[9:39] Oh, I don't like this position.
[9:44] Okay.
[9:52] Condition.
[10:00] charges over.
[10:15] » Okay.
>> Yeah.
[10:17] » Better.
>> Okay. Thank you. So,
[10:23] I'd like to call this meeting to order.
Today, May 19 at 7:05
[10:29] p.m., this is a work session of the
mayor and council and is in person here
[10:34] at Pot Hall. Um, first item, the agenda
is called to order. Um, Danielle,
[10:42] » Mike,
[10:46] first item is called to order. Second is
what?
[10:50] » I'm calling to order. So
>> Oh, I thought you asked me to read the
[10:52] agenda.
>> I'm asking you to say here.
[10:55] » Here.
>> Jenny
[10:57] » present.
>> Joseph
[10:59] » present.
>> Valerie,
[11:01] » I'm here.
>> Okay, I'm here. So, it's a full quorum.
[11:04] 500. Item number two, review of the
agenda. Five minutes. The mayor and
[11:08] councel review the agenda for the
meeting, adding or deleting topics of
[11:12] interest or discussion.
Um, so you we already did call to order.
[11:19] We, you know, are reviewing the agenda
right now. Item number three is update
[11:23] discussion the 3200 Row Island Avenue
property. We will receive um an update
[11:29] from the owner 3200 block of Rland
Avenue. Um, presentation discussion and
[11:34] missing middle housing study draft
strategies. It's a 20-minut discussion.
[11:39] Uh, mayor and council receive a
presentation from Prince George's County
[11:42] Planning Department on the missing
middle housing study draft strategies
[11:45] and provide feedback and
recommendations.
[11:49] Presentation, discussion on tree
commission report. Mayor Council receive
[11:52] a report from the tree commissioners.
Presentation and discussion for of the
[11:58] city ordinance. Uh, 20 minutes. The city
manager and city attorney will present
[12:02] the following ordinance to the mayor and
councel.
[12:06] It just might have there's like a big
space in between. All right. Ordinance
[12:09] 04-2026
amending the code of the city of Mariner
[12:13] by repealing and reacting chapter 7
license and permits for the purpose of
[12:17] systemically revising provisions that
absolutely and efficient or do not
[12:22] reflect actual city code compliance
activities and to reorganize its
[12:26] provision for greater clarity and
efficiency. Efficiency of enforcement
[12:31] and transferring section 1-01-107
[12:36] A illegal evictions to chapter 10 peace
and order as section 10-1 to3A
[12:43] ordinance 05-2026 amending the code of
the city of Marina chapter 9 parking
[12:47] meters to eliminate parking meters and
provide for the establishment of paid
[12:51] parking zones as a mean of charging for
parking and says and said zones
[12:56] ordinance 06-2026
Six. I made the code of the city of
[13:01] Mareno chapter 13 traffic uh to revise
and transfer fines previous privilege
[13:05] set forward in the city fee schedule and
make certain other minor revisions
[13:10] ordinance 07-2026
amend the code of the city of Marina
[13:14] chapter 3 building code section 3-105
permit fees to clarify the fees for
[13:22] demolition permits for building of 500
square feet amend chapter 3A standard
[13:27] for property maintenance
Section 3A-108
[13:32] violations and penalties to increase the
fines for certain violations. Amending
[13:36] chapter 6 health and nuisance section
6-118
[13:41] penalty to conform to penalty to amount
set forward previously in the mounter
[13:45] fee schedule amending chapter 12 street
section 12-109
[13:50] removal of snow le of freezing rain to
revise and transfer fines previously set
[13:55] forward by the fee schedule amending
chapter 14 animal control section 14-116
[14:01] penalty to increase fines to certain
violations and amending chapter 16
[14:06] violations of ordinance section 16-103
fines payments of fi fines payments of
[14:13] fines in section 16-106 failure to pay
fines to implement authority granted by
[14:18] the Maryland general assembly to
increase the maximum fines for municipal
[14:21] infractions from 1,000 to 5,000 item
number seven presentation and discussion
[14:27] of emergency ordinance 02-2026
council will discuss emergency ordinance
[14:32] 09-2026 budget amendment number Two.
Item number eight, presentation
[14:38] discussion on the third quarter of
finance report 20 minutes. City manager
[14:43] Kamali Kouch. Oh, sorry. Kuru Kamali uh
finance consultant Ronda Wilson will
[14:49] present the FY226 quarter uh third
quarter financial report. Item number
[14:54] nine, presentation discussion resolution
06-2026
[14:58] ordinance O82026.
Mayor uh car will present resolution 06
[15:04] 20226 ordinance 08 2026 establishing the
governoring of the city's uh son
[15:09] problem.
10 presentation discussion on
[15:13] legislative priorities and Daniel will
present a suggested turn practice for
[15:17] the council and city manager will create
the annual legislative priority list
[15:22] number 11 presentation discussion
legislative priorities council will
[15:26] discuss the legislative priorities for
the city uh including the Maryland
[15:30] municipal leagues uh in the state that
should read larks in case people don't
[15:34] know presentation discussion business
round table council member power will
[15:38] present a proposal business roundt
discussion item number 13 and and
[15:42] discussion on hybrid options on council
meetings. Council discuss potential
[15:46] having a hybrid option for council
meetings. Item number 14 presentation
[15:50] discussion FI27 legislative session
council uh customer half hour present a
[15:54] proposal begin FI27 legislative session
with a work session set a legislative
[15:58] meeting.
Item number 15 presentation discussion
[16:02] appointment members follow MUTC men.
Councelor Jakuda will present proposed
[16:06] appointment to the LA LTC number 16 uh
presentation of minutes. The city clerk
[16:13] present the minutes for May 5th
legislative meeting uh minutes a journ.
[16:17] And for coming events we have Marenia
Pride uh celebration June 27, 2026. And
[16:24] just a reminder, May is Asian-American,
Native Hawaiian, Pacific Islander um
[16:29] heritage month and Jewish American
Heritage Month, both uh by proclamation
[16:34] and ornance as well. So you can find
them in the website and and they're
[16:39] there. All right. So you guys have heard
a full read through of the agenda
[16:44] council. I need to know if there's
anything you guys need to add, remove,
[16:47] what are what is the plan? If there's
anything here you want to do. Um if not,
[16:52] we'll move to proceed. Anybody needs the
mic?
[16:55] » Joseph,
>> mayor. Um, I would suggest
[16:59] either removing item number three or
moving it to the end of the agenda just
[17:04] in case they do show up.
[17:09] » Okay. How about can we leave it as is
and if they don't come, we'll skip and
[17:13] then we'll come back to it.
>> Will that work? Because if I move it to
[17:16] the end and they don't come, then
>> whatever works best, but they're not
[17:19] here.
>> Okay. Thank you so much. Any other item?
[17:24] Nothing. All right. So, I need to hear a
voice um affirming that you guys approve
[17:28] this agenda as presented. So, Valerie,
>> I approve.
[17:33] » Joseph,
>> I approve.
[17:35] » Jenny,
>> I approve.
[17:37] » Daniel,
>> I approve.
[17:38] » All right. So, we have a working agenda.
Um, unanimously support for the agenda
[17:44] we have in front of us. All right. So
item number three is going to be put on
[17:49] hold uh until until the people uh from
3200 block come. Okay. So we are in
[17:56] agreement of that. So whatever time it
come they'll be the next item in. All
[18:00] right.
We're good because you guys are doing a
[18:04] lot of signals and I'm not sure what you
guys are talking about. All right. So um
[18:09] you LMTC people are not here. You don't
want to move them up in the agenda.
[18:22] Okay. Because that's going to be that's
going to be how do you call it? Um
[18:27] Joseph, you're
>> uh for those at home said Mary Lee will
[18:32] be here at 7:30.
>> Mary Lee will be here at 7:30. So she'll
[18:36] be
>> So that's in 15 minutes.
[18:37] » Yes.
>> And because the next agenda item is 20
[18:40] minutes. So that should be fine. sign
and then LMUTC. I recommend at least
[18:44] come to next meeting when we vote on it.
>> Okay. So, they're not here. So, it's
[18:49] just more like a read through. All
right.
[18:52] » Hi. All right. Perfect. Okay. All right.
So, we have um item number four will be
[19:00] the next one. Presentation discussion on
missing middle house study draft
[19:03] strategies. The Americans presentation
for prejudice county planning department
[19:08] and the missing middle house study draft
strategies. is providing feedback and
[19:11] recommendations. Who do we have here
from? Hi. Can you go ahead and press
[19:16] that button so it shows green so that
way um you're on and introduce yourself
[19:21] so we know who you guys are?
>> Absolutely you guys.
[19:23] » Good evening. Uh my name is Karen Muro.
I'm one of the housing planners in
[19:27] Prince George's County Planning
Department and the project manager of
[19:30] the missing middle housing study. And
joining me in giving you this
[19:34] presentation tonight is John Parks.
>> Hi, good afternoon um or good evening.
[19:39] My name is uh John Parks. I'm also
another housing planner with Prince
[19:42] George's County Planning Department and
the uh deputy project manager for the
[19:45] missing middle housing study.
>> I also just want to acknowledge that uh
[19:49] the supervisor of our NRS section in the
planning department CPD and also the
[19:54] division chief of community planning
department, Andrea um uh Andrea is also
[20:00] here with us today. Um Andrea Gillis and
Josephine Salvakumer. Sorry about that.
[20:06] I want to get their full names for you.
So, it's great to be back here uh with
[20:10] you. As you may remember, we gave you
the Missing Middle Housing Road Show
[20:14] virtually a few months ago. So, it's
great that you have that background as
[20:19] we're drilling down into more specifics
about the study. And tonight, what we're
[20:24] going to talk about is the draft
recommendations and strategies and then
[20:28] specific to um Mount Reneers and COC.
So, I'm going to start with a little bit
[20:33] of background for you. Uh could you go
back one slide, please?
[20:39] Thank you. As some of you are aware,
many other jurisdictions across the
[20:43] United States have undertaken a process
to address housing under production,
[20:48] affordability, and choices. We believe
that missing middle housing can be an
[20:52] additional way the county can meet those
housing needs and goals. This how
[20:57] housing shortage is experienced by both
renters and homeowners alike. That is,
[21:01] even when a household can afford to rent
or buy a home, there may not be an
[21:05] appropriately sized or priced unit
available in their area. This gap means
[21:10] that middle-income families have
difficulty finding appropriate housing
[21:14] in Prince George's County. But it also
means that current residents lack
[21:18] options to age in place, explore
first-time home ownership, and otherwise
[21:22] find homes that either aren't high-rise
apartment buildings or single family
[21:26] homes.
The goal of the study is to promote a
[21:29] range of missing middle housing types
and areas throughout the county, examine
[21:34] current barriers and opportunities, and
provide recommendations to create a more
[21:38] inclusive h inclusive housing future for
all Prince George's County residents.
[21:43] Next slide, please.
[21:48] Thank you. Historically, the county was
recognized as having a more competitive
[21:52] housing price points compared to the
region. But this increased demand for
[21:56] housing coupled with the narrow ability
to increase supply has driven up prices
[22:01] for everybody. And like other areas in
the county country, excuse me, Prince
[22:06] George's County is experiencing a
significant housing shortage. There is a
[22:11] mismatch between what housing is being
built and what folks need. Housing
[22:15] policies and development practices are
faltering to support firsttime home
[22:19] buyers to enter the market to provide
opportunities for seniors to age in
[22:24] place and develop pipelines for young
professionals. There is a lack of
[22:28] housing opportunities which directly dis
respond to the diverse needs of the
[22:32] county.
Given this reality, we have to think
[22:36] about housing production differently.
The study is exploring how to further
[22:40] housing production which meets the
unique needs of county residents through
[22:45] a diversity of housing types in both
form and scale.
[22:51] Missing next slide please.
Thank you. Missing middle housing
[22:57] describes a range of housing types and
design and unit count. These types can
[23:02] be anywhere from 2 to nine units and
have the same form and scale of a single
[23:06] family home. In many cases, these types
used to be built, but in the 1980s,
[23:12] zoning and building codes were changed,
and it made it basically impossible to
[23:16] build these types, and the outcomes of
development did not generate
[23:19] contextdriven types. These are examples
from across the country, but in many
[23:25] cases, missing middle housing types are
already in our neighborhoods. And the
[23:29] building on the top left is a forplex
located in Mount Rear Mount Reneer on
[23:34] Bunker Hill Road where it leads into
Eastern Avenue. Probably familiar with
[23:37] that. These are examples from across the
country. And in many cases, missing
[23:42] middle housing types are already in our
neighborhoods. As I said, not only is
[23:46] the form and scale of these are middle
in the traditional sense of a single
[23:50] family home and a large apartment
building, but the lower construction
[23:54] costs provides a more competitive price
point for middle inome families. Next
[23:59] slide, please.
[24:03] Missing middle housing functions best
when located in a walkable area with
[24:07] access to amenities, transit networks,
and jobs is critical to the success of
[24:12] this study. that way identify areas of
the county which are best suited for
[24:17] missing middle housing development
rather than offering merely an
[24:21] additional housing design which furthers
suburban sprawl. The studies identified
[24:26] two distinct target area designations
that you see on the map. The missing
[24:30] middle housing opportunity areas and the
missing middle housing focus areas.
[24:36] There were eight qualifying factors are
the place types analysis or nature of
[24:40] the existing built environment that went
into the consideration and development
[24:45] of these locations.
Job density, the development pipeline
[24:49] projects, proximity to plan 2035
centers, transit stations, population
[24:56] density, and street connectivity.
The missing middle housing focus areas
[25:01] are areas which meet all thresholds for
opportunity areas but have a combination
[25:07] of connectivity and access to local
amenities that make them especially well
[25:11] suited for missing middle housing.
Missing middle housing opportunity areas
[25:16] in areas with the potential to be
transformed from non-walkable into
[25:20] walkable places could support more
missing middle types and these should be
[25:24] encouraged and enabled. Next slide
please.
[25:29] Now, John is going to talk about some of
the study goals.
[25:33] » Great. Thanks so much, Karen. Um, so
housing policies in general can be
[25:38] organized into three categories.
Policies focused on housing production,
[25:43] housing preservation, or the protection
of existing residents. And this study is
[25:47] exploring a production focused policy,
which could be a tool for the county to
[25:51] respond to current and future housing
demand as highlighted in the previous
[25:55] slides. um based on internal
conversations within the planning
[25:59] department, leadership um and subject
matter experts. Um these are the the
[26:04] study goals that were identified in the
scope of work. Um and the project team
[26:07] has developed an approach for
accomplishing these study goals. Um
[26:11] these goals were identified by research
and analyzing best practices from around
[26:15] the country, regional trends, um and our
county goals for creating more
[26:19] attainable housing choices for
middle-income households. Um and these
[26:24] study goals informed and guided the
draft recommendations which we are going
[26:28] to discuss next. Uh next slide please.
So as stated um we conducted research
[26:34] into best practices to encourage the
production of missing middle housing. Um
[26:38] and the team used their vast experience
and looked at thought leaders across the
[26:42] United States to develop re draft
recommendations and strategies which are
[26:45] tailored specifically to the needs of
Prince George's County. Um many of these
[26:50] recommendations discuss needed changes
to our zoning ordinance, building codes,
[26:54] and overall agency coordination to
achieve um a greater availability of
[26:59] housing choices for current and future
county residents. Um these strategies
[27:04] and recommendations are by no means the
final language um or even proposed
[27:08] changes to any ordinances or regula or
regulations. These are simply guiding
[27:13] principles um that we will use to
coordinate internally to achieve these
[27:17] goals. Um, and these are the the
categories of draft strategies and
[27:21] recommendations. And I believe um the
full list of draft strategies and
[27:25] recommendations was distributed. Um, but
if um anyone didn't get that, we'd be
[27:29] more than happy to provide um that full
list of strategies and recommendations.
[27:36] So, we want to go into the draft
strategies and recommendations that are
[27:39] specific to the city of Mount Reineer to
gather input and feedback. And again, we
[27:43] want to emphasize this study um is an
exploratory exercise in changes that
[27:48] would allow for missing middle housing.
Um this study will not directly make
[27:52] changes. It will be used to inform um
county and uh municipal decision makers
[27:58] about missing middle housing and how to
promote these types. Um, specifically
[28:02] the Mount Reineer Neighborhood
Conservation Overlay Zone or NCZ
[28:06] preempts many of the development
standards within the base zoning
[28:09] district regarding height, bulk, lot
size, and other components as well
[28:14] provides additional design requirements
in order to preserve the historic um,
[28:18] design context within the city of Mount
Reineer. And as Mount Reineer was
[28:23] identified as a missing middle housing
focus area due to its excellent location
[28:27] adjacent to amenities, access to
transit, and proximity to employment
[28:31] centers, uh the NC without amendments
may be a barrier to miss to some missing
[28:36] middle housing types. Uh the draft
recommendations uh proposed to encourage
[28:41] missing middle housing types within the
NC area, but also highlight the
[28:45] importance of developing design
standards to maintain neighborhood scale
[28:49] and character. And while this is already
being done by the NCO itself and
[28:53] neighborhood compatibility standards
within the zoning ordinance, it's
[28:57] critical to ensure quality design at all
levels of review. Um, as well, we have
[29:02] provided again the full list of
recommendations. Um, and we would
[29:05] welcome any insight regarding those uh
that full list of recommendations.
[29:11] And next slide, please.
[29:16] Um, and as well I do want to highlight
that the um photo that's in the bottom
[29:20] is actually another forplex within uh
the city of Mount Rineer.
[29:24] » It's a fiveplex.
>> Fiveplex. Apologies. Fivelex.
[29:27] » Cottage city. Uh, a close neighbor.
>> Close neighbor.
[29:31] » Um, next slide, please.
[29:36] If we go back one. Yeah. So, this is a
truly a paradigm shift for the county.
[29:40] Um, an implementable uh, missing middle
housing policy will augment the county's
[29:44] ability to respond to the acute housing
needs of our current residents and
[29:49] retain or attract the next generation of
Prince Georgians. Um, something like
[29:53] this has never been done in the county
and this study provides a substantial
[29:57] body of work to inform the planning
department's vision for housing as well
[30:00] as county and municipal stakeholders and
assist in concise or correct messaging
[30:05] and inform um, our decision makers about
how to proceed in promoting missing
[30:09] middle housing uh, within Prince County.
And with that um, we would love to
[30:14] transition to a more open-ended
discussion um, about the draft
[30:17] strategies and recommendations. So,
thank you so much for having us. Thank
[30:20] you so much for the presentation. I'm
gonna open it up to Mayor and Council to
[30:24] see what questions they they have. Okay.
Um
[30:28] we are going to start Joseph.
>> Thank you, Mayor. Um I'm very excited to
[30:34] see this study progressing and I you
know I from what I understand about
[30:39] middle missing housing, it really brings
vibrancy to communities. It helps with
[30:43] long-term financial stability. Um and um
it also you know the we don't just have
[30:49] examples in our community from time in
memoriam. We actually not in the end
[30:54] cause but in the LMUTC we did have a
vacant lot used to be a underwhelming uh
[31:00] community garden um and is now four town
homes right right in the heart of
[31:05] downtown. So we we show we can do that
in Mount Reineer. Um the two things I
[31:10] was hoping to see in this study if it's
not too late to include them. I would
[31:15] love to see some how it would positively
impact our businesses because I often
[31:19] hear about how businesses don't have
enough uh customers and I know that if
[31:23] we have a denser um area with more folks
living in it that can be more of a
[31:28] customer base for our small businesses.
And the other thing I would like to see
[31:31] is I know that the as you put more
housing in you in less space you wind up
[31:36] with uh benefits for your tax rate. So I
would love to see how this could
[31:41] positively impact our communities. uh uh
our city's tax income um as you work
[31:47] through the study and I can send you
some links too if anything that if you
[31:51] need any guidance on that.
>> So every time you move away from the mic
[31:56] » they cannot they cannot pick you up.
>> No cuz you keep doing this just so you
[32:00] know
>> it's it's all dropped off. Jenny
[32:03] Danielle Valerie go ahead.
Um,
[32:08] so I'm new to dealing with Prince
George's County politics, but as far as
[32:14] I have learned, um, a year into being on
council, we don't really have any power
[32:20] here. And I'm I'm curious
given what you discussed in terms of the
[32:27] overlay uh zone um as a municipality,
what actually could we do to support um
[32:35] development of missing middle?
>> Sure, that's a great question. Well,
[32:39] this um any any changes to incorporate
new missing middle housing types
[32:45] throughout the county or in certain
areas that were identified on the maps
[32:49] before, the focus areas and the
opportunity areas. Um I think will take
[32:55] place through um either um sector plan
updates. we'll be writing that language
[33:02] to encourage that and and get it into
writing. Um so that when proposals come
[33:07] forth, we can compare those and and
support those types of developments. And
[33:13] then also um through probably some text
amendments to the zoning ordinance
[33:17] because as you know the planning
department does control the zoning um
[33:21] and other regulatory standards for
development in the county. for as far as
[33:26] the NC, what the strategy is
recommending is to um allow certain
[33:32] missing middle housing types, especially
more duplexes and triplexes in the NCO
[33:38] overlay zone so that you can incorporate
more missing middle housing types. And
[33:43] then back to Mr. Jakuda's uh point about
increasing small business activities. Um
[33:49] I want to point out that um one of the
things that uh one of the benefits that
[33:54] missing middle housing types have is you
know we talked about how they really
[33:58] work well in um walkable environments
where there's access to amenities and
[34:03] services. And you know, the more the
more um the more residents you have, the
[34:09] more people who are able to take
advantage of those, they're able to um
[34:14] support those businesses. In fact, there
was a Brookings Institute study that
[34:18] found that, you know, um there was an
80% increase in um small business
[34:24] activities just by um increasing the
walkability in those environments. So,
[34:30] um that's a good thing for the city.
It's a good thing for the small
[34:34] businesses in the city. But um as far as
making changes or recommendations to
[34:40] advance missing middle housing
throughout the county, that will
[34:43] probably be done by us through plan
changes and amendments uh to the zoning
[34:48] ordinance.
>> And and if I can add as well, a critical
[34:51] component of this is looking at the
design and what these missing middle
[34:56] housing types will look like. Um while
it hasn't been initiated yet, um we're
[35:00] going to be exploring that design and a
critical feature of that is partnerships
[35:04] with municipalities. Um you all know
best the feel and character of your
[35:10] communities and we want to ensure that
any new um housing types um specifically
[35:16] any new missing middle housing types
complement and and bolster the existing
[35:20] neighborhood fabric of that. So that
partnership is is critical. Um
[35:24] regardless of, you know, our agency
having land use authority, we we look to
[35:28] municipal leaders um to be able to
provide input on what these types are
[35:32] going to look like in the communities
that you represent.
[35:36] » Danielle,
>> thank you so much for coming. Um I
[35:40] actually first learned about missing
middle housing um when I did the uh
[35:44] neighborhood academy with uh parks and
planning. I was in the first class and
[35:48] it was very interesting to learn about
the different zoning types and stuff in
[35:51] the community. Um, what we have, what we
don't have. Um, as you may know, Mount
[35:56] Reineer is I I think we still hold the
designation of the most densely
[36:00] populated city um, in the state of
Maryland. So, density is not something
[36:04] that we are afraid of. Um, I I see this
map here of areas in Mount Reineer that
[36:10] um, Reineer, I could get in trouble for
not saying it right. Um, are there any
[36:14] specific areas that you have identified
here in Mount Reineer that you would
[36:18] like to see converted or is this just
bringing it to us for information? Do
[36:24] you have any
>> to you for information? We have not
[36:26] identified.
>> Before you answer, can I get council to
[36:29] add more time because we only have three
minutes. We still have like two speakers
[36:32] to speak.
>> Um, make can you guys a motion for at
[36:35] least um whatever 10 more minutes?
>> I motion we add 10 minutes to the clock.
[36:39] » Can I get a second?
>> Second.
[36:41] » All right. probably moved and second.
Any discussion? Objection stations
[36:46] hearing none. Apologies. I didn't want
to cut that. Go ahead.
[36:50] » Thank you.
>> You can answer.
[36:51] » So your question again,
>> my question was I mean I saw the map
[36:54] here that you have in Mount Reineer and
you have all the and I know those are
[36:58] the zoned areas that are zoned for this.
Do you have any specific you know like
[37:03] housing or vacant housing or anything
that you have identified?
[37:06] » No, not at this point. We are not
identifying specific parcels or
[37:11] properties. Um, we're not proposing to
take anyone's property or anything like
[37:16] that. That's not what this is about.
This is about actually providing the
[37:20] opportunity to add more housing choices
for people to um be able to afford um
[37:26] where they live.
>> Awesome. Thank you so much.
[37:29] » Welcome. And again just adding on to
this, this is um the study is an
[37:33] exploratory exercise. So there will be
no accompanying uh zoning changes, no
[37:38] changes to the development standards
that are currently in the zoning
[37:40] ordinance. This is meant to serve as
kind of the body of research in order to
[37:44] inform those decision makers. So um yes,
we have not identified specific parcels
[37:48] or identified, you know, specific areas
that will have any sort of development
[37:53] modifications. system is simply
highlighting um that there could be a
[37:57] need to make changes within the um
specifically the neighborhood
[38:00] conservation overlays.
>> Well, thank you for bringing your study
[38:03] to us. Thank you.
>> You're welcome.
[38:05] » Um yeah, thank you. I think um I think
this is a great study. Um so, thank you
[38:09] for doing this. Um I think uh I would
like to we have a strategic plan coming
[38:14] up in the city. Um and I think this is
where this study could possibly inform
[38:18] some of that work for the next 10 years.
Um, and then I also wonder, um, are you
[38:23] all is this only in Prince George's
County or is this um, like a more
[38:27] statewide I know this is the Prince
George's Planning Department, but like
[38:31] is this happening elsewhere and what is
the engagement is their engagement with
[38:35] the state department of housing and
community development?
[38:37] » Sure. So, this is this study applies
only to Prince George's County. Um, but
[38:42] as you are aware, in the past several
years, um, nearby jurisdictions have
[38:47] gone through the same process. uh
Montgomery County um they were
[38:51] successful after going through some back
and forth and changes. Also, Arlington
[38:58] um Alexandria um was able to change it
relatively quickly and and easily. Um
[39:05] you know, every every place's process is
a little bit different. Everyone um
[39:10] either engages with it more embraces it
more readily or not. But this study
[39:15] applies only to Prince George's County.
And in fact, we've learned a lot uh from
[39:19] what other places have gone through um
by doing this as well. So,
[39:24] » and and a component of the study and a a
critical part of it is looking at those
[39:29] other areas. So, um within the study,
we're looking at um you know, how the
[39:33] the housing shortage is not um isolated
to Prince George's County. Um it is not
[39:38] unique to us. It is a nationwide issue
and that lends itself to we have a great
[39:42] body of work to look on what other
places are doing, how we can tailor that
[39:46] to the needs within the county. So, a
component of the study is looking at
[39:50] what other places across the country are
doing.
[39:53] » Thank you. And just to follow up, um is
there any communication or engagement
[39:57] with the state department of housing and
community development um on this
[40:01] particular issue
>> with the Maryland Department of
[40:04] Planning? They're aware of the study and
they are supportive of it as you know.
[40:09] Um they um convened a oh this is not
missing middle housing but an ADU task
[40:14] force that's another housing option
that's going to become available to
[40:19] Prince Georgeians at the end of the year
hopefully. Um that was a state mandate.
[40:24] Um and then the uh Prince George's
Department of Housing and Community
[40:29] Development is also a partner with us
and will be a partner um in implement in
[40:35] implementing this as well.
>> Thank you.
[40:39] » So once again, thank you for coming. I I
think that for me I'm happy that that is
[40:45] is happening. In the last legislation,
there was a very big housing bill.
[40:50] » Um various um from the top level from
Prince George County all the way through
[40:55] um u county executive team like county
council chairs and stuff like that went
[41:00] to speak when it came to their
letting you know the state know like hey
[41:05] we're doing this study and it's just not
about like throwing a number this how
[41:08] many houses you're supposed to have in
Prince George's County because not all
[41:12] the counties are the same right? So this
allowed us to be able to analyze the
[41:16] data. The other thing is like the
comment regarding um the municipalities
[41:20] don't have any input. We have a lot of
input that actually the current summit
[41:24] um our LTC uh team
>> right
[41:28] » like send stacks of information. So
Joseph um I think that they're going to
[41:34] be doing the same thing. So they would
from the first review all the way
[41:39] through the final they would submit
information to us as council say hey
[41:43] this is the recommendations and we were
passing them forward. I think that from
[41:47] what I understand from the team was um
over 90% of the things that the marine
[41:51] asked for it to be in the plan um were
actually incorporated.
[41:55] » Great.
>> So Maria has never been very silent
[41:57] about what is it that we will see it.
Um, and it's always, you know, thank you
[42:01] for clarifying that it's not about
taking nobody's property and Marine is
[42:05] in a very unique position cuz we're
tapped out.
[42:09] » Yeah,
>> we're very tapped out. We might have
[42:10] like a little hole here and there, but
the reality is like we're very tapped
[42:14] out on potentially what we could what we
could do and being the highest density
[42:18] populated um city in the whole entire
state.
[42:21] » You know, there's only so much room,
>> right? Well, as residential
[42:25] redevelopment can occur, these might be
good options for you. And I think that
[42:28] that's important that you guys voice
because I think people feel like, okay,
[42:32] we we're known for having beautiful
backyards, right?
[42:35] » And people feel like they're going to be
chopped off and another building is
[42:37] going to be thrown in there and now it's
like double the population and as it is,
[42:41] we're very tight spaced already.
>> But um so my question to you guys is
[42:47] what is the timeline looks like for you
guys to start the the process? And um we
[42:52] definitely I would like to invite you
guys back to figure out like um you know
[42:56] when it comes to community involvement
because big for us.
[42:59] » Sure. Um well I can tell you right now
that we are reviewing the draft of the
[43:04] final study um and on June 4th the
consultants and uh the planning team
[43:12] here will be giving a hybrid
presentation in front of the planning
[43:16] board on June 4th. So you might be
interested in tuning into that. And then
[43:21] after that,
>> we could pass it out to the committee.
[43:22] » Sure. I'll I'll send you um the the
link.
[43:26] » Okay. And thank you for the work. That's
something I think that there is a need
[43:30] for housing. Yes.
>> And I think that will be able to best
[43:34] relate what is needed in Prince George's
County.
[43:37] » Yeah.
>> That way, from what I understand, a bill
[43:39] might be coming next legislation as as
well, but at least you'll have like more
[43:44] data from our county. Yeah.
>> Not prior to CO. That's the concerns of
[43:48] people. It's it's really something that
um you know when you either read it or
[43:53] you hear the full presentation on the
full study that you know it's it's
[43:58] really enlightening and and you really
start to realize that you know we all
[44:03] have housing issues. Um we we may not
have them now but we've had them in the
[44:08] past. We'll be confronted with them in
the future. So now is a really good time
[44:13] to think about not only our needs but
everyone else's housing needs as we go
[44:19] forward
>> to be more of a sense of um making sure
[44:23] that
>> you know we have a lot of our seniors um
[44:27] aging in place but sometimes the houses
are so big and there's nowhere for them
[44:30] to go
>> right
[44:31] » you know and the price point for some of
the apartments are so expensive that
[44:35] they pay le mortgage in their house
something that I know is being talked
[44:39] statewise like what is the around to be
able to move people so that way um
[44:44] families are moved to the big homes
because we're big family homes but also
[44:48] like making sure that
>> there is a place for our our elders if
[44:51] they choose to move.
>> Yes. Yes. And that that concern has been
[44:56] voiced loud loudly by all sorts of
people that we've talked to for sure.
[45:00] And as well, I want to just echo um you
know, we are of course available um you
[45:06] know, whether Karen, myself, Josephine
or Andrea to answer any questions um as
[45:10] the advocates for your community, we
want to make sure that you're informed
[45:13] and provided with all the information
that um your constituents are are
[45:17] looking for. And if we can um have any
opportunity to to speak with anyone,
[45:21] we'd be more than happy to do that.
>> Thank you. Yes. And any information you
[45:24] have, we'd love to read it as a human
right here. Okay. So, thank you guys so
[45:27] much for joining us.
>> You're welcome.
[45:30] All right, moving on to item number
five. Presentation discussion tree
[45:36] commission report. The American council
receive a report from the tree
[45:40] commission. Hi.
>> Hello.
[45:46] » All right. Greetings. Good evening. My
name is Mary Lee Howitt. I'm the tree
[45:51] commission chair and today I'm here to
talk about the tree commission, what
[45:55] we've been up to, some of our activities
that are ongoing, some of our
[45:59] accomplishments and some of our
challenges. Next slide.
[46:05] So why does the tree commission exist?
What do we do? So we are established in
[46:08] the urban forest code, so chapter 12b.
And we have a lot of different
[46:12] activities that we do. We help maintain
and improve the city's tree canopy. We
[46:17] advise the city on trees. We educate
city staff and the residents. We
[46:22] advocate for the preservation of
existing trees. We do a lot to
[46:26] coordinate planting of new trees around
the city. And then we do have a formal
[46:29] role in the review of public tree
removals and hear resident appeals under
[46:33] the ordinance. So I'm going to talk
about some of these things in more
[46:37] detail in the next slide.
I'm not going to spend a lot of time on
[46:42] this because hopefully council
understands the benefits of trees, but
[46:45] for folks that don't maybe are less
familiar of like why trees are um
[46:50] beneficial to communities. This is a
short list. There's a lot more that we
[46:55] could say about trees and their
benefits, but these are some of the
[46:58] common ones. They help cool our streets.
They help save residents energy, um
[47:03] support wildlife, of course, absorb
storm storm water, calm traffic, and do
[47:07] increase property values. Next slide.
Okay. So for ongoing activities, uh we
[47:14] do a lot. So the tree commission is a
very active group and some of the things
[47:19] that we do throughout the year of winter
pruning of young trees. We help maintain
[47:24] the city tree inventory and and
coordinate tree observation walks in the
[47:28] summer. I'll talk a little bit more
about that. Tree planting coordination,
[47:31] which I mentioned already, maintenance
coordination. We work with utility
[47:36] companies in the city. Pepco and WSIC
are very common ones that are doing work
[47:40] in the city. Provide input on city
projects and then again have a formal
[47:44] role in terms of some assessment,
permit, waiver process and outreach and
[47:49] education. So next slide.
I'm going to talk a little bit about
[47:54] winter pruning. So winter pruning, this
is when I talk about the tree commission
[47:59] is involved in winter pruning. We're
talking about small street trees. Uh so
[48:03] we have hand tools that the city has
purchased that we use. We go around the
[48:08] city. Um we have a map that we mark here
on the right to notate kind of where we
[48:12] have been. Each commissioner has a
different color so we're not duplicating
[48:16] effort. And we're going to hopefully
every street tree in the city um that is
[48:21] small and manageable with with hand
tools and trying to do structural
[48:25] pruning. So why do we do this? Um to
establish strong, healthy and
[48:30] structurally sound trees. This reduces
costly corrective pruning by contractors
[48:34] later. And we also are being really
observant about pedestrian um clearances
[48:41] and car clearances. So, we're trying to
shape the tree so it's not hitting
[48:44] people in the face when they're walking
down the street or hitting a car as
[48:47] they're driving by. It's not perfect. We
can't get everything, but it is
[48:51] something we are attempting to do every
year. And this map is an illustration of
[48:55] what streets we were able to tackle as,
you know, a five to six member
[49:01] commission last winter. Um, next slide.
Just as a reminder for folks that don't
[49:08] know, um, the ordinance governs who
governs who can prune city trees. So
[49:14] only city tree contractors, tree
commissioners, city staff, and other
[49:18] trained individuals with a pruning
authorization letter can prune city
[49:22] trees. So this includes, you know, the
tree and the tree box in front of your
[49:26] house. And the reason is because you can
do a lot of damage if you incorrectly
[49:30] prune a tree. And so there's training
behind this and anybody could stop
[49:35] somebody pruning a tree and say, "How do
you have permission to do this?" And so
[49:39] that's why we have these authorization
letters that document the person has
[49:43] been uh trained and has permission from
the city to to prune uh small street
[49:49] trees. Next slide.
[49:54] And we do a lot with outreach. So we do
a PR a winter pruning workshop. We've
[49:59] been trying to do this on an annual
basis. So we had one in February in
[50:03] which our tree commissioner um Barry
Stall led a uh public workshop. Anybody
[50:08] could come learn about the benefits of
pruning, why you do it, and how to feel
[50:12] comfortable and confident in terms of
pruning your own trees on your property.
[50:17] Um, we also had some folks show up who
were interested in getting that pruning
[50:20] authorization letter to help out the
tree commission. So, this was a great
[50:23] way to get them trained up. Next slide.
All right, I want to talk a little bit
[50:29] about the tree inventory. This is a
database called accessible urban tree
[50:34] inventory Audi. And this is something
that's been instituted in the last
[50:39] couple years. Before we had a database,
we had an Excel spreadsheet which was
[50:43] prone to a lot of errors and very
difficult to maintain. And so the city
[50:47] has invested in this database. The tree
commission keeps it maintained. And just
[50:53] so everybody knows, this is a pretty
significant number. Uh there's nearly
[50:56] 1,600 public city trees in Mount Reneer.
So these trees all need to be maintained
[51:02] over time. And we are entering data into
this database such as the condition of
[51:07] the tree, species, size, location, who
planted it, is it native, naturalized or
[51:12] invasive. This is a very datarich uh
database and we can pull information
[51:16] about it. Um so pull information from
it. So for example, what are the top 10
[51:21] species that are plant planted in Mount
Reneer? There's a list if you wanted to
[51:25] know the largest tree in Mount Reneer,
the smallest tree, you know, how many
[51:28] trees were planted in the last um two
years. We can get that information. And
[51:33] just tonight, um, somebody from the tree
commission asked Lester, who maintains
[51:38] this inventory, can you make a map of
all the service berry trees because
[51:42] there's a lot of delicious service
berries out there right now. And so we
[51:45] have a map of the service berry trees
that people can go and and pick. Um, so
[51:50] that is going to be posted, I think, to
the list serve and to Facebook um, very
[51:54] soon.
Next slide.
[51:59] And all that data is overlaid on a
Google map. So each dot represents a
[52:03] tree. Um, so this is on the city
website. If anybody's curious about the
[52:06] tree in front of their house, I want to
know what kind of species it is. Is it
[52:10] in good condition? When was it planted,
you can zoom in, find the tree in front
[52:14] of your house, and this is the type of
information that pops up. Just it's all
[52:18] GPS located as well as correlated with
the street address as well.
[52:23] Next slide. All right. So one of the
ways we maintain the information in the
[52:28] database is we do summer tree
observation walks. So we're trying to
[52:32] walk every street in the city and look
at every tree. So nearly 1600 trees in
[52:38] the summer to observe um how are those
trees doing? What are are there any
[52:43] changes in health? Are there hazards? Um
we want to make sure the data in the
[52:48] database in terms of its location is
correct. And then we communicate any
[52:52] sort of hazards or risks to public
works. So we're just getting going on
[52:56] that. And so that's something we do from
June to uh November when the trees are
[53:02] leafed out and we can get a good sense
of their overall health. Okay, next
[53:05] slide. Tree planting. So we do a lot of
coordination with different
[53:10] organizations.
Uh over 636 trees have been planted in
[53:15] the last 5 years in the city. This is
largely through partnerships with Joe's
[53:19] Greenworks uh which is located here in
Mount Reneer. They've run some great uh
[53:25] tree planting programs in partnership
with the tree commission. Casey trees
[53:29] has planted a significant number of
trees in the city at no cost as well.
[53:34] And then the county had a huge uh
planting project related to the levy
[53:40] mitigation project. So that's a whole
other can of worms. But we did get the
[53:44] trees after 10 years of waiting and
nearly, you know, over over 260 trees
[53:51] have been planted through that county
project. We also get trees that the tree
[53:55] commission may work in cooperation with
the city in terms of planting as well as
[53:59] WSSC does plant trees when they remove
remove trees. Next slide. And then we do
[54:06] a lot with maintenance and coordination
with the city. When we talk about
[54:09] maintenance, we're talking about
pruning, possibly needing to remove the
[54:13] tree, watering is a huge concern for
young trees, staking, mulching, and some
[54:18] in some cases removing invasive vines.
Um, so we work very closely with the
[54:23] Department of Public Works, again,
pulling information from that database
[54:26] about tree hazards, feeding that
information up if there needs to be some
[54:30] pruning done. Um, Bartlett is the city's
tree contractor. So with the small
[54:36] trees, we're trying to tackle those as a
tree commission, but as the big with big
[54:40] trees, you need to bring in Bartlett to
handle that. Um, so this is a very close
[54:45] collaboration and a lot of work goes on
in this area a couple times a year.
[54:50] Particularly Bartlett comes to town, I
think one to two times a year to do this
[54:53] work.
Next slide. Pepco also comes to town
[54:58] every two to three years. um they're
doing line clearing work and usually,
[55:03] you know, surprises people. I know we do
our best to try to let folks know when
[55:09] they're coming to town. Um they are
planning to come to town at some point
[55:13] this summer, I believe. And so we have
looked at their plans in the past. We
[55:17] have met with Pepco reps to go over kind
of what their plan is. Um, we did as a
[55:22] tree commission provide some questions,
recommendations to public works that I
[55:28] believe went back to Pepco and we're
waiting for the response. One of the
[55:31] concerns was just about the timing. So,
we and this is in the ordinance as well.
[55:36] We recommend that uh work on trees not
happen in the spring when birds are
[55:42] nesting. So, if we can postpone that to
later in the summer, that is a best
[55:45] practice that we're trying to encourage.
All right, next slide. And then input on
[55:50] city projects. This is an example of
input that we provided on the Newton
[55:54] Street project. So we provided a letter
to the city with some of our
[55:57] recommendations. We reviewed plans,
provide advice. In the case of the
[56:01] Newton Street project, I did meet with
the contractor, had a really good
[56:04] conversation about tree root protection,
tree protection, and that was very
[56:09] productive. So trying to do that as much
as possible as well. Next slide.
[56:14] And then outreach outreach and
engagement is uh also a focus. We try to
[56:19] do our best as a small commission. Um,
free tree program in partnership with
[56:24] Joe's Greenworks is an example of that
where we worked with the city of
[56:27] communications to get the word out about
that project. We had an Arbor Day
[56:32] celebration where um we had a tree walk
led by Gabe Popkin on the the tree
[56:37] commission and um Barry Stall in which
we planted a couple uh white oaks in
[56:42] Richardson Park uh the picture there in
the middle. And then we try to do as
[56:47] much communication out to the community
by writing articles for the message and
[56:51] posting those other articles around on
the list serve and Facebook as we have
[56:56] capacity. Next slide.
All right. So the tree commission has uh
[57:01] two vacancies right now. So we just want
to make the council and everybody aware
[57:06] that we are seeking new members. Um as I
mentioned I think we are a commission of
[57:10] seven. Um currently there are five. We
are very passionate, active, fun team.
[57:18] Uh we like to get things done. So if if
folks are interested in trees and want
[57:22] to be part of this community of
treeloving uh residents, we certainly
[57:27] invite you to be part of the commission.
You don't have to be an expert on trees.
[57:31] I came to the commission. I didn't have
a lot of background except I like trees.
[57:34] I knew a couple species and have learned
a lot um from other folks.
[57:40] Next slide.
All right, just pivoting to challenges.
[57:45] I just want to talk a little bit about
challenges in some of the solutions that
[57:49] we have been working on with the city.
So I think one big challenge is that you
[57:54] know residents and contractors that come
to the city aren't aware that we have an
[57:58] ordinance that governs public and
private property trees.
[58:03] So h how do you deal with that? like we
need to communicate that there is there
[58:08] are these rules and there has been a lot
of effort invested in this um ongoing
[58:13] coordination with the city on
communication work with code code
[58:17] compliance in terms of enforcement
working with public works getting
[58:20] information on the website so folks
understand if they're looking for does
[58:24] the city have tree protections they can
find it easily but all that said we do
[58:29] realize that there's people that have
lived here for a really long time but
[58:33] still don't know that there's a tree
ordinance and they could get in trouble
[58:37] and find if they illegally remove a tree
without going through the pro the
[58:41] process. So over the last year we've
worked with the city to develop a door
[58:46] hanger. Um, so those just got printed,
which is very exciting. And they're in
[58:52] English and Spanish. And the goal is
that we're going to put those on every
[58:56] house door knob that we can over the
next couple months so that there's
[59:01] awareness. Um, everybody's getting
information equally hopefully. Um, so
[59:06] that is a big project that we've been
working on over the last year and
[59:09] excited it's almost to fruition.
Next slide. Infrastructure projects. So,
[59:15] I talked a little bit about, you know,
Newton Street and other things. You
[59:18] know, there's a lot of construction in
the city. It's, we just heard about the
[59:21] density of the city. Um,
trees are kind of, you know, in this
[59:27] very stressed space between sidewalks
and streets and when you're taking
[59:31] sidewalks out or doing curb work or road
work, it's very likely tree roots are
[59:35] going to be affected. And that's the
life support system of the tree. So we
[59:40] have really I think improved the
relationship with the city in terms of
[59:44] communicating that impact and trying to
put things in place to protect trees.
[59:49] So, tree protection plans, the
consulting arborist Matt MadiRaa is an
[59:53] expert in putting together tree
protection plans. Um, requiring
[59:57] contracts, contractors with the city to
understand the tree protection rules. um
[1:00:03] and having follow-up enforcement if they
are violating those protective fencing
[1:00:07] of trees and then like I mentioned you
know the tree commission has
[1:00:10] recommendations and we'll meet with
contractors in advance as well just to
[1:00:14] kind of emphasize certain best
practices.
[1:00:19] Next slide.
Another big challenge is climate change
[1:00:23] and drought. Uh we have all these young
trees in the city and they need to be
[1:00:27] watered. Um they need regular deep
watering. So any tree that's young, one
[1:00:31] to three years, needs regular watering.
And we are in a drought right now. So
[1:00:36] this is an ongoing challenge. I it's
it's hard to it's hard to find solutions
[1:00:42] other than trying to get people to water
trees and trying to, you know, find time
[1:00:46] with the city public works staff to help
with this as well. So we have often sp
[1:00:51] sent watering reminders, worked with
public works to get the water truck out
[1:00:56] and also thinking about planting climate
resilient species. So native native
[1:01:02] trees are more resilient to climate
change in many cases. So we're trying to
[1:01:06] emphasize that. Um and this is just an
ongoing challenge with you know we have
[1:01:11] some solutions. It's just it's it's an
ongoing challenge. Next slide. And this
[1:01:17] is my last slide just in terms of
challenges. Um, we are a volunteer group
[1:01:23] and just have limited capacity. We do a
lot and I just want to articulate a lot
[1:01:29] of the services that we provide as a
tree commission are provided by
[1:01:32] professional paid staff in other
municipalities
[1:01:35] and we understand, you know, this is a
small city and there's only so much uh
[1:01:40] funding to support additional capacity,
but I do think there could be some
[1:01:45] creative solutions to look at in the
future. Um I think one of our fears as a
[1:01:51] tree commission is if you know we get
burned out and the tree commission
[1:01:54] becomes less active a lot of that work
most of that work I just mentioned will
[1:01:59] not happen. So do we have more hazardous
trees that are causing problems for
[1:02:04] residents? You know all those things
could really come into play. So just I
[1:02:08] think the solution here is to think
forward about what could additional
[1:02:13] capacity
um in the in the city look like and some
[1:02:17] of the creative funding options may
include Chesapeake Conservation Climate
[1:02:20] Corps. There has been some funding
through Maryland's urban tree grant
[1:02:24] program for capacity building in cities.
Possibly cost sharing position with
[1:02:29] neighboring municipalities.
Maybe there's a sustainability
[1:02:33] coordinator position that could be
supported with grant funding that could
[1:02:37] include some of the work related to
trees that I mentioned as well. Anyway,
[1:02:41] that's just some forward thinking
thoughts that we've included in our
[1:02:44] budget proposals for the last couple
years.
[1:02:48] And in closing, I just want to say a big
thank you to city staff, um, Department
[1:02:53] of Public Works, code compliance just
for the support. It's a big
[1:02:57] collaborative effort. Uh we're working
very closely with all those departments
[1:03:01] and want to call out Victor from public
works who is transitioning over to the
[1:03:06] police department. He has been our tree
liaison for many years and has been a
[1:03:10] great asset and so wish him the best and
just want to call out his his great
[1:03:14] service to working with us. And with
that I'll stop and see if anybody has
[1:03:18] questions.
>> Thank you so much Marley and also uh to
[1:03:22] the whole tree commission. So, I'm going
to go around the room um to have the
[1:03:27] council have a question if they have
any. Uh but definitely if you guys want
[1:03:31] to describe the tree commissioners are
basically the Lorax. We speak for the
[1:03:35] very vocal and um and we appreciate that
because we have been able to save a lot
[1:03:42] of trees, not just plant them. So, um
every tree every tree counts here. All
[1:03:45] right. So, Joseph, I'm going to go with
you since you're the liaison first.
[1:03:49] » Sorry. Um but uh I'll start first and
I'm going to start by making a motion to
[1:03:54] add 10 minutes to the clock.
>> So make it
[1:03:58] » I I move to make add 10 minutes to the
clock.
[1:04:01] » Second.
>> Mr. Probably moved and second. Any
[1:04:03] discussion?
Objections. Hearing none. We're adding
[1:04:07] 10 more minutes to the clock. Go ahead.
>> No, thank you. Thank you, Mary Lee. I
[1:04:12] don't I don't have too many questions
because that was a very thorough
[1:04:15] presentation that really covered I mean
I I've been listening and participating
[1:04:19] in the well liazing with the tree
commission for a a couple months now and
[1:04:24] you guys just do amazing work. I can't
help but thank Lester and Judy and Barry
[1:04:28] and Gabe and yourself um for making this
all happen plus all the other volunteers
[1:04:32] that are pruning and I know there's so
much more work to do too because we're
[1:04:36] not you didn't even get into the
problems of English ivy that needs to be
[1:04:40] dealt with and then we also have rain
gardens which aren't trees but are also
[1:04:43] plants and we need help with. So I'm I'm
really supportive of looking for ways to
[1:04:48] find funding to make this happen in
future budgets because we need support
[1:04:52] for all this. Um, and it's it's re
really a vital service given the climate
[1:04:56] impacts and and the ability to lower our
temperatures and have fresh cleaner air
[1:05:02] um from having trees and other plant
life. Thank you.
[1:05:06] » I thought you said it was going to be
short. Danielle, Jenny, Danielle,
[1:05:11] Valerie, and Jenny.
>> Thank you. Thank you so much for this. I
[1:05:14] I I really enjoyed this presentation. It
was very well done. I I love trees. They
[1:05:20] used to call us tree huggers, but I love
trees. Um, sadly we lost two of our
[1:05:24] trees a few years ago in our backyard
and we replaced it with an oak that I
[1:05:28] think my husband got from Barry down at
the nature center two years ago and um
[1:05:33] it breaks my heart that it's not growing
faster. So I'm looking for another tree
[1:05:37] to put in my backyard. Um I I the things
you guys do and the mapping, you know,
[1:05:42] you guys do tremendous work and I just
want to point out that you know it's
[1:05:46] recognized um even by people who don't
know about the tree commission. I didn't
[1:05:50] know about the tree commission till I
got on council. Um um I love what you
[1:05:55] said about Pep um about Pepco trying to
coordinate with them because they came
[1:05:59] in the tool at Magnolia next door to me
at 3204. Um they just they butchered it
[1:06:05] and it was it broke our hearts to see
it, you know, struggling to try to
[1:06:09] survive. Um and I love the idea of the
door hanger. So um and you say you need
[1:06:15] two volunteers to join the commission.
There's two vacancies. I mean, we can
[1:06:21] function as a commission with five, but
the we would like there's a lot to do,
[1:06:26] so we would love additional members.
Yes.
[1:06:29] » Well, I will be more than happy to put
that in my newsletter and see what I can
[1:06:32] do to try to help you find people, too.
So, thank you for everything you do.
[1:06:36] Thank you for this wonderful
presentation. You guys are amazing.
[1:06:39] Thank you.
>> Thank you.
[1:06:42] » Um, yeah, thank you. Um, this was a
really robust presentation, which I
[1:06:46] appreciate. Um, I'm happy to see the
Audi system working really well. Um,
[1:06:50] because that's an exciting development.
Um, I do have a question about that
[1:06:54] though. Um, is there are there any plans
for training other people to use the
[1:06:59] Audi system? Is that something the tree
commission might do? Um, especially as
[1:07:03] you know, you have different people
coming onto the commission, you might
[1:07:05] consider having a training on using the
system so that um, the next generation
[1:07:10] of people can use it. That's something
to think about. And then and then the
[1:07:13] other thing I was going to mention is
that the Maryland State Department of um
[1:07:17] service and civic innovation is opening
their grant applications now for their
[1:07:21] service core year. And I feel like this
would be a great program to include with
[1:07:26] the tree commission to to show young
people about how to use uh tree um like
[1:07:31] to work on trees and work in a city
committee and things like that. So that
[1:07:34] might be something the city could
potentially apply to. So those are my
[1:07:37] two things, but thank you for your
presentation. Um yeah, thank you.
[1:07:42] Do do you want me there was a question
there so I can answer about the
[1:07:46] database. Um so Lester Sherman is our
database expert on the tree commission.
[1:07:51] He's
>> adopted this project and he could
[1:07:54] probably really answer that question
easily. There's there's a couple people
[1:07:58] that have access to update and maintain
the information
[1:08:02] and we we as the tree commission have
really been the group that's maintaining
[1:08:07] it. We would like the city to also be
maintaining that information as well. So
[1:08:15] we yeah we would love to to to do that.
I think there's an opportunity perhaps
[1:08:19] with with public works depending on cap
capacity. Um but I think it has to do
[1:08:25] with like number of licenses and access
permissions and I don't have that the
[1:08:29] top of my head but several people do
have access and there's an ability I
[1:08:33] think to to get more access. is just
making sure they're trained like you
[1:08:37] said.
>> Yeah. I just think it would be a cool
[1:08:39] partnership even with the Joe's stream
team um to show people how the system
[1:08:43] works just so that there's more
awareness of it and that it's being
[1:08:46] done.
[1:08:50] » Um thank you Mary Lee. Um I'm was
snacking on service berries from a
[1:08:54] street food. Love it. Um 3802 Rhode
Island Avenue right by Tanges. It's like
[1:09:01] loaded. Um, so I'm super excited about
the map. Um, and um, but I I wanted to
[1:09:09] ask you, there's been a few incidents
over the past year that I'm aware of.
[1:09:14] There might be others that I'm not aware
of in which people were um, cutting or
[1:09:20] like pruning, like bad pruning or like
actually just cutting down trees um,
[1:09:26] that that you brought to our attention
or that that were brought to your
[1:09:30] attention. And I I'm wondering how you
feel the partnership with the city has
[1:09:34] been with regard to uh like problems
like that and if there are changes or
[1:09:41] improvements um that you think um the
council should consider or the city
[1:09:47] manager should consider. M yeah I think
you know I've been in the city for 15
[1:09:52] years long well a little longer than
that and I have seen a great improvement
[1:09:59] I mean part of that is having an
ordinance and rules part of that is
[1:10:03] enforcement so you can have the best
ordinance in the world but if you don't
[1:10:07] have enforcement doesn't really matter
so code compliance is really I think
[1:10:13] stepped up is not the right word like
added capacity in this regard um to the
[1:10:18] point where I feel that the code
compliance officers understand the
[1:10:23] ordinance to a large degree in a way
that they haven't before. And there's
[1:10:27] been cases where I hear a chainsaw,
which I'm like one of those people that
[1:10:31] chases the chainsaw and code compliance
is there in some cases already kind of
[1:10:37] asking the questions. Um could there be
improvement? I'm sure there could be. Um
[1:10:44] we did have a meeting with code
compliance
[1:10:48] gosh I don't know like five months four
or five months ago because one of the
[1:10:54] problems that we identified is that uh
co- compliance officers can identify
[1:10:59] hazardous trees or a neighbor can call
in a hazardous tree like I just don't
[1:11:04] like those people therefore I want to
get them in trouble and say their tree
[1:11:08] is hazardous and get them potentially
fined or something like that. Um, and so
[1:11:13] KAP plays aren't tree experts. And so
there was a couple cases where they were
[1:11:19] deeming a tree hazardous, but without a
professional arborist, the city
[1:11:23] consulting arborist making that
determination. So we had a a meeting to
[1:11:28] try to iron that out. And I think it's
ironed out. Um, so if there is a
[1:11:33] question of whether a tree is hazardous,
bring in the city consulting arborist to
[1:11:38] provide that professional opinion. He
reacts very quickly. they can often come
[1:11:41] to the city within a day. Um, so there
had been a couple issues around that. I
[1:11:47] think it's been ironed out. Um, but
education I think is the solution to any
[1:11:52] sort of issue of unawareness. Um, I
think a lot of tree work happens on the
[1:11:57] weekends where people are trying to get
away with it. So I I realize that we
[1:12:02] can't have CO compliance working every
day of the week given budget
[1:12:06] constraints, but that could be an area
of improvement as well if we have more
[1:12:11] eyes on kind of those issues on the
weekends.
[1:12:15] » Yeah.
>> You know that our
[1:12:21] also
have a mic.
[1:12:25] » It's okay if I just add something. Just
want to let you know that and you know
[1:12:29] it that our police department on the
weekend you know in case if we receive
[1:12:33] any call and the neighbors or the
resident can call the emergency line and
[1:12:39] definitely the police is going to be
there and then they can contact the code
[1:12:43] and the code Alma is just 5 minutes from
here and she can be there and it has
[1:12:49] happened in the past too. So I do
appreciate that if there is anything
[1:12:54] like this you know just on the weekend
as you said there is a budget you know
[1:12:58] limitation and we cannot have anybody on
the weekends
[1:13:01] » right okay that's good to know thank you
>> thank you for that um I don't
[1:13:07] necessarily have a well I do have a
question from one of the residents that
[1:13:11] I didn't was able to answer so be
perfect for you uh but I going back to
[1:13:17] the two positions that are still missing
for commissioners
[1:13:20] Um if you're interested, please reach
out to the tree commission. Uh Joseph is
[1:13:24] the leazison as well. The city portals
there as well. But also when they have
[1:13:28] events, it's open to all the community
>> like when it's like the pruning where is
[1:13:32] like tree where is information, right?
Um they're very welcoming. So even if
[1:13:38] they say like hey we're going to be
pruning trees, it's like if you come in
[1:13:40] and like you know they're they're
willing to teach you on the spot as
[1:13:43] well. Um but also when tree planting has
happened like a lot of us have been
[1:13:48] hands on to try to support it because it
takes some time.
[1:13:52] » So either could be done within an hour
and a half or it could be done into
[1:13:55] several hours based on how many people.
So um so the big ask for the community
[1:14:00] is also like when you see information
out please come out and support the team
[1:14:04] so that way they're also not burned out
because if we have ex we could get all
[1:14:07] the trees in the world coming to the
city but there is um a requirement for
[1:14:13] you to take care of it for the first
three years for you to help them plan
[1:14:16] right and that is more of like a
learning curve um that needs to be so
[1:14:20] please continue to volunteer the other
one I was asked uh dogwood trees I know
[1:14:25] there's a few in the city.
>> Um, how do you call it? Is there
[1:14:29] something that we're thinking of adding
more or what does that look like?
[1:14:33] » We haven't had a lot of luck with
dogwoods as street trees. They're pretty
[1:14:37] sensitive and we have tried multiple
times in various locations and they have
[1:14:42] died. So, we as a tree commission do not
recommend dogwoods as street trees.
[1:14:48] Could be perfectly fine in your yard,
but we just have not had success. So,
[1:14:53] we've kind of crossed that off our list,
unfortunately.
[1:14:56] » Good. Thank you for telling me because
the ones that I know of, they're in
[1:14:59] private property. Those are people that
came and make it. I was like, I don't
[1:15:01] know. I have to ask. Uh, but other than
that, thank you guys so much. You guys
[1:15:05] are definitely when I say you guys speak
for these
[1:15:08] » heavily and we have been very gifted to
have within the committee many people
[1:15:13] that are very knowledgeable
>> that they're able to train and work with
[1:15:17] people that might not be as
knowledgeable. So we're we're able to
[1:15:20] balance the the committee enough and and
that has allowed also for us to be able
[1:15:24] to do as much as as as it comes to the
city because it's I think that when
[1:15:30] people hear uh tree commissioners I
don't think they always realize how much
[1:15:34] work
>> is being done but um if in doubt ask for
[1:15:38] the letter because everybody that uh has
applied for it they go through the
[1:15:42] process they need to have the letter so
that's something that people could
[1:15:45] easily do. So thank you for that.
>> Sure.
[1:15:47] » Okay.
>> All right. Thank you
[1:15:51] » and and thank you as well to our co
department for being great partners and
[1:15:56] stewards as well as public work um as
well because we have at least two right
[1:16:02] to ario and Victor um which is
outstanding um but this is going on for
[1:16:08] many years of work. So thank you to all
the other people that have helped us
[1:16:12] through it. Right. Okay. So, moving on
to uh item number
[1:16:21] apologize.
>> Item number six. Um we have our city
[1:16:26] attorney um Alyssa here with us and our
city manager. So, I don't I'm not going
[1:16:31] to read the whole entire line of the
ordinance because it is in writing and I
[1:16:34] already read the whole entire thing. So,
um I don't have to go one by one on it.
[1:16:42] Okay. So, Mr. Kamali and Lisa Anz switch
this over in disregarding or04-2026.
[1:16:49] The floor is yours. And just remember,
Mr. Kamali, you don't have a mic, so you
[1:16:52] have to move the mic.
>> Yeah. Thank you, mayor. I just, you
[1:16:56] know, give the floor to Alyssa since uh
she's the major archite architects on
[1:17:02] that one. So, we listen to her and see
what we do.
[1:17:07] So, of the ordinances on your agenda,
I'm sorry. Good evening, Mayor Council.
[1:17:14] Good evening.
>> Of the ordinances on your agenda,
[1:17:17] Chapter 7, I think, at least on its
surface, is sort of the most um
[1:17:22] complicated in terms of um what we've
done to it. So, I I I've gone through
[1:17:29] sort of section by section to sort of
describe what we've what we've done
[1:17:33] there. So, chapter 7 has been largely
reorganized and streamlined to make it
[1:17:38] more understandable and easier to follow
hopefully and to better reflect the
[1:17:43] city's actual practices and nomenclature
because there were so many times when um
[1:17:48] I'd be talking to your code enforcement
officers uh director of code enforcement
[1:17:53] and I'd say this this doesn't make sense
to me. Is this really what you're doing?
[1:17:56] And she'd be like no we never do that.
Um so um there was a large amount of
[1:18:03] extraneous text in the purposes and
policy section that has been deleted so
[1:18:07] that what remains is the central tenant.
The definitions remain mostly the same.
[1:18:14] However, I included churches as
charitable institutions instead of
[1:18:17] calling them out separately which I
don't think is constitutionally
[1:18:20] supportable just as you cannot
discriminate against religious
[1:18:24] institutions who can't treat them more
favorably.
[1:18:28] Um, in 7-104, which continues to cover
business licenses as before, um, we
[1:18:33] streamlined and combined duplicative
provisions and corrected grammar and
[1:18:38] outlining errors.
There were inconsistencies relating to
[1:18:42] the treatment of home occupations that
we corrected and we omitted regulations
[1:18:46] that are a function of the county zoning
ordinance except to say that the use
[1:18:51] must have county proper county permits.
Section 7105 was previously entitled
[1:18:58] occupancy licenses and that was a little
>> sorry this before you go on they um what
[1:19:05] have you already is this the latest
package from that was submitted today?
[1:19:10] » Yes. So
>> there were two different packages that
[1:19:12] were submitted.
>> We did we did replace it this morning.
[1:19:20] » Okay. Good.
>> Yes. Oh, this is this is still the May
[1:19:24] 1st version that we were working on.
This is the April 15th version.
[1:19:28] » Yeah, there is a May
>> that's what we're
[1:19:33] » Yeah.
>> So, we're working on we need to work on
[1:19:38] » I think this is still the old for this.
>> Yeah, there was a revised version on May
[1:19:47] 14th. Um, however,
>> those revision Um, Councilman Jakuda
[1:19:53] very helpfully with Eagle Eyes went
through and corrected a lot of um,
[1:20:00] punctuation and um, uh, grammar and
things that I thought I'd done a pretty
[1:20:07] good job, but apparently I missed some
things. So, um, so mostly the changes in
[1:20:13] the May 14th version are those. So my
description so you'll have the correct
[1:20:19] one when you when you go to act on it at
um your legislative section session. Um,
[1:20:26] but I think the changes I'm describing,
I don't think were impacted by the last
[1:20:30] round of changes that we made. And, um,
Councilman Jakuda, you can, um, jump in
[1:20:35] after I finish describing this if you
want to, um, point out any changes that
[1:20:40] we substantive changes we made that, um,
need to be reflected.
[1:20:46] Um,
okay. So um
[1:20:52] in 7105 as I was saying was uh
previously entitled occupancy licenses
[1:20:57] and that was confusing because of its
similarity to occupancy permits which
[1:21:01] are thing that county issues and we
don't. Um so it's really relating
[1:21:06] primarily to rental licenses. So we've
retitled it for clarity and made the
[1:21:10] same general types of changes that were
made to section 7104.
[1:21:16] The code currently has a single section
106 titled permits which has a number of
[1:21:21] subsections relating to a relatively
large number of types of permits which
[1:21:24] makes it a little difficult to find
anything. And then it required a bunch
[1:21:29] of cross referencing in your the way the
code is is currently structured. So um I
[1:21:34] broke that up into separate sections for
each of the various types of permits. Um
[1:21:38] and then we've combined the provisions
for denial, suspension, and revocation
[1:21:43] into a single new section 7112. Um and
um except for provisions that relate
[1:21:50] specifically perhaps to a particular
kind of permit which remain in the
[1:21:54] individual sections.
We deleted provisions relating to
[1:21:59] payones and newspaper boxes because they
no longer exist. and we have deleted
[1:22:04] permits for temporary signs because the
city has not been enforcing it. Um, and
[1:22:09] it's a zoning matter for the county.
The current ordinance says for each kind
[1:22:14] of permit that the fee is in the fee
ordinance. It was unnecessary to say
[1:22:19] that repeatedly. So, the new section
7114 fees simply says that all of them
[1:22:24] are in the fee schedule except that it
also clarifies that there are certain
[1:22:28] administrative fees for gaming devices
and commercial refuge collection in
[1:22:32] addition to the basic fees and that um
previously was not clear because it was
[1:22:37] located in the fee schedule and not in
the chapter itself.
[1:22:42] We have moved um se what was section
107A illegal evictions because it
[1:22:48] doesn't really belong in licenses and
permits and we moved it to chapter 10
[1:22:52] peace and good order or peace and order
and you'll see it but it's it's in the
[1:22:55] same your same um physical ordinance. Um
and then there are no substantive
[1:23:00] changes to the violations and penalties
section which is now 715 except for the
[1:23:05] deletion of fines relating to the items
that we deleted.
[1:23:14] Do you want me to keep going through all
the ordinances or just do one at a time?
[1:23:19] » One second. Team, can you also do us a
favor as Alyssa is talking? Can you like
[1:23:23] try to show whatever is on the screen
because we're like in 105 and I think we
[1:23:26] got to 109 or something like that,
right? Okay. So, this is like the first
[1:23:32] chunk.
>> So, chapter seven.
[1:23:36] » Yeah, that is chapter that is the whole
ordinance. I've been through all the
[1:23:39] changes in this ordinance that you've
got on the screen.
[1:23:43] » Okay.
So, council,
[1:23:48] do you guys want Alyssa to continue or
do you have any questions at this moment
[1:23:53] for her?
I need to just if you have a question,
[1:23:57] raise your hand so that way I know. If
not, we'll continue.
[1:24:01] So, we're we're good to continue.
Remember, this is just a a walk through.
[1:24:06] We're not voting on anything, but at
least like verbally we're we're
[1:24:10] showcasing it. Okay.
>> If I can just make a quick comment. I
[1:24:13] think um there we have a lot of
questions, but I think it would be
[1:24:17] better for Alyssa just to read through
all of them. Um since the others because
[1:24:21] there's I have a lot of questions just
about this one.
[1:24:24] » Well, then we probably should do that
before I go to the next ordinance.
[1:24:29] I don't think I think in the interest of
time I I I think that we should have a
[1:24:33] separate work session um to address all
of the questions. So I think it would
[1:24:38] make the most sense right now for you to
go through everything. Yeah, that was my
[1:24:43] point. Thank you.
>> I would say just let me know that you
[1:24:45] need to speak so I could like call on
you. It does help.
[1:24:48] » It's a work session.
>> Joseph and Valerie, go ahead.
[1:24:52] I would just say I think that especially
chap title seven I think we do need to
[1:24:57] talk about it in more in depth because
there's some you know this is our
[1:25:01] opportunity to fix some other things
policywise so I would like to see
[1:25:05] another work session just for us to
discuss policy portions of it but I
[1:25:09] would like to get through
>> okay
[1:25:12] » Valerie
>> yeah I think we should just read through
[1:25:16] all the changes now and then we can have
conversation if we have to schedule
[1:25:19] another work session we can but again
remember It's we're at the very end of
[1:25:22] the fiscal year. Um, and so I want to
make sure that we're, you know, clear
[1:25:26] about the timing of everything right
now.
[1:25:28] » Okay.
>> So, Lisa, go ahead.
[1:25:30] » Did you want to bring up chapter nine
then?
[1:25:32] » Yeah.
[1:25:35] » Um,
can can you put chapter 9 out?
[1:25:38] » Chapter nine.
[1:25:43] » Um, so this one's relatively
straightforward. Um, it's intended to
[1:25:48] replace the provisions relating to
parking meters with provisions relating
[1:25:52] to your soontobe implemented
internetbased internetbased, pardon me,
[1:25:57] parking fee system.
It also revises slightly per city
[1:26:02] manager the times during which the paid
parking zones are in effect. Um, you
[1:26:08] will see text deleted from subsection E
on page six, but that language has
[1:26:12] merely been moved and now appears on
page seven as a new section B.
[1:26:18] And also per previous discussion, we
have moved the fines from the fee
[1:26:22] schedule to the chapter itself. And that
now appears on subsection A on page
[1:26:27] seven.
[1:26:37] That's all I have on chapter nine.
>> I was say keep going.
[1:26:42] » Chapter 13.
>> I think this is more like a a read
[1:26:45] through of information and then we'll
get back to it.
[1:26:50] » Uh can we get chapter 13 up?
[1:26:59] » Okay. Okay.
Um, this ordinance was primarily
[1:27:04] intended to move the fines from the fee
schedule to the text of the chapter
[1:27:07] itself for the reasons we have
previously discussed. Um, those fees
[1:27:12] have been increased per the
recommendation of the chief. The default
[1:27:16] fine has been increased from $30 to $50.
The fines for parking in a handicap
[1:27:21] space have gone from has gone from 225
to 250 and the same fine has been
[1:27:26] imposed for parking in front of a
hydrant.
[1:27:29] The fine for leaving a vehicle running
unattended is stayed at $100, but we
[1:27:34] removed the $200 cap, so it will double
every 30 days as the other fines in the
[1:27:38] chapter do.
A violation of the no through truck
[1:27:42] section, which is 13118, which has been
an increasing problem, as I understand
[1:27:46] it, has been made a misdemeanor with a
fine of $200.
[1:27:51] In addition, we took the opportunity to
make some changes that are more in the
[1:27:55] nature of housekeeping. We deleted some
references to dumpsters that are covered
[1:27:59] in chapter 7. We moved the references to
the procedure for electing trial and we
[1:28:04] inserted references to the
administrative fees that were already
[1:28:07] included in the fee schedule but had no
corresponding code reference.
[1:28:14] » That's all I've got on that ordinance.
[1:28:19] And then the la the last ordinance if we
could get up was the one with um
[1:28:23] multiple chapters in it starting with
chapter 3 including chapter 3A, chapter
[1:28:30] 16, etc.
[1:28:36] Uh this ordinance has combined changes
in the fines in various chapters where
[1:28:40] there were only one or two changes per
chapter to avoid a plethora of
[1:28:44] individual ordinances.
It amends chapter 3 section 305 relating
[1:28:50] to building permit fees to address the
issue identified by Councilman Jakuda
[1:28:53] regarding the absence of a specified
feed for demolition of buildings that
[1:28:57] are exactly 500 square ft.
It amends chapter 3A to increase various
[1:29:03] fines for property maintenance
violation, conform certain penalties in
[1:29:08] chapter 6, health and nuisances to the
amounts set forth previously in the fee
[1:29:12] schedule as there had been
inconsistency.
[1:29:16] It increases and transfers the fines for
violations of the requirement of snow
[1:29:20] and ice removal in chapter 12 because I
know that you all had difficulties with
[1:29:25] um those things in the past winter. and
it increases the number of fines for
[1:29:30] serious violations of chapter 14 animal
control.
[1:29:34] Lastly, it amends chapter 16 violations
ordinances to implement the authority
[1:29:39] granted by the general assembly to
increase the maximum fines for municipal
[1:29:43] infractions from $1,000 to $5,000. That
hadn't um that increase hadn't gone up.
[1:29:50] the the maximum fine had not gone up in
many many years and was not um
[1:29:55] consistent with the efforts of various
municipalities to obtain compliance
[1:30:05] and that's all I got.
Okay.
[1:30:15] » Is there another one?
[1:30:19] That's the one I just
[1:30:26] » Okay. So, you
>> Oh. Oh, that's a 3A part of chapter the
[1:30:30] one that you
>> Oh, okay. Hold on. No, no, that's
[1:30:32] different. Give me one moment.
>> Yes. One moment.
[1:30:39] I don't think I realized until today
that that was going to be on.
[1:30:44] One moment.
[1:30:55] Shoot.
[1:31:08] Apologies. I said it a while ago.
One second. So, as you look for it, um,
[1:31:17] as a reminder, as we talked about, it's
like this is not a voting item at this
[1:31:20] point. And if an extra meeting needs to
have to, uh, cut it into pieces to be
[1:31:26] able to get the answers that we need,
that's fine. Um, the the other thing is
[1:31:30] like
we had to rip the garage sometime,
[1:31:34] right? So, we need to talk about it
today. If not, it's going to continue
[1:31:37] being pushed back and
>> okay,
[1:31:40] » to be found.
>> I'm sorry.
[1:31:41] » Thank you, Alyssa.
This is the one um that uh for staff
[1:31:48] request um made some changes to um the
uh requirements regarding parking on uh
[1:31:56] residential property um to um substitute
this for what is in currently in um the
[1:32:05] uh international property maintenance
code. So, it will say it's adding a new
[1:32:10] provision that's about abandoned or
non-roadworthy motor vehicles um and
[1:32:15] providing that they may only be parked
on the exterior portion of residential
[1:32:19] property under a carport connected to a
street or alley by a driveway or on the
[1:32:24] driveway. And then it defines what
constitutes a driveway. So, I think
[1:32:30] that's pretty self-explanatory.
[1:32:39] That's it.
>> Okay. I just didn't want to cut you off.
[1:32:42] All right. Council, I'm going to go
around once in case you want if you have
[1:32:47] any questions for Alyssa since she's
here. Um, and just to remind you guys,
[1:32:52] this is not like the end all. So, if you
do not if you have a question that is
[1:32:56] not answered, um, we could get an answer
as well. All right. So, Joseph, I went
[1:33:01] first with you before. Daniel, have I
gone first with you before already or?
[1:33:04] No.
>> No, I haven't.
[1:33:06] » Okay, go ahead and we'll go around this
way.
[1:33:07] » Okay, great. Thank you, Alyssa, for
this. This is a lot of work and and it
[1:33:11] was a lot of work reading through it
all.
[1:33:14] » My brain was like, "Oh my gosh." Um, and
I really appreciate everything. Um, the
[1:33:20] questions that I have are mainly, you
know, about fee amounts and stuff like
[1:33:23] that, things that we can discuss with
Mr. Molly. So, I'm just going to take my
[1:33:27] moment to thank you very much for all
the hard work you put into this and we
[1:33:30] appreciate you coming and presenting it.
Thank you very much. Um and yes, because
[1:33:33] the amount of the fees I have no uh pony
in that race, so you decide what you
[1:33:40] think they should be and we will put
them in.
[1:33:44] » Jenny,
[1:33:47] » um thank you for your work on this and
thank you council member Jakuda um for
[1:33:52] um your exacting nature. Um I um
I just I I am applying for an outdoor
[1:34:03] event permit. Um
>> Okay.
[1:34:05] » And I I dislike the million-dollar
liability policy. Um
[1:34:12] can you and I I think we've spoken about
this before um because it was trying to
[1:34:17] be enforced against my residents when it
hadn't previously been in the code. So,
[1:34:21] I appreciate the trying to write the
code to match our practices. Um,
[1:34:27] but can you remind me what is this like
a requirement from legit? Because I I
[1:34:33] just I'm really trying to balance like
community,
[1:34:37] right? The purpose of our code is to
create a community that we all want to
[1:34:44] live in and um and sometimes that can
get lost in the minutia. Um, so could
[1:34:50] you remind me why that is recommended?
>> I don't believe, and I'd have to go back
[1:34:57] and look and I can follow up with you.
Um, I don't believe that it's a
[1:35:00] requirement from Legit, but it is
intended to, um,
[1:35:06] uh, reduce the number of claims that go
to Legit um because that increases the
[1:35:13] city's insurance costs.
>> Okay. I mean, no offense to you. I just
[1:35:17] don't like lawyers, right? And um
>> that's okay since you are
[1:35:22] » Yeah. Yeah. Um and and I just I would I
would like to have our ordinance reflect
[1:35:27] community togetherness more than fear of
liability.
[1:35:32] » That's entirely a policy call for you
collectively.
[1:35:36] » It's my job to
>> I know I know
[1:35:38] » tell you what will best in my judgment
protect the city.
[1:35:42] » Yeah. Um,
>> and then it's your job to balance those
[1:35:46] interests against your public policy.
>> Yeah, I think that um we will probably
[1:35:53] want to propose some changes to chapter
7 in particular um which council member
[1:35:58] Carter alluded to previously and um
we'll probably want your wise counsel in
[1:36:03] terms of risk assessment for some of
those changes. Thank you,
[1:36:08] » Joseph.
Um I'm sorry. Could I just
[1:36:12] » Can you add more time to the clock,
please? Can you make a motion?
[1:36:16] » I I'd like to make a motion to add
>> 10 10 minutes to the clock.
[1:36:20] » Just super fast.
>> It's been probably moved and second. Any
[1:36:24] discussion?
>> Sorry.
[1:36:25] » Objection. Abstensions here. None. 10
more minutes have been added to the
[1:36:28] clock. Just so we consistent. I
apologize.
[1:36:30] » I apologize. No, I not used to your
procedure. So, forgive me. I just wanted
[1:36:35] to ask to the extent that you're able to
before we come back to whatever work
[1:36:40] session we're going to talk about it if
you could just sort of highlight for me
[1:36:43] the sections you want me to to be
prepared to deal with that would
[1:36:48] probably make things more productive
>> Joseph
[1:36:53] » thank you mayor thank you so much for
all the work you've done on this
[1:36:57] » uh the I know in my comments to you I
think I was reading through chapters
[1:37:02] title seven and I was like this is
>> Joseph I need move the mic as close as
[1:37:06] you can to you because they're alerting
me that they can hear you
[1:37:09] » Jason and then as soon as it gets close
then it's
[1:37:14] » um uh so anyway yes I thank you for all
the work on this I do think there were
[1:37:17] still version control issues with it
looks like chapter 13 chapter 9 and the
[1:37:24] various ones as well um and um so I'm
hoping that that can correct it too
[1:37:29] because I think there were ones that
we've gone through and added our commas
[1:37:32] and whatnot Um, I I do think that we
could I'd be h personally fine if the
[1:37:41] the last one we talked about, chapter
3A, we moved forward. I think that one's
[1:37:44] pretty simple. I don't think we need
about it.
[1:37:47] » This is the exterior parking one. Um, I
don't think that's still up there, but
[1:37:53] that was a pretty short one and I don't
think there was much. So, if I know you
[1:37:56] wanted to get some stuff done, so I'd be
in favor of that one at least because I
[1:38:00] don't think I don't know, at least in my
opinion. I'm going to ask my one
[1:38:04] question though. I don't think anyone
here is going to be able to answer this.
[1:38:07] So, I'm calling upon the city to use
your collective minds to answer why it
[1:38:13] is that in chapter 13,
we allow for vehicles that are owned and
[1:38:20] licensed by city residents prior to
March 1st, 2006
[1:38:24] that are I believe RVs. Oh, no. boat
trailers with or without a boat, camping
[1:38:29] trailers, travel trailers, or utility
trailers to be parked solely on the 3700
[1:38:34] block of Otis Street. I I cannot fathom
that particular carve out. So, if any
[1:38:41] history buffs out there know why and can
tell me because I would I don't like
[1:38:45] carveouts like that, but I really want
to know what that one is.
[1:38:48] » Thank you.
>> Please email Ryan
[1:38:53] » your mic because I'm not going to hear
you. Well, I just want to let you know
[1:38:57] that that you're always welcome to email
Brian Nettler, the former council member
[1:39:03] » and former mayor too.
>> Mayor too. Thank you, mayor.
[1:39:06] » I wondered the same thing. I have to
say,
[1:39:09] » but now I look forward to our further
discussions on seven and nine um and and
[1:39:14] uh 13 because and we got some important
work
[1:39:17] » 16 and
the rest of them. All right, Valerie.
[1:39:22] » Um yes, thank you for your work on this.
Um, I uh I think my my request since
[1:39:28] we're going to go through all these
ordinances, I think we need to have a
[1:39:32] strong communications plan as the city
and we need to have like some
[1:39:36] visualization of like what the code was,
why we're changing it, and what it is
[1:39:41] now so that people can follow along um
as we change these ordinances. So, I
[1:39:46] just I that's my one request is that we
get that. It would be helpful for me as
[1:39:50] well just as a council member to see it
visually instead of just all the text. I
[1:39:54] mean, we've read through it three times,
but like getting it visually so I can
[1:39:58] quickly point to something, this is what
it is, this is what it's not, so that
[1:40:01] people are very clear, that would be
helpful. Um, so for most most of the
[1:40:06] time when I do an ordinance and we just
do it like most of the ones before you
[1:40:11] where we strike through and add stuff,
it's relatively easy to see. and chapter
[1:40:15] 7 because it was so extensive and um
counciloman Carter knows this but she I
[1:40:22] gave her a red line and I thought you're
never this is just it looks like
[1:40:26] gobbledygook but it was helpful to her
and if
[1:40:29] » I would be happy to share it with
>> I'm or I am um I just I didn't send it
[1:40:34] because when I looked at it I thought
that would give me a headache so I tried
[1:40:38] to explain it um yeah but I I I hear
what you're saying
[1:40:42] » I just think for the um for the
community. Um, especially for the
[1:40:46] community as we roll this out, we should
have a plan for communicating this in
[1:40:50] ways that make sense to people that
don't look at legally and lawyer stuff
[1:40:54] all the time. Thank you.
>> Thank you. Um, yeah, if you could send
[1:40:58] it to well, at least to me or all of us,
that definitely will be helpful. So, we
[1:41:02] could have it in archives.
>> Sure.
[1:41:04] » Um, that will help and and I definitely
will second when in doubt when it comes
[1:41:08] to um anything co-related in the books,
reach out to Brian. He was with us like
[1:41:12] 20 years as well just like Mary Miles.
So one or the other one will know. Um
[1:41:16] but um
so
[1:41:21] we definitely need to create a simple
document especially for the fees because
[1:41:26] um it's extensive work that we're doing
here. So Alyssa, thank you so much. Uh
[1:41:31] Joseph as well uh to our teams for
helping and making this documents
[1:41:36] happen. Um it's needed. That's the
reality of it with like every every year
[1:41:42] legislation changes and we have to
update our documents so that we're all
[1:41:46] like within the same time frame, right?
But yeah, some of the grammatical errors
[1:41:52] were just so frustrating at certain
point. But I'm glad that it got taken.
[1:41:56] So I asked for one heavily patient from
the community as we go through this
[1:42:02] because it's a lot a lot of information.
Um but it's cleaning out things that we
[1:42:06] need to um we need to do. Other than
that um it is an intensive document. So
[1:42:12] I feel like when their fees are added
they could be like the numbers could be
[1:42:15] bolded or something.
>> Okay.
[1:42:16] » So that will help at least to be able to
if you're scanning through it easier to
[1:42:21] to read and
I'm assuming in our code once we have to
[1:42:26] submit this there's going to be a legend
attached to it. I know it's
[1:42:29] electronically once we approve it goes
to mini code. Correct. and then we're
[1:42:33] able to um we're able to sort out a
little bit more cleaner by by words than
[1:42:38] than just directing people to the whole
document.
[1:42:41] » So um so to some extent the formatting
for changing documents goes back to
[1:42:46] typewriters, right? And I have moved it
a step forward by using small caps which
[1:42:53] weren't an option when you had a
typewriter and and using and bolding and
[1:42:57] things like that. But in theory,
you could show changes in different
[1:43:02] colors, right? There's nothing in state
law that tells you how you have to do an
[1:43:07] ordinance, right? We we we try to follow
a little bit the way the state does it,
[1:43:12] but I I don't personally find the bills
that this, you know, general assembly
[1:43:17] bills that I read to be particularly
easy to follow either. So, we could
[1:43:22] experiment with that now that we're in
the age of computers.
[1:43:28] Yeah.
>> And that might be useful to showing the
[1:43:31] changes.
>> Yeah. I mean, the only reason why I like
[1:43:34] it in the two colors is because um color
challenging is a real thing and there's
[1:43:40] some colors that do not show up for
people. I know I have a hard time seeing
[1:43:44] certain colors as well. And there's some
people are heavily color blind as well.
[1:43:48] » Well, that's true.
>> Yeah. So, accessibility wise,
[1:43:51] » I can bold things. I can there we can
italicize them. that might be a way to
[1:43:56] make them stand out that doesn't depend
on color.
[1:43:58] » Yeah.
>> Um I hadn't really thought about
[1:44:01] the um you know disability issues
related to putting them in color because
[1:44:07] that could make it harder for some
people. Um, but I guess my point is we
[1:44:13] can do things I think to make them
easier visually to pick out the changes
[1:44:19] and um,
>> thank you so much for that and I look
[1:44:23] forward to the to the other document as
well and um, in the communication
[1:44:27] campaign we're going to have to do to
put this roll it out. Uh, it's
[1:44:31] definitely a lot of information. Okay,
council is do I need to go one more time
[1:44:35] around or you guys are good? I need to
verbally hear you. Danielle, you shaking
[1:44:40] your head? No, you're good.
>> Yeah. No, I'm good.
[1:44:42] » Jenny,
>> I'm good.
[1:44:45] » Joseph,
>> I'm fine. Thank you.
[1:44:47] » Okay, Valerie.
>> Yes, I'm good.
[1:44:49] » All right. So, um Elissa, thank you so
much for uh joining us. It's always a
[1:44:54] pleasure to have you and thank you for
keeping us um very safeguarded as well
[1:44:58] as our city attorney for
>> My pleasure. My pleasure. I take it you
[1:45:01] do not need me for this. No angels.
>> I appre I did thank you in my
[1:45:06] presentation. Oh, that was unnecessary.
>> Okay. Excellent. Well, have a wonderful
[1:45:13] evening. I It looks like you got a long
night.
[1:45:15] » Thank you.
>> You're welcome to stay.
[1:45:20] » Thank you so much.
>> Have a safe uh travel home, please.
[1:45:25] Okay. And we'll see you very we'll be
seeing you very soon.
[1:45:28] » We'll see.
>> Yes. And all of you should respond to my
[1:45:32] invitation
>> after this. if I need to. Um so moving
[1:45:37] on to the next item on the agenda.
Uh it is item number um
[1:45:46] seven presentation and discussion on
emergency ordinance 09-2026.
[1:45:52] Mayor Council will discuss emergency
ordinance 09-2026
[1:45:56] budget and member and we have with us
Ron Wilson that just joined us in the
[1:46:02] table um
who is our financial consultant. All
[1:46:06] right. So Mr. Kamali and Ron the floor
is yours.
[1:46:09] » Yeah, thank you mayor. I just give the
floor to Ron and Ron is going to quickly
[1:46:14] walk you through the items that we are
proposing to be part of the budget
[1:46:20] budget amendment number two. Thank you.
I'm sorry. Thank you.
[1:46:24] » You're fine because you moved the you
can move in the microphone away for you
[1:46:27] so I could hear you. I'm sure they
cannot hear you. Okay. Thank you so
[1:46:30] much.
>> It's up in the
[1:46:32] » It's very up in the screen. Okay.
>> Can you guys like expand it just a
[1:46:37] little bit? a little bit bigger
>> or can we go to the ordinance page? We
[1:46:42] can see it better. Okay.
>> Okay. Go ahead.
[1:46:46] » Okay. Good evening. So, it's our um
annual um time to do um budget
[1:46:54] modification wrapup. Um most of this
budget amendment is uh adding grants uh
[1:47:01] that weren't previously budgeted, but we
do have one non-grant item to um modify
[1:47:09] in the budget. Uh if you recall last
year, fiscal 25, we did a budget
[1:47:16] amendment to add a million and a half in
use of fund balance for the Potts Hall
[1:47:25] project. Uh which brought the total to
$2.5 million use of fund balance for
[1:47:32] Potts Hall. Um, we used a little bit
more than 1.5
[1:47:39] uh last year which left us a little bit
well left us $955,000.
[1:47:46] Um, and we have those expenses in this
fiscal year. Um, so we need to uh
[1:47:55] rebudget the remaining part of the use
of fund balance for pots hall. So those
[1:48:00] are the first two items in this budget
modification.
[1:48:04] We are increasing the use of fund
balance which is a revenue line uh 4707
[1:48:13] uh for $955,240.
[1:48:17] And then on the expense side, which is
account 5701,
[1:48:22] we are adding $955,240
[1:48:27] to the Potts Hall uh welcome center
project. Uh those two things um net to
[1:48:36] zero
um in budgeting terms.
[1:48:42] Uh below that, everything else is
grants. Uh I'll run through it really
[1:48:48] quickly. Um
uh the basic idea here is that grants
[1:48:53] come in after the budget gets set. So we
we wait until late in the year to try to
[1:49:00] capture everything that we can. So on
the revenue side, um 4700.20
[1:49:08] is the streetscape uh Perry Street green
streets. Um, this was budgeted in in 25
[1:49:16] for $530,000, but we didn't use it. So,
we're we're adding the remaining part of
[1:49:23] that grant into this year's budget for
the 499.
[1:49:27] Um,
item 4700
[1:49:33] 52, which is the solar panels from the
MEA. Again, we had budgeted it last
[1:49:38] year, but used very, very little of it.
So, we're rebudgeting it for fiscal 26.
[1:49:45] U 4700.47
is the DHCD mural grant for 10,000.
[1:49:52] Uh that's a new grant that came in after
the budget was set. Uh 4700.57
[1:49:59] the um Maryland Department of
Transportation levy trail crossing.
[1:50:04] Again, this came in after the budget was
set and we're adding 75,000 to that one.
[1:50:11] Uh the next two lines, all we're doing
is
[1:50:15] switching grant numbers. So this this
these amounts were budgeted for the
[1:50:21] year, but they when the grants were
created, we had a different number in
[1:50:26] the GL. So I just need to clean that up
a little bit. So on the patch grant for
[1:50:31] 2026
um we are removing that from
[1:50:37] grant 48 and adding it to grant 54. So
that's a
[1:50:44] net nonchange. And likewise the national
night out for $14,000 we are removing it
[1:50:52] from
uh grant 49 and adding it to grant 58.
[1:51:00] So that's for the grant
revenues.
[1:51:04] Uh then under the grant expenses. So the
as you know the way grants work is
[1:51:10] revenue and expense equals. Um so for
5707.20
[1:51:17] for city hall. That's the streetscape.
Perry street green streets for 499,000.
[1:51:24] Uh 5701.52.
The MEA solar panels for 422
[1:51:31] 58.99.47
the DHCD mural for 10
[1:51:38] 5700.57
the MDT levy trail for 75,000
[1:51:45] and then 58.99.48
48.
[1:51:50] That's the packed grant. We're doing the
number switching. So, we're taking it
[1:51:54] off 48 and adding it to 54. And then
58.99.49
[1:52:00] National Night Out. Again, we're taking
it off with grant 49 and adding it to
[1:52:04] grant 58. So, that is the entire budget
modification that that we're
[1:52:11] recommending.
>> Okay. Thank you so much. And just as a
[1:52:16] point of information to the community,
um, if there is money allocated from the
[1:52:21] budget that is not used, it goes back
into our coffers. It's not like it
[1:52:26] disappears. So that's basically what
they're more or less doing here. They
[1:52:30] were able to part of the grant or not
utilize at all. And this is the reason
[1:52:34] why we need to allocate it to this year.
Correct.
[1:52:36] » Right. Yes.
>> Yes.
[1:52:38] » I just want to make sure that because we
had gone through budget amendments. I
[1:52:41] wanted to make sure that they understood
that it's not like all of it was
[1:52:45] expended last year. It wasn't is the
fact that it wasn't. So therefore,
[1:52:49] they're moving it to this, but we have
to do an amendment um in order to follow
[1:52:53] up with it. Okay. So Jenny, I'm going to
go first with you.
[1:52:58] » I don't have any questions. Thank you
for your work on this.
[1:53:01] » Okay, Danielle,
>> thank you. You were looking at me. You
[1:53:06] knew I was going to ask the um 955,240
just like with last year with the 1.5
[1:53:12] million. Um first of all that means that
the cost of POTS Hall went above the 7
[1:53:18] million as projected. It went by another
million
[1:53:22] » close to this is 955,000. So
>> no. So what what happened,
[1:53:29] excuse me, um we in fiscal 25, we
started out the budget with a million
[1:53:36] dollar use of fund balance knowing that
there was roughly another million and a
[1:53:41] half to come a and we were holding out
for grant money uh which we never did
[1:53:49] receive. So when we looked at this in in
the early spring, we decided that we had
[1:53:57] to use another million and a half of
fund balance uh to to complete the
[1:54:03] funding for Potts Hall
during fiscal. So that gave us 2.5
[1:54:09] million. We were at the time thinking
that it would be completed, closed out,
[1:54:14] all the expenses would be recorded and
then all of that use of fund balance
[1:54:19] revenue would be used. Um the project
extended past June 30. So in in effect
[1:54:29] we ended up using
a million545
[1:54:35] » of the 2 and a half
>> in fiscal 25. So what we're doing here
[1:54:41] is we're
[1:54:45] we're recognizing the rest of the two
and a half.
[1:54:49] » Okay. To get clear just to make sure I'm
clear because you know when I saw this I
[1:54:53] thought another million out of the rainy
day. So it's the money we didn't spend
[1:54:57] last year is being transferred to this
year. Thank you.
[1:54:59] » That's correct.
>> Okay. So thank you.
[1:55:02] » Okay.
>> Cuz you know you know cuz you remember
[1:55:04] last year I was like hold up.
>> Yeah.
[1:55:06] » So Okay. Great. Thank you so much.
>> Thank you for clarifying that.
[1:55:12] » Thank you for this. Um my my question
probably more is going to also touch on
[1:55:18] the next one. Uh the next item with the
uh review of the budget. I'm I'm I'm
[1:55:24] trying to understand if there's any GL
accounts we also need to rebalance
[1:55:29] through this because I see that probably
two of them are going to be over by the
[1:55:34] end of the fiscal year and mostly
they're under and did we need to do any
[1:55:38] other emergency rebalancing through this
emergency ordinance or so can you
[1:55:43] explain that to me?
>> Yeah, without getting too in the weeds
[1:55:49] um the weeds. Yes, we we do build our
budget on a lot of line items. The
[1:55:58] actual budget ordinance though it is
done in groupings. So one part of the
[1:56:05] budget ordinance just sets a
departmental total. Okay?
[1:56:11] And the other part of the budget
ordinance
[1:56:15] does it by
expense grouping for the city as a
[1:56:21] whole. So what those are the numbers
that we manage to so if any particular
[1:56:27] line item is over budget uh it's not a
problem if other items in that
[1:56:35] particular grouping are under budget. So
we're we're always, you know, trying to
[1:56:41] to balance that out. But technically, we
do not have a requirement to
[1:56:49] manage to each individual line items
budget. We we do it internally.
[1:56:56] Mr. Kamali and I are always trying to
manage that, but from a need for doing a
[1:57:03] budget modification,
uh, that doesn't
[1:57:08] necessarily create one.
>> Oh, no, no. I I just want to be clear. I
[1:57:12] wasn't anticipating line by line. I'm
talking about at the department level.
[1:57:16] It's like I think two departments maybe
>> um going a a hair over what was
[1:57:21] budgeted. and the way that the way that
the report is set up, it's really hard
[1:57:25] to look at the groupings. So that's why
I was wondering are do we need to make
[1:57:29] any other adjustments for the one or two
departments that may go over at this
[1:57:33] time?
>> We don't think so.
[1:57:36] » Okay.
>> Yeah.
[1:57:39] » Because we're waiting for June the 30th
and then we see the number and the
[1:57:45] picture of the whole budget better at
that time.
[1:57:48] » So there may be another emergency
amendment coming up. So, Mr. Kamal, you
[1:57:52] try to get the mic in front of you.
>> Oh, I'm sorry.
[1:57:55] » Because they're alerts that they can
hear you.
[1:57:58] » No, I don't think so that we need to do
because uh I know which departments
[1:58:02] you're talking. you're talking about the
police and public works and I'm working
[1:58:07] with Ron to make sure that we just use
the same fund that is available for that
[1:58:14] department to make sure that like I can
tell you right now building maintenance
[1:58:19] in the police department it's already
over vehicle maintenance in public works
[1:58:24] is already over so so we can we can just
basically look at the whole budget for
[1:58:30] that department and see how we can fix
those issues internally without going
[1:58:36] through the budget amendment.
>> Yes. I think historically this is this
[1:58:41] should be the this should be the last
budget amendment we have before June
[1:58:45] 30th because we're like around around
the corner.
[1:58:47] » We don't have time for it.
>> Yeah. So by the time we vote on it, it's
[1:58:51] going to be like June. You have like
three weeks. Go ahead, Valerie. Um
[1:58:56] » thank you. I I don't really have any
questions. Thank you for your
[1:58:58] clarifications from the other council
members questions. Thank you.
[1:59:02] So, um, for me, I think I already said
in my my statement, um, for those that
[1:59:08] are watching us online, uh, the
emergency is 09-2026.
[1:59:12] They basically describe it. That was the
document on it. It's just in a different
[1:59:15] format and it shows the revisions,
adjustments, and current budget. So, we
[1:59:19] already went through it, so we don't
have to go through the whole
[1:59:22] » ordinance. Yeah. I'm saying you don't
have to read it because you just went
[1:59:24] through the other page. And I would tell
you that I appreciate having both. I
[1:59:28] like this new method of having both of
because it's clear and removes the
[1:59:33] additional work. So, thank you for that.
Okay. I I definitely like it like this
[1:59:36] and it's also more in gear with what the
budget looks like so it's easier to like
[1:59:41] follow through along with the other
document. So, I like numbers away from
[1:59:45] documents so I could clearly see them.
Other than that, um I know that uh Mr.
[1:59:51] Kamali and the whole entire team, they
do a lot of work to make sure it's
[1:59:55] stable within their budget um and
stretch and like I mentioned earlier,
[1:59:59] any amount that is not utilized um it
goes back to our our our
[2:00:06] city. So by June 30, the strike at
midnight, whatever is not used, that's
[2:00:10] been allocated goes um more or less
straight in. Obviously, there's a couple
[2:00:15] bills that are there that need to come.
um they have like about a week or
[2:00:19] whatever, but anything has to be turned
in by the by the 30. So that's more or
[2:00:23] less what they're doing here is like um
some of the grants have gone either new
[2:00:27] or they gone split here and they're
trying to like accommodate in order to
[2:00:31] make sure um get basically the money
that we had or that went back grab it
[2:00:35] and and put it um to be able to pay what
we need to. Okay. Um so I have no
[2:00:39] questions. Just thank you guys for for
the work on on this and making sure you
[2:00:44] um keep us through it. And that means
we'll move on to next time in the
[2:00:49] agenda. Right.
>> Mayor, may I may I um ask for us to take
[2:00:54] a 5m minute break. It's been two hours
to get up stretch before we continue.
[2:01:01] » Um we could usually do two hours and a
half and then we take a break because of
[2:01:05] the rules. So if you guys want to take a
break right now, that's that's fine.
[2:01:08] Council, where are you guys? Want to
take a break?
[2:01:13] » Yeah.
>> Yeah, he has one.
[2:01:15] » Okay. I'm sorry. I thought he was done.
>> Yeah, cuz usually we do, too.
[2:01:18] » And Ron has a two hours driving.
>> I already have one foot out the door.
[2:01:24] » He has a
>> So, moving on to uh
[2:01:28] » the third quarter on the Hold on. Moving
on to the next item on the agenda,
[2:01:33] presentation, discussion, the third
quarter financial report. Uh Mr. Kamali
[2:01:37] and our consultant Wilson as well will
present the FY2026
[2:01:42] third quarterly financial report. The
floor is yours.
[2:01:46] » Oh, go ahead.
>> Okay.
[2:01:48] » All right. Um, as I understand it, you
all were given this financial report in
[2:01:54] advance. Um, recognizing that you have a
very full agenda tonight. I'm not going
[2:02:00] to read through it line by line, but I
do want to be available for any
[2:02:07] questions that you have. So, um we this
is the third quarter financial report.
[2:02:14] So, that's through March 31. Uh we are
already in the process of
[2:02:24] beginning our closing out of the fiscal
year, gathering up expenses, doing
[2:02:30] reviews and all of that sort of thing.
Um but we did want to give you the third
[2:02:36] quarter report. You the fourth quarter
report that you will receive will be
[2:02:42] part of the audit package. So that's the
the um the version of the financial
[2:02:48] report that goes through a lot more work
than what you're seeing here. Um so
[2:02:55] anyway um um I I would be glad to answer
any questions that you have.
[2:03:00] » So just as a point of information, this
covers until March 31st, 2026 and that's
[2:03:06] the ending of the third period. So
that's what you're seeing here. So April
[2:03:09] and May are not covered on this report
>> and June.
[2:03:12] » And June. Thank you so much. And that'll
be covered the in the four and and
[2:03:16] final. All right. So, council, I'm gonna
go
[2:03:20] I'm gonna go around if you have
questions regarding uh the report. Is
[2:03:25] there anything else you guys need to add
to it before I send it to council? Oh,
[2:03:28] we're good. Mr. Kabali.
>> No, we're good.
[2:03:32] » Okay. So, I wanted to make sure I give
you enough u notice. So, um Valerie, go
[2:03:36] ahead.
>> Um thank you. Thank you for preparing
[2:03:39] this report. Um I have two things that I
want to kind of think through and talk
[2:03:43] through. Um first the recreational
committee grants. It looks like it's
[2:03:47] zero. I think there was the half I think
we had approved two grants um before
[2:03:52] March 31st. So we just need to make sure
that this is in there unless they
[2:03:56] haven't come in for reimbursement. I
just wanted to make sure make a note of
[2:03:59] that. Um so you can do that first. Is
>> can you guys do me a favor? Um, when you
[2:04:04] guys make a reference to line, read the
number so that way the rest of us could
[2:04:08] follow up. At least give us well this
has page numbers, but that way we could
[2:04:11] fill we could fill it out under what
category like is
[2:04:15] » administration. Hold on. Like it's
administration and line whatever it is
[2:04:19] so it's easier for us to follow.
>> Um, administration 01-55-.033.00
[2:04:29] I'm sorry 554.
It's 333.0. So, I just I wanted to make
[2:04:34] sure I know that this is a reimburseable
grant, but it says zero, and I'm pretty
[2:04:37] sure two had been approved before this.
>> Um, I I would have to double check to be
[2:04:42] absolutely sure, but I I do recall
signing off on a couple of the
[2:04:47] dispersements. Uh, so I believe that
they were after March 31.
[2:04:52] » Okay. Um,
>> can I also add, mayor, yes, we did
[2:04:57] receive their reimbursement last week.
>> Last week. Okay.
[2:05:00] » Yes. That's why it's not in this report.
It was 2049 one of them and the other
[2:05:05] one we're waiting for more information
and you will see all those uh grants
[2:05:10] that have been processed by June 30th
once the report is complete.
[2:05:15] » Okay. And then I have one more if that's
okay. Um under economic development um
[2:05:20] this is 01-5504.041.00.00
[2:05:27] economic development main street
program. Um, is it possible for you to
[2:05:30] walk through kind of what happened here?
Um, in terms of the main street program,
[2:05:35] um, this is the I believe these are the
facade improvement for the bus stops.
[2:05:40] Um, and this is where, you know, the the
episode of this project actually
[2:05:45] affected the artworks that were
developed as part of the Wulmada um, art
[2:05:48] and transit program and was, you know,
put together by specific projects. Um,
[2:05:53] and I know that it sounds like this was
not a reimburseable by DHCD. So, we had
[2:05:58] to then spend $30,000 on top of, you
know, that 30,000 that we still have to
[2:06:03] use, which is good. Um, but I would like
to know like just generally like DHD
[2:06:08] grant agreements, do you sign them as a
city manager or does the economic
[2:06:11] development director sign them? Um, and
who signed this one? Um, and then I want
[2:06:16] to know know this timeline because um
September 2025 is when these were
[2:06:20] painted. Um and after that, um you would
have had to submit as a city three
[2:06:25] quarterly reports to DHCD. Um and so I'm
just a little concerned that that issue
[2:06:29] wasn't caught before that because if we
had a from September 2025 till April
[2:06:35] 2026, we did not know that this was not
a reimburseable grant. I think that's a
[2:06:39] little bit disconcerning um for me.
Thank you.
[2:06:43] » Okay. All right. First of all, re
regarding the quarterly report, it was
[2:06:49] done by Ron Hopkins. I did not have
anything to do with it. I did sign the
[2:06:54] agreement in 2024
and when he was doing the the bus
[2:06:59] shelters, this happened in November and
he came to me and he said that you know
[2:07:05] I'm going to paint those and as you know
that the property is a metro but the
[2:07:10] shelters are ours because the city got
the grant long time ago and the
[2:07:15] structure is ours. So when I asked him
as a director and and he said, "Yeah, we
[2:07:21] could use the money because we were over
uh close to $32,000,
[2:07:29] $31,000." And he said, and I asked him,
I said, "Have you communicated with the
[2:07:34] DHCD?" He told me, "Yes." I trusted my
and I got his signature on the purchase
[2:07:41] requisition that he sended to me. We
have that one. And that's why uh we
[2:07:46] signed it on November 18, I believe. And
the documentation is there. I gave you
[2:07:53] guys all the information. In my email
last week, I listed the dates. So, what
[2:07:59] happened in November? We we did that
one. Then we had two more stores. That
[2:08:05] was Nes and there is a barber shop next
to it. The barber shop had to do the
[2:08:11] roofing and Nes wants the awning. Ron
Hopkins was here and he was doing this
[2:08:17] one and then we let him go by December
27. The project was not closed out. So
[2:08:24] we waited until we did close out the
project. Then Bill was given that task
[2:08:31] to go after DHCD for the reimbursement.
When we submitted the reimbursement for
[2:08:36] $150,000
for the facade improvements, that was
[2:08:40] the first time that I found out. And
then I did ask Bill, let's have a
[2:08:47] meeting with the DHCD. I did go to the
Zoom meeting with the DHCD and I told
[2:08:53] them they said no, we did not have any
request from Ron Hopkins and this is not
[2:08:58] a facade improvement. The grant was
basically defined in the scope of the
[2:09:04] agreement for the facade improvement on
the businesses and we have no clue and
[2:09:11] you guys have to pay it out of the
pocket. So then I I told them, you know,
[2:09:16] is there any way that I could at least
retrieve the $30,000 and use it before
[2:09:21] we lose that grant? They said yes, the
grant is a two years grant and we have
[2:09:26] time until June June 30th 27 2027 to use
the grant and right away I tked Rosio to
[2:09:36] go and find more businesses to use that
$30,000. I'm sorry. I trusted my
[2:09:42] director and this is what happened. So
between the time that I gave it to you,
[2:09:47] we applied in in in February and then we
had to wait to hear from them. They
[2:09:54] didn't, you know, four or five weeks and
all those dates are there. And if you
[2:09:58] look at the date, we just we were
finally notified in April. And that's
[2:10:04] that's how you know we got into this
situation. And the easiest way I just
[2:10:10] want to say on the record, the city lost
$30,000, but thank God we had a line
[2:10:15] item over there which is defining the
same thing. Main Street $30,000. So Ron
[2:10:21] and I, you know, concluded and I even
talked to the city attorney. I said that
[2:10:28] can I use this line item without going
through the budget amendment? She said
[2:10:32] yes because the money is there. the work
is from the same department and
[2:10:38] unfortunately I know but somehow put
yourself in my position when when a
[2:10:44] director comes to you and asks you hey
we got $30,000
[2:10:49] in the grant and we don't want to lose
it how should we and I got a suggestion
[2:10:54] so I trusted and it I I get it and I'm
full fully responsible for it but I'm
[2:11:02] sorry that was one of the reason that I
Why don't you stop talking about a
[2:11:08] personnel issue?
>> Okay, I'm just going to stop you right
[2:11:10] there.
>> So,
[2:11:14] that is the case.
>> Okay. Thank you. So, we still have
[2:11:17] $30,000 in a DHCD grant to work on um
Main Street programming such as uh
[2:11:23] storefront uh facade improvements.
>> Facade improvement until June 30th,
[2:11:27] 2027.
>> Okay. Thank you.
[2:11:29] » Sure.
>> In addition, don't we have another new
[2:11:32] » Yes. Yes. We we have $100,000.
This was FY2025.
[2:11:40] We have $100,000 right now. We just
opened the bid yesterday and that is
[2:11:47] $100,000.
And if you look at the DHCD
[2:11:52] also information last week I received I
want to make sure that I haven't told
[2:11:56] you guys. There is another $150,000
for FY27
[2:12:01] is listed for the city of Mount Reineer.
I just received it, you know, through
[2:12:06] the the mail and I think Ron Hopkins
applied when he was here. He applied for
[2:12:11] 26 and 27 at the same time. So, we got
100,000
[2:12:17] 150 plus $30,000. Right now, we're
trying to find more businesses to use
[2:12:24] it. And I was just talking to the barber
shop on 3,800 last week and we just
[2:12:30] added him Mr. Wellman to the another
one. I'm sorry. Thank you.
[2:12:36] » So if if we could make sure that we
don't change people's names.
[2:12:40] » Oh, I'm sorry. Yes.
>> It will help. Okay.
[2:12:43] » Sure.
>> All right, Joseph. Go ahead.
[2:12:46] » Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Ron, for
this great report. And Mr. Kamali, I had
[2:12:50] two questions. The first one's probably
a simple one. It's in the the only items
[2:12:54] in non-dep departmental are for the
principal and interest on Potts Hall. I
[2:12:58] see that we've spent all of our yearto
date and our budget at year to date. I'm
[2:13:04] assuming there's no more payments for
the rest of year, but can you explain
[2:13:07] that?
>> Sure. That those um we call them a bond,
[2:13:11] but uh it's with the bank. Um they are
semianual payments. um and it's like
[2:13:20] September and March or
>> okay
[2:13:24] » something like that. But both of the
semiannual payments have been recorded
[2:13:29] for the fiscal year and there will be no
more.
[2:13:31] » Okay. Thank you. And then the other
question is public works on line item
[2:13:38] 015601
[2:13:42] 080.
It's towards the bottom. Oh, wait. No,
[2:13:45] sorry. I got off 5611
uh street electricity.
[2:13:53] » I see that we're if you look at just the
three quarters of the year, obviously
[2:13:58] summer's coming, so use a little less
than summer, but we probably should have
[2:14:02] spent about 60ish,000 already, but we're
already over budget and there's still
[2:14:06] three months in the year. I think that
this is just a good example of why we
[2:14:11] really need to move forward with LED
street lights because they will save us
[2:14:15] money. to also hopefully save on that
line item below too with the light
[2:14:18] repair.
>> Um but in particular with electricity
[2:14:22] costs skyrocketing.
>> Um I think this is a good area for us to
[2:14:26] save money going forward. So I hope you
have can give us some updates on how
[2:14:30] you're working on it.
>> All right. on the LED, changing the LED.
[2:14:36] Yes, we do have a meeting going on and
Rosu is having that meeting with Pepco
[2:14:44] and we are in process of moving all the
street lights to the LED lights and uh
[2:14:51] definitely we will have more updates as
we get from you know Pepco. But we have
[2:14:58] gone through few meetings with them and
they are counting all the street lights
[2:15:04] and we are working on that process.
Definitely we're going to get it done. I
[2:15:08] promise you. But I want to make sure
that regarding the next one, the street
[2:15:12] light and signal repairs. That was the
main issue that we had with 35
[2:15:18] decorative lights. Finally, thank God we
fixed it. And that's why that that's why
[2:15:24] we went over the budget and that was an
unforeseen situation unfortunately
[2:15:30] and the first one because the
electricity has gone up big time
[2:15:35] otherwise you know the way we projected
$80,000 we should have been fine but
[2:15:41] that's how it goes but you got a point
LED it's going to save city a lot of
[2:15:46] money and that's my ultimate you know
goal to do that definitely thank
[2:15:52] It also falls under a green initiative
um document that we have created
[2:15:56] » all that fun stuff. Jenny Danielle
>> um staying in public works I have a
[2:16:02] couple of questions. Um so the first is
um line 015543.080
[2:16:10] yeah whatever uh community garden. Um it
was budgeted for 4,000. We only spent
[2:16:16] 387.
Um can you explain that? Um because when
[2:16:21] they gave a presentation to the council
um they talked about certain projects
[2:16:27] being delayed and um I'm wondering if
this is what they're referring to and if
[2:16:33] there's an explanation for why it wasn't
done.
[2:16:36] » No,
thank you for asking. As you know that
[2:16:41] that $4,000 was allocated to community
garden. So far they have used 387
[2:16:48] but as you know that there that we we
received the grant from Gateway CDC
[2:16:54] $24,300
but unfortunately when we went to WSSC
[2:17:01] to make that connection they are Valerie
knows about this. They are recognizing
[2:17:06] that fire hydrant because we have to
connect fire hydrant to the community
[2:17:10] garden as a commercial. And yesterday I
received a proposal after Rosio asked
[2:17:16] Rosio to get more proposal. The lowest
one we got for $39,000.
[2:17:23] And if you recall, last time they were
here, they were complaining about the
[2:17:26] tool shed. We got that tool shed fixed
and they were so happy about this. But
[2:17:32] unfortunately right now uh we have
$39,000
[2:17:38] uh cost that we have to connect the
water to the community. We just have
[2:17:42] another grant sustainability grant that
mayor sended. Yes, that one I gave it to
[2:17:49] Bill and I said the limit is only
$10,000.
[2:17:53] So again 10 and 24 and maybe that 4,000
I'm trying to work it out somehow.
[2:18:00] » Okay. But um thank you. And I wanted to
clarify the the bike co-op um the reason
[2:18:05] they were so far over budget was because
of the roof.
[2:18:08] » Roof. Okay.
>> Yes. Thank you.
[2:18:10] » And then last question um the overtime
pay for public works um was
[2:18:16] significantly
um over. Is that simply because the
[2:18:20] snowrete or is there something else
going on?
[2:18:23] » As you know that uh public works has two
vacancies.
[2:18:28] So, and uh unfortunately we lost one of
our crew last year and so what we do
[2:18:35] right now we're using the staff to cover
>> and it's been hard to hire.
[2:18:41] » Yeah, it is it is hard and we have heard
we have had few interviews unfortunately
[2:18:48] we cannot find a qualified one. We hired
one and we had to let it go. So, we are
[2:18:55] working on it and definitely we're going
to have I'm sorry.
[2:18:58] » We're going to have
>> Yeah, thank you.
[2:19:01] » That's the reason that I am using it and
believe it or not, it's cheaper to do
[2:19:06] that because I don't have to give
benefits and it's going to balance the
[2:19:10] pay, regular pay with the overtime at
the end of the game.
[2:19:13] » Okay.
>> So, Danielle, can you add more time to
[2:19:16] the clock? Thank you, Mr. Ki.
>> Yes. I'd like to make a motion to add
[2:19:19] five minutes to the clock, please.
>> Just add 10 just in case.
[2:19:24] 10. I I make a motion that we had 10
minutes to
[2:19:27] » Could I have a second, please?
>> I'll second. Motion has been second. Any
[2:19:32] discussion?
Objection, extensions, hearing? None. 10
[2:19:36] more minutes have been added to the to
the club. Thank you.
[2:19:39] » Go ahead.
>> Okay. Thanks a lot for this. And yes,
[2:19:43] thank you for reminding me. I had looked
through this. It's been a long day for
[2:19:47] me. Um I I had some questions and um my
uh colleagues uh council member Hoffower
[2:19:54] and uh Jakuda touched on them. You know
the decorator street lights. I was going
[2:19:58] to confirm that that was all that and
>> question about the uh overtime as well.
[2:20:02] I have one other question and this is
you know shooting ourselves in the foot
[2:20:05] because it's about the council and that
is the association dues. I noticed that
[2:20:10] we had a budget of uh 8,000 but we went
up 12,000. Now, I do know the PGCMA
[2:20:16] increased our dues, but not by 4,000.
So, I'm curious, um, is this the MML
[2:20:22] that has increased it? Have we joined
new, um, organizations? Why is it
[2:20:27] $4,000?
>> Um, MML alone was $10,100.
[2:20:34] » Is that that's an increase? Well, no,
that's not the amount of the increase,
[2:20:38] but that is the the new
>> Yeah, that's the new dues for the city
[2:20:44] of Mount Reneer,
>> $3,000.
[2:20:47] » Yeah.
>> So, we we did, you know, when this came
[2:20:52] about, we did increase the budget for
fiscal 27 and that was a big reason. So,
[2:20:58] 10,100 is just for MML. Then there's PG
>> CMA
[2:21:04] » 700
>> $731.
[2:21:07] » Yeah. So there there are several other
much smaller items that are in that
[2:21:14] particular uh expense category.
>> But the bulk of that was in
[2:21:18] » the University of Maryland Association
that once you go to those classes, we
[2:21:23] pay $250 for each council member one
time registration. So it happened for
[2:21:29] the new council,
>> the academy.
[2:21:31] » Yes, the academy.
>> Yes.
[2:21:34] » Right. Okay.
>> I did discuss this one with Ron last
[2:21:37] week because I said why
>> I know if you attend the graduate
[2:21:40] classes at the conference as a separate
cost of like $75 to $100 per class.
[2:21:45] » Yeah.
>> Oh, okay. Well, all right. Well, thank
[2:21:47] you.
>> That's the reason.
[2:21:48] » So, so every time I take a graduate
class, you guys Okay.
[2:21:51] » Oh, yeah.
>> Fair. And you're taking them, too. So,
[2:21:54] yeah. Okay. Thank you for that
clarification. Yeah. Yeah.
[2:21:58] » And I'm glad you adjusted for it in the
new budget. Sorry, I didn't mean to cut
[2:22:01] you off.
>> No, I wanted to ask you if you were done
[2:22:02] with your question.
>> Um, so just to um a little bit of
[2:22:07] reference regarding MML, we were
notified two years ago that the increase
[2:22:12] was going to come and it was they
changed it from assessment to population
[2:22:18] which thank God they did because our
assessments are ridiculous. Uh so the
[2:22:22] difference between what it will have
been and not we will have paid more
[2:22:26] assessment. Uh the other thing that they
have added uh we do not have to pay the
[2:22:31] NLC fee because um it's incorporated
with ML. So that extra additional $3,000
[2:22:37] or so that they did allows for us to to
do that. But they have increased um a
[2:22:43] lot of the webinars. So there's a lot of
stuff that they offer as part of the
[2:22:46] package. And the first year they gave us
a step up in order for us to adjust our
[2:22:53] budget. And then this year we we paid
the full amount, but there was one step
[2:22:57] in the middle that um they said like,
"Okay, pay this lower amount." And we
[2:23:01] did took advantage of that. And then now
it's that. But um it's based on
[2:23:05] populations. So we're 8,250
versus according to the census. So
[2:23:10] unless we get to 10,000 or more, our
fees basically will stay the same every
[2:23:14] year. um because it needs to adjust
another three years. So at least it
[2:23:18] gives us some consistency for the staff
to be able to know like this is what it
[2:23:21] looked like because based on an
assessment it wasn't working. Um in in
[2:23:25] my end thank you for putting this
documents together and it takes a lot of
[2:23:29] work and um I know financing does a lot
of work. I know our department has a lot
[2:23:34] of work to provide the information to
you guys as well so you guys could keep
[2:23:37] up. I think that's been a very uh
continues to be a positive change
[2:23:40] because as you when you guys are closing
the books but also working on the audit
[2:23:44] is easier to maneuver the process of
what it looks like and I think that
[2:23:49] overall you have done a good job also
projecting as much as you guys can. Um
[2:23:54] gas I mean electricity
that was the roof um I think we also had
[2:24:00] like the police department roof as well
on it. So, there's a couple stuff that
[2:24:05] um we have to tackle. Um but because we
have been responsible with our funding,
[2:24:11] we were able to like grab the money that
we needed to be able to do the stuff
[2:24:15] that we needed. So, um that has come out
like, you know, quite a bit. And
[2:24:21] it's definitely a lot of work. So, thank
you guys for um putting all that
[2:24:24] together. And um I would tell you the
the only part when it comes to the 30k
[2:24:30] um
I I would like for us to figure out what
[2:24:35] other um steps we need to do in between
to make sure it doesn't happens again.
[2:24:40] » So even evaluations say like look this
is the contract sign. So every time
[2:24:44] something comes up we're going to match
it with the contract in order to make
[2:24:47] sure it doesn't happens because that way
it allows us to be able to be
[2:24:50] accountable. And I know some of those
contracts are signed three years prior
[2:24:54] or two years prior. So by the time that
works on it um it is through it. So if
[2:24:58] we could work on that to like write it
because our auditors love writing. If
[2:25:02] not it doesn't count. If we could go
ahead and do that if we haven't already
[2:25:05] done so can we please move forward with
it. So that way when we are audited they
[2:25:09] could check it to like okay this is what
happened but this is the written steps
[2:25:13] we're taking forward to make sure we're
not getting that position again.
[2:25:16] » I just want to add something to that. We
yesterday we opened the bid for the
[2:25:21] facade improvement. Right away I had
bill to list all the work that we're
[2:25:26] doing on the storefront to the DHCD and
we got the confirmation. I'm not going
[2:25:32] to let it happen. You all know me that
every penny matters to me and
[2:25:37] unfortunately
I got caught up, you know, and I didn't,
[2:25:41] you know, think about it. But I want to
also let you guys know that this year
[2:25:45] we're going to have a two audits. one
the regular audits and then the single
[2:25:49] audits because of SS4A.
So Ron is gonna be busy and I'm going to
[2:25:55] be working with him and hopefully we're
going to do make sure that we're going
[2:25:59] to meet the deadline. We just had the
first meeting with the auditor last
[2:26:05] week, last Thursday. They came over here
and we had a meeting in the council
[2:26:09] chamber. So, we're going to be getting
ready for the two audits that this year
[2:26:14] we're going to have because our spending
is more than $750,000.
[2:26:20] Thank you.
>> For the next aside from this year, for
[2:26:22] the next four years, we have to do
double audit. So, just for um for quick
[2:26:27] of information, um we managed to get a
lot of money, but it comes with
[2:26:32] additional uh and that's with accounting
with the reports and everything else
[2:26:35] that we have to do to provide constant
information. So, thank you guys for that
[2:26:39] as well and for reminding us that that's
an additional task you guys are going to
[2:26:43] be working on. All right. So, I am I am
good with questions um and comments, but
[2:26:49] thank you guys so much. Okay. All right.
Let me see where are we at?
[2:26:54] Okay. So,
okay. Item number
[2:27:00] nine that from 1300 block is still here,
right? So
[2:27:06] we'll take a we'll take a break right
now. So can I have a motion of to take a
[2:27:11] break and come back in what what do you
guys want? Five 10 minutes
[2:27:15] you guys. All right. What? So right now
it's 9:22 p.m. Can I have a motion the
[2:27:20] floor? Thank you on state travels to
have a 5m minute break.
[2:27:25] » Motion for a five minute break. Please
>> have a second.
[2:27:28] » Second.
>> Is there probably move and second? Any
[2:27:30] discussion,
objections, abstensions? here. 9. Uh we
[2:27:34] are going to be doing a 5m minute break.
It is 9:22.
[2:27:38] Uh 9:27. We'll come back. Okay.
[2:32:50] Where's everybody?
This is like 10 minutes. But you guys
[2:32:54] didn't believe me, right? Like 5
minutes. And never never have I seen
[2:32:59] five minutes. And honestly, like Well,
technically we had four, but
[2:33:04] in a meeting. Well, we only have two
bathrooms though.
[2:33:08] » Well, you have like we have said there
was only one over there.
[2:33:16] » Yeah.
[2:33:20] » I know.
[2:34:00] So next time break. Okay.
We can never get to five.
[2:34:10] All right.
[2:34:19] We're calling back to order. Can I have
a motion to come back into session?
[2:34:23] » I motion we come back into session.
Second probably move a second. Any
[2:34:27] discussion? Objection. Abstensions
hearing none. We are back in session at
[2:34:34] 9:29
p.m. All right. So, thank you guys for
[2:34:39] that. Members of the community, we did
took a small break. Um, and we're back.
[2:34:44] All right. Moving on to item number
nine, presentation. In discussion
[2:34:48] resolution 06-2026
and ordinance 08-2026
[2:34:54] uh vice car will present resolution
06-226 and ordinance OA226 establishing
[2:35:00] and guarding the city's snow angel pro
uh program.
[2:35:04] » Thank you so much mayor. Um, after my
unsuccessful attempt to have the lawn
[2:35:08] angels program and its sisters program,
the snow angels considered by council in
[2:35:13] the fall of 2023, I decided to do the
snow angel program on my own as a
[2:35:17] grassroot effort that sum that winter.
In the first year, eight residents
[2:35:21] requested help shoveling their
sidewalks. The next year, 12 to 15
[2:35:25] residents requested help. Then, before
the first snowflake fell this year, 28
[2:35:30] residents had already signed up for
assistance. And by the end of Snow Creek
[2:35:34] event, volunteers through the snow
angels program have helped more than 42
[2:35:39] residents with some volunteers taking on
two or three houses. That means that
[2:35:44] over the last three years, a program
fueled solely by volunteers grew by 250%
[2:35:49] before the first snowflake fell, but
continued to another whopping 425%
[2:35:56] at the end of the 2026 event compared to
2023.
[2:36:00] I don't understand the skepticism that
surround the program in 2023, but that
[2:36:04] doesn't matter anymore. What matters is
that more of our neighbors are choosing
[2:36:08] to age in place, are living with
disabilities, chronic illnesses,
[2:36:12] temporary injuries, and other physical
limitations. These residents just need a
[2:36:17] helping hand with things like shoveling
snow so that they can stay safe and
[2:36:20] avoid code violations.
During the Snowcrete event, all of us
[2:36:25] here at this table took part in one way
or another when it came to helping our
[2:36:29] neighbors dig out, and I am sure they
appreciated it, too. So, I would ask
[2:36:33] that we take one more step and make this
program an official city program. Now, I
[2:36:39] have no problem continuing to recruit
volunteers and match them with residents
[2:36:42] who need help, whether I'm on council or
not. But this program is not about me.
[2:36:47] It is about our residents and it is our
job as a council and as a city to do
[2:36:51] what we can to improve their quality of
life. I appreciate that other members of
[2:36:56] council agreed that this program has
value for our residents and that council
[2:37:00] member Jakuda helped me with the
language of the resolution and
[2:37:03] ordinance. I'd also be remiss if I did
not thank our city attorney who left um
[2:37:08] for helping um ask questions, thoughtful
questions and tweaking things here and
[2:37:12] there on both pieces of legislation.
The resolution and ordinance are as
[2:37:17] follows. The resolution establishes the
program as a cityrun and city sponsored
[2:37:22] program. And the ordinance governs how
it operates by requiring things like
[2:37:26] volunteer waiverss and allowing extra
time for volunteers to clear both their
[2:37:30] own properties and the properties of the
residents they are helping. There are a
[2:37:34] couple of things that I left open for
discussion and those are the amount of
[2:37:39] additional time volunteers should be
given to clear both of their properties
[2:37:42] and the properties that of the residents
they're helping which I am suggesting to
[2:37:47] be 24 additional hours and an aotment of
$1,000 in the budget to help offset city
[2:37:52] staff's time needed to administer the
program in case of a snow event. I am
[2:37:57] also more than happy to welcome whomever
Mr. Kali taps to run this program. Uh
[2:38:01] excuse me. I am also more than happy to
help whomever Mr. Kamali taps to run
[2:38:06] this program by showing them how I've
done it for the last three years so that
[2:38:09] that can ad they can adapt as necessary
including sharing the list of residents
[2:38:14] who are already signed up receiving help
during snow events. So with that I will
[2:38:18] hand this off to council member Jakuda
to make any comments as well since he is
[2:38:23] co-sponsoring this with me if he so
chooses.
[2:38:26] » Joseph, you don't have anything to say?
>> Um thank you. Um, I I think that this is
[2:38:31] an important program for us to move
forward with as a city, as council
[2:38:34] member Carter mentioned, we have a good
number of folks that are aging in place
[2:38:39] and um I I know from helping out from
the Snow Creek event that those were
[2:38:44] often the people that needed the most
help when it came to shoveling. I also
[2:38:48] think that having a program like this in
place will make it easier for us to be
[2:38:53] able to triage who needs help with a
sidewalk versus who's not doing it and
[2:38:58] should be held accountable under our
ordinances because I think no one wants
[2:39:02] to see um someone who's been living here
for 30 years um you know suffer fines
[2:39:09] from not clearing their sidewalk. we
know they need help, but others that can
[2:39:12] and don't want to, I think, because we
need safe sidewalks to pass since we
[2:39:18] have so many folks that walk, take the
bus, and otherwise get around without
[2:39:22] cars. Um, and this is also becoming more
commonplace. I believe Hyetszville has a
[2:39:27] program, one of the um one of the port
towns has a program. I think we should
[2:39:33] show leadership and um adopt the program
as well. Thank you.
[2:39:38] Okay, Denny.
>> Um, thank you. I um I agree with the
[2:39:46] program and I just want to say that one
of the things that uh concerned me um
[2:39:52] earlier this year with the snow creed
was uh the decision to not not enforce
[2:39:57] our ordinances. Um I really like the
rule of law and I like laws to be
[2:40:02] enforced um as written. Um, and I was
concerned that um people like my my
[2:40:10] children frankly um did not shovel their
sidewalk when they were perfectly
[2:40:14] capable of doing so. Um I was out of the
country. Um but um there was no fine um
[2:40:23] of them and um whereas having this
situation having the snow angels program
[2:40:30] will enable the city to identify the
people who really do need assistance and
[2:40:35] for whom um perhaps there could be
leniency and for the rest of us um to
[2:40:41] enforce the laws as written which I
think we should focus on doing. Thanks,
[2:40:47] » Valerie.
>> Um, thank you. Um, so I have a couple
[2:40:51] questions and some suggestions. Um, if
that's okay. I have, first of all, I
[2:40:56] wanted to ask if you've worked with the
city manager on the protocols and like
[2:41:00] managing the list. Has that already
happened or is that not something like
[2:41:03] has the city manager been involved in
the creation of the program?
[2:41:08] » Um, it's my understanding that council
member Jakuda spoke with Mr. Kamali and
[2:41:12] Mr. Kumali has um decided that it he
would direct who would be in charge of
[2:41:18] the program and uh go from that way. So
I trust that Mr. Kumali will be able to
[2:41:24] adapt um use the list that I have and
the practices that I've used and adapt
[2:41:29] them like I said in my statement adapt
them into the way that um best suits the
[2:41:33] staff that will be overseeing it.
>> Okay. Uh thank you. Um and then just
[2:41:37] quickly um one suggestion I would make
is changing the name of the program. so
[2:41:42] that it's a little more official to snow
snow removal assistance program or
[2:41:46] something similar. So that if in the
future we're going after, you know, if
[2:41:50] this is a program that becomes wildly
successful that if we're going after
[2:41:54] grants to support it in the future that
it's it's not connotated to like a a
[2:41:58] religion maybe or or angel, you know, I
I just thinking through that a little
[2:42:02] bit would be a good idea. Um, and then,
um, on the ordinance, I do wonder about
[2:42:09] the 48 hours for the volunteers to clear
their own snow because I think the point
[2:42:13] of this is for the volunteers to, you
know, like when you're on a plane, you
[2:42:17] put your mask on first and then you help
your neighbor kind of thing. Um, so I
[2:42:20] just wonder about that in the ordinance.
So those are my questions. Thank you.
[2:42:26] » Oh, okay. So, um the 24 hours, the
reason, um I came up with the additional
[2:42:32] 24 hours is, and this is from the time
that the snow finishes, um some of the
[2:42:37] volunteers have come from Southside over
here and have gone like all the way over
[2:42:42] to Windham. So, it it's it's more of a
you know, allowing them the time to get
[2:42:48] not just theirs, but their the one that
they're um doing as well. Some people
[2:42:53] have done two and three houses. Um so I
feel that an additional and this is just
[2:42:59] my feeling of course this is up for
debate but I feel that an additional 24
[2:43:03] hours gives them the leniency to do more
than one if there is a need and this
[2:43:08] year there was a lot of need. In fact
last year I had a couple of residents do
[2:43:12] more than one as well. So it's not just
giving them 24 hours to do theirs but
[2:43:17] it's giving them theirs and any others.
It it it allow I guess you can say that
[2:43:22] it um
encourages more volunteers to know that
[2:43:27] they have they they feel that they have
time. So or that they're Yeah.
[2:43:36] » Um
[2:43:39] I would tell you that I was expecting a
presentation, right? We have not fully
[2:43:45] heard this about three years in three
years. We had a lot of questions about
[2:43:48] how it was going to work, especially if
it's like cityrun. Uh we have a very
[2:43:52] small staff. Um and I feel like there's
a lot of questions I still have not been
[2:43:58] able to to get. We I'm not even sure how
the $1,000 came in and I need to
[2:44:04] definitely know who are the people cuz
right now in the audience you have the
[2:44:09] police department code public works and
I will tell you the police department is
[2:44:14] like down to the wire with the things
that they need to do. They cannot take
[2:44:18] an extra work. public works during the
storm is in charge of like
[2:44:22] clearing all of our streets and alleys
and even then like dealing with
[2:44:26] machinery and whatever comes their way
code is dealing with everything that
[2:44:31] court has to deal with as well. So my
thing is like if those three departments
[2:44:35] are already oversaturated,
where does this fall in? Um that's one.
[2:44:40] The other one is I would tell you that
I'm very much a line of like the
[2:44:46] volunteers have to do their homes first,
right? And then because if not their
[2:44:51] home becomes a hazard as they're helping
somewhere else. So they could clear
[2:44:55] three houses, but if their house is not
on now that block is be is a hazardous.
[2:45:00] So I think that it has to be them doing
their home first and then they could
[2:45:05] volunteer for for something else because
of the fact that if they can even clean
[2:45:09] their holes, how they're going to have
enough springs to come back after two
[2:45:12] three houses if they can. So they will
get I mean in 48 hours is a long period
[2:45:17] of time. I think that what happened a
lot with the the the the snow part of it
[2:45:21] was that people waited so long to remove
it that it turned into ice, right? to me
[2:45:27] is like they're going to go from snow to
come back and then now they have to deal
[2:45:31] with ice in their home. So, um that's
the other one. Uh so I I do need to know
[2:45:37] who's going to be in charge of this and
have you even reviewed the the I'm going
[2:45:42] to like this. Um what is the liability
for the city? I know there was a waiver
[2:45:48] for the the helper not to sue the city,
but is there a waiver where the
[2:45:53] homeowner does not sue the city or B the
volunteer doesn't sue the homeowner if
[2:46:00] they happen to fall on it? So what are
the protections? because right now this
[2:46:03] document just tells me like they cannot
technically they cannot sue us but the
[2:46:08] other three components of it are not
meant and and lastly I would tell you
[2:46:13] that
um I need to get a definition what a
[2:46:18] snow means right a snow means is 3 in 1
in 5 in or if one inch lens is going to
[2:46:25] be activated and who's going to be in
running this program you see has a very
[2:46:29] successful program actually taking the
training And it's like robust on what is
[2:46:33] it that is requiring because if you're
having to have a staff member um being
[2:46:38] pulled let's say on a on a Saturday to
like match people right who's calling
[2:46:45] that staff member to come in or work for
whatever they're doing and leaving their
[2:46:49] duties aside. So I know it's a lot of
cover but I definitely want to know that
[2:46:53] I think there's a need to help. I even
three years ago the issue wasn't the
[2:46:58] help wasn't needed. It was like how will
the city administer and protect ourel to
[2:47:03] be able to help the residents without
hurting ourel or or hurting other
[2:47:07] people.
>> Um thank thank you. I appreciate that.
[2:47:10] Um first of all, let me address the uh
the timeline. The timeline is not you
[2:47:15] get 24 hours to clean the people you're
volunteering for and then come out to
[2:47:19] yours. It is a you have this much time
to get everything your your home and
[2:47:25] anybody you're you're shoveling done. So
it's not, you know, designating what
[2:47:30] they do first. So there is, you know,
that's up to their discretion. Most
[2:47:34] people are going to scrape their own
sidewalks first. I mean, Brian scraped
[2:47:38] our sidewalks first and then went and
helped. Um the $1,000 that was um that
[2:47:44] is was something I put in there. As you
see, it's an asterisk, so it's up for
[2:47:48] debate um to help with Mr. Kamali when
it comes to staff that may need to work
[2:47:54] like to make extra phone calls or
whatever in case of a really bad snow
[2:47:59] event. Um, my original and and I talked
with uh Joseph uh council member Jakuda
[2:48:05] about this originally. My suggestion was
the social services coordinator to do
[2:48:09] this because they're the one that is
most in touch with the residents in the
[2:48:14] community who may fall into the
parameters of assistance or the need of
[2:48:19] assistance with this. But after council
member Jakuda spoke to uh city manager
[2:48:24] Kamali and then discuss it with me, we
felt that it would be best to defer to
[2:48:29] Mr. Kamali and let him use his best
judgment. Um and if you look at the
[2:48:33] resolution, it does say with input from
council the policing code. When I first
[2:48:39] um came up with this program three years
ago, the lawn angels and snow angels was
[2:48:43] a part of it. It was in a direct
response to the the answer that I gave
[2:48:49] to code when I was first elected. What
can I do to help you and make the
[2:48:54] quality of life for our residents easier
as a as a joint? And they said that
[2:48:58] there are a lot of people out there who
need assistance both with mowing their
[2:49:01] lawn and shoveling who otherwise get
violations who can't physically do this.
[2:49:07] So, this was a direct result of a an an
idea that came from code enforcement.
[2:49:13] So, I mean, originally, if you recall,
and if you don't, that's fine, but
[2:49:18] originally my suggestion was to let the
social services coordinator oversee the
[2:49:22] program with the um assistance with
code, and that was my original, but that
[2:49:28] was when I was first on. Now, after
speaking with council member Jakuda, I
[2:49:32] agreed to defer to Mr. Kamali. Um, I
think those were the questions you had
[2:49:37] about that. Um, as far as the waiver,
um, council member Jakuda,
[2:49:42] » put time on the clock.
>> Oh, yes. Um, I'd like to make a motion
[2:49:45] to add 10 minutes to the clock.
>> U second. I
[2:49:50] » second.
>> Probably moved and second in discussion.
[2:49:53] Objection extension hearing. None. We're
adding 10 more minutes to the clock.
[2:49:56] » Okay. And then the last point that you
made was about the waiver. the waiver.
[2:50:01] Um, that's something Hyetszville, it's
it's it's funny how some of these comm
[2:50:05] anyway the waiver HiZville um is the one
that decided to do the waiver and I
[2:50:11] think that deferring uh to the city
attorney to dis to design and um to
[2:50:18] design the waiver that we would use
would be the best practice there. She
[2:50:22] knows what liabilities are needed. She
knows who needs to be protected in which
[2:50:26] way that happens. So those were the u
things that were discussed before this
[2:50:31] has been brought tonight.
>> So I did ask what activates it.
[2:50:35] » Oh, what activates it? Okay. So you you
asked about inches. Well, that's that's
[2:50:39] an ordinance situation. There is nothing
in the ordinance. It says that if
[2:50:43] there's snow accumulation, there is no
this is another one of those things we
[2:50:47] may need to revisit, but it does not
give a specific measurement. So whatever
[2:50:52] would trigger
you to have to scrape your sidewalk is
[2:50:57] what would trigger the snow angels.
>> So
[2:51:01] So Mr. Kamali, there's there's two
questions for you. One, has legit been
[2:51:05] contacted to figure out what the
liability is and what is the cost for us
[2:51:09] to be able to inquire this additional
insurance to cover our residents doing
[2:51:12] this and who is the person that you are
um that you'll be allocating to do this
[2:51:19] work?
Well, based on my conversation with
[2:51:24] council Jacuda, we're supposed to
I think the best option is public works
[2:51:31] because they are here emergency
situation the director of public works.
[2:51:38] I'm talking about the director so people
can register and then she has the name
[2:51:44] and we can go through the process. But I
am the only thing that I'm concerned
[2:51:50] I see you know both sides that we got
smaller staff I know that six people but
[2:51:56] my my concern is what's going to happen
and I think the city attorney also
[2:52:02] raised this question that what's going
to happen if they are not available
[2:52:07] if the snow angel team are not available
at that time if they're out of town and
[2:52:13] we get a snow I just want to make sure
that if I am committed to something. I
[2:52:18] want to make sure that it's going to
work and it's not going to create more
[2:52:21] trouble. And then the waiver, I talked
to the city attorney. She's going to
[2:52:26] make sure that we're not going to have
any liability for this city. And I need
[2:52:30] to talk to the insurance. And I was
coming to this discussion and see you
[2:52:36] know what you guys going to decide and
we take it from there.
[2:52:40] » Okay. because um highest skill is having
issues currently with the liability part
[2:52:46] of it. Uh DC has very clear standards
because I did do the training. I'm
[2:52:52] trying to actually remove snow in the
sea if I so choose to. They have very
[2:52:56] specific standards when it activates.
The other thing according to the
[2:53:00] ordinance and you have to be 70 and over
to get the help but it does not does not
[2:53:06] implement whether it's a financial need
or is it open to all 70 years old or B
[2:53:12] if there's an able body in the house
like an example if you have an elderly
[2:53:16] that's 70 but however you have grown
children in there that could do this
[2:53:20] they'll still get the free service. So I
I would say at least for me if you guys
[2:53:26] you know haven't taken the training for
DC take the training because they're
[2:53:28] very specific so that way we are able to
follow the rule of what it looks like.
[2:53:34] DC does not remove eyes and they're very
clear like they do not do uh driveways
[2:53:39] and vehicles and steps. It's up to the
person and they do have a very slow
[2:53:44] window. And the way it also works, it's
like the person doing the house has to
[2:53:49] send a photo back to somebody to show
that they done the work. So that way
[2:53:54] they could validate that this is is
done. But uh there is once there's no is
[2:54:00] like people could valid people could
sign up at whatever time but then people
[2:54:04] call like say like hey I need the help
right and that's how they assign them.
[2:54:08] So, there's a coordinating team that is
working on on matching um homeowners
[2:54:13] with volunteers in order to make this
happen. But I believe if I'm correct,
[2:54:17] it's like there I know I'm correct.
There's a specific amount when it goes.
[2:54:22] So, if it's like half an inch or an
inch, they're not um they're not moving
[2:54:26] their their um snow heroes out into the
community. So, I think that there's at
[2:54:32] least for me, it feels like there's a
lot of uh things that we need to make
[2:54:37] sure we have in order to get the answers
that we need because if now you're
[2:54:40] asking the public works director who's
like conducting all the snow around,
[2:54:45] right, to also assign people to the to
this program and example, they have to
[2:54:49] give that list also to code because code
is also sighting. They also have to give
[2:54:54] the list to PD. So I think no matter
what you'll take three departments to
[2:54:58] work on it because even if public works
has it if code is like out there citing
[2:55:03] right if they don't have a document that
says like these are the people that are
[2:55:07] helping and these are the people and
they have to be obviously like you
[2:55:10] mentioned like it has to be that they're
they have signed up for a shift to help.
[2:55:14] It's not just like you know you're a
schedule volunteer so therefore you get
[2:55:19] a a free 48 hours. So, so to me there's
a couple more fine-tuning and I would
[2:55:25] definitely suggest for you guys to look
at ideally what um you know DC is doing
[2:55:29] to figure out how they're able to
accomplish what they're doing. I know
[2:55:32] the county tried doing uh the snow
removal and they hire contractors and
[2:55:38] they end up with a lot of delays because
the the need was on it and they're
[2:55:44] reviewing the program as well. So that
way it's more fine-tuned to who they
[2:55:48] potentially could help because they bit
a bigger apple than they could handle
[2:55:51] and that's reason why we had to add
additional time because they were under
[2:55:57] the county list and they had been
approved and how are you going to site
[2:56:00] them if you're supposed to be getting
help with the county. So that was
[2:56:04] another issue that we encounter. So, I'm
telling you this in good faith that you
[2:56:10] will look into those programs to figure
out how we could do it because if not,
[2:56:13] we're sending the team blindly to be
able to do it. When the city gets
[2:56:17] involved, there's other liabilities and
I don't want to get into situation where
[2:56:21] the public works going to have to choose
remove like the the snow and everything
[2:56:26] else and have to suffer people that
sometimes are not here than then having
[2:56:30] to do this. So, that might that might
stretch them to death. So that that's
[2:56:34] where I want you to please um consider
and review some of the stuff that I said
[2:56:38] » um on on some of your points um as far
as who um in in the um resolution I'll
[2:56:45] just read these two parts um it says
whereas the American Heart Association
[2:56:50] advises that persons 70 years old and
older with high blood pressure or
[2:56:55] previous cardiac issues are at increased
risk for cardiac strain and injury when
[2:57:00] shoveling snow and should be cautious or
refrain from shoveling snow and ice
[2:57:04] altogether. And whereas the community in
Mount Reineer has many residents who
[2:57:08] have opted or are opting to age in
place, as well as residents with
[2:57:12] disabilities, chronic illnesses,
temporary injuries, and other physical
[2:57:16] limitations that make snow and ice
removal difficult or unsafe, increasing
[2:57:20] the need for assistance during or after
snow and ice events. So, the resolution
[2:57:25] covers persons over 70. It literally
says persons over 70. Um, and it's not
[2:57:31] just some it's it's 70. It's not income
based. It's age- based or um disability
[2:57:37] um or injury or illness related. And I I
have full faith in the city uh manager
[2:57:44] that once I hand over the way that I've
done it that he and his team will be
[2:57:48] able to adapt it the way that it fits
into the the way that the team needs it
[2:57:55] to work for them. As far as if people
are not in town, that was something that
[2:58:00] the city attorney brought up. Um,
you you literally check with the way
[2:58:05] I've done it, you check with the people
when you hear the weather, you check,
[2:58:10] hey, are you in town? Are you going to
need services? So, as soon as the
[2:58:13] weather comes out a day or two in
advance, that's when you start making
[2:58:16] your checks.
>> Mr. Kamali, I saw you shaking your So, I
[2:58:20] just want to make sure you know
>> that's how I've done it. Well, I think I
[2:58:24] think I think this is my opinion
>> uh to be honest with you with this small
[2:58:30] team that I have if we have to run this
program it's going to be additional task
[2:58:35] and tonight I'll leave it up to you guys
discuss it but uh I need to look at it
[2:58:41] in the bigger a bigger picture because
public works is only six people and if
[2:58:47] we have to run and administer this this
program it's going to be additional task
[2:58:53] for me. That's why 3 years ago, I just
want to be frank with everyone. I said
[2:58:59] staff capacity is very important when it
comes to this snow. We hire some temps
[2:59:06] in order to to clean up our sidewalk
over here because I got only six people
[2:59:11] and with six people, Rosio is not going
to be doing any work or Hold on. Let me
[2:59:16] finish with this. Yes. Yes. I I just
want to let you know that and I think we
[2:59:21] need to sit down and discuss this one in
a broader picture because I do not want
[2:59:29] to obligate myself to something that I
I'm going to be sorry tomorrow for it
[2:59:34] and I think you know there should be
there are so many points that we have to
[2:59:39] look at it first of all when it comes to
the snow I am really short I cannot like
[2:59:45] you know I try to do I come here myself
and I stay here all night still I cannot
[2:59:52] you know get it over so I am not looking
to have additional task and I believe it
[2:59:59] is good it's a good program I wish I had
10 people to run it and do it but I
[3:00:06] think we need we need to talk about this
more
[3:00:09] » if I if I can ask you Mr. Kamali, um,
you keep referring to public works
[3:00:14] running this program. What is wrong with
the social services coordinator that is
[3:00:18] her job is to communicate and keep in
touch with people that literally fall
[3:00:21] into the uh the the the demographics
that that are mentioned and outlined in
[3:00:26] the in the um resolution. I mean, she's
it's her job.
[3:00:30] » May I ask for time, Daniel?
>> Yes. Um,
[3:00:34] » yes to 10.
>> Um, okay. Uh, a motion to add 10 minutes
[3:00:38] to the clock. at this point. So, we
don't have
[3:00:39] » I disagree with the motion.
>> So, there's a motion on the floor. Is
[3:00:43] there a second for adding to more
minutes?
[3:00:47] » I'll second it. Any discussion?
>> I disagree with the motion.
[3:00:52] » Okay. Any discussion?
Any objection? Jenny, you cleared
[3:00:57] there's an objection on your end?
>> Objection. I think we need to talk about
[3:01:00] this more offline and come back.
>> Well, I I think that I want to make
[3:01:04] sure.
>> I So, I object. So there's two I I I do
[3:01:08] want to honor Nenburg cars.
She wanted to say something.
[3:01:14] » Yeah. No. So let me let me call the vote
in order to make sure I'm fair. So
[3:01:18] there's two nos, right? So 10 minutes.
Um
[3:01:22] » so any obstensions? There's are you guys
abstensions or no?
[3:01:28] » No.
>> So no.
[3:01:29] » I'll go step abstension.
>> So one section one and no. Any yay? I'm
[3:01:34] a I'm a yes. Yes.
>> Yes, Danielle.
[3:01:37] » Um I I
>> It could be a yes. You could say final
[3:01:41] word. You don't have to say.
>> Yes. Okay. Yes. Yes. Yes.
[3:01:43] » Okay. Motion carries. So, go ahead,
Danielle.
[3:01:45] » Okay. Um I um I agree with the comments
um from Council Member Jakuda. This is
[3:01:50] something we need to discuss. However, I
do feel that we do need to focus on
[3:01:55] finding a way to make this program work.
>> That needs to be a goal.
[3:02:00] » That's our Yeah, definitely. That's our
goal. Can I answer? Yeah, go ahead.
[3:02:05] » But as a city manager, I want to make
sure that I am able to run this program
[3:02:10] and I'm going to afford it. Social
services is not an essential employee
[3:02:17] and I cannot assign her. Hold on a
second. Let me just Essential employees
[3:02:23] are police department and public works.
I cannot assign that person to be here
[3:02:29] to make sure that you know during this
snow time and again I do appreciate to
[3:02:36] as I talked to Joseph and Joseph should
recall this one you know that we need we
[3:02:41] need to talk about this whether to talk
about it more because the way I see it I
[3:02:48] don't know I just you know
however you guys want to decide
[3:02:54] » where are you guys still
I think it's around for the whole whole
[3:02:57] home's night.
>> You exhausted us.
[3:03:01] » All right.
>> Well, thank you guys for joining us. So,
[3:03:04] I I do agree this has to go to a drawing
board. There's a lot more information
[3:03:09] that we need to look into. There's a
couple programs that are currently
[3:03:14] running year. They have like gotten
theelves in a situation where we need to
[3:03:17] also like um figure out so that we don't
end up in the same situation, right? And
[3:03:23] so we will have to discuss it offline to
be able to get some of the answers that
[3:03:26] we need. Uh because I believe there's a
different um there's a different if you
[3:03:32] bring non-essential staff during an
essential emergency, it's differently
[3:03:38] coded. Um and do the legislation that
says like, you know, council members, um
[3:03:43] I'll definitely if this thing moves
forward, I want to make sure the mayor
[3:03:46] is also added to it since I'm not a
council member. So that way um any of us
[3:03:50] are able to refer if it moves forward.
But there I would say that the next step
[3:03:55] is definitely figure out what the two
programs are to figure out how they're
[3:03:59] doing it. Um but also talk when it comes
to liability and Mr. Kamali um I
[3:04:05] appreciate the the remarks that that you
made. So there's a couple steps that
[3:04:09] happen. I would say like um take it
offline like it's been said and we could
[3:04:15] figure out what what else to do in order
to to get more answers for this. I'll go
[3:04:19] ahead.
>> I I just have one question. You said add
[3:04:21] you to what? Did you say add you to
something? The the conversation
[3:04:26] » members could like um uh council members
could refer people in need.
[3:04:32] » Oh. Oh. Oh, the language. Okay. Yes.
Done.
[3:04:36] » Yeah. But I definitely think that we
have time. There's no snow again, but
[3:04:40] it's Maruk has snow tomorrow. But we
have time to figure this out and figure
[3:04:46] out what it what it looks like. And if
this is something we could potentially,
[3:04:50] but I know that um Highestville and DC
have two programs. And the other thing I
[3:04:58] will and I'll close it with this based
on the paragraph you wrote, you read
[3:05:02] there's no at this point I haven't heard
any distinction of where regarding
[3:05:07] volunteers. It sounds like 70 and over
volunteers cannot join to do this
[3:05:11] because they will have heart attacks and
whatever else it is and this is the
[3:05:15] reason why we we they need the help. So,
I want to make sure that that's a little
[3:05:20] bit clear um as well because if if they
could get their house clean at 70
[3:05:26] because of the different like um being
sick, not strong and blah blah blah,
[3:05:31] will that disqualify them from being
volunteers? So, well, because they fall
[3:05:34] under the same guidelines of not being
able to lift the snow and everything
[3:05:38] else. So, just hits us on that. Okay.
All right. So, um we'll move on to the
[3:05:44] next item. Okay. It is 10:01.
Uh item number 10 uh presentation
[3:05:52] discussion legislative priorities as
Mary car will present suggest alternate
[3:05:56] practices for the consultation manager
when creating the annual legislative uh
[3:06:00] priorities list.
>> Okay. Thank you. Um as we begin thinking
[3:06:04] about next year's state legislative
priorities, I would like to suggest that
[3:06:07] we consider redesigning the way we
develop and present them. Traditionally,
[3:06:11] each council member is asked to submit
three individual priorities. While that
[3:06:16] approach certainly generates ideas, it
can also result in a list of unrelated
[3:06:20] items rather than a cohesive set of
goals that reflects the broader needs of
[3:06:24] our city. Recently, I came across the
legislative priorities adopted by the
[3:06:28] town of Matthews, North Carolina, and I
was impressed by how they organized
[3:06:32] their priorities under a broad topic
areas such as transportation, revenue,
[3:06:37] and tax reform, public safety, and
planning. Rather than simply listing a
[3:06:41] handful of unrelated requests, they
create a comprehensive document that
[3:06:45] groups specific priorities under larger
policy umbrellas. For example, under a
[3:06:51] category such as transportation, Mount
Reneer could include priorities related
[3:06:55] to the CSX rail lines that run through
our city, improvements to Rhode Island
[3:06:59] Avenue, and issues involving Queens
Chapel Road. All of which involve state
[3:07:03] controlled infrastructure and have a
direct impact on our residents. under a
[3:07:07] category such as revenue and tax reform.
We could identify issues related to
[3:07:12] municipal funding, state aid, and
policies that affect our local tax base.
[3:07:16] Other potential categories might include
public safety, housing and economic
[3:07:20] development, environmental
sustainability, and local government
[3:07:24] authority. I also believe this process
would benefit from participation of the
[3:07:29] city manager who often has valuable
operational and legislative insights
[3:07:33] that can help identify priorities from
an administrative perspective.
[3:07:39] My suggestion, sorry, my suggestion is
that we begin discussing potential
[3:07:43] categories and priorities and refine
them during our September work session
[3:07:47] and adopt a final list in the fall so
that our legislative priorities are in
[3:07:51] place well before the Maryland General
Assembly convenes.
[3:07:55] In addition, I would like to suggest
that once adopted, the city's
[3:07:58] legislative priorities be posted on the
city's website under a dedicated tab
[3:08:02] titled legislative priorities. Doing so
would provide residents with a clear
[3:08:06] understanding of the issues we the city
council and mayor are advocating for at
[3:08:10] the state level and would further our
communic our commitment to transparency.
[3:08:15] Once those priorities are identified and
adopted, they would also serve as a
[3:08:18] roadmap for Greenwell, our lobbying
firm, by giving them clear direction on
[3:08:22] the types of legislation and policy
issues the council is interested in
[3:08:25] monitoring. If bills are introduced in
Annapolis that fall within these adopted
[3:08:30] priorities, Greenwill could bring them
to the council for consideration and
[3:08:33] possible support. This would create a
more organized and collaborative process
[3:08:37] and help ensure that our advocacy
efforts are guided by priorities that
[3:08:41] have been discussed and approved by the
council as a whole. Ultimately, the goal
[3:08:45] is to move from a simple list of three
priorities per council member to a
[3:08:49] collaborative and comprehensive policy
document that reflects our shared goals
[3:08:52] as a council and mayor, incorporates
input from staff, and serves as a
[3:08:56] roadmap for our advocacy efforts in
Annapolis. I believe this approach would
[3:09:00] result in a stronger and more thoughtful
legislative agenda, and I hope the
[3:09:03] council will consider adopting this
frame, this framework moving forward.
[3:09:10] and I've um submitted the uh this is off
of their website. Oops, I'm sorry.
[3:09:16] Sorry. This is off their website. So,
this is actually the blueprint that I'm
[3:09:21] speaking of. You have the main topics
like local government revenues and tax
[3:09:25] reform and then the priorities
individual identified. So under
[3:09:29] transportation for us it would be CSX
issues with trail uh with train it would
[3:09:34] be things uh dealing with Shaw or Rhode
Island Avenue, Queens Chapel um
[3:09:39] government revenues and tax reform
things of that nature. So that would be
[3:09:44] tailored to fit Mount Reineer not only
in the umbrellas but in the um items
[3:09:49] underneath. Thank you.
>> Okay.
[3:09:57] Um I um I agree with Council Member
Carter's uh presentation. I struggled um
[3:10:04] during this last legislative session to
understand where uh the priorities came
[3:10:09] from that our lobbyists um were given
and and what guidance um they were
[3:10:15] receiving since it had not come from the
council. Thank you.
[3:10:21] » I would concur with uh what council
members Carter and Hoff said. I think
[3:10:26] it's important for us to discuss our
legislative priorities clearly with a
[3:10:32] guide towards that we are discussing
state legislation or county legislation.
[3:10:38] Um I I don't think we should be our
lobbyists should be reading the tea
[3:10:42] leaves through resolutions that were
passed several council members ago. we
[3:10:46] were elected to in this current time in
this current body to be making our best
[3:10:53] judgments about how to move forward as a
city. And I think that having an
[3:10:58] approach like this where we're clearly
laying out our legislative priorities
[3:11:04] for the year as a council, as a body, um
is an important step forward. And
[3:11:09] September,
I think, seems like a reasonable time
[3:11:13] frame. Um but I
I would concur. I would I would defer if
[3:11:18] others have thoughts on that time frame.
[3:11:24] » Um, thank you. Um, so
a few things. I think having a document
[3:11:30] that sort of resembles this would be
helpful um to have on the city website.
[3:11:35] I think that I agree with that. Um, but
I do think that we have to think through
[3:11:39] the timeline a little bit. Um, we have
MML coming up in June. um and have the
[3:11:44] reason this document was created the way
it is is because we were able to then go
[3:11:48] to the all directors meetings at MML and
talk to them directly about the
[3:11:53] priorities we wanted to see happening.
So for example, it was specific things
[3:11:57] like POTS Hall, Memorial Park, when we
talk about academic development, we talk
[3:12:01] about Gateway CDC, like these are the
things that we were talking about in
[3:12:05] terms of um how we, you know, kind of
frame what we're going to be working on
[3:12:10] for the full year. It also helped for
the city manager to understand the
[3:12:14] direction the council was generally
going in. So that you know if for
[3:12:18] example we all said public safety was
the number one thing that then we would
[3:12:21] go after grants related to public
safety. If we said economic development
[3:12:25] we would continue on main street
programming and talking about those
[3:12:28] things. So I think this process had
worked for a very long time. I
[3:12:31] understand that we have a new council
and so things might have to change a
[3:12:34] little bit but I do think you we have
MML in June. we have the U. Mako, the
[3:12:40] Maryland Association of Counties. This
is when a lot of those discussions
[3:12:43] happen in in these conferences. And so I
think waiting till September to really
[3:12:48] put this together is going to be a
little too late for those initial
[3:12:51] conversations that people are having. Um
and so I do want to protect this. I
[3:12:55] think we should have a conversation
about our general buckets of city
[3:12:58] priorities. If we need to refine the
list in September, we can do that when
[3:13:02] we have all the more information on kind
of what the general assembly is going to
[3:13:06] be working on. They don't assign bill
numbers until like January, so we're not
[3:13:10] going to be able to get to that level of
detail, but we can certainly add to the
[3:13:15] list of priorities that we have kind of
bucketed out at this meeting. Thank you.
[3:13:21] » So, let me
um so I will tell you guys the thing
[3:13:26] September definitely does not work. The
larks are to be voted by January, by
[3:13:30] June. So, we will miss completely
submitting any larks, right? And if you
[3:13:36] don't know what it is, you guys will got
an email from MML. Those are the city
[3:13:41] suggesting a priority to MML for them to
potentially look into. Um, usually their
[3:13:46] uh legislative team and the legislative
committee look into it and then they
[3:13:52] come out with it. Right? So that is to
this reason why we're discussing it in
[3:13:56] May because we have to have voted um as
a body in June and if we don't vote as a
[3:14:04] body in June uh for this particular
piece of the puzzle, right? Uh we cannot
[3:14:09] submit uh alert. So just be be aware of
that. Uh the other thing to point out is
[3:14:18] you guys want a document that details
what we've been doing on your cool. I
[3:14:21] have no objection to it, but let's I
just want to make sure we we stay
[3:14:25] realistically that the numbers don't
even come out in January at times.
[3:14:29] Sometimes they come out in like
February, right? So, we have three
[3:14:33] voting meetings during this 90 days. And
I think that trying to get us to vote on
[3:14:39] legislation
um is we're going to be falling behind.
[3:14:43] Uh there's sometimes where we get notice
on
[3:14:47] on Monday that we have to um speak on
Tuesday or submit testimony or like
[3:14:53] request a testimony on Tuesday to speak
on Wednesday as an example, right? The
[3:14:57] turnaround is really really fast. So I
would say the other thing to point out
[3:15:02] is like um
I I I I feel that
[3:15:08] the system had worked for many years
because we simplified as much as we
[3:15:12] could. So that way during the summer the
city manager was aware like hey this is
[3:15:16] what our priorities are and then the
team will work during the summer to
[3:15:19] figure out like if they're grants we
need to look information we need to look
[3:15:22] forward right so it gave them at least
some time for them to also like adjust
[3:15:26] and then focus on those three items
right this doesn't means to say that we
[3:15:30] have a thousand things but I think it it
made it um smoother and at least that
[3:15:35] method if it doesn't work to this
council fine we could just some of it um
[3:15:39] if not mistaken it's been I want to say
be four councils that we have done this
[3:15:43] on um that we had you know reduced it on
it but when it comes to the quote
[3:15:50] unquote buckets uh we could list them up
but for the majority of the part um and
[3:15:55] this is not just legislation that we
have passed prior we actually passed
[3:15:58] human rights legislation you know
talking about you know um abortion being
[3:16:04] a human right the city marine this
council passed this so if there's a
[3:16:08] build in the legislation that you know
makes reference. I think that is
[3:16:12] definitely uh something that we
currently have passed and I'll tell you
[3:16:16] guys the rules do not disappear the same
way the city manager is tasked with all
[3:16:22] 116 years. So the rules as they stand so
are we right. Uh the books have usually
[3:16:30] been in the lobby has done a good job in
making sure if it's anything that's
[3:16:33] safety they they will like notify us in
the bill trackers right when it comes to
[3:16:38] mandates that have no funding. They will
notify us for us to be aware because
[3:16:42] that means the city's required to follow
the law and there's no money attached.
[3:16:46] So usually that's when we react and say
hey wait a minute we need to make you
[3:16:50] aware that if this happens you know you
have to attach money for it. The other
[3:16:54] thing when it comes to like human rights
or immigration in this sense, right?
[3:16:58] That's legislation that we also passed
this year. But it's something like, you
[3:17:01] know, they always look anything that
will harm our residents, you know, or
[3:17:04] the safety of them. That's something
that's also bucket. And I have a problem
[3:17:08] if you guys wanted to write them down,
they will write them down, but the
[3:17:11] lobbyist is basically alert us if
there's anything where there's a
[3:17:14] priority of ours or not. they will let
you know they will let us know because
[3:17:18] we're all copy and every week we get a a
report that says like hey this is the
[3:17:22] bill we're tracking and you guys are
welcome to ask them so I would say we
[3:17:27] could expand the document to to add the
other stuff that we need that's fine but
[3:17:33] at time wise um we are running against
the the clock of of the things that we
[3:17:38] need to do so the next item the agenda
is like you know we were supposed to
[3:17:42] bring um the three items in order to
figure out like and and I'll be honest
[3:17:47] with you, it was originally done to
figure out what we could agree on so
[3:17:53] that staff will have a clear message
across uh because a lot of us have like
[3:17:57] 20 different items a year but we want to
make sure it was realistic for us to say
[3:18:01] Mr. Ali, this is like the priorities for
this year and we could like figure out
[3:18:07] if we get them across. The problem with
having 20 different things that reality
[3:18:10] is like the staff cannot do 20 different
things. So that challenges so I will
[3:18:14] stay with that. I have no problem in in
if you guys want to create a document
[3:18:18] post it. I know we read it and post it.
So that way also will reme will remind
[3:18:22] the you know all of us like what they
what they are because for a minute there
[3:18:27] there was also confusion of what they
were and but their list are there and we
[3:18:31] could publish them so that way there is
>> okay um to respond to both of you um and
[3:18:39] just to be clear what what we're doing
next on the agenda is not setting our
[3:18:45] legit legislative agenda for our
priorities for the upcoming general
[3:18:50] assembly.
What we're doing is looking at what we
[3:18:53] want to see done in the city, not state
legislation. There is a vast difference.
[3:18:58] I mean, there there is a difference. Um,
and and I mean, we've seen it like the
[3:19:04] safe streets for all. That's not state
legislation. Yet, that was one of our
[3:19:08] priorities a couple of years ago and it
stayed that way. That's, you know,
[3:19:11] that's literally here. Stop sign
legislation. That's that's general
[3:19:15] assembly. But things that focus on city
priorities is that giving Mr. Kamali
[3:19:21] marching orders is literally a city
issue. We're talking about legislative.
[3:19:26] We're talking about things that happened
in the general assembly in in Annapolis,
[3:19:30] giving our um essentially giving our
lobbyists the marching orders. So the we
[3:19:35] are talking about two completely
different things. And I think that that
[3:19:38] that that um
designation that they are two different
[3:19:44] things needs to be highlighted as as to
the voting. You you speak about voting
[3:19:49] when when when we get like if if we have
this, which I hope we will um and
[3:19:54] Greenwill sees, hey, there's a there's a
bill coming up that fits under their
[3:19:58] transportation for CSX, just as an
example, they send it to us. It is an
[3:20:03] administrative vote. We can do that at a
work session. we do not need a
[3:20:08] legislative um session. It does not bear
the weight of law. We've had this
[3:20:12] discussion ad nauseium. Um so I mean
just like if you brought like um a
[3:20:17] letter from someone to ask for support
for something happening in the county,
[3:20:21] we do not need to legislate it over the
course of two to four weeks. So I would
[3:20:27] argue that this um that we do not need
to make this harder than it has to be.
[3:20:32] And I think dragging it out and and and
and putting assigning all these
[3:20:37] different stipulations to it is
literally making something so simple
[3:20:41] extremely complicated and confusing not
only for the people who are watching us
[3:20:46] and for others on council but for Mr.
Kamali and the staff because that this
[3:20:50] is going to confuse legislation in
Annapolis with city priorities. So
[3:20:55] that's my argument back
>> to clarify the large are legislative
[3:21:00] priorities we want to submit to MML this
technically what they are so they're not
[3:21:05] just city but it's like as a city we let
them know like an example when hur was
[3:21:10] cut off we've been having the the large
for um highway user revenue to be like
[3:21:16] um moved to 100% right we still don't
have that but we managed to get some of
[3:21:21] the money back right but that is
something that as as members of MML
[3:21:25] several of us like said like hey like
this has something to do with it right
[3:21:29] when it came to this to the ability for
trained nonofficers to be able to review
[3:21:35] the stuff like that that's another lark
right the last priority for MML that um
[3:21:40] which created a study to be able to find
what the revenue was that's in Annapolis
[3:21:45] legisl
I want to make sure that we are clear
[3:21:48] that the next point is going to be
talking about that it's not just going
[3:21:52] to be talking about like do we
prioritize X or B? Thank you, Mr.
[3:21:56] Kamali. Um, I'd like to somebody put 10
minutes on the clock, please.
[3:22:01] » Or we could drop it and then move on to
the next item. It's up to you guys.
[3:22:06] » I'll make a motion at 10 minutes.
>> Is there a second?
[3:22:11] Second. Uh, discussion, objection,
abstensions, hearing none. We have 10
[3:22:17] more minutes on the clock. So, I just
want to be clear that that's what's
[3:22:20] going to be the next step in order for
us because we have to have a vote on
[3:22:24] what the city considers a legislative
priority for us to be able to ask MML if
[3:22:30] they will um include it for the
legislative stuff or not. And the
[3:22:36] deadline is uh vote by June. So, we
could let them know like, hey, we
[3:22:40] discussed this here, but it has to vote
by June. If not, we cannot submit it.
[3:22:44] So, I know I thought I was one like
seeing the lights off. Um, so, oh, the
[3:22:48] the overhead projector. So, I just want
to make sure that that is uh clear.
[3:22:54] » I'm sorry. I I that that did not happen
last year, Mayor. And I'm I'm
[3:23:00] there is a a disconnect between what
you're saying and the facts. And and
[3:23:05] last year when we discussed the
legislative priorities, we were
[3:23:09] discussing, as Council Member Carter
noted, our priorities for legislation at
[3:23:14] the municipal level. We never discussed
in council the legislative priorities
[3:23:19] for MML or for um the general assembly.
And I'm tired of the misstatements being
[3:23:27] made about this. It was not discussed.
And so I I'd like to correct the record
[3:23:34] that you have made a lot of
misstatements about this. And and I I
[3:23:40] hope that this year um we can operate
differently. Again, item number 11, the
[3:23:47] agenda states, Maryland municipal league
and state priorities are next on the
[3:23:51] item. MML decides when those deadlines
are to be submitted and there's things
[3:23:58] that happened before you guys were
elected. I just want to make sure it's
[3:24:02] clear and I'm not misspeaking. The
reason why added, we all got the email
[3:24:05] from MML saying, "Hey, this is the
procedure on it and here it is. I'm
[3:24:10] bringing it to a table to give us a
chance in case we want to submit
[3:24:13] something. So I I understand that for
some people it's okay for them to
[3:24:18] continue chastising me and that has to
end. It's against the council rules. So
[3:24:22] we need to stop.
>> No. Um no mayor. Mayor actually. So we
[3:24:27] don't operate according to Robert's
rules. It's a work session. Mayor
[3:24:32] Bonitz, you violated the council rules
by submitting statements to the general
[3:24:38] assembly purporting to rec to represent
the city's position on legislation. And
[3:24:44] we never as a council discussed those
positions and you violated the council
[3:24:50] rules every time you did so. I believe
you submitted 13 statements last year to
[3:24:57] the general assembly purporting to
represent us when in fact we never
[3:25:01] discussed it as a council. So the rule
violation was by you
[3:25:08] » again. How does that relate to us
speaking about the large for MML today
[3:25:14] that are due in June? Absolutely
nothing. You just want to take a jab at
[3:25:17] me. So I want to make sure that
something is clear. I operated in the
[3:25:22] same way we have operated for the last
nine years. Okay. If there was a change
[3:25:27] the council needed to do, fine. That's
okay. But I think that there's a
[3:25:31] disconnect on how we have previously
operated to what it is. I did not went
[3:25:35] out of my way. Okay. There has been
resolutions and values and stuff like
[3:25:39] that the city has upheld for years
including stuff that this council has
[3:25:44] voted on. So I want to make sure that as
we put statements as such, we bring it
[3:25:50] back to the point of this. The next step
for item number 11 is for us to think
[3:25:56] about whether or not we want to submit a
legislative priority or not to MML
[3:26:03] because according to their rules, the
new deadline is speak about it voted by
[3:26:09] June. So this is not a rule that I put
together. This is the new deadline that
[3:26:15] they set up this year for us to do. So,
I'm trying. All I did was like bring it
[3:26:20] to the table and nothing else. I'm
haven't I haven't There's nothing else
[3:26:25] to discuss. If there's nothing else you
guys want to do with it, go ahead,
[3:26:29] Joseph.
>> Um, mayor, I believe we're still on
[3:26:31] agenda item 10. Not we haven't moved on
to agenda item 11 to discuss the MML.
[3:26:37] Um, though I also noticed there's no
document to discuss in regards to that.
[3:26:41] But um I did want to point out that we
did vote on the council rules um when we
[3:26:47] all took our oaths on in May and they
have been in place since July 5th of or
[3:26:53] June 5th of 2018 and they do
specifically say the mayor and council
[3:26:58] shall members shall not affirm to
represent the voices of their
[3:27:01] constituents on issues outside of the
city's jurisdiction eg county, state or
[3:27:06] federal issues except in the case of
approval by the majority of the council.
[3:27:11] The council did not vote on HB 1317. The
council did not vote on HB486.
[3:27:18] Council B did not work vote on HB178
this session. We did not vote on
[3:27:25] » SB36. We did not vote on HB923. We did
not vote on SB526. We not voted on HB
[3:27:33] 35.
>> You up for a minute because it's two
[3:27:35] different discussions. This is
discussing the document that Danielle
[3:27:39] brought up
>> and that is why we need to have a clear
[3:27:42] document.
>> Nobody's saying we don't need to. I
[3:27:44] heard council member Valerie Wood saying
like they will support a document as
[3:27:48] such. I said the same thing.
>> The only thing nobody else has said we
[3:27:52] don't need it. We specifically said if
this is like what will work for this
[3:27:56] council, we could adjust it to make it
work. So to me, that's the reason why
[3:28:00] I'm a little bit concerned that this
conversation has gone way on the other
[3:28:04] side to attacking me when everybody has
said like we could do a version of that
[3:28:09] document if that will facilitate it,
post it in whatever else is. So there's
[3:28:13] no so for it to go beyond that. That's
the reason why I want to make sure it's
[3:28:17] clear unless Valerie am I misreading
what you said about like creating a
[3:28:21] document such as is another point you
also made.
[3:28:26] Valerie.
>> Yes. I think if we want to have a more
[3:28:30] um structured document, we certainly
could.
[3:28:33] » That's we're all in agreement on it. So,
I don't know how it went from I done X,
[3:28:36] Y, and Z. So, I want to make sure that
we stay focused.
[3:28:40] The issue that was that and when I
mentioned number 11 was because
[3:28:45] councelor Carter said we are not talking
about Anapapolis legislative priorities
[3:28:49] and I said like the MML version at
number 11 does addresses but you know
[3:28:54] what we would like MML to potentially
consider advocating. So there is that
[3:28:59] aspect in number 11. So I just wanted to
clarify. That's it.
[3:29:02] » If I can Oh
Daniel go ahead.
[3:29:05] » Actually no I need to speak. You are
accusing me of attacking you. I'm not
[3:29:09] attacking you. I'm correcting the record
because you are making misstatements.
[3:29:12] That's not an attack. If you make a
misstatement, mayor, I have a right to
[3:29:17] correct it for the record. And your
attitude towards me, frankly, is
[3:29:21] disrespectful and it's not warranted.
>> Please don't don't after you call me a
[3:29:27] in a public.
>> Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh my god. I
[3:29:31] suggest
>> do not say anything to me anymore. You
[3:29:35] could leave, but you want to call me on
it. That's what you did at a public
[3:29:39] event and I walked away from you. Go
ahead.
[3:29:44] » Daniel, you have the mic.
>> I make the motion for recess.
[3:29:48] » I second.
>> Okay.
[3:29:50] » You need to give how much time? Um,
>> 10 minutes. 10 minutes.
[3:29:54] » All right. Thank you. We'll come back at
10:35.
[3:38:39] I get
[3:39:13] I make a motion to bring us back.
>> I second
[3:39:19] to motion to bring us back. We have to
get on camera.
[3:39:24] » Oh, we have 44 seconds.
>> You see what I'm saying?
[3:39:40] Second. Any discussion,
objections, abstensions? He hearing
[3:39:44] none. We are back at 12 10:35
p.m. Thank you. Uh Danielle, you you
[3:39:51] want to make a statement?
>> Yeah, I just want to make one um one
[3:39:53] final comment about this this suggestion
and I'm glad that everybody is is seeing
[3:39:59] the importance and the value on this.
Once we get this started, it will be
[3:40:04] easier to moving forward because there
will be items on there that roll over
[3:40:07] from year to year and we can add them as
we need to. We won't need to do this
[3:40:12] every year in June. So, I think once we
get this established, it will just be a
[3:40:16] rolling and then your the the city
priorities that you're talking about and
[3:40:21] the logs you're talking about with MML
would be a completely different topic.
[3:40:26] So we would have the legislative
priorities of the city of the mayor and
[3:40:30] council and then we would have our
separate with MML.
[3:40:34] » I would say that I would still like them
in the document so there's one place
[3:40:37] where everything's at even if it's for
us to say like this is the
[3:40:40] recommendation we made for MML for the
large so that way anything legislative
[3:40:44] or priorities in one document because
that's the purpose of being on it. And
[3:40:48] the other thing is like every year we
have to go to this exercise. Okay. I
[3:40:52] think that's sometimes I want you guys
like I said just have a little and I'll
[3:40:55] say this I wish there was more patience
mainly because we've been doing this the
[3:41:00] same way for the nine years this is the
first year I think you guys have adjust
[3:41:03] and be like hey we need something else
something else will spread up and if
[3:41:06] this what works for this two years then
we'll work on it because next next year
[3:41:12] we have elections and they might feel
like differently you know so I would say
[3:41:16] this is going to be something that we
have to review every year most likely
[3:41:20] more than once because as the
legislation season starts, we might have
[3:41:24] to have a conversation about it as well.
Okay. But I want to say thank you for
[3:41:27] bringing it up and um if we go have a
document or place to have everything
[3:41:31] together that works. Okay. Anything else
on this Valerie Joseph? No. Shamali.
[3:41:38] » Okay. Moving on to item number 11.
Presentation discussion legislative
[3:41:45] priorities. Mayor Council discuss
legislative priorities for the city, the
[3:41:48] Maryland Municipal League. um MML and
the state. Um so as I was pointing uh in
[3:41:56] the previous uh item, MML's has created
a new process in which the laws have to
[3:42:03] be voted by the council before the June
deadline. Okay. The the paper that we
[3:42:10] are receiving is basically here's a form
like they do a lot of forms. The
[3:42:13] discussion is basically does the city
has a recommendation behalf of mayor
[3:42:17] constant obviously Mr. Kamali right when
it comes to legislative priorities they
[3:42:22] want us they would we would like to
pitch to MML and the way it process is
[3:42:28] like the legislative team receives the
various they call large things the
[3:42:32] various large they evaluate them to
figure out like is this state is this
[3:42:36] apply just to one or two people does it
applies to county and usually if it
[3:42:40] applies just to a county or one
municipality they remove them right and
[3:42:44] if it applies to the state is it
something that could be done and what it
[3:42:47] looks like and the percentage and is
there a capability to do it based on
[3:42:51] what the members feedback? Um, hold on.
Let me just
[3:42:54] » for clarification, is there a document
we should be looking at for this?
[3:42:58] » It's an application. That's what they
sent. So, I'm describing the process of
[3:43:01] it. Right. So, the the vice there is a
committee that's called the legislative
[3:43:07] committee for MML, right? People
volunteer. I know Danielle is in the
[3:43:12] conference committee. I'm in the
outreach committee. People volunteer for
[3:43:15] legis committee. Basically, the
president of MML appoints the different
[3:43:20] people to the committee. They meet I
think weekly in order to review the
[3:43:25] various case. So once the LAR is
submitted right we have to vote on and
[3:43:30] say here's the resolution and it's
obviously signed by all of us saying
[3:43:34] this is what the body has voted on right
and this is what we would like to submit
[3:43:40] to you. it is up to you know the
administr the legislative team for MML
[3:43:46] and the legislative committee to be able
to um to say like yes we'll take upon
[3:43:51] this or no and mind you they get like
you know 80 or 20 or 60 they cannot do
[3:43:58] all of them last year the decision was
made that instead of having a list of
[3:44:02] like five of them they just had one and
the the main one was when it came to um
[3:44:08] that it actually passed uh being able to
create a task force to review the
[3:44:13] municipal
um and county uh tax money that comes to
[3:44:18] us because we feel as municipalities
that we always would like more money
[3:44:23] directly to us and this is something
that is not just Selena saying it but it
[3:44:27] worked for CO it worked for the
infrastructure bill you know that we if
[3:44:31] we receive the money directly in our
fair share of what we think is like
[3:44:35] taxes based that should be sent to us um
MML has done various um events and
[3:44:40] information and pamphlets that they have
sent to us, right? And it so there
[3:44:45] there's a couple things. So one of them
is the three priorities we would like to
[3:44:52] bring to table so that way when it comes
internally and two if we want to submit
[3:44:58] a large to MML that's a different we
need to discuss it today so that we
[3:45:04] could vote on it in the June work
session. If the answer for you guys is
[3:45:09] like you know what this year we're not
ready for we don't want it good we don't
[3:45:13] submit anything but I want to make sure
that the document that we're working on
[3:45:16] creating like states that on this
meeting discussion happen it was decided
[3:45:20] by the council that we would not be
submitting large on it so that way we
[3:45:23] don't not have an issue that a year from
now we'll be like wait a minute you know
[3:45:28] we interpret that conversation
differently so I will start with step
[3:45:33] number one when it comes to the three
priorities that each of us um you should
[3:45:39] bring to the table to figure out like if
there's anything that matches because
[3:45:45] what we realized nine years ago is like
we all have great ideas but if we come
[3:45:49] out and tell the staff here's 40 of them
the staff is looking at us like okay
[3:45:53] that's your priority that's your
priority your priority but if we could
[3:45:56] like figure out like like pot was
forever on it we realized that it was in
[3:46:01] the top priority for most of us so the
staff went okay let's make that into a a
[3:46:06] priority right to move forward and
that's where like you know um anything
[3:46:10] that had with zoning with like buildings
anything had to do with financing in
[3:46:14] order to bring money and grants and
direct funding everything was like how
[3:46:19] are we able to finance and be able to
make this building that we're that we
[3:46:23] are in happen so I would like to split
the two categories if we could
[3:46:29] potentially do that one of them is the
three priorities from um from mayor
[3:46:34] council when it comes to the city,
right? Like I said in the past has been
[3:46:38] possible it's been like you know um you
know a bunch of them, right? You guys
[3:46:43] already went through one year and figure
out um does this fit into
[3:46:49] into what we would like the staff to do.
The staff also has a summary to figure
[3:46:53] out like this is what works, this is
what doesn't. And they could come back
[3:46:56] to us and be like there might be
potential but also the lobbyist goes out
[3:47:00] there and be like hey this is the myian
priorities. Is there any bills? Are you
[3:47:06] thinking of something that could
potentially support what we're looking
[3:47:09] for um for Morinia? Right. So, that is
where it potentially helps. All right.
[3:47:16] So, um I'm going to go around the room
and if you guys have your three
[3:47:21] priorities or it could be three or less.
You don't have to have three. If you
[3:47:25] have two, you have two, right? Um
Valerie, if you could help me just type
[3:47:29] them and if you could share with the
with everybody at the at the end,
[3:47:32] especially Mr. Kamali so that way they
know like what it is. It definitely will
[3:47:36] help. So Joseph, do you have your three
priorities uh for the city? Not lock
[3:47:40] related, just city- wise. What would you
like to see for the next year?
[3:47:44] » It was very unclear that this that we
would be discussing the L as part of
[3:47:49] this. So there was no preparation that
could be done in order to accomplish
[3:47:53] this task.
>> I'm asking for the priorities for the
[3:47:57] city, not the large. I said I was going
to separate them.
[3:48:04] about the applications?
>> No, the application just asks you what
[3:48:08] it is, why do you need it, when was it
voted, has it ever been discussed?
[3:48:12] » It was also unclear from the the lack of
document with item 11 that we were
[3:48:17] supposed to prepare our own legislative
priorities.
[3:48:21] » It's not
>> which was a presentation that was
[3:48:23] supposed to be given to us. So
>> I like I said, we're not talking about
[3:48:27] legislative priorities right now. We're
talking about city the three city
[3:48:30] priorities non-legislative.
[3:48:34] » I think we should postpone this until a
further meeting.
[3:48:43] » Okay, Danielle, do you have yours?
>> Um, I'll be honest. I was kind of hoping
[3:48:49] we would
be doing it differently. Um,
[3:48:56] I would like to make a comment though
about this. Um, when it comes to what
[3:49:01] you were talking about the MML. Yeah, I
know what the MML does. um some the
[3:49:05] newer council members they may I don't
know but um like you said the
[3:49:10] legislative
group for the uh the legislative
[3:49:14] committee for the MML they get together
with all of our suggestions and then
[3:49:18] they whittle it down to what they
believe are the more
[3:49:22] comprehensive ones that you know the
more popular to focus on and so what if
[3:49:27] our legislative priorities that we
submit to them don't make it off the cut
[3:49:31] they end up on the cutting room floor.
So, I need to I I I would like to know
[3:49:37] more about, you know, that in the
process and how we can uh because I just
[3:49:42] I don't know. I I just I I have I have
questions about that. So, I'm not going
[3:49:46] to address the Lars thing tonight. I I I
agree with Council Member Jacuda on
[3:49:50] that. However, um as far as priorities
for the city, which have absolutely
[3:49:55] nothing to do with the general assembly,
have nothing to do with our legislative
[3:49:59] priorities, the the secretar's roundt,
any of that. um economic development
[3:50:05] one, two and three.
>> Can can I so two things you as a
[3:50:10] question I'll give you an answer.
>> Yeah. If it's not selected it's not
[3:50:13] selected
>> right which which which denies us.
[3:50:16] » This is no this is what we have around
lobbyist. We've always ask our lobbyists
[3:50:20] to go pitch the ideas to somebody else
but they cannot have 161 priorities.
[3:50:24] » Correct. So so to me this is a this this
is this is a time killer. you know,
[3:50:31] instead, I mean, we we pay for our own
lobbyists. Let's give our our lobbyists
[3:50:35] our marching orders that are going to
protect us. I mean, if if we want to go,
[3:50:39] hey, you know, here's some things, but
let's keep it focused on what we want to
[3:50:42] do as a as mayor and council. Um, and
then, you know, fill out the
[3:50:46] application, you know, whatever. But as
far as city um is concerned, economic
[3:50:52] development across the board.
>> And I'll tell you why that doesn't
[3:50:56] » those are mine. Economic development
times three. Why is it that that doesn't
[3:51:00] dissociate it from it? Because when we
talk to a round table people, Mr. Kamali
[3:51:04] is talking to the agency, he would tell
them economic development vulnerable
[3:51:08] priority for my council. Do you guys
have grants? Do you have legislation
[3:51:12] you're supporting? What does it looks
like? Everything ties up with realized
[3:51:15] it or not because Mr. Kamali's job if
that's economic because like number one
[3:51:20] is to go out there to fight to make sure
it
[3:51:24] » mayor I I appreciate but I don't need my
my comments editorialized. I do
[3:51:29] appreciate it. It's late. We're all
tense but you asked for my priorities
[3:51:33] when it comes to the city for this
coming year and its economic development
[3:51:37] across the board. It does not need to be
explained by anybody else editorialized.
[3:51:41] That's those are my priorities for the
city. Thank you. Just to clar just to
[3:51:45] clarify
>> I don't need my comments clarified
[3:51:48] mayor. I don't
>> I'm speaking Danielle. Thank you so
[3:51:50] much. You asked a question that said
what happens to the Lars if they're not
[3:51:55] selected and I gave you
>> so I was trying to make sure that that
[3:52:01] was answered. Okay. And that was it. Um,
and I wanted to clarify that this is the
[3:52:07] reason why our internal priorities also
means that when we talk to our team,
[3:52:11] their marching orders are are done. They
go look at every single option there is
[3:52:16] that could potentially fulfill that
priority for us. Okay. So, um, Valerie,
[3:52:23] » um, thank you. And I just, um, I just
sent around to the council um the the
[3:52:28] link to the L form just so they could
see it. It looks like we have to No.
[3:52:32] Well, I just Googled it cuz I I also did
not know I did not see the L thing come
[3:52:37] through before we had this meeting and
it wasn't the document wasn't attached
[3:52:41] to the package. So, um that's I I
understand the confusion there, but um
[3:52:46] I'm looking at it now. It looks like the
L form is due on May 31st and then
[3:52:50] approval
um that approval has to be sent in from
[3:52:55] council on July 1st so that they can
work on it. So, that's the timeline that
[3:52:59] we're working on here. Just to clarify
that. Um and then um in terms of overall
[3:53:05] city priorities for me it would be
transportation continued implementation
[3:53:09] of current safe streets for all um
funding um and new funding for future
[3:53:14] projects. I think that's critical to
keep matching funds if we can to keep
[3:53:18] building better streets, sidewalks and
and places for people to walk, bike and
[3:53:22] and roll. Um I think two for me is
strategic plan. We need to have a
[3:53:27] strategic plan to work from so that the
city has that marching order that's
[3:53:31] baked into what we're already working
on. Whether or not we have new
[3:53:34] priorities in the future, it's good to
have a a document to check boxes off of.
[3:53:38] So, I think getting that done would be
really great. And then I agree with
[3:53:42] Danielle, economic development is my
number three um top priority. Um and I
[3:53:47] have a bunch of little ones inside
there. I still want to get the home
[3:53:49] repair program back up and running, but
we'll see um if that can be done. But
[3:53:53] those are my top three. Perfect. Just do
you have any or I just want to make sure
[3:53:58] to give you a chance in case you have
anything to add.
[3:54:00] » Again, we were not provided a document
for this agenda item to make clear what
[3:54:04] it was or was not we would be
discussing. We really need to have a
[3:54:08] document in the packet as was requested
at previous meetings so that we know
[3:54:12] what it was we were talking about so we
know what so we can be prepared. I read
[3:54:16] through every single document in the
packet. No information was provided that
[3:54:21] we would be discussing three action
items and we should bring them. There
[3:54:24] was no document.
>> Thank you so much. So I'll give you my
[3:54:28] three. All right. Um I think the
strategic plan to me is like number one
[3:54:34] because it will be able to link it at
least to this financial document but
[3:54:39] also when our staff is doing something
they know where to go to to figure out
[3:54:46] um what it will fulfill. Right. Um in
this case like you know if um let's say
[3:54:53] any of the committees right when we have
the round table right are able to say um
[3:54:58] hey like you know what do what is going
on and then that way when we're able to
[3:55:02] have meetings we could say like this is
based on this plan and the signals like
[3:55:06] this is what we're aiming at for the
next five to 10 years and how does the
[3:55:10] committees how whatever else it's um can
you guys please get off the phone? No,
[3:55:14] mine went off and I think my husband was
texting me. That's all. I was trying to
[3:55:18] turn it down.
>> Okay. So, I you know, so that's like
[3:55:24] number one. Um for me, the safe streets
for all grant that's a big commitment
[3:55:29] that we have made. So, we fall under
transportation if you want to utilize
[3:55:33] the the language, right? Because we have
a four more year commitment that the the
[3:55:38] reality is like that's going to take
>> Yeah. Because this is the first year
[3:55:42] sorry the rice was born more. Yeah
>> it was five years but they count from
[3:55:50] 24.
>> Okay. Thank you Mr. Kamali. So your mic
[3:55:57] your mic was off.
>> Oh I'm sorry. It's a five years grant
[3:56:02] and from 24 to 29. Sorry.
>> Thank you so much Mr. Kamali. But that's
[3:56:07] a big commitment that we have gotten
oursel into to make sure the budget
[3:56:11] reflects the 20% to make sure like the
double audits are being done to make
[3:56:16] sure it's a report like that that 9.7 um
million dollars comes with a lot of work
[3:56:24] attached to it. So I think that that's
definitely um we need to follow through.
[3:56:28] If not, um, we tend to will be able to
lose that money and obviously economic
[3:56:33] development like falls. Um,
actually I cannot fall like under any of
[3:56:38] them to be honest with you. But um, at
least that's more or less where I feel
[3:56:44] the city uh needs to potentially focus
for the next um for the next year and
[3:56:50] everything that falls under those
umbrellas. Right. I I I
[3:56:56] fully Thank you. Um can I have a motion
for 10 minutes on the clock, please?
[3:57:06] Okay. If you guys are done with this
discussion where we have a list of at
[3:57:09] least three of us that have submitted,
Mr. Kamali, um I'm asking for this to be
[3:57:14] added to the next agenda. All right? So,
the conversation continues. And if
[3:57:18] there's something that um you think that
the city also needs, please let us know.
[3:57:23] So that way uh we hear also from from
your team. Okay. I think that um I'll
[3:57:30] move on to the next item. I think that
at least for me the next steps is
[3:57:33] continue the conversation because if we
want to fill a paper up on it and if we
[3:57:39] could submit if we could turn an alert,
great. If not, no. But this is like step
[3:57:44] one to be able to introduce you guys
what they are. All right. and I already
[3:57:48] got the email. Apparently, there was
miscommunication on on it. Um, but I
[3:57:54] apologize for that.
All right, moving on to the next item.
[3:57:59] And Mr. Kamali, nobody from 3200 block
is coming, right?
[3:58:04] Nobody I doubt. I mean, it's 11 o'clock
at night.
[3:58:10] » Thank you so much, Mr. Kamali.
[3:58:14] » Okay. Presentation and discuss. Oh,
sorry. Presentation, discussion, and
[3:58:18] business round table. Councelor Virginia
Huffar will present a proposal for a
[3:58:21] business round table.
>> Mayor, if I may make a motion.
[3:58:25] » Go ahead.
>> Um, I'd like to table the rest of the
[3:58:28] business meeting. Um, since council
member Hoffower has the next two agenda
[3:58:34] items, she is not here to give them. And
I am stepping out of bounds, but I am
[3:58:39] assuming council member Jakuda is fine
with postponing his since um the LMUTC
[3:58:44] person isn't here.
>> No, the the LMUTC person will be coming
[3:58:49] at the legislative meeting. So we and we
do need to get someone appointed to
[3:58:53] that.
>> Okay. Um then um I would ask that we
[3:58:56] table the next two items until the next
business meeting, please.
[3:59:01] So, I think that for the future I
honestly I thought the hybrid option was
[3:59:05] yours, Joseph. I didn't think it was.
>> I did not request that to be put on
[3:59:09] here. I know I brought it up at some
point, but it just showed up.
[3:59:14] » Okay. So, can we And you guys or not?
Can we figure out who puts it in because
[3:59:19] I assume it was um it was you.
>> I I asked for the LM UTC and the tree
[3:59:25] commission.
So, can we go ahead and skip 12, 13,
[3:59:31] 14, and move to 15? Will that can Can we
agree on that? So, is that to see one?
[3:59:36] » Do we have to do 14 tonight anyways
because we won't be able to vote on it
[3:59:41] prior to September. Otherwise,
>> I mean, we could talk about it
[3:59:47] » because we would need to vote on it at
our June meeting.
[3:59:51] » Yes. In order to have it by September.
So
[3:59:54] » I I withdraw my motion.
[3:59:59] Okay. So we um
[4:00:04] so for number the hybrid option can we
move Joseph can you like make sure it's
[4:00:10] on the agenda? I know Mr. Kamal said
that we don't have it's not within our
[4:00:14] site right now that needs to be
discussed. We have time. So but can you
[4:00:17] put it in your internal agenda Joseph so
that way you remember to bring it up if
[4:00:21] need be? I I will put it on the next
meeting where we do not have a 4-hour
[4:00:26] long meeting. You
>> mean work session?
[4:00:29] » Work session? Yes.
>> Which is June the 9th?
[4:00:32] » Yes. Unless June the 9th also turns out
to be a 4-hour long meeting.
[4:00:36] » Well, it's going to be up to you guys
because you guys have like three or four
[4:00:39] different items on here.
>> Okay.
[4:00:42] » Well, we didn't raise it. Okay. So, um
so number 13 has been sold. Uh number 14
[4:00:50] we have never put in position. you know
that there's no present. Is there
[4:00:53] anything on the dock? Is there anything
on the package? I apologize this late. I
[4:00:57] can't remember right now.
>> Oh, what number?
[4:01:01] » Is there anything in the package?
>> Yes, there is. Um I'm familiar with this
[4:01:06] so I can give a brief.
>> So, can you put it like um
[4:01:09] » Yeah, that's it right there.
>> So,
[4:01:12] » Oh, yeah.
>> Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Kamal.
[4:01:15] » I'm familiar with this. Um I hope
council member Hoffower is not upset
[4:01:19] that I speak on this. Um I may I
attempted this a long time ago as well.
[4:01:23] Um to start the um legislative session
with a work session instead of
[4:01:29] legislation session just makes good
common sense. um a lot of things um are
[4:01:35] build that we work on over the summer
and we want to bring it back to talk
[4:01:40] about it and introduce it for
consideration rather than coming back
[4:01:44] and voting on something that we may I
mean it would be a very small meeting
[4:01:48] unless it's just like like we did this
past year with a vice mayor rotation and
[4:01:53] things like that. Um, and ending the
legislative season with a legislative
[4:01:59] session makes sense because it ties up
every all the work we've done all year
[4:02:02] instead of leaving hanging threads. Um,
at least that was my argument when I
[4:02:07] made the um suggestion. Um, I don't know
what council member Hoffower had um
[4:02:13] planned to um present, but um I I do
support this. So I I hope that we can
[4:02:21] keep this in the discussion for tonight.
>> So authority before we continue talking,
[4:02:26] are you talking about switches the first
one or switching every single one of
[4:02:29] them?
>> Switching all of them. You you want to
[4:02:31] start with and and if I can if I can
remind um council member Woodall and the
[4:02:36] mayor when I presented this back in I
think it was 23. It was in June of 23.
[4:02:40] Um, I had called all 26 other
municipalities just here in Prince
[4:02:45] George's County and the lion share and I
mean it was like 23 of them start with
[4:02:51] work sessions or do work session before
legislation. So this just it's just
[4:02:56] common sense and it and a couple of
those municipalities actually had just
[4:03:00] recently switched from doing legislative
first to uh work and so anyway it it
[4:03:06] it's just logical. Um, and the majority
of the of the municipalities here in
[4:03:11] Prince George's County follow the same
thing, and I would venture to say most
[4:03:14] people do, too. So, anyway,
>> Joseph,
[4:03:18] » I I'm supportive of this schedule
generally. I think it's a a much wiser
[4:03:25] use of all of our time. Um, since, uh,
you know, whatever we're talking on June
[4:03:30] 9th, if there's anything we need to vote
on, it's going to have to wait till
[4:03:32] September. And that I think that's kind
of silly. Um, I did have three specific
[4:03:39] comments. Um, I did want to see the
instead of this called a council
[4:03:43] meeting, I think it should say a regular
council meeting because there are also
[4:03:48] special council meetings. And so I just
wanted that clarification.
[4:03:53] I think that we should not have a
meeting on November the 3. I think that
[4:03:57] should be rescheduled. I I will defer to
y'all which way you want to move it, but
[4:04:03] I definitely don't think we should have
one on election day. And then also, I
[4:04:07] was hoping we could also star the
meetings that are preceded by a holiday
[4:04:13] such as on January 19th, which is
preceded by January the 18th, um which
[4:04:19] is Martin Luther King Jr. Day. So that
way we would just be cognizant of when
[4:04:24] we're going to have uh crunches with the
agenda so we know to be a little bit
[4:04:28] more prepared for those meetings.
[4:04:36] » Um I'm not opposed to this. Um I do
think we need to scrub the dates because
[4:04:40] I can see a number of them that might
not work based on just general calendar
[4:04:44] things. So I think before we begin to
vote on this, I think we need to really
[4:04:48] scrub the dates. Um,
yeah, that's my comment. Thank you.
[4:04:53] » Yeah, the holidays. That's the same
thing I noticed. It's like November 13,
[4:04:57] the big one, but there's spring break
that we need to account into that before
[4:05:01] we run into it. Um, holidays, uh, I will
tell you that
[4:05:07] if I recall correctly, and the reason
why I was arguing that was because it's
[4:05:10] the first meeting and you kick off with
like, hey, welcome back. Here it is. is
[4:05:15] light friendly and it's not stuff you
have to get ready a whole entire like
[4:05:21] gigantic like work session meeting to
move forward. So the first meeting was
[4:05:25] taken more as of um a light thing if we
had it like anything that we needed to
[4:05:30] vote on uh that either got u the staff
was working during the summer or there
[4:05:37] was an emergency situation and it got us
to vote. I I don't know if I
[4:05:42] particularly would like to be having a
wedding maybe on the second third week
[4:05:48] the third week right before uh right
during the holiday season as an example
[4:05:53] right the holiday season like not just
Christmas but several of them and I
[4:05:58] think that also allow for the work
session to be very light that's one
[4:06:03] example you also have like the work
session on the 5th that's like shortly
[4:06:08] after he a couple New Year days, not
just one religion, but multiple ones,
[4:06:13] right? That the staff prepares
differently. I feel like for work
[4:06:17] sessions that they do um for um
legislative meetings. I think that for
[4:06:24] me in the past when we came in to vote
um the meetings were very short.
[4:06:31] Correct. Um Mr. Kamali,
>> I'm sorry. the legislative meetings were
[4:06:35] very short because everybody had work
either on several work sessions on the
[4:06:41] documents. So that way you came in and
they were like maybe sometimes like an
[4:06:45] hour um an hour and a half and you were
done with, right? Um it's no longer the
[4:06:51] case. Um the reality is like we've been
having a lot of items added into the
[4:06:56] legislative meeting that have not been
resolved in work session that have moved
[4:07:02] for a legislative news to be a lot
longer. So I will tell you this I've
[4:07:07] never had a 4 and a half hour 5 hour
meeting since nine or 10 years ago and
[4:07:14] that was a budget meeting. So I would
say that at least for me we definitely
[4:07:19] need to review those dates because the
scholarship committee days will have to
[4:07:23] be switched. Um any days where we have
to uh vote on items including the
[4:07:28] audits, including the budget, including
the elections
[4:07:32] definitely um have to be switched and
looked at. If you notice, we have a
[4:07:38] workstation on the four. Usually, we try
to vote on the budget before the next uh
[4:07:43] council is selected. So, that is
something that we need to look into
[4:07:49] because if not, uh potentially two weeks
into one week technically after being
[4:07:56] sworn in, you will have to vote on the
on the budget. So, there's a lot of
[4:08:01] other one. I mean, I'm happy with having
a legislative meeting at the beginning.
[4:08:04] And if the need happens to be that we
need to have a work session, it could be
[4:08:08] followed by a work session the same day.
That's fine. But I think tying us to
[4:08:12] come in and do like a work session
is definitely um is definitely a lot.
[4:08:18] And I definitely would like for you guys
to reconsider what it means for the for
[4:08:23] the staff and and and for us. And we
definitely will have to work not just
[4:08:28] these days for the meetings. Yeah, I
like it to be legislative meeting
[4:08:32] instead of council meeting. So people
know it's a voting meeting. But uh when
[4:08:36] it comes to the other markers um the
budget meetings, the audit like reports
[4:08:41] um uh the scholarship dates, anything
that we have to vote, we will have to
[4:08:46] look into um because the scholarship
schedule is tied up to whatever that is.
[4:08:53] » Yeah. Go ahead.
>> I'm just asking if we can do another
[4:08:55] round.
>> Okay. Okay. I mean it's a work session,
[4:08:58] so but anyway. um you gave a lot of um
you know you pointed out a lot of
[4:09:03] things. However, I would point out that
we have meetings all the time before
[4:09:08] holidays. I mean this is a Tuesday
before the uh Memorial Day week, you
[4:09:12] know, um weekend. Well, I mean this
happens all the time, you know. I mean,
[4:09:16] work session, council meeting or
legislative meeting, it six one way,
[4:09:20] half dozen the other. I I would think
that the staff is working harder to get
[4:09:24] legislation set up um for us to work on
legislative meetings. I don't know. I'm
[4:09:29] not city staff, but I think they work
their bottoms off. No matter what
[4:09:33] meeting we're having, whether it's a
work session or legislative, I don't
[4:09:36] think one's heavier than the other. I
mean, it's a heavy ask. I mean, our
[4:09:40] staff is here. We're here at almost
11:00 at night and they're still here.
[4:09:43] So, I mean, I think honestly, I think
we're literally playing with sematics
[4:09:48] here. Um, it's just what is more
logical. I think that the dates we can I
[4:09:53] mean, we we do this every year in June.
We we we settle our calendar, you know.
[4:09:57] We we can adjust. I mean, we always like
I pointed out, you know, I looked over
[4:10:01] to you and said November 3rd, it's
election day. Of course, we're going to
[4:10:05] move that. We always do every year. So,
I mean, there are things that we can
[4:10:09] make adjustments on. Working on what
days we actually meet is one thing. What
[4:10:15] kind of meeting we have is a completely
different thing. I think the question
[4:10:20] here is whatever the fiscal calendar is
that we end up agreeing on in June, we
[4:10:25] should start with a work session at the
beginning of the legislative session.
[4:10:29] And mayor, I I like your recommendation
of doing a combination meeting. I have
[4:10:33] no problem with that. We can do
legislative and work session on the same
[4:10:36] meeting if city staff is fine with that.
But I think we need to start with a work
[4:10:41] session and end with a legislative
session because I know I don't know
[4:10:44] about I don't know I can't speak for
council members um uh Jakuda Hoffower or
[4:10:50] Woodall or speak and I won't speak for
you but I may have things ready to go
[4:10:54] that I want to bring up in the work
session in September I've been working
[4:10:57] on all summer. So I I just say I I I
think this is logical and I urge you
[4:11:03] guys to reconsider. Danielle, the very
first regarding the holiday was is the
[4:11:08] council Juda mentioned that if we could
be cautious of not um and I know that's
[4:11:14] been hard for me too because you're like
having a holiday like a meeting. So that
[4:11:18] was in reference to the statement that
you made about being cautious with the
[4:11:22] calendar of not having a meeting the
next
[4:11:24] » I think
[4:11:30] now please. Um so yeah so that that is
um
[4:11:34] » for next 24 hours
>> for I'm not gonna be here that long for
[4:11:38] guys. So that that is the that was what
was in reference to. So it wasn't an
[4:11:42] obstacle. It was more like this is going
to require a lot of it. But if you guys
[4:11:46] are open to doing a legislative meeting
followed by potentially a work session
[4:11:50] if needed be that could be a good
compromise. So that way if we don't need
[4:11:54] a work session we're not tied up to
work. that was just said but a lot of
[4:11:59] them we need to the good thing about
early in the month it's like the stuff
[4:12:03] has like 30 like the whole month to be
able to deal with it right but I would
[4:12:07] say if the argument is like you guys
would like to is that that's the reason
[4:12:11] why I as kick off you would like to do a
work session we could do a legislative
[4:12:16] session that way we could vote on
whatever we like we might have like
[4:12:20] strategy things that we need
>> and then follow but followed by a work
[4:12:24] session if needed because we might be
like we nothing, you know, here here it
[4:12:29] is. But that way at least gives us the a
chance to a chance to like adjust it
[4:12:35] because I'll tell you this trying to
vote on those like snowy days like later
[4:12:42] on the month. So don't make it work for
us. But anyway, so if that's an
[4:12:46] agreement, if this is something that we
could potentially agree that we could do
[4:12:50] a legislative to kick off just to do the
formalities, right, and vote whatever we
[4:12:54] need to vote followed by a work session
the same day if needed, then we could
[4:12:58] decide like it's needed or not. And if
we decide like it's not needed because
[4:13:02] after two weeks of break, Heidi Colin
would decide to like, you know, it's not
[4:13:07] what we need, then we could then we
could deal with that. And then that way
[4:13:10] at least will keep the schedule more or
less consistent because what I'm worried
[4:13:15] about is like for elections that the new
council is going to have to vote on that
[4:13:18] budget a week after they got
>> pointing clarity.
[4:13:21] » So yeah,
>> pointing clarity. Are you saying you're
[4:13:24] okay with the flipping of the meetings
except that you're requesting that we
[4:13:29] start in September with legislative and
work session if we need it?
[4:13:33] » What I said is like because that's the
reason I was asking the question. and
[4:13:36] said is the will of the body to have a
you know to start with a work session at
[4:13:42] that first September meeting. If that's
the case we have legislative prior and a
[4:13:48] work session following and then the rest
of the schedule the next will be a work
[4:13:50] session legislative work session. So
basically we'll have the first day two
[4:13:54] potential meetings to meet change. you
have two meetings on one day later they
[4:13:59] will change
>> and they do on it but be conscious that
[4:14:03] you're also going to be asking the new
council to vote on a budget name
[4:14:09] » so I just want to make sure that some of
the days a little more complicated with
[4:14:12] that Joseph
>> thank you mayor um I mostly I I mostly
[4:14:17] fine with what you just said I just also
think that the June 15th meeting should
[4:14:22] also be a double one where we could have
a council meeting and a work session cuz
[4:14:27] I don't think the work session's all
that useful. And I do think that ending
[4:14:31] on a council meeting is important. But
if we want to do that just for those the
[4:14:35] first and the last the book ends, I'm
fine with that because I think that
[4:14:39] still solves the main problem we're
getting at. Um and then as far as I said
[4:14:43] about the holidays, I just wanted them
noted just so we know to get our agenda
[4:14:47] items in earlier for those. I don't
think we need to reschedu or anything.
[4:14:52] It was just noting that so we because
we've had problems with that where all
[4:14:57] of a sudden we try and get everything to
Melissa on Friday and folks are gone and
[4:15:02] then we have a problem. So um but yeah,
you know I'm fine with that if we can do
[4:15:07] the June 15th one one of these doubles
to I'm fine with that.
[4:15:11] » I'm fine with it. Like again if it's
needed we feel like okay we could just
[4:15:14] have a voting session and we don't need
a legis a work session then let it be
[4:15:18] you know so that could be a good
compromise.
[4:15:21] Valerie, where are you at? I apologize.
I want to make sure I go around the
[4:15:23] whole room.
>> Yeah, I'm okay with um September 1st
[4:15:27] being a council meeting and then a work
session and then October would be
[4:15:32] October 6th would be a work or whatever
the dates in October would be a work
[4:15:35] session and a council meeting. You know,
April would be a work session, council
[4:15:40] meeting. So, follow the same schedule
and then in June it would be a council
[4:15:44] meeting and work session to end this. I
think it's going to be a legislative
[4:15:48] meeting on the and don't quote me on the
days. It's just supposed to not.
[4:15:52] » So it'll be like the first will be
legislative work session. The 15th will
[4:15:59] be legislative,
>> right?
[4:16:02] » And then it go like the first one will
be like um legislative work session,
[4:16:06] legislative work session. So that way at
the top of the month we get to vote and
[4:16:09] move forward. And just that the bookings
are going to change.
[4:16:13] So what they're proposing is that the
work session would come first every
[4:16:17] month and the voting would be afterward
except for the two book ends. That's
[4:16:20] what I think that is
>> that's what we were originally
[4:16:25] proposing. But yes, what mayor said I I
I it's mostly the September and the June
[4:16:31] meetings that we were concerned about.
So I think that that solution keeping
[4:16:35] our schedule the same as it has been
except the first month and the the first
[4:16:39] meeting and the last meeting that
>> as long as we're aware those are going
[4:16:44] to be two potentially very long
meetings.
[4:16:47] » It's up to us because when you come in
immediately you could say hi how are you
[4:16:51] and here it is. I think that we need to
heavily work on looking at the looking
[4:16:56] at all 10 months right and saying what
am I going to propose this 10 months but
[4:17:00] I think that a certain point we cannot
be having like three items per person it
[4:17:04] is draining all right so we're in
agreement that leave it and the book
[4:17:09] ends have two meetings within reason
well the person shouldn't have if we do
[4:17:14] the if we we vote on everything we need
to go we should be it should be more
[4:17:18] like a welcoming meeting than anything
and a work session if needed And it
[4:17:22] could be a short work. Okay. But okay,
it could be a short work session. You
[4:17:26] don't have to put 20 items on the
agenda,
[4:17:28] » you know, because it's also not doable
because then the staff have to come over
[4:17:31] whatever it is we need to do.
>> Can we when we update this document, can
[4:17:34] we um make sure we really look at all
the dates um uh can staff like look at
[4:17:39] the PGCPS, look at the University of
Maryland, look at
[4:17:42] » you know various elections and things
like that. Thank
[4:17:46] » for going to be a lot. Um okay, perfect.
Thank you guys. U moving on to next item
[4:17:52] number 15 presentation discuss and
appointment members of LMBTC. Castor
[4:17:56] Jakuda will present proposed
appointments to the LTC.
[4:18:00] Uh thank you mayor. Um so uh a little
while back we had appoint we we had
[4:18:06] nominated seven uh residents to
participate in the LMUTC
[4:18:13] and we submitted their names to the
Prince George's planning department and
[4:18:19] through that process it turned out that
one of the members wanted to step down
[4:18:25] uh Miss Brav um so part of the
resolution is to thank her for her
[4:18:30] service. Um she served for three years
uh and has uh had to move on. And it
[4:18:37] took a while, a lot of uh uh
talking to folks um and we did find a
[4:18:45] very capable resident uh Miss Elise
Moore uh to fill the seventh spot. Uh
[4:18:51] she has a background in design. uh she
has a very nice portfolio up on the
[4:18:57] internet and um she was willing to serve
for two years. So we wanted to nominate
[4:19:04] her um in introduced this tonight and
then once this is done we already have
[4:19:10] her resume to go to send over to the
Prince George's planning board as soon
[4:19:14] as we finish our nomination. We can
finally have an LEM UTC up and running
[4:19:18] again
>> and vote on the June meeting. Right.
[4:19:21] » I'm sorry.
>> And vote on the June meeting. Yeah, this
[4:19:24] would be for a vote on the at the June
2nd meeting.
[4:19:28] » All right. So, I'm going to go around
the room. This is this is a straight
[4:19:32] like recommendation for appointment and
thanking
[4:19:35] and thanking
Miss Alina right for your service for
[4:19:41] the last years and appointing
Elise Moore. So, I do Okay. So, we'll go
[4:19:49] around and then I have a request for you
guys because this is hard to figure out.
[4:19:53] Um, so Valerie, go ahead.
>> I have nothing to add. Thank you,
[4:19:58] » Danielle.
>> Nope. Nothing to add.
[4:20:00] » Um, ideally request I'm going to ask and
this is like I've asked about it like
[4:20:04] more than once. Um, and I think we all
agree. Can we make sure we add their
[4:20:08] names through the agenda because you
have to go through the whole entire
[4:20:12] thing is everybody agenda itself. It
just says appointment to LMBTC with no
[4:20:17] name, no nothing.
>> So I know we used to do it. Can we like
[4:20:20] do it so that way also like it's easier
and I'll tell you this. It's easier for
[4:20:24] us because if we have to like go back
and finding information, it's easy for
[4:20:27] us to find an agenda than go through
resolutions and minutes and everything
[4:20:31] else. And the team has done a a better a
lot better job than in the past and
[4:20:37] trying to line up that people are to
yours. So big thank you to um to
[4:20:43] college, Miss um
Miss Elise um um board for like um for
[4:20:52] putting their name there and we look
forward to voting on the June meeting.
[4:20:57] Um, and thank you Joseph for uh seeking
I know for LMTC especially with a
[4:21:01] presentation we have they're going to
take a big role also on making
[4:21:05] recommendations to like the city manager
and and us and they're the group that
[4:21:11] help us keep the historical aspect of
Mount Rineer um and help residents who
[4:21:15] are needed. So it's a lot of design
architecture and everything else. So
[4:21:19] that's my piece. Thank you. All right,
moving on to item number uh 17. And I
[4:21:26] have a motion to adjurnn, please.
>> Presentation.
[4:21:30] » Oh, yeah. I'm so sorry.
>> Here's what happens when this is not
[4:21:33] here. She won't look at me like Okay.
Presentation of minutes is not a voting
[4:21:38] presentation minutes for May 5th. Uh
minutes to Mayor Council. They're there.
[4:21:43] They're in your package.
>> We're good. Review them. They move on to
[4:21:47] the June uh meeting. Yay. Yes.
>> Good. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. I
[4:21:53] » I move to adjourn.
>> Okay. Item number 17, motion to adjourn
[4:21:57] a
>> second.
[4:21:58] » Uh second by Jakuda. Any discussion?
Objection, extensions, hearing none. And
[4:22:03] we have come to an end at 11:17. Jesus
and
[4:22:10] happy pride month coming up.