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>> Well, it's great to have you

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all here.

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There's quite a few of you here.

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It's always good for democracy.

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-... Demande écrite de quatre

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conseillers municipaux peut

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également forcer la tenue d'une

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réunion. Cette réunion spéciale

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du conseil municipal a été

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convoqué malgré des objections.

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Par une demande écrite des

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conseillers Eric Stork, Brent

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Cowan et Cynthia Homan est Tara

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Stainforth. Je répète: Tara

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Stainforth, Eric Stork, un Brent

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Cowan, et Cynthia Homan. Le seul

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but de cette réunion est de

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voter sur la résolution visant à

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mandater notre directrice

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générale pour entamer des

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négociations avec

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(---)

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Fairview afin de faire un plan

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pour développer les zones Mu1,

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Mu2, la forêt Fairview et le

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stationnement Fairview. Je me

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poserai à cette résolution et je

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crois que des consultations

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publiques devrait d'abord avoir

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lieu.

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Though it is the role of the

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Mayor of Pointe-Claire to call

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meetings of the City Council, a

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written request from for City

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Councillors can also force

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meetings to be held. This

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special meeting of City Council

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was called over my objections by

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a written request from

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councillors Stainforth, Stork,

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Cowan and Homan. I repeat

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Stainforth, Stork, Cowan and

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Homan. The sole purpose of the

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meeting is to vote on a

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resolution to mandate our city

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manager to begin negotiations

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with Cadillac Fairview to create

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a comprehensive plan to develop

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zones Mu1 and Mu2. The Fairview

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forest and the Fairview parking

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lot -- I will be opposing this

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resolution and believe that

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public consultation should be

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held first. I am going to read

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you one clause of the

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resolution. There are others

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that I don't like. But this one

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is probably the most indicative.

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Be it resolved that this Council

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desires the city manager,

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Katrina -- meet forthwith with

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representatives of Cadillac

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Fairview in-camera in an attempt

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to work out with them a mutual

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agreeable path forward that will

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engage public participation in a

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structured process haven't as

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its objective, the creation of a

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comprehensive plan for zones Mu1

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and Mu2. Now, to translate --

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what that means is that you --

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the type of public participation

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you are going to have is going

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to be determined before you get

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it by City Council, or the city,

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and Cadillac Fairview. So, there

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is a prioritization here in the

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process that I don't like very

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much. And that is why I am quite

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offended by this whole exercise.

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And I hope you are too. Thank

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you.

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>> Comment --

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>> I just want to clarify

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something in your opening

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statement. In French, you said,

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too --

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In a global plan -- and an

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English, put a comprehensive

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plan together. If you read the

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resolution, it means, for the

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purpose of ensuring public

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participation in determining the

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future of zones Mu1 and Mu2 --

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and I repeat, for the purpose of

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ensuring public participation in

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determining the future of zones

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Mu1 and Mu2, that is not a

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global plan, nor is it a

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comprehensive plan. Thank you.

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>> It is a plan affecting zones

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Mu1 and Mu2 --

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>> Please read the --

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>> Councillor Stork, I am the

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chair of this meeting --

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>> Yes, you are --

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>> I was not finished --

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>> Is there anyone else --

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>> The councillor is not allowed

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to speak twice. You had already

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finish your comment. You are not

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allowed to speak twice on the

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same issue. Is there anybody

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else or --

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>> -- Thomas -- I would like to

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point to my objection to using

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your public privilege platform

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to comment on a resolution

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before we even make it to put

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your opportunity to speak that

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resolution occurs at the same

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time as the rest of us. And I

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would like it reported that, in

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my view, you have used your

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position and you have distorted

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the purpose of the resolution --

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and that was the reason for your

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abuse, to distort the resolution

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right from the beginning. But at

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any rate, everybody will have

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the opportunity to hear us all

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that out, when the motion is

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actually before the floor.

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>> Okay. I would like to remind

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Councillor Cowan that I am

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actually the Mayor of

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Pointe-Claire and I am allowed

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an opening statement. But that

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may have been overlooked. Should

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I proceed to the agenda?

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>> Yes. You must first approve

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the agenda.

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Approuver l'ordre du jour.

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>>

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Do I have a mover?

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>> Kelly Thorstad-Cullen,

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district three.

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>> Seconder? Cynthia Homan,

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district five.

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>> All in favour?.

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>> Okay.

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>> We can proceed with a

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question period. But first, I

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need to remind citizens in the

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room that the question must bear

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on items on the agenda --

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La période de questions peut

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s'ouvrir, je rappelle aux

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personnes présentes que les

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questions doivent porter

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uniquement sur les thèmes à

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l'agenda ce soir.

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>> Does anybody want to ask a

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question?

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- Et ce qu'il y a des questions

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dans la foule? Seulement au

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sujet de la résolution demandée.

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>> My

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Name --

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>> Closer to the mic, sir.

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>> My name is -- we did already

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in the meeting.

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>> We can't hear you. They are

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correct. Put your mouth closer

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to the microphone, sir.

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>> We did already the

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consultation in the chalet on

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the spring. And the majority of

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people, they refused about this

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project. I don't know why the

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City Council did bring it back

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again. That is my question. Why?

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The two of them was -- Brandt,

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Torah, and Eric. And there was

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over 100 people there. They

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refuse the project. So, why are

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they coming back again for it?

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>> I will give you another

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example. There were 500 people

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in the room against the

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demolition of the pioneer. And

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it still happened.

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>> I have no idea why these

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people working for the citizens

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of Pointe-Claire or working for

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-- please, I want to know.

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>> I can't answer that.

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>> I'm -- may

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>> I?

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>> Citizen for 30 years -- I

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never saw that. Please, I will

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ask very simple question. When

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we -- my wife and me, we both go

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to my kids. They ask us for

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credit about, do I have a

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criminal record or -- so we have

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to pass this test. So, when they

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do Election about citizen, City

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Council, or mayor, did they do

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that test, to get about the --

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do they have a criminal record

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or not?

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>> I can't speak to that either.

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>> Because that is what you are

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--

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>> Sir -- you are right, that is

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correct. Sir, correct, we have

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to speak to the resolution. Not

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-- speaking to the characters of

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people.

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>> Okay. We did all that in the

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spring. And all, the majority,

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refused it --

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>> The project --

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>> So, why you have to come back

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again?

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>> You have asked that and it's

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a very good point. I concur. I

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concur with you. I see no need

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for. I see no need for. I find

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this exercise rushed, hurried

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and unnecessary, and

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unfortunate.

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>> --

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>> Mayor Mister Mayor -- point

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of order, please.

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>> -- Councillor Cowan --

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>> Councillor Cowan, I am the

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chair. Would you like to speak?

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>> Yes, I would.

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>> Point of order, when you

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speak in question period your

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answers are not supposed to be

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-- your own personal opinions.

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Once again, I must record my

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protest against you abusing this

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process.

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>> Please do, Councillor Cowan,

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my job, I feel, is to protect

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this beautiful city. And I will

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respond accordingly. I feel I

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have been elected to protect the

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future of Pointe-Claire and I

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was on the mandate of allowing

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the citizens their right to

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equal participation in the

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future politics of Pointe-Claire

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and that is what I am trying to

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do right here, now, with my

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sincerest endeavours.

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>> Then please follow the rules.

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>> Please, Councillor Cowan,

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before you speak, you have to

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ask the chair to speak. Those

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are the rules. Why are you

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breaking the rules you are

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talking about?

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>> Because you are, sir.

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>> No, I'm not -- I'm just

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asking --

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>> Respect --

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>> Councillor Cowan I --

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>> Know, I'm not. I'm respecting

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them. Sir, is there another

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question?

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>> Am I able to speak now?

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>> Yes, you have asked one

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question. You have one more. You

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have a preamble, and you have

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had your preamble. You have one

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more question, sir.

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>> So, that is -- my question.

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Why are they already coming back

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again?

285
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>> You asked that when --

286
00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,000
>> I asked that one? But I

287
00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:39,000
didn't get an answer. Why?

288
00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:41,000
>> May I answer? There is no

289
00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:43,000
project. The only reason we are

290
00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:44,000
here tonight is to ensure that

291
00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:45,000
the public is aware of all the

292
00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:47,000
steps that are being taken in

293
00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:49,000
the back rooms, so to speak. We

294
00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:51,000
want to make sure that everyone

295
00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:53,000
understands what is happening

296
00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:56,000
and so for the past five months,

297
00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:57,000
my guess, since February, last

298
00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:59,000
year, it's almost been a year we

299
00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:01,000
have been discussing how to move

300
00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:04,000
forward with the new urban plan.

301
00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:06,000
We obviously cannot complete the

302
00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:07,000
entire urban plan all in one

303
00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:09,000
sitting. It has to be piece by

304
00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:12,000
piece. And so, tonight, we are

305
00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:13,000
coming forward. We want to

306
00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:14,000
ensure that the public is aware

307
00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:16,000
and that we are transparent of

308
00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:18,000
everything that is going on. So,

309
00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,000
we are coming forward to let you

310
00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:21,000
know where we are in this

311
00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:23,000
process. That is all this is,

312
00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:26,000
there is no project. There is

313
00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,000
nothing. All it is is, if you

314
00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:29,000
read -- if you read what is on

315
00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:33,000
here -- it is about mandating

316
00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:37,000
our director general to have a

317
00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:38,000
conversation. There is no

318
00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,000
project. And everybody was fully

319
00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:42,000
on board with this until we said

320
00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:44,000
we would go public with it. So,

321
00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:46,000
all we want to do is let the

322
00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:48,000
public know where we stand in

323
00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:50,000
this process. It has been one

324
00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:51,000
year we have been looking at

325
00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:53,000
this. I should hope we are going

326
00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:55,000
to move forward at some point.

327
00:11:57,000 --> 00:11:58,000
>> Okay --

328
00:11:58,000 --> 00:11:59,000
>> But --

329
00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:01,000
>> Excuse me, excuse me, Sir --

330
00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:03,000
>> Already consulted --

331
00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:05,000
>> Excuse, me excuse me, excuse

332
00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:06,000
me --

333
00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:07,000
>> Yes, sir?

334
00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:09,000
>> What is being determined here

335
00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:11,000
behind closed doors -- would you

336
00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,000
please stop making fun emotions

337
00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:15,000
and faces, ma'am, it's quite

338
00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:17,000
rude. In the pink, with the

339
00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:19,000
face, with a mask on? Could you

340
00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:21,000
please stop being so rude. I

341
00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:23,000
find that quite rude. -- don't

342
00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:25,000
play innocent. They did not see,

343
00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:27,000
but I did. Please stop that.

344
00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:28,000
Okay? Thank you very much. What

345
00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:32,000
is being determined here tonight

346
00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,000
is the back rooms -- are you

347
00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:36,000
mimicking or mocking? Thank you,

348
00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:38,000
Councillor Stork. Okay, excuse

349
00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:39,000
me --

350
00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,000
>> What's being determined here

351
00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:45,000
tonight is -- would you stop?

352
00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,000
What is being determined here

353
00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:49,000
tonight is how you are going to

354
00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:51,000
be allowed to participate. That

355
00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:55,000
is being negotiated on your

356
00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:57,000
behalf. How you are allowed to

357
00:12:57,000 --> 00:12:58,000
participate. That is the

358
00:12:58,000 --> 00:12:59,000
offensive part of this

359
00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:02,000
initiative.

360
00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:03,000
>> Can I finish what I have to

361
00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:04,000
say?

362
00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,000
>> One more question, sir. One

363
00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:07,000
question. Don't -- you have had

364
00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:08,000
your --

365
00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:12,000
>> -- or letter to every citizen

366
00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:15,000
to vote and to get the right

367
00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:20,000
result. And instead, maybe, it's

368
00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,000
just -- Cadillac Fairview in

369
00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:23,000
favour people are here to vote

370
00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:25,000
for it? So, really, the right

371
00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,000
solution to send to everybody in

372
00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:30,000
the -- or just the district,

373
00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:33,000
what is going to build, big

374
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:35,000
tower, that, to get the right

375
00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:37,000
decision from them? They accept

376
00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:42,000
it or not? Is that make sense --

377
00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:44,000
>> Pretty much. Well, no. They

378
00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:45,000
are starting the process of

379
00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:47,000
dialogue. The process of

380
00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,000
dialogue is being initiated. But

381
00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:51,000
the structure of the process is

382
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:53,000
being determined in negotiation

383
00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:54,000
with Cadillac Fairview to

384
00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:55,000
determine the structure of the

385
00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:59,000
process. The structure of the

386
00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:00,000
process includes your

387
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:02,000
participation.

388
00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:03,000
>> --

389
00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:04,000
>> That's where the inequity

390
00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:07,000
occurs. Yes, Councillor Cowan?

391
00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,000
>> What you just said is totally

392
00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:10,000
wrong.

393
00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:11,000
>> It's not.

394
00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:12,000
>> Yes, it is.

395
00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:13,000
>> What you said is totally

396
00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:14,000
wrong.

397
00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:17,000
>> It's not. It's not wrong?

398
00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:19,000
>> Okay, I will made it until my

399
00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:20,000
turn.

400
00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:21,000
>> Please -- do

401
00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:22,000
>> In order to explain how wrong

402
00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:23,000
you are, how misleading you are,

403
00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:24,000
and how you try to distort this

404
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:25,000
--

405
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:26,000
>> We will see by the end of the

406
00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:28,000
meeting how the public perceives

407
00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:29,000
this. Excuse me, sir. Thank you,

408
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:32,000
you have had your two. Thank

409
00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,000
you.

410
00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:38,000
- Geneviève Lucie,

411
00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:39,000
Pointe-Claire.

412
00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:40,000
>> So my, understanding of the

413
00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:41,000
resolution is to allow the

414
00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:42,000
director general of the city

415
00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:43,000
could have a conversation with

416
00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:45,000
Cadillac Fairview. For

417
00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:46,000
furtherance of a settlement of a

418
00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:47,000
litigation -- so, that is at the

419
00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:49,000
bottom of the resolution, right?

420
00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:52,000
The bottom of the resolution? Is

421
00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:53,000
that it --

422
00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:54,000
>> No, it is not to further the

423
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:55,000
settlement of the litigation.

424
00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:57,000
>> To help solve the settlement

425
00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:58,000
of the litigation.

426
00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:03,000
>> Well, it's separate.

427
00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:05,000
>> My first question is -- oh

428
00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:08,000
Merci, excuse-moi, O.K.,

429
00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:09,000
parfait.

430
00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:11,000
The supposed intent of this

431
00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:13,000
resolution is to allow for

432
00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:14,000
participatory process with

433
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:15,000
residents, why is discussion of

434
00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:16,000
these options not actually

435
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:18,000
happening with the public input?

436
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:19,000
And is that happening with a

437
00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:21,000
developer who has a vested

438
00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:22,000
financial interest in the

439
00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:23,000
outcome?

440
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:25,000
>> Excellent question. I can't

441
00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:28,000
answer that question. I have the

442
00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:29,000
exact same question.

443
00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:31,000
>> -- I can answer --

444
00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:32,000
>> Please, Councillor Cowan, go

445
00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:33,000
ahead.

446
00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:35,000
>> There is litigation with

447
00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:38,000
Cadillac Fairview. That is a

448
00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:39,000
lawsuit that was brought against

449
00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:40,000
the City a while ago. There can

450
00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:43,000
be no conversation with Cadillac

451
00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:45,000
Fairview that can involve the

452
00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:46,000
public because of that

453
00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,000
litigation. So, it has to be

454
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:50,000
in-camera. It is like when you

455
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:51,000
-- are if you are going to have

456
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:56,000
a settlement discussion, the

457
00:15:56,000 --> 00:16:01,000
litigate ease litigatees -- just

458
00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:06,000
to get the conversation going.

459
00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:09,000
The conversation you --

460
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:11,000
-- recognized as necessary.

461
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:12,000
There has to be conversation

462
00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:13,000
with Cadillac Fairview. And so

463
00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,000
all this is doing the starting

464
00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:17,000
that conversation.

465
00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:18,000
>> -- party involved in the

466
00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:20,000
discussion about what

467
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:21,000
participatory process is going

468
00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:22,000
to happen.

469
00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:24,000
>> That is only to start.

470
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:25,000
Cadillac Fairview has not even

471
00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,000
agreed to this discussion. I

472
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:28,000
>> Understand that.

473
00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:30,000
>> Once this discussion gets

474
00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:31,000
underway, then maybe we are

475
00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:32,000
going to have the starting point

476
00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:34,000
to what you want. That is all we

477
00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:35,000
are trying to do, get to the

478
00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:36,000
starting line.

479
00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:37,000
>> So, since there is

480
00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:38,000
transparency -- you are saying

481
00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:41,000
everything is in-camera, there

482
00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:42,000
is transparency, this was to be

483
00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:43,000
transparency, but we can't hear

484
00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:44,000
anything about what's gonna

485
00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:45,000
happen in the meetings between

486
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:46,000
the director general and

487
00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:47,000
Cadillac Fairview.

488
00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:48,000
>> That's correct. Because

489
00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,000
there's litigation going on. But

490
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:52,000
what pops out of that, that is

491
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:53,000
where we start. And there is no

492
00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:54,000
commitment. The City won't be

493
00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:56,000
bound. Cadillac Fairview would

494
00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:57,000
not be bound at that point. But

495
00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,000
that is the start of the

496
00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:00,020
conversation. That will be

497
00:17:00,020 --> 00:17:01,020
public.

498
00:17:01,020 --> 00:17:03,020
>> I think our concern as public

499
00:17:03,020 --> 00:17:05,020
is that there is not -- I'm

500
00:17:05,020 --> 00:17:10,020
speaking for myself -- is that

501
00:17:10,020 --> 00:17:11,020
is there really no other option

502
00:17:11,020 --> 00:17:13,020
available that would involve a

503
00:17:13,020 --> 00:17:15,020
more participatory process, in

504
00:17:15,020 --> 00:17:16,020
saying, what is the best

505
00:17:16,020 --> 00:17:17,020
solution for our city? What is

506
00:17:17,020 --> 00:17:18,020
the best solution for the city

507
00:17:18,020 --> 00:17:20,020
center that would not involve

508
00:17:20,020 --> 00:17:21,020
in-camera meetings with Cadillac

509
00:17:21,020 --> 00:17:22,020
Fairview that we are not privy

510
00:17:22,020 --> 00:17:23,020
to?

511
00:17:23,020 --> 00:17:25,020
>> Well I don't see how you can

512
00:17:25,020 --> 00:17:26,020
have a conversation about

513
00:17:26,020 --> 00:17:27,020
somebody else's property without

514
00:17:27,020 --> 00:17:28,020
bringing them in.

515
00:17:28,020 --> 00:17:30,020
>> Kirkland -- did Kirkland do

516
00:17:30,020 --> 00:17:32,020
that?

517
00:17:32,020 --> 00:17:33,020
>> They brought them in.

518
00:17:33,020 --> 00:17:35,020
>> Okay. Exactly.

519
00:17:35,020 --> 00:17:37,020
>> The whole idea is to try to

520
00:17:37,020 --> 00:17:38,020
model what worked in Kirkland.

521
00:17:38,020 --> 00:17:39,020
>> There are enough, but if we

522
00:17:39,020 --> 00:17:40,020
can't be in those meetings, or

523
00:17:40,020 --> 00:17:42,020
we can't even know what is in

524
00:17:42,020 --> 00:17:44,020
those meetings and how do we

525
00:17:44,020 --> 00:17:45,020
know that we are not being told

526
00:17:45,020 --> 00:17:49,020
what is the best for us?

527
00:17:49,020 --> 00:17:51,020
>> Because, as I said, the

528
00:17:51,020 --> 00:17:52,020
meetings are only to get to the

529
00:17:52,020 --> 00:17:54,020
starting point. That is it.

530
00:17:54,020 --> 00:17:57,020
>> Allow me to intervene here.

531
00:17:57,020 --> 00:17:58,020
>> --

532
00:17:58,020 --> 00:17:59,020
>> The Kirkland process started

533
00:17:59,020 --> 00:18:00,080
this way at the outset and

534
00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:01,080
failed. Because what happened

535
00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:02,080
is, too much was behind closed

536
00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:04,080
doors. And by the time it got to

537
00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:05,080
the public, it was not

538
00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:07,080
acceptable. That is exactly what

539
00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:08,080
we are on a path to do right

540
00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:10,080
now. At the current moment, your

541
00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:13,080
questions are excellent. At the

542
00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:15,080
current moment, there is nothing

543
00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:17,080
stopping us from starting public

544
00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:18,080
participation right away,

545
00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:19,080
yesterday, the day before. We

546
00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:21,080
can do consultations or we can

547
00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:23,080
have open meetings and find out

548
00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:25,080
what you people want tomorrow.

549
00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:26,080
>> I think that is the confusing

550
00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:27,080
--

551
00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:28,080
>> And that is what I would like

552
00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:30,080
to have happen before the

553
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:31,080
conversations even start. That

554
00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:33,080
would be a preferable option

555
00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:35,080
from my perspective, to get with

556
00:18:35,080 --> 00:18:36,080
the public says first before we

557
00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:38,080
start the process, so that it

558
00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:40,080
structures how we think and how

559
00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:42,080
we engage the process as a

560
00:18:42,080 --> 00:18:44,080
Council or as a City Council.

561
00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:46,080
So, that would be my option,

562
00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:47,080
just let me get that on the

563
00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:49,080
record. And there is nothing

564
00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:52,080
that in is in this process that

565
00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:55,080
stops -- engaging in public

566
00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:56,080
participation tomorrow.

567
00:18:56,080 --> 00:18:57,080
>> Mister Mayor?

568
00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:58,080
>> Yes?

569
00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:00,040
>> I would like to say, that's

570
00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:01,040
what I hear --

571
00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:03,040
>> You are awfully

572
00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:05,040
conversational, Mr. Cowan. I

573
00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:06,040
wasn't

574
00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:08,040
>> I was impatient and called

575
00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:09,040
for public participation process

576
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:12,040
-- in July, in 2022. Nothing

577
00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:13,040
happened since. At Tuesday's

578
00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:15,040
meeting, you called for public

579
00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:16,040
consultations five months ago.

580
00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:18,040
Well, where were you, five

581
00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:19,040
months ago? We could have had

582
00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:20,040
public consultations in some

583
00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:22,040
kind of structured form five

584
00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,040
months ago. But you did not do

585
00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:25,040
anything.

586
00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:27,040
>> I tried to encourage and beg

587
00:19:27,040 --> 00:19:29,040
for that on the numerous RCI

588
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:31,040
meanings we had along the way,

589
00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:32,040
and Councillor Tremblay did the

590
00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:34,040
same. We tried in those

591
00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:36,040
meetings. But we are, of course,

592
00:19:36,040 --> 00:19:38,040
outnumbered, to have that

593
00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:39,040
happen. But it was structured in

594
00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:40,040
a different direction. And I'm

595
00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:42,040
very glad that it is being

596
00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:44,040
transparent now. And let me say

597
00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:46,040
that -- this process that we are

598
00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:48,040
engaging in now is not what I

599
00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,040
would call public participation.

600
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:52,040
This process is not public

601
00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:53,040
participation. This is anything

602
00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:55,040
but. It's a last-minute meeting

603
00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:57,040
called when you guys have had no

604
00:19:57,040 --> 00:19:58,040
preparation, no time to

605
00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:00,000
research. This is not public

606
00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:01,000
participation.

607
00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:02,000
>> It's definitely throwing out

608
00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:03,000
a lot of red flags for me, and

609
00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:04,000
that's why -- I think a lot of

610
00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:05,000
us have questions about the

611
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,000
process. I know I as a lot of

612
00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:10,000
questions. Will you permit me to

613
00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:11,000
ask a second question?

614
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:12,000
>> Yes. Yes, one more.

615
00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:14,000
>> Okay. Thank you. My

616
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:15,000
understanding about the purpose

617
00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:16,000
of the freeze originally, that

618
00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:19,000
everybody voted on, was that it

619
00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,000
would give us time to take a

620
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:22,000
look at the entire city, look at

621
00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:23,000
everything, how everything works

622
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:25,000
together, look at things

623
00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:26,000
holistically. So, what I see

624
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,000
coming down the line is that Mu1

625
00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:31,000
and Mu2 are going to end up

626
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:32,000
coming out of the freeze and

627
00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:34,000
they're going to be seeing

628
00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:35,000
separate separately from the

629
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:36,000
entire city. However, they are

630
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:37,000
the biggest project that is

631
00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:40,000
going to be happening in

632
00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:41,000
Pointe-Claire God knows how

633
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:42,000
long. And it's going to affect

634
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:45,000
so much of our city. And yet we

635
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:47,000
are left -- to get out of the

636
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:49,000
freeze, and let that just happen

637
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:50,000
on its own, while we are

638
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:51,000
considering everything else in

639
00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:54,000
the city. So, okay. Tara, you

640
00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:58,000
are saying that's not -- Mu1 and

641
00:20:58,000 --> 00:20:59,000
it Mu2 are not coming out of the

642
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:03,060
freeze them. That's the --

643
00:21:03,060 --> 00:21:04,060
purpose

644
00:21:04,060 --> 00:21:05,060
>> May I comment, Mr. Mayor?

645
00:21:05,060 --> 00:21:06,060
>> --

646
00:21:06,060 --> 00:21:08,060
>> The final outcome of this is,

647
00:21:08,060 --> 00:21:09,060
every property should come out

648
00:21:09,060 --> 00:21:12,060
of the freeze. That is how the

649
00:21:12,060 --> 00:21:13,060
since. The RCI --

650
00:21:13,060 --> 00:21:15,060
>> I understand -- that

651
00:21:15,060 --> 00:21:17,060
>> But no one is coming out of

652
00:21:17,060 --> 00:21:19,060
the freeze here. As you said, it

653
00:21:19,060 --> 00:21:21,060
is probably the most important

654
00:21:21,060 --> 00:21:23,060
and focal, central point of our

655
00:21:23,060 --> 00:21:25,060
city. And so, we need to start

656
00:21:25,060 --> 00:21:27,060
somewhere. And so we are

657
00:21:27,060 --> 00:21:28,060
starting here. We are looking at

658
00:21:28,060 --> 00:21:32,060
this. And actually, I mean --

659
00:21:32,060 --> 00:21:34,060
this is where we need the input.

660
00:21:34,060 --> 00:21:37,060
And what we are doing is, we are

661
00:21:37,060 --> 00:21:41,060
asking our D G DG to move

662
00:21:42,060 --> 00:21:43,060
forward -- and at that point, we

663
00:21:43,060 --> 00:21:45,060
do want to establish a committee

664
00:21:45,060 --> 00:21:47,060
of citizens. And citizens will

665
00:21:47,060 --> 00:21:48,060
elect in all likelihood. And

666
00:21:48,060 --> 00:21:49,060
they are the ones that are going

667
00:21:49,060 --> 00:21:51,060
to be working on this project,

668
00:21:51,060 --> 00:21:54,060
much like Kirkland did. This is

669
00:21:54,060 --> 00:21:56,060
just us trying to show you where

670
00:21:56,060 --> 00:21:57,060
we are going with this moving

671
00:21:57,060 --> 00:21:59,060
forward. And we need a starting

672
00:21:59,060 --> 00:22:01,020
point. It has been a year, as we

673
00:22:01,020 --> 00:22:02,020
said. And public consultation --

674
00:22:02,020 --> 00:22:03,020
we talked about five months ago,

675
00:22:03,020 --> 00:22:05,020
and it did not happen. And we

676
00:22:05,020 --> 00:22:07,020
are talking about who we have

677
00:22:07,020 --> 00:22:09,020
now got a contract with. And it

678
00:22:09,020 --> 00:22:11,020
is being objected. And so, once

679
00:22:11,020 --> 00:22:14,020
again, we are talking about not

680
00:22:14,020 --> 00:22:16,020
doing public consultations due

681
00:22:16,020 --> 00:22:18,020
to objections to who picked up

682
00:22:18,020 --> 00:22:19,020
the contract. So, when will

683
00:22:19,020 --> 00:22:20,020
these public consultations

684
00:22:20,020 --> 00:22:22,020
happen? We want people to come

685
00:22:22,020 --> 00:22:24,020
in and share our opinions. We

686
00:22:24,020 --> 00:22:25,020
want people talking about this.

687
00:22:25,020 --> 00:22:27,020
And that is what this is about.

688
00:22:27,020 --> 00:22:28,020
This is about us being

689
00:22:28,020 --> 00:22:30,020
transparent. Us saying, look,

690
00:22:30,020 --> 00:22:31,020
this is where we are -- we want

691
00:22:31,020 --> 00:22:32,020
you guys in on this. We are not

692
00:22:32,020 --> 00:22:34,020
trying to do this behind closed

693
00:22:34,020 --> 00:22:36,020
doors. We are trying to move

694
00:22:36,020 --> 00:22:37,020
forward. Nothing is being

695
00:22:37,020 --> 00:22:38,020
planned. There is no project

696
00:22:38,020 --> 00:22:42,020
here. There is nothing other

697
00:22:42,020 --> 00:22:44,020
than our DG going and saying,

698
00:22:44,020 --> 00:22:45,020
are you willing to talk? Are you

699
00:22:45,020 --> 00:22:46,020
willing to participate with the

700
00:22:46,020 --> 00:22:48,020
citizens?

701
00:22:49,020 --> 00:22:50,020
>> Well --

702
00:22:50,020 --> 00:22:51,020
>> It just looks like a. Setup I

703
00:22:51,020 --> 00:22:52,020
set up, for a set up, for a set

704
00:22:52,020 --> 00:22:53,020
of. It's just concerning because

705
00:22:53,020 --> 00:22:54,020
there's a lot that we don't know

706
00:22:54,020 --> 00:22:56,020
at this point. And there is --

707
00:22:56,020 --> 00:22:57,020
to me, there is a lot of red

708
00:22:57,020 --> 00:23:00,080
flags. And so --

709
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:01,080
>> Well, things need to be

710
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,080
structured. We can't just grow

711
00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:04,080
the doors open --

712
00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:05,080
>> Councillor Stainforth --

713
00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:08,080
>> You are allowed to respond --

714
00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,080
>> And I respond

715
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:11,080
>> He certainly can, Councillor

716
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:12,080
Stork.

717
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:13,080
>> Thank you, Mayor Thomas. Just

718
00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:14,080
to go back to the point in terms

719
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:16,080
of public participation between

720
00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:18,080
the conversation between the DG

721
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,080
and Cadillac Fairview, whatever

722
00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:21,080
comes out of that can still be

723
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:24,080
questioned. It is not whatever

724
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:25,080
comes out of that is final. It

725
00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:27,080
just to establish a public

726
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:28,080
participation process, to lay

727
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:29,080
down the framework of general

728
00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:32,080
guidelines of where we want to

729
00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:34,080
head. We can disagree with what

730
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:35,080
comes out of it. We are here

731
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:36,080
because we want to be

732
00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:37,080
transparent, because we do not

733
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,080
want to hide anything.

734
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:40,080
Resolution like this, it would

735
00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:42,080
have had but -- some other

736
00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:43,080
people would have liked, it

737
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:45,080
would've been passed at the

738
00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:46,080
Public council meeting and slid

739
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:49,080
through the backdoor. --

740
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:52,080
>> Who would that have been?

741
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:53,080
>> Excuse me, sir, I'm talking.

742
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,080
>> Who would that have been?

743
00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:56,080
That's incredible. That's

744
00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:57,080
incredible.

745
00:23:57,080 --> 00:23:58,080
>> You need help.

746
00:23:58,080 --> 00:23:59,080
>> Nope, I don't.

747
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:03,040
>> You need help. Thank you. Let

748
00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:06,040
me finish, please --

749
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,040
>> Councillor Stork --

750
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,040
>> Excuse me, sir. Excuse me --

751
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:14,040
>> -- process --

752
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:18,040
>> This is democratic. So, to

753
00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:20,040
your point --

754
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:23,040
>> Excuse me --

755
00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:24,040
>> Stainforth --

756
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,040
>> --

757
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:28,040
>> That's why we are here, to

758
00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:30,040
actually be transparent. The

759
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:33,040
reason we are at this stage is

760
00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:34,040
because, for seven months,

761
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:36,040
nothing has happened. And we

762
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:37,040
need to move this dossier

763
00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:39,040
forward. It is spinning its

764
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,040
wheels. And, through resolution

765
00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,040
is the only way we can force the

766
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:44,040
conversation to be had. It is

767
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:46,040
the only way we can force the

768
00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:48,040
conversation to be had. And it

769
00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:49,040
is not -- they are not going to

770
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:50,040
come back with, this is what is

771
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,040
this, this is what is that. No,

772
00:24:52,040 --> 00:24:53,040
there isn't a come back with a

773
00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:54,040
structure for public

774
00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:55,040
participation policy. And once

775
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:56,040
we get, that we can review it

776
00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:59,040
and see if we like it or not.

777
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:00,000
Like we said, we need a starting

778
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:01,000
point.

779
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:06,000
>> If I could speak Ms. Lucia

780
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:11,000
Lucier -- public participation

781
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:15,000
at the outset, despite

782
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:16,000
councillor Tremblay's and mine

783
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:17,000
my objections, -- happened

784
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:21,000
sooner -- that process was --

785
00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:23,000
along with, us which and hasn't

786
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,000
been attended properly, and I

787
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:26,000
have been at every single

788
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:28,000
meeting and so have not missed

789
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,000
one but others, can say the

790
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:31,000
same. I have been ready and

791
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:33,000
eager to get this process going.

792
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:35,000
And I would have liked, had I

793
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:36,000
had more control of the process,

794
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,000
to have had public participation

795
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:40,000
much earlier in the process. The

796
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,000
key to remembering all of this

797
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,000
is, what is going on here is

798
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,000
that, another party, a

799
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:48,000
developer, is being asked to

800
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,000
help determine -- or help

801
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:52,000
structure -- how this process

802
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:53,000
should occur. They should not

803
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:54,000
have special powers over above

804
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,000
the average citizen. And that is

805
00:25:57,000 --> 00:25:59,000
my objection here. Thank you.

806
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:00,060
>> The mayor --

807
00:26:00,060 --> 00:26:01,060
>> Speak --

808
00:26:01,060 --> 00:26:02,060
>> Of course, Councillor Cowan.

809
00:26:02,060 --> 00:26:04,060
>> There's another bit of

810
00:26:04,060 --> 00:26:05,060
misinformation. The developers

811
00:26:05,060 --> 00:26:08,060
not having any role at all in

812
00:26:08,060 --> 00:26:10,060
the -- structural -- they are

813
00:26:10,060 --> 00:26:11,060
only going to have a role in how

814
00:26:11,060 --> 00:26:12,060
they will participate in. And

815
00:26:12,060 --> 00:26:17,060
then if we accept the way --

816
00:26:17,060 --> 00:26:18,060
they will be agreeable going

817
00:26:18,060 --> 00:26:21,060
forward, they will -- sum -- the

818
00:26:21,060 --> 00:26:23,060
public. As I said, this is all

819
00:26:23,060 --> 00:26:24,060
to get to the start line. That

820
00:26:24,060 --> 00:26:27,060
is it. The start line will be

821
00:26:27,060 --> 00:26:28,060
completely open to the public.

822
00:26:28,060 --> 00:26:30,060
But we have to get there first.

823
00:26:30,060 --> 00:26:31,060
And we have got a catch 22. You

824
00:26:31,060 --> 00:26:34,060
have to talk to the property

825
00:26:34,060 --> 00:26:35,060
owner. You have to -- them into

826
00:26:35,060 --> 00:26:40,060
it. And this is the way to --

827
00:26:41,060 --> 00:26:42,060
them into it. They have got to

828
00:26:42,060 --> 00:26:43,060
build up trust in the process.

829
00:26:43,060 --> 00:26:44,060
They are not going to be wasting

830
00:26:44,060 --> 00:26:45,060
their time. They have a court

831
00:26:45,060 --> 00:26:47,060
case going because, well -- we

832
00:26:47,060 --> 00:26:49,060
can guess why they have a court

833
00:26:49,060 --> 00:26:51,060
case going. We have got to get

834
00:26:51,060 --> 00:26:53,060
around that. We have got to get

835
00:26:53,060 --> 00:26:55,060
through that. We have got to

836
00:26:55,060 --> 00:26:57,060
build mutual trust and we can

837
00:26:57,060 --> 00:26:58,060
start talking, with the public.

838
00:26:58,060 --> 00:27:00,020
So, yeah, we are asking -- we

839
00:27:00,020 --> 00:27:02,020
are putting our trust in the

840
00:27:02,020 --> 00:27:04,020
director general to be able to

841
00:27:04,020 --> 00:27:05,020
engage in that conversation and

842
00:27:05,020 --> 00:27:07,020
gather some. Where we are not

843
00:27:07,020 --> 00:27:09,020
talking with Cadillac Fairview,

844
00:27:09,020 --> 00:27:11,020
she is. And the mandate letter

845
00:27:11,020 --> 00:27:15,020
that will be distributed -- I

846
00:27:15,020 --> 00:27:16,020
don't know, perhaps tonight --

847
00:27:16,020 --> 00:27:18,020
but the mandate letter we will

848
00:27:18,020 --> 00:27:22,020
see from that, exactly, with the

849
00:27:22,020 --> 00:27:27,020
limits of her powers or ability

850
00:27:30,020 --> 00:27:31,020
-- engage, Cadillac Fairview,

851
00:27:31,020 --> 00:27:32,020
for the sole purpose of building

852
00:27:32,020 --> 00:27:35,020
trust. The mayor wants to

853
00:27:35,020 --> 00:27:36,020
destroy trust. That is what he

854
00:27:36,020 --> 00:27:37,020
is doing tonight.

855
00:27:37,020 --> 00:27:39,020
>> I am trying to -- I'm trying

856
00:27:39,020 --> 00:27:40,020
to encourage trust in the

857
00:27:40,020 --> 00:27:44,020
citizen -- Ms. nearby Lussier --

858
00:27:44,020 --> 00:27:48,020
the way, because there's lots of

859
00:27:48,020 --> 00:27:51,020
people online. The process --

860
00:27:51,020 --> 00:27:52,020
allowing citizens to the -- in

861
00:27:52,020 --> 00:27:53,020
the process at the same time,

862
00:27:53,020 --> 00:27:55,020
maybe even before the developer.

863
00:27:55,020 --> 00:27:56,020
That is the point that

864
00:27:56,020 --> 00:27:58,020
Councillor Cowan just detoured,

865
00:27:58,020 --> 00:28:01,080
which is crucial to it. You, the

866
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:02,080
citizen, should be speaking

867
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:03,080
before we are speaking to the

868
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:04,080
developer. Thank you.

869
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:07,080
>> -- I agree with that. But

870
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,080
just to radio rate, Councillor

871
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:11,080
Cowan, you are saying the -- is

872
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:16,080
gonna be coming with to -- ideas

873
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:18,080
the Cadillac Fairview. And not

874
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:19,080
the other way around?

875
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:20,080
>> It's reciprocal.

876
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:23,080
>> --

877
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,080
>> And we don't have a mandate,

878
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:26,080
though? That's going to be

879
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:27,080
public?

880
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,080
>> Yeah, I will be. Absolutely.

881
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:32,080
And that -- know exactly what

882
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:33,080
the limits of her conversation

883
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:37,080
is to get us, again, as I said,

884
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,080
to the start line. Ms. --

885
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:44,080
>> Ms. Verdone, you had

886
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:47,080
something to say? Thank you. Ms.

887
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:48,080
Lussier -- there's a lot of

888
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:50,080
people online.

889
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:58,080
>> Good evening, Mark Ably,

890
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:03,040
district one. -- two of the

891
00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:05,040
statements that are made, or two

892
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:07,040
of the phrases that are used to

893
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:10,040
figure out exactly what they

894
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,040
mean and so, Mister Mayor, I

895
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:14,040
hope you can give a good answer.

896
00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:16,040
But I would be happy if other

897
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:18,040
councillors wanted to weigh in

898
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:23,040
on this. How much of the forest

899
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:26,040
has the Québec Ministry of the

900
00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:27,040
Environment mandated the

901
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:28,040
protection of? The preamble says

902
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:29,040
the protection of the wetland.

903
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:32,040
Do we know how many hectares

904
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:37,040
that covers and how much it

905
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:40,040
excludes? And is it the same

906
00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:41,040
area, or is a different area

907
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,040
that is already covered by the

908
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:44,040
interim freeze on development

909
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:49,040
passed by the sea M M CMM?

910
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:53,040
>> We are not exactly sure what

911
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,040
those numbers are from the

912
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:56,040
Québec Environment minister. We

913
00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:58,040
are not clear on that. As of

914
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:02,000
yet, it is not clear to us.

915
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,000
>> And none of the councillors

916
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:06,000
--

917
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:07,000
>> Of course --

918
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:08,000
>> On this

919
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,000
>> Yes, we are waiting for the

920
00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:11,000
response from them. We haven't

921
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:12,000
requested, that absolutely.

922
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,000
>> So, when the Québec Ministry

923
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:16,000
of the Environment issued its

924
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,000
mandate, what exactly did it

925
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:20,000
say? Are we allowed to know?

926
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:23,000
>> We don't have it.

927
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:24,000
>> Mr. Mayor --

928
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:25,000
>> Yes?

929
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:26,000
>> We have a communication from

930
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,000
Cadillac Fairview that they

931
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,000
received a specifications about

932
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:32,000
what lands had to be protected

933
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:34,000
because they are in a wetland.

934
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:36,000
But we, as the city, has not

935
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,000
received, itself, an official

936
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:39,000
word from the government. That

937
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,000
is my understanding.

938
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:42,000
>> That seems quite

939
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:43,000
extraordinary.

940
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:46,000
>> Doesn't it?

941
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:50,000
>> -- the right --

942
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:53,000
>> Excuse me, you are supposed

943
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:56,000
to speak to the comm before you

944
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:58,000
get to speak -- Councillor

945
00:30:58,000 --> 00:30:59,000
Stainforth --

946
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:00,060
>> I would say, Councillor

947
00:31:00,060 --> 00:31:01,060
Stainforth, that they may be the

948
00:31:01,060 --> 00:31:03,060
owners, but the citizens of

949
00:31:03,060 --> 00:31:04,060
Pointe-Claire have a right to

950
00:31:04,060 --> 00:31:06,060
that kind of information coming

951
00:31:06,060 --> 00:31:08,060
from the provincial government.

952
00:31:08,060 --> 00:31:10,060
Do we know how much land is

953
00:31:10,060 --> 00:31:14,060
covered by the interim freeze on

954
00:31:14,060 --> 00:31:16,060
development passed by the CMM --

955
00:31:16,060 --> 00:31:19,060
>> We do, we do. -- all of it at

956
00:31:19,060 --> 00:31:21,060
the moment.

957
00:31:21,060 --> 00:31:22,060
>> And so, I know there are a

958
00:31:22,060 --> 00:31:23,060
lot of people -- so, I will just

959
00:31:23,060 --> 00:31:24,060
ask one more related question,

960
00:31:24,060 --> 00:31:28,060
and then I will sit down. What

961
00:31:28,060 --> 00:31:30,060
role or what is the interim

962
00:31:30,060 --> 00:31:32,060
freeze passed by the CMM that is

963
00:31:32,060 --> 00:31:33,060
not mentioned in either

964
00:31:33,060 --> 00:31:36,060
resolution or the preamble --

965
00:31:36,060 --> 00:31:37,060
so, what role does that play?

966
00:31:37,060 --> 00:31:38,060
Are we simply ignoring that or

967
00:31:38,060 --> 00:31:40,060
pretending it does not exist or

968
00:31:40,060 --> 00:31:44,060
are we saying this will become a

969
00:31:44,060 --> 00:31:45,060
relevant when it's passed? What

970
00:31:45,060 --> 00:31:46,060
does that leave us?

971
00:31:46,060 --> 00:31:47,060
>> That's an excellent question.

972
00:31:47,060 --> 00:31:48,060
And it has not been considered

973
00:31:48,060 --> 00:31:49,060
in the process.

974
00:31:49,060 --> 00:31:51,060
>> --

975
00:31:51,060 --> 00:31:52,060
>> Address that --

976
00:31:52,060 --> 00:31:54,060
>> No, Councillor -- I'm tired.

977
00:31:54,060 --> 00:31:58,060
I want to hear Councillor Stork.

978
00:31:59,060 --> 00:32:00,020
>> Cede the floor to Councillor

979
00:32:00,020 --> 00:32:01,020
--

980
00:32:01,020 --> 00:32:04,020
>> Okay, thank you. You did

981
00:32:04,020 --> 00:32:05,020
express the need to speak.

982
00:32:05,020 --> 00:32:06,020
>> -- interim control bylaw. And

983
00:32:06,020 --> 00:32:08,020
for my understanding, what it

984
00:32:08,020 --> 00:32:12,020
does is, it's putting a freeze

985
00:32:12,020 --> 00:32:13,020
on certain areas of green spaces

986
00:32:13,020 --> 00:32:15,020
on the island of Montréal that

987
00:32:15,020 --> 00:32:16,020
appeared in the final version.

988
00:32:16,020 --> 00:32:17,020
They were not there in the

989
00:32:17,020 --> 00:32:22,020
draft. In the first draft, it

990
00:32:22,020 --> 00:32:23,020
only applied to the crown around

991
00:32:23,020 --> 00:32:26,020
Montréal with a --

992
00:32:26,020 --> 00:32:27,020
We only green space on the

993
00:32:27,020 --> 00:32:28,020
island of Montréal that was

994
00:32:28,020 --> 00:32:30,020
identified. Again, from my

995
00:32:30,020 --> 00:32:31,020
reading of it, it appears that

996
00:32:31,020 --> 00:32:34,020
what they are saying is that

997
00:32:34,020 --> 00:32:36,020
they are going to ask the

998
00:32:36,020 --> 00:32:38,020
provincial government to make it

999
00:32:38,020 --> 00:32:39,020
a straightforward process to

1000
00:32:39,020 --> 00:32:42,020
define the market value of land

1001
00:32:42,020 --> 00:32:46,020
that is identified frozen in the

1002
00:32:46,020 --> 00:32:47,020
interim controlled bylaw, so

1003
00:32:47,020 --> 00:32:51,020
that, if a City wanted to buy or

1004
00:32:51,020 --> 00:32:52,020
expropriate that land it would

1005
00:32:52,020 --> 00:32:53,020
be a fast track to determining

1006
00:32:53,020 --> 00:32:54,020
the value. So, you would not

1007
00:32:54,020 --> 00:32:56,020
have to go into years in court.

1008
00:32:56,020 --> 00:32:59,020
And then, in the end, once that

1009
00:32:59,020 --> 00:33:03,080
law is in place, if it gets to

1010
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:06,080
be ever put in place, then the

1011
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:07,080
city would have the ability to

1012
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:09,080
buy the land at market value.

1013
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:11,080
That is the way -- and then once

1014
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:13,080
it bought the land, then the

1015
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:14,080
Montréal metropolitan community

1016
00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:18,080
with allow to be rezoned green.

1017
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:24,080
>> -- -- more, Mr. Ably, that's

1018
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:26,080
Councillor Cowan's

1019
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:27,080
Interpretation. -- next

1020
00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:29,080
prochaine question? Question?

1021
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:35,080
- Bonsoir! Hello

1022
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:37,080
. Regardless --

1023
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,080
>> Excuse me --

1024
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:40,080
>> Sorry, before you start, can

1025
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:42,080
you state your name, please?

1026
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:44,080
>> Yes, sure. I don't come

1027
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:47,080
Nathalie Leconte. Very often --

1028
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:49,080
Natalie -- regardless of how

1029
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:51,080
this meeting has come into play,

1030
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:52,080
I'm still grateful it's

1031
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:54,080
happening. I'm grateful for

1032
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:55,080
everyone who has made it happen.

1033
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:57,080
I know there's a lot of polar

1034
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:00,040
positions on it. I'm just here

1035
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:03,040
as a resident. Who was involved

1036
00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:06,040
in Valois district three

1037
00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:07,040
revitalization from 2016 to

1038
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:09,040
2019, which I found super

1039
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,040
helpful, and then radio silence

1040
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,040
and -- I'm actually here because

1041
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,040
I assisted Cadillac Fairview's

1042
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:17,040
public information session that

1043
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,040
they organized on March 30th.

1044
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:22,040
And I had heard of it through my

1045
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:23,040
personal network, not through

1046
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:24,040
online publications or, to my

1047
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,040
knowledge, to the City's

1048
00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:29,040
website. So, that was very much

1049
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:30,040
a presentation with regards to,

1050
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:31,040
here is what we are planning to

1051
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:33,040
do. And it was more of a public

1052
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:35,040
approval, in my opinion, as I

1053
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:37,040
experienced it. So, I'm really

1054
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:40,040
excited when I hear Ms. a

1055
00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:42,040
Stainforth -- my pronouncing

1056
00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:44,040
that correctly -- yeah? Thank

1057
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:46,040
you? -- presentation. --

1058
00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:47,040
legalese, but I can understand

1059
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:48,040
the process of what you are

1060
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,040
trying to achieve. What I'm

1061
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:51,040
concerned about is what you is

1062
00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:52,040
going to happen after that

1063
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:53,040
process has begun to be

1064
00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:57,040
achieved. I was a community

1065
00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:59,040
mobilize or for a few years in a

1066
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:02,000
neighbourhood in NDG. And I am

1067
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:03,000
still a community worker today.

1068
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:06,000
So, my question that I am coming

1069
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:07,000
to is something that has been

1070
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,000
brought up. But I would like to

1071
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:13,000
know, given Cadillac Fairview's

1072
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:16,000
economic goals, impact, vision

1073
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:19,000
and lack of communication, I

1074
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:21,000
want to say bilateral

1075
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:22,000
communication between

1076
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:23,000
yourselves, the public and so

1077
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:26,000
forth -- even if you have not

1078
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:27,000
fully decided yet -- because it

1079
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:30,000
seems we are not at that point,

1080
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:31,000
who do you plan to be ahead of

1081
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:32,000
this public consultation

1082
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:35,000
process? You mentioned --

1083
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:36,000
committee. I just want to make

1084
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:40,000
sure that it's not just going to

1085
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:41,000
be the CF. Because when I read

1086
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,000
Cadillac Fairview -- and I read

1087
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:44,000
mutually agreeable, I was a

1088
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:45,000
little bit nervous with the

1089
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:47,000
people that have all the money.

1090
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:48,000
Having an equal position and

1091
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:49,000
something they should not have

1092
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:51,000
an equal position in -- even

1093
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:52,000
though they are the owners of

1094
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:53,000
the property, I do believe the

1095
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,000
City of Pointe-Claire has more

1096
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:57,000
power than that. And number two,

1097
00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:00,060
can you promise me, as an

1098
00:36:00,060 --> 00:36:01,060
individual, as someone who would

1099
00:36:01,060 --> 00:36:03,060
like to have my family here,

1100
00:36:03,060 --> 00:36:04,060
that passing this resolution and

1101
00:36:04,060 --> 00:36:08,060
removing the ICB does not mean

1102
00:36:08,060 --> 00:36:09,060
that Cadillac Fairview will be

1103
00:36:09,060 --> 00:36:11,060
the primary rent on this

1104
00:36:11,060 --> 00:36:13,060
project, with their own

1105
00:36:13,060 --> 00:36:15,060
objectives? And that the City of

1106
00:36:15,060 --> 00:36:16,060
Pointe-Claire will not be swayed

1107
00:36:16,060 --> 00:36:17,060
by their financial and

1108
00:36:17,060 --> 00:36:19,060
litigation threats?

1109
00:36:21,060 --> 00:36:23,060
>> I won't be.

1110
00:36:23,060 --> 00:36:24,060
>> May I respond?

1111
00:36:24,060 --> 00:36:25,060
>> Sure, absolutely, Councillor.

1112
00:36:25,060 --> 00:36:27,060
>> These a few things I just

1113
00:36:27,060 --> 00:36:30,060
want to highlight. When there

1114
00:36:30,060 --> 00:36:32,060
was the public meeting at

1115
00:36:32,060 --> 00:36:33,060
Cadillac Fairview, that was

1116
00:36:33,060 --> 00:36:34,060
Cadillac Fairview a's public

1117
00:36:34,060 --> 00:36:35,060
meeting. It was not the cities.

1118
00:36:35,060 --> 00:36:36,060
That is why it was on their

1119
00:36:36,060 --> 00:36:38,060
website, they advertised. It it

1120
00:36:38,060 --> 00:36:39,060
was not something that we

1121
00:36:39,060 --> 00:36:40,060
advertise. People were welcome

1122
00:36:40,060 --> 00:36:42,060
to go. That was something that

1123
00:36:42,060 --> 00:36:44,060
they were sharing with you. It

1124
00:36:44,060 --> 00:36:46,060
was not approval, disapproval.

1125
00:36:46,060 --> 00:36:47,060
We have not begun that public

1126
00:36:47,060 --> 00:36:49,060
participation. They wanted to

1127
00:36:49,060 --> 00:36:51,060
share with you. This is not a

1128
00:36:51,060 --> 00:36:53,060
resolution to remove them from

1129
00:36:53,060 --> 00:36:56,060
the RCI. Because you said, I

1130
00:36:56,060 --> 00:36:57,060
just want to be clear that it's

1131
00:36:57,060 --> 00:36:59,060
not -- it's a resolution, as has

1132
00:36:59,060 --> 00:37:00,020
been mentioned tonight, for

1133
00:37:00,020 --> 00:37:02,020
starting point, because, in my

1134
00:37:02,020 --> 00:37:03,020
opinion, if we don't do this

1135
00:37:03,020 --> 00:37:05,020
resolution, we are going to go

1136
00:37:05,020 --> 00:37:06,020
nowhere. We need to start having

1137
00:37:06,020 --> 00:37:08,020
the public participation. We

1138
00:37:08,020 --> 00:37:10,020
want that process to start. We

1139
00:37:10,020 --> 00:37:12,020
want to move forward. We must

1140
00:37:12,020 --> 00:37:13,020
move forward. And so, that was

1141
00:37:13,020 --> 00:37:15,020
the whole point of coming here

1142
00:37:15,020 --> 00:37:17,020
today, or passing the resolution

1143
00:37:17,020 --> 00:37:19,020
today, and to try to structure.

1144
00:37:19,020 --> 00:37:20,020
It's not, they are going to

1145
00:37:20,020 --> 00:37:22,020
dictate to us or we are going to

1146
00:37:22,020 --> 00:37:24,020
dictate them. It's about talking

1147
00:37:24,020 --> 00:37:26,020
about what can work best to

1148
00:37:26,020 --> 00:37:28,020
truly have your public

1149
00:37:28,020 --> 00:37:29,020
participation valuable, count,

1150
00:37:29,020 --> 00:37:31,020
interactive, registered,

1151
00:37:31,020 --> 00:37:35,020
structured, not just haphazard,

1152
00:37:35,020 --> 00:37:36,020
here and there and everywhere.

1153
00:37:36,020 --> 00:37:37,020
Because this is very important.

1154
00:37:37,020 --> 00:37:39,020
We all recognize this. We all of

1155
00:37:39,020 --> 00:37:40,020
our beautiful city. We want the

1156
00:37:40,020 --> 00:37:42,020
best possible outcome. That is

1157
00:37:42,020 --> 00:37:44,020
truly the point. And so, there

1158
00:37:44,020 --> 00:37:45,020
are some of us who really

1159
00:37:45,020 --> 00:37:46,020
believe that this is step one,

1160
00:37:46,020 --> 00:37:47,020
and if we don't do this, we are

1161
00:37:47,020 --> 00:37:49,020
going to go nowhere. So, that is

1162
00:37:49,020 --> 00:37:51,020
really what it is about. We will

1163
00:37:51,020 --> 00:37:52,020
have ongoing dialogue. I am

1164
00:37:52,020 --> 00:37:54,020
always there to answer any

1165
00:37:54,020 --> 00:37:55,020
further clarifications. But I

1166
00:37:55,020 --> 00:37:57,020
just want to want to clarify

1167
00:37:57,020 --> 00:37:59,020
some of those points for you.

1168
00:37:59,020 --> 00:38:01,080
>> We have been participating.

1169
00:38:01,080 --> 00:38:03,080
We have been meeting on a

1170
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:05,080
regular basis on exactly these

1171
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,080
matters. And it was no need for

1172
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,080
this. We have been moving along.

1173
00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:10,080
We have had progressive

1174
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:12,080
meetings, productive meetings,

1175
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:14,080
extensively, since we started

1176
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:16,080
the process. It was a process

1177
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:17,080
given to, us decided upon by

1178
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:19,080
Council and the administration.

1179
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:22,080
We have not missed -- we have

1180
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:23,080
met our goals. We have gone

1181
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,080
along, as we were going. And

1182
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:27,080
there is no need to do this. We

1183
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:29,080
were proceeding accordingly. And

1184
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:31,080
we should, absolutely, before

1185
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,080
doing this, have public

1186
00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:35,080
participation. We should -- if

1187
00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:36,080
-- before doing this process,

1188
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:37,080
which has nothing to do with

1189
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:39,080
what we were doing -- nothing to

1190
00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:41,080
do with it -- this is an

1191
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:42,080
accelerated, I, think artificial

1192
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:44,080
exercise. And we were doing just

1193
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:47,080
fine. And nothing about this --

1194
00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:49,080
I would love to accelerate

1195
00:38:49,080 --> 00:38:50,080
public participation. I would

1196
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:52,080
love that. If that is the result

1197
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:54,080
of this, and we agreed to do it

1198
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:55,080
tomorrow, I'm a happy camper.

1199
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:57,080
And I think we should have that

1200
00:38:57,080 --> 00:38:59,080
public consultation and

1201
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,040
participation prior to any

1202
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:04,040
mandate letter or any discussion

1203
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:05,040
with Cadillac Fairview. And

1204
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:06,040
what's being done right now is

1205
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:07,040
that Cadillac Fairview is being

1206
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:09,040
allowed into a process where it

1207
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,040
controls and determines, as has

1208
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:13,040
a say, in what type of public

1209
00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:15,040
participation is going to occur.

1210
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,040
Read that resolution.

1211
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:18,040
>> May I comment?

1212
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:21,040
>> Of course, Councillor Stork.

1213
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:22,040
That's

1214
00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:23,040
>> Your interpretation, once

1215
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:24,040
again.

1216
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:25,040
>> No.

1217
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:26,040
>> Yes, that's your

1218
00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:27,040
interpretation. So, if

1219
00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:29,040
everything is online and on par,

1220
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,040
wasn't that stated just two days

1221
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:34,040
ago that we were five months

1222
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:35,040
behind?

1223
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:36,040
>> Who stated that?

1224
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:37,040
>> You did.

1225
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:38,040
>> No.

1226
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:42,040
>> -- five months behind the we

1227
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:43,040
are five months behind, in my

1228
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:44,040
opinion, in public

1229
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:45,040
participation. In fact, we

1230
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:46,040
should have been doing public

1231
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:47,040
participation right at the

1232
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:48,040
outset.

1233
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,040
>> And Councillor Tremblay, and

1234
00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:52,040
I, if we had had our way, would

1235
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:54,040
have liked it much sooner, and

1236
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:55,040
Councillor Tedford, who is no

1237
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:57,040
longer on Council, we are all

1238
00:39:57,040 --> 00:39:58,040
arguing to have that far sooner

1239
00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:00,000
in the process then what is

1240
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:01,000
still in the system.

1241
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:04,000
>> -- like it much sooner. And

1242
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:05,000
we are behind on public

1243
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:06,000
participation.

1244
00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:08,000
>> May I finish? Because I was

1245
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:10,000
not finished.

1246
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:12,000
>> Let's --

1247
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:14,000
>> You said on Tuesday that you

1248
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:15,000
would like this process to start

1249
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:17,000
five months earlier. So, in our

1250
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:18,000
--

1251
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:20,000
>> Participation start --

1252
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:23,000
>> -- in our plan, when should

1253
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:25,000
the consultations, in Council,

1254
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:27,000
to discuss this process, when

1255
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:29,000
should they have started?

1256
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:32,000
>> Are you asking me? It's

1257
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:33,000
question period. It's not for

1258
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:35,000
you to question, Councillor

1259
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:36,000
Stork. It's a question period

1260
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:38,000
for the citizens, Councillor

1261
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:40,000
Stork. They are to come up to

1262
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:41,000
the mic. Councillors are not to

1263
00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:42,000
take the time away from the

1264
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:44,000
citizens to ask questions and

1265
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:45,000
circumvent the process away from

1266
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,000
the citizens. Thank you. It --

1267
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:49,000
>> I will let the next person

1268
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:52,000
go. But I do see that, given all

1269
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:54,000
the different voices on the

1270
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:56,000
council, I appreciate everyone

1271
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:58,000
making an effort in trying to

1272
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:01,060
come to an agreement. I, even

1273
00:41:01,060 --> 00:41:03,060
though I am a full-on supporter

1274
00:41:03,060 --> 00:41:04,060
of Fairview, because I care

1275
00:41:04,060 --> 00:41:06,060
about the forest, I care about

1276
00:41:06,060 --> 00:41:09,060
green spaces, I am also going to

1277
00:41:09,060 --> 00:41:11,060
trust that everyone is trying to

1278
00:41:11,060 --> 00:41:13,060
do the best they can. But I will

1279
00:41:13,060 --> 00:41:15,060
be knocking on peoples doors if

1280
00:41:15,060 --> 00:41:17,060
I don't hear about public

1281
00:41:17,060 --> 00:41:18,060
consultations. And I want to

1282
00:41:18,060 --> 00:41:23,060
trust the process. But, just

1283
00:41:23,060 --> 00:41:24,060
saying that, if this is what

1284
00:41:24,060 --> 00:41:25,060
happens in public, I am

1285
00:41:25,060 --> 00:41:27,060
concerned about what happens

1286
00:41:27,060 --> 00:41:28,060
behind closed doors. And I that

1287
00:41:28,060 --> 00:41:33,060
at every level. So, thank you.

1288
00:41:34,060 --> 00:41:36,060
>> Mr. Mayor --

1289
00:41:36,060 --> 00:41:39,060
>> Next question --

1290
00:41:39,060 --> 00:41:40,060
>> Councillor Tremblay --

1291
00:41:40,060 --> 00:41:42,060
>> An opportunity to speak --

1292
00:41:42,060 --> 00:41:44,060
>> Yes, a -- voice.

1293
00:41:44,060 --> 00:41:45,060
>> -- pitched as an exercise in

1294
00:41:45,060 --> 00:41:49,060
transparency. Being privy to a

1295
00:41:49,060 --> 00:41:50,060
lot of the documentation that

1296
00:41:50,060 --> 00:41:52,060
all of my fellow councillors are

1297
00:41:52,060 --> 00:41:56,060
exposed to, I tend to feel that

1298
00:41:56,060 --> 00:41:59,060
the word transparency and that

1299
00:41:59,060 --> 00:42:02,020
this is just merely an attempt

1300
00:42:02,020 --> 00:42:04,020
to begin the process, we only

1301
00:42:04,020 --> 00:42:08,020
want to communicate, is a little

1302
00:42:08,020 --> 00:42:10,020
light. I think that the

1303
00:42:10,020 --> 00:42:12,020
resolution that we have before

1304
00:42:12,020 --> 00:42:14,020
us is not as innocuous as you

1305
00:42:14,020 --> 00:42:16,020
might believe it to be. I think

1306
00:42:16,020 --> 00:42:20,020
it is a serious document that

1307
00:42:20,020 --> 00:42:22,020
will pushes, potentially, in a

1308
00:42:22,020 --> 00:42:26,020
direction that exposes us to a

1309
00:42:26,020 --> 00:42:28,020
situation that will not allow us

1310
00:42:28,020 --> 00:42:31,020
to control the way we should

1311
00:42:31,020 --> 00:42:36,020
control the process of

1312
00:42:36,020 --> 00:42:37,020
participatory urban planning

1313
00:42:37,020 --> 00:42:39,020
exercises that we need to go

1314
00:42:39,020 --> 00:42:44,020
through with the public. In

1315
00:42:44,020 --> 00:42:46,020
addition to, that I just want to

1316
00:42:46,020 --> 00:42:48,020
speak to the matter of the

1317
00:42:48,020 --> 00:42:51,020
urgency or not behind the whole

1318
00:42:51,020 --> 00:42:55,020
process. Both Councillor Cowan

1319
00:42:55,020 --> 00:43:00,080
and myself, at the urging of Mr.

1320
00:43:02,080 --> 00:43:03,080
Weemaes at the time, were very,

1321
00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:05,080
very bullish, in terms of

1322
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:06,080
meeting aggressively in the

1323
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:07,080
summer. The first meeting that

1324
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:09,080
was scheduled for July 9th. It

1325
00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:10,080
got cancelled because no one

1326
00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:12,080
could attend. The second meeting

1327
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:14,080
was July 16th. The same result

1328
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:16,080
-- the first meeting was July

1329
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:17,080
30th. It was a wonderful

1330
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:19,080
meeting. The meetings we have

1331
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:21,080
had since that point have been

1332
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:22,080
excellent. The administration

1333
00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:27,080
has provided

1334
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:32,080
-- the administration has

1335
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:34,080
provided a great deal of

1336
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,080
information, well presented,

1337
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,080
well exposed. It still needs

1338
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:40,080
some work in terms of what we

1339
00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:43,080
can do in terms of public

1340
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:45,080
participation and what that

1341
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:47,080
process might involve. But the

1342
00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:50,080
meetings have been far too

1343
00:43:50,080 --> 00:43:52,080
infrequent and irregularly

1344
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,080
attended, so that we can create

1345
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:56,080
a momentum to the point where we

1346
00:43:56,080 --> 00:43:58,080
want to be able to get to. So,

1347
00:43:58,080 --> 00:43:59,080
the idea that we are trying to

1348
00:43:59,080 --> 00:44:02,040
throw this in as a moment of

1349
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:03,040
transparency or that we are

1350
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:06,040
dragging our heels, I think, it

1351
00:44:06,040 --> 00:44:10,040
is generous. I will leave it

1352
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:11,040
there. I have other comments to

1353
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:13,040
make regarding the resolution

1354
00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:15,040
later. But I just want to make

1355
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:17,040
it -- I want to be able to

1356
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:18,040
stress my point of view in that

1357
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:19,040
regard, and allow you to ask

1358
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:21,040
your questions.

1359
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:27,040
>> Good evening, my name is

1360
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:32,040
Andrea Allen Guy -- Cadillac

1361
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:38,040
Fairview being a massive project

1362
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:40,040
that has potential massive

1363
00:44:40,040 --> 00:44:42,040
effects going forward, so we

1364
00:44:42,040 --> 00:44:44,040
really can't afford to get this

1365
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:46,040
wrong. So, my question -- and I

1366
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:48,040
will explain why I'm asking this

1367
00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:49,040
question is, what kind of

1368
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:51,040
safeguards will be put in place

1369
00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:53,040
if there are issues with the

1370
00:44:53,040 --> 00:44:55,040
Fairview project? And the reason

1371
00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:57,040
why I am asking this this is

1372
00:44:57,040 --> 00:44:58,040
that I am living the aftermath

1373
00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:01,000
of the Sotramont project. As

1374
00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:04,000
residents of Austin, we have

1375
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,000
asked for contingency plans in

1376
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:07,000
case there were issues with this

1377
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:09,000
project. But we were told it

1378
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:10,000
would not be necessary and if

1379
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:12,000
there was a profit problem that

1380
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:14,000
came up, it would be dealt with.

1381
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:16,000
So, as you know, this project

1382
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,000
was also built on wetlands. And

1383
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:20,000
so now we are dealing with

1384
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:22,000
numerous issues, including

1385
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:25,000
residents houses flooding. And a

1386
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:27,000
hedge -- a privacy hedge that

1387
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,000
has not been able to hold up, we

1388
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:32,000
are stuck with a ditch that

1389
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:34,000
breeds a bunch of mosquitoes.

1390
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:35,000
And so this is the situation

1391
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:40,000
that we are faced with. And so,

1392
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:43,000
when we asked what facility will

1393
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:45,000
do about this, we are told it's

1394
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:47,000
a case study on how something

1395
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:49,000
should not be done. So, the

1396
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:50,000
Fairview project looks, feels

1397
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:53,000
very similar to what I have

1398
00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:55,000
experienced, but in a

1399
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:57,000
potentially much bigger

1400
00:45:57,000 --> 00:45:59,000
experience scale. Again, what I

1401
00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:02,060
would like to know is, what is

1402
00:46:02,060 --> 00:46:03,060
the safeguards and contingency

1403
00:46:03,060 --> 00:46:06,060
plans that will be put in place

1404
00:46:06,060 --> 00:46:07,060
to ensure that this is not a

1405
00:46:07,060 --> 00:46:11,060
repeat of the Sotramont

1406
00:46:11,060 --> 00:46:13,060
disaster.

1407
00:46:13,060 --> 00:46:14,060
>> A very good question.

1408
00:46:14,060 --> 00:46:17,060
>> Mr. Mayor -- a friendly

1409
00:46:17,060 --> 00:46:19,060
reminder that the question must

1410
00:46:19,060 --> 00:46:20,060
bear on the --

1411
00:46:20,060 --> 00:46:22,060
>> It does, absolutely. She is

1412
00:46:22,060 --> 00:46:23,060
hoping that what we are engaging

1413
00:46:23,060 --> 00:46:24,060
in that won't result in the same

1414
00:46:24,060 --> 00:46:26,060
result. And she is worried that

1415
00:46:26,060 --> 00:46:27,060
this process that we are

1416
00:46:27,060 --> 00:46:29,060
discussing will have a negative

1417
00:46:29,060 --> 00:46:30,060
result, much like the one she

1418
00:46:30,060 --> 00:46:31,060
has lived through. I think that

1419
00:46:31,060 --> 00:46:33,060
is totally apropos of the

1420
00:46:33,060 --> 00:46:37,060
subject and not off-base at all.

1421
00:46:37,060 --> 00:46:39,060
And I think I would like to say

1422
00:46:39,060 --> 00:46:42,060
that it is absolutely on my

1423
00:46:42,060 --> 00:46:44,060
mind. A bad example is paramount

1424
00:46:44,060 --> 00:46:47,060
to me. I got elected to prevent

1425
00:46:47,060 --> 00:46:48,060
that kind of thing. And I hope

1426
00:46:48,060 --> 00:46:50,060
that I can in this instance. And

1427
00:46:50,060 --> 00:46:52,060
we are talking about this

1428
00:46:52,060 --> 00:46:53,060
instance. And I will do my

1429
00:46:53,060 --> 00:46:55,060
absolute best. And that is

1430
00:46:55,060 --> 00:46:56,060
engineering, that is the city

1431
00:46:56,060 --> 00:46:58,060
administration. That is every

1432
00:46:58,060 --> 00:46:59,060
single department working at

1433
00:46:59,060 --> 00:47:01,020
their utmost to make sure that

1434
00:47:01,020 --> 00:47:02,020
we don't duplicate what happened

1435
00:47:02,020 --> 00:47:04,020
there. I think we -- do that. I

1436
00:47:04,020 --> 00:47:05,020
think we have an excellent

1437
00:47:05,020 --> 00:47:07,020
administration. And I think that

1438
00:47:07,020 --> 00:47:08,020
that can be done. I think that

1439
00:47:08,020 --> 00:47:10,020
is -- keep reminding us.

1440
00:47:10,020 --> 00:47:14,020
>> --

1441
00:47:14,020 --> 00:47:18,020
>> Are there any other comments?

1442
00:47:18,020 --> 00:47:19,020
All right. Thank you.

1443
00:47:19,020 --> 00:47:21,020
>> Thank you.

1444
00:47:26,020 --> 00:47:29,020
Bonsoir, je vais faire une

1445
00:47:29,020 --> 00:47:30,020
introduction...

1446
00:47:30,020 --> 00:47:31,020
- Juste s'il vous plaît

1447
00:47:31,020 --> 00:47:35,020
mentionner votre nom.

1448
00:47:35,020 --> 00:47:36,020
(rires)

1449
00:47:36,020 --> 00:47:37,020
(inaudible)

1450
00:47:37,020 --> 00:47:39,020
Pour tout le monde... va

1451
00:47:39,020 --> 00:47:41,020
seulement pour madame. Je ne

1452
00:47:41,020 --> 00:47:45,020
suis pas offensé du tout. On

1453
00:47:46,020 --> 00:47:49,020
sait très bien que ce projet-là,

1454
00:47:49,020 --> 00:47:53,020
le projet, la loi doit être

1455
00:47:54,020 --> 00:47:59,020
observé de tous. Ça inclut

1456
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:04,080
Fairview, ça inclut la ville, ça

1457
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:07,080
inclut, dans ce cas-ci, le

1458
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,080
gouvernement à propos des terres

1459
00:48:09,080 --> 00:48:12,080
humides et toutes. Est-ce qu'il

1460
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:17,080
y a un potentiel que la Ville ou

1461
00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:20,080
Fairview... je ne peux pas

1462
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:22,080
parler pour les autres, qu'ils

1463
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:25,080
brisent la loi. Est-ce qu'il y a

1464
00:48:25,080 --> 00:48:28,080
un potentiel?

1465
00:48:28,080 --> 00:48:31,080
- Je pense que non. Je pense que

1466
00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:32,080
non.

1467
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:33,080
- Ça me rassure déjà.

1468
00:48:33,080 --> 00:48:35,080
- Il peut faire un projet les

1469
00:48:35,080 --> 00:48:37,080
mais briser la loi, non.

1470
00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:38,080
- Absolument.

1471
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:40,080
- Il peut faire un projet qui ne

1472
00:48:40,080 --> 00:48:41,080
s'agencent pas avec la ville

1473
00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:45,080
mais illégale, non.

1474
00:48:45,080 --> 00:48:46,080
- Je le sais par expérience

1475
00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:47,080
qu'il y a beaucoup de projets

1476
00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:52,080
qui ont été déposés, étudié par

1477
00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:54,080
notre personnel, par

1478
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:56,080
l'ingénierie légale, finance ou

1479
00:48:56,080 --> 00:49:01,040
quoi que ce soit. Et puis, le

1480
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:06,040
projet est modifié en chemin.

1481
00:49:08,040 --> 00:49:10,040
Vous comprenez ce que je dis?

1482
00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:11,040
Des fois, même moi je parle et

1483
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:16,040
je me confonds. Comment

1484
00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:22,040
pouvez-vous vous objecter à

1485
00:49:22,040 --> 00:49:23,040
quelque chose qui n'a pas été

1486
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:28,040
présenté? C'est l'essentiel d'un

1487
00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:31,040
dialogue. Ça ne compromet pas la

1488
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:33,040
Ville, ça ne compromet pas

1489
00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:37,040
Fairview. Je suis sûr qu'ils ont

1490
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:41,040
du personnel compétent,

1491
00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:42,040
ultra-compétents qui ne

1492
00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:43,040
présenteront pas quelque chose

1493
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:47,040
de tout croche mais advenant que

1494
00:49:47,040 --> 00:49:49,040
l'ingénierie arrive ou

1495
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:53,040
l'urbanisme, quoi que ce soit,

1496
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:58,040
advenant qu'il y ait un

1497
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,000
accroc... ça, je peux parler

1498
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:03,000
pour Fairview, quand tu as un

1499
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:05,000
investissement de cette

1500
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:07,000
grandeur-là, si c'est déplacer

1501
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:11,000
une porte, un trottoir, une

1502
00:50:11,000 --> 00:50:15,000
entrée, ils vont le faire. Alors

1503
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:17,000
tout ce que je trouve de ne pas

1504
00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:18,000
correct... tout ce qui n'est pas

1505
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:19,000
correct avec ça, c'est qu'il n'y

1506
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:21,000
a pas de date. On sera amorcé au

1507
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:23,000
même point. Donnez-vous, je ne

1508
00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:25,000
sais pas moi, si Fairview est

1509
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:28,000
prêt à présenter quelque chose à

1510
00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:32,000
notre directeur général et

1511
00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:34,000
commencer avec ça? Parce que

1512
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:36,000
moi, je peux lancer une rumeur,

1513
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:39,000
il paraît que Fairview veut

1514
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:40,000
faire une mine d'Asbestos avec

1515
00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:45,000
le terrain. Il y a des citoyens

1516
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:51,000
qui disent ça. Il n'y a jamais

1517
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:53,000
été question que la forêt soit

1518
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:58,000
coupé net. La loi existait avant

1519
00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:02,060
et elle existe toujours alors

1520
00:51:02,060 --> 00:51:05,060
c'est mes commentaires. La seule

1521
00:51:05,060 --> 00:51:07,060
réponse qu'il y a...

1522
00:51:07,060 --> 00:51:10,060
- Pour moi, Claude, les choses

1523
00:51:10,060 --> 00:51:14,060
importantes ici, qu'on a déjà

1524
00:51:14,060 --> 00:51:16,060
proposé, pas des projets

1525
00:51:16,060 --> 00:51:19,060
officiels mais des images, des

1526
00:51:19,060 --> 00:51:22,060
idées, des édifices de 27 étages

1527
00:51:22,060 --> 00:51:25,060
déjà. Alors la Ville de

1528
00:51:25,060 --> 00:51:26,060
Pointe-Claire ne voudraient pas

1529
00:51:26,060 --> 00:51:28,060
ça. Ils avaient déjà présenté

1530
00:51:28,060 --> 00:51:29,060
ça. Mais ce n'est pas le débat

1531
00:51:29,060 --> 00:51:33,060
ici, le débat, c'est le

1532
00:51:34,060 --> 00:51:35,060
processus pour décider ce qu'ils

1533
00:51:35,060 --> 00:51:39,060
vont créer. Et ça, on est en

1534
00:51:39,060 --> 00:51:41,060
besoin, la perspective des

1535
00:51:41,060 --> 00:51:43,060
citoyens pour faire ça. Avant

1536
00:51:43,060 --> 00:51:47,060
qu'on parle ou qu'on accepte une

1537
00:51:48,060 --> 00:51:52,060
proposition de Fairview, on

1538
00:51:52,060 --> 00:51:56,060
voudrait les idées, le goût des

1539
00:51:56,060 --> 00:51:58,060
citoyens, c'est ça qui est

1540
00:51:58,060 --> 00:51:59,060
absolument nécessaire. Je vous

1541
00:51:59,060 --> 00:52:03,020
comprends très bien mais le

1542
00:52:03,020 --> 00:52:06,020
citoyen en consultation ne peut

1543
00:52:06,020 --> 00:52:08,020
pas discuter d'à peu près

1544
00:52:08,020 --> 00:52:09,020
n'importe quoi. Il faut qu'il y

1545
00:52:09,020 --> 00:52:13,020
ait quelque chose de présenter

1546
00:52:13,020 --> 00:52:15,020
sérieusement. Oui, ensemble,

1547
00:52:15,020 --> 00:52:17,020
dans un processus sérieux. Un

1548
00:52:17,020 --> 00:52:21,020
processus légal et juste. On ne

1549
00:52:22,020 --> 00:52:23,020
va pas arriver et discuter si le

1550
00:52:23,020 --> 00:52:26,020
projet a Fairview... sans avoir

1551
00:52:26,020 --> 00:52:29,020
la moindre détail... le moindre

1552
00:52:29,020 --> 00:52:31,020
détail vous chercher à choisir

1553
00:52:31,020 --> 00:52:34,020
la couleur des rideaux. Voyons,

1554
00:52:34,020 --> 00:52:36,020
ça n'a pas de bon sens. Il faut

1555
00:52:36,020 --> 00:52:38,020
commencer avec une base. Merci

1556
00:52:38,020 --> 00:52:39,020
de m'avoir écouté.

1557
00:52:39,020 --> 00:52:43,020
- Merci, Claude. Merci beaucoup.

1558
00:52:43,020 --> 00:52:44,020
-

1559
00:52:44,020 --> 00:52:45,020
>> Excuse me, Mister Mayor,

1560
00:52:45,020 --> 00:52:46,020
Madison asked --

1561
00:52:46,020 --> 00:52:47,020
Madame Verdun, est-ce que c'est

1562
00:52:47,020 --> 00:52:48,020
possible de monter la

1563
00:52:48,020 --> 00:52:49,020
température un petit peu? On

1564
00:52:49,020 --> 00:52:51,020
gèle.

1565
00:52:51,020 --> 00:52:54,020
(brouhaha)

1566
00:52:56,020 --> 00:53:00,080
>> -- make a call --

1567
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:01,080
>> Okay.

1568
00:53:01,080 --> 00:53:03,080
>> I agree. It's freezing in

1569
00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:05,080
here my hands are ice.

1570
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:08,080
>> -- Watson, Pointe-Claire. Can

1571
00:53:08,080 --> 00:53:10,080
you hear me?

1572
00:53:10,080 --> 00:53:11,080
>> --

1573
00:53:11,080 --> 00:53:13,080
>> I agree with what was said

1574
00:53:13,080 --> 00:53:16,080
before, regarding the red flags.

1575
00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:18,080
And for me, what raise the red

1576
00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:20,080
flags, if you recall, when there

1577
00:53:20,080 --> 00:53:22,080
was RCI and there was discussion

1578
00:53:22,080 --> 00:53:23,080
of exempting Cadillac Fairview

1579
00:53:23,080 --> 00:53:25,080
from the freeze, a lot of you

1580
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:26,080
held town halls and you gave a

1581
00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:28,080
lot of information about how,

1582
00:53:28,080 --> 00:53:31,080
instead of doing the RCI -- I

1583
00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:32,080
forget what it was you kept

1584
00:53:32,080 --> 00:53:33,080
proposing -- and then you all

1585
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:35,080
realized, oh, no, it wasn't

1586
00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:36,080
really the right way to go. And

1587
00:53:36,080 --> 00:53:39,080
then we put Cadillac Fairview in

1588
00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:42,080
the freeze. So, I am troubled

1589
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:45,080
that this has come up, this

1590
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:46,080
resolution. Because it feels

1591
00:53:46,080 --> 00:53:47,080
like you are doing the same

1592
00:53:47,080 --> 00:53:50,080
thing. And I wish -- I mean, is

1593
00:53:50,080 --> 00:53:52,080
there a legal requirement for

1594
00:53:52,080 --> 00:53:54,080
this resolution? Is it legally

1595
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:57,080
required to do this? Is it?

1596
00:53:57,080 --> 00:53:58,080
>> No. We don't have to do it

1597
00:53:58,080 --> 00:54:02,040
legally, no. There is no --

1598
00:54:02,040 --> 00:54:03,040
>> -- process --

1599
00:54:03,040 --> 00:54:06,040
>> This resolution -- this is an

1600
00:54:06,040 --> 00:54:08,040
unnecessary process that is not

1601
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:09,040
legally required. We could have

1602
00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:10,040
continued our process along, as

1603
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:13,040
we were doing. This is an

1604
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:15,040
unnecessary -- just after

1605
00:54:15,040 --> 00:54:16,040
Christmas.

1606
00:54:16,040 --> 00:54:17,040
>> Is it possible to hear from

1607
00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:20,040
the director general? --

1608
00:54:20,040 --> 00:54:22,040
Madame Verdun, est-ce que c'est

1609
00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:23,040
légalement requis d'avoir cette

1610
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:24,040
réservation-là pour avoir les

1611
00:54:24,040 --> 00:54:26,040
démarches pour les consultations

1612
00:54:26,040 --> 00:54:31,040
et etc.? D'avoir des

1613
00:54:32,040 --> 00:54:34,040
discussions, aujourd'hui, c'est

1614
00:54:34,040 --> 00:54:36,040
une résolution qui me donne une

1615
00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:39,040
orientation du conseil municipal

1616
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:40,040
sur mon travail que j'ai à

1617
00:54:40,040 --> 00:54:44,040
faire. Donc la majorité du

1618
00:54:44,040 --> 00:54:45,040
public veut s'assurer que j'ai

1619
00:54:45,040 --> 00:54:46,040
un mandat clair.

1620
00:54:46,040 --> 00:54:47,040
- Mais ce n'est pas légalement

1621
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:50,040
requis?

1622
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:51,040
- Je ne vais pas répondre à

1623
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:52,040
cette question, je vous

1624
00:54:52,040 --> 00:54:53,040
répondrai demain.

1625
00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:57,040
- D'accord, merci.

1626
00:54:57,040 --> 00:55:00,000
>> Okay. So, thank you for that.

1627
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:02,000
Je ne sais I don't pas... know

1628
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:03,000
why -- it's to me tomorrow.

1629
00:55:03,000 --> 00:55:04,000
Pourquoi ce sera demain. -- en

1630
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:06,000
tout cas. What I would like to

1631
00:55:06,000 --> 00:55:08,000
know, also, is that there has

1632
00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:11,000
been some talk about public

1633
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:12,000
participation and public

1634
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:13,000
consultation. So, can someone

1635
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:15,000
please explain the difference?

1636
00:55:15,000 --> 00:55:16,000
Because I'm concerned that there

1637
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:17,000
is some sort of legal

1638
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:18,000
ramifications to one and the

1639
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:21,000
other. And I don't want us to

1640
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:22,000
get screwed over by having a

1641
00:55:22,000 --> 00:55:23,000
public consultation and not a

1642
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:24,000
participation --

1643
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:25,000
>> Participation is the better

1644
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:29,000
term, Ms. Watson. Because --

1645
00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:31,000
something went -- where's

1646
00:55:31,000 --> 00:55:33,000
participation, you are getting

1647
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:35,000
people in greater in the

1648
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:36,000
process.

1649
00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:37,000
>> Mr. Mayor, may I please

1650
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:38,000
clarify?

1651
00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:39,000
>> Absolutely.

1652
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:40,000
>> There are several points in

1653
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:43,000
the process of passing a bylaw,

1654
00:55:43,000 --> 00:55:46,000
where the law requires public

1655
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:48,000
consultation. So, that is when,

1656
00:55:48,000 --> 00:55:51,000
here, in Council, before voting

1657
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:53,000
on a bylaw at that point, the

1658
00:55:53,000 --> 00:55:55,000
public must be allowed to weigh

1659
00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:58,000
in. So, in order to prevent

1660
00:55:58,000 --> 00:56:01,060
confusion, we are talking about

1661
00:56:01,060 --> 00:56:02,060
public participation is, the

1662
00:56:02,060 --> 00:56:03,060
stuff that happens out there.

1663
00:56:03,060 --> 00:56:06,060
And public consultation is the

1664
00:56:06,060 --> 00:56:07,060
formal consultation required by

1665
00:56:07,060 --> 00:56:08,060
law.

1666
00:56:08,060 --> 00:56:09,060
>> Thank you for clearing that.

1667
00:56:09,060 --> 00:56:11,060
That's very helpful. Because --

1668
00:56:11,060 --> 00:56:15,060
okay. Now I am also confused by

1669
00:56:15,060 --> 00:56:18,060
what we said earlier. So, you

1670
00:56:18,060 --> 00:56:20,060
all have been meeting regularly

1671
00:56:20,060 --> 00:56:22,060
for this RCI process, but

1672
00:56:22,060 --> 00:56:23,060
apparently, not all of you have

1673
00:56:23,060 --> 00:56:26,060
been able to make it and

1674
00:56:26,060 --> 00:56:27,060
attendance is sketchy or

1675
00:56:27,060 --> 00:56:28,060
whatever. So, this is the

1676
00:56:28,060 --> 00:56:31,060
answer? Doing this resolution?

1677
00:56:31,060 --> 00:56:32,060
Okay.

1678
00:56:32,060 --> 00:56:33,060
>> May I speak to that?

1679
00:56:33,060 --> 00:56:34,060
>> You can. We

1680
00:56:34,060 --> 00:56:36,060
>> Were mostly at the meetings.

1681
00:56:36,060 --> 00:56:38,060
But the last meeting that was in

1682
00:56:38,060 --> 00:56:39,060
December was this vehicle for

1683
00:56:39,060 --> 00:56:40,060
some people because they were --

1684
00:56:40,060 --> 00:56:42,060
during the day and there are

1685
00:56:42,060 --> 00:56:45,060
some of us who work full-time.

1686
00:56:45,060 --> 00:56:47,060
Initially, we were meeting every

1687
00:56:47,060 --> 00:56:49,060
other Friday. But closer to the

1688
00:56:49,060 --> 00:56:50,060
holidays, it became impossible.

1689
00:56:50,060 --> 00:56:52,060
-- as of January, every other

1690
00:56:52,060 --> 00:56:53,060
Friday afternoon would be a

1691
00:56:53,060 --> 00:56:54,060
meeting. And then the other one

1692
00:56:54,060 --> 00:56:55,060
would be in the evenings to

1693
00:56:55,060 --> 00:56:57,060
allow for those of us who have

1694
00:56:57,060 --> 00:56:58,060
full-time jobs to be able to

1695
00:56:58,060 --> 00:56:59,060
attend as well. Because this is

1696
00:56:59,060 --> 00:57:01,020
not our only job that we do. And

1697
00:57:01,020 --> 00:57:04,020
it is not sketchy. I would say

1698
00:57:04,020 --> 00:57:06,020
our attendance -- I would say

1699
00:57:06,020 --> 00:57:07,020
those standing have maybe missed

1700
00:57:07,020 --> 00:57:09,020
one or two based on certain

1701
00:57:09,020 --> 00:57:10,020
personal issues.

1702
00:57:10,020 --> 00:57:11,020
>> Oh. Okay.

1703
00:57:11,020 --> 00:57:12,020
>> It's not sketchy. It's just

1704
00:57:12,020 --> 00:57:13,020
that we had to get the

1705
00:57:13,020 --> 00:57:15,020
scheduling down. That was easier

1706
00:57:15,020 --> 00:57:16,020
for everyone to be able to

1707
00:57:16,020 --> 00:57:17,020
attend and we wanted something

1708
00:57:17,020 --> 00:57:20,020
to be more regular. But that is

1709
00:57:20,020 --> 00:57:21,020
a different process than the

1710
00:57:21,020 --> 00:57:23,020
resolution. The RCI is the total

1711
00:57:23,020 --> 00:57:24,020
process that we need to do for

1712
00:57:24,020 --> 00:57:27,020
our entire city. But we

1713
00:57:27,020 --> 00:57:28,020
recognize that we want to also

1714
00:57:28,020 --> 00:57:30,020
move forward in other

1715
00:57:30,020 --> 00:57:31,020
directions. Because we just way

1716
00:57:31,020 --> 00:57:32,020
to do the whole entire thing,

1717
00:57:32,020 --> 00:57:34,020
it's going to take us six years.

1718
00:57:34,020 --> 00:57:35,020
That is not realistic.

1719
00:57:35,020 --> 00:57:37,020
>> Well, when you are looking at

1720
00:57:37,020 --> 00:57:39,020
the future of the city, the next

1721
00:57:39,020 --> 00:57:41,020
50 -- because, as you know, the

1722
00:57:41,020 --> 00:57:42,020
next 50 to 100 years is what we

1723
00:57:42,020 --> 00:57:43,020
have to look ahead, I think six

1724
00:57:43,020 --> 00:57:44,020
years is nothing --

1725
00:57:44,020 --> 00:57:46,020
>> We are --

1726
00:57:46,020 --> 00:57:47,020
>> Six years --

1727
00:57:47,020 --> 00:57:51,020
>> Excuse me, Councillor --

1728
00:57:51,020 --> 00:57:52,020
>> -- impact of --

1729
00:57:52,020 --> 00:57:54,020
>> It's not going to be even

1730
00:57:54,020 --> 00:57:55,020
remotely close to six years. On

1731
00:57:55,020 --> 00:57:56,020
the route we were going, it was

1732
00:57:56,020 --> 00:57:58,020
not even going to be close to

1733
00:57:58,020 --> 00:58:00,080
two. So, I agree with what you

1734
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:02,080
are saying. It has already been

1735
00:58:02,080 --> 00:58:04,080
close to -- yes, it has been

1736
00:58:04,080 --> 00:58:05,080
already -- and we are almost

1737
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:06,080
through. And we have to get the

1738
00:58:06,080 --> 00:58:08,080
public participation. And by the

1739
00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:12,080
way, the term going forward --

1740
00:58:12,080 --> 00:58:14,080
the term better uses public

1741
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:15,080
participation.

1742
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:16,080
>> Okay.

1743
00:58:16,080 --> 00:58:17,080
>> Because it involves the

1744
00:58:17,080 --> 00:58:19,080
citizens prior, not after.

1745
00:58:19,080 --> 00:58:20,080
>> Okay. Well, thank you very

1746
00:58:20,080 --> 00:58:21,080
much.

1747
00:58:21,080 --> 00:58:22,080
>> May I speak just for a

1748
00:58:22,080 --> 00:58:23,080
moment?

1749
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:24,080
>> Of course, Councillor.

1750
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:25,080
>> I just want to address --

1751
00:58:25,080 --> 00:58:26,080
because you brought up the

1752
00:58:26,080 --> 00:58:28,080
attendance thing. And Kelly

1753
00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:30,080
mentioned it. I have missed one

1754
00:58:30,080 --> 00:58:31,080
or two meetings. Unfortunately,

1755
00:58:31,080 --> 00:58:33,080
I require substitute. I can't

1756
00:58:33,080 --> 00:58:35,080
just leave my students alone,

1757
00:58:35,080 --> 00:58:38,080
they are five. We have planned

1758
00:58:38,080 --> 00:58:39,080
on almost all the meetings on

1759
00:58:39,080 --> 00:58:41,080
days where I could either take

1760
00:58:41,080 --> 00:58:46,080
the day off or it be a PED day

1761
00:58:47,080 --> 00:58:48,080
and I -- unfortunately, I

1762
00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:50,080
believe there was one day,

1763
00:58:50,080 --> 00:58:52,080
maybe, where I was unable to

1764
00:58:52,080 --> 00:58:55,080
attend, because my substitute

1765
00:58:55,080 --> 00:58:56,080
cancels. It's

1766
00:58:56,080 --> 00:58:57,080
>> Really, okay I'm just trying

1767
00:58:57,080 --> 00:58:58,080
to understand.

1768
00:58:58,080 --> 00:58:59,080
>> It's because it's been

1769
00:58:59,080 --> 00:59:00,040
brought up numerous times -- so

1770
00:59:00,040 --> 00:59:01,040
I would like to clarify.

1771
00:59:01,040 --> 00:59:02,040
>> You have all brought it up,

1772
00:59:02,040 --> 00:59:04,040
actually. And I was just trying

1773
00:59:04,040 --> 00:59:05,040
to clarify the origin of this

1774
00:59:05,040 --> 00:59:06,040
resolution. That's. All

1775
00:59:06,040 --> 00:59:08,040
>> Mister Mayor -- I can help

1776
00:59:08,040 --> 00:59:11,040
there.

1777
00:59:11,040 --> 00:59:14,040
>> The process that the mayor is

1778
00:59:14,040 --> 00:59:16,040
talking about, that process has

1779
00:59:16,040 --> 00:59:18,040
led to the overture to Cadillac

1780
00:59:18,040 --> 00:59:20,040
Fairview. The overture to

1781
00:59:20,040 --> 00:59:21,040
Cadillac Fairview -- which is

1782
00:59:21,040 --> 00:59:22,040
underway. We are just talking

1783
00:59:22,040 --> 00:59:24,040
about -- that overture was just

1784
00:59:24,040 --> 00:59:26,040
in writing. What we are talking

1785
00:59:26,040 --> 00:59:27,040
about now, like exchange of

1786
00:59:27,040 --> 00:59:28,040
letters, what we are talking

1787
00:59:28,040 --> 00:59:29,040
about now is trying to get to

1788
00:59:29,040 --> 00:59:32,040
the next phase where people

1789
00:59:32,040 --> 00:59:33,040
actually sit in a room and talk

1790
00:59:33,040 --> 00:59:35,040
to each other. So, that process

1791
00:59:35,040 --> 00:59:36,040
is the part of the process that

1792
00:59:36,040 --> 00:59:37,040
the mayor was talking about. The

1793
00:59:37,040 --> 00:59:40,040
only thing that is different

1794
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:41,040
about today is that we are doing

1795
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:43,040
this publicly. We are now making

1796
00:59:43,040 --> 00:59:45,040
that what we have been doing. We

1797
00:59:45,040 --> 00:59:47,040
are now putting it out there in

1798
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:51,040
public, number one. And two, by

1799
00:59:51,040 --> 00:59:52,040
doing it in a public resolution,

1800
00:59:52,040 --> 00:59:55,040
we are giving the director

1801
00:59:55,040 --> 00:59:56,040
general specific instructions

1802
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:58,040
from Council to guide that

1803
00:59:58,040 --> 01:00:02,000
conversation. So, the special

1804
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:04,000
meeting itself was not part of

1805
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:08,000
this ongoing process. But the

1806
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:11,000
conversation was and is.

1807
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:13,000
>> I really wish I could support

1808
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:14,000
this resolution. I really do.

1809
01:00:14,000 --> 01:00:16,000
But because of the words

1810
01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:17,000
mutually agreeable are in their,

1811
01:00:17,000 --> 01:00:21,000
scared the Jesus out of me. And

1812
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:23,000
unfortunately, with that kind of

1813
01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:24,000
resolution, I cannot support

1814
01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:25,000
this resolution. But -- because

1815
01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:27,000
of the language of the

1816
01:00:27,000 --> 01:00:28,000
resolution, I cannot support,

1817
01:00:28,000 --> 01:00:29,000
it. Sir

1818
01:00:29,000 --> 01:00:31,000
>> Ms. Watson, when I think.

1819
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:32,000
This will end up in a process

1820
01:00:32,000 --> 01:00:33,000
where people will sit in a room

1821
01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:35,000
and talk to each other without

1822
01:00:35,000 --> 01:00:39,000
public input.

1823
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:40,000
>> Mr.

1824
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:42,000
- Monsieur Lapointe?

1825
01:00:46,000 --> 01:00:50,000
LaPointe --

1826
01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:52,000
>> And that it's actually a

1827
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:53,000
political intervention at this

1828
01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:54,000
point.

1829
01:00:54,000 --> 01:00:56,000
>> Okay.

1830
01:00:56,000 --> 01:00:58,000
Si je peux, Madame la greffière,

1831
01:00:58,000 --> 01:00:59,000
est-ce que je peux mentionner le

1832
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:01,060
nombre de réunions qu'on a eu?

1833
01:01:14,060 --> 01:01:17,060
-- where we can actually get to

1834
01:01:17,060 --> 01:01:18,060
the point where we can deliver

1835
01:01:18,060 --> 01:01:19,060
on a variety of things that we

1836
01:01:19,060 --> 01:01:20,060
want to do, where we want to get

1837
01:01:20,060 --> 01:01:25,060
to. So, I'm very happy -- I'm

1838
01:01:26,060 --> 01:01:27,060
happy that Councillor

1839
01:01:27,060 --> 01:01:28,060
Thorstad-Cullen that we are

1840
01:01:28,060 --> 01:01:30,060
going to increase the cadence of

1841
01:01:30,060 --> 01:01:31,060
these going through the years,

1842
01:01:31,060 --> 01:01:33,060
and that's an important thing as

1843
01:01:33,060 --> 01:01:37,060
well. And then, I think, based

1844
01:01:37,060 --> 01:01:39,060
on the fact -- I will wait.

1845
01:01:39,060 --> 01:01:40,060
Because I've got comments later.

1846
01:01:40,060 --> 01:01:42,060
I want to wait and summarize

1847
01:01:42,060 --> 01:01:45,060
everything -- I will let other

1848
01:01:45,060 --> 01:01:46,060
people speak.

1849
01:01:46,060 --> 01:01:47,060
>> Thank you.

1850
01:01:47,060 --> 01:01:48,060
>> --

1851
01:01:48,060 --> 01:01:49,060
- Monsieur Lapointe ou Linda?

1852
01:01:49,060 --> 01:01:50,060
>> Or, Linda?

1853
01:01:50,060 --> 01:01:52,060
>> Linda do with

1854
01:01:55,060 --> 01:02:00,020
DeWitt -- at length about how

1855
01:02:00,020 --> 01:02:01,020
back from conversations with

1856
01:02:01,020 --> 01:02:03,020
Cadillac Fairview had obligated

1857
01:02:03,020 --> 01:02:05,020
the city to a certain course of

1858
01:02:05,020 --> 01:02:06,020
action, and that we were

1859
01:02:06,020 --> 01:02:08,020
reneging on our backroom deals.

1860
01:02:08,020 --> 01:02:10,020
And now --

1861
01:02:10,020 --> 01:02:11,020
>> Near Mr., point of privilege

1862
01:02:11,020 --> 01:02:12,020
--

1863
01:02:12,020 --> 01:02:13,020
>> No idea what she's talking

1864
01:02:13,020 --> 01:02:15,020
about, backroom -- we

1865
01:02:15,020 --> 01:02:16,020
>> Did not use that expression.

1866
01:02:16,020 --> 01:02:18,020
It's my expression but --

1867
01:02:18,020 --> 01:02:19,020
>> Yes --

1868
01:02:19,020 --> 01:02:21,020
>> You are saying --

1869
01:02:21,020 --> 01:02:23,020
>> Right now --

1870
01:02:23,020 --> 01:02:26,020
>> No. You stated that --

1871
01:02:26,020 --> 01:02:28,020
>> Councillor Cowan, you don't

1872
01:02:28,020 --> 01:02:29,020
operate a citizen. If he has to

1873
01:02:29,020 --> 01:02:31,020
alter her question, she will

1874
01:02:31,020 --> 01:02:34,020
alter her question. But please

1875
01:02:34,020 --> 01:02:35,020
refrain from operating a

1876
01:02:35,020 --> 01:02:36,020
citizen.

1877
01:02:36,020 --> 01:02:37,020
>> You said --

1878
01:02:37,020 --> 01:02:39,020
>> Mr. I Mayor, I'm just asking

1879
01:02:39,020 --> 01:02:41,020
her to be respectful. That's.

1880
01:02:41,020 --> 01:02:42,020
All

1881
01:02:42,020 --> 01:02:43,020
>> -- obligations to Cadillac

1882
01:02:43,020 --> 01:02:44,020
Fairview and all these

1883
01:02:44,020 --> 01:02:45,020
obligations were not done in

1884
01:02:45,020 --> 01:02:46,020
public. They were done in

1885
01:02:46,020 --> 01:02:47,020
private. And now, in response to

1886
01:02:47,020 --> 01:02:51,020
that, you would like to hold

1887
01:02:51,020 --> 01:02:52,020
in-camera meetings with Cadillac

1888
01:02:52,020 --> 01:02:55,020
Fairview. And the -- that was

1889
01:02:55,020 --> 01:02:57,020
imposed, including the Cadillac

1890
01:02:57,020 --> 01:02:59,020
Fairview property, is absolutely

1891
01:02:59,020 --> 01:03:01,080
necessary if we are to redo our

1892
01:03:01,080 --> 01:03:03,080
planning program properly. And I

1893
01:03:03,080 --> 01:03:05,080
submit that gross incompetence

1894
01:03:05,080 --> 01:03:08,080
on the part of previous

1895
01:03:08,080 --> 01:03:10,080
administrations allowed the

1896
01:03:10,080 --> 01:03:12,080
zoning Mu1 to be created, which

1897
01:03:12,080 --> 01:03:16,080
has no maximum density, no

1898
01:03:16,080 --> 01:03:17,080
minimum setbacks, no maximum

1899
01:03:17,080 --> 01:03:20,080
height, nothing about the kind

1900
01:03:20,080 --> 01:03:21,080
of buildings that can be put

1901
01:03:21,080 --> 01:03:24,080
their. So, when Cadillac

1902
01:03:24,080 --> 01:03:25,080
Fairview submitted a project

1903
01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:26,080
with over 1200 dwellings per

1904
01:03:26,080 --> 01:03:30,080
hectare, when the TOD recommend

1905
01:03:30,080 --> 01:03:32,080
60 dwellings per hectare, there

1906
01:03:32,080 --> 01:03:33,080
is nothing in the zoning

1907
01:03:33,080 --> 01:03:34,080
regulations that would have

1908
01:03:34,080 --> 01:03:36,080
prevented. The only thing the

1909
01:03:36,080 --> 01:03:38,080
City can really do is to rezone

1910
01:03:38,080 --> 01:03:41,080
it properly. And I submit, also,

1911
01:03:41,080 --> 01:03:42,080
that Pointe-Claire does not need

1912
01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:43,080
this huge development. It would

1913
01:03:43,080 --> 01:03:45,080
be like importing a city to our

1914
01:03:45,080 --> 01:03:48,080
city. Why? What good would it do

1915
01:03:48,080 --> 01:03:51,080
for us? And besides which,

1916
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:53,080
Pointe-Claire has no idea when,

1917
01:03:53,080 --> 01:03:57,080
if our infrastructure could

1918
01:03:57,080 --> 01:03:58,080
support this --

1919
01:03:58,080 --> 01:03:59,080
>> Ms. DeWitt, we are not

1920
01:03:59,080 --> 01:04:03,040
debating the project -- we are

1921
01:04:03,040 --> 01:04:04,040
debating --

1922
01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:05,040
>> I know --

1923
01:04:05,040 --> 01:04:07,040
>> We are debating -- I am

1924
01:04:07,040 --> 01:04:08,040
saying, --

1925
01:04:08,040 --> 01:04:09,040
>> We don't need to do a side

1926
01:04:09,040 --> 01:04:10,040
view of Cadillac Fairview right

1927
01:04:10,040 --> 01:04:12,040
now. -- it's not to the

1928
01:04:12,040 --> 01:04:13,040
advantage of the city. It's not

1929
01:04:13,040 --> 01:04:14,040
to the advantage of the

1930
01:04:14,040 --> 01:04:15,040
citizens. And I would like to

1931
01:04:15,040 --> 01:04:18,040
see us go through the -- of our

1932
01:04:18,040 --> 01:04:19,040
new planning program with the

1933
01:04:19,040 --> 01:04:22,040
zoning that we want and then let

1934
01:04:22,040 --> 01:04:23,040
Cadillac Fairview negotiate with

1935
01:04:23,040 --> 01:04:25,040
the zoning that is created.

1936
01:04:25,040 --> 01:04:28,040
[Applause]

1937
01:04:28,040 --> 01:04:29,040
>> Apparently, we are not

1938
01:04:29,040 --> 01:04:33,040
allowed to applaud.

1939
01:04:33,040 --> 01:04:34,040
>> So, I think that this

1940
01:04:34,040 --> 01:04:36,040
resolution is completely

1941
01:04:36,040 --> 01:04:39,040
unnecessary. And why would you

1942
01:04:39,040 --> 01:04:40,040
do something that is so

1943
01:04:40,040 --> 01:04:42,040
unnecessary. There is no need to

1944
01:04:42,040 --> 01:04:43,040
move forward, to hurry the long,

1945
01:04:43,040 --> 01:04:45,040
to get it done. No need at all.

1946
01:04:45,040 --> 01:04:47,040
It's not to Pointe-Claire's

1947
01:04:47,040 --> 01:04:48,040
advantage. It is not to the

1948
01:04:48,040 --> 01:04:49,040
taxpayers advantage. It is not

1949
01:04:49,040 --> 01:04:51,040
to the citizens advantage. I can

1950
01:04:51,040 --> 01:04:52,040
see that it is to the developers

1951
01:04:52,040 --> 01:04:54,040
advantage. But that is a

1952
01:04:54,040 --> 01:04:56,040
different story. So, I would

1953
01:04:56,040 --> 01:04:58,040
like to know, why would you even

1954
01:04:58,040 --> 01:05:00,000
think of doing this when there

1955
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:01,000
is no advantage to the citizens

1956
01:05:01,000 --> 01:05:04,000
of Pointe-Claire whatsoever,

1957
01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:05,000
when we are already in the

1958
01:05:05,000 --> 01:05:06,000
process of -- our planning

1959
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:08,000
program?

1960
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:13,000
>> Thank you.

1961
01:05:13,000 --> 01:05:14,000
>> Mr. Mayor --

1962
01:05:14,000 --> 01:05:16,000
>> Go ahead, Councillor Cowan.

1963
01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:17,000
>> First of all, what I was

1964
01:05:17,000 --> 01:05:18,000
referring to, months and months

1965
01:05:18,000 --> 01:05:19,000
ago, with the fact that Cadillac

1966
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:21,000
Fairview had been engaged with

1967
01:05:21,000 --> 01:05:24,000
conversations with the planning

1968
01:05:24,000 --> 01:05:27,000
department and exchange of

1969
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:28,000
documents in, I think, July of

1970
01:05:28,000 --> 01:05:32,000
2021, and February of 2022. And

1971
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:33,000
Council was completely in the

1972
01:05:33,000 --> 01:05:37,000
dark. Both mayors kept us in the

1973
01:05:37,000 --> 01:05:39,000
dark. -- Mayor Belvedere and

1974
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:41,000
mayor Thomas. We had no idea

1975
01:05:41,000 --> 01:05:42,000
these conversations were

1976
01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:43,000
ongoing. So, I was actually

1977
01:05:43,000 --> 01:05:46,000
criticizing that at that time.

1978
01:05:46,000 --> 01:05:48,000
We should have, though. If we

1979
01:05:48,000 --> 01:05:49,000
had known, maybe we would have

1980
01:05:49,000 --> 01:05:52,000
been able to intervene and the

1981
01:05:52,000 --> 01:05:53,000
--

1982
01:05:53,000 --> 01:05:55,000
>> Excuse me -- it was in the

1983
01:05:55,000 --> 01:05:58,000
papers. It was in the newspapers

1984
01:05:58,000 --> 01:06:00,060
-- and you as a city councillor

1985
01:06:00,060 --> 01:06:02,060
missed it?

1986
01:06:02,060 --> 01:06:05,060
>> -- let

1987
01:06:05,060 --> 01:06:07,060
>> Let Councillor Cowan --

1988
01:06:07,060 --> 01:06:09,060
>> Ms. but DeWitt let Councillor

1989
01:06:09,060 --> 01:06:10,060
Cowan --

1990
01:06:10,060 --> 01:06:12,060
>> -- it's all there in, writing

1991
01:06:12,060 --> 01:06:17,060
you will see it. As far as this

1992
01:06:17,060 --> 01:06:19,060
process is concerned, it has to

1993
01:06:19,060 --> 01:06:22,060
move. We have to be talking to

1994
01:06:22,060 --> 01:06:23,060
Cadillac Fairview at some point,

1995
01:06:23,060 --> 01:06:25,060
of how you are going to do it.

1996
01:06:25,060 --> 01:06:26,060
It's a question of how. But it

1997
01:06:26,060 --> 01:06:28,060
has to happen. They can't be

1998
01:06:28,060 --> 01:06:31,060
held indefinitely in an interim,

1999
01:06:31,060 --> 01:06:32,060
temporary measure. It is

2000
01:06:32,060 --> 01:06:34,060
temporary. We have to work

2001
01:06:34,060 --> 01:06:35,060
through this.

2002
01:06:35,060 --> 01:06:36,060
>> No one is suggesting --

2003
01:06:36,060 --> 01:06:40,060
>> Ms. DeWitt, allow Councillor

2004
01:06:40,060 --> 01:06:42,060
Cowan to finish --

2005
01:06:42,060 --> 01:06:44,060
>> -- its only discussion of

2006
01:06:44,060 --> 01:06:46,060
methodology. This methodology,

2007
01:06:46,060 --> 01:06:48,060
this plan that Council is moving

2008
01:06:48,060 --> 01:06:50,060
on now is something that has

2009
01:06:50,060 --> 01:06:54,060
been in process for months. We

2010
01:06:54,060 --> 01:06:55,060
only very recently that the

2011
01:06:55,060 --> 01:06:56,060
mayor voiced his objection. But

2012
01:06:56,060 --> 01:07:01,020
other than that, if he had any

2013
01:07:01,020 --> 01:07:02,020
disagreement, he did not say

2014
01:07:02,020 --> 01:07:04,020
anything. He kept it to himself

2015
01:07:04,020 --> 01:07:05,020
until just before the Christmas

2016
01:07:05,020 --> 01:07:07,020
break. So, as I said before,

2017
01:07:07,020 --> 01:07:10,020
what we are doing now is the

2018
01:07:10,020 --> 01:07:12,020
continuity of a plan, an

2019
01:07:12,020 --> 01:07:14,020
approach that was begun in July.

2020
01:07:14,020 --> 01:07:17,020
And I have detailed all this. I

2021
01:07:17,020 --> 01:07:19,020
will address it when the actual

2022
01:07:19,020 --> 01:07:21,020
motion is before the floor. And

2023
01:07:21,020 --> 01:07:24,020
I will point out the timeline of

2024
01:07:24,020 --> 01:07:26,020
how we arrived at the point we

2025
01:07:26,020 --> 01:07:28,020
are at now. And hopefully that

2026
01:07:28,020 --> 01:07:30,020
will start to unpack all the

2027
01:07:30,020 --> 01:07:31,020
pieces and bits of information

2028
01:07:31,020 --> 01:07:32,020
we are getting tonight, and put

2029
01:07:32,020 --> 01:07:33,020
them in some kind of sequence

2030
01:07:33,020 --> 01:07:34,020
that is more understandable. At

2031
01:07:34,020 --> 01:07:37,020
least, that is what I hope.

2032
01:07:37,020 --> 01:07:39,020
>> I still cannot see why there

2033
01:07:39,020 --> 01:07:41,020
is any reason to step outside of

2034
01:07:41,020 --> 01:07:43,020
the process that is ongoing for

2035
01:07:43,020 --> 01:07:45,020
the planning program, to give a

2036
01:07:45,020 --> 01:07:46,020
special deal to Cadillac

2037
01:07:46,020 --> 01:07:48,020
Fairview, and possibly makes

2038
01:07:48,020 --> 01:07:50,020
ideals with them in-camera that

2039
01:07:50,020 --> 01:07:52,020
would legally obliged to someone

2040
01:07:52,020 --> 01:07:53,020
--

2041
01:07:53,020 --> 01:07:54,020
>> Point of -- order

2042
01:07:54,020 --> 01:07:56,020
>> No, no -- please allow her to

2043
01:07:56,020 --> 01:07:57,020
-- finish

2044
01:07:57,020 --> 01:07:58,020
>> That would be in

2045
01:07:58,020 --> 01:07:59,020
contradiction to the planning

2046
01:07:59,020 --> 01:08:00,080
program we eventually put in

2047
01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:02,080
place. And if Cadillac Fairview

2048
01:08:02,080 --> 01:08:04,080
is now in litigation, well, look

2049
01:08:04,080 --> 01:08:07,080
at what happened in

2050
01:08:07,080 --> 01:08:09,080
Sainte-Anne-de-Bellevue when

2051
01:08:09,080 --> 01:08:14,080
they litigated -- the developers

2052
01:08:15,080 --> 01:08:16,080
litigated against St. and

2053
01:08:16,080 --> 01:08:17,080
develop Sainte-Anne-de-Bellevue

2054
01:08:17,080 --> 01:08:18,080
-- they got back, essentially,

2055
01:08:18,080 --> 01:08:19,080
what they paid for the land.

2056
01:08:19,080 --> 01:08:20,080
They did not get an composition

2057
01:08:20,080 --> 01:08:21,080
for that. However,

2058
01:08:21,080 --> 01:08:23,080
Pointe-Claire, in so ideals,

2059
01:08:23,080 --> 01:08:26,080
previously with quorum, already

2060
01:08:26,080 --> 01:08:27,080
lost the city $2 million. And

2061
01:08:27,080 --> 01:08:28,080
with Sotramont, we have the mess

2062
01:08:28,080 --> 01:08:30,080
that we have now. So, I think we

2063
01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:32,080
should stick to the process and

2064
01:08:32,080 --> 01:08:34,080
get a proper planning program in

2065
01:08:34,080 --> 01:08:37,080
place, and then follow our own

2066
01:08:37,080 --> 01:08:39,080
bylaws. Thank you.

2067
01:08:39,080 --> 01:08:41,080
[Applause]

2068
01:08:43,080 --> 01:08:44,080
>> No applauding --

2069
01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:46,080
>> -- I don't believe that our

2070
01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:48,080
wonderful square in the

2071
01:08:48,080 --> 01:08:49,080
Pointe-Claire village is a lot

2072
01:08:49,080 --> 01:08:50,080
of money. I just don't think

2073
01:08:50,080 --> 01:08:54,080
that that should be stated

2074
01:08:54,080 --> 01:08:55,080
publicly -- it's a beautiful

2075
01:08:55,080 --> 01:08:57,080
skating rink.

2076
01:08:57,080 --> 01:08:58,080
>> --

2077
01:08:58,080 --> 01:09:00,040
>> Throwing away money is not

2078
01:09:00,040 --> 01:09:01,040
appropriate -- we

2079
01:09:01,040 --> 01:09:02,040
>> Did a beautiful job in that

2080
01:09:02,040 --> 01:09:04,040
property. But we paid way too

2081
01:09:04,040 --> 01:09:06,040
much for it. Anybody doing their

2082
01:09:06,040 --> 01:09:08,040
homework, research that one, and

2083
01:09:08,040 --> 01:09:10,040
see what we paid for that. It is

2084
01:09:10,040 --> 01:09:11,040
a wonderful result. But we paid

2085
01:09:11,040 --> 01:09:14,040
an awful a lot for it. Now, if I

2086
01:09:14,040 --> 01:09:16,040
could get back to the

2087
01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:18,040
conversations with Cadillac

2088
01:09:18,040 --> 01:09:21,040
Fairview, both mayors -- we had

2089
01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:23,040
the RCI almost immediately when

2090
01:09:23,040 --> 01:09:26,040
I got into power. All these

2091
01:09:26,040 --> 01:09:27,040
conversations or these

2092
01:09:27,040 --> 01:09:28,040
negotiations with Cadillac

2093
01:09:28,040 --> 01:09:29,040
Fairview, if they were

2094
01:09:29,040 --> 01:09:31,040
happening, they're happening

2095
01:09:31,040 --> 01:09:33,040
without my knowledge. I spoke to

2096
01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:36,040
Mr. Weemaes and I had no

2097
01:09:36,040 --> 01:09:38,040
recollection of any meetings

2098
01:09:38,040 --> 01:09:39,040
happening with Cadillac Fairview

2099
01:09:39,040 --> 01:09:41,040
when I was first Mayor. I have

2100
01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:42,040
no recollection of that. It may

2101
01:09:42,040 --> 01:09:43,040
have been happening, but not

2102
01:09:43,040 --> 01:09:45,040
from what he told me.

2103
01:09:48,040 --> 01:09:49,040
>> I would like to comment on

2104
01:09:49,040 --> 01:09:51,040
that, please. It was actually

2105
01:09:51,040 --> 01:09:53,040
December 9th, when you actually

2106
01:09:53,040 --> 01:09:55,040
met with Cadillac Fairview, with

2107
01:09:55,040 --> 01:09:59,040
Mr. Weemaes at their site.

2108
01:09:59,040 --> 01:10:00,000
>> At the site --

2109
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:01,000
>> --

2110
01:10:01,000 --> 01:10:02,000
>> And that was withheld from --

2111
01:10:02,000 --> 01:10:03,000
us

2112
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:04,000
>> No, it wasn't withheld. It

2113
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:05,000
was the first week, I think, or

2114
01:10:05,000 --> 01:10:07,000
to, as mayor. And Mr. Weemaes

2115
01:10:07,000 --> 01:10:09,000
urge me to go and meet. We walk

2116
01:10:09,000 --> 01:10:10,000
through the mall and they showed

2117
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:11,000
us the renovation they had done.

2118
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:13,000
That was it. And he regrets

2119
01:10:13,000 --> 01:10:15,000
having asked me to do that. That

2120
01:10:15,000 --> 01:10:17,000
is the only time it happened. We

2121
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:19,000
met. The conversations were

2122
01:10:19,000 --> 01:10:20,000
civil. We went and walk through

2123
01:10:20,000 --> 01:10:23,000
the mall, showed us the

2124
01:10:23,000 --> 01:10:25,000
renovations. They were nice. We

2125
01:10:25,000 --> 01:10:27,000
all had a nice conversation and

2126
01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:29,000
went home. Nothing about a huge

2127
01:10:29,000 --> 01:10:31,000
27 storey or 25 storey

2128
01:10:31,000 --> 01:10:33,000
development -- nothing of that

2129
01:10:33,000 --> 01:10:37,000
came up whatsoever, this Mr.

2130
01:10:37,000 --> 01:10:40,000
LaPointe. He

2131
01:10:40,000 --> 01:10:42,000
Je voulais juste donner

2132
01:10:42,000 --> 01:10:43,000
peut-être un aperçu de ce qui

2133
01:10:43,000 --> 01:10:45,000
s'est passé depuis une quinzaine

2134
01:10:45,000 --> 01:10:48,000
d'années concernant la forêt. Le

2135
01:10:48,000 --> 01:10:51,000
6 septembre 2005 qu'il y a eu un

2136
01:10:51,000 --> 01:10:52,000
rapport...

2137
01:10:52,000 --> 01:10:55,000
- Par les plus proches du micro.

2138
01:10:55,000 --> 01:10:56,000
>> Right parlez plus proche du

2139
01:10:56,000 --> 01:10:57,000
micro. Into it, Norm. Almost

2140
01:10:57,000 --> 01:10:59,000
right into it.

2141
01:10:59,000 --> 01:11:01,060
- Il y a eu un rapport le 6

2142
01:11:01,060 --> 01:11:04,060
septembre 2005, un rapport

2143
01:11:04,060 --> 01:11:06,060
forestier fait par monsieur

2144
01:11:06,060 --> 01:11:10,060
Duval concernant la propriété...

2145
01:11:10,060 --> 01:11:14,060
la forêt Fairview. Sur 23

2146
01:11:14,060 --> 01:11:16,060
hectares, on retrouve le

2147
01:11:16,060 --> 01:11:18,060
Règlement dans le Règlement 27 -

2148
01:11:18,060 --> 01:11:21,060
87 de la Ville de Pointe-Claire.

2149
01:11:21,060 --> 01:11:24,060
La recommandation de la page 3,

2150
01:11:24,060 --> 01:11:27,060
on devrait conserver une

2151
01:11:27,060 --> 01:11:30,060
superficie de 37% du lot. Ce qui

2152
01:11:30,060 --> 01:11:34,060
représente 8,51 hectares. Le 1er

2153
01:11:34,060 --> 01:11:38,060
mars 2011, on est entré en

2154
01:11:38,060 --> 01:11:42,060
vigueur le Règlement 26,75

2155
01:11:42,060 --> 01:11:44,060
concernant la mosaïque des lieux

2156
01:11:44,060 --> 01:11:45,060
naturels.

2157
01:11:45,060 --> 01:11:46,060
(inaudible)

2158
01:11:46,060 --> 01:11:48,060
La biodiversité, tout projet

2159
01:11:48,060 --> 01:11:49,060
d'implantation d'une nouvelle

2160
01:11:49,060 --> 01:11:50,060
construction

2161
01:11:50,060 --> 01:11:51,060
(inaudible)

2162
01:11:51,060 --> 01:11:55,060
d'engagement de terrain dans la

2163
01:11:55,060 --> 01:11:56,060
mosaïque naturelle de la zone

2164
01:11:56,060 --> 01:11:58,060
aime d'eux et la zone 30 cette

2165
01:11:58,060 --> 01:12:00,020
eau être conçus et réalisés de

2166
01:12:00,020 --> 01:12:04,020
manière à maximiser la

2167
01:12:04,020 --> 01:12:05,020
conservation d'un boirai d'un

2168
01:12:05,020 --> 01:12:06,020
milieu humide

2169
01:12:06,020 --> 01:12:07,020
(inaudible)

2170
01:12:07,020 --> 01:12:08,020
une mise en à l'heure... en

2171
01:12:08,020 --> 01:12:10,020
valeur de son

2172
01:12:10,020 --> 01:12:12,020
(---)

2173
01:12:12,020 --> 01:12:15,020
Sa biodiversité. Ceci est en

2174
01:12:15,020 --> 01:12:19,020
2011. À l'alimentation en eau,

2175
01:12:20,020 --> 01:12:22,020
l'implantation de

2176
01:12:22,020 --> 01:12:23,020
l'agrandissement d'un bâtiment

2177
01:12:23,020 --> 01:12:25,020
et la...

2178
01:12:25,020 --> 01:12:26,020
(---)

2179
01:12:26,020 --> 01:12:27,020
en milieu naturel de la zone

2180
01:12:27,020 --> 01:12:29,020
aime deux, un terrain contiguës

2181
01:12:29,020 --> 01:12:33,020
à cette zone ne doit pas

2182
01:12:33,020 --> 01:12:34,020
contraindre à l'amélioration en

2183
01:12:34,020 --> 01:12:37,020
haut du secteur naturel. Déjà,

2184
01:12:37,020 --> 01:12:38,020
on

2185
01:12:38,020 --> 01:12:39,020
(inaudible)

2186
01:12:39,020 --> 01:12:40,020
a déjà fait des changements en

2187
01:12:40,020 --> 01:12:41,020
complément dans l'alimentation

2188
01:12:41,020 --> 01:12:44,020
en eau par le drainage à son

2189
01:12:44,020 --> 01:12:45,020
empreinte de la station

2190
01:12:45,020 --> 01:12:46,020
terminus, stationnement et

2191
01:12:46,020 --> 01:12:47,020
(inaudible)

2192
01:12:47,020 --> 01:12:50,020
. En 2013, un rapport

2193
01:12:58,020 --> 01:13:00,080
d'Environnement du site a été

2194
01:13:00,080 --> 01:13:04,080
fait sur le lot au nord-ouest de

2195
01:13:04,080 --> 01:13:07,080
l'autoroute 40, rue Harvey, sur

2196
01:13:07,080 --> 01:13:09,080
l'ancien heureux qui est

2197
01:13:09,080 --> 01:13:12,080
aujourd'hui une avenue,

2198
01:13:12,080 --> 01:13:14,080
l'inspection pour le compte de

2199
01:13:14,080 --> 01:13:15,080
Corporation

2200
01:13:15,080 --> 01:13:16,080
(---)

2201
01:13:16,080 --> 01:13:18,080
et par la suite, l'achat en août

2202
01:13:18,080 --> 01:13:22,080
de la choppe. Donc déjà là,

2203
01:13:22,080 --> 01:13:25,080
Cadillac Fairview savait que

2204
01:13:25,080 --> 01:13:28,080
cette zone-là était protégée,

2205
01:13:28,080 --> 01:13:31,080
des arbres centenaires, c'était

2206
01:13:31,080 --> 01:13:35,080
dans les règlements de la ville.

2207
01:13:35,080 --> 01:13:36,080
Lors de la séance de

2208
01:13:36,080 --> 01:13:39,080
consultation de 2017 au Conseil

2209
01:13:39,080 --> 01:13:41,080
du 4 juillet 2017, les agents de

2210
01:13:41,080 --> 01:13:44,080
consultations publiques,

2211
01:13:44,080 --> 01:13:47,080
monsieur Brian affalé, président

2212
01:13:47,080 --> 01:13:50,080
de faire rouler association et

2213
01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:51,080
madame

2214
01:13:51,080 --> 01:13:52,080
(inaudible)

2215
01:13:52,080 --> 01:13:55,080
représentants de Cadillac

2216
01:13:55,080 --> 01:13:56,080
Fairview.

2217
01:13:56,080 --> 01:13:57,080
(---)

2218
01:13:57,080 --> 01:13:58,080
Cadillac Sergio était en accord

2219
01:13:58,080 --> 01:14:00,040
avec la vision de la ville et

2220
01:14:00,040 --> 01:14:01,040
monsieur Fairview a remis une

2221
01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:03,040
lettre à l'assistante comprenant

2222
01:14:03,040 --> 01:14:04,040
des propos annoncées dans cette

2223
01:14:04,040 --> 01:14:06,040
séance de consultation. Par la

2224
01:14:06,040 --> 01:14:10,040
suite, monsieur Serge Laporte on

2225
01:14:10,040 --> 01:14:12,040
demande une question: la limite

2226
01:14:12,040 --> 01:14:14,040
à hauteur des bâtiments qui

2227
01:14:14,040 --> 01:14:19,040
devraient être construits sur le

2228
01:14:20,040 --> 01:14:22,040
Mu1 et Mu2 j'. Je répète la

2229
01:14:22,040 --> 01:14:24,040
question à monsieur le maire, et

2230
01:14:24,040 --> 01:14:25,040
madame Giguère répond à cette

2231
01:14:25,040 --> 01:14:29,040
question-là. France Giguère,

2232
01:14:29,040 --> 01:14:34,040
oui, quand il y a des zonage,

2233
01:14:34,040 --> 01:14:35,040
selon des zones, surtout en

2234
01:14:35,040 --> 01:14:38,040
fonction de l'environnement

2235
01:14:38,040 --> 01:14:41,040
immédiat, adjacent aux zones du

2236
01:14:41,040 --> 01:14:43,040
centre-ville dont les auteurs

2237
01:14:43,040 --> 01:14:45,040
vont varier et graduelle et en

2238
01:14:45,040 --> 01:14:48,040
partie de l'existence vers le

2239
01:14:48,040 --> 01:14:49,040
centre...

2240
01:14:49,040 --> 01:14:50,040
(inaudible)

2241
01:14:50,040 --> 01:14:52,040
supposé déranger le voisinage

2242
01:14:52,040 --> 01:14:54,040
existant, c'est toujours fait en

2243
01:14:54,040 --> 01:14:57,040
fonction, oui, des limites et en

2244
01:14:57,040 --> 01:15:01,000
fonction du voisinage immédiat.

2245
01:15:02,000 --> 01:15:04,000
C'est sont là la mission du

2246
01:15:04,000 --> 01:15:07,000
conseil de ville, il a adopté le

2247
01:15:07,000 --> 01:15:10,000
règlement pour Mu1 et Mu2 sans

2248
01:15:10,000 --> 01:15:12,000
aucune spécification du nombre

2249
01:15:12,000 --> 01:15:15,000
de planchers, ce que toutes les

2250
01:15:15,000 --> 01:15:19,000
autres zones de la Ville de

2251
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:22,000
Pointe-Claire procède.

2252
01:15:22,000 --> 01:15:23,000
(inaudible)

2253
01:15:23,000 --> 01:15:25,000
Était d'accord avec la vision de

2254
01:15:25,000 --> 01:15:26,000
la ville.

2255
01:15:26,000 --> 01:15:27,000
(intervention en anglais)

2256
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:29,000
Wow. The skies the limit.

2257
01:15:31,000 --> 01:15:32,000
- Normand, est-ce qu'il reste

2258
01:15:32,000 --> 01:15:34,000
beaucoup? Parce que...

2259
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:35,000
- Juste... trois

2260
01:15:35,000 --> 01:15:36,000
- Il y a quatre autres

2261
01:15:36,000 --> 01:15:37,000
>> Okay.

2262
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:38,000
Questions.

2263
01:15:38,000 --> 01:15:39,000
- Deux minutes.

2264
01:15:39,000 --> 01:15:40,000
- O.K..

2265
01:15:40,000 --> 01:15:45,000
- Avant Mu1, c'était C6, il

2266
01:15:46,000 --> 01:15:48,000
était permis 60 mètres, 15

2267
01:15:48,000 --> 01:15:53,000
étages, avant Mu2, c'était une

2268
01:15:55,000 --> 01:15:57,000
zone CP3, et heures 46,

2269
01:15:57,000 --> 01:16:00,060
boulevard Brunswick, le nombre

2270
01:16:00,060 --> 01:16:02,060
d'étages était 15, et la

2271
01:16:02,060 --> 01:16:07,060
longueur maximum de 60 mètres.

2272
01:16:09,060 --> 01:16:11,060
C'est à nous d'élus... à nos

2273
01:16:11,060 --> 01:16:15,060
élus de corriger ça, nous sommes

2274
01:16:15,060 --> 01:16:19,060
tous d'une crise climatique. Vu

2275
01:16:20,060 --> 01:16:22,060
les changements climatiques, il

2276
01:16:22,060 --> 01:16:25,060
est acquis que plusieurs

2277
01:16:25,060 --> 01:16:28,060
désastres et anomalie causeront

2278
01:16:28,060 --> 01:16:29,060
des pertes de vie à travers le

2279
01:16:29,060 --> 01:16:32,060
monde, nous devons prendre des

2280
01:16:32,060 --> 01:16:33,060
décisions importantes et

2281
01:16:33,060 --> 01:16:35,060
faites... faire notre part de

2282
01:16:35,060 --> 01:16:36,060
changement pour la survie de la

2283
01:16:36,060 --> 01:16:39,060
planète et la protection de la

2284
01:16:39,060 --> 01:16:41,060
biodiversité, et protéger les

2285
01:16:41,060 --> 01:16:42,060
marécages qui sont les poumons

2286
01:16:42,060 --> 01:16:47,060
de notre planète. New York à

2287
01:16:47,060 --> 01:16:49,060
Central Park, nous pouvons avoir

2288
01:16:49,060 --> 01:16:50,060
à Pointe-Claire notre parc

2289
01:16:50,060 --> 01:16:52,060
naturel de la forêt Fairview.

2290
01:16:52,060 --> 01:16:56,060
De, plus lors de la réunion...

2291
01:16:57,060 --> 01:16:59,060
réunion du comité stratégique le

2292
01:16:59,060 --> 01:17:00,020
13 novembre dernier à

2293
01:17:00,020 --> 01:17:04,020
Pointe-Claire, sur le territoire

2294
01:17:04,020 --> 01:17:06,020
de Pointe-Claire, la superficie

2295
01:17:06,020 --> 01:17:08,020
totale est de 73 kilomètres

2296
01:17:08,020 --> 01:17:12,020
carrés. Seulement 66% de cette

2297
01:17:12,020 --> 01:17:13,020
superficie est un parc ou des

2298
01:17:13,020 --> 01:17:17,020
ex-... des espaces verts, sur

2299
01:17:17,020 --> 01:17:22,020
2,8 kilomètres carrés, soit 1,38

2300
01:17:23,020 --> 01:17:24,020
kilomètres carrés sur 138

2301
01:17:24,020 --> 01:17:27,020
hectares, c'est ce qu'il manque

2302
01:17:27,020 --> 01:17:28,020
pour atteindre l'objectif de 10%

2303
01:17:28,020 --> 01:17:31,020
de protection pour la Ville de

2304
01:17:31,020 --> 01:17:32,020
Pointe-Claire et l'île de

2305
01:17:32,020 --> 01:17:33,020
Montréal. Pour atteindre cet

2306
01:17:33,020 --> 01:17:35,020
objectif, il faudrait augmenter

2307
01:17:35,020 --> 01:17:37,020
ou acheter huit fois la

2308
01:17:37,020 --> 01:17:42,020
superficie de la forêt Fairview

2309
01:17:42,020 --> 01:17:44,020
de 9,6 hectare et 142 acres que

2310
01:17:44,020 --> 01:17:46,020
le Cadillac Fairview possède, il

2311
01:17:46,020 --> 01:17:50,020
faudra acheter huit fois cela

2312
01:17:50,020 --> 01:17:51,020
pour avoir le 10% à la Ville de

2313
01:17:51,020 --> 01:17:55,020
Pointe-Claire. Comme élue, votre

2314
01:17:55,020 --> 01:17:58,020
devoir est de préserver

2315
01:17:58,020 --> 01:17:59,020
l'héritage centenaire de cette

2316
01:17:59,020 --> 01:18:02,080
forêt, la biodiversité, la

2317
01:18:02,080 --> 01:18:03,080
couleuvre brune...

2318
01:18:03,080 --> 01:18:04,080
- Est-ce qu'il reste...

2319
01:18:04,080 --> 01:18:05,080
>> Come on, Norm.

2320
01:18:05,080 --> 01:18:06,080
Allé, normalement... il reste

2321
01:18:06,080 --> 01:18:08,080
sans que personne...

2322
01:18:08,080 --> 01:18:11,080
- Le but de la résolution de ce

2323
01:18:11,080 --> 01:18:13,080
soir, est-ce qu'il peut y avoir

2324
01:18:13,080 --> 01:18:15,080
une consultation publique comme

2325
01:18:15,080 --> 01:18:17,080
la loi le... l'exige?

2326
01:18:17,080 --> 01:18:18,080
- La question?

2327
01:18:18,080 --> 01:18:19,080
- Ça, ma question.

2328
01:18:19,080 --> 01:18:21,080
- Enquête. Pour moi, la réponse,

2329
01:18:21,080 --> 01:18:23,080
c'est qu'on a toujours besoin

2330
01:18:23,080 --> 01:18:26,080
d'espaces verts à Pointe-Claire,

2331
01:18:26,080 --> 01:18:28,080
on en a pas assez. Notre

2332
01:18:28,080 --> 01:18:29,080
pourcentage d'espaces verts

2333
01:18:29,080 --> 01:18:31,080
n'est pas assez élevé. On a

2334
01:18:31,080 --> 01:18:32,080
l'opportunité, maintenant, de

2335
01:18:32,080 --> 01:18:37,080
garder le minimum pour protéger

2336
01:18:37,080 --> 01:18:38,080
la

2337
01:18:38,080 --> 01:18:39,080
>> Forêt -- to protect the

2338
01:18:39,080 --> 01:18:40,080
forest --

2339
01:18:40,080 --> 01:18:44,080
. En plus, si on permet un gros

2340
01:18:44,080 --> 01:18:46,080
projet du calibre de ce que

2341
01:18:46,080 --> 01:18:48,080
propose le Cadillac Fairview, et

2342
01:18:48,080 --> 01:18:50,080
ils ont besoin d'un espace vert

2343
01:18:50,080 --> 01:18:51,080
correspondant, mais l'espace est

2344
01:18:51,080 --> 01:18:54,080
déjà là, c'est déjà là. Pour

2345
01:18:54,080 --> 01:18:57,080
moi, c'est évident que si vous

2346
01:18:57,080 --> 01:18:58,080
voulez fabriquer quelque chose

2347
01:18:58,080 --> 01:19:00,040
d'aussi gros que ça, il faut

2348
01:19:00,040 --> 01:19:02,040
avoir un espace vert,

2349
01:19:02,040 --> 01:19:03,040
abracadabra, l'espace vert

2350
01:19:03,040 --> 01:19:04,040
>> Abracadabra --

2351
01:19:04,040 --> 01:19:05,040
Est là, il n'est pas nécessaire

2352
01:19:05,040 --> 01:19:08,040
d'en créer un. On a une bonne

2353
01:19:08,040 --> 01:19:09,040
solution minimale pour notre

2354
01:19:09,040 --> 01:19:13,040
ville est déjà.

2355
01:19:13,040 --> 01:19:14,040
- Parce que Cadillac Fairview

2356
01:19:14,040 --> 01:19:15,040
quand ils sont arrivés ici en

2357
01:19:15,040 --> 01:19:17,040
60, cinq ils ont coupé des

2358
01:19:17,040 --> 01:19:19,040
arbres, avez-vous vu la grosseur

2359
01:19:19,040 --> 01:19:22,040
de la canopée de ces arbres-là?

2360
01:19:22,040 --> 01:19:23,040
15 pieds, 20 pieds?

2361
01:19:23,040 --> 01:19:27,040
- Oui. Non... Norman, il faut

2362
01:19:27,040 --> 01:19:30,040
qu'on parle... on parle ici

2363
01:19:30,040 --> 01:19:31,040
de...

2364
01:19:31,040 --> 01:19:32,040
- C'est justement...

2365
01:19:32,040 --> 01:19:34,040
- Le processus, ici.

2366
01:19:34,040 --> 01:19:35,040
- O.K.. Merci.

2367
01:19:35,040 --> 01:19:37,040
- Merci, Monsieur.

2368
01:19:39,040 --> 01:19:41,040
>> Susan Weaver, Pointe-Claire.

2369
01:19:41,040 --> 01:19:42,040
I don't know what you are

2370
01:19:42,040 --> 01:19:45,040
discussing in the past. It was

2371
01:19:45,040 --> 01:19:47,040
-- but I would like to know what

2372
01:19:47,040 --> 01:19:48,040
public participation is, what

2373
01:19:48,040 --> 01:19:49,040
you expect of it.

2374
01:19:49,040 --> 01:19:51,040
>> To hear from citizens.

2375
01:19:51,040 --> 01:19:52,040
>> What citizens?

2376
01:19:52,040 --> 01:19:54,040
>> All the citizens, as many as

2377
01:19:54,040 --> 01:19:55,040
can come out.

2378
01:19:55,040 --> 01:19:56,040
>> Citizens? Where

2379
01:19:56,040 --> 01:19:59,040
>> The people of Pointe-Claire.

2380
01:19:59,040 --> 01:20:02,000
>> Just Pointe-Claire? Good

2381
01:20:02,000 --> 01:20:05,000
luck.

2382
01:20:05,000 --> 01:20:07,000
>> Thank you.

2383
01:20:07,000 --> 01:20:08,000
>> When the cruelly,

2384
01:20:08,000 --> 01:20:09,000
Pointe-Claire. I'm a little

2385
01:20:09,000 --> 01:20:10,000
concerned. I just feel this is

2386
01:20:10,000 --> 01:20:11,000
rushed.

2387
01:20:11,000 --> 01:20:15,000
>> Closer to the microphone,

2388
01:20:15,000 --> 01:20:16,000
Miss -- everybody, behind,

2389
01:20:16,000 --> 01:20:18,000
please speak right into the

2390
01:20:18,000 --> 01:20:19,000
microphone.

2391
01:20:19,000 --> 01:20:20,000
>> Is this good?

2392
01:20:20,000 --> 01:20:22,000
>> Right after. Put your lips

2393
01:20:22,000 --> 01:20:24,000
almost on it. Serious -- oh, I

2394
01:20:24,000 --> 01:20:28,000
didn't -- owe, everybody stop.

2395
01:20:28,000 --> 01:20:30,000
>> I'm just concerned. I feel

2396
01:20:30,000 --> 01:20:32,000
it's rushed. I have a question.

2397
01:20:32,000 --> 01:20:33,000
I will try to be specific about

2398
01:20:33,000 --> 01:20:38,000
point A of the resolution. The

2399
01:20:40,000 --> 01:20:41,000
special planning program for the

2400
01:20:41,000 --> 01:20:43,000
City shows the entirety of Mu2

2401
01:20:43,000 --> 01:20:45,000
as being a natural habitat

2402
01:20:45,000 --> 01:20:48,000
mosaic. Point A of the

2403
01:20:48,000 --> 01:20:49,000
resolution says the

2404
01:20:49,000 --> 01:20:51,000
comprehensive plan for Mu2 and

2405
01:20:51,000 --> 01:20:52,000
Mu1 will establish the

2406
01:20:52,000 --> 01:20:53,000
protection of wetlands and

2407
01:20:53,000 --> 01:20:56,000
existing natural habitat mosaic.

2408
01:20:56,000 --> 01:20:58,000
I just want to make certain that

2409
01:20:58,000 --> 01:21:01,060
-- this is mean that the city's

2410
01:21:01,060 --> 01:21:02,060
planning on protecting the

2411
01:21:02,060 --> 01:21:03,060
entirety of the force? I just

2412
01:21:03,060 --> 01:21:07,060
want to --

2413
01:21:07,060 --> 01:21:09,060
>> I would -- speaking for

2414
01:21:09,060 --> 01:21:11,060
myself, yes. Absolutely.

2415
01:21:11,060 --> 01:21:13,060
>> It seems to say that --

2416
01:21:13,060 --> 01:21:15,060
>> The entirety of the forest

2417
01:21:15,060 --> 01:21:16,060
would be the minimum objective.

2418
01:21:16,060 --> 01:21:19,060
>> The minimum objective?

2419
01:21:19,060 --> 01:21:22,060
>> Yes.

2420
01:21:22,060 --> 01:21:23,060
>> Mr. Mayor --

2421
01:21:23,060 --> 01:21:24,060
>> Yes, sir?

2422
01:21:24,060 --> 01:21:25,060
>> What happens up there will be

2423
01:21:25,060 --> 01:21:26,060
the result of public input,

2424
01:21:26,060 --> 01:21:28,060
public participation, including

2425
01:21:28,060 --> 01:21:30,060
Cadillac Fairview. So, what it

2426
01:21:30,060 --> 01:21:33,060
is saying is that, currently,

2427
01:21:33,060 --> 01:21:36,060
there are regulatory protections

2428
01:21:36,060 --> 01:21:37,060
already required for those

2429
01:21:37,060 --> 01:21:39,060
zones. And definitely, that

2430
01:21:39,060 --> 01:21:40,060
would be part of the plan going

2431
01:21:40,060 --> 01:21:42,060
forward. I can't see that

2432
01:21:42,060 --> 01:21:44,060
changing. What they are going to

2433
01:21:44,060 --> 01:21:47,060
be, that will be the result of a

2434
01:21:47,060 --> 01:21:49,060
process that involves the

2435
01:21:49,060 --> 01:21:51,060
public. It is not up to me, it's

2436
01:21:51,060 --> 01:21:53,060
not up to the mayor to dictate

2437
01:21:53,060 --> 01:21:54,060
whatever our views are. That is

2438
01:21:54,060 --> 01:21:55,060
the whole point of this whole

2439
01:21:55,060 --> 01:21:58,060
thing, so that you will have an

2440
01:21:58,060 --> 01:21:59,060
opportunity to present your

2441
01:21:59,060 --> 01:22:04,020
point of view and see where that

2442
01:22:04,020 --> 01:22:09,020
takes us. With the point that

2443
01:22:09,020 --> 01:22:11,020
Ms. Weaver was making about

2444
01:22:11,020 --> 01:22:12,020
public participation, we need to

2445
01:22:12,020 --> 01:22:13,020
have some kind of structure for

2446
01:22:13,020 --> 01:22:14,020
that to happen. What are you

2447
01:22:14,020 --> 01:22:18,020
going to do? Go to the Montréal

2448
01:22:18,020 --> 01:22:20,020
Olympic stadium and try to get

2449
01:22:20,020 --> 01:22:21,020
32,000 people to go in there and

2450
01:22:21,020 --> 01:22:23,020
say, okay, what are your ideas?

2451
01:22:23,020 --> 01:22:24,020
Obviously, you have the

2452
01:22:24,020 --> 01:22:25,020
structure that conversation

2453
01:22:25,020 --> 01:22:26,020
somehow. We are trying to get

2454
01:22:26,020 --> 01:22:29,020
there. We are trying to figure

2455
01:22:29,020 --> 01:22:30,020
out a structure to have that

2456
01:22:30,020 --> 01:22:31,020
conversation. That is why I

2457
01:22:31,020 --> 01:22:33,020
referred to the start line. The

2458
01:22:33,020 --> 01:22:36,020
start line is, once it is

2459
01:22:36,020 --> 01:22:40,020
settled -- mutual agreements

2460
01:22:41,020 --> 01:22:43,020
only, where that start line is

2461
01:22:43,020 --> 01:22:44,020
going to be -- the reason why it

2462
01:22:44,020 --> 01:22:46,020
has to be a mutual agreement is

2463
01:22:46,020 --> 01:22:47,020
because Cadillac Fairview is

2464
01:22:47,020 --> 01:22:48,020
part of it. Well, we want them

2465
01:22:48,020 --> 01:22:51,020
to be part of it of that

2466
01:22:51,020 --> 01:22:52,020
discussion. And where does it

2467
01:22:52,020 --> 01:22:56,020
lead? Who knows. That is why we

2468
01:22:56,020 --> 01:22:57,020
have the public involved. We

2469
01:22:57,020 --> 01:22:58,020
don't know what the outcome is.

2470
01:22:58,020 --> 01:22:59,020
We might have our own

2471
01:22:59,020 --> 01:23:00,080
preferences. But the idea is to

2472
01:23:00,080 --> 01:23:02,080
allow the public to weigh in.

2473
01:23:02,080 --> 01:23:03,080
And then we see --

2474
01:23:03,080 --> 01:23:04,080
>> It would be nice if the

2475
01:23:04,080 --> 01:23:06,080
public could weigh in before --

2476
01:23:06,080 --> 01:23:08,080
>> That's what we are trying to

2477
01:23:08,080 --> 01:23:09,080
do --

2478
01:23:09,080 --> 01:23:13,080
>> Sorry, go ahead -- sorry

2479
01:23:13,080 --> 01:23:15,080
Councillor Cowan -- what were

2480
01:23:15,080 --> 01:23:16,080
you saying --

2481
01:23:16,080 --> 01:23:18,080
>> -- before hand.

2482
01:23:18,080 --> 01:23:19,080
>> I agree.

2483
01:23:19,080 --> 01:23:20,080
>> But I don't want to keep

2484
01:23:20,080 --> 01:23:22,080
going over that same point. My

2485
01:23:22,080 --> 01:23:23,080
second question is just about

2486
01:23:23,080 --> 01:23:25,080
the mandate later, that is to

2487
01:23:25,080 --> 01:23:26,080
provide guidelines for the

2488
01:23:26,080 --> 01:23:27,080
desire dialogue. When does that

2489
01:23:27,080 --> 01:23:28,080
come into it? And where do we

2490
01:23:28,080 --> 01:23:29,080
get to see that? I don't know

2491
01:23:29,080 --> 01:23:32,080
where that leads to. I don't

2492
01:23:32,080 --> 01:23:34,080
know.

2493
01:23:36,080 --> 01:23:38,080
>> We cannot publish it until

2494
01:23:38,080 --> 01:23:40,080
tomorrow because we don't know

2495
01:23:40,080 --> 01:23:41,080
the result of the resolution

2496
01:23:41,080 --> 01:23:44,080
tonight. So, when we have --

2497
01:23:44,080 --> 01:23:46,080
public tomorrow, probably

2498
01:23:46,080 --> 01:23:49,080
tomorrow. Yeah.

2499
01:23:49,080 --> 01:23:50,080
>> Okay.

2500
01:23:50,080 --> 01:23:51,080
>> Ms. -- the key to your

2501
01:23:51,080 --> 01:23:52,080
question, the first point, is

2502
01:23:52,080 --> 01:23:55,080
that key to the public

2503
01:23:55,080 --> 01:23:57,080
participation process will be

2504
01:23:57,080 --> 01:23:59,080
can determine in conjunction

2505
01:23:59,080 --> 01:24:00,040
with Cadillac Fairview.

2506
01:24:00,040 --> 01:24:01,040
>> Right.

2507
01:24:01,040 --> 01:24:02,040
>> That's the key point in all

2508
01:24:02,040 --> 01:24:03,040
of this.

2509
01:24:03,040 --> 01:24:06,040
>> Thank you.

2510
01:24:06,040 --> 01:24:09,040
>> Good evening. Good evening,

2511
01:24:09,040 --> 01:24:12,040
Mr. Mayor, good evening

2512
01:24:12,040 --> 01:24:13,040
councillors, manager, everyone.

2513
01:24:13,040 --> 01:24:14,040
Thank you so much --

2514
01:24:14,040 --> 01:24:16,040
>> I'm sorry, can you please

2515
01:24:16,040 --> 01:24:17,040
state your name.

2516
01:24:17,040 --> 01:24:18,040
>> Kim Matthews?

2517
01:24:18,040 --> 01:24:23,040
>> Kim Matthews -- two T's -- I

2518
01:24:26,040 --> 01:24:27,040
thought that would at least get

2519
01:24:27,040 --> 01:24:28,040
a bit of a giggle. Because I

2520
01:24:28,040 --> 01:24:30,040
think we need a bit of a giggle

2521
01:24:30,040 --> 01:24:34,040
with what's going on -- with the

2522
01:24:34,040 --> 01:24:36,040
intentions of this -- are likely

2523
01:24:36,040 --> 01:24:38,040
very positive. I am finding it a

2524
01:24:38,040 --> 01:24:40,040
little bit difficult to follow,

2525
01:24:40,040 --> 01:24:42,040
however. We've got a resolution

2526
01:24:42,040 --> 01:24:44,040
for the purpose of ensuring

2527
01:24:44,040 --> 01:24:45,040
public participation in

2528
01:24:45,040 --> 01:24:46,040
determining the future of zones

2529
01:24:46,040 --> 01:24:49,040
Mu1 and Mu2. That's the title of

2530
01:24:49,040 --> 01:24:52,040
a resolution. But then, I have

2531
01:24:52,040 --> 01:24:53,040
been listening, and I took a few

2532
01:24:53,040 --> 01:24:56,040
notes. And at one point -- maybe

2533
01:24:56,040 --> 01:24:58,040
I misunderstood, Councillor

2534
01:24:58,040 --> 01:25:00,000
Cowan. But I heard that you

2535
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:01,000
mentioned, really, Cadillac

2536
01:25:01,000 --> 01:25:02,000
Fairview would not have a say in

2537
01:25:02,000 --> 01:25:04,000
how this participation took

2538
01:25:04,000 --> 01:25:07,000
place. But then when I read the

2539
01:25:07,000 --> 01:25:09,000
actual resolution, it says that

2540
01:25:09,000 --> 01:25:11,000
a mutually agreeable path for

2541
01:25:11,000 --> 01:25:12,000
that will engage public

2542
01:25:12,000 --> 01:25:14,000
participation in a structured

2543
01:25:14,000 --> 01:25:15,000
process would be one of the

2544
01:25:15,000 --> 01:25:18,000
goals of this particular

2545
01:25:18,000 --> 01:25:21,000
resolution. I am really at a

2546
01:25:21,000 --> 01:25:23,000
loss as to why we need a

2547
01:25:23,000 --> 01:25:26,000
resolution to allow for public

2548
01:25:26,000 --> 01:25:27,000
participation in this particular

2549
01:25:27,000 --> 01:25:30,000
process. I have heard already

2550
01:25:30,000 --> 01:25:34,000
from Ms. Watson -- thanks to Ms.

2551
01:25:34,000 --> 01:25:35,000
Watson's question -- that

2552
01:25:35,000 --> 01:25:36,000
legally, that that is not

2553
01:25:36,000 --> 01:25:38,000
required, that the inclusion of

2554
01:25:38,000 --> 01:25:39,000
Cadillac Fairview in this

2555
01:25:39,000 --> 01:25:42,000
process is not required. So, you

2556
01:25:42,000 --> 01:25:44,000
already have a committee. And I

2557
01:25:44,000 --> 01:25:45,000
would just like to understand,

2558
01:25:45,000 --> 01:25:47,000
why don't you, as a committee,

2559
01:25:47,000 --> 01:25:48,000
just strike up a situation where

2560
01:25:48,000 --> 01:25:50,000
we end up with public

2561
01:25:50,000 --> 01:25:54,000
participation? I took place in

2562
01:25:54,000 --> 01:25:56,000
something just at the end of

2563
01:25:56,000 --> 01:25:57,000
2022. It was lovely. We were

2564
01:25:57,000 --> 01:25:59,000
down by the water. And we had an

2565
01:25:59,000 --> 01:26:01,060
evening where we gave input on

2566
01:26:01,060 --> 01:26:02,060
what we would like to see from

2567
01:26:02,060 --> 01:26:04,060
the city. So, that was fabulous.

2568
01:26:04,060 --> 01:26:05,060
And I met a number of you there.

2569
01:26:05,060 --> 01:26:08,060
And I'm just wondering -- as I

2570
01:26:08,060 --> 01:26:09,060
said, I think the goal is

2571
01:26:09,060 --> 01:26:11,060
excellent. But I just don't

2572
01:26:11,060 --> 01:26:12,060
understand. And could someone

2573
01:26:12,060 --> 01:26:14,060
tell me why we can't just have

2574
01:26:14,060 --> 01:26:17,060
the same thing without,

2575
01:26:17,060 --> 01:26:18,060
especially if we are in

2576
01:26:18,060 --> 01:26:21,060
litigation -- without consulting

2577
01:26:21,060 --> 01:26:22,060
with Cadillac Fairview? Let's

2578
01:26:22,060 --> 01:26:25,060
get everybody together, discuss

2579
01:26:25,060 --> 01:26:26,060
things and then, from their,

2580
01:26:26,060 --> 01:26:28,060
come up with a resolution that

2581
01:26:28,060 --> 01:26:30,060
would then bring Cadillac

2582
01:26:30,060 --> 01:26:32,060
Fairview into the occasion. So,

2583
01:26:32,060 --> 01:26:33,060
if someone could just explain

2584
01:26:33,060 --> 01:26:36,060
why we need, that would help me.

2585
01:26:36,060 --> 01:26:38,060
>> I don't think we do. So, I

2586
01:26:38,060 --> 01:26:40,060
agree with your question. But I

2587
01:26:40,060 --> 01:26:41,060
will allow someone else that

2588
01:26:41,060 --> 01:26:43,060
thinks we do to answer it.

2589
01:26:43,060 --> 01:26:45,060
>> Mr. Mayor?

2590
01:26:45,060 --> 01:26:46,060
>> With --

2591
01:26:46,060 --> 01:26:48,060
>> The idea is, we want to

2592
01:26:48,060 --> 01:26:50,060
eventually have a comprehensive

2593
01:26:50,060 --> 01:26:53,060
development plan. We can't

2594
01:26:53,060 --> 01:26:54,060
impose that I'm Cadillac

2595
01:26:54,060 --> 01:26:55,060
Fairview. They have to

2596
01:26:55,060 --> 01:26:56,060
voluntarily sign it. They have

2597
01:26:56,060 --> 01:26:58,060
to voluntarily come into it. So,

2598
01:26:58,060 --> 01:27:00,020
the idea is, they will want to

2599
01:27:00,020 --> 01:27:02,020
participate in this process that

2600
01:27:02,020 --> 01:27:04,020
is going to give them an

2601
01:27:04,020 --> 01:27:05,020
opportunity to influence --

2602
01:27:05,020 --> 01:27:08,020
influence, not dictate --

2603
01:27:08,020 --> 01:27:09,020
influence an outcome -- they

2604
01:27:09,020 --> 01:27:11,020
will only be part of this

2605
01:27:11,020 --> 01:27:12,020
process. It will also include

2606
01:27:12,020 --> 01:27:14,020
the public. And the advantage of

2607
01:27:14,020 --> 01:27:15,020
a comprehensive development plan

2608
01:27:15,020 --> 01:27:17,020
is, it goes much further than

2609
01:27:17,020 --> 01:27:18,020
zoning. It goes much further

2610
01:27:18,020 --> 01:27:22,020
then -- so, it is not required

2611
01:27:22,020 --> 01:27:25,020
by law. There is -- we don't

2612
01:27:25,020 --> 01:27:26,020
have to do this. We could go

2613
01:27:26,020 --> 01:27:27,020
directly to public participation

2614
01:27:27,020 --> 01:27:30,020
and have meetings, consult -- we

2615
01:27:30,020 --> 01:27:32,020
could do all that. But we want

2616
01:27:32,020 --> 01:27:34,020
Cadillac Fairview to be there. I

2617
01:27:34,020 --> 01:27:35,020
think it makes sense that they

2618
01:27:35,020 --> 01:27:36,020
are going to be there. Right

2619
01:27:36,020 --> 01:27:37,020
now, we are in litigation with

2620
01:27:37,020 --> 01:27:40,020
them. So, the sole purpose of

2621
01:27:40,020 --> 01:27:42,020
this is to build that trust with

2622
01:27:42,020 --> 01:27:43,020
Cadillac Fairview, each will

2623
01:27:43,020 --> 01:27:46,020
trust, so that we can get to the

2624
01:27:46,020 --> 01:27:47,020
point where we can talk to the

2625
01:27:47,020 --> 01:27:50,020
public. It's not going to

2626
01:27:50,020 --> 01:27:54,020
structure -- we can't work out

2627
01:27:54,020 --> 01:27:55,020
an agreement with Cadillac

2628
01:27:55,020 --> 01:27:56,020
Fairview -- can't get that

2629
01:27:56,020 --> 01:27:58,020
mutual agreement going forward,

2630
01:27:58,020 --> 01:28:00,080
then we will go on our own. It

2631
01:28:00,080 --> 01:28:03,080
is preferable to have our

2632
01:28:03,080 --> 01:28:04,080
partner there. Because they are

2633
01:28:04,080 --> 01:28:06,080
a partner. They own a lot of

2634
01:28:06,080 --> 01:28:08,080
land. That is the preference.

2635
01:28:08,080 --> 01:28:09,080
But if it doesn't work out, it

2636
01:28:09,080 --> 01:28:10,080
does not work out. But we have

2637
01:28:10,080 --> 01:28:12,080
got to give it a shot.

2638
01:28:12,080 --> 01:28:14,080
>> I'm just -- thank you for

2639
01:28:14,080 --> 01:28:16,080
your response. I'm just --

2640
01:28:16,080 --> 01:28:17,080
further to this response, then,

2641
01:28:17,080 --> 01:28:18,080
is there a possibility of maybe

2642
01:28:18,080 --> 01:28:21,080
a friendly amendment on this

2643
01:28:21,080 --> 01:28:22,080
resolution if this were to ever

2644
01:28:22,080 --> 01:28:24,080
go forward? Because, as I am

2645
01:28:24,080 --> 01:28:29,080
reading it, it's that the mutual

2646
01:28:29,080 --> 01:28:31,080
agreeable Pat would also involve

2647
01:28:31,080 --> 01:28:32,080
Cadillac Fairview being in

2648
01:28:32,080 --> 01:28:33,080
favour of the type of public

2649
01:28:33,080 --> 01:28:36,080
participation that takes place.

2650
01:28:36,080 --> 01:28:38,080
And I am -- I don't say that

2651
01:28:38,080 --> 01:28:39,080
that was necessarily the intent.

2652
01:28:39,080 --> 01:28:41,080
But the way I am reading it, it

2653
01:28:41,080 --> 01:28:42,080
is how I am understanding it.

2654
01:28:42,080 --> 01:28:44,080
Thank you.

2655
01:28:44,080 --> 01:28:47,080
>> And if I could just add to

2656
01:28:47,080 --> 01:28:51,080
that, our partner in this city

2657
01:28:51,080 --> 01:28:54,080
-- there are 34,000 residents.

2658
01:28:54,080 --> 01:28:56,080
Each and every one of you has

2659
01:28:56,080 --> 01:28:59,080
equal say to Cadillac Fairview.

2660
01:28:59,080 --> 01:29:00,040
And Cadillac Fairview is not our

2661
01:29:00,040 --> 01:29:02,040
partner. Cadillac Fairview is a

2662
01:29:02,040 --> 01:29:04,040
participant in our city. And you

2663
01:29:04,040 --> 01:29:07,040
all really matter in how we

2664
01:29:07,040 --> 01:29:10,040
engage in this process. And I am

2665
01:29:10,040 --> 01:29:11,040
here to protect you and your

2666
01:29:11,040 --> 01:29:14,040
voice. And it is not a 50/50

2667
01:29:14,040 --> 01:29:16,040
thing here. There are 34,000

2668
01:29:16,040 --> 01:29:20,040
people and a large company. And

2669
01:29:20,040 --> 01:29:21,040
it does not work in a

2670
01:29:21,040 --> 01:29:25,040
partnership. The company has to

2671
01:29:25,040 --> 01:29:27,040
respect and deal with something

2672
01:29:27,040 --> 01:29:29,040
that represents 34,000 people.

2673
01:29:29,040 --> 01:29:31,040
And I want some of them to have

2674
01:29:31,040 --> 01:29:33,040
their voices heard.

2675
01:29:33,040 --> 01:29:37,040
>> --

2676
01:29:37,040 --> 01:29:40,040
>> May I comment?

2677
01:29:40,040 --> 01:29:42,040
>> Of course, Councillor --

2678
01:29:42,040 --> 01:29:43,040
>> Would have come to this

2679
01:29:43,040 --> 01:29:44,040
process, whatever comes out of

2680
01:29:44,040 --> 01:29:45,040
this discussion, will be brought

2681
01:29:45,040 --> 01:29:47,040
back to the administration,

2682
01:29:47,040 --> 01:29:49,040
Council, and directly through to

2683
01:29:49,040 --> 01:29:51,040
you. You will know with this is.

2684
01:29:51,040 --> 01:29:52,040
And if we don't like it as a

2685
01:29:52,040 --> 01:29:56,040
group, like Mr. Cowan said, we

2686
01:29:56,040 --> 01:29:57,040
can change. We can say, no, we

2687
01:29:57,040 --> 01:29:59,040
don't like it. But there has to

2688
01:29:59,040 --> 01:30:02,000
be a start point. So, whatever

2689
01:30:02,000 --> 01:30:04,000
they discuss as brought back,

2690
01:30:04,000 --> 01:30:06,000
it's a setup that communication

2691
01:30:06,000 --> 01:30:07,000
link. Because, whether we like

2692
01:30:07,000 --> 01:30:09,000
it or not, we are falling

2693
01:30:09,000 --> 01:30:10,000
behind, we are not moving

2694
01:30:10,000 --> 01:30:12,000
forward. And the purpose of this

2695
01:30:12,000 --> 01:30:14,000
resolution is to ensure that the

2696
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:17,000
public is aware that -- that

2697
01:30:17,000 --> 01:30:18,000
Cadillac Fairview is aware, we

2698
01:30:18,000 --> 01:30:20,000
are all aware, that the citizens

2699
01:30:20,000 --> 01:30:21,000
are aware that we are going to

2700
01:30:21,000 --> 01:30:22,000
begin something with them. And

2701
01:30:22,000 --> 01:30:26,000
it basically gives full

2702
01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:27,000
authority to our G G to speak

2703
01:30:27,000 --> 01:30:29,000
with them. And whatever they

2704
01:30:29,000 --> 01:30:30,000
come back will be under the

2705
01:30:30,000 --> 01:30:32,000
review, and our review. So we

2706
01:30:32,000 --> 01:30:34,000
are making sure we get to the

2707
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:35,000
start line. Again, it will come

2708
01:30:35,000 --> 01:30:37,000
back to us. And we will see. And

2709
01:30:37,000 --> 01:30:38,000
it will be discussed.

2710
01:30:38,000 --> 01:30:40,000
>> Thank you. Thank you,

2711
01:30:40,000 --> 01:30:41,000
Councillor Stork.

2712
01:30:41,000 --> 01:30:44,000
>> May I ask one more question?

2713
01:30:44,000 --> 01:30:45,000
Not

2714
01:30:45,000 --> 01:30:50,000
>> Yes -- if it's quick. --

2715
01:30:50,000 --> 01:30:53,000
>> I've got a couple of

2716
01:30:53,000 --> 01:30:56,000
concerns. -- when you enter into

2717
01:30:56,000 --> 01:30:58,000
a dialogue with, for instance,

2718
01:30:58,000 --> 01:30:59,000
Cadillac Fairview in this case,

2719
01:30:59,000 --> 01:31:00,060
when you have the public undoes

2720
01:31:00,060 --> 01:31:01,060
of commercial interests

2721
01:31:01,060 --> 01:31:03,060
involved, when there are

2722
01:31:03,060 --> 01:31:05,060
quasi-agreements made in those

2723
01:31:05,060 --> 01:31:08,060
situations, trying to

2724
01:31:08,060 --> 01:31:09,060
renegotiate them out can be

2725
01:31:09,060 --> 01:31:13,060
very, very difficult. And I am

2726
01:31:13,060 --> 01:31:16,060
still here wondering why -- I

2727
01:31:16,060 --> 01:31:18,060
understand, eventually, Cadillac

2728
01:31:18,060 --> 01:31:20,060
Fairview needs to be at the

2729
01:31:20,060 --> 01:31:24,060
table. I hope if this ever does

2730
01:31:24,060 --> 01:31:28,060
pass that madame Verdone will be

2731
01:31:28,060 --> 01:31:29,060
with a lawyer. Because if we are

2732
01:31:29,060 --> 01:31:30,060
already in court with him, I

2733
01:31:30,060 --> 01:31:31,060
don't know how this negotiation

2734
01:31:31,060 --> 01:31:33,060
is supposed to take place. But I

2735
01:31:33,060 --> 01:31:35,060
don't see why we just can't have

2736
01:31:35,060 --> 01:31:38,060
public participation fire to

2737
01:31:38,060 --> 01:31:42,060
this step. And so far -- maybe

2738
01:31:42,060 --> 01:31:43,060
when it's brought forward and

2739
01:31:43,060 --> 01:31:44,060
you have a chance to debate it

2740
01:31:44,060 --> 01:31:45,060
as a group I will understand

2741
01:31:45,060 --> 01:31:46,060
better.

2742
01:31:46,060 --> 01:31:47,060
>> --

2743
01:31:47,060 --> 01:31:49,060
>> Thank you.

2744
01:31:49,060 --> 01:31:50,060
>> Councillor -- that's enough.

2745
01:31:50,060 --> 01:31:52,060
>> --

2746
01:31:52,060 --> 01:31:54,060
>> With that to him? Or was that

2747
01:31:54,060 --> 01:31:56,060
to me?

2748
01:31:56,060 --> 01:31:59,060
>> Who is -- to be fair, I was

2749
01:31:59,060 --> 01:32:02,020
actually responding to Stork. He

2750
01:32:02,020 --> 01:32:04,020
acknowledged.

2751
01:32:04,020 --> 01:32:05,020
>> Go ahead, Councillor Stork.

2752
01:32:05,020 --> 01:32:06,020
>> --

2753
01:32:06,020 --> 01:32:08,020
>> Whatever comes out of this,

2754
01:32:08,020 --> 01:32:09,020
is nonbinding. Whatever comes

2755
01:32:09,020 --> 01:32:10,020
back, it's not a written

2756
01:32:10,020 --> 01:32:12,020
document we must adhere to. That

2757
01:32:12,020 --> 01:32:12,020
is -- to the start. Line if they

2758
01:32:12,020 --> 01:32:14,020
come -- back if we disagree with

2759
01:32:14,020 --> 01:32:15,020
it, as a group, as a community,

2760
01:32:15,020 --> 01:32:17,020
as a city, nothing is binding of

2761
01:32:17,020 --> 01:32:19,020
this. It is just to open

2762
01:32:19,020 --> 01:32:21,020
dialogue. It's like a first

2763
01:32:21,020 --> 01:32:24,020
date. Just to understand each

2764
01:32:24,020 --> 01:32:25,020
other. Get an understanding of

2765
01:32:25,020 --> 01:32:27,020
-- how do we want the public to

2766
01:32:27,020 --> 01:32:30,020
participate in this? And we have

2767
01:32:30,020 --> 01:32:33,020
heard an outside firm who would

2768
01:32:33,020 --> 01:32:35,020
be the ones who initiate and who

2769
01:32:35,020 --> 01:32:37,020
would set it up and have the

2770
01:32:37,020 --> 01:32:38,020
public consultations. And an

2771
01:32:38,020 --> 01:32:41,020
outside from that's already been

2772
01:32:41,020 --> 01:32:42,020
hired -- it's due -- to the

2773
01:32:42,020 --> 01:32:44,020
starting line in terms of

2774
01:32:44,020 --> 01:32:45,020
communicating and seeing how we

2775
01:32:45,020 --> 01:32:48,020
can build one together.

2776
01:32:48,020 --> 01:32:49,020
>> I suppose, in my limited

2777
01:32:49,020 --> 01:32:51,020
experience of community work, I

2778
01:32:51,020 --> 01:32:52,020
really like to get my ducks in a

2779
01:32:52,020 --> 01:32:54,020
row with the community first and

2780
01:32:54,020 --> 01:32:56,020
then go forward. But that's my

2781
01:32:56,020 --> 01:32:57,020
own personal preference.

2782
01:32:57,020 --> 01:32:58,020
>> Thank you.

2783
01:32:58,020 --> 01:32:59,020
>> Thank you very much for your

2784
01:32:59,020 --> 01:33:04,080
time.

2785
01:33:04,080 --> 01:33:07,080
>> Hello -- Conway.

2786
01:33:07,080 --> 01:33:09,080
- Le micro, Madame Conway, près

2787
01:33:09,080 --> 01:33:10,080
du micro, s'il vous plaît, pas

2788
01:33:10,080 --> 01:33:12,080
loin.

2789
01:33:12,080 --> 01:33:15,080
>> This resolution was drafted

2790
01:33:15,080 --> 01:33:16,080
by four councillors.

2791
01:33:16,080 --> 01:33:19,080
>> Yes?

2792
01:33:19,080 --> 01:33:20,080
>> Councillor Stainforth, Cowan,

2793
01:33:20,080 --> 01:33:21,080
Eric Stork, and who is the

2794
01:33:21,080 --> 01:33:22,080
fourth one?

2795
01:33:22,080 --> 01:33:27,080
>> Ms. Homan.

2796
01:33:27,080 --> 01:33:28,080
>> Okay. I guess we can ask you

2797
01:33:28,080 --> 01:33:29,080
a question. Because we did not

2798
01:33:29,080 --> 01:33:31,080
hear from you tonight so far. --

2799
01:33:31,080 --> 01:33:32,080
this is your resolution.

2800
01:33:32,080 --> 01:33:37,080
>> -- -- joint -- yes --

2801
01:33:39,080 --> 01:33:41,080
>> I don't see anything about

2802
01:33:41,080 --> 01:33:42,080
dates or timewise. Can you

2803
01:33:42,080 --> 01:33:44,080
address that quickly.

2804
01:33:44,080 --> 01:33:45,080
>> Sorry?

2805
01:33:45,080 --> 01:33:46,080
>> Could you address that? There

2806
01:33:46,080 --> 01:33:50,080
is no dates or limits of time.

2807
01:33:50,080 --> 01:33:51,080
>> I can't --

2808
01:33:51,080 --> 01:33:54,080
>> I can address that -- the

2809
01:33:54,080 --> 01:33:57,080
only reference to time is that

2810
01:33:57,080 --> 01:33:58,080
we would like the resolution, if

2811
01:33:58,080 --> 01:34:02,040
passed, would ask the DG to

2812
01:34:02,040 --> 01:34:05,040
initiate the conversation with

2813
01:34:05,040 --> 01:34:06,040
-- Cadillac Fairview forthwith,

2814
01:34:06,040 --> 01:34:08,040
with which means quickly.

2815
01:34:10,040 --> 01:34:12,040
>> I see there's a mishmash of

2816
01:34:12,040 --> 01:34:17,040
things in here. Why is there

2817
01:34:17,040 --> 01:34:19,040
reference to, whereas a project

2818
01:34:19,040 --> 01:34:21,040
to construct bicycle and

2819
01:34:21,040 --> 01:34:23,040
pedestrian path crossing Highway

2820
01:34:23,040 --> 01:34:24,040
40 in the city centre -- that

2821
01:34:24,040 --> 01:34:29,040
state of planning -- is this

2822
01:34:32,040 --> 01:34:35,040
going to have an access to, on

2823
01:34:35,040 --> 01:34:37,040
the Cadillac Fairview property,

2824
01:34:37,040 --> 01:34:38,040
the bike path?

2825
01:34:38,040 --> 01:34:40,040
>> That is the goal, ideally,

2826
01:34:40,040 --> 01:34:41,040
yes. If it happens, yes.

2827
01:34:41,040 --> 01:34:44,040
>> -- bike path that is going to

2828
01:34:44,040 --> 01:34:45,040
happen, then it's not going to

2829
01:34:45,040 --> 01:34:47,040
happen. I heard on and off so

2830
01:34:47,040 --> 01:34:49,040
many times. Is this something --

2831
01:34:49,040 --> 01:34:50,040
which government is paying for

2832
01:34:50,040 --> 01:34:51,040
this?

2833
01:34:51,040 --> 01:34:54,040
>> It's in progress. And we

2834
01:34:54,040 --> 01:34:57,040
can't reveal any of the details,

2835
01:34:57,040 --> 01:34:59,040
except that we are hoping -- we

2836
01:34:59,040 --> 01:35:00,000
are hoping -- that we can have

2837
01:35:00,000 --> 01:35:01,000
one.

2838
01:35:01,000 --> 01:35:03,000
>> Is it imminent? Or is it like

2839
01:35:03,000 --> 01:35:04,000
ten years --

2840
01:35:04,000 --> 01:35:06,000
>> Can say. Can't say.

2841
01:35:06,000 --> 01:35:08,000
>> Okay. But Cadillac Fairview

2842
01:35:08,000 --> 01:35:09,000
have to be involved in the

2843
01:35:09,000 --> 01:35:10,000
discussions with this?

2844
01:35:10,000 --> 01:35:11,000
>> No. No.

2845
01:35:11,000 --> 01:35:15,000
>> So, my question is, why is

2846
01:35:15,000 --> 01:35:18,000
this in the document?

2847
01:35:18,000 --> 01:35:19,000
>> That's a good question.

2848
01:35:19,000 --> 01:35:20,000
>> --

2849
01:35:20,000 --> 01:35:21,000
>> He Ms. Homan, we did not hear

2850
01:35:21,000 --> 01:35:23,000
from you much tonight. --

2851
01:35:23,000 --> 01:35:27,000
>> -- would you like Councillor

2852
01:35:28,000 --> 01:35:31,000
Cowan -- would you like

2853
01:35:31,000 --> 01:35:33,000
Councillor Cowan to answer, Ms.

2854
01:35:33,000 --> 01:35:34,000
Conway?

2855
01:35:34,000 --> 01:35:35,000
>> The answer is, that it's to

2856
01:35:35,000 --> 01:35:36,000
indicate that things are moving

2857
01:35:36,000 --> 01:35:38,000
up there, whether we are

2858
01:35:38,000 --> 01:35:39,000
involved or not, whether we get

2859
01:35:39,000 --> 01:35:40,000
through this process or not.

2860
01:35:40,000 --> 01:35:42,000
Things are happening up there.

2861
01:35:42,000 --> 01:35:44,000
>> Okay. So, my interpretation

2862
01:35:44,000 --> 01:35:45,000
of that is that this is just a

2863
01:35:45,000 --> 01:35:46,000
scare tactic. Because that

2864
01:35:46,000 --> 01:35:48,000
sentence does not belong in

2865
01:35:48,000 --> 01:35:50,000
there at all. And I keep hearing

2866
01:35:50,000 --> 01:35:52,000
about the public, the public.

2867
01:35:52,000 --> 01:35:55,000
Members of the public -- and

2868
01:35:55,000 --> 01:35:57,000
mutually agreeable. So, Cadillac

2869
01:35:57,000 --> 01:35:59,000
Fairview will pick which public

2870
01:35:59,000 --> 01:36:01,060
can assist in this?

2871
01:36:01,060 --> 01:36:02,060
>> Well, we don't know.

2872
01:36:02,060 --> 01:36:07,060
>> -- mutually agreeable.

2873
01:36:08,060 --> 01:36:09,060
>> Yep.

2874
01:36:09,060 --> 01:36:11,060
>> So, they will decide which

2875
01:36:11,060 --> 01:36:12,060
public --

2876
01:36:12,060 --> 01:36:13,060
>> They will have an equal voice

2877
01:36:13,060 --> 01:36:14,060
in how the public is to

2878
01:36:14,060 --> 01:36:16,060
participate. They are,

2879
01:36:16,060 --> 01:36:17,060
apparently, our partners,

2880
01:36:17,060 --> 01:36:19,060
according to Councillor Cowan.

2881
01:36:19,060 --> 01:36:20,060
>> They will be partners?

2882
01:36:20,060 --> 01:36:21,060
>> Yeah.

2883
01:36:21,060 --> 01:36:22,060
>> We don't know --

2884
01:36:22,060 --> 01:36:23,060
>> We don't know what the

2885
01:36:23,060 --> 01:36:24,060
partnership is going to result

2886
01:36:24,060 --> 01:36:25,060
in and how you guys are going to

2887
01:36:25,060 --> 01:36:27,060
be allowed to participate. We

2888
01:36:27,060 --> 01:36:28,060
don't know the end result.

2889
01:36:28,060 --> 01:36:29,060
>> Okay. So, that's very

2890
01:36:29,060 --> 01:36:30,060
concerning, like everybody else

2891
01:36:30,060 --> 01:36:32,060
that has mentioned it before me.

2892
01:36:32,060 --> 01:36:35,060
And the last sentence being a

2893
01:36:35,060 --> 01:36:37,060
settlement -- between the city

2894
01:36:37,060 --> 01:36:39,060
and Cadillac Fairview. So, is

2895
01:36:39,060 --> 01:36:40,060
this, like, relating to the

2896
01:36:40,060 --> 01:36:45,060
RCMP? RCI? --

2897
01:36:46,060 --> 01:36:48,060
>> -- City being sued because of

2898
01:36:48,060 --> 01:36:51,060
the RCI? This is the only thing

2899
01:36:51,060 --> 01:36:52,060
-- litigation --

2900
01:36:52,060 --> 01:36:54,060
>> I can't speak to that. I

2901
01:36:54,060 --> 01:36:55,060
can't speak to that.

2902
01:36:55,060 --> 01:36:56,060
>> I think we have a right to

2903
01:36:56,060 --> 01:36:57,060
know.

2904
01:36:57,060 --> 01:36:58,060
>> It is being litigated. I

2905
01:36:58,060 --> 01:37:03,020
can't speak to that. Ma'am --

2906
01:37:03,020 --> 01:37:05,020
madame Conway, I can't speak to

2907
01:37:05,020 --> 01:37:06,020
--

2908
01:37:06,020 --> 01:37:10,020
>> -- legal. The RCI -- Legal --

2909
01:37:11,020 --> 01:37:14,020
>> The RCI's legal -- yes.

2910
01:37:14,020 --> 01:37:15,020
>> So, no judge --

2911
01:37:15,020 --> 01:37:16,020
>> -- I'm not in position to

2912
01:37:16,020 --> 01:37:19,020
speak to that.

2913
01:37:19,020 --> 01:37:24,020
>> Okay. I think it was Eric

2914
01:37:25,020 --> 01:37:26,020
that said it would be

2915
01:37:26,020 --> 01:37:28,020
nonbinding. But if any

2916
01:37:28,020 --> 01:37:29,020
discussions --

2917
01:37:29,020 --> 01:37:31,020
>> Ms. Conway, you have had

2918
01:37:31,020 --> 01:37:34,020
quite a few questions now. I

2919
01:37:34,020 --> 01:37:36,020
will allow you one more. Do you

2920
01:37:36,020 --> 01:37:37,020
have one final question? Is this

2921
01:37:37,020 --> 01:37:38,020
it?

2922
01:37:38,020 --> 01:37:40,020
>> Will any discussion as the

2923
01:37:40,020 --> 01:37:42,020
City has be documented and have

2924
01:37:42,020 --> 01:37:43,020
a legal consequence?

2925
01:37:43,020 --> 01:37:45,020
>> That's a good question.

2926
01:37:45,020 --> 01:37:46,020
Probably not. We are not there.

2927
01:37:46,020 --> 01:37:47,020
I don't even know what the

2928
01:37:47,020 --> 01:37:48,020
structure of the conversation is

2929
01:37:48,020 --> 01:37:49,020
going to be.

2930
01:37:49,020 --> 01:37:51,020
>> Can any member of the city

2931
01:37:51,020 --> 01:37:52,020
that have a conversation, will

2932
01:37:52,020 --> 01:37:55,020
have a legal consequence of what

2933
01:37:55,020 --> 01:37:57,020
is said?

2934
01:37:57,020 --> 01:37:58,020
>> Apparently, these

2935
01:37:58,020 --> 01:38:01,080
conversations can be had in

2936
01:38:01,080 --> 01:38:04,080
spite of the court case. That is

2937
01:38:04,080 --> 01:38:09,080
my understanding. Am I wrong on

2938
01:38:10,080 --> 01:38:11,080
that one, Madame table?

2939
01:38:11,080 --> 01:38:13,080
>> That's correct --

2940
01:38:16,080 --> 01:38:19,080
Mr. Thomas, you did mention at

2941
01:38:19,080 --> 01:38:21,080
the beginning of the meeting,

2942
01:38:21,080 --> 01:38:22,080
but if duration is -- that

2943
01:38:22,080 --> 01:38:23,080
>> We are at the 90 minutes?

2944
01:38:23,080 --> 01:38:25,080
>> We went two minutes farther

2945
01:38:25,080 --> 01:38:27,080
last night. -- fast question,

2946
01:38:27,080 --> 01:38:30,080
and then the man behind you can

2947
01:38:30,080 --> 01:38:32,080
have a very fast question?

2948
01:38:34,080 --> 01:38:35,080
- Daniel Montpetit. Depuis

2949
01:38:35,080 --> 01:38:38,080
tantôt, j'entends parler du

2950
01:38:38,080 --> 01:38:39,080
Cadillac Fairview, qu'est-ce que

2951
01:38:39,080 --> 01:38:40,080
ça va nous prendre pour...

2952
01:38:40,080 --> 01:38:43,080
>> Excuse, me excuse -- me hang

2953
01:38:43,080 --> 01:38:44,080
on, Mr. --

2954
01:38:44,080 --> 01:38:45,080
(interpreter)

2955
01:38:45,080 --> 01:38:46,080
could we refrain

2956
01:38:46,080 --> 01:38:47,080
- C'est from discussing in beau.

2957
01:38:47,080 --> 01:38:48,080
Et là, on the room? Thank you.

2958
01:38:48,080 --> 01:38:49,080
Parle de Cadillac Fairview qui

2959
01:38:49,080 --> 01:38:51,080
veulent agrandir...

2960
01:38:51,080 --> 01:38:52,080
>> Thank you -- avant de

2961
01:38:52,080 --> 01:38:53,080
commencer à yes, -- parler de

2962
01:38:53,080 --> 01:38:55,080
ça... yes excuse me -- attendez,

2963
01:38:55,080 --> 01:38:56,080
monsieur Montpetit... someone is

2964
01:38:56,080 --> 01:38:58,080
being assured out.

2965
01:39:05,040 --> 01:39:07,040
Oui, Monsieur, je m'excuse.

2966
01:39:07,040 --> 01:39:09,040
- Bon, on recommence! On parle

2967
01:39:09,040 --> 01:39:10,040
de Cadillac Fairview qui veulent

2968
01:39:10,040 --> 01:39:13,040
bâtir, pour savoir ce qu'ils

2969
01:39:13,040 --> 01:39:17,040
vont faire, on a une place, ici,

2970
01:39:17,040 --> 01:39:18,040
à Pointe-Claire qui ont été,

2971
01:39:18,040 --> 01:39:22,040
fait, ça a été bâti, il y a du

2972
01:39:22,040 --> 01:39:24,040
monde qui a des problèmes avec

2973
01:39:24,040 --> 01:39:28,040
l'eau, ça se remplit, il me

2974
01:39:28,040 --> 01:39:29,040
semble que Cadillac Fairview

2975
01:39:29,040 --> 01:39:31,040
devrait passer après les

2976
01:39:31,040 --> 01:39:32,040
troubles qu'on a avant de

2977
01:39:32,040 --> 01:39:34,040
commencer à se faire d'autres

2978
01:39:34,040 --> 01:39:35,040
troubles, ça ne serait pas une

2979
01:39:35,040 --> 01:39:37,040
bonne idée, ça, régler un

2980
01:39:37,040 --> 01:39:39,040
problème qui est encore là avant

2981
01:39:39,040 --> 01:39:42,040
d'en causer un, autre peut-être?

2982
01:39:42,040 --> 01:39:45,040
- Quelqu'un a déjà posé cette

2983
01:39:45,040 --> 01:39:48,040
question. On en a déjà parlé, de

2984
01:39:48,040 --> 01:39:49,040
ça.

2985
01:39:49,040 --> 01:39:52,040
- L'autre affaire, on est assis,

2986
01:39:52,040 --> 01:39:55,040
ça ne marche pas bien, le

2987
01:39:55,040 --> 01:39:56,040
(inaudible)

2988
01:39:56,040 --> 01:39:57,040
.

2989
01:39:57,040 --> 01:39:58,040
- Les haut-parleurs ne marchent

2990
01:39:58,040 --> 01:40:00,000
pas bien en bas. Oui, Monsieur?

2991
01:40:00,000 --> 01:40:01,000
>> Just a point of

2992
01:40:01,000 --> 01:40:02,000
Clarification, before I --

2993
01:40:02,000 --> 01:40:04,000
>> The microphone? The

2994
01:40:04,000 --> 01:40:05,000
microphone? Can't hear you --

2995
01:40:05,000 --> 01:40:06,000
>> Can you please state your

2996
01:40:06,000 --> 01:40:07,000
name?

2997
01:40:07,000 --> 01:40:11,000
>> Yes, my name is David

2998
01:40:11,000 --> 01:40:12,000
Fletcher. I'm not a resident of

2999
01:40:12,000 --> 01:40:14,000
Pointe-Claire. I'm a resident of

3000
01:40:14,000 --> 01:40:16,000
the West Island and I'm the vice

3001
01:40:16,000 --> 01:40:17,000
president of the green

3002
01:40:17,000 --> 01:40:19,000
coalition. It represents many of

3003
01:40:19,000 --> 01:40:20,000
the people here in

3004
01:40:20,000 --> 01:40:24,000
Pointe-Claire. Just before I

3005
01:40:24,000 --> 01:40:25,000
make a comment --

3006
01:40:25,000 --> 01:40:27,000
>> The microphone? The

3007
01:40:27,000 --> 01:40:29,000
microphone, Mr. Fletcher,

3008
01:40:29,000 --> 01:40:31,000
because nobody -- can hear you.

3009
01:40:31,000 --> 01:40:33,000
Take it right out or maybe --

3010
01:40:33,000 --> 01:40:34,000
>> Okay. Maybe a clarification

3011
01:40:34,000 --> 01:40:37,000
is whether or not your council

3012
01:40:37,000 --> 01:40:38,000
considers itself to be a

3013
01:40:38,000 --> 01:40:39,000
sustainable development

3014
01:40:39,000 --> 01:40:42,000
administration.

3015
01:40:42,000 --> 01:40:44,000
>> We would hope to be. We are

3016
01:40:44,000 --> 01:40:45,000
one year in --

3017
01:40:45,000 --> 01:40:47,000
>> The you have a policy --

3018
01:40:47,000 --> 01:40:49,000
>> We have a pretty good

3019
01:40:49,000 --> 01:40:50,000
environmental policy. Hopefully,

3020
01:40:50,000 --> 01:40:51,000
we can live up to -- it

3021
01:40:51,000 --> 01:40:52,000
>> There are certain things

3022
01:40:52,000 --> 01:40:55,000
about your policy, Mr. Mayor,

3023
01:40:55,000 --> 01:40:56,000
that are questionable.

3024
01:40:56,000 --> 01:40:57,000
>> Okay.

3025
01:40:57,000 --> 01:40:59,000
>> Number one --

3026
01:40:59,000 --> 01:41:02,060
>> Yeah, this is not on topic,

3027
01:41:02,060 --> 01:41:03,060
Mr. Fletcher -- you have to

3028
01:41:03,060 --> 01:41:04,060
speak to the resolution.

3029
01:41:04,060 --> 01:41:05,060
>> The resolution --

3030
01:41:05,060 --> 01:41:07,060
>> And the mandate --

3031
01:41:07,060 --> 01:41:08,060
>> Well, can you make it up

3032
01:41:08,060 --> 01:41:10,060
really quickly?

3033
01:41:10,060 --> 01:41:14,060
>> Yes, yes. I just noticed --

3034
01:41:14,060 --> 01:41:16,060
the whereas, and to the things,

3035
01:41:16,060 --> 01:41:17,060
that are there, are having to do

3036
01:41:17,060 --> 01:41:18,060
with the economics of the city

3037
01:41:18,060 --> 01:41:23,060
center. There is no concurrent

3038
01:41:25,060 --> 01:41:28,060
noting of the ecological and

3039
01:41:28,060 --> 01:41:29,060
social vitality of the city

3040
01:41:29,060 --> 01:41:32,060
center. That is something agree

3041
01:41:32,060 --> 01:41:34,060
justly missing for a Council

3042
01:41:34,060 --> 01:41:36,060
that considers itself to be

3043
01:41:36,060 --> 01:41:38,060
committed to sustainable

3044
01:41:38,060 --> 01:41:40,060
development. What is missing in

3045
01:41:40,060 --> 01:41:43,060
your policy is, in fact, citizen

3046
01:41:43,060 --> 01:41:45,060
participation. Even though it is

3047
01:41:45,060 --> 01:41:47,060
included in Québec's

3048
01:41:47,060 --> 01:41:51,060
sustainability law -- it is

3049
01:41:52,060 --> 01:41:55,060
article six hyphen E --

3050
01:41:55,060 --> 01:41:56,060
>> We are not, we are not --

3051
01:41:56,060 --> 01:41:58,060
>> --

3052
01:41:58,060 --> 01:42:00,020
>> Excuse me, Mr. Fletcher --

3053
01:42:00,020 --> 01:42:03,020
minor standing is, there's no --

3054
01:42:03,020 --> 01:42:05,020
emphasis on the environment in

3055
01:42:05,020 --> 01:42:06,020
this resolution and the proposal

3056
01:42:06,020 --> 01:42:07,020
that is going to be discussed.

3057
01:42:07,020 --> 01:42:09,020
>> I would just like to point,

3058
01:42:09,020 --> 01:42:10,020
what's in your policy, with

3059
01:42:10,020 --> 01:42:12,020
respect to Cadillac Fairview.

3060
01:42:12,020 --> 01:42:13,020
>> Okay.

3061
01:42:13,020 --> 01:42:15,020
>> On page 37, what you don't

3062
01:42:15,020 --> 01:42:16,020
have -- but

3063
01:42:16,020 --> 01:42:18,020
>> We are not speaking to our

3064
01:42:18,020 --> 01:42:19,020
policy right now, on the

3065
01:42:19,020 --> 01:42:22,020
environment. We are not speaking

3066
01:42:22,020 --> 01:42:24,020
to that -- Mr. Fletcher --

3067
01:42:24,020 --> 01:42:27,020
>> That's the way your council

3068
01:42:27,020 --> 01:42:30,020
decides on these issues.

3069
01:42:30,020 --> 01:42:31,020
>> Okay.

3070
01:42:31,020 --> 01:42:32,020
>> It should be, if you have a

3071
01:42:32,020 --> 01:42:34,020
policy, your councillors should

3072
01:42:34,020 --> 01:42:36,020
be deciding abiding.

3073
01:42:36,020 --> 01:42:38,020
>> So, you are saying -- if we

3074
01:42:38,020 --> 01:42:39,020
understand our by mental policy

3075
01:42:39,020 --> 01:42:42,020
correctly, we should abide by in

3076
01:42:42,020 --> 01:42:43,020
construction of resolution such

3077
01:42:43,020 --> 01:42:44,020
as this?

3078
01:42:44,020 --> 01:42:45,020
>> Absolutely.

3079
01:42:45,020 --> 01:42:46,020
>> Okay.

3080
01:42:46,020 --> 01:42:47,020
>> And you don't feel it is

3081
01:42:47,020 --> 01:42:48,020
sufficient?

3082
01:42:48,020 --> 01:42:50,020
>> Yes. Absolutely. And I will

3083
01:42:50,020 --> 01:42:52,020
point out one thing, by the way.

3084
01:42:52,020 --> 01:42:54,020
On page 37 of your policy,

3085
01:42:54,020 --> 01:42:56,020
although there is no mention at

3086
01:42:56,020 --> 01:42:59,020
the very beginning of the right

3087
01:42:59,020 --> 01:43:00,080
-- the citizen participation

3088
01:43:00,080 --> 01:43:02,080
that is included in Québec

3089
01:43:02,080 --> 01:43:06,080
sustainability law, you do make

3090
01:43:06,080 --> 01:43:10,080
reference to working with local

3091
01:43:11,080 --> 01:43:13,080
players. Not citizens -- local

3092
01:43:13,080 --> 01:43:16,080
players. May I point out that

3093
01:43:16,080 --> 01:43:17,080
your policy -- according to your

3094
01:43:17,080 --> 01:43:19,080
policy, Cadillac Fairview would

3095
01:43:19,080 --> 01:43:22,080
get the honour of that rather

3096
01:43:22,080 --> 01:43:24,080
than your own citizens, 34,000

3097
01:43:24,080 --> 01:43:25,080
of them.

3098
01:43:25,080 --> 01:43:27,080
>> Okay. Councillor

3099
01:43:27,080 --> 01:43:28,080
Thorstad-Cullen?

3100
01:43:28,080 --> 01:43:29,080
>> I would just invite you --

3101
01:43:29,080 --> 01:43:32,080
please, all the comments, the

3102
01:43:32,080 --> 01:43:34,080
sustainable development

3103
01:43:34,080 --> 01:43:35,080
committee is --

3104
01:43:35,080 --> 01:43:36,080
>> --

3105
01:43:36,080 --> 01:43:37,080
>> -- talking about the

3106
01:43:37,080 --> 01:43:38,080
resolution.

3107
01:43:38,080 --> 01:43:39,080
>> -- much more pertinent --

3108
01:43:39,080 --> 01:43:41,080
>> Is it about the resolution?

3109
01:43:41,080 --> 01:43:42,080
>> --

3110
01:43:42,080 --> 01:43:44,080
>> -- about the RCI --

3111
01:43:44,080 --> 01:43:45,080
>> You should bring it back. We

3112
01:43:45,080 --> 01:43:47,080
want to hear these things --

3113
01:43:47,080 --> 01:43:48,080
>> May I, by the way, address

3114
01:43:48,080 --> 01:43:50,080
myself to your mayor, and not to

3115
01:43:50,080 --> 01:43:53,080
a councillor who, should, in

3116
01:43:53,080 --> 01:43:54,080
fact be speaking only at the

3117
01:43:54,080 --> 01:43:55,080
sufferings of your mayor?

3118
01:43:55,080 --> 01:43:59,080
>> She actually asked me to

3119
01:43:59,080 --> 01:44:00,040
speak, Mr. Fletcher --

3120
01:44:00,040 --> 01:44:03,040
>> She did ask me to speak.

3121
01:44:03,040 --> 01:44:06,040
>> Mr. Fletcher --

3122
01:44:06,040 --> 01:44:07,040
>> RCI --

3123
01:44:07,040 --> 01:44:09,040
>> Do you have a question? A

3124
01:44:09,040 --> 01:44:11,040
question? A question? We are

3125
01:44:11,040 --> 01:44:14,040
running low on time. If you have

3126
01:44:14,040 --> 01:44:15,040
a pregnant question --

3127
01:44:15,040 --> 01:44:16,040
>> -- very patiently, Mister

3128
01:44:16,040 --> 01:44:17,040
Mayor.

3129
01:44:17,040 --> 01:44:19,040
>> I know you have.

3130
01:44:23,040 --> 01:44:24,040
There is a process that is going

3131
01:44:24,040 --> 01:44:27,040
to take place in the next months

3132
01:44:27,040 --> 01:44:30,040
in which there will be public

3133
01:44:30,040 --> 01:44:33,040
input. In fact it's ongoing and

3134
01:44:33,040 --> 01:44:34,040
municipalities in the CNN are

3135
01:44:34,040 --> 01:44:36,040
going making our own been put

3136
01:44:38,040 --> 01:44:40,040
I was there in 2011,

3137
01:44:40,040 --> 01:44:43,040
participated in and contributed

3138
01:44:43,040 --> 01:44:47,040
to the process that resulted in

3139
01:44:48,040 --> 01:44:49,040
it being adopted.

3140
01:44:49,040 --> 01:44:50,040
>> How is this relevant to what

3141
01:44:50,040 --> 01:44:52,040
we are talking about tonight,

3142
01:44:52,040 --> 01:44:53,040
Mr. Fletcher?

3143
01:44:53,040 --> 01:44:54,040
>> This is important.

3144
01:44:54,040 --> 01:44:56,040
>> But Mr. -- yeah, Mr. Fletcher

3145
01:44:56,040 --> 01:44:57,040
--

3146
01:44:57,040 --> 01:44:58,040
>> Allow me to make this point.

3147
01:44:58,040 --> 01:45:01,000
>> Okay, but, can you summarize?

3148
01:45:01,000 --> 01:45:02,000
>> Yes, I'll get to the point

3149
01:45:02,000 --> 01:45:07,000
very quickly. When it was

3150
01:45:08,000 --> 01:45:12,000
adopted, by the end of 2023,

3151
01:45:12,000 --> 01:45:14,000
your council will have to bring

3152
01:45:14,000 --> 01:45:15,000
its urban plan into conformity

3153
01:45:15,000 --> 01:45:20,000
with it. So, any consultation

3154
01:45:20,000 --> 01:45:22,000
that takes place, whether it's

3155
01:45:22,000 --> 01:45:25,000
Cadillac vary, or any of your

3156
01:45:25,000 --> 01:45:27,000
34,000 citizens, it'll be

3157
01:45:27,000 --> 01:45:30,000
irrelevant until you have a

3158
01:45:30,000 --> 01:45:32,000
document presented to you by the

3159
01:45:32,000 --> 01:45:35,000
PMAD that will establish the

3160
01:45:35,000 --> 01:45:37,000
criteria against which you are

3161
01:45:37,000 --> 01:45:38,000
going to have to act.

3162
01:45:38,000 --> 01:45:41,000
>> Okay. Is that it? Is that

3163
01:45:41,000 --> 01:45:42,000
your --

3164
01:45:42,000 --> 01:45:43,000
>> That's pretty much it.

3165
01:45:43,000 --> 01:45:45,000
>> Okay, right now, you know, I

3166
01:45:45,000 --> 01:45:48,000
mean, with obstruction, in, oh I

3167
01:45:48,000 --> 01:45:49,000
think this is really -- I've

3168
01:45:49,000 --> 01:45:51,000
been watching your council, the

3169
01:45:51,000 --> 01:45:52,000
way it operates, Mister Mayor,

3170
01:45:52,000 --> 01:45:54,000
you should be exercising far

3171
01:45:54,000 --> 01:45:56,000
more control over these

3172
01:45:56,000 --> 01:45:57,000
dissidents councillors --

3173
01:45:57,000 --> 01:45:59,000
>> They were --

3174
01:45:59,000 --> 01:46:00,060
>> You have, by the -- way

3175
01:46:00,060 --> 01:46:02,060
>> No clapping, please, no

3176
01:46:02,060 --> 01:46:03,060
clapping.

3177
01:46:03,060 --> 01:46:05,060
>> People who elected to these

3178
01:46:05,060 --> 01:46:07,060
councillors, and put them in by

3179
01:46:07,060 --> 01:46:09,060
a majority as councillors, are

3180
01:46:09,060 --> 01:46:10,060
the same people who --

3181
01:46:10,060 --> 01:46:12,060
>> Point of order, please. Can

3182
01:46:12,060 --> 01:46:14,060
we end this conversation?

3183
01:46:14,060 --> 01:46:15,060
>> Excuse me --

3184
01:46:15,060 --> 01:46:18,060
>> Mister Mayor? Please --

3185
01:46:18,060 --> 01:46:21,060
>> Excuse me.

3186
01:46:21,060 --> 01:46:22,060
>> Civility --

3187
01:46:22,060 --> 01:46:26,060
>> Excuse me. Excuse me. Now,

3188
01:46:26,060 --> 01:46:28,060
thank you, Mr. Fletcher.

3189
01:46:28,060 --> 01:46:30,060
>> I've been given a short --

3190
01:46:30,060 --> 01:46:32,060
>> While, we are out of time,

3191
01:46:32,060 --> 01:46:33,060
Mr. Fletcher, with all due

3192
01:46:33,060 --> 01:46:34,060
respect, or out of time. Thank

3193
01:46:34,060 --> 01:46:39,060
you, very much.

3194
01:46:40,060 --> 01:46:42,060
>> Okay, so, let's proceed to

3195
01:46:42,060 --> 01:46:45,060
voting on the resolution. I

3196
01:46:45,060 --> 01:46:47,060
suggest we start with the people

3197
01:46:47,060 --> 01:46:49,060
who created it. Councillor

3198
01:46:49,060 --> 01:46:50,060
Cowan, would you like to explain

3199
01:46:50,060 --> 01:46:53,060
your vote?

3200
01:46:53,060 --> 01:46:55,060
>> First, we need to move --

3201
01:46:55,060 --> 01:46:56,060
>> It has to be moved and

3202
01:46:56,060 --> 01:46:58,060
seconded.

3203
01:46:58,060 --> 01:46:59,060
>> What?

3204
01:46:59,060 --> 01:47:01,020
>> Order to move the resolutions

3205
01:47:01,020 --> 01:47:06,020
before us, I have a speech I

3206
01:47:06,020 --> 01:47:10,020
prepared. I'm kind of

3207
01:47:10,020 --> 01:47:12,020
apprehensive about it,

3208
01:47:12,020 --> 01:47:14,020
delivering it, because it's been

3209
01:47:14,020 --> 01:47:16,020
such a long evening, and it's

3210
01:47:16,020 --> 01:47:17,020
going to go over points that

3211
01:47:17,020 --> 01:47:18,020
have been raised. However, I

3212
01:47:18,020 --> 01:47:20,020
think I really need to because I

3213
01:47:20,020 --> 01:47:22,020
have to put, I think, I think we

3214
01:47:22,020 --> 01:47:24,020
need to put things in order, in

3215
01:47:24,020 --> 01:47:27,020
sequence. There is a timeline of

3216
01:47:27,020 --> 01:47:28,020
this process that I think needs

3217
01:47:28,020 --> 01:47:31,020
to be addressed. I will go

3218
01:47:31,020 --> 01:47:34,020
through it. Please be patient.

3219
01:47:34,020 --> 01:47:35,020
>> There is a 15 minute

3220
01:47:35,020 --> 01:47:36,020
timeline.

3221
01:47:36,020 --> 01:47:37,020
>> It'll be far less than 15

3222
01:47:37,020 --> 01:47:39,020
minutes, that's for sure.

3223
01:47:39,020 --> 01:47:40,020
>> Okay.

3224
01:47:40,020 --> 01:47:43,020
>> I'd like to speak to the road

3225
01:47:43,020 --> 01:47:44,020
that's brought us to this point.

3226
01:47:44,020 --> 01:47:45,020
Pointe-Claire has been buffeted

3227
01:47:45,020 --> 01:47:48,020
by threats to the environment,

3228
01:47:48,020 --> 01:47:49,020
pressures caused by

3229
01:47:49,020 --> 01:47:50,020
identification, and an

3230
01:47:50,020 --> 01:47:51,020
overheated real estate market

3231
01:47:51,020 --> 01:47:53,020
that are opposing themselves in

3232
01:47:53,020 --> 01:47:54,020
almost every aspect of what

3233
01:47:54,020 --> 01:47:57,020
makes our city our community so

3234
01:47:57,020 --> 01:47:59,020
special. There is a completely

3235
01:47:59,020 --> 01:48:00,080
understandable and legitimate

3236
01:48:00,080 --> 01:48:02,080
fear that our city will change

3237
01:48:02,080 --> 01:48:04,080
forever, and those changes will

3238
01:48:04,080 --> 01:48:05,080
ruin what we all love most about

3239
01:48:05,080 --> 01:48:07,080
it. It's the manifest duty of

3240
01:48:07,080 --> 01:48:09,080
Council to understand that very

3241
01:48:09,080 --> 01:48:12,080
real and legitimate fear, and to

3242
01:48:12,080 --> 01:48:13,080
act on it, to respect the

3243
01:48:13,080 --> 01:48:15,080
concerns of our citizens, and to

3244
01:48:15,080 --> 01:48:17,080
address those concerns, and in

3245
01:48:17,080 --> 01:48:19,080
doing so, find a path forward,

3246
01:48:19,080 --> 01:48:21,080
our citizens, our city could

3247
01:48:21,080 --> 01:48:23,080
accept and follow. With that in

3248
01:48:23,080 --> 01:48:25,080
mind, a year ago, Council passed

3249
01:48:25,080 --> 01:48:27,080
the interim control resolution.

3250
01:48:27,080 --> 01:48:29,080
Provincial law allows us this

3251
01:48:29,080 --> 01:48:30,080
measure which creates a

3252
01:48:30,080 --> 01:48:32,080
three-month temporary halt to

3253
01:48:32,080 --> 01:48:33,080
development in a specific area

3254
01:48:33,080 --> 01:48:35,080
of our city, in order to allow

3255
01:48:35,080 --> 01:48:37,080
us the time we need to plan the

3256
01:48:37,080 --> 01:48:40,080
next steps. We took those three

3257
01:48:40,080 --> 01:48:42,080
months to complete a detailed

3258
01:48:42,080 --> 01:48:43,080
path forward that would allow

3259
01:48:43,080 --> 01:48:45,080
for full, public participation,

3260
01:48:45,080 --> 01:48:47,080
and determination of their

3261
01:48:47,080 --> 01:48:49,080
express collective vision of our

3262
01:48:49,080 --> 01:48:50,080
future, and incorporate that

3263
01:48:50,080 --> 01:48:51,080
vision into our planning

3264
01:48:51,080 --> 01:48:55,080
program, and zoning bylaws. That

3265
01:48:55,080 --> 01:48:56,080
plan mapped out a detailed

3266
01:48:56,080 --> 01:48:58,080
two-year process that would end

3267
01:48:58,080 --> 01:49:00,040
with a revised planning program

3268
01:49:00,040 --> 01:49:01,040
and zoning bylaws coming into

3269
01:49:01,040 --> 01:49:05,040
force in the summer of 2024. In

3270
01:49:05,040 --> 01:49:07,040
May of 2022, council passed the

3271
01:49:07,040 --> 01:49:09,040
interim control bylaw to extend

3272
01:49:09,040 --> 01:49:11,040
the temporary hold of

3273
01:49:11,040 --> 01:49:12,040
development so we could

3274
01:49:12,040 --> 01:49:14,040
implement that plan. Last June,

3275
01:49:14,040 --> 01:49:16,040
I sent a letter to mayor Thomas

3276
01:49:16,040 --> 01:49:18,040
expressing my alarm that we were

3277
01:49:18,040 --> 01:49:19,040
not progressing along the

3278
01:49:19,040 --> 01:49:21,040
critical path timeline, the

3279
01:49:21,040 --> 01:49:22,040
planning department had

3280
01:49:22,040 --> 01:49:23,040
presented to us. I told him I

3281
01:49:23,040 --> 01:49:25,040
felt my duty compelled me to

3282
01:49:25,040 --> 01:49:26,040
bring this to his attention, to

3283
01:49:26,040 --> 01:49:28,040
bring to his attention the lack

3284
01:49:28,040 --> 01:49:29,040
of progress being made, to

3285
01:49:29,040 --> 01:49:30,040
follow through on the interim

3286
01:49:30,040 --> 01:49:33,040
control measure is authorized by

3287
01:49:33,040 --> 01:49:35,040
Council five months earlier. The

3288
01:49:35,040 --> 01:49:37,040
groundwork should already have

3289
01:49:37,040 --> 01:49:39,040
been done then four would still

3290
01:49:39,040 --> 01:49:40,040
waited to be done, and in fact,

3291
01:49:40,040 --> 01:49:42,040
for what we are still waiting to

3292
01:49:42,040 --> 01:49:44,040
be done. Like public

3293
01:49:44,040 --> 01:49:46,040
participation. Steady progress

3294
01:49:46,040 --> 01:49:47,040
ought to have been made that

3295
01:49:47,040 --> 01:49:48,040
would lead to the participation

3296
01:49:48,040 --> 01:49:50,040
of the public last fall. That

3297
01:49:50,040 --> 01:49:53,040
was when it was on the original

3298
01:49:53,040 --> 01:49:54,040
schedule. I received no response

3299
01:49:54,040 --> 01:49:57,040
from Mayor Thomas, and so, with

3300
01:49:57,040 --> 01:49:58,040
the five July public meeting of

3301
01:49:58,040 --> 01:50:00,000
Council, I expressed my concerns

3302
01:50:00,000 --> 01:50:01,000
and filed my letter so that all

3303
01:50:01,000 --> 01:50:04,000
would be out in the open. The

3304
01:50:04,000 --> 01:50:05,000
summer yield into the fall,

3305
01:50:05,000 --> 01:50:06,000
which itself has given way to

3306
01:50:06,000 --> 01:50:09,000
the winter of 2023. The act of

3307
01:50:09,000 --> 01:50:11,000
participation of the public and

3308
01:50:11,000 --> 01:50:12,000
open for still remains somewhere

3309
01:50:12,000 --> 01:50:13,000
on the horizon. It keeps

3310
01:50:13,000 --> 01:50:14,000
receding, like a shimmering rock

3311
01:50:14,000 --> 01:50:18,000
in the desert. However, that's

3312
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:20,000
not to say that everything stood

3313
01:50:20,000 --> 01:50:22,000
still. A workshop with Council

3314
01:50:22,000 --> 01:50:23,000
and caucus, organized by the

3315
01:50:23,000 --> 01:50:24,000
planning department was held two

3316
01:50:24,000 --> 01:50:26,000
weeks after the five July public

3317
01:50:26,000 --> 01:50:28,000
meeting. They, are we began to

3318
01:50:28,000 --> 01:50:29,000
discuss the factors affecting

3319
01:50:29,000 --> 01:50:32,000
our city, included in that

3320
01:50:32,000 --> 01:50:33,000
discussion was the birth of the

3321
01:50:33,000 --> 01:50:35,000
idea to work out with Cadillac

3322
01:50:35,000 --> 01:50:37,000
Fairview and eventual

3323
01:50:37,000 --> 01:50:38,000
comprehensive development plan

3324
01:50:38,000 --> 01:50:40,000
for zone Mu1. That led to

3325
01:50:40,000 --> 01:50:43,000
subsequent discussion of the

3326
01:50:43,000 --> 01:50:44,000
means to get their, given to

3327
01:50:44,000 --> 01:50:45,000
fundamental requirements, a, a

3328
01:50:45,000 --> 01:50:47,000
comprehensive development plan

3329
01:50:47,000 --> 01:50:49,000
would have to be entered into

3330
01:50:49,000 --> 01:50:50,000
voluntarily by Cadillac

3331
01:50:50,000 --> 01:50:52,000
Fairview, and to, be, the public

3332
01:50:52,000 --> 01:50:54,000
would have to be intimately

3333
01:50:54,000 --> 01:50:56,000
involved in the process. Off one

3334
01:50:56,000 --> 01:50:58,000
of the planning staff, back came

3335
01:50:58,000 --> 01:51:00,060
the planning staff with another

3336
01:51:00,060 --> 01:51:02,060
idea. They had examined how our

3337
01:51:02,060 --> 01:51:04,060
neighbouring city of Kirkland

3338
01:51:04,060 --> 01:51:05,060
had angled a similar pattern

3339
01:51:05,060 --> 01:51:06,060
with respect to the

3340
01:51:06,060 --> 01:51:08,060
redevelopment of the mark frost

3341
01:51:08,060 --> 01:51:09,060
property right beside the purity

3342
01:51:09,060 --> 01:51:12,060
forest. After a false start that

3343
01:51:12,060 --> 01:51:13,060
it provoked an immediate public

3344
01:51:13,060 --> 01:51:15,060
outcry, they came up with a

3345
01:51:15,060 --> 01:51:17,060
better plan B. The basis of

3346
01:51:17,060 --> 01:51:18,060
their plan B was to establish a

3347
01:51:18,060 --> 01:51:21,060
citizen based task force with

3348
01:51:21,060 --> 01:51:22,060
support from the city's planning

3349
01:51:22,060 --> 01:51:24,060
professionals to work with the

3350
01:51:24,060 --> 01:51:25,060
developer and to bring in the

3351
01:51:25,060 --> 01:51:27,060
larger public and regular

3352
01:51:27,060 --> 01:51:29,060
intervals with the objective of

3353
01:51:29,060 --> 01:51:30,060
establishing a project that

3354
01:51:30,060 --> 01:51:32,060
could develop, and build and

3355
01:51:32,060 --> 01:51:34,060
enjoy broad public support. It

3356
01:51:34,060 --> 01:51:37,060
worked. That is why the planning

3357
01:51:37,060 --> 01:51:39,060
department proposed we base our

3358
01:51:39,060 --> 01:51:42,060
path forward for Mu1 on the

3359
01:51:42,060 --> 01:51:43,060
Kirkland example. In order to

3360
01:51:43,060 --> 01:51:45,060
get their, in order to bring in

3361
01:51:45,060 --> 01:51:47,060
the public via this task force,

3362
01:51:47,060 --> 01:51:49,060
and associate it at open forms,

3363
01:51:49,060 --> 01:51:50,060
we had to reach out to Cadillac

3364
01:51:50,060 --> 01:51:52,060
Fairview. Remember, we need them

3365
01:51:52,060 --> 01:51:54,060
to agree to the terms of a

3366
01:51:54,060 --> 01:51:55,060
comprehensive development plan

3367
01:51:55,060 --> 01:51:58,060
that would specify what would go

3368
01:51:58,060 --> 01:52:01,020
into Mu1 in far more detail than

3369
01:52:01,020 --> 01:52:02,020
penetrating way that is possible

3370
01:52:02,020 --> 01:52:04,020
through zoning or straight

3371
01:52:04,020 --> 01:52:05,020
bylaws. Council and caucus

3372
01:52:05,020 --> 01:52:06,020
approved this approach, and a

3373
01:52:06,020 --> 01:52:08,020
letter was sent to Cadillac

3374
01:52:08,020 --> 01:52:09,020
Fairview with an outlying

3375
01:52:09,020 --> 01:52:11,020
proposal. Cadillac Fairview sent

3376
01:52:11,020 --> 01:52:13,020
a response that was cautiously

3377
01:52:13,020 --> 01:52:15,020
favourable. Details would have

3378
01:52:15,020 --> 01:52:17,020
to be worked out, and they

3379
01:52:17,020 --> 01:52:19,020
stipulated that Mu2 would have

3380
01:52:19,020 --> 01:52:20,020
be brought in the scope of the

3381
01:52:20,020 --> 01:52:23,020
task force approach. Now,

3382
01:52:23,020 --> 01:52:25,020
bringing in Mu2 to this approach

3383
01:52:25,020 --> 01:52:26,020
simply means that, through this,

3384
01:52:26,020 --> 01:52:27,020
the public can now weigh in on

3385
01:52:27,020 --> 01:52:29,020
the future of the Fairview

3386
01:52:29,020 --> 01:52:31,020
forest, which you all want. That

3387
01:52:31,020 --> 01:52:33,020
does not mean a single square

3388
01:52:33,020 --> 01:52:35,020
inch of it will be developed. It

3389
01:52:35,020 --> 01:52:38,020
means the public can weigh in in

3390
01:52:38,020 --> 01:52:40,020
this process. A comprehensive

3391
01:52:40,020 --> 01:52:43,020
development plan for Mu1 and Mu2

3392
01:52:43,020 --> 01:52:44,020
could forever protect the

3393
01:52:44,020 --> 01:52:45,020
Fairview forest as is. That

3394
01:52:45,020 --> 01:52:48,020
would be on the table. Remember,

3395
01:52:48,020 --> 01:52:49,020
agreeing to a process commits no

3396
01:52:49,020 --> 01:52:52,020
one to an outcome, only a good

3397
01:52:52,020 --> 01:52:54,020
faith effort to try. All

3398
01:52:54,020 --> 01:52:56,020
together, public included, to

3399
01:52:56,020 --> 01:52:58,020
find one. Furthermore, if this

3400
01:52:58,020 --> 01:53:00,080
process would lead to a

3401
01:53:00,080 --> 01:53:01,080
successful outcome, the lawsuit

3402
01:53:01,080 --> 01:53:03,080
filed by Cadillac Fairview would

3403
01:53:03,080 --> 01:53:06,080
itself be settled. This has been

3404
01:53:06,080 --> 01:53:08,080
confirmed by our legal counsel.

3405
01:53:08,080 --> 01:53:10,080
Caucus then deliberated on the

3406
01:53:10,080 --> 01:53:12,080
next step. It was decided we

3407
01:53:12,080 --> 01:53:13,080
would authorize the director

3408
01:53:13,080 --> 01:53:15,080
general to offer to speak face

3409
01:53:15,080 --> 01:53:17,080
to face with representatives of

3410
01:53:17,080 --> 01:53:19,080
Cadillac Fairview in order to

3411
01:53:19,080 --> 01:53:20,080
make it abundantly clear to all

3412
01:53:20,080 --> 01:53:21,080
parties, including the general

3413
01:53:21,080 --> 01:53:23,080
public, just what the objective

3414
01:53:23,080 --> 01:53:25,080
and limits to the face to face

3415
01:53:25,080 --> 01:53:27,080
would be, a mandate letter was

3416
01:53:27,080 --> 01:53:29,080
drafted by the director general

3417
01:53:29,080 --> 01:53:30,080
and presented to caucus for

3418
01:53:30,080 --> 01:53:33,080
approval. That letter, and its

3419
01:53:33,080 --> 01:53:34,080
formal approval Mu2, is being

3420
01:53:34,080 --> 01:53:36,080
filed with this resolution.

3421
01:53:36,080 --> 01:53:38,080
Suddenly, just before the

3422
01:53:38,080 --> 01:53:39,080
Christmas break, after we have

3423
01:53:39,080 --> 01:53:41,080
all, staff and caucus,

3424
01:53:41,080 --> 01:53:43,080
participated in good faith, in a

3425
01:53:43,080 --> 01:53:45,080
five month profits to move it

3426
01:53:45,080 --> 01:53:47,080
along, this far, we abruptly

3427
01:53:47,080 --> 01:53:48,080
confronted with an alternative

3428
01:53:48,080 --> 01:53:51,080
strategy to delay, delay, and

3429
01:53:51,080 --> 01:53:53,080
delay indefinitely. On January

3430
01:53:53,080 --> 01:53:55,080
3rd, I wrote an email to the

3431
01:53:55,080 --> 01:53:57,080
mayor that began a thread, which

3432
01:53:57,080 --> 01:53:58,080
I will now file, with the city

3433
01:53:58,080 --> 01:54:03,040
clerk. In that email to the

3434
01:54:03,040 --> 01:54:05,040
mayor, I ask him to call a

3435
01:54:05,040 --> 01:54:06,040
special meeting so Council

3436
01:54:06,040 --> 01:54:07,040
could, with complete openness

3437
01:54:07,040 --> 01:54:09,040
and transparency, commit to a

3438
01:54:09,040 --> 01:54:11,040
process, not an outcome, that

3439
01:54:11,040 --> 01:54:13,040
would finally and delay, and

3440
01:54:13,040 --> 01:54:15,040
lead us towards beginning the

3441
01:54:15,040 --> 01:54:16,040
meaningful participation of the

3442
01:54:16,040 --> 01:54:17,040
public, in determining the

3443
01:54:17,040 --> 01:54:19,040
future of their city by first

3444
01:54:19,040 --> 01:54:21,040
dealing with the most

3445
01:54:21,040 --> 01:54:23,040
consequential sectors, Mu1 and

3446
01:54:23,040 --> 01:54:25,040
Mu2. Once that is determined

3447
01:54:25,040 --> 01:54:27,040
with broad public support, or at

3448
01:54:27,040 --> 01:54:29,040
least is on a firm path in that

3449
01:54:29,040 --> 01:54:31,040
direction, we can then serenely

3450
01:54:31,040 --> 01:54:32,040
deal with all the other areas

3451
01:54:32,040 --> 01:54:34,040
covered by the interim control

3452
01:54:34,040 --> 01:54:36,040
bylaw. Four days later, I

3453
01:54:36,040 --> 01:54:37,040
received the mayor's response,

3454
01:54:37,040 --> 01:54:39,040
which shut the door on both the

3455
01:54:39,040 --> 01:54:40,040
resolution and, shockingly, the

3456
01:54:40,040 --> 01:54:42,040
whole Kirkland task force model

3457
01:54:42,040 --> 01:54:43,040
we've been working on since this

3458
01:54:43,040 --> 01:54:45,040
summer, and the outreach by the

3459
01:54:45,040 --> 01:54:46,040
planning department to get

3460
01:54:46,040 --> 01:54:47,040
elected to that began several

3461
01:54:47,040 --> 01:54:50,040
weeks earlier. Flabbergasted, I

3462
01:54:50,040 --> 01:54:52,040
assumed he did not understand. I

3463
01:54:52,040 --> 01:54:53,040
send a follow-up email, included

3464
01:54:53,040 --> 01:54:55,040
in the thread, where he detailed

3465
01:54:55,040 --> 01:54:56,040
the exact argument for

3466
01:54:56,040 --> 01:54:58,040
proceeding with the mandate

3467
01:54:58,040 --> 01:54:59,040
letter dialogue with Cadillac

3468
01:54:59,040 --> 01:55:01,000
Fairview suggesting we hold a

3469
01:55:01,000 --> 01:55:02,000
special meeting before the

3470
01:55:02,000 --> 01:55:03,000
regular meeting on the 17th of

3471
01:55:03,000 --> 01:55:05,000
this month. I received no

3472
01:55:05,000 --> 01:55:07,000
response. The only conclusion

3473
01:55:07,000 --> 01:55:09,000
that could be drawn is the mayor

3474
01:55:09,000 --> 01:55:10,000
had no intention to follow

3475
01:55:10,000 --> 01:55:12,000
through on what this City staff

3476
01:55:12,000 --> 01:55:14,000
had proposed, his staff, but

3477
01:55:14,000 --> 01:55:15,000
Council and caucus had

3478
01:55:15,000 --> 01:55:16,000
supported, and what the City

3479
01:55:16,000 --> 01:55:17,000
staff had been actively pursuing

3480
01:55:17,000 --> 01:55:20,000
since the summer before. Five

3481
01:55:20,000 --> 01:55:22,000
months of effort was to be

3482
01:55:22,000 --> 01:55:23,000
checked. Following the mayor's

3483
01:55:23,000 --> 01:55:25,000
refusal in caucus to call for a

3484
01:55:25,000 --> 01:55:26,000
special meeting, a letter was

3485
01:55:26,000 --> 01:55:28,000
sent to the city clerk or the

3486
01:55:28,000 --> 01:55:29,000
requisite number of signatures

3487
01:55:29,000 --> 01:55:31,000
to override the Mayor's refusal,

3488
01:55:31,000 --> 01:55:32,000
call for a special meeting to be

3489
01:55:32,000 --> 01:55:34,000
convened on 19th of January,

3490
01:55:34,000 --> 01:55:36,000
tonight. The purpose of the

3491
01:55:36,000 --> 01:55:38,000
meeting is to put a resolution

3492
01:55:38,000 --> 01:55:39,000
before Council that would

3493
01:55:39,000 --> 01:55:41,000
formally and publicly ask the

3494
01:55:41,000 --> 01:55:43,000
director general to offer to

3495
01:55:43,000 --> 01:55:44,000
speak with representatives of

3496
01:55:44,000 --> 01:55:46,000
Cadillac Fairview to explore

3497
01:55:46,000 --> 01:55:47,000
within the limitations of

3498
01:55:47,000 --> 01:55:49,000
authorities in the mandate

3499
01:55:49,000 --> 01:55:51,000
letter, and nonbinding path

3500
01:55:51,000 --> 01:55:52,000
forward that would ultimately

3501
01:55:52,000 --> 01:55:53,000
lead to the full participation

3502
01:55:53,000 --> 01:55:55,000
of the public, which includes

3503
01:55:55,000 --> 01:55:57,000
Cadillac Fairview, and in

3504
01:55:57,000 --> 01:55:58,000
determining the expression of

3505
01:55:58,000 --> 01:56:00,060
the public's collective vision

3506
01:56:00,060 --> 01:56:04,060
of the future for zones Mu1 and

3507
01:56:04,060 --> 01:56:07,060
and Mu2, and integration of that

3508
01:56:07,060 --> 01:56:09,060
vision that the public at large

3509
01:56:09,060 --> 01:56:10,060
and Cadillac Fairview would both

3510
01:56:10,060 --> 01:56:14,060
endorse. That is the aim. So,

3511
01:56:14,060 --> 01:56:16,060
with that all said, I am done

3512
01:56:16,060 --> 01:56:18,060
with my preamble. Without all,

3513
01:56:18,060 --> 01:56:20,060
said the background fully

3514
01:56:20,060 --> 01:56:23,060
explained as best I can, I will

3515
01:56:23,060 --> 01:56:28,060
not proceed with the resolution.

3516
01:56:29,060 --> 01:56:31,060
- Attendu que le règlement de

3517
01:56:31,060 --> 01:56:33,060
contrôle intérimaire a été mis

3518
01:56:33,060 --> 01:56:34,060
en place comme mesures

3519
01:56:34,060 --> 01:56:36,060
tentait... temporaires afin

3520
01:56:36,060 --> 01:56:39,060
de... donner aux conseillers le

3521
01:56:39,060 --> 01:56:41,060
temps nécessaire pour réviser le

3522
01:56:41,060 --> 01:56:46,060
plan d'urbanisme, que les

3523
01:56:47,060 --> 01:56:48,060
conseillers répondent mieux aux

3524
01:56:48,060 --> 01:56:49,060
préoccupations de nos citoyens

3525
01:56:49,060 --> 01:56:51,060
en matière d'environnement,

3526
01:56:51,060 --> 01:56:55,060
d'identification et de

3527
01:56:55,060 --> 01:56:56,060
préservation des éléments

3528
01:56:56,060 --> 01:57:00,020
particuliers de Pointe-Claire.

3529
01:57:00,020 --> 01:57:01,020
Attendu qu'un secteur important

3530
01:57:01,020 --> 01:57:04,020
de notre ville

3531
01:57:04,020 --> 01:57:05,020
(---)

3532
01:57:05,020 --> 01:57:06,020
ce qui exige que la

3533
01:57:06,020 --> 01:57:07,020
planification de son avenir

3534
01:57:07,020 --> 01:57:09,020
soient traités en priorité.

3535
01:57:09,020 --> 01:57:11,020
Attendu l'arrivée imminente du

3536
01:57:11,020 --> 01:57:15,020
service de trains légers REM a

3537
01:57:16,020 --> 01:57:19,020
un impact énorme sur le

3538
01:57:19,020 --> 01:57:20,020
potentiel économique du

3539
01:57:20,020 --> 01:57:24,020
centre-ville, attendu la

3540
01:57:24,020 --> 01:57:26,020
passerelle cyclistes et piétons

3541
01:57:26,020 --> 01:57:27,020
qui traversent l'autoroute 40

3542
01:57:27,020 --> 01:57:30,020
au-dessus du centre-ville a...

3543
01:57:30,020 --> 01:57:35,020
est à un stade avancé, attendu

3544
01:57:36,020 --> 01:57:38,020
que In la English, whereas an

3545
01:57:38,020 --> 01:57:39,020
interim zone Mu2 est control

3546
01:57:39,020 --> 01:57:40,020
bylaw has been un milieu put

3547
01:57:40,020 --> 01:57:41,020
into effect as humide... a

3548
01:57:41,020 --> 01:57:42,020
temporary

3549
01:57:42,020 --> 01:57:43,020
Measure to give Council the time

3550
01:57:43,020 --> 01:57:45,020
necessary to revise our planning

3551
01:57:45,020 --> 01:57:46,020
program bylaws, such that,

3552
01:57:46,020 --> 01:57:48,020
within the context of the

3553
01:57:48,020 --> 01:57:49,020
planning objectives of the

3554
01:57:49,020 --> 01:57:51,020
Montréal metropolitan community,

3555
01:57:51,020 --> 01:57:52,020
it better addresses the concerns

3556
01:57:52,020 --> 01:57:54,020
of our citizens regarding the

3557
01:57:54,020 --> 01:57:56,020
Environment, Mr. Fletcher,

3558
01:57:56,020 --> 01:57:57,020
densification, and preservation

3559
01:57:57,020 --> 01:57:59,020
of those elements that

3560
01:57:59,020 --> 01:58:00,080
contribute to the special

3561
01:58:00,080 --> 01:58:02,080
character of Pointe-Claire.

3562
01:58:02,080 --> 01:58:04,080
Whereas the most significant

3563
01:58:04,080 --> 01:58:06,080
area of our city with respect to

3564
01:58:06,080 --> 01:58:07,080
its continued economic vitality

3565
01:58:07,080 --> 01:58:09,080
is the city center, which

3566
01:58:09,080 --> 01:58:11,080
further requires its planned

3567
01:58:11,080 --> 01:58:13,080
future be addressed as a

3568
01:58:13,080 --> 01:58:14,080
priority, whereas the imminent

3569
01:58:14,080 --> 01:58:16,080
arrival of the REM light rail

3570
01:58:16,080 --> 01:58:18,080
service has enormously impacted

3571
01:58:18,080 --> 01:58:20,080
the economic potential of the

3572
01:58:20,080 --> 01:58:22,080
city center, or as the project

3573
01:58:22,080 --> 01:58:23,080
to construct a pedestrian and

3574
01:58:23,080 --> 01:58:25,080
bicycle overpass crossing

3575
01:58:25,080 --> 01:58:27,080
Highway 40 in the city centre is

3576
01:58:27,080 --> 01:58:28,080
in an advanced state of

3577
01:58:28,080 --> 01:58:30,080
planning, whereas the Québec

3578
01:58:30,080 --> 01:58:32,080
Ministry of the Environment has

3579
01:58:32,080 --> 01:58:33,080
mandated the protection of the

3580
01:58:33,080 --> 01:58:36,080
wetland within Mu2. Je, Brent

3581
01:58:44,080 --> 01:58:49,080
Cowan, district numéro 8,

3582
01:58:49,080 --> 01:58:50,080
propose que madame

3583
01:58:50,080 --> 01:58:51,080
(---)

3584
01:58:51,080 --> 01:58:53,080
rencontrent les participants du

3585
01:58:53,080 --> 01:58:55,080
Cadillac Fairview à huis clos

3586
01:58:55,080 --> 01:58:57,080
afin d'engager les démarches

3587
01:58:57,080 --> 01:59:01,040
acceptables afin d'impliquer les

3588
01:59:01,040 --> 01:59:04,040
membres du public dans un plan

3589
01:59:04,040 --> 01:59:08,040
acceptable pour les zones Mu1 et

3590
01:59:08,040 --> 01:59:11,040
Mu2, qui établira de un, la

3591
01:59:11,040 --> 01:59:13,040
protection des zones humides et

3592
01:59:13,040 --> 01:59:14,040
des mosaïques existantes, de

3593
01:59:14,040 --> 01:59:17,040
deux, les limites d'aménagement

3594
01:59:17,040 --> 01:59:19,040
qui répondront à la vision

3595
01:59:19,040 --> 01:59:20,040
collective exprimée par les

3596
01:59:20,040 --> 01:59:21,040
citoyens de Pointe-Claire, tout

3597
01:59:21,040 --> 01:59:24,040
en tenant compte des intérêts

3598
01:59:24,040 --> 01:59:25,040
commerciaux du Cadillac

3599
01:59:25,040 --> 01:59:26,040
Fairview. Que la lettre de

3600
01:59:26,040 --> 01:59:28,040
mandat du conseiller à la

3601
01:59:28,040 --> 01:59:30,040
Chine... directrice générale qui

3602
01:59:30,040 --> 01:59:31,040
doit fournir les lignes

3603
01:59:31,040 --> 01:59:32,040
directrices pour le dialogue

3604
01:59:32,040 --> 01:59:34,040
souhaité avec les représentants

3605
01:59:34,040 --> 01:59:35,040
du Cadillac Fairview soient

3606
01:59:35,040 --> 01:59:37,040
déposés lors de l'adoption de la

3607
01:59:37,040 --> 01:59:39,040
présente résolution et qu'elle

3608
01:59:39,040 --> 01:59:42,040
en fasse partie intégrante, que

3609
01:59:42,040 --> 01:59:43,040
la directrice générale tiennent

3610
01:59:43,040 --> 01:59:46,040
le conseil au courant de

3611
01:59:46,040 --> 01:59:48,040
l'évolution des discussions et

3612
01:59:48,040 --> 01:59:50,040
que la présente résolution et

3613
01:59:50,040 --> 01:59:52,040
les démarches et les discussions

3614
01:59:52,040 --> 01:59:54,040
qui en découleront s'inscrivent

3615
01:59:54,040 --> 01:59:58,040
dans une volonté de régler le

3616
01:59:59,040 --> 02:00:00,000
litige impliquant la ville et le

3617
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:01,000
Cadillac Fairview. That this

3618
02:00:01,000 --> 02:00:02,000
council, be it

3619
02:00:02,000 --> 02:00:05,000
Resolved, this council requires

3620
02:00:05,000 --> 02:00:07,000
-- desires the city manager to

3621
02:00:07,000 --> 02:00:10,000
meet forth with representatives

3622
02:00:10,000 --> 02:00:11,000
of Cadillac Fairview in-camera,

3623
02:00:11,000 --> 02:00:13,000
in an effort to work out with

3624
02:00:13,000 --> 02:00:15,000
them a mutually agreeable path

3625
02:00:15,000 --> 02:00:17,000
forward that would engage public

3626
02:00:17,000 --> 02:00:18,000
participation in a structured

3627
02:00:18,000 --> 02:00:20,000
process, having as a subject of

3628
02:00:20,000 --> 02:00:22,000
the creation of a comprehensive

3629
02:00:22,000 --> 02:00:24,000
development plan for zones Mu1

3630
02:00:24,000 --> 02:00:27,000
and Mu2 that would establish, A,

3631
02:00:27,000 --> 02:00:28,000
protections of the wetlands and

3632
02:00:28,000 --> 02:00:31,000
existing natural habitat mosaic,

3633
02:00:31,000 --> 02:00:33,000
be, development limitations and

3634
02:00:33,000 --> 02:00:35,000
possibilities that will satisfy

3635
02:00:35,000 --> 02:00:36,000
the express collective issue of

3636
02:00:36,000 --> 02:00:38,000
the citizens of Pointe-Claire

3637
02:00:38,000 --> 02:00:40,000
well concurrently addressing the

3638
02:00:40,000 --> 02:00:41,000
commercial interests of Cadillac

3639
02:00:41,000 --> 02:00:43,000
Fairview, and the mandate letter

3640
02:00:43,000 --> 02:00:44,000
to the city manager from Council

3641
02:00:44,000 --> 02:00:46,000
that is to provide guidelines

3642
02:00:46,000 --> 02:00:47,000
with a desired ballot with

3643
02:00:47,000 --> 02:00:49,000
officials from Cadillac Fairview

3644
02:00:49,000 --> 02:00:51,000
be filed with passage of this

3645
02:00:51,000 --> 02:00:53,000
resolution, and be integral to

3646
02:00:53,000 --> 02:00:54,000
this resolution, and the city

3647
02:00:54,000 --> 02:00:57,000
manager will update Council as a

3648
02:00:57,000 --> 02:00:59,000
dialogue advances, and that this

3649
02:00:59,000 --> 02:01:01,060
resolution and the steps and

3650
02:01:01,060 --> 02:01:02,060
discussions that will result

3651
02:01:02,060 --> 02:01:04,060
from it may aid in a furtherance

3652
02:01:04,060 --> 02:01:05,060
of a possible settlement of

3653
02:01:05,060 --> 02:01:07,060
litigation between the city and

3654
02:01:07,060 --> 02:01:12,060
Cadillac Fairview. I so move.

3655
02:01:12,060 --> 02:01:16,060
>> Okay. Councillor Tara

3656
02:01:16,060 --> 02:01:17,060
Stainforth?

3657
02:01:17,060 --> 02:01:18,060
- -- we need ça prend... oui. A

3658
02:01:18,060 --> 02:01:20,060
seconder.

3659
02:01:20,060 --> 02:01:22,060
>> Now, actually, I wrap

3660
02:01:22,060 --> 02:01:24,060
something as well, but it seems

3661
02:01:24,060 --> 02:01:26,060
Brent has covered all the

3662
02:01:26,060 --> 02:01:27,060
topics, which is why I don't

3663
02:01:27,060 --> 02:01:30,060
want to repeat. It's clear he

3664
02:01:30,060 --> 02:01:31,060
hit all the buttons, and

3665
02:01:31,060 --> 02:01:33,060
especially the need for a

3666
02:01:33,060 --> 02:01:35,060
resolution, because a resolution

3667
02:01:35,060 --> 02:01:37,060
is binding, and basically

3668
02:01:37,060 --> 02:01:39,060
mandates our administration to

3669
02:01:39,060 --> 02:01:40,060
follow forward with the request

3670
02:01:40,060 --> 02:01:42,060
of Council, majority of Council.

3671
02:01:42,060 --> 02:01:43,060
With that, I second the motion.

3672
02:01:43,060 --> 02:01:47,060
>> Okay.

3673
02:01:48,060 --> 02:01:52,060
>> Councillor Cynthia Homan?

3674
02:01:52,060 --> 02:01:53,060
Now, we're not voting. Did you

3675
02:01:53,060 --> 02:01:55,060
want to speak to it? Not yet,

3676
02:01:55,060 --> 02:01:58,060
we're going to speak to it.

3677
02:01:58,060 --> 02:02:01,020
Would you like to speak?

3678
02:02:01,020 --> 02:02:04,020
>> I think Councillor Cowan and

3679
02:02:04,020 --> 02:02:05,020
Councillor Stork has said

3680
02:02:05,020 --> 02:02:07,020
everything, I'm aware of

3681
02:02:07,020 --> 02:02:08,020
everything in the letter, and

3682
02:02:08,020 --> 02:02:10,020
everything is there, so, I'm

3683
02:02:10,020 --> 02:02:11,020
happy with that, nothing else to

3684
02:02:11,020 --> 02:02:12,020
say.

3685
02:02:12,020 --> 02:02:13,020
>> Thank you. Councillor

3686
02:02:13,020 --> 02:02:15,020
Stainforth?

3687
02:02:15,020 --> 02:02:16,020
>> I won't speak for long

3688
02:02:16,020 --> 02:02:18,020
because I believe Councillor

3689
02:02:18,020 --> 02:02:20,020
Cowan has really crossed all the

3690
02:02:20,020 --> 02:02:23,020
t's and dot it all the ice,

3691
02:02:23,020 --> 02:02:26,020
except just to reiterate the

3692
02:02:26,020 --> 02:02:28,020
fact that, yes, this resolution

3693
02:02:28,020 --> 02:02:30,020
is binding, so it means our

3694
02:02:30,020 --> 02:02:32,020
director general must now take

3695
02:02:32,020 --> 02:02:35,020
this step. It also means the

3696
02:02:35,020 --> 02:02:36,020
letter that was not going to be

3697
02:02:36,020 --> 02:02:37,020
public will now be public, so

3698
02:02:37,020 --> 02:02:40,020
I'm happy about that. The public

3699
02:02:40,020 --> 02:02:42,020
now knows exactly what we've

3700
02:02:42,020 --> 02:02:45,020
been discussing as a Council for

3701
02:02:45,020 --> 02:02:47,020
the last five months, and how

3702
02:02:47,020 --> 02:02:48,020
things are going to move

3703
02:02:48,020 --> 02:02:50,020
forward.

3704
02:02:50,020 --> 02:02:51,020
>> Councillor Kelly

3705
02:02:51,020 --> 02:02:54,020
Thorstad-Cullen.

3706
02:02:54,020 --> 02:02:56,020
>> No further comments, much has

3707
02:02:56,020 --> 02:02:57,020
been said this evening, thank

3708
02:02:57,020 --> 02:02:58,020
you.

3709
02:02:58,020 --> 02:03:03,080
>> Councillor Tremblay?

3710
02:03:03,080 --> 02:03:04,080
- Oui, merci, Monsieur le Maire,

3711
02:03:04,080 --> 02:03:06,080
j'ai des commentaires à faire.

3712
02:03:06,080 --> 02:03:08,080
Premièrement, partout au pays,

3713
02:03:08,080 --> 02:03:10,080
les villes donne aux citoyens

3714
02:03:10,080 --> 02:03:12,080
les moyens de s'exprimer dans la

3715
02:03:12,080 --> 02:03:14,080
façon dont les projets sont

3716
02:03:14,080 --> 02:03:16,080
faites, c'est ce qui se passe

3717
02:03:16,080 --> 02:03:18,080
dans notre propre cour, Dorval,

3718
02:03:18,080 --> 02:03:20,080
Lachine... l'objectif de la

3719
02:03:20,080 --> 02:03:21,080
démocratie participative est de

3720
02:03:21,080 --> 02:03:23,080
faire en sorte que tout le monde

3721
02:03:23,080 --> 02:03:25,080
a son mot à dire, les résidents,

3722
02:03:25,080 --> 02:03:26,080
les experts, et les

3723
02:03:26,080 --> 02:03:27,080
administrateurs de la ville et,

3724
02:03:27,080 --> 02:03:30,080
oui, les promoteurs. La

3725
02:03:30,080 --> 02:03:31,080
résolution actuelle ne respecte

3726
02:03:31,080 --> 02:03:32,080
pas cette idée, d'après moi,

3727
02:03:32,080 --> 02:03:35,080
elle est faite à l'ancienne.

3728
02:03:35,080 --> 02:03:36,080
Elle donne à un tiers parti,

3729
02:03:36,080 --> 02:03:39,080
dans ce cas, si Cadillac

3730
02:03:39,080 --> 02:03:41,080
Fairview, la possibilité de

3731
02:03:41,080 --> 02:03:42,080
s'intégrer d'une manière ou

3732
02:03:42,080 --> 02:03:45,080
d'une autre pour se donner une

3733
02:03:45,080 --> 02:03:47,080
place à la table sur la façon

3734
02:03:47,080 --> 02:03:50,080
dont nous aller organiser notre

3735
02:03:50,080 --> 02:03:52,080
partie... processus de

3736
02:03:52,080 --> 02:03:54,080
participation publique et de ce

3737
02:03:54,080 --> 02:03:55,080
que devraient être les

3738
02:03:55,080 --> 02:03:57,080
règlements au préalable. La

3739
02:03:57,080 --> 02:03:58,080
résolution proposée ce soir par

3740
02:03:58,080 --> 02:04:00,040
les autres membres du conseil

3741
02:04:00,040 --> 02:04:02,040
n'est tout simplement pas

3742
02:04:02,040 --> 02:04:04,040
acceptable.... Je ne reviendrai

3743
02:04:04,040 --> 02:04:06,040
pas sur mon engagement et mon

3744
02:04:06,040 --> 02:04:07,040
respect pour les citoyens de

3745
02:04:07,040 --> 02:04:10,040
cette ville en acceptant cette

3746
02:04:10,040 --> 02:04:12,040
résolution, ils devront veiller

3747
02:04:12,040 --> 02:04:14,040
à ce que les résidents

3748
02:04:14,040 --> 02:04:16,040
directement concernés par le

3749
02:04:16,040 --> 02:04:17,040
projet de développement aient

3750
02:04:17,040 --> 02:04:20,040
une chance d'égale à égale de

3751
02:04:20,040 --> 02:04:22,040
s'inclure sans condition ou dans

3752
02:04:22,040 --> 02:04:23,040
des discussions préalables.

3753
02:04:23,040 --> 02:04:24,040
Néanmoins... nationwide, cities

3754
02:04:24,040 --> 02:04:25,040
are giving

3755
02:04:25,040 --> 02:04:27,040
Citizens a real voice on how

3756
02:04:27,040 --> 02:04:28,040
developments are being planned.

3757
02:04:28,040 --> 02:04:30,040
It's being done in our backyard,

3758
02:04:30,040 --> 02:04:31,040
Dorval, Kirkland, St. ends,

3759
02:04:31,040 --> 02:04:35,040
machine, et cetera. Very aim of

3760
02:04:35,040 --> 02:04:38,040
participatory urban planning,

3761
02:04:38,040 --> 02:04:39,040
public participation, to ensure

3762
02:04:39,040 --> 02:04:42,040
everyone has an equal chance to

3763
02:04:42,040 --> 02:04:44,040
express a viewpoint on a

3764
02:04:44,040 --> 02:04:46,040
transformation of a space, the

3765
02:04:46,040 --> 02:04:47,040
residents who live in the area,

3766
02:04:47,040 --> 02:04:49,040
experts, city administrators,

3767
02:04:49,040 --> 02:04:51,040
and yes, developers. The current

3768
02:04:51,040 --> 02:04:52,040
resolution does not respect this

3769
02:04:52,040 --> 02:04:54,040
idea, in my opinion. It does it

3770
02:04:54,040 --> 02:04:57,040
the old-fashioned way. That

3771
02:04:57,040 --> 02:04:58,040
gives a third-party, Cadillac

3772
02:04:58,040 --> 02:04:59,040
Fairview, in this case,

3773
02:04:59,040 --> 02:05:01,000
potentially, possibly, maybe,

3774
02:05:01,000 --> 02:05:03,000
we've heard a few, slightly

3775
02:05:03,000 --> 02:05:04,000
contradicting angles as to how

3776
02:05:04,000 --> 02:05:05,000
this might happen tonight, a

3777
02:05:05,000 --> 02:05:07,000
seat at the table on how we are

3778
02:05:07,000 --> 02:05:10,000
going to organize our public

3779
02:05:10,000 --> 02:05:11,000
criticism -- and what the rule

3780
02:05:11,000 --> 02:05:13,000
should be beforehand. The

3781
02:05:13,000 --> 02:05:14,000
concerns, I will pause here to

3782
02:05:14,000 --> 02:05:16,000
address the concerns that Mrs.

3783
02:05:16,000 --> 02:05:17,000
Matthews had at the beginning,

3784
02:05:17,000 --> 02:05:20,000
or during the question period.

3785
02:05:20,000 --> 02:05:22,000
You pretty much expressed the

3786
02:05:22,000 --> 02:05:23,000
concerns that I have, that once

3787
02:05:23,000 --> 02:05:25,000
you have begun these

3788
02:05:25,000 --> 02:05:28,000
conversations, and you are

3789
02:05:28,000 --> 02:05:29,000
involved in a process, you are

3790
02:05:29,000 --> 02:05:31,000
going to take the entire thing

3791
02:05:31,000 --> 02:05:33,000
into a direction that is

3792
02:05:33,000 --> 02:05:35,000
somewhat unpredictable. I would

3793
02:05:35,000 --> 02:05:37,000
prefer we give ourselves the

3794
02:05:37,000 --> 02:05:38,000
time necessary, as difficult as

3795
02:05:38,000 --> 02:05:40,000
it may have been, Councillor

3796
02:05:40,000 --> 02:05:42,000
Cowan, and I agree, in terms of

3797
02:05:42,000 --> 02:05:45,000
the speed, I think we need to

3798
02:05:45,000 --> 02:05:47,000
give ourselves more time in that

3799
02:05:47,000 --> 02:05:48,000
regard, and to work hard at

3800
02:05:48,000 --> 02:05:52,000
this. Many of the citizens in

3801
02:05:52,000 --> 02:05:54,000
the room have question with

3802
02:05:54,000 --> 02:05:56,000
regards to the resolution. I

3803
02:05:56,000 --> 02:05:57,000
don't think it necessarily takes

3804
02:05:57,000 --> 02:05:59,000
us to where you want to take, us

3805
02:05:59,000 --> 02:06:00,060
and it's understandable what you

3806
02:06:00,060 --> 02:06:02,060
want to do. I don't think the

3807
02:06:02,060 --> 02:06:03,060
resolution, as it's written

3808
02:06:03,060 --> 02:06:04,060
today, is going to help us at

3809
02:06:04,060 --> 02:06:06,060
all in the process. For that

3810
02:06:06,060 --> 02:06:07,060
reason, I'm going to be voting

3811
02:06:07,060 --> 02:06:10,060
against it.

3812
02:06:10,060 --> 02:06:12,060
>> Thank you.

3813
02:06:12,060 --> 02:06:13,060
>> Councillor Bissonnette?

3814
02:06:13,060 --> 02:06:17,060
>> Yeah, thank you. I will be a

3815
02:06:17,060 --> 02:06:19,060
lot shorter. I want to address

3816
02:06:19,060 --> 02:06:21,060
the question of the resolution

3817
02:06:21,060 --> 02:06:23,060
not be necessary. It is

3818
02:06:23,060 --> 02:06:24,060
necessary, and that's why we did

3819
02:06:24,060 --> 02:06:28,060
it. The summer, the Québec

3820
02:06:28,060 --> 02:06:29,060
government presented, for the

3821
02:06:29,060 --> 02:06:32,060
first time, there puts ignition

3822
02:06:32,060 --> 02:06:33,060
out the less that's two --

3823
02:06:33,060 --> 02:06:34,060
Politique nationale de

3824
02:06:34,060 --> 02:06:35,060
l'development today architecture

3825
02:06:35,060 --> 02:06:36,060
et du is very territoire.

3826
02:06:36,060 --> 02:06:38,060
Different than it was 30 years

3827
02:06:38,060 --> 02:06:43,060
ago. Today, basically, what is

3828
02:06:43,060 --> 02:06:45,060
being sought is a neighbourhood,

3829
02:06:45,060 --> 02:06:46,060
to develop a neighbourhood

3830
02:06:46,060 --> 02:06:49,060
environment, minimize your

3831
02:06:49,060 --> 02:06:51,060
movement, and mice having to go

3832
02:06:51,060 --> 02:06:55,060
use a car, and in this national

3833
02:06:55,060 --> 02:06:56,060
policy, they have four main

3834
02:06:56,060 --> 02:07:01,020
themes. Les milieux de vie de

3835
02:07:01,020 --> 02:07:02,020
qualité qui répondent aux

3836
02:07:02,020 --> 02:07:04,020
besoins de la population, un

3837
02:07:04,020 --> 02:07:06,020
aménagement qui préservent et

3838
02:07:06,020 --> 02:07:07,020
met en valeur les milieux

3839
02:07:07,020 --> 02:07:09,020
naturels et les territoires

3840
02:07:09,020 --> 02:07:11,020
agricoles, une communauté

3841
02:07:11,020 --> 02:07:12,020
authentique et dynamique partout

3842
02:07:12,020 --> 02:07:14,020
au Québec et un plus grand souci

3843
02:07:14,020 --> 02:07:17,020
du territoire et de

3844
02:07:17,020 --> 02:07:18,020
l'architecture.

3845
02:07:18,020 --> 02:07:19,020
I won't go into everything, but

3846
02:07:19,020 --> 02:07:20,020
I will read out the topics

3847
02:07:20,020 --> 02:07:22,020
included. These are things that,

3848
02:07:22,020 --> 02:07:23,020
when you are preparing your

3849
02:07:23,020 --> 02:07:25,020
plan, and our planning

3850
02:07:25,020 --> 02:07:27,020
department, who is very

3851
02:07:27,020 --> 02:07:31,020
knowledgeable, is looking into

3852
02:07:31,020 --> 02:07:32,020
incorporating some of these

3853
02:07:32,020 --> 02:07:34,020
things into the new development,

3854
02:07:34,020 --> 02:07:35,020
it's not just building a

3855
02:07:35,020 --> 02:07:38,020
building, and, like it was, like

3856
02:07:38,020 --> 02:07:39,020
I said, so many years ago.

3857
02:07:39,020 --> 02:07:42,020
Number one, Concevoir des

3858
02:07:42,020 --> 02:07:44,020
milieux de vie complet à

3859
02:07:44,020 --> 02:07:45,020
l'échelle humaine qui réponde

3860
02:07:45,020 --> 02:07:49,020
aux besoins des communautés.

3861
02:07:49,020 --> 02:07:50,020
Réduire les durée de

3862
02:07:50,020 --> 02:07:51,020
déplacements et les distances

3863
02:07:51,020 --> 02:07:53,020
entre les lieux de résidences,

3864
02:07:53,020 --> 02:07:55,020
de travail, de consommation et

3865
02:07:55,020 --> 02:07:57,020
d'autres types d'activités.

3866
02:07:57,020 --> 02:07:59,020
Accroître l'offre de logements

3867
02:07:59,020 --> 02:08:00,080
de qualité accessibles et

3868
02:08:00,080 --> 02:08:02,080
abordables répondant à une

3869
02:08:02,080 --> 02:08:04,080
diversité de besoins. Adopter

3870
02:08:04,080 --> 02:08:06,080
des formes d'aménagement qui

3871
02:08:06,080 --> 02:08:07,080
permettent de combler la perte

3872
02:08:07,080 --> 02:08:09,080
de milieux naturels et de

3873
02:08:09,080 --> 02:08:11,080
territoire agricole. Orienter la

3874
02:08:11,080 --> 02:08:12,080
croissance urbaine vers des

3875
02:08:12,080 --> 02:08:14,080
milieux déjà dotées

3876
02:08:14,080 --> 02:08:15,080
d'infrastructures, de services

3877
02:08:15,080 --> 02:08:16,080
publics situé au coeur de nos

3878
02:08:16,080 --> 02:08:19,080
villages et de nos villes,

3879
02:08:19,080 --> 02:08:20,080
limitant ainsi l'étalement

3880
02:08:20,080 --> 02:08:22,080
urbain. Planifiez des

3881
02:08:22,080 --> 02:08:23,080
territoires capables de mieux

3882
02:08:23,080 --> 02:08:25,080
s'adapter aux conséquences des

3883
02:08:25,080 --> 02:08:29,080
changements climatiques, visant

3884
02:08:29,080 --> 02:08:30,080
la préservation des milieux

3885
02:08:30,080 --> 02:08:32,080
naturels et de la biodiversité

3886
02:08:32,080 --> 02:08:33,080
ainsi que l'affirmation des

3887
02:08:33,080 --> 02:08:34,080
communautés résilientes,

3888
02:08:34,080 --> 02:08:38,080
notamment par des pratiques

3889
02:08:39,080 --> 02:08:43,080
architecturale durables, et

3890
02:08:43,080 --> 02:08:44,080
concerter toutes les parties

3891
02:08:44,080 --> 02:08:46,080
afin d'assurer une cohabitation

3892
02:08:46,080 --> 02:08:48,080
harmonieuse, des activités et la

3893
02:08:48,080 --> 02:08:49,080
mise These are some en valeur

3894
02:08:49,080 --> 02:08:51,080
des actifs. Of the concepts that

3895
02:08:51,080 --> 02:08:53,080
we have to incorporate in any

3896
02:08:53,080 --> 02:08:57,080
future development. As we know,

3897
02:08:57,080 --> 02:08:58,080
Cadillac Fairview already had

3898
02:08:58,080 --> 02:09:01,040
some ideas on what they wanted

3899
02:09:01,040 --> 02:09:05,040
to do with, certainly, Mu1. At

3900
02:09:05,040 --> 02:09:07,040
our last internal control

3901
02:09:07,040 --> 02:09:10,040
meeting on December 16th, it was

3902
02:09:10,040 --> 02:09:11,040
attended by all of Council, as

3903
02:09:11,040 --> 02:09:14,040
well as members of the

3904
02:09:14,040 --> 02:09:15,040
administration, city managers,

3905
02:09:15,040 --> 02:09:17,040
the city clerk, and the

3906
02:09:17,040 --> 02:09:18,040
assistant director of urban

3907
02:09:18,040 --> 02:09:20,040
planning. The consensus from

3908
02:09:20,040 --> 02:09:22,040
Council was to have the

3909
02:09:22,040 --> 02:09:26,040
Pointe-Claire city manager meet

3910
02:09:26,040 --> 02:09:28,040
forth with representatives of

3911
02:09:28,040 --> 02:09:30,040
Cadillac Fairview for the

3912
02:09:30,040 --> 02:09:32,040
purpose of working out this

3913
02:09:32,040 --> 02:09:34,040
agreement. The objective is, we

3914
02:09:34,040 --> 02:09:35,040
have certain requirements, and

3915
02:09:35,040 --> 02:09:37,040
we had to make sure, when you

3916
02:09:37,040 --> 02:09:39,040
start off, right now, we have

3917
02:09:39,040 --> 02:09:40,040
nothing to consult. We're going

3918
02:09:40,040 --> 02:09:41,040
to consult a black sheet of

3919
02:09:41,040 --> 02:09:43,040
paper. We have certain

3920
02:09:43,040 --> 02:09:45,040
requirements, Cadillac Fairview

3921
02:09:45,040 --> 02:09:46,040
has their plans, their

3922
02:09:46,040 --> 02:09:48,040
requirements. The idea of the

3923
02:09:48,040 --> 02:09:50,040
meeting, and that's, why because

3924
02:09:50,040 --> 02:09:51,040
the mayor did not agree with

3925
02:09:51,040 --> 02:09:53,040
having that meeting, therefore

3926
02:09:53,040 --> 02:09:55,040
this is why we asked for a

3927
02:09:55,040 --> 02:09:58,040
resolution, to have the meeting.

3928
02:09:58,040 --> 02:10:00,000
The thing is, to meet with

3929
02:10:00,000 --> 02:10:01,000
Fairview, and say, listen, this

3930
02:10:01,000 --> 02:10:03,000
is where we're going, if they

3931
02:10:03,000 --> 02:10:05,000
are in right field, and we're in

3932
02:10:05,000 --> 02:10:06,000
left field, it's not going to

3933
02:10:06,000 --> 02:10:10,000
work. If there's no cooperation,

3934
02:10:10,000 --> 02:10:12,000
will move on. We have other

3935
02:10:12,000 --> 02:10:13,000
activities. The thing is, you

3936
02:10:13,000 --> 02:10:16,000
have to sit down with people who

3937
02:10:16,000 --> 02:10:18,000
are there now and do you have

3938
02:10:18,000 --> 02:10:21,000
plans to see at what level you

3939
02:10:21,000 --> 02:10:23,000
come together. That's why the

3940
02:10:23,000 --> 02:10:25,000
resolution was necessary tonight

3941
02:10:25,000 --> 02:10:28,000
in getting back to the very

3942
02:10:28,000 --> 02:10:30,000
basic gist of this meeting

3943
02:10:30,000 --> 02:10:31,000
tonight. A lot of stuff was

3944
02:10:31,000 --> 02:10:32,000
debated that should have been

3945
02:10:32,000 --> 02:10:34,000
done in public consultation. It

3946
02:10:34,000 --> 02:10:35,000
shouldn't have been done

3947
02:10:35,000 --> 02:10:37,000
tonight. The consultation

3948
02:10:37,000 --> 02:10:40,000
tonight was to have, to mandate

3949
02:10:40,000 --> 02:10:42,000
the city manager to meet, set up

3950
02:10:42,000 --> 02:10:43,000
a meeting with Cadillac

3951
02:10:43,000 --> 02:10:45,000
Fairview, and discuss to see,

3952
02:10:45,000 --> 02:10:47,000
this is what we want, what are

3953
02:10:47,000 --> 02:10:48,000
you doing, what are you going to

3954
02:10:48,000 --> 02:10:49,000
do? Are we on the same

3955
02:10:49,000 --> 02:10:50,000
wavelength? Where are we? That's

3956
02:10:50,000 --> 02:10:54,000
my point. Thank you.

3957
02:10:54,000 --> 02:10:56,000
>> Okay. Early voting at the

3958
02:10:56,000 --> 02:11:00,060
same time, Madam Thibault?

3959
02:11:00,060 --> 02:11:01,060
>> If that debate is over, I

3960
02:11:01,060 --> 02:11:03,060
will proceed with the vote.

3961
02:11:03,060 --> 02:11:05,060
>> Could be vote before, and

3962
02:11:05,060 --> 02:11:06,060
I'll speak after?

3963
02:11:06,060 --> 02:11:09,060
>> You should speak now before

3964
02:11:09,060 --> 02:11:10,060
the vote.

3965
02:11:10,060 --> 02:11:15,060
>> All right, fair enough.

3966
02:11:15,060 --> 02:11:16,060
- Depuis que j'ai été élu maire,

3967
02:11:16,060 --> 02:11:17,060
j'ai toujours défendu le

3968
02:11:17,060 --> 02:11:19,060
principe que les citoyens

3969
02:11:19,060 --> 02:11:20,060
devraient être consultés sur

3970
02:11:20,060 --> 02:11:24,060
notre plan d'urbanisme avant que

3971
02:11:25,060 --> 02:11:27,060
nous négocions avec les

3972
02:11:27,060 --> 02:11:30,060
promoteurs. Il ne faut pas leur

3973
02:11:30,060 --> 02:11:31,060
présenter des affaires conclus

3974
02:11:31,060 --> 02:11:33,060
et leur dire qu'il est trop tard

3975
02:11:33,060 --> 02:11:36,060
pour faire des changements. Cela

3976
02:11:36,060 --> 02:11:37,060
est particulièrement important

3977
02:11:37,060 --> 02:11:42,060
pour les zones Mu1 et Mu2, la

3978
02:11:42,060 --> 02:11:44,060
forêt devrait Viau et le

3979
02:11:44,060 --> 02:11:45,060
stationnement sur lequel

3980
02:11:45,060 --> 02:11:46,060
Cadillac Fairview propose de

3981
02:11:46,060 --> 02:11:48,060
construire le plus grand projet

3982
02:11:48,060 --> 02:11:52,060
résidentiel de notre histoire.

3983
02:11:52,060 --> 02:11:53,060
Et qui couperait peut-être une

3984
02:11:53,060 --> 02:11:55,060
partie de la forêt et

3985
02:11:55,060 --> 02:11:56,060
construirait des tours

3986
02:11:56,060 --> 02:11:58,060
d'appartements de luxe de 25

3987
02:11:58,060 --> 02:12:00,020
étages dans une zone où les

3988
02:12:00,020 --> 02:12:03,020
cibles de densité de la

3989
02:12:03,020 --> 02:12:04,020
communauté métropolitaine de

3990
02:12:04,020 --> 02:12:06,020
Montréal serait satisfait avec

3991
02:12:06,020 --> 02:12:08,020
des bâtiments pas beaucoup plus

3992
02:12:08,020 --> 02:12:09,020
grand que les complexités

3993
02:12:09,020 --> 02:12:11,020
appartements de trois étages en

3994
02:12:11,020 --> 02:12:13,020
face de notre hôtel de ville.

3995
02:12:13,020 --> 02:12:16,020
L'année dernière, la majorité du

3996
02:12:16,020 --> 02:12:19,020
conseil a tenté de faire adopter

3997
02:12:19,020 --> 02:12:22,020
une motion visant à soustraire

3998
02:12:22,020 --> 02:12:24,020
Cadillac Fairview au règlement

3999
02:12:24,020 --> 02:12:26,020
de contrôle intérimaire et au

4000
02:12:26,020 --> 02:12:28,020
processus de consultation

4001
02:12:28,020 --> 02:12:31,020
publique afin de permettre à son

4002
02:12:31,020 --> 02:12:34,020
projet d'aller de l'avant.

4003
02:12:34,020 --> 02:12:38,020
Malgré mon objection, les

4004
02:12:38,020 --> 02:12:43,020
conseillers

4005
02:12:44,020 --> 02:12:45,020
Tara Stainforth, eux Eric Stork,

4006
02:12:45,020 --> 02:12:47,020
Brent Cowan et Cynthia Homan,

4007
02:12:47,020 --> 02:12:48,020
ont signé un document annulant

4008
02:12:48,020 --> 02:12:50,020
ma décision et forçant la tenue

4009
02:12:50,020 --> 02:12:52,020
d'une réunion spéciale pour

4010
02:12:52,020 --> 02:12:54,020
approuver leur nouvelle

4011
02:12:54,020 --> 02:12:56,020
résolution mandatant notre

4012
02:12:56,020 --> 02:12:59,020
directrice municipale a entamé

4013
02:12:59,020 --> 02:13:01,080
des négociations avec Cadillac

4014
02:13:01,080 --> 02:13:03,080
Fairview sur le plan

4015
02:13:03,080 --> 02:13:05,080
d'aménagement d'ensemble. Je me

4016
02:13:05,080 --> 02:13:08,080
pose à leur résolution ce soir

4017
02:13:08,080 --> 02:13:10,080
pour les mêmes raisons pour

4018
02:13:10,080 --> 02:13:11,080
lesquelles je me suis opposé à

4019
02:13:11,080 --> 02:13:12,080
leurs tentatives l'année

4020
02:13:12,080 --> 02:13:14,080
dernière. On Cadillac Fairview

4021
02:13:14,080 --> 02:13:17,080
ne devrait pas bénéficier d'un

4022
02:13:17,080 --> 02:13:19,080
traitement spécial et les

4023
02:13:19,080 --> 02:13:20,080
citoyens devraient être

4024
02:13:20,080 --> 02:13:23,080
consultés en premier. Je

4025
02:13:23,080 --> 02:13:24,080
m'oppose également à leur

4026
02:13:24,080 --> 02:13:26,080
décision de faire voter cette

4027
02:13:26,080 --> 02:13:29,080
résolution lors d'une réunion

4028
02:13:29,080 --> 02:13:31,080
spéciale provoquer à la dernière

4029
02:13:31,080 --> 02:13:32,080
minute au début du mois de

4030
02:13:32,080 --> 02:13:35,080
janvier, un moment où le nombre

4031
02:13:35,080 --> 02:13:38,080
de citoyens rentrant tout juste

4032
02:13:38,080 --> 02:13:42,080
de vacances ont moins de temps

4033
02:13:42,080 --> 02:13:43,080
pour comprendre l'initiative

4034
02:13:43,080 --> 02:13:47,080
elle-même et les implications de

4035
02:13:47,080 --> 02:13:48,080
ces applications. Je ne peux

4036
02:13:48,080 --> 02:13:52,080
m'empêcher de penser que cette

4037
02:13:52,080 --> 02:13:53,080
initiative reçoive moins

4038
02:13:53,080 --> 02:13:54,080
d'attention de la part du public

4039
02:13:54,080 --> 02:13:56,080
et des médias en raison de la

4040
02:13:56,080 --> 02:14:01,040
démission de la conseillère Erin

4041
02:14:03,040 --> 02:14:04,040
Tedford la semaine dernière.

4042
02:14:04,040 --> 02:14:05,040
Enfin, ce processus est

4043
02:14:05,040 --> 02:14:07,040
précipité et donne la prétention

4044
02:14:07,040 --> 02:14:09,040
qu'il s'agit d'une tentative de

4045
02:14:09,040 --> 02:14:13,040
faire participer le public. Les

4046
02:14:13,040 --> 02:14:14,040
conseillers Tara Stainforth et

4047
02:14:14,040 --> 02:14:16,040
Eric Stork ont affirmé aux

4048
02:14:16,040 --> 02:14:18,040
citoyens qu'ils aient suivre sur

4049
02:14:18,040 --> 02:14:19,040
leurs médias sociaux, mais ont

4050
02:14:19,040 --> 02:14:23,040
donné à leurs citoyens un

4051
02:14:23,040 --> 02:14:25,040
préavis de moins de 48 heures.

4052
02:14:25,040 --> 02:14:28,040
Pour ces raisons, j'utiliserai

4053
02:14:28,040 --> 02:14:30,040
mon veto suspensif pour empêcher

4054
02:14:30,040 --> 02:14:32,040
l'adoption de cette résolution

4055
02:14:32,040 --> 02:14:35,040
ce soir et la forcer à être

4056
02:14:35,040 --> 02:14:37,040
considéré à nouveau lors de

4057
02:14:37,040 --> 02:14:38,040
notre prochaine réunion du

4058
02:14:38,040 --> 02:14:40,040
conseil. Le résultat sera

4059
02:14:40,040 --> 02:14:41,040
peut-être le même, mais au

4060
02:14:41,040 --> 02:14:43,040
moins, le citoyen aura plus de

4061
02:14:43,040 --> 02:14:46,040
temps pour s'organiser et faire

4062
02:14:46,040 --> 02:14:49,040
entendre sa voix. Since I was

4063
02:14:49,040 --> 02:14:50,040
elected Mayor, I have always

4064
02:14:50,040 --> 02:14:52,040
stood up for the principle that

4065
02:14:52,040 --> 02:14:54,040
citizens should be consulted on

4066
02:14:54,040 --> 02:14:57,040
our urban plan before we

4067
02:14:57,040 --> 02:15:00,000
negotiate with developers. They

4068
02:15:00,000 --> 02:15:02,000
should not be presented with

4069
02:15:02,000 --> 02:15:04,000
data deals and told that it is

4070
02:15:04,000 --> 02:15:06,000
too late to make any changes.

4071
02:15:06,000 --> 02:15:09,000
This is particularly important

4072
02:15:09,000 --> 02:15:11,000
for zones Mu1 and Mu2. The

4073
02:15:11,000 --> 02:15:12,000
Fairview forest and the parking

4074
02:15:12,000 --> 02:15:14,000
lot on which Cadillac Fairview

4075
02:15:14,000 --> 02:15:15,000
is proposing to build the

4076
02:15:15,000 --> 02:15:17,000
biggest residential project in

4077
02:15:17,000 --> 02:15:20,000
our history -- they would cut --

4078
02:15:20,000 --> 02:15:22,000
given submitted proposals,

4079
02:15:22,000 --> 02:15:24,000
possibly cut into the forest and

4080
02:15:24,000 --> 02:15:25,000
builds 25 storey luxury

4081
02:15:25,000 --> 02:15:29,000
apartment towers in a area where

4082
02:15:29,000 --> 02:15:31,000
the metropolitan communities

4083
02:15:31,000 --> 02:15:32,000
density targets would be

4084
02:15:32,000 --> 02:15:33,000
satisfied with buildings that

4085
02:15:33,000 --> 02:15:34,000
much bigger than the three

4086
02:15:34,000 --> 02:15:36,000
storey apartment building

4087
02:15:36,000 --> 02:15:37,000
complexes across the street from

4088
02:15:37,000 --> 02:15:38,000
their city hall. Last year, the

4089
02:15:38,000 --> 02:15:41,000
majority on Council attempted to

4090
02:15:41,000 --> 02:15:42,000
pass a motion to take Cadillac

4091
02:15:42,000 --> 02:15:44,000
Fairview out of the interim

4092
02:15:44,000 --> 02:15:46,000
controlled bylaw. And the public

4093
02:15:46,000 --> 02:15:48,000
consultation process in order to

4094
02:15:48,000 --> 02:15:50,000
allow the project to go forward.

4095
02:15:50,000 --> 02:15:54,000
Despite my objection,

4096
02:15:55,000 --> 02:15:57,000
councillors Stainforth, Stork,

4097
02:15:57,000 --> 02:15:59,000
Cowan and Homan -- created

4098
02:15:59,000 --> 02:16:03,060
document -- special meeting

4099
02:16:03,060 --> 02:16:04,060
tonight to approve their new

4100
02:16:04,060 --> 02:16:05,060
resolution mandating our city

4101
02:16:05,060 --> 02:16:07,060
manager to begin negotiations

4102
02:16:07,060 --> 02:16:08,060
with Cadillac Fairview on a

4103
02:16:08,060 --> 02:16:10,060
comprehensive development plan.

4104
02:16:10,060 --> 02:16:11,060
I oppose the resolution tonight

4105
02:16:11,060 --> 02:16:13,060
for the same reason typos their

4106
02:16:13,060 --> 02:16:15,060
attempt last year. Cadillac

4107
02:16:15,060 --> 02:16:17,060
Fairview should not get special

4108
02:16:17,060 --> 02:16:18,060
treatment and citizens should be

4109
02:16:18,060 --> 02:16:21,060
consulted first. I'm equally

4110
02:16:21,060 --> 02:16:22,060
opposed to their decision to

4111
02:16:22,060 --> 02:16:24,060
have this resolution voted on at

4112
02:16:24,060 --> 02:16:26,060
a special meeting, called on

4113
02:16:26,060 --> 02:16:27,060
short notice in early January at

4114
02:16:27,060 --> 02:16:29,060
the time when many citizens are

4115
02:16:29,060 --> 02:16:30,060
just getting back from their

4116
02:16:30,060 --> 02:16:32,060
vacations will have less time to

4117
02:16:32,060 --> 02:16:33,060
adjust and the initiative itself

4118
02:16:33,060 --> 02:16:36,060
and its implications. I also

4119
02:16:36,060 --> 02:16:38,060
can't help but think that this

4120
02:16:38,060 --> 02:16:39,060
initiative will be getting less

4121
02:16:39,060 --> 02:16:40,060
attention from the public and

4122
02:16:40,060 --> 02:16:43,060
immediate due to the resignation

4123
02:16:43,060 --> 02:16:44,060
of Councillor Erin Tedford last

4124
02:16:44,060 --> 02:16:48,060
week. Finally, this process is

4125
02:16:48,060 --> 02:16:50,060
rushed and gives the pretends

4126
02:16:50,060 --> 02:16:54,060
that it is an attempt to involve

4127
02:16:54,060 --> 02:16:56,060
the public. It is a sham.

4128
02:16:56,060 --> 02:16:58,060
Councillors Stainforth and Stork

4129
02:16:58,060 --> 02:16:59,060
have claimed this to the

4130
02:16:59,060 --> 02:17:00,020
citizens following them on

4131
02:17:00,020 --> 02:17:01,020
social media but have given

4132
02:17:01,020 --> 02:17:03,020
their citizens less than 48

4133
02:17:03,020 --> 02:17:05,020
hours notice. I am doing what

4134
02:17:05,020 --> 02:17:07,020
you voted need to do, folks. I

4135
02:17:07,020 --> 02:17:09,020
am doing what you voted need to

4136
02:17:09,020 --> 02:17:11,020
do. But I am outgunned and I

4137
02:17:11,020 --> 02:17:12,020
need your help. For these

4138
02:17:12,020 --> 02:17:13,020
reasons, I will be using my

4139
02:17:13,020 --> 02:17:18,020
suspensive EDO veto to prevents

4140
02:17:18,020 --> 02:17:19,020
prevent this resolution from

4141
02:17:19,020 --> 02:17:20,020
being adopted tonight and force

4142
02:17:20,020 --> 02:17:23,020
it to be considered again at our

4143
02:17:23,020 --> 02:17:24,020
next next council meeting. The

4144
02:17:24,020 --> 02:17:26,020
result might be the same. But at

4145
02:17:26,020 --> 02:17:27,020
least citizens will have more

4146
02:17:27,020 --> 02:17:31,020
time to get organized and make

4147
02:17:31,020 --> 02:17:32,020
their voices heard.

4148
02:17:32,020 --> 02:17:34,020
Pointe-Claire, help me save this

4149
02:17:34,020 --> 02:17:36,020
beautiful city. Thank you.

4150
02:17:36,020 --> 02:17:38,020
>> Mr. Mayor, I would like to

4151
02:17:38,020 --> 02:17:40,020
exercise my right of reply.

4152
02:17:40,020 --> 02:17:41,020
>> Of course, Councillor Cowan.

4153
02:17:41,020 --> 02:17:43,020
We all get a chance -- to do we

4154
02:17:43,020 --> 02:17:44,020
get a chance -- no, we don't get

4155
02:17:44,020 --> 02:17:45,020
a chance --

4156
02:17:45,020 --> 02:17:48,020
>> --

4157
02:17:48,020 --> 02:17:51,020
>> We each get to explain our

4158
02:17:51,020 --> 02:17:52,020
vote and that's the end of? It

4159
02:17:52,020 --> 02:17:55,020
>> The councillor who moves has

4160
02:17:55,020 --> 02:17:56,020
the right to reply. And it's the

4161
02:17:56,020 --> 02:17:58,020
end of debate after that.

4162
02:17:58,020 --> 02:18:02,080
>> Okay. Don't worry, I won't

4163
02:18:02,080 --> 02:18:07,080
keep you. The mayor accused

4164
02:18:07,080 --> 02:18:11,080
Council of orchestrating a sham.

4165
02:18:12,080 --> 02:18:14,080
I'm just going to point that

4166
02:18:14,080 --> 02:18:16,080
out. And I am not going to

4167
02:18:16,080 --> 02:18:18,080
address any of his other

4168
02:18:18,080 --> 02:18:20,080
comments. In the end, it is a

4169
02:18:20,080 --> 02:18:21,080
question of trust. Who do you

4170
02:18:21,080 --> 02:18:25,080
trust? Do you trust the man who

4171
02:18:26,080 --> 02:18:29,080
labels his counsel sham

4172
02:18:29,080 --> 02:18:34,080
meister's? I couldn't go there.

4173
02:18:35,080 --> 02:18:38,080
Anyway, the mayor can't

4174
02:18:38,080 --> 02:18:39,080
interfere with the passage of

4175
02:18:39,080 --> 02:18:42,080
this resolution. He can

4176
02:18:42,080 --> 02:18:43,080
certainly suspend it afterwards.

4177
02:18:43,080 --> 02:18:48,080
>> I trust your instincts. Do I

4178
02:18:49,080 --> 02:18:50,080
have a motion for a closer? Does

4179
02:18:50,080 --> 02:18:52,080
someone move to close? We have

4180
02:18:52,080 --> 02:18:53,080
an -- oh, I thought we had when

4181
02:18:53,080 --> 02:18:56,080
we were speaking. Okay. All in

4182
02:18:56,080 --> 02:18:58,080
favour of passing the

4183
02:18:58,080 --> 02:18:59,080
resolution?

4184
02:18:59,080 --> 02:19:00,040
- Wait -- okay. Juste un

4185
02:19:00,040 --> 02:19:01,040
instant!. Hold the hands up,

4186
02:19:01,040 --> 02:19:02,040
please.

4187
02:19:02,040 --> 02:19:04,040
Everybody take note. Everybody

4188
02:19:04,040 --> 02:19:07,040
please take note. All those --

4189
02:19:07,040 --> 02:19:08,040
Councillor Homan says she will

4190
02:19:08,040 --> 02:19:12,040
stand up -- all those against?

4191
02:19:13,040 --> 02:19:14,040
-- une seconde! I'm voting this

4192
02:19:14,040 --> 02:19:17,040
time. It is my right. Thank you.

4193
02:19:17,040 --> 02:19:19,040
Thank you. Excuse me, Councillor

4194
02:19:19,040 --> 02:19:21,040
Stainforth, I think -- a motion

4195
02:19:21,040 --> 02:19:23,040
to close? Do I have a mover to

4196
02:19:23,040 --> 02:19:28,040
close? Paul Bissonnette? Paul?

4197
02:19:30,040 --> 02:19:31,040
You move?

4198
02:19:31,040 --> 02:19:32,040
>> --

4199
02:19:32,040 --> 02:19:33,040
>> Could you say? It

4200
02:19:33,040 --> 02:19:34,040
>> I moved to close.

4201
02:19:34,040 --> 02:19:35,040
>> Do I have a seconder?

4202
02:19:35,040 --> 02:19:38,040
>> Seconded by Tara Stainforth.

4203
02:19:38,040 --> 02:19:40,040
>> All in favour?

4204
02:19:40,040 --> 02:19:41,040
>> Thank you, Pointe-Claire.

4205
02:19:41,040 --> 02:19:43,040
Merci beaucoup!