Just checking audio live stream. Thanks.
Hopefully that's the most exciting thing that happens this evening.
» Mr. Green is not a party until
» I do.
Mr. You're the engineer. The engineer's just
going to sit there. >> He's not going to help.
» You know, I'm in. [laughter]
All All right, enough of the shenanigans here. Everyone, come on.
Welcome everybody to our regular council meeting for July 27th, 2026. Uh to call
the meeting to order. I just want to acknowledge that we gather on the
traditional territories of the coast and straight salish peoples and specifically
we recognize lungan speaking people known today as the sanghes and the
casaps of more squamalt nations and how their connections to these lands and
adjoining waters continue to this day. Our first order of business uh is
approval of the agenda. Can I have a move seconded? Any discussion?
All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. We have two adoption of minutes
from the regular council meetings on July 13th. Same mover and seconder. Uh
any changes, corrections, or amendments to the minutes?
Not seeing any. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. And then just a
motion to receive the comm the Heritage Commission minutes June 3rd. Move
second. All those in favor? Any opposed? We have no rise and report. My mayor's
remarks will be brief. Um I just want to acknowledge the very rare rare
cancellation rain cancellation that we had with with the music in the park.
That's the first time in my experience that that's happened. Um I just want to
thank the staff and participants who did set up and tear down the stage uh with
anticipation of a break in the web that never happened. Um so um uh just uh but
it is still continuing this summer. So make sure you get out to see those. Um I
was able to attend on July 21st the change of command. So um this is the CFB
squymalt. So Kevin Whiteside uh took down his penant and Captain Navy Doug
Leighton has taken over as base commander. uh seems a bit remote from
Oak Bay, but uh they're actually very engaged with municipalities uh across
the region, both in housing as well as many other uh initiatives. Um in fact,
the base commander often joins we have a semi-regular lunch meeting with the
mayors in the region and he often joins us as that as for some of the common uh
common issues. So uh Mr. Captain Whiteside has been done a great job.
We're looking forward to working with uh the new Captain Leighton. Um, I also
just wanted a little reminder uh that school district school district 61 is in
changing their electoral system to award system which means that uh this year
will be the first year that Oak Bay uh elects a Oak Bay specific representative
on the school board. So just [clears throat] uh wanted to make that
uh raising it here just for public awareness if people are interested in
representing the interests of Oak Bay at the school district 61 table. Uh it is
an election process. you would have to put your name forward and I'm just
encouraging people to to consider that. Um, also not directly in Oak Bay,
although you can watch it partially from Oak Bay, the the official viewing site
of the Snowbirds is happening on August 4th at 5:00 p.m. at Clover Point uh with
a very strict warning that there's very very very little parking. So, if you
want to go walk uh or ride uh your way down there, again, August 4th at 5:00
p.m. And finally, just a reminder that we
have we do have many activities, including music in the park, but also
yoga in the park, open air piano concerts, um um and of course, one more
night market in August and one in in September coming up. So, uh council
takes a bit of a breather over August. We don't have any scheduled meetings,
though. We sometimes have to have special meetings, but typically we
don't. Um, so I just want to thank uh staff and council for all the work so
far this year and wish everybody uh some relaxation and renewal over the next
month. I know obviously staff uh and even council are continuing to work
through the month. Uh that concludes my comments. Uh we now go to section seven
which is public comment and question period and I um an opportunity for
people to address council. This is on items not on the agenda u but of general
interest to the community. an opportunity to raise uh make comments or
make ask questions of council. Um and we did have a a member of the public
actually send us a picture ahead of time and wanted to speak. So we have the
picture uh and that is Mr. Tatty who I see has raised his hand online. So why
don't I start there and Mr. Tatty you can demonstrate the process which is to
state your full name and your municipality of residents not your
address just your municipality. Welcome. >> Uh Tim Daddy Oak Bay. Um can you hear
me? Okay >> we can. Thank you. Now, thank you very
much and and thank you to staff. I got this picture to them uh late this
afternoon and I was very appreciative of their quick response to get it to you.
I'll be very very brief. I always appreciate these opportunities, Mr.
Mayor. Um I was struck at one of the recent council meetings when um a
gentleman uh raised the issue of beach access uh with regard to the marina
lease for taking his kayak and canoes and whatnot on wheels and walking down
the street and putting them on. And it reminded me of something that's been in
my back of my mind and it may involve a couple of departments. So I thought I'd
go through you. Um, this is the foot of Baler and I would just draw your
attention to several quick things. The passageway where walkers go, many, many
of us have been there, has [clears throat] a telephone pole and
another concrete abutment and a concrete abutment with Chris Hidlay's very good
signs that they put so much effort into. And then as you go, there's a chain in
the garbage can and then a stack of signs, the top of which is uh ruined and
vandalized and and it's just a hodgepodge of signs. So my proposal,
again, this is related to access, and there's the obviously the blue multimat,
which is excellent. So my quick proposal is for uh staff or council, however this
works, to look at making some some very inexpensive changes that would make
accessibility u easier for everybody. So the first
thing I would propose is please note that [clears throat] the sign to the
left pointing to the left has no parking and that is I think because of the chain
I think that must be because of picking up garbage. to the right. Parking is
midnight to 6:00 a.m. So, what I propose, um, if you'll go back to the
walkway, the chains have been up year round usually, but whether it's been
vandalized or whether one's been taken down, they've been up across.
Cars are parked hodge podge there all the time. This one was taken without
cars. And the only option if one is uh trying to get through to the blue mat is
to go through the walkway and across the sand of course, but there's the
telephone pole. And it's equally hard for old people like me with kayaks and
canoes to wheel down through there. You can't actually bend the kayak. So my
proposal would be pretty simple that you take advantage of the opportunity to
clean up the signage. Keep them all. They're all very important. but somehow
clean them up. Make the no parking sign uh clear to the left and take down that
chain so that people like uh that that can't lift their kayak can take it down
whether the blue mat's there or not because the blue mat's seasonal. But I'm
proposing the the access for wheeling in where there's no parking to be year
round. And then to the right, I'm proposing that you make that handicap
parking. there's plenty of space so that in fact the garbage truck would still be
able to get his garbage because that's where people like me would take our
kayaks through on wheels. Um, [clears throat] walkers would not be
impeded and we would be introducing a handicap parking spot so that when
people do want to take advantage of the blue mat, they don't have to do an
awkward twirly around to get to it or come down from up higher on on Willows
Beach where the parking lot is. And and so that's essentially it. I appreciate
you listening to me. I know you can't respond, but if you can move that
forward if you think it makes sense, I'd really appreciate it. Thank you.
Thank you very much, Mr. Teddy. And and we do have our director of engineering
in the in the hall here. And I think I'll leave that as a bit of a conduit to
staff for for consideration of those pieces. So, uh and yeah, generally
speaking, um these a lot of the great ideas in our community do come from the
community as people walk about and see these kind of things. So, um always
appreciate people raising them. You don't have to come to the council.
You're certainly welcome to. Uh you can often just send a note in to staff. uh
you can CC Oak Bay Council on these things. Uh but generally they're the
ones who go do an assessment and see if it makes sense. So appreciate you
raising it. So have a good evening. Uh next in our speaking agenda I have here
uh is anybody in the room who wishes to speak? I'll invite the person in the
room come forward. >> Mayor, do I stand or
» uh come come up to the chair. >> Thank you.
» And what we'll have you do is uh again you can demonstrate for those in the
room. If anybody else wishes to speak, have a seat. You can push the button in
the middle. Okay. >> And just state your name, municipality
of residence. Then you have up to three minutes.
» Okay. Perfect. Thank you. Good evening, Mr. Mayor and Council. Uh my name is
David King, and I'm here this evening with my wife and neighbors. Uh we reside
on Hampshire. I would like to address a bit about the
property at 1538 uh Montterrey that is owned by the municipality and is going
to be subject to a temporary use permit application this evening.
Uh the property was purchased by very pardon me. We'll actually have an
opportunity to speak to that when it's on the agenda.
» Would I be able to just put this comment forward or um Sure. I guess.
» Sure. Okay. Thanks. It's it's um I live very adjacent to the property.
Uh the property was purchased in Oak Bay in 2016. Has been allowed to fall into
disrepair. Um if you visit the old house this
evening, the yard's unckempt, the buildings run down. uh windows are open
as they have been for months and resulting as I understand in pest and
rodent issues. Uh the site is also used as overflow
parking and smoking hole for local businesses and uh people in the area and
the fences are falling down. The site is actually covered in cigarette butts and
garbage. Um recently the house has been used as a
training facility for the Oak Bay Fire Department. When this first happened, I
was alarmed to see smoke billowing from the windows and firemen on the site in
full protective gear. It turns out there was no fire. Uh but
the house was being used for training using simulated smoke and houses being
dragged through the house. Um I recognize the the requirements for
training and I really do appreciate our local fire department.
I do have questions about the property and the tup. Um, Oak Bay is already
using it as an immersive training facility without putting the appropriate
TUP in place beforehand. What I would ask today is that we as the
neighbors um be consulted on this. Um, I understand that the first thing I saw
was a flyer come to my door on the TUP and uh I had seen no consultation before
that. I see that a lot of the things that are being uh asked for in the TUP
are already being done on the property. Um I have had conversations with the
municipality about other things such as parking in in in uh theater lane which
have been an issue. Um I've had some responses but no thorough responses
back. So um I think this property has been
treated somewhat poorly. And what I would ask is that Oak Bay act
as good neighbors. Um, and really what I would ask is that they consult us before
um any of the tups and other actions go forward. Uh, I I I'm I'm not against
development on the site or any other location, but I would love to be
involved in the uh the process. So, thanks Mayor. That's all I have to say.
» Thank you very much. Uh, I move to uh the uh Eric Zelka
online.
» Mr. Zelka, you have your hand raised online.
» Yes. Can you hear me? All right. How's that sound?
» We can. Yes. Thank you. >> Wonderful. Um, uh, hello. My name is
Eric Zulka. Uh, living in northern part of Oak Bay, uh, proper. And, uh, I just
wanted to follow up on an additional item. Um uh ripping off of uh Tim
Teddy's uh suggestion from a few moments ago, that area uh um uh that has the
wonderful map that heads down right down to the water for the um accessibility
aspect. That area uh especially if the chain is going to be adjusted, it really
needs two additional items. Every time I go down there, especially when I'm
leaving the beach, which be wonderful to have an opportunity to wash my feet like
I do at almost every other beach in the uh in the district. Uh plus down at
Willows Beach, you know, uh there is a way to wash your feet in the water
fountains. Uh unfortunately, I don't want to do it in the water fountain. I
don't know where else to do it, but a foot wash would be fantastic. It's
something that could also be um you know, nice for the for the dogs as well,
maybe not combined. Uh and uh ideally a washroom because I do notice that uh for
those who who have a need, there's a certain smell in that area. And for
those of you who visit the bu the bushes nearby, especially the house that lives
right next door to that, I'm sure everyone would appreciate a washroom
right there. Uh since uh unfortunately nature calls. Thank you.
» Thank you very much, Mr. Zulka. Uh I do think those are probably slightly more
complicated implementations than some of the other signage pieces, but we can
certainly have a look at that as well as consideration for future projects.
Anybody else in the room wish to speak to council? Again, uh it's intended for
items not on the agenda. Um
okay, I don't see any other hands raised either online or in person. Uh so with
that, we will uh conclude this portion of the agenda and move on to the uh next
piece which is recommendations from the meeting held on July 20th. Uh we had one
uh recommendation that came out of that that council direct staff to engage with
community green map and report back on the organization's proposed partnership
model. So can someone move that recommendation? Thank you. Seconded. Um
discussed it at that meeting, but if there's any further discussion, happy to
take some now. Not seeing any others in favor. Any opposed? None opposed. Thank
you. Uh not everything's going to be this quick. Uh so we now move to item
9.1, which is preliminary performance measures and council signoff. Um we have
Mr. Bull here, our director of community building and planning. Um this was a
fairly lengthy discussion at the uh committee of the whole and there's been
some uh some additions uh based on that conversation coming back to this table.
So over to you Mr. Bull. Thank you mayor. Just pulling up my
notes. [clears throat] So today's report follows up on the
broader discussion that council had last week and it responds directly to
council's direction from April uh to return with preliminary performance
measures and KPIs and also seeking final sign off on part two of the project and
optimizing development processes has been a key component of the housing
action program and is intended to prepare the district for increasing
development activity, new provincial housing requirements and anticipated
growth under the up propos updated OCP. Part two of the project builds on the
assessment completed in part one last year which included process reviews,
municipal benchmarking, industry consultation and the identification of
opportunities to improve development and building permit processes. The the
report before council today is about ensuring that we not only implement
process improvements but also establish clear ways to measure whether those
improvements are delivering better outcomes for applicants, staff, council
and the community. A total of 11 initiatives are proposed that are
intended to improve the entire applicant journey from initial inquiries and
pre-application discussions through to development approvals and building
permitting and construction rather than focusing on a single part of the
process. Miss Cook will um continue the introduction with a couple of additional
details regarding the proposed performance measures. Thanks.
» Thank you and welcome Miss Cook. >> Thank you. Good evening, Mayor and
Council. Um, as you'll see in the report, staff undertook an updated
outcomes impact assessment to analyze the cost benefit of each initiative.
This included assessing each initiative by the level of effort required, the
anticipated outcomes, and then rating the level of impact from high to low.
This assessment indicated that some initiatives are anticipated to have a
higher level of impact than others, but um that the proposed initiatives are
anticipated to generally have a high level of impact on the targeted outcome
or beneficiary. Following the updated outcomes impact assessment, staff
identified preliminary performance indicators to provide a framework to
measure the success of the initiatives. This includes quantitative and
qualitative key performance indicators as appropriate for a particular
initiative including time frame KPIs i.e. achieving an output of a particular
initiative on time and within budget customer and staff surveys to measure
qualitative impacts and quantitative data on improved sorry improved process
time frames for development approvals and building permitting. Staff
anticipate that further KPIs will be identified after each initiative is
launched and more detailed scoping specific to the initiative is
undertaken. KPIs will be used to provide updates to council on the success of the
initiatives and the project as a whole. Considered altogether staff anticipate
that the 11 initiatives will systematically improve the development
and building application processes and to end. Therefore, all 11 initiatives
are recommended for inclusion in CPP78. staff are seeking today for sign off
from council on CPP78 after which we will begin the process of pro procuring
external support and launching the project. Um we're happy to take any
questions that you may have. Thank you. >> Great. Thank you very much for that. Are
there questions for members of council to staff?
Go ahead. Ed Watson and then Green. >> Yes. Thank you very much. Thanks mayor
for allowing me to raise something. Um, and this is very high level to staff and
it it was something that really just came to me today when I was rereading
this package and thinking about the overall process and how the public um
perceives their their the service level. and it was about the relationship
between public works permits and planning permits and the extent to which
um there is coordination around that and
well I guess maybe I'll just think about my issue here
for certain projects I assume like larger ones people need both planning
and development permits and they also need engineering and public works
permits because they've got driveway winding they may have sewer or water
upgrades they need to do. And I wondered to what extent that those processes
would end up as a result of this being integrated and sort of um managed to the
same level or standard so that um somebody who's got one of those bigger
projects, these improvements around planning and building also spill over to
the other things that they have to do to get their project through the pipeline.
So I just a comment about that. I'm not expecting anything more than just a
reflection on that. >> Sure, Mr. Bull.
» Yeah, thank you, Mayor, through you. Um, yeah, there's a number of related
permits that uh might come up during either development applications which
are the planning stage or building permits uh in preparation of
construction. Um so usually those are coordinated because the the development
application has been made and some preliminary comments are made and some
requirements will be identified at that time and for building permits it's more
practical. For tree permits for example uh tree protection fencing needs to be
identified and installed and for any servicing needs uh uh the engineering
and public works department identifies the requirements and so that usually
makes sure that all these things are coordinated. the timing might be
sometimes u different. Um but when we did the
review last last year uh the focus was very much on the development application
process and the building permit process not so much on the other permit
processes. We we had uh definitely input from those groups as well u wasn't
coming up as a as a as a major issue at that point in time. So uh I think the
the improvements that we have here uh do have some relation those other kind of
permits as well because in the case of simplification for example for building
permits there may be uh options where a little bit of time can be gained if
there's either less or no involvement from other teams or there's less people
involved of a certain permit but so that's kind of the general answer I can
give or flection I guess. Thanks. >> And if I could just follow up. So
there's um one of the projects and it's a large one is about applicant resources
and I just wondered if in the in the in the scope of that project applicant
resources will will applicants be pointed to these other things as part of
that pre-screening all the things for this project I might have to do so that
if they point to parks you mentioned for parks tree permits and and other kinds
of permits that that that in effect becomes part of this project even though
it relates to departments outside your Cook,
» thank you for the question through you, mayor. Um, I would say definitely yes.
When we think about the applicant resources, it will be anything that we
consider is important to the applicant as part of their permitting process. So,
I think we'd be looking at applicant resources related to working with parks,
working with engineering, and working with fire as those are all interrelated
with our building permitting as well as our development approvals. Thank you.
» Thank you. >> Thank you, councelor Watson. Councelor
Green.
Thank you very much. Um and thank you for the report through you mayor. Um
just a couple of questions on on the report. One is around the demolition
permits and waste management. Um I just wanted to ask uh first of all expediting
demolitions. um wondered what the rationale was behind that. And then
secondly, on the waste management side um of of the demolition waste and I'm
asking the question only because I know many Oak Bay residents are concerned
about demolitions and and older housing stock. So that was the the purpose of
the question. And my other question is what is meant by
right-sized? And and that's just my own my own question. I I I wasn't clear how
that was being used and and the context for that. Thank you,
» Mr. B. >> Yeah, thank you to you, mayor. Um, for
demolition permits, oh, sorry. Uh, there's a couple of steps that need to
be followed. It's it's some one of the types of permits we'd like to look at.
It's not specifically on the radar to be faster or or slower. Um, right now, um,
it's just one type of permit. uh we have some OP policies that in the future we
might look at uh dealing differently with construction waste but right now we
don't have specific uh requirements for de demolition permits besides uh if they
are a designated or registered property uh in certain cases it does come to
council be first uh but in most cases it won't um then with regards to what right
sizing means um it's it's contrasted with um the current approach
particularly for building permits where um every permit
uh most building permits as you say this doesn't apply typically to plumbing
permits but building permits are treated first in first out so everybody gets
their turn but everybody regardless of the size of their project a small
kitchen ren or new house or complicated renovation perhaps all goes in the same
queue and that is a one sizefits-all that's not very efficient for the
smaller scope projects right sizing it about uh is there other ways and
pathways or a route for a quicker approval for something that is small and
also u less eyes that already happens I think the the smaller projects don't
have as many reviewers of course uh but to try to create a separate shorter
route for for those projects that don't need that much time or review time
effort that's what we uh try to convey with the term right sizing thanks
» thank you and just a quick followup through you on on um on demolition. I
think there was at one time I I don't know if it was a policy, but it was a
suggestion to deconstruct as opposed to demolish. Could you tell me where that
um that approach is at this moment in in Oak Bay? Thank you,
» Mr. Bull. >> Yeah, thank you, Mayor Through. Um it's
sometimes it already happens. Um but what the what council has considered a
while ago was a project options analysis for a deconstruction bylaw. I think that
is currently still on the long list long listed list of projects future potential
projects that might be picked up in the future. So that's the current status of
that particular topic. Thanks. >> Thank you very much.
» Thank you. I I will note there is a uh CRD is working on a model bylaw based on
the city of Victoria's bylaw that they will be sharing with other
municipalities. Um and just procedurally here I have one
more person on our council uh list of questions uh too. Um procedurally if
anybody wishes to speak to this item um after council ask questions. This is
true for all things with public input. Council ask questions then we will go to
the public for any comments and questions. Then we'll come back to this
table. Council may have more questions or they may give direction and we'll
speak to motions to give some some things forward. So that's the process
for all of these. So at this point we're I'll come back to this table for
questions. Councelor Braithweight and then Patterson.
» Thanks so much mayor and just a little bit on the technology. I'm just
wondering if the new digital tools that we're going to be using are compatible
with our existing software and if there's going to be any ongoing
licensing or maintenance costs that that are going to remain after the grant
funding ends that we'll have to take on. >> Mr. B.
» Thank you mayor through you. um um not for e apply in my district. Those are
specifically tools that connect to um a wider tempest system that the district
already uses and it's simply building out our toolbox so to say and using more
of the bells and whistles that that program allows for. So um I don't
anticipate increased cost there except for uh what
will happen through this project uh making sure it's all set up and works
properly. that is something that we can mostly do with in-house expertise. Uh
but we do need from time to time some support from basically the provider of
that software to make sure all the all the things connect as they should.
Thanks >> Patterson.
» Yes. Thank you, mayor, and through you to staff um in the uh initiative 10
performance measures and monitoring. It's recommended that we um utilize the
services of a consultant to um help develop those performance measures. Um,
and I I just wonder if staff could speak to is there a standardization or a
tailorization for these because I imagine some of the performance
indicators are um uh kind of tailored for each community in that um
big communities might have a different way of processing things than the
smaller communities and there will be certain things that they'll that both um
developers or permit that applicants or the general public um consider important
here with this this process. So, I'm wondering how uh if it if it's a hybrid,
if it's something they take from um generalized um benchmarks that other
municipalities would use, and um also if what will be captured with this
reporting is uh not only what is recommended, but what items may have
been examined and um considered perhaps too um resource intensive
um so that they they're they're not chosen as a performance
indicator. So just a bit of the the background on on the on what we would be
seeing as a council. >> Sure. I'll give it to Miss Cook.
» Thank you through you, Mayor. Um so I'd say that for the one big piece of that
question. So they'll definitely be tailored to Oak Bay. So as part of part
one, we already have done some municipal benchmarking, but as we move into that
initiative, we'll definitely look at, you know, what other municipalities in
the region do in terms of key performance indicators and performance
measures and we'll tailor it to what's important um to Oak Bay. Um in terms of
the use of a consultant, I would say that in terms of determining the
performance measures, we already do some performance measuring within uh planning
and building permitting. the use of the consultant won't be I'd say more focused
on what those um KPIs will be but more setting up um the tools and the software
um to establish that and I'm not actually I may have to ask you to repeat
the last part um of that question if you don't mind councelor Patterson thanks
» I think that captured it but something else councelor Patterson
» yes and the last part was just um whenever you go through these
examinations part of it is uh you can get all kinds of data in in a report,
but sometimes the it's resource intensive so that it it it's hard to
justify actually including that. So, I'm wondering if uh when we get this there
there will also be just some highlighting of things that were
considered and then were decided the decision was to not include them because
of them being resource intensive. >> I think that's more
» Thank you, mayor. Is the is that specific to the initiatives or the
measuring of of of yeah performance measures within that initiative?
» It it's really I think through you may it it's really about the performance
reporting and and the data that's gathered because some data can it it's
so resource intensive that we can't we can't justify it reasonably.
» Thank you through you mayor. think that we'll definitely focus our performance
measures on data that we think is important um to the district and that we
would think would be um important to our senior leadership team um and to
council. I think that um what we're looking to do is set up um a tool that
makes measuring performance actually quite simple. So, we'll be putting in
the effort to set up something that's going to help support our uh housing
target order um reporting by um so we already have the data in Tempest and
it's going to be kind of produced into a dashboard that's actually going to make
it a lot easier for us to to report on our performance. Thank you.
» Thank you. Um I guess I just my my questions here
are um uh I should probably leave more probably more comments and questions.
Yeah, I'll leave my my questions at this point and come back to it. So uh is
there any members of the public? Uh I don't have anybody with their hands
raised online at this point but I would certainly if you [clears throat] have
wish to speak I do have one. Anybody in the uh room here who would like to speak
to item this is item 9.1 performance measures.
Okay, I'll go to Mr. Zulka online related to item 9.1.
» Uh, hello. Can you hear me? >> Please go ahead.
» Um, oh, hello. >> We can hear you, Mr. Zulka. Please,
please go. >> Can you hear me? Thank you very much.
Okay. Hello, Eric Zulka again. Um, north part of Oak Bay. Uh, regarding this item
on the agenda, um, yes. Uh, [laughter] this is near and dear to my heart. Uh,
first of all, I do note that uh when I look up on the British Columbia uh
digital building permit uh website, if I put my address in there, I'm informed
that Oak Bay does not participate in this digital program. Check with local
government to learn how to apply. Okay. So, I'm hoping that uh that the $200,000
that was received by Oak Bay will not go to consultants, but will somehow allow
Tempest or whatever it is can to connect to this system since there's quite a
number of uh of benefits uh to be able to offload some of this uh uh work to
the province since they're offering it anyway. Number two is now that we've got
this situation where a homeowner who would normally go to apply for a single
residence and is treated as a home residential owner for what's referred to
as small projects, you know, and obviously uh um is treated that way.
Now, this residential owner who's wanting to uh expand uh can now put up
three, four, five, six, six units on their single family home property,
they're now being treated by OPAY staff as full-fledged developers.
The language is not appropriate. The uh the assistance uh uh for the two or
three situations that I'm aware of is not appropriate. the forms that that
come through are it's it's just gobbly goop to to a to a homeowner who's used
to putting in a a a bathroom and now just wants to put in two additional
units for their grown-up kids to live with them and they're being treated like
a developer. So when you talk about all these wonderful buzzwords I see in the
report, great buzzwords make sense to council, make sense to development
staff, makes no sense to the residents of Oak Bay in general. So please, when
you're talking about customer service, just realize you've got people out there
who haven't a clue what you're talking about. Thank you very much.
» Thank you, Mr. Zulka. Uh any other uh members of the public
online or in person to speak to this item?
I don't see any other hands. We'll come back to this table. Uh we have a
recommendation here and my understanding of this uh is really that uh the
recommendation here is to approve this is this will advance the projects the 11
priority projects. It gives authority to going go forth and do those projects. Um
uh but that the specific uh measures and so forth will will be coming back at a
future time for for final approval. There's some suggested uh KPIs and
measures there but they're not final we're not approving those at this point.
and it's really approving the the projects at this point. Is that is that
accurate? >> Yeah, thank you mayor. That's that's
correct. Um um a number of the initiatives do require council input
particular for bylaws particular but also particularly the ones for
performance measures and uh right sizing of processes. Those will definitely come
back to council and some of the other more um less complicated or less or not
really needing further direction. they will simply be implemented um as as we
go by but we'll definitely keep council posted of what the progress is on this
program. Thanks. >> Okay. Um at this point we haven't we
haven't define the reporting back correct like the reporting back on the
uh the status of the projects or the uh or the KPIs like are they going to be
annual semiannual by we haven't determined any of that at this point. Is
that correct? >> Uh yes mayor that's correct.
» Okay very good. Um any >> move the recommendation.
» Thank you. Move and seconded. Uh any discussion?
Uh [laughter]
uh yeah I I just have a couple of uh comments here. One, thank you. I mean I
think these are all incredibly important projects and uh and good to see them
moving forward. Um I do think that there's probably benefit for us to kind
of uh have the outcome metrics come back to this table for sign off at some point
in the future and probably also the um excuse me for my voice is just coming in
and out for some reason the last couple of weeks. um uh that the the timeline
for the status reporting and so forth should probably also we should figure
that out uh at some point not in the immediate future but I think as we
develop those KPIs and so I'm just uh going to uh turn to staff because I had
a thought of perhaps just amending [clears throat] the seeing the motion
amended just to be clear that the target outcome metrics that they that they do
come back to council for signoff and that the reporting timelines uh come
back as well. uh is that something that count that staff would see as as
reasonable? >> Thank you, mayor. Definitely the targets
and the performance measures uh progress reporting uh other council priority
projects we usually report on semiannually for the updates that we
provide for all projects. Uh so that would be um our intent. Uh but if
there's something different that council would like to see for this particular
project, uh definitely open to hearing that. Thanks. [laughter] I see Miss H
reaching for the microphones. Walter inter.
» Thank you, your worship. I just wanted to clarify when you speak about status
reporting, are you meaning in terms of the implementation of the various
initiatives or status reporting once we have those outcome metrics that we would
be reporting back to council on an annual basis with with a measure of you
know the metrics against the targets. Uh so just to clarify that please. Yeah, I
I think probably the the important piece from a governance level I would see
being more the uh a retainment of the KPIs once we've signed off on those. I
you know at a high level here um you know my my hope is that and this is sort
of a a bit of a maybe a cultural shift but you know I mean ideally we're not as
a council getting into too so far into the weeds on the individual projects.
Um, you know, it's helpful to have the information, but at the end of the day,
we're, you know, here to essentially set the the goals and and and staff to come
back with with with projects that help achieve that can achieve those. Um, and
and hopefully if we're setting, uh, you know, the outcomes, the desired
outcomes, then, you know, if we all agree on that, both staff and council,
then we're, you know, that sh that should shape decision- making. So, as
you're working on the projects and you have to prioritize to say, "Okay, well,
we've all agreed that these are the priorities and here's the outcomes and
and if there's things that staff, you know, need to come back and check in for
council to get approval on, then that's clear, right? That's so the intention
here is to kind of get us back to the KPI piece." And I think that's the
primary piece. The status of the individual projects, I think, is less
important than it is the status of the outcomes. Um, they're obviously driven
by the status of the outcome of the of the individual projects. Does that m
» Yes. Thank you very much. that helps. And uh what I may suggest is that um uh
we introduced a trimester reporting progress uh report just recently which
primarily included financial and HR indicators. Uh we can build on that
trimester reporting um to include you know community building uh and planning
indicators. Um you know we could do an annual performance report. I think um
you know there are avenues where we're already reporting to council in terms of
KPIs and we can add uh to that. you know, the annual report is another one.
Um, so I think if you let us take that away, we'll make sure that um, you know,
we figure out the best um, reporting back process on that. In terms of
determining what those targets are, I think what Mr. Bow um, mentioned is that
as we work through sort of the bylaw changes that that we will become to
council and talk about those bylaw changes and um, there will be choices
for council in terms of how they relate to the outcomes. And so at that point
we'll be having more of a discussion around those outcomes that council wants
to see because if we make a bylaw amendment in one way there might be a
certain outcome uh or target associated with that but if we do it in a different
way there would be a different target or outcome associated with that and so I
think those discussions will will come as part of the process in terms of um uh
yeah for finalizing the initiative. So I'll let Mr. Bull add on if he has
anything further. >> Okay. Oh thank you. So just for my
clarification uh and I'll get to the main motion here in a second. um just
because we haven't yet defined those KPIs and they will drive the decision-m
that goes forward like when does is like I guess my question here is either can
you can we be clear about when those KPIs will come back to council for sign
off or is it something that we should just put in as a as a as a amendment to
the motion that those will come back to council so that there's actually on the
record that they're coming back uh for council
Sorry. Thank you, Miss Cook. >> Thank you, mayor. Um, so yeah, the
[clears throat] initiative 10 performance measures and monitoring has
kind of two phases um in which we're planning on rolling it out. Um, so
there's kind of that Sorry, just let me go back to the program.
So the first phase um so Q3 2026 so about I'd say about October um of this
year we will um have established some some KPIs and performance measures that
we'll then use to measure the success um of the initiative and I think that that
it'll be a bit of an ongoing process um because as I mentioned before when we
get into the more detailed scoping of each initiative we'll be developing kind
of further KPIs to measure that specific initiative. So, I think we can report
back on performance measures um when we first established them in Q3 2026, but I
do think potentially through that tri um trimester uh report that we could update
on KPIs specific to each initiative if that's something that council would like
to hear from us. Thank you. >> Okay. Yeah, Mr.
maybe to add um specifically for building permits for example uh because
that's worked on uh starting later this year and next year in the first quarters
uh I anticipate we would as part of that initiative come back to you about how
those processes can be changed and that will also directly relate to number 10
performance measures so I see that with those two initiatives coming together
there and we'll come back to you with options and specifics at that point in
time so you get to direct specifically for building permits at that time and
then at other times other topics may come up that require your input. Thanks.
Okay. So, just for my clarification, there's not a spec in October we expect
some of the KPIs to be coming back and and presented to council. Is that what
I'm I'm hearing? Is that the sort of Well, October is a terrible time because
it'll be right in the middle of an election. [laughter]
» Probably early in the new year. >> Yeah. Your worship. Um I think let us
take it away. Uh we I understand exactly what you're looking for. You're looking
for council to set the targets in terms of those broader outcomes. Um and we
will make sure that we return to council to have that discussion as we work
through this project um later this year as we look at the individual uh KPIs.
That goes to councelor Patterson's. I don't want to get me down in a whole
variety of different KPIs and I think what you're looking at are those top
level ones in terms of outcomes and uh we will make sure we come back to
council once we've got into this um to have that discussion with you.
» Okay. Is there any benefit in amending the motion to sort of be clear about
that? Is >> okay. I'll leave that to turn to council
if they feel that's important um um to have that language in there, but
otherwise it's just a general understanding that that will come back
for council consideration. Um
council read, >> I think that um it's my understanding
that staff, both planning staff and senior staff have an understanding of of
what you were talking about. I'm not sure we need an amendment per se, but
» No, that's fine. I I I tend to agree sometimes it's beneficial to have
clarity, but it's not always required. So, um I'll leave my comments there and
thank you to staff for the for the work that's been going on on this. So, right
now we have a motion on the floor which is the staff recommendation. I don't see
any other discussions. We'll call the question. All those in favor? Any
opposed? Not opposed? That carries and good luck with all the projects.
Uh move to section now section 10. These are also both available for public
input. Uh item first one up is uh item 10.1 288 Hampshire Lane. This is a
request for a development variance permit. Um and I will hand this over to
is it Miss Clever. Welcome. >> Thank you. Good evening Mayor and
council. Uh the purpose of this report and application pertains to an
application for a development variance permit as you just mentioned to
specifically increase the lot coverage and also reduce um the setback
requirement of 3 mters between buildings and structures um to permit the
[clears throat] construction of pergola in on an existing patio um of a
relatively newly developed residential lot. Um the property owners and
applicant are actually here today if you have any questions later. But
essentially they're asking for this permit um to for a custom design pergola
um to better enjoy their their rear yard um and also just for protection from the
sun for health purposes. So uh design plans are in um attached as attachment
five um which also the rationale behind the intentionality of the project is in
attachment six. So as I mentioned before the variance triggers two requirements.
So the increase of block coverage as well as the um reduction of sighting
between um or the spatial separation of 3 m between buildings and structures um
so that it can be positioned in a specific place that makes sense uh on
the existing patio. Um ultimately they've they've consulted neighbors.
They have strata approval um to proceed and uh staff recommend approval of the
development variance permit. Thank you. >> Thank you very much for the overview.
Are there any questions from members of council to the applicant or to staff? Go
ahead, councelor briefly. Um, >> thanks very much. My question would be
to staff. I'm just wondering if um the reduced separation would create any um
fire separation or building code concerns um or will those have been um
addressed through the building permit process? Thank you.
» Yeah, great question. Uh the 3 m setback historically was developed decades and
decades ago um for that very reason to ensure that if a fire occurs that it
doesn't um spread. Uh ultimately because of the nature of uh the opening of the
pergola. Yes, it goes through a building permitting process. The building
officials will evaluate this. But ultimately um the nature of the
pre-existing patio, what's there uh staff have already kind of evaluated
that there wouldn't be that um that that hazard. Um but it still has to go
through the B building permit process. you may just one other question and this
is probably for the applicant and I'm just wondering if the um pergola is
intended to remain open or is there a future intention to enclose it at all?
» I'm going to ask the applicant and property owners to come to the stage
or to the podium I should say. >> Oh, just come to the desk here.
» You can actually go and sit right there. No, it's okay.
» All right. Okay. >> So, you probably heard the process. just
state your name and municipality and uh you can answer the question about the
» I'm new to Oak Bay so I'm going to say Oak Bay um and my name is Kevin Flanigan
and it's going to the intent is to remain open it will be a slant or
slanted uh pergola so that it kind of gives you some protection from the sun
» thank you any other questions for the applicant not seeing any um we then open
this floor up to uh members of the public who wish to address any of the
issues related to this variance. Um, again, this is for 2088 Hampshire. I did
lower a hand that was online earlier, so I'm not sure if there seems if the
speaker I think it was just a legacy hand remaining from an earlier uh
request. So, does anybody any members of the public either in person looking
around not seeing any uh or online uh don't see any public input?
» Staff recommendations second.
» Seconded. Thank you. Um, any further discussion?
All those in favor? Any oppose? You're approved. Good luck with the project.
Enjoy the pergola. Hope we get some sun that you can actually use it. Um item
number 10.2, which is 1538 Montterrey Avenue. This is the temporary use
permit. Um for 1538 Montter Avenue. We have Mr. Green here, our deputy director
of community building and planning to introduce the item. Same process will
take place. There will be staff introduction, questions from council and
then opportunity for public input. So you can come back and speak again if you
wish. Please go ahead, Mr. Green. >> Uh good evening, members of council.
[clears throat] The district has received a temporary use permit
application for the property uh at 1538 Montre Avenue. The applicant is the
district's facilities department who has submitted a temporary use permit in
order to allow the use of the property to be used for temporary municipal
office storage space and staff training facilities for the Oak Bay Police
Department and the Oak Bay Fire Department for a period of three years.
Staff have reviewed the proposal in context with the science area and based
on this review staff believe the TU is supportable in accordance with the
legislation and in accordance with council's development application
procedure bylaw. uh staff did give uh notification so a development
notification letter was sent to all properties within 50 meters as well as
an advert placed in the Oak Bay news on two separate occasions. Uh the applicant
is also here to answer any questions that council may have on the application
and planning staff are also happy to answer any questions that council have
on the technical merits of the application.
» Thank you very much Mr. Green by the applicant as Mr. Graham. Is that the
green? Welcome. Good to see you. Councelor Patterson and Councelor Green
and then councelor Briew. >> Yes. Thank you, mayor, and through you
to staff. Um just to follow up on uh Mr. King did speak about this earlier on,
but his comments are certainly echoed by many of the residents that are u
particularly on Mterrey. And so as part of this temporary use permit and the
uses we're we're planning for this um what are the plans to uh provide more
particularly um clean up and maintenance of the of the green space around the
building proper. >> Mr. Graham
» uh through your worship uh currently we maintain the property to just a minimum
standard uh with in alignment with our budget uh restraints and parks generally
cleans it and cuts the loans twice a year. So currently it wasn't our intent
to change that.
» I have councel green in the brief. >> Thank you and through you uh to staff.
Thank you very much for the report. Um just wondered following on councelor
Patterson's comments. Just wondering um what if any plan consultation there will
be with immediate neighbors that obviously have concerns about about the
property. Um I think the end result will address many of their concerns as it
becomes utilized and maintained. But is there any plan to at least talk with
them and and just um get a really good understanding of what what is concerning
to them? Thank you.
Um I guess from planning staff's perspective obviously we have complied
with the legislation in terms of sending a notification letter out to everybody
within 50 meters as well as place an advert in the paper and obviously this
is the opportunity for the public to have their say on the vacation.
Obviously, if the applicant uh wants or if council wants the applicant to do
further consultation, then that's the will of council, then that could also be
an opportunity that you could add a condition to the temporary use permit or
either as a pre-issuance condition or before council considers that
application to for the applicant to host some kind of information session with
the immediate neighbors is also an opportunity for that could be if council
so chooses. >> Thank you.
» Thank you, councelor Green. Councelor Braith in Appleton. Oh, thanks so much.
And my mine were around um some of the neighborhood impacts as well. Um and
questions around like um you know, how often will the fire department training
occur, the police training occur? Is it in evenings, weekends, overnight? Um
will there be sirens, smoke machines? I think we've heard that there are smoke
machines. Um you know, similated emergencies, those kind of all came up
when I was reading the report. You know, where will the trainee park? Um will
there be any impact on the neighborhood parking? and how will the neighbors know
when the training is going to occur? So, those are some of the questions I have.
» Over to you, Mr. Graham. >> Uh, thank you through your worship. Um,
if if I missed any of the questions, just there was a list there. Um, signage
is placed out in front of the building whenever there's um training. Uh,
training um I won't say will happen daily, but based on the training
requirements we have under the provincial legislation, it could be that
often. It is done during the day, not in the evening. So it would meet with our
um all of our um noise bylaws and those sort of things. Um generally we do um I
won't say occasionally, quite regularly use an actual smoke machine. Uh the
other opportunity with um the fires, they'll use full blackout face masks,
but the intention is to create as realistic conditions as possible. Uh we
typically leave the windows open for a few hours afterwards to allow the smoke
to come out. It's just a standard smoke machine that you'd use on any film set
type of a condition. Um, did I miss
sorry >> parking for the trainees that are there?
» Oh, for parking being that it's so close to the um uh the fire department, the
police department. Uh generally they just bring the apparatus over.
» Thank you. And then um the the report also mentions plumbing upgrades and
safety upgrades and and do we know what plan what um work is um is actually
planned and and what the cost of that might be
» uh through your worship that uh building permit is actually related to our
ongoing maintenance of the building. It's not related to the temporary use
permit. Um we did some uh extra bracing on the back deck for instance just
recently. Uh, I believe there's a toilet in there we're looking at replacing, but
being that the building isn't in use, we're likely just going to shut that
toilet off. >> Um, thank you. And if I may, mayor, um,
and what I noticed in the report, it said that we're going from two lots to
one lot for the TU. I think it said somewhere in there that we we have to
make it into one lot. Is that correct, Mr. through your worship to council bra
from planning stress perspective. We are adding that as a condition to the TU
that consolidates the lot given that I think there's an expectation that this
lot be brought into compliance with the zoning bar rather than being a a legal
non-conforming use. And so the planning staff have
recommended that condition be added to that draft permit.
» Thank you. And so then my question would be um after the 3 years if if um the TU
is has ended after the three years will it then go back to the two lots or will
it stay as the one lot? >> Mr. through your wish to cancel the to
in order then to create two lots the uh the applicant or the land owner need to
submit a subdivision application to subdivide a property into two lots if
that is the what is the requirement but at the end of that three years there's
an expectation that the slight be yeah uh remain as it was prior to uh
commencement of the development but there isn't the lot consolidation is a a
condition that we are the planning staff are recommending be
um undertaken.
» You go ahead, councelor Appleton. >> Thank you, worship. So, just expanding
on the idea of of just public information. So, I heard that there was
the proposal to put signage out to sort of inform people what was going on. I
just and this may be more a question for the fire service rather than Mr. But is
there any other is the nature of the training and the timeline of the
training consistent enough such that we the fire service might be able to uh
provide to local neighbors at least a rough idea of approximately the the
timing and the nature of what to expect as far as that I think that might help
neighbors a lot >> uh threeear worship I can't speak in
detail because the fire chief isn't here but generally The answer is yes. We're
consistent of training short of being called out on actual emergencies. Uh the
training would be uh set regularly uh during the uh daytime.
» Go ahead, Council. >> Thank you, Worship. Less of a question,
more just a comment. I think it would be I guess yeah, without being able to
speak directly to fire services. I think that it would be useful if there was
even some kind of circular bulletin or some type of regular posting on the
district's website that local residents could consult to just sort of get a
sense of when those things might be going on. So, just make that notation
for staff.
» Before I go back to second time questions, uh are there any the first
time? Um I just have questions to follow up on on the line of questioning
already. Um the while there's what's proposed for us
is the is a maintenance or continuation of the current maintenance model. There
is a possibility that we could direct that maintenance level becreased with a
thing with that thing. Thank you. The other question I have was just around
parking there that is because it's adjacent to the village is a high use uh
space. Does the and you you there's a comment made that the equipment would
come over from the fire hall, but that's would that parking space would it would
that be uh impacted? Would that be have to be reserved for chunks of the day for
the fire department use or would that would they be able to use their
equipment around the corner or other places that doesn't use up parking in
the village or adjacent to the village? Mr. Graham,
» uh to your worship, the the apparatus usually parks in the front of the
building right on Mterrey. Uh there is a fire hydrant there. So there is a no
parking section that they generally park on. From observing the the the test
exercises that we've done there to see how well the apparatus fits, it will
take up a couple of parking spots on Montre Avenue. We don't generally bring
the apparatus down a theater lane to park. Um the firefighters would carry
ladders around to the back of the building and do um practice evacuations
um things like that. >> Okay. So So do we have a sense of what
would be required then? If it's using up two parking spaces, would those parking
spaces have to be reserved ahead of time because obviously people might be
parking there on a regular basis and then the parking the equipment couldn't
park there if they if they needed the space.
» Uh to your worship, yes, they generally the days that they're going to be
training, they would put up signs really early in the morning to uh block those
spots open. >> Okay. And again, do we have a sense of
the frequency of that training? >> Worst case scenario would be daily. I
think it would be fairly consistent that it would be almost daily.
» Okay. Uh and the other uh question I have is just in the uses here. I mean
there was temporary municipal office office storage uh and staff training for
the police and fire departments. So is there any in thought here that that
would actually would would this be used for municipal offices or office storage?
» Uh to your worship, we do store some spare furniture in there. Part of it is
mockups for the uh the fire department to maneuver through um uh almost like a
little bit of a maze. Uh we do have it set up in case there is a flood or other
emergency just as part of business continuity for the district. If we had
to, we could move people in there temporarily to do temporary repairs or
something. But to date, we've never had to do that and we're not really
expecting to. >> Okay. Thank you for those answers. I
have second time speakers and Patterson. >> Uh thanks mayor. Actually, you you've
kind of asked one of mine questions, which was um because the the report
emphasizes the value of the site for the training, but it doesn't ever indicate
how many days a month it'll be used or how long the ex exercises will typically
typically last. But what I heard you say was that they're daily and they could go
on all day. So, okay. Um if that if there's it would be nice for the
neighbors um that that they would have that because then we can maybe assess
the impact for for them if if they knew in advance exactly how many days um the
training was going to go on. >> I think it's more of a comment than a
question. So we'll uh do you say anything Mr. Grim?
» Uh through your worship uh training at at like I say at worst could be daily.
It's usually only a few hours is our intent. Um there's uh I can get you
those exact details on the provincial standards for the number of hours of
training they have to put in per week. Um but uh I'm I'm like I say I'm I'm
showing kind of worst case scenario could be every other day but I I do want
to be clear it could be every day for a few hours. Usually they try and take
care of it in the morning and um the afternoons get a little busier for
callouts. >> Councelor Patterson.
» Yes. Thank you, Marin. I I will just comment because I have I have to
maneuver through the area when we d when the training is is going on and um it is
very close to the accessible parking in the village. So, I think that that's
something that we unfortunately the fire chief is not here to speak to it
tonight, but that's something we have to consider. I have also been caught a
couple of times of um there wasn't good direction for where pedestrians go. uh
because you then might have to maneuver out into the street and walk around the
fire truck on till they get set up because there's obstructions across the
sidewalk. But also, I've been caught in the um uh the circumstance of I guess
they had an alarm and so everybody had to come running out of the house and get
on the truck and away they go, which if you're a pedestrian caught up in that,
it's so I think logistically there needs to be uh um some uh review
of this. But also a question through you, Mayor, uh for Mr. Graham. I
believed at some point in time you talked about um removing the uh the
garage from the site and if if Mr. Graeme could just refresh my memory on
that. >> Mr. Graham
» uh three worship that was one proposal I think it was in January that we looked
at if we did want to turn part of that site into parking. Um it was it was not
something we were moving forward with at this time. We do find people, we have
had garbage dumped off around that garage. As soon as we notice it, we
clean it up. Uh we've also put uh doors and secured that building much better
than it was. So, uh hopefully that happens a lot less often, but there's no
intention of removing the garage at this point in time.
» I don't see other questions for members of council. So, if there's any members
of the public who wish to speak to council, yeah, uh you're welcome to come
forward. Uh same process as before, just uh state your name, municipality of
residence. >> Hi again. Uh David King. Uh thank you
very much. I'm sorry I didn't realize the procedure before, but um I live
actually immediately adjacent to the property and uh our neighbors are here
who are also adjacent and I have actually been in conversations with our
neighbors who are directly beside it as well and we're all kind of collectively
on the same page. I'd like to challenge a couple things um around the parking
and the way these exercises have gone. I mean, number one, we have not been
informed. Um, as you're aware, the alley between Montree and Hampshire is one way
that does not exit on the north. Our only exit is onto Theater Lane. Theater
Lane is already exceptionally busy. Uh, garbage pickup every day, large garbage
pickup, deliveries to local businesses, with trucks, uh, to the pubs, and to all
the businesses there. when you have added the fire trucks in
the last little while because the fire trucks were actually on Mterrey in
theater lane and up our alley and when I've asked the firemen cuz I was unable
to get out if they would move the trucks. They were very very polite and
kind but it did take them 10 or 15 minutes to gather somebody up to to be
able to move a truck. Um, I also just say it is it is a pretty, you know, with
the with the smoke coming out and the firemen coming around, it it I think
it's a lot more activity than most people would want in a daily basis um in
their backyard. Um, I'd also like to speak if I could on
the the minimum standard that was discussed about mowing the lawn twice a
year. I I really would love to go out with the mayor and council and have a
walk over the property because um it is actually frankly a little bit
embarrassing this the state of of the property and um and the lack of the lack
of maintenance on the property. Um so so really as I said we always probably
understood that there would be some development there and I understand that
there is a requirement for that but what I would appreciate is some more
consultation with us with the neighbors. uh this letter I got. I appreciate it,
but it was the first time I'd heard about this. And when I had and when our
neighbors had tried to make inquiries to the municipality about the nature of the
training, we we didn't get much of a response. And uh there are other
elements with that property that are uh that are a challenge right now. And
again, that is the the the parking on Theater Lane. Again, uh as I said,
Theater Lane's very busy. It is being used as temporary parking. The
municipality did put up no parking signs. Um what happens is the people
come, they throw the signs behind the the buildings and they park there
anyways. And when I've made my inquiries to the municipality, I've been told
they're going to look into it. I've yet to ever hear back. Uh last thing is on
the garbage. Um I would challenge what was said. uh that area is used as a
pretty reg routine dump and that that material is left there for months and if
you were to go and have a look there now people are using it as their as their
garden dump and dump for other materials behind the garage. Um I would really ask
that at this stage uh there's some time for that this be denied. There be some
more time for consultation with us and see if there is more that can be done uh
to support us and figure out a way forward with this property. So thank you
very much Mary. I really appreciate the time the opportunity to speak.
» Thank you very much Mr. King. Yes. Please come forward.
Exactly the same protocol. Just uh have a seat. uh turn to the microphone on
your name and municipality and then uh please address council.
» Good evening. I'm Michael Shan Danaher. I'm next door neighbor to the person
that just spoke um living in Oak Bay on Hampshire and I am the property directly
adjacent behind uh the property we're discussing. I would just like to
reiterate my neighbors comments the state of disrepair. I don't want to be
disrespectful, but I don't think I would be a good
neighbor if I cut my grass twice a year. I don't think I would be a good neighbor
if I didn't take care of my trees, my shrubs, if I left garbage in my yard, if
I left my house in a state of disrepair. I think Obey is a beautiful community. A
lot of people take great pride in their buildings
and it's a black eye on the township. You really should take a look at the
state of it. Several months ago, there's a garage that's um gravity is slowly
winning the battle and garbage and refuence was in disrepair. So, temporary
fencing was put up. The township's solution was rental fencing, green
rental fencing because cars were illegally parking. They there's a pub
nearby. There are restaurants nearby. Parking is a premium and they were
coming into the laneway and illegally parking. So solution, let's put
temporary fencing up. Um temporary is temporary half a year.
I I just I I don't want to be disrespectful, but I don't think this
property is being taken care of properly. And now an application has
been put in to put the h the house in greater state of disrepair.
It's let's abuse it. Let's have firemen regularly conduct drills in there. And
at some point, I imagine the house will be torn down for a future developer
because not much is being done to maintain it. As has already said, a
toilet is in disrepair. Okay, let's just shut that toilet off. So, as a neighbor,
I see the writing on the wall that this house is going to be abused until it
comes down and the town will cut the grass twice a year and barely maintain
standards until someone actually builds something and uh respects property.
» Thank you for your comments.
Uh, any other members of the public wish to speak to council?
» Oh,
hi. >> Just thank you and council. Um, my name
is Anton Brackage. Um, resident of Oak Bay.
Live fairly near to the the area in question and and pass through the area
fairly frequently. Um, I guess what I would like to ask is
since this location, as I understand, is being used for training for police and
fire, um, if this was not approved, what is
the alternative for training, is there any alternative location they could use
or would this just mean not being able to meet the training standards? And I
think that's something I'd like some clarification on.
Thank you. >> Thank you for that.
Any other members of the public? Uh we have a hand up online. Eric Zelka,
please go ahead.
» Uh council, uh mayor, uh thank you. Uh Eric Zulka from the north part of Oak
Bay. Oh my goodness. Uh quite a interesting bit of information regarding
this property. Uh so many things to talk about. Number one is um the state of the
property is rather I agree with many other members who have spoken. The state
of the property is terrible. Absolutely terrible. It reflects incredibly bad on
the owner of the property which is the district of Oak Bay and is an indication
a proxy measure of the lack of standards of the lowering of standards within Oak
Bay. Now this may not be true but it sure looks that way with the way Oak Bay
treats this property and treats the neighbors in that area. So absolutely
the property must be um uh uh at the very least they grass cut more than
twice a year. That's ridiculous. Number two is um I know the the fire department
has been looking for training uh uh uh places for quite a number of years. Uh I
know they were looking at the uh fifth Gary Oak uh building at one point but uh
I guess that didn't work out. Uh mutual aid. This is what this is the point of
mutual aid. I don't know know why we are not uh um getting into contract with uh
with Sandwich Fire or with uh Victoria Fire or if we have to drive all the way
over to Souk or whatever to do our training, why is it why why aren't we uh
uh considering mutual aid or is there something else going on? This is
definitely a place for mutual aid. Uh number three, uh I'm I'm quite alarmed.
Thank you uh councelor Braithway for bringing forward the question about the
two lots being forced to combine into one. I was on council years ago with
many of you when we the building was purchased. It's a land bank and having
two lots gives greater flexibility to council for what it can be done in the
future. Forcing it to be combined is ridiculous. So council should tell staff
that no, do not combine the two lots. Keep them separate. And if staff insists
because of some, I don't know, provincial regulation, well then do the
tup only on one of the two lots. do not combine the two lots until we know we
the royal we all bay what's going to be done to to with that area whether it's
going to be a new police station whether it's going to be what the money was was
intended for which is a parking for downtown businesses or some other
appropriate uh use uh that that's uh that's a benefit to all of Oak Bay. Uh
so thank you very much uh uh council and please um u uh you know brush up, paint
up uh uh make us proud uh as opposed to being a terrible example for the rest of
us. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments, Mr. Zulka.
Don't see any other hands of people wishing to speak.
Okay. Uh I don't see any more online. So I'm going to come back to this table. Uh
we have a report in front of us. We've had an opportunity for questions. Is
there any further questions from members of council at this time?
If not, go ahead, councelor Watson, then I'll seek a direction and we have a
motion. >> Yes. I just like to follow up on the
question that we got from a member of the public about alternative locations
for this training. Um uh and I I understand we don't have our fire chief
here, but I think that's a fair question. if not here, is there anywhere
else within the municipality that we can we can meet our requirements and
standards for that that very regular training? Um, so I I don't know who to
give that to. Maybe I guess it is Mr. Graham. Thank you,
» Mr. Graham. >> Uh, through your worship, the there were
a couple of uh comments made. One was having training off off outside the
district. If we do that, we have to take the crew offline. So, we'd basically be
paying two crews uh to do it. Uh there's no other training that's within the
response time zones. The the training being very close to the
existing fire hall allows us to keep that crew in an active status and that
that if there is an emergency call, they can respond immediately. Uh getting too
far outside of um you know, too far south or too far north, the trucks won't
be able to respond adequately. Um so there is no other location that we've
currently identified.
» Thank you, Mr. Uh, thank you. I'm going to just do a
followup before I go to councelor Braithweed and that is just the the fire
department does do current training. I think it is in the scout hall or some
other areas. Is there uh and you may not know this question maybe more for the
fire chief but is there a mechanism by which um the frequency of use of this
building is not daily or near daily but is more sort of uh as is used more
episodically and the existing uh sites that are being used continue Mr. Mr. for
him. >> Uh to your worship, I can certainly
explore that with the fire chief and and get a more accurate schedule from him
and get that uh bring that information back to council.
» Councelor Brie. >> Uh thank you, mayor. I'm just wondering
um if this uh if we did want to go and have a meeting with u the neighbors
around um this property uh and it puts um a bit of a delay on this. Is there
would there be any issues with with putting a temporary delay on on passing
this um to give us an opportunity to perhaps get some more information um for
the public and from the public? Graham
» uh through your worship that what I would want to refer to the fire chief. I
know that um if we're not doing training adequately enough we we do fall out of
our our standards but we do have we do have some leeway um currently some of
the training we've been doing um in the parking lot which creates its own issues
with the playground adjacent to it um is meeting the minimum standards but um we
are now falling out of standard. We need we need a structure to work with.
» M Anderson. >> Uh thank you, mayor. I believe Chief
McDonald has joined us online.
» Uh do you want to put that >> Yeah. Do you want to put that question
to the uh Chief McDonald? >> Uh sure. Um, Chief McDonald, I'm not
sure if you heard the question, but it was in regards to um if we uh if we did
um delay this decision uh so that we could go out to the public and perhaps
get more information for them and um for for council, um would that um would that
be an issue for the fire department? >> Go ahead, Chief.
» Hi. Can you hear me, your honor? And >> um yes, I heard the uh the question. Uh
uh thank you and good evening. I have been uh following the uh the past 10
minutes or so. Um yes, if we do delay that that will have somewhat of an
impact on our our day-to-day uh uh training. Uh we can do some limited
interior training at the fire hall, but we can't do multifloor training and we
are extremely limited with regards to our options to perform our provincial
job uh performance requirements under the uh the OFC um playbook and the
provincial training requirements where we can do interior search and multifloor
training. Uh this is one of the few locations that we can actually do it in
the district.
» Thank thank you very much. Um because I I'm just trying to find a a solution um
that we could uh move forward with this but and yet give the the the the
residents an opportunity to have some input into um or to gather more
information for them um to be able to make them feel comfortable about this
happening within their neighborhood as well. And I'm just not really sure how
to go about that. >> Okay.
» Yeah. If I uh uh if I may, um we we c we do have a um a training calendar for the
year and it is possible for us to uh you know de develop a schedule uh that we
can make uh available. We could also uh post it when we do plan on on being on
premises providing our operational schedule uh allows it.
» Thank you for that chief. Um, I guess my other question would be around the
maintenance as well. Um, because that that to me is is kind of shocking um in
regards to uh us allowing a property to be if it's in that sort of disrepair.
Um, I would like to know um from staff if we can up the maintenance on that
property and take care of some of the um the things that the the residents around
there have have talked about tonight because that to me seems like that would
be an issue that we would really want to take care of.
» We give that to the chief. Chief, how's your green thumb?
» Mr. Graham. >> Oh, miss.
» Well, through the chair, I I I can jump in actually in in assistance with to Mr.
Graham. Uh, you know, the fire department does have uh some um some
funds that were allocated for capital uh improvements to support training uh
which you might be able to to work with facilities to provide some uh support
and financial options um uh over the coming uh period of time.
» Wanted to add something? >> Yes. Uh thank you, worship. uh you know,
council could direct staff to uh to consult with the neighbors and have a
conversation with them, report back to council in terms of what we can do, um
you know, u to increase the maintenance and the the costs and resources involved
in that. We can report back to council, but uh that is something that council
could direct staff to do. >> Right. Thank you for that. Uh I'll go to
councelor Green and then I have a question.
» Um are you taking comments yet or just questions at the moment? We don't have a
motion on the floor, but uh so probably try and really keep us to questions at
this point, then we can get some direction from council and speak to that
for comments. [snorts] >> Okay, then through you mayor to staff
and thank you very much um for all the information. Um,
it says in the report that part of the intended use was temporary municipal
offices. And I guess my question is what is required to make those habitable then
given the state of of what the neighbors have reported and and the fact that the
house is being used for something very different at the moment. Um, what was
the plan around um temporary office space? Thank you.
Go >> ahead, Mr. Green.
That will be a question for the applicant.
» Okay. Yeah, Mr. Sorry, I thought I saw you raise your hand. Uh, Mr. Graham, my
my impression here is that the municipal office space is essentially not not
really on the books at this point. >> Uh, through your worship, there's
there's no active plans to do that. It is an emergency backup for business
continuity. If if one of our other facilities had a flood or something like
that, the interior of the building is is clean, usable. There's one toilet that I
would probably replace if I had it. Uh, the roof doesn't leak, the windows are
sealed. Um it is not in uh in inside it is in good condition.
» Thank you. >> Thank you. Um and then I'll my question
is is probably to Mr. Green and I'll sorry I'll go to councelor Smart first.
» Oh thank you um three mayor just a procedural question to staff. Um just
following up on the conversation around the table. Um just trying to take into
consideration the the timelines but the um needs we've heard today. I wondered
if we were potentially to go ahead with option two to approve with conditions
and to request that council um have an opportunity to approve a proposed
maintenance and training um schedule. Would that address some of the um
concerns around um delaying approval of the project um at all or would it have
the same um time implications that were a concern for the chief?
Mr. Green for your worship to council smart I guess um you know council could
approve this with some conditions that are delegated to staff to work with the
applicant on. So you could say that you know council could approve subject to uh
pre a preissuance condition subject to receiving a maintenance plan or a
training schedule from the applicant to address council's concerns or you could
ask for that to come back. You know, the benefit of a temporary use permit is
that council can add whatever generally whatever condition they so choose as
long as it's generally related to that application. That is the benefit of a
temporary use permit. And so council could ask add a specific condition to
that permit. Or you could defer it to receive that information and defer a
decision to a later date. I it would be ideal to a specific date. So then we
wouldn't need to give notification again if you indeed deferred it to a specific
date um to receive that further information. That is also an option for
council as well.
Um and then my question is to Mr. Green and it just touches on
a couple of comments made in the course of the of the discussion and that is
around the uh the uh combining of the two lots. There is certainly some some
value for us to continue to keep them as they as they currently are. Um, so is
there is there a legal require I know the building does straddle both lots.
Um, but is there a legal requirement? Could we do two temporary use permits
essentially bridging both lots or is there a legal requirement for a
temporary permit to be attached to a single lot? Mr. Green,
» thank you worship. No, I guess from the planning department's perspective, we've
been treating this applicant as if they were any other applicant. And so if this
was a private land owner, not the district, then we would have that same
requirement that we would want to try and address that legal non-conforming
nature, i.e. there's an expectation that a property is brought into compliance
with uh the district's zoning bylaw. Acknowledging that if if from a
council's perspective, if council wanted to remove that condition because they
felt that it would be uh more uh beneficial in the long run to have two
legal locks rather than one, then obviously council could delete that
condition. Um but it's just that we would have been essentially acting as a
as this development authority and treating this applicant like we would
treat any other applicant uh in this process.
» Right. Okay. Thank you. And yeah, I guess I'm looking at this really through
the lens of the the the temporary part of the temporary use permit and and try
to minimize the uh both impact and and changes if we since we don't know what
the future holds. So >> I guess there one thing that I would add
is that obviously that is a legal non-conforming building. It cannot the
legal non-conformant can't be exacerbated and so there can be no
changes to that building that would exacerbate any of those existing
non-conformances and without either uh bringing that by bringing that property
into compliance by removing the building and meeting those setbacks or seeking a
development variance permit to en allow those exacerbation of that that variance
or that encroachment. >> Sure. And just to that point, is there
anything in the proposed uses here that that would be anticipated?
» No. Uh your worship, in terms of what the applicant has currently submitted is
an applicant to use that building in its current form with no further changes to
the building in relation to u that legal nonconforming building in relation to F
and um the uh straddling of the uh that legal lot line.
» All right. Thank you very much. Any other questions? If not, we're going
to try and seek a proposed motion here to to speak to councelor Appleton.
» Thank you, worship. So, I will I'll test the will of council here and see whether
this works. Um, so I will uh propose a motion based on option two. So, I will I
will propose to move that council uh approve the temporary use permit for the
property located at 1538 Montterrey Avenue. uh with additional conditions of
use uh of which there are two. Uh firstly that Oak Bay facility services
and the fire service host a joint public information session to outline fire
training scope and schedule and receive feedback with respect to parking and
site upkeep. And secondly, let the applicant explore options to utilize
fire services training capital funds to expand the program of site maintenance.
second that and I would like to put a little amendment on there for one other
condition if I could. We'll >> let the uh the mover speak to it first
and if there's a go ahead councelor Appleton
your comments if you wish to hear councelor brief's proposed motion if you
wish. >> I guess it depends on the scope thereof.
» Sure. >> My my my um amendment would just be
around um a schedule of maintenance for the property to be included. I think
that was essentially included in there that that conversation
» that that was sort of the intent your worship but I think clarifying is fine.
» No, it's fine as long as as long as we have that maintenance for that property
that's great. >> I think there's in the second part of
that is to expand the program of site maintenance. I think we've heard that
the current program of site maintenance is is not adequate. So or at least
as per the discussion. >> So why don't you speak to your motion
councelor Appleton? >> Thank you worship. Um, you know, just
there is there's a balance to be struck here uh with with this and I and I hear
loud and clear from the neighbors and the members of the public that want more
information about what's going on. It represents a change in in use of the
property. There's no doubt about it. Um, there's going to be an unsignificant
amount of activity that's going on around the site and I think that
everybody in the neighborhood deserves a chance to understand really clearly
what's happening um and at what time what to expect. That's important. and at
the same time uh ensuring that the the property as a whole is is kept up and
hopefully you know improved cosmetically as part of the ongoing use of the site
for training. So I think that that would constitute an improvement. I do believe
I am in favor as per the motion of the temporary use permit going ahead now and
it's important for the public to to be reminded of the fact that it is becoming
increasingly more complex for the fire service. Uh fire training requirements
are expanding. Uh we have as the public is well aware we have reduced training
capacity ability on the actual firefighters park site because we were
in need of a new fire apparatus which requires its own building which requires
an expanded footprint. This uh constrains what fire services can do on
the site and at the same time they have expanding training requirements. As has
been referenced here, training cannot happen outside of the district. as we've
talked about around this table many times that we we only have one crew and
so that's while training that service that crew has to be available to deploy
while they're doing that training. So it severely limits the number of potential
options for training sites and and I can certainly recognize that there are uh
suboptimal things about this particular site. It is in close proximity to the
village. Um there's there's certainly a discussion to be had with the local
community about how operations are deployed on the ground and I'm sure our
fire services will work with the community to kind of come up with the
best solution on that side of things. But uh I think that there's a
conversation there to have but I do think that it's important that the
temporary use permit move ahead now with the understanding that uh those services
will consult with the public and have that conversation with the neighbors.
Thank you worship. >> Thank you. Further discussion council in
the briefly. >> Yes, Mayor, if I may. Um the the second
part of that um the second part of those conditions does raise a question for me
and I wonder if I could ask it to staff. It was about the actual source of the
funds for the maintenance. Would that be in order?
» It is. Although I'm not sure they would have an absolute answer at this point.
We had a comment from M from the chief that they may have some funds available.
Mr. Graham as the applicant. I'll give that over to you.
» Uh through your worship, if I understand the question correctly, is is the amount
of funds or where they're coming from. Sorry.
» No, my question was going to be about this motion is very specific as to the
source, but I wondered if it would if there was a possibility that there be
other places where those funds could be sourced from that weren't capital
accounts that could also um solve this problem. So, I just didn't want our
motion necessarily to be too narrow if we we should go broader and that was
with all respect to the mover. >> Mr. Graham,
» uh through your worship, uh we would actually we would actually have to use
an operating account. We can't use a capital account for landscaping and and
upkeep that way. But, uh what we can do is through budget amendments. We can we
can shift money around. I'm paraphrasing, but yes, we can make that
work. >> Thank you. So, if I may, I maybe I would
I if it's possible, I could suggest to the mover that we just make that
language a bit more generic as opposed to pointing to a fund that can't
actually be used. Is that >> to the mover?
» I'm amendable about your worship. Yeah, it's I I understand completely the end
the the the inability to apply capital funds to maintenance. For sure. Um, I
was just reflecting what I've heard, you know, Chief McDonald reference as far as
some available funds and that sort of thing. But, uh, certainly if there were,
uh, operating surplus or another, uh, another location that facility services
might be able to find those operating funds and if necessary amend the
financial bylaw in order to reflect that, then I think that that's certainly
an option as well. >> Sure. If I just before I go on with
other comments, I just probably worthwhile just can you just read the
proposed motion again just so we all have the uh the language fresh in our in
mind. So then I would I guess then I'm looking
to amend part two then your worship because that so I specifically
referenced capital funds but I think it >> with your with the amendment to remove
the >> amendment would be and that the
applicant explore options uh to uh
uh reallocate district funds to expand the program of site maintenance.
» Okay. >> Okay. Thank you. So there's two two
parts to that. One is consultation with neighbors and and improved maintenance.
Is that the two pieces? Okay, councelor Wraithweight.
» Uh yeah, thanks very much. Um and I think this this is far more supportable
than um option one. Um I think that we do have to support our fire department
uh to assist with their fire training, but I also think that we have to support
our the neighbors as well and the residents. So I hope it alleviates some
of um their concerns. Um and I'm sure that if it doesn't and if there's issues
that they'll come back and talk to us. Thank you.
Counc Patterson. >> Yes. Thank you, Mayor. I I will support
the amendment put forward and and in general, I support this. In fact, it's
already being used for this. So, putting into place a temporary use permit is is
is a little late in coming because it is
already being used. But, um I particularly um appreciate the uh
consideration of improved site maintenance. uh because we are not
really being a good neighbor and it if we if we want residents to maintain
their properties in good condition. I think that it uh it's up to us to set
the example. So, and I I I think also um and chief isn't in the room, but I I
think that the fire department will uh be able to review just the logistics of
how the training exercises are carried out because it is a very very public
area, heavily used during the day, and there isn't um there is not an easy way
to cross the street to avoid it unless you go all the way back to the the
crosswalk at the fire hall. So um you know so there are a few things but I
think it we are already putting the building to this use. We understand the
reasons why we have to do this to support our fire department but we can
certainly um look at improving the site conditions for the neighborhood.
» Thank you. Any other speakers on the Oh go ahead. Councelor Green.
» Thank you very much and I too will support the motion. But I just want to
say I think this is a really good lesson for us as as a property owner. Um, we've
talked about a maintenance bylaw in Oak Bay off and on over the years. Um, this
um, unfortunately we we're the poster child for why we need a maintenance
bylaw on this particular home. And that's not a criticism of of anyone, but
I know this house has been the object of many ideas and and and minations about
its future. So, I'm very pleased with the motion. And I um appreciate uh
councelor Appleton's motion and and councelor Braithweight's amendments, but
I I just want to say that, you know, we we must be good neighbors. We are
setting the example for the rest of the community. I think it's really important
and that maybe we have a chance now to sort of reexamine that. I also agree
that we have to support our fire department. Um knowing the chief as I
do, I think he will work hard to develop a working relationship with neighbors. I
think that's an absolute imperative. and I know the neighbors will appreciate
that and I'm sure that they will get back to us if there are any challenges
ahead. Thank you. >> Thank you, Councelor Green. Um I have
one question for the chief with the motion that's on the floor uh to Chief
McDonald through myself. um you know hearing the concerns raised about the
impact on the on the uh parking and on the transport of people and on the
village itself. Um as as the uh schedule is developed uh is it fair to to uh
assume that the fire department will look at the days of use of that
particular house recognizing that some have to be done on twotory as noted. uh
there are some aspects of that that that the house is essentially unique in the
in the readily available sites but that they can look at that as to how often it
has to be used and minimize the use of that site uh to minimize the impact on
the neighborhood. Um so I'm just going to give that over to you chief just
because I think that's one of the concerns that I've heard from the from
the neighbors and I think probably from the business community would would
reflect that as well. >> Uh thank you worship. Um, you know,
excellent point and and yes, the you know, the fire department um can be very
diligent in in developing our training plan to um you know, be very conscious
about the uh you know the options that we have and where we are are using it.
And I think we can also be a bit more mindful with regards to you know how we
are are um managing uh the site when we are on scene and ensure that we do have
a um a safety officer who can either you know stop training and you know shaffer
um you know the public uh through the the area safely and and be um you know a
a respectful neighbor in this regard.
The question was really just at this table because one of the points raised
here was around the uh the direction whether or not to require the um the
staff follow the staff recommendation which I think the current motion does of
amalgamating the two lots or do we want to keep those two lots separate for the
time being subject to future planning with the village area plan. Um, so I
just throw that out there as a for conversation with the council because I
think it was discussed, we should probably be clear in the motion uh going
forward. I would probably suggest if someone
wants to given I think the current motion as it stands would essentially
keep the uh the merging of the two lots that I think any decision by the council
to not do that would probably require a motion to amend the the to give that
direction as part of the motion to to retain the two lots.
» I I think it makes sense to keep the the lot separate actually. Yeah. Um I I I
know that in in the future. >> I was just going to ask if that's if if
you're interested in doing that, just to make an amendment to the to the motion
that >> So I would also include that direction.
» I would move an amendment to um keep the two lots separate and not amalgamate
them >> for the duration
» for the duration of the of the t. >> Is there a seconder for that?
» Okay. Yes. not uh so uh we'll leave that there. Um those are the only two set of
questions I wanted to make sure we clarified before we move forward with
any other pieces. Any other discussion? So the motion on
the floor is to approve the TUP but subject to uh consultation with
neighbors on the use and and the impacts and uh dedication of resources to
improve the maintenance of that lot.
So I'm going to and put that to question. All those in favor and those
opposed, seeing none opposed, that carries. Uh that was a more complicated
application than I was anticipating. So, thank you everybody for the uh for the
discussion and thank you very much to the neighbors for coming out and sharing
your experiences uh and uh and input. Um you're welcome to everybody's welcome
to stick around, but uh you don't have to. [snorts] Um because we move on to
10.3, which is another temporary use permit. Um, and this one for Cadbury Bay
Road and Cranmore Load Road parking lot. Uh, we've had a number of pieces of
correspondence on this one. Uh, and I'll give this over to Mr. Hatfield. Welcome.
Thank you, worship. This is another district initiated temporary use permit
application for council's consideration. This application is for the unadressed
district-owned parking lot located at the corner of Cadaro Bay Road and
Cranmore Road. The purpose of this application is to permit the use of the
property for a limited recycling depot use for a period of three years. The
applicant for this application is the district's engineering department. This
application was initiated by the district in line with council direction
received at a special council meeting held on June 15th, 2026. Staff were then
directed to participate in the capital regional districts beyond the curb
initiative and prepare and submit a temporary use permit application for the
subject property in question. Planning staff are recommending the
temporary use permit application be approved based on the proposal's
alignment with district official community plan policy. The proposed
temporary use also represents a service level enhancement to the existing
recycling drop off services offered to residents while posing no cost to the
district. No permanent site changes are proposes are proposed and operations
would be limited to weekends from 8 a.m. to 6 pm as a condition of the temporary
use permit that staff are recommending avoiding the peak congestion in this
area often associated with school operations.
Planning staff are here to uh answer your applications and speak to the
application. Steve Renick, the uh district's director of engineering
public works is present today to answer any questions council might have on this
application as well. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. Did you wish I had
anything uh director Renick? >> Uh thank you very much, Mr. Mayor. No, I
believe that uh between the discussion that we had in June and Mr. Hatfield's
introductory comments, um I think I'm I'm happy to take questions.
» All right. Thank you very much. We have had some correspondence from the public
on this. Um and I'll turn it over to the members of council for questions. I'll
go to councelor Smart and then brief. >> Thank you um through Mayor um to
director Renick. Um my first question was just with regards to whether or not
parking within the parking lot will be um reserved to allow people to park in
the lot when they're using the facilities. I just wondered if there's a
parking plan at this point. Mr. Rick,
» uh through the mayor, we had not intended on having reserved parking in
that lot for uh the use of the depot. Uh ultimately putting restrictions on
municipal parking lots is something that council has delegated to staff. I think
that if we were seeing a persistent problem of people parking vehicles there
and then walking to the rec center or something like that and and impeding the
ability for that site to be used for recycling, uh I think we would have
tools in the toolbox to be able to manage that.
» Anything else? >> Uh yes, through you may director. My
other question was just with regards to some of the emails we received and I
wondered if can you um uh remind us is street parking enforced on the weekends
um just if there's some incorrect parking
» Mr. Renick Mr. B. >> Thank you, Mayor. To you. Um, during the
weekends, uh, there is less enforcement uh on parking. However, if there are uh
serious things that need to be addressed, a way
police will be able to address those. Thanks,
» Dr. Smart. >> Thank you. and three emerges. My last
question is just with regards to um has there been communication or response
from the the school district on this? >> Give it to staff I think for the
notification I think or Mr. Enick. >> Uh thank you through the mayor. They
school district would have received a notification because the high schools
within the notification window but I'm not aware of any response from the high
school or from school district 61.
Breathway. >> Thanks very much. Yeah, mine was around
traffic as well because there there's no I know there we haven't done a traffic
study around that area. Um but um [clears throat]
there there may there could be um people queuing up for to get in and out of that
um to drop off. And I'm wondering whether or not um the vehicles uh could
be interfering with emergency access because of the the fireh hall being so
close by. And I'm wondering if there's anything in place for that or if you
have any anticipation of there being that many vehicles that could interfere
with emergency access. >> Mr. Renick,
» uh through the mayor, I don't see the amount of vehicles really being a major
concern and ultimately uh they are vehicles. They do have a requirement to
to pull the right and stop if they hear an emergency vehicle approaching with
with lights and sirens on. So, uh, on the whole, I I I don't think that's a
concern.
» Patterson. >> Yes. Thank you, Mayor. And I I would,
uh, through you to staff. Just wondering if there has been any further
considerational for directional traffic because the traffic can approach that
site either from Cranmore or from Cadbur Road. um Cadro Bay Road, of course, it's
the bus stop and the uh the crosswalk is located in that location. And while
Sunday it may be quieter, Saturday it's very busy busy pedestrian and traffic
flow. Um so I I I fail to understand how we will have um smooth interaction
between the cycling lane, the pedestrian crosswalk and vehicles if they're coming
from both directions and and then exiting. So I just like further
clarification to see if staff have given that more consideration.
» Mr. uh through the mayor. Similar to the
response with regard to the parking restrictions, I I think that those are
are tools that we can use in consultation with the operator if we do
see a need. I do understand the concern that's being raised of well, would it be
better for the flow of traffic if it was if you made one entrance the entrance uh
and and the other one the exit? But then you have the concern of well now do
people have to make a left turn off of Cadro Bay Road in order to get into the
site when they would rather come around from the Cranmore side for example. And
I I'm just overall of the opinion that I think we should see the site in
operation before we make changes to how the vehicles uh enter and exit it.
» Yes, thank you. So for clarification, what I'm hearing then is that if this is
if if this goes forward tonight, the staff will be still monitoring this and
making adjustments as ne necessary to protect the safety of uh pedestrians and
cyclists too. >> Mr. Rick
» through the mayor that is 100% correct. >> All right. Thank you.
Other questions? There's a process here. As there's no
more questions, we'll go to the public for comments and we'll come back to this
table for potential direction. Um, I think I'll leave my questions for the
time being and and invite members of the public who wish to speak to council. We
do have some correspondents for consideration. Please come on in.
You probably heard the process before. We try to be not intimidating. Just uh
have a seat, turn on the microphone, which is the center button. Perfect. and
then just state your name, municipality of residence, and then you have address
council. >> My name is Sasha Vilber, and I'm a
resident of Oak Bay for many years. Uh, and I rent an apartment in one of those
apartment buildings uh near Oak Bay High Oak and I support this temporary use
permit for a recycling site at this location. Um, I think it's a great idea
and I look forward to using it to recycle uh my glass and soft pla
plastics and batteries etc. Um, I hope that this new recycling opportunity will
help to reduce the amount of recyclables in the uh the landfill and um I'd like
to suggest that uh you also put some kind of collection option for um
clothing on the site. [snorts] Um, for example, uh there are those pink uh uh
Lifetime Network bins like the ones at St. Phillips on uh on Easttown. I don't
know if you've seen those. They're in the parking lot. Um and uh those bins
are for clothing, shoes, and um household items like um bedding and toys
and that type of thing. So yeah, thank you.
» Thank you very much. I should just point out uh this is a capital regional
districtwide program that they're driving the the standards with the
bottle depot and setting those. So it's not our program that we're selecting
what kind of services are going there. Uh we're agreeing to a temporary use
permit or not uh to allow a site for them to run that operation. So
» Oh, I see. >> Yeah. So that we the the type of things
like flexible packers, styrofoam, etc. batteries, light bulbs are set by the uh
by this regional program, not by Oak Bay.
» Okay. Well, um >> you can just have a seat down so people
at home can hear if you have anything else. I'm just just for your
clarification. It wasn't >> Yeah. Oh, I see. Okay. Yeah. Um, so I
just for your clarification, um, I just want to say that it this, uh, Coastal
Networks, um, is an organization that like they, uh, they run the the bins and
they have people pick things up and, um, and regularly empty them. They don't
allow things to overflow from the bins and uh, they have uh, phone numbers on
the bin to contact if there's any problem. Um, and yeah, so yeah,
» thank you very much. Thank you. >> Um, any other members of the public
either online or in person wish to speak?
Okay, I have uh Mr. Zulka online. You're welcome to uh to address council. Just
unmute you. There we go. Same process as before. Name and municipality, please.
» Uh, wonderful. You can hear me? Okay. >> Can please go ahead.
» Lovely. Uh, hello uh um uh your worship uh counselors. My name is Eric Zelka in
the north part of Oak Bay. Uh, thank you for the time to speak today. I stand
before you firmly opposed to the temporary use permit for the proposed
recycle depot at Cadbury Bay Road and Cranmore Road parking lot. While the
idea of expanded recycling sounds appealing, it sounds great. Sounds like
we're doing something. Yay. The practical evidence and realities and the
direct impacts on our community simply do not justify this location. If you
absolutely must proceed with this, then the district Oak Bay lands north of
Cedar Hill crossroads at Henderson Recreation Center uh which are not used
on the weekend. It appears might be much more appropriate or possibly Harleen
Point uh might be a good place. Both those areas have very few services
available and uh might as well spread the services around across Oak Bay uh
and because they would have fewer impacts on on a residents. And first we
must acknowledge the actual efficacy of what we're collecting. The narrative
around soft plastics and styrofoam is highly misleading. According to numerous
news reports, including from the CBC, only about 5% of this soft plastic waste
and styrofoam is actually recycled. Soft plastics normally jam up processing
machinery, etc., etc., and end markets often reject mixed or contaminated bales
of it. It ultimately ends up being burned, sent out of province, goes to
landfill, etc., etc. um uh we're forcing uh a local
neighborhood disruption for a global processing system that is fundamentally
broken. And by the way, the the current system was built assuming everything
could be sent to China. China no longer receives our recycling. So um uh it'd be
interesting to see how much money we're actually making from styrofoam and soft
plastics uh from our current operations. Recycle BC suggests 98% of materials
actually collected are recycled. Having worked for this BC government and seeing
many, many failed initiatives with great marketing, I do not believe those
numbers. Second, I question the basic necessity of this new site. We already
have a working facility, the district's dropoff depot public works yard on Elgen
Street, just north of Oak Bay, down the road from this site. It already accepts
soft plastics and styrofoam. Importantly, that Oak Bay facility is
already fully staffed and open to residents on Saturdays. Duplicating this
exact smelly service beside a school and in the middle of residential area makes
no sense. And finally, we must consider the severe impact on the immediate
neighbors. There's a vast difference between community youth fundraiser uh
and and a recurring depot. The impact to community groups such as the Fifth Gary
Oak Scout Group, the Girl Guys, and other community groups who already do
bottle collection uh such as the one in Canarvin Park. Uh those one-day
localized volunteer events are are fantastic. They will be impacted by
this. Uh what is being proposed with this permit is completely different
operation. This depot will be staffed by return of personnel handling depot
deposit materials. Introducing a cash exchange for empties guarantees a steady
stream of heavy traffic. People will be lugging bags of clinking bottles and
cans in a residential area, broken glass, etc., etc. These are realities.
If you any of you have actually tried to return uh stuff down to to the uh um
return it facilities downtown, constant vehicle idling, noise and disruption
that's entirely inappropriate for this location. How will you, council,
guarantee that no leftover garbage, broken glass or smell will be left over
uh for the for the schools and for the neighbors to deal with? And finally, how
will parking be maintained at the end of this TUP since this um permit says it
must be returned to the zoning as indicated and that zoning does not allow
parking. So again, the TU has to be modified in this case. I urge council to
deny this permit should you happen to silly to in my opinion go ahead. Thank
you. Bye. >> Thank you councelor Zilka.
Uh, any other members of the public who wish to address council?
I'm just going to pass one question off to staff. Um, my understanding of this
is can you just clarify the uh um the funding of refundable deposits? Is this
a return for cash or is it a drop off uh facility without payment?
» Thank you for the question, Mr. Mayor. Uh this was the first that I had heard
about it being a cash refundable. Uh certainly the way the program was
presented to us by the CRD was that it was a drop off recycling. Um certainly
do not anticipate that it's being cash returns.
» All right. So we may want to make that
clarification as part of our approval of the T if that's a concern of council. Um
uh any other questions? Uh, I don't see any other members of the public who wish
to address council. If you wish to speak for a second time,
we don't usually allow that, but you're >> I very much appreciate it.
» Very brief. >> Thank you again. It's Eric Zelka in
North Oak Bay. The staff report, if you read it carefully, it actually talks
about returnables before cash with exchange. It's in the staff report. So,
if you approve this, you are approving [gasps] money exchanged by the return of
st personnel. Please read the >> Mr. Zelka.
» Thank you, Mr. Zelka. It does refer to refundable beverage containers. It does
not speak specifically to it, the refunding happening at the site. Um, if
you could just make your comments briefly. We don't usually have
secondary. >> I didn't hear a lot of um support like
um backup for the assertions just made and um I support uh your idea of just
going ahead and doing it and seeing how things go. I mean, I look in our garbage
cans every day at the building I live in.
» That's fine. >> They need to try something.
» Yeah. Thank you for your comments. >> Uh, I'm just going to make sure every
member public that wishes to speak has a chance to speak. I don't see any other
hands raised though at this time to speak. Oh, Mr. B, please come forward.
Same process. Name, municipality, residents.
Then I'm going to bring it back to this table for discussion and direction.
if you just turned it off. >> Hello everyone, mayor and council. Thank
you again. Uh my name again is Anton Brackage, resident of Oak Bay. Um
from from what I've heard, I think this this sounds like a perfectly reasonable
thing to approve. I would support it as well. Um, [sighs]
and I would say that I I would agree with this that the what criticisms we've
heard of it do not appear to be particularly wellounded in my view.
Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Brackich. One more chance for the members of the
public to address council.
All right. Seeing none, I'm going to come back to this table. Uh, I'm going
to seek there is there's I'll just see if there's any questions before I go to
seeking a motion. No more questions. Go ahead, Council Watson. Uh, yeah. I'd
like to move the staff recommendation that council approve temporary use
permit TUP00002 for the property located at the corner
of Cadar Bay Road and Crmore Road. >> Second.
» Seconded. Thank you. Just to speak briefly to you. Uh yeah, just to say I
think this is a great initiative and it's a lovely marriage between a program
that the CRD is willing to come forward and do and our own uh needed direction
to staff to find some options for pedestrians and cyclists to be able to
uh access recycling facilities within the community. So I think uh it solves
it it it solves that issue uh really beautifully and provides um regular
access to the same kind of facility that they don't have access to at the
municipal yard. Thank you. >> Thank you Appleton.
» Thank you worship. So certainly support what's on the table here. I I I guess I
would call the public and and council's attention is is very good timing. There
was actually an article presented on the CBC just today um with respect to what
they referred to as wish cycling which is sort of crosscontamination of
recyclables um and how this has actually become a significant concern in some
other municipalities u as council's probably aware and staff
certainly knows that you we're required when operating our municipal recycling
systems to keep uh contamination by other materials down below a certain
level or actually in some cases risk financial penalties and
in and in uh certain situations too much contamination can obviously result in
the whole load of recyclables not being recycled and in fact landfilled. So
there was just a recent article about how significant the issue is becoming.
So this I think really provides a directed opportunity for us to provide
an opportunity for folks to recycle things which are not bluebox. Many
things are not bluebox materials. Some things are not available for recycling
at our current dropoff depot. Uh so provides a real tactile and a real
practical way for people to minimize crosscontamination which has real uh
real concrete and uh significant potential results for the district if
contamination be expands beyond a certain level. So it has a lot of
practical benefits in my mind your worship. Thank you.
» Thank you very much councelor Green. >> Thank you very much and I'm happy to
support the motion. I think we also have a year in which to assess the location
in terms of traffic safety and public pedestrian safety and so on. And I think
um neighbors will have a chance to weigh in and uh so we have a a year to sort of
trial this program and I think it's it's a good opportunity to do that. But I am
mindful of some of the concerns that have been expressed about traffic noise
and parking.
» Uh thank you councelor Patterson. Yes. Thank you, mayor. Well, I I guess I'm
hesitant at supporting this, but uh I I recognize it is a temporary use.
However, I I must admit I am a bit disappointed that we are placing yet
more traffic flow in in a in a part of the community where where people have
already expressed so many concerns about transportation issues and I live through
that daily. So, I I certainly appreciate those those concerns and uh I think that
while we are considering this, we haven't as a council um received a
transportation overview of this area and how it does function and the changes and
how they will be monitored um to ensure that we are not um it it feels like
we're overburdening a part of the uh community uh that is
already taking more than their share of the burden while relieving it from from
other areas. And so I just put those comments out there while I I support
some of the initiative by the CRD and certainly it will provide the
opportunity for people to access this on foot or or other methods like that. Um,
I could see certainly where it it also could add to a lot of the transportation
problems that the area is already experiencing. So, while I'll support it,
I think that we we need to we need to pay more attention to what we're doing
transportation in that whole area. Thank you.
» Thank you very much. Um, don't see any other discussion. I just want to raise
the flag. I think the the question was raised and and it seem to be just a lack
of clarity on the on the question of whether or not this would be acting as a
as a commercial payer of refundables. Uh and so I think if that's not part of I
mean I will point out there is payable refundables immediately across the
street basically at Savon Foods and at the liquor store. And so if there's
something we don't we want to be able to receive them but don't want this become
a commercial transaction place we may want to make that as a condition of the
of the top at least we get the information back. So Miss Hunt
» yeah thank you your worship I did actually have a look at the CRD's beyond
the curb website and it says beverage containers and in brackets donation
only. So I don't believe that they are thank you for looking that up. I was
trying to find it but a few too many things going on here. Uh thank you for
that clarification. So I don't think we need any more clarification for that. Um
and I don't see any other hands. I'm going to call the question. All those in
favor? Any opposed? None opposed. Uh thank you very much. I move to 10.4 uh
which is a correspondence management policy update. Miss Anderson, this was
before committee of the whole and there's been a couple of changes based
on the feedback. Uh so over to you for the uh for the update.
» Uh thank you mayor. That was my opening comments. [laughter]
Um but it is providing clarity for council corresponding with the public
related to governance related matters and correspondence timelines and process
when it relates to bylaws subject to public hearing. So the revisions are
incorporated into the version before you for consideration of approval.
» Thank you very much. It is subject to public input. So I'll take questions
first and then public and then back to this table. I have please wait then.
» Thanks very much mayor. Um and thanks so much for um implementing those um those
suggestions from last week. That was awesome. Um, and I I just have one
question in regards to the to the words disregarded and deleted when it comes to
um, council submissions around the public hearing process. Um, I I'm just
wondering I I understand the legal reasoning for that, but I'm just
wondering whether um, deleting correspondents might raise questions.
So, I'm wondering if it might be more appropriate to say that the
correspondence would will not be considered as part of the public hearing
process, but will be retained as part of the corporate record rather than
deleted, or is there a reason why we would say um disregarded and deleted?
» Miss Anderson was looking at Mr. Bull, you can hand
this off if you want.
I give it to Mr. Paul. Thank you, Mayor. Um um this is I haven't looked at the
legislation, but we we could. And uh um I think that there's another uh set of
correspondents. I think that gets provided later after the decision is
made. So I think this could be treated the same, but also look at Miss Anderson
who has spent more time on this policy than I have. So thanks.
» Yes. Thank you. said um 9.5 is in relation to correspondence received by
council members. So it is sitting in your inboxes. It isn't a corporate
record at that point. So there would need to be a transaction between the
council member forwarding it to corporate in order for it to be on file
with us. And that there it does muddy the waters on what is being considered
as part of the public hearing package at that point. So when it hits the inboxes
of those individual council members, it would be better to disregard and delete
because then there couldn't be any confusion that it had been considered as
part of the public hearing. >> Thank you. That makes sense. Thank you.
» Thank you, Council Wson. >> Uh yes, thank you. And I also have a
question for Miss Anderson. And it's just a clarification. um when the when
the up Thank you for the updates to the draft on the flowchart
document uh the correspondence flowchart attachment three on the second page
there's just something that I didn't quite understand and it may not have
gotten updated at the same time as the rest of the policy did and it's stream
five and that would be on page 140 of the agenda or I think it's page 20 of
your report um it says council members members who have received correspondence
after public hearing deadline but before decision. So that's the item and then it
says inform the member of the public that at the public hearing they will
have the opportunity to be heard or to present written submissions for the
public record. The chronology the chronology of that doesn't make sense to
me. It speaks to something about correspondence after the public hearing
but it gives advice for what to do before the public hearing. So I just
wonder if I'm missing something there.
I think that's referring to the public hearing deadline, not the public hearing
per se. >> Okay. So, as long as you guys know what
that me I I I couldn't parse that, but [laughter]
maybe it just is missing a word. Anyway, I'll leave that to you.
» And thank you through the mayor. We could we we can update this to include
the deadline more more consistent language with the policy if it would
make it easier. >> Yeah, it would. Cuz I actually couldn't
follow it. So I would I would certainly appreciate that. Thank you.
» Yeah, it's I I hear what you're saying. I think the wording is correct, but I
think part of it is just because the carriage return happens after, you know,
correspondence after public hearing and so you sort of trigger that that's after
the public hearing, but of course it continues on deadline. And so I think
anyway, I don't think it affects the actual uh policy. I think that can be
either a formatting thing or just some minor clarification language changes.
Any other comments or questions at this point? Uh, anybody from the public wish
to address this item on the agenda, which is a 10.4 correspondence
management policy?
Take a moment. Nope. Nobody has raised their hand online or in person. So, I'll
come back to this table for direction. >> I'll move the recommendation. This
» is for approval of the correspondence management policy. Thank you. Moved and
seconded. Um any further discussion? There's no we had a robust de discussion
on this a committee of the whole. So I don't uh anybody's wondering why this is
going through so smoothly. That is why all those in favor. Any opposed? None
opposed. Thank you very much Miss Anderson for that report and for joining
us tonight to be here to present it. Uh we move then to section 11. This
Saturday is not for public input um uh relating to bylaws and permits. 11.1 is
for 2630 Margate Avenue. This is a zoning bylaw amendment. Miss Claver is
with us again to uh to introduce this item and the applicant is here as well.
Please go ahead. >> Thank you. Um mayor and council, this
report uh as you noted refers to a zoning bylaw amendment application for
the property located at 2630 Market Avenue. The application specifically
seeks a sightsp specific amendment to facilitate the construction of a new
single family dwelling and an associated patio directly outside of the rear of
the property of the residence. Um there is a protected mature uh atlas cedar in
the boulevard and so the sighting of the new residence specifically is cited um
to avoid um or or at least to protect the critical tree uh root system of this
tree. Um and also because of the sloping of the site the the house is positioned
exactly where it is. Um because under the district zoning bylaw um patios um
exceeding 8 in above natural grade um do trigger uh or fall under the definition
of floor area and floor area and uh being a measurement of density if uh
[snorts] you exceed the allowance um a zoning bylaw amendment is required.
Hence why we're here today. So um a tree management plan uh was submitted. Uh so
it did consider this mature tree as well as the remaining site. Um the parks
department did evaluate this tree management plan. Um and the walkway
actually was uh from the the front entrance was actually redesigned to
consider parks department referral comments. Um and ultimately they're
they're satisfied with the current plan. Um, ultimately the amendment is pretty
limited in scale. It represents a pretty modest exceedence of the permitted floor
area and lot coverage. Um, and which this primarily relates to the inclusion
of the elevated patio. So ultimately staff recommend first, second, and third
reading as well as adoption of the bylaw tonight. Thank you.
» Thank you very much, Miss Claver. Are there any questions for the applicant or
staff? Please go ahead, councelor Braithweight, and then Um, thanks very
much, Mayor. I have two questions. Um, the one would be if we did accuse um
approve this amendment, could a future owner uh choose to enclose the patio
without getting a zoning amendment, >> M. Clever.
» So, it would have to fit uh specifically the the variances that were we're
including in this bylaw amendment speak to the lot coverage and the F or the
floor area. And ultimately we've increased it ever so slightly. I think
you could see it's at 32% and um.5 for F to include to include sorry to inclo in
why can't I speak tonight [laughter] to make the patio incl.
[laughter] Can we do some bloopers please? um
ultimately that would trigger even further and so ultimately that would
very likely exceed what is being um approved tonight and so we would have to
come back um to council. >> Thank you for that. And then my second
question um is uh the the rear um setback the required rear set setback is
like 7.6 6 meters, but the proposal is providing like 18.74 meters. Um, which
is quite large. And I'm wondering if there was any consideration given to
moving the house slightly forward if it would still protect the trees. Um, it's
probably a question for the proponent. Um, just because then because you do
have such a a large rear setback in the in the back.
» Sure. So, just need to state your name and municipality residence and then you
can answer the question. >> Sure. Hi, my name is Louis Harvat. Good
evening, mayor, council. Um, so if I understand the question correctly, it is
it if we were to move the building forward toward the toward the street.
Um, so we haven't considered that only because of the root zone of the tree,
the root zone is right is touching our building right now. So it's it's as far
forward as we would like to push it. Um, yeah. [clears throat]
» Okay. Thank you. Any other questions for staff or the applicant?
I'm not seeing it. It's usually a good sign. Yeah.
» Um so, uh I'll turn to the council to see if someone wishes to
» I'll move that council give first and second reading to zoning bylaw number
3531 1986 amendment bylaw number 4976 2026.
» Second move and seconded. Any discussion?
Not seeing any. All those in favor? Any opposed? Not opposed, please carry. I'll
move that council give third reading to zoning bylaw number 3531 1986 amendment
bylaw number 4976 2026 >> and seconded. Thank you. There is a
debate on third reading. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed.
» And I'll move that council adopt zoning bylaw number 3531 1986 amendment bylaw
number 4976 2026. >> Seconded. Thank you. Uh before I call
the question, since there's unanimous agreement on this, just want to
congratulate you and uh wish you all the best with the project. It'll be it'll be
a lovely project and a lovely street. So, good luck. All those in favor? Any
opposed? None opposed? Car. Yeah. Thank you. Uh moving on then to item 11.2.
This is 310 King George Terrace zoning bylaw amendment. Mr. Green, this is an
application we had some time ago, but with some modifications.
» Yeah, thank you. This item relates to a zoning amendment application that
council gave three readings to on November the 24th, 2025.
Since that time, the applicant has received updated survey information from
the surveyor for the subject property, which has altered the proposed lot
layout. Because the proposed CD8 zone was specifically for this proposed
subdivision of the subject property, amendments are also required to the zone
to accommodate the updated survey information specifically in relation to
the minimum lot size and minimum lot width. As such, staff are recommending
that council receive third reading of the zoning amendment bylaws and that
council amend the bylaw and give third reading to the bylaw. Staff are also
recommending that a section 219 covenant be registered as a charge on title to
secure the accessible washroom for the secondary suite and either lot two, lot
three or lot four and ensure that a residential fire sprinkler system is
installed in each of the residential units to address the concerns of the
fire department. The applicant is also here to answer any questions that
council may over the application and also happy to answer any questions that
council may have on the uh application. >> Thank you. very convenient having the
same applicant for for two applications, but I'm too bad that you're here at the
end of the night, not the beginning. Uh, councelor Brieweight.
» Uh, thanks very much, Mayor. And I just wanted to um clarify from staff that um
aside from the res uh revised survey and corresponding lot dimensions that no
other aspect of the development has changed, including building size, floor
area, setbacks, landscaping, anything like that.
» Mr. Green, >> that is correct. There's only those
changes to the minimum lot area and the minimum lot width that has changed as a
result of that updated survey information and that was a result of a
posting plan adjacent to this property which then required the surveyor of this
property to submit a new posting for this property which then resulted in
this ability to change the proposed plan of subdivision.
» Thank you. And then my my next question um is uh does the narrower lot create
any challenges for uh emergency access?
» So the the proposed common property i.e. The access driveway for these four lots
is below 6 m which is the cut off for when a fire department requires those
buildings to be sprinkled. And that is the reason for the section 219 that
would require the four buildings to be sprinkled at time of building permit.
And we're recommending that this be dealt with through a section 219. So
that at the time of building permit uh that that covenant will be on title for
the building department to know that there is a requirement for those four
buildings to be sprinklered. Thank you, Mr. Barv. I can just get you to turn off
your microphone. It's just that's okay. Thank you. Uh just prevents any feedback
loop from happening. Uh any other questions for staff or the applicant?
Councelor Watson. >> Yes, I do. Um actually, um it's about
the sprinkling requirements in the driveway width and I just wondered um
the sprinkling adds, you know, I don't know proportionally,
but it certainly adds cost to the project. And I wondered if the
alternative of widening the driveway access was one of the things that was
considered if you could meet those fire requirements without having sprinkling
and if that was something that was ever discussed with the applicant or a
possibility. >> Mr. Green uh through your worship to
council Watson. Yes, that was a a comment back to the applicant to say
that they the new plan of the subdivision had a a driveway with less
than six meters which was the requirement for our fire department and
as such the applicants had already agreed that the buildings would be happy
to be sprinkling those buildings. >> Yeah. So, if I could also just direct
can I direct a question to the applicant just so that I I'm clear about that.
Were you actually able to consider widening the driveway as an alternative
to sprinkling? Was that was that a design process that you actually contemp
you you thought through that that might have saved you the cost of sprinkling?
Maybe it was six of one half dozen of the other. I don't know.
» Um, >> yes. Uh, we did we did look at widening
the driveway. Um, what ends up happening is the driveway width comes closer to
the south property line and there are a number of trees that we're planting and
we're trying to salvage along that property line. So, that's one reason we
didn't want to do it. Um the second reason is uh it increases the
impermeable paving. So I I think we're at our limits right now with impermeable
coverage. >> So So that's another reason that we we
decided not to do it. >> Great. Thank you. I just wanted to
understand that. Great. >> Thank you. I don't see any other
questions and we don't have public input on this item. So I'll need someone to go
through. There's a number of uh of bylaws that have to be read into the
record. Uh so if we can start somewhere, >> uh your worship, I would move that
council resend the third reading of zoning bylaw number 3531 1986, amendment
bylaw number 4937 2025. >> Second.
» Seconded. Thank you. Any discussion? >> Go ahead, councelor Brie.
» Uh thanks. Um, I actually um went back and looked on this one because I
remember it um coming to council before and I I did vote in opposition of this
um based on what I felt was the neighborhood fit and density. Um and
that rationale for me is is really largely unchanged. I think it's I think
you'll end up with a nice product, but I think that for me it's it's a little bit
too much density for that neighborhood fit. So I I'm I'm probably going to end
up voting against all of these which seems weird to be voting against a
resins and then um so I might vote for the first two but then I'll be voting
against the the the next ones. So thank you.
» Understood. I appre always appreciate comments of voting against things. Uh so
we have a mover and a seconder uh for the motion to resend. Uh see no
discussion. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. I worship I would
move the council amend zoning by law number 3531 1986 amendment by law number
4937205 by a revising the minimum lot area in
section 7.8.5 uh subsection 1 to 286 square meters and
b revising the minimum lot width in section 7.8.5 subsection 3 to 5.5 m.
» Seconded. Thank you. Any discussion? All those in favor? Any opposed? None
opposed. Please continue. >> I would move your worship the council
give third reading to zoning by number 3531 1986 amendment bylaw number 4937
2025 as amended. >> Second.
» Seconded. Any discussion? Seeing none. All those in favor and
those opposed. Council braith oppose. That carries.
» This is a large one you worship. Uh, I would move that council direct staff to
work with the applicant on a covenant under section 219 of the land title act
registered prior to adoption of zoning bylaw number 3531 1986 amendment bylaw
number 49372025 as a charge against title to all of the
land in the proposed comprehensive development zone that secures a the
provision of an accessible washroom for the secondary suite on either stratalot
2, three or four and b the provision of residential potential fire sprinkler
systems for all units in the development in compliance with the BC building code,
BC fire code and building and plumbing bylaw number 4247.
» Second move and seconded any discussion seeing none. All those in favor any
opposed councelor Braithweight to oppose that carries.
Uh so this is not for adoption at this point. We come back for a future uh
piece of that correct subject. Okay. Thank you. Uh we then moved to good luck
with the project. Although we'll come back here for final adoption after all
those things are done. Uh we now move to uh sessions items 113 through 116. These
are all related to the uh blasting regulation changes. Um Mr. B, I'll let
you provide the introduction for all four and then I'll I'll go through them
procedurally. >> Thank you. Um the new blasting and rock
breaking bylaw uh represents the culmination of a review that began in
2020 in response to resident concerns regarding blasting activities in Oak
Bay. Since that time, staff have completed technical review work and
multiple rounds of public and industry consultation and the proposed regulatory
framework in the bylaws now seeks to balance community livability objectives
with the practical and safety considerations raised throughout the
process. Um, as the bot implemented, staff will
continue to monitor uh its effectiveness and we would report back to council on
any significant issues or recommended amendments that might emerge through
experience with the new regulations. Um, yeah, today these four bas are in front
of you for adoption and that would introduce the new regime as of tomorrow
and we have done our preparations. We still have some to complete uh but we're
largely prepared for this change. Thank you.
» Great. Thank you very much, Mr. B. Uh, are there any questions on any of these
before I get to the motions? Go ahead, Council Green. Oh, go ahead, Council. We
had questions. >> I think she was going to move.
» Oh, I was going to make a motion. >> I just had a really quick question. Um,
there there I noticed that it says one blasting permit every 12 months. And I'm
wondering what happens if a project like legitimately has requires two blasting
phases. Do we just have to grant an exemption in that case?
Mr. B. >> Thank you, Mayor. For you, there there
is an option to either extend the permit uh for certain reasons. That might be
one option. And the other option uh for an extra permit, I'm not quite sure. Um
but um yeah, that might be through council decision if the pilot doesn't
give staff that option. Thanks. >> Thank you.
Green, >> I'm prepared to make a motion. Second,
» can I just uh I need you to read it into the motion to the record, please. So,
for 11.3. >> Sorry.
» I just need that council adopt blasting and rock breaking by number 4958 2026.
» Moved and seconded. Uh any discussion? Okay. All those in favor? Any opposed?
Not opposed. That carries. Can you just continue on council brace if you have it
handy for 11.4 >> uh for um 11.4? Yeah. I I'll move that
council adopt anti noise bylaw number 3210 1997 sorry 1977 amendment bylaw
number 4960 2026. >> Seconded. Thank you. Any discussion on
adoption? Seeing none. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed.
And I'll move that council adopt building and plumbing bylaw number 4247
2005 amendment bylaw number 49592026 and seconded. Thank you. Uh all those in
favor opposed and 11.6.
» I'll move that council adopt planning building and development fees and
charges bylaw number 48452023 amendment bylaw number 49612026
blasting. >> Move and seconded. Thank you. All those
in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. Is there any new business or notices
emotions? Not seeing any. We will see you all here
in September. Uh so have a great August >> and uh hopefully there's no emergency
meetings before. Before that, uh we move now to adjournment. I have a motion to
adjurnn. Move second. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. 929
and 59 seconds. Just squeeze under the 9:30 barrier.
Thank you everyone. [sighs]