1
00:00:06,075 --> 00:00:11,054
All right, big car. Thanks for being here, everybody. This is a meeting of the City

2
00:00:11,054 --> 00:00:16,034
of Polson Commission. It is October 5, 2026. If you would please join me again, I

3
00:00:16,038 --> 00:00:17,025
pledge of allegiance.

4
00:00:20,009 --> 00:00:26,002
I want to listen to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic

5
00:00:26,008 --> 00:00:32,008
of the Russian stands, one nation, an underdog, the indivisible with the liberty

6
00:00:32,008 --> 00:00:37,086
and justice for all. Thank you so much. Let me order another roll call for this meeting

7
00:00:37,088 --> 00:00:43,071
of the commission. Uh, Commissioner Rugglas here, here. McDonald is not here. Holly

8
00:00:43,071 --> 00:00:48,075
is not here. Schrader Young here, and Pardini is here. Thank you. Uh, agenda item

9
00:00:48,075 --> 00:00:53,025
3 is the approval of the proposed agenda. Can I have a motion, please? So moved.

10
00:00:53,052 --> 00:00:58,005
Thank you. In a second, 2nd. Thanks. We have a motion from Commissioner Ruglas, a

11
00:00:58,005 --> 00:01:01,091
second from Commissioner Reard. Is there any commission discussion? The proposed

12
00:01:01,091 --> 00:01:02,033
agenda.

13
00:01:04,044 --> 00:01:06,023
Any public comment on the proposed agenda?

14
00:01:08,026 --> 00:01:14,057
Is everything online? No, ma'am. All right. Comment on the proposed agenda. I'm sorry,

15
00:01:14,073 --> 00:01:17,096
would you like to raise hands to make a comment, or how do you want to do this? Um,

16
00:01:18,009 --> 00:01:22,007
you would have to come up to the podium, please, and state your name. And this is

17
00:01:22,009 --> 00:01:23,056
on the proposed agenda for this evening.

18
00:01:25,057 --> 00:01:30,056
I assume we're still talking about the, the southern, um, that so that'll be agenda

19
00:01:30,056 --> 00:01:35,047
item 7 we're on agenda item what are we talking about now just the agenda itself

20
00:01:35,065 --> 00:01:42,051
procedure itself good practice. I don't have any comment. Government is complicated.

21
00:01:43,087 --> 00:01:51,016
All right. Seeing done, then we will take a vote, Commissioner Pardini, for, for

22
00:01:51,095 --> 00:01:57,032
young for weird for for this for Endeavor for so that motion. Carries, thank you.

23
00:01:57,055 --> 00:02:02,004
Agenda item 4 is public comment on significant matters to the public that are not

24
00:02:02,006 --> 00:02:07,041
on the agenda tonight. If you have any public comment, um, that doesn't include any

25
00:02:07,041 --> 00:02:10,082
agenda items, please come up to the podium and stay tuned in.

26
00:02:14,034 --> 00:02:21,041
Anything online, chief manager? No, ma'am. All righty, we'll move on then to our

27
00:02:21,041 --> 00:02:26,041
consent agenda, which is agenda item 5. The consent agenda consists of the July 30th,

28
00:02:26,054 --> 00:02:34,018
2026 claims, July 30th, 2026 claims, August 31st, 2026 claims, the September

29
00:02:34,018 --> 00:02:40,016
17th through 30th, 2026 claims, the city. Commission electronic public hearing meeting

30
00:02:40,016 --> 00:02:45,045
minutes of September 21, 2026. The city commission written summary public hearing

31
00:02:45,045 --> 00:02:50,085
meeting minutes of September 21, 2026. The city commission electronic meeting minutes

32
00:02:50,085 --> 00:02:56,077
from September 21, 2026, and the city commission written summary meeting minutes,

33
00:02:56,094 --> 00:03:03,036
September 21, 2026. Um, commission, can I have a motion, please?

34
00:03:05,057 --> 00:03:07,043
So, thank you in a second.

35
00:03:10,004 --> 00:03:14,063
Second, but I got a correction or something. OK, so we have a motion from Commissioner

36
00:03:14,063 --> 00:03:19,003
Douglas, a second from Commissioner Reard, uh, to approve the consent agenda. Commissioner

37
00:03:19,003 --> 00:03:24,042
Reard. Yes, on the, I have to find it here. Just a second.

38
00:03:32,095 --> 00:03:40,048
Now, on the minutes pertaining to the second reading of Ordinance 2026, uh, concerning

39
00:03:40,048 --> 00:03:46,042
the annual short-term rental permit, I'm quite certain that I was not the one who

40
00:03:46,042 --> 00:03:51,095
seconded the motion to table, and I don't remember who was, but I know I wasn't that

41
00:03:51,095 --> 00:03:57,016
person, so it was could have been me Schrader Young, I believe.

42
00:03:59,089 --> 00:04:04,056
I'll get that corrected. Thank you. We'll check the video and see for sure.

43
00:04:06,096 --> 00:04:11,082
Is there any other discussion, commissioners on the consent agenda? Well, this is

44
00:04:11,082 --> 00:04:17,069
Carolyn. Um, yes, as long as it came up that there was a correction and we're gonna

45
00:04:17,069 --> 00:04:24,093
look at it by checking the video, it would be so great if we could improve the capacity

46
00:04:25,019 --> 00:04:33,002
of the recordings to be played on a mobile device because right now, it's very

47
00:04:33,002 --> 00:04:39,064
difficult to watch a replay of a city commission meeting on a phone. It's OK on a

48
00:04:39,064 --> 00:04:47,035
computer, not so good on a phone, and lots of people use their phones as

49
00:04:47,035 --> 00:04:53,008
a computer. And when I've brought this up before, I've kind of been dismissed about

50
00:04:53,008 --> 00:05:00,002
it. So if we could continue to work on upgrading the performance of the recording.

51
00:05:01,004 --> 00:05:06,043
So we could check for, so we can watch, rewatch ourselves on our phones. It would

52
00:05:06,043 --> 00:05:10,055
be great. Thank you. Thanks, Carolyn. Any other commission discussion on the consent

53
00:05:10,055 --> 00:05:11,021
agenda?

54
00:05:13,024 --> 00:05:15,055
All right. Any public comment on the consent agenda.

55
00:05:18,017 --> 00:05:23,054
The online. OK. All righty then, we'll move forward with the vote on that. Commissioner

56
00:05:23,054 --> 00:05:30,053
Pardini for Schrader Young for, uh, for Douglas for Endeavor for that motion carries.

57
00:05:30,059 --> 00:05:36,014
Thank you. This brings us to agenda item 6, which is our city manager comments. We

58
00:05:36,014 --> 00:05:43,024
have our, uh, Chief City Manager, Simpson. Take it away, please. Thank you. So, uh,

59
00:05:43,037 --> 00:05:47,032
one question that came up last time in regards to the golf course and the legal expenses.

60
00:05:47,058 --> 00:05:55,002
Uh, I was curious how much money was, was spent to date on that. It's $2,515.82 and

61
00:05:55,002 --> 00:06:01,018
they're, they're still actively working on that. Um, the old nine was closed on September

62
00:06:01,018 --> 00:06:06,056
30th. The rest of the golf course is still open, and it will, Typically close around

63
00:06:06,056 --> 00:06:12,026
mid-November with the the change in the weather. Um, the fire department, I believe

64
00:06:12,026 --> 00:06:19,002
last week attended a drone symposium at SKC, and they got caught up on some public

65
00:06:19,002 --> 00:06:23,074
safety advantages of drones and, and fires and search and rescue and some new SCC

66
00:06:23,074 --> 00:06:30,058
regulations that came out. Fire engine 2312 is still in for repairs. It's expected

67
00:06:30,058 --> 00:06:36,021
to be due back in November, uh, when they get that done. Also for the fire department,

68
00:06:36,003 --> 00:06:42,001
uh, the tribes, CSKT issued micro grants to all the fire departments across the reservation.

69
00:06:42,003 --> 00:06:48,065
Our fire departments received 2500. It's gonna go for some, uh, PPE, some personal

70
00:06:48,065 --> 00:06:54,051
protective gear for some of the firefighters. And they also received a $20,000 grant

71
00:06:54,051 --> 00:07:00,071
from Town Pump for new turnout gear. Another one for them as well. Today, Westland

72
00:07:00,071 --> 00:07:07,055
Seed began their, uh, weed spraying fall cycle, and so that, that'll go, uh, through

73
00:07:07,055 --> 00:07:12,019
the end of the month, but today was the first day on that. Our new city website is

74
00:07:12,019 --> 00:07:17,052
expected to go live at the end of the month. Uh, it's mostly new updates, some ADA

75
00:07:17,052 --> 00:07:21,075
stuff on there. I'll see if I can get the question answered about the mobile devices

76
00:07:21,075 --> 00:07:27,059
for recordings. And then I wanted to mention that in the supplement pages of tonight's

77
00:07:27,059 --> 00:07:32,055
agenda, there was some uh FAQs, some frequently asked questions on the closure of

78
00:07:32,055 --> 00:07:37,035
SID 42. Hopefully that will provide some, some feedback and some good answers uh

79
00:07:37,035 --> 00:07:42,001
for some of the common questions that were asked. But we also set up an email that

80
00:07:42,001 --> 00:07:48,029
goes straight to our financial officer in regards to SID 42. So if anybody has questions

81
00:07:48,029 --> 00:07:54,006
specifically about that, it's SID42@cityofPulsa.com. So that should help funnel that

82
00:07:54,006 --> 00:07:58,038
info straight to our financial officer. That's all I have. Excellent. Thank you,

83
00:07:58,051 --> 00:08:02,054
Chief Simpson, and thanks so much for setting up that SID 42 fact in the email. I

84
00:08:02,054 --> 00:08:05,033
think that's really important, and I appreciate the work you guys put into that,

85
00:08:05,079 --> 00:08:09,089
you and Jody. Thank you. Commissioners. Any questions for that? This is Carolyn.

86
00:08:09,099 --> 00:08:15,071
Could you just real briefly talk about what SID 42 is? So it's the, the, the topic

87
00:08:15,071 --> 00:08:20,036
is the closure of Special Improvement District Number 42, which was the streetscape,

88
00:08:20,081 --> 00:08:26,018
and there's funds still in that, um. Money is still in that fund and that's being

89
00:08:26,018 --> 00:08:30,042
closed and so we're, we're refunding it. The city's refunding it and some folks have

90
00:08:30,042 --> 00:08:35,084
questions about that. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. Commissioner, is there any other questions

91
00:08:35,086 --> 00:08:40,065
on the city manager comments? I have a question on an unrelated, but something that's

92
00:08:40,065 --> 00:08:48,028
coming up next meeting. I've had a constituent inquiry on the status of the development,

93
00:08:48,042 --> 00:08:55,049
uh, between 35 Highway and Mission Bay off Hoc Drive there. I think it got started

94
00:08:55,049 --> 00:09:01,000
and then it kind of stalled and The citizens who live there asking about updates

95
00:09:01,021 --> 00:09:09,006
and also an update on the um Storage facility. That is off

96
00:09:09,006 --> 00:09:16,009
35 that also abuts the golf course and Yellowstone Court. I, so I'm,

97
00:09:17,025 --> 00:09:22,082
I, I don't need any answers at this point, but between now and next meeting, we might

98
00:09:22,082 --> 00:09:30,017
want to be prepared to answer citizen. Questions about it. Thank you. Thanks, Commissioner.

99
00:09:30,053 --> 00:09:34,057
Commissioner, is there any further questions for our Chief Manager? This is Carolyn

100
00:09:34,057 --> 00:09:40,017
again. Um, I also have neighbors who are really wondering about that sidewalk issue,

101
00:09:40,034 --> 00:09:47,038
George, up on 15th, and it's been since Ed was here that I've been asking questions

102
00:09:47,038 --> 00:09:53,086
about it, and I've sent him pictures several times, um, and They're kind of just

103
00:09:53,086 --> 00:09:59,005
like they can't believe that brush pile has been sitting there for 2 years. So I,

104
00:09:59,014 --> 00:10:05,081
I called, I've been calling the city. Don't, don't get much of a response. So it

105
00:10:05,081 --> 00:10:08,057
would be great to have an answer. They might be wrong.

106
00:10:11,006 --> 00:10:14,069
All right, thank you, Carolyn. Commissioner, is there any further questions for Mr.

107
00:10:14,009 --> 00:10:21,049
Simpson? All righty. Thank you for your report. I appreciate it, Chief. This brings

108
00:10:21,049 --> 00:10:27,029
us to new business. Agenda item 7 is the Southern Slope Construction. And again,

109
00:10:27,032 --> 00:10:31,037
we have Community Development Director Robert Eddington and City Attorney Dave Mickey.

110
00:10:33,003 --> 00:10:38,089
Good evening again, uh, commission, fellow staff, members of the public. Uh, thank

111
00:10:38,089 --> 00:10:45,035
you for being here tonight. Um, I recently gave a Earlier, uh, a staff report. So

112
00:10:45,035 --> 00:10:52,061
here, um, presentation. So just real quick for the record, um, I'll reiterate.

113
00:10:55,099 --> 00:11:03,008
So OTB Development, represented by Tracy Yost and Park Shera, is proposing Southern

114
00:11:03,008 --> 00:11:10,012
Slopes Subdivision, a major subdivision creating 90 residential lots in 3 phases

115
00:11:10,041 --> 00:11:16,012
within the low-density residential zoning District or LRZD of the city of Polson.

116
00:11:17,037 --> 00:11:25,024
Joe, Joe Nelson of Geo Planned is acting as the applicant's agent. The proposal includes

117
00:11:25,024 --> 00:11:30,002
extension of municipal water and sewer, public streets, pedestrian routes, drainage

118
00:11:30,002 --> 00:11:35,056
facilities, public, and a public park to be dedicated to the city and maintained

119
00:11:35,056 --> 00:11:40,064
by the landowners association. Um, and your preliminary plat, or you'll also see

120
00:11:40,064 --> 00:11:46,031
a legal description for the property. There's also a proposed phasing plan, so as

121
00:11:46,031 --> 00:11:53,005
part of phase subdivisions under state law, um, the, the phases could be completed

122
00:11:53,052 --> 00:12:01,019
up to a maximum of 20 years. The first phase is proposed with 41 lots to be completed

123
00:12:01,019 --> 00:12:08,003
within 2 years. Phase two is 34 lots within 5 years, and phase three is 15 lots to

124
00:12:08,003 --> 00:12:15,056
be completed within 7 years. The subject property was Annexed in

125
00:12:16,001 --> 00:12:23,004
February of 2006, you'll see an application timeline, a discussion of expedited review.

126
00:12:23,089 --> 00:12:29,011
The applicant has requested expedited review pursuant to Montana Code annotated

127
00:12:29,011 --> 00:12:36,094
763-623. Um, this is a new procedure that was originally

128
00:12:37,011 --> 00:12:44,059
adopted in, uh, from the legislature in 2023 and I believe, um, amended slightly

129
00:12:44,059 --> 00:12:52,036
in 2025. In either case, the city of Folsom adopted it in, uh, 2025. The proposal

130
00:12:52,036 --> 00:12:59,044
was reviewed for zoning informants. Um, there you'll see in the staff report, uh,

131
00:12:59,064 --> 00:13:07,022
there is an engineered memorandum, um, sealed or stamped by a professional engineer

132
00:13:07,067 --> 00:13:14,023
addressing the hillside development or slopes in particular that exceed 8%. There's

133
00:13:14,023 --> 00:13:19,022
also discovered or discussion of block coverage, runoff, slope stability, and erosion.

134
00:13:20,024 --> 00:13:27,031
There's a discussion of blocks and streets. Um Uh,

135
00:13:27,093 --> 00:13:35,072
also included in, um, the application package is, um, a

136
00:13:35,072 --> 00:13:42,063
part plan. There's a list of the adjacent property owners, including a certified

137
00:13:42,063 --> 00:13:49,009
list of owners within 150 ft. Those property owners, adjacent owners were notified

138
00:13:49,009 --> 00:13:56,074
via certified mailing. The item was listed uh twice in the paper pursuant

139
00:13:56,074 --> 00:14:03,073
to um public hearing, uh, state law. There was one,

140
00:14:04,055 --> 00:14:11,009
written comment that was received after, um, the staff report was published and you'll

141
00:14:11,009 --> 00:14:18,004
see that, um, I believe, in front of you there. Also included in the application

142
00:14:18,004 --> 00:14:25,042
is entity comments, um, title report, preliminary covenants, bylaws of the

143
00:14:25,042 --> 00:14:32,002
landowners association, construction plan for the roads, design reports for drainage

144
00:14:32,002 --> 00:14:38,001
and stormwater, a water main extension, sewer main extension. You'll see a geotechnical

145
00:14:38,001 --> 00:14:45,003
report, a traffic impact study, and also a discussion of floodplain and irrigation

146
00:14:45,003 --> 00:14:50,042
rights. And so that concludes the staff presentation. Excellent. Thank you, Rob.

147
00:14:50,086 --> 00:14:54,089
Commissioners, do you have any questions? Madam Mayor, because Eddington, go ahead,

148
00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:59,088
Dave, because we ran over on time on the public hearing, I was, I was hoping in conformity

149
00:14:59,088 --> 00:15:04,088
with the public hearing that you could open for public comment before you open your

150
00:15:04,088 --> 00:15:09,024
discussion so that it would conform with. What procedure me. I'm so glad you're here.

151
00:15:09,033 --> 00:15:16,072
Dave's our Robert Spills expert. Can, can, so you would want public comment now before

152
00:15:16,072 --> 00:15:22,004
we commented on Rob's, before we open up for a commission discussion to allow people

153
00:15:22,004 --> 00:15:26,029
to present their public comments so that you can receive it, have your discussion,

154
00:15:26,049 --> 00:15:30,045
and open up again for public comment after you've had your discussion. Um, before

155
00:15:30,045 --> 00:15:35,045
you bring it up again, so it'll be two public comment periods, but at least, good

156
00:15:35,045 --> 00:15:39,077
idea. Great idea. So real quick, public comment is just that it's public comment.

157
00:15:39,009 --> 00:15:44,033
We have a 3 minute clock. We just need your name. It's not a question and answer

158
00:15:44,033 --> 00:15:47,097
discussion period. I just want everybody to be clear about that, OK? Do we make a

159
00:15:47,097 --> 00:15:52,057
motion first, or no, not, not yet. OK, cool. Thanks, Jen. I appreciate that. I just

160
00:15:52,057 --> 00:15:56,055
wanna make sure, right. All right. So since Dave is our expert, definitely go with

161
00:15:56,055 --> 00:16:00,077
that. If there's any public comment tonight, please come up to the podium. Now's

162
00:16:00,077 --> 00:16:05,078
your chance. OK then, thank you. State your name and your concern, please. I will.

163
00:16:06,014 --> 00:16:11,013
My name is Dale Engstrom, and I live at the, the top of the hill. Um, there are actually

164
00:16:11,013 --> 00:16:16,049
3 developments. The original one was the top of the hill with, um, Mission View Drive.

165
00:16:17,019 --> 00:16:21,098
The second, uh, development was the Jensen development, and it's filling in really

166
00:16:21,098 --> 00:16:27,005
rapidly, and this is the 3rd development and, and it has gone through several sets

167
00:16:27,005 --> 00:16:33,006
of hands to get where it is. I'm sorry you took that picture off of there, um, so

168
00:16:33,006 --> 00:16:37,056
let me first address the fact that this is supposed to be a low density development

169
00:16:37,082 --> 00:16:38,057
and if you.

170
00:16:40,062 --> 00:16:46,021
If you look at this triangular piece right here, That was 2 lots in the original

171
00:16:46,021 --> 00:16:52,052
development, OK? And if you look at the rest of the lots, especially the ones. Right

172
00:16:52,052 --> 00:17:00,018
in there Some of those lots are 0.17 acres, 0.19 acres, they're really

173
00:17:00,002 --> 00:17:06,015
tiny. And if we're talking about low density, uh, subdivision, that's, that's not

174
00:17:06,015 --> 00:17:11,035
it. Um, the rest of the subdivisions between the Jensen and the one at the top are

175
00:17:11,035 --> 00:17:15,075
much, much larger lots and much, much more room between houses. And this is gonna

176
00:17:15,075 --> 00:17:21,004
be more like city lots, they're gonna be very close together, cheek on jowl. Part

177
00:17:21,004 --> 00:17:28,067
two. The other thing I was thinking about was that that Jensen development has a

178
00:17:28,069 --> 00:17:36,044
pump station at its lowest point. Uh, right there. And it has

179
00:17:36,046 --> 00:17:40,041
that pump station for the sewer to pump the sewer over the hill and onto the other

180
00:17:40,041 --> 00:17:46,004
side to get it out of there. I don't see any. Uh, accommodation for getting the sewer

181
00:17:46,004 --> 00:17:49,008
from the bottom of the hill, and we're now at the bottom of the hill, all the way

182
00:17:49,008 --> 00:17:55,000
over the top of the hill to the back over to Polton. But, you know, it's, it doesn't

183
00:17:55,000 --> 00:17:58,077
mean it's not there, I just didn't see it. But it's a big job, and, and it seems

184
00:17:58,077 --> 00:18:03,078
like a silly thing to try to do. The reason I was talking about density, partly is

185
00:18:03,078 --> 00:18:08,078
because we sit right where the road splits when it comes off of uh Mission View Drive.

186
00:18:09,068 --> 00:18:12,094
And, and where that road splits, we watch the traffic. And of course, with the new

187
00:18:12,094 --> 00:18:17,081
Jensen division, subdivision. Improvements, all the new houses that are going up,

188
00:18:17,086 --> 00:18:22,084
we're seeing a lot more traffic. And, and we have a fear that when they start developing

189
00:18:22,009 --> 00:18:27,089
that thing, and they're talking about 90 more houses, that we're talking about a

190
00:18:27,089 --> 00:18:31,069
whole lot more traffic going on the paved road that goes past our house, which was

191
00:18:31,069 --> 00:18:36,087
something that I appreciate Lisa talking about. So one of the things we'd like to

192
00:18:36,087 --> 00:18:42,097
see is some kind of a proposal guarantee, uh, something that says that they're going

193
00:18:42,097 --> 00:18:48,017
to pave the road that goes out to. Mission view rather than sending those people

194
00:18:48,019 --> 00:18:50,027
up through I mean

195
00:18:52,035 --> 00:18:57,046
Not sending them up through Mission View but going out the other way and and uh and

196
00:18:57,046 --> 00:19:01,005
dropping the amount of traffic that would come through our our place, OK? And then

197
00:19:01,005 --> 00:19:08,067
the other thing I'd like to suggest is. I'm, I, I did my PhD work in

198
00:19:08,067 --> 00:19:15,095
hydrogeology. And I can tell you that when we first um noticed in 2018,

199
00:19:16,004 --> 00:19:22,083
2019, on to about 2025, 2026, every Fourth of July, the tanks at the top of the hill

200
00:19:22,083 --> 00:19:27,007
ran out of water, the big old million gallon tanks. And the reason was, is because

201
00:19:27,072 --> 00:19:33,009
they weren't Sending the water up there as they should have been. And also, but more

202
00:19:33,009 --> 00:19:38,013
importantly, the water availability in Polson is a real tricky situation, as you

203
00:19:38,013 --> 00:19:44,082
were talking about the sanding wells and so forth. So the idea that we're gonna continue

204
00:19:44,082 --> 00:19:50,069
to approve more houses as quickly as we are, 90 more houses, and each one of them's

205
00:19:50,069 --> 00:19:55,038
gonna need water, and each one of them is gonna be contributing to sewer, it's, it's,

206
00:19:55,046 --> 00:20:01,034
it can be a problem, and I can see a problem coming because. The approval of housing

207
00:20:01,044 --> 00:20:07,035
and the uh and the arrival of enough water to make that happen may not be the same

208
00:20:07,035 --> 00:20:12,019
thing. Thank you very much. Thanks for your patience. Thanks for your comment. I

209
00:20:12,019 --> 00:20:20,011
like that. Anybody else? I'll go next. Can you put the map up please again? Arlene

210
00:20:20,011 --> 00:20:25,015
Atkins. I, I was lucky my husband and I got a certified letter, so that tells you

211
00:20:25,015 --> 00:20:32,097
how close we are. So we are, OK, good. I'm really short. So you see where the road

212
00:20:32,097 --> 00:20:39,096
comes out on the skyline. We're just above that, or, or actually an easier way, you

213
00:20:39,096 --> 00:20:45,076
know, the whiteboard fence Brad Barengo has. We're on the corner of the whiteboard

214
00:20:45,076 --> 00:20:50,036
fence, so you know where everybody crashes through the fence. I know that that's

215
00:20:50,036 --> 00:20:57,072
where we live. So that thank you first everybody um.

216
00:20:59,024 --> 00:21:05,022
Some of the crashes we get, we've been getting at least one a year, a lot of times

217
00:21:05,026 --> 00:21:11,063
twice a year, um. And of course we don't want anybody hurt. Some of the vehicles

218
00:21:11,063 --> 00:21:18,065
come at least 100 ft past our fence. And that's after hitting a board fence with

219
00:21:18,065 --> 00:21:25,097
posts. So, I, I worry about the, the houses that are right on the

220
00:21:25,097 --> 00:21:32,035
skyline. That fence gets crashed through too. It's barbed wire, there's no animals

221
00:21:32,035 --> 00:21:36,084
in there, so nobody fixes that. This, that, that corner there.

222
00:21:38,089 --> 00:21:45,094
Where all wait, am I backwards? You're right, that's OK, where all the um houses

223
00:21:45,094 --> 00:21:52,005
are gonna be on that corner. There there's gonna be cars in their house unless there's

224
00:21:52,005 --> 00:21:58,062
guardrail or a berm or something anyway, so that I wanted to address that um.

225
00:22:00,007 --> 00:22:06,042
Skyline might be the best road in Lake County. I think we probably all agree. Guess

226
00:22:06,042 --> 00:22:12,054
what everybody does? They drive faster. I, I kind of don't blame him, and especially

227
00:22:12,054 --> 00:22:17,094
if you've got a, a really nice old car, we get to watch. Like I'll, I'll tell him,

228
00:22:18,019 --> 00:22:25,048
look, it's a '69 whatever, you know, going up the road. More traffic, they're gonna

229
00:22:25,048 --> 00:22:31,064
go, that's more, more accidents. I don't want anybody to get hurt. The the other

230
00:22:31,064 --> 00:22:36,048
thing they mentioned about the homeowners association of the other developments that

231
00:22:36,048 --> 00:22:43,007
were prior, I know I'm almost out. Who's gonna enforce the homeowner rules, so that

232
00:22:43,007 --> 00:22:50,012
all of our our property values stay good. We want theirs, the new people too, cause

233
00:22:50,012 --> 00:22:57,059
we're new. We built that house. The biggest thing, water, our water

234
00:22:57,059 --> 00:23:05,028
pressure right now. Like if he's getting a shower, I can't run anything else.

235
00:23:06,085 --> 00:23:10,062
I can't get a shower when he's getting a shower. I mean, I don't wanna get in the

236
00:23:10,062 --> 00:23:18,018
same shower always with my husband. I love him, but you can't run the washer and

237
00:23:18,018 --> 00:23:22,009
get a shower. You can't have the dishwasher run and get a shower. I got 3 seconds.

238
00:23:23,023 --> 00:23:29,022
So the original development that we were aware of was less than 50 houses. How did

239
00:23:29,022 --> 00:23:35,029
it go from 50 to 90? We know there needs to be more homes. We know that, especially

240
00:23:35,031 --> 00:23:40,068
in Folsom. So that's my speed up. Thank you. I use all my time. You did great. I

241
00:23:40,068 --> 00:23:45,042
appreciate your comments, Miss Atkins. Thank you. Thank you. Sorry, what's up? Yeah.

242
00:23:48,012 --> 00:23:55,014
I try to tell her price. I live on, uh, Mission View Drive, and I appreciate

243
00:23:55,088 --> 00:24:01,075
Lisa and the other comments about, you know, some reservations as far as the, uh,

244
00:24:01,092 --> 00:24:09,079
capacity and like Dale mentioned, who's my neighbor, uh, we have almost

245
00:24:09,079 --> 00:24:16,061
every summer. A water pressure issue. And as Dale indicated, you know, you're just

246
00:24:16,063 --> 00:24:21,086
gonna, I don't see how in the world you're gonna get sufficient volume to handle

247
00:24:21,086 --> 00:24:28,071
this development. All right? And then, much less on the sewer side. One point I have

248
00:24:28,071 --> 00:24:36,021
is, is there going to be a SID, you know, a, a special improvement district,

249
00:24:36,048 --> 00:24:44,022
uh, uh, bond on that property, or is it gonna encompass where we live as well? So,

250
00:24:44,033 --> 00:24:46,009
is there any discussion about that?

251
00:24:48,039 --> 00:24:54,007
No, OK, well, that's a point that, you know, obviously would, would need to be addressed.

252
00:24:55,003 --> 00:25:02,005
Um Has the tribe approved this? The tribe, yeah, yeah.

253
00:25:03,097 --> 00:25:07,053
It's not really a question to answer type situation in public health, but we can

254
00:25:07,053 --> 00:25:12,008
look into that curious on that. And the, and the traffic, uh, there is like Dale

255
00:25:12,008 --> 00:25:19,000
indicated, is just crazy. Sometimes we have to wait 5 to 10 minutes, especially during

256
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:24,088
the summertime, to leave, you know, Mission View Drive to get on Skyline. So is there

257
00:25:24,088 --> 00:25:30,001
gonna be, you know, the traffic mitigation quote report. Uh, you know, what does

258
00:25:30,001 --> 00:25:34,097
that indicate? I didn't, I didn't know what was said or what's contained in that

259
00:25:34,097 --> 00:25:39,068
to address that issue. But, you know, is somebody gonna widen the road a little bit,

260
00:25:39,082 --> 00:25:46,026
uh, you know, the, the roads here. Coming out, you know, we need to have at least

261
00:25:47,064 --> 00:25:50,066
Maybe another one around here somewhere, I don't know, but there's gotta be some

262
00:25:50,068 --> 00:25:56,035
other, you know, outlets in order to control and mitigate, you know, the traffic

263
00:25:56,035 --> 00:26:02,034
to some degree. I would think that's gotta be uh uh also a priority on it. So I'm

264
00:26:02,034 --> 00:26:07,069
up for development, I'm fine with that, but you know, there's some serious concerns,

265
00:26:07,086 --> 00:26:13,053
especially the SID, because I don't wanna be paying for it. You know, um, that's

266
00:26:13,053 --> 00:26:19,023
one of the things. Multi-family, it says that it's gonna have multi-family. How many?

267
00:26:19,007 --> 00:26:26,024
How tall? You know, I don't know whether that's in the, in the report or not. Um,

268
00:26:26,004 --> 00:26:32,069
let's see. Oh, low income. I mean, I was involved in, in building something recently

269
00:26:32,069 --> 00:26:40,004
too. I mean, you're, you're 220 $275 a square foot right now, right? So how's that

270
00:26:40,006 --> 00:26:45,001
going to be low income? You know, on, on, uh, I mean, the places, are they're gonna

271
00:26:45,001 --> 00:26:50,007
be 1000 ft, you know, square feet houses? I don't think so. The lots up there are

272
00:26:50,007 --> 00:26:54,064
going for anywhere between, I mean, a little one just sold recently, and I think

273
00:26:54,064 --> 00:27:00,079
it was 145. You know, much less a larger one. So now you're gonna increase who's

274
00:27:00,079 --> 00:27:05,083
gonna buy the larger lots, and then they're sure not gonna build a 1000 square foot

275
00:27:05,083 --> 00:27:12,049
home. So the, the feasibility of, you know, affordability is what? I think it's a

276
00:27:12,049 --> 00:27:16,071
limited amount of time. Thank you. Appreciate your comments. Thank you, Mr. Price.

277
00:27:17,041 --> 00:27:18,012
Who's next?

278
00:27:21,006 --> 00:27:26,073
Mhm. This is when it would be good to have the microphone just saying that's not

279
00:27:26,073 --> 00:27:34,004
mine. Hi, I'm Nancy Artube. I'm really happy I can be here and you'll listen to me.

280
00:27:34,005 --> 00:27:40,057
Um, I think Burt and, you know, the others talked about the water pressure, so I'm

281
00:27:40,057 --> 00:27:47,084
not gonna keep going on that, but my greatest concern. Is the traffic.

282
00:27:48,005 --> 00:27:54,088
And we have come to the city several times, and whoever planned Skyline Drive

283
00:27:55,072 --> 00:28:02,077
years back, never took into consideration to look ahead at the amount of traffic

284
00:28:02,077 --> 00:28:09,098
that would come through and where my driveway sits. I can't tell you how many times

285
00:28:09,098 --> 00:28:15,018
we, cause it's blindsided, like, you know, people can't see it, and when we pull

286
00:28:15,018 --> 00:28:22,073
out, I can't tell you how many times my husband or I or my family, my grandkids have

287
00:28:22,073 --> 00:28:29,094
almost got sideswiped. So my real concern is when I hear 80 houses.

288
00:28:30,048 --> 00:28:38,023
I think at least 80 more to 160 cars going past my house and the danger

289
00:28:38,023 --> 00:28:44,043
that's gonna be on us. I mean, I'm not kidding, we sit at the window and watch each

290
00:28:44,043 --> 00:28:48,086
other pull out just to make sure we get out there. Not that we can do anything about

291
00:28:48,088 --> 00:28:53,035
it, you know, but we have to sit there and we sit and watch cause we're hoping they're

292
00:28:53,035 --> 00:28:58,042
gonna pull out of that driveway, OK. And we know we can't, there's not much we can

293
00:28:58,042 --> 00:29:02,009
do. We've done everything we can, I think the city has, but if you're putting all

294
00:29:02,009 --> 00:29:07,086
that traffic, please look out for the people that are there and try to take that

295
00:29:07,086 --> 00:29:14,016
into consideration. I heard the gentleman say this started back in 2005 or 2006.

296
00:29:14,043 --> 00:29:20,026
I was, that's 20 years ago. OK. 20 years ago, we didn't expect. And be like this,

297
00:29:20,037 --> 00:29:25,026
we didn't expect the traffic. I've been in there for 8 years, and the traffic on

298
00:29:25,026 --> 00:29:31,054
Skyline in the morning and at the evening especially, it's crazy going up and down

299
00:29:31,054 --> 00:29:38,035
that road, you know. So I'm just asking you to please be considerate of all the facts.

300
00:29:38,095 --> 00:29:45,038
Sometimes growing bigger isn't necessarily better, OK? Thank you. Thanks for your

301
00:29:45,038 --> 00:29:46,003
coming through.

302
00:29:48,013 --> 00:29:51,064
Chuck Nancy, who's up? OK.

303
00:29:54,063 --> 00:29:54,073
talk.

304
00:30:00,098 --> 00:30:05,062
My name is Gail Barrett. I live at Mission View Drive. And I want to reiterate, she

305
00:30:05,062 --> 00:30:09,061
was just talking about the traffic. I had a guy passed me the other day going down

306
00:30:10,035 --> 00:30:14,072
skyline. He was doing over 60. Because he had the little sign that starts flashing,

307
00:30:14,086 --> 00:30:19,032
said 60. He was in a hurry to get to Woody's, or I'm sorry, Western Building. That's

308
00:30:19,032 --> 00:30:25,022
how long I've been here. As far as water pressure goes, First house I built a house

309
00:30:25,024 --> 00:30:29,022
on Skyline up on Mission View, not the one I live in now, but I built one other one.

310
00:30:29,004 --> 00:30:34,014
I had to put a pressure tank in, cause there was no water pressure at all. You build

311
00:30:34,014 --> 00:30:38,082
more houses, you're gonna have to have a big water pressure problem. They need to

312
00:30:38,082 --> 00:30:44,011
do something about that. As far as the sewer goes, I, I, I'm sure they're gonna have

313
00:30:44,011 --> 00:30:47,007
to figure that one out. Sewer prices went up quite a bit a few years ago when they

314
00:30:47,007 --> 00:30:52,003
had to redo the whole system out here. We've been paying for that ever since. That

315
00:30:52,003 --> 00:30:55,075
was because of the commission here, over 20 years never did anything. Finally, they

316
00:30:55,075 --> 00:31:01,001
did, and now we pay for it. They need to start fixing some of the infrastructure

317
00:31:01,001 --> 00:31:07,032
in the city. City streets suck. I understand why, but they need to start fixing some

318
00:31:07,032 --> 00:31:12,016
of these things. As far as Skyline goes, it's starting to be a nightmare. I watch

319
00:31:12,016 --> 00:31:17,036
it every day. If you want, I count the cars. I did one day just for an hour, just

320
00:31:17,036 --> 00:31:23,036
to see how many cars went by. It was 7 a minute. That's what we got now. You start

321
00:31:23,036 --> 00:31:29,006
building those houses, and you're gonna have another, like she said, 80 to 160 cars.

322
00:31:29,052 --> 00:31:36,043
That's a lot. And that's a lot of people. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Thank you. OK

323
00:31:38,042 --> 00:31:38,098
Yeah, go ahead.

324
00:31:44,089 --> 00:31:50,023
Just to follow up, follow up on Joe Archer, 1420 Skyline Drive. Just to follow up

325
00:31:50,023 --> 00:31:55,008
on, on the water and the traffic. It, it's true. The, the water pressure some mornings

326
00:31:55,008 --> 00:31:59,067
is ridiculous. And it hasn't been but a couple of years back, we were on restrictions

327
00:31:59,073 --> 00:32:04,008
for water to with what we have now. So let's put in another 100 homes and see what's

328
00:32:04,008 --> 00:32:08,046
gonna happen with it. And secondly, with the traffic, you let the cat out the bag,

329
00:32:08,087 --> 00:32:13,099
George. George has the numbers on the traffic, he shared with me. He's got that machine

330
00:32:13,099 --> 00:32:17,099
out there, it's on Skyline right now. And we can do an easy survey on the difference

331
00:32:17,099 --> 00:32:23,041
in that traffic from 2020 to 2026 and see how it's grown already without this development.

332
00:32:25,003 --> 00:32:26,045
Thank you very much. Thank you, sir.

333
00:32:31,053 --> 00:32:35,013
Anybody else? Come on up. Thanks. Sure girls are nice.

334
00:32:37,082 --> 00:32:39,028
I'm extra short.

335
00:32:41,029 --> 00:32:47,001
My name is Missy Leahu. I live on 1400 Skyline with my husband. As it is, we already

336
00:32:47,001 --> 00:32:51,042
can't even use our driveway. We can come in it as long as nobody's on our tail too

337
00:32:51,042 --> 00:32:57,006
hot, but we can't use it to leave because we're gonna get hit and our neighbors are

338
00:32:57,006 --> 00:33:01,045
the same way. So we have to use a wraparound road that goes all the way back out

339
00:33:01,045 --> 00:33:05,062
to the stop sign in order to be able to get good enough view to be able to pull out

340
00:33:05,062 --> 00:33:11,053
safely. OK, that's already a problem as it is. We're swimming in the summer, right?

341
00:33:11,089 --> 00:33:18,011
Winter, it's real slick hill and everything. Um, as it is, My husband's almost been

342
00:33:18,011 --> 00:33:22,041
ran over in our own driveway with our dogs. I've almost been ran over in our own

343
00:33:22,041 --> 00:33:27,021
driveway because people like to try to use it to skip through to go around. Even

344
00:33:27,021 --> 00:33:31,017
though we have signs posted on both ends that it's a private driveway, this is already

345
00:33:31,017 --> 00:33:37,061
an issue. So when you're talking about adding 90 more units with Who knows how many

346
00:33:37,061 --> 00:33:42,058
more drivers on there? It's gonna become a really big issue. I myself have ran out

347
00:33:42,058 --> 00:33:47,018
the door with 911 on the phone because I saw vehicles flip on the road trying to

348
00:33:47,018 --> 00:33:52,007
not hit deer, because we have herds of deer and animal populations that that are

349
00:33:52,007 --> 00:33:57,066
there because they're being pushed out. There's nowhere else for them to go. So you

350
00:33:57,066 --> 00:34:02,005
take all of those things and you're just gonna compound the problem and coming up

351
00:34:02,007 --> 00:34:07,066
with the numbers of traffic after the fact, it's too late. It's too late. You can't

352
00:34:07,066 --> 00:34:13,041
go back and fix it once it's done, and it's already an issue. So for me, I, I'd like

353
00:34:13,041 --> 00:34:17,061
to know how you're gonna expand the roads. I don't want to read something I can't

354
00:34:17,063 --> 00:34:21,082
understand. I want you to explain it to me like a 5th grader with crayons. I want

355
00:34:21,082 --> 00:34:26,006
to know exactly how you're gonna do our roads, what you're gonna do to help that,

356
00:34:26,063 --> 00:34:30,062
and for the private areas that are already private drives, what are you gonna do

357
00:34:30,062 --> 00:34:34,042
to reinforce that to make sure more traffic isn't going through there and people

358
00:34:34,042 --> 00:34:38,017
aren't getting hit? That's what I'd like to know. Thank you, ma'am.

359
00:34:48,065 --> 00:34:56,019
Agreement. Um, Taylor Lipscomb, I live at 129 Skyview, so it's the last house on

360
00:34:56,019 --> 00:35:02,073
that, uh, the paved road before the proposed development, uh, and I have two main,

361
00:35:02,095 --> 00:35:10,058
uh, concerns. The first is, um, the developer spoke to the need for a bus route potentially,

362
00:35:10,071 --> 00:35:14,007
so the transportation, um, for the school, but have we consulted with the school

363
00:35:14,007 --> 00:35:20,049
district regarding. The potential for the influx of 90 homes' worth of new students,

364
00:35:20,055 --> 00:35:25,099
um, and if we have capacity to accept that. Um, and then the other concern is if,

365
00:35:26,012 --> 00:35:33,027
uh, CSKT has been, um, consulted on both the archaeological and cultural heritage

366
00:35:33,027 --> 00:35:41,003
of the site, as well as, uh, natural resource impacts, um, and, uh, it being a potential

367
00:35:41,003 --> 00:35:45,039
wildlife corridor. I can't hear you. What was the last thing you speak of? Yeah,

368
00:35:45,071 --> 00:35:50,066
potential wildlife wildlife, yeah, yeah. Did you guys hear me? Yeah, got you. Thanks.

369
00:35:52,007 --> 00:35:52,089
Thank you so much.

370
00:35:55,025 --> 00:36:02,071
What's up? Good idea. That'd be very hard. I already got. Do you have any other public

371
00:36:02,071 --> 00:36:10,006
comment? At this time, come on, somebody, sure, sure, and, and

372
00:36:10,006 --> 00:36:17,042
there'll be another chance, right? So we're gonna go through and talk about it and

373
00:36:17,042 --> 00:36:22,039
you guys will have another chance if you have different ideas. OK, McGail Barrett

374
00:36:22,039 --> 00:36:26,085
again, Mission View Drive. One of the other comments I want to make is on Skyline

375
00:36:26,085 --> 00:36:34,034
Drive and 93. Those are the only two routes to get into Polson from the south. That's

376
00:36:34,034 --> 00:36:34,007
it.

377
00:36:36,051 --> 00:36:41,024
It's the only way you can get in Pulsa. That's why it's got so much traffic. Somebody

378
00:36:41,024 --> 00:36:47,029
needs to think of another way in. So, just thought I'd bring that up. Thank you,

379
00:36:47,031 --> 00:36:47,071
sir.

380
00:36:50,013 --> 00:36:53,039
Um, Chief Simpson, is there any comment online? No, ma'am.

381
00:36:56,089 --> 00:37:02,006
Anybody else in the room before we move on with our discussion? Just gonna add my

382
00:37:02,006 --> 00:37:07,034
name's Bill Rich. I live, I live up on Skyview Lane. The one thing I do talking about

383
00:37:07,034 --> 00:37:13,078
the traffic when you come off of Skyline Drive on the Mission Spur or Mission. You

384
00:37:13,078 --> 00:37:20,054
get those curves, more traffic, somebody's gonna go faster. More accidents. When

385
00:37:20,054 --> 00:37:23,075
you get down in my area, which I live right across the street from the tower water

386
00:37:23,075 --> 00:37:31,058
towers, that curved. I've already seen burnout marks on the, on the pavement there.

387
00:37:32,076 --> 00:37:37,071
Are the roads gonna get wider? And with more traffic, that means more traffic come

388
00:37:37,097 --> 00:37:44,001
both that route and then coming in the other side of Skyview Lane. So it's again,

389
00:37:44,006 --> 00:37:50,028
it's a traffic concern. Also reiterate just like everybody else's water. Those 2

390
00:37:50,028 --> 00:37:53,078
towers are not gonna be able to accommodate those 90 houses.

391
00:37:56,071 --> 00:38:01,043
So, you know, the question is, is Obviously there's gonna have to be something had

392
00:38:01,064 --> 00:38:07,017
taken place to accommodate that. Who, who pays that bill? Do we or the developer?

393
00:38:09,055 --> 00:38:13,094
Thank you. Thank you, sir. Anybody else right now?

394
00:38:17,043 --> 00:38:21,041
I can't help it. I've got another shot at it, Dale.

395
00:38:23,059 --> 00:38:29,022
Dale Ekstrom, um, I just wanna reiterate because I don't know if I made it clearly

396
00:38:29,022 --> 00:38:35,074
enough that, um, this is supposed. To be a low density housing area with large lots

397
00:38:35,074 --> 00:38:41,006
and houses with room to, to grow. And it's not designed that way on that plat. If

398
00:38:41,006 --> 00:38:45,088
that's the plat that they're gonna go with, it's in 90, 90 homes in that little bitty

399
00:38:46,011 --> 00:38:53,007
50 acres. Um, it's way overdone. And I, I don't know if you guys have the. Power

400
00:38:53,074 --> 00:38:58,008
to say no, this is, this is not drawn correctly, that this is a low density area,

401
00:38:58,013 --> 00:39:04,056
it should have larger lots and, and not as dense housing as what you're proposing

402
00:39:04,081 --> 00:39:11,000
and, and try to push this in the direction of more reasonable, um, and, and so that

403
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:15,056
it matches the other developments in the area and, and it isn't this sudden city

404
00:39:15,056 --> 00:39:21,017
that where there where there was not one before. So I'm. Hoping you will push this

405
00:39:21,017 --> 00:39:28,066
idea of low density. Um, development rather than these little 0.17 acre lots that

406
00:39:28,066 --> 00:39:35,082
are on this map. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Thank you. All right. One more time before

407
00:39:35,082 --> 00:39:37,044
we move on a little bit. Anybody else?

408
00:39:40,032 --> 00:39:46,057
OK. Then Rob or Dave, I think we'll take um commission questions on the agenda item,

409
00:39:46,065 --> 00:39:53,066
OK? All right, commissioners, what do we got? Well, first of all, this is Carolyn.

410
00:39:53,079 --> 00:39:58,046
You guys are pretty close on the matching shirts, but I really think that we need

411
00:39:58,046 --> 00:40:02,077
to work a little bit harder in the fashion, and you know I'm going to talk about

412
00:40:02,083 --> 00:40:08,006
that, right? I have a couple of questions if I may, please. The first one is about

413
00:40:08,006 --> 00:40:13,074
the expedited review because I think that is something that we struggle with as a

414
00:40:13,074 --> 00:40:21,059
commission. And I think it's something that's difficult to explain to the

415
00:40:21,059 --> 00:40:26,062
public when people ask me questions. Sometimes I, I have some confusions about it.

416
00:40:26,096 --> 00:40:34,047
And if I'm, and I'd love to hear what you, um, Mr. Nelson, is that right? Um, you

417
00:40:34,047 --> 00:40:39,062
brought it up several times in. Your presentation at the public meeting. So if you

418
00:40:39,062 --> 00:40:44,093
have something to help us understand better, I'd be happy to hear from you now or

419
00:40:45,007 --> 00:40:53,007
in another place. But as I understand expedited review, the, uh, we, the city of

420
00:40:53,007 --> 00:41:00,098
Folsom has adopted this policy, and we really didn't have Much choice about it.

421
00:41:01,018 --> 00:41:08,008
The state legislature has changed the subdivision review laws, and a municipality

422
00:41:08,009 --> 00:41:15,014
has to conform with state law. Am, am I in the ballpark on being correct on that?

423
00:41:15,034 --> 00:41:20,025
You are correct. So expedited review is relatively new creature. It was enacted in.

424
00:41:20,082 --> 00:41:27,041
2021, amended in 2023 and 2025, and like you said too, with that amendment, it was

425
00:41:27,041 --> 00:41:32,016
required by the cities to adopt it uh regardless of their desire to opt in or opt

426
00:41:32,016 --> 00:41:37,008
out, um, and that, that is the truth of the matter. It is a relatively new form of

427
00:41:37,008 --> 00:41:43,048
subdivision. And Mr. Nelson, would you agree with that? Like we're kind of, so we're

428
00:41:43,048 --> 00:41:47,052
kind of speaking the same language is because I think that's a really important thing

429
00:41:47,052 --> 00:41:55,048
to have happen right now. So we don't, as I understand, as a commission, we

430
00:41:55,048 --> 00:42:03,035
can listen to a lot of public comment concerns. But we have very little

431
00:42:03,035 --> 00:42:11,003
power to deny. At least the beginning of the beginning approval of this

432
00:42:11,003 --> 00:42:18,009
subdivision because the state legislature has passed this expedited review is

433
00:42:18,099 --> 00:42:24,075
I kind of correct there? You are correct. My hands are tied. The preliminary development

434
00:42:24,075 --> 00:42:29,041
complies with the expedited review requirements even if you haven't updated the pulse

435
00:42:29,041 --> 00:42:35,057
development code. If we request expedited review and it qualifies, that means it

436
00:42:35,057 --> 00:42:40,022
goes through as an expedited review subdivision. So one of the places. Is that I

437
00:42:40,022 --> 00:42:47,009
see that we still have a little bit of power is somewhere in our code it talks about

438
00:42:47,009 --> 00:42:54,062
health, safety, and welfare of our community and so um I would say

439
00:42:54,062 --> 00:43:02,008
that in order for us not to approve this. We have to have a very strong case that

440
00:43:02,008 --> 00:43:07,028
the health, safety, and, and some things have been brought up, but I don't think

441
00:43:07,028 --> 00:43:14,076
we have the kind of case to not approve the preliminary appro approval or I think

442
00:43:14,076 --> 00:43:19,096
I used to approve twice there, um, but, but I think we're in a sticky place as a

443
00:43:19,096 --> 00:43:25,093
commission right now because of expedited review. It's a deal where elections have

444
00:43:25,093 --> 00:43:31,009
consequences. Yeah, thank you, Carolyn. Good points. Um, commissioner, is there any

445
00:43:31,009 --> 00:43:38,047
other questions? I have Lisa go. Commissioner, first of all, there, there are some

446
00:43:38,047 --> 00:43:43,054
questions about tribal review. Has there been tribal review of these plans and is

447
00:43:43,054 --> 00:43:49,078
it required? Um, there's as part of the entity comment, the subdivider requests a

448
00:43:49,078 --> 00:43:54,085
list of entities who to request comment from, and as part of that, it's spelled out

449
00:43:54,087 --> 00:44:02,044
in our subdivision review. There's a section which requires a review from a cultural

450
00:44:02,044 --> 00:44:07,006
historical, forgive me, I don't remember the exact title of that division of CSKT.

451
00:44:07,093 --> 00:44:14,024
Uh, there was, they, uh, as part of that you request comment, they have 30 days to

452
00:44:14,024 --> 00:44:21,093
reply. If there's a health safety comment or some something in there that's

453
00:44:21,093 --> 00:44:29,085
significant, we can request a second time, um, CSKT. Um, preservation did provide

454
00:44:29,085 --> 00:44:35,093
comment, um, that there was, um, I don't have it in front of me exactly, but they

455
00:44:35,093 --> 00:44:40,069
were, additional comment was gonna be forthcoming, um, but as of this date, we have

456
00:44:40,069 --> 00:44:47,034
not received any of that additional comment, um, at, at this point in time.

457
00:44:48,075 --> 00:44:56,017
And if it's received at a later point, I mean, walk me through the, um, their

458
00:44:58,074 --> 00:45:05,064
It gets a little bit uh tricky um as to imposing conditions of approval.

459
00:45:06,004 --> 00:45:13,089
um uh I have seen in my time with the county a condition where there could

460
00:45:13,089 --> 00:45:21,021
be potential concern, but there was nothing apparent. Um, there was a condition that

461
00:45:21,021 --> 00:45:27,087
said, you know, if during any time during. Um, the construction process, you know,

462
00:45:28,006 --> 00:45:34,009
um, historical artifacts or any of that encountered that they should immediately

463
00:45:34,009 --> 00:45:41,085
contact the CSKT or State of Montana if it's off the reservation, um, as part of

464
00:45:41,085 --> 00:45:49,078
that development. It, it was less of, um, No, your development is denied and more

465
00:45:49,078 --> 00:45:54,006
of, you know, if you encounter any sort of a conditional, we don't know, we aren't

466
00:45:54,006 --> 00:45:58,072
aware of anything, but if you uncover anything, then notify us and it may have an

467
00:45:58,008 --> 00:46:00,046
impact at that point. That's correct.

468
00:46:03,003 --> 00:46:08,014
Um, the water pressure concerns me, and I've heard those complaints from people in

469
00:46:08,014 --> 00:46:15,098
that neighborhood before. And I Don't Really even

470
00:46:16,011 --> 00:46:21,034
know where to begin with that. I mean, is, is that something that the engineers are

471
00:46:21,034 --> 00:46:26,005
going to be looking at on the capacity issue? Or

472
00:46:28,048 --> 00:46:35,000
What do we have a plan to, I mean, if, if, if we're already having water pressure

473
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:42,013
problems, it sounds to me like we have a capacity issue. Um, uh, that will be part

474
00:46:42,013 --> 00:46:49,006
of the water modeling and review. I know historically, um, There's been some issues,

475
00:46:49,088 --> 00:46:55,036
significant, um, water pressure issues. One of those had to do with the faulty valve.

476
00:46:55,069 --> 00:47:00,083
It, it took them a number of days. I believe they were out of water. I was, I was

477
00:47:00,085 --> 00:47:08,019
just aware of it. Remember that? So, um, and I'm sure, uh, the residents could have

478
00:47:08,019 --> 00:47:14,004
more. It was a few days. Yeah. Of no water. Yeah. And that had to do with, Not it

479
00:47:14,004 --> 00:47:18,052
didn't have anything to do with not enough water. It had to do with a valve that

480
00:47:18,052 --> 00:47:24,076
was misdiagnosing and so the water was looping instead of providing pressure. So

481
00:47:24,076 --> 00:47:31,004
it was not a capacity issue. It was, uh, infrastructure. When does the engineering

482
00:47:31,004 --> 00:47:38,083
review occur? Um, the engineering review occurs, um, after. Preliminary plat approval

483
00:47:39,003 --> 00:47:44,098
and prior to any construction of the infrastructure. So before a sewer main is placed

484
00:47:44,098 --> 00:47:50,073
in the, in the ground or a water main, they'll need to obtain all necessary approvals

485
00:47:51,001 --> 00:47:58,067
from DEQ and from the city of Polsa. And our, our city engineers aware of

486
00:47:58,067 --> 00:48:05,096
the Problems we're already having with water in that area? Yes. OK. Mhm

487
00:48:06,082 --> 00:48:13,038
This is Carolyn. Can, can I ask like a hypothetical? Um, so we're kind of on the

488
00:48:13,038 --> 00:48:20,009
hook to approve this. We, we have a recommendation from you. Um, Mr. Nelson has done

489
00:48:20,009 --> 00:48:27,038
his due diligence. It, it looks like to me and Jack to get this preliminary, um,

490
00:48:28,008 --> 00:48:35,078
Approval done. But what happens they now they can take the

491
00:48:35,078 --> 00:48:41,087
next step and start looking at things like what really is gonna be the traffic? Is

492
00:48:41,089 --> 00:48:47,003
there enough water? Are we gonna be able to pump the sewer up over the hill? Um,

493
00:48:47,025 --> 00:48:55,003
what happens if One of those, if there's a failure in one of those places, then do

494
00:48:55,003 --> 00:49:02,086
we deny it or does it continue to go ahead with um imminent failure? I mean,

495
00:49:03,011 --> 00:49:04,081
how, what is the procedure?

496
00:49:07,034 --> 00:49:13,042
Um, I think the first step is to receive engineering approval as well as DEQ approval.

497
00:49:14,026 --> 00:49:19,009
Then following is the construction of the infrastructure, and then prior to final

498
00:49:19,009 --> 00:49:25,018
plat, this application will come back before the commission for final plat approval

499
00:49:25,055 --> 00:49:33,053
with um a demonstrate a list demonstrating that um they've dotted all the I's, crossed

500
00:49:33,053 --> 00:49:38,008
all the T's, demonstrated that they've just trafficked, um, constructed the roads,

501
00:49:39,013 --> 00:49:46,053
various infrastructure, water, sewer, etc. But, but, and I have no doubt that um

502
00:49:46,076 --> 00:49:54,046
that South Shore, South. What's the name? Southern Slope. That's a great name.

503
00:49:54,064 --> 00:49:59,091
I've spent a lot of time in up there. My personally I've spent a lot of time up there,

504
00:50:00,028 --> 00:50:00,009
um.

505
00:50:02,078 --> 00:50:08,085
What if all of a sudden there isn't any water, then is the city liable? Do we carry

506
00:50:08,085 --> 00:50:15,013
a liability because in the beginning, we said, OK, go ahead with this, and now I

507
00:50:15,013 --> 00:50:20,004
look at, you know, like you hear the stories about subdivisions in other places getting

508
00:50:20,004 --> 00:50:27,093
started and then there aren't, there's not enough water or Whatever, can, can they

509
00:50:27,093 --> 00:50:33,052
come back and say, well, you approved it. You should have known that, that this was

510
00:50:33,054 --> 00:50:39,072
gonna happen. We need to, and justifiably, you've invested your time and your money

511
00:50:39,009 --> 00:50:45,057
to make this go forward. So how does that balance play out? Yeah, my first step would

512
00:50:45,057 --> 00:50:47,036
be to consult the city attorney.

513
00:50:50,004 --> 00:50:56,013
Generally all those capacity layers have time frames. Same with the with the um preliminary

514
00:50:56,013 --> 00:51:00,003
prior right. So this is a phase aspect of it, but to get to that final and and into

515
00:51:00,003 --> 00:51:04,019
that phase you can have to come back to, you know, to get approval. So he has to

516
00:51:04,019 --> 00:51:08,078
meet those capacities, um, otherwise usually they have their clawback procedures

517
00:51:08,096 --> 00:51:14,009
they fail to meet it. It's not hanging out there for 10 years. So that way those

518
00:51:14,039 --> 00:51:19,038
he can't the the the subdivider can't keep those limits open forever and there's

519
00:51:19,038 --> 00:51:22,045
there's, you know, plenty of competition, so it's in his best interest to comply

520
00:51:22,045 --> 00:51:27,026
as soon as possible and and conform but if he can't, then we can come back to the

521
00:51:27,026 --> 00:51:31,037
subdivision and say he didn't meet the subdivision. Regulations of expedite review.

522
00:51:31,074 --> 00:51:37,061
Right. Well, I haven't, this is still Carolyn. I've, I have no question that Southern

523
00:51:37,061 --> 00:51:45,008
Slope is gonna do their best to comply, but water is a finite issue, and if there's

524
00:51:45,008 --> 00:51:53,002
no water, and we've approved it. If we've said go ahead and

525
00:51:53,002 --> 00:51:59,001
then all of a sudden there's no water, are we, what's our responsibility? I don't

526
00:51:59,001 --> 00:52:03,026
wanna say liability, but what's our responsibility because I don't think there is

527
00:52:03,026 --> 00:52:06,042
enough water. I mean, I just flat out don't think there is.

528
00:52:09,016 --> 00:52:14,014
That that hypothetical I can't answer at this moment. Well, you can answer whether

529
00:52:14,014 --> 00:52:19,086
or not they, whether or not we would be responsible if, if something like that happened.

530
00:52:20,032 --> 00:52:24,083
Well, I mean, we have a capacity and aspect to it, right? And that those are those

531
00:52:24,083 --> 00:52:27,084
rights. If we have a shortage, then we have to sign off that we have a shortage,

532
00:52:28,003 --> 00:52:33,033
and if we have a shortage, we do emergency water. Um, restrictions and those may

533
00:52:33,033 --> 00:52:38,017
apply to developments and if they can comply with the emergency restrictions, uh,

534
00:52:38,003 --> 00:52:42,012
then they could build, but if that restricts the number of units, then that, that's

535
00:52:42,012 --> 00:52:46,053
a restriction, right? And if it's unforeseeable, it's, you know, that's the forced

536
00:52:46,053 --> 00:52:51,004
majeure clause, right? I don't, we could have a drought, you know, a 5 year drought.

537
00:52:51,043 --> 00:52:56,065
We don't know. I mean, the whole city could go under be, yeah, absolutely restrictions.

538
00:52:57,049 --> 00:53:01,051
Well, you can set a moratorium, but at the moment we don't have that, and that's

539
00:53:01,057 --> 00:53:06,048
all hypothetical, and that's the problem. And until it occurs we can't do it. It's

540
00:53:06,048 --> 00:53:13,047
kind of an unforeseen, um, aspect of it, right? OK, thanks, Dave. Thanks, I appreciate

541
00:53:13,049 --> 00:53:21,013
that. I just still have a few more um. No part of the plan is widening

542
00:53:21,013 --> 00:53:27,072
skyline, right? That's not something that's been discussed. Uh, no. Is there, if

543
00:53:27,074 --> 00:53:34,029
we approve this as written, there's no language in there about the option one for

544
00:53:34,029 --> 00:53:41,041
large subdivisions like we have in our code that if If upgrades are required to accommodate

545
00:53:41,041 --> 00:53:47,033
the additional traffic, then they have to pay their share of it. That is not included

546
00:53:47,033 --> 00:53:54,093
in your proposal at this time, right? Um, no. And if this is

547
00:53:54,093 --> 00:54:00,065
approved as is, then does that preclude that from happening in the future if there's

548
00:54:00,065 --> 00:54:08,059
a determination that improvements are needed to skyline. That

549
00:54:08,059 --> 00:54:12,062
would be a, that would be the result of the engineering review.

550
00:54:15,011 --> 00:54:22,078
So that's something that like like water and sewer infrastructure upgrades that's

551
00:54:22,078 --> 00:54:28,031
something that if it becomes apparent that there's a need for it under the code at

552
00:54:28,031 --> 00:54:32,066
a later date if that can be required at a later time that is correct.

553
00:54:34,097 --> 00:54:41,027
Laura, can I ask you a question? This now this talking to Dave and um Rob right now

554
00:54:41,041 --> 00:54:46,075
is not so much it's mostly just questioning them, but there'll still be discussion

555
00:54:47,005 --> 00:54:53,098
after the motion. So this is direct questioning for. Their expertise thank you. Yeah,

556
00:54:54,008 --> 00:54:59,047
and, and one item to clarify, so the traffic impact analysis discussed um some signage,

557
00:54:59,056 --> 00:55:05,019
so on and so forth, um, that's still subject to review from our city engineers. OK,

558
00:55:05,006 --> 00:55:11,034
so. There's probably going to be something required, but whether it's widening of

559
00:55:11,034 --> 00:55:17,009
skyline is probably not what the result is gonna be. That's, uh, according to the

560
00:55:17,009 --> 00:55:22,077
transportation engineer, um, his statement, his professional opinion is that that

561
00:55:22,077 --> 00:55:30,065
is not required, OK, um. And Mr. Engstrom asked about low density, and there's actually

562
00:55:30,067 --> 00:55:37,003
a definition of low density within our code, is that right? Um, there's the low density

563
00:55:37,003 --> 00:55:44,049
residential zoning district. And does it have minimum lot sizes? It does. And does.

564
00:55:45,073 --> 00:55:51,001
This subdivision, I mean, these lots are all within that minimum lot size, correct?

565
00:55:51,013 --> 00:55:58,071
OK, so it, it meets the definition of low resident, low density residential within

566
00:55:58,089 --> 00:56:01,085
our code. Yeah, it meets the requirements of low density

567
00:56:03,089 --> 00:56:09,000
and our code complies with state code on that, yeah, that would, that's subject to,

568
00:56:09,033 --> 00:56:15,037
uh, the growth policy, the adopted zoning regulation. Um, staff doesn't dispute that

569
00:56:15,037 --> 00:56:19,089
the watts are smaller, but it does meet the requirements of the, which is really

570
00:56:19,089 --> 00:56:23,073
what we have to look at is whether it complies with the definitions of our code,

571
00:56:23,094 --> 00:56:29,013
correct? And somebody said something about multi-family. I thought it was single

572
00:56:29,013 --> 00:56:34,081
family and duplex, but duplex is treated as single family under the statutes and

573
00:56:34,081 --> 00:56:40,097
under the code, correct? State law requires that, yes, and. So there's no other multi-family

574
00:56:40,097 --> 00:56:45,005
beyond the duplex, uh, to my knowledge, no, um, it would be prohibitive, and, and

575
00:56:45,005 --> 00:56:50,009
the low, low density residential district does not allow anything more than a duplex,

576
00:56:51,006 --> 00:56:56,006
correct, in any markets, OK, a duplex or you could also have a single family residence

577
00:56:56,006 --> 00:57:01,017
in an ADU, but in no circumstance would there be two dwelling units on a property.

578
00:57:01,047 --> 00:57:06,005
It's my understanding that is not proposed, but we would not be able to prohibit.

579
00:57:06,091 --> 00:57:14,061
Um, uh, to duplex or the ADU, but beyond that we can prohibit, right, OK, and

580
00:57:14,075 --> 00:57:20,001
that you mentioned the street proposal that it requires input from the city commission.

581
00:57:20,027 --> 00:57:27,014
Do you all have a recommendation as to what that street? proposal should be, uh,

582
00:57:27,025 --> 00:57:32,073
uh, could you please clarify? Well, he mentioned that in your report it says I think

583
00:57:32,073 --> 00:57:38,033
it's the phase requires commission decision. The phase timing requires commission.

584
00:57:38,085 --> 00:57:44,011
Decision and also how the street maintenance is going to be handled and it's, is

585
00:57:44,011 --> 00:57:49,086
it going to be that city is going to be responsible? Is it gonna be that we're taking

586
00:57:49,086 --> 00:57:57,055
dedication, but the homeowners association is gonna be responsible, or are you

587
00:57:57,055 --> 00:58:03,031
considering uh uh maintenance SID? Um, that's a good question. Part of that, I will

588
00:58:03,031 --> 00:58:10,082
defer to the city attorney. Originally we had um there had been discussions of the

589
00:58:10,082 --> 00:58:16,008
spur roads being privately owned and maintained and that the city would just maintain

590
00:58:16,008 --> 00:58:21,027
the, the, the ownership would be platted just the main thoroughfare and that it was

591
00:58:21,029 --> 00:58:26,056
the request of our public works director, um, so on and forth just based on staffing

592
00:58:26,056 --> 00:58:33,069
and being able to maintain um. There has been a proposal to amend our subvision language

593
00:58:33,069 --> 00:58:39,057
to allow for both private and public to address that um potential discrepancy in

594
00:58:39,057 --> 00:58:47,041
code, but, um, and so that was part of the original discussion application, so

595
00:58:47,041 --> 00:58:53,072
on to give that option to the commission, but, um, at this point in time, um, that.

596
00:58:54,069 --> 00:58:59,026
That, uh, amendment to the code is still outstanding and will be forthcoming at a

597
00:58:59,026 --> 00:59:07,019
future date, right? But, so my point is your report says requires commission decision

598
00:59:07,021 --> 00:59:10,088
on the street maintenance, and I guess I'm not understanding what the recommendation

599
00:59:10,088 --> 00:59:18,006
is, or is it something that can be decided at a later point, um, that is, um.

600
00:59:20,081 --> 00:59:25,096
That is something I would have to talk with Dave. I, I think the intent was to allow

601
00:59:25,096 --> 00:59:32,007
that flexibility so the spur roads with the cul-de-sac could be maintained by the

602
00:59:32,005 --> 00:59:37,087
homeowners association or at least that discussion, but as of where we're at today,

603
00:59:37,097 --> 00:59:45,077
um. They are proposed as plotted fee simple to the city to the city we don't

604
00:59:45,077 --> 00:59:51,082
have the, we don't have the. Bandwidth in our street department to actually maintain

605
00:59:51,084 --> 00:59:57,091
them, is that a fair statement? So if, um, so they're on their own one way or the

606
00:59:57,091 --> 01:00:05,045
other. Well, if that zoning regulation were to be amended prior to final latte,

607
01:00:05,006 --> 01:00:10,098
um, it may be a simple amendment coming back to the city commission, but I would,

608
01:00:11,041 --> 01:00:17,005
um. Part of the technicalities, I would need to defer that to Dave for further. And

609
01:00:17,005 --> 01:00:24,029
I guess my real question is, do we, I mean, An approval tonight,

610
01:00:25,018 --> 01:00:32,098
do we need to be doing something more than? On, on that issue because your report

611
01:00:32,098 --> 01:00:40,023
says requires commission decision or um I would suggest um looking at the commission

612
01:00:40,027 --> 01:00:46,085
uh recommended findings of fact. And conditions of approval, the, the commission,

613
01:00:47,052 --> 01:00:53,063
um, has the ability to modify those, make a statement, um, adopt those, adopt all,

614
01:00:53,091 --> 01:00:59,082
some, none, uh, you just need to have findings of fact on your decision, so.

615
01:01:02,005 --> 01:01:09,061
But does that need to be done tonight because how once we do preliminary plan

616
01:01:09,007 --> 01:01:15,096
basically we don't have the ability to make changes after the fact. So is that something

617
01:01:16,003 --> 01:01:21,033
that depends on later facts or is that something that has to be decided tonight?

618
01:01:21,083 --> 01:01:28,005
I'm not getting an answer to that. It can be both right aspects of it because right

619
01:01:28,005 --> 01:01:31,077
now we're still in that first preliminary engineering aspect, but we. Even gotten

620
01:01:31,077 --> 01:01:35,093
there. We're in preliminary but we don't have an SID. The expedia doesn't really

621
01:01:36,002 --> 01:01:40,058
the subdivision regulations don't necessarily require an SID for maintenance for,

622
01:01:40,007 --> 01:01:44,081
for, uh, these simple roads dedicated to the city because this was the expectation

623
01:01:44,081 --> 01:01:48,069
of the city maintain it. We don't really have that in the code. We do have some SID

624
01:01:48,069 --> 01:01:52,077
stuff in the code that may require it and it may be something that we need to bring

625
01:01:52,077 --> 01:01:57,069
in in front of the bring it up again to figure it out where it is after an engineering

626
01:01:58,018 --> 01:02:04,053
engineering traffic review aspect. Um, so it could be done tonight. Um, I can ask

627
01:02:04,053 --> 01:02:08,068
Joel what they want to do with their snow maintenance or if we have enough information

628
01:02:08,068 --> 01:02:14,002
to do it tonight, and, or we can do it at a at a later date as well. The, um, an

629
01:02:14,002 --> 01:02:21,012
SID is open at any time, OK, if we don't do the SID, if instead we do like they're

630
01:02:21,012 --> 01:02:25,072
doing with the park where it's publicly dedicated, but the homeowners association

631
01:02:25,072 --> 01:02:29,008
is handling the maintenance, yeah.

632
01:02:31,017 --> 01:02:35,038
What's our flexibility? What's our timeline on when that decision needs to be made?

633
01:02:37,092 --> 01:02:44,005
Who's handling your street? Have you determined that it's we propose to dedicate

634
01:02:45,004 --> 01:02:50,079
the streets to the public, the city of Folsom, and have the city take on maintenance,

635
01:02:51,021 --> 01:02:58,096
but we did include permission, uh, HOA documents. Where commission decides not decides

636
01:02:58,096 --> 01:03:00,098
to reject main street maintenance

637
01:03:03,057 --> 01:03:07,076
associated responsibility so there could be, so that's something that doesn't have

638
01:03:07,076 --> 01:03:13,002
to be decided. I mean, the reality is if we assume responsibility for maintenance

639
01:03:13,002 --> 01:03:19,028
we don't have the ability to provide it so it's a, it, it's a false commitment if

640
01:03:19,028 --> 01:03:23,066
you will. I mean, realistically, right.

641
01:03:27,039 --> 01:03:35,004
OK. Do we have to decide on the phasing timeline? Um, Uh, state law requires a,

642
01:03:35,074 --> 01:03:43,024
um, a public hearing if the phasing extends beyond.

643
01:03:43,069 --> 01:03:51,019
Um, 5 years. So, um, the commission could approve their proposed phasing plan.

644
01:03:51,061 --> 01:03:57,024
Um, I think what's important is the order of phasing and the fact that all the infrastructure

645
01:03:57,024 --> 01:04:04,094
is there and that if it, I would say in compliance with state law, so if it exceeded

646
01:04:05,068 --> 01:04:12,029
whatever. Timeline to require additional hearing, um, that it would comply with that,

647
01:04:12,004 --> 01:04:13,006
so.

648
01:04:18,001 --> 01:04:25,083
Did you? Mm mm. Sorry, any questions? Oh, Lisa, you did a great job. Yeah, yeah,

649
01:04:25,085 --> 01:04:29,046
thanks you guys. Thanks for answering our questions. Yes, thank you. Yep.

650
01:04:31,077 --> 01:04:34,059
No other questions for the staff commission.

651
01:04:36,061 --> 01:04:43,002
Yeah Then I would take a motion so we could have a discussion. Please, I move to

652
01:04:43,002 --> 01:04:48,086
approve the preliminary plot of Southern Slopes Subdivision, a 90 lot phase major

653
01:04:48,086 --> 01:04:52,098
subdivision subject to the findings of fact and conditions of approval contained

654
01:04:52,098 --> 01:04:57,079
in the staff report. Thank you, Commissioner Ruglas. Do we have a second? I second

655
01:04:57,079 --> 01:05:01,007
that. All right, we have a motion from Commissioner Ruglas, a second from Commissioner

656
01:05:01,007 --> 01:05:03,094
Schrader Young. Commission discussion.

657
01:05:06,011 --> 01:05:11,016
Carolyn, I have a couple of questions, and the first one should be easy. What ward

658
01:05:11,019 --> 01:05:11,087
will this be?

659
01:05:14,083 --> 01:05:15,086
That's a really good question.

660
01:05:19,026 --> 01:05:24,091
3. I'm, I'm getting the, I'm getting the signal that it's 3. I think the city clerk,

661
01:05:25,021 --> 01:05:29,096
you all are, yeah, Corey, yeah, yeah, you know, I was getting from, from the city

662
01:05:29,096 --> 01:05:32,003
clerk that it would be 3,

663
01:05:34,066 --> 01:05:40,033
So, so my, uh, thank you, that's my simple question. It's already in the city, so

664
01:05:40,033 --> 01:05:46,054
whatever it is, right, um, I, I think though that we'll be looking at how I'm doing

665
01:05:46,054 --> 01:05:51,041
some adjustments over time, maybe not right now, but as subdivisions come in, we'll

666
01:05:51,041 --> 01:05:57,002
be looking at population adjustments, but that's not what my question was, my, um.

667
01:05:57,077 --> 01:06:03,028
Second, I don't know if it's a question or an observation or just one more chance

668
01:06:03,028 --> 01:06:11,008
to plug complete streets, but the idea of pedestrian walkways is mentioned, and I

669
01:06:11,008 --> 01:06:18,008
just get a freeze of fear every time I hear pedestrian walkways because that is not

670
01:06:18,008 --> 01:06:24,038
a sidewalk. And if you don't have a sidewalk, you don't have a curb and a gutter,

671
01:06:24,057 --> 01:06:29,072
and if you don't have a curb and a gutter, you've got stormwater problems and you've

672
01:06:29,072 --> 01:06:36,069
got pedestrian safety issues. And we've already heard a lot of questions

673
01:06:37,017 --> 01:06:45,015
about traffic concerns. There is a way for people to move from

674
01:06:46,045 --> 01:06:53,056
That area of Folsom into town as a non-vehicular

675
01:06:54,013 --> 01:07:02,004
movement. But it's, if it's not safe, they're not gonna do it. So I really wanna

676
01:07:02,004 --> 01:07:09,061
see curbs, gutters, and sidewalks in anything that comes in the city and, and I agree.

677
01:07:09,069 --> 01:07:14,059
I meant to ask about that. Because the application is not entirely clear. It says

678
01:07:14,093 --> 01:07:20,004
sidewalks. The application itself says that sidewalks are included, and then there's

679
01:07:20,004 --> 01:07:27,067
some discussion of extension of existing walkways, and I think it said skyline. Lane,

680
01:07:27,008 --> 01:07:33,002
but I guess the only one I'm aware of is Skyline Drive. So I, I guess I would like

681
01:07:33,002 --> 01:07:38,051
to hear something on sidewalks and pedestrian because I'm pretty sure the houses

682
01:07:38,051 --> 01:07:43,037
up there don't have sidewalks. They, they play in the street. They do not. Yeah,

683
01:07:43,006 --> 01:07:50,066
some areas have a paved. Pedestrian path. Which is

684
01:07:50,066 --> 01:07:58,063
completely different from a curb which diverts a speeding car away from a pedestrian.

685
01:07:58,072 --> 01:08:06,067
I mean, that's what curbs do. They also channel stormwater runoff. Um, and that is

686
01:08:06,067 --> 01:08:12,042
just something I wanna see. So, when I see pedestrian pathways, no offense, Mr. Nelson,

687
01:08:12,006 --> 01:08:19,075
it makes me nervous because I've heard it in other things, and, um, and I, it's not

688
01:08:19,075 --> 01:08:25,005
what I want. It's not the Polson, we're gonna see development. And I just wanna be

689
01:08:25,005 --> 01:08:30,009
able to look at development. I can't say 50 years anymore because I won't be here,

690
01:08:30,063 --> 01:08:35,085
but I wanna look at development down the road and say, yeah, I'm really proud that

691
01:08:35,087 --> 01:08:40,094
I was on the commission when that development came in, and that made Paulson a better

692
01:08:40,094 --> 01:08:46,093
place for everybody to live. Thanks, Caroline. So Caroline, on page 7, I'm just trying

693
01:08:46,093 --> 01:08:51,048
to clarify this is Laura. Plans provide pedestrian routes and phased park access.

694
01:08:52,061 --> 01:08:58,091
Um PMC 604,260 requires safe routes to the development boundaries at least 5 ft wide

695
01:08:58,091 --> 01:09:04,072
for pedestrians or 9 ft wide where shared with bicycles. And roots serving a phase

696
01:09:04,072 --> 01:09:10,095
must function without later phase construction. So there's been consideration of

697
01:09:10,095 --> 01:09:16,062
how to move people besides moving in a car, which is one of the fundamental parts

698
01:09:16,078 --> 01:09:22,075
of complete streets, but A curb is a safety feature.

699
01:09:26,016 --> 01:09:29,055
Will these be curved curved streets, Rob, do you know? Well, I think it's kind of

700
01:09:29,055 --> 01:09:35,079
early. I mean, preliminary, it is, it's, um, it's not too early to ask all part of

701
01:09:35,079 --> 01:09:42,074
this I may be deferred to Mr. Nelson, but as part of the, the, at least the pre-application

702
01:09:42,074 --> 01:09:48,008
process, there was a discussion of continuing, um, similar to the neighboring. Where

703
01:09:48,008 --> 01:09:53,052
they had um kind of a borrow ditch, and then there's an asphalt pathway, I know that's

704
01:09:53,052 --> 01:09:59,099
part of it. Really, what the development code requires is a pedestrian pathway, whether

705
01:10:00,001 --> 01:10:06,032
that's an asphalt pathway or a sidewalk, and that's part of the engineering review

706
01:10:06,032 --> 01:10:12,002
is when we'll actually Look at, look at those plans in specific and to ensure that

707
01:10:12,002 --> 01:10:17,076
there's a pedestrian pathway, so that is at least from planning that would be uh

708
01:10:17,097 --> 01:10:22,056
my requirement or our requirement. Is that there's some sort of pathway so they're

709
01:10:22,056 --> 01:10:26,044
not on the road. That, that's still the, sorry, this is Carolyn again, and not to

710
01:10:26,044 --> 01:10:30,056
belabor the point, but it that still doesn't, uh, that might make it safe. A barrel

711
01:10:30,056 --> 01:10:37,005
pit and a um pedestrian pathway is way safer than just a strip on the side of the

712
01:10:37,005 --> 01:10:45,000
road, which was what we had on um 17th Avenue for years with all the middle schoolers

713
01:10:45,000 --> 01:10:50,006
walking up and down that. It does not address the collection of stormwater. Which

714
01:10:50,006 --> 01:10:56,006
is still a big concern of mine. So I'm just making my concerns known. Um, cause it's

715
01:10:56,006 --> 01:11:00,043
way easier to deal with concerns if some, if you know what they are, right?

716
01:11:02,051 --> 01:11:06,037
OK, so to revisit that real quick, this is what curves are planned for the streets.

717
01:11:07,049 --> 01:11:13,022
No, no curves. The vision was to continue the theme from the adjacent sky view subdivision.

718
01:11:13,047 --> 01:11:17,046
Just continue it right through. If you're familiar with it up there, it does have

719
01:11:17,046 --> 01:11:22,074
the paved pedestrian pathway, not contiguous to the actual road, and they use the

720
01:11:22,074 --> 01:11:28,091
distance between them for routing of stormwater and forced driveway access. And,

721
01:11:28,093 --> 01:11:34,099
and I get that, Jack, um, uh, this is Carolyn again. I just, when I look at things

722
01:11:35,001 --> 01:11:40,095
like that, I mean, I look at Ralson edition where they didn't put in any sidewalks,

723
01:11:41,037 --> 01:11:45,096
they didn't put in any stormwater runoff, and you kind of look at, oh well, we made

724
01:11:45,096 --> 01:11:51,052
a bad decision here and we're gonna continue with the bad decision. So you're somehow

725
01:11:51,052 --> 01:11:59,052
you're gonna have to prove to me. That continuing it is not. An expedited way of

726
01:11:59,052 --> 01:12:04,005
doing business. It's the right way of doing business because, as I said, I know development

727
01:12:04,005 --> 01:12:09,054
is coming, but I want the development to be something that I can be proud of, that

728
01:12:09,054 --> 01:12:13,009
I can take my granddaughter. I, I can see Jackson up there and say, hey man, I was

729
01:12:13,009 --> 01:12:18,076
on commission when we did this. It's really, it looks really good, huh. So that's

730
01:12:18,076 --> 01:12:25,047
my feeling. And that kind of raises Mr. Engstrom's issue with it's, it's considerably

731
01:12:25,047 --> 01:12:32,095
more dense than what is already up there, so which might warrant different infrastructure.

732
01:12:33,041 --> 01:12:33,099
Good point.

733
01:12:36,024 --> 01:12:41,058
Mr. Mayor, may I have another comment, or is that um, you still have a chance. Got

734
01:12:41,061 --> 01:12:47,054
it. Give us a second. Thank you for asking. All right, so commission, any further

735
01:12:47,054 --> 01:12:55,004
discussion, I might have one more question. I I wrote some things down. Um Oh,

736
01:12:55,077 --> 01:13:03,019
on the covenants. So, so, and maybe this is for Mr. Nelson, a question for Mr. Nelson,

737
01:13:03,049 --> 01:13:08,035
or Rob, you guys might know, I don't know very much about homeowners associations

738
01:13:08,061 --> 01:13:16,002
or covenants when they go on property, but we, our hands are tied on a lot of

739
01:13:16,002 --> 01:13:24,001
restrictions, but if there's a homeowners association, Can can they implement covenants

740
01:13:24,012 --> 01:13:31,031
or more restrictions like on building height or um number of units things like just

741
01:13:31,031 --> 01:13:36,087
and this is a general question um but answer that OK is that OK with you guys yep

742
01:13:36,098 --> 01:13:44,098
ok I'll answer real quickly um so um all private covenants easements agreements

743
01:13:44,098 --> 01:13:49,096
conditions restrictions. Those are all the responsibility of the landowner to meet.

744
01:13:50,029 --> 01:13:55,036
So there's an actual specific question or uh section within the Pulse and Development

745
01:13:55,036 --> 01:14:00,072
Code which states the city does not enforce private covenants. Typically, where we

746
01:14:00,072 --> 01:14:06,092
see covenants or homeowners associations, um, are oftentimes maybe within a condo

747
01:14:06,092 --> 01:14:12,002
agreement, condominium agreement, and what we review our, our city attorney reviews

748
01:14:12,002 --> 01:14:17,006
are just to, to ensure they have the necessary elements. Um, as to the specifics

749
01:14:17,006 --> 01:14:24,068
of that, um, the city is not, does not participate in that unless we're a part, unless

750
01:14:24,068 --> 01:14:30,011
it's a specific covenant for something that the city is a party to, such as, um,

751
01:14:30,045 --> 01:14:34,037
an ease, you know, I can't really think of a hypothetical, but if there was an easement

752
01:14:34,069 --> 01:14:38,095
that. That's part of a covenant that has city infrastructure in it and maybe we're

753
01:14:38,095 --> 01:14:45,011
part of that agreement, but typically um those are private agreements and um they

754
01:14:45,011 --> 01:14:50,075
could have additional restrictions on maximum building heights or number of units,

755
01:14:51,000 --> 01:14:57,006
um, so on and so forth so. Thank you, thanks Rob.

756
01:14:58,083 --> 01:15:04,097
That seems so crazy to me that the homeowners association can put restrictions on,

757
01:15:05,031 --> 01:15:10,082
but the municipality can't. It just seems crazy to me. It's 5 inches. That's the

758
01:15:10,082 --> 01:15:15,029
way it goes, yeah. Homeowners made it before. So any other commission discussion

759
01:15:15,063 --> 01:15:16,002
right now?

760
01:15:18,006 --> 01:15:23,089
All right, let's take some more public comment, please. Now's your time. Burt Price

761
01:15:23,089 --> 01:15:29,035
again. So where I got the uh multi-families, I saw it on YouTube when I was about

762
01:15:29,052 --> 01:15:33,027
announcing this meeting, that's where I got the multi-family, so I don't mind that

763
01:15:33,027 --> 01:15:39,051
I'm off on that. I really appreciate some of these questions because I think health

764
01:15:39,051 --> 01:15:47,051
and safety, if it's not a maybe regarding shortage of water, it's a fact. I

765
01:15:47,051 --> 01:15:52,043
mean, you could put another storage tank for just specifically for that, you know,

766
01:15:52,052 --> 01:15:57,098
you're gonna have to do another pumping station. You know, for the sewage, and if

767
01:15:57,098 --> 01:16:02,066
that's not health and safety, if you don't have water and sewage, you know, the runoff,

768
01:16:02,087 --> 01:16:09,054
that's a public healthy safety issue. I think you may have your, uh, the direction

769
01:16:09,054 --> 01:16:15,069
it is here, you have your hands tied to this particular phase. Of, of where it's

770
01:16:15,069 --> 01:16:21,004
at. Uh, but I believe as, as you indicated, Carolyn, I mean, there's a different

771
01:16:21,066 --> 01:16:28,001
steps, and definitely before they start turning the ground or putting pipes in or

772
01:16:28,001 --> 01:16:34,013
infrastructure, you know, things that can be done and called for, like curbs, things

773
01:16:34,013 --> 01:16:41,004
like that, uh, before it gets the final green light to build, and I think that uh

774
01:16:41,004 --> 01:16:48,091
request. That you consider that uh uh amongst the members here as, as a safety net

775
01:16:48,091 --> 01:16:53,096
to kind of, you know, put in some of the missing pieces possibly that need to be

776
01:16:53,096 --> 01:17:01,038
put in. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Any other public comments?

777
01:17:03,058 --> 01:17:03,059
Mhm

778
01:17:10,026 --> 01:17:17,057
Hi, Terry Cova here. I live on JB Drive, which um comes out on Skyline, and uh I

779
01:17:17,057 --> 01:17:24,041
highly advise the commission not to do a public road privately maintained. That was

780
01:17:24,041 --> 01:17:32,005
a headache for over 40 years on JB Drive, and it's not allowed in the United

781
01:17:32,005 --> 01:17:38,088
States according to the laws that we were able to obtain, and it was such a headache.

782
01:17:39,096 --> 01:17:44,091
And so I, I advise you not to do a public road privately maintained. I, I get what

783
01:17:44,091 --> 01:17:50,063
you're saying that the, the city doesn't have the, um, capacity to take on additional

784
01:17:50,063 --> 01:17:57,087
roads, but I don't recommend going that route. I don't like private roads, but yeah,

785
01:17:58,005 --> 01:18:03,082
no, the other thing I wanna do is really thank the um people who have come here.

786
01:18:04,021 --> 01:18:09,004
Um, I think what they've done is identified for the developers these are like the

787
01:18:09,004 --> 01:18:14,016
top 6 issues and um I understand the developers are saying, well, you know, it's

788
01:18:14,016 --> 01:18:20,024
too cold. But um if you wanna be a partner with the city, you know, go ahead and,

789
01:18:20,039 --> 01:18:25,017
you know, meet the city halfway, and I really wanna thank the commission for your

790
01:18:25,017 --> 01:18:32,077
great uh questions and looking out for the people of Folsom. Thank you, Terry. Thanks.

791
01:18:34,008 --> 01:18:36,029
Neither public convent in the room.

792
01:18:38,035 --> 01:18:44,066
Anything online, chief. There was, uh, one online. It was already asked and answered.

793
01:18:44,071 --> 01:18:51,018
It was about low density. And there was another one in regards to, um, does the city

794
01:18:51,018 --> 01:18:56,002
have the bandwidth to patrol the area? Uh, park safety is currently an issue. What

795
01:18:56,002 --> 01:18:59,098
about the potential park that they're talking about? Um, the short answer is yes,

796
01:19:00,013 --> 01:19:05,096
we, we already patrol that up there as it's part of the city, and I have investigated

797
01:19:05,096 --> 01:19:09,019
some of those crashes that were brought up earlier and it is about 2 a year, but

798
01:19:09,053 --> 01:19:15,000
we do have the the bandwidth for patrol up there and that's it. All right, thank

799
01:19:15,000 --> 01:19:22,046
you. All right, so, um, Dave, can I ask you a question on the record? Yes,

800
01:19:23,002 --> 01:19:26,075
just so everybody's clear how this process goes, could you just walk us through it

801
01:19:26,075 --> 01:19:32,003
very basically, um. What we would be approving or disapproving tonight and then if

802
01:19:32,003 --> 01:19:37,004
that goes forward, what are the next steps. So today is the opening of the application

803
01:19:37,006 --> 01:19:41,087
for them to begin, and that's for the engineering review infrastructure and implement

804
01:19:41,087 --> 01:19:45,083
the infrastructure referral to come back to the final flat as we heard tonight. There's

805
01:19:45,083 --> 01:19:49,059
a lot of engineering review, and those questions can only be answered after engineering

806
01:19:49,059 --> 01:19:54,035
review is done. So today is only the opening of the application and then setting

807
01:19:54,035 --> 01:19:59,096
that setting that timeline for that phase development aspect, um, and that. So that's

808
01:19:59,096 --> 01:20:03,008
where we are today. If you would like me, if there's anything else you want me to

809
01:20:03,008 --> 01:20:11,001
elaborate on. Mhm Um, Can I ask you a question

810
01:20:11,001 --> 01:20:18,093
about it in the same, in the same idea. So at this approval gives

811
01:20:19,031 --> 01:20:26,009
the people Mr. Nelson is here representing, um, the chance to begin spending

812
01:20:26,009 --> 01:20:34,007
money. To see if this development can meet the conditions that the city requires.

813
01:20:34,089 --> 01:20:40,064
Is that about right? If we would deny it, then he wouldn't move forward with any

814
01:20:40,064 --> 01:20:43,054
of the engineering reports, any.

815
01:20:46,012 --> 01:20:52,099
But approving it just says that we're gonna let these the money be spent in a significant

816
01:20:52,099 --> 01:20:58,063
amount of money, I'm sure to start solving these engineering issues that people have

817
01:20:58,063 --> 01:21:04,017
brought up. Uh, there's already been a sign it's my understanding. Or there's some

818
01:21:04,017 --> 01:21:07,045
assumptions here, but there's already been a significant amount of engineering that

819
01:21:07,045 --> 01:21:13,001
has been spent, but what hasn't occurred is the city's official review and as part

820
01:21:13,001 --> 01:21:18,061
of that there's gonna be additional requirements such as um they'll probably the

821
01:21:18,061 --> 01:21:23,085
biggest question is the capacity and, and they have the structure getting the necessary

822
01:21:23,085 --> 01:21:30,068
water and sewer, uh, so on and so forth so um but you'll see is in. Embedded there

823
01:21:30,068 --> 01:21:37,008
are the design reports for the, the stormwater, for the sewer main

824
01:21:37,084 --> 01:21:45,059
extension, and for the water, um, extension as well. So, all those reports are,

825
01:21:45,092 --> 01:21:50,034
there's a, a fair amount of time and energy and engineering that has been spent there,

826
01:21:50,072 --> 01:21:55,085
but it hasn't been reviewed by the city yet at this point in time, so. So the next

827
01:21:55,085 --> 01:22:01,094
steps would be a formal application, review fees, city engineering review. And then,

828
01:22:02,012 --> 01:22:07,007
and then the city engineers. Our engineers will respond and say um you've addressed

829
01:22:07,007 --> 01:22:12,094
all these items this is additional information that that we need. Is that kind of

830
01:22:12,094 --> 01:22:17,088
going where you were? Yeah, it's kind of, well, I, same questions here because it,

831
01:22:17,095 --> 01:22:23,062
it's a super complicated program process and we wanna do it right. We don't wanna

832
01:22:23,062 --> 01:22:27,085
have to redo it in 20 years because you got it wrong. Well, and we don't wanna, um,

833
01:22:28,015 --> 01:22:35,055
we don't want people this is Carolyn, we don't want there has been a lot of Oh,

834
01:22:35,084 --> 01:22:41,023
dissatisfaction from developers about working with the city and we don't wanna send

835
01:22:41,023 --> 01:22:48,055
somebody down the road spending a ton of money, um, to, to develop something and

836
01:22:48,055 --> 01:22:56,023
then not have done it right. That's fair. Um, thanks, Carolyn. I have done it right.

837
01:22:56,074 --> 01:23:01,084
Yes, anybody. So HDR is the city engineer that we contract with, right? That is correct

838
01:23:01,084 --> 01:23:05,049
for many years. Just to get that on the record, we don't have an official engineer

839
01:23:05,049 --> 01:23:13,045
on staff. Um, should, uh, HDR. Engineering reports come back about capacity with

840
01:23:13,045 --> 01:23:18,009
sewer and water. Any fixes that need to be made, any improvements that need to be

841
01:23:18,009 --> 01:23:23,044
made to allow for this development. The cost of that weighs on the developer, correct?

842
01:23:23,007 --> 01:23:24,034
That is correct.

843
01:23:26,081 --> 01:23:33,056
Yeah, and, and as part of that I answered on behalf of the developer or um Mr. Nelson

844
01:23:33,056 --> 01:23:38,007
may have a response there as well um on the client, but that's the way I understand

845
01:23:38,084 --> 01:23:41,006
what the project is currently so it's OK.

846
01:23:44,075 --> 01:23:49,042
This is Carolyn. Can I ask one more? So just again, the super hypothetical, sorry,

847
01:23:49,055 --> 01:23:55,027
Dave, but let's say the engineering report comes back and says, oh my gosh, this

848
01:23:55,027 --> 01:24:02,054
looks great. You could put 150 homes there. Then could the developer readjust, come

849
01:24:02,054 --> 01:24:09,009
to us and readjust the schedule, or the other side would be there's only enough water

850
01:24:09,035 --> 01:24:17,001
for. 35 homes then you could adjust that those you could adjust it either way depending

851
01:24:17,003 --> 01:24:22,019
on the engineering reports is that correct any deviation from the preliminary plat

852
01:24:22,019 --> 01:24:26,062
approval as approved would require an amendment and then we look at the amendment

853
01:24:26,062 --> 01:24:34,025
is it um is it um. Non-material such you're just adjusting the boundary between two

854
01:24:34,025 --> 01:24:39,096
lots, it doesn't increase the number of units, uh, you know, all those sorts of things,

855
01:24:40,026 --> 01:24:45,015
um, if it does, then it would be a material amendment and then we would be. Legally

856
01:24:45,015 --> 01:24:50,043
noticing and going through there's a significant process similar to what we did tonight

857
01:24:50,043 --> 01:24:55,023
and so um I would be under the assumption if it was a material amendment then then

858
01:24:55,023 --> 01:25:01,071
we'd be noticing in the paper and so on and so forth um if that capacity would be

859
01:25:01,071 --> 01:25:07,029
to. If it's non-material, if it's significant, if they're gonna reduce the reduction,

860
01:25:07,036 --> 01:25:12,019
then, um, I would have to look at the regulations more closely, but I would be under

861
01:25:12,019 --> 01:25:16,039
the assumption that that would just be resolved in finally there would be some sort

862
01:25:16,039 --> 01:25:23,095
of amendment, but yeah, so. Super great, super clear answers on some things that

863
01:25:23,095 --> 01:25:28,001
I, I, I personally don't know much about, so it's good to, I'm so glad you're here.

864
01:25:28,036 --> 01:25:32,095
Yeah, and you, Mr. Nelson. Thanks, Carolyn. And because I have a question, one more

865
01:25:32,095 --> 01:25:38,048
for you guys or two maybe. Thank you. I'm sorry, we're fine, um. Because this isn't

866
01:25:38,048 --> 01:25:45,069
expedited. Review We don't need any planning board review or approval, correct? Uh,

867
01:25:45,078 --> 01:25:53,074
that is correct. OK. And also, So I just feel like we're a little, as Carolyn

868
01:25:53,074 --> 01:25:58,002
alluded to earlier, I mean we have to rule on this or vote on this according to the,

869
01:25:58,031 --> 01:26:03,022
the state codes, so the city functions under the state laws, right, so we can't just

870
01:26:03,022 --> 01:26:07,026
subjectively decide as a commission that we just don't want 90 homes up there we

871
01:26:07,026 --> 01:26:14,009
really have to conform to state law in order to be. Operating legally as a city commission

872
01:26:14,009 --> 01:26:20,052
correct compliant, yeah, yeah, OK, uh, this is Caroline. Our only out on that is

873
01:26:20,052 --> 01:26:28,009
safe health, safety, health and welfare, so noncompliance and failure, inability

874
01:26:28,009 --> 01:26:34,044
to provide infrastructure, yeah, yeah, but that comes later, exactly. Um, well, and

875
01:26:34,044 --> 01:26:40,075
I don't think some, some part of that we don't know. I mean right now we do the preliminary

876
01:26:40,077 --> 01:26:46,002
and they make determinations about infrastructure after the fact. I mean, isn't that

877
01:26:46,002 --> 01:26:52,036
kind of where we are? Is it the, I mean, the sewer, the water, and even to some degree

878
01:26:52,057 --> 01:26:58,017
street safety. It is gonna be determined after the engineering review and that's

879
01:26:58,026 --> 01:27:02,017
OK, so this is the preliminary. Then there's the engineering review that hasn't yet

880
01:27:02,017 --> 01:27:06,012
to be completed. It won't be completed unless the preliminary but some preliminary.

881
01:27:07,042 --> 01:27:10,033
OK, Dave, I'm sorry to make you repeat this, but can you walk me through it one more

882
01:27:10,033 --> 01:27:13,061
time? I just wanna make sure everybody's on the same page. I understand. Once we

883
01:27:13,061 --> 01:27:18,028
receive an application, we determine that, uh, we bring it forth here under expedited

884
01:27:18,028 --> 01:27:22,005
review. If it passes through expedited review, the plans that were submitted with

885
01:27:22,005 --> 01:27:26,043
it can be reviewed for engineering. And then they can either be adjusted or if they

886
01:27:26,043 --> 01:27:30,007
meet the engineering aspect of it, then they can be implemented under the infrastructure.

887
01:27:30,016 --> 01:27:33,026
And once the infrastructure is installed, then he can come back for a final plot

888
01:27:33,032 --> 01:27:38,058
approval. Um, if he has additional phases, he can come back under additional phases

889
01:27:38,068 --> 01:27:42,091
where he completes, uh, infrastructure. In phases and then builds along those phases

890
01:27:42,091 --> 01:27:46,075
until he has to branch out to a different phase. So we had a map up here, you can't

891
01:27:46,075 --> 01:27:50,083
quite see it, but it's yellow, purple, green, those represented his three different

892
01:27:50,083 --> 01:27:55,067
phases, uh, subdividers 3 different phases with regards to how, where he plans to

893
01:27:55,067 --> 01:28:00,006
build. But the only part that comes before this commission is the preliminary plat.

894
01:28:00,074 --> 01:28:06,014
Final plat is Mr. Eddington, isn't it? No, the final plat will come before the commission,

895
01:28:06,028 --> 01:28:12,035
OK. So at least 2 more times the commission, uh, there'll be 1 for each phase affirmatively,

896
01:28:12,057 --> 01:28:19,087
um, at, at a public meeting if after 5 years, now this is where I, I don't have that,

897
01:28:20,009 --> 01:28:23,048
the, the new law memorized, but it's my understanding I think it's if it's after

898
01:28:23,048 --> 01:28:27,072
5 years then there's a public hearing and so there's no summary requirement so to

899
01:28:27,072 --> 01:28:34,079
come back for final plot. Approval, um, that would just be, uh, your standard, uh,

900
01:28:34,081 --> 01:28:40,049
commission agenda item. The item would not be placed in the paper. Adjacent neighbors

901
01:28:40,049 --> 01:28:45,056
wouldn't be notified. Um, the event where it would be, that would be as if it required

902
01:28:45,056 --> 01:28:53,028
a hearing such as a, a material amendment, those sorts of things, um. So, and

903
01:28:53,003 --> 01:28:59,001
5 years, is that part of the, we're supposed to approve the phase schedule and if

904
01:28:59,001 --> 01:29:04,081
we approve something longer than 5 years now that does that alter the statutory requirement

905
01:29:04,081 --> 01:29:10,008
or do you know the answer to that? I don't immediately know the answer, um, as it's,

906
01:29:10,082 --> 01:29:15,025
uh, a newer law and this is the first time we've been implementing and those things

907
01:29:15,025 --> 01:29:22,078
change so and it's confusing. It is confusing, um. Well, I lost my train of thought

908
01:29:22,078 --> 01:29:28,024
on those questions. Are we approving three phases tonight at once, or do they come

909
01:29:28,024 --> 01:29:33,025
back individually once the final plat? What is before the commission is the overall,

910
01:29:33,067 --> 01:29:40,096
um, the overall subdivision lot layout and then phase one of the preliminary plat.

911
01:29:41,013 --> 01:29:45,088
So, so once phase one was completed, theoretically we'd have to come back with phase

912
01:29:45,088 --> 01:29:53,063
2 and 3, not for preliminary plats, just for final plat. Mhm. Let me verify

913
01:29:53,063 --> 01:30:00,058
that. OK. All require final flat approval. Yeah, all require final flat approval.

914
01:30:00,077 --> 01:30:06,068
So yeah, I'm sorry to keep you, but thank you for your patience. So we also had discussed

915
01:30:06,068 --> 01:30:14,000
a little bit earlier, um. That phase one when that construction begins that has to

916
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:18,028
be absolutely up to code. Say there's buildings, say everything passes tonight, this

917
01:30:18,028 --> 01:30:21,092
moves forward through all the flat processes and the engineering reviews, so that

918
01:30:21,092 --> 01:30:27,048
would make accommodations for everything in phase one water, sewer safety turnarounds,

919
01:30:27,057 --> 01:30:31,068
roads that has to be completed. I'm saying that can't be completed in phase 3. That

920
01:30:31,068 --> 01:30:36,053
all has to go on with phase one, right. All infrastructure necessary for phase one

921
01:30:36,053 --> 01:30:42,084
needs to be completed prior to final plot of phase one, and in such a manner that

922
01:30:43,026 --> 01:30:49,049
you're not waiting on phase two for some of the, the infrastructure. So, so it's

923
01:30:49,049 --> 01:30:54,049
assumed that there's a potential that maybe the developer decides we're not gonna

924
01:30:54,049 --> 01:31:00,053
develop anymore and it, it sits there for 30, 20 more years, um, but they need to

925
01:31:00,053 --> 01:31:05,066
have all necessary infrastructure, um. And probably the, the main thing is the, the

926
01:31:05,066 --> 01:31:13,027
water sewer, stormwater roads, um, more minor nature would be. Um, cluster boxes

927
01:31:13,027 --> 01:31:19,003
so adequate so they can receive mail. Um, Mr. Nelson is correct, and he had mentioned,

928
01:31:19,048 --> 01:31:25,043
um, about the, the school bus service that's spelled out via in state law, so it's

929
01:31:25,043 --> 01:31:31,099
like 3 miles. If for some reason, uh, there's a bus route and they go right by there

930
01:31:31,099 --> 01:31:36,022
and they have capacity, they may offer to stop, but they're not required to. So,

931
01:31:36,067 --> 01:31:40,062
OK. And to a previous question, Rob, do you happen to know, um. Does that, I mean,

932
01:31:40,067 --> 01:31:46,063
you, I've seen, we've approved subdivisions before where the school system is consulted

933
01:31:46,063 --> 01:31:52,037
about capacity for students. Um, that should be in the entity comments. Typically,

934
01:31:52,075 --> 01:31:58,082
uh, schools have capacity. It's just one of those boxes to check typically. And same

935
01:31:58,082 --> 01:32:05,021
kind of situation with CSKT? And those issues, OK. Thank you, Rob, very much. You're

936
01:32:05,021 --> 01:32:09,093
welcome. Thank you. All right, commissioners, any further discussion or questions?

937
01:32:10,012 --> 01:32:14,098
No, I just ask, just to ensure public ask for public comment once more. I'll do it.

938
01:32:15,067 --> 01:32:19,085
Thanks, Dave. Dave, is there anything else you wanted to throw in there? No, not

939
01:32:19,085 --> 01:32:23,073
at all. Is there any other public comment at this time, please?

940
01:32:26,021 --> 01:32:31,059
We have plenty of time. I have one little thing. You bet. OK, Arlene Atkins again.

941
01:32:32,029 --> 01:32:40,028
So So pedestrian paths, OK, so the side of skyline that we live on

942
01:32:40,006 --> 01:32:46,057
is where there is one without a curve. And let me tell you, going through the fence,

943
01:32:46,086 --> 01:32:54,068
our fence, that little, that don't slow up and down. Um, how are they gonna get

944
01:32:55,014 --> 01:33:00,058
if they live over here, they're gonna have to go across skyline. To get to it

945
01:33:03,002 --> 01:33:08,076
So you're gonna put a walk bridge? To keep people from dying on those couple of turns.

946
01:33:09,086 --> 01:33:17,045
I mean, otherwise, they're gonna have to go all the way around. That road during

947
01:33:17,045 --> 01:33:24,019
our walk across the road. Yeah, I mean, yep, I don't wanna see people, I mean, we

948
01:33:24,019 --> 01:33:29,071
see enough, and, you know, like in the middle of the night, the sirens and people

949
01:33:29,071 --> 01:33:37,005
crash, and we don't wanna see somebody die. You see now. You know, yeah,

950
01:33:37,078 --> 01:33:40,004
thank you, I appreciate you coming, Mr. Nelson. Do you have any?

951
01:33:42,089 --> 01:33:47,028
Comment on uh Miss Atkins' comment. You don't have to. Well, I would have to agree

952
01:33:47,028 --> 01:33:52,063
that they will have to cross the street to get to that sidewalk, yeah, or go to the

953
01:33:52,063 --> 01:33:57,087
top of the hill where the one, I think the one lady, she's still there, yeah, yeah,

954
01:33:59,017 --> 01:34:05,039
hm. Yeah, the very top of the hill, you know, where the one lady is scared to come

955
01:34:05,039 --> 01:34:09,053
out of her driveway, I know exactly where she is. The walkway continues. That's where

956
01:34:09,053 --> 01:34:16,059
the walkway is then on the side of this development. Correct. So either way,

957
01:34:18,082 --> 01:34:25,031
Could be bad. Understood. Yeah, I had to cross the street to get into this building

958
01:34:25,031 --> 01:34:32,028
today. Yeah, but that is the skyline. And there's a stoplight, correct, and it's

959
01:34:32,028 --> 01:34:37,072
not blind corners and people going way faster than the speed limit. There's a lot

960
01:34:37,072 --> 01:34:43,084
of ice tonight. Yeah, well, in the, in the casino wasn't as good, yeah, but it's

961
01:34:43,084 --> 01:34:50,003
up now. Yeah, sorry. All right, so moving on, I believe there's no other public comment.

962
01:34:50,079 --> 01:34:54,092
Yeah. Nothing else online, chief. Thank you. No, ma'am. You're welcome. Thank you

963
01:34:54,092 --> 01:34:59,078
guys all for being here. Uh, are we commissioner comment? Sure, I was gonna vote

964
01:34:59,078 --> 01:35:03,003
for this, but after that last comment, I'm voting against it because I don't think

965
01:35:03,003 --> 01:35:04,084
you have our safety in mind.

966
01:35:08,032 --> 01:35:15,055
Well, I'm sorry to hear that, but it was just a, a plain response to, you know, suggesting

967
01:35:15,055 --> 01:35:21,011
that it was that we were creating some sort of unusual safety hazard by having, you

968
01:35:21,011 --> 01:35:26,029
don't have my boat, the sidewalk to cross the sidewalk to cross the street. It's

969
01:35:26,031 --> 01:35:30,009
not a street. Thank you, Carolyn. Yeah, it's any other commission discussion please

970
01:35:30,009 --> 01:35:33,086
before we go. I have one more question for you. Go ahead, Lisa.

971
01:35:37,067 --> 01:35:42,058
It is your opinion according to your report that this meets the minimum requirements

972
01:35:42,058 --> 01:35:48,082
of our code, correct? That's correct. OK. And curbs and sidewalks, our code does

973
01:35:48,082 --> 01:35:56,022
not require curbs and sidewalks in these circumstances. Our code requires um. Conformance

974
01:35:56,022 --> 01:36:00,005
with the city Pulson standards for design and construction, it does not spell out

975
01:36:00,005 --> 01:36:06,013
the requirement for curbs and gutters. It requires that they address stormwater,

976
01:36:06,059 --> 01:36:12,087
water, and sewer, and, um, streets are conformed with the standards of, uh, city

977
01:36:12,087 --> 01:36:16,054
Pulsive standards for design and construction, which is part of the engineering review.

978
01:36:16,079 --> 01:36:23,073
OK. So, if we wanna do what Commissioner Pardini asks for every time we have a street

979
01:36:23,073 --> 01:36:27,006
issue and maybe people put sidewalks and we need to change our design standards.

980
01:36:27,084 --> 01:36:32,091
OK, thank you. Good point. Thank you. Yeah, but pedestrian pathways are still incorporated.

981
01:36:32,093 --> 01:36:37,076
Pedestrian pathways are required, right? That's, that's where we have that particular

982
01:36:37,076 --> 01:36:41,008
authority. What's the difference? Just, I'm curious now, between a pedestrian pathway

983
01:36:41,008 --> 01:36:45,002
and a sidewalk. Is the sidewalk connected to the curb on the street? The pedestrian

984
01:36:45,002 --> 01:36:49,026
pathway is a gutter. The neighboring subdivision is a great example of the difference.

985
01:36:49,049 --> 01:36:57,029
Um, it's not a path or it's not a sidewalk. It's an asphalt, um. Pathway

986
01:36:57,066 --> 01:37:01,083
there's a there's a ditch in there for storm water and then the pathway and it's

987
01:37:01,083 --> 01:37:08,032
a means for people to um to walk alongside the road without being in the road so

988
01:37:08,054 --> 01:37:13,092
um there may be technical definition that I don't have memorized but it's it's pretty

989
01:37:14,033 --> 01:37:18,018
nice up there it's this is Carolyn it's pretty nice up there. The pedestrian pathways

990
01:37:18,018 --> 01:37:23,016
up there are pretty nice. Excellent. Thank you, Rob. Thank you. So commissioner,

991
01:37:23,021 --> 01:37:25,001
is there any other discussion before we go?

992
01:37:28,038 --> 01:37:31,023
Before we do, I just wanna thank everybody from the public for being here tonight.

993
01:37:31,034 --> 01:37:36,025
These are really, um, valid concerns, and we're happy to listen to you. We live here

994
01:37:36,025 --> 01:37:41,077
too, and, um, I just appreciate you all taking the time to be here very much. Yeah,

995
01:37:41,099 --> 01:37:47,021
anytime. Public meetings. We're always happy to have you only on Monday nights, anytime

996
01:37:47,034 --> 01:37:54,085
on Monday nights. Um, and I, I last meeting I erroneously threw a, uh, staff employee

997
01:37:54,085 --> 01:37:58,017
under the bus by saying you can call her, take a bunch of questions. That was Jody.

998
01:37:58,022 --> 01:38:02,021
I apologize officially on the record to Jody for that, but if you do have further

999
01:38:02,021 --> 01:38:05,057
questions, um, because this isn't really a question and answer session, and as you

1000
01:38:05,057 --> 01:38:09,073
heard tonight there will be further meetings on this. This is just a very preliminary

1001
01:38:09,073 --> 01:38:15,023
stage. Um, you can contact our city manager, Chief Simpson, and he will get you to

1002
01:38:15,038 --> 01:38:19,061
Rob and Dave if needed, you know, to register some more concerns and ask some more

1003
01:38:19,061 --> 01:38:25,045
questions. Sound good, Sam? Just wanna make sure that's all clear for everybody.

1004
01:38:26,036 --> 01:38:31,008
Um, all right, there's no further discussion. Nothing else online, Chief. No, ma'am.

1005
01:38:32,006 --> 01:38:37,073
We have a motion on the table, so let's take a vote. Commissioner Ruglas for Commissioner

1006
01:38:37,073 --> 01:38:38,000
Reard.

1007
01:38:40,001 --> 01:38:46,064
4 only because I feel like I'm legally obligated to. Uh, Commissioner Schrader in

1008
01:38:47,004 --> 01:38:52,042
for Commissioner Pardee against, and I am for both. I'll vote also with Commissioner

1009
01:38:52,042 --> 01:38:58,012
Reard's, uh, hesitations, but, um. Respectful of our legal obligations here tonight,

1010
01:38:58,028 --> 01:39:03,079
so to be continued. All right, so that motion does carry tonight. This brings us

1011
01:39:03,079 --> 01:39:11,041
to Agenda item. Wrong meeting. Agenda item 8, which is commissioner's comments on

1012
01:39:11,041 --> 01:39:14,025
matters not on the agenda. Commissioners, do you got anything to make?

1013
01:39:17,092 --> 01:39:23,098
Tracy's not here. Give us an update on the high school. I don't know. OK, no, I just

1014
01:39:23,098 --> 01:39:29,006
wanna say that, um, Chief Simpson and I are attending the Montana League of Cities

1015
01:39:29,006 --> 01:39:34,018
and Towns conference this week, so we'll report back, um. I was asked to be on the

1016
01:39:34,018 --> 01:39:39,014
board for the Montana League of Cities and Towns to represent Folsom, so against

1017
01:39:39,014 --> 01:39:43,073
my better judgment, I'm not attending more meetings in my life. I accept it, so I,

1018
01:39:43,083 --> 01:39:47,008
I'll do that and report back to you guys on that too. Cool. Anything else, Jan? Anything

1019
01:39:47,008 --> 01:39:54,012
going on in Romeo? Um, just the mural painting. I saw pictures. It looks nice. It

1020
01:39:54,012 --> 01:40:01,015
is nice, isn't it? Love if Polson would do a paint by number with the kids. That

1021
01:40:01,017 --> 01:40:07,046
would just be great instead of adults doing it when we get a Main Street grant. Yeah,

1022
01:40:07,064 --> 01:40:13,009
because it's 20 days, yeah, and thanks to Chief Simpson for working on our growth

1023
01:40:13,009 --> 01:40:18,022
policy. We will then be able to apply for a Main Street grant that has to be done

1024
01:40:18,022 --> 01:40:24,004
first. All right, yeah, they're because they're still doing them, the. Well, Main

1025
01:40:24,004 --> 01:40:29,015
Street and they're still doing the tourism grants because they just released um Cohort

1026
01:40:29,015 --> 01:40:36,096
3, so they are still doing the pilot tourism grants, so. And the agrotourism

1027
01:40:37,033 --> 01:40:42,002
grant, what is that? We ought to be getting that. Well, I don't know, we can't get

1028
01:40:42,002 --> 01:40:49,002
a, uh, can't get a, uh, resort tax, so, you know, agrotourism probably wouldn't work

1029
01:40:49,002 --> 01:40:54,084
cause, you know, we don't grow any crops around here in town, do we? Some people

1030
01:40:54,084 --> 01:41:02,079
might be. I know Lisa does. I got an orchard. I don't know. Uh, all right, anything

1031
01:41:02,079 --> 01:41:08,029
else for you guys? Um, no, good job, Laura. Thank you. There's something going on.

1032
01:41:08,059 --> 01:41:16,002
Oh, the governor's summit is this month, and the farmers, the Montana Farmers

1033
01:41:16,002 --> 01:41:22,012
Union's convention is the 15th, I think, in Helena. So that's kind of an important

1034
01:41:22,012 --> 01:41:27,038
one if you're into that kind of stuff. So excellent, good information. Thanks, Jen.

1035
01:41:27,065 --> 01:41:34,025
Um, I also did have another meeting with Representative Rexton and Paul Bishop and

1036
01:41:34,025 --> 01:41:38,092
Dennis Dody, that was the four of us, just regarding preliminary talks about how

1037
01:41:38,092 --> 01:41:43,068
we would move forward if the city was on board with a lake walk. You like the river

1038
01:41:43,068 --> 01:41:48,008
walk, and it would extend from Quatuck to Matty's Marina, you know, pedestrian safety

1039
01:41:48,008 --> 01:41:52,086
walk, yeah, yeah, since you brought that up. You have another meeting with Linda.

1040
01:41:53,023 --> 01:41:59,041
Um, I, I believe that the project that the golf course and the Lakers are working

1041
01:41:59,043 --> 01:42:06,029
on, that retention pond, is running into a little bit of a hiccup with state regulations,

1042
01:42:06,059 --> 01:42:11,038
and Linda might be able to smooth that. She might know the right people to talk to.

1043
01:42:11,067 --> 01:42:19,037
I, I just heard that report. In a cocktail concert conversation, um, but sure, I'll

1044
01:42:19,037 --> 01:42:24,021
ask her, yeah, because city manager, you can maybe ask Mr. Nolan. She's, she's, um,

1045
01:42:24,038 --> 01:42:29,075
Linda's repeatedly said that she's willing to continue to be a lame duck advocate,

1046
01:42:30,022 --> 01:42:36,072
so, and that she is. Yeah, for sure. Oh, I'd love if our, um, two representative

1047
01:42:36,076 --> 01:42:42,059
or two candidates for representing Paulson would love to come, you know, introduce

1048
01:42:42,059 --> 01:42:47,035
themselves considering we see one fairly frequently and one has never shown his face.

1049
01:42:47,052 --> 01:42:51,082
That would be wonderful. They are certainly welcome to come. Yes, they are a public

1050
01:42:51,082 --> 01:42:56,062
meeting. Yes. All righty. Anything else, commissioners? All right, can I have a,

1051
01:42:56,075 --> 01:43:00,082
oh, thanks to the staff for being here. Thanks to Cora. Thanks to Chief. Thanks to

1052
01:43:00,082 --> 01:43:06,038
Link. Thanks to Dave and Rob and Don. Sorry, Don, thanks to Don. Thank you. We took

1053
01:43:06,038 --> 01:43:09,099
wonderful pictures for our website recently. Thank you, Don. Yes, you're welcome.

1054
01:43:10,035 --> 01:43:15,078
Can I have a motion to adjourn, please? I would so move. In a second. I'll second

1055
01:43:16,007 --> 01:43:19,096
motion from Commissioner Reard. Second from Commissioner Rutled. All in favor. Hi,

1056
01:43:19,097 --> 01:43:22,031
I'm the guy. We're adjourned. Thank you.

1057
01:43:24,043 --> 01:43:25,065
I know I was gonna say something.