[This transcript was generated automatically from audio using AI and hasn't been reviewed by a person -- it can contain mistakes, including plausible-sounding sentences that were never actually said. Treat it as a starting point, not a verbatim record.]

[0:02] It is 6.30 and we'll call the City of Monroe Common Council to order and please rise for the pledge of allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation of the God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Thank you.
[0:35] And at this time, we'll have roll call, please.
[0:39] All their toll men here, all their chronic here, all their Cleveland here, all their Grenzou, all their true heart, all their Miller, here, all their Warrantweiler,
[0:53] All there no here and all the shaffer here, okay and all our present is there any the corrections of the minutes of October 7th, 2024.
[1:08] Any corrections hearing none they will stand approved as presented.
[1:17] Are there any presentations of petitions and communication?
[1:27] No, okay. All right. And moving on to the business by the mayor. I do have a letter that I'd like to read. It's from
[1:41] Noreen Rutgers. It says, Dear Mayor Douglas, on behalf of Cheese Days, I would like to thank you for the excellent assistance we received from so many of the departments within the city of Monroe.
[1:52] Every encounter was positive and every department head was always ready to help.
[2:00] Of course a lot of things happened during the festival weekend but most people would be surprised
[2:06] to know that your department heads began planning and strategizing months in advance.
[2:13] They cooperate and communicate with each other and with us at Tuesdays.
[2:21] All of these efforts add up to a festival that Monroe in Green County can be proud of Nareen Rutter.
[2:29] So, thank you department heads and thank you to the community, it was a wonderful event.
[2:36] So, even if we didn't have them for eight, right?
[2:41] So, and at this time I'm going to read this is in order to ensure a fair and efficient
[2:55] public hearing this evening we are setting expectations and rules of procedure.
[3:01] If you are here to participate in the public hearing for the discussion of fluoride or
[3:07] shared ride taxi rates please sign in ahead of time with the clerk and that's
[3:15] clerk right there and your name will be called in order you signed in during the
[3:21] public hearing of that topic not the general public comment each participant
[3:27] should state their name and address in any organization or group you are
[3:33] are representing.
[3:35] You will have three minutes to speak.
[3:37] Attorney Bartoff will warn you at two minutes
[3:41] and three minute mark.
[3:43] In respect of all of your and our time,
[3:47] please consider a representative for shared opinions
[3:51] and avoid being repetitive of all the same information.
[4:00] The council has also had multiple opinions and information shared with them through other methods prior to the council meeting.
[4:10] Those are equally considered and we have quite a pile of that we have.
[4:17] Council members please allow each council member their turn to speak prior to speaking a second time.
[4:27] Please stick to the topic, be concise and absent of personal attacks.
[4:35] If the decision not to continue fluoridation is recommended, that will be subject to
[4:41] another public hearing following a recommendation by judiciary and ordinance.
[4:48] So, you all understand that, thank you.
[4:52] Okay, moving on.
[4:56] Is there any appearance by
[4:59] Thank you.
[5:00] Let's see, yep, right here, by the citizens, other than the public hearing. So this is if anybody
[5:09] wants to speak, there are city resident just on anything but fluoride or but taxi cab. So if you want
[5:17] to speak on anything else, this is your time.
[5:23] Okay. All right. And any appearances by property owners
[5:28] business owners for the city okay hearing none we'll move on to the consent
[5:36] agenda do I have a motion to approve do I have a second I'll second okay on
[5:44] favor say aye
[5:47] and oppose no and the clerk will call the roll older tomen I
[5:53] Aye. Older Cranig. Aye.
[5:55] Older Cleveland. Aye.
[5:56] Older Grinzo. Aye.
[5:59] Older Truhart. Aye.
[6:01] Older Miller. Aye.
[6:02] Older Wharton-Wyler. Aye.
[6:04] Older Noel. Aye.
[6:05] Older Schaefer. Aye.
[6:10] Yes, yes.
[6:14] Are there any comments or questions about the Treasurer's report?
[6:18] Do you all receive the Treasurer's report at a time?
[6:26] Hearing none?
[6:29] We don't know that.
[6:30] We don't know much. No.
[6:32] We
[6:36] will move on to the Board of Public Works.
[6:40] At this time, we'll hold the public hearing, the discussion on probable action regarding
[6:47] the ordinance 8-4-10, the Florida Nation of the City of Monroe Water Supply.
[6:58] Can I just make a quick comment?
[7:00] So I'll be taking time.
[7:02] At two minutes, I'll probably go like that something like this to let you know I have two minutes.
[7:06] At three minutes, I'm going to be doing something like this.
[7:08] If you go too far, I'm going to step in.
[7:11] People, if they're on the line, of course, I'll
[7:15] have to probably just say two minutes,
[7:16] and then either your time to wrap up.
[7:20] You'll have to, on the microphone, there's
[7:23] a little button on down below.
[7:25] You'll see the red light.
[7:26] The red light means that everybody can hear you on the mic.
[7:29] If you stop talking for more than 10 seconds,
[7:32] I think it goes off.
[7:33] So you just got to make sure the red light's there so everybody
[7:35] can hear.
[7:40] I'll be assisting the clerk with calling the names and I apologize if I mispronounce
[7:45] and I might need some help in sometimes reading the penmanship but first off we'll start
[7:51] with Gwen Busby.
[8:04] Hi I'm Gwen Busby my address is 161616th Street in Monroe and I just wanted
[8:10] to come to express my strong support of keeping fluoride in the water because it's safe and effective
[8:16] about preventing cavities, especially for young children, which is really important to me.
[8:23] If you choose to remove flared from the water, families will have to choose between either
[8:28] purchasing expensive flared supplements, or just getting more cavities that would have been
[8:36] preventable, and with things being more expensive, like a lot of people are concerned with cost
[8:44] of living, I think that's a major issue in addition to just negative health outcomes
[8:50] of having cavities.
[8:52] So, thank you.
[8:57] Next up is Noah Hibberd.
[9:07] Okay.
[9:08] Hi, my name is Noah.
[9:09] I live at 26, 18, 11th Avenue in Monroe.
[9:13] I'm a city of Monroe resident and it would be a mistake to remove a flow ride from our drinking
[9:17] water.
[9:18] I grew up in the country without access to a floridated water and my teeth suffered because
[9:23] of it.
[9:24] I did some fluoride treatments, but it doesn't compare to having a constant study supply of it.
[9:29] It isn't as simple as, oh, you just get some more cavities.
[9:33] Well, if you're a young child and you get a cavity, well, that only lasts for so many years.
[9:36] Then you need to get another cavity.
[9:38] You can only fill a cavity so many times before you need a crown or a rug canal or something.
[9:42] So the costs really add up when you start that track really early on in life.
[9:48] I have a young daughter and I'm glad that she has access to a floridated water in our in our city our trust
[9:54] I trust our local dentists and our health professionals that believe that floridated water is best
[10:00] Thank you for the health of our community. I urge the city council members to listen to our local health leaders and support keeping Florida in the water. Thank you.
[10:11] Next up, it's a D.C. of the initials 13-10-19th Street,
[10:18] I can't read that, shall I?
[10:25] You can do that, yeah.
[10:27] Don Collins, 13-10-19th street mineral, I would say to remove this stuff, it's poison.
[10:34] People that have spoke in favor of it, obviously, don't know the true ramifications of it.
[10:39] It's actually bad for your teeth.
[10:43] And since it's in the toothpaste, why do they have to have it in the water?
[10:46] not only do you drink it, you sit in it and soak it in the tub, it soaks in your body, it accumulates over years
[10:52] causes bone problems, thyroid problems, and
[10:56] You know, I could have brought a stack of papers on that
[10:59] Which I'm sure you've already gotten plenty of
[11:02] so
[11:04] You know, just think about that when you vote your little grandkids and kids sitting playing with the rubber ducky in the tub, soaking all that up in their bodies and
[11:11] It's not good
[11:13] God didn't make it. Don't take it. Don't need it
[11:22] Next is Peggy Frint,
[11:29] 2826 for Streton Monroe.
[11:32] I have been a resident of Monroe for my entire life.
[11:35] I am in favor of continuing the Cuthmunity Florida Water Program.
[11:39] I have been drinking this fluoride-fluorid-gated, sorry, water since I was born.
[11:44] I drank our city water when I was pregnant with my two sons.
[11:47] I used it to mix their formula and prepare their meals.
[11:50] They brushed their teeth daily.
[11:51] I also took them to the dentist regularly.
[11:54] I realize this is an advantage that all moms can provide for their children, whether due
[11:59] to financial or insurance reasons or struggles of other life factors.
[12:03] I am glad our community has a fluoride program that is available to benefit all children
[12:08] and residents of Monroe.
[12:11] My children I have great dental health in part because of this program.
[12:14] It is safe and effective.
[12:16] We have never had any side effects or adverse reactions from fluoride.
[12:21] Scientific research shows its benefits with no evidence of harmful effects.
[12:27] Good dental health also positively promotes one's body's physical well-being.
[12:31] I would like to thank all the dentists here for their advocacy.
[12:35] For them, this isn't about money.
[12:37] If it were, they would recommend to take fluoride out.
[12:40] It would increase tooth decay and the procedures needed to fix it.
[12:44] They are here because they have dedicated their lives to their patients well-being, service
[12:49] to the community, community, and science.
[12:52] We are here because they are here because they know the difference a healthy smile can
[12:56] make in people's lives.
[12:58] They see firsthand every day the impact of fluoride in promoting good, oral, and overall
[13:04] health.
[13:05] City Council members, please vote to continue this important public health program.
[13:10] Thank you.
[13:13] Thank you.
[13:16] Good
[13:23] evening, my name is Janelle Actol, I am an owner and provider at Actol Family
[13:30] Dentistry and our address is 912-16th Avenue here in Monroe. I am a dentist and a mom and
[13:37] I support continuing community water fluoridation in Monroe. For every parent out there you know how
[13:43] viscerally important it is to keep your child healthy and I am no different. My family lives in the
[13:49] country and we do not have fluoride in our water source. When my four children were little,
[13:54] I would buy fluoride water from Walmart and refill the jugs in town to put in their
[13:58] sippy cups. And now I encourage them to fill their water bottles at school to have the
[14:03] advantages of the well-balanced, safe, and dependable municipal fluoridated water.
[14:09] My children have benefited from this. They have developed strong, healthy enamel on their teeth
[14:13] that will carry them through their lifetime. As a dentist, I have served Monroe in the surrounding
[14:19] communities for the past 17 years. I read peer-reviewed journals in my industry
[14:24] from the American Dental Association and trust the scientific research reported
[14:29] by the American Academy of Pediatrics, who in 2024 still recommends drinking
[14:34] optimally-forilated water to prevent dental disease.
[14:38] And the U.S. Public Health Service and the Center for Disease Control,
[14:41] this is a natural mineral that is safe like calcium. If there was ever
[14:48] a credible and statistically significant and repeatable study that showed community
[14:53] water fluoridation at the low level of .7 parts per million concentration if it ever
[15:00] So that it was harmful, I would change my practice. I would change what I feed my own children. My family is one of the lucky ones. I am informed, educated, and able to access floridated water for their health. However, in my nearly 20 years of dental practice, I have seen the devastation of dental disease. This doesn't only attack children, it attacks committee, all the community. I have sent out, I think, some slides
[15:29] for all of you to see, but I wanted to share that cavities don't only mean fillings.
[15:36] They can be pain, loss of sleep, appetite, loss of school.
[15:40] Parents lose time at work to take children into the dental offices.
[15:46] There can be increased cavities and permanent teeth when there's poor development or poor
[15:51] fluoride exposure and expensive hospitalizations in ER visits.
[15:55] benefits. When I see advanced dental disease in children, I utilize local pediatric dentists
[16:01] in our area. In Jainsville and Madison, I talked to them last week. For a child to see
[16:07] a dentist in an OR operating room, it can be between $10,000 and $20,000 for their dental
[16:12] needs. And they're not even seeing available appointments available until December.
[16:20] Let's get ahead.
[16:21] All right.
[16:22] For the health of our community, please follow the science and the professionals in this
[16:26] field to vote and continue to, to, to, to Florida, our community water.
[16:30] In Monroe.
[16:30] Thank you.
[16:35] Joan?
[16:35] Joan Roophenak.
[16:37] I
[16:44] am Joan Wynn Roophenak and I'm from Loyodo, Scanson.
[16:49] I grew up in Loyoda.
[16:50] I now live at 9234th Street.
[16:53] in Monroe, right across from Parkside School, and I love being in Monroe, and I love
[17:00] the fact that after I moved here 45 years ago, there is fluoride in the water
[17:08] because I growing up in Wyoda, me and my brothers and sisters, all had, I hate to
[17:16] tell you this, horrible dental.
[17:19] I mean, our teeth was all jeopardized.
[17:23] By the fact, we had no fluoride in our rural water
[17:27] on the fireman, Wyoda.
[17:29] So my sister was just telling me that she worked
[17:34] for the school system in Darlington for 16 years,
[17:38] and she had to put little mouthwash and paper cups
[17:43] every morning for the children to rinse their mouth out and then give them a
[17:48] little paper towel to dry their mouth because they needed that the fluoride in
[17:54] the mouthwash for their teeth because most of them are rural. So that's really
[18:01] all I have to say. Thank you. So I wish that you would leave the fluoride in the
[18:08] water system. Thank you.
[18:13] Luke Buholzer.
[18:23] Luke Buholzer, 2708, 22nd Avenue, Minerale. So, again,
[18:29] I'm a lifelong resident of Minerale. I'm a fourth-generation cheese maker at Klondike Cheese.
[18:37] I'm part of the ownership. So, I'll bring a little bit different perspective than everyone else.
[18:43] Well, I believe we should have fluoride.
[18:46] We struggle to bring people to our community
[18:48] to fill job vacancies.
[18:53] And that's a daily struggle with a lot of the companies
[18:56] in town.
[18:57] We're not alone.
[18:59] Removing fluoride from our water source
[19:03] will make us less attractive to families
[19:08] that want to come and live in barrel and set up their life.
[19:13] And we need those, and I personally believe it's a helpful thing to have in the water supply.
[19:25] But to have something that tells people they shouldn't live here because it will make
[19:31] their families less healthy, I think would be a great detriment to the community.
[19:39] Thank you for your time.
[19:40] Jerry
[19:45] Whitney.
[19:54] Hi, my name is Jerry Whitney. I live on 812 21st Street.
[20:02] As a resident of the city, I want to share my concerns regarding the potential removal fluoride from our water. It's difficult for me to see this issue unfold because I trust the professionals in the dental and public health communities who have dedicated themselves to improving our health. Many of these agencies, funded by our taxes, continue to support water fluoridation based on years of careful research. Why is this decision being made?
[20:30] and hastily without actual directives from regulatory bodies telling us to stop adding
[20:35] fluoride to the water. I don't think there has been enough opportunity for residents
[20:39] to be involved in this decision. It feels like decisions are being made behind closed
[20:44] doors with limited opportunities for city residents to have a say. We deserve to be part of
[20:49] this conversation. I believe our community values open dialogue and more public input.
[20:54] But like surveys, newsletters, and publicity about this would help us feel included in this
[21:00] important decision.
[21:02] As an administrator in the dental field, I see the struggles family face in accessing
[21:07] timely dental care already, and I can't imagine how much crazier it would be if the need
[21:12] for dental treatment increases in our community.
[21:16] Our clinic is already booking new patients into February, and I hear it from the patients
[21:19] students who are calling that many other local dentists are at full capacity also.
[21:24] Working parents often don't have a hard time finding appointments that don't interfere
[21:29] with work or their children's school schedules, and I know it's hard when kids have to miss
[21:33] school for treatment.
[21:35] I also understand how expensive dental care can be, and I see firsthand how dental insurance
[21:41] often falls short in helping families cover the costs.
[21:45] Florida water is a simple cost-effective way to help reduce dental expenses
[21:50] especially for those already finding it hard to afford care. Removing it could
[21:55] add more financial strain on families. I hope we can continue to focus on what
[22:01] benefits our city in the long run protecting our residents' dental health in
[22:05] any way possible including keeping water for our nation. Thank you.
[22:13] Carey Spencer?
[22:29] Thank you for the opportunity to speak this evening on behalf of Wisconsin the
[22:32] Department of Health Services, my name is Kerry Spencer, and I'm the Oral Health Prevention
[22:36] Program Coordinator for the Division of Public Health.
[22:40] My work entails oral health prevention across our state, including community water flirtation.
[22:45] In this role, my responsibility is to serve as the liaison between DHS and the Department
[22:50] of Natural Resources.
[22:52] You've heard and received a lot of information about flirtation.
[22:55] I want to share information regarding the regulation and safety.
[22:59] As with many substances and high concentrations, they can be hazardous to human health, and
[23:04] the correct concentrations, they're therapeutic.
[23:07] Fluoride is no different.
[23:09] This is why there's regulations and safety protocols in place to ensure proper handling
[23:13] and dosage.
[23:15] In Wisconsin, these regulations are set and monitored by the DNR following EPA and OSHA guidance, thus
[23:21] ensuring protocols are being followed by operators to ensure public safety.
[23:26] Water operators test the natural levels of fluoride present in a well to calculate the appropriate
[23:31] dosage and feed rates to achieve the optimal level of 0.7.
[23:35] In Monroe, there's five wells, wells three and seven are newer wells that have raw water
[23:40] samples confirming the natural levels are 0.11.
[23:44] The DNR regulates fluoride at 0.6 to 0.8 and levels below 0.7 do not provide oral health
[23:50] benefits necessary for oral disease prevention.
[23:53] It impacts the health impacts fall quickly when levels are not maintained.
[23:58] While I'm not aware this is ever happened in Monroe, if levels ever go above 2.0 due
[24:03] to a system over a feed or equipment malfunction, there are protocols in place for such situations.
[24:10] They require public notice and other steps to ensure public safety.
[24:16] Communities that Florida do require daily testing.
[24:18] the results are logged, submitted to the DNR, DHS and the CDC.
[24:24] Once a month, split samples are taken and verified by an independent lab.
[24:29] Fluorid additives used in water fluoridation meet the standards of the American Water Works Association,
[24:36] the NSF International and the American National Standards Institute.
[24:40] Personal protective equipment, proper ventilation, and chemical storage and more are to ensure operator safety.
[24:46] This is similar to a dental professional
[24:49] wearing personal protective equipment
[24:50] when performing procedures that contain bodily fluids.
[24:54] Multiple professions have risk associated
[24:56] with performing job duties,
[24:58] but the proper equipment and protocol.
[25:00] Calls allow them to do their job safely. I hope the information shared with you tonight helps provide reassurance of proper protocols and safety measures to ensure safe drinking water for the residents of Monroe. Public health measures are to promote health for everyone in your community for years to come. Thank you.
[25:34] I'm a family medicine physician and a health advisor for Green County but today I speak on my own behalf.
[25:40] Fluoridation opponents may not appreciate the frequency and severity of dental disease and its harm to general health.
[25:46] I see this every day in my practice.
[25:48] More than half of children aged six to eight have cavities in their baby teeth.
[25:51] And children from low-income families are twice as luckily to have cavities than children in high-income households.
[25:57] Nearly 90% of adults have had decay in their teeth.
[26:01] Children growing up in areas with Florida to water have better dental health than those
[26:05] without.
[26:07] At all ages, tooth decay is reduced by about 25% and the proportion of children with no
[26:13] decay is about 15% higher in those unflornated areas.
[26:17] A study in Alaskan children showed that kids living in non-flornated areas had 32% higher
[26:23] rates of decay, missing, or filled teeth and kids in Florida.
[26:27] Unfortunately, in my practice, I see the other side of this when patients come in with
[26:31] poor dentition and related health concerns.
[26:34] Frequently, patients will come in with dental pain from infections, and I will prescribe
[26:38] antibiotics to bridge them until they can see a dentist.
[26:41] Weight times to see a dentist can be several months, especially for those in Medicaid or
[26:46] rural areas, these are even longer.
[26:48] Unfortunately, while they wait, people are at increased risk of complications.
[26:51] These can include bloodstream infection, heart valve infections, heart disease, worsening
[26:57] control of underlying diabetes, chronic pain, or impregnant women, even premature birth.
[27:03] People with dental pain find it difficult to chew, and the pain disrupts learning, sleet
[27:07] mood, countless other things.
[27:09] Everyday ICU patients were unable to eat nutritious diets and participate in social activities
[27:14] because they have lost their teeth.
[27:16] Those with missing or decayed teeth often feel self-conscious or unwilling to smile.
[27:20] I also have patients who have had delayed medical treatments as they await
[27:25] for dental extractions due to fractured or infected teeth. The rate of these
[27:30] conditions is troublesome and problematic even with fluoridated water. I'm very
[27:34] concerned about the downstream effects of potentially removing fluoridated water
[27:37] and decreasing tooth decay as this helps with these complications.
[27:42] fluoride in toothpaste and applications that the dentist or in the office of my
[27:47] My office is not enough to prevent these.
[27:50] Community Water Floor Nation is safe and effective.
[27:53] For every dollar that we invest as a city, $32 is saved in avoiding treatment of cavities.
[27:59] The safe citizens time out of work, out of school.
[28:03] Dental disease is costly and accumulates over time.
[28:06] Young children and those with disabilities often require general anesthesia for dental work
[28:10] increasing the cost of the procedures.
[28:17] I would also like to take just a moment of my remaining time to thank you all on the City Council.
[28:23] You have such a vital role in our community and you work countless hours behind the scenes to make mineral better.
[28:29] I hope today that you vote so that we can continue to move our community forwards and not backwards.
[28:34] Please trust the experts in the science so that our citizens can continue to receive safe effective doses of fluoride in their water.
[28:40] Thank you.
[28:44] Don Golechson.
[28:53] Hi, I'm Don Golechson.
[28:56] I live at N-33-09 Monroe, Sylvester Road in Monroe.
[29:00] I am a registered dental hygienist here in Monroe at the dental house.
[29:04] And I'm also here representing my children who reside half of the time in Monroe
[29:08] and go to the Monroe schools.
[29:10] I've worked in the dental field in this town for 25 years.
[29:13] I have a strong passion for keeping fluoride in our municipal water.
[29:17] I've seen the benefits of fluoride in the water and I have seen the consequences of
[29:21] not having fluoride in the drinking water.
[29:23] I'm not here to change anyone's mind on how they feel about fluoride, which is a mineral
[29:28] that is found naturally in lakes, rivers, and groundwater.
[29:31] I'm here to encourage the council to hear from the experts before making any decisions about
[29:36] removing the fluoride from the water.
[29:38] This is a public health matter and one that should not be taken lightly.
[29:42] The right research needs to be reviewed.
[29:44] You don't need to be bullied or scared into making any hasty decisions.
[29:48] You need to fully understand what could and will happen if the fluoride is removed.
[29:52] You can google anything these days and get research on what you want to hear or what someone may want you to believe.
[29:58] But I believe in the science and I re-
[30:00] We lie on the science every day to prove or disprove practices. Can you without a doubt based on what you've seen thus far prove that it is the Florida and our water, causing these potential neurological issues, thyroid issues, and whatever else the fan is making claims on? Can you be sure that it is not contributed to our diet such as fast food, pesticides, energy drinks, sodas? I could play the devil's advocate on and on. If Florida is so dangerous, then why would we be okay with the point two
[30:29] parts for a million in our natural water supply. Will the city be publicly
[30:33] funding the reverse osmosis of our water to be rid of all of it? Are those who
[30:37] deeply care about the fluoride being in our water planning to stop filtering
[30:41] their water or stop drinking bottled water if it is removed? Can't it just be as
[30:45] simple as those that don't want it just don't drink the water? Water
[30:49] fluoridation benefits children and adults alike in preventing tooth decay
[30:53] removing it could lead to more tooth decay in children resulting in lost days
[30:57] of school, hospitalizations, high doses of prescribed medications, and premature
[31:02] tooth loss that it can affect them for years to come.
[31:06] Not to mention the unplanned expenses to families that are already struggling to make
[31:11] ends meet.
[31:12] I know you have been told that there is research showing just the opposite, but are you sure
[31:16] that that research is valid?
[31:18] You need experts to know this, people that are qualified to analyze research.
[31:23] I don't go to my mechanic to find out if my heart is healthy.
[31:26] Therefore, I am requesting a workshop so that you can hear from professionals who analyze
[31:32] this research that can explain the research to you so that you can make an informed decision.
[31:38] Thank you.
[31:42] Laura Hibberd.
[31:48] Hello.
[31:49] I'm Dr. Laura Hibberd, a local dentist and mother living in the city and seeing patients
[31:54] from the city of Monroe.
[31:56] Growing up outside the city, I drank water and by the time I was in elementary school,
[32:01] I had a mouthful of cavities.
[32:02] It was painful.
[32:03] It was scary and it left me with a fear of the dentist.
[32:07] In contrast, my friends who lived in town with access to the Florida water didn't face
[32:12] the same struggles like I did.
[32:14] Their visits were positive with no cavity awards and good news.
[32:19] I see patients every day who have severe dental fear because of all the work they needed as a kid
[32:23] and I think we should do everything we can to reduce their need for treatment at all.
[32:28] I want the best cavity reduction for my own daughter here.
[32:33] The local dental professionals all here know that fluoride in the water helps our patients.
[32:38] That's why I handed you the packet of the dental letter because I didn't see it published on the agenda.
[32:43] We can tell the difference in the cavity risk for those who aren't drinking the fluoridated water,
[32:47] but we're not trained researchers to be able to extract the percentages that you want to see.
[32:52] What we do have is years of experience and our first hand results that we see in our
[32:57] own patient's mouth.
[32:58] We hope that we've earned your trust as your dentist, and it's really disheartening to
[33:03] see the lack of trust in the professionals that have dedicated their lives to the service
[33:08] of their patients.
[33:09] You might be wondering why toothpaste alone isn't enough.
[33:13] Rushing with fluoride toothpaste helps, but it returns the saliva concentration to baseline
[33:18] within one to two hours.
[33:19] The water on the other hand, when someone's drinking it all day long, provides a consistent
[33:23] low level of fluoride throughout the day, and that gets secreted throughout your saliva.
[33:28] It offers better overall protection against tooth decay, and particularly for those who
[33:32] might not brush consistently or effectively.
[33:35] For example, we don't recommend large amounts of toothpaste we use for toddlers and infants
[33:39] because they could swallow those concentrations all at once.
[33:43] But those little ones still develop or benefit from the low level of fluoride that's added
[33:47] to the water because it gets an incorporated into their developing teeth.
[33:52] Basically, you need both things.
[33:53] You need a toothpaste and the water for the most protection.
[33:57] 2018 cross-sectional study by Slade at all analyzed NHANES data from about 20,000 children,
[34:03] aged 2 to 17, they found that living in a county where 75% or more of that drinking water
[34:09] contained optimally fluoride or 0.7 parts per million fluoride had a 30% reduction in the rate
[34:15] of cavities and baby teeth and a 12% reduction in cavities and permanent teeth.
[34:19] And this data was taken from a timeframe where fluoridated toothpaste, fluoride treatments
[34:24] at the dentist and sealants were commonplace.
[34:27] New research is always emerging and as dental professionals we rely on organizations to release
[34:32] clinical practice guidelines before changing the way we practice.
[34:35] I trust our national organizations like the CDC, ADA, and WHO, as well as the state health departments
[34:41] to monitor this research and make policy recommendations
[34:45] based on that evidence.
[34:46] At this time, I hope the City of Monroe
[34:48] continues water floor dation.
[34:53] Director Allison Ignis.
[35:01] Good evening. My name is Dr. Alice and Agnes. I live at North 3051 Youth Cabin Road here in Monroe. I'm a local dentist, an expecting mother and a resident of Monroe. I want to share the severity of current dental conditions in our community. At my clinic, I see an overwhelming demand. Our clinic was founded on volunteers and a majority of our patients are on Medicaid or discount plans due to low income.
[35:32] were booked out months in advance, often treating children and parents with
[35:38] over 20 cavities or missing teeth. And for me, it's heartbreaking. We've had to
[35:43] go through times where we couldn't accept new patients because we couldn't
[35:47] catch up. I've treated children with rampant decay on nearly every tooth. I've
[35:52] treated teenagers who have lost multiple front teeth due to cavities. Many patients
[35:58] and admit they brush less than three times a week if that.
[36:02] And while we focus on Kerry's prevention,
[36:04] the path to stability is long and difficult.
[36:07] My husband, an ER doctor here in Monroe,
[36:10] frequently sees patients with dental pain due to decay.
[36:14] After they're referred, and I evaluate them,
[36:16] I find it can take more than eight or more visits
[36:19] to achieve stability.
[36:20] And finding specialists can mean traveling over an hour,
[36:23] sometimes two, if they're even accepting new patients.
[36:28] For parents juggling multiple jobs with multiple kids,
[36:31] this can be devastating.
[36:33] Tooth to cake goes beyond the tooth.
[36:35] When severe, it can affect the children's ability
[36:38] to learn and concentrate in school,
[36:40] impacting their mental health and social skills,
[36:42] particularly when they feel they have to cover their teeth
[36:45] to hide a black tooth.
[36:47] Or they have picture day, the next day,
[36:49] and they're asking me, how did we get this?
[36:53] How do I get these cavities?
[36:54] and they're interested in being better.
[36:59] On my days off, I volunteer in local schools teaching
[37:03] for brushing techniques.
[37:05] I spearheaded this program and started it last year.
[37:08] I travel hours to shadow specialists
[37:10] to bring more services to Monroe
[37:12] and I feel overwhelmed and desperate to find more help.
[37:17] Multiple families in my clinic without Florida aid water
[37:19] are requesting fluoride supplements
[37:21] and they are seeking out more help.
[37:24] With split household and inconsistent adult supervision
[37:27] on brushing or nutrition,
[37:28] because parents are working night shifts
[37:30] or multiple jobs,
[37:32] fluoridated water may be their only defense.
[37:35] I grew up in Illinois drinking fluoridated water.
[37:38] My husband and ER doctor grew up in the Middle East
[37:41] and Europe drinking fluoridated water.
[37:43] And we chose to move to Monroe
[37:45] because we care deeply about this community.
[37:48] In conclusion, we cannot afford to increase
[37:50] the risk of cavities in already high-carry risk population and I support the fluoride concentrations
[37:56] in the water at this time. Thank you.
[38:01] Robin Cooster.
[38:10] My name is Robin Cooster. I live in N3815, Autumn Ridge Road in Monroe.
[38:15] Thank you for allowing me to provide some comments tonight.
[38:18] Monroe has been adding fluoride to the drinking water since 1966, providing cavity prevention
[38:22] benefits to thousands of people who live, go to school, and work here. I work in public
[38:28] health and have dedicated the entirety of my professional career to understanding and addressing
[38:33] the burden of oral disease and working to increase access to dental care for those who are low
[38:38] income or uninsured. I care about and want what is best for our community of Monroe. One in four
[38:45] children, one in four third grade children have untreated cavities and three out of five did not have
[38:51] dental sealants on permanent molars which means children are at risk for spending time away from
[38:56] school for preventable oral disease. In Green County only 21% of the population with Medicaid
[39:03] insurance had a preventive dental service last year. That means 4 out of 5 did not get
[39:10] fluoride from a dental provider. Dental, medical and public health professionals are using
[39:16] multiple strategies to improve oral health but we need your help. The most effective way
[39:23] perspective way to support our efforts is to continue providing optimally
[39:27] fluoridated water. By doing so, you are reducing the amount of disease and
[39:31] saving mineral families an estimated $345,000 per year. The best available
[39:38] scientific evidence supports water fluoridation. Yet a wide variety of claims
[39:43] have been made linking fluoride with harms to health. The Internet easily
[39:47] allows activists to spread disinformation, sewed out, and influence opinions
[39:52] through podcasts, social media influencers, videos, and blog posts.
[40:00] I can empathize with how hard it must be to sift through all the information and try to figure
[40:07] out how to make a well-informed decision. The public health policy is based on the entire
[40:13] body of scientific evidence, research and the scientific process is complex, science
[40:19] is iterative, new research is reviewed and scrutinized, new findings lead to new questions, evidence
[40:25] is carefully weighed and put into context and more studies are done so we can continue to build
[40:30] on previous research using conclusive results until conclusive results are found.
[40:37] For over 75 years, Florida has been and continues to be extensively researched.
[40:42] There are literally thousands of studies. If Florida at levels used in water was bad for health,
[40:48] there would be conclusive evidence by now. It just isn't there. I am concerned with the
[40:55] possibility of preemptive decision about water fluoridation and what that could
[41:00] mean for Monroe. Studies show that dental health worsens after a community
[41:04] ceases fluoridation. At a time when so many people are struggling, fluoridated
[41:09] water will help. I respectfully ask that you continue to provide mineral
[41:13] residents with optimally fluoridated water.
[41:18] I apologize, this one's hard to read.
[41:20] to potentially a last name, Dunkle, address one, West Wilson?
[41:29] OK, yes, I think so.
[41:33] Good evening.
[41:34] I'm Dr. Russ Dunkle, and I'm the Wisconsin State
[41:36] Donald Director and Chief Dental Officer
[41:38] for the State of Wisconsin, which means
[41:40] that I work for everybody in the state.
[41:42] I'm one of the few dental directors nationally
[41:44] that works in both Medicaid and public health.
[41:47] It should come as no surprise to this group
[41:49] that we are dealing in this country
[41:51] and in Wisconsin as well with an access to care problem,
[41:54] especially in dental care. There's a small percentage of people that in
[41:59] Medicaid that are unfortunately able to get the dental care they need. It's the
[42:04] mission of Wisconsin Department of Health Services to first and foremost
[42:10] protect and promote the health and safety of the people of Wisconsin. I know you've
[42:17] received a lot of reports, etc., and a lot of studies. Many are being
[42:21] contradicted, contradicted this evening. One of the things to remember is when we're
[42:26] talking about fluoride, you're hearing reports from other people saying it's
[42:30] toxic. The first rule of toxicology is that the dose makes the poison.
[42:37] Everything is toxic at some level, including water. There's a medical condition
[42:42] called hypometriumia where an individual that gets dehydrated can drink too much
[42:46] water. What happens is the kidneys get overflowed with water, it reduces the
[42:51] sodium in the body, cells increase water intake, and they burst.
[42:56] And this is a condition that can kill an individual.
[42:58] In addition, Coumadin are warfarin, which has been around for decades as a blood center,
[43:04] and has been used safely if you increase the dosage a little bit.
[43:08] It also becomes a rat poison.
[43:10] We need to put things in perspective and reality.
[43:13] We can't keep just looking at, throwing darts at things, and just assuming that this is reality.
[43:18] There have been many confounders in some of the studies that have been reported, and even
[43:23] the EPA lawsuit picked 0.7 as their standard, where in the National Toxicology report,
[43:31] it said the only considerations that they looked at was above 1.5.
[43:36] So again, where it is at 1.6, was it 3.6, that's inconclusive.
[43:41] And the studies that were reviewed, the National Academy of Science and Engineering in medicine
[43:46] and review the next national toxicology report twice.
[43:50] Each time they found confounders and issues
[43:53] with the study on the way they were reviewing the research.
[43:58] What the next national toxicology program decided to do
[44:01] is then do an internal review, which is not typically
[44:04] the way you do national scientific research.
[44:08] You have an outside peer review doing it.
[44:10] Unfortunately, they did not follow that protocol,
[44:12] which, again, questions the results that they have.
[44:16] In part, what I ask you to do is to actually look at all the science, not just one side,
[44:21] and consider all the results that we have.
[44:24] And as mentioned previously, I'm not going to go into it.
[44:26] But Florida has been proven and saved for 75 years.
[44:30] And it does work in concert with toothpaste, but differently.
[44:34] Thank you.
[44:38] Molly Norton.
[44:47] Hi, I'm Dr. Molly Norton.
[44:48] I live at 1114, 23rd Avenue in Monroe.
[44:51] I'm a lifelong resident of Monroe and mother of three.
[44:54] I'm also a dentist here at Act All Family Dentistry and have been taking care of the people in our community since 2020.
[45:00] I've drank the city water while pregnant, and furthermore give it to all three of my children daily. I'm happy to report that all three of my children are exceeding expectations both physically and cognitively. My family also uses fluoride toothpaste daily, and I recommend it for all of my patients. Fluoride concentrations are closely regulated, and far below any harmful levels. Many people will point to the warning label on toothpaste as a sign that fluoride is toxic.
[45:26] Toothpaste has 1,500 times the concentration of city water, and even still is only dangerous
[45:33] if ingested in very large quantities.
[45:36] I even went to the Poison Control website, and I filled out their e-form as if my four-year-old
[45:40] had eaten an entire tube of toothpaste.
[45:43] Their response was that it is unlikely that a significant toxicity will develop.
[45:46] You do not need to take him to the emergency room.
[45:50] In fact, if you tried to give yourself fluoride toxicity from city water, you would die from
[45:54] over-hydration just as Dr. Dunkel had explained before you reached toxic levels.
[46:00] Dose matters and the dosage in city water has been proven again and again and again to
[46:06] be safe and effective.
[46:07] If city fluoridation ended, Monroe residents would need to supplement to continue to get the
[46:12] benefits of fluoride.
[46:13] The trouble with that is that they are difficult to source, requiring a prescription, and
[46:18] more importantly, expensive.
[46:20] of the cost of a year of fluoride tablets per adult is $45.
[46:24] And for prescription toothpaste annually, it's around $165.
[46:28] That's compared to the $1 yearly cost per person for city fluoridated water.
[46:33] No other public health measure provides as much value as fluoridated city water.
[46:38] I have evaluated the evidence personally and believe strongly as both a dentist and
[46:43] a local mother that we must continue the community water fluoridation program.
[46:47] Thank you.
[46:47] Deb
[46:51] Cratiger?
[47:02] Deb Cratiger, 525-20th Avenue here in Monroe.
[47:07] Last month, a federal court ruled that Florida Nation at current U.S. levels poses an unreasonable
[47:13] risk to the IQ of children, thus ordering the EPA an act of regulation that will eliminate
[47:19] the risk.
[47:20] The deposition by aura health director Casey Hannon of the CDC admitted under oath that
[47:26] But the CDC has no safety data on fluoride and the brain.
[47:30] The fact is that CDC does not have any data on the tolerable upper fluoride intake for
[47:40] neurotoxic effects for infants.
[47:45] Yes.
[47:45] Okay.
[47:46] And you see how the definition also includes toddlers.
[47:50] So CDC does not have any data on the tolerable upper fluoride intake for neurotoxic effects
[47:55] on toddlers.
[47:56] That's true.
[47:57] Okay.
[47:57] And CDC, as you see here today, is not aware of any data in the published literature
[48:03] that would define the tolerable upper fluoride intake for neurotoxic effects on children.
[48:11] As a rep of CDC to my knowledge, we don't have any knowledge about that.
[48:16] Fluoridation proponents argue that fluoride is natural, so is arsenic and lead.
[48:21] Floral cellulosic acid is a corrosive acid captured in the air pollution control devices
[48:27] of the phosphate fertilizer and aluminum industries.
[48:31] The EPA has ruled that fluoride gases cause significant environmental harm.
[48:36] In the latest mineral water utility consumer competence report where fluoride is listed under
[48:42] the section titled Source of Contaminate, it is written, Discharge from Fertilizer and
[48:48] aluminum factories. Why are we putting this in our water? The FDA accepts that the fluoride is
[48:54] a drug. Not a nutrient went used to prevent disease. By definition, fluoridating water is a
[49:02] form of mass medication. It's a medicine. They're going to try and tell you it's not, but it is. It
[49:08] can't be bought over the counter without a prescription. Where is our informed consent? I don't have a
[49:14] title, a fancy title or a bunch of letters behind my name.
[49:18] And I'm not paid by anyone to promote anything or any organization.
[49:22] I know you all have been inundated with emails from both sides of this conversation.
[49:27] The ADA has said and I quote, there is widespread misinformation circulating online in social
[49:34] media around the community of Florida.
[49:37] The CDC urged the public to be cautious of pseudo-science misinformation.
[49:41] Are you kidding, calling the National Toxicology Program, a U.S. federal court ruling, consecutive National Institute of Health Studies.
[49:50] The Cochrane Review and countless other journals of misinformation and pseudoscience is an insult to the public.
[49:57] That's an insult to me and insult to the citizens of our society.
[50:00] Our community and insult to each and every one of you. They use their lobbying forces to come after anyone of us who want this to be a personal choice.
[50:11] Then they try to belittle us and about it. We don't have a mind to make our own health decisions. People are tired. We want to clean up our food. We want to clean up our air and we want to clean up our water. We can start right here. You can make the change. You can be the difference. A quote from anthropologist Margaret Mead.
[50:29] Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, concerned citizens can change the world.
[50:34] Indeed, it is the only way it ever has.
[50:37] Thank you.
[50:41] Emily DuVall.
[50:48] Hi.
[50:49] I'm Emily DuVall.
[50:51] I live at W675 Rothen-Bueller Road in Monroe, Wisconsin.
[50:56] I'm a registered dental hygienist, representing the dental house with 15 years of experience,
[51:01] and a mom of three here in Monroe.
[51:03] I'm going to give some quick information about how cavities form and what fluoride really
[51:07] does to help.
[51:09] Every time you take a bite or a sip of something, sugary or stardry, it lowers the pH in
[51:14] your mouth.
[51:14] Essentially your mouth becomes a more acidic environment because the bacteria living there
[51:18] use the sugars and starches for energy and the waste product of that is acid.
[51:23] The acid dissolves the minerals of your namo, forming a cavity over time.
[51:27] Fluoride strengthens the NAML by replacing lost minerals like calcium, which makes it
[51:32] more resistant to acid.
[51:35] And it interferes with the ability to produce that acid.
[51:38] Fluoride can also get incorporated into the developing tooth and NAML of kids before their
[51:42] teeth even come in, which makes them their teeth stronger and helps prevent cavities later
[51:47] in life.
[51:48] Now, in a perfect world, no one would drink soda or each sugary snacks or crackers.
[51:53] everyone would brush their teeth twice a day and floss every day. Parents would help their kids
[51:58] be thorough brushers until they have the dexterity to do it themselves, which is around age eight.
[52:04] But as much as a hygienist may wish and dream, this isn't reality. Not even for me, I love dessert.
[52:11] We all need all the help we can get to combat tooth decay. In my 15 years, I've seen Florida make a
[52:17] difference time and time again. So I truly believe safe levels in water is beneficial to everyone. I got
[52:23] in to dental hygiene to educate and help people so I needed to come here today so I can say that I
[52:29] did what I could to keep fluoride in the water in Monroe because if it gets taken out I know what
[52:34] I'm going to see and it won't be good.
[52:40] Cold of all.
[52:48] Hi I'm cold of all I live at W6785 Roth and
[52:52] Bueller Road Monroe, Wisconsin. I have three kids that go to school in Monroe and three nephews and
[52:59] niece that live in the town and regularly benefit from fluoride in the water. I grew
[53:05] up on fluoridated water and until we moved out in the country my kids did too. I know
[53:11] we all reap the benefits of it so when we moved out to the country we got the kids on
[53:17] fluoride supplements. Speaking of which was not covered by my insurance and thankfully we
[53:22] had the means to pay for it. Supplements are not the ideal solution here. They weren't
[53:27] cheap it was an occasional battle to get our youngest to take them and just
[53:32] remembering to do it regularly is a challenge and we're a family that was
[53:37] strong dental hygiene habits having fluoride in the water is a great way for
[53:42] people especially children who aren't as good at taking care of their teeth to
[53:47] get some protection and I just want to say I can buy fluoride over the counter via
[53:53] toothpaste. I know it's not the same as what gets put in our water, but I can buy it.
[54:01] Prescriptions, the reason that you need a prescription for it, is because it's such
[54:06] a concentrated amount. They need to make sure that you get the right levels just like
[54:10] we get in our waters. So, our prescription that we had, we had to test our water to see
[54:16] what was naturally occurring, and then our doctor prescribed the difference. So we were
[54:21] at the .7 level, which is why you need a prescription,
[54:26] and you can't just buy it over the counter,
[54:27] because then you can reach the toxic amounts.
[54:30] So please keep that in mind.
[54:32] And also, fluoride is a natural occurring mineral,
[54:36] not a chemical.
[54:38] So that being said, I trust my dental professionals,
[54:42] and they are all in support of fluoride staying in the water.
[54:45] I hope the council listens to them
[54:47] and doesn't make a quick decision to have it removed,
[54:50] because this is a big decision with consequences for everyone who lives in Monroe.
[54:55] Thank you.
[54:58] Amanda Fields.
[55:07] Give me a break from getting my hair done.
[55:11] Amanda Fields, 2036, Lincoln, Row and Monroe. As a young
[55:17] mother, people told me, no better, do better, no better, no better, do better, and I have yet
[55:28] to hear anything that has told me removing fluoride is the right choice. What I have heard is from
[55:38] professionals that I trust that keeping fluoride in our water is a good thing. If I can be shown
[55:46] information that says this is something that will benefit everyone, I'd be happy to rethink that,
[55:54] But at this time, that's not something I feel I have been presented with.
[55:59] And I believe that this really needs to be looked at more in depth than,
[56:07] you know, the past few weeks have given the council time to do since this has become a topic for discussion and decision.
[56:17] Thank you.
[56:23] Hello,
[56:30] my name is Rohan Warden and I'm the public health officer for Green County as the public health officer my role is to protect and promote the health and safety of all of the Green County residents.
[56:44] It was about 15 years ago that the Green County Healthy Community Coalition, the Green County Public Health, and our many health and dental care partners identified oral health care for children and adults as a priority health need for this county.
[57:02] Back then, the Fowler Dental Clinic was founded to help address this major priority health
[57:09] need.
[57:10] And you've already heard from Dr. Agnes, who served as that dental provider with the
[57:17] free Fowler Dental Clinic.
[57:19] Tooth decay remains the most common childhood chronic disease, and it is preventable.
[57:25] In Wisconsin, one out of every five children have untreated decay.
[57:31] We know that community water fluoridation is safe, effective, and is one of the most
[57:37] equitable ways for reducing the burden of oral disease for all of our residents.
[57:42] Studies have shown that community water fluoridation reduces cavities by 25% in children and adults.
[57:50] Adding fluoride to drinking water is like adding vitamin D to milk or phylic acid to
[57:58] breads and cereals.
[58:00] We know that fluoride benefits people of all ages and community water fluoridation helps
[58:06] address a large disparity in access to oral health care based on people's income, their race
[58:12] and ethnicity.
[58:14] The CDC for Disease Control and Prevention have identified fluoridation of community
[58:20] Under the water is one of the most significant public health advances of the 20th century
[58:25] and one of the safest most cost-effective ways to increase oral health.
[58:31] Two minutes.
[58:33] Based on the city of Monroe's population, it is projected to save the city 345,000 per year
[58:42] on dental care for families.
[58:43] Communities can save $20 for every $1 invested in community water fluoridation.
[58:52] After careful consideration and review of the scientific literature, there is more than
[58:57] 125 national and international health service professional organizations that recognize the
[59:06] public health benefits of fluoridation.
[59:08] These include the American Public Health Association, the American and Wisconsin Dental Association,
[59:15] the American Medical Association, Wisconsin chapter of the Academy of Pediatrics, Wisconsin
[59:21] Academy of Family Physicians, also supports community water fluoridation as recommended
[59:27] by the World Health Organization.
[59:30] If you could wrap up please.
[59:31] So thank you.
[59:33] Thank you.
[59:37] Jim Kershaw.
[59:38] I'm
[59:43] Jim Kershaw, Superintendent of the Bismarck North Dakota Water treatment plant, 615 River Road.
[59:49] I've got 40 years of experience here. I've worked with Floridaite for all those years.
[59:55] Florian gas, wavelengths and lime are far worse than anything I've ever done with.
[1:00:00] All right. But housekeeping and venting our essential. I didn't know about the health oral health
[1:00:07] benefits of community water, Florida, or CWF, until we looked at stopping in 2018. The
[1:00:13] reason we thought about stopping was because we had a new mayor and two new commissioners
[1:00:17] and they wanted to cut buckets. I said, what about the $40,000 a year that we've spent on
[1:00:22] Florida. I've learned a lot since then. Not counting electricity $40,000 is about 1.6% of our total
[1:00:29] treatment costs that we spend for a year. After talking with public health professionals at the
[1:00:34] local state and national level and reading the research that both supports and opposes CWF,
[1:00:41] we decided that the 50 cents to a dollar per customer is far cheaper than the oral health cost
[1:00:46] that are 80,000 customers with baby Janice,
[1:00:50] which can average $20 to $40 per person per year.
[1:00:53] For us, that translates to $1.6 million to $3.2 million.
[1:00:59] CWS is especially beneficial to the under-fill
[1:01:02] which is a California proper dental care.
[1:01:04] It doesn't discriminate.
[1:01:07] And up here in North Dakota, I recently talked to a Janice
[1:01:09] in a rural area and she told me that she could tell
[1:01:12] by looking in the malls which ones were on well water
[1:01:15] and which ones came from Florida to town.
[1:01:17] Now I grew up on well water and my key suffered.
[1:01:20] I used to fear and hate dentists.
[1:01:23] Now I respect them.
[1:01:24] Because one thing that surprised me is
[1:01:26] that most dentists support community water
[1:01:28] for radiation, which is something
[1:01:29] that would cost them money earned
[1:01:31] from extra services, that fact alone.
[1:01:34] I'm afraid to mean that they are truly public
[1:01:36] health oriented and not just out to make dollars.
[1:01:40] Water operators are also public health oriented.
[1:01:42] Some say that Florida is the only thing
[1:01:44] we add for health reasons. Why I'd like to say that chlorination and corrosion control
[1:01:49] treatment that it used to provide a safe coating for service lines in the distribution
[1:01:53] setting system are also a couple things we do to provide public health benefits. The
[1:01:58] additive use for fluorination is no different than the naturally occurring fluoride that is
[1:02:02] found in all water. Fluoride has been in the water since the beginning of time and CWS has
[1:02:07] been practiced for 76 years. I would think that if it caught serious issues it would have
[1:02:12] been heavily regulated many years ago.
[1:02:15] EPA regulates things down to the parts per billion
[1:02:17] and even parts per trillion.
[1:02:20] We do UCMR testing every three years
[1:02:23] where any contaminants they suspect
[1:02:25] could be a potential hazard that we have to test for.
[1:02:29] At 0.7, there's never been any proof of causes or harm.
[1:02:34] All water has fluoride in it.
[1:02:36] The natural level can be anywhere from 0.1
[1:02:38] to over the MCL of four parts per million.
[1:02:41] some natural fluoride systems can be higher than the 0.7.
[1:02:45] 10% out of you being added.
[1:02:46] 10 rep up please.
[1:02:47] As they are by lawful to us.
[1:02:50] Has there any benefit in the small towns that lower IQ is happening?
[1:02:57] Current science has proven that 0.7 parts of the unit is optimal.
[1:03:01] To put it in perspective, 0.7 parts of the unit is equal to 1H
[1:03:06] 23 miles one minute and a thousand days and one set and 14 thousand dollars. Thank you for your time.
[1:03:19] Dr. Johnny Johnson.
[1:03:23] Good evening. Thanks for allowing me to speak to these folks tonight. I'm a pediatric
[1:03:28] dentist and my wife is from Wisconsin. I pulled her out from Edgerton and moved Florida with me
[1:03:35] several years ago. You've heard a lot of testimony tonight about why we are poor business people as
[1:03:41] Dennis. It is because Ford, because cavities are a infectious and transmissible disease.
[1:03:49] We don't have anything that we can do to reach outside the bloodstream to stop the bacterial
[1:03:55] plaque from causing decay on your teeth. There's no way. If there wasn't any vaccine against
[1:04:02] it, we would be out of business. Would I find other things to do? We can vet you, but that's
[1:04:09] not half the people still abuse their mouth. One of the biggest things that I have heard
[1:04:15] that adults really benefit. I'm 68 and a lot of the folks around the room, myself here,
[1:04:24] as we get older, we know that our guns begin to receive. One of the places that Florida
[1:04:30] really helps us as we age and those that are in long-term care facilities, so on and so
[1:04:37] for it as we get more of our roots exposed. There's softer areas there than there are on the
[1:04:44] chewing surfaces of our teeth. They get cavities very easily because it's softer and you can't wrap
[1:04:50] around the back of a molar root to get in there and clean it so you get a cavity. Well we're good
[1:04:56] But what we do, but we can't wrap around the back without falling your-
[1:05:02] We're going to follow out. One of the biggest reasons why we lose our teeth is adults is because of root surface cavities, and we have to take those teeth out, which is tragic. Florida didn't want to help adults. I say more than it does kids, and I'm a pediatric dentist. And if you think about it, we are adults who will show the impact of cavities faster.
[1:05:27] Two minutes. You had a minute. Okay. Thank you.
[1:05:32] We absolutely benefit as adults also.
[1:05:35] Couple of bookies because I know you've gotten emails and my name has been mentioned. I've seen some
[1:05:40] of them sit forward. There are there's a give
[1:05:51] out there. I know one of the attorneys I could see is
[1:05:54] on the call tonight. Probably group is
[1:05:59] not stated
[1:06:05] in a hundred and
[1:06:11] there's never
[1:06:12] Air
[1:06:25] National toxicology program.
[1:06:45] Time to wrap up other gentlemen.
[1:06:54] We asked our PDs here
[1:06:57] And he asked me, he looked at me and said, Johnny, how would you ask,
[1:07:03] do you got a point?
[1:07:05] And I looked at him and I said, you know, why would I not trust you?
[1:07:07] I trust you with my baby.
[1:07:09] Over 60,000 American Academy of Pediatric Pediatricians stand behind water fluorination.
[1:07:15] Four million nurses stand behind it.
[1:07:18] Not a single credible scientific organization or health care group in the world opposed it
[1:07:24] for
[1:07:27] the health of yourselves.
[1:07:34] Linda Jockensen,
[1:07:40] can you hear me?
[1:07:41] I'm
[1:07:45] Linda Jorgensen. I'm speaking on behalf of the Wisconsin-Dental
[1:07:49] Hygiene Association. I'm a member of that association of a dental hygienist.
[1:07:55] I don't live in Monroe. I'm way over in Western Wisconsin, River Falls,
[1:07:59] Hello. But so many people have already made several of the claims that I was
[1:08:05] going to say and I love hearing what you all have said. I'm just going to read a
[1:08:11] a comment about the city of Antigo in Wisconsin that did consider removing
[1:08:20] fluoride from its water a few years, many years ago. In fact, Antigo
[1:08:24] Wisconsin began fluoridating its water supply in 1949, but it stopped in
[1:08:30] 1960 after a referendum passed to repeal the program. Antigo citizens voted to
[1:08:38] repeal fluoridation after an anti-pluridation group
[1:08:42] campaigned and claimed that fluoride was toxic,
[1:08:45] even in small amounts.
[1:08:46] And that was in 1950, I was really little at that time.
[1:08:52] After fluoridation was stopped, dental decay increased
[1:08:56] dramatically among children in antigoals.
[1:09:00] Kindergarten children had a 92% increase in tooth decay.
[1:09:05] 2nd graders had an 183% increase in decay and 4th graders had a 41% increase in 2st decay.
[1:09:16] After seeing the decline in their children's dental health,
[1:09:20] antigo citizens voted to reinstate water fluoridation in 1965.
[1:09:26] Goraid is effective at preventing 2st decay and that's my main comment.
[1:09:33] And you could make the decision to discontinue, but thank goodness, two minutes.
[1:09:40] Oh, it's really, okay, dental hygienists are all about prevention.
[1:09:45] Most of what we do as healthcare providers is try to prevent those preventable diseases,
[1:09:53] tooth decay being one, periodontal disease, we talk about oral cancer and injuries.
[1:09:58] So, we are about...
[1:10:00] This continuing floor in your water would do the exact opposite of that. It would move the needle in the wrong direction. And I urge you to continue floor it into your water, fix your equipment, maintain it. And thank you so much for hearing my testimony.
[1:10:25] Thank
[1:10:28] you very much for calling me. I live even further away. I live in a city of leads in Yorkshire and England. I am a dentist but I really wanted to join this to support my clinical colleagues because I've been in academia as a dental epidemiologist.
[1:10:52] And indeed, part of my career was carried out in Birmingham, the second largest city in
[1:10:59] England, which has been fluoridated for quite a long time now. And I carried out a major
[1:11:07] study looking at the effects of water fluoridation in that city. And mention some of the things
[1:11:17] on your website mentions the Cochran Systematic Reviews. I have to say that they had very,
[1:11:26] very tight criteria in the studies they would accept. So much so that in fact the American
[1:11:33] Academy of Pediatrics said that they ignored 97 percent of all the evidence on water
[1:11:40] of fluoridation. However, that being said, they accepted my two major studies as satisfying
[1:11:49] their tights criteria, and those studies show very clearly the benefits of water fluoridation.
[1:11:57] And people will say, well, we've got it in the toothpaste, why do we need it in the water?
[1:12:03] The major effect, the big effect, is if you have it in the toothpaste and in the water,
[1:12:09] it's not either or, it's getting it from both sources and I just want to say
[1:12:16] something about the claims of affecting health. I noticed that on their
[1:12:23] website one of the emails lists 16 conditions said to be caused by
[1:12:29] water fluoridation. I have to say two minutes without being too much about your
[1:12:35] correspondent, that is Nonson. Listen to your own public health
[1:12:41] advisers, your own local advisers. They live in your community, they drink the
[1:12:48] fluoridated water, their families drink the fluoridated water, and I don't
[1:12:53] think they would be supporting it if they thought that their own kids were
[1:12:57] going to suffer from having fluoridated water. So listen to what they say, they
[1:13:04] will have looked at all the evidence, they will tell you that it is not harmful, it doesn't
[1:13:10] cause the conditions which have been alleged and that you should continue with the border
[1:13:18] prioritisation in your city. And I thank you again for allowing me as someone from overseas
[1:13:26] in making the contribution to your discussion. Thank you.
[1:13:31] That
[1:13:35] is everyone that I have signed up.
[1:13:50] At this time, the public hearing, since there's no more to be heard, the public hearing
[1:13:56] is closed, so do we have to vote on that?
[1:13:59] No.
[1:14:00] No.
[1:14:01] And this means that the council's not going to deliberate the discuss that they can do a
[1:14:05] ram of options, but no more public comment, this that we've heard from that, now it's
[1:14:14] the council of discuss.
[1:14:17] I'll go and start off comments a little history my wife and her sisters grew up in
[1:14:24] towns with fluoride great teeth my two sons grew up in fluoride fluoride water
[1:14:31] great teeth my brother's and I grew up in town without fluoride water and as
[1:14:37] doctor act all knows I've got enough money in my mouth I can buy a car I'm a
[1:14:44] freaking flyer there so yeah it's my background is engineering industrial engineer
[1:14:51] for years and with my training and experience I look at all the all the I don't
[1:14:58] We're blinders to look at all the abs.
[1:15:01] You can go on the internet and find whatever you want. You can come up with a good theory for it. Yes, some aren't true, but as I was taught, a good leader has good people working for them. With all the medical people that are saying fluoride is good, and there's some people saying it's not, but the medical people are the ones that know the information.
[1:15:29] and they've done the studies and I would much rather go with them until they are convinced
[1:15:37] that fluoride is bad, I'm going to be voting to keep fluoride in the water.
[1:15:42] Thank you.
[1:15:43] I
[1:15:47] had a have a question and I don't know if it's me or if other council members feel this
[1:15:54] way but it seems kind of like a steam roller coming at us as far as how quickly this came
[1:16:02] up. And again, maybe it's just me, but from my going back through the agenda, it seems
[1:16:11] like this issue first came to Board of Public Works about the end of September, September
[1:16:18] 23rd is it? No, it must have been after that. Yeah, September 23rd. And the letter that
[1:16:25] superintendent, Kinnison, and closed said he was contacted by citizens in the community
[1:16:32] and there was one letter attached. So I guess I'm wondering how much of a public cry
[1:16:40] to eliminate fluoride is there really because based on, you know, we had a couple speaking
[1:16:47] against and we had letters against, but what is the background on how this came to be
[1:16:52] an issue if somebody could answer that because this is the first, the past month is the
[1:16:57] first I've heard of it and suddenly it's like, I think earlier this spring I'll speak
[1:17:02] to that as the mayor I was contacted and there were several people, there was one individual,
[1:17:11] he was present tonight or is present tonight but he kept calling and then I got a few more
[1:17:17] calls. And then at that point I felt that it was important. I did call the way I called
[1:17:25] our administrator down at the wastewater treatment plant and the public works of Mike
[1:17:33] Kennisin and he said you know it didn't make any difference to him but he supplied us
[1:17:38] with all of the information that we needed. And I felt that it was important that we bring
[1:17:43] it to the public and let you decide the majority and then we could make a decision based
[1:17:53] on what the input was from the community and it was early on that that happened.
[1:18:01] So it was something that I did bring to the attention.
[1:18:07] That's fine.
[1:18:08] I was just kind of curious because it seemed like it just popped up but sometimes things
[1:18:14] It was simmering, it didn't come to it.
[1:18:18] I had until now to bring it to the council for consideration.
[1:18:25] I have a couple questions from Mr. Tennyson,
[1:18:28] the possibly come up here.
[1:18:33] So I got the Bill O'Lean lady sitting here in front of me
[1:18:36] of what we add to our water from this, is it Mark Tell?
[1:18:41] Yeah, Mark Tell water out of Jamesville.
[1:18:43] Yep. Do you know where they get it from?
[1:18:45] They have a distributor that they get it from, I'm not aware of who they, I think they have multiple suppliers.
[1:18:51] Okay, so I got one here from Panko and I'm just going to talk about the, so it is a naturally occurring mineral.
[1:18:59] What is it in our water right now before we add anything?
[1:19:04] We tested well number five and it is .2.
[1:19:07] Okay, what do you think the average is then in town?
[1:19:10] 2, 3, 1 and 2, which we have 1 and 2, okay.
[1:19:15] So this is the company we get our stuff from, the acid that we put in our water.
[1:19:21] It has 1.039 parts per million of arsenic in it.
[1:19:29] Last time I looked, arsenic is not good for anything in our water or anything that you would
[1:19:37] consume, your kids would consume, your animals would consume.
[1:19:43] That's one of the
[1:19:44] companies that provides us to communities throughout the country. The next is
[1:19:49] Free Acid 0.40% specific gravity 1.216 at 66. Heavy metals is also in there.
[1:20:00] I mean, look what 3M did to the water, I mean, PFASD, you're never getting rid of that. I'm a firm believer what happened in the 50s or 60s is not current today. Lead service line replacement. We're doing that throughout the community because back then, lead lines are good. No, they're not. You know, this is, yes, it occurs naturally. What is being supplemented in our water comes from a company with a bill relating with the ingredients.
[1:20:29] and that is not a mineral that you pull out of the ground, it is subsidized, it is processed,
[1:20:35] it is dumped in the water, and people need to have a choice.
[1:20:40] People that don't want it,
[1:20:43] you know, people that want it, but everybody needs to have a choice
[1:20:47] and just putting it in and then telling one person like, you can drink bottled water or
[1:20:51] not drink the water, or you can take medication, least they have a choice.
[1:20:56] If we don't give the people a choice, then this is not a free society.
[1:21:09] Well, I'm not exactly sure how we give people a choice on a municipal service.
[1:21:15] If they're not comfortable with our water supply, I mean, we can't say here's tap A and here's tap B.
[1:21:23] This one has flour. I think this one doesn't. I mean, they either choose to live in the narrow and drink the tap water.
[1:21:28] They can live here and not drink the tap water or they can leave the narrow.
[1:21:31] those are your choices. I mean, can I just remind all there's that we're
[1:21:41] going to give each one of you a chance to speak and then if you have any
[1:21:45] rebuttal it will be after each one of you have had input. Okay, so thank you.
[1:21:52] I have a question as long as Mike is up there.
[1:21:56] The DNR is getting really strict on
[1:21:58] what we can expel out of our treatment plant, put into the water. Do they have a level
[1:22:04] of fluoride that we can expel a non-cook creek? No, there is no limit as of now for what
[1:22:10] we can discharge into the creek from the wastewater treatment plant.
[1:22:14] Okay.
[1:22:17] I have a lot of talking points here. I don't know how you want me to do this. Do
[1:22:21] them all at once, or.
[1:22:25] And am I able to question the professionals in the house, the doctors
[1:22:30] or not?
[1:22:32] That's up to the mayor.
[1:22:33] The mayor wants to let.
[1:22:35] It's called a point of information.
[1:22:36] If the mayor wants to hear a point of information,
[1:22:38] then she can do that.
[1:22:45] Well, before I get into that, I guess.
[1:22:48] I think the people that wanted to speak have spoken.
[1:22:54] And so at this point, I just assume that you present
[1:22:59] what you want to present.
[1:23:02] Okay.
[1:23:02] Okay, what we heard tonight, I think, was narrow-minded, short-sighted, whatever you want
[1:23:08] to say.
[1:23:09] They were talking about teeth, but there's so many other things, and you talk about
[1:23:13] professionals.
[1:23:14] My wife has a dental degree.
[1:23:16] I went to dental conventions.
[1:23:18] I know a fluoride industry is a billion-dollar industry.
[1:23:22] I enjoyed a lot of their wine, and in Dynan, down in St. Louis, Disney, we had a whole park
[1:23:28] to ourselves.
[1:23:31] There's a lot of money in it and they give a lot of freebies out and stuff.
[1:23:35] My wife would not allow our kids to have 4-8, 4-8 on their teeth.
[1:23:42] She would not add it.
[1:23:43] We drink distilled or purified water all our lives.
[1:23:47] My dad knew as a kid or when I was a kid that with all the chemicals going in the ground
[1:23:53] and I mean at the county we're trying to clean up water.
[1:23:56] We don't want all those things in there.
[1:24:00] So we've drank clean water, and to Tom's thing,
[1:24:03] I mean, we could go back and forth all day.
[1:24:05] My kids did not have a lot of cavities.
[1:24:07] We did not have huge dental bills.
[1:24:10] So they didn't have fluoride, and they were fine.
[1:24:14] There's a lot of new data and research and these lawsuits.
[1:24:18] And I just hear the dental community discrediting them.
[1:24:22] I understand you don't want to bite the hand that feeds you,
[1:24:25] But if there's even a small chance that this is harmful to our health,
[1:24:32] I don't know why the citizens of Monroe cannot have a choice.
[1:24:37] I mean, like Mary Jane said, we don't have tap A, tap B.
[1:24:42] And you say, well, the less unfortunate.
[1:24:45] I know a mother with three little kids.
[1:24:49] She's like, what do I do?
[1:24:51] Do I get an RO thing?
[1:24:53] she they can't afford that I mean I when I looked at my wife said down at Walmart and I look
[1:25:00] Act fluoride rents, you can get. And from what I understand, it's topical on your tooth, not ingesting fluoride that helps.
[1:25:13] So, choices, I think the big thing is choices here. And I don't know if I could ask the audience, and probably I can't, but do you believe the citizens of Monroe should have a choice or just be?
[1:25:28] you're getting the fluoride, whether you like it or not.
[1:25:32] Because when I go to the doctor, I have to sign a consent for a medical, and this seems
[1:25:37] like a medical thing, it's to prevent tooth decay, and maybe it does.
[1:25:43] There's both sides of that.
[1:25:45] You can, you said, yeah, you can find arguments on both sides, yeah, we can.
[1:25:49] Then I can find Dennis that are against it.
[1:25:52] In fact, one of the emails was from a dentist against it.
[1:26:00] And the doctors, there was an MD.
[1:26:02] I listened to an hour-long program today, and he warned about the dangers of fluoride.
[1:26:12] One size fits all is kind of what we're doing, and I think it should be between me and my
[1:26:16] dental, professional, how much fluoride I'm intaking. I'm also wasn't mentioned, and
[1:26:24] I think even the fluoride society says that infants should not have that fluoride mix
[1:26:30] with their formula and stuff. And what do you do with the mothers that can't afford water
[1:26:36] that's unfloridated? They can't go to an R.O. machine or whatever. I guess yeah, they can
[1:26:42] and move out of the city of Monroe,
[1:26:44] or by bottled water, I guess is what we're hearing,
[1:26:47] but in a day and age, it's always my body, my choice,
[1:26:52] but in this, it's like, no, you're doing this.
[1:26:55] And then where do we stop?
[1:26:59] Magnesium, most kids are lacking in magnesium.
[1:27:02] Do we start pumping magnesium in the water?
[1:27:06] What else do we pump in?
[1:27:07] I mean, vitamins?
[1:27:10] I, and the beer and the cheese industries, I mean, do they want fluoride in their water?
[1:27:16] I heard that some companies are starting a maybe market non-fluoridated soda or whatever
[1:27:22] you know, because people don't want fluoride, many people don't.
[1:27:27] And I think the city could take the savings if people really wanted them by some act of fluoride
[1:27:33] ignorance and if we're going to have to have it for the children that are less fortunate.
[1:27:42] I guess my list of questions I had and then I guess I'm not supposed to ask, does one
[1:27:47] dosage fit everyone regardless of diet, etc. What about people with dentures? Do they need
[1:27:53] fluoride? What about those that have allergies to fluoride? What are the side effects I didn't
[1:28:00] or anything about side effects today, we know there's side effects.
[1:28:04] As many of you know, I have a birth defect with a hole in my heart, but they said if I
[1:28:10] had been taken aspirin, I probably could have prevented it, and I don't think everybody
[1:28:15] should take an aspirin.
[1:28:17] I think you should consult your doctor, but then I had one doctor say, well, you can get
[1:28:22] ulcers from that, so it's like, at some point I need to be the one making the choice for
[1:28:28] my body and with my health professional I believe not just you're getting it whether you want
[1:28:34] it or not. It's not safe from what I understand for infants to drink fluoridated water and I
[1:28:41] don't think anybody hears a license toxicologist.
[1:28:47] I guess what do we expect when we turn on our
[1:28:50] tap. I think we want water, just clean water, not medicine, not medication, so.
[1:28:57] Okay, I appreciate your comments, older tool, in the essence of time so that we can get
[1:29:05] input from each one of the elders. Can we move on? And yeah, we can hack
[1:29:17] from the
[1:29:24] in a full city council room and clearly there are passions on both sides of the debate and
[1:29:33] spending an hour and a half here with us is probably not what you want to be doing on
[1:29:36] Monday night, but here we are. I'm going to circle back to something at times that I'm
[1:29:43] Okay, cool.
[1:29:51] How's that? Okay.
[1:29:56] Okay. Circle back to something.
[1:30:00] That time, older Miller said earlier about just
[1:30:09] having a torrentive information and being expected to, you know, sift through quite a bit of highly scientific information that we're typically not used to reading. And I'm good at a lot of things but I'm not necessarily good at reading scientific papers. And I also am pretty good at relying on experts.
[1:30:35] and officials who are educated and have devoted their entire lives to these endeavors.
[1:30:41] So I'm certainly, I came into this debate with an open mind.
[1:30:49] I kind of went back and forth a couple times and I've landed firmly on the side of continuing
[1:30:56] the fluoridation and the water because of the outpouring of support from the local professionals
[1:31:01] who clearly care about the community and one other, there was one I think I wanted to mention.
[1:31:13] Well, it's an ask. It's an ask of those same professionals to pay attention to the research
[1:31:18] and the, because I would imagine there's going to be more research coming out as this issue
[1:31:23] becomes a touch point in communities throughout, throughout the country.
[1:31:29] that if the guidance does change that you let us know what we need to do to make
[1:31:35] adjustments going forward. So thank you.
[1:31:45] Alder Warton-Royer? I
[1:31:57] have a few thoughts as well. I do feel like it's a bit
[1:32:04] of a steam roller or trying to drink water from a fire hose. I'm actually shocked
[1:32:13] to add the amount of people that have come out so quickly and so vehemently in favor
[1:32:22] of fluoride, and I do believe there are two sides to the issue, and I here trust the
[1:32:33] science, and I believe the science on both sides has people that are sincere and want
[1:32:41] the best for communities and for community health.
[1:32:50] Like I said, I do feel like it's a lot of
[1:32:53] information and one of the things I heard a lot about almost more stood out more to me than the
[1:33:05] fluoride was the access to dental care and I know that's been since my children were small and
[1:33:13] And that was more than 20 years ago.
[1:33:16] So I think it might be who wants to look at what we can do to create better access to
[1:33:23] dental care for all of our communities.
[1:33:27] I know it's not just in Monroe that that affects people.
[1:33:33] So I saw that.
[1:33:35] I wondered about the dose, the dose of fluoride has been talked about a lot, and the .7 parts
[1:33:47] per million is what is in the water, and I thought about, I think someone else mentioned
[1:33:55] it as well, we bathe in it, we shower in it, we wash our hands, we use it for cooking,
[1:34:04] our
[1:34:04] For everything we cook, does that add up?
[1:34:09] I don't know.
[1:34:10] Has there been any?
[1:34:11] I don't know.
[1:34:11] I don't have the answer to that.
[1:34:13] Does that?
[1:34:13] How much is too much?
[1:34:15] How do we know how much is too much?
[1:34:17] How do we know how much each child or each person is getting when it's used in everything?
[1:34:31] I know that we are also bombarded with toxins in our environment everywhere in the air,
[1:34:39] in the water, in our food supply, the things we eat and drink, and the places we choose to go.
[1:34:45] I feel like we have our bodies are overloaded with toxins and we need to address the toxic burden
[1:34:51] on our bodies,
[1:34:56] and so I think it's okay to...
[1:35:00] Put a pause on the fluoride treatment of our water, while maybe more studies are done, and maybe more things will show up that will help us. And in the meantime, I would vote to put a pause on putting fluoride in a water supply. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Elder Orton, and moving on to older Cleveland. In an effort to be efficient,
[1:35:29] I have written down my thoughts so I don't miss anything.
[1:35:33] I want to think those who have come out today to talk as well as think those who took the
[1:35:37] time to email their input.
[1:35:40] I've looked at all the letters and resources and to the City Council as well as reviewed
[1:35:45] the suit ruled against the EPA and I've done additional research.
[1:35:49] I'm not a scientist nor a dentist but as a city alder I need to look at what's best for
[1:35:54] all Monroe City residents and I think it comes down to three things.
[1:35:58] effectiveness, safety, and ethics.
[1:36:01] There's no doubt that topical fluoride is effective
[1:36:05] in fighting tooth decay.
[1:36:07] We have seen a decrease in dental disease
[1:36:09] since the addition of fluoride to toothpaste in the 1950s.
[1:36:13] As well as now, we have mouthwashes,
[1:36:16] fluoride burnish for teeth and teeth sealants.
[1:36:20] However, reports on the decrease in cavities
[1:36:23] from ingested fluoride via the water supply
[1:36:26] range widely with initial reports back in the 1960s saying that there's a 60% decrease in
[1:36:33] cavities, and then the number changed to, well, now there's a 30% decrease, and now
[1:36:38] more recently, there's been documentation that shows a 15% decrease or lower in some
[1:36:44] studies from drinking fluoridated water. So one wonders how effective ingesting the
[1:36:49] fluoride really is. The second thing, safety. Although the recommended amount of hydrofluoric
[1:36:55] acid in the water supply has decreased over time. Is this 0.7 parts per million a safe
[1:37:02] women in today's world from little babies to pregnant women to older adults with various
[1:37:08] lifestyles? We now have fluoride in many processed foods, some bottled water, even baby food,
[1:37:17] powder baby formula when adding fluorinated water, soft drinks, juices, tea, some pharmaceuticals,
[1:37:24] as well as the water we cook in and has mentioned,
[1:37:27] I even think of, bathing, et cetera.
[1:37:29] Then there are other claims of a multitude of health problems
[1:37:34] from long-term ingested fluoride ranging from decreased IQ,
[1:37:39] from exposure in the womb to ADHD to cancer.
[1:37:42] I've read in multiple legislative recommendations
[1:37:49] and journals that more studies really need to be done
[1:37:53] to determine the long-term safety effects, which I haven't heard anybody mention here today.
[1:37:59] And lastly, ethics.
[1:38:00] If a person can only get fluoride supplements with a doctor's prescription, not over the
[1:38:05] counter, then it is considered a medication.
[1:38:08] Yet, we distribute this medication via the water supply to the entire city without residences
[1:38:14] consent.
[1:38:15] Plus, with effectiveness and safety concerns, this does not seem right to me.
[1:38:19] As on the side, the nonprofit organization,
[1:38:24] bridging brighter smiles, offers a variety of services
[1:38:27] for Monroe School District students, 4K through grade 12.
[1:38:33] Parents fill out an authorization form
[1:38:35] which can include oral screenings, dental cleanings,
[1:38:39] fluoride varnish, dental sealants,
[1:38:42] dental health education, and referral assistance.
[1:38:45] They accept badger care and have a place on the application
[1:38:48] to list if one does not have insurance.
[1:38:51] Services are provided to students
[1:38:53] up to three times per year
[1:38:55] as the parent indicates that they want.
[1:38:58] In closing, I know our water department does an excellent job
[1:39:01] following the current recommended amount of fluidization
[1:39:04] in our city water.
[1:39:06] And even though the federal judge
[1:39:08] in the California ruling did not state water fluidization
[1:39:13] should be banned, he did write that it quote presents
[1:39:17] an unreasonable risk of injury to health or the environment and
[1:39:22] quote because of these this and these three concerns that I've listed, I feel
[1:39:28] that the city should stop adding hydrovaloric acid to our water supply until
[1:39:34] further information on safety can be provided.
[1:39:37] Thank
[1:39:41] you all to Cleveland and moving on to yeah well
[1:39:52] first of all thank you
[1:39:56] for everyone for coming and I really appreciate
[1:40:00] All the opinions in this room. I am a product of having not floridated water growing up and I suffered the consequences of that. I have children and grandchildren who have had floridated water with wonderful teeth. I'm sure some people will say that's coincidence. I believe in the science. I think we have heard from the science community.
[1:40:29] me to tonight. I believe one of the other person said something about they weren't a tax
[1:40:37] ecologist. I believe we heard from a tax ecologist tonight. I support the science. I'm not
[1:40:47] qualified to not support the science because that's what I trust. I do know that there are
[1:40:58] studies out there to refute just about anything you believe in. So I believe there
[1:41:06] are studies out there that will say this is not good. You can find a study out
[1:41:11] there to say that you know your shampoo is going to make your hair fall out. There's
[1:41:16] just like so many studies. You could create some fear and which would drive
[1:41:25] people to make decisions. I make decisions on the science and I make decisions for what's good
[1:41:32] of the children of this town. And supplements, a lot of people can't even afford to go to the doctor.
[1:41:42] They can't afford to go to the dentist. And I highly doubt we're going to supply them all with
[1:41:48] Oral Rinses, that's not realistic.
[1:41:51] So we have to do what we can to help the children
[1:41:55] of this community.
[1:41:57] And so I would not be doing my job
[1:41:59] if I turned my back on that, I believe
[1:42:04] in the children of this community.
[1:42:06] And you know, I am getting old, like the one doctor said,
[1:42:10] I want to protect my teeth too.
[1:42:13] So what's left of them?
[1:42:15] So, I am going to support the science, I will be voting to keep the Florida and the water.
[1:42:23] I do trust our water department to keep us safe and not go above the loud limits.
[1:42:30] And one thing that struck me is someone said, well, I don't hear anyone opposing putting
[1:42:36] more vitamin D in milk or fully acid in bread.
[1:42:41] That kind of struck me because that is a supplement that's a naturally occurring supplement
[1:42:48] that we add for our health benefits.
[1:42:51] And we're doing the same with fluoride.
[1:42:56] I urge everyone to think twice before not
[1:43:03] listening to science and drawing their own conclusions.
[1:43:07] and I urge everyone to think about the children who can't afford to go to the doctor or the
[1:43:16] parents that can't take the time off or don't have health insurance or they just don't have
[1:43:25] the means and the kids that are on state aid or some Medicare to go to the dentist have you ever
[1:43:33] tried to find a dentist that accepts those benefits. They're not around here and you have to
[1:43:40] drive hours to go there. So I am just a firm believer in the Children Monroe and I will support
[1:43:48] keeping fluoride in the water.
[1:43:52] Thank you. All right. Okay. Okay. And okay. And all they're
[1:44:01] Oh, thanks.
[1:44:02] I'm going to keep it short, sweet.
[1:44:04] I thank every one of you guys being here.
[1:44:08] I respect every one of you for your voices.
[1:44:13] I grew up, none, well water.
[1:44:17] What I was taught is how to properly brush my teeth,
[1:44:21] how to properly take care of my mouth.
[1:44:23] I think that's a bigger problem we have in the society
[1:44:26] than our fluorine or water.
[1:44:30] Do I say it helps?
[1:44:32] I do believe the science but I also believe in choices
[1:44:38] Personally, it was down just me. I'd love to see it voted on as an entire city
[1:44:43] Put on the ballot and let us vote on it. Um, I don't think it's ethical for us nine to make this decision
[1:44:52] But if I have to vote I'm gonna give the vote that we can add it if we need to and I'd rather have the cleaner the water
[1:44:58] We can have without it in there
[1:45:00] So, I will say I'm going to be a no. But thank you.
[1:45:13] I grew up in the country on well water and no offense. I can't stand the city's water. I bought every different filter that possibly is. And the taste that I grew up with is far superior than what I have in my house. And it's no offense to the tree or plant or nothing. It's just the way I grew up. I grew up brushing my teeth. I never took any supplements. I don't believe in medication.
[1:45:35] And a lot of the doctors should wear a patch on their jacket and who pays them the most money to pump drugs into individuals.
[1:45:44] And like all the true art said, decisions, decisions, that's right. It's a choice to be made. I make the decisions for my children.
[1:45:52] Just like I don't make any decisions for anybody else's children. You have the choice to medicate your kid, vaccinate your kid. That's not my choice.
[1:46:03] just like my body, my choice, I make the decisions for myself.
[1:46:08] I will be voting to remove it because everybody deserves a choice.
[1:46:13] And it shouldn't be on a ballot because everybody needs a decision,
[1:46:17] a choice, not just majority.
[1:46:22] I agree with Aldrin O'ole.
[1:46:23] I think the nine of us shouldn't make the decision on it since it's a controversial decision.
[1:46:29] We all know how I go for it, but a lot of people don't.
[1:46:35] and I think we just need to put on a ballot in order to vote on it.
[1:46:39] It's not my recommendation, but I think that's what sounds like we should do.
[1:46:44] I think that if alders aren't willing to make a controversial decision, they need to rethink their positions.
[1:46:50] Excuse me, positions.
[1:46:53] And also, I'm yet to, you know, this just came up tonight, but I fail to see how we're providing people a choice
[1:47:03] in providing fluoride, you know, there's no,
[1:47:07] what are the logistics of this?
[1:47:09] Are you going to give high alder true hearts,
[1:47:14] fluoridated water and me not?
[1:47:16] Do I, just, that's not a choice.
[1:47:19] You're not giving, you're not giving the people
[1:47:22] who want fluoride a choice.
[1:47:25] You're saying no, we're not doing it.
[1:47:27] That's not a choice.
[1:47:28] and again remember we're trying to go forward in this town and moving backwards
[1:47:36] to 1900 isn't exactly forward.
[1:47:46] Is there anyone else that wants to make a second
[1:47:49] comment because at this time I would also like to have Attorney Bartoff
[1:47:55] explain something about the bowling. For the citizens yeah we can't do a non-binding
[1:48:04] advisory referendum 66.0144 talks says no city may conduct a referendum for
[1:48:13] advisory purposes except for the names of few different statutes which are
[1:48:16] dealing with video service telecommunications local government utilities so
[1:48:23] I wouldn't apply in this situation so we would not be able to do a non-binding
[1:48:28] advisory referendum and as the mayor that was the first thing that came to my
[1:48:33] mind and then I was informed that that was not possible because of the way
[1:48:38] the statutes are so I think it puts you know it puts it on the council but it's
[1:48:46] not you know something that we can just make a decision tonight probably I
[1:48:52] don't know is anything compelling us to make a decision at this point are
[1:49:02] we
[1:49:02] liable if somebody does start a class action lawsuit because we know of this
[1:49:08] information that was presented. I know the audience didn't get it but adding
[1:49:16] fluoride that we know it may be harmful and some of those things are we liable
[1:49:21] as a city.
[1:49:26] Well ultimately you can be sued for anything right whether you could win
[1:49:31] or not, there's always class to that.
[1:49:34] So someone could always sue the city if they want to do for something like that, include
[1:49:39] us in a lot of class action.
[1:49:44] Cities also do maintain immunity for discretionary decisions like that.
[1:49:51] We also are, there are also different, I think was mentioned today, you know, EPA and the
[1:49:58] state of Wisconsin, a record many...
[1:50:01] So, ultimately, there are other signs out there. It's not, hey, if someone develops this, you're not a black and white decision. So, I'm not necessarily myself worried about class actions.
[1:50:15] Because of our immunity and different studies and recommendations from the state and federal government that are out there. That doesn't mean it still can't be sued.
[1:50:28] Yeah, I make another comment. Yes, I'll honor that. Well, Mayor.
[1:50:32] you know why? Since all the grants were said we kind of got railroads on this only a couple
[1:50:38] months I think we should wait to say to probably after the next election bring it back up give us
[1:50:47] more time in order to get more information I mean the medical field is all for it but we don't have
[1:50:56] information on how it would be if we'd drop it down to 0.5. So I'd like to wait on it, not get
[1:51:03] more information. I know we've got a bunch of information, a bunch, but I'd like to get some
[1:51:10] more information and wait on it instead of making such a quick decision right now.
[1:51:16] I'll make a
[1:51:17] motion to send this to JNO to repeal the flirtation of our water in the city of Monroe. I'll second
[1:51:24] that?
[1:51:28] We have a motion on the floor.
[1:51:33] Is there any further discussion on that motion?
[1:51:38] It goes to JNO and they agree to do it. It'll come back to City Council, correct?
[1:51:43] That's correct and it will still be, we'll have to have another public hearing.
[1:51:47] That time, though, the public hearing will be limited to city residents because it's affecting just the city
[1:51:52] matter and so it would probably be and we thought maybe two council meetings if you know
[1:51:58] from that judiciary so probably in November and December it would be the most likely.
[1:52:04] I guess I don't think the ordinance language would be too hard to update for it to go to
[1:52:09] day and oh so it would take two council meetings because after day and oh recommends council
[1:52:16] would set the public hearing for the following council meeting so you'd be looking at probably
[1:52:20] six week process. Council recommends it to Jane O'Jane or reveals it sends it back to council
[1:52:26] public hearing notification then the actual. That is correct.
[1:52:35] No does everyone understand that?
[1:52:39] Do I read it?
[1:52:42] Read it back. So the motion is to send this to Jane O to repeal the
[1:52:46] forwardation. Can you can you please explain what JNO is for those who don't. So it's a judiciary and
[1:52:56] ordinance review committee. It's another subcommittee that council members sit on and they review
[1:53:02] any of the changes to the ordinances and then they make a recommendation to council to approve those
[1:53:07] or not to approve those.
[1:53:15] So this is just an avenue to take it back and then
[1:53:23] Since the decision to fill the water is set by in the city,
[1:53:28] I'm going to roll through the ordinance nature,
[1:53:30] then we would have to change that ordinance
[1:53:33] and change it ordinance and ask about that process.
[1:53:36] But until it goes back, it will be in the water, yes.
[1:53:43] OK, so everyone understands that, correct?
[1:53:46] OK, so is there any further discussion for questions?
[1:53:53] OK, at this time, all in favor say, I oppose no and a clerk will call the role to send it back to judiciary.
[1:54:03] OK, do you understand that?
[1:54:06] That's the motion to send it back. OK?
[1:54:10] So it does not pass the send back to JNO. What happens?
[1:54:17] It stays in the water.
[1:54:18] It stays in the water.
[1:54:19] It's a peror dancing. We have to do that.
[1:54:25] OK.
[1:54:25] all right?
[1:54:26] All their granny?
[1:54:28] Aye.
[1:54:29] Older Cleveland?
[1:54:30] Aye.
[1:54:31] Older Grenzot?
[1:54:32] No.
[1:54:33] Well, they're too hurt?
[1:54:35] No.
[1:54:36] Older Miller?
[1:54:37] No.
[1:54:39] Older Wartonweiler?
[1:54:40] Aye.
[1:54:42] Older Noel?
[1:54:43] Aye.
[1:54:44] Older Shaper?
[1:54:45] No.
[1:54:46] And Older Talman?
[1:54:48] Aye.
[1:54:55] So that will be going back to the end of the judiciary
[1:54:58] in our reduced review committee.
[1:55:00] Committee to be repealed and, okay,
[1:55:07] and then it will be brought back according to what the ordinance and or judiciary and ordinance decides to bring it back. They don't make the final decision. It's just in committee, okay. Does everyone understand that? Does it need any further? No, I think that will likely put it on for next Monday for the judiciary, maybe.
[1:55:33] I mean, you're just saying ideally based on the ready drafting, agendas and election and other items coming up and budget and things that will have to be considered.
[1:55:42] It would probably be in the best interest of time and energy to avoid again to potentially have JNO on the 11th Council set the public hearing on the 18th to occur on December 2nd.
[1:55:57] So you will,
[1:56:04] sorry, you will be notified of that through the publication and in the agenda announcements.
[1:56:12] Okay.
[1:56:13] And thank you all for coming and your input.
[1:56:16] It's greatly appreciated.
[1:56:18] I know it's taken a long time, but it was worth sitting through.
[1:56:22] And this is not an easy decision for these nine members to make.
[1:56:27] and I'm sure that we're going to have to really look at this and so but we'll
[1:56:37] keep you informed and you can keep us informed because we have plenty of
[1:56:41] things to back us up. Thank you. Thank you for coming and
[1:56:49] we still have our
[1:56:50] meeting for those of you that want a city and on it.
[1:57:09] Okay,
[1:57:12] we're down to license committee, aren't we?
[1:57:14] That's correct.
[1:57:15] Yeah.
[1:57:15] Okay.
[1:57:16] All right.
[1:57:17] Okay.
[1:57:18] Moving on.
[1:57:19] The license committee, a resolution approving the temporary class B-1.
[1:57:24] Pardon?
[1:57:25] What?
[1:57:27] What happened?
[1:57:29] We wanted a five minute break.
[1:57:30] Two people.
[1:57:31] Oh.
[1:57:33] Oh, sure.
[1:57:34] I didn't realize that.
[1:57:37] They all just
[1:57:43] rammed the legs for breakfast.
[1:58:15] Oh, how are we going for cookies?
[1:58:17] Everybody else is getting up from them with my legs.
[1:58:19] Yeah.
[2:04:56] Okay. Our five minute break and we're back.
[2:05:00] Second session. This is the license committee. We have everybody? Okay. The resolution approving temporary class B wine and malt beverage license in beer garden to Main Street Monroe LLC in conjunction with the first Thursday wine walk. I have a resolution granting temporary class B permitted malt beverage and wine likes to Main Street Monroe in conjunction with the wine walk multiple locally locations.
[2:05:29] and be resolved by the Comma Council of the City of Mineral upon recommendation from
[2:05:32] the License Committee that the temporary Class B wine license for picnics and gatherings
[2:05:36] be here by granted the main street with a numerous locations here to be held on November
[2:05:42] 7th, 2024 from 4 to 9 p.m. and I move for its approval.
[2:05:48] I'll say again.
[2:05:49] Is there any further discussion hearing
[2:05:56] none?
[2:05:57] All those in favor see aye oppose no and the clerk will call the roll.
[2:06:01] All the Cleveland, all the Grinzo, all the Chouhart, all the Mueller, all the
[2:06:09] Wharton-Wyler, all the Noel, all the Shaffer, all their Toman, and all their
[2:06:16] Cranig. Okay, and that passes unanimously. Yeah.
[2:06:24] Oh,
[2:06:28] I'm up here. Yeah, there we go.
[2:06:31] Okay, and moving on to Public Safety Committee.
[2:06:35] Read the resolution approving the special event for Main Street.
[2:06:39] Monroe, first there's the wine walk.
[2:06:41] I
[2:06:45] have a resolution approving special events.
[2:06:48] We are resolved by the Common Council of the City of Monroe upon recommendation of the Public Safety Committee that the approval be hereby given for the following special events.
[2:06:57] and it's just one, Monroe Main Street to hold the Main Street Wine Walk event on November
[2:07:02] 7, 2024 from 4 p.m. to 9 p.m. in the downtown area. It's offered by the Public Safety Committee
[2:07:10] dated this 21st day of October, 2024, and I move for its approval.
[2:07:15] Second, okay, is there any further discussion?
[2:07:21] Hearing none, all those in favor say aye,
[2:07:24] I oppose no and the clerk will call the roll.
[2:07:27] Older grinzo.
[2:07:29] Older Truhart.
[2:07:31] Aye.
[2:07:31] Older Miller.
[2:07:32] Aye.
[2:07:33] Older Wharton-Waller.
[2:07:34] Aye.
[2:07:34] Older Noel.
[2:07:35] Aye.
[2:07:36] Older Schaefer.
[2:07:37] Aye.
[2:07:38] Older Toman.
[2:07:38] Aye.
[2:07:39] Older Draenig.
[2:07:40] Aye.
[2:07:41] Older Cleveland.
[2:07:42] Aye.
[2:07:42] Aye.
[2:07:42] Aye.
[2:07:43] Aye.
[2:07:43] Aye.
[2:07:43] Aye.
[2:07:43] Aye.
[2:07:43] and I was moving on to salary and personnel committee,
[2:07:47] the resolution approving years of service,
[2:07:49] accreditation for new hire at PTO accrual.
[2:08:00] Does anybody have that?
[2:08:04] I have.
[2:08:05] It's here for someone else.
[2:08:07] I don't have a resolution approving engineering technician
[2:08:10] paid time off, accrual right,
[2:08:12] be it resolved by the Common Council of City Monroe
[2:08:15] upon recommendation of the salary and personnel committee
[2:08:18] the engineering technician be accredited for four years of service to begin a
[2:08:24] brewing paid time off at the rate of 160 hours per year offered by the salary
[2:08:31] and personal committee dated this 21st day of October 2024 and I move for its approval.
[2:08:39] Okay, is there any further discussion?
[2:08:43] I have a question, is this include holidays also and why are we going to a four year service when you just hired?
[2:09:02] Yeah, pretty much just trying to look for the four years we posted twice for this position.
[2:09:10] This last time we had five applicants we interviewed three.
[2:09:14] So kind of narrowing it down this existing person has eight years experience in public works.
[2:09:19] working on that, so we looked at a credit EM for half of his years of
[2:09:23] experience for the PTO portion, because he did ask for it with that movement he
[2:09:29] would start out at basically 0 until after one year of accreditation. Does this
[2:09:36] include holidays or holidays on top of this? Holidays are on top of that.
[2:09:47] So this
[2:09:47] would be equivalent to vacation and sick leave, correct? Correct.
[2:09:58] Okay, any other
[2:09:58] questions available.
[2:10:00] All these up here? Okay. Thank you, Al.
[2:10:06] Okay.
[2:10:10] Is there any more discussion?
[2:10:14] Hearing none. All in favor say aye. Opposed? No. And the clerk will call the roll. All their true heart? Aye. All their Miller? No. All their Wartweiler? Aye. All their Noel? Aye. All their Shaffer? Aye. All their Tollman? Aye. All their Cranig? Aye. All their Cleveland? Aye.
[2:10:35] and older grunzo.
[2:10:37] Okay, and that passes.
[2:10:40] Moving on to the discussion regarding the quarterly HSA contribution versus annual HSA
[2:10:48] contribution.
[2:11:00] Resolution approving quarterly health savings account payments with accelerated payment
[2:11:05] option for high cost pharmaceuticals.
[2:11:09] Be it resolved by the City of Monroe Common Council upon recommendation of the salary and
[2:11:13] personal committee to authorize the addition of the accelerated application policy for high-cost pharmaceuticals in support of the health savings account quarterly payment program effective January 1st, 2025, a copy of which attached here to for reference.
[2:11:31] This is the date of this 21st day of October 2024 and I move for its approval.
[2:11:38] Is there any further discussion on that?
[2:11:45] Hearing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye, a pose no, and the clerk will call the roll.
[2:11:53] All their Miller, aye, all their Wartweiler, aye, all their no, aye, all their shaffer, aye, all their tomen, aye, all their
[2:12:04] Dr. Crannick, Alder-Cleven, Alder-Grenzel, and Alder-Jullhart.
[2:12:10] And that resolution passes.
[2:12:14] Moving on to the Council of the Whole, a resolution approving the business improvement
[2:12:19] district, 2024 operating plan levy.
[2:12:24] Be resolved by the Common Council of Steven Earl of the approval and acceptance be here
[2:12:28] up by given for the business improvement district operating plan for calendar year 2025, a copy
[2:12:33] of which is attached here to and made part here by reference dated this 21st day of October
[2:12:39] 2024 and I move for its approval.
[2:12:44] I'll second that. Okay. Is there any further discussion?
[2:12:53] Hearing none. All in favor say aye. A poll is no and the clerk will call the roll.
[2:12:58] Older Wartweiler? Aye. Older Noel? Aye. Older Shaffer? Aye. Older Toman? Aye. Older Cranig? Aye.
[2:13:07] Okay, Alder Cleveland, Alder Grenzo, Alder Truhart, and Aldermiller, and that passes.
[2:13:18] Moving on to, at this time, we'll hold the public hearing on the shared ride fair rate increase, and at this time, we'll have-
[2:13:32] I do have a list of individuals that did sign up for this, so I can read through and have them come up and
[2:13:39] speak on that behalf. The first one and I apologize, I can't really read the
[2:13:44] signature is maybe a gym or it's the one that lives in unit 217.
[2:13:50] Is that your job or Jen made it?
[2:13:57] Well, you need to know your name.
[2:14:01] No, thank you. My name's Melody Jenkins. I write the cab. I would just want you guys to
[2:14:06] keep the fill race with right now. So I hope you guys this I hope you guys just make
[2:14:13] a good association on that. Thanks. Bye.
[2:14:18] Thank you. Okay. Is there anyone else that wishes
[2:14:22] to be heard? We do have a Sean Sharon Miller.
[2:14:40] I'm Sharon Miller. I live at 813th Avenue
[2:14:46] Churchill Woods. I don't always ride the cab, but sometimes I do and I just find
[2:14:54] compared to what we had where I used to live, it's a...
[2:15:00] It's really affordable for older people. And sometimes I have to write it and it's nice that it's there. And I hope that you keep the rates the way they are so that we who are on fixed income can better afford them.
[2:15:20] Thank you and then is it Jim is Jeff okay my
[2:15:30] name is
[2:15:36] smart
[2:15:42] this isn't good okay my name is Jeff Prophet I live at Churchill Woods
[2:15:48] that's 813th Avenue, I've been there about 12 years and I used to drive in 2018,
[2:15:58] took it to work for a room, and I've seen both sides of the coin I guess. When
[2:16:04] it's people told me they're riding along that hey we need this because I can't
[2:16:10] see because some people had been here, I don't have a car and in that time
[2:16:16] since then I don't have a car either so I can see where the ride is beneficial to me but I don't
[2:16:23] know about raising the amount of costs for disabled and elderly is well you know kind of beneficial to
[2:16:32] the people so security is not giving us an increase it's worth the darn so everything else is more
[2:16:39] expensive but the cab should be something we should try to keep level for everybody to pay for
[2:16:45] You know, because it's hard. I mean it is hard. We have a fixed income and you know, take care of all that stuff.
[2:16:52] So, please will not to increase it. Thank you.
[2:16:58] Thank you.
[2:16:59] Okay.
[2:17:00] And let me do a Pat Brandenburg.
[2:17:08] Good evening. Thanks for listening. This I'm Pat Brandenburg. I'm executive director to Monroe Housing Authority.
[2:17:13] the three people that you see there are part of my 85 tenants and I want to thank
[2:17:19] whoever did the public hearing into the paper for the cardiac arrest I almost had.
[2:17:24] It was listed as going up $1.50 a ticket and our disabled and elderly as they said it in
[2:17:32] the thing said it was going to go up $1.75 on a $2.25 ticket.
[2:17:38] Okay that put me in a little panic but that got me going with these guys.
[2:17:41] So the average ride will increase 50 cents as they ride both ways, they don't have cars,
[2:17:47] they need a place to go.
[2:17:49] There are 85 tenants that reside at Churchill Woods.
[2:17:52] This will give them, they will get them to Walmart at $5 around truck, so much for going
[2:17:58] for savings.
[2:17:59] 75 cents if they go to the bank is the increase that we're talking because the cab will take
[2:18:06] you from Churchill Woods to Walmart then to the bank or vice versa.
[2:18:10] They will hit your ticket every time so you'll end up hitting three tickets and they do try to save and they do try to get a
[2:18:17] Right share, which is another point I was going to ask you for. If you would not raise the increase on a
[2:18:23] Right share so that more of the tenants would go together and be able to save that money right there because right now you're talking a
[2:18:31] Quarter increase on everything. I'm also asking because we sell 180 tickets per month to our tenants.
[2:18:38] some ride more than others, some pay cash as they ride, so I don't have a number
[2:18:42] to give you of how many people actually use the cab totally, but I can tell you
[2:18:47] I have 85 residents, so that does make a difference. Some of these people tip the
[2:18:53] driver, some tip over a dollar a ride. Will that change? I would think so, but
[2:18:58] that's up to them. Cola, Costa Living Adjustment, was 3.2% last year for
[2:19:06] or January 1st for Social Security for those of us
[2:19:09] that are aware of that.
[2:19:11] And the average person that lives in my building,
[2:19:13] that's about $32 a month raised.
[2:19:17] So when you start calculating that back into your rides
[2:19:19] at a quarter ride, which is $0.50, both ways,
[2:19:23] then the $32 starts disappearing.
[2:19:27] Some have to go by cab to get to the clinic.
[2:19:30] Well, we all know you get your blood tests in the morning,
[2:19:33] then you come back at one o'clock.
[2:19:34] So the poor person what do they do because they can't stay there for lunch they have to ride back get their
[2:19:40] Lunch at their home at their department and then go back again. That's two more rides
[2:19:45] That's 50 cents more. I just want you guys to do the calculation for me
[2:19:49] So we are blessed to have carrying cab drivers on the service as much as we are here there are there
[2:19:54] The service has been interrupted by whether staff short staff shortage and
[2:20:00] Aye, abstain or not working. Low income means $20,600 a year. That's mostly SSI. Those are the people that are qualified to live at Churchill Woods. It doesn't cover extra clinic trips, grocery trips, and Walmart, as well as visiting the Main Street stores and markets. And Farmers Market isn't free to get there if you can't walk. So $20,600 divided by 12 is $1,700 a month before medical expenses and Indian insurance payments. A lot of people
[2:20:29] try to be on a Medicare supplement if they can afford it. It's $182 a month, but that
[2:20:36] take that out of your $1,700. Okay, please consider no increase, at least for our community
[2:20:43] of the low income seniors and persons with disability. That's why I'm here. I'm just asking
[2:20:48] you to give them a break. And my mouth is dry because it's a good time. So I also want state
[2:20:56] that you wanted to raise it a quarter for children to ride.
[2:21:00] I, as a parent, had two children go to a wonderful babysitter.
[2:21:05] It was a lot more feasible and economic for me
[2:21:08] to have the wonderful cab service take them to grandma.
[2:21:12] Or their babysitting service while they were growing up.
[2:21:16] Then for me to punch out at students,
[2:21:19] go get them at Northside, drive them,
[2:21:20] clear over by a quick trip, and then go to work.
[2:21:23] And bosses don't really like that
[2:21:25] when you're not there to answer the phone.
[2:21:27] So I'm just trying to tell you that years ago,
[2:21:29] I found that as a great benefit
[2:21:31] to have that in the community,
[2:21:33] and I would have paid $1 more,
[2:21:36] whatever it would have cost to get them back and forth.
[2:21:41] So that's what I have to say.
[2:21:42] Thank you.
[2:21:43] Hope I didn't use it in my three minutes.
[2:21:45] Thank you.
[2:21:46] Oh, yeah.
[2:21:49] OK.
[2:21:53] OK.
[2:21:54] Thank you for your input tonight.
[2:21:57] we appreciate that okay so yeah
[2:22:05] oh yeah at this time the public hearing is
[2:22:10] closed since we have no more speakers okay can you give us all a background of
[2:22:15] where this originated from is this from can we call the next session the first but
[2:22:21] we ask your question can we ask yeah yeah the right and moving on to the
[2:22:27] resolution approving the sole bid for shared ride to yeah we're so we yeah what
[2:22:37] this is just the fair rates but then the bid is a separate item what so we
[2:22:42] would have to do the public hearing and that's it for there's no motion well there
[2:22:48] could be good in their discussion we're still on the same area yeah we're
[2:23:03] So this increase come from the company that's doing it or I guess can you give like a
[2:23:11] happily yeah I will give a background kind of a where we're at or why this is here before you
[2:23:16] So this year, as you see on the next item, we are up for having to out forbid for our shared
[2:23:22] ride services.
[2:23:24] Over the last couple of years with Council, there's been discussion on those services.
[2:23:28] There was also sometimes discussions on the rates and if that could help with any of the
[2:23:33] services.
[2:23:34] And so at that point of kind of always was said when we go out for bid, maybe that's something
[2:23:39] we then evaluate.
[2:23:40] So it's actually been something that's been discussed with the Council over the last couple
[2:23:44] years of saying let's be mindful of that when we go into a new contract. It is not anything
[2:23:50] of that. Any of the increased rates does not go to the provider. It is partly what
[2:23:57] actually we would then offset what we have to pay the provider. So when we, you look
[2:24:02] at the next item, there's a contract. They bill us for the hours that they're out driving
[2:24:07] and providing the services and they collect the fair revenue. They deduct that from the hours
[2:24:13] that they're charging us. So if we collect a little bit more in fairs it might help offset
[2:24:19] what we're paying towards the shared-ride program. With that since I've been here and even
[2:24:26] I know at the last renewal there was not any consideration of rate increases in those
[2:24:32] five or six years. I don't know the exact date of when any last consideration of rate increases
[2:24:37] have occurred. Also I do apologize for it. There's a 30-day notice for this public hearing
[2:24:42] and was still in the midst of trying to gather information to tie it with the
[2:24:47] consideration of the contract. So the initial increase that was put in that
[2:24:53] 30-day notice we did get a listing from the DOT of everybody that's involved in the
[2:24:59] Thank you very much.
[2:25:00] Board, right, and what their rates were, and we kind of went to the average rate after further investigation and discussions too. Feel like that would be too much of an increase. Obviously, we want to be mindful of that we don't want to have negative impacts on the users that this benefits. We also don't want to, I mean, there's there's cost and demand that if you potentially increase it too much, they're going to find different avenues.
[2:25:27] will have less riders and then we could even see us actually having to pay more
[2:25:32] annually as well. Another thought and thing to be mindful of is that was kind
[2:25:37] of detailed to my memo is during kind of the COVID time frame there were
[2:25:42] additional grants through CARES Act so there was a lot there were a couple
[2:25:48] years where we weren't having to it was almost fully covered through grants that
[2:25:52] we're now starting to see that fall off and so we will continue to see that our
[2:25:58] city's portion will continue to potentially increase or at least more than
[2:26:02] what it has been in the past. It did include so for the 2024 program the
[2:26:09] overall operating expenses is projected to be 672. 40% of that is set to be
[2:26:16] We've covered through federal funding, 12% by state, and then about 28% local, so that
[2:26:24] would be about $193,000.
[2:26:29] She alluded to that what I made in the recommended memo for increases was a 25% increase each
[2:26:35] year for the next four years, and then the dollar increased to additional passenger.
[2:26:41] something to be mindful of like so package delivery that's if say somebody goes
[2:26:46] from the hospital back home and they utilize a wheelchair but then that wheelchair
[2:26:52] has to get returned to the hospital you're paying for that wheelchair to go back
[2:26:56] that's not typically covered by the resident it's actually covered by the
[2:26:59] hospital or the clinic or the agency that's asking for that package to be
[2:27:03] delivered an agency fare which might cover some of the items she's referring to I'm
[2:27:08] not positive in their exact scenarios,
[2:27:11] but agency is when somebody is, say,
[2:27:14] on a supported like Medicaid or badger care
[2:27:17] to go to their appointments and those services
[2:27:20] then part of what they do is provide transportation
[2:27:23] to their appointments and so the agency
[2:27:25] or the insurance has then covered that.
[2:27:28] So that's why there's a proposed annual increase
[2:27:30] of a dollar for the next four years
[2:27:31] that wouldn't impact the riders themselves directly
[2:27:35] and it's still very competitive
[2:27:36] from what I've been told through the organizations because if the agency can't get a ride through the local transport they have to pay like for somebody to come down from Madison or something else to still get them there.
[2:27:50] So then they're paying like $30 for the ride versus the $8.
[2:27:56] So with that, I mean I'm not saying, even when I brought this forward, I'm bringing it forward because it was mentioned maybe we should consider it.
[2:28:05] I think it could be important to the sustainability as we're starting to find kind of our share has increased since the lapse of the CARES Act.
[2:28:15] It's totally open to negotiation or your thoughts or further consideration if you need further time to discuss.
[2:28:24] I did kind of show in the memo also like an example to help give a picture of like a monthly invoice how they charge the $36.59 for other hours.
[2:28:34] they serve so that they drove around for 1165 hours, so there's a bill for 42,000.
[2:28:40] But from the riders that rode that month, they collected 8,900, so then we owe that difference.
[2:28:46] So if we increase some of those fares, they can help to offset that difference that we're
[2:28:50] paying monthly.
[2:28:52] The agency, if you increase it, there's approximately 4,000, 7,000 rides annually that are billed
[2:28:59] that way. And that, so if you take that with a dollar increase, that's 7,000 increase
[2:29:05] the first year and 20,000,000 by the third year. For the other rides, it was about,
[2:29:18] well
[2:29:19] it would equate to 42,000 regular trips annually. So if you take an increase of 25 cents, that
[2:29:27] equates to about 10,000 annually. Of an increase, and that's to our revenue, not to the impact
[2:29:34] of like she shared a good perspective of what it might do to a specific writer
[2:29:37] themselves of how often they use it so to balance the both sides of that how much
[2:29:43] did the bid go up from the last one so I mean where there's only one company
[2:29:50] you can't get anybody else to bid it unfortunately we've been trying we've
[2:29:53] been trying for what four years yeah every time it's been I think I think the
[2:29:58] The pride, well, the pride...
[2:30:00] We're two bids ago. I think they didn't initially get one and had to go out for a second bid, and then the last time, which, so it happens every five years, we did get the one, and now we do have, again, one.
[2:30:13] It's going to look as approximately, I think we're currently at the 36, and it might go to 39 per hour,
[2:30:28] 39.96.
[2:30:29] Yeah, so that charges for them to pay what it does is it charges for the coverage of their drivers having the vehicles, their insurance, the maintenance of the vehicles, the dispatch team, then providing the services of also that's required as part of information needed for the grants and the reporting and things to that nature.
[2:30:54] So it's not like the driver just sees that that goes to the whole administration.
[2:30:59] and it goes to however many drivers are out at that time as well, but that's what they charge at that point.
[2:31:07] A few questions. Are the drivers getting a pay increase?
[2:31:12] So that would not be a factor of this.
[2:31:16] How much would the impact would be if we would not increase the shared ride, the second rider in the cab?
[2:31:24] or also if we do some adjustment on if they've got to stop at Walmart and make a couple different stops.
[2:31:34] Yeah, we can't change that. We don't charge for those. I think that would say I could double check on that.
[2:31:41] But I'm pretty certain we would still have to charge for each of those. And if there's an additional rider, but we can impact it by how much we do charge.
[2:31:49] The I don't have the stats in front of me of how many additional passengers and I believe
[2:31:55] for my call she even said that would be hard to always know because sometimes they might
[2:32:01] call to go for the ride and then along the way to somebody else calls and dispatch will
[2:32:04] say there's somebody here and they'll pick that up and so it's not always but more often
[2:32:10] than not they can it's that they coordinate it but she didn't have that I don't have that
[2:32:15] in front of me to know the impact and report right now.
[2:32:22] If somebody's already in the cab and then the cab company gets called or someone else
[2:32:26] to pick them up, they charge full rates for both of them.
[2:32:30] No, I don't believe so.
[2:32:32] So I believe as it was described to me as that the part of the shared ride is that you could
[2:32:39] be riding with somebody that you don't know to go, like you both want to go to Walmart
[2:32:44] and around the same time they'll coordinate that through the dispatch and so then I believe
[2:32:48] than it would only be the one in the in the shared.
[2:32:52] I said it is interesting because how do you know I don't you I don't know and they didn't
[2:32:56] really say I don't know somebody can speak to it but like how do you determine who pays
[2:33:01] being the additional passenger versus not but it's a possibility but I think more often
[2:33:06] than not your coordinating that ahead of time I don't know how often that but you said
[2:33:12] earlier about like the hospital or something of the wheelchair has to go back or something
[2:33:18] like that. Is there a percentage higher in this? Like if we could take some of this and
[2:33:23] put it on the provider to offset it? Because I mean they have deeper pockets.
[2:33:29] So the increases for them are greater, I think, currently, like the agency, like we're doing
[2:33:33] the dollar increase instead of the 25 cent increase. So it is more, and it is a lesser
[2:33:40] ridership. Also the package delivery was 8, yes, currently 650 and the proposal I have
[2:33:54] has increased that to 10. So those are a greater percentage increase in those that are
[2:33:59] versus the other riders.
[2:34:04] Are they still doing the for the bars late night stuff?
[2:34:07] So no, and that's not included in the proposal that was submitted.
[2:34:13] Is into the tabernacle also help out with some of the funding?
[2:34:16] At one point I believe they may have, but that isn't the case anymore.
[2:34:21] I believe they might even have their own scenario right now or something to anager.
[2:34:26] There's nothing out there for them.
[2:34:27] That's something we really, with this kind of assistance that we're paying them,
[2:34:31] I would think they should be open. Their hour should be wider.
[2:34:33] I don't know what there's to be mindful of. Yes, we could. We would be paying for those hours that they are out there
[2:34:42] and I don't know that the demand so we would have less riders probably utilizing it to offset the cost so we could be paying $39 an hour from 10 to 3 a.m.
[2:34:52] and have a few riders use it. Does that also justify our needs and the true demand of the people that
[2:35:00] What needed in the community? I mean, but so in looking at the list that you provided, I think I read it right.
[2:35:10] Our most communities like our size, about $5.00.
[2:35:16] I think that was from the averages. So as we originally, like she said, I wanted to increase it from 350, I think to close to five. That was what the average was. If we took all of them in Wisconsin, so not just in our area.
[2:35:33] Yeah, actually we're probably there's not many other communities right in our specific area that have a shared right program.
[2:35:40] I mean, if you look at say like Plattville or and Jamesville might be more of a bus thing, but so you have to look at some other organized municipalities that are more similar in our size and services to the surrounding rural communities.
[2:35:55] Is there Uber in the area looked up my Uber app and shows get me to my house at 915 PM $5.72.
[2:36:03] use sense. Yeah they could. I mean anybody can do it
[2:36:07] it typically if if somebody wants to they could but I don't know how consistent and
[2:36:12] demanding and it wouldn't be anything we would support but if there was ever somebody
[2:36:18] looking to want to do a side gig they definitely could and it would that would be something
[2:36:22] they do through there but I think that also speaks to that it might be hard sometimes to find
[2:36:27] and Uber because of having enough drivers
[2:36:30] that do Uber consistently to rely on it
[2:36:33] and to have enough demand in our community
[2:36:36] to make them want to do it here.
[2:36:40] And that's affordable for the individuals that need it
[2:36:44] and something to be mindful of of like,
[2:36:46] so this service is also, it's not just your standard say,
[2:36:49] like Uber, taxi cab, it is, they do kind of do the door
[2:36:54] to door service that helping the individuals get into the vehicle
[2:36:58] and get into where they're going and assisting them
[2:37:01] in that manner as well.
[2:37:03] Is there a way, like I don't know,
[2:37:06] where this is for, say, 65 and younger?
[2:37:11] You know, like where we can...
[2:37:13] There are fairs that are,
[2:37:15] there are senior fairs compared to the base fairs for...
[2:37:21] I'm trying to think,
[2:37:21] is there any other options to not raise, you know,
[2:37:25] Yeah, you could be not increasing the senior or disabled fair at all and then put that on
[2:37:34] People that are outside of that
[2:37:37] That's why I was comparing the base pay of other communities if they're five dollars and if we took that
[2:37:42] You know and instead of making it 350 375. I mean with the numbers work out then. I don't know how many people use
[2:37:50] Yeah, and I'm I guess I'm not a hundred percent of saying like we have to get
[2:37:55] to those numbers, I think, no matter what we're understanding that we are subsidizing some
[2:38:00] of this program, so that's not to be lost. It is something that's been identified as
[2:38:06] a need and something that they want as support in the community. It was just this is what
[2:38:13] in discussions felt like it could be an increase that could help with the sustainability but
[2:38:21] but also not be too great of an increase potentially to the users.
[2:38:25] But yeah, I think you could look at just not increasing the senior disabled
[2:38:29] in only the base and still even just the 25 or a little bit more.
[2:38:35] We could definitely play around with those numbers.
[2:38:39] I'd be, I'd be in favor of increasing the base and not the 65 and older and
[2:38:45] the disabled and putting it on, you know, other avenues.
[2:38:52] I'm
[2:38:55] curious, so isn't the vast majority going to be senior and disabled from this?
[2:39:02] And I guess my concern, not that I certainly don't want to increase fees or fairs on anybody,
[2:39:09] but I would be a little hesitant to, anytime you push fair increases off,
[2:39:16] it's just going to become more painful at some point.
[2:39:19] Because at some point you're going to have to play catch up.
[2:39:21] And you mentioned Administrator Rundee several years, four or five years, that you're aware of that we haven't had a fair increase.
[2:39:32] Okay, so if we if we punt this down the road a couple of years, you know, is the increase going to be a lot more painful at that point rather than when you have regular small increases versus infrequent large increase.
[2:39:50] We would be increasing it, it would go to the base, the youth, everything outside of
[2:39:57] seen her and disabled, so I guess what I'm saying.
[2:40:00] I don't think- I don't have the stats on telling you like ten students ride and- I'm just thinking that the base isn't going to account for very much. So the vast majority at some point is going to have to come from senior disabled. I mean, I'm assuming. From what I understand, that's the, that's the core user group. And so at some point that's going to have to, we can't hold it to 25 forever.
[2:40:27] I guess how did we come to 25 cents?
[2:40:31] consecutive in four years because that's a dollar or more in four years.
[2:40:39] It felt like it would be a reasonable amount that could have an impact on offsetting our
[2:40:46] cost, but hopefully still be something that was done over time and accounted for that
[2:40:52] wouldn't hopefully be a negative impact on the users.
[2:40:54] I
[2:41:01] tend to agree with all their granzo I mean there comes it has brazen what how many years
[2:41:08] not that any button for sure six remember yeah um chief colleagues maybe ten I certainly you know not a
[2:41:19] proponent of making people pay more but we do have to be realistic too we cannot keep our prices our
[2:41:29] prices as a city count as a city are going up. So how do we offset that?
[2:41:40] I do have a report from 2023 up. Unfortunately not numbers of rides but so in 2023 we
[2:41:51] collected 18,500 in the base amount and the senior fair was 61,000 so and the
[2:42:03] senior slash disability fair so it definitely is the higher portion of the
[2:42:09] the usership now.
[2:42:12] Are a lot of the senior fairs additional people, or the one person in the cab, or majority
[2:42:25] of people share a ride, or just one person, and if we don't increase the share ride,
[2:42:32] would that encourage people to ride together?
[2:42:34] Would that help?
[2:42:35] Well, it's technically no matter what a shared ride program, so they're always subject
[2:42:39] to having somebody else with them.
[2:42:41] It may be you could encourage, I mean, it's already a currently only $1 versus the two.
[2:42:48] I don't have that data quickly accessible to me, though, to comment on that.
[2:43:25] So Nick just was looking at average out of the states for the senior disabled is 371 comparing
[2:43:35] So
[2:43:38] if we don't raise, you probably said this, but I don't remember, the city will pay
[2:43:50] how much more because the cab company is raising its rates.
[2:43:56] So how much more will we be paying and where will that money come from if we don't raise
[2:44:02] rates? Yeah, the rate increase will be going up approximately $3 next year. No
[2:44:11] matter what, like I said, it's in its hard to give an exact number of what we
[2:44:16] would be paying, so it depends on the number of users, so that throughout the
[2:44:22] hours that we're providing the service, but obviously it just, if we do less of an
[2:44:28] increase, we know that that will result in a subsidizing higher amount of that. But that's
[2:44:35] where I've mentioned to also be mindful that we don't increase it too much that we deter
[2:44:40] use and also have no riders. Then we also see no revenue offsetting and utilizing a service
[2:44:47] that we're paying $40,000 a month to.
[2:44:50] So.
[2:45:02] That money extra money, if it's not raised, will have to be fit into the budget somewhere. Where would that fit and what would possibly be?
[2:45:15] Typically, it's subsidized through the various grants and then the tax levy would cover the difference of what we don't have through revenue or grants.
[2:45:29] Realistically, you're not going to actually know an increase until you actually know how many youth riders there are, how many base riders there are. And if you raise those by 50 sensors,
[2:45:38] or 75 cents and then average it out and then you also raise the, was it the box or delivery and wheelchair or whatever the term is for that you raise that a few dollars which you said so you don't know until you have this all these numbers compiled together and throwing something out there without those numbers compiled together it's just it's it's foolish.
[2:46:04] Does
[2:46:16] any of us have some input?
[2:46:29] No.
[2:46:34] And if there was what we are thinking there isn't also a resolution for approval that tonight
[2:46:39] obviously it could be discussion and that it would come back with a formal resolution
[2:46:43] identifying the right if there is a recommendation to do any increases.
[2:46:52] I didn't catch the last part you said.
[2:46:55] If there is any recommendation to do any increases we would take that and formalize it into a formal
[2:47:00] resolution to come back to council for a full approval at that point okay all right so you're
[2:47:07] more looking for guidance at this point and yeah consent has been okay
[2:47:15] so how do we go I don't
[2:47:17] approach that personally I'd like to see the I will actually say that I actually have quite a few of
[2:47:25] my customers I use the cab on a pretty darn regular basis coming and going from my shop and I
[2:47:30] appreciate them when they do do that but I will say most of them are probably falling the base
[2:47:35] Not in the and they're using it the way it should be used and I think they use it because it's affordable
[2:47:41] Now if we let's say put a regular base to floor 25
[2:47:45] I don't think that's gonna scare most people away in today's society
[2:47:50] but for
[2:47:51] The students I hate to see that all fall in the parents. I could see a 25 cents there and
[2:47:57] Senior Disabled I would truthfully. I know they're the biggest one
[2:48:00] That's where truthfully given the services to I'd rather leave that alone
[2:48:05] I know we need to put an increase there a little bit, but on the same hand as my gut tells me we should leave it alone and that's just speaking for my gut.
[2:48:15] That's how I feel.
[2:48:17] Leave the elderly disabled fee as it is if you know if it all possible.
[2:48:28] So would this would go back to what committee if we sent it back to?
[2:48:34] would. So it wouldn't go back to a committee to set up a new fee schedule. Okay.
[2:48:43] And I don't know if you'd want to, I mean, entertain it all, just for the senior disabled
[2:48:49] category, something like smaller over the next four years or in two years it increases
[2:48:56] to this or something, that's just an idea or if you for sure just want to say we want
[2:49:01] not to stay at that until the next time I rate fair increases considered.
[2:49:08] I think it needs to be reviewed at least every year.
[2:49:12] Well, at least every two years, if not nearly.
[2:49:15] Because I think it could easily slip away from us very quickly.
[2:49:18] And then, like I say, you're going to be faced with a big jump that's going to really upset people
[2:49:24] and make it very difficult on people.
[2:49:27] I
[2:49:37] agree with reviewing it every two years.
[2:49:40] I think a quarter.
[2:49:42] We don't raise it for so many years, and then we raise it a quarter every year, seems a bit aggressive.
[2:49:48] That is one of the comments we're talking with some of the other kind of cap companies and DOT and stuff was that
[2:49:55] you do one at the part of the reason why you do evaluate this is
[2:49:59] is
[2:50:00] I think we're going to have to do something about this for the sustainability that, yes, they are the larger user ship of it or a fair amount of it, and you don't want to get to the point where you're having to subsidize a significant amount of it and it doesn't, that you can't, and you're putting that on all the taxpayers or you need to find areas to cut and that you're, then you're trying to all of a sudden catch up to make it sustainable. So that was one of the points that they shared of why you would consider this.
[2:50:27] Can you do a breakout where you do that quarter every other year and then put the other bulk
[2:50:33] onto the base and that delivery, whatever it's called, and anybody outside that group?
[2:50:43] And so with that, are you asking to increase the base more than 25 cents?
[2:50:48] like what Alder Noel said with the base, but then the disabled, if you do the
[2:50:54] quarter every other year, like split it in half, and then see how that shakes
[2:51:00] out with the actual dollars and sensualize. And so what what amount are you
[2:51:05] seeing as reasonable to at least base my increase to for the base? To factor in
[2:51:11] first. Alder Noel knows more because they run an operation like that. Go up to 50%
[2:51:16] Increase on the base. I think it'd be over four bucks. I would say 425 or 25 and then it and then a increase every year
[2:51:25] I would review it to I
[2:51:28] When I wouldn't set ourselves up for any certain dollar amount from their amounter
[2:51:34] But I will agree. I mean and the good factor is this gasoline as price has been pre-stable
[2:51:40] I know that doesn't seem like a lot but that's something that's been pre-stable really and so
[2:51:47] You have to pull that out of it for the cab company, but their rates are going up.
[2:51:51] I'm not going to lie, seeing what we're paying them is, being in this business is absolutely
[2:51:59] crazy.
[2:52:01] Their vehicles are not going to go that far, but they need some repairs.
[2:52:10] They're not updating.
[2:52:12] I know these guys can speak for it.
[2:52:14] Are you guys still having problems getting people when you need them?
[2:52:16] or they're more often, they're limited hours.
[2:52:19] I struggle with a lot of it, but I do believe
[2:52:22] that the base needs to go up higher than 50 cents.
[2:52:27] I would say more in the four and a quarter,
[2:52:28] but I struggle with the whole thing.
[2:52:33] Well, I can come back with that updated calculation
[2:52:37] with those differences and the draft resolution,
[2:52:41] and then you can either play with all of them,
[2:52:45] and hopefully I can have even some
[2:52:47] different scenarios to consider to plug in too.
[2:52:54] I agree with increasing the base more than what we've got on here and keeping the senior
[2:53:02] disabled the same and the additional passengers.
[2:53:07] We could encourage people to do that and just let's say that's 25% of the increase just keep
[2:53:19] but at the $2 raise that after this year.
[2:53:34] So at this point, you're going to bring it back to, OK.
[2:53:39] So there'll be no action taken on that tonight, right?
[2:53:46] OK.
[2:53:47] I have one question.
[2:53:48] When it says package delivery, like if they
[2:53:50] buy groceries or something, that's not just a wheelchair
[2:53:54] or something like that.
[2:53:56] Is there transporting something without a passenger?
[2:53:59] there. What
[2:54:11] do we need a motion to? Nope. Nope. Okay. So at this time, we'll move on to
[2:54:20] the discussion and possible action regarding the industrial surcharge plan. Oh, we're on
[2:54:27] the, we have to go to the sole, sole bed for the share drive. Yeah. What? Oh. Oh, okay. The
[2:54:40] The resolution, the shared short version?
[2:54:43] Be it.
[2:54:46] Oh, okay, yes, please.
[2:54:48] Be it resolved by the common council of the City of Monroe
[2:54:51] that the shared ride tax operating contract
[2:54:54] and public transit lease agreement for the years 2025 to 2026.
[2:54:58] With the options.
[2:55:00] We are extending to 2029, be here by award to Brown Cab Service Inc. And that approval and acceptance be hereby given for the attached contract,
[2:55:09] contingent upon no protest to the award being received within 10 days. Be a further resolve that the mayor and city of minister be hereby authorized to execute the four mentioned contract on behalf of the city of now.
[2:55:22] day of this 21st day of October 2024 and I move for it's approval.
[2:55:27] I have a second.
[2:55:29] Okay.
[2:55:30] Is there any further discussion?
[2:55:34] Hearing none?
[2:55:35] Yep, I got some.
[2:55:36] Okay.
[2:55:37] So this is multiple years.
[2:55:39] So yes, it's for the confirmed to base our rate for 2025 to 2026 but then the
[2:55:46] option of continuing for years through five which would be through 2029.
[2:55:52] So, the rate is locked in for the first two years, and then the third year, the fourth
[2:55:59] year, they give a current rate, but that is then dependent upon the CPI at that time
[2:56:08] cannot be a factor in what the final rate of for those years would be approved.
[2:56:15] I'm going to say that I'd be okay with locking in for the 25, 26 year but the optional years I would definitely stay away from.
[2:56:26] All it takes is a little competition and we're going to get blown out of the water and I feel like we need to be mindful of that and understand that competition brings.
[2:56:35] but rates. So the whole time I've been on council we've been trying to get
[2:56:40] competition has not worked. I, however, because we all see the dollar amount and
[2:56:46] we've tried and tried and tried and you never know when the opens up a cab
[2:56:52] company in the city of Mineral. Yeah and part of what they relate to where it is to
[2:56:57] be a part of the federal program where we are subsidized a portion of this
[2:57:03] through the federal and state, like this process is very regulated, what they have to do,
[2:57:09] what we have to do, what they have to submit, and so it's also, if you look at the shared
[2:57:18] ride programs across the state, they are very prevalent in that, partly because they have
[2:57:23] then the resources to handle this challenging aspect of providing it in rural communities
[2:57:29] is where the demand is a little different and the services have to be a little different
[2:57:34] because of the it's providing a service rather than a competitive taxi service so but I can potentially
[2:57:48] attempt to negotiate that we don't include the option of the three years. I don't know if that
[2:57:56] that will change their willingness to serve or not.
[2:58:01] And I can speak to some of that.
[2:58:03] So part of the federal guidelines
[2:58:06] is that after we've only received one bid,
[2:58:08] we had to email out to other providers in the state.
[2:58:11] So I had to email out to five providers.
[2:58:15] I heard back from three of them saying
[2:58:17] that we're just too small or too far
[2:58:19] out of their region to even service us.
[2:58:22] So they kind of put that limit on us.
[2:58:24] So
[2:58:33] I see the third and fourth and whatever fifth year goes up to $40 and higher.
[2:58:41] Is that mean it's going to or can we just say no we want to lock in this rate for all
[2:58:48] five years or whatever?
[2:58:50] No the contract is so that you have for sure that base two years but then those following
[2:58:58] years will even know the prices they'll ultimately be adjusted them by the
[2:59:03] current CPI so
[2:59:08] we couldn't necessarily lock them into that.
[2:59:23] Honestly, what is
[2:59:24] our alternative? We don't have one so vote we move on.
[2:59:32] Okay. Okay, what's
[2:59:35] no further discussion?
[2:59:39] All in favor say aye, oppose no and the clerk will call the
[2:59:43] roll. Older, no.
[2:59:48] Older, shaffer. Hi. Older, tommon. Hi. Older, crannig.
[2:59:55] Hi. Older, cleven. Hi. Older, grenzo. Hi.
[3:00:00] All their true heart, all their Miller, aye, and all their Wharton-Wyler. Okay, and that passes. Moving on to the discussion and
[3:00:10] possible action, the regarding the industrial surcharge plan, discuss impossible, approve new industrial surcharge. Honourable Mayor, we've been here since five o'clock.
[3:00:29] We're
[3:00:30] been working real hard on floor ride.
[3:00:32] And I know I haven't given
[3:00:33] part of any attention to this at all.
[3:00:36] And I'd like to do more research on it,
[3:00:37] because they would like to give us
[3:00:39] a little presentation on it right now.
[3:00:41] Before we look at it, I would appreciate that.
[3:00:44] And also with the closed session,
[3:00:45] if we don't need to do that tonight,
[3:00:46] I'd like to post that, post-pulling that also.
[3:00:49] You've read my mind of that.
[3:00:51] I was going to at least kind of elude
[3:00:53] and get some history and say here is a material
[3:00:55] I know you are exhausted, I am too, and that we can take some time to answer any questions
[3:01:02] that you feel important to answer tonight or over the next couple of weeks when we come
[3:01:07] back.
[3:01:08] Do you guys want me to just give my brief summary on what's before you, and then go from there.
[3:01:13] So yes, based off of, I know we've had discussions with you in the past and with fair
[3:01:17] Graham about kind of the issues with our permit processes and industries exceeding their
[3:01:23] permit amounts, hence why we're also looking at the wastewater treatment plant expansion.
[3:01:28] And part of that then is how do we incentivize and have people stay within their permit
[3:01:34] amounts?
[3:01:34] How do we make sure if we're doing another expansion that they aren't going to continue
[3:01:38] to just utilize that additional capacity.
[3:01:41] And so part of the direction you guys gave us was to consider like a surcharge policy.
[3:01:46] So that's what's been presented.
[3:01:47] and we've sent letters to the various industries
[3:01:49] that this would impact back in September.
[3:01:53] Obviously it's not very well received by the industries
[3:01:57] and we had a lot of one on individual meetings
[3:01:59] with the businesses and phone calls or various avenues
[3:02:03] to talk through it.
[3:02:05] Obviously there can be economic impacts
[3:02:07] and impacts their operation.
[3:02:09] So we have the initial proposal that was presented
[3:02:13] in the one letter that might sent to them
[3:02:15] of what that surcharge could look like.
[3:02:17] In the updated letter, we included options
[3:02:19] where you could do the surcharge.
[3:02:23] You could impose only a surcharge to the mouse
[3:02:26] over the issued permit.
[3:02:28] You could do no surcharge.
[3:02:30] And then with any of that,
[3:02:31] there's things of like we could evaluate their permits.
[3:02:37] See, maybe push this out that it's not effective
[3:02:40] until like quarter two of 2025.
[3:02:42] So they have time to change their operations and also then have the industries kind of formulate
[3:02:48] an insuminant action plan of how they might come back into compliance with their permits.
[3:02:53] Unpowered of that note, we already have their grant starting a process of evaluating what
[3:02:58] the industries are sending us over the last three years and then what our new facility could
[3:03:04] allow and we anticipate that to be done in hopefully the next three to four weeks so that
[3:03:10] That also might be very helpful information for us to wait to have for you guys to consider
[3:03:15] to then see what have they been doing, what will the new plant allow, and how do we find
[3:03:20] that balance?
[3:03:21] So, our thought is probably to wait until that point as well, but it's a significant topic
[3:03:28] and so, at least, wanted to get it before you and allow you to then ask questions between
[3:03:34] now and then as well.
[3:03:35] Well,
[3:03:41] after that explanation, do we need to...
[3:03:48] Unless anybody else has any questions?
[3:03:50] The motion's table, otherwise we can just have the agreement of the mayor to set it on the next agenda.
[3:03:54] Yes.
[3:03:55] Okay. I will ask that be placed on the agenda at the next meeting.
[3:04:02] Are we okay waiting? Maybe not.
[3:04:04] So the next meeting, but until we have that...
[3:04:05] Until we have it?
[3:04:07] Yes.
[3:04:07] Until you have it.
[3:04:08] Yes.
[3:04:09] Yes.
[3:04:09] More input.
[3:04:12] Pardon?
[3:04:16] Yeah, we do not have to go into closed session if you guys want to go.
[3:04:21] We can or we can add that we I know we are planning for a closed session at the November
[3:04:26] fourth meeting for a different item.
[3:04:29] So we can have more of them.
[3:04:31] Is this is this something that needs this this can wait?
[3:04:34] I think it'll be.
[3:04:35] Yeah.
[3:04:35] Okay.
[3:04:36] Okay, so at this time, then we can go on to, right now we can move on to the business
[3:04:48] presented by older persons, correct?
[3:04:51] Okay.
[3:04:52] Anything?
[3:04:54] Okay.
[3:04:54] Just a reminder, tomorrow at 5.30 will be the ground breaking ceremony for the pocket
[3:05:00] Okay. Yeah. I'll put the up at the site, right? Yeah. What's Council back in trust in front of that? Yeah. Right. In front of. Yeah. Okay. And department heads. Thank you for sitting here. We owe you. Right.
[3:05:27] Is it about could you could we postpone that?
[3:05:38] Yes. Chief Kelly.
[3:05:39] Would you like to present that in our next meeting?
[3:05:46] Okay, and so and the press I'm sure that they have probably gone to bed already and
[3:05:54] Yeah
[3:05:56] Make a motion to adjourn all right
[3:05:59] And please note that we'll take up the business and thank you for
[3:06:07] All in favor, say aye.
[3:06:09] Aye.
[3:06:10] Oh, we are.
[3:06:12] Okay.