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Mr. Lansky
>> here.

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» Mr. Newman
>> here.

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» Chairman Kenestra
>> here.

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» Thank you.
>> Uh, thank you. Would I request everybody

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stand for the pledge of allegiance?

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» I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the

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republic for it stands. One nation under
God, indivisible with liberty and

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justice for all.

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Thank you everyone and good evening. Uh
we're going to go to the very first item

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on the agenda this evening. Uh first
item is of HRE properties. This is an

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application for a second directory sign
to the entrance of the shopping center

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where one does not currently exist in a
neighborhood shopping district at 249

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Route 202.
Is someone here to represent the

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applicant? Yes, sir. If you could please
give us your name and uh who you are.

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» James Pollinsky. I'm here from Signs,
Inc. Sign Company in Yorktown.

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» And you have authorization to represent
the client in regard to this

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application.
>> Yes, I do.

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» Okay, great. Could you briefly request
uh I'm briefly describe what you're

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requesting?
>> So, uh we are requesting a sign for the

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rear entrance of the Heritage 202
Center. Uh it's been brought to the

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attention of the new uh owner property
that a lot of uh traffic flows into that

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entrance and heads to into Heritage
Hills and doesn't make the right into

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the parking lot there. Uh I believe it
was last month or the previous month we

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were at the ARB for the front sign. Uh
we're going to be changing the front

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sign to the exact look that you see
here. Uh as well that was approved. Uh

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they're just freshen up. the old sign is
starting to rot away. So, um they the

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new uh company Regency, a lot of their
plazas, they go with the black and white

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theme. So, that's what we're looking to
do uh here as well. So, the front will

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match exactly what this sign will be. Um
it's an all aluminum construction. Uh it

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does not light up at night. Um it's
something that'll uh stand the test of

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time uh as far as not peeling or rotting
or or fading. Um, [clears throat]

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so, uh, this is obviously for the the
rear entrance of that property, which a

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lot of cars exit from and also and like
I said, it was brought to their

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attention. Um, there's a lot of people,
you know, missing that entrance and

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going and then turning around.
>> Yeah. From Route 202, you only

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[clears throat] get onto this property
going south. I guess it would, right?

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» Uh,
>> you going west?

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» Is that west? There's only one way you
can go.

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» You can't make a left from 202.
>> Right. Right. I don't

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» have to go in this this way.
>> So, okay. So, people are forced. So,

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this really is a true second entrance to
the property.

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» Right.
>> And and the only exit out as well,

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» right?
>> I know that's a oneway going in.

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» Yeah, that's a out. So, um this just
adds, you know, that the people don't

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miss that turn and and
>> Yeah, it's it's a true entrance as well.

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Yeah.
>> Right.

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» That's what I was just kind of figuring
that that it was and Everybody, in case

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you don't know what shopping center,
this is where Bobo is.

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» Yeah, it's a very it's [laughter] that's
the most popular place there. I think

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» it's a well even pizzeria and I've been
there. I go there quite often and uh

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it's a very busy shopping center.
>> Right.

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» You mentioned the black and white theme.
>> Yes.

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» The individual logos are could be color
as well or I noticed one side is all

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black and white, the other side
[clears throat] is color. It's just the

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way it laid out um that some of the
anchor tenants that demanded their

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colors or whatnot that they they were so
the the property owner didn't scrutinize

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that everybody had to be black or white
or whatnot. They allowed color and um

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font or logo var no uh yeah the logo
font variant. They didn't say that it

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had to be

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Because one of the accessories I like is
the elephants up on the top.

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» Yeah.
>> Similar to across the street. It matches

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other signs in that area.
>> Right. Why is this a variance?

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» It's a second second pole sign.
>> But I don't see that that reference in

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the in the code. Second because
we talk about from a structure. There's

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like separate structures here. Is there
not? Why is this?

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» Uh I mean we've done we've certainly had
to do these before. remember we did come

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out on uh
>> the code

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» it was my understanding it wasn't there
prior and that it was a second that we

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needed a variance
>> just wondering

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» yeah I don't know if it's
>> I don't see it in the code

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» I'm not sure it's a poll sign for each
business then theoretically if there's

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six or seven businesses
>> this code refers to structures

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» and so that building in the back is
[clears throat]

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» right
>> I but but I guess the I guess we're

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saying the directory sign refers to the
entire

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shopping centers. Therefore, that's why
I'm just curious logically.

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» That kind of makes sense because let's
say if there's four structures on a

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property, would that mean we're going to
allow force four pole signs? I think

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that would be excessive.
>> Yeah. [clears throat]

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» Yeah. But I know you make a interesting
point.

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» I just don't see it here in the
language.

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» Why I'm curious what
>> there is a section in the code that

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allows for one sign
and they've only ever had one sign. So

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to have a sign at their other um
entrance

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requires a variance to have a second
sign. I don't have the code in front of

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me, but under 170 signs under um
businesses, it says that they could just

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have one sign giving this situation.
>> Tommy, what's your feel on this? the um

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the application uh speaks to 170-126
A3.

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» Yep. And that's what I'm that's what I'm
reviewing. Um and I don't see that. But

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but I think what Denise is referring to
is B1, one freestanding identification

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sign not exceeding 100 square foot in
area may be erected at each entrance

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drive to a permitted principal office
use. But I this that not necessarily

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applying to this because it's not an
office use.

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But that said, that's where that's where
I'm seeing the freestanding sign.

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And I'm sure it makes sense to have a
freestanding sign. I'm just wondering

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there two separate streets. Um, and
people do miss that prime pub there

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because there's not great signage for
that. They do drive by it. It just seems

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like um that that's going to
I don't know.

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Finding the code.

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Is the intent of the owner to replace
the signs immediately? Is this something

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that's going to happen right away?
>> Yes.

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» Yes.
And they also own the the plaza next

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door that they're going to be looking to
update those front signs as well that

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we're going to be at the Thursday night
ARP meeting uh to do a similar looking

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sign. [clears throat]
about the one at Stown Shopping Center

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itself.
>> Correct. Yeah.

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» Maybe tying in the elephant over there.
>> So, is it you talking about the property

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across the street or the property next
to it?

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» Across the street to where the CVS is
and Okay.

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» Not the Chico, but the the rest of the
shopping center.

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» Okay. And you were before the uh ARB
with this

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» for the front sign. They looked at the
front sign and we got approval for the

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front sign which is identical to the
sign that you're looking

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» but we were told that we needed the
variance for the for the second sign.

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[clears throat]
>> Did they have any objection to the

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second sign?
>> No, they did not.

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They thought it was a necessary uh sign
since it's not illuminated. It's you

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know people looking for the center.
>> Yeah. Well, the last last sentence of

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the ARB's letter uh to us is as
discussed at our meeting, the

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architectural review board feels that
aesthetically the sign is well done,

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does not oppose does not oppose a second
sign and understands the need for it.

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» You still need us to get get the okay,
though.

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» Yeah. [laughter] Yeah,
>> you understand that, right? Yes. And

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looks like there's 12 available spots on
the sign. Do you know if every business

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in there has [clears throat] excuse me
has a space?

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» Uh I I don't know 100%. Um I know that
the two bottom spaces or or right now

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said space available at the phone number
so they could be changed out. So I I

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believe they're my
>> room. Usually what they do um I we do a

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lot of work for the company. They will
look at the total number of tenants that

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they can have whether they subdivide if
somebody moves out or whatnot,

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you know, try to get the total number on
the sign so they don't adds,

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» right?
>> Yeah. I mean, because right some land

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some landlords will use signs as a
revenue generator, right? So they'll

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ask, you know, your leases a little more
if you want your name on both sides. So

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I want to make sure we're not us up for
>> No, I don't believe so. It's not It's

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not that much of a draw this shopping
center. I could see maybe Sr's Commons,

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you know, something like that, maybe.
But

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» do it at Sr's.
>> One of one of the last items on the sign

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is an individual's name and a
>> that's the leasing. Yeah, that's for

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them to if for leasing. So that tells me
I think there's a few spaces that are

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» that will be removed if the uh all the
ten all the vacancies were filled.

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» Correct.
>> Well, they have an opportunity for that

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because they've opened up a place
already called audio something and

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that's not on there. That's a 13th sign.
>> Okay. Yes.

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» They will have an opportunity.
>> Yeah. So they would be able to remove

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and
>> what is the dimensions of the sign

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proposed 4x6?
>> Yes, you're correct. 4 foot by six foot

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» which is exactly the same as the
existing

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» yes
>> square footage stays the same as the

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front one in the front
>> and looking you know unless I may unless

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I'm not looking at the correct side
looking at the correct section of code

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» 4x5
>> it's 4x5

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» that's that's the section that the
application refers to the only thing

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looks like it could possibly apply
>> they sorry they got site plan approval

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when the shopping center was built to
have a 24 square foot sign so it stays

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with them until
>> if I may

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years no not that many years ago Vic you
may remember and Arie I don't know if

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you're on the board at time but we
granted a variance for the sign that's

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on route 202 and there were at that
point the applicant and the owner not

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this owner but the owner wanted to make
it larger so we settled on that side

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that's on
And so is that the

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» that's 4 foot by six foot would be
>> yes same

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» because it's saying saying that this is
going to be the same size

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» correct
>> okay

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» now that you say that that sounds very
that I recollect that yes

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» and so my thought process here do we
need to give a variance as to the size

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of the sign if we grant this
>> because because it exceeds the code is

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four by
>> this is what we're if we're referring to

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this code.
Um, I see a variance for 4x6 from 4x5.

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I'm a little still confused on whether
one or two is a variance, but but uh, as

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long as we're going, might as well go
>> clean it up. So, it's not an issue. They

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don't have
>> Yeah, I was unaware of that. I was told

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by the planning department that it was
approved as 24 square feet. So, yes, it

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would be two variances.
>> As a result, does this have to be

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renoticed?
I don't think so.

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» Okay.
>> And then the code also says 15 ft from

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the street line,
>> right?

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» I don't know if that's it doesn't look
15,

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» but I don't
>> Yeah, I'm pretty sure we are.

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» Okay.
>> The way the property uh like swoops

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around. I think it even goes out like
into the road a little bit or that that

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curve there.
two two signs, the one on 202 and this

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sign you're proposing, they're going to
be identical size and look.

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» Yes.
>> The little elephants on top,

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» wording, everything is going to be
identical.

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» Fabric time and put them.

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» Any further comments from the board or
questions before we we'll still have

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some time. I
>> It's a private road. I don't know if

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that matters.
I heard it chills there.

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» Yeah, it's a private road. I don't know
if that makes any difference in our code

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with our definitions when they talk
about what a street is. Um and we have

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setbacks on streets. I don't know if
that matters or doesn't.

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» It's a good point.
>> They they own those roads.

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» Heritage owns those roads.
>> Um

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» because Heritage could could block at
the sign.

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» So it' be more of a setback issue than a
>> Well, they but There's an aesthetic

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question. I mean, whether you like it or
don't like it.

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» Yeah,
>> they monitor the aesthetics within

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00:14:10,560 --> 00:14:17,839
heritage. Um, that's within their
purview.

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» Sign sign wouldn't be on their property,
but it's certainly off one of their

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private roads, right?
>> Yeah.

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» I don't I don't know that.
>> Well, it seemed like a like I said, a

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lot of the residents had reached out to
the property owner anyway to try to

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avoid the issue. Um we were here years
ago um for a same for best plumbing um

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» that the trucks would miss and then the
tractor trailers that they're getting

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wouldn't have anywhere to turn around.
So that was also you know residents

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» were also complaining at that time. Um
so there was like I said there was a an

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owner switch year it was bidd now it's
owned by Regency. Um, so they have

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received [clears throat] feedback from
Heritage Hills residents saying that

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00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:11,600
they're having the same issue that
trucks or people miss and they drive up

211
00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:14,079
» and they got to make the U-turn
>> and they got to come back down, you

212
00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:18,800
know, and you can see now like when I
just came here and 202 is closed and

213
00:15:16,639 --> 00:15:23,680
everywhere has orange signs saying this
is not a

214
00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:27,600
a throughway, you know, or pass through.
>> Yeah. So, it was a little difficult

215
00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:32,079
getting here.
So, I I I think this sign, like I said,

216
00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:36,800
and it's not it's a not an illuminated
sign.

217
00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:41,120
I I think it's just purely directional.
>> Neither sign is illuminated.

218
00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:43,040
» No, neither.
>> It's double-sided, though. Both signs

219
00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:46,160
are,
>> you know, this one says double-sided,

220
00:15:44,639 --> 00:15:50,639
but I think that's a mistake. I don't
think it needs to be doublesided here,

221
00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:55,519
especially traffic comes down um because
the there's the uh median in the middle.

222
00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:59,279
So I location.
>> Yeah. I don't think it I think this

223
00:15:57,040 --> 00:16:02,560
might be a since we copied the other
sign. I think the other sign on 202 is

224
00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:05,680
definitely
>> that makes sense to be doublesided. This

225
00:16:04,079 --> 00:16:10,160
why would doublesided.
>> I think it's I think it just we ducks.

226
00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:13,839
» Yeah. [laughter]
>> Yeah. Um but I don't I think

227
00:16:12,079 --> 00:16:16,079
single-sided is [clears throat] what it
should be.

228
00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:20,639
» That kind of makes sense to me.
>> Yeah. You got the curve, you got the

229
00:16:17,920 --> 00:16:24,480
median there. So the traffic coming down
from Heritage Hills is way on the right

230
00:16:22,399 --> 00:16:29,040
side. they wouldn't be able to of it
anyway. And so let's say that this is

231
00:16:27,040 --> 00:16:32,759
going to be a single-sided. The one on
202 would be doublesided.

232
00:16:33,279 --> 00:16:36,560
» But identical look.
>> And what did you say the size is going

233
00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:38,399
to be?
>> 4 foot by six foot.

234
00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:43,199
» Four by six.
>> Yes.

235
00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:48,800
» Did he So you know if heritage was
noticed for this application?

236
00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:55,279
» Uh yes. The heritage society was
noticed. they were based on, you know,

237
00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:59,600
the formula formula that is used. Um, it
was just the the their main offices

238
00:16:57,759 --> 00:17:03,560
right up the road there that were
noticed.

239
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,560
» Okay.

240
00:17:05,120 --> 00:17:08,720
» So, while we're thinking about this a
little bit more, how about we take it

241
00:17:07,360 --> 00:17:13,199
out to the public, see if anybody has
any comments. Uh, so this is our public

242
00:17:10,959 --> 00:17:16,319
portion of the application. Uh, anybody
here in the audience who wishes to speak

243
00:17:14,799 --> 00:17:20,000
in regard to the application, you're
welcome to do so. Also, anybody online

244
00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:23,520
can call into one of the numbers
indicated on the screen. Just plug in

245
00:17:21,919 --> 00:17:28,000
the Zoom meeting ID number. You can come
right on and ask your questions. So,

246
00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:32,000
we'll leave the public uh opinion
portion of this application open for a

247
00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:36,400
minute or two. Does anybody here wish to
speak in regard to this application? Any

248
00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:39,840
comments?
>> Okay. Thank you.

249
00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:43,520
» All right. Any further comments from the
board discussions while we're waiting to

250
00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:50,937
see if anybody checks in on the line?
>> Nobody has come in online. It seems to,

251
00:17:46,559 --> 00:17:55,280
you know, it seems to be that uh a sign
[clears throat] preferential to

252
00:17:52,880 --> 00:18:03,600
additional traffic up and down, turning
around um further further into Heritage.

253
00:17:59,039 --> 00:18:10,240
So that seems pretty reasonable to me.
And it is it is a [clears throat] you

254
00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:13,280
know unique entrance exit scheme
in that in that shopping center.

255
00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:17,600
» It is a true entrance for people coming
in a certain direction on 202. So, they

256
00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:19,679
have to use they have to go this way.
>> Yeah.

257
00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:24,559
» Okay.
>> I just wonder if the sign needs to be of

258
00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:30,080
that size. And
it it also just doesn't really the

259
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:36,559
colors, the black and white. It doesn't
match to the heritage typical signs that

260
00:18:33,360 --> 00:18:39,600
are right there in the photograph that
it just stands out to me a little bit

261
00:18:38,160 --> 00:18:44,520
like a sore thumb
>> because of the colors

262
00:18:41,120 --> 00:18:44,520
» and the size.

263
00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:54,640
We are
12 tenants. Um the panel is a 6 inch

264
00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:59,919
panel, you know, so you're going to with
your your five 5 inch letter.

265
00:18:57,200 --> 00:19:02,000
» It's going to be barely legible.
You're not going to see it.

266
00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:05,360
» You're not going to see.
>> And that was the reason probably why

267
00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:12,240
they came for the variance for the front
sign off of 202 is the anything smaller

268
00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:19,679
with that. you know, it's a decent size
plaza um that a large sign, you know, is

269
00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:23,440
necessary.
>> And I think this is just making

270
00:19:21,983 --> 00:19:26,799
[clears throat] it to, you know, be
legible.

271
00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:31,039
» No, it's not overwhelming.
>> I was hoping you were going to say that

272
00:19:29,360 --> 00:19:36,960
it was all black and white and that's
why you did one side black and white to

273
00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:39,440
show color versus black and white.
I don't know.

274
00:19:38,799 --> 00:19:43,520
Yeah. What I
>> and I and I if I may, Melissa, I think

275
00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:48,960
what your your point is in terms of
aesthetics because if you look at the

276
00:19:46,240 --> 00:19:54,400
the photograph we have by the applicant,
right to the left of that are two signs,

277
00:19:51,919 --> 00:19:58,640
you know, for the heritage heritage and
they seem to be in brown with a tan or

278
00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:04,320
beige border.
>> Is that is that is that your point?

279
00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:07,520
» That and and I just feel that maybe you
need notice that there's a shopping

280
00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:13,679
center there. I don't think every tenant
needs double marketing that their

281
00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:18,799
storefront is there. I think clearly
just delineating that it's a Heritage

282
00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:22,600
202 shopping center is enough to avoid
cars passing by.

283
00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:27,919
Then
>> are you are you saying not have any of

284
00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:31,200
the vendor names there at all on the
sign?

285
00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:36,240
» I don't think you need it. I think just
the shopping center being advertised

286
00:20:33,039 --> 00:20:41,840
with the 249 alerts people that there
are businesses there.

287
00:20:39,679 --> 00:20:46,000
» I think you know since we did say that
in one direction this is the only

288
00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:51,000
entrance into the shopping center it
only helped.

289
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:51,000
» Right.

290
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:57,760
» The current sign that is uh at the
entrance off of 202 going into the

291
00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:02,080
shopping center.
>> Yes. Are they all black and white or are

292
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:08,960
they color or com?
>> It's It's a combination, but it's mostly

293
00:21:04,559 --> 00:21:11,600
like a like an ivory and green.
>> Um, but I think there's some color on it

294
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:15,280
as well.
>> Yeah, I go past it all the time. If I go

295
00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:18,000
past it once, I probably go past it 30
times a day and doesn't, you know, I

296
00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:24,720
don't recall.
>> Yeah. Yeah, there's some color on it,

297
00:21:19,679 --> 00:21:29,600
but it's mostly ivory and um
ivory and green, dark green, and some,

298
00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:34,294
you know, some of the panels are black,
but the like I said, the we're going to

299
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:37,600
be switching that one out as well.
[clears throat]

300
00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:43,200
And I I think, you know, a classic look
from Hounds is black and white

301
00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:48,559
» because I will say it would be nice to
make the sign where all the names are

302
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:51,520
uniformed in color.
or uniform black and white.

303
00:21:50,159 --> 00:21:55,360
» Yeah,
>> we're not at all.

304
00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:59,280
[laughter]
>> Third option from Melissa. Yes.

305
00:21:59,185 --> 00:22:03,440
[clears throat]
>> Get into a constitutional question when

306
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:05,200
you start telling people what color is
their

307
00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:08,320
» Well, that's what the architectural
review board does,

308
00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:12,159
» right? It's it's not generally our
purview and it's also

309
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:14,000
» but it is theirs. It is their I mean
they spend a lot of time on color in

310
00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:18,320
that board,
>> right? and and we and they approved it.

311
00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:21,520
» Yeah,
>> they approved both, you know, they

312
00:22:20,145 --> 00:22:25,280
[laughter] both wrote it. They weren't
against it.

313
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:28,440
» I think we should take a vote.
>> I agree.

314
00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:33,919
» Okay, we don't have any comments from
the public.

315
00:22:33,245 --> 00:22:38,840
[clears throat]
>> Any further discussion amongst the board

316
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:38,840
here?

317
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:44,799
» Okay,
I'll take a motion as to the type of

318
00:22:42,799 --> 00:22:48,880
action. Thank you.
>> Second,

319
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:53,120
» Mr. Burke.
>> Hi, [clears throat]

320
00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:54,880
» Mr. Leap. Miss I'm sorry, Miss Daleo.
>> Hi,

321
00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:56,720
» Mr. Guio.
>> Hi,

322
00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,960
» Mr. Harden.
>> Hi,

323
00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,720
» Mr. Lansky.
>> I

324
00:22:59,679 --> 00:23:02,720
» Mr. Newman.
>> I,

325
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:04,559
» Chairman Canestra,
>> I.

326
00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:09,840
» Thank you.
>> Okay. Can we have a motion to whether

327
00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:16,080
we're going to
grant the applicants

328
00:23:12,559 --> 00:23:21,039
request for the sign as proposed or
revisions there too?

329
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:28,720
» I would make a motion to approve
uh a variance for second directory sign

330
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:35,240
uh in the size of 4x6
for the uh heritage 202 center.

331
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:35,240
» I'll second it.

332
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:38,960
Mr. Burke.
>> Hi.

333
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,880
» Mr. Pledo.
>> Nay.

334
00:23:39,679 --> 00:23:43,120
» Mr. Guio.
>> Hi.

335
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,200
» Mr. Harden.
>> Hi.

336
00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:47,039
» Mr. Lansky.
>> I.

337
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:49,200
» Mr. Newman.
>> I.

338
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:52,480
» Chairman Canestra.
>> I.

339
00:23:50,159 --> 00:23:55,440
» Thank you.
>> Okay. Congratulations, sir. Your

340
00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:59,840
application has been granted. Since
we're a seven member board, you need

341
00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:01,840
four positive votes. And you got it.
>> Thank you.

342
00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:05,039
» Okay. Good luck with it.
>> Feel better, Denise.

343
00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:12,240
Thank you, Jim.
>> Okay, we're going to go to the second

344
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:18,320
item on the agenda this evening. This is
of William Fernandez. This is an

345
00:24:14,799 --> 00:24:23,279
application for a 28A exemption for a
front yard variance to construct a new

346
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:29,200
dwelling in R120 Residential District at
8 Cottage Place, Granite Springs. Is

347
00:24:26,159 --> 00:24:33,120
someone here to represent the applicant?
>> Okay, thank you.

348
00:24:31,360 --> 00:24:39,039
if you could just please give us your
name and address and uh

349
00:24:37,279 --> 00:24:41,039
take your time. Yeah. Put up all your
set up.

350
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:44,957
» Yeah, it's all right. Take your time. No
problem.

351
00:24:42,937 --> 00:24:44,957
[clears throat]

352
00:25:03,279 --> 00:25:10,080
Good evening, chairman and members of
the board. My name is Dan Pyano, my wife

353
00:25:06,799 --> 00:25:13,679
Emily Pyano. Um, we are here on I guess
behalf of William Fernandez, but we are

354
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:19,840
actually in contract to purchase the
property at 8 cottage place. Um, we are

355
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:24,720
is pending uh obtaining a variance um
for the frontage here property. Um,

356
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:29,440
we've been in contract since November.
Uh, and we've worked through a multitude

357
00:25:27,679 --> 00:25:33,760
of issues related to this piece of
property. Um, and this would be just

358
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:36,960
kind of the last hurdle that we thought,
um, we need to achieve to move forward

359
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,960
with the closing.
>> Okay.

360
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:44,559
» So, uh,
>> if you could just describe your

361
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:47,919
application. It looks like you have a
long narrow driveway with limited road

362
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:53,679
frontage. Is that what we're getting to?
>> That is correct. So, um the property is

363
00:25:51,120 --> 00:26:03,120
a flag lot. It has a very long easement
um that has been there in uh

364
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:07,039
uh in plan for a long time. Uh we um
the the easement is about 780 ft. One of

365
00:26:05,279 --> 00:26:12,400
the things we've done to date is the
easement was indeed of 20 ft. Um, we've

366
00:26:10,159 --> 00:26:17,679
made an agreement with the neighbor to
increase the size of the easement to 30

367
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:22,080
feet um north south uh east west, excuse
me, and 40 feet north south. Why?

368
00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:27,120
Because that'll allow proper emergency
vehicle access. We've met with the uh

369
00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:33,360
Bureau of Fire Prevention twice um most
recently May 20th and we've obtained

370
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:39,840
their uh agreement that it does provide
a proper emergency vehicle access. Now,

371
00:26:36,159 --> 00:26:45,919
um, and the other thing we've done is,
uh, well, um, we've we've looked at all

372
00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:48,000
the options to do find a different
easement because at first we didn't

373
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:51,600
think we're going to be able to find it.
We've looked at different neighbors.

374
00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:56,080
We've spoke to multiple neighbors. Um,
this is the the best route. Um, we've

375
00:26:54,640 --> 00:27:00,960
been in contact with the neighbor,
Anthony, for outage place many times.

376
00:26:59,360 --> 00:27:08,159
Um, he's very on board for what we're
looking to do. Um so just wanted to

377
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:14,559
touch on a couple things. Um
so surrounding area uh is developed with

378
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:18,080
single family homes that are lots. Um
many of those lots do have uh frontage

379
00:27:16,863 --> 00:27:22,240
[clears throat] that does not meet the
current code. Um which tells us that you

380
00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:28,799
know it is a safe viable solution for us
to have this frontage. Um and we also

381
00:27:26,559 --> 00:27:34,559
there's no way to possibly build on this
lot without having this easement, right?

382
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:37,679
it would be a unbuildable lot. Um, and
we're looking to build this for our

383
00:27:35,919 --> 00:27:41,760
family, our future. Um, I grew up in
North Salem and I like Smers. I love

384
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:44,960
this piece of property. I'd love to
raise my family here. So, I'm hopeful

385
00:27:43,919 --> 00:27:48,000
that we'll be able to obtain the
variance to be able to to build this.

386
00:27:46,799 --> 00:27:50,000
Um,
>> is the lot about 10 acres from what I

387
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:54,399
see?
>> Yes, 10.5 acres. And we are just looking

388
00:27:51,919 --> 00:27:55,600
to have one single family home on it.
>> Okay.

389
00:27:54,960 --> 00:28:00,399
» Yes.
>> Okay. I'm sorry to interrupt.

390
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:05,440
» No, no problem at all. Um so couple
things uh we did put together principal

391
00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:11,520
points which we provided to you um along
with these uh two uh drawings um one of

392
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:16,240
which is the site plan uh which you can
see it is proposed right this we are

393
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:20,799
looking to build about a 2800 foot house
um it does meet all the other required

394
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:26,320
setbacks and zoning codes and per the
checklist the only one is the frontage

395
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:30,480
um and uh as you can see from the
emergency vehicle turning uh movement

396
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:36,320
diagram that there is proper access as
well. Um, so the proposed home would not

397
00:28:34,559 --> 00:28:39,279
be visible from so there's no real
impact to the neighborhood character.

398
00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:44,320
We're going to be building a house that
fits in with the with the character of

399
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:47,679
this neighborhood. Um, it will not be uh
it will not be visible from Cottage

400
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:51,679
Place um because it's going to be tucked
behind because the flag lot. We do feel

401
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:55,279
like um it'll create a substantially
more uh valuable ratable for the town

402
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:59,840
taking a property that has no house on
it to a property that will now have a

403
00:28:56,720 --> 00:29:03,679
home on it. Um
so as I mentioned the properties uh

404
00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:07,360
remains unbuildable uh forever if we
can't get a variance on it. It's just a

405
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:13,520
10acre piece that would be I guess a
park land or something. Uh the um the

406
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:19,679
expanded easement is only practical
solution that unlocks the property's

407
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:24,799
lawful um residential use. Um, and for
us, uh, there's no real environmental

408
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:31,520
impact. Um, you know, this is, uh, it
fits in with the entire, uh, with the

409
00:29:27,679 --> 00:29:37,159
surrounding area. Um, and, uh, leaving
the property undeveloped provides no

410
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:37,159
environmental benefit.

411
00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:42,159
So, I just those are some points.
There's a lot more in there. Sorry if

412
00:29:40,559 --> 00:29:46,080
I'm not relaying it perfectly, but in
closing, I just want to request that the

413
00:29:43,919 --> 00:29:49,200
board grant these variances because of
all the reasons that we've described in

414
00:29:47,679 --> 00:29:53,120
our documentation and what I've stated
here. Um, and allowing us the

415
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:56,720
opportunity to take the next step in the
process to building uh our forever home

416
00:29:55,440 --> 00:30:01,360
and neighborhood that we've already
fallen in love with. Um, benefits to our

417
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:05,679
family and the town's fiscal health and
the community will far outweigh the

418
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:09,200
detriment. Um, this variance unlocks the
lawful intended use of the lot and it's

419
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:13,919
been waiting for a long time to get a
house on it. Um, it transforms a vacant

420
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:20,320
land to a family home and a meaningful
contributor to the town of Summers.

421
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:23,440
» You mentioned a an arrangement that you
made. Yes.

422
00:30:21,919 --> 00:30:27,520
» Uh, the neighbor
>> was co people.

423
00:30:25,279 --> 00:30:33,200
» What kind of an arrangement is that? Um,
so I'm going to be buying 9,587

424
00:30:30,399 --> 00:30:38,720
square feet of land from him. Um, for a
deter a $30,000 price that we've agreed

425
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:42,159
upon. Um, that is we've agreed in
writing. Uh, I've not we have not

426
00:30:40,799 --> 00:30:45,279
exchanged the money yet because we're
waiting till we would obtain this

427
00:30:43,679 --> 00:30:48,720
variance and then close on the property
which we're hopeful to do very soon.

428
00:30:47,279 --> 00:30:52,080
» And of course, if we grant the variance,
you will then buy be buying the property

429
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:54,159
from Andes.
>> That's correct.

430
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:58,000
» He's the current owner, right?
>> That is correct.

431
00:30:56,320 --> 00:31:02,399
the one thing that I was not clear in
the in the material. So, you're saying

432
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:08,320
and I understand you have a an agreement
with the uh one of your one of the

433
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:14,240
neighboring lots to purchase the land,
but there's already an easement if I if

434
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:18,320
I'm correct across that land. Correct.
>> Correct.

435
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:22,240
» So, are you actually purchasing land or
you have an agreement to expand the

436
00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:24,080
easement?
>> We're we're expanding the easement.

437
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:28,240
Okay.
>> Yes. So as opposed to buying the land,

438
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:33,200
so you won't be the needed owner of
whatever that additional 15 ft is,

439
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:36,640
you'll be you'll have right to use it
through the easement.

440
00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:44,080
» Correct.
>> But you're you're more that if 100t's

441
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:48,960
required or front and they have zero
feet of frontage. [clears throat]

442
00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:50,960
» No, no. I I think that the easement
gives them, you know,

443
00:31:50,159 --> 00:31:53,919
» you count that as
>> the frontage. It was just in

444
00:31:52,399 --> 00:31:59,039
clarification frankly from my
perspective you know it seemed if we

445
00:31:56,960 --> 00:32:03,039
have an easement as a as has been
described as a flag. [clears throat]

446
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:04,159
» So presently the ement is 15 ft.
Correct.

447
00:32:03,519 --> 00:32:07,600
» 20 ft.
>> 20 ft. Yes.

448
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:11,440
» Okay. And you're you're purchasing or
the additional easement is going to be

449
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:13,360
that you're added to is is 10 feet. Then
>> it's um

450
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:16,559
» I'm just going to step around.
>> 20 plus the 10 to 30.

451
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:20,960
» Yeah.
It's 10 [clears throat] additional feet

452
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:25,799
up here.
>> It's 20 feet on the side.

453
00:32:22,799 --> 00:32:25,799
» Okay.

454
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:30,159
» So, fire truck can get up there,
ambulance or correct

455
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:33,399
» in case it's emergency.
>> That's correct.

456
00:32:39,919 --> 00:32:48,399
So the other point I had is that it's an
application for two section 28A

457
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:52,559
exemption for a front yard variance. So
are we

458
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:57,840
are you looking for an exemption to
section 28A

459
00:32:54,640 --> 00:33:02,480
of the town law or a variance? And I
don't know just be splitting hairs here

460
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:05,519
but I think for the record it's you know
we should be clear.

461
00:33:03,919 --> 00:33:09,600
» Good question.
It's a variance under New York Town law.

462
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:14,552
» Okay. So, you're seeing a variance.
Okay.

463
00:33:12,532 --> 00:33:14,552
[clears throat]

464
00:33:18,799 --> 00:33:23,279
» We're thinking about addition. Let's
take it out to the public and see if

465
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:27,440
anyone has any comments in regard to
this application. Uh sir, if you have

466
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:31,600
any questions, you could just come up or
want to make any comments, please just

467
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:34,559
come up and uh just give us your name
and address.

468
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:38,000
And if yeah, if you could just move
aside. Thank you. Yeah. So they can

469
00:33:35,919 --> 00:33:41,519
speak.
>> So I am David Vilman. This is my wife

470
00:33:40,399 --> 00:33:45,938
Sharon Vulkman. We're [clears throat]
Cottage Place. We're immediately next

471
00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:47,600
door to where the driveway would be
[clears throat] located.

472
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:52,799
» Right.
>> Um and so we certainly don't have any

473
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:59,760
kind of an issue with this as long as we
can have a minor adjustment to it. Um

474
00:33:57,279 --> 00:34:06,720
so the proposed new access roadway will
directly abut the northern aspect of the

475
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:11,919
front and side of our yard property
uh for a significant portion of that

476
00:34:08,720 --> 00:34:17,520
property line. The roadway uh will
impact our property view and lines of

477
00:34:14,399 --> 00:34:23,520
sight. Accordingly, we would request
that the applicant be required to plant

478
00:34:20,399 --> 00:34:27,919
mature evergreen or similar trees along
that roadway at the edge of our property

479
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:32,960
line in order to screen our property
from the proposed roadway and related

480
00:34:30,079 --> 00:34:38,720
traffic. [snorts] Uh we will gladly
grant the applicant uh a license to

481
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:44,960
plant the trees uh along the roadway uh
with our direction by our property line.

482
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:49,679
There are two mature natural trees on
the property line that may need to be

483
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:56,399
removed uh to put in the road as their
roots will be cut to place the road per

484
00:34:53,440 --> 00:35:00,880
the proposed plans. Um to the extent
that this screening is implemented as

485
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:07,040
part of the board's approval of the
application, we have no further

486
00:35:02,240 --> 00:35:10,320
objections to the proposed variance
>> right now. Is there any road there at

487
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:13,520
all or is it just woods?
>> It's just mowed down.

488
00:35:12,720 --> 00:35:18,480
» It's brush.
>> The neighbor rides up and down.

489
00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:21,480
» Okay. So, it's brush and [laughter]
everything.

490
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:27,200
» Okay. There's a rock wall there. All
>> it's like a

491
00:35:24,240 --> 00:35:29,200
» well loosely rock wall.
>> Very short. [clears throat] Not anything

492
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:33,040
that
>> So, if I understand this correctly,

493
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:37,119
there's only
two trees that you meant. Correct.

494
00:35:35,119 --> 00:35:39,839
They're literally right on the
>> Okay. But there's nothing else right

495
00:35:39,119 --> 00:35:43,760
now.
>> No grass.

496
00:35:41,119 --> 00:35:48,560
» It's basically the front of the house
that he's describing that they're going

497
00:35:46,079 --> 00:35:51,040
to have that property from. It's just
the front of their property is there.

498
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:56,720
That's it.
>> Could you point to that on a chart so we

499
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:58,480
see what you're talking about?
>> Their house.

500
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:00,079
» Yeah.
>> Their house is here.

501
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:02,320
» Right.
>> Okay.

502
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:05,280
» Four cottage place over here.
>> Okay. Right. Cottage place itself is

503
00:36:04,720 --> 00:36:08,400
right here.
>> Yeah.

504
00:36:07,839 --> 00:36:13,040
» Okay.
>> I'm not I'm not sure how a road though

505
00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:16,560
would interfere with your view
>> because a road sits down low. He's not

506
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:19,760
building a structure. He's building a
road.

507
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:24,079
» If you were actually at our house
parallel with the level of the property,

508
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:27,760
» it would literally be driving right past
us

509
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:29,440
» and part of it is a privacy issue in our
backyard, which currently right now is

510
00:36:29,119 --> 00:36:32,000
not.
>> Talking about the proximity of the road.

511
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:37,839
So your house is very close to that.
>> Yeah, it would literally on the property

512
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:39,599
like the end of their driveway or road
would go right up against the property

513
00:36:39,359 --> 00:36:42,240
line,
>> right? And how many feet does your house

514
00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:44,240
sit from the property line?
>> I have no idea.

515
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:49,200
» I have no idea. But
>> what's your guess?

516
00:36:46,240 --> 00:36:53,920
» Well, let's see. Shape of the of the
property is like a piece of pizza. Um,

517
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:58,480
and so the fattest parts on the street
on Cottage Place and it goes down to a

518
00:36:56,240 --> 00:37:03,119
point in the back. So I'm going to guess
maybe 40 or 50 from the edge of the

519
00:37:01,119 --> 00:37:04,400
garage to the property line. That's a
total guess,

520
00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:09,200
» right?
>> But basically, our backyard is generally

521
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:13,440
private because nobody's going back
there because there's nothing built

522
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:18,160
there. And the next house is a good
distance away. So, it's it's quiet, it's

523
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:22,560
private, there's not cars going up and
down. And so he's just saying if there's

524
00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:25,680
these bushes there then we can maintain
some

525
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:30,720
» Are you proposing or requesting
screening and trees for the entire plate

526
00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:38,480
or just the part behind your house
>> the street to where the woods start.

527
00:37:34,240 --> 00:37:41,200
» Um and so it's about 150 160 ft. We're
estimating about 30 trees would be

528
00:37:40,240 --> 00:37:45,200
required.
>> Um and we would be fine retaining them.

529
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:48,400
We would just want them to be
>> Yeah. Because this is quite a long

530
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:50,960
driveway to screen the whole thing. Is
>> it's not the whole thing. It's just

531
00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:53,520
» that one section. Just that once. Okay.
That's just question.

532
00:37:52,079 --> 00:37:57,440
» That screening would essentially be
planted on your property.

533
00:37:54,960 --> 00:38:00,640
» Correct.
>> Because there would be no room for it to

534
00:37:58,720 --> 00:38:02,480
be planted not on our property.
>> Right.

535
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:05,280
» The driveway would go right up to the
property.

536
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:08,800
» And so if I may build a driveway that
close to a property line.

537
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:14,400
» Yeah. But I I wanted to address Tom's
point because I think it's two varian.

538
00:38:11,119 --> 00:38:20,160
It's a variance from 28A which says you
can't get a permit if you are not on a

539
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:25,359
town road and it's also a variance
frontage

540
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:30,440
of course. So it's it's uh we'd be
granted two variances

541
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:30,440
requested.

542
00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:38,800
» So in terms of the screening if we now
I'm looking at one of the one of the

543
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:43,200
submitted uh drawings where it has a
rock wall that's a neat rock wall

544
00:38:41,599 --> 00:38:47,680
» loosely. I would not question
>> I heard your characterization. Yeah,

545
00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:50,960
» this is very neat. Would the screening
then be planted on your side of the rock

546
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:56,800
wall?
>> Correct. Because that would be on our

547
00:38:53,440 --> 00:39:00,800
property and we're fine with that.
I think it's more aesthetically pleasing

548
00:38:58,160 --> 00:39:05,520
than a fence. So,
which would probably be more expensive.

549
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:09,280
This would be less expensive.
>> Now, is there any particular type of

550
00:39:08,079 --> 00:39:13,599
shrubs that you would like to have
planted? Um forgot what the

551
00:39:11,839 --> 00:39:19,839
» So we we got an estimate from the
landscaper which we can provide.

552
00:39:17,599 --> 00:39:24,640
» Uh what did Paul
>> He just he didn't specify what type. He

553
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:27,839
just said planting 30 trees and he gave
a price for each component of what needs

554
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:31,839
to be done.
>> Not not I don't know what they're called

555
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:33,440
but arborites.
>> Not sure.

556
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:38,079
» Evergreen
>> some type of evergreen that basically

557
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:42,320
grows as it grows. The only reason why I
I'm asking is because the fact that

558
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:45,760
there's a lot of things get planted.
It's all deer food and the

559
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:49,119
» screen goes bye-bye.
>> That is true. We have not had that

560
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:53,119
problem.
>> What is the cost of the proposal? I'm

561
00:39:50,720 --> 00:39:55,599
curious as to what what and that you
know it doesn't mean that you can't get

562
00:39:54,320 --> 00:40:00,640
more quotes. I'm just curious.
>> Our landscaper said including the mulch

563
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:03,040
would be $10,837.50.
>> And had this had you told us to the

564
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:06,560
applicant?
>> We have the first time we're moving.

565
00:40:05,119 --> 00:40:09,200
So, we'll have to talk to the applicant
about that. Obviously, a substantial

566
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:11,839
expense. So,
>> understood.

567
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:15,012
» Can you just I'm sorry. Your house is
what number?

568
00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:17,032
» Number 10.
[clears throat]

569
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:24,880
» And does your property line go if
referring to here in the bottom one?

570
00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:28,320
» Our property line.
>> Does your property line so it goes to

571
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:30,320
the where the curve is?
>> No, before the curve.

572
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:34,320
» Before the curve.
>> Correct. Now, if I understand this

573
00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:36,720
correctly, you are asking the applicant
to pay full freight for this,

574
00:40:36,240 --> 00:40:40,400
» correct?
>> Would you be considering maybe going

575
00:40:38,240 --> 00:40:45,520
50/50?
>> No. I mean, I think this was expensive

576
00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:47,599
way of doing it other than a fence. Not
to mention a fence would be kind of

577
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:50,320
ugly.
>> I'm just asking.

578
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:52,640
» Yeah. [clears throat]
Right.

579
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:58,400
» Okay.
>> Are you finding the the house, Tom,

580
00:40:54,480 --> 00:41:02,400
» now? Yeah, now I'm getting there.
because we're already going to have the

581
00:40:59,599 --> 00:41:05,839
expense of maintaining it, you know, for
however many years.

582
00:41:03,359 --> 00:41:09,720
» So, Illoo is four,
>> correct?

583
00:41:06,319 --> 00:41:09,720
» Correct. Okay.

584
00:41:09,839 --> 00:41:17,599
There's no six, I guess.
>> I'm not sure if the

585
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:21,359
» one
Okay,

586
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:25,319
» which is also still a good distance from
where you guys would need the road.

587
00:41:26,240 --> 00:41:31,920
And is this road going to be a mcadam
road or is it going to be stones or what

588
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:34,640
is it going to be?
>> Your driveway that you're going to have

589
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:39,280
» your driveway. It's quite a driveway.
>> Yeah. So, right now we're proposing to

590
00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:41,760
have a stone driveway, you know,
properly graded everything.

591
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:46,058
» Loose stone.
>> Uh,

592
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:51,720
» yeah. Why don't you just tell us what
[clears throat]

593
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:51,720
» Sorry, it's on the back here, but um

594
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:58,640
there's
three.

595
00:41:56,880 --> 00:42:01,520
» I apologize. Can you guys turn the mic?
>> Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. They can't hear you

596
00:41:59,839 --> 00:42:04,453
in the mic. I'm sorry. You guys got to
speak into the mic. [laughter]

597
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:09,680
» Okay. So, the the
>> Yeah. The detail you're providing. Yeah.

598
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:14,000
On the on the
>> Yeah. So, there is a detail for the

599
00:42:11,119 --> 00:42:16,960
driveway um that we're proposing uh to
our property line. When we get to our

600
00:42:15,280 --> 00:42:20,880
property line, we'll we may consider
paving at the property line. It's just a

601
00:42:18,720 --> 00:42:24,880
very very long driveway. An upfront
expense at the beginning of uh of

602
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:28,800
» How long is the driveway? It's like uh I
think it's 650 ft or something like

603
00:42:28,079 --> 00:42:30,560
that.
>> Yeah, it's

604
00:42:29,599 --> 00:42:34,800
» very big.
>> Yeah, it's very long. So to pave that

605
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:38,640
long would be upfront. I mean
ultimately, you know, over time we'd

606
00:42:36,240 --> 00:42:42,720
love to do that as we mature in the
house and and do so, but up front we're

607
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:45,760
proposing to do so.
>> Okay.

608
00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:48,079
» And the rock wall, regardless of its
condition, is going to remain.

609
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:53,440
» Correct.
>> So there's there's that as a buffer.

610
00:42:50,319 --> 00:42:58,560
Okay. And the trees are beyond
>> the trees are beyond the wall.

611
00:42:55,520 --> 00:43:00,480
» Yeah. On this on the Yeah.
On the south side of the wall.

612
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:04,480
» Yeah.
>> If I could clarify, like when we say

613
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:09,040
wall, it's just like one rock. It's not
like a stack of rocks. That's a wall.

614
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:11,440
This providing anything. It's literally
like

615
00:43:09,839 --> 00:43:15,119
» more of a board. More
>> like a row of stones than it is a wall,

616
00:43:14,240 --> 00:43:20,800
say.
>> Yeah. And so I'm just looking at a map

617
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:25,760
here. So, and then I can see in your
your backyard where the sort of tree

618
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:29,200
line is. You'd want it from from cottage
place from the street that tree line

619
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:33,200
» just in the tree line
>> and and your landscaper estimated that

620
00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:36,160
would be approximately 30
>> approximately 30

621
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:40,319
» 30 trees.
>> Again, we were trying to be reasonable

622
00:43:38,319 --> 00:43:45,040
this from happening. So
>> would something else work in terms of

623
00:43:42,079 --> 00:43:51,200
screening besides treat Cynthia or some
type of bushes

624
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:53,599
» because for Cynthia grows out and
provides provides screening.

625
00:43:52,720 --> 00:43:57,280
» It does. We actually
>> frankly from my perspective it's easier

626
00:43:55,280 --> 00:44:02,480
to maintain perhaps
>> earth. It's we have three of them right

627
00:43:59,839 --> 00:44:05,119
near right the the on the corner of this
property and it's we're actually looking

628
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:08,880
to pick them out because they're
terrible. [clears throat]

629
00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:12,880
Did your landscaper suggest anything
else besides trees?

630
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:17,200
» Because I I think as as Arie had said a
lot of these especially arborite are

631
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:24,800
chewed up by trees because sometimes
you'll see arborite are the mature ones

632
00:44:21,359 --> 00:44:30,960
at from the base to maybe four or five
feet. It's bare because the deer have

633
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:35,520
bud and then above that where they grow
where the deer can't reach certainly

634
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:38,000
ones spread you know and do provide
screening

635
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:43,520
» I suppose
>> where you thought of this but

636
00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:48,960
god forbid something happens where our
volunteer fire department has to come to

637
00:44:46,160 --> 00:44:54,400
your house.
How easy is it for accessibility of a

638
00:44:52,560 --> 00:45:00,400
cottage
versus going over the proposal

639
00:44:58,720 --> 00:45:02,480
the
driveway or the rightway?

640
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:04,000
» Immaterial.
>> I'm sorry.

641
00:45:03,119 --> 00:45:06,400
» Immaterial.
>> Really?

642
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:10,960
» Yeah.
>> Now, because I'm asking if it's easier

643
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:13,119
for them to come off of the easement
and [clears throat] you put all the

644
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:15,680
shrub in there.
>> Yeah.

645
00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:18,640
» Yeah. If if if we had a fire at our
house, they'd be pulling up right in

646
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:20,480
front of our house. Okay.
>> Or in our driveway.

647
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:23,480
» Thank you.
>> Yeah.

648
00:45:24,240 --> 00:45:29,359
» Again, our goal is we don't want to
prevent them from from making this

649
00:45:28,079 --> 00:45:31,599
purchase. We're just trying to make
something that would be a little

650
00:45:30,319 --> 00:45:35,599
aesthetically
>> and I assume

651
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:38,880
you may have considered something on
that culde-sac at the end kind of

652
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:41,599
looping around.
>> Talk to the farmer.

653
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:47,200
» Stuarts is not
>> all that

654
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:51,040
six months. We've done a lot. I yeah I I
mean I assumed you had I check so that

655
00:45:49,599 --> 00:45:55,520
people know that you've looked at
>> is a very nice man but I pretty much

656
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:58,946
opened my opened my mouth and he said no
thank you. Okay, [laughter]

657
00:45:59,119 --> 00:46:04,880
» this may [clears throat] be one because
I think the screening perhaps, you know,

658
00:46:02,720 --> 00:46:10,480
certainly it's in terms of the neighbors
is something that is is a concern. Maybe

659
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:14,560
we need a site visit
because I'm, you know, I I'm familiar

660
00:46:13,040 --> 00:46:17,119
vaguely with the area.
>> I have a picture of it if that would be

661
00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:19,359
helpful.
>> Picture of what?

662
00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:25,200
» Of exactly the area.
>> Please Yeah, please provide it.

663
00:46:23,119 --> 00:46:28,160
» What are we looking at? Well, I'm
thinking in terms of if we're going

664
00:46:26,401 --> 00:46:31,359
[clears throat] to condition screening,
I think that we'd have, you know,

665
00:46:29,920 --> 00:46:33,760
certainly want to be fair to the
applicant. We want to be fair to the to

666
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:38,640
the neighbor.
>> How does

667
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:45,680
» how does screening mitigate the harm?
>> As you can see, how scant

668
00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:49,440
this is the first of two trees that come
down

669
00:46:48,017 --> 00:46:53,119
[clears throat]
>> to the road

670
00:46:51,599 --> 00:46:58,400
right here.
>> What I'm talking just had here.

671
00:46:56,800 --> 00:47:02,119
» So once you show Thank you. You can
maybe show the other me.

672
00:47:05,119 --> 00:47:08,079
» Okay. Now the road is on the other side
over here.

673
00:47:07,760 --> 00:47:09,440
» Yeah.
>> The road

674
00:47:08,720 --> 00:47:14,400
» over here.
>> Over over there on the right side. Yeah.

675
00:47:12,720 --> 00:47:15,280
» Okay.
Okay.

676
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:19,599
» Thank you.
>> You're talking about the road is going

677
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:22,240
to be on this side over here.
>> Yes.

678
00:47:20,640 --> 00:47:24,800
» Okay. And this is the stone wall they're
talking about with just rocks that are

679
00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:28,319
just a collection.
>> Yeah.

680
00:47:26,240 --> 00:47:30,800
» It's kind of silly to call it a wall
because it's not.

681
00:47:29,040 --> 00:47:33,280
» Now the other thing is these trees going
to stay or they plan on cut bring them

682
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:37,200
cutting them down
>> as soon as they as they're grading it.

683
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:42,000
They're going to end up likely cutting
the roots that tree and there's another

684
00:47:40,079 --> 00:47:45,520
one back.
>> No, the only reason why I ask is there

685
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:50,560
give shade and you plant something
there. It's not going to make

686
00:47:47,359 --> 00:47:53,560
» that tree. It's another tree anyway.
witness.

687
00:47:57,839 --> 00:48:01,200
» Thank you.
>> Please show the applicant the picture

688
00:47:59,920 --> 00:48:06,079
also just so they're seeing everything
that we're seeing.

689
00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:09,920
» My question is what
>> what are we mitigating? If you have a

690
00:48:07,839 --> 00:48:13,520
regular lot, 100 foot lot
>> and you have your driveway to one side

691
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:18,640
and you pull in, the lights are going to
go on your neighbor's house.

692
00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:22,720
» It's not
I mean, the harm is that they you're

693
00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:25,200
supposed to have frontage,
>> right?

694
00:48:23,119 --> 00:48:28,319
» Screening doesn't address frontage,
>> right? And and yeah, please please speak

695
00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:31,280
into the microphone so we can hear. We
can't hear.

696
00:48:29,119 --> 00:48:34,480
» So So we're just discussing exactly
where our driveway goes. So he he was

697
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:38,720
under the impression that our driveway
was going to sit on his property line.

698
00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:41,200
It doesn't. It sits about 8 to 10 feet
off of his property line within our

699
00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:44,400
easement.
>> It's a 12oot driveway.

700
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:47,760
» So from 30 foot easement,
>> correct?

701
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:50,880
» Okay. From the rock border.
>> Yeah. SLwall

702
00:48:49,839 --> 00:48:54,800
eight feet in.
>> Correct. That's correct.

703
00:48:52,319 --> 00:48:57,280
» So that's good. So that tree may not be
harmed.

704
00:48:55,280 --> 00:49:01,760
» You know, that tree would we would we do
not intend to touch that tree.

705
00:48:58,720 --> 00:49:06,160
» No, but I think the the uh Sorry, I'm
sorry. I I didn't write down your name,

706
00:49:03,839 --> 00:49:09,680
but the you know, the neighbor here I
think you're saying that the whatever

707
00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:13,440
construction it would be to to build the
driveway that would harm the roots and

708
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:18,520
ultimately the tree would die.
>> My landscaper was concerned about that.

709
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:18,520
» Yeah. Okay.

710
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:25,119
But to your point, if the driveway for
the house for number four happened to be

711
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:27,760
on that side of the prop,
>> you would have the same

712
00:49:26,559 --> 00:49:32,559
» same situation.
>> Situation. I don't I don't see the nexus

713
00:49:30,559 --> 00:49:35,680
between the two things. I
>> I don't have a problem with it. It's

714
00:49:33,839 --> 00:49:39,520
always great to have neighbors
>> agree, right? That's that's one of our

715
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:46,960
goals to have a good community.
>> They and they seem like a lovely family

716
00:49:43,119 --> 00:49:52,640
and and it'd be great to have uh build a
nice home here um and enjoy what many of

717
00:49:50,000 --> 00:50:00,079
us enjoy in SRS. But I don't see how any
of this changes the fact that it's a a

718
00:49:56,480 --> 00:50:04,720
really deep flag lot which you know the
people who wrote the code said not only

719
00:50:02,720 --> 00:50:10,720
the people who wrote the code the state
said we want to get away with 28A the

720
00:50:07,599 --> 00:50:16,800
state right and then our local code says
we want 100 ft and so what mitigates

721
00:50:13,520 --> 00:50:21,599
that not not some trees I mean and I'm
okay with the variance I just don't know

722
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:24,880
what the mitigation is by how we're
analyzed.

723
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:29,359
» I'd like to hear from the applicant as
to your opinion on putting in the trees,

724
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:32,960
yay or nay, or are you against it for
it?

725
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:37,680
» Uh, so I'm not overly opposed to it. Um,
I I can tell you that we did over time,

726
00:50:36,079 --> 00:50:42,240
not maybe at the initial bill because
we're going to be, you know, bringing

727
00:50:40,079 --> 00:50:45,920
trucks and such up and down. Over time,
we did plan to build put some trees in.

728
00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:49,920
I mean that may maybe not exactly the
way they had planned it, but we didn't

729
00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:54,640
plan to to do some trees over the course
of time as money allowed, right? Um so

730
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:58,079
I'm not overly opposed to it. I don't I
would say I'd rather plant them in the

731
00:50:56,319 --> 00:51:03,280
easement where I can control them and
put them where I would like to, but I'm

732
00:50:59,760 --> 00:51:08,559
not totally opposed to the idea.
And um for the neighbor, could you tell

733
00:51:05,440 --> 00:51:13,920
me if he's do you definitely want or
requesting the trees on your side of the

734
00:51:11,200 --> 00:51:19,040
rock wall or would you mind if those
trees were planted in the easement which

735
00:51:15,440 --> 00:51:21,920
is on the other side of the stones?
Have you given any thought to that?

736
00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:28,960
» They hadn't really thought about it, but
if if the same type of system was set up

737
00:51:25,920 --> 00:51:31,599
on their side, um would be
>> you'd be amenable to that. I'm just

738
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:35,359
curious is yeah I'm just trying to
figure out what everybody would like.

739
00:51:33,920 --> 00:51:40,000
I think I think it's fine if it's
something that's from the outset and not

740
00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:43,400
like a years down the road situation
because by then

741
00:51:50,079 --> 00:52:00,760
» well I would anticipate us putting it
into the uh into the off

742
00:51:57,280 --> 00:52:00,760
into the premise

743
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:06,880
» for the applicant. Do you think Oh, I'm
sorry. Applicant, do you think 30 trees

744
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:10,640
is
>> an excessive number, a reasonable

745
00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:13,040
number?
>> Uh, I

746
00:52:12,160 --> 00:52:17,200
» seems like a lot of trees.
>> It does seem like a lot of trees. I I

747
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:22,960
you know, I I would say not sure, but
I'd be again like I would like to have a

748
00:52:20,400 --> 00:52:26,800
happy neighbor and I'm not, you know,
I'm not going to I don't want this to

749
00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:29,280
not proceed because of a few trees to be
honest with you. I'm going to be

750
00:52:27,599 --> 00:52:34,400
spending a heck of a lot of money to do
this. So, you know, if I can control it

751
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:38,400
and I'll buy by the trees and how I
control it, you know, 10 grand could

752
00:52:36,079 --> 00:52:41,599
become five or six grand in the grand
scheme of what I'm going to be spending,

753
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:43,920
» right? Yeah. You can price this out
between other, you know,

754
00:52:43,119 --> 00:52:47,200
» right? Okay.
>> Yeah.

755
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:52,000
» Now, would you two
families like to step to the side and

756
00:52:49,839 --> 00:52:54,800
work this little bit out of what how
many trees you want, how much you

757
00:52:53,119 --> 00:52:56,079
willing to spend, so forth so on before
you

758
00:52:55,119 --> 00:52:58,720
» Well, I think
>> or do you need to do more shopping?

759
00:52:58,160 --> 00:53:02,000
Yeah.
>> But but we can just say so many trees

760
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:04,880
and then they can decide right
>> the cost ultimate.

761
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:08,319
» I mean ultimately the I didn't come up
with that number. The landscaper did. He

762
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:10,400
walked it out and measured it and that's
how he came.

763
00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:15,760
» Well, he's selling trees.
>> Yeah. [laughter]

764
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:18,960
» Yeah. But and and uh he's what type of
district want so forth so and the type

765
00:53:17,839 --> 00:53:23,359
of trees.
>> And and Mr. Pasano uh I'm assuming

766
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:27,200
you're going to have a landscaper.
Correct. Correct. For your property.

767
00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:32,960
» That's correct. So it may well be in
your, you know, in your to your benefit

768
00:53:30,079 --> 00:53:35,599
to have your uh landscaper do the work
because you're paying him whatever

769
00:53:34,800 --> 00:53:38,640
you're going to be paying.
>> Economy of scale will be doing a lot of

770
00:53:37,599 --> 00:53:42,319
landscaping. So
>> yeah.

771
00:53:39,040 --> 00:53:46,559
» And and and for the neighbors and I said
to you, I apologize sir, but I'm looking

772
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:51,119
at you know one of the drawings here is
your name Vulkman.

773
00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:56,160
» Okay. So Mr. Vulkman and and Mrs. Oakman
in terms of the trees where where where

774
00:53:54,240 --> 00:54:00,079
you're talking about are you talking
about from cottage place all the way in?

775
00:53:59,440 --> 00:54:01,200
» No. No.
>> Only to the tree line.

776
00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:05,040
» To the tree.
>> The tree line. Okay. I sorry. I did hear

777
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:09,280
that. I did hear that.
>> The way I'm

778
00:54:06,240 --> 00:54:13,760
» But what are you looking is and how far
in from Cottage Place is your house

779
00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:18,079
» from
>> from Cottage Place? What's the length is

780
00:54:15,599 --> 00:54:21,119
your is your Do you have it attached
garage? Detached garage.

781
00:54:19,599 --> 00:54:23,200
» Yes. You have an attached garage.
>> Excuse me.

782
00:54:21,599 --> 00:54:27,599
» You have an attached garage
>> and is and is your attached garage

783
00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:33,280
» where the roof will be.
>> Correct. And so you're you do you have

784
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:38,800
any windows from your house that look
onto that side of of your property?

785
00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:43,839
» We have windows on the back of our house
that now you can see up to house number

786
00:54:42,559 --> 00:54:48,319
four. So we can see
>> Okay.

787
00:54:45,520 --> 00:54:51,839
So is that where you would be proposed
to put would that would screening care

788
00:54:50,559 --> 00:54:56,720
would that [clears throat] benefit you
as to oppose the screening starting from

789
00:54:54,800 --> 00:55:01,760
Cottage Police?
>> No, because the like we sit on our back

790
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:03,920
deck and that's you know
>> I apologize. A little closer to the

791
00:55:03,119 --> 00:55:09,359
microphone please.
>> Sure. We sit on our back deck. If people

792
00:55:06,559 --> 00:55:14,160
are driving down the driveway, whether
it is neighbors or their guests or

793
00:55:12,720 --> 00:55:19,680
somebody coming to do work in their
house and we're in our

794
00:55:17,599 --> 00:55:24,559
backyard or sitting on our deck right
now, it's private.

795
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:28,960
We don't have cars driving up and down
along the side of our property. So what

796
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:35,440
I'm trying to do is to determine the
length along that rock wall where it be

797
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:37,119
necessary from your perspective to have
screening

798
00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:41,680
» from the street to the tree line
>> from the street to the tree line. So if

799
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:47,119
if say from the street to the front of
your house is not impacted

800
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:51,920
then it may not be nec it may be
necessary to have screening say from the

801
00:55:50,079 --> 00:55:56,480
from the side of your house toward
towards your back where your deck is and

802
00:55:54,079 --> 00:56:01,680
where the window in the wherever it is
in your house facing that proposed

803
00:55:58,720 --> 00:56:08,240
driveway. See what I'm saying? Trying to
be fair to everybody. provide screening

804
00:56:04,480 --> 00:56:13,079
where it's necessary but also limiting
it in terms of expense to the applicant.

805
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:19,839
» I'm sure we
again we're not trying to prevent

806
00:56:18,640 --> 00:56:24,839
happening.
>> You're just screening.

807
00:56:21,839 --> 00:56:24,839
» Okay.

808
00:56:26,720 --> 00:56:34,160
So
number four, cottage place, that is a

809
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:38,319
flag lot,
>> right? The the other house on the

810
00:56:36,319 --> 00:56:40,880
towards the end of the two
>> two houses

811
00:56:38,960 --> 00:56:42,640
» houses are away. Those are flag lots
actually.

812
00:56:41,359 --> 00:56:47,119
» Two and four.
>> Yeah, that's what they look like. That's

813
00:56:45,119 --> 00:56:51,359
I think the best argument.
>> They do have a long very

814
00:56:49,440 --> 00:56:56,880
» they do a very long driveway. haven't
made is that [clears throat]

815
00:56:53,920 --> 00:57:03,200
in this neighborhood there are several
flag lots unless I'm reading the map

816
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:07,920
wrong. Two and four their driveways are
adjacent to each other and they're and

817
00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:11,400
they're deep back behind.
>> That is correct.

818
00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:20,880
» Do you suggest that we should be worried
about them?

819
00:57:18,480 --> 00:57:28,319
» No, I'm I'm saying that we're supposed
to analyze this not neighbors screening

820
00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:33,680
convenience but based upon criteria and
one of the things is the detriment to

821
00:57:30,559 --> 00:57:39,440
the neighborhood and whether it is
um out of context with the neighborhood

822
00:57:37,440 --> 00:57:43,680
» right because you said in in front of uh
number four there's actually another

823
00:57:41,359 --> 00:57:46,480
house almost in its front that's correct
would look like it's front yard right

824
00:57:45,760 --> 00:57:51,760
» so that's so
>> he's behind

825
00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:54,760
» six four is behind This seems like a
pretty

826
00:57:54,799 --> 00:58:01,280
unusually big flag lot, right? It's a
super long driveway. It doesn't seem

827
00:57:59,920 --> 00:58:05,680
like it makes a lot of sense. This is
why they said we don't want flag lots

828
00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:09,760
because it's changing the urban street
face

829
00:58:07,280 --> 00:58:14,319
um and our setbacks and everything else.
But this street, it already seems in

830
00:58:12,319 --> 00:58:17,040
this portion of the street, it already
seems to be fairly normal to right

831
00:58:16,430 --> 00:58:20,000
[clears throat] there.
>> So, in other words, it doesn't affect

832
00:58:18,480 --> 00:58:25,119
the character of neighborhood. No,
>> that's that's what I'm including.

833
00:58:22,400 --> 00:58:27,839
» Plus plus this is one house on 10 acres.
I mean, it's pretty

834
00:58:26,319 --> 00:58:30,079
» well the character of the neighborhood
is you're driving cottage

835
00:58:28,875 --> 00:58:36,000
[clears throat] place and
>> there's houses in and out.

836
00:58:32,559 --> 00:58:39,240
» This one shouldn't change much and so
coming [clears throat] around.

837
00:58:43,119 --> 00:58:47,520
All right, let me expand this also. Is
there anybody else here in the audience

838
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:50,520
that wishes to speak in regard to this
application?

839
00:58:50,880 --> 00:58:55,359
Okay, Denise, we didn't have anybody
come online who wishes to speak in

840
00:58:54,000 --> 00:58:59,680
regard to the application.
>> We didn't put it out for online yet.

841
00:58:58,079 --> 00:59:02,000
» Oh, could you put it out for online?
>> Yep.

842
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:04,319
» Just in case.
>> Right. So, we continue our discussion. I

843
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:06,640
just want to make sure we're covering
the public.

844
00:59:04,799 --> 00:59:09,200
» So, if it's 100T of frontage normally,
why not 100T screening? [clears throat]

845
00:59:09,040 --> 00:59:13,040
No,
>> I don't I don't think that that I'm not

846
00:59:10,720 --> 00:59:18,240
looking that that that screening is is
necessary in terms

847
00:59:15,920 --> 00:59:23,200
in terms of the the neighbor's concerns.
Yeah.

848
00:59:19,839 --> 00:59:26,160
» We have to come down somewhere that's
arbitrary number.

849
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:27,760
» Oh, sure. Yeah.
>> I mean,

850
00:59:26,640 --> 00:59:31,040
» there's no one there.
>> I mean, yeah, like you said, it would be

851
00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:34,559
great if we had a sense of the street to
the tree line. If if we had a sense of

852
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:41,040
how long that was. I think your point
was a good one. I I can see that where

853
00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:45,839
the view is is about half of that
distance, I would say, is what would

854
00:59:43,440 --> 00:59:50,000
like some private. It looks It looks
like they're 40 50 feet from the road.

855
00:59:47,680 --> 00:59:52,079
The house is another 40 ft and then it's
60. So

856
00:59:51,760 --> 00:59:58,720
» yeah,
>> it looks like it's 140 ft or something

857
00:59:54,720 --> 01:00:02,400
like that. Um back to the tree line if
we're going to condition it

858
01:00:01,599 --> 01:00:07,359
number.
>> Well, I said we have to be interest to

859
01:00:04,720 --> 01:00:10,799
everybody. We if we do condition it
should be something that's

860
01:00:08,960 --> 01:00:14,400
» somebody going back would say okay
that's what the condition was rather

861
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:16,480
than keep it nebulous. Yeah, that's
that's my point.

862
01:00:15,119 --> 01:00:20,226
» And there's a question too of are we
going to be specific as to the foliage

863
01:00:18,559 --> 01:00:22,246
to be used and I don't know if we can do
[clears throat]

864
01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:28,880
» maybe a landscaper has something cheaper
and better and you know so we don't want

865
01:00:27,839 --> 01:00:33,040
to
>> and I'd be willing to work with our

866
01:00:30,880 --> 01:00:36,160
potentially new neighbor to decide agree
on what that

867
01:00:34,480 --> 01:00:38,480
» might be plant is
>> maybe something deer resistant you know.

868
01:00:37,760 --> 01:00:41,520
» Yes. Exactly.
>> You know so

869
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:43,520
» like Andromeda are kind of deer
resistant.

870
01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:46,559
Correct.
>> Got to

871
01:00:44,400 --> 01:00:49,839
» research it ourselves [laughter]
where we want to plant figure out what

872
01:00:48,240 --> 01:00:53,440
the team aren't going to grab.
>> And they they'll eat almost anything,

873
01:00:51,200 --> 01:00:56,000
but spray them and you know
>> you got to just do the best you can with

874
01:00:54,720 --> 01:01:00,520
it. But there are some things they'd
rather not eat. So

875
01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:00,520
» yes,

876
01:01:05,440 --> 01:01:12,799
» any more comments from the board?
>> How about Melissa?

877
01:01:09,680 --> 01:01:17,119
» Melissa, any comments on this?
No, none that we haven't already

878
01:01:14,319 --> 01:01:23,040
covered. Um, I pretty much have the same
sentiments as BART. I don't see this as

879
01:01:20,559 --> 01:01:27,280
a real substantial ask. The property is
non-conforming.

880
01:01:24,799 --> 01:01:31,920
What they're asking for is consistent
with the neighborhood. I think if there

881
01:01:29,680 --> 01:01:37,359
is a screening agreement to be reached,
that's great. But for me, I don't see

882
01:01:34,799 --> 01:01:40,839
screening as necessary to move forward
on this application.

883
01:01:42,160 --> 01:01:46,240
I mean, I'll give my opinion. I think,
yeah, the application is very

884
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:49,599
reasonable. I mean, got to get to the
lot somehow. You can't just leave 10

885
01:01:47,440 --> 01:01:55,200
acres sitting there. It's one house on
10 acres. Uh, the required square

886
01:01:52,640 --> 01:02:02,880
required square footing footage is 120
square feet. Lot is 456,000 square feet.

887
01:01:58,079 --> 01:02:09,760
So, it's a big difference. Um,
and uh,

888
01:02:06,400 --> 01:02:14,240
so what we're really doing is
going to prove the variance and then

889
01:02:11,599 --> 01:02:17,440
screening. I mean we number Pete and the
neighbors to agree upon some reasonable

890
01:02:16,720 --> 01:02:21,599
screening.
>> I go along with that. How Tommy, how

891
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:24,000
close are we this deep?
>> Uh

892
01:02:23,280 --> 01:02:28,559
what's that?
>> You look at the grades

893
01:02:26,559 --> 01:02:31,680
» it it drops off in the back there.
>> It's fairly flat where they're proposing

894
01:02:30,240 --> 01:02:35,839
that the build the dwelling
>> there. It is flat where we're propo flat

895
01:02:35,119 --> 01:02:39,599
fairly flat.
>> Not within any of the steep slopes. No,

896
01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:42,319
no, we our engineer has looked at that.
I think I actually included as a part of

897
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:45,920
the documents we provided where the
dwelling would be would be away from the

898
01:02:44,160 --> 01:02:49,599
steep any steep slopes.
>> Okay.

899
01:02:46,880 --> 01:02:58,760
» And as well as well as the wetlands to
victor's point, the large size mitigates

900
01:02:53,839 --> 01:02:58,760
u some degree the lack of frontage.

901
01:02:59,119 --> 01:03:06,319
» Frankly, the position where the proposed
house, I don't think anybody would see

902
01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:12,640
it from cottage place. The only thing
they would see is is the proposed

903
01:03:09,520 --> 01:03:15,200
driveway and probably a mailbox.
>> That's it. And I'm sure there are

904
01:03:14,160 --> 01:03:22,039
mailboxes.
>> I'm sure. Right. Mailbox

905
01:03:18,160 --> 01:03:22,039
all along Cottage Place.

906
01:03:22,559 --> 01:03:26,400
» Ready to make a motion?
>> Yep. Are we any further comments or are

907
01:03:24,880 --> 01:03:29,039
we ready to vote on this?
>> Ready to vote.

908
01:03:27,520 --> 01:03:32,559
» Okay.
Uh before we vote, do you have anything

909
01:03:30,720 --> 01:03:36,480
further you'd like to say, sir?
>> No. I think we've covered it all.

910
01:03:34,240 --> 01:03:38,559
» Okay. Can I have a motion as a type of
action?

911
01:03:37,039 --> 01:03:42,160
» Type two.
>> Second.

912
01:03:41,200 --> 01:03:44,480
» Mr. Burke.
>> I

913
01:03:42,960 --> 01:03:45,920
» Miss Deledo.
>> I

914
01:03:44,960 --> 01:03:47,839
» Mr. Guio.
>> Hi.

915
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:49,760
» Mr. Harden.
>> I.

916
01:03:48,480 --> 01:03:51,359
» Mr. Lansky.
>> I.

917
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:53,280
» Mr. Newman.
>> I.

918
01:03:52,079 --> 01:03:54,880
» Chairman Kestra.
>> I.

919
01:03:54,079 --> 01:03:58,799
» Thank you.
>> Can we have a motion whether we're going

920
01:03:56,400 --> 01:04:04,599
to grant or deny the application and
what any any conditions we might place

921
01:04:00,559 --> 01:04:04,599
upon it if we approve it?

922
01:04:06,079 --> 01:04:08,824
You got that?
>> Want to take it part?

923
01:04:07,599 --> 01:04:13,440
» Uh, who's on the hearing?
[clears throat]

924
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:18,720
» I'll uh make a motion to
uh grant varants for

925
01:04:16,559 --> 01:04:27,680
uh ADA
um exemption uh for frontage as well as

926
01:04:24,079 --> 01:04:31,680
a uh variance for
for

927
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:38,720
front yard.
Um,

928
01:04:33,760 --> 01:04:46,240
and I will condition that bearings on
uh applicant providing uh 150 ft of

929
01:04:42,240 --> 01:04:49,960
screening along the edge of the eastment
um towards

930
01:04:51,039 --> 01:04:57,480
» 10
>> towards 10 cot place.

931
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:57,480
Second.

932
01:04:58,799 --> 01:05:07,720
» Hold on.
>> Yep. 150. We'll

933
01:05:04,079 --> 01:05:07,720
» just about do that.

934
01:05:08,079 --> 01:05:11,280
» Yes. Good.
>> Do we have a second?

935
01:05:10,799 --> 01:05:13,520
» Second.
>> Second.

936
01:05:11,839 --> 01:05:15,760
» Huh? Yep.
>> Mr. Burke.

937
01:05:15,039 --> 01:05:18,079
» I
>> Mr. Pledo.

938
01:05:17,359 --> 01:05:19,839
» Hi,
>> Mr. Guio.

939
01:05:19,039 --> 01:05:21,520
» Hi,
>> Mr. Harden.

940
01:05:20,720 --> 01:05:23,440
» Hi,
>> Mr. Lansky.

941
01:05:22,640 --> 01:05:25,280
» Hi,
>> Mr. Mr. Newman.

942
01:05:24,480 --> 01:05:28,079
» I,
>> Chairman Kestra,

943
01:05:26,880 --> 01:05:30,240
» I.
>> Thank you.

944
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:31,920
» Congratulations. Your application has
been granted.

945
01:05:31,039 --> 01:05:35,995
» Thank you very much.
>> Thank you.

946
01:05:33,975 --> 01:05:35,995
[clears throat]

947
01:05:36,559 --> 01:05:42,480
» Don't forget all your drawings.
>> Nice to see that neighbors were able to

948
01:05:40,880 --> 01:05:47,130
work trucks out.
>> Good.

949
01:05:45,110 --> 01:05:47,130
[clears throat]

950
01:05:48,559 --> 01:05:54,880
» Okay, so we're going to go to the next
item on the agenda. This is the

951
01:05:52,400 --> 01:05:58,480
application of Danielle Fennesses. This
is an application to renew a special

952
01:05:56,640 --> 01:06:03,359
exception use permit for an existing
accessory apartment in an R80

953
01:06:00,480 --> 01:06:07,359
residential district at 31 Valley Pond
Road in Kona. Is somebody here to

954
01:06:06,079 --> 01:06:09,520
represent the applicant?
>> There she is.

955
01:06:08,160 --> 01:06:12,480
» Hello. Can you please give us your name
and address?

956
01:06:10,240 --> 01:06:17,599
» Hi, I'm Danielle Fennessy, 31 Valley
Pond Road, Katona, New York. I'm with my

957
01:06:14,880 --> 01:06:21,135
husband and my father-in-law.
>> Okay, jumping in at times.

958
01:06:19,119 --> 01:06:26,079
» Okay, that that would be fun.
[clears throat] Uh so can you briefly

959
01:06:22,559 --> 01:06:30,160
describe your application? Um I guess
the site plan or the uh layout has

960
01:06:28,880 --> 01:06:32,640
changed since last time this was
approved. Maybe you could fill me in a

961
01:06:31,520 --> 01:06:38,960
little bit on what's going on here.
>> Yeah. So the short version of all of

962
01:06:35,359 --> 01:06:44,480
this is the original plans that we
received when we purchased the home did

963
01:06:41,359 --> 01:06:50,799
not match what Tommy thought when he
came in for the site visit. Um we did

964
01:06:47,599 --> 01:06:57,039
have an architect. And we had an
architect

965
01:06:51,280 --> 01:07:01,599
» architect come in. Um he gave us a a
statement basically saying that nothing

966
01:06:58,480 --> 01:07:07,440
has changed since then um since the '9s.
So what was in place has always been in

967
01:07:05,200 --> 01:07:09,920
place and nothing was changed over time.
Um

968
01:07:07,920 --> 01:07:11,839
» what was approved what wasn't wasn't
ever there basically.

969
01:07:11,280 --> 01:07:13,359
» Correct.
>> For 20 years.

970
01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:17,039
» Correct.
>> Um so we were left kind of holding the

971
01:07:15,039 --> 01:07:20,480
bag. Um,
>> so this has kind of been going on for a

972
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:25,119
while and thankfully Denise and Tommy
have kind of been helping us with this

973
01:07:22,079 --> 01:07:27,520
process. At one point we were like screw
it to be honest with you. We don't want

974
01:07:26,240 --> 01:07:31,920
to deal with this anymore. So much
drama. But then we were like hey it

975
01:07:30,079 --> 01:07:36,799
makes sense to have a variance and
potentially good for us in the future.

976
01:07:34,240 --> 01:07:42,319
So we tried to figure out ways to
actually make the layout happen with the

977
01:07:39,920 --> 01:07:48,000
square footage of the house. We think we
came up to a solution that um we brought

978
01:07:45,359 --> 01:07:54,680
to Tommy and that should be what you
guys have.

979
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:54,680
» Yeah, there was a variance granted

980
01:07:54,801 --> 01:08:00,559
[clears throat]
>> variance that was granted apartment.

981
01:07:58,720 --> 01:08:04,160
» Oh, I don't remember when that was but
it was 93 quite some time ago. A

982
01:08:03,039 --> 01:08:08,240
» while ago [clears throat] and what we
came up with is is actually under the

983
01:08:06,079 --> 01:08:11,240
square footage variance that was
granted.

984
01:08:13,920 --> 01:08:23,359
And the current proposal it looks like
is it a,58

985
01:08:19,279 --> 01:08:26,960
uh square feet up to 1137
looking at the little

986
01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:32,960
» 1137 is what variance was approved back
in 93. But what we're looking to do is

987
01:08:29,759 --> 01:08:34,560
less. And that's the um the 53 you just
noted.

988
01:08:33,600 --> 01:08:38,000
» The max is 800.
>> 58. I'm sorry.

989
01:08:35,359 --> 01:08:41,600
» Yeah. 10,58,
right? Yeah. Because 800 or 850 is the

990
01:08:40,560 --> 01:08:43,839
max for the code.
>> I think it's 800.

991
01:08:42,799 --> 01:08:46,319
» 800.
>> So [clears throat] we'd have to grant

992
01:08:44,719 --> 01:08:51,600
you a variance as to the square footage
if we were to approve this.

993
01:08:49,759 --> 01:08:57,120
And right now this So this really isn't
a renewal, is it Tommy? I mean there was

994
01:08:54,159 --> 01:09:00,159
tell me what you what's your what's your
take on what's going on here?

995
01:08:58,239 --> 01:09:04,000
» The the applicant has been before the
board before

996
01:09:01,920 --> 01:09:07,520
» that I I recall that that was for this
pro same property.

997
01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:11,279
» Yeah, it was a while back.
>> Okay.

998
01:09:08,000 --> 01:09:15,759
» The uh as required by the code every
seven years we have to do uh an on-site

999
01:09:14,159 --> 01:09:20,400
inspection of the accessory apartment.
Make sure everything's compliant with

1000
01:09:16,960 --> 01:09:26,159
the terms of the original approval.
Um when I went out to do that, the

1001
01:09:24,480 --> 01:09:33,600
apartment
um which the applicant thought um was

1002
01:09:30,080 --> 01:09:40,239
the primary portion of the dwelling was
was not. They was they were flip-fpped.

1003
01:09:37,839 --> 01:09:43,839
The original approval showed the primary
dwelling in the upper level of the home

1004
01:09:41,920 --> 01:09:50,560
and the apartment on the lower level of
the home.

1005
01:09:45,920 --> 01:09:57,920
the um the actual was was reversed.
So what that did was it increased the

1006
01:09:54,480 --> 01:10:04,800
footprint uh floor area of the apartment
space. So the applicant came before the

1007
01:10:01,679 --> 01:10:08,400
board to for the renewal of the
accessory apartment with with the

1008
01:10:06,800 --> 01:10:14,560
modifications.
The board was not in favor of granting

1009
01:10:11,679 --> 01:10:19,840
such a large square footage. Was it like
1,500 square foot when it was

1010
01:10:16,640 --> 01:10:25,840
flip-flopped? And you you advised the
applicant [clears throat] to go and work

1011
01:10:22,080 --> 01:10:30,159
on a plan to make it more uh appealing
for a positive of the board which they

1012
01:10:29,199 --> 01:10:33,760
have done.
>> And if I recall, I don't think that was

1013
01:10:31,920 --> 01:10:38,000
an actual application. That was more of
a

1014
01:10:34,400 --> 01:10:42,159
» dual of a special exception permit for
an accessory apartment which was granted

1015
01:10:40,320 --> 01:10:46,960
in the 1990s
>> for 1137.

1016
01:10:43,920 --> 01:10:52,440
» The first the first visit was to renew
the special exception use permit as new

1017
01:10:49,440 --> 01:10:52,440
owners

1018
01:10:52,640 --> 01:10:59,679
and then they came back another time to
have a discussion

1019
01:10:56,320 --> 01:11:02,880
» to see what the board would and would
not be okay with.

1020
01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:06,640
» Okay.
bing at the 1400 square foot size of the

1021
01:11:05,280 --> 01:11:08,560
apartment.
>> Paul,

1022
01:11:07,600 --> 01:11:10,560
» correct?
>> So,

1023
01:11:08,960 --> 01:11:13,040
» only 800's allowed. It's almost double.
Right. Okay.

1024
01:11:11,280 --> 01:11:20,239
» They've gone back and they've reworked
the floor plan to be um

1025
01:11:17,920 --> 01:11:24,400
hopefully appealing to the board so they
can get your approval. And what they're

1026
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:26,880
explaining is the original approval was
for how many square feet?

1027
01:11:25,760 --> 01:11:30,960
» 1137.
>> 1137. and the proposed with this

1028
01:11:30,400 --> 01:11:35,360
» 158
>> 1,00 so it's

1029
01:11:33,520 --> 01:11:40,719
» less although it's more than the 800
square foot that code permits but the

1030
01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:46,880
original approval in the '9s was in
excess of what they're looking for now.

1031
01:11:44,080 --> 01:11:52,560
So, at at this point in time,
isn't this an application for a new

1032
01:11:50,239 --> 01:11:56,159
special exception use permit? Because
we're talking about from my from what

1033
01:11:54,534 --> 01:12:02,920
[clears throat] I'm hearing, a different
apartment than what was originally

1034
01:11:58,880 --> 01:12:02,920
approved in the 1990s.

1035
01:12:03,040 --> 01:12:08,320
» The uh
>> unless I'm missing,

1036
01:12:05,199 --> 01:12:10,880
» I I was looking at as a modification
to

1037
01:12:09,920 --> 01:12:13,760
approval,
>> but it was on the first floor, now it's

1038
01:12:12,159 --> 01:12:17,920
on the second. So, it is kind of a new
apartment. I see what you're saying.

1039
01:12:16,080 --> 01:12:22,800
» So, the layout of the house is exactly
the same. From my perspective, it just

1040
01:12:20,640 --> 01:12:24,800
looks like whoever drew this
flip-flopped it.

1041
01:12:23,440 --> 01:12:28,800
» Flip-flopped it.
>> So, what they were showing is the

1042
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:32,960
apartment actually is upstairs.
>> Let me just be, you know, clear. I have

1043
01:12:30,719 --> 01:12:36,719
no real problem with with the plan you
have. It's just I want to make sure that

1044
01:12:34,800 --> 01:12:40,000
we're doing things correctly.
>> I agree with you.

1045
01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:45,920
» And so, what the question is what
cleaning up? What do we what would we be

1046
01:12:42,159 --> 01:12:52,640
approving today? Would it be a new an
application for a special exception use

1047
01:12:48,400 --> 01:12:57,520
permit starting today or is it a uh
continuation of the prior special

1048
01:12:55,920 --> 01:13:00,480
exception use permit
>> that was granted?

1049
01:12:58,400 --> 01:13:03,920
» I think it's a new application now. I I
think it's a new application.

1050
01:13:02,400 --> 01:13:08,400
» That's how to clean it up. If you want
to clean it up, do it right. semantics

1051
01:13:06,480 --> 01:13:13,920
new application. [clears throat]
>> And we we if we approve this, we also

1052
01:13:10,480 --> 01:13:17,199
have to approve a variance of 258 square
feet because we're over the 800,

1053
01:13:15,760 --> 01:13:20,320
» right?
>> Which is a little bit over. This is

1054
01:13:18,800 --> 01:13:21,280
intended to be only a one bedroom
though,

1055
01:13:20,880 --> 01:13:24,800
» right?
>> Yes.

1056
01:13:21,679 --> 01:13:30,239
» Okay. I see the living room is kind of
bifurcated between two areas here, kind

1057
01:13:27,199 --> 01:13:33,280
of cut in half. And u I do see closets.
Usually a closet is an indication of a

1058
01:13:31,920 --> 01:13:38,000
bedroom, but it's not intended to be
another bedroom there. That's detail of

1059
01:13:35,440 --> 01:13:42,000
the existing of the existing floor plan
of the house. That [clears throat] was

1060
01:13:39,600 --> 01:13:50,719
that was designed that way during the
original um proposed um apartment

1061
01:13:47,440 --> 01:13:52,880
application, but that was in the '9s.
>> Yes.

1062
01:13:51,360 --> 01:13:58,480
» But I thought you I thought you said,
Tom, that the original application was

1063
01:13:54,960 --> 01:14:01,280
for the assessment department to be on
the first level.

1064
01:13:59,679 --> 01:14:06,080
» That's what was approved,
>> right? And so,

1065
01:14:02,560 --> 01:14:12,000
» and the and the main dwelling main
dwelling actually occupied both levels.

1066
01:14:09,440 --> 01:14:15,920
It was it's kind of it's it's it's kind
of odd in my opinion how it was how it

1067
01:14:14,960 --> 01:14:20,400
was laid out.
>> How we got here was originally there

1068
01:14:18,159 --> 01:14:23,920
were walls that showed on the plans that
were never there. The architect that

1069
01:14:22,239 --> 01:14:28,320
came in said those walls were never
there. Nothing has ever changed. So, it

1070
01:14:26,719 --> 01:14:31,440
was kind of messed up from the
beginning. Um, but right now the

1071
01:14:29,600 --> 01:14:36,880
upstairs and the downstairs are
identical um, in how they look.

1072
01:14:35,280 --> 01:14:44,719
» But it would seem to me that you'd clean
it up with a new assessment, a new

1073
01:14:41,280 --> 01:14:50,239
a doover and not attempt to change what
was done in 93, which was wrong.

1074
01:14:49,040 --> 01:14:53,840
» I mean, the way the application's
written, it does say an application for

1075
01:14:51,679 --> 01:14:58,120
a proposed relocation.
>> Yeah, I think we'd have to change that.

1076
01:14:58,159 --> 01:15:03,440
Well, the relocation would just be
flip-flopping,

1077
01:15:01,360 --> 01:15:08,080
» right? Can we just can we just can we do
a renewal with a relocation?

1078
01:15:06,640 --> 01:15:11,360
» That's what I was thinking.
>> Yeah.

1079
01:15:08,480 --> 01:15:14,800
» But if the board feels differently, then
>> I mean, as long as the plans are now

1080
01:15:13,920 --> 01:15:17,760
right,
>> I

1081
01:15:15,120 --> 01:15:20,880
» So the next next time you go,
>> which

1082
01:15:18,239 --> 01:15:26,880
» I I just want to make mention of this
and this could even be before Tom Tuma

1083
01:15:23,199 --> 01:15:31,679
time. We have had at least one instance
where somebody changed the location of

1084
01:15:29,600 --> 01:15:37,199
their apartment within their original
footprint. It was the mother and father.

1085
01:15:34,960 --> 01:15:42,000
They were upstairs needed to be moved
downstairs because of mobility and it

1086
01:15:40,239 --> 01:15:47,040
was just it wasn't a brand new
application. We changed the lo it was a

1087
01:15:45,040 --> 01:15:51,520
relocation of the apartment. So, I'm
just I just want to throw that out

1088
01:15:48,640 --> 01:15:55,679
there. Obviously, it's up to you guys.
However it gets done, we need to just

1089
01:15:53,520 --> 01:16:00,239
get it done.
>> And then in terms of the the present

1090
01:15:57,920 --> 01:16:03,920
present uh
accessory use permit, when does that

1091
01:16:02,239 --> 01:16:06,400
expire?
>> It's been expired.

1092
01:16:05,679 --> 01:16:10,159
» Okay.
>> We've been think about new application.

1093
01:16:09,840 --> 01:16:14,239
» Yeah.
>> Because you don't have right now. We

1094
01:16:11,760 --> 01:16:17,760
don't have a an existing permit,
accessory permit.

1095
01:16:15,760 --> 01:16:20,640
» Does that cause us a problem? Do we do
we need it? But it's been expired

1096
01:16:20,080 --> 01:16:22,640
because
>> because we've been going through this

1097
01:16:21,920 --> 01:16:26,960
process
>> and tried to renew it. When Tommy

1098
01:16:25,052 --> 01:16:29,440
[clears throat] came in, it wasn't
>> Yeah.

1099
01:16:27,440 --> 01:16:32,960
» built the way it was approved.
>> So that's the only reason it's

1100
01:16:31,040 --> 01:16:37,440
» So we we've been in process, you know,
from, you know, the beginning when

1101
01:16:34,800 --> 01:16:40,560
Denise said, "All right, you know, um,
Tommy just has to come out and then you

1102
01:16:38,880 --> 01:16:44,000
guys can start renting it out." And
Tommy came out and said, "Nope, you

1103
01:16:42,719 --> 01:16:47,040
can't start renting it out yet."
>> This was when it was very difficult to

1104
01:16:46,400 --> 01:16:50,239
get in.
>> Yeah. I

1105
01:16:48,239 --> 01:16:54,320
» is it is it I mean is there any reason
to not make a new

1106
01:16:52,320 --> 01:16:56,159
» what would be the reason a notice do
would this have to be can we do it

1107
01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:59,840
tonight
>> I don't I don't

1108
01:16:57,280 --> 01:17:03,698
» I think we could do it with that I think
the only question was whether you

1109
01:17:01,840 --> 01:17:07,520
provide a little difference because
[clears throat]

1110
01:17:04,400 --> 01:17:10,480
it's a renewal um you know that
typically gets less less

1111
01:17:09,280 --> 01:17:12,640
» less scrutiny
>> than a new application

1112
01:17:11,920 --> 01:17:17,679
» square footage
>> that said there's a hardship issue here

1113
01:17:15,600 --> 01:17:22,400
where these
purchased something and didn't know

1114
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:28,588
exactly what they purchased um and
thought they had u you know everything

1115
01:17:26,000 --> 01:17:32,000
legal and a permit and they're trying
[clears throat] to do the right thing.

1116
01:17:30,400 --> 01:17:38,080
So
show the same kind of difference we

1117
01:17:33,600 --> 01:17:44,400
normally would by you know given
and property meets still meets the same

1118
01:17:41,760 --> 01:17:50,159
things right it's 1992
you know they separate entrances there's

1119
01:17:47,760 --> 01:17:54,000
driveway right all those things still
meet so now we're just at the apartment

1120
01:17:52,640 --> 01:17:57,600
the apartment's a little bit big is
there anything else that doesn't meet on

1121
01:17:55,840 --> 01:18:01,600
the apartment besides square footage
>> we uh felt oh we weren't doing That was

1122
01:18:00,000 --> 01:18:03,520
» Yeah, we didn't have our usual checklist
back then.

1123
01:18:02,560 --> 01:18:07,280
» I was looking for that.
>> Yeah, we'd have I'd have to revisit.

1124
01:18:06,159 --> 01:18:10,159
» But you don't know of anything else
that's not

1125
01:18:08,159 --> 01:18:13,920
» No, they have they have they have ample
parking two entrances.

1126
01:18:12,880 --> 01:18:19,760
» Everything else seems to make
>> The only thing that that's not um in in

1127
01:18:17,600 --> 01:18:23,679
um complying with our code is the uh
floor area in excess of 800 square feet.

1128
01:18:22,080 --> 01:18:25,440
» The house was built before that date
that we have.

1129
01:18:24,880 --> 01:18:27,440
» It was
>> it was built. Okay.

1130
01:18:26,640 --> 01:18:31,920
» So,
>> there you go. Given all that and given

1131
01:18:29,600 --> 01:18:34,719
the fact that they have
>> I I don't have a problem if they

1132
01:18:33,440 --> 01:18:38,239
» were doing doing it correctly.
>> Probleming it as a new application and I

1133
01:18:36,640 --> 01:18:40,320
think that's a little bit cleaner and I
don't see it as a notice issue.

1134
01:18:39,760 --> 01:18:43,280
» Okay.
>> We have a notice up already.

1135
01:18:42,560 --> 01:18:45,040
» Excuse me.
>> We already have a notice up in front of

1136
01:18:44,640 --> 01:18:46,800
the house.
>> Yes.

1137
01:18:45,440 --> 01:18:50,960
» For a renewal, not for a new
application. Technicality. Yeah.

1138
01:18:49,679 --> 01:18:56,400
» Semantics. Just
>> we have to write another no.

1139
01:18:54,159 --> 01:18:58,880
You're good Ricky. It doesn't even tell
you anything on that other than the date

1140
01:18:58,320 --> 01:19:00,880
of the meeting.
>> Okay. Yeah. Let's let's try to get this

1141
01:19:00,320 --> 01:19:02,800
resolved tonight.
>> Get this over.

1142
01:19:01,679 --> 01:19:07,360
» Yeah.
>> And in terms of the the plan that we

1143
01:19:04,960 --> 01:19:13,040
have here on the left side, it said
recreation room, which seems which seems

1144
01:19:10,560 --> 01:19:19,920
to be the left side of the the upstairs
of the h left side of you're facing the

1145
01:19:16,159 --> 01:19:25,440
house, left side of the upper floor.
Does the proposed

1146
01:19:22,560 --> 01:19:27,360
apartment dweller have access or would
have access to that recreation?

1147
01:19:27,120 --> 01:19:29,600
» No.
>> No. That's part of your house.

1148
01:19:28,719 --> 01:19:33,040
» Correct.
>> Okay.

1149
01:19:31,040 --> 01:19:34,719
» Because if that's part of the apartment,
then we got a problem.

1150
01:19:33,840 --> 01:19:37,280
» That's why you said no.
>> Right.

1151
01:19:35,520 --> 01:19:41,760
» Well, that put us back where we were.
>> Yeah. Let's not go there. So, yeah.

1152
01:19:40,159 --> 01:19:45,199
» Okay. So, let's let's take this out to
the public and then we can discuss

1153
01:19:43,199 --> 01:19:48,000
further. Uh, is there anyone uh Denise,
if you can open up online if anybody

1154
01:19:46,719 --> 01:19:51,679
wishes to speak in regard to the
application. Uh, is there anyone here

1155
01:19:50,080 --> 01:19:58,560
present in the audience who would like
to speak in regard to this application?

1156
01:19:55,679 --> 01:20:02,960
» Sure. Just give us your It's all right.
>> Come on, Rick. Step up. [clears throat]

1157
01:20:01,840 --> 01:20:05,040
» All right. So, we'll just give it a
minute. Any further discussions from the

1158
01:20:04,640 --> 01:20:09,120
board?
>> There's nobody coming on.

1159
01:20:06,880 --> 01:20:13,199
» Okay, Denise, you can close it down. Any
further discussions from the board?

1160
01:20:10,880 --> 01:20:16,400
» No.
>> Okay. Does the applicant have anything

1161
01:20:14,880 --> 01:20:21,600
further to say before we vote on the
application?

1162
01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:24,640
I have no problem with uh taking out
closets because we already talked about

1163
01:20:23,280 --> 01:20:28,159
that [clears throat] needing to be done.
So

1164
01:20:26,159 --> 01:20:33,920
» upstairs in those rooms,
>> the room the uh yeah the living room um

1165
01:20:31,360 --> 01:20:37,600
would be viewed as a bedroom in the
board of health's eyes because of the

1166
01:20:36,800 --> 01:20:40,480
privacy.
>> Correct.

1167
01:20:38,000 --> 01:20:44,880
» So if those doors were taken out and the
privacy was eliminated, it would not be

1168
01:20:43,040 --> 01:20:47,120
considered a bedroom.
>> Right.

1169
01:20:45,520 --> 01:20:49,760
» Okay. And that might be a smart move
just to prevent issues with the border.

1170
01:20:48,719 --> 01:20:54,239
Does the board of health looks at
bedrooms by Is there a closet?

1171
01:20:51,679 --> 01:20:56,080
» It's uh privacy and reasonable access to
all bath.

1172
01:20:55,600 --> 01:21:02,159
» Right.
>> Right.

1173
01:20:59,040 --> 01:21:04,239
» The closets could stay as nothing.
>> Okay.

1174
01:21:02,560 --> 01:21:07,920
» So just you just take off the doors.
>> Privacy

1175
01:21:06,159 --> 01:21:11,199
access. This a full bathroom. That was a
powder room.

1176
01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:17,120
» Yeah. No, there's no doors on that.
>> Problem solved. I'll I'll be doing an

1177
01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:22,080
alteration permit in conjunction with um
the um with with the apartment if it

1178
01:21:20,960 --> 01:21:24,719
were approved.
>> Okay.

1179
01:21:22,880 --> 01:21:27,040
» Okay.
>> Are we ready to vote on this

1180
01:21:25,840 --> 01:21:29,360
application? I think we should move.
>> Yes.

1181
01:21:27,679 --> 01:21:31,040
» Okay. Can I have a motion as to the type
of action?

1182
01:21:30,000 --> 01:21:34,480
» Type two.
>> Second.

1183
01:21:33,520 --> 01:21:36,640
» Mr. Burke.
>> I.

1184
01:21:35,199 --> 01:21:38,800
» Miss DO.
>> I.

1185
01:21:37,440 --> 01:21:40,400
» Mr. Guio.
>> I.

1186
01:21:39,520 --> 01:21:42,400
» Mr. Harden.
>> Hi.

1187
01:21:41,199 --> 01:21:44,320
» Mr. Minski.
>> I,

1188
01:21:43,120 --> 01:21:46,239
» Mr. Newman.
>> I,

1189
01:21:44,960 --> 01:21:47,920
» Chairman Kenistra,
>> I.

1190
01:21:47,120 --> 01:21:50,719
» Thank you.
>> Can I have a motion as to whether we're

1191
01:21:49,280 --> 01:21:55,120
going to grant the 7-year special
exception use permit? Keep in mind, we

1192
01:21:53,040 --> 01:22:02,320
do approve it as is. We do have a
variance for square footage of

1193
01:21:58,320 --> 01:22:02,320
258 square feet.

1194
01:22:03,760 --> 01:22:12,639
I make a motion to grant a variance of
258 square feet for the accessory

1195
01:22:08,880 --> 01:22:18,480
apartment at 31 Valley Pond Road. Uh and
a motion to approve to uh grant a

1196
01:22:15,600 --> 01:22:22,239
special exception use permit uh for the
same

1197
01:22:19,840 --> 01:22:23,920
» second.
>> Mr. Burke

1198
01:22:23,199 --> 01:22:28,000
» I
>> Mr. [clears throat] Pledo

1199
01:22:25,760 --> 01:22:30,639
» I and that's with the closet removal,
right?

1200
01:22:29,120 --> 01:22:33,679
» With the doors off the closet. I guess
that's one of the too,

1201
01:22:31,760 --> 01:22:38,239
» right? [clears throat]
>> Is that part of the motion?

1202
01:22:35,040 --> 01:22:41,920
» No, I I think it was only the there can
be no doors on the bedroom.

1203
01:22:40,639 --> 01:22:44,320
» The closets can stay, Tommy.
>> Living room.

1204
01:22:43,040 --> 01:22:48,400
» Sorry, the living room.
>> There can't be doors. Can't be a private

1205
01:22:46,719 --> 01:22:49,920
space. And we've been told there are no
doors,

1206
01:22:49,360 --> 01:22:54,320
» right?
>> Yeah. So, what we're saying is it's a

1207
01:22:53,040 --> 01:22:55,360
one-bedroom apartment,
>> correct?

1208
01:22:54,719 --> 01:22:59,280
» Yes.
>> Right. That's correct.

1209
01:22:57,120 --> 01:23:02,880
» So, can you can Sorry, Denise, can you
just amend my motion to to say a

1210
01:23:01,199 --> 01:23:06,400
one-bedroom accessory apartment?
>> Yes, I added that. Thank you.

1211
01:23:04,639 --> 01:23:09,920
» I amend a second.
>> Okay. Thank you. All right. Let me start

1212
01:23:08,639 --> 01:23:12,000
again. Mr. Burke.
>> I

1213
01:23:10,719 --> 01:23:13,520
» Miss Pledo.
>> Hi,

1214
01:23:12,639 --> 01:23:15,280
» Mr. Kio.
>> Hi,

1215
01:23:14,320 --> 01:23:17,040
» Mr. Harden.
>> Hi,

1216
01:23:16,000 --> 01:23:19,440
» Mr. Lansky.
>> Hi,

1217
01:23:17,760 --> 01:23:22,080
» Mr. Newman. I
>> chairman Canistra.

1218
01:23:20,880 --> 01:23:24,800
» I
>> thank you.

1219
01:23:23,120 --> 01:23:27,440
» Congratulations. Your application has
been

1220
01:23:25,440 --> 01:23:28,480
» very much. Thank you, Tommy and Denise,
too.

1221
01:23:27,679 --> 01:23:32,772
» Thank you.
>> You're welcome. So, guys, your next step

1222
01:23:30,719 --> 01:23:35,760
is Tommy.
[clears throat]

1223
01:23:34,560 --> 01:23:38,480
» Okay.
>> Good night.

1224
01:23:36,320 --> 01:23:43,679
» Thank you. Bye.
>> Okay. Next item on the agenda this

1225
01:23:40,080 --> 01:23:48,159
evening is that of Polia uh Water New
York, Inc. They actually are item four

1226
01:23:45,760 --> 01:23:51,360
and five on the agenda.
Yep.

1227
01:23:48,800 --> 01:23:55,800
» Um sir, if you could please give us your
name and how you represent the applicant

1228
01:23:56,000 --> 01:24:04,320
I see the application here, but you
could also add um an explanation of why

1229
01:24:02,880 --> 01:24:06,880
this is necessary, what we're doing
here, what's you know, you know,

1230
01:24:05,760 --> 01:24:08,880
» we'll do Mr. Chairman.
>> Yes.

1231
01:24:07,280 --> 01:24:12,639
» First of all, Mr. Chairman, members of
the board, staff, uh Lo Sharetta,

1232
01:24:11,360 --> 01:24:16,480
partner with the law firm Blakeley
Platin Schmidt on behalf of Violia. with

1233
01:24:14,880 --> 01:24:21,040
me this evening, Dan Scholenfelder with
Violia and Will Sherman from Suburban

1234
01:24:18,960 --> 01:24:24,960
Consulting Engineers. So, just to get
into the background, um I've been doing

1235
01:24:23,440 --> 01:24:28,400
this a long time for Violia in terms of
these types of projects. So, just to

1236
01:24:26,880 --> 01:24:33,120
give you a background, about several
years ago, the state and the EP the

1237
01:24:30,800 --> 01:24:36,960
federal EPA had a 10 parts per trillion
acceptable POS level, which is

1238
01:24:34,800 --> 01:24:41,360
polyfllorinated alkal aka forever
chemicals that have now, you know,

1239
01:24:38,719 --> 01:24:46,000
seeped into waters and wells. And back
then, back in right before COVID, it was

1240
01:24:43,199 --> 01:24:49,280
a 10 parts per trillion uh requirement.
That that was the acceptable level.

1241
01:24:47,760 --> 01:24:54,560
2024,
uh the EPA decided to reduce that to

1242
01:24:51,679 --> 01:25:00,560
four parts per trillion. And what that
caused is us and the team going to now

1243
01:24:57,600 --> 01:25:06,159
have to install all these new POS
treatment uh facilities across Hudson

1244
01:25:02,560 --> 01:25:10,639
Valley. Uh we've done about 17 so far
across the Hudson Valley to our service

1245
01:25:08,000 --> 01:25:15,360
area and this is just one of another
other projects that we have throughout

1246
01:25:12,080 --> 01:25:19,760
the region to get us uh basically in
compliance with that federal mandate uh

1247
01:25:18,239 --> 01:25:24,960
which takes into effect in a couple of
years. Um so we're we're all, you know,

1248
01:25:22,960 --> 01:25:27,920
not just here but everywhere trying to
get this done and get these

1249
01:25:26,100 --> 01:25:31,440
[clears throat] facilities built. So
basically what we're looking to do is

1250
01:25:29,440 --> 01:25:36,320
this this project is an existing
treatment facility. It's been around for

1251
01:25:33,760 --> 01:25:41,040
decades. Uh there's five wells that are
served at this site. Uh the last upgrade

1252
01:25:39,440 --> 01:25:45,679
we made to this well these wells were
back in 1980, but it has been a water

1253
01:25:43,600 --> 01:25:50,159
treatment facility for again several
decades. Uh what we're proposing as part

1254
01:25:48,480 --> 01:25:54,480
of this this project and we've been
before planning board uh this was a type

1255
01:25:52,080 --> 01:26:00,000
two action. They deemed it um we're
looking to install 1,700 give square

1256
01:25:58,080 --> 01:26:04,000
foot give or take what's called a gak
filter. It's a granular activated

1257
01:26:01,920 --> 01:26:07,920
carbon. So think of it as a brittle
filter. So it's that's what they are.

1258
01:26:06,000 --> 01:26:12,320
They're larger brittle filters that we
install which basically treat and take

1259
01:26:09,920 --> 01:26:16,000
out POS. Uh boiling it won't do
anything. You know some things you have

1260
01:26:14,480 --> 01:26:18,960
a boil but boiling water doesn't do
anything to the POS. You have to run it

1261
01:26:17,520 --> 01:26:23,120
through these these Gak filters.
>> What is this POS? What is that?

1262
01:26:20,800 --> 01:26:29,040
» Uh so POS was a chemical. It's it's
polyfllorinated alkal. It was used in

1263
01:26:25,120 --> 01:26:32,159
non-stick surfaces, fire, makeup. But uh
over the course of the many years that

1264
01:26:30,719 --> 01:26:34,480
these chemicals have been in use,
they've seeped into the into the water

1265
01:26:33,760 --> 01:26:36,880
system. Okay.
>> You're basically going down getting the

1266
01:26:35,840 --> 01:26:39,360
ground water out.
>> Yeah. In the wells back in. Is that what

1267
01:26:38,960 --> 01:26:42,880
we're
>> Yeah. We're basically having the again

1268
01:26:41,120 --> 01:26:48,400
very simple again go back to the Brit
filter. Uh we're running water through

1269
01:26:45,679 --> 01:26:52,560
the filter to cleanse it out in addition
to other treatment that we have to

1270
01:26:49,760 --> 01:26:56,560
provide the water. So this particular
site we're not changing capacity. We're

1271
01:26:54,639 --> 01:27:01,840
not increasing water capacity. All we're
doing is treating it for POS. So with

1272
01:26:59,679 --> 01:27:07,520
respect to this project again it
involves the installation of a building

1273
01:27:04,560 --> 01:27:13,360
uh again which is a 7,750 I believe
square feet. Yeah. 7 yeah 7:30. Sorry.

1274
01:27:11,120 --> 01:27:17,600
In addition to that there's also some
accessory structures that have to be

1275
01:27:14,960 --> 01:27:21,120
installed. But the main components Mr.
Chair members of the board is the Gak

1276
01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:24,880
building and the accessory structure. So
which takes me to the variances that we

1277
01:27:22,800 --> 01:27:28,320
need for tonight. The variances that we
require, we require two setback

1278
01:27:26,639 --> 01:27:33,120
variances. One for accessory, one for
principal structures, and then one for

1279
01:27:30,159 --> 01:27:36,960
the height. Uh where this is proposed to
be is in not if you if you've seen the

1280
01:27:35,440 --> 01:27:40,480
site, it's not in a residential
neighborhood. Again, it's it's behind,

1281
01:27:38,880 --> 01:27:43,760
you know, where where the land trust is,
Heritage Hills area, but again, there

1282
01:27:42,159 --> 01:27:48,080
are no residences that are currently
existing. It makes it an ideal site for

1283
01:27:46,320 --> 01:27:51,280
this, but this is something we have to
do. It's not like I want to be here and

1284
01:27:49,520 --> 01:27:54,960
I respect and enjoy spending time with
all of you, but it's not something that

1285
01:27:53,679 --> 01:27:57,920
uh you know we we want to do. It's
something we have to do in the federal

1286
01:27:56,239 --> 01:28:02,639
and state guidelines say we have to do
this projects. Uh and that pretty much

1287
01:28:00,639 --> 01:28:06,080
it is it in a nutshell. Mr. Chairman, if
it's okay with you, I just like to have

1288
01:28:04,239 --> 01:28:10,239
Will just come up and just talk about
the the site plan real quick in terms of

1289
01:28:07,920 --> 01:28:15,199
the variances and why we need them. uh
you know it it is important to note you

1290
01:28:12,880 --> 01:28:18,800
know just to just real quick that you
know there was and I'll just give you

1291
01:28:17,280 --> 01:28:22,719
just to get it out in the open. I know
when we were at the planning board I

1292
01:28:20,639 --> 01:28:26,560
know the folks here from land trust kind
of objected to it the location of it but

1293
01:28:25,199 --> 01:28:30,480
you know and I said this to the planning
board and I'll state it just off you we

1294
01:28:28,400 --> 01:28:34,960
have no desire to change this facility
in terms of moving it. We have a

1295
01:28:32,400 --> 01:28:39,040
deadline that we have to comply with. uh
moving the building whether it's 65 feet

1296
01:28:37,040 --> 01:28:42,320
further is going to cost us with
testimony that we presented before the

1297
01:28:40,400 --> 01:28:45,520
planning board over half a million
dollars just to do and additional time

1298
01:28:44,080 --> 01:28:49,040
which we just don't have. We have to get
these things up and running and this

1299
01:28:47,920 --> 01:28:52,159
building right here if you go to your
bathroom has a POS problem. If you look

1300
01:28:50,719 --> 01:28:55,600
at the sign when you go to the bathroom
on your right [snorts] uh and hopefully

1301
01:28:54,320 --> 01:28:59,440
this facility will will take care of
that issue. That's why you have uh

1302
01:28:58,400 --> 01:29:02,639
» we're on well
>> yeah you're on right and

1303
01:29:00,639 --> 01:29:06,000
» we're not we don't we're not fed by
>> Yeah. But one of the ideas is is

1304
01:29:04,480 --> 01:29:09,760
probably once this comes online is
hopefully to get this all worked out. So

1305
01:29:08,320 --> 01:29:12,800
» how far of a range does this thing work
as far as cleaning?

1306
01:29:11,040 --> 01:29:16,239
» Uh there's five wells that this is going
to be treating right now.

1307
01:29:14,159 --> 01:29:18,400
» Yeah. Can you just tell us just for so
sure background?

1308
01:29:17,840 --> 01:29:22,719
» Just Heritage.
>> Who's who is served? Who is served by

1309
01:29:20,560 --> 01:29:24,400
this? All of Heritage Hills and
>> it's uh

1310
01:29:23,440 --> 01:29:29,120
» Dan Shenfelder.
>> Hi Dan Shenfelder with Filelia. uh

1311
01:29:26,480 --> 01:29:37,120
Heritage Hills, the uh community up
there. Uh parts of uh Sr's Crossing, the

1312
01:29:34,239 --> 01:29:42,320
» Stown Shopping Center, oh the condos.
>> There's a small development behind THCO

1313
01:29:40,159 --> 01:29:47,600
we serve. And I believe that there's a
current plan that may not be finalized,

1314
01:29:45,440 --> 01:29:49,199
but there have been talks about this
building here

1315
01:29:48,400 --> 01:29:53,120
» park district
>> being served uh once the department of

1316
01:29:51,679 --> 01:29:55,360
health approves the uh the
interconnection and

1317
01:29:54,639 --> 01:29:57,520
» so this is
>> approves the expansion of the service

1318
01:29:56,960 --> 01:30:00,560
territory.
>> No

1319
01:29:57,840 --> 01:30:03,440
» school's not involved
>> right into it.

1320
01:30:01,120 --> 01:30:05,360
» These five wells give Heritage all their
water.

1321
01:30:03,840 --> 01:30:08,000
» Correct.
>> No.

1322
01:30:05,760 --> 01:30:09,840
» For the Heritage Hills development,
those are

1323
01:30:08,480 --> 01:30:13,600
» huge development. That's why I'm
surprised that these five wells could do

1324
01:30:11,040 --> 01:30:18,480
» it. It's five uh portable drinking water
wells. They get the the water gets

1325
01:30:15,520 --> 01:30:22,560
treated at uh the location that we're
presenting on and then we're proposing

1326
01:30:20,880 --> 01:30:25,760
additional treatment in addition to
what's there uh to remove PAS from the

1327
01:30:25,120 --> 01:30:29,280
the drink.
>> But those five wells serve all of her

1328
01:30:28,880 --> 01:30:30,560
chills.
>> That's correct.

1329
01:30:29,920 --> 01:30:35,280
» Wow. Okay.
>> Yeah.

1330
01:30:32,000 --> 01:30:39,920
» So, this is a new and continuous.
You're not storing the water. So, it's

1331
01:30:38,000 --> 01:30:41,360
going to be a new and continuous
>> atmospheric tank

1332
01:30:40,800 --> 01:30:43,920
» filter.
>> One of the one of these is an

1333
01:30:42,719 --> 01:30:46,560
atmospheric tank.
>> Yeah. So,

1334
01:30:45,040 --> 01:30:50,560
» the heights
>> that's the gak building

1335
01:30:49,120 --> 01:30:54,480
» both they're both above the height.
>> Yeah.

1336
01:30:52,320 --> 01:30:57,840
» Just to make quick comment. Sorry.
>> Will Sherman from Suburban.

1337
01:30:55,600 --> 01:31:00,320
» Will Sherman consulting engineers. So,
the height variance is going to be for

1338
01:30:59,199 --> 01:31:03,920
the accessory structure which would be
the tank. The existing or the proposed

1339
01:31:02,880 --> 01:31:07,040
building does not need a height
variance. We are underneath the

1340
01:31:05,520 --> 01:31:13,840
respective requirements of the mean
height on the zoning table as listed on

1341
01:31:10,800 --> 01:31:18,719
page five. So C00 the height
requirements are listed under note

1342
01:31:15,760 --> 01:31:21,679
number five.
The the accessory structure would be

1343
01:31:20,239 --> 01:31:25,679
requiring height variance. I believe
it's a 34 foot tall built where the

1344
01:31:24,480 --> 01:31:30,960
height variance for the accessory
structure is for the

1345
01:31:28,880 --> 01:31:33,840
» and there's al there's an existing
structure there now. Correct.

1346
01:31:32,159 --> 01:31:37,760
» Correct. Correct. That's an existing
footage and what is the height of the uh

1347
01:31:36,480 --> 01:31:43,360
existing structure?
>> The existing facility is approximately

1348
01:31:40,639 --> 01:31:45,840
2100 square feet and the height of the
building is about 16 to 18 ft.

1349
01:31:45,120 --> 01:31:50,480
» I'm sorry.
>> 16 to 18 ft

1350
01:31:48,719 --> 01:31:52,800
» and that that building is to remain.
>> That is correct.

1351
01:31:51,199 --> 01:31:56,480
» And what purpose does that building
serve at this time?

1352
01:31:54,159 --> 01:31:59,760
» Uh that building houses uh current water
quality treatment where we are proposing

1353
01:31:58,480 --> 01:32:01,920
to add additional water quality
treatment to the facility.

1354
01:32:01,060 --> 01:32:06,719
[clears throat]
So that the existing facility will be in

1355
01:32:05,199 --> 01:32:09,920
continuous use as well. Is that
>> correct?

1356
01:32:07,440 --> 01:32:14,880
» Yes.
>> And you're going to show us where this

1357
01:32:12,239 --> 01:32:20,040
new structures are.
>> Yes. So this is the facility right here.

1358
01:32:22,239 --> 01:32:27,840
» Will will I'm sorry. Get that microphone
please.

1359
01:32:25,280 --> 01:32:30,159
» You can take it.
>> Hopefully this works.

1360
01:32:28,719 --> 01:32:35,360
» If you could just repeat what you said.
>> Yep. No worries. Yep. Thank you. Yeah.

1361
01:32:33,520 --> 01:32:39,600
So the existing facility is this one
right here where the prelim all wells

1362
01:32:38,000 --> 01:32:44,000
are currently go to this facility where
it gets preliminary treated where we are

1363
01:32:42,239 --> 01:32:48,639
proposing a new treatment facility which
is this box right here to house the PAS

1364
01:32:46,639 --> 01:32:52,800
treatment. So all wells would go to the
existing treatment facility go into the

1365
01:32:50,639 --> 01:32:55,679
proposed treatment facility and then out
to the distribution system.

1366
01:32:54,159 --> 01:33:00,080
» And then in addition to that building
there's also another accessory structure

1367
01:32:59,199 --> 01:33:03,760
for a tank.
>> Correct. The accessory structure is

1368
01:33:01,679 --> 01:33:07,600
right here which is the water storage
tank about 40,000 gallons.

1369
01:33:05,920 --> 01:33:14,000
» Okay. And then can you point to where
the S's Land Trust has their pavilion?

1370
01:33:11,679 --> 01:33:18,840
» Yes. So, their pavilion is right down
here, which I can show.

1371
01:33:40,239 --> 01:33:47,440
What number is that drawing?
>> Uh this is VT 103. So this second last

1372
01:33:44,639 --> 01:33:51,920
page on the set. So this is fire
apparatus turning radius sheet. However,

1373
01:33:49,679 --> 01:33:56,994
it's aerial image that could show
picture of the site. So currently the

1374
01:33:54,159 --> 01:34:00,639
land trustes pavilion right here
[clears throat]

1375
01:33:58,080 --> 01:34:03,880
where the existing facility is located
right here.

1376
01:34:04,239 --> 01:34:12,000
» We are about 750 ft away from the access
road. Uh, US 202.

1377
01:34:10,719 --> 01:34:14,320
» This is this is
>> right. So,

1378
01:34:13,040 --> 01:34:18,560
» be far back. Okay.
>> Well, I don't know if you guys have been

1379
01:34:16,480 --> 01:34:23,920
back to Rhinoceros Creek,
>> the pavilion. There's hiking trails. So,

1380
01:34:22,159 --> 01:34:30,320
we're going to come closer to the road.
So, the the access road to get into the

1381
01:34:26,320 --> 01:34:32,880
Renaos Creek. We're coming on that
coming close the road closer to the

1382
01:34:32,320 --> 01:34:37,840
pavilion.
>> Correct. We be going closer to the

1383
01:34:35,040 --> 01:34:40,480
access road still on the property of the
applicant's property.

1384
01:34:38,960 --> 01:34:44,560
» Okay. Thank you.
>> Is there currently an access road?

1385
01:34:42,960 --> 01:34:48,400
» Uh there's a currently an access road
and access easement all the way to the

1386
01:34:46,159 --> 01:34:53,360
facility from from US 2022.
>> And is there any any part of the plan

1387
01:34:50,639 --> 01:34:57,760
been large in that access road?
>> Uh not at this time. The turnaround

1388
01:34:55,840 --> 01:35:02,639
that's depicted in this this drawing,
the one I believe they have up there

1389
01:34:59,280 --> 01:35:05,920
now, is that turnaround presently in
place?

1390
01:35:04,400 --> 01:35:12,080
» The truck right here?
>> Correct. Yes. So, there is the um

1391
01:35:08,719 --> 01:35:15,360
parking area where there is a agreement
uh pending. We are working with the land

1392
01:35:13,520 --> 01:35:20,719
trust to provide an additional permanent
easement for the entire uh parking area

1393
01:35:18,159 --> 01:35:25,199
there for that turnaround.
>> Oh, is that parking area presently?

1394
01:35:23,600 --> 01:35:29,840
Yeah, correct.
>> Thank you.

1395
01:35:27,520 --> 01:35:33,120
» Just in terms of operational
capabilities, this is not a a fully

1396
01:35:31,520 --> 01:35:36,960
manned facility. I mean, there's one
person that comes to Violia maybe to

1397
01:35:34,960 --> 01:35:40,000
inspect per day. So, it's not [cough]
doesn't get traffic. Again, there's one

1398
01:35:38,719 --> 01:35:43,600
vehicle. It's not a fully manned
facility where it's manned full-time.

1399
01:35:41,679 --> 01:35:48,560
Someone from comes in what once a day
maybe if if that to to basically look at

1400
01:35:46,480 --> 01:35:52,560
the site and inspect
>> the existing building's coronation.

1401
01:35:51,920 --> 01:35:54,880
I'm sorry.
>> The existing building is coronation.

1402
01:35:53,840 --> 01:35:57,920
» Yes, there is chlorination
>> and then the carbon's going after the

1403
01:35:56,800 --> 01:36:01,679
chlorination.
>> Yeah. So the existing facility right now

1404
01:35:59,600 --> 01:36:05,760
is iron and maganesees removal. So
currently the water goes to the iron

1405
01:36:03,199 --> 01:36:10,480
magnes removal. Then it gets treated
right now with um a pH adjuster and

1406
01:36:08,000 --> 01:36:15,120
chlorine. then goes out to the facility
where currently we are proposing to put

1407
01:36:12,320 --> 01:36:19,040
the uh carbon vessels after the iron
maganesees relocating the chemicals to

1408
01:36:17,520 --> 01:36:22,080
the new building where the chemicals
will still be still be the last

1409
01:36:20,560 --> 01:36:25,280
treatment step but no change in
chemicals no change in dosage or

1410
01:36:23,679 --> 01:36:29,760
anything like that
>> and then after the treatment rather than

1411
01:36:27,520 --> 01:36:32,880
going directly back into the wells it
goes into the it proposed to go into the

1412
01:36:31,920 --> 01:36:34,960
storage facility
>> correct it'll go into the storage

1413
01:36:34,239 --> 01:36:38,800
facility
>> which is 30 foot high correct

1414
01:36:36,400 --> 01:36:42,800
» correct and then from there it goes back
to the existing building where there's a

1415
01:36:40,400 --> 01:36:48,080
booster pumps to hit to the distribution
system to meet the grade line of

1416
01:36:44,880 --> 01:36:53,600
Heritage Hills.
>> What is what are the slopes in the area?

1417
01:36:51,280 --> 01:36:58,159
» There are some steep slopes in the area
where the proposed building location

1418
01:36:55,280 --> 01:37:05,560
right now is located on maintain lawn
which is minimum steep slopes. However,

1419
01:37:00,719 --> 01:37:05,560
off to the west of the page

1420
01:37:06,480 --> 01:37:13,119
here,
there are several steep slopes in that

1421
01:37:09,920 --> 01:37:18,137
area which is going to be uh cleared for
staging and replanted for well

1422
01:37:14,960 --> 01:37:18,137
mitigation. [clears throat]

1423
01:37:18,960 --> 01:37:26,320
There should be a steep slope page I
believe on

1424
01:37:23,440 --> 01:37:29,840
» Yeah, I I did see it.
>> The height variance for the new building

1425
01:37:28,000 --> 01:37:32,639
or for the tank? for the tank.
>> The tank that's the hype area

1426
01:37:31,360 --> 01:37:36,480
» that is correct.
>> I got confused because I assumed that

1427
01:37:35,119 --> 01:37:40,880
the second building [clears throat]
was an accessory building,

1428
01:37:38,800 --> 01:37:46,560
» right? That you had a princip there's
two new uses for accessory uses. The way

1429
01:37:43,520 --> 01:37:52,080
they're that their application reads is
this new building is principal building

1430
01:37:49,440 --> 01:37:56,239
as well as the existing one.
>> Right? So the question for the B board

1431
01:37:54,480 --> 01:37:59,040
would be whether it's a pertinent to the
other one or whether it's its own

1432
01:37:57,600 --> 01:38:05,119
princip.
>> I think either interpretation is

1433
01:38:03,040 --> 01:38:08,800
» and do who [clears throat] owns the the
property that these buildings sit on is

1434
01:38:07,440 --> 01:38:11,520
owned by Heritage Hills.
>> Uh Viola

1435
01:38:10,000 --> 01:38:14,560
» viola that property
>> property

1436
01:38:12,000 --> 01:38:21,520
» and how what's the size of that lot?
>> Uh about 2.5 acres.

1437
01:38:17,040 --> 01:38:26,320
» Okay. What caused the contamination?
It's not is it is it is it is it

1438
01:38:24,238 --> 01:38:29,360
[laughter] so it's not that it's so
>> or what caused this that we're trying to

1439
01:38:27,840 --> 01:38:32,400
filter out? What what is I'm trying to
understand.

1440
01:38:29,920 --> 01:38:35,520
» P again POS is a chemical again what I
was stating earlier. It it was it's a

1441
01:38:34,000 --> 01:38:42,560
chemical that was used in non-stick
surfaces uh makeup back in the day fire.

1442
01:38:39,440 --> 01:38:46,719
Okay. So again, but used everywhere,
right? So over the course of decades,

1443
01:38:44,719 --> 01:38:49,440
these chemicals do seep into the ground
and seep into the

1444
01:38:47,679 --> 01:38:51,199
» How would they get to the ground? Yeah.
>> Your your pan.

1445
01:38:50,719 --> 01:38:52,560
» Yeah.
>> Right.

1446
01:38:51,600 --> 01:38:56,400
» Teflon pan.
>> Uhu. Every time you every time you walk

1447
01:38:55,199 --> 01:39:00,639
take something [laughter] you take
something false off of that it goes down

1448
01:38:58,480 --> 01:39:04,639
your drain and it doesn't disintegrate
and at some point in time it aggregates

1449
01:39:02,400 --> 01:39:06,639
enough for over enough parts per
million.

1450
01:39:05,119 --> 01:39:12,800
» Okay. So tired.
>> It's all [laughter]

1451
01:39:08,960 --> 01:39:15,760
the chemical that's treated on uh for uh
carpeting.

1452
01:39:13,600 --> 01:39:20,000
» Cor right. Exactly. I mean when you look
at if you if you look at problem

1453
01:39:18,000 --> 01:39:23,119
» if you look at PAS and just look at all
the what it's been used for it's

1454
01:39:21,840 --> 01:39:27,920
astonishing. So it's
>> vortex but but the thing you around here

1455
01:39:25,600 --> 01:39:31,840
we didn't have the industrial uses like
like Delaware right but

1456
01:39:30,080 --> 01:39:36,480
» here we have people washing their
washing their pants and we have you know

1457
01:39:35,440 --> 01:39:41,239
things
>> standing I think

1458
01:39:37,920 --> 01:39:41,239
» and there are

1459
01:39:41,280 --> 01:39:45,520
» uh products
>> that don't meet the require that you

1460
01:39:44,159 --> 01:39:48,880
know don't meet the state requirements.
Yeah, and you know back when I was doing

1461
01:39:46,960 --> 01:39:51,760
this right before COVID, okay, so when
we tested the wells, they're all some of

1462
01:39:50,400 --> 01:39:55,280
them met 10 parts per trillion, no
problem. But then all of a sudden now

1463
01:39:53,280 --> 01:39:58,800
they're a bunch that do not meet the
current EPA or parts per trillion. So

1464
01:39:57,440 --> 01:40:02,320
that's why we have to go and now install
these these these

1465
01:39:59,679 --> 01:40:05,800
» How many are how many of your five wells
meet the criteria?

1466
01:40:07,440 --> 01:40:13,760
» It it varies seasonally, but to get you
an answer, I'd have to go back and and

1467
01:40:11,840 --> 01:40:16,880
check. But there have been times when
these wells have tested above four

1468
01:40:15,520 --> 01:40:20,400
parts.
>> We are required to install this

1469
01:40:18,480 --> 01:40:23,199
treatment to meet the um
>> you ask if they tested.

1470
01:40:22,159 --> 01:40:25,280
» You have tested above.
>> That's why we're doing this project,

1471
01:40:24,400 --> 01:40:31,280
» right?
>> And with any luck, terrible tasting

1472
01:40:28,400 --> 01:40:35,119
heritage water will get better. Carbon
the carbon filter will take out some of

1473
01:40:33,600 --> 01:40:38,560
the excess chlorine that they already
put in that water. So that's why I was

1474
01:40:37,119 --> 01:40:39,920
» Is there any noise that emanates from
this facility?

1475
01:40:39,280 --> 01:40:43,360
» No.
>> No.

1476
01:40:40,560 --> 01:40:46,239
» Nope. So nobody up uphill or anything's
going to hear anything running or

1477
01:40:45,600 --> 01:40:50,320
» generator.
>> We're we're replacing the existing

1478
01:40:48,000 --> 01:40:54,960
emergency generator uh which is used to
power the facility in emergency when

1479
01:40:52,320 --> 01:40:55,920
lose power. But that emergency only does
right.

1480
01:40:55,360 --> 01:41:01,760
» Yeah.
>> Um and in terms of the and this perhaps

1481
01:40:59,040 --> 01:41:06,480
for the engineer in terms of the slopes
what what I'm concerned about frankly

1482
01:41:03,520 --> 01:41:09,760
the height of the proposed uh port of
storage.

1483
01:41:07,199 --> 01:41:16,400
» Yep. So in terms and looking at the the
fund the front sheet on on the

1484
01:41:11,600 --> 01:41:22,480
submission here of Burrings there are uh
I'll say a number is probably more is

1485
01:41:18,960 --> 01:41:26,880
certainly more than 10 uh properties
private properties I'll say behind the

1486
01:41:24,880 --> 01:41:31,920
facility.
So if you look at it, if I I'll say the

1487
01:41:29,520 --> 01:41:37,360
I'm taking the view that the front of
the facility just

1488
01:41:34,400 --> 01:41:40,560
is what faces route 202.
>> Yep.

1489
01:41:37,679 --> 01:41:45,920
» So now I'm taking what's the rear or the
back [clears throat] of the facility.

1490
01:41:43,119 --> 01:41:49,040
The storage tank is to be on the to the
right of it. Correct.

1491
01:41:48,000 --> 01:41:56,320
» Uh that is correct.
>> Right. So what is the slope of the of

1492
01:41:52,800 --> 01:41:58,400
the property going beyond where the tank
is going to be

1493
01:41:56,960 --> 01:42:00,880
» going way uphill
>> going away?

1494
01:41:59,280 --> 01:42:05,600
» Correct. It goes about several hundred
feet up. I believe it's 150 to 200 feet.

1495
01:42:04,159 --> 01:42:08,480
» I live neighborhood. That's Summit
Circle Lake Drive. That's the

1496
01:42:06,639 --> 01:42:11,520
neighborhood I live in. It goes way up.
Yes.

1497
01:42:08,880 --> 01:42:17,920
» Yeah. So is there [clears throat] have
you gone yourself or somebody from your

1498
01:42:13,920 --> 01:42:23,280
office to any of the streets that look
that would look down on the proposed

1499
01:42:20,639 --> 01:42:28,639
area because I want to get a view what
you know is there is there going to be a

1500
01:42:25,199 --> 01:42:34,000
an impact but on any of these residences
by a 30-foot storage tank. That's my

1501
01:42:31,520 --> 01:42:37,280
that's my point. We don't believe there
would be any impact due to the forested

1502
01:42:35,679 --> 01:42:42,719
area and the forested nature of this
entire facility and with the hill with

1503
01:42:39,679 --> 01:42:46,880
the forested aspect of there should not
be any uh impacts. However, I did not

1504
01:42:44,800 --> 01:42:50,480
personally look at
>> it's a 40,000gallon p.

1505
01:42:48,639 --> 01:42:55,119
» No, I understand. I just I just
>> and and this steep slope is

1506
01:42:53,840 --> 01:42:59,440
on both sides,
>> so there's not another not another hole

1507
01:42:57,360 --> 01:43:04,080
to put it unless you unless it came up
into this front corner.

1508
01:43:01,360 --> 01:43:06,960
» Um That would be the only possibility.
And so if your question is is why can't

1509
01:43:05,520 --> 01:43:10,320
it be over here?
>> No, I just want to make sure that

1510
01:43:08,320 --> 01:43:13,119
there's no impact on on the folks who
live up the hill.

1511
01:43:11,520 --> 01:43:16,719
» You know, it's you're going to see it. I
mean, even even with the slopes, it's

1512
01:43:14,960 --> 01:43:18,800
it's 40,000 gallons. You're going to see
it.

1513
01:43:17,040 --> 01:43:22,000
» What's the color of the tank
>> right now? It's proposed to be cobalt

1514
01:43:20,800 --> 01:43:26,480
blue.
>> Sure. Like the one in Shannrock.

1515
01:43:23,600 --> 01:43:30,639
» Yeah, they they all end up being blend
into the sky.

1516
01:43:29,040 --> 01:43:33,360
» Should be bending blending into the
trees.

1517
01:43:31,840 --> 01:43:36,639
Just curious. [laughter]
That's

1518
01:43:34,719 --> 01:43:42,080
» I know this uh facility has went through
the architectural review board and blue

1519
01:43:38,560 --> 01:43:45,040
was a caller, but they wanted to
>> Oh, boy.

1520
01:43:42,639 --> 01:43:48,159
» That's
>> And who's paying for this? I'm just

1521
01:43:46,560 --> 01:43:51,679
curious. This a state payment
>> rate payers after

1522
01:43:50,159 --> 01:43:55,199
» the customers. Customers.
>> So, at Heritage Hills, this is cost

1523
01:43:53,679 --> 01:43:59,199
going to be allocated amongst all the
and everybody who gets the water from

1524
01:43:56,480 --> 01:44:02,800
here. Well, Viola is a private
for-profit water company. Correct.

1525
01:44:01,440 --> 01:44:06,639
» We're regulated by the New York State
Public Service Commission. They set our

1526
01:44:04,320 --> 01:44:09,600
rates, right? And that's we're state
regulate.

1527
01:44:07,280 --> 01:44:13,119
» So, this project is part of your budget
of maintenance.

1528
01:44:10,719 --> 01:44:18,239
» Yeah. This is they submit a tariff based
upon their cost, which goes back. So,

1529
01:44:15,360 --> 01:44:20,080
your $50 going to be $52.
>> Yeah. Right.

1530
01:44:18,719 --> 01:44:24,719
» Yeah. What is it? I'm curious. What is
the cost of this facility? What's this

1531
01:44:22,560 --> 01:44:29,360
project going to cost? The overall cost
for this project is close to about five

1532
01:44:26,880 --> 01:44:31,840
million
>> estimated. Sorry,

1533
01:44:30,320 --> 01:44:34,719
» I understand. But it's just I just want
to have a general idea.

1534
01:44:32,719 --> 01:44:40,719
» Correct.
>> It is what it is.

1535
01:44:38,000 --> 01:44:44,320
» Subject to change. That's Yeah, that's
engineering estimate. We haven't gone

1536
01:44:42,320 --> 01:44:49,760
out with Fed.
>> Yeah. For more caveats with that.

1537
01:44:47,040 --> 01:44:52,080
» Just curious. Okay.
>> But there's probably people here who

1538
01:44:51,199 --> 01:44:55,840
want to speak.
>> Yes.

1539
01:44:54,159 --> 01:44:59,840
Okay.
So, um

1540
01:44:58,400 --> 01:45:00,880
Okay. So, we'll put it out to public
then.

1541
01:45:00,159 --> 01:45:04,159
» Yeah.
>> Okay.

1542
01:45:02,480 --> 01:45:08,000
Uh so, is there anybody here who wishes
to speak in regard of the application?

1543
01:45:06,000 --> 01:45:12,239
Please give us your name and address and
we'll also open up to the public online.

1544
01:45:10,159 --> 01:45:16,719
» Uh my name is Bob McGregor. I'm vice
president of the Summers Land Trust. Um

1545
01:45:14,960 --> 01:45:23,280
the property that we're talking about,
which is the SLwest property, is at 401

1546
01:45:20,320 --> 01:45:31,520
Route 202. Um, I think that's the
address you want. um as the uh uh part

1547
01:45:28,560 --> 01:45:37,119
of the owner of the uh property that
this is impact significantly.

1548
01:45:34,400 --> 01:45:42,080
Um I've got a couple of things that I'd
like to be able to cover with you and I

1549
01:45:39,520 --> 01:45:47,520
want to also provide you with a document
that will give you some more background

1550
01:45:43,840 --> 01:45:51,760
information so you know that this is not
a trivial project

1551
01:45:50,080 --> 01:45:56,080
as [clears throat] and an impact on the
community is going to be significant.

1552
01:45:54,000 --> 01:46:01,960
Also,
please give the applicant a copy, too.

1553
01:45:58,800 --> 01:46:01,960
» Thank you.

1554
01:46:05,679 --> 01:46:12,520
» And Tom Tuma, please.
>> Yeah, our building inspector there.

1555
01:46:17,199 --> 01:46:20,520
» Thanks, Bob.

1556
01:46:21,199 --> 01:46:27,520
» Thank you.
And like I said, please give the

1557
01:46:24,639 --> 01:46:31,800
applicant a copy if not already done so
so they could take a look and see what

1558
01:46:28,719 --> 01:46:31,800
you have.

1559
01:46:34,183 --> 01:46:41,679
[clears throat]
So um from the SERs Land Trust point of

1560
01:46:37,679 --> 01:46:49,040
view, we um would like you to deny these
variances. Um the reason for that is

1561
01:46:45,040 --> 01:46:55,360
that uh these variances are significant.
Um there's a 60 ft setback and they're

1562
01:46:52,480 --> 01:47:00,800
asking for a variance of 52 feet or over
52 feet. So they're going to come down

1563
01:46:58,000 --> 01:47:05,280
right to the property line of their
property. Um

1564
01:47:03,520 --> 01:47:11,040
and that's going to have significant
impact on how we use the Renosterous

1565
01:47:08,880 --> 01:47:18,560
Creek Reservation.
Um, we also believe that um the

1566
01:47:16,400 --> 01:47:25,280
variances that they're requiring or
they're asking for um are not necessary.

1567
01:47:22,880 --> 01:47:30,800
That as you've already heard uh they
have 2.6 acres of property. They're only

1568
01:47:28,320 --> 01:47:37,280
using about a third of an acre on the
front of the property um that abuts our

1569
01:47:34,639 --> 01:47:45,040
property. Now we abut the property on
three sides. The back side is part of

1570
01:47:40,880 --> 01:47:50,639
Heritage Hills uh property. So the
property across the front is 210 ft.

1571
01:47:48,719 --> 01:47:59,760
Across the back of the property up on
Heritage Hills property is about 220

1572
01:47:55,280 --> 01:48:07,760
ft. And they sit back 560 ft on one side
and 510 ft on the other side. So, it's a

1573
01:48:04,400 --> 01:48:14,560
section of property that provides them
with an opportunity to be able to put

1574
01:48:11,119 --> 01:48:23,199
the building, this new building, and the
uh water uh chemical chlorine water tank

1575
01:48:20,000 --> 01:48:29,280
um on their property without needing any
variances.

1576
01:48:24,880 --> 01:48:35,840
Um what we would ask is that the
uh this new facility be located behind

1577
01:48:32,639 --> 01:48:42,719
the existing facility.
Now when the first uh uh facility was

1578
01:48:39,280 --> 01:48:50,560
built in 1973
um it provided uh the pumping and some

1579
01:48:46,719 --> 01:48:55,679
treatment of the water. Um at a later
point in time they added an addition on

1580
01:48:52,719 --> 01:49:02,080
the back of that building uh and
expanded that building. Uh the what we

1581
01:48:59,040 --> 01:49:08,080
would like them to do now is to put this
new building behind the existing

1582
01:49:04,719 --> 01:49:13,360
building. So, our objective is not to
prevent them from having the building on

1583
01:49:10,560 --> 01:49:17,280
their property, but to move it to a
place where they don't need any

1584
01:49:14,960 --> 01:49:23,360
variances, where they have the
opportunity to be able to put their

1585
01:49:19,760 --> 01:49:27,920
building without significantly impacting
our property. This building, no matter

1586
01:49:25,920 --> 01:49:32,400
where it is on their property, will have
an impact on our property. And I'll talk

1587
01:49:31,040 --> 01:49:38,800
a little bit about that in just a
moment. Um and and I think it's

1588
01:49:35,440 --> 01:49:42,560
important that there's no hardship if
they have to move the building because

1589
01:49:40,560 --> 01:49:48,159
it's going to be on their property and
they don't need variances. We've also

1590
01:49:45,360 --> 01:49:53,679
talked about a couple of other and has
already been mentioned. Uh they have

1591
01:49:50,639 --> 01:49:57,600
already rejected um some options which
we have brought forwards for them.

1592
01:49:56,800 --> 01:50:00,719
» Question.
>> Yeah.

1593
01:49:58,320 --> 01:50:06,480
» Um the backside of their property
appears to be really steep. Were you you

1594
01:50:02,880 --> 01:50:08,400
saying you should put it like is if I'm
am I getting this right? Yes.

1595
01:50:07,716 --> 01:50:13,199
[clears throat]
Because there right here is where

1596
01:50:11,119 --> 01:50:15,840
they're putting it flat. And then if you
want them to be right here where it's

1597
01:50:14,719 --> 01:50:20,400
deep
>> well what am I missing?

1598
01:50:17,760 --> 01:50:25,199
» U it is steep back there but they should
be able to do excavation to be able to

1599
01:50:22,480 --> 01:50:31,600
get that in. Now we had suggested that
they come down on the front aside but

1600
01:50:28,800 --> 01:50:37,040
still need to be a variance for that but
that would move their building um to a

1601
01:50:34,000 --> 01:50:44,159
place which be much more palatable uh
that we could live with. Uh but they

1602
01:50:39,840 --> 01:50:50,800
rejected that. We also uh suggested move
it um uh to the side of the building.

1603
01:50:47,119 --> 01:50:56,080
They rejected that. So um since they're
rejecting all the options, the best

1604
01:50:53,600 --> 01:51:01,360
option from us and from our point of
view is to put this building behind

1605
01:50:58,800 --> 01:51:06,400
their existing building. They're capable
of doing excavation. I'm sure the

1606
01:51:03,440 --> 01:51:11,119
engineering company would be able to
determine how much that they would have

1607
01:51:08,480 --> 01:51:19,520
to excavate and could be able to put in
a uh retaining wall to the building in.

1608
01:51:15,760 --> 01:51:23,679
Um, so we don't want to jump to a
conclusion that says that you have to

1609
01:51:22,239 --> 01:51:28,719
put the building on the front of the
building right up to the property line.

1610
01:51:26,080 --> 01:51:34,080
It's going to have tremendous impact on
our property and basically make our

1611
01:51:31,280 --> 01:51:40,880
property unusable because our property
right now although it is open space is a

1612
01:51:37,840 --> 01:51:45,599
nature preserve. And as Mr. Newman has
already indicated we have hiking trails.

1613
01:51:43,440 --> 01:51:52,800
We have a pavilion. We do education
programs. Uh we do a lot of youth

1614
01:51:48,639 --> 01:51:58,400
projects on our property and uh we're
talking right now about the southeast

1615
01:51:54,880 --> 01:52:03,360
portion of the property. Um and I have a
map in this and we'll get to that in a

1616
01:52:00,239 --> 01:52:09,440
minute. Um
and um what we uh want to make sure that

1617
01:52:07,119 --> 01:52:14,400
everybody's aware of is that the Smers
Land Trust is a not for profofit. We're

1618
01:52:11,840 --> 01:52:19,280
an all volunteer organization and that
we provide tremendous service to the

1619
01:52:16,320 --> 01:52:24,400
community as volunteers.
So, this property is important to us

1620
01:52:21,920 --> 01:52:31,199
because this gives us an opportunity to
be able to do programs to do outreach

1621
01:52:27,280 --> 01:52:35,679
and invite people to a nature preserve
where they could get an opportunity to

1622
01:52:33,679 --> 01:52:42,639
get an understanding about how to deal
with nature, go out on hikes. Um, on our

1623
01:52:39,520 --> 01:52:49,119
property, we have, I believe it's the
only water cascade uh that's uh open to

1624
01:52:46,480 --> 01:52:53,440
the public in the town of Smers.
So, there's a lot of advantage to the

1625
01:52:51,599 --> 01:53:00,800
property and we would like to be able to
keep it open if this facility comes in.

1626
01:52:57,520 --> 01:53:05,920
Um, and again, there's a picture in the
handout I I gave to you which um shows

1627
01:53:03,920 --> 01:53:12,400
you what people are going to be looking
at when they drive in the property. Now,

1628
01:53:09,199 --> 01:53:16,480
the the driveway that they come in in
off of Route 202 uh belongs to the

1629
01:53:14,960 --> 01:53:22,080
Summers Land Trust. They have an
easement to be able to use that driveway

1630
01:53:18,880 --> 01:53:27,760
to get in and out of their property, but
it it it is our property. Their property

1631
01:53:25,679 --> 01:53:34,880
is landlocked.
So, they have the ability to be able to

1632
01:53:30,800 --> 01:53:40,719
uh draw the water and pipe the water um
from the wells on our property because

1633
01:53:38,080 --> 01:53:47,199
we have property on both sides. So, all
five wells are on our property.

1634
01:53:43,760 --> 01:53:53,520
Now, you ask about uh the the quantity
of water. Um they're permitted to draw

1635
01:53:50,480 --> 01:53:59,679
600,000 gallons a day.
Right now, they're running about 360

1636
01:53:56,000 --> 01:54:06,400
370,000 gallons a day. So, they have
capacity. Now, the five wells produce

1637
01:54:03,119 --> 01:54:10,639
that, but they do have from time to time
where they do go over 600,000 gallons

1638
01:54:08,719 --> 01:54:15,679
that they're drawing.
Um we we allow them access to the wells

1639
01:54:14,000 --> 01:54:21,280
which they are entitled to under the
easement. Um they're

1640
01:54:19,280 --> 01:54:29,040
from time to time they have to come in
and work on those wells. So they have to

1641
01:54:23,840 --> 01:54:37,280
cross our property. Um they have built a
driveway to get to their high high

1642
01:54:33,119 --> 01:54:44,719
pressure pipeline. Um they filled in a
area on a wetland. uh they put a

1643
01:54:40,159 --> 01:54:50,480
driveway in across that wetland. Um so
uh they do a lot of work and we do and

1644
01:54:47,840 --> 01:54:57,040
we partner with a lot of the day-to-day
staff. Now they talk about yeah only a

1645
01:54:54,080 --> 01:55:02,320
person a technician comes in once a day
maybe. Uh that's not true. The

1646
01:55:00,480 --> 01:55:06,400
technicians are in there two or three
times a day.

1647
01:55:04,400 --> 01:55:10,800
um that whenever they have a maintenance
issue, you have a maintenance team that

1648
01:55:08,480 --> 01:55:16,800
comes in to work on the pipeline. So,
there's often five, six, seven cars

1649
01:55:12,960 --> 01:55:22,320
there of people who are using um the
property to come in and and work on the

1650
01:55:20,000 --> 01:55:26,560
uh the equipment and the maintenance.
And I'm sure with this new facility,

1651
01:55:24,080 --> 01:55:31,599
there'll be even more of that. Uh you
talk about noise, um there is a fair

1652
01:55:29,760 --> 01:55:36,880
amount of noise from the existing
building. uh they have um large

1653
01:55:34,400 --> 01:55:43,760
ventilation fans which we hear quite
frequently. Um that's not going to go

1654
01:55:39,599 --> 01:55:47,840
away. So um we don't want this just to
be pushed through and get a variance

1655
01:55:46,320 --> 01:55:54,560
knowing that they have some other
options. Um

1656
01:55:51,280 --> 01:55:59,520
we've tried to work with VIA um in the
past but u

1657
01:55:56,960 --> 01:56:04,239
it hasn't been working out as well as we
would like. Um, a lot of the day-to-day

1658
01:56:01,920 --> 01:56:09,440
operations we have no problems with. The
technicians that are in and out, we know

1659
01:56:06,400 --> 01:56:16,320
them, they know us. We work together on
that. Um,

1660
01:56:13,280 --> 01:56:22,960
I would encourage you
before you make a decision to uh to come

1661
01:56:20,239 --> 01:56:29,679
and visit the site so you can see just
how this is going to impact us. Now, if

1662
01:56:27,440 --> 01:56:34,159
you look a little bit about the Summers
Land Trust, as I mentioned earlier, that

1663
01:56:31,840 --> 01:56:39,119
we do a lot of outreach and do a lot of
things for the members of the community.

1664
01:56:36,800 --> 01:56:44,719
Um, we will continue to try to do that,
but we need this property to be able to

1665
01:56:41,920 --> 01:56:50,080
continue to have that outreach.
Um

1666
01:56:46,719 --> 01:56:54,960
we uh we're talking about the um uh the
Southwest property and there's a map in

1667
01:56:52,560 --> 01:56:59,199
that handout which shows you exactly
where the the property is in

1668
01:56:56,719 --> 01:57:03,679
relationship to our property and you can
see it's a small cutout

1669
01:57:01,599 --> 01:57:10,480
um that shows
that um we have a a trail network. Um we

1670
01:57:07,920 --> 01:57:15,599
have people in and out of all the time.
Uh the Heritage Hills Hiking and Walking

1671
01:57:12,560 --> 01:57:22,880
Group is in all the time uh because it's
convenient for them. Um

1672
01:57:19,119 --> 01:57:27,199
the Northeast uh property is 60 acres.
It's on the other side of the road

1673
01:57:24,239 --> 01:57:33,040
opposite the Stonehouse. Um they have
three wells on that. Well, three, four,

1674
01:57:29,040 --> 01:57:37,360
and five. Um now the question was about
the wells that they have right now. The

1675
01:57:35,520 --> 01:57:42,239
wells that they have right now, they're
drawing water from only four of the five

1676
01:57:39,440 --> 01:57:46,639
wells. The fifth well they're not using
at this point in time. It's been shut

1677
01:57:43,760 --> 01:57:52,560
down because that's where the PAS are.
The other four wells are providing water

1678
01:57:49,520 --> 01:57:58,159
which are treated through the normal
treatment plant. So there's not an

1679
01:57:55,119 --> 01:58:03,440
urgency to make a decision immediately
because there's a crisis.

1680
01:58:01,199 --> 01:58:09,599
um they've got three year over three
years before they have to have a PAS

1681
01:58:06,080 --> 01:58:13,840
facility in place. So there's no rush.
We should take our time and do it

1682
01:58:12,159 --> 01:58:19,040
appropriately.
Um

1683
01:58:15,599 --> 01:58:25,360
the uh there's um a picture in uh the
this package that shows um what this is

1684
01:58:22,560 --> 01:58:31,599
going to look like. So it's a draw the
two pictures. So, from our pavilion, if

1685
01:58:28,960 --> 01:58:36,719
you look at this property, um you can
see in the background the existing

1686
01:58:33,679 --> 01:58:44,960
building, the new building is going to
be 37 feet tall, 56 feet wide, and it's

1687
01:58:42,239 --> 01:58:50,159
going to block most of the view of the
wooded area from our education and

1688
01:58:47,679 --> 01:58:55,679
pavilion center.
that setback on that building on the

1689
01:58:52,480 --> 01:59:01,840
left hand picture is only seven and a
half feet from the property line.

1690
01:59:00,000 --> 01:59:07,040
So, it's going to be right up there. So,
if somebody drives in and comes in,

1691
01:59:05,119 --> 01:59:10,719
they're going to be get just think about
it. You get out of your car and you're

1692
01:59:09,119 --> 01:59:17,760
looking at the building and you're going
to be looking up at a 37 foot high

1693
01:59:14,159 --> 01:59:22,320
building with a metal building.
When you drive in, the picture on the

1694
01:59:19,840 --> 01:59:28,960
right shows you what you're seeing.
You're walk you're coming in and you're

1695
01:59:24,560 --> 01:59:34,239
just seeing a big square uh blob in
front of you. So, when they talk about

1696
01:59:31,840 --> 01:59:38,320
the fact that it's just open space,
nobody's there, nobody's going to see

1697
01:59:35,920 --> 01:59:41,760
it, it's not going to be any problem,
you got to think about people who are

1698
01:59:40,000 --> 01:59:46,560
coming out and visiting our nature
preserved because they want to be

1699
01:59:43,920 --> 01:59:51,679
engaged with nature.
Coming into a situation where you feel

1700
01:59:48,719 --> 01:59:55,920
like you're in a warehouse situation
is not conducive to being in a nature

1701
01:59:54,880 --> 01:59:59,360
preserve.
>> A question for you just to interrupt for

1702
01:59:57,440 --> 02:00:04,480
a moment. What if the applicant were to
provide screening trees or something

1703
02:00:01,520 --> 02:00:08,159
else there that would soften that
building?

1704
02:00:05,040 --> 02:00:11,840
» They've only got 7 and 1/2 ft. What kind
of screening are you going to put in 7

1705
02:00:09,920 --> 02:00:15,360
and 1/2 ft? need seven and a half ft
between the building and the

1706
02:00:13,360 --> 02:00:19,440
» the property line and they've got to
have a walkway in there and they have to

1707
02:00:17,119 --> 02:00:22,239
have a fence. Are they going to put
>> some trees on your property?

1708
02:00:20,800 --> 02:00:25,840
» They could put some trees on our
property, but they've already indicated

1709
02:00:24,080 --> 02:00:27,760
that they don't have budget for any of
that.

1710
02:00:26,320 --> 02:00:32,000
» Okay. I'm just looking at the options.
>> So, so every time we've come up with

1711
02:00:30,239 --> 02:00:38,000
some things which we would like them to
do, it's always been we don't have

1712
02:00:34,560 --> 02:00:43,119
budget. the concrete base around the
building that we we asked at one point

1713
02:00:41,280 --> 02:00:49,360
in time, could you put Fieldstone on
that? No budget. So, that's the

1714
02:00:47,040 --> 02:00:54,880
frustration that we've had when we
asked, can you move the building down uh

1715
02:00:52,400 --> 02:00:59,199
so that it's less visible from our
pavilion in our education center? That's

1716
02:00:57,520 --> 02:01:07,599
when they come up and said it would cost
us more. We have no budget. So we're

1717
02:01:04,000 --> 02:01:12,880
we're looking at a situation where we
know that they can put it down further.

1718
02:01:10,719 --> 02:01:17,280
They still need variances or put it
behind the existing building. They don't

1719
02:01:14,880 --> 02:01:23,040
need any variances. the height of the
building could be also could be modified

1720
02:01:21,440 --> 02:01:30,800
because
when um I looked at a property or a a

1721
02:01:27,040 --> 02:01:35,360
facility down county uh by the airport
that they're building um they're they

1722
02:01:33,840 --> 02:01:41,440
have to do put in the same kind of
equipment. They needed a a three-story

1723
02:01:38,480 --> 02:01:45,599
building. So what they did was put the
first story underground.

1724
02:01:43,679 --> 02:01:51,119
So the building that they ended up with
is only two stories which is compatible

1725
02:01:48,159 --> 02:01:58,159
with the surrounding properties.
So there are things that you can do that

1726
02:01:53,920 --> 02:02:03,840
that reduce the impact on our property.
And that's that's what we're asking for

1727
02:02:00,400 --> 02:02:08,320
is don't have it in your face. Move it
move it back. Um move it in other

1728
02:02:06,800 --> 02:02:12,320
places.
Um

1729
02:02:09,119 --> 02:02:17,760
» excuse me one second. You mentioned the
um treatment plant down by the

1730
02:02:15,040 --> 02:02:21,599
Westchester airport. Is that the one if
you're going down 684 on the right hand

1731
02:02:19,679 --> 02:02:25,760
side that looks like a church?
>> No. Um it's a it's a different one. It's

1732
02:02:24,320 --> 02:02:32,800
uh just been approved. They're working
on that right now. Um, but I thought it

1733
02:02:29,840 --> 02:02:37,280
was creative that rather than having a
three-story building, which would be

1734
02:02:34,480 --> 02:02:42,320
incompatible with the the housing in and
the areas around it, um, they're putting

1735
02:02:40,080 --> 02:02:46,159
the first story underground, so it's
only going to end up to be a two-story

1736
02:02:44,000 --> 02:02:53,679
building. Now, it probably costs more to
do that, but from a but if if we're

1737
02:02:50,159 --> 02:03:00,000
purely looking at dollars and cents,
then why do anything other than you just

1738
02:02:56,880 --> 02:03:06,400
put in a a basic box with a with a
building and you can put it anywhere you

1739
02:03:02,400 --> 02:03:11,280
want it and um it can be an eyes sore.
Um the other piece is that you ask about

1740
02:03:09,199 --> 02:03:16,159
who's going to see this. Are the people
from Heritage Hills going to see it when

1741
02:03:12,880 --> 02:03:22,960
they look down on it? They may. But more
importantly, uh the people on Stonehouse

1742
02:03:18,960 --> 02:03:27,840
Road on 202 um eight months out of the
year are going to be able to see this

1743
02:03:25,119 --> 02:03:34,159
building. Um the people from the
Stonehouse will clearly see it. Um even

1744
02:03:31,679 --> 02:03:40,560
uh the Timones that are up the road on
202 will be able to look across and

1745
02:03:36,480 --> 02:03:44,560
they'll see the building. So, um, it's
not going to be out of sight and as

1746
02:03:42,880 --> 02:03:49,920
people drive into town, they're going to
see this building on the right as you

1747
02:03:46,800 --> 02:03:55,280
drive south on Route 202.
So,

1748
02:03:52,000 --> 02:04:01,840
what can we do to soften the view, make
it more palatable?

1749
02:03:57,440 --> 02:04:05,760
So what we're asking is um to deny this
variance

1750
02:04:03,520 --> 02:04:11,840
um at least at this point in time to see
if we can come up with another mo

1751
02:04:07,840 --> 02:04:16,960
another option. Um ideally we'd like it
to be put behind the existing building.

1752
02:04:14,080 --> 02:04:24,239
Yes, it's going to require excavation,
but um they do this all the time with

1753
02:04:21,280 --> 02:04:27,199
buildings in many other parts of of the
country and the state and and and in the

1754
02:04:26,400 --> 02:04:34,560
county.
>> The issue is if they spend more money

1755
02:04:31,360 --> 02:04:39,920
than our seniors inherited hills, we'll
get it in the rate. That's how the

1756
02:04:36,400 --> 02:04:45,760
tariffs work. So there, you know what
you're saying is it would be great if it

1757
02:04:42,080 --> 02:04:50,960
were down the hill, but there are going
to be people in heritage which are on a

1758
02:04:48,400 --> 02:04:56,080
limited budget and that delta is going
to be important to them. They're already

1759
02:04:53,360 --> 02:05:01,440
engineering looking at $5 million.
>> Y it's $6 million that may there's a

1760
02:05:00,159 --> 02:05:06,560
certain amount of people which are going
to be very much impacted by that. And so

1761
02:05:04,639 --> 02:05:11,760
I don't I I think you're going to find
that this board is going to be very

1762
02:05:07,920 --> 02:05:16,159
receptive to have doing some screening,
doing some things which are affordable

1763
02:05:13,520 --> 02:05:20,880
and thoughtful to try to make it uh more
attractive and and

1764
02:05:19,119 --> 02:05:25,520
me personally and I know other board
members agree like you have a wonderful

1765
02:05:22,880 --> 02:05:28,719
mission and we're thankful you're here
um and that you're local and that you're

1766
02:05:27,440 --> 02:05:31,920
providing the services that you're
providing and we want to commend you for

1767
02:05:31,119 --> 02:05:37,920
that.
There's there's got to be under [snorts]

1768
02:05:34,000 --> 02:05:44,239
our law utilities have um favor because
they're providing a public good

1769
02:05:41,280 --> 02:05:47,599
balance in how we approach that.
>> Understand that. That's why we first

1770
02:05:46,080 --> 02:05:53,840
proposed
um and um actually I presented a a

1771
02:05:50,560 --> 02:06:00,880
document to the planning board about
shifting the location of the building um

1772
02:05:57,360 --> 02:06:06,480
about 65 or 70 ft to the left of where
it is now. That screens it because then

1773
02:06:04,960 --> 02:06:11,280
you're not looking at it from our
property and there's there's trees and

1774
02:06:08,960 --> 02:06:14,239
shrubs that are behind that that this
building would be behind.

1775
02:06:13,679 --> 02:06:18,560
So,
>> and I I think Bart, you know, if I don't

1776
02:06:16,960 --> 02:06:21,199
know if you've been back there.
>> Yeah.

1777
02:06:19,199 --> 02:06:24,880
» Right. I mean, you know, when you if you
>> when you're driving in, you think where

1778
02:06:23,040 --> 02:06:28,480
where where would we not want a
building?

1779
02:06:25,920 --> 02:06:31,520
» It's where this one is. You say, put it
on this side, on this side, over here,

1780
02:06:29,760 --> 02:06:34,800
over here. It might be just
>> I see nothing but slopes here,

1781
02:06:32,960 --> 02:06:38,560
» right on the road. Well, I and but we we
need to look at what are the

1782
02:06:36,480 --> 02:06:42,400
alternatives, what are the obstacles to
the alternative because we haven't heard

1783
02:06:40,320 --> 02:06:46,719
anything about that. So, let's make sure
that we look at we get information on

1784
02:06:45,360 --> 02:06:49,360
» Oh, we got the we have the top too right
here.

1785
02:06:47,360 --> 02:06:52,800
» Excuse me. I got a question for the
applicant.

1786
02:06:51,599 --> 02:06:56,560
» You want the applicant to come back up
because that's got to come up to come

1787
02:06:55,360 --> 02:06:59,520
back. I got a question for you
>> because the applicant's going to have to

1788
02:06:57,760 --> 02:07:01,920
address all of these things that
>> Right.

1789
02:07:00,079 --> 02:07:05,599
» If you want, we can have public comment
finish and then we can address those

1790
02:07:03,840 --> 02:07:07,760
comments at the end if you want. I mean,
it's up to you.

1791
02:07:06,560 --> 02:07:09,040
» I'm going to want to hear from you,
right,

1792
02:07:08,079 --> 02:07:11,280
» about moving the building.
>> Yeah, we could talk about all those. So,

1793
02:07:10,159 --> 02:07:14,639
if you want to hear from the public and
then we'll back clean up

1794
02:07:12,480 --> 02:07:18,560
» those things. Screening, uh, put it
someplace else, dig out. You know, I

1795
02:07:16,239 --> 02:07:22,520
want I want you to go.
>> Yeah,

1796
02:07:18,880 --> 02:07:22,520
» we're done. Thank you.

1797
02:07:23,360 --> 02:07:31,920
» The difficulty is that if we lose the
ability to be able to use this property

1798
02:07:28,639 --> 02:07:38,000
as a nature preserve, we will lose the
ability to be able to get grants. We

1799
02:07:34,480 --> 02:07:43,119
will lose our volunteer base and we will
lose the ability for people people will

1800
02:07:41,119 --> 02:07:48,079
not want to donate because right now
they want to donate because we have a

1801
02:07:45,679 --> 02:07:53,840
nature preserve in town. You're
basically if this comes in the way it

1802
02:07:50,159 --> 02:07:57,599
is, it puts us out of business.
>> But that's rather drastic and I I don't

1803
02:07:56,320 --> 02:08:04,639
know that probably isn't going to
happen. But have you proposed something

1804
02:08:01,679 --> 02:08:05,760
that reduces the $5 million?
>> Yes.

1805
02:08:05,360 --> 02:08:10,639
» Okay.
>> Well, not like the five the $5 million

1806
02:08:08,400 --> 02:08:13,679
is for the what they're proposing here.
>> Yeah.

1807
02:08:11,280 --> 02:08:17,280
» What they have come back and say that we
propose to move the building further

1808
02:08:16,400 --> 02:08:20,400
down.
>> Yes.

1809
02:08:17,679 --> 02:08:25,280
» On their property.
Um, and they've come up with a figure

1810
02:08:22,960 --> 02:08:30,639
that said that that would cost them uh
$400,000 more to build the building

1811
02:08:27,840 --> 02:08:35,840
further down. That's 400,000 on a $5
million base. So, we're talking about

1812
02:08:33,440 --> 02:08:41,520
seven or eight or nine%.
So, yes, it may have an slight impact on

1813
02:08:38,880 --> 02:08:48,000
the rates. Um, but the rates have
already gone up for Heritage Hills

1814
02:08:43,280 --> 02:08:52,800
people. Um, and the other possibility is
that at some point in time they want to

1815
02:08:50,560 --> 02:09:00,880
expand, and they're starting to do that
now, to offer water to more of the

1816
02:08:57,760 --> 02:09:06,239
people outside of Heritage Hills.
So, they're going to get additional

1817
02:09:02,560 --> 02:09:12,239
monies in for that. So,
it that may offset any increases on the

1818
02:09:09,679 --> 02:09:15,599
Heritage Hills population. Well, I don't
I don't think that's what you're what

1819
02:09:14,159 --> 02:09:21,840
you're proposing here. What they're
proposing here is what they have put

1820
02:09:18,719 --> 02:09:26,960
out. And I'm saying the way to challenge
that, in my opinion anyway,

1821
02:09:24,400 --> 02:09:32,960
» is to say, "Wait a minute. I got a way
for you to do it cheaper. If you say

1822
02:09:30,000 --> 02:09:36,960
those magic words, and it's true,
they'll probably welcome you."

1823
02:09:35,119 --> 02:09:41,599
» Well, the problem is that I know that
they the size of the building. We've

1824
02:09:39,679 --> 02:09:47,199
talked to them. That's the size of the
building they need. No ma matter where

1825
02:09:43,920 --> 02:09:53,920
that building sits, it's going to cost
the same. The the uh water tank that

1826
02:09:51,440 --> 02:09:58,400
they want to put on the property, um
that's going to cost the same no matter

1827
02:09:55,920 --> 02:10:02,719
where they put it. So,
>> but that that isn't part of your

1828
02:10:00,079 --> 02:10:11,119
proposal. What you're proposing tonight
is say to them, okay, we turn down your

1829
02:10:07,119 --> 02:10:17,920
proposal. We have to reasonably tell
them why we did that. And if their

1830
02:10:14,000 --> 02:10:24,079
response is this is the least expensive
way that we can do that, we have to be

1831
02:10:21,440 --> 02:10:31,360
ready to challenge that. We have to say,
well, no, how about proposal one here,

1832
02:10:27,119 --> 02:10:33,840
which is $500,000 less. You'll probably
get their attention.

1833
02:10:33,199 --> 02:10:37,760
» Yeah. I I
>> I think the onus is on the neighbor to

1834
02:10:36,239 --> 02:10:41,599
get into the financials of their
construction projects.

1835
02:10:38,960 --> 02:10:46,400
» Well, it is it is Tom because we're
volunteers.

1836
02:10:43,119 --> 02:10:50,480
We're we're non-paid, so to speak. So,
we have a perfect right to do that. And

1837
02:10:48,480 --> 02:10:53,679
I think we should do that.
>> Yeah. I think that I think they should

1838
02:10:51,840 --> 02:10:57,840
state their hardship and and their
objection to the property. I don't think

1839
02:10:55,920 --> 02:11:00,880
they need to come up with the the
financial solution.

1840
02:10:58,560 --> 02:11:05,679
» Yeah. But I think it's a dollars and
decision. So we should have a dollars

1841
02:11:03,599 --> 02:11:13,119
and cents answer.
>> Well, it would if we follow that logic

1842
02:11:10,000 --> 02:11:19,360
then any project that anybody wants to
do can always say it's a hardship

1843
02:11:16,400 --> 02:11:24,400
because this is the cheapest. if if I
can't if I can't do it cheap, then I've

1844
02:11:22,320 --> 02:11:29,520
got a real hardship,
which is what they're telling us that

1845
02:11:27,040 --> 02:11:35,199
that you've got to go with the cheapest
solution that we can come up with and

1846
02:11:33,840 --> 02:11:42,880
that's what they're doing because they
keep saying they don't have budgets to

1847
02:11:36,880 --> 02:11:48,320
do things. Um, so there the approach is
if we can make it cheap enough,

1848
02:11:45,679 --> 02:11:53,840
don't worry about the neighbors.
Um, just make it cheap and then

1849
02:11:50,639 --> 02:11:58,880
everybody will be happy. But that's not
>> Yeah, but that but that's a foolish a

1850
02:11:56,320 --> 02:12:04,000
foolish path to follow. I wouldn't
recommend that. My recommendation is to

1851
02:12:01,440 --> 02:12:06,079
say, all right, they've already said how
much they're going to spend, how much

1852
02:12:05,440 --> 02:12:10,320
they can afford.
>> Right? If you're ready to come back to

1853
02:12:08,639 --> 02:12:15,520
them and say, "Wait a minute. Wait a
minute. We have a better solution,

1854
02:12:13,840 --> 02:12:16,960
» then we I should hear the better
solution."

1855
02:12:16,480 --> 02:12:20,480
» Okay.
>> So, this application is about setback,

1856
02:12:19,920 --> 02:12:24,079
right?
>> That's correct.

1857
02:12:21,199 --> 02:12:26,880
» Because the the height issue,
>> a water tower is a water tower,

1858
02:12:25,520 --> 02:12:31,119
» but they need a height variance also.
>> Yes. So, no, I know. But I'm saying

1859
02:12:29,360 --> 02:12:33,199
you're not going to change the water
water tower, right?

1860
02:12:32,000 --> 02:12:38,480
» They come how they
>> right. So every I I don't I don't see

1861
02:12:36,320 --> 02:12:43,119
that as an issue. The only the only
question which is really in front of us

1862
02:12:40,719 --> 02:12:51,280
is there is a a very large setback
issue. Um and it's 7 and 1/2 ft from the

1863
02:12:46,800 --> 02:12:59,040
property line where uh it should be 60
ft. Right? So that's really what's in

1864
02:12:55,199 --> 02:13:05,840
front of us. Um and the the mitigatory
things are this is a public good and you

1865
02:13:02,719 --> 02:13:11,679
know we have uh the the population it
impacts is our most vulnerable

1866
02:13:07,760 --> 02:13:16,960
population, right? It's our seniors. Um
and and so the costs have an impact, but

1867
02:13:14,320 --> 02:13:23,040
also the neighbors have there's
externalities here. Um, and so when

1868
02:13:20,639 --> 02:13:27,440
these gentlemen get up for me, I'd like
to hear them how they're going to deal

1869
02:13:24,480 --> 02:13:33,760
with those externalities, which is
sighteline from down below, and and what

1870
02:13:30,400 --> 02:13:39,360
they can do for screening. And hopefully
they have an answer to that. And I think

1871
02:13:36,480 --> 02:13:44,000
that you know I also want to hear from
the applicant because I think summer's

1872
02:13:41,840 --> 02:13:48,719
land trust is
valid points perhaps

1873
02:13:47,199 --> 02:13:52,800
uh
reciting

1874
02:13:50,560 --> 02:13:58,960
the proposed building
on what I'll say the the footprint not

1875
02:13:56,480 --> 02:14:03,520
the footprint that's not correct but the
area that we're talking about in terms

1876
02:14:00,719 --> 02:14:09,520
of the drawings in front of us perhap
because I see on on one drawing the

1877
02:14:06,000 --> 02:14:14,800
existing one frame uh one one-story
woodframe building is to be modified. So

1878
02:14:12,639 --> 02:14:21,040
how what's that modification? Is it
internal? Is it the size?

1879
02:14:18,079 --> 02:14:27,760
Can this can the proposed building be
turned and perhaps put where where the

1880
02:14:24,159 --> 02:14:34,960
above ground 40-gallon tank is proposed
and put that tank where the existing

1881
02:14:31,440 --> 02:14:40,719
backwash waste storage tank is located.
So there may be some alternatives

1882
02:14:38,400 --> 02:14:47,199
in the areas that we're talking about
and that's what I want to hear from you.

1883
02:14:43,520 --> 02:14:52,800
Now I the last page um in what I handed
you was the proposal that we made or we

1884
02:14:50,239 --> 02:14:58,639
brought forward to the planning board of
one of the proposals which we made which

1885
02:14:55,840 --> 02:15:06,960
was to relocate the building by moving
it 68 ft to the left of what what's on

1886
02:15:04,480 --> 02:15:12,320
your plan. It keeps it on their
property. Uh it's in an area which

1887
02:15:10,079 --> 02:15:16,079
they're already going to clear cut
because they're going to take down all

1888
02:15:13,679 --> 02:15:20,480
the trees and remove all the vegetation
because that's where they were going to

1889
02:15:17,280 --> 02:15:28,000
use it as a staging area. So it's
already been cleared. Um it allows them

1890
02:15:24,639 --> 02:15:32,560
uh a relatively flat space because it's
uh directly parallel to where they want

1891
02:15:30,400 --> 02:15:40,480
to put the building.
Um and that uh it also gives us a little

1892
02:15:37,760 --> 02:15:45,520
bit further set back from the driveway.
But key is by moving it that far and

1893
02:15:43,679 --> 02:15:51,760
flipping the building over to have the
lower end of the building towards the

1894
02:15:48,079 --> 02:16:00,880
entrance of of the property. um allows
us to have a a much it allows us to have

1895
02:15:57,199 --> 02:16:06,079
a view of the wooded area and doesn't
create that problem. They don't have to

1896
02:16:03,360 --> 02:16:12,880
put in any any additional vegetation or
buffer. Um if they if they do that um

1897
02:16:10,960 --> 02:16:19,360
now they rejected that.
>> Well, I don't mean to interrupt you but

1898
02:16:15,599 --> 02:16:23,599
okay. So, did you do the the financial
work for your proposal?

1899
02:16:21,679 --> 02:16:29,360
» I I don't have the capability of do
that. I'm I'm sorry. I just don't I'm

1900
02:16:25,760 --> 02:16:33,920
not an engineer. Um I can't do that. Um
and there's nobody within the land trust

1901
02:16:31,360 --> 02:16:38,080
that has that capability that can do it.
We're a not for profofit. We don't have

1902
02:16:35,920 --> 02:16:43,599
cash that we can go out and hire an
engineer to do a financial analysis of

1903
02:16:40,960 --> 02:16:48,399
that kind of proposal. Um
>> the answer is it's it's slightly steeper

1904
02:16:46,240 --> 02:16:53,120
and you got to run the pipes farther.
>> Yeah.

1905
02:16:49,840 --> 02:16:58,719
» So did there there's an associated cost
uh to to going that way

1906
02:16:56,719 --> 02:17:01,920
to help the view,
>> right? Whatever that number is, there's

1907
02:17:00,639 --> 02:17:06,639
a real associated cost.
>> Well, is that a missing number? Is that

1908
02:17:03,599 --> 02:17:12,080
a number we need to have?
>> I don't think so. I I I think I think we

1909
02:17:09,120 --> 02:17:15,120
can we can either we should hear what
the applicant has to say then we should

1910
02:17:13,599 --> 02:17:23,280
decide whether we think this something
we want to look at in the field. Um

1911
02:17:19,120 --> 02:17:29,679
and uh but but clearly you know it needs
to be it's a federal mandate they need

1912
02:17:25,280 --> 02:17:34,000
to build um and you know it's something
that we should uh get to approving. I

1913
02:17:32,160 --> 02:17:36,880
just don't know. I don't have enough
information and we'll see what the

1914
02:17:35,359 --> 02:17:40,559
applicant has to say whether they can
close the loop.

1915
02:17:38,399 --> 02:17:46,000
» I think Bart is right. The the federal
mandate so the applicant has to has to

1916
02:17:43,840 --> 02:17:51,280
build something
for the for the treatment for the

1917
02:17:47,519 --> 02:17:55,840
forever chemical and this is the area
that they own in town. So this is the

1918
02:17:54,080 --> 02:18:02,319
location that we're dealing with and so
that's can it be recited somewhere on

1919
02:17:58,880 --> 02:18:08,399
these plans? Is there screening that
perhaps would would work but would get

1920
02:18:06,240 --> 02:18:12,880
down to it something that has frankly
has to go forward in some form.

1921
02:18:11,040 --> 02:18:19,200
» And the problem is is they've done their
engineering at this point in time. They

1922
02:18:16,000 --> 02:18:23,679
would go back to if we said hey just
make the existing building bigger. Um

1923
02:18:22,240 --> 02:18:28,479
you know we'll give you you have that
space there. You're not in the setback.

1924
02:18:26,080 --> 02:18:33,439
They're now restarting their
engineering. you know, we're now putting

1925
02:18:30,559 --> 02:18:35,840
out, you know, four or five months and
whatever. Whatever.

1926
02:18:34,639 --> 02:18:41,760
» Why don't we hear why?
>> Well, this this has been characterized

1927
02:18:38,399 --> 02:18:45,679
as a noncrisis opportunity.
>> Now, there there there are two other

1928
02:18:43,359 --> 02:18:48,960
locations that they could put put their
treatment.

1929
02:18:47,200 --> 02:18:56,880
If you think about it, they do have
property at 250 um up across uh Heritage

1930
02:18:53,760 --> 02:19:02,080
Hills Drive um where the water tank is
right now. uh they have additional space

1931
02:18:59,280 --> 02:19:08,240
up there. Um so rather than treating it
at the at the lower end, treat it at the

1932
02:19:05,040 --> 02:19:14,639
upper end. Um also with the pipeline
which is about a mile long, uh the

1933
02:19:11,120 --> 02:19:19,599
Heritage Hills Society has uh vacant
land along that pipeline. So if they

1934
02:19:17,519 --> 02:19:25,439
wanted to, they could acquire land ac
along the pipeline or at the top uh

1935
02:19:22,479 --> 02:19:30,559
because their uh water tank is located
in the center with a with uh undeveloped

1936
02:19:28,960 --> 02:19:36,000
land around it.
>> Um so they could acquire property and uh

1937
02:19:33,760 --> 02:19:41,920
move their treatment facility. Um
>> they have their manpower coming here

1938
02:19:38,880 --> 02:19:44,399
every day. Like you're going to you know
and this is where they're doing their

1939
02:19:43,359 --> 02:19:49,040
treatment. And if you're going to push
them up the hill where they have like

1940
02:19:47,200 --> 02:19:54,080
that's that's a burden. That's something
which is really going to get into the

1941
02:19:50,640 --> 02:19:59,120
costs for the the rateayers. Um
>> I'm sure that their their engineers have

1942
02:19:56,640 --> 02:20:05,439
already consulted these options
>> and probably disposed of them or some of

1943
02:20:02,080 --> 02:20:12,720
your same logic. But I I think that what
we're missing is a comparative between

1944
02:20:09,840 --> 02:20:20,880
their cost. I happen to be a recipient
of their bills every month. So,

1945
02:20:17,760 --> 02:20:28,000
so you're dis you're only working on one
side of the equation. You need to know

1946
02:20:23,600 --> 02:20:32,479
what your alternative costs are
>> and quite certainly they have reviewed

1947
02:20:30,000 --> 02:20:35,439
the alternatives and will probably tell
us all about that.

1948
02:20:33,840 --> 02:20:40,640
» Yeah. rather than make a case for
anybody like to hear them explain to us

1949
02:20:38,560 --> 02:20:45,280
how they have rigorously looked at ways
to not impact the summer's land trust

1950
02:20:43,359 --> 02:20:49,520
» by placing this in other places and why
they ultimately

1951
02:20:46,720 --> 02:20:51,680
» have fair enough.
>> Yeah. Can I

1952
02:20:50,240 --> 02:20:57,120
» But Bob, you need to gohead.
>> I I noticed your on on your map of

1953
02:20:53,760 --> 02:21:00,160
Rhinoceros Creek have the green trail.
>> Yes.

1954
02:20:57,680 --> 02:21:05,200
» Like the green trail goes farther
through the back of the property, right?

1955
02:21:01,840 --> 02:21:08,640
» And continues around. Um, if you were to
put the building behind the existing

1956
02:21:07,359 --> 02:21:09,920
building, wouldn't that interfere with
the trail?

1957
02:21:09,280 --> 02:21:14,080
» No.
>> Okay. Enough room between the building

1958
02:21:12,000 --> 02:21:19,920
and the trail building.
>> Yeah. The existing building uh sits back

1959
02:21:17,840 --> 02:21:27,439
60 ft from the property line because
that's what the uh the DRD requires.

1960
02:21:24,880 --> 02:21:32,800
Uh the building is about 40t wide. So
the back of the building now is about

1961
02:21:30,000 --> 02:21:41,600
100 ft from the front of the property.
The property goes back 5 and um uh 10

1962
02:21:38,080 --> 02:21:46,399
feet on one side and 560 feet on the
other side. So it goes back. So even if

1963
02:21:44,319 --> 02:21:51,200
they were to put the building behind the
existing building, it would still be

1964
02:21:48,800 --> 02:21:54,240
four or five or three or 400 feet from
their back of their property.

1965
02:21:52,960 --> 02:21:57,840
» The trail
>> um it would be probably 250 300 feet

1966
02:21:57,040 --> 02:22:06,319
from the trail.
>> The trail. Okay. Um now the

1967
02:22:01,840 --> 02:22:14,240
trail and and the property I mean um
uh we acquired the property in 2017. It

1968
02:22:11,120 --> 02:22:23,280
was donated to us uh with the with the
idea that it would be a nature preserve.

1969
02:22:17,040 --> 02:22:27,359
Um and uh if we go back um the the
original building was built in 1973 or

1970
02:22:25,840 --> 02:22:34,720
thereabouts.
Um it was upgraded. Um the water company

1971
02:22:32,080 --> 02:22:38,319
had the opportunity to add to their
property if they thought they were going

1972
02:22:36,160 --> 02:22:43,680
to need it on several occasions, but
they did not did not do that. So when we

1973
02:22:41,280 --> 02:22:49,200
acquired it in 2017, the property was
for sale, but it was not acquired by the

1974
02:22:46,240 --> 02:22:56,240
water company at that point in time. Um,
so, um, we're trying to live with the

1975
02:22:52,720 --> 02:23:03,040
property and work with Violia on the
wells and all the stuff that they're

1976
02:22:58,319 --> 02:23:07,280
doing. Um, there is an advantage to us
keeping the property as a nature

1977
02:23:05,520 --> 02:23:13,840
preserve
because the aquifer runs underneath that

1978
02:23:10,479 --> 02:23:18,160
property from Croin Falls down south of
the hamlet. So, it goes down a little

1979
02:23:15,920 --> 02:23:25,280
further down. That's the aquifer that
they're tapping into. Uh the 115 acres

1980
02:23:23,120 --> 02:23:30,319
which we h we are using as a nature
preserve sits um almost totally on that

1981
02:23:28,560 --> 02:23:36,479
aquifer.
So we're protecting that aquifer by not

1982
02:23:32,880 --> 02:23:41,359
having that property developed.
I mean if you develop that property um

1983
02:23:39,520 --> 02:23:46,160
you could put all kinds of things. It
was going to be a lot of housing

1984
02:23:43,439 --> 02:23:50,960
development in there. Um, there was
going to be a shopping center uh on this

1985
02:23:48,800 --> 02:23:53,040
property here. Arie, you probably
remember that.

1986
02:23:52,160 --> 02:23:59,920
» I do.
>> Um, there was a lot of debate about

1987
02:23:55,200 --> 02:24:05,439
that. Um, that didn't happen. Um, but
that that property has been disturbed

1988
02:24:02,319 --> 02:24:12,560
for many years. Uh, uh, when they built
684, Lton Adams leveled that property

1989
02:24:09,120 --> 02:24:16,080
and excavated that property. Um, that's
why it's so loaded with invasives at

1990
02:24:14,479 --> 02:24:23,120
this point in time. It was totally
disturbed. Uh, we're trying to bring it

1991
02:24:18,479 --> 02:24:27,840
back. Um, we are protecting the ponds.
There are four ponds on the on the two

1992
02:24:25,280 --> 02:24:33,920
sides of the property that sit above the
aquifer. It's a shallow aquifer that's

1993
02:24:31,280 --> 02:24:38,640
recharged with groundwater. It's
probably good that the groundwater is

1994
02:24:35,680 --> 02:24:46,399
coming from ponds that are surrounded by
open space, not developed. Um, so in the

1995
02:24:44,479 --> 02:24:51,439
long term, that's probably good for
them. So, we're trying to be a good

1996
02:24:48,720 --> 02:24:58,319
citizen and trying to protect. So, that
should have some value, too. Um, if you

1997
02:24:54,560 --> 02:25:03,760
lose that capability of that aquifer,
um, then, uh, they're going to have more

1998
02:25:01,200 --> 02:25:09,439
expenses for the water.
So, there are a lot of things that need

1999
02:25:05,680 --> 02:25:12,720
to be considered in this. And
>> yes, sir, I think I'd like to hear from

2000
02:25:10,880 --> 02:25:16,160
the applicant though to address all of
the items you brought up because we need

2001
02:25:14,720 --> 02:25:20,240
to hear we need to hear you you've
brought up some options. I'd like to see

2002
02:25:18,720 --> 02:25:21,520
what the applicant has to say in regard
to those options.

2003
02:25:21,120 --> 02:25:23,600
» Okay.
>> So, just so we keep things moving along

2004
02:25:23,120 --> 02:25:27,600
here,
>> Vic. And before that, is there anybody

2005
02:25:26,000 --> 02:25:29,520
else, you know, right from the
community? Because then maybe they can

2006
02:25:28,880 --> 02:25:32,160
address everything.
>> Yeah. Anybody else here from the

2007
02:25:30,800 --> 02:25:36,080
community that wishes to speak in regard
to the application?

2008
02:25:35,040 --> 02:25:40,720
» Nope.
>> Do you want to go outside if

2009
02:25:38,880 --> 02:25:42,560
» Okay. Yeah, Denise, if you could put it
up on screen. It might have been up on

2010
02:25:41,840 --> 02:25:45,120
screen before. So,
>> yeah, it was up on screen and nobody

2011
02:25:44,240 --> 02:25:48,160
came on.
>> Okay. So, I think we're probably good on

2012
02:25:46,960 --> 02:25:52,080
that. All right. So, I'd like to hear
from the applicant. So, if you could

2013
02:25:49,680 --> 02:25:55,439
address all of those issues of moving
the building, can you put

2014
02:25:54,180 --> 02:25:58,800
[clears throat] it somewhat underground?
Can you put it in another location? Tell

2015
02:25:57,680 --> 02:26:03,200
us what you
>> Sure. So, I'll start to the legalities

2016
02:26:00,560 --> 02:26:06,479
of it and then I'll turn it over to Dan
and to Will as to the engineering. So,

2017
02:26:05,040 --> 02:26:09,280
let me just a couple of points. Mr.
Chairman, thank you for the opportunity.

2018
02:26:07,680 --> 02:26:13,120
I know it's a long night for you all,
but I'll try to be as quick as possible,

2019
02:26:10,960 --> 02:26:17,120
but you know, I know we mentioned like
hardship u at the end of the day, you've

2020
02:26:16,000 --> 02:26:20,479
all been doing this a while. You're a
zoning board. You're looking at area

2021
02:26:18,399 --> 02:26:23,200
variances this evening. Okay? This is
not about hardship. Hardship, they got

2022
02:26:21,840 --> 02:26:25,920
rid of that back in the early 90s when
they changed the zoning law. So, there

2023
02:26:24,800 --> 02:26:30,080
there's no there's not there's not a
hardship issue here. This is about an

2024
02:26:27,280 --> 02:26:33,439
area variance and I think the gentleman
here also mentioned that you know we are

2025
02:26:31,520 --> 02:26:38,080
a public utility. You know we have a
public health safety welfare issue that

2026
02:26:35,439 --> 02:26:42,640
we have to address.
Mr. McGregor mentioned that this

2027
02:26:39,600 --> 02:26:46,960
preserve is 115 acres. This this site
viol has had this in its predecessors

2028
02:26:44,479 --> 02:26:49,439
for decades as a water treatment. That's
not going to change. It's it's in the

2029
02:26:48,399 --> 02:26:53,359
middle of the preserve. We have
easements to use the roadway to get in.

2030
02:26:51,600 --> 02:26:56,960
We have to treat the water for the
federal mandates. There's nothing we can

2031
02:26:55,040 --> 02:26:59,840
do about that. And you know, with all
due respect to the the anecdotal

2032
02:26:58,479 --> 02:27:03,200
comments that were made, it's not going
to put them out of business. Okay,

2033
02:27:01,600 --> 02:27:06,240
Violia has been there. The water
treatment's been there. We have to treat

2034
02:27:04,560 --> 02:27:10,080
now a new chemical. That's what we have,
a new chemical that's in the water.

2035
02:27:07,439 --> 02:27:14,880
That's what we have to do. And another
point that was raised as utilities,

2036
02:27:12,640 --> 02:27:18,319
utilities have a a certain preference in
the law, especially when it comes to use

2037
02:27:16,319 --> 02:27:22,479
variances, different criteria altogether
and even so with area variances because

2038
02:27:20,479 --> 02:27:26,720
we are providing a public health safety
welfare which with all due respect

2039
02:27:24,399 --> 02:27:30,160
trumps viewsheds and trumps you know
what what you know in terms of again

2040
02:27:28,479 --> 02:27:34,000
there's no there's no you have no legal
right to a first of all and especially

2041
02:27:32,640 --> 02:27:37,600
when it comes to utility that's trying
to treat the water that needs to be

2042
02:27:35,439 --> 02:27:40,399
treated. This is something we have to
do. So again, I started the night by

2043
02:27:38,960 --> 02:27:44,080
saying, Mr. Chairman, members of the
board, we don't want to be here. We have

2044
02:27:42,160 --> 02:27:46,640
to be here. And you know, same thing
with costs. We talked about costs. We

2045
02:27:45,600 --> 02:27:49,520
know it's going to be half a million
dollars to do what their proposal is.

2046
02:27:48,080 --> 02:27:52,640
They're not engineers. They don't have
any empirical proof or data that was

2047
02:27:51,280 --> 02:27:56,640
submitted to you this board this
evening. We know what those costs are,

2048
02:27:54,960 --> 02:28:00,240
but even then, costs are not a factor
for this for this board. It's an area of

2049
02:27:58,640 --> 02:28:03,520
variance request. We're giving you that
just to tell you we we're not going to

2050
02:28:02,000 --> 02:28:07,760
shift the building, and we'll give you
the reasons why we're not going to do

2051
02:28:04,800 --> 02:28:10,720
it. But it goes to Yes. As if you look
the news, if you look at the governor in

2052
02:28:09,200 --> 02:28:14,560
the state, they're trying to lower
utility costs throughout. That's been a

2053
02:28:12,319 --> 02:28:19,120
policy from the state. We as a public
utility are trying to do that by

2054
02:28:17,040 --> 02:28:23,760
lowering the cost to do these facilities
and doing it in in the most

2055
02:28:21,680 --> 02:28:27,040
costefficient way possible. We're not a
developer in the sense that we're

2056
02:28:24,960 --> 02:28:30,560
building residentials properties or
retail establishments. We're utility.

2057
02:28:28,960 --> 02:28:35,439
We're providing again a service with
respect to water. And in in my world,

2058
02:28:33,439 --> 02:28:39,680
that that trumps a lot of things. Okay?
Same thing when it comes to electric but

2059
02:28:36,880 --> 02:28:44,080
water more so you know we we heard about
screening we would gladly do screening

2060
02:28:42,080 --> 02:28:48,160
and if if there's room we would gladly
do it as and to I know was mentioned

2061
02:28:46,880 --> 02:28:51,520
that we we haven't done anything we
rejected everything but when it came to

2062
02:28:49,920 --> 02:28:56,479
architecturals colors you know we did
work with the land trust and in terms of

2063
02:28:54,880 --> 02:29:00,319
screening we'll provide screening if if
we can do it we'll we'll do it but we

2064
02:28:58,800 --> 02:29:03,600
can't do a wholesale shift of this
building where we've engineered this

2065
02:29:02,000 --> 02:29:08,160
we've looked at this for months for
years at this with respect this site.

2066
02:29:06,240 --> 02:29:11,200
So, you know, this and by the way, you
you'll hear from the engineer, but

2067
02:29:09,280 --> 02:29:14,160
moving this property or the project to
the back, you have steep slopes. I'm not

2068
02:29:12,880 --> 02:29:17,520
an engineer, but I know I've been doing
this 30 years, more clear cutting of

2069
02:29:16,080 --> 02:29:21,120
trees. You're going to dig into the
slope. As land use guys, you got to try

2070
02:29:19,840 --> 02:29:26,640
to disturb the land as least as
possible. This proposal does that. Okay?

2071
02:29:23,680 --> 02:29:29,920
It puts the facility that is needed in a
spot on the property that's going the

2072
02:29:27,920 --> 02:29:32,640
least amount of disturbance. In terms of
secret, this is a type two action.

2073
02:29:31,120 --> 02:29:36,640
There's no environmental issues here,
right? This is a this falls under the

2074
02:29:34,880 --> 02:29:41,280
exemption under the less than 4,000
square feet of of a non-residential type

2075
02:29:38,560 --> 02:29:45,840
of use. That's what we're doing here.
You know, with with respect to,

2076
02:29:44,080 --> 02:29:48,479
you know, this thing about, you know, we
rejected, you know, we've been here a

2077
02:29:47,280 --> 02:29:53,120
long time. We've worked with the land
trust before and we will continue to do

2078
02:29:50,240 --> 02:29:57,920
it, but this type of project has to be
done. We can't shift it. We're not going

2079
02:29:55,760 --> 02:30:01,760
to shift it. This is this is what it is.
We I've said this to the planning board.

2080
02:29:59,600 --> 02:30:04,960
I've said this to your board. In terms
of cost, again, it's a half million

2081
02:30:03,120 --> 02:30:08,240
dollar expense, not relevant, but it
goes to the fact that someone mentioned,

2082
02:30:06,479 --> 02:30:11,840
I believe it was you, sir. It goes back
to the rateayers. That's unlike other

2083
02:30:10,319 --> 02:30:15,439
applicants that appear before your
board. So, without further ado, I'm just

2084
02:30:14,160 --> 02:30:18,560
going to have the engineer come up and
just explain some of these things that

2085
02:30:16,800 --> 02:30:22,399
we did look at. And just to show you
that what we're doing here is is really

2086
02:30:20,640 --> 02:30:25,520
what what the plan is. This is what's
been budgeted. This is what we're

2087
02:30:24,000 --> 02:30:29,439
looking at to reduce and keep those
values as low as possible. And again, we

2088
02:30:28,160 --> 02:30:33,280
understand that yes, there's going to be
a building there. But with all due

2089
02:30:31,520 --> 02:30:36,640
respect, with 115 acres of nature
preserve, this is not going to impact

2090
02:30:34,880 --> 02:30:40,880
that, okay? People are still going to
visit it. People are still going to walk

2091
02:30:38,319 --> 02:30:43,280
the trails. And this facility is not
going to prevent them from doing that.

2092
02:30:42,000 --> 02:30:45,680
And matter of fact, you're going to want
to see this facility because it's going

2093
02:30:44,319 --> 02:30:51,800
to treat that water for the very folks
that who live up there. So without

2094
02:30:47,359 --> 02:30:51,800
further ado, I'll turn this to to Will.

2095
02:30:54,080 --> 02:31:00,240
» Thank you. in regards to building
alternatives location. So let's start uh

2096
02:30:59,040 --> 02:31:04,319
take a look at the existing building
location as it stands currently. The

2097
02:31:02,560 --> 02:31:09,280
current building location right now is
proposed in a previously maintained lawn

2098
02:31:06,640 --> 02:31:13,439
area. So no additional tree clearing or
grading requirement in that specific

2099
02:31:11,040 --> 02:31:18,479
area to the west of the site. We are
proposing invasive specy removal tree

2100
02:31:16,080 --> 02:31:22,319
clearing for staging area. However, that
area will be put back as a wetland

2101
02:31:20,399 --> 02:31:25,600
buffer area in accordance with the town
regulations.

2102
02:31:23,840 --> 02:31:29,920
If we move the building to that area
into the west uh southwestern portion,

2103
02:31:28,240 --> 02:31:34,880
we would eliminate the wetland buffer
area as well as eliminate the definition

2104
02:31:32,080 --> 02:31:38,479
of the wetland buffer area for the town.
So that is just the one environmental

2105
02:31:36,399 --> 02:31:42,800
impact associated with that shifting of
the building. Along with that, the cost

2106
02:31:40,960 --> 02:31:46,960
for the grading of that portion of the
area. As previously mentioned, there is

2107
02:31:44,160 --> 02:31:50,880
some steep slopes in that area. There is
excessive grading and associated

2108
02:31:48,960 --> 02:31:53,840
requirements associated with that. As
previously mentioned, it was about a

2109
02:31:52,000 --> 02:31:57,840
half million dollar cost to shift that
building to that location, including the

2110
02:31:55,920 --> 02:32:01,280
additional grading, site clearing,
restoration, and related requirements

2111
02:31:59,520 --> 02:32:06,319
associated with new piping, new
conduits, everything else like that. In

2112
02:32:04,479 --> 02:32:10,880
regards to shifting the the building
behind the existing building, that's a

2113
02:32:08,800 --> 02:32:14,720
extremely steep slope back there. We
would have to grade about or the grade

2114
02:32:13,520 --> 02:32:20,000
difference between the top of the
building and the grade where we would

2115
02:32:16,800 --> 02:32:23,680
have to go is about 25 ft. That's
excessive amount of grading that would

2116
02:32:21,600 --> 02:32:28,880
be required and a giant retaining wall
that would be required that will be

2117
02:32:25,760 --> 02:32:33,840
visible from the road.
Overall, alternate areas have been

2118
02:32:31,520 --> 02:32:39,120
evaluated and their cost benefit has
been looked at where based off of the

2119
02:32:36,560 --> 02:32:44,960
site constraints, steep slopes, grading
impacts, driveways, etc., The location

2120
02:32:42,880 --> 02:32:49,920
of the building in previously maintained
lawn was determined to be most favorable

2121
02:32:47,760 --> 02:32:52,880
along with the building or the tank
location.

2122
02:32:50,800 --> 02:32:59,040
» Is there any basis at all for
considering another or this filtering

2123
02:32:56,240 --> 02:33:02,240
plant? I mean I I could see it, but is
there somebody else someplace else you

2124
02:33:00,640 --> 02:33:04,160
could put it that would be cost
effective or

2125
02:33:03,280 --> 02:33:08,560
» other than this site?
>> Other than this site, like along the

2126
02:33:06,399 --> 02:33:12,640
pipeline someplace at another tank
facility. Is there any other place that

2127
02:33:10,399 --> 02:33:16,399
it would make sense at all or is it just
I wouldn't think it would. You have to

2128
02:33:14,080 --> 02:33:21,200
» it's an integral part of the future
system. It has to be located where the

2129
02:33:18,880 --> 02:33:25,280
existing treatment system is before the
water is delivered to the customers. Any

2130
02:33:23,520 --> 02:33:31,120
other alternative location that was
suggested by the storage tank somewhere

2131
02:33:27,920 --> 02:33:35,280
you know down the pipeline the uh res it
it just we wouldn't be able to treat the

2132
02:33:33,520 --> 02:33:39,200
water before we deliver it to the
customer. So it has to be

2133
02:33:37,439 --> 02:33:41,680
» this is where it has to be. From a
treatment perspective, in terms of the

2134
02:33:40,800 --> 02:33:45,280
process, it has to be
>> there. There aren't options. Okay. I

2135
02:33:43,040 --> 02:33:48,319
just want to know that. No. And just
Sorry. Go ahead.

2136
02:33:46,000 --> 02:33:54,080
» All right. Getting back to what I wanted
to ask with this water storage tank.

2137
02:33:51,120 --> 02:33:57,200
Does it has to be
vertical,

2138
02:33:55,600 --> 02:34:00,640
horizontal?
>> Alternate arrangements have been

2139
02:33:58,640 --> 02:34:04,399
evaluated. However, due to the various
site constraints with the steep slope

2140
02:34:02,160 --> 02:34:11,680
and related requirements, the narrower
base was uh most favorable due to the

2141
02:34:08,000 --> 02:34:15,840
site impacts that would have uh in
relation to the height. The height of

2142
02:34:13,920 --> 02:34:20,240
the uh accessory tank would be
underneath the height of the proposed

2143
02:34:17,520 --> 02:34:23,280
building. So, the tallest structure on
site would still be the existing or

2144
02:34:22,000 --> 02:34:27,760
proposed building for PIA.
>> But can part of it be put underground?

2145
02:34:25,680 --> 02:34:31,840
So, this way it's not so high. There
would be conflict with the foundation

2146
02:34:29,680 --> 02:34:36,000
especially with the piping. So there is
rock in that area. So there would be

2147
02:34:34,240 --> 02:34:40,960
excessive amount of rock excavation
would be required and if we say 5 feet

2148
02:34:38,319 --> 02:34:44,560
10 feet below grade that's a significant
amount of area that would be necessary

2149
02:34:43,280 --> 02:34:47,680
to be removed
>> and I assume that the height of the

2150
02:34:46,080 --> 02:34:50,560
building that you're going to be
building it can't be any shorter than

2151
02:34:49,120 --> 02:34:53,120
that right I mean that's the size that
you need to run the facility right you

2152
02:34:52,640 --> 02:34:55,680
can't make
>> that is correct

2153
02:34:53,760 --> 02:35:00,960
» okay there's no option there once again
>> there are vessels like uh Lo described

2154
02:34:59,280 --> 02:35:05,120
that are required for treatment those
vessels have a minimum height we're

2155
02:35:02,960 --> 02:35:09,120
putting in. They don't come any smaller,
right? There's a certain capacity for

2156
02:35:06,720 --> 02:35:15,840
this facility. We have selected the
vessels to for that for the facilities

2157
02:35:12,880 --> 02:35:17,760
uh capacity, the withdrawal rate. We're
we're stuck with

2158
02:35:16,640 --> 02:35:19,680
» once again, we don't have an option.
>> We don't have a choice.

2159
02:35:18,800 --> 02:35:24,960
» Okay.
>> Now, as I mentioned before, um I guess

2160
02:35:23,359 --> 02:35:29,280
it's a water treatment plant that is
going down 684 by uh the airport. It's

2161
02:35:27,520 --> 02:35:30,720
on the right hand side down by White
Plains

2162
02:35:29,680 --> 02:35:33,680
» by the reservoir there. So, I was
talking

2163
02:35:30,880 --> 02:35:38,960
» by the reservoir. Now, is there any way
I never knew that that was a water treat

2164
02:35:35,920 --> 02:35:43,920
uh a water water plant. Is there any way
to soften this building up similar to

2165
02:35:40,960 --> 02:35:47,280
that like stone to make it look
>> looks like a stone house that

2166
02:35:45,040 --> 02:35:50,880
» stone house or I always thought it was a
church.

2167
02:35:48,880 --> 02:35:55,439
» So, um I guess what hasn't been
mentioned yet is before we started the

2168
02:35:53,200 --> 02:36:01,200
uh the planning board process, we met
with uh Mr. McGregor from the land trust

2169
02:35:58,160 --> 02:36:05,439
um a handful of times to discuss the uh
the proposal what what we were required

2170
02:36:03,120 --> 02:36:11,280
to do and we made some aesthetic changes
from the get-go to the building uh based

2171
02:36:09,439 --> 02:36:15,359
on comments that we directly received
from the land trust um and they've been

2172
02:36:13,760 --> 02:36:20,560
incorporated into uh
>> so there is some facade changes and some

2173
02:36:17,760 --> 02:36:27,359
» yes visual uh we colors we did some trim
work uh we made it look more barnlike

2174
02:36:23,520 --> 02:36:31,680
okay as best as we could Um, and you
know, Mr. McGregor mentioned he provided

2175
02:36:29,520 --> 02:36:36,080
a lot of comments to us. We respect
that. We understand where he's coming

2176
02:36:33,200 --> 02:36:42,240
from. We've incorporated the comments
that we can into the project up to this

2177
02:36:38,720 --> 02:36:51,200
point. what you can do. Um, and I heard
the the language from the attorney of um

2178
02:36:47,760 --> 02:36:56,560
was a binary I thought. Um if you if you
look at our code for DRDS and you go to

2179
02:36:54,479 --> 02:37:00,240
1712D4E,
it says water supply facilities, tanks

2180
02:36:58,560 --> 02:37:04,000
or towers, wastewater treatment
facilities and public utility stations

2181
02:37:02,000 --> 02:37:07,359
and buildings shall be in such a
location so as to be separated from the

2182
02:37:05,840 --> 02:37:12,640
outside perimeter of the entire
development by adequate topographical

2183
02:37:09,760 --> 02:37:18,720
andor landscape buffering. So, what I'm
saying, what you can do is you can do

2184
02:37:14,479 --> 02:37:23,840
landscaping. And I would like to see you
take another run with the land trust and

2185
02:37:21,680 --> 02:37:27,120
and doing landscaping. I know you're
right up against the border there, but

2186
02:37:25,600 --> 02:37:30,000
if they'll allow you to do landscaping
on their property, I'd like to see that

2187
02:37:29,439 --> 02:37:33,040
addressed.
>> You must have landscaped other projects

2188
02:37:31,840 --> 02:37:35,200
like this. So, I'd like to know what you
would recommend because these are tall

2189
02:37:34,240 --> 02:37:40,000
buildings.
>> What you would, you know, what? So,

2190
02:37:37,920 --> 02:37:44,399
Violia would be amendable to doing
landscaping uh based on the location of

2191
02:37:42,880 --> 02:37:49,040
the the building and our treatment
facility. We have eliminated it limited

2192
02:37:46,720 --> 02:37:54,319
space on our property. If the land trust
is amendable to it, I'm sure we could

2193
02:37:50,800 --> 02:37:59,359
work something out uh with uh with the
land trust to do landscaping on their

2194
02:37:56,479 --> 02:38:04,560
property. Uh disguise visually disguise
the impact of the building. Uh we are

2195
02:38:01,680 --> 02:38:09,359
also just disclosing this trying seeking
an easement from the land trust to use

2196
02:38:07,439 --> 02:38:14,720
their parking lot as part of the
construction process and then long-term

2197
02:38:11,680 --> 02:38:18,399
operations. That has not moved forward
because we're going through this project

2198
02:38:16,560 --> 02:38:23,920
process which is understandable. But
that would be an avenue for us to

2199
02:38:20,240 --> 02:38:26,479
incorporate the landscaping changes um
and make sure everybody's

2200
02:38:25,760 --> 02:38:30,720
» Are you [clears throat] willing to
adjourn your application for oh we don't

2201
02:38:29,120 --> 02:38:33,920
have an August pitch?
>> I mean we can condition that but we

2202
02:38:32,479 --> 02:38:36,880
really again because we have to get back
to the planning board so we can

2203
02:38:35,200 --> 02:38:41,280
condition it on doing some landscaping
and work you can condition your variance

2204
02:38:39,359 --> 02:38:44,399
inclined to do so but we have no problem
with that. Again we said I said in the

2205
02:38:42,640 --> 02:38:47,520
outset if we can do screening if they
allow us to do screen on their property

2206
02:38:45,920 --> 02:38:52,319
we've done it. I mean you could do some
evergreens you know kind of tiered

2207
02:38:50,240 --> 02:38:55,920
closer to the building taller lower you
>> and we by the way we have done that

2208
02:38:54,080 --> 02:39:00,800
» make it look natural evergreens that
would hide this building in effect it is

2209
02:38:58,720 --> 02:39:05,200
an eyesore there's no question about it
>> I have some questions for the for the

2210
02:39:02,560 --> 02:39:11,760
engineer if I may
>> sir in terms of the proposed building

2211
02:39:08,080 --> 02:39:17,600
and the existing [snorts]
why can't that gap be lessened

2212
02:39:15,520 --> 02:39:20,720
» so the gap between the existing building
proposed building meets the current

2213
02:39:18,960 --> 02:39:22,720
require uh variance the separation
between buildings half the height as the

2214
02:39:22,160 --> 02:39:27,280
tallest building
>> that's what I had thought so if we were

2215
02:39:24,720 --> 02:39:33,200
to if the applicant were to say and I
think this board may might be to grant a

2216
02:39:31,200 --> 02:39:37,920
variance you know
>> Tommy what is the what is the

2217
02:39:35,040 --> 02:39:42,720
» move it closer just spacing between the
buildings

2218
02:39:40,160 --> 02:39:44,479
» I'd have to double check the ft on the
plans right now

2219
02:39:43,680 --> 02:39:48,880
» what do you got
>> 19 ft between the two buildings

2220
02:39:46,640 --> 02:39:54,640
Yeah, you got you got zoning and then
you got state codes that mandate

2221
02:39:53,040 --> 02:39:57,680
» if you're going to less than that then
that gives you more room for screening

2222
02:39:56,800 --> 02:40:02,160
» they can
>> the area between the two buildings right

2223
02:39:59,840 --> 02:40:05,920
now is there is infrastructure between
those two buildings so piping there is

2224
02:40:04,080 --> 02:40:08,880
going to be a generator between the
>> I see

2225
02:40:06,319 --> 02:40:13,359
» trying to get equipment to it difficult
>> that because it's not in place it could

2226
02:40:10,960 --> 02:40:17,680
be shifted if
>> but you can you can I mean they could do

2227
02:40:15,280 --> 02:40:22,479
a brief way between the two buildings
and then your your building code issue

2228
02:40:20,640 --> 02:40:28,000
is mitigated
um and that changes how it can be

2229
02:40:26,000 --> 02:40:30,880
interpreted as one building and
therefore they can pull it in. I think

2230
02:40:30,000 --> 02:40:35,680
it's a great idea
>> because the the infrastructure that's

2231
02:40:33,359 --> 02:40:37,200
shown here that has to be built correct
between the two buildings

2232
02:40:36,720 --> 02:40:39,439
» correct
>> not existing so we're not talking about

2233
02:40:38,560 --> 02:40:42,800
moving
>> so there is some existing in

2234
02:40:41,040 --> 02:40:47,359
infrastructure between the two buildings
however most of it is going to be to tie

2235
02:40:45,040 --> 02:40:54,640
back into the existing building and uh
>> that's why I think that if you modify or

2236
02:40:50,800 --> 02:40:59,359
lessen that gap provide then the lot
line uh front yard variance would be

2237
02:40:57,359 --> 02:41:04,479
less
You also and would allow room for for

2238
02:41:03,840 --> 02:41:07,040
screening.
>> Yeah, it gives you more room for

2239
02:41:05,600 --> 02:41:09,600
screening. That's what I like. Move it
eight or 10 feet closer. That's a great

2240
02:41:08,800 --> 02:41:12,160
idea.
>> So, the separation between the Sorry to

2241
02:41:11,359 --> 02:41:16,240
cut you off. Yeah.
>> The separation between the two buildings

2242
02:41:13,600 --> 02:41:22,080
right now is to accommodate the repair
of such utilities. If an an if an

2243
02:41:19,760 --> 02:41:27,280
excavator needs to get into that area to
replace a section of pipe, that area is

2244
02:41:24,479 --> 02:41:31,200
utilized for that sole purpose. Could
that piping be brought out the side of

2245
02:41:29,200 --> 02:41:34,800
the building as opposed to what I'll
call the rear? Because here in the on

2246
02:41:33,280 --> 02:41:41,600
the plan is coming out from what I'm
calling the rear which is probably the

2247
02:41:37,920 --> 02:41:45,920
what northwestern side of the building.
>> Piping may be relocated on site.

2248
02:41:43,840 --> 02:41:49,120
However, it's going to be same um aspect
but right now we are proposing a

2249
02:41:47,280 --> 02:41:55,439
generator between the two buildings to
reduce the visual impact of generator to

2250
02:41:52,080 --> 02:42:00,479
the land to the access road. So
>> I you know I frank I understand that

2251
02:41:57,600 --> 02:42:06,240
engineering has been done but I guess my
looking at the the area here seems to me

2252
02:42:04,399 --> 02:42:11,200
that you can bring in you know an
excavator here if you if if the

2253
02:42:09,280 --> 02:42:15,359
infrastructure that's going to be built
could be put at the side of that I think

2254
02:42:13,760 --> 02:42:18,240
» but the pipe work in the breezeway as
well and

2255
02:42:16,160 --> 02:42:23,600
» right well but I think you're
>> there there's a well yeah I mean I think

2256
02:42:20,880 --> 02:42:27,359
you know we got we yeah I'm not hearing
a lot of solutions from the applicant

2257
02:42:26,880 --> 02:42:30,479
and the other
>> and I think I think we have an important

2258
02:42:28,800 --> 02:42:33,920
resource here in the town of Sers which
is the Soners Land Trust as an

2259
02:42:32,000 --> 02:42:37,439
organization and in particular Reasser's
Creek and in particular this section of

2260
02:42:35,600 --> 02:42:45,040
Renasser's Creek is an important
resource for the town. So, I'd like to

2261
02:42:40,560 --> 02:42:49,680
hear more solutions about how we can
do this better so that the town can

2262
02:42:47,040 --> 02:42:55,280
continue to enjoy that resource way they
always have and we can have clean

2263
02:42:53,439 --> 02:42:59,200
» and I don't I I just would like to see a
bit more effort on that

2264
02:42:58,479 --> 02:43:02,160
in that vein.
>> From my perspective, that's what I'm

2265
02:43:00,479 --> 02:43:05,359
trying to come up with solution with
screening because

2266
02:43:03,280 --> 02:43:09,359
» I would like to see the applicant
presenting solutions

2267
02:43:06,800 --> 02:43:14,160
» in that direction. The other question I
have the the the

2268
02:43:11,520 --> 02:43:18,800
existing backwater backwash waste
storage tank on concrete pad. What's the

2269
02:43:16,640 --> 02:43:22,640
size of that tank?
>> I believe it's a 12 foot diameter. It's

2270
02:43:21,439 --> 02:43:27,520
an above grade tank.
>> Right. And what's the capacity?

2271
02:43:26,080 --> 02:43:32,720
» I don't have off top of my head.
>> Can you just be a ballpark?

2272
02:43:29,439 --> 02:43:35,680
» I believe it's like 15,000 gallons
intake.

2273
02:43:34,399 --> 02:43:41,920
» I don't recall.
>> Okay. But is it and the the above ground

2274
02:43:39,680 --> 02:43:45,040
the proposed above ground tank is is is
40 40 40,000.

2275
02:43:43,439 --> 02:43:53,040
» That is correct.
>> Can that can that proposed above ground

2276
02:43:48,080 --> 02:43:59,120
tank 40 40,000galon tank be put where
the backwash tank is presently?

2277
02:43:56,960 --> 02:44:03,760
» The backwash tank is still necessary for
the iron and magnes. So we are not uh we

2278
02:44:01,680 --> 02:44:06,800
cannot remove that tank. a week.
>> What I'm asking, can essentially they be

2279
02:44:05,680 --> 02:44:11,520
flipped?
>> We would need to evaluate that area.

2280
02:44:08,960 --> 02:44:16,319
However, there is steep slopes area as
previously mentioned with

2281
02:44:13,279 --> 02:44:22,479
» but well I'm looking at the topo and it
seems to me they're similar 237

2282
02:44:20,000 --> 02:44:24,479
and 239 this two foot difference
>> but it's in service.

2283
02:44:23,760 --> 02:44:27,279
» Was that
>> in service? You're asking them to take

2284
02:44:26,160 --> 02:44:31,840
» Well, I I know but
>> I don't service. No, but I'm I'm asking

2285
02:44:30,000 --> 02:44:36,720
part I'm asking trying to come up with
alternatives because then I think the

2286
02:44:33,840 --> 02:44:40,000
proposed building would perhaps screen
the 30 foot tank.

2287
02:44:38,479 --> 02:44:43,840
» That's you know that's that's where I'm
getting at. And if there is going to be

2288
02:44:41,439 --> 02:44:49,920
a cost involved certainly but if if it's
a cost that's that's palatable to

2289
02:44:46,640 --> 02:44:55,920
mitigate that tank you know from
rhinoceros creek and also from route uh

2290
02:44:53,600 --> 02:45:01,279
202. I'm trying to find, you know,
trying to see if there's alternatives.

2291
02:44:58,080 --> 02:45:08,720
» I think the real complaint from the land
trust was this building sitting in front

2292
02:45:05,040 --> 02:45:15,640
and and you know, if you look at their
their depiction and I and your previous

2293
02:45:11,359 --> 02:45:15,640
idea, I think the best idea.

2294
02:45:23,920 --> 02:45:31,359
» Yeah. But Mr. Mr. McGregor also brought
up the point that essentially somebody

2295
02:45:28,560 --> 02:45:37,359
coming down from Crotonf Croin Falls
road not old cro will see that above

2296
02:45:34,640 --> 02:45:41,200
ground tank and that's why I'm saying if
they can if these two tanks can be

2297
02:45:39,040 --> 02:45:46,080
flipped then that above ground
40,000galon tank would be shielded

2298
02:45:44,160 --> 02:45:50,080
perhaps and I but I think more than
perhaps by the proposed building

2299
02:45:47,920 --> 02:45:54,800
assuming that the proposed building is
some built in somewhere in that

2300
02:45:53,040 --> 02:45:57,200
» just It's a it's a visual.
>> Yeah, I know. But it's it's

2301
02:45:56,080 --> 02:46:00,960
» Yeah. And just public good.
>> Yeah. Just also too from a legal

2302
02:45:58,720 --> 02:46:04,560
standpoint, we we have to get the least
amount of variances. So this board can't

2303
02:46:02,720 --> 02:46:07,920
say get another variance. You we
presented you with the setback and the

2304
02:46:06,000 --> 02:46:10,720
height. You know, we don't need that
variance right now because we we've had

2305
02:46:09,120 --> 02:46:14,160
the separation by state code and your
code. So telling us to basically go get

2306
02:46:12,800 --> 02:46:18,960
another variance is really not for the
ZBA to to to offer because we we're

2307
02:46:16,800 --> 02:46:22,960
we're giving you the minimum variances
that we need for this project, right? So

2308
02:46:21,600 --> 02:46:25,600
telling us to get another variance is
really not for the zoning.

2309
02:46:24,479 --> 02:46:28,240
» I'm just telling you, sir. I'm
>> No, I understand that

2310
02:46:26,560 --> 02:46:31,840
» and I'm asking I'm trying to find
>> No, I understand it. I'm just saying I

2311
02:46:29,920 --> 02:46:35,120
just I'm just saying I'm just
>> say that we're telling you to do

2312
02:46:33,120 --> 02:46:38,000
something. You're you're you're you have
your points and they're well taken.

2313
02:46:36,560 --> 02:46:40,240
» I understand, but I just I just what I
heard I just want to make sure I

2314
02:46:38,960 --> 02:46:42,479
understood correctly because what I
heard was asking us to get on the

2315
02:46:41,600 --> 02:46:44,000
variance and that's all that
>> that would be correct. Okay, that was

2316
02:46:43,760 --> 02:46:47,439
all
>> as as a potential alternative saying

2317
02:46:46,800 --> 02:46:50,920
that.
>> Yeah. Thank you.

2318
02:46:55,520 --> 02:47:02,160
And then the last question for the
engineer. What's what's the the

2319
02:46:59,920 --> 02:47:06,000
one-story woodframe building to be
modified? What's the modification?

2320
02:47:03,920 --> 02:47:10,399
» Uh several internal modifications are
being proposed for the um essentially

2321
02:47:08,800 --> 02:47:13,200
connections to and from.
>> So it's just it's all internal.

2322
02:47:11,920 --> 02:47:16,200
» Everything is be internal to it.
Correct.

2323
02:47:23,600 --> 02:47:30,080
So screening seems to be something that
you're amendable to and maybe working

2324
02:47:27,840 --> 02:47:33,040
with Rhinoceros Creek or the land trust
to

2325
02:47:31,600 --> 02:47:38,880
try to come up with a solution that
you'd both be happy at least assuming

2326
02:47:35,920 --> 02:47:42,920
everything stays where it is.
>> That's correct.

2327
02:47:39,920 --> 02:47:42,920
» Okay.

2328
02:47:47,359 --> 02:47:52,399
And that screening would be applicable
for not only the new building but for

2329
02:47:50,080 --> 02:47:55,399
the tank also.
>> Yes.

2330
02:47:55,520 --> 02:48:00,080
» You know I know they're pretty tall. So
I don't you know screening that would

2331
02:47:58,319 --> 02:48:05,359
hopefully grow over time that would get
up there or

2332
02:48:03,279 --> 02:48:07,520
» I mean some evergreens and some spruces
you know get will get that high. You

2333
02:48:07,040 --> 02:48:11,680
know, I mean,
>> we we could work with the land trust uh

2334
02:48:09,520 --> 02:48:13,840
landscape architect, figure out the the
right native landscaping.

2335
02:48:12,880 --> 02:48:18,479
» You know, it's not going to be 30 feet
on installation. I realize that, but you

2336
02:48:16,319 --> 02:48:22,399
know, it will grow and over the years it
will hopefully get up there and really

2337
02:48:19,680 --> 02:48:25,399
screen it well.
>> Yeah.

2338
02:48:29,439 --> 02:48:37,160
» Perhaps can we hear from Miss McGregor
what his take on screening would be?

2339
02:48:38,160 --> 02:48:41,600
Um,
>> I know you're not happy with the

2340
02:48:40,240 --> 02:48:44,240
location.
>> Yeah.

2341
02:48:42,080 --> 02:48:46,960
» If if we were to stay where it is, would
screening be something I assume you

2342
02:48:45,760 --> 02:48:52,399
would want?
>> Oh, [clears throat] if you if you go

2343
02:48:49,600 --> 02:48:58,800
that direction, clearly we would have to
have that because otherwise when you're

2344
02:48:56,640 --> 02:49:04,160
per our education programs or people are
coming in, they're not looking directly

2345
02:49:01,279 --> 02:49:10,000
at this big box.
Um [clears throat] so a couple of

2346
02:49:06,720 --> 02:49:18,720
interesting things that have come up um
which uh we could probably come up with

2347
02:49:14,000 --> 02:49:24,560
some options. Um but if you have if any
of you have not been there, I would

2348
02:49:21,600 --> 02:49:30,640
encourage you to visit the site um so
that you can see see it firsthand so you

2349
02:49:28,000 --> 02:49:37,200
have an idea and and [clears throat] so
if we can come up with some options that

2350
02:49:33,200 --> 02:49:42,319
may work, but unfortunately I think any
options we're going to come up with is

2351
02:49:39,600 --> 02:49:46,960
going to add some additional cost. So if
we do screening, it's got to be a fairly

2352
02:49:44,800 --> 02:49:53,680
extensive amount of screening which is
going to have a cost. Um

2353
02:49:50,720 --> 02:49:58,720
so and there there's a possibility that
maybe we could do some shifting of the

2354
02:49:56,160 --> 02:50:04,960
building a little bit um [clears throat]
that could could make things easier for

2355
02:50:01,920 --> 02:50:09,920
us um without adding a huge amount of
expense. So, I understand your point

2356
02:50:07,439 --> 02:50:15,439
that the the rateayers are going to end
up having to pay something for this. Um,

2357
02:50:14,080 --> 02:50:20,800
but if [clears throat] we're going to be
held to making it cheaper than what

2358
02:50:18,880 --> 02:50:26,560
they've proposed,
um, I don't think that we would ever be

2359
02:50:23,359 --> 02:50:31,760
able to do that. I think anything any
options that we might be able to come up

2360
02:50:28,479 --> 02:50:37,120
with that we could all live with are
going to have some cost.

2361
02:50:34,160 --> 02:50:43,840
So um maybe at this point in time from
my vantage point um I would like to

2362
02:50:40,560 --> 02:50:48,160
adjourn until your next meeting maybe
you can come to the site and for any of

2363
02:50:46,240 --> 02:50:54,800
you that haven't seen it so that you can
see it um and then um

2364
02:50:52,720 --> 02:50:57,520
we can try to see if we can work some
something out.

2365
02:50:56,160 --> 02:51:02,319
» The problem is we're not meeting in
August and it's it's a burden.

2366
02:51:00,000 --> 02:51:06,960
» It'll push it till September. Yeah. six
six days is a burden on on them. I

2367
02:51:05,600 --> 02:51:09,760
» Well, we'll ask the applicant what they
have to say about that, but I have a

2368
02:51:08,080 --> 02:51:15,200
feeling they're not going to like
>> then then I think it's kind of a useless

2369
02:51:12,880 --> 02:51:19,520
effort to try to do anything. They're
going to get what they want if

2370
02:51:17,040 --> 02:51:23,439
» we we don't look at anything.
>> So, he's mentioning cost. There's a big

2371
02:51:22,080 --> 02:51:27,279
difference in providing landscaping,
which we do mainly for these projects.

2372
02:51:25,439 --> 02:51:32,880
We do provide landscaping, which we'll
agree to do. It's one thing, you know,

2373
02:51:30,000 --> 02:51:35,920
cost landscaping is one thing. Asking us
to shift the building, redesigning it,

2374
02:51:34,399 --> 02:51:40,319
that's a completely different situation.
So, we we stayed on the record tonight,

2375
02:51:38,319 --> 02:51:43,680
we will work with the land trust. Again,
if you're inclined to grant the

2376
02:51:41,439 --> 02:51:46,560
variances, you can condition it that we
would plant evergreens, whatever

2377
02:51:45,279 --> 02:51:50,560
whatever the case may be, whether it's
on our property, the land trust,

2378
02:51:48,479 --> 02:51:54,479
assuming they consent to that, we we'll
do that. That's that's an easy one for

2379
02:51:52,960 --> 02:51:58,160
us to do because we've done that before
with other projects. We could do

2380
02:51:56,399 --> 02:52:01,279
screening. The cost is reasonable
compared to other

2381
02:51:59,279 --> 02:52:04,880
» incredibly immensely so compared to
having a wholesale redesign,

2382
02:52:03,439 --> 02:52:08,240
re-engineering, reshifting the building.
I mean, it's it's that that's something

2383
02:52:06,960 --> 02:52:11,520
screening is something we can do.
>> Well, we know the cost of that, right?

2384
02:52:09,439 --> 02:52:13,680
You said the cost of that is $500,000.
>> Shifting.

2385
02:52:12,000 --> 02:52:16,560
» The alternative. Oh, sorry.
>> So, we have an al we do have an

2386
02:52:14,960 --> 02:52:19,920
alternative.
>> It is a 10% variance in your current

2387
02:52:18,560 --> 02:52:25,520
budget.
So,

2388
02:52:21,760 --> 02:52:30,240
I think where I disagree with um
applicants's attorney was he was

2389
02:52:27,760 --> 02:52:36,319
suggesting that
moving the buildings closer together is

2390
02:52:33,439 --> 02:52:44,560
asking for another variance. But what I
was proposing was that if this portion

2391
02:52:41,279 --> 02:52:48,399
uh the carbon treatment was attached to
the other building and it's one

2392
02:52:46,240 --> 02:52:56,399
building, there's no there's no variance
whatsoever required.

2393
02:52:50,399 --> 02:53:02,720
» And he's now taken the the 60 ft which
is you know the the 52 foot variance and

2394
02:52:59,520 --> 02:53:08,800
he's taken it down by 19 feet which is
almost half the way there. and then I'm

2395
02:53:06,000 --> 02:53:13,520
feeling really good about it. Um, so I I
think that is and I don't I don't see

2396
02:53:10,800 --> 02:53:19,359
these things in the middle as having any
real cost impact. The cost impact is

2397
02:53:16,479 --> 02:53:23,200
that they've already done a design
like this and they'd have to start

2398
02:53:21,600 --> 02:53:27,200
» I mean can you abut the buildings right
next to each other or can you move them

2399
02:53:24,560 --> 02:53:29,279
if we're 18 ft apart can you move it
>> you can

2400
02:53:27,760 --> 02:53:30,960
» to within two feet and put the breezeway
in

2401
02:53:29,760 --> 02:53:33,200
» you can it's a little bit tricky on the
footing

2402
02:53:31,359 --> 02:53:36,000
» I mean I know you might have to redesign
what's involved but tell us

2403
02:53:35,040 --> 02:53:39,600
» your thoughts on that
>> correct so there will definitely be a

2404
02:53:37,920 --> 02:53:43,359
redesign aspect that would be necessary
for that we did look at uh joining the

2405
02:53:41,760 --> 02:53:46,880
building together initially just like an
expansion of the footing However, based

2406
02:53:45,200 --> 02:53:50,960
off of the initial investigations of the
building, that existing foundation is

2407
02:53:49,040 --> 02:53:54,880
not strong enough and not big enough to
house the additional treatment. So, a

2408
02:53:53,200 --> 02:53:59,120
connection like a breezeway between the
two buildings to be considered one

2409
02:53:56,560 --> 02:54:02,960
building may be an option to look at.
However, separation between the

2410
02:54:00,880 --> 02:54:08,399
buildings still is necessary for
equipment in the f uh excavators. Same

2411
02:54:06,960 --> 02:54:12,479
thing with the generator right now is
with buildings as well as additional

2412
02:54:10,640 --> 02:54:15,760
piping the transformers between the two
building related items.

2413
02:54:13,840 --> 02:54:18,160
» Now you bring in you mentioned numerous
times bringing an excavator.

2414
02:54:17,520 --> 02:54:22,640
» Yes sir.
>> The pipes that go from one building to

2415
02:54:20,080 --> 02:54:24,960
the other how deep do they go?
>> Typically the water mans about 4t of

2416
02:54:24,319 --> 02:54:26,479
cover.
>> Four feet.

2417
02:54:25,680 --> 02:54:32,960
» Correct.
>> They make small excavators that go

2418
02:54:29,920 --> 02:54:36,240
through pathways and open gates like
four feet.

2419
02:54:34,319 --> 02:54:38,720
But but they can if they have a
breezeway connecting it, they put it in

2420
02:54:37,600 --> 02:54:41,680
the breezeway. They don't they don't
have to bury them,

2421
02:54:39,760 --> 02:54:48,399
» you know, that change that changes the
whole thing. But but that's

2422
02:54:44,399 --> 02:54:53,520
the the question for the board is is um
where do we land on on this? I I don't

2423
02:54:51,600 --> 02:54:58,479
see the generator and these these other
things. I don't see them as monumental

2424
02:54:56,399 --> 02:55:03,520
issues. It's cheaper to build two
separate buildings because

2425
02:55:00,880 --> 02:55:07,840
that this one's going to, as he said,
has an inadequate footing as compared to

2426
02:55:06,640 --> 02:55:12,800
the weight that they're going to put on
this. And so they'd have to underpin and

2427
02:55:10,880 --> 02:55:19,279
go from one to the next. So there'd be a
little bit of structural but but nothing

2428
02:55:15,920 --> 02:55:25,600
nothing dramatic. It's it's doable. Um
or we can just say landscaping

2429
02:55:23,040 --> 02:55:29,680
screening, you know, and figure out what
how we want to do that.

2430
02:55:27,920 --> 02:55:33,680
» A couple just a couple questions. So you
have a you I know federal mandate has

2431
02:55:32,479 --> 02:55:36,000
been mentioned. There's there was a
state mandate also correct.

2432
02:55:35,279 --> 02:55:38,560
» They follow each other.
>> They follow each other.

2433
02:55:36,880 --> 02:55:42,160
» Okay. And what is the what is the
deadline for compliance?

2434
02:55:40,000 --> 02:55:44,800
» I believe right now it's 2029 to be in
operation.

2435
02:55:43,439 --> 02:55:47,840
» But we have to be
>> in service for one year.

2436
02:55:46,880 --> 02:55:52,640
» It's got to be in service and
operational for

2437
02:55:50,160 --> 02:55:54,560
» So it has to be built by 2028.
>> Operation by 202.

2438
02:55:53,840 --> 02:55:59,279
» That's right. Yeah.
>> 27. We got to start building. And when

2439
02:55:56,720 --> 02:56:03,840
how long I'm sorry how long in terms of
the proposal would the construction be?

2440
02:56:01,840 --> 02:56:08,080
I think I saw something a timeline
perhaps a year.

2441
02:56:05,279 --> 02:56:13,279
» Yes. In past experience about a year for
treatment buildings not if not longer

2442
02:56:09,920 --> 02:56:18,960
for uh uh commissioning and training
>> and and when did these these mandates

2443
02:56:16,319 --> 02:56:22,399
went into effect? When?
>> Okay. Does the wind

2444
02:56:20,399 --> 02:56:30,319
» and you started this particular planning
process for this enhancement when?

2445
02:56:26,560 --> 02:56:32,800
» 25. We started design back in 24.
>> I think our our first meeting was in

2446
02:56:32,319 --> 02:56:35,600
April
>> I believe. So

2447
02:56:34,000 --> 02:56:39,279
» we met internally then we had a client
board meeting but when was our first

2448
02:56:36,640 --> 02:56:41,359
meeting internally?
>> I believe it was like February or

2449
02:56:40,720 --> 02:56:46,080
January.
>> February February 26.

2450
02:56:43,760 --> 02:56:50,240
» All right. Does winter hamper your
operations? you want to pull something

2451
02:56:48,399 --> 02:56:53,439
» for construction. Yes. Especially with
uh concrete footing.

2452
02:56:51,359 --> 02:56:55,120
» Pouring concrete and and digging if it's
frozen ground or whatever.

2453
02:56:54,720 --> 02:56:58,399
» Correct.
>> You know, so the reason I asked some of

2454
02:56:57,200 --> 02:57:01,040
those questions, right, this is a big
project. Yes,

2455
02:56:59,200 --> 02:57:07,359
» it's an important project.
>> Um there are important neighbors as

2456
02:57:03,600 --> 02:57:13,200
well. Um this is been around for two
years. Um this mandate's been around for

2457
02:57:11,120 --> 02:57:19,439
two years. You guys have been working on
it for two years.

2458
02:57:15,600 --> 02:57:21,840
It's a couple years away and
we're saying we got to approve it

2459
02:57:20,720 --> 02:57:24,160
tonight.
>> That's a good question.

2460
02:57:22,560 --> 02:57:28,319
» There are people that have outstanding
concerns and issues. So, I just I don't

2461
02:57:26,720 --> 02:57:33,040
want to We're talking about a four-year
thing here. There's no zoning zoning

2462
02:57:30,720 --> 02:57:38,880
board meeting next month. I understand.
I understand that a 10% variance in

2463
02:57:36,160 --> 02:57:45,279
their initial in this budget is
unacceptable to them, right? Uh, a

2464
02:57:43,200 --> 02:57:50,319
two-month delay, I guess, is also
unacceptable. I mean, you know, it's

2465
02:57:48,640 --> 02:57:54,640
unacceptable.
What does that mean? Unless I get

2466
02:57:52,640 --> 02:57:57,920
exactly what I want, these things are
unacceptable to me. So, I'm having a a

2467
02:57:56,720 --> 02:58:05,120
little bit of a hard time swallowing
that. So, I think this is an important

2468
02:58:00,240 --> 02:58:09,600
project. This is clean water is of
utmost importance, right? But a

2469
02:58:07,840 --> 02:58:15,760
community's resources are also of
importance. So please, it's I I I don't

2470
02:58:13,359 --> 02:58:20,640
think rushing this through if there are
outstanding questions. I believe there

2471
02:58:17,439 --> 02:58:26,000
is an alternative. I believe the budget
variance

2472
02:58:22,800 --> 02:58:31,120
in in the scheme of things doesn't seem
overly significant to me. It's 10%. Um

2473
02:58:29,120 --> 02:58:36,880
it's certainly less significant than the
variances

2474
02:58:32,720 --> 02:58:42,880
um in terms of percentages. So I don't
know. I'm not, you know, I I'm not in a

2475
02:58:39,359 --> 02:58:46,960
position right now to to grant to, you
know, to vote to grant this particular

2476
02:58:45,439 --> 02:58:52,399
request.
Um, I'd like to see

2477
02:58:50,080 --> 02:58:57,680
if we can do better, but it it it
appears we can't. So, if it's a vote,

2478
02:58:54,240 --> 02:59:01,120
it's a vote. But and and again and I
respect what you're saying again if this

2479
02:58:59,200 --> 02:59:04,800
was any other application again for
anything other than a water utility in

2480
02:59:02,880 --> 02:59:07,760
this project. I hear what you're saying
but there's one person that came out

2481
02:59:06,399 --> 02:59:11,120
tonight again it's the land trust that
came out and said these concerns but

2482
02:59:09,439 --> 02:59:14,640
I've seen nothing scientific. I've seen
nothing empirical. I understand yes

2483
02:59:13,120 --> 02:59:19,120
there are concerns with respect to the
view but this project is not going to

2484
02:59:17,120 --> 02:59:22,880
take away from the land trust. It's not
going to take away from the preserve.

2485
02:59:20,800 --> 02:59:27,840
It's just it simply will not. And you
know, I I've read what they submitted.

2486
02:59:24,560 --> 02:59:32,960
Again, these are again the these are
again comments, opinions by an

2487
02:59:30,479 --> 02:59:36,720
individual. Okay. And and with all due
respect,

2488
02:59:34,960 --> 02:59:41,359
this again, I understand the concerns of
land. They provide a wonderful resource

2489
02:59:39,359 --> 02:59:46,160
for the for the town, but at the same
time, this is something that we just

2490
02:59:43,680 --> 02:59:51,040
have to do. And again, it's not that we
don't we discount it. We designed this.

2491
02:59:48,880 --> 02:59:53,920
We've been at this. And again, losing
two more months on this because then we

2492
02:59:52,640 --> 02:59:56,640
still have to go to planning board,
right? Because planning board's not

2493
02:59:55,040 --> 02:59:59,600
done. They it's been adjourned because
we have to get these variances here

2494
02:59:58,000 --> 03:00:03,120
first before we go back to the planning
board that there's no there's no reason

2495
03:00:01,760 --> 03:00:06,080
to go back there without this issue
resolved. And we we expressly told the

2496
03:00:05,120 --> 03:00:10,080
planning board that we're not
redesigning this thing. This is this is

2497
03:00:07,680 --> 03:00:13,600
our project. This is what it is. So
again, with all with all due respect, I

2498
03:00:12,160 --> 03:00:16,800
understand if I was Toll Brothers or
another project coming in, you're right.

2499
03:00:15,359 --> 03:00:21,120
It's it's not the end of the day, but
this is I have a time crunch here. And

2500
03:00:18,720 --> 03:00:24,640
again in 2028 I have to be fully
operational for one year for one year in

2501
03:00:23,200 --> 03:00:26,319
order to meet the EPA and state
guidelines.

2502
03:00:25,040 --> 03:00:28,080
» Yeah. No, I fully understand that. I
would have brought it to the zoning

2503
03:00:27,200 --> 03:00:30,880
board sooner.
>> And you know, we have other projects

2504
03:00:29,439 --> 03:00:34,800
throughout this throughout this region
that we have to and again this is not

2505
03:00:32,880 --> 03:00:37,200
when we go to these local towns,
communities. And by the way, I'm also a

2506
03:00:35,920 --> 03:00:41,520
town and village attorney. So I'm on the
other side of this sometimes as well. So

2507
03:00:38,720 --> 03:00:45,200
I get it. All I'm saying is, you know,
we h we have our our you know, this is a

2508
03:00:43,680 --> 03:00:48,160
big power that goes on with viol. Okay,
which projects need to go on? Which is

2509
03:00:46,640 --> 03:00:50,800
less complicated? And actually, this
turned out to be the least complicated

2510
03:00:49,600 --> 03:00:54,399
out of other projects that I'm dealing
with throughout the state on this

2511
03:00:52,240 --> 03:00:58,640
because it's it's a small facility and
it's it's an, you know, 1,700 square

2512
03:00:56,880 --> 03:01:01,760
feet and change in terms of the the
structure that's being built. We're not

2513
03:01:00,000 --> 03:01:06,000
talking massive structure here and we're
talking 115 acres like I said of

2514
03:01:03,359 --> 03:01:09,600
preserve. That's not going to change. So
again, I understand you don't meet in

2515
03:01:07,439 --> 03:01:12,800
August. I just need to move this. We we
need to move this along and again, we

2516
03:01:11,439 --> 03:01:16,640
respect the request that you grant the
variances. We can condition it on doing

2517
03:01:14,399 --> 03:01:20,160
the screening. We will do that. We'll do
evergreens. We'll do green giants.

2518
03:01:18,640 --> 03:01:22,880
Whatever whatever the land trust in
Viola can agree with, we're willing to

2519
03:01:21,760 --> 03:01:26,560
work with them because we're going to be
neighbors. We've been neighbors for

2520
03:01:24,000 --> 03:01:29,840
decades. So, that's not going to change.
>> The question this again for the engineer

2521
03:01:28,640 --> 03:01:35,680
because I think I just want to make sure
I heard it correct. I think Tom this may

2522
03:01:32,399 --> 03:01:40,960
uh be to your point. If the building is
moved to the left as proposed by land

2523
03:01:38,720 --> 03:01:44,479
trust, did you say that it then is in
the wetland buffer?

2524
03:01:42,479 --> 03:01:48,720
» So, this entire area is in the wetland
buffer. However, if we shift the

2525
03:01:46,080 --> 03:01:52,560
building to the western portion and we
build in that area, we would eliminate

2526
03:01:50,800 --> 03:01:57,200
the wetland buffer mitigation area that
we would be giving back to the wetland.

2527
03:01:55,760 --> 03:02:01,840
So, right now where the building is
located, we are removing the invasive

2528
03:01:59,200 --> 03:02:05,840
species and planting in native species
as well as this would be a continuous

2529
03:02:03,520 --> 03:02:08,960
part of that wetland buffer area. If
there's a fence line between that with a

2530
03:02:07,520 --> 03:02:14,800
building location, it would defeat the
purpose of the wetland buffer area.

2531
03:02:12,960 --> 03:02:18,960
I let me just
>> I guess you know this is for the this is

2532
03:02:16,399 --> 03:02:24,800
for the the applicant. Frankly I'm
struggling right now with uh

2533
03:02:22,640 --> 03:02:28,800
one of the criteria for an area variance
and that's whether the benefits sought

2534
03:02:26,399 --> 03:02:32,880
by the applicant can be achieved by some
method feasible for the applicant to

2535
03:02:30,560 --> 03:02:37,520
pursue other than an area variance. And
I think that you know Bart to to Bart's

2536
03:02:35,200 --> 03:02:42,800
point about
putting a breezeway and then there's you

2537
03:02:39,200 --> 03:02:42,800
know considered one building

2538
03:02:43,600 --> 03:02:51,600
Frankly, I don't know that that that
issue or that suggestion has been

2539
03:02:49,040 --> 03:02:59,160
adequately adequately
addressed by the applicant.

2540
03:02:53,680 --> 03:02:59,160
I would just like to say though um

2541
03:02:59,200 --> 03:03:08,640
small organizations like the land trusts
like small businesses

2542
03:03:05,040 --> 03:03:12,720
it's an individual it and their opinions
matter because without them those

2543
03:03:10,640 --> 03:03:19,200
businesses and those trusts and those
organizations disappear. A lot of our

2544
03:03:16,000 --> 03:03:24,319
enterprises are small and it's one
person leading it. It's two people

2545
03:03:20,720 --> 03:03:30,880
leading it. So it, you know, the we do
have to be cognizant even if there's no

2546
03:03:27,520 --> 03:03:37,040
empirical evidence and views aren't
protected, there is a a reason the code

2547
03:03:34,640 --> 03:03:41,680
puts the setbacks in there. And so we're
trying to we're trying to figure that

2548
03:03:39,040 --> 03:03:44,720
out. Um,
so

2549
03:03:42,560 --> 03:03:48,399
» how much of an imposition is it if we
were to say bring this build new

2550
03:03:46,800 --> 03:03:52,560
building closer to the existing
building? How much of a I mean is that

2551
03:03:50,479 --> 03:03:57,439
something that you if we conditioned our
approval on moving the building x number

2552
03:03:54,960 --> 03:04:02,240
of feet from the from the existing one
and with landscaping is that something

2553
03:03:59,920 --> 03:04:05,520
that is reasonable? Are we asking
something reasonable or are we not

2554
03:04:03,680 --> 03:04:07,680
asking something reasonable? I mean you
you probably have you have to redo some

2555
03:04:06,880 --> 03:04:11,439
of the plans, right?
>> Yeah, we so just speaking to the my

2556
03:04:10,240 --> 03:04:15,760
client, you know, they said we could do
the landscaping but we can't do the

2557
03:04:13,680 --> 03:04:18,640
pushing the building closer or or the or
the breezeway because it's just again

2558
03:04:17,120 --> 03:04:22,800
it's it's a redesign. It's going to
involve us to go back to planning, come

2559
03:04:20,720 --> 03:04:26,319
back here, and again, we just don't have
the luxury of doing that.

2560
03:04:24,640 --> 03:04:30,399
» What are the penalties if it's not an
operation timely

2561
03:04:28,560 --> 03:04:34,479
» penalties?
That's that's a tough one.

2562
03:04:32,399 --> 03:04:41,120
» Uh kind of hard to say, but I think
there's uh eventually fiscal penalties

2563
03:04:36,720 --> 03:04:44,720
from the Department of Health, fines. Um
>> I can't give you an exact number though,

2564
03:04:42,720 --> 03:04:48,000
but the complaint states are firm.
>> Yeah, I would I would expect there to be

2565
03:04:46,720 --> 03:04:52,000
penalty. As I said, what are the
penalties? That's one. There's financial

2566
03:04:49,840 --> 03:04:55,279
penalties. Correct.
>> Correct.

2567
03:04:52,560 --> 03:04:59,800
» Which go back to the rate payer
>> ultimately. Ultimately, right?

2568
03:05:01,439 --> 03:05:07,760
» I do just want to clarify that
[clears throat] the wetlands that they

2569
03:05:05,359 --> 03:05:12,319
have talked about when they put in the
driveway on [clears throat] that side,

2570
03:05:10,479 --> 03:05:18,960
um, they filled in a good portion of the
wetland to make that driveway. So what

2571
03:05:15,520 --> 03:05:26,080
was a wetland is now a p or a driveway
that's was filled in and is stone to

2572
03:05:23,200 --> 03:05:34,800
lead to get to some valves on their
pipeline. So if we're we we should look

2573
03:05:30,720 --> 03:05:40,319
at that and see that it's not as close
to the wetland as it it probably is on

2574
03:05:38,240 --> 03:05:45,439
plans that they've got because it's been
filled in. Um the president of the land

2575
03:05:44,000 --> 03:05:49,200
trust would also like to make some
comments.

2576
03:05:47,120 --> 03:05:51,760
» Okay. Sure. Sir, can you just give us
your name, please?

2577
03:05:50,479 --> 03:05:56,080
» Yeah. My [clears throat] name is um
Michael Barnhard. I'm president of the

2578
03:05:53,520 --> 03:06:01,760
Summers Land Trust. Um I just wanted to
clarify a few things. Um for one thing,

2579
03:05:59,840 --> 03:06:08,399
in response to uh the attorney's
comments about um one person, uh we

2580
03:06:05,520 --> 03:06:13,680
actually have a board and um we are
supported by the community. So you're

2581
03:06:11,359 --> 03:06:17,600
not hearing from just one person. Um
it's a considered opinion. Bob has been

2582
03:06:15,439 --> 03:06:23,040
the lead on this, but it's something
that the organization as a whole um has

2583
03:06:20,399 --> 03:06:27,359
been concerned about. Um Bob stressed
that there was an existential threat to

2584
03:06:25,200 --> 03:06:33,359
the land trust um by virtue of this
property. I think that was dismissed a

2585
03:06:30,319 --> 03:06:38,880
little too quickly um in some of the
comments that I heard. Um

2586
03:06:36,720 --> 03:06:43,359
the there are differing opinions about
the impact of this on our organization,

2587
03:06:40,880 --> 03:06:47,840
but overall you have to understand this
is our major property.

2588
03:06:46,080 --> 03:06:54,479
Uh we have one other property up on
Warren Street that we own. Um but this

2589
03:06:50,960 --> 03:06:58,880
is our our u shall we say our flagship
property. It's actually two properties

2590
03:06:56,960 --> 03:07:03,520
as you well know. It's on there's the
property on which this facility is

2591
03:07:01,520 --> 03:07:11,200
located and then there's the property
across the road which is another 60some

2592
03:07:06,560 --> 03:07:15,760
acres um or close to 60 acres. Um when
we originally acquired the property from

2593
03:07:12,960 --> 03:07:21,439
the Bashars we looked for a place to
locate uh where we would do um public

2594
03:07:19,359 --> 03:07:27,600
presentations and things like that. The
property is very constrained in terms of

2595
03:07:24,000 --> 03:07:34,080
public access and um also in terms of
available space in order to locate some

2596
03:07:31,439 --> 03:07:42,319
kind of gathering area uh that would be
a natural um easily accessible and a

2597
03:07:37,840 --> 03:07:46,399
sort of natural um gathering point. We
landed on the area where the pavilion is

2598
03:07:44,880 --> 03:07:51,200
now constructed that you can see from
202 as you drive um drive north and

2599
03:07:49,760 --> 03:07:56,560
south there.
um that is really the only area in the

2600
03:07:53,840 --> 03:08:01,040
property where we can manage to have
public programs. We were originally a

2601
03:07:58,880 --> 03:08:06,000
little leerary of that because of course
the treatment facility that the existing

2602
03:08:04,000 --> 03:08:11,520
treatment facility is right there and
quite visible. Uh we had always uh

2603
03:08:09,040 --> 03:08:17,279
looked for some kind of agreement to do
landscaping

2604
03:08:13,279 --> 03:08:22,000
um which has eluded eluded us so far. I
mean, I think um I don't think Bob was

2605
03:08:20,160 --> 03:08:28,720
suggesting that we wouldn't be immunable
to landscaping. We'd certainly be happy

2606
03:08:24,399 --> 03:08:34,080
to work with VIA uh in regard to that.
Um and it would be um it would be

2607
03:08:31,120 --> 03:08:40,720
definitely welcome. Um I think the
bigger problem is that you know you have

2608
03:08:36,960 --> 03:08:44,880
a major facility in terms of its size
and the original plan we were given it

2609
03:08:43,040 --> 03:08:49,840
was a blank facade. It looked
essentially like a big metal warehouse

2610
03:08:47,760 --> 03:08:55,560
planted right at the edge of their
property which is already very visible

2611
03:08:52,319 --> 03:08:55,560
from our

2612
03:08:55,680 --> 03:09:05,200
uh primary location for land trust
activities. Um and um so if it had gone

2613
03:09:02,960 --> 03:09:10,000
in if it went in like that some of the
aesthetic um uh changes that they've

2614
03:09:08,720 --> 03:09:15,600
made to the facade of the building are
very welcome and I think will help. Um

2615
03:09:13,520 --> 03:09:25,200
how wherever this thing is located on
the property but um the issue uh is that

2616
03:09:21,439 --> 03:09:29,920
um if you you know is already a
compromised property uh from our point

2617
03:09:27,439 --> 03:09:36,960
of view in terms of having this kind of
public location but we don't have any

2618
03:09:31,359 --> 03:09:41,040
other um and if you drive down visitors
uh the number of visitors you also drive

2619
03:09:39,520 --> 03:09:47,520
down the number of people who are
contributors to the land trust.

2620
03:09:43,200 --> 03:09:52,080
Um you also we also like many other area
organizations depend on other

2621
03:09:49,520 --> 03:09:57,600
organizations. Um in this case we have
uh reing isn't it rewing who runs

2622
03:09:55,600 --> 03:10:02,560
programs there. We get revenue from
those programs. We are a very small

2623
03:10:00,080 --> 03:10:09,760
organization. every revenue source is
incredibly important to us and the uh

2624
03:10:06,560 --> 03:10:14,800
base of uh members is also very
important to us and membership is driven

2625
03:10:12,560 --> 03:10:22,160
largely by people feeling that they are
getting some value out of visiting our

2626
03:10:17,200 --> 03:10:26,800
properties and things like that. So, um,
we, you know, it's it's it isn't I don't

2627
03:10:25,279 --> 03:10:30,240
know whether it's an existential threat
in the sense that we'll go out of

2628
03:10:28,000 --> 03:10:34,399
business, but it would put our, if it's
built as it's proposed, it would

2629
03:10:32,399 --> 03:10:39,439
definitely have a very negative impact
on our organization and it could indeed

2630
03:10:36,960 --> 03:10:44,160
lead to the point where we are really
struggling from a standpoint of revenue.

2631
03:10:41,920 --> 03:10:48,640
So, I didn't want that to pass by
without being commented on. Um I

2632
03:10:47,120 --> 03:10:53,040
appreciate all the issues that you guys
are raising. Um I think uh this board

2633
03:10:51,279 --> 03:10:59,040
has done an excellent job of reviewing
it and um you know I look forward to uh

2634
03:10:57,120 --> 03:11:02,200
the result. Thank you very much.
>> Thank you.

2635
03:11:05,359 --> 03:11:11,760
» Okay. I think we've uh exhausted the uh
public uh opinion regarding this. Does

2636
03:11:10,319 --> 03:11:16,840
the applicant have anything further to
say at this point in time or do board

2637
03:11:13,120 --> 03:11:16,840
members have further questions?

2638
03:11:17,840 --> 03:11:26,000
So I I I guess well well okay I guess
you've addressed moving the building

2639
03:11:23,520 --> 03:11:30,000
closer together would be a redesign of
the plans and a significant delay. I

2640
03:11:27,840 --> 03:11:35,040
mean I think we've
discussed that piping changes plan

2641
03:11:32,880 --> 03:11:40,399
changes blah blah blah. It seems like
both parties are amendable to

2642
03:11:38,880 --> 03:11:42,960
landscaping here and you working
together to come up [clears throat] with

2643
03:11:41,600 --> 03:11:45,680
something that both would be acceptable
to and maybe on

2644
03:11:44,319 --> 03:11:47,920
» not only your property but maybe on
their property

2645
03:11:46,080 --> 03:11:50,720
» and even as a condition we would include
that you know as that landscaping.

2646
03:11:49,600 --> 03:11:53,600
» I think at the very least I don't know
what the board's going to do but I think

2647
03:11:51,840 --> 03:11:58,960
at the very least the board certainly
condition approval with significant

2648
03:11:55,840 --> 03:12:02,600
landscape as approved or as discussed
with the land trust

2649
03:12:02,800 --> 03:12:08,800
board members. further discussions,
questions of the applicant.

2650
03:12:06,240 --> 03:12:14,479
» I guess from you know in terms of the
you know it's all I think well and good

2651
03:12:11,040 --> 03:12:18,880
to say yes conditioned on uh you know
landscaping.

2652
03:12:16,560 --> 03:12:25,840
I'd put I'd like to put some heat on
those bones [clears throat] because

2653
03:12:23,120 --> 03:12:30,479
it's all very well and good to say okay
you know we'll work with with with the

2654
03:12:27,520 --> 03:12:36,000
land trust but what happens if those
discussions break down and no

2655
03:12:33,040 --> 03:12:39,359
landscaping is put in there.
>> You do have a valid point.

2656
03:12:37,359 --> 03:12:41,200
» But but if if if we're truly
conditioning it,

2657
03:12:40,960 --> 03:12:47,200
» um
>> landscaping, they wouldn't meet it. But

2658
03:12:42,800 --> 03:12:49,680
» then they would have to um meet the
condition. Otherwise, the approval

2659
03:12:48,960 --> 03:12:52,640
wouldn't be valid
>> and they'd have to come back to us.

2660
03:12:51,359 --> 03:12:54,319
» They'd have to come back to us.
>> Yeah.

2661
03:12:53,120 --> 03:12:56,000
» Right. If the two of you can't agree on
the landscaping, you're both going to be

2662
03:12:55,520 --> 03:12:59,223
back here.
>> So what I would what I would what I

2663
03:12:57,600 --> 03:13:02,560
would suggest to to your point too, I
[clears throat] mean, obviously the land

2664
03:13:00,160 --> 03:13:06,479
trust is here. So if they because again
there's we have room in our very limited

2665
03:13:04,640 --> 03:13:10,319
room on the Violia side where we can do
things but you know there's more room

2666
03:13:08,000 --> 03:13:14,399
obviously on the landra side. So if they
consent to us coming on their property

2667
03:13:12,000 --> 03:13:18,800
and installing landscaping I think we
should condition that and as long as

2668
03:13:16,080 --> 03:13:21,200
they're here tonight to consent to that
should be in the resolution because that

2669
03:13:20,000 --> 03:13:23,840
way you've heard it on the record that
they would consent to us coming on their

2670
03:13:22,479 --> 03:13:27,120
property to plant evergreens or what
have you.

2671
03:13:24,240 --> 03:13:30,800
» I just don't think they're going to
I' I'd be surprised if everyone was

2672
03:13:29,439 --> 03:13:37,120
going to
be able to do the analysis to figure out

2673
03:13:34,160 --> 03:13:41,520
what trees were going where and how that
would work. I think there's going to be

2674
03:13:39,120 --> 03:13:46,800
a gestation period to understand the
viewsheds and what have you. And they're

2675
03:13:44,319 --> 03:13:53,120
going to want to be thoughtful about
non-invasive species and native plant

2676
03:13:49,840 --> 03:14:00,239
things like that. So I I think we I
think we can condition it. Um but the

2677
03:13:56,000 --> 03:14:04,640
question is is what is our mechanism? Uh
to enforce.

2678
03:14:01,840 --> 03:14:08,800
» I mean, if the applicant wants X and the
land trust wants Y and they can't agree,

2679
03:14:07,040 --> 03:14:12,000
» well, they can they can come back.
>> Then you haven't met the condition in

2680
03:14:10,399 --> 03:14:14,560
our opinion. You got to come back to us.
And we're

2681
03:14:12,640 --> 03:14:23,064
» How do we How do we write the
>> Are we are we saying is it is it for the

2682
03:14:17,840 --> 03:14:25,520
length of the building and then 30 ft of
[clears throat]

2683
03:14:23,600 --> 03:14:30,720
spaced out? We maybe we should just
condition it upon the applicant and the

2684
03:14:28,319 --> 03:14:34,479
land trust reaching a mutual agreement.
If you can't reach a mutual agreement,

2685
03:14:32,720 --> 03:14:38,960
we'll be happy to see them again here.
>> Not to to the mix, but maybe you work

2686
03:14:36,880 --> 03:14:42,319
with a building inspector to come to an
agreement to for landscape plan or some

2687
03:14:40,800 --> 03:14:45,840
kind of landscaping. I don't want to
make any more work for you.

2688
03:14:44,000 --> 03:14:48,479
» I'm [laughter] sorry. I know. That's why
I said, "Let me look to you."

2689
03:14:46,800 --> 03:14:52,080
» This is notector's problem.
>> No, I know. But I'm saying as opposed to

2690
03:14:50,399 --> 03:14:54,880
coming back here, obviously he has to be
satisfied and we have to I'm just

2691
03:14:53,600 --> 03:15:00,720
throwing it out there because I know
>> I mean I assume both fairly reasonable

2692
03:14:58,720 --> 03:15:03,279
» I'm going to chime in here. That's under
the architectural review board,

2693
03:15:02,560 --> 03:15:07,200
» right?
>> Landscaping for a commercial building

2694
03:15:05,680 --> 03:15:09,600
» and we were there and again like Mr.
Barard said, we did work with them on

2695
03:15:08,640 --> 03:15:14,160
the landscape I mean on the
architectural we did provide some way.

2696
03:15:11,439 --> 03:15:18,640
We worked with them requiring screening
that both parties agreed to. If we want

2697
03:15:16,160 --> 03:15:20,479
to leave it to ARB to reconcile that and
get it

2698
03:15:20,000 --> 03:15:23,040
» okay
>> final that be something reasonable.

2699
03:15:22,479 --> 03:15:27,600
» Yeah.
>> Um

2700
03:15:25,359 --> 03:15:31,920
» I mean planning boards do that all the
time. They leave it with somebody you

2701
03:15:29,359 --> 03:15:34,239
know they say go meet with our lady who
likes plants and

2702
03:15:32,720 --> 03:15:38,720
» and both are going to police each other
quite honestly in this situation.

2703
03:15:36,399 --> 03:15:44,239
» I don't have an issue with that. I mean
we we we could create some guidelines if

2704
03:15:41,600 --> 03:15:49,439
you if we thought that would be helpful.
that would have to happen before a

2705
03:15:47,120 --> 03:15:54,640
building permit is issued and building
begins as far as the ARB approving a

2706
03:15:53,279 --> 03:15:58,080
landscape plan
>> and the ARB knows we're requiring that

2707
03:15:56,640 --> 03:16:01,600
as part of our condition upon
>> right I would share that with them.

2708
03:16:00,000 --> 03:16:06,640
» Yes. But you have to understand that
these gentlemen have already stated

2709
03:16:03,359 --> 03:16:13,040
their their place. They said they came
here tonight decided apparently that

2710
03:16:09,439 --> 03:16:17,840
they would uh go along with with
landscaping and that's it. They're not

2711
03:16:15,840 --> 03:16:22,399
going anything else. The rest of what
they're bringing either take it or leave

2712
03:16:20,000 --> 03:16:24,479
it. That's the way they presented it to
me.

2713
03:16:23,040 --> 03:16:26,800
» Here's another thing too. We need an
easement from the land trust. So they're

2714
03:16:25,760 --> 03:16:31,359
not going to give it to us if they're
not happy with the landscaping. So

2715
03:16:28,640 --> 03:16:34,880
because we we so that's another lynch
pin for them as well because we we need

2716
03:16:33,359 --> 03:16:38,800
an easement from them. obviously from
Beijing. So they need to be satisfied

2717
03:16:37,359 --> 03:16:42,080
with the landscape they're providing if
we're going to get the eman. So again,

2718
03:16:40,479 --> 03:16:45,359
if they're not satisfied, we don't get
the easement. And so

2719
03:16:43,200 --> 03:16:47,200
» landscaping a lot to hide this thing.
>> Also in sir,

2720
03:16:46,800 --> 03:16:49,040
» yes,
>> in terms of

2721
03:16:47,920 --> 03:16:51,096
» you want to speak to the engineer now.
You didn't want to talk to me too much,

2722
03:16:50,000 --> 03:16:55,439
but it's okay. I'm just kidding.
[laughter]

2723
03:16:51,439 --> 03:17:01,439
» And in in terms of in terms easement, so
there would be uh an economic benefit to

2724
03:16:59,520 --> 03:17:05,080
the land trust would there not if they
were to give you an easement?

2725
03:17:05,840 --> 03:17:10,880
who would pay the money.
>> He's he's he's referring to the easement

2726
03:17:09,920 --> 03:17:13,920
for parking and
>> the one the easement that you see

2727
03:17:12,479 --> 03:17:17,840
» haven't negotiated the term.
>> Yeah, we don't know those terms are yet.

2728
03:17:15,840 --> 03:17:22,319
» What I'm because the land trust is
concerned with their finances which is

2729
03:17:20,000 --> 03:17:26,319
to me reasonable and I think that if if
if Viola is looking for an easement

2730
03:17:25,040 --> 03:17:29,319
there should be there should be
reinumeration.

2731
03:17:30,080 --> 03:17:33,080
Right.

2732
03:17:34,000 --> 03:17:39,680
» Improvements. Yeah. Improvements.
>> Correct.

2733
03:17:35,920 --> 03:17:42,479
» But we could expand upon that.
>> Do you have a plan in place if you don't

2734
03:17:41,279 --> 03:17:46,840
get the easement to do this
construction?

2735
03:17:43,200 --> 03:17:46,840
» Is not requment

2736
03:17:50,047 --> 03:17:52,066
[clears throat]

2737
03:17:52,720 --> 03:17:59,600
makes sense though if you look at the
site where the parking lot is and

2738
03:17:57,120 --> 03:18:01,680
long-term operations.
it. It's

2739
03:18:00,239 --> 03:18:04,160
» Do you have another place to turn trucks
around?

2740
03:18:02,479 --> 03:18:10,319
» We could take care of it on our property
and on our core area. If you do that,

2741
03:18:08,399 --> 03:18:14,160
» um take it on your property, it's
existing there, right?

2742
03:18:11,359 --> 03:18:19,279
» Our existing easements and property are
sufficient for us to construct and

2743
03:18:17,120 --> 03:18:23,680
maintain long-term the facility. There
happens to be a parking lot directly

2744
03:18:21,200 --> 03:18:28,800
across the street or across from our
property line, an existing parking lot,

2745
03:18:25,840 --> 03:18:32,560
which makes sense long term for these
trucks to turn around on.

2746
03:18:30,399 --> 03:18:36,800
» So, and I'm sorry, I didn't mean to
interrupt you, but what you're just

2747
03:18:33,840 --> 03:18:39,760
saying about improvements to that area
for the land that that would benefit the

2748
03:18:38,640 --> 03:18:44,319
land obviously.
>> Yes. And uh when we originally spoke

2749
03:18:42,080 --> 03:18:48,960
about it, like I said, uh the document,
the letter of intent as we call it, is

2750
03:18:46,319 --> 03:18:55,000
has not been signed, but um we did
include that type of compensation uh at

2751
03:18:51,760 --> 03:18:55,000
their request.

2752
03:19:03,279 --> 03:19:07,960
» Any further comments from members of the
board?

2753
03:19:08,800 --> 03:19:17,840
We ready to vote on this?
>> And the planning board has already said

2754
03:19:15,279 --> 03:19:20,319
it's type two. So we don't need a
motion.

2755
03:19:19,200 --> 03:19:22,399
» We just go directly.
>> They've already made that

2756
03:19:21,520 --> 03:19:28,239
» made that determin.
>> Yeah. Yeah. So we just put the

2757
03:19:25,680 --> 03:19:31,200
» Okay. Uh applicants. Good. No further
questions or no further comments. I

2758
03:19:29,920 --> 03:19:36,160
» think you've heard enough.
>> Okay. [laughter] I think we've all heard

2759
03:19:33,279 --> 03:19:43,279
enough of each other, right? So Okay. Uh
so keep in mind um the we have two

2760
03:19:39,120 --> 03:19:47,040
variances here and uh if we approve the
variances

2761
03:19:45,120 --> 03:19:49,840
uh we have to get specific with we're
not well

2762
03:19:47,520 --> 03:19:54,640
» yeah I have there's two separate
applications

2763
03:19:51,439 --> 03:19:57,439
so we need to vote on each application
as they read.

2764
03:19:55,920 --> 03:20:01,000
» Is that how you want to do it? Okay.
>> Yeah. All right.

2765
03:20:08,239 --> 03:20:11,239
All right.

2766
03:20:12,080 --> 03:20:18,080
Okay. So, the first one is for the water
treatment plant. The next one is for the

2767
03:20:15,279 --> 03:20:21,520
ground storage tank. Okay. So, item four
in the agenda is an application for

2768
03:20:19,600 --> 03:20:26,080
variance for a proposed water treatment
plant in RD district at 405 Route 2

2769
03:20:24,560 --> 03:20:33,600
Summers.
>> Okay. Do we have a motion in regard to

2770
03:20:30,640 --> 03:20:39,720
the um that
application and what conditions we might

2771
03:20:35,840 --> 03:20:39,720
want to put upon it?

2772
03:20:44,399 --> 03:20:53,800
» So here the required is 60 ft proposed
is 7 and a half the relief sought is

2773
03:20:49,760 --> 03:20:53,800
52.5 ft.

2774
03:20:53,920 --> 03:21:00,200
would like to make them.
>> What's the percentage on that? That's

2775
03:20:57,200 --> 03:21:00,200
87.5%

2776
03:21:00,319 --> 03:21:04,239
» variance. Correct.
>> Right.

2777
03:21:03,200 --> 03:21:07,279
» So significant
>> that would be considered significant in

2778
03:21:06,319 --> 03:21:10,880
our book.
>> Okay.

2779
03:21:09,200 --> 03:21:15,479
» So I would not I don't have a motion
because support that.

2780
03:21:15,920 --> 03:21:20,319
» Happy to make a motion to deny.
>> Okay.

2781
03:21:18,960 --> 03:21:23,520
» You can make a motion to deny and then
we could vote the other way or I don't

2782
03:21:22,399 --> 03:21:28,800
know. Bart, do you want to make a
motion? [clears throat]

2783
03:21:25,200 --> 03:21:35,439
I would u
make a motion to approve

2784
03:21:31,439 --> 03:21:42,880
the setback as submitted on the
condition

2785
03:21:38,160 --> 03:21:47,840
that um applicant provide uh screening
and landscaping

2786
03:21:44,880 --> 03:21:54,800
um to mitigate
the proximity to the adjoining property

2787
03:21:51,040 --> 03:22:01,680
and the edge of the DRD.
Um

2788
03:21:57,040 --> 03:22:08,399
and that such planting and screening be
approved by our ARB and

2789
03:22:06,880 --> 03:22:13,200
uh that this variance be conditioned
upon that approval

2790
03:22:10,640 --> 03:22:16,880
» and hopefully the ARB will consult with
the land trust regarding this.

2791
03:22:15,040 --> 03:22:21,040
» Well, we could we could also have that.
>> Oh, I'll make sure.

2792
03:22:18,399 --> 03:22:24,549
» Okay. [laughter]
>> Second.

2793
03:22:22,529 --> 03:22:24,549
» [clears throat]

2794
03:22:25,040 --> 03:22:31,760
» Okay. Bart and Tom.
Mr. Burke.

2795
03:22:30,399 --> 03:22:34,960
» Hi.
>> Misty Pledo.

2796
03:22:33,600 --> 03:22:37,359
» I.
>> Mr. Guio.

2797
03:22:36,080 --> 03:22:41,479
» Hi.
>> Mr. Harden.

2798
03:22:38,479 --> 03:22:41,479
» Nay.

2799
03:22:41,680 --> 03:22:45,680
» Mr. Lanski.
>> I.

2800
03:22:44,479 --> 03:22:49,439
» Mr. Newman.
>> Nay.

2801
03:22:47,120 --> 03:22:52,319
» Mr. uh Chairman Canestra.
>> I.

2802
03:22:50,880 --> 03:22:57,520
» Okay. Okay. So, do
>> variance for uh item four on the agenda

2803
03:22:54,880 --> 03:23:02,080
has approved. Uh we're going to go to
item five on the agenda. This is an

2804
03:22:59,359 --> 03:23:09,840
application for two variances for an
above ground storage tank in a DRD

2805
03:23:04,560 --> 03:23:13,680
district at 405 Route 202 in S.
Okay. Let's see here.

2806
03:23:11,840 --> 03:23:15,920
» The variances are for the height.
>> Yeah.

2807
03:23:14,479 --> 03:23:19,880
» And what's the second variance?
>> Let me see here.

2808
03:23:16,880 --> 03:23:19,880
» Setback.

2809
03:23:23,520 --> 03:23:28,920
page two of the application.

2810
03:23:28,960 --> 03:23:38,000
» Okay. So, the the pitched roof, so the
roof roof height and then required

2811
03:23:33,920 --> 03:23:45,279
permitted 30 uh proposed 12.9 relief saw
17.1. Is that a property setback?

2812
03:23:42,960 --> 03:23:53,160
» Yes.
>> So, it's 100% on the roof and

2813
03:23:49,200 --> 03:23:53,160
% on the setback.

2814
03:23:54,960 --> 03:23:59,680
» Once again, they are significant
variances, but because this is a

2815
03:23:58,319 --> 03:24:02,160
utility,
>> these are significant, but there's no

2816
03:24:01,120 --> 03:24:04,560
other way to do the tank,
>> right?

2817
03:24:03,120 --> 03:24:06,479
» There is [clears throat] another way.
>> There is tank we're talking about right

2818
03:24:06,000 --> 03:24:10,160
now, right?
>> Yeah. Tank

2819
03:24:07,840 --> 03:24:15,359
» the 100% there's another way to do the
building. the tank. I I think the tank's

2820
03:24:13,200 --> 03:24:17,439
the tank
my

2821
03:24:15,840 --> 03:24:22,000
» This is similar to when we had when we
used to have the cell tower application

2822
03:24:19,840 --> 03:24:25,279
the telecommunications act
>> you're somewhat stuck.

2823
03:24:22,960 --> 03:24:29,520
» No, frankly under undercut us any
objection then here this is a public

2824
03:24:28,160 --> 03:24:32,880
utility.
>> It's it's a tough one.

2825
03:24:30,960 --> 03:24:36,319
» Right. Right.
>> So once again we're going to need a

2826
03:24:34,319 --> 03:24:40,160
motion. Um and then if we're going to
condition it upon once again landscaping

2827
03:24:38,880 --> 03:24:43,600
and things like that. Bart, you want to
take this one, too?

2828
03:24:41,840 --> 03:24:49,479
» Um, [clears throat]
I'll make a motion to approve the

2829
03:24:45,680 --> 03:24:49,479
variances as stated.

2830
03:24:50,239 --> 03:24:53,840
» Conditioned upon.
>> No conditions.

2831
03:24:52,640 --> 03:24:58,800
» You're not You're not going to do land.
>> No, this this is not in the front of the

2832
03:24:57,200 --> 03:25:02,479
property.
This is not the concern that the the

2833
03:25:00,560 --> 03:25:05,200
land trust brought up. This one's off to
the side, right? We're just talking

2834
03:25:03,600 --> 03:25:08,960
about the water storage thing.
>> Yeah, but the applicant is willing to do

2835
03:25:07,040 --> 03:25:12,359
landscaping. They are
>> now do it.

2836
03:25:13,200 --> 03:25:17,880
» That's the way I kind of look at it. Why
not?

2837
03:25:18,239 --> 03:25:24,120
» Because downhill
is

2838
03:25:24,160 --> 03:25:30,960
this way is what is the coming up is the
is the vista that they're trying to

2839
03:25:28,800 --> 03:25:34,399
stop. And this way they have plenty of
space.

2840
03:25:32,000 --> 03:25:41,120
» It's it's this
side sideyard variant the issue. And I

2841
03:25:38,319 --> 03:25:47,040
don't see them needing landscaping here.
So that's why that's my thought pattern.

2842
03:25:43,600 --> 03:25:49,600
But if somebody if where else where
where are you suspecting to put

2843
03:25:48,319 --> 03:25:54,319
landscaping on this one?
>> I would still [clears throat] like to

2844
03:25:51,279 --> 03:25:58,160
see some landscaping between route 202
because you're still going to see that.

2845
03:25:56,239 --> 03:26:00,399
» But but this is you're saying you want
to see something here?

2846
03:25:59,200 --> 03:26:03,600
» Yeah.
>> I would think the trust would probably

2847
03:26:01,840 --> 03:26:06,319
want land.
That's the driveway,

2848
03:26:04,720 --> 03:26:09,439
» right? They would. I mean, I think if
both sides want to do it, why not?

2849
03:26:08,479 --> 03:26:13,200
» Okay. Yeah. Yeah.
>> That's the way I look at it.

2850
03:26:10,319 --> 03:26:18,720
» Go ahead. I I I didn't see it that way.
I That one That one looks The other one

2851
03:26:16,880 --> 03:26:24,239
clear as day, you know, as much
landscaping as possible. That's it's a

2852
03:26:20,800 --> 03:26:28,720
It is messing up the view. This one it's
a water storage tank and it's 80 ft from

2853
03:26:26,640 --> 03:26:32,640
from the edge of the property.
>> I would like to see it.

2854
03:26:30,800 --> 03:26:37,327
» I think I would too, but
>> Okay. All right.

2855
03:26:34,560 --> 03:26:40,720
» You something like that to really
[clears throat] soften it up like some

2856
03:26:38,720 --> 03:26:44,399
white pines that grow like there's no
tomorrow or

2857
03:26:42,080 --> 03:26:50,640
» you got a He's got a road cutting across
right there and there's that road's

2858
03:26:48,560 --> 03:26:55,200
going to
But yes, we can send that to the ARB as

2859
03:26:54,160 --> 03:27:00,239
well. No problem.
>> Yeah. So, I'd like to I'd like to uh

2860
03:26:57,279 --> 03:27:06,640
take back that l and make a motion to
approve the variances stated conditioned

2861
03:27:02,239 --> 03:27:13,399
upon um applicant uh completing
landscaping in accordance with a plan uh

2862
03:27:09,760 --> 03:27:13,399
approved by the ARB.

2863
03:27:16,399 --> 03:27:20,800
» Who seconded that, please? I'm sorry.
>> I did second Tom.

2864
03:27:19,840 --> 03:27:23,920
» Thank [clears throat] you, Tom. Thank
you, Tom.

2865
03:27:22,800 --> 03:27:26,640
Mr. Burke.
>> Hi.

2866
03:27:25,279 --> 03:27:28,960
Mr. Pledo,
>> hi

2867
03:27:27,840 --> 03:27:32,000
» Mr. Guio.
>> Hi,

2868
03:27:30,479 --> 03:27:34,640
» Mr. Harden.
>> I

2869
03:27:33,359 --> 03:27:37,200
» Mr. Lansky.
>> I

2870
03:27:36,000 --> 03:27:41,040
» Mr. Newman.
>> Nay.

2871
03:27:38,560 --> 03:27:43,760
» And Chairman Kenistra.
>> I.

2872
03:27:42,479 --> 03:27:47,439
» Thank you.
>> Congratulations. Both applications have

2873
03:27:45,520 --> 03:27:50,239
been
very much.

2874
03:27:48,160 --> 03:27:55,680
» Thank you.
>> I just hope the land trust will be happy

2875
03:27:52,640 --> 03:28:01,520
with everything later.
Okay. Uh, we don't have minutes to

2876
03:27:58,080 --> 03:28:05,600
approve, so we're going to, uh, set that
aside for now. And our don't have a

2877
03:28:04,080 --> 03:28:11,359
meeting in August. I'll remind
everybody. Uh, so our next meeting will

2878
03:28:09,200 --> 03:28:14,239
be September I think it's September
15th. Thank you. Night, Denise.

2879
03:28:13,439 --> 03:28:19,279
» Yes. Yes.
>> That will be our next meeting. Um, and

2880
03:28:16,720 --> 03:28:24,160
minutes will do the
>> both sets of minutes. That would be the

2881
03:28:21,680 --> 03:28:27,359
July and the Anything
>> May and July,

2882
03:28:25,439 --> 03:28:30,000
» right? May and Yes. Yes. Is there
anything further anybody would like to

2883
03:28:28,880 --> 03:28:33,600
discuss?
>> Can Denise, can we drop these back off

2884
03:28:32,160 --> 03:28:37,120
in your office,
>> please? No. There's a garbage pail on

2885
03:28:35,840 --> 03:28:39,359
your way out the door.
>> You guys want to see your plans? Do you

2886
03:28:38,800 --> 03:28:43,439
need them?
>> You can you can pile them up. Stand by

2887
03:28:42,479 --> 03:28:48,080
the door.
>> Have Tom, you have them, right?

2888
03:28:45,920 --> 03:28:52,319
» Yeah, Tommy. Yeah, we don't need those.
>> I hate to waste all this paper.

2889
03:28:50,319 --> 03:28:54,880
» It's okay. Wallpaper something in your
house that way. Can you give them to the

2890
03:28:53,359 --> 03:28:57,040
next group? Do you want yours?
>> No, I'm going to keep mine. He wants to

2891
03:28:56,239 --> 03:29:01,600
keep his. Okay.
>> Lo. Lo.

2892
03:28:59,120 --> 03:29:04,960
» Lo, if you really need more, I think
there might be more in my office. Do you

2893
03:29:03,279 --> 03:29:07,520
want me to save them for you?
>> I think I have enough. We're good.

2894
03:29:06,560 --> 03:29:10,800
» Okay. [laughter]
All right. Good.

2895
03:29:08,160 --> 03:29:13,439
» I I left Meresa's office.
>> Okay. Thank you.

2896
03:29:11,760 --> 03:29:15,359
» Okay. Good night, everybody. Thank you.
>> Good night.

2897
03:29:14,000 --> 03:29:18,800
» Okay. So, if there's nothing further,
we're going to close the meeting. Are we

2898
03:29:16,960 --> 03:29:23,760
done? Okay. So, good night everybody and
we will see you uh September 15th.

2899
03:29:22,720 --> 03:29:25,680
» We made up for
>> a good night.

2900
03:29:24,479 --> 03:29:28,920
» Close down the meeting.
>> Good night.