1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:07,940 [Music] 2 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:19,680 Welcome, welcome to the city of Malala Planning Commission meeting for May or 3 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:26,560 sorry June June uh June 4th 4th 2025. 4 00:00:24,240 --> 00:00:31,119 Um so please join me in the flag seat. 5 00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:41,280 I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the 6 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:47,879 republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and 7 00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:47,879 justice for all. 8 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:58,879 Uh, next is roll call. Um, I guess we'll start with 9 00:00:57,120 --> 00:01:02,640 um over here. We'll start over here with 10 00:01:00,239 --> 00:01:06,320 you, Jessica. Jessica, community development technician. Jessica Worth, 11 00:01:04,239 --> 00:01:10,479 present. Jamie Viverus, associate planner, present. Commissioner 12 00:01:08,320 --> 00:01:14,560 Hodkinson, present. Commissioner Ornelis, present. Uh, Commissioner Eagle 13 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:20,320 Bear, present. Commissioner Anel, present. Commissioner Pototts, present. 14 00:01:17,119 --> 00:01:26,720 Senior Planner Dan Zinder, present. Pho Brown, 3J Consulting, present. Mhm. 15 00:01:24,479 --> 00:01:32,479 Thank you. Um we're moving on to our 16 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:40,000 uh consent agenda uh for the minutes from May 7th, 2025. Um there are there 17 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:43,759 were some corrections made. So I need to ask may I have a motion to amend and 18 00:01:42,159 --> 00:01:50,640 adopt the consent agenda with corrections? I motion to approve the uh 19 00:01:47,439 --> 00:01:55,280 May 7th agenda with corrections. May I get a second? I second. Is there any 20 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:59,360 discussion? Does anybody need any discussion on 21 00:01:56,720 --> 00:02:05,280 that? All right. Uh Jessica, can you call the role? 22 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:12,560 Commissioner Anel, I. Commissioner Onelis, I. Commissioner Pototts, I. 23 00:02:09,599 --> 00:02:16,680 Commissioner Hodkinson, I. And Chairman Eagle Bear, I. 24 00:02:17,040 --> 00:02:22,280 It passes. 5 Z. 25 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:30,520 Okay. 26 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:41,360 Next, uh, we don't have any ceremonies or proclamations. 27 00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:46,160 Um, however, we do have, let's see, now's the time to receive public comment 28 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:49,920 on items not listed on our agenda. Citizens are allowed up to three minutes 29 00:02:47,920 --> 00:02:55,440 to present information relevant to the city but not listed as an item on the 30 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:59,920 agenda. Prior to speaking, citizens shall complete a comment form and 31 00:02:57,599 --> 00:03:03,040 deliver it to the support staff. Planning commission does not generally 32 00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:06,879 engage in dialogue with those making comments, but may refer the issue to the 33 00:03:04,959 --> 00:03:11,360 community development director. Complaints shall complaints shall first 34 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:15,280 be addressed at the department level prior to addressing the planning 35 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:19,840 commission. Did staff receive any written communications? 36 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:25,200 We did receive one via email and you each have a copy. 37 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:31,440 Yep. It was submitted by Paige Lance in regards to the general business item, 38 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:35,519 the UGB CO4 memo. Um generally uh talking about challenges in in expansion 39 00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:42,480 to the south. Um and so that'll be added to public record. Okay. Yes, it was uh 40 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:46,560 thank you for the copies. um looks a little lengthy and my understanding is 41 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:53,760 that it'll be attached to the uh meetings posted at next next month's 42 00:03:50,239 --> 00:03:56,760 meeting online. Yes, sir. All right. So, 43 00:03:57,599 --> 00:04:04,959 all right. Um we don't have any other public comment or anything that you're 44 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:09,439 aware of. Okay. 45 00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:14,959 Uh we don't have any public hearings today. So that moves us already into our 46 00:04:12,319 --> 00:04:18,519 general business. Mr. Zinder, we got a lot of general business 47 00:04:18,639 --> 00:04:28,240 um for the goal 14 um general business category. Uh we didn't submit a written 48 00:04:26,479 --> 00:04:32,320 staff report. I'll just read a quick overview into the record before turning 49 00:04:29,840 --> 00:04:38,479 over in to uh our consultant Violet Brown with 3J Consulting. So uh yeah, 50 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:44,320 this is uh this topic is for our UGB study. It's a goal 14 memo overview. Uh 51 00:04:41,759 --> 00:04:51,520 the just recommendation is to get your feedback on it once we present to you 52 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:55,360 what um the goal 14 memo overview. And uh so background when cities have de 53 00:04:53,919 --> 00:04:58,800 demonstrated land need as determined through their housing 54 00:04:57,280 --> 00:05:03,440 employment lands and public facility studies. Uh statewide planning goal 14 55 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:07,840 outlines criteria for urban growth boundary expansion to to meet those 56 00:05:05,280 --> 00:05:12,400 needs. uh once the land need has been quantified, a study area determined and 57 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:16,800 sub areas have been created with within that study area in accordance with state 58 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:22,320 prioritization for UGB expansion, four factors are applied to the sub areas to 59 00:05:19,039 --> 00:05:26,560 determine suitability for expansion. Um the first one is efficient accommodation 60 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:31,919 of identified land needs. Second is orderly and economic provision of public 61 00:05:29,199 --> 00:05:36,400 facilities and services. The third is comparative environmental, energy, 62 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:40,400 economic and social consequences. And the fourth is compatibility of the 63 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:43,520 proposed urban area with nearby agricultural and forest activities 64 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:47,120 occurring on farm and forest land outside the UGB. So how how would the 65 00:05:45,840 --> 00:05:53,120 expansion interact with the stuff outside the UGB? Um 66 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:57,600 sub areas within the exception lands are to be considered first as our exception 67 00:05:56,160 --> 00:06:00,880 lands are large enough to accommodate the needed residential lands. These 68 00:05:59,199 --> 00:06:04,479 seven sub eight areas are the focus of this analysis. Uh from their 69 00:06:03,039 --> 00:06:08,880 consideration is given to the remaining sub areas to accommodate the larger 70 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:12,240 parcels needed for uh larger employment developments that are unavailable in the 71 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:18,400 exception lands. Um so with that I'll turn it over to Brown of 3J Consulting 72 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:23,280 to talk about our memo our goal 14 analysis stole my thunder. 73 00:06:21,199 --> 00:06:29,120 Um okay so yeah thank you for the opportunity to come back and talk about 74 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:33,440 the expansion process. Uh the agenda tonight will take a very similar uh 75 00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:38,479 structure in that I'll start with the policy framework and a bit of the 76 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:42,160 process and timeline and then move into a quick review of some of the 77 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:48,400 information that you've already received uh in terms of what is the kind of 78 00:06:44,319 --> 00:06:54,319 factual basis behind this. We'll dive into the goal 14 analysis which uh uh 79 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:59,759 Dan was alluding to and at that point we'll get to look very closely at some 80 00:06:57,120 --> 00:07:05,280 maps of you know at a at a parcel level and look at these sub areas and it is my 81 00:07:02,479 --> 00:07:09,680 hope at that point that we can uh have a discussion because I I do want to get 82 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:14,880 through all seven of them and then have sort of a end kind of next steps and 83 00:07:12,319 --> 00:07:19,680 what happens later. Uh but I do hope that we're able to kind of discuss them 84 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:23,440 as we as we move through them because there's going to be some some very 85 00:07:21,199 --> 00:07:27,840 specific uh information at that point and then like I said at the end we'll go 86 00:07:25,199 --> 00:07:32,560 through next steps. Uh I will say this is uh something I wanted to say before 87 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:37,520 but this is sort of the beginning of the process. I know it might feel like we've 88 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:44,080 been doing this for a very long time. Uh, but the information that I'm 89 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:47,919 presenting tonight is a draft. That's what we're as consultants, that's what 90 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:53,120 we've been brought on to do is to to kind of get you guys through this draft 91 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:57,280 analysis of the goal 14. Staff will be able to sort of pick it up from there 92 00:07:54,879 --> 00:08:02,080 and start applying that more specifically. So again, the work plan 93 00:07:59,199 --> 00:08:06,639 goes all the way through March of 2026. There's still quite a bit of discussion 94 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:11,120 and planning that goes into actually drawing the boundary. We're not going to 95 00:08:08,639 --> 00:08:16,800 end tonight with a recommendation for a specific boundary. It's just setting up 96 00:08:13,759 --> 00:08:22,240 the what will become the factual basis when a boundary does get get suggested. 97 00:08:19,759 --> 00:08:26,560 So again, as Dan talked about and we've seen this slide, although I let uh 98 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:31,520 PowerPoint give me some fancy uh graphics on there uh by just clicking a 99 00:08:29,039 --> 00:08:36,320 button. So um let's see. establish the land needs. So, as Dan mentioned, uh the 100 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:42,479 HNA, the housing needs analysis or or now it's called an HCA, housing capacity 101 00:08:39,039 --> 00:08:47,440 analysis, is what sets the the land need for residential. And then the EOA is 102 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:52,000 what sets the land need for jobs and uh and and employment. That was completed. 103 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:57,600 We've gone through efficiency measures both part of the HPS which is just uh 104 00:08:55,839 --> 00:09:02,240 making sure that you're you're doing things sort of efficiently to build 105 00:08:59,839 --> 00:09:07,040 housing but then also efficiency measures the very specifically like the 106 00:09:04,480 --> 00:09:11,040 reasonzoning that definitely bring down the land need that you have by 107 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:16,800 increasing the capacity within the existing UGB. So that's a required step. 108 00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:20,880 We've created the preliminary uh and the final study area which I talked to you 109 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:26,240 guys about last time and gone through the parcel prioritization which I know 110 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:31,120 has been a big issue here in terms of the fact that some of the land has been 111 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:35,839 designated as first priority and uh and we spent some time last time discussing 112 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:40,240 why that is and and why that happens. And then we uh evaluate the sub areas 113 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:44,880 according to the goal 14 location factors. That's what I've been doing uh 114 00:09:42,399 --> 00:09:48,959 in May. And then here we are presenting analysis to both planning commission. 115 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:53,920 Next week we'll present to city council. And it's my hope that our discussion 116 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:58,080 tonight will uh inform some of this information and may change a few of the 117 00:09:55,839 --> 00:10:03,279 slides and and and will get incorporated into our analysis as we talk to city 118 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:08,080 council next week. Uh, we'll also then as as 3J starts to finish this DLCD 119 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:13,279 grant that's been funding this this analysis, we'll sort of like turn over 120 00:10:10,560 --> 00:10:19,680 all my spreadsheets and my uh my stuff and write this all up and so that the 121 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:23,519 staff has all of the details uh in their hands and there will be a report 122 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:29,120 associated with that. What happens next is uh an amendment uh gets adopted by 123 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:33,839 the city to change the boundary and update the the comp plan and the comp 124 00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:40,640 plan map and uh it then needs to get adopted by the county and then you get 125 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:45,760 to an approval or denial by DLCD. Um at that point there is the potential 126 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:50,959 for a legislative override. We've seen uh Roseberg do this. Uh we've also seen 127 00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:57,440 uh I think more recently I think Monmouth uh is trying that as well to 128 00:10:54,640 --> 00:11:00,640 say you know if we apply the rules we're going to get a negative outcome. 129 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:07,760 Therefore, we're asking for the legislature to allow us to uh not apply 130 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:13,519 the the rules uh the way that they stand since there is not a mechanism with DLCD 131 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:18,720 to allow you to do anything other than what this what the rules what the OAR 132 00:11:15,839 --> 00:11:22,399 and and and and the rules say. So, um that is something that uh has happened 133 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:26,640 in other jurisdictions. It's not something that I'm presenting on. I'm 134 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:31,600 presenting on how to get this kind of submitted to DLCD and and and and what 135 00:11:29,279 --> 00:11:36,320 happens then. I'll add a quick addendum on that at the end of this. Yes. So, I 136 00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:40,959 just it's it's um you know, it's kind of a buzz in the planning world. Um you 137 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:44,560 know, I think that I wasn't, you know, necessarily around for the the grand 138 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:47,839 bargain and other things that have happened around in the Portland area, 139 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:52,000 but you know, again, there's there's this mechanism for UGB expansion. I'm 140 00:11:50,079 --> 00:11:56,000 here, you know, I'm an expert on that and those rules. That's what I've been 141 00:11:53,920 --> 00:12:00,640 applying my legal brain to and trying to like pick it apart for you guys and and 142 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:05,440 get you as much information as possible. That's what I'm presenting on. Um, but I 143 00:12:02,959 --> 00:12:11,440 would be remiss if I didn't say that other jurisdictions have explored this 144 00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:16,720 ability to um go a more political route and say, you know, to the governor's 145 00:12:13,680 --> 00:12:21,279 office and to the legislature that um applying the rules isn't in the the 146 00:12:19,279 --> 00:12:25,200 spirit of goal 14 wouldn't accomplish what goal 14 is really trying to 147 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:28,880 accomplish. Um, and so there's been some traction on that. So again, I would be 148 00:12:27,279 --> 00:12:36,079 remiss if I didn't mention that as part of the process. So, UGB expansion. Um, 149 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:41,120 that slide is doubled. So, I guess I'm really deep into the process. Um, EOA 150 00:12:38,959 --> 00:12:45,200 and HNA land needs. Um, as you guys have heard many times, the population 151 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:51,440 forecast that we're required by law to to rely upon from PSU says that uh 152 00:12:49,279 --> 00:12:58,720 there's going to Malala is going to grow by about 5,432 153 00:12:54,880 --> 00:13:04,880 people. Um again PSU uses uh birth and death rates for that. It isn't 154 00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:08,800 necessarily uh you know in migration but a lot of it is just around birth and 155 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:13,040 death rates and families growing and people living longer and things like 156 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:18,560 that. Um so around that there would be a housing need of about 2,000 new units uh 157 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:24,639 between 2023 and really based on 2022 numbers when 158 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:29,600 the H&A was done into 2042. So for 20 years from 2022 to 2042, 159 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:32,720 uh through the efficiency measures, and we talked about this last time, the 160 00:13:30,959 --> 00:13:37,519 efficiency measures and the pipeline projects that have been completed since 161 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:45,360 the HNA was adopted, we've gotten that number down to 928 new units. Uh that 162 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:50,800 comes out to around um 182 acres. Although there is a 25% adjustment for 163 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:55,760 infrastructure for utility easements, road easements uh and parks that because 164 00:13:53,680 --> 00:14:00,959 there is a requirement to have parks per a certain amount of acres of parks per 165 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:08,800 thousand residents. So that brings that up to about 227 166 00:14:03,680 --> 00:14:15,120 228 acres of residential land. Uh 98% of that is for R1 is for single family. 167 00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:21,120 So um and then on the other side the employment land goal is to accommodate 168 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:26,959 uh four sites each of the 10 the 5 to 10 and the 10 to 20 acre size 169 00:14:24,079 --> 00:14:32,560 and uh two acre two sites that are over 20 acres and again as you saw in your 170 00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:37,760 EOA that's really to attract jobs and businesses that they feel the market 171 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:42,720 around Malala uh you know is in the best interest of Malala and uh and the 172 00:14:39,839 --> 00:14:46,320 citizens. So we want to do that prioritization. There are four 173 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:52,639 priorities again. Fourth priority being that high value farmland that we keep as 174 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:57,440 the land of last resort. Um where we have assessed the soils uh based on you 175 00:14:55,920 --> 00:15:01,760 know a whole laundry list of very particular soil types and determine that 176 00:14:59,920 --> 00:15:06,079 those are the that is the land of last resort. And then first priority are 177 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:11,199 lands that have already been urbanized uh outside of the UGB. And we've gone 178 00:15:08,959 --> 00:15:17,279 through this uh map before where you have the uh exclusive farm use land 179 00:15:14,880 --> 00:15:22,399 versus the county zoning that is primarily residential zoning. 180 00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:25,920 And so we have this map which you've seen before which is the first priority 181 00:15:24,079 --> 00:15:29,839 and fourth again you have a little bit of third priority but that's because 182 00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:37,760 it's not high value farmland because it's um mainly around the creek uh and 183 00:15:34,639 --> 00:15:44,000 um not around Kaiser Creek and uh other watershed sort of areas that are not as 184 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:52,000 easy to farm. So we had a public meeting uh we went through a handout. We did an 185 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:56,959 FAQ on what it meant um to, you know, to uh do an expansion. We got a lot of of 186 00:15:54,399 --> 00:16:00,639 really good attendance on that. Um we had an online survey which I believe was 187 00:15:58,959 --> 00:16:07,839 still open last time I spoke with you guys. We got 41 responses on that. Uh 188 00:16:04,079 --> 00:16:11,600 they kind of ran a huge v variety. Um some people very positive about 189 00:16:09,680 --> 00:16:14,880 expansion, some people very against expansion. 190 00:16:13,199 --> 00:16:19,040 um you know somebody said it was the worst idea that had ever happened in the 191 00:16:16,399 --> 00:16:23,360 history of ideas. Um but that is um I smile because that is sort of you know 192 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:27,519 we we do hear this the people are um not always in favor uh but there were 193 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:31,680 definitely a number of people who responded who were and we got some very 194 00:16:29,759 --> 00:16:37,279 thoughtful responses that that really did um dive into the different sub areas 195 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:40,880 and give me some details on to how that land is being used and what the 196 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:46,240 implications would be for expansion there. And so I thought that that the 197 00:16:42,639 --> 00:16:51,839 survey uh was very helpful. Uh so okay, the location factors, we've talked about 198 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:55,600 this last time. Uh location factor one is about efficiency. And when they say 199 00:16:54,079 --> 00:17:00,079 that, usually they're talking about proximity to the UGB, the existing UGB. 200 00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:03,759 So is it efficient? Right? We're not going way over here. We're just kind of 201 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:09,839 expanding land that's already on the border. Uh parcel size. So, we're 202 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:15,679 looking at um how parcelized it is in terms of whether it would be efficient 203 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:21,600 for development, meaning uh larger parcels tend to be easier to develop uh 204 00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:27,280 to to purchase and develop as opposed to a bunch of 5 acre lots where, you know, 205 00:17:24,319 --> 00:17:32,240 maybe they split and com, you know, and create two or three new homes. Maybe, 206 00:17:30,559 --> 00:17:37,120 you know, maybe they don't, maybe they just don't develop, right? So, um, we 207 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:41,200 look at parcel size and buildable land. So, again, if you're going to bring in a 208 00:17:38,799 --> 00:17:45,520 whole parcel, but half of it is not buildable because of, uh, wetlands 209 00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:49,280 constraints or things like that, then that's not an efficient, 210 00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:54,720 uh, you know, you don't want to bring in 80 acres and only get 40, uh, use out of 211 00:17:52,240 --> 00:17:58,559 it. That that goes to against efficiency measures. I want to say these goal 14 212 00:17:57,120 --> 00:18:05,760 locations, again, it's sort of a balancing uh, and and comparable. So uh 213 00:18:02,559 --> 00:18:09,919 u when we look at land if we're looking all at the same priority so let's say 214 00:18:07,840 --> 00:18:14,480 it's all first priority and that's what we have here for location uh sub areas 215 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:17,520 one through seven you know these are going to be a balancing you're going to 216 00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:21,840 look at one against the other is this more or less efficient than going here 217 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:26,400 if I take these parcels versus that parcels you know what is more efficient 218 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:29,919 these are just criteria by which to gauge that right so we want to make sure 219 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:33,440 that when you're choosing one and you say hey we're going to go this direction 220 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:38,400 over that one. You want to be citing back to these things that I'm kind of 221 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:42,000 giving you guys as that basis. So you would say, you know, this side is more 222 00:18:39,919 --> 00:18:46,720 efficient because of these reasons. Again, on efficiency, the second one is 223 00:18:44,559 --> 00:18:50,320 orderly and economic provision of public facilities. Again, your water, your 224 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:54,880 sewer, your transportation, and storm water, uh public services, public works. 225 00:18:53,200 --> 00:19:00,160 What What does it mean to go this way versus that way? How expensive would it 226 00:18:56,960 --> 00:19:07,919 be to expand down Malala Avenue or over on you know onaway or or somewhere else? 227 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:12,320 Okay. Um and then uh again the Dan mentioned three three is really kind of 228 00:19:09,679 --> 00:19:17,760 sneaky. It's like you know four different factors in a trench coat. It's 229 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:21,200 got um economic where we talk about cost of the land. Uh transportation 230 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:26,160 facilities. Again, you're seeing utilities and services prop up again, 231 00:19:23,679 --> 00:19:30,400 just as we saw in location factor 2. Parcel size, just like we saw in 232 00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:34,400 location factor 1. Uh development potential, what do you think is really 233 00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:39,840 the the likelihood that this land is going to develop? Um so again, that goes 234 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:45,679 into like this is an economic use of of land. Social, we talk about how close is 235 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:51,840 it to school existing schools and parks. uh how close is it to uh commercial 236 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:57,919 centers, economic centers, uh you know, serviceable through emergency services 237 00:19:54,160 --> 00:20:02,320 and stuff, right? So, how um you know uh from a community basis, how compatible 238 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:07,280 is it with nearby uses and does this really make sense as an expansion uh 239 00:20:04,799 --> 00:20:12,000 from a social standpoint? environmental, we look at gulf five resources, we look 240 00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:16,320 at the wetlands, we look at slopes and flood planes and, you know, is this a 241 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:20,960 hazardous area that we're bringing in for development you would want to, you 242 00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:27,919 know, the the greater the risk of of environmental damage or uh flooding, 243 00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:32,720 right? Um then the lower the efficiency of bringing that in as a as an 244 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:37,120 expansion. And then energy. Usually that's talked about very similar to the 245 00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:42,559 social in my mind, which is like if you're way over here and people have to 246 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:46,640 drive across town to get to shop, groceries, and dinner, and schools, and 247 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:50,240 all that stuff. And it's sort of like way out here, then that's more vehicle 248 00:20:48,799 --> 00:20:54,880 miles traveled. That's not something that we're necessarily trying to 249 00:20:51,760 --> 00:21:00,559 encourage. Um so they look for energy standpoint but then also like pipe up 250 00:20:58,159 --> 00:21:04,880 sizing, wastewater pumps, you know, things like that. Is this uh really 251 00:21:02,559 --> 00:21:09,679 going to be a good use of energy in terms of or a good impact on on energy 252 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:15,679 resources? And then the last is compatibility with a and forest outside 253 00:21:12,799 --> 00:21:20,400 of the UGB. So again, since this is all about expansion, generally what the 254 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:27,200 expansion's new neighbors will be is that EFU land. So, um, as you all know, 255 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:32,480 not all EFU land is created equal in terms of compatibility with neighbors. 256 00:21:30,159 --> 00:21:37,760 Some farmland is very active where they're harvesting multiple times a year 257 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:41,200 and big trucks and things are coming in. Sometimes, 258 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:48,080 like was mentioned with Christmas trees, you know, they may not be super active 259 00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:53,120 year round. Um and so again looking at um you know what what that expansion 260 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:57,200 what type of neighbors it would have and how compatible with the type of 261 00:21:55,200 --> 00:22:02,799 development that you're expanding in order to include what that make if that 262 00:21:59,679 --> 00:22:09,919 makes sense. So um I have here the existing uh map although it doesn't have 263 00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:13,760 uh the recent resoning on it but that's on the next slide. And so one of the 264 00:22:11,919 --> 00:22:19,200 ways that I look for compatibility is just really looking at both outside of 265 00:22:17,360 --> 00:22:22,559 the UGB like what are the neighbors going to be on the other side and then 266 00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:26,880 what are the neighbors right we're talking about like expanding along the 267 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:31,280 UGB having close proximity what are the uses that are on the other side of that 268 00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:36,559 existing UGB border. So here you can see I think a lot of the 269 00:22:33,360 --> 00:22:41,600 sub area um was near sorry I skipped twice was near industrial and now we're 270 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:46,960 um there's some here that is now uh 271 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:51,440 residential and so I think that will be uh will play a role as we start to look 272 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:56,480 at these these smaller sub areas as we go because you can see sub areas six and 273 00:22:54,400 --> 00:23:00,320 seven which I showed you last time and a little bit of five are right across from 274 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:04,320 that reszoning from industrial to residential. 275 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:10,000 Uh so that sort of becomes relevant in terms of thinking whether parts of five, 276 00:23:07,120 --> 00:23:15,360 six or seven would make sense for future residential uh development and whether 277 00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:19,440 it's compatible. So the way we look at this and the way um eventually you'll 278 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:23,600 see in a report is just to take each one this is sub area 2 and I think you guys 279 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:30,480 saw this map last time and just really try to dig in to the facts factual basis 280 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:36,480 that we have around these parcels. So we look at sewer mains, storm mains, water 281 00:23:33,120 --> 00:23:42,080 manes, the existing UGB, the goal five constraints. And here there is a piece 282 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:47,440 that we're reviewing which is um goal five is speaking to what uh the state 283 00:23:45,120 --> 00:23:52,880 requires constraints on development due to wetlands. Um but I do think that the 284 00:23:50,559 --> 00:23:57,919 city code may have additional uh protections that I didn't map here. So, 285 00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:02,799 um, we've talked a lot about hydric soils, um, and additional wetlands, and 286 00:24:00,799 --> 00:24:11,520 you can see from the map in the middle on the right that, um, sub area 2 has 287 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:17,120 significant wetlands on it. Um, but only the blue is what is, um, has been taken 288 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:22,640 out already from the constraints in terms of like what's buildable. Um, so 289 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:28,080 it a lot of those other wetlands may be things that can be mitigated. uh but we 290 00:24:25,360 --> 00:24:33,440 wouldn't really know until uh the inventory gets done as part of a concept 291 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:37,840 plan later down the road. But again, I think we talked about this last time in 292 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:42,480 terms of comparable um going one way versus the other. Um if 293 00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:46,640 if you do have we have a couple of sub areas that do have significant hydric 294 00:24:44,799 --> 00:24:51,360 soils on them and you are sort of running the risk that they're going to 295 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:56,960 end up not being very developable once uh once they get inventoried. And so 296 00:24:54,799 --> 00:24:59,600 here you can see that two is next to one. We don't talk about one. And I 297 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:04,320 think there was a little bit of confusion. Uh I got a couple survey 298 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:08,080 responses that said please don't develop one. And I said, I, you know, it's there 299 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:11,279 because it has to come in because it's a city- owned park, but there is no plan 300 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:15,360 to develop it. We're not talking about what's the developable, what's the 301 00:25:13,039 --> 00:25:20,320 capacity, how many how many homes can we fit on uh on the park. Uh that would 302 00:25:18,799 --> 00:25:24,559 that's not in the plan at all. We're just including it because we know it 303 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:30,960 needs to come in. Uh but so yeah, we can see that this one is uh while zoned 304 00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:36,960 residential in county zoning, it's right next to the park. It's across the 305 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:44,480 existing UGB from industrial zoning and it does have those wetlands and um 306 00:25:40,559 --> 00:25:49,919 and you can see in terms of access to existing lines, you know, I think it's 307 00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:56,640 Malala Avenue really and then also some down uh South Malala Forest Road. uh one 308 00:25:53,919 --> 00:26:01,440 of the things later down the road to give the answer away, but um I think we 309 00:25:59,679 --> 00:26:06,080 talked about last time we know that because you got 580 acres of first 310 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:13,679 priority land and we're looking for about 225 acres of residential land and 311 00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:20,000 about 120 acres of of industrial land that it all fits in that first priority. 312 00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:25,440 Um what doesn't fit is there's two 20 acre parcels. Um, so once we get through 313 00:26:23,679 --> 00:26:30,400 this process for the residential expansion 314 00:26:27,279 --> 00:26:35,679 and you can include in that the eight parcels that are smaller than 20 acres 315 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:41,600 because there are parcels like that in the first priority land u but there 316 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:47,919 aren't any that are over 20 and so the city can then start to look outside um 317 00:26:44,559 --> 00:26:54,080 and that's why I drew eight sub areas 8 through 19 as contenders for are any of 318 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:59,760 these large lots really um things that we want to consider for expansion. 319 00:26:56,559 --> 00:27:03,279 That's under a separate separate rule u because that's site site characteristics 320 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:07,360 where you're saying hey it has to be a parcel size and we'll talk about that a 321 00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:11,360 little bit later but this one will come up because sorry I keep clicking on it. 322 00:27:09,679 --> 00:27:16,400 This one will might come up again because uh one of the things before you 323 00:27:13,679 --> 00:27:19,919 can go outside of first priority land and say hey we have some first priority 324 00:27:18,559 --> 00:27:24,080 land left but we're not going to take it. we're going to go to highv value 325 00:27:21,679 --> 00:27:28,960 farmland because it's bigger because it's the 20 acres. You kind of have to 326 00:27:25,679 --> 00:27:34,159 show that you can't make a larger parcel. If you have large parcels that 327 00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:38,640 are owned by the same owner, then you may be kind of asked to consider them as 328 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:43,039 one. Um if they're all have the same ownership and so I think this is one 329 00:27:41,120 --> 00:27:48,400 where many of these parcels have the same owner. And so um so it may come 330 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:56,000 back into play a little bit further on in terms of can we go elsewhere and take 331 00:27:53,039 --> 00:28:01,279 uh 20 acres of highv value farmland that's fourth priority because we don't 332 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:06,320 have anything that fits the bill but this could maybe fit the bill um if it 333 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:10,159 if it can be combined. Um so those are the kind of things and then I dig in a 334 00:28:08,399 --> 00:28:14,640 little bit deeper. So this is the map again I think you've guys seen and 335 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:22,320 really try to put some numbers to this. So this is 40 uh sorry 74 acres uh 336 00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:28,960 without that blue strip of the creek. Uh it leaves about 67.7 acres again of 337 00:28:25,919 --> 00:28:36,960 buildable land. That may go down uh because again we it just came up 338 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:43,039 um just came up this week I think um that um that we maybe need to apply some 339 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:47,520 additional code from the city that give additional u protections to uh wetlands 340 00:28:45,919 --> 00:28:52,399 and and limit development within wetlands. So, we'll be an analyzing that 341 00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:57,919 in in GIS to see if it comes if that number comes down at all. Um, and then 342 00:28:55,440 --> 00:29:04,559 240 housing units. Uh, again, there's math from DLCD ex about how I can go 343 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:10,720 about doing all of that calculation. Uh, and you basically are looking for uh you 344 00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:15,520 apply the five units per acre to anything over two acres. And then things 345 00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:20,559 under two acres, if it's I think I talked about this last time, if it's 346 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:24,720 under two acres and it has one home on something that's say one to two acres, 347 00:29:22,399 --> 00:29:29,279 they assume a development capacity of adding one additional home over the next 348 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:34,080 20 years on those two acres. If it's one home on one acre or less, they assume 349 00:29:31,919 --> 00:29:40,240 it's not going to develop at any greater density than what it is. So that's how I 350 00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:47,840 come up with 240 units um added that could be built on this par 351 00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:52,240 on this sub area. It are four parcels that could be of a significant size to 352 00:29:50,399 --> 00:29:58,880 make them contenders for industrial development. Uh combined their 54 353 00:29:55,279 --> 00:30:02,000 buildable acres of uh of in those four and you can kind of see I've put the 354 00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:06,399 numbers on there so you can see which four I'm talking about. Uh again, you 355 00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:12,399 can tell that they're sort of the same owner since some of them don't have 356 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:17,120 access outside of going through uh some of the other parcels. 357 00:30:14,559 --> 00:30:21,279 This one is contiguous. Uh there is existing sewer along Malala Avenue, but 358 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:26,240 it can't accommodate additional flow the way that it is. Uh and that there would 359 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:32,000 be a required lift station over Bear Creek. Again, compatible uses. There's 360 00:30:29,279 --> 00:30:36,960 industrial inside the UGB, but there's a park and nature area on the other side. 361 00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:42,000 Uh, and there are those hydric soils that may turn out to be locally uh 362 00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:48,480 locally significant wetlands uh once the inventory is done. 363 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:53,520 Um, moving on to sub area three. You can see I'm just going to kind of move 364 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:59,520 through the along the UGB uh border here. Uh, you can see three is pretty 365 00:30:56,000 --> 00:31:05,039 long. Uh again I want to reiterate that the sub areas are for the ease of 366 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:12,880 analysis. When it comes time to actually draw the boundary it may be that some of 367 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:18,720 the parcels along the existing UGB in sub area 2 makes sense to bring in and 368 00:31:16,559 --> 00:31:24,080 some don't. It doesn't mean that you either bring in two or three or it's 2 369 00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:28,720 plus three. It really will be a carving up of each of these sub areas. This is 370 00:31:26,399 --> 00:31:32,960 just for me to get you the numbers. Uh, and I do think, you know, with GIS and 371 00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:37,120 things, you know, Dan will be perfectly capable of saying, okay, well, if we 372 00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:41,600 draw it this way and we take these par, you know, this half of two and this half 373 00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:46,559 of three or whatever, how many units are we creating and how many acres have we 374 00:31:43,679 --> 00:31:50,640 met our need? Uh, that definitely will be doable based on the information and 375 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:54,559 the analysis that we've done. One of the reasons you might see in other UGB 376 00:31:52,559 --> 00:31:59,120 expansions and it came on came up in our TAC is the idea of giving like a scoring 377 00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:04,880 system to each sub area for this one. I didn't want to do that because again 378 00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:10,159 you only need about 200 acres of this 580. So we all know there it's going to 379 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:16,000 get carved up. So, I could give sub area 2 a, you know, three out of five stars 380 00:32:13,039 --> 00:32:21,120 or whatever it is, uh, in terms of for location factor one or location factor 381 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:24,480 two or three. But the reality is it it's probably going to come in in peace meal 382 00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:27,840 and then those scores go out the window because you don't know if what was 383 00:32:26,159 --> 00:32:32,320 bringing the score up or down, was it this parcel or that until you actually 384 00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:37,279 apply these four factors to where you're drawing the line. 385 00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:42,640 So three um you can see the the size of the parcels on three uh is is 386 00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:48,559 interesting. I think it's again continues South Malala Avenue down a 387 00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:53,600 bit. Um and uh so that would include similar it would include similar 388 00:32:50,240 --> 00:33:01,039 expansion along South Malala Avenue of uh water and sewer. Again, it's between 389 00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:06,480 residential uh uses in um kind of two and four, but across the UGB there are 390 00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:11,600 some industrial uses. And um this one has very little in terms 391 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:16,240 of the wetlands. There are a little bit on the edges. Uh and we did hear in the 392 00:33:14,559 --> 00:33:20,240 survey that there was significant flooding when there are heavy rains. Um 393 00:33:18,559 --> 00:33:24,240 we heard that for a number of the sub areas that there was flooding uh in 394 00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:29,360 heavy rains and that is definitely something that can be considered uh and 395 00:33:26,799 --> 00:33:34,399 the city can rely on that information uh when making a determin a comparable 396 00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:38,880 determination between uh between parcels. 397 00:33:36,399 --> 00:33:44,559 So, if we go in and um dig into the numbers again, uh we've got sub area, 398 00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:50,720 it's about 90 acres. 67 acres are buildable, and that seems really low. Um 399 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:59,120 but those blue areas, it it does get quite hilly. Um I think uh very small 400 00:33:55,039 --> 00:34:03,120 little hills um that just make a kind of change in elevation kind of over and 401 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:07,840 over again that just keep it from being these kind of large you know uh uh 402 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:13,599 parcels that are considered fairly easy to develop. Um so again the ones that 403 00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:19,359 don't have that are more over towards Malala Avenue. Um, and it may be that 404 00:34:17,119 --> 00:34:24,560 when the city actually goes to draw a boundary that some of these are brought 405 00:34:21,359 --> 00:34:30,879 in and some are not. It may be that like you you may decide that further over 406 00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:36,399 like these 9 acres over uh to the east uh next to the park, you know, maybe 407 00:34:34,079 --> 00:34:40,720 they're, you know, too far from services or or things like that. When you apply 408 00:34:38,240 --> 00:34:46,000 all of these location factors and that things closer in uh to Malala Avenue 409 00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:52,879 might be easier. Um it is contiguous again to the extent that the the western 410 00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:56,639 chunk of it is contiguous or if two came in then it would be contiguous with the 411 00:34:54,639 --> 00:35:02,880 new boundary. Um sewer could get extended along uh 412 00:35:00,079 --> 00:35:06,720 Matias road. The lines are currently 8 in and are designed only for the 413 00:35:04,720 --> 00:35:11,280 subdivisions that they currently serve. So they would have to be upgraded. Uh, 414 00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:15,920 and I think, you know, I think you guys are in in good hands, uh, with staff in 415 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:20,079 terms of telling you how much that actually would cost, right? How many 416 00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:25,680 feet are we talking and what's the cost per foot for for that sort of upgrade 417 00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:30,160 when it comes time to deciding that? Um, and then there's an 8 in water line 418 00:35:27,599 --> 00:35:34,079 along Matias at the southern uh town boundary that would need to be expanded 419 00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:38,320 as well. So again, it's near the city park, it's 420 00:35:35,839 --> 00:35:43,599 near industrial, but it's also uh near rural residential, and there has been 421 00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:48,320 flooding reported when we uh when we did the survey. 422 00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:53,359 Sub area 4 is a little bit removed. It's on the other side of sub area 3. You can 423 00:35:50,160 --> 00:35:58,400 see it is our most parcelized. Um in terms of development, there aren't 424 00:35:55,440 --> 00:36:03,520 a lot of large parcels to develop. uh unless all of three comes in then it's 425 00:36:00,720 --> 00:36:08,079 not contiguous with the UGB um and and again we don't have sign 426 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:14,079 significant wetlands but it will definitely still be on the border with 427 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:17,359 EFU land and I didn't get an uh what I feel like would the the amount of 428 00:36:15,839 --> 00:36:23,119 information that I would have loved to have gotten is like what is that EFU 429 00:36:20,240 --> 00:36:29,520 land right there is that an active farm um you know are we going to be putting 430 00:36:25,839 --> 00:36:36,240 uh significantly more traffic down um is it sautell sautell road 431 00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:40,800 um or uh in where Malala turns into willpoint 432 00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:45,119 right so I don't know anything about those farms that would be something that 433 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:49,440 the city would want to uh explore in other projects that I've done uh for say 434 00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:56,000 the city of Cami where there is a lot of really active farming um then we uh we 435 00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:59,359 were able to do like informational interviews 436 00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:03,520 and conversations with the farmers and get those notes down and do summary 437 00:37:01,520 --> 00:37:07,520 reports. Um, and that's definitely something that staff could still do. 438 00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:11,280 That farm on the corner there of Sautel has been a Christmas tree farm for 40 439 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:13,599 years. Okay. I don't think it's going to change anything and it's not going to 440 00:37:12,240 --> 00:37:17,839 change. Are you talking about one that's in the in the No, we're talking just on 441 00:37:15,839 --> 00:37:21,280 the outside of it. Oh, that that one. And 442 00:37:19,359 --> 00:37:24,400 I think some of those properties there are are the ones that are being 443 00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:28,880 addressed in the comment that was submitted by Miss Lance. I was just 444 00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:31,839 reading through it. Let me own some of those that Yeah. Right where the mouser 445 00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:37,920 is right there. Yeah. Yeah. That's Kylo's farm. Okay. It's been a tree farm 446 00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:41,599 for Yeah. Yeah. And I will say um we do have a map of the crops and I know we 447 00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:45,280 talked about this before. I unfortunately if somebody ever reported 448 00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:49,440 that they were going to do Christmas trees, it got put on the map. You know, 449 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:55,119 you would think that this was, you know, Christmas town cuz all over it's just 450 00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:59,520 just Christmas trees everywhere. Um I don't know how accurate that is today 451 00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:02,720 because again somebody we we were told somebody it was like yeah they gave it a 452 00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:06,320 shot two years ago they put in a you know permanent they they didn't make it 453 00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:12,000 work and and now it's not actively a Christmas tree farm um and so I don't I 454 00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:17,680 don't know uh right but what I wanted to say is is on this when we talk about 455 00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:22,320 compatibility you know something like here where where we're talking about sub 456 00:38:19,599 --> 00:38:28,000 area three that goes along here it's very easy to say this is industrial 457 00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:33,119 within the UGB. This is sub area 2 that we discussed. Here's the park and we 458 00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:39,520 know that this is rural residential. So when we talk about compatibility of 459 00:38:35,359 --> 00:38:45,359 developing three and its impact on local agriculture there there's basically no 460 00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:51,440 impact on local agriculture for say two or three because it's not bordering it. 461 00:38:47,599 --> 00:38:55,680 But when you start to go out here to to four, you know that their boundary is 462 00:38:54,000 --> 00:39:01,599 with an active farm. And you would probably the city would want to reach 463 00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:06,720 out to them to discuss uh you know, again, how trafficicky is it? Are they 464 00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:11,920 moving? Are they using the roads to move big equipment on a regular basis? You 465 00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:16,320 know, how sensitive are their is their crop? If it's Christmas trees, probably 466 00:39:13,839 --> 00:39:20,880 not so much. But like organic produce farms are very sensitive to trespassers 467 00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:25,599 and people walk, you know, letting their dogs run out in the field. And I mean, 468 00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:27,839 that's a huge problem. Um, versus a Christmas tree, it might be a little bit 469 00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:31,760 different, right? So, it would be something that the city would want to 470 00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:37,920 reach out and discuss. You can see here I added in the acreage even though you 471 00:39:35,119 --> 00:39:44,320 know when we're talking like 5.1 or five acres. Uh again parcelization it doesn't 472 00:39:41,839 --> 00:39:48,640 mean it can't develop. It doesn't mean you don't bring in land that's 473 00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:52,400 parcelized. It just means there is an assumption that it would be harder to 474 00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:57,760 devel to develop. And we had uh developers on our uh pack on our 475 00:39:55,520 --> 00:40:02,880 committee who talked about you know if I have to if you know I need what what did 476 00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:07,760 he say? He was like I need you know like 16 was sort of a slow end for for to 477 00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:14,079 build a sub again he's building subdivisions so that's one particular 478 00:40:10,079 --> 00:40:18,960 type of of of development. Um but it is tends to be the you know um I know there 479 00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:23,200 was like e economy of scale. It tends to happen like they can plan it out. it can 480 00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:29,040 happen versus something that maybe happens sort of trickles over time where 481 00:40:25,359 --> 00:40:34,880 individual owners sell and and and you know maybe five to 10 homes get built on 482 00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:39,200 a on a 5 acre lot uh as opposed to a larger development. So this is our more 483 00:40:36,720 --> 00:40:44,480 parcelized area although there are two larger uh larger sites that could be 484 00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:49,359 potential for um I mean technically there are 11 sites that could be 485 00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:54,480 potential for industrial development. Um although again that's because you're 486 00:40:51,280 --> 00:41:00,720 looking for four that are over five five to 10 acres and you've got uh you know a 487 00:40:57,839 --> 00:41:06,319 handful of them that are exactly five or 5.1 acres. Um but again you're right 488 00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:12,400 across from uh from the EFU land. So I you know and 489 00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:16,319 I don't and with with existing residential. So I don't know how much 490 00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:21,760 the city would actually determine that you know four of those five acres should 491 00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:26,079 be set aside for industrial development. Um and again there was some 492 00:41:24,079 --> 00:41:29,760 flooding reported and we have been working with the city to also get you 493 00:41:28,079 --> 00:41:34,240 know for each of these we're really trying to look at it and say okay where 494 00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:38,000 is the existing sewer and water where would it make sense to expand it here I 495 00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:43,280 think there would be an expansion along Malala um but uh you know there might be 496 00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:47,680 other areas where there could be expansion how many feet are we talking 497 00:41:45,599 --> 00:41:51,920 what's the cost per foot for that how many homes can really be serviced and 498 00:41:49,599 --> 00:41:57,839 then when you actually get a number and you start to draw a boundary and include 499 00:41:54,560 --> 00:42:01,839 certain parcels. Um that was is when you can really say well what's the price tag 500 00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:07,440 on this one versus going the going this way. 501 00:42:03,599 --> 00:42:13,200 Uh sub area five um I think is interesting. Um it is uh we shaped it a 502 00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:18,880 little strange and it is another one of those that does share a significant 503 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:24,960 boundary with existing EFU land. Uh particularly the uh parcels to the 504 00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:34,240 south. Uh some of the parcels that are up along uh the existing UGB boundary at 505 00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:41,040 the top um are right across from what is uh what is now residential. Although 506 00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:48,319 there is this one little bump out here of the existing UGB that is still uh in 507 00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:52,560 industrial use. Um but yeah, so we have um a number of parcels here. We got some 508 00:42:50,319 --> 00:42:58,160 really good information uh from the community around this. Um I 509 00:42:55,760 --> 00:43:03,680 think a lot of these parcels don't have access. Um so there may be like 510 00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:11,520 easements through they don't have very clear access to the major roads. Um so 511 00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:15,119 in terms of um you know finding these parcels and how they would be serviced 512 00:43:13,359 --> 00:43:22,240 and how the roads would need to be expanded. Um again it's not a complete 513 00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:28,640 bar that this is like never developable. Um, but uh I think there would have to 514 00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:33,119 be some real thought put into uh exactly the the public works piece and the 515 00:43:31,119 --> 00:43:39,359 transportation piece. Again, if you go to DLCD and you say, you know, this 516 00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:43,200 isn't efficient. I will say this, um, one of the reasons 517 00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:47,359 that we have these rules is the most efficient thing sometimes is just to 518 00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:51,760 take the high value farmland, right? That's why we have the UGB expansion. we 519 00:43:49,520 --> 00:43:55,040 h force you to do this analysis to say like well we really want to protect this 520 00:43:53,440 --> 00:44:00,480 land and not necessarily always do what's just easiest um but we want to do 521 00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:06,240 something that kind of follows our values um so this is definitely one that 522 00:44:04,079 --> 00:44:10,480 I think um we'll need to look at the cost associated with the transportation 523 00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:14,319 so if you go to DLCD and you're like it's going to be expensive they're like 524 00:44:11,760 --> 00:44:18,319 yeah expansions are expensive everybody knows ex right you like city grows by 525 00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:22,160 5,000 people you're going to need new roads you're going to need new pipes, 526 00:44:20,079 --> 00:44:27,040 you're going to need like growth is exp running a city is expensive. So saying 527 00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:33,599 it's expensive doesn't quite get us out of the conversation. Um but saying that 528 00:44:30,079 --> 00:44:37,280 this is more expensive than say one of the other sub areas where you're talking 529 00:44:35,359 --> 00:44:41,280 apples to apples, then that is definitely a conversation. Uh but when 530 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:45,119 you're talking apples to oranges and you're saying, "Well, we can't use the 531 00:44:42,720 --> 00:44:49,920 first priority land and we want to use fourth priority land instead because 532 00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:55,040 it's easier." that burden is it needs to be sort of prohibitively expensive uh 533 00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:59,119 for for for that to happen according to the goal 14 rules in the framework that 534 00:44:57,040 --> 00:45:03,040 I'm I'm showing you guys here. But yeah, we did get some really good information 535 00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:08,319 and I'm I'm hopeful that the city uh on this sub area and I'm hopeful that um 536 00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:15,280 you know public works can really dig into uh where those lines are. Um again 537 00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:21,040 we have here that there's water um nearly to the city limits on Matias Road 538 00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:24,720 but no sewer until 7th Street could extend it along Matias. The lines are 8 539 00:45:23,359 --> 00:45:28,880 in and designed only for the subdivisions that they currently serve. 540 00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:33,760 So we are talking significant upgrades. Um and again I do think that while there 541 00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:39,680 are some large parcels here that could be con uh contenders. Sorry I was 542 00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:46,560 thinking here where we have it. Um yeah, extend water down Malala Forest Road and 543 00:45:42,800 --> 00:45:51,760 uh way Yeah. and likely a lift station. Um so and and like I said, we got really 544 00:45:49,200 --> 00:45:56,560 good information from the public around um access to these parcels and sort of 545 00:45:54,079 --> 00:46:01,440 how they're going to be used. Um I will also say that this has come up many 546 00:45:59,040 --> 00:46:08,640 times and we've talked with the with DLCD about this. They will tell you time 547 00:46:03,839 --> 00:46:13,200 and again that um trying to get to talk about whether 548 00:46:10,720 --> 00:46:17,359 property owners want or don't want to be to come in is something that they don't 549 00:46:15,200 --> 00:46:20,880 like to rely on because property changes hands. And so people say, you know, so 550 00:46:19,599 --> 00:46:26,319 it's like somebody really doesn't want to do it and then whoever inherits the 551 00:46:23,280 --> 00:46:29,359 land does or whoever bought it does and then all of a sudden you're having a 552 00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:33,920 totally different conversation. So in terms of talking about development over 553 00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:39,440 the next 20 years, we try not to to look at that. But at the same time, if you 554 00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:43,040 know something is, like I said, parcelized, it's not going to be 555 00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:47,680 combined and put into a large development and people are are probably 556 00:46:45,599 --> 00:46:51,599 against development, then you go into developability and what's the likelihood 557 00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:57,119 that you're actually going to get homes out of bringing that land in, right? 558 00:46:54,720 --> 00:47:01,599 Um, so that and again there's some flooding and you'll see that some of 559 00:46:58,880 --> 00:47:07,440 these right along uh Malala Forest Road up at the top uh are still kind of uh 560 00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:11,040 have some of that wetlands and hydric soils from the creek and we did hear 561 00:47:09,599 --> 00:47:20,480 that there's some flooding and heavy rains. Um let's see uh sub area here 562 00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:26,800 hold on sub area six. Um so here we've got um a number of parcels. So this goes 563 00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:32,560 along uh south on way and again uh follows the UGB. So the 564 00:47:30,319 --> 00:47:36,880 northern parcels are along the existing UGB, but again that's kind of along the 565 00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:41,359 creek as well. Although the actual constraints and wetlands aren't on any 566 00:47:38,720 --> 00:47:46,560 of these parcels themselves. Uh right across the UGB is the land that's been 567 00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:51,440 reszoned into residential and this goes down south on away. Um, so again, it's 568 00:47:49,119 --> 00:47:56,240 about 70 acres. Almost all of them are considered developable from a constraint 569 00:47:53,680 --> 00:48:02,800 standpoint. Uh, the housing capacity of these parcels would be about 240 new 570 00:47:59,440 --> 00:48:08,240 units. Uh, six of the lots are of the size that are included in your EOA and 571 00:48:05,359 --> 00:48:12,880 they take up about 55 buildable acres of those 70. Like I said, I put that number 572 00:48:11,119 --> 00:48:16,880 there so that you can kind of see, okay, well, if like if these are going to be 573 00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:21,839 four of the if these are going to be the four that we bring in for the 10 acre 574 00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:25,839 size, then you know, we'd have to subtract from that housing capacity 575 00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:30,559 number, right? Um we'd have to subtract 55 buildable acres from that and redo 576 00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:34,240 that math, which is not difficult. And I'll they've they've got my 577 00:48:31,839 --> 00:48:38,800 spreadsheets. Um, again here we're dealing with stuff that's near uh 578 00:48:36,400 --> 00:48:44,240 residential, but again uh towards the south of it, your border would then be 579 00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:48,720 on EFU land. Uh, so again, it's kind of a short border on this one. The way that 580 00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:52,960 we drew them the sub areas, you know, tend to kind of be strips coming out 581 00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:57,280 from the existing UGB. Uh, but it's something to consider in terms of 582 00:48:54,480 --> 00:49:01,599 compatibility. Um, here we've got two 8 in pipes, uh, sanitary lines in the 583 00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:06,960 vicinity of the northern portion of the property. One goes along south on ONA 584 00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:12,240 north of Bear Creek and one along the Malala Forest Road and South Low Road. 585 00:49:10,240 --> 00:49:16,079 Um 8 inch water line at city limits along South Ona way. So there again 586 00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:21,520 would be need to be an expansion and depending on uh or extension of lines 587 00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:25,839 depending on how many of the acres uh how many of the parcels would come in 588 00:49:23,839 --> 00:49:30,400 would determine how many feet right of of extension would need to happen and 589 00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:33,599 that would impact the cost there. Um and again we're creek adjacent here and and 590 00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:38,160 we did hear that there was some flooding. 591 00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:43,520 All right, sub area seven. You can see we've got hydric soils through the 592 00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:48,160 center. Um and this one while it borders on six, so it kind of depends on what 593 00:49:45,280 --> 00:49:55,200 happens with six. Um but right across the UGB is industrial uses. Uh there are 594 00:49:52,160 --> 00:50:00,319 a number of larger lots. It's not as parcelized as some of the other sub 595 00:49:57,680 --> 00:50:08,079 areas that we looked at, although you do have uh some EFU land between seven and 596 00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:13,119 the 213. Um we did hear uh in terms of, you know, increased traffic and and and 597 00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:19,520 things like that. I'll show you here. We've got it 76 acres, 291 possible 598 00:50:16,720 --> 00:50:25,040 units. According to the state's math, uh there are eight lots on 58 buildable 599 00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:29,839 acres with access mainly along South Ona away. I mentioned access. We got this 600 00:50:27,359 --> 00:50:34,480 question on the TAC. I tend to talk about access a lot, but again in my mind 601 00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:38,559 it's like if you're saying something is could be developed for industrial then 602 00:50:36,720 --> 00:50:42,400 like what kind of industrial and what kind of trucks and things are they 603 00:50:40,640 --> 00:50:47,280 needing to come in, you tend to want to put industrial development near larger 604 00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:52,400 highways um and not necessarily have them uh going through neighborhoods, 605 00:50:50,079 --> 00:50:58,400 right? So, I tend to think about access. Um, and I do feel like through this this 606 00:50:55,200 --> 00:51:03,760 whole exception land, uh, you know, there would need to be a number of of 607 00:51:01,280 --> 00:51:08,480 street improvements, I think, and a lot of these lots don't seem to have very 608 00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:13,520 obvious access to me, and I think people are kind of maybe using easements to get 609 00:51:10,559 --> 00:51:18,640 through um, on some of this land. So that would obviously be something that 610 00:51:15,040 --> 00:51:24,559 would need to be worked out um in terms of if uh something would were to develop 611 00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:29,040 and the other one would not. Right. So um yep. So I think here we've got 612 00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:34,480 similar to six we've got an opportunity for sewer water uh to lines on the on 613 00:51:31,839 --> 00:51:39,680 the 213. There's a 12-in water line that ends um this says Crumpton's and I don't 614 00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:44,720 think that's right. Is that wasn't it Cromp? There's 615 00:51:41,760 --> 00:51:50,400 Crumpton's. Yeah, okay. Yeah, it's it's O. Yes, I think my auto correct decided 616 00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:55,599 it needed to be Crump. Um, and sewer ends about 135 ft north of the city 617 00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:59,839 limits, potential gravity connection with extensive upsizing and extension of 618 00:51:57,839 --> 00:52:03,680 sewer. So again, when you actually talk about where to build that boundary would 619 00:52:01,839 --> 00:52:09,440 when those those you actually start to put a price tag on different um 620 00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:14,400 different uh expansion ideas. So looking at all seven, I've now given 621 00:52:12,079 --> 00:52:21,520 you a map a bit with green just being EFU land. Um, and then the brighter blue 622 00:52:18,160 --> 00:52:27,680 being 5 to 10 acre lots, the darker blue being the uh the 10 to 20 acre lots that 623 00:52:25,040 --> 00:52:32,400 are in this first priority land. Again, if you leave any first priority land on 624 00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:37,440 the table and want to go outside of the first priority land to fourth priority 625 00:52:34,319 --> 00:52:45,280 land to get anything, your EO does say you need 28 two 20 acre parcels. Um, so 626 00:52:40,720 --> 00:52:52,880 you can uh but you would have to um you would have to look into these sub areas 627 00:52:48,720 --> 00:52:58,960 and um decide which where those two parcels are going to be. You would need 628 00:52:55,440 --> 00:53:04,559 to then apply your goal 14 exactly the same analysis, the efficiency, the 629 00:53:01,119 --> 00:53:10,559 parcelization, the you know the the location to transportation, the cost of 630 00:53:07,040 --> 00:53:15,760 public works. And these would all be apples to apples if you're talking about 631 00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:21,760 sub areas 8 through 19. Um in terms of looking for two candidates for a 20 acre 632 00:53:18,720 --> 00:53:25,680 parcel, uh or for yeah, two candidates for 20 acre parcels. I will say um one 633 00:53:24,319 --> 00:53:32,240 of the conversations that we had is there are restrictions if you bring in 634 00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:38,240 say 10 which has been talked about a little bit um if you bring in sub sub 635 00:53:34,720 --> 00:53:42,480 area 10 because it is a large parcel um that possibly makes sense for industrial 636 00:53:40,319 --> 00:53:47,280 it's near the air strip it's near trans it's near major highways it's near the 637 00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:52,800 water treatment plant uh things like that uh there would be restrictions that 638 00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:58,160 uh the city would have to then zone it and restrict it from then being chopped 639 00:53:55,040 --> 00:54:02,880 up. Because if the reason that it is you're able to go get it is because it 640 00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:07,359 is a large parcel, then you have to as a city preserve that characteristic. So if 641 00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:11,359 you say this site has characteristics that we need, you have to then preserve 642 00:54:09,760 --> 00:54:14,559 the characteristic. you can't then let it kind of just go by the wayside 643 00:54:13,440 --> 00:54:18,960 because what you're trying to do according to the EA EOA is attract a 644 00:54:16,720 --> 00:54:24,240 certain kind kind of business and jobs and you want to kind of have that land 645 00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:29,599 as a potential candidate for that. Uh my report will sort of end with just a kind 646 00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:35,280 of like advantages disadvantages notes on areas 8 through 19 in terms of if 647 00:54:32,880 --> 00:54:40,160 they make sense or compatible for industrial uh uses. And so I'll give you 648 00:54:38,319 --> 00:54:46,240 a little bit of analysis on that. But since you're not required to do the two 649 00:54:43,119 --> 00:54:50,640 20 acre lots, um you're required to do residential and you're required to start 650 00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:57,119 with for first priority land. That's what my report is sort of writing up. 651 00:54:54,480 --> 00:55:02,400 So again, next steps is for the city to actually start to dig in over the course 652 00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:08,000 of now until March of 2026 to start to dig in to each of these sub areas and 653 00:55:05,440 --> 00:55:13,280 really start to decide probably talk with people um uh you know about, you 654 00:55:11,119 --> 00:55:19,119 know, really dig into where those lines are in terms of public works and what 655 00:55:15,280 --> 00:55:23,599 the cost would be and um and the uh the ability for for them to develop. Um, and 656 00:55:22,079 --> 00:55:28,960 again, then the county has to approve it. If the county doesn't approve it, 657 00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:34,319 um, I think you, that is something that is appealable. Um, I did send, uh, Dan a 658 00:55:32,319 --> 00:55:38,880 kind of more detailed list of all of the, uh, ins and outs of, you know, how 659 00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:43,359 many days not, you know, all the stuff in terms of all the pieces of this. Uh, 660 00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:47,359 but again, basically, it's the city makes a decision, the county then either 661 00:55:45,440 --> 00:55:53,839 agrees or doesn't agree. Hopefully, they agree and then DLCD looks at it. If they 662 00:55:51,119 --> 00:55:59,760 approve it, great. Um, it can get appealed by outside parties. Um, um, but 663 00:55:56,799 --> 00:56:04,799 if if DLCD doesn't sign it, doesn't sign off on it, um, the city can appeal or 664 00:56:02,799 --> 00:56:08,400 again, some other cities have been doing a legislative override. What's what 665 00:56:06,720 --> 00:56:13,839 we're what we in the planning world have been referring to as the legislative 666 00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:17,599 override uh, button. Uh, and so again, two cities have done it now. I don't 667 00:56:15,599 --> 00:56:23,839 know what the future of that is. I do think that Roseberg might get go to the 668 00:56:21,119 --> 00:56:29,200 court of appeals. It might not. It might stand. Uh it might not. We'll see. Uh 669 00:56:27,040 --> 00:56:35,280 but again, that's definitely something where uh Roseberg felt like the rule as 670 00:56:32,799 --> 00:56:40,319 it stood didn't uh accomplish what needed to be accomplished and so they 671 00:56:36,799 --> 00:56:47,119 asked the legislature to basically order DLCD to approve it. Um so we'll see what 672 00:56:44,079 --> 00:56:50,880 what happens with that. Yes, I think and I think before uh before we get to 673 00:56:49,200 --> 00:56:56,240 questions and discussion, I just wanted to add a little piece about that uh 674 00:56:52,559 --> 00:57:00,160 legislative override um because that's sort of where uh 3J and 675 00:56:58,640 --> 00:57:05,839 Violet's work end. And I want to be clear about that's where their work ends 676 00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:11,520 and sort of staff and and and you know city officials uh work may begin a 677 00:57:08,640 --> 00:57:15,280 little bit and I think uh since we've been looking at this you know sta staff 678 00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:18,319 has certainly felt and we've gotten uh some of that some of that similar 679 00:57:16,960 --> 00:57:24,960 feedback from some of the commission and council um that we'd be remiss uh to 680 00:57:22,640 --> 00:57:28,799 only look at the the lands to the south that are that are that those first 681 00:57:26,640 --> 00:57:33,040 priority lands um and that before we sort of exhaust other options because so 682 00:57:31,520 --> 00:57:37,599 what you know when you look at the prioritization it's very clear where 683 00:57:34,559 --> 00:57:40,880 where the city has to expand. Um when you look at some of the other factors 684 00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:46,000 that you find in the goal 14 analysis, those four factors of uh you know 685 00:57:42,960 --> 00:57:50,480 efficient accommodation of land needs or orderly and e economic provision of 686 00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:55,920 public facilities or and services comparative environmental energy 687 00:57:53,520 --> 00:58:00,559 economic social consequences and the compatibility with uh adjacent farm 688 00:57:58,559 --> 00:58:06,319 uses. Um there's some pretty clear advantages to going other places in the 689 00:58:04,400 --> 00:58:11,760 city uh than to the south. uh just because of uh where our utility lines 690 00:58:08,799 --> 00:58:16,400 lie, where where major roads go through uh for access uh for at least initial 691 00:58:14,240 --> 00:58:22,079 access before you sort of carve up into uh you know subdivision roads that get 692 00:58:19,119 --> 00:58:27,200 that get built. And then um for uh 693 00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:33,680 and then the the economic viability of going um you know going in other 694 00:58:29,839 --> 00:58:39,920 directions versus uh versus to to the first priority lands. Um, so we uh MAC 695 00:58:36,799 --> 00:58:45,359 drafted and and Scott sent a memo uh that uh outlines a lot of this to the to 696 00:58:43,680 --> 00:58:51,839 the governor's office to the legislature over the past couple weeks. I think 697 00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:57,440 about a week ago. Uh they sent it out to them and and we'll be talking uh to 698 00:58:54,960 --> 00:59:02,720 those officials uh you know within the next couple weeks uh I think early next 699 00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:07,040 week. um just and and and basically the idea is like say we went to we we passed 700 00:59:05,440 --> 00:59:10,079 an ordinance that went to the north, you know, we did our we did our analysis and 701 00:59:08,799 --> 00:59:15,119 said this is where we want to go. Well, so DLCD by law would just they'd 702 00:59:13,599 --> 00:59:20,160 basically remand it on site. They'd say no. No, you can't you can't do that. Um 703 00:59:18,319 --> 00:59:23,200 and then at that point we would that that's where we would invoke the 704 00:59:21,680 --> 00:59:26,960 legislative override. We we'd go and we'd say, "Hey, we we want an amendment 705 00:59:24,880 --> 00:59:32,240 that says, hey, DLCD, you pass this, right?" Um and and you know, we'll get a 706 00:59:29,680 --> 00:59:36,480 sense in the next couple weeks if if uh the governor's office and legislators 707 00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:40,000 are like, "Absolutely no. We're not we're not going to support this. We like 708 00:59:37,839 --> 00:59:43,440 uh we like our Senate Bill 100 as it as it is." And and or if they say, "Yeah, 709 00:59:42,160 --> 00:59:46,240 we've been looking for a case and this seems like the perfect case." Or more 710 00:59:44,960 --> 00:59:50,559 probably more likely somewhere in between those two. Yeah, those two 711 00:59:48,480 --> 00:59:58,160 polls. I'll jump in even though Dan's trying to protect me in my my bubble of 712 00:59:53,200 --> 01:00:02,480 my my goal 14. Uh but um one of the things is the rules just don't have a 713 00:59:59,760 --> 01:00:07,839 mechanism. The rules as they stand don't have a mechanism for you to say uh what 714 01:00:05,440 --> 01:00:13,440 what members of your community and staff have said very eloquently which is the 715 01:00:11,200 --> 01:00:19,760 spirit of goal 14 is not being accomplished if you follow the letter of 716 01:00:15,280 --> 01:00:23,680 the of the rules. Um, and so, um, I think that 717 01:00:21,520 --> 01:00:28,880 in in that way, I think DLCD's hands are tied because there just isn't a 718 01:00:25,040 --> 01:00:35,280 mechanism in the rules to apply sort of a kind of like gray area, you 719 01:00:32,799 --> 01:00:41,440 know, gut feeling override, right? Like there just isn't a subjective 720 01:00:38,240 --> 01:00:45,359 thing other than um once you're looking at land that is all first priority, then 721 01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:48,319 it's subjective, right? you're kind of looking at the goal 14 criteria. You're 722 01:00:47,280 --> 01:00:53,920 looking at all these things and you're weighing them and it's a balance, but um 723 01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:58,640 you know there isn't really a way to say well if we apply the goal 14 we should 724 01:00:56,720 --> 01:01:05,040 go to fourth priority before first. It's just not possible under the rules. And 725 01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:09,200 so it may be that um you know that that is a moment when the legislature decides 726 01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:15,440 that yeah okay well we're going to step in because the outcome you know in order 727 01:01:12,559 --> 01:01:20,880 to get the most just outcome uh that the goal 14 envisions we need to do 728 01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:26,480 something other than apply those rules. Um again as planners I think that it 729 01:01:23,599 --> 01:01:32,640 would be nice for just to create a mechanism instead of each people you 730 01:01:28,880 --> 01:01:36,240 know each jurisdiction asking uh for an exception. You know what I mean? I think 731 01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:41,119 maybe exceptions like that are kind of what got us here in the first place. Um 732 01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:45,520 but so it would be nice if there was just like a clear bright line rule of 733 01:01:43,200 --> 01:01:49,680 when you were out allowed to do this. Um but again that doesn't exist today. So, 734 01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:54,240 you know, I've given all of the analysis, I think, and and again, I 735 01:01:52,000 --> 01:01:57,920 think you have very um eloquent and thoughtful community members who are who 736 01:01:56,079 --> 01:02:02,000 are active in this. I think staff has been very impressive in their ability to 737 01:01:59,839 --> 01:02:05,760 kind of understand the details. I think everyone that we've met with, I feel 738 01:02:04,079 --> 01:02:09,200 like, from this commission, city council, and the public feels I feel 739 01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:13,839 like they really get it. They understand the rules. They understand the process. 740 01:02:11,599 --> 01:02:17,359 And um some people really support it and say, "Okay, well, if that's the first 741 01:02:15,040 --> 01:02:21,760 priority land, then just go there." um and some people don't. So, I think it'll 742 01:02:19,200 --> 01:02:26,240 be um kind of up to you guys to kind of figure out what your community wants and 743 01:02:24,079 --> 01:02:29,839 um what the legislature is willing to to kind of consider when you get the 744 01:02:28,079 --> 01:02:33,520 numbers really in front of you of of what a new boundary would look like. And 745 01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:37,839 and that's a good point what you're saying that we first is a good point 746 01:02:35,200 --> 01:02:41,680 that the that the relationship with DLCD isn't adversarial in this case. It's 747 01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:45,119 it's just uh they they they have their way that they have to Yeah. They just 748 01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:50,319 straight don't have a mechanism, right? So it's like you apply our you apply the 749 01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:55,599 OAR, you know, like or and if you don't follow the O, we have to deny it, right? 750 01:02:53,520 --> 01:02:58,160 It's like that's the law. And so we've been Yeah, we've been we've been talking 751 01:02:56,799 --> 01:03:01,200 with them and transparent with them and and having this discussion about what 752 01:02:59,680 --> 01:03:04,480 what what that would even look like, right? So, I mean, I would love to see 753 01:03:02,559 --> 01:03:10,079 if, you know, if if these situations keep coming up, um, then, you know, 754 01:03:07,520 --> 01:03:14,319 maybe a change to the rule, you know, add another section there and say, 755 01:03:11,520 --> 01:03:17,520 unless, right, you can make this case or here's the burden of proof to to do 756 01:03:16,079 --> 01:03:22,400 something different, but as of today, that doesn't exist. So, um, so I think, 757 01:03:20,640 --> 01:03:29,760 you know, we we've gotten all the all the details possible. There's still 758 01:03:24,400 --> 01:03:34,559 plenty of time like I said um where uh I didn't really get a lot of kind of 759 01:03:31,839 --> 01:03:39,359 individual like farmers reach out or be able to have a conversation about 760 01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:43,599 certain parcels. That's definitely again this analysis is the beginning. It's the 761 01:03:41,440 --> 01:03:48,079 draft. It's setting things up. There's still a lot of conversations to be had 762 01:03:45,440 --> 01:03:51,599 and a lot of numbers to crunch in terms of where a new boundary would actually 763 01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:56,640 go. it's not like they're just going to look at my maps and and and do it. Um, 764 01:03:55,039 --> 01:04:00,079 so I do think there's still a lot of opportunity for the community to be 765 01:03:58,319 --> 01:04:06,640 involved and to have conversations with staff about uh, you know, hopefully 766 01:04:03,599 --> 01:04:10,240 within these factors and these criteria and say, "Hey, you're not thinking of it 767 01:04:08,720 --> 01:04:14,400 this way or or you don't have the wetlands really marked or you don't have 768 01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:18,000 the crops really marked correctly. Let me get you some information." and then 769 01:04:16,319 --> 01:04:22,400 the city can get that into the factual record and include it into the report 770 01:04:20,240 --> 01:04:28,440 and use it as part of their decision making. 771 01:04:24,640 --> 01:04:28,440 Any any questions? 772 01:04:28,640 --> 01:04:38,799 I have a clarifying question. Yes, it's a question for clarity, I guess. Yes. Um 773 01:04:36,240 --> 01:04:48,400 I'm speaking to your comment about the LCD 774 01:04:42,720 --> 01:04:54,240 just went like no denying that. Yeah. So I guess I'm looking for insight maybe. 775 01:04:50,319 --> 01:04:59,359 Yeah. Um just for trying to understand. So you spend we we as a community spend 776 01:04:57,119 --> 01:05:05,119 all this time and money and energy on creating this idea, right? unless this 777 01:05:01,280 --> 01:05:09,200 is what we want. DLC comes back just is is it just that binary just No, no, no, 778 01:05:07,440 --> 01:05:14,079 no. I didn't mean Yeah, I didn't mean to make it. Is it is it is or is there a 779 01:05:12,079 --> 01:05:18,720 collaboration where you go like oh we're not going to approve it go back make 780 01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:24,160 some changes bring it back to there's absolutely a collaboration but my my 781 01:05:22,319 --> 01:05:28,720 thing of like they would just say no would be if 782 01:05:26,480 --> 01:05:35,039 if you don't go to first priority if you went to 12 or 13 for example if you 783 01:05:30,559 --> 01:05:38,960 don't go south and the or you go south a little bit right like maybe you take 784 01:05:36,559 --> 01:05:43,520 some parcels but you leave some first priority land on the table that hasn't 785 01:05:41,359 --> 01:05:48,720 been incorporated into the UGB and instead leapfrog and take fourth 786 01:05:46,319 --> 01:05:53,200 priority land. I don't think they have a mechanism that 787 01:05:50,799 --> 01:05:56,720 would allow them to sign that is what I'm saying. Okay? Like there isn't a 788 01:05:55,119 --> 01:06:01,200 rule for them to sort of hang their hat on and say, "Oh, okay. You have if we 789 01:05:58,960 --> 01:06:04,559 apply the criteria, you know, I mean, they have a checklist, right? DLCD has 790 01:06:03,359 --> 01:06:09,039 there are the rules. they have their criteria and they march through it and 791 01:06:06,799 --> 01:06:14,079 they have been again you know this this work has been funded by a grant that's 792 01:06:11,200 --> 01:06:20,079 you know that that's what why I'm very focused on what the rules are today um 793 01:06:16,720 --> 01:06:25,039 and um you know and they've been working with us at every step to make sure they 794 01:06:22,960 --> 01:06:29,599 have checked all my math they have gotten on a million different calls with 795 01:06:26,880 --> 01:06:34,400 me to for me to say okay look I'm calculating it this way is that going to 796 01:06:31,920 --> 01:06:39,520 fly right and they and they it would take their time to jump on a call with 797 01:06:36,640 --> 01:06:43,839 us, look at it and say yes or no or to say, "Hey, our read of the rule is that 798 01:06:41,920 --> 01:06:47,520 you have to do it this way." Right? So, they've been very involved. It isn't 799 01:06:45,760 --> 01:06:52,960 that they just look at it and say no. But again, if you don't go south and and 800 01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:56,799 you try to say, you know, go north, I know that there were many community 801 01:06:54,240 --> 01:07:02,640 members from, I believe, in 12 and 13 who showed up and wanted their land to 802 01:06:58,559 --> 01:07:07,119 come in um for residential. that's just against the way it stands, 803 01:07:05,520 --> 01:07:13,039 the rules stand today and there wouldn't be a mechanism within the OAR for D for 804 01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:16,400 DLCD to sign off on it. And so that would be the thing of like we where I 805 01:07:14,880 --> 01:07:20,559 feel like what I'm being told and what looking at it, I just don't see anything 806 01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:25,119 in the rule that would allow them to approve that. There's no discretion in 807 01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:29,520 their in their ability to approve that. Um but again, yeah, I think that's why 808 01:07:27,680 --> 01:07:33,599 the legislature come in. But there there is back and forth. there is a review of 809 01:07:31,359 --> 01:07:38,160 all the process. They've been looking at all of this and um and I know that they 810 01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:44,799 also have technical assistance for future grants um if the city wanted to 811 01:07:41,440 --> 01:07:49,839 apply to continue to apply the goal 14 and to do more analysis on going south. 812 01:07:47,760 --> 01:07:53,760 I think that that's something that DLCD has let us know that they do have other 813 01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:59,520 grants and the city could apply for that and continue to get money to do that 814 01:07:55,680 --> 01:08:04,880 analysis. Um but uh I I don't believe that they would continue to do it if it 815 01:08:02,400 --> 01:08:09,200 was clear that the city's plan was was to to try to do it legislatively. And 816 01:08:07,440 --> 01:08:13,039 just uh and so like likewise I don't think we would try to right I think I 817 01:08:11,359 --> 01:08:17,679 don't think we would try to go outside the first priority if we don't have a 818 01:08:14,640 --> 01:08:22,080 clear sense from you know from the governor's office and from the the 819 01:08:18,960 --> 01:08:27,120 legislature that there's a possibility. And just as a quick followup just to 820 01:08:24,799 --> 01:08:33,120 again another clarity this is a lot of information you know over time so 821 01:08:29,520 --> 01:08:40,319 forgive me if I don't remember why but why is it we have to go south um so 822 01:08:36,080 --> 01:08:45,679 again the um the prioritization so in the past property owners in the 823 01:08:43,199 --> 01:08:52,000 south have gone to the county and wanted to be excluded from exclusive farm use 824 01:08:49,440 --> 01:08:55,600 and they didn't want to be EFU land and so they asked the county to reszone 825 01:08:53,759 --> 01:09:01,759 their land so that they could be zoned residential, okay, and not have to do 826 01:08:57,920 --> 01:09:07,839 exclusive farmland. the the flip side of of that is it's like okay well then 827 01:09:04,400 --> 01:09:12,400 you're urbanized land and you're we have the the if you look at the I think 828 01:09:09,839 --> 01:09:18,960 there's a previous report or something where I put the exact language of the 829 01:09:16,400 --> 01:09:24,080 county zoning where it's like these two zones are primarily residential and 830 01:09:22,000 --> 01:09:30,960 they've been developed beyond the point of being usable as farmland. Um, and so 831 01:09:28,000 --> 01:09:37,520 when the county makes that decision, you've got this land that's already been 832 01:09:33,359 --> 01:09:44,480 removed from farm use. And so if you're expanding your urban footprint 833 01:09:40,719 --> 01:09:49,839 into outside of the UGB, the state says, which on its face makes sense, assuming 834 01:09:46,960 --> 01:09:55,199 that those exclusions were given in a way that makes sense, right? So 835 01:09:52,560 --> 01:10:00,400 again, assuming everything works as it's supposed to work, then your exception 836 01:09:57,760 --> 01:10:03,600 land would be land that is already urbanized and being used for residential 837 01:10:02,239 --> 01:10:08,320 use. And so if the city's going to expand, they should go there before 838 01:10:05,360 --> 01:10:12,560 going to high value farmland that's like prime soil for farming. So if you Yeah, 839 01:10:10,640 --> 01:10:18,400 if you look at those zoning outside of Malala, um you know, for most of it, 840 01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:22,080 you'd see EFU, EFU, EFU, EFU, EFU, and then where the air strip is, I think 841 01:10:20,159 --> 01:10:28,000 there's a rural residential. Yeah. designation. And then all those lands 842 01:10:23,920 --> 01:10:32,320 south have this RR FF55 which is rural residential farm forest 5 acre, right? 843 01:10:30,800 --> 01:10:36,960 um and and and similar zoning designations that are that are different 844 01:10:34,239 --> 01:10:42,960 from EFU and that that's those are those exceptions that B and and I wasn't part 845 01:10:39,199 --> 01:10:49,120 of the work back in 2014 but I know that when the comp plan was updated in 2014 I 846 01:10:45,360 --> 01:10:54,560 think Winterbrook did it and um uh that that firm did it and um I believe there 847 01:10:51,679 --> 01:11:00,480 was some discussions about putting some of the land that is now 11 12 and 13 848 01:10:57,520 --> 01:11:07,040 into uh urban reserves and doing the urban reserves process which would be 849 01:11:03,840 --> 01:11:10,960 your land of first resort if you do go through all the process of getting 850 01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:14,960 designated as urban reserves. That process never really got off the ground. 851 01:11:12,800 --> 01:11:18,800 I don't know why at the time I don't know if it was you know staff or 852 01:11:16,480 --> 01:11:22,560 politics or whatever happened it didn't get off the ground. So you have no urban 853 01:11:20,560 --> 01:11:28,960 reserve. So you don't have any land specifically designated for your 854 01:11:26,239 --> 01:11:32,640 uh you know for for expansion to happen. So instead, we, you know, we have to go 855 01:11:30,560 --> 01:11:36,560 through this process. And again, stuff that's that's zoned for exclusive farm 856 01:11:35,120 --> 01:11:41,600 use versus stuff that's zoned for primarily residential uses. When you 857 01:11:38,560 --> 01:11:44,960 need 180 acres of residential land, the the rules say that's where you have to 858 01:11:43,280 --> 01:11:50,880 go. So, yeah, thank you. No, no, no worries. 859 01:11:48,159 --> 01:11:54,960 No worries. This is the time. Yeah. I think this is, you know, for now, this 860 01:11:52,640 --> 01:12:00,159 is my last uh meeting. So, ask all your all your questions. 861 01:11:58,239 --> 01:12:04,080 you know, no pressure. It sounded like you guys had more to go. So, I was I was 862 01:12:02,640 --> 01:12:08,239 I had a couple other questions, but you kind of answered them in a way during 863 01:12:06,239 --> 01:12:12,000 your conversation that you had a plenty. There's still more steps and more. 864 01:12:10,320 --> 01:12:16,719 There's more steps and all of this will get put down into a report. Yeah. Um 865 01:12:14,640 --> 01:12:24,480 that that you guys will will have access to at some at some point, I believe. 866 01:12:20,960 --> 01:12:29,600 You guys have anything? Well, thank you so much. Well, thank you 867 01:12:26,880 --> 01:12:37,199 so much. Thank you again for coming and sharing always anytime presenting. 868 01:12:35,520 --> 01:12:42,679 All right. All right. Well, thank you so much. Thank you. 869 01:12:39,600 --> 01:12:42,679 All right. 870 01:12:42,880 --> 01:12:50,000 And with that, that was a lot. So, and with that, we'll uh we have staff 871 01:12:47,920 --> 01:12:56,239 communications. So, does any staff have any updates other than this big project 872 01:12:53,280 --> 01:13:02,400 that we're working on? Yes, sir. I do. Yeah. Um, if you guys haven't seen it 873 01:12:59,040 --> 01:13:07,360 yet, the Clark Park Pavilion has been replaced. It's beautiful, gorgeous. Go 874 01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:13,280 check it out. Um, summer is going to be great there. Um, along with Bolander 875 01:13:10,480 --> 01:13:20,960 Field, about 90% of the traffic improvements have been done, including 876 01:13:15,520 --> 01:13:26,960 those ADA and parking strips that they did. Um, and the Boy Scouts worked 877 01:13:24,560 --> 01:13:33,440 alongside public works maintenance to put a bench in Pioneer 878 01:13:31,120 --> 01:13:39,520 Cemetery. So, they poured a concrete pad, they cleaned up the um the 879 01:13:37,280 --> 01:13:46,440 cemetery, took out some sticks and stuff, and then put a bench in. So, 880 01:13:43,040 --> 01:13:46,440 they've been busy. 881 01:13:48,080 --> 01:13:56,880 Awesome. Uh any other project updates I might 882 01:13:55,040 --> 01:14:01,840 Yeah. So I wanted to give one on the efficiency measures. Um so that the 883 01:13:59,360 --> 01:14:06,960 efficiency measures was the uh this ordinance that passed at the end of 884 01:14:04,400 --> 01:14:12,880 March. Um we we chatted about it a couple times here. Uh included the ADU 885 01:14:09,760 --> 01:14:17,280 to to type one. Um that that's uh no issue. And then also a number of 886 01:14:14,480 --> 01:14:22,400 reasonzoning projects. Um so I wanted to update you on what's going on with that. 887 01:14:19,040 --> 01:14:28,719 So council did approve it um in Mar March and adopt it. Um 888 01:14:26,320 --> 01:14:35,199 but we did get a challenge to it from ODOT that um that basically some of the 889 01:14:32,480 --> 01:14:37,760 properties uh we went through a number of back and forth discussions on on the 890 01:14:36,800 --> 01:14:43,520 matter. But basically for the transportation planning rule um the city 891 01:14:41,440 --> 01:14:49,840 determined no significant impact to transportation facilities and ODOT um 892 01:14:48,000 --> 01:14:54,719 sort of disagreed and wanted more robust findings uh with regards to the the 893 01:14:52,400 --> 01:15:00,159 transportation planning rule. Um so we did uh an exercise we you know our staff 894 01:14:57,600 --> 01:15:05,760 and their staff worked together um to determine uh 895 01:15:02,480 --> 01:15:10,320 sort of the the what a high high trip count case scenario would be with the 896 01:15:07,280 --> 01:15:16,000 existing zoning and what what high count uh high trip count would be possible 897 01:15:12,800 --> 01:15:20,480 with the proposed zoning. Um and so basically from from there we got to uh 898 01:15:18,880 --> 01:15:24,640 you know ODOT was very comfortable what we had done with the residential uh 899 01:15:23,040 --> 01:15:30,159 resonings and then also the courtesy resonings but the industrial to 900 01:15:28,000 --> 01:15:34,159 commercial zonings uh increased trip counts in a way that they 901 01:15:32,719 --> 01:15:41,440 wouldn't have been comfortable passing it without um further analysis done. Um, 902 01:15:38,159 --> 01:15:45,760 and that comment would have been uh that comment would have put the ordinance 903 01:15:43,120 --> 01:15:49,600 subject to remand from DLCD. Uh, so rather than go through that process, 904 01:15:47,520 --> 01:15:52,800 we're going to do a repeal and replace. Um, and that's the that's the map that I 905 01:15:51,360 --> 01:15:59,280 have up here. There's sort of gray areas that show the commercial um industrial 906 01:15:55,679 --> 01:16:04,159 to commercial on the map. Um, that is going to be left out of this new 907 01:16:00,640 --> 01:16:09,040 ordinance. Uh and then the residential um and a little bit of downtown 908 01:16:07,600 --> 01:16:13,600 commercial and then also the prairie house in uh will go to commercial uh 909 01:16:11,520 --> 01:16:17,920 that'll go from from residential to uh but a as we had previously discussed. So 910 01:16:16,239 --> 01:16:24,080 that that will remain the same from the from the previous ordinance. 911 01:16:20,320 --> 01:16:27,520 Um, so I just wanted to make you all aware that that was that was going to 912 01:16:25,840 --> 01:16:33,480 happen and we're planning to go before council with the replacement ordinance 913 01:16:29,920 --> 01:16:33,480 um on the 25th. 914 01:16:34,480 --> 01:16:41,600 So, um it it wouldn't preclude in the future um doing those commercial 915 01:16:38,880 --> 01:16:46,320 resonings. It will just take uh a little more effort than we had capacity to do 916 01:16:43,199 --> 01:16:52,239 at the time. Um but with regards to our work with the UGB studies, uh we're 917 01:16:48,800 --> 01:16:56,080 still on track by uh for efficiency measures getting some of that 918 01:16:53,280 --> 01:17:00,280 residential extra residential land and taking out some of the surplus 919 01:16:57,280 --> 01:17:00,280 industrial. 920 01:17:01,199 --> 01:17:04,440 That's it. 921 01:17:04,560 --> 01:17:07,560 Cool. 922 01:17:08,239 --> 01:17:12,280 Anything else? No, 923 01:17:12,320 --> 01:17:20,640 that's good. That's good. All right. Uh, commission. Does the commission have 924 01:17:18,159 --> 01:17:28,400 any community event announcements or activities 925 01:17:24,640 --> 01:17:33,800 that they're aware of? Not me. Nothing. Nope. Chamber of Commerce isn't here 926 01:17:30,320 --> 01:17:33,800 tonight. So, yeah. 927 01:17:34,320 --> 01:17:45,360 True. Um, I'm just going to share it. I I attended the latest meeting for the 928 01:17:40,080 --> 01:17:49,440 new middle school and um that was uh pretty good a lot of good information. 929 01:17:47,520 --> 01:17:52,800 Seems that they uh took a lot of the feedback from the previous meeting that 930 01:17:51,040 --> 01:17:56,800 I attended um 931 01:17:54,400 --> 01:18:03,280 and incorporated that there. So, but appears that they legitimately went back 932 01:17:59,600 --> 01:18:07,440 and made some adjustments to the site layout and the traffic flows and things 933 01:18:05,120 --> 01:18:13,600 like that. So they were pretty excited. It looked pretty solid and um it seemed 934 01:18:11,760 --> 01:18:18,480 to be wellreceived, a lot better than the first one. So So that was very 935 01:18:16,320 --> 01:18:24,800 positive. So um I know they had indicated that it's potential that it 936 01:18:20,080 --> 01:18:30,080 should be coming to the city soon. So we we got the application. So yeah, we're 937 01:18:27,360 --> 01:18:35,360 looking at it now. There we go. So it's exciting. It's looking good. And I think 938 01:18:31,840 --> 01:18:39,920 on the I think it's the uh school district's website or the middle school 939 01:18:37,840 --> 01:18:44,159 website, I I forget which, but uh they have a video where you can do the 940 01:18:41,520 --> 01:18:50,400 virtual fly through and see what it's going to at least the proposed plan is 941 01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:55,040 for it and uh for the for the building. So I encourage people to check it out. 942 01:18:53,040 --> 01:19:01,120 But just kind of an update on that that I 943 01:18:57,760 --> 01:19:09,239 had I had encountered. and and attended. So that's all I got. 944 01:19:05,920 --> 01:19:09,239 Very exciting. 945 01:19:09,280 --> 01:19:20,080 So um with that, is there anything else for the good of the order? 946 01:19:17,199 --> 01:19:24,850 No. Nothing. All right. Well, then I am going to adjourn this meeting at 7:52 947 01:19:23,600 --> 01:19:28,499 p.m. [Music]