[0:00] Hi, I'm
[0:02] Kevin Morrissey, a member of the
[0:05] Solebury Board of Supervisors.
[0:08] Before I get into my introduction, I just would like to make just a real quick
[0:12] comment
[0:14] concerning an article in the Bucks County Herald
[0:18] this week.
[0:21] It was entitled, "North Wales Water Authority Plans to
[0:24] Place Storage Tank on Solebury Open
[0:28] Space." At very least, it's misleading.
[0:32] We have not made any sort of decision like that.
[0:34] We requested North Wales to contact the
[0:38] affected communities
[0:40] and find out what their feedback is, and then for North Wales to come back and
[0:44] talk to us about what that is. So the affected communities are Fox Run,
[0:48] North Pointe, Ingram Mills, Logan Square,
[0:53] and Hermitage communities. So anyway, there's that.
[0:56] I need to mention that a gathering such as this is not automatic.
[1:00] It's not magical.
[1:03] It takes quite a bit of effort to coordinate, and the credit
[1:07] really goes to Solebury Township manager, Chris
[1:11] Gargus, and his staff and consultants for doing the
[1:14] logistics for all this. I'd also like to
[1:18] thank you for coming. There are many
[1:21] temptations,
[1:23] many obligations. We all have tight schedules.
[1:26] We're pulling it all sorts of different ways, and I appreciate you coming tonight.
[1:30] The overriding question before us is, why do any of this at all?
[1:35] Why talk about attainable housing?
[1:38] And frankly, it's a topic
[1:41] that
[1:43] introduced by residents, not infrequently, in a variety of
[1:46] circumstances.
[1:49] I've had conversations in Giant and McCaffrey's and all sorts of places.
[1:54] And
[1:57] frankly, some are supportive and some aren't supportive.
[2:01] But it is a popular topic in the community.
[2:06] And before we go any further, I'd like to just spend a few
[2:10] moments outlining what was discussed at the first
[2:14] Attainable Housing
[2:16] Forum, which was April 9th.
[2:21] There, we discussed a wide range of topics,
[2:24] which included representatives from Habitat for Humanity,
[2:28] Bucks County, as well as Middle Atlantic Housing Development.
[2:32] We also talked about tiny houses, ADUs, accessory
[2:36] dwelling units. Those are things that--
[2:41] Well, a common example would be maybe converted garage or barn or
[2:46] some other existing structure, or even a new structure.
[2:49] Additionally, we talked about a variety of architectural types.
[2:54] Throughout the discussion, we invited feedback from the audience.
[2:58] And
[3:00] why have a second forum
[3:03] concerning attainable housing?
[3:05] Well, after the first
[3:07] forum,
[3:08] we really did have quite a bit of feedback,
[3:12] emails, and personal conversations, and phone
[3:16] calls, and it seemed residents had quite a bit to say about
[3:19] it.
[3:21] So
[3:23] reviewing community feedback is really what we do, and we really do, do that.
[3:27] Currently, the township has about 12 different committees covering a wide
[3:31] variety of topics, parks and rec, and
[3:34] historical
[3:37] architectural review, land preservation, all sorts of things.
[3:44] And of course, the goal of all this is to develop
[3:48] conclusions from all this,
[3:51] and
[3:53] we really try to get the best
[3:55] review of details that we can. None of us, none of the board are
[3:59] experts in everything, and
[4:01] we're lucky we're experts in anything.
[4:04] I
[4:05] haven't really got the hang of dancing yet.
[4:07] I
[4:09] don't know. That's something I'll have to work on.
[4:15] And additionally, tonight, we're also going to have representatives from the
[4:18] township
[4:20] further describe zoning characteristics of Solebury.
[4:23] It's not all the same, and it may not be clear at times.
[4:27] So again, what we're trying to do here is, as we have in many other
[4:31] parts of the township, we try to get the best
[4:35] feedback we can from the community and work off of that.
[4:39] As I said, we have all sorts of committees, and this is another effort to
[4:43] get community feedback.
[4:47] Hopefully, we'll have some good conversations tonight.
[4:50] And I'd like to hand this off to Tom Kometa, who will be
[4:54] coordinating our discussions tonight.
[4:56] Tom has worked with the township from 1987 to
[5:00] 1991 as township planner, and again, has helped us with a
[5:04] variety of planning projects since
[5:07] 2024.
[5:09] Tom has 53 years of experience as township
[5:13] planner
[5:14] and has worked with 149 municipalities since
[5:18] 1973. Tom, thank you for joining us.
[5:21] Oh, thank you, Kevin.
[5:23] Since we have such a good group, I wanted to start off
[5:28] by passing the mic just real quick around the room and tell us
[5:32] who you are, and let's say what road you live on.
[5:36] Thank you.
[5:37] Hi. I'm pretty loud without the mic.
[5:40] Oh, you're good. Okay.
[5:41] My name is Christine Stefanaki. I live on Lakeview Drive
[5:45] in the Riverwoods community.
[5:48] And a reminder, the mic is going to here as well. Thank you.
[5:53] Hi, I'm Peter Brusock. I live on Hillside Lane, close to
[5:57] Phelps Mill.
[6:01] Hi, I'm Helen Thai. I live on River Road close to Peter Brusock.
[6:07] Hannah Howe. I'm a Solebury School employee.
[6:12] Hi, Mitch Ardman on Stony Hill Road, near Aquitong.
[6:17] John.
[6:22] What's that?
[6:22] Why are you giving me the mic?
[6:23] Yeah.
[6:25] I have to say.
[6:26] You're in-
[6:27] John Francis.
[6:29] Supervisor.
[6:30] Right.
[6:31] Oh, Phillips Mill Road.
[6:34] Thank you.
[6:35] Hi, Susan McMahon, Silvertale Lane.
[6:38] Up.
[6:38] Preserve.
[6:41] It.
[6:43] Shannon Pendleton, Upper York and Green Hill.
[6:46] Thank you. And then for the panelists, let's start with Kate.
[6:50] Tell us who you are and all your titles with Solebury Township.
[6:55] Hi, everyone. My name's Kate Robison-Grubb, and I am Solebury's sustainability
[6:58] specialist. I also work closely with the EAC as their administrator, as well as
[7:02] the sustainability subcommittee.
[7:04] Thanks, Kate.
[7:06] Hello, my name is John Ives. I am the planning and zoning administrator, and I
[7:10] work in the planning and zoning department.
[7:13] Thank you, John. As I mentioned, I'm Kevin Morrissey.
[7:16] I'm on the board of supervisors,
[7:18] with John Francis and Mark Bombacker.
[7:21] I think he stepped out for a moment. He'll be back.
[7:25] And together we
[7:27] work with Chris Gargus through the whole process of this
[7:31] township.
[7:33] Hi, everybody. I'm Zach Zuber. I'm the zoning officer and also the director of
[7:37] planning and zoning.
[7:38] Very good. Thanks, Zach. So,
[7:43] basically what I wanted to do before each of
[7:46] the panelists
[7:49] takes a part of the program tonight is to reflect
[7:53] a little bit on
[7:55] what we heard
[7:56] April 9th at Housing Forum number one,
[8:00] and also
[8:02] to talk about what
[8:04] was the idea in organizing the agenda that we have for
[8:07] tonight. I suppose
[8:11] the most simplistic way to summarize is that
[8:15] in the about three weeks following the April 9th
[8:19] Housing Forum number one, we received a number of
[8:24] emails
[8:26] that
[8:27] commented on the takeaways that they had from the
[8:31] housing forum. And then the persons who weren't able to join us
[8:35] saw the
[8:37] video of the session, and then they also chimed
[8:41] in.
[8:42] My takeaway of
[8:45] what I read
[8:47] in the comments is that
[8:51] we
[8:52] raced through Housing Forum number one so quickly,
[8:56] that
[8:57] as our panel prepared for that,
[9:01] we just figured, well, we'll talk about zoning and different
[9:05] housing types and so forth, and everyone would
[9:09] absorb it in the same way that we had.
[9:12] But what we discovered from the emails is that the
[9:16] presentations that John and Zach had made were
[9:19] so
[9:20] complex,
[9:22] and perhaps for persons who hadn't looked at a zoning
[9:26] map or weren't familiar with which
[9:30] districts fell in which geographic areas of the township, they
[9:33] just needed more clarity. And they were courteous to say
[9:39] it was hard to follow and get into the
[9:43] detail with what John and Zach
[9:47] said. So fortunately, John and Zach did a deep dive
[9:52] and are going to talk about
[9:55] the same things that they mentioned at Housing Forum number one,
[9:59] but in a more focused way. And
[10:02] perhaps
[10:04] your email replies after this, and the ones from people who
[10:08] view the video
[10:10] will say, "That's it. They did it. We didn't quite
[10:14] understand what they had to say on April 9th, but now we really
[10:18] understand what they're talking about."
[10:21] The fact of the matter is, what John presented on
[10:25] April 9th
[10:27] is a very, I think, achievable number.
[10:30] That when we asked ourselves how would we move the needle
[10:35] if we wanted to on the idea of attainable housing,
[10:40] and we looked at 2030 and 2040.
[10:44] Even when you look at the Delaware Valley Regional Planning Commission
[10:48] population and housing forecasts,
[10:52] and we're in a growing region,
[10:55] that
[10:56] presumably less than
[10:59] 100 dwelling units
[11:03] might be in the trajectory or forecast from the regional planning group.
[11:08] And so I think it's easy for us to just think about
[11:13] how certain zoning districts allow lot
[11:17] sizes that are achievable, and there could be a house here and house there,
[11:22] infill here and there. But
[11:24] what we pretty much tried to concentrate on, because as Kevin said, there
[11:29] are about 12 different committees,
[11:31] is as a housing committee, we wondered,
[11:35] are
[11:37] the right types of housing
[11:40] accessible and available to people who need them?
[11:44] So one of the exhibits that we had and talked about last time
[11:48] is this idea of the attainable housing transect shown
[11:52] on the screen. And the idea is it's not one size
[11:56] fits all, and there might be different
[11:59] solutions in the more rural to
[12:02] suburban to more urbanized area. And
[12:06] realize it's probably not until you get to New Hope Borough that
[12:10] you're in the area that this illustrative is
[12:14] showingThe black rectangles closer together,
[12:18] and it might be not until you're in Doylestown
[12:22] Borough that you're in the urban core area.
[12:27] But
[12:28] in any event,
[12:31] the graphic on the bottom tries to
[12:34] put in each of these baskets,
[12:39] potentially plausible housing types that wouldn't
[12:43] upset you. And the reason I say wouldn't upset you, because the second set
[12:47] of responses
[12:49] that we got in the email, and I'm just
[12:53] generalizing, is, "I moved from
[12:56] Bristol or Bensalem or other parts of Bucks
[13:00] County to Solebury. Hey, I love it here.
[13:03] I love the rural character. I love the ambiance of the place.
[13:07] I love all the preserved farms.
[13:10] I love the scenic values and the environment.
[13:14] I don't want
[13:16] to
[13:17] inject housing types that would give an imbalance
[13:21] to Solebury."
[13:23] And that was
[13:25] sort of a couple of other responses.
[13:28] We didn't hear those
[13:29] specifically on April 9th, but we saw them in the
[13:33] response. And then about another third of the
[13:36] responses were, "Good job. I'm glad that the township
[13:40] is wrestling with the subject." And as Kevin
[13:44] pointed out at the beginning last time,
[13:47] we didn't know if we were going to have housing forum two,
[13:51] and we don't know if we're going to have housing forum number three.
[13:54] It could be in the fall.
[13:56] And so tonight, we're here to talk about
[14:00] some of the things that we need to have more detail on and also to
[14:04] hear from you. And we have a part of the program as an exercise to
[14:08] get your opinion on these housing types.
[14:11] We realize that it's not a statistically valid representative sample.
[14:15] It's just a polling.
[14:18] But
[14:19] all the while, and whatever we hear you say, whatever
[14:23] notations we take, however we would review the tape,
[14:28] would pretty much decide
[14:30] that when we have our follow-up, we're going to say, what did we learn from
[14:34] housing forum number two?
[14:36] Does it
[14:37] lead to a third program?
[14:40] Does our panel then collectively write
[14:44] the notes of what we're doing? And we're also
[14:48] simultaneously working on an update to the Solebury Township
[14:52] Comprehensive Plan, and that has a future land
[14:56] use element, which is required to have a housing
[15:00] plan element. So the perfect timing of the housing forum
[15:05] and the comprehensive plan is that they're coming together at the same
[15:09] time.
[15:12] I told a couple stories September 15th when we had a
[15:15] public workshop on
[15:18] the comprehensive plan, not even knowing that there were going to be housing
[15:22] forums, about some of my experiences over the years
[15:26] in other municipalities. So about 25 years ago in West
[15:30] Chester Borough,
[15:32] they said, "So Tom, we need to embark on a attainable
[15:35] housing initiative. How might we do it?" And I said,
[15:39] "Forget about it. There's no attainable housing in West Chester now, and there will
[15:43] never be."
[15:45] Mostly because when my two children graduated from high school and
[15:49] college, they couldn't afford to move into West Chester, and in
[15:53] fact, they didn't. One moved to San Francisco and the other one
[15:56] moved to Manhattan, and basically, they stayed there for a long
[16:00] time
[16:02] in more attainable housing opportunities.
[16:06] In any event,
[16:09] we scratched our heads in West Chester and we said, "Well, what
[16:13] could we do?" And I found a 1912
[16:17] Sanborn insurance map that had identified
[16:21] 92 carriage houses
[16:24] that were built in West Chester. So we hatched an idea
[16:28] called Historic Carriage House Overlay District.
[16:32] And in each of those that were mapped and that were then
[16:37] memorialized on a zoning overlay map, we would allow a
[16:41] second dwelling unit on a lot without subdivision.
[16:44] Or if the kids come back from college, you can kick them out and they can go live
[16:48] in the carriage house. Or if you are an
[16:52] artisan, a potter,
[16:55] good luck, Nagashima woodworker,
[16:58] or some craftsperson,
[17:01] you could have your business in this structure.
[17:05] Nancy Solomon, one of my neighbors, did clay board and
[17:08] pottery, and it's been wildly successful there.
[17:12] She could have never had
[17:14] that business enterprise in any other way, and it's in a
[17:18] residential district.
[17:21] Also in West Chester,
[17:24] we were decanted by the malls in the '70s and
[17:27] '80s, and the borough council came to me in 1995,
[17:32] where there was about 25%
[17:34] occupancy. Now there's 110% occupancy.
[17:39] And they said, "What's wrong with the picture?" And right at that time,
[17:43] the borough of West Chester had 1,250 square
[17:47] feet minimum lot area and an onerous parking
[17:50] requirement. So all of the second and third floors were
[17:54] vacant.
[17:56] And so
[17:58] we repealed the minimum 1,250 square foot per
[18:02] lot area, and we repealed the parking in the TC-1, Town Center-1
[18:06] District.
[18:07] And in the last 20 years, there have been about 160
[18:11] apartments in downtown West Chester.
[18:14] The West Chester University students walk downstairs to get their coffee or
[18:18] bubble tea or whatever is the
[18:21] hot itemAcai bowls. I don't even know how to say it, but
[18:25] anyway, it's hot.
[18:27] In Lower Gwynedd Township, they were concerned about 15 years ago
[18:31] about teardowns.
[18:34] And a lot of the houses built in the '40s and '50s were being torn
[18:38] down and in their words, they said that these McMansions were
[18:41] being built that were out of character and scale.
[18:45] So we then came up with an idea in some of the residential districts that if
[18:49] you left the house standing, we would bonus you by having two
[18:53] flag lots under certain design standards.
[18:56] So you could have two tiny homes on smaller lots than what the
[19:00] minimum lot area required.
[19:03] It was
[19:05] mildly successful. People still did the teardowns.
[19:09] A couple people took advantage of these bonus provisions
[19:13] where instead of tearing down the house and dividing the lot
[19:17] in two to have two homes, you could have three homes. Some people liked it.
[19:21] In 2006 in Charlestown, we did five TND overlay
[19:25] districts in Spring Oak and Duvall.
[19:28] They're the slip ramp on the turnpike.
[19:31] We allowed the granny flat or a mother-in-law suite above
[19:35] the garage.
[19:37] Only three
[19:39] of the 120 homes at Spring Oak took advantage of it,
[19:44] but still, we made provisions in these examples.
[19:48] So the lesson learned for me that relates to
[19:52] Solebury is
[19:54] memorialized in what I said at the housing forum, number one, which is, is
[19:58] there low-hanging fruit? Are there some sleeper
[20:02] opportunities where there could be housing
[20:05] types that are
[20:08] not troubling to most people, whether you're
[20:12] converting a barn that might be for farm work or housing,
[20:17] creating an accessory dwelling unit.
[20:20] And you've probably all read in the newspaper about so many different
[20:23] states that have that initiative,
[20:26] and the smaller home, tiny home movement.
[20:30] And then, in 1991 when we rewrote the Uwchlan
[20:34] Township zoning ordinance cover to cover, of all things, we
[20:38] did live-work units. And if you go to Eagleview at
[20:42] the Downingtown, West Chester exit of the turnpike, you
[20:46] find 12 of them.
[20:48] And
[20:49] the Eagleview pharmacist has his business downstairs.
[20:53] He lives upstairs. A yoga studio,
[20:57] rug salesperson,
[21:01] real estate office, what have you.
[21:03] And some of that is achieved in the illustrations that
[21:07] are listed on the right side of
[21:11] mixed use.
[21:14] I was asked in 1993 to give a
[21:17] presentation on smart growth,
[21:20] and I claimed that between the Delaware and
[21:24] Susquehanna Rivers on Route 30, coming out of
[21:28] Philadelphia to Lancaster, that there would be no
[21:31] farmland left,
[21:34] or open space left, by 2050, except
[21:38] for
[21:39] federal, county, and state parks, and Amish
[21:43] and Mennonite farmland. That's in the mid-'90s.
[21:48] And there's probably about
[21:51] 300 development entities in the Delaware
[21:55] Valley who have deep
[21:59] personnel who are always searching for the next farm to
[22:03] develop and build houses on. And I think on
[22:06] balance, a lot of communities like Solebury
[22:10] lament the loss of open space and love to see the
[22:14] farmland
[22:16] that you have, like here in Solebury.
[22:19] So the question that we've been asking ourselves is,
[22:22] what is the goal
[22:25] and what can we learn from population and housing forecasts?
[22:30] What does the zoning allow, and are there some
[22:33] sleeper opportunities?
[22:36] What do the demographics tell us, and does it move us
[22:40] in one direction or not? And
[22:44] another is, are there any other creative
[22:48] solutions that we're not thinking about?
[22:51] And today, I was telling a story about in the
[22:54] 1970s in Chester County, when
[22:58] a certain member of the family passed,
[23:01] the husband or wife occasionally would donate the farm to
[23:05] the municipality that had a farmhouse.
[23:08] And the municipalities would come to me and say, "Well, what are we going to do
[23:11] with that farmhouse?" And I would say,
[23:14] "Let's convert it to a
[23:17] viable dwelling unit and offer for free
[23:21] to live in it for the occupant who's going to cut the
[23:24] grass and shovel the snow, plow the snow, prune the
[23:28] shrubs, whatever,
[23:31] be like a town watch eyes on the property."
[23:35] And even to this day, Valley Creek Park in East Whiteland does have such a
[23:39] unit.
[23:40] I also thought as I parked the car on the side of the township building,
[23:44] if it's five or 10 years from now, and not a darn thing has
[23:48] changed, could the township put one
[23:52] house in that park? And on a snowy
[23:56] night, when Chris doesn't have to drive all the way
[24:00] cross-country, he has a place to stay.
[24:04] Or
[24:05] at properties
[24:07] like at schools,
[24:09] could there be housing? When I grew up in Manayunk,
[24:13] there were a lot of factories along Manayunk Canal.
[24:18] And
[24:19] basically, I told the story
[24:22] recently to New Hope borough officials.
[24:25] So-When I got my license at age
[24:29] 16, what you did in Manayunk at the time is you got
[24:33] your best
[24:34] girlfriend on a Sunday, and you drove to New Hope,
[24:38] and we would walk along the Delaware Canal.
[24:41] I did my undergraduate thesis at Penn State for a historic renewal
[24:45] plan of the Manayunk Canal, informed by what
[24:49] you all did in New Hope.
[24:51] And along the canal in Manayunk were the lock keepers'
[24:56] quarters. In Manayunk, where I grew up, with all the factories along the
[25:00] Schuylkill River and the Manayunk Canal, there was watchman's
[25:04] quarters.
[25:06] There used to be, in the '50s and '60s, boarding houses
[25:10] allowed in ordinances. They've all been repealed.
[25:14] So, I think there are
[25:17] maybe 20
[25:19] ideas that we could cultivate. We don't want to
[25:23] overshoot the mark. There's probably only three to five to
[25:26] six of them that would really be easy to achieve
[25:30] in Solebury. But on the strength of having these housing
[25:34] forums, we could pretty much say
[25:37] we
[25:38] tried to leave no stone unturned, unveil
[25:42] possibilities. What did we learn, and what are we going to do
[25:46] about it? Because the most frustrating thing for you would be to come back here in
[25:49] the fall, if we have housing three, and we don't have any answers
[25:53] for you, we don't have any suggestions for you, and you would say, "This is
[25:57] a complete waste of time. What the heck did we do?" So, I think sincerely,
[26:02] tonight we're going to listen to what you say, and we're going to
[26:05] process it, and then come back with some, ta-da,
[26:10] here's what we think we're going to do about it.
[26:12] Now, in that regard,
[26:14] John, we said as we were planning these sessions,
[26:19] what is the demand? What is the demographic and housing
[26:23] situations?
[26:25] What weaknesses do we have? What are the
[26:28] issues? So,
[26:31] going beyond what you did
[26:35] last time, can you do a deeper dive and then
[26:40] highlight
[26:42] some of the items in your demographic analysis?
[26:46] So Kate, that next one is going to be for Zach, who's going to follow
[26:50] John. But let's go to John's demographics.
[26:58] Yeah. We're going to go
[27:01] to that one and then Zach's going to-- There we go.
[27:06] So admittedly, John, you did a deeper dive than any of us
[27:10] have the brain bandwidth to process in a short
[27:14] time tonight. So, if you could touch on the high points, that would
[27:18] be great. And then, I think because we have such a
[27:22] good small group, John, would you mind if when you're
[27:25] saying if somebody goes to raise their hand, "Hey, what do you mean by that?" Would
[27:29] you mind if people interrupted you?
[27:31] Okay. So why don't you take it from there and
[27:35] take us through your deeper dive on this subject.
[27:39] Thank you.
[27:47] Great. Thanks, Tom.
[27:48] Sure. You're welcome.
[27:50] And if I can't do a deeper dive, I will probably defer to Zach, Kevin, or
[27:54] Kate.
[27:55] So,
[27:59] this part of the presentation is an overview and builds upon the previous
[28:03] demographic information that was presented at the first forum.
[28:07] But it does delve a little deeper into the possibility of establishing a
[28:11] need or interest to locate attainable housing in
[28:15] Solebury. It is for discussion purposes and to
[28:19] gauge interest in attainable housing opportunities.
[28:23] So according to the public workshop input for the new comprehensive plan
[28:28] that is underway that Tom mentioned,
[28:31] Solebury's strengths remain clear.
[28:33] Residents value Solebury's location and scenic beauty.
[28:38] They value community safety.
[28:41] They value the quality of life and the quality of education in the township.
[28:45] So, we felt in order to evaluate the attainable housing, we posed
[28:49] a series of questions to be asked.
[28:52] These questions look at aging trends, housing
[28:56] affordability,
[28:57] workforce alignment, housing production,
[29:01] and ultimately, housing types that may be missing.
[29:04] All of which will be a part of the overall common discussion tonight.
[29:11] Is Solebury aging?
[29:15] The numbers on this slide show that Solebury is aging, with a median age
[29:19] of 54.2 years old.
[29:23] That number is substantially above county, state, and national
[29:27] benchmarks.
[29:29] Additionally, this slide shows that 11% of the residents are between the
[29:33] ages of 20 and 40, which is commonly one of the targeted
[29:36] attainable housing age range that typically drives
[29:40] demands for starter homes and rentals.
[29:44] On the flip side,
[29:46] just over 51% of the population is 50 to 80 years old,
[29:51] indicating that the senior population is growing and will be in the near
[29:54] future.
[29:56] Many older residents may eventually seek smaller,
[30:00] accessible, lower-maintenance housing options while remaining in the community.
[30:06] So these numbers are not negative trends in any way, but do show that
[30:09] Solebury is a desirable community to live in.
[30:13] But it does raise the question about long-term demographic
[30:16] balance
[30:18] with an underrepresented population between the ages of 20
[30:22] and 40.
[30:24] The next question becomes whether younger households can realistically
[30:28] enter the housing
[30:29] market.And
[30:35] many of these numbers were emphasized in the first forum.
[30:39] So according to the census, the median household value is
[30:42] almost 800,000.
[30:45] And the latest typical home value, according to Zillow, is just
[30:49] under 955,000. In fact, the median list price
[30:53] of a home that
[30:56] sold in Solebury as of April 26 was just over 1.5 million,
[31:00] according to Zillow.
[31:02] According to the census, the median household income is
[31:06] $195,000 plus.
[31:09] The gross average monthly rents between the census and Zillow range
[31:13] between $2,500 to $3,000 a month.
[31:17] Taking into account these numbers, home prices are four to five times
[31:21] greater than the median household income.
[31:26] Of the total number of homes in the township, 93% are
[31:29] owner-occupied,
[31:31] and single-family detached homes comprise 80% of the total
[31:35] housing stock in the township.
[31:38] So what are some of the takeaways here?
[31:41] Home values and rents have risen to levels to create significant barriers for
[31:45] first-time homebuyers and moderate-income homebuyers.
[31:48] The housing market is overwhelmingly ownership-based,
[31:53] leaving limited rental or entry-level pathways.
[31:57] Even households with strong incomes may face difficulty
[32:00] purchasing locally without accumulated equity or
[32:04] dual incomes.
[32:06] This issue affects multiple groups, young families, single-income
[32:10] households, local employees, and even seniors looking to
[32:14] downsize.
[32:16] So this affordability challenge becomes even more visible when compared with
[32:20] the local workforce
[32:23] numbers.
[32:27] This slide shows the various employment sectors that
[32:30] support the local economy throughout the township.
[32:34] That'll get there first.
[32:37] And what the average salary ranges are.
[32:40] It shows that professional and technical services, jobs in finance,
[32:44] technology, and business
[32:46] is the highest employment sector with salaries that range from 95,000 to
[32:50] 160,000.
[32:53] The highest salary bands, which include professional and technical services and
[32:57] finance and real estate
[32:58] have
[33:00] what's called a possibility to purchase a home in Solebury, most like
[33:03] if the family includes dual incomes.
[33:07] And the other employment groups that include arts, tourism,
[33:11] recreation, education, retail, hospitality, and construction,
[33:16] have lower earning salaries, therefore more difficult to purchase housing.
[33:21] So the biggest takeaway is the growing gap
[33:24] between housing costs and workforce earnings,
[33:28] which creates pressure on workforce retention,
[33:31] commuting patterns, and long-term community sustainability.
[33:36] Another big takeaway is the notion that
[33:39] 66% of job salaries within the township,
[33:43] according to these employment sectors, will find it difficult to afford
[33:47] the current housing stock.
[33:56] So this slide displays
[33:58] that there was moderate job growth between the years of 2000 and
[34:02] 2020 at about 14.5% over the last
[34:06] 20 years.
[34:08] Projections over the next 20 years from 2020
[34:12] to 2040 show a low employment growth rate of 10%.
[34:17] The biggest takeaway from this is that all employment sectors
[34:21] that need workforce employees will be limited, which will impact
[34:25] targeted attainability housing population and their ability to
[34:28] afford a house in Solebury.
[34:33] So this presentation is not arguing that every worker should live locally,
[34:37] but rather examining whether there are enough housing options across
[34:41] different income levels.
[34:47] The next slide asks, has housing production kept pace?
[34:52] The population grew 11% from 2000 to 2010
[34:57] and 0.2% from 2010 to 2020.
[35:01] And from 2020 to 2025, the population growth has dropped
[35:06] below the 2010 population.
[35:10] However, the population is projected to slightly increase over the next 15
[35:14] years to 2040.
[35:16] Housing production increased 540 units from 2000 to
[35:20] 2020.
[35:22] It has slightly grown since then, and in the last few years
[35:26] has averaged five plus units according to approved permits for
[35:29] new residential construction.
[35:32] So currently, there is slow population growth and slow new
[35:36] housing growth.
[35:40] So basically, housing growth appears to be currently stable for the current
[35:43] predominantly housing type of single-family detached, which comprises
[35:47] 80% of housing types in Solebury.
[35:51] So the big key takeaway with regards to attainable housing and
[35:55] population is
[35:58] the housing inventory remains tight with limited vacancy and
[36:02] relatively little
[36:03] housing being added over the last two decades.
[36:07] Since Solebury Township is 93% owner-occupied with a low
[36:11] vacancy rate, with high and competitive housing prices,
[36:16] it is obvious that the people want to stay here,
[36:19] which creates little opportunity for younger starter homeowners and the
[36:23] elderly who wish to downsize.
[36:26] This suggests a limited diversity in housing types beyond single-family detached
[36:30] to accommodate the targeted attainable
[36:32] populations.And
[36:37] just to summarize some of the findings.
[36:41] So this limited data consistently points toward a mismatch between housing
[36:44] availability and the needs of attainable populations.
[36:49] The strongest themes are aging demographics, high housing costs,
[36:53] limited rental and attainable ownership properties, and low turnover.
[37:00] The presentation basically identifies what planners often call missing middle
[37:04] housing,
[37:05] smaller scale, more attainable housing options between large
[37:10] lot single-family homes and high-density development.
[37:14] So in closing, the broader discussion is ultimately about balance,
[37:18] preserving Solebury's character while ensuring future generations,
[37:22] local workers and older residents can continue to be part of the community.
[37:27] Solebury's desirability and quality of life are clear strengths.
[37:32] The question raised by this analysis is whether the community's
[37:36] housing choices remain broad enough to support residents at
[37:40] different ages and life stages,
[37:43] as well as younger families, to local workers, to seniors who want to age in
[37:47] place.
[37:57] John,
[37:59] when we think about what your title would be next year, we're
[38:03] going to ask Chris and Kevin and the board, could we add
[38:07] to your role, township demographer? Could we do that?
[38:11] No, seriously, this is really complex stuff.
[38:14] You did an excellent job to simplify a very, very
[38:17] dense set of factoids. Before we go
[38:21] on, does anybody in the audience have any specific question to ask
[38:25] John on what he's just presented?
[38:28] Hopefully it wasn't more confusing than-
[38:31] Go for it. So please, uh-
[38:33] I do research as well.
[38:36] Mm-hmm.
[38:36] So I compared Solebury... Oh, sorry.
[38:40] I compared Solebury Township with Warminster and Doylestown, and I grew up in
[38:44] Warminster right, in the early '70s.
[38:47] And so I'll have a story at the end because I originally
[38:51] thought that Warminster had a density population
[38:55] increase over time, and it didn't,
[38:58] which was really intriguing to me because when I was a kid,
[39:02] we were able to cross Street Road as a young kid going to
[39:06] the grocery store or shop with my mom, right, no issues.
[39:09] When I was 16, before I went to college, I was able to go from Davisville Road
[39:14] up to 611 in 15 minutes. You cannot do that today,
[39:19] right?
[39:21] So some of the research I had was looking at those numbers and
[39:25] verifying those numbers. I actually did my own kind of research.
[39:32] In Solebury Township, 4% of the population work in the
[39:35] township,
[39:37] 22% work from home,
[39:39] 44% commute out,
[39:42] and their commute on average is 39.2 miles.
[39:46] So they are going far away to work at those high-level jobs,
[39:49] right, that they're paying.
[39:53] And then the 30%, which is actually on average across all those three
[39:56] townships, are not in the labor force.
[39:58] And ironically enough, all townships have about the same amount of
[40:02] people commuting out,
[40:04] but ours is the furthest commute,
[40:07] right? So people who live in this township don't necessarily work in this
[40:10] township.
[40:11] Yeah.
[40:12] Right? Which I find is okay.
[40:16] Mm-hmm.
[40:16] Right? I'm okay with that. I moved into this township at
[40:20] 38 years of age. I worked hard because we wanted to come
[40:24] here,
[40:25] and I
[40:27] feel that it's a privilege to live here.
[40:30] I love the open spaces.
[40:33] And I'm not against
[40:37] affordable housing if we're talking like
[40:41] the in-law suites,
[40:44] additional properties on someone's farm for farm workers to go
[40:50] and live in. If it's someone who owns the property and they want to build a
[40:54] carriage house, if we have rules against that, I think maybe we should look into
[40:58] changing those rules.
[41:01] Thank you.
[41:03] John, do you have any other comments?
[41:05] I was going to say, those are all options that we probably will be
[41:09] discussing tonight.
[41:10] Yeah.
[41:11] Because we want any sort of attainable housing to work its way into
[41:15] the fabric of the community.
[41:17] Yes, sir.
[41:18] I just have a comment, yeah.
[41:21] So in the beginning, everyone said who they were and what road they lived on.
[41:25] Okay.
[41:25] And tell us who you are and what road you live on.
[41:28] Use the microphone.
[41:29] Okay. Just-
[41:30] I don't think I need it, but-
[41:31] It's for the recording.
[41:34] I didn't see.
[41:35] Just so the people that watch this later can-
[41:40] There you go. Hi, my name is Joseph Verone.
[41:43] I live on Shetland Drive in Solebury.
[41:46] I purchased my house in 1996. I've been here for 30
[41:49] years.
[41:51] It was an upgrade for me. I moved here when I was 37 also.
[41:55] I worked very hard to purchase a home in Solebury.
[41:58] I drive over 30 miles each way to work, one
[42:02] hour each way in traffic. I want to say that I was
[42:06] looking at, is Solebury aging? Yes.
[42:09] Five homes on my street in the past year sold,
[42:14] and they were seniors who could no longer afford to live here, which was very
[42:18] sad. They were retired on a fixed
[42:21] income, and their taxes, including mine, went up 700
[42:25] last year, and I'm sure they're going up 700 this year.
[42:29] The five houses were purchased by you saying 11%
[42:33] residents age 20 to 40. All five of those homes were
[42:37] purchased by-By residents aged 20 to 40.
[42:41] My neighbors next door are 28 years old and just
[42:45] purchased their home in Solebury.
[42:48] And so I don't think you're doing enough for the seniors
[42:52] to bring a...
[42:55] I think this is
[42:58] not attainable,
[43:02] for the population. It's more low income, trying to
[43:06] bring low income here.
[43:08] For 30 years, I've been hearing
[43:12] supervisors and the school board saying, "This is a
[43:15] serene, peaceful place." Bonds have floated for 30
[43:19] years to buy open space, and now all of a sudden
[43:23] you want to bring in 100 units of
[43:27] low-income housing. You want to put a tiny house in every backyard.
[43:31] You want everyone to turn their garage into an in-law suite.
[43:35] What's that going to do to our aquifer? We're all on well water.
[43:38] We're septics. Has anybody thought about that? And Mr.
[43:42] Zubas, are you going to give a permit for a tiny house in everyone's
[43:46] backyard or for them to turn their garage into an in-law
[43:50] suite? We have enough traffic as it is.
[43:52] We have enough problems with well water and septic.
[43:56] I don't think this is attainable at all, to be honest.
[43:59] If I could make a comment, please.
[44:01] Perfect.
[44:02] No one has made a plan for 100 units of anything.
[44:06] Well, that's what I heard last week.
[44:08] They said between 50 and 100 units were going to be built in Solebury.
[44:12] No, what we said is the projections.
[44:15] So before we got started as a group, we asked,
[44:19] just like any other community would ask,
[44:22] what is in the stars? What
[44:26] does the Delaware Valley Regional Planning Commission, the Bucks County Planning
[44:30] Commission, the Pennsylvania State Data Center say in terms of
[44:33] growth?
[44:34] And so is it a little bit, like 100 homes,
[44:39] or a lot, or a medium amount? We wanted to wrap
[44:43] our minds around what
[44:46] do the prognosticators think is going to happen so we
[44:50] can plan ahead. Now, I also want to just mention
[44:55] that I didn't earlier,
[44:58] I didn't say we were working simultaneously on the comprehensive plan.
[45:03] The municipality's planning code,
[45:05] circa 1968, called Act 247,
[45:10] as amended,
[45:12] has a section on comprehensive planning, and it has the word shall.
[45:15] And when you look at the definitions, may is discretionary and
[45:19] shall is you have to do it. So it says, "Municipalities
[45:23] shall include the following elements in a comprehensive plan." It lists like a
[45:27] dozen items. I'm going to just touch one of them, because we're
[45:31] asking ourself the question in the comprehensive plan, how can
[45:35] we comply with this shall requirement?
[45:38] So it says, "Comprehensive plans shall include a
[45:41] plan
[45:43] to meet the housing needs of present residents."
[45:47] Could be, as you said,
[45:50] not doing enough for the seniors.
[45:53] "And those individuals and families anticipated to reside in the
[45:57] municipality, which may include the conservation of
[46:00] presently sound housing,
[46:03] rehabilitation of housing in declining neighborhoods." This is
[46:06] written for the whole state. I don't think we have declining neighborhoods in
[46:10] Solebury.
[46:11] And the accommodation, this is the key part, "The accommodation of
[46:15] expected new housing in different dwelling types
[46:20] and at appropriate densities for households of all income
[46:23] levels."
[46:25] So when we're done the comp plan, we have to say, do we get an A on our report
[46:28] card? Did we address the shall requirement there?
[46:32] So in what we're doing, we are sort of
[46:36] scraping at the surface of saying, how do we do this?
[46:40] And we're doing a deep dive in all of these subjects.
[46:44] What we're going to conclude at the end, I'm not sure.
[46:47] But we're in this probative fact-finding kind of
[46:52] mood. And
[46:54] more to follow. We will have some answers to your
[46:58] questions,
[46:59] not tonight, but it's good that you've mentioned what you did.
[47:03] So-
[47:03] If I could mention-
[47:04] Yeah
[47:05] ... as I introduced,
[47:08] we have 12 committees of about 100 residents
[47:12] drilling down on all sorts of topics, and that's what this is.
[47:15] This is not a ramp-up, and this is not an announcement to say, "Okay, we're going
[47:18] to build 100 units in your backyard." This is an
[47:22] attempt to get community input.
[47:26] So is this an important issue
[47:30] or is it not an important issue? Let's talk about this.
[47:33] That's what we're doing, but it's not something that
[47:36] the bulldozers aren't rolling at this point.
[47:40] Yeah, and so Kevin, to your point, Kevin,
[47:43] the easy-peasy part is just to say, well, we have a
[47:47] mandate in the planning code. All Pennsylvania municipalities
[47:51] have it. We've done our
[47:55] homework. We've looked at what people say might be the housing and
[47:59] population forecast. And we have to say, well, if there
[48:02] were additional housing on the order
[48:06] of 100 units,
[48:09] what would it look like? Where might it go? What might be the options?
[48:13] We don't have a housing authority. We're not building houses.
[48:17] Solebury Township does not have a housing authority.
[48:20] But what we could do is say, are there any
[48:23] impediments in the zoning ordinance that would
[48:26] prevent what the gentleman said of not
[48:30] having enough for the seniors? So anyway-
[48:33] But again, back to my point, what we're trying to
[48:37] do here is we're trying to determine what percentage of the population,
[48:42] the community,
[48:43] in whatever way we can determine
[48:46] Are in favor of attainable housing.
[48:49] And if it is attainable housing, what does that look like?
[48:52] And as I said, maybe it's ADUs,
[48:54] maybe
[48:56] it's a seven-story
[48:59] building unit, or maybe it's
[49:03] tiny houses
[49:05] or nothing.
[49:07] But the stage we're at at this point is we're trying
[49:11] to get input from the community as to what is the tolerance.
[49:15] I can tell you, at the last
[49:18] meeting,
[49:21] I sat here and there were--
[49:24] And I could identify, and it was a well-attended meeting.
[49:29] There were people of a variety of political positions,
[49:33] left and right, and all of them said, "There is an issue."
[49:37] And this is flying 40,000 feet up looking at it,
[49:40] but there are issues. And what do we do?
[49:43] And some people said, "Yes, I worked hard to be
[49:47] here and they can work hard too," or,
[49:51] "Gee, we've got a problem here. We need to diversify the
[49:54] population." But that's what we're doing here.
[49:56] We're trying to discuss what those issues are.
[50:00] And Kevin, the one thing I forgot to say in my story about
[50:05] Lancaster Avenue from Philadelphia to Lancaster, City of Philadelphia
[50:09] to the City of Lancaster, as I said in my presentation in the mid-'90s,
[50:14] all you would have to do is add the second story
[50:17] above single story, non-residential,
[50:21] and you could meet the population demand for 2050.
[50:26] After the federal tax code was amended in
[50:29] 1954,
[50:32] you no longer
[50:35] were incentivized to do two and three-story buildings.
[50:40] In my alma mater, Penn State, when you go down the bottom of the
[50:43] so-called mall from the Pattee Paterno Library to the corner room,
[50:48] if you look to the right, you see all the buildings built up to
[50:51] 1954. If you look to the left, you see all the buildings that were built
[50:55] after 1954, many of which are one-story buildings.
[51:00] And
[51:02] Route 202 corridor,
[51:04] just in your mind's eye, think about how many one-story non-residential
[51:08] buildings there are,
[51:09] and just pretend that each of them had a second floor.
[51:15] That would be more than 100 units.
[51:17] That is one possibility, but it's not going to happen.
[51:21] People aren't going to do that. Maybe one or two or three if we let them, but it
[51:25] is a possibility. It's one of the possibilities.
[51:28] So we're going to go-- Sure. Helen. Yes.
[51:32] Let's take the mic. Go for it.
[51:34] There you go.
[51:37] I think
[51:39] I'm troubled by some of what I've heard.
[51:41] We all moved here and love it here because it's so
[51:45] beautiful and it's a wonderful place to live.
[51:48] And at the same time, I'm hearing this like we don't want anybody else to come,
[51:52] which I find very troublesome.
[51:55] The data that John shared shows that we have
[51:59] a big deficit in the age 20 to 40.
[52:03] I think our community would benefit from having people of that
[52:07] age.
[52:08] And what's going to happen when
[52:11] the older folks in Solebury die?
[52:15] They've got these massive homes and who
[52:19] even wants massive homes anymore? Who can afford these massive homes?
[52:23] I think we need to be trying to attract people and this
[52:27] gentleman mentioned we need to do more for seniors because they can't afford to
[52:31] live here. Well, that's the same problem younger people have.
[52:33] And so having attainable housing would benefit both younger people,
[52:37] lower income people, as well as older people.
[52:40] And I don't hear anybody saying, "Let's build a massive apartment
[52:44] complex." I'm hearing,
[52:47] to me, if you like the rural character of Solebury,
[52:51] having accessory dwellings or tiny homes
[52:55] is a way to preserve that rural setting while
[52:59] also bringing in more attainable housing.
[53:02] So
[53:04] you can't have it both ways, right?
[53:05] We
[53:07] have an aging population. If we don't
[53:11] make allowances or provisions that allow for attainable
[53:15] housing, then we're just going to continue to have the same problem.
[53:18] We're not going to attract younger people.
[53:20] Older people are going to have to leave the community.
[53:22] So-
[53:23] Totally agree.
[53:25] Oh, please. Yes, please.
[53:27] Thank you.
[53:30] I also wanted to speak to the concept of hard work.
[53:35] I really am grateful for this in this session and last time,
[53:39] the highlighting of
[53:42] how much money people are paid. By the nature of our
[53:47] world and economy,
[53:49] different people get paid different amounts of money.
[53:51] All of the people who are working are working hard.
[53:56] Some people are doing very hard work
[53:59] caring for elderly in nursing homes and getting paid very little.
[54:02] Some people are doing very hard work as CEOs of companies and
[54:06] getting paid a lot.
[54:09] I believe that all people, if they want
[54:13] to, should have the possibility of living
[54:17] close to where they work. I like the idea of
[54:21] the person who
[54:23] is the plumber in our homes being someone I
[54:27] might run into in the grocery store, or
[54:30] a kid's teacher
[54:32] also having a kid on the local soccer team, and you see that teacher as a
[54:36] human being outside of the classroom because they live in your community.
[54:40] So, just a reminder that when we talk about attainable
[54:44] housing, we're not talking about necessarily
[54:47] "low income," even though I'll personally say
[54:51] that would beFine with me. But what we're really talking about here in
[54:55] Solbury Township is what is not low
[54:58] income. We're talking about somebody potentially who makes
[55:02] $70,000 a year.
[55:05] That's a person working very hard for a very
[55:09] reasonable income who cannot live close to where they work
[55:13] in this community.
[55:16] So I just want to speak to that concept of hard work.
[55:20] There's a great phrase that all labor is skilled labor.
[55:25] All work is hard work, and I want everyone the opportunity to not
[55:29] have to drive 39 miles if that's not their
[55:33] choice to get to work.
[55:35] Let's do this. One more comment, or two more comments, and
[55:39] then we're going to go to Zach, just to keep on time. Thank you.
[55:45] Yeah. Love all of these comments. I'm a big believer in
[55:49] improvisation and yes, and, I think maybe we could have it both ways.
[55:56] I think not only looking at housing typologies and vacant lots
[55:59] where housing could go, but the nature of the housing we have now,
[56:04] the houses that we live in in Solbury
[56:07] are very large.
[56:09] I talked with a friend of mine who grew up in the Bronx, and she looks at
[56:13] some of the new houses being built, and she goes, "10 families could live in
[56:16] there."
[56:17] So I think it's also a question of what does the existing housing
[56:21] stock look like? What could it look like if we were
[56:25] to change zoning to do some of the multifamily, mixed-use,
[56:29] live-work, boarding house?
[56:32] Use the typologies that we have and understand how it impacts the
[56:36] septic, the water use, and
[56:39] make reasonable rules around how we might
[56:43] reexamine the housing we have.
[56:45] And I really appreciate what you're doing tonight, appreciated the last forum very
[56:49] much. The biggest takeaway for me is
[56:54] as we have more and more privileged people living here who
[56:57] don't labor, in a sense, without
[57:01] machines at their aid. They work with their hands, they work with people.
[57:06] We had a lot of commercial mom-and-pop
[57:10] business owners here at the last forum talking about how
[57:14] they could not find staff. We have hospitals that cannot
[57:18] find staff. We have schools that sometimes cannot find staff.
[57:21] Our school pays very well. But a lot of other communities that end up in
[57:25] this very narrow demographic,
[57:28] they don't have assistance that they need
[57:32] to age here, even if they could afford to stay, because no one
[57:36] who will care for them or help them or fix their broken parts,
[57:40] whether it be the house parts or the people parts, can afford to live
[57:43] nearby and can't commute for an hour to give you a hand.
[57:48] I actually live on a property here in
[57:52] Solbury that I was lucky enough to inherit,
[57:55] and I run it with my brother, and we are grandfathered in as a multifamily.
[57:59] And we rent very affordably
[58:02] because we want to be able to enjoy the people that we
[58:05] live on the property with.
[58:08] And I think that the other thing that was missing, John, from
[58:11] your reasons why people live here, and the more I meet people
[58:15] and talk to local folks because I volunteer a lot, I go out a lot,
[58:19] I love this community,
[58:21] people love the farms. And they really love being able to have local
[58:25] food,
[58:26] which is not a small thing. And that requires
[58:30] a lot of seasonal housing, seasonal workers, and a lot
[58:34] of respect for working with the earth.
[58:37] So I just want to reconsider some of the
[58:40] typologies we have, some of the big buildings we have, and how we might rezone
[58:44] them or look at them in a different way to have it both
[58:47] ways. Sorry that was so long. Good transition to zoning.
[58:51] You can... Yeah, there we go.
[58:53] Hey, Chris.
[58:55] Thanks.
[58:58] I'll start by saying
[59:01] I agree with you 100%.
[59:04] When I was growing up, I grew up on Long Island.
[59:08] I graduated from university. I had to commute from Long
[59:12] Island into Brooklyn every day.
[59:15] Every day.
[59:17] There was no way I, as a working person, could
[59:21] ever have afforded to live in the neighborhood where I
[59:25] grew up, where my parents worked hard to buy a
[59:28] home. I had to leave. I left New York. Eventually, I married.
[59:33] I moved. And believe it or not, I moved to Main Line, Pennsylvania.
[59:37] I moved to Wayne. Believe it or not, I could afford a home there that I could not
[59:40] afford on Long Island. And I worked hard.
[59:44] I worked really, really hard. And when I finally
[59:47] retired 11 years ago, I moved here
[59:51] for the same reasons you said. I was considerably older than you when I
[59:55] moved here, but that's why I moved here,
[59:58] because I can attain the housing here,
[1:00:02] and I don't want it to change. I'm sorry. I don't want it to change.
[1:00:06] That's why I moved here.
[1:00:09] I'm fine with some
[1:00:11] of this, what you're talking about, attainable housing.
[1:00:13] But I fear, I truly fear,
[1:00:16] that it will get out of hand. The idea for
[1:00:19] diversity and bringing in-- I don't believe that just because you
[1:00:23] work in this township, you have to have
[1:00:27] housing provided for you. I understand the
[1:00:30] farmworkers. That part I get. I do.
[1:00:33] But
[1:00:35] I don't believe just because you work somewhere that you
[1:00:39] must be provided housing. I commuted for years.
[1:00:43] I survived.
[1:00:44] Yeah. Thanks a lot. Okay, so what we're going to do,
[1:00:48] we're going to hear from Zach next.
[1:00:51] I also wanted to give a shout-out to my-Colleague
[1:00:55] Erin Gross, who's joining us virtually-
[1:00:58] Hello
[1:00:58] ... who's helped a great deal in presenting these
[1:01:02] work products and working on our housing
[1:01:06] committee. So Zach,
[1:01:10] tell us a little bit more about
[1:01:14] the zoning from your perspective.
[1:01:16] And
[1:01:17] we are going to have questions of the panel later, so I'm going to hold
[1:01:21] off on the questions just so we could stay on time, but could you tell us what you
[1:01:26] have done in your deep dive after the April 9th
[1:01:30] housing forum? Thanks.
[1:01:53] Some technical difficulties.
[1:01:58] There we go. Okay.
[1:01:59] So just want to go over some of the zoning districts we have here,
[1:02:05] talk a little bit about the residential, some of the commercial districts.
[1:02:10] I'll go over the residential districts,
[1:02:13] talk about what districts are--
[1:02:18] There's not a whole lot that we can do in those districts because they're so built
[1:02:22] out. There's some restrictions, so talk about those districts,
[1:02:26] talk about
[1:02:28] some opportunities we have in other districts as well.
[1:02:32] So this first slide here shows that we have 16 zoning districts
[1:02:36] in Solbury.
[1:02:38] So seven of the zoning districts are primarily
[1:02:42] residential. Eight are primarily commercial,
[1:02:46] but we will see in certain commercial districts, there are
[1:02:49] some residential housing types that are permitted, depending on the
[1:02:53] situation. And then we have the OR zoning
[1:02:57] district,
[1:02:58] which is outdoor recreational. No residential use is
[1:03:02] permitted there.
[1:03:06] So the first slide is the RARB zoning
[1:03:10] district. The RARB zoning district takes
[1:03:14] up the majority of the township.
[1:03:18] As you can see, it's probably 80,
[1:03:22] 90, 85% of the township is RARB.
[1:03:28] RARB stands for residential agricultural.
[1:03:31] RA is smaller lots, RB is larger lots.
[1:03:36] RA is one and a half acre minimum, RB is a three-acre
[1:03:40] minimum.
[1:03:43] So some of the opportunities in these zoning districts
[1:03:46] include in-law suites.
[1:03:50] At the April 9th meeting, I think I had mentioned that I get a lot of
[1:03:54] phone calls about in-law suites.
[1:03:58] Ironically, I did get a phone call yesterday from someone looking to buy a property
[1:04:02] and asked me, "Is this something that I can purchase and have
[1:04:06] my mother come live with me as an accessory dwelling?" And due to
[1:04:10] the restrictions, I said, "No, it doesn't work with the
[1:04:14] current standards that we have in the ordinance."
[1:04:19] Moving forward, just maybe take another look at the accessory dwelling
[1:04:23] restrictions and the regulations that we have.
[1:04:27] So these districts currently allow accessory dwellings, but there are some
[1:04:31] restrictions that would really
[1:04:34] damper some of those potentials.
[1:04:38] We have barn conversions, which
[1:04:42] is something that we're also looking at with farm worker housing, potentially.
[1:04:46] That's an option.
[1:04:48] Tiny homes
[1:04:50] and pocket neighborhoods. Pocket neighborhoods would be small
[1:04:54] cluster of houses
[1:04:58] located on the same lot.
[1:05:01] So not looking at something where you're going to have a subdivision come through
[1:05:04] and have 20 lots.
[1:05:07] Some of the obstacles that we see in these zoning districts, as I mentioned, the
[1:05:11] acreage requirements.
[1:05:14] When it comes to accessory dwellings currently, the RA zoning
[1:05:18] district requires that you have a four-acre minimum to
[1:05:22] have an accessory dwelling. Our RB zoning district requires
[1:05:26] a minimum of seven acres.
[1:05:29] So
[1:05:30] the way it is in the current ordinance is in-law suites are not
[1:05:35] a recognized use.
[1:05:37] So if someone were to call me and say, "Can I have an in-law suite
[1:05:41] for my mother?" I'm in the RB zoning district, and I
[1:05:45] have five acres.
[1:05:48] Current process would be, they would have to go to the zoning hearing board and ask
[1:05:51] for a variance, because it doesn't meet the current standards of the ordinance.
[1:05:56] Another-
[1:05:58] Zach, can you just provide
[1:06:01] for someone coming to you in that situation, what's the
[1:06:04] timeline and the outlay for something like that, on average?
[1:06:10] So as far as the zoning hearing board process,
[1:06:14] typically you're looking at
[1:06:18] two, three months,
[1:06:20] just to go through that process and get a decision.
[1:06:24] And there's no guarantees that that
[1:06:27] would be granted. It really depends on the situation and if there's a
[1:06:30] hardship
[1:06:32] recognized by the municipality's planning code and the zoning ordinance
[1:06:36] to grant the variance. So there's no guarantees.
[1:06:39] Yep.
[1:06:41] Some of the other obstacles in RARB, we see a lot of conservation
[1:06:45] easements.
[1:06:46] Zach?
[1:06:46] Oh, I'm sorry.
[1:06:48] Zach, do you know how many times you get asked for in-law suites and the
[1:06:51] percentage that are--
[1:06:54] Does it happen more often than not?
[1:06:57] We don't get a whole lot of accessory dwelling unit
[1:07:01] applications.
[1:07:03] Many times, what we try to look at is
[1:07:07] if someone's doing an addition, perhaps they're not doing
[1:07:12] a separate kitchen. That is one of the triggers for a dwelling unit
[1:07:16] definition.
[1:07:17] So we do see additions, and we occasionally will get accessory
[1:07:21] dwellings, but it's not a rare occurrence right now.
[1:07:29] As I had mentioned, we have a lot of properties.
[1:07:31] I'd say,
[1:07:32] yeah, basically almost all the conservation
[1:07:36] easements are in the R-AR-V zoning district.
[1:07:39] So those conservation easements will prohibit certain types of
[1:07:43] uses,
[1:07:45] which may not allow to do an accessory dwelling unit in any capacity.
[1:07:49] And also deed restrictions.
[1:07:52] And then we also have some HOA oversight in some of
[1:07:56] those developments as well.
[1:08:07] There we go.
[1:08:12] So the next zoning district is the R-1 zoning district, and this is
[1:08:16] a zoning district that doesn't have a lot of
[1:08:19] hope for having any kind of accessory dwelling
[1:08:23] units, but I did want to at least kind of go through this.
[1:08:27] So the R-1 zoning district is a small lot
[1:08:30] residential zoning district.
[1:08:33] It is adjacent to Peddler's Village, and this is the Peddler's View
[1:08:37] development.
[1:08:41] So that's bugging in.
[1:08:48] The R-1 zoning district potential opportunities, and
[1:08:52] this could be far-fetched, but potentially small
[1:08:56] additions or if there's existing garages to have an apartment.
[1:09:00] The big problem is
[1:09:03] small lot sizes, and then there's HOA oversight and bylaws that
[1:09:06] probably would not permit these type of uses.
[1:09:10] Zach, when you say it doesn't have hope, it's pretty much because it's already all
[1:09:13] built out, correct?
[1:09:14] That's correct.
[1:09:15] Okay, thanks. Let's go to the next one. Thanks.
[1:09:31] So the next zoning district here is the R-DC zoning
[1:09:35] district. This is residential development and conservation.
[1:09:39] So basically, it's
[1:09:42] two areas you'll see in these areas, Fox Run
[1:09:45] Estates, Fox Run Preserves, and then you're going to see some larger
[1:09:49] properties along Meeting House Road, Creamery Road, and
[1:09:53] Sugarland Road.
[1:09:56] Some potential opportunities,
[1:10:00] small additions for in-law suites,
[1:10:03] garage apartments for existing garages,
[1:10:07] accessory dwellings, but that's really dependent on
[1:10:11] all of these properties on Meeting House and Creamery and
[1:10:15] Sugarland. They basically all have conservation easements.
[1:10:19] So that could impact whether or not you could do accessory
[1:10:22] dwellings on these properties, and then barn conversions as well.
[1:10:29] Some obstacles, small lot sizes in the Fox
[1:10:33] Run Preserves area.
[1:10:37] HOA oversight, bylaws, which could prevent having any of
[1:10:41] that use,
[1:10:43] and then more so for the larger lots, you have
[1:10:47] natural resource restrictions in addition to the conservation
[1:10:51] easements.
[1:11:00] So the next zoning district is the residential development zoning
[1:11:04] district. This encompasses Northpointe, Wil-Shire
[1:11:08] Hunt,
[1:11:09] Fieldstone, Hermitage, and I don't have it listed everything.
[1:11:13] Amuse is also in there.
[1:11:16] Potential opportunities, again, this is another difficult
[1:11:20] zoning district because of it already being built out, but potentially small
[1:11:24] additions for in-law suites or garage
[1:11:27] apartments.
[1:11:30] Obstacles, small lot sizes, and there's HOA oversight and bylaws that
[1:11:34] could prevent the type of use.
[1:11:40] So on this slide, we have two zoning districts.
[1:11:43] They're village residential and village commercial.
[1:11:46] You'll see these zoning districts in a few different spots
[1:11:50] in Solbury, so it encompasses Lumberville,
[1:11:53] Centerbridge, and Solbury Village.
[1:11:57] Each zoning district allows for mixed use, residential and
[1:12:01] commercial.
[1:12:04] Some potential opportunities, small additions for in-law suites,
[1:12:09] garage apartments, and looking at some broader mixed-use
[1:12:12] opportunities.
[1:12:14] For instance, some of the other commercial zoning districts allow
[1:12:18] for a use such as a
[1:12:21] dwelling unit in combination with a business, which isn't currently allowed
[1:12:25] in the village commercial zoning district.
[1:12:30] Obstacles, small lot sizes, non-conforming lots,
[1:12:35] natural resource restrictions, and then we also have a historic district buffer
[1:12:38] zone, which
[1:12:40] would require basically anyone to go to the zoning hearing board to build in that
[1:12:44] area.
[1:12:50] So these next two districts are
[1:12:54] Carversville, specifically. So Carversville has a village
[1:12:58] commercial and a village residential zoning
[1:13:00] district.Right
[1:13:04] now, these
[1:13:06] zoning districts allow for
[1:13:09] residential and commercial uses.
[1:13:12] Village residential is obviously residential uses, but Village Commercial
[1:13:16] Carversville allows for both because a lot of the houses that are in
[1:13:20] that zoning district, obviously residential, there's a few commercial properties
[1:13:24] there.
[1:13:27] Some opportunities,
[1:13:30] small additions for in-law suites, garage
[1:13:33] apartments for existing garages.
[1:13:38] Some obstacles, smaller lot sizes.
[1:13:41] You have a lot of non-conforming lots.
[1:13:43] The lots are
[1:13:44] very narrow there.
[1:13:46] So there may be some real restrictions on doing any kind of
[1:13:50] additions or building anything new.
[1:13:54] Natural resource restrictions.
[1:13:58] A lot of Carversville is in a floodplain and a flood way, so
[1:14:01] that does have an impact on what kind of development can be
[1:14:05] done.
[1:14:07] There's also a historic district buffer zone around Carversville, which
[1:14:12] some of these properties do lie in, so that would
[1:14:15] potentially impact development.
[1:14:20] And then, there's also HARB restrictions.
[1:14:23] So if somebody wants to build something new or somebody wants to
[1:14:27] change any kind of exterior architectural
[1:14:30] details, they'll have to go to the HARB board and get the approval
[1:14:34] first.
[1:14:49] So this zoning district here is the
[1:14:52] Oquinton Village Commercial. It's a VC-1, and as you can see
[1:14:56] on the screen here, this is also VC-1.
[1:14:59] It just didn't color orange when this was
[1:15:03] taken.
[1:15:05] So this also allows for
[1:15:08] mixed uses.
[1:15:11] Some opportunities again, small additions,
[1:15:16] garage apartments, looking at if
[1:15:19] there's potential for mixed-use allowances and adaptive
[1:15:23] reuse.
[1:15:25] Obstacles. Peter?
[1:15:30] I don't need my phone. Just a quick question.
[1:15:34] The emphasis seems to be on development, but in this area, for
[1:15:38] example,
[1:15:39] would it be feasible to do multiple lots in
[1:15:43] a mixed-use redevelopment
[1:15:47] that is consistent with the overall plan for the border as far
[1:15:51] as making things more accessible and
[1:15:55] concentrated, and still providing housing as an
[1:15:59] element that may be more attainable than a single-family home?
[1:16:02] Yes. I think this zoning district in particular would work
[1:16:06] best for that type of redevelopment.
[1:16:12] Especially with what we already have in this zoning district.
[1:16:16] We have the New Hope Winery there, then you have some houses, you have
[1:16:19] antique dealers, and if there's a way to
[1:16:23] redevelop those areas and make it residential, have some
[1:16:27] different mixed uses, I think that'd be at work.
[1:16:31] Somebody else have their hand up? No.
[1:16:34] All right.
[1:16:35] Obstacles,
[1:16:38] zoning requirements,
[1:16:40] non-conforming lots,
[1:16:42] limited mixed-use allowances.
[1:16:45] This area's also in a Carbonate Geology
[1:16:49] overlay district, so that
[1:16:52] is something that limits impervious surface to
[1:16:55] 10%.
[1:16:57] It also requires someone to do a carbonate study to see if
[1:17:01] there's any carbonate features
[1:17:04] in the surrounding area that could prohibit any kind of
[1:17:07] additions or any buildings.
[1:17:20] So this is Rural Commercial. Again, this is another zoning district where
[1:17:24] things are
[1:17:26] pretty built out. This is the Peddler's Village area.
[1:17:32] Most of the
[1:17:33] properties in this area are Peddler's Village, but there's a
[1:17:37] few properties along 202 that are not, but they all
[1:17:41] encompass the Rural Commercial zoning district.
[1:17:44] Currently, there's no ability to
[1:17:48] have any type of residential or mixed use in the
[1:17:52] zoning district. So thought would be if there's any kind of,
[1:17:57] for instance,
[1:17:58] there's a fish store that's there now, potentially having
[1:18:02] first-floor commercial, second-floor apartment
[1:18:06] above that. Some kind of ability to have that mixed
[1:18:09] use. And then obstacles, obviously, there's not many lots that we
[1:18:13] can do much with in a zoning district.
[1:18:16] Can I ask a question?
[1:18:18] Yeah.
[1:18:18] In Peddler's Village, maybe it's in Buckingham, there are apartments
[1:18:21] above some of the stores. Is it different in
[1:18:25] Buckingham?
[1:18:26] Yes. It's different in Buckingham. Yep.
[1:18:29] All
[1:18:33] right.
[1:18:38] And this is the last slide. So this is the TNC
[1:18:42] zoning district. The TNC zoning district is traditional
[1:18:46] neighborhood commercial, and that's our largest zoning district.
[1:18:50] So this encompasses Logan Square,
[1:18:53] other areas along Route 202,
[1:18:57] bordering New Hope Borough.
[1:18:59] Presently, it does allow for some mixed uses.
[1:19:04] Opportunities are looking at some adaptive reuse opportunities and
[1:19:07] redevelopment.Consider looking at
[1:19:11] different multifamily dwelling options, because
[1:19:15] right now it does allow for some at this point, but
[1:19:18] it's specific to things like a
[1:19:22] long-term residential healthcare facility.
[1:19:24] But that is considered residential in our ordinance.
[1:19:28] So potentially looking at what else we could add into this that already exists.
[1:19:33] And then, obstacles is, there's few lots that could be developed
[1:19:37] and there's also the public water and sewer, which
[1:19:42] could
[1:19:44] put a hamper on things as well.
[1:19:47] Excuse me. There is or is not public water?
[1:19:49] There is public water and sewer. Yeah.
[1:19:54] That's it.
[1:19:57] Okay.
[1:19:58] Then also make things easier to-
[1:20:00] No, it wouldn't.
[1:20:03] No,
[1:20:04] because it could be a problem for the capacity
[1:20:08] that that specific water authority could have.
[1:20:12] Doesn't necessarily mean you can't do it, but eventually we've got
[1:20:16] to think about these things.
[1:20:18] Yeah. Let's think the same way that focus in some of these
[1:20:22] where critical sewer capacity seems like that's a limiting
[1:20:25] factor in rural areas is
[1:20:28] why the lot sizes are what they are-
[1:20:31] Mm
[1:20:31] ... because well and septic.
[1:20:33] Yeah, that's a good point.
[1:20:36] We've got to think about aquifers and where our
[1:20:39] on-lot septic could percolate.
[1:20:42] Those things would definitely come into play.
[1:20:45] So,
[1:20:47] just in the interest of time, what I would like to do
[1:20:51] is
[1:20:52] do some questions before we get into the-- thanks, Zach,
[1:20:56] into this housing exercise that we're going to spend a few
[1:21:00] moments on. So,
[1:21:03] real quick,
[1:21:06] John,
[1:21:09] when you think through
[1:21:11] all the facts that you reviewed and presented tonight,
[1:21:18] what filters down that is the lowest hanging
[1:21:22] fruit?
[1:21:23] I know Zach's going to be asked the same question about what he
[1:21:27] talked to us about on zoning opportunities and limitations.
[1:21:31] But,
[1:21:35] do you interpret
[1:21:38] what you've found
[1:21:40] to inform this discussion in a very
[1:21:44] simple way where you'd say, "My biggest takeaway
[1:21:49] and my
[1:21:50] wisdom to the group is X." Is there
[1:21:54] something that jumps out at you in particular
[1:21:58] as you went through all of your analysis?
[1:22:04] Actually just, and Zach touched on this, just knowing
[1:22:08] that the RA and RB zones
[1:22:09] comprise a large portion of the
[1:22:13] township.
[1:22:15] Looking at different types of ADUs, and I know some are
[1:22:19] permitted on those properties,
[1:22:22] as, I think, detached units.
[1:22:25] But-
[1:22:25] Sorry, I didn't hear you say.
[1:22:28] Say what you said. Did you say ADUs?
[1:22:30] Yeah.
[1:22:31] Okay.
[1:22:32] And I know ADUs are permitted in
[1:22:36] those districts, but on certain acreage sizes.
[1:22:39] Okay. So like-
[1:22:39] Incorporating different types-
[1:22:40] Sorry, you need seven acres in RB. That was like,
[1:22:44] whoa, that's a lot of acres for one ADU.
[1:22:48] Yeah, but there's different types of ADUs-
[1:22:51] Okay
[1:22:51] ... that have been brought up. The grant, the in-law suites.
[1:22:55] Okay.
[1:22:56] Apartments over garages.
[1:22:58] Very good. And Zach, from your perspective,
[1:23:04] I was looking around the room as you were presenting, and I was sort of
[1:23:07] wanting to say, "Anybody who likes that district, raise your hand."
[1:23:12] And I didn't see very many people smiling when you were doing your
[1:23:15] presentation, so I thought like they were saying, "No, Zach, I
[1:23:19] don't like that. Forget about.
[1:23:22] Next district."
[1:23:23] Mm-hmm.
[1:23:24] So-
[1:23:25] I like them all.
[1:23:26] Yeah. Okay. There you go.
[1:23:29] It's a thumb problem.
[1:23:30] Yeah. So Zach, of all the districts that you looked at, and
[1:23:34] those for which you have received requests to do something,
[1:23:39] does any one or two districts stick out as being,
[1:23:42] whether it's Aquatong to the, you said maybe adaptive
[1:23:46] reuse, or any other district that you would say,
[1:23:50] "It would be pretty plausible
[1:23:55] to make a little bit of a change to
[1:23:58] get a couple of units in this
[1:24:02] district or that." Anything really stand out to you?
[1:24:05] Yeah, and I think I kind of harped on this a lot in my presentation, but
[1:24:09] I think RA, RB,
[1:24:12] looking at potentially in-law suites.
[1:24:16] Do get a lot of calls about that, and if we can do it in a way
[1:24:19] that
[1:24:21] is not super restrictive, but also
[1:24:25] done in a way that's going to protect
[1:24:27] neighbors, so someone, once that family member
[1:24:31] passes, maybe having some kind of ordinance restriction in
[1:24:35] there,
[1:24:36] that prevents it from being rented out as a
[1:24:40] for-profit apartment or something like that.
[1:24:44] So I'd say RA, RB, and then potentially the
[1:24:48] Aquatong Village commercial for adaptive reuse.
[1:24:51] Okay. So, I'm going to invoke moderator
[1:24:55] privilege because I want to keep us on time, and we only have 30
[1:24:59] minutes left. I wanted to ask Katie.
[1:25:02] Kate, can you lead us through the housing exercise?
[1:25:06] Because what we wanted to
[1:25:09] have you
[1:25:11] do
[1:25:12] is have the broader question to the audience
[1:25:15] about-appropriateness of attainable housing.
[1:25:19] So Chris, do we have
[1:25:22] copies of that sheet?
[1:25:24] Tom, may I ask the basic question?
[1:25:26] Oh, sure, Kevin. You go.
[1:25:27] We've heard from
[1:25:32] some of the people, but I think it's important to ask the very
[1:25:36] basic question and allow you to expand on this.
[1:25:41] Do you think it is important to provide attainable housing in Solbury?
[1:25:45] Flat out. I'd love to hear as much.
[1:25:48] So the gentleman had two thumbs up.
[1:25:50] Can we give you the mic so you go first?
[1:25:54] Sure.
[1:25:54] Yeah. Go ahead.
[1:25:57] Thank you.
[1:25:58] So again, I've been here just short of 30 years also.
[1:26:02] When we came in, you could get a house for,
[1:26:05] it was a $300,000 and afford. My son was
[1:26:09] a 2020 graduate of high school here.
[1:26:12] Out of his friends,
[1:26:15] they're smart kids. They're getting work, and how
[1:26:19] many of those can afford to live here? My son's 400 miles north.
[1:26:22] That's out of choice, but that's another question.
[1:26:24] But
[1:26:26] a lot of people not
[1:26:29] affording to be here. I
[1:26:33] didn't make the first one, but I watched the first
[1:26:36] presentation. I thought you guys did a very good job in bringing a lot of
[1:26:40] people in. It was a lot of data, I think, thrown at people.
[1:26:44] I'm kind of in the business, so I understand it, but
[1:26:47] a lot of people have to
[1:26:51] get caught up on it. So I think affordable housing
[1:26:55] is important. We should have it 100%.
[1:26:59] I've also been doing it a long time, and I know it's the scale.
[1:27:03] And scale scares me, it scares everybody.
[1:27:07] I 100% agree with that. But I think with all the people that have
[1:27:11] been putting the time and thought into it, we could pick,
[1:27:14] we as a whole community, pick places, two units
[1:27:18] here, three units there.
[1:27:21] Maybe in these districts where instead of going to four and seven acres,
[1:27:26] because of restrictions and people worry about the aquifer, which I'm on well and
[1:27:30] septic, that why
[1:27:35] can't it be 50% more instead of four times for a lot
[1:27:38] size? Things like that. And I think a little bit what we're thinking
[1:27:42] about, my thought, which would be least disruptive, because
[1:27:46] again, we've been here for three bond referendums, and happy that we
[1:27:50] have this open space.
[1:27:52] So to be less impact on people,
[1:27:55] my thought was always the commercial area.
[1:27:57] Why can't we have an overlay district in Logan that's probably more of
[1:28:01] an investigation? What's the water and sewer capacity?
[1:28:05] There can be all manner of
[1:28:09] the medium- to small-sized developments worked in there that I
[1:28:13] don't think anybody would notice with a lot of good planners and designers in a
[1:28:17] lot of those properties.
[1:28:19] That could be worked in there. So those are my quick thoughts.
[1:28:23] Very good. And sir.
[1:28:25] Thank you.
[1:28:28] I wear a couple of hats, so I'll go through them and then say that I just only
[1:28:32] speak for myself. But I am a trustee and chair of the Buildings and Grounds
[1:28:36] Committee at Solbury School, and as such,
[1:28:40] part of a group that is maybe one of the largest attainable housing providers
[1:28:44] in the township. We have about two dozen units for our teachers
[1:28:49] and members of our community that we need on campus because we are a boarding
[1:28:53] and day school, and our community
[1:28:55] is enriched by having
[1:28:58] our faculty and some staff that are able to live on campus.
[1:29:02] It's a necessity for us because while we try to
[1:29:05] pay competitive wages,
[1:29:08] our faculty and teachers
[1:29:10] are part of a group that it's very difficult to
[1:29:14] afford housing here. And one problem we have is, while we're able to provide as
[1:29:17] much housing as we can,
[1:29:21] and we want teachers to stay for a long time, being a teacher at a boarding school,
[1:29:25] living on campus is very difficult.
[1:29:26] And hopefully they're not burning out,
[1:29:30] but their life changes and maybe they don't want to be on
[1:29:34] campus anymore. They still want to be part of our community.
[1:29:37] Where can they go? It could become very difficult for them to
[1:29:40] remain a teacher with us if they need to move too far away.
[1:29:45] I'm also the
[1:29:47] chair of the farm committee here in the township and really appreciate the work
[1:29:50] that, Tom, you specifically and the rest of the administration staff has done to
[1:29:54] work with us and the supervisors on trying to come to some conclusion
[1:29:59] or positive outcome on farm worker housing.
[1:30:02] Because as an advocate for that, we understand that farm work
[1:30:05] is essential. Our farms really
[1:30:09] struggle to have the labor that they need, whether that's local labor
[1:30:14] or visa,
[1:30:15] where housing would be required for them.
[1:30:18] So for the sustainability and thriving of our farms, we need to have some
[1:30:24] accommodation made for farm worker housing.
[1:30:27] And then just as a resident who's lucky enough to live on preserved
[1:30:30] land,
[1:30:33] I just think that there are so many
[1:30:35] opportunities that would not even be noticed as
[1:30:39] change in the character of the community.
[1:30:41] If we're talking about
[1:30:44] modest accommodations for extra units
[1:30:48] on properties, these garage apartments or these in-law suites.
[1:30:53] I am not interested in, and I don't think anybody here is, in
[1:30:57] increasing subdivision of our open spaces that are not
[1:31:01] preserved, right? So much of our township wouldn't even be available to that.
[1:31:05] But we're not talking about
[1:31:07] the types of subdivision that we saw over the last 30 years.
[1:31:11] A very different type of housing, and a variety of housing,
[1:31:15] and probably a smaller scale of housing.
[1:31:17] And it would be tucked away neatly that no one would
[1:31:21] Notice. I think you just said that.
[1:31:23] So let's-
[1:31:24] We have lost the effort
[1:31:24] ... let's do this. I'm just, sorry.
[1:31:26] I'm going to just keep us on schedule, if you can hold for a minute.
[1:31:30] So Kate,
[1:31:33] as a committee, we put together a
[1:31:37] little questionnaire that is on the screen right now.
[1:31:40] Could you
[1:31:42] take us through that? Could you sort of orchestrate and
[1:31:46] ask everyone to help weigh in on that?
[1:31:50] Yeah, absolutely. So if anyone needs a copy of this worksheet, I think Chris is
[1:31:53] coming around with a few. So feel free to raise your hand for
[1:31:57] that.
[1:32:02] So basically, the big question here when we're looking at this worksheet
[1:32:06] is we're essentially asking what forms of attainable housing do you
[1:32:10] think would be most appropriate for Silvery Township?
[1:32:14] This isn't a question of whether or not
[1:32:19] you're super in favor or super opposed, but-
[1:32:22] Does everyone have a copy of that sheet to fill out?
[1:32:27] Okay. There we go.
[1:32:32] And ma'am, do you need one?
[1:32:36] Yeah, very good.
[1:32:39] Okay. So I'm sorry to interrupt, Kate. Go ahead.
[1:32:42] That's okay. So for anyone who has a pen, please feel free to
[1:32:45] fill out whether you strongly prefer, moderately prefer, or do not
[1:32:49] prefer each type of housing that is listed here.
[1:32:53] And at the bottom, you'll see there's a box for other.
[1:32:55] So if you have any great out-of-the-box ideas that we haven't thought
[1:32:59] of, we'd be super interested in learning that from you all.
[1:33:02] And at the end of this session, we're going to be collecting these
[1:33:06] worksheets to kind of get an idea of what the
[1:33:10] opinions are of this group and maybe some new ideas that we haven't been able
[1:33:14] to think of ourselves yet so far.
[1:33:17] But so here, of the ones on this worksheet,
[1:33:21] the types that we have are above-ground apartments
[1:33:25] that are... Sorry. Apartments above ground floor,
[1:33:29] non-residential use. So that's essentially the mixed use that Zach was talking
[1:33:33] about earlier, where bottom floor is commercial, top floor is residential.
[1:33:37] We have barn conversions,
[1:33:41] barns that are converted to housing units, such as the
[1:33:45] one I live on on Upper York Road.
[1:33:48] We have farm worker housing. We have garage apartments.
[1:33:52] We have the in-law suites. We have, say, a
[1:33:56] second dwelling unit on a lot, that is an ADU,
[1:33:59] and then tiny homes as well.
[1:34:04] Yeah?
[1:34:04] Can you put some definition around angle
[1:34:08] size?
[1:34:09] So there's a minimum square footage, right Zach,
[1:34:13] per building code?
[1:34:15] So, and Josh, you had made me look into this after our discussion,
[1:34:19] but
[1:34:21] right now in our zoning ordinance, there is a restriction
[1:34:24] on minimum floor area, net floor area, and it's
[1:34:28] 500 square feet. So it's something we would have to look at
[1:34:32] potentially amending depending on what the tiny home looks like.
[1:34:36] As a
[1:34:38] word, should you think about a tiny home, is 500 square feet, 800 square feet,
[1:34:41] what is
[1:34:45] less than 500? What is it should be?
[1:34:46] It could potentially be below
[1:34:49] 500 square feet. I've seen some of them.
[1:34:55] Yeah. They're-
[1:34:55] The idea.
[1:34:57] That
[1:35:01] would be
[1:35:02] Yeah.
[1:35:03] People have tons of big homes. They're at home. Yeah.
[1:35:06] But I think they're definitions that-
[1:35:08] Yeah. And tiny homes can take various forms.
[1:35:12] You have some that are built onto trailer frames, and then you have some that are
[1:35:16] actually built onto foundations.
[1:35:18] They're just
[1:35:20] very low square footage as compared to your traditional home.
[1:35:23] So they can take various forms and be
[1:35:26] constructed in several different ways.
[1:35:30] So I think that might be a good idea for looking forward, actually,
[1:35:34] John and Zach, is to figure out what it is that we mean exactly by tiny homes
[1:35:38] in Silvery Township.
[1:35:40] And I might add, as a committee to get ready for
[1:35:43] tonight. Sir, in the middle, I love what you
[1:35:47] said about least disruptive. Tell us your name.
[1:35:52] Mitch.
[1:35:52] Mitch. So Mitch,
[1:35:55] we
[1:35:56] drank the Kool-Aid after the first attainable housing, and
[1:36:00] we decided the images on here, in our
[1:36:04] opinion, were least disruptive, but we didn't call it
[1:36:08] that. So I love what you said, because in no way, shape, or form
[1:36:12] did we say, "Put in Section 8, seven-story, high-rise
[1:36:16] buildings." Because we know you would kick us out of the room.
[1:36:19] So we got the message from the last time and the comments that were made.
[1:36:24] But to Kate's point, where we left the blank on the bottom,
[1:36:28] is there any other housing type under the least disruptive category
[1:36:33] except for appliance box at the end of the driveway?
[1:36:37] Is there any other
[1:36:39] housing type that you think is not
[1:36:43] reflected that we should think about, Mitch?
[1:36:46] There's two things. One's
[1:36:49] senior housing was brought up, and if there is a way
[1:36:53] in a commercial zone where there is
[1:36:56] public works who are available.
[1:36:59] And it could be a small scale. Habitat and the other group that
[1:37:03] were here presented, I thought, nice images of
[1:37:08] not 100, not 50, not even probably 20-unit buildings,
[1:37:11] but smaller buildings that could be mixed in as an overlay,
[1:37:15] so some type of multifamily to create a
[1:37:19] neighborhood. I think if you threw out, and people would be
[1:37:23] scared off if you showed images of small lots with
[1:37:27] mixed in retail and commercialAs a plan, and people
[1:37:31] get scared and you say, "Oh, those are our villages we have." That's actually
[1:37:35] what draws people to Solbury is besides the rural, the
[1:37:39] villages. So I think it's in the design, and I think you could get
[1:37:43] a small multifamily
[1:37:46] that would work for senior or non-senior.
[1:37:49] And you had your hand up. Which type do you think we should be thinking about?
[1:37:56] When you talked about boarding homes.
[1:37:58] Sure.
[1:37:59] Oh, thank you. Yeah. Only because, when I look at all the
[1:38:02] images on here, the one I think that people would rail against the most is the
[1:38:06] farm worker housing appearance. Not the idea of it,
[1:38:10] but the image that's on here.
[1:38:13] Sure.
[1:38:13] And I wonder about how the township
[1:38:17] might be able to support that since there
[1:38:21] seems to be some agreement that that's really needed.
[1:38:25] And how that could be
[1:38:28] integrated in a different way than
[1:38:31] for it to stand out like that and be so visually different.
[1:38:35] Sure.
[1:38:36] Because I think there's already a stigma against
[1:38:40] the building typology, and I don't want to see someone living
[1:38:44] there having a stigma associated with them because they
[1:38:48] live in a housing typology. It looks so different than all the others that we would
[1:38:51] permit.
[1:38:52] Yeah.
[1:38:52] You know what I mean?
[1:38:53] Yeah. So it's something for us to think about.
[1:38:56] I have to say, I'm guilty about something.
[1:38:59] So after World War II,
[1:39:02] boarding homes started to be a term of art used in zoning
[1:39:06] ordinances.
[1:39:06] Mm-hmm.
[1:39:07] And if you trace the lineage from the
[1:39:10] 1928 zoning ordinance in New York City, and then you
[1:39:14] come to Philadelphia, and you get on that Route 30, and you start
[1:39:18] in Lower Merion, and then you go to Radnor and Tredyffrin,
[1:39:22] Easttown,
[1:39:24] East Whiteland, Willistown, West Whiteland,
[1:39:28] Easttown. They all had boarding homes in their
[1:39:31] ordinances from about 1950 to about
[1:39:34] 1960, '65.
[1:39:38] Because a lot of the GIs that got out of World War II, who
[1:39:41] were part-time
[1:39:46] work employment here, they needed a place to stay.
[1:39:50] And some of the short communities have these little, like Wildwood, New
[1:39:54] Jersey,
[1:39:55] in the central portion of it. They have these sort
[1:39:59] of
[1:40:00] post-World War II boarding home zoning opportunities that
[1:40:04] they converted into guesthouses and now Airbnb.
[1:40:08] Like today's Airbnbs.
[1:40:10] Almost like that. Yeah. But what we did is we cleansed that
[1:40:14] in the '70s, '80s, '90s. We always got rid of all the boarding houses
[1:40:18] because we said, "Low rent people, we don't want to create the
[1:40:22] ghetto." And so we scrubbed it.
[1:40:26] I would say 100 ordinances were scrubbed to no longer allow
[1:40:30] that. So it's something that we hadn't talked about, but we can put our
[1:40:34] thinking caps on. Okay. Just-
[1:40:36] Can I just ask one question?
[1:40:37] Sure. Sure.
[1:40:38] The typology. So I know the township is also struggling with the amount
[1:40:42] of second homes that people buy that either they are permanent
[1:40:46] residences or just claim to be that by in the area, especially after COVID
[1:40:51] when people were really looking for less expensive housing further from the city.
[1:40:55] And we also have a ton of Airbnbs
[1:40:58] that are temporary dwelling for the
[1:41:02] people who are
[1:41:04] seasonal.
[1:41:06] And I wonder about,
[1:41:09] is there a way to incentivize some of the homeowners that want to have
[1:41:13] that extra income to change the levels at
[1:41:17] which they charge in order to create attainable housing
[1:41:21] spaces that they're already renting out?
[1:41:23] Or allow for rentals to have...
[1:41:25] Right.
[1:41:26] Or allow more rentals, right? More houses to be
[1:41:30] rented.
[1:41:31] Yeah.
[1:41:31] It'll be difficult to do that.
[1:41:35] So
[1:41:36] good ideas.
[1:41:37] You can talk about one.
[1:41:38] Oh, sorry, Peter.
[1:41:40] Yes. I like Mitch's comments, but I don't like the concept of
[1:41:44] disruptive as an aspect. We're not act-- this isn't
[1:41:48] negative. This is a positive planning process.
[1:41:51] I like putting it in the context of what kind of housing is best
[1:41:54] aligning and compatible with the Solbury Township vision and the
[1:41:58] comprehensive plan, which we're about to finish a major update that's been
[1:42:02] on the works for two and a half years.
[1:42:04] So it's aligning and compatible, and that's really the community vision
[1:42:08] that's had tremendous community input, not just in this plan,
[1:42:12] but carryover from 30 plus years of planning.
[1:42:15] So I'd like to keep it in the positive.
[1:42:20] The other aspect in the process of any kind of
[1:42:24] development, redevelopment, the township has tremendous and
[1:42:27] detailed
[1:42:29] ordinance provisions that put guardrails on how things look.
[1:42:33] Is it compatible with the setting, the community, the opportunity for community
[1:42:37] input on each individual approach?
[1:42:41] The last thing I want to mention is
[1:42:44] this idea of sprinkling a few places here and there doesn't do
[1:42:48] anything to really address
[1:42:50] what the problem we have.
[1:42:52] One last comment is there's a lot of emphasis on what the residents are
[1:42:56] doing in terms of where they work and where they're going.
[1:43:00] What about all those people who come into the township every day from far
[1:43:04] away to do the service work, the
[1:43:07] restaurants, the retail?
[1:43:11] Should we be considering in our long-term planning
[1:43:15] and priorities how maybe we can provide
[1:43:19] for more opportunities for them to live locally,
[1:43:23] including coordinating with our adjacent municipalities?
[1:43:27] Okay.You didn't
[1:43:31] know it, but you helped us get to the point on our
[1:43:34] agenda of comments and suggestions.
[1:43:37] So former Philadelphia Eagles coach Andy Reid, during the press
[1:43:41] conference after the game, would say, "Time's yours." So
[1:43:45] for anyone who hasn't had a chance to speak tonight,
[1:43:50] in particular,
[1:43:52] we want to know what your comments and suggestions might be,
[1:43:56] something that we haven't said or
[1:44:00] some idea that you have that you liked what we said, or you didn't like
[1:44:04] what we said. So in the time that we have left,
[1:44:08] 10-ish minutes,
[1:44:10] 12-ish minutes,
[1:44:13] could anyone make a suggestion on
[1:44:17] what we should be thinking about as a result of these two
[1:44:21] housing forms and
[1:44:24] maybe something that we haven't looked at in enough
[1:44:28] detail or that we should be more
[1:44:33] concentrated on? So, yes.
[1:44:36] One thing we haven't talked about, at least tonight, and I didn't get
[1:44:40] all through the video, but I don't think it was talked about,
[1:44:43] and take it however you want.
[1:44:45] John had mentioned the average market value of the house is about a million
[1:44:49] dollars.
[1:44:52] School taxes paid on that is 11,500.
[1:44:56] Township taxes is between 1,100 to
[1:45:00] $1,400. Students per home in that is
[1:45:03] 0.45.
[1:45:05] School cost per home is about $13,500.
[1:45:09] Township cost per home is 2,237. Net
[1:45:12] fiscal impact is a negative 3,000, but we make up for it in budget through
[1:45:16] other things. With affordable home, if you estimate at
[1:45:20] 350,000 affordable home price, the school taxes
[1:45:24] paid is 4,500. Township tax paid is
[1:45:27] $375.
[1:45:29] Students per home, because they're estimating it that people
[1:45:33] from 20 to 40 would move in, more of those, would be
[1:45:36] 0.55. School cost per home would be
[1:45:39] 16,500. Township cost per home would be
[1:45:43] 2,000, and a net negative fiscal impact of
[1:45:47] $13,000 for affordable housing. So it jumps
[1:45:50] from
[1:45:52] a net impact minus three to a net impact of minus 13.
[1:45:56] So you did a lot of homework to get ready for tonight.
[1:46:00] Would you be willing to share that information with us?
[1:46:03] Could you email it to Chris or just the township manager?
[1:46:07] And actually, Tom, if I could add to this just for a second.
[1:46:11] All of us have a bunch of things to say, and I know you have a schedule to
[1:46:15] keep. If you go in the township website, you go
[1:46:18] into general info, there is an
[1:46:22] email address. Couple of things. I would
[1:46:27] love your input and as detailed as you care, because
[1:46:30] I'm very much aware that there's a variety of
[1:46:34] opinions in this room. Please send them.
[1:46:38] And also, as importantly, ask your neighbors to send them.
[1:46:41] And those who are looking at this video, I would encourage you to send
[1:46:45] emails as well. Because, again, the business I'm in is trying to
[1:46:49] get community opinion, trying to understand what is the
[1:46:53] community opinion. The only way we can do that is to hear from you.
[1:46:56] So I really do want to hear that. So again,
[1:46:59] township website, general info, and there's an email address.
[1:47:03] Send it to that. Thank you.
[1:47:04] Kevin, we're going to grab my business cards and my email address will be
[1:47:08] on there. And then I can distribute to everyone as well.
[1:47:11] But for those who are looking at the video,
[1:47:14] the website, please.
[1:47:16] Helen, words of wisdom?
[1:47:19] Not words of wisdom, but question that Shannon had brought up
[1:47:23] about converting existing,
[1:47:26] I don't know if this is exactly what you meant, but converting large homes into
[1:47:29] maybe multi-unit dwellings. I was just curious if that's
[1:47:33] anything, because I saw that Zach mentioned a lot of small
[1:47:37] additions, et cetera, but
[1:47:40] what about instead of building more is reworking what we
[1:47:43] already have? Is that something that you've considered, and have we seen that work
[1:47:47] in other communities?
[1:47:50] It's a good point because in what I read from the state planning code, it says
[1:47:54] rehabilitation of existing housing.
[1:47:57] So
[1:47:58] quite honestly, we hadn't explored that.
[1:48:01] So in terms of adaptive reuse, that's a possibility, yes.
[1:48:09] For Philadelphia residents who came out
[1:48:11] here to visit with their families, they built their summer home across from their
[1:48:15] parents' house. And it was converted because it was such a large
[1:48:19] home that during the Depression, it ended up to be vacant.
[1:48:22] It was too hard to upkeep because it was so big.
[1:48:25] And it was converted into apartments, and my parents rented one of those
[1:48:28] apartments, became friends with the owners, bought the property,
[1:48:32] and here I am today, and I've been here since 1969.
[1:48:36] So to watch that happen to that typology, if we
[1:48:40] could just have an open mind about that, it could always be converted back in a
[1:48:44] single-family mansion with maid's quarters and all of that if
[1:48:48] you wanted to. But
[1:48:50] it's already there. It already exists. It has embodied energy.
[1:48:54] It has a lot of benefits.
[1:48:57] But the other piece that I really want to applaud this group for is how
[1:49:01] thoughtful you're being, and to echo what you were saying about
[1:49:05] if you do it thoughtfully, you can really do just about anything.
[1:49:10] And for those of you who don't understand the Solebury history of why this open
[1:49:13] space was preserved, that was environmentalists who were
[1:49:17] largely farmers, volunteers, and artists.
[1:49:21] And if you volunteer in any of the environmental groups in this area, a
[1:49:25] lot of those folks
[1:49:27] are renting and are volunteering their time because they care about
[1:49:31] this area and they want to preserve the area.
[1:49:34] And for those of you who understand the aquifer and the
[1:49:38] fact that we have a designation for public water, all of that water is drawn
[1:49:42] from the aquifer that private wells draw from as well.
[1:49:46] And then that public water is sent and processed
[1:49:49] Either in New Jersey or over at the processing plant in Pedlers Village, and
[1:49:53] then either processed and infiltrated there
[1:49:57] in large holding areas or sent to New Jersey and discharged in the
[1:50:01] river, never to recharge our aquifer again.
[1:50:04] So really do a little understanding of why that
[1:50:07] happened. The developments that moved out of Philadelphia are why
[1:50:11] we protected Solebury, and also the highway that was going to
[1:50:15] be planned. And so the environmentalists that created this
[1:50:20] wouldn't be able to afford to live here today .
[1:50:23] And I think just having one type of income
[1:50:26] level is a very dangerous precedent because the amount of
[1:50:30] imagination that it took to do this in the first place is just applaudable and why
[1:50:34] we're all here. So thank you.
[1:50:37] Yeah.
[1:50:38] And thank you for being thoughtful.
[1:50:39] Before Kevin closes us out, I have to
[1:50:43] confess that over the last month,
[1:50:46] I was thinking about... And we'll take another
[1:50:50] comment before we go, but bear with me a sec.
[1:50:53] I was thinking about
[1:50:55] what
[1:50:56] creative, really cool ideas we could hatch that
[1:51:01] were truly Solebury based. So I thought about
[1:51:05] Nagashima,
[1:51:07] and I thought if he were still alive, I know his daughter isn't-- I think
[1:51:11] the daughter did the tables?
[1:51:13] Yeah. So imagine that we did the
[1:51:17] attainable house in Solebury, which was the model house in the Delaware Valley,
[1:51:21] which was the Nagashima house. What would it look like?
[1:51:24] And then I thought about going to the second.
[1:51:27] Usually, when I go to the elementary schools to do a town planning program,
[1:51:31] the second graders are saints. They are very
[1:51:35] forthcoming with ideas. So we would say,
[1:51:38] "Draw the attainable housing type in
[1:51:42] Solebury." And it'd be interesting to see how many had gables.
[1:51:45] Mm-hmm.
[1:51:46] Whether they lined up the windows, and
[1:51:49] did the little sketches. But what would be really cool is that
[1:51:53] if we are successful in doing something
[1:51:57] that we would all agree to, light imprint, low impact,
[1:52:01] what would it look like? And how might it distinguish itself?
[1:52:05] I know some of the tiny homes that were built after Hurricane Katrina
[1:52:10] were designed by some very skilled architects.
[1:52:12] They're so-called Katrina Cottage, little sweetheart cottages.
[1:52:16] And that tiny home,
[1:52:20] can we bring up that slide that's on there, down on the bottom, the
[1:52:24] tiny home example that Aaron put in?
[1:52:29] Yeah. So just this sweetheart little cottage with the
[1:52:32] gable and
[1:52:34] sort of the little front porch and so forth, and my sense
[1:52:38] is like, what's not to like when you see that?
[1:52:41] Whether you saw it in Nantucket or Martha's Vineyard
[1:52:45] or Cape May, New Jersey, or somewhere along the Delaware
[1:52:49] River in Upper Black Eddy or whatever in
[1:52:52] Lumberville. So in any event,
[1:52:56] Kevin,
[1:52:58] having divine intervention to all the things that we've talked
[1:53:02] about,
[1:53:04] where do we go from here? What do you think is
[1:53:08] a next step, and what ideas do you have on
[1:53:12] closing out Housing Forum number two? One other thing.
[1:53:16] I apologize. The gentleman in the back had a comment.
[1:53:19] You go next, and then Kevin will close us out.
[1:53:21] Yeah, I just want to make one final comment.
[1:53:24] My father said you live where you can afford to live.
[1:53:27] And I'd like to live in Stone Harbor or Spring
[1:53:31] Lake or Palm Beach. I can't afford to live there.
[1:53:35] And if you can't afford to live in Solebury, you shouldn't be living here.
[1:53:39] If you're a teacher in Solebury, you can live five miles down the road in
[1:53:43] Washington's Crossing or Furlong or Warminster.
[1:53:47] You can. And-
[1:53:50] You
[1:53:54] shouldn't decide who should live here
[1:53:55] Well, you shouldn't decide who should live here.
[1:53:56] You shouldn't do that to me either.
[1:53:57] You shouldn't decide who should live here.
[1:53:57] Well, you shouldn't decide who should live here.
[1:53:57] You shouldn't do that to me either.
[1:54:03] You should do by making an application to the state to explore this and-
[1:54:07] They use the word-
[1:54:08] For us
[1:54:09] ... they use the word 'shall.' That can't be used in
[1:54:13] legal terms. In a statute or a reg, you must
[1:54:17] use the word 'must.' 'Shall' and 'may' is
[1:54:21] not a legal word. You can't use that.
[1:54:23] Okay.
[1:54:23] In a statute or reg, you cannot use those words.
[1:54:26] Now, and-
[1:54:27] And the final thing I just want to say is it's really not fair to the
[1:54:30] residents of Solebury. It really isn't.
[1:54:34] So let me just say, the humorous Garrison Keillor's noted for saying, "If we all
[1:54:37] thought alike, one of us is unnecessary." So appreciate all the
[1:54:41] comments. We're going to weigh all of them.
[1:54:43] But we heard from everyone except you.
[1:54:46] Could you share any insight that you have from tonight, please?
[1:54:51] My name is Emily. I grew up in Solebury
[1:54:55] Township. I am the fourth
[1:54:58] generation to live at my farm, and that is not
[1:55:02] because I can afford it. That is because my
[1:55:05] family did things they had to do to put me in that
[1:55:09] position. It was passed down from generation to
[1:55:13] generation.
[1:55:14] I had to purchase it so my family could
[1:55:18] stay in Solebury Township, so my parents could stay here.
[1:55:22] When I was growing up,
[1:55:26] it was affordable to live here. And I am a
[1:55:30] realtor in the area. My
[1:55:34] friends and neighbors who I grew up with can no longer afford to
[1:55:38] live here, buy here, have their kids in the schools that they went
[1:55:42] to,
[1:55:43] and they make good money. And those who are
[1:55:46] purchasing on your street or the next street over, you don't
[1:55:50] know what theirfinances
[1:55:54] are. But many of those people in
[1:55:58] my age demographic, 20 to 40, are
[1:56:02] borrowing money from their parents who got equity in their
[1:56:06] homes from buying them at $300,000, and the
[1:56:11] values have increased to $2 million.
[1:56:13] So that being said, I want my kids to be
[1:56:17] raised in a school that I grew up in.
[1:56:21] I want my sister, who is a teacher at a local school here, to be able
[1:56:25] to afford to raise her kids here.
[1:56:30] And
[1:56:31] the school is decreasing. I know my
[1:56:34] neighbor's kids have to drive to Upper Makefield for
[1:56:38] soccer because there's not enough kids on the girls' soccer team.
[1:56:41] That wasn't the case when I was growing up here.
[1:56:44] So I think this is very important in our community.
[1:56:47] So the beauty of all of you contributing your ideas
[1:56:51] tonight is for us to process this and to
[1:56:55] evaluate it.
[1:56:58] It is taped, and we can go back and look at the tape, but my request to
[1:57:02] each of you is that each of you made some very important
[1:57:06] comments, and if you have time over the next week to
[1:57:10] pretty much say, "Okay.
[1:57:12] I was there on June 4th. I made a number of comments.
[1:57:17] I'm going to coalesce these comments," and you send to Chris, "Okay,
[1:57:21] da-da, at the end of the day, here is my overall takeaways and
[1:57:25] my suggestions for the good of the order," we would really,
[1:57:29] really appreciate it, including the comments that you just made.
[1:57:33] So if you have just a little bit of time to send an email to Chris on
[1:57:37] that, that would be great.
[1:57:39] So Kevin,
[1:57:40] where do we go from here?
[1:57:42] Well, I think you
[1:57:43] answered part of it. I think we still need to get more community input.
[1:57:48] I think the people who attended this meeting, I applaud you for
[1:57:52] doing that.
[1:57:53] I would love to hear from more people.
[1:57:58] You mentioned, and we'll have to talk about
[1:58:03] the next few days,
[1:58:05] where do we go from here, but I think it has to incorporate getting more
[1:58:09] community input.
[1:58:11] And perhaps there is a third forum, and we have to figure out some
[1:58:15] way of getting a higher attendance, frankly.
[1:58:18] And also, I think we'll have to do as many creative things as
[1:58:21] possible for people to look at this video.
[1:58:24] And please, as I said,
[1:58:27] go to the Solebury Township website, go to general info, and there's an email
[1:58:30] address. Send it to that, those who are looking at the video.
[1:58:33] But please, do everything you can to get additional
[1:58:37] input because I think it's a big topic,
[1:58:42] and we need to figure out where we go from here.
[1:58:45] It's not something we can ignore.
[1:58:48] So
[1:58:50] I would encourage
[1:58:53] input, and I would encourage your friends and neighbors to also provide
[1:58:57] input, please.
[1:59:00] Yes.
[1:59:08] We
[1:59:09] should talk about that as well. Yes.
[1:59:16] So thank you, all. And if you get a chance--
[1:59:20] Oh, yeah. Let's collect the
[1:59:23] pages that you filled out. And don't be bashful on the
[1:59:27] way out. There's a lot of popcorn and goodies
[1:59:32] for your lunch snack tomorrow.
[1:59:36] Thank you.
[1:59:38] Thank you, everyone.