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Hey Malia and Kevin Councelor Christian.

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Okay, thank you.

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» Yes, I'm on.

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>> We're just making sure you have audio.

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Can you hear now, Craig?

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>> Yes, now I've got audio. Thank you.

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>> Okay, awesome. Thank you. All right.

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Next, we have a ceremony recognizing the

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Provo City employee of the month for

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February 2026.

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» Thank you, council. I'd like to invite

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Pearl Spencer up here with me.

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Pearl is one of our senior customer

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service representatives. In fact, she's

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the only one that we have and that just

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means she's a more advanced level of

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customer service. So, I just have a few

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things that her manager wrote about

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Pearl. Pearl has been with us for three

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years and recently stepped into that

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role of senior customer service

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representative, a well-earned promotion

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that reflects her dedication,

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professionalism, and growth. This past

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year she has really excelled. She became

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a certified notary, mastered the RPS

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system, which is our mail processing

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system, and she did it for six months,

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>> I think. So,

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>> without a single mistake, which is

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unheard of. So, she's incredible, attention to detail. She took

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on additional responsibility supporting

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our parking collections process

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um to the point where even our

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collections agency reached out and said,

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"Wow, what are you doing?" She did such

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a good job.

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Um, all while maintaining ex sorry

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maintaining excellent customer service.

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Pearl is someone who we can always count

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on whether she's resolving complex

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residents issues, supporting her

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co-workers, or helping with special

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projects. She communicates clearly even

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in high pressure situations and brings a

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calm, confident presence to the team.

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She also contributes to our workplace

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culture by practicing in team activities

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and city and events and by creating a

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positive environment for those around

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her. Way to go, Pearl. Thanks for all

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you do.

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Where you at?

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What's that? Um, all right. Next, we

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have a ceremony recognizing the new

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sewer treatment plant project for

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receiving the APWA Utah wastewater

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project of the year award. This is

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presented by Brian Romswell, the

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president of the Utah chapter of the

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American Public Works Association. I

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don't think we've met him before.

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Come on up.

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» Thank you. It's good to be with you

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today. It's an honor to be here and

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present a an award. Um, I'd like to

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invite others from the city to come up

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and and join me here to to receive this

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award in just a second, but I wanted to

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just preface this. I do have some

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connections to the city. Um, one, I do

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like wastewater. That's why it's what I

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studied in my master's degree. A lot of

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uh uh wastewater treatment processes.

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Um, and I do a little bit of that for my

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work now, too. But two, my I found out

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my my mom's uncle was mayor of the city

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for a little while. So that's kind of

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cool. Um,

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Verl Dixon. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, the

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outstanding wastewater project of the

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year. We want to jump back just a little

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bit. The American Public Works

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Association represents

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thousands of public works professionals

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across North America and actually across

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different countries as well, throughout

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the world. And what do public works

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professionals do? Well, what when the a

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lot of what we do is goes unnoticed.

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It's quiet. There's not a lot that that

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we we see because a lot of it's below

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the ground or it's off in the corner of

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your city, right? Uh the water reclam

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reclamation facility is one of those

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examples. But when things are

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functioning, life goes great. Our first

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responders get where they need to go. We

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have clean water. Our Utah lakes remains

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clean and and our environment stays

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clean. So, uh, that's what public works

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do. That's what all these professionals

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do. And so, uh, the American Public

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Works Association here in Utah, our

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chapter, we we do, uh, recognize a

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number of awards or projects throughout

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the year that have done an outstanding

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job and we, this is a really deserving

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project. The Provo water reclamation

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facility was started in 2020, completed

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in 2025.

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I believe that the new plant, upgraded

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plant is about 16 million gallons per

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day capacity and meets all the new uh

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regulations for phosphorus removal and

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nitrogen removal, which is really

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awesome. That's what we get excited

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about as engineers. But uh it's a it's

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an expensive endeavor to keep our

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environment clean, too. Uh I other other

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notable things about the project um

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completed on time and really a great

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collaboration between the engineer uh

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waterworks engineering and the

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contractor was Alder I believe. I just

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wanted to go ahead and recognize on

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behalf of the American Public Works

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Association, Utah chapter, the project,

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wastewater project of the year.

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Jane, you want to snap quick picture so

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we can recognize? We'll put this up on

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our web page.

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Hey Jen, can you read a picture of him

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too? We'll

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>> just stand up.

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>> That works great.

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Yeah, it's awesome.

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[laughter]

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That that was a huge and expensive

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project and took years of their lives

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and I'm it's it's a huge win for Provo

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in the sense of how we were dumping our

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wastewater before then. So, um we're

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grateful that people have the foresight

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to do that treatment plant. All right.

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Um, next, a ceremony recognizing Provo

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as a gold level bicycle friendly

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community. This will be presented by

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Vern Kesler, our traffic manager.

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Vern didn't tell me he was on the

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agenda. He asked me to assist in this.

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Scott Henderson, chief administrative

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officer for Provo City. And I have the

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honor to announce that Provo, Utah, has

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been elevated to gold status as a

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bicycle friendly community by the League

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of American Bicyclists.

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Provo is one of only two cities in Utah

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to carry this designation.

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Provo's decadesl long escalation from

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bronze to silver and now to gold shows

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our city's commitment to continued

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progress in a balanced transportation

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philosophy.

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Speaking of commitment, a team including

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Burn Kesler, Hannah Sausel, Lyndon

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Abernathy, and myself met monthly at 7

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a.m. to orchestrate a citywide effort

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for this extensive application process.

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This application stretched across all

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departments and the team assembled

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formed a compelling and unique story of

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transportation diversification.

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The proof is in the golden result.

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Whether you ride a bike or not, knowing

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that our city is designate is designed

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in a thoughtful and balanced way and

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independently recognized for it should

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bring us all joy.

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I'd ask Vern Kesler, transportation

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manager, to join me for the presentation

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of awards to the mayor and council. One

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thing we need to remember is this is

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Vern's Super Bowl. [laughter]

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his passion for Provo's transportation

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system is undeniable and we see that

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every single day. So Vern, would you

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mind explaining the awards and the signs

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and then we could ask you all come down

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to be able to present this. Thank you.

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>> Thank you, Scott. Really appreciate

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working uh with Scott. He really said,

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"Hey, let's let's do this. Let's let's

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make this reality." And the process we

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started in October of 2024. The

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application is 92 pages long. It took us

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about six months. I had plenty of time

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reserved in there, built in there, but

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every department had to participate in

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development of the application.

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The deadline for that application was

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June of 2025. So, we had to wait until

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January of 2026 to hear the results. Is

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quite a lengthy process.

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um to tell you about our surrounding

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states um and where they stand in

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comparison. Arizona has two Gold Award

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recognitions just like Utah. Colorado

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has three, Idaho has two, New Mexico has

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zero, Nevada has zero, Wyoming zero. And

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so when you start to take a look at this

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investment in infrastructure, I love

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planning, don't get me wrong, but I love

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building infrastructure more. And Provo

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City has done that. Mayor's office, the

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council, all departments. This is a

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citywide award. And not only that, we

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have developed a signature that says

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Provo Bicycle Friendly Community Gold

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Award that anybody in the city can use

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as their tagline for their signature.

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So, with that, we'd love to present this

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award both to um the city council and

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the mayor for the League of American

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Bicyclist Bicycle Friendly Community

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Gold Award.

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Yeah, Park City is the other city in

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Utah.

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One, two, three.

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Let me actually try real quick.

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That word

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miss.

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Oh my gosh.

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» All right. Now, we're going to get to

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our regular meeting. As indicated on the

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screen, a required public hearing will

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be held for certain agenda items prior

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to council action. After each such item

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has been presented, time to comment will

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be provided for all those who wish to

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speak. For items that do not require a

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public hearing, public comment will

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still be taken following presentation of

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the item

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that will be limited to 10 minutes.

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At this time, up to 15 minutes been set

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aside for an open public comment period,

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which is intended to allow comment on

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matters that do not appear on the

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agenda, but are limited to topics

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regarding municipal business or with a

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municipal council purview. Persons who

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speak during this time to an item that

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is on the agenda will not normally be

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afforded a second opportunity to speak

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during the comment period specific to

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that item. During any public comment

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period, each speaker will generally be

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limited to two minutes. Due to noticing

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requirements, no formal action will be

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taken in this meeting on matters that do

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not appear on the agenda.

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Those with comments are invited to

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approach the podium. Those participating

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on Zoom will need to use the raise hand

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feature to indicate they wish to

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comment. The chair may choose to

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alternate alternate between inerson and

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online commenters. Please begin your

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comments by stating your name and the

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city of residents. You'll have two

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minutes to speak. I'd also like to

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acknowledge that um councelor Travis

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Hoben has joined us.

275
00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:50,160
But now is open public comment for

276
00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:52,079
anyone who'd like to come speak. Just

277
00:14:52,079 --> 00:14:53,519
need your name and your city of

278
00:14:53,519 --> 00:15:00,310
residence.

279
00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:02,399
» Uh good evening. My name is Don Flake.

280
00:15:02,399 --> 00:15:04,560
I'm a resident of Provo. Um I feel like

281
00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:05,920
a broken track record at this point

282
00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:07,120
getting up here. This is my fourth time

283
00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:10,160
here. Um I of course you know exactly

284
00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:11,519
what I'm I want to speak about already.

285
00:15:11,519 --> 00:15:13,199
I I want to talk about flock safety

286
00:15:13,199 --> 00:15:14,959
cameras. Um I know there was a work

287
00:15:14,959 --> 00:15:16,800
meeting held earlier today about it. Um

288
00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:18,240
I have not had an opportunity to review

289
00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:19,360
that since it was held during the work

290
00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:20,480
day. I just came here straight from

291
00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:23,279
work. Um so I just wanted to come up and

292
00:15:23,279 --> 00:15:24,399
you know express my concerns about it.

293
00:15:24,399 --> 00:15:26,560
Of course, generally I also wanted to

294
00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:30,320
make sure that um I am understood that

295
00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:32,880
the the framing that flock safety and

296
00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:35,040
its advocates will attempt to uh to

297
00:15:35,040 --> 00:15:37,360
paint the picture in is that of a of a

298
00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:39,519
binary between public safety and

299
00:15:39,519 --> 00:15:42,160
privacy. Both can coexist at the same

300
00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:44,399
time. Um and and furthermore that I

301
00:15:44,399 --> 00:15:45,760
think that they there there will be an

302
00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:49,199
attempt to to frame this as uh you know

303
00:15:49,199 --> 00:15:51,360
a breakdown of discourse where people

304
00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:52,959
perhaps who are confused a public

305
00:15:52,959 --> 00:15:55,120
citizen who doesn't understand the issue

306
00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:58,639
um is concerned unnecessarily about the

307
00:15:58,639 --> 00:16:01,120
uh concerns that I've raised with uh

308
00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:04,959
flock safety cameras. Um, and I want to

309
00:16:04,959 --> 00:16:06,720
perhaps put my own framing on this

310
00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:10,320
issue, which is that flock is not um,

311
00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:12,399
necessarily, you know, they have their

312
00:16:12,399 --> 00:16:13,600
own interest in mind. They have a

313
00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:15,120
financial interest. I have no financial

314
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:16,320
interest in standing here. In fact, I'm

315
00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:19,360
losing money by not being a work. Um,

316
00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:23,040
and uh, ultimately, this is about the

317
00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:25,360
fact that flock safety cameras in now

318
00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:27,360
well over 50 cities across the country

319
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:30,320
have lost the democratic mandate. Um,

320
00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:32,000
and indeed never even had it in the

321
00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:33,519
first place. cases and most of these

322
00:16:33,519 --> 00:16:35,600
cases they were never discussed publicly

323
00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:36,800
and then the first time that they were

324
00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:38,880
they came to light uh it was discovered

325
00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:41,199
that in fact the people did not want

326
00:16:41,199 --> 00:16:43,440
this uh technology in their communities.

327
00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:44,639
So I just wanted to frame it in that

328
00:16:44,639 --> 00:16:46,639
sense. Every conversation that I've had

329
00:16:46,639 --> 00:16:49,680
with people publicly online um just

330
00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:52,560
going about my daily life um everyone

331
00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:54,399
I've talked to has been concerned about

332
00:16:54,399 --> 00:16:56,160
this issue. And so I urge you to

333
00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:57,759
remember that you represent the people

334
00:16:57,759 --> 00:16:59,519
of this community and not a

335
00:16:59,519 --> 00:17:03,360
multi-billion dollar corporation. Thank

336
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:09,990
That was really good timing.

337
00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:11,839
» Remind the audience that the rules of of

338
00:17:11,839 --> 00:17:14,799
decorum do not allow

339
00:17:14,799 --> 00:17:18,240
clapping or cheering or commenting.

340
00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:18,640
>> Hi.

341
00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:19,600
>> Hey, good to see you.

342
00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:21,919
>> Good to see you, too. Um, my name is

343
00:17:21,919 --> 00:17:24,640
Bonnie Shiffler Olsen. I'm a resident of

344
00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:28,799
Provo. Um, I'm here to say thank you so

345
00:17:28,799 --> 00:17:33,200
much for the help that you gave us to be

346
00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,280
able to pull off a really beautiful

347
00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:39,360
vigil for my sweet little street

348
00:17:39,360 --> 00:17:46,549
daughter Kate Hoke. Um,

349
00:17:46,559 --> 00:17:50,080
just thank you, K. Thanks for letting

350
00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:53,600
people matter. Thank you for listening.

351
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:55,360
Thank you, Rachel, for being super

352
00:17:55,360 --> 00:17:58,480
patient with me. You, too. Um, so here's

353
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:02,000
some jelly that I made with Kate um back

354
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:07,120
in October before she passed. Um, so

355
00:18:07,120 --> 00:18:19,029
this is for you.

356
00:18:19,039 --> 00:18:22,000
Hello, my name is Amanda Nelson. I am a

357
00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:24,400
resident of Provo. Um, and I am just

358
00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:26,400
here representing Utah Valley refugees

359
00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:28,640
where I work. It's a nonprofit and we

360
00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:31,039
serve refugees and immigrants in Utah

361
00:18:31,039 --> 00:18:33,440
County. Um, where our mission is to help

362
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:36,240
them become self-reliant. And we just

363
00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:38,799
wanted to um introduce ourselves to the

364
00:18:38,799 --> 00:18:39,919
council, let you know that we're here

365
00:18:39,919 --> 00:18:42,160
and that we're providing key services to

366
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:43,679
some of your constituents who live in

367
00:18:43,679 --> 00:18:45,360
the city and most of our clients live

368
00:18:45,360 --> 00:18:50,080
here in Provo. and um we are happy and would love to work with you and

369
00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:51,679
partner with you on any initiatives to

370
00:18:51,679 --> 00:18:54,000
help this population. Thank you and

371
00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:55,919
thank you for all you do for the city.

372
00:18:55,919 --> 00:19:00,310
Thank you.

373
00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:03,280
Any other public comment?

374
00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:05,360
Oh, and we have one online come up, sir,

375
00:19:05,360 --> 00:19:09,430
and then we'll do online next.

376
00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:11,520
» Well, I just wanted to reiterate what a

377
00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:13,200
>> just we need your name and where you

378
00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:13,600
live, please.

379
00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:15,760
>> Oh, right. I'm Seth. I live in Provo.

380
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:16,400
Um,

381
00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:17,760
>> Seth, we need your last name, too.

382
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,080
>> Draper. Seth Draper. Um, I just want to

383
00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:21,679
reiterate what I didn't catch your name,

384
00:19:21,679 --> 00:19:24,559
but yeah, flock cameras, massive concern

385
00:19:24,559 --> 00:19:26,480
uh for all of us. Uh, there's been

386
00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:29,039
numerous cases of like misidentification

387
00:19:29,039 --> 00:19:30,799
um and like wrongful arrests, and I just

388
00:19:30,799 --> 00:19:32,240
want to make sure that we continue to

389
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:34,720
live in such a safe and and secure city.

390
00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:36,960
So, just want to make sure more people

391
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:38,880
are talking about it. Thank you'all.

392
00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:40,880
>> Thank you.

393
00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:45,590
>> All right. online.

394
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:47,760
You can speak. We need your name and

395
00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:49,600
where you live.

396
00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:52,320
>> Yeah. My name is Vivian Flake and I'm a

397
00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:54,240
resident proto

398
00:19:54,240 --> 00:19:56,559
and I would also like to talk about

399
00:19:56,559 --> 00:19:58,480
flock safety. I'm really concerned about

400
00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:01,280
the privacy aspect of block cameras

401
00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:02,960
because they record information that I

402
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:04,960
haven't agreed to specifically because

403
00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:07,039
it's accessible to law enforcement

404
00:20:07,039 --> 00:20:10,960
without a warrant. Um, so that just

405
00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:13,200
makes me um what makes me even more

406
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:16,880
concerned is that um federal law

407
00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:18,480
enforcement can do this information as

408
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:21,760
well. So I just want to I know that you

409
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:24,640
guys discussed this today and I just

410
00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:25,840
want to make sure you understand like

411
00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:28,080
there are significant security flaws

412
00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:30,640
with hot cameras and they they're not

413
00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:34,799
always um reliable. So, as a proent

414
00:20:34,799 --> 00:20:37,280
resident, I urge the city council to

415
00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,280
keep the rights and privacy of its

416
00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:42,640
citizens a high priority. And um I I

417
00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:46,559
know you guys value our rights and our safety and our

418
00:20:46,559 --> 00:20:48,799
privacy and I just urge you to keep that

419
00:20:48,799 --> 00:20:51,760
in mind going forward. Thank you. Thank

420
00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:53,360
you.

421
00:20:53,360 --> 00:20:56,880
All right. Any more public comment?

422
00:20:56,880 --> 00:21:01,590
All right. We'll cl

423
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:08,149
sure

424
00:21:08,159 --> 00:21:09,840
Okay, we're going to hear from Captain

425
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:11,600
Patrick now. Captain, is this in

426
00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:13,919
response to the flock camera? Okay. All

427
00:21:13,919 --> 00:21:16,080
right. So, public comment is over and we

428
00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:20,000
will Captain Patrick will address some

429
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:21,440
of the concerns that have been brought

430
00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:23,520
up concerning flock cameras. And this

431
00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:27,600
was also discussed in our um in our

432
00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:29,600
meetings, work meetings today. Go ahead,

433
00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:30,000
captain.

434
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:31,280
>> Thank you. So, I'm Robert Patrick. I'm a

435
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:32,240
captain with the Provo Police

436
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:34,159
Department. I'm also over the flock

437
00:21:34,159 --> 00:21:36,000
program for the city of Provo. I also

438
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:38,640
live in Provo. Um as does my family. I

439
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:41,440
appreciate the the Mr. Flake. Uh Vivian,

440
00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:43,360
I'm not sure if that's a relative of

441
00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:45,120
yours or related to you and the other

442
00:21:45,120 --> 00:21:46,799
gentlemen that came up and have concerns

443
00:21:46,799 --> 00:21:49,520
about PL flock. Um, I I also have

444
00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:51,919
concerns about public safety, about

445
00:21:51,919 --> 00:21:54,880
private um information. Uh, for those

446
00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:58,240
that are listening, um, there's no

447
00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,159
personal identifiable information that

448
00:22:00,159 --> 00:22:02,240
is captured by Flock, not anybody's

449
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:04,880
name, not anybody's, uh, telephone

450
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,000
number, age, date of birth, biographical

451
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,799
information. flock captures a a picture

452
00:22:10,799 --> 00:22:13,039
of a of a a vehicle with a license

453
00:22:13,039 --> 00:22:14,559
plate, sometimes a vehicle without a

454
00:22:14,559 --> 00:22:16,880
license plate, which uh can be very

455
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:19,760
useful for law enforcement to

456
00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:21,600
investigate crimes that have been

457
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:24,480
committed. When our law enforcement

458
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:27,039
access that program, that flock program,

459
00:22:27,039 --> 00:22:29,360
it's because a crime has been committed

460
00:22:29,360 --> 00:22:31,520
and there is some type of information

461
00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:33,200
regarding a vehicle that has been

462
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:36,080
associated with that crime. Um, I can

463
00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:39,360
tell you from investigating these uh

464
00:22:39,360 --> 00:22:42,000
these incidents that that this program

465
00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:45,039
has been vital in bringing

466
00:22:45,039 --> 00:22:48,080
serious criminal offenders to justice.

467
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:49,919
Without this program, I can tell you

468
00:22:49,919 --> 00:22:51,360
that some of those criminal offenders

469
00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:53,280
would not have been brought to justice.

470
00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:56,799
Um, I I would invite anyone who has

471
00:22:56,799 --> 00:22:59,280
questions about Flock to please contact

472
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:01,200
me at the police department. I'd be more

473
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:03,280
than happy to sit down with anyone and

474
00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,840
discuss those issues in person um to

475
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,240
help educate the entirety of the

476
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:09,440
community about what this program

477
00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:11,919
actually does and what it does not do.

478
00:23:11,919 --> 00:23:14,240
>> And Captain, someone mentioned that the

479
00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:16,720
federal government can access our data.

480
00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:18,000
Can you please address that?

481
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,760
>> Sure. Um so Flock is not accessible by

482
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:24,880
any federal agencies with the exception

483
00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:26,640
of two or three. It was like the parks

484
00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,440
department and uh I I believe Flock uh

485
00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:31,600
informed what was that?

486
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:32,960
>> Postal service. Yeah, I think that was

487
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:33,360
one of

488
00:23:33,360 --> 00:23:34,320
>> and the VA. Yeah,

489
00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:37,360
>> thank you. And the VA. Um

490
00:23:37,360 --> 00:23:40,480
Homeland Security, the FBI, the ATF, uh

491
00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:42,159
the the other three-letter acronym

492
00:23:42,159 --> 00:23:44,480
agencies do not have access to Flock.

493
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:47,440
Um, I can tell you that uh we have

494
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:49,840
officers that work with agencies and

495
00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:52,080
that if those agencies request access to

496
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:54,320
Flock, the only reason that they would

497
00:23:54,320 --> 00:23:55,760
be given access to any information out

498
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,240
of that is if our agency was

499
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:01,200
investigating a criminal act that uh

500
00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:03,760
that involved our some type our

501
00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:05,360
jurisdiction. Uh having been on the

502
00:24:05,360 --> 00:24:07,120
major crimes task force for a number of

503
00:24:07,120 --> 00:24:09,200
years, we often uh dealt with

504
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:11,520
individuals that would be would deal

505
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:13,600
with criminal acts inside of Utah as

506
00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:16,159
well as outside of Utah. And in those

507
00:24:16,159 --> 00:24:18,320
types of cases,

508
00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,320
potentially information could be shared.

509
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:21,760
That's only because it's a provo

510
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,159
investigation uh with some type of a

511
00:24:24,159 --> 00:24:27,120
federal attach uh agent attached to it

512
00:24:27,120 --> 00:24:28,320
or assigned with it.

513
00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:31,120
>> Thanks, Captain. Um, if you just want to

514
00:24:31,120 --> 00:24:32,960
wait outside where people could come hit

515
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,200
you up for an email or talk to you,

516
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:35,840
that'd be great.

517
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:36,559
>> Appreciate it. Thank you.

518
00:24:36,559 --> 00:24:40,149
>> Okay. Thank you.

519
00:24:40,159 --> 00:24:42,000
» All right. We're going to start our

520
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:43,520
business. First, we have an implied

521
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:45,919
motion on an ordinance amending proba

522
00:24:45,919 --> 00:24:47,520
city code regarding development

523
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:50,480
standards for the year 2026. And this is

524
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,480
something we do every year. Presented by

525
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:55,382
Gordon hate.

526
00:24:55,382 --> 00:24:56,320
[clears throat]

527
00:24:56,320 --> 00:25:02,549
>> Right.

528
00:25:02,559 --> 00:25:04,799
So this is an ordinance that just

529
00:25:04,799 --> 00:25:08,559
updates our city code that brings in in

530
00:25:08,559 --> 00:25:10,240
complian with all the changes have been

531
00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:11,840
made on federal documents, state

532
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:14,640
documents that we have to comply to. So

533
00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:18,000
this this code is um fairly generic, but

534
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,559
it gets updated by all these agencies

535
00:25:20,559 --> 00:25:22,320
periodically. And so we're just updating

536
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:26,240
our code to make that happen. So that's

537
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:28,480
and the biggest change is also we now

538
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:30,640
have the detail for our own water

539
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:32,559
sampling station. So if anybody has any

540
00:25:32,559 --> 00:25:35,600
questions on any of those items

541
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,279
um anyway that's that whole portion of

542
00:25:39,279 --> 00:25:41,440
the code if there's any question about

543
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,480
that and that's just an independent you

544
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:46,799
can just I think we put in a spec on

545
00:25:46,799 --> 00:25:49,760
that or a ordinance on that just that

546
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,720
item.

547
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:54,080
Okay.

548
00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:54,960
>> Any questions?

549
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:57,840
for Gordon?

550
00:25:57,840 --> 00:25:58,559
>> No.

551
00:25:58,559 --> 00:26:01,120
>> Okay. Do Do we want to vote on that now

552
00:26:01,120 --> 00:26:02,880
or do we want Okay.

553
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:05,919
>> Okay. All right. Um, we're going to open

554
00:26:05,919 --> 00:26:07,360
this item up for public comment first.

555
00:26:07,360 --> 00:26:08,080
>> Oh, yeah. I forgot.

556
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,320
>> Yeah. [laughter]

557
00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:13,520
Any public comment on the 2026

558
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:15,520
development standards?

559
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:17,360
All right. Seeing no comment. Council

560
00:26:17,360 --> 00:26:20,559
discussion. Any discussion?

561
00:26:20,559 --> 00:26:23,679
All right. We will have a vote.

562
00:26:23,679 --> 00:26:25,760
Councelor Garrett,

563
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:26,559
>> yes.

564
00:26:26,559 --> 00:26:28,320
>> Councelor McCay, yes. Councelor

565
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:32,159
Christensen, are you still with us?

566
00:26:32,159 --> 00:26:34,799
>> Okay, he's excused. Councelor Whitlock,

567
00:26:34,799 --> 00:26:35,600
>> yes.

568
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:39,039
>> Councelor Bogden, yes. Councelor Hoben,

569
00:26:39,039 --> 00:26:40,480
>> yes.

570
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:42,000
>> Councelor Whipple,

571
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:43,600
>> yes.

572
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:48,549
>> So, that passes unanimously. 60.

573
00:26:48,559 --> 00:26:49,679
All right. Right, Gordon's going to do

574
00:26:49,679 --> 00:26:51,760
the next item, too. A resolution that

575
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:54,559
made the 2026 Provo standard drawing

576
00:26:54,559 --> 00:26:57,360
details and 2026 Provo City Public Works

577
00:26:57,360 --> 00:26:59,520
Department development design standards

578
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:01,360
due to changes in the minimum street

579
00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:03,440
width requirements.

580
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:04,480
Go ahead, Gordon.

581
00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:07,200
>> All right. So, there was a lot of

582
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:08,960
discussion about this in previous work

583
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:12,559
meetings and in the city council um last

584
00:27:12,559 --> 00:27:14,559
month and also again today. So, I want

585
00:27:14,559 --> 00:27:16,080
to just go through it fairly briefly,

586
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:17,679
but bring up some points that we've

587
00:27:17,679 --> 00:27:22,159
talked about. So, in 2018, this standard

588
00:27:22,159 --> 00:27:25,039
of a 25- ft pavement minimum

589
00:27:25,039 --> 00:27:27,919
cross-section was adopted by the city.

590
00:27:27,919 --> 00:27:31,039
And what it required is no parking on

591
00:27:31,039 --> 00:27:32,880
one side of the street. One of the

592
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:34,640
things that had happened through that

593
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,799
process is this been built since 2018

594
00:27:38,799 --> 00:27:40,640
about eight or nine streets have been

595
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,360
constructed this way and the city public

596
00:27:43,360 --> 00:27:44,960
works that's kind of my responsibility

597
00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:46,880
did not get the stop signs in before the

598
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:48,159
homes were built. So, that's something

599
00:27:48,159 --> 00:27:48,880
we're working.

600
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:50,559
>> Stop signs, not stop signs.

601
00:27:50,559 --> 00:27:53,039
>> Not stop signs. No parking signs. All

602
00:27:53,039 --> 00:27:55,600
the stop signs were put in each of those

603
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:57,840
subdivisions. I want to make that very

604
00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,480
clear.

605
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:02,159
We're working to correct that. And in

606
00:28:02,159 --> 00:28:03,919
current ones that are on the board now,

607
00:28:03,919 --> 00:28:06,159
we're having that done. So, before

608
00:28:06,159 --> 00:28:07,520
anybody moves in, they know that's

609
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:11,440
happening. This was um a resolution or

610
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:13,440
uh not a resolution but a proposal that

611
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,760
was voted on by the city council last

612
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,080
week work meeting that we brought in

613
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,279
that limited this 20 excuse me 24T

614
00:28:21,279 --> 00:28:25,679
section for infill projects and hillside

615
00:28:25,679 --> 00:28:29,679
projects still less than the 480 and

616
00:28:29,679 --> 00:28:32,480
approved by the fire marshall. So this

617
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,360
was the one that was talked about and

618
00:28:35,360 --> 00:28:38,159
this third one is the current one but

619
00:28:38,159 --> 00:28:39,679
with the addition of the fire marshall

620
00:28:39,679 --> 00:28:42,399
approval and design. This is the one

621
00:28:42,399 --> 00:28:44,880
staff recommends maintaining it for

622
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:47,200
reasons we talked about including just

623
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,000
some ideas on what a 40 400 trips per

624
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:52,720
day during a peak hour that's about 40

625
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:54,559
trips in that hour. So if you can

626
00:28:54,559 --> 00:28:57,120
visualize that got 60 minutes an hour

627
00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:03,039
and you have 40 cars pass just kind of a rough I can visualize it in my mind so

628
00:29:03,039 --> 00:29:06,720
I'm seeing that but also this allows for

629
00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:08,480
some flexibility when we're doing

630
00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:12,480
subdivisions um that allow for different

631
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:15,039
types of uses. People that would prefer

632
00:29:15,039 --> 00:29:17,039
a smaller cross-section versus a larger

633
00:29:17,039 --> 00:29:20,000
cross-section. It's not used extensively

634
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:23,039
by developers but it has come into play.

635
00:29:23,039 --> 00:29:25,600
Um, I know there was some concern about

636
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:27,600
parking enforcement. I talked to to Bill

637
00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:29,360
just to verify. This doesn't seem like

638
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:31,520
it would doesn't feel like it put an

639
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,159
undue burden. These six extra streets

640
00:29:34,159 --> 00:29:36,080
are we see about every seven or eight

641
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:38,720
years. Um,

642
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:43,750
and

643
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:45,600
so anyway, we vet these all with the

644
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,039
fire department to make sure that we're

645
00:29:47,039 --> 00:29:50,000
meeting the right criteria when we do

646
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:51,200
these things. So, if there's any

647
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,039
questions, let me know and I'll

648
00:29:53,039 --> 00:29:55,679
certainly answer them. So, those are the

649
00:29:55,679 --> 00:30:00,240
two cross-sections that we have there.

650
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:01,279
>> Thanks, Gordon.

651
00:30:01,279 --> 00:30:01,600
>> Okay.

652
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:05,679
>> Um, any questions for Gordon?

653
00:30:05,679 --> 00:30:07,120
>> All right. We are going to open this

654
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:17,990
item up for public comment.

655
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:20,559
» Sorry. Catherine Hall, Provo DI, uh,

656
00:30:20,559 --> 00:30:22,640
East District. I just have a question.

657
00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,919
Are the no parking signs going to be

658
00:30:25,919 --> 00:30:28,080
installed before

659
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:29,840
when will those be installed? Before the

660
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:30,960
homes are sold or

661
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:32,320
>> before the homes are installed. That's

662
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:33,120
optional.

663
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:38,870
>> Okay. Thank you.

664
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:40,799
All right. Seeing no public comment, we

665
00:30:40,799 --> 00:30:43,039
will close public comment and we'll go

666
00:30:43,039 --> 00:30:45,120
to council discussion. Any discussion on

667
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,760
this item?

668
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:49,440
Councelor Hopens.

669
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:50,799
>> Yeah. I mentioned in the work meeting,

670
00:30:50,799 --> 00:30:52,559
for me, this all hinges on enforcement.

671
00:30:52,559 --> 00:30:54,399
So, if we're going to decrease the width

672
00:30:54,399 --> 00:30:56,960
of the road and have parking only on one

673
00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,120
side in order to ensure that emergency

674
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:02,880
vehicles can proceed, um it all hinges

675
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:04,720
in my mind on whether or not we will

676
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:06,559
enforce that. I've seen other cities

677
00:31:06,559 --> 00:31:08,640
where they just kind of give up on that.

678
00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:10,320
We're seeing some friction that it's

679
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:12,720
causing and trying to enforce that in

680
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:14,880
areas where we have to go back and add

681
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:18,559
these signs. Um, now I know that's a

682
00:31:18,559 --> 00:31:19,760
little bit different because it's

683
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:22,240
they're used to having that parking, but

684
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:23,919
I think you'll find very quickly how

685
00:31:23,919 --> 00:31:25,440
easy it will be for residents to get

686
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,480
used to having parking in a in a street

687
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:32,000
that is is tight with parking. Um, so my

688
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:33,360
preference would be I don't want to

689
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,480
expand where we can offer 24 foot roads.

690
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:39,360
I actually would like to ideally not

691
00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:41,120
offer it and see how this goes with

692
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:44,159
these areas where we're going to be um

693
00:31:44,159 --> 00:31:45,840
enforcing the parking. see what that's

694
00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:47,840
like, see how the enforcement goes, and

695
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:49,679
if the enforcement's there, then we can

696
00:31:49,679 --> 00:31:53,039
look to to bring this back. Um, but for

697
00:31:53,039 --> 00:31:57,269
now, I'm not comfortable.

698
00:31:57,279 --> 00:31:59,919
» Any more discussion?

699
00:31:59,919 --> 00:32:02,720
Councelor Whipple? Yeah, I'm I'm

700
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:07,360
slightly confused by um your comments,

701
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:09,600
councelor Hobin, because right now we do

702
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:12,799
have the 24 foot thing allowed. And so

703
00:32:12,799 --> 00:32:14,399
the question is whether or not we want

704
00:32:14,399 --> 00:32:16,320
to allow to continue that. It almost

705
00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:18,799
sounded like you were presenting as

706
00:32:18,799 --> 00:32:20,399
we're

707
00:32:20,399 --> 00:32:23,120
considering a new option.

708
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:24,480
And I I think I may have just

709
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:29,120
misunderstood you. I I do like um this

710
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,320
option three that addresses the safety

711
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:34,080
concerns which are the the biggest

712
00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,000
issues for me, right? Being able to have

713
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,399
that fire access.

714
00:32:38,399 --> 00:32:42,000
Um, and I also like that

715
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:46,240
this um keeps that use

716
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:48,559
for these very limited circumstances,

717
00:32:48,559 --> 00:32:52,960
that very low flow of traffic. So, I

718
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:57,600
think this is appropriate and

719
00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:02,640
generally I think it's best if we have

720
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:05,919
fewer laws and fewer restrictions.

721
00:33:05,919 --> 00:33:08,240
Um, I I just worry that we're cluttering

722
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,240
up too much of the code and this seems

723
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:15,110
less cluttery to me.

724
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:17,760
» Any other comments, discussion?

725
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:19,679
Councelor Whitlock?

726
00:33:19,679 --> 00:33:23,600
>> Yeah. So, I think um all the cases we're

727
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:24,880
looking at here are more restrictive

728
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:27,120
than what currently exists today. That's

729
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,360
correct.

730
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:31,919
Yeah. So, I think I think that's just a

731
00:33:31,919 --> 00:33:34,159
point of clarification is each of these

732
00:33:34,159 --> 00:33:35,760
narrow the options. And in our last

733
00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:38,799
discussion, we discussed the cases in

734
00:33:38,799 --> 00:33:40,399
which we feel like it is appropriate.

735
00:33:40,399 --> 00:33:42,399
One is inside of uh when you're

736
00:33:42,399 --> 00:33:44,880
developing on hillside because wide cuts

737
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:47,279
are less stable for hillsides. And then

738
00:33:47,279 --> 00:33:49,039
when we are doing kind of smaller

739
00:33:49,039 --> 00:33:51,760
infield type residential developments

740
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:53,919
and I think um we talked about the

741
00:33:53,919 --> 00:33:56,720
traffic per day at 400 trips or less is

742
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:58,640
usually these very small residential

743
00:33:58,640 --> 00:33:59,919
developments. On top of that, we're

744
00:33:59,919 --> 00:34:01,519
clarifying that parking is restricted

745
00:34:01,519 --> 00:34:03,519
and then the fire marshall has to feel

746
00:34:03,519 --> 00:34:04,960
comfortable comfortable with the public

747
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:06,480
safety, which I think is the trigger of

748
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:10,069
this entire conversation.

749
00:34:10,079 --> 00:34:11,359
» Councelor Hoben,

750
00:34:11,359 --> 00:34:13,280
>> so I'll clarify. I don't want more of

751
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:16,159
the 24 for roads in the city. Um, so I

752
00:34:16,159 --> 00:34:17,359
would prefer that we take away the

753
00:34:17,359 --> 00:34:21,190
option.

754
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:24,560
» Um, I think that option three is exact

755
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:26,639
is pretty much what we do now. It's not

756
00:34:26,639 --> 00:34:30,720
different status quo. Um, as far as more

757
00:34:30,720 --> 00:34:33,919
words, I think getting rid of those less

758
00:34:33,919 --> 00:34:36,720
words, right? If we get rid of the 24,

759
00:34:36,720 --> 00:34:38,800
um,

760
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:40,800
parking is a huge issue in the city all

761
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:43,440
over the place. And I think not

762
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:45,599
acknowledging that it's a huge issue.

763
00:34:45,599 --> 00:34:48,240
And I think that

764
00:34:48,240 --> 00:34:49,679
people just want more and more density.

765
00:34:49,679 --> 00:34:51,839
It's a constant constant fight for more

766
00:34:51,839 --> 00:34:53,679
and more and more density. So, you're

767
00:34:53,679 --> 00:34:55,359
already going to start with roads that

768
00:34:55,359 --> 00:34:57,200
only have parking on one side of the

769
00:34:57,200 --> 00:34:58,880
road when in the future we know we're

770
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:00,560
going to have higher density and need

771
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,000
more parking. And

772
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,800
I talk to students, I talk to families,

773
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:09,280
I everyone is irritated about the

774
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:11,839
parking. It is an issue. And people want

775
00:35:11,839 --> 00:35:13,680
to be social. They want to have events.

776
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:14,880
They want to have weddings. They want to

777
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:18,480
have parties. They want to have um you

778
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:21,200
know, mission farewells. and

779
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:23,280
they need a park and they want to have

780
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:24,560
people to be able to come visit them. I

781
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:25,839
lived in an area of Provo where there

782
00:35:25,839 --> 00:35:27,839
was no parking lot on the street and I

783
00:35:27,839 --> 00:35:29,440
knew that before I bought the home, but

784
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:33,040
it really made entertaining really, hard and you had to organize with

785
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:34,320
all your neighbors to have them park at

786
00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:36,320
their house and I mean it was a thing.

787
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,640
Um I'd have to organize with a church

788
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,119
blocks away to have them park there. Um

789
00:35:41,119 --> 00:35:42,400
it was hard and it made entertaining

790
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:44,560
really difficult and my my friends hated

791
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:50,079
it. But um the I think Travis's idea is

792
00:35:50,079 --> 00:35:54,000
a good one and I think seeing if it's

793
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,400
successful and if it's working well and

794
00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:58,000
it's being enforced. I'm mostly worried

795
00:35:58,000 --> 00:35:59,280
about the safety issue and I'm worried

796
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,119
about it not being enforced and I live

797
00:36:01,119 --> 00:36:03,440
by a few of these streets where you know

798
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:04,720
there's not the signs yet and people

799
00:36:04,720 --> 00:36:06,000
parked on both sides and you couldn't

800
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,079
get an emergency vehicle down that road

801
00:36:08,079 --> 00:36:10,000
with the people parked on both sides as

802
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:11,839
it has been multiple times especially

803
00:36:11,839 --> 00:36:14,240
with mission farewells and homecomings.

804
00:36:14,240 --> 00:36:15,839
Um,

805
00:36:15,839 --> 00:36:19,270
and

806
00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:23,680
so I think I I I I concerned that people

807
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:25,200
just don't think it matters and they

808
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,440
park on both sides and in the one case

809
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:29,359
of an emergency, it would be too much

810
00:36:29,359 --> 00:36:31,200
for me. I mean, like a heart attack, a

811
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:34,079
fire, it's just not worth it. But um, so

812
00:36:34,079 --> 00:36:36,000
that's my thoughts on it. Any other

813
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,160
comments? Counselor Hoben,

814
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:39,680
>> I'll just make a motion that we remove

815
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:42,160
the 24oot option. I don't know if I need

816
00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:44,320
to make that in a specific way, but

817
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:46,160
that's my intent.

818
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:48,160
>> Call a substitute motion, Travis.

819
00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:50,079
>> Oh, substitute motion that we remove the

820
00:36:50,079 --> 00:36:54,079
24 foot option. Thanks.

821
00:36:54,079 --> 00:36:55,119
>> I'm taking that.

822
00:36:55,119 --> 00:36:56,720
>> The thing I'm a bit confused about is

823
00:36:56,720 --> 00:36:58,720
last time we had this discussion, the

824
00:36:58,720 --> 00:37:00,480
express direction of the council at the

825
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:03,520
time was to allow for infill development

826
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:05,680
and this is completely a 180 turn from

827
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,960
that direction. So I think you know um

828
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:10,079
while I understand a lot of the points

829
00:37:10,079 --> 00:37:11,760
that we made, we do have a city where

830
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:13,359
there's less and less land to build.

831
00:37:13,359 --> 00:37:14,960
There's a lot of old legacy lots.

832
00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:16,720
There's infill is something we need to

833
00:37:16,720 --> 00:37:18,320
do to be able to provide affordable

834
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:20,640
houses that younger people can buy and

835
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:22,720
own and build equity in our community.

836
00:37:22,720 --> 00:37:27,680
So I'm not very comfortable with that.

837
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:29,359
And I will say we just got a parking

838
00:37:29,359 --> 00:37:31,040
report that says the city is quite good

839
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:33,280
at parking enforcement. I think um we

840
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:34,960
added no parking on Slate Canyon Drive

841
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:36,720
and the adherence there has been

842
00:37:36,720 --> 00:37:38,640
incredible much to the frustration of

843
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:41,359
the residents there.

844
00:37:41,359 --> 00:37:43,706
>> I would second Travis's motion.

845
00:37:43,706 --> 00:37:45,200
[clears throat]

846
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:47,680
>> Um I think that's part of the question

847
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:49,040
too though, Jeeoff. Like we do need

848
00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:50,480
infill and we're doing smaller square

849
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:52,800
footages to make homes for people that

850
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:54,240
they can afford, right? that are smaller

851
00:37:54,240 --> 00:37:57,200
square feet, smaller land, smaller yard

852
00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:00,880
and the higher higher density

853
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:02,480
already is creating parking issues. It's

854
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:04,000
creating parking issues on the west side

855
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:05,280
and some of those developments that are

856
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:07,280
so tight and they're frustrated by the

857
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:08,320
lack of parking because there's old

858
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:11,040
driveways, you know, and there's not so

859
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,359
I think it inhibits our building

860
00:38:13,359 --> 00:38:15,839
somewhat.

861
00:38:15,839 --> 00:38:17,200
>> Councelor Hoben.

862
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:20,240
>> Yeah. So just my to just to clarify my

863
00:38:20,240 --> 00:38:22,400
intent, my my concern is around we have

864
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:24,160
these streets that we're going to start

865
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:26,400
to enforce and they're kind of the first

866
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:28,000
ones that we're starting to enforce. I'd

867
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:29,359
like to see how that goes. I'd like to

868
00:38:29,359 --> 00:38:31,680
see resident response. I'd like to give

869
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:33,359
it some time and make sure that it's

870
00:38:33,359 --> 00:38:34,880
working. It's working for emergency

871
00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:37,520
services. Um and then we could revisit

872
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:38,800
it. We could bring this back. If it's

873
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:40,640
just going, great. But if it's not, then

874
00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:42,079
we know, okay, we're glad we didn't do

875
00:38:42,079 --> 00:38:45,520
that, right? We didn't open that up. So,

876
00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:46,960
um, I'm not saying we could never

877
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:48,560
revisit this. I just want to make sure

878
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:49,920
that if we're going to do this, we're

879
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:50,960
going to do it right because there's

880
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:54,079
kind of no going back if we don't. So,

881
00:38:54,079 --> 00:38:56,079
that's my intent.

882
00:38:56,079 --> 00:38:59,829
Councelor Whipple,

883
00:38:59,839 --> 00:39:02,079
we've already had these streets at this

884
00:39:02,079 --> 00:39:04,800
size and we've had so much public

885
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:07,280
comment and so many emails coming to us

886
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:09,599
as a council saying that we need to

887
00:39:09,599 --> 00:39:12,320
preserve these narrower streets that

888
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:16,240
they are good for this human scale

889
00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:18,880
everyday life for living on the street

890
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:20,880
for driving on the street for walking

891
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:22,960
across it and for riding their bikes.

892
00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:25,359
It's safer for families. It's safer for

893
00:39:25,359 --> 00:39:28,000
children to have narrower streets. And

894
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:31,359
frankly, we don't have very many 24- ft

895
00:39:31,359 --> 00:39:36,400
streets in in Provo. This is not a big

896
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:38,160
problem. And the ones the people who

897
00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:39,760
live on them, with the exception

898
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:41,200
potentially of your neighbors who do

899
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,839
lots of entertaining really like the

900
00:39:43,839 --> 00:39:46,400
narrower streets and the traffic

901
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:49,599
calming, the neighborhood character and

902
00:39:49,599 --> 00:39:52,079
feel that they get from this. This is

903
00:39:52,079 --> 00:39:53,680
not

904
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:56,400
just about being able to park. It's

905
00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,720
about all these other aspects for

906
00:39:58,720 --> 00:40:01,119
quality of life for the people who are

907
00:40:01,119 --> 00:40:05,040
in our city right now.

908
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:08,960
I I think we need to keep this as an

909
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:12,160
option which again is not being deployed

910
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,240
in all new developments and everywhere

911
00:40:14,240 --> 00:40:16,079
in the city, but we need to keep it as

912
00:40:16,079 --> 00:40:19,359
an option. Um, we need that flexibility

913
00:40:19,359 --> 00:40:22,160
for our development planning services as

914
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:24,560
they're looking at doing the infill, as

915
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:28,079
they're looking at building on the edges

916
00:40:28,079 --> 00:40:31,839
of our city where we may have slopes. I

917
00:40:31,839 --> 00:40:35,280
don't see a good reason

918
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:38,640
to remove this option. And if really

919
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:40,960
safety concerns are the top one, then

920
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:42,880
adding the fire marshall approval

921
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:45,920
addresses those safety concerns.

922
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:47,680
So,

923
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:53,599
I cannot support the idea that we would

924
00:40:53,599 --> 00:40:56,800
be taking away an option for something

925
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,560
that makes our city better.

926
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:02,640
>> Um, one thing to note, a lot of the

927
00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:04,079
people that emailed us talked about the

928
00:41:04,079 --> 00:41:07,520
Shakespeare neighborhood and

929
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:09,440
the Shakespeare neighborhood has alleys.

930
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:11,200
That was never brought up. Like it is

931
00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:12,480
different. They're not have to park on

932
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:14,000
their street. So it is a different

933
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:15,599
dynamic where in the end they have a

934
00:41:15,599 --> 00:41:17,119
double the wide street because they have

935
00:41:17,119 --> 00:41:18,800
the alley in the back and parking in the

936
00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:20,560
back and visitors can go in the back,

937
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:24,640
garbage in the back and so their narrow

938
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:26,880
road is not for the garbage cans. It's

939
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:30,800
not for their cars. So there that is a

940
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:32,319
that does make a difference and it's a

941
00:41:32,319 --> 00:41:34,480
significant difference, right? But if we

942
00:41:34,480 --> 00:41:36,400
get rid of the 24 foot option, you

943
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:37,920
wouldn't be able to do that even if you

944
00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:41,520
had an alley access,

945
00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:45,680
right? like it it just

946
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:48,000
we're not saying you can only do 24 foot

947
00:41:48,000 --> 00:41:50,319
if you also have back alley access.

948
00:41:50,319 --> 00:41:52,400
We're saying you couldn't do it at all.

949
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:56,240
I think that's wrong. Councelor Garrett,

950
00:41:56,240 --> 00:41:58,480
>> I'm wondering councelor Hoben if there

951
00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:00,640
could be room in your motion um even

952
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:02,560
though it's not in the ordinance for an

953
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:05,119
appeal if a developer could bring a plan

954
00:42:05,119 --> 00:42:09,040
to the city and request an exception to

955
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,520
the ordinance that would allow under

956
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:16,160
certain circumstances to um for the 24ft

957
00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:18,079
street to be even though it's not in the

958
00:42:18,079 --> 00:42:21,119
ordin ordinance a developer could appeal

959
00:42:21,119 --> 00:42:23,200
for an exception.

960
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:24,720
Brian, couldn't that be part of a

961
00:42:24,720 --> 00:42:26,240
development agreement? We could grant

962
00:42:26,240 --> 00:42:28,240
that under specific criteria on a

963
00:42:28,240 --> 00:42:31,040
one-off basis or

964
00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:34,079
>> Well, uh, there's two or three different

965
00:42:34,079 --> 00:42:35,839
questions there to unpack. So, first of

966
00:42:35,839 --> 00:42:37,839
all, with regard to councelor Garrett's

967
00:42:37,839 --> 00:42:40,480
question, it's generally not permitted

968
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,920
to give discretion without criteria. Uh,

969
00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:47,680
it leads to uh complaints uh that the

970
00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:50,160
discretion is applied in unequally. And

971
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:53,280
so I mean both option two and option

972
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:56,160
three uh you know option two as it was

973
00:42:56,160 --> 00:42:59,200
pres as it was designed to try to uh

974
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:01,280
follow what the council voted on last

975
00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:03,440
time and option three as the

976
00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:04,960
administration's

977
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:08,319
uh recommended variation. Both of those

978
00:43:08,319 --> 00:43:11,520
are intended to do exactly that. meaning

979
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:13,520
that those are intended to lay out what

980
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:16,560
the criteria are so that when so that if

981
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:18,720
you meet those criteria you you get it

982
00:43:18,720 --> 00:43:20,960
where we it it becomes problematic if we

983
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:22,960
have no criteria and it's just up to

984
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:24,880
somebody to make kind of wave a magic

985
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:26,880
wand and say you get it because I like

986
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:29,839
this project with regard to your

987
00:43:29,839 --> 00:43:32,880
question about the development agreement

988
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:36,160
um it's generally disfavored at least by

989
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:37,599
me [laughter]

990
00:43:37,599 --> 00:43:40,960
to do development agreements that allow

991
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:44,640
violations of the law. It is technically

992
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:47,040
permissible under state law if the

993
00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:48,880
entire development agreement goes

994
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:51,760
through the entire land use regulation

995
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:53,359
process, meaning that it goes to the

996
00:43:53,359 --> 00:43:56,000
planning commission uh and then to the

997
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:57,680
council and there's actually a

998
00:43:57,680 --> 00:43:59,760
recommendation on from the planning

999
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:01,119
commission on a development agreement

1000
00:44:01,119 --> 00:44:03,440
that allows deviation from the statute.

1001
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:06,400
So, it's technically permissible. I can

1002
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:08,400
only think of one time that we've ever

1003
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:11,440
done it and it had to do with that um

1004
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:13,760
property out on the Oram border that had

1005
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:18,079
already been zoned by Oram and then and was coming into the city. So that's

1006
00:44:18,079 --> 00:44:19,440
the only time I can think of that we've

1007
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,160
actually done it.

1008
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:23,440
>> So to answer your question, I don't

1009
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:25,839
think so. I think it would be preferable

1010
00:44:25,839 --> 00:44:29,280
to me to let's let's just put a pause on

1011
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:30,640
this, see how it goes with enforcement

1012
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:32,160
in these new new streets that we're

1013
00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:33,920
going to be enforcing on. See what the

1014
00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:35,920
resident response is. I think we'll get

1015
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:38,960
a really good pulse if, you know, one

1016
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:41,040
side of the street is not enough parking

1017
00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:43,599
for a typical neighborhood, right? Um

1018
00:44:43,599 --> 00:44:45,280
then we can always bring it back and

1019
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:46,720
say, "Okay, this has been going great."

1020
00:44:46,720 --> 00:44:48,720
Or we can just reaffirm that, all right,

1021
00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:50,720
yeah, this this didn't go well, so this

1022
00:44:50,720 --> 00:44:53,599
is probably not a great idea. And so

1023
00:44:53,599 --> 00:44:54,960
it's, you know, the world's not going to

1024
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:56,880
end either way. It's not going to end if

1025
00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:00,720
we take this away. Um, and I but I think

1026
00:45:00,720 --> 00:45:03,280
it's probably from my perspective better

1027
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:04,800
to be cautious because once you make

1028
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:06,960
that 24 foot road, you're not going to

1029
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:09,760
be expanding it, right? And so I would

1030
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:11,920
prefer we air on the side of caution as

1031
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:13,760
opposed to permissive, you know, being

1032
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:15,440
permissive with it and then maybe

1033
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:18,640
regretting it down the road.

1034
00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:20,319
>> Council Mccay, I have I have a question.

1035
00:45:20,319 --> 00:45:22,960
What happens if if we make this change

1036
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:25,440
uh to current developments that have not

1037
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:27,760
been completed like Buckley Draw I

1038
00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:30,160
believe has the 24 ft

1039
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:32,079
>> roads. Um I think that's the question

1040
00:45:32,079 --> 00:45:33,440
I'd have for

1041
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:34,960
>> and they have no parking allowed on the

1042
00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:35,359
road.

1043
00:45:35,359 --> 00:45:36,960
>> Correct. I think that's how we

1044
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:38,240
>> So that's fine. That's not going to be

1045
00:45:38,240 --> 00:45:39,599
an issue there.

1046
00:45:39,599 --> 00:45:41,680
>> But I think it's can if things are

1047
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:42,560
that's already in their development

1048
00:45:42,560 --> 00:45:44,160
agreement stuff it will be able to go

1049
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:47,520
through. But as I'm understanding uh

1050
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:49,040
councelor Hobin's motion, we're saying

1051
00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:51,119
we're removing the 24 foot blacktop

1052
00:45:51,119 --> 00:45:53,520
option from the options at all.

1053
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:53,920
Regardless,

1054
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:54,880
>> we've already done a development

1055
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:56,240
agreement with them. So it's already

1056
00:45:56,240 --> 00:45:56,640
done.

1057
00:45:56,640 --> 00:45:58,000
>> So as long as the development agreement

1058
00:45:58,000 --> 00:45:58,720
is done.

1059
00:45:58,720 --> 00:45:59,680
>> Yeah.

1060
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:01,440
>> And really, even if there isn't a

1061
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:04,079
development agreement, any application

1062
00:46:04,079 --> 00:46:05,920
that was submitted before the law

1063
00:46:05,920 --> 00:46:08,319
changed is vested to use the law at the

1064
00:46:08,319 --> 00:46:10,800
time they submitted their application.

1065
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:12,560
Councelor Hogan, would you be open to

1066
00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:14,160
continuing the item and then seeing

1067
00:46:14,160 --> 00:46:17,119
because I I feel like, you know, we had

1068
00:46:17,119 --> 00:46:19,599
this packet, we've done our research on

1069
00:46:19,599 --> 00:46:21,839
the proposal before us and now this is a

1070
00:46:21,839 --> 00:46:26,240
pretty new direction. Um, so I I I think

1071
00:46:26,240 --> 00:46:28,720
like there's a lot of questions and I

1072
00:46:28,720 --> 00:46:31,119
personally think it's better process to

1073
00:46:31,119 --> 00:46:33,200
consider the new direction and do our

1074
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:35,599
research and come informed than kind of

1075
00:46:35,599 --> 00:46:37,760
on the spot. But maybe people feel

1076
00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:41,510
otherwise.

1077
00:46:41,520 --> 00:46:44,880
Well, um it's there's four of us that

1078
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:46,400
have to vote one way or another, so

1079
00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:49,119
you're asking me, but um I prefer just a

1080
00:46:49,119 --> 00:46:50,640
vote. I think we'll get an answer one

1081
00:46:50,640 --> 00:46:52,960
way or another tonight. I think that

1082
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:55,520
councelor Christensen is on. If not,

1083
00:46:55,520 --> 00:46:56,400
then maybe we will.

1084
00:46:56,400 --> 00:46:59,200
>> Yeah, Councelor Christensen is online.

1085
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:02,240
>> Um I mean, my intent was to say pause

1086
00:47:02,240 --> 00:47:04,240
this. So, I guess not. I I don't want to

1087
00:47:04,240 --> 00:47:05,920
continue it because continuing as status

1088
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:07,520
quo means that other applications could

1089
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:11,359
come in for the 24 foot. So, I'd say no.

1090
00:47:11,359 --> 00:47:13,280
Thanks for asking,

1091
00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:14,720
>> Patrice.

1092
00:47:14,720 --> 00:47:16,720
>> Yes, Councelor Christensen.

1093
00:47:16,720 --> 00:47:18,800
>> Yeah, I would I would share Travis's

1094
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:21,200
concern. I would rather go slow on this

1095
00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:23,200
and be very careful. This is something

1096
00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:26,960
we can't undo. And after reflection on

1097
00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:29,040
the last meeting and talking to

1098
00:47:29,040 --> 00:47:31,440
different constituents, uh my preference

1099
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:35,520
would be to remove the 24 foot uh road

1100
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:37,599
uh for the time being and this could be

1101
00:47:37,599 --> 00:47:38,960
addressed at some point in the future if

1102
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:40,079
we find that there's a different

1103
00:47:40,079 --> 00:47:43,109
reality.

1104
00:47:43,119 --> 00:47:46,880
» All right, we will take a vote on the

1105
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:49,280
substitute motion.

1106
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:50,800
>> Councelor Whitlock,

1107
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:51,520
>> no.

1108
00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:54,240
>> Councelor Bogden, yes. Councelor Hoben,

1109
00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:54,800
>> yes.

1110
00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:56,319
>> Councelor Whipple,

1111
00:47:56,319 --> 00:47:57,040
>> no.

1112
00:47:57,040 --> 00:47:58,960
>> Councelor Garrett,

1113
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:00,000
>> no.

1114
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:01,599
>> Councelor McKay,

1115
00:48:01,599 --> 00:48:02,720
>> yes.

1116
00:48:02,720 --> 00:48:05,280
>> Councelor Christensen,

1117
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:06,800
>> yes.

1118
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:10,000
>> So, that passes 43.

1119
00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:12,240
>> Chair McKay, just to clarify where we're

1120
00:48:12,240 --> 00:48:14,960
at in the process, can you put up the

1121
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:18,720
new draft that um you sent? So, again,

1122
00:48:18,720 --> 00:48:20,720
because we don't vote on items that

1123
00:48:20,720 --> 00:48:23,599
haven't been written yet. So the the

1124
00:48:23,599 --> 00:48:26,480
substitute motion was to substitute a

1125
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:28,240
different version of the ordinance that

1126
00:48:28,240 --> 00:48:30,240
removes it entirely. You now still so

1127
00:48:30,240 --> 00:48:31,839
that so now you still need to vote on

1128
00:48:31,839 --> 00:48:34,800
the implied motion as it has been

1129
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:36,720
amended by the substitute motion which

1130
00:48:36,720 --> 00:48:40,000
is this version which takes out the

1131
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:43,839
>> we will now vote on the implied motion

1132
00:48:43,839 --> 00:48:47,040
that reflects the substitute motion.

1133
00:48:47,040 --> 00:48:48,400
>> Councelor Bogden,

1134
00:48:48,400 --> 00:48:49,040
>> yes.

1135
00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:50,240
>> Councelor Hoben,

1136
00:48:50,240 --> 00:48:52,160
>> yes. Councelor Whipple,

1137
00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:53,920
>> no. Councelor Garrett,

1138
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:54,480
>> yes.

1139
00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:56,400
>> Councelor McCay, yes. Councelor

1140
00:48:56,400 --> 00:48:57,599
Christensen,

1141
00:48:57,599 --> 00:48:58,400
>> yes.

1142
00:48:58,400 --> 00:48:59,599
>> Councelor Whitlock,

1143
00:48:59,599 --> 00:49:00,240
>> no.

1144
00:49:00,240 --> 00:49:05,990
>> So, that passes 52.

1145
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:09,119
» Is that it, Brian? Okay.

1146
00:49:09,119 --> 00:49:10,720
>> All right. I think this is the one most

1147
00:49:10,720 --> 00:49:13,040
of you are here for. Next, an implied

1148
00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:14,160
motion on ordinance a sub amending the

1149
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:16,160
zone map classification of real property

1150
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:18,960
generally located at 1507 South 180 east

1151
00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:21,599
from the planned industrial commercial

1152
00:49:21,599 --> 00:49:23,040
zone to the planned industrial

1153
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:24,800
commercial data center overlay zone.

1154
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:38,390
This will be presented by Dustin Wright.

1155
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:39,680
Are they not on? They don't sound like

1156
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:42,240
they're on other buttons to push.

1157
00:49:42,240 --> 00:49:43,200
It says it's on.

1158
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:44,319
>> It's green. There we go.

1159
00:49:44,319 --> 00:49:45,040
>> There you are.

1160
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:47,119
>> Okay. So, here's the property that we're

1161
00:49:47,119 --> 00:49:49,680
looking at on this item. Um, it's in the

1162
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:52,640
East Bay neighborhood. And here's a

1163
00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:54,160
closeup showing the zoning on the

1164
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:56,160
property. So, the property is currently

1165
00:49:56,160 --> 00:49:57,920
in our planned industrial commercial

1166
00:49:57,920 --> 00:50:01,200
zone. And they're applying for the zone

1167
00:50:01,200 --> 00:50:03,280
map amendment to apply an overlay zone,

1168
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:06,400
which is that newly created data center

1169
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:09,200
overlay zone. So, this would be the

1170
00:50:09,200 --> 00:50:13,040
first um project that's come in to to

1171
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:16,640
request this overlay zone. Um our

1172
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:18,960
general plan in this area is commercial,

1173
00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:21,680
which this would align with.

1174
00:50:21,680 --> 00:50:24,319
And the property has an existing

1175
00:50:24,319 --> 00:50:25,440
structure on there that would be

1176
00:50:25,440 --> 00:50:28,720
demolished for the new um data center to

1177
00:50:28,720 --> 00:50:33,040
be built there on this site. Um here's a

1178
00:50:33,040 --> 00:50:35,760
look at uh what that data center would

1179
00:50:35,760 --> 00:50:38,960
look like rendering here and some

1180
00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:41,440
elevations as well showing um the

1181
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:44,400
proposed structure.

1182
00:50:44,400 --> 00:50:47,440
Um what the applicants are looking to do

1183
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:52,240
with this data center is um to have it

1184
00:50:52,240 --> 00:50:54,079
be one where they're they're acquiring

1185
00:50:54,079 --> 00:50:57,680
their power needed to run it um from our

1186
00:50:57,680 --> 00:51:00,800
grid as that power becomes available. So

1187
00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:03,440
they would have to go and acquire

1188
00:51:03,440 --> 00:51:07,599
um or or work with uh Provo City Power

1189
00:51:07,599 --> 00:51:10,800
um to be able to get the power needs

1190
00:51:10,800 --> 00:51:13,040
that they are looking for for this

1191
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:16,640
project as opposed to developing the the

1192
00:51:16,640 --> 00:51:19,200
energy from the site specifically. So

1193
00:51:19,200 --> 00:51:21,920
that helps um eliminate a lot of that

1194
00:51:21,920 --> 00:51:24,480
environmental um issues that would come

1195
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:28,160
with generating the power um on site. Uh

1196
00:51:28,160 --> 00:51:29,520
the other thing that they're proposing

1197
00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:34,720
to do um to help conserve with uh water

1198
00:51:34,720 --> 00:51:37,359
that's typically used in uh cooling

1199
00:51:37,359 --> 00:51:39,440
these data centers is to use a closed

1200
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:43,119
loop system. Um and that way they're

1201
00:51:43,119 --> 00:51:45,119
recirculating that water instead of

1202
00:51:45,119 --> 00:51:48,400
using uh water over and over. So both of

1203
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:49,680
those things are things that they've

1204
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:51,200
profered to put into a development

1205
00:51:51,200 --> 00:51:53,440
agreement as they're um different than

1206
00:51:53,440 --> 00:51:56,000
what our code requires. Um the other

1207
00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:58,000
thing that came up in when it went to

1208
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:01,760
planning commission um is that when that

1209
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:04,319
waters changed out that they would have

1210
00:52:04,319 --> 00:52:06,079
a third party do that that it wouldn't

1211
00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:09,359
be discharged into our uh sewer system

1212
00:52:09,359 --> 00:52:12,000
which um public works would be grateful

1213
00:52:12,000 --> 00:52:14,800
to to not have that happen. So to have

1214
00:52:14,800 --> 00:52:18,640
that in the development agreement um is

1215
00:52:18,640 --> 00:52:23,280
another um good thing there. So that is

1216
00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:26,319
an overview of this project. Um we have

1217
00:52:26,319 --> 00:52:28,079
a representative from Provo Power here

1218
00:52:28,079 --> 00:52:30,079
if you have specific questions related

1219
00:52:30,079 --> 00:52:33,839
to to any of that. Um and the applicant

1220
00:52:33,839 --> 00:52:36,160
is here as well. So if you have any

1221
00:52:36,160 --> 00:52:37,520
questions for me, I'd be happy to answer

1222
00:52:37,520 --> 00:52:38,000
those.

1223
00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:39,760
>> Thanks Dustin. Any questions from the

1224
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:43,510
council for Dustin?

1225
00:52:43,520 --> 00:52:46,160
» All right. Thank you.

1226
00:52:46,160 --> 00:52:48,319
We will now take public comment on this

1227
00:52:48,319 --> 00:52:50,319
item.

1228
00:52:50,319 --> 00:52:52,319
And remember to say your name and where

1229
00:52:52,319 --> 00:52:56,470
you live.

1230
00:52:56,480 --> 00:52:58,720
» Hi, my name is Angie Carter. I'm the

1231
00:52:58,720 --> 00:53:01,680
East um neighborhood district chair.

1232
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:03,359
I've emailed my comments about the data

1233
00:53:03,359 --> 00:53:05,280
center to you already and I speak today

1234
00:53:05,280 --> 00:53:07,920
to ask you to postpone the decision on

1235
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:10,240
reszoning the East Bay area for the data

1236
00:53:10,240 --> 00:53:13,040
center. Um my reasons are as follows. In

1237
00:53:13,040 --> 00:53:14,160
a letter read to the planning

1238
00:53:14,160 --> 00:53:16,000
commission, Mayor Judkins asked that the

1239
00:53:16,000 --> 00:53:18,160
decision be postponed until after the

1240
00:53:18,160 --> 00:53:20,720
Provo economic plan is complete. This is

1241
00:53:20,720 --> 00:53:22,400
a smart move that would allow Provo to

1242
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:24,000
put a data center where it most benefits

1243
00:53:24,000 --> 00:53:27,200
the city and existing businesses. Two,

1244
00:53:27,200 --> 00:53:28,640
although I'm not opposed to a data

1245
00:53:28,640 --> 00:53:30,319
center in the city, I don't believe that

1246
00:53:30,319 --> 00:53:33,599
the current location is ideal ideal. It

1247
00:53:33,599 --> 00:53:35,760
would sit next to two hotels and a

1248
00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:38,720
school. While 60 dB is normal talking

1249
00:53:38,720 --> 00:53:40,559
level, people do not want that level of

1250
00:53:40,559 --> 00:53:42,640
noise when they're sleeping or attending

1251
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:44,880
class or studying. In fact, that level

1252
00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:47,440
of noise is disruptive. Third, the

1253
00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:49,040
planning commission argued that Provo

1254
00:53:49,040 --> 00:53:50,800
does not need more business space. Yet,

1255
00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:52,720
they overlooked that Rocky Mountain

1256
00:53:52,720 --> 00:53:55,040
University moved some of their campus to

1257
00:53:55,040 --> 00:53:56,559
Springville because they could not get

1258
00:53:56,559 --> 00:53:59,200
off a space. Um whether that's because

1259
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:01,440
the current owners were not willing to

1260
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:04,720
let them use additional space or it lack

1261
00:54:04,720 --> 00:54:06,559
Provo lacks the type of space that they

1262
00:54:06,559 --> 00:54:08,559
need. It's possible that they and other

1263
00:54:08,559 --> 00:54:10,640
current businesses may be leaving Provo

1264
00:54:10,640 --> 00:54:12,160
because they can't get the space they

1265
00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:15,200
need here. An economic plan would show

1266
00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:17,119
whether Rocky Mountain situation is an

1267
00:54:17,119 --> 00:54:19,200
outlier or a sign of an unmet need in

1268
00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:22,160
the city. Fourth, in their remarks

1269
00:54:22,160 --> 00:54:23,839
recommending the zoning change, several

1270
00:54:23,839 --> 00:54:25,040
members of the planning commission

1271
00:54:25,040 --> 00:54:26,800
inferred that those speaking against the

1272
00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:29,200
data center are anti-technology. I take

1273
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:32,240
offense to those remarks. I am not

1274
00:54:32,240 --> 00:54:34,480
anti-technology. In fact, I use a wide

1275
00:54:34,480 --> 00:54:36,559
variety of large language models, cloud

1276
00:54:36,559 --> 00:54:38,720
computing, and so forth in my work, and

1277
00:54:38,720 --> 00:54:40,319
I teach my students to use those

1278
00:54:40,319 --> 00:54:42,960
systems. But using a technology also

1279
00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:44,640
means preparing for the long-term

1280
00:54:44,640 --> 00:54:47,280
ramifications of its use. I believe

1281
00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:49,440
decisions about energy use, land use,

1282
00:54:49,440 --> 00:54:51,119
city priorities require more time and

1283
00:54:51,119 --> 00:54:53,040
analysis so we can move forward

1284
00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:55,680
proactively. I urge the city council to

1285
00:54:55,680 --> 00:55:03,990
postpone the decision to resone

1286
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:07,119
Alec Bracken. I live in Provo, Utah. And

1287
00:55:07,119 --> 00:55:09,680
uh I am in general opposed to any data

1288
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:11,119
center within the city and I do believe

1289
00:55:11,119 --> 00:55:12,720
that they don't serve a purpose for our

1290
00:55:12,720 --> 00:55:14,559
city and instead serve corporate

1291
00:55:14,559 --> 00:55:16,160
interests that do not benefit our city

1292
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:18,079
in any way. If you look at studies

1293
00:55:18,079 --> 00:55:20,640
regarding data centers, they don't add

1294
00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:22,720
nearly any economic benefit or impact to

1295
00:55:22,720 --> 00:55:24,880
the city after it has been built and

1296
00:55:24,880 --> 00:55:26,720
instead they serve a purpose for a

1297
00:55:26,720 --> 00:55:28,559
corporation that is not contributing

1298
00:55:28,559 --> 00:55:30,960
anything to the city as a whole. I know

1299
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:32,640
that the proposal states that is a

1300
00:55:32,640 --> 00:55:34,400
closed loop water system but it's still

1301
00:55:34,400 --> 00:55:36,160
water. It's still water being used.

1302
00:55:36,160 --> 00:55:38,400
There's already been a con uh they've

1303
00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:39,359
stated they're going to have to change

1304
00:55:39,359 --> 00:55:41,119
out that water. How often are they going

1305
00:55:41,119 --> 00:55:42,319
to have to change out that water? How

1306
00:55:42,319 --> 00:55:43,839
much water they be using on a daily

1307
00:55:43,839 --> 00:55:46,480
basis. We are currently in record low

1308
00:55:46,480 --> 00:55:48,799
snow pack in the state of Utah and we

1309
00:55:48,799 --> 00:55:50,079
are dealing with a drought. The Great

1310
00:55:50,079 --> 00:55:51,680
Salt Lake is shrinking. Other lakes are

1311
00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:54,240
shrinking. I for one enjoy hiking, enjoy

1312
00:55:54,240 --> 00:55:55,920
going to the mountains. And last summer

1313
00:55:55,920 --> 00:55:59,119
the lakes were nearly dry. Deer Deer uh

1314
00:55:59,119 --> 00:56:02,000
Creek Reservoir is half of what it used

1315
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:04,720
to be. We are running out of water in

1316
00:56:04,720 --> 00:56:06,720
our state and to build a data center

1317
00:56:06,720 --> 00:56:08,720
that uses water to cool it is reckless

1318
00:56:08,720 --> 00:56:11,200
and irresponsible. Further, taking

1319
00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:13,280
energy from the grid of the city is only

1320
00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:15,520
going to result in higher energy prices

1321
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:17,280
for the rest of the city. This is also

1322
00:56:17,280 --> 00:56:19,839
proven in studies that show that using

1323
00:56:19,839 --> 00:56:21,760
these data centers have increased the

1324
00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:24,720
residents cost of utilities. Um, and

1325
00:56:24,720 --> 00:56:26,319
them not generating their own power may

1326
00:56:26,319 --> 00:56:28,480
result in better environmental results,

1327
00:56:28,480 --> 00:56:30,000
but it will result in residents like me

1328
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:31,920
and other residents paying more for

1329
00:56:31,920 --> 00:56:34,160
their energy, which will then make it

1330
00:56:34,160 --> 00:56:35,599
harder to live in Provo, a place where

1331
00:56:35,599 --> 00:56:38,000
it is already pretty expensive to live.

1332
00:56:38,000 --> 00:56:40,799
And so, I would encourage the council to

1333
00:56:40,799 --> 00:56:43,119
look at the impacts of the residents,

1334
00:56:43,119 --> 00:56:45,760
look at how a resident like myself is

1335
00:56:45,760 --> 00:56:47,200
going to benefit from this. And I don't

1336
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:49,440
see any benefits. It just benefits the

1337
00:56:49,440 --> 00:56:51,520
corporation that wishes to build this

1338
00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:53,599
data center that wishes to use the data

1339
00:56:53,599 --> 00:56:55,599
center but does not benefit the city in

1340
00:56:55,599 --> 00:56:57,280
any way. So I believe it would be absurd

1341
00:56:57,280 --> 00:56:58,960
to build something that does not benefit

1342
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:05,190
the city in any way. Thank you.

1343
00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:06,400
» I'm going to say your name and your

1344
00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:09,040
city. Hi, I'm Jocelyn Bracken and I live

1345
00:57:09,040 --> 00:57:11,359
in the North Park neighborhood in Provo.

1346
00:57:11,359 --> 00:57:13,839
I emailed a couple weeks ago and I'm

1347
00:57:13,839 --> 00:57:15,280
really grateful to the council members

1348
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:18,079
who responded um with very thoughtful

1349
00:57:18,079 --> 00:57:20,000
responses and showed me kind of more

1350
00:57:20,000 --> 00:57:22,079
data and things that the state

1351
00:57:22,079 --> 00:57:24,799
legislature is looking at data centers.

1352
00:57:24,799 --> 00:57:27,680
I'm opposed to a data center. I we just

1353
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:29,760
got this award. We just got gold for

1354
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:32,160
being a bicycle friendly community and

1355
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:34,480
it feels like five steps backwards to

1356
00:57:34,480 --> 00:57:36,319
introduce a data center into our

1357
00:57:36,319 --> 00:57:38,640
community. I'm concerned about the

1358
00:57:38,640 --> 00:57:40,240
environmental impact. I'm concerned

1359
00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:41,920
about the water usage. I'm concerned

1360
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:46,400
about the the influx of power. I think

1361
00:57:46,400 --> 00:57:49,839
the noise is a concern. I don't see a

1362
00:57:49,839 --> 00:57:51,680
data center aligning with the goals of

1363
00:57:51,680 --> 00:57:54,480
Provo and being beneficial to our

1364
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:56,160
community and I would much rather use

1365
00:57:56,160 --> 00:57:58,640
that for use that space for something

1366
00:57:58,640 --> 00:58:00,880
that would bring back things into our

1367
00:58:00,880 --> 00:58:03,839
community and be beneficial to us. I

1368
00:58:03,839 --> 00:58:06,880
think too AI is something that's a hot

1369
00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:08,480
topic right now and it's a big deal

1370
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:10,480
right now and it is something that is

1371
00:58:10,480 --> 00:58:12,240
going to level out and I don't want to

1372
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:14,720
be a city that jumps in on it really

1373
00:58:14,720 --> 00:58:16,319
quickly and then we find that we don't

1374
00:58:16,319 --> 00:58:18,720
actually need it as much as we thought

1375
00:58:18,720 --> 00:58:23,520
we did and so I implore the the city to

1376
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:25,680
not allow this to continue. Thank you.

1377
00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:31,270
>> Thank you.

1378
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:34,720
» Hi. Uh my name is Don Whitmer and I'm uh

1379
00:58:34,720 --> 00:58:37,599
from I'm living currently in Provo. Um

1380
00:58:37,599 --> 00:58:40,160
and I think an introduc sorry an

1381
00:58:40,160 --> 00:58:42,079
introduction of a new data center here

1382
00:58:42,079 --> 00:58:44,000
in Provo is directly selling out our

1383
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:47,920
energy uh to technology um corporations

1384
00:58:47,920 --> 00:58:50,079
um and are giving out our resources to

1385
00:58:50,079 --> 00:58:52,240
multi-billion dollar corporations. Uh, I

1386
00:58:52,240 --> 00:58:54,880
do not see how the 20 to 30 proposed new

1387
00:58:54,880 --> 00:58:58,079
jobs created by this new data center or

1388
00:58:58,079 --> 00:58:59,839
any vague promises of future

1389
00:58:59,839 --> 00:59:02,240
productivity would offset the increase

1390
00:59:02,240 --> 00:59:04,559
of electricity to our grid, which I

1391
00:59:04,559 --> 00:59:06,880
believe is currently our usage is at 175

1392
00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:09,839
megawws and would be adding 30 to 50 uh

1393
00:59:09,839 --> 00:59:11,680
megawws. And this cost would have to

1394
00:59:11,680 --> 00:59:15,920
fall um I assume on um the electric

1395
00:59:15,920 --> 00:59:18,160
bills of the citizens here in Provo if

1396
00:59:18,160 --> 00:59:20,640
that cost is going to be paid um by the

1397
00:59:20,640 --> 00:59:22,799
data center. Um in addition uh water

1398
00:59:22,799 --> 00:59:24,319
usage is a concern. I know people are

1399
00:59:24,319 --> 00:59:26,799
worried about um the water uh direct

1400
00:59:26,799 --> 00:59:29,200
water usage to cooling the center. Um

1401
00:59:29,200 --> 00:59:30,960
but it goes a lot farther than that

1402
00:59:30,960 --> 00:59:33,359
because I think uh it's about uh what I

1403
00:59:33,359 --> 00:59:36,000
heard before was um about the use of a

1404
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:37,839
car wash is what this new data center

1405
00:59:37,839 --> 00:59:39,440
will be using and that is true for

1406
00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:41,440
direct usage but there's also indirect

1407
00:59:41,440 --> 00:59:43,920
usage that are harder to calculate like

1408
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:47,599
um the electricity generation um for uh

1409
00:59:47,599 --> 00:59:49,520
semiconductor manufacturing needed to

1410
00:59:49,520 --> 00:59:52,319
create um the GPUs.

1411
00:59:52,319 --> 00:59:55,599
Um and I want to emphas emphasize that I

1412
00:59:55,599 --> 00:59:57,520
believe in the importance of investing

1413
00:59:57,520 --> 01:00:00,000
in new technologies. But this increase

1414
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:03,599
of data centers to uh support LLM is a

1415
01:00:03,599 --> 01:00:05,839
technology culde-sac. Instead of giving

1416
01:00:05,839 --> 01:00:08,240
Probo more ability to expand and adapt

1417
01:00:08,240 --> 01:00:11,040
to its challenges, this data center um

1418
01:00:11,040 --> 01:00:13,920
reduces uh the the charge for

1419
01:00:13,920 --> 01:00:15,440
billion-dollar corporations at the

1420
01:00:15,440 --> 01:00:18,000
expense of Provo residents. Thank you

1421
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:19,599
guys for your time.

1422
01:00:19,599 --> 01:00:26,390
>> Thank you.

1423
01:00:26,400 --> 01:00:28,960
What up council? My name is Brennan

1424
01:00:28,960 --> 01:00:30,640
Larson and I've been a Utah resident my

1425
01:00:30,640 --> 01:00:32,400
entire life and a prov resident for the

1426
01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:34,720
last four years and I am not a lite. I'm

1427
01:00:34,720 --> 01:00:36,240
here to address the data center. I find

1428
01:00:36,240 --> 01:00:37,680
it preposterous that there is time and

1429
01:00:37,680 --> 01:00:39,599
energy to even address a data center

1430
01:00:39,599 --> 01:00:41,119
being built when the entire neighborhood

1431
01:00:41,119 --> 01:00:42,799
has been asking for a grocery store for

1432
01:00:42,799 --> 01:00:45,040
literal decades. I fully understand and

1433
01:00:45,040 --> 01:00:46,559
emphasize for whatever financial

1434
01:00:46,559 --> 01:00:48,480
incentive this may offer the city and

1435
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:50,240
especially given the financial quagmires

1436
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:52,400
and trespasses from the previous mayor.

1437
01:00:52,400 --> 01:00:54,000
However, having recently spoken with a

1438
01:00:54,000 --> 01:00:55,920
civil engineer, David Chapel, he

1439
01:00:55,920 --> 01:00:57,359
estimates that the Provo power grid

1440
01:00:57,359 --> 01:01:00,079
consumes around 175 megawws. This data

1441
01:01:00,079 --> 01:01:01,839
center would require around 50 megawatts

1442
01:01:01,839 --> 01:01:04,240
to be purchased from the UMPA. Despite

1443
01:01:04,240 --> 01:01:06,160
whatever rhetoric the AI company says to

1444
01:01:06,160 --> 01:01:07,839
the contrary, this will undoubtedly

1445
01:01:07,839 --> 01:01:09,839
raise power bill prices. It is an

1446
01:01:09,839 --> 01:01:11,760
completely unfair ask to force Provo

1447
01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:13,760
citizens to foot the bill for a data

1448
01:01:13,760 --> 01:01:15,760
center power and energy needs. I would

1449
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:17,280
alternatively propose that the council

1450
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:19,119
require the data center to invest in the

1451
01:01:19,119 --> 01:01:21,040
city's power grid to actually decrease

1452
01:01:21,040 --> 01:01:23,040
citizen energy bills through renewable

1453
01:01:23,040 --> 01:01:25,200
energy and to use the profits from the

1454
01:01:25,200 --> 01:01:27,119
data center to assist the individuals

1455
01:01:27,119 --> 01:01:28,799
that are at risk of housing displacement

1456
01:01:28,799 --> 01:01:31,040
for the proposed Provo Mall development.

1457
01:01:31,040 --> 01:01:32,400
Housing is already increasingly

1458
01:01:32,400 --> 01:01:34,079
unaffordable for students and renters in

1459
01:01:34,079 --> 01:01:35,760
Provo. This data center without

1460
01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:37,440
oversight and requirements of the AI

1461
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:39,040
company to invest back into the

1462
01:01:39,040 --> 01:01:41,440
community does not benefit Provo's

1463
01:01:41,440 --> 01:01:43,680
future in the long term whatsoever. I

1464
01:01:43,680 --> 01:01:45,200
firmly believe that is the role of the

1465
01:01:45,200 --> 01:01:46,799
city government to provide common sense

1466
01:01:46,799 --> 01:01:48,480
compromises that benefit the community

1467
01:01:48,480 --> 01:01:50,559
as a whole. Provo has a world-class

1468
01:01:50,559 --> 01:01:52,240
university within city boundaries that

1469
01:01:52,240 --> 01:01:53,760
is full of talented and intelligent

1470
01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:55,119
individuals and professors that are

1471
01:01:55,119 --> 01:01:56,559
fully qualified and equipped with

1472
01:01:56,559 --> 01:01:58,720
resources to create real solutions to

1473
01:01:58,720 --> 01:02:00,240
address a data center's energy

1474
01:02:00,240 --> 01:02:01,760
requirements in a way that benefits

1475
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:03,920
everyone and to aid in ensuring housing

1476
01:02:03,920 --> 01:02:05,680
for Provo citizen at any risk of

1477
01:02:05,680 --> 01:02:07,839
displacement. As a taxpaying citizen, I

1478
01:02:07,839 --> 01:02:09,200
demand excellence from my local

1479
01:02:09,200 --> 01:02:11,440
government whose wages I help pay for.

1480
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:13,200
Figure it out. Don't let my energy bill

1481
01:02:13,200 --> 01:02:18,549
go up and do your job.

1482
01:02:18,559 --> 01:02:22,150
Thank you.

1483
01:02:22,160 --> 01:02:24,319
» I push a button or speak.

1484
01:02:24,319 --> 01:02:26,000
>> No, you just can speak. Just need your

1485
01:02:26,000 --> 01:02:27,520
name and where you live.

1486
01:02:27,520 --> 01:02:29,440
>> Um, my name is Alex Strawber. I'm in the

1487
01:02:29,440 --> 01:02:31,680
Dixon Provo neighborhood. I just wanted

1488
01:02:31,680 --> 01:02:33,599
to ask you guys not to do the data

1489
01:02:33,599 --> 01:02:35,040
center because it just seems like it's

1490
01:02:35,040 --> 01:02:36,799
such an environmental risk, especially

1491
01:02:36,799 --> 01:02:38,640
with us being in a drought. That's all I

1492
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:39,680
have to say. Thank you.

1493
01:02:39,680 --> 01:02:48,789
>> Thank you.

1494
01:02:48,799 --> 01:02:51,119
Uh, hi, my name is Austin Simcox. I live

1495
01:02:51,119 --> 01:02:53,599
in Provo in the Maser neighborhood. Um,

1496
01:02:53,599 --> 01:02:56,079
I am opposed to an AI data center in

1497
01:02:56,079 --> 01:02:59,359
Provo. Uh, the economic impact might uh

1498
01:02:59,359 --> 01:03:01,280
will be minimal, but the potential harms

1499
01:03:01,280 --> 01:03:04,240
could be severe. Uh, I understand the

1500
01:03:04,240 --> 01:03:05,599
line is that it's going to use the same

1501
01:03:05,599 --> 01:03:07,760
amount of water as a car wash. Um, in

1502
01:03:07,760 --> 01:03:09,119
which case the better investment seems

1503
01:03:09,119 --> 01:03:11,359
to be the car wash. uh because it will

1504
01:03:11,359 --> 01:03:13,359
provide about the same amount of jobs uh

1505
01:03:13,359 --> 01:03:14,960
and won't ask to create its own power

1506
01:03:14,960 --> 01:03:18,400
plant in a few years. Um

1507
01:03:18,400 --> 01:03:20,799
all the economic issues aside, there's

1508
01:03:20,799 --> 01:03:24,000
still the moral issue. Um

1509
01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:25,760
it's understood that generative AI can

1510
01:03:25,760 --> 01:03:28,079
only function using the work of creative

1511
01:03:28,079 --> 01:03:30,319
humans, work that is often stolen from

1512
01:03:30,319 --> 01:03:32,960
them. And finally, even with that issue

1513
01:03:32,960 --> 01:03:35,039
aside, I don't want my city to be

1514
01:03:35,039 --> 01:03:36,400
involved in the development of a

1515
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:38,400
technology that is currently being used

1516
01:03:38,400 --> 01:03:40,880
to wage war around the world, surveil

1517
01:03:40,880 --> 01:03:42,960
Americans here at home, and deport our

1518
01:03:42,960 --> 01:03:45,200
friends and neighbors. A data center

1519
01:03:45,200 --> 01:03:47,039
would be a moral stain on Provo, and I

1520
01:03:47,039 --> 01:03:48,799
do not want it in my community. Thank

1521
01:03:48,799 --> 01:03:50,400
you.

1522
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:53,440
>> Thank you.

1523
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:55,039
>> She's already spoken. You might as well

1524
01:03:55,039 --> 01:03:59,654
come. Oh, not for this item, though.

1525
01:03:59,654 --> 01:04:00,400
>> [clears throat]

1526
01:04:00,400 --> 01:04:02,160
>> So, I'm Seth Draper. I'm in North Side

1527
01:04:02,160 --> 01:04:03,760
Provo. Uh, but I actually grew up in

1528
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:06,079
Virginia. Um, and as a former resident

1529
01:04:06,079 --> 01:04:07,680
of the state with 50% of the data

1530
01:04:07,680 --> 01:04:10,400
centers in the US, um, I just want to

1531
01:04:10,400 --> 01:04:13,039
really implore y'all not to do it. Uh,

1532
01:04:13,039 --> 01:04:17,200
the, uh, quality of life, uh, has been

1533
01:04:17,200 --> 01:04:18,960
noticeably lowered, uh, within cities

1534
01:04:18,960 --> 01:04:21,520
that I used to know. Um, with high

1535
01:04:21,520 --> 01:04:24,240
levels of, uh, with the energy bills

1536
01:04:24,240 --> 01:04:26,319
being raised, with incredible noise

1537
01:04:26,319 --> 01:04:28,880
pollution. Um, I love this city. I think

1538
01:04:28,880 --> 01:04:30,720
it's beautiful and I would like to keep

1539
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:36,309
it that way. Um, so thank y'all.

1540
01:04:36,319 --> 01:04:43,270
» Thank you.

1541
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:44,960
» Hello. My name is Don Flake. I'm a

1542
01:04:44,960 --> 01:04:47,280
resident of Provo. Um, something this is

1543
01:04:47,280 --> 01:04:49,440
an angle has not been brought up yet. Um

1544
01:04:49,440 --> 01:04:50,799
and I don't know how much this will

1545
01:04:50,799 --> 01:04:53,200
factor into the decision but this is

1546
01:04:53,200 --> 01:04:55,839
sort of a more macroeconomic sort of um

1547
01:04:55,839 --> 01:04:59,119
perspective on uh

1548
01:04:59,119 --> 01:05:00,319
neural networks and artificial

1549
01:05:00,319 --> 01:05:02,559
intelligence broadly. Um three days ago

1550
01:05:02,559 --> 01:05:05,680
it was reported that um an insider from

1551
01:05:05,680 --> 01:05:08,319
Kurser which is a they provide uh uh

1552
01:05:08,319 --> 01:05:10,000
like coding by using artificial

1553
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:12,079
intelligence and one of the competitors

1554
01:05:12,079 --> 01:05:16,640
is Claude Code um they estimated that a

1555
01:05:16,640 --> 01:05:19,920
$200 per month Claude Code subscription

1556
01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:23,920
um could use up to $2,000 per month in

1557
01:05:23,920 --> 01:05:27,599
compute. Um and that was a year ago.

1558
01:05:27,599 --> 01:05:30,720
today that subsid subsidization is even

1559
01:05:30,720 --> 01:05:33,520
more aggressive. Its $200 plan consumes

1560
01:05:33,520 --> 01:05:36,480
about $5,000 of compute. So in other

1561
01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:38,240
words, Anthropic and this is just one

1562
01:05:38,240 --> 01:05:40,000
example of one company is heavily

1563
01:05:40,000 --> 01:05:42,400
subsidizing the use of AI. What that

1564
01:05:42,400 --> 01:05:47,359
suggests is that with time u as the uh

1565
01:05:47,359 --> 01:05:48,960
payment requirements for these AI

1566
01:05:48,960 --> 01:05:51,200
companies as they come to bear um these

1567
01:05:51,200 --> 01:05:52,319
companies are not going to be able to

1568
01:05:52,319 --> 01:05:55,599
meet their financial um their financial

1569
01:05:55,599 --> 01:05:59,359
obligations. Um, and it suggests a real

1570
01:05:59,359 --> 01:06:01,520
risk that this data center that's built

1571
01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:08,000
here uh will be uh heavily neglected or like the company that builds it won't

1572
01:06:08,000 --> 01:06:10,799
be able to um actually use it and occupy

1573
01:06:10,799 --> 01:06:12,640
it in the way that is perhaps maybe

1574
01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:15,280
projected. So that's so much more sort

1575
01:06:15,280 --> 01:06:17,839
of macroeconomic view of things. But um

1576
01:06:17,839 --> 01:06:19,680
I think that ultimately we want in Provo

1577
01:06:19,680 --> 01:06:22,079
to have the things that are built um

1578
01:06:22,079 --> 01:06:24,319
especially like buildings if they are

1579
01:06:24,319 --> 01:06:27,440
built to be reused by uh you know other

1580
01:06:27,440 --> 01:06:29,119
entities if they you know go out of

1581
01:06:29,119 --> 01:06:30,799
business for example or or if something

1582
01:06:30,799 --> 01:06:33,440
else happens um and in this instance it

1583
01:06:33,440 --> 01:06:35,280
seems like that is a higher likelihood

1584
01:06:35,280 --> 01:06:37,599
than perhaps is otherwise uh normally

1585
01:06:37,599 --> 01:06:39,359
suggested. So know that's all I have to

1586
01:06:39,359 --> 01:06:41,200
say about that. Thank you.

1587
01:06:41,200 --> 01:06:49,109
>> Thank you.

1588
01:06:49,119 --> 01:06:50,720
Hi, my name is Aaron Wheatley. I live in

1589
01:06:50,720 --> 01:06:53,440
the Walke neighborhood. Um my like that

1590
01:06:53,440 --> 01:06:55,680
gentleman who spoke uh just before or

1591
01:06:55,680 --> 01:06:57,920
two before. Uh my wife is from Lowden

1592
01:06:57,920 --> 01:06:59,781
County, Virginia. It's like where

1593
01:06:59,781 --> 01:07:02,000
[clears throat] all data centers are. Um

1594
01:07:02,000 --> 01:07:03,520
every time I go out there, there's some

1595
01:07:03,520 --> 01:07:05,440
more forest that's no longer there.

1596
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:07,920
There's a new road that must be there.

1597
01:07:07,920 --> 01:07:09,920
There's uh what where the edge of

1598
01:07:09,920 --> 01:07:11,599
civilization was. They had to clear some

1599
01:07:11,599 --> 01:07:14,400
more and more and more. And I've talked

1600
01:07:14,400 --> 01:07:16,480
to my in-laws multiple times kind of

1601
01:07:16,480 --> 01:07:17,920
talking about what is this like for you?

1602
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:19,760
And they they explain, well, you know,

1603
01:07:19,760 --> 01:07:21,440
it's it's a place out here where we're

1604
01:07:21,440 --> 01:07:22,799
fine because we have enough water with

1605
01:07:22,799 --> 01:07:25,119
it. They never work in Utah. And so I

1606
01:07:25,119 --> 01:07:27,119
never thought we'd ever have to to talk

1607
01:07:27,119 --> 01:07:30,000
about this. So surprised uh to see that

1608
01:07:30,000 --> 01:07:34,880
happen. Uh, I do want to uh commend the developer, everyone in the project

1609
01:07:34,880 --> 01:07:36,240
who's looking at different ways that

1610
01:07:36,240 --> 01:07:38,160
they'll recycle the water, that they'll

1611
01:07:38,160 --> 01:07:41,280
um use the energy different ways. Um, I

1612
01:07:41,280 --> 01:07:43,440
wish I could believe that would happen.

1613
01:07:43,440 --> 01:07:46,400
I I I would hope, but my experience with

1614
01:07:46,400 --> 01:07:48,720
this is that's not what happens. Like I

1615
01:07:48,720 --> 01:07:50,880
said, um, my mother-in-law, I ask her,

1616
01:07:50,880 --> 01:07:52,480
"Is this nice?" And she says that she

1617
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:56,799
appreciates the the tax income. But what

1618
01:07:56,799 --> 01:07:58,559
I'm recognizing is the reason they get

1619
01:07:58,559 --> 01:08:00,079
tax income is because the next year

1620
01:08:00,079 --> 01:08:01,680
they're building a new one and the next

1621
01:08:01,680 --> 01:08:03,440
year they're building a new one and the

1622
01:08:03,440 --> 01:08:05,119
next year there's another one. They

1623
01:08:05,119 --> 01:08:07,119
don't get a lot of income from the ones

1624
01:08:07,119 --> 01:08:09,440
that are already built. So my issue is

1625
01:08:09,440 --> 01:08:11,440
we're going to build one then what what

1626
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:13,200
happens here? Cool. We get some money.

1627
01:08:13,200 --> 01:08:14,799
That's great. That's really important.

1628
01:08:14,799 --> 01:08:16,560
But then what happens in the future?

1629
01:08:16,560 --> 01:08:18,319
What's this going to look like? We just

1630
01:08:18,319 --> 01:08:20,960
I just heard you guys discuss about hey

1631
01:08:20,960 --> 01:08:22,880
um we don't want to make a decision now

1632
01:08:22,880 --> 01:08:24,239
that will affect things in the future.

1633
01:08:24,239 --> 01:08:25,920
We want to go slow on this. That's what

1634
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:27,520
you just said about the other thing. I

1635
01:08:27,520 --> 01:08:30,159
would implore you to go slow on this.

1636
01:08:30,159 --> 01:08:32,640
I've seen what happens and I don't like

1637
01:08:32,640 --> 01:08:34,480
what happens. Again, I do want to say

1638
01:08:34,480 --> 01:08:35,759
I'm glad that we're bringing up the

1639
01:08:35,759 --> 01:08:37,120
water issue. There's so many other

1640
01:08:37,120 --> 01:08:39,199
issues with this. This does not seem

1641
01:08:39,199 --> 01:08:40,719
like the right way. This does not seem

1642
01:08:40,719 --> 01:08:42,799
like the Utah way, the Provo way to get

1643
01:08:42,799 --> 01:08:45,359
a quick buck and then have to pay for it

1644
01:08:45,359 --> 01:08:46,880
in the future. So, I would implore you

1645
01:08:46,880 --> 01:08:49,120
to vote no on this. Thank you.

1646
01:08:49,120 --> 01:08:58,870
>> Thank you.

1647
01:08:58,880 --> 01:09:00,880
Hi, my name is Brooklyn Brighton. I'm a

1648
01:09:00,880 --> 01:09:04,159
Provo resident on 200 South. Um, my

1649
01:09:04,159 --> 01:09:07,199
husband is a PhD student at BYU studying

1650
01:09:07,199 --> 01:09:11,120
AI and I would like to echo the desire

1651
01:09:11,120 --> 01:09:15,679
to move slowly on this um because having

1652
01:09:15,679 --> 01:09:19,199
his perspective I think of the costs

1653
01:09:19,199 --> 01:09:22,400
associated is valuable. But um I would

1654
01:09:22,400 --> 01:09:24,319
like to

1655
01:09:24,319 --> 01:09:25,839
offer

1656
01:09:25,839 --> 01:09:27,839
some insight into what those

1657
01:09:27,839 --> 01:09:31,759
conversations look like um at in his

1658
01:09:31,759 --> 01:09:35,279
labs at BYU and also at home with him.

1659
01:09:35,279 --> 01:09:37,600
um the amounts of investing that are

1660
01:09:37,600 --> 01:09:41,359
going into AI right now um are

1661
01:09:41,359 --> 01:09:45,199
significant and the the way the place

1662
01:09:45,199 --> 01:09:48,480
that AI is at right now was somewhere we

1663
01:09:48,480 --> 01:09:53,440
weren't projected to achieve until many years in the future and the speed

1664
01:09:53,440 --> 01:09:55,760
at which AI is getting better and the

1665
01:09:55,760 --> 01:09:59,440
technology is improving is faster than

1666
01:09:59,440 --> 01:10:02,239
was ever anticipated and I would like as

1667
01:10:02,239 --> 01:10:04,960
a young provo resident who will be here

1668
01:10:04,960 --> 01:10:06,719
many years into the future to be able to

1669
01:10:06,719 --> 01:10:11,280
experience that and continue to see Utah

1670
01:10:11,280 --> 01:10:14,159
um in the ways that it echoes the best

1671
01:10:14,159 --> 01:10:15,840
parts of Silicon Valley without the

1672
01:10:15,840 --> 01:10:17,440
worst parts of it. I would like that to

1673
01:10:17,440 --> 01:10:18,960
continue and I would like that value to

1674
01:10:18,960 --> 01:10:22,000
be preserved um in our best interest and

1675
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:24,239
I think it would be good to go slow but

1676
01:10:24,239 --> 01:10:26,719
I I would like that still to be an

1677
01:10:26,719 --> 01:10:30,080
option. Thank you. I didn't hear much of

1678
01:10:30,080 --> 01:10:31,679
what you said because that cute little

1679
01:10:31,679 --> 01:10:34,560
kid that you brought up there with you.

1680
01:10:34,560 --> 01:10:36,159
So, are you for or against? I just

1681
01:10:36,159 --> 01:10:37,840
wanted to see if I understand.

1682
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:40,400
>> I'm for the data center slowly.

1683
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:41,360
>> Got it. Thank you.

1684
01:10:41,360 --> 01:10:45,520
>> Potentially not in that location.

1685
01:10:45,520 --> 01:10:47,040
>> All right. Any more public comment

1686
01:10:47,040 --> 01:10:53,030
before we close?

1687
01:10:53,040 --> 01:10:55,280
» John Southerntherland. I live in Provo.

1688
01:10:55,280 --> 01:10:58,000
Um I am a former retired technology

1689
01:10:58,000 --> 01:11:00,320
executive so I'm definitely not a lead

1690
01:11:00,320 --> 01:11:02,159
and I understand that two of the top

1691
01:11:02,159 --> 01:11:03,520
three initiatives in the state are

1692
01:11:03,520 --> 01:11:06,960
increasing energy capacity and also AI

1693
01:11:06,960 --> 01:11:08,640
and you know talent ready Utah and

1694
01:11:08,640 --> 01:11:11,760
others are deep into that. Um however I

1695
01:11:11,760 --> 01:11:13,360
think that where you locate a data

1696
01:11:13,360 --> 01:11:15,760
center you got to be careful about I

1697
01:11:15,760 --> 01:11:17,600
don't think Provo City from my point of

1698
01:11:17,600 --> 01:11:19,440
view is the right place. 70 years ago

1699
01:11:19,440 --> 01:11:20,880
when they built the Idaho National

1700
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:22,719
Engineering Laboratory. They put it out

1701
01:11:22,719 --> 01:11:24,159
in the middle of the desert near Arco,

1702
01:11:24,159 --> 01:11:27,360
Idaho. And um there's no reason why a

1703
01:11:27,360 --> 01:11:29,199
data center needs to be in city limits.

1704
01:11:29,199 --> 01:11:32,880
It needs water. It needs um some energy

1705
01:11:32,880 --> 01:11:34,400
and it needs connectivity to the

1706
01:11:34,400 --> 01:11:36,239
internet. We don't exactly have the

1707
01:11:36,239 --> 01:11:38,960
greatest peering point in Provo for uh

1708
01:11:38,960 --> 01:11:41,120
for data centers for connectivity to the

1709
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:43,360
internet. So I don't think Provo is the

1710
01:11:43,360 --> 01:11:45,120
right place. I don't like the idea that

1711
01:11:45,120 --> 01:11:46,880
it's going to be using our water. I

1712
01:11:46,880 --> 01:11:48,320
don't like the idea it's being on our

1713
01:11:48,320 --> 01:11:50,640
power grid. I think that there's a big

1714
01:11:50,640 --> 01:11:53,280
push um nationally to say that these

1715
01:11:53,280 --> 01:11:54,880
companies like Meta and others ought to

1716
01:11:54,880 --> 01:11:56,400
be along with their data centers

1717
01:11:56,400 --> 01:11:57,679
providing their own power. I don't want

1718
01:11:57,679 --> 01:11:59,600
that power generation here in Provo

1719
01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:01,760
City. Um I think it ought to be located

1720
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:04,400
in a much more remote place, put its own

1721
01:12:04,400 --> 01:12:06,719
power generation in and someplace where

1722
01:12:06,719 --> 01:12:08,560
they can get the water to connect to the

1723
01:12:08,560 --> 01:12:10,080
easily to the internet, the rest of the

1724
01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:12,719
internet. So I would prefer that we not

1725
01:12:12,719 --> 01:12:14,400
go ahead with putting a data center in

1726
01:12:14,400 --> 01:12:16,960
Provo. It's not a very big data center.

1727
01:12:16,960 --> 01:12:18,800
Frankly, the country is going to need a

1728
01:12:18,800 --> 01:12:20,560
lot more and I don't want to see that

1729
01:12:20,560 --> 01:12:23,440
expansion happen in Provo. Thank you.

1730
01:12:23,440 --> 01:12:26,640
>> Thank you.

1731
01:12:26,640 --> 01:12:27,840
All right, we're going to close it.

1732
01:12:27,840 --> 01:12:30,000
Anyone else?

1733
01:12:30,000 --> 01:12:32,560
Oh, come on up here.

1734
01:12:32,560 --> 01:12:34,000
>> Just had this wild idea.

1735
01:12:34,000 --> 01:12:35,360
>> You have to give your name again.

1736
01:12:35,360 --> 01:12:37,920
>> Okay. My name is Bonnie Shiffler Olsen.

1737
01:12:37,920 --> 01:12:40,400
Um, I love AI. It's so much

1738
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:41,600
>> She lives in Provo.

1739
01:12:41,600 --> 01:12:44,400
>> Yeah, I do. I love having conversations

1740
01:12:44,400 --> 01:12:45,920
because

1741
01:12:45,920 --> 01:12:49,199
it has all of the information that it's

1742
01:12:49,199 --> 01:12:52,480
Yeah. Why don't we ask it? Why don't we

1743
01:12:52,480 --> 01:13:01,350
ask it if it is feasible for our city

1744
01:13:01,360 --> 01:13:05,120
in tandem with our goals?

1745
01:13:05,120 --> 01:13:07,840
>> I love I love AI.

1746
01:13:07,840 --> 01:13:09,679
>> If you have Siri on your phone, ask her

1747
01:13:09,679 --> 01:13:12,000
and then let us know. just do it out

1748
01:13:12,000 --> 01:13:18,310
there. All right, come on up.

1749
01:13:18,320 --> 01:13:20,560
But um I had to check if something was

1750
01:13:20,560 --> 01:13:22,480
addressed. My name is Katherine Hall

1751
01:13:22,480 --> 01:13:25,199
again, Provo City resident, um East

1752
01:13:25,199 --> 01:13:28,400
District. Um

1753
01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:30,800
I know a closed loop system, I've I've

1754
01:13:30,800 --> 01:13:32,239
researched a lot about that, but

1755
01:13:32,239 --> 01:13:34,560
eventually they need to be flushed. when

1756
01:13:34,560 --> 01:13:36,719
they're flushed, there are a lot of

1757
01:13:36,719 --> 01:13:38,560
contaminants that come out that our

1758
01:13:38,560 --> 01:13:40,560
water treatment system that a new

1759
01:13:40,560 --> 01:13:43,280
amazing facility that we just built

1760
01:13:43,280 --> 01:13:46,159
cannot handle. And I think that has to

1761
01:13:46,159 --> 01:13:48,719
be considered. The emissions that come

1762
01:13:48,719 --> 01:13:50,239
out of data centers, especially if

1763
01:13:50,239 --> 01:13:51,920
they're running generators, which isn't

1764
01:13:51,920 --> 01:13:54,880
all the time, I understand, is really a

1765
01:13:54,880 --> 01:13:56,560
health risk for a lot of people like

1766
01:13:56,560 --> 01:13:59,600
myself and my son who have asthma. Um,

1767
01:13:59,600 --> 01:14:01,840
so I really think you need to consider

1768
01:14:01,840 --> 01:14:04,400
what's being put out from the data

1769
01:14:04,400 --> 01:14:07,679
center, you know, from the water, the

1770
01:14:07,679 --> 01:14:09,600
what the contaminants are and how that's

1771
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:10,960
going to affect the quality of life for

1772
01:14:10,960 --> 01:14:12,400
those of us that live in Southeast

1773
01:14:12,400 --> 01:14:15,920
Provo. So, thank you.

1774
01:14:15,920 --> 01:14:18,560
>> All right, last call.

1775
01:14:18,560 --> 01:14:21,440
Oh, okay.

1776
01:14:21,440 --> 01:14:23,199
>> Sorry. Sorry. I know that you're trying

1777
01:14:23,199 --> 01:14:24,880
to close this. Um, my name is Holland

1778
01:14:24,880 --> 01:14:26,719
King. Um, I just moved

1779
01:14:26,719 --> 01:14:28,320
>> What city do you live in? Well, I just

1780
01:14:28,320 --> 01:14:30,719
moved from Provo to Oram. Um, so I was

1781
01:14:30,719 --> 01:14:32,239
living in Provo. I live I've lived here

1782
01:14:32,239 --> 01:14:33,280
for the past

1783
01:14:33,280 --> 01:14:35,920
>> I don't know since 2022. Um, and I just

1784
01:14:35,920 --> 01:14:38,239
wanted to say that my concern about the

1785
01:14:38,239 --> 01:14:39,600
data center

1786
01:14:39,600 --> 01:14:42,159
>> and with most AI data centers, well

1787
01:14:42,159 --> 01:14:43,679
there's I mean the environmental factor

1788
01:14:43,679 --> 01:14:45,520
which everyone has addressed like

1789
01:14:45,520 --> 01:14:48,159
beautifully. Um, and then also I wanted

1790
01:14:48,159 --> 01:14:51,679
to address the issues that I um am

1791
01:14:51,679 --> 01:14:54,480
concerned about with like taking jobs. U

1792
01:14:54,480 --> 01:14:56,880
my sister is a graphic designer and she

1793
01:14:56,880 --> 01:14:58,800
studied at BYU Idaho and she got her

1794
01:14:58,800 --> 01:15:02,480
graphic design um degree there and she

1795
01:15:02,480 --> 01:15:05,679
works in an office where Claude is

1796
01:15:05,679 --> 01:15:07,600
projected to like the Claude AI is

1797
01:15:07,600 --> 01:15:10,960
projected to take her job and um she has

1798
01:15:10,960 --> 01:15:12,239
her best friend who she works with who

1799
01:15:12,239 --> 01:15:15,280
has also lost jobs um because of AI. And

1800
01:15:15,280 --> 01:15:16,640
I know that like we're not going to be

1801
01:15:16,640 --> 01:15:18,400
able to completely get rid of AI and I

1802
01:15:18,400 --> 01:15:19,679
don't think we should. It's very helpful

1803
01:15:19,679 --> 01:15:23,120
in a lot of ways. Um, but I just would

1804
01:15:23,120 --> 01:15:26,000
urge you to be mindful of the way that

1805
01:15:26,000 --> 01:15:28,800
it could influence the job market here,

1806
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:31,920
especially with Provo being um full of

1807
01:15:31,920 --> 01:15:34,159
so many young people with with BYU with

1808
01:15:34,159 --> 01:15:36,400
being close to UVU and young people

1809
01:15:36,400 --> 01:15:38,000
trying to go into the workforce and it

1810
01:15:38,000 --> 01:15:42,000
eliminating a lot of um like entry level

1811
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:44,800
jobs because like it it can take over a

1812
01:15:44,800 --> 01:15:46,480
lot of data entry jobs and things like

1813
01:15:46,480 --> 01:15:48,480
that. So, I just would urge you guys to

1814
01:15:48,480 --> 01:15:51,280
be aware of that and um vote against it.

1815
01:15:51,280 --> 01:15:53,120
So, thank you so much for your time.

1816
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:56,709
>> Thank you.

1817
01:15:56,719 --> 01:16:02,070
» You better hurry, Adam.

1818
01:16:02,080 --> 01:16:04,000
» I want to run, but I'm I know we're

1819
01:16:04,000 --> 01:16:05,600
going to move on. Uh my name is Adam

1820
01:16:05,600 --> 01:16:07,600
Shin. I live here in Provo, Utah. Um and

1821
01:16:07,600 --> 01:16:10,640
I I think it's uh it is it it's good

1822
01:16:10,640 --> 01:16:13,840
that a lot of people are caring and and very interested in the in the water

1823
01:16:13,840 --> 01:16:16,239
conservation issue. We have a real uh we

1824
01:16:16,239 --> 01:16:17,840
live in a desert. Uh we do need to

1825
01:16:17,840 --> 01:16:21,040
conserve water. Um it is a very strong

1826
01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:22,480
uh an important thing to consider out

1827
01:16:22,480 --> 01:16:23,920
here. Uh especially as we're looking

1828
01:16:23,920 --> 01:16:25,600
ahead to the future of Utah Lake and the

1829
01:16:25,600 --> 01:16:27,280
Great Salt Lake and the future of of you

1830
01:16:27,280 --> 01:16:30,000
know how um just the livability of this

1831
01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:32,080
area really depends on how we uh think

1832
01:16:32,080 --> 01:16:33,840
about the environment. Um and for those

1833
01:16:33,840 --> 01:16:35,360
who are here uh concerned about that

1834
01:16:35,360 --> 01:16:37,520
water issue, I would I you this is kind

1835
01:16:37,520 --> 01:16:39,520
of a side side point, but I do want to

1836
01:16:39,520 --> 01:16:41,440
um just raise a thought that we have a

1837
01:16:41,440 --> 01:16:44,000
lot of at the state level um we have

1838
01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:46,719
programs that actually will help with uh

1839
01:16:46,719 --> 01:16:48,000
water conservation here at the

1840
01:16:48,000 --> 01:16:50,800
neighborhood level. Um I think the you

1841
01:16:50,800 --> 01:16:52,080
know the the numbers that have been put

1842
01:16:52,080 --> 01:16:53,840
out for just you know like a car wash as

1843
01:16:53,840 --> 01:16:55,760
a point of comparison. Um, I think the

1844
01:16:55,760 --> 01:16:57,280
napkin math for that is, you know, you

1845
01:16:57,280 --> 01:16:58,880
can compare that to about maybe a few

1846
01:16:58,880 --> 01:17:00,719
dozen yards being watered in in the

1847
01:17:00,719 --> 01:17:02,560
summer for one data center of this of

1848
01:17:02,560 --> 01:17:04,159
this size. You know, taking those

1849
01:17:04,159 --> 01:17:06,239
numbers at face value, uh, which just to

1850
01:17:06,239 --> 01:17:08,000
put into perspective, there's a lot of

1851
01:17:08,000 --> 01:17:09,440
water that we use for a lot of other

1852
01:17:09,440 --> 01:17:12,080
things. Um, currently, right, um, the

1853
01:17:12,080 --> 01:17:13,600
state currently has programs that will

1854
01:17:13,600 --> 01:17:15,120
help with things like zeroscaping and

1855
01:17:15,120 --> 01:17:17,280
reducing water usage in uh, in

1856
01:17:17,280 --> 01:17:18,719
residential, like your front lawn, if

1857
01:17:18,719 --> 01:17:19,760
you want to replace that with something

1858
01:17:19,760 --> 01:17:21,199
that's a lower water usage than just

1859
01:17:21,199 --> 01:17:24,560
grass. Um and in the past we Provo City

1860
01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:27,040
actually has not adopted those um those

1861
01:17:27,040 --> 01:17:29,840
state programs uh under the the argument

1862
01:17:29,840 --> 01:17:31,440
that we have enough water to supply and

1863
01:17:31,440 --> 01:17:32,960
we don't feel the need to to conserve

1864
01:17:32,960 --> 01:17:34,800
those those uh that water for that kind

1865
01:17:34,800 --> 01:17:36,640
of stuff. So if this is an issue that

1866
01:17:36,640 --> 01:17:38,400
matters to you, I'd encourage you to um

1867
01:17:38,400 --> 01:17:40,080
to look into that program and and and

1868
01:17:40,080 --> 01:17:41,280
talk to your city council

1869
01:17:41,280 --> 01:17:42,480
representatives about the potential of

1870
01:17:42,480 --> 01:17:44,800
adopting a program like that. Um there

1871
01:17:44,800 --> 01:17:47,360
are many many many blocks in Provo um

1872
01:17:47,360 --> 01:17:49,520
that we could save a lot of water on by

1873
01:17:49,520 --> 01:17:50,800
uh taking advantage of a program that

1874
01:17:50,800 --> 01:17:52,880
already exists and would help a lot of

1875
01:17:52,880 --> 01:17:54,159
people to lower their water bills in

1876
01:17:54,159 --> 01:17:56,000
addition to conserving overall. So thank

1877
01:17:56,000 --> 01:17:58,880
you.

1878
01:17:58,880 --> 01:18:00,320
>> All right, we're going to close public

1879
01:18:00,320 --> 01:18:02,640
comment and on that note, Provo has its

1880
01:18:02,640 --> 01:18:04,800
own water conservation program and right

1881
01:18:04,800 --> 01:18:06,719
now we're doing the exceed exchange so

1882
01:18:06,719 --> 01:18:10,000
that you can put more water friendly

1883
01:18:10,000 --> 01:18:11,679
grass in your yard. So know that we do

1884
01:18:11,679 --> 01:18:13,199
have our own program. So feel free to

1885
01:18:13,199 --> 01:18:16,400
reach out to public works for that. All

1886
01:18:16,400 --> 01:18:20,560
right. Um we let developer speak. So um

1887
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:21,840
I kind of helped you out there so you

1888
01:18:21,840 --> 01:18:23,440
can hear all the comments. I you can

1889
01:18:23,440 --> 01:18:28,390
reply to them.

1890
01:18:28,400 --> 01:18:29,199
» This one. Yeah.

1891
01:18:29,199 --> 01:18:31,120
>> There we go. So my name is Steve Styler.

1892
01:18:31,120 --> 01:18:33,360
I represent the applicant B plusfonogus

1893
01:18:33,360 --> 01:18:35,520
tech. Uh

1894
01:18:35,520 --> 01:18:37,760
anecdotally a really interesting

1895
01:18:37,760 --> 01:18:40,480
question. I sat through a separate um

1896
01:18:40,480 --> 01:18:42,159
land use entitlement for a data center

1897
01:18:42,159 --> 01:18:43,600
somewhere else and someone asked the

1898
01:18:43,600 --> 01:18:46,640
question of AI what does a data center

1899
01:18:46,640 --> 01:18:48,640
look like and I will warn you that's a

1900
01:18:48,640 --> 01:18:50,320
dangerous question because it produced

1901
01:18:50,320 --> 01:18:52,800
what looked like the Taj Mahal and I

1902
01:18:52,800 --> 01:18:54,560
felt like that was unfair to ask AI

1903
01:18:54,560 --> 01:18:56,400
where it would like to live because it

1904
01:18:56,400 --> 01:18:58,159
could design a palace for itself to

1905
01:18:58,159 --> 01:18:59,120
live.

1906
01:18:59,120 --> 01:19:01,199
Uh this has been a really interesting

1907
01:19:01,199 --> 01:19:03,199
project to be working on and I should

1908
01:19:03,199 --> 01:19:05,840
introduce Rain Smith is with me. Uh he's

1909
01:19:05,840 --> 01:19:09,040
principal with B+ Tech. Just a couple of

1910
01:19:09,040 --> 01:19:10,880
things for perspective and I appreciate

1911
01:19:10,880 --> 01:19:13,199
the time working with Provo City. We've

1912
01:19:13,199 --> 01:19:15,760
been at this now for about a year to to

1913
01:19:15,760 --> 01:19:18,159
look through how do we do this and how

1914
01:19:18,159 --> 01:19:20,480
might we build out this project. This

1915
01:19:20,480 --> 01:19:24,320
property was acquired in 2017 as part of

1916
01:19:24,320 --> 01:19:26,960
the entire Noville campus. This hasn't

1917
01:19:26,960 --> 01:19:29,280
this wasn't recently bought to turn into

1918
01:19:29,280 --> 01:19:31,199
a data center. This was something that's

1919
01:19:31,199 --> 01:19:34,000
been developed over a long time process.

1920
01:19:34,000 --> 01:19:36,560
Um [clears throat] and and just to give

1921
01:19:36,560 --> 01:19:38,960
a little bit of history and and I would

1922
01:19:38,960 --> 01:19:40,400
like to say kudos to those who have

1923
01:19:40,400 --> 01:19:42,159
spoken here today. It take gut it takes

1924
01:19:42,159 --> 01:19:43,760
guts to show up at a city council

1925
01:19:43,760 --> 01:19:46,880
meeting um and speak and we appreciate

1926
01:19:46,880 --> 01:19:48,239
those comments. One of the things that

1927
01:19:48,239 --> 01:19:50,719
we've really tried hard to do in working

1928
01:19:50,719 --> 01:19:52,560
with the city and with the planning

1929
01:19:52,560 --> 01:19:54,960
department and going through planning

1930
01:19:54,960 --> 01:19:56,800
commission, I I know many of you

1931
01:19:56,800 --> 01:19:58,000
probably listened to the planning

1932
01:19:58,000 --> 01:20:01,440
commission. It was long and it was very

1933
01:20:01,440 --> 01:20:03,920
well done. We talked about water, we

1934
01:20:03,920 --> 01:20:05,679
talked about energy, we talked about

1935
01:20:05,679 --> 01:20:07,360
overall impacts, we talked about

1936
01:20:07,360 --> 01:20:09,440
parking, we talked we talked about

1937
01:20:09,440 --> 01:20:11,120
everything. And I thought that it was a

1938
01:20:11,120 --> 01:20:13,199
really meaningful conversation and from

1939
01:20:13,199 --> 01:20:16,880
that we've we've learned because at the

1940
01:20:16,880 --> 01:20:18,560
end of the day we're trying to do a

1941
01:20:18,560 --> 01:20:20,719
really awesome development for Provo

1942
01:20:20,719 --> 01:20:23,440
City. If we come in and we disrupt air

1943
01:20:23,440 --> 01:20:25,679
quality, we disrupt water conservation

1944
01:20:25,679 --> 01:20:28,239
efforts, we disrupt power, we haven't

1945
01:20:28,239 --> 01:20:30,159
done our job because that's not what

1946
01:20:30,159 --> 01:20:32,719
this is about. This project has been

1947
01:20:32,719 --> 01:20:35,040
designed to do something that is part of

1948
01:20:35,040 --> 01:20:37,920
a critical

1949
01:20:37,920 --> 01:20:40,080
re-engineering and a different thought

1950
01:20:40,080 --> 01:20:42,080
process of how we might utilize this

1951
01:20:42,080 --> 01:20:44,239
property in a better way. Um, many of

1952
01:20:44,239 --> 01:20:45,840
you are familiar with this. Obviously,

1953
01:20:45,840 --> 01:20:47,600
there is a hotel that's directly to the

1954
01:20:47,600 --> 01:20:50,320
west. Um, we have a great relationship,

1955
01:20:50,320 --> 01:20:52,159
a comment was made about uh Rocky

1956
01:20:52,159 --> 01:20:53,600
Mountain University. We have a great

1957
01:20:53,600 --> 01:20:56,400
relationship with them. Um they they did

1958
01:20:56,400 --> 01:20:58,080
not to our knowledge have not approached

1959
01:20:58,080 --> 01:21:00,400
us about utilizing any of the existing

1960
01:21:00,400 --> 01:21:01,760
buildings on the property. If they did,

1961
01:21:01,760 --> 01:21:03,360
we'd love to have that conversation with

1962
01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:06,800
them. Um as far as water, and if it's

1963
01:21:06,800 --> 01:21:08,880
okay, uh council members, I'll I'll just

1964
01:21:08,880 --> 01:21:10,159
address some of the concerns when we

1965
01:21:10,159 --> 01:21:12,080
talk more about the project. First and

1966
01:21:12,080 --> 01:21:13,600
foremost is water. It's the thing we've

1967
01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:16,239
heard the very very most about just

1968
01:21:16,239 --> 01:21:18,480
ahead of energy. We kind of keep track

1969
01:21:18,480 --> 01:21:20,719
of what we hear the most about. One of

1970
01:21:20,719 --> 01:21:25,920
the neat things about this piece of of ground of this property is its

1971
01:21:25,920 --> 01:21:27,360
proximity to the water treatment

1972
01:21:27,360 --> 01:21:30,159
facility. When we started looking at

1973
01:21:30,159 --> 01:21:32,239
this working with Provo Power and with

1974
01:21:32,239 --> 01:21:34,560
Provo City, uh the water treatment

1975
01:21:34,560 --> 01:21:37,120
facility reached out to us. Um there is

1976
01:21:37,120 --> 01:21:38,640
a product and and if you've listened to

1977
01:21:38,640 --> 01:21:40,239
city council, there was discussion about

1978
01:21:40,239 --> 01:21:42,480
silver water. I literally had never

1979
01:21:42,480 --> 01:21:44,000
heard about silver water and I've done

1980
01:21:44,000 --> 01:21:46,080
water most of my career. I didn't know

1981
01:21:46,080 --> 01:21:48,480
that was a thing. Um, but what it is is

1982
01:21:48,480 --> 01:21:50,159
it's a treated water that cannot be

1983
01:21:50,159 --> 01:21:52,080
released back into a water system

1984
01:21:52,080 --> 01:21:53,840
because of the contaminants, potential

1985
01:21:53,840 --> 01:21:55,760
contaminants it has. One of the things

1986
01:21:55,760 --> 01:21:57,920
is we've identified is that we actually

1987
01:21:57,920 --> 01:22:01,120
think that water um and the early

1988
01:22:01,120 --> 01:22:02,800
engineering shows that we could actually

1989
01:22:02,800 --> 01:22:04,880
use that as part of our closed loop

1990
01:22:04,880 --> 01:22:07,840
system. Um, again trying to help Provo

1991
01:22:07,840 --> 01:22:09,440
City where we can. If that that's a

1992
01:22:09,440 --> 01:22:10,960
problem and the amount of silver water

1993
01:22:10,960 --> 01:22:13,360
and we don't know where to put it, we

1994
01:22:13,360 --> 01:22:15,760
would love to be a customer and pay for

1995
01:22:15,760 --> 01:22:17,360
that water and be able to utilize it

1996
01:22:17,360 --> 01:22:20,400
within the facility. Our intention is

1997
01:22:20,400 --> 01:22:22,239
for this water and what we agreed in the

1998
01:22:22,239 --> 01:22:24,239
planning commission and as part of the

1999
01:22:24,239 --> 01:22:25,440
development agreement we've worked

2000
01:22:25,440 --> 01:22:28,080
closely with Brian to try to propose how

2001
01:22:28,080 --> 01:22:30,560
we might bind ourselves if this project

2002
01:22:30,560 --> 01:22:32,560
moves forward is that we would never

2003
01:22:32,560 --> 01:22:34,080
discharge any of that water anywhere

2004
01:22:34,080 --> 01:22:36,400
within the city system. It does contain

2005
01:22:36,400 --> 01:22:38,080
glycol and other cooling agents. It's

2006
01:22:38,080 --> 01:22:39,520
not suitable to put back into the

2007
01:22:39,520 --> 01:22:42,400
system. We won't go there. We maybe the

2008
01:22:42,400 --> 01:22:43,840
analog to that would be what you would

2009
01:22:43,840 --> 01:22:45,360
see at a restaurant. You also don't dump

2010
01:22:45,360 --> 01:22:46,800
the grease. you have a third party

2011
01:22:46,800 --> 01:22:48,880
vendor that comes and collects the

2012
01:22:48,880 --> 01:22:51,199
grease from a fryer and not it's the

2013
01:22:51,199 --> 01:22:52,719
same but it's the same type of process.

2014
01:22:52,719 --> 01:22:54,239
We would never discharge that back into

2015
01:22:54,239 --> 01:22:55,679
the city system.

2016
01:22:55,679 --> 01:22:59,360
>> Um as far as filling that's a process um

2017
01:22:59,360 --> 01:23:01,760
that we we work with our engineers as we

2018
01:23:01,760 --> 01:23:04,000
design this on the frequency. It's

2019
01:23:04,000 --> 01:23:06,560
something that would happen probably two

2020
01:23:06,560 --> 01:23:09,600
to three years. Um, again depending on

2021
01:23:09,600 --> 01:23:11,679
the engineering, but again, we're trying

2022
01:23:11,679 --> 01:23:14,480
to utilize that silver water so that we

2023
01:23:14,480 --> 01:23:16,400
it's not such a draw upon the city

2024
01:23:16,400 --> 01:23:18,159
system. Again, we're trying to make sure

2025
01:23:18,159 --> 01:23:20,000
that we're doing it as responsibly as we

2026
01:23:20,000 --> 01:23:22,320
can without placing a drain on existing

2027
01:23:22,320 --> 01:23:25,760
resources. Um, second most popular topic

2028
01:23:25,760 --> 01:23:28,400
is power. What are we going to do? Are

2029
01:23:28,400 --> 01:23:30,719
we going to ruin Provo City's power

2030
01:23:30,719 --> 01:23:33,120
system? Are we going to be this big draw

2031
01:23:33,120 --> 01:23:35,679
on the system? Um the building that you

2032
01:23:35,679 --> 01:23:38,000
see and the renderings that were there,

2033
01:23:38,000 --> 01:23:40,719
those were produced about a year ago

2034
01:23:40,719 --> 01:23:42,880
when we started to look and get a feel

2035
01:23:42,880 --> 01:23:45,120
for what this would look like. And the

2036
01:23:45,120 --> 01:23:47,679
reason that we we considered this for a

2037
01:23:47,679 --> 01:23:51,120
small neocloud type facility was because

2038
01:23:51,120 --> 01:23:54,080
of the existing power in infrastructure

2039
01:23:54,080 --> 01:23:56,800
that is already being delivered to this

2040
01:23:56,800 --> 01:23:58,960
property and to this campus. While

2041
01:23:58,960 --> 01:24:01,040
working with Provo Power, we we asked

2042
01:24:01,040 --> 01:24:03,840
the question, how much power is already

2043
01:24:03,840 --> 01:24:06,080
there. There's already a building there,

2044
01:24:06,080 --> 01:24:07,760
right? There's multiple buildings and a

2045
01:24:07,760 --> 01:24:10,080
campus that sits there. And the number

2046
01:24:10,080 --> 01:24:12,159
that we came back with was 6 to 10

2047
01:24:12,159 --> 01:24:14,480
megawatts of power that literally is

2048
01:24:14,480 --> 01:24:17,040
there. That's already allocated to this

2049
01:24:17,040 --> 01:24:20,639
property. Um that conversation moved

2050
01:24:20,639 --> 01:24:22,400
forward to what if you looked at doing

2051
01:24:22,400 --> 01:24:25,120
generation on on property? could you do

2052
01:24:25,120 --> 01:24:27,600
something to generate natural gas fired

2053
01:24:27,600 --> 01:24:30,080
power to build a bigger facility and

2054
01:24:30,080 --> 01:24:31,760
that's largely the product that you see

2055
01:24:31,760 --> 01:24:33,280
on the screen today is that bigger

2056
01:24:33,280 --> 01:24:37,600
facility as we we walked with um Provo

2057
01:24:37,600 --> 01:24:40,159
City as we you all considered a new data

2058
01:24:40,159 --> 01:24:42,560
center overlay ordinance. We tried to

2059
01:24:42,560 --> 01:24:45,040
work with the city to to make sure that

2060
01:24:45,040 --> 01:24:46,880
we knew what was happening and that we

2061
01:24:46,880 --> 01:24:49,440
could participate and help. Um and along

2062
01:24:49,440 --> 01:24:51,760
the way we realized hey this is a

2063
01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:53,600
simpler process. We ought to just look

2064
01:24:53,600 --> 01:24:57,280
at the power that's already there on

2065
01:24:57,280 --> 01:24:59,120
that site. We can have other

2066
01:24:59,120 --> 01:25:01,120
conversations other days about whether

2067
01:25:01,120 --> 01:25:03,840
we want to grow with the city or whether

2068
01:25:03,840 --> 01:25:06,480
we work with UMPA or Provo City. And so

2069
01:25:06,480 --> 01:25:08,159
the application you have in front of you

2070
01:25:08,159 --> 01:25:10,719
is to create a data center overlay, but

2071
01:25:10,719 --> 01:25:13,360
for us to look at only effectively the

2072
01:25:13,360 --> 01:25:16,639
power that's already on this site. Um we

2073
01:25:16,639 --> 01:25:19,199
believe we'd be a great customer. Um,

2074
01:25:19,199 --> 01:25:21,199
Provo Power spoke in support of this at

2075
01:25:21,199 --> 01:25:23,440
the planning commission. Um, because the

2076
01:25:23,440 --> 01:25:26,239
power is there and not being utilized

2077
01:25:26,239 --> 01:25:28,000
and we think that we could utilize it

2078
01:25:28,000 --> 01:25:29,840
and create, you know, a good revenue

2079
01:25:29,840 --> 01:25:33,199
stream for the city. One additional item

2080
01:25:33,199 --> 01:25:34,880
we hear, we heard a lot at the planning

2081
01:25:34,880 --> 01:25:37,679
commission. People said, "What's in this

2082
01:25:37,679 --> 01:25:40,239
for Provo? Why does this matter to

2083
01:25:40,239 --> 01:25:42,800
Provo? It's not creating a hundred

2084
01:25:42,800 --> 01:25:44,880
million dollar a year jobs and those

2085
01:25:44,880 --> 01:25:46,239
types of things." And that's where I

2086
01:25:46,239 --> 01:25:48,159
think a lot of people wonder what this

2087
01:25:48,159 --> 01:25:51,360
what what's in it for Provo. Um, one of

2088
01:25:51,360 --> 01:25:52,960
the things that is interesting about a

2089
01:25:52,960 --> 01:25:54,719
data center like this one, the model

2090
01:25:54,719 --> 01:25:56,159
that you've seen on the screen would be

2091
01:25:56,159 --> 01:25:59,120
about a $300 million building to build.

2092
01:25:59,120 --> 01:26:01,040
Um,

2093
01:26:01,040 --> 01:26:04,080
so and we could get way into the weeds

2094
01:26:04,080 --> 01:26:05,920
on the taxing authority and how much I

2095
01:26:05,920 --> 01:26:08,480
could ask the city uh treasurer to come

2096
01:26:08,480 --> 01:26:11,360
tell me what the numbers might be, but

2097
01:26:11,360 --> 01:26:13,199
run through the scenario with me from a

2098
01:26:13,199 --> 01:26:15,440
taxing authority standpoint. Not getting

2099
01:26:15,440 --> 01:26:16,960
into the weeds of how much goes to the

2100
01:26:16,960 --> 01:26:18,719
county and the school district, but this

2101
01:26:18,719 --> 01:26:21,840
property at a $300 million construction

2102
01:26:21,840 --> 01:26:23,679
of this building if we were to build the

2103
01:26:23,679 --> 01:26:26,480
building that you've all considered. Um,

2104
01:26:26,480 --> 01:26:28,239
inside of it, we would put the rule of

2105
01:26:28,239 --> 01:26:30,159
thumb is between three and four times

2106
01:26:30,159 --> 01:26:31,520
the value of the building would go

2107
01:26:31,520 --> 01:26:33,679
inside as far as the the components, the

2108
01:26:33,679 --> 01:26:38,000
GPUs and other AI um equipment. If we

2109
01:26:38,000 --> 01:26:39,600
add those things together, which would

2110
01:26:39,600 --> 01:26:42,080
all be taxable as either real property

2111
01:26:42,080 --> 01:26:44,400
or taxable personal property, we're

2112
01:26:44,400 --> 01:26:47,360
somewhere in the ballpark between 1.2

2113
01:26:47,360 --> 01:26:49,600
billion and 1.4

2114
01:26:49,600 --> 01:26:52,000
billion dollars of new taxable value to

2115
01:26:52,000 --> 01:26:54,560
the to the taxing authority. Obviously,

2116
01:26:54,560 --> 01:26:56,239
Provo would get their share of that, the

2117
01:26:56,239 --> 01:26:57,600
county would get their share, the school

2118
01:26:57,600 --> 01:27:00,239
district would get their share. Um, from

2119
01:27:00,239 --> 01:27:02,480
an investment standpoint, it's it's

2120
01:27:02,480 --> 01:27:05,840
pretty significant on a pretty all

2121
01:27:05,840 --> 01:27:08,000
things considered small piece of dirt

2122
01:27:08,000 --> 01:27:09,600
because of the value of the the

2123
01:27:09,600 --> 01:27:11,440
components that are there. One of the

2124
01:27:11,440 --> 01:27:13,520
comments that was made was uh on the

2125
01:27:13,520 --> 01:27:15,920
property tax base, they they only get

2126
01:27:15,920 --> 01:27:17,600
new property tax when they build another

2127
01:27:17,600 --> 01:27:20,080
one. The question gets asked, well, what

2128
01:27:20,080 --> 01:27:22,239
about the GPUs? They're just computers.

2129
01:27:22,239 --> 01:27:24,800
They, you know, they depreciate quickly.

2130
01:27:24,800 --> 01:27:27,760
They do, and they depreciate along with

2131
01:27:27,760 --> 01:27:29,920
their their life cycle. And what would

2132
01:27:29,920 --> 01:27:31,920
happen within this facility or any other

2133
01:27:31,920 --> 01:27:34,320
hyperscaler is you are constantly

2134
01:27:34,320 --> 01:27:36,800
rotating and bringing in new equipment.

2135
01:27:36,800 --> 01:27:40,239
So you have instead of a a a landslide

2136
01:27:40,239 --> 01:27:43,040
downward progression of property tax um

2137
01:27:43,040 --> 01:27:45,679
you actually do a little bounce because

2138
01:27:45,679 --> 01:27:47,760
every 3 to five years those compu those

2139
01:27:47,760 --> 01:27:49,600
components are being replaced and you

2140
01:27:49,600 --> 01:27:51,920
start over from a tax standpoint. So

2141
01:27:51,920 --> 01:27:54,080
it's a fairly reliable property tax to

2142
01:27:54,080 --> 01:27:56,239
the taxing authority.

2143
01:27:56,239 --> 01:27:59,510
Um

2144
01:27:59,520 --> 01:28:02,080
as part of the ownership of this entire

2145
01:28:02,080 --> 01:28:05,440
kind of campus, the idea that we are

2146
01:28:05,440 --> 01:28:08,719
proposing to the council to consider is

2147
01:28:08,719 --> 01:28:11,679
that that we are allowed to develop this

2148
01:28:11,679 --> 01:28:14,480
as kind of backbone infrastructure. We

2149
01:28:14,480 --> 01:28:16,560
too we understand the council is

2150
01:28:16,560 --> 01:28:18,400
considering an economic study to see

2151
01:28:18,400 --> 01:28:19,840
what are the best things and right

2152
01:28:19,840 --> 01:28:22,159
things that are here. From our

2153
01:28:22,159 --> 01:28:24,960
perspective, this is a fantastic anchor

2154
01:28:24,960 --> 01:28:28,080
tenant or backbone infrastructure. Uh

2155
01:28:28,080 --> 01:28:30,000
we've heard people suggest this would be

2156
01:28:30,000 --> 01:28:33,360
a great site for technology or biomed or

2157
01:28:33,360 --> 01:28:35,840
other types of businesses. We agree with

2158
01:28:35,840 --> 01:28:38,880
that and what we're finding and what we

2159
01:28:38,880 --> 01:28:40,800
believe will happen is that those

2160
01:28:40,800 --> 01:28:43,520
companies that come to this area will

2161
01:28:43,520 --> 01:28:46,400
also become our customers. That is the

2162
01:28:46,400 --> 01:28:48,080
way that this is being structured and

2163
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:50,560
we're developing this property is

2164
01:28:50,560 --> 01:28:52,080
putting in some of that critical

2165
01:28:52,080 --> 01:28:55,840
infrastructure first so that we have the

2166
01:28:55,840 --> 01:28:57,840
key needs for future development comes

2167
01:28:57,840 --> 01:29:02,960
to this to this area in this campus. We love Provo. We've the the property

2168
01:29:02,960 --> 01:29:05,600
owners have been um good stewards of

2169
01:29:05,600 --> 01:29:07,679
this land and feel like this is a great

2170
01:29:07,679 --> 01:29:10,159
opportunity to provide some value to

2171
01:29:10,159 --> 01:29:14,560
Provo, provide a a a gateway access into

2172
01:29:14,560 --> 01:29:16,800
this new emerging technology as part of

2173
01:29:16,800 --> 01:29:19,040
a of a great redevelopment of this of

2174
01:29:19,040 --> 01:29:22,159
this area. Um I'm happy to answer any

2175
01:29:22,159 --> 01:29:23,520
questions. I know I've kind of rambled

2176
01:29:23,520 --> 01:29:25,840
on and I don't intend to, but I'm happy

2177
01:29:25,840 --> 01:29:27,120
to answer any questions.

2178
01:29:27,120 --> 01:29:29,040
>> Okay. Thank you. Any questions for the

2179
01:29:29,040 --> 01:29:32,070
developer?

2180
01:29:32,080 --> 01:29:36,790
No. Okay. Thank you so much.

2181
01:29:36,800 --> 01:29:40,390
What?

2182
01:29:40,400 --> 01:29:42,639
All right. Council discussion. Any

2183
01:29:42,639 --> 01:29:46,080
council discussion on this item?

2184
01:29:46,080 --> 01:29:50,149
Councelor Bogdan.

2185
01:29:50,159 --> 01:29:53,280
Okay. Um the one thing that we hear over

2186
01:29:53,280 --> 01:29:55,600
and over and over again and we've read a

2187
01:29:55,600 --> 01:29:57,920
lot of emails and we've studied this for

2188
01:29:57,920 --> 01:30:00,639
a long time. Data centers is something

2189
01:30:00,639 --> 01:30:03,040
that the council has been studying for a

2190
01:30:03,040 --> 01:30:04,639
while and we came up with a data center

2191
01:30:04,639 --> 01:30:06,239
policy

2192
01:30:06,239 --> 01:30:09,199
last fall. This is something that our

2193
01:30:09,199 --> 01:30:11,520
energy department has been studying.

2194
01:30:11,520 --> 01:30:14,800
This is something that um Utah Municipal

2195
01:30:14,800 --> 01:30:17,679
Power has been studying for a long time

2196
01:30:17,679 --> 01:30:20,000
that they came up with a policy because

2197
01:30:20,000 --> 01:30:22,080
those things that you're worried about,

2198
01:30:22,080 --> 01:30:24,639
so are our people. And so they did dig

2199
01:30:24,639 --> 01:30:27,520
in pretty hard to look at how to protect

2200
01:30:27,520 --> 01:30:30,480
Provo residents and Provo citizens. Um

2201
01:30:30,480 --> 01:30:32,000
there is a development agreement with

2202
01:30:32,000 --> 01:30:36,000
this. So I won't be voting yes on this,

2203
01:30:36,000 --> 01:30:37,520
but I do want to send the message to

2204
01:30:37,520 --> 01:30:41,199
Provo that Provo residents that these

2205
01:30:41,199 --> 01:30:43,040
are things that we have been looking at

2206
01:30:43,040 --> 01:30:45,760
for a really long time. And it's not

2207
01:30:45,760 --> 01:30:48,880
like if a data center is passed in Provo

2208
01:30:48,880 --> 01:30:51,760
that we're selling you all out because

2209
01:30:51,760 --> 01:30:53,280
energy is something that we've looked

2210
01:30:53,280 --> 01:30:55,280
at. Water is something that we've looked

2211
01:30:55,280 --> 01:30:57,679
at.

2212
01:30:57,679 --> 01:30:59,360
There is a lot more that goes into a

2213
01:30:59,360 --> 01:31:02,400
data center besides energy and water.

2214
01:31:02,400 --> 01:31:05,679
But these are things that we have looked

2215
01:31:05,679 --> 01:31:08,320
at and that we know about and that we

2216
01:31:08,320 --> 01:31:15,750
have gotten on top of. Thanks.

2217
01:31:15,760 --> 01:31:17,520
» All right. Are we ready for a vote on

2218
01:31:17,520 --> 01:31:20,400
the implied motion?

2219
01:31:20,400 --> 01:31:24,239
>> I see no other comments if Craig wants

2220
01:31:24,239 --> 01:31:27,120
to talk. Councelor Hoben

2221
01:31:27,120 --> 01:31:29,440
>> for me. So, there's a lot of arguments

2222
01:31:29,440 --> 01:31:31,760
out there for or against. Um, I think

2223
01:31:31,760 --> 01:31:34,000
probably the one that resonated the best

2224
01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:35,600
with me came from some of my fellow

2225
01:31:35,600 --> 01:31:37,920
council members, which was basically

2226
01:31:37,920 --> 01:31:39,440
that

2227
01:31:39,440 --> 01:31:43,120
we aren't exactly sure. This is this is

2228
01:31:43,120 --> 01:31:45,280
a big decision in regards to land use.

2229
01:31:45,280 --> 01:31:46,719
So, that's what it comes down to for the

2230
01:31:46,719 --> 01:31:51,199
most part for me is is that we this is a

2231
01:31:51,199 --> 01:31:54,239
big area of redevelopment for us and so

2232
01:31:54,239 --> 01:31:56,880
it's a it's a long-term decision and we

2233
01:31:56,880 --> 01:31:58,000
want to make sure we make the right

2234
01:31:58,000 --> 01:31:59,520
decision for this area. Now we

2235
01:31:59,520 --> 01:32:01,679
understand nobody else is suiting this

2236
01:32:01,679 --> 01:32:04,080
particular property right now. Um so we

2237
01:32:04,080 --> 01:32:07,679
kind of have what we have. Um but long

2238
01:32:07,679 --> 01:32:10,880
term is is this what we want in the area

2239
01:32:10,880 --> 01:32:13,280
as opposed to retail or hospitality or

2240
01:32:13,280 --> 01:32:17,360
something else. So I think that's the the

2241
01:32:17,360 --> 01:32:19,360
piece of the puzzle that kind of

2242
01:32:19,360 --> 01:32:21,600
resonates the best with me is like we're

2243
01:32:21,600 --> 01:32:23,120
going to do this economic development

2244
01:32:23,120 --> 01:32:25,520
study. We're going to see what the city

2245
01:32:25,520 --> 01:32:28,480
wants to be when it grows up and then

2246
01:32:28,480 --> 01:32:29,679
we'll be able to make a decision

2247
01:32:29,679 --> 01:32:31,440
regarding this parcel and it might be a

2248
01:32:31,440 --> 01:32:33,199
data center, it might not depending on

2249
01:32:33,199 --> 01:32:35,440
what we get back, right? And so just

2250
01:32:35,440 --> 01:32:37,840
having that information before we make

2251
01:32:37,840 --> 01:32:41,840
the leap I think um

2252
01:32:41,840 --> 01:32:43,280
though you know of course I always

2253
01:32:43,280 --> 01:32:45,120
appreciate the burden the the birden

2254
01:32:45,120 --> 01:32:46,719
hand over the two you know two in the

2255
01:32:46,719 --> 01:32:49,520
bush but um it's a big decision to make

2256
01:32:49,520 --> 01:32:52,800
so I can appreciate that.

2257
01:32:52,800 --> 01:32:55,360
Councelor Christensen.

2258
01:32:55,360 --> 01:32:57,760
>> Well, I think it is a u a big decision

2259
01:32:57,760 --> 01:33:01,760
and um I would just say to those um

2260
01:33:01,760 --> 01:33:03,360
citizens who have come and shared their

2261
01:33:03,360 --> 01:33:04,880
perspective

2262
01:33:04,880 --> 01:33:07,280
um we have heard from many many and

2263
01:33:07,280 --> 01:33:10,719
talked with many of you uh about this.

2264
01:33:10,719 --> 01:33:13,280
Um some people ask you know why is Provo

2265
01:33:13,280 --> 01:33:15,280
considering this? It's because people

2266
01:33:15,280 --> 01:33:17,760
have property rights and they can

2267
01:33:17,760 --> 01:33:19,760
petition for what'sever within the code

2268
01:33:19,760 --> 01:33:22,400
or they can petition to change, you

2269
01:33:22,400 --> 01:33:26,560
know, um code. Um so taking a taking a

2270
01:33:26,560 --> 01:33:28,560
look at a project like this isn't a

2271
01:33:28,560 --> 01:33:31,600
moral stance. It's actually part of

2272
01:33:31,600 --> 01:33:34,480
property rights. And so the data center

2273
01:33:34,480 --> 01:33:37,520
has every right to come into Provo and

2274
01:33:37,520 --> 01:33:40,639
to make a case for any particular site

2275
01:33:40,639 --> 01:33:42,159
that is allowed, you know, through the

2276
01:33:42,159 --> 01:33:44,560
overlay. And uh this is certainly

2277
01:33:44,560 --> 01:33:47,440
allowed in the overlay. So uh to me it's

2278
01:33:47,440 --> 01:33:50,080
much less of a moral stance. Um there

2279
01:33:50,080 --> 01:33:52,400
are questions about uh water and

2280
01:33:52,400 --> 01:33:53,760
electricity and power and all those

2281
01:33:53,760 --> 01:33:56,080
kinds of things. But uh again I I would

2282
01:33:56,080 --> 01:33:58,639
just emphasize that um people have the

2283
01:33:58,639 --> 01:34:02,800
right to apply for these things. Um my

2284
01:34:02,800 --> 01:34:04,639
concern about the data center is the

2285
01:34:04,639 --> 01:34:07,760
same I had about the road width. Um, I

2286
01:34:07,760 --> 01:34:09,679
think we should move slow and I think we

2287
01:34:09,679 --> 01:34:11,679
should be very deliberate and very

2288
01:34:11,679 --> 01:34:15,040
careful because both of these items, the

2289
01:34:15,040 --> 01:34:17,120
previous item and this item are not ones

2290
01:34:17,120 --> 01:34:20,159
that you undo and I think it does make

2291
01:34:20,159 --> 01:34:24,470
sense to be careful.

2292
01:34:24,480 --> 01:34:27,199
» Any more discussion? Councelor Whitlock?

2293
01:34:27,199 --> 01:34:29,760
>> Yeah, I I really appreciate everything

2294
01:34:29,760 --> 01:34:31,360
that was shared here today. We also, I

2295
01:34:31,360 --> 01:34:33,199
think, received more emails about this

2296
01:34:33,199 --> 01:34:34,800
issue than almost any other issue than

2297
01:34:34,800 --> 01:34:36,719
at least since I've been on the council.

2298
01:34:36,719 --> 01:34:39,199
Um, to the point that councelor Hobin

2299
01:34:39,199 --> 01:34:41,360
made about we're in the middle of trying

2300
01:34:41,360 --> 01:34:42,800
to create this economic development

2301
01:34:42,800 --> 01:34:44,800
study and try to come up with a vision

2302
01:34:44,800 --> 01:34:46,400
for the area. East Bay is one of the

2303
01:34:46,400 --> 01:34:48,159
areas we're looking at in this study.

2304
01:34:48,159 --> 01:34:49,760
So, we're in kind of a transition point

2305
01:34:49,760 --> 01:34:52,400
there. Also, we're in transition with

2306
01:34:52,400 --> 01:34:54,480
Provo Power Director if I understand

2307
01:34:54,480 --> 01:34:56,239
correctly and this person would be

2308
01:34:56,239 --> 01:34:59,199
responsible who's yet to be chosen to be

2309
01:34:59,199 --> 01:35:02,400
responsible for uh implementing this and

2310
01:35:02,400 --> 01:35:04,080
making sure it's done correctly. So, I

2311
01:35:04,080 --> 01:35:05,600
think it's a I think it's a tough time

2312
01:35:05,600 --> 01:35:08,320
for this. I also think that everything

2313
01:35:08,320 --> 01:35:09,920
we do or at least I should speak for

2314
01:35:09,920 --> 01:35:11,840
myself, I do want it to be better for

2315
01:35:11,840 --> 01:35:13,679
the lives of the provo residents. And

2316
01:35:13,679 --> 01:35:17,760
while the potential um general fund

2317
01:35:17,760 --> 01:35:20,480
impact from all the additional power is

2318
01:35:20,480 --> 01:35:22,239
a good thing I think for a general fund,

2319
01:35:22,239 --> 01:35:26,639
I think that the risks outlined are are quite high. everything from the

2320
01:35:26,639 --> 01:35:29,679
sound pollution to the hotels there to

2321
01:35:29,679 --> 01:35:32,000
is this the highest and best use of land

2322
01:35:32,000 --> 01:35:36,800
to um my understanding is uh as much

2323
01:35:36,800 --> 01:35:39,920
power as this could could uh consume it

2324
01:35:39,920 --> 01:35:41,440
could I have a hard time imagining it

2325
01:35:41,440 --> 01:35:43,760
won't affect power rates I mean Provo

2326
01:35:43,760 --> 01:35:46,239
peak demand is around 200 megawws and

2327
01:35:46,239 --> 01:35:48,639
this is going to be marginal 30 to 50

2328
01:35:48,639 --> 01:35:50,080
that's a lot of marginal power

2329
01:35:50,080 --> 01:35:51,440
consumption and that power has to be

2330
01:35:51,440 --> 01:35:53,840
purchased from somewhere um so I think

2331
01:35:53,840 --> 01:35:56,000
there's a risk there and then I

2332
01:35:56,000 --> 01:35:57,840
Lastly, this kind of closed loop water

2333
01:35:57,840 --> 01:35:59,760
is a huge concern and air quality is a

2334
01:35:59,760 --> 01:36:02,400
huge concern and this closed looped uh

2335
01:36:02,400 --> 01:36:04,080
cooling system. It's hard to find

2336
01:36:04,080 --> 01:36:06,639
precedence of one working for a data

2337
01:36:06,639 --> 01:36:08,880
center this size um based on my

2338
01:36:08,880 --> 01:36:10,639
understanding. So, there's just a lot of

2339
01:36:10,639 --> 01:36:12,639
risks here. And so, I agree with what uh

2340
01:36:12,639 --> 01:36:15,440
councelor um

2341
01:36:15,440 --> 01:36:17,280
Craig Christensen just said about, you

2342
01:36:17,280 --> 01:36:19,840
know, let's uh be cautious here and make

2343
01:36:19,840 --> 01:36:21,199
sure we're not approving something that

2344
01:36:21,199 --> 01:36:24,709
we regret.

2345
01:36:24,719 --> 01:36:27,840
Um, so AI says Provo is an awesome place

2346
01:36:27,840 --> 01:36:30,639
for a data center.

2347
01:36:30,639 --> 01:36:33,600
And the reason the reason why it says it

2348
01:36:33,600 --> 01:36:37,199
is because our energy is so cheap. We

2349
01:36:37,199 --> 01:36:39,120
are so blessed to have Provo Power and

2350
01:36:39,120 --> 01:36:41,360
we're blessed to own our own power

2351
01:36:41,360 --> 01:36:44,000
company and

2352
01:36:44,000 --> 01:36:45,679
we don't put any of that at risk, right?

2353
01:36:45,679 --> 01:36:48,159
like it's one of our greatest assets and

2354
01:36:48,159 --> 01:36:49,920
it's one of the reasons why we don't

2355
01:36:49,920 --> 01:36:51,840
have to tax our citizens as much because

2356
01:36:51,840 --> 01:36:56,080
we have provoke power. So um I concur

2357
01:36:56,080 --> 01:36:58,080
with what the other counselor said. We

2358
01:36:58,080 --> 01:37:00,960
are waiting on an economic plan. Um the

2359
01:37:00,960 --> 01:37:02,880
goal of the data center is to grow in

2360
01:37:02,880 --> 01:37:05,199
the future. That is your goal and you

2361
01:37:05,199 --> 01:37:07,600
have a lot of space there to do that.

2362
01:37:07,600 --> 01:37:09,920
And um

2363
01:37:09,920 --> 01:37:12,239
the end goal is to make your own energy

2364
01:37:12,239 --> 01:37:13,199
because you'd have to make your own

2365
01:37:13,199 --> 01:37:14,800
energy as you grow which would be

2366
01:37:14,800 --> 01:37:18,239
emissions right in Provo. And I don't

2367
01:37:18,239 --> 01:37:21,040
want to do I and emissions are a huge

2368
01:37:21,040 --> 01:37:22,639
thing for me in our city. you know, we

2369
01:37:22,639 --> 01:37:24,800
have the inversion and it's just quality

2370
01:37:24,800 --> 01:37:28,880
of life issues and um I wonder about the

2371
01:37:28,880 --> 01:37:30,560
best use of the land which we need to

2372
01:37:30,560 --> 01:37:33,920
figure out with the economic plan and um

2373
01:37:33,920 --> 01:37:36,080
I do think the water solutions brilliant

2374
01:37:36,080 --> 01:37:37,600
with the silver water and stuff. I mean,

2375
01:37:37,600 --> 01:37:41,119
I'm not as worried about that. Um

2376
01:37:41,119 --> 01:37:44,159
but on the as things scale, you know,

2377
01:37:44,159 --> 01:37:47,199
that's kind of an on and on,

2378
01:37:47,199 --> 01:37:49,199
but yeah, that's where I stand. Any more

2379
01:37:49,199 --> 01:37:51,600
comments? Councelor Garrett,

2380
01:37:51,600 --> 01:37:53,840
>> having said all of that or heard all of

2381
01:37:53,840 --> 01:37:56,560
that, relative to priorities for Provo

2382
01:37:56,560 --> 01:37:59,840
City's economic development, um I I do

2383
01:37:59,840 --> 01:38:01,760
feel encouraged by the progress that

2384
01:38:01,760 --> 01:38:04,480
data centers are making relative to the

2385
01:38:04,480 --> 01:38:06,880
environment. We talked about the closed

2386
01:38:06,880 --> 01:38:09,360
loop water system, the use of silver

2387
01:38:09,360 --> 01:38:13,920
water and I I feel that there is uh is

2388
01:38:13,920 --> 01:38:14,960
that they're moving in the right

2389
01:38:14,960 --> 01:38:17,760
direction that there's a future and and

2390
01:38:17,760 --> 01:38:19,600
that we haven't heard the end of data

2391
01:38:19,600 --> 01:38:24,560
centers. Uh I do um agree that we want

2392
01:38:24,560 --> 01:38:27,040
to see what's best for Provo in this

2393
01:38:27,040 --> 01:38:30,239
site, but I feel encouraged that the the

2394
01:38:30,239 --> 01:38:32,480
data centers in general are making good

2395
01:38:32,480 --> 01:38:33,920
progress with respect to the

2396
01:38:33,920 --> 01:38:39,350
environment. Councelor

2397
01:38:39,360 --> 01:38:41,600
Whipple,

2398
01:38:41,600 --> 01:38:45,040
>> I had a lot of different questions um

2399
01:38:45,040 --> 01:38:47,280
based on conversations that I have with

2400
01:38:47,280 --> 01:38:52,080
constituents, but given the general vibe

2401
01:38:52,080 --> 01:38:53,840
of the council, I don't know that it's

2402
01:38:53,840 --> 01:38:56,800
necessary to to even go into those right

2403
01:38:56,800 --> 01:39:04,080
now. I'm grateful to the developers for coming and working

2404
01:39:04,080 --> 01:39:10,070
with us and trying to propose this. Um

2405
01:39:10,080 --> 01:39:12,880
there there are only a few places within

2406
01:39:12,880 --> 01:39:14,960
the city where something like this could

2407
01:39:14,960 --> 01:39:17,760
happen. This is one of them. Maybe down

2408
01:39:17,760 --> 01:39:20,400
Iron could be another.

2409
01:39:20,400 --> 01:39:23,119
um

2410
01:39:23,119 --> 01:39:25,119
this one because we're already in

2411
01:39:25,119 --> 01:39:28,159
proximity to hotels, to an elementary

2412
01:39:28,159 --> 01:39:30,320
school, things like that makes some

2413
01:39:30,320 --> 01:39:35,920
hesitation for me. But um it's it's

2414
01:39:35,920 --> 01:39:38,080
you're in the ballpark, right? So that's

2415
01:39:38,080 --> 01:39:41,350
good.

2416
01:39:41,360 --> 01:39:44,320
And I've tried to be really careful to

2417
01:39:44,320 --> 01:39:48,080
recognize my own biases that I have

2418
01:39:48,080 --> 01:39:52,080
against data centers. AI generally I my

2419
01:39:52,080 --> 01:39:54,000
information should not come solely from

2420
01:39:54,000 --> 01:39:56,560
watching Silicon Valley, right? That's

2421
01:39:56,560 --> 01:40:00,880
not appropriate. But um

2422
01:40:00,880 --> 01:40:05,119
I I my concerns would be like on the

2423
01:40:05,119 --> 01:40:07,520
closed loop water system where has this

2424
01:40:07,520 --> 01:40:09,679
been deployed before with what success

2425
01:40:09,679 --> 01:40:12,800
on what scale right because I know there

2426
01:40:12,800 --> 01:40:14,480
are these technologies but I don't know

2427
01:40:14,480 --> 01:40:16,719
if they've been implemented on the same

2428
01:40:16,719 --> 01:40:18,239
scale that you're looking at for this

2429
01:40:18,239 --> 01:40:22,239
program things like that um which we'll

2430
01:40:22,239 --> 01:40:24,080
probably have those more in-depth

2431
01:40:24,080 --> 01:40:25,679
conversations again later but I don't

2432
01:40:25,679 --> 01:40:27,520
think it's necessary to do it tonight

2433
01:40:27,520 --> 01:40:31,990
but Thank you very much.

2434
01:40:32,000 --> 01:40:33,440
» All right, we'll take a vote on the

2435
01:40:33,440 --> 01:40:36,950
implied motion.

2436
01:40:36,960 --> 01:40:38,239
» Councelor Bogdan,

2437
01:40:38,239 --> 01:40:39,840
>> no.

2438
01:40:39,840 --> 01:40:42,320
>> Councelor Hoben,

2439
01:40:42,320 --> 01:40:43,040
>> no.

2440
01:40:43,040 --> 01:40:44,400
>> Councelor Whipple,

2441
01:40:44,400 --> 01:40:45,040
>> no.

2442
01:40:45,040 --> 01:40:46,239
>> Councelor Garrett,

2443
01:40:46,239 --> 01:40:46,880
>> no.

2444
01:40:46,880 --> 01:40:48,400
>> Councelor McCay, no. Councelor

2445
01:40:48,400 --> 01:40:49,600
Christensen,

2446
01:40:49,600 --> 01:40:50,480
>> no.

2447
01:40:50,480 --> 01:40:52,080
>> Councelor Whitlock,

2448
01:40:52,080 --> 01:40:53,119
>> no.

2449
01:40:53,119 --> 01:40:57,350
>> So that does not pass 70.

2450
01:40:57,360 --> 01:40:58,800
If there is no objection, we will now

2451
01:40:58,800 --> 01:41:00,480
adjourn the provisal council by

2452
01:41:00,480 --> 01:41:02,960
unanimous