[0:04] Good evening. This is the sandwich select board meeting for
[0:06] September 10th, 2026.
[0:09] Tonight's meeting is being recorded and broadcast live by standard
[0:11] community television. We'll open with the pledge of alleging.
[0:16] Pledge allegiance to the flag.
[0:19] Of the United States America. And she was a Republic.
[0:22] From which to stands one nation.
[0:25] Under God, indivisible was Liberty and justice for all. And
[0:29] while we're standing, if I may.
[0:33] May we remember
[0:34] Margaret arsenal.
[0:37] Sandwich public schools.
[0:41] Educational support professional.
[0:44] Who passed on September 2nd.
[0:57] Thank you.
[1:01] Thank you, Mr. Holden.
[1:05] This brings us to our first opportunity for public comment.
[1:09] Mr. Hartman.
[1:12] Please, please write your name.
[1:15] And address on the slip list there.
[1:52] Hello. I'm here again.
[1:55] About been here every meeting since July, but.
[2:00] The illegal HOA.
[2:02] A and I took, I took your advice.
[2:07] And
[2:09] I went up and saw the police department.
[2:12] I met an young officer.
[2:14] In the lobby two weeks.
[2:17] Be two weeks from Saturday.
[2:19] And I even very busy.
[2:22] I said, would you want to go over the material
[2:24] I have. And he said,
[2:26] oh, you you'd have to make a copy and I'll
[2:29] get back to you.
[2:31] So I ran out and made copies and I got
[2:33] back to 'em when I gave it to him.
[2:36] Crickets from there, but I, I, I didn't hear anything,
[2:39] but.
[2:41] In after our meeting.
[2:43] In the springtime
[2:46] I get a call from the police department.
[2:49] That said I was sending lewd emails. I said, where's
[2:51] your jurisdiction?
[2:53] From the assessors or from the.
[2:55] Registry DH, but
[2:59] I don't know, it just seemed, it just seemed.
[3:02] I don't know, it seemed different. I, I would never
[3:05] go to the police department.
[3:07] And say anything. They want to keep junks in the,
[3:11] in my neighborhood, unregistered vehicles, couple trailers in the yard.
[3:15] Open top dumpsters not covered at night.
[3:18] All summer along.
[3:21] That's fine, but
[3:23] why I came in here is because.
[3:27] Do you know what the mission statement for the town
[3:29] is?
[3:30] We ever read it.
[3:33] I think if you read it, it says.
[3:35] You provide honesty and integrity.
[3:39] And I, I don't think you said, oh, it's we
[3:41] don't have jurisdiction is honesty.
[3:45] And integrity. You could have made two phone calls.
[3:48] And sent out one letter.
[3:50] In this whole thing would be over. We'll be done.
[3:54] But instead, I'm gonna go to court. I've talked to
[3:57] lawyers.
[3:58] Is, and I'm gonna end this.
[4:01] And I just wanted to come up here and tell,
[4:03] tell you that because.
[4:05] I didn't like when you called me a criminal and
[4:08] you said, oh, you're a criminal. You never called you
[4:10] a criminal. Yes, you did. You go back in the
[4:12] meeting envelope, but I, I did.
[4:13] Not call you a criminal, you could, you know, and.
[4:17] Said Snoop. I never been arrested.
[4:20] I pay my taxes.
[4:22] Taxes, but when you see something that's so wrong.
[4:26] And then you come here and if you read the
[4:28] mission statement,
[4:30] it says, oh, that's what you should do.
[4:33] I went down. I went through a lot of stuff
[4:34] and you're right.
[4:36] I need a lawyer.
[4:38] And, and I, and I'll go to court.
[4:41] And I know I'll win because they never had one,
[4:44] but you knew that.
[4:46] You, I spoke to you.
[4:48] I spoke to Shane. You, you guys knew that and
[4:51] it would've been simple. I.
[4:54] I don't, it only tweaks it ratches up the tension
[4:57] in my neighborhood. I don't need it. I don't want
[5:00] it.
[5:01] You know, it's crazy. So that's it. I guess I'm
[5:04] done. I'm honestly not sure what you're referring to.
[5:08] About writing a letter or calling somebody, but if there
[5:10] was something that we could have done, they absolutely, we
[5:14] would've done it. And, and we've been very clear with.
[5:16] You about that. And we got, Hey, town council to
[5:19] render an opinion. We provided that to you. There was
[5:22] something we could have done to help you with the
[5:23] situation we would.
[5:24] Would've done it. All you gotta do is make two
[5:26] phone calls. That's all you had to do. If you
[5:29] wanted to help me out.
[5:31] You gave me something from 2003, 2004.
[5:34] It's some guy did.
[5:37] Did you called me two years ago and told me.
[5:40] Did they have? No, they have.
[5:44] No, nothing, no documentation from the registry. Indeed. You called
[5:48] me and said, I did call you. I told you
[5:50] to talk to the registry of deeds. I told you,
[5:51] you needed an attorney.
[5:52] So that's it. Thank you. Sounds like you're on the
[5:56] right path. Thank you so much.
[5:58] Would anybody else like to speak at public forum this
[6:00] evening?
[6:03] Seeing none.
[6:06] Review and approval of minutes from August 20th.
[6:11] Make a motion. We approve the minutes of August 20th as
[6:14] presented.
[6:15] Second, the motion for Mr. Hawk and a second for
[6:18] Mr. Holden, is there any discussion on the minutes from
[6:21] August 20th?
[6:22] Seeing none, all those in favor.
[6:25] Aye. Any abstentions or opposed Mr. Ellis opposed? Everyone else
[6:29] is in favor.
[6:31] Abstained. I'm sorry.
[6:33] Town manager report a couple of quick updates. Our next
[6:36] meeting is in two weeks.
[6:39] On September 24th and this.
[6:42] Still at this location.
[6:44] Next Wednesday, which is the 16th of September. The recreation department is
[6:49] holding an open form about pickleball.
[6:52] And that's at the center for active living from five
[6:55] to 7:00 PM.
[6:56] If anyone from the public is interested.
[6:59] And then last thing I just wanted to pass along,
[7:01] believe it or not like our last meeting we did.
[7:03] Miss a week because of the holiday.
[7:07] JIRA was in, at our last meeting and they sent
[7:09] us an email earlier this week.
[7:11] If you recall, they highlighted the state, RFP was due.
[7:15] Today, the state ended up extending that by a month.
[7:19] So remember the exact date, but they sent us an
[7:21] email saying just so you know, they're gonna keep.
[7:24] Refining some of their
[7:26] submissions, but they have another month to get that in.
[7:29] Okay. That was it. Thank you.
[7:31] Any questions for bud.
[7:35] Correspondence statements and announcements.
[7:39] Mr chairman, Mr. You quick things, if you don't mind,
[7:41] school committee meant last night.
[7:44] The school department has experienced positive SP start to the
[7:49] 26th, 27th school year.
[7:52] This, despite the fact unofficial enrollment is slightly down.
[7:57] From 25 to 26, that doesn't become official until October.
[8:03] The committee voted to
[8:06] retain a management expert.
[8:08] Activity task Inc. To maintain the established specifications.
[8:13] Developed for the tennis court project.
[8:16] The committee also voted to adopt.
[8:19] Or district action plans for 26, 27.
[8:24] As presented first.
[8:27] School safety committee meeting will be.
[8:30] Next Thursday. And then
[8:32] looking forward to another item. If I may.
[8:35] There is a community invitation.
[8:38] From the sandwich fire department.
[8:40] To the nine 11 Memorial ceremony.
[8:43] Ceremony for the town of sandwich to be conducted tomorrow.
[8:47] Friday, beginning at 9:00 AM.
[8:50] At the sandwich, fire headquarters, Memorial garden.
[8:53] Behind station three of katuit road.
[8:56] The service will be in conjunction.
[8:59] With American Legion Clark had approached.
[9:02] 180 8 begin with an opening prayer.
[9:06] Include a 21 gun salute.
[9:08] And conclude with remarks from chief Burke.
[9:11] September 11th, 2001 to September 11th, 2026.
[9:16] 25 years. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
[9:19] Thank you, Mr. Holden, and I, I appreciate you raising.
[9:23] The Memorial service tomorrow. And.
[9:25] I think it's also important for folks to know that
[9:27] we've combined what was used to be two events into
[9:29] one. So the, the Legion.
[9:31] Is not holding a separate event downtown as they have
[9:33] in the past. You're bringing those two events together.
[9:36] Thanks to the, the fire department, as well as the
[9:39] legions, willingness to collaborate.
[9:44] Anybody else?
[9:46] Okay.
[9:48] And I would also just echo what bud said about
[9:51] the upcoming recreation meeting next week. I, I won't be
[9:53] able to attend that meeting, but that will be a
[9:55] very good.
[9:56] Opportunity to openly discuss the pickleball.
[10:00] Scheduling concerns.
[10:03] Concerns. Okay. We have a public hearing for an on-premises
[10:08] all alcohol.
[10:09] Beverage liquor license change of class from seasonal to annual.
[10:13] For Los Scotto, LLC, doing business as LA paella eight
[10:17] Jarvis street.
[10:19] Lauren Matsui as manager.
[10:23] Make a motion. Should we open the public hearing?
[10:27] So moved.
[10:28] Moved motion for Mr. Hawk second for Mr. Holden, is
[10:31] there any discussion?
[10:32] All those in favor. Aye. Aye. Okay. We are in
[10:35] the public hearing. If you wanna just come forward for.
[10:39] This is gonna be a.
[10:42] Oh, okay. Thank you. Thank you. Oh,
[10:46] okay.
[10:49] Okay. So I think every, everybody.
[10:52] Economic seat, if you want, if you're welcome to.
[10:54] So, so really this is about changing from a seasonal
[10:57] to annual liquor license to a year round liquor license.
[11:02] I think we issued this license in spring of last
[11:04] year. Yeah, we were granted in spring of this year,
[11:06] we were granted the annual license.
[11:08] But then it, we found out we were a short
[11:10] one license, so we were waiting for the other one
[11:12] to yep. To pop back up. So, yep. So, so
[11:15] this is about fixing that issue.
[11:17] Does anybody have any questions?
[11:19] Questions comments concerns. How are things going?
[11:22] Really well, I mean, it's, it's been nonstop since Memorial
[11:26] day. so.
[11:28] But the community has been so welcoming and everybody has
[11:31] just been so kind like we couldn't be busier with
[11:33] nicer people. So thanks. Terrific. Not a.
[11:36] Complaint. And can you opened at the right time?
[11:39] Yeah, definitely. And I still feel like it was mostly
[11:40] people from here. I don't really think we had as
[11:43] many tours as everybody thought, which I really liked.
[11:46] Liked to meet everyone.
[11:48] Okay. Awesome. And
[11:50] all of that internal. Yep. Everything are in order. Yep.
[11:55] Everything's in order. And the state has said that they
[11:58] will work.
[11:59] With us when we notify them after the board votes
[12:01] to try to expedite things in light of the.
[12:04] Mix up that happened previously. So.
[12:07] You excellent. Would anyone from the public like to comment
[12:10] on this matter?
[12:12] Seeing none.
[12:14] Motion. We close the public hearing.
[12:16] Second motion for Mr. Hawk to second for Mr. Holden.
[12:19] I need discussion all those in favor.
[12:22] Aye. It's unanimous. I'd like to make a motion that
[12:25] we proceed forward with the.
[12:27] Conversion of the
[12:30] licensed to us around year-round license for Los LLC, doing
[12:34] business as lots paella at eight German street as presented.
[12:38] Second. Okay. We have a motion and a second. Is
[12:40] there any discussion?
[12:42] All those in favor. Aye. It's unanimous. Thank you. Thank
[12:45] you. Best wishes for continued success. Apologies for the yes.
[12:49] Oh, it's.
[12:50] It's okay. Challenges come visit us. have a good
[12:54] night.
[12:56] Okay. Our next item, we have human resources director Marie Buckner
[13:00] here this evening regarding the recommended update to the personal
[13:03] policy.
[13:03] Policies and procedures. And I don't, but if you, I
[13:06] don't know if you wanna tee this up or you
[13:07] wanna just, yeah. And I know tear away the assistant
[13:09] director is here as well. So I think they're both
[13:11] gonna come up.
[13:12] And just Reese gonna go through an overview. I guess
[13:15] the two things that I would add.
[13:17] I think it's really important when you look at the
[13:19] cover sheet on the.
[13:21] Personnel policies and procedures. By my quick count, this will
[13:24] be the 13th update that we did from the original
[13:26] ones. And that's.
[13:27] That's telling a professional HR department that these.
[13:31] Policies and the state and federal laws that we have
[13:34] to go by, have to be updated all the time.
[13:37] And it's not an exaggeration to say that Marie and
[13:40] Tara have been working on these for over a year.
[13:43] Town council has been scrutinizing and very closely. There's been
[13:46] a lot of separate.
[13:49] Zoom meetings a lot of back and forth. And the
[13:51] last thing I would say every time we think we're
[13:53] done.
[13:54] You know, oh, maybe we should have an AI policy
[13:56] or, oh, we should really go with K P's new
[13:59] social media policy.
[14:01] So we, a lot of the stuff that Marie will
[14:03] present.
[14:06] Is the latest and greatest from our attorneys. So it'sgood.
[14:08] Excellent. Good evening, everyone.
[14:11] Thank you for having us here. So.
[14:15] What I thought I would do is, is just to
[14:17] give a little bit of a little bit of a
[14:18] background about what these policies are and, and.
[14:22] These, these policies and procedures have been in place for.
[14:26] For for several years, as you can tell by the
[14:27] number of edits that had, and, and really their.
[14:31] There are
[14:34] so many union employees and we have so many non-union
[14:38] employees. So these are, this is the document that really
[14:41] covers.
[14:42] Covers the parameters of E non-union employees.
[14:45] Employees by and large those with collective bargaining agreements, those
[14:48] union employees are also covered by these policies as well.
[14:52] Where their contracts are silent.
[14:55] And so that those areas include the anti-harassment policy.
[14:59] The all of the other, the policies that are listed
[15:02] in the back, he won't find those in general.
[15:05] In a collective bargaining agreement. So that's where, where it
[15:07] says all employees. That's what we're talking about. It's like
[15:09] all employees are covered where we all.
[15:13] Are are governed by an anti-harassment and anti-discrimination policy.
[15:17] We're all covered by the I T R policy, the
[15:18] internet, the information technology resources policy.
[15:22] We're all. So those that's what those policies are designed
[15:24] to do. And that's why there's so many of them.
[15:27] And as you can tell, we're, we're kind of growing.
[15:31] As well. And so our process to review them.
[15:35] Involves just a lot of conversation with a course council
[15:38] because we wanna make sure that the policies are up
[15:41] to date. And what's nice about it is.
[15:43] That you won't see a lot of changes proposed by
[15:45] council.
[15:46] And many of those policies that we, that we have,
[15:48] and partly that's because.
[15:51] We, we, we updated them in 2022. I'd like to
[15:53] do it a little bit more often than that, but
[15:55] sometimes we just, we didn't have the need to do
[15:58] that. And if.
[15:59] You also notice that the policies themselves.
[16:02] Were we really weren't.
[16:04] Weren't thinking of
[16:07] expanding any of the so-called benefits that non-union employees have.
[16:12] That really wasn't the purpose. The purpose was to add
[16:15] in some.
[16:15] Policies that counsel felt strongly over several months of discussion
[16:19] about that. We should just add them. It didn't mean
[16:22] that we weren't subject to those policy.
[16:24] Policies. It just means that it's very specific here. I'll
[16:26] never forget one time. When, when we were in a
[16:28] particular hearing for an unemployment, the, the gentleman from.
[16:32] Unemployment said, do you have a written policy that prohibits
[16:35] stealing?
[16:37] We do now.
[16:39] We didn't then we still want, but it's one of
[16:41] those things where it's just like, you think it's obvious
[16:43] and it's really not.
[16:44] So, so there were a couple of policies that we
[16:46] added.
[16:48] That we feel are important to, to really spell out
[16:52] and that, and those involve the.
[16:55] The, the conflict of interest policy and that has existed
[16:58] forever, but it's just something that we were more specifically
[17:01] wanted to define. You can go and.
[17:03] Find that in the law, you can find it in
[17:05] a policy that's nine pages long, but here it's a
[17:07] little bit more concise and it's, it's readily available. It's
[17:10] in the policies.
[17:11] And it's in the red book. .
[17:15] And every employee knows what the red book is. And
[17:18] so every employee gets one of these books.
[17:21] And in it is the personnel policies and procedures. It
[17:23] is , there's some knowing. Yes. And, and we unle
[17:27] and we go over these policies.
[17:29] With every employee. And, and we also just address the,
[17:32] the, the, the ultimate copy of their own collective bargaining
[17:35] agreement, which we also go over with them.
[17:38] So that the parameters around their employment are as clear
[17:40] as possible upon their start. And so that's kind of
[17:43] that the, the background and, and.
[17:46] Just going over what we added.
[17:48] We added a policy.
[17:51] On a drug-free workplace. Now, again, that's been a policy,
[17:54] that's been an existence in, in the fact that that's
[17:57] what.
[17:58] We have always followed, but just saying it more specifically.
[18:03] And also having a separate policy that we're able to
[18:05] provide.
[18:06] To any organization that when we get federal funds, even
[18:10] $1 of them, it's helpful to have that policy to
[18:12] be able to send out and that, and these.
[18:15] Policies. We, we share them when.
[18:18] With the school, if they are silent on any policy.
[18:20] So they really are meant to be a policy.
[18:24] That we can, we can we share regularly and adopt
[18:28] when, when you adopt them, their they're good for any
[18:31] employee within the town.
[18:33] And so that we, so we added that one and,
[18:35] and you can see that in the, in the document.
[18:38] And in the, I know the voluminous documents that you
[18:41] have. So there's 98 POL pages of policies that, that
[18:44] were sent to you. I'm sure you.
[18:46] Had some fun reading.
[18:49] So with that said, I, we worked as a team,
[18:51] you know, I mean, these are all, I just bought
[18:54] them for show and tell.
[18:55] And that it's just, it's one of those things where
[18:57] these are, these are terrorist notes in the, in the
[18:59] colorful where it's just like, what is that? Well, how
[19:01] is that? You know, we just try to.
[19:03] Make them so that they're as good as they possibly
[19:06] can be. And there's a team of us that work
[19:08] on it and includes the team that I'm sitting across
[19:11] from.
[19:12] And Tara and several department heads that, that partake in
[19:15] the process.
[19:17] And so without, I don't know.
[19:20] If there's anything in particular that you'd like me to,
[19:22] to review with you. I'm, I'm really not expecting you
[19:25] just got these a few days ago.
[19:27] So, so the idea of you, you know, taking a,
[19:30] a photo on them, I, I leave that up to
[19:32] you in your timeframes. I'm happy to come back and
[19:33] answer questions that you may.
[19:35] Have of the, the volumes of information the AI generated.
[19:42] Information that Mr. Samson did is fantastic. And that is,
[19:46] is something that we did look over and that's a
[19:47] nice weight of looking at the.
[19:49] Policies as well to see what's really proposed and what's
[19:52] changed.
[19:53] So that's a nice document. Sadly check, probably three minutes
[19:56] of my time. so don't give me too much
[19:59] credit, but thank you. It's.
[20:02] It's it's very easy to kind of just translate that
[20:04] way really to your point. You know, if it's not
[20:06] written down.
[20:08] When it comes to, to policies and procedures, if it's
[20:09] not written down, it just doesn't count. Right? There's, there's
[20:11] no accountability around anything that's not written down. And none
[20:14] of these things are ever done.
[20:16] And it applies across all sorts of business policies. And
[20:19] I talk to people about this pretty often, so I,
[20:21] I understand it will, but.
[20:23] The ongoing review is critical. It is, it it's really
[20:26] important. And, and I think that, and, and to, to
[20:29] your point, it's, it's one of those that you think
[20:31] you got it.
[20:32] Right in there. It's like something else that comes up.
[20:34] So it's not to say that we won't be back
[20:36] for something else that that comes out. For example, the
[20:38] AI policy, I will tell you.
[20:40] That that is not my forte. Anyone can attest to
[20:42] that, but.
[20:45] But we did rely on council who said that this
[20:48] was the most up-to-date way to.
[20:52] To form the policy and, and, and, and have the
[20:53] policy in place. And it's in place for several times
[20:56] that KP law is.
[20:59] That the, the
[21:02] representative of, so we did.
[21:05] Take that, that policy and, and, and here it is
[21:07] before you, and I think it's just something new for,
[21:10] for all of us to, to have to, you know,
[21:13] consider and absorb in our different professions and how.
[21:17] Help me do our work. So.
[21:20] There's I'm happy to answer questions and I can.
[21:25] Can cover.
[21:27] Other things that you want.
[21:30] Where we get, we get nine postings right now. So
[21:33] we're busy, small Meg. We've got we. We just.
[21:38] This there's a, on the town side. There's.
[21:41] 205 full-time.
[21:43] Employees, we got 38 part-time.
[21:46] This summer, we had 138 seasonal employees and every one
[21:50] of them.
[21:51] Comes through this office and, and other town departments that,
[21:54] that you can appreciate that every single one of 'em,
[21:56] whether they're here for a day or.
[21:59] 30 something years. They're, it's the same process that we
[22:01] go through and that's a large part.
[22:04] All the efforts of
[22:06] person sitting to my right.
[22:09] It's tear away. okay. Questions between, because you brought
[22:14] it up.
[22:15] With the hiring of the open positions. What do you,
[22:19] I think I asked you this probably three years ago,
[22:21] but what do you see as the biggest challenge?
[22:24] With
[22:26] new employees or gaining new employees and challenges, you know,
[22:29] in the marketplace that make the town as attractive as
[22:33] Bob, as.
[22:35] Possible. What do you see as the challenge for us?
[22:38] We have, I think because of our geographic location.
[22:43] We have fewer challenges than other.
[22:46] Members of our community in on Cape Cod. So I,
[22:49] I don't know that that is.
[22:52] That is so much of it, but a challenge. I
[22:53] think there's some positions that require an incredible amount of
[22:57] expertise. You know, you were looking.
[23:00] For a local inspector and that local inspector, can't just
[23:02] be anybody coming off the street. They have to have
[23:04] had their, their, the cer certain certifications to.
[23:08] Be ordered in order to be able to qualify, to
[23:10] even sit for the exam that they have to have
[23:12] within 18 months of hire. So those kinds of things
[23:15] are, those are positions are just.
[23:16] Physicians are just more challenging because you have to have
[23:18] a real, certain set of.
[23:22] Of of abilities.
[23:24] And, and experience in the get-go. So that, that has
[23:27] been, that has been and been challenging. And I think
[23:30] that sometimes getting.
[23:32] Individuals to get their commercial driver's licenses. That that is
[23:35] another.
[23:36] Avenue that we have a very successful in program.
[23:41] In the town where we.
[23:44] Train our new employees coming in.
[23:48] We have certified trainers amongst the laborers within the department.
[23:52] And they are, they are trained to.
[23:55] Train the employees, and that has been very successful. And
[23:58] that has been something that.
[24:00] That through the years, we have not had the Exodus
[24:04] that some.
[24:05] Other towns have had with that regard.
[24:08] First for whatever reason they're staying. I think that in
[24:11] October we'll have a full compliment of, of laborers and
[24:15] I guess another.
[24:16] Thing that I'd like to tout is the fact that.
[24:19] In our workers' comp like there are, there are zero.
[24:24] Town employees.
[24:26] Employees in
[24:28] out injured. There are a couple of long-term and the
[24:31] police department that are just, that are long-term that, that
[24:34] is going suffering.
[24:36] Serious injury in the line of work and in one
[24:39] in the school. But on the town side, there are
[24:42] zero.
[24:43] Individuals out with any work-related injuries.
[24:47] And so that's, that's just.
[24:49] It's not something that that's, that's people being safe in
[24:52] the workplace.
[24:53] And that doesn't happen by accident.
[24:56] If you don't mind, if I could just add a
[24:57] couple things like.
[24:59] I would say from our four collective chairs, cuz we
[25:02] see it a lot. Like.
[25:05] We're still getting qualified applications for department head positions, but
[25:08] where we used to get 40 or 50.
[25:11] We might get 10.
[25:14] And things are getting, you know,
[25:16] tighter in terms of competing with other towns in terms
[25:19] of salary rates, benefits, health, insurance, et cetera.
[25:23] And although many times we're impacted by the cost of
[25:27] those things. Like we need to stay competitive and get
[25:29] the best people because it really pay.
[25:31] Pays off in the long run. So we've been.
[25:34] Very fortunate, I would say, but.
[25:37] Certainly, if you look at what we used to receive
[25:38] for resumes years ago, compared to today, it's a lot
[25:42] less.
[25:43] I would also say that, you know, for certain positions,
[25:45] I would also say, cuz the board's familiar cuz you're,
[25:48] you've all been around a long time that the, you
[25:50] know, for.
[25:51] Example in, in the administrative professional union, if someone retires
[25:54] and it's a higher position that gets advertised first within.
[25:58] The unit, someone may go for that. Well, then that
[26:01] creates the ripple effect and now you have to advertise
[26:03] their position and if that's higher and someone goes for
[26:05] it and that opens.
[26:06] Opens up that position. So a lot of times it's,
[26:09] you know, follow the dominoes as they fall and then
[26:11] try to figure out how to, how to do it
[26:13] the best way. And so.
[26:15] As Marie said she and Tara, like every single resume
[26:19] that comes in, everyone gets responded to everyone, gets treated
[26:22] professionally.
[26:23] At one point or another, you've all sat in on
[26:25] interviews and you know what they do.
[26:28] And then I would just say like,
[26:31] I think the hardest thing for us is that.
[26:34] We're the employer by law.
[26:36] We issue payroll in-house.
[26:39] And yet, you know, only a quarter of the employees
[26:42] are under our control.
[26:44] So what's really hard is with the school department, you
[26:46] know, they have 5, 6, 700 people on their payroll every week.
[26:50] And some of those are, you know,
[26:52] sup substitutes.
[26:55] Substitutes others are longtime employees, you know, and it requires
[26:58] a lot of work from our department, especially the treasure
[27:00] collector's office. And.
[27:03] And I know HR gets contacted a lot by schools
[27:06] to help try to address some of the more complex
[27:08] things because of their expertise. So.
[27:11] I would say, you know, it's not bashing anyone, but
[27:13] that is re that makes it really difficult on our
[27:16] side. And I think I've said it to you guys
[27:18] for.
[27:19] Five plus years, payroll is our weakest internal procedure and
[27:22] we've tried.
[27:23] 10 different ways to skin the cat. And I still
[27:25] don't feel like we've accomplished it yet.
[27:27] And a lot of that is software related and waiting
[27:29] for an upgrade to come.
[27:31] But it's still
[27:33] if I had to pick our weakest internal thing, it
[27:35] would be that.
[27:38] Yeah. For most of it's not ours.
[27:40] Ours. I'll be honest. Most of the payroll is not
[27:41] ours and, and I wanna stress. We get the payroll
[27:44] out every other week.
[27:46] Many days in advance done perfectly. So it's not issuing
[27:49] the payroll. It's all the other things that go with
[27:51] it. Yeah. I was gonna say most of I'd say
[27:53] at least 90.
[27:55] 95% of the treasurer collector.
[27:58] Related activities to employment come from the schools.
[28:02] By far.
[28:04] And I know that the, the amount of work that
[28:06] goes into these blinders and it's one of those things
[28:09] you hope to never have to use a binder. Everybody
[28:11] gets the binder, but.
[28:13] It's you, it seems like it's the 99% are finest
[28:16] to 1% where you have to pull a binder out,
[28:18] you know, and it.
[28:19] But that work that you guys do is which people
[28:23] don't, he's one of the things that's behind the curtain
[28:25] kind of thing.
[28:27] They that they don't see as the amount of work
[28:28] that goes into the, you know, the policies and procedures.
[28:32] Procedures, which you not only protect the employee, but you
[28:35] know, importantly too, is it protects the town.
[28:38] Yeah, because when these things happen, it, it gets ugly
[28:41] quick as, as you guys know, and that.
[28:44] You know, and a lot of times it's not a
[28:46] fun job because of the stuff that you guys have
[28:47] to deal with. But, but I appreciate the, the amount
[28:50] of effort that went into putting this.
[28:52] Together cuz it is, it is a substantial amount of
[28:54] work to maintain that on a, you know, daily basis.
[28:57] So thank the both of you. Appreciate it. Thank you.
[29:00] Spend.
[29:00] One just quick follow up. I don't know if you
[29:02] heard what Marie said about the department of public works,
[29:04] being fully staffed with laborers. And I think it's the
[29:06] first time. I don't, at least in eight years.
[29:09] Probably longer than that.
[29:11] And that's with the new personnel that we've added. So
[29:13] that is a huge accomplishment for that department.
[29:15] And that will, you know, manifest real results for the
[29:17] town.
[29:19] The same issues that we have with hiring, I think
[29:21] are more, even more acute in public safety and Marine
[29:25] tar. Talk to it more.
[29:28] Specifically than I can, but I know that they're.
[29:31] Looking at creative ways to bring additional staff on the
[29:33] fire. Department's been creative about that. The police department's looking
[29:36] at ways to recruit and make the work that they
[29:38] do more at.
[29:39] Attractive to people and looking at doing some communications around
[29:42] the changes and hiring for public safety that were no
[29:45] longer a civil service.
[29:47] Community that we would accept applications from folks from all
[29:50] fields of work, with different backgrounds.
[29:53] So we'll be looking at that in the next.
[29:55] Coming months as well, but those are, are even, I
[29:58] think, more difficult to.
[30:00] Recruit. And so
[30:03] certainly could made easier be by being able to open
[30:06] up.
[30:08] The police, for example.
[30:11] To, to individuals that
[30:13] are not current police officers somewhere else or in the
[30:16] civil service system.
[30:18] So that's been, that's been very helpful. Yeah. Mm-hmm
[30:22] and it's, but there's there's challenges and.
[30:26] As both
[30:29] indicated where we don't necessarily have, have the volume of
[30:33] applications, but oh, you need is one really good. One
[30:36] or two.
[30:37] So, you know, part quantity doesn't necessarily.
[30:41] Equate to quality and, and just we're, we're always looking
[30:44] for that quality. So, so that's the piece that we're
[30:47] when, and we.
[30:49] Seem to find a lot of very, very good high
[30:51] quality.
[30:52] Individuals. That's an interesting shift though, because.
[30:56] Historically the benefits of municipal jobs have been very attractive
[30:59] to people.
[31:01] So, you know, and I've seen this actually in other
[31:03] municipalities as well is just interesting. The, the.
[31:07] I don't know if it's a generational shift or what
[31:08] it is, but.
[31:11] It is what it's it's I absolutely isn't. And, and
[31:14] to find out somebody's motivation. I think that we're we're.
[31:18] With, with our communications coordinator, Caitlin Fogerty, she's been able
[31:23] to.
[31:25] Kind of attract a different kind of audience for positions.
[31:28] And so she's been great with some social media things
[31:30] that, that we didn't do before. That that is, that
[31:33] is you.
[31:33] Know, and just advertising in a different way. So we
[31:36] were able to fill jobs.
[31:38] In for a seasonal that we hadn't in the past.
[31:39] And I think that's in large part to, to her
[31:43] efforts. And, and so, you know, and again, just.
[31:46] The HR department, we we're, it's, it's so much of
[31:49] a collaboration and there's no way that we can do.
[31:52] Any work without the co cooperation of so many different
[31:55] departments, including as by mentioned treasure collector and the, and
[31:58] the accounting office in, in, on daily.
[32:01] Basis and just all the other departments that we get
[32:03] so much cooperation from, they, they attend our safety committee
[32:06] meetings. Like we get a room full of.
[32:09] Of of 20 departments.
[32:11] Represented at a safety committee meeting and, and through terrace
[32:15] efforts, we, we get recognized for that.
[32:18] Through our reimbursements that we get from our insurance carrier,
[32:22] who recognizes the type of work that gets done from
[32:25] all of those depart.
[32:26] Departments. And so it's really everybody working together, cuz it
[32:29] is, I don't, I think Maya, her insurance provider has
[32:32] a, has this little slogan that it's like.
[32:35] Ex safety doesn't happen by accident. And so in any
[32:39] case, that's just another normal what we do and.
[32:43] It's really, it's nice to have the cooperation of all
[32:45] the departments and we do and police and fire and.
[32:49] All the pigments library. Mm-hmm they all show up.
[32:54] And now take it seriously. So that's, this is like,
[32:57] HR doesn't come in that much. So I know we're
[32:59] talking about a lot of things and just the policies,
[33:01] but I mean, I think this is incredibly important to
[33:03] say, and I sure hope I don't jinx it.
[33:06] But it's a Testament to their knowledge and expertise in
[33:09] over three decades, we've never had a major personnel decision
[33:11] overturned by an arbitrator, a.
[33:14] Mediator or a judge ever.
[33:16] Like there's been small things that, you know,
[33:19] we may have lost a grievance, but we literally haven't
[33:21] had anything go to a grievance except one department in
[33:24] over 20 years. I mean,
[33:29] I think the way they treat our employees.
[33:32] Employees is appreciated, appreciated, and it, it bears fruit.
[33:35] So it's good.
[33:39] To piggyback off what Shane was saying with, you know,
[33:41] these policies that, which I know very well , but
[33:45] you know,
[33:46] not only, it's very important that they protect staff in
[33:48] the town, but you also have to walk that tightrope
[33:51] of making sure that doesn't stifle work or creativity. And
[33:54] I think.
[33:55] That's also another piece of this, cuz it's very easy
[33:56] to write a policy that basically says you cannot do
[33:59] this whatsoever. Right. And you know, have it.
[34:03] Shut down, you know, potential future.
[34:06] Creative work of our, you know, and I'm sure the
[34:08] AI.
[34:10] You know that policy, I'm sure you had to walk
[34:11] that tightrope quite a bit. So, you know, it really
[34:14] shows that you've gone and.
[34:17] Researched it and, you know, looked at it and through
[34:19] multiple ways. So I do appreciate that and I always
[34:21] appreciate it when I was going through the policies that
[34:23] it was.
[34:25] Very protective, but also not too.
[34:29] Not too stifling. Thank you.
[34:33] Having zero.
[34:35] Workers' comp claims. Just incredible.
[34:38] For people at home. That's how our rates are set.
[34:42] And when people go out on claims.
[34:45] The town's required to hold reserves against whatever that.
[34:50] However they're wounded and senses from the job.
[34:54] So those all add up.
[34:56] And so it's not just the idea that we're.
[34:59] Happy that no, one's her, but it's just.
[35:02] Financial dividends.
[35:05] Dividends immeasurable and add onto that a little bit is,
[35:09] is that every single person knows that if they are
[35:12] injured at.
[35:13] Work, how to go about filing the claim. So it's
[35:15] not like people are walking around limping and not reporting
[35:18] something, you know, they're this, you know, we're not.
[35:21] Doing that either. You know? So it's very clear that,
[35:24] that, you know, if you, if you get bit by
[35:26] tick, you know, and you're out and above and you're
[35:29] doing tree work.
[35:30] You need to let us know. And, and, and those
[35:32] are the kind of things that we also kind of,
[35:35] we stress as well, but we've fed a very.
[35:44] Yeah. Anyway.
[35:47] Okay.
[35:48] So, so what folks monitor here?
[35:51] Do you want to take these in and read them?
[35:52] And.
[35:54] Act later or do you laugh now?
[35:59] I read through it. Okay.
[36:02] You do it now? I'm Charlie. I'm a Ford. I
[36:08] have a general question number. If you don't mind at.
[36:10] Least, I think it's an old question because it's a
[36:13] new policy.
[36:15] Artificial.
[36:17] Intelligence use. Yes.
[36:20] For the public interest.
[36:22] Is there a succinct
[36:25] way to explain.
[36:27] What we're trying to accomplish.
[36:29] Yes, I think so. Shall I try.
[36:33] In please feel free to can I'll take a, a
[36:35] stab. You can take a stab if you, you may
[36:37] remember. We, we started one and, and essentially.
[36:41] Was to give employees the opportunity to use AI.
[36:45] But to protect the systems that we have and to
[36:47] protect personal information.
[36:49] While we do that. And so we drafted one that
[36:51] was in use in some other communities. And ultimately our
[36:54] council took a look at what we had and said,
[36:56] we think we have something.
[36:57] Better, but essentially said the same thing, but in a
[36:59] format that they felt more comfortable with, but it's about
[37:03] giving employees the opportunity to use it, to disclose.
[37:06] It, when it is being used, like we did in
[37:08] this meeting, which went excellently.
[37:11] To make sure that we're not using it, any of
[37:12] the systems where there's personal information.
[37:15] Or protected information and that could be fire. It could
[37:18] be public safety could definitely.
[37:21] HR and treasury. So it'd be very cautious about how
[37:24] and when we use it and to give our staff
[37:26] the heads up, when we're looking at software.
[37:30] To help us do our work.
[37:32] That that software doesn't include.
[37:34] The AI tools that might make that information exposed to
[37:37] some teacher date.
[37:39] Very complicated. I'm talking like, I know what I'm talking
[37:42] about. I do not. A lot of this really has
[37:45] to do with data governance. So.
[37:47] So, so I would actually classify.
[37:51] A lot of the, the mission of a policy like
[37:53] this around.
[37:55] Attempting to prevent the utilization of shadow AI mm-hmm
[37:57] so folks going out and.
[37:59] Acquiring AI tools on their own, and then taking our
[38:02] data and putting it into those systems and using it
[38:04] to generate summaries like this, like I did. So this
[38:07] would be the.
[38:07] Example of, you know,
[38:10] outside actors taking data and, and running it through the
[38:12] system now. So you violated, or it policy, it's not
[38:15] it's hasn't been enacted yet, but.
[38:19] To your point, right?
[38:20] So software tools that leverage AI capabilities, which many tools
[38:25] have that built in, right. That doesn't necessarily mean that
[38:28] data that goes into.
[38:29] Those platforms is going into the public domain because the
[38:31] AI capability within that particular.
[38:34] Piece of software may be containing that data. Correct? Right.
[38:37] So like,
[38:38] and I don't know. I, I was actually thinking about
[38:40] asking this question, but you know, it says in the
[38:42] policy around.
[38:45] Utilizing only tools that are sanctioned by the it department,
[38:48] but you know, what are those tools like today? What
[38:49] are they? Right. So off the top of my head,
[38:51] you know, I'm assuming.
[38:52] That Kate is using AI based or AI type based
[38:56] image, generation tools to generate images for.
[38:59] The content that she creates or graphics that she creates,
[39:02] which is extremely common today. Right? Mm-hmm but.
[39:06] You know, like with Microsoft 365 mm-hmm we could
[39:08] license the co-pilot capability, which, you know, takes automated notes
[39:12] in all your meetings and gives you the summary of
[39:14] the.
[39:14] Meeting and the follow up might have some, all those
[39:15] pieces. Right. But it doesn't.
[39:17] Doesn't necessarily mean that data is going to the public
[39:19] domain, cuz it's.
[39:21] It's it's just as secure as any other data within
[39:23] our Microsoft 365, 10. That that's probably a very good example
[39:26] to exactly, to think about.
[39:28] For that everybody I think can relate to.
[39:32] Yeah, I, I think that was.
[39:34] You know, like you said, most of it is data
[39:36] governance, which I think is a core principle of the
[39:39] it policies for anywhere.
[39:43] But I was just curious about the generative.
[39:45] It, I mean a I piece because you also, as
[39:48] I talk about stifling, you wanna make sure that people
[39:50] can still use these tools, but just making sure that
[39:52] it's marked as.
[39:53] AI. I think even when I was in the treasurer's
[39:56] office, that video.
[39:58] On how a tax bill is. And I think it
[40:00] even has in the corner, you know, made with AI
[40:02] and I wrote the script, put it into AI so
[40:04] it can read it better than I.
[40:06] Could, you know, so I think that's just.
[40:09] If you're using the tools and they're approved and sanctioned
[40:12] and.
[40:13] You know, as long as it denotes that it's AI,
[40:15] I think there's nothing wrong with that.
[40:17] Yeah. I mean, generally speaking like this document, I just
[40:19] generated and sent over to you. So you guys couldn't
[40:21] do what you wanted with it. But if I was
[40:23] generating the document, I actually find that I spend.
[40:26] Usually about the same amount of time working on a
[40:28] document, it just comes out better. Yeah. So, so I've
[40:30] gone through enough times that it's edited quite a bit
[40:33] from what was originally.
[40:34] Produced by whatever the tool might be, but you know,
[40:37] the, the content just it's, it's more efficient.
[40:39] It's I think that that's exactly what our goal was,
[40:42] at least initially, and where we are now is to
[40:44] give our.
[40:46] Our staff, the ability to feel comfortable using those tools
[40:49] with some guardrails.
[40:52] Guardrails around it. I was initially people felt like, oh,
[40:54] you know, I used AI to do this and we
[40:56] all would look at it and say, we know, because
[40:58] you can tell.
[41:00] So people feel comfortable, the tasks like we need.
[41:03] This data to be in this format in Excel, that
[41:06] would take us half a day to go put together
[41:09] that task can be completed. You can tell it to.
[41:11] Do it and it'll be done in 15 or 20
[41:13] minutes. I mean, that's the type of stuff that's just
[41:15] low hanging fruit.
[41:19] I don't know if this answers your question or makes
[41:21] it worse.
[41:24] Okay. Yes, we'll on the same page. We are. Okay.
[41:28] Thank you very much.
[41:32] Everybody's good. I'll make a motion that we approve the.
[41:36] HR updated policies as presented.
[41:40] Second, any of this discussion?
[41:43] Seeing none, all those in favor. Aye. Unanimous.
[41:48] Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you so much.
[41:50] Thank you, suspension. One last thing before they go, I
[41:53] know all four of us would want to recognize attorney
[41:55] Tim Essen.
[41:56] Who's our HR expert, labor expert at Copeman and page
[42:01] AP law. And.
[42:03] It's amazing how responsive he's to us and available to
[42:06] us and how knowledgeable he is. And he's a great
[42:09] person.
[42:10] On top of it. So we're really lucky to have
[42:11] him. Thank you for saying that. Yeah. Excellent. Thank you.
[42:16] Thank you. Thank you.
[42:19] Yes. So that brings us to whole business matters. Not
[42:22] reasonably anticipated. Does anybody have anything?
[42:28] Now new business. So commission on disability membership.
[42:32] Request to reduce to seven members. And Shane is the
[42:34] liaison to the commission on disability.
[42:37] I attended, I was gonna say their last meeting, but
[42:39] I think this was another. Yeah, I missed since then,
[42:42] but we, we attended a meeting with raised.
[42:45] Raised in early August or so. Yeah. Yep.
[42:49] And I think the current.
[42:51] Membership is at 11. Yes, it was at 11.
[42:58] Voting members, there were small turnouts, but that they werehaving.
[42:59] You know, most of the time they met the quorum,
[43:01] but they were having difficulty.
[43:03] Maintaining a warm throughout the meeting. Right? So, so the
[43:07] request here, and I guess.
[43:09] And I believe it was when I was not on
[43:11] the board. The.
[43:13] The commission was expanded to the 11 members, but.
[43:16] Based on those challenges around yeah. Achieving a forum.
[43:19] The request here is to dial that back.
[43:23] And I believe the members have already been identified.
[43:26] As far as who will continue to be the full-time
[43:28] members and who will be the alternates.
[43:31] Alternates. And that is all in the packet.
[43:35] Yeah. So I'm not sure if anybody has any questions
[43:37] or concerns. I did.
[43:39] Notify Nick Keegan, that we were gonna raise this issue
[43:42] this evening.
[43:43] But if not anybody from the commission here. So if
[43:45] you.
[43:46] Have questions or want to hear from somebody at the
[43:48] commission? We could always do that. Or we could act
[43:50] on this now.
[43:54] I'm okay with it. Yeah. I, I, I.
[43:57] Just want to understand that.
[44:03] From 11.
[44:05] We're back down to seven. Yes, because that's more.
[44:09] Serviceable. Yes, because I think that the.
[44:12] Be when this was one of the concerns that we
[44:14] had going to 11 mm-hmm was that they would
[44:17] have enough people to hit Warren numbers.
[44:20] Every time they held a meeting.
[44:23] So by going back down to seven, you only need
[44:26] four.
[44:27] To head quorum. Okay. Yeah. So that was the whole,
[44:30] yeah. Six verse four.
[44:34] And the ultimate stood still be utilized, correct to, to
[44:37] fill in the.
[44:39] Other gaps as I can set. Yeah. The vacancy from
[44:41] the meeting. Right. Okay. Thank you. Just goes to show
[44:44] you when you turn it up to 11.
[44:46] Sometimes you gotta dial it back. .
[44:52] Okay. Yes, that was good. That was good. it's
[44:57] good.
[44:58] I am glad that everybody was on board with that
[45:00] one.
[45:01] Most of us. Okay.
[45:03] Do you need the adult names or do as presented
[45:06] last page of the packet? Excellent.
[45:13] Okay.
[45:16] So the only one was down was per email.
[45:19] Are we good with, is he alternate or is he.
[45:23] D. So the
[45:27] Southern members are Kelly, Meg, Dom, Stephanie.
[45:30] Lisa Jeanie and Charlene.
[45:33] Okay. Yes. Can you
[45:37] read it. Yep.
[45:39] I'd like to make a motion.
[45:42] That
[45:44] we use that the seven members.
[45:47] For the commissioner on disabilities would be Kelly, Kelly. Trapasso
[45:52] Meg Keegan.
[45:54] Dom Gelson, Stephanie.
[45:57] Laton
[45:59] Lisa Judson.
[46:01] Janine Collins and Charlene and Chadwick. And then the alternate
[46:06] members would be.
[46:08] Joanne Liebers, Shonda Desante Julia Wright.
[46:13] And Don Royer as presented.
[46:17] Pending they're accuracy status.
[46:23] And the call that Shane and I run, we, we
[46:25] kind of.
[46:26] Talk to them about just, you know, making sure that
[46:28] the members that are being chosen or the members that
[46:30] are the most likely to attend and be available.
[46:34] Just based on history. Okay. We received an understood.
[46:38] Thank you second. Okay. Any additional discussion?
[46:43] All those in favor. Aye. Aye. Aye. It's unanimous.
[46:51] No problem. It's not entirely straightforward. I don't get that
[46:53] package.
[46:56] Matter's not reasonably anticipated for new business.
[47:02] Public comment.
[47:06] Closing remarks.
[47:08] Remarks. If I may, Mr. Chairman.
[47:12] Let's please continue to pray for peace.
[47:15] For restraint among leaders for protection of innocent life.
[47:19] And for justice guided by wisdom.
[47:21] Thank you, Mr. Yeah, one of the thing is that.
[47:25] As schools back in session.
[47:28] You know, all those food athletes and.
[47:31] The other seasons are posted on the, you know, school
[47:33] website. It's always a.
[47:35] You know, good thing to go out and, you know,
[47:37] support all the sandwich, you know, athletics, you know that
[47:40] and another programs they have some plays coming up. So
[47:43] it.
[47:43] It's always good for the public to know about it
[47:45] and that they're all welcome to go. They're all free,
[47:48] you know, so it's a good yeah. Thing to go
[47:50] see.
[47:52] And, you know, here we on the Eve of the
[47:54] anniversary of September 11th.
[47:57] 25 years. So
[47:59] certainly a very significant moment in all of our lives.
[48:02] But if you have the opportunity, I encourage you to
[48:04] join us at station three in Forestdale tomorrow morning at
[48:07] nine.
[48:07] Am for what I'm, I'm confident is gonna be a
[48:10] very nice ceremony and then there's gonna be a.
[48:13] Small reception afterwards with pastry.
[48:16] Provided by the bakery.
[48:19] Bakery and, and an opportunity for folks to, to interrupt
[48:22] a little while. So that starts at 9:00 AM.
[48:25] Tomorrow morning at station three.
[48:27] So with that.
[48:29] I'm gonna let folks know that our next meeting.
[48:31] Will be here on September 24th at 6:00 PM.
[48:36] And that will continue to be here at the Sandhill
[48:39] school. And then we'll likely be moving back to town
[48:41] hall, I think. But.
[48:43] That's yet to be finalized, but likely.
[48:46] And we are going to be moving into executive session
[48:48] and we will not be returning to public session this
[48:51] evening.
[48:52] So with that, I will take a motion to.
[48:55] Move to executive session, make a motion. We honor executive
[48:57] session.
[48:59] Second. Okay.
[49:01] Motion to move to executive session in compliance with mass
[49:04] general law, chapter 30, a.
[49:07] Section 21 a to comply with open meeting law for
[49:10] the review and potential approval and release of the executive
[49:12] session minutes.
[49:14] As well as the disposition of real property, is there
[49:16] any discussion on the motion as presented by Mr. HAWC?
[49:19] Seeing none, we will roll call vote.
[49:23] Aye. Aye. And I vote. Aye. It is unanimous. We're
[49:27] now on executive session.