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>>we will start with the flag salute.

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if you could stand.

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>>[pledge of allegiance]

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>> roll call

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>> mr. Hauge here, mr. Johnson here,

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mr. Woodward here, mr. Demattei here,

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mr. Herzog here

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>> welcome, everyone. Today's meeting

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is open to in person in attendance and

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we will also be observed online through

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the placer county website. In an effort

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to encourage the public to engage in

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the process our public comment for the

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meeting will be offered in person and

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through remote virtual process.

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citizens who wish to comment virtually

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today should be prepared to comment via

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zoom platform. To join online click on

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the link on the planning commission

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homepage. Be sure your microphone is

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muted. You may also call in using the

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toll-free number. That number is

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8887880099, or call 8778535247. Please

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enter the webinar id number 83694865277.

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please press star six to mute

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yourself. If you would like to make

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public comment virtually, please raise

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your hand with the hand icon at the

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bottom of the page. If you are calling

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in please press star nine to raise your

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hand. Please be prepared to speak at

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the time I open public comment for the

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specific item you would like to address

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which may include public comment for

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matters not on the agenda, a consent

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item or a timed item. If attending in

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person we request that once you have

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commented on your item returned here

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cedar leave through the hearing exit

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door to accommodate physical distancing

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and allow for others to provide

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in-person comment. Each commenter is

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entitled to three minutes. Thank you

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for your patience as we work to

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preserve the safety and health of all

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meeting participants and ensure each

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citizen who wishes to comment has the

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opportunity to do so. At this time I

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left the planning director report

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>> I want to clarify the id number I

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provided you with the incorrect web id

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number my mistake. The number is

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81971524079. Once again 81971524079.

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>> is it correct on the website?

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>> yes just the know you had

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>> thank you and then I will start with

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my report. Reporting out on board of

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supervisors meeting past and upcoming.

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there was a board special board meeting

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on april 5. There were budget

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presentations from the county

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departments for the fiscal year 22/23

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budget. Those were initial department

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requests the board is actually going to

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take up the budget and adoption at two

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upcoming board meetings on june 14 and

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june 28. Next week which is the next

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board meeting april 19 several planning

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items going forward. The ridge

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subdivision which is a general plan

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amendment, next to the bickford

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project. The emergency shelter cup

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modification that will allow the

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extension of the permit for another

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five years. Also the base to base

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gondola which extends the construction

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season. Are there any questions on

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those? Also on the agenda april 19 the

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board will consider two appointments to

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the planning commission. The one you

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are aware is the at-large seat for the

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eastern sierra crest. That one there

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will be an appointment made on tuesday

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for that. And then we did hear from

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commissioner sam cannon that he

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regrettably has submitted a resignation

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for personal reasons. I want to wish

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him well and thank him for his service

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on the commission while he was here.

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that is the district 1 seat and that

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reappointment will be on the agenda

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next week. Are there any comments? May

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10 looking out a month ahead the

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housing related code amendments, that

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is scheduled on that date. That's just

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where workshop the board won't take any

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action just provide direction to staff

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at that meeting. Are the questions?

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>> ej a couple if it's okay. I

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understood the community was going to

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appeal the bayside decision. As you know

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has that happened?

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>> we did receive an appeal on that

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project. I don't know if we have a

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tentative date when it will go to the

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board but it's probably 60 days out.

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thank you for bringing that up it was

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not on my list

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>> no problem. Now a comment if you

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don't mind. This is for public I guess

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public consumption. And to get it on

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the record. I am continuing to be

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concerned about a code rewrite that

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will take place or is taking place as

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we speak associated with mixed-use

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multifamily associated with the housing

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element associated with streamlining

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etc.. I continue to be concerned about

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hearing about the way this will

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proceed. For everybody to get it on the

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public record, I did ask for a meeting

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with the ceo on this because at the

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individual who could resolve the

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problem without question I think ahead

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of time. That meeting was acknowledged

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by his office, I haven't heard from

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them and I basically indicated this

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would be the time, this thursday would

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be the time it would need to take place

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or prior to that. Since that has not

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happened I withdraw that request for a

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meeting. I offer the same request to

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the lead attorney and county counsel

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office. If there's an interest in

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meeting with me on this I suggest it be

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done. I would love to have it happen. I

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will be gone for eight days leaving

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this evening. If we can do that when I

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get back it would be great. If not

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that's okay as well. I think it would

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be a good idea to meet

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>> thank you

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>> moving on to upcoming planning

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commission schedules. We have a meeting

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scheduled for april 28 in two weeks. On

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that agenda now granite bay medical

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office project down on the corner of

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berg and douglas boulevard, a general

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plan amendment, that will be up for

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your consideration. We also have an

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appeal of a sign variance also in

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granite bay at the next meeting. For

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may 12 meeting agenda yet to be

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determined so I can't confirm whether

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or not we will have that meeting or

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what will be on the agenda so stay

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tuned. Staffing update, the county has

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hired a new community development

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resource agency director. As of last

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friday. The gentleman's name is david

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wong, he is currently the community

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development director for

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[indiscernible] county. I believe he's

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also worked in the past for the city of

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sacramento in different capacities and

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also as the planning director. The

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start date is june 7 so we are about a

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month out in the interim james

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christensen acting as interim agency

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director will continue until that time.

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that's good news so thank you

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>> thank you. I will open up public

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comment for any matters not on the

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planning commission agenda.

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>> is there anyone here that wishes to

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comment on non-agenda items?

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>> anyone online?

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>> there's a little bit of a delay for

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online so I will wait.

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>> we will close public comment for

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items not on the agenda. We will move

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on to consent agenda. Would any

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commissioners like to remove an item

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from the consent agenda? I will remove

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item b

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>> we will pull item b and leave item a.

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I will ask the public if they would

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like to remove any consent agenda

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items? Anyone here in person? Anyone

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online?

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>> I move to approve the consent items,

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second

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>> let's take a roll call vote on item

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a on the consent

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>> mr. Hauge yes mr. Johnson yes mr.

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woodward yes mr. Demattei yes mr.

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herzog yes

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>> let's go ahead and move to the

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consent agenda item presentation from

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staff steve?

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>> before steve gets started maybe the

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it folks can jump to the plumpjack

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powerpoint slide? Good morning mr. Chair

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members of the commission supervisor

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planner out of the tahoe office today I

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bring the plumpjack in redevelopment

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project and requests from the applicant

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for an extension of time on the project.

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to help orient to you to where the

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project is located, situated at the

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northwest intersection of olympic

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valley road and shirley canyon road

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toward the west end of the olympic

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valley. The subject property is shown

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on the screen, the property was

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developed in 1959 in preparation for

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the olympics. The current site

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improvements include a 61 room hotel

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surface parking a restaurant and a

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related functions. Just for orientation

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purposes, to the north the area subject

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property is zoned village commercial.

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to the north of the subject property

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shown in the hash marks in the

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conservation preserve zone district is

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where it is located. Immediately to the

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east and across the roadway is the

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village of palisades. To the south of

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the subject property is the squaw

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valley lodge property. Area shown to

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the west is zoned high density

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residential and [indiscernible] condos

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property. Back in 2017 the planning

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commission approved a vesting tentative

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map and subdivision that allow for the

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demolition of existing structures on

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the property including the surface

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parking and in its place replaced with

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underground parking structure and above

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ground will be three separate buildings

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underground parking area is all

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interconnected. Contained within the

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buildings your approval allowed for a

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60 hotel room and 34 residential units

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which will be dispersed amongst all

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three structures. The eastern structure

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is where the hotel itself is intended

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to be located. As I mentioned february

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2017 the planning commission approved

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the vesting tentative map conditional

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use permit. Accompanying the proposal

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was an environmental document prepared

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for the project which was deemed to be

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adequate by the planning commission. In

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may 2018 the applicant proposed a

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modification to the previous approved

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entitlement essentially resulted in

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minimal exterior changes, the

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structures were going to remain the

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same. It was more the internal use of

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the structures at that point they were

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considering a reprogramming of the

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interior of the site which would cause

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a shift from the touristy uses two more

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residential uses. About that same time,

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the floodplain mapping for the area was

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updated by fema which created some

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design concerns for the applicant team

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the application was placed on hold and

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later withdrawn. In april 2020, the

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planning commission approved a two-year

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extension of time for the project which

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established a new expiration date of

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february 2022. In january 12th 2022

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prior to the expiration date, for the

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project the applicant filed a timely

277
00:16:34,100 --> 00:16:37,100
appeal I'm sorry a timely request for

278
00:16:37,100 --> 00:16:38,100
an extension of time to extend the

279
00:16:38,100 --> 00:16:41,601
expiration date of the project. Similar

280
00:16:47,100 --> 00:16:48,100
to the previous extension of time

281
00:16:48,100 --> 00:16:49,100
request there are a number of findings

282
00:16:49,100 --> 00:16:50,100
required for the planning commission to

283
00:16:50,100 --> 00:16:54,201
make to approve the extension of time.

284
00:17:00,100 --> 00:17:01,100
some of those include there are no

285
00:17:01,100 --> 00:17:02,100
changes or circumstances occurred that

286
00:17:02,100 --> 00:17:03,100
would've impacted the planning

287
00:17:03,100 --> 00:17:06,100
commission original approval of the

288
00:17:07,100 --> 00:17:08,100
project in 2017. Additionally, the

289
00:17:08,100 --> 00:17:09,100
planning commission will be asked to

290
00:17:09,100 --> 00:17:10,100
make the findings the applicant has

291
00:17:10,100 --> 00:17:14,201
been diligent in their pursuit of the

292
00:17:15,100 --> 00:17:16,100
implementation of the project. Staff

293
00:17:16,100 --> 00:17:19,601
has reviewed the applicants request for

294
00:17:20,100 --> 00:17:21,100
an extension of time and staff believes

295
00:17:21,100 --> 00:17:23,100
the planning commission can meet the

296
00:17:23,100 --> 00:17:26,100
findings. Speaking to the diligent

297
00:17:28,100 --> 00:17:31,601
pursuit of the project the applicant

298
00:17:32,100 --> 00:17:33,100
continues to evaluate design revisions

299
00:17:33,100 --> 00:17:34,100
or modifications that address the flood

300
00:17:34,100 --> 00:17:37,100
proofing of the underground parking

301
00:17:37,100 --> 00:17:40,601
structure that was impacted by the

302
00:17:41,100 --> 00:17:42,100
remapping of the floodplain. At the

303
00:17:42,100 --> 00:17:45,100
same time the applicant is pursuing

304
00:17:45,100 --> 00:17:46,100
obtaining capital to secure the

305
00:17:46,100 --> 00:17:49,100
financing that will allow the project

306
00:17:49,100 --> 00:17:53,201
to move forward. With all of that,

307
00:17:57,100 --> 00:17:59,100
staff recommendation is the planning

308
00:17:59,100 --> 00:18:00,100
commission approved the two-year

309
00:18:00,100 --> 00:18:03,601
extension of time request for the

310
00:18:04,100 --> 00:18:07,601
plumpjack inn vesting tentative map and

311
00:18:09,100 --> 00:18:11,401
conditional use permit 1400047 in

312
00:18:15,100 --> 00:18:16,100
reliance on the previously certified

313
00:18:16,100 --> 00:18:17,100
environmental impact report and modify

314
00:18:17,100 --> 00:18:18,100
conditions of approval as recommended

315
00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:22,100
by staff and based on the findings and

316
00:18:22,100 --> 00:18:23,100
the staff report. Speaking to the

317
00:18:23,100 --> 00:18:26,100
modify conditions contained in the

318
00:18:27,100 --> 00:18:29,100
staff report, there's one item

319
00:18:29,100 --> 00:18:32,100
condition 107 that needs to be

320
00:18:36,100 --> 00:18:37,100
modified, your planning packet and

321
00:18:37,100 --> 00:18:39,401
expiration date of february 23, 2025.

322
00:18:41,100 --> 00:18:42,100
that should be consistent with the

323
00:18:42,100 --> 00:18:45,100
two-year extension of time request

324
00:18:45,100 --> 00:18:48,601
before you. It should read february 23,

325
00:18:49,100 --> 00:18:52,100
2024. I'm happy to answer any questions

326
00:18:52,100 --> 00:18:56,100
should you have any. The applicant is

327
00:18:56,100 --> 00:19:00,801
also on the line happy to answer any

328
00:19:01,100 --> 00:19:02,100
questions

329
00:19:02,100 --> 00:19:04,401
>> questions from commissioners for

330
00:19:08,100 --> 00:19:09,100
staff?

331
00:19:09,100 --> 00:19:12,100
>> I think we will have some

332
00:19:12,100 --> 00:19:14,401
>> I'd like the applicant

333
00:19:22,100 --> 00:19:23,100
>> can you hear me okay?

334
00:19:23,100 --> 00:19:24,100
>> we can hear you

335
00:19:24,100 --> 00:19:27,601
>> my name is hayes parzybok. Principle

336
00:19:34,100 --> 00:19:37,601
with paradigm eight we are in

337
00:19:38,100 --> 00:19:39,100
partnership with the plumpjack group

338
00:19:39,100 --> 00:19:40,100
and cnc the property owner on this

339
00:19:40,100 --> 00:19:44,201
project and have been working on it

340
00:19:46,100 --> 00:19:49,100
since 2018. Actually 2017 how the years

341
00:19:55,100 --> 00:19:59,801
go by. I wanted to sort of reiterate

342
00:20:00,100 --> 00:20:04,201
what steve mentioned. As you can all

343
00:20:09,100 --> 00:20:10,100
probably appreciate, the floodplain

344
00:20:10,100 --> 00:20:12,100
change while we were going through

345
00:20:12,100 --> 00:20:15,100
potential modification process was a

346
00:20:16,100 --> 00:20:17,100
substantial item relative to making

347
00:20:17,100 --> 00:20:21,801
sure we could meet the building code to

348
00:20:22,100 --> 00:20:26,100
do that with a subterranean garage as

349
00:20:26,100 --> 00:20:29,100
the project was approved. We believe

350
00:20:29,100 --> 00:20:32,100
that is feasible and relatively

351
00:20:34,100 --> 00:20:35,100
straightforward to design through. Just

352
00:20:35,100 --> 00:20:39,801
as we got the first extension, we were

353
00:20:41,100 --> 00:20:44,100
in a position to move the project

354
00:20:44,100 --> 00:20:47,601
forward quickly and pick up the

355
00:20:50,100 --> 00:20:51,100
improvement plan process where we left

356
00:20:51,100 --> 00:20:54,601
that off with placer county. As

357
00:20:59,100 --> 00:21:00,100
everyone knows we had done that and

358
00:21:00,100 --> 00:21:01,100
immediately after receiving or

359
00:21:01,100 --> 00:21:02,100
basically concurrent with receiving the

360
00:21:02,100 --> 00:21:05,100
first extension, we ran into all the

361
00:21:05,100 --> 00:21:08,601
challenges on the project relative to

362
00:21:10,100 --> 00:21:11,100
covid-19 including as you can

363
00:21:11,100 --> 00:21:14,100
appreciate with a complex project like

364
00:21:14,100 --> 00:21:17,100
this, getting design teams together in

365
00:21:17,100 --> 00:21:20,100
the summer of 2020 and the fall of 2020

366
00:21:20,100 --> 00:21:23,601
two the site to coordinate design

367
00:21:25,100 --> 00:21:28,601
modifications and things like that to

368
00:21:30,100 --> 00:21:33,100
address those complexities was not

369
00:21:34,100 --> 00:21:36,100
feasible. So, we've continued to do

370
00:21:36,100 --> 00:21:40,100
work on the project remotely. We are

371
00:21:40,100 --> 00:21:42,100
starting to get to a place where folks

372
00:21:42,100 --> 00:21:45,601
are comfortable reconvening on the site.

373
00:21:47,100 --> 00:21:48,100
we also have had a lot of good

374
00:21:48,100 --> 00:21:51,601
progress the last six months relative

375
00:21:53,100 --> 00:21:56,100
to the investment of capital stack

376
00:21:56,100 --> 00:21:59,100
needed for the project to move forward

377
00:21:59,100 --> 00:22:02,601
toward construction. So, we are excited

378
00:22:03,100 --> 00:22:04,100
about hopefully getting this extension

379
00:22:04,100 --> 00:22:08,801
and being in a position to move the

380
00:22:09,100 --> 00:22:12,100
project forward toward execution. I'm

381
00:22:12,100 --> 00:22:16,201
happy to stay on and answer any

382
00:22:17,100 --> 00:22:18,100
questions you may have. Also, we've got

383
00:22:18,100 --> 00:22:22,100
project council on as well if needed

384
00:22:22,100 --> 00:22:25,100
>> alright thank you hayes. Questions

385
00:22:28,100 --> 00:22:30,100
for the applicant?

386
00:22:31,100 --> 00:22:35,100
>> let's go ahead and move to public

387
00:22:35,100 --> 00:22:36,100
comment. Is there anybody in person

388
00:22:36,100 --> 00:22:39,601
wishing to speak on the item?

389
00:22:41,100 --> 00:22:42,100
>> anyone online?

390
00:22:42,100 --> 00:22:45,601
>> not seeing anyone in the public

391
00:22:57,100 --> 00:23:00,100
wanting to speak, we will close the

392
00:23:00,100 --> 00:23:03,601
public comment and bring it to

393
00:23:05,100 --> 00:23:06,100
commissioners for questions or

394
00:23:06,100 --> 00:23:07,100
clarification or discussion

395
00:23:07,100 --> 00:23:11,801
>> I have a question. I guess if I

396
00:23:13,100 --> 00:23:14,100
remember right when this project was

397
00:23:14,100 --> 00:23:17,100
first approved by the planning

398
00:23:17,100 --> 00:23:21,201
commission, it was also appealed to the

399
00:23:22,100 --> 00:23:24,100
supervisors. I was aware or not aware

400
00:23:24,100 --> 00:23:28,100
if it was gone beyond that to the court

401
00:23:28,100 --> 00:23:31,100
system or not. Is this involved in the

402
00:23:31,100 --> 00:23:32,100
court?

403
00:23:32,100 --> 00:23:34,100
>> it was not subject to litigation

404
00:23:34,100 --> 00:23:37,100
>> so it is separate litigation

405
00:23:43,100 --> 00:23:44,100
discussed in the letter we received?

406
00:23:44,100 --> 00:23:45,100
>> yes the litigation mentioned in the

407
00:23:45,100 --> 00:23:48,601
letter received pertains to a different

408
00:23:49,100 --> 00:23:50,100
project in the region or the vicinity

409
00:23:50,100 --> 00:23:51,100
>> okay thank you

410
00:23:51,100 --> 00:23:56,401
>> we can move to a motion if you have

411
00:24:08,100 --> 00:24:09,100
clarity

412
00:24:09,100 --> 00:24:13,201
>> move to extend for two years the

413
00:24:16,100 --> 00:24:17,100
request on the plumpjack 10 of map and

414
00:24:17,100 --> 00:24:20,100
conditional use permit pln 140-0047

415
00:24:23,100 --> 00:24:24,100
reliance on the previous environmental

416
00:24:24,100 --> 00:24:25,100
report and modify conditions of

417
00:24:25,100 --> 00:24:27,100
approval as recommended by staff based

418
00:24:27,100 --> 00:24:28,100
on the findings in the staff report

419
00:24:28,100 --> 00:24:31,601
>> do we have to modify 107 and 24

420
00:24:38,100 --> 00:24:42,201
months to 2024?it would be a separate?

421
00:24:43,100 --> 00:24:46,100
>> all one motion as commissioner

422
00:24:50,100 --> 00:24:51,100
hague, that includes [indiscernible]

423
00:24:51,100 --> 00:24:52,100
>> I am deaf today

424
00:24:52,100 --> 00:24:53,100
>> I will second that

425
00:24:53,100 --> 00:24:54,100
>> roll call vote

426
00:24:54,100 --> 00:24:58,201
>> first from mr. Hauge second from mr.

427
00:25:04,100 --> 00:25:07,601
demattei. Mr. Hauge yes, mr. Johnson

428
00:25:09,100 --> 00:25:12,601
yes, mr. Woodward yes, mr. Demattei

429
00:25:13,100 --> 00:25:15,401
yes, mr. Herzog yes

430
00:25:18,100 --> 00:25:22,100
>> we will move on to the first time

431
00:25:22,100 --> 00:25:25,100
the item winchester lot 35 and open

432
00:25:25,100 --> 00:25:28,601
space lot x conditional use permit

433
00:25:32,100 --> 00:25:34,401
subdivision modification. Members of

434
00:25:36,100 --> 00:25:37,100
the public may raise their hand or

435
00:25:37,100 --> 00:25:38,100
press start nine to queue up for the

436
00:25:38,100 --> 00:25:39,100
public item which will not begin until

437
00:25:39,100 --> 00:25:40,100
the presentation is complete. Chris

438
00:25:40,100 --> 00:25:41,100
schmidt will present on the item

439
00:25:41,100 --> 00:25:45,201
>> sorry chris I could have asked them

440
00:25:55,100 --> 00:25:56,100
to get that

441
00:25:56,100 --> 00:25:58,401
>> good morning commissioners, chris

442
00:26:09,100 --> 00:26:12,100
schmidt with planning services the

443
00:26:13,100 --> 00:26:15,100
project. Forward today is a conditional

444
00:26:15,100 --> 00:26:17,100
use permit modification for the

445
00:26:17,100 --> 00:26:19,100
winchester residential development in

446
00:26:19,100 --> 00:26:22,601
meadow vista. The project site involves

447
00:26:24,100 --> 00:26:28,100
one lot, one of the cottage lots and

448
00:26:28,100 --> 00:26:29,100
winchester. The zoning is residential

449
00:26:29,100 --> 00:26:32,100
agriculture minimum building site of

450
00:26:33,100 --> 00:26:35,100
five-acre it has a plan development

451
00:26:35,100 --> 00:26:38,601
combining district of .39 units to acre.

452
00:26:39,100 --> 00:26:43,100
located at the corner of legends drive

453
00:26:43,100 --> 00:26:44,100
and lodge view drive, across the street

454
00:26:44,100 --> 00:26:47,100
from the community clubhouse and pool.

455
00:26:47,100 --> 00:26:51,801
a couple photos of the site, a highly

456
00:26:52,100 --> 00:26:55,601
constrained property if you have driven

457
00:26:56,100 --> 00:26:59,100
through winchester the lots are highly

458
00:26:59,100 --> 00:27:00,100
constrained with outcroppings slopes

459
00:27:00,100 --> 00:27:03,100
cottage lots very small buildable areas.

460
00:27:03,100 --> 00:27:04,100
on the slot in particular is a

461
00:27:04,100 --> 00:27:07,601
significant boulder in the middle of

462
00:27:10,100 --> 00:27:14,801
the lot. You can see there are cottage

463
00:27:15,100 --> 00:27:16,100
lots developed adjacent to this this is

464
00:27:16,100 --> 00:27:18,100
one of the last lots that has not been

465
00:27:18,100 --> 00:27:22,100
built on in the background is the golf

466
00:27:22,100 --> 00:27:25,100
course clubhouse. A couple more

467
00:27:26,100 --> 00:27:27,100
pictures of the rock. The back of the

468
00:27:27,100 --> 00:27:31,100
property is a highly sloped, so the

469
00:27:31,100 --> 00:27:32,100
house will be built closer to the

470
00:27:32,100 --> 00:27:36,801
street like most of the lots here. The

471
00:27:40,100 --> 00:27:41,100
applicant is a potential buyer of the

472
00:27:41,100 --> 00:27:42,100
property proposing a single-story 1758

473
00:27:42,100 --> 00:27:45,100
square-foot house designed to work

474
00:27:45,100 --> 00:27:49,100
around the boulder instead of trying to

475
00:27:49,100 --> 00:27:52,601
remove it. A little history about

476
00:27:55,100 --> 00:27:58,601
winchester, the project was approved in

477
00:27:59,100 --> 00:28:01,100
1993 for 409 units including 385

478
00:28:03,100 --> 00:28:05,100
single-family lots. And 24 cluster home

479
00:28:05,100 --> 00:28:08,601
lots closest to the clubhouse. These

480
00:28:10,100 --> 00:28:13,100
are smaller .1 acre to quarter acre

481
00:28:13,100 --> 00:28:16,100
smaller homes. There's an 18 hole golf

482
00:28:16,100 --> 00:28:19,100
course, the clubhouse swim and tennis

483
00:28:19,100 --> 00:28:21,100
club and eight acre public park and 10

484
00:28:21,100 --> 00:28:24,100
miles of trail throughout the property.

485
00:28:24,100 --> 00:28:28,100
the subject site is at the center of

486
00:28:28,100 --> 00:28:31,601
the community. When the project was

487
00:28:32,100 --> 00:28:36,201
approved, there was an open space lot

488
00:28:38,100 --> 00:28:39,100
called lot x set aside because it was

489
00:28:39,100 --> 00:28:41,100
deemed done buildable on the final map

490
00:28:41,100 --> 00:28:45,201
lot x is labeled open space. In 2002

491
00:28:51,100 --> 00:28:52,100
there were a bunch of boundary line

492
00:28:52,100 --> 00:28:55,100
adjustments on cottage lots. For

493
00:28:56,100 --> 00:28:59,100
unknown reason, lot 35 which was a

494
00:28:59,100 --> 00:29:03,100
residential lot x south of it there was

495
00:29:03,100 --> 00:29:07,201
an adjustment on these lots, so the

496
00:29:08,100 --> 00:29:11,100
open space lot grew by 1800 square

497
00:29:11,100 --> 00:29:14,100
feet. Strangely enough the rock

498
00:29:14,100 --> 00:29:16,100
outcropping stayed on lot 35 so no

499
00:29:16,100 --> 00:29:19,601
adjustment to avoid the rock. I'm

500
00:29:20,100 --> 00:29:23,100
unclear why the boundary line

501
00:29:23,100 --> 00:29:27,100
adjustment was done but it was recorded

502
00:29:27,100 --> 00:29:30,601
in 2002. In 2015, the owner of the

503
00:29:32,100 --> 00:29:35,100
common area lot the homeowners

504
00:29:36,100 --> 00:29:39,100
association agreed to sell this to the

505
00:29:39,100 --> 00:29:42,100
golf course owner. The golf course

506
00:29:42,100 --> 00:29:43,100
owner also when they purchased the

507
00:29:43,100 --> 00:29:46,100
property purchased a vacant residential

508
00:29:46,100 --> 00:29:47,100
lot and they were developing and

509
00:29:47,100 --> 00:29:50,100
selling them off to individual buyers.

510
00:29:50,100 --> 00:29:54,201
the original ccr for the project list

511
00:29:57,100 --> 00:29:58,100
lot x as common area and says it was

512
00:29:58,100 --> 00:30:01,100
him buildable property between lot 35

513
00:30:01,100 --> 00:30:04,601
and 36. The hoa members of the

514
00:30:06,100 --> 00:30:09,601
community agreed to sell the property

515
00:30:10,100 --> 00:30:15,100
in a boat, sold lot x to the golf

516
00:30:15,100 --> 00:30:16,100
course developer in 2015. Later removed

517
00:30:16,100 --> 00:30:21,401
any mention of lot x in the ccr were

518
00:30:24,100 --> 00:30:27,601
rewritten in 21. Last year the applicant

519
00:30:34,100 --> 00:30:35,100
applied for a merger between lot x and

520
00:30:35,100 --> 00:30:36,100
lot 35 to create .36 acre lot it was

521
00:30:36,100 --> 00:30:40,201
approved and recorded at the end of

522
00:30:41,100 --> 00:30:45,201
last year. Unbeknownst to us at the

523
00:30:46,100 --> 00:30:49,601
county, discovered by the title company

524
00:30:50,100 --> 00:30:53,601
was language in the transfer document

525
00:30:55,100 --> 00:30:56,100
when the community was developed

526
00:30:56,100 --> 00:30:59,601
between the developer and hoa. It

527
00:31:01,100 --> 00:31:02,100
transferred the common area and

528
00:31:02,100 --> 00:31:06,100
preserve lots to the hoa that had a

529
00:31:06,100 --> 00:31:08,100
clause that said if the property is no

530
00:31:08,100 --> 00:31:11,100
longer needed as protective preserve

531
00:31:13,100 --> 00:31:17,201
open space, a document must be recorded

532
00:31:23,100 --> 00:31:24,100
and it must be signed by the county

533
00:31:24,100 --> 00:31:25,100
executive officer or chairman of

534
00:31:25,100 --> 00:31:26,100
supervisors which confirms placer

535
00:31:26,100 --> 00:31:27,100
county no longer imposes restrictions

536
00:31:27,100 --> 00:31:28,100
on the property restricted as a

537
00:31:28,100 --> 00:31:29,100
protective preserve. That's what we are

538
00:31:29,100 --> 00:31:32,100
here to do today. We did look to see if

539
00:31:32,100 --> 00:31:35,100
this common area lot was part of the

540
00:31:35,100 --> 00:31:37,100
required open space for the residential

541
00:31:37,100 --> 00:31:40,100
development and winchester when this

542
00:31:40,100 --> 00:31:43,601
was approved, our rules were less

543
00:31:44,100 --> 00:31:45,100
stringent than today. To do a pd today

544
00:31:45,100 --> 00:31:48,100
at least 20 percent open spaces

545
00:31:48,100 --> 00:31:52,100
required. When this was approved it was

546
00:31:52,100 --> 00:31:54,401
only 12.5 percent. They needed 139

547
00:32:00,100 --> 00:32:01,100
acres of open space,. 335 acres of open

548
00:32:01,100 --> 00:32:04,100
space that does include 228 acres of

549
00:32:04,100 --> 00:32:06,100
golf course property. There's nothing

550
00:32:06,100 --> 00:32:09,100
in the conditions of approval that

551
00:32:09,100 --> 00:32:13,100
mention lot x. It is not listed as a

552
00:32:13,100 --> 00:32:16,100
preserve system. Even if it was

553
00:32:16,100 --> 00:32:17,100
included in the 335 acres they are well

554
00:32:17,100 --> 00:32:21,100
above the open space required for the

555
00:32:21,100 --> 00:32:24,601
project. There is nothing recorded on

556
00:32:25,100 --> 00:32:28,601
the property that says this is

557
00:32:29,100 --> 00:32:30,100
restricted open space. There is no

558
00:32:30,100 --> 00:32:33,100
restriction listed in the conditions of

559
00:32:33,100 --> 00:32:37,201
approval. With that I'm here before you

560
00:32:41,100 --> 00:32:42,100
to ask you to approve the subdivision

561
00:32:42,100 --> 00:32:43,100
modification subject to modify

562
00:32:43,100 --> 00:32:44,100
conditions of approval attachment of

563
00:32:44,100 --> 00:32:45,100
the staff report findings in the staff

564
00:32:45,100 --> 00:32:48,100
report approved the conditional use

565
00:32:58,100 --> 00:32:59,100
permit modification for the winchester

566
00:32:59,100 --> 00:33:00,100
planned unit development subject to

567
00:33:00,100 --> 00:33:01,100
modify conditions lot x is no longer

568
00:33:01,100 --> 00:33:02,100
restricted as open space subject to the

569
00:33:02,100 --> 00:33:03,100
findings and recommend the county

570
00:33:03,100 --> 00:33:04,100
executive officer sign a letter of

571
00:33:04,100 --> 00:33:05,100
determination to document

572
00:33:05,100 --> 00:33:06,100
abolishment of previous space

573
00:33:06,100 --> 00:33:07,100
restrictions on lot x. I have one

574
00:33:07,100 --> 00:33:10,601
change similar to the previous item

575
00:33:11,100 --> 00:33:13,100
condition one on the first page

576
00:33:13,100 --> 00:33:15,401
mentions the march 28 22 planning

577
00:33:18,100 --> 00:33:19,100
commission date, this was scheduled to

578
00:33:19,100 --> 00:33:23,100
go the last meeting but we did have

579
00:33:23,100 --> 00:33:26,100
scheduling problems so we did have to

580
00:33:26,100 --> 00:33:29,100
delay that to today's date. So that

581
00:33:29,100 --> 00:33:30,100
needs to be updated to april 14

582
00:33:30,100 --> 00:33:33,100
>> happy to answer any questions

583
00:33:37,100 --> 00:33:39,100
>> thank you chris. Commissioners,

584
00:33:39,100 --> 00:33:40,100
questions for staff?

585
00:33:40,100 --> 00:33:44,201
>> good morning my name is les carter,

586
00:33:47,100 --> 00:33:50,100
I hope the commission can hear me well.

587
00:33:50,100 --> 00:33:54,801
I don't have anything to add. I believe

588
00:33:57,100 --> 00:33:58,100
mr. Schmidt has covered as addressed

589
00:33:58,100 --> 00:34:01,601
all of the specific findings or

590
00:34:05,100 --> 00:34:07,100
considerations. I do appreciate the

591
00:34:07,100 --> 00:34:09,401
commissions consideration for approval

592
00:34:10,100 --> 00:34:15,100
of the item but I'm here to answer any

593
00:34:15,100 --> 00:34:16,100
specific questions the commission may

594
00:34:16,100 --> 00:34:18,100
have

595
00:34:18,100 --> 00:34:19,100
>> thank you lester. Do you have any

596
00:34:19,100 --> 00:34:22,100
questions for the applicant? Standby,

597
00:34:25,100 --> 00:34:26,100
we may have some. We will go ahead and

598
00:34:26,100 --> 00:34:29,100
open up the public comment. Is there

599
00:34:29,100 --> 00:34:33,100
anyone here in person to speak on the

600
00:34:33,100 --> 00:34:36,601
item? Anyone online? We will close

601
00:34:45,100 --> 00:34:47,100
public comment and bring it back to the

602
00:34:47,100 --> 00:34:49,401
commissioners for clarification for

603
00:34:51,100 --> 00:34:52,100
staff applicant for discussion?

604
00:34:52,100 --> 00:34:53,100
>> has there been any feedback from

605
00:34:53,100 --> 00:34:55,100
neighbors on either side of the lot

606
00:34:55,100 --> 00:34:58,601
that they don't want this done?

607
00:35:01,100 --> 00:35:05,100
>> no we have not got emails or calls

608
00:35:05,100 --> 00:35:07,100
on the project. I believe the applicant

609
00:35:07,100 --> 00:35:08,100
has talked to the immediate neighbors

610
00:35:08,100 --> 00:35:12,801
and no hesitation at this time. The hoa

611
00:35:14,100 --> 00:35:15,100
has not commented. There has been

612
00:35:15,100 --> 00:35:16,100
nothing

613
00:35:16,100 --> 00:35:17,100
>> so this whole lot is residential?

614
00:35:17,100 --> 00:35:21,801
>> it's in the yellow area that will be

615
00:35:24,100 --> 00:35:28,201
buildable. The balance of the site is

616
00:35:29,100 --> 00:35:32,100
steeply sloped in the rear

617
00:35:32,100 --> 00:35:33,100
>> that's all I have

618
00:35:33,100 --> 00:35:35,401
>> ready for a motion

619
00:35:46,100 --> 00:35:47,100
>> move to approve the subdivision

620
00:35:47,100 --> 00:35:49,100
modification subject to the modified

621
00:35:49,100 --> 00:35:50,100
conditions of approval and findings in

622
00:35:50,100 --> 00:35:52,100
the staff report

623
00:35:52,100 --> 00:35:54,100
>> second

624
00:35:54,100 --> 00:35:55,100
>> roll call vote

625
00:35:55,100 --> 00:35:58,601
>> first from mr. Hauge, second from

626
00:36:04,100 --> 00:36:08,201
mr. Demattei. Mr. Hauge yes mr. Johnson

627
00:36:11,100 --> 00:36:15,201
yes mr. Woodward yes mr. Demattei yes

628
00:36:19,100 --> 00:36:23,201
mr. Herzog yes. Move to approve the

629
00:36:24,100 --> 00:36:25,100
conditional use permit modification for

630
00:36:25,100 --> 00:36:26,100
winchester planned development subject

631
00:36:26,100 --> 00:36:29,601
to conditions of approval attachment b

632
00:36:33,100 --> 00:36:34,100
as modified today to note lot x is no

633
00:36:34,100 --> 00:36:35,100
longer restricted as open space and

634
00:36:35,100 --> 00:36:36,100
subject to the findings in the staff

635
00:36:36,100 --> 00:36:37,100
report

636
00:36:37,100 --> 00:36:39,100
>> roll call vote

637
00:36:39,100 --> 00:36:42,601
>> first from mr. Hauge, second from

638
00:36:44,100 --> 00:36:47,601
mr. Demattei. Mr. Hauge yes, mr.

639
00:36:49,100 --> 00:36:52,601
johnson yes mr. Woodward yes mr.

640
00:36:55,100 --> 00:36:56,100
demattei yes mr. Herzog yes

641
00:36:56,100 --> 00:36:58,401
>> finally recommend the county

642
00:37:06,100 --> 00:37:07,100
executive officer sign a letter of

643
00:37:07,100 --> 00:37:08,100
determination to document abolishment

644
00:37:08,100 --> 00:37:09,100
of previous open space restrictions on

645
00:37:09,100 --> 00:37:10,100
lot x

646
00:37:10,100 --> 00:37:11,100
>> roll call vote

647
00:37:11,100 --> 00:37:15,201
>> first from mr. Hauge second from mr.

648
00:37:17,100 --> 00:37:21,100
demattei. Mr. Hauge yes mr. Johnson yes

649
00:37:21,100 --> 00:37:25,201
mr. Woodward yes mr. Demattei yes mr.

650
00:37:26,100 --> 00:37:27,100
herzog yes

651
00:37:27,100 --> 00:37:30,100
>> we will move on to the second timed

652
00:37:30,100 --> 00:37:33,100
item sterling point estate subdivision

653
00:37:35,100 --> 00:37:38,601
map modification. Members of the public

654
00:37:39,100 --> 00:37:40,100
may raise their hands press star nine

655
00:37:40,100 --> 00:37:41,100
to queue up for public comment on the

656
00:37:41,100 --> 00:37:45,201
item which will not begin until the

657
00:37:46,100 --> 00:37:48,401
project presentation is complete.

658
00:37:52,100 --> 00:37:53,100
kally, senior planner will present on

659
00:37:53,100 --> 00:37:54,100
the item

660
00:37:54,100 --> 00:37:55,100
>> good morning commissioners kally

661
00:37:55,100 --> 00:37:56,100
kedinger cecil senior planner of the

662
00:37:56,100 --> 00:37:57,100
planning services division. The item

663
00:37:57,100 --> 00:37:59,100
this morning as a request to modify the

664
00:37:59,100 --> 00:38:02,601
subdivision map for the sterling point

665
00:38:04,100 --> 00:38:07,100
homeowner association for lot 19 to

666
00:38:07,100 --> 00:38:09,401
eliminate open space riparian

667
00:38:11,100 --> 00:38:12,100
protection easement redesignate that

668
00:38:12,100 --> 00:38:15,601
drainage easement and modify the size.

669
00:38:20,100 --> 00:38:21,100
project site is in the sterling point

670
00:38:21,100 --> 00:38:22,100
estate subdivision located east of

671
00:38:22,100 --> 00:38:23,100
folsom lake and west of auburn fulsome

672
00:38:23,100 --> 00:38:27,100
road. Here we have the sterling estate

673
00:38:27,100 --> 00:38:28,100
final map in aerial. The lot in

674
00:38:28,100 --> 00:38:32,201
question is shown here in red. The

675
00:38:44,100 --> 00:38:45,100
sterling points estate subdivision was

676
00:38:45,100 --> 00:38:46,100
approved by the board of supervisors in

677
00:38:46,100 --> 00:38:47,100
1990 includes 60 lots on 157 acres 14

678
00:38:47,100 --> 00:38:48,100
of the lots created with open space

679
00:38:48,100 --> 00:38:49,100
protection easements and the final map

680
00:38:49,100 --> 00:38:52,100
includes a note. I will read that so

681
00:38:52,100 --> 00:38:54,401
everyone understands the restrictions.

682
00:39:00,100 --> 00:39:01,100
the final map states and easement for

683
00:39:01,100 --> 00:39:02,100
the protection of folsom lake water

684
00:39:02,100 --> 00:39:03,100
quality and native oak woodlands across

685
00:39:03,100 --> 00:39:04,100
the areas designated here on as scenic

686
00:39:04,100 --> 00:39:07,601
setback and natural area easements and

687
00:39:22,100 --> 00:39:23,100
an easement for the protection of

688
00:39:23,100 --> 00:39:24,100
wetlands and endangered elderberry

689
00:39:24,100 --> 00:39:25,100
beetle habitat across the areas

690
00:39:25,100 --> 00:39:26,100
designated here on open space riparian

691
00:39:26,100 --> 00:39:27,100
easements notification to all future

692
00:39:27,100 --> 00:39:28,100
lot owners no homeowner or tenant shall

693
00:39:28,100 --> 00:39:29,100
place fill materials lawn clippings oil

694
00:39:29,100 --> 00:39:30,100
chemical or trash when the open space

695
00:39:30,100 --> 00:39:31,100
and riparian easement in scenic setback

696
00:39:31,100 --> 00:39:32,100
and natural area easements nor shall

697
00:39:32,100 --> 00:39:33,100
grading vegetation removal or

698
00:39:33,100 --> 00:39:35,401
alteration be permitted including

699
00:39:36,100 --> 00:39:38,100
domestic landscaping and fencing

700
00:39:38,100 --> 00:39:39,100
accepting fencing or other activities

701
00:39:39,100 --> 00:39:42,100
approved elsewhere in the conditions of

702
00:39:42,100 --> 00:39:43,100
approval a provision for the

703
00:39:43,100 --> 00:39:46,601
enforcement of the restriction by the

704
00:39:47,100 --> 00:39:50,601
hoa shall be provided. Trending or

705
00:39:56,100 --> 00:39:57,100
other maintenance are allowed for the

706
00:39:57,100 --> 00:39:58,100
purpose of fire prevention elimination

707
00:39:58,100 --> 00:39:59,100
of deceased growth for sending

708
00:39:59,100 --> 00:40:00,100
necessary for the maintenance of

709
00:40:00,100 --> 00:40:01,100
natural vegetation only with the

710
00:40:01,100 --> 00:40:04,100
written consent of the drc. The drc is

711
00:40:04,100 --> 00:40:07,100
the development review committee. Shown

712
00:40:12,100 --> 00:40:13,100
here is a selection of sterling points

713
00:40:13,100 --> 00:40:14,100
final map shown in red is the open

714
00:40:14,100 --> 00:40:17,100
space riparian easement in question.

715
00:40:22,100 --> 00:40:23,100
the easement affects three lots

716
00:40:23,100 --> 00:40:24,100
including 1819 and 21 the majority of

717
00:40:24,100 --> 00:40:28,801
the open space lot is on lot 19. The

718
00:40:30,100 --> 00:40:34,100
1.4 acre site at 9700 rim rock circle in

719
00:40:34,100 --> 00:40:37,100
loomis, zoned out agriculture with

720
00:40:39,100 --> 00:40:40,100
minimum building site of 4.6 acres and

721
00:40:40,100 --> 00:40:42,401
planned development of .44 dwelling

722
00:40:43,100 --> 00:40:44,100
units per acre. It is developed with

723
00:40:44,100 --> 00:40:46,401
single-family residence driveway and

724
00:40:47,100 --> 00:40:50,100
landscaping. The property owners are

725
00:40:56,100 --> 00:40:57,100
requesting approval of a map

726
00:40:57,100 --> 00:40:58,100
modification to change the designation

727
00:40:58,100 --> 00:40:59,100
of the easement from open space and

728
00:40:59,100 --> 00:41:00,100
riparian protection to a drainage

729
00:41:00,100 --> 00:41:01,100
easement for the portion of the

730
00:41:01,100 --> 00:41:02,100
easement that affects their property.

731
00:41:02,100 --> 00:41:06,100
they are proposing to modify the width

732
00:41:06,100 --> 00:41:07,100
of the easement so will be reduced from

733
00:41:07,100 --> 00:41:11,100
75 feet on their lot to 10 feet. The

734
00:41:11,100 --> 00:41:12,100
portions of the easements on the

735
00:41:12,100 --> 00:41:15,100
adjacent parcels will not be modified.

736
00:41:15,100 --> 00:41:19,201
for some background on this project, in

737
00:41:21,100 --> 00:41:23,100
april of last year the county received

738
00:41:23,100 --> 00:41:26,100
a code complaint violation for

739
00:41:27,100 --> 00:41:28,100
unpermitted grading activities. The

740
00:41:28,100 --> 00:41:29,100
complaint noted the area had been

741
00:41:29,100 --> 00:41:32,601
widened filled with weed barrier fabric

742
00:41:36,100 --> 00:41:37,100
and lined with landscape rock raised

743
00:41:37,100 --> 00:41:38,100
planter beds and concrete walkway

744
00:41:38,100 --> 00:41:41,100
constructed in easement area. This

745
00:41:42,100 --> 00:41:45,601
photo shows the disturbance., in april

746
00:41:46,100 --> 00:41:49,100
21 the county sent a notice of

747
00:41:49,100 --> 00:41:52,100
violation to property owners notifying

748
00:41:54,100 --> 00:41:55,100
them a grading permit would've been

749
00:41:55,100 --> 00:41:56,100
required and work within the easement

750
00:41:56,100 --> 00:41:58,100
continued after the notice was

751
00:41:58,100 --> 00:41:59,100
received. On may 4 of last year a

752
00:41:59,100 --> 00:42:03,100
second notice of violation was sent and

753
00:42:03,100 --> 00:42:04,100
requested a grading permit submitted to

754
00:42:04,100 --> 00:42:07,601
the county by may 21. On august 11

755
00:42:11,100 --> 00:42:12,100
staff met with the property owners to

756
00:42:12,100 --> 00:42:14,100
discuss a resolution to the code

757
00:42:14,100 --> 00:42:17,100
enforcement complaint. There were two

758
00:42:21,100 --> 00:42:22,100
potential resolutions including

759
00:42:22,100 --> 00:42:23,100
restoring the site to pre-disturbed

760
00:42:23,100 --> 00:42:24,100
conditions for submitting an

761
00:42:24,100 --> 00:42:25,100
application and supporting information

762
00:42:25,100 --> 00:42:26,100
to request a modification to the map.

763
00:42:26,100 --> 00:42:29,601
on october 6 an application for map

764
00:42:30,100 --> 00:42:33,100
modification was submitted.. There are

765
00:42:41,100 --> 00:42:42,100
two other lots within the subdivision

766
00:42:42,100 --> 00:42:43,100
that have approved modifications to the

767
00:42:43,100 --> 00:42:44,100
easement area including lot 17 and 56

768
00:42:44,100 --> 00:42:45,100
here we have lot 17 they submitted a

769
00:42:45,100 --> 00:42:48,601
request to modify the easement in 2002,

770
00:42:53,100 --> 00:42:54,100
a biological assessment determine the

771
00:42:54,100 --> 00:42:55,100
wetland was no longer functioning as a

772
00:42:55,100 --> 00:42:57,100
wetland but did function as a drainage

773
00:42:57,100 --> 00:42:58,100
feature. They were required to dedicate

774
00:42:58,100 --> 00:43:01,601
a 10 foot easement to the homeowner

775
00:43:02,100 --> 00:43:04,401
association. The modification was

776
00:43:06,100 --> 00:43:07,100
approved july 25, 2022. They pulled a

777
00:43:07,100 --> 00:43:10,100
building permit november 24 for the

778
00:43:10,100 --> 00:43:13,100
pool after the modification have been

779
00:43:13,100 --> 00:43:17,201
approved. We also have lot 56. Here we

780
00:43:18,100 --> 00:43:22,201
have the easement area. A biological a

781
00:43:23,100 --> 00:43:25,100
sub submitted determine the easement

782
00:43:25,100 --> 00:43:26,100
area no longer supported wetlands but

783
00:43:26,100 --> 00:43:28,100
functioned as a drainage easement. It

784
00:43:28,100 --> 00:43:30,401
was approved december 11 2003 and

785
00:43:35,100 --> 00:43:36,100
dedicated to the county. Grading permit

786
00:43:36,100 --> 00:43:39,100
issued on august 25 2004. What these

787
00:43:45,100 --> 00:43:46,100
property owners did after the

788
00:43:46,100 --> 00:43:48,100
modification is some grading and

789
00:43:48,100 --> 00:43:49,100
extensive landscaping. The tree cover

790
00:43:49,100 --> 00:43:54,100
hides it but they did do some work. Lot

791
00:43:54,100 --> 00:43:57,601
19 is proposing a modification in order

792
00:43:59,100 --> 00:44:02,100
to redesignate the property. In support

793
00:44:02,100 --> 00:44:05,100
of that, the applicant provided a

794
00:44:05,100 --> 00:44:07,401
biological resource assessment channel

795
00:44:09,100 --> 00:44:10,100
analysis and grading plans. The

796
00:44:10,100 --> 00:44:12,100
biological report determine the wetland

797
00:44:12,100 --> 00:44:16,201
area was 0.09 acres and was expanded to

798
00:44:20,100 --> 00:44:23,601
0.24 acres. The no there was no

799
00:44:26,100 --> 00:44:27,100
understory vegetation or special

800
00:44:27,100 --> 00:44:28,100
species and there was no suitable

801
00:44:28,100 --> 00:44:29,100
habitat on site for special status

802
00:44:29,100 --> 00:44:31,100
species the project description

803
00:44:31,100 --> 00:44:34,100
submitted with the request because

804
00:44:34,100 --> 00:44:38,100
there is no habitat or any special

805
00:44:38,100 --> 00:44:40,100
status species, the area is no longer

806
00:44:40,100 --> 00:44:43,100
functioning as a wetland or providing

807
00:44:43,100 --> 00:44:45,100
biological benefit and therefore should

808
00:44:45,100 --> 00:44:49,100
be changed to a drainage easement msi

809
00:44:49,100 --> 00:44:52,601
should be reduced. A channel analysis

810
00:44:57,100 --> 00:44:58,100
prepared for the project determine the

811
00:44:58,100 --> 00:44:59,100
existing channel would need to be

812
00:44:59,100 --> 00:45:00,100
widened to six feet and excavated to

813
00:45:00,100 --> 00:45:03,100
two feet to convey floats. Before there

814
00:45:03,100 --> 00:45:04,100
was disturbance, the storm water

815
00:45:04,100 --> 00:45:05,100
entered at the southeast corner and

816
00:45:05,100 --> 00:45:09,201
sheet flowed across the site. The size

817
00:45:11,100 --> 00:45:12,100
of the easement and vegetation allowed

818
00:45:12,100 --> 00:45:13,100
natural filtration of storm water. Here

819
00:45:13,100 --> 00:45:18,401
we have photos of the site. This is a

820
00:45:21,100 --> 00:45:22,100
pre-disturbance and post disturbance.

821
00:45:22,100 --> 00:45:23,100
you can tell it is the same location

822
00:45:23,100 --> 00:45:26,100
because we have the solar panels here.

823
00:45:26,100 --> 00:45:29,100
there was blackberry bushes and

824
00:45:29,100 --> 00:45:33,201
cattails. We can see the area slopes.

825
00:45:34,100 --> 00:45:39,100
this area is lower than all of the land

826
00:45:39,100 --> 00:45:42,100
surrounding it. These photos are closer

827
00:45:42,100 --> 00:45:45,100
down the easement. This is forest drive

828
00:45:45,100 --> 00:45:49,100
here. Lake forest drive here. We have

829
00:45:49,100 --> 00:45:53,100
the same tree and we know it's the same

830
00:45:53,100 --> 00:45:56,100
location we have cattails that have

831
00:45:56,100 --> 00:45:57,100
been removed. The landscaping has been

832
00:45:57,100 --> 00:46:00,100
installed within the easement area.

833
00:46:02,100 --> 00:46:04,100
staff considered all of the information

834
00:46:04,100 --> 00:46:07,601
that was provided and determined the

835
00:46:08,100 --> 00:46:11,100
information provided did not support

836
00:46:12,100 --> 00:46:15,100
the request. Staff is recommending

837
00:46:16,100 --> 00:46:18,100
denial of modification. The first

838
00:46:18,100 --> 00:46:19,100
reason is elimination of resources is

839
00:46:19,100 --> 00:46:21,100
not justification for removal of

840
00:46:21,100 --> 00:46:22,100
protection. The easement limitations

841
00:46:22,100 --> 00:46:26,100
noted on the final map the development

842
00:46:26,100 --> 00:46:27,100
notebook for lot 19 within the

843
00:46:27,100 --> 00:46:30,601
conditions of approval and ccr. The

844
00:46:32,100 --> 00:46:33,100
property owners continue ground

845
00:46:33,100 --> 00:46:36,601
disturbance after receiving a notice of

846
00:46:37,100 --> 00:46:40,100
violation. The disturbance to the

847
00:46:47,100 --> 00:46:48,100
easement without the necessary permits

848
00:46:48,100 --> 00:46:49,100
is inconsistent with the placer county

849
00:46:49,100 --> 00:46:50,100
general plan the horseshoe bar penryn

850
00:46:50,100 --> 00:46:51,100
community plan the zoning ordinance and

851
00:46:51,100 --> 00:46:52,100
the grading ordinance. Where

852
00:46:52,100 --> 00:46:53,100
modifications have been authorized

853
00:46:53,100 --> 00:46:56,601
approval was sought prior to ground

854
00:46:57,100 --> 00:46:58,100
disturbance. If there are properties

855
00:46:58,100 --> 00:46:59,100
within the subdivision that have

856
00:46:59,100 --> 00:47:02,100
changed their drainage without permits,

857
00:47:03,100 --> 00:47:07,100
they may be expected to go through a

858
00:47:07,100 --> 00:47:10,100
similar process. Staff recommends the

859
00:47:12,100 --> 00:47:13,100
commission denied the modification

860
00:47:13,100 --> 00:47:16,100
request as supported by the findings in

861
00:47:16,100 --> 00:47:19,601
the staff report. I'm available for

862
00:47:24,100 --> 00:47:25,100
questions and before I conclude my

863
00:47:25,100 --> 00:47:26,100
presentation I want to know we received

864
00:47:26,100 --> 00:47:27,100
one comment letter from the property

865
00:47:27,100 --> 00:47:28,100
owner to the south in opposition to the

866
00:47:28,100 --> 00:47:29,100
map modification request. You should

867
00:47:29,100 --> 00:47:31,100
have received that letter prior to

868
00:47:31,100 --> 00:47:32,100
today's hearing. I'm available for

869
00:47:32,100 --> 00:47:33,100
questions

870
00:47:33,100 --> 00:47:36,100
>> thank you kally. We will open to

871
00:47:36,100 --> 00:47:37,100
questions from commissioners

872
00:47:37,100 --> 00:47:40,601
>> the wetland area expanded how did

873
00:47:43,100 --> 00:47:47,201
that happen? What was the analysis of

874
00:47:48,100 --> 00:47:49,100
that?

875
00:47:49,100 --> 00:47:52,100
>> that happened when the grading

876
00:47:52,100 --> 00:47:53,100
occurred to the channel. I will go back

877
00:47:53,100 --> 00:47:57,801
to one of the slides. The open space

878
00:47:59,100 --> 00:48:02,100
riparian protection area encompasses a

879
00:48:02,100 --> 00:48:05,100
large area. Within that, there is a

880
00:48:05,100 --> 00:48:07,100
channel. When that was disturbed, that

881
00:48:07,100 --> 00:48:10,100
widened it a little bit.

882
00:48:10,100 --> 00:48:11,100
>> that's helpful thank you

883
00:48:11,100 --> 00:48:13,401
>> was this area fenced?

884
00:48:18,100 --> 00:48:19,100
>> no

885
00:48:19,100 --> 00:48:21,401
>> it is now though?

886
00:48:22,100 --> 00:48:26,201
>> yes there is fencing there now. It's

887
00:48:27,100 --> 00:48:30,100
around the property boundaries there

888
00:48:31,100 --> 00:48:35,201
was a conditional of approval from the

889
00:48:39,100 --> 00:48:40,100
subdivision that fencing was supposed

890
00:48:40,100 --> 00:48:41,100
to be placed around the protection

891
00:48:41,100 --> 00:48:42,100
easements it's not clear that fencing

892
00:48:42,100 --> 00:48:43,100
was in place it's not in any of the

893
00:48:43,100 --> 00:48:44,100
photos I have seen of the site so I

894
00:48:44,100 --> 00:48:47,100
don't know if the cable fencing was

895
00:48:47,100 --> 00:48:48,100
ever installed around the wetland area

896
00:48:48,100 --> 00:48:50,100
but there is perimeter fencing

897
00:48:50,100 --> 00:48:53,100
>> the photograph is confusing because

898
00:48:54,100 --> 00:48:56,100
the fencing crosses drainage and it's

899
00:48:56,100 --> 00:49:00,100
on the side so that gives the

900
00:49:00,100 --> 00:49:01,100
impression...

901
00:49:01,100 --> 00:49:03,401
>> you mean this one?

902
00:49:06,100 --> 00:49:07,100
>> dispensing was installed without

903
00:49:07,100 --> 00:49:11,801
written consent of the drc as noted in

904
00:49:13,100 --> 00:49:15,100
the final map note. Any landscaping or

905
00:49:15,100 --> 00:49:19,201
fencing is not supposed to occur there.

906
00:49:21,100 --> 00:49:22,100
the fence was installed without benefit

907
00:49:22,100 --> 00:49:23,100
of county purview

908
00:49:23,100 --> 00:49:24,100
>> okay thank you

909
00:49:24,100 --> 00:49:26,100
>> commissioner woodward

910
00:49:26,100 --> 00:49:31,401
>> can you go to 28?I may not have a

911
00:49:34,100 --> 00:49:38,100
question, I want to look at the slide

912
00:49:38,100 --> 00:49:41,601
one more time. The biological resource

913
00:49:45,100 --> 00:49:48,601
assessment is a product of the

914
00:49:49,100 --> 00:49:51,100
applicant in other words they went

915
00:49:51,100 --> 00:49:53,100
under contract to get this assessment

916
00:49:53,100 --> 00:49:55,100
done?

917
00:49:57,100 --> 00:49:58,100
>> that's correct that is consistent

918
00:49:58,100 --> 00:50:02,100
with how the other two provided their

919
00:50:02,100 --> 00:50:03,100
assessments

920
00:50:03,100 --> 00:50:06,601
>> so, the county differs with the

921
00:50:11,100 --> 00:50:12,100
project description alleges because

922
00:50:12,100 --> 00:50:15,100
there's no habitat designation should

923
00:50:15,100 --> 00:50:18,100
be changed. You differ from that

924
00:50:18,100 --> 00:50:21,601
principally because the reason there is

925
00:50:22,100 --> 00:50:24,100
no wetland habitat is that the site has

926
00:50:24,100 --> 00:50:26,100
been disturbed eliminating the wetland

927
00:50:26,100 --> 00:50:28,100
habitat?

928
00:50:28,100 --> 00:50:29,100
>> that's correct

929
00:50:29,100 --> 00:50:31,100
>> okay thank you

930
00:50:32,100 --> 00:50:36,100
>> the packet we got the pictures of

931
00:50:36,100 --> 00:50:40,100
the backhoe is that in the drainage

932
00:50:40,100 --> 00:50:41,100
easement area?

933
00:50:41,100 --> 00:50:44,100
>> I believe that is within the

934
00:50:44,100 --> 00:50:47,601
drainage easement area that photo was

935
00:50:49,100 --> 00:50:51,100
provided by public comment. I'm pretty

936
00:50:51,100 --> 00:50:52,100
sure it's within the easement area

937
00:50:52,100 --> 00:50:53,100
>> and that fence was put up by the

938
00:50:53,100 --> 00:50:55,100
property owner and then all this work

939
00:50:55,100 --> 00:50:59,801
was done in an area that was not

940
00:51:02,100 --> 00:51:03,100
supposed to happen?

941
00:51:03,100 --> 00:51:04,100
>> correct

942
00:51:04,100 --> 00:51:08,201
>> okay thank you kally. We will open

943
00:51:10,100 --> 00:51:15,100
it up to chris cox with e green legal

944
00:51:15,100 --> 00:51:19,201
on behalf of the property owner scott

945
00:51:22,100 --> 00:51:24,100
and belinda zhang

946
00:51:24,100 --> 00:51:28,100
>> if I could interrupt I know the

947
00:51:28,100 --> 00:51:31,100
applicant has a powerpoint. Are you

948
00:51:31,100 --> 00:51:32,100
going to rely on that powerpoint

949
00:51:32,100 --> 00:51:33,100
because of so we need to take a five

950
00:51:33,100 --> 00:51:37,801
minute recess so we can get it uploaded.

951
00:51:39,100 --> 00:51:40,100
I will leave that up to the chairman

952
00:51:40,100 --> 00:51:44,100
whether you want to take a recess now

953
00:51:44,100 --> 00:51:45,100
while we do that?

954
00:51:45,100 --> 00:51:47,100
>> yes we will take a recess. We will

955
00:51:47,100 --> 00:51:48,100
take a five minute recess.

956
00:51:48,100 --> 00:51:52,201
>> we are back in session. Chris, go

957
00:55:46,100 --> 00:55:49,100
ahead and continue with the

958
00:55:52,100 --> 00:55:53,100
presentation.

959
00:55:53,100 --> 00:55:57,201
>> I am representing mr. And mrs. Zhang.

960
00:56:00,100 --> 00:56:01,100
you just heard about the issues on

961
00:56:01,100 --> 00:56:03,100
their property and we are not refuting

962
00:56:03,100 --> 00:56:07,801
that. But we would like to go through

963
00:56:08,100 --> 00:56:09,100
some more clarity on the history of the

964
00:56:09,100 --> 00:56:11,100
property from a content perspective and

965
00:56:11,100 --> 00:56:14,601
get to the potential remedies that

966
00:56:15,100 --> 00:56:19,201
could be at hand here. Similarly to

967
00:56:22,100 --> 00:56:25,100
what the planner just mentioned, the

968
00:56:25,100 --> 00:56:28,601
subdivision was built in the 1990s.

969
00:56:29,100 --> 00:56:32,100
retraced historical aerial photos to

970
00:56:33,100 --> 00:56:34,100
that time period to show what the

971
00:56:34,100 --> 00:56:36,100
property look like at that point in

972
00:56:36,100 --> 00:56:39,100
time. This is 2007 after some

973
00:56:40,100 --> 00:56:43,100
development. You can see there's

974
00:56:44,100 --> 00:56:48,201
generally a grassy swale that was here.

975
00:56:50,100 --> 00:56:51,100
I'd like to point out the biological

976
00:56:51,100 --> 00:56:54,601
assessment that was brought up earlier

977
00:56:55,100 --> 00:56:58,100
about lot 19, the actual biological

978
00:56:58,100 --> 00:57:02,201
opinion indicated it is unclear why the

979
00:57:03,100 --> 00:57:06,100
open space/riparian easement on lot 17

980
00:57:06,100 --> 00:57:10,100
was established if the intent was to

981
00:57:10,100 --> 00:57:12,100
protect riparian habitat, the site is a

982
00:57:12,100 --> 00:57:14,401
functioning drainage corridor that

983
00:57:16,100 --> 00:57:19,100
carries and dries up too quickly to

984
00:57:19,100 --> 00:57:22,601
support wetland vegetation it was never

985
00:57:23,100 --> 00:57:26,100
a riparian corridor. We found the same

986
00:57:26,100 --> 00:57:29,601
thing on lot 19. We prepared a

987
00:57:30,100 --> 00:57:32,100
biological study, went out and looked

988
00:57:32,100 --> 00:57:33,100
at existing as well as forensic

989
00:57:33,100 --> 00:57:36,100
evidence from topography and vegetation.

990
00:57:37,100 --> 00:57:38,100
there was no evidence of any sort of

991
00:57:38,100 --> 00:57:41,601
elderberry bush on the property. I'd

992
00:57:42,100 --> 00:57:45,100
like to point out in order for an

993
00:57:45,100 --> 00:57:46,100
elderberry bush to be jurisdictional it

994
00:57:46,100 --> 00:57:50,100
has to have one inch stems. The photo

995
00:57:50,100 --> 00:57:51,100
presented in the letter you received

996
00:57:51,100 --> 00:57:55,801
does not have any stems as my biologist

997
00:57:56,100 --> 00:58:01,401
can attest to. You can see in the photos

998
00:58:02,100 --> 00:58:06,100
that what we have deemed was a grassy

999
00:58:06,100 --> 00:58:07,100
swale up through 2011 definitely

1000
00:58:07,100 --> 00:58:11,100
changed over time and was not the zhang

1001
00:58:11,100 --> 00:58:15,201
that changed it it was the surrounding

1002
00:58:16,100 --> 00:58:17,100
development. This is a more current

1003
00:58:17,100 --> 00:58:19,100
photo you can see the houses are

1004
00:58:19,100 --> 00:58:21,100
popping in including the one that filed

1005
00:58:21,100 --> 00:58:25,801
the complaint. We get to a point here

1006
00:58:26,100 --> 00:58:30,801
in 2021, let me go back one, this one

1007
00:58:34,100 --> 00:58:36,100
it's a little faint but you can see how

1008
00:58:36,100 --> 00:58:40,201
the drainage has incised quite a bit.

1009
00:58:41,100 --> 00:58:44,100
>> you have is laser pointer

1010
00:58:45,100 --> 00:58:49,100
>> this here is the drainage and in

1011
00:58:49,100 --> 00:58:52,100
previous slides you can see that this

1012
00:58:52,100 --> 00:58:56,801
was more of a grassy swale. There is

1013
00:58:58,100 --> 00:59:02,801
actual grass and trees but by the time

1014
00:59:04,100 --> 00:59:07,100
you get to 2020, this area was entirely

1015
00:59:07,100 --> 00:59:10,100
incised. The representation of the

1016
00:59:10,100 --> 00:59:14,100
channel is three or four feet deep and

1017
00:59:14,100 --> 00:59:16,100
two feet wide. This is indicative of

1018
00:59:16,100 --> 00:59:18,100
more of a drainage channel that carries

1019
00:59:18,100 --> 00:59:22,201
water flows in periods of storm events

1020
00:59:24,100 --> 00:59:25,100
otherwise is relatively dry with no

1021
00:59:25,100 --> 00:59:28,100
capability of supporting a riparian

1022
00:59:28,100 --> 00:59:32,100
easement. We'd also like to point out

1023
00:59:32,100 --> 00:59:34,100
and I brought a map and passed it out

1024
00:59:34,100 --> 00:59:37,100
that shows the riparian easement

1025
00:59:37,100 --> 00:59:40,100
overlaid onto the current aerial for

1026
00:59:40,100 --> 00:59:43,601
the property. What's interesting is the

1027
00:59:47,100 --> 00:59:48,100
development here is only the latest of

1028
00:59:48,100 --> 00:59:49,100
a series of events that have changed

1029
00:59:49,100 --> 00:59:53,801
the area. The map shows that the water

1030
00:59:56,100 --> 00:59:58,100
coming into the drainage starts

1031
00:59:58,100 --> 01:00:02,201
primarily from up here and is under

1032
01:00:03,100 --> 01:00:06,601
grounded into a catchment and then

1033
01:00:08,100 --> 01:00:09,100
there is a rock lined what looks to be

1034
01:00:09,100 --> 01:00:10,100
a channel but we have confirmed after

1035
01:00:10,100 --> 01:00:13,601
talking to property owners last week

1036
01:00:15,100 --> 01:00:16,100
that this supposedly channel is a bunch

1037
01:00:16,100 --> 01:00:19,100
of rocks on the surface and there's a

1038
01:00:19,100 --> 01:00:20,100
pipe under the ground that conveys

1039
01:00:20,100 --> 01:00:24,100
water all the way down to this point

1040
01:00:24,100 --> 01:00:25,100
here. Additionally, this person did the

1041
01:00:25,100 --> 01:00:29,100
same thing and it forks into there. We

1042
01:00:29,100 --> 01:00:31,100
essentially have an outfall from two

1043
01:00:31,100 --> 01:00:34,100
properties going into the drainage

1044
01:00:34,100 --> 01:00:37,100
channel. Nothing riparian about that.

1045
01:00:39,100 --> 01:00:40,100
additionally on our map, we show the

1046
01:00:40,100 --> 01:00:43,601
property that filed the complaint also

1047
01:00:49,100 --> 01:00:50,100
build a cage structure in the riparian

1048
01:00:50,100 --> 01:00:52,100
area that is in violation of the codes

1049
01:00:52,100 --> 01:00:55,100
mention recently they also have two

1050
01:00:55,100 --> 01:00:58,100
drainage outfalls that are taking

1051
01:00:58,100 --> 01:00:59,100
overland flow from this property and

1052
01:00:59,100 --> 01:01:02,601
conveying it through a drainage outlet

1053
01:01:03,100 --> 01:01:04,100
into the channel. In summary what you

1054
01:01:04,100 --> 01:01:07,100
have is instead of overland sheet flow,

1055
01:01:07,100 --> 01:01:10,601
because of all the other development,

1056
01:01:11,100 --> 01:01:13,100
we now have an incised channel as of

1057
01:01:13,100 --> 01:01:16,601
2020. That's what was modified by the

1058
01:01:20,100 --> 01:01:23,100
zhangs. You mentioned earlier you

1059
01:01:23,100 --> 01:01:24,100
question an increase in the wetland

1060
01:01:24,100 --> 01:01:28,100
area it was because the incised channel

1061
01:01:28,100 --> 01:01:29,100
only one and a half to two feet wide

1062
01:01:29,100 --> 01:01:32,100
was widened out through some grading.

1063
01:01:32,100 --> 01:01:36,201
so surface wise you get more surface.

1064
01:01:38,100 --> 01:01:41,100
the planner was correct that both our

1065
01:01:41,100 --> 01:01:42,100
engineer and the county came back and

1066
01:01:42,100 --> 01:01:46,100
said the drainage in the area is not

1067
01:01:46,100 --> 01:01:47,100
adequate, not designed properly. Is

1068
01:01:47,100 --> 01:01:49,100
going to continue to degrade. They

1069
01:01:49,100 --> 01:01:53,801
suggest a rock line drainage. We get to

1070
01:01:54,100 --> 01:01:57,100
what is the remedy for handling the

1071
01:01:57,100 --> 01:02:00,601
situation. The county is suggesting you

1072
01:02:02,100 --> 01:02:05,601
deny the map modification and change

1073
01:02:06,100 --> 01:02:07,100
the center drainage easement. But in

1074
01:02:07,100 --> 01:02:11,100
fact we feel it is the most appropriate

1075
01:02:11,100 --> 01:02:12,100
approach moving forward, not because

1076
01:02:12,100 --> 01:02:15,100
they should be given any preferential

1077
01:02:15,100 --> 01:02:16,100
treatment but because any other remedy

1078
01:02:16,100 --> 01:02:19,100
to try to put a riparian easement and

1079
01:02:19,100 --> 01:02:23,100
riparian corridor in the area would not

1080
01:02:23,100 --> 01:02:26,601
function. Those things can only control

1081
01:02:28,100 --> 01:02:32,201
what's on their property. Even if they

1082
01:02:39,100 --> 01:02:40,100
try to change this corridor into

1083
01:02:40,100 --> 01:02:41,100
something whatever that is and remove

1084
01:02:41,100 --> 01:02:42,100
their portion up here you still have

1085
01:02:42,100 --> 01:02:43,100
the property owner to the south in

1086
01:02:43,100 --> 01:02:44,100
violation dumping water into the

1087
01:02:44,100 --> 01:02:47,601
channel and these over here. This

1088
01:02:48,100 --> 01:02:49,100
entire area really all the way up to

1089
01:02:49,100 --> 01:02:50,100
this point needs to be change for this

1090
01:02:50,100 --> 01:02:53,000
to be any sort of a grassy swale again.

1091
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:57,100
we talk to the county about potential

1092
01:02:57,100 --> 01:02:58,100
remedies. It wasn't that this was the

1093
01:02:58,100 --> 01:03:02,100
only option available to us. We talked

1094
01:03:02,100 --> 01:03:05,601
about restoring the area through a

1095
01:03:06,100 --> 01:03:07,100
restoration plan. The response we got

1096
01:03:07,100 --> 01:03:11,801
from the county was vague and bring us

1097
01:03:13,100 --> 01:03:16,601
a proposal. We don't feel comfortable

1098
01:03:18,100 --> 01:03:19,100
about bringing a proposal to change the

1099
01:03:19,100 --> 01:03:22,100
hydrologic regime and put in a riparian

1100
01:03:22,100 --> 01:03:24,100
area when nothing in the area supports

1101
01:03:24,100 --> 01:03:27,100
that and we will be fighting. Pretty

1102
01:03:27,100 --> 01:03:31,201
much the zhang will be forced into

1103
01:03:32,100 --> 01:03:33,100
filing a complaint on their neighbors

1104
01:03:33,100 --> 01:03:35,100
to get a comprehensive remedy. That's

1105
01:03:35,100 --> 01:03:36,100
where we are at right now.

1106
01:03:36,100 --> 01:03:40,201
>> do we have any questions at this

1107
01:03:48,100 --> 01:03:49,100
point for the applicant?

1108
01:03:49,100 --> 01:03:53,801
>> I have a few we can go through

1109
01:03:54,100 --> 01:03:58,100
quickly. This is may be a difficult

1110
01:03:58,100 --> 01:04:00,100
question because it's in your dialogue

1111
01:04:00,100 --> 01:04:05,401
so was back quite a bit you may not

1112
01:04:06,100 --> 01:04:07,100
even be able to recall the context of

1113
01:04:07,100 --> 01:04:10,100
this and unfortunately I was not able

1114
01:04:10,100 --> 01:04:13,100
to write it down. You made a quote

1115
01:04:13,100 --> 01:04:14,100
about riparian habitat and then you

1116
01:04:14,100 --> 01:04:18,801
said the same was found zhang in the

1117
01:04:22,100 --> 01:04:26,100
study. It was unclear to me what you

1118
01:04:26,100 --> 01:04:29,601
were discussing. What study you were

1119
01:04:32,100 --> 01:04:33,100
discussing

1120
01:04:33,100 --> 01:04:36,100
>> sure. Our research we were trying to

1121
01:04:36,100 --> 01:04:37,100
pull out whatever biological evidence

1122
01:04:37,100 --> 01:04:40,100
there was for what happened on lot 19.

1123
01:04:40,100 --> 01:04:42,100
what we did find was a biological

1124
01:04:42,100 --> 01:04:45,100
assessment completed for lot 17, which

1125
01:04:49,100 --> 01:04:52,601
is two doors down. That biological

1126
01:04:53,100 --> 01:04:54,100
assessment concluded there was no

1127
01:04:54,100 --> 01:04:58,100
reason for the riparian easement to be

1128
01:04:58,100 --> 01:05:02,801
in the location where you saw the pool

1129
01:05:03,100 --> 01:05:05,100
and the planner presentation. That it

1130
01:05:05,100 --> 01:05:06,100
really was supposed to be drainage

1131
01:05:06,100 --> 01:05:10,201
easement in the first place. And there

1132
01:05:13,100 --> 01:05:14,100
was no endangered species habitat there

1133
01:05:14,100 --> 01:05:17,100
we are saying through our research and

1134
01:05:17,100 --> 01:05:19,100
observations on lot 19, we understand

1135
01:05:19,100 --> 01:05:20,100
lot 19 to be a similar situation

1136
01:05:20,100 --> 01:05:23,100
>> okay thank you for that. In one of

1137
01:05:23,100 --> 01:05:26,100
the photographs presented by staff,

1138
01:05:27,100 --> 01:05:31,201
there is a significant area of cattails.

1139
01:05:33,100 --> 01:05:36,100
you can see that in the photograph in

1140
01:05:36,100 --> 01:05:40,801
the staff report on page 5 it says the

1141
01:05:42,100 --> 01:05:43,100
photographic evidence at the site

1142
01:05:43,100 --> 01:05:46,100
pre-disturbance shows cattails in the

1143
01:05:46,100 --> 01:05:49,601
area which is potentially indicative of

1144
01:05:50,100 --> 01:05:51,100
an aquatic resource as the area was

1145
01:05:51,100 --> 01:05:53,100
disturbed before the biological

1146
01:05:53,100 --> 01:05:56,601
assessment was conducted aside from the

1147
01:05:59,100 --> 01:06:00,100
photographs there's no way of knowing

1148
01:06:00,100 --> 01:06:03,100
with certainty what was on site prior

1149
01:06:03,100 --> 01:06:05,100
to the site disturbance. But there was

1150
01:06:05,100 --> 01:06:07,100
evidence of cattails would you agree

1151
01:06:07,100 --> 01:06:10,601
that's indicative as they claim that

1152
01:06:12,100 --> 01:06:13,100
there is an aquatic

1153
01:06:13,100 --> 01:06:16,100
>> that is absolutely evidence of

1154
01:06:16,100 --> 01:06:19,100
water. There has been water flowing

1155
01:06:19,100 --> 01:06:23,201
over the site forever. The question is

1156
01:06:24,100 --> 01:06:25,100
if it's a riparian habitat what we are

1157
01:06:25,100 --> 01:06:27,100
saying is the cattails were living in

1158
01:06:27,100 --> 01:06:30,100
an incised channel 3 to 4 feet deep and

1159
01:06:30,100 --> 01:06:31,100
two feet wide. There was no riparian

1160
01:06:31,100 --> 01:06:36,401
edge to it at all and the biologist can

1161
01:06:37,100 --> 01:06:38,100
attest to the fact that no habitat

1162
01:06:38,100 --> 01:06:42,100
could live on the banks of something

1163
01:06:42,100 --> 01:06:45,100
like that. I would also add that

1164
01:06:45,100 --> 01:06:48,601
cattails are not an endangered species

1165
01:06:50,100 --> 01:06:51,100
and are invasive. They can grow

1166
01:06:51,100 --> 01:06:52,100
anywhere there is water

1167
01:06:52,100 --> 01:06:53,100
>> alright thank you

1168
01:06:53,100 --> 01:06:56,601
>> looking at the photograph, it's hard

1169
01:07:05,100 --> 01:07:07,100
to tell are there solar panels

1170
01:07:07,100 --> 01:07:10,100
installed in the easement area?

1171
01:07:10,100 --> 01:07:14,801
>> it does not look that way but it

1172
01:07:20,100 --> 01:07:21,100
does look like the outfalls from the

1173
01:07:21,100 --> 01:07:22,100
two neighbors to the east as well as

1174
01:07:22,100 --> 01:07:23,100
the two neighbors to the south are

1175
01:07:23,100 --> 01:07:24,100
within the riparian easement. All of

1176
01:07:24,100 --> 01:07:28,801
that was done without a permit, we can

1177
01:07:29,100 --> 01:07:30,100
pull up the historical records for

1178
01:07:30,100 --> 01:07:32,100
permitting and there has been no

1179
01:07:32,100 --> 01:07:36,201
permits for any. The cage structure here

1180
01:07:38,100 --> 01:07:39,100
pretty significant about 10 feet in

1181
01:07:39,100 --> 01:07:40,100
the riparian easement and there's two

1182
01:07:40,100 --> 01:07:44,100
outfalls here in addition to this one.

1183
01:07:44,100 --> 01:07:48,201
>> go up a little bit into 19, there's

1184
01:07:54,100 --> 01:07:55,100
kind of a grassy

1185
01:07:55,100 --> 01:07:58,100
>> this is 2020 you can see the

1186
01:07:58,100 --> 01:08:00,100
incision, if you go backwards in

1187
01:08:00,100 --> 01:08:03,601
history you see that this is 2011,

1188
01:08:05,100 --> 01:08:06,100
there's more incision. You can see some

1189
01:08:06,100 --> 01:08:09,601
level of something going on here.

1190
01:08:11,100 --> 01:08:12,100
whether it's this as a riparian

1191
01:08:12,100 --> 01:08:15,100
endangered species habitat is highly in

1192
01:08:15,100 --> 01:08:17,401
question. There's obviously drainage

1193
01:08:19,100 --> 01:08:23,801
here. In 2007 you can see it was even

1194
01:08:25,100 --> 01:08:26,100
more of a grassy swale rather than

1195
01:08:26,100 --> 01:08:30,201
incised ditch or riparian area. This is

1196
01:08:31,100 --> 01:08:33,100
pretty common, you are planning

1197
01:08:33,100 --> 01:08:34,100
commission when development goes into

1198
01:08:34,100 --> 01:08:35,100
an area you see this happen

1199
01:08:35,100 --> 01:08:40,401
>> can you drop the map we have in the

1200
01:08:41,100 --> 01:08:42,100
table?

1201
01:08:42,100 --> 01:08:43,100
>> I do not have that in the slide

1202
01:08:43,100 --> 01:08:47,801
>> I just have it in the paper that's

1203
01:08:48,100 --> 01:08:49,100
why I handed it out to you

1204
01:08:49,100 --> 01:08:52,100
>> you have a current one?

1205
01:08:54,100 --> 01:08:57,100
>> it was in the previous presentation

1206
01:08:57,100 --> 01:09:00,601
unfortunately. I only have the historic

1207
01:09:01,100 --> 01:09:02,100
aerials.

1208
01:09:02,100 --> 01:09:04,100
>> that's what I'm looking at our

1209
01:09:04,100 --> 01:09:07,100
historic aerials. Do you have one that

1210
01:09:07,100 --> 01:09:09,100
is current?

1211
01:09:11,100 --> 01:09:15,201
>> oh yes. One second. This is current.

1212
01:09:25,100 --> 01:09:26,100
>> okay I guess where there is a

1213
01:09:26,100 --> 01:09:29,100
concrete trail that comes in it looks

1214
01:09:29,100 --> 01:09:30,100
like there are solar panels or

1215
01:09:30,100 --> 01:09:34,100
something there at the end of the trail

1216
01:09:34,100 --> 01:09:38,201
>> this looks like the trail but this

1217
01:09:39,100 --> 01:09:40,100
is a cobbel line

1218
01:09:40,100 --> 01:09:41,100
>> on lot 19

1219
01:09:41,100 --> 01:09:44,100
>> those are raised lanterns. The

1220
01:09:56,100 --> 01:09:57,100
zhangs installed those, raised plant

1221
01:09:57,100 --> 01:09:58,100
beds but not within the drainage. They

1222
01:09:58,100 --> 01:10:01,100
are within the riparian easement

1223
01:10:03,100 --> 01:10:06,100
because it extends 75 feet into the

1224
01:10:06,100 --> 01:10:10,100
property but what we are saying is this

1225
01:10:10,100 --> 01:10:13,100
riparian area was never actually a

1226
01:10:13,100 --> 01:10:14,100
riparian area it was a line on a map

1227
01:10:14,100 --> 01:10:17,100
but there's no endangered species and

1228
01:10:17,100 --> 01:10:21,201
riparian has to be supported by water

1229
01:10:25,100 --> 01:10:26,100
and it has a specific regime of

1230
01:10:26,100 --> 01:10:27,100
vegetation and there's no evidence in

1231
01:10:27,100 --> 01:10:28,100
this area there's any riparian habitat

1232
01:10:28,100 --> 01:10:32,801
>> it is in the easement area that is

1233
01:10:35,100 --> 01:10:36,100
recorded?

1234
01:10:36,100 --> 01:10:37,100
>> yes

1235
01:10:37,100 --> 01:10:41,801
>> I guess this is for the county, has

1236
01:10:53,100 --> 01:10:56,601
there been any notifications to the

1237
01:10:58,100 --> 01:11:01,601
residents at 4569 that they have built

1238
01:11:02,100 --> 01:11:03,100
within the riparian area?

1239
01:11:03,100 --> 01:11:04,100
>> [indiscernible]

1240
01:11:04,100 --> 01:11:05,100
>> okay

1241
01:11:05,100 --> 01:11:09,801
>> thank you. We will open it up for

1242
01:11:14,100 --> 01:11:17,100
public comment. Is there anyone here in

1243
01:11:17,100 --> 01:11:20,100
the public in person that would like to

1244
01:11:20,100 --> 01:11:21,100
speak on the item?

1245
01:11:21,100 --> 01:11:24,601
>> please state your name for the

1246
01:11:29,100 --> 01:11:30,100
record and you have three minutes

1247
01:11:30,100 --> 01:11:31,100
>> my name is jared taylor I'm the

1248
01:11:31,100 --> 01:11:35,201
property owner to the south on lake

1249
01:11:37,100 --> 01:11:38,100
forest drive. I'm the one that provided

1250
01:11:38,100 --> 01:11:41,100
the letter thank you for meeting here

1251
01:11:41,100 --> 01:11:42,100
today you probably reviewed my letter

1252
01:11:42,100 --> 01:11:45,601
and everything I'm concerned about is

1253
01:11:46,100 --> 01:11:47,100
in there. One thing really important to

1254
01:11:47,100 --> 01:11:52,100
look at is the very last page of packet

1255
01:11:52,100 --> 01:11:54,100
from staff. The existing what was the

1256
01:11:54,100 --> 01:11:58,100
map when the subdivision was built. If

1257
01:11:58,100 --> 01:12:01,100
you look you can see there is contour

1258
01:12:01,100 --> 01:12:02,100
lines. You see there is a depression

1259
01:12:02,100 --> 01:12:05,100
that needs to be there. That super

1260
01:12:05,100 --> 01:12:08,100
important that provided attention for

1261
01:12:08,100 --> 01:12:12,100
the water and held it there and that's

1262
01:12:12,100 --> 01:12:13,100
where the cattails grew. That's what

1263
01:12:13,100 --> 01:12:16,100
kind of help the water from flowing

1264
01:12:16,100 --> 01:12:19,100
down through the wetlands area and it

1265
01:12:19,100 --> 01:12:21,100
was infiltrating through the natural

1266
01:12:21,100 --> 01:12:24,100
grasses. Before they moved in there was

1267
01:12:24,100 --> 01:12:28,201
an awesome population of frogs. I'm not

1268
01:12:29,100 --> 01:12:30,100
a biologist but critters you could hear

1269
01:12:30,100 --> 01:12:34,100
every night and it was a nice. I feel

1270
01:12:34,100 --> 01:12:37,100
they are deflecting responsibility for

1271
01:12:37,100 --> 01:12:38,100
their legal actions here trying to

1272
01:12:38,100 --> 01:12:39,100
point fingers at everyone else and

1273
01:12:39,100 --> 01:12:43,801
that's okay I get it. The fact that

1274
01:12:44,100 --> 01:12:47,601
they openly knowingly graded work in

1275
01:12:51,100 --> 01:12:52,100
the wetlands area I'm really feeling

1276
01:12:52,100 --> 01:12:53,100
they are above the law wealthy grand

1277
01:12:53,100 --> 01:12:54,100
bay landlord that can come in and do

1278
01:12:54,100 --> 01:12:55,100
what they want and if they get caught

1279
01:12:55,100 --> 01:12:56,100
they get caught at the expense of

1280
01:12:56,100 --> 01:12:59,100
consultants to help them out. That's

1281
01:12:59,100 --> 01:13:02,601
what's being presented today I'm sure

1282
01:13:03,100 --> 01:13:07,100
you can see that I really feel approval

1283
01:13:07,100 --> 01:13:08,100
of the application will eliminate the

1284
01:13:08,100 --> 01:13:09,100
open space and previous wetlands that

1285
01:13:09,100 --> 01:13:12,100
makes this neighborhood unique and

1286
01:13:12,100 --> 01:13:15,100
desirable. Not houses right on top of

1287
01:13:15,100 --> 01:13:19,100
each other. Such an important part of

1288
01:13:19,100 --> 01:13:21,100
the neighborhood. I want to point out

1289
01:13:21,100 --> 01:13:22,100
also useful in my letter they are only

1290
01:13:22,100 --> 01:13:25,100
proposing the wetlands area on their

1291
01:13:25,100 --> 01:13:28,100
property that contains the wetlands

1292
01:13:28,100 --> 01:13:30,100
area. My property is significantly

1293
01:13:30,100 --> 01:13:34,100
above the majority. You will see the

1294
01:13:34,100 --> 01:13:37,100
creek or the wetlands area runs

1295
01:13:37,100 --> 01:13:38,100
parallel between our two properties and

1296
01:13:38,100 --> 01:13:40,100
it does return back onto my property

1297
01:13:40,100 --> 01:13:44,100
toward lake forest drive where there is

1298
01:13:44,100 --> 01:13:48,100
a drain.. I can give you in a photo

1299
01:13:48,100 --> 01:13:49,100
adjacent to our fence line I'm concern

1300
01:13:49,100 --> 01:13:52,601
without the previous detention we had,

1301
01:13:59,100 --> 01:14:00,100
and the fact that county engineering

1302
01:14:00,100 --> 01:14:01,100
confirmed their water flow analysis and

1303
01:14:01,100 --> 01:14:02,100
what they are proposing and have

1304
01:14:02,100 --> 01:14:03,100
installed is not adequate I may

1305
01:14:03,100 --> 01:14:04,100
potentially have flooding on my

1306
01:14:04,100 --> 01:14:05,100
property that will go cross my driveway

1307
01:14:05,100 --> 01:14:08,100
and into the street. I also want to

1308
01:14:08,100 --> 01:14:10,100
point out their biological assessment

1309
01:14:10,100 --> 01:14:13,100
was completed after they completed the

1310
01:14:13,100 --> 01:14:16,100
grading. So of course they're not going

1311
01:14:16,100 --> 01:14:17,100
to find anything if you tear it all out

1312
01:14:17,100 --> 01:14:19,100
and then do the biological assessment.

1313
01:14:19,100 --> 01:14:23,201
that's it. I'm against it thank you

1314
01:14:24,100 --> 01:14:25,100
>> thank you jared

1315
01:14:25,100 --> 01:14:27,100
>> [speaker off mic]

1316
01:14:31,100 --> 01:14:35,801
>> I majority up hill. You have to be

1317
01:14:37,100 --> 01:14:41,201
there to understand it. This is my

1318
01:14:42,100 --> 01:14:44,100
property here. I got a grading permit

1319
01:14:44,100 --> 01:14:45,100
for all the work I've done on my

1320
01:14:45,100 --> 01:14:48,100
property and have worked with the

1321
01:14:48,100 --> 01:14:51,601
county about that.. All my inspections

1322
01:14:52,100 --> 01:14:53,100
closed out so that's how I knew the

1323
01:14:53,100 --> 01:14:55,100
process so well you had to have it and

1324
01:14:55,100 --> 01:14:59,201
how sensitive it was. Here is the

1325
01:15:01,100 --> 01:15:04,100
wetlands area. Water is collected from

1326
01:15:04,100 --> 01:15:06,100
all of this area, all the way up here

1327
01:15:06,100 --> 01:15:09,100
it all comes down into this area and

1328
01:15:09,100 --> 01:15:13,801
returns on to my property here. This is

1329
01:15:15,100 --> 01:15:19,801
a low spot here. I'm flowing down here,

1330
01:15:20,100 --> 01:15:23,100
they are flowing this direction, and

1331
01:15:23,100 --> 01:15:25,100
then it comes on to my property here

1332
01:15:25,100 --> 01:15:28,601
and goes into my drain and

1333
01:15:30,100 --> 01:15:31,100
plugs there goes across the

1334
01:15:31,100 --> 01:15:35,100
driveway and into the street and it's a

1335
01:15:35,100 --> 01:15:37,100
big concern.

1336
01:15:39,100 --> 01:15:40,100
>> [speaker off mic]

1337
01:15:40,100 --> 01:15:44,201
>> I have some questions but it looks

1338
01:15:46,100 --> 01:15:47,100
like in some of the photographs you put

1339
01:15:47,100 --> 01:15:48,100
drainage lines going toward their

1340
01:15:48,100 --> 01:15:49,100
property

1341
01:15:49,100 --> 01:15:53,100
>> I have drain lines that come out

1342
01:15:53,100 --> 01:15:57,201
here. I have to drain somewhere. That

1343
01:15:58,100 --> 01:15:59,100
was included with the inspections when

1344
01:15:59,100 --> 01:16:02,100
I got the grading permit

1345
01:16:04,100 --> 01:16:05,100
>> so it's okay for you to drain into

1346
01:16:05,100 --> 01:16:09,100
their property but not okay for them to

1347
01:16:09,100 --> 01:16:10,100
drain into your property?

1348
01:16:10,100 --> 01:16:13,100
>> I'm not saying that they drain onto

1349
01:16:13,100 --> 01:16:14,100
my property here and that's fine

1350
01:16:14,100 --> 01:16:18,100
>> that was an easement put in by the

1351
01:16:18,100 --> 01:16:19,100
county

1352
01:16:19,100 --> 01:16:20,100
>> that's fine what I'm talking about

1353
01:16:20,100 --> 01:16:24,801
is the management of the flow of water.

1354
01:16:28,100 --> 01:16:29,100
the fact that if you look at the last

1355
01:16:29,100 --> 01:16:30,100
page in the packet there used to be a

1356
01:16:30,100 --> 01:16:32,100
natural depression and that acted as a

1357
01:16:32,100 --> 01:16:34,100
detention basin to hold the water so in

1358
01:16:34,100 --> 01:16:36,100
large events it doesn't all hit my

1359
01:16:36,100 --> 01:16:38,100
drain at one time and it doesn't

1360
01:16:38,100 --> 01:16:41,601
overflow the drain. That's what I'm

1361
01:16:43,100 --> 01:16:46,601
concerned about. I'm not saying they

1362
01:16:50,100 --> 01:16:51,100
should not be allowed to drain on my

1363
01:16:51,100 --> 01:16:52,100
property I get that and that's fine I

1364
01:16:52,100 --> 01:16:53,100
want to make sure it's engineered so

1365
01:16:53,100 --> 01:16:54,100
it's going to work and I'm not going to

1366
01:16:54,100 --> 01:16:58,100
have a future problem. To me, it's a

1367
01:16:58,100 --> 01:16:59,100
little crazy they are proposing to not

1368
01:16:59,100 --> 01:17:03,801
look at the wetlands area as a whole.

1369
01:17:10,100 --> 01:17:11,100
is not just their property is three

1370
01:17:11,100 --> 01:17:12,100
properties they never once approached

1371
01:17:12,100 --> 01:17:13,100
me about this and should we get rid of

1372
01:17:13,100 --> 01:17:14,100
this they are trying to muscle their

1373
01:17:14,100 --> 01:17:15,100
way through to get your approval that's

1374
01:17:15,100 --> 01:17:16,100
their goal. To answer your question, I

1375
01:17:16,100 --> 01:17:19,100
agree it should continue to drain onto

1376
01:17:19,100 --> 01:17:21,100
my property.

1377
01:17:22,100 --> 01:17:24,100
>> in addition, the drainage you have

1378
01:17:24,100 --> 01:17:27,601
arrange their was done in compliance

1379
01:17:31,100 --> 01:17:34,601
with the county. Is that correct?

1380
01:17:36,100 --> 01:17:37,100
>> yes the existing drain and let all

1381
01:17:37,100 --> 01:17:38,100
my property that receives drain from

1382
01:17:38,100 --> 01:17:39,100
their property was there before I

1383
01:17:39,100 --> 01:17:43,100
bought the house. And all the drainage

1384
01:17:43,100 --> 01:17:44,100
I did was part of the permit that was

1385
01:17:44,100 --> 01:17:46,100
inspected

1386
01:17:47,100 --> 01:17:48,100
>> by the county

1387
01:17:48,100 --> 01:17:51,601
>> this picture presented to us with

1388
01:17:52,100 --> 01:17:53,100
these drain outlets

1389
01:17:53,100 --> 01:17:55,100
>> I haven't seen those that was not

1390
01:17:55,100 --> 01:17:56,100
shared with me

1391
01:17:56,100 --> 01:17:59,601
>> I'm trying to get clarification of

1392
01:18:06,100 --> 01:18:09,100
what it looks like I've driven by

1393
01:18:09,100 --> 01:18:10,100
numerous times I have friends but I

1394
01:18:10,100 --> 01:18:13,100
never paid attention to it so now I'm

1395
01:18:13,100 --> 01:18:14,100
paying attention to it

1396
01:18:14,100 --> 01:18:15,100
>> [speaker off mic]

1397
01:18:15,100 --> 01:18:19,801
>> so all this rock area, this is the

1398
01:18:25,100 --> 01:18:26,100
drainage canal in question

1399
01:18:26,100 --> 01:18:27,100
>> can you go back to the microphone

1400
01:18:27,100 --> 01:18:31,201
>> to clarify the canal they made, yes

1401
01:18:36,100 --> 01:18:39,601
>> but that drainage is compliant with

1402
01:18:41,100 --> 01:18:42,100
the county?

1403
01:18:42,100 --> 01:18:45,100
>> the drainage on my property that's

1404
01:18:45,100 --> 01:18:48,100
my understanding. I had it all

1405
01:18:48,100 --> 01:18:50,100
inspected. The county inspector guy

1406
01:18:50,100 --> 01:18:53,100
came out. When I submitted the

1407
01:18:53,100 --> 01:18:56,100
complaint he came out and walked the

1408
01:18:56,100 --> 01:18:57,100
whole thing as well

1409
01:18:57,100 --> 01:18:58,100
>> okay thank you for your time

1410
01:18:58,100 --> 01:19:02,201
>> but stay focused on this property we

1411
01:19:04,100 --> 01:19:07,100
are reviewing. Is there any other

1412
01:19:07,100 --> 01:19:08,100
public comment?

1413
01:19:08,100 --> 01:19:12,201
>> no one here, no one online. We

1414
01:19:22,100 --> 01:19:24,401
will close public comment.

1415
01:19:30,100 --> 01:19:31,100
clarifications, we can bring up scott

1416
01:19:31,100 --> 01:19:32,100
again and the applicant representative

1417
01:19:32,100 --> 01:19:33,100
for discussion

1418
01:19:33,100 --> 01:19:34,100
>> I'd like some clarification on the

1419
01:19:34,100 --> 01:19:36,100
riparian easement area. It looks like

1420
01:19:36,100 --> 01:19:39,601
we have two different proposed or

1421
01:19:40,100 --> 01:19:41,100
drawings here. One is on both lots and

1422
01:19:41,100 --> 01:19:44,601
one is on lot 19. [indiscernible] on

1423
01:19:49,100 --> 01:19:50,100
the last page I guess it is

1424
01:19:50,100 --> 01:19:51,100
>> the last page of the staff report

1425
01:19:51,100 --> 01:19:54,100
>> what is the question about?

1426
01:19:57,100 --> 01:19:59,100
>> in the area highlighted in red is

1427
01:19:59,100 --> 01:20:00,100
that the riparian area?

1428
01:20:00,100 --> 01:20:04,201
>> you are asking if that's a true

1429
01:20:08,100 --> 01:20:10,100
riparian area?

1430
01:20:10,100 --> 01:20:11,100
>> the map presented by the applicant

1431
01:20:11,100 --> 01:20:15,201
shows that falls into two other lot

1432
01:20:16,100 --> 01:20:17,100
lines

1433
01:20:17,100 --> 01:20:19,100
>> it does encompass three different

1434
01:20:19,100 --> 01:20:22,100
lots. I don't know if my slide is on

1435
01:20:22,100 --> 01:20:27,401
here. Can it get my site back up. While

1436
01:20:28,100 --> 01:20:30,100
we are waiting for it to do that, one

1437
01:20:30,100 --> 01:20:35,401
thing I do want to note there are many

1438
01:20:37,100 --> 01:20:38,100
subdivisions within the county that

1439
01:20:38,100 --> 01:20:39,100
have open space riparian protection

1440
01:20:39,100 --> 01:20:43,201
easements. On the final map is not

1441
01:20:44,100 --> 01:20:47,100
unique to sterling point. The reason I

1442
01:20:47,100 --> 01:20:50,100
mention this is because conditions

1443
01:20:50,100 --> 01:20:53,601
change over time and when development

1444
01:20:54,100 --> 01:20:55,100
occurs it does change the overall

1445
01:20:55,100 --> 01:20:58,601
hydrologic function of the area. Where

1446
01:21:01,100 --> 01:21:02,100
changes occur and someone wants to

1447
01:21:02,100 --> 01:21:03,100
modify the easement there is a process

1448
01:21:03,100 --> 01:21:08,401
in place for that. That is what we are

1449
01:21:09,100 --> 01:21:11,100
discussing today. Commissioner demattei,

1450
01:21:11,100 --> 01:21:13,100
what I'm trying to show is the

1451
01:21:13,100 --> 01:21:16,601
selection from the final map. That

1452
01:21:19,100 --> 01:21:20,100
shows the location of the easement

1453
01:21:20,100 --> 01:21:24,201
relative to all three properties. Is it

1454
01:21:42,100 --> 01:21:44,100
still working? Here we go. The easement

1455
01:21:44,100 --> 01:21:45,100
is open space riparian protection

1456
01:21:45,100 --> 01:21:47,100
easement that encompasses three

1457
01:21:47,100 --> 01:21:50,601
properties. The majority is on lot 19.

1458
01:21:52,100 --> 01:21:54,100
it doesn't specify where the os open

1459
01:21:54,100 --> 01:21:57,100
space riparian is, it just designates

1460
01:21:57,100 --> 01:21:58,100
the entire thing.

1461
01:21:58,100 --> 01:22:02,201
>> okay. I'd like to emphasize and ask

1462
01:22:07,100 --> 01:22:10,100
you to emphasize that this is an open

1463
01:22:10,100 --> 01:22:12,100
space riparian easement. We are not

1464
01:22:12,100 --> 01:22:15,100
just talking about riparian easement.

1465
01:22:20,100 --> 01:22:21,100
it's also open space which implies

1466
01:22:21,100 --> 01:22:22,100
other values

1467
01:22:22,100 --> 01:22:23,100
>> that is true that is correct

1468
01:22:23,100 --> 01:22:26,100
>> just an observation and maybe

1469
01:22:30,100 --> 01:22:31,100
comment on this, obviously the

1470
01:22:31,100 --> 01:22:33,100
hydrology has changed in that

1471
01:22:33,100 --> 01:22:36,100
subdivision. Originally, this area was

1472
01:22:39,100 --> 01:22:40,100
providing retention and what's being

1473
01:22:40,100 --> 01:22:43,100
proposed here is no detention which

1474
01:22:43,100 --> 01:22:46,100
hydrology hydraulically is not good my

1475
01:22:46,100 --> 01:22:50,100
own thought is that detention needs to

1476
01:22:50,100 --> 01:22:52,100
come back and that function as far as

1477
01:22:52,100 --> 01:22:55,100
riparian habitat through that boundary

1478
01:22:59,100 --> 01:23:02,100
[indiscernible] it's open space. So

1479
01:23:03,100 --> 01:23:04,100
those are my observations. The

1480
01:23:04,100 --> 01:23:07,100
detention basin in that area needs to

1481
01:23:07,100 --> 01:23:08,100
be brought back to what it was

1482
01:23:08,100 --> 01:23:12,201
>> are there any other questions I can

1483
01:23:15,100 --> 01:23:16,100
answer?

1484
01:23:16,100 --> 01:23:20,201
>> I have a couple of questions. For

1485
01:23:22,100 --> 01:23:23,100
the applicant

1486
01:23:23,100 --> 01:23:26,601
>> we can move to the applicant.

1487
01:23:30,100 --> 01:23:31,100
>> and then I will probably ask staff

1488
01:23:31,100 --> 01:23:32,100
to come back up

1489
01:23:32,100 --> 01:23:33,100
>> that's okay

1490
01:23:33,100 --> 01:23:36,601
>> we have questions for you chris

1491
01:23:39,100 --> 01:23:43,201
>> thank you very much. The nature of

1492
01:23:47,100 --> 01:23:51,201
the disruption of the area, however you

1493
01:23:52,100 --> 01:23:54,100
term it, that's the word that came to

1494
01:23:54,100 --> 01:23:58,100
mind, anyway the nature of this. Why is

1495
01:23:58,100 --> 01:24:02,201
it that when there are provisions that

1496
01:24:03,100 --> 01:24:04,100
homeowner association set forth

1497
01:24:04,100 --> 01:24:06,100
provisions associated with the final

1498
01:24:06,100 --> 01:24:10,100
map one of the first slides why is it

1499
01:24:10,100 --> 01:24:13,100
the applicant elected to ignore those

1500
01:24:13,100 --> 01:24:16,100
and proceed with the process? Why did

1501
01:24:16,100 --> 01:24:17,100
that happen?

1502
01:24:17,100 --> 01:24:20,601
>> their response was that they were

1503
01:24:23,100 --> 01:24:27,100
talking to their neighbors and did what

1504
01:24:27,100 --> 01:24:30,100
their neighbors did. The rock line

1505
01:24:30,100 --> 01:24:31,100
drainage you see on the neighboring

1506
01:24:31,100 --> 01:24:34,100
properties upstream was done before

1507
01:24:34,100 --> 01:24:37,601
theirs and they claimed ignorance. I

1508
01:24:42,100 --> 01:24:43,100
can't say I can't speak for them they

1509
01:24:43,100 --> 01:24:44,100
are sitting in the back row here so

1510
01:24:44,100 --> 01:24:46,100
they can speak for themselves. I'm

1511
01:24:46,100 --> 01:24:50,100
trying to go with what is the past

1512
01:24:50,100 --> 01:24:53,100
historical conditions of the area and

1513
01:24:53,100 --> 01:24:56,100
what we can do to remedy the situation

1514
01:24:56,100 --> 01:24:58,100
moving forward. They understand they

1515
01:24:58,100 --> 01:25:01,100
did something wrong. There's no

1516
01:25:02,100 --> 01:25:04,100
question about that. But I think the

1517
01:25:04,100 --> 01:25:05,100
question on the table now is what do we

1518
01:25:05,100 --> 01:25:09,201
do to modify the situation. In contrast

1519
01:25:10,100 --> 01:25:13,100
I came up to explain the contours

1520
01:25:13,100 --> 01:25:15,100
brought up previously about the

1521
01:25:15,100 --> 01:25:17,100
depression are very old and there's no

1522
01:25:17,100 --> 01:25:20,601
evidence that was the recent history.

1523
01:25:21,100 --> 01:25:24,100
our biological assessment did not show

1524
01:25:24,100 --> 01:25:28,100
any sign of a previous depression in

1525
01:25:28,100 --> 01:25:30,100
the area. You can see we pointed out

1526
01:25:30,100 --> 01:25:33,100
the outfalls from the neighboring

1527
01:25:34,100 --> 01:25:36,100
properties. What might have been a

1528
01:25:36,100 --> 01:25:37,100
depression long before they put those

1529
01:25:37,100 --> 01:25:41,801
outfalls in is no longer there, even if

1530
01:25:43,100 --> 01:25:46,601
the zhangs did nothing the 2020 aerial

1531
01:25:47,100 --> 01:25:51,201
shows a channel, there's no question in

1532
01:25:53,100 --> 01:25:54,100
that. Going forward, what is the remedy

1533
01:25:54,100 --> 01:25:58,100
here is more important in my mind. I

1534
01:25:58,100 --> 01:26:02,100
think the remedy seems to hit on all

1535
01:26:02,100 --> 01:26:03,100
the properties here. You have a

1536
01:26:03,100 --> 01:26:06,100
riparian easement that covers 25 feet

1537
01:26:08,100 --> 01:26:11,100
of the complaint. That water coming in

1538
01:26:11,100 --> 01:26:13,100
from their property which should have

1539
01:26:13,100 --> 01:26:16,601
been sheet flow and probably going

1540
01:26:17,100 --> 01:26:19,100
south to the drainage, rather than

1541
01:26:19,100 --> 01:26:20,100
being directed to the back of the

1542
01:26:20,100 --> 01:26:22,100
property and into this drainage. That's

1543
01:26:22,100 --> 01:26:26,100
part of the problem so what do we do

1544
01:26:26,100 --> 01:26:28,100
about it?

1545
01:26:32,100 --> 01:26:33,100
>> that was excellent and I do

1546
01:26:33,100 --> 01:26:34,100
understand the question you want

1547
01:26:34,100 --> 01:26:35,100
answered but there are questions on the

1548
01:26:35,100 --> 01:26:36,100
table as well and I would appreciate if

1549
01:26:36,100 --> 01:26:38,100
you would answer those. For example,

1550
01:26:38,100 --> 01:26:42,801
why is it the first code violation went

1551
01:26:43,100 --> 01:26:46,100
to the zhang was ignored?

1552
01:26:47,100 --> 01:26:51,801
>> I can let them speak about that if

1553
01:26:52,100 --> 01:26:56,100
you don't mind. I did not start working

1554
01:26:56,100 --> 01:26:57,100
on the project until august when they

1555
01:26:57,100 --> 01:26:58,100
brought me in to remedy the situation

1556
01:26:58,100 --> 01:27:00,401
>> you are representing them.

1557
01:27:05,100 --> 01:27:08,601
>> we can bring up the zhangs

1558
01:27:12,100 --> 01:27:16,201
>> good morning. My name is scott zhang

1559
01:27:17,100 --> 01:27:20,601
the owner of [indiscernible] when we

1560
01:27:22,100 --> 01:27:26,100
got the notice, I came to there is a

1561
01:27:26,100 --> 01:27:30,201
property he was doing his swimming pool.

1562
01:27:32,100 --> 01:27:33,100
I came to his property and he

1563
01:27:33,100 --> 01:27:34,100
mentioned you were working on the

1564
01:27:34,100 --> 01:27:38,201
riparian area. I said why what about

1565
01:27:47,100 --> 01:27:49,100
this? But I did not get a clear answer.

1566
01:27:49,100 --> 01:27:53,201
when I was asking him about this

1567
01:27:54,100 --> 01:27:58,100
grading area for the cage and also I

1568
01:27:58,100 --> 01:28:02,100
did not get a clear answer so that is

1569
01:28:02,100 --> 01:28:06,801
why I do not think there was anything

1570
01:28:07,100 --> 01:28:08,100
wrong [indiscernible]

1571
01:28:08,100 --> 01:28:09,100
>> after I got the notice

1572
01:28:09,100 --> 01:28:13,201
>> they are asking why you did not

1573
01:28:15,100 --> 01:28:18,100
respond to the first notice

1574
01:28:26,100 --> 01:28:30,201
>> oh. Um. . I don't know how to

1575
01:28:35,100 --> 01:28:36,100
respond.

1576
01:28:36,100 --> 01:28:40,201
>> okay. That's it, thank you very much.

1577
01:28:45,100 --> 01:28:49,100
>> I thought I heard you say earlier

1578
01:28:49,100 --> 01:28:51,100
that cattail is an invasive species

1579
01:28:51,100 --> 01:28:54,100
>> they are native aren't they

1580
01:28:55,100 --> 01:28:58,100
>> there are multiple species of

1581
01:28:59,100 --> 01:29:00,100
cattails. I can have the biologist

1582
01:29:00,100 --> 01:29:03,601
speak about that if you'd like

1583
01:29:04,100 --> 01:29:06,100
>> I'm just wondering, every place you

1584
01:29:06,100 --> 01:29:09,601
see a wetland you see cattails

1585
01:29:11,100 --> 01:29:14,601
>> so I'm just trying to get

1586
01:29:15,100 --> 01:29:18,601
clarification of what's wrong with the

1587
01:29:20,100 --> 01:29:21,100
cattails

1588
01:29:21,100 --> 01:29:24,601
>> my name is doctor barnett, barnett

1589
01:29:28,100 --> 01:29:29,100
environmental. I did the biological

1590
01:29:29,100 --> 01:29:31,100
assessment and the historical analysis

1591
01:29:31,100 --> 01:29:35,801
of the area. In the early 90s, there

1592
01:29:36,100 --> 01:29:39,100
used to be intermittent stream that

1593
01:29:39,100 --> 01:29:43,201
passed through the area. As the area

1594
01:29:44,100 --> 01:29:48,100
built out, the integrity of the stream

1595
01:29:48,100 --> 01:29:50,100
essentially disappeared because you

1596
01:29:50,100 --> 01:29:54,801
chop it up. There's a theory of an

1597
01:29:58,100 --> 01:29:59,100
island by geography. You create these

1598
01:29:59,100 --> 01:30:02,100
little islands and each island has less

1599
01:30:02,100 --> 01:30:06,100
value than the larger habitat that was

1600
01:30:06,100 --> 01:30:09,601
extracted from. As this area developed,

1601
01:30:11,100 --> 01:30:14,100
you started creating islands, little

1602
01:30:15,100 --> 01:30:16,100
islands of habitat. I think that's what

1603
01:30:16,100 --> 01:30:19,601
the riparian easements are trying to

1604
01:30:20,100 --> 01:30:21,100
get to. Here is this little island but

1605
01:30:21,100 --> 01:30:25,801
we better save it because it's the last

1606
01:30:28,100 --> 01:30:30,100
island we have. But what it did not

1607
01:30:30,100 --> 01:30:32,100
acknowledge is the island in and of

1608
01:30:32,100 --> 01:30:35,601
itself can't support itself. It needs

1609
01:30:36,100 --> 01:30:37,100
everything around it. So as you remove

1610
01:30:37,100 --> 01:30:40,601
the resource that moves into this

1611
01:30:42,100 --> 01:30:43,100
little island, gives that water and

1612
01:30:43,100 --> 01:30:45,100
animals and seeds and things like that,

1613
01:30:45,100 --> 01:30:48,100
then you remove the value that comes

1614
01:30:48,100 --> 01:30:51,601
into it and it essentially languishes

1615
01:30:55,100 --> 01:30:56,100
and synapses. It does not survive as an

1616
01:30:56,100 --> 01:30:59,601
ecological island in a more. So

1617
01:31:03,100 --> 01:31:04,100
ultimately as the build out continued

1618
01:31:04,100 --> 01:31:07,100
in the area the riparian easements look

1619
01:31:07,100 --> 01:31:08,100
more like artifacts, artifacts of past

1620
01:31:08,100 --> 01:31:11,100
wishful thinking that we could save the

1621
01:31:11,100 --> 01:31:12,100
area. But what has developed in the

1622
01:31:12,100 --> 01:31:16,201
area is a drainage problem. People have

1623
01:31:18,100 --> 01:31:19,100
put catchments in and they concentrated

1624
01:31:19,100 --> 01:31:22,100
drainage and put it in a pipe and pipe

1625
01:31:22,100 --> 01:31:25,100
outfalls before the zhang property and

1626
01:31:25,100 --> 01:31:28,601
water dumps onto the property. The

1627
01:31:29,100 --> 01:31:31,100
neighbor to the south has two outfalls

1628
01:31:31,100 --> 01:31:34,601
into the zhang property. It was

1629
01:31:35,100 --> 01:31:38,100
convenient prior to 2020, it looked

1630
01:31:39,100 --> 01:31:43,100
sort of natural. Cattails are as much

1631
01:31:43,100 --> 01:31:46,601
an indication of a disturbed and

1632
01:31:47,100 --> 01:31:50,601
distressed system as anything like at

1633
01:31:52,100 --> 01:31:53,100
the marshes and you look at a healthy

1634
01:31:53,100 --> 01:31:54,100
marsh you see cattails but you won't

1635
01:31:54,100 --> 01:31:58,201
see a channel clogged with them.. What

1636
01:31:59,100 --> 01:32:00,100
we see here is a channel clogged with

1637
01:32:00,100 --> 01:32:02,100
cattails as soon as there's water in a

1638
01:32:02,100 --> 01:32:06,100
dry area these things will jump in and

1639
01:32:06,100 --> 01:32:10,100
grow. But what happens is while it may

1640
01:32:10,100 --> 01:32:14,100
have some value in red wing blackbirds

1641
01:32:14,100 --> 01:32:15,100
for example nests there, not here

1642
01:32:15,100 --> 01:32:18,100
because it's in the middle of a

1643
01:32:18,100 --> 01:32:19,100
residential area. As you clogged the

1644
01:32:19,100 --> 01:32:21,100
areas with cattails the drainage

1645
01:32:21,100 --> 01:32:24,100
function is disrupted because you

1646
01:32:25,100 --> 01:32:29,801
clogged a channel. Even if you want to

1647
01:32:30,100 --> 01:32:31,100
do anything you should remove the

1648
01:32:31,100 --> 01:32:32,100
cattails because you increase the flow

1649
01:32:32,100 --> 01:32:35,100
capacity of the drainage line. What we

1650
01:32:35,100 --> 01:32:38,100
are trying to do is say how is best to

1651
01:32:38,100 --> 01:32:40,401
incorporate whatever conservation we

1652
01:32:41,100 --> 01:32:43,100
can which is important no question

1653
01:32:43,100 --> 01:32:47,201
about it this area has been converted

1654
01:32:48,100 --> 01:32:49,100
to residential subdivision. What seems

1655
01:32:49,100 --> 01:32:53,201
to be more important now even expressed

1656
01:32:54,100 --> 01:32:58,100
by the complainant is there could be a

1657
01:32:58,100 --> 01:32:59,100
potential drainage issue. It's not

1658
01:32:59,100 --> 01:33:02,601
because there was a slight depression

1659
01:33:03,100 --> 01:33:04,100
on the zhang property. That slight

1660
01:33:04,100 --> 01:33:06,100
depression probably didn't do a whole

1661
01:33:06,100 --> 01:33:08,100
heck of a lot. But what is the problem

1662
01:33:08,100 --> 01:33:12,201
is they started getting dumped on, you

1663
01:33:13,100 --> 01:33:17,100
had a very small in size and ditch that

1664
01:33:17,100 --> 01:33:21,201
went over top anyway. So these guys

1665
01:33:24,100 --> 01:33:25,100
figured I will do what they are doing

1666
01:33:25,100 --> 01:33:26,100
because the drainage will flood my

1667
01:33:26,100 --> 01:33:27,100
property so I will do this they did it

1668
01:33:27,100 --> 01:33:28,100
wrong they should've talk to somebody

1669
01:33:28,100 --> 01:33:30,100
first. After the whole thing happen

1670
01:33:30,100 --> 01:33:31,100
they said can you help us and that's

1671
01:33:31,100 --> 01:33:35,100
what we are trying to do. How to best

1672
01:33:35,100 --> 01:33:36,100
solve the problem. We believe rather

1673
01:33:36,100 --> 01:33:38,100
than restore an area to some riparian

1674
01:33:38,100 --> 01:33:42,100
which is and even accurate, much more

1675
01:33:42,100 --> 01:33:45,601
on the streamside for habitat, we

1676
01:33:49,100 --> 01:33:50,100
believe the best function and use as a

1677
01:33:50,100 --> 01:33:53,100
drainage easement to protect the

1678
01:33:53,100 --> 01:33:57,100
properties. What we are trying to do is

1679
01:33:57,100 --> 01:34:00,601
request a map modification and turn

1680
01:34:03,100 --> 01:34:06,100
this archaic artifact into a much more

1681
01:34:06,100 --> 01:34:08,401
functional [indiscernible] and that

1682
01:34:10,100 --> 01:34:11,100
drainage easement serves not just their

1683
01:34:11,100 --> 01:34:13,100
property but everybody upstream and

1684
01:34:13,100 --> 01:34:16,100
surrounding. Ultimately that's going to

1685
01:34:16,100 --> 01:34:20,100
draw the county in to redesign the

1686
01:34:20,100 --> 01:34:23,601
drainage in the subdivision. That's an

1687
01:34:24,100 --> 01:34:25,100
important thing and maybe this is a

1688
01:34:25,100 --> 01:34:26,100
good thing that forces the county to do

1689
01:34:26,100 --> 01:34:27,100
that but at least this is a beginning.

1690
01:34:27,100 --> 01:34:30,601
we expanded the capacity of the

1691
01:34:31,100 --> 01:34:33,100
channel. We remove the obstructions so

1692
01:34:33,100 --> 01:34:37,100
at least it will conduct more water than

1693
01:34:37,100 --> 01:34:40,100
a four foot deep by two foot wide

1694
01:34:40,100 --> 01:34:44,100
ditch. It will clog with the cattails.

1695
01:34:44,100 --> 01:34:48,100
we are trying to piece by piece improve

1696
01:34:48,100 --> 01:34:50,100
the drainage. The first step is to turn

1697
01:34:50,100 --> 01:34:54,100
it into what it is which is drainage.

1698
01:34:54,100 --> 01:34:58,100
we can plant plants around it and make

1699
01:34:58,100 --> 01:35:01,100
it beautiful and that's a good idea but

1700
01:35:01,100 --> 01:35:02,100
the most important thing is how does it

1701
01:35:02,100 --> 01:35:04,100
function as drainage for the

1702
01:35:04,100 --> 01:35:06,401
surrounding properties because in 2018

1703
01:35:07,100 --> 01:35:10,100
storm event and these people are going

1704
01:35:10,100 --> 01:35:13,100
to be flooded out because they don't

1705
01:35:13,100 --> 01:35:16,100
have adequate drainage. They are trying

1706
01:35:16,100 --> 01:35:17,100
to start the process to get better

1707
01:35:17,100 --> 01:35:19,100
drainage but now we have to go to

1708
01:35:19,100 --> 01:35:20,100
[indiscernible] that's why we are

1709
01:35:20,100 --> 01:35:21,100
requesting this change

1710
01:35:21,100 --> 01:35:25,100
>> a couple of questions. You use we a

1711
01:35:25,100 --> 01:35:29,201
lot. Are you involved in designing the

1712
01:35:30,100 --> 01:35:31,100
zhang? Did you have any clue what they

1713
01:35:31,100 --> 01:35:33,100
are doing?

1714
01:35:33,100 --> 01:35:34,100
>> no

1715
01:35:34,100 --> 01:35:38,801
>> so it's not we it's of them. You

1716
01:35:43,100 --> 01:35:44,100
were hired after the fact to explain to

1717
01:35:44,100 --> 01:35:45,100
us [indiscernible]

1718
01:35:45,100 --> 01:35:46,100
>> yes

1719
01:35:46,100 --> 01:35:49,100
>> are the professionals at hydrology?

1720
01:35:51,100 --> 01:35:53,100
>> not to my knowledge

1721
01:35:53,100 --> 01:35:55,100
>> thank you

1722
01:35:56,100 --> 01:36:00,201
>> one of the things that puzzles me

1723
01:36:02,100 --> 01:36:06,201
it's listed as open space riparian. Not

1724
01:36:09,100 --> 01:36:10,100
just riparian. What's being talked

1725
01:36:10,100 --> 01:36:14,100
about here is just riparian. If you

1726
01:36:14,100 --> 01:36:18,801
could come up with a solution on this

1727
01:36:20,100 --> 01:36:24,801
then why change this to just a drainage?

1728
01:36:26,100 --> 01:36:27,100
>> that would be totally fine with us

1729
01:36:27,100 --> 01:36:30,100
we were just coming up with the

1730
01:36:30,100 --> 01:36:34,100
proposal. We were given this option by

1731
01:36:34,100 --> 01:36:35,100
the planning department literally. They

1732
01:36:35,100 --> 01:36:37,100
told us look at lot 17 and follow what

1733
01:36:37,100 --> 01:36:39,100
they did. So that's why we came here

1734
01:36:39,100 --> 01:36:43,100
today. But we are happy to modify the

1735
01:36:43,100 --> 01:36:45,100
area to a more appropriately fit what

1736
01:36:45,100 --> 01:36:49,100
the original intent was from open space

1737
01:36:49,100 --> 01:36:53,201
no problem. We just don't think the

1738
01:36:55,100 --> 01:36:56,100
zhang should be the only ones facing

1739
01:36:56,100 --> 01:36:57,100
ramifications from their efforts

1740
01:36:57,100 --> 01:36:58,100
because the other property owners did

1741
01:36:58,100 --> 01:36:59,100
the same thing

1742
01:36:59,100 --> 01:37:01,100
>> I don't believe there's a lot of

1743
01:37:01,100 --> 01:37:04,100
ecological value to a riparian habitat

1744
01:37:04,100 --> 01:37:05,100
at this location

1745
01:37:05,100 --> 01:37:09,201
>> in the original plan it was called

1746
01:37:12,100 --> 01:37:13,100
open space

1747
01:37:13,100 --> 01:37:14,100
>> sure and you can incorporate open

1748
01:37:14,100 --> 01:37:16,100
space into a drainage

1749
01:37:16,100 --> 01:37:19,601
>> reduce that to a 10 foot wide

1750
01:37:22,100 --> 01:37:23,100
[indiscernible]

1751
01:37:23,100 --> 01:37:25,100
>> our understanding from county staff

1752
01:37:25,100 --> 01:37:29,801
was we have two options. Pursue a map

1753
01:37:31,100 --> 01:37:34,100
modification or propose a restoration

1754
01:37:35,100 --> 01:37:40,100
of the area. The question is if we went

1755
01:37:40,100 --> 01:37:41,100
with the restoration option meaning

1756
01:37:41,100 --> 01:37:42,100
turning it into pre-disturbance

1757
01:37:42,100 --> 01:37:43,100
conditions as they pointed out in the

1758
01:37:43,100 --> 01:37:46,601
slide, what is that condition because

1759
01:37:49,100 --> 01:37:50,100
we are showing an aerial from 2020 that

1760
01:37:50,100 --> 01:37:51,100
has an insights channel 4 feet deep and

1761
01:37:51,100 --> 01:37:55,201
two feet wide. Is that the remedy?

1762
01:37:56,100 --> 01:37:59,601
otherwise the zhang don't have control

1763
01:38:00,100 --> 01:38:03,100
on anybody else's property. We are just

1764
01:38:03,100 --> 01:38:04,100
trying to figure out a path forward

1765
01:38:04,100 --> 01:38:05,100
>> you can easily incorporate open

1766
01:38:05,100 --> 01:38:06,100
space into a drainage easement

1767
01:38:06,100 --> 01:38:07,100
>> [indiscernible] 35 feet

1768
01:38:07,100 --> 01:38:10,100
>> that encumbers anybody on the

1769
01:38:20,100 --> 01:38:21,100
property

1770
01:38:21,100 --> 01:38:22,100
>> they want the property with a 75

1771
01:38:22,100 --> 01:38:24,100
foot easement

1772
01:38:24,100 --> 01:38:25,100
>> we understand that

1773
01:38:25,100 --> 01:38:29,201
>> at any rate that's one thought. As

1774
01:38:30,100 --> 01:38:33,100
far as restoration I guess that's a

1775
01:38:33,100 --> 01:38:36,100
challenge. Cannot be met somehow

1776
01:38:36,100 --> 01:38:40,100
>> sure it can. We are asking for a

1777
01:38:40,100 --> 01:38:43,100
hybrid solution. Turn it into primarily

1778
01:38:43,100 --> 01:38:46,100
a drainage easement and then we will

1779
01:38:46,100 --> 01:38:48,100
landscape around it, make sure it has

1780
01:38:48,100 --> 01:38:51,601
native characteristic, we will do that

1781
01:38:52,100 --> 01:38:55,100
kind of thing. You want to put

1782
01:38:55,100 --> 01:38:56,100
elderberries, that's fine. But the

1783
01:38:56,100 --> 01:38:59,100
important thing is so it functions.

1784
01:38:59,100 --> 01:39:02,100
because it will not function as a

1785
01:39:02,100 --> 01:39:05,100
riparian habitat it won't I'm telling

1786
01:39:05,100 --> 01:39:06,100
you it won't

1787
01:39:06,100 --> 01:39:09,100
>> this is a bit of a debate I admit

1788
01:39:09,100 --> 01:39:10,100
that

1789
01:39:10,100 --> 01:39:13,100
>> I'm not debating with you

1790
01:39:13,100 --> 01:39:16,601
[indiscernible] we continue to hear we.

1791
01:39:17,100 --> 01:39:22,401
but this was done by people and not you.

1792
01:39:23,100 --> 01:39:24,100
>> that's correct

1793
01:39:24,100 --> 01:39:27,601
>> this is a county responsibility. The

1794
01:39:34,100 --> 01:39:35,100
drainage is not adequate here than it's

1795
01:39:35,100 --> 01:39:36,100
a county responsibility not the

1796
01:39:36,100 --> 01:39:37,100
responsibility of the zhang to solve

1797
01:39:37,100 --> 01:39:38,100
the problem is the counties

1798
01:39:38,100 --> 01:39:39,100
responsibility. It's not about we it's

1799
01:39:39,100 --> 01:39:42,100
about this issue. You were involved in

1800
01:39:42,100 --> 01:39:43,100
this. You are not coming in after the

1801
01:39:43,100 --> 01:39:47,100
fact hired by the zhang to make their

1802
01:39:47,100 --> 01:39:49,100
case. [indiscernible]

1803
01:39:52,100 --> 01:39:55,100
>> do you agree it was historically a

1804
01:39:55,100 --> 01:39:56,100
riparian area?

1805
01:39:56,100 --> 01:39:59,100
>> I would say prior to the initial

1806
01:39:59,100 --> 01:40:03,100
development. It was a scrub area. When

1807
01:40:03,100 --> 01:40:06,601
you think riparian you think cottonwood

1808
01:40:07,100 --> 01:40:10,601
trees. There's a scrub riparian where

1809
01:40:13,100 --> 01:40:14,100
there's the occasional oak bush and the

1810
01:40:14,100 --> 01:40:15,100
occasional elderberry bush along a

1811
01:40:15,100 --> 01:40:18,100
watercourse. That could be called

1812
01:40:21,100 --> 01:40:22,100
riparian.

1813
01:40:22,100 --> 01:40:24,100
>> thank you

1814
01:40:24,100 --> 01:40:27,601
>> are there any other questions? A

1815
01:40:30,100 --> 01:40:32,100
couple questions for staff

1816
01:40:32,100 --> 01:40:36,201
>> I do want to note candace with

1817
01:40:38,100 --> 01:40:39,100
engineering and surveying is here as

1818
01:40:39,100 --> 01:40:41,100
well so if you have questions about the

1819
01:40:41,100 --> 01:40:42,100
preconstruction drainage conditions she

1820
01:40:42,100 --> 01:40:43,100
can provide information

1821
01:40:43,100 --> 01:40:45,401
>> perhaps [indiscernible] I'm curious

1822
01:40:51,100 --> 01:40:52,100
about whether or night there might be

1823
01:40:52,100 --> 01:40:54,100
value in examining the area. It does

1824
01:40:54,100 --> 01:40:57,100
appear to be some concern from the

1825
01:40:57,100 --> 01:41:01,201
applicant and the plaintiff in the back

1826
01:41:03,100 --> 01:41:05,100
of the room, regarding the drainage in

1827
01:41:05,100 --> 01:41:06,100
the area there's value in going out and

1828
01:41:06,100 --> 01:41:08,100
evaluating that is the county

1829
01:41:08,100 --> 01:41:10,100
>> perhaps. An candace if you want to

1830
01:41:10,100 --> 01:41:11,100
speak to drainage?

1831
01:41:11,100 --> 01:41:14,601
>> good morning. With this project, the

1832
01:41:23,100 --> 01:41:26,100
drainage analysis was provided. It did

1833
01:41:26,100 --> 01:41:28,401
not identify significant preproject

1834
01:41:30,100 --> 01:41:33,601
condition. It identified the swale was

1835
01:41:36,100 --> 01:41:37,100
constructed undersized so the proposal

1836
01:41:37,100 --> 01:41:40,100
was to reconstruct it larger to

1837
01:41:40,100 --> 01:41:43,100
facilitate flows. If there was on-site

1838
01:41:43,100 --> 01:41:44,100
drainage problems, that would be

1839
01:41:44,100 --> 01:41:46,100
something that zhang could apply for

1840
01:41:46,100 --> 01:41:49,601
grading permit to resize their on-site

1841
01:41:50,100 --> 01:41:52,401
drainage. [indiscernible] to correct

1842
01:41:55,100 --> 01:41:58,100
those issues on-site. It wouldn't

1843
01:41:58,100 --> 01:41:59,100
necessarily be the county

1844
01:41:59,100 --> 01:42:02,100
responsibility we would just help

1845
01:42:02,100 --> 01:42:03,100
facilitate the grading process to size

1846
01:42:03,100 --> 01:42:07,100
it appropriately and we would do the

1847
01:42:07,100 --> 01:42:08,100
calculations

1848
01:42:08,100 --> 01:42:11,100
>> [indiscernible] I'm still, we are

1849
01:42:12,100 --> 01:42:15,601
talking about a drainage easement, a 75

1850
01:42:19,100 --> 01:42:20,100
foot open space easement. That's kind

1851
01:42:20,100 --> 01:42:22,100
of one issue I'm thinking about. And

1852
01:42:22,100 --> 01:42:26,100
then we are talking about how do we fix

1853
01:42:26,100 --> 01:42:27,100
the problem. It seems like to fix the

1854
01:42:27,100 --> 01:42:30,100
problem with open space easement as

1855
01:42:30,100 --> 01:42:33,100
well as what they have now. Are there

1856
01:42:33,100 --> 01:42:36,601
other options available to fix the

1857
01:42:39,100 --> 01:42:40,100
problem?

1858
01:42:40,100 --> 01:42:43,601
>> apart from the riparian open space

1859
01:42:47,100 --> 01:42:48,100
restrictions on construction in the

1860
01:42:48,100 --> 01:42:49,100
areas purely from the grading permit

1861
01:42:49,100 --> 01:42:50,100
and easement perspective there are

1862
01:42:50,100 --> 01:42:51,100
options they could've applied for

1863
01:42:51,100 --> 01:42:54,100
grading permit to reconstruct or

1864
01:42:57,100 --> 01:42:58,100
reconfigure the drainage on their

1865
01:42:58,100 --> 01:42:59,100
property apart from open space

1866
01:42:59,100 --> 01:43:00,100
>> I guess what you are talking about

1867
01:43:00,100 --> 01:43:04,100
is they could do some engineering and

1868
01:43:04,100 --> 01:43:05,100
some biological evaluations can come to

1869
01:43:05,100 --> 01:43:07,100
the county with a solution

1870
01:43:07,100 --> 01:43:10,100
>> that you could look at

1871
01:43:14,100 --> 01:43:15,100
>> yes with this project it's going

1872
01:43:15,100 --> 01:43:16,100
through environmental review when it

1873
01:43:16,100 --> 01:43:20,801
went for approval. We ask for a revised

1874
01:43:26,100 --> 01:43:27,100
to analyze off-site downstream impacts

1875
01:43:27,100 --> 01:43:28,100
because it would be less pervious so

1876
01:43:28,100 --> 01:43:29,100
would affect downstream facilities to

1877
01:43:29,100 --> 01:43:31,100
make sure everything is sized

1878
01:43:31,100 --> 01:43:34,100
appropriately. That would be something

1879
01:43:34,100 --> 01:43:35,100
we would review with improvement plans

1880
01:43:35,100 --> 01:43:36,100
and drainage analysis to make sure it

1881
01:43:36,100 --> 01:43:37,100
functions appropriately

1882
01:43:37,100 --> 01:43:38,100
>> so they could meet with you and get

1883
01:43:38,100 --> 01:43:42,801
an idea of what criteria they should be

1884
01:43:43,100 --> 01:43:44,100
evaluating

1885
01:43:44,100 --> 01:43:47,601
>> yes there is an approval process

1886
01:43:49,100 --> 01:43:50,100
drainage outside of the open space

1887
01:43:50,100 --> 01:43:53,100
riparian restrictions on the lot

1888
01:43:55,100 --> 01:43:56,100
>> okay thank you

1889
01:43:56,100 --> 01:43:59,601
>> does the drainage area outside of

1890
01:44:00,100 --> 01:44:04,100
the riparian area, is it restricted by

1891
01:44:04,100 --> 01:44:08,100
anything? Is it the same size of the

1892
01:44:08,100 --> 01:44:09,100
riparian area two feet wide three feet

1893
01:44:09,100 --> 01:44:13,100
I don't know what the dimensions are.

1894
01:44:13,100 --> 01:44:17,100
does that get backed up there if the

1895
01:44:17,100 --> 01:44:20,601
riparian area is brought back to

1896
01:44:23,100 --> 01:44:27,100
standards? I'm trying to think is that

1897
01:44:27,100 --> 01:44:30,100
really going to be big enough is the

1898
01:44:30,100 --> 01:44:31,100
drainage area adequate [indiscernible]

1899
01:44:31,100 --> 01:44:36,401
on to the zhang property and on to lot

1900
01:44:37,100 --> 01:44:38,100
19 as well

1901
01:44:38,100 --> 01:44:41,100
>> I'm not familiar with the specific

1902
01:44:41,100 --> 01:44:44,601
off-site conditions. I know with this

1903
01:44:49,100 --> 01:44:50,100
project when they provided drainage and

1904
01:44:50,100 --> 01:44:51,100
alice they provided area for off-site

1905
01:44:51,100 --> 01:44:52,100
coming on site it was not large enough

1906
01:44:52,100 --> 01:44:53,100
to encompass off-site flows

1907
01:44:53,100 --> 01:44:54,100
[indiscernible] sized appropriately for

1908
01:44:54,100 --> 01:44:57,601
all off-site flows coming to the

1909
01:44:59,100 --> 01:45:01,100
project.

1910
01:45:04,100 --> 01:45:05,100
>> it looks like there was a depression

1911
01:45:05,100 --> 01:45:07,100
before hand where maybe there was a

1912
01:45:07,100 --> 01:45:09,100
raised garden bed. Did you evaluate

1913
01:45:09,100 --> 01:45:10,100
that?

1914
01:45:10,100 --> 01:45:14,100
>> from the looks of it it looked to me

1915
01:45:14,100 --> 01:45:16,100
like there was a shallow depression

1916
01:45:16,100 --> 01:45:19,100
across part of the open space easement.

1917
01:45:19,100 --> 01:45:22,100
it was kind of overland flow but

1918
01:45:22,100 --> 01:45:25,100
channelized because of the depression.

1919
01:45:26,100 --> 01:45:28,100
I'm not sure if the flow is reached

1920
01:45:28,100 --> 01:45:31,601
where their current planter boxes are

1921
01:45:32,100 --> 01:45:35,100
>> expectation of retention for this

1922
01:45:35,100 --> 01:45:37,100
property?

1923
01:45:41,100 --> 01:45:42,100
>> there is some assumed detention

1924
01:45:42,100 --> 01:45:43,100
because it's natural vegetated state

1925
01:45:43,100 --> 01:45:45,100
versus rock line ditch which would have

1926
01:45:45,100 --> 01:45:46,100
less detention. They could design grass

1927
01:45:46,100 --> 01:45:50,100
line swale instead of rock line ditch,

1928
01:45:50,100 --> 01:45:51,100
that was part of the proposal

1929
01:45:51,100 --> 01:45:55,201
>> it safe to assume the changes made

1930
01:45:56,100 --> 01:46:00,100
on this property will affect the water

1931
01:46:00,100 --> 01:46:01,100
flows?

1932
01:46:01,100 --> 01:46:04,100
>> yes and designs can incorporate

1933
01:46:05,100 --> 01:46:06,100
remedies to that

1934
01:46:06,100 --> 01:46:07,100
>> if it would have contacted before

1935
01:46:07,100 --> 01:46:10,601
hand that could've been figured out?

1936
01:46:21,100 --> 01:46:22,100
>> yes apart from the restrictions are

1937
01:46:22,100 --> 01:46:23,100
construction in this area a grading

1938
01:46:23,100 --> 01:46:24,100
permit needs to be obtained to modify

1939
01:46:24,100 --> 01:46:25,100
drainage on-site

1940
01:46:25,100 --> 01:46:26,100
>> thank you

1941
01:46:26,100 --> 01:46:27,100
>> if they removed the cattails which

1942
01:46:27,100 --> 01:46:28,100
grow wild, I've taken out thousands of

1943
01:46:28,100 --> 01:46:32,100
them myself to have better water flow,

1944
01:46:32,100 --> 01:46:33,100
they would be a problem for water flow

1945
01:46:33,100 --> 01:46:37,100
to have cattails in there it would be

1946
01:46:37,100 --> 01:46:40,601
restricted so by them removing the

1947
01:46:41,100 --> 01:46:44,601
cattails it would benefit all their

1948
01:46:45,100 --> 01:46:46,100
neighbors to let water flow because if

1949
01:46:46,100 --> 01:46:47,100
you stick a tree in the middle of the

1950
01:46:47,100 --> 01:46:49,100
canal you will have disturbance if you

1951
01:46:49,100 --> 01:46:52,100
pull it out water will flow easier and

1952
01:46:52,100 --> 01:46:53,100
get out

1953
01:46:53,100 --> 01:46:57,201
>> I'm not sure on how much cattails

1954
01:46:58,100 --> 01:47:01,100
restrict flows but I guess there could

1955
01:47:01,100 --> 01:47:02,100
be benefits of sewing with water

1956
01:47:02,100 --> 01:47:05,100
flowing downstream facilities by having

1957
01:47:07,100 --> 01:47:10,601
bigger response times and water moving

1958
01:47:11,100 --> 01:47:12,100
quicker

1959
01:47:12,100 --> 01:47:15,601
>> but if it's all rock [indiscernible]

1960
01:47:18,100 --> 01:47:19,100
from what I see here it's all rock with

1961
01:47:19,100 --> 01:47:23,100
underground pipes in some areas. So I

1962
01:47:23,100 --> 01:47:26,100
don't think you erosion [indiscernible]

1963
01:47:26,100 --> 01:47:27,100
[speaker off mic] thank you for all

1964
01:47:27,100 --> 01:47:28,100
that I appreciate it

1965
01:47:28,100 --> 01:47:32,201
>> I have one more question for you.

1966
01:47:38,100 --> 01:47:41,100
you said there are, the first slide you

1967
01:47:41,100 --> 01:47:43,100
put up with the whole breakdown which

1968
01:47:43,100 --> 01:47:45,100
was an excellent slide of what's

1969
01:47:45,100 --> 01:47:48,100
involved in this particular subdivision.

1970
01:47:50,100 --> 01:47:53,601
the restrictions and that sort of

1971
01:47:54,100 --> 01:47:55,100
thing for this area. This is found in

1972
01:47:55,100 --> 01:47:57,100
multiple areas across the county is

1973
01:47:57,100 --> 01:48:01,201
that true? That is absolutely true. So

1974
01:48:03,100 --> 01:48:06,100
would you agree that although each case

1975
01:48:06,100 --> 01:48:09,100
would have to be considered separately

1976
01:48:09,100 --> 01:48:10,100
in terms of situation, if in fact we

1977
01:48:10,100 --> 01:48:14,801
were to permit this to go forward, with

1978
01:48:15,100 --> 01:48:16,100
that not be precedent-setting in that

1979
01:48:16,100 --> 01:48:18,100
we are allowing this violation to take

1980
01:48:18,100 --> 01:48:19,100
place when proper permits are not

1981
01:48:19,100 --> 01:48:23,100
granted in the first place. In other

1982
01:48:23,100 --> 01:48:24,100
words you could theoretically say to

1983
01:48:24,100 --> 01:48:27,601
the rest of the neighbors, this

1984
01:48:28,100 --> 01:48:31,100
violation took place, the commission

1985
01:48:32,100 --> 01:48:36,100
approved it, so everybody else can do

1986
01:48:36,100 --> 01:48:37,100
what they choose to do as well

1987
01:48:37,100 --> 01:48:40,100
>> I would agree it is

1988
01:48:41,100 --> 01:48:43,401
precedent-setting. There are multiple

1989
01:48:45,100 --> 01:48:46,100
subdivisions that have these open space

1990
01:48:46,100 --> 01:48:47,100
riparian protection easements or

1991
01:48:47,100 --> 01:48:48,100
similar easements with that language

1992
01:48:48,100 --> 01:48:50,100
that you can't do any kind of work

1993
01:48:50,100 --> 01:48:53,601
within it landscaping you can't put

1994
01:48:57,100 --> 01:48:58,100
clippings in the easements. That

1995
01:48:58,100 --> 01:49:01,100
language is found in multiple

1996
01:49:01,100 --> 01:49:02,100
subdivisions. When someone wants to

1997
01:49:02,100 --> 01:49:06,100
modify the easement or do work in

1998
01:49:06,100 --> 01:49:07,100
easement, they have to come to the

1999
01:49:07,100 --> 01:49:10,601
county to get written permission from

2000
01:49:11,100 --> 01:49:15,801
the drc. For example, if there is an

2001
01:49:18,100 --> 01:49:19,100
open space area managed by an hoa and

2002
01:49:19,100 --> 01:49:20,100
they want to do vegetation management

2003
01:49:20,100 --> 01:49:24,100
for fire safety, they get a tree permit

2004
01:49:24,100 --> 01:49:27,100
from the county we may require

2005
01:49:27,100 --> 01:49:28,100
biological assessment and ensure the

2006
01:49:28,100 --> 01:49:29,100
work is done in an appropriate manner.

2007
01:49:29,100 --> 01:49:32,601
it could be precedent-setting yes if

2008
01:49:33,100 --> 01:49:36,601
someone is removing habitat or resource

2009
01:49:41,100 --> 01:49:42,100
the subject of the easement and then

2010
01:49:42,100 --> 01:49:43,100
request the easement to be eliminated

2011
01:49:43,100 --> 01:49:45,100
using a lack of resource as

2012
01:49:45,100 --> 01:49:46,100
justification.

2013
01:49:46,100 --> 01:49:47,100
>> thank you

2014
01:49:47,100 --> 01:49:51,801
>> if I can just add to that. Whether

2015
01:49:52,100 --> 01:49:56,100
or not there's an easement there there

2016
01:49:56,100 --> 01:50:00,100
is a process to fix any drainage issues

2017
01:50:00,100 --> 01:50:02,100
or concerns conditions of approval are

2018
01:50:02,100 --> 01:50:05,601
written where you can ask permission.

2019
01:50:07,100 --> 01:50:08,100
and make those adjustments necessary

2020
01:50:08,100 --> 01:50:12,201
the first issue for the commission is

2021
01:50:13,100 --> 01:50:14,100
we have a recorded open space riparian

2022
01:50:14,100 --> 01:50:17,100
easement on a subdivision map. Every

2023
01:50:17,100 --> 01:50:20,100
property owner around there should be

2024
01:50:20,100 --> 01:50:21,100
aware of that even the neighboring

2025
01:50:21,100 --> 01:50:24,100
property when they bought their

2026
01:50:26,100 --> 01:50:29,100
property, they were aware there's open

2027
01:50:29,100 --> 01:50:31,100
space riparian area. The first question

2028
01:50:31,100 --> 01:50:35,201
to be answered, is the commission okay

2029
01:50:36,100 --> 01:50:38,100
suggesting the easement based on the

2030
01:50:38,100 --> 01:50:40,100
work unauthorized work that's been in

2031
01:50:40,100 --> 01:50:43,601
there. If there's a drainage issue,

2032
01:50:47,100 --> 01:50:48,100
there's a mechanism to get that

2033
01:50:48,100 --> 01:50:49,100
addressed even if the open space

2034
01:50:49,100 --> 01:50:51,100
riparian easement stays in place. If

2035
01:50:51,100 --> 01:50:54,601
it's reduce the open space riparian

2036
01:50:58,100 --> 01:51:00,100
easement. That will allow for other

2037
01:51:00,100 --> 01:51:01,100
improvements it looks like the zhang

2038
01:51:01,100 --> 01:51:02,100
already put in garden boxes and other

2039
01:51:02,100 --> 01:51:05,601
things in that easement area. They

2040
01:51:07,100 --> 01:51:08,100
could potentially put a structure in

2041
01:51:08,100 --> 01:51:09,100
the area if the open space riparian

2042
01:51:09,100 --> 01:51:12,100
easement is reduced. The commission has

2043
01:51:12,100 --> 01:51:15,100
to consider that. If there are no

2044
01:51:15,100 --> 01:51:18,100
resources whatsoever and the commission

2045
01:51:18,100 --> 01:51:21,601
does want to entertain adjusting that

2046
01:51:22,100 --> 01:51:23,100
boundary, that is something the

2047
01:51:23,100 --> 01:51:27,100
commission can take a look at. If the

2048
01:51:27,100 --> 01:51:31,201
commission does go down that path, we

2049
01:51:32,100 --> 01:51:33,100
would be looking for a tentative

2050
01:51:33,100 --> 01:51:35,100
approval and staff will have to go back

2051
01:51:35,100 --> 01:51:37,100
and look from an environmental review

2052
01:51:37,100 --> 01:51:40,100
standpoint what that will require

2053
01:51:40,100 --> 01:51:43,100
before we bring something before the

2054
01:51:43,100 --> 01:51:44,100
commission. That is an option as well

2055
01:51:44,100 --> 01:51:48,201
>> thank you kally. We will move to

2056
01:51:57,100 --> 01:51:59,401
discussion. If there's more

2057
01:52:01,100 --> 01:52:02,100
clarification needed?

2058
01:52:02,100 --> 01:52:03,100
>> it's obvious to me there's a problem

2059
01:52:03,100 --> 01:52:07,801
that needs to be fixed. It's going to

2060
01:52:08,100 --> 01:52:11,100
require some biologic work, engineering

2061
01:52:15,100 --> 01:52:16,100
work. Personally, they bought the

2062
01:52:16,100 --> 01:52:20,100
property with an easement on it. I

2063
01:52:20,100 --> 01:52:21,100
think they have to look at that and

2064
01:52:21,100 --> 01:52:25,201
honor the easement they have. And doing

2065
01:52:26,100 --> 01:52:30,100
work on the drainage that needs to be

2066
01:52:30,100 --> 01:52:31,100
done. It's beyond our commission to

2067
01:52:31,100 --> 01:52:35,100
tell you what to do, it's going to take

2068
01:52:35,100 --> 01:52:39,100
some work with the county as well as

2069
01:52:39,100 --> 01:52:42,601
engineer and biologists to figure that

2070
01:52:44,100 --> 01:52:47,100
out. At any rate, I'm going to

2071
01:52:47,100 --> 01:52:50,601
recommend we follow the denial process.

2072
01:52:52,100 --> 01:52:55,601
>> kally can you put up the

2073
01:52:56,100 --> 01:52:57,100
recommendations

2074
01:52:57,100 --> 01:53:01,201
>> if we are still in discussion that's

2075
01:53:08,100 --> 01:53:11,100
okay? Or do you want a motion?

2076
01:53:11,100 --> 01:53:15,100
>> I'd like a bit of the discussion but

2077
01:53:15,100 --> 01:53:18,601
I have a degree of knowledge

2078
01:53:20,100 --> 01:53:23,100
re-creating a riparian habitat given

2079
01:53:26,100 --> 01:53:27,100
modification of adjacent properties. I

2080
01:53:27,100 --> 01:53:29,100
think the staff needs to look at

2081
01:53:29,100 --> 01:53:30,100
adjacent properties for violation, need

2082
01:53:30,100 --> 01:53:35,100
to take a look at the 9714, there is no

2083
01:53:35,100 --> 01:53:38,100
vegetation whatsoever in that easement.

2084
01:53:38,100 --> 01:53:41,100
and you have a structure within the

2085
01:53:41,100 --> 01:53:45,100
other easement. The county has to look

2086
01:53:45,100 --> 01:53:46,100
at violations. Understand the

2087
01:53:46,100 --> 01:53:48,100
properties started putting drainage and

2088
01:53:48,100 --> 01:53:49,100
so there is a drainage problem that

2089
01:53:49,100 --> 01:53:53,801
needs to be looked at. I think again

2090
01:53:54,100 --> 01:53:56,100
there was an open space easement that

2091
01:53:56,100 --> 01:53:57,100
needs to be respected

2092
01:53:57,100 --> 01:54:01,201
>> I do agree on both comments. Real

2093
01:54:07,100 --> 01:54:11,100
quick rich one thing is I do think that

2094
01:54:11,100 --> 01:54:14,100
would be appropriate for homeowner

2095
01:54:15,100 --> 01:54:18,100
association or whomever if necessary to

2096
01:54:18,100 --> 01:54:20,100
file a violation if that is the

2097
01:54:20,100 --> 01:54:24,100
mechanism to get the county involved in

2098
01:54:24,100 --> 01:54:25,100
this area.

2099
01:54:25,100 --> 01:54:26,100
>> we can't allow that to be the

2100
01:54:26,100 --> 01:54:28,100
driving force.

2101
01:54:30,100 --> 01:54:33,100
>> I agree. What they did was wrong.

2102
01:54:33,100 --> 01:54:37,801
whether they knew it or not. That needs

2103
01:54:38,100 --> 01:54:41,100
to be addressed. There is a huge

2104
01:54:41,100 --> 01:54:45,100
drainage issue and with my own personal

2105
01:54:45,100 --> 01:54:46,100
experience I drain water off of a lot

2106
01:54:46,100 --> 01:54:50,801
of acreage and I cleaned the canal, it

2107
01:54:54,100 --> 01:54:57,100
looks like from pictures it has been

2108
01:54:57,100 --> 01:54:58,100
modified in other areas. I'm not ready

2109
01:54:58,100 --> 01:55:01,100
to vote on this. I think from my

2110
01:55:01,100 --> 01:55:04,100
perspective it should be postponed

2111
01:55:04,100 --> 01:55:06,100
until we can take a better look at this

2112
01:55:06,100 --> 01:55:10,201
so this is done properly. And the

2113
01:55:15,100 --> 01:55:16,100
drainage is suitable for all these

2114
01:55:16,100 --> 01:55:17,100
houses and the zhang are not stuck with

2115
01:55:17,100 --> 01:55:21,201
the water on their property. Maybe at

2116
01:55:22,100 --> 01:55:25,100
that time the pipe put underneath lot

2117
01:55:25,100 --> 01:55:26,100
18 was big enough and sufficient enough

2118
01:55:26,100 --> 01:55:29,601
and it's not sufficient anymore you

2119
01:55:34,100 --> 01:55:35,100
have underground less penetrated water

2120
01:55:35,100 --> 01:55:36,100
and run off I don't want to see anybody

2121
01:55:36,100 --> 01:55:40,100
have any kind of flooding issues I've

2122
01:55:40,100 --> 01:55:41,100
been through 20 feet of water and I

2123
01:55:41,100 --> 01:55:42,100
don't want to feet of water in this

2124
01:55:42,100 --> 01:55:45,601
property my recommendation right now is

2125
01:55:48,100 --> 01:55:49,100
we postpone any recommendations until I

2126
01:55:49,100 --> 01:55:51,100
think we get better information on the

2127
01:55:51,100 --> 01:55:54,100
drainage and maybe an adjustment for

2128
01:55:54,100 --> 01:55:55,100
the boundaries of the open space

2129
01:55:55,100 --> 01:55:59,201
>> I think it's obvious to me there's

2130
01:56:00,100 --> 01:56:05,100
going to be had to be some work. No

2131
01:56:05,100 --> 01:56:07,100
matter what we do it's going to take

2132
01:56:07,100 --> 01:56:10,100
some work. I really can't see where

2133
01:56:10,100 --> 01:56:12,100
[indiscernible] is going to help any.

2134
01:56:12,100 --> 01:56:14,100
there's work they have to do, and they

2135
01:56:14,100 --> 01:56:19,100
need to do the work with the county. As

2136
01:56:19,100 --> 01:56:24,401
it stands right now, I make a motion we

2137
01:56:27,100 --> 01:56:28,100
go with the staff recommendation to

2138
01:56:28,100 --> 01:56:29,100
deny a map modification as supported in

2139
01:56:29,100 --> 01:56:32,601
the findings contained in the staff

2140
01:56:34,100 --> 01:56:35,100
report

2141
01:56:35,100 --> 01:56:39,201
>> still part of my complaint is water

2142
01:56:44,100 --> 01:56:48,100
flows where nothing grows and if there

2143
01:56:48,100 --> 01:56:49,100
are things growing their it will make

2144
01:56:49,100 --> 01:56:50,100
this problem for the neighbors

2145
01:56:50,100 --> 01:56:52,100
[indiscernible]

2146
01:56:52,100 --> 01:56:56,201
>> I concur this does need to be

2147
01:56:57,100 --> 01:56:58,100
studied. So I second that motion

2148
01:56:58,100 --> 01:57:00,100
>> roll call vote

2149
01:57:01,100 --> 01:57:05,801
>> quick question of ej if they were to

2150
01:57:07,100 --> 01:57:08,100
come back because right now this is

2151
01:57:08,100 --> 01:57:10,100
open space and riparian so the county

2152
01:57:10,100 --> 01:57:13,100
says you have to replace riparian I'm

2153
01:57:13,100 --> 01:57:16,601
concerned about that because I don't

2154
01:57:17,100 --> 01:57:18,100
think you can. If they came back and

2155
01:57:18,100 --> 01:57:21,100
re-address this in the future is that

2156
01:57:21,100 --> 01:57:23,100
possible?

2157
01:57:26,100 --> 01:57:27,100
>> if we deny the application

2158
01:57:27,100 --> 01:57:30,100
>> as the motion stands if this was

2159
01:57:30,100 --> 01:57:32,100
denied it would be go back to code

2160
01:57:32,100 --> 01:57:35,601
compliance and they would be required

2161
01:57:39,100 --> 01:57:40,100
restoration plans to the planning

2162
01:57:40,100 --> 01:57:42,100
division which will include review of

2163
01:57:42,100 --> 01:57:45,601
the drainage. That's one option. The

2164
01:57:46,100 --> 01:57:50,100
other option is if the commission wants

2165
01:57:50,100 --> 01:57:53,100
to give direction for us to further

2166
01:57:53,100 --> 01:57:57,100
study the drainage issue, also take a

2167
01:57:57,100 --> 01:57:59,100
look at what the restoration plan would

2168
01:57:59,100 --> 01:58:03,801
look like, we can do that as well

2169
01:58:04,100 --> 01:58:05,100
>> I suggest we do that

2170
01:58:05,100 --> 01:58:08,601
>> what I'm questioning is would that

2171
01:58:10,100 --> 01:58:13,100
happen right away? What you are talking

2172
01:58:13,100 --> 01:58:14,100
about?

2173
01:58:14,100 --> 01:58:18,201
>> if you deny it, what would be

2174
01:58:21,100 --> 01:58:22,100
happening is the open space riparian

2175
01:58:22,100 --> 01:58:23,100
easement will remain the same. What

2176
01:58:23,100 --> 01:58:27,801
goes on in the area can still be

2177
01:58:29,100 --> 01:58:30,100
resolved. But the actual boundaries of

2178
01:58:30,100 --> 01:58:33,601
the open space riparian easement will

2179
01:58:35,100 --> 01:58:39,100
remain the same. So if the commission

2180
01:58:39,100 --> 01:58:42,601
was to elect to reevaluate that

2181
01:58:43,100 --> 01:58:47,100
boundary, as well as look at the

2182
01:58:47,100 --> 01:58:48,100
restoration drainage, that is not the

2183
01:58:48,100 --> 01:58:52,100
motion on the table but that is an

2184
01:58:52,100 --> 01:58:53,100
option

2185
01:58:53,100 --> 01:58:56,601
>> what I'm questioning is with the

2186
01:58:58,100 --> 01:59:01,100
motion on the table, what would happen

2187
01:59:01,100 --> 01:59:04,100
if this would become an abatement

2188
01:59:04,100 --> 01:59:07,100
issue? Would it go back to that?

2189
01:59:07,100 --> 01:59:11,100
>> our hope would be the property owner

2190
01:59:11,100 --> 01:59:12,100
would work with the county and we would

2191
01:59:12,100 --> 01:59:15,100
get a restoration plan for the area and

2192
01:59:15,100 --> 01:59:18,100
at the same time we can address

2193
01:59:18,100 --> 01:59:19,100
drainage issues

2194
01:59:19,100 --> 01:59:23,100
>> so they would still have to do that

2195
01:59:23,100 --> 01:59:25,100
anyway

2196
01:59:27,100 --> 01:59:28,100
>> to resolve the violation, correct

2197
01:59:28,100 --> 01:59:30,100
>> it seems denial is a force of

2198
01:59:30,100 --> 01:59:31,100
function

2199
01:59:31,100 --> 01:59:35,100
>> but if they want to come back with a

2200
01:59:35,100 --> 01:59:36,100
proposal on an adjustment, we can

2201
01:59:36,100 --> 01:59:37,100
evaluate that separately

2202
01:59:37,100 --> 01:59:39,100
>> if it is denied

2203
01:59:39,100 --> 01:59:43,801
>> they would have to appeal to do an

2204
01:59:46,100 --> 01:59:48,100
adjustment on the easement. If we don't

2205
01:59:48,100 --> 01:59:52,100
deny it and let it stand, and they go

2206
01:59:52,100 --> 01:59:56,201
in a process for an application to

2207
02:00:01,100 --> 02:00:04,601
readjust that easement, without I think

2208
02:00:05,100 --> 02:00:06,100
it's too big personally.

2209
02:00:06,100 --> 02:00:07,100
>> we have a motion let's take a vote

2210
02:00:07,100 --> 02:00:08,100
>> the motion is to deny

2211
02:00:08,100 --> 02:00:11,601
>> first from mr. Johnson second from

2212
02:00:23,100 --> 02:00:26,601
mr. Woodward. Mr. Hauge yes, mr.

2213
02:00:27,100 --> 02:00:30,601
johnson yes, mr. Woodward yes mr.

2214
02:00:33,100 --> 02:00:34,100
demattei no mr. Herzog yes.

2215
02:00:34,100 --> 02:00:35,100
>> we are going to move on

2216
02:00:35,100 --> 02:00:36,100
>> the appeal language

2217
02:00:36,100 --> 02:00:39,100
>> decision of the planning commission

2218
02:00:53,100 --> 02:00:56,100
can be appealed by anyone who appeared

2219
02:00:56,100 --> 02:00:57,100
at today's hearing or anyone who

2220
02:00:57,100 --> 02:01:00,601
submitted written comments on the item

2221
02:01:04,100 --> 02:01:05,100
in appeal must be filed within 10 days

2222
02:01:05,100 --> 02:01:08,100
and shall be accompanied by filing fee

2223
02:01:08,100 --> 02:01:09,100
of $641.

2224
02:01:09,100 --> 02:01:13,801
>> now we will move on to the third

2225
02:01:16,100 --> 02:01:17,100
time the item appeal of the zoning

2226
02:01:17,100 --> 02:01:20,100
administrator denial of the sorenson

2227
02:01:21,100 --> 02:01:24,601
setback variance. Members of the public

2228
02:01:26,100 --> 02:01:27,100
may raise their hand to queue up for

2229
02:01:27,100 --> 02:01:28,100
public comment on the item which will

2230
02:01:28,100 --> 02:01:30,100
not begin until the item presentation

2231
02:01:30,100 --> 02:01:31,100
is complete. Assistant planner will

2232
02:01:31,100 --> 02:01:33,100
present the items

2233
02:01:35,100 --> 02:01:38,100
>> good morning. Good afternoon chair

2234
02:01:42,100 --> 02:01:43,100
herzog and planning commissioners. Adam

2235
02:01:43,100 --> 02:01:45,401
anderson, representing the planning

2236
02:01:47,100 --> 02:01:48,100
division. I will be presenting the

2237
02:01:48,100 --> 02:01:51,601
staff report for the sorenson appeal.

2238
02:02:01,100 --> 02:02:02,100
we are here to consider an appeal from

2239
02:02:02,100 --> 02:02:03,100
mr. Sorenson to the zoning

2240
02:02:03,100 --> 02:02:04,100
administrators denial of a variance to

2241
02:02:04,100 --> 02:02:05,100
allow an existing shop to be located

2242
02:02:05,100 --> 02:02:08,100
3.74 feet from the northern property

2243
02:02:09,100 --> 02:02:13,100
line 80 foot setback for a nine foot

2244
02:02:13,100 --> 02:02:14,100
retaining wall on the north property

2245
02:02:14,100 --> 02:02:17,601
line where a 30 foot setback is

2246
02:02:18,100 --> 02:02:21,601
required. This property is located in

2247
02:02:24,100 --> 02:02:27,100
colfax. You will see it as the red

2248
02:02:27,100 --> 02:02:30,601
highlighted property in the middle. The

2249
02:02:32,100 --> 02:02:36,201
blue line is indicating the county line

2250
02:02:37,100 --> 02:02:39,100
and also the river. The colfax general

2251
02:02:39,100 --> 02:02:43,201
plan calls for this property to be

2252
02:02:44,100 --> 02:02:48,201
split. You will see another thin line

2253
02:02:49,100 --> 02:02:52,100
that runs here. This portion of the

2254
02:02:52,100 --> 02:02:53,100
property as part of the estate 1.1 to

2255
02:02:53,100 --> 02:02:56,100
1.5 acre minimum general plan. This

2256
02:02:57,100 --> 02:03:00,100
portion of the property on the side

2257
02:03:00,100 --> 02:03:01,100
following this line up as part of a

2258
02:03:01,100 --> 02:03:04,100
special study corridor in colfax. We

2259
02:03:04,100 --> 02:03:06,100
also have ben taylor road through here

2260
02:03:06,100 --> 02:03:09,601
and that's a major thoroughfare for

2261
02:03:14,100 --> 02:03:17,100
people familiar with colfax. The blue

2262
02:03:17,100 --> 02:03:18,100
area is similarly zoned they are all

2263
02:03:18,100 --> 02:03:22,201
zoned farm with one acre minimum. The

2264
02:03:27,100 --> 02:03:28,100
yellow area is also zoned farm with 2.3

2265
02:03:28,100 --> 02:03:29,100
acre minimum the orange is residential

2266
02:03:29,100 --> 02:03:32,601
single family three acre minimum and

2267
02:03:33,100 --> 02:03:34,100
the green is timber production zone and

2268
02:03:34,100 --> 02:03:38,201
follows the area along the river. I

2269
02:03:46,100 --> 02:03:47,100
have a question maybe you could

2270
02:03:47,100 --> 02:03:50,100
elaborate on what the special study

2271
02:03:50,100 --> 02:03:51,100
area?

2272
02:03:51,100 --> 02:03:54,100
>> I have some quotes on that. In the

2273
02:03:54,100 --> 02:03:58,201
general plan for the colfax area, it

2274
02:03:59,100 --> 02:04:02,100
states careful attention for the

2275
02:04:02,100 --> 02:04:05,601
special study corridor should be given

2276
02:04:06,100 --> 02:04:07,100
to protecting the natural scenic

2277
02:04:07,100 --> 02:04:08,100
recreational resources encourage

2278
02:04:08,100 --> 02:04:09,100
limited development in the area. Some

2279
02:04:09,100 --> 02:04:12,601
part should be preserved in their

2280
02:04:13,100 --> 02:04:16,100
natural state others careful control

2281
02:04:18,100 --> 02:04:20,401
development for recreation encouraged

2282
02:04:21,100 --> 02:04:22,100
and properly control development will

2283
02:04:22,100 --> 02:04:23,100
harmonize with the natural settings and

2284
02:04:23,100 --> 02:04:26,100
attract visitors to the area. In the

2285
02:04:26,100 --> 02:04:30,100
colfax area you have this portion for

2286
02:04:30,100 --> 02:04:31,100
special study corridor, on the other

2287
02:04:31,100 --> 02:04:35,201
side of colfax where ridgeline is a

2288
02:04:36,100 --> 02:04:39,601
special study corridor. This is an

2289
02:04:41,100 --> 02:04:45,801
aerial image of the site. I wanted to

2290
02:04:48,100 --> 02:04:49,100
show this because it's important to see

2291
02:04:49,100 --> 02:04:50,100
this is the fire scar that came up from

2292
02:04:50,100 --> 02:04:53,100
the river fire. It is surrounded the

2293
02:04:53,100 --> 02:04:56,100
[indiscernible] property and burned a

2294
02:04:57,100 --> 02:05:01,201
lot of the western portion. Also burn

2295
02:05:03,100 --> 02:05:04,100
down the neighbor to the south and it

2296
02:05:04,100 --> 02:05:06,100
burned the area to the north. This

2297
02:05:06,100 --> 02:05:09,100
house remained in this house is burned,

2298
02:05:09,100 --> 02:05:14,100
so were homes down here. This is one of

2299
02:05:14,100 --> 02:05:18,100
the few homes that remained along the

2300
02:05:18,100 --> 02:05:21,601
street and the ridgeline. The site

2301
02:05:29,100 --> 02:05:31,100
itself is sloped. It is the developed

2302
02:05:31,100 --> 02:05:34,601
portions sloped at a 16 percent grade.

2303
02:05:37,100 --> 02:05:38,100
the rest of the property is sloping

2304
02:05:38,100 --> 02:05:41,100
down toward the river at a 22 percent

2305
02:05:41,100 --> 02:05:45,201
grade. Background on the site, this has

2306
02:05:52,100 --> 02:05:53,100
a history and I want to go over that

2307
02:05:53,100 --> 02:05:56,100
because it's important for where we are

2308
02:05:56,100 --> 02:05:58,100
today. The retaining wall in question

2309
02:05:58,100 --> 02:06:01,100
was constructed in 2011 without a

2310
02:06:02,100 --> 02:06:06,201
permit. And then a shop was constructed

2311
02:06:07,100 --> 02:06:10,100
in 2014 finished in 2015 without a

2312
02:06:11,100 --> 02:06:14,100
permit. The county received a complaint

2313
02:06:14,100 --> 02:06:17,100
in january 2018 for buildings without

2314
02:06:18,100 --> 02:06:21,100
permit on-site. After the fact permit

2315
02:06:21,100 --> 02:06:22,100
was issued for the site in april 2019

2316
02:06:22,100 --> 02:06:25,601
for the wall and shop. The

2317
02:06:26,100 --> 02:06:28,100
after-the-fact permit did show the

2318
02:06:28,100 --> 02:06:30,100
property line was 30 feet from the

2319
02:06:30,100 --> 02:06:34,201
retaining wall and from the shop. It

2320
02:06:35,100 --> 02:06:38,100
was only after the second complaint

2321
02:06:38,100 --> 02:06:40,000
received regarding setbacks that we

2322
02:06:40,000 --> 02:06:42,100
identified the property line was closer

2323
02:06:42,100 --> 02:06:45,100
to the structures than initially

2324
02:06:46,100 --> 02:06:47,100
believed. A survey was created in

2325
02:06:47,100 --> 02:06:49,401
september 2020 detailing the property

2326
02:06:50,100 --> 02:06:54,100
line. When we came out for a setback

2327
02:06:54,100 --> 02:06:56,401
inspection, the after-the-fact permit

2328
02:06:58,100 --> 02:07:00,100
failed in march 2021. Variance was

2329
02:07:00,100 --> 02:07:02,100
applied for and a hearing held in

2330
02:07:02,100 --> 02:07:05,601
january 22. That brings us to today.

2331
02:07:10,100 --> 02:07:15,401
this is a site plan. You can see the

2332
02:07:17,100 --> 02:07:18,100
shop is located here. This is the

2333
02:07:18,100 --> 02:07:20,100
retaining wall that stretches here. It

2334
02:07:20,100 --> 02:07:23,601
extends into the neighbors property a

2335
02:07:31,100 --> 02:07:32,100
little over four feet. We also have the

2336
02:07:32,100 --> 02:07:33,100
corner of the shop here and it's about

2337
02:07:33,100 --> 02:07:36,601
3.74 feet from the property line. This

2338
02:07:40,100 --> 02:07:41,100
is the portion of the property that is

2339
02:07:41,100 --> 02:07:44,100
16 percent slope and the rest of the

2340
02:07:44,100 --> 02:07:45,100
property is 22 percent. I will have a

2341
02:07:45,100 --> 02:07:48,601
picture later that depicts the slope

2342
02:07:49,100 --> 02:07:54,401
for you. This is from the corner of the

2343
02:07:56,100 --> 02:08:00,201
shop. This is three feet from the

2344
02:08:03,100 --> 02:08:04,100
property line starting here. This is

2345
02:08:04,100 --> 02:08:07,100
from the other portion of the property

2346
02:08:07,100 --> 02:08:10,100
line looking north along the shop. This

2347
02:08:10,100 --> 02:08:14,201
is the beginning of the retaining wall

2348
02:08:16,100 --> 02:08:18,100
and it continues. This is from the

2349
02:08:18,100 --> 02:08:21,601
north property line looking west. This

2350
02:08:22,100 --> 02:08:25,100
is a steak showing where the property

2351
02:08:25,100 --> 02:08:28,100
line is. If you take it up you continue

2352
02:08:28,100 --> 02:08:31,601
that here.. That point that little

2353
02:08:32,100 --> 02:08:36,801
orange dot is the property line for the

2354
02:08:37,100 --> 02:08:38,100
site. That shows we have a good portion

2355
02:08:38,100 --> 02:08:42,100
of the retaining wall on the site with

2356
02:08:42,100 --> 02:08:46,801
the shop being a little over three feet

2357
02:08:48,100 --> 02:08:50,100
from the property line. Lastly, this

2358
02:08:50,100 --> 02:08:55,100
shows the burn scar in the area and the

2359
02:08:55,100 --> 02:08:58,100
slope. This is the developed portion of

2360
02:08:58,100 --> 02:09:00,100
the home and this is sloping down 22

2361
02:09:00,100 --> 02:09:04,201
percent toward the river in this area.

2362
02:09:09,100 --> 02:09:13,201
a variance hearing was held on january

2363
02:09:14,100 --> 02:09:16,100
20, 2022. The appellant mr. Sorenson

2364
02:09:16,100 --> 02:09:20,100
stated he was under the initial belief

2365
02:09:20,100 --> 02:09:21,100
the shop, that since the shop did not

2366
02:09:21,100 --> 02:09:25,201
include water or power it did not

2367
02:09:26,100 --> 02:09:29,100
require a building permit. As soon as

2368
02:09:29,100 --> 02:09:30,100
he became aware of the building permit

2369
02:09:30,100 --> 02:09:31,100
being required he worked with the

2370
02:09:31,100 --> 02:09:32,100
county to bring the building into

2371
02:09:32,100 --> 02:09:35,100
compliance. The appellant requested the

2372
02:09:36,100 --> 02:09:39,100
variance so we would not lose the value

2373
02:09:39,100 --> 02:09:40,100
he put into the property at the time of

2374
02:09:40,100 --> 02:09:43,100
his submittal he did believe the

2375
02:09:43,100 --> 02:09:46,601
property line was 30 feet away from

2376
02:09:48,100 --> 02:09:49,100
where he was constructing. He did

2377
02:09:49,100 --> 02:09:52,100
receive two public comments during the

2378
02:09:52,100 --> 02:09:55,100
variance hearing. One was a verbal

2379
02:09:55,100 --> 02:09:56,100
opposition because they were concerned

2380
02:09:56,100 --> 02:10:00,100
about the safety of the retaining wall.

2381
02:10:00,100 --> 02:10:03,601
they requested the shop and retaining

2382
02:10:04,100 --> 02:10:05,100
wall be removed completely. We received

2383
02:10:05,100 --> 02:10:07,100
a second comment regarding a second

2384
02:10:07,100 --> 02:10:09,100
concern, not relevant to the variance

2385
02:10:09,100 --> 02:10:12,100
being heard. The zoning administrator

2386
02:10:12,100 --> 02:10:15,100
took action to deny the variance for

2387
02:10:15,100 --> 02:10:18,601
finding the property was uniform in

2388
02:10:19,100 --> 02:10:22,100
shape and meets the one acre minimum

2389
02:10:22,100 --> 02:10:26,100
zoning size and the shop could be

2390
02:10:26,100 --> 02:10:27,100
located in the manner that complied

2391
02:10:27,100 --> 02:10:30,100
with the setback requirements without

2392
02:10:30,100 --> 02:10:33,100
relief from the standard. The zero foot

2393
02:10:33,100 --> 02:10:34,100
setback for the retaining wall did not

2394
02:10:34,100 --> 02:10:37,100
meet the minimum departure of standard

2395
02:10:37,100 --> 02:10:40,100
requirements. Mr. Sorenson filed an

2396
02:10:44,100 --> 02:10:48,201
appeal of the decision on january 21st.

2397
02:10:53,100 --> 02:10:55,100
that appeal letter. Have three main

2398
02:10:55,100 --> 02:10:56,100
points it contended the topography of

2399
02:10:56,100 --> 02:10:57,100
the site limits buildable area and

2400
02:10:57,100 --> 02:11:00,100
required a retaining wall be built. The

2401
02:11:00,100 --> 02:11:04,100
location of the shop was necessary to

2402
02:11:04,100 --> 02:11:08,100
allow for fire access and lastly it

2403
02:11:08,100 --> 02:11:09,100
contended the construction of the shop

2404
02:11:09,100 --> 02:11:10,100
and wall was placed due to a

2405
02:11:10,100 --> 02:11:12,100
misunderstanding of where the property

2406
02:11:12,100 --> 02:11:15,100
line was located. The site is sloped.

2407
02:11:15,100 --> 02:11:18,601
the slope does not prevent development.

2408
02:11:19,100 --> 02:11:20,100
a retaining wall could have been

2409
02:11:20,100 --> 02:11:24,201
designed to meet the site setback and

2410
02:11:26,100 --> 02:11:27,100
create a path it's not uncommon for

2411
02:11:27,100 --> 02:11:30,100
these types of slopes to be constructed

2412
02:11:30,100 --> 02:11:33,601
or to have constructive retaining walls

2413
02:11:34,100 --> 02:11:38,201
to support a pad. Slope is often

2414
02:11:41,100 --> 02:11:42,100
special circumstance used to support a

2415
02:11:42,100 --> 02:11:43,100
variance however in this case the

2416
02:11:43,100 --> 02:11:44,100
zoning administrator determine the

2417
02:11:44,100 --> 02:11:47,601
property does have buildable area on

2418
02:11:51,100 --> 02:11:52,100
site and the property was not limited

2419
02:11:52,100 --> 02:11:53,100
to building site locations the area in

2420
02:11:53,100 --> 02:11:54,100
front of the retaining wall shop

2421
02:11:54,100 --> 02:11:55,100
structure toward the center of the

2422
02:11:55,100 --> 02:11:56,100
parcel, that was relatively flat and

2423
02:11:56,100 --> 02:11:59,100
could have been a building location.

2424
02:11:59,100 --> 02:12:02,601
also in regards to retaining walls,

2425
02:12:04,100 --> 02:12:06,100
retaining walls within setbacks are

2426
02:12:06,100 --> 02:12:09,100
limited to six feet and you could have

2427
02:12:09,100 --> 02:12:11,100
designed it with a stepped-up nature

2428
02:12:11,100 --> 02:12:15,201
described here where you might do six

2429
02:12:16,100 --> 02:12:17,100
feet and then step back and then

2430
02:12:17,100 --> 02:12:21,801
another three feet to get the total. If

2431
02:12:22,100 --> 02:12:23,100
you have enough distance between the

2432
02:12:23,100 --> 02:12:26,100
two we would count those as two

2433
02:12:26,100 --> 02:12:29,601
separate heights. I mentioned on the

2434
02:12:38,100 --> 02:12:40,100
previous slide there was potential

2435
02:12:40,100 --> 02:12:44,201
buildable area. This is a flat portion

2436
02:12:45,100 --> 02:12:49,201
in front of the shop constructed. This

2437
02:12:51,100 --> 02:12:54,601
is approximately the shop is 5540 area.

2438
02:12:57,100 --> 02:12:58,100
you can see there is some space here

2439
02:12:58,100 --> 02:13:01,100
where they could be meeting that 30

2440
02:13:01,100 --> 02:13:04,601
foot setback. They also made the

2441
02:13:06,100 --> 02:13:09,601
contention that the fire access was

2442
02:13:11,100 --> 02:13:12,100
necessary for the site. This area was

2443
02:13:12,100 --> 02:13:15,601
reviewed by county fire planners. They

2444
02:13:16,100 --> 02:13:18,100
determine the existing driveway in

2445
02:13:18,100 --> 02:13:21,601
hammerhead was sufficient for the fire

2446
02:13:22,100 --> 02:13:24,100
safe turnarounds. While additional fire

2447
02:13:24,100 --> 02:13:27,601
turnaround down here is appreciated, it

2448
02:13:29,100 --> 02:13:33,100
is not a requirement to go beyond the

2449
02:13:33,100 --> 02:13:36,601
minimum. Lastly the contention that the

2450
02:13:55,100 --> 02:13:56,100
construction of the shop and wall was

2451
02:13:56,100 --> 02:13:57,100
placed to a misunderstanding of where

2452
02:13:57,100 --> 02:14:00,601
the property line was located. Zoning

2453
02:14:02,100 --> 02:14:03,100
administrator did take into

2454
02:14:03,100 --> 02:14:04,100
consideration the circumstances the

2455
02:14:04,100 --> 02:14:07,100
retaining wall and shop were built. The

2456
02:14:07,100 --> 02:14:08,100
zoning administrator did not find

2457
02:14:08,100 --> 02:14:11,100
special circumstances applicable to the

2458
02:14:11,100 --> 02:14:14,100
property that included size shape

2459
02:14:16,100 --> 02:14:18,401
topography location or surroundings.

2460
02:14:19,100 --> 02:14:20,100
since a stated hardship is not a

2461
02:14:20,100 --> 02:14:22,100
finding we can take into consideration

2462
02:14:22,100 --> 02:14:26,100
when viewing the variance, there was a

2463
02:14:26,100 --> 02:14:27,100
portion of denial. The property owners

2464
02:14:27,100 --> 02:14:29,100
responsibility to know that where the

2465
02:14:29,100 --> 02:14:33,201
property lines are and depict them on

2466
02:14:34,100 --> 02:14:36,100
site plans. If the project that

2467
02:14:36,100 --> 02:14:39,100
followed the building permit process,

2468
02:14:43,100 --> 02:14:44,100
the property lines and setback issues

2469
02:14:44,100 --> 02:14:45,100
would've been addressed before

2470
02:14:45,100 --> 02:14:47,100
construction of the shop and retaining

2471
02:14:47,100 --> 02:14:50,100
wall. At that time they would've

2472
02:14:50,100 --> 02:14:53,100
qualified for a variance due to slope

2473
02:14:53,100 --> 02:14:57,100
but at this time it's not a minimum

2474
02:14:57,100 --> 02:15:00,601
departure. Based on the analysis, staff

2475
02:15:07,100 --> 02:15:08,100
recommends the planning commission

2476
02:15:08,100 --> 02:15:09,100
uphold the decision of the zoning

2477
02:15:09,100 --> 02:15:10,100
administrator to deny the variance

2478
02:15:10,100 --> 02:15:11,100
supported by findings in the staff

2479
02:15:11,100 --> 02:15:13,100
report.

2480
02:15:14,100 --> 02:15:15,100
>> thank you adam.

2481
02:15:15,100 --> 02:15:16,100
>> would question what is the size

2482
02:15:16,100 --> 02:15:19,100
limit before you have a permit? They

2483
02:15:19,100 --> 02:15:23,100
said they did not know what the size

2484
02:15:23,100 --> 02:15:25,100
limit was

2485
02:15:25,100 --> 02:15:26,100
>> in a structure that has power or

2486
02:15:26,100 --> 02:15:28,100
water over 120 square foot or over

2487
02:15:28,100 --> 02:15:29,100
eight feet in height

2488
02:15:29,100 --> 02:15:33,801
>> I have a quick question. Is it even

2489
02:15:40,100 --> 02:15:44,201
in the authority of this commission to

2490
02:15:48,100 --> 02:15:49,100
authorize any kind of structure being

2491
02:15:49,100 --> 02:15:52,100
constructed on someone else's property

2492
02:15:52,100 --> 02:15:56,201
and say that's okay? We literally have

2493
02:15:58,100 --> 02:15:59,100
a retaining wall built on somebody

2494
02:15:59,100 --> 02:16:02,100
else's property by the applicant

2495
02:16:03,100 --> 02:16:05,100
>> [indiscernible] part of this

2496
02:16:05,100 --> 02:16:08,100
variance request is to include that

2497
02:16:08,100 --> 02:16:10,100
extension onto the neighbors property

2498
02:16:10,100 --> 02:16:14,100
would have to be reengineered to be a

2499
02:16:14,100 --> 02:16:18,100
zero foot setback. We are only granting

2500
02:16:18,100 --> 02:16:21,100
a retaining wall request with a zero

2501
02:16:21,100 --> 02:16:23,100
foot setback. He's aware there is four

2502
02:16:23,100 --> 02:16:26,601
feet would need to be removed

2503
02:16:27,100 --> 02:16:28,100
>> okay thank you

2504
02:16:28,100 --> 02:16:32,201
>> I don't know the rules well enough

2505
02:16:38,100 --> 02:16:42,801
but if this was an adu, is there

2506
02:16:44,100 --> 02:16:46,100
anything that changes?

2507
02:16:47,100 --> 02:16:50,100
>> yes if this was an adu it would be

2508
02:16:50,100 --> 02:16:53,100
allowed five feet from the side

2509
02:16:53,100 --> 02:16:57,201
property line. So that would be that

2510
02:16:59,100 --> 02:17:00,100
change. However, the structure, the

2511
02:17:00,100 --> 02:17:03,100
retaining wall itself since it is over

2512
02:17:03,100 --> 02:17:04,100
height since it [indiscernible] it

2513
02:17:04,100 --> 02:17:08,100
would still not be allowed at that

2514
02:17:08,100 --> 02:17:10,100
distance. It would need to be

2515
02:17:10,100 --> 02:17:11,100
redesigned to step back or if they

2516
02:17:11,100 --> 02:17:13,100
wanted to do a nine foot wall it would

2517
02:17:13,100 --> 02:17:14,100
have to be completely [indiscernible]

2518
02:17:14,100 --> 02:17:18,801
>> with an adu they could get four feet

2519
02:17:19,100 --> 02:17:21,401
from the property line

2520
02:17:22,100 --> 02:17:26,100
>> I'm sorry, I thought it was five

2521
02:17:26,100 --> 02:17:29,100
>> does it currently have water or

2522
02:17:29,100 --> 02:17:30,100
power?

2523
02:17:30,100 --> 02:17:34,801
>> I don't believe it does. No, it does

2524
02:17:40,100 --> 02:17:41,100
not

2525
02:17:41,100 --> 02:17:42,100
>> ordinarily I would think a shop

2526
02:17:42,100 --> 02:17:45,100
would at least have power. At any rate,

2527
02:17:45,100 --> 02:17:49,201
I guess in the county, some structures

2528
02:17:51,100 --> 02:17:54,601
in the farm zones don't require

2529
02:17:56,100 --> 02:17:57,100
[indiscernible]

2530
02:17:57,100 --> 02:18:00,601
>> if this was an agricultural building,

2531
02:18:02,100 --> 02:18:05,100
it could be an exempted agricultural

2532
02:18:05,100 --> 02:18:08,601
structure from the ad commission. It

2533
02:18:10,100 --> 02:18:13,100
could also be on minimum 10 acres. It

2534
02:18:13,100 --> 02:18:17,201
would also still need to meet setbacks.

2535
02:18:19,100 --> 02:18:20,100
and agriculture exempt building does

2536
02:18:20,100 --> 02:18:21,100
not exempt setbacks

2537
02:18:21,100 --> 02:18:22,100
>> okay thank you

2538
02:18:22,100 --> 02:18:26,201
>> to be clear, can the buildings still

2539
02:18:33,100 --> 02:18:37,100
be there if the retaining wall is moved?

2540
02:18:37,100 --> 02:18:38,100
>> that's a question for an engineer

2541
02:18:38,100 --> 02:18:42,201
>> I know the applicant is working with

2542
02:18:46,100 --> 02:18:47,100
an engineer to have the retaining wall

2543
02:18:47,100 --> 02:18:49,100
redesigned so will meet the zero foot

2544
02:18:49,100 --> 02:18:53,201
requested but I don't know if that's

2545
02:18:56,100 --> 02:18:57,100
everything is possible in engineering

2546
02:18:57,100 --> 02:18:58,100
but I'm assuming not

2547
02:18:58,100 --> 02:19:01,601
>> can we have that answered question

2548
02:19:03,100 --> 02:19:04,100
or that question answered?

2549
02:19:04,100 --> 02:19:06,100
>> [indiscernible]

2550
02:19:11,100 --> 02:19:13,100
>> hello commissioners [indiscernible]

2551
02:19:14,100 --> 02:19:17,601
from engineering and serving they could

2552
02:19:18,100 --> 02:19:19,100
do it without the retaining wall but

2553
02:19:19,100 --> 02:19:20,100
they'd have to have [indiscernible]

2554
02:19:20,100 --> 02:19:21,100
saying the slope is stable

2555
02:19:21,100 --> 02:19:25,201
>> they have been working to redo the

2556
02:19:29,100 --> 02:19:32,100
retaining wall however it still going

2557
02:19:32,100 --> 02:19:34,100
to be [indiscernible]

2558
02:19:35,100 --> 02:19:37,100
>> you have to take the building down

2559
02:19:37,100 --> 02:19:39,100
to do that?

2560
02:19:40,100 --> 02:19:43,100
>> no, the engineer is redoing

2561
02:19:43,100 --> 02:19:46,100
calculations without taking it down

2562
02:19:46,100 --> 02:19:49,601
>> any other questions? Adam, how big

2563
02:19:53,100 --> 02:19:55,100
is the building?

2564
02:19:56,100 --> 02:19:58,100
>> 30 by 40.

2565
02:19:59,100 --> 02:20:00,100
>> okay thank you.

2566
02:20:00,100 --> 02:20:01,100
>> can we bring up the applicant, would

2567
02:20:01,100 --> 02:20:06,401
you like to come up, I don't know her

2568
02:20:08,100 --> 02:20:09,100
name

2569
02:20:09,100 --> 02:20:11,100
>> the applicant

2570
02:20:11,100 --> 02:20:12,100
>> her name is sue

2571
02:20:12,100 --> 02:20:15,601
>> susan sorenson. First of all I'd

2572
02:20:28,100 --> 02:20:30,100
like to say is a garage not a shop. He

2573
02:20:30,100 --> 02:20:35,100
has electric in his shop as part of the

2574
02:20:35,100 --> 02:20:38,601
house. We don't need any electric

2575
02:20:39,100 --> 02:20:43,201
attached. I just have the a statement

2576
02:20:45,100 --> 02:20:46,100
I'd like to read. I know there will be

2577
02:20:46,100 --> 02:20:50,100
repetition so I'm sorry to take up so

2578
02:20:50,100 --> 02:20:52,100
much of your time. Adam presented so

2579
02:20:52,100 --> 02:20:56,201
well and covered all the details. We

2580
02:21:03,100 --> 02:21:04,100
are making an appeal to protect our

2581
02:21:04,100 --> 02:21:05,100
investment because of the changes we

2582
02:21:05,100 --> 02:21:06,100
have made to the property clearing our

2583
02:21:06,100 --> 02:21:07,100
land for fire access and building the

2584
02:21:07,100 --> 02:21:08,100
garage in question the fire department

2585
02:21:08,100 --> 02:21:10,100
was able to save our home on all four

2586
02:21:10,100 --> 02:21:14,801
sides of us was consumed by the river

2587
02:21:15,100 --> 02:21:16,100
fire. A firefighter told us after the

2588
02:21:16,100 --> 02:21:19,100
triage of homes in the area a crew was

2589
02:21:19,100 --> 02:21:23,100
sent to our property to use it as

2590
02:21:23,100 --> 02:21:24,100
defense, the neighborhood refers to our

2591
02:21:24,100 --> 02:21:28,801
house as the one that did not burn.

2592
02:21:30,100 --> 02:21:31,100
with no intent of malice but only

2593
02:21:31,100 --> 02:21:34,100
improving the property and clearing it

2594
02:21:34,100 --> 02:21:37,601
to allow better access, we began

2595
02:21:39,100 --> 02:21:40,100
removing combustible vegetation and

2596
02:21:40,100 --> 02:21:41,100
spreading gravel for the drive which

2597
02:21:41,100 --> 02:21:44,601
required a retaining wall as the

2598
02:21:45,100 --> 02:21:48,100
property is steep we assumed a building

2599
02:21:48,100 --> 02:21:49,100
permit for the wall and outbuilding

2600
02:21:49,100 --> 02:21:52,100
structure with no electricity or

2601
02:21:53,100 --> 02:21:55,100
plumbing was not needed. The

2602
02:21:55,100 --> 02:21:56,100
construction of the retaining wall was

2603
02:21:56,100 --> 02:21:57,100
completed without permit and the help

2604
02:21:57,100 --> 02:21:58,100
of a neighbor from bordering property

2605
02:21:58,100 --> 02:22:02,100
who we hired to upgrade the tractor. At

2606
02:22:02,100 --> 02:22:06,100
that time it was not clear where the

2607
02:22:06,100 --> 02:22:07,100
property line was. None of the

2608
02:22:07,100 --> 02:22:08,100
properties in the neighborhood were

2609
02:22:08,100 --> 02:22:12,201
given information as to surveys. At the

2610
02:22:15,100 --> 02:22:18,601
point they were sold. Mr. Mantzey

2611
02:22:27,100 --> 02:22:28,100
agreed this was not an issue and we

2612
02:22:28,100 --> 02:22:29,100
have been friends with him for 30 years

2613
02:22:29,100 --> 02:22:30,100
and he has constantly used our

2614
02:22:30,100 --> 02:22:31,100
equipment for the excavation of his

2615
02:22:31,100 --> 02:22:32,100
land the adjoining six acres which were

2616
02:22:32,100 --> 02:22:35,100
almost 40 years he has used for salvage.

2617
02:22:35,100 --> 02:22:36,100
he has no residence there while we

2618
02:22:36,100 --> 02:22:37,100
were building the retaining wall he had

2619
02:22:37,100 --> 02:22:38,100
the opportunity to speak to county code

2620
02:22:38,100 --> 02:22:41,601
enforcement. And spoke favorably on our

2621
02:22:42,100 --> 02:22:43,100
behalf when the construction of the

2622
02:22:43,100 --> 02:22:46,100
garage began we were notified by the

2623
02:22:46,100 --> 02:22:49,100
county for a building permit which was

2624
02:22:49,100 --> 02:22:50,100
immediately applied for after-the-fact

2625
02:22:50,100 --> 02:22:53,100
and hired an architect to help with

2626
02:22:53,100 --> 02:22:56,601
proper planning. The architect led us

2627
02:22:57,100 --> 02:22:58,100
to believe the construction was far

2628
02:22:58,100 --> 02:22:59,100
enough from the property line and he

2629
02:22:59,100 --> 02:23:00,100
depicted as such on the permit. The

2630
02:23:00,100 --> 02:23:02,100
permit was approved by the county. The

2631
02:23:02,100 --> 02:23:05,100
discovery that four of the

2632
02:23:06,100 --> 02:23:08,401
[indiscernible] came after the

2633
02:23:10,100 --> 02:23:13,601
construction. We are working with an

2634
02:23:17,100 --> 02:23:18,100
engineer to rebuild and make sure the

2635
02:23:18,100 --> 02:23:19,100
structure does not encroach on

2636
02:23:19,100 --> 02:23:20,100
adjoining land though it isn't possible

2637
02:23:20,100 --> 02:23:21,100
for mr. Mantzey to build a structure

2638
02:23:21,100 --> 02:23:22,100
there due to public utility easement

2639
02:23:22,100 --> 02:23:25,601
rights as power lines are overhead..

2640
02:23:35,100 --> 02:23:36,100
also our garage was discovered to be

2641
02:23:36,100 --> 02:23:37,100
three feet from the property line where

2642
02:23:37,100 --> 02:23:38,100
30 feet is required we want to comply

2643
02:23:38,100 --> 02:23:39,100
with all requirements but do not want

2644
02:23:39,100 --> 02:23:40,100
to lose the investment we have put

2645
02:23:40,100 --> 02:23:42,100
toward improving our property. We've

2646
02:23:42,100 --> 02:23:43,100
never had the intent to go against

2647
02:23:43,100 --> 02:23:44,100
county laws or displease neighbors were

2648
02:23:44,100 --> 02:23:48,201
encroach on the land of others county

2649
02:23:49,100 --> 02:23:50,100
through the permitting process led us

2650
02:23:50,100 --> 02:23:53,100
to believe we were putting it in the

2651
02:23:53,100 --> 02:23:54,100
right place. This endeavor to improve

2652
02:23:54,100 --> 02:23:58,100
our land has been a costly investment.

2653
02:23:58,100 --> 02:24:00,100
>> but we wish to make it right

2654
02:24:00,100 --> 02:24:04,100
>> I have a question. The gentleman who

2655
02:24:04,100 --> 02:24:07,100
helped build this for you is the

2656
02:24:07,100 --> 02:24:10,100
neighbor and it's on his land?

2657
02:24:10,100 --> 02:24:13,100
>> the four feet of the wall

2658
02:24:13,100 --> 02:24:16,601
>> he helped build for the property?

2659
02:24:19,100 --> 02:24:21,100
>> we hired him and a tractor

2660
02:24:21,100 --> 02:24:22,100
>> okay thank you

2661
02:24:22,100 --> 02:24:26,201
>> you say the county led you to

2662
02:24:31,100 --> 02:24:34,100
believe the permitting process you were

2663
02:24:34,100 --> 02:24:35,100
doing correct

2664
02:24:35,100 --> 02:24:36,100
>> yes because at that time the

2665
02:24:36,100 --> 02:24:39,601
property line was not discovered. There

2666
02:24:40,100 --> 02:24:41,100
was no survey done until after

2667
02:24:41,100 --> 02:24:43,100
>> [speaker off mic]

2668
02:24:51,100 --> 02:24:54,100
>> the area in the colfax area are

2669
02:24:54,100 --> 02:24:57,100
generally identified on the assessors

2670
02:24:57,100 --> 02:25:00,100
map at this time. We don't have parcel

2671
02:25:00,100 --> 02:25:01,100
maps for a lot of the properties

2672
02:25:01,100 --> 02:25:04,100
because they were created prior to the

2673
02:25:04,100 --> 02:25:05,100
subdivision map. It's not uncommon for

2674
02:25:05,100 --> 02:25:08,601
us to take a property owners

2675
02:25:11,100 --> 02:25:14,100
representation as gospel until the

2676
02:25:15,100 --> 02:25:18,601
inspector goes out.. There wasn't a

2677
02:25:20,100 --> 02:25:21,100
survey property line map in our offices

2678
02:25:21,100 --> 02:25:24,100
there's only the assessors map created

2679
02:25:24,100 --> 02:25:26,100
by the assessor's office. If that

2680
02:25:26,100 --> 02:25:27,100
clarifies anything

2681
02:25:27,100 --> 02:25:29,100
>> when was the permitting process take

2682
02:25:29,100 --> 02:25:30,100
place?

2683
02:25:30,100 --> 02:25:31,100
>> that was after the initial

2684
02:25:31,100 --> 02:25:34,601
complaint, that would have been in

2685
02:25:49,100 --> 02:25:50,100
after-the-fact permits were issued in

2686
02:25:50,100 --> 02:25:51,100
april 2019

2687
02:25:51,100 --> 02:25:55,201
>> who made the complaint? Is it the

2688
02:25:56,100 --> 02:25:57,100
person that helped build the wall?

2689
02:25:57,100 --> 02:26:01,201
>> so we issued a permit in april 2019

2690
02:26:10,100 --> 02:26:12,100
for this building?

2691
02:26:12,100 --> 02:26:16,201
>> correct we issued a permit for the

2692
02:26:19,100 --> 02:26:20,100
grading permit for the retaining wall

2693
02:26:20,100 --> 02:26:21,100
and a permit for the structure

2694
02:26:21,100 --> 02:26:23,100
after-the-fact and how was depicted

2695
02:26:23,100 --> 02:26:24,100
from the property line

2696
02:26:24,100 --> 02:26:26,100
>> okay.

2697
02:26:33,100 --> 02:26:36,100
>> I did not add it in here but it has

2698
02:26:36,100 --> 02:26:37,100
this shifted up.

2699
02:26:37,100 --> 02:26:41,100
>> they did a lot line adjustment and

2700
02:26:41,100 --> 02:26:42,100
they wanted to sell a portion of the

2701
02:26:42,100 --> 02:26:45,100
property but it will be in compliance.

2702
02:26:45,100 --> 02:26:48,601
we could potentially design it for

2703
02:26:49,100 --> 02:26:50,100
that, the only concern you'd have to

2704
02:26:50,100 --> 02:26:53,100
take the full 30 feet to be the

2705
02:26:53,100 --> 02:26:56,100
retaining wall to meet the nine foot

2706
02:26:56,100 --> 02:26:59,601
requirement but that would be a

2707
02:27:01,100 --> 02:27:02,100
potential remedy. At this time I don't

2708
02:27:02,100 --> 02:27:04,100
believe the neighbors are interested in

2709
02:27:04,100 --> 02:27:05,100
that remedy

2710
02:27:05,100 --> 02:27:08,601
>> I'm thinking out loud since he

2711
02:27:10,100 --> 02:27:11,100
helped build it maybe he will sell you

2712
02:27:11,100 --> 02:27:14,100
property to help fix it

2713
02:27:16,100 --> 02:27:17,100
>> we tried that.

2714
02:27:17,100 --> 02:27:20,601
>> I'm just trying to process thank

2715
02:27:21,100 --> 02:27:22,100
you

2716
02:27:22,100 --> 02:27:26,201
>> adam, has this happened in the past

2717
02:27:27,100 --> 02:27:29,100
to your knowledge and what we have done

2718
02:27:29,100 --> 02:27:33,100
in the past when we've given a permit

2719
02:27:33,100 --> 02:27:35,401
and after-the-fact realized the

2720
02:27:36,100 --> 02:27:39,100
property line was not discovered

2721
02:27:39,100 --> 02:27:40,100
correctly. Has this been done before?

2722
02:27:40,100 --> 02:27:43,100
>> there are circumstances where we

2723
02:27:46,100 --> 02:27:49,601
have had structures built similar to

2724
02:27:50,100 --> 02:27:54,201
this. There was one recently. There was

2725
02:27:58,100 --> 02:28:00,100
the crowley variance that was heard by

2726
02:28:00,100 --> 02:28:03,100
the zoning administrator and denied.

2727
02:28:03,100 --> 02:28:06,601
also denied by your commission.. It

2728
02:28:10,100 --> 02:28:11,100
went to the board I was not the planner

2729
02:28:11,100 --> 02:28:14,100
on that so I don't know the

2730
02:28:14,100 --> 02:28:15,100
circumstances and that one. But I know

2731
02:28:15,100 --> 02:28:16,100
it was approved by the board a five

2732
02:28:16,100 --> 02:28:20,201
foot setback for a structure they built

2733
02:28:21,100 --> 02:28:22,100
and then there were existing structures

2734
02:28:22,100 --> 02:28:26,100
on the site approved with a 10 foot

2735
02:28:26,100 --> 02:28:30,201
setback. So this is not the zoning

2736
02:28:34,100 --> 02:28:35,100
administrator made his findings...

2737
02:28:35,100 --> 02:28:37,100
>> yes

2738
02:28:38,100 --> 02:28:41,601
>> adam, given the topography and the

2739
02:28:44,100 --> 02:28:45,100
adjacent neighbor appears to the north

2740
02:28:45,100 --> 02:28:48,100
how close can they build to their

2741
02:28:48,100 --> 02:28:49,100
property line?

2742
02:28:49,100 --> 02:28:52,100
>> the neighbor to the north there's a

2743
02:28:52,100 --> 02:28:55,100
30 foot setback. As mr. Sorenson noted,

2744
02:28:55,100 --> 02:28:59,801
there is a power line that runs through

2745
02:29:02,100 --> 02:29:04,100
there. I'm not sure if there is an

2746
02:29:04,100 --> 02:29:05,100
easement as described because usually

2747
02:29:05,100 --> 02:29:06,100
easements are listed on parcel maps. I

2748
02:29:06,100 --> 02:29:09,601
don't have access to those titles.

2749
02:29:12,100 --> 02:29:16,100
there is a power line that starts here

2750
02:29:16,100 --> 02:29:19,100
in the corner and stretches this way.

2751
02:29:19,100 --> 02:29:24,401
you can see a little bit of it here.

2752
02:29:27,100 --> 02:29:30,100
>> this would be the more level portion

2753
02:29:30,100 --> 02:29:33,100
of the neighboring property. It also

2754
02:29:33,100 --> 02:29:37,100
slopes down and levels out down here

2755
02:29:37,100 --> 02:29:40,601
where we had some [indiscernible] as

2756
02:29:41,100 --> 02:29:42,100
well

2757
02:29:42,100 --> 02:29:45,601
>> are there any other questions? I

2758
02:29:47,100 --> 02:29:48,100
will open it up for public comment.

2759
02:29:48,100 --> 02:29:52,801
>> thank you we will open it for public

2760
02:30:00,100 --> 02:30:01,100
comment. Is there anyone in person that

2761
02:30:01,100 --> 02:30:05,100
would like to speak? State your name

2762
02:30:05,100 --> 02:30:08,100
for the record and you have three

2763
02:30:08,100 --> 02:30:09,100
minutes

2764
02:30:09,100 --> 02:30:10,100
>> [speaker off mic]

2765
02:30:10,100 --> 02:30:13,601
>> we were friends for 25 years. I

2766
02:30:19,100 --> 02:30:22,100
helped him, a backhoe he said I could

2767
02:30:22,100 --> 02:30:25,100
borrow anytime I want. And then

2768
02:30:25,100 --> 02:30:28,601
covid-19 came and we put the

2769
02:30:30,100 --> 02:30:31,100
[indiscernible] to that. I got a friend

2770
02:30:31,100 --> 02:30:32,100
of mine that is a contractor

2771
02:30:32,100 --> 02:30:36,201
construction, he did the wall. I helped

2772
02:30:38,100 --> 02:30:42,100
him with his and paid him to do the

2773
02:30:42,100 --> 02:30:43,100
wall. They put the wing wall in all my

2774
02:30:43,100 --> 02:30:47,801
property I was not there, I was having

2775
02:30:48,100 --> 02:30:51,100
medical problems. Before the beginning,

2776
02:30:52,100 --> 02:30:57,401
I asked him to have a survey. I don't

2777
02:30:58,100 --> 02:31:00,100
need it surveyed. The top part of his

2778
02:31:00,100 --> 02:31:03,100
property and my property there is a pin

2779
02:31:03,100 --> 02:31:07,801
by the telephone pole that did with a

2780
02:31:08,100 --> 02:31:11,100
metal post on it and you can tell, we

2781
02:31:11,100 --> 02:31:13,100
are in the property line is. I asked

2782
02:31:13,100 --> 02:31:17,801
him to have it surveyed. That was a

2783
02:31:19,100 --> 02:31:23,201
denial. That's all I have to say

2784
02:31:24,100 --> 02:31:26,100
>> thank you.

2785
02:31:27,100 --> 02:31:31,801
>> this might be a little bit one of

2786
02:31:33,100 --> 02:31:36,601
the surrounding issues but not the

2787
02:31:37,100 --> 02:31:41,100
issue. A note from the property owner

2788
02:31:41,100 --> 02:31:43,100
indicates you used your property for

2789
02:31:43,100 --> 02:31:44,100
storage?

2790
02:31:44,100 --> 02:31:49,401
>> I have yes I have some old cars it

2791
02:31:50,100 --> 02:31:53,100
burned and now I'm in the process of

2792
02:31:53,100 --> 02:31:54,100
clearing everything out. I lost

2793
02:31:54,100 --> 02:31:55,100
everything on the property

2794
02:31:55,100 --> 02:31:59,801
>> okay so did you have some kind of

2795
02:32:01,100 --> 02:32:02,100
storage?

2796
02:32:02,100 --> 02:32:06,801
>> I did not everything is gone, it was

2797
02:32:10,100 --> 02:32:14,100
burnt it burned everything. I'm in the

2798
02:32:14,100 --> 02:32:15,100
process of cleaning

2799
02:32:15,100 --> 02:32:16,100
>> okay thank you

2800
02:32:16,100 --> 02:32:19,601
>> are there any other people here?

2801
02:32:25,100 --> 02:32:26,100
anyone online? We will close the public

2802
02:32:26,100 --> 02:32:30,801
comment and bring it back. We can bring

2803
02:32:32,100 --> 02:32:33,100
up staff. And have a discussion.

2804
02:32:33,100 --> 02:32:36,601
>> can you put the timeline chart

2805
02:32:47,100 --> 02:32:48,100
backup?

2806
02:32:48,100 --> 02:32:51,100
>> there was a survey september 2020.

2807
02:33:08,100 --> 02:33:12,201
[speaker off mic] and that's how we

2808
02:33:13,100 --> 02:33:15,100
determine these.

2809
02:33:18,100 --> 02:33:20,100
>> [speaker off mic]

2810
02:33:22,100 --> 02:33:25,100
>> the complaint received in 2018 was

2811
02:33:32,100 --> 02:33:33,100
only for the lack of building permit

2812
02:33:33,100 --> 02:33:36,100
for the retaining wall and the shop. It

2813
02:33:36,100 --> 02:33:39,601
was only identified the setbacks were

2814
02:33:40,100 --> 02:33:43,100
also a concern in the second complaint

2815
02:33:43,100 --> 02:33:45,100
that highlight setbacks.

2816
02:33:46,100 --> 02:33:48,401
>> after-the-fact permits, we issue

2817
02:33:49,100 --> 02:33:51,100
building permit what happens with a

2818
02:33:51,100 --> 02:33:52,100
permit is issued?

2819
02:33:52,100 --> 02:33:54,401
>> and after-the-fact permit? Usually

2820
02:33:57,100 --> 02:33:59,100
in after-the-fact permit is a customer

2821
02:33:59,100 --> 02:34:01,100
coming in and applying to the building

2822
02:34:01,100 --> 02:34:04,601
department. They provide a site plan

2823
02:34:05,100 --> 02:34:08,601
and internal diagrams of the structure.

2824
02:34:10,100 --> 02:34:13,100
they also provide letters from a

2825
02:34:13,100 --> 02:34:15,100
structural engineer, a contractor

2826
02:34:15,100 --> 02:34:17,100
electrician whatever it is for the work

2827
02:34:17,100 --> 02:34:22,401
that was done that will sign off on the

2828
02:34:23,100 --> 02:34:26,100
work in the construction. And then the

2829
02:34:26,100 --> 02:34:27,100
application goes to planning. Planning

2830
02:34:27,100 --> 02:34:30,601
reviews it for meeting setbacks and

2831
02:34:32,100 --> 02:34:36,100
then it goes to it runs the route and

2832
02:34:36,100 --> 02:34:37,100
goes through engineering serving,

2833
02:34:37,100 --> 02:34:38,100
through environmental health for

2834
02:34:38,100 --> 02:34:41,100
septic, it goes to plan check,

2835
02:34:41,100 --> 02:34:44,100
eventually gets issued to the applicant

2836
02:34:44,100 --> 02:34:48,100
>> did I hear you write that the

2837
02:34:48,100 --> 02:34:51,601
original complaint had nothing to do

2838
02:34:55,100 --> 02:34:57,100
with the setback? They thought it was

2839
02:34:57,100 --> 02:34:58,100
30 feet from the property line

2840
02:34:58,100 --> 02:35:01,100
>> the original complaint did not

2841
02:35:01,100 --> 02:35:04,100
mention the setback, it was the

2842
02:35:04,100 --> 02:35:05,100
original structure built without a

2843
02:35:05,100 --> 02:35:06,100
permit and they were concerned about

2844
02:35:06,100 --> 02:35:07,100
the safety of the wall

2845
02:35:07,100 --> 02:35:10,100
>> complaining parties are usually not

2846
02:35:13,100 --> 02:35:14,100
listed [indiscernible]

2847
02:35:14,100 --> 02:35:17,601
>> I guess I'm hearing that regardless

2848
02:35:25,100 --> 02:35:29,201
of what we determine today, one issue

2849
02:35:30,100 --> 02:35:35,401
is the wall has to be rebuilt to meet

2850
02:35:36,100 --> 02:35:37,100
the current standard

2851
02:35:37,100 --> 02:35:38,100
>> it would have to meet the zero foot

2852
02:35:38,100 --> 02:35:41,601
setback or be accepted by engineering

2853
02:35:43,100 --> 02:35:44,100
[indiscernible] standard is

2854
02:35:44,100 --> 02:35:48,201
>> the current wall does not meet that?,

2855
02:35:49,100 --> 02:35:50,100
>> it needs to be redesigned it could

2856
02:35:50,100 --> 02:35:54,201
not be on the neighbors property. The

2857
02:35:59,100 --> 02:36:00,100
setback will be shop, it could be

2858
02:36:00,100 --> 02:36:04,201
approved at that three foot if you

2859
02:36:06,100 --> 02:36:09,601
decided to but that's not the

2860
02:36:12,100 --> 02:36:13,100
application

2861
02:36:13,100 --> 02:36:14,100
>> but on their property they still

2862
02:36:14,100 --> 02:36:15,100
have to rebuild the wall

2863
02:36:15,100 --> 02:36:17,100
>> it's up to their engineer designing

2864
02:36:17,100 --> 02:36:21,100
the retaining wall it won't be allowed

2865
02:36:21,100 --> 02:36:26,401
to extend I don't know if they have to

2866
02:36:28,100 --> 02:36:29,100
rebuild the whole thing is up to the

2867
02:36:29,100 --> 02:36:30,100
engineer they hired to design that to

2868
02:36:30,100 --> 02:36:31,100
not encroach on the neighbors property

2869
02:36:31,100 --> 02:36:32,100
and still hold the structure as it is

2870
02:36:32,100 --> 02:36:35,601
>> so I'm confused because the permits

2871
02:36:36,100 --> 02:36:40,100
were issued for the wall in 2019. The

2872
02:36:40,100 --> 02:36:44,801
county at that time felt the wall was

2873
02:36:47,100 --> 02:36:48,100
up to standard?

2874
02:36:48,100 --> 02:36:51,100
>> we accepted plans and calculations

2875
02:36:51,100 --> 02:36:54,100
on the wall. I don't believe that

2876
02:36:54,100 --> 02:36:58,201
grading permit was for the wall was

2877
02:36:59,100 --> 02:37:03,201
ever finalized. At the time the plans

2878
02:37:06,100 --> 02:37:09,100
and were issued we received were

2879
02:37:09,100 --> 02:37:10,100
excepted and issued but with the

2880
02:37:10,100 --> 02:37:13,100
changing of the retaining wall we'd

2881
02:37:13,100 --> 02:37:14,100
have to reengineer

2882
02:37:14,100 --> 02:37:17,601
>> so the existing wall on their

2883
02:37:20,100 --> 02:37:23,100
property could be okay? He

2884
02:37:24,100 --> 02:37:25,100
>> it depends if we can take off that

2885
02:37:25,100 --> 02:37:29,201
forefoot wing wall and have it still

2886
02:37:30,100 --> 02:37:31,100
meet whatever engineering.

2887
02:37:31,100 --> 02:37:33,100
>> okay thank you

2888
02:37:35,100 --> 02:37:39,100
>> it is determined that the slope it's

2889
02:37:39,100 --> 02:37:43,801
necessary to have a wall on that slope,

2890
02:37:44,100 --> 02:37:45,100
then could it extend into the neighbors

2891
02:37:45,100 --> 02:37:48,601
property for example to protect erosion

2892
02:37:54,100 --> 02:37:57,100
or landslides or engineering. Could it

2893
02:37:57,100 --> 02:38:01,100
be determined it's necessary to have a

2894
02:38:01,100 --> 02:38:02,100
retaining wall for that area regardless

2895
02:38:02,100 --> 02:38:03,100
if there's a building or not?

2896
02:38:03,100 --> 02:38:06,601
>> while a retaining wall is most

2897
02:38:13,100 --> 02:38:17,100
likely required to build a pad in the

2898
02:38:17,100 --> 02:38:18,100
area, I don't believe it's required to

2899
02:38:18,100 --> 02:38:22,801
maintain soil on the site because as a

2900
02:38:24,100 --> 02:38:27,601
natural slope that hasn't been eroding

2901
02:38:30,100 --> 02:38:31,100
naturally.

2902
02:38:31,100 --> 02:38:35,100
>> if you take it off it will leave

2903
02:38:35,100 --> 02:38:36,100
some kind of [indiscernible]

2904
02:38:36,100 --> 02:38:40,100
>> if we remove the retaining wall? If

2905
02:38:40,100 --> 02:38:41,100
we remove the wall I assume we also

2906
02:38:41,100 --> 02:38:45,201
have to remove the structure. And make

2907
02:38:47,100 --> 02:38:51,201
sure there's going to be some erosion

2908
02:38:53,100 --> 02:38:54,100
problems.

2909
02:38:54,100 --> 02:38:58,201
>> if you remove the retaining wall you

2910
02:38:59,100 --> 02:39:01,100
have to have an engineer with a grading

2911
02:39:01,100 --> 02:39:04,100
permit saying the soil is stable.

2912
02:39:04,100 --> 02:39:08,801
currently the plan I looked at is they

2913
02:39:09,100 --> 02:39:12,100
are taking [indiscernible] and turning

2914
02:39:12,100 --> 02:39:16,201
it back onto there's and with the

2915
02:39:17,100 --> 02:39:18,100
[indiscernible] two feet buffer between

2916
02:39:18,100 --> 02:39:20,100
the property line so we are asking for

2917
02:39:20,100 --> 02:39:21,100
[indiscernible]

2918
02:39:21,100 --> 02:39:24,100
>> no matter what we do with the wall,

2919
02:39:24,100 --> 02:39:27,100
it still has to be approved with the

2920
02:39:27,100 --> 02:39:30,100
setback. With the structure currently

2921
02:39:32,100 --> 02:39:36,801
there. So the wall will be too high

2922
02:39:38,100 --> 02:39:39,100
from the property line, also need to be

2923
02:39:39,100 --> 02:39:42,100
a variance for the wall.

2924
02:39:43,100 --> 02:39:47,100
>> what I'm getting at is if we allow

2925
02:39:47,100 --> 02:39:48,100
this to happen like commissioner

2926
02:39:48,100 --> 02:39:51,100
woodward said in the past let people

2927
02:39:51,100 --> 02:39:54,601
build 3 1/2 feet from the property line

2928
02:39:55,100 --> 02:39:56,100
without issuing a permit and coming

2929
02:39:56,100 --> 02:39:59,100
back and asking for forgiveness

2930
02:40:01,100 --> 02:40:04,601
>> so it is your hearing body

2931
02:40:07,100 --> 02:40:09,100
determination and you can make

2932
02:40:09,100 --> 02:40:11,401
different determination on different

2933
02:40:14,100 --> 02:40:15,100
properties.

2934
02:40:15,100 --> 02:40:16,100
>> what's good for one person should be

2935
02:40:16,100 --> 02:40:19,601
good for all. Consistency is important

2936
02:40:22,100 --> 02:40:26,100
>> is it possible, could they move the

2937
02:40:26,100 --> 02:40:30,100
shop 30 feet. Could be picked up and

2938
02:40:30,100 --> 02:40:31,100
moved cheaper than having this

2939
02:40:31,100 --> 02:40:33,100
reengineered and putting a wall up? We

2940
02:40:33,100 --> 02:40:36,100
move properties and buildings before

2941
02:40:36,100 --> 02:40:39,100
it's only 700 square feet. 1200 square

2942
02:40:43,100 --> 02:40:44,100
feet. But no electrical or plumbing

2943
02:40:44,100 --> 02:40:48,801
>> would it be possible to lift it and

2944
02:40:53,100 --> 02:40:55,100
move it

2945
02:40:59,100 --> 02:41:02,100
>> because the footings for the walls

2946
02:41:02,100 --> 02:41:04,100
on the side, you'd have to move the

2947
02:41:04,100 --> 02:41:08,201
footings all the way out. It's not

2948
02:41:11,100 --> 02:41:13,100
feasible. My age says I can't do that

2949
02:41:13,100 --> 02:41:16,100
>> I'm not asking you to. I'm just

2950
02:41:16,100 --> 02:41:19,100
asking is it feasible to do that.

2951
02:41:19,100 --> 02:41:20,100
trying to help you save your building

2952
02:41:20,100 --> 02:41:21,100
>> it's not feasible

2953
02:41:21,100 --> 02:41:22,100
>> [indiscernible]

2954
02:41:22,100 --> 02:41:23,100
>> get closer to your microphone

2955
02:41:23,100 --> 02:41:27,201
>> I'm at a standstill because what I'm

2956
02:42:00,100 --> 02:42:03,100
hearing, a neighbor helped build the

2957
02:42:03,100 --> 02:42:07,201
wall and he deferred to somebody else.

2958
02:42:08,100 --> 02:42:09,100
if he knew where the property line was

2959
02:42:09,100 --> 02:42:13,100
but agreed to help build it, it was

2960
02:42:13,100 --> 02:42:17,201
built without a permit which was wrong.

2961
02:42:19,100 --> 02:42:23,100
I'm thinking out loud but I guess we go

2962
02:42:23,100 --> 02:42:27,801
with the county and deny it. I can't

2963
02:42:29,100 --> 02:42:30,100
see letting it go through and giving

2964
02:42:30,100 --> 02:42:31,100
someone else the same permission to do

2965
02:42:31,100 --> 02:42:33,100
the same thing and come back and ask

2966
02:42:33,100 --> 02:42:34,100
for forgiveness

2967
02:42:34,100 --> 02:42:35,100
>> [indiscernible]

2968
02:42:35,100 --> 02:42:39,201
>> I don't have any information to make

2969
02:42:53,100 --> 02:42:56,601
a different determination that was made

2970
02:42:58,100 --> 02:42:59,100
by the zoning administrator.

2971
02:42:59,100 --> 02:43:01,100
>> me either

2972
02:43:03,100 --> 02:43:07,100
>> I can't have any findings that would

2973
02:43:07,100 --> 02:43:09,100
change that decision. I have the same

2974
02:43:09,100 --> 02:43:12,100
information same evidence nothing new.

2975
02:43:12,100 --> 02:43:16,201
there are changes that need to happen.

2976
02:43:18,100 --> 02:43:21,100
I'm kind of at the point of going along

2977
02:43:21,100 --> 02:43:22,100
with this recommendation.

2978
02:43:22,100 --> 02:43:25,100
>> when I was looking at, this is

2979
02:43:25,100 --> 02:43:28,100
pretty straightforward to me initially,

2980
02:43:28,100 --> 02:43:30,100
you violate the guidelines and rules

2981
02:43:30,100 --> 02:43:34,201
and you have to face the consequences.

2982
02:43:38,100 --> 02:43:41,100
if you get caught. I was trying to

2983
02:43:41,100 --> 02:43:43,100
understand if maybe the county was

2984
02:43:43,100 --> 02:43:45,100
partially culpable here with the

2985
02:43:45,100 --> 02:43:48,100
issuing of a building permit and that

2986
02:43:48,100 --> 02:43:53,100
sort of thing but I have to say I don't

2987
02:43:53,100 --> 02:43:57,201
think so. I'm where you guys are.

2988
02:43:59,100 --> 02:44:02,100
>> I really feel for these people I

2989
02:44:02,100 --> 02:44:03,100
really do because this has been around

2990
02:44:03,100 --> 02:44:06,601
since 2014 for crying out loud. It's

2991
02:44:08,100 --> 02:44:09,100
really too bad

2992
02:44:09,100 --> 02:44:13,801
>> do you put up a fine for violating

2993
02:44:17,100 --> 02:44:18,100
the permit process and still allow them

2994
02:44:18,100 --> 02:44:22,801
to keep the structure? And fix the wall?

2995
02:44:26,100 --> 02:44:30,201
>> it has to come into compliance. And

2996
02:44:32,100 --> 02:44:33,100
that is the process

2997
02:44:33,100 --> 02:44:36,601
>> we could allow a 3 1/2 foot setback.

2998
02:44:38,100 --> 02:44:40,100
so if we allow the 3 1/2 foot setback

2999
02:44:40,100 --> 02:44:43,601
and go back to property, like

3000
02:44:51,100 --> 02:44:52,100
commissioner woodward said there's a

3001
02:44:52,100 --> 02:44:53,100
lot of miscommunication between a lot

3002
02:44:53,100 --> 02:44:54,100
of people this was approved and now

3003
02:44:54,100 --> 02:44:58,100
denied, I do feel sorry for the

3004
02:44:58,100 --> 02:44:59,100
applicant as well. But if there's a way

3005
02:44:59,100 --> 02:45:03,801
to help them keep this with less costs

3006
02:45:04,100 --> 02:45:08,801
out of their pocket, I'm up for that.

3007
02:45:09,100 --> 02:45:13,100
if the county would allow that to

3008
02:45:13,100 --> 02:45:14,100
happen. If we approve a 3 1/2 foot

3009
02:45:14,100 --> 02:45:17,601
setback and put that in the

3010
02:45:18,100 --> 02:45:20,100
recommendation

3011
02:45:20,100 --> 02:45:25,401
>> what I would need to tell you is if

3012
02:45:26,100 --> 02:45:27,100
the commission decides to go down that

3013
02:45:27,100 --> 02:45:30,601
route of approving the variance, it

3014
02:45:31,100 --> 02:45:34,100
would be a tentative approval and we

3015
02:45:34,100 --> 02:45:37,601
would send that back to prepare

3016
02:45:39,100 --> 02:45:42,601
findings for approval, we'd have to

3017
02:45:45,100 --> 02:45:46,100
make the findings or the commission

3018
02:45:46,100 --> 02:45:47,100
would have to make the findings for

3019
02:45:47,100 --> 02:45:48,100
approval and we bring that back to the

3020
02:45:48,100 --> 02:45:51,100
commission for you to take final action.

3021
02:45:51,100 --> 02:45:52,100
>> okay.

3022
02:45:52,100 --> 02:45:55,601
>> what are the findings required again?

3023
02:45:56,100 --> 02:45:57,100
>> they are listed in the staff report

3024
02:45:57,100 --> 02:46:01,801
>> I refer you to page 19 in the staff

3025
02:46:10,100 --> 02:46:14,201
report packet. Page 20. We all need to

3026
02:46:15,100 --> 02:46:19,801
get on the same page. Right before the

3027
02:46:21,100 --> 02:46:22,100
analysis where it says findings

3028
02:46:22,100 --> 02:46:25,601
necessary for granting a variance. The

3029
02:46:29,100 --> 02:46:32,100
first one special circumstance the

3030
02:46:35,100 --> 02:46:36,100
property including size shape

3031
02:46:36,100 --> 02:46:37,100
topography location surroundings or

3032
02:46:37,100 --> 02:46:38,100
circumstances restrict application

3033
02:46:38,100 --> 02:46:39,100
private property [indiscernible]

3034
02:46:39,100 --> 02:46:42,100
adjoined by other property vicinity

3035
02:46:45,100 --> 02:46:46,100
[indiscernible]. The variance

3036
02:46:46,100 --> 02:46:48,100
authorized not constitute special

3037
02:46:48,100 --> 02:46:50,100
privilege locations upon other

3038
02:46:50,100 --> 02:46:53,100
properties vicinity and same district.

3039
02:46:53,100 --> 02:46:56,100
the variance is not authorize use that

3040
02:46:56,100 --> 02:46:59,601
otherwise is allowed in zoning district.

3041
02:47:01,100 --> 02:47:04,100
the variance does not under

3042
02:47:04,100 --> 02:47:06,401
circumstance conditions apply adversely

3043
02:47:10,100 --> 02:47:11,100
affect the public safety, not

3044
02:47:11,100 --> 02:47:13,401
materially detrimental to public

3045
02:47:15,100 --> 02:47:16,100
welfare to nearby property. The

3046
02:47:16,100 --> 02:47:18,100
variance is consistent with the general

3047
02:47:18,100 --> 02:47:22,201
plan and the community plan or specific

3048
02:47:23,100 --> 02:47:25,100
plan. And the variance is the minimum

3049
02:47:25,100 --> 02:47:27,100
departure from the requirements of the

3050
02:47:27,100 --> 02:47:29,100
ordinance necessary to grant to the

3051
02:47:29,100 --> 02:47:33,201
applicant subsections a and b. You'd be

3052
02:47:35,100 --> 02:47:39,100
asking the staff to come back with

3053
02:47:39,100 --> 02:47:40,100
that

3054
02:47:40,100 --> 02:47:42,100
>> [speaker off mic]

3055
02:47:50,100 --> 02:47:56,100
>> I'd be in tune to what is here to do

3056
02:47:59,100 --> 02:48:00,100
what we can to help them keep their

3057
02:48:00,100 --> 02:48:03,601
structure but be in compliance with

3058
02:48:04,100 --> 02:48:07,100
engineering and allow this 3 1/2 foot

3059
02:48:09,100 --> 02:48:11,401
setback considering [indiscernible] if

3060
02:48:14,100 --> 02:48:17,100
there are power lines. May be the

3061
02:48:17,100 --> 02:48:20,100
county or whoever [indiscernible] I

3062
02:48:20,100 --> 02:48:22,100
would recommend we do what ej was

3063
02:48:22,100 --> 02:48:26,801
saying, have them come back to us with

3064
02:48:27,100 --> 02:48:30,100
a ruling or something that gives us the

3065
02:48:30,100 --> 02:48:31,100
proper engineering that lets them keep

3066
02:48:31,100 --> 02:48:32,100
their structure and move forward

3067
02:48:32,100 --> 02:48:36,801
>> I guess I kind of struggle with the

3068
02:48:41,100 --> 02:48:44,100
coming back part. Because the answer is

3069
02:48:44,100 --> 02:48:46,100
going to be is going to change if they

3070
02:48:46,100 --> 02:48:50,100
come back? To me it seems like if we

3071
02:48:50,100 --> 02:48:53,100
were to support the staff

3072
02:48:57,100 --> 02:48:58,100
recommendation. It sounds like no

3073
02:48:58,100 --> 02:48:59,100
matter what something has to happen

3074
02:48:59,100 --> 02:49:03,801
with changes to the wall. And work has

3075
02:49:04,100 --> 02:49:08,801
to be done. It would be a possibility

3076
02:49:09,100 --> 02:49:12,100
of changes are made, and the various

3077
02:49:12,100 --> 02:49:16,801
items we just heard can be met, they

3078
02:49:18,100 --> 02:49:19,100
could go back to the zoning

3079
02:49:19,100 --> 02:49:22,601
administrator and ask for a variance.

3080
02:49:23,100 --> 02:49:25,100
that would be the come back

3081
02:49:25,100 --> 02:49:28,100
>> I think the wall has to be dealt with

3082
02:49:28,100 --> 02:49:29,100
>> for sure

3083
02:49:29,100 --> 02:49:33,201
>> that's what this finding is all about

3084
02:49:35,100 --> 02:49:38,100
>> so this finding is the wall, it

3085
02:49:38,100 --> 02:49:40,100
doesn't mean they tear down the

3086
02:49:40,100 --> 02:49:42,100
structure?

3087
02:49:44,100 --> 02:49:48,801
>> it means the wall needs to be fixed

3088
02:49:50,100 --> 02:49:54,201
>> then they can come come back and

3089
02:49:56,100 --> 02:49:57,100
apply for a variance

3090
02:49:57,100 --> 02:49:59,100
>> they can go to the zoning

3091
02:49:59,100 --> 02:50:01,401
administrator. The zoning administrator

3092
02:50:03,100 --> 02:50:04,100
initially said [indiscernible] so

3093
02:50:04,100 --> 02:50:07,100
that's going to be an issue they have

3094
02:50:07,100 --> 02:50:09,100
to deal with.

3095
02:50:09,100 --> 02:50:12,100
>> there were other buildable space on

3096
02:50:12,100 --> 02:50:16,100
the property etc.. So the building the

3097
02:50:16,100 --> 02:50:17,100
zoning administrator basically applied

3098
02:50:17,100 --> 02:50:20,100
those guidelines to the entire project.

3099
02:50:20,100 --> 02:50:23,601
we are affecting the entire project.

3100
02:50:24,100 --> 02:50:28,100
not just the wall. But the building as

3101
02:50:28,100 --> 02:50:30,100
well correct?

3102
02:50:30,100 --> 02:50:33,601
>> yes so the decision today affects

3103
02:50:36,100 --> 02:50:37,100
both.

3104
02:50:37,100 --> 02:50:41,801
>> I think the thing we don't know is

3105
02:50:42,100 --> 02:50:43,100
if they can't do the wall then the

3106
02:50:43,100 --> 02:50:47,801
building has to come down. So we don't

3107
02:50:51,100 --> 02:50:52,100
know. I don't know that we have enough

3108
02:50:52,100 --> 02:50:56,100
information to try to save the building.

3109
02:50:56,100 --> 02:50:58,100
>> the applicant has a question.

3110
02:50:58,100 --> 02:50:59,100
>> we are in discussion.

3111
02:50:59,100 --> 02:51:02,601
>> are there any issues with allowing

3112
02:51:10,100 --> 02:51:13,100
the applicant to make another comment?

3113
02:51:13,100 --> 02:51:16,100
>> it's up to the chair

3114
02:51:17,100 --> 02:51:20,100
>> would you like to hear something

3115
02:51:20,100 --> 02:51:21,100
from the applicant?

3116
02:51:21,100 --> 02:51:22,100
>> come on up to the microphone

3117
02:51:22,100 --> 02:51:25,100
>> [indiscernible] move the wall we've

3118
02:51:30,100 --> 02:51:34,801
got an engineer working on it now. We

3119
02:51:35,100 --> 02:51:36,100
are going to turn that one wing that

3120
02:51:36,100 --> 02:51:40,100
goes onto the other property back into

3121
02:51:40,100 --> 02:51:44,801
the site and then we will put still

3122
02:51:45,100 --> 02:51:46,100
pylons alongside the wall and tie the

3123
02:51:46,100 --> 02:51:50,801
wall back into the slab. Tear the slab

3124
02:51:51,100 --> 02:51:55,801
out and report the slab where there is

3125
02:51:57,100 --> 02:52:01,801
cable. We will put the cable into the

3126
02:52:05,100 --> 02:52:06,100
wall that's what my engineer is talking

3127
02:52:06,100 --> 02:52:10,100
about right now how to fix that. The

3128
02:52:10,100 --> 02:52:14,100
other question you people have asked is

3129
02:52:14,100 --> 02:52:18,100
if I could move. The building forward

3130
02:52:18,100 --> 02:52:21,100
if you move the building forward more,

3131
02:52:21,100 --> 02:52:25,201
you actually put the building over the

3132
02:52:26,100 --> 02:52:30,100
top of my septic. And that is mainly

3133
02:52:30,100 --> 02:52:34,100
one of the reasons we set it back so

3134
02:52:34,100 --> 02:52:36,100
far. So we weren't over the top of the

3135
02:52:36,100 --> 02:52:37,100
septic and interfering with that.

3136
02:52:37,100 --> 02:52:41,201
>> so is part of the buildable area

3137
02:52:48,100 --> 02:52:49,100
where the septic is?

3138
02:52:49,100 --> 02:52:53,201
>> I did not get a confirmation on

3139
02:52:55,100 --> 02:52:59,801
where the septic field is but that is

3140
02:53:01,100 --> 02:53:05,201
the area we identified. On his site

3141
02:53:07,100 --> 02:53:11,201
plan, it showed the repair area being

3142
02:53:13,100 --> 02:53:17,801
here. So there's a little bit of a

3143
02:53:20,100 --> 02:53:22,100
distance. But without getting tracings

3144
02:53:22,100 --> 02:53:23,100
or something that tells us for sure

3145
02:53:23,100 --> 02:53:27,201
where the repair area is, we usually

3146
02:53:28,100 --> 02:53:29,100
take the applicant were property owners

3147
02:53:29,100 --> 02:53:32,100
word for the septic lines, compared

3148
02:53:32,100 --> 02:53:34,100
with whatever environmental health has

3149
02:53:34,100 --> 02:53:35,100
on record.

3150
02:53:35,100 --> 02:53:36,100
>> I don't know for sure

3151
02:53:36,100 --> 02:53:40,201
>> the slab you are removing, is that

3152
02:53:44,100 --> 02:53:48,100
the slab the garage sits on? You said

3153
02:53:48,100 --> 02:53:52,201
you are going to remove a slab

3154
02:53:53,100 --> 02:53:57,801
>> the slab at the back on the west

3155
02:54:00,100 --> 02:54:04,201
side of the building. Where the trailer

3156
02:54:07,100 --> 02:54:11,201
is sitting. The concrete slab, we will

3157
02:54:13,100 --> 02:54:16,100
remove that slab. Input the retaining

3158
02:54:16,100 --> 02:54:20,100
wall in, and put the concrete over. So

3159
02:54:20,100 --> 02:54:23,100
pins will come off the iron set in the

3160
02:54:23,100 --> 02:54:27,201
ground and pulled back into the slab

3161
02:54:28,100 --> 02:54:33,100
and then we for the slab so you get

3162
02:54:33,100 --> 02:54:36,601
pressure going back into the building

3163
02:54:38,100 --> 02:54:43,100
to help it, so you don't tip the wall

3164
02:54:43,100 --> 02:54:46,601
over the building. That's talking, I

3165
02:54:49,100 --> 02:54:50,100
don't have an engineer, but that's what

3166
02:54:50,100 --> 02:54:54,100
my engineer has talked to me about. I'm

3167
02:54:54,100 --> 02:54:56,100
okay with that. Whatever it takes to

3168
02:54:56,100 --> 02:54:58,100
fix it. That's what I'm going to do.

3169
02:54:58,100 --> 02:55:02,201
short of taking the building down. I

3170
02:55:07,100 --> 02:55:11,201
can't do that. [speaker off mic]. This

3171
02:55:49,100 --> 02:55:51,100
was my house, the septic sits right

3172
02:55:51,100 --> 02:55:55,201
about there the leach field goes out.

3173
02:56:05,100 --> 02:56:09,201
>> so thank you. If we uphold the

3174
02:56:14,100 --> 02:56:15,100
zoning administrator's decision, what

3175
02:56:15,100 --> 02:56:16,100
kind of timeline do they have?

3176
02:56:16,100 --> 02:56:20,801
>> I want to make sure I hear this

3177
02:56:26,100 --> 02:56:27,100
right. If you uphold the zoning

3178
02:56:27,100 --> 02:56:30,601
administrator's decision to deny it, I

3179
02:56:36,100 --> 02:56:37,100
don't think we have put anything in the

3180
02:56:37,100 --> 02:56:41,201
conditions of when everything has to be

3181
02:56:42,100 --> 02:56:43,100
brought into conformance. They can

3182
02:56:43,100 --> 02:56:47,201
appeal they have appeal rights. Like in

3183
02:56:51,100 --> 02:56:54,100
the past, the commission can require

3184
02:56:54,100 --> 02:56:56,100
removal of the structures or compliance

3185
02:56:56,100 --> 02:56:59,100
within whatever period of time you

3186
02:56:59,100 --> 02:57:01,100
think fits

3187
02:57:02,100 --> 02:57:06,100
>> I have a question for the engineer.

3188
02:57:06,100 --> 02:57:09,100
how long if we give them an extension

3189
02:57:09,100 --> 02:57:13,100
of time do you feel they would need

3190
02:57:13,100 --> 02:57:15,100
from an engineer and start of

3191
02:57:15,100 --> 02:57:16,100
construction to get to the point they

3192
02:57:16,100 --> 02:57:19,100
can save the wall and property?

3193
02:57:19,100 --> 02:57:22,601
>> as far as issuing the permit?

3194
02:57:23,100 --> 02:57:25,100
>> correct if they go to step two and

3195
02:57:25,100 --> 02:57:29,100
say we have the engineering and we go

3196
02:57:29,100 --> 02:57:33,201
to permitting and it gets approved, how

3197
02:57:34,100 --> 02:57:38,100
long is the process if we want to give

3198
02:57:38,100 --> 02:57:41,100
them extension of time, what we can

3199
02:57:41,100 --> 02:57:42,100
extend to get this done

3200
02:57:42,100 --> 02:57:44,100
>> the typical process for getting the

3201
02:57:44,100 --> 02:57:46,401
permit [indiscernible] ahead of

3202
02:57:47,100 --> 02:57:50,100
schedule. If they give us a complete

3203
02:57:50,100 --> 02:57:53,100
packet where the calculations are

3204
02:57:53,100 --> 02:57:54,100
correct [indiscernible] it could be

3205
02:57:54,100 --> 02:57:58,801
done in three weeks or four. But after

3206
02:58:00,100 --> 02:58:02,100
we need corrections is just however

3207
02:58:02,100 --> 02:58:03,100
long it takes [indiscernible] once they

3208
02:58:03,100 --> 02:58:06,601
give us the grading permit we

3209
02:58:07,100 --> 02:58:08,100
distribute it to environmental health

3210
02:58:08,100 --> 02:58:11,100
and they look at the septic and then

3211
02:58:11,100 --> 02:58:14,100
look at it for a variance on the size

3212
02:58:14,100 --> 02:58:15,100
of the wall with the setback

3213
02:58:15,100 --> 02:58:18,100
>> usually we wouldn't approve those

3214
02:58:20,100 --> 02:58:24,201
grading plans unless we have approved a

3215
02:58:32,100 --> 02:58:33,100
variance.

3216
02:58:33,100 --> 02:58:34,100
>> currently, we have not distributed

3217
02:58:34,100 --> 02:58:36,100
anything for the grading [indiscernible]

3218
02:58:36,100 --> 02:58:39,100
>> so the variance of 3 1/2 feet

3219
02:58:43,100 --> 02:58:44,100
[indiscernible]

3220
02:58:44,100 --> 02:58:45,100
>> [speaker off mic]

3221
02:58:45,100 --> 02:58:49,201
>> in your opinion what he stated from

3222
02:59:17,100 --> 02:59:18,100
his engineer, do you feel an educated

3223
02:59:18,100 --> 02:59:21,100
guess that that would work?

3224
02:59:23,100 --> 02:59:24,100
>> I have talked to his engineer a

3225
02:59:24,100 --> 02:59:25,100
couple times and I feel like that would

3226
02:59:25,100 --> 02:59:26,100
work

3227
02:59:26,100 --> 02:59:28,100
>> okay

3228
02:59:29,100 --> 02:59:32,601
>> I was wondering where the zoning

3229
02:59:33,100 --> 02:59:36,100
administrator identified a place the

3230
02:59:37,100 --> 02:59:40,601
structure could be built within the

3231
02:59:42,100 --> 02:59:43,100
setback? Where was that?

3232
02:59:43,100 --> 02:59:45,100
>> I believe that could have been

3233
02:59:45,100 --> 02:59:47,100
located here. On the site plan this is

3234
02:59:47,100 --> 02:59:51,100
the one we were shown and it did not

3235
02:59:51,100 --> 02:59:53,100
show there was a septic field there at

3236
02:59:53,100 --> 02:59:57,100
the time. So that's news to me. That

3237
02:59:57,100 --> 03:00:01,100
there's a septic field here. I thought

3238
03:00:01,100 --> 03:00:04,100
this was a septic field down here. We

3239
03:00:04,100 --> 03:00:07,100
have a repair area identified.

3240
03:00:09,100 --> 03:00:12,100
>> it's over the septic system

3241
03:00:12,100 --> 03:00:15,100
>> if the septic system is here as the

3242
03:00:15,100 --> 03:00:18,601
applicant described that will not be

3243
03:00:19,100 --> 03:00:21,100
buildable

3244
03:00:24,100 --> 03:00:25,100
>> so will have to shift to the south

3245
03:00:25,100 --> 03:00:26,100
>> it would have to shift further south

3246
03:00:26,100 --> 03:00:28,100
or they'd have to build an increased

3247
03:00:28,100 --> 03:00:31,601
retaining wall or an increased there

3248
03:00:35,100 --> 03:00:37,100
were other places but this was the

3249
03:00:37,100 --> 03:00:38,100
easily identifiable level location they

3250
03:00:38,100 --> 03:00:41,100
could have built and still not have the

3251
03:00:41,100 --> 03:00:43,100
30 foot setback

3252
03:00:44,100 --> 03:00:46,100
>> it's already done

3253
03:00:46,100 --> 03:00:50,201
>> we have to think about the neighbor

3254
03:00:51,100 --> 03:00:53,100
and the setback that is expected from

3255
03:00:53,100 --> 03:00:57,201
the neighbor or any future neighbor. I

3256
03:00:58,100 --> 03:01:02,201
don't have any new information for me

3257
03:01:03,100 --> 03:01:06,100
to change the zoning administrator

3258
03:01:06,100 --> 03:01:08,100
original decision. I know we are trying

3259
03:01:08,100 --> 03:01:12,100
to figure this out but I don't think we

3260
03:01:12,100 --> 03:01:16,801
can. I'm feeling like I still need to

3261
03:01:17,100 --> 03:01:20,100
go along with the zoning

3262
03:01:21,100 --> 03:01:22,100
administrator's recommendation, allow

3263
03:01:22,100 --> 03:01:23,100
them to appeal to the board of

3264
03:01:23,100 --> 03:01:26,601
supervisors where maybe they can figure

3265
03:01:29,100 --> 03:01:32,100
it out. I'm sorry but I don't see a way

3266
03:01:32,100 --> 03:01:34,100
that we can change that decision

3267
03:01:34,100 --> 03:01:39,401
>> I tend to agree. I think we want to

3268
03:01:40,100 --> 03:01:43,601
be able to exercise the zoning

3269
03:01:45,100 --> 03:01:46,100
administrator checklist. We are going

3270
03:01:46,100 --> 03:01:49,100
to try to apply to this but at this

3271
03:01:49,100 --> 03:01:52,601
point this would be a special

3272
03:01:54,100 --> 03:01:57,100
circumstance etc.. I don't see

3273
03:01:59,100 --> 03:02:02,100
justification for allowing this to

3274
03:02:03,100 --> 03:02:04,100
proceed

3275
03:02:04,100 --> 03:02:08,201
>> I don't know, I'm still trying to

3276
03:02:11,100 --> 03:02:15,801
figure out how to help them. If there's

3277
03:02:17,100 --> 03:02:18,100
a way to recommend a change in the

3278
03:02:18,100 --> 03:02:21,601
setback and extend time for the

3279
03:02:22,100 --> 03:02:23,100
engineer approval, considering there is

3280
03:02:23,100 --> 03:02:27,201
high power lines going next to the

3281
03:02:29,100 --> 03:02:30,100
property.

3282
03:02:30,100 --> 03:02:33,100
>> we kind of expect the neighbor

3283
03:02:33,100 --> 03:02:34,100
approval. If we are going to change a

3284
03:02:34,100 --> 03:02:36,100
setback it puts it someone else's

3285
03:02:36,100 --> 03:02:39,100
property, we want the neighbors

3286
03:02:40,100 --> 03:02:43,100
blessing on that. And it does not seem

3287
03:02:43,100 --> 03:02:45,100
likely have that.

3288
03:02:48,100 --> 03:02:49,100
>> [indiscernible] the neighbor is here

3289
03:02:49,100 --> 03:02:53,100
and we can always ask. He helped to

3290
03:02:53,100 --> 03:02:56,100
build the wall and knew where the

3291
03:02:56,100 --> 03:02:57,100
property line was.

3292
03:02:57,100 --> 03:03:00,100
>> I'm getting this information. They

3293
03:03:08,100 --> 03:03:10,100
hired somebody [indiscernible]

3294
03:03:10,100 --> 03:03:14,100
>> that's not for me to judge. I'm

3295
03:03:14,100 --> 03:03:15,100
ready to make a motion

3296
03:03:15,100 --> 03:03:19,100
>> I tried to help these people as much

3297
03:03:19,100 --> 03:03:20,100
as possible but I don't know that

3298
03:03:20,100 --> 03:03:21,100
there's a way to do it.

3299
03:03:21,100 --> 03:03:24,100
>> I move the planning commission

3300
03:03:29,100 --> 03:03:32,601
uphold the decision of the zoning

3301
03:03:33,100 --> 03:03:34,100
administrator and the findings stated

3302
03:03:34,100 --> 03:03:35,100
in the staff report

3303
03:03:35,100 --> 03:03:36,100
>> second

3304
03:03:36,100 --> 03:03:39,601
>> [indiscernible] I'd like to make a

3305
03:03:44,100 --> 03:03:48,801
comment on that. That does not stop the

3306
03:03:50,100 --> 03:03:53,100
process. It's just that you have to

3307
03:03:53,100 --> 03:03:57,100
look into this and come up with

3308
03:03:57,100 --> 03:04:00,100
solutions. If the septic system is

3309
03:04:00,100 --> 03:04:04,100
placed it has to be on a map, somebody

3310
03:04:04,100 --> 03:04:06,100
has to know. And take a serious look at

3311
03:04:06,100 --> 03:04:10,801
where you can put the shop. Right next

3312
03:04:12,100 --> 03:04:15,100
to the property line. It depends on

3313
03:04:15,100 --> 03:04:19,100
your analysis as the owners of the

3314
03:04:19,100 --> 03:04:22,601
property. What you communicate with the

3315
03:04:23,100 --> 03:04:26,100
planning department, it does not

3316
03:04:26,100 --> 03:04:27,100
prevent you from coming back if you

3317
03:04:27,100 --> 03:04:28,100
have more information that supports a

3318
03:04:28,100 --> 03:04:30,100
variance, that would be a reason to

3319
03:04:30,100 --> 03:04:33,100
come back. It seems like right now, we

3320
03:04:33,100 --> 03:04:37,201
are still open ended question. So it's

3321
03:04:40,100 --> 03:04:44,100
hard for me anyway to disagree with the

3322
03:04:44,100 --> 03:04:45,100
zoning administrator.

3323
03:04:45,100 --> 03:04:49,100
>> we have a first and a second. Roll

3324
03:04:49,100 --> 03:04:50,100
call vote

3325
03:04:50,100 --> 03:04:53,601
>> first from mr. Woodward, second from

3326
03:04:55,100 --> 03:04:59,201
mr. Demattei. Mr. Hauge yes mr. Johnson

3327
03:05:03,100 --> 03:05:07,201
yes mr. Woodward yes mr. Demattei yes

3328
03:05:08,100 --> 03:05:10,100
mr. Herzog yes.

3329
03:05:19,100 --> 03:05:20,100
>> the decision of the planning

3330
03:05:20,100 --> 03:05:21,100
commission may be appealed by anyone

3331
03:05:21,100 --> 03:05:22,100
who appeared at today's hearing and

3332
03:05:22,100 --> 03:05:23,100
provide comment first written comments

3333
03:05:23,100 --> 03:05:24,100
on the item in appeal must be filed

3334
03:05:24,100 --> 03:05:25,100
within 10 days of today's date and

3335
03:05:25,100 --> 03:05:29,100
shall filing fee of $641. I do want to

3336
03:05:29,100 --> 03:05:30,100
thank my commissioners. I think we do

3337
03:05:30,100 --> 03:05:34,801
our best to really think and read all

3338
03:05:35,100 --> 03:05:38,100
the documents and taken public comment.

3339
03:05:38,100 --> 03:05:40,100
we think about the best decision. You

3340
03:05:40,100 --> 03:05:46,100
guys put in a lot of work and talked to

3341
03:05:46,100 --> 03:05:50,100
people. I want to thank you because you

3342
03:05:50,100 --> 03:05:52,100
do really good job. We will conclude

3343
03:05:52,100 --> 03:05:55,601
the meeting and the meeting is

3344
03:05:58,100 --> 03:06:00,100
adjourned.