>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
it is 2:00.
Today is -- this is our final
board meeting of 2025.
Before we begin let's take a
moment for a moment silence.
[Moment of silence]
Thank you so much.
Please stand, if you are able,
the pledge of allegiance.
>>> I pledge allegiance to the
flag of the united states of
america and to the republic for
which it stands, one nation
under GOD, indivisible, with
liberty and justice for all
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
before we go through with our
formal agenda I would like to
get a motion to waive the rules
of procedure and approve the
request to participate remotely
through electronic
communications means.
>> so moved
>> second.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
any discussion?
Let's go ahead and
take our vote
.
>> vote unanimous supervisor
angry absent from vote.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Is he present on the screen?
>> Victor Angry: yes, ma'am.
I'm here.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
sorry you are feeling bad, but
I'm also spreading out and we
are going to be taking up some
your space.
Without let's go to agenda item
number four.
I mean, get out of my way, yes
lee.
First of all, we have 4a.
Unfortunately she is not well
so we will not be proceeding
with 4a today.
I'm going to go ahead and do 4b
and 4c separately.
Before actually go over there
let's do approval of the
minutes from NOVEMBER 18.
And I get a motion?
All right.
I will give it to supervisor
stewart.
Any discussion?
If not
, let's go ahead and take
our vote.
>> supervisor angry?
Vote unanimous.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
now we are going to move to
commendations and
proclamations.
So again 4a we are pulling that
as the recipient is not well.
4b and 4c I'm going to do
separately.
Can I get a motion?
It has been properly moved and
seconded.
Any discussion?
Let's go ahead and take our
vote.
>> supervisor angry on 4b?
Motion passes 6/2 supervisors
gordy and vega voting no.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
And 4c I would like to get a
motion.
>> so moved.
>> second.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
it has been properly moved and
seconded.
Any discussion?
Let's go ahead and take our
vote.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
for 4b, if you can join me.
And then for 4c we have a very
large group.
I would like to take a brief
recess so everyone on the dais
can take a picture.
Maybe we will find a way to
photoshop you in, victor, I
don't know.
We will figure out something.
If you can join me for the
first one
.
>> do we have anyone here from
united workers?
It's
>> Margaret Angela Franklin:
good afternoon.
Tenants and workers united is a
grassroots organization
committed to building community
power to win social and
economic justice across
northern virginia.
For 39 years tenant workers
united have been organizing low
income communities of color to
build power through community
led campaigns for affordable
housing, health equity,
education justice, police
accountability, immigrants
rights and more.
tenants and workers united have
advocated the creation of the
counties office a housing
community development, the
housing trust fund and
affordable
drilling ordinance.
Enants and workers united is
a ub summer institute program,
the eastern prince william
county.
For middle and high school
youth with the goal to provide
leadership, educational
workshops and guidance to
ensure student success.
Tenant workers united provides
education and leadership
development so people become
change agents and proactive
civic engagement to secure
sustainable systemic changes
that advance racial economic
social justice across prince
william.
Therefore today the prince
william board of county
supervisors hereby recognizes
and commends the outstanding
efforts the tenants and workers
united has contributed to
prince william county
residence.
>> good afternoon
CHAIRWOMAN
Jefferson and supervisors.
We are grateful and honored to
be commended today
.
Our organization has been
around for many years in the
community working alongside
families, communities of color,
and youth doing really
impactful work
.
We recognize it's not easy work
so we appreciate being
recognized
.
thank you so much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
The next one for 4c.
If anyone associated with this
commendation wants to come down
.
Come on folks.
Don't be shy.
I was wondering why we had such
a large police presence and
someone reminded me of this
commendation.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you
MADAM Trip recommend fire and
rescue personnel
, police
department lakeridge residence
on NOVEMBER 13, 2025.
I will wait until everyone
files in.
I will note for the public this
is the safest building in the
county right now.
[Laughter]
On the evening of NOVEMBER 13,
2025 a major gas leak caused by
a water main rupture into
hesitated the evacuation of 82
residence.
9:30 P.M. Prince william county
firefighters and rescue workers
responded to the area near
contini place to investigate
reports of leaking gas
undetermined three inch gas
line was severely damaged or in
an excavation work but he
residence of 65 townhomes in
danger.
The office of emergency
management coordinated with the
prince william county schools
to provide immediate shelter at
woodbridge high school for adt
people, 11 whom were children
with additional fire and rescue
units providing evacuation and
shelter support.
The following groups played a
roll in assisting lakeridge
residence that night.
The prince william county fire
and rescue hazardous materials
response unit
, rehabbed units
and safety and command
officers.
The prince william safety
communications
, prince william
county police department,
prince william county
department of social services,
washington gas and red cross.
Therefore today the prince
william board of supervisors
commends the prince william
county fire and rescue police
department, department of
social services, on the right
drivers and other groups that
help evacuate and assist
lakeridge residence endangered
by the gas leak in the
townhouse community on NOVEMBER
13, 2025.
Thank you so much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
we have a number of speakers.
I will start with those closest
entries, I'm going to have you
take the opportunity to walk
over here as well.
I will start with you, MR.
Schneider.
Come on up if you
have a few words.
> yes, for brevity say,
thank you for the opportunity.
Unfortunately our chair could
not be here, supervisor angry,
but I'm really impressed by the
avatar of his remote
participation so we thank him
for that.
Are operators are
about on the way home for the
day.
They put in a full day at work
when the phone call came in.
I want to thank our dispatcher
was able to coordinate the
researchers, supervisor melvin
denton
.
Melvin denton who led the team
,
frank and patrick daily to the
scene and they were able to
provide the support
.
We are thrilled to do it.
You know us for our services
but you might forget we are
two-time transportation
security administration award
winner for the gold standard
and we love supporting prince
william county.
[Applause]
>> think is a much for this
honor.
On the deputy chief and I was
the acting chief on the day the
incident occurred.
First one to say as the closest
representatives of the citizens
it's always a difficult thing
for us to make these types of
decisions
.
In the case of a gas leak, it's
not what has happened already.
The incident command is also
responsible for what might
happen.
And that caused people to be in
very uncomfortable conditions.
We are glad there wasn't an
injury or loss, but still
difficult to be told in the
middle of the night you must
leave
, and they don't get a
whole lot more information.
It's uncomfortable for
firefighters.
They wonderful equipment, for
pathogens, for but they don't
have explosion suits.
They don't have suits that will
protect them.
As they are going until people
get out of the dangerous
situation, they are also in
danger.
This is your amazing team like
all the work done.
The fire and rescue units in
here is the fire rescue system
.
We had units from nokesville,
from dfr and multiple agencies
were involved in this,
obviously.
Has met had a critical roll
making sure we were evacuating
and deciding based on the
science that they were able to
provide to.
This is a very small part.
With 18 units dispatched to
this.
There were 40 personnel.
This is a representation of the
people who were actually at
work at that time.
But they are amazing and I
really appreciate this
commendation for them.
When they are working and
working a large-scale incident
like this, multiple agencies
from oh wl to dale city are
putting in the extra work at
night to make sure the 9-1-1
calls don't stop happening
.
It really is a systemwide
event.
And these people did a
wonderful job.
So thank you very much.
[Applause]
>> good afternoon.
On behalf of the members of the
department of public safety
communications, I would like to
thank the board for the
positive recognition and for
your continued support of
public safety professionals who
serve the community every day.
Thank you.
[Applause]
>> good afternoon.
I'm not going to repeat what
everyone has said, but this is
one of the reasons I really
enjoy working in prince william
county.
It is also one of the reasons I
feel safe about living in
prince william county.
If you look at the
collaboration between on the
right, the schools, community
services, fire department,
emergency management and then
to have our elected leaders
recognize it and say thank you
means the world to us.
So thank you for giving them.
To our first responders who do
this every single day.
[Applause]
>> good afternoon chair
jefferson, members of the
board.
Phyllis jennings holt, director
of social services.
As he can see, this amazing
group of people here.
I was the caboose at the end.
Social services, when I
received the call from brian
got into immediate action to
find shelter for the families
.
That is part of the work that
we do as a team.
We have conversations in
emergency management so thank
you for the accommodation and
I'm proud to be a part of the
team and to help shelter the
families that evening.
Thank you.
[Applause]
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I know we listed a lot of
organizations.
Does anyone representative with
come up.
I don't know if nokesville
volunteer.
All right.
I feel like
saying this.
Come on down!
>> a number of you were with us
last night.
Thank you for seeing being here
today.
It's nice to be a part of a
long time collaborative
relationship
.
With the school division.
My name is ryan crow with
prince william county school
security.
Want to think say thank you to
the people who came before us.
When I worked in the door 30
years ago these establish
well-known we are fortunate it
continues to stay with everyone
using the room.
If things go sideways, we know
the most important thing is to
take care of our citizens and
we appreciate the invitation
here today.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I don't see anyone else coming
down so I'm going to ask the
board, if we can come out for a
quick picture.
I mean quick.
I know some of you like to chat
and linger.
I know who you are.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I really appreciate the first
responders and I appreciate the
people who come back to the
dais.
we are going to go ahead and
move on to the consent agenda.
I would like to ask if anyone
would have anything that would
like to pull.
I'm going to poll 5j and trent
eight.
Does anyone have anything from
the consent agenda they would
like to poll?
Don't see
anything also I would like to
get a motion for.
Sorry.
Upervisor vega
.
>> Yesli Vega: I was going to
second.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I would like to get a motion
for 5a through 5I.
It has been properly moved and
seconded.
Any discussion on those items?
Supervisor bailey
?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
nevermind.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Let's go ahead and take a vote
for those items.
>> supervisor angry?
>> Victor Angry: aye.
Thank you sir.
Vote unanimous.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
The next item is 5j.
Can I get a motion to move it
forward?
It has been properly
moved and seconded.
Any discussion?
I'm sorry.
Supervisor vega, did you have
something
.
>> Yesli Vega: I did plan on
pulling this item myself.
i guess my questions are for
the county attorney since that
is what is lifted here on the
agenda.
I understand there are two
appeals and an additional 17
assessment property cases.
Is that correct?
>> MS. Roble: manager members
of the board, there are two
appeals currently before the
court of appeals and I believe
it is yes
.
17 real estate assessment cases
in the circuit court at this
time.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you.
And where do we come up with
the 400,000 number?
Is it an estimate based on
existing funds that have been
allocated for other lawsuits or
is there a specific breakdown
of this amount used for legal
fees?
>> MS. Roble: it's an estimate
going forward for the rest of
the fiscal year to defend the
boards actions.
The board voted to appeal the
one case and in discussions
with
our outside legal counsel.
It all depends.
There are many variables with
the court system whether the
court of appeals is going to
remand it back
.
But this is a guesstimate with
regards to litigation fees for
the rest of the fiscal year.
>> Yesli Vega: understood and
that is where my concern comes
from.
Understanding we still have
what seems to be a long road
ahead of us.
Would you be able to give me an
idea as to the amount that has
already been spent fighting the
digital gateway.
>> MS. Roble: I can get back to
you will not.
>> Yesli Vega: okay.
So we don't have that at the
moment.
Would offer this to
my colleagues that we are being
asked to appropriate $400,000
while still having 17
additional items that are soon
going to also probably more
than likely need additional
funding.
Nd at some point we
have done the tough
conversations where do we keep
going, which direction to be
taken where do we draw the line
in terms of how much are we
going to use tax dollars to
keep fighting these lawsuits.
I also want to know, I don't
know if this is questions for
you or somebody else.
I would like to know what the
reserve fund is.
>> MS. Roble: in discussion
with the finance department,
that fund is used whenever we
receive complaints or vials
against us, whether it's a
workers comp case, an
allegation of excessive use of
force by the police department.
That evolves from day to day,
claim to claim.
We can work with the county in
executive get you an estimate
of what it is.
It is very fluid.
It changes day-to-day based on
allegations against of the
county.
>> Yesli Vega: those are all
the questions I have.
> Deshundra Jefferson,
Mayor: I don't have so much any
questions.
I have made my stance on this
case clear and I just want to
be consistent.
So I will be voting no.
If there is no further
discussion let's go ahead and
take our vote.
>> supervisor angry.
Motion passes 5/3 supervisors
gordy, vega, and chair stewart
voting no.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
chair stewart?
>> George Stewart: thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I have been wheeler, I have
been stewart.
At least no one can say I don't
have a good sense of humor.
All right.
We are going to go to 5k.
Before we go to this one, so I
have had conversations with
manasses airport
, and they did
have some concerns about the
second part of this and
supporting a name change from
stafford regional airport of
washington executive-staff
regional airport.
I would like this but the
question.
I would like to go ahead and
ask for emotion.
Unless there's any discussion
or dissension, to approve the
amendment to stafford regional
airport authority agreement
extend the term of agreement to
FEBRUARY 28, 2070.
>> so moved.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
any discussion?
Let's go ahead and take a vote.
>> vote unanimous.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
We are now going to agenda item
number six and that is the
public comment time.
Before we go on to that, we are
going to have to take a vote to
support a name change for the
airport authority
, from
stafford regional airport to
washington executive-stafford
regional airport
.
I should ask andrea if this is
something we do not support
,
should I ask for us to deny it
or do we support it and go
ahead and vote it down.
We can defer it, but it's going
to be a date uncertain.
I know a lot of people are
uncomfortable with that.
>> I move to different us to a
date uncertain.
>> to be have a second.
>> Kenny Boddye: second.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
now that we have to defer this
to a date uncertain, supervisor
vega.
>> Yesli Vega: I would like to
know what the reason.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
so I had conversations with
some folks, my appointee and
others in the manassas regional
airport.
They are also looking to do a
change.
They had some feelings that
this might be trying to get
ahead of what they are looking
to do.
And it really is that piece
washington executive.
They felt that there might be
some confusion.
I have not had discussions with
anyone from stafford airport.
No one has come to me about
this
.
In speaking with manasses
airport they had concerns.
And I would like them time for
all of us to have a discussion
to have a discussion about
that
.
To learn what is going on with
the manasses airport.
Given the proximity of the
changes they are looking,
installing commercial service,
that's going to have a pretty
big impact, more significant
impact on our community.
That is why I would like to go
ahead and delay this.
>> Yesli Vega: I will let tom
elaborator expand.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor gordy.
>> Tom Gordy: both supervisor
vega and I intended in meeting
with the county executive
shorter and county executive
hugh yesterday.
That topic came up about their
name change as well
.
I think personally, before --
again, no one has come to speak
to me about this particular
issue.
But we have been speaking with
manasses airport officials and
I would like for us to get our
ducks in a row as it relates to
manasses airport.
And I think that will be coming
sooner rather than later.
On the once we have that, we
want to make sure that we get
everything right before we
paint ourselves into a corner.
With stafford.
That is my position and that is
why I am deferring at this
time.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Anyone else?
I appreciate it because I have
had the opportunity to go out
there and have discussions with
them.
I don't want to get into the
middle of this because we
haven't spoken to stafford
airport and there are a lot of
things happening literally in
our backyard or perhaps it's
better to say the little donut
hole within our county.
And so do we have more
information, yes.
I agree delaying this to a date
uncertain.
Any further discussion?
If not, let's go ahead and take
a vote.
>> thank you supervisor angry.
Vote unanimous.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
now we get the public comment
time.
I'm so excited and
enthusiastic.
I have a sheet.
We have a few people signed up.
I see some new names pick what
I'm going to do is I'm going to
call everyone up in groups of
five.
Please state your name and the
magisterial district where you
reside.
You don't need to give your
address unless you want us to
show up for lunch or dinner.
Up there you will see a screen
.
It's going to be a timer.
You three minutes.
I will call the first person.
I think it is leslie mayne,
carrie lee carrington, [Name]
,
susie more steam.
You may
begin.
>> Public Speaker: hello.
My name is lee soul and I live
in the occoquan district.
I am a musician and I play with
70 to 80 other musicians who
live throughout prince william
county.
The groups I'm in perform all
throughout prince william
county the gainesville all the
way down the woodbridge.
I would like to speak about
item 11 c, the motion to
dissolve the prince william
county arts council.
I'm deeply concerned that
action being taken is in haste.
I want to explain why the arts
council matters but not just to
me as a local musician but the
volunteer arts groups that
serve this county.
My first and most serious
concern is the lack of notice
and transparency.
According to the virginia
history, item 11 was added
DECEMBER 9, one week before the
meeting.
And I understand even members
of the
arts councils board were
blindsided by the proposal.
I played the -- in the prince
william county bound and it is
an all volunteer nonprofit
ensemble.
And I perform in a quintet
called the queen winds that
operate under the bands
umbrella.
The arts council supports
groups like ours.
Not just through funding access
but coordination, promotion,
partnership and institutional
knowledge.
For example, the arts council
help fertility rehearsal and
performance space including
discounted access to school
facilities and community venues
eliminating the arts council
without a clearly defined
operational replacement could
make concert programming more
difficult and costly for our
group.
It would also limit our ability
to provide free concerts for
the community.
My quintet has performed over
30 free concerts in the past
you three years in addition to
the 15 to 20 concerts the
principal them community band
has put on.
Who performed at senior
centers, assisted living
communities, churches, and
county community events
.
Want to our recent performances
at that community day was
facilitated directly by the
arts council.
These connections don't happen
automatically.
It happened because there's a
central county supported body
making them happen in arts
alive is another example.
This festival showcases
everyone from small volunteer
ensembles to large orchestras,
along with dance and visual
arts groups
from across the
county.
It takes months and months of
planning, and extensive
volunteer coordination.
The arts alive is a public
asset built through long
stewardship and turning it over
abruptly to private model risks
disrupting continuity and
eroding community trust.
Arts council is helping us plan
a woodwind workshop for middle
school and high school students
, and educational opportunity
that would not exist without
their coordination.
If improvements to the arts
councils are needed they need
to address the reform and not
sudden dissolution.
Hat needs
to be a viable in place.
>> Public Speaker: good
afternoon.
Thank you for allowing me the
opportunity to speak today.
My name is carol lee carrington
and I am the current elected
chair for the prince william
county arts council.
My roll has included being on
the arts council board for the
past eight years.
I am also the founder of in ceo
.
I want the state with the
utmost respect am disappointed
regarding the current proposal
for the dissolution of the arts
council.
Neither I nor the membership
were notified of this proposed
resolution.
The lack of engagement is
concerning, particularly as I
have sought the opportunities
to meet with county leaderships
and discuss the challenges
facing the arts council on
possible solutions.
Many of
the requests have gone
unanswered.
While the resolution asserts
the current arts council is
insufficient to advance the
arts grooming, I emphasize
dissolving the county arts
council would remove public
oversight, transparency, and
equitable access.
as a privately operated model
without county oversight
,
inherently risks excluding
artists, organizations, and
community members rely on the
fear and inclusive process of
the arts council.
The arts council currently
serve 69 members, which include
private artists as well as many
organizations.
And manages an approved budget
and support the growing arts
community.
These facts demonstrate not
failure but the need for
collaboration, guidance, and
the thoughtful reform.
Programs like arts alive have
long-standing value as a public
benefits and they deserve
stewardship that includes
accountability.
I respectfully urge the board
to pause the resolution and
engage directly with the arts
council leadership and its
members
.
Reform as possible, but it
needs to be done with the arts
community around it and not
excluding us from this process.
The dissolution of the arts
council at this time without
discussion or transparency
risks undermining the community
and the creative that we serve.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker, please
.
You MAY proceed
.
>> Public Speaker: MAY speak
now?
Good afternoon.
I'm debbie madsen
.
i am a former elementary
through high school music
teacher in prince william
county.
If you are sitting and can't
see me want to turn around,
that's okay because I'm used to
being at the front of the room.
Today we are dealing with the
possibility of the arts
council.
I have a
lot of friends in the
room today.
I'm sure you will heal various
things from various people.
My thought is I'm in agreement
with the first two speakers in
that this proposal appeared
very suddenly.
When I was working and was a
board member of the arts
council and the leader of one
hour small groups, if I wanted
to have a meeting I had to
announce it publicly a certain
amount of ahead of time so
anyone could attend the
discussion at those meetings.
As I was leaving the house to
date my husband who is also in
a band got an email this was
going to be brought up today.
My proposal is that you listen
carefully to all the people who
speak.
I think perhaps a pause is a
good idea.
I am the mother of a ballerina
so I know some of the ballet
stories
.
If you don't know the story of
sleeping beauty from having
been to the ballet, you MAY
have seen the movie as a child.
Sleeping beauty is supposed to
die when she parks her finger,
but I think in the ballet it's
the violet very arrives and
changes that to falling asleep.
I don't know if we can propose
a little more time to consider
what we are going to do with
sleeping beauty here.
I know your jobs are difficult
.
But I think you need to hear
from people.
He talked about the large
presence we have here today.
The bands, the choirs, the
orchestras, the dance
organizations, the arts
organizations, the people
putting on plays.
We could not fit them all in
this room door in that room nor
even throughout the building.
We are representing a lot of
people.
That is really all I have to
say.
Please think carefully about
this decision today and if
there is a way to postpone it
or get input or develop a small
group that can help and advice
you, perhaps that's a
possibility.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
before you leave say where you
reside because he didn't say
that at the top.
>> Public Speaker: and from
neabsco.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
and carol lee, if you can see
where you resign.
Masking karoly now if she can
go to the microphone.
She also didn't mention that.
>> Public Speaker: we are just
passionate and forgot where we
are from.
>> Public Speaker: I am
carefully parent carrington
from the gainesville district.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I've got to get better with
that.
That is one of my new year's
resolutions.
State your name and where
you're from.
>> Public Speaker: originally
from ohio but I have lived in
prince william county since
1980 and I live in the coles
district.
My name is susie.
I have been involved with
theater probably since I came
out of the
womb, or so my
mother has said.
When I moved to this county
there was not very much to do
when it came to theater.
A few friends of mine, we got
together and created prince
william theater.
As of OCTOBER we are 41 years
going.
Right from the very beginning
the government of the county
has at a grant system that has
supported us
.
Up until last year we still
continued to get great things
from the arts council we have a
lot of great programs we have
because of the grants we
received.
Now, I am here
because I'm a member and
director of prince william
little theater, but I also
speak on behalf of all of the
arts organizations.
I agree with the ladies who
spoke before me.
A little history.
There used to be an
organization called the
cultural arts federation.
And they are sort of what
grants were funneled through.
It worked very well for many
years and then we got up to
22
members, much less than what
we have now.
The park authority decided it
was best they take over the
granting and facilitate.
From that became the arts
council.
It has been a continuous thing.
I do hope as the young ladies
that spoke before me, because I
am the oldest person here, that
you take time to think about
it.
Artists are very special
people.
We think differently.
I am married to an attorney.
He has
the greatest left brain
I've ever seen but I am all
right brain.
We work together really well
.
I hope that you will listen to
some of these people who really
believe in what they do because
they are volunteers.
Prince william theater is a
total volunteer organization.
Most of these organizations of
people do them because they
love what they do and they
don't expect anything out of it
except some joy and to get back
joy.
Now I'm going to give you back
your 44 seconds.
Thank you very much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
I don't know is if.
[Name] Wanted to speak, but if
so -- okay.
All right.
I just didn't mark you.
Rob thompson, herb williams,
don
.
?
And season.
You MAY proceed.
>> Public Speaker: thank you
councilmembers for having us
here today.
My name is bob thompson.
I'm the current PRESIDENT Of
prince william little theater.
I work with susie almost on the
daily.
We are members of the board.
As you mentioned, prince little
theater is 41 years old and
growing strong.
We have been an original member
of the council going back 41
years.
The process of this again, I
disagree with the fact the
county came up suddenly.
I didn't know anything about it
being the PRESIDENT On the
board and the company that
people start calling me saying
to do know about this?
This is happening tomorrow.
Nd you get there and say
something?
I looked it up.
I have someone send me the
resolutions.
I'm surprised.
I know that there been problems
.
I've been to several arts
council meetings.
Having a very good standing
with them.
I did find there
were some issues and things
that can be worked out.
As a member of several boards
I've been a theater member for
30 years and I have been on the
corporate councils as a senior
arts director marketing person.
I know there are problems,
their communication
issues.
i don't know how far back this
goes with you all, but for us
to hear about it now is a
little except upsetting.
I might call for a delay so it
could be properly discussed so
that we the arts members can be
included in this
.
As I see it, it is almost a
done fact and I would like the
fact to be researched.
It would be very important.
I was told the money will keep
coming.
The grant money will still be
there and we will still get it.
My worry is when the council is
dissolved, what the process
going to be?
Form a new one, start from
scratch.
Know it comes from
the park authority and I
appreciate that.
I trusted them but I wonder if
this process has been thought
through enough as we depend a
lot on this money
.
As soon as you said we are
volunteers.
We are constantly begging for
sponsors
.
Anybody to come help us
overcome expenses and put on
the kind of art we like to put
forward to in the residence
outside.
On that point I feel, I would
like to call for a delay in a
discussion in a public basis is
amount to look into this and
avoid an arts meltdown in the
county.
Again, thank you for your time.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
what magisterial district are
you.
> Public Speaker: I knew
that was going to happen.
I live in manassas
but I am the
coles district.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker, please pick.
>> Public Speaker: I am season.
I need to switch because I have
a concert at 3:30 P.M. I live
in manassas but I have been a
prince william county teacher.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
what magisterial district.
>> Public Speaker: city of
manassas.
I am a board member on the arts
council.
I am also chair the arts and
education committee bringing
arts to the students and
students to the arts.
In fact, we friday group from
patriot high school coming into
art factory to do an art
gallery tour and an art
painting demonstration and they
can take if you will with an
artist from this area.
I would like to thank you for
your continued support for so
many years.
I have only been a member.
This is my fourth year once I
retired.
Masses and you are not doing
anything tuesday nights.
Why don't you go.
And I said yes.
I love the arts in expression
and ability to have for people
to just grow as human beings.
You get the many volunteers an
opportunity to serve and share
the arts in our community.
I would ask you listen
carefully to the speakers
today.
I've heard statements i
totally agree with about the
arts council.
I think we have room to grow
together, to work together as
the board, the arts council,
board of supervisors and anyone
that can help bring forward
what needs to happen in order
for the arts council to
continue.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
you can adjust it.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
herbert williams
.
I'm a resident of woodbridge.
Chair, members of the board and
on executives of the public.
Before I speak about the
resolution to dissolve the arts
council I need to speak clearly
and directly about myself
because decisions like this are
being made without the full
truth of what happened in my
name has been used without my
voice on numerous occasions
.
My name is herb williams.
Of
professional arts
administrator, educator and
performer with 35 years of
experience.
Accepted the roll of the arts
integration specialist in 2022.
Because I believe prince
william county is ready to
build an arts ecosystem that
was equitable, visible, and
intentional not symbolic.
I did not walk away lightly and
I did not walk away and
possibly
.
Walked away because remaining
would have required my silence
in the face of practices I knew
were wrong.
Early in my tenant and began to
encounter conditions that
obstructed the work was hired
to do.
Programs approved by my
immediate supervisor were later
removed without explanation.
Volunteer leaders and arts
council members were dismissed
,
talked down to, by two or
undermined.
Ethics to engage youth,
emerging artists, and
underrepresented communities
were slowed and discouraged.
I was repeatedly questioned for
taking initiatives all being
given no meaningful pathway to
advance the work
.
At the same time I was asked to
maintain the appearance of
progress.
In this moment I realize
something critical.
The issue
is not capacity, the issue was
not structure, the issue was
will.
I did not come in with what I
believe is a responsible county
employees should do.
I wasn't capable of doing in
that situation so I worked
around it.
I raised questions, reached out
to supervisors not to secure or
accuse anything, but to explain
.
I offered solutions grounded in
professional experience
.
I work beyond my paid hours ago
represented prince with them
county in regional spaces and
returned those resources
directly back to the arts
council because integrity
mattered to me
.
There were only two supervisors
I was able to have listened to
gain audience with the.
One by telephone, which was a
45 minute conversation with
supervisor bailey.
The next was supervisor angry
who sat with me on a sunday and
previously after that on a
saturday.
There comes a point public
service when you must decide
whether your roll is to comply
or protect the mission.
I was told directly by the
director, overseeing the arts
council that it was his hope
the arts council.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I apologize.
Our timer went down.
You have gone over the three
minutes but thank you.
I apologize
.
Thank you.
>> Public Speaker: good
afternoon MADAM Chair and
supervisors.
My name is don.
I live in the woodbridge
district.
I am elected on the arts
council the vice chair
programming, also the appointee
of occoquan district supervisor
boddye.
Today I speak on behalf of
myself and my position as
someone involved in the arts
and arts community with my own
business as well as a poet, a
writer and an author.
And I sat on the board for the
past two years.
I want to speak to the lack of
notice and transparency of the
request for the disillusion on
the agenda.
We were not notified
, nor is a
member of the arts council
.
Having to participate as vice
chair programming in any
meeting we have with a small
group or
council group or
changes, the notification
required with 3 to 5 days
business days notice we were
not given any type of notice
like that.
I want to speak to the lack of
communication with us as a
board regarding lawrence
council with whatever issues
have been going on to come to
the point of dissolution.
I do agree that there have been
several issues with arts
council, especially within the
past 4 to 6 months.
I never thought it would be
something we could not work
through, talked through and
come to some type of
resolution.
I would like to ask for a
weight, and delay in the
dissolving of the arts council
and see what we can do to bring
it together.
Roles and responsibilities need
to be better defined and take a
look at the charter as there
were mistakes and that.
For example, the one we had
still said tourism, but it was
being handled by the department
of parks and recreation.
I just want to request there be
a delay in the dissolution the
arts council.
The arts council serves a great
purpose in the community and
under working hard with the
member the arts council to
spread the word about the arts
council because so many
residents in prince william
county are not aware of the
arts council and the work they
do but they want to be
represented.
I had the opportunity to
participate in victor increase
community day.
I did a tent in the park to let
residents know about arts
council and it was wonderful.
So many people learned about
the arts council and I got to
give away all the -- to the
people in the community and
they wanted to know how they
could be a part.
It would be sad to see this go
and it was
something that is
definitely needed.
I think if we put our heads
together we can make it better
than it ever has been.
Thank you for your time.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
And I would like to have kelly
and jill.
>> Public Speaker: good
afternoon MADAM Chair.
My name is kelly and I am a
prince william county full-time
artist and ceo of minor
miracles, PRESIDENT Of art of
life charities, and all
volunteer prince william county
based nonprofit 501(C)(3),
current secretary in
brentsville district appointee
for supervisor gordy and I have
been volunteering with arts
council in several capacities
since 2019 and I've been in the
county and the brentsville
district since 1998.
I'm taken back as everyone
mentioned by the total lack of
transparency and communication
and plans
, especially plans
regarding a motion to dissolve
the arts council.
In less than two weeks from
today.
This is an important counsel
that has been around for
decades
the prince william county
strategic plan, which is
mentioned in this motion states
enhanced opportunities for
engagement and communication
between the public and county
government fostering dialogue,
feedback and follow-up to
promote the shared
trust,
understanding and transparency.
Including formalized response
time and metrics.
The arts council chair and
executive board were not
consulted at all.
The dissolution motion states
whereas the county arts
community is growing at a
fast-paced.
Or of the data and metrics
provided for the statement.
The motion also states existing
arts council is not conducive
for advancing arts programming
in education at the pace and
skill appropriate for a
community the size of prince
william.
Did you know each of the arts
council allocated $65,000 for
the entire programs and is
denied funding for proposed
ideas recommended by the arts
council.
Each of the unused money goes
back for whatever nonrelated,
non-art related projects but
the director feels should be
used for motion states greeting
an opportunity to explore a new
organizational
model to
accelerate the county strategic
plan goals.
Do you have a copy of the new
organizational plan model?
What part are you referring to
as you are accelerating by
dissolving the council.
The strategic plan innovate and
localize how the county
communicates, delivers, and
engages the dissolution of the
motion of the arts council
states transitioning all county
aren't events to a private
entity.
I could go on but I wanted to
say was recently voted as the
public arts task force person
as I been on a track to get
prompt public art in our county
for years since 2022, but I've
learned that can't happen until
we have a public art policy in
place.
We can't even a public art
until the policies in place,
which won't happen until the
earliest 2027 which doesn't
align with your strategic plan.
As county supervisors if you
don't have the answers to the
questions a more which I don't
have time to tell you about,
you cannot good faith but the
motion forward.
This motion should be denied
and that should be discussed
with arts council team and the
board and I wish director voss
and the team are here today to
address this important thing.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
jill and I'm the executive
director of the northern
virginia affordable housing
lien so thank you for the
opportunity to speak today show
support for item 11 which is
the resolution to
address
housing obtain ability fast
track measures.
As board of county supervisors
past housing chapter the comp
plan, just over three years ago
to date we know you been
working hard to address housing
of art ability by improving the
affordable dwelling unit
ordinance and the affordable
housing fund and the guidelines
to support that fund, which we
know where to best practices we
know this work has been patient
and slow and so I commend your
consideration to look at
additional methods to fast
track or green tape housing
projects that address housing
affordability.
Before initiatives ranging from
using land owned by faith
communities to access a really
living units to dining homes to
using county owned land to help
develop attainable housing.
We
are seeing this happen in
another jurisdiction so
appreciate prince william
county is taking a look at it.
Think it is a potential to
address housing affordability
issues in the county.
Thank you for the time.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
We don't have anyone signed up.
I ask everyone to make sure you
have a seat if you are going to
be in board chambers.
Not my role, fire marshal.
I am now going to go to promote
public comment time.
supervisor bailey.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you very much.
Are we ready to start?
!
Good afternoon.
Yes, we are.
Our first speaker will be MISS
Sarah.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
you can begin, please.
>> Public Speaker: I am sarah
and I reside in the brentsville
district.
I am a resident in my family
and I are fortunate to own a
home that backed up to the open
wooded space in the community.
The proposed dominion energy
blue line will destroy the land
in place powerlines incredibly
close to my private backyard.
Here to say, think that ask you
to insert your authority until
dominion energy that you would
not approved the easements for
the roof I blue line
transmission.
We need you to wait for
dominion energy to file with
the fcc in 2026 or it will be
too late.
70 percent of projects filed or
approved.
The best time to stockton is
before they are filed.
We know that you have said no
to dominion before.
In fact, that happen twice.
The board stopped dominion for
the carver road project and
horn baker proposed routes
forcing dominion to find the
other routes peer group 5 goes
through county protected open
space as well as ghostly
protective conservation area on
patriot high school.
Route 5 goes did the county
parkland.
this will destroy the areas
whether they are above or below
ground.
These would cause even more
devastation in place a line in
between a natural gas and oil
line, which is very dangerous
to give aboveground the towers
would cause approximately 30
percent lower property values,
as well as being extremely
close to our backyards.
Route 5 will be closed at
patriot high school and t clay
wood elementary school.
On the areas listed above under
the county jurisdiction
.
In order to move forward,
dominion needs you to grant
easements across these areas
along the route 5 blueline.
Us the board don't have to
grant these easements.
You can say no to dominion
route 5 blueline now.
Thank you very much.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
next speaker, please.
MS. Gardner, please begin.
>> Public Speaker: good
afternoon board, county
supervisors thank you for
allowing me to speak today.
Eitan katie gardner.
I live in the brentsville
district and I too am here to
talk about urging you to stop
dominion in the jeep proposed
blueline.
I speak with the perspective as
a mother of four and a proud
military wife
.
My family chose to live in
prince william county three
years ago when we moved here
after much research.
I have loved every moment of
living here in prince william
county.
I have lived all over the
country and I can say prince
william county to meet is the
closest and it's really great
and I love it so much
.
I feel like that vision is
about to shatter at the
proposed powerline route gets
approved.
The blue line 1. I'm really
worried about it even reaching
the ssc.
As many of spoken before behind
where I live is a bunch of
woods where my children spend
their entire summers.
They are often out exploring,
building, experiencing
childhood as it should be.
But this blueline will destroy
this natural habitat, eliminate
their safe outdoor space in but
hazardous, noisy, industrial I
sort right where they used to
play.
It will kill the wildlife,/are
property values and limit our
children's option for outdoor
play.
We cannot allow taxpayer
dollars to fund this expensive
extension cord for data centers
for the project prioritizes
temporary needs over the
long-term well-being of
citizens you represent.
I implore you to consider this
long-term impact on the
community.
Is another county plans on
extending the four your
assignment with the space for
us to try to live here longer
because we love it here so
much.
If the towers are built I see
no other option than moving
away once his assignment ends,
which absolutely breaks my
heart.
I recommended prince william
county to so many fellow
military families, and I
believe this is a great place
to live.
If corporate needs are deemed
more important than citizens, I
feel like I can no longer
represent this area.
Prince william county risks not
just losing my family but
damaging its reputation and
jeopardizing future military
connected schools enrollment
and funding.
We believe you have the power
to stop this before dominion
files we are desperate and
can't do it without you.
I urge you to vote no and
protect our community and
children in the high quality of
life that makes prince william
county so special.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> our next is david.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
please begin.
>> Public Speaker: david.
I also live in the bristow,
part of the brentsville
district.
I am here talking on the same
issue, the blue line.
I work from home several days a
week.
My window looks out on a
beautiful tree line the homes
behind me.
If dominion comes in, they are
going to destroy these trees
and destroy the habitat.
I walk, I run, my children walk
and run along the path into the
parkland
on the roadways here.
It will be ruined.
i get up in the morning, I see
deer and coyote, fox and
raccoon
.
We have endangered toads around
the area.
The blue line will destroy
that.
I'm concerned about my
neighbors
.
I am from california when I
went to high school and college
become seen the devastation
wildfires cause, but I see what
happens after the fact when the
vegetation and the trees are
gone, the homes on mountain
corridor on home hills and if
the trees are gone, what's
going to happen with the
weather roshan?
When I went to a dominion
valley meeting they said the
roots are still there.
Roots are biodegradable.
Those will go away at some
point.
My final thing I want to bring
up is we commended the first
responders in lakeridge with
the gas leak and I commend
them.
Hat is a dangerous,
scary situation.
What we are talking about here
could happen.
Think about it.
Dominion energy wants to put a
high intensity powerline right
between two highly flammable
gas lines what if the same
situation was to happen here in
bristow with all of these homes
with the schools in an ignition
system for flammable gas.
This is not safe for our
families and neighborhood.
I've been told dominion energy
will ask the recommendation of
the board of supervisors
, in
particular a representative for
the brentsville district.
For recommendation of which
line to take.
I don't like any of the lines I
know it affects everyone,
including my supervisor.
With the power to say no
.
You do have the
power to say no
or not recommend, not give them
easements.
We need you to not allow
dominion energy to move forward
.
I can only speak to the
blueline because of my concerns
about the effect on the
environment and the safety
issues that we have and again,
you commended first responders.
I don't want them down that
risk.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you.
Next speaker.
>> next speaker is steve.
>> Public Speaker: good
afternoon board members
.
I'm steve from the occoquan
district.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
could you speak louder.
>> Public Speaker: how is
that?
My remarks this afternoon are
going to address item 7-a
,
dumped local foundation and
soil management ordinance
countywide.
Why is the board considering
the tax payer money to support
private and commercial
foundation repairs?
Es, i
understand the state has passed
the bill in the governor signed
it this year.
This initiative needs to not be
supported.
The majority party in the board
of county supervisors has been
touting housing affordability
for the past 2+ years.
Now with the
passage of the
board, if it is passed today
,
property owners would be tasked
more the fund an additional
initiative.
This foundation repair
initiative.
This initiative counters the
majority housing affordability
awareness because property
owners are going to be taxed
significantly more to fund this
initiative.
Foundation repair companies
have financed vehicles on
property owners to have their
repairs funded.
I'm familiar with this as I
recently had foundation repairs
completed on our home
.
Now the board is going to be a
financial institute to fund
private commercial foundation
repairs.
Ome will have to
manage this program.
Now the county would have to
add more fte in the future
budget to which is a permanent
cost because they're going to
have to be tax on property
owners to pay for the new fte
and their
perpetual benefits.
My additional concerns are why
should the prince william
county government take on the
roll to be responsible for
repairing the private and
community commercial property
in the county.
We can say no.
Is this grant free money or
loan interest to grant loan.
How and what accountability
safeguards will be established
to ensure fairness,
transparency, accuracy and
inspection reports?
His is
the draft ordinance and there
is nothing in there about
accountability and how to keep
people accountable.
Foundation repairs are the
responsibility of the
homeowners.
Developers and insurance
companies
.
Not in prince william county.
I urge you to vote no and item
7-8.
I know this ordinance has been
brought up three times in 2025
before the board.
And so I urge you to vote no on
this thank you.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you.
Next speaker.
>> there are no more speakers.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you very much for your
help.
MADAM Chair, back to you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
That is our public comment
time.
We are now going to go to
agenda item 7. And that is
public hearings.
I am just waiting for the list.
All right.
I'm going to open the public
hearing.
We do not have any
speakers in person.
Do we have
anyone online.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
we have two people, so I see.
>> MADAM Vice chair, we have
nobody online at this time.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you so much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
leave no one in person, no one
online.
I'm going to close the public
hearings suit 478 through I.
Going to separate out 7a
because I know there will be
robust discussion and I will
take that at the end.
Does anyone have anything else
they want me to separate?
>> is the public hearing
closed?
I did not hear.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
it is closed.
>> I'm sorry.
There is one person online to
talk if you can still do so.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I will open the public hearing
to accommodate the gentleman
available online to speak.
>> I can't hear, they are
muted.
Hold on one second.
Is he
allowed to speak?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
he is.
>> go ahead.
>> Public Speaker: can you hear
me okay?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair: I
can.
Thank you.
>> Public Speaker: for a second
I thought I was going to be cut
off.
I am jack from the woodbridge
magisterial district.
thank you for the opportunity
to speak today.
I appreciate the board of
county supervisors and the
county staff efforts to advance
the ordinance to establish the
soil.
It is a meaningful and
necessary step to help our
community and others across the
county address urgent soil and
stability concerns.
If the
conditions in our community and
left it will continue to
worsen.
We have seen this
before.
The last time a similar
situation occurred, the slope
failed and was ultimately
condemned.
According to a standard, this
is not an isolated incident.
There have been three slope
failures
.
At first occurred in 1996 to
repair the damage hoa nor the
county was able to verify the
work was actually completed.
A second failure occurred in
2007 adjacent to the original
area and we are facing another
failure in the same location
first impacted in 1996
.
At the boards meeting we had
concerns about the use of
public funds for what were
described as private issues
become respectfully offer
another perspective.
Homeowners relying good faith
by that oversight approval
process which reviewed soils
reports, inspection and issues
certificates of occupancy
.
Residents were not in a
position to evaluate the
complex geotechnical decisions
or verify whether properly
repaired instability issue.
That reliance is fundamental to
the partnership between the
county developers, and the
county developers and the
communities they serve.
Current conditions inadequate
compaction are not do --
further these efficiencies are
causing erosion and
uncontrolled runoff,
threatening the watershed,
public safety, in the broader
community individual properties
.
For these reasons we believe
the public investment in slope
stabilization remediation
watershed protection is not
only appropriate but necessary.
We respectfully ask the board
to consider modifications
,
structured the fund to accept
contributions from grants or
other mitigation programs and
allow for multiyear grants
within annual funding cap
.
We thank you and appreciate
your leadership for
recommendation, recognition of
challenges are not private
feathers but the result of
processes that did not fully
protect our community and a
developer who failed to
properly prepare a known issue.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you.
>> we have no speakers this
time.
Apologize.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
no apologies necessary.
Thank you for your help.
MADAM Chair, back to you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
going to close the public
hearings for 7a through 7I.
What I'm going to do because I
know 7a will have additional
discussion
.
I'm going to pull that off and
we can get that to the end.
Does anyone else on the dais
have anything they want to pull
off?
Supervisor bailey.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
MADAM Chair, I would like to
poll item 7g.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
is this something you're going
to vote against her highlight
you have questions?
All right.
I would like to get the motion
for 7b through f and 7h and I.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
moment.
>> Kenny Boddye: second.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
any discussions just on those
items?
If not, let's go ahead and take
a vote.
>> supervisor angry?
> Victor Angry: aye.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
>> the unanimous.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I'm going to go back to 7a.
First, does anyone have any
questions
?
All right.
Supervisor vega, you've
questions?
>> Yesli Vega: yes.
I'm not sure if ricky or who is
going to answer questions.
>> if I can't get it right we
will get one of the others.
>> Yesli Vega: while i
understand the reasoning behind
the request before us, I have a
sick concerns.
Raised those concerns from the
beginning.
Appreciate staff working to
answer some of my questions.
Not all of them because this is
very much fluid and while I
still don't believe it's ready
for prime time, we are here
today.
The first question I want to
ask is does the county regulate
soil for soil suitability or
geotechnical standards in
land-use approvals?
>> yes, it is the short answer.
I can give you more background
if you want a more technical
answer.
>> Yesli Vega: I do.
Thank you.
>> MADAM Term, members the
board, director of public
works.
Yes, it's always required
.
>> Yesli Vega:
what does not
consist of?
I want you to elaborate more.
>> no sole conditions, the
stability of slopes
, the water
table of the soils
, all of that
is important for the design the
retaining wall
.
Those are very important
information.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you.
And since when has the county
been practicing this?
>> 2003.
>> Yesli Vega: 2003.
What criteria specifically,
refresh my memory again, was
refused used for arbitrary
decision in terms of what homes
qualify for this?
> you mean as far as the
ordinance?
We are still working on that
but we are looking at impact of
foundation, impact to slopes
that MAY impact other
structures such as rodents,
such as a stream, other
development MAY be.
Those other criteria is to make
decisions.
>> Yesli Vega: I am referring
to the decision made that the
eligibility is for homes built
between 10 and 40 years old.
You said you are still
developing it?
>> the timeframe of when we
consider evaluating proposals
.
Is that when you are saying?
10 to 40 years.
>> supervisor, thank you for
the question.
As I recall at the last hearing
there were questions relative
to what data we have in
relation to this
.
After the board meeting went
went back and went back 10
years and over the 10 year
period we had 74 foundation
repairs done across all in the
county.
An average of 70 year
.
The average age was 37.1 years
for the justification to go to
40 what we are talking about is
latent defects and who would be
responsible or who would help
.
Based on the ad hoc data, the
conclusion was over 10 years
the average age is 37 years
.
It would be appropriate to go
10 to 40 years
.
That is how we got to the 40
compared to our previous
recommendation was I believe 10
to 20.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you for
that.
You said in terms of
responsibility for repairing
your position is here today
that the county bears
responsibility assisting
homeowners
.
>> I would say that's your
decision.
>> Yesli Vega: staff is
recommending approval so
masking staff if that is the
recommendation, is that your
position?
>> the position is we have a
state law in place to allow you
to make the decision to adopt
an ordinance.
>> Yesli Vega: correct.
And it is a recommendation and
that is the reason for my
question.
>> MS.
Roble: I don't think
anybody is saying the county is
responsible for defects out
there.
Think what staff is
recommending is the general
assembly allowed the state code
is a discretionary alternative
for the board to do and if that
is the boards prerogative to go
forward with it.
I don't think anyone on the
staff is saying the county is
responsible for any issues
involved in these properties.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you MADAM
Chair and I understand what the
general assembly passed.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
would you like your next block
of time?
>> Yesli Vega: yes.
However, it is my position we
are being guided in a certain
direction and I want to make
sure we don't blur the lines we
are clear as to what the board
make it ready to approve
.
As you all know, I conducted a
survey because it's important
for me to understand where
people in prince william county
are not just in the coles
district.
My position doesn't stem in
being in opposition to this
initiative being moved forward
because I understand the
intent.
Prevention, offer this to my
colleagues and those in
chambers and watching at home,
is in fact a public response
ability, which is why I lead
with opening question I did.
However, fixing private
property matters is a private
one and that is the issue I
take with this.
I believe this is a private
matter among the journalism we
granted localities the ability
to enact an ordinance, I do not
believe it's in the best
interest of the county to use
tax dollars to pay for
private
matters.
It gets muddy quickly in
regards to where do we draw the
line.
I would then going to be
subsidizing roof replacements,
hvac repairs, who knows her
driveway cracking weeks.
If the argument is made into
steam to be structural.
I want to offer to my
colleagues that when we were
going to distribution with the
great oak community, a request
was made that the county pay
and purchase equipment to
measure noise and it was
quickly shut down because of
the precedent it would set.
I asked my colleagues, are we
going to open the door for a
similar matter if we deemed it
is not appropriate then, how do
we justify an issue that is
clearly been pushed on county
residents by decisions made by
the governing body.
Ot
appropriate then, appropriate
now.
For those main reasons I would
ask perhaps we table this
matter for a later time born we
can flat out in my opinion
denied the request altogether.
Don't think it is
appropriate for the county to
be using public dollars to fix
what in my opinion is a private
matter.
I think the approach we need to
take is an approach where we
are working with the developers
and we are holding them
accountable to ensure the
problems don't continue to
happen.
F they do, they paid
their fair share of the pie in
addressing these concerns and
paying for these repairs down
the road.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
are you asking for a suggestion
you would like him to make a
motion to defer this or table
this?
What is it you are asking for.
>> Yesli Vega: I am willing to
meet halfway.
I don't mind tabling it so we
can infer their discussions and
make sure we tie up loose ends
.
But if that is not something
agreeable, I would certainly
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
make the motion and let's see
if you get a second.
>> Yesli Vega: I move that we
table this matter, MADAM Chair.
>> second.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
any discussion?
Supervisor franklin.
>> Margaret Angela Franklin:
want to clarify we have
differed this before.
We would been working on the
several years and I am not in
favor of differing.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega.
>> Yesli Vega: the
reason for
the deferral was it was not
ready for prime time.
My position as it is still not
and I would ask the majority of
my colleagues to support my
motion to table this.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor bailey?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair: I
just need clarification because
we talked about this over and
over again before we take the
vote.
I want to make sure we clearly
understand what this is this is
alignment with the state code
that has been put forth that we
are trying to achieve
.
We are not voting to say we are
actually going to make a final
decision on this matter
.
Can you explain it?
>> I don't know that part you
just said.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
let me rephrase my question.
>> we
were given a directive to
look at the new state code that
was passed.
We were given a directive to
propose an ordinance for prince
william county to use.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
that's the alignment.
And going forward, what are you
asking for now?
>> we have now brought the
ordinance forward.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
for the alignment.
But it does not say we are
going to take care of
everybody's property if we vote
on this today
.
>> the application process and
scoring criteria and then those
applications will come to the
board and the board would vote
on who was funded and who
wasn't.
Was available to be used.
>> MR. Shorter: the board is
voting on an ordinance today
.
Later on in the agenda
depending on how the board
reacts to this ordinance
,
request to transfer funding to
a fund.
Now, what would come after is
an application process where
individual homeowners will
essentially apply
.
We won't based on this
ordinance will come to the
board when it's time to make a
decision but the action the
board is taking right now is an
ordinance.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
so this is the final.
Supervisor vega, did you have
something you want to say?
There is a motion but I don't
know if you want to speak on
that.
Is anyone else have comments or
discussions?
If not I will take the vote on
a motion to table the
discussion.
I would like to call for the
vote.
This is to table it.
Supervisor vega and gordy.
>> supervisor ingrid just told
me his computer is shutting
down automatically so he MAY
have to log back on.
He MAY MISS This vote.
>> somewhere, is absent from
vote.
Motion fails 2/5 supervisors
bailey, boddye, franklin,
stewart enter jefferson know.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
so the motion to table has
failed.
When someone like to make a
motion to move this forward?
Properly moved and seconded.
Any further discussion?
>> Yesli Vega: I want to enter
into the record with 300 people
partake in our survey from
every single magisterial
district and everyone who
partook overwhelmingly opposes
their private tax dollars being
used for the private measure
and I want to let my colleagues
know what that looks like.
Young people participated from
neabsco, occoquan, potomac and
woodbridge.
We did the purple listed.
Those were folks who did not
want to share but again
, it's
our response ability to make
sure we put forward good public
policy and although the general
assembly MAY have allowed them
to do that, I don't think it's
in the best interest of the
taxpayers of the county and
when we get to the allocating
of the funds I will be
discussing more about that in
my reasons for that as well.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisors franklin and gordy.
Ll right.
Supervisor gordy.
>> Tom Gordy: thank you
supervisor vega.
I completely agree.
Had a
meeting with the community last
night about roads and about
their private road failing.
Are we going to open up the
door for communities and paving
private roads.
Because when the roads were
built the rules the county had
the time were different than
they are today.
Is not just the roads, the
culverts underneath the road to
failing think that's a health
and safety issue.
In the fire
and police get into
those community?
I think we are opening up
pandora's box and this is going
to be something we are going
I'm more and more people come
in because of things, we learn
things over time.
But I will tell you when I
moved to prince william county
my realtor said stay away from
the potomac.
This has been known for 30, 40
years.
No, those soils
.
the water is good.
The soils below the fall line
,
you get above the fall line a
lot of rock, below this a lotta
sentiment
.
That is why it moves and it
shifts.
Nonetheless, the fact we are
going to offer government funds
, I believe we are opening up
pandora's box here and I don't
think that is the right
direction we ought to be going
so I will not be supporting
this.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I don't have anything else in q
so let's go ahead and take our
vote.
>> motion passes 4/3
supervisors gordy, stewart and
vega voting no.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much
.
We are going to go back to 7g.
You'd questions?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you so much for
acknowledging me.
I just have a quick question.
It's because I didn't talk
about this when the
presentation was given to me.
I'm excited about this and I
will move forward with the
vote.
Want to make sure as we are
establishing and building this
drive through, this will not
interfere with the traffic flow
we've been talking about as it
relates to the school,
forest
park.
Business nothing to do with the
interest we are working on as
well.
>> supervisor bailey, chair
jefferson, we did work with the
applicant and did look at
potential traffic impacts.
All of them are being mitigated
through the conditions or the
route that they chose to the
development.
We are confident and should not
impact any of the development.
Outside of the flow.
But we just looked primarily at
the special use permit area.
They did provide conditions.
We worked with the applicant
and the applicants
representative we are
comfortable with the
conditions.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
okay.
I appreciate that.
With that I would like to move
forward item 7g.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
properly moved and seconded.
Any further discussion?
Seeing none, let's go ahead and
take the vote supervisor angry,
are you backup?
>> he is not back online yet.
Vote unanimous supervisor angry
absent from vote.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
We are now moving to agenda
item 8 and that is county
executive time.
MR. Shorter, the floor is yours
.
>> MR. Shorter: thank you MADAM
Chair.
Good afternoon.
I want to start cxo time off
with a brief demo because many
of you know, our office of
planning
, wanted to invite
director washington down to
talk about this
.
They did a very creative job
building an online dashboard
for a buildout analysis
.
I wanted to have her demo day
analysis to show the board and
the public what sort of work is
happening in the planning
office and so with that, I will
turn it over to you.
>> good afternoon.
Tonya washington director of
the planning office.
We are excited to be here to
provide the demo of the
buildout analysis.
The updated up analysis.
The analysis estimates how much
residential and nonresidential
development could be built
under the maximum extent
allowed under zoning program
one of the exciting things
about this analysis is not only
do we have updated data from
the last time we completed the
buildout analysis in 2021.
It is now in an online
dashboard format.
Previously reports were done
annually as written reports
with illustrations and tables,
but they were a snapshot in
time.
In preparation during this
update I asked our team can we
turn this into a dashboard so
when the import approves new
land use cases or other items
are updated that affects this
data, the data can be updated
throughout the year.
Until we know fully online
dashboard
.
It is very interactive with
data tables as well as maps MR.
David Mcgettigan, our deputy
planning director, will walk us
through the demo.
But before we do that I would
like to give a shout out and
appreciation to
john Mccleary
and frank on on our gis team
which is part our countywide
division they are here to
answer any questions as well.
S well as a shout out if you
worked with us to build out the
buildout analysis dashboard.
So take it away, david.
>> thank you.
Are buildout analysis is a
publication that we have done
for many years
.
It was a pdf document for a
colorful static and this is an
opportunity to bring it into a
more interactive format where
we can get to interactive maps
and download data.
It is also a lot of automation
and programming went into
maintaining this thanks to
frank hunt of our office
.
This is much easier to update
and we will be updating on a
regular basis when zonings are
approved.
And when existing units
occupancy permits are reported
out so we can update the
existing construction.
This is the main page.
You can get to it from the
planning page.
It also has its own url.
Pwc va.Gov/buildout analysis
and that will get you to a
page.
This was done in the gis
platform
.
First on the right sleeve
several things that tell us
what the buildout analysis is.
How you use the site,
frequently asked questions we
will buildout as we get the
questions in.
And we encourage the public and
everybody who uses this to let
us know if there any questions
or anything that needs fixing
or tweaking more additional
things he want to see.
The first use of the product we
hope to expand it to attract
when things in later phases a
development.
Is an email address to submit
any comments about the buildout
analysis
.
The buildout analysis is in
three buckets degree of the
existing information
, existing
dwellings construction.
We have the zone but not built
yet.
This is something that has
zoning approval.
We know how many units are
approximately how many square
feet going in for commercial or
retail industrial uses
.
This is a list of cases and we
call the residential inventory,
nonresidential inventory.
That is the zone but not built
yet.
The third bucket is those plan
but not zoned yet.
The conference of plan as a
guide for the growth and
development and as areas for
redevelopment or new
development that has been zoned
yet to the appropriate zoning.
Hose are the three buckets.
If something gets rezoned from
bucket one, the pelanda not
zoned.
it automatically is going to be
, show up in the zone but not
built on them once it was built
it would be quarterly updated
with that information.
We can see off the bat that
there is 160,000, 100 existing
dwelling units in the county
right now based on our
occupancy reports.
There are you potential
remaining to be built based on
the conference a plan for
54,542 more units
.
In terms of nonresidential
square feet of building area,
we are 92.8 million square feet
in the potential buildout of
the conference a plan is 148.8
million square feet.
That doesn't mean that by 2040
we will have all of this but
this is just the total capacity
shown that could be built.
There's no timing associated
with this from that standpoint.
The buildout analysis also has
charts and graphs to show you
percentages of the different
types of lands that make up the
build analysis and pipeline and
buildout capacity.
We also have as well we have an
interactive map that have
polygons of these in this data
is available in the county
portal, data portal for use so
gis users could download the
data if they wanted to read it
and manipulate it.
We can zoom in on the map and
click on activity center areas
are there different layers you
can turn on and off from
activity centers to residential
inventory cases where things
have been zoned or are not
built are currently have things
to be built on.
as a table
.
It can be exported to an excel
spreadsheet has information not
only of the zoning district,
the number units approved, how
many are built so far, how many
are remaining to be built.
This is useful to developers
and others to find out where
our land is that they could
maybe purchase and develop or
already have the zoning
available or to rezone.
By being able to download this
you can filter and sort it and
summarize.
You can sort by magisterial
district and look up the case
number so if you wanted to find
out more you could go to the
county look at that particular
case.
And with that I would be happy
to answer any questions.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega.
>> Yesli Vega: first off, I
think this is great.
I was thinking about issuing a
directed so directive avoided
picketing want to ask him
appointed the numbers regards
to cog projections
.
I know at one point a big push,
if you will
, for not just the
affordable housing component
for housing in general was
driven by those numbers so
where are we in regards to the
numbers and where we are today?
>> in relation to
, our
capacity.
A relationship to the capacity
of the county conference and
plan to accommodate our growth,
we can accommodate the growth
to 2050 based on the projected
growth.
Out to 2050.
That's maybe the extent of the
relationship.
The cog projections were
recently updated.
They give a timeframe when our
growth is in that is not in
relation to the buildout.
Buildout does guide our
distribution a distribution in
the cog model used for
transportation modeling and air
quality monitoring and the
kinds of planning
exercises
including regional water supply
.
So there are many uses for the
cog data and this is something
that helps us develop and
refine and where the growth is
going to go in the model.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you for
that.
I've been playing around
with it and I'm looking at the
nonresidential inventory
summary.
Do we have an interactive map
specific to data centers in the
county?
>> no, but that is a phase 2 we
can look at adding to the
buildout analysis to show where
data centers are and I know
that we are working on those
.
>> Yesli Vega: great.
Another directive avoided.
Can you talk to me about the
timing of the phase 2
interactive map for data
centers only in the county?
>> that is an effort that
requires coordination with
other departments such as
development services, which
again for the planning office
we handle the entitlements.
When it comes to building
permits and what have you, that
development services and so
there are already conversations
underway working with deputy
county executive and other
departments toward producing an
interactive map that includes
all the datacenter related data
that we have.
>> Yesli Vega: we don't have a
range in terms of timing?
>> we would have to get back to
you on that.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor gordy?
>> Tom Gordy: I also just
applied for the tool.
I've been playing around with
it for the past few weeks
looking into it and trying to
manipulate the numbers to
understand at least from the
brentsville district
perspective of what the
potential is in taking a look
at the 10 acre lots and trying
to understand how many of those
could get built.
Looking how we can leverage it
for calculations trying to
understand within a certain
area what is the buildout
potential for that.
I've been enjoying learning how
to use the tool and I got to
spend more time on it.
The one thing I want to go back
to his affordable housing.
In each and every one of our
developments
, most of them have
affordable units that are part
of it that become entitled.
Are you including in phase 2
helping us track the number of
affordable units that were
approved in part of the process
in sort helping us track
working toward meeting that
goal because that is going back
to cog and we set a target and
then how are we doing to meet
that target.
Will that be embedded in this
as well?
>> that is something we are
considering and have been
discussions of the housing
office.
In fact, we had a training this
morning on the affordable
dwelling unit ornaments let all
three of our departments
provided that training because
we all play different roles
implementing that ordinance and
as a part of that using that as
a way to get our ducks in a row
to be able to track the
different ways that the county
gets affordable housing units.
We track it through the
entitlements we have that data
,
looking at the other mechanisms
through pyrite projects
.
That is something that again we
have already been discussing
the buildout analysis and their
other venues with the county is
asked to provide the data so we
would be looking at how we can
but the tracking mechanisms in
place so we can track the
various ways we could get units
moving forward that.
Which ones are committed
affordable units because that's
another distinction which one
state affordable so we can
continue to track it and to
figure out a buildout analysis
and/or other venues where we
can provide that data so we can
be transparent.
>> Tom Gordy: okay.
On my last question.
and this MAY be efface three,
but as we update -- don't get
too excited, christina.
As we
update the targeted industries
list and we start looking at
the types of zonings sort of
having an overlay to know
what's available for the
targeted industries and pulling
all that together is a tool to
help us as we are talking but
we know we have x amount of
acres for this type of
industry, this type of zoning
in order to meet that need of
whatever the target industry is
.
I think that would be a great
benefit.
But looking out more of a phase
3 approach.
Hat is all I
have.
Thank you.
> Deshundra Jefferson,
Mayor: thank you so very much.
Supervisor bailey?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you MADAM Chair.
This is great.
Excellent news
.
It also enables us to create
vision.
You get together ANDb& create
vision for the future for our
county.
The question I had was about by
right
.
Does this help us better assess
or predict the by right pieces
of property we have?
That is always an opportunity
for us.
>> thank you for the question
supervisor bailey.
The residential inventory is a
list of everything zoned and
not built.
And has been zoned.
It already has the ability to
develop however many units or
square feet through the zoning
process already
.
It becomes the entitlement for
the piece of property.
You can look at each rezoning
case, how many units are left
on see what the by right number
is for all the re-zonings that
can be developed by right.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
and will that be compatible
with the datacenter information
supervisor vega asked you
about?
Unthought be integrated and
that also?
>> there's a non-inventory and
how many square feet
are left to
be developed on the cases so we
can look at now what can be
developed.
The data centers in and lots of
different districts, but other
uses can use the tool to look
for land zoned appropriately
for their use.
When you look up an individual
case you will be able to tell
what the datacenter is and if
it is a datacenter or if it is
not associated with any
datacenter.
You could tell that from
looking up for a majority of
the cases listed in the
nonresidential inventory.
Some cases are blanket
industrial zonings done in 19
video when they created the
zoning map.
Most types it uses.
E are not
going to know other than the
total floor area ratio and
therefore the square footage
.
As far as a use, it can be any
use in the zoning district.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye thank you
MISS Washington.
Thank you for putting this
together.
I have also been someone asking
about the buildout analysis for
a while.
Temperature the
conversation
about there being future phases
.
I was playing with that earlier
and are going to say this right
now.
In the potomac mills activity
center is a dwelling potential
of 6300 units.
That makes me excited and I'm
sure it makes christina excited
too.
My actual question is
.
David, you probably remember
this when we adopted the
comprehensive plan we allowed
to there to be some residential
allowed in the office mixed
use.
However, as I look at it right
now in the office mixed use
countywide figuring out a
dwelling unit potential is zero
and so could you talk about how
that drives knowing we added
residential allowances in
there?
>> I believe it was a small
percentage
.
We wanted to be consistent and
so with the conference and
plan.
That is something we can go
back and look at and see if we
should assume some residential
growth.
But again, it was a smaller
percentage of that particular
designation but we can go back
and look at that thank you so
much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I don't have anyone else in
queue.
It is fun to geek out and play
around because there is so much
data at your fingertips.
It looks really good.
It looks very, very good so
thank you.
>> MR. Shorter: thank you MADAM
Chair and thank you director
washington.
Thank you all for the great
work.
To directives issued last week
when we were together staff is
directed to research, review,
and evaluate the positions of
the state code section which
allows for the creation of
local economic revitalization
zones in the section that
provides impartial tax
exemption for properties in the
designated redevelopment
conservation areas where
rehabilitation districts all
with the purpose of providing
recommendations on the
establishment of a local
economic development
revitalization zone ordinance
this directive was assigned to
the department of economic
element and tourism.
Staff is directed to bring a
resolution to the board to
dissolve the arts council,
which we did today.
That resolution -- that
directive was assigned to the
department of parks and
recreation.
And it will be closed today
given the agenda.
There were no directives closed
during the week between last
meeting in this meeting
.
MADAM Chair, I wanted to take a
moment if I can commit to
recognize michelle.
She is retiring this month.
She served as the director of
public safety communications
and has served this community
for 36 years.
I want to recognize her,
thinker to hers for her service
overseeing us through a
generation here
.
All kinds of technological
changes and other changes in
the county when she has been
here.
She is the voice behind the
voiceless.
Those who call 9-1-1. I would
like to take a moment because
this is his last meeting with
prince william county.
I would like to recognize our
deputy county executive dan
alexander.
Dan has been appointed to be
the next city manager for the
city of fairfax
.
We are going to MISS Him here.
Appreciate his service and
work.
It's been a pioneer in that he
served as the first deputy
county executive on the safe
and secure community quadrant.
So dan, thank you.
Thank you for all you have done
for the county.
[Applause]
And I want to make sure that I
recognize
.
If there's anything else.
All right.
Well
, finally I want to make
sure I think in recognize steve
austin.
Steve has come out of
retirement to serve as acting
deputy county executive for
safe and secure community while
we search when he has served in
this community for a
significant amount of time.
I personally called to ask him
to come back and appreciate he
has taken the opportunity to
come back and serve the
community so thank you so much
.
And with that I will close,
MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you and let's move to
agenda item number nine and
that is county attorney time.
MADAM Attorney, the floor if
you are.
> MR. Shorter: thank you met
interpret this afternoon we
will have several items for the
first is consultation with
legal counsel and briefings by
staff members pertaining to the
discussion or consideration of
the disposition a publicly held
real property along with the
consultation with legal counsel
and briefings by staff members
regarding specific legal
matters requiring the provision
of legal advice by such counsel
pertaining to land-use and
electric energy
, electric power
regulatory law to include legal
advice on proposed energy
projects including but not
limited to the dominion energy
nokesville to bristow 230
project on the more smoke
wishing star 532 project were
such consultation, discussion
our briefing would adversely
affect the bargaining position,
negotiate a strategy,
litigating posture of the
public body we will
consultation with legal
counsel, briefings pertaining
to the discussion concerning an
economic develop an item
regarding an expansion of an
existing business or industry
were no previous announcement
has been made on the business
or industries interest in
expending the facilities and
the county along with the
related discussion or
consideration of the investment
of public funds for economic
development matters where
competition in bargaining is
involved with made public
initially financial interest of
the county would be adversely
affected along with the
discussion or consideration of
disposition a publicly held
real property.
All where discussion in an open
meeting would adversely affect
the litigating posture,
bargaining position, or
negotiating strategy the public
body.
We will consultation with legal
stuff counsel and briefings by
staff members containing to an
economic develop an item
regarding the discussion or
consideration of the investment
of public funds for an economic
development matter where
competition or bargaining is
involved where it made public
initially the financial
interest of the county would be
adversely affected, along with
a discussion and consideration
of the disposition a publicly
held real property.
All where discussion in an open
meeting would adversely affect
the bargaining position,
litigating posture, and
negotiating strategy the public
body.
Consultation with the ghost
counsel and briefings by staff
members pertaining to the
discussion concerning an
economic development item
regarding an expansion of the
existing business or industry
were no previous announcement
has been made if the business
or industry interest in
extending the facilities in the
county.
Along with the related
discussion or consideration of
the investment of public funds
for economic development
matters where competition or
bargaining is involved were
initially made public the
financial interest of the
county would be adversely
affected, all where discussion
in an open meeting would
adversely affect the litigating
posture and bargaining position
in negotiating strategy the
public body
.
Finally, personnel discussions
and considerations relating to
the hiring of an interactive it
off as a human resources were
consultation, briefing or
discussion in an open meeting
would adversely affect the
bargaining position, letting an
imposter, or negotiating
strategy of the public body.
These items are pretty close
session presented 2.2-3711 a1,
three, five, six and eight of
the code of virginia.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
hold on.
Supervisor gordy.
> Tom Gordy: before the
board votes on the racing and
holds the closed meeting a need
to declare personal interest
regarding the dominion energy
nokesville to bristow 230
kilowatts electric transmission
project but my home is located
in the vicinity of the project
study area.
S property owners
in proximity to the project
study area my wife and I are
members of a group which is
affected by the matter.
I will be participating in the
matter because I am able to do
so fairly, objectively, and in
the public interest.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
We have a motion.
> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
move for approval.
>> Kenny Boddye: second.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
let's go ahead and take our
vote.
>> Victor Angry: aye.
>> thank you supervisor angry.
Vote unanimous.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Ding, victor.
I appreciate you for staying in
their.
We are going to go to MR.
Shorter for agency time.
>> MR. Shorter: with item 10 a
we just talked about it as we
adopted
, the board adopted the
ordinance for local foundation
and soul management earlier in
the meeting.
This is the transfer budget and
appropriate item and we are
asking for the board
consideration.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
are there any further questions
for staff?
If not I would like to get a
motion to move 10a forward.
Properly moved and seconded.
Any further discussion around
this?
>> Yesli Vega: thank you MADAM
Chair.
I want to reiterate the staff
report explicitly states
recurring costs for the
foundation until management
fund that will need to be
included in the budget are
unknown at this time also, the
report warns analyze programs
cause will be driven by
community interest in the
program which could
significantly be more than the
initial 200,000 transfer been
asked from the contingency fund
today.
I think we can all assume that
is just to kick this off at the
ask is going to be much greater
than the 200,000.
And lastly, the ordinance
clearly states the board is not
required to budget and or
appropriate funds to the fund
each year relying on
voluntarily edible
appropriations to the fund
being empty or unable to meet
demand if that community
interest is hi.
Again MADAM Chair, to my
colleagues, I don't think that
this is a radial.
There are a lot of unknowns and
a lot of things in my opinion
we can still figure out make
sugar through transparency and
accountability and how these
funds are going to be
administered once the time
comes
.
Lastly, I do have one question
and assuming this will pass,
which more than likely will
,
when do we anticipate that the
fund will be semi-operational
or operational altogether to
start receiving applications?
>> deputy director of
development services
.
If the money is appropriated,
the applications would start
MAY through JULY 2026 with the
applications coming to the
board.
All the application submitted
coming to the board in
SEPTEMBER 26 because AUGUST you
are on recess.
That will line us up to bring
everything to the board in
SEPTEMBER.
Ith our scoring
and top scoring kind of thing.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Anything else?
If not, let's go ahead and take
our vote.
>> Victor Angry: aye.
>> motion passes 6/2 supervisor
gordy and vega voting no.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
MR. Shorter?
>> MR. Shorter: very excited to
invite christina winn in the
economic development and
tourism team up.
Consistent with the strategic
plan presentation of the board
saw the last time we were
together, very excited about
the completion of the workforce
development study and all the
work that happened up to this
point.
Whenever we can get the
presentation up
, I will turn it
to christina winn.
>> Christina Winn: thank you.
Good afternoon chair jefferson,
members of the board.
Economic development and
tourism.
I am really excited to be here
today to talk about our
workforce presentation.
As you know, economic
development, our main mission
is to create jobs and attract
businesses and retain those
businesses.
When we look at what companies
come in their mind main
criteria, their initial
criteria when they are looking
for a new location is always
about workforce that is top on
the list.
Skills and demand for workforce
has become even more
competitive amongst companies,
and as become even more
important to focus on workforce
and economic development.
As MR. Shorter mentioned
,
workforce is spelled out in our
strategic plan and the study is
going toward being responsive
to that.
Last year
, put it this way.
During the pandemic we had to
stand up a lot workforce
related programs because
employment agon hi we were
doing that.
We did not have
any existing staff people
focused on it so everybody was
doing workforce development
.
In the fiscal year the board
and given us a position to we
are in the process of hiring
our new workforce position that
would be dedicated to
workforce, which this is super
crucial for moving this
forward.
As background in AUGUST of 2024
we went through an rfp process
we hired to strategies to
perform an analysis of
workforce development in prince
william county.
So why do we do this?
There are so many workforce
players in this landscape.
Everybody does a little piece
.
Whether it is on the training
front door with attraction or
skills development.
All of
these organizations do pieces
of this
.
We allocated the $100,000 to
get the study.
We hired to strategies and we
were focused on okay, if we are
going to be in the space, which
we focus on.
We didn't want to duplicate
services.
We knew we were not
going to have a lot of
resources that were going to be
available for this so one of
the areas in prince william
county we could carve out and
do effectively and optimize
whatever resources we are
provided.
So the scope of work was
looking at those strong
partnerships and key
stakeholders and also did an
extensive demographic analysis
really looking at our labor
force, our skills, what's in
demand.
what is oversupplied.
And it looked at are barriers
that affect our employment and
career advancement.
And then most importantly, it
made strategic recommendations
and how we could implement a
workforce program here in
prince william county.
And so with that I'm excited to
introduce tom, he is the ceo
and cofounder of tip strategies
and he has joined with erica
colston today and then called
clarice grove, you all know her
better than a business
development manager.
She has been managing this
project.
And so with that, take it away.
And you can raise this up if
you need to.
>> thank you very much
everyone.
As christina mentioned, I'm tom
and we as a firm are in
economic development and
workforce development strategy
firm
fortunate to have been in
business for 30 years.
And we do work all over the
country and I happened to be
based in austin texas.
Erica who is with me, of the
principal on the project and
erica was our lead consultant
and project manager.
And she is in route moving from
texas to chicago at the moment.
I want to say thank you to
christina and alyssa who is
kind of the research group in
that department who are all
very helpful.
We are going to present kind of
an overview today
.
Just know that there is a full
report and document in a couple
datasets
, dashboards if you
guys would like access
, I will
give it to you guys.
All right.
Just a reminder, the actual
goal is to analyze the
workforce development
landscape.
Who is doing what within the
county and identify where the
opportunities.
And as christina pointed out,
the ultimate goal is to give a
game plan, sort of a roadmap
for the program within economic
development and tourism.
I will say beforehand into
erica, it is important to be
reminded the workforce
ecosystem includes a number of
parts.
In many of them, and the county
has great influence over.
You can see up there is the
orange where that department
and this program will live.
But employers are a big part of
it.
Obviously the residents of
prince william county are a big
part of it and there are
multiple agencies.
Virginia career work that
others in the business of doing
workforce training.
And there are a number of what
we call wraparound services
.
People have to act fast off
access to transportation, there
has to be affordable housing.
S a number of things he have
a great influence over the
economic development and
tourism department and there is
obviously the university and
northern virginia community
college providing direct
education services.
So just a reminder of where all
of this lives ultimately the
goal here is to really hone in
on what is the roll of the
county.
And specifically what is the
roll for this program within
economic development.
With that I'm going to hand it
to erica
.
Just push this button here.
>> thank you tom and thank you
to the board for having us here
today and giving us the
opportunity to present on the
results of the study.
On task we wanted to highlight
without review of the county
strategic plan.
When we mentioned earlier not
been duplicative of existing
recommendations and in terms of
current work ongoing in the
workforce ecosystem.
We found as we went through the
strategic plan for the county
that there are three different
goals areas the related
specifically to the work in the
department economic development
and tourism.
There are more objectives but
we only highlighted the ones
directly relevant in some form
or fashion.
Those three goals are
education, quality of life, and
smart growth.
What we have done is
highlighted the small right
column differentiating between
where the workforce program
offers a contributing roll
meaning they are part of
day-to-day implementation.
They are not necessarily the
only actor or entity advancing
but they should be considered a
key contributor in terms of
implementation for new
strategic plan.
He plus side
syndicating a supportive role.
The workforce program might be
called upon to support their
but isn't necessarily part of
the day-to-day responsibility
to mention technical reviews,
an example of documents
reviewed.
We also reviewed the previous
workforce development program
called elevate
.
That generated a lot momentum
coming out of cobit in terms of
leveraging arpa dollars to
implement a workforce program.
I will talk about how that
relates to the work.
We reviewed plans from your
partners in the workforce
ecosystem we conducted
interviews and focus groups we
conducted a conference of data
analysis.
Tom mentioned we provided data
tools to the staff.
Those particular tools are
workforce them analysis of the
demand and supply landscape.
As well as a job quality access
to a. You can dig into
different occupations and see
the relative quality and access
of the jobs across to couple
different factors with the
staff has access to those so we
can be sure to get access to
those later on.
Those three tasks built into
the strategic direction of the
study results and I wanted to
highlight there are two sets of
recommendations that came out
of the study that differ in
terms of the responsibilities
employers involved.
i did want
to highlight findings before we
get into the recommendations
about what were the key results
thus far assist in engagement
as well as the data analysis.
In terms of what we learned the
different focus groups we
conducted across the study who
was involved, who we talk 2 to
make sure we were accounting
for the overall landscape.
Funding 1a talk to stakeholders
quickly spoke a lot about the
previous workforce development
program and how there were gaps
left behind in terms of the
relationships and efforts
ongoing
.
In terms of momentum fell off
in terms of the existing
program
.
In terms of where these
specific lane is the economic
development department.
They help clarify where they
saw the particular value.
The second take away is how
having access to the resources
from the economic development
perspective will help in terms
of retention but help the
educators understand what is
coming down the pipeline to
prepare for in terms of program
expansion in terms of where the
demand is.
In engaging with employers in
terms of what the program would
do employers of what existing
resources are in the community.
Maybe there is not a need for
new program, maybe there is a
need to promote an existing
program.
And vice versa in terms of
supporting educators.
Make each of the of
connections
to employers as they are denies
that designing programs to make
sure the end result is a mind.
The last takeaway when we
talked education
training
providers, the highlight of
the trend toward short-term
training that hasn't really
been present in the area
previously
.
That is a new trend for prince
william county workforce
development ecosystem.
Historically it has been
focused on higher education,
four year degrees that have a
education level.
In the short term there has
been a focus in terms of
certificates
, short-term job
training and so on and that
would help increase access to
jobs
.
I want to highlight
quantitative data points that
help validate things we heard
from stakeholders for any are
probably familiar with this as
a community.
That's the first thing we saw.
That is definitely still
present in terms of how the
workforce development ecosystem
operates in terms of accessing
jobs
.
In terms of local employment
growth you are outpacing the
region.
We take the long-term view.
We looked at the last 15 years
.
You all have grown 36 percent.
The next closest benchmark
would be the overall northern
virginia.
Just to let you know, you are
growing in that regard parker
mentioned new programs or
technical skills, short-term
training we did see evidence
for demand fugue we looked at a
two-year sample of job postings
for the area we noticed half
the job postings required
education below the bachelors
degree level.
Mention the mismatch between
demand and supply.
That's an area of opportunity
we saw
, which I will talk about
in a second.
That demand is actually present
across to couple different
industries wanted to highlight
healthcare, skilled trades, and
manufacturing jobs as well
present in terms of the growth
of the industry.
Getting into the
recommendations for the study,
when alignment piece we brought
together some principles of the
success we have seen in other
communities these were informed
by what we heard from
stakeholders as well.
What we wanted to make sure we
were solving for was sustaining
the job growth
, making sure
they continue to be economic
growth opportunities for
residents
.
Making sure the workforce
itself is as olympic we talked
about covid and responding
quickly picked that is
dependent on the networks that
exist
.
The third pieces data making
sure we have access to
effective datasets for
decision-making.
Making sure you are a leader in
terms of representing prince
william county workforce needs
what are the needs of your
specific employers because you
are accounting for the
challenges and community
specifically versus the overall
region
.
Barrier reduction.
Addressing challenges that
jobseekers face when they are
looking for a job and they're
looking for job training.
Each individual is a different
point addressing that and then
lost pieces ensuring the
overall talent pool is
competitive to ensure your
economy is resilient.
This is the first step of
strategies and regulations
designed to help move the
needle on the principles
themselves we talked about
earlier the overall ecosystem
the different players of all.
These are meant to be of the
delivered partnership and
collaboration with different
workforce development entities
.
In terms of wraparound services
and hr efforts, that's focused
on addressing barriers to
employment and improving job
quality.
The second is upscaling and
rescaling.
In terms of helping incumbent
workers
.
Other advancing or maybe in
switch industry areas
.
Industry sector partnerships
are bringing together the
public, private, nonprofit
sectors in specific industries.
Picking an industry like
healthcare to focus on
improvements to different
certifications or programs.
Bringing new people into
careers the fourth one is
getting specific in terms of
supporting the service
providers the provide the
direct assistance.
There are existing entities
that do this.
Especially the workforce
development board.
Sometimes they have limitations
in terms of how they can deploy
their funding for making sure
you are retaining highly
skilled talent so that way you
have people who have the skill
set to continue to teach the
skill sets kind of having
people in the community who
have the skills needed for
retention standpoint.
The last piece, and this is the
last light we have got.
This is focused on in the short
term with the county workforce
development program should be
doing in the short term as they
higher than a position
.
In terms of what the primary
functions should be relating to
strategies laid out in the
ecosystem.
Use the same color so we are
parallel but these are more
short-term and more focused on
the current level of resource.
Ving workforce data expert
providing that through
publication and different
presentations in terms of
communicating with the demand
is in terms of marketing
resources to employers
partnering with chambers,
partner with different business
organizations actively
marketing in terms of convening
stakeholders.
Released a partnerships there
are existing convening the
position should be involved in
and then in terms of increasing
awareness partnering with
different entities to launch a
communication campaign in terms
of one of the jobs out there
that don't necessarily require
a bachelors degree.
When you might need additional
training for those are
opportunities for upscaling and
rescaling.
Lost pieces acknowledging the
tourism department.
Promoting the county is not
just a destination for tourism
but an ideal place to live and
work.
So incorporating workforce
development assets like
innovation district into the
reason you should stay here
after visiting.
That is in terms of our
presentation.
This is an overview and so in
terms of review in this study
we highly encourage you to get
in touch with the team on that.
Otherwise that is it for a
formal presentation.
You are here for questions
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye?
P2 thank you MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
do you have more?
I apologize
.
>> real quick I wanted erica
had outlined the four core
functions they were
recommending.
The first to we are doing the
existing
.
We are going to continue to be
ramping those up in performing
those better.
And just like we did with the
various for success the small
business we are going to start
to work on implementing these
other opportunities but they
are in the long-term and they
MAY require future resources
.
The other pieces I'm excited to
announce michelle is coming
back as our workforce
development manager so she will
be our first official resource
management area.
And she will be leading the
effort looking at helping to
bring back, elevate, and look
at how we can and resources as
well as putting back job fairs
and career fairs and connecting
the whole entire workforce
.
Okay.
There.
That is what I get for talking
with my hands anyways, we are
looking forward to implementing
that and with that we will take
questions.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Does anyone -- re:.
Supervisor boddye?
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you
.
Thank you tom, thank you erica.
Appreciate the work that you
have all done on this and
appreciate you just added that
you got michelle back from
where she was in richmond,
right?
Thank you for approaching her
back from richmond.
Hank you
for the work.
I had a couple questions
.
You had a timeline here and
near
the beginning of the
presentation.
The actual study, list the
time.
The study took place?
>> we procured it in 2024 but
that takes a what all.
We are just finishing it.
It was almost a year long.
AUGUST 2025
.
>> Kenny Boddye: I appreciate
that.
Whether you are talking about
covid.
Covid, post covid with the
uncertainty happening
, each one
of those is a snapshot of
certain workforce trends that
can't be correlated to two or
three years before that.
The moment you took was the
best one because right now, we
talked about it as a county
becoming more fiscally and
financially resilient shocks
the federal level.
And lot of folks who came out
of the federal workforce after
rescaling up skill or lateral
skill.
I appreciate that.
My overall question is how much
if that is in the report
because as a county region so
dependent on the federal
government
, contractors, what
have you.
How does that plan to the
report?
>> I'm going to turn into erica
to answer that.
Erica touched on it.
After this meeting we will be
sending out the full report
, as
well as the link to the data
dashboard.
The way you were getting
excited about the residential
buildout analysis, this is the
same thing but it's about our
workforce and skills in
education and it is interesting
data.
And so I think that will be
helpful to continue to help us
monitor what's going on.
Do you want to respond to
addressing the federal
?
>> in terms of where we looked
at, haven't quite hit
.
I recall when we talk to
phyllis with the social
services department, she
mentioned expecting to see a
bump in terms of accessing
social services related to
folks either transitioning out
of federal jobs in terms of
people
looking for different
opportunities.
That was something
we heard
throughout.
In terms of the timeline on the
data itself, I don't know that
we saw it in the dataset but
there is original dashboard
tracking the area in terms of
how the job of an impact in the
area
.
In terms of the regulation of
the study, we were looking at
different partners.
He
regional development
partnership has worked on an
initiative with the virginia
community college.
Is terms of rescaling federal
workers in picking a different
notifications.
One of the key challenges as
they are a niche specialized
school sets of people coming
out of the workforce have there
can be challenges without.
Hat is one of the areas going
to mention career development
and navigation services
and
ecosystem that is very much
where we have a recommendation
about pursuing collaborative
opportunities.
>> Kenny Boddye: my last one on
that note appreciate the
perfect segue.
How involved was your work
engaging with the school system
did they play a roll on this?
Spoke with doctor career and
technical education they were
included in our focus group
study as well.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
I don't have anyone else so
thank you very much for that.
>> MR. Shorter: thank you for
christina, to you and the team
to tip strategies, thank you
very much.
We will now hear from matt to
talk us through the longer-term
expansion of the judicial
center and the work that the
team has been doing to plan for
that work.
>> chair jeff is in the members
of the board, director of
facilities of fleet management.
I'm excited to speak to about
the judicial center projects.
Both the current and future
expansion projects we have
going on right now.
You were asked to provide the
presentation to provide this
information to you and to the
public.
And so our current projects
here are pictures of the
projects we have completed.
Since fiscal year 2018 we
refurbished five of the six
elevators in the sixth elevator
is scheduled to be completed
over the next year or in half
that the republic elevators
with lots of issues with
reliability those have been
resolved
.
We refurbished the judges
elevator and one of the
transfer elevators we also
completed a renovation work of
the clerk of the circuit court
public counters for that
project was completed around
21/22.
Courtroom number seven which
used to be the jury assembly
room we repurposed the room
into
a new courtroom and that
project was completed in the
last 12 months.
Public restrooms, we renovated
in the courthouse
.
It has been a lot more
convenient to use.
Next projects is the sheriffs
conference room.
We enlarged it so he can now do
press conferences and things of
that nature.
It's a real nice base.
We moved of the library up to
the third floor into a new
renovated space
.
It looks nice.
As part of a replacement
project ongoing we replace the
boilers in the facility.
We have done quite a bit of
projects and have a lot of
things going on still.
Thousands of white 18 we
initiated and completed 52
projects in the courthouse.
Right now we have 15 ongoing
projects and that totals 23.5
million projects completed than
21.3 million projects in
process right now.
The projects in process right
now include updating the av
systems in the 18 courtrooms,
also doing restoration in the
courtrooms.
Replacing generators for the
building, roof replacement,
carpet replacement, led
lighting upgrades, constructing
courtroom number seven
, doing
hvac system replacement.
E
are waiting until JANUARY
before we replace the
air-conditioning part of the
hvac system.
Next is the future expansion
project.
This project came about based
off of the 2023 judicial center
master plan we brought forward
to the board.
This was completed by mostly
architects but they worked with
the different parties in the
judicial center complex.
Both occupants and the
different agencies that work in
the facilities around the
judicial center.
They had found as we identified
that we need 15 circuit
courtrooms who can 20 years we
are going to need 221,000
square feet of additional space
needed for all three courts and
support function areas we
identified the need for 950
structured garage there as well
completed in two phases
.
On the current challenges we
are seeing right now
,
specifically secured jury
assembly room, liberation rooms
easily accessible, secured
restrooms and kitchenette area
for them when they are in the
lunch breaks to sit down in a
comfortable place and have
their lunch.
Another big concern we had is
related to his a committee of
the court system in the circuit
court.
In the area behind the circuit
court courtrooms we have a
hallway.
We don't have complete
segregation in the prisoner
transports on the judges and
the jurors and so there are
courtrooms we bring the
prisoners up and they have to
traverse in the same hallway we
had jurors and judges affect
our practices in place to keep
the segregation, but if you
make a mistake you could
potentially open ourselves up
to a pretty serious issue
.
That's a big concern we are
working on developing a
resolution to was in the new
design of the new courthouse.
Want to share renderings of
what potentially the courthouse
could look like.
It MAY look like this, it MAY
look completely different.
To stop talk with my hands.
MAY look like this, and MAY
not.
We wanted to give you an idea
of what it could potentially
look like in the space in front
of the courthouse that's a
front look at the potential
courthouse and that is the side
view of that courthouse this
slide shows you where we are
planning on putting the
judicial center expansion
project.
As you can see up top of the
new parking garage which is
across the road from the adult
detention center adjacent to
the manassas senior center and
we had the judicial center
expansion area which is
essentially next door to the
adc and judicial center.
But you will notice that is
located where the bennett
school currently resides.
And so I want to give you an
overview about the bennett
school.
It is uncharted for the past 40
years.
See the picture on the top
right bottom right?
That is what it look like for
the last four years.
We know the inside of the
building the work has been done
on it.
We are concerned that comes to
integrity is in question.
I'm not comfortable sending my
stuff inside the building to do
any work
.
We don't know what we are going
to find inside there.
We are pretty sure it contains
asbestos, lead, mold, water
damage and terminates.
In 2019 we had done a report or
an assessment on it looking at
it to use it for a share space
and those are some of the
findings that study it came up
with.
It's not currently listed in
the fridge and landmarks
adjuster, it's not listed in
the national register of
historic places.
T is listed
on the historical marker
database and it is a historic
site by the prince william
county department of parks and
recreation under the historic
preservation division.
Student it's age before we take
the building down we have to
get permission from the
virginia department of historic
resources.
We had to get the
approval before we move to
raise the building.
We have to do it at minimum we
would have to do more is a
level I archaeological survey
and we would have to deal with
whatever findings MAY come up
as a result of the survey.
This building dates back to
1909 and it was last used as a
school in 1969.
After that it was used either
with the sheriff's office or
the police department.
We got conflicting information
about that.
Has not been used 4 at least
last 40 years.
We did look at how can we
potentially incorporate the
bennett school into the
expansion project
.
We did have a company come and
that did a rough order of
magnitude estimate renovating
existing bennett school and the
neighbor they gave us was
37,500,000.
We anticipate we would need to
budget a large contingency.
we don't know what we don't
know and we can kinda guarantee
we are going to run into stuff
we are unanticipated.
Totally speaking, we think a
budget of 46,875,000 is what we
are looking at.
Until we got in there and
started
assessing things.
It is going to be if we're
going to try to renovate that
facility and if we try to
renovate we would have to try
to connect it to the new
facility on that would create
more variables we have to solve
and I don't know if our current
estimate factors that in.
We have been asked what it
would cost and what it would
take to move the facility.
In 2023 we had done preliminary
research and it was 2.5 million
to pick up the building and
move it.
With that doesn't include is
it's on the rubble foundation
preventive pick it up and drop
it somewhere you've to build a
new
foundation to put that on.
That is another additional $5
million we anticipate we dock
to spend.
You have to figure out where
you put it, if the hook
utilities up to it and get it
in service
.
I don't know if we want to move
it.
We wouldn't want to move
it and drop it somewhere else
and let it sit for more time
but we would have to make a
commitment at the time to do
the work.
Our current estimate was a
rough order of magnitude which
includes the contingency was
56,250,000.
We want to memorialize the
bennett school whatever future
project we do.
We reached out to dewberry and
asked them if they can provide
us ideas on what potentially
could do.
We've not made any decisions at
this point but there are ways
to try to memorialize the
bennett school and some if that
is repurposed thing the salvage
materials.
Mother it is taken the front
columns and somewhere in the
complex developing it shows the
colors in the bennett school
with the informational market.
Talks about with the bennett
school is in the area.
We can take that reservist
materials and incorporate
them
until the new facility.. We
can take the foundation and
incorporate that into the
building as well.
.
In the bottom right we see an
outline.
We create outline where the
bennett school was sent a note
that having different color
floor to denote this is where
the bennett school sat and then
create informational panel of
sorts to explain the history
and have that available to the
public can see that.
Information about the actual
expansion project
.
And construction of a five
level building.
One underground and four levels
above ground.
The facility would be dedicated
to the circuit court that would
include the circuit court
clerks operations as well.
We anticipate they would have
12 courtrooms which meets the
expectations of the circuit
court judge is.
We were designed to lead old
standards we would incorporate
practices like solar arrays,
led lighting whatever we need
to put in their to get
qualifications for legal
standards.
One of the way, it's most
efficient use of the site.
Expend in the future possibly
on the 20 year mark.
We can add additional space
north, parallel with the adc.
What it doesn't do is the
existing courthouse is not
renovated and that would be
something we would have to come
back and develop a cap project
in the future to renovate the
existing courthouse after
circuit court in the clerk move
out there use the space more
effectively for the growth of
other functions in the
courthouse.
We projected the timeline with
the different things we would
have to do.
It is about six years.
Let is the worst case scenario.
Will try to beat it but that is
where we are at.
I do want to give you a number
that is not realistic.
A rough estimate of cost, 4.8
million to demo 43.5 million to
do the parking structure in the
151.7 million for the judicial
center.
The parking structure, the
process would be done sooner.
It would be going up sooner
than expansion project so that
would to be a good thing that
is the cost of nuts in the $200
million budget we have right
now.
When to give you a potential
layout.
This is an set in stone but to
give you a visual of what we
could have
.
There is separation between the
different functions.
You notice the public is
separated from the prisoner
transport and separated from
the jurors and the judges.
Need judges and jurors are
separated from the prisoner
movement in the facility.
The orange spaces where the
prisoners would come up from
the basement and they would be
brought into the courtrooms for
their cases where there's not
any worry about what we have.
It's fine the current circuit
court courtrooms.
This would be on levels two,
three and four pick you notice
that they have judged chambers
in space for jury deliberation.
They will also areas for
support staff to support those
operations.
The first level is where we
have the clerks office.
The performing on the marriage
licenses, probate
and will,
civil motions, processes they
manage on the third floor the
circuit court building.
With space for jury assembly.
For point of reference you see
where we have the outline of
where the bennett school would
exist if we dropped the
building right on top of it.
And then this is the lower
level of the facility and you
can see the orange pathway.
you can see it is connected to
the adc that develops into the
courthouse and holding areas
that can be directly taken
upstairs via elevator not have
to have any interaction with
anyone other than the sheriff's
office. We see in the basement
being an area for historical
archives, land
records, law
library.
We know we will need
maintenance space
.
When we go further into design
we get more detail as to what
the different things would be.
This is to give you an idea of
what they could potentially be.
I talked about the potential
for expansion.
As you can see here we have the
potential to add additional
floors which would to be too
court room set up similar to
the courtrooms on the original
building.
We have the same set up for two
courtrooms per floor.
We could add 2 to 3 levels
before we start running into
the height restrictions we have
on that property.
So our next upside this week we
are going to begin the process
with the state on the bennett
school.
We will design process on
expansion of the building.
We made good progress doing the
programming discussions and now
it's time to get into the
details of the design and we
start working on that and we
will continue the design
process for the parking
structure.
With that I would be happy to
take any questions.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so much.
Supervisor gordy.
> Tom Gordy: thank you for
the presentation.
There was one little thing I
saw it right there.
The orange dot under the
central holding
.
This book that is the elevator.
>> Tom Gordy: how do I get to
it?
>> the central area would be
cells we have them down there
and they would bring them there
and they would escort them or
take them down the hallway to
the other elevator.
>> you mention the clerks
office
.
I know there bennett bought a
discussions going between the
judges on the clerks office.
To what extent is the clerks
office
.
I know there been discussions
on who is in control of what
but my understanding is the
judges control the court
sunrooms but not the clerks
office.
I want to make sure as a
relates to who has got what
authorities over what areas of
the judicial center.
>> MS. Roble: the county owns
it.
Those areas necessary for
the use and occupancy are under
the authority of the circuit
court.
The board is required to
provide office space to the
clerk with the fire prefer the
files in the space is acquired
deadbeat in or
outside the
courthouse.
>> Tom Gordy: thank you MADAM
Attorney.
You and I talked about this
.
I have given my opinion on how
it relates to the bennett
school.
I don't think it's worth the
investment to save it,
maximizing the stone the
bennett school is made out of
its unique to the area and
unique to that part of manassas
with the red colored stone so
finding a way to incorporate
that into whether it's the
promenade or outside or even
like markers like you said.
I appreciate the effort you are
taking to memorialize the
building but I don't see the
value in trying to save a
building that even when we are
done saving it we aren't sure
how we are going to use it.
When we really need the space
to expand our judicial center.
On the only other thing.
You mentioned you were going to
move on the parking structures
with
doesn't just look like a
parking garage.
This is for all intents and
purposes downtown manassas but
it is surrounded by residential
and it is right next to the
courthouse.
Something that has a fac
de on
it that looks really good.
We look forward to seeing what
you guys are able to come up
with.
That's all I have.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Before.
Apologize I want to
recognize look smith we have
you with us today.
With that I will turn it to
supervisor bailey.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
here I am there.
Thanks for the presentation.
The more we see it the more we
understand it.
I have two things.
In prince william county
manassas city we are dealing
with old infrastructure.
In
the bennett building is an
example of that.
I agree with my colleague about
when you talk about investing
money, 46 million is a loft of
money.
56.
Excuse me.
That is still more than a lot
of money.
As we talk about preservation
of the old and incorporating
that in the new I encourage you
to think about it that way as
we get grants
.
Similarly what they did with
the museum and manassas city
.
But the thing I wanted to ask
is going back to something
supervisor gordy mentioned
about the collaborative input
between the clerks office and
judicial system and the
explanation our county attorney
gave us
.
As we move along with this
,
that is incorporating or has
been incorporated.
>> part of the design process
is we bring in the customer and
they participate in the process
and identify what their needs
are and they identify how the
business they run rents
effectively in the space.
I don't run the circuit court
so I need their input.
Hey
work with our design team in
our facilities construction
management team and they
incorporate their needs into
the final design and they have
an opportunity to provide the
feedback as to whether the
design would be sufficient for
what their needs are.
We anticipate we expect them to
be part of the process for
designing whatever facility
week instruct.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
do we have to do any additional
digitizing documents and things
like that as we are building?
>> there MAY or MAY not be.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
but that doesn't involve this.
In terms of cost.
>> we have done a loft of work
with the clerks recently
.
And think we had pretty good
success digitizing records and
we have a lot of space to be
repurposed.
There are also legal
requirements and we will be
taking that into account in
taking into account what we
design.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair: I
mentioned that because it has
to be.
I do appreciate the hard work
as it relates to the judicial
center because it hasn't been
done in a long time.
The security piece as well.
When I talk about elevators, is
that incorporated the security
piece in that?
what does that look like?
>> the whole building will have
access control
, video
recording, lots of different
things the sheriff's office
needs.
My team, the security team will
be part of the design process
to make sure we have the right
infrastructure into the
facility so it meets the
expectations of the sheriff's
office for what they need to do
.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you.
Thank you MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you supervisor.
Supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: I appreciate.
I know we talked about it last
time you thought of designing
this in a way that can be
expanded later.
As we know right now it's so
tight at the existing center
they are taking space from
other offices, one of which is
in the chambers right now so I
wanted to highlight that.
My two questions, one.
I think I MAY have asked this
of the last time but is there
going to be space contemplated
for the public defenders
office?
>> that decision to my
knowledge has not been made.
I don't think if there is in
this new building.
Whether or not we make space
somewhere else, that's a
decision that will have to be
made later.
>> Kenny Boddye: I feel like I
have raised that before.
My second question and it goes
back to what supervisor
gordy
said.
This is a very utilitarian one
there are no bells and whistles
.
There are also ones that have
no more amenities and what have
you.
As you continue to go down the
road of looking at that, if
you're going to be a thought
about the fact we different
ecosystems of folks using the
parking garage someone will be
coming because they work in the
judicial center and others will
be coming because they MAY be
having their day in court.
We talked about the functional
design and how that MAY feed
into the infrastructure there?
>> we focused on how the garage
would work but as we get for
their own we understand the
city manasses does a lotta
history there and is being used
to support the court room.
I assume in the design process
we would try to weave that into
the design of the exterior of
the building so it blends in
and it is not a utilitarian
concrete building.
>> Kenny Boddye: appreciate
that.
Spoke also say if I can come to
reiterate the point that matt
made.
As we engage in insurance
office who escorts in some
cases
, the input would be there
and how we might design the
garage and away or make sure
traffic is flowing in a way
that is safe for
all involved.
>> Kenny Boddye: my last one
goes back to what you mentioned
earlier on linkedin some other
things for the new building.
You talk about solar, I
appreciate that.
Remind me, is this part in the
dominion territory?
>> it is in the city manasses.
>> Kenny Boddye: do they have a
connection fever solar?
>> I don't believe they do
because we will be putting
solar on top of the current
one.
>> Kenny Boddye: appreciate
that.
The significantly less cost so
thank you so much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Supervisor vega?
>> Yesli Vega: thank you MADAM
Chair.
Thank you for answering
questions.
To staff to meet with you and
acknowledge the clerk of the
court for candor in expressing
challenges we have had.
The content no surprise we care
about the dollars limit on
about the due 2 million needed
where are we at with current
investments in the existing
building.
>> in the current facility
, to
date we have spent 23.5 million
on different projects and 21
million we have ongoing
projects when total we have
about $45 million in projects
completed or ongoing right now
since 2018.
>> Yesli Vega: that is not
included in the 200 million?
>> it is not.
>> Yesli Vega: what is a
timeline in terms of completing
the outstanding work?
> the one that will take the
longest will be the av work
because it has to be done at
night and we have to shut down
a courtroom at a time.
We are looking another two
years at least.
>> Yesli Vega: and then
speaking about the challenges
and problematic corridors, can
you go into detail how we solve
the challenges in the future
building when it comes to the
jury assembly room?
>> the jury assembly space
would be segregated out on the
first level of the building.
The two blue scare stairs we
only used by the jurors and
judges
.
They wouldn't have to be
getting into the public
elevators and then they would
be taken upstairs to whatever
courtroom process.
On the levels two, three and
four, you can see where the
blue space is only for jurors
and judges which the orange
space separated from everybody
is the prisoner transport area
in the green spaces segregated
from the blue and orange space
as well
.
>> Yesli Vega: is it out of
convenience
.
This is something I don't know.
This is something we want to
keep the jury room -- can you
go back to the other slide?
The other one.
Is there a reason we want to
keep it next of the clerk of
courts office?
>> we are using levels two,
three and four forgive you
where to put that on another
floor you are using courtroom
space for cover thought
processes if you have a year
could pool there and then from
there the circuit court clerks
office would take them to
whatever court they are
assigned to.
>> Yesli Vega: I want to avoid
current issues in terms of
maximizing the space and not
having to go and take more and
more if we are talking about
growth in the coming years and
highlight the fact we can do a
better job in regards to how we
split up space in particular
with courtroom seven, which was
a huge investment and how much
we are utilizing it.
For us to take those into
consideration and learn from
them and to ensure we don't
keep making the same mistakes
over and over again
.
And then the last thing I
wanted to bring up is in the
presentation you identified the
master plan calls for 15
circuit court rooms, however,
there's only toby included.
Is
there a reason?
>> the feedback they gotten was
they were looking for 10 and
then they told us they needed
12.
>> Yesli Vega: not that I am
pushing for more courtrooms.
I just wanted to make sure that
it wasn't a typo.
I just wanted to be consistent
.
And then lastly MADAM Chair, we
are not approving anything
today.
Today is just a presentation.
Understand we vent challenges
but this opportunity to work
through those challenges and
make sure we have all key
stakeholders being a part of a
conversation to include our
constitutional officers.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor stewart
.
>> George Stewart: thank you
for your presentation.
I really appreciate it.
A couple of questions.
I agree with the point
supervisors gordy and daly
brought up about just how
expensive it would be too redo
the school for such a tiny
space.
But a couple things.
This archaeological study, is
there a plan.
Manasses is such a golden
historic place.
It would not surprise me if you
found something there.
Is there a planned is what to
do what is that branch off into
opening or perhaps another
issue of some sort about
preserving that space
, working
with the museum to remediate
and remove things
.
Is there a plan around that,
first of all?
>> there's a process we will
have to follow in accordance
with I believe the state laws
.
And we will follow that.
Current firm dewberry has a lot
of experience doing these types
of projects
.
When they come across something
we will have to make decisions
on what it is we've come
across, how to be deal with it
moving forward
.
until we get to that point, we
don't know what it is we are
going to find.
If it is artifacts and things,
we can look to incorporate that
in the new facility as part of
the displays or things
memorializing the bennett
school.
If there is something else we
follow that process
.
>> George Stewart: speaking of
which, I like supervisor gordy
idea about that
.
It's a touchstone bringing that
forward.
The other question I have.
What's happening now to ensure
the safety of jurors if they
don't have the proper spaces
for deliberation or for
assembly?
What is being done to keep them
safe?
>> the sheriff's office in the
hallways the process to do
their best to keep the judges
over their office staff popping
out in the hallways when they
are transporting presidents
back and forth.
The provide the security for
the jurors when they are moving
them in mass throughout the
building.
There's more to it but I can
provide
you the details.
Sheriff's office has processes
in place to provide security
for the jurors
.
>> George Stewart: thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
We don't have anyone also thank
you so very much for this
presentation.
you don't have anything else?
We are done?
All the right.
We are going to go to agenda
item 11, supervisors time.
Before we go around the dais
there are three outstanding
items and I would like to take
the votes separately.
A couple of them I think will
have a significant discussion.
Can I get a motion to move 11 a
forward?
Properly moved and seconded.
Would like to call for the
vote.
>> supervisor angry?
>> Victor Angry: aye.
It is not displaying but I have
the vote. Unanimous.
Supervisor franklin absent from
vote.
> Deshundra Jefferson,
Mayor: we are going to move to
housing obtain ability fast
track measures
.
Supervisor boddye, I don't know
if you have anything you want
to speak to?
>> Kenny Boddye: I didn't know
if you want me to make the
motion or preamble a little
bit.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
if you want to make the motion
and we can of discussion within
that because I have one
question and something I would
like to amend
.
>> Kenny Boddye: I move 11 b
for approval
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
it has been properly moved and
seconded.
Discussion.
I will kick it off.
On the second page of going to
ask for the clarification
.
Residential development weaver
reform and any other elements
in the scope of work of the
ordinance update related to
housing.
Can you clarify what you mean
by weaver reform?
>> Kenny Boddye: as anyone will
tell you, quite a few times now
when anyone comes through for
development residential they
have to request a law of
waivers of examples engraved on
this form, some other one where
whether it is a unit type,
setbacks, things like that.
When the zoning ordinance was
updated and created speaks to
an earlier time when we had
much more suburban and large
scale development.
It doesn't speak to what we're
trying to go
.
We are trying to have a more
compact design
, taller
buildings that are more
walkable uneven unit types
.
Right now a lot of folks to
come and if you want things
like duplexes
, things we really
want to go 2 to make more
housing stock, and lot of the
zoning districts don't allow
that so people have to ask for
waivers and ask for these
things.
We have a lot of concrete
examples where supervisor gordy
has done a lotta good work
trying to push developers to
have more unit types rather
than single-family homes and
townhouses but renowned the
zoning ordinance doesn't speak
to that.
If we want have better outcomes
we need to have more
flexibility for this because
otherwise if a developer has to
request waivers over and over
again for these issues it costs
time, money and more
negotiating ticket causes more
staff time because they have to
review every single waiver that
comes in.
If these waivers were baked
into the zoning ordinance we
would have better outcomes and
a much wider variety of unit
types.
All the things we like to see
as we talk about urbanizing
important areas of the county.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I one more thing and I might
have to do a friendly
amendment.
Does anyone else have anything
they want to say?
Supervisor gordy.
>> Tom Gordy: I want to add on
a look at the opportunity for
like accessory living units,
particularly in an area where
parking is not a problem.
Larger lots could have a
basement apartment or limit
good that opportunity for
affordable housing in an area.
Or instance, folks who had 10
acre lots or five acre lots
they have an opportunity to
provide rental housing.
Incidentally I have a neighbor
of mine who is renting a
bedroom to a marine
.
What you were looking at some
of the folks we are trying to
support here who it MAY be
temporary housing
.
I know my wife and I when we
started our jobs out of college
we lived in the garage
apartment
.
That was our first home.
Nd
so the opportunity to move that
forward to get that done will
serve to help us address
affordability without actually
having to go have read zonings
or go through these challenging
applications.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
So my concern is removing
smaller dwelling unit such as
tiny homes including under
certain circumstances reducing
or eliminating minimum lot
sizes, setbacks, and other
requirements.
Been trying to do reading to
catch up her tiny homes have
taken off but from what I
understand is not the same for
mobile homes.
That gives me concern
concerned about the long-term
impact about having tiny home
communities and are there
better ways I creating more
diverse affordable housing
stock
.
That was something I couldn't
make peace with.
If you are okay, I would like
to amend this and remove the
first bullet point I read on
the second page.
>> Kenny Boddye: tiny homes and
small homes like this, we have
to look to see how we are able
to based on what the general
assembly gives us.
Lonely follow-up would be be
able to if we slip this out now
have the possibility of
considering it later
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I'm open to having discussion
and see what authorities the
general assembly gives us.
Having not enough examples I am
not comfortable with this.
And so you are okay with the
family amendment?
Supervisor bailey seconded it.
Any further discussion with
removing that?
I don't see
anything so I will call for the
vote
.
I don't have the vote on the
friendly amendment.
That's
what I am thinking
.
Okay.
Supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: am not going
to wax poetic too much on this.
The basis of the resolution as
I said before and as is in the
resolution, this washington and
her staff are working to bring
forth a comprehensive zoning
ordinance update.
But we can't wait until 2027 to
fix the housing crisis quickly
adopted the conference and plan
at the end of 2022 and we are
2.5 years beyond that and we
don't have a zoning ordinance
that handshakes to the things I
talked about.
I appreciate supervisor gordy.
Then we go with read zonings,
proper amendments, all these
other things to do the larger
projects winamp options on the
table having that in law suite,
having the fully functional
kitchen outlawed in prince
william county.
Having the ability to allow
folks to have slightly larger
lots when they are able to put
a new apartment on there to
give folks more options.
We have overreaching
regulations created and not
reflect the reality of how
folks lived today.
Renault one in three households
in our county is cost burden
term for one people spending 30
percent of their income on
housing
.
It's no wonder the first time
home buyer is 40 years old in
this region.
On the average home price is no
$600,000 personal that renters
have anything better either
prevent
two-bedroom apartment
rents $2000 a month of ending
oreo trying to live.
That is not sustainable.
The prices is hurting our
younger residents on people
trying to get established and
move through their lives as
they work through their careers
.
I'm not going to talk about it
too much.
It's in the resolution but one
is creating a framework
allowing houses of worship to
build affordable housing on
their land.
Make it easier and faster for
them to go through the review
process for developing
accessory dwelling units
policy.
Number three is removing arista
smaller homes.
We talked about that and pulled
that out.
And evaluate the county owned
lands
.
We will be looking at parkland
but county owned land outside
of parks to create more
obtainable housing
.
Places like libraries and other
public facilities to allow us
to use the fact we use public
land that developer who comes
in without afterward about the
land cost to establish housing
which means that cost is
transferred to the eventual
homeowner or renter
.
We talked before and why we
should single use lots anymore.
To bring people closer to the
amenities they unveil
themselves on.
These were added by staff to
empower county workforce to
better do outreach, fit lots
better and be able to have
advanced tools for their
analyses pick I will finish
missing this prince william
county should have a place
where a nurse, schoolteacher
and everyone else makes our
lives better can afford to live
here but this represents a
meaningful step towards out and
makes prince william county
better for all.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
We can take our vote.
That is what I am saying.
I thought you were cleared out.
>> George Stewart: this is
directing staff to compile the
ordinance and bring it back to
us
.
Is there a way to do it
comprehensively as one whole
thing instead?
>> Kenny Boddye: yes unknown.
When this is happening as the
zoning ordinance update
corporate housing but
commercial
spaces, mixed-use and
a bunch of other things.
It peels out the things that
pertain to housing and brings
back all those comprehensively
for us that's why one of the
other bullets says anything
that deals with housing all the
housing stuff would come
pensively but it comes before
the commercial and non-piece
of the update.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I apologize.
All right.
Let's go ahead if there's
nothing else.
No one else?
Kay.
Let's vote.
That was a yes.
>> motion passes unanimously.
Supervisor franklin and vega
absent from vote.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
we are moving to 11 c and let
us dissolve the prince william
county arts council put forth.
I don't know if you have
anything to say.
Because you don't sound so
good.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I have a lot of questions but
seeing as you are not here and
feeling well I have a lot of
reservations about this because
there are too many questions
for me.
Who is going to lead this
nonprofit.
Why hasn't it been up and
running.
Why not working with existing
groups.
What would be the roll and
hearing from members of the
arts council they had a lot of
concerns.
They don't feel they had a
proper head's up in discussion.
And so for those reasons I will
be voting against this,
however, I would like to go
ahead.
I don't know if you would like
to do the motion, victor?
Is there a second?
Move it and seconded.
Will give the second two
supervisor bailey.
Any further discussion on this?
Go on.
>> Tom Gordy: I appreciate
everyone who came out to speak
and I had phone calls from
concerned constituents.
The best I can tell, we have
some personality conflicts and
that seems to be what is
driving the challenges related
to the arts council.
I believe in reconciliation.
I believe people need to come
together and work out their
differences.
Regardless of what we do here
today, that still needs to
happen.
No matter what we do next, the
problem is still going to be
there.
The one challenge I have
someone who runs a nonprofit in
my civilian job I know how much
it takes to get a nonprofit up
and running.
You have to go intimate the
paperwork and get approved and
that would take six months in
and of itself.
We could be talking about the
year before nonprofit could
even be established in order to
provide the continuity of what
we are talking about here.
I
know the motion is on the floor
.
Given the fact supervisor angry
is not here and wish he was and
he was able to speak.
I'm really praying for you.
That sounds really bad what
you're dealing with.
Maybe we could do for this to
JANUARY
.
From what I am hearing on the
resolutions calling for a
nonprofit to be established
outside the county purview, but
I'm here in the potential of an
arts commission being
established by the county.
And I would like to get clarity
what the next steps are on the
direction we are going to go
and if we are going to move
from one to the next I think
there needs to be a seamless
transition rather than a gap in
order for us to maintain the
continuity
, and in the meantime
hopefully we can find out the
basis of these relational
conflict and seek to get that
resolved so that whatever
happens next moves forward in
unity and that's my perspective
on it.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor angry, I know you
are not well.
How do you feel about deferring
this until you are here for the
discussion?
>> Victor Angry: okay.
This is hard to talk.
Can I send an email to someone?
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
for the record I did get a text
from supervisor angry and he
says it's pointless to defer.
S that how you feel?
Because we can continue the
discussion.
>> Victor Angry: is that how I
feel?
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
you do not want to differ?
>> Victor Angry: no.
> Deshundra Jefferson,
Mayor: I'm going to continue
on.
Supervisor vega?
>> Yesli Vega: supervisor angry
is here.
He is not here physically but
he is here and I think his
intent has been made clear.
It's not the first time we
heard
about this.
That's why we will make a
decision here today.
Let's address the elephant in
the room.
I understand what you are
saying.
I just don't think we are at a
point where we are going to fix
the problems that have been
going on for a long time but
you've seen the emails
, some
very nasty personal attacks
have flown back and forth.
The reality is and is not the
boards job or his department
job to babysit this counsel.
I believe the next course of
action imprudent one would be
too establish a nonprofit so
they can go ahead and manage
things in a much more efficient
way.
O for that reason I'm
going to be supporting this
initiative.
I do hope and I believe this
nonprofit will be started up
fairly quickly because we heard
from a lot of passionate folks
who are passionate about the
arts and I know they won't let
this initiative fall through
the cracks so I call for the
vote.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I have two other people.
Supervisor bailey?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you MADAM Chair.
I agree with supervisor vega.
Think because of how strong and
dedicated folks are to the
passion of arts, they will
continue to make sure that the
community gets the benefit of
that.
I think we are at a point where
make it decision.
I brought this forward and it
was somewhat of a surprise to
most of my colleagues, but I
brought this forward where we
are discussing this today.
I think we need to move
forward, start on over them in
some senses.
We do need to have the tough
discussions we need to move
forward so we can serve the
community.
I will be supporting this
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor stewart?
>> George Stewart: I had a
friend who was very upset
living in new york.
I think
she wanted to move to phoenix
and she goes new york is done
with me I'm going to move to
phoenix and I said guess who is
going to be waiting for you at
baggage claim.
You.
We bring our problems with us.
If there is a personality
conflict
, the new folks are
going to bring it to the new
location.
I agree with the supervisor
gordy on it.
This might be an opportunity
where if you do differ it
, and
gives them time to get their
stuff in one sock and work it
out.
I would like to give them the
opportunity to go ahead and do
that.
There's a law that passion.
I've been playing music since I
was eight years old.
Clarinet in the saxophone.
I still played today.
I just realized that's 50
years.
Anyway, I think we should give
it a month.
If we are going to call for the
vote, we are going to call for
the vote.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye I am of two
minds on this because I bridget
the folks who came to speak
today and I understand all this
was a surprise to them how this
was put on the agenda.
At the same time, these issues
are not new.
Even before the emails we
received over the last two or
three months, we know there has
been a lot of tension festering
there has been a lot of issues
around the folks that have been
a part of this
.
I do not want to diminish the
work that counsel has done.
They have done a lot of great
work since the beginning
.
The progress mentioned in the
resolution put to a nonprofit
are proof in the pudding they
do good work and there's
obviously a place for arts and
we promote the arts in the
county.
T the same time I am
always one to look for other
other folks doing this work you
could connect with.
The prince william arts
society.
I don't know if anyone reached
out to them to see if someone
wanted to continue this from
the arts council would join up
with art society that is a
pre-existing group.
There
might be some
there that there
is a going to be a huge span of
time.
They can approach an
existing one.
Worked in partnership with arts
council
.
I don't think I will be
speaking to much when I say
they would be staff support
should they have the next
endeavor, especially if they go
to the art society and find
partnership with them.
Emerge all the time when they
find the missions are aligned.
The good of economies of scale
and connecting with an existing
group linked art society MAY
allow there to be a stabilized
first the other folks are not a
part of the trauma.
, we will be supporting the
solution know I won't one to
diminish the work being done, I
don't want to diminish the work
that has been done by my
appointee and I hope we
continue to support the arts
council as they look at their
next chapter.
Hank you MADAM
Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
hold on.
Supervisor gordy, did you have
something else he wanted to
add?
>> Tom Gordy: to clarify, begin
I'm still confused on whether
the next move according to the
resolution says nonprofit but I
am hearing the potential for a
commission as a directive, next
month.
Can I get clarity
?
This has been fed to me today
and I want to make sure what
the next steps are and what the
plan is.
Or not there'd be commission
directive put forward when we
meet again next year.
>> MR. Shorter: there is a
parks commission currently.
My understanding and I can have
seth come down, is that the
languages encouraging groups to
set up a nonprofit or any kind
of private organization.
We are not saying any component
of the arts council, the arts
council itself or any
individual that MAY be
participating has to go out and
create a nonprofit in order for
grants programs or special
events to content you.
We will continue the special
events.
We will work with a
partner whether it was
competitively or not.
The arts grants
, the program
will be administered.
In terms of the next steps, I
don't believe the languages
saying we are requiring a
nonprofit be established.
What we are suggesting is we
were encouraging a nonprofit
because it makes it easier to
apply for grants, it makes it
easier to work with the
organization.
> my colleague texted me and
said his intent is to put
forward a directive for a
commission next year.
That will fill a gap
.
And so based on that I will be
supporting it as long as I
commission is established.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I do have questions and maybe
supervisor angry can message
me.
Are we choosing sides
?
Every one of the arts council,
are they going to be invited to
be a part of the nonprofit.
Where is the select group go
integrated nonprofit.
Were going to have two
competing nonprofits?
I am worried about choosing
sides and without having the
information I cannot support
this
.
There has been a lot of
personality conflicts
.
People are not getting along.
I don't understand the genesis
of that.
I'm sorry it has come to this,
but I'm worried and I want to
be on record if we are choosing
sides.
We will be invited to
participate in this new
nonprofit.
That the huge concern for me.
Especially since the
allegations I've heard about
being silenced and shot out,
being a click, being
discriminatory from some of the
members who feel they are not
welcome to be a part of this
.
I'm going to be cautious on
this one and that is why I am
voting no.
Upervisor vega
.
>> Yesli Vega: in thinking
perfectly summarized how toxic
unfortunately the counsel has
become become not picking
anyone sign.
I'm being prudent and I
understand the ship of civility
in the ship of coming a meeting
in the middle have sailed and
sailed far away when you folks
emailing board members to
unemployed people.
Making claims that have
absolutely no evidence or proof
is indicative the group is not
working and so here is the
council serving.
I had to come to the
realization it is not serving
the purpose for which it was
created and we have to start
over again and this is the best
course of action regarding
picking sides?
I'm basing my decision off of
how ineffective the counsel has
become and I wouldn't want to
be part of such a toxic
environment.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor bailey
.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
I
agree.
I'm not taking sides at all.
This is an opportunity for us
to clear the air and get the
focus on the community and not
on personalities and to
understand creating a new
mission and vision for the
county to serve the county.
we need to preserve the
template.
The county executive says we
are
going to continue with the
programs.
I think that's very important.
The negative synergy created in
this environment needs to be
the views dissolved and we move
forward with a brand-new
, fresh
commission we move forward with
brand-new fresh vision to serve
the county.
I'm certainly not picking
sides.
As we move forward to
transformative ideas and
transformative talent that we
move forward with
transformative decisions on how
we do that.
Not picking sides but we need a
fresh minutes moving forward
to.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor stewart
.
>> George Stewart: I took my
name.
>> Deshundra
Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor gordy.
>> Tom Gordy: I misspoke
.
Supervisor angry it's not
putting forward a directive for
a commission.
Wanted to correct the record
for that.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Let's go ahead and take a vote.
>> supervisor angry?
Motion passes 5/2 supervisors
gordy and chair jefferson
voting no.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so much.
we are now going to go around
the horn and I will start with
supervisor vega.
She is not ready so I will
start with supervisor gordy.
>> Tom Gordy: I will make this
quick.
On the 11th of the pleasure of
attending the parks foundation
reception
.
We have such a great community
of supporters for our parks and
to see them all in one place
and see
the commitment and
excitement, especially after
the opening of the pump track
has them energized looking
forward to the next
opportunities to support our
community.
And I enjoyed visiting with the
misty creek community to
discuss issues related to their
roads and opportunities how we
can address that.
Yesterday and begin hanukkah.
I want to wish our jewish
community happy hanukkah.
It started off rough with what
happened
in sydney and our
hearts go out to all those
families.
Some of that did hit close to
home
.
Some folks from this area were
over there participating in
sydney
.
They are having the menorah
lighting at that out list
walking gainesville.
I certainly want to welcome the
community in support of jewish
neighbors.
And then I want to wish our
community a very merry
christmas and happy new year
happy holidays and look forward
to seeing everyone again in the
new year.
I will say 2025 has been rough.
I'm ready for it to be over
with.
And has been a challenging year
for my family and so looking
forward to a better 26.
Thank you.
>> Yesli Vega: of a directive
you have all seen.
Without objection I would like
to direct the county executive
to work with staff to compiling
clear and complete breakdown of
all county funds, services, and
resources and other public
education programs
.
This should include not only
budgeted transfers or
appropriations but additional
money approved aside the annual
budget process is only a
services or resources provided
to the county departments such
as information technology,
parks and recreation, or other
shared services.
They should identify the
purpose of funding source for
each item and specify whether
it is required by state
mandate, local policy, or
provided at the boards
discretion part county
attorneys office is directed to
review the regulations for
legal issues on the research
and work is complete the county
executive should the board with
his analysis and
recommendations by memorandum
within 60 days of the board
directive.
That is all I have.
Merry christmas.
Happy new year.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: at supervisor
increase request I'm going to
start with his supervisors time
.
He wanted to put in his notice
of intent to -- the advisory
committee.
I wanted to make sure you have
that and he says merry
christmas.
Down to the occoquan time.
I wanted to first thank
everyone who came out to join
me at the two open houses that
happened on friday.
Irst in
the morning we went to the
senior center breakfast lunch I
wanted to thank supervisor
franklin for her invitation to
that.
Was a great time.
They live it up.
There was a lot of festivities.
I want to say thank you
supervisor franklin to all the
staff that helped make that
event a success every year.
N
the evening my staff and other
folks went to the gainesville
district open house.
Wanted to say supervisor
stewart and his staff do not
play when it comes into
throwing a great party.
They spend a lot of time
decorating with their office.
It was well received big
congratulations to your first
open house, supervisor stewart.
Sunday my family and I took
part in our annual santa trains
and manasses.
For folks of not been
on the
brt, I invite you to do so.
My four-year-old, my
two-year-old and 13-year-old
lovett
.
We see santa claus.
There are elves, caroling,
singing
.
Is a really good time.
If you're concerned about your
kids having candy canes or
candy, you should pass because
they get out a lot of candy on
that my kids were bouncing
around throughout the day.
Also wanted to talk about
yesterday morning.
I attended alongside supervisor
bailey and angry the annual
transportation legislative town
hall forum put on by prt c, vre
and in vtc.
It's always great to bring so
many transit nerds into the
same building to talk about
transit in our region.
A lot of great conversations
come out of that.
My team was able to join rabbi
in the jewish community for the
menorah lighting and occoquan.
Wanted to thank the jewish
community in our county for
continuing that tradition then
supervisor gordy said, during
this rough period folks are
going through.
With that, I have nothing else
and I hope everyone has happy
holidays, happy kwanzaa, happy
hanukkah, merry christmas and
happy new year.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
you forgot for the rest of us.
All right.
Supervisor stewart
.
>> MR. Shorter: stole my
thunder and now it's time for
the grievances.
[Laughter]
i want to thank everybody who
came out to the gainesville
office for the open house.
T
was like 12 days of christmas
and thanks for being there
,
thanks for the support.
It was great posting you all
got a great time and can't wait
for christmas next year.
The next day the town or
haymarket, speaking about
artists, the best in the county
descended upon haymarket for
their town bazaar and tree
lighting.
It was a great time.
We had that haymarket polar
express train for the kids and
it was really great.
Yesterday I attended the
unveiling of
elevate 2030.
The prince william county
school strategic plan for the
next five years, which was
great.
This morning I attended the
ribbon-cutting for the veterans
care center on van til rd.
Really awesome facility.
Took some time to
get it done,
but from what I saw today it
was worth every bit of the
weight.
The governor was there for the
ribbon-cutting and for any
marine or sailor who knows the
name polar, this place was
aptly named.
And if there was going to be a
place dedicated to the whole
family, this was it.
I want to wish everybody a
happy holiday
, merry christmas,
happy hanukkah, happy kwanzaa.
This has been for me an amazing
year.
T the beginning of the
year I was in this room in a
completely different way and
now I find myself here.
Inside of that though, I want
to remember bob and his family
.
Especially at this time.
The first christmas without
first close loved one
, as well
as supervisor bailey
having just
lost her mom.
My prayers are with you
.
I know what that can be like
having lost both of my parents.
Another part of this year with
me reconnecting with my birth
family, as
many of you know.
I'm adopted.
And so that was a special thing
for me.
But I wish everybody all the
success for the remaining days
we have for this year and make
it a good one and I will see
you on the next one.
>>
Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor bailey.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you MADAM Chair.
On 10 DECEMBER I would like to
thank my staff and supervisor
franklin and county staff in
all the constituents who
attended the community meeting
to discuss the safety solutions
for potomac shores community.
It was an awesome turn out.
That's what we do.
Work together to resolve issues
.
On the 11th, thank you to my
staff who has been covering me
in the moments of losing my
mom.
I appreciate my staff covering
me and helping me pick but they
attended the 54 graduation
promotions ceremony here
congratulations to the seven
graduates who were promoted and
welcome to the team pick
supervisor stewart, I heard
integrate all that
they bash.
Your first he got an a+ and
thank you for the invitation
and embracing our staff to come
and participate in your open
house pick on the 13th quantico
national cemetery did the
laying of the wreaths across
america.
Thank you to my appointing for
attending the wreaths across
america for me in my absence.
As I graduated from the swanson
institute on DECEMBER 13.
It was an amazing nine months.
Thank you to staff, delivery,
roberts, sam and rebecca for an
exceptional guidance and
support in the program
.
That would helped me understand
the state of virginia a lot
more and helped me lead to
better in prince william
county.
I'm a graduate.
That was an amazing experience
.
On the 14th thanks to my
PRESIDENT Allison and the links
incorporated for partnering
with me in my office for toys
for tots this year.
Special thanks to that
organization in providing gifts
, all kinds of gifts to our
children less fortunate in the
community.
I'm excited about that being a
marine corps wife.
it's going to be a great time.
And we will be supporting the
shelter and the homeless
ministries on the local
communities and churches here
in prince william county.
Yesterday I did participate
with my colleague victor angry
and kenny boddye in the form
and it was exceptional pick we
are doing great things in
transportation across the
region.
We will continue to
make priorities in legislative
agendas our utmost to give
service to our communities as a
relates to strategic planning
and funding.
Last night was amazing is that
we supported doctor Mcdade in
the 23rd a strategic plan
.
Another opportunity to partner
together in this county for the
best of what we have and that
is the next generation so
congratulations on that.
Today my staff attended the
veterans care center
.
Here was outstanding
.
Thank you for supporting me in
that way.
128 bed skilled nursing for
virginia veterans and we need
that so much.
Upcoming events on the 17th.
Would like to thank my staff
for attending the sit fencing
at swans creek elementary
school
.
It is an evening holiday with
song so I know we are excited
about that.
And boys and girls
club, the big kid event
finality
.
On the 18th I will not be
attending and that is the
memorial service for my mom.
But thank you to my staff for
attending the copy holidays
.
I would like to wish all of my
colleagues.
I will
get the cards after
christmas.
And I hope you have a joyful
and peaceful and happy holiday
season and thank you to all of
you for your warm respect and
prayers and blessings for the
loss of my mother.
Thank you MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
This has been a really tough
year for the board collectively
and individually as people have
been dealing with a lot of a
loss this year.
The holes people we care about
leave in our hearts will always
be there.
Some days it will hurt more,
some days it will hurt less.
I was excited last night going
to elevate 2030, the school
strategic plan.
I have to say I was really
blown away.
Was really in all of what our
schools put together.
It shows having the right
leadership, having the right
people who care and who are
passionate about the work that
they do, there are no bounds.
When I was thinking about this,
it's funny how this came
together.
I'm going to do a directive for
children's.
I sent information around my
colleagues about what this
could look like at a local
level.
As for my directive, without
objection I would like to
direct the county executive to
work with staff to explore the
creation of a children's
cabinet to leverage the power
of community stakeholders to
address the needs of the youth
in our community.
The approach will bring
together local government
schools, health, human services
and other community-based
organizations to address
challenges related to the
issues of attendance, mental
health, housing instability,
workforce readiness, and early
childhood development.
This approach should consider
how the children to come that
would be structured to align
policies, resources, and data
around shared outcome for
families.
Especially from birth through
young adulthood.
While maintaining the legal and
physical responsibilities of
the county government and
public school system, this
model should allow for
quarterly the community system
that aligns efforts across
education
, health, housing and
social services for the
recommendation should include
the potential governance
structure of the cabinet model
with a list of potential
members and impacted steak
oldest, budget implications and
in the other items the board
should be aware of in the
creation in such a group.
The county attorney office is
directed to review the
information and recommendations
for legal issues but when the
work is complete the county
executive should report back to
the board of the recommendation
during the board meeting or by
memorandum as they deem
appropriate.
Supervisor vega?
Before thank you.
I do object
.
You sent this late last night.
But a quick review.
I understand the intent but I
will keep it short because I
know we are pressed for time.
I'm proud to say this
initiative is not needed in
here is why prince william
county has a children service
division which is a
state-funded pool for
eligibility for youth under 21
with emotional, behavioral
needs, fact
, multiagency teams
including schools, dss and it
plans are individualized
services like outpatient
treatment that mirrors the
proposal you have shared.
When the officer youth services
that promotes positive
development via evidence-based
programs, partners with
nonprofits for afterschool
resilience building.
With the child advocacy center
which houses in dss which
brings law enforcement,
prosecutors, mental health and
professionals, the
professionals together for
abused cases preclude the
strategic plan interagency tool
which shares data dedicated
liaisons, joint training and
school meetings which ensures
alignment with the spark
funding to the tune of 350,000
which supports cls and other
partnerships.
E have metrics
and accountabilities in prince
william county schools that are
tracked of the pass rates,
graduation data and family
engagement surveys but prince
william county uses enterprise
wide processes for service
delivery.
In summary into my colleagues I
will offer this the prince
william county framework in
interagency mechanisms via dss,
prince william county schools,
community services already
delivers coordinated data
driven support built in
accountability.
I don't believe we should be
adding another group,
especially when we really
haven't spoken to the school
division in regards to how this
is going to make, how it's
going to mean how it's going to
back policy.
I did a quick rundown.
I have a lot more because
there's a lot more detailed
breakdown, specifically to the
population if you will,
specific age.
Again, I am proud to say
everything detailed in a
directive is quite literally
already covered through all the
these other groups which we
should all be very proud of,
therefore we do not need this
initiative to be implemented
to.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I agree we have a lot of work
we are doing in the county and
there is better coordination
can always be there.
This is something I have
approached the schools about.
And it just to discuss it fully
but it's a directive to come
back with recommendations.
That there's nothing to be done
and there is nothing to be
done.
I have seen this in
other jurisdictions.
Up above to explore this idea.
But since there is an objection
we are going to have to make
this a resolution info on this.
Going to go ahead.
We can -- did you have
something you want to say?
>> Kenny Boddye: I was going to
second it.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
it has been seconded by
supervisor boddye.
Is there any further
discussion?
Supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: supervisor
vega, I appreciate you bringing
that forward.
I know that there is a lot of
cross agency work and you can
give great examples of what is
being done.
Print the analysis given is our
we duplicating efforts.
Is there room for something
else to enhance and d silo
further what is being done a
guy will be supporting it
because I think it would be
good fact-finding on the county
and all the colleagues in the
agency to look through that.
If it comes up it is redundant
and we don't need to do
anything else other than
enhancement to existing that's
fine.
If it comes forth and says this
is a new way to raise this to a
higher level, I am all for that
but the last thing I will say
is I like the idea of uplifting
children and families around
this pick would love to talk to
you further about having a
group like this to inform
futures report for the county.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega.
>> Yesli Vega: I hear
everything you've said and what
supervisor boddye added.
We often talk about the
pressures we talk about rick if
we took time to refresh our
memories and what we provide in
the county we would learn it
would be redundant but now we
are going to pile on additional
work on staff already burdened
with initiatives simply because
we want to.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor bailey.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair: I
appreciate what supervisor vega
is saying.
Didn't have an opportunity to
digest because we did get it
late last night.
We did have an opportunity to
really digest what you were
putting forth.
And thought I what we saw with
the school board is addressing
what you presented.
This is an
opportunity for us to partner
with the school board more and
partner with agencies more to
see where the needs are.
And I, like supervisor vega
, we
have seen a lovely great
transformative things being
presented to us here lately.
I don't want staff to be
overworked.
Mission is to GETb
understand
where we are.
so though I appreciate what you
presented, we are in the
pathway of doing that.
Would like to see that come to
fruition the impossible and
then if it is not what we want
come back with another
directive.
My concern is overworking staff
as they are trying to get a
rhythm partnering together to
make sure that programs we have
are relevant, makes sense, the
resources are there in the
funding is
there.
We are in it era right now were
nationally things are so
unstable that to put additional
things on them, I don't see it
right now
.
Though I would love to support
this, the timing is off for me.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
appreciate that.
I want to check on the stock
thing.
I apologize they got back so
late.
We have anti-bows and
directives the same day or last
minute.
We talking about staff.
I'm pretty sure I've been a
strong advocate for review
staff members would say I
haven't making sure the other
resources they need to do the
work in front of them to make
sure departments are adequately
staffed.
If people don't like
this for reasons such as
political reasons, I know that
nobody is going to name them.
Let's be honest.
We can use more coordination.
This is a directive.
I don't think it hurts for us
to look at things more
holistically.
Annecy were saying, I wasn't
sure in your point
.
If you can clarify.
If you can clarify
.
If you could take a moment to
clarify.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
first of all, not political
all.
I'm on the dais to understand.
What I mean by that is I don't
think it is fair for us to have
staff overworked and what is it
you are not clear?
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
you are saying there are other
ways to get after what it is we
want.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
what I meant by that getting
what we want, let them bring
back what they are working on
now with the data they have now
to assess what is needed.
And once they do that if it is
not satisfactory
, and
additional directive is needed.
I don't think it is needed
right now because of all the
transformative things they are
trying to grade to bring data
back to us to make sure the
programs in different agencies
are relevant from being so old
the.
That's where I'm going with
that.
It's not political.
I am
trying to make sense out of
what they are bringing to us
now.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
usa in getting the data back.
Are you making a directive?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
I'm not making a directive.
I'm saying we need to continue
with what they are bringing to
us now with the programs
supervisor vega resented.
And there are a plethora
.
Some we need to weed out, some
we need to keep.
But I think there
, they are in
a rhythm bringing things back
to us as well as our school
board.
This is not personal against
you.
I'm just saying information
coming to us is relevant and it
is information we haven't had
before.
Ot trying to make
it
personal.
I am just saying that's my
opinion.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I'm still confused.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
bottom line what I'm saying
it's not political, but I think
based upon what we saw last
night and a lot of it can be
resolved and what you're trying
to initiate if we work with the
school board.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
what I'm looking at is more
holistic and it's looking at
that coordination piece.
It's not needed.
If we have the data would not
have made this request.
The reason I'm making this
request is I would like staff
to look into this.
If it is nothing, it is
nothing.
I don't know if this is
overburdening staff.
i'm not asking for them to
create a new program
necessarily.
I'm asking for information.
I know we can go back and forth
.
If you would like to sit down
and discuss this, I'm
interested in.
>> I'm offering my 1/8 opinion.
I would like to discuss it
further.
In consideration of
what you are trying to propose,
there is something already that
you might want to consider
.
It MAY be an opportunity.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
you cut me off.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair: I
don't mean to cut you off.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
we are going to take a vote in.
I don't feel we have this in
place and that is why I offered
a directive.
Let's go ahead and take a vote.
>> supervisor angry?
>> Victor Angry: no.
>> motion fails 3/3
.
Hold on.
Three votes for no.
Upervisor
angry, bailey and vega.
Supervisor gordy abstaining
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I ask everyone to go see.
We are going to certify our
closed session so if somebody
can have a motion.
It has been properly moved and
seconded.
Let's take a vote.
Goes off the second
I get back
>> thank you, sir.
Vote unanimous.
supervisor frequent absent from
vote
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right
.
We have one thing to report
out.
Supervisor stewart?
>> I move we appoint susan
washington as human resources
director.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
let's go ahead and take a vote.
>> supervisor angry?
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
I don't know if you would like
to say something?
>> MR. Shorter: want to express
my appreciation for your
support and express my
enthusiasm, great enthusiasm to
welcome susan washington who
has served this community
extremely well.
She is over 25 years experience
in hr and I am very pleased we
now get to call susan, not
acting director but director of
human resources.
I don't know if you wanted to
say a few words.
[Inaudible]
Good evening chair
.
And cxo shorter.
I appreciate
this opportunity to continue to
serve my community, to support
the county and my colleagues
across the county and help lead
the office of hr for prince
william county.
I am very excited about this
opportunity.
I'm thankful my children are
here.
They are there to see this and
I appreciate your confidence in
me as we move forward.
Thank you so much.
[Applause]
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Everyone is really excited for
this new chapter in your
career.
I know we are right at 6:59 pm
but because we had to rush back
from closed session I'm going
to give the board a five minute
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
for us five minutes went by
fast.
I hope it did for us well.
We are moving to agenda item 13
a and that is the rezoning for
maple valley grove.
I would like to ask the
applicant to come forward to
the present.
Are we missing part of the
applicant?
All right.
Talk amongst yourselves.
We
gained a lawyer but we lost the
supervisor.
That's okay.
We still have a quorum.
>> good evening keri jeffers
and the members of the board.
My name is jonelle cameron with
walsh colucci leah bley and
walsh are on behalf of the
applicant, galveston crossing.
With me are representatives
from the applicant, the civil
engineering team, traffic
consultant and environment a
consultant.
Property is comprised of three
parcels and is approximately
23.43 acres in size.
Reference prince william pkwy.,
here is hoadley road and here
is galveston court.
The property is zoned a-1
agriculture and a small portion
is zoned into light industrial.
The properties comprehensively
planned mixed-use three.
The mixed-use three recommends
4 to 12 dwelling units per
acre.
This slide is an exhibit does
show how it fits in with
the
surrounding area.
Here is the shopping center,
here is the apollo development
that includes townhomes,
commercial and here is
additional commercial with
residential here and del or nor
here.
This slide is the layout that
shows the proposal.
The applicant is proposing 274
residential units which will
allow 242 multifamily stacked
units in the 32 traditional
multifamily units.
That up to 32 is because
multifamily building here is
proposed to be a lie tech
building.
That will be available to
people making up to 60 percent
ami.
If the building is not
approved, the applicant is
proffered this building would
be available to people earning
up to 80 percent ami.
The proposal is between 11.35
dwelling units per acre and if
there are 32 traditional
multi-units 11.69 dwelling
units per acre.
The proposed into the minds
with the comprehensive plan.
This slide shows the open space
plan.
The humor in the comprehensive
plan also recommends 30 percent
open space for the applicant is
proposing 55 percent as open
space to.
the applicant is proposing a 50
foot buffer alone prince
william pkwy.
In the area here there is a 20
foot great difference between
prince william pkwy. And the
property which requires
grading
within the buffer area.
The applicant is requesting
modified 30 foot buffer
adjacent to the shopping center
to the south.
This area here and here.
The applicant is integrated
instead of separated from it.
Providing a 50 foot buffer
adjacent to the shopping center
disrupts the walk ability
between the uses.
Although the buffer is 30 feet
the applicant signed a majority
of amenities to be along the
property boundary line.
Sorry.
So this here is the buffer
area.
It's a variable with.
There's a pinch point in this
area here which is 37 feet, but
with the amenities it ranges up
to 198 feet.
Applicant is proposing
amenities on site that are
walkable no matter where you
are in the community.
A little less than 1 1/3 acres
is proposed as the amenity
areas which include a community
garden, community park, pocket
park, fitness area and
promenade.
The multifamily building will
have a community located inside
of it.
The applicant is proffering the
monetary contribution of her
parks and recreation for
occoquan and neabsco greenways.
This slide shows the community
garden that provides outdoor
space for residents to plan
their own preferences and needs
in addition to plots shared
work in the form of potting
benches unseating would be
present as well.
This slide shows the community
park.
His is the primary
amenity
area in this portion of
the neighborhood and it
includes a playground for ages
two through 12, gathering
space
, long gardens and a
fitness area.
This slide shows a pocket park
and fitness areas
.
There are seating inventions in
this area here and in the
fitness area is in this area
here.
Finally we have the promenade
.
It's designed so when you come
into the site and looks great
ahead what you're looking at is
the promenade area.
That area and assess an outdoor
seating here alone area and the
possibility to have a library
station and or swing.
As part of the proposal the
applicant was required to do
and traffic impact analysis.
The traffic impact analysis
requires you to look at the
three intersections on the
screen.
It requires us to look
at levels
of service today.
The levels of service in the
future without the development.
The future requires you to take
a two percent per year annual
growth rate as well as include
any other projects that have
been approved and not yet
developed.
So for this specific site had
to look at the special use
permit that was approved of the
background trips and the need
to look at what is the level of
the service in the future
looking at the two percent
annual growth rate, the
doorbell nor approval and
project.
Because hoadley square was go
into the rezoning process at
the same time.
The county also asked the
applicant also include hoadley
square in their review all the
intersections operated on an
exceptional level of service
except for the intersection of
prince william pkwy. And
hoadley road feeling in the
future without the project and
with maple valley grove in the
proposed hoadley square, there
was an increase of delay by 5.5
seconds.
In calculating the proposed
trips for the development the
applicant did not take a
reduction for nearby transit or
walk ability, which is
something they are normally
allowed to do.
As you are aware, vdot started
the star study at the
intersection of hoadley road,
davis ford rd. In prince
william parkway.
That looks like at the entire
corridor were down to 234.
The study provided options for
intersection improvements
,
including at the intersection
of prince william pkwy. And
davis ford road.
The applicant provided the
monetary contribution of a
little over $71,000 for an
interim improvement
intersection of prince william
pkwy.
, hoadley road and davis ford
road.
Or along the court order.
This slide shows the interior
street network.
The street network is designed
with a structured hierarchy
prioritizing connectivity
,
functionality, accessibility,
efficiency, and safety for a
vehicular, bicycle and
pedestrian traffic.
As part of the project the
applicant will be relocating
the existing cul-de-sac at the
end of galveston court in this
area here in relocating that
into the development.
The applicant was also asked if
they can work with the adjacent
shopping center to obtain an
easement for pedestrian
connectivity in this area here
to have a direct connection
other than the on galveston
court to the shopping center.
In the event hoadley is not
approved, the applicant is
relocating galveston court
further into the development
which is in this area here.
This slide is a
interconnectivity exhibit that
demonstrates how vehicular and
pedestrian access would work in
the event hoadley road is
approved.
The red dashed line of the
vehicular
, the blue lines of
the sidewalks in the yellow
lines are asphalt trails.
As
part of this proposal the
applicant is over part by 55
spaces.
This slide shows the monument
signage.
This slide shows the stack
multifamily elevations.
The standards are updated and
don't necessarily align with
today's market
.
For this reason we are seeking
the modifications as a relates
to the multifamily stacked
unit.
The first is a modification to
increase the building height to
55 feet to allow for rooftop
terraces on the reduction of
the front setback to 25 feet.
The design guidelines different
materials, colors and bump outs
be provided to break up the
building.
This slide shows the
multifamily buildings the
applicant is seeking a waiver
modification for the setback.
In the next few slides I'm
going to review revisions to
the proffers made based on
feedback at the planning
commission public hearing.
The first change was requiring
30 percent of the units to
include bricks, stone, masonry,
siding or cultured stone.
The second revision was to add
a low impact development best
practice manager to the
property and essentially this
is a measure added to
stormwater management to help
with stormwater management.
And finally they added them
contribution is $31,046.28 to
be used for an interim
improvement along the corridor
were.
That concludes my presentation.
Am available to answer any
questions you all MAY have.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Does anyone have any questions
for the applicant right now?
All right.
Supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you for
the presentation.
Just a couple questions and I
will likely ask staff some of
the same issue areas their
constituents who talked about
three issues for
transportation, environments,
schools here can you talk a
little bit about, he talked
about the transportation piece
quite a bit and you said in
this case wasn't a bonus given
for transit, walk ability.
Can you talk more about that?
>> when you are doing traffic
impact analysis, each
project-based on the number of
units and type unit is assigned
a prep.
When you are doing this you
have to get it reduction in
your trip when you are near
transit or walk ability.
In this instance there a bus
stop specifically on galveston
court as well as alone hoadley
road and and there is the walk
ability between the shopping
center and the residential.
That allows for there to be a
reduction in trips on the
applicant did not do that
reduction in trips when it was
doing the traffic impact
analysis.
>> Kenny Boddye: you talked
about the star study a little
bit, but has there been
conversation around what the
interim improvement might be
that the contribution go
towards?
>> I started the star study,
they provided options.
In addition when is being
reviewed, prince william county
transportation also looked at
potential options
.
One of those was a triple left
on prince william pkwy.
.
Sorry to make you all dizzy.
Essentially the left turn lane,
these two lane left movements
that have that delay today in
seconds and then with both
projects it was adding an
additional 5.5 seconds.
One of the options potentially
was to re-stripe a through lane
to create another left turn
movement on hoadley road but
the county is looking at all
options to determine what is
the best interim option.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
to we will get there when you
get the county staff.
Thank you for that.
Ot of
folks or concerns about the
occoquan reservoir
and how this
feeds into that.
For starters, for the comp
plan we adopted and staff
recommendation, this was always
proposed to be in him you 3,
correct?
T wasn't supposed to
be -- nothing like that?
Appreciate that.
On the environmental piece, can
you talk about the storm water
management system and how that
compares the existing
conditions on the site?
>> absolutely pick on going to
have nat marshall who is our
civil engineer come and speak
on that.
>> good evening
.
My name is matt marshall.
I am the engineer for the
applicant.
The system is going to be two
parts.
It's going to be a level I what
pond and complemented now with
an lad.
We are going to do
at least one
but we are going to pursue work
fits where it provides the most
benefit.
They will be in treatment
someone will drain to another
to help improve the water
quality.
We are also doing what is
called general protection and
flood protection using the
energy balance equation such we
are mimicking the development
flows
to reduce downstream
erosion.
Be more friendly, if you will,
in terms of the post
development relative to the
predevelopment division.
>> Kenny Boddye: appreciate
that.
Last question for now.
Schools.
Some folks are concerned about
the schools impact.
Talk about the schools impact
on the options the school board
how should this could approved.
>> absolutely.
The elementary and high school
do not have capacity.
Prince william county looked at
the site as part of the
application.
Application gets distributed to
prince william county schools.
They call it and they provided
impact report.
there are other schools within
the district for elementary
schools that have capacity and
I have a couple of slides.
The slide here is what was
actually in the impact report
within the county staff report
that you received.
Marshall elementary, benton
middle and charles cogan senior
high school are the three
schools currently assigned.
Arshall and charles cogan are
overcapacity today pick with
this development they would
continue to be overcapacity.
What the county said it is the
14 high school will provide
additional capacity to address
overcrowding at the high
school.
It's the enrollment projections
do not reflect any potential
remedial measures the school
board has which includes
redistricting.
What we did is looked at the
elementary schools which is
carried out, marshall and penn.
Garrido has capacity in the
future and then we also looked
at the high schools prince
william county schools tom
mentioned which were hilton
high school and garfield in
both of those are under
capacity as well
.
Is a likely at the time the
school system is notified.
E
sold our first unit or our
first unit is about to be
occupied.
They would then look at the
schools and address
overcrowding which could
include redistricting the
students in this development to
a school that has capacity.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
any other questions.
Let's go ahead and have the
county percent.
>> in evening.
Scott meyer of the planning
office
.
Nice to see everybody.
You have already been oriented
toward the site is, is just a
couple of things
.
The site is right here.
It's along the prince william
pkwy.
This corner is entirely planned
is immune 3. Mixed use
neighborhood mixed-use.
It is not in the -- , but still
give natural features
.
Existing in even though there
are districts and descriptions,
we need to move mindful of all
the things.
The applicant is proposing to
rezone the plan mixed
residential of a total unit
count not to exceed 274.
It's going to be a mixture of
stock multifamily were stacked
towns
, as we sometimes refer
them to as.
Untraditional is going to be in
the eastern part of the site.
Staff is recommending approval.
Just a couple of things.
This is the current land use
and we are charged looking at
what the currently
induces among
other things.
It's along the prince william
pkwy.
One of the big issues is, and
I'm going to get into this
later.
the loss of areas and also
trying to preserve trees on
site to the extent practicable.
E have to balance that with
affordable housing component
which is also important.
This is just the context of the
analysis.
This is the design guidelines.
At issue in the site here in
position to
the intersection of
the parkway.
The next piece to be discussed
after this is to the west next
to dorrell nor.
As janelle it mentioned
, land
bait a is the stock multifamily
.
Thus the height increase is for
the stock multifamily.
It is not for the traditional
multifamily.
Just to clarify that.
This is the environmental
constraints analysis and we
have a staff from environmental
services here as well.
There are also a couple of
extra slides if we want to get
into that discussion.
But the point of this is there
are intact limits of clearing
and grading which is a good
thing.
A lot of the site is being
cleared.
How do we balance that with the
intent and the environmental
component of the conference a
plan.
We feel that is one of the
issues we feel could've been
better looked up.
Open space this is not the
develop open space which is
considerably more than what we
have.
Looked at the quality of the
design.
.
One thing we do wishes the
buffer along the parkway was
increased
.
It does meet the intent and the
50 foot buffer, but we feel the
height and with the massing
, on
the other side of the parkway
of a much more intact buffer.
We feel respectfully the buffer
should be increased and also we
feel that there is a thin
amount of pine trees along the
parkway.
Also, the applicants are
requesting to modify the buffer
to the south.
We
really feel that should still
be 50 feet because it is
backing up.
We want to have that
separation, but we look at all
these things she in
combination.
Not in isolation.
This is again, the public
street alternative.
You
are looking at the stock
multifamily and personal in the
traditional piece to the east
here.
Until the height increases only
for the stacked multifamily.
It is not for the traditional
there is also a setback
modification as well.
These are the elevations with
the stock multifamily to the
left in the traditional
multifamily to the right.
Just a couple of
things to point
out.
Overall we are supporting the
application.
we look at land use and design
and all those things.
However, we feel environment
our concerns.
We understand we are not going
to solve this all through the
districting issue, but we look
at what schools have provided
us.
Just a couple of things to
point out with the loss of
vegetated areas.
The need for increase on site
preservation.
We feel there could still be
great or tree preservation on
site and they could increase
the buffer by not losing a lot
of units by enhanced tree
preservation, particularly
along the parkway.
We feel there are still
opportunities for on-site tree
preservation.
The applicant based on the
planning commission discussion
did add a commitment for impact
development, but we feel
environmentally with a lot of
areas that will be gone and we
have to look at what the intent
of the environment policies
are.
So
the environment was a no.
Schools we feel there are still
unmitigated impacts based on
the scope capacity for the
elementary school.
We also have some concerns
about the analysis schools have
brought up they don't agree
with the methodology.
The applicant has done their
analysis.
We look at proffers as being
voluntary.
S just interesting
to point out this does not have
a monetary contribution for
schools.
But hoadley square to the west
does.
Do something to absorb.
And community design we feel
again, with an undisturbed
greater buffer along the
parkway louisville with a
greater buffer to the south
that could fully mitigate the
impacts.
But we look at everything in
combination.
With the modifications we are
supporting all of them.
We feel the contiguous buffer
for 40 feet that would be more
50 feet.
We ask for that numerous times
but we respect the applicants
position on that.
And we feel the setbacks are
based on the safety
requirements.
I would be looked at later on
in the site process.
With todd in combination
, the
planning commission recommended
denial.
There was a lotto
discussion because there is a
time with a potential itech it
component in the interest to
move this forward to the board
,
the planning commission
recommended did not know.
We have to note it was
recommended.
Staff is recommending approval.
Staff is still recommending
approval with revised proffers
dated NOVEMBER 26.
We feel this meets and directly
implements that
because that is
what the current plan land uses
.
We feel is proffered we are
going to have a cohesive
quality development,
multifamily housing options.
Most notably the affordability
component we have to look out
good things and the things that
could use improvement over all.
We feel this directly provides
greater housing and
affordability component and
also meets the intent of the
strategic plan.
With that I will be happy to
answer questions.
We have transportation staff
and I wanted to mention meals
at the health department as
well.
Nd planning commission
there was a lotto discussion
about septic and water quality.
With that, thank you.
I will answer any questions if
I can then we have staff as
well.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye then vegas be
too thank you for the
presentation and all of your
work on this
.
Can we go to transportation for
a second?
She split kevin, transportation
planning manager.
What specifically.
>> Kenny Boddye: sure.
Can you talk about the options
being talked out with the
interim staff for prince
william pkwy.
The ideas in the future?
>> we are zeroing in from the
left bound approach on the
parkway, but by no means is not
the only option.
There are other options as far
as a long term
improvements.
Not only can then be similar to
the improvements if that is
what is considered to be the
most feasible from an
efficiency standpoint, but
there are options being looked
at right now as part of the
stars study we should get the
results sometime in 2026 and
begin to move forward with the
project in the future
hopefully.
>> Kenny Boddye: 2026 is when
we will have the results?
>> meant 2026 the study will be
closed out.
>> Kenny Boddye: this is partly
a you question and partly
escott question
.
A box of the southern buffer
along the shopping center.
Can you guys helped me out in
terms of the balance sheet
between wanting and walking
multimodal time development in
this desire data buffers.
You guys like walk ability and
everything to be multimodal.
If you're pushing these back
that makes things less
walkable.
>> we look at a combination of
things.
The standard is to provide a 50
foot buffer between commercial
and residential.
There is a connection point
which is right here.
But we feel because this is in
the rear of the shopping center
is loading set forth in.
We feel that there is an
opportunity to still increase
the planning commission
.
I will say there was a
discussion of over shifting the
amenity area closer to the red
dot is
.
that was not done.
This is in the only way to do
this, but with a lookup with
the intent of buffering is.
With environmental services, is
there anything that you wanted
to do?
I want to make sure that I am
reflecting my we were holding
and winning the 50 foot
deceptive.
>> basically for minimum
standards and so with this
being it is backing the loading
area we wanted more screening.
It does allow for perpendicular
crossings.
Of your concern is walk
ability, they can certainly add
more crossings through the
buffer.
Ut being there going
to be walking back to where the
trucks are loading, that's a
concern for us which is public
safety.
>> Kenny Boddye: scott, last
one for me right now.
The light tech piece.
Can you talk about more about
that and how that works in the
thought process?
You talked about there was a
lotto discussion about that.
>> yes.
With the affordability
component
the applicant is proposing to
options.
We are looking at the light
tech component for the
traditional multifamily.
Or if not, they are looking at
where the traditional 80
percent of ami.
The planning commission, there
was an interest to keep this
moving in terms of the timing
with the funding.
I will let the applicant
explain more, but I will say
the planning commission, they
recommended denial to
procedurally still allow this
to move forward because it was
.
>> tonya washington, planning
director.
The first motion of the
planning commission was
recommendation of approval, but
it was a split vote so that
motion failed.
And made a
comment of the planning
commission nodded the planning
commission did not take action
on this obligation within 90
days, the obligation would then
move forward to the board with
an assumption of approval.
But I also make note that the
applicant discussed this a
light tech component they do
have an upcoming
deadline next
year.
Nd so I shared that for
their consideration.
And subsequently there was a
second motion to recommend
denial to make sure the
application can continue to
move forward to the board so
the board can take action and
if it were approved they could
presumably meet the light tech
application deadline.
>> Kenny Boddye: scott was
tagging in the applicant for
the light tech piece.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
did you have anything else?
>> the deadline to have your
light tech application is is
MARCH 15.
In the event it is not approved
the applicant add a specific
proffer
.
i can read that to you or just
reference it.
Proffer for b states in the
event the light tech
application is not awarded, the
building would be made
available making 80 percent
ami.
That would be in a portable
dwelling unit building and not
a market rate building.
You are welcome.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega.
>> Yesli Vega: scott, I have a
few questions for you.
Remind me what the total
acreage of this property is.
>> it is 22.4.
>> Yesli Vega: how many stacked
buildings are we talking about.
>> we are looking at the 242.
In terms of the buildings were
the units?
I'm sorry.
>> Yesli Vega: the buildings.
>> looking at the sticks
.
>> Yesli Vega: let me make it
easier.
What percentage of the project
is composed of stacked
buildings?
>> probably 80 percent.
>> Yesli Vega: okay.
You answered questions in
regards to proffers for schools
and traffic.
There was a comment made that
the pmr standards are outdated.
Can you expand on that?
>> maybe the applicant could
expand.
I know that we often get
waivers to meet current market
demands and development trends
.
Pmr, it's not uncommon to have
waivers that go with that.
One could say they are outdated
that I can't say that one way
or the other.
They are intended to have more
flexibility.
>> Yesli Vega: yup MS.
Washington behind to.
>> as part of the comprehensive
update, one of our big
objectives is to update the
zoning ordinance in full
alignment with the
comprehensive plan and as a
part of the scope of work we
will be looking up.
And actually, we already
provided to our consultant of a
sample of the waivers we see
frequently.
Related to the issues in terms
of zoning ordinance standards
and how they do or don't meet
with the policy goals of the
comprehensive plan
.
Pmr being a good example
because we see that often with
these types of applications
.
That is something we are
looking at so we can bring the
zoning ordinance standards a
better alignment with the
company and supplant and reduce
the need for waivers for these
types of circumstances.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you.
Back to you, scott.
You mentioned the concerns that
led to the planning commission
denial of this application and
you highlighted some.
I see there are two proffers
listed.
Or at least highlighted.
I know that there are more out
of the 21 is being accepted
with contingencies and the
other one stop does not support
as submitted.
No, I do know that there is a
request for waiver in regards
to parking but for public
record and awareness, can you
talk to me about the parking
situation?
>> the site as proposed
, they
are providing 40 or 50 spaces.
>> Yesli Vega: it is going
over?
>> yes.
Based on the minimum
requirements because with these
condo developments parking is a
concern on site
.
>> Yesli Vega: okay.
And then the last question I
have is in regards to buffers
.
You talked a lot about the
buffers and I know that was a
point of great discussion
during the pc hearing also.
My concern stems, I know you
talked about the buffer along
the parkway, but I know we
received concerns in regards to
the buffer that abuts the
commercial property.
Based on my understanding of
your comments, this has been a
request made but I guess we
haven't been able to reach
common ground?
>> that is correct.
We feel it should be increased
to 50 feet.
>> Yesli Vega: those are all
the questions I have for now.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
does anyone else on the dais
have questions?
All right.
If not, I'm going to go ahead
and open the public hearing for
agenda item 13 a and that is
maple valley road to.
I already have a list of people
who have signed up to speak in
person and I'm sure there are
more.
I'm going to call you in groups
of five.
You have three minutes.
If you are with an organization
recognized by the board you
have five minutes and we cannot
have two people from the
organization.
Would like to start with MR.
Martin, delta nichols
, larry
brenneman
, chris cummings and
then jessica francis.
Would like to remind everyone
to make sure you state your
name clearly and in the
magisterial district where you
aside.
You don't need to give your
home address it.
Make sure you adjust the
microphone so we can hear you.
That is very important.
>> good evening.
My name is martin.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
adjust the microphone.
>> my name is martin.
I live in the occoquan district
and me representing the civic
association and I would like
the extended time if I could.
I want to welcome MR. Stewart
to the board
.
I look forward to working with
you.
Ready had a fairly short
conversation but looking
forward to working with you in
the future.
Want to thank the applicant
coming ultimate county civic
association and sharing the
information on the program.
We digested their information
and took a look at the project
and send a letter to the board
previously from the mid-county
association in prince william
county conservation alliance
asking that you deny the
application.
And I want to go into some
reasons why.
Just a little background on
this area
.
And referring to the slide I
have appear now, the area was
previously in the comp plan
before this was all semi-rural
residential.
Including the parcels were
maple valley road is.
That semirural residential is
2.5 acres for home average
density in a course the one we
have now is five acres per
home.
It has been recognized for a
long time in the county
combines a plan and even for
the
county combines and plan, and
this area of the county is
environment lease incident in
is the watershed area that
should be protected such as
fairfax county did many, many
years ago in the area on the
occoquan.
So this area was in the srr but
for whatever reason in the new
comprehensive plan that was put
into a much higher density
designation which is mu3.
We don't agree with that
change.
We think this creates a
situation where you have a
transition that is really
unworkable between the mu3
designation and the designation
which is one home per five
acres
.
It is hard to have a transition
between that much of a
difference in these density
recommendations.
And I might mention that the
maple valley grove project is
right at the top of the density
range and so we have a range
and I will talk about that in a
minute.
But the project is right at the
top of that.
From the very beginning we
didn't see a way forward.
We like to work with the
applicants, would like to work
with the community and make
improvements to a project, but
it was so far out of scale what
was around that we didn't feel
we could do that with the
application.
So since it is in mu3 we have
to recognize the reality of the
situation and it is in the comp
plan so developers are going to
develop based on that.
Was sober, going to the lower
end of the density range in a
situation like this where you
are in an area where young much
lower density
around it.
They provide for a better
transition to the other areas,
other parcels.
And it would also enable the
applicant to do some things the
staff is wanting to do with
larger buffers.
It would enable them to
preserve more of the trees.
If you talk to your arborist
you will find that this parcel
is completely wooded it with
the good-quality forest.
So this project would involve
clearcutting most of the woods
and it would involve a lot of
impervious surfaces added to
this project.
We would look, going to the
lower end of the density scale
and that would enable you to
protect a lot of the sensitive
forest and less impervious
surfaces and make a better
transition to the surrounding
areas.
We did talk briefly to the
applicant about the any meeting
and that wasn't something new
that
they were interested in
doing.
I just will say along with
their planning commission who
did recommend denial, and of
course they were deadlocked and
they went ahead and moved it
forward to.
But they did recommend denial
and also prince william
conservation alliance I sent a
letter recommending denial.
That is our position on this.
We appreciate the time and I
will see you again in a few
minutes.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
For that I request five
minutes, please.
Hopefully he to you is doing
well.
The maple valley grove, this
proposed development is
proposed in the wrong location.
The idea of a development
nothing against it but the
location is not good.
When you think about the high
density and being in the middle
of a transportation desert, it
just doesn't add up.
We hear people talk about walk
ability.
walk ability is a big variable.
If you live in a community you
a favorite spot that you want
to go.
Of your favorite grocery store,
you of your favorite hardware
store, so on and so forth.
And you MAY not
, the people MAY
not want to go and shop any of
these businesses right next to
it.
And so when you think about
walk ability
, let's be real.
It is only a theory.
Now, this area is already
overly saturated with traffic.
And when I came over here of
5:30 P.M. This evening so I
could sign up to speak
, on the
principle william parkway
backup coming for manassas was
just about a half-mile.
And when you think about that
kind of congestion which is
typical for basically any day
of the week.
That is not acceptable.
Why would we want to pack I
high density development with
274 units into an already over
saturated intersection of a
parkway
.
Now, keep in mind that the
mosque is going to expand in
the future.
You are going to have even more
traffic.
And so I think we need to think
this through very clearly and
not be prone to say yes just
because someone asks the
question.
To consider the location
, this
location, it's likening to
trying to hammer a round peg
into a square hole.
When you think about this,
there are a lot of other areas
in the county in which this
would be the ideal development.
Ideally among transportation
hubs
.
And I can never figure out why
we sometimes seem to consider
developments in isolation from
some of the other factors that
are interlocked.
They are interwoven in the same
campus.
He can't consider one
without the other.
You can consider building
houses without considering the
transportation because in the
process of doing that, and
create a larger problem than
the overused phrase the
unintended consequences
.
The truth of the matter is
you're going to have to come
back later and fix those and
they are going to cost you more
, cost us more later than they
do today.
Maple valley grove would place
a lot of pressure on this small
corner of the county.
Oversaturation in this
particular location already
suffering from congestion and
vehicles.
The planning commission as it
was stated already recommended
disapproval and asks you to
please consider the big
picture.
Don't consider this in
isolation, considerate with
all
the pieces that go together
that make up the whole.
'm
under the impression now that
we perhaps consider one or two
pieces of this in disregarding
the whole.
Think about the consequences of
it just MAY not be so positive.
So I am asking you to vote no.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Can you
hold on?
We are not going to have any
outburst of applause.
Second of all, if you can say
the magisterial district where
you reside, it's very
important we get everyone's
name and where they reside
.
>> Public Speaker: I thought
already said that, but I reside
in the occoquan district
.
Supervisor kenny boddye is my
supervisor.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
you don't need to give your
address.
Unless you want me to show up.
>> Public Speaker: my wife just
made some cookies.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
that's not what I need.
Say your name and magisterial
district.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
larry.
I'm in the coles district I'm
just a resident.
I would ask the board to vote
no on the current versions of
the projects pick up relays we
are talking about maple growly
grove, but as the previous
speaker spoke about, hoadley
square is abutted right up to
this project so just as the
principal the planning
commission have done.
I understand progress and I in
in favor of it, however,
progress should be
strategically planned.
Stay within the confines of
previous planning and do what
is right for the surrounding
area as well as prince william
county.
These housing projects do not
fit in the locations proposed.
Other board approved projects
such as trenton falls fit into
hunter's ridge in lake
communities.
Although two separate projects,
hoadley square in maple valley
should not be considered in
isolation.
Instead of 40+ homes covering
81 acres about these
properties, these projects
proposed 553 housing units
combined.
This introduces an overwhelming
amount of traffic and has of
our middle and school
implications and then I propose
projects I kings grove, the
mosque expansion, you
completely inundated and
overwhelmed hoadley road.
Not sure about the parkway but
I assume it will be overwhelmed
as well.
I live in pencil and county
since 1983.
But my first home in 1989.
Y
second home just down the road
in 2013.
We use hoadley road and prince
william every day.
My life and I would love to
retire here.
Please vote no on the current
versions of the projects.
Said the applicant back and
stay in the prince william
county 2040 comprehensive plan
and as parameters and protect
our water resources.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: good evening
members of the board of
supervisors.
My name is christopher
cummings.
I live in the occoquan
magisterial district and I have
been there since 1996.
It seems recently all we get
our increased taxes, or data
centers, and more high density
housing.
The maple valley grove proposal
if passed will, I believe,
impose unreasonable burdens on
the transportation
infrastructure as well as a
watershed area that buffers the
occoquan reservoir.
Identity housing should be
steered to areas with high
capacity transit like vre nodes
and not to major road in the
sections already heavily
burdened with traffic.
The impact on schools has been
mentioned here, but the
solution town tenuous and iffy
to me.
Is a crucial consideration.
A huge amount of impervious
surfaces in the hoadley prince
william pkwy. Area detract from
the watershed and threaten
those of us nearby who depend
on well water from our homes.
It matters the planning
commission at a lotta concerns
about this, but that only tells
part of the story.
I think this is an ill-advised
plan and should be denied and I
ask you vote no
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker.
ask everyone speaking make sure
the microphone is close so we
can hear you.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
My name is jessica and I am an
occoquan resident and I am
happy to call prince william
county my home.
Appear to speak about both
maple valley grove and hoadley
square since they are together
at this point.
I know something I will say.
People touched on the impacts.
I was at the pc meeting as well
and thought it was really
important they shared.
It was a 1000 percent impact,
which I thought was really
minimal.
I think both these communities
my thought is being close to
existing retail, commercial,
businesses I shop at, I'm
happy to see that they are near
businesses like that that I
want to stick around and be
supported in the long-term.
I think that makes a sensible
fit for where it is at work on
a personal note I am a parent
of a to and half-year-old so I
care deeply about crating
places my to and half-year-old
can be raised.
Want to be here for the
long-term so I hope when you
think about the projects which
I'm in support of because they
of amenities and are close to
the shopping that you guys
think about invoices like us
who want to live here for the
next
20 to 30 years and I
appreciate your time today.
>>
Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor: I
should have called up my next a
bunch.
Shley, norman, gary
o'brien and paul howard.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
norman stone.
I live in the occoquan
district.
I would like to mention
something we are talking about
tree buffers and other things.
Walkways to the shopping
center.
The most important things are
the traffic, number of cars in
the hoadley square develop an
is going to bring.
It's already tough getting out
of my neighborhood which is
lost creek court.
During friday you would be
lucky to get out within 30
minutes.
I don't know where they got the
numbers of prince william pkwy.
Only being a five second delay
on a car.
What world do they live in?
And also, the schools
.
There were statements about
overcrowding and if they could
handle this development and I
didn't hear
it a clear answer
what the future would bring.
Virginia is doing the study on
hoadley road now, but they
haven't come up with any
solution we are talking about
adding more problems to the
road.
Wouldn't it be wise to get the
first solution corrected before
we start adding anymore
possible traffic?
Something that is going to be
here forever.
If you approve the project and
they start it, there's no
turning back.
we might lose water also in the
reservoir across the occoquan
reservoir and it seems there is
more loss of water than gaining
of water.
That should be important to the
board.
Traffic, schools and water
.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please
.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
My name is ashley.
Speaking on the half of the
prince william conservation
alliance and I request five
minutes and I'm from the
occoquan district.
So the principle of them
conservation alliances and
environmental nonprofit.
We've been operational for 20
years in the county and we
focus on creating equitable and
sustainable communities
throughout our wonderful
county.
So martin outlined the lot of
the main points I wanted to
hit, but there are a couple
things I wanted to mention in
highlight again.
In relation to maple valley
grove proposal.
First, the site is forested and
it is located in the occoquan
reservoir watershed.
So from an environmental
perspective there's no
environmental reason why the
parcel was excluded from the
occoquan reservoir protection
area when it was created it was
upland for development.
As a result we are facing a
proposal that would pretty much
clear cut and percent of an
intact forest in the watershed
that supplies the drinking
water up to a million
residents.
We keep seeing this erosion
across the county.
Is parcel is located and what
they are referring to as so
forest built
.
And actually, if I can get this
little do hickey here we can
see it together.
This is the forest built.
Anyway, we will have to go with
it but the light green area is
the force belt that extends
from prince william forest all
the way in the fairfax and it
protects most the headwaters of
the streams that flow toward
the eastern end.
Neabsco creek.
I am sure I am leaving.
But also the area in the
reservoir.
So this proposal represents
further outward expansion
.
Those red areas on the map end
of the landscapes that play a
critical roll protecting our
waterways.
Each of these decisions MAY
seem small but collectively
they add up to a steady
erosion.
From a small group perspective
we would prefer to see the type
of development in higher
density directed to the red
areas and areas of a structure
exists and we can build a
critical mass needed to support
existing public transit hubs
walkable communities.
Rather than continue to push
develop an outward.
Which
undermines those goals.
of the proposal MAY be
consistent with the
comprehensive plan, it reflects
the long-standing pattern of
wood locks and agriculture
lands because it easier and
more profitable to do so the
redevelopment.
Phone as we fill meaningful
incentives for redevelopment or
incentivized conservation, this
is the types of things we will
be continuing to seek and get
someone to lead with what if we
had a goal of maintaining our
existing tree cover
introduction seriously.
How would be billed than what
if we had a goal to reduce salt
in the occoquan reservoir and
what would development look
like if that was our goal.
Pw see accreted the vision to
start to play with these
questions and so much more in
this application should
consider reducing the density
so we can cluster and protect
more the tree covered at the
very least.
Thank you very much
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: name is paul
howard.
I have lived in the occoquan
area since 1987 and I am
currently a resident in the
forest development of lost
creek ct.
The addition of high density
housing on the corner of
trenton and the parkway is
going to greet an additional
nightmare.
I'm not too sure where the five
top five seconds comes from,
but it took me almost 8 minutes
to make a left turn from the
parkway onto hoadley yesterday
evening.
I'm not sure how that
translates to 5.5 seconds.
There are a lot of things to
like about these developments.
The low cost housing for
believers responders that live
in the county.
Is much better places to put
these.
Hopefully near transportation
hub.
I have the misfortune of
trying to get the bus to
potomac mills from the trenton
bus stop and it took an hour.
I don't consider that practical
for people living in these
proposed developments to use
public transport.
We are going to have to use
cars and as far as the walk
ability to the shopping center,
I don't want to be loading bags
from harris teeter all the way
back to my house on the hoadley
square or the other
development.
That's not going to happen.
No one will do the shopping and
then lug it all back to the
house that is just not the way
it works will be realistic
about that.
You could talk about 50 feet,
30 feet.
Another 20 feet when you're
carrying your groceries doesn't
really matter.
I'm not in favor of either of
these developments and I think
we could be moved much better
locations in the county near
transportation hubs where
people can use transportation
to get to jobs and shops, etc.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: thank you
for this opportunity.
My name is gary o'brien.
I'm from the coles district.
The proposed rezoning of the
occoquan reserve protection
area proposed trenton amico
valley grove development brings
back disturbing memories of the
initial rezoning in the rural
crescent in 2001 for the 305
acre preserve at long branch.
Some of you remember that.
First of all, calling it a
preserve is an oxymoron.
Every buildable portion was
stripped of trees.
The argument was it would they
be
, it would subsequently be
used by developers and their
lawyers as a precedent for more
rezoning within the rural
crescent watershed.
Investment
co. And the prince william
conservation alliance and
others not correctly predicted
with any of the supervisors
voted to eliminate the rural
crescent 170,000 acres or 52
percent of the county landmass
,
which removed substantial
portion of the occoquan
watershed from adequate
protection.
What we didn't foresee was
homebuilders like selling their
rezoning linda data centers
which are exploding with
general crescent another
formally protected watershed
areas are protected watershed
acres are gone forever.
Like I said, here we go again.
There once again saying it's a
small intrusion into a newly
created for much-needed
housing.
Exact excuse used last time.
the only difference at this
time it was argued was we
needed the upscale housing to
attract industry
.
Boy did that backfire.
It sad to watch decision so
shortsighted the provide
instant gratification of the
cost of painful and expensive
subsequent outcomes will live
to regret putting highly
density housing lynn takes away
more water absorbing critically
needed resources reducing
flooding, rapid water runoff
scours the stream thanks which
filled the occoquan reducing
the amount of water it can hold
as well as reduce its water
quality.
Rainstorms are getting more
severe globally.
If he continued to pay over the
critical forest as well as not
update our stormwater
management guidelines, we are
asking for more trouble ahead.
The proposed projects would
further permanently harm the
occoquan reservoir they don't
allow for enough tree buffers
there are not enough classroom
seats available for high
density housing.
That threatens nearby woods and
it is too far for mass transit
and would further exacerbate
the problems in prince william
pkwy.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I'm going to call the next
group but I do ask, this is
going to be a very long night.
Particularly for people
speaking on all the cases
tonight.
I'm going to ask for decorum.
When your time is up be
respectful because we have a
number of people who want to
speak and I know no one wants
to stay here until zero dark
30.
I hope no one wants to stay
here until zero dark 30.
Before get to the next speaker
I will call up minnick stupid
people.
Paul, william, michael
, clancy.
If all of you all can go up
there.
You can go to the microphone.
You can also adjust it.
I want to make sure we hear you
and everyone else.
Just stay there.
Don't move.
You MAY begin.
>> my name is anne stephenson
and I reside in the occoquan
district and my property is
adjacent to the current horse
farm that they would be hoadley
square I came to the county in
1970.
To teach school.
Dale boulevard ended at derby
dale at the time
.
Lived in my current health
since 1990
.
I have seen the widening in
forcing the building of the
parkway
.
I've seen it all actually.
The two projects together, it's
hard to talk about one without
talking about the other
.
There are good developments but
not on this area.
Not for the kind of land they
would be built on and not the
traffic it's going to
exacerbate.
the clearcutting of the maple
valley grove area is
disturbing.
It's an environmentally
sensitive area and we have had
meetings over the last year or
so within normal experts they
feel the area should have been
placed.
It is very sensitive.
As wetlands
.
It is close to our pas just
like the horse farm area there
.
Whatever is done on the land
maple valley grove will affect
on down the area where the
horse farm is and into our
neighborhoods we are concerned
about our wells into houses on
the street already have had to
redraw their wells.
This is a sensitive issue and
we have a right to be concerned
with it.
Added to that in the mosque
expansion are unimaginable.
Maple valley grove is going to
be landlocked
.
Is only one road going into the
and that is galveston.
Galveston will also be the main
road bringing the cars in and
out of hoadley square.
You can imagine all the people
in the morning and at night
coming down to galveston trying
to get out.
Is a light but there's also
another new light thereby the
mosque when you and the parkway
very close.
He traffic jams
and gridlock are going to start
on galveston pour out
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
your time is up.
Next speaker.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
bill.
I've lived here for 30 years in
the occoquan district.
The planning commission denied
this I'm sure for
great reasons.
You got that against it.
The biggest thing for me is the
traffic congestion.
T's a zoo
out there already.
On fridays the mosque has a lot
of people.
And it does add half an hour.
I would by the intersection of
purcell and hoadley.
When I have to get to the
parkway going south toward old
bridge, it's taking me forever
.
When I forget about it's friday
afternoon, I'm in trouble.
But you put in the light over
there by the mosque which is
great.
The police are still out there
for what eight hours?
The start before noon they
don't stop until after 5:00.
It is not just one cop.
Have a bunch of cars down the
road and they are all there.
Light is not doing it.
I can't imagine what the
intersection of galveston and
hoadley will be like.
The only way into and out of
their
.
Women heading east and I have
to get in there, that's the
only way
.
When I want to go to frosty
moose I have to thread my way
over there
.
there are a couple ways but
they are heading west if I want
to turn around and go back
toward the parkway I have to
wait in the separate left-hand
turning lane to turn around.
Can there be a separate
left-hand turning lane for the
new intersection
.
There can.
When you look at it the way you
set it up now heading west on
hoadley after galveston there
is a left-hand turning lane.
There's no way to backup a new
left-hand separate turning lane
to get into galveston.
It is going to be a zoo and if
they are talking about 3700
additional trips out of
galveston, that's insane.
I don't know where the two
percent figure came from, but I
can imagine this place grew
.
It was a whole lot more than
that.
That is a little too much.
I can't imagine that was
happening.
F it was the same
density as the stuff near penn
elementary, I guess that would
work.
But that's unbelievable.
And there are other places.
I have been up and back over by
costco for the last couple
weeks.
On either side of ashton avenue
.
There are already constructed
entrances into vacant land.
It seems like nobody can be a
good place.
I very much hope you're getting
rid of this thing.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
next speaker, please.
Spoke on michael.
On reside in occoquan district.
I spent the last several weeks
walking our communities.
I have been taught over 300
houses and universally every
single person I talked to that
I encounter walking dogs, they
were shocked and irate when
they found out the details of
the two projects.
Maple valley and hoadley
square.
Mostly speaking about maple
valley.
He density is what
was shocking to them.
They were appalled this is
being considered for this place
in the county.
I grew up working for my father
who owned a construction
company.
I know growth is a part of this
county.
I've been here since I was born
1979.
My grandmother sat on the
school board.
I understand the challenges
from having conversations
across the dinner table.
The fact the schools are
looking up this the way they
are on the fact when I talk to
people that have a lived
experience every
day like myself
, this didn't project in the
shape it is today is being
considered for a vote.
It's horrifying to those of us
who live here.
I'm not saying l1 as he glanced
exactly as it is.
We grow.
We improve the community around
us.
This particular project is too
dense for the current
transportation schools.
What I would ask is to consider
looking at things holistically
against all the projects being
considered an offer real world
solutions.
Turn lane for the parkway is a
laughable solution.
Look at what is being done with
the overpass.
That is a more recent solution.
We need real solutions that
exist today before the project
is put in place.
We have real challenges that
need to be addressed.
Thank you for my time.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker, please.
>> Margaret Angela Franklin:
>> Public Speaker: my name is
james highland park we recently
relocated from the subdivision.
My wife and I fell in love with
the neighborhood 22 years ago.
There was a horse farm in the
bryson substation on hoadley
road.
Obviously things have changed
quite a bit over the years.
We couldn't handle the
congestion and frustrations of
the friday traffic alone, let
alone all the other development
proposals.
We relocated to montclair.
High density growth in a small
congested sector is not
intelligent, well-planned
development.
The result is a plethora of
danger and safety concerns
together with environmental and
quality-of-life issues.
The building codes developers
must abide by.
Although your transportation
code sound accurate, I have to
wonder about the practicality.
When the population quadruples
in the same two lanes on the
road network, something is
definitely wrong.
All this suggests the primary
emphasis is on tax revenue and
appeasing the interest of one
group over the betterment of
all.
Thank you very much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
before we get to the next
speaker want to call up my next
group.
Doctor jack, andrew
, nancy and
julie
.
All right.
You MAY proceed to.
>> Public Speaker: I'm clancy
phenol lakewood occoquan civic
association.
In occoquan district.
I been in the same house since
1973.
More than three months.
Five minutes, right?
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
if you get the five minutes
then doctor jack can't get it.
>> Public Speaker: you get that
then.
He will give you the history
.
I served on the comp plan
committee and I served on the
csm committee.
We tried to protect occoquan,
our drinking water, all that
you and all that everybody in
this room other than those of
you who are on a well.
That's our legacy to protect
it.
And not overburdening the river
with inappropriate developments
.
We are putting in an urban
center in the middle of our
so-called rural area
.
I have a question.
The staff said they are going
to try to get trees preserved,
but I didn't hear the county
arborist made any sense that
you could have trees where you
could clear cut everything.
I know we worked with ridge
development for years trying to
retain as many trees as we
could in lake rachael and that
is why you have trees there,
but the fact of the matter is
when 1/4 acre lot you can save
some trees
.
On this thing there's no way
you would have trees anywhere
except in the buffer and they
don't want to have a buffer.
Needs to have as much buffering
as possible.
MAY be a golf cart path between
the development and shopping
centers of people who can't
carry poorer buybacks can hop
in their golf cart like they do
in florida and drive down there
and go shopping in the shopping
center.
We need, I know we ignore this
but we need to look at the d
csm to say what kind of
development standards do we
want.
Fairfax county has done not we
have not.
Our stop is way behind the
curve trying to preserve the
occoquan reservoir is a
drinking water source.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker.
>> Public Speaker: good evening
MADAM Chair.
I wanted to wish you a.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
doctor jack, thank you.
>> Public Speaker: 11 occoquan
magisterial district.
Wanted to welcome george
stewart and wish you the best
for holidays and new year
ahead.
Would like to ask for five
minutes.
I don't know if I need it.
I served on the original
committee over 15 years ago
when we recommended to be
created.
We had high hopes but we were
very much gratified to see this
happen with the 2022 comp plan.
Was wonderful but we don't
have something like an
ordinance that could
institutionalize some of the
things one would expect.
I would like us to collectively
think about that what we might
do to move in that direction to
have guidance, text and stuff
that would have expectations
for performance.
That would be very helpful in
our decision-making process
moving forward to.
And currently the site is a
very heavily wooded site.
It's only 23.4 acres and when
it came into the belt
committee, we do what we
normally do.
Extend are welcome to the
applicant we try to be as
objective as we can.
We work in the guidance of the
former german for 23 years and
he would say hey guys
, what if
the board approves the project
any misgivings you walk away or
do you continue the dialogue.
His recommendation was always
continue the dialogue.
walk away.
We did meet with the applicant
more than once.
The last time was JULY 31.
The committee had mixed
feelings about this high
density
.
We weren't enthusiastic for the
project we had mixed feelings
for a lot of the high density
in
the area.
But we understand when the
transportation solutions to
move hoadley road westerly
occurred, and set up a major
network all the way it is the
root 234 and set up the growth
and development patterns for
developers
.
B& a part of the normal result
you see with the developers
coming in looking at the comp
plan in here you have the mu3
and comp plan for mu3 and at
the higher end.
I just want to say we support
element in here that try to
provide for green space,
continued green space along the
parkway.
The 50 foot buffer along the
parkway, we fully support that.
We were talking about the
pedestrian walkway there
, but
that was taken out and we
understand having the full 50
foot buffer.
Of the planning commission
there was much discussion
regarding the 30 foot buffer to
integrate it with amenities
along the property line is a
good idea, but you have the
backs of the shopping center
that need more buffering so I
think staff recommendation to
look at beefing that up is a
reasonable one
.
We should take that only got it
more carefully and see what
could be done there to improve
it.
We are asking for stormwater we
have a proffer which we
supported and we would like to
encourage dialogue with the
applicant for controls
,
including things later on we
will see applications on the
reservoir.
That would to be a very good
thing.
And so with that we are
comfortable offering those
suggestions thank you very
much.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker.
>> good evening.
Can you hear me okay?
Good evening chair
jefferson and
supervisors.
My name is nancy and I'm the
occoquan resident.
I've lived in the county for 38
years.
I'm come tonight to ask you to
vote no to the maple grove
project for the reasons for
denial have been eloquently
expressed by the previous
speakers.
Y main issue is
the potential impact on the
occoquan reservoir in our
drinking water.
The other issues are traffic,
the impact of schools and the
overall environmental impact
.
For the record I am requesting
you deny the hoadley square
project for the same reasons.
Please protect the occoquan
,
the water I drink in the water
that 800,000 people drink in
this region.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I have a couple more people.
I will call up MR. Richard as
well and nathan higgins.
>> good evening.
Can you hear me?
Okay, great.
My name is julia and I am in
the occoquan district
.
I am a resident here and have
been disappointed to hear this
type and development is coming
into this area.
I moved here specifically
because I somehow green and
protected the area was.
I saw there was the put in
place and how that felt that
was a great sign for the
community to show they take
their watershed seriously, they
want to protect the trees and I
would really like this area was
protective of the reason.
Have been very disappointed to
see the projects will chip away
at the protections given
.
Our houses off of the well
.
Worried about drinking water.
Thinking all the issues that
would come from not having a
house with water.
That is something that keeps me
up at night.
It sounds like this area for
maple grove, even though it is
technically not in the orpa it
will have impacts which is
definitely where hoadley square
is planning to go.
I've seen the plans, it seems
80 percent covered in concrete.
But the big buildings in the
parking lots and I'm very
concerned about the storm water
runoff.
And so I would request that if
there is some kind of
development here to greatly
reduce it to look at having
something that is required to
have the four houses per acre
.
Something, I believe some
dimension before some kind of
trade-off that is not the same
requirements but it could be a
transition period location.
Also worried about the traffic
everything is going from what
I've been able to see in and
out of galveston.
Road in the is going to be for
the very dense communities
adding all the extra cars
trying to get on to hoadley.
I also live in the hoadley area
and can imagine how we would be
able to reach principal and
parkway again.
I appreciate your time.
I urge you to vote no
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> good evening board, chair
jefferson!
My name is andrew.
I live in the occoquan
district.
I move from fairfax county to
hoadley behind the mosque.
Our whole desire was to get
away from the high density, the
high-traffic and to seek peace
.
I highly recommend you vote no
and the type space area.
And for the reasons is high
density.
This is meant for an easy
transit is all the other
speakers it is not easy transit
to get to 95 and to 66.
You are putting these people
everyone is arguing for I do
more of a disadvantage in the
strength of the infrastructure
on the occoquan district.
That creates a domino effect of
taxpayers pay more taxes to
increase the bus infrastructure
and if the metro made it this
far, anything like that versus
keeping intact the way it is
and we say develop and improve
the district
.
Select another area.
On the schools, all they offer
is rezoning.
As of today of four first grade
classes, for second grade at
mass convexity 21.
He developed the new homes and
you are bringing in new younger
families, what do you think
that will impact?
Rezoning will not solve the
problem so infrastructure once
again not sustainable.
Taxes go up.
We talked about from prince
william county within five
years fairfax county people not
be able to live in the county
because of the property tax
because it was poor planning
infrastructure and starting to
fall apart again.
To take into consideration the
community being developed as we
speak.
There are 1015 homes be
developed that would create
5000 more trips per day and
that is on a standard two-car
household.
Many have kids who drive, and
laws to live with us and so
increase that number.
As we talked about the effects
of maple grove, it does not
fall on orpa but it would
affect the 800,000 people that
that water system provides
.
With in my neighborhood we have
all wells in the houses so when
you start developing that close
to our development we will
start impacting our water
systems which could cost
anywhere from $10-$30,000 to
have a well wheeled we drilled.
I say do not approve this
project.
I am all for development.
Dear company developed cannibal
in fairfax and oakton view
which is more along the lines
of our occoquan area and so I
recommend those types of
projects.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
richard welsh,
occoquan district
.
For the barrington oaks
neighborhood.
I do want to be too repetitive.
I want to add my voice or do
new to deny the application.
The traffic impacts will be
horrendous, the environment
will impact will be horrendous
.
And concerned about the aquifer
levels.
I don't have to predrill that
well.
I shouldn't have to.
Think this is just too high
dense of a project
.
The density is a requirement
location to change.
F
location changes or stays, the
density should change.
I urge you to support smart
development rather than
automatic piece by piece
,
applicant by applicant
development and take a holistic
view.
And you will come to the
conclusion this should be
denied until it is amended
meaningfully.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: can you hear
me?
Can you hear me?
My name is nathan higgins., and
the occoquan district and I am
make student charles k cogan
high school.
I represent the students.
What I can tell you is the
students and teachers all think
the same pictures too much
traffic and it's already 40
percent overcapacity.
With all the parents I've
spoken to a lot of people
bought properties in the area
specifically to go there and I
can tell you on top of that
live in the lost creek.
Trying to take a left out
.
Just turned 18 recently
.
It's difficult to take a left
turn out if I want to go
anywhere.
Have to take a right turn in a
u-turn
.
Even when I take a right turn
it takes for ever.
For me to get to the school in
the morning, if you go down
hoadley and you try to take a
left to get to cogan in the
morning it takes about 30
minutes if you're waiting at
that light.
Hoadley can simply not handle
anymore cars and also as a
future virginia taxpayer the
residence I would love to live
your for the rest of my life, I
can tell the am extremely
concerned with the increased
property taxes that MAY be
imposed because of this
development.
I think, and most people that
are students who want to live
here would oppose of this plan
so therefore I would like to
vote no.
We should want our children to
stay in this area for a longer
period of time.
That's what virginia wants is a
state
.
I think this would be a huge
mistake.
Received the rest of my time.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I'm going to move to remote
part of this public hearing.
Supervisor bailey?
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
we have two people.
Are you ready?
>> good evening.
We have nobody speaking for
this item tonight.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
okay.
No one, MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
now going to close the public
hearing for agenda item 13 day.
With that I would like to
applicant restocked if there is
anything that would respond to.
Do one question because maple
valley grove, is that in the
orpa?
Can somebody come and say that.
For the record
.
Turn on the microphone.
>> my name is.
[Name] And with the applicant.
This property is not located in
the orpa.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
If there's anything else you
heard from public hearing that
you would like to respond to?
>> I wanted to address the
gentleman last a comment
regarding the colgan high
school concerns.
The trenton rd., star study has
taken a look at the entire
corridor from prince william
pkwy. All the way to dumfries
road and that includes the
dumfries and colgan in the
section as part of the area we
are studying for improvement as
well.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you very much.
Anything else?
>> I wanted to follow up.
There were a lot of comments on
transportation so I thought it
would be helpful to answer some
of those.
For the traffic impact
analysis, we are required to
look at future traffic which
was a two percent growth rate
per year which matches what the
county as seen a growth rate in
this area and it required us to
look at the full buildout of
dorrell nor pickett assume the
full buildout per special use
permit application but the
traffic impact analysis is
reviewed by vdot in prince
william county transportation
and ultimately accepted by
vdot.
The star study is looking at
regional improvement and so
kevin mentioned it again.
It is from the intersection of
prince william pkwy. All the
way down to dumfries and it is
looking at a long-term solution
for transportation
improvements.
Goes out to 2055 to make sure
whatever solution is proposed
that can handle future growth
in traffic.
We heard a lot of comments
regarding transit
.
There is an omni ride transit
hub on galveston.
That has two routes.
The first row or one of them is
the best way to say it, is
between the stop and commuter
garage at stonebridge which
also has stops along the way to
other commuter park and ride
lots.
He other stop goes from
the site to the vred, the
woodbridge vre
.
That also has stops along the
way.
One of the things they wanted
to make sure was that they
would still have their transit
hub and that this project would
not impact that.
I also heard comments regarding
galveston being the only way
out.
The applicant is part of the
impact analysis looked at this.
That intersection operates at a
level of service in the A.M.
And in the P.M. In the future
without the project on the
levels of service remain the
same and in the future with the
project the levels of service
remain the same.
In the event hoadley square is
approved, there is a street
grid network and interpersonal
connectivity that allows for
access on queens chapel road.
And there wasn't one more
wanted to hit as it related to
stormwater management and
impacts to the well
.
We are not near any wells or
septic fields but we are
providing 55 percent open space
and public water, which would
allow recharge and removes
demand on the aquifer
.
We also drain north with the
drainage divide between the
sites and west of hoadley.
This wheels are characterized a
slow infiltration and high
water table so there would not
be in the impact of the wells.
And I think I hit all of them
but if not I'm sure you will
ask me question.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I have a quick question.
You were talking about
transportation a and b.
>> I'm sorry?
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
you are mentioning
the routes.
The timetables.
>> when you do a traffic impact
analysis you have to look at
various intersections and you
look at the levels of service
.
Each one of the levels of
service have a letter grade
associated with it.
That is a
through f. Look at the levels
of service and it's based on
how long you at the traffic
signal waiting so what is that
timing?
The goal is the level of
service remains the same.
If they degrade to come up as a
mitigation measure that you
look to do.
For the intersection of
galveston and hoadley road, the
antique hour period, that
assumes the worst case scenario
for traffic is your peak.
The A.M. Peak is a level of
service and the P.M. Peak is a
level of service c and that
remains the same level of
service in the future with the
project and then the future
without the project.
We are not degrading the levels
of service on galveston and
hoadley road.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Supervisor boddye?
Hold on.
Before we go on
.
I'm sorry.
I asked the people while they
are here please observe decorum
so that we can continue this
meeting moving forward.
>> Kenny Boddye: scott, were
you going to stand up and say
something?
>> I want to point out big
picture that this is, in the
comprehensive plan it is a
suburban tampa development.
This is not an urbanized
development pattern.
Mu3 is kind of in the middle.
I want to point that out.
It is a long major corridor.
We have a course the major
intersection there
.
This is not a t5, t6, t7.
I just want to point that out.
they are at the higher density,
but that is permissible be of
the comprehensive plan.
This is very suburban.
The pattern is a suburban type
of development.
What is challenging as you have
orpa and they have intact trees
but you have a major shopping
center and on the other side on
the south side you have a lot
of other rooftops and surfaces.
I want to give the general
perspective that this is as
urban suburban type development
pattern.
>> Kenny Boddye: if I could
follow up on that, thank you.
I don't know if it will be you
or someone else on the planning
team, provide this was
recommended by planning staff
to be in the comp plan.
>> good evening.
David from the planning office.
This is an opportunity with the
retail shopping center to
create a mixed use community.
The mu3 provides that.
It is not high density
.
It's a medium density.
Loser opportunities to provide
mixed-use walkable communities
with a mix of uses
.
The retail is lacking the
housing to support the retail
.
We need to develop these types
of places so that people can
live near where they work and
shop.
Also, the transit is they are
.
In the comprehensive plan when
we aligned the transect, in
this case it is a transect
three with the type of transit
available to that served by
that when you need transit
support identities as well in
order for transit to be
working.
Hopefully that answers your
question.
>> Kenny Boddye: it does.
Into quick ones if you don't
mind.
Thank you for that.
I appreciate your context to
their grounding us and what mu3
looks like and not being a
suburban type place.
Can you talk about this being
on the edge of the government
center activity center.
And this obviously didn't
happen when you recommended
this but now that we have a
master space master plan for
the government center, how did
those in her play with each
other.
>> again we want to live near
where we work.
Also, the opportunity for
affordable housing in the
location and the like tech
development is essential to
providing not only the housing
that the people who work in the
area can afford, but that is
going to be near where they
work.
With the development of an
increase in the government
center in the jobs in that
area, there is a need for
additional housing nearby to
support that workforce.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you very much.
I don't see anyone else.
Supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you've
met him to.
I'm not going to go on too long
before I make the motion but I
wanted to thank everyone in the
community who came out today
.
Obviously a lot of folks
concerned
.
You live off of purcell, you
live right near where the
property lines are for the
site.
I hear you traffic in the area
can be challenging given some
of the unique uses such as
darnell norberg between the
star study we are looking to
address a lot of the concerns
.
When they put the projects they
don't rise out of the ground
immediately built it takes time
to build a projects and all the
other things which gives us
time to work with vdot and the
transportation department.
That it said
, I want to move we
do 13 a for approval.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
motion improperly seconded.
Supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: here concerns
about traffic in schools and
the pace of change.
Growth pressures a real and the
choices and growth versus no
growth.
Can be coordinated with
transmission services jobs or
whether we push it outwards and
of our middle impact
countywide.
For the folks following the
comp plan as it involved they
were originally was supposed to
be a proposed just north a
bacon race.
Advocated for that to be taken
out there is also a proposal in
a request to have the delaney
track up zoned
.
i fought against that that was
down soon.
To me this is a culmination
pushing everything to where it
belongs which is near the
shopping center, near the
government center, near the
implement centers
.
One of my constituents talked
about first responders.
There is a public safety center
north of davis ford road in the
parkway.
That would be expanded with the
county master plan.
We had a robust conversation
about that last week.
If you did not tune then I
invite you to do so.
Over the next 20 years the
government center will be built
out in a modern robust
employment center which will
host double digits dozens of
county agencies that would be
hundreds of employees those
people will need the places to
live.
O me this is where this
goes because no matter whether
you are a social worker, a
planner, environment, teacher
corps you work in the shopping
center
, he doesn't have a place
to live close to where you
work.
So for those reasons I support
this
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Hold on.
I have never had to clear board
chambers.
All right.
I'm going to say this.
We can disagree
.
we have had a law of
disagreement.
We have had a lot of
disagreements over this board,
but I do not want outbursts.
I want people to be able to
speak.
I want people to have their
comments
, but I also want
respect.
For some of the frequent flyers
who come to a lot of these
meetings.
I see doctor jack shaking his
head.
We don't agree on everything,
we listen.
Going to ask there be more no
more outbursts.
I know tensions are high, but
I'm going to respectfully ask
that there be no outbursts.
If there is I will clear out
the chambers
.
I don't want to have to do
that.
I've never done that before and
I really don't want to have a
first time for everything.
So I'm asking for everyone who
is here to please adhere to the
decorum we established in the
board room.
Supervisor vega?
>> Yesli Vega: first off I want
to thank the citizens who
showed up.
I noticed a law of coles
residence redistricting did
happen at one point.
The proposals on the agenda for
tonight were in fact in the
district so I know the concerns
we raised are not just tonight
but over the course last for
years.
Want to think county staff for
all of their work for the
applicant as well for making
themselves available to any
questions I did have.
The reality is I understand the
frustration.
A sound like a broken record
saying we continue to put the
cart before the horse we
continue to approve projects
what we have lagging
infrastructure and in some
cases we MAY even argue its
crumbling infrastructure.
We keep talking about studies
in 20 years from now, but the
reality is the things we are
approving now are only going to
make the challenges we face
here today much greater.
Want to make sure nobody leaves
chambers feeling like their
concerns aren't valid, because
they absolutely are.
I commend the young man who
cannot hear and spoke.
We need invoices to continue to
do the thing you did here today
because education is a very
powerful tool in the more you
know about what is happening in
your community, the more
impactful and viable your
change will be.
I commend you for being here
tonight and I encourage you to
not be discouraged and continue
to stay engaged.
For those who MAY feel the vote
is not going to go their way, I
continue to ask you to stay
engaged because that's what we
need.
We need lines of communications
and they are always going to be
open.
I will echo with the chair said
about decorum.
We MAY agree to disagree, but
at the end of the day respect
carries the way and so without
the of our middle concerns have
been raised
, the additional
strains on schools within
rates, additional concerns
about traffic have been raised.
I do want it drag this out but
they are valid concerns this
board has to look closely as we
move forward and continue to
approve these projects and ask
ourselves are really making
communities better or are we
just giving him explanations,
long explanations trying to
justify our votes.
I think the county residents
are very knowledgeable.
And they are tired of it and at
some point we have to start
doing things differently.
And so I will not be supporting
this application tonight for
the concerns raised the
planning commission hearing.
Some concerns haven't been
addressed about I understand
county staff is recommending
approval, but I take issue with
that because they've raised a
lot of concerns and things they
are not happy yet with, yet we
are recommending another
project forward.
I want to be very clear with
the time I have left.
We keep hearing folks being
opposed to projects in the
current form they are being
presented.
Not being opposed to
development, which is a clear
distinction that needs to be
made.
People are not opposed to
growth, people are not opposed
to development.
What people are opposed to get
frustrated with time and time
again as we have proposals
being brought before the
governing body that can without
a shadow of a doubt be made
better and that is not
happening.
I don't think that is a fair
request our constituents are
demanding of their elected
representatives and I hope we
can do better by the wishes of
the people who elected us and
put us in the seats.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor bailey.
>> Andrea Bailey,
Vice Chair:
thank you MADAM Chair.
I want to thank the citizens
that came out tonight.
That shows you care.
I got distracted on I apologize
to you because I am proud of
the young man in his dapper
suit with his curly hair.
His book extremely eloquent
about how he felt about the
community and I commend you for
that.
I have a son.
Much older than you.
I am proud of you as he speaks
over his community as well.
You need to continue to do that
and you are an example of what
we are trying to do on this
dais we want you to come back
and live here want to go to
college.
We want you to come back here
and work here once you finish
college.
We want you here because this
is your community.
The lot of the things we deal
with on this dais are very old
.
20, 30 years old.
I'm speaking to you because I
want you to understand that.
Part of what is happening and
when we make these decisions,
sometimes favorable, sometimes
not so favorable is education.
We need to educate the
community and bring the
community along with what we
are doing.
That has not been done in a
very long time.
Having you stand at the podium
voice your opinion is critical
because you are engaging.
You are engaging in what is
going on right now.
You can speak about a 20 or 30
years from now and you can give
the history about it.
We had to inherit the history.
And so with that I want to
say
education continually in the
wonderful place called prince
william county is so important
.
People want to live, work and
play here.
They want to.
Military people want to stay
here once they retire whatever
that looks like.
How do we make it better.
And we need to collaborate to
make it better.
The other thing I want to say
is today staff and developer
working through this project,
you work really hard making it
the best that you could.
It's not about giving into the
developer.
It is about how can we have
policies and procedures we have
to live with and work with and
make a good for the citizens
.
Again, I'm proud of you because
you are an example of what
should have been done 20 or 30
years ago.
To the citizens
, thank you for
your voices
.
Thank you for saying exactly
how you felt about it.
I would ask you, help us work
together to educate each other.
There is a lot of history that
we are dealing that is old, old
infrastructure.
A lot of old stuff.
And doctor jack, you know that
big thank you for coming out
tonight to thank you for the
developer worked with the
staff.
Long hours.
Ust thank you.
I will be supporting this
because we need housing and we
can't get around that.
We need you to explain to us
what does that look like.
But it has to happen.
Doctor jack, you know that.
Thank you MADAM Chair for this
moment.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor stewart?
>> George Stewart: look, I
support everything everybody
has said appeared.
Especially supervisor vega and
even supervisor bailey.
And also supervisor boddye.
We do need housing.
We do need housing close to
where people live.
But this project is not ready
for prime time.
50 foot buffer fail,
environmental concerns fail.
School concerns fail.
Those are things that need to
be fixed and you came here not
ready.
You came you not ready.
I also agree with supervisor
boddye that we do need places
close to where people live,
work and play.
In places more so that they can
afford
.
Affordability is a problem in
the county.
MR. Higgins, I appreciate you
being here.
I was you 40 years ago.
Well, not yet.
But exactly 40.
At your age I was coming to
these meetings dressed just
like that.
I appreciate that.
And I really need the concerns
that the staff has called upon
these things to be fixed.
Like supervisor boddye say,
this is a going to just sprout
out the ground tomorrow in
lincoln a cartoon it's going to
be there.
Hi need these things to be
fixed
.
The community needs these
things to be fixed.
People want to be treated
fairly.
People want to be heard
.
People want the tax money they
are paying to be utilized in a
fashion that reflects them
.
Because of the location I am
going to support this project,
however, there are things going
to be breathing down staffs
neck about all the way until
the first shovel is in the
grown.
And you should to be aware of
that.
This is not good.
This is a bad haircut.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega
.
>> Yesli Vega: a question for
the county attorney.
For clarification purposes, is
this board committed are under
the same pressure with the
timing component of this
application?
>> the board has one year to
act unless the applicant
waives.
And I am not sure when the
application was filed.
MAY of 24.
So it has been more than a
year.
>> Yesli Vega: this board has
to take action today?
>> MS. Roble: I would recommend
the board take action.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
nothing else?
Before no thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
does anyone else wish to speak
on this?
All right.
Let's go ahead and take our
vote.
Spoke supervisor angry?
>> Victor Angry: yes.
>> thank you.
Motion passes 7/1 supervisor
vega voting no.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
on the right.
Thank you so very much.
The attorney has asked for a
brief recess and I will grant
that.
We have 10 minutes and then
everyone please come back if
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
we are back.
Going to ask everyone to find a
seat and we are going to start
with the applicant
.
I'm going to let everyone know
we are going to combine the
presentation and the public
hearings 413 b and c. The
applicant will present the cpa
as well as the rezoning.
The county will give their
presentation and then I will
open up the public hearing.
Thank you.
You can proceed.
>> good evening turned
jefferson to members of the
board.
For the record my name is
jonelle cameron with walsh
colucci, lou bly and walsh.
Here with me tonight on behalf
of jr real estate group by the
applicant, our civil
engineering team,
transportation team and
environmental team to answer
any questions that you all MAY
have.
As a roadmap we are going to
walk through the property
location, land use and zoning,
the proposal which includes
open space and buffers,
amenities, transportation we
will then end with 3d exhibits
to show you how the development
will look in a very brief video
that walks through the
development.
The applicant is a contract
purchaser of eight parcels and
is seeking encumbrance a plan
amendment onto the parcels in a
rezoning and all of the
properties.
The property is a little less
than 58 acres in size.
Here is william parkway and
here is hoadley road.
The property is currently zoned
a-1 agriculture and sr one semi
rural residential
.
It is comprehensively planned
mixed-use 3, residential
neighborhood 2 in orpa occoquan
resource protection area.
The proposal proposal is a
conference a plan amendment to
designate the entire property
is mixed-use 3 and a rezoning
to planned mixed residential.
The applicant is seeking that
comprehensive plan amendment on
the parcels here.
The applicant has conducted
significant community outreach
and based on feedback the
proposal has changed.
What you see on the screen is
the initial proposal.
The original proposal included
434 two units that include a
multifamily stacked unit here,
townhome units here and here,
duplex units here, to
multifamily buildings here in a
community center to be open to
the public here.
This slide shows the final
proposal based on input from
the community.
The applicant is proposing 279
residential units.
265 are single-family attached
units because he will know as
townhomes and 14 are duplex
units.
28 will be a dus.
The applicant is now proposing
-- inclusive areas defined as
er po and there are around
eight dwelling units per acre
if you exclude the b3 portion
in this area here.
Access will be from galveston
court here are
, right in right
out access from hoadley road
here and access from a new
public road public road a I
will go into further detail
with you on in this area here.
This slide shows the rear
loaded townhome elevation!
He
applicant is seeking
modifications of the width of
the townhomes to allow for 16
foot townhomes that allow for
seven townhomes in a row.
N
increase in height 45 feet to
allow for rooftop terraces and
a reduction in the minimum
setback for roof decks,
students, landings and similar
features in a reduction of the
minimum footprint for the
townhomes.
This slide is an illustrative
of the duplex the applicant is
seeking modifications to
decrease the minimum lot area
to 39 hundred square feet and
reduce the lot with to 38 feet.
In MAY 2024 the board initiated
the comprehensive plan
amendment at the request of the
applicant to change the
designation to mixed-use 3. At
the time of the initiation
planning staff recommended
approval with for the
regulations you on the see on
the screen.
The first was to provide a
minimum of 60 percent open
space in the area is currently
designated as orpa pick the
second recommendation was to
provide a minimum of 60 percent
undisturbed area within that
open space.
The applicant was encouraged to
preserve preservation of a
natural buffer or existing
woodland or forestation area of
50 feet along each side of all
significant non-rpa streams
,
and the applicant was asked to
commit additional measures to
improve water quality to the
occoquan river watershed.
With this application the
applicant has met or exceeded
the county recommendations in
the comprehensive plan.
The
total of 56 percent of the
entire site is open space pick
the applicant is preserving 64
percent of the area designated
as open space.
In addition the applicant is
preserving 65 percent of that
open space as undisturbed.
That's a little less than eight
acres the applicant exceeded
the county requirement will
request to commit to 60 open
space within the area
designated as orpa and to
preserve 60 percent of that
open space.
He applicant is
providing 20 foot buffers along
hoadley road.
A 30 foot buffer adjacent to
dorrell nor
, 50 foot buffers
adjacent to the residential and
30 foot buffers that will be
undisturbed adjacent to the
residential neighborhood tear
and 50 foot buffer adjacent to
prince william parkway.
The next regulation was to
encourage the applicant to
provide a 50 foot buffer next
to non-rpa streams pick the
applicant was able to
accomplish that in most areas
except for the area here in the
area here.
The area here is where the
storm water management facility
is.
There was a cultural resource
found on the site that is going
to be retained in undisturbed
and because of that the
applicant is unable to relocate
the storm water management
facility to the east so that's
why they were able to commit to
a full 50 foot buffer in this
area here in this area is for
they enter personal connection
to maple valley grove and the
road network.
The applicant has proffered
several proffers as a relates
to environmental protections
within the occoquan watershed.
The applicant permitted to an
area designated as orpa pick
the applicant committed to
construct a sediment basin at
the very beginning of the very
development of preconstruction
and essentially what this does
is it allows for there to be
additional mitigation treatment
during construction
.
Normally you wouldn't put in
the settlement basins and so
there is a concern some of the
erosion would go into the
water.
From a stormwater management
perspective, the applicant
proffered low impact
development in the area
.
The applicant also proffered to
not purchase any off-site
nutrient credits to comply with
water quality requirements.
And to my knowledge this is the
only time this has been
proffered.
The applicant also proffered a
reduction in phosphorus by 60
percent.
The county
, they do not have a
zoning ordinance as to how you
develop in the orpa area.
Fairfax duns in fairfax has a
similar area with the occoquan
and these recommendations are
proffers came from what fairfax
requires and so for example, in
fairfax phosphorus reduction
load is a minimum of 50 percent
to the applicant proffered a
minimum of 60 percent higher
than what the requirement is in
fairfax.
In the next few slides I will
review the amenities proposed
on site.
This slide shows the linear
park, the dog park, the garden
and reflection park.
This slide here shows another
border park.
The central look community park
is gated in this area here and
then we also have the pony
park, arrowhead trailhead and
community garden.
And the applicant originally
proposed the application, that
trailhead was in this area as
well and it looped around.
Based on feedback from the
community they wanted the trail
moved further away from the
development and the applicant
agreed to do that, which is why
you see the trail in the
location that it is today.
This slide shows overall
transportation note and
network.
As part of the proposal the
applicant is required to
conduct a traffic impact
analysis
.
Required to look at the five
intersections on the screen.
Again, the required to look at
the existing levels of service,
what are the levels of service
in the future without you
development including a two
percent growth rate per year as
well as unapproved projects
which include the dorrell nor
expansion project.
They were then required to look
at what at the levels of
service in the future winter
project, the two percent growth
rate in the dorrell nor
expansion and they are required
to look at it in the future
assuming maple valley grove was
also approved.
All of the intersections
operated at acceptable levels
of service except for the
intersection of prince william
parkway and hoadley road.
That intersection in the left
movement here is a failing
movement.
Vdot kicked off the star study
which looks at the corridor
from prince william pkwy.,
hoadley road and davis ford
road all the way down to the
intersection of hoadley and
dumfries.
That's designed to look at the
future development and any
improvements that need to be
made to account for growth.
The applicant has proffered
over $71,000 for an interim
improvement at this
intersection.
As part of the proposal the
applicant is realigning the
access
, which is currently
their access is in this
location here.
The applicant is creating
public road a in this location
here.
That removes the offset
geometry.
So currently that access is
offset from queens chapel road.
This will now align the road.
It reduces potential conflicts
and it improves the operational
efficiency.
So today the access is an e at
the intersection with the
approval on the change did they
signal it is now a level of
service be until the delay is
48 seconds in the P.M.
Reduction is 24.8 seconds on
fridays the reduction is 37
seconds.
This slide shows the overall
connectivity
.
There is a transfer station
today on galveston court.
The
prophet a monetary contribution
for three bus shelters, two on
galveston court and one on
hoadley road.
The applicant also designed the
state so if in the future on
the right decides they want a
stop internal to the site, that
could be accommodated in this
area here.
As we were doing the community
meetings
, there were a lot of
discussions about parking and
what does parking look like,
how are you all providing
parking there are 708 parking
spaces required.
The applicant is providing 1124
parking spaces.
In addition the applicant
designed the site so public
road b can a public parking on
the site.
When you're calculating the
number of parking spaces, the
county and vdot did not allow
you to include public street
parking even though it can be
used.
If we were to include the
public street parking, that is
an additional 59 spaces so
that's 1183 spaces.
Or this
project the applicant is over
parked by over 400 parking
spaces.
There were comments made at the
planning commission public
hearing recommendations from
staff and the staff report.
I'm going to briefly review the
proper revisions made.
First as part of the project
there is a b3 land debate.
Staff wanted us to commit what
the use would be.
There were concerns it would be
a shopping center or some more
heavily intense commercial use.
The applicant proffered and
limited these uses to adult day
care center, childcare
facility, event center meeting
hall, funeral home, office,
religious institution and/or
wedding chapel.
An essential believe those are
uses compatible with the uses
dorrell nor has.
But we wanted to say was one of
the other uses that would be
compatible with in a knot
heavily intense.
We also heard a lot of
discussions and concerns from
the folks who live along lost
creek rd. Regarding their wells
what would the development do
or how would the development
impact their wells
.
The applicant did a proffered
to do a baseline study of 17
wells immediately adjacent to
the property.
What that means is 60 days
prior the applicant would send
a letter to the neighbors
offering to do a baseline
study.
That would test for both
quality and quantity of the
water.
And when they were completed
the site construction on the
site offer to do another study
to confirm that there were no
impacts to the wells.
If there is an impact of the
well the applicant would be
responsible to repair or
replace that well.
This slide shows those
properties in which the letters
would go to and are subject to
that proffered to do that.
Another change pertained to
adding the low-impact
development.
That was a proffer not included
that the planning commission
public hearing, but it was a
request from doctor jack on
behalf of lou coppell so the
applicant made that addition.
The applicant also providing
clarity in the credit and
phosphorus reduction proffers
as requested by watershed
staff.
In the next few slides I have
aerials
.
This is the view from hoadley
looking toward prince william
pkwy.
This is the view from the other
location and direction.
This is the right in, right out
entrance.
This is the area for the
central community park.
This is showing the clubhouse
in this area here
.
And I do have one video I MAY
need andrea has helped to
upload.
[Music]
Split good evening.
Gr real
estate.
Were challenged to grade a
sense of place we wanted to pay
all munch to the chris wood
family and the horse farms.
There's a corset theme
throughout the tack shop, the
bridle would park as well as
the trails
.
As he will see everywhere as
part of the development when
you turn in he will actually
turn into greenery and it's
intended to look like that
.
As you turn into the site you
will turn into linear parks
throughout
.
We created a central amenity
area that would be public
access so this will be publicly
accessible not just for the
community.
And we called this area
.
We are trying to keep the horse
theme throughout and even the
trail network within this area.
In the clubhouse is just for
the community and it creates
the place for the community to
have meeting space and grilling
areas
.
What we did was we took out the
units because that was what was
at maple valley road so we can
create integrated community.
You different levels and sizes
of townhomes to create a folder
community between the
multifamily, stacked townhomes
and traditional townhomes.
As you can see, the streets is
a grid network.
We parking everywhere.
Ven
the townhomes are rear loaded
townhomes we purposely did
that.
And they have their
own
driveway so we could exceed
parking requirements.
With multiple playgrounds
throughout the site.
We have multiple amenities,
community garden as well as a
dog park that is there.
We also purchased a piece of
property so we could create the
connection to the shopping
center and make sure that's an
accessible facility.
Led dog park will be a part of
that in the pond will be a wet
pond that is and enticed it
there.
So the central park area will
be publicly accessible and
maintained by the hoa in the
community.
Thank you very much.
>> the only thing I did not
mention in my presentation is
this property here was
initially purchased to have
another access point from lost
creek so they did not have to
come out at lost creek and
hoadley.
Based on feedback from the
community they did not want the
access point.
That access point was removed
on the applicant has stated
that house would remain as a
residential use.
And I can answer any questions
you all MAY have.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I actually have a few I want to
get started.
You live in this area or
nearby?
>> yes.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
one of the questions I had
proposed to me is there is a
pond in front of where the
horse farm is.
Is that part of the neabsco
creek works is that the
headwaters?
>> we do not believe that's the
headwaters.
We both are a civil engineer as
well as the environmental
consultant look at that.
We believe it was a pond
created for the horse farm
itself.
And I think I have an image.
This is the pond being
referenced today.
The civil engineer looked and
there is no evidence that there
is actually any piping that
goes from the pond anywhere
else under the road.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
my next question, there is a
small piece of land
.
Can you tell me
.
I have heard concerns it might
be something not fitting
say 711 or a retail.
>> that's an area we proffered
and I can repeat those uses.
It is only permitted for an
adult day care center,
childcare facility
, in the
event or meeting hall, mortuary
funeral home, office, religious
institution and/or wedding
chapel.
In addition, this piece here
shall be retained as a
residential use.
So when looking out what the
uses are we looked at what is
the special use permit and what
do they have or what can they
already do so it would be a
compatible use.
We did your concern somebody
thought it could be in
convenience store or a shopping
center so we wanted to make
sure we limited those uses.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you
janelle.
Long time no see.
A couple questions
.
Transportation.
You talked about not only the
proffers to help enhance the
bus shelters but also that
center drive area there can you
talk more about that the
conversations we have had
.
>> we met with prt see on the
site and the transfer station.
They wanted to make sure with
this project and the other
project the transfer station
would be able to be located in
the vicinity.
Initially what was proposed is
that transfer station would
come into the site.
Omni ride came back and said we
don't want it in the site.
We want to keep it on galveston
court and we said great, we are
happy to do that.
There are not bus shelters
there so they are proffering
the monetary contribution to be
able to construct bus shelters
where they see fit
.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you for
that.
Lets down transportation.
And you go back to what you're
talking about our round the
queens chapel.
And you repeat what your
improvements are going to do
for that intersection in its
performance?
>> yes.
The current access to dorrell
nor is here.
that is offset from the
intersection for the applicant
is proposing to construct
public road a cup of it is on
the side of the property line,
the other half of it is on the
squared side of the property
line.
What that does is it better
aligns the intersection
.
What it also does is it poles
people coming from the moss
further into the site and so
right now you can come in and
turn left here or you come
straight back and turned left.
What this does is you come in
and go straight and as a
designated left turn lane into
the site so it is pulling
vehicles further from the
intersection.
When we looked at this
, it's a
48 reduction in time that you
are waiting at that light in
the pmp cassette 24.8 second
reduction that you are waiting
on that line.
And then on fridays because
that is the main day for the
moss, it's a 37 second
reduction in the delay that you
are waiting at that
intersection.
>> Kenny Boddye: appreciate
that.
On the slide you have a you
show it connects all the way to
galveston.
What does that do for the
connectivity and folks
concerned about the traffic
around the mosque?
>> what happens is when you're
coming out it is controlled by
the police
!
There is a police car here and
then there are police cars or
cars here.
What's happening now as they
come out during friday's.
When you come out if you want
to go back to prince william
pkwy.
You are making that you turn
here which ultimately is a
delay for people on ross creek
or webster way trying to make a
left out of their development.
What this does is creates a
street network so what the
police could do is instead of
making the u-turn
, people can
come down here and come out at
galveston to make that left so
it provides another option is
an opportunity for police when
they are doing the traffic
management plan to determine
the best way to get people back
to the parkway commitment this
way it avoids making the u-turn
movement.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you for
that.
Ow to move quickly to
environmental.
Talked about the parental
protections in the enhancement
the applicant is going to be
doing
.
Any talk about the timing as it
pertains to the storm water
management, the water
protections in the delay
between when you put it in and
staff is a bit?
What is being
reflected in the previous staff
report?
>> what is being reflected in
the previous staff report does
not have that lad change
.
At the planning commission the
proffers still have the
nutrient credit in the
phosphorus reduction.
What watersheds staff wanted us
to do was be clear with the 60
percent meant.
That's basically a reduction in
34 pounds.
>> Kenny Boddye: appreciate
that.
I wanted to see if a consultant
wanted to add anything else to
the water quality conversation.
>> matt marshall.
N the
engineer for the applicant.
There are two parts.
Number one is about the
settlement basin we are talking
about.
We are building a permanent
pond in phase 1. In lieu of
billing and settlement trapper
basin and then building the
pond.
So you only have to do it once.
Minimize the amount of sediment
that can migrate downstream in
the permanent pond also has
tripled the capacity of what it
would have allowing for more
storage and settlement
materials to the bond.
Number two relative to quality.
We are deploying treatment
degree of underground storm
water management and something
else we are using called an mtd
someone referencing them as a
jellyfish.
It helps improve the water
quality, significantly above
what is required by the minimum
code and that is what we are
proposing here.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
To be have anyone else with any
questions?
Supervisor vega?
before can you address some of
the questions from folks who
talk about the 60 percent you
are leaving undisturbed in
regards to how much of that can
be built on?
And if we can pull it up on the
map
.
>> there been questions
.
I think supervisor vega what
you are getting to is our
limits and development is
essentially a gray line here in
the question or comment I thank
you were getting to is you are
saving it but you couldn't
build on that anyways.
Is that correct?
>> yes.
>> so the acreage that we are
preserving is a little bit
under 18 acres undisturbed.
Actual rpa area I believe is
somewhere in the neighborhood
of 4 to 6 acres victor is
actually 12+ acres of
developable that are going to
be undisturbed.
Anomaly undisturbed.
We have proffered to put them
in a conservation trust that
will remain as undisturbed in
perpetuity.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
anything else.
>> Yesli Vega: I think I
misspoke.
I think I said 60 acres.
60 percent.
I just wanted to
correct myself.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I would like to invite the
county to present.
>> good evening.
Case planner for the cpa
request.
this is to change long-range
land use of the property of
almost 48 acres to mu3.
Pc recommend denial for this
case.
Staff recommends approval of
the cpa.
The slideshows existing
long-range land use and
proposed for this request.
As you see
, the area on the
north and east side plan for
orpa in the west side and south
side are planned
.
This slide compares long-range
land use
, existing as you see
,
it is plan to protect occoquan
reservoir by reducing density
in the area to one dwelling per
five acres and recommended
space for the land use up to 60
percent in the primary use is
residential.
And primary use is residential
and minimum spaces 30 percent
and density is 1 to 4 dwelling
per acre.
For mu3, the primary uses
residential and commercial and
office use densities 4 to 12
dwelling per acre.
The applicant 90 don't 12 and
seven dwelling and land baby
which the residential land with
a proposal.
To provide 67 percent 56
percent open space in the
rezoning property and also they
going to build 265 dwelling in
their application
.
10 percent defined as
affordable units.
There are some of this
application.
In the proposal includes
development
, some alarmingly
sensitive areas shown here and
here and they provide a buffer
as recommended by the board in
the initiation process.
The
applicant also expands the
request in the zoning and on
the property which makes
consistency in the boundary of
the request
, the boundary of
the cpa request and zoning
request.
And also, the ad commercial use
which is not discussed in the
process and its intense use in
orpa.
The applicant provides mix of
residential housing including
affordable units
, addressing
the county housing needs
.
The request also in support
mixed-use development in the
area in line at the smart
growth and policy conference
and plan the applicant
committed to preserve to
provide 60 percent open space
and protect 60 percent which is
36 percent undisturbed in the
request.
Staff recommends approval
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
does anyone on the dais have
any questions.
Supervisor vega
?
>> Yesli Vega: MR. Cobra
.
We didn't hear your name at the
beginning.
>> rizo
.
>> Ricardo Canizales: okay.
can you refresh my memory and
tell me what the primary
purpose of the orpa is?
>> to reduce density and have
one dwelling per five acre to
protect occoquan reservoir.
>> wise occoquan reservoir so
crucial for our county.
>> the main source of water in
our county and the main idea
for orpa is reducing pollution
in the watershed and also
manage water with low density
manage occoquan reservoir.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you.
That is all I have for now.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye than bailey.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you
messenger.
Thank you for your
presentation.
Appreciate you.
You have not been doing this in
front of the board very long so
good job so far. You back off
what supervisor vega asked.
Because of the unique nature
why did you decide to require
in the 60 percent of the
current area to be undisturbed
to be open space.
That 60 percent to be
undisturbed.
>> this strategy we wanted to
mitigate the impact of the
development by protecting some
area.
First for the widening of the
space and protecting the
watershed by making them
undisturbed
.
We don't have any authority to
protect the property owner can
do what they want to do.
But my proffering we can better
management
.
>> Kenny Boddye: can you
complete that in a slightly
different way?
We do not have a zoning
district for orpa.
Of any protections would be
able to impose upon them for
the water supply?
>> no.
>> Kenny Boddye: appreciate
that
.
As we talked about slopes and
other things because we talked
about the level of protections
that
the applicant is proposing
for this.
Other elements he would like to
see in future proposals?
>> I am a member of a resident
group.
One of the main concerns is the
development.
So I think reducing salt
pollution in the water is the
main factor we need to take
care of
.
>> Kenny Boddye: my last
question goes to looking at
this more holistically.
We talked about maple valley
grove and the connections here
in the shopping center what
have you.
In your opinion, how does this
make a cohesive area given the
applicant talked about the fact
they change their unit mix to
be a more cohesive holistic
community?
>> they protect the northern
part of the property that has
more major trees and south of
the property is planned for
mainly residential.
And they are using some area
and connecting to mu3 this area
close to commercial park.
I think this is a good design
for this development.
And the location is very close
to mu3.
And helps to have a mixture
development there.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you.
>> tonya washington planning
director.
I just wanted to add in looking
at the bigger context, I think
that's the question you are
asking about.
This area, I don't know if it's
in the presentation but in the
previous one when you saw the
mu3 areas, essentially they are
so directed toward prince
william pkwy. And hoadley road.
This is essentially a site
extension of that but it is
including
, if you also consider
the 60 percent of that area and
does open space it's creating a
cluster development closer to
the roads.
And so it is sort of building
off of the mu3 focus closer to
the prince william pkwy.
And the government center
activity center
.
Which is a crossed the major
intersection.
It's creating a more cluster
development around the area but
with that cpa request still
preserving the area is open
space.
>> Kenny Boddye: very last one
can you talk about the density
a crossed hoadley and the
differences between the density
a crossed the street and then
density here at hoadley square?
>> supervisor boddye, alex from
the planning office.
On the other side of hoadley we
have housing stock as well.
We do have
apartments.
We do have townhouses as well
as single-family detached.
This adds to the element.
In particular this one
supplements what we have on the
other side of hoadley road.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor bailey then vega
.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
thank you MADAM Chair.
Wanted to ask
, slide number
seven
, the environmental
commitment.
.
Yes, that one.
Was 60 percent open space about
30 percent
.
>> 60 percent of that 60
percent should to be
undisturbed.
60 percent of 60 percent means
36 percent
.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice
Chair:.You.
And the other question I have
is where there is an expansion
of the road by the door eleanor
piece, we've been talking about
the last three or four years
the congestion there.
Will that additional expansion
allow for less congestion in
that area?
Because I know there is no
light there.
>> since we looked at the cpa
in tandem we recommend is that
rezoning would have to mitigate
any impacts to the road
network.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
it helps though?
>> yes.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
the other piece I want to ask
about, the presentation
mentioned there was a private
clubhouse that is a part of the
project.
Is there a spot I recall open
to the public in that area
also?
>> supervisor bailey, we still
have to do a presentation on
the rezoning application and so
your question might be to that
part.
That combines a plan amendment.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair: I
will hold it until then.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega
.
>> Yesli Vega: thank you MADAM
Chair.
[Name] And got it right.
Just as a follow-up to a
comment
, what would buy right
density look like in comparison
to this project?
>> comprehensive plan is a
guideline.
By right densities is a zoning
issue.
And now it is one and they
request to rezone the property.
By right it is a one.
>> Yesli Vega: for later?
Fair enough.
I will ask it then.
But can I have watershed
management.
Db have somebody here?
>> we do.
We have claymore.
>> what protects the watershed
better.
Development of the sort
?
>> if you look at the intent it
was meant to reduce
imperviousness
.
and that strategy could be for
infiltration as well as
stormwater management.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
does anyone else have
questions?
You MAY resume.
>> hello everyone.
Case planner of the trenton
square application
.
The hoadley square application
part of the zoning is located
north of hoadley road and south
of the prince william pkwy.
This is a rezoning application.
The applicant requests to
rezone the 57.69 acres to pmr
planned mixed residential to
allow for development for
development of 279 residential
units
.
The zoning of the application
I'm talking about the boundary
of the rezoning.
As mentioned, the boundary of
the cpa is different from the
rezoning.
Most part of the application,
zoning of the application is a1
and we have it as r 1 in the
property located in the rest of
the project.
The land use of the application
is containing of three parts.
Orpa or in two mu3.
Again, the property on the
rezoning application is not a
cpa request to mu3.
Following the cpa request to
change the orpa with mixed use
neighborhood, the target land
use is 50 percent to 85 percent
for residential development and
10 percent to 45 percent for
nonresidential.
Primary use for single-family
detached
.
implementing zoning district is
for pmr in the target
residential density is 20 units
per acre
.
Application for rezoning
application the applicant
provides a mixed type
development.
This is a development for
residential and nonresidential
for 265 townhouse for duplex
and recreation area.
On the other hand the applicant
requests to provide the service
and the rest of the property
implementing zoning and provide
the density and rezoning
application is eight
.
That is completely consistent
density of the mu3.
The proposed rezoning is
consistent with mu3, but the
proposed designation is a
nonresidential development is
not consistent with mu3
designation.
To background and summary of
the development of the
application.
The applicant requests 432
units development
, just to type
of houses.
Multifamily and townhouse.
And in the second and third
submission the number of the
units reduced to 370 in the
last submission, the number of
the units to 279 in the
applicant completely changed
the multifamily tab the house
from the application.
Is means from the first
application to last, the
density of the application
reduced 35
.
As I mentioned the application
is contained on the residential
development
.
Nonresidential development is
containing in the two parts.
The applicant requests to onto
the kiosk and seasonal activity
in the other proposed
development in terms of the
nonresidential development is
related to the land bay that
they applicant proffers to
provide the b3 or retail
district in land bay d that I
mentioned is not consistent
.
In terms of residential
development, the application is
the total 279 units that is
contained in the 265 townhouse
and 14 duplex.
It means 95 percent of the
units are townhouse and five
percent of the units
single-family detached.
The weakness of the application
are concerned about the
application.
First of all, the first concern
and weakness of the application
is related to trafficking.
Proudly square application is
close to the mosque
, school and
commercial area.
So closing to this area would
increase the traffic congestion
.
The other concern of the
application is related to the
land of a. As I mentioned, the
applicant proffered to provide
the nonresidential development
in this area.
The applicant proffered and for
what type of the development,
but in the exact development on
the exact purpose of the
nonresidential didn't detain by
the applicant.
so staff needs to have wendy
dylan information to review the
type development to review and
analyze the design standards
all to ensure all the
necessaries consistent with
development regulation
.
Staff needs to be consistent
potential impact of the
nonresidential development on
adjacent area.
School impacted.
This would confirm that this
application the future student
for the future student
generated but the application
is not in the space for
elementary school and high
school.
Some of the key points that is
a string is created the
conservation of the national
space the applicant during the
cpa and rezoning process
proffers and provides more than
60 percent open space and tries
the best to conserve the orpa
area.
The other key point is related
to multipurpose recreational
area.
On this application and
rezoning application, the
applicant proposed and
proffered to provide the area
like the central community
park, community garden and
trained it.
The other string of the
application is related to
proffers to provide the 28
dwelling units or 10 percent
for this application and
project.
So after we review the
application with different
agents
, staff recommends the
board community supervisor
approve rezoning 2024-00 23
.
It's great subject to proffers
dated DECEMBER 01, 2025 for the
following reasons.
The rezoning is resistant with
the long range designation
except on the western portion
of the property.
The applicant and site
connectivity to meet the
residence needs applicant
proffers provide the 10 percent
or 28 dwelling units in the
last key point in the
application for approval is
related to conservation of the
existing space and environment
resource protection proffered
for conservation easement.
Thank you for your time and my
pleasure to answer your
question.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
>> after the staff report went
out we received
revisions to the
proffers that addressed.
I know that we showed that is a
weakness.
It was a weakness on the
planning commission and the
applicant provided us
clarification because staff
felt it was important we had
that.
The applicant address that.
I wanted to make that clear.
Did limit the uses that could
occur.
>> kevin, transportation
planning manager.
I want to add a clarification
as well.
In the time between the staff
report and tonight, we met with
the applicant to resolve
outstanding comments that were
giving us a little bit of pause
they were meeting the
requirement as far as meeting
the tru result in mitigating
the
traffic congestion.
>> I would like following his
comments, I would like to have
it given more information and
purpose of the nonresidential
development based on the zoning
ordinance and section of the
pmr.
Every district greater than 15
should incorporate at least one
area
as nonresidential.
In
reviewing the application with
surrounding residential.
So provided nonresidential
development
, that is greater is
essential for the development
of the application.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
on the right.
Thank you very much
.
Does anyone have any questions?
Going once, going twice.
All right.
It is time to open the public
hearing.
So I am going to go
ahead and I'm going to do these
together for 13 bnc.
I'm going to open the public
hearings for both the ask
people have a seat until I call
you up.
Thank you.
People are so excited to talk
her what we are going to do
this because I'm doing these
both together, whereas it would
get them in this to speak I
will give people six minutes.
If you are an organization
recognized by the board you get
up to 10 minutes.
and again, we can only have one
person for each organization.
I'm going to invite people up
five at a time.
Please state your name, where
you live, the magisterial
district and also make sure we
can hear you.
Sometimes we are straining to
hear people.
And if you have come out this
late, you should be heard.
Wendat I'm going to call him
martin, delta nichols, larry,
connie christopher and chris
cummings.
You were my first
five.
>> can I have the overhead
projector, please?
Okay.
Good evening george avicenna
members of the board.
Saint martin from the occoquan
district and I'm here
representing an county civic
associations open like the
extra time if I could.
Thank you.
We want to thank the applicant
for coming to medco in
presenting the project of the
meetings.
We talk to everybody but more
importantly we listen to
everybody.
We reviewed the project
.
There have been changes made
from response to community
concerns.
Nfortunately this
project has a fatal flaw that
has been there from the
beginning and I will go into
that in a moment.
Everest want to say medco is
not imposed other developments
in the area.
The kings grove project is one
we were not opposed to end the
community did not have
opposition to that we saw in it
was generally less impactful
than something that could have
been built thereby right.
Another object medco was not
available is the dean crossing
project on the other side of
the parkway from here.
That's a 42 unit apartment
building for 50 percent and
under of the area median income
level so it is a low income
housing project on the
communities and how much
opposition to that we saw in
the belmont gardens project is
a 55 over community near the
glen shopping center.
Again, it was less impactful
than other projects could have
been I could've been there in
the community we didn't see
much opposition to that.
This
one is different.
We have seen a lot of community
opposition to it and we are
opposed to it for that and
other reasons.
But first I wanted to start by
dispelling misrepresentations
and misunderstandings that have
been floating around the
project over the last year or
so.
You MAY have heard the boundary
line is arbitrary and it isn't.
It is the watershed line and
you can see that on the map.
The yellow line that parallels
that trenton is the watershed
line.
The green area is the area and
that is the occoquan watershed
on the other side is the
potomac watershed fed by
neabsco creek into potomac
river.
it is the watershed line and
another thing that made things
confused is the fact that the
previous project was taken out
so it was
, it has been said
that this just a line.
But two wrongs don't make a
right when there's a reason for
the line, it's the watershed
line.
That makes sense because it's a
watershed protection area.
This is something we heard
again tonight.
Some have been seeing doing
projects with much more
impervious surface and
clearcutting of the trees on
the property is better than
five acre lots in the orpa
area.
I think that violates common
sense like saying adding
thousands of vehicles to the
road is going to improve
traffic conditions
.
These are things that violate
common sense but it is the
opinions of our own
environmental management staff
as you heard and it is counter
to the experts we have heard
from.
It is also counter to what
fairfax county has done.
In the past when they did
pretty much the same thing with
the five-acre lot and down
zoned a large area on their
side of the occoquan.
This was 30 or 40 years ago
that they did not.
I think it's clear the
watershed better than covering
properties with large amounts
of impervious surfaces
including large amounts of
trees.
as they told you a few minutes
ago you three factors.
Groundwater infiltration, storm
water and nutrient pollution
runoff
.
To some extent you can mitigate
the last two of those, but the
infiltration is anything that
is important that you need
,
especially for the place that
live on the area which means
pretty much everybody from
trenton to the city of manassas
and from the occoquan reservoir
to the prince william line.
These are all well and septic
and people are worried about
their water.
Another reason why it not a
good idea to start chipping
away orpa is we don't know what
the groundwater situation is in
prince william county.
The board initiated a
groundwater study less than a
year ago in the study will not
have results for it a year or
two.
We don't know what the levels
of the groundwater are.
We don't know what the trend is
we don't know that for a while
and we have a lot of people on
well water and we have had some
antidotal information about
failing wells.
We don't know what the
situation is
.
We need to be careful about
what we do.
There is not as good protection
because people could clear cut
five-acre parcels
.
The reality is they don't and I
can tell you that from
experience
.
We worked on numerous projects
and what we do is work with the
developers and we have the lots
clustered because the five-acre
recommendation is an average
.
The lots are clustered.
With large amount of open space
protected with the conservation
easement and receive most of
the trees on the parcels
.
People aren't going to move to
the most forested area and
immediately want to cut their
trees down.
It's another thing that doesn't
make logical sense
.
It is just reasons to try to
make the project seem better.
If it was better to pave over
large areas and clear cut the
trees, there is like washington
D.C. And baldwin marilyn would
to be ideal watersheds because
they use the high-tech
techniques in the watershed to
be improved over the natural
state.
And I think we all understand
that's not true for the
overarching issue is the
precedence setting part of it.
The stuff said they do a
case-by-case basis
.
They probably do.
Maybe they take the blinders on
approach but I can tell you
developers don't developers
look at trends the board has an
appetite to do.
As we all know, developers make
money off of the units per acre
and that's fine.
That is what makes our economy
work.
But when people are getting
entitlements to vastly increase
the density on land and the
board is okay with that, he
will get more applications for
this book anyone who thinks
it's not a precedent is not
being realistic.
The reality of the cpa over the
last 10 or 15 years
, the
majority once they are applying
two for our approved.
So the idea this won't be a
precedent, it's again not just
with common sense.
But the good news is on all of
this is we don't want to do
these kinds of things in our
watershed protection area to
achieve our housing goals, to
achieve our affordable housing.
Here projects on the parkway
for affordable housing.
We plenty areas and the
comprehensive plan without
changing it where we can
achieve our goals for housing
and have walkable communities
and varied housing times and
all the things we need to do as
we grow
.
I hope you understand there are
places where we can do these
things
.
So based on all that and the
fact the planning commission
recommended denial, along with
the letter you received from
the conservation alliance and
pwc a are also recommending
denial.
You tonight the cpa for the
project.
Happy holiday everyone and we
will see you next year.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Next speaker.
>> Public Speaker: good evening
again.
I am delta nichols and I am
need to a precedent of -- and I
am in occoquan district and I
request additional time, though
I probably will not need all of
it.
So hunters ridge is in the
middle of orpa.
We are 216 home strong and we
do not support hoadley square,
this proposed development.
We ask you to please disapprove
the comprehensive plan
amendment and rezoning.
Front at the proposed
development would encroach upon
orpa.
Orpa was originated from sound
scientific and is grounded in
prudent concerns to protect one
of the counties most precious
resources
.
That is our drinking water.
There's not a person in the
room that does not need good to
clean drinking water.
And also to enable it to be
sustainable far into our
counties future.
For our prosperity in the
county future prosperity.
It is imperative orpa is
protected.
It's somewhat rare for a
majority of the county
residents and government
entities to identify in issue
and to come together and unite
around it and to protect it
.
Regardless of what part of the
county you live in, regardless
of your ethnic background, your
political persuasion, your
background affiliation.
There are a lot of things that
have the potential of dividing
us but orpa is one of the most
important things to this
county.
And individuals and interest
groups came together and
affirmed orpa important and
they develop a sustainability
plan and codified orpa into our
conference a plan.
And it is only been standing
and codified by 2.5 years and
now and developer wants the
county to approve his plan to
start undoing orpa and the work
that has been done to put orpa
in place.
We find ourselves asking the
question why
.
Given all of the considerations
in the debates that occurred to
stand orpa up, why would one
developer put forth a request
and ask the county start to
undo the good prudent work that
has been done.
And I submit to you those
asking for this are simply
asking because they can ask.
But you don't have to say yes
because they are asking.
They are asking you to forget
about sustaining this county
drinking water.
That proposal as asking you to
not be concerned about creating
excessive amounts of impervious
surfaces that negatively impact
groundwater recharge.
This proposed development is
asking you to not be concerned
about the traffic that is
already a nightmare in the area
and overly congested in the
failing intersection of hoadley
road and the prince william
county pkwy.
Hoadley square would best be
built close to transportation
hub not in the middle of a mass
transportation desert in the
middle of mint county.
We talk about bus stops in omni
right and I don't want to
disparage anyway the only ride,
but we all know it just doesn't
work
.
If it worked, more people would
use it.
It takes too long from point a
to point b. It's just not
feasible.
We should focus on making the
county better.
To better housing location
planning that goes hand-in-hand
with better transportation
planning in essence ability to
be efficient and affordable
mass transit.
The chris would the farm is not
that location for this type of
development.
And again, I'm not against
development.
And I will tell you, the
residence 260 strong.
We are against this
development.
Don't let this proposed
development steel water from
our future.
Told this development to find
another location.
Many of us would to be happy to
help and look for another
location.
Supervisor boddye, you ran on a
platform and protecting our
precious natural resources like
water.
Stick to the platform you ran
on.
That is what we ask you to do.
Stick to it.
Don't show favor to the
developer who wants to put the
drinking water for our future
at risk.
we ask you board of county
supervisors to be responsible
selected citizen residence of
our county and stewards of our
drinking water now and into the
future.
Don't chip away at the orpa.
In essence what was said
earlier, if you set this
precedent, you know another
developer is going to come and
ask for the same thing.
Nd
then what are you going to tell
that developer
?
When you do things like this is
just like feathers in the wind.
Is hard to get and pick them
all back up so don't set a
precedent disapprove this
.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please
.
>> I don't know if I can follow
those two speakers.
Arry, I
am in the coles district.
Supervisor vega, thanks for
what you do.
I spoke about the maple valley
grove.
Won't bore you with
that again.
If I heard this correctly the
applicant requested, I wrote
down five waivers.
Reduced setbacks, increase the
height restrictions, reduce the
minimum footprint, reduce the
lot length and reduce the lot
with.
MAY be incorrect but that's
what I thought I heard.
To meet these are indicators.
If we are going to ignore
weaver restrictions why do we
even have them on paper.
the second thing I want to talk
about is the public road
through this development.
If I was a prospective buyer I
would want to be told that and
they will probably be told that
but they probably don't know
what that is going to mean down
the road because any of us who
lived here knows a cut through
becomes a cut through
.
You get involved of traffic
going through public road.
Hill 'n dale is a good example.
On the third thing I will talk
about traffic again.
One of the weaknesses
identified was traffic
.
And I will run down this will
quick.
Everyone knows about them but
we are going to put all these
people that are going to live
here and move here.
The church on the corner, they
are going to increase that
proposed delete square.
Maple valley grove
, hoadley
falls one and two, kings crest.
Kings grove.
The moss expansion.
Not all
have been approved yet but they
are on the docket and then the
other end is the klein farm and
on the other end is the porch
project.
Were those people going to cut
through thick they are going to
come right through the hoadley
road prince william county
pkwy. In a section.
I ask you vote no to this
project.
Thank you for your time.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
connie christopher.
Myself and
my sister
.
Phone chris would farm.
My family moved here in 1969
into forest dale and dale city
on the day neil armstrong
walked on the moon.
My parents
in 1975 when I was 18 years
old, we bought chris would
farm.
And has been writing, boarding
and training facility for 50
years.
People asked me all the time
how can I sell the farm.
It is not easy
.
It is not been an easy
decision.
This is very emotional for me,
I am sorry.
Throughout the whole time we've
tried to keep our prices down
it helped keep our prices down
to allow people to learn about
horses, learn about riding
horses and to afford a place
for people who own horses to
keep their horses here.
How I know we are affordable is
because for years I have other
barns call me and tried to talk
me into raising our prices and
we've been one of the least
expensive in the four county
area.
When we bought the property,
hoadley road was a 2 lane
winding rd.
Our property was surrounded by
woods on every side except
hoadley road to.
There was another farm across
the street where dale city is
now.
There were winds where forest
is now, teeter shopping center
is now and there are woods
where the mosque is now.
When each of these things came
before the county to be built,
we never went and opposed any
of them.
We moved into an area we expect
it to grow, dale city,
lakeridge wasn't even there
yet.
We are in the suburbs of
washington D.C. And we expected
growth to happen.
What we did because we were the
only farmers put up a bigger
fence to keep our horses in so
they are not running across
peoples yards and to keep
people out so they are not
messing with our horses.
We built a thriving business
through the years.
It has not always been easy.
Having large animals is a law
of work and most of the time my
family has done because we
could not afford to hire
people.
I made the decision to sell my
farm when I got kidney cancer
seven years ago.
I had to ensure my horses would
be taken care of so I had to
get another place.
I have some land that I hope to
build a barn on to move all of
my horses
, three quarters are
over three years 20 years old
which makes them between 60 and
70 years old and people years.
And you will not get any money
for those horses
.
People say you can sell them.
Not really.
I cannot let my horses go to
people who will not take care
of them.
will horses require a law of
care.
Here I am seven years later
still fighting the cancer,
still hoping to sell my place
and still hoping to move my
horses.
Chris would farm has been my
life
.
I don't want to sell it and I
want to sell it.
But I cannot continue what I
have been doing so I have no
choice
.
I would like to thank the
residents of prince william
county and on the board of
supervisors because without all
the help from this county
throughout the years we would
not have been able to make it
this long
.
We truly appreciate it.
Thank you for listening, and
it's been a great ride to.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Before our next speaker going
to call up the next group of
five.
I've ashley -- hold on.
Some going to call up the next
group and then you can speak.
Ashley, norman
, anne
stephenson, gary o'brien and
catherine howard to.
All right.
You MAY begin.
>> Public Speaker: good evening
board of supervisors forgotten
back here.
Still christopher cummings from
the occoquan district.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
can you adjust the microphone
so we can hear you better?
>> Public Speaker: I'm still --
by the feeling we get increased
taxes, more data centers and
more high density housing here.
Turning to the matter at hand
but application needs to be
seen together with the maple
valley road application
.
Together if passed, and one of
them has already been passed,
they will impose unreasonable
new
burdens on the
transportation infrastructure,
as well as the watershed area
that offers occoquan reservoir
.
High density housing in these
two combined together comprise
high density housing should be
steered the areas with high
capacity transit not to major
road intersections already
heavily burdened with traffic
.
The impact on schools have been
discussed and everybody knows
how tricky that gets in terms
of redistricting and promises
of new schools that get
postponed and all that sort of
thing.
As things stand, a huge
amount of impervious surfaces
detract from the watershed and
threaten those of us nearby who
depend on well water for our
homes
.
It matters of the planning
commission recommended denial
were at least 10 serious
problems with the proposal.
I would ask you seriously
consider and deny this
application.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker
, please.
>> Public Speaker: good evening
chair jefferson, members of the
board.
My name is ashley, occoquan
district.
Speaking on behalf of the
prince william conservation
alliance and I request the
additional time in prince
william conservation alliances
and environmental
nonprofit.
We have been operational for 20
years in the county and our
focus is on creating equitable
and sustainable communities
.
The occoquan reservoir
production area was created
just 2.5 years ago.
N lot of
this
.
Martin did a terrific job
providing an outline here, but
I did want to highlight a
couple points that he pointed
out.
This was established 2.5 years
ago as part of the company and
supply an update.
The same update resolved the
urban growth boundary and as a
result significantly increased
the allowable density in the
occoquan reservoir watershed.
Which is already one of the
most urbanized drinking water
watersheds in the country.
While there are watersheds more
urbanized, they are not able to
convey drinking water an
affordable cost the way the
occoquan does.
This change was made despite
the request to conduct a water
study prior to making such
significantly induced
decisions.
we are still waiting for the
results, although my
understanding is those are
being wrapped up.
And also recommended ground
water study has also not been
conducted.
With the adoption of the new
comprehensive plan, orpa has
become the primary strategy for
protecting the occoquan
reservoir in the groundwater
resources that are in that
area.
Like we heard before, orpa
follows watershed boundaries
and hydrogeologic lines and
these were not arbitrary.
They were drawn intentionally
and based on the geology that
are particularly susceptible to
droughts and it's why I
mentioned earlier maple valley
grove really does fit into
these categories.
We already work including the
parcels that could have and
should have been included
.
Without a groundwater study, we
do not fully understand how
increased development pressure
would affect these resources
over time.
And now just 2.5 years later
after than density in the
watershed has been
significantly increased, we are
facing the first request to
remove land from the orpa area.
Planning staff has recommended
approval they highlighted
prioritizing affordable housing
goals over upholding our
primary policy to protect
critical
drinking water
resources.
This creates an either/or
scenario when the whole purpose
a comprehensive planning is a
course to be able to say yes
and
.
I want to acknowledge the
comments made on the planning
commission hearing that I heard
.
It was really important for me,
for all of us to hear from
residents who spoke favorably
about this proposal and hear
their lived experiences and
their hopes and this proposal
represents on their
perspectives really
matter.
It is really heartening to hear
the stories and I appreciate
the care and thought it brought
to that discussion.
By looking
up the county holistically we
can accommodate the vision in
the dream and continued growth
by incentivizing redevelopment
near the existing transit hubs
while offering additional
housing configurations
.
I'm going to use this really
quick.
Even though I will know for
next time to zoom in so we can
see this better.
And allow for different housing
configuration and the aa
.
The arts and ag arts overlay
which is in yellow here.
To protect our natural and
cultural resources for the
benefit of all residents and to
allow for diverse housing.
I will say the project does
have a lot to offer.
If it were located in one of
the red areas, that would be
awesome and provide a loft
, and
of protecting the reducing
green space we have in those
areas
.
You can see the map on the
other side that there are
parcels.
You can see the little flex of
purple and green.
There are parcels we can and
should protect in these areas.
Configuration like we are
seeing here one of the areas
would be absolutely phenomenal
for the residents in the areas
that are experiencing depleted
green space and they have a
right should have access to
walk out there door and get
into some trees as well because
there's a lotta health benefits
for that.
It really comes down to that
here in the area our focus
should be building upon the
density framework and ensuring
it succeeds.
In fact
, we've had multiple
meetings with county staff in
the late supervisor and
supervisor boddye about
discussing the importance of
orpa, how we can build on the
framework and the need to
created dedicated zoning
district so we can build upon
and strengthen the protections
of the framework is designed to
provide.
This should come first.
The bayreuth development is
mostly a one so that is one
house per 10 acres so even
proposals would still need to
go through rezoning
.
Honest away from the speaker
before the farm, you can't hear
her story and hear your have
your heart broken.
When I heard that I felt so sad
we have not yet incentivized
this type of land use and
supported her vision for what
the parcel could and
should be.
To the point where she is
feeling she has no choice and
needs to be pushed out
.
I have to sit.
I think we should sit with that
sadness we do not on the
incentives in place to
encourage thought and instead
we are seeing data centers by
up our nurseries and we are
seeing the lower green
businesses leave
.
And I don't think that's the
direction I want to go.
Right now the board is
considering starting to erode
what is become our primary
production strategy, especially
at the time when we are seeing
unprecedented development
pressure across the county it's
not argument to say the
proposal only removes whatever
number of acres or is whatever
percent of orpa or the
watershed.
This is about upholding a
policy.
It's about sending a clear
message we take a
responsibility estimates of the
critical drinking water
resource seriously and that we
are part of the responsibility
rather than contribute in the
death of 10,000 cuts.
We recommend this be denied.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
anne stevenson.
Occoquan district.
Thank you for letting me speak
again.
I would also like to address
the orpa.
And has had quite a history.
Martin with medco, meant county
civic association pursuit of
the creation of an occoquan
reservoir overlay district for
more than a decade.
Published a report with a list
of regulations for potential
overlay district in 2011.
The ashley is organization, the
conservation alliance, a local
nonprofit back plans for the
overlay district
.
That's what she was talking
about.
Executive director
, MAY she
rest in peace
, advocated for
development restrictions
throughout the entire occoquan
watershed.
From headwaters to river which
dan spans two thirds of the
county landmass.
Is important overlay to the
entire watershed addressing
problems in the upper reaches,
which is where the horse farm
is addressing problems in the
upper reaches of the watershed
and the headwaters is of
critical importance of.
If you screw up the headwaters
he will never recover.
To comment on whether or not
the pond on the horse farm is
springfed or not, the
information I was told by
colony will springfed.
No?
If you look at martin's overlay
were projection in each of the
protected areas the, dale city
and crosses over trenton road
and it covers the first section
of the horse farm when the pond
is.
That MAY need to be
investigated more because that
is in the protection area
according to the county map
there.
And then back in 2020
,
supervisor vega directed the
county staff to begin work on
an overlay district in NOVEMBER
2020 following several
development proposals approved
by the board.
At the time supervisor vega
said many of your constituents
are concerned about increased
development throughout the
county that could impact the
counties drinking water.
The last ground study was done
in 1997.
I know there is one in the
making but and hadn't yet been
done
.
I feel needs to be done before
the development takes place
within the orpa and potentially
will affect our drinking water
an hour wells
.
We all drink the water that
comes from these headwaters in
the end of the occoquan.
Going to read from prince
william county times dated back
in AUGUST 2021.
Quote is by supervisor boddye.
A major part of prince william
county commitment to its
citizens is ensuring
environmental resources,
including clean water arguably
the most important resource are
protected for current and
future generations.
Currently poorly planned
development lacks enforcement
of the normal safeguards
threatening the health of our
waterways, including the
occoquan reservoir.
He
regions drinking water supply
for the occoquan reservoir is
on the epa dirty waters list
and is condition continues to
decline posing a direct threat
to the cleanliness of your
drinking water will protecting
the watersheds that are
critical to the health of the
occoquan reservoir is both
affordable and practical once
the damage has been done
.
The cost to you as a taxpayer
will be astronomical.
Principal the monthly tools an
obligation to address this
issue
.
One of the most important tools
granted the local virginia
government is the ability to
protect waterfront land known
as the resource preservation
areas from clearing another
destruction.
These waterfront buffers are
lost to best of defense to vent
pollution in the ring are
water.
Serving occoquan
district
, I'm particularly
aware of the importance of
protecting waterways the
supervisors debated allowing on
development including data
centers in the county rural
crescent some residents rely on
private wells for drinking
water raised concerns about how
the kind of development might
affect groundwater.
The county is preparing options
and recommendations for a
groundwater study to be
considered in the making.
By signing onto the 20/40 comp
plan,
those of you who were here
, he made a promise with your
signature signing on to protect
and preserve this orpa for our
drinking water.
Please leave the orpa as is.
Really keep those promises?
Promises made, promises kept or
will the promises broken.
Please keep yours.
Keep the orpa thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
before I go to the next speaker
I want to call up the next
group.
Paul halberd to come I called
up catherine howard.
Catherine, paul, michael,
william
, clancy and jack.
You MAY proceed, sir.
>> Public Speaker: gary o'brien
again, coles district.
Thank you.
For the vote. If we continue
this path, I really worry about
this county.
If you look at the way we do
things here, it seems we set
these rules only to be broken.
Not having any real solid
protection for orpa is the case
in point.
We need to lock it down some
builders don't come in and say
we will get a waiver on a
portion of it and we will chip
away and eventually it will be
worthless
.
If you have been here for these
board meetings like I have over
the years, and the boards are
faced with lawsuits if they
refuse precedents that have
been set by their previous
votes.
Here we are setting another
precedent potentially.
And I continue to worry about
this because right now there's
a serious health problem in the
occoquan.
And it is growing worse and
worse.
The data centers are going to
make it worse as they flush
their systems.
Now, where are we going to get
our water from.
Clean water if we don't
, if we
have to share it with data
centers and potentially.
Hate to say this, but nuclear
power plants potentially to run
these things
.
Where are we going to get our
water?
We are already having droughts
and severe floods
.
The floods are causing damage
that we are spending a fortune
to repair
, streams and what
have you.
And that is not cheap.
And if we are to use osmosis to
get the salt out of the water,
imagine what is going to cost
us for fresh water.
And if you have a salt problem
in your diet, you going to
drink bottled water because he
won't be able to drink anything
out of the faucet.
And I didn't hear anything
about the schools this last
time.
Are we going to get the money
for all the schools the kids
are going to come into.
I didn't see any proffers.
They said there was but I
didn't hear any.
And it is not cheap busing kids
and nobody likes their kids
being bussed outside their area
to satisfy a builder that wants
to build high
density in the
wrong place.
On who is to say the courts is
going to be built before this
maple valley is going to be
built
.
In this and thought going to
have low density or low cost
housing?
And yet you say you needed this
one for low-cost housing.
Will, in another 279 know you
want double that with this
development.
I just don't get it.
As far as the pond goes, I
can't imagine a pond not being
self-sufficient.
There isn't any stream that
runs into it and you want to
have a house built over a
stream or a
pond?
I made the mistake of buying a
townhouse built inside a dry
lake.
Every time it rained the
basement practically filled up
with water.
These MAY not have basements
but I still wouldn't want my
foundation on unsolved the
ground.
We have a number of issues here
speak the biggest one being
orpa is setting a precedent
.
We are ready approved some low
income housing.
E are going
to have more with courts
.
And we had to sacrifice orpa in
the freshwater we need for our
future and our futures children
just to make some builder
happy?
I don't get it.
And if you really are hell-bent
determined to vote for this
,
what about that property.
Why don't you delay this and
think give us the property is
offset what you're taking away
and putting in conservation
instead of making it
industrial.
Industrial in the area doesn't
make any sense.
In fact, it makes things worse.
In conclusion, I think we have
to look for the future and
think logically and do what's
right for citizens and
taxpayers because bad mistakes
now are going to cost us a lot
more leaders.
Ook at schools
p $50-$60 million for the next
middle school.
MAY be 79 million for the next
school.
Where is that money going to
come from?
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: michael,
occoquan district.
Thank you all for the time.
I would like to talk a little
bit about impacts and what we
see from these projects.
One was already approved.
We are looking on this one is
approved which they are not
equal is reestablished.
One is in deep orpa, one isn't
.
but it is 550 homes here in
looking at depending on what
estimate measure you use,
around 3000 to 4000 trips on
hoadley in the span of a day
between deliveries, trash
trucks, cars, what have you.
You put that much traffic on
hoadley road and you are
looking at having to solve that
traffic issue which is already
a problem, which MAY be a means
whitening hoadley road so I
hope the residents enjoy that
road getting a little closer to
their homes.
Let's talk about the schools
for a second.
The elementary and high school
is overcrowded today
.
It is at 100 percent and I
appreciate the developer
proffering money toward it
unlike the other one that we
approved in the room and put
more burden on me tonight and
all the people in the room
.
If you live in prince on them
county.
My kids are looking to going to
school the elementary in
trailers.
Nathan who you praised tonight
in here, they have trailers at
colgan high school.
Is that what we want in our
community to take 100 percent
packed schools and make that
the way our kids go to school
and then to solve it because
the proffers while they are
great, they do not solve
everything.
You're talking about additional
funding coming out of each
taxpayers pocket to fix a
problem were saying yes to
tonight that is not our
problem.
We are creating the problem in
this room
.
We breeze passed another thing
that flew past earlier in the
night about the, I get forget
the phrasing.
The cultural significant area
on the project.
Just so everyone is clear,
that's a site that predates
colonial sediment the pattern
of life in any archaeological
area means it is not just in
the area which it is
discovered.
Once we bulldoze that area and
disturb it, that is damage that
can't be recovered from.
So there is also the orpa which
we talked about in depth.
The orpa was put in place to
protect every single persons
drinking water in this area.
We heard at naseem I don't want
to go through it and repeat
what others have said it better
than I can.
I know from the well-known
property because I bought the
house from family, the well has
lowered the amount of gallons
per minute reduced.
It was drilled in 1986.
The cost and impact of the
people who live in my area
, the
entire mid to co-area, to draw
up a new well you're talking
$10,000-$40,000.
So if we vote yes on this
particular project tonight when
somebody in prince william
county medco area in the years
to come has to drill a new well
maybe they don't get the car
that year, there can doesn't
get to go to college, that is
the choice you're making
tonight by beginning to take
land out of the orpa for those
people, want them to remember
if they are listening that if
people vote for the project
here and take land out of the
orpa they are taking
potentially money out of their
pocket.
Thank you for your time.
I appreciate it.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
I am quincy
, and occoquan
resident since 1973.
I will just take the short term
because my father jack is going
to do the long time.
I want to thank the chris with
the family for all the years he
put in the place.
Both my daughters became expert
writers on your property and
they both went off to compete
at the national level in
quarter horse writing.
Thank you very much for your
service and I am beyond sad
this is shutting down.
You guys were a magnificent
addition to our community for
more than 50 years so thank you
very much.
I'm going to repeat what you
just heard.
Please keep the orpa in place.
We have to
protect our drinking
water and datacenter water,
unfortunately.
You for that went to fairfax
county because they know what
they are doing up there and we
don't
.
If the data centers need water,
they can choose groundwater
recycling through wells that
are cut down a huge amount of
our water from prince william
county that we produced in the
mooney plant goes
, the water
from fairfax county water
authority.
The plant recycles it.
But a huge amount about water
goes to the data centers
.
If I was you I would ask pws a
how much of their water is
going to data centers because
it's an unknown.
You should know what that
number is every day.
We can't drink it if it is in
the data center
.
It goes up there and get pumped
up and they recycle it.
And then it comes back to the
occoquan of course.
This is
your decision obviously
.
Citizens have opinions,
planning commissions have
opinions and boards and
supervisors are the only ones
that have boats so this is on
the wall.
Want to thank the applicant for
downsizing for what he started
out staying open communication
with the rest of the community
thank you very much.
Guys have done good and I think
not being an expert on this
stuff.
I think a big open area with
the pond on it is going to do
the things we want for
protecting, rather than just
five acre lots.
So thank you very much for
that.
Like jack said, we need more
support for the orpa.
Thank you all for paying
attention.
Thank you for a
long night.
Thank you for doing what you're
going to do and protect the
orpa whatever you do.
As far as I'm concerned, we the
quality developer here who is
trying to make in our mental
impact and he picked up the
fairfax county standards which
nobody else has which I
appreciate a loft.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
before jack goes again, I'm
calling the next group out.
Hold on.
Let me call them up.
Doctor jack, let me call up the
next group of people.
So I have andrew
, [Name], julie
I am sorry have your
pronunciation on the other page
but I am looking at you so go
on up.
Richard welch and nathan
higgins
.
It is your turn.
>> Public Speaker: MADAM Chair
and members of the board, I
wish you well for the holidays
in the year ahead.
I do want to say we are blessed
with quality staff
.
They do as much due diligence
as possible and I want to thank
the staff for working at the
applicant and I want to thank
the applicant for remaining
open dialogue with us
.
We can pick up the phone and
say could you meet us?
In fact, we met OCTOBER 30 our
last meeting and went over all
the changes
.
The committee has asked over
the high density, but we ended
up with a substantial density
suggestions and then also doing
a lot of things that were more
respectful of the land.
I want to complement the
applicant in that regard.
I know he is a commitment to
continue the dialogue.
And with that I want to ask
whatever decision you make, if
you make an approval we would
like to have a courtesy review
on the architecture signage,
lighting, landscaping,
stormwater controls and such so
we can have that dialogue.
And we can engage the community
in the discussion prior to
final site plan.
So we would like to see that.
With regard to the orpa in
particular, we strongly
recommend to maintain the orpa
designation rather than that in
the three.
It's a philosophy of protecting
the reservoir and just trying
to be good stewards
.
I would say the applicant a
step
forward in that regard in a
positive manner, which
encourages us
.
As we look at this particular
application
, we have serious
commitments
.
65 percent is now an opened
base
.
We have the commitment to place
it into a conservation easement
in trust.
We have the buffer along the
prince william parkway.
It will be an undisturbed
buffer.
Is not quite 50 feet but it is
an undisturbed buffer.
And we
talked a lot about parking and
we said we want to see ample
parking in street parking and
all that came to pass so we
ended up with 1124 parking
spaces when we have 721
required spaces.
And we are approximately 400
spaces above code.
These are all good places been.
We have the bow stations we are
looking at within our around
the site.
The other thing we worked on
years ago with the moss was
trying to eliminate the u-turns
.
Are a specific recommendation
in the letter to the mosque
leadership was the queens
chapel intersection to be
better realigned
.
And what MR. Romano actually
affected the change with what
he has done
.
What he is proposing along
galveston court.
In the area of the complex and
then we talked about internal
traffic movements the idea of
not having more traffic on the
parkway
.
I think it is at work in
progress, but the internal
traffic movements have been
optimized as much as the
applicant could do.
I think that would help reduce
the counts on the two
problematic areas of that
section.
we are looking to have
undisturbed areas with the
natural slope and natural
surface trail
.
And that was discussed by the
applicant with the lost creek
neighbors in the trail when to
be field cleared with minimal
clearcutting.
So these are
, in the end of the
conservation easement as well
.
A lot of this is coming to pass
based on his discussion with
the neighbors and we like to
see that continue in some
fashion because this project
will not be built overnight.
It will take a while to get in
place.
I just wanted to go back to the
orpa.
The orpa is designed
.
Was on the original committee
we were trying to meet
preservation standards
.
By the way, I worked on writing
a paper to the public works
committee as the chair of the
federal water quality
association government affairs
from the water environment for
senator mitchell and the
committee to recommend and be
established and then they came
back to the sunshine and
government act five years later
and said should the act remain
or should it go away
.
And we recommended that remain
in place as a permanent
institution.
Because we've ecological change
going on in the area.
Ecological changes more than
decades.
Knew of the local jurisdictions
that need to work to codify
things and they were working on
it.
That was quite an experience
working to get preservation by
act incorporated in congress.
I did it through the
professional organization with
other members of associations.
Chesapeake, virginia, and
others picked pennsylvania and
others
.
I do want to say when we were
pondering the orpa of what it
should look like, to have it
function to reduce settlements,
reduce nutrients and pollutants
and although that comment and
be respectful of steep
slope
areas, environmentally
sensitive areas and it shrinks
well soils, which by the way on
list if you can see up on the
charts the staff offered to,
you had those elements in the
chart
.
And that is the very definition
of orpa.
We need to work smartly to be
considerate of our environment
and to work expectations for
performance so we can leave
that at the foot of the
developer who says I want to do
something here on this piece of
land and staff out of the
expectations provide to the
applicant
.
It saves time, saves money, it
seems problems down the road if
we can be more thoughtful about
what to do within the orpa.
I would urge the board to think
about this MAY be committed
staff time and funds and have a
citizen stakeholder group
discussed that in a thoughtful
manner and see what elements
could be incorporated in those
expectations that you could
provide others in the future.
By the way, in the presentation
he had
, he talked about the
horse theme your grave
institutions in prince william
county such as the foundation,
the center for the arts that
they could take off on the
horse theme park unit of other
things involved.
Might be something for
discussions in the future if
you decide to go forward with
this project and so with that,
thank you very much and I wish
you well in your decision.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you very much.
Next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: my name is
andrew.
I live in the occoquan district
.
Been in the area seven months
now.
I have four kids myself so this
was going to be our secluded
forever home.
As far away as I could go my
way from the D.C. Area.
I would first like to start
with the development and
turning the lost creek
residential area to be three.
I don't think it is an adequate
segue from a religious temple
to a business place to the
residential place backing to
nsr 1. Is not respectful of the
lay of the land and it's going
to cause more traffic into a
high density area.
With that being said, I will
move on from that.
People have spoken.
Rofessionals with the county
is spoken.
You people signal about
environmental, you people
saying know about school in the
first presentation 20 citizen
say no and one say yes and you
guys still chose to go against
the professionals and the
people.
I ask why
.
Location on hoadley regarding
identities will add traffic and
more traffic in a tight space.
We have a mile stretch of
shopping centers
.
Now maple grove park no matter
what traffic pattern you do,
it's not going to work.
We lived in the northern region
my whole life.
It is always a disaster
.
You are not going to turn three
lanes into two lanes because
you were getting the whole
woodrow wilson bridge effect.
D.C. To marilyn effect.
We can do we want to keep
piling on the high density and
it's never going to work in all
your numbers are statistics
.
Poor planning and traffic
circle we keep hearing from the
development company is I'm
going to make an additional
left lane.
Three left lanes to two, common
sense does not work.
Making changes I appreciate
that but I would expect the
professional manner those
changes would be made in the
presentation suitable for the
common person to see and
technologist.
Otherwise we are green what is
on the board.
And I would like to see before
you guys commit to this is an
actual plan.
We have all this ai, all these
professionals to say it's good
for the development but what
about the traffic pattern per
quarter feasible traffic
patterns that are going to be
done by the tax payers were the
county
.
What is that going to be.
They going to do to solve these
problems, not to
mention we have
another thousand homes being
built in a two mile radius.
Like he said, there would be
additional runoff traffic and
then returning prince william
county into fairfax county
which is an unaffordable place
for its own self if this is
going to trickle down
.
I would take this time to think
wisely on making these
decisions and development in
certain areas we improve
certain areas developing other
areas.
That is all they will say this
time.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
My name is julia
.
I am in the occoquan district.
I would like to circle back.
I've been hearing a lot about
orpa and the thing I'm most
concerned about is that in orpa
it sounded like it recommended
five acres per one home
.
And then we heard also that
when we had the environment all
specialist was asked the
question which would be better
for orpa
.
Five acres per one home or the
development is currently
proposed and he said five acres
per one home.
That is what was
in orpa.
And had been developed over 10
years with a locked of studies,
a law that input and those
recommendations
.
It surprises me one developer
can come in, propose something
that doesn't match orpa and yet
this is being seriously
considered, which would also
jeopardize the drinking water
for already the current
residents who have moved to the
area because we wanted to have
areas that were conserved.
We wanted to have the trees, we
wanted to have this area
.
And when doing this, it's just
this area that needs to be
preserved for the watershed.
We are not saying oh my gosh
potomac mills is disturbing the
watershed are these other areas
, they would be more
appropriate.
There are other areas that are
better suited for
transportation.
Here is
transportation already multiple
buses going to certain areas
and then if we would have been
to redeveloping some of those
areas
, that would be better for
the community
.
Currently I live off of hoadley
road near purcell and I decided
to try omni ride to.
It was very discouraging.
I never could get a ride back
.
During a five day period taking
omni ride I would be able to
get to work but I would show up
in one bus would state that the
time, another bus wouldn't show
up
.
Even if you add a couple of
buses
, we don't have a law that
come through.
There other areas where people
able to.
Here we go to stoneridge and it
is very small.
When he of the other buses that
go near potomac mills
, those
buses come so regularly.
If one driver is unable to
shall be of another bus did
another bus of people were
saying that was not a big deal.
This is something we are trying
to plan already in saying we
are going to rely on buses that
that would help with the
traffic
.
I just don't see how that's
going to pick especially when
there are so many developments
that have been made or they
have one entrance.
This one sounds like it might
have one other entrance but
again, it's funneling onto
hoadley road and estimates
traffic.
The other main thing I wanted
to point out was by changing
this designation
.
Going from agriculture to mu3,
not keeping in the spirit with
orpa but it also sounds like we
have a locked
, if with this
change we are creating this
precedent that will show other
areas can be chipped away.
The watershed will continue to
be degraded by having these
high density projects right
next to the watershed.
Of this is something that can
happen this time the developers
remember this and come back
again and again and by
properties already and say no
we are ready to develop this
and it would to be harder and
harder to say no.
Think one of the thing people
have mentioned is fairfax
county has also been an example
of having five acre homes per
one house
.
You can see the area they try
to protect in the watershed in
fairfax county just the crossed
the river has shown it provides
ample area for the watershed to
recharge
.
And so with that, I urge you to
oppose the changing of the
zoning.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: hello.
I live in the coles district.
We have spoken at length about
the future tonight so if you
will allow me would like the
pause and alternative
perspective with respect to
that future.
I am the father of two young
beautiful children.
t took my
wife and I several years to
find appropriate housing for
our family and we wanted to
live here in prince william
county.
Fortunately we found some, but
many young families like
ourselves in our generation are
not as fortunate.
We are struggling to find
housing is at a reasonable
price point and it's no secret
we are facing a housing crisis.
People want to be near their
families in a multigenerational
presence here in print on them
county.
The majority of my wife's
family are in prince william
and that's key for us having
our family nearby to help raise
our children.
Often when reasonably priced
housing as discussed, we are
told not here because of reason
x or not there because of
reason why.
Or not there because of reason
z and the end result is there's
very little suitable space for
the reasonably priced housing
the message becomes no one
else's welcome to continue
renting because the
american
dream is not for you.
You own nothing and you will be
happy.
We are at risk of becoming a
transient county where young
families are subscribing to
live just because it is within
a manageable district
.
If you want homeownership the
message becomes no
.
Spend more time communing and
less time with their family.
understand there are many
factors contributing to the
housing crisis one of those
that supply and that is a key
the board distal control over.
It is within your power to do
your part in reining in these
runaway home
prices.
Looking at hoadley square I see
a proposal that sets a strong
standard for environmental
protection and has adequate
funds proffered to support
transportation education.
Just as important and means
warehousing for young families
who want to call prince william
home
.
Not just some transient
location where we subscribe to
limburg am asking the board of
supervisors to invest in the
vision of a county where people
can continue to lead on the
roots.
Not just a place they lead so
they can take their kids to
mosaic.
Did not just a place where you
a are a perpetual tenant.
Hoadley squirt and I request
the honorable board of
supervisors vote in favor of
the conference of plan
amendment and the rezoning.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
before I get to the next
speaker I want to make sure I
call the next few.
So I've richard.
Nathan higgins
.
[Name]
Thank you.
[Name]
Kevin parker
.
[Name] If you can all go to the
back.
And then I will have the next
speaker come up.
Spoke on jonathan higgins,
nathan higgins father.
It's a school night so school
starts in seven hours or so.
He is getting up in seven hours
so I am here on his behalf.
Ot going to try to retell
what nathan told you.
You heard about his concerns
with the school capacity in the
traffic capacity and they are
the same concerns on the
project here.
Item I would like to bring up
is that b3 zoning
.
I look at that is a different
area than the rest of the
project.
I'm concerned with the orpa I
don't support that but the
zoning a particular hate to use
the word offensive, but I would
use that word.
The idea homes can be bought in
the neighborhood and rezoned
out from under you to
commercial space, convenience
store, whatever the different
ideas have been
.
Thinking lot of us in this room
lives in a community that
doesn't have an hoa that
doesn't protect us from the
sort of intrusion.
Purchased the home my realtor
looked at not
having hoa being a
positive thing.
Never realized there is no
organization or by laws
protecting me from having homes
converted and rezoned.
That is why we rely on mute to
prevent zoning and things of
that nature to maintain the
public confidence that if you
move into a neighborhood it is
not going to become a
convenience store and at the
convenience store doesn't work
out become a smoke shop like I
have seen in some of the other
neighborhoods were mixed use
zoning was allowed in the
businesses failed.
With that I ask you to vote no
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
It will be good morning soon.
Neabsco district but I did live
across from this project for
many years.
In queens dale estates today
there is a property in the
market for 950,000.
Most properties when I lived in
the area were 500, 550.
And basically it has doubled
that's what's happening in the
area.
For me this is the most storm
desirable area.
That last barrier between
eastern prince william county
and manasses area.
Realistically at the end of the
day, and this is still a
suburban area often measure
road at a major intersection in
prince william pkwy.
, we have here is a property
that is attached to this major
route and that the development
is going.
What it does all this instead
having homes at 950,000 the
lack of supply, there are five
homes in the entire area
between trenton road and
richfield available-for-sale.
rom prince william pkwy.
To dale boulevard, the entire
square if you guys can have the
mental imagery, it is five
homes that are for sale in the
entire area.
Hat's what we
have had for the last couple
years.
We need to solve is a supply
issue.
We need 2000 homes in the
region to solve some format of
what we have.
What the impact for me here.
And live off dale boulevard
that is one of only parks and
trails you can access walking
.
There is nothing.
From dale boulevard to prince
william pkwy.
And there's no sidewalks and no
access to any kind of amenities
.
For me what this creates is a
movable, walkable community
where I have a sidewalk that
connects to hoadley.
It creates trails I can
actually walk
.
If you guys are aware, there is
nothing in the area.
There is no nature, there's no
walkable communities.
For me that's one of the
biggest potential impacts for
me.
I think the applicants have
done a great job lowering the
density so there is a lot of
density pick what they are
doing is bringing density that
matters and they are creating
better product
.
With the maple dale proposal
you have a lot of these high
density, smaller homes this
type of product brings livable
townhomes, usable townhomes.
I personally hate the
reloading, kind of four levels
.
Data house you can have a
modest space in, have a
townhouse that has a garage,
have a driveway so you are not
in these communities where one
car can come in, one car can
come out.
The community design has been
great, the public area is
great.
I don't know of any other
developer in the region that
would do what they can for the
public and that's the biggest
difference between the
development versus others the
fact that there is additional
parking, the fact they are
relining the road.
I go across that every friday.
The misalignment has been so
many incidents there.
Having the ability to pull
traffic away and have a public
road that goes into their
having the access to galveston.
Not only is it going to support
the businesses, all the people
leaving other friday, but it
will pull a lot of the traffic
away from the intersection of
queens dale.
So those are major points.
If you look at the current farm
that's the majority of the
developable area.
It is really a minor area, in
additional seven acres.
But the majority is going to be
preserved and I know that if a
huge concern but this is a
suburban area off of the major
road at a major intersection
.
That is it for me.
i would ask you to approve it.
It is going to be huge impact
and will bring a lot of people
that can live and work here.
Would add one thing.
For me every single community
amenity have to drive to.
I used to do a lot of sports.
Have to go to fairfax to have
that environment or community
center.
Is nothing like that here and a
lot of times we need the
density.
We need the density to support
community events, community
activities and programs.
We need the density to create
jobs in the area and have the
jobs be local versus having to
go to D.C. Or arlington and
same thing for retail.
We need density to support
long-lasting retail in our area
versus we get half-baked ideas
over here that last a couple
years and they fizzle out.
With all that I would ask you
vote for approval on this
project.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: kevin
parker, neabsco district.
I'm here to urge you to vote
against this.
We need to balance the values
of housing and the other
environmental values that we
have.
But we tend to do with water
issues like in the book I read,
a civil action talking about
the pollution in woburn
massachusetts and exposed
talking about the pollution in
west virginia
.
intends to cause a big problem.
And later go we have a big
problem we have to fix the
problem.
It is better to instead with
water situations is to say
let's try to have a situation
beforehand and not worry about
the problem after it happens.
Was mentioned about this is a
small area in comparison of the
watershed.
Say we want to protect the
occoquan nonstick to the rules
is like saying you want to lose
weight but not today.
Today in comparison to the will
of everything is not really
consequential.
I don't think it's realistic to
think people will use public
transit from this location.
The commuting will get worse it
will be the same issue the
gentleman that spoke for it was
talking about traveling in from
outside the county.
You
increase the time on the road
.
A lot of people can't be at
these meetings and all the
people will be stuck in traffic
on old bridge the parkway.
Eventually the story would have
to be told that the decisions
that led to the situation of
living and sitting in traffic
and how it happened.
It we developed on the edge
over the decades the
development moved from 95
marching out in the manassas
direction.
What we decided to
do instead having the density
that people do want to, we said
okay we want to have this dense
development on the edge of the
pattern for I've lived here for
decades as the emerging among
old bridge over the years.
All the arguments I have heard
are persuasive I think I think
these are strong arguments that
argue in favor of voting
against this project.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
before we get to the next
speaker I want to call up my
next group.
I have.
[Name]
, allie and a guy named
chris griffin said he wanted to
sign up?
All right.
And that is it for in person.
If all of you can go up.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
I am.
[Name] I have been in part in
this area since 1995 so for the
last 30 years I've lived in
manassas, manassas park and I
live in bristow as part of the
gainesville district.
First I would like to thank all
of you county staff and
everyone involved such as
trenton project area.
I strongly support the project
as it represents responsible
growth of benefits local
community in the county.
In the past 30 years I've seen
housing demand and supply and
how it impacted on an
individual.
As many of us know currently
into significant housing
shortage.
My daughter working full-time
for the past three years is
struggling to find a home
.
Increasing the housing supply
is crucial to addressing rising
costs.
as we know from the principal
limited supply and how demand
drive up prices.
This is exactly what's
happening in our area.
By improving the project we can
take a significant step toward
meeting communities need.
We look forward to receiving
approval for the project.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
And then number in the
community since 2010.
Here to talk about the housing
affordability.
As a parent I'm concerned about
the limited options available
to the young graduate
.
I strongly support the project
and urge you to approve it.
More housing means more
opportunities for our children
to stay in the community they
grew up in.
Let's work together to build a
bright future for our families
with forward to receiving your
approval for this project
.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: five minutes
later it would've been good
morning.
My name is.
[Name] I would request to give
me a little more time because
I'm going to mention something
that is not just what everyone
else said that will open your
eyes in terms of other aspects
.
I've lived directly across from
the
horse farm the subdivision
that has 60 houses.
Unfortunately than builders we
are providing the space for
community for folks to come in
and enjoy time.
They didn't do anything for the
subdivision.
I wish the county did they
proffer and out a little bit a
land for a parker something.
Was here and mentioned the only
place where the kids can go, we
go to dar alnoor.
We have swings literally
nothing on this area.
I'm excited about it.
Because one of the reasons for
us to go somewhere is a park
like that, there's a walk
around in depend elementary.
In fact, one time I didn't know
that and I took my children
over there and the principal
came out running saying we can
be here during school hours
even though there was nobody
using it.
That is the frustration that we
feel.
Anyway, moving on the reason I
wanted extra time was we all
grabbed a word but I can
guarantee you I didn't think I
think the folks here today.
Thank you executive shorter.
Thank you to the chairperson
other folks being here past
midnight and listening to us
babbling for going back to what
I insane, the buzzword we all
cite arpa but go ask the
residents 90 percent of even
know what it is.
The reason I'm saying this
right now is what is it really.
Never in the history of man
kind putting a dam on the river
has been beneficial to the
natural life but we are calling
out supervisors and you made a
commitment that you're going to
protect the natural life.
If you protect arpa you are not
protecting the natural life.
It's like a fountain, water
content and there is a bucket
next to it.
The runoff goes into the bucket
supervisors, would you drink
out of the water faucet or the
bucket?
I would not drink out of the
bucket.
I would drink out of the water
faucet but guess what?
We have polluted parliament
reversal unit is supervisors
look at the bigger picture
because it we are looking at
this chunk of land in talking
our heart out.
Look at the bigger picture and
say we will clean up the river,
the state go unfenced going to
clean up all that.
It right of the river which is
dirty, which is nasty and
trying to fix it is not going
to work for trying to fix it is
almost like asking executive
shorter up the tree behind him,
can you please water that kenny
put some light on it.
It's not going to work out.
That is almost like that.
Trying to fix something that is
broken and we are all out here.
We have heard a lot of folks
talk about a joint that not
having an hoa that the land is
taken away and reasons.
We have heard the planning
commission folks coming and
satan snakes are getting into
the home because of the
subdivisions on the building
that's
going to happen.
That's not going to happen.
but I want to say right now,
which other folks haven't
talked about, is in 2021 there
was a resettlement.
Which is
what I told him the planning
commission hearing as well.
They were brought over here, I
am a veteran so they help those
overseas.
We try to resettle them over
here.
Housing prices so high like the
gentleman side almost $1
million so they cannot purchase
a home in this area.
Until these townhouses going
in, they are more reasonable in
price as opposed to
single-family homes on this
area and then there is bidding
even though I don't believe in
critical race theory but some
of my friends are like that
kinda sounds like it when you
have single-family homeowners
bidding on housing and you have
low income folks that can't get
in here in this area.
One thing I will mention to you
is these folks, like I said
there are many folks you will
see them on MARCH 29.
Is it MARCH 29
.
There would be 10,000 folks
every batch that will come in
from almost 30,000 folks that
will come in here.
These are the same folks
another expensive areas in the
movement in this area.
So you are actually providing a
means for the people to stay
here.
Come election time I can
guarantee these folks, I
request you to come on that
need and tell them that we
approved it, but the housing
happened and so you can move
into the housing cheaper homes
compared to the single-family
million dollar homes and we can
thank us for that.
And I can guarantee you they
will thank you for that.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: hello
everybody.
I am not your average joe, but
I am your average chris.
My name is chris griffin.
I am currently a coles
resident.
, 40+ year born and raised
print will end county
competent.
My parents raised me, went to
the school systems to show my
age.
I have a 22-year-old who still
lives with us, which is fine.
I was the first graduating
class of forest park high
school when it was brand-new.
Go bruins.
I grew up in montclair.
About that thanks to live in
most of the jurisdictions up
there I want to thank the
county supervisors
, county
attorney, and the county
executive.
I know you guys don't get
recognition often so thank you.
I passed by the horse farm for
a long time.
I took my wife there many
times.
Are small son.
It was a great time.
It's become a landmark for
prince william county.
But I want you to know.
I can hear the title and some
of the papers going something
like this.
County approves new rezoning
opening
for development but
wait, there's more.
New residents will get a
courtesy cut through
recommended for the police to
direct for hundreds of traffic,
but only on fridays.
Hoa clubhouse signage
.
Comes with us on fridays and
start traffic going past our
white picket fences what we
discussed dues and inspections.
By improving the rezoning your
opening pandora's box and
arrive over making prints
within county more unaffordable
for middle-class constituents.
A lot of people are not staying
and retiring
.
I have the luxury of being able
to work with a lot of people my
small business, some even in
the room has clients and old
friends.
It's a pitch.
You need to understand your
stats.
Sources are saying there are 75
undeveloped properties in
prince william county.
Thousand homes are currently
for sale.
There are approximately 1500
homes available for rent the.
I think we should focus on some
of that and try to make those
obtainable for existing
residents and encouraging them
to come in.
Average new house cost is
$600,000
.
We don't have an available home
option for some.
we don't have an availability,
in available home option.
We have an available
affordability option at the
cost of others in long-term
residence.
In regards to the young
gentleman up
here, 10 percent
of his age are going to be able
to afford of that magnitude on
a single income.
Since jr real estate comes from
fairfax, prince william county
is a land grab pick they are
experts, but you need to
understand everybody in the
room, we are experts up in
constituents and
residents of
prince william county.
You need to listen to us.
We are all here, it's late,
some
of us have work in the morning
, some of us don't.
Jr
specializes in entitlement
specializations include
rezoning, encumbrance and plan
amendments, special use permits
and subdivision and site
planning, by right
entitlements,
proffer amendments
.
Group acts as a bridge between
landowners national builders
taken the risk of entitlement
procedures before selling and
ready to build development.
Who knows what's going to
change once it goes through.
Time and time again we have
seen the estimated cost go
higher and higher from what
staff originally tells you what
developers or buyers would tell
you it's going to cost.
We have seen that time and time
again where you've been
misinformed or you have been
lied to.
Whether on purpose or
indirectly, I don't know
.
Let's find actual local prince
william county groups
developers to work for our own
area and build our own area.
Support local businesses to do
the bidding for you.
I enjoy being a long-term
resident and I think because we
all know the situation for the
current course farm, there's a
lot of smart people in the
county.
If it is something that is one
to do, I think the county board
and people in the area should
come together and help the farm
owner if they want to stay and
allow her to stay and afford
where she is at and take care
of the horses rather than
selling it to a community
developer.
Or find somebody who will buy
it and keep it as a horse farm.
This a lot of people involved
in the county were smart and
willing and able to do that
.
I know you can find somebody to
do that rather than building
and building and building
piglets make things more
affordable.
I appreciate everyone's time.
Thank you so much for being
here and I hope we can come
together now that we all know
what's happening.
It's a historic, I'm going to
say historic landmark.
And remember it as a kid.
I loved it.
Hate to see it
go.
i don't think people will be
happy about watching traffic
come through a new subdivision
only on fridays
.
Thank you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: good
evening.
I live in neabsco district.
I've been living there for more
than 15 years
.
We always think me and my wife
and two beautiful kids always
thinking to relocate to this
area because we attend dar
alnoor.
We always bring kids here in
prince william county to sport
activity running and we always
have a challenge finding the
community center as well in the
area.
I can spend time with my kids
doing sport activity.
And also looking for affordable
housing here and I am here
tonight to support the
department and I want to thank
you as well.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Do we have anyone online
.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
let's check and see.
Do we have anyone online,
chris?
>> the one person we did have
online has dropped out.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
okay.
Incorporated you for your
assistance.
Have a good night.
Back to you, MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
i'm going to close the public
hearing for agenda items 13 b
and sc
.
I would like the applicant and
staff to be prepared to ask
additional questions based off
of what they heard and I do
have a question for the
applicant.
If you can come up.
We have heard doctor jack had
asked for a courtesy review.
I would also like to see one in
medco.
Is that something applicant is
willing to do?
>> yes.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
I guess this is for staff.
We have been hearing a lot
about identity.
There was a mention
for maple
valley grove that was more
suburban.
When I think of identity I
think of the mark of
alexandria.
That's a very dense, urban
multifamily
.
What is the difference if you
can say between suburban high
density.
How would you define the
difference.
>> can look at the
comprehensive plan.
E have
six categories.
The top is the one that can
support the highest level of
transit which is our
high-capacity transit like our
vre stations in the sixes 100+
dwelling units per acre.
The next category is 5 to 50
and per bus rapid transit or
some other kind of transit.
and so at the transit service
level goes down, the density
goes down.
We are talking about three,
which is a suburban moderate
density that doesn't need
intense transit for service.
It doesn't support with
high-capacity transit.
And so it is not high density
.
I would say hi density our
transect five and six.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: dave, don't go
too far.
There's been talk about the
line of where it should
start,
where it shouldn't start, what
tributaries and waterways it
feeds to.
There's a discussion about the
body of water on the frontage
of the horse farm right now.
Could you talk about that and
from a planners perspective
where the lines are drawn what
that means and larger
perspective?
>> first the comprehensive plan
is a guide it.
We would like to use a big fat
crayon to draw those lines.
Since we use a computer to draw
them they end up being much
more precise then we intend
them to be.
But generally the orpa line was
following the watershed line we
had mapped.
We have that map
for the whole county.
Different watersheds and
subwatersheds.
Those were developed on usgs
quad topo topography.
Those are not super accurate
and we always want those things
to be field verified at the
site plan when they come down
to it.
Where the real line is for the
watershed really needs to be
determined at a later date.
That's why I say we use a big
crayon and we use it as a guide
and not as a precise
measurement is not the best way
to use it.
>> Kenny Boddye: thank you for
that did the applicant want to
add anything to that piece
based on their own findings?
Hey were looking at the site
and
analysis.
>> yes.
So the applicant actually
looked at the county map and
looked at what dcr has on their
map and ultimately it would be
field verified.
To the left is prince william
county watershed map onto the
right is the dcr a watershed
map so this is the amount
.
There this a more updated and
accurate then prince william
county mapper
.
If you look at the map, it goes
like this
.
It was hard to see so what we
did was we mapped it ourselves
using the county percentage
.
And so county mapper has 10
acres going to neabsco creek.
The dcr malpass 12 acres going
to the neabsco creek.
Our environmental consultant
that the review of what would
be required at the sign of site
plan and determine is probably
2 to 3 percent more going to
neabsco that would be verified
at the time a site plan and
submitted to the county for
review.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega?
>> Yesli Vega: follow-up for
dave.
Winded that county discovered
these lines aren't, and they
quote, super accurate?
>> I don't know what you mean
by discovered.
>> Yesli Vega: this is the
first time I've heard about
this.
>> the applicant brought that
to our attention last week.
>> Yesli Vega: the applicant
brought it to her attention
last week and now the position
is lines are not super
accurate?
Got it.
I have a question for jonelle.
When did the commercial
component get added in the
process?
>> I believe it was the third
submission.
>> Yesli Vega: it was that
before or after the request and
what was the reason for it
again?
>> the zoning ordinances when
you have a pmr over 50 acres
you have to provide an area of
nonresidential
.
With the commercial area in the
pmr district
, the only area
permitted is b3.
We understand the encumbrance
of blame when we look at zoning
designations they have it is
implementing.
The pmr district the
implementing commercial is b3
and thus the least intense
commercial use.
but we do commit to doing is
the area is specifically says
the use, the residential
, the
home should remain as a
residential use
.
This remains as a residential
use and this is the b3 areas of
the lost creek folks have the
residential use remains in me
of the buffers and undisturbed
open space area.
>> Yesli Vega: you are saying
it is a need to?
I don't know dave if you want
to come up.
I'm struggling with this
because the staff report
highlights the addition of
commercial use is incompatible
with the designation.
We don't know what type of
commercial development has
come.
We have been given a list of
potentials, but it adds to the
discussion of what is going to
be thrown into the reservoir.
So I am a little confused.
Can you help clarify my
confusion?
>> some of that area is being
changed to mu3 but some of that
area was not in the initiated
comprehensive plan amendment
.
That is why it doesn't reflect
the orpa.
It's not going to be changed by
the comprehensive plan
amendment because it wasn't
included in the original
property boundary we use to
initiate the comprehensive plan
amendment and we can't change
what was initiated.
Therefore
that remains a orpa and
therefore cobra analyzed it as
if it was still orpa.
>> Yesli Vega: talking about
the and faxed to school,
hounded we calculate the
monetary contributions?
What formula
.
How did we land 490 SEPTEMBER
06, 2020 I believe?
>> as part of the application
you have to do a proper impact
analysis
.
The state code says you can
only mitigate your inbox via
monetary contributions for
schools, fire and rescue
,
police, parks and recreation.
It also says if there is not a
plan in the cip to address the
lack of something so if there's
not a plan to address the lack
of schools or new school coming
online you don't mitigate your
impacts
.
That is basically see one
ticket then says he can look
and offer what the developer
sees as reasonable.
Where to
company that does the proper
impact analysis.
They look at the number of
schools and they do their
calculation in order to tell us
what is a reasonable amount for
the monetary level of service
and that's how we came up with
that number.
>> Yesli Vega: I'm not going to
ding the applicant for that
because I don't think it's
appropriate but it is in their
fine example of poor planning
and moving projects without
addressing underlying issues.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
does anyone else have any
additional questions?
Thank you so much.
With that, supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: it is my
understanding that some folks
MAY feel differently and so I'm
going to do them separately of
folks don't mind.
I move 13 b for approval.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
It has been properly moved and
seconded.
Any discussion on this?
Upervisor vega?
>> Yesli Vega: since you
offered, why not.
Why not.
Here we are again.
The door has been opened and
it's not going to be closed and
I want you to remember this for
those who are pro and against.
This is the standard being set
by the majority who decides to
vote for this project.
For the cpa initiation.
I will reserve my comments for
the rezoning that is about to
follow.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
does anyone else have any
comments?
All right.
I would like to call for the
vote.
>> thank you supervisor angry.
>> motion passes 6/2
supervisors gordy and vega
voting no.
>> Kenny Boddye: if you don't
mind I also move 13c for
approval.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
13c has been moved and
seconded.
I see supervisor boddye, you
are first.
>> Kenny Boddye: one, wanted to
thank all the residents who
came out tonight.
I know it has been a long
night.
It is now morning.
Welcome the wednesday morning
everyone.
Want to think staff of the work
they have done this.
I know we have gone through a
long journey with this.
As was said before
, you went
and did the work anyone above
and beyond the applicant.
Iterated to, he went to the
community, you came back.
From where is started and where
we are now, and a 35 percent
reduction from your first
submission.
Not only did you lower the unit
themselves, he lowered the
intensity of their multifamily
units, you have a lot of
denser units and now we are at
a much more suburban type
development that keeps a lot
more with the community asked
for.
I also wanted to commend you
for offering at various times
trying to figure out ways to
mitigate other issues you had
no control over and you didn't
necessarily have a play into.
You have that initial
connection that wanted to give
them another way to get out and
turn left without having to sit
there that they're one way in
and out.
I know that we had a joint
community event with them
, they
rejected that and so you moved
on from that
.
I wanted to thank the community
continuing to meet with me in
my office.
we had quite a few different
meetings around the proposal
and we heard you.
I do not see this as a death of
a thousand cuts as has been
remarked.
I see this is a bridge linking
existing residential religious
uses to major employment center
in the government complex.
Infill protects more land, not
less.
Wanted to talk about traffic.
What is different here.
There significantly more
contributions for the project
and the other one
.
If you talk about this
holistically, I agree with you
these two projects link
together.
There are interpersonal
connections and roadway network
which we get the folks another
way out other than galveston
court.
Those things fit together.
Folks will be able to in talks
with both applicants there will
be conversations about joint
use agreement so this will not
be just one isolated community.
This will be enlisted
community.
I pushed so hard
to make sure the projects came
in on the same night.
I know and appreciate the
constituent who shared her
story about not being able to
get home pick a number of us on
the board sit on the on the
right commission.
That's the type of feedback we
need because no one should take
a bus and have an omni ride bus
to take them back home so that
is feedback we can use and it
underscores the fact there's a
lot more work we need to do
around making sure our internal
traffic network as it pertains
to transit is better
.
You should be able to ride to
work the ride back and so I
hear you and appreciate that.
I also wanted to hone in on the
water quality for a second
.
Folks are right protecting the
occoquan reservoir is not an
option.
The guidance exists there when
the case matters is the
rezoning includes protection
that currently does not exist
under the current zoning
ordinance.
We are still working to get
there.
We have at meetings around it,
we'd meetings around updating
the zoning ordinance to meet
the need for the moment,
however, there are things I
wanted to highlight that meet
the moment.
Well testing.
I've heard a lot about folks on
the wells
.
The folks to the west and the
folks to the north.
I hear you on wells in the
applicant has committed to well
testing.
Baseline afterwards to make
sure they are not adversely
impacting peoples wells.
If there's any indication they
are they will make people hold.
That is in their
.
High-performance storm water
management, jellyfish
filtration.
Works.
Low impact development are.
they are not buying credit
somewhere else to offset the
fact they are polluting the
water there.
They are doing the right thing
there.
Last thing they will say is I
hear only you that pertains to
the change this represents I'm
not dismissing anyone's input.
We've been applying it to the
last two years
.
This record shows the plan is
changed to because residents
showed up.
Fewer units, less intense
buildings increase protections
unenforceable proffers pick my
job is to weigh the full public
interest, neighborhood impacts
on water quality, the county
long-term plan were jobs and
services are growing.
This connects to a larger
picture on what the county
center will be in
the next 20
years.
Ll the other
proposals that have, crossed to
put density elsewhere and
outward we brought them here to
this part of it so you don't
have it further out
.
Thank you MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
supervisor vega?
>> Yesli Vega: thank you to
everyone who showed up.
We often get put in between a
rock and hard place when
developers come to
the office we
talk about projects having to
make financial sense.
We don't know the breakdown of
the details of their financial
so we take their word for it.
as a county supervisor, my job
is to make sure my constituents
interests are represented in
the land use application that
comes before my desk.
Why do I highlight that?
It's very important.
While they understand
developers need to make money,
you should not put a price on
something as basic as a human
right when it comes to having
access to clean water.
No amount of credits, no amount
of proffers can guarantee that
get in that.
It is frustrating when we have
applications come before the
board be presented to the
community that can be better
that the district supervisor
can work harder to improve and
that is the most frustrating
part about this entire process
is our job is elected officials
is to meet the applications
better to buy bringing your
concerns to the discussion
table this a lot about the
project I like.
I like the different types a
housing, like the product type.
But at the end of the day how
do we solve the overcrowding
issue and issues with traffic
how do we resolve the issues of
adding additional strains to
our public services
.
It comes down to the density.
Is never the willingness to
meet in the middle because
there is always that we had to
make money, and asked to make
financial sense and we as a
board have to figure that out
.
It is my opinion that the
community should not be forced
into an either or scenario
between housing and clean water
we talk about trying to solve
one problem by creating so many
more in this is a reality we
faced for a long time and in
many ways it's ridiculous I
have to keep saying the fact
folks are not opposed to
growth.
We have the second largest
county in the, will the
virginia.
Is a reason people want to come
and we can tackle the
affordable housing crisis, we
can tackle that overcrowding,
we can tackle the crumbling
infrastructure if we are
serious about doing it.
This is going to pass but the
simple promise to you all.
'm
going to continue to be a hawk
when it comes to sustainability
measures, when it comes to
talks about the environment and
how we put additional
protections because we can't
have it both ways pick we
cannot continue to speak out of
both sides of our mall and we
care about the environment in
its entirety or we don't.
Or we don't
.
It is that simple.
I think the applicant for
meeting with me, but this cake
was already baked because I
asked about density and asked
if we could talk about that and
the answer was no because the
district supervisor had already
brought into what the district
supervisor brought to me.
We had to be serious about
negotiate to make projects
better.
I believe in poverty rates in
my heart breaks for the
landowners to give every right
to sell your property but it's
my job to ensure I look at
things holistically, while you
are going to sell your property
and probably move out of the
area, of debate attention to
those of us who remain here and
for those who are to follow so
I will be voting no for those
reasons.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Supervisor boddye.
>> Kenny Boddye: not going to
go back and forth for as it
pertains to the motion itself
there was a courtesy review
requested.
I want to make sure county
staff updated the proffers.
>> the proffers have been
updated to include the courtesy
review.
>> Kenny Boddye: I want to
restate my motion to be
proffers dated
12/17/2025.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
do I need a second since we are
updated it?
Properly moved and seconded.
Is there any further
discussion?
Upervisor bailey
.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair: I
will be brief.
I wanted to thank the citizens
who came out and spoke on
behalf -- lend their voice to
how I feel about this.
I totally agree you are
entitled to good clean water,
but all are entitled to have
sheltered to have good homes to
live in.
And obtainable housing to live
in.
verybody in prince
william county and that's what
we are focused on to make sure
everybody who lives here wants
to be or can raise their
families here and could afford
to live here and have a decent
life
.
That is something nationally
everyone is suffering from.
How do we do that?
We do that by making sure the
comprehensive plan is holistic
,
totally holistic as we grow and
we have no control on how we
grow.
We've been growing a long time
under old rules and old housing
and so we need affordable
housing, obtainable housing.
Not just section 8 housing.
We need housing.
I commend the developer for
working with the staff to make
sure there's a little bit in
the pot for everybody.
Thank you so much for your
ability to think brought her.
We respect that and appreciate
that.
We don't always agree, but we
come to the center as much as
we can for everybody and that's
essential.
So thank you to the citizens
for coming out on speaking, but
you're right is also deaf
shelter.
Thank you MADAM Chair.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
all right.
Is there anyone else?
All right then.
Let's go ahead.
I would like to take the vote.
>> Victor Angry: yes.
>> thank you, sir.
Motion passes 7/1 supervisor
vega voting no.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so very much.
Just so everyone knows we are
going to go into public comment
time.
After we do public comment time
we still have an item we have
to discuss in session.
After that we will come out and
certify and at that time we can
adjourn.
If anyone is a betting person,
I am saying to weigh in.
Public comment time.
All right.
I'm going to let people file
out.
Goodbye alex.
All of you.
We know you.
All right everyone.
E have
two people signed up in person.
MR. Clancy and eileen johnson.
We haven't seen you in a long
time.
All right.
>> Public Speaker: are we
ready?
MADAM CHAIRMAN?
Okay.
Have a couple things I want to
bring up and citizens time.
First of all, I brought this up
before but I keep on until I
hear something positive about
it.
We need a county policy what we
are going to do with school
board property when it is
turned back from the developer
by the school system.
I have proposed before the
policy should be the priority
should be community gardens
.
We have a shortage of places
where people can increase the
densities all over the place.
this idea of the county getting
involved using taxpayer money
repair foundation the
geotechnical work was not done
is absurd.
That is what second mortgages
are for.
Going to be hard on this thing
if you decide you want to use
the tax money to fix somebody's
foundation.
Three, required data centers in
the development standards form
to use geothermal cooling.
If
we make them do geothermal
cooling it will stop using our
public water supply to cool the
things and send it down the
road to be retreated in sewage
treatment plant.
My last one is I will bring
this up again.
We need a county ordinance for
noise on vehicles because these
guys are running around
demonstrating
.
You can hear them six blocks
away with the noise they make.
Mongomery county has put noise
monitors and the issue tickets
to people for doing that kind
of stuff.
And you have the
authority to do it down here
and we can do something about
the disturbance in the
neighborhoods and thank you
very much for taking a moment
to listen to this.
GOD bless you all, merry
christmas
.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you so much.
Next speaker, please.
>> Public Speaker: hello.
How are you?
You didn't respond back.
how are you.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
we are wonderful.
We can barely hear you.
>> Public Speaker: I'm getting
rusty.
Is that better?
Good to be back.
Good morning.
My name is I in johnson then I
am from the woodbridge
district.
This morning I stand before you
as a wife and mother and
relentless advocate for foster
families and foster children in
prince william county.
For 33 months you've heard this
before but I will keep
repeating it.
In 28 days we had the honor of
loving a child affectionately
known as bumpy.
Bumpy was not just a child in
our care, bumpy was family.
A sweet little boy.
E was
deeply loved
, cherished with
everyday and help close in our
hearts.
My husband as well as my
children and I was pregnant
twice while advocating.
What happened to my family was
absolutely horrible.
Instead of support we faced
retaliation.
We were left at outside the
courtroom by dss workers, yes
we were.
Someone reached out to me and
took bumpy from me and laughed.
Dss workers, this was under
your watch MR. Shorter.
We were mocked accused of
becoming foster parents just
for money.
My family actually lost about
$30,000 to date advocating for
bumpy but we did it for money.
MR. Shorter, to this day those
accusations remain uncorrected.
The prince william county
department of social services
even went out of their way
, I
promise you, after I spoke
initially at public comment.
I don't know if I have said
this before, to make sure we
were no longer allowed to be
foster parents.
He of the pageantry of having
dss workers posted up online
saying how much you care about
foster families, but when I
spoke at public comment my
family was no longer allowed to
be foster parents.
Today I heard the board talk
about programs to support
families and children
, but what
good of the programs when the
system punishes families like
my own and don't protect the
foster children.
What good of the programs when
families are silenced for
speaking out.
And will continue to speak, MR.
Shorter, I told you that.
Our lives, our fight is not in
vain.
It is not in vain when I helped
take bumpy in the night when he
cried to.
It was not in vain when we make
sure bumpy had close on his
back, food on the table and
support in school.
It was not in vain when I
gained legal knowledge skills I
never had before but needed and
use now to protect my family.
It is not in vain when I
navigate for a 504 plan and an
iep when I've advocate for my
children MAY speak with parents
about autism and what it truly
means.
First corinthians 1558.
Therefore my blood brethren and
sisters, be steadfast and
immovable, always abounding in
the work of the lord knowing
that your labor of love is not
in vain.
I stand here today steadfast,
unmovable.
What is it morning?
Did fast and unmovable.
Knowing my labor of love for
bumpy was not in vain.
MR. Shorter, I have said this
to you for nearly 3 years to
hold you accountable for what
was done to my family.
This is not about policy, this
is about transparency, dignity
and children who deserve
better.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
Do we have anyone available
online?
There is no one online.
What we are going to do, we are
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
get the votes up.
>> supervisor vega?
>> Yesli Vega: yes.
>> thank you.
Vote unanimous supervisor angry
absent from vote.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
we have a resolution.
Hold on.
I kindly ask we refrain from
sidebar conversation so we can
get out of here.
Supervisor gordy.
>> Tom Gordy: I would like to
move that the county executive
send a letter on behalf of the
board of county supervisors to
met dominion in the state
corporation commission stating
that the board of county
supervisors is concerned with
all proposed lines of the
nokesville to bristow
, want to
be call it in this
.
Project.
Sharing concern to the
constituents impacted by the
proposed route and encourage
dominion in the state
corporation commission to
underground the lines and for
the county attorney to assist
with the review of the letter.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
second.
I will take the second.
Any additional discussion?
If not let's go ahead.
--
>> vote unanimous.
>> Andrea Bailey, Vice Chair:
moved to adjourn.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
second.
There is already a motion for
adjournment and it has been
properly seconded.
>> supervisor gordy?
Thank you.
Vote unanimous.
>> Deshundra Jefferson, Mayor:
thank you.
This is our last meeting of the
year.
Happy holidays all.