[0:33] Everybody welcome This is Monday August
24th As I speak very slowly so the mayor
[0:37] can get back to his seat Thank you Welcome
And I'll call us to order And if you
[0:43] please rise and join me for the Pledge of
Allegiance
[0:47] I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the
[0:54] Republic for which it stands One nation
under God Indivisible with liberty and
[1:00] justice for all
[1:05] Thanks so much We have all City Council
members in attendance tonight so that's
[1:09] exciting We'll move on to number four
which is approval of our agenda Does
[1:13] anybody have any changes or additions or I
would look for a motion to approve
[1:18] So moved approve
[1:20] Can you give that to Ron Is that a second
Second Is that okay
[1:24] Any last comments or questions
[1:27] All those in favor of tonight's agenda
please say aye
[1:30] Aye
[1:31] Any opposed Agenda passes Move on to five
which is our proclamations and
[1:35] recognitions And we do have a special
night tonight So I'll hand it over to our
[1:40] fire department and Chief Warner and
others
[1:43] Good evening Well this past year
[2:01] Oh my gosh
[2:03] Good evening Council president council
mayor administrator staff family and
[2:07] fellow firefighters Tonight we're
introducing to you Assistant Chief Fire
[2:10] Assistant Fire Chief Grady Nelson He's
assigned to the task of emergency
[2:14] management for the city and professional
standards within the fire department He
[2:18] has successfully passed his probation and
is a valued member of the team Grady grew
[2:23] up in Red wing and is a fourth generation
Red wing resident Grady holds a Bachelor
[2:28] of Science in Political science from the
University of Wisconsin River falls a
[2:32] Master of Public administration from
Hamline University and an associate of
[2:36] Applied Science and Paramedic Fire Science
as well and recently attained an Associate
[2:40] in Applied Science and Emergency
Management from the Hennepin Technical
[2:43] Community Or I'm sorry College Grady has
been with the Red Wing Fire Department
[2:48] since 2019 and before that he actually
served in the capacity and administration
[2:52] at city since 2015 He also worked for the
Savage Fire Department and a Maplewood
[2:57] Fire Department as a firefighter paramedic
When I asked Grady what he wanted why he
[3:02] wanted to be in the fire service he stated
red wing fires a paid on call in 2019 and
[3:09] just fell in love with the work The
significance of the work and the direct
[3:14] service provided by the fire and EMS is
incredibly fulfilling Additionally Grady's
[3:17] grandfather was also a volunteer
firefighter with the Red Wing Fire
[3:21] Department Grady is supported by his
family his wife Therese or children
[3:25] Charlie Megan Teddy and Grady's wife will
pin his badge on tonight
[3:59] Congratulations Congratulations
[4:05] Congratulations
[4:08] Congratulations
[4:13] Thank you And now on to our next
[4:18] No speech
[4:28] Next I want to introduce Brad Parlier Brad
has recently successfully passed probation
[4:32] which including passing this paramedic
certification Brad is assigned to be chief
[4:35] with the fire department Brad grew up in
Wanamingo Brad was homeschooled by his
[4:39] parents all the way through high school He
earned a Bachelors of Science and Health
[4:44] and Human Services or sorry Health and
Human Sciences from the University of
[4:47] Minnesota Rochester Brad didn't have any
prior experience before joining Red wing
[4:51] This is something he takes pride in as he
learned everything about the fire and EMS
[4:56] service from his co-workers here at Red
wing From day one he witnessed a level of
[5:00] care and excellence and pride in his job
When I asked Brad why he wanted to join
[5:05] the fire service he said he wanted to be
part of something greater than himself He
[5:10] mentioned that he goes through fire No pun
intended Together as a team responding to
[5:14] calls for service with the people of Red
wing followed by his peers next to him
[5:18] Brett is supported tonight by his wife
Connie and their three children Noah Luke
[5:22] and Stella His parents and co-workers at
Red Wing Fire His wife is going to pin his
[5:27] badge on tonight
[5:59] Congratulations
[6:01] Congratulations
[6:05] Congratulations
[6:07] Thank you
[6:08] Good job
[6:13] Thank you Counsel
[6:15] Thank you so much
[6:18] We'll move on to number six which is our
Red Wing Legacy Choir presentation So I'll
[6:23] wait for them to file out and a few ladies
And maybe if there's gentlemen also please
[6:28] come up
[6:40] Good evening My name is Liz McGill I am
the executive director of the Red Wing
[6:46] Area Seniors or pier 55 We are here
tonight to introduce our Red Wing Legacy
[6:50] Choir Chorus We have a couple people
passing out some information to the
[6:54] audience and I think you guys all got them
Um we are a division of giving voice
[7:00] giving voice started as a grassroots
project here in Minnesota about 14 years
[7:04] ago by a group of women and one man who
had family members who were diagnosed with
[7:09] Alzheimer's but they discovered they still
loved to sing and they were very
[7:14] interactive and were really enjoyed
singing And so they started the first
[7:17] giving voice choir that has now grown to
We are now an international program that
[7:22] was based out of here in Minnesota last
fall the Mayo Health um Rural Health
[7:27] Initiative put out funding for four new
rural programs And so I heard of that
[7:32] funding and I thought that sounds very fun
And I was trying to grow programs at the
[7:37] Red wing area seniors being I was very new
there And so I applied for the funding and
[7:43] found out a couple of months later that we
were one of four choirs chosen to expand
[7:48] in rural Minnesota It was like us and
there's one up north and a couple others
[7:54] So we were very excited to get that
funding to kick off our first season So
[7:59] what it is is we have three different
sessions in a year We have a spring a
[8:04] summer and a fall And there are 10 to 12
week sessions And we choose a different
[8:10] theme kind of every year every session for
our choir We try to find songs that are
[8:16] I'll show tune based very popular songs
songs that people with dementia are going
[8:20] to be able to recall maybe from their
childhood or just sing with the family
[8:24] those type of things I want to note too
that we are not just a dementia friendly
[8:29] choir Anyone who loves to sing can join us
We have some folks that have traumatic
[8:34] brain injuries We have folks who simply
just want to sing We have folks like
[8:38] myself who were asked when the choir
started by our musical director juicing
[8:42] alto soprano and I said I don't know and I
don't think we've ever discovered yet What
[8:46] I do I just show up and sing and bring the
snacks which is very important So we are a
[8:52] very low barrier Um choir we have there's
our our quote is there's no wrong in the
[8:57] room And we just we just want people to
show up and enjoy our choir
[9:02] So this Wednesday we are kicking off our
first mini concert I call it a mini
[9:07] concert because typically when we would
have our concerts we'd have about ten
[9:11] songs ready to go Like I said we just
started this summer so we're going to have
[9:17] four songs ready to go And as we were
moving through our our songs and
[9:21] everything I thought how fun would it be
if we could sing before the Red Wing Arts
[9:27] concert in the park Like what a fun
audience that would be So I called up the
[9:32] very nice ladies at Red Wing Arts and I
said hey I have this idea And they said
[9:37] sure And it happened to be the local
hooligans And I'm like very cool And so I
[9:43] was very excited and then found out that
they are the local hooligans heard about
[9:47] us and our mission and they said don't
sing before us We'll take a longer
[9:52] intermission and sing during our
performance So we are so thrilled that the
[9:56] Red wing arts and the local hooligans
embraced us that way So we'll be there
[10:01] Wednesday night We'll be singing
approximately 7454 of our songs and we
[10:04] really hope all of you can make it Um I
want to introduce like I said earlier my
[10:10] role is very administrative I write the
grants I will be writing more grants now
[10:15] because our first grant cycle is done Um I
do the organizing of it the marketing of
[10:20] it that type of thing Buy the snacks That
is actually part of the choir Every
[10:25] rehearsal is snack time at the end And um
but Stephanie Nolton is our musical
[10:29] director She's absolutely amazing and she
is so organized It's really nice for me to
[10:34] stay organized with her And then um
Candace Bean is our pianist She is not
[10:39] here this evening but she is the one who
keeps us all in tune And then we have a
[10:45] few members of our chorus with us tonight
too So they are the true magic of it I
[10:50] just try and keep it organized and like I
say write the grants So we really hope you
[10:56] guys can make it Wednesday night at the
park Bring your chairs and some of it will
[11:01] be a sing along We will let you know But I
know you all know the song so I'm gonna
[11:07] turn it over to Stephanie now Thank you
[11:11] Hello and thank you so much for allowing
us to speak to you about the Red Wing
[11:17] Legacy chorus It's been such a pleasure to
work with the men and women who have
[11:22] joined us to start our adventure this
summer On the music and rehearsal side of
[11:26] things As Liz said our motto is there is
no wrong in this room We're here to bring
[11:32] joy just through the fun of music and
singing and through my experience here in
[11:36] Red wing as well as with another dementia
friendly choir I have had experience with
[11:41] in the Rochester area I have found that
this model really gives people living with
[11:46] memory loss a beautiful dignity and
purpose in this season of life We're
[11:50] currently working on songs like Ben E
King's Stand By Me and Louis Armstrong's
[11:54] What A Wonderful World both of which do
trigger existing memories for our singers
[11:59] How amazing it is that music is so closely
connected to brain health and can improve
[12:04] the quality of life of so many people
right here in Red wing I'd like to leave
[12:09] you with a song that sums up our motto
This was written by one of the founding
[12:14] dementia friendly choir directors David
Moore And it goes like this
[12:19] There's no wrong in this room There's no
wrong in this room There's no wrong in
[12:27] this room Just music joy and cookies
[12:33] In the words of one of our singers I've
always enjoyed singing Here's a new
[12:37] opportunity to meet new friends and share
our music with you We hope you'll join us
[12:42] and sing along on Wednesday evening at the
park Thank you for your time
[12:47] Thank you so much
[12:51] Thank you If I could just add one last
thing We are always encouraging new
[12:55] members If you know somebody who is
diagnosed with dementia if you know
[12:59] somebody who's a family member or
caregiver of dementia if you know somebody
[13:02] who just loves to sing if you want to just
join us 10 to 1130 Wednesdays at Red Wing
[13:08] Area Seniors or pier 55 we will be
starting our fall session in the end of
[13:12] September Thank you
[13:13] Thank you
[13:20] All right We are now at the public comment
section number seven on our agenda tonight
[13:23] Each person is allowed one time of up to
three minutes to speak on agenda items and
[13:27] one time of up to three minutes to speak
on non agenda topics We have started a new
[13:32] process using comment cards and I will
start by calling the card numbers of those
[13:35] who wish to speak on non-agenda items and
then we'll move on to agenda items If you
[13:39] want to speak would have not filled out a
comment card yet You can pick one up on
[13:44] the lobby or actually they'll be up here
by the box and then you will put it in the
[13:48] box So sorry for that Again you'll just
come up and I'll call you and you'll come
[13:52] up and grab a card fill it out and put it
in the box when you come up We'll work on
[13:57] that Michelle
[13:59] Um when you come up to the podium please
drop your card in the box again and then
[14:04] state your name and what city you live in
If you can share what ward or street name
[14:09] neighborhood you live in Red wing we'd
appreciate it Remember that personal
[14:12] attacks and comments related to political
campaigns are not permitted and may be
[14:15] ruled out of order The Council welcomes
all perspectives and appreciates your time
[14:19] and attending tonight So it looks like I
have three for non agenda items Um signed
[14:23] up right now
[14:25] So we'll have some more So how about the
first number one If you want to come up
[14:31] please and introduce yourself again
[14:35] Good evening My name is Stephanie Rogers
and I am the executive and artistic
[14:40] director of the Anderson Center at Tower
View here in Red wing I live in Ward one
[14:47] precinct two I am here today on behalf of
the Anderson Center's Public Artist
[14:52] Residency program and our collaborators
the Public Artist Residency Program
[14:56] launched in 2021 It builds on the Anderson
Center's long standing Artist in Residence
[15:01] program providing additional financial and
administrative support to enable an artist
[15:05] to co-create a significant public artwork
with Red wing community members Past
[15:10] public art residents include muralist
Camila Leyva who worked with Hispanic
[15:14] Outreach and other community groups on the
Plant Wisdom mural across from Liberty's
[15:19] and statue Jones who stand in the shadows
etched the shadows of historic black
[15:24] residents of Red wing into our sidewalks
Anderson Center's 2025 and 2026 Public
[15:29] Artist residency is Doctor Margaret Pierce
a map maker and Citizen Potawatomi tribal
[15:34] member I'm here today in my role as the
project manager for the Red wing
[15:39] installation of her national project
Mississippi Dialogues Pierce is the lead
[15:43] artist Prairie Island Indian Community
Tribal Historic Preservation Office and
[15:47] Ho-Chunk Nation tribal Historic
Preservation Office are important
[15:50] collaborators Our proposal for a public
art installation in Red Wings Colville
[15:54] Park also includes the artistry of Red
Lake Nation woodcarver Ben Spears
[16:00] There's information in your status report
today about the packet or about the
[16:04] project which is being financed entirely
through Non-city funds Um many of them
[16:08] private sources and prestigious national
grants including a 2025 MacArthur
[16:12] fellowship for Pierce a 2026 Creative
Capital Award and a Blandin Foundation
[16:15] grant to Prairie Island Indian Community
also provided significant funding for the
[16:19] local portion of this project As you
review the materials we have provided
[16:24] you'll note that there's a budget for
maintenance funds to be transferred to the
[16:28] city along with the gift of the artwork
Our intention is to formally bring this to
[16:33] the next council meeting on September 14th
for your consideration and approval Both
[16:37] myself and Margaret Pierce who will speak
during the virtual comment period wanted
[16:42] to join you today to call your attention
to the upcoming project and proposal which
[16:46] has been in discussion with relevant
commissions and staff members for several
[16:50] years In the meantime if you have any
questions about this project please don't
[16:55] hesitate to reach out to me about
Mississippi Dialogues All of my contact
[16:59] information is on the Anderson Center
website Thank you
[17:02] Thank you so much
[17:05] All right Do we have our second speaker
tonight
[17:21] Hi Danny Howdy Neal Street Um this is
probably too little too late but I just
[17:28] want to make a comment on what went on
here earlier with uh money allotted for
[17:35] the different organizations and such Uh I
got some ancient history that I could lay
[17:42] on you Um years ago there was another car
club in town called the Bearing Burners I
[17:49] don't know if anybody remembers that or
not The what The bearing burners Thank you
[17:56] Um of which I happen to be the president
Um we decided to have a car show in
[18:04] conjunction with uh River City days So we
talked to chamber got everything arranged
[18:10] They gave us Bay Point Park So we fenced
it off so that we could charge admission
[18:17] to the cars and to the spectators Um we
bought the awards We hired music a DJ for
[18:25] music We hired a bus to haul people from
Bay point to downtown or out to the mall
[18:33] out in Burnside
[18:35] um
[18:37] and had a very successful show And after
the show we gave the chamber back money
[18:46] and we had enough money to do our next
year's show And we did this show for quite
[18:52] a quite a few years as the Baring Brothers
Now it's done by I think the Corvette Club
[18:58] or something So
[19:00] I just wanted to let you know that we did
this all without money from you guys or
[19:07] the chamber or anybody We did it on our
own nickel
[19:12] Um we also used to hold dances
[19:17] uh in the wintertime for the uh what was
it called
[19:23] It escapes me the winter celebration that
you all used to have Rivers shiver River
[19:32] days We had dances raise money there too
So these things these organizations can do
[19:40] things
[19:42] quite easily I think if they've got good
membership they can do it without money
[19:47] from you all Thank you
[19:50] Thank you
[19:55] We have our third public comment for non
agenda items
[20:04] Hello my name is Alex Colley and I'm from
Central Park Street near in Red wing Uh I
[20:10] just want to uh take a moment of your time
to air my grievances regarding al P s more
[20:17] commonly known as flock cameras Uh quite
frankly I am just very unhappy as not uh
[20:22] strong enough word to bring up how I feel
about them
[20:27] They are constantly tracking just normal
citizens They have a remarkably high
[20:33] failure rate for false positives Records
can be accessed without a warrant They can
[20:39] They create their own security issue And
in addition to that uh
[20:47] There are multiple cases across the nation
of people being stalked because of these
[20:53] cameras Uh they are being used as a tool
for the stalker So I just want to uh bring
[21:00] up my uh my issues and concerns Thank you
very much for your time
[21:05] Thank you
[21:09] All right
[21:10] I think we have a couple more people that
have signed up So do we have a fourth or
[21:13] fifth that grabbed cards if you want to
walk up
[21:25] If you want to just come up for non agenda
items that's fine So
[21:36] You can just put the microphone down so we
can hear you Okay Introduce yourself and
[21:41] where you live
[21:45] Here's my card
[21:48] Do I have to like say my address or just
word for it
[21:52] Perfect
[21:53] I'm a word for it So first things first I
hope everyone had a wonderful summer Um I
[22:00] hope you all had a nice year
[22:04] Um to tell you I'm doing great My mom got
a surgery She's doing well
[22:09] Here's what I want to say
[22:12] Um you were kind amazing articulate smart
funny pretty handsome And no matter what
[22:20] you matter
[22:23] I hope you're starting to love yourself
like I am doing And you're trying to be
[22:28] the best you can I'm also trying to myself
[22:33] Um
[22:35] And also remember you are important Thank
you
[22:38] Thank you
[22:45] Do we have another non agenda item
[22:49] You can come up Do we have a fifth Number
five Or you can come up and then we'll go
[22:54] to number six And then I'll let people
raise up their hand if you haven't grabbed
[22:57] the card yet
[23:06] So just put it up a little bit
[23:08] All right Uh blank Ward four First I would
like to bring up the moment of silence
[23:13] again I previously asked for one That
request was denied and afterwards a rule
[23:18] was put in place that doesn't allow
moments of silence anymore
[23:22] I'm not bringing this up just to argue
about what happened before I'm bringing it
[23:28] up because when residents make simple
requests like that and then responses the
[23:32] responses to create a rule restricting
them I think that it can make people feel
[23:37] like there's no point in speaking up I'd
ask the council to think about whether the
[23:42] rule is actually necessary or whether
there's a way to allow moments of silence
[23:47] again without disrupting meetings The only
other thing I want to talk about is
[23:52] something I've noticed as a younger person
in this community Most people my age don't
[23:57] even know about city council meetings or
that they happen A lot of them probably
[24:02] don't know that they can come here and
speak We're not really taught or taught
[24:07] how to participate in local government
Unless you have a reason to pay attention
[24:12] to it you might never know what what's
happening there Here Um
[24:18] that means the same small group of people
tends to show up Well a huge part of the
[24:23] community has no clue about the decisions
being made that can affect them I think
[24:28] this city could do more to change that It
could be as simple as reaching out to
[24:33] schools using social media in ways that
actually reach younger people or working
[24:37] with youth youth organizations to explain
what city Council does and how people can
[24:41] get involved If you want more people
involved in local government especially
[24:44] younger people they first have to know
what they're invited to be part of And I
[24:49] think we could do a much better job of
making sure they know that Thank you
[24:54] Thank you
[25:00] Card number six out there
[25:02] or people would like to Again anyone
wanting public comment on a non agenda
[25:07] item Okay
[25:20] Amber Planck Ward four Many people believe
that Jesus is coming back So what if Jesus
[25:25] already came back Only this time his name
was pronounced Jesus There's a chance he'd
[25:30] be sitting in an immigration detention
center right now because he wasn't sent
[25:34] back with papers You ever thought about
that Somewhere along the way along the way
[25:38] we started calling things political I've
heard people say I don't do politics and
[25:42] sometimes I understand that politics can
be exhausting Democrats versus Republicans
[25:46] taxes budgets elections policy those
things are all political But you know what
[25:50] isn't political Caring about people
believing a woman has bodily autonomy or
[25:53] that people shouldn't be called slurs
believing that somebody in a wheelchair
[25:57] should be able to access a public space or
that a family shouldn't go hungry that an
[26:02] immigrant should be treated like a human
being or that LGBTQ people deserve dignity
[26:07] or that someone experiencing homelessness
still deserves compassion Those are not
[26:10] political beliefs That's called humanity
And frankly some got way too comfortable
[26:14] using the word political as an excuse not
to get involved with when something
[26:18] doesn't directly affect us You ain't got
to agree with somebody's lifestyle You
[26:22] don't have to vote like them or share
their religion their beliefs their
[26:26] background You don't even have to like
them But at the very least you should
[26:30] still care when they're basic when their
basic humanity is being violated that's
[26:34] like a bare minimum There are absolutely
political questions about how government
[26:38] should solve problems We can disagree on
those That's democracy But whether another
[26:42] human being deserves dignity doesn't
depend on which box you check in a ballot
[26:46] Now that brings me to something else that
should cross political lines the flocks
[26:50] and the ALP I understand the argument for
them If a child is kidnapped or somebody
[26:55] commits a violent crime we want police to
have the tools to help find them But also
[27:02] that also requires us to ask what happens
when the tool is used wrong or when
[27:07] somebody abuses it In Wisconsin a woman
was stopped twice because her vehicle was
[27:11] flagged with a homicide alert during the
second stop Officers drew guns on her
[27:16] Texas used 83,000 cameras to find one
woman accused of having an abortion
[27:20] nationwide Dozens of law enforcement
officials have been accused of abusing the
[27:23] system including officers using them to
track exes and people in their personal
[27:27] lives And I've seen reports that show that
they've been pointed at pools parks and
[27:32] splash pads That should concern everybody
Privacy is not Democrat or Republican
[27:36] Civil liberties are not left wing nor
right wing And asking questions about
[27:40] surveillance doesn't mean you're
anti-police It just means that you pay
[27:43] attention Red wing is our home and many
residents simply don't believe the level
[27:48] of crime in our community warrants this
level of surveillance and Red wing alone
[27:52] isn't questioning it Communities across
the country have ended their use of flock
[27:56] cameras and alpr over concerns of misuse
and data sharing I'm not saying these
[28:01] cameras have never helped solve a crime
I'm asking whether that benefit is worth
[28:05] the privacy we're giving up in return Just
because we can track people doesn't mean
[28:10] that we should They call them flock
cameras people because they think that
[28:14] we're sheep They think that we're sheep
Sheep Thank you Until next time
[28:18] Thank you
[28:24] All right Do we have someone with number
seven card
[28:32] Do we have Is that it Okay All right Is
there anybody else in the chamber that
[28:37] would like to provide public comment on a
non agenda item Anyone in the chamber I
[28:41] saw the man in the black and back there
first If you want to come up
[28:51] And please introduce yourself and what
neighborhood you live in
[28:54] My name is Ron Teasdale Some of you out
there know me Majority of you don't But as
[29:00] I look around this room I've been a member
of this community longer than anybody in
[29:04] this room So I've seen a lot of ups and
I've seen a lot of downs Right now we have
[29:10] both ups and we have a lot of downs And
it's not just the city not just the city
[29:16] but our school district has the same has a
problem Also
[29:20] having been in business for as many years
as I was I saw people desiring to move to
[29:27] this community because of the community
and because of the education system for
[29:32] their children They no longer do that So
many children from Red wing are gone to
[29:38] other school districts which is a shame
and it's not your problem but I would say
[29:44] you and the school district together have
to work together and figure out a plan to
[29:50] improve
[29:52] what what's being taught and handled in
that school district And as far as as far
[29:58] as the city council
[30:01] you have problems too You've got many
problems and a lot of them throughout the
[30:07] community
[30:09] It's a well known fact that you have a
money problem not just income but but what
[30:17] you're spending on and how you're spending
it and the justifications of what you're
[30:23] buying
[30:25] It's not there
[30:27] And I'm I'm talking about this as somebody
that's been in the business for a long
[30:32] time and knows a lot more about this than
what you might think and you have a
[30:38] problem
[30:39] and it needs to be looked at And if any of
you want to talk to me I'd be happy to
[30:46] talk to you and have a nice conversation
because it it needs to be directed
[30:52] and I won't take any more of your time But
like I said we have a problem And I hate
[31:00] to see it because it's been my community
for a long time Thank you
[31:05] Thank you
[31:11] Is there anyone else in the chamber that
would like to provide public comment on a
[31:15] non agenda item
[31:17] Come on up
[31:25] Uh my
[31:25] Name is Mueller and I live on West Avenue
Um
[31:30] I didn't come to comment on this but I
would like to express my agreement with
[31:36] the two people who've spoken and expressed
concerns about the spy cameras
[31:42] Um this is something I've given a bit of
thought to and many people have and it's
[31:48] generated a lot of discussion Um and there
are obviously two sides to it but what
[31:55] strikes me as being very red wing so to
speak about the issue is that it doesn't
[32:01] appear that residents have been asked
whether they think this is a good idea or
[32:07] not whether they want cameras
[32:11] In the vicinity of their homes or not
[32:15] Um and as usual I feel that the residents
should be consulted about decisions of
[32:21] this nature And if I'm mistaken if they
have been I'd be happy to know that but
[32:28] I'm not aware of it
[32:32] Um item number two I have a document to
provide to you as an exhibit
[32:39] It's entitled The Health Effects of Waste
Incinerators and it's from the British
[32:45] Society for Ecological Medicine It's not
too long about 70 pages but there are 329
[32:51] citations Um and this is not the most
recent uh report of this nature There are
[32:58] lots of them that I like to
[33:02] offer it to you with the request that you
read it Particularly since you seem so
[33:08] determined to take actions that would
increase the amount of garbage being
[33:12] burned in Red wing garbage from
Minneapolis garbage from Saint Paul and so
[33:17] on and so forth Um can I give this to the
attorney or
[33:23] Sure That's fine
[33:24] Okay
[33:33] I only brought one printed copy but it's
something easily found online
[33:39] Can can can
[33:41] We make a copy of it and distribute it
Thank you I mean like as in in a packet
[33:47] It's
[33:49] it's readily available online Thank you
There are several succeeding versions of
[33:54] it but it's one of the most comprehensive
reports that I have seen focused on the
[34:00] health effects of this which I certainly
have had no success over the last 18 or 20
[34:07] years And um convincing city councils or
city staff that this is something that
[34:13] they ought to be interested in
[34:17] Um okay I'm I'm done Thank you
[34:20] Thank you
[34:24] If you're
[34:25] in the chambers I would like to provide
public comment on a non agenda item
[34:30] one last time Anyone in the chambers
[34:33] Then I will move online I think we have
one person virtual on a non agenda item If
[34:38] you'd like to unmute yourself and
introduce yourself that would be great
[34:45] Good evening councilors I'm Margaret
Pierce I'm a resident of Rockland Maine
[34:49] and a citizen Potawatomi tribal member And
as Stephanie mentioned I'm the lead artist
[34:55] on the project called Mississippi
Dialogues that is described in your packet
[34:59] and will be in the status updates at the
end of this meeting So Mississippi
[35:05] Dialogues is a public art project
elevating indigenous knowledge and
[35:09] experience of the Mississippi River
through 14 map panels in public parks
[35:14] along the river from the Gulf to the
headwaters And we would like to install
[35:20] the Premier the first panel installation
portraying the stretch of the river
[35:24] between Hastings and La Crosse in Red Wing
at Colville Park on October 1st It's been
[35:31] my privilege to collaborate on this
artwork with Prairie Island and Ho-Chunk
[35:35] Tippo We first started working on it back
in 2019 and then we really got going this
[35:42] past couple of years after securing the
needed funding Some of you already know
[35:47] about this project from our presentations
over the past couple of years including
[35:52] presentations to the Arts and Culture and
Heritage commissions and an evening event
[35:58] centering Fairy Island elders at the barn
at Tower View last year called our
[36:03] relative haha Wakpa and a Saturday picnic
this past June in Colville Park
[36:09] The installation is two oak structures
that look like oversized park signage
[36:15] standing side by side and the structures
hold two map panels each 7.5ft wide by
[36:22] five feet tall Described describing the
river through indigenous voices and
[36:27] memories through direct quotations from
extensive interviews with
[36:31] Dakota and Ho-Chunk knowledge holders And
on the other side of the panels are two
[36:37] wood artworks by Red Lake Nation artists
Ben Spears who also built the structures
[36:43] So we've been working with Michelle Lacy
Pat Ramaker and Steve Cohen to select a
[36:49] site in the park that would be appropriate
for such a work and that doesn't interfere
[36:56] with existing park usage Last week we made
our third presentation in two years to the
[37:02] Arts and Culture Commission and they voted
to recommend approval So as Stephanie
[37:07] mentioned please reach out with any
questions you might have prior to your
[37:13] formal consideration at the September 14th
meeting Meegwetch Thank you
[37:18] Thank you so much
[37:23] All right Anybody else last time virtually
that would like to provide public comment
[37:28] on a non agenda item
[37:31] Please unmute yourself if you'd like to
comment on a non agenda item
[37:36] All right I'm not seeing anybody else So
we will move on
[37:39] There is one
[37:40] There's a hand up Jean
[37:41] Oh there we go
[37:44] Do you want to unmute yourself and
introduce yourself please
[37:50] Deployed
[37:52] at all
[37:55] times
[37:57] for the upstate
[38:00] Beth I think it's you since I can see your
name but you can
[38:04] I know it's kind of hard to hear you Can
you hear
[38:07] Me Yep You can go ahead
[38:09] Um I have concerns Um I kind of piggyback
off of to Ronnie a little bit here Just
[38:16] just thinking about things Um in the past
when I was um on different committees um
[38:22] and I'm not speaking of of being on a city
committee other committees or other
[38:28] festival committees Um the funding that
was channeled um to help the festivals we
[38:34] had to actually report back what we did
with that funding We also had to have
[38:40] somebody as a city representative
[38:44] on the meetings with us As far as the
groups we had to keep track of all
[38:51] receipts and report all receipts We had to
do monthly reports back to actually at
[38:57] that time it was Mark Marshall um
[39:02] regarding monthly Um but I'm very
concerned about money um of how it's being
[39:06] handled out and the non reports the non
receipts Um last fall one of your staff
[39:12] members actually mentioned that on the
funding that was given out that the people
[39:16] underneath their breath um that person
which they were speaking um mentioned that
[39:20] they didn't have to show receipts Um it's
concerning to me regarding the money or
[39:25] all the money that's that's out there to
be had or being given out Um I really
[39:31] strongly feel that the city council really
needs to kind of sit down and put some
[39:36] policies and procedures in place if
they're going to be giving money or big
[39:41] money Um even if it's 5000 or 2000 or 1000
or whatever Um I think it's very important
[39:47] that people come back and report you know
what They spent the money on what they did
[39:52] with the money Um I think Ronnie's right I
mean we have been really dishing out a lot
[39:58] of money here Different committees have
given money here money there Somebody else
[40:02] goes some different committee gets money
to again Um I think we need to really be
[40:08] watching all that I think it's very
important Um because if you go back and
[40:13] look at the reports there's been a lot of
money that's been given out Um but a lot
[40:19] of people haven't come back to report what
the money was used for
[40:24] Thank you
[40:26] Thank you
[40:30] All right The last time is there anybody
virtually that would like to provide
[40:34] public comment
[40:36] All right I think we're going to move on
then And we're going to move on to agenda
[40:40] items And I don't believe we have any
cards that were taken for agenda items So
[40:44] I will start in our chamber Is there
anybody tonight that would like to provide
[40:48] public comment on an agenda item tonight
[40:51] One last time Is there anyone that would
like to provide public comment on an
[40:55] agenda item
[40:57] All right Seeing none we'll move on
virtually Is there anybody virtually that
[41:01] would like to provide public comment on a
agenda item Please unmute yourself
[41:08] Anyone virtually that would like to
provide public comment on an agenda item
[41:12] tonight please unmute yourself and
introduce yourself
[41:15] And again I'm seeing nobody else do that
So I'm going to close public comment and
[41:19] move on
[41:22] Then we're on to number eight which is our
consent agenda section And these are items
[41:26] on the agenda that don't often require
require council discussion These items are
[41:30] routine business non-controversial or have
been discussed publicly in the past These
[41:34] items can be approved by the council all
at once unless the Council member
[41:38] acknowledges that they would like to
comment on or discuss any of the items at
[41:42] tonight's meeting Are there any items that
council member would like to pull from the
[41:46] consent agenda tonight
[41:49] All right Is there a motion to approve
[41:51] So moved Second
[41:52] All right The motion is by Don and a
second by Beth
[41:58] Any last discussion or questions
[42:02] All right Now we don't have a rock Are we
going to do a roll call for these for
[42:07] consent agenda
[42:10] Um is that usually
[42:12] We would do that So would you be prepared
to do that
[42:15] I'm not prepared Um is Melissa on line
Melissa is on line
[42:19] Oh sorry
[42:20] There we are
[42:21] There we go Hey Melissa Wonderful to see
you So again no last discussion So roll
[42:27] call vote please
[42:29] Snyder Hi
[42:32] there Hi
[42:34] Cleaver I
[42:37] I
[42:38] Lambert
[42:39] I
[42:40] Goggin
[42:41] I
[42:43] Norton I seven eyes zero nays Motion
carries
[42:48] Thanks Melissa We've now approved all the
consent agenda items We'll now move on to
[42:52] our general business section and the
council will address each of these items
[42:55] separately All input from community
members occurred during the public comment
[42:58] period at the beginning of the meeting so
we won't be taking any more comments at
[43:02] this time
[43:08] And our first item is nine A which is
considering a motion to introduce
[43:12] ordinance number 241 a rezoning option
[43:16] All right Thank you Madam Mayor Members of
the council I'd like to do a quick
[43:21] introduction This item This is a
recommendation coming from the Planning
[43:24] Commission to rezone a piece of property
within the community The property is
[43:27] located at 1808 Shakya Street and the
rezoning would be from agricultural
[43:30] residential to single family residential
or R1 And just to get us oriented I'll
[43:34] make sure we understand where this is
because this is an area of the city that
[43:39] we don't deal with a whole lot when it
comes to zoning This is an extreme
[43:43] northwestern portion of the city It's
really hard to even show it and show other
[43:47] um kind of features in Red wing So what
you're seeing is a pretty blown out map
[43:52] here But just to get us oriented real
quick downtown Red wing is right here
[43:56] Highway 60 runs east and west Uh highway
19 heads north here uh by Prairie Island
[44:00] Then the site that we're talking about is
located roughly right in here So the
[44:04] nuclear power plant right here Uh the
casinos up here And so this is a piece of
[44:09] property that is located again up on
Prairie Island Uh so like I said this is
[44:14] an area that is unusual because of the mix
of properties that are owned under trust
[44:18] with the Prairie Island community and
parcels that are also still part of the
[44:22] city of Red wing Uh so the next maps do
show those a little more clearly This is a
[44:27] blow up the property again this is one 808
Shockey Street That's the area shown in
[44:31] red Um this is the parcel that's under
consideration tonight It's just under one
[44:35] acre in size The site is currently zoned R
residential which means it
[44:40] only really applies to sites that are
rural and that don't have access to public
[44:44] services In this case this particular site
and others around it are provided with
[44:49] sewer and water service from the Prairie
Island community And then the street
[44:52] Typekit Street itself is not a public
street but it is a street that's
[44:57] maintained and owned by the tribal Council
So in the past as we've had these these
[45:01] matters come forward we have generally
interpreted our code to reflect that
[45:05] because the site does tie into a community
system or a community run system that it
[45:10] would meet the requirements for the R-1
zoning That hasn't always been the case
[45:14] out here So a lot of this zoning goes back
to and predates the Prairie Island system
[45:19] being installed So with that in place the
Planning Commission has been making
[45:23] recommendations to support Rezonings in
situations like this In this particular
[45:26] situation the property owner is asking for
the rezoning to allow for the removal of
[45:30] the home and to allow new home to move
onto this property Without that zoning in
[45:35] place it would be difficult to build
something new and comply with the area
[45:39] requirements setbacks and all those other
much greater standards in the AR district
[45:43] And again this will allow for basically
resetting of a home on the property
[45:47] consistent with the development patterns
that you see in the surrounding
[45:51] neighborhood The rezoning would allow for
a potential resubdivision of the property
[45:54] or further dividing the property The
applicant has not indicated a desire to do
[45:58] so at this point in time but that has
happened in some of these parcels as well
[46:03] that have been rezoned The last map I
wanted to show was just the general zoning
[46:08] of this area The areas that's shown in the
purple kind of cross-hatched color are
[46:13] parcels that are part of the Prairie
Island community The parcels that you see
[46:17] that are the more yellow and tan color
greenish color Those parcels are within
[46:21] the city of Red wing limits So that
includes properties that are zoned AR
[46:25] which is the lighter green color and then
R1 which is the tannish color the purple
[46:30] ish color there is all uh Um owned by
Prairie Island And most of those are
[46:35] parcels that are split between industrial
zoning and some other zoning
[46:38] classifications So again just to point out
this particular parcel in particular we
[46:42] don't show it highlighted here but it's
this parcel right here You can see it's
[46:46] surrounded by the cursor So as noted in
the staff report there have been two
[46:51] previous rezonings of similar nature to go
from R to R1 Those are the parcels to see
[46:56] here that that are shown that way on the
map Uh the other unique thing here is that
[47:01] these parcels are essentially surrounded
by Prairie Island and by tribal lands Uh
[47:05] again this is a little unusual in terms of
how this was um
[47:10] how this how this what the history of the
area is and why the parcels are set up the
[47:15] way they are Um but again this is I think
really allowing the property owner to uh
[47:20] further re further use the property in a
way that's consistent with the character
[47:24] of the neighborhood So with that the
Planning Commission did review the request
[47:27] On August 18th the Planning Commission
unanimously recommending approval of the
[47:30] Proposal with the findings that are
documented in the report I would note
[47:34] because this is a rezoning it does require
a five vote majority of the council to
[47:38] move this forward And for tonight's we are
asking for a first reading of the
[47:42] ordinance and we'll bring back a second
reading if it goes forward with that If
[47:46] there are any questions I'm happy to
answer Any questions from the Council
[47:52] Any questions for Kyle
[47:54] I'll look for a motion to approve
[47:57] I'll make the motion to introduce
ordinance number two 414 Series rezoning
[48:01] 1808 Shaker Street from R to R one
[48:04] I'll second that
[48:08] Discussion or questions
[48:11] All right Again the motion is to introduce
ordinance number 2414 Series rezoning 1808
[48:16] Check Street from R to R one All those in
favor please say aye
[48:22] Aye
[48:23] Any opposed Motion passes seven zero
[48:28] Didn't it
[48:30] Did that need a roll call vote because it
has to be a super
[48:33] I think it's an introduction So I was
assuming we didn't need that
[48:37] Okay
[48:38] Thank you I'm sorry
[48:40] That's okay
[48:40] All right Nine B is considering a motion
to amend the assessments policy interest
[48:45] rate methodology
[48:47] So is this Chris
[48:50] Actually I think Tony's going to take the
bulk of it But as far as an introduction
[48:56] this is a follow up conversation from last
year As you recall we had an assessment um
[49:02] uh during the assessment uh approval
policy There was a concern or a question
[49:07] about um actually raised by council member
Lambert about potentially adjusting the
[49:11] rate for that particular assessment and
the determination at that time the council
[49:16] was uh um
[49:18] open to possibly considering it but not on
the fly not at that time and requested
[49:23] that it be added to a future agenda We
also talked about it at our annual
[49:28] workshop which I mentioned earlier this
evening at our workshop Um and so this has
[49:33] been added not as a special request item
but as sort of a cleanup and an option for
[49:39] for your consideration prior to our
assessment process which is actually
[49:42] coming forward probably in the next two
meetings here for our 2026 street
[49:47] reconstruction or not the street
reconstruction project actually the alley
[49:50] construction project Um so in light of
that um Marshall put the staff report
[49:54] together but Tony was going to cover a few
of the things from a financial perspective
[50:01] All right
[50:01] Thank you
[50:01] Yeah Thank you Well as you all know um
periodically when we do some of these
[50:08] larger projects uh one of the financing
sources is through special assessments And
[50:13] um we have a couple of those projects
coming up this fall yet Um so when we do
[50:20] levy those assessments we have a policy
and we have our ordinance that we follow
[50:26] which establishes the interest rate for
those projects Um so
[50:31] we've compiled information from other
cities across the state of Minnesota on
[50:35] what their policy does We included that as
an attachment And if you have any
[50:40] questions on that you can let us know But
[50:44] um
[50:46] our policy falls in line with what
[50:49] most other cities do Um there's a little
variance across across the board Um but
[50:56] what we're doing is trying to establish a
[51:01] a guided policy over time that we can
follow Um and what we're doing is So the
[51:07] reason that we do this is because
[51:11] we have an interest rate that should any
assessed property for any of these
[51:16] improvements um
[51:19] not prepay one of the one of the rules and
guidelines established in Minnesota law is
[51:24] to offer the right to prepay but should
they not there's a borrowing cost So the
[51:30] city when we do a project or if we issue
general obligation bonds we have borrowing
[51:36] cost So this policy is meant to cover
those borrowing costs for the city That's
[51:41] why we have it
[51:43] Um
[51:46] We follow several criteria Many of the
considerations um it's to cover our
[51:51] financing costs It's out of fairness to
property owners So we're not picking and
[51:57] choosing We're we're following a set
policy and offering the right to prepay to
[52:03] everybody Um
[52:06] One of the considerations I think that's
important to point out also
[52:11] is if we don't have a interest rate policy
such as this we still have borrowing costs
[52:18] to cover Those borrowing costs would be
subsidized likely from the general fund So
[52:24] to the broader tax base So having an
interest applied to the
[52:30] owner of the improvement is actually an
equitable way
[52:36] to capture that financing source versus
subsidizing those borrowing costs from the
[52:41] general fund and spreading it across the
entire tax base essentially Um so we've
[52:47] provided the attachments Um what we're
looking for is any discussion if there is
[52:52] some sort of proposed change um what the
council can do tonight is discuss um and
[52:59] then the alternatives would be for the
council to either take no action to leave
[53:05] the policy as is currently or if there's
discussion to make a motion to change the
[53:11] interest rate methodology that would be
the other direction we could go
[53:18] So with that I'll be available to take any
questions as they come up
[53:22] Beth Balthazar
[53:23] Handout I just have some
[53:25] questions for understanding So in your um
in the brief that you gave us you say
[53:32] state that um
[53:35] Red wing has one of the lowest assessed
rates in Minnesota for street
[53:40] reconstruction projects at 50% of the cost
So of a total cost So if I'm a homeowner a
[53:46] homeowner right now where things are being
reconstructed how am I assessed How do you
[53:51] forget the interest for amendment How am I
assessed
[53:54] Sure And I'm glad you pointed that out
because that is different than the
[53:58] interest rate the borrowing Right
[53:59] I just want to understand because when I
look at the thing that big sheet you gave
[54:05] me it says nothing about that
[54:07] Sure
[54:08] That's important to point out but it also
is a factor consideration okay that you
[54:13] all should take into account and I'll
maybe lean on Zach or Amy potentially to
[54:17] weigh in on this because they might know
more than I do about comparing to other
[54:22] cities but
[54:25] we have a total cost of a project and if
you have a property that's being improved
[54:31] we can we can calculate what that cost is
to your property Right And so our policy
[54:38] is to assess half of that improved cost to
your property
[54:43] Half of my piece
[54:46] Correct
[54:46] Correct So if there's 100 hundred homes
being affected by this I'm going to pay
[54:53] 100th of it but it's cut by 50%
[54:56] Correct Yep The city will pay 50% of that
assessed improvement And then we assess
[55:02] the other 50% Now that's just a lower
formula or percentage to what some other
[55:08] communities do for their projects
[55:11] And that's we we take into account the
total cost of the project Correct
[55:16] That's correct Yep
[55:17] Okay I have more questions but I'll wait
[55:22] Mayor
[55:23] So Tony
[55:26] We What do other cities charge What do
other cities charge We're at 50% What are
[55:32] other cities that you know of charged Is
it 75% or is it
[55:37] Now you're
[55:38] Really
[55:38] Trying to pin me down
[55:39] Just in general
[55:41] It does vary It depends on the size of the
city and what their policy is I think
[55:47] there are
[55:49] It's hard for me to give you a number on
what some other cities charge Um but 50%
[55:56] is on the conservative side
[55:58] Okay That's all I needed right
[56:00] I think it's fairly typical to see more
like 75% Okay Um because the improvement
[56:07] is going to go to the property owner
[56:11] Thank you
[56:12] Sounds like Marshall might have an answer
[56:14] Is Marshall on Oh
[56:16] Oh Hi Marshall
[56:17] I am I am Great to see everybody So if
memory serves me correct on that last
[56:23] question from the mayor I believe it was
Kim Busy and I that read a league
[56:29] conference in Duluth and they asked and it
was a conference session on special
[56:34] assessments and they asked They pulled the
room hundreds of people in the room and
[56:40] said how many people assessed 75% or more
of the costs for reconstruction Most hands
[56:46] went up 50% or more most hands up 50% or
less I think it was Kim and I standing
[56:53] there solely with our hands up So the
anecdotal evidence is street
[56:57] reconstructions are often at 75% or more
of the total cost and that's an estimated
[57:03] cost that can get into great detail with
you but I'll leave it at that
[57:10] Thank you
[57:14] So
[57:16] when I look at our policy around interest
it talks about the bond buyers index
[57:24] And so then
[57:26] I don't know about stuff like that So I
look it up and there's tons of bond buyer
[57:32] indexes Do we use the municipal bonds or
which one do we use And it changes from
[57:38] what I've read daily So how do we
[57:42] how do we set on this is the rate This is
the current rate
[57:47] If I may
[57:50] Sure
[57:51] Yeah Um so the bond buyers index You're
right There's a lot of different bond
[57:56] buyers index The one we're looking at is
for the 20 year muni rate which tends to
[58:02] be and which tends to give uh citizens a
benefit from the get go because it's it's
[58:08] uh it's a double It's similar to what Red
wings credit rating and it's a a a a plus
[58:15] So it's a good rate and it does It
fluctuates every day along with any bond
[58:21] prices in the market So we would
technically we just go look on that day
[58:26] we're going to declare for the assessments
pull the bond buyers index from that day
[58:31] And it doesn't usually deviate
substantially over the 30 30 35 days it
[58:36] takes to get the assessment to the City
Council Any other questions I'd be happy
[58:41] to answer those
[58:44] So yeah can I keep going
[58:46] Somebody else says she's on a roll
[58:48] Well I'm just trying to understand why do
why is our policy state that we're going
[58:53] to choose Um either we're going to use the
bonds Um the interest rate for the bonds
[58:58] that we receive So like this latest one
was it was a pretty low rate I mean we
[59:04] were surprised that it was a lower rate Um
but we raise it to to the nearest quarter
[59:10] percent I get that And then we add the 2%
But then in the then it says Or we use the
[59:16] buyer bond index again rounded up And then
we choose whichever is higher Why do we do
[59:21] that
[59:23] That is just the methodology that the City
Council picked at one moment in time
[59:28] That's been on It's been part of our
policy for over 25 years And that's why we
[59:35] brought this for the council consideration
because we frankly we'll we're happy to
[59:40] use whatever methodology you'd like us to
use We just need to be able to go to the
[59:46] market and be able to say okay this is the
rate that we're benchmarking on Round up
[59:53] by quarter add 2% add 1% whatever it may
be But it just so happens that the bond
[1:00:00] buyer's index is usually better than the
bond If you just go out for some general
[1:00:06] bond because then you get commercial and
everything else involved When you're using
[1:00:11] a government benchmark they tend to be
lower than what you'd see For example bank
[1:00:16] rates like we go to bank rate.com and find
the bank rate for that day as I mentioned
[1:00:23] earlier But it's likely to be higher than
the bond buyer's index because bond
[1:00:29] buyer's index is strong municipal
governments receive that rating Just again
[1:00:33] I mentioned Red wing receives that rating
So it's just one methodology out of a
[1:00:38] million That just so happened the council
decided to utilize and and um as as Tony
[1:00:44] mentioned there was some discussion about
should we change the methodology And you
[1:00:49] can see all the varying methodologies in
those three pages of that addendum that
[1:00:55] got attached to that exhibit There's no
real rhyme or reason to it It's just the
[1:01:01] one that was selected 25 plus years ago
[1:01:07] Anyone else comments Becky
[1:01:09] Well yeah I mean I'm glad that this came
up And I think that one of the pieces that
[1:01:13] might also be missing from this is
[1:01:16] there were this is if I'm recalling
correctly there were some times when the
[1:01:21] bond rating was more or less favorable to
let's say the home owner Um and so that
[1:01:27] made a difference to if we were assessing
it on June versus on October And
[1:01:32] ultimately my question is this have we
ever done a study of let's say that our
[1:01:38] last I don't know five years or 8 or 10
years worth of projects using this formula
[1:01:44] if we have what percent of our street
reconstruction projects have we
[1:01:50] has this method covered So I know that
that's a separate question than have we
[1:01:55] been paid Because I know sometimes we
[1:01:58] people don't pay their property taxes
right And so we haven't gotten that money
[1:02:02] in So that's not really what I'm looking
for I'm really looking for studying this
[1:02:07] methodology are we coming out of that 50%
benchmark That's what our goal if I'm
[1:02:11] understanding correctly that's what our
goal is is 50% of the project cost correct
[1:02:16] So there's two questions in there
[1:02:18] Yeah
[1:02:19] The first I'll answer by saying we have
used the same methodology for at least the
[1:02:26] last 27 years Um the second part is really
something Zach's a better expert on but we
[1:02:32] set in the fee schedule We set an
assessment rate for reconstruction That
[1:02:37] rate approximates 50% of the cost per foot
of street reconstruction So we've we're
[1:02:42] covering two things here One is the
assessment rate That's the I'll just call
[1:02:48] it Zach can correct me $55 a foot The
linear foot And then on top of that we
[1:02:55] have that time value of money financing
cost which is an interest rate component
[1:03:00] that we're discussing now I don't know if
that answers the question or not but
[1:03:08] Yes and or yes But um I mean we're the
write up talks about that We're trying to
[1:03:15] if we don't cover enough then it moves
towards the other taxpayers And if we
[1:03:20] cover too much it's an unnecessary burden
on the resident who's paying that So I
[1:03:26] guess what I'm asking for is there must be
some way to analyze whether we're hitting
[1:03:32] the middle
[1:03:34] So by definition if we just stick with
that 50 if we just stick with my $50 or
[1:03:43] $55 per linear foot example that's
approximately 50% of the cost So
[1:03:50] theoretically we are assessing 50% of the
cost because we know how much it costs per
[1:03:58] linear foot So we're covering 55% or 50%
of the costs on that $55 And we're also
[1:04:06] trying to address these other issues like
administrative costs recording costs
[1:04:12] financing costs all in this interest rate
But again there's no
[1:04:18] perfect methodology So we're optimistic
that um if there's a discussion or debate
[1:04:24] there was three pages of different
methodologies to really choose from What
[1:04:29] finances we're really concerned about is
that we just end up with a standardized
[1:04:36] methodology Um the preference on that
methodology is totally the council's
[1:04:42] Don has a question
[1:04:44] Um when we when we do a street project
whether it's a resurfacing or a complete
[1:04:50] reconstruct is the uh the do we base that
50% off the total cost of a reconstruct
[1:04:57] the same as a resurfacing
[1:05:01] Um I think this is where Zach would be
handy
[1:05:05] So I can chime in a couple things So when
it comes to resurfacing if you're talking
[1:05:11] the historically mill and overlays um we
don't assess for that at all So there's
[1:05:16] zero cost to homeowners Um we only assess
for street reconstructs
[1:05:21] that cost So it's one correction We
generally actually assess for only 25% not
[1:05:27] 50% in that ballpark I believe uh seventh
Street we were actually under 10% largely
[1:05:33] because a lot of that right of way was the
highway right of way So we're we're fairly
[1:05:40] low A lot of communities are probably in
that 50% give or take Um but we
[1:05:48] assess you can do a bunch of different
ways We assess based on our fee schedule
[1:05:54] which sets an amount per linear foot which
is actually $56 currently So Marshall was
[1:06:01] very close We base that on looking at our
past projects and kind of setting a rate
[1:06:08] rather than doing every single individual
project and setting a special assessment
[1:06:12] rate for that individual project Um that
method I don't think is super common There
[1:06:19] are a lot of communities that move it to
an even simpler approach and just assign a
[1:06:26] assessment amount per lot period So you're
not calculating an assessment amount based
[1:06:31] on lot sizes and whatnot But we do that
and ours is based on frontage of street
[1:06:38] that they have generally And it is
comprised of both a street assessment
[1:06:43] amount And then if homes have their
private utility laterals that need to be
[1:06:49] replaced their sewer and water that's also
assessed So there are separate charges but
[1:06:55] in the end they get put into one
assessment amount and that is the
[1:07:01] assessment amount that is then charged
interest
[1:07:04] You're talking from the street to the home
[1:07:06] From the street to the right away So we
don't do work on private property but we
[1:07:11] replace their private lateral from our
main line to the right of way line
[1:07:15] Gotcha
[1:07:16] And that's what we charge for If they
don't currently meet code which oftentimes
[1:07:22] they don't because it's old parts of town
Um and so together with the utility
[1:07:28] assessment and our street assessment that
ends up being around 25% 20 to 25% of our
[1:07:36] total costs that we assess for
[1:07:39] And is that a 25% rather than the 50% Is
that a policy Who who determined 25%
[1:07:48] Yeah So I don't know what the year was on
our assessment policy but it's several a
[1:07:53] few probably as old as the interest rate
policy a couple decades old We have an
[1:07:58] assessment policy that outlines all that
and there's technically three different
[1:08:01] methods we use to look at assessment
calculations All that's an assessment
[1:08:05] policy Let's say if we update it like last
year we did update it in our fee schedule
[1:08:11] which we
[1:08:12] look at our reconstruct data and adjust it
if needed and try to stay in line with
[1:08:19] that amount
[1:08:24] Thank you
[1:08:24] Joe Go ahead
[1:08:25] No I knew that you had your hand
[1:08:27] Oh go ahead
[1:08:28] Okay Thank you Um I appreciate all of this
conversation And one of the reasons that I
[1:08:34] had um asked about this um the interest
rate was because residents had come
[1:08:39] forward and they made um there were a few
different public comments And one of the
[1:08:45] things that that I was asking is what is
our actual cost
[1:08:50] for doing business on this So I understand
we're charging the interest rate because
[1:08:54] we're getting charged interest rate and I
[1:08:58] passing it on But my question is um
because now I'm hearing that this has been
[1:09:04] going on for 20 some years but um when I
did research last September I understand
[1:09:10] that there was a revision in uh completed
in 2017 So um that's I'm just curious
[1:09:16] about what does the city actually need
from a resident with the assessment And
[1:09:21] that's my question about the interest And
so the question for this body is do we
[1:09:27] need that extra rounded up and 2% or do we
not need that And um particularly when um
[1:09:34] folks were talking about if they could go
out and refinance it they would have
[1:09:40] and they can't afford to do that So here
they're stuck with this interest rate And
[1:09:45] one of the things I appreciate is that
once it's locked in it's locked in which
[1:09:51] is which is a double edged sword right So
if the interest rates go way down then
[1:09:56] they're still locked into that interest
rate But if interest rates go way back go
[1:10:01] way up then they are still locked in But
that's my my ultimate question is what do
[1:10:06] we really need and what are we willing
What is this body willing to accept or
[1:10:12] charge for that
[1:10:14] opportunity for the person to have to pay
the assessment
[1:10:19] And what do we really need
[1:10:24] Can I let Ron ask a question Maybe they'll
build on it Is that okay Or did you have
[1:10:28] or did you even have your hand up
[1:10:30] Yeah I did yeah
[1:10:31] Would that add on to it or should we let
the staff respond to that one
[1:10:34] Let let staff respond and then I'll
respond
[1:10:37] No I I don't know that that was a question
directed at finance specifically or staff
[1:10:43] I think that was a good way of framing It
is as Zach pointed out we're on the very
[1:10:50] conservative end of financing and funding
These projects were way less than 50% of
[1:10:55] the assessed value of the project So it's
a financing source that council needs to
[1:11:00] consider what our policy is both on the
assessed rate as well as the borrowing
[1:11:06] rate so that we can do these projects in a
sustainable way without placing
[1:11:12] too much burden maybe just on overall
[1:11:18] General fund tax residents essentially
Yeah
[1:11:21] Yep
[1:11:24] A comment that you know with our low uh
assessment to the actual homeowner you
[1:11:29] know we're much lower than the norm Our
interest rate policy is pretty much right
[1:11:33] at the norm you know for all the examples
you showed but in relation to your
[1:11:38] question residents saying well they go out
and refinance it themselves or they could
[1:11:42] afford to do it Well the city has to pay
upfront costs as well to administer the
[1:11:47] bond So if you're going to go and buy by
bonds There's administrative costs
[1:11:52] associated with doing that just like
closing costs and things like that Just
[1:11:55] just the same not the same as a mortgage
but similar to a mortgage So that's part
[1:12:01] of that additional interest rate piece But
I think um you know we are very
[1:12:05] conservative on what we're charging the
the residents to begin with So they're
[1:12:09] paying an interest rate on a much lower
principal than they would in other
[1:12:13] communities So I think I think we're good
where we're at
[1:12:20] Mayor And then I will go to Kim
[1:12:22] I want to say that I have a building on
Old West Main And when you redid Old West
[1:12:28] Main what I was charged was very very
reasonable I think it was 10 or $11,000
[1:12:32] for my 60 foot And I thought it was very
For what we got out of that on Old West
[1:12:39] Main I think it was very very good
[1:12:43] Kim And then I think
[1:12:45] I'll just
[1:12:46] Echo what Ron said You know I think our
interest rates are reasonable
[1:12:53] for what we do and with what we assess
people on projects is way below the norm
[1:13:00] Having been at the conference of the
League of Minnesota Cities and being the
[1:13:05] last men standing
[1:13:08] It's like people kind of were amazed So I
think we're in the ballpark and we're fair
[1:13:14] to our residents
[1:13:17] Becky
[1:13:17] Well I'll agree with that I think
considering that we're at that 25%
[1:13:21] assessment rate I don't have an issue so
much with this now that I understand a
[1:13:26] little bit more But I will say this I'll
contrast a little bit I looked at similar
[1:13:31] homes and some of the last few
reconstruction projects And while it is a
[1:13:36] low rate I've thought about what it would
do to you know my income having to pay
[1:13:41] some of what I was assessed And that would
have been a really hard hit for me And
[1:13:46] what I think is a pretty modest home Um so
in contrast I thought it was it can hit
[1:13:52] hard for families but given that um I
think that I think I asked the same
[1:13:57] question really that Vicki Joe asked which
is
[1:14:01] what what are we trying to accomplish What
is the cost Are we trying to So I I think
[1:14:07] there's an ambiguity ambiguity about what
the cost is I think that the cost is the
[1:14:12] build and the administrative costs and
staff time and all the other things that
[1:14:17] we do not just how much concrete we pour
Right But like Zach said it's also all the
[1:14:23] you know the sewer and water and all of
those things Um plus the administrative
[1:14:28] costs it might not be the borrowing rate
that might be a separate thing or it could
[1:14:34] be looped into the cost But I think what
we should be thinking about is are is the
[1:14:40] goal to cover 25% of the total cost which
includes administrative And then are we
[1:14:45] accomplishing that or is the goal to do
25% of the total cost plus recoup our
[1:14:50] borrowing rate And if that's the goal then
when we do it internally when we don't do
[1:14:56] a bond we would change the line in there
that says if it's an internal I think
[1:15:01] there is
[1:15:03] There's a specific line Um if no debt was
issued the rate of interest shall be the
[1:15:09] bond buyer's index rounded up But if it's
an internally funded no debt then why are
[1:15:14] we recouping that interest if we're not
trying to recoup that bond again For now I
[1:15:20] think because we're at a 25% assessment um
which is I agree which is a low assessment
[1:15:25] rate though it would feel pretty heavy for
for some residents So I'm not advocating
[1:15:30] to change that because I think that that
you know everybody tips into the pot
[1:15:36] That's the other philosophy is that
everybody who uses the streets chips into
[1:15:40] that pot which is how we're Why it's paid
by the taxpayers why the other 75% is paid
[1:15:46] by the taxpayers Um so given that I
support what we have right now However I
[1:15:51] think that this merits some further study
What is our objective and then is the
[1:15:56] policy meeting that objective
[1:16:01] So I just want to clarify something is I
mean Tony we assessed 50% do we not
[1:16:08] Well as Zach pointed out um 50% is our
policy But in practice based on that fee
[1:16:14] schedule we're actually assessing quite a
bit less more like 25%
[1:16:19] But that depends on the project So I mean
you have a you have an alleyway If you're
[1:16:24] if you're doing an alleyway or something
of that nature I would guess that's being
[1:16:27] assessed at 50% right
[1:16:29] Yeah They have different rates Um yeah
[1:16:32] So it's not 25 across the board I mean it
can vary
[1:16:36] Yeah
[1:16:37] They generally end up being fairly low
though Um
[1:16:41] yeah Not we don't ever really hit 50% or
even close to it
[1:16:49] Okay
[1:16:52] Well does anybody else have any last
thoughts or
[1:16:56] Actions
[1:16:56] To take No action So I want to make sure
we didn't move on before
[1:17:01] And if we took no action that means it
stays in place Correct Okay
[1:17:06] All right We'll move on to nine C then
which is the 2027 budget discussion
[1:17:15] Tony's on the hot spot today
[1:17:18] Yeah we really stacked mine back to back
here
[1:17:20] Thank you Yep You're ready to go
[1:17:23] Um I'm going to get this one going from up
here And then I'll probably slide back
[1:17:28] over just so I'm it's easier to answer
questions from over there but I'll just
[1:17:33] give the quick overview here Um so 2027
budget We had a workshop On August 3rd How
[1:17:39] do I get this
[1:17:40] Bottom right corner
[1:17:48] Slide show
[1:17:54] Thank you Michelle
[1:17:56] So 2027 budget update On August 3rd we had
a preliminary workshop at which we had a
[1:18:06] 3.99% levy
[1:18:10] So as you see on the top here we were at a
3.99% levy level Um what we've done is we
[1:18:18] have some updates here that we can talk
about tonight or have further discussion
[1:18:23] on where council wants to be Um and then
there's some questions to be answered or
[1:18:30] discussed Now this is
[1:18:33] this is a fluid process as finance says
several times I mean there's updates and
[1:18:38] changes We're trying to capture some
static data here to give you for a one
[1:18:43] moment in time shot Um but what I tried to
do here that's a little different from
[1:18:48] what we included in the staff report is
those above the line items there we have
[1:18:53] the preliminary proposed and then we have
a couple of items that are above the line
[1:18:59] Now one of them is a CIP project itself Um
that's one that was brought up at that
[1:19:05] August 3rd workshop And we had the
discussion and that was a redundant
[1:19:09] project that simply has been eliminated
from the CIP
[1:19:13] Um that second item there the
miscellaneous changes
[1:19:19] That includes dozens probably even a
hundred minor changes to the budget minor
[1:19:24] little operating things that departments
have either requested to add or we've
[1:19:29] continued to fine tune And you know a
department has said we don't need a couple
[1:19:36] of printers or things so that that
miscellaneous changes line that is
[1:19:42] capturing all of those operating one time
specific things and just netting them all
[1:19:48] together rather than listing out a hundred
separate changes for you So then those are
[1:19:54] those are the changes that essentially
have been made already Um we have enough
[1:20:00] information to factor those in Then
there's those below the item changes And
[1:20:06] these are things that
[1:20:09] need more discussion need more information
We don't have final determination on any
[1:20:14] of these but we felt like it's an
important time that we at least have some
[1:20:19] good enough information on all of them and
just need to start the discussion on some
[1:20:25] of these projects So um we have a couple
CIP items that I think Zach will briefly
[1:20:31] touch on tonight just for a little more
explanation Um
[1:20:35] and then the item there for eliminating
extra that's one that's been asked for by
[1:20:41] council for over a year now We finally
we've worked with IntelliSense The
[1:20:46] insurance committee has met in August we
were able to take a look at the data and
[1:20:52] get a pretty conservative So this is a
very conservative number and we feel like
[1:20:57] it's going to be important for you to keep
that number in mind or that part of the
[1:21:04] discussion um based on a number of factors
that are going to occur We still have a
[1:21:10] workshop in August or not August It is
August in October October 5th Um that'll
[1:21:16] go into this a little more depth but we've
done enough legwork to have a number here
[1:21:22] to be able to show you the conservative
potential impact This number hopefully is
[1:21:27] on the high side As far as if a change
needed to be made Um so all of this what
[1:21:35] it does is it captures where we were at as
of publishing this for you last Thursday
[1:21:41] which is essentially if we made all these
changes now some of which still need to be
[1:21:47] determined we're at roughly a 3.5% levy
increase
[1:21:51] Um
[1:21:54] So then what we've done based on the last
discussion and Chris will probably chime
[1:21:59] in on this point is based on feedback from
the August 3rd workshop
[1:22:05] We've added in either a 2% preliminary
levy increase to offer council flexibility
[1:22:10] or a 1% preliminary levy increase for
flexibility or the third option that's not
[1:22:16] listed here but would just go right from
where we left off on the August 3rd
[1:22:22] workshop would be to stay at a 3.99%
Preliminary levy I think those options are
[1:22:28] all things that we should discuss And if
there's any other changes or things that
[1:22:35] were included in the packet for
attachments if you have any of those
[1:22:40] questions I'll be ready to answer
[1:22:44] And maybe I'll just clarify again to Tony
and Chris and Marshall on there So we're
[1:22:48] looking at a preliminary levy vote on
September 14th So that's why this is
[1:22:53] extremely important
[1:22:53] Correct
[1:22:54] Correct
[1:22:55] I'll go back to the
[1:22:56] With no more workshops between now and
then
[1:22:58] Correct I'll go back to the
[1:23:00] Calendar really quickly
[1:23:01] Yes
[1:23:02] The next budget date we have is that
September 14th And we need to set
[1:23:07] preliminary levies for the city And then
of course the port and the HRA Um so this
[1:23:12] is kind of our last opportunity for
direction on what you want prepared um
[1:23:17] prior to that meeting
[1:23:18] And we can always go lower on a final levy
if we need to
[1:23:21] Mhm
[1:23:22] Yes That's an important consideration
[1:23:24] For me too
[1:23:25] So we can't go up
[1:23:27] Yes
[1:23:29] Thank you And then I'll leave That was my
last
[1:23:32] So if I could play the transition music
Tony can go back to his seat I'm going to
[1:23:39] say the important piece here is that that
that number the 301 is a really good
[1:23:44] number for going back to the the group
health plan But the piece that really
[1:23:49] needs to come at that October So it will
be after our setting the preliminary levy
[1:23:55] is what are the potential impacts one year
down the road So that is um in some ways
[1:24:02] it's because of the diligent work of
separating out some of the higher cost
[1:24:06] claimants And and um you know having that
option that has enabled us to get like
[1:24:12] last year we wouldn't have gotten that bid
It would have been closer to I think it
[1:24:18] was over a million in estimates that we
had from IntelliSense to to actually add
[1:24:23] the currently 37 exempt employees back to
the group plan This year the estimate is
[1:24:29] 301,000 It's doable but then the renewal
for the entire group could be significant
[1:24:34] Like we could be looking at the 15 20 25%
renewal cost So there's a lot more
[1:24:40] information that needs to be in front of
you before anyone makes a decision on that
[1:24:45] For sure
[1:24:46] And maybe to piggyback that's one of the
important things of the staff survey that
[1:24:50] we talked about a little bit today with
DDA So yes because I know some people
[1:24:54] don't care for it but there might be some
employees out there that really like it
[1:24:58] too So I think it'll be really important
to figure out what our staff needs and
[1:25:02] wants So Right
[1:25:04] So then the other thing that I think Tony
alluded to is a couple of these CIP items
[1:25:09] We really haven't had exclusive updates on
them And I don't know how much detail you
[1:25:14] can provide on the spot Zach But if on the
[1:25:19] at least explaining what the $150,000
Broad Street to the crossing improvements
[1:25:24] and what that implies for moving forward
with grant projects And then secondly the
[1:25:29] what the intended purpose of the
[1:25:33] 2705 Riverfront Trail expenditures were
for
[1:25:36] Yeah I can give an update I'll just go in
the order there So the first one with the
[1:25:43] Broad Street railroad crossing uh that one
is for the Broad Street railroad crossing
[1:25:48] specifically pedestrian focused uh the
roadway and all that is fine Um nothing
[1:25:53] specifically there Uh this initially kind
of came back up I mean it was talked about
[1:25:59] throughout the quiet zone process for the
last couple decades when that was in the
[1:26:04] works And then as we finalized that
process um and I believe I talked briefly
[1:26:09] about this a couple times in the past when
we've talked about the implementation of
[1:26:15] this one
[1:26:17] Pedestrian improvements are not a specific
requirement for quiet zones yet They're
[1:26:24] like an ancillary thing Essentially if the
railroad thinks it's not good enough they
[1:26:29] could require an improvement to be made
there But there's not a specific criteria
[1:26:35] like there is for the roadway Um and so
during our process we they basically did
[1:26:41] identify that it's not ideal And if you
would look out there you'd probably tell
[1:26:47] why there's not enough space The gate arms
are in the sidewalks It's not an ideal
[1:26:54] crossing for pedestrians And it's a really
not great crossing for bicyclists using
[1:26:59] the roadway with the turns and access to
the trail there Um so it's something just
[1:27:06] we leave ourselves a potential risk of
losing the quiet zone If for a reason the
[1:27:12] railroad were to come back or the Fra in
the future and say you know we don't think
[1:27:19] this is safe enough So that's just a piece
of it But just in general we know that
[1:27:27] that's our one and only crossing in the
entire downtown corridor It's adjacent to
[1:27:32] the Amtrak station The why Potential
future uh large residential developments
[1:27:37] the Saint James the Riverboats levee park
essentially our trailhead to the
[1:27:41] Riverfront trail which will tie into the
next item So there's a lot of movement
[1:27:48] there And from an engineering perspective
I believe from a community development
[1:27:52] perspective Kyle's been involved in the
discussions to um we think it would be a
[1:27:58] worthwhile improvement for pedestrians and
bicyclists to upgrade that crossing Uh so
[1:28:03] that's why that's in there The specific
amount is to basically get through a do
[1:28:09] the design of the project That would be
assuming we go after some grants this fall
[1:28:16] which this all kind of implies Um we have
a good chance of scoring well on grants
[1:28:23] and we have funds this year to do that
application process And if we got those
[1:28:29] grants typically they're like one and two
is out Um depending on the grant So I'd be
[1:28:36] looking at a design next year with the
implementation in 2028 to utilize grant
[1:28:42] funding But grant funding doesn't cover
the entire process So you know say next
[1:28:47] year's CIP there would be likely another
[1:28:51] if it was all city funded probably at
least about 350,000 to do the final
[1:28:57] construction for the non city match
portion So if that's a project that you
[1:29:01] want to commit to there's further
commitments But unless we want to fund it
[1:29:06] all we do need we would need to start and
go after the grants and to go after the
[1:29:13] grants We need to commit to the project
That's what that one's there for Um the
[1:29:18] Riverfront trail kind of just alluded to
that This this also goes back a few
[1:29:23] decades and it has been worked through up
to this point with getting it connected to
[1:29:29] Bay point getting it connected to Levee
Park Just this year finishing up that
[1:29:34] connection between Barn Bluff and Covell
Park Now the one and only remaining gap is
[1:29:39] between Barn Bluff and Levee Park And
prior to doing the segment we just
[1:29:44] completed that was actually the targeted
segment back in the last decade or so And
[1:29:49] there's some challenges with that A fair
amount of money was spent on a study that
[1:29:54] looked at a bunch of aspects regarding the
river route and the challenges there and
[1:29:59] basically they skipped over that segment
tackled the segment that was more doable
[1:30:04] immediately So now we're circling back to
completing that gap which is why I put it
[1:30:09] in there We do also have in my head just
thinking towards their other future
[1:30:14] projects that it ties into as well Uh the
plan that would go along the river has
[1:30:20] been identified as going around the
wastewater treatment plant on the water
[1:30:24] side We're obviously in the midst of
talking about that project and just making
[1:30:29] sure that if that was the route that that
would accommodate it And just talk briefly
[1:30:35] with Sean And we think that it it'd
probably be fine to accommodate but it's
[1:30:40] good to keep in mind that we're not going
to cost ourselves more money in the future
[1:30:46] by not properly accommodating that or the
other reason why I put this in there And
[1:30:51] these are just for more feasibility um
studies to just get us more on the path to
[1:30:57] actually getting something done If we
can't go the river route what are our
[1:31:02] options In my mind the other option is to
go the other way around the bluff It's not
[1:31:08] really desired And back in the early 2000
when there was a steering committee and
[1:31:13] everything developed that was very
specific to a riverfront trail So that's
[1:31:17] why that's the preferred option to go on
the river But if that were to not be the
[1:31:23] desired option potential to go down Fifth
Street and connect in through downtown
[1:31:28] more or less And if we do that there's
likely a chance we'd end up going down
[1:31:34] Fifth Street to fourth Street to Potter
Street and maybe tying in with say the
[1:31:39] Eisenhower Bridge And in 2029 we have
plans to reconstruct Potter and Fourth
[1:31:43] Street So also wanting to make sure if
that was a route that we wanted to pivot
[1:31:49] to we don't put in sidewalk and then want
to tear that sidewalk out and put in a
[1:31:55] trail So just trying to make sure we're
forward thinking a bit and covering all
[1:32:00] our bases with that feasibility study And
that amount would definitely should be
[1:32:05] enough to do feasibility study some public
engagement to see if public viewpoints
[1:32:09] have changed and try to get this to a
point where we could make a decision to go
[1:32:15] no go after grants or other funding or
whatever the next steps would look like
[1:32:22] Madam president if I could for sure
[1:32:25] Go ahead Marshall
[1:32:26] I would just mention there on the list
because I placed them on the list because
[1:32:32] they do need some more internal dialogue
There has also been conversations previous
[1:32:37] to the on the rail crossing trying to get
that incorporated within the TIF district
[1:32:43] and utilizing TIF revenue if there is
sufficient TIF revenue to help pay for
[1:32:48] that And there's also um we just like a
little more time to make sure we don't
[1:32:54] have a comprehensive study on that small
segment to connect over towards the water
[1:33:00] treatment plant So um those are just a
couple more considerations More internal
[1:33:05] dialogue is necessary on those
[1:33:09] Well thank you Question Any other
questions or thoughts at this time on the
[1:33:14] Cips Maybe we start there
[1:33:22] Okay I guess not Is there anything else
that we want to cover on that then that we
[1:33:28] did on the Cips and
[1:33:31] We can go to the next slide
[1:33:32] Okay Um
[1:33:34] So what we're looking for tonight I guess
is any direction on we've tried to
[1:33:40] highlight a few of the larger things to
keep in mind that still need to be
[1:33:45] determined You know if there's a change in
group health plan from ICRA or if there's
[1:33:51] a few of these CIP projects that need more
internal consideration before we're doing
[1:33:56] them Um but outside of that I mean there's
still our list sort of pending from the
[1:34:02] last workshop of potential budget adds to
bear in mind Um I don't know the timing of
[1:34:08] it but if if or when we have the um
[1:34:12] I forget the name of it Mike the
[1:34:16] the community risk assessment Thank you
for that Um from the fire department Um
[1:34:22] there may be a request at some point
following that or a consideration to add
[1:34:28] some more fire department department
personnel um
[1:34:32] longevity pay or other you know
compensation related adjustments
[1:34:39] um funding for community survey in 27 uh
we discussed at the workshop funding for
[1:34:48] community festivals or special events
[1:34:50] Actually I should I should have clarified
that this morning that is included in the
[1:34:55] budget at or not this community survey
sorry
[1:34:59] I'm getting confused
[1:35:02] Is 15,000
[1:35:06] 15,000 is included in this These numbers
[1:35:10] Yes 15,000 is the amount that is currently
in there for
[1:35:16] a community survey Now there was some
internal discussion on whether or not that
[1:35:21] was enough for a um I think it's to do a
full comprehensive survey prior to the
[1:35:28] strategic We have 15,000 in there for the
strategic plan effort
[1:35:34] But that's correct
[1:35:36] But not the
[1:35:38] Not for a
[1:35:39] Survey
[1:35:39] Community
[1:35:40] Survey
[1:35:40] Beforehand
[1:35:42] So that's that's what this is If we want
to do a comprehensive survey before
[1:35:47] strategic plan initiative that would be an
item that is not currently in there Um we
[1:35:53] talked about it earlier this evening at
the workshop the funding for community
[1:35:58] festivals and events I mean that's a
potential ad change I think we got
[1:36:03] direction on that
[1:36:05] um
[1:36:07] dog park That's been another
[1:36:09] hot button issue but I don't think we have
anything currently in the budget for dog
[1:36:14] park so we need more direction or that
it's a decision that's going to come after
[1:36:19] we're setting a preliminary levy here So
it's a it's something to keep in mind
[1:36:26] And then on the flip side of that any
reductions Um so whether or not we reduce
[1:36:32] or eliminate performance pay or other
compensation related things deferring
[1:36:36] capital projects which you know we've
presented a few and if there's any others
[1:36:41] we'll continue to have internal
discussions on anything in the CIP which
[1:36:45] we included as an attachment And I hope
you've all had a chance to look through Um
[1:36:54] We continue
[1:36:55] Every
[1:36:55] Day every week to reevaluate those
discretionary items and we're factoring
[1:37:00] those in Um
[1:37:02] We included those reserve amounts for
alternative funding strategies Internally
[1:37:06] the Capital Project Reserve Fund has a
little over 900,000 that if we identify
[1:37:12] any of these projects where we can utilize
any of those funds we may consider or even
[1:37:19] the Green Fund there's some money in the
Green Fund And then lastly the policy
[1:37:25] change of you know converting all the
exempt employees over to the plan And you
[1:37:31] know that'll just be a decision that needs
both more information coming in October
[1:37:36] and then more discussion and consideration
on that before we can actually make a
[1:37:42] change
[1:37:44] But those are important factors to weigh
in
[1:37:48] I have a question Do you do we have a
sheet or a write up on each of those
[1:37:53] subjects What the uh reduction would look
like
[1:37:58] Help me out
[1:37:58] The reduction on
[1:38:00] If we were to reduce or eliminate
performance pay what does that look like
[1:38:05] How much are we going to reduce Next one
Same the same thing for every one of them
[1:38:10] What would that would that would what
would it look like
[1:38:13] Yeah I can address that So on the first
one we haven't done an analysis yet on
[1:38:19] we provided one last year And I feel like
we could dust that off and it'd be a fair
[1:38:27] or close estimate once again Last year in
the discussion we reduced it from 5% down
[1:38:33] to the four and a half Um 300,000 is
jumping to my head right now of what our
[1:38:40] annual estimated amount was city wide Okay
Um and then as far as those other items I
[1:38:46] mean um deferring capital projects or CIP
items that's a matter of simply going
[1:38:51] through that CIP we provided and seeing if
there's any items in there We continue to
[1:38:58] have dialogue as staff regularly about
different CIP items and where they can
[1:39:03] move around or be deferred But we're kind
of at a
[1:39:08] standstill right now where we feel
comfortable with what's in there for both
[1:39:12] the five year plan and for 2027 As long as
the as far as the work plan goes
[1:39:19] Um
[1:39:25] Yeah I guess that's all I have to add as
far as your questions Is that address
[1:39:30] looking for
[1:39:33] And Tony maybe again to clarify um you
know in past years we've had a lot of
[1:39:39] discussion about the ambulance fund and
kind of the general you know the balance
[1:39:44] reserve transfer taking it from the
reserve fund So as of right now with the
[1:39:49] numbers again presented we have kind of
that ambulance fund large
[1:39:55] Addition in there right now That's a no
kind of general like fund balance transfer
[1:40:00] to help reduce the levy Is that the right
way to say it
[1:40:05] Um
[1:40:06] let me try to address it Maybe a little
different way
[1:40:09] Okay
[1:40:10] Um so we do have two things in there for
the ambulance fund We have one which is
[1:40:17] the use of the unassigned fund balance
That's a one time purposeful transfer
[1:40:21] That's to address that pre-existing
deficit that is built up over the course
[1:40:26] of the last 4 to 5 years So that's one
component And then the other component we
[1:40:33] do still have that annual transfer
[1:40:35] Now I remember the discussion Yeah
[1:40:36] Which is a contribution or a subsidy from
the general fund to the ambulance fund
[1:40:44] That's still at the
[1:40:47] um increased amount We've increased or
stepped that up over the course of the
[1:40:52] last few years to try to prevent that
ambulance from fun from going even further
[1:40:57] into deficit So we do have both of those
pieces in
[1:41:01] I remember like about 2 million for both
of those
[1:41:04] Uh it's actually when you combine both of
them it's close to 4 million for a
[1:41:08] transfer
[1:41:08] Never mind But and I know that's going to
be a whole nother discussion but I just
[1:41:12] for my mind needed to kind of put that in
again
[1:41:14] So but only that annual operating amount
would be a current year levy or revenue
[1:41:21] source right Yep
[1:41:24] And that do you know that off the top of
your head is it 750
[1:41:27] Yes It's still 750,000
[1:41:33] Other comments from people Vicki
[1:41:34] Joe I've got a few things Um one of the
things I'm just thinking about is that
[1:41:40] there are going to be additional Medicare
and Medicaid cuts after the first of the
[1:41:46] year and I anticipate that will impact our
ambulance fund again because those
[1:41:51] reimbursement rates will go down again So
I think we need to be mindful of that as
[1:41:57] we are considering because with our aging
population and with people not feeling
[1:42:02] comfortable or safe going to the doctor
regularly I imagine more emergency calls
[1:42:07] versus people doing preventive care or
ongoing treatment because they can't
[1:42:11] afford it And and I'm really mindful of
that when we're thinking about this and um
[1:42:17] and
[1:42:18] transition forward when I was listening to
the budget meeting um something that Kim
[1:42:23] had said that really is still sitting with
me is that we can't I don't remember
[1:42:28] exactly how you said it but it was almost
like it was glossed over and then somebody
[1:42:33] else started talking again But it was
something about like making sure that we
[1:42:37] have um that the levy when it's when it's
set isn't the absolute we have continuing
[1:42:43] conversation And I think with all these
variables that are in I think it's
[1:42:47] incredibly shortsighted to say what we're
going to do 3.5 and go down or we're going
[1:42:52] to do 3.9 and go down I think it makes way
more sense to give ourselves this
[1:42:57] opportunity to be aware of what's
happening in the bigger world That's going
[1:43:01] to definitely impact our ambulance fund
and other things that may come in And I'm
[1:43:06] also curious about things like I don't
know fuel costs because they kind of do
[1:43:11] this crazy thing How much is diesel fuel
anyway these days How much is that Do you
[1:43:16] know how much that is
[1:43:18] I don't know what we paid but at the pump
it's 537 There you go
[1:43:23] Five that I know
[1:43:25] So I don't know I'm not really raising my
hand to say please don't plow my street in
[1:43:32] the winter Um so that fuel cost which is
unpredictable at best I think running the
[1:43:37] city keeping the city going I think we
need to be open minded and say let's start
[1:43:43] let's start high and agree that there will
be additional things just to give the
[1:43:49] assurance that all of these things that
are maybes can be effectively worked on
[1:43:53] That's my um my ask or recommendation
[1:44:00] Beth
[1:44:00] I agree with Vicki
[1:44:02] I think we said it next week Well the next
meeting I won't be at Um but I do agree We
[1:44:08] give us
[1:44:10] room to work I wouldn't I wouldn't be
happy if it were five Whatever is being
[1:44:16] suggested but I think we need room to work
[1:44:22] And general fine with that to
[1:44:25] other people
[1:44:26] Ron I'm not in favor of that I mean it's
we need to get this down
[1:44:30] We need to reduce our spending And that's
just where I'm at I can't
[1:44:35] I can't go over certainly what what the
preliminary was was first proposed by
[1:44:38] staff at 3.99 And now we're talking about
going even higher
[1:44:43] No I can't So any of the additions listed
there It's a no for me and several of the
[1:44:48] potential budget reductions are a yes for
me as well
[1:44:53] as for CIP goes Sean We had a report on
the athletic field you know the agreement
[1:44:59] or whatever Um and we see stuff still in
the CIP I know we talked about there's
[1:45:05] probably going to be some city costs
associated with that Does the CIP reflect
[1:45:10] the new agreement with the athletic field
the baseball association
[1:45:14] Yes The costs in the CIP are outside of
the projects that the Baseball Association
[1:45:19] is taking on
[1:45:24] Any other comments Becky
[1:45:27] Well the only comment I agree with setting
it high That gives us some room to have
[1:45:33] the not high but a reasonable amount that
gives a conversation to have between now
[1:45:39] and when we actually agree to the to the
levy in December The one thing that I feel
[1:45:45] really strongly Well actually I'm going to
step back with a question Um Chrissy had
[1:45:50] mentioned that the renewal rate would be
could potentially be high So my
[1:45:55] understanding with the insurance is that
on occasion 1 or 2 or a few employees can
[1:46:01] really sort of have a high claim years And
that's what trips the the renewal rate So
[1:46:09] I'm I guess I'm I'm confused
[1:46:13] that you say that the renewal rate could
potentially be really high Is that if
[1:46:18] they're bringing us back on on a $300,000
[1:46:22] Is there data to support that the renewal
rate could potentially be that like
[1:46:25] significantly higher or is that just a
sort of a guess because you're bringing on
[1:46:28] more people Like where where does that
risk come from Or is it just an ambiguous
[1:46:32] risk
[1:46:33] There is data to support that That comes
from IntelliSense That's actually the
[1:46:36] reason we're having or we're calling for
that workshop is to provide some of that
[1:46:40] data for you to consider
[1:46:43] I guess Yeah Yeah
[1:46:44] Madam president
[1:46:46] Sir Marshall
[1:46:47] Yeah So there's two things going on here
So I just want to make sure they're clear
[1:46:53] The first is what Tony told you We have
reasonable assurance that that number is
[1:46:59] uh 300 plus thousand is is a conservative
estimate of what it would take to get
[1:47:05] everybody on the group health plan 27 with
the council administrator is referring to
[1:47:10] is what happens in the renewal rate in 28
Once everybody comes back on 27 and you
[1:47:16] see the experience of the whole group what
happens to the group health plan rates
[1:47:22] moving into 28 and beyond Thank you
[1:47:25] Yeah And I would just add that that's
something that we're further evaluating Um
[1:47:31] the insurance committee met in the middle
of August here just to get the initial
[1:47:37] data And we're working closely with
IntelliSense to get a couple different
[1:47:42] scenarios But exactly what Councilwoman
Naughton is describing We're trying to
[1:47:46] evaluate a couple scenarios as far as if
[1:47:51] you know almost like a worst case scenario
if those high cost claimants go back into
[1:47:56] the pool what effect is that going to have
on what we need to do with our funding
[1:48:03] I know the mayor had his hand up
[1:48:05] I used to deal with health insurance for
my old company Is this kind of like a
[1:48:09] first year We want to get you in at a
lower rate and then geez it just happens
[1:48:14] to go up you know
[1:48:16] Um I won't go too far in depth on this
conversation but we talked for a couple
[1:48:21] hours about this internally a couple of
weeks ago
[1:48:25] That was kind of our worry at first too or
our suspicion Um we asked a lot of
[1:48:31] questions with IntelliSense
[1:48:33] shortly I would say no And the reason
being is because we're self-insured we are
[1:48:39] funding our own insurance Um I think we
had the same suspicions that Is this too
[1:48:46] good to be true Are we in some way being
tricked here into two rosy of a situation
[1:48:54] Um there's some other underlying factors
but what we still don't have worked out
[1:49:00] and what we're going to bring in October
is a more
[1:49:05] thorough evaluation of our
[1:49:10] Census our our people to try to predict
whether or not those costs would actually
[1:49:17] increase substantially or if we feel like
it could be absorbed And again I we've
[1:49:24] projected it initially in the 301 000 is
hopefully a conservative initial year cost
[1:49:30] And then down the road we just we're in
the evaluating stages
[1:49:35] But and obviously it depends if we have
any large claims and we don't know that
[1:49:40] Yep We're trying to we're doing predictive
analysis on that And IntelliSense is
[1:49:44] helping us with that
[1:49:45] So thank you
[1:49:46] Yep
[1:49:48] Any other comments from people
[1:49:52] Any other guidance that staff feels like
they need
[1:49:58] I think we mostly heard that having the
flexibility
[1:50:03] towards the higher end is where we're
comfortable at the moment But I didn't
[1:50:08] hear I don't think I wrote down anything
for Don or Kim or the mayor
[1:50:16] I think what I said at the last meeting
was sufficient
[1:50:22] Same here
[1:50:25] I haven't changed my thought process
[1:50:27] Okay
[1:50:28] With that I think we have enough direction
then
[1:50:32] Thank you
[1:50:33] Thank you Thank you very much It's a lot
of work
[1:50:36] Yep All right We'll move on to number ten
in our agenda tonight Communication items
[1:50:41] and ten A is our Housing and Redevelopment
Authority update with Curt
[1:50:51] I'll bet you enjoyed staying here all late
tonight huh Didn't you put it out the room
[1:50:57] Um
[1:50:59] thank you for the opportunity to come in
front of you and just give you a brief
[1:51:03] update about what the HRA has been doing
and going to be doing Uh you had a written
[1:51:08] report I just want to highlight a couple
of things I know we've talked about Jordan
[1:51:12] Tower and the big plumbing replacement
project that we're doing And it seems like
[1:51:16] every time I come I say it's close it's
close it's close This time it's actually
[1:51:20] really close
[1:51:22] We're going to do a pre-construction
meeting in the middle of September The
[1:51:26] contractor should mobilize to the site by
the middle of October and they'll start
[1:51:31] ripping and tearing on the ground floor
Our main sewer and water lines uh in
[1:51:37] November with actual work in residence
units starting just after the holidays we
[1:51:41] decided to wait till after Christmas and
New Year's before we start moving people
[1:51:46] around there So that's kind of exciting
And then on top of that we had enough
[1:51:52] money to do Jordan Tower one We were a
little short on our family sites and so we
[1:51:58] went back to Minnesota Housing and said
would you consider a funding modification
[1:52:03] And to our delight uh July their board
meeting agreed to that So we now have
[1:52:09] enough funding to move forward with the
family site project that because of timing
[1:52:14] and how very long it takes to get to
closing on the financing that will start
[1:52:20] probably in 2027 sometime the first
quarter maybe uh and finish in 2027 as
[1:52:25] well So it's it's been a big project that
takes a lot of bandwidth from staff and
[1:52:31] we're very close to that So we're excited
about that On the voucher side you just
[1:52:36] call your attention on the federal
vouchers If you've been paying attention
[1:52:41] you'll see that that number of utilized
vouchers keeps floating downward Right We
[1:52:45] used to be 13125 Now we're 119 and that's
simply a function of rents increasing and
[1:52:51] the federal funding staying static So we
can we can't help as many people at a
[1:52:57] higher rent than we could before So that's
why it's important that the other two
[1:53:02] state funded programs are there We use
bridges And now to bring it home program
[1:53:08] to help try and keep the number of
vouchers in our community somewhat steady
[1:53:13] So this is a rare case where state funding
is helping us moderate the decrease in
[1:53:18] federal funding But there's no denying
that our waiting list continues to grow
[1:53:23] We're now up to 448 people So you know the
need is there The resources at the federal
[1:53:30] level are staying static at best Luckily
the state has come forward but I don't
[1:53:35] know how long that will hold either The
other thing I would call your attention to
[1:53:41] on the on the second page and is kind of
exciting is the Jefferson School RFP The
[1:53:47] Housing and Redevelopment Authority is
considering submitting a proposal along
[1:53:50] with Three Rivers Community Action and the
HRA commissioners will hear that in a
[1:53:55] workshop on September 3rd at 1:00 If any
of you would like to attend and be in the
[1:54:02] know of what we're proposing there And
then the my commissioners will be asked to
[1:54:07] either approve submission or reject
submission at their regular September 8th
[1:54:11] meeting which is just two days before the
proposals are due to the port So that's
[1:54:17] sort of exciting and I'm happy to answer
questions if I can
[1:54:22] Any questions Vicki
[1:54:23] The date and time and place again uh
[1:54:27] For the workshop is September 3rd at 1
p.m. here in council chambers
[1:54:34] Okay Thank you
[1:54:38] Thank you very much
[1:54:39] Thanks so much Have a good night
[1:54:43] All right Well we will move on to council
comments Tenby Would anybody else like to
[1:54:48] share any information
[1:54:51] Vicki Joe
[1:54:53] I know you have Go ahead I'll be quick
[1:54:55] Ladies first
[1:54:56] Okay
[1:54:58] So I got an interesting call and I guess I
might look to the chief for this
[1:55:04] particular thing Um there was a woman who
decided that the bike trail went all the
[1:55:09] way through and came up and over and was
at the base of humanity and then was
[1:55:15] biking what she thought was a trail which
it's not And she was stopped by the police
[1:55:21] officer And this officer said oh we do
this all the time And so I'm guessing that
[1:55:27] that all the time is actually a frequent
occurrence So
[1:55:34] I mean they probably put an emphasis on it
probably more than it actually happens But
[1:55:39] there's
[1:55:40] quite a few people that drive the wrong
way down places they shouldn't The
[1:55:44] railroad tracks for instance is one of the
places that sometimes people have driven
[1:55:48] down We've had a vehicle well a couple
vehicles get hit by trains because of it
[1:55:53] Mhm So it's not a surprise that somebody
drives down a trail Um I wouldn't say all
[1:55:58] the time I guess I wouldn't emphasize that
but it it occurs
[1:56:02] I imagine it does And so um I'm curious
[1:56:07] This might be over here now Is there an
opportunity for us to maybe do like some
[1:56:12] signage trail ends here for now Um and on
both sides maybe at Levy on the other side
[1:56:17] So people aren't trying to come through
thinking hey there's this new trail down
[1:56:21] there I'm going to go this way Can we is
there How much would that cost And is that
[1:56:27] would that would that be helpful That was
that was what this person was um inviting
[1:56:31] me to bring to this body is to say that it
[1:56:36] don't come here private property Stop it
Whatever you need to do
[1:56:41] Turn around Go back
[1:56:43] You know whatever The big hand Stop I
don't know if that's an offer that I
[1:56:47] wanted to bring that up here because I
think it's it's important that people
[1:56:51] aren't going where they shouldn't if they
don't know that they shouldn't be going
[1:56:54] there because this person is an avid biker
and was really disappointed And she said
[1:56:58] well if I had known I would have turned
off and gone down fifth So
[1:57:06] Can I can I piggyback on hers I know the
mayor had his hand up but um just from
[1:57:12] that perspective I would love to see I've
been an advocate for more of the sharrows
[1:57:17] and the bike ability in our community
Maybe there's even some safe routes
[1:57:21] funding And so maybe instead of the stop
you know don't go here Or maybe in
[1:57:26] addition to that is signage that says
trail continues this way or or trail
[1:57:30] continues on the road And there's more
signage that has the Sharrows on the road
[1:57:35] because I think the alternative was mapped
to sort of zigzag them through town to get
[1:57:40] them back onto the rest of the trail by
levee until that that piece continues So I
[1:57:45] mean I think some signage that would say
you know trail continues on the road
[1:57:50] Sharrows or more road painting for
Bikeability I think drivers need to know
[1:57:54] that they're sharing the road with bikers
as well So that signage is twofold gets
[1:57:59] the bikers in the right spot and helps the
drivers not run into them
[1:58:04] What she said
[1:58:05] Maybe we can get an update on that
eventually if that's possible or if it's
[1:58:09] already in the plan or if there's money I
don't know if somebody wants to respond
[1:58:14] Now I know we're putting you on the spot
but it's true
[1:58:18] Zach's talking to Sean Sean's talking to
Zach No
[1:58:22] Sean's taking notes
[1:58:23] I'm trying to get a better understanding
of exactly what we're talking about here
[1:58:28] Signage
[1:58:29] Know where this incident happened
[1:58:31] Oh at the base of
[1:58:33] where the trail ends There
[1:58:35] The new
[1:58:35] Trail The new trail
[1:58:37] Okay
[1:58:38] Trail bikers are coming from cobble up and
over the new trail Okay And then
[1:58:42] continuing by what used to be I don't know
The name of the place now is Isaac Walton
[1:58:47] Yep
[1:58:47] Past there and going that way to try to go
and continue that
[1:58:51] Private road the private road
[1:58:53] Wastewater treatment
[1:58:54] The gravel road going past treatment plant
[1:58:56] Correct Got it And being stopped by police
saying hey okay you don't belong here Um
[1:59:03] because this is private road So if we
could get signage before folks get that
[1:59:10] far Uh something saying please turn here
Don't go there at the end And also at Levy
[1:59:18] So people aren't walking that way either
Same sign like please don't go here Turn
[1:59:24] around
[1:59:26] There's a sign that says Private Road
[1:59:29] Does it Oh so whoever's doing that is not
reading
[1:59:32] I've driven past it When I went fishing
down there
[1:59:34] Okay
[1:59:35] So you're paying attention We didn't We
didn't go Admit that publicly Good job
[1:59:41] Okay
[1:59:42] I'm in the water
[1:59:44] Oh my gosh
[1:59:46] I think we'll move on to the mayor if
that's okay
[1:59:48] I don't have anything that's interesting
but uh today I saw they're not sentenced
[1:59:53] to serve Shawn Correct me again
Corrections labor was out trimming at one
[1:59:58] of our parks They did an exceptional job I
got an opportunity to talk to them and
[2:00:04] they all said thanks for the opportunity
So they really they really appreciate that
[2:00:08] opportunity Now we had a battle of the
badges on Saturday and the winner is in a
[2:00:14] blue shirt
[2:00:16] and the second first loser is in a white
shirt His team But they played fabulous I
[2:00:22] don't know who was operating the
scoreboard but he was an idiot
[2:00:26] Oh gosh
[2:00:28] It was me Oh they asked me Rise up Asked
me to run the scoreboard and I'm thinking
[2:00:33] okay push a button to run Oh no Oh no One
of the I believe on call paid on call
[2:00:39] Firefighters came in the eighth inning and
straightened it out But I was hoping
[2:00:43] That one
[2:00:45] Oh
[2:00:45] Oh yeah So I asked Neil Hammer who's doing
a great job announcing I said Neil can you
[2:00:50] help me out here He says many people have
left left this booth crying He says I have
[2:00:55] no idea
[2:00:57] So thank you And on good news I received a
letter today I know other staff have that
[2:01:04] Mpca has given us preliminary approval on
the new wastewater treatment plant plans
[2:01:09] So awesome Good
[2:01:12] That's all I have But don't ever ask me to
do the scoreboard again Unless it's like
[2:01:16] at Wrigley Field where you put a thing in
there you take one down
[2:01:21] Go ahead Go ahead Talk amongst yourselves
Yeah I was receiving numerous texts on You
[2:01:27] know it's not the ninth inning It's the
third inning It's not 21 to 4 Yeah Like I
[2:01:34] didn't know But thank you very much to
everyone who texted me
[2:01:40] All right Well any last comments I would
just do a public service announcement
[2:01:44] Maybe Becky knows this too but school does
start in Red wing Tuesday September 1st So
[2:01:49] I've actually had people in the community
that didn't realize that So if you have
[2:01:54] kids in Red wing right Tuesday September
1st Um school starts early this year
[2:01:58] because of Labor Day So and I'll hand it
over to Chris for status updates
[2:02:04] All right Um the only two that I want to
call your attention to tonight Well
[2:02:09] actually let me start with I should first
look at the dates of upcoming meetings as
[2:02:13] we've mentioned a few um additions here So
[2:02:18] obviously September 14th is a normal date
but we do have a workshop before that
[2:02:23] meeting 5 p.m. and that's as requested by
the council at the last meeting An update
[2:02:29] from the police department primarily or
from on the law enforcement Center
[2:02:34] primarily about the the proposed new
facility So it'll just be a 45 minute to
[2:02:39] you know lot less than that hour period Um
and whatever data is available at that
[2:02:45] time Um then the 28th is the standard
meeting workshop before it but we also
[2:02:51] have the October 5th workshop that was
mentioned in here as an upcoming meeting
[2:02:56] That's a newly scheduled um standalone
workshop
[2:03:01] Um I mean it could delve into budget
related topics but it's intended to be
[2:03:06] specifically about benefits benefits
analysis the survey and and kind of have a
[2:03:11] non bookended time to be able to talk
about that topic
[2:03:17] The other two things that I was going to
initially call your attention to um the
[2:03:23] public comment at the beginning of the
meeting referred to the last item in the
[2:03:28] status update and that's the Mississippi
dialogues That was initially on the agenda
[2:03:32] for tonight but we didn't have staff
reports ready And there was some some
[2:03:37] questions about exactly where it was
Because when we were finalizing the agenda
[2:03:41] packet it was before the Arts and Culture
Commission meeting last week So we instead
[2:03:46] shifted pivoted had the presentations of
sorts at public comment to make sure that
[2:03:51] you're at least aware that it's coming And
then it's intended to be on the on the
[2:03:57] agenda on the September 14th meeting I
think their concern about getting in front
[2:04:02] of you tonight was that it's supposed if
if approved it will be installed in
[2:04:07] October So they really want to make sure
that this doesn't get deferred when it
[2:04:12] comes before you at the next meeting And
then last but not least I might turn this
[2:04:17] I didn't pre discuss anything but we have
um an update um a paragraph update We have
[2:04:23] a number of links three separate links on
our um LPR program which are LPR
[2:04:28] technology which is axon Um and then
there's a separate attachment that was
[2:04:33] prepared with a lot of additional detail
of um kind of uh frequently asked
[2:04:37] questions I guess you would say And um so
we tried to provide the information that
[2:04:43] was requested and as as clear away and as
quickly as possible But I don't know if
[2:04:49] you want to present anything further Nick
or answer or if there's any additional
[2:04:53] questions but make sure you saw that in
the status update
[2:04:58] Yeah there's a lot of data privacy concern
over license plate reader cameras as you
[2:05:02] know I mean we had a couple people come in
and talk today and and people should be
[2:05:07] concerned about what we do with our data
I'm not against that by any means Um
[2:05:12] I obviously see the data and what comes
through Um so my perspective probably is a
[2:05:16] bit different than most people I did have
one of our council members take a look at
[2:05:21] it um to an extent without seeing the
actual data but seeing what it is that we
[2:05:26] do Um so I mean if you question as far as
what it is I really invite you to actually
[2:05:31] take a look at the program There's nothing
here to hide Um but I do want to let you
[2:05:36] know that the data is held within I mean
it's a cloud system It's with axon who
[2:05:41] holds all of our data by the way they hold
all of our digital evidence data they have
[2:05:46] for the last six years we haven't had any
issues Um they hold all of our body camera
[2:05:51] data They hold all of our in-car camera
data um and all of our digital evidence
[2:05:55] data which could include photos um videos
anything that you could think of that's
[2:05:59] digital um is all held on the same base
system Uh people talk about the flock
[2:06:04] cameras We don't have flock Um that's not
not a thing here Uh we went with axon for
[2:06:09] a couple reasons One we're actually not
even paying a bill this year It's free Um
[2:06:13] because we contract with them for a lot of
other services So in return for our
[2:06:17] service to them and theirs to ours we made
an agreement where we would get the first
[2:06:22] year for free and then we would pay uh
after that also with a substantial
[2:06:26] discount We didn't pay for installation
nothing Um so we actually got a really
[2:06:30] good deal on the program itself But beyond
the cost I just really want to address the
[2:06:35] data issue right So we hold the data here
Nobody else has access to it We don't
[2:06:39] share the data with anybody Nobody uh no
no other entities have access currently to
[2:06:44] our data One thing we are looking at is a
possible share with Pierce County Um there
[2:06:48] was concern of immigration use by Pierce
County if we were to do that So we have an
[2:06:53] agreement typed up that if we were to go
into an agreement with them that we would
[2:06:58] maybe take a look at that They couldn't
use that data for immigration Um but
[2:07:02] that's the only entity that we're even
looking at sharing data and we're not
[2:07:06] doing it currently Um they don't even have
the cameras installed Even they don't even
[2:07:10] have the system to to get into our cameras
anyway yet Um so they're just not there
[2:07:15] yet either Um but even the company itself
if they're going to access our data they
[2:07:19] need to go in And the only reason they do
that is to fix something in the system Uh
[2:07:24] they actually have to ask us to access it
and then it gets logged and it gets
[2:07:29] audited Um any time that our officer does
a search and I showed one of the council
[2:07:34] members this um you actually have to enter
information and even to do a search Uh and
[2:07:38] that includes the reason why you're doing
it the date and time you're doing it who's
[2:07:43] doing it Um a related ICR call for service
um related to why you're doing it Um so
[2:07:48] there is a lot of
[2:07:50] stuff that you have to enter to even get
to a point to even do a search And then
[2:07:55] all that is in an auditable program and
then we're required by the state to do an
[2:08:00] audit So we have a third party come in and
actually audit us and look at all our
[2:08:05] stuff as far as whether or not we're doing
it correctly Um so yeah you see officers
[2:08:10] that are on the news getting arrested for
misuse of data uh they're getting arrested
[2:08:14] because they got found because it tracks
them Um so I wish I could tell you that
[2:08:18] nobody's ever going to abuse technology I
can't make that promise to you So if as a
[2:08:23] council you decide that you don't want
this program anymore I understand Um and I
[2:08:27] can't make the promise that nobody here is
going to misuse it I can tell you that we
[2:08:32] have a lot of restrictions in place Um and
that it is monitored Um and if somebody
[2:08:37] does misuse it there's a high likelihood
that they're going to get found probably
[2:08:40] go to jail um and lose their job Um but I
mean I can't sit here and tell the public
[2:08:46] that nobody's ever going to misuse
something Um there's always potential for
[2:08:49] anything So but with that I don't want to
keep I mean I could talk about this for
[2:08:54] the next two hours probably but I don't
want to do that Um but if you have
[2:08:59] questions feel free to ask me
[2:09:02] Thanks Becky
[2:09:03] I have two questions Um first First can
you restate what you said about Pierce
[2:09:07] County requesting to share the data I just
missed that
[2:09:09] Yeah So Pierce County has requested to do
a data share with us because they're going
[2:09:14] to install the same type of camera system
through axon as well over there And we can
[2:09:18] decide to do a sharing program with them
if we choose Um right now we don't share
[2:09:22] with anybody And so nobody has access to
our data Um if we did a sharing we would
[2:09:27] have access to their data then to over the
bridge So right now we do have one camera
[2:09:31] on the bridge It doesn't pick up
everything I don't believe Um and so they
[2:09:35] were looking at actually putting the
camera on the other side of the bridge to
[2:09:39] pick up the other traffic And so it would
kind of be a mutual sharing agreement
[2:09:43] where we would get both sides of the
traffic if we did that Um and then any
[2:09:48] other cameras they decided to install
within the county as well Um we can if you
[2:09:52] want also restrict the fact that they you
know only have access maybe to that one
[2:09:56] camera Um if you really wanted to where we
just would share just the two cameras on
[2:10:00] the bridge or none at all It's completely
up to the body as far as what you want to
[2:10:05] do and how you want that done
[2:10:07] Did I mishear you or did you say something
about immigration data Or do you mean
[2:10:12] across the the Wisconsin Minnesota border
[2:10:13] Nope So you did hear me correct
[2:10:15] Um there was concern Somebody brought up
concern about um Pierce County using the
[2:10:19] data for immigration Um and so if we don't
have we don't allow that here Um we don't
[2:10:24] use the we we don't allow the feds to get
our data for immigration purposes We don't
[2:10:28] look it up or anything like that We don't
have access to any of that Um so there was
[2:10:33] concern that if they got the data that it
could be used that way So what we do is we
[2:10:38] have a type up agreement that if we were
to go into an agreement with them to share
[2:10:43] camera systems we would ask that they
would sign an agreement that they wouldn't
[2:10:47] be able to use that technology for that
purpose our data
[2:10:50] And that brings me to my other question is
so what other agencies can access to it
[2:10:56] Can so can Goodhue County or can any other
federal agencies access that data
[2:11:01] None currently I mean certainly somebody
could serve me with a bench warrant or
[2:11:04] something and make me give up the data But
but we currently don't share with anybody
[2:11:09] Nobody has access to it except for us
There is a possibility let's say
[2:11:13] another community calls us and says hey we
had a robbery and we're looking for this
[2:11:17] vehicle Could you look in your system We
would ask them a lot of questions of
[2:11:21] course and go through and log all that
information of why we're looking at the
[2:11:25] data And we could look at it for that
purpose and share that one search with
[2:11:28] them if we choose to do so Um but
currently nobody has access to searcher
[2:11:32] data system
[2:11:33] And then um do when somebody logs in when
somebody from your department logs in for
[2:11:37] rightful purposes do you do you
specifically or assistant chief Matt link
[2:11:41] get an alert that somebody has logged in
for a purpose
[2:11:44] We don't get an alert but
[2:11:45] Right under the system there's an audit
log that we can just click on and look at
[2:11:50] it at any point to see who accessed it and
for what reason And so it will show us
[2:11:55] that log And then that log also will get
audited And we can't we can't delete it
[2:11:59] It's it's you cannot delete it Even if the
company goes into our system it gets
[2:12:03] logged in that audit as well If if if we
have an agreement with somebody it's still
[2:12:08] the same thing It gets audited and logged
in that in that log as well
[2:12:13] So it's always there Um it just you know
and I think that one of our captains
[2:12:17] usually goes through it every few weeks Um
just to kind of check up on it to make
[2:12:22] sure we've also sent a new directive out
recently that we specifically only allow
[2:12:26] the officers to use it or even search the
database for higher based crimes Um so
[2:12:30] like if you have a driving complaint and
they're like hey we want to find this car
[2:12:35] It's not allowed to be used for that Um
there's a directive that's put out that
[2:12:39] says you can't use it for this And they
certainly could but then it would be
[2:12:44] against the directive And then obviously
there would be discipline based upon what
[2:12:47] they do Um so right now it's only set for
higher based crimes I've actually had it
[2:12:52] up this whole time because I was hoping to
see a plate so I could actually block it
[2:12:57] out and show you kind of without showing
you the data what it actually looks like
[2:13:01] Um but during this whole process one is
actually not even uh gone up there because
[2:13:05] it's set so high Um so it's just it's
collecting the plates but it's not showing
[2:13:10] us any data currently right now
[2:13:12] And you answered one of my other questions
which is is there a procedure within your
[2:13:16] department to to regularly check that And
you said that one of the captains is and
[2:13:20] I'd like I'd like that in the I think
that's a good policy Is that somebody in
[2:13:25] there whether it's a captain or captains
or you or assistant chief battling is
[2:13:29] routinely looking at that record so that
you know this pattern seems a little bit
[2:13:33] off You can preventatively
[2:13:34] Look
[2:13:34] Yeah And that's actually an easy policy
addition Um because it's really easy just
[2:13:38] to go in and look So it doesn't it
probably takes you know a few minutes out
[2:13:42] of a day um to just go through and just
scan it real quick So we could actually
[2:13:46] add that directly into our policy or
requirement Maybe it gets scanned every
[2:13:49] four weeks or every three weeks Um and
direct person do it right now Our patrol
[2:13:53] captain usually takes a look at it
[2:13:56] Thank you
[2:13:58] All right Any other questions or comments
[2:14:02] All right Seeing none then No else on our
agenda I'll call us Adjourned