[0:03] Maintenance. Not maintenance. What would this be called? Set up.
[0:08] I like that word. Thank you.
[0:20] Good morning, members of the corporate and finance Services Committee.
[0:24] I call this meeting to order. This meeting. Is being
[0:26] held using a hybrid model with both members of council
[0:29] staff and members of the public participating from the council
[0:31] chamber and electronically. Remind those in attendance that this meeting
[0:37] is being recorded, web streamed and captioned. Therefore, the microphones
[0:41] must be used at all times for those participating remotely.
[0:44] The clerk has muted all microphones. If you wish to
[0:47] speak, please advise the clerk via the webex chat function
[0:50] and I will recognize you by name and you may
[0:51] unmute your microphone. Members participating from the chamber may raise
[0:55] their hands to indicate they wish to speak. If you
[0:58] have a motion, it must be submitted in writing and
[1:00] sent to Jennifer Lane and Pamela. Aguilera to their respective
[1:04] email addresses in order for it to be displayed in
[1:06] our meeting. Please note that all who attend meetings in
[1:09] the council chamber do so voluntarily, and as a result.
[1:11] Of their attendance at these meetings may be photographed and
[1:14] or videotaped. I ask everyone for their patience as we
[1:17] work with the. Hybrid meeting model and trust that we
[1:20] will treat each other fairly and with respect at this
[1:23] time. I'll introduce members participating from the chamber. Good morning
[1:27] to members of the committee. Vice chair, Councilor Bradley Marks.
[1:30] Councilor Tito Dante. Mary. Petri yeah. Good morning, Councilor Rosemary
[1:34] McConkey, Councilor John Neal and Mayor Dan Carter, who is
[1:38] ex officio member and turning to the visiting side visiting
[1:41] councilors this morning. Include councilor Bob Chapman, councilor Jim Lee.
[1:45] Good morning and welcome to you both. Do you have
[1:47] anyone? Okay. And at this time. I will turn to
[1:55] the commissioner to introduce staff who are in attendance. Commissioner
[1:58] Stephanie, Senate the commissioner. Of corporate and finance services. Good
[2:02] morning. And I'll turn it over to you. Good morning.
[2:05] Chair guy. Participating in the chamber. We have Pamela Aguilera
[2:10] and Jennifer Lane, council committee coordinators, to my left is
[2:14] Michelle Brethrick, the director of finance services. We have Kim
[2:18] Villanu, the manager of taxation services. Tina Barker, manager, procurement
[2:24] and Julie McKeesak, the director of innovation and transformation. Thank
[2:29] you. And I think Alicia Bioncad is supporting us in
[2:35] the back. Okay, thank you. Is there anyone else? Thank
[2:40] you. Okay. The city of Ashwa is situated on lands
[2:44] within the traditional and treaty territory of the Mitchisag and
[2:47] Shipwa Anishanabeg and the signatories of the Williams. Treaties, which
[2:51] include the Mississaugas of Scugog island, curve Lake, Ayewatha. And
[2:56] Alderville first nations and the Chippewaz of Georgina Island, Rama
[2:59] and Boso First Nations. We are grateful for the Inish
[3:04] Nabik who have cared for the land and waters. Within
[3:07] this territory since time immemorial. We recognize that Oshawa, steeped
[3:11] in rich indigenous history and is now present day home
[3:13] to many first nations, inywit and Mati people. We express
[3:17] gratitude for this diverse group of indigenous peoples who continue
[3:20] to care for the land and shape and strengthen our
[3:22] community. As a municipality, we are committed to understanding the
[3:26] truth of our shared history, acknowledging our role in addressing
[3:29] the negative impacts of the colonization continues to have on
[3:32] indigenous peoples. Developing reciprocal relationships and taking meaningful action toward
[3:39] reconciliation. We are all treaty people. Turning to our agenda
[3:44] now. We have no additional agenda items. Are there any
[3:47] declarations of pecuniary? Interest on our agenda this morning. Councilor
[3:50] Neil. Good morning. Yes. Good morning, Mr. Chair. Cf 24
[3:56] 28, as I'm on the board of directors of the
[3:59] OSCC. And they've got feedback back from that organization in
[4:06] regards to that report. Thank you. Okay. We will note
[4:09] that one as a poll at the time of the
[4:11] public consent agenda. Thank you. Any other declarations? Seeing none,
[4:15] I'll move on. Presentations, we have none delegations, we have
[4:19] none referrals from council, we have none reports. From advisory
[4:24] committees. There is cf 24 24 on our agenda, which
[4:28] comes from the Oshwa accessibility award nomination and. They have
[4:37] provided a nominee looking for a motion to endorse the
[4:40] nominee. I see. Councilor. McConkey's hand. The motion is duly
[4:45] moved. Did you or any members want to speak to
[4:49] the item? Yes, thank you. I'd like to point out
[4:52] this award will be given during. National accessibility, we can
[4:57] may. It's really great that we have the OSHA blood
[5:01] donor Clinic being nominated, and I hope that we have
[5:04] full support on that. Thank you. Thank you. Any other
[5:07] members to speak on that item? Seeing none. All in
[5:11] favor of the nomination? Are there any opposed? See? None
[5:16] that carries. Thank you. Okay. No items requiring direction. And
[5:22] looking now on to the public consent agenda. Are there
[5:28] any items to be pulled from the public consent agenda,
[5:31] Councilor Neil? Just cf 24. 2007, according.
[5:42] Okay, that's been pulled. That's the 2024 final tax rates
[5:45] bylaw. And then councilor marks, could you also pull the
[5:50] item that councilor Neil had? So 24. 28. Yeah. So
[5:54] pulled. Okay, thank you. Other polls on this councilor McConkey.
[6:00] Sorry. 24 29, the corporate payment report. Thank you. And
[6:05] 24, 30. The energy audits report. Any others to be
[6:12] pulled from the consent agenda. Seeing none. Councilor Marks, I'll
[6:19] turn to you for the consent motion. Thank you. Good.
[6:21] Morning to you, Mr. Chair. My colleagues, staff members of
[6:24] the public, listening at all items listed under heading of
[6:27] public consent agenda for April eigth 2024 corporate and finance
[6:31] service committee meeting. Be adopted as recommended, with the exception
[6:35] of those, of course, pulled. For discussion. Thank you. Are
[6:40] there any opposed to that public consent agenda? I see
[6:42] none that carries. Thank you. Okay, at this time. Just
[6:48] want to make sure that. I'm getting in the habit
[6:54] of reading this. Okay. The following items have been pulled
[6:56] from the consent agenda for discussion and separate vote, and
[7:00] that's cf 24272 428-242-9243 if you're here for an item
[7:07] that has not been pulled the recommendation related to the
[7:08] item printed on the agenda will be recommended to city
[7:12] council. So. I'm going to move through. The items that
[7:18] were pulled. So the first one is CF 24 27,
[7:21] the 2024 final tax rates bylaw that was pulled by
[7:25] councilor Neil. Councilor Neil, you had said you pulled it
[7:28] for a recorded vote. Were you moving the motion or
[7:30] do I need to turn to someone? Else to move
[7:32] the motion. No, I'm not moving. Okay, so councilor marks
[7:36] has moved. 24 20. Seven. Was there any discussion on
[7:40] this one? Councilor McConkey. Thank you. Appreciate, councilor. Neil Poly.
[7:45] I was going to as well, because here we are.
[7:49] Of course, this has to be. Sent out every year.
[7:54] The final tax rates are listed, but this year I
[7:58] have a big problem with it, so I will be
[8:00] voting against it. It's no criticism of any member of
[8:07] finance staff. But what I've seen just last week, region
[8:12] of Durham is put together a 7.5% increase and we,
[8:17] the city of Oshua, especially the city councilors wear it
[8:22] people. Don't realize. The tax bill is divided between the
[8:26] region and the city. But also, the fact is this
[8:29] particular budget was the mayor's budget. With that strong mayor's
[8:33] power, First mayor's budget. That. Basically takes away. Any input
[8:41] from certain members of council like myself. And I have
[8:45] tried to say at committee and council certain aspects of
[8:49] what was approved and what wasn't in the budget. There
[8:53] was no mention of the $9 million. That's going to
[8:57] be needed for rotary park pool to be completed. No
[9:01] mentioned during the budget. About the 8 million, the 4
[9:04] million surplus. Four and a half million. Are from reserves
[9:07] totaling eight and a half million that we discussed, tried
[9:10] to discuss. Last Monday. So here's the thing at council.
[9:16] Sorry. So I have a right to say no to
[9:19] something. And on this one, I'm saying no, but I
[9:22] also have a question. To finance staff on the report.
[9:27] Just comparing what the city revenues generating from. Commercial listings.
[9:34] And industrial and, of course, the bulk being residential property
[9:39] owners being hit. With these increases every year. And, of
[9:43] course, increases are needed to keep up with services. And
[9:47] the growth of the city. But I had one particular
[9:50] question about. The exempt. There's an amazing amount of money
[9:54] of exempt properties. And if I could ask. The commissioner.
[10:00] What is actually, like, city owned properties? Parkland? Is that
[10:04] the total compass of what's exempt. Looks like they're getting
[10:09] an answer for you. The exempt properties are municipal places
[10:14] of worship. Or. Schools. Thank you. Okay.
[10:24] Other comments on this one, Mayor Carter. I do have
[10:28] to respond. I was quite proud of not only counsel,
[10:33] but the process that we undertook as the mayor's. Budget.
[10:38] I'm shocked to hear that it wasn't open and transparent
[10:41] that people didn't get an opportunity to ask and answer
[10:44] questions or to be able to bring amendments. Forward because
[10:47] to my recollection, there was an. Opportunity to be able
[10:51] to participate. I also understanding this is when it came
[10:54] to Rotary park, it was clear and concise in regards
[10:57] to what our commitment was for 2024. And that moving
[11:02] forward, there would be another commitment in regards to 2025.
[11:07] So. I am confused in regards to the comments that
[11:09] have been made. I am proud of this council. Matter
[11:12] of fact, I believe this council did a tremendous job
[11:15] with our budget, and I think it was reasonable. I
[11:19] don't disagree in regards to making sure we're clear and
[11:22] concise about 60% of our tax bill go somewhere else.
[11:27] I think that that. 's a fair observation. I think
[11:31] it's important that. We make sure that people understand that
[11:34] 60% of that tax bill that goes out goes to
[11:37] other entities in regards to operations. So. I'm going to
[11:43] support, of course. The report. I understand, but the challenges
[11:48] that Canadians are facing. And like I say, I am
[11:53] very proud of this council for what it did throughout
[11:57] that process. And staff, by the way. That worked diligently
[12:01] for a full year with myself to be able. To
[12:07] formulate the budget, and I'm looking forward again to working
[12:11] with members of council. And staff to be able to
[12:14] deliver it. And as many members know, I've already started
[12:17] meetings with members of council to be able to cure
[12:20] their priorities. I'm also a believer that if you don't
[12:24] want to support revenue, In regards to what's necessary for
[12:28] operations. Then maybe we have to have a conversation about.
[12:32] How we're making investments across the city. You have to
[12:36] support the revenue to be able to support the capital
[12:38] projects that are going to be in your warrant. And
[12:41] if you're not going to support it, just be clear
[12:43] about it. That you do not support the revenue to
[12:46] be able to build or invest into those wards and
[12:50] allow the public to be able to be clear and
[12:51] concise in regards to where you stand. On the item.
[12:55] Thank you. Other speakers to the item. Councilor McConkey, back
[13:00] to you. Second thank you. I don't wish the mayor
[13:02] to take it personally. There was transparency. I'm not arguing
[13:07] that. But what happened after the budget, and I think
[13:10] the main problem here is that the city of Ojwa
[13:13] budget was approved in December and at the time, like
[13:16] the past five years, now that I've been on council,
[13:19] I understood. The merits of getting in early, but now
[13:23] we find, with the surpluses that are coming forward, And
[13:26] not having really any say. It comes to council to
[13:30] be approved by staff. As I mentioned, that eight and
[13:34] a half million. But also. The fact that the region's
[13:39] budget here was just approved the last week of March.
[13:43] And truly, that 60% that's going to the region budget
[13:47] and a lot of the services, of course, are absolutely
[13:49] necessary. But when the mayor mentions that we have to
[13:53] be responsible. To improve the revenue. I'm looking at all
[13:58] sources to improve the revenue, just like the Mayor and
[14:02] members of council and staff. But there's a certain point
[14:05] which the voice of a member of council has definitely
[14:08] changed. Look at this agenda right now. Three items at
[14:11] the beginning are referred to the Mayor's budget. The Mayor
[14:15] has basically say in what goes forward. Councilor really starting
[14:19] to veer off. I'm just trying to reply or rebut.
[14:22] The tax rates. I'm just trying to make my case
[14:25] here. I'm thinking that basically. The scheduling must change. So
[14:31] we have a little bit more understanding of the surpluses
[14:34] that come forward and the region's budget, because this year.
[14:38] In a year that should be a lot more affordable.
[14:42] To Osha residents. It's not looking that way. Thank you.
[14:46] Thank you. I'll turn to councilor Mayor Petri because he
[14:49] hasn't spoken. Yet. And then I'll look to you. Yeah.
[14:51] Councilor. Good morning, Mr. Chair. I think that. When you
[14:56] get into a sort of discussion about finances and affordability.
[15:00] No one wins, especially if you're in government. So in
[15:02] this particular case, If we just focus in on what
[15:07] the facts are, I would have to say that the
[15:09] city of Osha. Actually did a pretty good job. This
[15:14] committee, the finance department, the mayor. Actually a super job.
[15:19] And I would hesitate. To accept other municipalities, in particular
[15:24] the region of Durham's model. That's been a challenge, and
[15:27] hopefully that can align with ours, because I would suggest
[15:31] that maybe their timelines and the way that their budget
[15:34] process. Was undertaken. And provided to both council and the
[15:39] public may need. To align with ours instead. I would
[15:45] have to say that it is disappointing that the same
[15:48] did not happen. In other municipalities, but definitely when it
[15:53] comes to ours, a lot of heavy lifting occurred, and
[15:56] I'd have to say. A lot of thoughtful. And informed.
[16:04] Interaction by the mayor and staff occurred here at the
[16:07] city, which produced. An impact. That would have otherwise been
[16:13] much, much higher. As you can tell by the regional.
[16:18] Increase. That was approved. In the budget just weeks ago.
[16:26] Our budget process ended months ago, which I would suggest
[16:30] is intelligent because you're going. Into a calendar year. And
[16:34] not having to go through. The first quarter of a
[16:38] calendar year to be able to figure out how much
[16:40] money you have. For that year. So. I just. Constructively.
[16:46] It's not like I'm pulling any punches. It's. The same
[16:49] thing that I've said at the regional level. I hope
[16:52] that when we get the opportunity. Staff does interact with
[16:56] us. And other municipalities that have aligned with us and
[17:01] advance a process that I think is a lot more
[17:04] sensible. So when it comes to affordability and finance, we
[17:08] do struggle. We have tools that are very limited here
[17:11] at the municipality. We've been downloaded onto. I think it's
[17:15] the same rhetoric and story that you hear. Within each
[17:19] municipality in Ontario and throughout Canada. But the fact of
[17:22] the matter is that property taxpayers are impacted heavily as
[17:25] a result of them having to finance provincial and federal
[17:29] programs or initiatives such as infrastructure, and we hope that
[17:32] changes in future. But that's part of the work that
[17:34] we're doing to not only activate that, but raise awareness
[17:38] and get the support. As the mayor has done and
[17:40] other council members. To facilitate community infrastructure and the funding
[17:47] that's required outside of the property tax base because it
[17:50] is overburdened. Thank you, other members of committee, visiting members
[17:55] of council. I'll just provide a brief closing. Remark on
[17:59] this one. I am sure that we're all concerned about
[18:04] the cost of living. And taxation impacts on this. But
[18:08] as has already been alluded to, we're now into the
[18:11] second week of April. A budget was passed at the
[18:14] end of last year, so we're almost four months out.
[18:19] And over three months into the year. It would be
[18:21] a very awkward thing, given. That business plans are being
[18:26] executed by departments and branches for council to suddenly not
[18:30] approve the final tax rates by law. Having said that,
[18:34] I'll turn to clerks now for the recorded vote that
[18:35] was called by councilor Neil. Councilor Neil. No. Councilor Mayor
[18:45] Petri. Yes, Councilor Mark. Yes, councilor mcconkey. No. Mayor Carter?
[18:52] Yes. Councilor Guyrson. Yes. Or affirmative. Thank you. That carries.
[19:00] Moving on to CF 24 28. And I had to
[19:03] ask councilor. Mars to pull that for move the recommendation
[19:06] and recorded vote. Thank you. Recorded vote for council Neil's
[19:10] declaration. Was there any speakers on this one? Sorry, before
[19:12] I. Jump ahead. Councilor McConky, I have a question. So
[19:17] when this now. Is basically being reported. In the reporting
[19:22] of the Oshwa strategic plan. When the city does see
[19:26] Oshwak's, strategic plan, which we are doing right now. Should
[19:32] be coming forward. I think we have the date. But
[19:36] that's once every four years. Basically three or four or
[19:39] five years. Depending on what timeline you pick. So does
[19:45] that mean that the update on actions to address poverty
[19:48] are only going to be reported? When. The city approves
[19:53] an Oshwa strategic, so we'll be getting annual updates on
[19:56] the strat plan. That exists once it's passed each year.
[20:00] This will now get embedded in that update, so. There
[20:03] will be annual updates. On these actions. And I'm just
[20:08] wondering if there could be a bit of. An info
[20:13] package. Not package. What do you call it? Infogram. Because
[20:18] going through these items. It's nice to see the list,
[20:22] but just for a little more so it can be.
[20:24] Promoted better because a lot of people ask what is
[20:28] the city doing to address and then to find it
[20:32] now when it's part of the strategic plan reporting. Next
[20:35] time, maybe we'll. Have a little bit more of a
[20:39] marketing kind of like, I don't know. The correct word
[20:41] to describe what I'm trying to get through, but it's
[20:44] nice. To. People don't like to spend a lot of
[20:47] time reading dense reports or lists and lists. Like if
[20:51] there was some one page infograph. That's kind of because
[20:55] this is a concern to everybody how the city of
[20:58] Oshawa is addressing poverty. Thank you. Sure. I'm sure staff
[21:03] have noted those comments and that can be part of.
[21:09] The things that could be brought forward. I'm a big
[21:12] fan of making information digestible for the public as well.
[21:17] And I do think that as our communications team has
[21:20] been staffing up. As proved through the last couple of
[21:25] budget cycles. Part of it has been to be able
[21:27] to create good material. For public consumption. Councilor marks, you
[21:31] had your hand up. Thank you very much. Just briefly,
[21:33] Mr. Chairman, I'd like to commend staff on number nine,
[21:35] which is the property tax. Surveyors payment program. This is
[21:39] a very good tool for people to catch up on
[21:41] their property. Taxes should they fall into arrears. I can
[21:43] tell you, as a real estate practitioner in Durham region.
[21:46] This is quite the case. We are seeing a lot
[21:48] of power. Sale. Applications move forward by big banks who
[21:53] are ruthless in making sure that they collect. So this
[21:56] is nice to see that the city of OShA has
[21:58] implemented this program, which is further to affect. The recent
[22:04] state of the economy. And affordability. What seems to be.
[22:10] A big area right now to focus upon, but I
[22:13] just wanted to commend staff on number nine and happy
[22:16] to vote yes on this recommendation. Thank you. Thank you,
[22:19] Councilor Marks. Any other members of committee. Visiting members. I'll
[22:24] just maybe echo the commendation to staff on the report
[22:28] as a whole. One of the items that I find
[22:30] is often missing. In this type of. Inventory is all
[22:38] the preventative work that we do. So if you look
[22:40] at our recreation programs, Our arts camps and programs. Funding
[22:45] into arts and culture and many of the programs, by
[22:48] extension, that they run. And through our libraries. What's the
[22:51] old saying? Announce of prevention is worth a pound of
[22:53] cure. And as a municipality. I think we do as
[22:56] well as funding OSCC. These are all preventative. These are
[23:00] the things that help to keep people both out of
[23:03] poverty. And to enrich their lives so that. Their long
[23:09] term trajectory is improved upon. So again, thank you to
[23:12] staff for preparing these particular initiatives. And I will turn
[23:16] now to the committee for vote. Are there any in
[23:19] opposition to this item? Oh, sorry. Thank you. Recorder vote
[23:24] call by councilor Mars. Councilor mark. Yes. Councilor Mary Pittree.
[23:31] Councilor McConkey. Yes. Councilor Neil has a declaration. Mayor Carter?
[23:37] Yes. Councilor Geverson? Yes. Five. Affirmative. Thank you. That carries.
[23:42] Moving on now to CF 24 29. And that was
[23:46] pulled by. Councilor McConkey. Thank you. Discontinuing the court. Sorry.
[23:53] Are you moving the motion? That's. I have actually sent
[23:57] an alternate motion. Okay, so give us a moment. We're
[24:00] going to get that on screen.
[24:19] Okay, just briefly here. So there is one part. That.
[24:33] I think that we have to strike the last sentence
[24:35] just because. It isn't really for any of us on
[24:39] committee. To state. What the staffing requirements are for something,
[24:49] but the rest of the material part of the motion.
[24:53] Is in order for the moment. Mr. Chair, can I
[25:02] call point of order? Yeah, go ahead. Just to have
[25:04] your review. Of. Designate something confidential, does it fall in
[25:13] line with the confidential areas of the procedural bylaw which
[25:17] we afforded to under the Municipal act. Just by merely
[25:20] pointing something as confidential, my contention would be and I
[25:24] would look for your ruling on this, is that this
[25:26] is out of order because it does not fall into
[25:28] the maxims of. What is deemed confidential under the procedural
[25:32] bylaw. And I think also the municipal act as well,
[25:37] too. And having had no chance. To really get appropriate
[25:42] staff. Feedback on the procedural side of this because. The
[25:49] item just came in this morning. Maybe I could help
[25:53] if this is referred to. Stop, because this is the
[25:56] exact wording from a report in 2015. So. If it
[26:06] could be, I think the essence of. Okay. Everything in
[26:11] quotes there. So anyhow, if I read it out loud,
[26:14] in keeping with the role of counsel to exercise its
[26:18] supervised refunction rather than discontinue reporting. The corporate payment records
[26:22] to counsel that the wording from a 2015 staff recommendation
[26:26] and report finance. What I'm. And if I could read
[26:11] it out loud. I'm sorry, which part? Is from the
[26:13] 2015 report.
[26:29] Fin 1582, which was proposed for the practice of producing
[26:34] corporate payment records that the monthly corporate payment reports. Be
[26:38] prepared as a confidential payment report to the finance committee
[26:42] now. Corporate and finance committee. But back then it was
[26:46] finance committee outlining monthly expenditures considered confidential and such report
[26:51] will be available on the city's secured shared drive for
[26:54] all counselors in the mayor to review the confidential report
[26:58] will require. Minimal monthly staffing efforts and will replace the
[27:02] existing format of the public report. This is an issue
[27:05] that I've been involved in as a private citizen. Back
[27:10] in 2015. And then. Have you ruled if you're accepting
[27:15] this or not, or if the conference now that I
[27:17] understand, the better the part that. This was a quote
[27:22] from a previous report. And. I think what committee needs
[27:27] to do is ask staff questions on the. Thank you,
[27:30] sir. Okay. Do I still have the floor? Thank you.
[27:36] So discontinuing the practice. I understand. It's a lot of
[27:41] paperwork. That. Is reproduced. And it used to go on
[27:46] the info package. But I find asking questions is the
[27:50] way we basically make better decisions. Finding out as much
[27:55] information as we can. And taking this away is something.
[28:01] That. Is problematic in a lot of ways. The financial
[28:05] oversight section. In the report 5.3, it says council has
[28:10] significant oversight related to the payments. It's not actually council
[28:14] that has the purchase orders and we have to ask.
[28:18] For the packing slips, the whole list that goes on
[28:21] there. I ask because I don't have access to the
[28:25] bids and tenders to see the scope of certain things.
[28:29] We approve them at committee. But we don't know in
[28:33] the end, normally. Except there is one report today. On
[28:41] the agenda. I know I'm getting a little off track.
[28:46] I'm just finding that. We need to have as much
[28:49] information as possible. When we're making decisions here. And. If
[28:56] council. Sorry. The main thrust of this is that. There's
[29:00] some cybersecurity elements to it, but city has spent a
[29:03] lot of money on cybersecurity. And the fact that it's
[29:08] time consuming for staff. The city has spent money on
[29:12] new hires for finance. I don't see this as onerous.
[29:17] I think. It's integral to the role of council members
[29:21] to have this oversight, knowing what happens in other municipalities.
[29:25] On occasion. In the past, there was an issue. In
[29:29] the city of Oshawa, and it's just to make sure
[29:34] that. There may be monthly reports, and I appreciate the
[29:38] fact that the finance staff put. Quarterly reports in, and
[29:44] I believe seeing those confidentially. Is great, but. To actually
[29:50] stop producing that. And I know the report mentions the
[29:53] other municipalities. Only. Brock does that provides the rule to
[29:59] the mayor in Brock and the other municipalities are not
[30:02] reporting on the check rules. But here's the thing. Just
[30:06] because others aren't, I actually. Think we have to give
[30:10] Oshwa credit that we do this. It's so important nowadays.
[30:14] To ensure that. There is the transparency. And without transparency,
[30:21] There's no accountability. We wear it. If we find out
[30:24] that. Something's gone amiss, and hopefully that doesn't happen under.
[30:29] Our term. But there's other terms. There's other. Situations that
[30:36] we have to plan for the future. And. I think
[30:40] that. There's really. The interest should be there in keeping
[30:45] this moving forward. There was a time when they were
[30:48] talking about doing away with it. And public came forward.
[30:54] Right now, we're in a situation where we don't have
[30:57] much media coverage on what's going on? I don't know
[31:01] how transparent this is right now before the public, but
[31:06] why take it? Away. I just don't believe that. It's
[31:10] the best move here for us. So I will be
[31:12] voting against the report if this motion. Is not either
[31:17] referred or if it's not accepted. I rew the day,
[31:23] actually, when this sort of thing happens, because. We have
[31:27] such. I mean, we're looking through things now, like I've
[31:30] said this. Before through a pinhole. We need to have
[31:32] better overview on certain things, so that's. All I have
[31:36] to say. Thank you. Thank you, councilor. I saw councilor
[31:39] marks hand. Yeah. Briefly. I can't support this motion without
[31:43] vetting the wording of the 2015 motion. That was brought
[31:47] forward. We can't marry it up. We don't know. Why
[31:50] the staff were indicating that the 2015 report create this
[31:54] as a confidential payment report. You marry? Up the motion
[31:58] against the legislation and against the procedural bylaw to see
[32:00] if it falls into the confidential wording. I've spoken to
[32:03] the commissioner. These aren't confidential reports. They are given. I've
[32:08] also been assured by the commissioner if any one of
[32:10] us or any one of our colleagues. Has any sort
[32:13] of information that they require on corporate payments. I'm sure
[32:16] the commissioner team would respond. In lightning quick with those
[32:19] information. Members of the public also have the ability to
[32:23] come into the city, make a request, and get the
[32:26] information that they need. They have to be pretty precise
[32:28] because it is a lot of breadth. Information, but. There's
[32:32] certainly the transparency element. I'm just not buying that argument
[32:35] today, I think. It's a situation where this information is
[32:38] available if members of the committee or council request this
[32:41] information, you contact the commissioner and her team, and I'm
[32:44] sure it will be provided. But to vote this and
[32:47] make it confidential, I'm just not going to support that.
[32:50] Thank you. Other members. Of the committee, any visiting members
[32:56] of council. Okay. For a second time, Councilor McConky. Well,
[33:00] if have members not comfortable, I would like to refer
[33:03] this back to staff to investigate because there's no mention
[33:07] of the report from 2015, so I'm referring it back.
[33:10] So. You're moving a referral motion. Referral of the motion
[33:14] that I've put forward. Yes, that's understood. Thank you. So
[33:18] there's a referral. Recorded vote, please. Okay, councilor McConk has
[33:22] called for a recorded vote. On the referral. Councilor mcconkey.
[33:30] Yes, councilor mayor petri. Councilor mark. No, councilor neil. Yes.
[33:36] Mayor carter, no. Councilor guyberson, no. Ferrell. Okay. Sorry, the
[33:42] referral fails. So I think that right now what we
[33:45] have is this item. Were there any other speakers on
[33:50] the replacement motion? Councilor McConaughey, would you like a recorded
[33:53] vote on the motion? I would. Okay. Is lane back
[33:59] to you. On the replacement motion, Councilor McConkey. The replacement
[34:08] motion being the motion. This is what's in front of
[34:09] us. So this would be the motion for the item
[34:14] on the agenda? Yes. Councilor mayor Petri. Councilor Mark? No.
[34:22] Councilor Neil. Yes. Mayor Carter? No. Councilor Gerson. Four negative.
[34:30] Okay, so the item fails. Councilor marks. So councilor Marks
[34:34] has moved the recommend. Recommendation. Did you want to speak
[34:39] to the item? Members of committee on the item recorded
[34:42] vote, please. Okay. Councilor McConky has asked for a recorded
[34:45] vote. Are there any? Further on the report. I will
[34:49] just provide. One closing remark on this one as well,
[34:55] in terms of. Both the content and the intent of
[34:59] the report. I think. It's important to recall that council's
[35:06] role. We approve bylaws and policies. And we have oversight
[35:09] of procedure. But ultimately it's up for staff to execute
[35:13] on those. And as the report highlights, There are an
[35:17] abundance of processes and checks. And redundancies built into the
[35:24] system. The other thing that I want to note on
[35:27] this item is that. As our municipality grows, we have
[35:32] to decide what exercises produce value for the city and
[35:35] for the community. And sometimes it means taking a look
[35:38] at things that might be in this case. 60 year
[35:43] old policies. And determining is this actually. Producing value for
[35:49] the community and for the municipality? Or could staff resources
[35:53] be deployed in ways that might be more strategic. And
[35:57] policy driven and improvement initiative driven. So I think that's
[36:03] the other part of this item that underlies the intent.
[36:07] So every court of vote has been called by Councilor
[36:09] McConky. On the main motion. As pursuant to report cf.
[36:17] 24 29, Councilor McConkey. No, councilor. Mayor Petri. Sorry. Can
[36:25] you hit the microphone for that, just so it's on?
[36:28] Yes. Thank you, councilor. Marks? Yes. Councilor Neil? No. Mayor
[36:36] Carter? Yes. Councilor Guyberson, yes to four. Affirmative. Thank you.
[36:40] That item carries. Moving on to the last item pulled,
[36:44] which is CF 24 30, contract award c. 2024. 14
[36:52] energy audits, and that was also pulled by councilor McConkey.
[36:55] Councilor McConkey are you moving the item? Yes. I just
[36:59] had some questions of staff. Sure you have. The floor.
[37:02] And. Through you two. Commissioner, Senate. I sent a request
[37:08] in asking about. The. Deep dive into the. Energy. Looking
[37:16] for. That email that you sent me yesterday. I'm asking
[37:22] how it compares to. This report and the audit that's
[37:28] being done. What's the difference?
[37:38] Commissioner. Sorry, can you repeat the question? It's not clear
[37:42] to me. Okay, so I had asked you. About another
[37:49] energy audit. I'm just trying to find the email that
[37:53] you sent, because that was. The number. And I'm having
[38:00] trouble finding my pages here.
[38:15] This energy audit. Is basically related to Project 1085. And
[38:24] the one that I sent and asked about. And you
[38:29] replied, giving me. The financial. Approval. And the
[38:39] rfp. What project number was that? Commissioner.
[38:50] It was project ten. 86, as was approved in the
[38:55] 2024 capital budget. Thank you. So can you explain to
[38:59] me the difference between Project 100 zero 85 and 100
[39:03] zero 86 because they're both for a lot of money.
[39:08] And it's not clear to me the difference what's being
[39:12] accomplished. I'll turn to the commissioner for this, but this
[39:16] really is about. Approving the outcome of the RFP for
[39:21] this item. So maybe if the commissioner could answer. In
[39:24] brief, but I don't want us to go too far
[39:26] down the road on a different capital budget item.
[40:13] So I believe the difference between the two is that
[40:17] one looks at sort of energy consumption in terms of.
[40:22] Reducing. The amount of energy that we would use in
[40:26] a facility, and the other one deals with decarbonization. Of
[40:29] a building. Okay, so the total between the two is
[40:33] spread over. A number of years and a lot of
[40:37] money. And in my request, when I was asking for
[40:40] the RFP. For the. I didn't hear back. Is this?
[40:49] Particular report that we have on the agenda. Is it
[40:52] phased? The total amount. Being a lot more than what's
[40:57] here. 100. And 50. Not to exceed 150. So when
[41:07] this is contracted, does it continue with. The same. Supplier,
[41:13] I guess. Lots of better word. The procurement was issued.
[41:22] For. 2024. At energy audits for initial one year term.
[41:29] With the option to renew, so it's not going back
[41:31] out for another RFp. When this goes through. Is this
[41:35] correct that we are sticking with. The same commissioner provider.
[41:40] Through you. Chair Garberson yes, we would continue with the
[41:43] same provider, provided that we have satisfactory service, satisfactory pricing,
[41:48] and capital a budget. And so the total amount of
[41:53] this audit over the course of what number of years
[41:57] was it? Four years. Four years. The total amount. Could
[42:01] you give it to me again, please? Over four years
[42:04] would be $1 million. And the other one that we
[42:07] were looking at. Similar going to the different facilities doing
[42:12] an energy audit. But also for an extended period of
[42:16] time. Sorry, which other one you're referring to? The other
[42:24] capital project. Exactly. I'm just. But I'd like to know
[42:29] what we're spending on energy audits at this. Point in
[42:32] time. The item that's in front of us is. 85
[42:39] and approving the RFP for that. Right. So the RFP
[42:42] for 150 or the award of contract. Is really 150.
[42:48] But. We just heard it. Over four years. Yes. I've
[42:54] been saying, instead of looking narrowly, I like to see
[42:57] a larger picture here. So. Thank you for that information.
[43:00] That's what I was looking for. Okay. Thank you. Anyone
[43:03] else? On this item, on the award of contract. See
[43:08] none. All in favor? Any opposed? Seeing none that carries.
[43:16] Okay, moving on to items introduced by councilors. I will
[43:25] turn to councilor, mayor and Petrieus on your hand. Yeah,
[43:28] nothing to introduce. I just wanted to compliment you in
[43:30] the work that you're doing with staff. Did a great
[43:32] job today in the meeting, and I think that our
[43:34] finance staff has been under pressure. And has done an
[43:38] excellent job in being able to deliver. Both our core
[43:42] services and a number of capital projects which I think
[43:45] are going to benefit the community into the future, so.
[43:49] I just want to acknowledge that chair. Thank you, councilor.
[43:52] And hopefully the commissioner can convey that. To the finance
[43:55] team and the director. Okay. Sorry. Items introduced by councilor.
[43:59] So, Councilor McConky. Yes. Thank you. I believe you had
[44:03] three items that you sent in, so we're going to.
[44:05] Do them one at a time. I don't know if
[44:07] you had the chance to see. My email. The third
[44:09] one, I don't think it would be an order because
[44:12] there's an item pretty much identical to that that's coming
[44:14] forward to the Eds committee, actually. It's not identical. We'll
[44:17] come to that one when we do, but let's. Start
[44:19] with them in order that they were sent. Thank you.
[44:22] Just a moment while we get that first one on
[44:24] screen.
[44:38] Just one moment, committee.
[44:58] Yeah. So, just so you are aware in advance, the
[45:05] first item. The deputy city clerk has recommended that this
[45:11] be referred. To to clerk staff for a report. But
[45:17] we'll get it on screen first. And do this one
[45:21] step at a time here.
[45:37] Okay. So, Councilor McConkey, did you want to read that
[45:40] motion? Thank you. In keeping with the city's commitment to
[45:42] be an accessible place of employment and removing barriers. I
[45:45] don't think we need the comma, that AShwa accessibility Advisory
[45:49] committee, OAAC members be permitted virtual participation at all meetings.
[45:54] Access. Without a restriction of notifying clerks Department 24 hours
[45:59] prior to an OAAc meeting. This actually came as a
[46:05] shock to members of the OAAC last month when they
[46:08] were told. They needed to notify the clerks 24 hours
[46:15] prior had not been in practice before. And other members
[46:20] of the committee actually wanted to make the motion. But
[46:24] as Jennifer will recall, Committee was told that no, it
[46:29] had to. They could not make a motion to counsel
[46:32] on something. That. Is council policy. But the council policy
[46:37] that may be there, which I actually don't agree with
[46:40] at this. Point. It came early. After Covid, but it
[46:44] was never put into practice at the oaac. Members of
[46:48] the oaac. Are very dedicated, give a lot of time.
[46:55] Come to the city hall when they can. And some
[46:59] of them are in not good health. And still come.
[47:03] But others. Things crop up. Not only health issues, but.
[47:10] Weather issues. The meeting, actually, when this was discussed. There
[47:17] was a snow event which was unexpected. This winter has
[47:20] been kind of erratic that way. We've had lots of
[47:22] fine weather, and then when the snow comes, sometimes it's
[47:25] been a bit of a surprise, and the snow started
[47:27] in the afternoon, and by the time for the evening
[47:31] committee meeting. Some were thinking that they may not be
[47:35] able to get to the committee meeting and hadn't. Called
[47:38] in ahead. Because like I said, In march. This was
[47:42] basically a notice that all members received. And I have
[47:47] discussed some of this. With staff. I just believe at
[47:51] this point, virtual meetings are such a thing. I mean,
[47:54] staff have the ability. To come to work or work
[47:59] from home. Virtual is. Part of the everyday workplace now.
[48:05] And I believe that members of. The clerk's department. Who
[48:13] are monitoring a meeting would be able to make sure
[48:17] there's a connection. If it might be a matter of
[48:21] tuning things up and plugging something in, but I believe
[48:24] hopefully it's something that all clerks. Staff are able to
[48:29] do to ensure that. We have the. You know how
[48:33] awkward it is when committee has a problem with connections,
[48:38] but I. Think we've gotten better at it. It's been
[48:41] a fair number of meetings since. The first policies about
[48:46] virtual meetings came in. And especially with this particular committee,
[48:51] who I know the members well. Now, after five years,
[48:56] Serving with them. There's no more dedicated people on an
[49:01] advisory committee than on the OAAC, and they were upset,
[49:06] and I'm embarrassed that they were, that they were told
[49:09] that they have to call in 24 hours before an
[49:12] OAAC meeting. Those are my comments, and I'm not sure
[49:16] why. This is a corporate policy. Why it would not
[49:19] be before this committee. Thank you. Thank you. Is there
[49:27] any other speakers? I probably turn to committee just based
[49:30] on the deputy clerk's. Suggestion that I have in an
[49:34] email that it be referred to staff for report. Is
[49:38] that councilor Mark did. I agree with the motion in
[49:41] spirit, certainly. The 24 hours policy that was in place.
[49:45] Just to refresh my memory. Because I know often if
[49:49] I call and there's a meeting, the clerk set up
[49:52] a telephone conference. I don't get that email straight away,
[49:55] so I don't know if it's a logistical issue that
[49:58] maybe these hours couldn't be manipulated to certainly create. A
[50:02] situation where people feel like they have some accessibility to
[50:04] the meeting, but I just don't. Know the 24 hours.
[50:08] Prior. Is that something that staff require or is it
[50:11] something that can be a bridge? Certainly to this case.
[50:17] And I'm happy to take your direction or your concern
[50:19] on this, Mr. Chair. I do agree with the motion
[50:22] spirit. Yeah. And just for clarification, part of it is
[50:27] in the procedure bylaw. So I think that that's probably
[50:31] why the deputy city clerk is asking for it to
[50:33] be referred so that they can figure out what the
[50:35] moving parts are, because some of it is as you're
[50:38] alluding to, would be operational. But then some of it's
[50:40] actually embedded in the procedure bylaw and. It isn't so
[50:43] much. 24 hours prior notice it's a noon the previous
[50:47] day. Previous business day. So order referral. Complicate councilor McConkey's
[50:55] ability to have the next advisory committee meeting. Or would
[50:58] we? I think in any case, there would have to
[51:00] be a look at it, would take some time in
[51:03] any case, because it would both be operational. That would
[51:05] have to be looked. At and the procedural bylaw. Can
[51:07] somebody tell me when the next accessibility advisory committee meeting
[51:10] is? Monthly, are they? Not usually. It's the first 3rd
[51:13] week. Yeah, it's coming up. Yeah. So, I mean, the
[51:16] next one is coming up shortly in any case, I
[51:18] think this will take a bit of time for staff.
[51:21] To. Those are my question, okay? Would there be a
[51:26] referral motion? Okay. Mayor Carter has moved a referral. All
[51:34] in favor of the referral? Opposed. See one hand. Opposed?
[51:41] Recorded vote, please. Okay, recorded vote. We'll give a record
[51:45] of over this one for Councilor McCaukey. Thank you. Councilor
[51:50] McConkey. No. Councilor man Petri? No. Councilor marks? Yes. Councilor
[52:00] Neil? No. Mayor Carter? No. Councilor Guyrson? Yes. That. Two.
[52:09] Affirmative or negative? Okay, the referral doesn't carry, so now
[52:13] we have. The item that's here. Okay. A record vote
[52:18] on the item. And I want to take one last
[52:21] look at it here to make sure that I know
[52:23] what I'm voting on. So. The difficulty here
[52:33] with the wording as is, which was why I was
[52:35] sort of leaning on the referral request from the deputy
[52:38] city clerk is that I'm trying to determine. I don't
[52:43] want to say whether it's in order or not, but
[52:45] it is. Missing the part. That would require an amendment
[52:48] to the procedure bylaw. For this to be accommodated so.
[52:56] I'm not trying to weigh in on. Whether it might
[53:00] be a thing worth investigating. And have merit to it.
[53:04] It may have merit to take another look now that
[53:06] it's been a couple of years since these were put
[53:07] in place. It's. Missing some pieces, I guess, is. What?
[53:16] I'm alluding to here. Yeah. Currently. It's contrary to the
[53:22] procedure bylaw. It would need language that says a recommendation.
[53:25] To amend the procedural bylaw. Would you accept? Notwithstanding the
[53:30] procedural bylaw, It confines it to the accessibility advisory committee.
[53:38] It's a little bit tricky because, really, it usually requires
[53:40] a two thirds vote from council. To waive something that's
[53:43] already in place, but. We've got two. Two weeks. Three
[53:52] weeks until council. When is the three? Is it three?
[53:56] So. I'll take notwithstanding. And perhaps. In that time, staff
[54:02] would be able to get some elaboration on. What would
[54:06] be necessary in order to do this? So that's an
[54:11] amendment to add, notwithstanding. Notwithstanding the procedural bylaw, I'll take
[54:18] it as a friendly. I prefer not to. It's a
[54:22] bad habit we've gotten into. So I don't want to
[54:25] promote that. So the amendment is notwithstanding the procedural bylaw.
[54:30] And that would be right at the front of. The
[54:34] moment. I'll turn to speakers on the amendment once that's
[54:38] up in front of us. I mean, if it's a
[54:46] point of order, someone can jump in and. Mr. Chair,
[54:54] I do have a point of order, and the issue
[54:56] being is 31 two, which is. Electronic participation meetings, subsection
[55:03] b. It says a member must advise a clerk no
[55:07] later than. The business day before the meeting. Of the
[55:11] intent of the participation of electronic in order to assure
[55:15] proper technology is enabled to make sure participation is possible.
[55:19] Then when you go to the definitions under member says
[55:23] member means according to the circumstances. A member of council,
[55:26] including mayor. A member of committee, including the chair. I
[55:31] don't. Know. Is that? A formal committee. Is that an
[55:36] advisory committee? I'm just looking at it here and. I
[55:43] just like that there might be a little bit of
[55:45] wiggle room, given that it's. Not exposed. I don't know.
[55:48] The issue being is I don't have a problem with
[55:51] the accessibility aspects of them having it like to be
[55:54] able to do it. They're an advisory group, and I'd
[55:57] like to see that. I'm struggling with that anyways. Well,
[56:01] Ms. Lane has reminded me that it is a committee
[56:03] of council now. They have their own procedural. Yes, but
[56:07] with. So. As Ms. Lane has noted, if there
[56:17] isn't something that specifies. A particular procedure within. Their policy
[56:24] and procedure. Then it falls back to whatever the procedure
[56:26] of council. I appreciate it. The clerk's department will have
[56:36] a couple of weeks just to figure out what would
[56:38] be. Sort of a reasonable approach to it. I would
[56:46] presume that it would either need to be an amendment
[56:49] to the procedural bylaw. Or an amendment to add something.
[56:54] Into their policy and procedure guidebook. Because then something would
[56:58] exist and wouldn't require. Anyway, so. We have the amendment
[57:05] in front of us, notwithstanding procedure bylaw.
[57:19] Okay. So now I'm being told. Notwithstanding, is not allowed.
[57:26] Yeah, I was going to say that, Mr. Chair. So
[57:27] I have something for. You. I think in the spirit
[57:30] of what you just indicated, because I was just going
[57:32] to say that. We were unable to use notwithstanding earlier.
[57:37] On another issue. And I would attest that the notwithstanding
[57:43] could have been used here without any sort of confusion.
[57:48] But. Notwithstanding the fact that we can't use it. I
[57:53] think we could just indicate that the procedural bylaw be
[57:57] amended accordingly. And that leaves clerks. With ample room to
[58:00] be able to navigate that. And should they need to
[58:03] add things accordingly, allows them to do so and bring
[58:06] it back to council with the appropriate ordering. I'd be
[58:09] fine with that, if that's the wording. That we want
[58:11] to look at. And in that time, if clerks looks
[58:13] at it and says, actually, this would be better in
[58:16] the advisory committee, policy and procedure, or whatever the name
[58:19] is of that document. They can certainly advise on that.
[58:22] But. I would be fine with that. So I'm going
[58:25] to agree that we can't. Do the notwithstanding. So we
[58:29] just need wording on an amendment for it. Members. I
[58:34] think what it would have to read is that, in
[58:35] keeping with the city's commitment, to an accessible place. Employment.
[58:42] Members. So right after members that it would say that
[58:47] the procedural bylaw. Amended. Such that.
[59:02] Such that. Oh, sorry, I should have said before.
[59:33] Thank you. Okay, so that's the amendment there that the
[59:41] procedural bylaw be amended such that. Thank you for the
[59:47] input on this. Sorry, just second. So, Councilor Mary Petri,
[59:50] that's. Your amendment? Any other comment to add. So, Councilor
[59:53] McConkey, I'll turn it to you. And then, councilor Mark
[59:56] I just wanted to say thank you to my colleagues
[59:59] here on the committee for getting. This basically something that
[1:00:03] I can announce at the next OAAC meeting that at
[1:00:07] least the. Corporate and finance committee have come up with
[1:00:12] this, and I'll read them the motion and it'll be
[1:00:14] going to council this month. Thank you. Sure. Yeah. I
[1:00:18] mean, we still needed to go through the process and
[1:00:19] determine what's doable and all that sort of stuff. So
[1:00:22] please let them know staff are looking at it rather
[1:00:26] than. It's a done deal. Councilor marks. Yeah. I'm just
[1:00:29] glad the city clerk's not in attendance, but online probably,
[1:00:32] so. Fears, face or glares. But a procedural bylaw amendment
[1:00:38] is a very important and serious debate. Given the sensitive
[1:00:42] nature of the accessibility Advisory committee, this is something that
[1:00:46] I think I'm happy to support a recommendation from this
[1:00:49] committee to move forward to council, but in the future,
[1:00:52] if we're going to have any procedural bylaw review, remember?
[1:00:55] You remember, Mr. Chairman, we had lengthy conversations about. It.
[1:01:00] It is a discussion of council as a whole. Otherwise,
[1:01:04] you'll see procedural bylaw amendments come from every committee on
[1:01:08] a weekly or. Sorry. On a monthly basis, which is
[1:01:10] a very dangerous game to play. So this is. Our
[1:01:14] governing bylaw. It governs our meetings. It's very important. So
[1:01:18] to have any further discussion about any amendments will require.
[1:01:23] A full meeting of council to discuss that. So happy
[1:01:26] to support this, given the sensitive nature of the accessibility
[1:01:29] advisory committee. But as far as I'm concerned, this is
[1:01:32] as far as I'm willing, and I hope this committee
[1:01:34] is willing to go to amend this bylaw. Thank you.
[1:01:38] Point well taken. Thank you. On the amendment, are there
[1:01:40] any opposed to that amendment that's highlighted. I don't see
[1:01:44] any. So now it is the motion, as amended, in
[1:01:47] front of. Us. Were there any other speakers on the
[1:01:51] motion? As amended. Record a vote from vice chair marks.
[1:02:08] Councilor marks? Yes, Councilor Mayor Petrie? Councilor McConkey. Yes. Councilor
[1:02:14] Neil. Yes. Mayor Carter? Yes. Councilor Geverson? Yes. Six? Affirmative.
[1:02:19] Thank you. That carries. So we will. Now, just give
[1:02:22] us a moment. We're going to move on to the
[1:02:24] next item. As councilor McConkey has sent in. I believe
[1:02:28] this is item two of three.
[1:02:42] Okay, Councilor McConkey, this is your motion. Did you want
[1:02:45] to read that? Yes. Thank you. The region of Durham's
[1:02:48] vision Zero program included an agreement that the region and
[1:02:51] its lower tier municipalities would share in the camera revenues
[1:02:54] on a 60 40 basis. Yet. Since the implementation of
[1:03:04] that program, the city of OSHA has and I have
[1:03:07] to get a t at the end of that, it.
[1:03:10] Has not. My error has not received any revenue. Therefore,
[1:03:15] Ashwa city staff request a detailed accounting from the region
[1:03:19] of Durham with an explanation why and when revenue will
[1:03:23] be shared with the city of Osha. So give me
[1:03:30] a moment with this one because I'm going to turn
[1:03:33] to the commissioner. And just get some clarification on both
[1:03:40] this revenue. And do we get information from the region
[1:03:45] of Durham on it? Thank you, chair Guy Burston. It's
[1:03:50] my understanding that the 60 40 split is based on
[1:03:53] provincial offenses act revenue and the region gets 60%. The
[1:03:58] other 40% is then shared. With the area municipalities on
[1:04:03] their share of weighted assessment. In terms of the revenue.
[1:04:07] It's my understanding from discussions with regional staff that the
[1:04:13] costs actually exceed the revenue. And therefore, if we were.
[1:04:18] Sharing the costs, they would actually be sending us an
[1:04:21] invoice. So. Yeah, councilor. I'm not really sure. What we
[1:04:29] would given that information. I'm not sure that this motion
[1:04:32] really would have any effect. Well, I'm sorry, but I
[1:04:35] would like to see an actual accounting. Because you read.
[1:04:38] In the paper. Other municipalities in Mississauga, Edmonton. The public
[1:04:43] is calling it a cash grab. Well, if it's a
[1:04:45] cash grab, we haven't seen the cash, but I don't
[1:04:48] think that's. Fair. To say if 60% is going to
[1:04:52] the region. Has the region not received a dollar of
[1:04:57] revenue? And how is it that they would receive but
[1:05:00] the lower tiers don't? A 60 40 should be prorated.
[1:05:05] So it's not all going to the region, and then
[1:05:07] what's left over is. Going to the lower tier municipal.
[1:05:11] It just doesn't make sense to me, and I believe
[1:05:13] that it's time that we have. I mean, this was
[1:05:14] implemented, what, three years ago? I'm searching from the regional
[1:05:20] counselors. Was it 2021 that I think this came into?
[1:05:23] Play, like, surely to goodness there's revenue coming in now.
[1:05:27] I mean, I know a lot. Of people that have
[1:05:28] received the tickets. The city of Ash was looking at
[1:05:32] investigating like Pickering and Ajax has, doing it on their
[1:05:35] local roads. I think we need to know a little
[1:05:37] bit better how this operates. So I would hope to
[1:05:43] see. This motion pass so we can get a clear
[1:05:47] picture. Thank you. Councilor. Neil, you had your hand up.
[1:05:52] Yeah, I have no problem. What this suggests. But I
[1:05:56] would hope. That. Our city manager, Tracy Adams, would, and
[1:06:01] I've talked to her about this before. Whether they discussed
[1:06:06] this or not. When all caos. Get together and have
[1:06:10] their meetings with the region. I don't know when the
[1:06:12] next one is. But perhaps Tracy would be able to
[1:06:16] tell us if this has been brought up, because I
[1:06:18] know, she advised me that last time I asked that
[1:06:21] they were bringing it up. So what's? The latest update.
[1:06:25] From those meetings with the region where they iron. They
[1:06:28] sit down and they iron certain things out. And. It
[1:06:32] comes back to us. That's what I'd like to throw
[1:06:36] out. There is, has this been discussed? Because I've asked
[1:06:39] that it be brought up at those meetings. Thank you.
[1:06:43] If city council chooses to ask the region for information
[1:06:46] on this, it certainly is not out of order. If
[1:06:49] the committee wants. To send the recorded vote, please. Sorry.
[1:06:57] Yeah. I'll turn to visiting councilor Lee. Thank you very
[1:07:02] much, Mr. Chairman. I don't like trying to simplify this.
[1:07:07] It seemed pretty simple to me. That how much revenue
[1:07:11] is coming in based on the number of tickets they
[1:07:13] give and what's? The cost of administration. It's just simple
[1:07:17] math to me. I can't see where the difficulty would
[1:07:22] be. Just asked the question, how much revenue comes out
[1:07:26] of the 407? And that seems to be like, asking
[1:07:30] somebody to split the atom around here, so thank you.
[1:07:36] I don't know. Maybe they're still paying off the machines.
[1:07:38] Still? I don't know enough about this to know. But.
[1:07:44] If Merrickard did you. So, not to complicate things, but
[1:07:47] it is a lot. More complicated than the simplicity that
[1:07:50] we're looking at it. There was capital investments. There is
[1:07:56] challenges in regards to the tickets coming through. There is
[1:07:58] a process that, that's undertaking. I don't have all the
[1:08:02] information. And again as it comes back down. Therefore, ASHra
[1:08:06] staff request detailed accounting. I just want to remind all
[1:08:10] members of council. When we go through the year end
[1:08:15] with our staff in regards to their business plans. We
[1:08:19] support those business plans. Every meeting that we bring new
[1:08:24] items to the floor means something has to come off
[1:08:26] their work. Plan. And then we get disappointed because the
[1:08:30] reason that we keep on adding things. And certain things
[1:08:33] don't get done. And then through my discussions with department
[1:08:37] heads, as I'm asking for accountability and making sure that
[1:08:41] they accomplish the task and that our work plans are
[1:08:44] actually accomplished within that annual twelve month period. I just
[1:08:48] want us to take into consideration. The amount of work
[1:08:51] that. Is already scheduled in these departments. And every time
[1:08:57] we bring these forward, that means if this ends, up
[1:09:00] being a priority of this council, then that means something
[1:09:03] has to come off their work plan. And there's a
[1:09:05] limited amount of resources that everybody has, so I'm just
[1:09:08] asking. Everybody please take that into consideration as. We continue?
[1:09:14] The pylon in regards to our departments. I think this
[1:09:18] council is being very supportive in regards to making sure
[1:09:21] that we get the extra resources so that we can
[1:09:23] actually achieve great customer service, which we are in the
[1:09:26] process of undertaking. But every time we add something. This
[1:09:31] adds another. Job. That now becomes a priority. So something
[1:09:36] else has to come off the priority list. So I
[1:09:40] just know little about this, but I know there's a
[1:09:42] lot more complexities. To it than the simplicity of what
[1:09:45] it seems. Other speakers. Yeah. Councilor McConky, second round. Thank
[1:09:51] you. Don't need to burden. Anyone. But I do believe
[1:09:53] in getting answers. At this point, when we see in
[1:09:59] the paper, like I said, a lot of municipalities, how
[1:10:02] much they're making and the number of cameras they're putting
[1:10:05] out keeps increasing. But. The region of Durham this year
[1:10:10] did not add any new cameras. We have, as everyone
[1:10:14] knows, on council, we get all the calls. About the
[1:10:20] speeding problems on city of Ashwa roads and regional roads
[1:10:26] in the city of osha I'd like to keep this
[1:10:28] just to find a request for financial accounting. Right, but.
[1:10:31] The fact is, the region has not approved any new
[1:10:34] cameras in 2024. And the number of cameras that they
[1:10:38] have. I'm surprised there's not that many. They have eight
[1:10:43] fixed and. Eight, rotating at six right now. Really? We
[1:10:49] got to keep this to a request for financial there.
[1:10:51] You go. I'm just sharing some information there. Thank you.
[1:10:54] Okay. Thank you. And you had requested a recorded. Yes.
[1:10:59] Okay. Thank you. Just looking one last time. Okay. Record
[1:11:03] a vote called by councilor. Okay, councilor McConkey. Yes, Councilor
[1:11:08] Mayor Petri? Yes. Councilor Marks? Yes. Councilor Neil? Yes. Mayor
[1:11:14] Carter? No. Councilor Geverson? Yes. Five. Affirmative. Okay, that carries.
[1:11:21] So, there's one last item, and councilor McConkey. I have
[1:11:24] to rule the item out of order for two reasons.
[1:11:26] One, the item. Exists fundamentally on the afternoon agenda at
[1:11:31] economic and development services. The other reason being that given
[1:11:36] that that type of program has been determined to be
[1:11:40] in the purview of the business and economic Development Branch,
[1:11:43] which reports to that committee. For the time being. I'm
[1:11:50] treating it as being something that wouldn't come to this
[1:11:52] committee. Okay, so. I could take it this afternoon to
[1:11:55] economics. What I would suggest you do if there are
[1:11:59] tweaks. Or some slight differences or additions to what is
[1:12:04] in that report. That you had in mind. Take a
[1:12:07] look at what's in that report, and then as a
[1:12:10] visiting council. No, I. Have looked at it, and I
[1:12:12] see quite a difference. In fact, we had someone from
[1:12:14] the downtown email about graffiti, and I said, look at
[1:12:18] what the city of Toronto, there's nothing on the floor
[1:12:20] right now, and I've ruled it out of order. What
[1:12:22] I would suggest you do come this afternoon as a
[1:12:24] visiting councilor. Provide your feedback. Maybe there will be. Amendments
[1:12:28] that could be brought. To that? Because if I could
[1:12:31] clarify, what we're talking about this afternoon is $100,000. From
[1:12:34] the city. Give me a moment, because I've already declared
[1:12:37] a set of. Order. Give me 1 second to look
[1:12:39] one last time. This is not from the city of
[1:12:41] Osha. We're asking the province of. Wait while I look
[1:12:44] at that. Thank you.
[1:12:56] Yeah. So my suggestion would be either at committee this
[1:12:59] afternoon, Suggest that. As an addition to that package. Or
[1:13:07] bring it as an amendment to council. Thank you. Okay.
[1:13:09] Thank you. Are there any other items? To be introduced
[1:13:11] by members of council or committee. Sorry, Councilor Neil. Motion.
[1:13:16] No, Jarrett. Well, that's not an item to be introduced,
[1:13:19] but it's in order, so we'll take it. Are there
[1:13:22] any opposed to adjournment? We are adjourned. Thank you.