[This transcript was generated automatically from audio using AI and hasn't been reviewed by a person -- it can contain mistakes, including plausible-sounding sentences that were never actually said. Treat it as a starting point, not a verbatim record.]

[0:00] All right, welcome to the Monday, December 11, 2023, ordinal city council meeting.
[0:06] Note all council members are here in present.
[0:09] We're always through the pledge of allegiance at the meeting, so I invite you to stand up and join us.
[0:16] Budget allegiance to the flag of the United States of America.
[0:23] One nation under the House of Representatives.
[0:30] All right, thanks for that.
[0:31] Next on the agenda is the approval of the agenda, and one vote we will accept the agenda and pass the consent agenda.
[0:38] And I'll go over the consent agenda before we vote on it to see if there's anything.
[0:44] If anyone wants to talk a little bit more about it.
[0:46] With that said, would somebody like to take a stab at the consent agenda tonight?
[0:51] Thank you for the water.
[0:53] Yes, thank you.
[0:55] I'll take care of it this evening and make a motion to accept items one through eighteen as listed in the consent agenda.
[1:07] Okay, with that, so we got one through 18 in the consent agenda tonight.
[1:11] One is the City Council meeting minutes of November 27.
[1:15] Two is the City Council work session minutes of November 27th.
[1:18] Three is City Council closed session minutes of December 4th.
[1:22] Four is claims and bills.
[1:24] I have as approved next work session draft agenda.
[1:27] Six is approval of rental licenses.
[1:29] Seven is retirement of police canines,
[1:32] We're sorry to see zirxes go, where's the chief he's not here?
[1:37] And you know, thanks to North Sharmarina, who funded all those years?
[1:43] Yeah, funded it for that year.
[1:46] A number eight is a point election judges and established absentee ballot board resolution 7434.
[1:53] Niners authorization to accept resignation of Barry Sullivan.
[1:56] Ten is approval to hire custodian.
[1:59] 11 is a appointment of a finance director, Maggie Lynn, is that right?
[2:06] Jim.
[2:08] Jim.
[2:08] Jim.
[2:08] Jim.
[2:09] Jim.
[2:09] Jim.
[2:10] Jim.
[2:12] Jim.
[2:14] Jim.
[2:14] that interviewed her with Adam and Christine.
[2:18] And she's a fabulous choice.
[2:19] She's been here before, you know, Ron speaks very highly of her,
[2:23] so he says we're actually very lucky to have her,
[2:25] so we feel very lucky to have her.
[2:27] So we appreciate all the work of keeping in touch with her as well.
[2:32] So number 13 is the men's city code,
[2:34] government operations ordinance 286.
[2:37] 14 is a men's city code, fire prevention and fire safety standards
[2:41] ordinance 287. 15 is LA-23-60 by
[2:46] Embencine. 3600 Cascol Avenue of
[2:49] Variance Resolution 7432. 16 is
[2:53] Personal Policy Updates. 17 is
[2:57] Employee Payscale Adjustments Resolution
[3:00] 7443. 18 is LA-23-61 Amy
[3:05] with outdoor escapes, and behalf of Jeremy and Stephanie Tom,
[3:12] 2601 Cascol Point Road Variance Resolution 743.
[3:17] That's it.
[3:18] So any of those items, anybody like to have taken off the agenda today?
[3:20] I want to talk more about them.
[3:23] You've seen none.
[3:23] I've got a motion to have a second.
[3:26] Again, Mr. Johnson, all in favor say aye.
[3:28] Aye.
[3:29] You know what that pass is?
[3:30] Five zero.
[3:31] That will bring us to our Community Development Report,
[3:34] which will hit number 19, which is LA-23-45,
[3:40] L.A.L.A. L.A. L.A. L.A. Anderson, vacation of a redway between
[3:44] 1250 and 1260 spruce mobs.
[3:47] How many?
[3:48] Thank you. The applicants are requesting to vacate the
[3:51] unimproved right-of-ways situated between 1250 and 1260 spruce
[3:55] pace owned by the applicants. This unimproved right-of-way
[3:58] terminates at the lake. The right-of-way contains
[4:02] for facilitating overland drainage from spruce place, retaining walls, and approximately
[4:07] 900 square feet of the easily-strived way, which accesses their sidewalk grudge.
[4:12] You know, remember the Planning Commission held a public hearing following the public hearing
[4:16] the Commission voted five to zero on a motion of favor of vacation with the condition that the
[4:21] city maintain a drainage easement. There was quite a bit of discussion at that meeting, both by the
[4:25] Planning Commission in the public. The applicant stated they are amenable to the city
[4:30] maintaining a drainage easement over that area.
[4:33] Supportive comments from the neighbors
[4:34] were received at the meeting and in writing.
[4:38] Adam Edwards provided a comment on the request
[4:40] and opposition of the vacation.
[4:42] He indicated that the site served as a drainage wave for the area,
[4:45] and it is identified as a possible future public access
[4:48] to the lake, areas that provide a public purpose
[4:51] should not be vacated.
[4:53] Access to the lake for the public is provided by Sandy Beach
[4:56] to the south and the city's fishing dock off
[5:00] New to the north and both are within 500 feet of this location. The challenge with vacating rights of
[5:05] ways that vacation is a final action. Should the public or the city have access or utility
[5:10] needs in the future of the cost to re-acquire the property would be at a premium? Staff recommends
[5:17] denial of the vacation request at this time is there's currently a public benefit for drainage
[5:22] purposes. And a future in the future use of the land is yet in determined. Should the council
[5:28] find that the right away does not have a public purpose, and determines vacation is appropriate.
[5:33] staff does recommend that the city maintain a drain management over the area. Tonight, council
[5:38] should direct staff to draft a resolution reflecting your decision. I can answer questions if
[5:42] you have any, and that up can as well. Any questions for staff? I think we have the applicant here
[5:48] I'm assuming. The applicant here tonight? You are. Okay. Any questions for staff? The applicant
[5:55] I'd like to come up and talk about your item there.
[5:58] I know you were at planning commission, so.
[6:01] Yeah, I
[6:04] spoke then.
[6:06] This property has been in our family since 1972.
[6:09] We have maintained this property for more than 50 years,
[6:13] along with our neighbor Jim Easley here.
[6:16] And we have installed more than $20,000 worth of rip wrap
[6:20] on the shoreline.
[6:21] We have managed the drainage.
[6:23] I have installed a $15,000 drain system in my own basement
[6:26] because it drains directly into my basement.
[6:30] And I had a lot of times during the year.
[6:32] In 1979, my mother had a letter from the city.
[6:35] She came before the council, and they deemed it
[6:38] not appropriate for any type of city purpose,
[6:40] because it is a watershed.
[6:43] So at times when it rains, it will fill up three to six feet wide.
[6:46] There's really no way that the public's ever
[6:48] going to use it as an access.
[6:51] And just down the street about four houses,
[6:53] there's a lovely lake access that is maintained by the city.
[6:56] they do a moat, and they take care of it.
[6:59] There's also, as mentioned, to the left of us,
[7:03] within a 500 feet, there is the Lomelinda Lake Access,
[7:05] which has a public dock.
[7:07] And then there's also a public access at Sandy Beach.
[7:10] So there are actually three public lake accesses.
[7:12] They're very close to this property.
[7:15] And being able to split this with our neighbors,
[7:18] we would be able to make some much needed improvements
[7:20] to both of our properties.
[7:22] Easily, would be able to pave their driveway.
[7:24] it is the only unpaved gravel driveway on our street currently and they would have a safer
[7:29] better access to their garage. So these are kind of all the reasons why we would like to
[7:36] see this split between our two properties and again it's just something that we've been paying
[7:42] to mow and maintain for nearly 50 years so that is kind of all I have to say about it. Thank you.
[7:48] I have a question for you.
[7:52] So, had you at, had you notified the city that there was some issues with drainage there along the way?
[8:00] No, we've been maintaining it for so long and we had a much bigger city problem with the sewer at the end of the street that we really focused on that being fixed and my mother actually did get that.
[8:11] The city to put in a new, I can't remember what it's called, but some type of pump.
[8:15] We are the lowest point in the neighborhood.
[8:16] lift, a lift station made a lift station that she worked on for about 20 years and it finally
[8:20] was passed and it's fantastic but we used to have a lot of sewer back up in our basement so
[8:25] that was the one battle that we really chose to fight there and my mother is a service like
[8:29] naturalist and she'd done a lot of work too when when she bought the house it was a big
[8:33] muddy mess, it was full of old tires and bottles and rebar and it was that 40 feet of just mud
[8:39] and through the years she did a lot to maintain it, put some nice boulders in, plant all the grass
[8:44] that would then drain the water from the street
[8:47] into the lake without it being kind of a muddy mess.
[8:51] And something to note also, there is also a drainage
[8:53] that happens on 1230s per place.
[8:57] So three houses, there's another, what you would call,
[9:00] like, a public drainage site, but it's on private property.
[9:03] So there's actually a culvert that runs through their property
[9:05] to drain, so that's just something to note
[9:08] that I think, even though this would be on private property,
[9:11] that's never been an issue for the last.
[9:12] I think they've owned it 70 years that house so, and we're happy to have the city have an easement there to take care of any drainage problems that might arise.
[9:21] I know it's the one down the street is obviously a pretty large call for access.
[9:26] You've got a bunch of lake access.
[9:29] Obviously it's been uncontested that we know that this is kind of a water area that goes down.
[9:36] And so I know, and thank you for saying that you don't have any problem with what they're keeping an easement.
[9:41] No, not at all.
[9:42] And a lot of people make a big issue about that the DNR sends letter and they don't recommend
[9:47] doing it.
[9:48] But the DNR as is, we all know up here at least have been doing this for the DNR as per their
[9:52] policy always says no.
[9:55] Now, historically, just to give you a little perspective, too, before we read it, our
[9:59] comprehensive plan.
[10:02] That was our policy as well. We took a little more proactive approach to that because we have a lot of issues and things like this around the community that are old fire lanes, old roads and the window to the lake that don't exist anymore.
[10:15] And we changed that because we thought common sense should prevail and that we should at least look at these on a case by case basis to see if it makes sense to clean it up.
[10:25] and it not just get rid of it, but clean it up so it makes sense for the
[10:29] property owners, and if there are lake accesses, and it seems like from my
[10:32] perspective, this kind of fits all those requirements, you've got all the
[10:35] different lake accesses around you. It's not an issue. This is kind of an old fire
[10:39] remnant as well, and a watershed issue. And so I think I'd be definitely very
[10:46] supportive of doing it, but keeping the easement on there for the water drain
[10:51] for sure. I have a question. I don't know if it's for you or the other homeowner, though, the
[10:56] driveway issue is that in your, that's not your property, okay. You know, the home was built
[11:03] so long ago and then you can see their property line actually ends kind of right at the apron
[11:07] of their garage and it would be really impossible to access if they weren't able to kind of use that
[11:12] area there. So that would be, again, a big improvement to hold their home in the neighborhood.
[11:20] So I do have a question then for you if, thank you.
[11:25] So it sounds like part of the issue here is erosion or gravel that is moving around or moving
[11:32] toward the lake.
[11:33] And I'm wondering if this issue has ever been addressed historically through any variants
[11:37] or quest or any other sort of formal process with the city?
[12:05] And it is a nice thing.
[12:06] I think it must have been somebody's mom who found the letter from the city back in
[12:12] I think your mom was here at public comments, if I remember.
[12:18] Not public comments, but the planning commission.
[12:28] I don't see how people can get down through the water
[12:31] because they're trees that are planted into the space.
[12:38] It's just,
[12:41] especially when it's raining,
[12:45] flowing through there.
[12:47] And downwards, close to the lake shore,
[12:50] it can get 15 to 20 feet wide.
[12:56] water there. It's not contained in it.
[13:04] Thank you.
[13:09] That is the great-year gravel dryway that goes all the way across there now, right?
[13:14] Our lotline currently is about where the telephone pole is.
[13:18] Yeah, and it runs just to the left, to the Lakeshore.
[13:34] It's just...
[13:45] So you've been unable to pave that because it's on city property.
[13:49] But is there an easement for the driveway across there now there is not there's not well
[13:54] there would what you would need there isn't an improvement. Yeah, which was just as at also a point
[14:00] So even if this is turned into a training easement we will still need a corrosionment agreements
[14:05] For things like driveways still ways
[14:09] Retaining walls structures that's what sit inside of our training management and does this change the hard-covered calculations then as well
[14:20] So what do you mean or each property
[14:22] They'd be able to get large amounts of square footages.
[14:26] We'll be able to have more part of it.
[14:29] As a public right away, it's not excluded.
[14:32] If it is vacated by it in half, then the property will obviously get bigger.
[14:38] So part of the reason we have not pursued any kind of improvement of the gravel driveway
[14:44] is that we have a water problem with the garage.
[14:48] We have some very mature maple trees on the other side.
[14:52] And they represent the high point in the yard, and so the drainage goes into our production.
[14:58] It really isn't anything to about it.
[15:02] And so, in doing something that's going to have to get ripped out later on, we thought, you know, let's plan for this and see where we want to go.
[15:22] We have we ever done in this city, an encroachment agreement to allow a homeowner to pave part of a driveway in a public right-of-way lake access.
[15:30] Yes. Thank you.
[15:34] Any questions for the applicant?
[15:36] Okay, thanks.
[15:40] All right.
[15:51] Jay 9, I got our 1386 REST Point Road, Orno.
[15:54] I put in for a minor property line adjustment years ago.
[16:00] I completely understand why you guys are doing what you're doing.
[16:05] But here I am looking at someone who put a driveway in city property.
[16:10] You're about to give him the property and for some reason,
[16:13] My minor property line adjustment that nobody knew about you guys spent all kinds of time figuring out some minor
[16:20] Technicality to prevent me from doing it even though I own both properties. So I just want to point out for here because y'all know we're in litigation
[16:30] I was going to point out for here right now
[16:33] They are minor property line adjustment that made no effect on the city compared to what this is
[16:39] was completely denied and worked on for not denied,
[16:41] but you have something to say about this item in particular,
[16:44] not your agency's litigation.
[16:46] This item, in particular, is going,
[16:49] you are actually giving them city property to do it.
[17:04] Drive way, since we've moved
[17:08] there, a number of years before.
[17:12] When did you move there again?
[17:20] Yeah, and so I thought I had a couple things, I guess.
[17:25] So I heard the applicant mentioned that they,
[17:29] You know, from the 60s they had that the city had no use for it, but I read in my pack
[17:34] here that the city saw that it was a potential public use for access.
[17:41] When the park's commission did the last look at Lake Access points, it was just, it was
[17:45] one that it was identified as maybe we looked at again in the future.
[17:50] About two years ago, three years ago, we did a project where, you know, the Lake Access
[17:56] is that at the most promising immediate use for extra in access, down to the Lakeshore, this
[18:02] didn't make the cut for that, but it was one of the ones that the Republicans will get
[18:07] again in the future.
[18:09] Yeah, I mean, I see, I don't know, I'm not as comfortable about giving up this in
[18:20] the 50 years
[18:22] that my family has owned this property.
[18:24] No one has used this as a public access.
[18:26] So the one that is up the street from us that's three houses up is very heavily used for
[18:31] TV's for snowing fields for people going on the lake to fish.
[18:34] So when we just talk about it being in public access, the other two are maintained and
[18:38] safe and they're much easier to access and no one even the people across the street
[18:41] to us have ever used it.
[18:43] So there are much better accesses that we have within a very area.
[18:55] One public benefit that this lives is, we have the busiest fishing shoreline
[19:06] coming there
[19:07] every day, fishing because
[19:16] it's a good, it serves a pretty nice purpose,
[19:23] or the fish I can just
[19:41] OK. So, yeah, so I mean, if we've kind of identified this, even on the fringe of being a possible
[19:47] site to look back at, I'm more comfortable, you know, coming back with, you know, not sure why the
[19:56] of the property.
[20:00] To the north there meets the driveway needs to come all the way to the edge of this,
[20:07] but we definitely need to have an agreement in place for that.
[20:13] And if the city's land is causing problem for the property owners, that's why I asked if you contacted the city. I wanted to make sure that we were doing our part, but we need to make sure that we're maintaining them to the point,
[20:30] or when I'm causing problems to the neighboring properties.
[20:37] So I think they can, I see the need to clean up that corner, and we can do that through
[20:44] an easement.
[20:45] How I see it?
[20:50] Can we see the overhead view again?
[21:00] Go, can you go back to one?
[21:02] There.
[21:07] You see how they have their gravel?
[21:11] No, I've got a picture of it on Google Earth, too.
[21:18] Matt, you're suggesting to go with what the, um,
[21:21] the board said in their five to zero vote, and I'm sorry.
[21:26] I mean, you're saying to move forward with the maintaining the
[21:29] great drainage easement?
[21:31] No, I'm talking about not granting the vacation and if staff can work
[21:39] with the applicant to the north to find a reasonable easement agreement
[21:45] over the top of it.
[21:48] Okay, an accroachment agreement with the applicant to the north,
[21:57] I don't know what's reasonable.
[21:58] That seems excessive to me.
[22:01] Was there, you know, the mound driver that's there right now.
[22:06] But I, I'll leave that to staff to work with them on that.
[22:11] I guess I'd be in favor of what the planning commission said,
[22:14] only because we favor self-slexibility in these items to clean neighborhoods up when we have
[22:21] lots of additional access points that are just, just houses away.
[22:26] And this is an old fire lane that doesn't exist for a fire lane purpose anymore.
[22:30] But it does serve a drainage issue and that will little want to keep.
[22:37] So I'd like to go through a couple things here.
[22:41] The bar for vacation of public land in Orno is high by design, and we're a Lakeshore city
[22:49] that is a finite number of city owned access points.
[22:54] And as I consider this application, I think it's important to remember that public land
[22:59] is a precious resource that requires oversight, because when our city decides to vacate land,
[23:06] typically that's not going to return to the public.
[23:10] And in terms of how this request affects our city as a whole,
[23:13] I think it's important to look at this request
[23:15] in the context of history.
[23:17] And I did check with staff to understand a little bit more
[23:20] about how many leak access points we have.
[23:24] And the number is, it was about 41, five years ago,
[23:30] and today it's 39.
[23:32] So we've decreased the number and we're
[23:34] not going to be getting more of those in the future. So the considerations I'm thinking of as I
[23:40] deliberate with on this vacation request is one whether or not this request aligns with our
[23:50] 2040 comprehensive plan and in that plan it states that or now will maintain like access for all
[23:58] as it ends and it's the city's intent to permanently retain
[24:03] for public use all existing like access corridors and
[24:06] file lanes regardless of the current level of use or maintenance.
[24:12] So whether the public is actively using a right of way
[24:15] is not necessarily a factor in assessing its worth to the city
[24:18] or the public and the city's guiding documents states
[24:22] that the intention is routine, these public lands.
[24:24] My second point is that this vacation is not supported by city staff, whether it be the engineer or the
[24:32] and community development planning department, one because it serves a public drainage benefit
[24:37] and possible potential use, and number two because vacations are permanent, and the DNR
[24:43] is essentially the same thing. And number four, the issues are real ones as they relate to
[24:51] the erosion issue, which is why I ask that question about whether or not that issue can be addressed in a different format.
[25:00] Not and whether or not a variance or encroachment agreement has been considered in the past, because it seems to me a more reasonable way of assessing this within the context of what's being asked, and I don't believe that necessarily a vacation of public land is required here.
[25:19] And it doesn't sound like that's been entertained, and that's, I believe, the point that
[25:25] Council Member Johnson was addressing a moment ago.
[25:27] And finally, the state statute support this vacation request, and the state statute reads
[25:33] that no vacations will be made unless it appears in the interest of the public to do so.
[25:38] And I think that the crux of the matter here is that there's not a clear and identified,
[25:43] an identifiable benefit to the public at large with relation to the vacation request.
[25:51] And I think it's easy with some of these looks that we're doing at these public right
[25:56] of ways to begin to consider that the city must assess or justify its use or how it is
[26:04] using public land, especially when there's brush on the site or when it's an undesirable piece
[26:11] I think it's easy to get in the habit of saying, well, how is the city using that land, rather than saying, by vacating it, what are we doing to serve the public at large?
[26:24] And it's clear that it may benefit the folks in that street or in the neighboring parties, but I struggled to see how that's going to benefit the original public at large or the public beyond that.
[26:36] And also the factor here of precedent and setting a precedent of addressing what may be a real issue regarding erosion by looking at the vacation of public land that does not seem necessary in this case.
[26:55] So I'm not supportive of the idea of vacating public land to resolve an issue that is a real one for sure.
[27:07] But an issue that might be looked at being resolved in a different way.
[27:12] And I would look to staff for some guidance on that.
[27:16] It sounds like there is some history there with regard to working with issues where a driveway placement or drainage issues,
[27:24] is maybe impacting people negatively.
[27:27] We're reach any of the thoughts?
[27:29] Yes, I just would defer back to public access
[27:34] being a few houses down correct, and that's where I think
[27:38] sometimes when you have multiple access points,
[27:40] you do there is danger involved in not having
[27:43] a clear streamline approach.
[27:44] So if we were to do improvements in better markings,
[27:48] would your resources be better spent and possibly safer
[27:51] if you had all entrances in exit?
[27:53] really marked and if we can't do that, there could be a safety risk. I did listen to the
[27:59] Parks Commission and they're thoughts on it and think with some encroachment, encroachment
[28:07] within the easement and drainage easement, I think we're the two items that I think were
[28:14] for sure necessary but seemed very, I don't know, desirable by everybody I think I would
[28:21] be in favor.
[28:22] I don't need as much time to say that I think it does meet the qualifications for doing what
[28:27] we have to do and I'll just get to it, because I will just then make a motion to accept
[28:33] a deaf staff, bring a resolution to vacate the right away with the drainage easement,
[28:38] as well as an encroachment agreement regarding the items that are in the easement.
[28:42] It's so like to talk about this a little bit.
[28:44] Okay, that's the discussion a little bit more.
[28:50] With these interesting things that we have throughout the city, I think it has been our
[28:55] complication.
[28:59] I guess if we can look at it like,
[29:09] you know, it was a situation that it was not really being utilized as a far-away and so forth, and
[29:15] never well-being
[29:17] so
[29:18] the benefit to the city
[29:20] for the most part is no
[29:26] as long as
[29:28] and unfortunately electronically, I'm not working real well tonight.
[29:37] I don't think that
[29:40] if there isn't other access point in the area and it's more accessible.
[29:48] I'd like
[29:51] to understand a little bit more because to my reading with state statute and with a
[29:56] complaint, it's not an indication of whether or not
[30:00] There are other accesses, close by. It's an indication of whether or not there would be public benefit to vacating the property in question here.
[30:10] To my reading, there's nothing saying that the residents also, I would think, constitute the benefit and they are part of the public.
[30:18] And if we can come up with a whole bunch of things, they are part of the public.
[30:22] I'm Melanie, would you mind speaking to that?
[30:24] Because from my reading again with the, with the, with the compound and with states statute,
[30:28] I'm trying to, to understand a little bit more about.
[30:32] There is not an obligation on the part of the city to vacate land just because there is a better access point
[30:39] or clearly marked one 500 feet away.
[30:41] That's not necessarily determining factor and whether or not we vacate this public land.
[30:46] I
[30:52] think we can talk about a whole bunch of different public issues.
[30:56] It's not a requirement that there's public accesses.
[30:59] We have the ability because we did change the campaign.
[31:02] You take the common sense approach to be able to look at what makes sense from our standpoint
[31:07] and not just say no, not just say yes, but we take all the circumstances into consideration
[31:14] when we make a decision.
[31:16] Okay.
[31:16] That makes sense.
[31:17] Let me just clarify, the drainage is still either, correct?
[31:23] That's what I put, that's what I put motion.
[31:25] The mayor's motion was, okay.
[31:27] To vacate the existing easement and establish a new easement for drainage.
[31:33] I'm wondering if I could do the right away with the easement and an encroach from agreement,
[31:36] but the stuff within the easement, which then covers kind of the whole kitten.
[31:40] So I have a motion, do I have a second?
[31:43] I'll second.
[31:44] I must.
[31:44] I put a friendly amendment to that.
[31:47] I will listen to the friendly amendment.
[31:49] I will listen to the friendly amendment.
[31:51] Can we have a pedestrian access over the top with the utility easement?
[32:00] I guess that's what you have now.
[32:02] That's what you have now.
[32:04] Right now we have a right of way, which is the most generous to the city easement we can have.
[32:13] it's as if it's our own property. So the way it is now that allows transportation across that
[32:22] easement, as well as the various different kinds of utilities. In this case, the utility
[32:27] that is there is a form of stormwater utility. So when you take it and change it from and so on
[32:34] can jump in, I see him nodding. You can change it from a right way to a drainage easement. It's still
[32:39] management, you've just reduced the benefits to the city for that easement.
[32:47] We've limited it, yes, because now it's an easement, we're just minimized in the easement to drainage.
[32:55] If you added back in, transportation over the site, then we're basically back to it.
[33:01] Yes, that's right away.
[33:02] And you show us the other one that's closed by.
[33:06] There's two of them, yeah.
[33:07] One, oh, sorry.
[33:09] I only thought two of them.
[33:10] Yes, there's the blue one.
[33:11] Well, she's looking at somebody.
[33:12] I just want to put on the record.
[33:14] I think we've met every threshold.
[33:16] I mean, I think we've met the threshold of vacating this.
[33:20] So I want to be clear.
[33:21] And all the other ones is yes.
[33:23] And so I'm not disputing that.
[33:28] But I think we can do it with a encroachment agreement.
[33:31] But I just wanted to say I wasn't in.
[33:35] I believe we've met the threshold to vacating.
[33:39] That's not my no-board isn't for that.
[33:41] Let's finish this at the movies we got a whole bunch.
[33:43] So I'll remove my friendly amendment,
[33:46] which was never adopted in the first place.
[33:48] I do have a motion in a second.
[33:49] Yeah, and I would.
[33:50] I'm calling for the board.
[33:51] So all in favor.
[33:52] But you won't, I just want to make sure you won't listen to anything else I've to see.
[33:55] I'm calling for the board.
[33:57] All in favor.
[33:57] Can we, I'd prefer to listen first.
[34:01] If that's okay.
[34:02] I would like to make sure I heard it.
[34:04] Oh, this is my first time hearing this.
[34:05] The mayor called the board.
[34:06] So I'm going to let that go.
[34:07] of all itself, on favor say aye.
[34:10] Aye.
[34:11] Aye.
[34:12] Okay, I pass this three to two.
[34:14] Thank you.
[34:15] Aye.
[34:15] If I want to get in touch with Melanie?
[34:17] Yes.
[34:18] Who's seconded that, please?
[34:20] Aye.
[34:21] It was Maria.
[34:23] And that you should probably get in touch with Melanie or somebody for the talk
[34:27] about the encroachment agreement.
[34:29] No.
[34:29] I'll work on that.
[34:30] And then we'll bring that back at the next.
[34:32] Oh yeah.
[34:32] That's right.
[34:33] Cause you're going to bring it back to us.
[34:37] Okay, I don't bring any more community development report. I don't see a lower here, so
[34:42] Laura's out sick today. So you probably have a slide force though.
[34:47] Ron just included it in his finance.
[34:49] Okay.
[34:51] Anything else from your middle any then?
[34:53] No, thank you.
[34:54] Okay, thanks.
[34:55] Okay, that'll bring us to our finance report.
[34:57] with the monolson is last meeting here.
[35:14] Okay, so we have number 20, which is at app 2024, Long Lake Faire operating budget. And that one is actually Mr. Edwards.
[35:23] Okay, well, before you have the adoption of the 2024 Long Lake Faire operating budget, this was first provided to the council back in September at the time that the primary budget,
[35:34] preliminary levy was set. It was tabled at that point as far as the approval of this budget.
[35:43] And staff was directed as was the fire advisory board work with the city of Long Lake on adjusting the budget.
[35:51] The budget that you have before you is an adjusted budget. Now, it's a bit nuanced. The overall Long Lake fire budget remains the same.
[36:00] So there was no change, there are some minor moves within the budget but the end number
[36:06] for the budget remains the same.
[36:08] What has changed is the distribution.
[36:11] So worked long way and did acknowledge the reduction of the Navar area.
[36:17] Does reduce ornose portion of that budget by acknowledging the reduction in the land value
[36:24] and the reduction in the average number of fire calls that are both the factors and
[36:30] the allocation of the budget done. So you can see that in there. We need to do this vote
[36:40] into pieces due to a conflict of interest concern. So I, as the, as I wrote the council
[36:49] action, I did divide it into two pieces. One is to look at approving the long-lake fire operating
[36:57] budget for 2024 as written less the wage increases and the duty crew portion of the budget
[37:05] and then a second motion to consider those two items, which the latter vote on those two items
[37:13] can't remember which I believe is intending to recuse ourselves from since she is related to a fire fire
[37:18] that would direct the benefit.
[37:19] You later, she's been here, you'd do a fire fire.
[37:22] I'm going to give her more credit.
[37:25] So the operation budget is going to be one with the duty crew or with the, I divided it into two, so I took the, and just so we're clear, both boats will have to carry.
[37:38] Could you call it up on the screen please?
[37:39] Both boats will have to carry in order for the, the budget to be approved.
[37:44] Yep.
[37:45] Yes.
[37:46] Thank you.
[37:46] It stales.
[37:50] I have another question.
[37:51] I can hear if you want to.
[37:52] Yeah,
[37:55] one is the motion to approve the budget last May and duty crew budget lines, and then the second one is, again, approve the budget, which is the call in training,
[38:05] I recall in training pay increases, so two separate motions to separate votes within that item.
[38:14] But it is just the wages by itself.
[38:17] Yes, right.
[38:17] The wages of duty crew and operational budget minus wages.
[38:20] Is duty crew and wages are separate?
[38:23] Are separate?
[38:24] Duty crew is a wage?
[38:25] So we take that in the actual wages and the duty crew, how it is the first item.
[38:32] And do you have a conflict of interest on the duty crew vote?
[38:34] Because it could be a wage.
[38:36] So I consulted with Sorn and got the advice.
[38:39] And asked if we could separate it because I wanted to be able to vote on the budget.
[38:44] So there I could have thought I would try to write the council action.
[38:48] First one, there.
[38:49] Motion to approve the 2024 long-lake fire operating budget less pay and duty crew budget the budget lines.
[38:55] And then the second motion would be to approve the budget of the fire call training paying increases in the duty curve, which is also, again, combined together as an approval of the budget.
[39:07] But as you have any more just details on the budget itself kind of what you worked out and what's still to be worked out as we kind of go a little bit.
[39:18] So, just some highlights for the 2024 budget, some things that make it different than previous budget years, which are much more straightforward.
[39:28] So, the first we've already alluded to is a long-lick fire has implemented a volunteer duty crew program.
[39:36] They did a pilot program, this year using their state safety dollars or grants dollars.
[39:50] And so in the budget there is an inclusion continuing that program into 2024 as a budgeted item.
[39:57] So...
[40:00] That is one of the items that's different. And then I did, in the packet, as I think it's
[40:07] Exhibit C, I put in what the Long Lake fire chief had put together as the program, kind of
[40:13] aligning the program and what its purpose is for. So, and they are, you know, the program is aimed
[40:19] at targeting service times with the goal of getting those duty crews out the door in two minutes.
[40:24] And also, I think also of key importance is the improvement of firefighter-skill levels by providing additional training opportunities to those firefighters who take advantage of the duty group pace of, you know, they're coming on ship for four hours, and there's nothing to call out there, they're not just sitting there, they're doing, they're doing training.
[40:46] So the 2024 budget includes that, the one thing we did talk about, at least the staff level
[40:53] back and forth was that this is still an early program that still needs adjustments,
[40:59] they're still refining, refining, how it works from what they originally set out.
[41:04] And that idea would be to continue to provide updates via the Fire Advisory Board, which was
[41:10] the partnering city sit on so that the cities were still having an opportunity to provide feedback.
[41:17] The second thing I already mentioned to you is the allocation formula,
[41:22] portion, so the reduction of the Navar service area, which begins in July of 2024,
[41:29] drastically, impacts the way that that allocation formula works. The budget that you received in September,
[41:36] we didn't back that out. We were going to we had planned staff to staff to back that out
[41:40] But once we got there, so that we would approve a budget with all that, then the way that it would be allocated, the actualals would be allocated as we got to the 3rd and 4th course would be using the new allocation.
[41:55] But in the interim time, we were able to apply the new allocation formula.
[42:00] When you say staff to staff, you mean our staff and long-lake staff.
[42:04] Correct.
[42:05] So that is backed out of the numbers now.
[42:07] it is backed out of the numbers. That's the reason you see a reduction from what you're
[42:10] already saw in September.
[42:14] And then finally I think the third big piece of what makes this
[42:17] budget different than past budgets is that it does include a substantial wage increase for the
[42:24] firefighters, something that's probably long overdue, and the budget proposal as presented
[42:30] increases the hourly wage for the paid-on call firefighters from $13 an hour for training
[42:37] for response to 15 to 65 an hour.
[42:41] So, and I will say that that wage increase was something that was, I think, unanimously supported
[42:46] by all members of the Fire Advisory Board from all of the different cities.
[42:53] I did that answer.
[42:55] I just want to just give you a brief overview before we figure any questions or any discussion
[43:00] about it.
[43:01] It seems like we've kind of got as close as we can get there's going to be like you said nuances
[43:05] moving forward with just changes and just getting information on how the pilot program is
[43:09] working, I just say it's too early to get really any of that information at this point,
[43:13] so that's going to be a little bit of a moving target, which I think we're close enough
[43:16] at this point, so I'm good with that to continue to move it forward, so I don't know what anybody
[43:21] else is thoughts are here, so, or if anybody has anything to do with it.
[43:24] Well, I have, so,
[43:28] Adam, would you be willing, will you pull up exhibit C, UD crew program?
[43:34] I think, in a nutshell, my opinion is, you know, the, you know, we had about $40,000 in increased
[43:44] due to the hourly wage increase, and there is $60,000 in the duty crew.
[43:55] So the operational budget plus the wage increase for the fire fires, I'm 100% there now.
[44:03] So the question to me is the duty crew and, you know, here's my concern, I mean even on this, you can see up in the top there it said this was first issued, uh, first issued in 2023.
[44:22] the current revision was back from O3 2003.
[44:27] I don't know what happened, and it's probably the same.
[44:30] I think that's a typo.
[44:31] It should be 2023.
[44:35] And then at the bottom of this,
[44:38] it says that there will be an update to this in the next three weeks,
[44:42] I think it said,
[44:51] and that we were going to get an update in the next three weeks
[44:55] to the standard operating procedures
[44:57] of the duty crew.
[45:00] And where this, you know, duty crew is different. You know, James, do you mind coming forward?
[45:09] Is this duty crew is a volunteer model with the existing paid-on call and they sign up for shifts?
[45:20] And, you know, James, would you just explain the difference between the food just for the record?
[45:25] Sure, absolutely, so this one, they receive a stipend for volunteering to be on shift, right?
[45:33] So ours is different where we're actually hiring part-time individuals to work during the day for those shifts.
[45:40] And why did you, why did you, because we already went through this conversation, but just to bring us everybody current,
[45:47] is why did we go with that versus the model that long-lake is?
[45:53] So I thought it would be easier to hire individuals that wanted to work during the day as part time firefighters and then they would eventually move on to be full time firefighters because it was a big group of them that wanted to do that out there.
[46:07] This model was just what excels you started with and that's what Mike was familiar with and they did well over there with that so I believe that's why he chose this model.
[46:16] And the issue that makes sense to me is the daytime responsiveness is our issue, specifically
[46:26] out of station number two's territory, we've been doing all call during daytime, calling
[46:31] everybody.
[46:32] And the reason is is because we don't have the same availability of firefighters available
[46:38] during daytime hours.
[46:40] Correct.
[46:40] For the most part, they're working there full-time jobs that span their mortgage and a lot
[46:44] and most types of things, so they're taking time out of their days to be able to fill these shifts, so.
[46:49] So when you go to this volunteer model during the day, it's the same group of people and therefore you have the same problem,
[46:55] because even we can say it's early in early stages of the duty crew at Long Lake,
[47:04] but their model is trying to use the labor that they already know they have a shortage of and they're not getting the slots filled.
[47:12] I will say this in the conversation with Chief Fallon and crackling with the fire advisory board, but he showed kind of an increase in
[47:21] Phil Rates as the months went on. Is that what others had heard of the fire advisory board meeting?
[47:27] Or I can still talk to everything, Chris.
[47:30] Yeah, sorry.
[47:32] Station one they said was still an issue. I think they showed they had put
[47:37] to excuse me was still an issue to staff. They should
[47:40] one, they were finding, I think it outlined that they were going to do one person at
[47:45] station one from this and they were building it actually up to four people. It's
[47:49] station one. At station two I want to probably pull it up. They provided us I think
[47:56] of all the shifts for October. Maybe only five of them had two people, so a full
[48:04] I know when we also talked to other freight apartments that had started the same model and found out that the problems that they were having was for number one reliability.
[48:15] And number two of the people that were coming and doing these daytime shifts are getting their credits and then they weren't going to the on call calls.
[48:20] So they were getting sort of on call calls.
[48:23] So they ended up being such a bad experience.
[48:25] They think up and plummet.
[48:25] They abandoned that.
[48:26] Just went to the full duty crew of model, which they said was much much much better.
[48:31] which is obviously the way we're going to be doing this.
[48:34] Yeah, that's what we utilize that model based off of
[48:37] Minotock and Polethan, even Prairie in those larger cities
[48:41] that we're seeing a little more successful.
[48:43] But I'm comfortable with the pay increase.
[48:47] My concerns would be are we, maybe I'm stepping on Matt Stos
[48:53] saying the same thing, but are we not stepping on my toes
[48:57] if you're seeing the same thing?
[48:58] Well, what I'm saying is I'm reiterating it.
[49:01] But are we answering the problem at Station 2 daytime calls?
[49:07] Because I implementing the duty crew and we've got proper response time from Station 1,
[49:13] which really wasn't a problem.
[49:16] I don't feel like we're addressing anything.
[49:18] What Station 2, we're going to take that over in July, so that, so we're going to be implementing
[49:22] a full of the crew.
[49:23] Some of the territory.
[49:25] Part of my entire territory, at least over there, but we don't have any information to see
[49:30] there's just working and we won't have it moving forward.
[49:33] So we're gonna give us a smattering of times.
[49:35] It's a little bit to be, they're doing better
[49:37] with their turn-out times.
[49:38] I don't think they're hitting their two-minute goal,
[49:40] but I know they've improved that dramatically,
[49:43] at least from what Mike's supplied us so far.
[49:46] So, yeah, I just like, yeah.
[49:47] It would have been nice if he was here presenting us.
[49:50] You know, I thought that one applicant was him, actually.
[49:55] The, oh yeah, he kind of looked like a map.
[49:57] I don't know, did he's here.
[50:00] So, the one thing to sort of remember in this duty crew, again, is this two different duty crew models.
[50:07] The one advantage I think that the one thing about what's long-lake fires trying to do is,
[50:12] one, the acknowledge what was a long-standing problem, a long-standing goal to provide duty crews.
[50:18] They have chosen a different model than what we have chosen for the reasons,
[50:23] But the one thing that are seeing decent response for volunteers at Station 1, so we are seeing seeing that.
[50:32] And there is an advantage to that to the entire call area.
[50:37] If you have four duty crew available during the daytime, even if they come in from Station 1, they can get to the Station 2 cover area.
[50:45] A lot faster than trying to pull just, you know, pay it on call guys who might be at their other places of employment.
[50:51] So there is an advantage. Some of it is not realized yet. I don't think in any structural change or organizational change of this magnitude
[50:59] You're going to see it meet all its goals in three months. I think that's unrealistic.
[51:06] You know what long-lake is kind of asking for in this is to continue this program at I think a 60% funding rate
[51:15] and they can expand it and get it to grow and improve.
[51:19] The other benefit that they're really seeing is that small group training when they only have three or four people there,
[51:24] you can really get the hands-on piece to that, and that's a mark improvement.
[51:29] I think they've been certifying more drivers too.
[51:32] Exactly, that's what's very helpful where you can't do that.
[51:35] Well,
[51:38] I agree that it's early in having patients with the process as acceptable.
[51:42] What to me?
[51:43] is hard to get behind, is this was dated in July, and it said in three weeks, the leadership team will continue to finalize the SOP, and we've asked you guys have asked for more updates on how this is going to, you know, the standard operating procedure, all this could have been outlined to us in more detail and it hasn't.
[52:09] And I think it's premature to, you know, put taxpayers money towards the program that they haven't completely outlined and updated, you know, to us despite our asking.
[52:23] So, and then the other piece of that is is they won't use any of our resources during this period either.
[52:35] We could put James in station number two, serve as a duty crew member there, utilize that resource and sure additional coverage for that area while we transition.
[52:48] And that's another piece that they're not allowing and even going back even to, you know,
[52:56] along as a blue line, blue card training, you know, they're hiring outside parties to do blue
[53:04] line training, blue card, and blue card training when we can provide it for free.
[53:10] And that is not cooperation and there has to be some to put our money.
[53:15] So, again, you know, where I'm at is the budget, the wage increases, I'm on board with the duty
[53:26] crew.
[53:28] I'm not supportive of supporting based on where we're at today.
[53:34] I think we work it out, but we didn't get the updates from them to show that they're organizing
[53:42] yet.
[53:43] And it's a lot of money.
[53:44] point well made, I agree. The one thing in their defense from this July document,
[53:58] if they
[53:58] haven't given us a written update to the procedures are planning not.
[54:06] So we know, I just got the one update at the last, along the way, about time, sir, performance.
[54:14] We just had the one. That's all I've been to, they've brought it an update there.
[54:19] Well, I mean, update, but they don't have a plan for it yet, because this one says that there's going to be doody cruise in both station one and station number two.
[54:32] I mean, do we know that to be true?
[54:35] We have there.
[54:36] We have they provided their monthly rosters
[54:40] to fill rates.
[54:43] If it is like one person at station.
[54:45] That's where they're stationed, too.
[54:47] Council member, I'm going to talk about how you can see on those that they're getting really good response rates for station one at some points, I think, having four.
[54:56] A lot of station station number two, their responses is usually one.
[55:02] And again, talking with the administrator over a long leg, that is one of the things that they will have to be looking at in the new years, do we adjust the model so that maybe they don't even attempt to try to build a station too, as focus on station one.
[55:19] I say it's a little bit of a movie, right? There's a whole bunch of different things that the chief and the team over there can do to try to keep growing.
[55:30] I agree. I agree with everything Matt said, but I think at this point, I think we need to move it forward and you guys can work as is to have to make sure and with a very advisory board to
[55:39] To make sure they're held accountable to best being the stuff that they're supposed to bring so I know you can only vote on one of these
[55:46] Rea so I'll make a motion to approve the 2024 long-lake operating budget less pay and duty crew budget lines
[55:54] Second that
[55:55] on favor say aye I opposed you know that passes five zero and the Maria will recus
[56:01] herself on the second one and so I'll make a motion to approve the 2024
[56:05] long-length fire operation budget fire call and training pay increases.
[56:09] On favor say aye aye not that passes four to one abstent and there's yeah and one
[56:16] nay okay thank you that was the pay increases what's that but that a duty crew that's
[56:22] the duty crew it's duty crew am paid together
[56:24] So I'm against it.
[56:26] A 320 crew portion, but three one and one more on the day and correct it.
[56:30] He would have been a three in a hand.
[56:33] Okay, I didn't direct it.
[56:34] Yeah, right.
[56:35] Okay, the little bring us to a number 21.
[56:39] Ron, our final, love me 2023, collectible in 2024.
[56:43] Resolution 74th, 36th.
[56:46] Thanks, Chief.
[56:48] Thank you, Mayor.
[56:49] Yes, this item is to adopt the 2024 collectible.
[56:54] tax levy, which is used to fund our budget.
[56:58] We had our truth and taxation meeting two weeks ago.
[57:03] No one really, completely about the tax levy itself.
[57:08] There is one comment that was made during the team meeting that I would like to clear up and
[57:15] review this with the transcript of the feature of our new software today.
[57:19] And there was a comment made that said that not paying down debt is fiscally irresponsible.
[57:27] And I would just like to let the citizens know that the city is paying down all of the debt that we are legally required to pay.
[57:37] And when it comes to bonds, this had to do with the debt service level.
[57:40] When it comes to bonds, it's not as if we can just say we're repaying this bond early,
[57:46] or we're repaying a portion of this bonderly we can only pay these bonds and they're due unless we do a formal council action to refund to the whole bond issue,
[57:57] which I don't think there's any move to do that and certainly that would take time.
[58:02] So I just wanted to clear it up. We are paying all of the debt that we are legally responsible to pay.
[58:10] With that said, the tax levy was going up 12.6%, it fully funds the operating budget and the general fund, it fully funds the orinal fire department and it fully covers our debt service.
[58:26] So if there's any other questions, we've, the levy has not changed since it was adopted as the preliminary levy three months ago.
[58:35] tax rate is actually going down.
[58:37] Tax rate is going down just a here.
[58:39] So I'm just going to say that I'm not in agreement and just reiterate that the 12.26 increase
[58:45] would be a 4% increase that we're not for the Orno fire department therefore I do not support
[58:50] this resolution.
[58:52] All right.
[58:53] I'll make a motion to approve bill as a resolution 7436 set in the 2023 collectible 24 tax
[59:00] lobby.
[59:00] I'll second it.
[59:01] That's me on favor say aye aye aye aye.
[59:04] Opposed?
[59:05] No.
[59:05] That passes for to one.
[59:08] Okay.
[59:08] That'll bring us to number 22, which is special revenue funds budgets 24 resolution 7438.
[59:17] And thank you Mayor that won again as me.
[59:21] There is not a whole lot to be said about the special revenue funds.
[59:25] We had adopt budgets for these funds that are restricted uses of the
[59:31] funds.
[59:32] So the park fund main funding source used to be parked education fees and they're restricted
[59:38] by law as to what they could be used for and that's why we created the revenue fund
[59:45] way before my time here.
[59:48] We now supplement those parked education fees with a tax levy.
[59:52] The Tiff Fund was established with the building of the Orino Woods.
[1:00:00] It's senior building. It is used to, it was originally its current purposes to be used to pay off the bond or the bonds that the company built or no was took out. It's called a pay as you go, tiff district. And so that's that's why that one's separate. And the drug and felony forfeature one has restrictions to with those are, sometimes if there's a DWI and a car will be forfeited and sold it auction.
[1:00:30] those funds can only be used for traffic enforcement, DWI enforcement, and then if it's a drug
[1:00:38] forfiture, those funds can only be used specifically for drug programs or policing. So that's why
[1:00:49] you have the special revenue funds. We do have a few other ones that we don't actually adopt
[1:00:53] budgets for one would be like the Crystal Bay Lake Improvement District where they come to us,
[1:00:59] We love the special assessment on their behalf, so they don't have to go around knocking
[1:01:04] on doors, collecting papers.
[1:01:06] Same one.
[1:01:07] But since that, we're just a pass through entity on that one, we don't actually adopt
[1:01:12] a formal budget.
[1:01:13] And I guess that's all I have.
[1:01:15] Say about the special revenue funds, I must have a question, questions about the revenue
[1:01:20] funds.
[1:01:22] We'll make a motion to approve resolution 7438, 24 special revenue funds budgets.
[1:01:30] Second.
[1:01:31] I'm going to reach on.
[1:01:32] The paper say aye.
[1:01:33] Aye.
[1:01:33] I'm opposed.
[1:01:34] Not that pass is five to zero.
[1:01:37] Okay.
[1:01:37] That'll bring us to number 23, which is fee schedule updates ordinance 288.
[1:01:44] Okay.
[1:01:45] Thank you.
[1:01:47] And the document itself has a number of changes made to it.
[1:01:53] Most of them are minor in housekeeping in nature, I think, and the building and zoning we added,
[1:02:01] the words, less expenses to it, it really didn't change anything, it just cleared it up that,
[1:02:09] yes, people who are applying might have to pay additional expenses that are incurred by the city,
[1:02:14] which was always the case, but it just made it in the, in the fees schedule.
[1:02:18] There were some wording changes to, and some amount changes to make what the police were charging when they made a photo copy for someone, the same as what the city, all would do for a photo copy, and like I said a lot of minor minor changes there, the bigger changes, or the changes, most people are interested in would be the utility rates, and if you remember we actually adopted the new utility rates at the last meeting, so that we could communicate.
[1:02:48] those changes to the citizens on their utility bills that were just male-class week.
[1:02:56] I saw them.
[1:02:58] I saw them come.
[1:02:59] They showed up.
[1:03:00] There you go.
[1:03:02] And they're included in tonight's memo just because they're included as a section of the fee schedule
[1:03:08] as a whole.
[1:03:09] But the council already gave the approval of them two weeks ago.
[1:03:13] That's really all I have on the fee schedule unless someone has.
[1:03:17] Anybody any questions in the fee schedule?
[1:03:21] We've got two motions that will make it the same time here.
[1:03:24] Motion to one adopt the ordinance 288 of the third series of
[1:03:28] Mending Title 1 Chapter 2 of the City Code relating to the
[1:03:31] fee schedule and number 2 approve the summary publication of
[1:03:35] ordinance 288.
[1:03:37] I'll sign on it.
[1:03:39] On favor say aye.
[1:03:40] Aye.
[1:03:41] Not that passes five zero.
[1:03:43] Okay, that'll bring us to number 24, which is adopt 2024 Capital Improvement Plan.
[1:03:51] Okay, thank you, Mayor.
[1:03:53] The Capital Improvement Plan, I would like to start out by stating this is a planning document only.
[1:03:58] Approval of the Capital Improvement Plan does not approve any individual expenditure,
[1:04:04] and since these are all big projects in them when we move forward with them when it would require us
[1:04:10] coming back to council or approval.
[1:04:13] So this is more of a planning document.
[1:04:15] We use it when we're setting utility rates in the future.
[1:04:19] We, it accounts for all the infrastructure improvements needed
[1:04:22] for water, sewer, storm water, public works with their trucks.
[1:04:28] The police department, the golf course,
[1:04:32] every department in the city that has capital or expensive equipment
[1:04:38] Or has big projects, we try to keep track of them, so we can forecast tax needs and rate
[1:04:48] needs for the utility funds.
[1:04:55] Anyone has any questions on it?
[1:04:57] we could talk about it, but we've, the council.
[1:05:00] We've seen that before, too. It was seen talked about briefly last week. And we'll be available on the website by the end of the week once it's approved.
[1:05:09] Any other questions for Ron and the improvement plan?
[1:05:12] I don't have any questions. I just want to make a comment that I'm not in support of this capital improvement plan, because of the expenditures that we are
[1:05:28] and dollars that could be used for other opportunities in public safety, but we're earmarking
[1:05:34] for the Arnaut Fire Department.
[1:05:36] Motion to approve the 2024 CIP.
[1:05:40] So moved.
[1:05:40] The favor say aye.
[1:05:42] Aye.
[1:05:42] Opposed?
[1:05:43] Can I second it?
[1:05:45] Rich.
[1:05:45] I'm sorry.
[1:05:46] Got it.
[1:05:48] No.
[1:05:48] No.
[1:05:48] No.
[1:05:49] No.
[1:05:49] No.
[1:05:49] No.
[1:05:51] That'll bring us the number 25, which is the final general fund budget 2024 resolution 7437.
[1:06:02] The budget, the general fund budget has really not changed since the adoption of the preliminary general fund budget.
[1:06:11] We've shifted some numbers around as numbers came in and became more definite.
[1:06:16] And the total amount of the General Fund budget is the same as was adopted in September.
[1:06:24] And short of any, and once again, we had the Truth and Taxation meeting the last week that allowed public comment on the budget and Council to talk about the budget and other than some comments about the Orinal Fire Department, the public really had no comments on the General Fund budget at all.
[1:06:41] So, the questions we can pull up some information, but otherwise, that's all I have.
[1:06:48] Any questions on that one?
[1:06:50] No questions, just a comment, but again, I don't support this.
[1:06:54] Plan to expenditure related to Ornafair Department.
[1:06:56] We're looking to spend over $772,000 next year, which is a 342% increase over this year.
[1:07:04] So, I don't agree with this direction.
[1:07:06] the lowest tax in the area and we'll motion to approve of Resolution 7437 adapting the
[1:07:14] 2024 General of Unbudget.
[1:07:17] Let's think of it.
[1:07:18] Thanks for your Johnson on, Faber, say aye.
[1:07:20] Hi.
[1:07:20] Opposed?
[1:07:24] Number 26 as Enterprise Funds Budget 2024 Resolution 7439.
[1:07:31] Okay, thank you, Mary.
[1:07:33] I believe this is my last budget item.
[1:07:35] I do have one comment I would like to make as a result of last meeting's T&T meeting.
[1:07:44] The comment was made that the enterprise funds are referring to the enterprise funds,
[1:07:51] a slush funds that actually bothered me quite a bit because we do a, we work hard at setting
[1:07:58] our rates and setting what we need for the enterprise funds and to refer to them as slush
[1:08:03] ones is just that that was rather uncold for yes they do have good fund balances the last
[1:08:11] two years on water especially we've had droughts so we are exceeded our revenue expectations
[1:08:18] if you go back three of the four years before that we had incredibly wet seasons and we were
[1:08:23] actually under budget on some of our water revenues and it's all because those funds are very
[1:08:33] The new one, we just moved the golf course back to an enterprise fund that should be seen
[1:08:37] as a positive step.
[1:08:39] It's being moved out of the general fund, so regular tax dollars will no longer be supporting
[1:08:45] the golf course fund.
[1:08:48] But, rest a little bit off the utility funds.
[1:08:50] I think we do a great job of setting the budgets there.
[1:08:53] The rates were set in a 2019 rate study and once again, 2% for water, 2% for sewer, 1% for
[1:09:01] warm water significantly below the level of inflation. So I think we are doing a great job there.
[1:09:07] And some of that cash balance that's referred to as slush. I would just like to remind everybody
[1:09:13] that the sewer fund has over $21 million worth of infrastructure in the ground. It is expensive to maintain.
[1:09:20] It's expensive to replace. And that's why we have the rate set as we have. And the water fund has $9.3 million worth of infrastructure in the ground.
[1:09:30] or the water in the case could be a water tower,
[1:09:33] which is anything but in the ground.
[1:09:35] But that's why we have the water rates we do.
[1:09:37] That's why we have the sewer rates we do.
[1:09:40] And once again, the council has met with the budget committee.
[1:09:47] We've met with the whole council to work session.
[1:09:49] And the rates have already been set.
[1:09:51] This is, that's all I have to say about the enterprise budget.
[1:09:55] All right, any questions about the interface budget?
[1:09:58] Good job.
[1:09:59] Work Run.
[1:09:59] Yep.
[1:10:00] I think I think too on water and infrastructure and you correct me if I'm wrong, you know, our population density, because it's a more rural area, we've got longer pipes, less people on them, not as dense of populated areas. So, 45 lift stations rotate for 2,100 connections, that's a very high ratio of lift stations to connections.
[1:10:27] It's going to be great for people when those pipes or sort of connections need to be replaced
[1:10:33] that you're not being assessed on at your home.
[1:10:36] Is that going to be devastating to a lot of people?
[1:10:38] We've planned very well to make sure all these budgets are taken care of whether it's parks, whether it's engines,
[1:10:46] cars, or snowplows, or robots.
[1:10:49] We do a fabulous job and make sure everything is budgeted and taken care of for our citizens.
[1:10:53] and top of being the lowest tax rate around here.
[1:10:56] Excellent job, man.
[1:10:57] Thank you.
[1:10:58] Good job, Brown, for all your help over the years on that as well.
[1:11:01] Any other questions for Ron at all?
[1:11:04] I appreciate everything you've taught me, Ron.
[1:11:07] And I think your forecast, Dean, is very impressive.
[1:11:10] Thank you.
[1:11:12] All right, we're motion to adopt Resolution to 74.39
[1:11:15] established in the 2024 Enterprise Fund budgets.
[1:11:18] So I'm on favor say aye.
[1:11:20] Aye.
[1:11:20] I always, it's not that fast as 5 to 0.
[1:11:25] Okay, well that'll bring us, well let's go back to it.
[1:11:27] Run, any other finance stuff.
[1:11:29] What do we have at you?
[1:11:30] Slide for us.
[1:11:31] I do have a slide.
[1:11:34] Before we get to the slide, I just want to take this opportunity to say it's been, it's been
[1:11:40] an enjoy, mostly enjoyable 26 years, there's been a little stress at times,
[1:11:47] but you guys
[1:11:48] We'll be in good hands with Maggie taking over, I have nothing but positive things.
[1:11:58] In about six months, you'll say, Ron, who, that'll be fine with me.
[1:12:03] She might be calling you a lot.
[1:12:04] You might be.
[1:12:05] Yeah, my phone number.
[1:12:07] Adam, if you could pull up the permit slide.
[1:12:11] Oh.
[1:12:12] What does that not show the whole slide?
[1:12:14] It's not the same one.
[1:12:15] It's not the same thing last time we're again.
[1:12:18] There we go.
[1:12:19] There we go.
[1:12:20] That looks better.
[1:12:20] Yes, and as you can see, I added a black line there, which is roughly the budget among
[1:12:27] a 565,000, we are well above it, had just a hair under 800,000 through November, so we
[1:12:35] will go over 800,000, we're definitely ahead of last year also, so that's the good news.
[1:12:42] there is extra building permit fees collected,
[1:12:48] are over what was budgeted, I talked with Laura a little bit
[1:12:52] about this, and she's not here to talk on her behalf.
[1:12:55] At the moment, we have Orno crossings, what we've all done,
[1:12:59] we've had stone bay, it's built out Lakeview golf course
[1:13:03] that the development has maybe a couple of homes left.
[1:13:07] So we are running out of the big developments.
[1:13:09] So my suspicion is that we will come back down closer to the budget at numbers just because we don't have those big developments going on right now, but who knows?
[1:13:22] Maybe maybe one of the two down.
[1:13:24] Highway 12 here.
[1:13:25] How many one 12 will pop and then will exceed budget again?
[1:13:34] It's good news on the building permit revenue slide and I'm presenting it on behalf of Laura,
[1:13:40] because she didn't want to say goodbye to me and I would have hurt both of that.
[1:13:45] Oh my god, that's a cutest thing ever.
[1:13:48] She was sick today.
[1:13:51] It's so real.
[1:13:53] It's still cute.
[1:13:57] Oh, yeah, that's a good job.
[1:13:58] I mean, that's, and when there's not big dollar permits, that means a lot more work,
[1:14:04] because a lot more applications for our staff.
[1:14:06] Yeah, they'll still be the re-ruffing and the re-siding of the additions.
[1:14:11] The people tearing down housing tearing down and re-models, I'm sure.
[1:14:16] I don't know.
[1:14:19] Well, good job, Melanie.
[1:14:21] You're the only planning department left here.
[1:14:23] That's good.
[1:14:24] Thank you.
[1:14:27] All right.
[1:14:27] Well, that'll bring us to our attorney report.
[1:14:30] Mr. Mayor, members of the council.
[1:14:31] I don't have an update for tonight.
[1:14:32] That brings us to our city administrator report which brings us to our 27 27 appreciation for finance director Ronald's and Resolution 7435.
[1:14:47] We could have put that on consent, I would not have.
[1:14:51] So you have a resolution here, I'd like to read it.
[1:14:55] as it's a resolution of appreciation to Ronald J. Olsen for his 20...
[1:15:00] Any six years of dedicated service, resolution number 7435, whereas Ronald since set the example for
[1:15:08] his fellow public service with his positive attitude, column demeanor, and service focus, since being appointed
[1:15:14] as a management analyst, slash accountant, an October 27th, 1997, and whereas through hard work and technical
[1:15:22] competence, Ron quickly progressed to positions of increasing responsibility first by being
[1:15:29] from what had to do a assistant finance director in 1998 and culminating in his appointment
[1:15:34] as the Orno Finance Director in 2006, whereas Ron's final acumen has been instrumental
[1:15:41] in the city's establishment and maintenance of a AAA bond rating since 2005, one of the
[1:15:47] relatively few million municipalities of Orno-sized to do so, as well as receiving a 100%
[1:15:52] clean annual audit reports.
[1:15:54] And whereas Ron led the establishment and then the modernization of the city's information
[1:16:00] technology system, including the current network and communication system, as well as implementing
[1:16:06] of numerous software programs, resulting in improved efficiencies in accuracy throughout
[1:16:11] the wide variety of city staff functions.
[1:16:14] And whereas Ron created the city's human resource function and then spearheaded the streamlining
[1:16:19] of the personnel system through the implementation of automated benefits on boarding and
[1:16:24] role, and whereas Ron's 2006 Olsen, Ron Olsen's 26 years of service, have been characterized
[1:16:31] by professionalism, expertise, and dedication to providing the highest quality service to the
[1:16:37] city and its citizens. And now therefore, be it resolved, at the Orno City Council, staff and
[1:16:45] residents, which to extend their utmost appreciation and gratitude to Ron Olsen for his service
[1:16:50] the community as a finance director adopted by the City Council of Orinal Minnesota and a regular
[1:16:56] meeting held this 11th day of December 2023. Thank you Ron.
[1:17:13] Do I have a motion to adopt the resolution?
[1:17:16] So move all second it.
[1:17:18] One favor say aye.
[1:17:20] Note that pass this five is your wrong. Come up here for a picture with the seal.
[1:17:23] Oh, it's nice.
[1:17:24] Okay.
[1:17:24] So we're going to take the picture.
[1:17:26] Who's going to take the picture?
[1:17:26] Who's going to take the picture?
[1:17:31] Yeah, I'm getting in here.
[1:17:33] Come on.
[1:17:34] Yeah, come on, come on.
[1:17:39] Okay.
[1:17:39] So we're going to make a good day.
[1:17:44] So we're going to make a good day for the water.
[1:18:00] So we're going to make a good day for the water.
[1:18:03] Okay.
[1:18:04] We'll see you in Wednesday.
[1:18:05] A little cake and everything going.
[1:18:08] Okay.
[1:18:09] So we're out of the retirement party in Wednesday.
[1:18:17] So we're going to have to bring us food, counsel.
[1:18:21] Or do you have any more city ends here in the ministry reports?
[1:18:24] No.
[1:18:25] Other than the staff focus over the last couple of weeks has really been
[1:18:29] given budget finalized as well as as you mentioned for funding,
[1:18:34] funding replacement for our finance director.
[1:18:37] We're able to accomplish that both of those things.
[1:18:40] All right.
[1:18:41] A lot of bringing us to council committee reports.
[1:18:43] I'm not sure if we had any in the last couple of weeks.
[1:18:46] We did not think that just got left on the title.
[1:18:49] Okay.
[1:18:49] Okay.
[1:18:50] Okay.
[1:18:50] Sometimes we have one and a, they get we had one.
[1:18:53] So, okay, public comments.
[1:18:54] So, this will be limited to three minutes per person.
[1:18:56] It's an opportunity for the public to address the city council.
[1:18:59] The city council will not engage in discussion or take actions on items presented at this time.
[1:19:04] However, the council may refer issues to staff or follow or consideration in a few meetings.
[1:19:09] Staff, speakers should state their name and home address.
[1:19:13] At the podium before speaking, we will invite this owner residence first.
[1:19:17] So when the owner residents are done, we will ask for any non-order residents to come up.
[1:19:21] There's any owner residents that would like to come up tonight.
[1:19:34] Cheryl Colzette, 725 Stone Bay Drive, or no.
[1:19:40] During the last city council meeting, six citizens came up during the truth and taxation agenda item.
[1:19:46] And 11 people came up to this podium during the public comments.
[1:19:50] In 17 times, people in this community wanted to give this council feedback.
[1:19:55] A mayor likes to quote others, so here are some of his quotes prior to wrapping up that meat.
[1:20:01] You know, it always amazes me when the cameras are around, show that gets portrayed by the same 12 people who come up here every single meeting.
[1:20:10] That is what Channel 9 asked me. What do you think about the people who will be coming?
[1:20:15] It's the same people, whether it's pickleball or beaterwood. It's the same people who come up and give us grief.
[1:20:21] When someone turns around and says you do not represent Orano, well, maybe it's the 12 people who, who, from Orano, do not like us here, but the people that are out there that are watching the people that I see day and day out over all of Orano say we're doing the right thing.
[1:20:38] We're the champs of budgeting and we are the envy of all the cities around and everyone should tell their cities that they should be more like Orano.
[1:20:47] What we do speaks volumes.
[1:20:50] I am not convinced that other cities want to be like or not right now.
[1:20:54] I agree that what you do speaks volumes.
[1:20:57] What you say about those who dare to challenge this council,
[1:21:01] during public comics, comments, speaks volumes.
[1:21:05] Oh, you behave speaks volumes.
[1:21:08] I'm only speaking for myself, but it takes a little bit of courage
[1:21:11] to come up here and address this council.
[1:21:13] I do so sadly knowing that what I say will probably not change.
[1:21:18] Standing up here does not come easy to meet, it's not fun, but I do hope that when I choose to step out on my comfort zone that you actually make an attempt to take in the information I'm trying to relay.
[1:21:29] Why would anyone want to come up here and speak if they're jazz-sized for it?
[1:21:33] Do you really think we come here to give you grief?
[1:21:36] Well, I can tell you that I for one want to continue to voice my concerns and hope that you'll listen with an open mind.
[1:21:42] The Orno Fire Department was a catalyst for me to wake up and pay attention, but the behavior
[1:21:47] that I see coming from some council members is disappointing.
[1:21:50] Lecture on Citizens knowingly to find court orders, non-verbal during meetings, disrespecting
[1:21:57] fellow council members does not well with me.
[1:22:00] I want to see healthy debate during a city council members during, before they take a vote.
[1:22:07] and I expect to see some disagreement.
[1:22:10] I try to remain respectful to each other.
[1:22:13] From my part, I would like to apologize
[1:22:14] for any disrespect I've shown in the past
[1:22:17] by leaving City Council meetings
[1:22:19] early out of frustration
[1:22:20] or clapping in agreement during public comments.
[1:22:23] I promise to do better.
[1:22:24] I will continue to come to meetings to listen,
[1:22:27] to learn, and to speak up.
[1:22:28] When I cannot attend, I will watch the videos.
[1:22:31] I'll encourage my neighbors to attend City Council meetings,
[1:22:34] and lastly, I will vote in November.
[1:22:38] Everybody else from on-off tonight.
[1:22:42] Nobody else from on-off.
[1:22:49] You'd go out of order if you want.
[1:22:51] But but but it's first for on-off resistance. There's no more that want to come up first than
[1:22:56] I'll open it up to do a general public. Everybody else that wants to just come up in general.
[1:23:06] Oh, yes.
[1:23:22] First of all, make Valley View Road, Long Lake.
[1:23:25] So I was like to bring up just the awesome things that firefighters, Long Lake Fire Department
[1:23:29] is doing the antennaed both cities, holiday tree ladings,
[1:23:33] bringing Santa and participating with the community
[1:23:36] and the community events.
[1:23:39] And so I'm just here today to say this holiday season
[1:23:44] as you guys wrap things up tonight and head home
[1:23:46] into the coming weeks with lots of family.
[1:23:49] I ask that you think long and hard about the men and women
[1:23:51] who will be ready to respond all holiday season.
[1:23:55] During Christmas parties on Christmas Eve,
[1:23:57] Christmas day as they spend time with their families. All of you and all of this city will remain a
[1:24:04] priority for them. And if duty calls they will be torn away from their family time to respond and they
[1:24:11] will do so as humble servants of this community. Tonight I ask you to consider what lies ahead for
[1:24:16] them. To truly spend some time this holiday season when we remember hope, peace, joy, and love.
[1:24:22] Remember that they have asked you not to split them up. Remember that everybody does better with
[1:24:27] collective effort working together toward common goals. Remember that Long Lake does not want
[1:24:33] to work or remember that Long Lake does want to work with you no matter what narrative you tell
[1:24:38] yourself. They do not want the power they want to work together for the betterment of the community
[1:24:44] at large. Long Lake wants to build together with you a joint powers agreement. For those that aren't
[1:24:50] familiar with the idea, joint powers agreement or a fire district is a trend among smaller local
[1:24:55] government units as it relates to fire service in which local entities come together.
[1:25:00] To pull resources, and the governance of the department is transitioned to a board, compromised in members from each city involved.
[1:25:07] This idea could potentially bring ordnals share of a fire service budget from 85% currently down to 49%.
[1:25:16] If ordnal, long-lake, Medina, Minitank, a beach, and ways that it came together under a GPA, this is what long-lake hopes to do.
[1:25:23] In fact, a proposal to begin working together under some type of GDP remains on the table,
[1:25:30] unanswered by Orno. You could be the answer to what they all hope this season to stay together.
[1:25:35] At a bare minimum, I'm going to the holidays with an open mind and an open heart,
[1:25:39] ready to go on a mediation with the same openness.
[1:25:44] Thank you, anybody else, in the general public.
[1:25:52] Kelly Grady, two, seven, one, Greenhill, Leigh, Monique.
[1:25:56] Since I started trying to figure out fire, I received criticism from a few of the members
[1:26:01] on council about my participation in this discussion, why do you care? You don't even
[1:26:06] live here. The rhetoric is not only dismissive and ugly, but it is not rooted in the
[1:26:11] truth. You don't live here. While I might not be able to vote in Orano, make no mistake about
[1:26:17] it, my family lives our lives in Orano, and the decisions made by this council affect
[1:26:22] our daily life.
[1:26:24] Case in point, why do I care?
[1:26:26] My husband has been a long-lake firefighter for nearly eight years,
[1:26:29] and as such, fire decisions made here affect my family
[1:26:33] more than the majority of your voters.
[1:26:35] But these are not the only reasons why I care.
[1:26:38] Two years ago today, my mom found my dad lying on the ground
[1:26:42] outside of their home and had to call 911.
[1:26:45] First responders arrived on the scene
[1:26:46] and did everything they could to save his life.
[1:26:48] My dad died as a result of sudden cardiac arrest that day.
[1:26:54] So I understand as much as anybody, the need for effective and skilled first responders.
[1:27:00] For nearly a decade, this council has done everything but
[1:27:03] burned down the Long Lake Fire Department with their lack of support in ways
[1:27:08] that I believe have been a long play for control, including the Nile
[1:27:13] of the nearly every capital improvement spend that would increase effectiveness of this
[1:27:19] department and set it up for future success. Refusal to negotiate a solution that
[1:27:24] didn't result in orinal having majority control. And third, not lastly, all of the
[1:27:30] flagrant violations that Judge Miller noted in her order for contempt, using LLFD as a primary
[1:27:37] pool of recruits, intimidation of firefighters, not including long-lake in planning that
[1:27:43] would tamper with their ability to serve under the existing contract for the next two years.
[1:27:47] And what kills me is that all of this is being done with zero community input.
[1:27:53] This is not effective governing.
[1:27:55] It is beyond irresponsible.
[1:27:57] It is reckless.
[1:27:58] And I know all too well that there is a human cost to playing with fire.
[1:28:04] So I am here to remind you, and perhaps inform the citizens, that there is still a proposal
[1:28:09] for a shared services agreement with Long Lake on the table.
[1:28:13] Or, no does not have to go it alone.
[1:28:17] Call it a JPA, a shared service agreement,
[1:28:19] a fired service, a fire district, whatever.
[1:28:21] But coming together to share resources and fiscal responsibility
[1:28:26] is the future of fire service nationwide.
[1:28:28] This is the community's wake-up call to let them know
[1:28:31] that this council is making a deliberate choice
[1:28:34] to isolate themselves from surrounding communities.
[1:28:37] Mediation is scheduled for Thursday, January 30,
[1:28:39] and I would encourage Tuesday, January 30th, and I would encourage citizens to write this
[1:28:44] council and ask them to head into that mediation in good faith and with a goal to work towards
[1:28:49] the solution that builds on the existing effective, efficient, and excellent public safety and
[1:28:53] diddy that we currently have up and not to burn it down.
[1:28:58] Anybody else from the general, I would like
[1:29:09] to put your Christmas here, it's a bag of coal,
[1:29:13] if you don't know what that is, it's for, I heard you've been naughty, I don't think it's funny,
[1:29:17] I don't think it's funny at all.
[1:29:19] Still Brad Erickson, 21-150 horseshoe trail in Corcoran.
[1:29:23] So I'm down on my lot.
[1:29:25] Much like I was the day the person drove up to me
[1:29:28] and told me about Mr. Crosby's involvement
[1:29:31] with the J6 thing and the proud boys know that.
[1:29:34] I'll feel no doubt.
[1:29:36] Well, anyway, same thing happens to me.
[1:29:39] I November 14th, but it has to do with you, Mr. Walsh.
[1:29:42] And that's why you're getting this bag of coal.
[1:29:45] See, he rolls up and he says, if you heard about the rumor that's going around the high school.
[1:29:53] And I said, how in the hell?
[1:29:56] And I'm sure I used a different word, but would I hear about a rumor at the high school?
[1:30:00] So he goes on to tell me about this rumor at the high school involving you and a high school kid, girl, right?
[1:30:08] Yeah, really unfortunate. So then I find out that there's a video online about it now.
[1:30:14] On YouTube, called is the Oranomear Propositioning A Teenagers.
[1:30:20] Here's the problem. Here's the problem. I'm not done. Here's the problem for me. Why?
[1:30:25] What's the clock so I can say, I'll give you your time, but is this appropriate? Is there any
[1:30:32] spoken about it? I'm spoken with Chief Farney. I can have spoken with an investigating officer today.
[1:30:38] So yes, it is appropriate. Has it do with Orno? Has it do with Orno? Kids? Has it do with me?
[1:30:44] You can be lucky. It's not my god damn daughter. I'll tell you that right now.
[1:30:48] So what's going on? You're going to answer these allegations? Are you just going to sit there and shake your head?
[1:30:53] and yell out fake news and false narrative
[1:30:56] and whatever it is that you think, you know,
[1:30:58] we'll get you out of this.
[1:31:01] It's overdue.
[1:31:02] What's wrong with you?
[1:31:04] I think it's a drinking problem.
[1:31:07] You don't know where the boundaries are.
[1:31:09] You need to tighten up, bro.
[1:31:12] You need to check yourself.
[1:31:14] Get your drinking in line.
[1:31:16] Go get some treatment.
[1:31:18] You want to sue me, sue me.
[1:31:20] Let's get this over with.
[1:31:22] I am about done, get it, but I will be back here next year to continue until you're gone.
[1:31:34] This is despicable.
[1:31:36] I don't know, how could you even make this up?
[1:31:40] Somebody drove onto my lot.
[1:31:41] I was pressure washing equipment to tell me this.
[1:31:46] What's up?
[1:31:49] Somebody needs to sort this out.
[1:31:52] somebody with some power, privilege, and authority, okay, because I know who it is, and I know who you are, and I believe her.
[1:32:06] Anybody else would like to come up tonight? Can we get the coal on it here?
[1:32:11] Brad would you mind grabbing your coal? You can have it, thanks.
[1:32:23] 8-Jurvangon, don't lag, 386, rest point road, lost few seconds, but you can't.
[1:32:30] And that might be a little wound up.
[1:32:33] But I really hate to tell you all.
[1:32:35] Perhaps on dishonor.
[1:32:38] You'll all read here.
[1:32:42] It is survivor, sexual abuse.
[1:32:52] I don't remember.
[1:32:54] You're one of those strangers.
[1:32:56] You're people from the school of Orno.
[1:33:01] It's not happening in our community.
[1:33:05] It changed my life,
[1:33:10] none of you could
[1:33:15] have.
[1:33:16] And that's what we're dealing with here.
[1:33:18] I'm not saying anything's true.
[1:33:20] I report it out.
[1:33:22] I've challenged Mr. Walsh.
[1:33:25] You go to Mr. Wilcoe.
[1:33:27] And simply take a detective test and prove his innocence.
[1:33:31] The challenge is still out there.
[1:33:34] But if this is true,
[1:33:37] There's a victim in the community, and it's interesting because, you know, years ago, my daughter
[1:33:44] and you, and she had friends over, I challenged her friends, and I talked to them, not just
[1:33:50] about drugs in our community, but about abuse, and what I had been through.
[1:33:54] You know what I found out later, because I had, right, to speak about my abuse, there was a
[1:34:01] of you who found her own strength to stand up and seek, and to help herself. And I found
[1:34:09] that out later, and that's why I'm weak of that. Not because of me, but because of what
[1:34:16] I can do to help others. And that is why I'm here today. And I'm not specifically accusing
[1:34:22] Mr. Walsh of it. I've heard there are things out here. I would never have used anybody
[1:34:29] because I know what it can do when you do, but the allegations are out there, and they need
[1:34:38] to be addressed, and these kinds of allegations need to be addressed by our community.
[1:34:45] It really do.
[1:34:47] From what I understand, there's been a report made to the police department and the police
[1:34:51] have waffles.
[1:34:53] Well, we don't know.
[1:34:54] We have jurisdiction.
[1:34:55] We have this.
[1:34:56] You know what? Everybody waffle, but now there was a kid.
[1:35:00] And look what happened to me.
[1:35:09] It's time to stand up, investigate, look, is it true or not, and move on?
[1:35:15] Find the truth. This up to our enforcement, people, to do that.
[1:35:22] Thank you.
[1:35:23] Remember to also like to come up for more news or not for more news.
[1:35:34] We've been retired pediatrician and I live on four, seven, five different right.
[1:35:40] I have zero opinion about anybody in this room and their attributions that have been made this evening.
[1:35:48] But I will say that practicing pediatrics for a long time.
[1:35:54] I had innumerable children that were assaulting and pedophilia and rape are routinely dismissed
[1:36:06] as nothing.
[1:36:09] I had a two-year-old raped by her, that father.
[1:36:13] I had just before I retired, I had a young woman with a morbid obesity who came into
[1:36:21] of this and my partner when the results of a test came back pre-tiger gone over the next day.
[1:36:29] This is a common thing.
[1:36:31] Another thing is, my nephew was the Jacob letter when he was kidnapped right.
[1:36:42] And I just want to say, it has to be taken seriously.
[1:36:47] I am not saying anything about Mayor Walsh or anybody else in this room.
[1:36:52] But it's a real thing, it is usually somebody, you know, in the case of Jacob, it was stranger.
[1:37:01] But the most common scenario is a family member, a friend, a uncle, a brother, a parent.
[1:37:13] And it's not just our community.
[1:37:15] People are talking about, like, it is only here, it is not only here, it afflix virtually
[1:37:23] every community, not just in the U.S., my husband grew up in another country, happened
[1:37:30] there, it's a common problem and what are the biggest problems we have is people turn away
[1:37:36] from it, they don't want to think about it because it is ugly, but you can't fix the
[1:37:44] problem that you can't name anybody else from the general public that will like to come up to
[1:37:53] Nate.
[1:37:53] Okay.
[1:37:54] We'll close public comments and I'll bring you back to the Mayor Council reports.
[1:37:57] Before we get started I will just tell you it is absolutely alive.
[1:38:02] You know, one person saying he knows who it is and another person saying that's a rumor
[1:38:05] and he's the one who has the video proclaiming that there's rumors out there.
[1:38:10] So that's what you're dealing with here.
[1:38:13] They've been trying for years
[1:38:16] So now we're gonna go to America
[1:38:18] We're going to sit down, sit down, sit down, sit down, you're out of order, sit down
[1:38:29] You can't use whatever happened to you to try and attack somebody else
[1:38:33] Sit down, that is ugly, ugly, ugly, ugly, ugly, no, sit down
[1:38:40] You should don't sit down and down and read other people in your report. You want to do that you like everybody else come here take your three minutes
[1:38:50] The call home in your report is the sit down sit down sit down
[1:38:55] Do you have nothing to say that I want to hear no sit down
[1:38:59] Okay
[1:39:00] Okay.
[1:39:09] Sit down.
[1:39:15] I have a definition.
[1:39:19] That's what she did it.
[1:39:21] And it's on tape.
[1:39:25] Can you talk about sitting business up there.
[1:39:28] You do not.
[1:39:33] You're done.
[1:39:36] Only if you leave people alone.
[1:39:38] You talk about sitting business.
[1:39:40] You can't remember.
[1:39:43] Well, we obviously hit an issue that's touched a lot of people in this community, you know, here, but I,
[1:39:50] and so role as, like, officials, we play in that awareness, but whatever we can do, maybe there's something to talk about.
[1:39:59] I think...
[1:40:02] Actions, you know, that are directed at the mayor. I mean, it was tasteless. And it doesn't take away from
[1:40:10] Jesus horrible experience and, you know, many of us are parents. And the idea, you know, any child being harmed, you know, that hurts. And it lingers clearly. And so I'm sorry for the people that have had that experience. But at the same time,
[1:40:29] You know, these accusations coming and, and, and, and attacking the mayor and, you know,
[1:40:35] a brat, you've been doing a good job just bringing your information and, and, so it was a
[1:40:42] little disappointing turn today.
[1:40:45] Um, and so the, uh, I think, I think, I think a big part of what we do on the council is, you
[1:40:57] you know, is we respond to what's being said.
[1:41:04] And so another note, I'm glad a piece of the,
[1:41:08] you know, fire department is behind us tonight.
[1:41:10] I think that none of our concerns about, you know,
[1:41:14] the budgeting had anything to do with the performance
[1:41:17] of the firefighters, so I want to make that clear.
[1:41:20] It's about, you know, being financially responsible
[1:41:23] and making the right decisions for the city,
[1:41:25] So, but, at the same time, I think in that budget behind us, even though I wasn't quite
[1:41:29] ready, due to the lack of information on the duty crews, I think that's a good piece
[1:41:35] to have behind us and look forward to moving on on that.
[1:41:41] So, that's all I am.
[1:41:43] It goes to my friends.
[1:41:46] Thank you, Mayor.
[1:41:53] I do just want to say it's very hard to listen to these statements tonight.
[1:41:57] And I know coming from a helping profession professionally as well in mental health, how incredibly hard.
[1:42:06] These issues are to cope with as adults, so I applied
[1:42:10] all those who are able and willing to speak out about that.
[1:42:16] And I was going to refrain from making some other remarks here in light of these recent developments.
[1:42:23] It's just incredibly difficult to emotionally shift like that.
[1:42:27] But as somebody who values tackling issues regarding city business and a timely manner,
[1:42:35] I do feel the need to proceed with my remarks for the night.
[1:42:39] It is related to city business.
[1:42:42] And I do want to say that I did speak with our city administrator about the topic I plan
[1:42:49] to discuss tonight to ensure that my comments would not be in any violation of the rules
[1:42:55] that govern our closed sessions and after discussing with our attorney, our city administrator
[1:43:01] assured me that they would not. So I do want to discuss something that happened at our
[1:43:06] December 4th closed session, a member of City Council, a fellow member raised an issue of concern
[1:43:14] regarding the use of technology by council members of the day as during regular council meetings.
[1:43:22] And because this issue was not related to the legal strategy, we were discussing that night,
[1:43:28] I am legally able to openly discuss this, so I'm going to do this in an effort to help resolve
[1:43:34] this going forward in the future in the new year.
[1:43:37] During the meeting, the council member explained their concerns that other council members
[1:43:41] may be texting or otherwise communicating with members of the public during meetings.
[1:43:47] The issue at hand was whether or not sending or receiving electronic communications during meetings
[1:43:54] as a possible violation of open meeting law.
[1:43:58] And because the meeting was focused on litigation, the issue was not discussed at length.
[1:44:03] So for the record, if a fellow member of Council has concerns about possible open meeting
[1:44:09] law violations, I share those concerns.
[1:44:12] And to that end, I discuss the matter with our city administrator and also with the League of Minnesota Cities.
[1:44:19] There are no formal policies that exist governing the use of cell phones of the days,
[1:44:25] and the League of Minnesota Cities attorney recommended that the matter be discussed as a council under the advisement of our city attorney.
[1:44:33] So since this issue is raised, I'd like to propose that it be addressed by this council in the new year.
[1:44:39] a work session could possibly be dedicated to the topic of open meeting law and the use of
[1:44:44] technology and meetings. This would be an opportunity to discuss as a body, what policies
[1:44:50] or procedures we might implement going forward. I do fully support any measures that can
[1:44:56] be taken to comply with open meeting law at all.
[1:45:00] And it's my belief that if a member of council has concerns about the use of cell phones and council meetings, the public may as well, and it's something that requires further discussion.
[1:45:12] So apart from this, I do want to say that this past year of service on the Orno City Council has been both challenging and also tremendously gratifying.
[1:45:23] I sincerely appreciate the opportunity to learn and grow in this role of Council member and it is one for which I have the utmost respect.
[1:45:34] I look forward to reconvening in the new year and send best wishes for a safe and happy holiday season tall.
[1:45:43] That's all I have thank you.
[1:45:45] Council member Grasby.
[1:45:48] I would just like to wish everybody Merry Christmas and happy holidays over the next couple
[1:45:53] weeks.
[1:45:54] Be good to each other and enjoy your time and have a wonderful time with your family.
[1:46:02] Because we're rich.
[1:46:06] I want to acknowledge a lot of pain in this room and Brad, I did not mean to offend you.
[1:46:11] And I'm sorry if I did.
[1:46:13] I just think that one thing that I've been in any communication that I've come across is
[1:46:19] how you facilitate change and I believe accountability to oneself is the first step and sometimes
[1:46:26] by in time for that is the only okay so again I just wanted to buy time to let cooler
[1:46:35] heads prevail because sometimes that's what we all need and we need someone to help us do that
[1:46:42] I understand I just wanted to say that as far as well as far as the meetings go and
[1:46:48] communication, I have continued to try to build relationships. It takes a while. I'm really proud
[1:46:57] of the budget being passed tonight because I'm sorry, it's really distracting. But I thought
[1:47:03] it was very impressive of the budget being passed and it's a step in the right direction,
[1:47:09] and I think that's something that maybe is small when, but I think it is a step on what accountability
[1:47:15] to one's self, what trying to do what you can control makes a difference. So I want to acknowledge
[1:47:21] the pain in the hurt, encourage people to, when it's too hard to try to control everything else,
[1:47:27] so we can do as control ourselves and coming together can be the healing solution that we need.
[1:47:33] And hopefully this holiday season, everyone has time to reflect, maybe have a little break,
[1:47:38] a breather from all of this. And I hope we start the new year fresh.
[1:47:45] Thank you.
[1:47:48] Well, first I want to thank Ron for getting to all of his fabulous service for the city and
[1:47:53] all the council members have been up here and all the other council that you've advised
[1:47:56] and everything else though.
[1:47:58] Thank you again for that.
[1:47:59] We had a great successful tree lighting again, the fourth annual at the Horn of Golf Course,
[1:48:04] we had four or 500 people I know that Horn of Lyons that they went through 400 Brots and
[1:48:09] Hot Dogs and I don't know how many jugs of hot chocolate that you had to go get and bring
[1:48:15] over and over and over and over is that it was not too bad. Last year was really cold. This wasn't too bad.
[1:48:21] And the lighting.
[1:48:21] I don't know.
[1:48:22] The lighting show is absolutely fabulous. So I think we've created a wonderful community opportunity
[1:48:28] to get together all the time as our fourth annual.
[1:48:32] I wish that Vic was here, but I'll throw my head off to her because she helped kind of come up with the idea.
[1:48:36] Many, many years ago, and we kind of want to repeat it behind her as we needed to community event.
[1:48:41] That was once that told Rope.
[1:48:44] I think we all needed it at this year.
[1:48:46] I want to talk a little bit about it right here.
[1:48:48] This flooding hill?
[1:48:50] Yes.
[1:48:52] We needed snow, though, this year.
[1:48:53] Yes.
[1:48:54] Got it.
[1:48:55] We do have coffee at the mayor again on Wednesday and we talked about that just from a community
[1:48:59] engagement even at our work session this afternoon, that's at 9 a.m.
[1:49:05] Coffee and Donuts.
[1:49:06] The coffee's always warm and the doughnuts are always good.
[1:49:08] Conversation is always good as well, so it's always a good time.
[1:49:11] I want to make sure everybody has a mayor Christmas.
[1:49:14] I have a Pat Bihannaka, lots of Jewish friends, which just started to think Hannaka started
[1:49:19] back in Thursday and it goes to the 15th, so the right right in the middle of that right
[1:49:25] now have a fabulous new year for 20 and I'm looking forward to a fabulous 24, I've got
[1:49:31] three great quotes that are along that theme, first one is a Christmas from Bob Hope, and
[1:49:38] This is my idea of Christmas, whether old fashion or modern is very simple, loving others.
[1:49:44] Come to think of it.
[1:49:45] Why do we have to wait for Christmas to do that?
[1:49:48] Second one is related to Hanukkah, by Albert Einstein, says they are only two ways to live
[1:49:53] your life.
[1:49:55] One is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is a miracle.
[1:50:00] The last one is about New Year's and Resolutions by Abraham Lincoln.
[1:50:05] Always bear in mind that your own resolution to succeed is more important than any other.
[1:50:11] Motion to adjourn.
[1:50:12] So moved.
[1:50:13] On favor say aye.
[1:50:14] Aye.
[1:50:14] Aye.