1 00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:02,200 at a time. 2 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:07,760 » All right, cool. >> We're good to go. 3 00:19:05,360 --> 00:19:11,840 » I call the August 18th of 2026 meeting and planning zoning commission to order. 4 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:15,200 Consider a motion for approval of the minutes from the August 5th, 2026 5 00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:19,360 planning zoning session. Do we have a motion to approve these minutes? 6 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:22,000 » I'll make a motion to approve. Do we have a second? 7 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:26,080 » I'll second. >> We have a motion to second to approve 8 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:27,679 the minutes. Any discussion? If not, all in favor say I. 9 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:33,360 » I. >> I. Opposed. Motion [clears throat] 10 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:37,200 passes. Is there any old business? We have no unfinished business. So, 11 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:41,039 we'll proceed to the new business. First item on our agenda tonight is a public 12 00:19:39,039 --> 00:19:45,440 hearing to discuss review proposed amendment to accessory use of 13 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:49,039 development and operation standard. Operational standard. Does the staff 14 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:52,720 have a report? Yes. Thank you, chairman. So, at the 15 00:19:50,559 --> 00:19:56,480 July 20th board of alderman meeting, the board directed staff to prepare report 16 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:59,840 to the planning zone commission regarding proposed amendment to the 17 00:19:57,919 --> 00:20:03,919 unified development code or UDC to reduce the minimum setback requirements 18 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:07,120 for accessory structures. The city's current accessory structure regulations 19 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:12,880 were established with the adoption of the UD in 2003. The UDC establishes the 20 00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:16,240 zoning district's development standards and regulations for accessory 21 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:19,840 structures, including the requirements, the current requirements that accessory 22 00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:26,160 structures be located a minimum of 8 ft from the rear and side property lines. 23 00:20:24,080 --> 00:20:29,600 So, our current standards uh apply to those accessory structures um as 24 00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:33,200 accessory uses to the principal residential use and establishes the 25 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:37,679 standards governing their location, size, height, and placement. In 26 00:20:35,360 --> 00:20:43,679 reviewing other cities codes, which is in your packet, um you can see that Blue 27 00:20:40,799 --> 00:20:48,000 Springs is two and a half feet for rear setback and two and a half feet for side 28 00:20:45,360 --> 00:20:53,679 setback. Grain Valley, Odessa, Belton, Independence, and Peculiar are all five 29 00:20:49,919 --> 00:20:57,760 feet rear and five feet for the side. Oak Grove is 8t for rear and eight feet 30 00:20:55,520 --> 00:21:03,840 for side. And Carney is 10 feet rear and eight feet for the side. 31 00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:10,080 Uh so at the July 20th uh board meeting, the Uh they directed staff to bring back 32 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:15,120 um a recommendation to align our code with five feet to be more consistent 33 00:21:12,799 --> 00:21:18,400 with our peer cities and neighbors. Staff does find the proposed revisions 34 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:21,200 in your packet are consistent with the intent of the unified development code 35 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:25,280 which seeks to promote the orderly growth of the city, reduce unnecessary 36 00:21:23,039 --> 00:21:29,280 regulatory barriers, and ensure zoning regulations adapt to the evolving needs 37 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:32,400 of our community and case and stay current with development practices. 38 00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:35,840 aligning our accessory use setback standards more closely with our peer 39 00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:38,880 cities, promotes efficient land use while maintaining appropriate 40 00:21:37,039 --> 00:21:43,679 development standards. So in your packet is a draft ordinance that would go to 41 00:21:41,679 --> 00:21:48,880 the board. Um you guys certainly can amend that as you wish. So in this you 42 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:53,600 can see where the changes are. Bold underlines are additions, red 43 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:58,000 strikethroughs are deletions. So the 8T for rear setback has been replaced with 44 00:21:55,120 --> 00:22:01,120 five feet. Uh fences and walls um should not be subject to the minimum rear side 45 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:08,000 setback. So you can still put your fence along your property line. And then the 46 00:22:03,120 --> 00:22:11,440 side setback um has been removed in red there you can see and added that 47 00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:14,640 accessory structures should not be required to comply with the side setback 48 00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:18,880 standard that applies to principal uses. So that would be the larger principal 49 00:22:16,559 --> 00:22:22,320 use setback of say 10 ft. Accessory structures other than fencer walls shall 50 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:25,840 however be set back at least 5 feet from side lot lines. Fences and walls shall 51 00:22:24,559 --> 00:22:28,720 be subject to the minimum side step setback requirements of accessory 52 00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:34,720 structures. We wanted to make sure that each section was very clear on what was 53 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:38,400 and wasn't um required. So that's why this side setback section there's 54 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:41,840 additional language was added to just make sure that everyone's understanding 55 00:22:39,919 --> 00:22:47,280 that the rear is five as well as the side is five. And then just to cross 56 00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:51,039 reference another section of code. Um, so if somebody's just looking here for 57 00:22:48,559 --> 00:22:54,320 accessory structures, we added section 8, which is non-residential design 58 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:58,159 standards. I'm simply stating that non-residential accessory structures 59 00:22:57,039 --> 00:23:02,240 subject to comply with the non-residential design standards in 60 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:06,000 section 405.260. Um, that section already applies to 61 00:23:03,919 --> 00:23:08,720 accessory structures, but we wanted to make sure that if somebody was looking 62 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:12,080 just through in this section for accessory structures, they would see 63 00:23:10,559 --> 00:23:16,159 that cross reference and they could go to that section for the non-residential 64 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:20,000 design standards. those sections would not apply to residential accessory 65 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:25,200 structures just to commercial industrial things like that. So what this ordinance 66 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:28,640 does is essentially reduces the side and rear from 8 to 5 and then adds that 67 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:32,240 cross reference for non-residential design standards. So with that, I'd be 68 00:23:30,799 --> 00:23:37,440 happy to answer questions the commission may have. 69 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:40,559 » All right. >> Yeah, I'm sure it's just me, but I'm 70 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:47,360 struggling with the wording. I don't quite understand it. on page two of the 71 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:51,360 proposed bill. Um number three, 72 00:23:49,360 --> 00:23:56,640 the accessory structures shall not be required to comply with the side setback 73 00:23:53,520 --> 00:24:01,039 standard that applies to principal uses. Um what is principal uses? I'm sorry. 74 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:06,240 » Yeah. So that would be the side setbacks that that would be applied to like R1, 75 00:24:02,559 --> 00:24:11,919 R2, R3 standards. So those would be different than the accessories use. 76 00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:16,159 So the accessory structure doesn't have to comply with the principal setbacks 77 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:20,159 that are established in the R1, R2, or R3 zoning restrictions. 78 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:24,120 » Okay. Okay. Thank you. I'm sorry. I was struggling with that. Sorry. 79 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:36,279 » That wasn't for you. You're okay. You guys won't be going to the public 80 00:24:33,279 --> 00:24:36,279 hear. 81 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:41,600 » Yeah, you can just ask >> ask them all. 82 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:46,480 Oh, are you guys good or we can just move on to the public hearing? Do you 83 00:24:43,279 --> 00:24:49,200 have any questions? All right, perfect. All right, [clears throat] 84 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:52,640 members of the public who wish to offer testimony regarding the proposed 85 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:56,000 amendment may now set forward and give their comments. [clears throat] Please 86 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:59,279 state your name and address for the record prior to the beginning of your 87 00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:03,200 comments. Please speak into the microphone. If you have questions 88 00:25:00,799 --> 00:25:07,039 regarding the application, uh, state your questions to me and I will follow 89 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:10,799 up and request an answer when you have finished your comments. Anyone who 90 00:25:09,039 --> 00:25:17,320 wishes to testify, please come forward to the microphone at this time. I will 91 00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:17,320 now open for public hearing. 92 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:28,039 » Roger Lake, 36510 East Road. >> Hold on one second. 93 00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:37,600 » Roger Lake, 36510 East Church Road. So, did I hear hear that correctly? This is 94 00:25:34,559 --> 00:25:41,720 only going to affect industrial, not residential setback. 95 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:49,200 » It would be both. >> Go ahead and just answer that. 96 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:51,760 » It would be both. >> It would be both. 97 00:25:50,559 --> 00:25:56,960 » Excuse me. It would be both. >> It It will both be commercial, 98 00:25:53,679 --> 00:26:01,520 industrial, and residential. So the setback is that for that five feet for 99 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:05,919 if a homeowner decides to build a shed or a building has to be five feet from 100 00:26:04,080 --> 00:26:08,320 the property owner. >> Correct. From the property line. 101 00:26:07,360 --> 00:26:10,799 » From the property line. >> Yeah. 102 00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:13,760 » So we're going from 8t to 5t. >> Correct. 103 00:26:11,279 --> 00:26:15,520 » And it's for industrial, commercial, and residential. 104 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:19,480 » Correct. >> All right. Thank you. Yeah. 105 00:26:27,360 --> 00:26:32,480 All right. If there are no more public comments, I will now close the public 106 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:37,960 hearing. Are there any questions or comments from the members of uh 107 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,960 commission to the city staff? 108 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:41,000 All right. 109 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:47,200 So, we don't need to make a motion on this. What not? We just go straight to 110 00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:50,320 it. I guess next item is All right. All right. The next item on the agenda is 111 00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:55,520 discussion, consideration, and possible action regarding recommending approval 112 00:26:52,080 --> 00:27:00,720 or denial to the board of alderman for >> you have to close your public hearing. 113 00:26:57,039 --> 00:27:03,520 » I did. Did I not? Oh, I think I did. >> I did. I said there no more comments. 114 00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:06,880 We'll close the public hearing and I said to move on to the next one. 115 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:10,799 » Do you have them that for the minutes? >> Okay. Thank you. She just she motioned. 116 00:27:08,799 --> 00:27:13,679 That's why >> she didn't hear. I'm sorry. All right. 117 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:17,679 There's no more public comments. I would now close the public hearing. The next 118 00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:20,880 item on the agenda is discussion, consideration, and a possible action 119 00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:25,600 regarding recommending approval or denial to the board of alderman for the 120 00:27:22,799 --> 00:27:30,039 proposed amendment to accessory use, development, and operational standard. 121 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:36,120 Does the staff have a report? 122 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:43,919 Sorry, I went backwards. I apologize. So, yeah, we're at the motion. Do we 123 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:48,640 have a motion? Well, I I was I'll make a motion, but I 124 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:52,720 was waiting to see if anybody wanted to discuss it first. So, I mean, 125 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:57,600 » absolutely, we can discuss it. >> I I mean, I I I don't have anything to 126 00:27:55,120 --> 00:28:00,720 say about it. I just was giving people an opportunity before. 127 00:27:59,279 --> 00:28:04,720 » Does anybody else want to discuss it or have anything that they want to talk or 128 00:28:02,559 --> 00:28:08,960 state about it? I I can say that I think the board's 129 00:28:06,399 --> 00:28:15,360 thoughts that were when we reduced lot sizes that made it a little 130 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:21,200 more difficult um for homeowners to fit in that 8 foot and and um 131 00:28:19,919 --> 00:28:25,039 different board members had been approached by this and so it seemed 132 00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:30,640 logical to take a look at it. >> We adjusted setbacks and stuff on a 133 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:35,600 bunch of other stuff several months ago, didn't we? Didn't Didn't that come up 134 00:28:33,360 --> 00:28:39,760 before or was that the lot size? >> Yeah, for not for this. 135 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:42,880 » Just as Pam said, >> yeah, it wasn't accessory structures. It 136 00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:46,159 was >> ADUs maybe. 137 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:53,360 » And since our lot sizes for single family was 9,000 and then we reduced it. 138 00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:59,919 We were getting calls and questions from constituents asking about the their, you 139 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:04,559 know, their their buildings of building them because it was harder. Now, if that 140 00:29:02,799 --> 00:29:08,399 helps with the discussion, >> does that cause anything with fire? Like 141 00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:13,360 fire being able to I don't know. There's just a thought. I don't know. Does that 142 00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:15,200 with the ability to fight a fire in a structure like that with it being 143 00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:20,520 closer? >> You mean as far as code? 144 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,520 » Justin, 145 00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:29,520 » thank you. There's no other discussion. I'll make a 146 00:29:26,559 --> 00:29:34,640 motion that we recommend approval of the revisions to the board of alderman. 147 00:29:32,559 --> 00:29:36,159 » Would you pull your mic up so it will audio? Thanks. 148 00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:41,360 » Sure. >> Yeah. Thanks. 149 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:45,279 » We have a motion. Do we have a second? >> I'll second. 150 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:46,720 » We have a motion to second. All in favor say I. 151 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:51,000 » I. I. >> Oppose. Motion passes. 152 00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:58,000 All right. Next item on agenda is discussion, 153 00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:02,640 consideration, and possible action regarding recommending approval. 154 00:30:00,159 --> 00:30:07,760 Approval is modifications or denial of the preliminary plat for Edgewood Farms 155 00:30:04,799 --> 00:30:10,559 R1 estate lots. The staff, do you have a report? 156 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:14,320 » Yes, thank you. So, the applicant development has requested approval of a 157 00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:19,960 preliminary plat for Edgewood Farms, which will be 51 single family estate 158 00:30:16,559 --> 00:30:19,960 style lot. 159 00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:30,520 Is that better? Is that coming through at all? 160 00:30:37,679 --> 00:30:41,320 » Already getting feedback. 161 00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:47,320 » Feedback. >> It was raining 162 00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:47,320 » here. It's coming through this. 163 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:53,279 » Yes. No. Oh, I hear you. You're looking right at me. Talking to the mic. 164 00:30:51,919 --> 00:30:55,840 » I can It's talking. I mean, can you hear it? 165 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:59,440 » Yeah. >> Okay. All right. The applicant ward 166 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:02,880 development is requesting approval of a preliminary plat for Edgewood Farms 167 00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:08,399 consisting of 51 single family state style lots of uh which would be on 170 168 00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:12,080 acres generally located south of RDM and 12th Street. 169 00:31:10,559 --> 00:31:15,520 The planning and zoning commission may approve approve with conditions or deny 170 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:19,840 the application. The commission may continue or postpone action at a later 171 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:24,640 meeting. Under uh city code section 405.420 for 172 00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:26,960 preliminary plats, the plan zoning commission shall determine based on the 173 00:31:25,919 --> 00:31:29,919 evidence before it whether the preliminary plat meets the design 174 00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:33,039 standards requirements of subdivision regulations and conforms with the 175 00:31:31,679 --> 00:31:37,440 requirements of the unified development code for comprehensive plan and other 176 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:40,720 applicable provisions and standards of the city of Oak Grove. If the 177 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:43,440 preliminary plat does comply with all those requirements, the plan zoning 178 00:31:41,919 --> 00:31:47,440 commission shall approve the preliminary plat. The approval shall be recorded and 179 00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:51,279 attached to the preliminary plat. If the plumber plat is a general compliance but 180 00:31:49,039 --> 00:31:54,480 not complete compliance, plan zone commission may grant conditional 181 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:57,440 approval for then those things to be amended. If the plumber plat is not in 182 00:31:56,320 --> 00:32:03,559 compliance with all the requirements of planning commission shall then uh 183 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:03,559 disapprove the plat. 184 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:11,440 Uh some background on this development. Uh the property is currently zoned R1 185 00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:15,440 for single family residential use. that's proposed uh to be developed as an 186 00:32:13,679 --> 00:32:20,799 estate style subdivision consisting of 51 3acre or larger lots. In September of 187 00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:26,799 2021, the planning commission approved a preliminary platform this subdivision 188 00:32:23,519 --> 00:32:31,760 the number of 379 lots. That approval expired in 2023 due to inactivity by the 189 00:32:29,519 --> 00:32:35,120 developer. In February of 2024, the applicant resubmitted the previously 190 00:32:33,279 --> 00:32:38,480 approved preliminary plat, which was reapproved by the plan zoning 191 00:32:36,399 --> 00:32:43,360 commission. Uh civil permits were approved for phase one, but construction 192 00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:48,159 never commenced. The 2024 plary plat approval has also since expired. The 193 00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:54,240 developer has spent time uh relooking at this piece of property and wants to now 194 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:58,640 propose a reduction from that 379 lots down to 51 lots. So the proposed 195 00:32:56,799 --> 00:33:03,279 preliminary plat includes 51 estate style lots on that 170 acres. The lots 196 00:33:01,279 --> 00:33:06,320 are designed to be at least three acres or larger and will be served by 197 00:33:04,559 --> 00:33:10,799 individual septic system as approved by the Missouri National Department of 198 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:15,679 Resources as well as Jackson County. The state style um subdivision they also 199 00:33:13,679 --> 00:33:18,960 have requested certain deviations from city standards 200 00:33:17,519 --> 00:33:22,559 including curb and gutter and sidewalk requirements interior to the 201 00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:27,120 development. This includes no interior sidewalks and ribbon curve along with 202 00:33:25,039 --> 00:33:31,279 open uh ditch drainage in le of curb and gutter interior to the development. 203 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,360 Staff has reviewed the plenary platform for compliance of the unified 204 00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:37,279 development code supporting documentation. The applicant provided 205 00:33:35,279 --> 00:33:42,159 water quality availability analysis, storm water study, Missouri DNR approval 206 00:33:40,159 --> 00:33:45,679 with private septic systems. They also provided a traffic impact analysis. The 207 00:33:44,159 --> 00:33:49,679 preliminary plat was distributed to the applicable utility providers to valley 208 00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:52,399 fire protection district police department and the Oakrove school 209 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:57,120 district. Letters were also sent to addition property owners informing them 210 00:33:54,080 --> 00:34:00,480 of this proposed preliminary plat. Staff finds the proposed preliminary plaque 211 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:04,559 complies with unified development code as well as our subdivision regulations. 212 00:34:02,399 --> 00:34:08,079 It complies with R1 single family zoning district standards. The proposed estate 213 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:12,000 style lots are consistent with the city's comprehensive plan of future land 214 00:34:09,599 --> 00:34:15,119 use designation. They are compatible with the surrounding residential 215 00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:20,639 development in terms of overall density and size. In fact, this would be the 216 00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:24,720 largest um you know lot acreage subdivision in 217 00:34:22,720 --> 00:34:27,760 Oakrove. The requested deviations for curb, gutter, and sidewalks are 218 00:34:26,079 --> 00:34:31,599 permitted underneath uh the unified development code for state style 219 00:34:29,119 --> 00:34:37,119 subdivisions. Staff does recommend approval of the Edgewood Farms plary 220 00:34:33,599 --> 00:34:42,240 plant subject to several conditions. One uh suburban and state style light street 221 00:34:39,919 --> 00:34:46,879 design is allowed under 405.435D12 435D12 222 00:34:44,879 --> 00:34:50,480 shall be utilized including ribbon curb and vegetative drainage ditches in lie 223 00:34:48,720 --> 00:34:55,520 of traditional curb and gutter with an enclosed storm sewer system. No interior 224 00:34:53,919 --> 00:34:59,200 sidewalk shall be required as permitted for state style subdivisions as allowed 225 00:34:57,359 --> 00:35:03,280 under 405.440 point C.5. However, sidewalk shall be 226 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:08,000 constructed along the development frontage on 15th Street. Each lot shall 227 00:35:06,240 --> 00:35:11,359 be served by an individual private septic septic system in lie of being 228 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:15,680 connected to the city's gravity sewer system. A westbound right turn lane 229 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:20,000 shall be constructed on 12th Street as identified in the traffic impact 230 00:35:17,599 --> 00:35:22,880 analysis as well as an approved development agreement between the city 231 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:26,599 of Oakrove and the developer authorizing the state style subdivision. 232 00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:32,720 Uh with that, I'd be happy to answer any questions uh that the commission may 233 00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:36,480 have. Uh in your packet is a letter both from the developer as well as the 234 00:35:33,839 --> 00:35:39,839 engineer requesting the state style um deviations. They provided the 235 00:35:38,240 --> 00:35:45,440 preliminary plan information is required. Um the traffic impact uh 236 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:49,040 analysis, the water analysis and other information is also available in your 237 00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:54,400 packet as well as DNR's approval of the private seed systems. Um the applicant 238 00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:59,200 as well as the engineer as I say is here for further questions and there's also I 239 00:35:56,960 --> 00:36:02,680 believe members um neighbors they would also like to provide 240 00:36:03,359 --> 00:36:06,880 you allow them to >> okay 241 00:36:05,839 --> 00:36:09,760 » it's not a formal we don't have to have a public hearing but you can allow 242 00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:13,520 » we can allow them to do it >> provide testimony 243 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:17,760 » all right perfect um thank you city staff um we'll allow it if somebody's 244 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:21,359 here that wants to come up and speak >> let's listen let's hear from Brian first 245 00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:25,280 do you mind so we about >> so we can and then we might want to hear 246 00:36:23,359 --> 00:36:28,680 what Brian has to say about it and it'll help with conversation. 247 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:36,079 » Thank you. Um my name is Brian Ron. I'm with Board Development 1120 Eagle Ridge 248 00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:40,880 Boulevard, Green Valley, Missouri. Appreciate your consideration this 249 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:44,000 evening, Mayor Reb Commissioners. So, as mentioned in the staff report, we've 250 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:50,079 looked at this property for some time and previously had it approved for a uh 251 00:36:47,359 --> 00:36:53,200 typical lot subdivision. And, you know, due to several different factors, we 252 00:36:52,079 --> 00:36:56,400 kind of thought that it would be appropriate to go in a different 253 00:36:54,400 --> 00:37:00,079 direction. That direction that we decided on was to do a large lot 254 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:03,520 subdivision, uh, similar to some things that we're doing in some other areas. 255 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:08,240 And, you know, with looking at the topography there, uh, it's a beautiful 256 00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:12,960 piece of ground. Um and then looking at the neighborhood, you know, and the 257 00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:17,200 market here, uh we felt that the large lot subdivision was appropriate there. 258 00:37:15,119 --> 00:37:21,440 We, uh, you know, have been discussing it with the city for some time, work 259 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:26,480 through the different considerations, uh, that would be necessary and, uh, you 260 00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:31,520 know, bringing it to you this evening. As mentioned, I mean, we've cut the the 261 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:37,119 density down tremendously. Uh we are expecting it to be, you know, uh the 262 00:37:34,240 --> 00:37:40,640 upper end of uh values in the area. You know, the lots are going to be at 263 00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:45,359 approximately $200,000 and the homes, as we're expected, are 264 00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:50,320 going to run, you know, you know, likely uh upper sixes to, you know, close to a 265 00:37:48,079 --> 00:37:54,400 million. We're doing a similar subdivision in another area called 266 00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:59,200 Heritage Farms. Uh and it's been very very successful. And you know, we're 267 00:37:57,040 --> 00:38:03,520 anticipating similar styles homes. And the homes there are also ranging, you 268 00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:08,240 know, seven to nine are the typical homes there. Uh the piece of ground that 269 00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:11,920 we're looking at here, we've actually gone through several different designs 270 00:38:10,079 --> 00:38:15,680 to make sure that the home sites all work. There's a lot of rock up there. 271 00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:20,720 There's, you know, a lot of topography we're working with, but it adds so much 272 00:38:18,079 --> 00:38:24,640 character to to the site. I don't know if any of you have ever been up there. 273 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:29,359 you know, there's a treeine corridor that that comes in. Uh there's an 274 00:38:27,119 --> 00:38:35,680 existing silo. We're anticipating that area to become a park. Uh we're going to 275 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:39,920 keep that treeine corridor, the sidewalk that we uh that was just mentioned are 276 00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:45,280 going to tie into an interior trail system around the park. And then as you 277 00:38:43,119 --> 00:38:49,599 go into the subdivision, you know, would be more rural 3 acre, you know, style 278 00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:55,440 lots. the homes are going to sit back further uh than you know our typical you 279 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:59,520 know right there you know at at the setback lines and things like that. So 280 00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:04,000 you know we're excited about it. Hopefully it's something that uh you 281 00:39:01,839 --> 00:39:09,920 know is going to be you know unique here in in Oakrove a community like this you 282 00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:14,560 know we have several other you know steps up to you know these style homes 283 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:18,320 and price points in this type of community. Uh, but we didn't see 284 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:21,680 anything quite, you know, quite like this and we think it's we think it's 285 00:39:19,839 --> 00:39:27,079 appropriate. More than happy to answer any questions. 286 00:39:23,839 --> 00:39:27,079 » Thank you. 287 00:39:27,119 --> 00:39:36,560 » Anybody have questions for him? >> Can you describe the ribbon curb? We 288 00:39:34,240 --> 00:39:39,520 there's not really a visual visual of it. And I 289 00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:43,280 » um I can bring up the engineer to get more specific, but essentially rather 290 00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:48,480 than the the the curb that's going to channel water just specifically down the 291 00:39:45,599 --> 00:39:53,359 streets and everything, it's more of uh a rural type of curb that's going to 292 00:39:50,320 --> 00:40:00,240 allow water to to flow naturally into the um the system that we're designing 293 00:39:56,960 --> 00:40:05,359 to channel the water. Uh, but it's it's not the high back curb that you know or 294 00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:12,119 the lazy back curbs that you're used to. Um, Richard, you want to come up and 295 00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:12,119 describe the purpose of the curbs? 296 00:40:15,359 --> 00:40:24,480 » Uh, Richard Michael 25604 Northeast Coen Road. Um, yeah. So, in an industrial 297 00:40:22,720 --> 00:40:30,880 type commercial setting, you would have what's called highback curb or CG1 that 298 00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:34,720 has about a 6 inch tall back on it. In a subdivision, you would have a CG2 that's 299 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:38,960 called lazy back because it's it's mountable by cars when you go into a 300 00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:44,000 driveway. A ribbon curb is essentially just flat. It it really just frames in 301 00:40:42,079 --> 00:40:48,079 the roadway, the asphalt to give it a nice picture frame look while still 302 00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:52,480 allowing the water to sheet flow into a vegetated swale for the drainage system. 303 00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:53,200 » So, it's concrete. >> Yes. 304 00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,079 » Okay. >> Yeah. 305 00:40:54,160 --> 00:41:00,960 » And I I believe on one of the sheets that was provided, there's a typical 306 00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:06,880 section. It may show it on on the edges of the road there. That's 307 00:41:04,240 --> 00:41:13,040 it's a small detail, I admit. But yeah, it is in concrete. 308 00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:19,200 And then the the the right turn lane is coming out of the current [cough] 309 00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:25,520 that it it would be coming out of there turning right onto 310 00:41:21,119 --> 00:41:29,920 » it'd be going uh eastbound on on 15th to do a right hand into the subdivision 311 00:41:28,240 --> 00:41:33,119 » eastbound. >> That's correct. 312 00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:36,800 » 15 west westbound on 12. >> Matt mentioned westbound previously. I 313 00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:41,920 think it was eastbound is is the right turn. And as you come into the 314 00:41:38,319 --> 00:41:46,480 development off of 15th at the main entrance, which is the easternmost 315 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:53,200 entrance, it lines up with the is it 12th Street on the north side? 316 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:53,920 » And it says westbound on 12. So I was >> It does. 317 00:41:53,599 --> 00:41:56,079 » Yeah. >> I miss Buck. When I said westbound, it 318 00:41:55,359 --> 00:41:59,359 it'd be eastbound. >> It' be eastbound. 319 00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:00,640 » Okay. All right. That makes Okay. Thank you. 320 00:41:59,599 --> 00:42:05,800 » Sorry for the confusion. >> It's okay. [laughter] 321 00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:05,800 Anyone 322 00:42:10,079 --> 00:42:13,960 else have questions for him? 323 00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:23,440 » Um, I would ask I I hadn't had a chance to go through the whole packet, but um 324 00:42:20,319 --> 00:42:28,880 did did have you done the perk tests and stuff for these uh onsite 325 00:42:27,359 --> 00:42:34,480 lateral systems? >> Yes. Yeah. So, part of that DNR approval 326 00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:38,400 that we've received, um, when you do a a subdivision of this size, you have to 327 00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:43,359 get approval for the whole development from DNR. Part of that is, I believe you 328 00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:49,040 have to have one soil test for every 10 acres. So, we did 17 of them for this 329 00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:54,160 170. We tried to locate them. That made sense within the lots. Granted, we 330 00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:59,760 didn't do 51 of them. And those tests come back. We submit that to DNR to show 331 00:42:56,319 --> 00:43:03,599 the load rate and the soil reports and they sign off on it saying, "Yep, you 332 00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:08,000 know, so it's the the types of systems have already been dedicated based on the 333 00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:11,280 soil rate." >> So then that's all been worked out. So 334 00:43:09,599 --> 00:43:16,319 then, yeah, from from here it would go to county review and approval when it's 335 00:43:14,079 --> 00:43:20,160 the on-site individual designs. 336 00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:24,720 Does that make sense? >> So the county approves the 337 00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:30,480 » Well, it's Yes. to my understanding right Matt is because these are on-site 338 00:43:27,839 --> 00:43:34,960 septic the sewer portion of it is actually a county item 339 00:43:33,440 --> 00:43:37,520 » I think city limits Jackson County approves [cough] 340 00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:41,440 » okay >> Lafayette we we approve them on 341 00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:43,760 Lafayette side but Jackson County side >> okay 342 00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:46,760 » Jackson County is the one who approves it 343 00:43:53,119 --> 00:43:56,119 Anybody 344 00:43:56,240 --> 00:44:01,000 else have anybody else [clears throat] have any questions for you gentlemen? 345 00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:06,560 » Does anybody else have questions for them? 346 00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:11,760 » All right. Thank you. >> Thank you. 347 00:44:08,720 --> 00:44:15,440 » Um, this is not a formal public hearing, but we will allow if anybody does want 348 00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:18,240 to come up to the microphone to come up. Please state your name, your address, 349 00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:21,720 and everything that we did the first half. Thank you. 350 00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:33,680 again, Roger Lake, 36510 East Church Road. Uh, I believe I'm the largest 351 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:39,440 property owner button up to this from Church Road. Um, 352 00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:44,400 actually we uh the our family farm raised cattle. 353 00:44:42,079 --> 00:44:49,359 The north side of our property is is approximately half a mile 354 00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:53,760 wide. So the half a mile of this development on the north side of our 355 00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:58,319 property that's going to affect us on the east side probably a third of our 356 00:44:56,079 --> 00:45:01,680 property if if you all got one of these things. Y'all got one of those? 357 00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:06,480 » Yes. >> So [cough and clears throat] 358 00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:10,880 we're this little cutout right here. You don't have a big flat map, do you? So 359 00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:12,880 everybody can see what I'm talking about. 360 00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:20,319 » Not not here this evening. >> All right. So um that's our property. 361 00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:27,040 our properties props props uh 60 acres is a half mile uh deep quarter mile 362 00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:32,800 wide. So I'll recorrect that. So the backside is a quarter of a mile wide. I 363 00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:39,280 got a few questions. The first one when you put in uh single 364 00:45:36,079 --> 00:45:44,000 family homes like this u and I like I said we have cattle, we got barns, we 365 00:45:41,200 --> 00:45:49,920 got ponds. Uh, is there going to be some kind of means from the developer for the 366 00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:55,599 people that butt up to this, a privy fence or some type of fence to keep uh 367 00:45:52,800 --> 00:46:01,200 the residents from intruding on properties? That's my first question 368 00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:06,560 because they're going to bring in kids and kids just want to go explore, 369 00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:14,240 right? That's one of the questions I like to have answered. Uh secondly, 370 00:46:11,680 --> 00:46:19,839 that's why I'm requesting some dialogue about a privacy fence or some kind of 371 00:46:16,720 --> 00:46:26,079 fence to keep them from coming in there. Um next, 372 00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:33,040 looking at this plat, it's got several roundabouts or culde-sacs. 373 00:46:29,359 --> 00:46:38,640 Has uh the planning and zoning board staff 374 00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:45,119 talked to the fire district because I just left a fire district meeting about 375 00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:49,760 are these culde-sacs big enough to handle a firet truck coming around them 376 00:46:47,839 --> 00:46:56,800 because the district's in the process of buying new fire trucks. 377 00:46:52,400 --> 00:47:00,640 So, as staff contacted the district to look over the fire district to look over 378 00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:05,280 these culde-sacs to make sure firet trucks can adequately 379 00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:09,680 service that area. This is my next question. 380 00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:17,119 Uh [snorts] I know approximately 25 years ago, Oak 381 00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:23,440 Grove had a uh my 20-year plan which is expired. You know, u at that time they 382 00:47:20,240 --> 00:47:28,800 was thinking about running a sewer line down the ditch, 383 00:47:26,079 --> 00:47:33,119 the watershed that starts up there on Cemetery Road that comes down there. 384 00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:38,720 There's approximately 500 acres that runs into that ditch. So, is there still 385 00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:46,079 plans, that's my third question, of running a sewer line down our ditch? 386 00:47:43,599 --> 00:47:51,680 You know, I understand what they said that they perk test everything. So, my 387 00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:57,280 question is, are they planning on tying into Oakrove sewers? I heard I kind of 388 00:47:54,240 --> 00:48:02,800 heard that. Are they planning on septics or are they planning on polishing ponds? 389 00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:08,240 I'd like a little definition on on those subjects right there. You know, how the 390 00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:12,000 runoff's going to go. So, I may have more questions. I know I have several 391 00:48:10,240 --> 00:48:16,319 neighbors here that'd like to have questions at Well, 392 00:48:14,319 --> 00:48:19,119 I may be back up. >> Thank you. [clears throat] 393 00:48:17,839 --> 00:48:25,480 » Is there anybody else that wanted to step forward and have a comment or a 394 00:48:21,599 --> 00:48:25,480 question or anything of that nature? 395 00:48:30,198 --> 00:48:36,480 [snorts] >> I'm Linda Rhodander. We're on 36307 East 396 00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:41,599 Art Mis. And I'm curious about where this water is going to go. Is it going 397 00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:45,760 to go on? Does it have places to go east, west, north, south, or does it 398 00:48:43,359 --> 00:48:52,760 stay on the property and go into septic tanks or whatever? Is it going to run 399 00:48:48,400 --> 00:48:52,760 over on any of the neighbors properties? 400 00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:58,880 » I think that we're waiting to hear all the questions and then we'll have the 401 00:48:57,440 --> 00:49:01,440 developer come back up. >> Okay. So, you're not going to answer 402 00:48:59,839 --> 00:49:07,000 mine right now. Well, some of them they'll need to answer. 403 00:49:02,720 --> 00:49:07,000 » Okay. Thank you. Thank you, 404 00:49:13,119 --> 00:49:22,079 » Nathan [clears throat] Brown. Uh, 21101 Oage Drive. I noticed on the map on one 405 00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:28,000 of the culde-sacs that butts up to the east side. It looks like there's an 406 00:49:25,040 --> 00:49:31,200 easement of some sort that I wasn't sure. I was curious about that. that 407 00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:34,880 comes right into my property and I was wondering what the intentions were if 408 00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:38,800 that's what that is or if that's something else. 409 00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:43,640 Uh, I can show you if somebody's got a map 410 00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:43,640 up. 411 00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:53,000 » I believe >> the two lines. 412 00:49:53,760 --> 00:50:02,480 » It's right here around. He's speaking around lot 37 and 413 00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:06,319 lot 38. Thank you. I just noticed that was the only 414 00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:09,280 roundabout that looked like it had that and I was curious what the intentions 415 00:50:07,794 --> 00:50:14,559 [clears throat] were in the end with that. That comes right into my property. 416 00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:19,839 The I was wondering what the septic 417 00:50:17,839 --> 00:50:26,240 you guys said it perked. What was was it advanced systems or or basic systems 418 00:50:23,440 --> 00:50:31,680 that that perked out for or morphology reported for? Sound like you guys did a 419 00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:37,040 morphology report. I was curious what that what that came up with. We talked 420 00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:41,440 about how much rock is in there. Septic system is not a good system. A basic 421 00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:46,880 system would not be good on a rocky situation. 422 00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:51,040 Uh runoff. All the runoff that comes off I'm concerned with. We we all have 423 00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:56,240 cattle and livestock all the way around this place. A lot of that water for the 424 00:50:54,480 --> 00:51:02,800 animals comes out of that ditch that runs the entire distance down the east 425 00:50:59,920 --> 00:51:07,440 side and north and south or heading east and west and north and south of that 426 00:51:04,720 --> 00:51:14,720 entire second phase. Uh I think that's probably all I got. 427 00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:17,720 So, the uh one other thing, the ribbon curb, 428 00:51:17,839 --> 00:51:24,640 when you hit the lots, we're talking about a 429 00:51:22,319 --> 00:51:28,400 retention area on each lot running around. So, you're pulling in, you're 430 00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:33,680 going over a covert to get into your driveway. And we have 431 00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:38,000 actual retention on the front of those lots all the way around this place. Or 432 00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:41,839 we just ribbon curb right into the drive, right into the yard frontage. 433 00:51:41,460 --> 00:51:45,920 » [snorts] >> I I [clears throat] am concerned with 434 00:51:43,359 --> 00:51:53,559 runoff for sure. So that's it. 435 00:51:48,640 --> 00:51:53,559 » Thank you. Is there anybody else? 436 00:51:56,240 --> 00:52:04,640 » Matt Reer, 37400 East Hillside School Road. My property is on the south side 437 00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:10,880 of this property and same concerns with the runoff. the property elevation is 438 00:52:08,880 --> 00:52:14,160 has a significant drop down into that creek that they're mentioning. So, the 439 00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:17,440 fact that we would have all this additional runoff into that creek is a 440 00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:21,760 concern for flooding and things like that, as well as our livestock. So, I'd 441 00:52:20,079 --> 00:52:26,400 be curious. And then when I was looking at the plats, I didn't see anything for 442 00:52:24,079 --> 00:52:30,079 these drainage ditches. All I see is lots. So, I'd be curious where those 443 00:52:28,559 --> 00:52:36,400 drainage ditches are and where they're going to flow. Thanks. 444 00:52:34,559 --> 00:52:40,119 Thank you. Is there anybody else? 445 00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:51,359 » My name is Michaela Deble and I'm at 6619 South Still House Road. Um my 446 00:52:48,160 --> 00:52:55,599 property backs up to lot 51 on the map and I do have the same similar questions 447 00:52:53,599 --> 00:53:01,839 about runoff. I have a creek that runs through my property that um my animals 448 00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:05,680 access. And um then I also was curious um what the time frame is for this um 449 00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:12,960 specifically phase two since that's what lot 51 is in for me. Um and will there 450 00:53:10,079 --> 00:53:18,960 be some sort of stake survey or survey to where I know in advance whether or 451 00:53:16,319 --> 00:53:26,400 not that lot is going to encroach into my property line. Um, I'm sure with like 452 00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:31,359 most of my neighbors, the property lines aren't by the tree corridor that he's 453 00:53:29,040 --> 00:53:36,400 talking about, our properties go into that tree corridor. So, um, the trails 454 00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:38,319 and the, um, other things that he was talking about, I just want to make sure 455 00:53:37,520 --> 00:53:44,720 that those aren't going to be encroaching into my property as well. 456 00:53:40,960 --> 00:53:47,960 Um, and I think that's it for right now. >> Thank you. 457 00:53:48,559 --> 00:53:57,280 Again, Roger Lake 36510 East Church Road. [snorts] 458 00:53:53,359 --> 00:54:02,319 So earlier you you're you're doing an or ordinance from 8T to 5T, right? I 459 00:54:00,400 --> 00:54:05,760 believe the county is a little bit more than that. Most of us live in the 460 00:54:04,240 --> 00:54:10,960 county, not in the city limits. I get that. So that you know that's why I 461 00:54:08,240 --> 00:54:14,960 asked question earlier 8t to 5t. So these residents that the question to the 462 00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:19,839 developer, you know, are these residents going to be allowed to build a a 463 00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:24,160 building or any structure within five feet of our property? 464 00:54:21,839 --> 00:54:29,280 I know you talked about, you know, uh smaller lots in the city, people needed 465 00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:33,440 to put a shed up or something. Uh I would like to see some kind of 466 00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:40,319 restriction on how close they come to our property, you know, maybe along the 467 00:54:35,760 --> 00:54:46,000 guidelines of what the county does. Thank you. 468 00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:49,119 Is there anybody else? [clears throat] >> Looks like one more. 469 00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:52,720 » One more. Oh, I can't see your right there. Thank you. 470 00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:56,640 » Hi, I'm Christine Nicholas and I actually live over at 3300 South Fields 471 00:54:54,559 --> 00:55:00,319 Road. Um, but my daughter is Michaela. So, uh, we have been kind of looking at 472 00:54:58,640 --> 00:55:04,160 this quite a bit and I have a little bit of familiarity with, um, the 473 00:55:02,559 --> 00:55:08,880 subdivisions themselves. I actually am a real estate agent, so I've seen this 474 00:55:05,680 --> 00:55:13,200 come and go quite a bit. Uh I had very similar concerns with uh realizing that 475 00:55:11,599 --> 00:55:18,160 three acres is what the minimum is for Jackson County to be able to actually 476 00:55:14,720 --> 00:55:21,680 have a septic system. Um, and if you look at the topography of actually how 477 00:55:19,839 --> 00:55:27,920 those lay, especially the ones here that are on the west and the the south side, 478 00:55:25,599 --> 00:55:33,839 um, when you look at how that runoff is, and especially with the way that the 479 00:55:30,240 --> 00:55:38,000 rock and, um, where that sediment lays, I I think the biggest concern will be 480 00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:42,160 whether this septic is going to actually retain that or where that leech is going 481 00:55:39,760 --> 00:55:46,240 to end up going because it it's you can't tell me that there's not going to 482 00:55:43,440 --> 00:55:52,440 be a way for that to find a pathway. way back down with the way that that 483 00:55:47,599 --> 00:55:52,440 topography actually stands. So, 484 00:55:56,559 --> 00:56:04,160 Nathan Brown again, O Sage Drive. I along with that, is there if this goes 485 00:56:02,079 --> 00:56:10,640 through and and moves on, is there a down the road process that we could get 486 00:56:06,799 --> 00:56:15,040 to have that creek tested occasionally to know that everything's still still 487 00:56:13,040 --> 00:56:22,319 safe or is it just nap, we're done, we're out, houses are built, you know? 488 00:56:18,960 --> 00:56:25,319 Uh that was that's something I wonder about. 489 00:56:26,079 --> 00:56:29,520 » All right. Thank you. All 490 00:56:33,200 --> 00:56:40,160 right. Go ahead. >> She's gonna lander again. Our demise. 491 00:56:37,359 --> 00:56:44,480 Uh, I do have a question like Roger had about the property butdding up against 492 00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:48,720 the these properties against our properties. Will there be something to 493 00:56:46,799 --> 00:56:55,119 keep these people off our properties? Because we go way back to from the north 494 00:56:52,799 --> 00:57:00,240 to the south and we cannot see the south side of our property. How do we keep 495 00:56:56,799 --> 00:57:05,119 people off of it? >> All right. Thank you. Is there anybody 496 00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:08,799 else? >> Of course. All right. Cool. Uh we're 497 00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:11,440 just going to go ahead and go and open for discussion and and answer some of 498 00:57:10,559 --> 00:57:15,760 these questions. >> Um I was just going to respond to two 499 00:57:13,520 --> 00:57:19,280 things that were city related. Um speak on behalf of the city and then Brian, if 500 00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:24,079 you don't mind coming up, I see you've been writing down the questions. Uh, one 501 00:57:21,920 --> 00:57:27,359 is in response to the comprehensive plan, which is what you were talking 502 00:57:25,119 --> 00:57:33,119 about, the 20-year plan. We did update that in 2023. There's a a very good uh 503 00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:38,000 on our website. You can read through that. So, we have updated that. You're 504 00:57:35,760 --> 00:57:42,000 supposed to do those about every 10 15 years. So, we have updated that. And 505 00:57:40,400 --> 00:57:48,319 then, just so you know, this is a planning and zoning meeting. And these 506 00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:54,480 people, they are recommending whether this goes on to the board, which is city 507 00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:58,240 council. And so there's, you know, this they'll tonight they'll either say yes 508 00:57:56,400 --> 00:58:01,760 or no. No, they won't. The final approve. Oh, my bad. 509 00:58:00,240 --> 00:58:06,000 » Plat for final approve. >> Excuse me. I apologize. This would be 510 00:58:04,079 --> 00:58:10,880 just their decision whether this is approved tonight. So, um, now Brian, 511 00:58:09,200 --> 00:58:15,440 would you come back up? >> Sorry. You're okay. That was nice. Thank 512 00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:20,079 you. Yeah, [cough] >> thank you. Um, like to speak to a couple 513 00:58:18,319 --> 00:58:24,400 things and I'll have some things for Richard uh as well. You know, I do 514 00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:27,680 appreciate all the comments and you know, these are things that we that we 515 00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:31,839 do look at and we have looked at with with this community. Um, you know, 516 00:58:30,079 --> 00:58:39,440 starting with, you know, some things that we we absolutely have uh some plans 517 00:58:35,839 --> 00:58:44,160 in place and others, you know, at at best I can give an explanation. So, you 518 00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:49,119 know, for example, the the fence question, uh, and the access question as 519 00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:55,599 far as, you know, the the property rights questions, you know, um, we do 520 00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:59,920 not have plans in place to to fence the property. You know, those would be 521 00:58:57,440 --> 00:59:05,359 individual homeowner uh, you know, considerations. However, I mean, I can 522 00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:09,599 say the the property is zoned R1 and, you know, we feel that because of the 523 00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:15,280 the large rural surrounding properties and stuff like that that the much larger 524 00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:20,720 3acre lots uh are going to be less impactful than the typical R1 lots. So, 525 00:59:19,040 --> 00:59:25,359 while you know we're not doing offense, >> they can't hear you back there. 526 00:59:22,960 --> 00:59:29,839 Is this Mike on or? >> So, um, you know, I can back up and, you 527 00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:33,680 know, if there was anything in particular that you heard that you'd 528 00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:39,680 like me to readress, I'm more than happy to to do that. But, you know, we feel 529 00:59:36,319 --> 00:59:44,880 that the design that we have now and what we are asking to to do with the 530 00:59:41,920 --> 00:59:49,599 property is far less impactful across the board and most of the concerns that 531 00:59:47,520 --> 00:59:54,559 were raised this evening. You know, we do hear the the access. You know, we 532 00:59:52,720 --> 00:59:58,000 also we currently have cattle on the property right now. We you know, we do a 533 00:59:56,720 --> 01:00:01,680 lot of cattle farming. We're very familiar. You know, the storm, I'm going 534 01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:07,520 to let Richard speak to that a little bit further. Uh the septic design, you 535 01:00:04,720 --> 01:00:12,960 know, all of those things are fairly well regulated. So, in addition to the 536 01:00:10,160 --> 01:00:17,520 testing that's been done so far, the next steps, you know, there's additional 537 01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:22,720 testing. An engineer gets involved. An engineer designs a system based off the 538 01:00:20,480 --> 01:00:27,119 considerations of additional testing on the site. Uh then that system is 539 01:00:24,880 --> 01:00:32,319 installed and inspected and then that system is designed to operate. We're not 540 01:00:29,839 --> 01:00:38,400 planning on any lagoons there. So they are going to typically be you know 541 01:00:35,119 --> 01:00:43,839 designed systems. Now again those have not been individually designed but we 542 01:00:40,880 --> 01:00:48,000 would trust those professionals DNR's recommendations. the county's 543 01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:53,200 recommendations and then yes there is mechanisms in place and I would imagine 544 01:00:50,400 --> 01:00:58,480 the the city has some as well you know if there are problems that pop up uh but 545 01:00:56,559 --> 01:01:04,720 you know those are all steps that would be taken with additional checks at each 546 01:01:01,359 --> 01:01:09,760 point um the stub streets you know that were brought up and that's uh there lot 547 01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:14,799 at lots 37 and 38 you know just good planning uh we don't 548 01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:19,280 know what's you know going to be down on the road, you know, whether or not that 549 01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:24,319 property develops. You know, if it did ever develop, there needed to be a pl an 550 01:01:21,760 --> 01:01:28,640 opportunity in place for streets to connect, you know, for good planning, 551 01:01:26,480 --> 01:01:32,640 for fire safety, for those types of things. That's all that is. And that's 552 01:01:30,319 --> 01:01:37,839 that's recommendation of, you know, staff and good planning. Um, as far as 553 01:01:35,680 --> 01:01:41,760 location of property lines, you know, I'm more than happy to give anybody a 554 01:01:39,359 --> 01:01:45,920 card this evening and, you know, we would absolutely work with them as 555 01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:51,440 we're, you know, going through the process to to establish where those 556 01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:57,119 property lines are. You know, again, being very rural, it's very easy, you 557 01:01:53,760 --> 01:02:01,200 know, one way or the other, uh, a a little bit, you know, more than happy to 558 01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:06,160 work with those property owners. uh the setbacks, you know, we are anticipating 559 01:02:03,599 --> 01:02:10,240 that based off the lot size that the homes and structures and things like 560 01:02:07,760 --> 01:02:16,240 that would be, you know, further from the property line than a typical R1. Um 561 01:02:13,440 --> 01:02:21,440 however, you know, we don't have any mechanism in place other than to follow 562 01:02:18,240 --> 01:02:25,520 the city's codes on on the setbacks. Uh with that, I'm going to bring up Richard 563 01:02:23,359 --> 01:02:28,520 and he can talk further on the the storm questions. 564 01:02:31,440 --> 01:02:45,880 Okay, nicely done, Brian. Um, I'm going to really quickly make sure that my 565 01:02:37,760 --> 01:02:45,880 notes are taken care of as well. Um, so 566 01:02:46,480 --> 01:02:54,079 fire access, um, it's been approved by fire. They've already looked at it. Uh, 567 01:02:51,520 --> 01:02:58,720 again, a lot of everything that will be designed is to the city's code. So 568 01:02:57,119 --> 01:03:03,280 nothing that we've brought before falls short of that per match plan. So again, 569 01:03:01,040 --> 01:03:10,528 those kind of things really across the board, it's not just go put in what you 570 01:03:06,240 --> 01:03:14,240 want. We are following a a the code. Um [snorts] 571 01:03:11,359 --> 01:03:19,680 let's see. So sewer, I'm just going to hit on the sewer really quickly. So, the 572 01:03:17,039 --> 01:03:24,160 process is when you want to do on-site treatment for a full subdivision is to 573 01:03:21,680 --> 01:03:29,359 get DNR approval and to go dig the soils, one pit per 10 acres to see what 574 01:03:27,359 --> 01:03:34,400 you find and make sure it is adequate for on-site septic systems, which then 575 01:03:32,240 --> 01:03:39,680 the DNR says, "Yep, you're good. You can maintain uh you can go as low as 1acre 576 01:03:37,599 --> 01:03:45,520 lots." Um, we did we chose not to, again, with the theme of trying to not 577 01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:50,160 be so dense and lower the lot count. Now we have soil maps that indicate where 578 01:03:47,839 --> 01:03:56,240 the better soil is and we have tried to lay the lot layout per the topography to 579 01:03:53,119 --> 01:04:01,039 benefit. So every lot has a good spot to put this system in and good spot to put 580 01:03:59,440 --> 01:04:04,640 a house and probably an accessory structure of what you would typically 581 01:04:02,319 --> 01:04:09,039 see in that. So the layout has been combed over pretty meticulously for all 582 01:04:06,880 --> 01:04:14,400 of those things combined while still using the topography to our advantage to 583 01:04:11,520 --> 01:04:19,280 have really nice lookouts. you know this at the top of the hill you can see in 584 01:04:16,240 --> 01:04:24,160 miles for directions. So um now when it gets time to do those on-site septic 585 01:04:21,359 --> 01:04:28,319 designs every lot will have to design that system get it approved by the 586 01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:32,160 county which follows DNR regulations. So again, all of those details will be 587 01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:36,240 worked out in lot development once infrastructure is in [snorts] 588 01:04:34,559 --> 01:04:39,920 um [clears throat] the 589 01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:44,559 Brian touched on the uh kind of the future planning. Again, not knowing what 590 01:04:42,640 --> 01:04:48,240 future holds is just good idea to instead of have lot lines, let's leave 591 01:04:46,240 --> 01:04:53,119 some open space so that in the future if roadways need to go through. Um not to 592 01:04:50,720 --> 01:05:00,799 say that they are now at all, that's just a future planning. [snorts] 593 01:04:55,440 --> 01:05:06,640 Um, okay. So, the it sounds like, let me lot line concerns Brian touched. Okay. 594 01:05:03,280 --> 01:05:10,799 So, runoff as a whole, we we provided a storm water report. Um, city has 595 01:05:09,200 --> 01:05:16,400 reviewed and approved it after a couple rounds of review comments. The the whole 596 01:05:13,599 --> 01:05:20,720 idea with this is again unlike a standard subdivision where we have 597 01:05:18,240 --> 01:05:26,240 enclosed storm sewer system and pipes where the water is really channelized 598 01:05:23,440 --> 01:05:33,839 and going very quickly and lots of imperous area. We are intentionally 599 01:05:29,920 --> 01:05:39,680 trying to limit that in 51 lots of a house driveway accessory structure 600 01:05:37,520 --> 01:05:44,079 roadway pavement. Yes, but we're trying to with the ribbon curb put it in a 601 01:05:41,680 --> 01:05:49,039 roadside ditch that will be the gentleman that spoke earlier. Yes, there 602 01:05:45,760 --> 01:05:53,599 is a roadside ditch on both sides. There will be permanent ditch checks in those 603 01:05:51,119 --> 01:05:57,599 roadside ditches to try to hold and slow that water down as it traverses around 604 01:05:55,520 --> 01:06:02,000 the site mainly for the water that is coming off the roads. All the water 605 01:05:59,599 --> 01:06:06,319 that's inside of the development will be not concentrated. It will be sheet flow 606 01:06:03,920 --> 01:06:10,240 across well manicured lawns versus patchy, you know, fields as today that 607 01:06:08,640 --> 01:06:14,720 maybe don't have any grass because of the rock. So, yes, at driveway 608 01:06:13,119 --> 01:06:19,119 locations, there will be a covert that they have to drop in the ditch to then 609 01:06:16,559 --> 01:06:24,640 traverse over. Um, but yeah, the the rules and regulations will be followed 610 01:06:21,280 --> 01:06:28,400 so that post-development runoff does not exceed pre-development runoff. Um, 611 01:06:27,030 --> 01:06:32,880 [snorts] so I I think that answers most the 612 01:06:31,119 --> 01:06:38,680 questions. Uh if if there's more, we'll happy to 613 01:06:35,440 --> 01:06:38,680 answer them. 614 01:06:39,680 --> 01:06:46,640 » The future roadway between 37 and 38, will that be installed like when you do 615 01:06:45,839 --> 01:06:52,799 the development? >> No. No. The idea is from a property and 616 01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:57,520 platting standpoint is to make it so if in the future the lot lines and the 617 01:06:55,920 --> 01:07:02,599 dedication has already been taken care of. But no, those it will all be 618 01:06:59,599 --> 01:07:02,599 culde-sacs. 619 01:07:03,711 --> 01:07:07,359 » [snorts] >> There'll be no stub to your property, 620 01:07:06,160 --> 01:07:09,280 Mr. Brown. >> Say that again. 621 01:07:07,920 --> 01:07:12,720 » There will be no stub out to your property. 622 01:07:09,760 --> 01:07:14,400 » Okay. That's just on the drawing for >> future 623 01:07:13,280 --> 01:07:19,280 » when they buy my place. >> Correct. 624 01:07:16,799 --> 01:07:21,680 » Would you uh comment about the easement that was asked about? I don't think you 625 01:07:20,799 --> 01:07:23,839 addressed that. >> I think that's probably 626 01:07:22,799 --> 01:07:26,559 » Is that what you were talking about? The >> easement the language on there. I think 627 01:07:25,680 --> 01:07:30,799 it's Thanks, David. >> I couldn't tell on the map that it was 628 01:07:28,079 --> 01:07:32,960 an easement. I just but it was direct obvious something was 629 01:07:32,480 --> 01:07:35,280 » okay >> a thought 630 01:07:33,599 --> 01:07:37,520 » yeah the thought was instead of make it a property line that would be 631 01:07:36,640 --> 01:07:42,319 » it's a good thought >> difficult to then you know obtain 50 632 01:07:40,559 --> 01:07:47,960 foot of rightway is let's just leave it in a track [clears throat] now for 633 01:07:44,640 --> 01:07:47,960 future planning 634 01:07:49,119 --> 01:07:56,559 » all anybody else have any questions for them 635 01:07:54,000 --> 01:07:59,599 » all right thank you >> thank you thank you 636 01:07:57,920 --> 01:08:04,400 » thank All right, we're [clears throat] going to go ahead and move forward to um 637 01:08:02,799 --> 01:08:06,480 commission open for discussion. Do you have anything else you want to discuss 638 01:08:05,520 --> 01:08:10,240 about this? >> Did we close kind of the open? 639 01:08:08,160 --> 01:08:15,280 » It wasn't an open. It was just >> just um Yeah. 640 01:08:13,760 --> 01:08:19,120 » No, I think we're we're done with questions and comments for now. 641 01:08:16,799 --> 01:08:22,319 » I do have a a question for them. I thought you said earlier that they would 642 01:08:20,640 --> 01:08:25,440 we get we was allowed to ask questions. They were going to answer our questions. 643 01:08:24,159 --> 01:08:28,159 Now I have a question. >> We we did and we moved on from that 644 01:08:27,199 --> 01:08:34,480 part. But as I stated earlier, I was just at 645 01:08:31,520 --> 01:08:40,400 the fire district meeting. I went to the fire chief's office. He had the plat on 646 01:08:37,520 --> 01:08:43,839 his wall. He told me himself he has not approved anything for this development. 647 01:08:42,239 --> 01:08:52,000 So I would like to see the paperwork where the fire district approved 648 01:08:47,359 --> 01:08:56,960 on that. And as far as setbacks, developments all over the city, the 649 01:08:54,159 --> 01:09:04,640 county, they for being good neighbors to us, they do work with us and the city 650 01:09:01,120 --> 01:09:11,480 council has the ability to make those setbacks more than five feet. Thank you. 651 01:09:07,920 --> 01:09:11,480 » All right. Thank you. 652 01:09:16,400 --> 01:09:23,199 » Okay, perfect. Um, could you guys verify the fire when they uh asked a question 653 01:09:21,120 --> 01:09:26,719 about uh fire trucks being able to enter around the roundabouts and things of 654 01:09:24,960 --> 01:09:30,640 that nature? Do you guys remember that question? 655 01:09:28,239 --> 01:09:35,359 » So, the um I I didn't personally speak to the 656 01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:40,080 fire department, but I can speak to the design of these streets, the size of 657 01:09:36,960 --> 01:09:45,679 these culde-sacs, the radiuses involved. Those are actually all in in the city's 658 01:09:42,080 --> 01:09:52,159 codes. So any subdivision would have the exact same requirements. So this is not 659 01:09:49,120 --> 01:09:57,360 a situation where um we're asking for any variance for anything any type of 660 01:09:55,520 --> 01:10:03,120 street design that that would affect that. So and you know uh we can confirm 661 01:10:00,880 --> 01:10:08,560 with staff there you know these these culde-sacs are are per code. So that 662 01:10:06,159 --> 01:10:14,920 radius factors that in. >> All right. Thank you. 663 01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:14,920 All right, 664 01:10:16,880 --> 01:10:24,719 we're going to go ahead and close that part of this and move on to discussion 665 01:10:21,280 --> 01:10:30,040 with the board. Thank you. Does the board have any questions or 666 01:10:26,480 --> 01:10:30,040 have anything to discuss? 667 01:10:34,239 --> 01:10:37,679 » I do have a question on the property line. 668 01:10:37,243 --> 01:10:44,000 » [clears throat] >> My name is Kenneth Broadlander, 669 01:10:40,080 --> 01:10:49,280 36307 East, 30 miles. My property line runs a quarter mile north and south. 670 01:10:47,199 --> 01:10:53,679 It's loaded with trees right on the property line. It's been like that for 671 01:10:51,440 --> 01:10:57,600 51 years. What about these trees? Who's going to 672 01:10:55,440 --> 01:11:05,360 be responsible for the trees when they fall on their property? 673 01:11:00,960 --> 01:11:08,480 All right. Thank you. I appreciate that. All right. Once again, we're going to 674 01:11:06,640 --> 01:11:12,080 move on to the discussion piece for the committee that speak and so we can 675 01:11:10,320 --> 01:11:16,320 discuss to see if we can either approve or deny this on forward to the board of 676 01:11:15,199 --> 01:11:18,960 alderman. Thank you. >> No, it's final. 677 01:11:17,600 --> 01:11:22,719 » This is final. >> Yeah, for I'm sorry for the the 678 01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:27,920 finalized preliminary plan. Sorry about that. 679 01:11:25,199 --> 01:11:31,840 I do remember and I can't remember if it was the first time we brought this when 680 01:11:29,679 --> 01:11:36,960 it came to the fire trucks. I think the first time we got this, there was only 681 01:11:33,600 --> 01:11:41,600 one entryway into this development and we asked them to come back to make it a 682 01:11:38,400 --> 01:11:46,560 second one and follow the code to follow to make it easy for them to come in and 683 01:11:44,159 --> 01:11:51,040 also come out if there was a backup or or a emergency. I I vaguely remember 684 01:11:49,360 --> 01:11:54,960 that, but I do think I remember that from a time ago. 685 01:11:52,800 --> 01:12:00,640 » There's two entrances now. Yeah, there was there was so like when it first came 686 01:11:57,199 --> 01:12:04,560 to the board years ago, I think it was one and they changed it to two because 687 01:12:02,000 --> 01:12:06,800 of that concern. >> But that's going off of memory. I could 688 01:12:05,920 --> 01:12:10,640 be wrong though. So yeah, >> I think you're right. 689 01:12:07,520 --> 01:12:13,920 » Is that correct, Matt? >> Yeah, staff did recommend two entrances 690 01:12:12,719 --> 01:12:20,199 in case one is shut down for emergencies. 691 01:12:15,760 --> 01:12:20,199 » Good memory job. 692 01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:30,159 » Regarding Mr. Roadlanders question about the tree line. Is it going to remain 693 01:12:27,040 --> 01:12:35,920 there or >> so? It it would it would definitely be 694 01:12:33,280 --> 01:12:41,040 our intention to maintain trees. Uh there are some absolutely gorgeous trees 695 01:12:38,000 --> 01:12:46,320 on that property and uh you know we will we will be maintaining what trees we 696 01:12:43,040 --> 01:12:50,640 can. Um, I can't speak to his specific property line because I haven't, you 697 01:12:48,239 --> 01:12:56,320 know, looked at that particular one, but as a general rule and our past practice, 698 01:12:53,760 --> 01:13:00,159 and again, I use Heritage Farms, uh, and everybody's welcome to go out there and 699 01:12:57,679 --> 01:13:03,360 take a look at it. We kept absolutely every tree that we could. 700 01:13:01,600 --> 01:13:07,440 » Is that the one on 150? >> Correct. 701 01:13:06,080 --> 01:13:10,320 » I may go ahead. >> Go ahead, Jim. 702 01:13:08,400 --> 01:13:17,280 » I may have misunderstood the question. And I I it may have been preservation of 703 01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:21,920 the trees, but I I thought I understood it as who's going to take care of the 704 01:13:19,520 --> 01:13:25,360 trees when they fall on his property. Was that the 705 01:13:23,440 --> 01:13:31,520 » Yeah, that's what I heard as well. >> Um yeah, so that that was part of the 706 01:13:27,679 --> 01:13:37,360 question. Um so you know definitely as a property rights um question one of the 707 01:13:34,560 --> 01:13:42,480 things that I would say that this gives an advant like right now uh which today 708 01:13:40,480 --> 01:13:45,679 even if this project didn't move forward I'm more than happy to give anybody my 709 01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:51,280 card if something like that happens because it could happen now easier um 710 01:13:48,640 --> 01:13:56,480 you know those those are things that uh the property owner should and would take 711 01:13:53,920 --> 01:14:02,000 care of. I will add one of the advantages to this moving forward versus 712 01:13:59,920 --> 01:14:06,960 some other mechanisms for developing the ground. There is going to be a 713 01:14:03,600 --> 01:14:11,520 homeowners association. So now it's not going to be a very uh I mean it's it's 714 01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:15,440 only 50 homes. We're not putting in a community pool or those types of things, 715 01:14:13,679 --> 01:14:21,520 but there is still going to be a central point of contact. So the homeowners, you 716 01:14:19,679 --> 01:14:25,840 know, with the adjacent properties and stuff like that will have those contacts 717 01:14:23,600 --> 01:14:30,480 available to them. And, you know, some of the things that that do pop up. Uh 718 01:14:28,320 --> 01:14:34,239 we've got some, you know, landscaping, some enhanced landscaping that's going 719 01:14:32,080 --> 01:14:37,440 out out at the street, the trails, those types of things, those are all going to 720 01:14:35,520 --> 01:14:41,679 be maintained and that's all going to happen through this homeowners 721 01:14:38,880 --> 01:14:46,400 association. So, you know, when those things do pop up, there is a mechanism 722 01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:53,520 to deal with them. I I mean I ask it because he asked it as 723 01:14:50,159 --> 01:14:59,679 I understood the question. Um I mean in general the whole issue of trees falling 724 01:14:57,120 --> 01:15:04,480 on adjacent people's property is universal. It's not the subdivisions 725 01:15:02,400 --> 01:15:09,679 problem. It happens every day, you know, and there's there's established rules 726 01:15:06,800 --> 01:15:14,080 and laws about who's supposed to do what and what you can and can't cut. And um 727 01:15:12,560 --> 01:15:17,360 you know there's kind of a legal precedence for all of that stuff. So 728 01:15:16,640 --> 01:15:21,520 » correct. >> Yes. 729 01:15:19,600 --> 01:15:25,360 » Thank you. >> I do have a question and you guys can 730 01:15:23,280 --> 01:15:29,600 educate me on this because a lot of them mention cattle 731 01:15:27,600 --> 01:15:34,640 when you have cattle. Don't you already have like an enclosed barrier for your 732 01:15:31,760 --> 01:15:39,440 cattle be that's like requirement to keep anybody from them coming down or up 733 01:15:37,360 --> 01:15:43,440 or whatever like that or >> Yeah. if they've got a mind of their 734 01:15:41,040 --> 01:15:48,000 own, you know, they often times don't respect fences. It's a common thing, nor 735 01:15:46,159 --> 01:15:52,000 do kids. Um, >> also 736 01:15:50,080 --> 01:15:56,640 what's been brought up a few times is a lot of these old fences aren't going to 737 01:15:53,520 --> 01:16:01,040 match what real property lines are. So, when they go through and develop, 738 01:15:59,360 --> 01:16:04,560 » what happens to our fence if it's three feet on the wrong side? Does it just get 739 01:16:02,800 --> 01:16:10,159 knocked down? Does it get put back up? What happens from there? 740 01:16:08,080 --> 01:16:15,360 » That's Yeah. also probably have fence up. We have our livestock in, but is it 741 01:16:12,719 --> 01:16:20,719 going to remain up through the process? If if the property lines aren't where, 742 01:16:17,679 --> 01:16:24,560 you know, 75 years ago when grandpa put the fence up, it may not be there 743 01:16:23,280 --> 01:16:29,120 anymore. >> That may not be exact. 744 01:16:26,800 --> 01:16:34,640 » All right. Thank you. I appreciate that. >> As as I understood that issue, um I 745 01:16:32,880 --> 01:16:39,120 think they addressed it by saying that they'd work with the property owners. I 746 01:16:36,480 --> 01:16:44,480 mean, I've got a similar situation on my property. Developers building 28 new 747 01:16:42,080 --> 01:16:50,400 lots up against my north and east property lines. You know, I preemptively 748 01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:55,199 paid to have the property all surveyed and staked and pins. And, you know, some 749 01:16:52,960 --> 01:17:00,080 fences were on the line, some fences weren't. You know, I don't know. He 750 01:16:57,840 --> 01:17:05,440 they'll have to address it on a lot bylot basis. as I understood his 751 01:17:02,480 --> 01:17:11,199 response a while ago is that he would work with individual lot owners to make 752 01:17:08,159 --> 01:17:16,400 sure it was worked out. But obviously if one's jogging in and out, I mean it's 753 01:17:14,320 --> 01:17:22,320 just something that has to be resolved. I mean there's uh we were talking last 754 01:17:20,080 --> 01:17:26,719 week about adverse possession and there's issues with that and if you've 755 01:17:24,400 --> 01:17:32,480 been maintaining it you know there's court issues you know so it's a whole 756 01:17:29,440 --> 01:17:37,120 litany of of stuff that just has to play out as the development goes along 757 01:17:34,320 --> 01:17:42,960 whether you fight it you know if they pay and have the property surveyed it 758 01:17:39,600 --> 01:17:48,159 will be there'll be markers that'll be you know what the meetats and bounds 759 01:17:45,199 --> 01:17:52,880 descriptions s by the county dictate. It'll all be laid out by a licensed 760 01:17:50,320 --> 01:17:57,040 surveyor to the hundth of a foot. They'll reconcile all those boundaries 761 01:17:54,960 --> 01:18:03,199 and they may or may not line up with the fences. You you know as as someone said 762 01:17:59,920 --> 01:18:08,480 or multiple people said. So, uh at that point you just have to resolve it. You 763 01:18:05,679 --> 01:18:14,080 know, some people will want to hold on to that fence line, other people may not 764 01:18:10,719 --> 01:18:19,520 care. you know, um the individuals will probably build their own fences, but uh 765 01:18:17,440 --> 01:18:25,040 you know, they won't have the right to take down the fences that's already been 766 01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:32,480 established unless you agree to that. So, um there's not anything this board 767 01:18:28,400 --> 01:18:38,800 can specifically do. Um, and I'll just speak generally to this board and and 768 01:18:35,280 --> 01:18:46,080 you know, the public can listen in, but the way this board works, whether we 769 01:18:42,480 --> 01:18:51,360 like it or not, the city through significant effort, staff and others 770 01:18:49,199 --> 01:18:57,520 make every reasonable effort to make sure that that, you know, one, we pass 771 01:18:55,280 --> 01:19:05,440 regulations and rules. We've spent a lot of time, you know, I've been doing this 772 01:19:00,159 --> 01:19:09,520 off and on for 25 years, you know, um, on this board and other positions in the 773 01:19:07,840 --> 01:19:14,400 city, trying to make sure, you know, that we preemptively anticipate all of 774 01:19:12,560 --> 01:19:18,800 the things that could possibly come up and that we'd have to address. And it's 775 01:19:16,640 --> 01:19:23,520 impossible to do. I can tell you, you can't pass enough rules to, you know, 776 01:19:21,120 --> 01:19:33,600 think, outthink everything situation that can come up. But um we're obligated 777 01:19:27,760 --> 01:19:39,520 by law um if the developer meets the regulations that are on the books at the 778 01:19:36,880 --> 01:19:43,520 time that he presents his plat. We can't preemptively say, "Oh, he's, you know, 779 01:19:41,920 --> 01:19:46,960 doing this. We aren't going to allow that. We're going to change the rules 780 01:19:45,120 --> 01:19:53,120 out from under him." We can get sued over that and lose. So, um, and the city 781 01:19:50,960 --> 01:19:57,840 has in the past run into that where they tried to preemptively change the rules 782 01:19:55,280 --> 01:20:02,880 after the fact. So, uh, we're not going to do or I'm not going to vote to do 783 01:20:00,080 --> 01:20:10,080 anything like that. So, uh, that being said, um, as Matt when you you may or 784 01:20:07,600 --> 01:20:16,560 may not have picked it up, but when he was reading, uh, the provisions and the 785 01:20:13,440 --> 01:20:22,080 directions to this board, uh, I don't remember the exactly exact terms, but 786 01:20:19,440 --> 01:20:26,800 the term was that if it meets all the regulations, the board shall approve. 787 01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:34,239 You know, we don't have any choice but to approve if they meet at all. Um, my 788 01:20:30,719 --> 01:20:39,840 biggest concern, and I guess I would put out a general comment, um, you know, to 789 01:20:38,000 --> 01:20:43,679 the developer, um, 790 01:20:41,360 --> 01:20:49,760 I'm not a big fan of septic systems. They always seem to, you know, fail. I 791 01:20:46,640 --> 01:20:56,640 realize that the regulations provide for them certain lot size restrictions and 792 01:20:52,640 --> 01:21:02,080 and as everybody as I kind of stated before if they meet the regulations we 793 01:20:59,520 --> 01:21:08,960 can't deny it whether we dislike it or not you know but um I would I would just 794 01:21:07,040 --> 01:21:16,560 put out the general comment to the developer um that if you could maybe 795 01:21:13,840 --> 01:21:21,600 look at like an E1 system or some kind of, you know, pumped. I mean, I know you 796 01:21:18,719 --> 01:21:26,800 got rock, you've got uh topography issues, you know, it's not conducive to 797 01:21:23,840 --> 01:21:32,800 the sewer, but the current price, you know, for a lateral system, somewhere 798 01:21:28,880 --> 01:21:37,280 between maybe 20 and $70,000 per lot. You know, those individuals, they're 799 01:21:35,280 --> 01:21:41,440 going to spend that money to put a house on that in addition to the $600 to a 800 01:21:39,679 --> 01:21:49,760 million dollars to build the house, you know, and maybe that's included in the 801 01:21:43,120 --> 01:21:56,239 price. But it seems like um maybe um you know a verier machine with the you 802 01:21:52,560 --> 01:22:00,960 know uh ejection pump stations uh you know I mean they do it in the in 803 01:21:58,719 --> 01:22:06,320 the Branson and southern Missouri area all the time where they do uh you know 804 01:22:03,679 --> 01:22:11,120 these pumped ejection systems because there's just no other way to do it and 805 01:22:09,040 --> 01:22:16,000 uh they apparently work and then the sewage goes to a legitimate treatment 806 01:22:13,679 --> 01:22:21,920 plant and there's not the issue of of runoff. And it seems like, you know, 807 01:22:18,800 --> 01:22:28,080 okay, it maybe it adds to the lot price, but it seems like the system like that 808 01:22:24,639 --> 01:22:33,520 would eliminate that potential for I mean I mean I I I remember one 809 01:22:31,760 --> 01:22:38,320 particular house that I encountered where there were 26 adults living in the 810 01:22:36,159 --> 01:22:41,600 house along with children, you know, we don't know how many people are going to 811 01:22:39,600 --> 01:22:46,320 live. the sewage system was completely overwhelmed. You know, it was out in the 812 01:22:43,920 --> 01:22:53,120 county and so there was nobody really regulating it. But um it uh you know, 813 01:22:50,960 --> 01:22:58,000 when those systems get break down, when they're not maintained, you know, then 814 01:22:55,679 --> 01:23:04,320 sewage starts, you know, seeping out and running off and water quality fails. 815 01:23:00,560 --> 01:23:13,520 They may meet design standards, but I'm not I'm not a big fan of them. I I I 816 01:23:08,159 --> 01:23:19,840 mean I will vote to approve this because based on the staff's review, we you 817 01:23:17,440 --> 01:23:25,840 know, you meet all the requirements. So there's really nothing this board can do 818 01:23:21,760 --> 01:23:31,120 to deny it, you know, but um it seems like that it a system like that 819 01:23:28,480 --> 01:23:39,040 might be both financially and environmentally viable if if it was 820 01:23:34,320 --> 01:23:42,560 looked into. Um, so, um, trying to think of the other stuff. 821 01:23:40,400 --> 01:23:49,280 Privacy fences, that's not going to happen. Uh, you know, um, runoff storm 822 01:23:46,719 --> 01:23:53,600 water. I mean, I like the idea of the ditch checks if they're permanent and 823 01:23:51,280 --> 01:23:58,960 they have some way of wearing out that water in the channelized, you know, uh, 824 01:23:56,480 --> 01:24:05,600 the pre and postdeveloped runoff can be managed um, effectively. Um, 825 01:24:03,920 --> 01:24:10,239 I don't know that I'm a big fan of ribbon curb, but you know, it's probably 826 01:24:08,320 --> 01:24:16,960 better than channelizing it and dropping it off the curb in one big flow. So, you 827 01:24:13,040 --> 01:24:22,400 know, it's reasonable. Um, um, I will say generically, um, the three acres, I 828 01:24:20,800 --> 01:24:27,600 mean, this this thing was already approved [laughter] for several hundred 829 01:24:24,880 --> 01:24:33,679 houses. So, you know, and they wouldn't have had individual septic systems, but 830 01:24:30,480 --> 01:24:39,520 like the traffic impact, you know, the amount of kids, the just the overall I 831 01:24:36,560 --> 01:24:43,600 mean, this is about as unegregious of a development, you know, if you're going 832 01:24:41,440 --> 01:24:48,480 to have property develop, it's about as friendly as it gets. So, you know, so 833 01:24:46,480 --> 01:24:52,560 that's that's about all I have to say. >> No, very well said. Thank you for 834 01:24:50,320 --> 01:24:58,000 explaining doing the explanation on how the process works and I will agree that 835 01:24:55,760 --> 01:25:00,239 it was this was already approved for quite a few 836 01:24:58,960 --> 01:25:03,679 » Yeah. twice houses. >> I mean it expired 837 01:25:01,679 --> 01:25:05,600 » three years ago, correct? >> Yeah. 838 01:25:04,239 --> 01:25:08,000 » Three years ago this was approved. >> Long longer than that. 839 01:25:06,960 --> 01:25:10,800 » No. >> Yeah. It was approved a couple years 840 01:25:09,520 --> 01:25:13,520 four years ago and then again two years ago. 841 01:25:12,080 --> 01:25:17,360 » 379 lots. >> Right. 842 01:25:15,600 --> 01:25:21,760 So >> All right. Perfect. Do we have any more 843 01:25:20,159 --> 01:25:26,000 discussion? Any questions? Anything else? 844 01:25:24,159 --> 01:25:30,560 So, I just want to let you know just to be respectful, we did close the public 845 01:25:27,840 --> 01:25:34,400 hearing and then we allowed you guys to come back up and ask more questions for 846 01:25:32,800 --> 01:25:39,280 just the sake of everything. >> Just curious about blasting. Are we 847 01:25:36,159 --> 01:25:43,120 doing any blasting? >> We don't have any schedule. 848 01:25:42,719 --> 01:25:47,280 » Sorry. >> All right. You're okay. Just just remind 849 01:25:44,639 --> 01:25:51,840 everybody the public hearing's closed. The extra questions are closed. The 850 01:25:49,360 --> 01:25:55,120 board's in discussion and from there we'll finish out the meeting. I 851 01:25:53,120 --> 01:25:59,760 appreciate it. All right. If we have no more questions 852 01:25:56,880 --> 01:26:05,920 or discussion, do we have a motion? >> I'll make a motion to uh approve the 853 01:26:03,120 --> 01:26:09,360 premillinary plant. >> Go ahead. 854 01:26:06,960 --> 01:26:13,760 » I I may just want to clarify with with the conditions 855 01:26:11,280 --> 01:26:17,920 as as presented. I did misspe on the one. It's an eastbound, not a westbound 856 01:26:15,520 --> 01:26:20,480 right turn lane. So >> yeah, 857 01:26:18,560 --> 01:26:23,199 » the one that you clarified with Pam Wiggo, correct? 858 01:26:21,520 --> 01:26:26,239 » Yeah, because in my staff report, I I put westbound, but it's eastbound. So, 859 01:26:24,960 --> 01:26:30,880 » no. Thank you for clarifying. >> Thank you. So, we have a motion. Do we 860 01:26:28,639 --> 01:26:34,080 have a second? >> A second. 861 01:26:31,760 --> 01:26:35,679 » We have a motion in a second. And all in favor say I. 862 01:26:35,360 --> 01:26:37,600 » I. >> I. 863 01:26:36,239 --> 01:26:41,000 » Opposed. >> Motion passes. 864 01:26:41,600 --> 01:26:44,679 All right. 865 01:26:45,520 --> 01:26:51,400 We just did that. All right. If there 866 01:26:52,719 --> 01:26:57,600 » if there are no more discussions, do we have a motion? Uh 867 01:26:56,000 --> 01:27:01,760 » I would just like to make one more comment. I' I'd like to thank all you 868 01:26:59,440 --> 01:27:06,400 guys for coming out. I can't tell you. I mean, you know, the previous two two 869 01:27:04,480 --> 01:27:11,760 approvals, you know, we didn't have anybody show up. You know, it's nice to 870 01:27:08,960 --> 01:27:16,159 get input when we can and and we certainly appreciate you taking the time 871 01:27:13,600 --> 01:27:19,520 and stuff to to show up and let us know what your 872 01:27:17,360 --> 01:27:24,960 » I do have one comment. The letters that were sent out to the public, they were 873 01:27:22,239 --> 01:27:27,679 not addressed as board. They were addressed to someone else. I feel like 874 01:27:27,120 --> 01:27:32,560 that's a >> I don't Did we send any letters out? 875 01:27:30,239 --> 01:27:38,960 » Yes, you guys did. >> They were not addressed as the true 876 01:27:35,360 --> 01:27:45,280 » It's Blue Springs Storage. It's because they own the blue storage country homes 877 01:27:41,920 --> 01:27:48,400 as well. But it's just something maybe you guys need 878 01:27:46,639 --> 01:27:53,360 to make sure when you're doing this. >> Oh, for a separate issue. 879 01:27:50,320 --> 01:27:58,880 » No, just he when he started reading it, he said more development, but that's not 880 01:27:55,600 --> 01:28:03,440 the letters that we got we received. So, I mean, 881 01:28:01,280 --> 01:28:08,239 » we can talk about this after the meeting if you want, but 882 01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:11,920 » there was no there was no notification sent out for a hearing for this specific 883 01:28:11,360 --> 01:28:16,159 thing. >> Yes, that's correct. The public hearing 884 01:28:13,520 --> 01:28:20,120 was for the first item on agenda. Correct. 885 01:28:16,800 --> 01:28:20,120 » The actual 886 01:28:20,800 --> 01:28:27,679 » and it says the the Edgewood Development RDM and it's from the city. 887 01:28:25,600 --> 01:28:30,719 » All right. Excuse me. Let's let the city staff explain and talk. 888 01:28:28,719 --> 01:28:35,520 » I may if I may clarify. So the plenary plat does not require a public hearing. 889 01:28:33,360 --> 01:28:38,560 » We send a courtesy letter so neighbors will know that we're not necessarily 890 01:28:37,280 --> 01:28:42,480 required to do that, >> but we did that so people would know 891 01:28:40,639 --> 01:28:46,320 it's here so they could come participate as part of it. There was not a formal 892 01:28:44,400 --> 01:28:49,280 public hearing requirement, but you as a planning commission allowed them to 893 01:28:47,760 --> 01:28:54,560 communicate. In my um 894 01:28:52,480 --> 01:29:00,080 memo I I mentioned in discussion I said word development the actual 895 01:28:57,760 --> 01:29:03,679 development is blue spring safety storage that is who's actually applied 896 01:29:02,159 --> 01:29:08,320 that is on the application and that was what's in the letter. So I just want to 897 01:29:05,600 --> 01:29:11,760 be clear not bait and switch that is actually who has submitted the 898 01:29:10,560 --> 01:29:14,480 application and that's why they're listed on the letter. 899 01:29:14,080 --> 01:29:17,920 » All right. >> All right. Thank you for clarifying 900 01:29:15,600 --> 01:29:21,120 that. All right. Are there any communication 901 01:29:19,360 --> 01:29:25,199 correspondence? Are there any additional items? 902 01:29:23,600 --> 01:29:28,480 Do we have a motion to adjurnn? >> I'll make a motion to adjurnn. 903 01:29:26,639 --> 01:29:30,880 » Do we have a second? >> Second. 904 01:29:29,280 --> 01:29:34,480 » We have a motion and a second to adjurnn. Any discussion? If not, all in 905 01:29:33,360 --> 01:29:39,719 favor say I. >> I oppose. Meeting adjourn. Thank you.