[0:00] I pledge allegiance
to the flag
[0:03] of the United States of America
and to the republic for which it stands,
[0:08] one nation under God,
indivisible, with liberty and justice
[0:14] for all.
>> Lord, please bless all assembled. Help
[0:17] us to do the best we can, make the best
decisions we can for the town of Groton,
[0:20] Indiana.
[0:35] » Roll call. Eddie Menzel, president.
Phil Stahler, vice president.
[0:40] » Here.
>> Alex Willis,
[0:43] » Here.
[0:45] » Andrew
Ellis, secretary.
[0:48] Mark Winkle, member.
>> Here, Robert.
[0:50] » And Meyer,
>> Here, Robert.
[0:53] » Chad Collyer,
>> Here, Robert.
[0:57] » Donald Jones, attorney.
[1:02] And our new town attorney,
>> He's with me. I'm sitting here.
[1:22] » All right, can I pause you guys for a
second? Who did the
[1:25] pledge?
>> Me.
[1:26] » Oh, no.
He always does the pledge. I just do the
[1:30] » prayer.
[1:32] » Thank you.
The president always does the
[1:36] » First thing on the agenda would be
consideration of the minutes
[1:41] of November
[1:58] » I'll read them, but I was out here, so
>> Motion that we accept the minutes.
[2:06] » I have a motion
by Councilman Boggs to accept the
[2:09] minutes.
Second.
[2:12] » I'll second.
>> All in favor.
[2:15] » Aye.
>> Opposed.
[2:17] So be
>> I abstain. I wasn't here.
[2:21] » You can still vote on the minutes even
if
[2:23] » Oh, really?
>> at the meeting. I'm just saying that the
[2:25] minutes You do not Yeah, you do not have
to be in the meeting.
[2:28] » Okay, well, I approve
Yeah, absolutely.
[2:32] I know, I thought I had to abstain.
[2:36] » All right. We have a
public hearing
[2:41] site plan review 26-01
for GBI a 1.1 million square foot
[2:49] distribution center
at 39 and Hollow Hill.
[3:00] » I need a motion to open the public.
>> I move that we open the public hearing.
[3:09] » All in favor.
>> Aye.
[3:10] » Aye.
[3:14] » Public hearing is open.
>> We do not have anyone signed up to
[3:17] comment.
>> Pardon?
[3:20] » No one signed up to comment.
>> At all?
[3:24] » No.
[3:26] I don't think anyone's here to either.
>> Okay, well, then I'll move that we
[3:30] close the public hearing.
>> Second.
[3:40] » All in favor.
>> Aye.
[3:42] » Aye.
[3:52] » All right, do we have any discussions on
the site plan review?
[3:57] Do we have any discussions for the site
plan review?
[3:59] » I just know that these presented here
are just they're missing a stub for what
[4:02] would be the
the
[4:04] the road into
>> That is correct. The most up-to-date one
[4:07] is there in front of you on the board.
Yeah, that one there.
[4:10] » Because there's a stub on there.
>> Does that have the stub street?
[4:13] » Yeah.
>> Is it the same one that was here last
[4:16] month?
>> Yeah, yep.
[4:20] I just grabbed the wrong
little handouts.
[4:23] Cuz I had a lot of them now.
>> Because it did Alec, it it's just
[4:26] missing the stub there on the very
bottom.
[4:29] So, that's all.
[4:46] It's here.
Yeah, there's a
[4:50] stub.
[4:53] Do you uh
Do you want a motion on this?
[4:56] Well, since we have no more in the
public hearing
[5:00] We do have discussions for as the
planning commission.
[5:09] » We do want to make a determination on
the curb cut before we move forward from
[5:13] here.
>> Can I couldn't hear you.
[5:15] » We want to move make a determination on
the curb cut at the access to 39
[5:20] before we move forward.
>> Okay.
[5:35] » That's not
not
[5:38] been
approved
[5:41] by NCDOT as of yet.
>> I was going to ask if that was
[5:44] somebody's next question.
NCDOT has has NCDOT seen it though?
[5:55] » Okay.
[5:59] Okay.
[6:04] Okay. So, INDOT's already seen this.
[6:13] Okay.
>> They won't be able to get a permit to
[6:15] construct until the permit their permits
for the road access is approved.
[6:20] » Well, if that'll happen
>> and submitted to me.
[6:22] » stipulation that
[6:31] » Phil, can you step up to the mic?
>> Thank you.
[6:33] » That helps, Phil. That way everybody
will hear.
[6:36] » So, with INDOT, you have to submit a
traffic impact study, which studies
[6:40] current traffic, future traffic, and the
engineers make a determination of what
[6:45] that intersection looks like based upon
that.
[6:48] The drawings are a picture of that
written description of what is required
[6:54] for that intersection.
And so, the traffic study has been
[6:57] approved by INDOT.
>> Mhm.
[7:00] » The drawings are in the process of being
approved. The drawings represent the
[7:05] outcome of that traffic impact study.
[7:10] And you can't submit your design until
you have an approved traffic study.
[7:14] » I understand.
>> And so, that's why
[7:16] it would be we would be asking for
contingent approval.
[7:34] » Do you have a INDOT permit?
[7:41] » Yeah.
I understand.
[7:48] » And we've also been coordinating with
John Harris. There was one comment that
[7:52] we needed to address with him, which is
being addressed.
[7:54] It was mainly adjusting our pavement
section.
[7:57] » Mhm.
>> Since it
[7:59] that portion is controlled by
Henrico County for on the Kelly Hill
[8:04] Road connection.
So, the approval will be contingent on
[8:08] that approval as well.
[8:13] » Because I think Henrico County handles
all the roads that are on the south or
[8:17] east side of the county, and that's the
reason they handle Keller Hill.
[8:21] » Yeah.
>> [snorts]
[8:21] » Yeah.
[8:37] » I will say I I read it through the
traffic study I was and
[8:40] anybody else did, and
there were really a couple times I noted
[8:45] down that number one
study is done in December, probably
[8:50] once a year for traffic.
There before
[8:54] » Is that not the latest one?
>> That was the first
[8:56] first one.
The second
[9:01] in June.
>> I thought I provided that one as well.
[9:07] » Right.
>> Okay.
[9:10] I I did uh provide the June one. I have
it's it's in there.
[9:14] » Could you give me a time of the study
then?
[9:20] » I don't I don't see a problem with him
present uh see
[9:24] comment on that, do you?
>> No, I'm fine with that.
[9:31] » Evening, Eric Wickersham with American
Structure Point.
[9:34] » Mhm.
>> So, from EMCS, we have their initial
[9:37] executive summary. It's
>> the quick parts.
[9:41] Um
At least for the State Road 39 and
[9:45] Keller Hill Road, there were no
additional improvements recommended for
[9:48] this intersection.
For State Road 39 and Creekside Drive,
[9:52] there were no improvements or
recommendations for this intersection.
[9:57] For the original proposed access A,
which would be intersection three,
[10:02] they would recommend a minimum 100-ft
storage
[10:05] for the left turn lane.
The shifting taper will extend to the
[10:09] south end of the structure of a Cracking
Creek, require the relocation and
[10:13] replacement of guardrail impacted by the
widening of the roadway, effectively the
[10:18] north end of our connection.
[10:21] And then for the State Road 39 proposed
truck access intersection four,
[10:27] this intersection will be constructed
with proposed development. The truck
[10:30] access is expected to accommodate truck
traffic entering and exiting the
[10:33] proposed development. The analysis
indicated that neither a left turn lane
[10:38] for westbound traffic nor right turn
lane for eastbound traffic is warranted
[10:42] based on this study.
[10:46] » But we discussed last time that
I know you said you couldn't guarantee,
[10:51] but the truck traffic would be going on
Keller Hill Road.
[10:54] » Yes, that is the intention. And the
reason for the second the traffic study
[10:58] that was submitted was
uh
[11:01] The first traffic study represented two
curb cuts on the State Road 39. And then
[11:06] that second curb cut was conceded, we
had to update the traffic impact study.
[11:11] And so, the most current one was shared.
It was dated
[11:15] » It's D1C in your packet.
>> June 8th of this year.
[11:20] » And we also know
Keller Hill and and 39, that's going to
[11:25] be a roundabout anyways.
I think we're going to start that what,
[11:28] 29?
>> In March.
[11:30] » March of
>> This March.
[11:32] » Yes. Keller Hill and 39 start next
month.
[11:35] » Start next month. Okay.
>> And if I remember correctly, the
[11:38] roundabout was considered in this
traffic study and there was no impact
[11:41] from that.
[11:46] » Thank you.
[11:53] » Well, I
I've got something I want to add to the
[11:56] stipulations.
Uh
[11:59] if
[12:03] a road
gets built at the intersection of the
[12:09] entrance to Homestead,
then
[12:13] that Stubbs Street
needs to extend into that road.
[12:21] So that traffic can use both the left
turn
[12:26] on 39 and they can also enter the
property from the road
[12:32] at the intersection of Homestead.
[12:37] » With that, did you want that to be a
commitment or stipulation?
[12:42] » Uh
that's probably be a commitment.
[12:45] » Are they going to have any say in that
though? I mean
[12:47] » Yeah, if it's not their property
>> Yeah, I don't know that they're going to
[12:49] be able to have any say in that or not.
>> Well, it has to it has if it's a useful
[12:53] road, a public road.
>> Which is what we would like to see it
[12:57] become.
>> And it may eventually become.
[13:00] » Yeah, but they can't there's Yeah, but
they're not going to have any They're
[13:03] not going to be able to have any say
in how that happens. I mean, they can
[13:07] only control what they have as far as
their property is concerned. I think
[13:11] » They got I mean, they got the curve
coming there. We're able to
[13:15] We're able to
>> connect it.
[13:17] » have a say in if that
if it materialize, it would be
[13:23] we would need to force them in the
middle of that to be able to actually
[13:27] have them stop there waiting on us to
have an engineer
[13:32] » I don't think we can ask them to build
us something else probably.
[13:35] » And besides we're also going to be I
agree and I think we're going to be at
[13:39] the mercy of whoever built that darn
road anyways and as to whether they're
[13:41] going to go ahead and accept that stuff
there anyway.
[13:43] » He's broke.
It all depends on if you have any say in
[13:46] the future.
>> Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
[13:55] I agree with No, I'd say about a 50/50.
[14:06] We're all at the mercy of whatever
Google does with that road anyway, no
[14:10] matter what.
>> The only way we can
[14:12] The only way we can have any say in
doing it is to
[14:15] try to pressure the county into making
sure that
[14:18] » Exactly.
>> that it's connected to the stub.
[14:21] » Exactly.
>> Cuz they're the ones that we're going to
[14:23] have to have control over that little
parcel if that road
[14:27] materializes.
That's going to be a county decision.
[14:29] So, we're going to have to try to force
the county into making sure it gets
[14:34] connected.
>> So, I don't think we can go ahead and
[14:36] add this as a stipulation.
>> From my current understanding, I
[14:38] wouldn't count on that being a public
road for 5 plus years.
[14:42] » Right.
>> So,
[14:44] you know, but I'm still saying
>> But if it becomes a public
[14:47] » Yeah, then we can have them connect to
it because we already have them have the
[14:50] stub to the edge of their property.
Yep.
[14:55] Yep.
[14:57] » Then the I guess the other concern of
mine would be if the GDI was
[15:03] if
the developer was using that road as
[15:06] well as Google,
then that makes now three
[15:10] intersections.
[15:14] » That's a positive from public safety's
point of view, but maybe not ours.
[15:18] But I That's not something that we can
do
[15:21] until we come to it 5 years from now. I
mean, we're we're look we're trying to
[15:24] look at 31 and 32. We can't do anything
with that.
[15:29] » None of us may even be here.
[15:33] » Exactly.
[15:37] » I'm ready to
move forward.
[15:41] » All right.
[15:47] » So, do we need one to call to make a
motion?
[15:53] » I move that we
uh approve
[15:57] the site plan as presented with the
stipulations that we've already agreed
[16:01] » Uh could you spell out those
stipulations, please?
[16:04] » They're going to be documented here in
the document here. You can go ahead and
[16:07] add them.
>> The building department the item from
[16:10] the floor construction to be done.
>> I still have a motion on
[16:17] » We need
>> Do we have a second?
[16:19] » I'll second.
>> Accepted.
[16:22] » Uh
>> Bob second.
[16:24] » Mhm.
[16:38] » Yeah, go ahead.
>> Do you mind when that motion, are you
[16:40] approving the new curb cut? When you
approve the site plan, are you approving
[16:43] the new curb cut as presented in that
site plan?
[16:46] » Yes.
>> Okay.
[16:47] Just want that
>> Yeah, this the one that he handed out
[16:49] was just
>> I'm just saying it for the for the
[16:51] record since you have to approve that.
Absolutely.
[16:54] » Yeah, that's why we have this one.
>> That makes sense.
[17:07] » I'm for
I'm for
[17:11] I'm for
For.
[17:16] I'm for strap.
>> Against.
[17:23] Possible is four.
[17:32] I like I guess.
[17:50] Four
and two against.
[17:55] » 884
>> Yeah.
[17:58] » 34
>> Yeah.
[18:00] » Just making a note of this.
[18:13] Make sure to add in there that this is
contingent on their
[18:16] vacating and replat for next month as
well.
[18:19] » Pardon?
>> Make sure to add on the stipulations
[18:21] that it's contingent on the vacate and
replat for next month.
[18:27] For the next public hearing we have to
do.
[18:34] » Yeah, that was already discussed ahead
of time.
[18:36] » Just making sure it's on the record.
>> The reason for that is on a site plan
[18:40] review you're saying that the site plan
complies with all aspects of the
[18:44] ordinance. If you haven't properly
vacated and replatted the property then
[18:49] you can't also say that it complies with
the ordinance. So that's why we're
[18:52] adding that as a condition.
>> Yeah.
[18:56] » And we also have to have a public
hearing on the plat separately from site
[19:00] plan review so that way the public can
come and present
[19:03] their opinions as to the plat even
though the approval of the plat is a
[19:06] ministerial decision meaning you must
approve if it meets the requirements of
[19:10] the ordinance.
[19:13] » And I think it already does.
>> You can't hear that until next month.
[19:17] » Correct.
[19:26] If that's the biggest mistake I make all
year, I'm doing pretty good.
[19:29] Huh.
Well, you don't have to be town manager
[19:30] anymore.
Thanks, Scott.
[19:49] » Well, that's four point two gigs, so I
think it's pretty
[19:55] » Okay.
[20:00] Congratulations again.
See you next month.
[20:04] One last go.
[20:07] I need to hear more about Italy.
[20:53] We're just finishing paperwork.
[20:57] » All right, August planning and building
report.
[21:01] Eight new single family homes
for DR Horton
[21:07] in
Homestead.
[21:09] One remodel
for Melissa Lloyd
[21:14] 125 South Chestnut.
[21:20] » She's got a sign permit, too.
[21:28] » One pole barn for Andrew Arthur, 192
East Main.
[21:36] Melissa Lloyd, also
125 South Chestnut, has a sign permit.
[21:43] Greek's Pizza, 160 West Main, has a sign
permit.
[21:53] » How many more houses do we have left in
total out there?
[21:56] » Roughly 160
to 180.
[21:59] » Still we go.
>> Yeah, section 9C
[22:02] and 9B combined have 120
>> two houses.
[22:06] And then they're still finishing up
section 9A,
[22:10] which is 20 to 40 or so left.
They're They're moving fast on them.
[22:16] Eddie had what, 33 inspections like this
month, last month?
[22:20] » Or no, 2 weeks.
33 inspections in 2 weeks.
[22:24] » Amazing.
[22:37] » Do we have any old business?
[22:45] New business
is our uh
[22:49] 2027 plan commission schedule.
[22:56] » Yeah, that December 13th is a Monday, so
because of the the
[23:01] town council meeting getting moved up.
>> Yeah, it's on that day.
[23:04] » that the Christmas holidays, yeah.
>> It's uh similar to last year's in
[23:09] structure.
Or this year's, I suppose.
[23:16] » Okay.
>> I move that it be approved.
[23:21] » I'll second.
>> All in favor?
[23:24] » Aye.
>> Aye.
[23:25] » Opposed?
>> It'll be it.
[23:29] » Okay, I do have one more piece of new
business that I want discussion on. Um
[23:33] Anna and I have been talking about uh
violation enforcement. Currently, we do
[23:37] not have a penalty fee schedule. I was
wondering if it's in the commission's
[23:40] best interest that we work together to
create one and if you guys
[23:45] want me to spend the time to do that.
>> I thought we Isn't there something in
[23:49] the UDO on that already?
>> Regular fee schedule. Our penalty fee is
[23:53] 25 up to 2500, but it doesn't have any
state like tall grass. What do I charge
[23:59] for that?
Right? Is it 50 bucks? Is it 100 bucks?
[24:03] How much is too much? How much is too
little? So, if we get that in writing,
[24:07] that that's what I would charge for
that, then that makes it easier on me to
[24:11] instead of just having to guess between
zero and $2500.
[24:15] » Isn't the violation bureau aren't they
supposed to go ahead and
[24:18] » Not for penalty fee schedule.
>> Okay. I didn't know whether they would
[24:23] » They've never met yet.
>> They haven't. Yeah.
[24:26] Put that thing together.
I knew it never met.
[24:30] » So, I would list out all the different
kinds of penalties for different kinds
[24:33] of violations I get, and then
we could assign a price to that if I
[24:38] have to fine somebody. I don't have to,
usually, but it's good to have that
[24:42] there.
>> have Have you talked to any other
[24:44] municipalities and see what they do?
>> Yeah, like Mooresville, Plainfield.
[24:48] » I just get copies of theirs so we can go
ahead and look at that and go from
[24:50] » I've looked at other ones. I didn't send
them today. Um Anna had mentioned that
[24:55] it's probably not best to just copy
someone else because
[24:58] » But it might give us an idea.
>> Yeah, we we can discuss. Right.
[25:02] » If if if it would give us a starting
point to you know
[25:05] that would help.
>> Yeah, we can find out what they're
[25:07] charging for you know tall grass.
>> Yeah.
[25:10] » Or what's getting charged for you know
>> I just wanted to get the conversation
[25:13] started before I put work in spend our
money on it.
[25:17] » Wouldn't it be easier instead of just
coming up with something off the head
[25:21] wouldn't it be easier if you go to
like Mooresville find someone that's
[25:24] already got something and that could
give you a starting point?
[25:28] » Yeah, for sure. I've I've been doing
that. Yeah.
[25:31] » Yeah, I mean I think that's
the best way to go would be to start out
[25:35] like that instead of well
cuz I don't know all the things that
[25:39] could
>> Oh, I know.
[25:40] » go wrong or be in violation so
you know
[25:43] hard for me to say
what's going to be serious to have a big
[25:48] fine and what's a nuisance for a little
fine.
[25:51] » Exactly.
That's why I didn't want to leave it up
[25:54] to just me to pick up $2,500
to do that because I also don't know
[25:59] what's reasonable.
[26:03] » Yeah.
>> Just slap on $2,500 on everything?
[26:09] Oh, jeez.
>> Yeah, but he's going to be walking. I
[26:11] know he's going to be walking by my lawn
looking at it again.
[26:16] » I'll get
>> [laughter]
[26:17] » I'll get death threats if I pass this.
>> He'll watch Kenny do all that.
[26:24] » Okay.
Thanks for the feedback.
[26:27] » Anything else to say?
[26:30] » I'm ready to be adjourned.
>> I'll prepare for next month.
[26:36] » I'm I made a motion to adjourn.
[26:41] » I second.
>> You did.
[26:43] » All All in favor.
>> Aye.
[26:46] » Aye.
>> Opposed.
[26:50] » Turn your mics off if the stream's still
on.
[26:54] » Say anything.
>> Say anything to her, baby.
[26:58] » Donald Jones.
[27:05] » Everybody knows that the Great Captain
Old Gregg has finished.
[27:09] » Hey!
>> Yeah, yeah.
[27:11] » I told him
>> He was saying that he was a bit
[27:13] » It's a bridge.
>> I can't follow it.
[27:15] » It didn't fall for it.
[27:26] » Okay.
[27:37] » But