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Okay, good evening everyone.
Welcome to the July 13, 2026 council

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meeting.
Uh council, we've got uh Council

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Donaldson, Council Schuken, myself in
the room online. We have Council

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Councelor Gray. Councelor Gray, can you
hear us?

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Yes, I can. Thank you very much.
>> Thank you. So, council, before you, we

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have the agenda as amended with the
addition of the late items. Uh, is that

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all right? Yep. Moved by councelor
Schukan, seconded by councelor Donaldson

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as amended. All in favor?
Opposed?

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Seeing no opposed, that appro that is
approved unanimously. Next, we have

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presentations. Thank you very much. Um
well actually I forgot to do the

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territorial. Thank you for reminding me.
So um I've got notes here somewhere but

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I think I'll just say territorial
acknowledgement like we've done for the

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last four years. So we sit on um the
land of the s coish people um and we

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acknowledge and recognize our first
nations community uh especially the Jano

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first nations uh to our near uh west
here the patchidot far west out near

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Port Renfruit as well as the suk first
nation uh the songis and the first

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nations and we acknowledge them and we
work towards good governance with them

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and good relationships.
Okay, let's move along uh to the

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presentations. We tonight we have a
presentation a delegation from William

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Head Institution that has been planned
for quite some time. Um and um uh the

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correspondence was on there and I'd like
to welcome team warden um Tony uh BL and

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Renee Pero the assistant warden
management services to the podium.

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Welcome.

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» Yeah, you'll have to
Yeah. And turn the mic. That'd be great.

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» All right. Testing. Testing. Okay.

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» Good evening, Mayor Mayor Little.
Council members, staff, and community

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members.
My name is Anthony Baldo, and I'm the

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acting warden of Williamhead
Institution. Our substantive warden,

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Trent Mitchell, is on temporary special
assignment now, and he has asked that I

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speak on his behalf. I have the pleasure
of being joined by colleagues act acting

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deputy warden Renee Parent and assistant
warden of operations Jeff Longhurst.

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Thank you for the opportunity to speak
this evening about something that

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deserves our collective recognition and
mutual deep appreciation the strong and

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collegial relationship between
Williamhead Institution the District of

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Mosen and its surrounding communities.
Please know that while I am speaking the

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memory of Mr. Payne, who had his life
taken away in 2019, stays with me and

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with all the staff at William Head
Institution. [clears throat] Our

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thoughts continue to be with the family
and friends of Mr. Bane.

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William Head Institution sits on the
traditional territory of the Beecher Bay

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First Nation, who thoughtfully granted
us the name Shianu, land of the salmon

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people during our 50-year recognition
ceremony in 2009.

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Established in 1959,
William Head Institution, a 200 bed

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capacity minimum security facility, has
been a proud member and neighbor within

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the community of Machosan for nearly 70
years.

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Historically, correctional facilities
are often understood through the lens of

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their security mandate. While public
safety and accountability remain

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fundamental responsibilities and are top
of mind each day in the decisions made

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at William Head, they are a crucial part
of a larger picture. Within the William

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Head Institution community are dedicated
professionals, volunteers, and community

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stakeholders who work every day to
promote rehabilitation, support personal

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growth, and prepare individuals for
successful reintegration into society

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and back into our local communities.
What makes the relationship between

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William Head Institution and the
community of Machosen special is the

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understanding that public safety and
rehabilitation can only occur when the

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community and William Head Institution
is part of the same narrative and are

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striving towards the same goals.
The relationship between Williamhead,

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the residents, organizations,
businesses, and local government is

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built on mutual respect, open
communication, and a common goal of

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creating a safer and stronger community
for everyone. While recent events have

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certainly served to test the resolve of
our collective relationships, they have

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also served to strengthen them and have
shown us the importance of maintaining

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robust communication protocols and
processes.

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I know that William Head Institution
Management is looking forward to

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continuing this work with the district
and with the RCMP Superintendent

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Gillespie. I know that this work is well
underway and communications procedures

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have already strengthened between the
key stakeholders of the offices

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mentioned.
We have also seen the benefits of this

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partnership and how William Head
Institution offenders have given back to

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the immediate Machosen community through
community service escorted temporary

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absences, educational opportunities,
community initiatives, charitable

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projects and ongoing dialogue that
brings people together rather than

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keeping them apart. These connections
help to educate, clear up

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misconceptions, build trust, and remind
us that meaningful change happens when

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William Head Institution and the local
communities work side by side.

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In fact, further to the community
service escorted at temporary absence,

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as I mentioned, offenders approved for
this program have actually painted the

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exterior of this building, engaged in
the annual setup and takeown of staging

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equipment from a chosen days year after
year, repaired and painted the pavilion

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as well as the riding ring, and have
recently assisted in the cleanup of the

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St. Mary the Virgin Church Cemetery.
The men have for 20 years or more have

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also been the go-to team to clean up the
course and the broom epidemic that is in

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our community.
You'll also see them doing uh trail

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cleanup and uh remediation as well on
occasion.

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Moreover, it was our community
connections group made up of

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particularly talented offenders who
built the little library across the way

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and have built thousands of toys, sock
puppets, and items for charitable

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auctions over the years. These
activities occur daily and the reach is

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throughout the CRD and beyond. This is
community in action.

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A further testament to community in
action can be found through our

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wonderful citizens advisory committee.
The Citizen Advisory Committee or CSE as

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it's referred to plays a vital role at
William Head Institution by fostering

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transparency, accountability, and
meaningful engagement between the

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institution and the community it serves.
Through its independent volunteer

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members, the CAC provides valuable
oversight, offers constructive feedback,

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and helps ensure that the perspectives
of the public are reflected in the

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correctional environment. Their
commitment to observing operations,

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supporting rehabilitation efforts, and
promoting open dialogue contributes to a

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culture of respect, fairness, and
continuous improvement.

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The dedication and insight of the CAC
are instrumental in strengthening public

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confidence while supporting William Head
Institution's mission of safe, secure,

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and effective reintegration.
William Head is extremely fortunate to

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have such a robust CAC consisting of
members from all over the CRD

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representing a wide range of ages,
professions, and background experiences,

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including folks from right here in
Mosen.

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These volunteers have have unfettered
access to the institution and to its

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offender population, ensuring that the
important dialogue between the

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citizenry, the offenders, and staff
remain candid, relevant, and forward

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focused.
I would be remiss in not briefly

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articulating how William Head
Institution supports some of our most

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vulnerable and racialized populations,
an issue that affects communities at

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large as well as the community within
William Head Institution.

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Indigenous peoples remain significantly
over represented in the federal

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correctional system, accounting for
approximately 30% of individuals under

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CSC jurisdiction,
the Correctional Service of Canada. Uh

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despite representing only 5% of the
Canadian population, CSC recognizes that

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the disparity reflects broader systemic
inequities and committed to addressing

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it through enhanced cultural supports,
streamlined release processes, and

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targeted reintegration and employment
initiatives. These efforts have

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contributed to increased discretionary
releases for our indigenous offenders

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and reduced rates of gradual return to
federal custody within five years of

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sentence completion.
The Correctional Service of Canada also

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has developed a phase black offender
strategy to address the over

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representation of uh offenders in the
correctional system. The first phase has

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already been completed, but including
the identification of promising

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initiatives across the country, efforts
to expand successful pilot programs into

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national practices have been undertaken.
In January 2025, CSSE shared a draft of

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the strategy with the black offenders
whose feedback was generally supportive

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while ongoing consultations with
blackled community organizations.

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CSC is currently funding using uh
current funding to implement, evaluate,

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and research further initiatives to
better understand and improve outcomes

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for our black offenders. But community
is also about reciprocity engagement,

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sorry, is also about reciprocity.
In the continued spirit of meaningful

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community engagement and meeting people
where they're at culturally, the

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offenders of William Head Institution
have hosted several ethnicultural

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events, symposiums, and forums over the
past several years. In fact, William

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Head Institution for the past 10 years
has been counted on to spend nearly 70%

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of the entire region's ethnicultural
budget year-over-year.

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William has has been able to do this as
it enjoys very progressive and

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enlightened relationships with the
Intercultural Association of Victoria,

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Dr. Lisa Gunderson, and the University
of Victoria, just to name a couple.

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Community partnerships such as these are
yet another key to contributing to

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public safety. Perhaps our longest
community outreach venture can be found

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in the annual William Head on Stage
Theater Performances, or who's for

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short. I'm sure many people in the
audience are are familiar with who's for

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45 years who's has stood as an
extraordinary example of transformation

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transformation transformation
transformative power of arts easy for me

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to say creativity and community through
its remarkable performances written by

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the offenders. The program has pro
provided a platform for personal growth,

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self-expression, and meaningful
connection, touching the lives of

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participants, audiences, volunteers, and
supporters alike. This milestone 45th

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year this fall will not celebrates not
only decades of outstanding theatrical

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theatrical productions, but also a
lasting commitment to rehabilitation,

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inclusion, and hope. The dedication,
talent, and pers perseverance of the

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offenders, community partners, and of
the supportive community CRDwide

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have created a legacy that continues to
inspire, demonstrating how the

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performing arts can foster
understanding, build confidence, and

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build bring people together. It should
be noted that who's hosts approximately

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2,000 paying guests to see its perform
performance each year. That's 2,000

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paying guests.
The healthy relationship between

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Williamhead Institution and the Machosen
community has not been built overnight.

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It has been built through years, nearly
70 years in fact, of listening,

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cooperation, problem solving, and shared
successes. It is strengthened when

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challenges are addressed respectfully
and timely and when opportunities are

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embraced together.
This evening, I recognize a partnership

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that reflects those principles. We
celebrate the understanding that every

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person has the capacity for growth, that
public institutions can be positive

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community partners, and that a community
is strongest when it works together

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toward common goals. I'd like to thank
you for your time, for your collegiality

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and commitment to our mission, and for
allowing us to be part of your wonderful

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community of Machosen. Thank you.
>> Thank you very much. So, um, council,

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uh, did you have any comments or
questions that you wanted to address to

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either either parties, the the three,
Jeff, uh, Renee, and Tony, the acting

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warden. Uh, we'll start with council
Schukan and then move throughout uh,

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council table. Thank you.
>> Great. Um, uh, through your little, Mr.

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BLO. Yes.
>> Baldo. Sorry. Baldo. Uh, Mr. Mr. Bald,

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Miss Brown and Mr. Longhurst, thanks
very much for being here. Um, of course,

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top of mind is the whole um situation
with the escaped inmate. Um, that

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situation I think revealed to us that
there were some things that we needed to

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do and learn in terms of our emergency
communication. Um I you you probably

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can't get into depth around the response
that you corrections Canada made at at

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your your site, but I I just wonder if
you can maybe talk about what you are

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doing now to learn and to improve and
Yeah. Well, I can tell you right now

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that as I said in in my uh short
presentation that um our staff is

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actively engaged with the staff here at
uh Machosen City Hall and our emergency

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or first responders. Um Superintendent
Gillespie as well and RCMP uh local

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authorities are also engaged in um sort
of dotting eyes and crossing tees and

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sort of seeing how the communication can
be even more efficient and more

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effective. I think with any um incident
or event uh we learn from that and we'll

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continue to learn. Uh rehabilitation is
a is not a straight line. It's a

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journey. It's a it's a cross country run
as opposed to a sprint. And um we we it

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behooves us to to ensure that we learn
from past practices and make future

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practices stronger and and more
effective. and that's where we're at

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right now. So, thank you for
understanding that the the the current

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uh situation with Mr. Jensen and his
passing is under current investigation

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and I cannot comment further, but that's
sort of the lay of the land right now.

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Thank you.
>> Okay, thank you Donaldson.

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» Thank you. I had a similar um concern
about that. we've we've probably each

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one of us heard from our community and
the alarming um effects that go with

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that. I live near where Mr. Payne lives
so I appreciate the acknowledgement at

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the very beginning of your talk. Um I
also want to express my gratitude for

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the amount of work um that your staff
have done over the years and have

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evolved. Uh as well as the gentleman
crew that comes out and works within the

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community. um having um being a part of
that um with the riding ring or and

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seeing the the recent work at the at the
churchyard and the parks and trails

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you've helped out as well as camp
Bernard and some other um projects and I

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think that that's a very good program in
helping these individuals to um

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gradually get back into our community um
having visited the institution as well

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and different events the ethnic ones um
was really interesting for me and also

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transformative. I'm always learning and
I appreciate that we are working that

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you're working your you're um the
institution uh Corrections Canada is

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working with our staff to assure our
residents um that we'll have an improved

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protocol as to alerting people. Um it
was uh it was quite bumpy and people

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people were obviously alarmed. So, I
look forward to the new roll out of a

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better plan. Thank you.
>> Thank you,

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» Councelor Gray online. Do you have any
uh comments or concerns or questions?

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» Yes. Well, first thanks Mr. Baldo for
your presentation and and uh I do want

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to recognize the contributions your
inmates make in our community. So, thank

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you for that and thank you to the
inmates. Um this was I think for many

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people a frightening experience given
what had happened previously uh with a

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escaped um inmate and I I wasn't sure
under previous council I think there

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were some discussions and perhaps
decisions or at least I was had the

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impression there were about the nature
of inmates that would be um kept at

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William Head and then I think it was
yesterday I read an article in the Times

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colonist which gave quite a description
of Mr. Jensen and his time in in the in

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um Corrections Canada and it made me
feel less certain about what's going on.

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It will that be part of the discussion
going forward then? Um is the nature of

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people who are kept there? Is that part
of the issue for us to address?

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» Well, I I guess how I can respond is
that um after Mr. Payne's uh um uh his

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the taking of Mr. 's life in 2019. There
were um adjustments and and changes made

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uh and how we screen offenders and and
exactly what offender profile uh comes

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to William Hit Institution. I can I
assure you that those practices are

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still in play and as I said earlier um
in in in corrections in in a minimum

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security facility I would be uh remissed
to to say if if if I told you that there

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would be no risk. I think that everybody
would understand in human behavior um

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that there is no such thing as is no
risk and it's low risk that we subscribe

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to. So to answer your your question more
directly is we will continue to review

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closely how we screen offenders to come
to William Head Institution. Yes. And um

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in Mr. Jensen's case um as has been
reported there were a lot of factors

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that um affected Mr. Jensen's um
behavior and stay. And uh we will

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continue to revisit how uh we supported
Mr. Jensen and what we can do

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differently going forward. Thank you.
>> Thank you for those comments and and for

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the work that you're doing on that
front. The second issue I wanted to ask

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about was simply the one of
communication. I read in the paper that

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police were going doortodoor.
Otherwise, I heard from residents that

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there was something on Facebook. Um, but
is there a way that we notify residents

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when when there's a concern of an inmate
escaping? Um, or is it or is that at

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doortodoor and Facebook?
>> Um, well, I can only speak from from how

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we notify. We have a set um list of
contacts that we um contact during an an

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escape or other um similar type of
event. And I know that uh when we went

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through our uh terms of reference and
our contingency plan um we checked every

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bit of the steps along the way. Now what
I can't speak to is um what happened

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internally from from the from this level
if you will but I as I said earlier in

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my um in my presentation that we will do
whatever we can to help smooth uh and

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fill any gaps that may have been that
have were experienced uh three or four

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weeks ago.
I guess maybe what I'm curious about the

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chair is whether it's the police, the
institution or the district who's

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responsible to kind of get the
information out to residents. I'm I'm

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not aware of the protocols and that and
I and it and this was kind of um really

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uncertain. I only heard about it, you
know, through an email um and then later

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heard about Facebook. But is there a
who's who's responsible for letting

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residents know? Is that the district or
the institution or the police or all

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three?
>> Well, again, we we notify the police

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immediately and we also notify uh site
contacts in this office immediately as

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well. After that, uh in terms of direct
um public uh console or in um u

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notification, we as the site don't do
that. we have to go through our uh law

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enforcement partners and our community
partners for that information to get

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through. Uh as you can appreciate, we're
dealing with the the the emergent

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situation of a missing offender at that
time, but we also have the duty to make

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sure that what we know we uh disseminate
to our immediate community as soon as as

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practical.

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» Thank you.
>> Okay. Thank you. Um we're just going to

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turn to Bob Pad, our CEO. Go ahead, Bob.
>> Thanks for the chair.

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Um thanks for all the information. Uh
Deputy Warden, that's all good. People

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want to hear that and if it's possible
to have your comments, we could uh um

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you know, maybe make that public as well
um so people can read because not

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everybody's here tonight obviously or
listening. Um couple things. Um

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it would be interesting. I would be
interested to know uh who when you refer

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to screening
um for um inmates I guess you call them

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uh to be in Mosen like who exactly does
that and um I'm of the belief that

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somehow the local community should be
involved in that process or at least

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have some fidelity in that review
process if that's even possible. Um,

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00:23:51,039 --> 00:23:59,840
second point is, um, today I noticed
that there was a CSC van out front.

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Maybe there was some volunteers doing
something, you know, chosen. Um, I'm I'm

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not aware of it and I find it
interesting that, you know, that there's

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00:24:07,120 --> 00:24:15,279
inmates doing operational stuff in the
community. I have no I have no awareness

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of it. So, I think we need to work on
that uh on that relationship a little

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bit better. Thanks. Okay. Thank you.
>> Okay. Anybody else there want to add

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anything towards the communication
piece?

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00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:33,279
» Nope. Okay.
>> Um

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» yes, Steve here.
>> I haven't yet for if you if you can wait

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00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:45,120
until I speak and then you can speak for
the second time. Um I just want to

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00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:51,200
acknowledge uh uh all three of you here.
Um, as is mentioned in the letter, I am

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00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:55,120
a part of the CAC. I'm an official
member of the community advisory

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00:24:53,120 --> 00:24:59,679
committee. And the reason why I did
that, and I know that's not uh what has

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00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:03,840
happened at the district before, but I
thought it was really important that we

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00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:09,440
have a good communication between the
district of Mosen and William Head

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00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:14,880
Institution because we do have u work
release uh throughout the CRD. I'm a

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00:25:12,159 --> 00:25:18,400
member of the CRD board as vice chair. I
thought it was just really important

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00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:24,799
that we have that communication and that
that uh you were in my uh mobile phone

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00:25:21,679 --> 00:25:30,159
and and recognized here at the district
if there was something that was to go

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00:25:26,799 --> 00:25:34,400
wrong. Um and I think uh the proof was
in the pudding to tell you the truth in

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00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:40,400
this incident. This incident was very
sad and very very frightening for my

303
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:46,480
community. Um however um we followed the
emergency protocol uh when as I

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00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:55,120
understood it um and what we've talked
about is when an inmate is not accounted

305
00:25:49,679 --> 00:26:00,480
for uh the CSC uh notifies the RCMP.
Once that happens it becomes there's a

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00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:07,279
second count but there's also that is
now an RCMP investigation. Um I was and

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00:26:05,120 --> 00:26:12,880
at the same time I was at the farmers
market. I came over here um to do some

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00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:18,720
business in my office. Almost
simultaneously I received a a text from

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00:26:15,919 --> 00:26:25,039
the uh warden at the prison and a call
from the RCMP superintendent. So that

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00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:31,600
was within uh 30 minutes or so and then
it proceeded from there. Um I called our

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00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:37,679
CEO. He came in from Souk within about
15 minutes and joined me here. Um, and

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00:26:35,039 --> 00:26:42,080
we were discussing what was the next
steps. I knew that we were going to get

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00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:47,919
authorization from the Correctional
Services Canada on what could be said. I

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00:26:45,279 --> 00:26:53,200
was waiting for the RCMP to give me some
notification of what were the next step.

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00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:58,799
This was my responsibility here because
I am the the chief executive officer,

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00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:03,440
the mayor. I'm responsible for the
health and well-being of 5,067

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00:27:01,919 --> 00:27:11,120
citizens.
Um, and we had good communication. This

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00:27:06,559 --> 00:27:19,600
continued on um into the night. Prior to
that, um, CEO Payet uh, said, "If you

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00:27:14,559 --> 00:27:25,760
need me, I'll be here." Um, CEO Payet
left. I went into the community because

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00:27:22,799 --> 00:27:30,799
I was worried that citizens that don't
have access to Facebook, don't have

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00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:36,400
access to their phone were recreating in
the district. In particularly, I knew

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00:27:33,279 --> 00:27:40,480
that the art pod at our municipal owned
school uh was there painting for their

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00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:45,279
next exhibition and they wouldn't be
looking at their cell phone. So, I went

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00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:49,840
there [snorts] to u let them know what
has happened and I didn't have a lot of

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00:27:47,679 --> 00:27:54,559
information at that time. I went door
todo to all the businesses and everybody

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00:27:52,159 --> 00:28:00,960
that that I could all the business
owners uh to talk about that. I also

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00:27:57,360 --> 00:28:06,399
went out to William Head um to talk to
the RCMP officers that there. This

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00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:11,679
continued into the night. Um, and I was
liazing back and forth with um, Trent

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00:28:09,279 --> 00:28:18,320
Mitchell, our warden, Superintendent
Terry Terry Gillespie at the RCMP, as

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00:28:15,039 --> 00:28:24,000
well as uh, Shano First Nations uh,
Chief Rush Chips, who is in Vancouver

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00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:29,039
um, recovering from surgery there, as
well as the counselor, the only

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00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:34,080
counselor that was available um, and in
uh, the band or at the band, which was

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00:28:31,919 --> 00:28:39,279
uh, Tracy Oman. So I was uh
communicating back and forth between all

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00:28:36,159 --> 00:28:43,600
of these five people. It was me uh that
put it on Facebook because I was trying

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00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:47,840
to figure out what is the best way to
get this to the community. I know that

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00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:55,360
many members of the community are on fa
Facebook not all. Uh so that was and I I

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00:28:52,320 --> 00:29:01,039
relayed official information not
circumsp

338
00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:06,799
circumspect my opinion. It was official
um information on on how it was

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00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:12,159
unfolding to reassure the public but to
give them as much information as

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00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:18,799
possible that was actual um information
and factual. Um, and during the night I

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00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:25,279
woke up every hour on the hour. I set my
my mobile um calendar because Chief

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00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:31,919
Chips wanted to know. And so that's what
I did. The next morning, we had various

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00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:38,559
um inquiries from the press. I knew that
the RCMP were having their own press

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00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:43,200
release uh press conference at the RCMP.
I suspected that there was something

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00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:47,760
going on at um still at the prison
because we could see the helicopters

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00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:53,840
above and I had had communications from
Trent Mitchell. Um and at that point I

347
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:58,320
decided to call a press conference here
so that the press could hear everything

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00:29:55,679 --> 00:30:04,480
that had happened in the past not quite
24 hours but that they would all hear uh

349
00:30:01,679 --> 00:30:09,600
my statement simultaneously and they
would all hear the same message. uh that

350
00:30:06,799 --> 00:30:13,600
was typed out my message um and it was
given to all of the the press that were

351
00:30:11,679 --> 00:30:17,600
here. Additional copies were given to
their colleagues for their colleagues

352
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:23,840
that weren't there.
And so u that's sort of a communicate

353
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:29,840
that is exactly how it it unfolded.
There are gaps in the system that we've

354
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:33,520
been able to identify um and uh there's
there are things that we did right and

355
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:38,960
there are some gaps and we will do
better in the future. But I'm very very

356
00:30:36,399 --> 00:30:44,240
happy that I've spent the time over the
past four years to have those good

357
00:30:40,799 --> 00:30:49,360
communications to meet monthly with the
personnel at William Head Institution as

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00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:54,640
well as good communications with our new
superintendent of the RCMP, Terry

359
00:30:52,000 --> 00:31:01,760
Gillespie, and his colleagues.
Okay. Any other comments or concerns?

360
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:03,440
Okay. With that, I'll thank you.
>> Thank you.

361
00:31:02,399 --> 00:31:08,640
» Yes.
>> Thank you, counselor. And you you don't

362
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:13,200
have to stay. Um we've got a long night
and I I imagine you don't want to stay

363
00:31:10,559 --> 00:31:15,919
for till 11. So thank you very much for
joining us.

364
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:19,520
» Thank you. Mayor
>> Mayor Little, you'd asked if I had

365
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:22,799
another comment and I do.
>> I'm sorry.

366
00:31:20,159 --> 00:31:27,200
» It's a C. You'd asked if I had another
question or comment and I do have one.

367
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:31,919
» Oh, I apologize. Go ahead.
>> Yeah. Well, thank you for for reporting

368
00:31:29,039 --> 00:31:36,399
out on on your activities and I very
much appreciate that businesses were

369
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:40,559
notified. My concern, I guess, lies with
the residents of the community and I

370
00:31:38,799 --> 00:31:45,760
think that Facebook and email just
doesn't cut it. Um, and I'm wondering if

371
00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:50,399
we might get advice from the institution
if if our role is in fact to notify

372
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:54,080
residents rather than the police. Um
maybe in our communications plan that

373
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:59,120
we're building now or the protocols that
we heard about a moment ago being

374
00:31:55,519 --> 00:32:03,919
revised, we might find out from the
institution or from kind of um

375
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:07,840
corrections Canada what's done in other
communities and how do they manage it?

376
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:13,039
Are there lessons we can get there? Is
there anything like amber alert type

377
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:18,320
activity or phone trees? We have our our
emergency pods which kicked into action

378
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:21,840
but but delayed. And then the other
point, so so just I think it would be

379
00:32:19,919 --> 00:32:25,760
good if if that communication plan as
it's developed came back to council so

380
00:32:24,399 --> 00:32:30,480
we could see it and share it with the
public. And then my final comment would

381
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:36,240
be that it would be really great to know
what the messages actually were. I think

382
00:32:33,679 --> 00:32:44,559
they were lock your doors, but I'm and
and um and um but I don't know really

383
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:48,480
what else was was out there. Um did we
talk about outuildings? be careful about

384
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:52,799
out build out buildings or check on your
neighbors. I'm not totally sure. I

385
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:56,960
didn't really see anything in that
regard uh out to residents. So, those

386
00:32:55,279 --> 00:33:00,000
are just my comments about if we could
have a report back to council from staff

387
00:32:58,559 --> 00:33:03,120
as they work forward on it. Thank you
very much.

388
00:33:01,519 --> 00:33:08,480
» Do you wish to comment on that?
>> I can definitely comment on the first

389
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:14,080
part that um with uh Did you want to
come up and Okay, I'll have um Jeff come

390
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:17,679
up. He was doing the the the hard work
here with regards to that.

391
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:21,919
» Okay. Thank you for joining us, Mr.
Longhurst. Go ahead. Go ahead.

392
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:27,919
» Okay. I got to lower this a little bit.
Yeah, there was a big tall guy here. Um,

393
00:33:24,799 --> 00:33:36,399
okay. Can everybody hear me? Okay. Um,
yes. So, uh, the question going back

394
00:33:30,799 --> 00:33:41,120
about, um, notification for public, I
believe that's something that we might

395
00:33:38,399 --> 00:33:45,840
be able to, uh, take a look at in the
future. Uh, I do have contacts at other

396
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:51,679
minimum minimum sites across the
country. So, this is something that is

397
00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:57,039
sort of in my wheelhouse of uh, the side
of things. Um, so I can explore that as

398
00:33:54,960 --> 00:34:02,279
we go into the future.
Uh, was there another question that was

399
00:33:58,799 --> 00:34:02,279
attached to that?

400
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:10,639
» So, may I the coding speaking for the
council? Great. The coding

401
00:34:08,879 --> 00:34:12,879
» the coding like lock your door or
whatever like

402
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:19,040
» Oh, okay. What does that mean?
>> Uh, we don't do we don't do that. Um, we

403
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:24,480
don't say lock your door. We don't do
any of that kind of stuff. So, uh, um,

404
00:34:22,879 --> 00:34:32,399
I'm not sure where that would have came
from, but, uh, it wouldn't be from a

405
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:37,440
Correctional Service Canada site. So,
>> right. And that that makes sense to me

406
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:42,639
because once once the prison, as I
understand, the Correctional Services

407
00:34:39,119 --> 00:34:47,440
Canada notifies the RCMP, it's no longer
correctional services jurisdiction, if

408
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:54,240
I'm using the correct terminology. The
jurisdiction is actually RCMP. It's now

409
00:34:50,399 --> 00:34:57,920
their investigation and once and
>> yeah it's a it becomes a command center

410
00:34:56,560 --> 00:35:03,760
within the site.
>> Uh so then it's a joint force between uh

411
00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:08,240
our operations and uh the RCMP.
>> Right. So the communications regarding

412
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:11,839
that would be an RCMP piece. Yes. Any
notification would be an RCMP piece.

413
00:35:11,359 --> 00:35:17,599
» Yeah.
>> Yeah. Okay.

414
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:22,560
Okay. that we forgot to mention. I did
lies with Kathleen Sutherland, our

415
00:35:20,720 --> 00:35:29,599
volunteer emergency management
coordinator uh that evening. Um and uh

416
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:33,839
she had what had happened. She had a
resident earlier in the day respond that

417
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:38,800
she had heard there was an incident at
William Head Institution. Um she

418
00:35:36,240 --> 00:35:44,720
immediately went to Facebook to see if
there was something on there. She saw my

419
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:50,000
post um and saw that it was on official
uh Correctional Services Canada uh

420
00:35:47,359 --> 00:35:55,200
notification and their verbiage and she
took that as authorization that she had

421
00:35:52,480 --> 00:36:00,400
factual information that she could then
send out to all the pod leaders the the

422
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:06,000
the pod leaders um throughout the
district. So, anybody that has signed up

423
00:36:03,119 --> 00:36:12,160
for that being in a pod and who had
access to a computer or a phone would

424
00:36:09,839 --> 00:36:16,160
have received that pod notification. And
I think that was about I've got my I

425
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:21,200
don't have my notes with me, but it's
about 3:00 in the afternoon or or so.

426
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:25,760
So, we've continually asked people to
sign up for those notifications if

427
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:31,520
people don't want if they want to live
off the grid, if they if they want to be

428
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:37,040
left alone. we have honored that and and
we don't have a a um a phone number for

429
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:41,920
we don't have a email address for every
resident. It's if you've opted into the

430
00:36:39,599 --> 00:36:48,800
system, you would have received that
notification and I one of the council

431
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:54,720
members here did uh say that that um uh
his wife is a pod leader and he received

432
00:36:51,520 --> 00:37:00,160
that notification at the same time and
and um so that's good that the pod

433
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:04,960
system worked. uh in that case and many
residents were identifi were notified by

434
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:11,839
the pod system.
Okay, any other questions?

435
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:15,079
Okay, with that, thank you very much to
this review.

436
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:23,880
Thank you.

437
00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:52,000
Okay, next we're going to move to public
participation.

438
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:58,400
We have four minutes per person to a
maximum of 45 minutes. So, we'll

439
00:37:54,240 --> 00:38:03,839
conclude this session at 8:30. Um, if
you could state your name, your road,

440
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:09,760
and we are accepting respectful
conversation this evening. Thank you.

441
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:15,200
Good evening. Uh, first of all, I'd like
to thank members of council and the

442
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:20,560
mayor for your service up to this point
and hope you have a good summer. Uh,

443
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:26,800
deserve a break for a bit.
My name is Gary Smurfett.

444
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:32,800
I'm a 40-year member of Machosen.
Live on Gilbert Drive. I'm also a member

445
00:38:29,839 --> 00:38:39,599
of the Fireh Hall technical team. I'm
here tonight with member Claus Craig and

446
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:45,119
our Sean Shen
who's our technical support here.

447
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:50,800
Tonight on the agenda you have our
proposal for services was accepted by

448
00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:58,000
council on May the 25th and we started
work on June the 5th with our meet and

449
00:38:55,599 --> 00:39:02,640
greet with the mayor with the the CEO
I'm sorry. [laughter]

450
00:39:00,240 --> 00:39:08,880
And uh tonight there's our progress
report for the first month and an

451
00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:13,440
updated plan action and uh we're hoping
to keep going forward on it. So I'd just

452
00:39:11,119 --> 00:39:19,599
like to uh say we're here if you have
any questions. Uh if afterwards the

453
00:39:17,359 --> 00:39:22,960
meeting if members of the public want to
grab us in the hallway, we'll be more

454
00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:27,880
than pleased to talk to them as well.
Thank you very much.

455
00:39:24,720 --> 00:39:27,880
» Thank you.

456
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:44,240
John Ren stro
just want to make a correction mayor

457
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:48,480
little I mean
you said that good communication hasn't

458
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:54,240
happened before well that's just not
true we've always had good communication

459
00:39:51,200 --> 00:40:00,160
with William head I even I served on the
CAC myself for several years After that,

460
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:06,240
we had council members that served on it
and more recently in my time, Bob

461
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:12,320
Mitchell was a CAC member for a long
time and reported almost monthly to the

462
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:18,640
council as to what was going on there.
And

463
00:40:14,079 --> 00:40:23,599
as to how the community got alerted,
I was immediately alerted by the RCMP

464
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:29,359
whenever there was any problems with
William.

465
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:34,720
I immediately referred that
initially and then just was automatic

466
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:42,000
went to Chief Dunlop's community alert
system and that community alert system

467
00:40:38,240 --> 00:40:48,880
was very heavily subscribed by residents
of this community. So that that was the

468
00:40:45,599 --> 00:40:53,520
main way it got sent out. Also then we
contacted staff and staff uh put it on

469
00:40:52,079 --> 00:40:59,200
the website and did all sorts of other
stuff too. the community knew but

470
00:40:56,400 --> 00:41:04,880
primarily through Chief Dunlop's
community alert system instantly when

471
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:10,088
something like that happened
and you know

472
00:41:08,068 --> 00:41:10,088
[clears throat]

473
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:18,079
this coun previous councils we were
heavily involved with corrections Canada

474
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:22,319
particularly with the uh the murder that
took place

475
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:29,920
and the problem there was overrides it
was the sending warden overrides and and

476
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:33,599
we and myself, we went right to uh some
of the top people in the Corrections

477
00:41:31,839 --> 00:41:38,319
Canada thing right across the country
and worked on that and the overrides

478
00:41:35,839 --> 00:41:41,599
were changed.
Not a lot, but they were changed and

479
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:48,800
those are the changes that I believe
that this the assistant warden was

480
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:54,480
referring to. But anyways,
we had very good communications. We had

481
00:41:51,599 --> 00:41:59,520
set up really positive structures where
the community could be advised.

482
00:41:57,599 --> 00:42:04,079
So
I'd appreciate it if you didn't say good

483
00:42:02,079 --> 00:42:07,800
communication has only happened now and
it never occurred before.

484
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:15,280
» I we don't usually respond during public
participation but I will respond.

485
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:21,760
I thought that we could have better
communication. That's why I put my name

486
00:42:17,839 --> 00:42:26,400
forward for the uh CAC. Um I wasn't
aware that you were a member of the CIC.

487
00:42:24,079 --> 00:42:32,079
Um that has never been communicated to
me. Certainly Bob Mitchell was a part of

488
00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:38,240
the CAC. Um and remember I was on
council uh last term and so I was fully

489
00:42:35,599 --> 00:42:45,359
aware what the communications were
regarding uh the last prison break and

490
00:42:41,839 --> 00:42:50,560
the murder of Mr. Payne. regarding the
overrides. Anybody in the community can

491
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:55,839
go to the Correctional Services Canada
website and find out what was done at

492
00:42:53,760 --> 00:43:02,000
Correctional Services regarding that
incident and how they've pivoted uh

493
00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:07,920
including I wouldn't say overrides but
uh giving more authority to the warden

494
00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:13,920
at William Head in terms of who is
accepted at the prison and who is not

495
00:43:10,720 --> 00:43:17,599
accepted. No, I'm not accepting. Um,
you're this is not

496
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:20,640
» I'm not telling it the way it was.
That's okay.

497
00:43:20,079 --> 00:43:26,839
Mayor,
>> you want to keep this council chamber

498
00:43:23,839 --> 00:43:26,839
business?

499
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:35,960
» Enough,
>> Mr. Rance. Enough.

500
00:43:32,079 --> 00:43:35,960
» Enough. Enough.

501
00:43:38,079 --> 00:43:46,800
» I apologize to everybody. This is a very
serious debate. It's not a debate. This

502
00:43:44,720 --> 00:43:52,319
is a very serious matter. We need to
stick to the facts.

503
00:43:49,599 --> 00:43:58,800
Go to the Correctional Services Canada
and see what they've done since the last

504
00:43:55,680 --> 00:44:07,119
prison break and the murder of Martin
Payne, who was a beloved member of this

505
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:12,319
community. Go there and find out. Okay,
please calm down in the back. If there

506
00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:18,960
are problems with this, we'll remove
everybody from the chamber.

507
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:22,800
Please keep your comments to yourself.
Please go to the website for

508
00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:27,760
Correctional Services of Canada, what
they've done since that murder of Mr.

509
00:44:25,599 --> 00:44:33,119
Payne. They've there's more
authorization

510
00:44:29,839 --> 00:44:38,800
uh for the warden to
um accept or not accept inmates as well

511
00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:44,800
as they've done a lot of um safety
guards um regarding their counts. Go to

512
00:44:42,720 --> 00:44:51,359
the website, find out the facts rather
than rely on innuendo and and um hearsay

513
00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:54,359
information. Okay, let's move to the
next

514
00:44:57,680 --> 00:45:04,640
Patty White House, Rocky Point Road. And
I just want to express my appreciation

515
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:08,960
for the very readable and informative
progress report from the fireh hall

516
00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:12,200
technician team.
>> Thank you.

517
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:22,960
» Um, for the record, we heard through our
pod very quickly. I don't know the

518
00:45:21,599 --> 00:45:24,831
process it got there, but it got there
quickly.

519
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:27,119
» I'm glad that you heard from the pod.
[laughter] If you could identify

520
00:45:26,240 --> 00:45:32,640
yourself.
>> Madame Mayor, I'm Clayton Baker, a

521
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:38,480
resident of 5109 William Head Road. Um,
I also own in partnership with my family

522
00:45:34,720 --> 00:45:41,920
3659 Soup Road. For clarity, I'm here in
today in respect to the soup road

523
00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:45,680
properties.
We have put forward development

524
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:49,440
proposals in the past on this on our
property. Since we began this process,

525
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:53,920
we have received a lot of public
feedback. As a result of this feedback

526
00:45:51,599 --> 00:45:58,640
and other information we've gathered, we
believe we have a better understanding

527
00:45:55,520 --> 00:46:02,240
of the concerns of this uh residents and
the level of support for the project

528
00:46:00,240 --> 00:46:06,400
that exists for the project. To this
end, we also want to keep the

529
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:10,240
conversation going. This brings me to my
next point. We are in the process of

530
00:46:08,319 --> 00:46:14,880
revising our development proposal to
reflect what we've learned so far. We

531
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:19,440
intend to bring the revised proposal to
Machosen in time for the August council

532
00:46:17,119 --> 00:46:24,319
meeting. We also believe that it will be
a benefit to get better education of

533
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:27,920
where Mosen residents are on the
developing the Supro corridor for

534
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:33,920
commercial and light industrial use for
things like mini storage and and others.

535
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:39,280
Um we feel the residents are generally
supportive to expanding the tax base in

536
00:46:36,720 --> 00:46:43,359
this manner. It is my belief that this
would be a logical way to maintain the

537
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:47,680
rural nature of chosen while at the same
time providing options for future

538
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:54,319
councils to meet upcoming challenges
without placing the burden of the cost

539
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:58,079
of these challenges on the residents.
As we believe this information be

540
00:46:56,079 --> 00:47:02,880
beneficial to the chosen as well as
ourselves, we are prepared to fund the

541
00:47:00,240 --> 00:47:07,760
cost of adding a question to the
election on October 17th that provides

542
00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:12,240
clarity for residents and if they see
this as a way forward. Specifically, we

543
00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:16,000
would ask residents, we would like to
ask residents if they would support

544
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:19,760
limited expansion of commercial light
industrial zoning on soup road in

545
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:24,400
accordance to the community plan. I want
to emphasize this is not specific to our

546
00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:27,680
thing just the general stretch not to
our development in particular with the

547
00:47:26,240 --> 00:47:31,839
time of proposal it is our intent to
make this not election issue but to make

548
00:47:29,920 --> 00:47:37,520
it more of a opportunity for the
residents to be heard um

549
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:42,000
I suspect I don't know that there would
be a cost to adding a question like this

550
00:47:39,839 --> 00:47:48,720
to the election and we'd be willing to
bear that cost so respectfully thank you

551
00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:52,160
» okay just to uh clarify there's no
council meeting in August. There is a

552
00:47:50,480 --> 00:47:55,200
September 21st meeting.
>> Then I screwed up my research.

553
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:57,520
» That's fine. [laughter] That's
>> okay.

554
00:47:56,160 --> 00:48:00,680
» Okay. Thank you.
>> Thank you.

555
00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:17,200
» My name is Mark Gross and I live on Mat
Lake Park Road. I'd like to comment on a

556
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:21,200
variance request for my street. Um, I
want to become aware of this variance

557
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:26,000
request was being tabled today on your
agenda in a letter from the district

558
00:48:24,240 --> 00:48:30,559
which arrived on Friday and I haven't
had a chance to see the complete

559
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:36,000
variance request but I would like to
comment on it since they're considering

560
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:41,920
it today. Um, my first point is that I'm
the neighbor that would probably be most

561
00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:48,400
impacted. is the variance request for a
secondary suite and um the variance is

562
00:48:45,440 --> 00:48:52,079
to increase the distance allowable.
So I'm probably the neighbor that would

563
00:48:50,079 --> 00:48:55,839
be most affected by this because it's
moving in the direction of my property.

564
00:48:53,839 --> 00:49:03,280
It's moving towards my property line.
I'm on the immediate west side uh of the

565
00:48:59,119 --> 00:49:08,240
uh property in question here. And um my
family's concern is that uh this

566
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:12,559
potentially increases disturbance and
noise and voices. This summer for the

567
00:49:10,319 --> 00:49:16,960
first time in the three years that we've
lived there, we could actually hear

568
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:24,079
personal discussions uh from their
property as they were building uh the

569
00:49:20,079 --> 00:49:27,280
home and um and so that you know they
sit on your deck in your house and you

570
00:49:25,599 --> 00:49:33,280
hear personal conversation would not be
enjoyed by anybody. So that's one

571
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:39,119
concern by bringing it closer to us. The
second uh concern is that we were uh

572
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:45,920
approached by a representative for the
property last fall and at the time we

573
00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:52,240
were asked to assign a supporting uh
letter uh for uh a variance request um

574
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:56,880
to increase the distance between the
secondary suite and the and the main

575
00:49:54,079 --> 00:50:02,720
house. And my wife and I believe it was
for 8 feet or 2 meters. I might be wrong

576
00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:06,720
on that. But trying to remember back
that seemed to be what the request was

577
00:50:04,319 --> 00:50:12,160
going to be for. But what I see in the
letter of Friday that we received Friday

578
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:17,920
is that the request is for 30 ft. It's
9.1 m.

579
00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:23,359
And um so that's quite different from
what we had signed to though I don't

580
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:29,520
have a copy of the uh full application
so I could be wrong. The weather was 8

581
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:34,240
ft but that's what we think. Um so we
signed in good faith because we wanted

582
00:50:31,359 --> 00:50:40,000
to welcome the neighbors. Um and this
seems to be a little bit um

583
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:46,720
bad faith. That's the impression it
gives us. So we're unsure about that.

584
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:54,079
Um, the third comment uh point is that
I'm not sure that uh a 61%

585
00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:59,280
increase to the bylaw is appropriate for
what Mosen wants to achieve with these

586
00:50:56,480 --> 00:51:03,760
bylaws. I I believe what it wants achie
achieve is keeping the footprint of

587
00:51:01,040 --> 00:51:09,440
construction small and that's to
contribute to the ambiance of the chosen

588
00:51:06,240 --> 00:51:16,640
of this open spaces and biodiversity and
so forth. And if this were passed then

589
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:20,720
it seems to me it sets a precedence of
other properties even on our street but

590
00:51:19,119 --> 00:51:26,960
certainly elsewhere as they come up in
the future that such a significant uh

591
00:51:24,160 --> 00:51:32,720
variance was allowed. So those are the
the three points our concern about

592
00:51:29,119 --> 00:51:38,079
disturbance as it comes closer to us um
the issue about what had we been

593
00:51:34,880 --> 00:51:42,480
approached to agree upon and uh thirdly
whether it suits me chosen. So we

594
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:46,800
welcome the neighbors but we think
they're overreaching perhaps within the

595
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:53,680
machosen framework uh to achieve
something that uh is perhaps

596
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:58,079
inappropriate. Um and that's all I want
wanted to have a chance to pass on like

597
00:51:56,240 --> 00:52:02,280
our family's comments. Thank you. Thank
you for your time.

598
00:51:59,119 --> 00:52:02,280
» Thank you.

599
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:11,920
So the the complete package uh the
request uh and the planners report was

600
00:52:08,640 --> 00:52:18,480
at at the last council meeting that was
June 10th I believe. I could be wrong on

601
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:22,960
that date. Uh but we can ask uh staff to
send you that that all that

602
00:52:20,240 --> 00:52:28,599
correspondence um and the link to the
website. Okay. Next

603
00:52:31,119 --> 00:52:38,800
Hi, my name is Lynn Pollock. I'm
[clears throat] not a resident Mosen, so

604
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:43,440
I apologize for that. However, I'm here
to speak

605
00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:50,480
um on behalf of the amendment
application for 3280 Woodruff Road.

606
00:52:48,480 --> 00:52:56,640
So, my name, like I said, is Lynn
Pollock. Um, I'm the daughter of John

607
00:52:53,760 --> 00:53:03,760
and Peggy Jervis who owned the property
at 5280 Woodruff Road. My parents owned

608
00:53:00,079 --> 00:53:08,400
the property for 66 years.
In more recent years, while my mother

609
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:14,000
was still alive, she had an agreement
with CRD to purchase a large portion of

610
00:53:11,040 --> 00:53:20,000
her property for park.
However, this was never approved. The

611
00:53:17,119 --> 00:53:24,079
property means so much to me personally.
>> Miss Miss Pollock. Yes,

612
00:53:21,359 --> 00:53:28,720
» we've got a member of council online, so
if you can just speak directly into it,

613
00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:31,040
that would be great. And I'm sorry, just
that's fine. Just direct us here. Thank

614
00:53:30,559 --> 00:53:33,599
you.
>> I'd rather not, but

615
00:53:32,079 --> 00:53:36,160
» I know. I know. [laughter]
Thank you.

616
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:40,319
» Uh this property means so much to me
personally. After my mother passed away

617
00:53:38,400 --> 00:53:45,440
and my brother and I inherited the
property, we both realized that even if

618
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:50,240
we bought each other out, we couldn't
afford to do the upgrades that were

619
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:56,640
needed. nor would it be smart at our
ages of 66 and 68 to take on the

620
00:53:53,359 --> 00:54:00,960
responsibility of the property.
It was so important to the my brother

621
00:53:58,720 --> 00:54:06,000
and I that we sold this property to the
right buyer.

622
00:54:03,119 --> 00:54:11,359
We adamantly agreed after my mother
passed away that we didn't want a

623
00:54:08,160 --> 00:54:15,760
developer to purchase the property that
we wanted it to be kept intact. And as

624
00:54:14,240 --> 00:54:21,119
you can appreciate, when you're selling
a property, you really can't force

625
00:54:18,319 --> 00:54:24,720
another person to do something or not do
something.

626
00:54:22,960 --> 00:54:30,720
We were approached by the Victoria
Humane Society and a deal was made. It

627
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:36,720
was a perfect sale for my brother and I
as we knew the property would be kept

628
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:41,119
whole. We thought the Victoria Humane
Society has graciously allowed my

629
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:46,640
brother and I to put a plaque on the
property in memory of our parents. It

630
00:54:43,920 --> 00:54:51,319
reads, "Loving caretakers of this
property for 66 years."

631
00:54:51,680 --> 00:54:56,040
I'm sorry. It's okay.

632
00:54:59,119 --> 00:55:09,000
Victoria Humane Society is also giving
me permission to come on the property

633
00:55:05,280 --> 00:55:09,000
whenever I want

634
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:20,800
and I have done that. I've done that
many times. My mom subscribed to

635
00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:26,559
beautiful BC magazine. So whenever it
comes she I got to call the magazine

636
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:31,200
there. So I've been there a lot.
I've seen the improvements

637
00:55:29,119 --> 00:55:37,200
they've done to the property. For
example, a new septic field. The old

638
00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:43,359
field was 54 years old. Another example
of improvements on the property was

639
00:55:39,119 --> 00:55:47,440
enormous amounts of cotch broom removed.
Both of these are examples of huge

640
00:55:45,440 --> 00:55:50,960
environment improvements. All
improvements I've seen personally.

641
00:55:50,363 --> 00:55:56,799
[snorts]
I write I'm did write a letter. So, I

642
00:55:54,559 --> 00:56:02,240
write the letter in support of Penny
Stone and the Victoria Humane Society

643
00:55:59,839 --> 00:56:07,520
application for a zoning change. They've
been totally environmentally respectful

644
00:56:04,640 --> 00:56:14,400
and responsible with this property. That
means much more to me than it does to

645
00:56:11,599 --> 00:56:19,359
anyone here. Please note, if they were
not being environmentally responsible or

646
00:56:16,960 --> 00:56:24,319
respectful of the property, I wouldn't I
would be the first person here to speak

647
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:28,480
up against it.
And I'm just asking to support the

648
00:56:26,640 --> 00:56:33,359
Victoria Humane Society in their
application for zoning reszoning. Thank

649
00:56:32,319 --> 00:56:38,079
you.
>> Thank you. And thank you, Miss Pollock.

650
00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:45,680
And and on behalf of council, please
accept our condolences. Uh Peggy was uh

651
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:48,799
admired and um a wonderful member of our
community. I had tea with her at her

652
00:56:47,520 --> 00:56:54,640
house.
She was she was generous and um in

653
00:56:51,599 --> 00:57:00,440
spirit and with her resources and uh
yeah she was a true gem of this

654
00:56:56,559 --> 00:57:00,440
community. So our condolences.

655
00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:04,760
Okay. Next

656
00:57:12,880 --> 00:57:24,720
Gary Lamb Hackmore Drive. Um I just want
to raise uh a comment regarding the tax

657
00:57:21,520 --> 00:57:30,400
exemptions being sought.
uh in that many of the groups

658
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:38,319
um seeking the tax exemption are
registered charities and as such are

659
00:57:34,079 --> 00:57:43,599
able to provide tax deductible receipts
and individuals can then claim a tax

660
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:48,960
deduction
uh for their contribution whereas

661
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:51,960
increased property taxes are not tax
deducted.

662
00:57:52,160 --> 00:57:55,280
» Thank you.

663
00:58:00,559 --> 00:58:05,920
Good evening, Mayor and Council. My name
is Ivon Becker and I live on Liberty

664
00:58:04,319 --> 00:58:10,319
Drive and I'm the president of the
Machosen Hall Society. I want to thank

665
00:58:08,319 --> 00:58:15,119
staff for their report and for
recognizing the Hall Society continues

666
00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:20,240
to meet the criteria for the permissive
tax exemption. Mosen Community Hall has

667
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:24,000
sub served the community for
generations. It provides a place for

668
00:58:22,079 --> 00:58:29,599
weddings, celebrations, community
groups, emergency support, culture

669
00:58:26,880 --> 00:58:35,839
events, and local organizations. Like
many uh nonprofits, we rely on certainty

670
00:58:33,680 --> 00:58:39,920
so we can budget responsibly, plan
maintenance, and continue serving

671
00:58:37,599 --> 00:58:45,040
residents. The traditional permissive
tax exemption framework has provided

672
00:58:42,799 --> 00:58:49,520
that certainty for many years. From the
hall society perspective, restoring that

673
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:54,160
framework for 2027 would allow us to
focus on operating the hall rather than

674
00:58:52,160 --> 00:58:58,319
wondering how future funding decisions
may change from year to year along with

675
00:58:56,480 --> 00:59:02,559
the added volunteer time to apply for
the required grants. Whatever council

676
00:59:00,559 --> 00:59:06,480
decides about the long-term direction of
this policy in the future, we

677
00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:10,640
respectfully ask that the organizations
which clearly qualify under the current

678
00:59:08,480 --> 00:59:13,920
criteria continue to receive the
stability they need to serve the

679
00:59:12,079 --> 00:59:17,520
community. Thank you for your time and
for your consideration.

680
00:59:15,520 --> 00:59:21,520
» Thank you, Miss Becker. Did you um
identify yourself as a me a trustee? I

681
00:59:20,400 --> 00:59:26,079
didn't hear it. Sorry.
>> I'm not a trustee. I'm the president of

682
00:59:23,839 --> 00:59:29,720
the Hall Society.
>> Okay. Thank you.

683
00:59:33,040 --> 00:59:40,400
» Judy Roer, Paris Road. Good evening,
Mayor and Council. Thank you for um the

684
00:59:38,319 --> 00:59:44,480
opportunity to speak tonight. I am here
to express my strong support for

685
00:59:42,640 --> 00:59:49,680
maintaining full permissive tax
exemptions for all the organizations

686
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:53,599
that have applied. While the report to
council frames the cost of these

687
00:59:51,440 --> 00:59:58,960
exemptions as an increase in property
taxes, it unfortunately repeats a past

688
00:59:56,559 --> 01:00:03,839
mistake. It completely fails to
calculate the immense value these

689
01:00:01,359 --> 01:00:09,680
organizations return to the Machosen
community. These groups provide vital

690
01:00:06,640 --> 01:00:14,640
services, programs, community spaces,
and environmental stewardship. The value

691
01:00:12,319 --> 01:00:20,240
to the municipality far exceeds the
estimated cost to taxpayers. A true

692
01:00:17,760 --> 01:00:25,119
costbenefit analysis is simply not
complete unless both sides of the

693
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:29,599
equations are factored in. We all want
to keep taxes as low as possible, but I

694
01:00:27,760 --> 01:00:34,400
strongly recommend that council look to
other areas to generate revenue. For

695
01:00:32,240 --> 01:00:38,960
instance, pursuing light industrial
development opportunities along Souk

696
01:00:36,640 --> 01:00:42,319
Road would bring in substantial funding
without undermining the very

697
01:00:40,559 --> 01:00:46,640
organizations that serve as the
cornerstones of our community. I was

698
01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:50,559
actually very interested uh in what Mr.
Baker said about [clears throat] a

699
01:00:48,079 --> 01:00:53,920
referendum. I would before that because
I think this community does want to see

700
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:58,640
some light industrial. Anyways, thank
you for your time and consideration.

701
01:00:55,760 --> 01:01:02,160
» Um Miss France, what road do you live
on? Sorry.

702
01:00:59,520 --> 01:01:04,559
» Uh um sorry, it's Miss Roer.
Paris Road.

703
01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:09,359
» Paris Road. Thank you.
>> Sorry, it's very hard to hear with

704
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:12,839
hearing aids in this uh right where I
am. Thank you.

705
01:01:19,200 --> 01:01:26,079
Hello, Rachel Olsen, Typton Avenue. Good
evening, Mayor and Council. My name is

706
01:01:24,400 --> 01:01:30,960
Rachel Olsen. I'm the secretary of the
Victoria Motorcycle Club. I'm here in

707
01:01:29,359 --> 01:01:34,960
support of the club regarding our
application for the permissive tax

708
01:01:32,880 --> 01:01:39,760
exemption. Thank you for the opportunity
to appear. The Victoria Motorcycle Club

709
01:01:37,680 --> 01:01:45,920
has been in continuous operation since
1912, making us one of the oldest and

710
01:01:42,559 --> 01:01:50,720
largest motorcycle clubs in Canada. Our
property is one of only two sanctioned

711
01:01:48,319 --> 01:01:55,440
off-road vehicle sites on the South
Vancouver Island, providing safe,

712
01:01:53,119 --> 01:02:00,480
dedicated space for families to enjoy
sport in our region. In the past year,

713
01:01:58,319 --> 01:02:04,559
as noted in our application, we've
hosted the Machosen Fire Department, the

714
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:09,440
search and rescue, and the Macho
Machosen scouts, providing our

715
01:02:06,799 --> 01:02:13,599
facilities at no cost to support their
training, and we support the fire

716
01:02:11,040 --> 01:02:18,160
department further through fundraising
through our annual hill climb. We've

717
01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:22,480
also worked directly with the Mosen Fire
Department on fireing our property work

718
01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:26,480
that was recently recognized in the
Machosen Muse for its role in protecting

719
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:30,799
our neighbors and the surrounding
community. As stewards of this land, we

720
01:02:29,440 --> 01:02:35,119
take our responsibility to the
surrounding environment seriously. We

721
01:02:33,280 --> 01:02:39,440
are currently developing a master plan
that will guide the long-term

722
01:02:36,960 --> 01:02:43,599
sustainable and use of our trails. one
that balances our members passion for

723
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:49,040
the sport through thoughtful land
management, habitat protection, and

724
01:02:46,240 --> 01:02:53,119
erosion control. Our goal is to ensure
that our property continues to serve

725
01:02:50,960 --> 01:02:57,599
both our community and the natural
environment around it for generations to

726
01:02:55,200 --> 01:03:01,680
come. I'm available to answer any
questions if you have anything about our

727
01:02:59,040 --> 01:03:04,920
application. Thank you for your time.
Thank you.

728
01:03:11,200 --> 01:03:21,359
I guess it's me. Wendy Mitchell, Woody
Beach Road, uh, I want to commend this

729
01:03:18,079 --> 01:03:28,640
council for a change
that you are reconsidering the PTE. It

730
01:03:25,359 --> 01:03:35,520
really is important. It It was just a
crazy thing to try and change that. The

731
01:03:31,760 --> 01:03:42,480
these organizations are
so important to our community. So, I'm

732
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:49,520
really glad you're
going to revisit that last decision you

733
01:03:46,160 --> 01:03:56,960
made, and I hope that you
just revert to the original, which I

734
01:03:53,200 --> 01:04:03,520
think is option one there.
It must be an election year because

735
01:03:59,520 --> 01:04:09,680
you've listened to us all. We've all
come out many times and talked about

736
01:04:06,079 --> 01:04:15,520
this, so it's good. Thank you. I'm glad
you're looking at it again. Hope you do

737
01:04:11,920 --> 01:04:18,680
the right thing this time.
>> Thank you.

738
01:04:20,559 --> 01:04:28,000
Mr. Bennington, did you want to speak?
There's there's uh a bit of time here. I

739
01:04:26,160 --> 01:04:31,720
don't know if you wanted to go to the
microphone or not.

740
01:04:39,039 --> 01:04:47,440
I would just like to uh sorry it's Ed
Bennington from Tain Road. Uh I would

741
01:04:45,039 --> 01:04:54,319
just like to uh point out that the
uncertainty of going forward with annual

742
01:04:51,200 --> 01:04:57,760
sort of possibilities of changing stuff
is make it very difficult for these

743
01:04:56,240 --> 01:05:04,400
organizations.
Uh I am associated with St. St. Mary's

744
01:05:00,720 --> 01:05:10,799
Church which has for decades provided
the funding to look after the heritage

745
01:05:06,240 --> 01:05:15,680
church uh as one of their uh benefits to
the community among the many other

746
01:05:13,280 --> 01:05:21,599
things which have been pointed out uh by
previous speakers. So uncertainty going

747
01:05:18,079 --> 01:05:25,839
forward is very troublesome and uh our
survival as a church within this

748
01:05:23,359 --> 01:05:31,039
community is at risk depending on the
decisions that you make.

749
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:31,039
» Thank you.

750
01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:40,599
Okay. See, you know what?

751
01:05:40,720 --> 01:05:46,960
Good evening. Kiara Kakawa, Perry
Crossroad, uh, speaking in support of

752
01:05:44,799 --> 01:05:50,559
the permissive tax exemptions. As
someone who sat at the table for a

753
01:05:49,039 --> 01:05:55,039
number of years and provided those tax
exemptions to most of the organizations

754
01:05:52,319 --> 01:05:59,520
that are on this list, they do require
stable funding. They do require the

755
01:05:57,440 --> 01:06:03,280
ability to know in advance what that
funding will look like so that they can

756
01:06:00,960 --> 01:06:06,960
look at what their programs are, what
capital projects that they might need to

757
01:06:04,960 --> 01:06:10,400
consider for this year or the next year
or as they're as they're doing their own

758
01:06:08,400 --> 01:06:13,920
financial planning. The volunteer
organizations and not for-profit

759
01:06:11,920 --> 01:06:18,400
organizations within Machosen, most of
whom are asking for these permissive tax

760
01:06:15,760 --> 01:06:23,359
exemptions, are ones that provide the
fabric of this community and what it all

761
01:06:20,319 --> 01:06:28,240
is that we hold dear as Machosen without
the contributions that they do that may

762
01:06:25,119 --> 01:06:33,760
or may not be monetary in value allows
us to be proud Chosenites and to

763
01:06:31,760 --> 01:06:37,920
continue having the environment that we
live in which is rural in nature but

764
01:06:35,520 --> 01:06:42,240
also allows us to function.
The other item that I would like to

765
01:06:39,359 --> 01:06:47,359
speak to is in regards to um Stacy
Charles's uh Cho First Nation canoe

766
01:06:44,319 --> 01:06:50,240
family partnership request. Honestly, my
suggestion would be if you've got some

767
01:06:48,640 --> 01:06:54,000
money left over in your grants and aids
or in your um council discretionary fund

768
01:06:52,720 --> 01:06:57,920
that you would consider providing them
with a donation. Uh it is one of those

769
01:06:56,240 --> 01:07:02,000
things where they they actually do quite
a bit of of good work and this is great

770
01:06:59,839 --> 01:07:07,599
for their community. I've had an
opportunity in the past to sponsor this

771
01:07:04,480 --> 01:07:13,280
uh personally through my business and um
they they come asking um with the best

772
01:07:11,119 --> 01:07:17,680
intentions at at heart in order to
provide their youth in particular the

773
01:07:15,520 --> 01:07:22,200
opportunity to participate in the tribal
journeys. Thank you. Thank you.

774
01:07:30,720 --> 01:07:38,319
Good evening. It's Ellen Fresh Perry
Crossroad. Uh speak about three things

775
01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:44,240
this evening. First off, the per
permissive tax exemption bylaw. I think

776
01:07:41,520 --> 01:07:47,760
if we take a step back to the principle
of what we're trying to do here, which

777
01:07:45,839 --> 01:07:53,280
is provide certainty all the way around,
including to the district, we've got

778
01:07:50,640 --> 01:07:58,720
four examples of requests for money on
this agenda in addition to the request

779
01:07:56,319 --> 01:08:03,599
for exemptions. And every meeting I've
been at where we've talked about these

780
01:08:00,160 --> 01:08:09,039
things, it comes down to how much money
uh is is in our budget or conversely not

781
01:08:07,039 --> 01:08:14,559
in our budget and having to make
decisions at every meeting as to who's

782
01:08:11,839 --> 01:08:18,719
going to get funded, whose proposal is
worthy or not. And somewhere there needs

783
01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:24,400
to be a balance in there that provides
certainty to the taxpayers of Machosen

784
01:08:21,679 --> 01:08:29,120
about where that bucket of money is
coming out of which might be tapped from

785
01:08:27,279 --> 01:08:34,000
a combination of permissive tax
exemption and then other opportunities

786
01:08:31,040 --> 01:08:40,000
for the grants that were just spoken
about. So I advocate a a principled

787
01:08:37,279 --> 01:08:46,799
approach on that. Number three,
wholeheartedly support the reasonzoning

788
01:08:42,000 --> 01:08:51,520
of um of the property for the SPCA. Um I
have followed that one and I just wanted

789
01:08:49,359 --> 01:08:58,640
to note on a technical matter on the
recommendation in it. It refers to staff

790
01:08:55,759 --> 01:09:03,520
seeking information from the applicant's
qualified environmental prep

791
01:09:00,799 --> 01:09:08,080
professional. The relationship there to
request that information is not with

792
01:09:05,920 --> 01:09:12,880
it's not between
municipal staff and the QEP. It rests

793
01:09:10,400 --> 01:09:17,679
with the applicant. So the applicant
presumably is going to be responsible

794
01:09:14,560 --> 01:09:22,560
for the billable hours and time that QEP
has to put in answering the questions

795
01:09:20,319 --> 01:09:28,880
that the district requests of them. So
I'd look at how that request is

796
01:09:25,359 --> 01:09:34,560
structured. Um, and then lastly, just in
terms of the fireh hall update, um, I

797
01:09:32,480 --> 01:09:40,880
just wanted to make those aware because
I I wasn't aware until I was doing my

798
01:09:37,040 --> 01:09:46,719
own research, um, that the Agricultural
Land Commission approved the non-farm

799
01:09:43,679 --> 01:09:54,080
use application for the future fireh
hall uh, site, presuming it's it would

800
01:09:50,400 --> 01:09:59,199
be here on the lands. great letter, 10
pages long, released May 12th, gives a

801
01:09:57,280 --> 01:10:03,760
great summary of all the past
applications

802
01:10:00,719 --> 01:10:08,080
for uh removal of the ALR and then
reversal and then all the many non-farm

803
01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:14,080
use applications and the OCP amendments
that were put in and uh continuous

804
01:10:11,120 --> 01:10:19,040
reaffirmation that the property is meant
to be used for uh public community

805
01:10:17,280 --> 01:10:24,239
development. So, it's it's a good read
and it's a publicly available letter and

806
01:10:22,239 --> 01:10:32,040
uh I've got a copy of it here that I'll
be sharing if those of you who are

807
01:10:26,800 --> 01:10:32,040
interested. Thanks so much. Thank you.

808
01:10:34,560 --> 01:10:37,560
Okay.

809
01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:45,360
Seeing no other uh comments, we'll
conclude uh public participation and

810
01:10:42,560 --> 01:10:53,199
move along in our agenda.
Next, uh, council, we've

811
01:10:49,920 --> 01:10:58,719
sorry, we've got the adoption of the
minutes. This is for the June 22nd, 2026

812
01:10:57,120 --> 01:11:01,520
regular council meeting.
>> Move adoption.

813
01:10:59,679 --> 01:11:05,760
» Moved by council Schukan, seconded by
council Donaldson. All in favor?

814
01:11:04,239 --> 01:11:10,480
Opposed?
Not opposed. If you're opposed, uh,

815
01:11:08,000 --> 01:11:16,159
councelor Gray, just, uh, scream out.
Okay. Otherwise, I will take it as in uh

816
01:11:14,080 --> 01:11:20,800
voting in the affirmative.
>> Uh we've got the receipt of minutes.

817
01:11:18,480 --> 01:11:26,000
We've got we'll take these individually.
We've got the receipt of the June 16th

818
01:11:23,440 --> 01:11:30,480
draft parks and trails advisory select
committee meeting.

819
01:11:28,239 --> 01:11:36,000
Moved by council, seconded by council
Donaldson. All in favor? Opposed?

820
01:11:33,520 --> 01:11:41,280
Carried. Thank you. We've got the
>> May I ask a question? I had a question

821
01:11:39,040 --> 01:11:47,040
to ask.
I'm wondering if the parks and trails

822
01:11:43,520 --> 01:11:51,360
draft master plan will come forward for
council.

823
01:11:49,280 --> 01:11:54,719
» I'm I'm going to ask councelor Schukan
to answer this. Uh could you answer the

824
01:11:53,760 --> 01:12:00,560
question?
>> Um

825
01:11:56,480 --> 01:12:06,239
yes. And what is interesting about um
the master plan? Two things. Um there is

826
01:12:04,159 --> 01:12:10,719
the potential of a s significant
revision because we're no longer ideally

827
01:12:08,960 --> 01:12:15,679
after tonight talking about the buffer
land as a as a potential park as a park.

828
01:12:14,159 --> 01:12:22,880
So there'll be some revisions around
that. Um we are also working on um some

829
01:12:20,239 --> 01:12:28,640
mapping as well and that that is
underway. Uh, I have received comments

830
01:12:26,159 --> 01:12:32,159
from council don council gray for me ask
from members of the community and we're

831
01:12:30,320 --> 01:12:35,920
also factoring those into a new new
draft and I'm hoping to circulate that

832
01:12:34,480 --> 01:12:43,199
before too long. So,
>> okay. Thank you.

833
01:12:39,440 --> 01:12:48,800
» Okay. Uh, that uh motion was passed.
We'll move along to June 23rd Mosen

834
01:12:45,440 --> 01:12:53,679
Environment Select Committee. Um, one of
you at the table go ahead

835
01:12:51,440 --> 01:13:00,239
move adoption.
Move moved by councelor Schukan,

836
01:12:55,440 --> 01:13:06,800
seconded by council Donaldson. Comments.
>> Yes, I it's Steve here. I just wanted to

837
01:13:03,040 --> 01:13:11,760
um mention an important um event
happened at our last meeting and that is

838
01:13:08,640 --> 01:13:16,719
that Bill Cave um gave notice that he
would um be stepping down from MASK.

839
01:13:14,239 --> 01:13:20,719
Bill's been a longtime member and um a
Machosen Friends of the Earth award

840
01:13:18,480 --> 01:13:24,960
winner. We really appreciated Bill's
input over these years and we'll be sure

841
01:13:22,000 --> 01:13:31,040
to recognize him further. Thank you.
>> Thank you. I see nodding heads at the

842
01:13:27,280 --> 01:13:36,560
table. Uh we we welcome his wise
guidance here. Thank you. Okay, I'll

843
01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:41,040
call the question then on the adoption
of the MROS environmental advisory

844
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:45,360
select committee meeting of June 23rd.
Call the question. All in favor? Seeing

845
01:13:43,600 --> 01:13:49,280
no one oppose that move. That is
carried. Uh we Yep. I I think we may

846
01:13:47,840 --> 01:13:51,520
have missed the uh special planning
committee

847
01:13:50,480 --> 01:13:57,760
» or jumped ahead.
>> I'll I'll go back. Thank you for that.

848
01:13:54,159 --> 01:14:02,000
» Um for adoption the June 23rd special
community planning committee minutes. Go

849
01:14:00,560 --> 01:14:06,400
ahead council.
>> Proceed.

850
01:14:02,719 --> 01:14:11,840
» Moved by councelor Donaldson. Second
by council Donaldson.

851
01:14:08,400 --> 01:14:17,120
All in favor? Opposed? Hearing none
opposed. Move along to the June 25th

852
01:14:14,960 --> 01:14:21,320
Health and Community Advisory Select
Committee meeting minutes.

853
01:14:21,679 --> 01:14:27,920
» Move for receipt.
>> This is moved by council Schukan,

854
01:14:24,800 --> 01:14:33,440
seconded by uh councelor. Oh yeah, it is
received. Uh council Donaldson. All in

855
01:14:30,880 --> 01:14:40,080
favor?
No. In oppose? That carries. Okay,

856
01:14:37,199 --> 01:14:47,719
moving along to the mayor's update. I'll
be as brief as possible.

857
01:14:42,880 --> 01:14:47,719
as soon as I get this up on my screen.

858
01:14:48,320 --> 01:14:57,679
Okay. Um so, uh once a month, uh at a
council meeting, I give a written report

859
01:14:54,880 --> 01:15:02,719
regarding, uh my activities regionally
and within the district. Uh this time it

860
01:15:00,880 --> 01:15:08,560
was just there was there's been a lot
going on. I did it in point form and got

861
01:15:05,600 --> 01:15:17,120
I gave you um links to all the different
media reports um um as well as uh

862
01:15:13,600 --> 01:15:23,600
different um communicates for instance
by Ro University. So I'll I'll just name

863
01:15:20,640 --> 01:15:31,440
them. Um celebration of life for Lillian
Mariebach who died um in office. Uh she

864
01:15:28,560 --> 01:15:37,520
died in in May May 2nd of this year.
There was a celebration of life uh held

865
01:15:34,080 --> 01:15:45,440
at Royal Rose University on June 13th. I
was asked by the family of Lillian to

866
01:15:40,239 --> 01:15:50,640
give uh tribute to her as well as um the
celebration of life was hosted by the

867
01:15:47,679 --> 01:15:57,360
city of Langford. Uh the uh female
counselors uh were the

868
01:15:54,239 --> 01:16:05,840
MC's for the event. Mary Wagner, Colby
Harter, and Kimberly Gyrie. Uh the

869
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:11,520
uh Ted Robbins, the CEO of the CRD, also
gave a tribute as well as um Lillian's

870
01:16:09,440 --> 01:16:17,840
daughter-in-law,
Tanya Sunshine. Uh Roy Roads has set up

871
01:16:15,040 --> 01:16:24,480
an entrance award and an endowment in
Lillian's honor has been established. Um

872
01:16:21,120 --> 01:16:30,800
the CRD will honor Lillian's name on an
annual basis. Um that was also reported

873
01:16:27,440 --> 01:16:36,560
in the news. Um, every year I've been
delighted to attend the Kimosen College

874
01:16:33,120 --> 01:16:41,920
spring comication. This year was uh dece
or sorry June 17th. Uh, this was the

875
01:16:39,520 --> 01:16:46,239
fourth year in a row. It was really an
extraordinary event. I I I wish all of

876
01:16:44,320 --> 01:16:51,679
council could have been there. Uh there
were drummers, celebration, territorial

877
01:16:49,040 --> 01:16:57,840
acknowledgements. Uh Sap Scott, a
respected knowledge keeper, um cultural

878
01:16:54,960 --> 01:17:03,920
facilitator, ceremonial dry uh drummer
from the Sartup First Nation was there.

879
01:17:00,719 --> 01:17:10,719
He is the son of Elder May as many of
you know her, very revered and has deep

880
01:17:07,280 --> 01:17:15,840
family ties to the First Nations. Um the
governor general's collegiate prawns

881
01:17:12,640 --> 01:17:22,239
medal was awarded to Gayang Yu. Uh this
was event was hosted by Dr. Wayne Troder

882
01:17:18,880 --> 01:17:26,960
the president of Kimosin College.
Uh there is a change of command. Um

883
01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:32,480
there was a change of command at CFBS
Wyalt. I attended the ceremony in May.

884
01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:40,640
The ceremony was to mark the change of
command between Samuel Patchel CD to

885
01:17:35,679 --> 01:17:46,640
Blair Brown OM MSC CD. Um this was at
the invitation of Kevin Whiteside, our

886
01:17:43,040 --> 01:17:52,080
bear base commander. Um there was uh of
course uh welcoming and blessings from

887
01:17:49,040 --> 01:17:57,040
Chief Jerome Thomas of Squyold uh First
Nations that was also covered in the

888
01:17:54,400 --> 01:18:03,120
news. I did had a lengthy conversation
with Chief Chief Jerome Thomas who I've

889
01:17:59,920 --> 01:18:08,560
met previously uh as a part of as vice
chair of the CRD when we've gone out.

890
01:18:05,760 --> 01:18:16,320
You okay? Yeah. Okay. Do you have a
cough drop? Okay. Good. Um and um

891
01:18:13,440 --> 01:18:20,159
anyways, that was a wonderful uh event.
Uh we did have an open house as a part

892
01:18:18,400 --> 01:18:25,040
of the Victoria Family Court and Youth
Justice Committee. This is a deal

893
01:18:22,400 --> 01:18:31,600
delegated CRD commission. I'm chair of
that committee. Um, as you've known, uh,

894
01:18:28,239 --> 01:18:40,000
last month I, um, shephered in our
annual 2020 2025, uh, report. This was,

895
01:18:36,960 --> 01:18:44,320
um, our open house to welcome back all
those service providers that provide

896
01:18:42,080 --> 01:18:49,809
valuable service for youth and families
in our region. It was a it was a wild

897
01:18:46,719 --> 01:18:54,000
success. Um, so on that note,
[clears throat] I forgot to mention that

898
01:18:51,199 --> 01:18:59,280
I have gone to Langford Council and to
View Royal Council to also shepherd in

899
01:18:56,880 --> 01:19:03,920
that report of the Victoria Family Court
and Youth Justice as is my

900
01:19:01,120 --> 01:19:10,960
responsibilities of of uh as chair of
that delegated CRD Commission. Um, I

901
01:19:08,239 --> 01:19:16,320
also attended the uh cadetses at the
CSSC

902
01:19:13,040 --> 01:19:21,360
SECC Beacon Hill, the 47th annual
ceremonial review. It was marvelous

903
01:19:18,560 --> 01:19:27,440
event um particularly because it was
attended by the cadetses themselves and

904
01:19:23,840 --> 01:19:31,840
their family. It was so celebratory. I
was joined by regional partners uh Doug

905
01:19:30,320 --> 01:19:38,239
Kobayashi
uh uh the mayor of Cowwood, the mayor of

906
01:19:35,120 --> 01:19:45,679
Langford uh Scott Goodmanson as well as
MP uh Jeff Gibble Kibble from um where

907
01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:50,480
is he the MP in Shanigan Lake area to
the Malahhat. Um it was a wonderful

908
01:19:48,159 --> 01:19:55,520
event seeing all of these young women
and men graduating from the cadet

909
01:19:52,800 --> 01:19:59,360
program with uh valuable tangible
skills.

910
01:19:56,880 --> 01:20:04,400
Um, I also attended, as some of you did,
the Parisian Cafe put on by our

911
01:20:01,760 --> 01:20:10,320
marvelous Mosen Seniors Association.
This was on June 6th. It seems to almost

912
01:20:08,159 --> 01:20:18,080
always rain on that event, but they were
prepared. Uh, we had music and treats.

913
01:20:13,600 --> 01:20:22,000
Um, the uh food was uh donated by
Petisserie Danielle, so Danielle Voki,

914
01:20:20,480 --> 01:20:27,280
so we thank him for that. There was
great conversations

915
01:20:23,840 --> 01:20:34,560
um as well as many seniors and dogs and
our MLA Dana Leinesess was able to join

916
01:20:30,960 --> 01:20:40,080
us for that briefly. I'm very proud to
uh recognize that we did raise the pride

917
01:20:37,120 --> 01:20:44,800
flag here in the district on June 25th
and thank you to all of council for

918
01:20:41,840 --> 01:20:48,960
joining me here. This marks the fourth
consecutive year at the district had

919
01:20:46,480 --> 01:20:54,640
chosen that we've raised the pride flag.
Um, our staff was there, members of the

920
01:20:51,600 --> 01:21:00,800
fire department, our MP, uh, Stephanie
Mlan helped raise the flag. Um, she made

921
01:20:57,920 --> 01:21:07,600
a special trip from Vancouver to attend
our pride, um, flag ceremony. Uh we had

922
01:21:04,640 --> 01:21:13,120
cake and co conversations uh members of
the William Head Institution, Pearson

923
01:21:09,679 --> 01:21:17,600
College, West Shore RCMP, our own fire
department, the chosen search and

924
01:21:15,040 --> 01:21:22,960
rescue, the art pod volunteers, some of
them, and community volunteers uh were

925
01:21:20,640 --> 01:21:28,320
here. We had an amazing turnout. So,
thank you for joining us. I did march in

926
01:21:25,520 --> 01:21:32,560
the Pride Parade yesterday. Um I
actually I wasn't marching. I was

927
01:21:29,760 --> 01:21:39,600
sitting in the central Sanage uh firet
truck, the big rig that they have there

928
01:21:34,800 --> 01:21:43,600
with Mayor uh Maya Tate from Souk. Uh we
were invited to uh ride in the

929
01:21:41,840 --> 01:21:47,920
firetruck. So that was something new. I
didn't have to march and it was a

930
01:21:45,280 --> 01:21:53,280
wonderful positive event.
Uh we had the Canada Day Festivist

931
01:21:50,719 --> 01:21:57,520
celebration right here in the district.
Uh we're very fortunate to have the

932
01:21:55,440 --> 01:22:05,120
Mosen Arts and Cultural Center
Association, MKA, that put on this this

933
01:22:00,719 --> 01:22:10,960
valuable and um quite um extensive
celebration festivist um celebration to

934
01:22:08,239 --> 01:22:17,199
honor Canada Day. It started with a
horse parade. Uh Stella French um and

935
01:22:14,400 --> 01:22:22,159
Anna Whitten uh started off the day. We
had music, food, portraits, a blacksmith

936
01:22:19,760 --> 01:22:27,440
demonstration. It was a wonderful Canada
Day celebrations and thanks to council

937
01:22:24,639 --> 01:22:34,719
for joining us there as well as the art
pod maka um which and at the what I'm

938
01:22:32,159 --> 01:22:41,440
now calling the machosen arts and
recreation uh center or collective

939
01:22:38,320 --> 01:22:46,719
center collaboration is called alchemy
of creating. I invite everybody to go to

940
01:22:44,159 --> 01:22:52,400
that gallery. It is absolutely
phenomenal right now the exhibition that

941
01:22:49,199 --> 01:22:57,520
they have. Um
as well the as you know the Westshore

942
01:22:54,800 --> 01:23:02,159
mayors have been meeting um every month
for the past four years just to increase

943
01:23:00,320 --> 01:23:08,000
the communications
uh that uh wasn't there in the past. uh

944
01:23:05,199 --> 01:23:14,480
we had all recognized that given our
shared resources, given everybody is in

945
01:23:11,040 --> 01:23:18,719
tight tight financial situations, all of
the Westshore municipalities are feeling

946
01:23:16,639 --> 01:23:24,880
it. We felt that it was important that
we meet monthly and it was so important

947
01:23:21,360 --> 01:23:31,280
in the beginning in early um or in late
2022 and early 2023. And I initiated

948
01:23:28,880 --> 01:23:34,960
these meetings because I knew we had to
have good communications because at some

949
01:23:33,679 --> 01:23:39,199
point we were going to have
disagreements and it's easier to have

950
01:23:37,280 --> 01:23:46,000
disagreements with people that you know
and people that you trust. So, we've

951
01:23:41,440 --> 01:23:51,280
been meeting um monthly and uh July 3
was our final meeting of the four years

952
01:23:48,560 --> 01:23:58,400
and I thank my regional partners Scott
Goodmanson, the city of Langford, Doug

953
01:23:53,920 --> 01:24:05,360
Kobayashi, city of uh city of Cowwood,
uh Sid Tobias uh from the township of

954
01:24:01,840 --> 01:24:12,719
Uroy, Maya Tate from the district of
Souk, uh Waterf Director Al Wickham, who

955
01:24:09,840 --> 01:24:18,639
am I missing? Oh, and Ken Williams uh
from the district of of um Highlands.

956
01:24:16,159 --> 01:24:23,760
This was so successful that we also had
Mayor Barb Dejarden from Esquyimal

957
01:24:21,679 --> 01:24:30,320
wanting to join our group and so she
joined as well. So, it was great

958
01:24:26,639 --> 01:24:36,320
communications and um great to get uh
input from other mayors um at being a

959
01:24:33,280 --> 01:24:41,440
new mayor at the time. Uh, additionally,
I attended the Strong Cities Network.

960
01:24:38,639 --> 01:24:46,159
This was hosted by Laura Peron of the
city of Victoria. All of council

961
01:24:43,360 --> 01:24:50,560
received that invitation. Um, and this
was an opportunity for mayors and

962
01:24:47,840 --> 01:24:56,880
councils within the CRD region and other
civic leaders to explore all tools and

963
01:24:53,440 --> 01:25:03,040
resources to respond to hate, extremism,
and polarization. Maryanne Alto, the

964
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:07,440
mayor of the city of Victoria, um,
presented her community safety plan. I

965
01:25:05,440 --> 01:25:14,159
think everybody got a copy of that. If
not, I can get you a copy. Um, it's uh

966
01:25:10,719 --> 01:25:20,000
located or the link to this particular
um network uh conversation and workshop

967
01:25:17,120 --> 01:25:24,639
was was there, but there is uh that
report and and I can get that for you.

968
01:25:23,040 --> 01:25:29,679
Additionally,
um some important things. So, we got uh

969
01:25:27,520 --> 01:25:35,760
tea with the mayor. So, we've been
meeting uh once a month. Um, I've

970
01:25:33,199 --> 01:25:42,480
invited uh the community to come in and
have tea and coffee and cookies to uh

971
01:25:39,600 --> 01:25:47,520
talk about anything that is of mind uh
for the citizens and that has been very

972
01:25:44,719 --> 01:25:53,520
successful. The next one is tomorrow and
the deputy mayor and myself will be

973
01:25:50,000 --> 01:25:56,719
attending. I believe that is uh is that
you?

974
01:25:54,560 --> 01:26:02,080
» Yeah. And I know that you might have to
leave uh quite a bit early because you

975
01:25:58,880 --> 01:26:07,440
you've got other commitments. Uh but um
if you can be there for 15 minutes,

976
01:26:03,600 --> 01:26:13,280
that'd be great. Okay. And then as well
uh we've got uh this Thursday there's

977
01:26:10,560 --> 01:26:20,159
going to be music in the park in our
pavilion here. The band that will be

978
01:26:16,320 --> 01:26:27,760
playing is again Helen Davies and the
High Definition Chicks. Uh they've um

979
01:26:23,840 --> 01:26:32,159
they've uh played here before. It was
wildly successful for the last three

980
01:26:29,679 --> 01:26:38,480
years and I'm looking forward to that.
It starts at 6 PM in the pavilion. Um

981
01:26:35,600 --> 01:26:42,320
they will be setting up at uh 5 to 6.
We'll have some Taylor Swift playing and

982
01:26:40,560 --> 01:26:47,679
please bring your blankets and your
family and a picnic.

983
01:26:44,719 --> 01:26:53,679
Um and there's some other things that I
missed on this update, but I'll uh

984
01:26:50,320 --> 01:27:00,480
include in my September update. So that
concludes my mayor's update.

985
01:26:58,159 --> 01:27:05,400
Mayor Little,
it's councelor Ray.

986
01:27:02,400 --> 01:27:05,400
» Yes.

987
01:27:05,440 --> 01:27:11,760
» Thank you for your um article. Also,
just to mention the article in the news

988
01:27:09,440 --> 01:27:16,400
about the police department, the RCMP
building and the work being done on

989
01:27:13,920 --> 01:27:20,440
that. Will we consider a report for that
in at our September meeting?

990
01:27:20,800 --> 01:27:30,320
» I didn't I didn't hear. Sorry. I when
you speak my my um hearing aids sort of

991
01:27:25,840 --> 01:27:35,679
go off with a echo. Can you repeat that?
>> Yes. I said I wanted to add another item

992
01:27:33,520 --> 01:27:40,719
and to thank you for the article you
wrote in the news about the RCMP

993
01:27:38,400 --> 01:27:45,679
building and the concerns that we have.
And I wondered would we receive a report

994
01:27:43,199 --> 01:27:49,760
on that in September?
>> You won't receive a report from me but

995
01:27:47,840 --> 01:27:54,880
you might from staff. So, that's the
second letter that I've written or um

996
01:27:52,800 --> 01:28:00,880
article that I've written for Mosen News
regarding the RCMP

997
01:27:57,120 --> 01:28:04,400
uh the Westshore RCMP rebuild. Um we are
renters in that building and I thought

998
01:28:02,560 --> 01:28:10,000
it was important for the community to
hear the facts and get the links to the

999
01:28:07,600 --> 01:28:14,880
V Royal and the city of Langford
websites where all of the information is

1000
01:28:12,000 --> 01:28:18,719
there. Perhaps uh CEO Payet, would you
like to comment on a report?

1001
01:28:16,480 --> 01:28:23,840
» Yeah, sure. Through the chair. Um,
thanks for that question. Out there

1002
01:28:21,040 --> 01:28:30,320
where wherever you are, the um we're
we're working with the Langford staff to

1003
01:28:26,960 --> 01:28:34,480
get some information on the on the um
rental

1004
01:28:32,080 --> 01:28:40,159
issue and once we get that information,
we can put together a report quickly. Um

1005
01:28:37,520 --> 01:28:45,280
I'm I'm sure we'll have it in September.
Um but I'm we're waiting for information

1006
01:28:43,600 --> 01:28:47,840
um from Langford. So
>> Okay.

1007
01:28:46,880 --> 01:28:51,360
» Okay.
So with

1008
01:28:48,639 --> 01:28:57,840
» thank you.
>> Okay. Uh with that um Thomas maybe you

1009
01:28:55,280 --> 01:29:03,360
can turn down the volume uh a little
bit. Thank you.

1010
01:29:00,320 --> 01:29:08,800
Okay. We've got business arising.
This is 7A in your council agenda.

1011
01:29:06,639 --> 01:29:15,679
Everybody's got that. This is the June
23rd special community planning meeting

1012
01:29:11,760 --> 01:29:21,760
zoning amendment application for 3280
Woodruff Road. Councelor Schukan.

1013
01:29:18,960 --> 01:29:27,520
» Thank you, Mayor Little. Um, we had
extensive discussion on June 23rd and

1014
01:29:25,120 --> 01:29:30,560
there was, you know, significant public
interest, I would say, in this

1015
01:29:28,800 --> 01:29:35,520
application and I recognize the people
that uh wrote in at that time. Also want

1016
01:29:33,360 --> 01:29:40,960
to recognize Miss Pollock who um also
has written in and spoken to us tonight.

1017
01:29:37,840 --> 01:29:46,560
Um, one thing we again, we talked about
this on the 23rd. We're at a preliminary

1018
01:29:44,080 --> 01:29:51,679
stage with this zoning amendment
application. And so what the motion that

1019
01:29:48,880 --> 01:29:56,960
we passed at the committee level does is
it gives clear direction to a planner in

1020
01:29:53,920 --> 01:30:01,520
how to work with the humane society and
the professionals all directed toward

1021
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:08,480
what I believe is going to be a very
strong conservation outcome

1022
01:30:04,639 --> 01:30:13,679
and or at least build the pillars so we
can move on that on that road. So, and

1023
01:30:11,600 --> 01:30:18,239
so with that, I would like to move that
council direct staff to proceed with

1024
01:30:16,320 --> 01:30:22,719
referrals for this zoning amendment
application and that council direct

1025
01:30:20,400 --> 01:30:26,880
staff to seek additional information
from the applicant's qualified

1026
01:30:24,800 --> 01:30:32,080
environmental professional regarding
wildlife movement, habitat connectivity,

1027
01:30:29,600 --> 01:30:36,080
fencing, trails, and the potential
effects of the proposed animal shelter

1028
01:30:33,840 --> 01:30:41,280
use, including associated site
activities, structures, and future site

1029
01:30:38,800 --> 01:30:45,120
improvements on environmentally
sensitive areas of the property,

1030
01:30:43,199 --> 01:30:49,920
including any recommended mitigation
measures. And that council directs staff

1031
01:30:47,840 --> 01:30:53,760
in consultation with the applicant and
legal council to explore potential

1032
01:30:52,239 --> 01:30:57,360
options to address environmental
considerations associated with the

1033
01:30:55,840 --> 01:31:03,280
undisturbed southerntherly portion of
the property, including the potential

1034
01:30:59,280 --> 01:31:08,080
use of section 219 restrictive covenant,
and that staff report back to council

1035
01:31:05,760 --> 01:31:11,600
with a draft zoning amendment bylaw for
consideration. So moved.

1036
01:31:10,000 --> 01:31:13,520
» Okay. This is moved by councelor
Schugan.

1037
01:31:12,880 --> 01:31:18,320
» Seconded.
>> Seconded by council Donaldson. Do you

1038
01:31:15,760 --> 01:31:22,159
want to motivate further council? Then
I'll move to council Donaldson, then to

1039
01:31:20,320 --> 01:31:27,120
councelor Gray, and then I'll conclude
with my comments.

1040
01:31:25,120 --> 01:31:31,840
» Very simply, yeah. This allows our
planner um to advance the process and

1041
01:31:30,080 --> 01:31:36,480
return to council with a substantive
package to consider again with these

1042
01:31:33,600 --> 01:31:41,440
environmental pillars in place. I I with
respect to Miss Frri um she's probably

1043
01:31:39,679 --> 01:31:47,120
right about the um relationship between
the applicant and the proponent sorry

1044
01:31:45,360 --> 01:31:51,520
the staff and the proponent but there is
a relationship that our planner has with

1045
01:31:49,840 --> 01:31:57,440
the QEP as well. So I think the motion
is is solid enough in that respect. Um

1046
01:31:55,440 --> 01:32:01,360
again it does give the green light for
staff to discuss conservation covenants

1047
01:31:59,360 --> 01:32:06,560
and other options with the Humane
Society. Um, and I I think it is the

1048
01:32:05,360 --> 01:32:12,600
right thing to do. If you're looking for
a strong conservation outcome, this this

1049
01:32:08,719 --> 01:32:12,600
is the path to take.

1050
01:32:13,600 --> 01:32:22,239
» I'm sorry, Council Donaldson.
>> Thank you. Um yeah, I had a lot of

1051
01:32:20,239 --> 01:32:27,440
questions uh regarding this application
initially and I think that the second

1052
01:32:24,480 --> 01:32:31,679
paragraph here the and that council
direct staff regarding the QEP and it

1053
01:32:30,480 --> 01:32:36,880
does list a lot of different things
here. This is 38 over 38 acres and one

1054
01:32:35,360 --> 01:32:41,679
of the things they report out on is
having up to 100 dogs and 100 cats and

1055
01:32:39,280 --> 01:32:49,760
you know that's a concern.
Um, so I look I'm looking forward to a

1056
01:32:44,639 --> 01:32:55,520
much more conclusive um, report as to
what it ex exactly is is going to happen

1057
01:32:52,400 --> 01:32:59,920
with this property, whether that's uh,
50 to 100 dogs or whatever uh, closer to

1058
01:32:58,239 --> 01:33:03,199
the buildings or is it going to be the
whole property, that sort of thing. Uh,

1059
01:33:01,920 --> 01:33:10,480
one of the things that keeps coming up
at the community throughout the

1060
01:33:05,120 --> 01:33:15,840
community is the um the fact that the uh
the owners of this property

1061
01:33:13,440 --> 01:33:21,440
uh were very resistant to put a covenant
on when they were asked about when they

1062
01:33:18,400 --> 01:33:28,080
were inquiring about a permissive tax
exemption. This here now is asking again

1063
01:33:26,159 --> 01:33:33,199
but only a little bit different. This is
a 219 restrictive covenant for the whole

1064
01:33:30,639 --> 01:33:39,520
property. So I am looking forward to
what the outcome is, what uh work our

1065
01:33:35,760 --> 01:33:46,159
planner can um put together, working
with the proponent and uh giving a much

1066
01:33:42,960 --> 01:33:50,400
more conclusive uh report on this with
the end goal being a restrictive

1067
01:33:48,560 --> 01:33:56,000
covenant. [snorts]
Thank you.

1068
01:33:52,159 --> 01:34:01,199
» Okay, councelor Gray.
>> Yes. When I read the the motion again um

1069
01:33:59,520 --> 01:34:05,280
and consider our discussion earlier at
the planning committee

1070
01:34:03,360 --> 01:34:10,800
in some we're asking the staff to
negotiate a section 219 covenant with

1071
01:34:07,760 --> 01:34:14,800
the u proponent
and we have a letter in other words in

1072
01:34:13,120 --> 01:34:18,639
writing
the Victoria Humane Society said they

1073
01:34:16,480 --> 01:34:23,520
will not consider section 219 covenant
or other measures to protect the natural

1074
01:34:21,520 --> 01:34:28,239
world there. As a result I cannot
support this motion. I think that it is

1075
01:34:25,520 --> 01:34:35,040
futile to have that discussion at the
moment. I would be prepared to um accept

1076
01:34:32,159 --> 01:34:39,040
a motion that asked staff to speak with
the Humane Society

1077
01:34:37,199 --> 01:34:43,280
to get a better report on the
environment. In other words, the second

1078
01:34:40,719 --> 01:34:49,920
paragraph of the motion. But I see no
point in us expending valuable staff

1079
01:34:45,600 --> 01:34:55,480
time and legal um co legal costs when
the developers already said they're not

1080
01:34:52,480 --> 01:34:55,480
interested.

1081
01:34:56,159 --> 01:35:07,199
Okay, thank you. Um I will I will be
supporting this application. Um if you

1082
01:35:04,080 --> 01:35:14,080
look to the video of what was said at
that meeting, um certainly uh the uh

1083
01:35:11,600 --> 01:35:20,480
person in charge, Miss Stone, Miss Penny
Stone was very open uh to not only

1084
01:35:17,760 --> 01:35:27,199
having Bill Creek Watershed Protection
Society come on the land. I introduced

1085
01:35:23,520 --> 01:35:33,600
her at the end of the meeting with uh to
Allison Leuke uh who is spearheading the

1086
01:35:29,920 --> 01:35:40,880
Bilston uh watershed protection um
society at the moment um the group and

1087
01:35:37,920 --> 01:35:48,080
um she was very receptive to that. I
really wanted to see that connection um

1088
01:35:44,159 --> 01:35:56,400
as well. um she was uh a little bit more
amendable to discussing covenants. Um

1089
01:35:52,560 --> 01:36:02,320
and I also want to beg the question with
every application, are we now going to

1090
01:35:59,199 --> 01:36:08,159
ask for a special covenant or is it just
for this group? because if another

1091
01:36:05,440 --> 01:36:16,159
person, another entity, another
developer decided to buy this property,

1092
01:36:11,440 --> 01:36:21,040
they could um do whatever they want
according to the zoning. And let's not

1093
01:36:18,639 --> 01:36:27,520
forget that the provincial government
has brought down a number of different

1094
01:36:23,360 --> 01:36:34,320
bills and um a number of different
bills. uh bill 16 uh the transportation

1095
01:36:31,600 --> 01:36:41,199
amendment act. Bill 43 the housing
supply act we've talked about all this

1096
01:36:36,960 --> 01:36:47,920
bill 44 the housing statutes act um in
which enables smallcale multi-unit

1097
01:36:43,679 --> 01:36:56,719
housing uh bill 46 development financing
as well as bill 47 the transit oriented

1098
01:36:52,080 --> 01:37:01,520
areas. So if a um another entity was to
purchase this property, they would be

1099
01:36:59,199 --> 01:37:06,080
able to develop it according to the
zoning. And certainly we know from the

1100
01:37:03,679 --> 01:37:11,040
province that they're interested in
housing, they're interested in in

1101
01:37:08,480 --> 01:37:18,080
growth. Um and that's why I stated all
these different uh bills. Um so with

1102
01:37:14,960 --> 01:37:22,880
this property owner, um you've heard
from Peggy Jerves's daughter who came

1103
01:37:20,800 --> 01:37:29,280
who wrote us a letter. It's included in
the package as well. She spoke very

1104
01:37:25,440 --> 01:37:35,520
passionately at this meeting about the
intent of her mother, the the initial

1105
01:37:31,679 --> 01:37:41,440
intent of her mother's wishes. Um
she also spoke that both her brother and

1106
01:37:38,480 --> 01:37:47,679
her herself who inherited the property
from Miss Jervis, they were very happy

1107
01:37:43,920 --> 01:37:52,639
with who they chose to sell the property
to and they think that that they are

1108
01:37:50,560 --> 01:37:58,639
good stewards of the land. I think that
speaks volumes. Um she also mentioned

1109
01:37:56,000 --> 01:38:04,719
that she's welcomed on the property at
any time. They have the Victoria Humane

1110
01:38:01,920 --> 01:38:10,080
Society has allowed uh Miss Pollockch
and her brother to go on the property

1111
01:38:06,480 --> 01:38:15,600
and place a plaque in memory of their
mother Peggy Jervis as well. Miss

1112
01:38:12,960 --> 01:38:20,320
Pollock spoke at the meeting tonight and
said that if there were environmental

1113
01:38:17,840 --> 01:38:25,840
concerns, she would be the first to
speak out and she has no concerns. And a

1114
01:38:23,840 --> 01:38:30,960
lot of what we speak at at the table
here is trust. I have trust in Miss

1115
01:38:28,480 --> 01:38:36,000
Pollock. I have trust in the Victoria
Humane Society to do the right thing. I

1116
01:38:33,679 --> 01:38:40,800
know that another developer, another
sorry, another entity such as a

1117
01:38:38,159 --> 01:38:47,119
developer could take that site and do
things to it um um and develop according

1118
01:38:44,960 --> 01:38:52,400
to their zoning. We know that other
people in the area do have property and

1119
01:38:50,320 --> 01:38:58,000
are are doing things that are outside
their authority of zoning such as light

1120
01:38:55,920 --> 01:39:03,760
industrial activities when they're not
supposed to be doing that. Um I'm very

1121
01:39:01,119 --> 01:39:09,600
confident in what the Victoria Humane
Society is doing there. It it it puzzles

1122
01:39:07,199 --> 01:39:15,280
me why we are holding the Victoria
Humane Society to a higher account than

1123
01:39:12,719 --> 01:39:20,719
we have other properties. and are we
going to ask for a covenant on every

1124
01:39:17,679 --> 01:39:26,320
property? I don't think that's fair. I
will be speaking um further in favor of

1125
01:39:23,840 --> 01:39:30,960
this, but at this moment I'll keep an
open mind, but I will vote in favor.

1126
01:39:29,440 --> 01:39:35,280
Does anybody else have additional
comments?

1127
01:39:33,360 --> 01:39:40,080
» Yes, I'd like to speak again.
>> Yep. We've got Councelor Gray followed

1128
01:39:37,840 --> 01:39:43,840
by Councelor Donaldson and perhaps
councelor Shukin would like to weigh in

1129
01:39:41,679 --> 01:39:50,719
for a second time as well. Go ahead,
councelor Gray.

1130
01:39:47,119 --> 01:39:55,360
» I'm I guess I might say that
we're already aware that the owners of

1131
01:39:53,199 --> 01:39:58,960
the property did not follow the riparian
regulations.

1132
01:39:56,960 --> 01:40:03,440
So when you say you have full
confidence, I I'm sitting in the other

1133
01:40:01,840 --> 01:40:08,400
camp because we've already seen actions
on the property that were detrimental to

1134
01:40:05,040 --> 01:40:12,480
the environmental regulatory framework.
I think councelor Schu has emphasized

1135
01:40:10,400 --> 01:40:16,000
we're early in the process and I'm
simply saying rather than us spending

1136
01:40:13,840 --> 01:40:20,159
our money and time on this, let the
proponents take their time and consider

1137
01:40:18,159 --> 01:40:28,639
whether or not they want to come forward
um and um protect some of the property.

1138
01:40:26,480 --> 01:40:32,880
when you speak and say that you don't
think the covenant's um appropriate,

1139
01:40:31,040 --> 01:40:39,360
well, that would mean voting against the
motion because in this instance, Mayor

1140
01:40:35,600 --> 01:40:42,960
Little, what the motion is is to work
towards getting section 219 covenant.

1141
01:40:41,840 --> 01:40:46,560
We're not talking about other
properties. We're talking about this

1142
01:40:44,400 --> 01:40:51,040
property. And we're doing that because
the planner has recommended it to

1143
01:40:48,400 --> 01:40:53,920
council and and we passed it a planning
committee. So, you supported a covenant

1144
01:40:52,400 --> 01:41:01,040
then. Are you not supporting a covenant
at this point?

1145
01:40:57,119 --> 01:41:06,719
Is that a question to me or to staff?
>> A question to Mayor Little.

1146
01:41:03,280 --> 01:41:12,159
» Yeah, that's me. Um, so the the covenant
I'm I'm what I'm saying is we need to

1147
01:41:09,280 --> 01:41:19,040
follow due process. We need to follow
due process and and what is outlined by

1148
01:41:15,679 --> 01:41:25,760
our very experienced planner. That's
what that's what I'm um suggesting. I'm

1149
01:41:22,239 --> 01:41:32,239
I'm questioning the wisdom of having to
have uh covenants on all different

1150
01:41:29,119 --> 01:41:37,840
properties. I'm just wondering why this
it's I think it's a valid question. Why

1151
01:41:35,040 --> 01:41:42,719
is this particular property
being subject to to a section 219

1152
01:41:40,800 --> 01:41:47,360
restrictive covenant when other
properties haven't been? I'm just

1153
01:41:44,719 --> 01:41:52,159
begging that question. Um the planner
has suggested it with you at that

1154
01:41:49,840 --> 01:41:57,119
meeting. You will you will been have
been able to hear that Penny Stone is

1155
01:41:54,480 --> 01:42:06,719
more open to that and she said she will
consider that. I trust her on her work

1156
01:42:00,800 --> 01:42:14,480
regarding the um uh what did you term um
problems with the uh riparian um she

1157
01:42:11,840 --> 01:42:20,400
mentioned that she didn't realize what
what that she was breaking the rules

1158
01:42:17,520 --> 01:42:25,119
once once they were made aware that they
were doing something that they shouldn't

1159
01:42:22,000 --> 01:42:32,639
do. they stopped and they've they've got
valid um environmental professionals um

1160
01:42:29,600 --> 01:42:38,080
giving advice on this with that. I have
trust in them. I'm sorry that you don't,

1161
01:42:34,719 --> 01:42:42,800
but I I do have trust.
Uh councelor Schukan. Oh, sorry. I'm

1162
01:42:40,880 --> 01:42:47,679
sorry, Council Donaldson.
>> Thank you. Um, one of the outstanding

1163
01:42:45,679 --> 01:42:50,960
concerns that I have, not just of the
use of property, but this is an upland

1164
01:42:49,600 --> 01:42:57,280
zone
>> and heavily treed, um, this is in the

1165
01:42:54,080 --> 01:43:04,320
Sucro corridor, um, adjacent to the
buffer land section 25 and Neil Road.

1166
01:43:01,600 --> 01:43:10,000
And um being in the uplands, the one
thing that I've learned from the last

1167
01:43:06,159 --> 01:43:16,480
report um in seeing some photographs was
how much of the headwaters are um in the

1168
01:43:13,520 --> 01:43:21,280
uplands. And so protecting that is is
quite valuable when we think about the

1169
01:43:19,199 --> 01:43:26,400
headarters of the Bilston goes all the
way through our community. Um there are

1170
01:43:24,320 --> 01:43:33,119
a couple of farms that do have licenses
on that on the water from that. Um and

1171
01:43:30,159 --> 01:43:39,520
so you know keeping the water pure and
and clean and flowing. Um this is also

1172
01:43:37,280 --> 01:43:45,600
uh the value of having a restrictive
covenant in that area. Um and there are

1173
01:43:42,719 --> 01:43:51,360
several properties that would have um
subsidiary uh waters that go into the

1174
01:43:48,400 --> 01:43:55,679
Bilson. So the wershed is uh a valuable
asset to our community and runs straight

1175
01:43:53,199 --> 01:44:02,159
through it. So again protecting that is
is superior in my opinion.

1176
01:43:59,119 --> 01:44:08,960
Yeah, absolutely. Councelor Schuken.
>> Yeah.

1177
01:44:03,280 --> 01:44:12,320
um in terms of the humane society's um
you know actions around their fencing

1178
01:44:10,400 --> 01:44:17,199
and the stream crossings uh just to pull
a quote from the planners or the sorry

1179
01:44:14,480 --> 01:44:21,679
the report from the QEP says the QEP
reports that required remediation of

1180
01:44:18,800 --> 01:44:25,119
previous unremitted unpermitted stream
crossings has now been completed in

1181
01:44:23,600 --> 01:44:31,600
accordance with the water sustainability
act and no further remediation of stream

1182
01:44:27,520 --> 01:44:36,719
crossings is required. So, um I I
thought Council Gray's comments at the

1183
01:44:34,080 --> 01:44:43,600
other day were were actually really
aggressive in terms of terming things

1184
01:44:39,199 --> 01:44:47,840
illegal. Um uh and and I'm glad the the
planner or Miss Johnson didn't take the

1185
01:44:45,760 --> 01:44:53,360
bait and u threw it back to the report
itself. Um, the one thing I would just

1186
01:44:50,080 --> 01:45:00,719
say though is if anybody at this table
wants to be that pointed and point out

1187
01:44:57,119 --> 01:45:05,920
um, unauthorized uses on sites that come
before us for reasonzoning, say, that

1188
01:45:03,040 --> 01:45:10,159
they're consistent and that they they
take a look at maybe unauthorized uses

1189
01:45:08,000 --> 01:45:13,920
that might be in place on some of those
other things. So, I hope that is a

1190
01:45:11,840 --> 01:45:19,280
precedent that that might be set
especially for certain individuals at

1191
01:45:15,840 --> 01:45:23,760
this table. And again, I ask folks to
look around if they want to have a an

1192
01:45:21,679 --> 01:45:27,760
understanding of the impacts going on in
that area. Look around, look broadly at

1193
01:45:26,320 --> 01:45:30,639
some of the neighbors to this particular
property.

1194
01:45:29,119 --> 01:45:37,040
» So, I'll leave it at that. But the one
thing I I take your point, Mayor Little,

1195
01:45:33,760 --> 01:45:43,440
why the Humane Society is being target
like I I don't know the emphasis on a

1196
01:45:40,080 --> 01:45:48,480
covenant for this particular um property
owner. Um, we have a number of um,

1197
01:45:46,080 --> 01:45:51,760
permissive tax exemption, sorry,
organizations looking for permissive tax

1198
01:45:50,159 --> 01:45:54,880
exemptions coming up in the next
discussion. I'm going to support I'll

1199
01:45:53,679 --> 01:45:59,119
tip my hat right now. I'm going to
support the status quo. But I do want to

1200
01:45:57,119 --> 01:46:04,639
point out a few things. The Victoria
Motorcycle Club, there's no covenant on

1201
01:46:01,520 --> 01:46:08,239
that property as I understand it. Um,
um, the Chosen Hall Society, I'm betting

1202
01:46:06,320 --> 01:46:12,960
there isn't a protective covenant there.
Uh, the YMCA, there is no protective

1203
01:46:10,719 --> 01:46:17,440
covenant there. the Boys and Girls Club,
there is no protective covenant with

1204
01:46:14,880 --> 01:46:20,960
that organization. Um BC Parks
Foundation on Hummingbird Hill, as I

1205
01:46:19,199 --> 01:46:25,760
understand it, there was no protective
covenant there either. So I I'm a little

1206
01:46:23,360 --> 01:46:31,600
confused as to why the Humane Society is
being singled out, but again, they've

1207
01:46:28,239 --> 01:46:35,920
indicated I saw them there um indicated
a willingness to enter some discussions.

1208
01:46:33,760 --> 01:46:40,159
So yeah, I'll leave it at that.
>> Yeah, good point. I think it's uh

1209
01:46:37,920 --> 01:46:45,440
council Donaldson has point out in the
past about we should treat everybody

1210
01:46:41,920 --> 01:46:50,000
fairly and evenly and perhaps if this is
the route we're going to go down um

1211
01:46:47,840 --> 01:46:55,600
perhaps with the Victorian Motorcycle
Club, with the um Hall Society, Boys and

1212
01:46:53,440 --> 01:47:01,040
Girls Club, all of them, maybe they
should all have protective covenants on

1213
01:46:57,679 --> 01:47:06,800
their properties. Um that's probably not
practical and it might be expensive. Uh

1214
01:47:04,320 --> 01:47:12,639
but I think that needs to be considered
if we hold one group and one property uh

1215
01:47:10,000 --> 01:47:20,719
to this. Um, and I take your point,
council, and look around and um that

1216
01:47:15,920 --> 01:47:27,440
area um and uh see uh what is happening
on some of the properties in in the area

1217
01:47:24,400 --> 01:47:32,560
um in terms of u not abiding by
provincial legislations um cutting trees

1218
01:47:30,480 --> 01:47:38,719
that they shouldn't have uh destroying
the canopy. Um so I I take your point

1219
01:47:36,639 --> 01:47:42,639
and thank you for that.
Okay, I'm gonna call the question. Oh,

1220
01:47:41,360 --> 01:47:46,560
go ahead.
>> Yeah, for for a third time. Go ahead.

1221
01:47:44,639 --> 01:47:52,159
» I just
>> Yeah. Um, well, I think some said that

1222
01:47:49,520 --> 01:47:57,360
it it's worth um just covering a few
points. One point is that the reason why

1223
01:47:55,360 --> 01:48:02,800
the planner is suggesting a covenant
here, it's quite well detailed in her

1224
01:48:00,159 --> 01:48:06,880
report to us is to uphold our official
community plan.

1225
01:48:04,960 --> 01:48:13,280
We're we're being asked for an amendment
to zoning and that has led us and led

1226
01:48:10,480 --> 01:48:18,000
the planner to say now when that happens
now's your time to step in and follow

1227
01:48:15,760 --> 01:48:20,960
the plan. It's a sensitive ecosystem.
Make a move to protect it. So that's the

1228
01:48:19,679 --> 01:48:25,119
rationale. I'm sorry that people have
missed it. On the second the second

1229
01:48:23,280 --> 01:48:30,000
point in relation to permissive tax
exemptions, you will all recall that

1230
01:48:27,280 --> 01:48:37,119
last summer we passed a brand new policy
such that we would uh on the advice of

1231
01:48:33,440 --> 01:48:42,480
me ask seek uh covenants on properties
that have significant forest canopy in

1232
01:48:40,000 --> 01:48:47,920
time. We would have be we would have
been doing that this year except that

1233
01:48:45,840 --> 01:48:52,080
council abolished the permissive tax
exemptions for 2026. So it's already on

1234
01:48:50,400 --> 01:48:56,639
the books that we are going to pursue
that policy not to force people but to

1235
01:48:54,400 --> 01:49:00,080
enter a discussion with them. But all
those other organizations that were

1236
01:48:58,000 --> 01:49:04,560
named none of them are seeking
amendments to their zoning. So that's

1237
01:49:02,159 --> 01:49:08,960
why this is special. It's not targeting
them. It's in response to an application

1238
01:49:06,880 --> 01:49:12,560
for a zoning amendment and it's a simple
responsibility of the local government

1239
01:49:10,639 --> 01:49:16,000
to follow its OCP and take that
opportunity to move us forward. Thank

1240
01:49:15,280 --> 01:49:19,360
you.
>> Thank you. Since I've given you the

1241
01:49:17,760 --> 01:49:24,239
third opportunity, I'll also give
everybody else the the third opportunity

1242
01:49:21,600 --> 01:49:28,800
to speak. Does anybody else at the table
wish to speak

1243
01:49:26,480 --> 01:49:33,679
um provide more commentary? Go ahead,
Councelor Donaldson.

1244
01:49:30,239 --> 01:49:37,520
» I just want to uh uh clarify
uh and hopefully everybody in the room

1245
01:49:35,119 --> 01:49:45,440
has followed this. Um we're talking
about a zoning amendment, not a PTE.

1246
01:49:41,840 --> 01:49:51,119
that was PTE was a previous discussion
that is not to be mixed up with this.

1247
01:49:48,480 --> 01:49:56,639
» I think that's that's very important. Um
here um we'll discuss the permissive tax

1248
01:49:54,480 --> 01:50:04,800
exemptions later this evening. We're
discussing this uh zoning application.

1249
01:50:00,880 --> 01:50:11,280
Now, uh um what I want to point out is
uh even prior uh to this zoning

1250
01:50:08,719 --> 01:50:18,159
amendment application when we were
discussing the permissive tax exemptions

1251
01:50:14,480 --> 01:50:23,360
and it goes back to 2023, September
11th, 2023.

1252
01:50:20,320 --> 01:50:29,679
And uh when Penny Stone came to council
to talk about permissive tax exemptions,

1253
01:50:26,159 --> 01:50:36,239
it was at that time that Penny Stone was
approached by members of our community

1254
01:50:32,159 --> 01:50:44,080
asking for uh a covenant. And at that
time she was asked to give up part of

1255
01:50:39,360 --> 01:50:49,360
her property in exchange for um I don't
know I I don't know what in exchange

1256
01:50:46,239 --> 01:50:56,320
for. Um that was not council. It was not
the mayor. it was not our staff and and

1257
01:50:52,159 --> 01:51:02,639
I think um I don't think I know that
that set the tone of the relationship

1258
01:50:59,360 --> 01:51:08,400
between the district of Machosen and uh
Penny Stone rightly or wrongly. Uh I

1259
01:51:05,600 --> 01:51:13,199
think uh that and she acknowledged this
when she spoke. She got her backup a

1260
01:51:10,880 --> 01:51:17,520
little bit. And I would too if I had
just bought a property and I had

1261
01:51:15,119 --> 01:51:22,320
outsiders coming in and telling me that
I needed to put a restrictive covenant

1262
01:51:19,760 --> 01:51:28,480
on my property and that I needed to give
up part of the property that I was I had

1263
01:51:26,080 --> 01:51:33,679
just purchased from donor um
contributions. And and so what I spoke

1264
01:51:31,600 --> 01:51:39,119
about quite passionately the last
meeting was I want to see a reset in the

1265
01:51:37,040 --> 01:51:44,560
communications between the district
between the residents and this property.

1266
01:51:42,000 --> 01:51:50,880
I think they are valued members of our
community. I welcome them here. There

1267
01:51:47,360 --> 01:51:57,719
could be far worse you activities on
that property.

1268
01:51:53,360 --> 01:51:57,719
I will vote in favor of this motion.

1269
01:51:57,840 --> 01:52:07,119
Okay. I'm going to call the question on
what has been um put forward. Uh the

1270
01:52:03,679 --> 01:52:15,520
motion is there uh on screen and it is
in your business arising 7A.

1271
01:52:12,000 --> 01:52:19,760
I'll call the question. All in favor?
Those opposed?

1272
01:52:18,480 --> 01:52:23,840
» Opposed?
>> Opposed by councelor Grave. That motion

1273
01:52:21,760 --> 01:52:30,119
passes. Thank you everyone. That was a
good discussion. Moving along to reports

1274
01:52:26,880 --> 01:52:30,119
for action.

1275
01:52:34,639 --> 01:52:44,000
Reports for action. We have a request
for a development development variance

1276
01:52:39,440 --> 01:52:50,400
permit 1010 Mat Lake Park Drive. We have
a report here. And um who's going to

1277
01:52:48,239 --> 01:52:55,840
take that? Councelor Schukan.
>> Thank you very much, Mayor Little. Um

1278
01:52:52,480 --> 01:53:00,400
again the variance request is for a
setback of 24 meters just slightly over

1279
01:52:57,920 --> 01:53:05,840
that from 50 meters which is in our
bylaw. Uh when all and and that is the

1280
01:53:04,080 --> 01:53:14,800
only thing there the building is the
size of the um secondary suite as

1281
01:53:08,000 --> 01:53:20,480
required by the um land use bylaw. Um I
will so from my perspective um the

1282
01:53:18,639 --> 01:53:23,360
proposed variance does minimize sight
disturbances and helps maintain the

1283
01:53:22,000 --> 01:53:29,280
natural character of the property
especially with the shared driveway and

1284
01:53:26,639 --> 01:53:33,599
with the one variance just being the
setback um from the principal residence.

1285
01:53:32,080 --> 01:53:39,360
We're we're not considering everything
else. the residences or sorry the

1286
01:53:36,320 --> 01:53:45,840
setbacks from the side and front of the
yard are well within our um our

1287
01:53:42,320 --> 01:53:52,880
allowances. Now I do take Mr. Gross's um
comments um but into consideration but

1288
01:53:50,400 --> 01:53:57,520
we do take those into consideration. We
look at what the potential impacts are

1289
01:53:54,639 --> 01:54:02,159
to biodiversity elements and consistency
with community values and also um

1290
01:54:00,560 --> 01:54:07,920
especially the setbacks the required
setbacks. So with that, I would like to

1291
01:54:05,360 --> 01:54:12,400
move that um council direct staff to
issue development variance permit

1292
01:54:10,080 --> 01:54:16,239
application 2602
further recommendation. So moved.

1293
01:54:14,400 --> 01:54:21,880
» Moved by councelor Shukin, seconded by
council Donaldson. Do you wish to

1294
01:54:17,679 --> 01:54:21,880
motivate further further?

1295
01:54:22,239 --> 01:54:29,199
» Okay. No comments from councelor Shukin.
Councelter Donaldson,

1296
01:54:27,119 --> 01:54:34,239
» I just want to comment that uh we did do
a site visit

1297
01:54:30,960 --> 01:54:37,920
» uh to see where uh the the lay of the
land was. There are no trees or

1298
01:54:36,080 --> 01:54:42,320
shrubbery in the way. It's uh
interesting that it isn't upland zone

1299
01:54:39,679 --> 01:54:45,599
because it was uh fairly
level. Yeah.

1300
01:54:43,280 --> 01:54:50,560
» Um the concern in the report was that
there was a rock in the middle of the

1301
01:54:47,679 --> 01:54:54,800
driveway. I didn't see that, but that
again isn't a concern. They put the

1302
01:54:52,159 --> 01:55:01,679
driveway where they needed to. uh based
on the bedrock underneath and the um and

1303
01:54:58,719 --> 01:55:07,920
cited the fact that the uh secondary
dwelling on the opposite side of that

1304
01:55:04,639 --> 01:55:16,639
drive shared driveway to the house. Um
anything closer uh there's quite a a

1305
01:55:12,960 --> 01:55:22,400
deviation into the um of the land that
goes into say the basement area. the

1306
01:55:19,520 --> 01:55:28,320
frontal part or I guess the Maton Lake
side of it is more filled. So building

1307
01:55:24,639 --> 01:55:33,440
on fill isn't as um secure I suppose
than where they sited. So I do

1308
01:55:29,840 --> 01:55:37,760
appreciate the site that they have. I um
empathize with the neighbor with the

1309
01:55:35,040 --> 01:55:42,080
sounds traveling because there has been
nobody on this property ever. There's no

1310
01:55:40,639 --> 01:55:48,000
dwellings on this property. It's been
vacant for no

1311
01:55:45,280 --> 01:55:52,400
forever I guess. Yeah. So, so that will
be certainly an adjustment. Certainly

1312
01:55:49,840 --> 01:55:58,639
something um that maybe the neighbors
can um work through as well. So, I I do

1313
01:55:55,440 --> 01:56:04,480
understand the concerns there.
>> Okay. Councelor Gray, you weren't able

1314
01:56:01,520 --> 01:56:10,480
to attend the site visit. Um but did you
have any comments regarding this?

1315
01:56:08,239 --> 01:56:15,599
» Yes, I do.
We've looked at quite a few variances um

1316
01:56:13,040 --> 01:56:20,639
for this sort of thing and this is the
first time we've heard from a neighbor

1317
01:56:17,360 --> 01:56:25,840
opposing the application for variance on
the basis of the noise and disturbance.

1318
01:56:23,760 --> 01:56:29,360
Um each time we've looked at the
variances

1319
01:56:27,840 --> 01:56:35,360
I've considered I think council
considered two questions. One was would

1320
01:56:32,560 --> 01:56:40,719
it disturb the neighbors
um as much or more than the principal

1321
01:56:37,599 --> 01:56:45,599
residents? And two was what about the
driveway? A single driveway with no

1322
01:56:43,599 --> 01:56:51,119
opportunity for a new driveway which
might um

1323
01:56:48,480 --> 01:56:56,800
encourage subdivision interest in future
times. So of the two tests, this one

1324
01:56:53,920 --> 01:57:04,080
seems to fail on the first test.
um the disturbance of the neighbors and

1325
01:56:59,599 --> 01:57:08,239
I'm also concerned with the issue of
Mr. Gross when he spoke said he re

1326
01:57:06,159 --> 01:57:12,080
received the referral on Friday before
to before the meeting today on Monday.

1327
01:57:10,880 --> 01:57:18,320
So, I'm wondering about the other
neighbors and I'm curious if we and

1328
01:57:15,040 --> 01:57:22,159
maybe I'm pitch to the planning chair, M
councelor Schukan, should we be

1329
01:57:20,000 --> 01:57:27,320
deferring this until we hear concretely
from all of the neighbors who have been

1330
01:57:24,000 --> 01:57:27,320
sent referrals,

1331
01:57:29,199 --> 01:57:39,360
» councelor Shuken, um we can also ask
staff um uh Mr. Payet, as I understand

1332
01:57:35,840 --> 01:57:44,199
it, um we did receive replies from um
anybody else that received the letter,

1333
01:57:44,320 --> 01:57:53,760
» Miss uh Miss Barnes or CEO Payet.
>> Um I don't really have a response other

1334
01:57:51,520 --> 01:57:58,560
than um
if there's if there's a date on the

1335
01:57:55,599 --> 01:58:01,280
letter to respond by maybe. I don't
remember seeing the letter, but we could

1336
01:58:00,480 --> 01:58:04,080
look that up.
>> Okay. quickly.

1337
01:58:02,159 --> 01:58:07,360
» This this was a letter that was sent to
the the neighbors regarding the

1338
01:58:05,840 --> 01:58:13,199
application. Go ahead, councelor
>> Shugan. Um I'm I'm not preferred sorry

1339
01:58:09,840 --> 01:58:18,480
I'm not prepared to um wait. I mean if
the vote at the table is is such um we

1340
01:58:16,639 --> 01:58:25,119
can the one thing I would just say
whether it's 15 m 24 meters the you know

1341
01:58:23,199 --> 01:58:29,280
the impact of sound is unlikely to
change

1342
01:58:26,159 --> 01:58:34,400
» based on you know the secondary Sweden
and the difference of um what is it 9

1343
01:58:31,520 --> 01:58:39,760
meters so again as councelor Donaldson
says there's been no home there

1344
01:58:36,320 --> 01:58:43,440
» ever so that is a change I I and we all
sorry there are many of us in the

1345
01:58:41,360 --> 01:58:46,960
community that go through this. Uh you
live next to a site that isn't developed

1346
01:58:45,040 --> 01:58:50,560
and all of a sudden you've got uh great
neighbors next to you and their lovely

1347
01:58:49,119 --> 01:58:55,360
dog and children and all that and you
hear noise you never did before. So,

1348
01:58:52,480 --> 01:58:59,920
» Right. Right. And actually, since we've
got the applicant here and the neighbor

1349
01:58:57,360 --> 01:59:04,880
at this meeting, perhaps we can after
the council meeting introduce them both

1350
01:59:01,920 --> 01:59:09,440
so that they have a starting basis for a
good neighbor uh to neighbor

1351
01:59:07,040 --> 01:59:13,520
communication. um because many of the
issues that we deal with or or that

1352
01:59:11,360 --> 01:59:17,840
staff deals with are neighborto-
neighbor issue and it costs us a lot of

1353
01:59:15,280 --> 01:59:24,400
money and by law enforcement. So uh
let's um I hopefully these two parties

1354
01:59:21,040 --> 01:59:31,679
can um connect and talk about their
mutual uh differences and uh their the

1355
01:59:28,080 --> 01:59:35,440
places where they meet on.
Okay.

1356
01:59:33,280 --> 01:59:41,119
And that's also about the the site
visit. That is the beauty of us going to

1357
01:59:37,840 --> 01:59:46,000
the site and seeing for ourselves. Um
seeing uh plans on a map are very

1358
01:59:43,760 --> 01:59:49,920
difficult uh to make a decision and
that's why we insist upon every time

1359
01:59:48,080 --> 01:59:55,280
going for a site visit and that's the
beauty of seeing that that property

1360
01:59:52,080 --> 02:00:00,800
because it's not a a large uh canopied
property. It's pretty wide open and it

1361
01:59:57,840 --> 02:00:07,119
is in the definition of the uplands.
It's sort of rocky outcrops. uh it's not

1362
02:00:03,920 --> 02:00:12,400
necessarily a a treed area uh where
you'd have that buffer. Um but the

1363
02:00:10,239 --> 02:00:17,199
property owner also at that site visit
that that others that didn't attend it

1364
02:00:14,400 --> 02:00:23,040
would know. Um it was pointed out to her
that or to um the the uh mother of the

1365
02:00:21,119 --> 02:00:29,520
owner of the property that there's a
very a huge amount of gor growing which

1366
02:00:26,239 --> 02:00:35,360
is a huge fire hazard uh for us in this
community as we saw in California when

1367
02:00:32,639 --> 02:00:41,440
uh the hills went up and it was u some
of it due to uh species like gorse and

1368
02:00:38,560 --> 02:00:45,599
so um she said at that time thank you uh
we've got the digger here or the the

1369
02:00:43,520 --> 02:00:49,520
bulldozer here we can rip it with the
bulldozer and um but there's some on the

1370
02:00:48,239 --> 02:00:54,159
other side of the fence. So, they'll
have to have those communications with

1371
02:00:51,280 --> 02:01:00,960
their neighbors. So, okay. Well, let's
move to calling the question then. I'll

1372
02:00:56,719 --> 02:01:04,639
call call the question. All in favor?
Those opposed?

1373
02:01:03,440 --> 02:01:11,360
» Opposed.
>> Uh those uh that passes unanimously.

1374
02:01:08,719 --> 02:01:14,000
Councelor Donaldson. Did you vote in
favor?

1375
02:01:12,320 --> 02:01:18,960
» Yeah. Council Donaldson, Council
Schukan, myself voted in favor.

1376
02:01:16,159 --> 02:01:23,199
Councelor Gray was opposed.
Okay, moving along to reports for

1377
02:01:21,280 --> 02:01:30,440
information. We have the District of
Mosen public communication statistics

1378
02:01:25,760 --> 02:01:30,440
report June 2026.

1379
02:01:31,920 --> 02:01:41,119
If I could have a motion. Yep. Move
receipt by councelor Shukan, seconded by

1380
02:01:37,599 --> 02:01:46,800
council Donaldson. comment.
Get these monthly. I'll call the

1381
02:01:43,679 --> 02:01:51,679
question. All in favor? Opposed? No one
opposed. We have the District of Mosen

1382
02:01:49,440 --> 02:01:58,119
building inspection department report
June 2026.

1383
02:01:53,599 --> 02:01:58,119
The report. I'll take a motion.

1384
02:01:58,159 --> 02:02:07,440
» Moved by councelor Shuken receipt.
Seconded by council Donaldson. All those

1385
02:02:04,880 --> 02:02:11,920
in favor?
Anyone opposed?

1386
02:02:10,239 --> 02:02:18,320
Hearing no one opposed. Let's move along
to 10. A this is correspondence. We have

1387
02:02:15,679 --> 02:02:23,599
a request from the mayor of the city of
Victoria. A request for contribution to

1388
02:02:21,440 --> 02:02:31,040
support the 2026 Truth and
Reconciliation Day ceremonial event. The

1389
02:02:27,360 --> 02:02:37,840
letter is there for your perusal. Um
what say ye? Does anybody have any

1390
02:02:33,440 --> 02:02:43,280
comments regarding this letter?
I will comment then. I think um I think

1391
02:02:40,639 --> 02:02:49,280
it behooves us if we've got some money
uh to support the city of Victoria. I

1392
02:02:45,920 --> 02:02:55,360
think even a nominal uh a very modest uh
donation of let's say $200 to support

1393
02:02:52,639 --> 02:03:00,880
this. We've never supported it before.
It is a regional um activity. It's

1394
02:02:58,480 --> 02:03:08,320
attended by thousands. were welcome to
attend and I would ask maybe a comment

1395
02:03:04,719 --> 02:03:15,280
from our CFO if we have money um in the
budget uh to do this. If not then then

1396
02:03:10,960 --> 02:03:22,880
we don't do we have any um extra funds.
Uh we're pretty tight here. Uh CFO Creek

1397
02:03:20,000 --> 02:03:26,960
» through the chair. Um so council has
already given away all the money that's

1398
02:03:24,480 --> 02:03:32,560
been budgeted for the grant aid um for
2026.

1399
02:03:28,639 --> 02:03:36,480
But if you wanted to give 200, we could
uh pull something out from the uh

1400
02:03:34,880 --> 02:03:39,679
unappropriated surplus.
>> Okay.

1401
02:03:37,280 --> 02:03:45,920
» And that would hold uh for other
requests uh such as the First Nations

1402
02:03:42,960 --> 02:03:53,199
Canoe Family uh tribal journey as well
if we were to go down that route. Um

1403
02:03:48,560 --> 02:03:56,880
that would be from um surplus as well
>> through the chair certainly could do

1404
02:03:55,040 --> 02:04:01,119
that. Uh but we've actually we do have
some grant funding that is more than

1405
02:03:59,119 --> 02:04:04,639
likely available for that purpose. We
can talk about that one pops up.

1406
02:04:02,880 --> 02:04:09,360
» Okay. So we'll cross that bridge when we
come to it. Let's deal with this one. Uh

1407
02:04:06,960 --> 02:04:13,520
Maryanne Alto's request.
>> Uh go ahead council shooken.

1408
02:04:11,520 --> 02:04:17,280
» Mayor Little, if that's a motion to
support the um the regional powo at

1409
02:04:15,599 --> 02:04:22,560
$200, I'll second it.
>> Okay. Yep. So that was moved by me.

1410
02:04:20,480 --> 02:04:29,199
Mayor Little, seconded by councelor
Schukan. Anybody else have any comments?

1411
02:04:27,360 --> 02:04:33,360
Okay, I'll call the question. All in
favor?

1412
02:04:31,040 --> 02:04:37,840
Those opposed?
Hearing none opposed. Let's move along

1413
02:04:34,960 --> 02:04:43,119
to 10B. This is a request from Julia
Leget, a manager of the counseling

1414
02:04:40,320 --> 02:04:49,119
programs for the P Pacific Center Family
Services Association. This is a request

1415
02:04:45,920 --> 02:04:54,880
for longterm funding for the mobile
youth services team.

1416
02:04:52,560 --> 02:04:59,520
Uh, you can see the letter there. I'm
just pulling it up. My my computer has

1417
02:04:57,599 --> 02:05:04,320
frozen.
Oh, there we go. Okay. So, this is the

1418
02:05:01,599 --> 02:05:09,119
letter dated uh June 30th out of
interest for everybody in the um

1419
02:05:07,119 --> 02:05:14,080
community. This was sent to every
council, every municipality in the

1420
02:05:11,360 --> 02:05:19,840
region within the CRD. So, they're
they're advocating. This is the Pacific

1421
02:05:17,199 --> 02:05:25,520
Center Family Services Association
located in the city of Cwood. Um, they

1422
02:05:23,119 --> 02:05:32,400
are advocating for long-term funding for
the mobile youth services team, which is

1423
02:05:28,639 --> 02:05:39,599
uh a team composed of a counselor and a
police officer that moves throughout the

1424
02:05:35,280 --> 02:05:45,599
region responding to youth and family
concerns regarding

1425
02:05:41,760 --> 02:05:50,880
um sex trafficking, regarding
um youth being in trouble for one reason

1426
02:05:48,560 --> 02:05:56,960
or another. they're supported by this
pro this program and uh otherwise

1427
02:05:54,159 --> 02:06:03,679
they're facing violence um gang
recruitment, sexual exploitation and

1428
02:05:59,520 --> 02:06:07,920
trafficking uh substance use um and in
contact with the police or the courts at

1429
02:06:06,239 --> 02:06:12,800
the Victoria Family Court and Youth
Justice. We have been advocating

1430
02:06:10,239 --> 02:06:16,880
strongly for the eight years that I've
been on the committee. I'm chair of the

1431
02:06:14,800 --> 02:06:23,679
committee and I'm actually quite
exhausted writing letters and speaking

1432
02:06:19,599 --> 02:06:28,400
about the need for this um long-term uh
funding for this group. As you'll

1433
02:06:25,920 --> 02:06:33,599
mention at this table, we did hear from
Superintendent Todd Preston that he had

1434
02:06:31,440 --> 02:06:39,280
changed the model which was very
unfortunate without notice to us,

1435
02:06:36,400 --> 02:06:44,239
without engagement, without any kind of
consultation. We heard about it after

1436
02:06:41,199 --> 02:06:50,719
the fact that the uh Westshore was no
longer going to be a part of the uh

1437
02:06:47,199 --> 02:06:55,360
missed or a part of that mobile youth
services team. Um which was very

1438
02:06:53,440 --> 02:07:01,440
disappointing to me and I'm hoping that
will change in the future. But regarding

1439
02:06:57,920 --> 02:07:07,599
this specific ask, um I did put put
forward a notice of motion at the CRD

1440
02:07:03,760 --> 02:07:14,159
table last week. Um and that passed
unanimously and that was to ask, it was

1441
02:07:10,560 --> 02:07:21,599
simple ask. It was to ask the staff at
the CRD to consider funding options.

1442
02:07:18,079 --> 02:07:26,480
What is available at the CRD table for
this regional mobile youth services

1443
02:07:24,719 --> 02:07:31,679
team? And I I brought that forward
because it is applicable. It is a

1444
02:07:29,040 --> 02:07:36,480
regional table that I sit on and this is
a regional service. So this is not

1445
02:07:34,480 --> 02:07:42,239
problems that are only happening in
Langford. Believe me, it's happening in

1446
02:07:39,360 --> 02:07:48,480
Oak Bay, Central Sanage, Sydney and this
mobile youth services team is uh moves

1447
02:07:46,079 --> 02:07:55,920
across borders. I'm very passionate
about the group. Um and uh that's why I

1448
02:07:53,280 --> 02:08:01,440
um I put forward the notice of motion.
So I'm not sure if um we need to

1449
02:07:59,599 --> 02:08:06,000
actually do anything. We can send an
advocacy letter. That would be great. Um

1450
02:08:04,000 --> 02:08:12,480
I've written hundreds I'm sure for the
mobile youth services team and I can

1451
02:08:08,079 --> 02:08:17,760
write one more. Um but we it is um at
the hands of the CRD uh right now and I

1452
02:08:15,920 --> 02:08:24,800
think that is more appropriate than
individual municipalities responding

1453
02:08:20,400 --> 02:08:30,639
with with um either advocacy or funding.
Have I made that clear? Yeah. Okay.

1454
02:08:28,000 --> 02:08:36,719
Councelor Donaldson,
>> I'm just wondering um as I read through

1455
02:08:33,360 --> 02:08:39,920
this letter um
>> I understand the value of of this group

1456
02:08:38,880 --> 02:08:45,280
for sure.
>> Um but like so many things keeps getting

1457
02:08:43,199 --> 02:08:50,159
downloaded to municipalities.
>> So I appreciate you making the notice

1458
02:08:46,880 --> 02:08:54,880
motion and I would like for us when we
when when you move that along to to get

1459
02:08:52,639 --> 02:09:00,000
more of a report on that. But I'm also
thinking we're also going to UBCM and if

1460
02:08:57,840 --> 02:09:03,440
it's if there's an opportunity to put in
a late resolution

1461
02:09:01,760 --> 02:09:08,159
» to this effect
>> because that is the place to do it.

1462
02:09:05,440 --> 02:09:13,440
» Yeah, we have had no motions um
delegations at at UBCM before. U but

1463
02:09:11,679 --> 02:09:18,639
it's a good it's a good thought. Let's
let's put our heads together and and um

1464
02:09:16,159 --> 02:09:24,079
put in a a late motion. That's that's a
good idea. Um what was your first point?

1465
02:09:22,159 --> 02:09:28,639
I've forgotten. Well, I'm just saying
like the um the fact that this is a very

1466
02:09:27,679 --> 02:09:32,400
valuable service,
>> right?

1467
02:09:29,199 --> 02:09:36,800
» Right. Um you've got this notice motion
at the CRD

1468
02:09:34,239 --> 02:09:40,000
and and all the leaders there of the
region are there.

1469
02:09:38,639 --> 02:09:43,599
» Um [clears throat] yeah, you could you
could write another letter to the

1470
02:09:41,360 --> 02:09:46,079
province, but it may fall on deaf ears,
but rallying up

1471
02:09:45,280 --> 02:09:50,079
» sure
>> everybody in the region. Yeah.

1472
02:09:47,920 --> 02:09:56,480
» Um and then I look further on here about
the percentage. I mean 1% of Machosen

1473
02:09:53,599 --> 02:10:01,920
just in our budget alone that's $30,000.
But if we compare that with, you know,

1474
02:09:59,520 --> 02:10:04,639
um other communities here, they're
paying more. Obviously, they got more

1475
02:10:03,440 --> 02:10:09,440
people, that sort of stuff. It's I don't
know. It's it

1476
02:10:06,719 --> 02:10:14,239
it's only 1%, but 1% is a lot of money.
>> It is a lot of money for us. Yeah.

1477
02:10:11,920 --> 02:10:19,199
» Okay. Regarding I'm so glad that you
brought this up, Councelor Donaldson.

1478
02:10:16,000 --> 02:10:24,400
Very perceptive of you. that uh comment
regarding downloading was also at the

1479
02:10:21,599 --> 02:10:29,440
CRD table. It was my Tate actually that
that mentioned that we have been subject

1480
02:10:27,199 --> 02:10:35,360
we as municipalities have been subject
to uh downloading and what my response

1481
02:10:32,639 --> 02:10:41,920
to that was that the province um they're
in uh billions of dollars deficit. Um I

1482
02:10:39,280 --> 02:10:47,040
understand that um the the federal
government also has different priorities

1483
02:10:44,239 --> 02:10:53,280
at the moment uh given the global global
crisis. Um it's just simply I brought

1484
02:10:50,320 --> 02:10:58,000
this forward because I'm impatient and
I'm not trying to point fingers at the

1485
02:10:55,199 --> 02:11:02,719
province or the feds. I'm just impatient
because it's been eight years of hard

1486
02:11:00,239 --> 02:11:07,440
advocacy and we haven't seen anything
move. And so that's why I brought it to

1487
02:11:05,040 --> 02:11:13,440
the CRD table and it passed uh
unanimously by the way despite the

1488
02:11:09,679 --> 02:11:19,760
reservations from uh the the um district
of Souk and the city of Colwood. It it

1489
02:11:16,480 --> 02:11:28,400
was a unanimous uh decision to ask staff
to go back and look at funding options.

1490
02:11:23,760 --> 02:11:32,639
Okay. So um I think what we should do if
you don't mind my direction is move

1491
02:11:30,320 --> 02:11:37,360
receipt of this letter. Would that be
palatable at the table? Okay, go ahead.

1492
02:11:35,760 --> 02:11:39,599
Council Dalson, would you like to do
that?

1493
02:11:38,159 --> 02:11:44,960
» Yeah, I would suggest that we move
receipt on this um this correspondence.

1494
02:11:42,639 --> 02:11:49,119
» Okay. Moved by council Donaldson,
seconded by council Shukin. Any

1495
02:11:47,040 --> 02:11:55,280
comments?
Call the question. All in favor?

1496
02:11:51,280 --> 02:12:01,360
Opposed? That's unanimous. Okay, great.
Uh moving right along to

1497
02:11:58,880 --> 02:12:06,639
uh other correspondents. This is
correspondence in 10 C from Kevin

1498
02:12:03,440 --> 02:12:10,639
Murdoch, the mayor of Oak Bay. This is a
request for advocacy letter for

1499
02:12:08,639 --> 02:12:17,599
continued local government climate
action program LGCAP

1500
02:12:14,800 --> 02:12:21,520
funding and this is the correspondence
certainly a great idea. Does anybody

1501
02:12:19,920 --> 02:12:26,320
want to comment on this or make a
motion? Let's put the motion on the

1502
02:12:24,159 --> 02:12:32,079
table. Councelor Shuk,
>> I um I believe that we had talked about

1503
02:12:30,159 --> 02:12:35,920
writing our own letter
>> and um

1504
02:12:34,560 --> 02:12:40,159
happy to assist you with that, Mayor
Little. And uh yeah, I very much agree

1505
02:12:38,159 --> 02:12:43,280
with the principles and I think it was a
letter that we got from Sandwich

1506
02:12:42,400 --> 02:12:48,560
» previously.
>> Yeah, that's right. Okay, that's right.

1507
02:12:45,119 --> 02:12:51,679
» Okay. Um but uh that I think that motion
is already in place so I can make a

1508
02:12:50,400 --> 02:12:58,560
motion to receive.
>> Sure. and and um

1509
02:12:55,840 --> 02:13:04,000
yes, we did have that motion previously.
I'm just looking to staff to uh comment

1510
02:13:01,920 --> 02:13:10,480
on that. And the letter is in draft
form, our own letter, right? Yeah. Okay.

1511
02:13:07,520 --> 02:13:16,800
Yep. Um written hundreds of letters and
I appreciate your support and and help

1512
02:13:12,880 --> 02:13:22,639
uh councelor Schukan. Okay. So, uh, move
receipt from councelor Schukan, seconded

1513
02:13:19,760 --> 02:13:30,079
by councelor Donaldson.
All in favor? Opposed? Carried. We have

1514
02:13:26,880 --> 02:13:35,599
10 C, correspondence from Stacy Charles,
Shiano First Nation Canoe Family

1515
02:13:32,560 --> 02:13:41,280
Partnership Support for Tribal Journey
2026 event. We did support them a couple

1516
02:13:39,040 --> 02:13:46,719
of years ago. They didn't they went to
the CRD last year. They're not asking

1517
02:13:43,280 --> 02:13:51,840
the CRD. They've come back to us uh for
a request. Anybody at the table want to

1518
02:13:49,520 --> 02:13:55,520
move this forward?
Councelor

1519
02:13:53,760 --> 02:13:57,760
» councelor Shu can go ahead and then
we'll talk. Go ahead. Put it on the

1520
02:13:57,440 --> 02:14:01,840
table.
>> I I wonder if we might find a way of

1521
02:13:59,920 --> 02:14:07,440
contributing a thousand dollars to the
uh to this event. That is what we

1522
02:14:03,840 --> 02:14:11,199
provided a few years ago. If there is a
grant uh which councelor Donaldson had

1523
02:14:09,840 --> 02:14:14,239
mentioned I I don't know what is
available in the grant but

1524
02:14:12,480 --> 02:14:18,719
» yeah that's what was indicated by the
CFO we can ask him to comment. So let's

1525
02:14:16,480 --> 02:14:23,840
put the motion on the floor uh moved by
councelor Schukan to support the tribal

1526
02:14:21,040 --> 02:14:30,560
journey by $1,000
seconded by council Donaldson. Um do you

1527
02:14:27,760 --> 02:14:35,760
want to further motivate No. Uh, Council
Donaldson,

1528
02:14:31,920 --> 02:14:43,119
» I I would like to um include um comments
from our um colleague um

1529
02:14:40,880 --> 02:14:47,679
Council Gray is he had some
correspondence he was sharing with us

1530
02:14:44,639 --> 02:14:51,360
earlier about um grants or something
like that. I can't remember.

1531
02:14:49,119 --> 02:14:56,079
» Yeah. Yeah. Let's move to the CFO and
then we'll move to councelor Councelor

1532
02:14:53,280 --> 02:15:01,760
Gray. um CFO Creek uh regarding the
grant that that might be um this might

1533
02:14:59,199 --> 02:15:08,560
fall under that category
>> through the chair. Uh so the district um

1534
02:15:05,119 --> 02:15:12,880
received funding in 2024 and 2025 for
indigenous engagement and

1535
02:15:10,320 --> 02:15:17,760
reconciliation. Um it seems like it
would likely fall under that scope. Um

1536
02:15:15,840 --> 02:15:23,360
it would certainly help with the grant
reporting if one or more council members

1537
02:15:20,639 --> 02:15:28,480
wanted to also attend this. Um, but we'd
certainly have ordered enough in there

1538
02:15:25,119 --> 02:15:36,560
to uh give them $1,000.
>> Okay. Okay. Councelor Gray,

1539
02:15:33,760 --> 02:15:43,719
» yes, I'll be attending the event. Um, my
suggestion was that we had received some

1540
02:15:38,960 --> 02:15:43,719
money under a grant as

1541
02:15:45,840 --> 02:15:51,599
thisation. I wonder if we could just um
be reminded on the the total amount of

1542
02:15:50,000 --> 02:15:56,560
that grant. We haven't spent any of it
as far as I'm aware.

1543
02:15:54,480 --> 02:16:01,679
» That recent grant, I don't believe we
spent any. Um I'm just going to return

1544
02:15:58,960 --> 02:16:04,320
to our CFO, CFO Creek. Can you comment
on that

1545
02:16:02,800 --> 02:16:08,880
» through the chair? Uh correct. We
haven't spent any of it. Uh and right

1546
02:16:06,239 --> 02:16:13,119
now we've got $96,000.
Uh now, the fire chief is going to be

1547
02:16:10,719 --> 02:16:18,800
using some of that funds in order to uh
build out the EOC program. Uh and that

1548
02:16:16,159 --> 02:16:23,440
requires the cooperation of uh Beach Bay
Shu. uh and so that will take up tens of

1549
02:16:21,440 --> 02:16:28,480
thousands uh as they build out that
report and hire the consultants etc. So

1550
02:16:25,840 --> 02:16:32,160
I wouldn't give it all for this
particular program but there's certainly

1551
02:16:30,960 --> 02:16:36,160
enough funding in there.
>> Yeah. So what I'm hearing we we can

1552
02:16:34,240 --> 02:16:42,000
within the grant framework we can
definitely afford to give uh $1,000 for

1553
02:16:39,120 --> 02:16:46,960
this tribal journey as well. Okay. I
will be attending as well. I did attend

1554
02:16:44,160 --> 02:16:53,439
the uh Shano First Nations tribal
journey last year and potlatch very very

1555
02:16:50,080 --> 02:17:00,240
interesting event and hope to be invited
to the pot latch again this year. Uh but

1556
02:16:56,719 --> 02:17:05,840
the tribal journey was was definitely an
um really interesting event to witness.

1557
02:17:04,000 --> 02:17:09,200
I'll be attending as well and I'll
encourage others to

1558
02:17:08,319 --> 02:17:11,040
Okay,
>> Mayor Little.

1559
02:17:10,160 --> 02:17:14,719
» Yes,
>> Mayor Little.

1560
02:17:12,000 --> 02:17:19,599
» Yes, I'm here. I'm I'm intending to
volunteer at the event and I would

1561
02:17:16,960 --> 02:17:23,760
certainly support the donation of $1,000
and then I would hope that we would then

1562
02:17:22,080 --> 02:17:28,319
uh look to other things that we might
support with Shannon Nation with the um

1563
02:17:26,479 --> 02:17:33,040
much remaining fund as we heard from the
CFO and our fire fire chief activity. So

1564
02:17:31,200 --> 02:17:36,080
I look forward to expanding those
dollars in support of our dear

1565
02:17:35,040 --> 02:17:40,000
neighbors.
>> Yes indeed. Uh go ahead councelor

1566
02:17:39,519 --> 02:17:45,439
Schukan.
>> I wonder if we could ask Mr. Creek if

1567
02:17:42,240 --> 02:17:50,080
there is a um timeline or sorry a time
limit in terms of spending this

1568
02:17:47,519 --> 02:17:53,599
particular grant
through the chair. So we've already

1569
02:17:51,519 --> 02:17:58,399
gotten an extension as the 2024 funds
were supposed to be spent by the start

1570
02:17:55,200 --> 02:18:02,319
of 2026. Um that didn't happen. The
previous fire chief was working with

1571
02:17:59,679 --> 02:18:08,080
them to try and arrange something. Um
but we should have it spent by 2027.

1572
02:18:06,319 --> 02:18:12,240
But if that doesn't occur, we're sure
they'll give us another extension anyway

1573
02:18:09,599 --> 02:18:14,960
for another year on top of that to 2028.
But

1574
02:18:14,479 --> 02:18:19,120
» okay.
>> Okay.

1575
02:18:16,080 --> 02:18:23,599
» Just um clearly this is probably
something the next council should give

1576
02:18:21,679 --> 02:18:27,679
some consideration to. It's
>> in terms of putting it in the budget.

1577
02:18:25,439 --> 02:18:34,479
um in terms of how we work with Channu
to spend the money effectively and yeah

1578
02:18:31,519 --> 02:18:40,719
» as I as I understand perhaps staff can
comment um the EOC emergency management

1579
02:18:38,719 --> 02:18:46,880
there is a they are working on an
emergency management plan in

1580
02:18:42,800 --> 02:18:51,439
collaboration with Shannu uh uh for
Shano uh first nation and they're

1581
02:18:49,439 --> 02:18:55,040
developing those and and quite a bit of
the funds will be directed towards that

1582
02:18:53,599 --> 02:18:57,920
is that not correct
Yeah.

1583
02:18:55,760 --> 02:19:03,040
» Okay, that's great. So, we do even
though we can't see it, there are those

1584
02:19:00,559 --> 02:19:06,080
channels of of collaboration and
supporting each other.

1585
02:19:04,240 --> 02:19:10,399
» Great. Just, you know, two ideas I might
throw out if there are funds. Um,

1586
02:19:08,399 --> 02:19:13,599
shoreline protection might be um
something to look at. Shoreline

1587
02:19:12,160 --> 02:19:18,639
assessments
>> um but also um invasive removals as

1588
02:19:16,960 --> 02:19:21,760
well, whether there's a way of funding
that both at Chanu and and here as well.

1589
02:19:21,439 --> 02:19:27,679
So,
>> yeah. Okay. Okay. Good conversation. Um,

1590
02:19:25,679 --> 02:19:33,599
I'm going to call the question on that.
That is 10D. Stacy Charles Shana, First

1591
02:19:30,960 --> 02:19:39,359
Nation Canoe Family Partnership Support
for the Tribal Journey 2026. I'll call

1592
02:19:36,800 --> 02:19:44,960
the question. All in favor? Those
opposed?

1593
02:19:41,200 --> 02:19:51,680
None opposed. Okay, let's move along to
um uh how far along are we here? You

1594
02:19:49,439 --> 02:20:00,840
know what? I'm just going to take a 90
second break. Um yeah, everybody stretch

1595
02:19:55,040 --> 02:20:00,840
their legs and come back in less than

1596
02:25:33,520 --> 02:25:42,160
Let's uh resume our meeting here.
Any of the conversations and perhaps you

1597
02:25:39,680 --> 02:25:47,359
can move out to the parking lot for
further discussions and we'll resume our

1598
02:25:44,240 --> 02:25:53,120
our council meeting. Thank you.
Okay, moving along to item number 11,

1599
02:25:50,160 --> 02:26:00,240
bylaws. This is the park dedication
buffer land bylaw 2026 number 721.

1600
02:25:57,359 --> 02:26:06,000
This is bylaw number 721 at third
reading. Uh council Schukan, do you want

1601
02:26:03,040 --> 02:26:11,600
to start off or council Donaldson?
>> Yes. I'd like to move that council adopt

1602
02:26:08,240 --> 02:26:16,000
park dedication buffer land bylaw to
2026

1603
02:26:13,200 --> 02:26:20,000
number 721.
This is moved by council Donaldson,

1604
02:26:17,920 --> 02:26:25,359
seconded by council Schukan. For those
in the room, it's displayed up on your

1605
02:26:22,720 --> 02:26:28,960
on the screen here. Uh, council
Donaldson, if you would wish to motivate

1606
02:26:27,120 --> 02:26:33,359
further.
>> Uh, I just want to uh thank all of the

1607
02:26:31,920 --> 02:26:37,760
people that have been involved in this
process starting with the Bufferland

1608
02:26:35,200 --> 02:26:41,520
working group. Um, actually may have
been started before that, but they

1609
02:26:39,280 --> 02:26:46,960
formalized the recommendations for
staff. um staff have done a great deal

1610
02:26:44,640 --> 02:26:53,840
of work on it as well. We uh I think
we've had two different planners working

1611
02:26:49,040 --> 02:26:59,280
through this process and um and now we
have a uh an energetic group of uh

1612
02:26:57,439 --> 02:27:04,960
friends of bufferland doing invasive
work and looking at the future of

1613
02:27:02,080 --> 02:27:11,439
managing or protecting in their way of
their neighborhood the uh buffer land.

1614
02:27:08,319 --> 02:27:18,960
Um and here we are this evening for the
third reading of uh

1615
02:27:14,560 --> 02:27:25,200
the bufferland having a new zone. Um and
I would defer the next um uh bit of

1616
02:27:23,200 --> 02:27:30,319
history perhaps to my colleague
councelor Shukin as to um how it came to

1617
02:27:28,479 --> 02:27:33,920
be to have this place called the buffer
land.

1618
02:27:32,240 --> 02:27:39,520
» Yeah, thank you. that would be helpful
because um people in the room and others

1619
02:27:37,280 --> 02:27:43,520
haven't been paying attention probably
for the full length of this. This has

1620
02:27:41,280 --> 02:27:47,439
been a long drawn out process over the
last four years. So I'd appreciate a a

1621
02:27:46,240 --> 02:27:52,479
brief synopsis.
>> Yeah. Yeah.

1622
02:27:48,160 --> 02:27:58,640
» Well, um just let me begin by saying wow
and thanks. Um this has been yeah four

1623
02:27:55,920 --> 02:28:03,680
years in the making and I remember
having a conversation even before the

1624
02:28:00,960 --> 02:28:08,479
the term began. um talking about the
responsibility that the community has to

1625
02:28:06,640 --> 02:28:14,479
the residents living in the Neil Road
area because of the vote that was taken

1626
02:28:11,040 --> 02:28:19,680
in 2017 that involved the land swap
because it does have the potential of

1627
02:28:16,240 --> 02:28:26,000
bringing in these um section 25, 28 and
95 into Machosen in terms of ownership

1628
02:28:23,520 --> 02:28:30,479
but it also did lead to the impacts that
those neighbors are feeling in terms of

1629
02:28:27,680 --> 02:28:35,680
the development of Central Mountain. Um
this is a big step toward that but um

1630
02:28:34,240 --> 02:28:38,880
there's a lot of work ahead of us as
well and as councelor Donaldson was

1631
02:28:37,280 --> 02:28:43,680
saying we have a great group of
energetic volunteers who are going to

1632
02:28:40,880 --> 02:28:47,280
help us help the council of the day
think through some of the issues and put

1633
02:28:45,280 --> 02:28:56,399
forward ideas and also do some of the
leg work on this as well. Um so again uh

1634
02:28:51,680 --> 02:29:01,200
yeah we've been through um we the very
first thing that triggered this way back

1635
02:28:58,720 --> 02:29:05,040
in early 2023
was news of the storm water the covenant

1636
02:29:03,280 --> 02:29:10,160
that would allow a storm water detention
pond on the buffer land and it was it I

1637
02:29:08,399 --> 02:29:13,760
think from that that we decided to get
mobilized and do a working group on the

1638
02:29:11,920 --> 02:29:20,640
bufferland which began I think it was in
early 2024. We did our report on time in

1639
02:29:17,280 --> 02:29:24,640
October of 2024 and again went through
some you know swirl and the usual

1640
02:29:23,040 --> 02:29:31,120
bureaucracy of getting this moving
along. Mr. PayP was very helpful at um

1641
02:29:27,600 --> 02:29:35,040
moving moving again this to um a good
conclusion by bringing in a contract

1642
02:29:33,120 --> 02:29:40,319
planner when our current planner was
busy with the the housing work housing

1643
02:29:37,280 --> 02:29:45,359
report that sorry housing amendments uh
that were done and as needed to be done

1644
02:29:42,399 --> 02:29:52,080
by the province. So, here we are. And uh
I uh if goes without saying, I'm gonna

1645
02:29:48,080 --> 02:29:58,479
vote in favor. So, thanks everyone.
>> Okay. Any other comments or concerns?

1646
02:29:56,880 --> 02:30:01,760
» Yeah. Councelor Gray here. I just want
to um enthusiastically support the

1647
02:30:00,319 --> 02:30:06,960
motion. Thanks to everyone who's worked
so hard on this.

1648
02:30:04,000 --> 02:30:13,200
» Yeah. and my my [clears throat] excuse
me my my congratulations to both council

1649
02:30:10,399 --> 02:30:17,520
Schukan and council Donaldson who took
this up. It wasn't in your portfolio

1650
02:30:15,760 --> 02:30:24,039
originally. It was in the environment
portfolio, but you you um took it on as

1651
02:30:21,200 --> 02:30:28,240
your own. Uh there was great excuse
[clears throat] me great public

1652
02:30:25,200 --> 02:30:35,439
engagement um great outreach to the
community and this is a wonderful

1653
02:30:31,040 --> 02:30:41,120
outcome uh for the bufferland. Okay,
I'll call the question. All in favor?

1654
02:30:38,720 --> 02:30:46,000
Those opposed?
No one opposed. That's unanimous.

1655
02:30:43,120 --> 02:30:51,359
Congratulations, council. Next we have
the general tax exemption bylaw 2026

1656
02:30:49,439 --> 02:30:59,359
number 723.
This is a report followed by a number of

1657
02:30:55,520 --> 02:31:03,520
different uh schedules A to J. There are
recommendations [snorts]

1658
02:31:00,479 --> 02:31:09,359
here. Um I think what we'll do is we'll
go to the report first. Um here that

1659
02:31:07,040 --> 02:31:14,880
I've got some general comments after
that. Uh and we've got a number of

1660
02:31:11,840 --> 02:31:20,000
different options tonight. Um including
deferral to a September 21st meeting if

1661
02:31:18,080 --> 02:31:24,319
needed. if council needs more
information to make that evidence-based

1662
02:31:22,720 --> 02:31:29,920
decision that we've been talking about
for the last four years. So with that,

1663
02:31:26,880 --> 02:31:33,479
I'll turn to our CFO, Jeffrey Creek. Go
ahead, Mr. Creek.

1664
02:31:42,160 --> 02:31:49,840
Thank you, Mayor and Council. So through
the chair, uh this is as you mentioned

1665
02:31:47,120 --> 02:31:52,880
the 2027 permissive tax exemptions. Uh
council may grant permissive tax

1666
02:31:51,200 --> 02:31:57,840
exemptions to qualifying properties
under section 224 and 225 of the

1667
02:31:55,520 --> 02:32:00,880
community charter. Uh permissive tax
exemptions are discretionary and must be

1668
02:31:59,600 --> 02:32:06,399
established by bylaw before the
statutory deadline. Uh this related

1669
02:32:03,520 --> 02:32:11,040
bylaw must be adopted by October 31st or
November 2nd because October 31st is on

1670
02:32:08,640 --> 02:32:14,960
the weekend this year. Uh but November
2nd is the first day of the new council

1671
02:32:12,880 --> 02:32:20,560
and they can't pass it by law uh that
they didn't do the first, second, third

1672
02:32:16,479 --> 02:32:25,280
reading on. So it's all you guys. Um
purposes report lay out the uh

1673
02:32:23,680 --> 02:32:28,560
applications that have been received
estimated financial impact and then

1674
02:32:26,880 --> 02:32:33,785
whether or not uh council wants to
approve a full partial or no permissive

1675
02:32:30,720 --> 02:32:33,785
tax exemption for 2027. [music]

1676
02:32:34,080 --> 02:32:41,040
So the district received eight different
organizations applications. Uh they

1677
02:32:38,640 --> 02:32:45,280
cover 14 different properties valued at
close to $34 million.

1678
02:32:43,359 --> 02:32:50,160
Uh they provide space for rent,
recreation, reserved habitat, religious

1679
02:32:47,439 --> 02:32:57,200
services, and animal welfare wildlife
care. Um all the applications were

1680
02:32:53,200 --> 02:33:00,399
reviewed against policy F100.60.
All applicants were found eligible for

1681
02:32:58,800 --> 02:33:05,680
permissive tax exemption based on those
criteria. And so while the district uh

1682
02:33:04,160 --> 02:33:09,600
while they met the district policy for
approval, council has discretion based

1683
02:33:08,000 --> 02:33:14,560
on policy and the community charter on
whether to approve any or all groups and

1684
02:33:11,680 --> 02:33:19,760
how much of an exemption is provided.
Uh so I didn't estimate based on their

1685
02:33:16,800 --> 02:33:27,720
2026 assessed value and then at 5% tax
increase uh in 2027 and the total uh

1686
02:33:23,439 --> 02:33:27,720
value of exemptions would be 324,000.

1687
02:33:28,160 --> 02:33:37,680
Um there was a few criteria that like
maybe kind of pause and think on whether

1688
02:33:35,040 --> 02:33:42,160
or not they did qualify. Uh under the
policy if a portion of the land or imp

1689
02:33:40,399 --> 02:33:46,720
improvements is used by a private sector
entity and or organization not meeting

1690
02:33:44,720 --> 02:33:49,040
exemption criteria.
And so with [clears throat] this the

1691
02:33:47,600 --> 02:33:53,120
Anglican Church currently rents out
their building to a number of groups

1692
02:33:50,399 --> 02:33:57,280
such as Drivewise, Exercise Classes,
Elections BC, and Elections Canada. And

1693
02:33:56,000 --> 02:34:01,840
those are groups that would not meet
council's exemption criteria, but

1694
02:33:59,920 --> 02:34:05,359
because they rent out that space, uh
they receive a benefit of below market

1695
02:34:03,520 --> 02:34:10,319
rent due to the exemption provided by
the district. Um and then further

1696
02:34:08,160 --> 02:34:15,120
criteria maintains an organization does
not compete with private enterprise.

1697
02:34:12,960 --> 02:34:19,520
This is a little harder to do in Mosen
as it's not a big business area. Uh but

1698
02:34:17,359 --> 02:34:23,040
there are some private event spaces to
rent and machosen which could be

1699
02:34:21,200 --> 02:34:28,240
negatively impacted by machosen
providing funding for some operations of

1700
02:34:25,760 --> 02:34:32,720
these organizations and not others if
they're not owned by a society or

1701
02:34:29,840 --> 02:34:37,280
nonprofit organization. So a small
caveat but historically the district's

1702
02:34:34,880 --> 02:34:45,040
always provided an exemption or in this
case uh for 2026 a grant.

1703
02:34:41,200 --> 02:34:50,640
Uh so in 2027
uh we can see that the on page three

1704
02:34:48,479 --> 02:34:55,040
here the municipal tax value of the
total exemptions would be $167,000.

1705
02:34:53,600 --> 02:34:59,600
The other taxing authorities would be
$157,000

1706
02:34:56,640 --> 02:35:04,160
for a total of 324.
The impact on municipal taxes is about

1707
02:35:01,920 --> 02:35:09,600
$80 for the average residential property
or about 4% of their total tax bill from

1708
02:35:06,640 --> 02:35:15,040
chosen.
And then below I get into um the rising

1709
02:35:12,160 --> 02:35:22,080
cost of this. So as the district I
chosen um has a very small and almost

1710
02:35:19,120 --> 02:35:25,439
non-growing tax base. Uh the cost of the
grants and permissive tax exemptions

1711
02:35:23,760 --> 02:35:30,640
that have been given for over the last
three years. Uh it's growing from

1712
02:35:27,439 --> 02:35:34,560
344,000 up to $457,000
uh next year if these permissive tax

1713
02:35:32,640 --> 02:35:37,680
exemptions are granted. and the
subsidies and grants to other

1714
02:35:35,840 --> 02:35:42,720
organizations remain the same as
estimated for 2026.

1715
02:35:40,720 --> 02:35:47,520
Uh there's a breakdown where this comes
from. So there's grant aid for 5,000. We

1716
02:35:44,960 --> 02:35:52,960
give grant a taxes permissive taxes for
$240,000 this year. We give grants to

1717
02:35:50,240 --> 02:36:00,040
organizations of $42,000. And then with
subsidized rent to MEA, community house,

1718
02:35:56,240 --> 02:36:00,040
that type of thing for 86,500.

1719
02:36:00,319 --> 02:36:08,640
When we compare that to the rest of the
CRD, um we chose in as at at the top of

1720
02:36:04,800 --> 02:36:14,000
the list. Uh so our total grants and tax
exemptions would come to 8.3% of total

1721
02:36:10,960 --> 02:36:18,960
tax revenue collected. Um the average in
the CRD is 2.98%.

1722
02:36:16,319 --> 02:36:23,200
The median is 2.25%.
If we focus solely on permissive tax

1723
02:36:20,800 --> 02:36:27,680
exemptions, the average in the CRD is
1.79%

1724
02:36:25,359 --> 02:36:32,920
compared with a median of 1.7 whereas
Machosen has uh gives 4.68%.

1725
02:36:32,960 --> 02:36:40,720
So Mosen's not the only one where
everybody comes to ask for money. Um

1726
02:36:38,000 --> 02:36:44,720
there happens in every municipality. So
a number of municipalities in the CRD

1727
02:36:42,560 --> 02:36:49,520
have already decided to put a cap on
their permissive tax exemptions. And so

1728
02:36:47,280 --> 02:36:54,720
this is something council can consider
this year talkable for next year and

1729
02:36:52,160 --> 02:37:01,439
possibly implement in the future. But if
we look at the table uh souk so they put

1730
02:36:57,120 --> 02:37:07,760
a limit of 1.7% central san 1.5%
Victoria is 1.6% and squalt 5% whereas

1731
02:37:06,160 --> 02:37:12,720
oak bay doesn't provide any tax
exemptions unless it's a nonprofit or

1732
02:37:10,880 --> 02:37:18,000
charity organization that is renting
municipal land. Um and then there's a

1733
02:37:15,840 --> 02:37:23,359
few more on the island mainland itself.
But

1734
02:37:20,000 --> 02:37:28,399
it is uh if MHosen were to limit their
exemptions to the same as Souk at 1.7%

1735
02:37:25,920 --> 02:37:34,000
at the highest on the island here um or
in the CRD total value would be knocked

1736
02:37:30,720 --> 02:37:39,040
down to 90,900 or 55% of the total
estimated tax exemptions for 2027 which

1737
02:37:37,280 --> 02:37:43,200
would save residential property owners
about $38 on the taxes along with

1738
02:37:41,520 --> 02:37:49,120
savings from the other taxi authorities
like parks and recck transit Victoria

1739
02:37:45,920 --> 02:37:49,120
Library etc.

1740
02:37:49,280 --> 02:37:56,800
Um so the process and timeline here so
we've received all the applications

1741
02:37:54,080 --> 02:37:59,920
reviewed it um coming to hear for
council's direction on what they want to

1742
02:37:58,240 --> 02:38:03,520
do. We do have to put out a public
notice under section 227. We have to

1743
02:38:02,319 --> 02:38:08,080
advertise in the paper for two
consecutive weeks. Uh and so there's a

1744
02:38:06,160 --> 02:38:15,200
possibility that this cannot be wrapped
up on September 21st. Um but ideally

1745
02:38:12,640 --> 02:38:19,520
no later than October 5th to avoid
calling a special meeting before the

1746
02:38:16,640 --> 02:38:25,359
election on October 17th.
Uh so staff is coming um asking for a

1747
02:38:23,120 --> 02:38:29,680
few options here whether to provide full
exemptions to all properties that

1748
02:38:26,960 --> 02:38:33,280
applied full exemptions to some prop
some groups and partial exemptions to

1749
02:38:31,439 --> 02:38:38,399
others that generate income from
ineligible groups. Set a funding limit

1750
02:38:35,920 --> 02:38:45,439
on the permissive tax exemptions i.e. 2%
of total tax revenue or don't provide

1751
02:38:40,880 --> 02:38:49,040
any exemptions. And now there is um put
the caveat on there could be some people

1752
02:38:47,760 --> 02:38:54,960
with conflict of interest that was
mentioned last year. Um they say discuss

1753
02:38:52,479 --> 02:39:00,240
the policy and report as a whole before
diving into any individual groups

1754
02:38:56,560 --> 02:39:05,520
itself. Um and then if needed uh we can
come back on September 21st with

1755
02:39:02,720 --> 02:39:09,040
multiple bylaws that break out the
groups that would have a conflict of

1756
02:39:06,800 --> 02:39:13,680
interest or not if we don't have a
quorum when people declare a conflict of

1757
02:39:11,040 --> 02:39:21,280
interest
kind of go from there discussion.

1758
02:39:17,040 --> 02:39:26,319
» Okay. Uh I think what we'll do is we'll
excuse me entertain uh questions and

1759
02:39:23,840 --> 02:39:31,399
concerns and then we'll move to other
aspects. So questions and concerns,

1760
02:39:31,760 --> 02:39:39,200
who wants to discuss it?
>> Um,

1761
02:39:36,880 --> 02:39:45,600
so uh I want to thank Mr. Creek again
for continuing to expand our knowledge

1762
02:39:42,399 --> 02:39:51,200
of permissive tax exemptions and the
fiscal impact they have um on our

1763
02:39:48,319 --> 02:39:57,840
taxpayers. Uh again, I don't believe
that this was fully known and except um

1764
02:39:55,359 --> 02:40:01,200
when this was brought up last year. Um
and even me once I had it, I had to

1765
02:39:59,840 --> 02:40:09,600
probably have it explained about four
times. Um the point was made last year

1766
02:40:06,479 --> 02:40:18,000
that if we were to make any sort of
change to PTEES, we really should give

1767
02:40:13,520 --> 02:40:21,359
the groups significant notice on that.
And and that is a point I will confess

1768
02:40:19,600 --> 02:40:26,720
that I lost and I think is actually a
wise one. So my own as I as I look at

1769
02:40:25,200 --> 02:40:32,240
things right now and without the benefit
of my comments from my colleagues I

1770
02:40:29,200 --> 02:40:39,520
would be in favor of continuing the
PTEES as they once were. So maintain the

1771
02:40:35,359 --> 02:40:45,600
status quo but also suggest that there
is a deeper discussion that is held on

1772
02:40:42,640 --> 02:40:49,920
permissive tax exemptions and the other
funding that we provide to community

1773
02:40:47,840 --> 02:40:53,920
groups and initiatives
um

1774
02:40:51,600 --> 02:40:58,800
and and have that deeper discussion in
terms of the PTS. I mean the discussion

1775
02:40:56,000 --> 02:41:02,960
might go in terms of what what level you
know we set but the point was made I

1776
02:41:01,200 --> 02:41:10,640
think by Mr. Bennington too about the
year after year of having to um um come

1777
02:41:07,120 --> 02:41:14,160
to council and apply like and and that
does leave these groups with a bit of

1778
02:41:12,240 --> 02:41:21,359
uncertainty. So that might also be a
topic of conversation once we get into

1779
02:41:16,240 --> 02:41:25,280
the deeper issue. Um so so again my my
I'm I'm interested in hearing what my

1780
02:41:22,960 --> 02:41:30,800
colleagues have to say. My suggested
approach would be to maintain the status

1781
02:41:26,960 --> 02:41:34,960
quo with PTEs but also discuss PTEs and
the other funding that we provide to

1782
02:41:32,640 --> 02:41:39,359
community groups sometime in the new
year and this would be under the new

1783
02:41:36,479 --> 02:41:44,880
council as well. So,
>> so there's um some is some comments that

1784
02:41:43,120 --> 02:41:50,640
our staff can make regarding our
statutory obligations and what we are

1785
02:41:47,920 --> 02:41:55,840
confined to do with permissive tax
exemptions. I'm going to turn to our uh

1786
02:41:53,520 --> 02:41:59,760
CFO Creek. Could you comment on some of
those and some of the other concerns of

1787
02:41:57,680 --> 02:42:03,840
of councelor Shu?
>> Certainly. Thank you through the chair.

1788
02:42:01,680 --> 02:42:10,240
Um so I guess going going back to the
original idea there of having to apply

1789
02:42:05,760 --> 02:42:17,280
every year to get this exemption. Um so
before we put in the policy in 2025,

1790
02:42:13,439 --> 02:42:20,479
right, um the policy we chosen was a
page and a half and there was no

1791
02:42:18,800 --> 02:42:26,399
application, right? people just wrote in
a letter said, "Please give us an

1792
02:42:22,560 --> 02:42:31,680
exemption or we do X and then they got
it." It was always on an annual basis.

1793
02:42:29,359 --> 02:42:35,920
It was never you've got this forever,
right? A municipality can't give a tax

1794
02:42:33,439 --> 02:42:41,840
exemption forever to anybody. There's a
limit of 10 years, right? So, I haven't

1795
02:42:39,120 --> 02:42:46,399
seen anybody that does give an exemption
for 10 years. Most of it, some people

1796
02:42:44,800 --> 02:42:50,080
have done it where we'll give her four
years, right? line up with the council

1797
02:42:48,000 --> 02:42:55,280
term. Don't lock in the next people. And
that's certainly something we can do.

1798
02:42:52,000 --> 02:42:59,680
Um, come 2027, new council shows up.
It's like, hey, like church always gets

1799
02:42:57,200 --> 02:43:03,040
it, the hall always gets it, YMD always
gets it. Put it in, lock it in for four

1800
02:43:01,840 --> 02:43:08,399
years. This is what you're going to get.
Then they know. Um, now we'll provide

1801
02:43:05,200 --> 02:43:12,479
the certainty. I don't really know where
the idea that we never [clears throat]

1802
02:43:10,399 --> 02:43:16,240
like there was no application process
before, right? So people just assume

1803
02:43:13,920 --> 02:43:19,359
that they would always get it. Some kind
of handshake agreement that was made

1804
02:43:17,760 --> 02:43:23,520
that hey don't worry about it you'll
never we'll never challenge you on it.

1805
02:43:21,280 --> 02:43:26,640
Um and so
I would say when I first started here

1806
02:43:25,280 --> 02:43:31,359
right everybody just complained about
their taxes being too high even though

1807
02:43:29,439 --> 02:43:36,240
you know be the bad guy that pointed out
it's like second lowest in the CRD. Um,

1808
02:43:33,840 --> 02:43:40,640
and so when we find out that all these
organizations that are applying, the

1809
02:43:38,160 --> 02:43:45,920
majority of them had net incomes, like
after all the expenses of half million

1810
02:43:42,640 --> 02:43:50,560
dollars, some groups have like get it
give a give a grant to a group that has

1811
02:43:47,920 --> 02:43:55,600
$3,000 in cash in their bank account.
But to give a grant to somebody who has

1812
02:43:52,720 --> 02:43:59,040
$300 million in their bank account kind
of blew my mind, but do whatever you

1813
02:43:57,920 --> 02:44:03,359
want with the money. I don't get to make
a decision. Um, so it was kind of

1814
02:44:01,359 --> 02:44:08,399
pointing out, look, all of these
organizations, nonprofit, they're still

1815
02:44:06,240 --> 02:44:12,960
making millions of dollars, and so they
can pay, you would think they would be

1816
02:44:10,240 --> 02:44:18,880
able to pay $5,000, $6,000 to contribute
to the roads, the fire services that

1817
02:44:15,600 --> 02:44:25,040
they all rely on in the in the district,
but again, didn't go over went over like

1818
02:44:22,479 --> 02:44:30,479
a lead balloon. But this is where we can
come out and say 2027 pass four years.

1819
02:44:28,720 --> 02:44:34,720
like look, we got to we really need to
take a look at this because over the

1820
02:44:31,760 --> 02:44:38,319
next over those four years, the cost for
this district are just going to keep

1821
02:44:35,920 --> 02:44:45,680
escalating and if we have no tax base
growth again, it just gets dumped onto

1822
02:44:41,279 --> 02:44:50,560
the 98 93 and8% that are residential
property owners. Um, and so it just gets

1823
02:44:47,760 --> 02:44:57,120
more and more burdensome on them. And I
I get it. They all these groups provide

1824
02:44:52,560 --> 02:45:02,000
something, but um you gotta find some
middle ground on support, but also help

1825
02:45:00,080 --> 02:45:06,640
for the people that do struggle to live
here that have been living here for 30,

1826
02:45:04,080 --> 02:45:10,479
40, 50 years.
>> Did you want to carry on with your

1827
02:45:08,399 --> 02:45:15,600
conversation and your questions and then
we'll move to other people?

1828
02:45:13,200 --> 02:45:19,439
Yeah, I um sorry just just really
briefly um you know the the comment that

1829
02:45:17,600 --> 02:45:24,160
was made earlier about how important
these groups are in terms of providing

1830
02:45:21,600 --> 02:45:27,760
basically the social fabric of the
community and they are the these are

1831
02:45:26,319 --> 02:45:31,520
wonderful groups. All of them do great
work, but we also have to take into

1832
02:45:29,840 --> 02:45:37,680
account
MACA museum society, uh the community

1833
02:45:35,120 --> 02:45:43,520
association, the equestrians. So all of
these groups, um there's a cricket group

1834
02:45:41,680 --> 02:45:48,640
that plays out in the field there. To
me, they're they're they're all part of

1835
02:45:45,439 --> 02:45:55,120
a spectrum of use in terms of social
benefit and recreation and support. um

1836
02:45:52,240 --> 02:46:00,080
even even in terms of um um land
conservation as well. So when we look at

1837
02:45:57,680 --> 02:46:04,800
something like the school that we know
we've just seen the full potential of

1838
02:46:02,399 --> 02:46:09,359
the school beginning to flower, remember
the first year that we've had full

1839
02:46:07,279 --> 02:46:13,439
ability of the school to sorry to rent
the gym and the three classrooms was

1840
02:46:11,359 --> 02:46:18,720
only 2025.
So again there there's a there's a a

1841
02:46:16,160 --> 02:46:22,399
facility there. There's interest in that
from again community groups, but we're

1842
02:46:21,200 --> 02:46:26,479
also seeing the pressure and the
stresses that this is putting on staff

1843
02:46:24,000 --> 02:46:31,840
and also the costs as well. So to me
that is part of the full spectrum

1844
02:46:29,600 --> 02:46:35,680
of again support that we provide to
community organizations and initiatives

1845
02:46:34,000 --> 02:46:40,720
and you I think you've identified that
Mr. Creek. I think you've said that you

1846
02:46:38,160 --> 02:46:47,200
know the additional figure is equivalent
to 8.32 of all the taxes we collect like

1847
02:46:44,000 --> 02:46:53,200
all of it together. Um, so we're at
8.32. The average in the CRD was 2.25.

1848
02:46:51,120 --> 02:46:55,359
So we are I think that's what you said.
Yeah.

1849
02:46:53,520 --> 02:46:58,880
» Through. Yeah. And that that includes
like the pills, right? With our with the

1850
02:46:57,120 --> 02:47:03,920
federal government handing over, you
know, almost like $1.5 million. So like

1851
02:47:02,319 --> 02:47:08,800
we weren't collecting the pills, right?
That disappeared.

1852
02:47:06,080 --> 02:47:15,760
That number would, you know, increase by
35%. So you're talking over 10%. Okay.

1853
02:47:12,640 --> 02:47:20,560
just residential tax going after this
which would be astronomical for a

1854
02:47:18,479 --> 02:47:25,920
district this size.
>> So I I'll just hear you. I just one

1855
02:47:23,680 --> 02:47:30,160
final comment. Um we are going to see
costs increase. We're going to see uh

1856
02:47:28,080 --> 02:47:34,640
continuing interest and expectation on
the school. Something like the buffer

1857
02:47:32,399 --> 02:47:40,319
land is also an important recreational
and community benefit. Um so again um

1858
02:47:38,399 --> 02:47:47,200
grant and a process are we putting
enough into that? Um and again Miss Frri

1859
02:47:44,160 --> 02:47:52,479
had said uh the number of requests that
we keep getting and again it's almost

1860
02:47:49,600 --> 02:47:57,600
every council meeting. So to me I very
much support these groups. I very much

1861
02:47:54,240 --> 02:48:02,080
support um providing the PTE. Uh I think
there is a deeper conversation that does

1862
02:47:59,200 --> 02:48:06,399
have to happen though. So um that's it.
Thank you very much.

1863
02:48:03,279 --> 02:48:10,600
» Thank you Kelton.
>> Oh thank you. Um

1864
02:48:11,680 --> 02:48:20,160
where where where to start? Um the
application process um and I and thank

1865
02:48:17,600 --> 02:48:26,479
you for the um some background on that
Mr. Freak. Um to reapply every year is

1866
02:48:24,560 --> 02:48:30,479
quite an honorous task because that is a
very long application.

1867
02:48:28,479 --> 02:48:34,960
Um so this is something we would need to
discuss if it's you know every two

1868
02:48:32,640 --> 02:48:40,960
years, five years or whatever. But the
one thing I would like to see from all

1869
02:48:38,160 --> 02:48:46,000
the people that um receive a tax
exemption is a report, an annual report

1870
02:48:43,760 --> 02:48:52,399
of what they've done, what's what's new,
what's exciting, you know, um the

1871
02:48:49,520 --> 02:48:56,479
ability for council to go and visit or
maybe have a tour. Like I've never been

1872
02:48:54,000 --> 02:49:02,792
on the Thunderbird property. Um they
they gave a a a great uh presentation

1873
02:48:59,279 --> 02:49:06,640
recently. I know where they are. um
[clears throat] and I'm familiar with

1874
02:49:04,160 --> 02:49:10,479
many many of these organizations.
Um I'm

1875
02:49:08,800 --> 02:49:15,520
so so I think that is something that we
need to also um have a a better

1876
02:49:12,800 --> 02:49:20,000
understanding. Um one of the questions
are is this open to the public. Some

1877
02:49:18,000 --> 02:49:25,439
things are and some things aren't. Most
of them are. Um others aren't. Maybe

1878
02:49:22,640 --> 02:49:28,960
because it's a cons conservation zone. I
don't really know. Or maybe it's the the

1879
02:49:27,359 --> 02:49:37,520
lay of the land that I'm not sure
either. um um security is not the word

1880
02:49:33,200 --> 02:49:43,279
but uh risk various risks um might might
be some of those things. However, um the

1881
02:49:40,720 --> 02:49:49,680
social fabric we got a great outpouring
from our um our

1882
02:49:46,720 --> 02:49:54,640
um what do we call these um these
property owners of you know what it is

1883
02:49:52,880 --> 02:49:59,680
that they actually do for our community.
It would cost us a lot of money to have

1884
02:49:56,399 --> 02:50:07,200
a lot of these services. So they are an
asset. As far as the school, the school

1885
02:50:02,800 --> 02:50:12,080
building is also an asset. It's also uh
was it ever intended to be partially

1886
02:50:09,760 --> 02:50:15,680
commercial and partially
um

1887
02:50:13,760 --> 02:50:22,880
uh
what's the word? Um

1888
02:50:19,200 --> 02:50:26,800
no no um
sorry it's late. Um,

1889
02:50:26,240 --> 02:50:30,479
» so,
>> so I'm just thinking about the dollars,

1890
02:50:28,640 --> 02:50:35,600
the dollars and cents. So, we've got
people paying a lot more money in part

1891
02:50:32,800 --> 02:50:40,160
of the building, um, say the the full
amount for per square footage, right?

1892
02:50:38,399 --> 02:50:45,279
And another part subsidized. That's
we're looking for subsidized um, and yet

1893
02:50:42,720 --> 02:50:50,399
making a profit. So, we need to work
more on that still. Um, so the school is

1894
02:50:48,640 --> 02:50:54,319
evolving. I mean, compared to where it
was two years ago, uh, quite a bit of it

1895
02:50:52,640 --> 02:51:01,439
was empty. So there's a lot of things
that will need to be discussed. Uh a lot

1896
02:50:58,160 --> 02:51:08,479
of um things will need to be evolved.
I'm just very appreciative that the um

1897
02:51:05,200 --> 02:51:14,000
the longevity of services that the um
per permissive tax exemption property

1898
02:51:10,800 --> 02:51:20,319
owners have given us uh as far as
services has been amazing because none

1899
02:51:17,840 --> 02:51:26,319
of them get paid. It's all volunteer. It
is uh it is what Matosen is based on as

1900
02:51:23,600 --> 02:51:30,720
far as rural honestly can't compare it
to Souk. Souk is uh quite a business

1901
02:51:28,640 --> 02:51:36,800
hub. They've they're they're much bigger
and and yeah, everything is quite a lot

1902
02:51:33,760 --> 02:51:40,080
different. But uh we do have to have
more conversations about some things

1903
02:51:38,720 --> 02:51:45,600
especially with some of the data that
you've presented here tonight. But I do

1904
02:51:43,680 --> 02:51:49,920
um
and I've written about this in in a news

1905
02:51:47,920 --> 02:51:54,560
article and spoken to many of these
individuals and these groups. Uh

1906
02:51:52,080 --> 02:51:58,560
appreciate all the services and the um
the work that they do because it's they

1907
02:51:57,279 --> 02:52:03,200
don't they don't get paid but they
provide great service to our small

1908
02:52:01,520 --> 02:52:11,120
community.
I don't have any other questions just

1909
02:52:05,120 --> 02:52:15,359
suggestions for future um conversations.
>> Okay. Councelor Gray.

1910
02:52:13,600 --> 02:52:20,720
» Can I make a motion that we extend the
meeting beyond 10 pm?

1911
02:52:17,680 --> 02:52:24,960
» Uh, yep. Go ahead. Uh, motion to extend
the meeting beyond 10 p.m. Moved by

1912
02:52:23,359 --> 02:52:29,359
Councelor Gray, second by Council
Donaldson. All in favor? Post carried.

1913
02:52:27,600 --> 02:52:36,160
Go ahead. Councelor Gray, did you have
any uh questions or comments for uh CFO

1914
02:52:34,399 --> 02:52:41,040
Creek?
Yeah, just the notion sort of following

1915
02:52:38,319 --> 02:52:45,760
on comments of um councelor Schukan and
Donaldelsson that I think changes to the

1916
02:52:43,439 --> 02:52:50,080
permissive tax exemption
uh approach need a process with our

1917
02:52:48,479 --> 02:52:55,359
community
rather than us meeting and making a

1918
02:52:51,840 --> 02:53:00,720
determination one evening. Um I'm
referring to changing from from the way

1919
02:52:57,439 --> 02:53:04,399
things have been for a very long time.
Um we've already had a robust debate

1920
02:53:02,720 --> 02:53:12,160
this year in terms of the community
involvement and um the response was

1921
02:53:07,120 --> 02:53:18,000
quite strong. I think the issue still um
sits with us though about the total

1922
02:53:14,160 --> 02:53:22,479
value of these um contributions.
We heard uh from someone this evening

1923
02:53:19,920 --> 02:53:27,840
and we've heard previously about the
value that the community gets from

1924
02:53:25,760 --> 02:53:30,960
government's local government support
and I commend you the Victoria

1925
02:53:29,200 --> 02:53:38,880
Foundation report which was shared with
all of us um indicating the tremendous

1926
02:53:35,200 --> 02:53:42,960
um value we get when we support
community groups.

1927
02:53:40,960 --> 02:53:47,680
Um
I think of another example though some

1928
02:53:44,880 --> 02:53:52,720
somewhat different one. It would be very
difficult for the citizens of Machosen

1929
02:53:50,160 --> 02:53:57,520
to pull together the kind of money
that's been spent by the BC Parks

1930
02:53:54,880 --> 02:54:00,720
Foundation to save some very large
acreages.

1931
02:53:59,120 --> 02:54:05,840
Um they're you know protected
permanently now. Um

1932
02:54:04,319 --> 02:54:09,840
we couldn't come up with that money but
we can come up with a tax exemption for

1933
02:54:07,840 --> 02:54:13,359
those groups.
back to my first point. Um, I think of

1934
02:54:11,840 --> 02:54:18,560
the Thunderbird camp where the largest
beneficiary of tax exemptions. I think

1935
02:54:15,760 --> 02:54:23,120
it's something like 4,000 young children
go through or young and maybe not so

1936
02:54:20,720 --> 02:54:29,120
young children going through that camp
every year. Um, so it's a tremendous

1937
02:54:26,640 --> 02:54:35,200
benefit to to young people in our
community and beyond. It's also very

1938
02:54:31,840 --> 02:54:39,520
difficult for the YMCA. They may have
other resources but that camp I think we

1939
02:54:37,760 --> 02:54:43,279
heard back if if we don't have tax
exemptions they have to look to other

1940
02:54:40,720 --> 02:54:48,560
ways of raising money and that I'm
afraid may come in the form of logging

1941
02:54:46,240 --> 02:54:52,000
and yet that property is part of mature
our tax exemption from my point of view

1942
02:54:50,240 --> 02:54:58,160
is part of our contribution to the sea
to see green and blue belt um so I see

1943
02:54:56,319 --> 02:55:04,000
the value there I'm I'm going I'm I'm in
favor of continuing um as we have um

1944
02:55:02,000 --> 02:55:07,640
that we give the uh first second and
third reading this evening.

1945
02:55:09,200 --> 02:55:16,640
» Thank you. [clears throat] And um I'd
like to thank uh Mr. Creek for not only

1946
02:55:13,760 --> 02:55:22,800
this uh report that provided valuable
information for council, but also the

1947
02:55:19,359 --> 02:55:28,160
past uh the the past reports that that
you've provided. Um I have a number of

1948
02:55:25,439 --> 02:55:34,960
comments, but I thought um I I wanted to
ask questions to Mr. Creek regarding our

1949
02:55:31,600 --> 02:55:42,720
current financial picture as well as our
picture um after 2030. And I think that

1950
02:55:39,439 --> 02:55:49,200
should frame our discussion. And and at
our budget meetings this year, there was

1951
02:55:45,200 --> 02:55:58,640
quite um impassion speeches
regarding um being uh um that that other

1952
02:55:55,920 --> 02:56:04,720
members of uh government, provincial,
federal are moving into austerity uh

1953
02:56:01,760 --> 02:56:10,160
measures. um that we also have to be
really careful with our dollars and uh

1954
02:56:07,680 --> 02:56:15,840
we had conversations about what I
considered uh pretty small tuppence but

1955
02:56:13,680 --> 02:56:22,319
was voted down by this council because
we were worried about about our fiscal

1956
02:56:18,479 --> 02:56:27,840
constraint. Um here we are giving very
generously and it's not our money. We're

1957
02:56:25,359 --> 02:56:33,760
giving generously on behalf of the
citizens of Machosen. Although we did

1958
02:56:30,960 --> 02:56:40,240
hear from a lot of groups that they were
dissatisfied with the way the permissive

1959
02:56:36,160 --> 02:56:46,319
tax exemptions um conversation unfolded,
I did have some comments from some

1960
02:56:42,640 --> 02:56:52,000
citizens saying my taxes are too much
for me. I may have to move. Um, I think

1961
02:56:49,760 --> 02:57:00,160
that the some of these groups that have
millions of dollars in their coffers and

1962
02:56:55,200 --> 02:57:06,960
they're asked to pay um uh 7,000 a year
or uh 4,900 in terms of the BC Parks

1963
02:57:04,160 --> 02:57:12,399
Foundation. Um they do provide benefit
and I'm not questioning the benefit that

1964
02:57:10,000 --> 02:57:17,040
all these groups give. They give
valuable benefit and we value our

1965
02:57:15,520 --> 02:57:23,600
volunteers.
But we also need to look at our finances

1966
02:57:20,399 --> 02:57:29,680
and our financial picture. And while Mr.
Cus is um thinking about um his comments

1967
02:57:27,760 --> 02:57:35,279
regarding my questions, I want to just
remind everybody that this wasn't a

1968
02:57:32,720 --> 02:57:40,160
sudden decision in the last year.
Questions and concerns regarding the

1969
02:57:37,120 --> 02:57:44,880
permissive tax exemptions for nonprofit
societies at the district machos was

1970
02:57:42,160 --> 02:57:52,319
first raised by council members at this
table at the September 11th 2023

1971
02:57:49,040 --> 02:57:57,600
meeting. So that was we were not even in
office one year and questions were were

1972
02:57:55,279 --> 02:58:02,479
raised that was raised by councelor Gray
at that September 11th meeting and that

1973
02:58:00,160 --> 02:58:07,600
was in regards to the Victoria
Motorcycle Club and his concerns

1974
02:58:04,880 --> 02:58:13,120
regarding this club receiving a
permissive tax exemption and that's what

1975
02:58:10,160 --> 02:58:17,439
got the ball rolling. So it's incorrect
to say we've been discussing this for a

1976
02:58:15,600 --> 02:58:23,920
year. We've been discussing the
permissive tax exemptions since

1977
02:58:20,160 --> 02:58:28,319
September 11th, 2023.
Uh, two years later, the discussions of

1978
02:58:26,240 --> 02:58:34,880
the permissive tax exemptions has
continued. Discussions or three years

1979
02:58:31,359 --> 02:58:43,359
discussions for the 2026 tax year began
on June 25th or sorry, June 2025 with a

1980
02:58:39,600 --> 02:58:48,000
report from our CFO. Uh this was again
discussed at another opening meeting on

1981
02:58:45,439 --> 02:58:54,160
July 14th and there were no concerns
raised by uh the council that was at the

1982
02:58:50,800 --> 02:58:59,120
table. Okay. So this was 2025. There was
five members at the table. Um on

1983
02:58:57,040 --> 02:59:03,680
September 15th, the discussion was
brought back to council. Before the item

1984
02:59:01,600 --> 02:59:07,920
was fully introduced, two counselors
declared conflicts of interest and

1985
02:59:06,000 --> 02:59:12,720
recused themselves from the entire
discussion. Thus there were open

1986
02:59:10,880 --> 02:59:17,680
discussions about permissive tax
exemptions for the next year at the mid

1987
02:59:15,439 --> 02:59:22,640
district have been chosen as it relates
to what was then the seven nonprofits.

1988
02:59:20,800 --> 02:59:30,960
So that's to give you factual
information about how this has unfolded

1989
02:59:26,160 --> 02:59:35,600
since September 11th 2023. Um and then
the conflict of interest uh has

1990
02:59:33,680 --> 02:59:40,720
complicated this. I think we should be
clear and admit that the conflict of

1991
02:59:38,000 --> 02:59:46,160
interest uh um declarations did
complicate the permissive tax

1992
02:59:42,720 --> 02:59:52,640
exemptions. Um regarding my comments
regarding uh this uh permissive tax

1993
02:59:49,359 --> 02:59:58,240
exemptions, the overarching for me is
our fiscal responsibility. It's not our

1994
02:59:55,439 --> 03:00:04,240
money, it's the taxpayers's money. And
I'd like before I conclude my comments,

1995
03:00:00,800 --> 03:00:10,080
I'd like to turn to our CFO to give um
him an opportunity to give us a brief

1996
03:00:06,800 --> 03:00:16,160
synopsis of our financial picture now
and the comments that he had made

1997
03:00:12,319 --> 03:00:20,640
regarding concerns about 2030 and
beyond. Thank you,

1998
03:00:18,640 --> 03:00:25,840
» Mayor Little. It's councelor Gray. Just
before that, I' I'd like you. We should

1999
03:00:23,279 --> 03:00:29,760
be dealing with FRA facts as you say
>> and I think um

2000
03:00:27,120 --> 03:00:32,720
» could you just wait, Councelor Gray? Um
no, I think

2001
03:00:30,399 --> 03:00:39,040
» the CFO is going to speak and then you
can speak afterwards. Go ahead, CFO.

2002
03:00:36,560 --> 03:00:45,359
» Councelor Gray, you're out of line and
you're out of order. If you can just

2003
03:00:41,040 --> 03:00:49,840
wait for the CFO to give his synopsis.
if you can wait until this.

2004
03:00:48,319 --> 03:00:54,319
» It's a point of order. You said
something that wasn't accurate about

2005
03:00:52,640 --> 03:00:58,720
myself, and I think that needs to be
cleared up. Um, and the the fact of the

2006
03:00:56,800 --> 03:01:03,279
matter is that I raised the issue of the
Victoria Motorcycle Club, the

2007
03:01:01,120 --> 03:01:08,160
Thunderbird Camp, and all of the Tree
Canopy properties. and council then

2008
03:01:05,920 --> 03:01:12,800
passed a policy to say that we would
consider Tree Canopy or approached the

2009
03:01:11,200 --> 03:01:17,359
groups to ask if they're interested in
that being part of their arrangements

2010
03:01:14,800 --> 03:01:20,960
with us. But it wasn't um I would did
not speak against the motorcycle club

2011
03:01:18,880 --> 03:01:25,680
receiving its thing, but rather whether
they would have an interest in doing

2012
03:01:22,399 --> 03:01:30,080
more than um commit to more than just
the services they provide. Thank you.

2013
03:01:28,399 --> 03:01:35,760
» Yeah, thank you. You can go back to the
tape of September 11, 2023 to find out

2014
03:01:33,359 --> 03:01:39,800
what the real comments were. My
recollection was that

2015
03:01:39,920 --> 03:01:49,760
» maybe councelor Gray,
>> my recollection is that you spoke

2016
03:01:47,120 --> 03:01:54,880
against the Victoria Motorcycle Club.
You had grave concerns about uh whether

2017
03:01:53,040 --> 03:02:00,240
they should be receiving the permissive
tax exemptions. we can all go back to

2018
03:01:57,439 --> 03:02:05,439
that council meeting of September 11th
and um look at those comments. CFO

2019
03:02:03,359 --> 03:02:09,359
Creek, could you give your comments,
please?

2020
03:02:06,800 --> 03:02:14,960
» Through the chair. Thank you. All right.
So, for the district uh chosen right now

2021
03:02:12,399 --> 03:02:19,359
for the next five years, right, we got a
budgeted increase for RCMP is going to

2022
03:02:17,200 --> 03:02:25,359
be about half a million dollars. um
we're going to end up using up our

2023
03:02:21,120 --> 03:02:31,279
police reserve uh by the end of 2029,
I believe it was, maybe 2028. Uh so full

2024
03:02:29,279 --> 03:02:35,920
brunt of that tax increase will be
coming in. Um we're also going to be

2025
03:02:33,520 --> 03:02:41,200
using up our
uh revenue stabilization reserve with

2026
03:02:38,160 --> 03:02:48,240
the estimated loss of our Mary Hillland
um in 2028. Those funds are going to be

2027
03:02:44,160 --> 03:02:53,040
extinguished by 2030. Uh and then after
that it's more of a what's the province

2028
03:02:51,120 --> 03:02:57,920
going to download onto municipalities
again. And so once we've used up these

2029
03:02:55,200 --> 03:03:04,000
reserves um the tax increases are going
to be fairly significant. Um especially

2030
03:03:01,200 --> 03:03:09,040
over over the next six years it was
going to be close to double digit

2031
03:03:05,120 --> 03:03:12,960
increases every year. Uh and so it's uh
something that the district really needs

2032
03:03:10,479 --> 03:03:18,240
to consider on what are we going to do
is right cutting tax uh cutting

2033
03:03:15,520 --> 03:03:22,000
expenses, increasing revenues to pay for
what's coming down the line. Uh and then

2034
03:03:20,399 --> 03:03:27,359
when you add on the infrastructure
deficit that the uh district's facing

2035
03:03:24,319 --> 03:03:30,800
with roads, equipment, buildings, etc.
Um anything that happens with the fire

2036
03:03:29,200 --> 03:03:33,680
hall, right, like our building
replacement reserve is going to be gone

2037
03:03:32,080 --> 03:03:39,040
with that. probably a good chunk of our
general capital reserve unappropriated

2038
03:03:36,319 --> 03:03:43,680
surplus. Um it's all going to be
whittleled down quite rapidly. And then

2039
03:03:41,520 --> 03:03:48,479
along with the west parks and wreck uh
if we stay a member of that we end up

2040
03:03:46,240 --> 03:03:53,040
doing whatever their master capital plan
uh is predicting over the next 5 to 10

2041
03:03:50,880 --> 03:03:56,800
years u the reserve that we have for
that is also going to gone and probably

2042
03:03:55,040 --> 03:04:00,479
asked for more. That requisition is
going to be increasing significantly as

2043
03:03:58,399 --> 03:04:04,479
well uh because of the operating costs
of brand new buildings. So

2044
03:04:02,771 --> 03:04:10,000
[clears throat] a number of impacts that
are going to be played out in the next 5

2045
03:04:06,319 --> 03:04:15,359
to 10 years and that's
the main concern that I would have long

2046
03:04:12,000 --> 03:04:20,800
term right this fiveyear period that we
have right now between now and 2030 got

2047
03:04:17,760 --> 03:04:27,920
enough for capital uh projects uh that
are currently planned um and we'll be

2048
03:04:24,399 --> 03:04:31,680
able to cover these taxes again with
fairly high tax increases as a

2049
03:04:29,520 --> 03:04:39,600
percentage wise dollar-wise comparable
to the other municipalities in the CRD.

2050
03:04:35,920 --> 03:04:42,880
But um as the mayor mentioned, people
are feeling the pressure, right? Like

2051
03:04:41,040 --> 03:04:48,160
when I first got here, that's all I
heard was taxes were too high. When I

2052
03:04:44,960 --> 03:04:52,800
looked at it, um comparably, they're
really not. So, it was really based on

2053
03:04:49,920 --> 03:04:57,920
the people that are um land rich and
cash poor, right? Where they bought in a

2054
03:04:55,200 --> 03:05:04,160
long time ago, have houses that are now
worth a million plus, right? Average

2055
03:05:00,160 --> 03:05:08,240
value is 1.2. do but they're on a fixed
income with a small pension that isn't

2056
03:05:06,479 --> 03:05:14,479
increasing at the cost of living
increases. So, uh something to really

2057
03:05:11,680 --> 03:05:18,160
consider on how the district is going to
be funding their operations going

2058
03:05:15,760 --> 03:05:22,240
forward. Um as councelor Donaldson
mentioned, these groups provide services

2059
03:05:20,319 --> 03:05:26,720
that would cost us a significant amount.
We see it in the school, right? The

2060
03:05:24,479 --> 03:05:31,520
district right now is subsidi
subsidizing five different event spaces

2061
03:05:29,120 --> 03:05:37,680
in this district, right? The community
house, community hall, Mcca, the school,

2062
03:05:35,200 --> 03:05:43,200
and the and the church, right? All five
of those um

2063
03:05:40,880 --> 03:05:48,080
buildings rent out to different groups,
right? None of them are full 100% of the

2064
03:05:45,920 --> 03:05:52,560
time. So, they're all being subsidized
for partial use. And we see on the

2065
03:05:50,960 --> 03:05:55,600
school, right, we're losing six figures
a year. And that's because we're

2066
03:05:54,399 --> 03:05:59,200
actually having to pay people, right?
These other organizations all rely on

2067
03:05:57,279 --> 03:06:05,439
volunteers.
And that's where that great return that

2068
03:06:02,319 --> 03:06:09,439
um organizations get when you give them
a dollar, they can turn it into, you

2069
03:06:07,359 --> 03:06:12,960
know, a $1.70.
That's based on them not paying anybody,

2070
03:06:11,600 --> 03:06:17,200
right? Unfortunately, the district has
to pay their staff to maintain

2071
03:06:15,120 --> 03:06:22,080
operations. School is being run on the
side of a couple people's desks right

2072
03:06:18,560 --> 03:06:26,800
now. Um and so we're not maximizing the
use of that space.

2073
03:06:23,600 --> 03:06:33,040
But it is it is very costly and so the
district does get quite a bit out of

2074
03:06:28,640 --> 03:06:36,640
those groups. But it has I think that
good review of what's actually being

2075
03:06:35,120 --> 03:06:41,520
done because everything's just been
piled on but no one's taken the broad

2076
03:06:39,760 --> 03:06:46,160
look at everything that's being done in
the district and whether or not we still

2077
03:06:44,080 --> 03:06:51,279
need to be subsidizing these places
because school was bought back in 2017.

2078
03:06:49,760 --> 03:06:54,319
um wasn't really a business plan in
place in order to actually make the

2079
03:06:53,200 --> 03:06:58,240
money. It was just said, "Hey, we're
going to break even. Don't worry about

2080
03:06:55,439 --> 03:07:02,800
it." Um that has not taken place. It's
taken a lot of work just to get to the

2081
03:06:59,600 --> 03:07:09,200
point where now we're losing $150,000 a
year. But um with the number of spaces

2082
03:07:06,399 --> 03:07:14,800
being rented out uh and the size of this
district, it's uh something to certainly

2083
03:07:11,680 --> 03:07:18,960
consider as costs are just going to keep
escalating, right? Car insurance goes up

2084
03:07:16,560 --> 03:07:25,920
every year, utilities go up every year.
we just go up every year supplies

2085
03:07:22,399 --> 03:07:29,680
doesn't matter right and so and
with the limited growth in the tax

2086
03:07:28,444 --> 03:07:36,240
[snorts] base here right it's been less
than 1% for a quarter century right and

2087
03:07:33,600 --> 03:07:41,920
compared to everywhere else where it's
close to 10% right Langford is doing 13%

2088
03:07:39,040 --> 03:07:48,319
a year right they can they can cover off
things no problem um councelor Donaldson

2089
03:07:45,600 --> 03:07:53,600
was asking about you know how much are
as a percentage, right? 1% is $30,000

2090
03:07:51,600 --> 03:07:56,720
for us. 1% for Victoria is a million
bucks, right? So, when they wrote

2091
03:07:55,955 --> 03:08:00,800
[clears throat] their letter saying
we're giving $100,000 to this group,

2092
03:07:58,800 --> 03:08:03,840
it's 0.1% of a tax increase for them,
right? It's drop in the bucket, right?

2093
03:08:02,319 --> 03:08:07,840
For us, that's three and a half%
increase [laughter]

2094
03:08:05,120 --> 03:08:12,960
to meet that. Uh very, very different
fiscal reality that faces here. Um, and

2095
03:08:10,319 --> 03:08:18,399
it's something that the chosen was lucky
enough um to be able to get away with in

2096
03:08:15,200 --> 03:08:22,160
the 80s, 90s, early 2000s when inflation
wasn't that bad. You were getting a good

2097
03:08:20,319 --> 03:08:25,920
return on your on the savings that you
did have. Um, but as I showed, I think

2098
03:08:24,800 --> 03:08:30,080
it was last year when we're talking
about capital and infrastructure, right?

2099
03:08:28,640 --> 03:08:33,359
Totally switched. Inflation is way
higher than what we're earning now with

2100
03:08:31,200 --> 03:08:39,279
the bank. Uh, so we can't just sock away
$100,000 and beat inflation on any

2101
03:08:35,760 --> 03:08:43,040
capital project. um it's it's gone
unfortunately and now what we're dealing

2102
03:08:41,439 --> 03:08:47,040
with with emergency replacement and that
type of thing

2103
03:08:45,120 --> 03:08:52,560
we'll never get there with with what
we're earning right now in a bank or

2104
03:08:49,439 --> 03:08:56,720
from our tax base growth
there hope that answers our question

2105
03:08:54,560 --> 03:09:02,560
» yeah thank you so [clears throat] I just
want to reiterate council it's not it's

2106
03:08:59,600 --> 03:09:09,040
nothing that we've done uh to bring this
on that the forecast for 2030 has been

2107
03:09:06,479 --> 03:09:14,240
That's just what has happened. Um, and
it's nothing that council has done.

2108
03:09:11,120 --> 03:09:18,720
We've had a very good uh, finance chair
um, who has shephered us through the

2109
03:09:16,160 --> 03:09:25,760
finance meetings every year. We've been
very very conservative in how we have

2110
03:09:21,439 --> 03:09:31,279
spent money. Um, it's exactly what uh,
Mr. Creek is saying. Every cost is

2111
03:09:28,720 --> 03:09:36,560
increasing. The only thing it seems like
is not increasing is a revenue coming

2112
03:09:33,840 --> 03:09:43,760
into the district. We will be at a
crisis fa phase in 2030 and I started

2113
03:09:41,279 --> 03:09:49,359
talking about this as you will remember
in early 2023 when I wanted to set up an

2114
03:09:46,880 --> 03:09:53,520
economic sustainability committee but
that wasn't palatable by one member of

2115
03:09:51,600 --> 03:09:58,080
the council and we've never discussed
that. We should have had this

2116
03:09:55,120 --> 03:10:03,680
conversation regarding sustainability at
the beginning because we were told by

2117
03:10:00,160 --> 03:10:10,080
the province uh in particular that they
will be giving out grants but they will

2118
03:10:06,240 --> 03:10:15,359
not be in the future and um I could see
it based on what I was hearing uh from

2119
03:10:12,560 --> 03:10:20,399
the other mayors what we're moving
towards and I knew our financial

2120
03:10:17,279 --> 03:10:25,040
position as I was a counselor from
before regarding the premierive tax

2121
03:10:23,279 --> 03:10:31,120
exemptions. that we're discussing
tonight. No doubt all of these group

2122
03:10:28,240 --> 03:10:38,240
provide tremendous value and we
appreciate them. Um, but we did receive

2123
03:10:35,840 --> 03:10:45,359
a lot of comments from people saying
these groups provide value, but we

2124
03:10:41,520 --> 03:10:50,640
received also other comments saying
I'm worried about my taxes. I don't have

2125
03:10:48,080 --> 03:10:54,319
I have a very limited income. I'm
worried if we go into the double digit

2126
03:10:52,640 --> 03:10:59,680
whether I'm going to be able to stay in
my home. So the money that we're talking

2127
03:10:57,279 --> 03:11:06,479
about is not our money. It's the
taxpayers's money and whether it is

2128
03:11:02,560 --> 03:11:13,920
equitable and fair for us to ask
taxpayers to contribute to uh a

2129
03:11:10,960 --> 03:11:20,880
municipal tax exemption for some of the
groups that have millions of dollars.

2130
03:11:16,800 --> 03:11:26,399
Um uh for instance the um BC Parks
Foundation they've they do have when we

2131
03:11:23,520 --> 03:11:31,760
we had those figures I was very shocked
how much they really do have in their

2132
03:11:28,800 --> 03:11:37,040
assets. Um not to say that they haven't
done good work in retaining property and

2133
03:11:34,640 --> 03:11:42,160
providing uh conservation and
environmental values. Absolutely. Um,

2134
03:11:40,240 --> 03:11:48,640
but the question that I ask myself
always with these type of questions is,

2135
03:11:45,200 --> 03:11:55,120
is this good for the community? Is this
good for the community at large?

2136
03:11:51,359 --> 03:11:59,200
Permissive tax exemptions. And um, I'm
hearing concerns from our chief

2137
03:11:56,880 --> 03:12:04,560
financial officer that the long-term
picture from it chosen does not look

2138
03:12:01,279 --> 03:12:10,800
well look great. And so I think we need
to be very very careful with how we give

2139
03:12:07,279 --> 03:12:16,800
out money. Um um if we don't pass the
bylaw um as it sits now, nobody gets

2140
03:12:14,800 --> 03:12:21,520
anything. And that will provide a
hardship for for probably not BC Parks

2141
03:12:19,840 --> 03:12:26,000
and maybe not some of these other
groups, maybe not the probably not the

2142
03:12:23,680 --> 03:12:32,640
Victoria Motorcycle Club. I'm just
surmising. But for sure it will have

2143
03:12:28,960 --> 03:12:38,399
impact on the Anglican Church, um the
St. Mary's Church. And I can speak to

2144
03:12:35,279 --> 03:12:45,680
this. It's not my church. I don't attend
um their um um services uh but they

2145
03:12:42,800 --> 03:12:51,200
provide valuable benefit to the
community at large and so I'm a big

2146
03:12:47,920 --> 03:12:57,920
supporter of them. Um this if we do not
give them the tax exemption they are

2147
03:12:54,640 --> 03:13:03,600
going to be in a real crunch. We have
elderly gentlemen that are providing

2148
03:13:00,479 --> 03:13:09,520
services at the old St. Mary's Church
and they've asked for new volunteers.

2149
03:13:06,000 --> 03:13:14,399
you new backs, uh, new young men, young
women that can help them with the

2150
03:13:11,200 --> 03:13:20,000
graveyard, um, upkeep upkeep. And they
do that for free on behalf of the

2151
03:13:16,800 --> 03:13:24,880
community. And you can see at at the
Spring Liies, we get people from the

2152
03:13:22,319 --> 03:13:29,840
mainland visiting that little church.
They've asked for other younger men,

2153
03:13:27,680 --> 03:13:36,560
younger women to help them, and they've
received no support. they continue on

2154
03:13:34,000 --> 03:13:42,720
continue on and quite frankly a lot of
them are dying off. What are we going to

2155
03:13:38,800 --> 03:13:48,479
do there? Uh we can't afford to pay for
a gardener for that. They've provide

2156
03:13:45,120 --> 03:13:55,359
that service. Um so I worry if we don't
give the permissive tax exemption

2157
03:13:51,120 --> 03:14:02,560
particularly for the church that that we
will um what I think um it was spoken at

2158
03:14:00,560 --> 03:14:08,080
the last meeting or the meeting before
that they will be at a crisis and it's

2159
03:14:05,760 --> 03:14:13,359
not my church but I still don't want
them to be at a crisis. We want to

2160
03:14:10,239 --> 03:14:17,359
support them as much as possible.
Um,

2161
03:14:15,040 --> 03:14:23,359
I spoke in favor of the decisions that
we've made previously and I still stand

2162
03:14:20,080 --> 03:14:28,000
by the decisions that we made. Uh, the
three of us, there was council Sherry

2163
03:14:25,120 --> 03:14:34,960
EP, councelor Schukan and myself left at
the table. I still think we made a good

2164
03:14:30,560 --> 03:14:41,439
decision where we aired and this is my
responsibility mostly. Where we aired

2165
03:14:38,160 --> 03:14:48,800
was in not communicating this because
we'd been talking about it. so long from

2166
03:14:44,239 --> 03:14:54,720
2023 to that time when we had the um
September 15 2025 meeting that's two

2167
03:14:51,840 --> 03:15:00,239
years later it was irrelevant in our
minds but for the community they some of

2168
03:14:58,399 --> 03:15:04,479
them had attended meetings some of them
had not attended meetings they weren't

2169
03:15:02,319 --> 03:15:09,840
following it and it looked like it was a
sudden decision it wasn't a sudden

2170
03:15:06,880 --> 03:15:14,640
decision it was a decision that was made
over two years and it was a decision

2171
03:15:12,560 --> 03:15:22,479
where we did have meetings in June of
2025, July 14th and September 15th when

2172
03:15:18,720 --> 03:15:28,319
all members of the of the uh the council
were at that meeting and then there was

2173
03:15:25,680 --> 03:15:34,800
uh declarations of conflicts of interest
which left three of us at the table

2174
03:15:30,640 --> 03:15:41,600
holding a bag. And so um that that is
just a fact. Um I we weren't clear in

2175
03:15:39,040 --> 03:15:45,760
our communications to the to the
community and and that we aired on that

2176
03:15:44,000 --> 03:15:50,479
absolutely and we'll do better in the
future. But let's face it, there was a

2177
03:15:47,840 --> 03:15:57,520
lot of fear-mongering going around when
the council chambers uh was um filled

2178
03:15:54,560 --> 03:16:03,279
and some of them some of the uh comments
were alternate facts. They were not

2179
03:15:59,760 --> 03:16:08,880
actual facts. Um as Mr. Creek has
mentioned we are in a tight fiscal

2180
03:16:05,600 --> 03:16:13,439
situation especially after 2030. We've
gone from $250,000

2181
03:16:11,359 --> 03:16:19,520
to 400,000
um or almost 4,000 um allowing for the

2182
03:16:16,319 --> 03:16:25,680
PTEES. Some municipalities as is
outlined in this report have caps.

2183
03:16:22,479 --> 03:16:31,439
They've had caps on their their what
they give in allowance for these

2184
03:16:28,239 --> 03:16:35,600
permissive tax exemptions like souk 1.7
of the property taxes

2185
03:16:33,520 --> 03:16:40,880
» because they've had this kind of a
conversation

2186
03:16:38,399 --> 03:16:44,399
» yes what's your what was your point
>> we don't have

2187
03:16:42,399 --> 03:16:48,000
» there's no motion on the table
>> yeah there's no motion on the table I

2188
03:16:46,479 --> 03:16:53,600
said we were going to have a discussion
before we had a a motion on the table

2189
03:16:50,800 --> 03:16:58,720
what was your point
your point of order. What is your point?

2190
03:16:56,960 --> 03:17:01,359
» We should have a motion on the table to
continue discussing the the issue, I

2191
03:17:00,720 --> 03:17:06,160
believe.
>> Yeah. Let's continue having this

2192
03:17:03,279 --> 03:17:12,960
discussion and then we will move to
something else. Um so I'll conclude by

2193
03:17:09,760 --> 03:17:18,239
saying that some municipalities
um have a different formula. They do

2194
03:17:15,200 --> 03:17:23,439
have this different formula and often if
you notice they decide on it at the

2195
03:17:21,040 --> 03:17:29,920
beginning of the term once for the four
years and then it's not every year that

2196
03:17:26,800 --> 03:17:35,040
these organizations have to get back and
it avoids the situation that we're in

2197
03:17:32,319 --> 03:17:41,279
now which is this is the silly season
and like it or not um people also have

2198
03:17:38,399 --> 03:17:45,600
other motives at this time regarding
campaigning um whether they're going to

2199
03:17:43,279 --> 03:17:50,080
be elected or not it's it's actually
brilliant to bring it in at the

2200
03:17:47,439 --> 03:17:55,680
beginning of council at the term and
then for the four years and and I would

2201
03:17:52,800 --> 03:18:03,200
I would suggest we do that if we're so
lucky to be at this table again. Um and

2202
03:17:59,760 --> 03:18:07,880
uh let's see what else did I have to say
uh regarding that. Um

2203
03:18:10,960 --> 03:18:19,920
yeah it and also we we let's face it
we're in a difficult situation now with

2204
03:18:17,040 --> 03:18:27,279
a council of four because if we have a
22 split uh the motion will fail. Okay.

2205
03:18:24,560 --> 03:18:31,120
And that's just a fact with uh councelor
stepping away because of of family

2206
03:18:29,600 --> 03:18:34,960
concerns.
Um

2207
03:18:32,640 --> 03:18:40,319
yeah, and also the conflict of interests
that were declared then not declared and

2208
03:18:37,680 --> 03:18:46,479
then declared again. It's was confusing
to the public and we've had two members

2209
03:18:43,600 --> 03:18:51,359
of the public speaking out about the
conflict of interests that were declared

2210
03:18:49,040 --> 03:18:56,800
and I think we need clarification on
that. And if you declare a conflict of

2211
03:18:53,760 --> 03:19:01,680
interest, as councelor Dawson does every
time, she declares a conflict of

2212
03:18:59,040 --> 03:19:06,239
interest and she states a reason. That
is your responsibility. That is our

2213
03:19:04,239 --> 03:19:14,399
right and we need to have that
conversation as well. So I will um

2214
03:19:10,720 --> 03:19:20,640
conclude my remarks that um what I'm
asking what is good for the community at

2215
03:19:16,800 --> 03:19:28,000
this point and uh what is possible for
us is that if you need more information

2216
03:19:24,560 --> 03:19:34,800
we could defer this uh to the September
21st meeting for a council uh decision.

2217
03:19:32,560 --> 03:19:42,800
It is getting late. We're all tired.
It's 10:30. We've been here since 6. Uh,

2218
03:19:38,319 --> 03:19:46,800
we could defer this. And with that, um,
I don't know. Uh, could I get some

2219
03:19:44,640 --> 03:19:54,239
guidance from staff regarding that? Did
you want to speak? No. Can I get some

2220
03:19:50,319 --> 03:19:59,040
guidance from staff regarding the, uh,
potential to defer this? I'm not trying

2221
03:19:56,720 --> 03:20:04,000
to defer to the decision. I'm trying to
get more information for council to make

2222
03:20:01,840 --> 03:20:09,760
that decision. And one of the things we
may want to do is because we've had

2223
03:20:06,960 --> 03:20:15,680
conflict of interest declarations before
which would put us in a very awkward

2224
03:20:12,560 --> 03:20:21,200
position uh with maybe three council
members or even two left at the table

2225
03:20:18,080 --> 03:20:25,600
which would we we couldn't make a
decision. Um we need to have that

2226
03:20:23,920 --> 03:20:32,359
conversation.
Mr. Creek could you comment on that or

2227
03:20:28,560 --> 03:20:32,359
or Mr. Payet?

2228
03:20:33,200 --> 03:20:39,200
Um through the chair you could table you
could table the decision for more

2229
03:20:38,239 --> 03:20:45,279
information.
>> Yeah. Would that be beneficial to you

2230
03:20:42,479 --> 03:20:52,560
council members? Councelor Shuken.
>> Uh no it it wouldn't be for me. Um I

2231
03:20:49,520 --> 03:20:58,640
again I'm willing to
um

2232
03:20:54,720 --> 03:21:02,960
hear more I suppose but uh nothing that
I've heard

2233
03:21:00,560 --> 03:21:09,520
will change my view that the best thing
to do at this particular juncture is to

2234
03:21:06,399 --> 03:21:14,080
move ahead with the pts
in terms of the status quo previous

2235
03:21:11,359 --> 03:21:18,800
status quo but open up this discussion
next year in light of the full um you

2236
03:21:17,200 --> 03:21:24,640
know all of the pressures that you
outlined the um and also include the

2237
03:21:21,920 --> 03:21:30,239
groups as well. So it's it's a deeper
discussion that includes the groups but

2238
03:21:26,720 --> 03:21:34,640
at this juncture um I I'm I'm willing to
move ahead with um moving to first,

2239
03:21:32,800 --> 03:21:38,479
second, third reading on the PTS as
presented.

2240
03:21:36,000 --> 03:21:43,120
» Okay, let's hear from your council
colleagues. Uh council Donaldson, do you

2241
03:21:41,359 --> 03:21:45,520
want some more time to think or are you
okay?

2242
03:21:43,840 --> 03:21:52,319
» No, but I do have a question through the
chair to the CEO. Y

2243
03:21:47,760 --> 03:21:56,080
» um so if we were to do as um what my
council [clears throat] colleague Mr.

2244
03:21:53,520 --> 03:22:02,960
you can hear is suggesting perhaps it's
motion one. I'm not sure. Um

2245
03:22:00,319 --> 03:22:07,279
in this list there is one organization
that I would [clears throat] have a

2246
03:22:03,920 --> 03:22:12,960
conflict of interest. Would the if we
were to

2247
03:22:09,200 --> 03:22:17,840
motion that we accept um all groups in
the PTE is that

2248
03:22:15,840 --> 03:22:22,720
um without [clears throat] debating
which ones get and don't very similar to

2249
03:22:20,720 --> 03:22:27,279
what we do in a budget where there also
might be a conflict of interest on a

2250
03:22:24,319 --> 03:22:33,920
topic or an investment of an asset or
such. So my question to you is

2251
03:22:31,680 --> 03:22:39,439
if we do this,
if we pass all eight, is it the policy

2252
03:22:36,319 --> 03:22:43,359
we're passing or are we or shall I
recuse myself? I'm a bit confused on

2253
03:22:41,680 --> 03:22:47,439
that.
>> Um CEO pay question.

2254
03:22:45,520 --> 03:22:50,960
» Yes, great question and
>> upfront question. So thanks to the

2255
03:22:49,279 --> 03:22:56,800
counselor for that and uh would
recognize that the um decision would be

2256
03:22:54,000 --> 03:23:02,800
based on the overall general policy and
uh that you have not discussed specifics

2257
03:23:00,160 --> 03:23:08,080
on your personal conflict. So um that's
how we would see that.

2258
03:23:04,560 --> 03:23:12,160
» Okay. Thank you. So it'll depend on
which right

2259
03:23:09,439 --> 03:23:18,479
» motion is being made. So, the
possibility of deferring or tableabling

2260
03:23:14,160 --> 03:23:25,439
this, the um CFO could restructure
potentially the um the wording here in

2261
03:23:22,640 --> 03:23:31,306
terms of the motion and break apart the
bylaw. Is that a possibility? CFO Creek

2262
03:23:30,239 --> 03:23:34,399
» through the chair. Correct.
[clears throat] I would be able to

2263
03:23:32,479 --> 03:23:38,399
create two different bylaws, three
different bylaws, whatever is kind of

2264
03:23:36,080 --> 03:23:43,040
needed. Um just won't be able to do it
tonight.

2265
03:23:39,439 --> 03:23:48,080
» Right. And so my my comments regarding
tableabling this is to give respect to

2266
03:23:45,120 --> 03:23:53,040
our colleagues that have uh declared a
conflict of interest. That is their

2267
03:23:50,080 --> 03:23:57,680
right and it is their responsibility to
to adhere to the rules of the

2268
03:23:55,279 --> 03:24:03,040
confidential uh conflict of interest
guidelines. But it's it's her right to

2269
03:24:00,560 --> 03:24:09,680
declare that I'm trying to give space
and oxygen for that to happen. And if we

2270
03:24:06,560 --> 03:24:13,920
subdivide them then she can she can
declare a conflict of interest where she

2271
03:24:11,680 --> 03:24:20,960
has a real conflict of interest not on
the over broad arching policy but uh

2272
03:24:18,560 --> 03:24:26,080
specifically if I'm not speaking out of
turn uh council Donaldson we're talking

2273
03:24:23,359 --> 03:24:28,960
about the Victoria Motorcycle Club.
>> Is that right?

2274
03:24:26,960 --> 03:24:31,439
» Correct. But right now we don't even
have a motion on the table. So

2275
03:24:30,399 --> 03:24:35,600
» Right.
>> Right. It's hard for me to make this

2276
03:24:33,120 --> 03:24:38,800
decision creating something else that's
not written here.

2277
03:24:36,560 --> 03:24:44,080
» Sure. Sure. And that's why I'm
suggesting perhaps it would be better

2278
03:24:40,800 --> 03:24:51,200
for us to table this, give the CFO a
chance to restructure this, break apart

2279
03:24:46,880 --> 03:24:55,840
the bylaw um to allow for um this.
Council Schulen,

2280
03:24:53,520 --> 03:25:00,319
» should we pass a motion
>> regarding deferral?

2281
03:24:57,520 --> 03:25:05,359
» Deferral, but also um direction to Mr.
Creek to um segment the bylaw to avoid

2282
03:25:03,520 --> 03:25:09,680
any conflict of interest.
>> Yeah. I I I don't think we need to pass

2283
03:25:07,200 --> 03:25:12,960
a motion. I think he's got a clear
message of what what can happen.

2284
03:25:12,319 --> 03:25:15,120
» Great.
>> Yeah. Okay.

2285
03:25:14,560 --> 03:25:21,120
» Okay.
>> Well, um would we would we need a um

2286
03:25:18,479 --> 03:25:24,800
motion to defer or we just table it? A
motion to table it.

2287
03:25:22,800 --> 03:25:29,920
» U Mayor Little.
>> Yes.

2288
03:25:27,279 --> 03:25:33,840
» Yes. Councor Greg, go ahead.
Yeah, I had a single question and then

2289
03:25:31,600 --> 03:25:39,680
I'm ready to tackle the motion tonight.
Um, and the question was for the C CFO,

2290
03:25:36,239 --> 03:25:45,120
so through the chair. Um, then the
Victoria Humane Society

2291
03:25:42,160 --> 03:25:50,479
um last year at about this time a vote
was held that granted them a 2026

2292
03:25:48,160 --> 03:25:57,279
premise of tax exemption.
And we um because their uh their um

2293
03:25:55,120 --> 03:26:04,880
purpose did not meet any of council's
priorities, we asked that they um pursue

2294
03:26:02,080 --> 03:26:08,640
a section 219 covenant to support, you
know, getting a permissive tax exemption

2295
03:26:06,800 --> 03:26:13,920
and to give us progress by August of
last year. Now, we've heard that the

2296
03:26:10,960 --> 03:26:19,439
Victoria Humane Society, well, they've
written us and said they don't want to

2297
03:26:15,279 --> 03:26:22,640
consider such a thing. are they still um
or which council priority are they

2298
03:26:21,120 --> 03:26:27,760
meeting I guess is my question in your
graph you've got them as eligible and

2299
03:26:24,239 --> 03:26:33,040
I'm not sure how
>> through the chair uh so that was that

2300
03:26:30,080 --> 03:26:39,359
was based on uh the council strategic
priority regarding environmental and uh

2301
03:26:36,399 --> 03:26:43,239
care and so kind of comes down to the
animals that they're taking in

2302
03:26:43,279 --> 03:26:50,640
ends up preventing like uh stray dogs
and cats

2303
03:26:47,120 --> 03:26:54,720
from destroying other wildlife, right? I
think we've all read about the number of

2304
03:26:52,160 --> 03:27:00,720
cats that have killed millions of birds
out there, unfortunately. Um, and so

2305
03:26:57,600 --> 03:27:05,279
it's kind of on on that rain that I took
it. Um, so more probably a more liberal

2306
03:27:03,600 --> 03:27:10,800
interpretation than what I was giving it
last year. Last year I just looked at it

2307
03:27:07,200 --> 03:27:15,920
and said, "No, this year
kind of widened it a bit to say if they

2308
03:27:14,479 --> 03:27:20,880
weren't taking them in, people just let
their stray dogs and cats uh and

2309
03:27:18,720 --> 03:27:26,680
proliferate the way that they do um
cause more environmental degradation

2310
03:27:22,720 --> 03:27:26,680
than would be preferred.

2311
03:27:26,800 --> 03:27:34,239
» I see. I I hadn't um I don't see it in
the same light as you do because you

2312
03:27:32,239 --> 03:27:39,279
know we're we didn't discuss anything
like that when we considered our uh

2313
03:27:36,479 --> 03:27:47,439
strategic priorities.
>> Okay. Um I just wanted to ask a question

2314
03:27:42,880 --> 03:27:52,560
from uh CFO Creek. My recollection is
that the Victoria Humane Society did

2315
03:27:50,080 --> 03:27:57,200
come for originally for the permissive
tax exemption uh for the year previous,

2316
03:27:55,600 --> 03:28:01,600
but they didn't follow through on that
and we never gave them a permissive tax

2317
03:27:59,520 --> 03:28:06,080
exemption. Is that correct in their
first year?

2318
03:28:03,439 --> 03:28:09,840
Or did we?
>> Through the chair, I believe like if

2319
03:28:09,028 --> 03:28:14,239
[clears throat] they had applied in
2024, it was it was because it was too

2320
03:28:12,399 --> 03:28:17,200
late when they applied for it when they
got

2321
03:28:15,680 --> 03:28:21,200
ended up on title. So, [music] we
couldn't give them one in 2024.

2322
03:28:19,359 --> 03:28:25,600
» Yeah. So, it wasn't that we denied them,
they they just didn't they they they

2323
03:28:24,479 --> 03:28:30,399
weren't considered.
>> Yeah.

2324
03:28:26,080 --> 03:28:37,200
» Yeah. Cal Gray.
Okay. So, let's go back to the deferment

2325
03:28:34,720 --> 03:28:40,800
tableling this. Uh that's what I'm
suggesting to council.

2326
03:28:38,960 --> 03:28:46,239
» Sorry. If we need a motion to table, I
will make that motion um to be brought

2327
03:28:43,439 --> 03:28:50,720
back as soon as possible with the again
the segmented um bylaw.

2328
03:28:48,399 --> 03:28:56,800
» Okay, great. So, that's moved by
councelor uh Schukan, seconded by I'll

2329
03:28:54,319 --> 03:29:03,200
second that motion.
>> Yeah. Okay. And then with that, we can

2330
03:29:00,000 --> 03:29:08,160
allow other uh conversations uh to be
had. Perhaps uh Council Donaldson can

2331
03:29:05,680 --> 03:29:12,720
reach out to staff regarding uh the
conflict of interest just to make sure

2332
03:29:10,160 --> 03:29:18,319
it's crystal clear regarding your rights
and responsibilities. Council Donaldson.

2333
03:29:15,920 --> 03:29:24,720
» Okay.
>> Before quoting voting, I had a question.

2334
03:29:22,800 --> 03:29:29,120
» Pardon?
>> Before voting, I had a question.

2335
03:29:27,279 --> 03:29:33,520
» Okay. Go ahead.
>> Uh through the chair to the CEO. I

2336
03:29:32,080 --> 03:29:38,000
wasn't clear when you responded to
councelor Donaldelsson. Were you saying

2337
03:29:36,080 --> 03:29:43,680
that it would be fine if she voted on
the motion tonight because it has so

2338
03:29:40,960 --> 03:29:49,439
many pieces to it and so she would not
you would not consider that she had a

2339
03:29:45,120 --> 03:29:55,200
conflict to vote on say option one.
>> Yeah. Um so counselor it's up to

2340
03:29:51,920 --> 03:30:02,720
counselor Donaldson to decide if
she has a conflict or not and to declare

2341
03:29:58,479 --> 03:30:09,760
it and why. So that's her purview. The
the um conversation and the dialogue has

2342
03:30:06,880 --> 03:30:15,840
been in general and the policies
written and designed so that uh all of

2343
03:30:13,760 --> 03:30:22,080
the um
all of the service service clubs or

2344
03:30:18,720 --> 03:30:27,600
whatever um they meet the the general
criteria that are listed. they're all in

2345
03:30:24,479 --> 03:30:34,319
general terms and if they meet or don't
meet. Um, so it's an overall policy and

2346
03:30:31,359 --> 03:30:40,239
so that's my view and that's how I would
consider it. Um, but it's up to to each

2347
03:30:38,239 --> 03:30:44,880
counselor to decide if that if they're
still in conflict or not. Um, that's it.

2348
03:30:43,760 --> 03:30:49,200
» Thank you.
>> Yeah, I I think that's a really good

2349
03:30:46,720 --> 03:30:55,120
point, Councelor Gray. It is up to the
individual council member uh to decide

2350
03:30:52,640 --> 03:30:59,600
whether or not they have a a perceived
conflict of interest or an actual

2351
03:30:57,359 --> 03:31:05,600
conflict of interest. And as you'll
know, Council Gray, you had a perceived

2352
03:31:02,640 --> 03:31:12,160
or you had a conflict of interest at one
time and then you changed it um and said

2353
03:31:08,880 --> 03:31:18,560
you no longer had a conflict of interest
even though um you did have a conflict

2354
03:31:15,040 --> 03:31:24,640
of interest regarding the uh lands title
office. And so it opens up a huge can of

2355
03:31:21,920 --> 03:31:28,399
worms with you declaring a conflict of
interest, then not declaring the

2356
03:31:26,640 --> 03:31:34,160
conflict of interest. And where does
that leave us? So in you you have a

2357
03:31:31,680 --> 03:31:38,960
right you have a right to declare a
conflict of interest but you have an

2358
03:31:36,479 --> 03:31:45,439
obligation to give us the reason the
rationale as councelor Donaldson has

2359
03:31:42,080 --> 03:31:50,080
» consistently given you communicated to
us that you had a conversation with a

2360
03:31:47,920 --> 03:31:54,960
lawyer that is not
>> telling us what the resolution of that

2361
03:31:52,880 --> 03:32:01,200
conflict of interest is. That's you're
telling us a communication piece. So you

2362
03:31:58,160 --> 03:32:06,399
you need to you need to comment
regarding having a conflict of interest

2363
03:32:04,399 --> 03:32:11,120
and then not having a conflict of
interest and then I don't know what you

2364
03:32:09,040 --> 03:32:14,560
you're planning on doing at this meeting
whether you're planning to have a

2365
03:32:12,479 --> 03:32:18,960
conflict of interest or a perceived
conflict of interest or no conflict of

2366
03:32:16,960 --> 03:32:23,840
interest. You haven't declared that
although councelor Donison has raised

2367
03:32:21,439 --> 03:32:29,680
comments that she may declare a conflict
of interest.

2368
03:32:26,479 --> 03:32:35,200
Mayor Little, just to to play that back,
um I think you need to be be um fair

2369
03:32:32,479 --> 03:32:41,439
with your counselors. What happened was
that I followed precisely the um the

2370
03:32:38,800 --> 03:32:45,439
rules of how this works. I declared a
conflict of business. I explained why

2371
03:32:42,960 --> 03:32:49,920
that I was a trustee in the hall. I left
the room. I then as per our policy and

2372
03:32:48,160 --> 03:32:54,160
as per the community charter consulted a
lawyer. I described that to you and I

2373
03:32:52,640 --> 03:32:58,239
stepped off as a trustee of the Hall
which I told you and and I said now I

2374
03:32:56,080 --> 03:33:01,600
can vote on the issues and I think
there's not really any confusion there

2375
03:32:59,600 --> 03:33:05,680
when you follow exactly the policies in
place. Um if you don't understand them I

2376
03:33:03,840 --> 03:33:10,479
can certainly show you the areas in the
community charter and in our own um

2377
03:33:08,399 --> 03:33:14,720
policy book on the on these issues and
how counselors are to behave and it's

2378
03:33:12,800 --> 03:33:18,160
not fair for you to tell me that I have
a conflict of issues somehow around the

2379
03:33:16,239 --> 03:33:22,479
land titles office. I have no idea what
you're talking. That's as as our CEO

2380
03:33:20,640 --> 03:33:26,000
just advised all of council and the
public. It's up to the counselor

2381
03:33:24,160 --> 03:33:30,160
themselves to determine whether they're
in conflict. You don't tell me if I'm in

2382
03:33:27,680 --> 03:33:35,920
conflict or not. You must
>> and I apologize if you think that I'm

2383
03:33:32,319 --> 03:33:39,439
trying to declare asked you to conflict
of interest.

2384
03:33:37,279 --> 03:33:47,920
» I completely understand community
charter 12 or 224 227 and section 941

2385
03:33:45,200 --> 03:33:53,920
the requirement. I understand the
community charter completely, but you

2386
03:33:50,640 --> 03:33:58,800
have a right to declare the conflict of
interest, but you also have a

2387
03:33:56,080 --> 03:34:02,880
responsibility not only to us, but to
the public who's watching. That's the

2388
03:34:00,720 --> 03:34:06,663
transparency piece.
>> Councelor Shuk,

2389
03:34:04,479 --> 03:34:12,399
» we should move on. like it's almost
[laughter] 221 and we'd be really awful

2390
03:34:09,600 --> 03:34:15,760
to break our longest meeting record on
one of our last meetings in the middle.

2391
03:34:14,000 --> 03:34:20,439
» Okay, so we've got a motion on the table
to defer until September 21st.

2392
03:34:23,038 --> 03:34:25,058
[laughter]

2393
03:34:26,319 --> 03:34:34,080
» Sorry, I've got allergies. Okay,
I'll call the question on [laughter]

2394
03:34:32,863 --> 03:34:41,040
[cough]
on the deferral. All in favor?

2395
03:34:38,160 --> 03:34:45,319
All opposed?
That's deferred. Just a moment.

2396
03:35:04,800 --> 03:35:10,200
I'm going to have to take a break for 90
seconds.

2397
03:38:24,735 --> 03:38:26,755
» [snorts]

2398
03:38:30,080 --> 03:38:38,560
» Uh staff, are we ready to move on?
>> Okay,

2399
03:38:36,560 --> 03:38:44,000
I apologize for that. I've got terrible
allergies regarding the pollen in the

2400
03:38:40,399 --> 03:38:48,880
air. Okay. Um item number 12, other
business.

2401
03:38:46,800 --> 03:38:55,760
We've got the progress report from the
fireh hall technical team. Progress

2402
03:38:51,680 --> 03:39:00,520
report uh
council or sorry CA opt.

2403
03:39:04,036 --> 03:39:10,880
[clears throat]
Yeah. Speak speak. Um wasn't really

2404
03:39:08,319 --> 03:39:15,279
planning on speaking to this but I can
start off.

2405
03:39:12,800 --> 03:39:23,200
Everybody had a chance to read the
progress. We've met number of times um

2406
03:39:20,239 --> 03:39:27,680
and we had an opportunity to introduce
the CFO and the fire chief to the

2407
03:39:25,680 --> 03:39:36,160
technical team
and um they've been touring the facility

2408
03:39:32,201 --> 03:39:41,279
[clears throat] and um we have to we
still have not signed a service

2409
03:39:37,920 --> 03:39:48,160
agreement, but we're closing in I would
say on the service agreement um to make

2410
03:39:44,000 --> 03:39:52,640
sure we're all um properly governed and
insurance is in place. I'll be bringing

2411
03:39:49,680 --> 03:39:57,920
that to council
um once that's done.

2412
03:39:55,600 --> 03:40:02,880
Um
and uh we look forward to their good

2413
03:39:59,920 --> 03:40:05,880
hard work. So
questions.

2414
03:40:06,239 --> 03:40:15,399
Okay. Um [clears throat]
do we have any uh comments from

2415
03:40:12,000 --> 03:40:15,399
committee members?

2416
03:40:16,000 --> 03:40:21,520
Thanks.
>> Well, first

2417
03:40:19,600 --> 03:40:26,319
yeah, Council Donaldson, then councelor
Shukin and Councelor Gray. Go ahead.

2418
03:40:24,239 --> 03:40:34,720
» Thank you very much. I really appreciate
the um this report and the layout uh

2419
03:40:31,200 --> 03:40:39,520
specifically the guiding u principles
um and the timeline and how quickly

2420
03:40:36,720 --> 03:40:47,680
everything has uh taken place. Each
member clearly has a task to do. Um and

2421
03:40:44,960 --> 03:40:52,960
involving uh our staff has been
obviously paramount in this and will be

2422
03:40:50,080 --> 03:40:56,720
going forward as well. Um I was
surprised by only really one thing and

2423
03:40:54,720 --> 03:41:01,680
that was that we have six existing
mutual aidus. Um I wasn't aware of that.

2424
03:40:59,840 --> 03:41:06,560
I know at this table we signed off one
with uh Cwood about two years ago. I

2425
03:41:04,960 --> 03:41:12,640
haven't seen anything with the Langford
one. It's now fully um manned at their

2426
03:41:10,319 --> 03:41:15,359
station, number two station. So, so
that's uh interesting. I'd like to learn

2427
03:41:14,080 --> 03:41:20,640
a little bit more about that going
forward. Um that's that's a minor detail

2428
03:41:18,160 --> 03:41:24,720
as to what they're doing, but it is uh
significant. Um I think I've highlighted

2429
03:41:23,359 --> 03:41:29,760
everything here, so I'm not going to
speak to all my highlights, but uh very

2430
03:41:27,359 --> 03:41:34,239
pleased with the uh progress report.
Looking forward uh to the next one and

2431
03:41:32,720 --> 03:41:38,560
getting their service agreement in
place, too. Thank you.

2432
03:41:36,720 --> 03:41:43,359
Kelsea Shuk,
>> I wonder if I could ask a question of

2433
03:41:40,960 --> 03:41:47,680
the representatives. So, one of one of
the intriguing um well, first of all,

2434
03:41:45,359 --> 03:41:51,120
thank you for your work and reporting.
>> Mr. Smurfett, could you come to the

2435
03:41:49,439 --> 03:41:55,520
microphone, please?
>> Sure.

2436
03:41:52,800 --> 03:41:59,760
» Okay.
>> Um

2437
03:41:57,279 --> 03:42:04,080
Okay. So, thank you so much for the work
in the report. Um

2438
03:42:02,319 --> 03:42:08,640
and again, yeah, all the back and
forthing with um I understand uh I think

2439
03:42:07,279 --> 03:42:15,200
there's been also a meeting with the
fire chief as well. So, one of the

2440
03:42:11,120 --> 03:42:18,319
intriguing parts of the report for me
comes under the apparatus bay and it

2441
03:42:16,800 --> 03:42:22,560
says the team proposes to fully
understand the safety related issues to

2442
03:42:21,200 --> 03:42:25,359
determine what options might be
considered to solve these. And I think

2443
03:42:23,920 --> 03:42:30,800
we're talking about the decontamination,
the ventilation,

2444
03:42:27,680 --> 03:42:35,520
uh movement around trucks, etc. Unless
these can be solved, it is of no use to

2445
03:42:33,279 --> 03:42:40,800
investigate the structural issues. Can
you reflect on that and expand on that a

2446
03:42:38,880 --> 03:42:47,840
little bit?
>> Um, yeah, sure. Uh, when we looked at

2447
03:42:45,120 --> 03:42:53,760
the lists that had been compiled of
previous reports, we we we tried to wrap

2448
03:42:49,840 --> 03:42:59,920
our hand heads around that. Um, we first
tried one approach and that didn't gel

2449
03:42:57,680 --> 03:43:06,399
with us. So we we we structured it
differently. We we saw that we really

2450
03:43:02,399 --> 03:43:10,960
have two big issues to grapple with and
a couple of smaller ones. We put those

2451
03:43:08,640 --> 03:43:16,239
aside and said okay so what do we have?
We have all these safety related issues

2452
03:43:13,600 --> 03:43:22,080
and we have structural related issues.
Um there have been in the past a number

2453
03:43:19,520 --> 03:43:26,800
of calls to say oh well you can you can
fix that with steel, you can fix it this

2454
03:43:24,080 --> 03:43:34,399
way, you can fix that way. that may be
so um but there's no use going down that

2455
03:43:30,479 --> 03:43:39,279
rabbit hole if we're blocked by the
safety items. Um so we said okay we got

2456
03:43:37,520 --> 03:43:44,640
to look at these safety items first we
need to understand them. Um we had a a

2457
03:43:42,080 --> 03:43:48,880
great conversation a longer conversation
with the chief and we understood all

2458
03:43:47,040 --> 03:43:54,720
those safety items and we now need to
take those away and say well is is there

2459
03:43:51,840 --> 03:44:00,080
something one can do about that? Um, if
there is, we can consider the second

2460
03:43:57,120 --> 03:44:05,760
part. If there isn't, it's maybe a bit
of a showstopper. It's It's just where

2461
03:44:02,640 --> 03:44:09,920
we are. We haven't made a decision
anyway at this stage.

2462
03:44:08,160 --> 03:44:14,760
» We have made a decision. We haven't made
a decision on making a recommendation

2463
03:44:11,760 --> 03:44:14,760
yet.

2464
03:44:16,720 --> 03:44:22,800
» Mr. Smurfett, can you just repeat that
in the microphone so our council

2465
03:44:20,479 --> 03:44:28,160
colleague can hear? We haven't made a
decision on making a recommendation

2466
03:44:26,640 --> 03:44:30,880
to council.
>> Okay.

2467
03:44:28,880 --> 03:44:35,359
» It's very clear to everyone, I'm sure,
that we're not making any decision and

2468
03:44:32,880 --> 03:44:41,199
we we're not decision makers as far as
what goes ahead and doesn't make. We're

2469
03:44:37,520 --> 03:44:45,359
just a advisory group to uh provide
technical

2470
03:44:43,359 --> 03:44:48,160
direction if you will to the next step
in this project. Right.

2471
03:44:47,040 --> 03:44:54,560
» Thank you.
>> Okay. Thank you.

2472
03:44:51,920 --> 03:44:58,880
Okay. Yep. You you can you can sit down.
Thank you. I appreciate that.

2473
03:44:57,085 --> 03:45:01,680
[clears throat] U did you have any other
questions,

2474
03:45:00,560 --> 03:45:06,239
councelor Shukan?
>> Um no, but I I um that was the one that

2475
03:45:04,880 --> 03:45:09,120
stuck out for me, but I do appreciate
it. Sounds like you're taking a very

2476
03:45:07,600 --> 03:45:13,760
methodical
and objective approach um and digging

2477
03:45:12,000 --> 03:45:16,560
into the issues. Yeah. So, thank you.
Yeah.

2478
03:45:14,239 --> 03:45:20,640
» Great.
>> Councelor Gray.

2479
03:45:19,120 --> 03:45:25,279
» Yeah. I just want to say I like the
methodical approach and the clarity. Um

2480
03:45:23,520 --> 03:45:29,120
I found it to be the most satisfactory
report and was pleased to receive it and

2481
03:45:26,960 --> 03:45:36,040
read it and I want to thank the team for
their work. Um and I look forward to the

2482
03:45:31,439 --> 03:45:36,040
next report. Thank you.

2483
03:45:36,239 --> 03:45:44,160
» Okay. Thank you. Um my comments, you
know, I've I've changed my mind um quite

2484
03:45:41,520 --> 03:45:48,960
a few times back and forth um after
reviewing our decision to engage the

2485
03:45:46,319 --> 03:45:56,239
technical team. Um, and with this
report, I have some concerns. Um, for

2486
03:45:52,640 --> 03:46:01,600
instance, it seems to me that um,
they're re-examining space application,

2487
03:45:58,720 --> 03:46:06,960
the apparatus b issues, the fleet
requirements, and the workflow. This was

2488
03:46:04,000 --> 03:46:13,920
already done in the feasibility study
provided by JDA architects. So, they're

2489
03:46:10,720 --> 03:46:23,359
rehashing that. Why have we got a group
of volunteers who in their own um

2490
03:46:19,120 --> 03:46:29,520
capacity in their former jobs um and and
none of these individuals have current

2491
03:46:26,160 --> 03:46:36,560
seals of approval for engineers?
Why are we asking a group of volunteers

2492
03:46:33,680 --> 03:46:42,640
to give direction not to council,
they're giving direction to our CEO? and

2493
03:46:39,920 --> 03:46:47,680
and that brings up issues to me in terms
of good governance. So these meetings

2494
03:46:44,479 --> 03:46:53,120
are behind closed doors where council is
not viewing them and the public is not

2495
03:46:50,399 --> 03:46:58,560
viewing what is being discussed at that
meeting. So we're allowing a volunteer

2496
03:46:55,920 --> 03:47:03,120
group to do things that we're not
allowed to do. We have to have the

2497
03:47:00,720 --> 03:47:07,760
public watching us. So, I don't think
this is good governance and I don't

2498
03:47:05,199 --> 03:47:13,040
think it's good for our CEO to be
directed by a group of volunteers. Yes,

2499
03:47:10,640 --> 03:47:17,680
they're not providing they're not asking
for a fee, but they have cost the

2500
03:47:15,680 --> 03:47:24,880
district already. There was a week's
worth of effort of the CFO or sorry this

2501
03:47:21,439 --> 03:47:31,040
the CFO partly, but the CEO and our
legislative clerk. So, that was a week's

2502
03:47:28,000 --> 03:47:35,359
worth of work. that is that that is time
that they didn't have for other

2503
03:47:33,040 --> 03:47:43,600
activities. So that has cost the
district. Um the uh they're correcting

2504
03:47:40,640 --> 03:47:48,080
the minor uh discrepancies in a
completed professional architectural

2505
03:47:45,520 --> 03:47:53,840
study. I don't think that's role a role
for volunteers. uh proposing to expand

2506
03:47:51,199 --> 03:47:59,840
scope to all district buildings within
200 meters school community house EOC um

2507
03:47:57,520 --> 03:48:04,960
which was never part of the fireh hall
original mandate uh proposing to

2508
03:48:02,640 --> 03:48:11,040
re-examine whether the apparatus bay can
be retained uh skyline engineering

2509
03:48:07,600 --> 03:48:16,319
answered this not only once but twice.
So these are professionals that have

2510
03:48:13,359 --> 03:48:25,279
already given written assessments and
now volunteers who had great careers and

2511
03:48:20,319 --> 03:48:29,920
had were um um what's the term they were
they they were engineers with their

2512
03:48:27,520 --> 03:48:37,199
seals of approval that they no longer
hold. um we're asking them to

2513
03:48:33,040 --> 03:48:43,439
re-evaluate what we've already paid for
professional opinions and so that brings

2514
03:48:40,960 --> 03:48:48,479
up concerns for me. We've also got an
additional member of the team that we

2515
03:48:45,279 --> 03:48:54,399
didn't hear about before and plus we
were never allowed to vet the team with

2516
03:48:50,960 --> 03:49:00,880
our our uh fireh hall steering committee
that came to council. We decided who was

2517
03:48:57,840 --> 03:49:06,080
going to be on that committee.
that that is good governance. We gave

2518
03:49:03,120 --> 03:49:10,800
them a terms of reference. We gave them
what their scope of practice would be

2519
03:49:08,399 --> 03:49:15,199
and we decided who was on the committee.
We didn't decide on this group. They

2520
03:49:12,880 --> 03:49:22,319
came forward and they added an
additional member. No, Gary. Uh I'll

2521
03:49:19,680 --> 03:49:27,279
give you an opportunity later. Okay.
>> Yeah. I I will give you an opportunity

2522
03:49:25,840 --> 03:49:33,760
at in a [clears throat] moment. Okay.
Mr. Murph

2523
03:49:30,000 --> 03:49:38,880
um at the last council meeting um it uh
the council stated the next steps in the

2524
03:49:36,000 --> 03:49:45,520
community needs assessment. Um that's
the correct next step. Okay. Um what a

2525
03:49:43,120 --> 03:49:51,680
community needs assessment actually is
it's it's a formal professional

2526
03:49:48,560 --> 03:49:57,840
delivered study. It's distinct from the
feasibility study work and it defines

2527
03:49:54,880 --> 03:50:03,279
what the new facility um must accomplish
from the service delivery uh in terms of

2528
03:50:00,560 --> 03:50:09,760
population growth, response standards,
the service demand, the risk assessment.

2529
03:50:06,000 --> 03:50:17,199
Um it's a document that uh the grant the
granting agencies uh require and in BC

2530
03:50:13,760 --> 03:50:21,840
it's delivered by firms like um um
Firewise for instance. we heard about

2531
03:50:19,359 --> 03:50:26,720
them in the in the last term. Um Dave
Mitchell and Associates. So a lot of

2532
03:50:24,640 --> 03:50:33,439
what they're
um responding to has already been

2533
03:50:30,239 --> 03:50:39,600
completed by professionals that this
council has given the authorization to

2534
03:50:36,880 --> 03:50:43,920
pay for those. So we've got paid
consultants who have given us

2535
03:50:41,199 --> 03:50:48,640
professional reports that is now being
reassessed by volunteers in our

2536
03:50:46,160 --> 03:50:54,479
committee, our community. And I don't
think that's a good use of volunteers,

2537
03:50:51,840 --> 03:50:58,720
but also a good use of our staff time.
And it's not good governance because

2538
03:50:56,800 --> 03:51:02,960
good governance would be allowing the
fireh hall steering committee to

2539
03:51:00,720 --> 03:51:09,680
continue on in their work. What has
happened is this technical team has

2540
03:51:05,840 --> 03:51:14,560
supplanted and and sort of displaced the
fireh hall steering committee and meet

2541
03:51:11,920 --> 03:51:20,880
the the committee and they're feeling it
and they've said to us why we were

2542
03:51:17,680 --> 03:51:25,840
appointed to this body. Why aren't we
meeting to discuss this and move along

2543
03:51:23,359 --> 03:51:32,399
in the fireh hall debate? Why have we
been disregarded and we've taken um up

2544
03:51:29,439 --> 03:51:39,359
this new group and they're reassessing
them some things that um that have

2545
03:51:36,080 --> 03:51:45,439
already been accomplished and completed.
We have the fire fireh hall feasibility

2546
03:51:41,760 --> 03:51:50,239
study completed by JDA architects.
They've done fire halls throughout BC,

2547
03:51:48,000 --> 03:51:56,479
including Central Sanage, which was
completed in 2018

2548
03:51:52,720 --> 03:52:03,439
by this architect. Um, which has all of
the requirements that we need. It's more

2549
03:51:59,120 --> 03:52:09,199
grandiose, yes, but it could be scaled
to our community. and JDA architects

2550
03:52:06,800 --> 03:52:14,640
that we
contracted to give us that feasibility

2551
03:52:12,080 --> 03:52:19,359
study completed that central Sanich
fireh hall and we should go and look at

2552
03:52:16,160 --> 03:52:23,760
it really it it addresses a lot of the
issues that we have been grappling with

2553
03:52:21,600 --> 03:52:29,760
and I suggest we do that in short order
within the next couple of weeks staff

2554
03:52:25,920 --> 03:52:34,720
and council go for for um uh a visit
there um [clears throat]

2555
03:52:32,399 --> 03:52:42,160
to to continue the two seismic
assessments done by skyline engineering

2556
03:52:37,680 --> 03:52:48,640
that was in 2022 2025 the existing app
apparatus bay is 433% of the current

2557
03:52:46,399 --> 03:52:52,000
code requirement the up
>> moment of order mayor mayor little

2558
03:52:51,279 --> 03:52:56,239
» yes
>> did you have comments on the actual

2559
03:52:54,640 --> 03:52:59,840
topic under discussion or do you just
want to cite a lot of past work you did

2560
03:52:58,080 --> 03:53:03,680
vote in favor of directing the co to
engage the proposed volunt firehouse

2561
03:53:01,920 --> 03:53:08,880
technical team I recall
>> yeah I did. I did. And as I explained at

2562
03:53:06,640 --> 03:53:13,680
the beginning, I've had reservations and
I don't think this is good governance.

2563
03:53:11,199 --> 03:53:17,600
» So, I'm going to continue. I didn't
interrupt you while you were talking.

2564
03:53:16,399 --> 03:53:21,920
And I would
>> I would ask you to be respectful and not

2565
03:53:19,840 --> 03:53:28,319
interrupt me.
>> And so, I'll carry on.

2566
03:53:23,840 --> 03:53:35,439
» I I'll carry on, Counselor Gray.
>> I'll carry on. Counselor Gray. So the

2567
03:53:31,279 --> 03:53:40,399
hazardous material survey by the AIC um
environmental 2022 there's no asbestous

2568
03:53:38,479 --> 03:53:45,040
for instance that doesn't need to be
addressed that has already been

2569
03:53:42,239 --> 03:53:50,160
addressed um the six layout options
developed uh and the preferred option of

2570
03:53:47,840 --> 03:53:57,760
option 1A the new build on the adjacent
ALR site um is another example the

2571
03:53:54,479 --> 03:54:03,040
highle cost analysis has been completed
the mutual aid reviewed has been

2572
03:53:59,920 --> 03:54:08,960
complete did the technical team uh just
redid this and got the same answer. Now

2573
03:54:05,760 --> 03:54:15,680
what is that? What is the utility of
that? Um they're reviewing what has

2574
03:54:11,920 --> 03:54:21,199
already been completed and by qualified
professionals that we paid for it.

2575
03:54:17,920 --> 03:54:28,640
They're meeting behind closed doors and
directing our CEO. As a council, to me,

2576
03:54:25,680 --> 03:54:33,359
that is not good governance. As vice
chair of the CRD and chair of our

2577
03:54:31,199 --> 03:54:40,560
governance and first nations committee,
I see this as not good governance. I

2578
03:54:37,120 --> 03:54:46,800
don't think I will not speak in favor of
this. I've I've Yes, councelor Gray's

2579
03:54:43,840 --> 03:54:53,920
right. I did speak and I voted for it,
but I've had grave reservations since.

2580
03:54:51,120 --> 03:54:59,199
Mr. Smurfett, I said that I would give
you an opportunity. Did you wish to

2581
03:54:55,840 --> 03:54:59,199
speak at this time?

2582
03:55:00,880 --> 03:55:07,120
Thank you very much, Madame Mayor.
>> Uh,

2583
03:55:05,760 --> 03:55:12,800
some of the comments you've made
regarding the people who formed this

2584
03:55:10,160 --> 03:55:15,520
team, I found personally disparaging.
>> Okay.

2585
03:55:13,359 --> 03:55:21,279
» You've received a copy of my resume. You
know that I've been project manager on

2586
03:55:18,319 --> 03:55:26,080
many projects including most recently
the sewage treatment plant and

2587
03:55:23,520 --> 03:55:29,760
collection facility in souk which we
brought in under budget and on time.

2588
03:55:28,880 --> 03:55:32,239
» That's right.
>> And

2589
03:55:30,319 --> 03:55:36,880
» but I wasn't speaking towards the
project management. I was speaking to

2590
03:55:34,160 --> 03:55:42,239
the what what the the engineering
component because on the fire at the

2591
03:55:40,319 --> 03:55:47,199
fireh hall steering committee we do have
a structural engineer. That's what I was

2592
03:55:45,199 --> 03:55:52,399
pointing to. I'm not pointing to your
project management, but but you're not

2593
03:55:49,760 --> 03:55:57,920
asked to be project managers here, Mr.
Smurfett. You're you have been tasked

2594
03:55:54,720 --> 03:56:02,399
and you have been asked you as a little
Sorry, you did ask Mr. Point of order.

2595
03:56:01,040 --> 03:56:06,319
» Okay, go ahead, Mr. Murph.
>> I I'm sorry. I don't see any sense in me

2596
03:56:04,560 --> 03:56:13,199
continuing to speak because I just
started trying to explain and you jumped

2597
03:56:08,640 --> 03:56:18,160
in and I just feel if I continue, you
know, [snorts] I'm going to lose it

2598
03:56:14,720 --> 03:56:21,840
because I don't I don't need no we're
all volunteers.

2599
03:56:20,000 --> 03:56:27,920
I was a professional engineer since
1974.

2600
03:56:23,600 --> 03:56:33,199
I cancelled my professional stamp about
five years ago because I didn't want to

2601
03:56:30,560 --> 03:56:38,479
take any more courses to show that I was
capable. The other gentlemen are that

2602
03:56:35,120 --> 03:56:43,040
way. We have a a deputy captain from the
Sanage Fire Department on our team.

2603
03:56:41,040 --> 03:56:47,279
We're not
our [clears throat]

2604
03:56:45,359 --> 03:56:54,319
work is based on what we submitted to
you to this council. Uh we presented our

2605
03:56:50,800 --> 03:56:59,439
first report. If you and this council
and the CIO feel that we're wasting our

2606
03:56:57,040 --> 03:57:06,479
time, then tell us and we'll we'll leave
Dodge and let you continue on at the

2607
03:57:01,920 --> 03:57:11,600
same rate that's gone on. But uh I read
through this $23.5 million proposal and

2608
03:57:09,600 --> 03:57:16,560
I don't see where we need to have
facilities for

2609
03:57:14,640 --> 03:57:20,800
refugees or battered women or that in
the fire hall and that I mean we're

2610
03:57:19,120 --> 03:57:26,000
trying to bring some reality to the
situation and and if you don't want that

2611
03:57:23,359 --> 03:57:34,920
fine tell us to leave Dodge and we will.
Thank you very much. Good evening.

2612
03:57:29,920 --> 03:57:34,920
» I move receipt of the report. Second.

2613
03:57:35,760 --> 03:57:43,840
» Uh, I didn't hear that motion. If you
can repeat that.

2614
03:57:40,720 --> 03:57:50,479
» I move receipt of the progress report
from the fireh hall technical team.

2615
03:57:47,840 --> 03:57:56,640
» Okay. And that was seconded by councelor
Schukan. Do you wish to speak to that,

2616
03:57:52,880 --> 03:58:00,479
Mr. M uh councelor Greg?
I think it's a fine report and I

2617
03:57:58,319 --> 03:58:05,520
appreciate the work being done and I'm
uh would like to move on. Thank you.

2618
03:58:03,120 --> 03:58:10,880
» Thank you. Go ahead, Councelor Gray.
Councelor Donaldson.

2619
03:58:07,840 --> 03:58:15,520
» No. Um I will just speak out. I don't
think this is good governance. I

2620
03:58:12,479 --> 03:58:19,920
appreciate the work of the volunteers
and I appreciate their sentiment. I

2621
03:58:17,760 --> 03:58:25,680
wasn't speaking disparagingly about
their project management. I all I'm

2622
03:58:22,800 --> 03:58:30,720
saying is they've displaced the fireh
hall steering committee which was good

2623
03:58:28,319 --> 03:58:38,560
governance. That was a committee that we
all vetted and is waiting and standing

2624
03:58:33,760 --> 03:58:43,120
by to help. This has surpped or or
pushed aside the fireh hall steering

2625
03:58:40,960 --> 03:58:47,920
committee and I don't think that is
respectful. I wish some of them were at

2626
03:58:45,359 --> 03:58:55,600
this meeting.
And I I do have grave concerns about

2627
03:58:52,640 --> 03:59:01,760
uh even though they're they're valuable
that they're meeting behind closed doors

2628
03:58:59,199 --> 03:59:08,720
in their discussions and they're meeting
with RCAO behind closed doors. As a

2629
03:59:05,840 --> 03:59:13,760
council, we're not seeing that. We get
the report, yes, but it's that

2630
03:59:10,960 --> 03:59:17,279
transparency piece. The public hasn't
been able to weigh in and see what

2631
03:59:15,359 --> 03:59:22,479
they're talking about. We haven't been
able to weigh in and see what they're

2632
03:59:19,040 --> 03:59:26,640
talking about. So, I will vote in
against receiving the report.

2633
03:59:26,160 --> 03:59:32,720
» Okay.
>> Well, I'll call then all in favor

2634
03:59:29,840 --> 03:59:35,680
» that here to look at and that's the
report. The public can see it. Thank

2635
03:59:34,319 --> 03:59:40,720
you.
>> I didn't hear that but I couldn't

2636
03:59:37,840 --> 03:59:48,920
understand. Let's call the question. All
in favor of receipt.

2637
03:59:43,520 --> 03:59:48,920
Councelor Shukin, Councelor Donaldson.

2638
03:59:48,960 --> 03:59:57,040
Anybody else?
And I'm voting against it. Um, Councelor

2639
03:59:55,279 --> 04:00:00,880
Gray, are you voting in favor or
against?

2640
03:59:59,040 --> 04:00:04,720
» As a mover of the motion, I'm voting in
favor.

2641
04:00:01,680 --> 04:00:09,840
» In favor. So, that motion passes. Okay.
Thank you.

2642
04:00:06,880 --> 04:00:12,840
Okay. Moving back to our uh council
agenda.

2643
04:00:15,040 --> 04:00:21,040
Go ahead.
Moved by councelor Shukin to adjourn.

2644
04:00:19,199 --> 04:00:25,720
Seconded by councel Dalton. All in
favor? Post carried. Thank you.