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Good evening. I'd like to call this meeting to order.

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This is the hybrid select board meeting. Today is Tuesday, October 6th, 2026.

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It is a little past 7:00 in the evening.

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All members are present with the exception of Member Marion. She is online tonight.

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In person, we have our town administrator, Lisa Long as well. Welcome.

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We have announcements/public comment.

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Before we get into that, I have a citation for Sergeant

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Percy. I believe he's in the crowd. Sergeant, would you like to come up?

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I would just like to say, this is a certificate of recognition.

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This certificate is proudly awarded to Sergeant Douglas Percy in recognition of his

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honorable and dedicated service to the town of South Hadley, given upon his

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retirement from the South Hadley Police Department this 28th day of September 2026

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by the South Hadley Select Board, with their deepest appreciation and respect.

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Actually, can I have you guys come by the flag and just take a quick picture to

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share with them? Oh.

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Everybody?

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Everybody.

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Okay.

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Wait. You?

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Really?

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Yes.

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Enjoy it. It better be this. One at a time.

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Oh.

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Except this one. We'll bond the medals.

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Got everything?

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Think it's up here.

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Yeah.

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Okay. All right, thank you.

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Thank you.

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I just want to say,

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Doug was a great member of our police department, gave so much from the last 35

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years, and a lot of the work that he did was really behind the scenes.

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He was a great community partner, coach, volunteered at the church, so it was a lot

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more than just what he did. And he ran the overnight shift for the last five years,

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so he had the most junior officers, and then he had the most senior officers.

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So he had a difficult job, and he's really going to be missed.

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Not easy to fill his shoes. So thank you, Doug.

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Yay. Okay, now we are on to announcements.

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Do any members have any announcements this evening?

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Yes, I do.

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Renee, please.

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South Hadley's Historic District Study Committee is having a ribbon cutting for the

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old Firehouse Museum local historic district.

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It's going to be Saturday, October 17th.

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They want you to arrive at 1:30 to mix and mingle, and then there's going to be a

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ribbon cutting 2:00 to 3:00, and tours, and that is at 4 North Main Street,

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where the old Firehouse Museum is.

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And there's going to be a dessert truck there, so get over there.

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Thank you.

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Dessert.

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I have a few announcements, so bear with me.

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Town Hall is going to be closed on Fridays, starting immediately, except for people

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who need to do early voting on October 23rd and 30th.

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The reason that Town Hall is closing on Fridays is to give town employees

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time to catch up on their work that they

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have to do without interruptions by the public.

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It's important work that they do, and we need them to be able to focus on their

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work to get it done.

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There is a community needs survey. You can get that information on the website.

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It's also on lots of social media. We're looking for responses for that.

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Land waste pickup is now through the 28th, so any

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leaves and brush from your yard can be put out on your trash day in an open

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container.

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And then finally, there's a really cool thing happening.

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There's a call for artists and creators to create the design for a Welcome to South

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Hadley sign that's going to go up on the corner of Bridge and Main Street.

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There's information about that on the town website, and you can

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get in touch with the town planner, Anne Capra, to get more details about that.

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Thank you, Carol. Any other announcements?

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Yeah, I'd like to make an announcement.

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I'd like to congratulate Sergeant Felix Lingye Perez of the South Hadley Police

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Department. He received a certification recognition award from the Black and

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Latino Legislative Caucus in their selection as a 2026 Latino Excellence

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on the Hill honoree. There were 81 or 82

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awards, of which two were police officers.

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I'd like to congratulate Sergeant Perez on that.

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Very good.

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Congratulations, Felix.

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Any other announcements?

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Okay, is anybody here for public comment?

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Please.

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You'll let me know when mic's...

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Hi, Christian.

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Good evening.

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So just identify yourself and where you live, and-

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Yeah, I'm about to do that.

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All right, thanks.

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My name is Barry McPhee. I live at 3 Woodward Street here in South Hadley.

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I guess I've got a question in terms of how the select board, after

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the last few years, looking at the budgets and the shortfalls and the cuts in

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people and this and that, and

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where are we

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with looking at what we have for available space within

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town for businesses to

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join the town, create a business, and are we pursuing them

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in any way? Are we advertising globally within the state,

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or even outside of the state, to try and get new businesses,

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new developers,

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whatever we can, to come into town?

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Maybe even just advise what we can do to try and get more revenue

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coming into town. And I don't know if Lisa can tell us if

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you've done this kind of research, and if you could highlight where and who you've

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talked to, and the status on those

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endeavors, and let us know what's going on.

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Sure. I'll be as brief as I can, but we can also discuss this later.

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The select board has, and it's towards the end, unfortunately, a line agenda item

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about creating subcommittees, and one of those is an economic development

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subcommittee, so we are going to talk about it more then.

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But I will say briefly, in terms of expectations, my very first jobs in government

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was working in economic development, industrial development, doing that kind of

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thing. But that involved agencies that we don't have here and staffing that we

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don't have here. So the kind of comprehensive work that you're talking about, we

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don't have a lot of internal staff with either the job title or in the job

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description, and we are losing staff, so that's going to be a challenge.

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That being said, though, towns will typically advertise publicly owned properties

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or put out RFPs for availability for projects.

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The town doesn't have a lot of excess property right now,

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and there's also not necessarily a lot of private property.

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But for private property, it's more delicate because you can't just advertise

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somebody else's property. A lot of the work that we're doing, either through the

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falls or through grants or a

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request that we have to try to get money through the economic development bond

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bill, is to support private landowners by helping them with mini-grants

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for them to invest in their own property.

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Because we can't tell property owners what to do with their own property, but we

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can help incentivize and reach out to them and have meetings.

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So those are being done by myself and the staff,

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not on a regular basis, not like I used to when this was my primary job, when

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opportunities arise. But we've also found that because of the nature of South

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Hadley having very few properties available, even for private development, that

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it's a complex nature of brownfield cleanup, potential property acquisition,

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zoning reform, and zoning changes.

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So a number of the actions that you've seen before

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are in that ilk, and you'll see that the town meeting coming up has a lot of those

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changes to try to incentivize and support businesses.

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And also, some of the funding sources that you'll see advertised on our website

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are, again, aimed towards private entities.

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That being said, though,

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we still want to bring in businesses and support them here, but bringing in new

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businesses actually doesn't necessarily increase the tax revenue at all.

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Right. Thank you.

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So we do also say we've got to also prioritize ...

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sustainable revenue sources for just basic operations.

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So I know it's very brief-

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Yep

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... but it gives you an insight as to some of the conversation where if the Select

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Board supports something like an economic development committee, we get to talk

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about this on a regular basis. So the kinds of conversations that I might be having

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internally with my staff or with business owners or the chamber of state

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legislators get reported out in a public venue regularly.

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So folks like you don't feel like we're just sitting around not thinking about it.

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Yep. Okay.

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What about, just off the top of my head, the old James River Graphics and

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Rexon and that property. Is that a brown site? What do you mean by a brown site?

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Oh, so brown fields just refers to a property that might have a contamination

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that is preventing a redevelopment.

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So there's a site where if, for example, there's contamination, then you can't just

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go and rebuild it or reconstruct it.

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You have to do the

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primary work to do an assessment,

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go through the proper channels, do the proper reporting, things like that.

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And actually, we do have some of that on our agenda tonight with the Select Board

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to look at those kinds of sites.

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Yeah.

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So we are doing those things, again, not at the pace that I would love to see, but

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investing in staff would not yield an immediate return on investment.

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And I think with some of the staff reductions we have, we would have to cut

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something to make that investment at this point in time.

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But it's definitely something where existing staff and perhaps the Select Board are

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thinking about creative ways to move some of those kinds of activities forward.

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Okay. All right. Thank you so much.

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Yeah. And I encourage you, if you want to have another conversation or you have

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some ideas, reach out to me, at my office, reach out to me.

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Okay. Thank you so much.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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My name is Wayne Wetzel, 113 Pinecroft Drive.

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I'm the pen to the next from a few meetings ago, and I still

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have serious questions about the jobs you're doing.

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I don't think that you have a communication problem.

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I think you're not doing the job correctly.

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And I have two or three major suggestions for you.

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One is, there's some of us here that do have some ideas, and when you limit us to

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three minutes to give you those ideas, and you give our town administrator an hour

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to respond to them, you don't get any idea that you can work on.

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All you get is more of the same. And when you put in the paper, you talk about

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activities at the school,

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and primarily sports, and you focus on that. And think about it for a second.

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I don't know the details because I don't know the school budget, but

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all the sports have a fee. So that's money that's kicking in, and you

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pay for some minimum stipends to the faculty members to be the

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coaches, and you buy a few balls, and you buy a few gloves or another equipment,

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and cutting out sports doesn't solve your problem.

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But schools is one of the problems, and the school problem relates to the housing.

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And you've got a thing before you right now concerning a housing project up at the

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liquor store on 202.

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Think about it for a second. The worst part of your budget is the school budget.

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No house payer anywhere in this town pays enough revenue to cover the

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cost of the students that are in this house.

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So when you increase housing, especially

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lower income housing, you're more likely to have less tax revenue and more

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students, and that's going to blow your budget all up.

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But you need to think about that a little bit.

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Third one, and I mentioned it before, and I still haven't heard a single word from

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anybody about doing anything about it, and that is the biggest landowner in

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town is a non-paying taxant. I asked before,

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I haven't done the work. I could do the work if I wanted to, but our town

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administrator ought to know what percentage of land in the town

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is the property of our wonderful college.

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And the way it seems to happen in the past, I've only been in town six or seven

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years, but the way it seems is the school college comes forward and

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says, "Well, we have a generous handout here that we're going to give you

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$50,000 or $100,000." That's not the way to approach it.

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You need to have a solid plan and go to the school and tell them the

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benefits that they have for being in this town.

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Part of the lovely experience their student body has is the town of South Halley,

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and part of the reason that people give to their colleges is because of their

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experiences. And you need to have the school step up to the

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plate with a viable number, and it ought to be one that you ask for and not just

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accept. And I've got more ideas, but I'm running out of my three minutes.

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No, you can take my three minutes if you want to keep going.

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Does anybody at the table know about zero-based budgeting?

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When is the last time you did it?

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In my professional career, we do it every year.

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Every year at my professional career.

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Every year. It's not just we look at last year's budget and add 5% or

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3% or 2% for inflation. I don't believe it, but I accept your

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answer. Secondly, you've got two fire stations in town.

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I read an article and it says two fire stations, they were put in because in the

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horse and buggy dates, you couldn't get from one side of the town to the other side

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of the town. But we have, I

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can't think of the word anymore, but community help from our neighboring town if

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they have a fire station. Has anybody contemplated

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what you ought to do with two fire stations instead of one?

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Has anybody asked what you ought to do with two libraries instead of one?

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There are all sorts of things that could be looked at in this budget, and I don't

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think it's being done.

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Carol, if you want to-

239
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Lisa, go first.

240
00:17:07,740 --> 00:17:12,960
Yeah. I think part of the issue is that a number of the items that you talked about

241
00:17:13,861 --> 00:17:17,850
have been talked about. But if I said, well, the first time you talked about was

242
00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:20,820
done at three different meetings over the past three years, and you have to go to

243
00:17:21,390 --> 00:17:25,020
hour one and a half to get that seven-minute conversation about that, that's really

244
00:17:25,080 --> 00:17:29,760
hard. It's very hard for, I think, a lot of people to really follow all the complex

245
00:17:29,790 --> 00:17:32,520
discussions with each of those topics.

246
00:17:32,551 --> 00:17:32,760
So,

247
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one of the ways in which, and I'll speak generally versus addressing any specific

248
00:17:37,801 --> 00:17:38,010
thing,

249
00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:45,030
we have completely revamped the budgeting process that is in the Select Board

250
00:17:45,090 --> 00:17:50,910
financial policies by incorporating the existing appropriations committee to

251
00:17:50,940 --> 00:17:56,520
essentially do a zero-based budgeting exercise at a very public and transparent and

252
00:17:56,580 --> 00:18:00,990
comprehensive level. So that it's not just staff that are sort of doing things

253
00:18:01,051 --> 00:18:05,340
behind the scenes and then presenting something to the boards, and then you ask

254
00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:10,020
questions. So, we have sort of deconstructed the budgeting process so that

255
00:18:12,540 --> 00:18:15,660
members of the appropriations and perhaps members of the Select Board, we'll talk

256
00:18:15,690 --> 00:18:20,700
about that later, would be part of the process to basically help zero-based budget

257
00:18:20,850 --> 00:18:24,810
different departments and then bring them all together so that it's looked at

258
00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:27,030
comprehensively. And to do that

259
00:18:28,260 --> 00:18:33,840
during the fall and winter versus waiting until the late winter, early spring to

260
00:18:33,900 --> 00:18:35,880
have the public meetings and the public process.

261
00:18:35,910 --> 00:18:41,371
So it's a completely different way of doing things publicly, even though that might

262
00:18:41,430 --> 00:18:45,510
happen behind the scenes with staff, it hasn't been as transparent.

263
00:18:47,850 --> 00:18:49,500
And I will say briefly that the

264
00:18:50,820 --> 00:18:55,861
fire districts are legally and politically not part of the town, so there's a

265
00:18:55,920 --> 00:18:59,820
separate election, a separate board, a separate town meeting, but there are

266
00:18:59,880 --> 00:19:04,260
residents who are working on those very issues, and Carol can certainly talk about

267
00:19:04,861 --> 00:19:06,871
how to get involved or engage in those discussions.

268
00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:09,720
In terms of things like

269
00:19:10,980 --> 00:19:13,410
two libraries or one library, those

270
00:19:14,700 --> 00:19:18,900
have and will continue to be discussed about whether

271
00:19:20,790 --> 00:19:23,310
that's actually the budget issue.

272
00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:27,210
So for example, if it's really the staffing issue and the funding minimum levels

273
00:19:27,301 --> 00:19:32,371
versus A building operations level, then that's a whole different conversation than

274
00:19:32,430 --> 00:19:35,010
just saying one building is cheaper than two.

275
00:19:35,340 --> 00:19:39,840
So some of it, the conversations that we'll have moving forward, is what's the

276
00:19:39,900 --> 00:19:43,260
service delivery and the impact we're looking for? What does that cost?

277
00:19:44,250 --> 00:19:48,180
I wish it was that simple. The schools have had a lot of conversations about

278
00:19:48,270 --> 00:19:48,810
sports.

279
00:19:50,850 --> 00:19:56,070
High school sports or public school sports have to meet estate standards,

280
00:19:56,580 --> 00:20:01,080
which means that you have to hire an athletic director, you have to have the

281
00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:06,330
trainers, you have to have the training for the coaches, you have to pay them

282
00:20:06,390 --> 00:20:12,270
legally, and you have to transport kids, and the

283
00:20:12,361 --> 00:20:16,470
cost of that is well beyond the kind of fees.

284
00:20:16,500 --> 00:20:20,551
So there's a breakdown, and there's multiple presentations that the superintendent

285
00:20:20,580 --> 00:20:25,650
has done. I think one of the things that I'm thinking about is it is just so hard

286
00:20:25,710 --> 00:20:30,480
to navigate town information without asking one of us or trying to do a Google

287
00:20:30,570 --> 00:20:30,871
search.

288
00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,250
I think one of the things we'll discuss is if there are the top 10 issues that

289
00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:38,490
people ask about, what about the library? What about the districts?

290
00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:40,650
What about the sports here? What about this, what about that?

291
00:20:41,670 --> 00:20:47,520
Either we figure out how to have a Q&A with topics, and then in addition to the

292
00:20:47,700 --> 00:20:50,611
Q&A-- So let's say that the library is a major topic.

293
00:20:50,910 --> 00:20:54,090
So you've got the Q&A about commonly asked questions about the library.

294
00:20:54,150 --> 00:20:56,100
But then, let's say we talk about the library tonight.

295
00:20:56,700 --> 00:21:00,060
What we do is maybe say, "We're going to have a link to tonight's meeting," and say

296
00:21:00,090 --> 00:21:03,871
that, "Here's a link to the meeting, and at one hour and 17 minutes, we have a

297
00:21:03,900 --> 00:21:08,250
discussion." So you have a link to the meeting under Library, and then you can tell

298
00:21:08,310 --> 00:21:11,790
people to Zoom forward to that period where we talked about the library.

299
00:21:11,850 --> 00:21:17,820
So it's more work on our end, but these are the kinds of conversations we are

300
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:22,020
actually going to have tonight about communications and public engagement.

301
00:21:22,980 --> 00:21:28,020
Because there are so many boards, so many meetings, they're really long, they're

302
00:21:28,051 --> 00:21:30,810
not very searchable. It's a complex discussion.

303
00:21:31,710 --> 00:21:37,560
We really don't want people to feel like they're left behind, or we're

304
00:21:37,650 --> 00:21:39,750
asking you to go figure this out yourself.

305
00:21:40,380 --> 00:21:43,380
I think some of this, we definitely need to do a better job with public engagement,

306
00:21:43,470 --> 00:21:45,060
which is exactly what we're going to talk about tonight.

307
00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:47,640
So these are very timely comments.

308
00:21:48,361 --> 00:21:52,080
I think you're illustrating the exact reason why the Selectboard is trying to do

309
00:21:52,140 --> 00:21:55,830
things differently tonight. We're going to talk about the retreat we had, which

310
00:21:56,940 --> 00:21:59,790
takes, I think, the self sort of

311
00:22:01,051 --> 00:22:04,861
critical look that you have of ourselves and I have of ourselves, actually reflects

312
00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:08,490
a lot of the same feelings we have about what's been talked about tonight.

313
00:22:08,611 --> 00:22:12,960
So I feel like we're on the same page, but we need to sort of roll up our sleeves

314
00:22:12,990 --> 00:22:14,820
and make those changes and not just

315
00:22:16,650 --> 00:22:18,240
answer a question and move on. Right?

316
00:22:21,270 --> 00:22:24,510
I think the questions regarding the districts are great, but it doesn't fall under

317
00:22:24,570 --> 00:22:28,530
Selectboard purview. There is a group in town, a volunteer group, that is looking

318
00:22:28,590 --> 00:22:32,910
into cost savings with combination, possibly, of the districts.

319
00:22:32,970 --> 00:22:36,030
I hate the word merger, but combination's a little cleaner word.

320
00:22:38,551 --> 00:22:44,160
So that committee's working on that, and if there's further questions, comments,

321
00:22:44,250 --> 00:22:48,210
concerns, then the potential board in District 1 just met tonight.

322
00:22:48,330 --> 00:22:53,460
Those are the arenas that those conversations have to be talked about in terms of

323
00:22:54,210 --> 00:22:56,611
the possible duplication of service in town.

324
00:22:56,790 --> 00:22:59,430
It really doesn't fall under our purview.

325
00:22:59,551 --> 00:23:03,301
I mean, it's a constant question every time somebody runs for a Selectboard seat,

326
00:23:03,871 --> 00:23:09,540
and the answer is that it doesn't fall under this board itself.

327
00:23:09,660 --> 00:23:14,611
But the duplication is definitely there, Carol, if you want to-- Because Carol sits

328
00:23:14,700 --> 00:23:19,560
on that volunteer group, and maybe if you want to expand a little bit, Carol.

329
00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:26,010
Just that there is a citizens group that's involving, that's going in-depth

330
00:23:26,130 --> 00:23:31,560
into the cost of the districts, how they run, and running a number of budget

331
00:23:31,621 --> 00:23:32,611
numbers to see

332
00:23:34,650 --> 00:23:38,820
if there is some savings possible because of potential

333
00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:45,600
duplication of efforts. I'm looking through my notes, trying to remember when our

334
00:23:45,660 --> 00:23:47,820
next meeting is at the library.

335
00:23:49,051 --> 00:23:50,700
Hold on, I'll get my calendar up.

336
00:23:57,930 --> 00:24:00,780
And the public is welcome to attend our meetings.

337
00:24:05,010 --> 00:24:10,830
I believe it's the 14th at 4:30 at the South

338
00:24:10,861 --> 00:24:16,621
Hadley Public Library, for the citizens group that's working on studying

339
00:24:17,730 --> 00:24:19,890
the districts and the cost of the districts.

340
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:28,260
Appreciate the questions very much, though,

341
00:24:29,551 --> 00:24:30,450
you and Barry.

342
00:24:35,310 --> 00:24:39,150
Yeah. Can you go to the mic, please?

343
00:24:46,890 --> 00:24:52,111
It may not be under your purview. It may have been handed down the line.

344
00:24:52,950 --> 00:24:53,460
But what

345
00:24:55,290 --> 00:25:01,080
power or persuasion or goal or target do

346
00:25:01,170 --> 00:25:05,970
you guys give these committees? Because the budget is your concern.

347
00:25:06,630 --> 00:25:06,630
I-

348
00:25:06,660 --> 00:25:12,540
And we know we have a problem with the budget, as you've seen from three overrides

349
00:25:12,690 --> 00:25:17,730
not passing. So there's got to be things done, and

350
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:23,850
I spent 35 years or something like that in town government.

351
00:25:23,940 --> 00:25:26,371
I spent 30 of them as the

352
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:33,660
finance committee chair, or appropriate committee, or whatever you call it in town.

353
00:25:34,020 --> 00:25:36,330
So I've been doing this for a long time.

354
00:25:36,690 --> 00:25:42,450
And if you don't push, then you just push it down the line and nothing

355
00:25:42,540 --> 00:25:48,510
happens. And the interesting thing is, nobody

356
00:25:48,601 --> 00:25:54,389
spoke specifically to the point of our largest non-taxpayer in

357
00:25:54,479 --> 00:25:59,310
town. That is something that you guys got to take on yourself.

358
00:26:00,180 --> 00:26:02,580
You can't push it off to a committee

359
00:26:03,991 --> 00:26:09,630
because it has to come from you. You're the governing body of this

360
00:26:09,690 --> 00:26:15,660
town, and you're the only one that has enough statute to go and demand

361
00:26:15,750 --> 00:26:21,690
something or ask politely or however you want to express it from the college,

362
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:24,450
but they need to contribute more.

363
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:36,301
Does anybody want to respond to that? I think we talked about that in the past.

364
00:26:36,991 --> 00:26:40,861
So just briefly, the Selectboard did put together a policy after looking at

365
00:26:41,730 --> 00:26:46,950
researching all of the non-taxable properties, including Mount Holyoke College,

366
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:51,180
and did request a number,

367
00:26:52,890 --> 00:26:57,810
both sort of publicly, but also in very nice ways.

368
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:00,960
It was responded with a smaller number.

369
00:27:02,250 --> 00:27:06,960
The town asked again a few times in different ways and tried to look at it

370
00:27:06,991 --> 00:27:08,790
creatively, with

371
00:27:10,470 --> 00:27:12,571
a response that they were not able to do it at that time.

372
00:27:12,690 --> 00:27:16,111
So I think we can keep asking, but

373
00:27:18,571 --> 00:27:19,920
that's just like we're done.

374
00:27:24,060 --> 00:27:25,830
It's completely voluntary, so

375
00:27:27,270 --> 00:27:27,540
there's

376
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:33,750
putting a policy together, being consistent, being clear, asking multiple times,

377
00:27:34,170 --> 00:27:39,000
trying to be creative. We are still rolling up our sleeves to see if there is

378
00:27:40,290 --> 00:27:46,170
non-cash contributions or in-kind or other significant benefits the

379
00:27:46,260 --> 00:27:51,270
college can contribute that they might not, or they're saying they're not able to

380
00:27:51,330 --> 00:27:56,190
do with cash as well. And my understanding is that they're also operating with a

381
00:27:56,250 --> 00:27:59,010
significant deficit, but I'm not privy to that information.

382
00:28:00,210 --> 00:28:01,290
So again, there's

383
00:28:02,730 --> 00:28:03,150
many

384
00:28:04,980 --> 00:28:10,861
area towns around us have pilot policies in place, but there are

385
00:28:10,890 --> 00:28:15,361
actually no real pilots in place with universities because they are resistant to

386
00:28:15,420 --> 00:28:18,750
it, so most of that is voluntary contributions.

387
00:28:19,530 --> 00:28:24,120
Some of our nearby towns have seen those voluntary contributions go away because

388
00:28:24,180 --> 00:28:26,910
universities have unilaterally said they don't have the funding to do that.

389
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:27,180
So,

390
00:28:28,620 --> 00:28:31,470
we are not in a dissimilar boat-

391
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:37,980
We're probably in a unique position in that we at least are going to see a greater

392
00:28:38,010 --> 00:28:39,870
pilot payment than we did last year, which was zero.

393
00:28:40,890 --> 00:28:46,590
But we're going to continue to work with the college and find ways to continue to

394
00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:50,821
have this be a relationship that is ongoing and sustainable moving forward.

395
00:28:51,301 --> 00:28:55,650
But certainly the Selectboard, if you have other thoughts or ideas,

396
00:28:57,060 --> 00:29:00,301
we're being as transparent as we can to the public about when we ask, what we're

397
00:29:00,361 --> 00:29:02,821
asking for, how, what the response is.

398
00:29:02,910 --> 00:29:03,090
So,

399
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,051
I'm not sure there's much more we can do on that front.

400
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:13,560
Barry McPhee, Three Woodbridge Street.

401
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:16,440
I happen to be an alber of Mount Holyoke College,

402
00:29:18,090 --> 00:29:18,390
and

403
00:29:21,450 --> 00:29:24,870
I see a lot of waste. And if they're in a deficit,

404
00:29:26,460 --> 00:29:31,920
a lot of it, I bet, is contributed to that foolish geothermal project that they

405
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:34,861
pursued. And from what I understand now,

406
00:29:36,150 --> 00:29:37,020
it's completed.

407
00:29:38,430 --> 00:29:41,880
I don't know if that's true or not. Somebody told me it was completed.

408
00:29:43,741 --> 00:29:47,310
Besides that, does the town assessor

409
00:29:50,370 --> 00:29:52,620
go out and audit and look at properties?

410
00:29:53,611 --> 00:29:57,480
A lot of these properties I've looked at, they call them educational.

411
00:29:59,460 --> 00:30:05,280
Now, Will A Tollewill, for an example, is called as educational, and it

412
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:10,470
encompasses acres and acres of land that go out to Park Street.

413
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:17,910
That's a business. It's a hotel. It's a restaurant. That's not education.

414
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:24,270
I think the town, whoever, whether it's the assessors, need

415
00:30:24,390 --> 00:30:30,090
to reassess the properties at Mount Holyoke. That's just one piece of property.

416
00:30:30,630 --> 00:30:36,270
There are a number of empty lots that are potential building lots

417
00:30:36,900 --> 00:30:39,000
that should be taxed, and they're not.

418
00:30:39,630 --> 00:30:44,790
They've got a group of four buildings, I'm not quite sure if that's Jewett Lane or

419
00:30:44,851 --> 00:30:47,970
not, that are listed as one property

420
00:30:49,290 --> 00:30:54,991
at a million dollars. Well, they just renovated the first building on that street,

421
00:30:55,530 --> 00:31:00,330
and they had to spend $2 million to renovate it, if not more.

422
00:31:01,230 --> 00:31:01,680
So I think

423
00:31:03,510 --> 00:31:07,590
we've got to do something. There's money out there that we're not going after.

424
00:31:08,430 --> 00:31:11,190
Got to go after it. I would agree with this gentleman here.

425
00:31:12,241 --> 00:31:17,670
That's a big egg in town that should be contributing, and they're not.

426
00:31:18,601 --> 00:31:19,260
Thank you so much.

427
00:31:21,660 --> 00:31:22,920
I'll just say briefly that

428
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:30,330
this is a decent start because at least we're getting some positive responses,

429
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:34,410
and I think a desire to do more. I think we just need to, again, pull up our

430
00:31:34,470 --> 00:31:40,290
sleeves and work on it. We have the police chief in today, and one of the things we

431
00:31:40,321 --> 00:31:45,150
talked about at the retreat was to have our departments come in on a regular basis

432
00:31:45,270 --> 00:31:47,760
and talk about this and be accessible to the public.

433
00:31:48,629 --> 00:31:52,861
When it comes to our assessing department, I know of no one better that I want on

434
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:58,890
my team or my side. We have just the top team here, who are doing a lot with a

435
00:31:58,950 --> 00:32:02,370
little. They're experts. They're sought-after experts in the state.

436
00:32:03,060 --> 00:32:07,200
I think they're kind of the ones that are helping to generate all the assessor

437
00:32:07,590 --> 00:32:11,130
knowledge in the rest of the state. So we are incredibly lucky.

438
00:32:12,571 --> 00:32:14,160
The work they do is,

439
00:32:15,450 --> 00:32:18,270
I trust, but they also fight for the town.

440
00:32:18,361 --> 00:32:22,111
So, there are state laws, there's appeal processes.

441
00:32:22,140 --> 00:32:25,920
There's certainly a lot of people push back, right? They ask for a reassessment.

442
00:32:25,950 --> 00:32:29,430
They ask for an appeal. They ask, there is a lot of pushback.

443
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:32,430
They come in with knowledge and facts and research,

444
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:38,430
but they're also working pretty much nonstop and sometimes giving up holidays and

445
00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:41,430
weekends and just doing a lot. But I think that

446
00:32:43,770 --> 00:32:47,040
I just want the public to know that we just have a top team that is doing

447
00:32:47,071 --> 00:32:49,560
incredible work, and that they

448
00:32:51,450 --> 00:32:55,410
got their eyes on all of these entities. They know the law.

449
00:32:55,770 --> 00:33:00,930
They know what we can do. But certainly we have conversations with our assessing

450
00:33:00,991 --> 00:33:05,071
team and the board from time to time because of things that we need to do, things

451
00:33:05,101 --> 00:33:09,030
like the tax rate. But I think that's going to be coming up later this year.

452
00:33:09,810 --> 00:33:13,051
We're going to be talking about things like exemptions that might be on future

453
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:14,670
agendas. We're talking about,

454
00:33:16,140 --> 00:33:21,780
I just completely lost it, but there's a few things that we're talking about with

455
00:33:21,810 --> 00:33:27,090
that team. So there'll be opportunities for us to have these discussions and also

456
00:33:27,571 --> 00:33:30,480
invite the public to view and to ask questions, too.

457
00:33:33,930 --> 00:33:34,680
Any other comments?

458
00:33:36,450 --> 00:33:37,980
Any other public comment?

459
00:33:39,991 --> 00:33:41,670
Okay, thank you for the input.

460
00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:49,650
Okay, next on our agenda, we have the approval of the draft minutes of September

461
00:33:49,890 --> 00:33:54,120
22nd, 2026. Do any members have any questions or comments on those minutes?

462
00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:00,601
Hearing seeing none, I believe there's a motion.

463
00:34:01,710 --> 00:34:06,090
I move to approve the draft minutes of September 22nd, 2026 as presented.

464
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:07,710
I'll second.

465
00:34:08,430 --> 00:34:09,960
Okay. I'm going to roll call. Renee?

466
00:34:10,170 --> 00:34:10,440
Aye.

467
00:34:10,890 --> 00:34:11,190
Carol?

468
00:34:11,430 --> 00:34:12,030
Abstain.

469
00:34:12,780 --> 00:34:13,111
Kevin?

470
00:34:13,650 --> 00:34:13,950
Aye.

471
00:34:13,980 --> 00:34:14,491
Priscilla?

472
00:34:15,810 --> 00:34:15,991
Aye.

473
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:20,101
Aye. Okay, four in favor, one abstention. Thank you.

474
00:34:20,940 --> 00:34:22,471
The next item is the consent agenda.

475
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:27,991
We have multiple one-day beer and wine licenses requests from Mike McKenna for

476
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:33,420
October 16th at the Equestrian Center at Mohonk, November 13th at Blanchard at

477
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:37,770
Mohonk, and November 13th at the Art Museum at Mohonk College.

478
00:34:38,730 --> 00:34:41,341
Do any members have any questions or comments on that?

479
00:34:45,510 --> 00:34:48,301
I move to approve the consent agenda as presented.

480
00:34:48,660 --> 00:34:49,020
Second.

481
00:34:49,861 --> 00:34:51,780
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

482
00:34:51,991 --> 00:34:52,290
Aye.

483
00:34:52,351 --> 00:34:52,710
Carol?

484
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:53,250
Aye.

485
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:53,640
Kevin?

486
00:34:53,790 --> 00:34:53,971
Aye.

487
00:34:54,180 --> 00:34:54,810
Priscilla?

488
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:55,741
Aye.

489
00:34:56,789 --> 00:35:02,760
Aye. It's unanimous. Thank you. Okay, we are now onto the listening session

490
00:35:05,101 --> 00:35:08,971
portion of our meeting, and our first item is the food truck.

491
00:35:10,620 --> 00:35:11,640
So we are-

492
00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:16,860
We've had a lot of folks that have opined on both, so if people want to speak, they

493
00:35:16,890 --> 00:35:18,960
can certainly, I think, speak to both at the same time.

494
00:35:19,020 --> 00:35:20,851
Oh, so you want to do food truck and data center? Okay.

495
00:35:21,090 --> 00:35:26,040
Yeah. I feel like most of the emails we've gotten have commented on both and not

496
00:35:26,101 --> 00:35:30,991
just one or the other. But the many emails that Selectboard have received

497
00:35:32,130 --> 00:35:34,620
have mostly been in favor of

498
00:35:35,910 --> 00:35:39,510
eliminating the 14-day restriction per month on food trucks.

499
00:35:40,170 --> 00:35:45,840
That being said, I was not around when that restriction was put in place, so I

500
00:35:46,110 --> 00:35:46,471
cannot

501
00:35:47,700 --> 00:35:52,290
adequately speculate as to why town meeting added that at one point in time.

502
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:57,690
And usually it might be related to a concern from brick-and-mortar restaurants that

503
00:35:58,290 --> 00:36:03,930
there might be some competition. I think food trucks are regulated, and actually we

504
00:36:04,020 --> 00:36:06,750
see a lot of brick-and-mortar restaurants who do have a food truck component.

505
00:36:07,530 --> 00:36:12,870
I haven't heard back, but I did want to maybe see if you've heard some input,

506
00:36:13,471 --> 00:36:17,040
or also reach out to the chamber and maybe say, "Hey, can you put this out to your

507
00:36:17,070 --> 00:36:21,180
membership and let them know that this is in the works?" I know they work with a

508
00:36:21,210 --> 00:36:27,120
lot of restaurants. Just to make sure that they're not surprised and just to

509
00:36:27,150 --> 00:36:30,330
get some feedback, and maybe even to proactively reach out.

510
00:36:30,690 --> 00:36:36,120
But again, if somebody had that historic knowledge of what the concerns were, that

511
00:36:36,150 --> 00:36:41,640
would be helpful for me to figure out if they're still valid concerns.

512
00:36:42,450 --> 00:36:43,140
That was a town

513
00:36:45,601 --> 00:36:49,620
meeting back when we had Dave Gardner here as a building inspector.

514
00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:52,140
He was the one that was speaking

515
00:36:53,820 --> 00:36:58,170
to this issue, which is why it was passed at the current 14-day restriction.

516
00:36:58,230 --> 00:37:01,500
But I don't remember. I think there was a concern about

517
00:37:04,530 --> 00:37:06,840
too many trucks on private property.

518
00:37:07,380 --> 00:37:11,400
The public property issue was the main driver for the 14-day restriction.

519
00:37:12,900 --> 00:37:16,530
So like if you had a food truck at one of the Mosher schools or the middle schools

520
00:37:16,590 --> 00:37:19,680
or something like that. But again, that's just going on limited knowledge that I

521
00:37:19,710 --> 00:37:20,580
had at that time. But

522
00:37:22,830 --> 00:37:25,471
there is probably archives related to that.

523
00:37:26,491 --> 00:37:30,120
Okay. So if I could maybe find out which town meeting that was, I might be able to

524
00:37:30,150 --> 00:37:35,130
go back and view the video. Or if folks know, they can send me a quick email and

525
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:40,782
let me know. For data centers In general, there is

526
00:37:41,112 --> 00:37:46,662
opposition to what I consider to be the large, disruptive, resource-eating

527
00:37:47,262 --> 00:37:50,712
data centers. There are a lot more nuanced conversations, including what's

528
00:37:50,742 --> 00:37:54,552
happening internally, because we do have data centers, like the smaller ones.

529
00:37:54,942 --> 00:38:00,762
I think South Hadley Electric Light, yeah, the town has a data center

530
00:38:00,822 --> 00:38:05,893
for backup. So I think if you lump them all and just ban everything that's

531
00:38:05,893 --> 00:38:09,643
considered a data center, you're not getting the nuances of existing things that

532
00:38:09,643 --> 00:38:13,452
are very helpful to supporting businesses and government.

533
00:38:13,602 --> 00:38:13,752
So,

534
00:38:14,952 --> 00:38:20,922
we are internally doing a lot more research to change that quick ban to something

535
00:38:20,952 --> 00:38:25,242
that's more nuanced and might look at either a moratorium, might look at size.

536
00:38:25,452 --> 00:38:27,252
So we're nowhere near

537
00:38:28,932 --> 00:38:30,072
done sort of exploring

538
00:38:31,362 --> 00:38:34,393
data centers, but of course, we wanted to make sure that it was a public process.

539
00:38:35,862 --> 00:38:39,672
I think on the food truck one, again, where we've talked about it's 14 days.

540
00:38:39,732 --> 00:38:42,762
Do we eliminate it? Do we change the number of days?

541
00:38:42,852 --> 00:38:45,822
And, right now, our initial recommendation is just to eliminate it.

542
00:38:45,882 --> 00:38:51,672
So there isn't a restriction, even if it's 14 to 21 or 14 to 28, just to take out

543
00:38:51,702 --> 00:38:57,552
those lines altogether. I don't see any hands up online, but I'm watching. Anybody?

544
00:38:58,482 --> 00:38:58,752
So,

545
00:39:00,462 --> 00:39:04,512
I think reaching out to the chamber of commerce is a great idea,

546
00:39:06,012 --> 00:39:10,452
just to get their input on it. I don't have any recollection of that town meeting

547
00:39:11,623 --> 00:39:14,652
about when that was passed and what the conversation was about.

548
00:39:15,522 --> 00:39:19,902
As far as data centers, I really appreciated the comment made by resident Megan

549
00:39:19,932 --> 00:39:20,352
Bristol

550
00:39:22,452 --> 00:39:27,912
suggesting that we do a one-year moratorium while we study the details.

551
00:39:28,332 --> 00:39:34,242
So that allays people's concerns that a data center could come in and sneak in,

552
00:39:36,162 --> 00:39:41,322
then giving us an opportunity to actually have a thoughtful process

553
00:39:42,222 --> 00:39:44,802
for the permitting for something like that.

554
00:39:44,893 --> 00:39:50,472
And so we would be able to say, "We need this kind of data center, and this is

555
00:39:50,532 --> 00:39:56,202
allowed," versus this kind of data center, which presents a bigger problem than the

556
00:39:56,262 --> 00:39:59,532
mega data centers that everybody's talking about right now.

557
00:40:00,132 --> 00:40:05,862
And can I just say that people talk about using AI all the time, but if you

558
00:40:05,922 --> 00:40:11,172
really hate data centers, you really should try to resist using those AI because

559
00:40:11,232 --> 00:40:16,393
it's just feeding the need for those data centers. My side.

560
00:40:16,722 --> 00:40:17,352
Just an aside.

561
00:40:17,412 --> 00:40:22,662
Understood. So I think the last meeting I was talking about what resources are

562
00:40:22,722 --> 00:40:27,282
these consuming. I heard electric, which we have private electric. I heard water.

563
00:40:27,612 --> 00:40:32,922
We have plenty of water. So other than that, and we don't have a moratorium on

564
00:40:32,982 --> 00:40:36,792
natural gas in South Hadley, unlike other communities around us.

565
00:40:37,662 --> 00:40:40,452
So I'm inclined to learn more.

566
00:40:42,042 --> 00:40:47,052
Again, we have people here that are worried about or expressing concern regarding

567
00:40:47,472 --> 00:40:51,401
budgets and regarding development and things of that nature.

568
00:40:51,462 --> 00:40:56,682
Now, I'm not saying data centers are the cure-all, but if we can look at that, take

569
00:40:56,772 --> 00:41:01,242
a really hard look at that, because right now we're not getting anything.

570
00:41:01,902 --> 00:41:06,462
And I think if we needed to get something smaller, I'll probably get chastised.

571
00:41:06,522 --> 00:41:10,842
I'll get 30 emails tonight hating me for this comment, but I think we need to keep

572
00:41:10,873 --> 00:41:15,552
our options open. I know that everybody around us is putting moratoriums and

573
00:41:16,242 --> 00:41:18,822
Westfield, they're looking at it. They were going to get one.

574
00:41:18,852 --> 00:41:23,352
They're looking at it closer. But I think we've really got to take a hard look on

575
00:41:23,412 --> 00:41:24,552
what we want to do with this.

576
00:41:34,662 --> 00:41:39,882
Barry McPhee, 3 Woodbridge Street. I agree with Jeff.

577
00:41:41,832 --> 00:41:47,232
You need to really look at this as well, not just your group, the planning board.

578
00:41:48,042 --> 00:41:53,382
I mentioned it last night at their meeting that you guys got to make a big tent

579
00:41:54,192 --> 00:41:55,123
of all of you

580
00:41:56,382 --> 00:42:02,143
and local businesses and providers of all sorts of materials, and

581
00:42:03,702 --> 00:42:09,102
it would be good for the trades. And from what I understand,

582
00:42:09,942 --> 00:42:15,432
they have a few employees, but the tax

583
00:42:15,492 --> 00:42:20,652
benefits to the town of South Hadley would be immense, and we can drive that train,

584
00:42:20,832 --> 00:42:24,762
tell them what they're going to do and what we want and how much they're going to

585
00:42:24,822 --> 00:42:25,062
pay.

586
00:42:26,202 --> 00:42:26,893
I agree with Barry. I

587
00:42:28,242 --> 00:42:32,862
think you brought up Gaylord Street, the old James River.

588
00:42:33,702 --> 00:42:35,382
Aeteron, that building

589
00:42:37,152 --> 00:42:40,362
is cleaner than my house. It's sitting there doing nothing.

590
00:42:40,393 --> 00:42:41,232
Nothing. Right.

591
00:42:41,292 --> 00:42:42,373
There's nothing in there.

592
00:42:42,402 --> 00:42:42,432
Right.

593
00:42:42,432 --> 00:42:44,832
It's got plenty of capacity for parking.

594
00:42:44,893 --> 00:42:47,562
I don't care if you had 100 employees, it's still got the same capacity.

595
00:42:47,712 --> 00:42:47,952
It's probably-

596
00:42:48,252 --> 00:42:53,922
You have 21 Mill right next to it. Across the street, EYENCO at one time was going

597
00:42:53,952 --> 00:42:57,402
to build an expansion for there. That's been put on hold.

598
00:42:58,512 --> 00:43:01,032
From what I understand, they're trying to figure out what they're doing in terms of

599
00:43:01,062 --> 00:43:05,922
their operations because they're in Billerica and they're overseas as well.

600
00:43:07,152 --> 00:43:10,422
I personally was excited about that because that would have brought more revenue as

601
00:43:10,482 --> 00:43:10,992
well. So-

602
00:43:11,412 --> 00:43:11,472
Right

603
00:43:11,562 --> 00:43:11,562
...

604
00:43:13,032 --> 00:43:18,102
that property has limitations, but in the meantime, we have 6 Mill that is

605
00:43:18,132 --> 00:43:19,452
crumbling within itself.

606
00:43:20,022 --> 00:43:20,112
Right.

607
00:43:20,412 --> 00:43:24,882
There's a company out of California that purchased it for very little money, and

608
00:43:24,912 --> 00:43:26,412
they're just sitting on it. So-

609
00:43:27,012 --> 00:43:30,492
And I'm sure it has plenty of power, electricity, because that was a-

610
00:43:31,123 --> 00:43:32,112
Yeah, and I meant-

611
00:43:32,143 --> 00:43:32,893
It was a plant

612
00:43:33,072 --> 00:43:37,692
... we have private electric, so it's palatable. We're not EverSource driven.

613
00:43:37,722 --> 00:43:37,932
We're not-

614
00:43:38,893 --> 00:43:39,012
Right.

615
00:43:39,402 --> 00:43:42,942
So I think, again, we have to take a really, really hard look at this.

616
00:43:43,062 --> 00:43:43,272
Yeah.

617
00:43:43,332 --> 00:43:46,362
It's not going to solve our budget woes, but it certainly can contribute-

618
00:43:46,393 --> 00:43:46,873
It's going to help. Yeah

619
00:43:46,873 --> 00:43:50,082
... with the right process. And I agree with you on the planning board, and I have

620
00:43:50,143 --> 00:43:55,452
total faith in our town planner and our planning board that to propose or to maybe

621
00:43:55,542 --> 00:44:01,482
suggest to this board and our residents, mainly town meeting, that

622
00:44:02,471 --> 00:44:04,393
we should look at this closely.

623
00:44:04,422 --> 00:44:05,111
Absolutely. Thank you.

624
00:44:05,172 --> 00:44:05,623
Thank you.

625
00:44:06,162 --> 00:44:10,752
And I would agree with Jeff that we need to look at this and be very cautious with

626
00:44:10,812 --> 00:44:13,692
it because we did drop the ball with the marijuana,

627
00:44:15,072 --> 00:44:16,452
and we relate to the game on that.

628
00:44:21,342 --> 00:44:22,812
Anything else on the

629
00:44:24,492 --> 00:44:26,982
listening session for food truck and data centers?

630
00:44:28,512 --> 00:44:29,292
Nobody online?

631
00:44:30,102 --> 00:44:30,373
Nope.

632
00:44:31,572 --> 00:44:32,442
Any other comments?

633
00:44:34,452 --> 00:44:39,342
Okay, we're going to move on. We are now under new business, and we'll begin with

634
00:44:39,462 --> 00:44:45,432
item A, police staffing. I believe we have Chief Gundersen in

635
00:44:45,462 --> 00:44:50,143
the room, and I think between Lisa and Chief, we'll kick this off.

636
00:44:52,123 --> 00:44:56,172
Oh, and also to be transparent, we have two members of the Appropriations Committee

637
00:44:56,772 --> 00:44:57,942
that are sitting,

638
00:44:59,922 --> 00:45:03,762
or they are representing the Appropriations Committee for the police budget as

639
00:45:03,822 --> 00:45:06,672
well, so I welcome them as well. Chief, welcome.

640
00:45:07,692 --> 00:45:11,052
Good evening. Thank you. Lisa, should I start? Would you like to start?

641
00:45:11,982 --> 00:45:14,202
I guess we can both start. We'll say that

642
00:45:15,702 --> 00:45:21,042
one of the reasons for the chief coming in is that we want to get your input

643
00:45:21,162 --> 00:45:25,752
on some of the changes that are happening or some of the decisions we want to make

644
00:45:25,782 --> 00:45:27,222
moving forward with the police department.

645
00:45:28,782 --> 00:45:32,893
Again, we want to do this regularly with departments so that you are much more

646
00:45:32,922 --> 00:45:36,252
aware, and the public's more aware of all the stuff that usually goes on behind the

647
00:45:36,312 --> 00:45:38,232
scenes or outside of public meetings.

648
00:45:39,792 --> 00:45:43,422
One of the things that we shared in the packet that some of you were here for and

649
00:45:43,452 --> 00:45:48,942
some of you weren't was the staffing study that we did a few years ago that did

650
00:45:48,972 --> 00:45:52,632
provide some recommendations. We want to make sure that we don't just do those

651
00:45:52,662 --> 00:45:55,302
studies and they're sitting on a shelf, but that we return to them and have

652
00:45:55,332 --> 00:45:56,652
conversations about them as well.

653
00:45:57,312 --> 00:46:03,252
But there are also some updates that she can provide of the issues and

654
00:46:03,252 --> 00:46:07,992
the opportunities that we're tackling, and then I'll sort of jump back in and talk

655
00:46:08,082 --> 00:46:11,712
about maybe some concrete steps that we can take and decisions I'll need your input

656
00:46:11,742 --> 00:46:12,192
on tonight.

657
00:46:13,422 --> 00:46:17,022
Sure. Thank you. So for people that don't know me, I'm Jen Gundersen.

658
00:46:17,112 --> 00:46:22,542
I'm the police chief. And just by way of history, so the police department has

659
00:46:22,602 --> 00:46:25,992
historically been funded for 29 police officers.

660
00:46:26,052 --> 00:46:30,192
That's been the same since Bill Shanker was the chief. He left in 1995.

661
00:46:30,912 --> 00:46:36,672
With the budget reductions, the police department was reduced to 27 funded

662
00:46:36,732 --> 00:46:39,972
positions. We've also closed the dispatch center.

663
00:46:40,032 --> 00:46:41,532
We're in the process of doing that.

664
00:46:41,592 --> 00:46:42,282
We think we're

665
00:46:43,326 --> 00:46:47,556
About 30 days out from having our station go dark.

666
00:46:48,427 --> 00:46:53,826
It's been a long process for us to figure out best practices, but I think we're

667
00:46:53,886 --> 00:46:58,866
almost there. Going back to the staffing study, so when that was done, they took

668
00:46:58,927 --> 00:47:04,746
data from 24, like where did South Hadley, with our 29 police officers,

669
00:47:05,496 --> 00:47:09,067
match up with similar and like communities.

670
00:47:09,876 --> 00:47:15,456
At that time, South Hadley had less officers per residence than Greenfield,

671
00:47:15,966 --> 00:47:20,976
Easthampton, Longmeadow, East Longmeadow, Wilbraham, and Palmer.

672
00:47:21,606 --> 00:47:26,526
The only like community that we did have more than was Belchertown, but now that

673
00:47:26,556 --> 00:47:31,776
we've been reduced to 27, we're certainly lower than Belchertown when we look at

674
00:47:31,806 --> 00:47:37,746
our population. We've reduced our staff, and I just want to say that that is not

675
00:47:37,806 --> 00:47:39,696
without a pretty large impact

676
00:47:40,927 --> 00:47:45,756
to the safety of the community and to the safety of the police officers.

677
00:47:45,817 --> 00:47:48,726
So I'm just going to ask for you to give me a few minutes so I can just

678
00:47:50,166 --> 00:47:55,326
review some data with you. So our calls for service haven't reduced at all.

679
00:47:55,356 --> 00:47:55,866
We're still

680
00:47:57,516 --> 00:47:59,976
at the same level of calls for service.

681
00:48:00,186 --> 00:48:00,486
Our

682
00:48:01,866 --> 00:48:06,606
NIBRS crime and incident reports have not reduced at all.

683
00:48:09,126 --> 00:48:14,736
I chose, I made the operational decision when we lost two sworn staff to

684
00:48:14,797 --> 00:48:18,756
remove our two officers from the schools. I know that was impactful.

685
00:48:18,817 --> 00:48:24,096
It was a great relationship. It is still a strong relationship with the schools,

686
00:48:24,186 --> 00:48:28,956
but removing our SROs is very impactful, not just to the schools and the

687
00:48:28,986 --> 00:48:32,677
constituents at the schools, but also to our police officers.

688
00:48:33,156 --> 00:48:37,266
Because those incidents that we're dealing with juveniles haven't gone away.

689
00:48:37,386 --> 00:48:40,776
Now it's just a different officer every single day dealing with that.

690
00:48:41,317 --> 00:48:47,076
And I just want to go through a few of those calls that we've had to deal with

691
00:48:47,976 --> 00:48:51,126
regarding juveniles in the last three weeks.

692
00:48:52,086 --> 00:48:55,626
So we had two runaway juveniles on the 10th of September.

693
00:48:55,836 --> 00:48:58,326
We did locate that juvenile and brought them home.

694
00:48:58,956 --> 00:49:03,756
On the 12th, five officers responded to a fight in progress between juveniles at a

695
00:49:03,786 --> 00:49:07,536
football game at the high school. Two of those officers were working detail.

696
00:49:07,567 --> 00:49:12,547
The other three were on shift. We've summonsed a juvenile to court for that.

697
00:49:12,636 --> 00:49:18,606
We've since trespassed two juveniles from some youth school events

698
00:49:18,666 --> 00:49:24,126
because of that incident. We responded to an eight-year-old who left

699
00:49:24,516 --> 00:49:28,596
his home on a motorized bike. His parents couldn't find him.

700
00:49:28,656 --> 00:49:34,026
We assisted that juvenile. On the 17th, we had a juvenile seriously injured by

701
00:49:34,086 --> 00:49:36,726
three other juveniles when they broke into his house.

702
00:49:38,256 --> 00:49:43,927
On the 22nd, we had a parent come to the police department regarding their child, a

703
00:49:44,047 --> 00:49:47,047
student dealing with harassment at the school.

704
00:49:48,096 --> 00:49:53,166
We also had an officer respond to the high school for an altercation between an

705
00:49:53,226 --> 00:49:58,235
employee and a person unrelated to the high school in the parking lot with a road

706
00:49:58,297 --> 00:49:59,165
rage incident,

707
00:50:00,696 --> 00:50:02,916
where they threatened the person with a gun.

708
00:50:02,946 --> 00:50:06,366
They've since been trespassed from the school property.

709
00:50:07,177 --> 00:50:11,406
We had four officers respond to an at-risk juvenile who left their home, reported

710
00:50:11,466 --> 00:50:13,806
missing. We were able to find that juvenile.

711
00:50:14,436 --> 00:50:20,256
We had another student at a school report being assaulted at another game

712
00:50:20,526 --> 00:50:25,806
the weekend prior. We were contacted by one of the principals of the school

713
00:50:25,866 --> 00:50:29,616
regarding a sexual assault that was reported to them about one of their students.

714
00:50:29,677 --> 00:50:31,446
This incident didn't report at the school.

715
00:50:32,376 --> 00:50:34,956
They were just the first complaint witness to this.

716
00:50:35,076 --> 00:50:40,236
We had three juveniles apprehended as they broke into an apartment to try to take

717
00:50:40,266 --> 00:50:45,126
money from another juvenile. We had a seven and eight-year-old that were missing,

718
00:50:46,686 --> 00:50:51,726
thought they were playing a game. Just this past weekend, not in my summary, we

719
00:50:51,846 --> 00:50:57,246
arrested a juvenile for the fourth time for assault and battery, but we'd been to

720
00:50:57,276 --> 00:51:01,626
that house probably seven or eight times previous to this, where we were able to

721
00:51:02,016 --> 00:51:07,056
successfully deescalate. We then had to take that juvenile to Clinton and then pick

722
00:51:07,116 --> 00:51:12,576
that juvenile up. We deal with a lot of youth in this community, and that is why

723
00:51:12,636 --> 00:51:16,807
when there was a federal grant that just recently came up that gave us an

724
00:51:16,896 --> 00:51:22,656
opportunity to perhaps fund partially our SRO program again, we

725
00:51:22,716 --> 00:51:25,807
were aggressive in applying for that grant.

726
00:51:25,896 --> 00:51:31,837
We don't know if we will get that grant, but it would fund 50% of a police officer.

727
00:51:32,826 --> 00:51:36,666
Some people may be saying, "Why didn't I apply for that before?" Because this grant

728
00:51:36,756 --> 00:51:41,736
is only eligible to us because we are increasing our staffing.

729
00:51:42,216 --> 00:51:46,986
We are increasing. We had to provide budget documentations that showed how many

730
00:51:47,106 --> 00:51:52,386
sworn personnel were authorized by municipal government. So we were increasing.

731
00:51:52,446 --> 00:51:56,736
It is illegal to supplant your budget with federal funds.

732
00:51:57,876 --> 00:52:03,636
So the only positive of a funding reduction was it made us

733
00:52:03,756 --> 00:52:07,777
actually eligible to apply for this grant that has a 50% match

734
00:52:09,096 --> 00:52:14,557
at that time. I've spoken to the two principals, the assistant principal,

735
00:52:14,797 --> 00:52:17,706
and the principal of the high school.

736
00:52:17,976 --> 00:52:23,616
They're both very much in support of us being able to try to get a position and get

737
00:52:23,677 --> 00:52:26,376
that resource back into the school.

738
00:52:27,337 --> 00:52:30,936
I've also communicated to the principal at the Michael E. Smith Middle School.

739
00:52:31,027 --> 00:52:36,396
He supports the position, having the consistent presence of an officer in there and

740
00:52:36,456 --> 00:52:38,166
improving the communication

741
00:52:39,396 --> 00:52:44,916
between the schools and the police department is vital, especially at Michael E.

742
00:52:45,066 --> 00:52:50,376
Smith. I've got Liz Smith, that the safety and the staff,

743
00:52:51,006 --> 00:52:56,616
the safety improvements when having an SRO are instrumental to

744
00:52:57,186 --> 00:52:59,886
improving the educational system of the schools.

745
00:53:01,236 --> 00:53:06,396
So I bring this to you because this grant does require a 50% match, and that's not

746
00:53:06,456 --> 00:53:08,976
something we can take from our existing budget.

747
00:53:09,337 --> 00:53:11,256
There's also another grant opportunity.

748
00:53:11,375 --> 00:53:17,346
Again, we were ineligible unless we were going to add onto our staff that I

749
00:53:17,436 --> 00:53:23,166
also want to apply for, and this is a grant that will allow us to specialize in

750
00:53:23,256 --> 00:53:28,297
some work with victims of domestic violence and sexual assaults.

751
00:53:28,956 --> 00:53:34,596
I believe right now we probably have six or seven open sexual assault cases going

752
00:53:34,716 --> 00:53:36,756
on that haven't come to conclusion.

753
00:53:37,626 --> 00:53:42,486
We certainly have a great deal of domestic violence in this community.

754
00:53:43,536 --> 00:53:48,876
This is a state grant. It's a four-year grant, and that requires a 25% match for

755
00:53:48,936 --> 00:53:51,516
that position. I'd also like us to apply for that.

756
00:53:52,146 --> 00:53:57,726
I want to talk a little bit about what reducing our staffing by two personnel and

757
00:53:57,756 --> 00:53:58,686
what that has done.

758
00:54:01,027 --> 00:54:06,936
Over the last three months, the first quarter of fiscal year '27, so

759
00:54:06,996 --> 00:54:12,186
that's July, August, and September, overtime has increased by 17%.

760
00:54:12,246 --> 00:54:15,756
And I'm not talking about the money, I'm talking about the amount of hours our

761
00:54:15,876 --> 00:54:21,666
officers have had to work. 17% more than the same time last year.

762
00:54:21,726 --> 00:54:27,696
That is not sustainable, but that is the necessary staffing levels that we have

763
00:54:27,786 --> 00:54:29,856
to ensure the safety of this community.

764
00:54:30,277 --> 00:54:35,557
Our officers do so much more than just responding to calls, so the calls are always

765
00:54:35,616 --> 00:54:37,686
there, but really it's being proactive.

766
00:54:38,166 --> 00:54:43,146
Motor vehicle enforcement in that same period, looking back five months, has

767
00:54:43,206 --> 00:54:48,516
reduced 30%. We do not have the time and resources

768
00:54:49,206 --> 00:54:54,756
to go out to the streets where people are complaining about speeders or

769
00:54:55,746 --> 00:55:00,936
bicyclists that are e-bikes that are on sidewalks, which is against the law, that

770
00:55:01,536 --> 00:55:07,326
we have people that are flying by school buses when the safety arms are down.

771
00:55:07,416 --> 00:55:10,746
We just do not have the personnel to go out there and do that.

772
00:55:10,807 --> 00:55:14,226
But so much more than response to calls, mental health calls.

773
00:55:14,316 --> 00:55:18,126
Last month, we had 32 mental health calls that we're dealing with.

774
00:55:18,456 --> 00:55:24,186
That was unheard of 25, 30 years ago when I started this job, that we were dealing

775
00:55:24,246 --> 00:55:30,036
with people in crisis 32 times, and I bet it's much larger than that,

776
00:55:30,307 --> 00:55:34,266
but that's at least those calls that we've assigned to that CAD number.

777
00:55:34,326 --> 00:55:40,116
We work with veterans, veterans that are at risk of being unhoused. We do outreach.

778
00:55:40,206 --> 00:55:43,896
We have a team of officers that are veterans that follow up on those calls.

779
00:55:44,376 --> 00:55:49,386
We have officers that follow up with people that are suffering from substance abuse

780
00:55:49,777 --> 00:55:52,566
after overdoses, non-fatal overdoses.

781
00:55:52,626 --> 00:55:57,264
They go back, try to encourage To let them know that we're a resource, that it's

782
00:55:57,294 --> 00:56:01,974
not just enforcement action, that we can refer them to resources.

783
00:56:02,094 --> 00:56:03,144
We provide

784
00:56:04,344 --> 00:56:08,875
guidance to their families on how they can get Narcan, how they can help their

785
00:56:08,964 --> 00:56:13,884
family member, clean wounds from drug use.

786
00:56:14,155 --> 00:56:15,444
It's just so much more.

787
00:56:16,674 --> 00:56:21,625
We're seeing more unhoused people in this community, not just down by the river.

788
00:56:21,714 --> 00:56:24,655
That's where we would see people occasionally

789
00:56:26,574 --> 00:56:31,584
go. We're seeing more of that happening in this community, and I don't think that's

790
00:56:31,614 --> 00:56:32,544
going to go away.

791
00:56:33,775 --> 00:56:38,094
We treat them with respect and dignity. We try to get them to a shelter.

792
00:56:38,184 --> 00:56:41,004
We try to reconnect them with family members.

793
00:56:41,094 --> 00:56:45,655
We give them the department's cell phone if they need to make phone calls.

794
00:56:47,214 --> 00:56:51,474
We try to do a lot of things proactively to reduce crime and disorder for our

795
00:56:51,504 --> 00:56:56,934
community. This committee helped us pass the

796
00:56:57,625 --> 00:57:02,394
second ban of cryptocurrency machines in the Commonwealth.

797
00:57:02,844 --> 00:57:06,384
We haven't had one since then, so I'm really proud of that.

798
00:57:06,414 --> 00:57:10,854
And that was a recommendation that came from the officers that said, "These crimes

799
00:57:10,944 --> 00:57:15,054
are out of control. This money can never be recuperated.

800
00:57:15,114 --> 00:57:19,914
We're spending so much time. Can we try to do that?" So we looked legislatively,

801
00:57:20,454 --> 00:57:23,905
waiting for the state to change the laws. That wasn't going to be possible.

802
00:57:25,014 --> 00:57:29,184
The school bus violations, I know this board was spoken to two weeks ago by

803
00:57:29,244 --> 00:57:35,035
Lieutenant Barron, he and his team talking about putting cameras on

804
00:57:35,125 --> 00:57:40,794
school buses to get violators that risk the safety of our children and their

805
00:57:40,884 --> 00:57:43,254
family members that are at those school buses.

806
00:57:44,035 --> 00:57:48,954
And it's constant, those violations, and it's really impossible for us to be able

807
00:57:49,014 --> 00:57:52,254
to enforce those laws. We just don't have the resources.

808
00:57:52,974 --> 00:57:58,405
We work with the schools with internships, and we have students from HCC that do

809
00:57:58,494 --> 00:58:00,714
internships with us. We get free labor.

810
00:58:01,074 --> 00:58:05,514
We hope we're selling this profession, public safety profession, with these people.

811
00:58:05,574 --> 00:58:07,434
Our officers work with interns

812
00:58:08,934 --> 00:58:10,704
from high school that also come in.

813
00:58:10,764 --> 00:58:15,504
Now they've expanded that program, and we're really excited about the expansion for

814
00:58:15,565 --> 00:58:19,375
public safety. I just had that meeting last night as part of the steering

815
00:58:19,405 --> 00:58:23,574
committee, so public safety at the high school to strengthen the vocational

816
00:58:23,694 --> 00:58:29,664
program. That's going to include not just law enforcement, but dispatching and

817
00:58:29,724 --> 00:58:32,484
also fire service and EMS services.

818
00:58:32,875 --> 00:58:37,254
But as I'm having this meeting, I'm thinking to myself, we would send officers to

819
00:58:37,344 --> 00:58:42,655
teach classes, defensive tactics, canine programs, community outreach, history of

820
00:58:42,714 --> 00:58:46,674
policing. It's like, how can I find officers to do that?

821
00:58:46,734 --> 00:58:52,134
When I'm contacted by a second-grade teacher at Mosier that

822
00:58:52,614 --> 00:58:57,384
wants Officer Figinski to go and talk to five of her classes about leadership and

823
00:58:58,044 --> 00:59:02,934
in public safety in our community, and I have to say no, because Officer Figinski

824
00:59:02,994 --> 00:59:07,194
works midnights, and I can't take him off his night shift because then I have to

825
00:59:07,285 --> 00:59:09,714
force somebody to work overtime on that shift.

826
00:59:10,673 --> 00:59:14,544
And then he's working the day shift, and I can't take somebody working the day

827
00:59:14,634 --> 00:59:18,354
shift, then I have to force somebody to work overtime to fill that shift.

828
00:59:18,414 --> 00:59:23,244
It's just kind of filling gaps. It's been really impactful this overtime.

829
00:59:23,664 --> 00:59:27,294
A lot of people think officers like to work overtime, but they've already worked

830
00:59:27,324 --> 00:59:31,794
their 40 hours that week. Sure, we have some officers that work their details, but

831
00:59:31,824 --> 00:59:35,905
they've already worked their 40 hours. A lot of our overtime is forced.

832
00:59:35,964 --> 00:59:38,424
They don't have a choice. They know they have to do it.

833
00:59:38,934 --> 00:59:42,234
They have to cover those shifts. It's impacting morale.

834
00:59:42,294 --> 00:59:43,854
It's impacting their safety.

835
00:59:45,594 --> 00:59:50,094
I've recently had a conversation with one of our sergeants that quite frankly, I

836
00:59:50,155 --> 00:59:54,294
envisioned that at some point in his career that he'd be in my seat.

837
00:59:54,714 --> 01:00:00,144
He is applying for another job, and it's disheartening for me to hear that,

838
01:00:00,414 --> 01:00:06,084
and he is doing this solely because of the reduction in staffing, and he is

839
01:00:06,144 --> 01:00:11,604
concerned of his personal liability and his personal safety when running a shift

840
01:00:11,664 --> 01:00:16,285
with only two police officers, and he doesn't feel like he has enough to do the

841
01:00:16,375 --> 01:00:20,934
job. In the last five months, we've called in mutual aid 11 times.

842
01:00:21,084 --> 01:00:24,444
The same period the previous year, we never called in mutual aid.

843
01:00:24,504 --> 01:00:28,884
So 11 times we've called other police departments, Holyoke, Granby, Belchertown, I

844
01:00:28,914 --> 01:00:32,785
think we had Hadley, Amherst, and their canines to come into town.

845
01:00:33,264 --> 01:00:38,454
We'd never done that before. Right now, we're looking to fill Sergeant Percy's

846
01:00:38,544 --> 01:00:43,554
vacancy as a sergeant's position, and I was reminded back four years ago, this

847
01:00:43,584 --> 01:00:45,474
board supported the police department

848
01:00:46,734 --> 01:00:50,094
getting removed from civil service because I talked about the recruitment

849
01:00:50,155 --> 01:00:54,684
challenges that I was having. I was literally calling people on the state civil

850
01:00:54,775 --> 01:00:58,974
service list. I was googling them and trying to find their phone number and calling

851
01:00:59,004 --> 01:01:03,025
them up. "Will you please apply? Will you apply?" So we were able to get out of

852
01:01:03,084 --> 01:01:08,454
civil service. We were able to hire five police officers already trained, excellent

853
01:01:08,574 --> 01:01:13,134
additions to our police department. That saves us $40,000 each.

854
01:01:13,224 --> 01:01:19,074
Well, I've had a posted vacancy for seven months now, and I can't get

855
01:01:19,254 --> 01:01:21,625
one trained police officer to apply.

856
01:01:21,684 --> 01:01:21,924
And I

857
01:01:23,364 --> 01:01:28,794
don't think, I'm certain it has to do with if somebody's looking to come to South

858
01:01:28,824 --> 01:01:31,914
Hadley, they live in South Hadley, but they work in a neighboring police

859
01:01:31,944 --> 01:01:35,244
department, they want to come to this community, they're afraid of layoffs, and

860
01:01:35,275 --> 01:01:38,754
they're afraid of staffing levels. I digress.

861
01:01:39,054 --> 01:01:39,804
Talking about

862
01:01:41,125 --> 01:01:42,565
Sergeant Percy's position,

863
01:01:43,854 --> 01:01:48,655
I've had to go to officers that I've envisioned in leadership positions like,

864
01:01:48,744 --> 01:01:54,504
"That's definitely sergeant potential." And they

865
01:01:54,565 --> 01:01:59,454
haven't signed the list to take the test. So I'm knocking on their cruiser doors.

866
01:01:59,514 --> 01:02:03,204
They're heading out to calls. I'm like, "Are you taking the sergeant's test?" And

867
01:02:03,264 --> 01:02:08,694
like, "I don't feel comfortable taking that risk right now. I'm concerned.

868
01:02:09,084 --> 01:02:11,304
The sergeant's running with two on their shift."

869
01:02:13,405 --> 01:02:19,315
Morale is suffering over it, and I really think that I need help from this board.

870
01:02:19,405 --> 01:02:20,815
I need help from the community

871
01:02:22,525 --> 01:02:25,913
to support the police officers, and we get supported with staffing.

872
01:02:26,604 --> 01:02:31,854
They're first concerned about not being able to ensure the safety of the community,

873
01:02:32,094 --> 01:02:33,954
but then also it's themselves, right?

874
01:02:34,974 --> 01:02:38,785
One of our sergeants, he responded to a mental health call with only one other

875
01:02:38,905 --> 01:02:43,584
officer. I think he had a second officer working, but two were available at that

876
01:02:43,644 --> 01:02:46,525
time. He broke his hand. He's been out at work for two months.

877
01:02:47,454 --> 01:02:51,444
Had it been a normal day when maybe we would have had a sergeant plus three, there

878
01:02:51,504 --> 01:02:54,924
might have been two officers, and maybe they would have de-escalated that a little

879
01:02:54,954 --> 01:02:55,824
bit safer.

880
01:02:58,944 --> 01:03:02,394
Back to the grant. It's a Department of Justice grant.

881
01:03:02,484 --> 01:03:05,304
It would be for a school resource officer position.

882
01:03:05,364 --> 01:03:06,264
It would fund

883
01:03:07,464 --> 01:03:10,614
50% of the job for the first three years.

884
01:03:10,674 --> 01:03:16,194
We'd look to hire, bring in a new officer, and take an existing trained officer and

885
01:03:16,704 --> 01:03:20,604
put them in that position. The state grant that we're looking at, which I also

886
01:03:20,664 --> 01:03:25,644
think that we'd have a pretty competitive chance to get that grant, it would

887
01:03:25,704 --> 01:03:31,344
require us to have an officer specialized in domestic violence and sexual

888
01:03:31,375 --> 01:03:35,905
assaults, which would be excellent for this community to be able to have that.

889
01:03:38,844 --> 01:03:44,424
The state guidelines on responding to domestic violence tells us that we should be

890
01:03:44,484 --> 01:03:48,775
going back to those survivors on day two and day three and checking up on them.

891
01:03:48,804 --> 01:03:51,864
The reality is we're not able to do that.

892
01:03:51,984 --> 01:03:56,004
If we had this position, we'd be able to do that, and we'd be able to improve the

893
01:03:56,094 --> 01:03:57,384
safety of this community.

894
01:04:00,714 --> 01:04:01,614
Was that two minutes?

895
01:04:07,074 --> 01:04:07,254
So,

896
01:04:08,934 --> 01:04:09,924
this is not

897
01:04:11,155 --> 01:04:12,025
an uncommon

898
01:04:13,344 --> 01:04:18,984
insight into most departments or all departments throughout town.

899
01:04:19,074 --> 01:04:22,974
So we want to have more discussions like this.

900
01:04:23,424 --> 01:04:24,625
That's sobering,

901
01:04:26,424 --> 01:04:31,525
and that there's not necessarily an easy solution to, but we can do things like

902
01:04:31,614 --> 01:04:37,134
acknowledge, witness, and indicate support, find

903
01:04:37,254 --> 01:04:43,044
time to be part of strategic thinking, and find time to be a bit more aggressive,

904
01:04:44,065 --> 01:04:46,674
and take some recommended actions.

905
01:04:47,065 --> 01:04:52,944
We do have some actions that we are going to ask you today that this is certainly

906
01:04:53,035 --> 01:04:53,634
short-term,

907
01:04:55,344 --> 01:04:58,440
and we need a lot more than this But I wanted to

908
01:05:00,360 --> 01:05:03,721
get your feedback on what the chief has said,

909
01:05:06,030 --> 01:05:08,370
whether you think the public is even aware that

910
01:05:10,110 --> 01:05:12,721
staff is shouldering a lot more

911
01:05:14,101 --> 01:05:17,670
at personal and professional and financial risk,

912
01:05:19,710 --> 01:05:21,481
whether we need more information like this.

913
01:05:22,020 --> 01:05:27,240
And then also talking about my recommendation of supporting these grant

914
01:05:27,330 --> 01:05:32,910
applications and to initially fund the

915
01:05:33,000 --> 01:05:33,570
matching

916
01:05:34,860 --> 01:05:37,080
portion of these grants by

917
01:05:38,340 --> 01:05:43,290
basically not filling the human resources director that was supposed to fill the

918
01:05:43,380 --> 01:05:45,810
assistant town administrator/human resources director

919
01:05:47,221 --> 01:05:49,740
by essentially having me take on all three roles

920
01:05:51,630 --> 01:05:56,400
temporarily. We are going to eliminate this position anyways next year because we

921
01:05:57,330 --> 01:06:01,440
have a deficit next year. But at least this year, if we don't fill this position,

922
01:06:02,040 --> 01:06:07,590
then we would have the matching funds to at least apply for and initiate these

923
01:06:07,620 --> 01:06:11,070
grants. But again, knowing that has consequences, too.

924
01:06:11,370 --> 01:06:15,481
So you want me to do economic development, but I now have to do human resources

925
01:06:15,540 --> 01:06:19,981
work. So I think the public really has to understand that it's certainly one thing

926
01:06:20,010 --> 01:06:25,050
to demand that we be creative, that we roll up our sleeves, but when it comes to

927
01:06:25,740 --> 01:06:27,391
some of the priorities in this community,

928
01:06:28,920 --> 01:06:29,670
at the end of the day,

929
01:06:31,560 --> 01:06:33,810
it's not easy for me because it also means

930
01:06:35,701 --> 01:06:38,250
less ability to be proactive in other areas.

931
01:06:39,540 --> 01:06:43,680
But this is one of those critical things where

932
01:06:44,971 --> 01:06:47,400
we can be like, "Oh, it's zero-based budget," the whole thing right now.

933
01:06:47,460 --> 01:06:49,951
But there are also things that bubble up to

934
01:06:51,481 --> 01:06:52,260
what I consider to be

935
01:06:56,070 --> 01:06:59,340
an immediate priority with huge implications on the community.

936
01:07:00,030 --> 01:07:03,510
Public safety is one of those things that we take for granted.

937
01:07:04,260 --> 01:07:06,570
Some people might say they don't take it for granted, but I think as a whole,

938
01:07:07,050 --> 01:07:12,150
communities often take public safety for granted because you don't see the complex

939
01:07:12,210 --> 01:07:17,520
work that might be done on one or multiple individuals because we are

940
01:07:18,090 --> 01:07:18,990
living our lives. So

941
01:07:20,370 --> 01:07:23,370
this is something that I worry about, I want us to talk more about.

942
01:07:24,000 --> 01:07:29,610
But at least immediately, the select board needs to indicate that you understand

943
01:07:30,300 --> 01:07:33,481
what the chief has said, that you are committed to helping to be part of the

944
01:07:33,540 --> 01:07:38,610
solution, that you support these grants even if you have concerns about that, that

945
01:07:38,910 --> 01:07:41,490
you understand that we are asking for trade-off in terms of

946
01:07:42,840 --> 01:07:45,840
not hiring town administration support,

947
01:07:47,670 --> 01:07:50,340
and that we also need to figure out a couple of other things.

948
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:53,340
So there's some recommendations I'll have later on in the budget.

949
01:07:53,370 --> 01:07:58,260
For example, we have two appropriations of the three appropriations members that

950
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:02,701
have voluntarily assigned themselves to the police department, and we'll talk about

951
01:08:02,731 --> 01:08:06,391
whether the select board wants to either create a liaison position to the

952
01:08:06,451 --> 01:08:11,340
Appropriations Committee or whether you as individuals want to volunteer and join

953
01:08:12,149 --> 01:08:15,780
individual appropriation groups that are working with different departments,

954
01:08:15,840 --> 01:08:18,931
including public safety, including schools, including public works, et cetera.

955
01:08:19,020 --> 01:08:19,141
So

956
01:08:21,210 --> 01:08:25,710
again, these are hard conversations, but I think the public wants to hear from the

957
01:08:25,740 --> 01:08:30,120
executive leadership on where you stand, even if it's a hard discussion.

958
01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:33,540
Any comments?

959
01:08:35,851 --> 01:08:37,590
I have a couple of questions I'd like to ask.

960
01:08:37,920 --> 01:08:42,210
The chief, I feel like the most concerning thing that you talked about, to me at

961
01:08:42,240 --> 01:08:46,891
least, was the very thin shifts in the force overtime, and I want to understand if

962
01:08:47,010 --> 01:08:52,500
the grant about hiring an SRO would in any way alleviate either of

963
01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:54,150
those items.

964
01:08:55,770 --> 01:09:00,360
Yes, because an SRO position, we at least have three months out of the year, the

965
01:09:00,451 --> 01:09:02,310
summertime, to be able to cover shifts.

966
01:09:02,400 --> 01:09:07,951
So when I talked about the 17% increase in overtime, that was one less body to fill

967
01:09:08,010 --> 01:09:13,290
those shifts. We also had an officer out on military leave and injured on duty, but

968
01:09:13,380 --> 01:09:19,141
that would give us that officer back for most of June, all of July, and all of

969
01:09:19,231 --> 01:09:19,740
August.

970
01:09:20,910 --> 01:09:24,750
Okay. And then the second question that I had was when the motor vehicle

971
01:09:24,810 --> 01:09:29,941
enforcement had gone down by 30%, did you see any sort of upswing in

972
01:09:30,630 --> 01:09:33,030
accidents with serious injury or fatalities?

973
01:09:35,010 --> 01:09:37,441
Last month we had three OUI accidents.

974
01:09:39,181 --> 01:09:40,560
I don't know how that compares to other-

975
01:09:41,370 --> 01:09:42,030
That's a lot.

976
01:09:42,481 --> 01:09:42,601
Yeah.

977
01:09:43,530 --> 01:09:49,260
Three OUI accidents in a period. Two were on the same night within 30 minutes of

978
01:09:49,290 --> 01:09:52,740
each other. The other one was about five days away.

979
01:09:53,790 --> 01:09:54,150
Thank you.

980
01:09:54,240 --> 01:09:54,810
So, yes.

981
01:09:55,110 --> 01:09:55,260
Yep.

982
01:09:56,220 --> 01:09:56,580
Kevin.

983
01:09:57,481 --> 01:09:59,670
Chief, is the grant, is that the COPS grant?

984
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:01,620
That's correct, the COPS hiring grant.

985
01:10:01,710 --> 01:10:03,390
How many year commitment beyond?

986
01:10:03,960 --> 01:10:04,350
One year.

987
01:10:04,680 --> 01:10:04,951
One year.

988
01:10:05,010 --> 01:10:09,451
So it's a three-year grant, $150,000, which if you figure that-

989
01:10:09,930 --> 01:10:10,231
And then it's up for renewal

990
01:10:10,290 --> 01:10:11,640
... you have to do the fourth year.

991
01:10:12,030 --> 01:10:12,270
Okay.

992
01:10:12,510 --> 01:10:17,880
The other grant is the VOWA grant. That is three years, doesn't require a

993
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:22,410
fourth-year commitment, so we could reduce the position. Hopefully, we wouldn't.

994
01:10:22,890 --> 01:10:23,640
Okay. Thank you.

995
01:10:27,360 --> 01:10:30,451
I just want to say that I'm extremely concerned.

996
01:10:30,720 --> 01:10:35,010
Chief, you gave us an unbelievable report for just the month of September alone.

997
01:10:35,070 --> 01:10:36,060
Yeah.

998
01:10:36,270 --> 01:10:37,830
That's just one month.

999
01:10:37,890 --> 01:10:41,970
And that's just juveniles. I just gave you the juvenile reports.

1000
01:10:42,570 --> 01:10:42,900
Sure.

1001
01:10:45,630 --> 01:10:51,570
So I guess my question is, is there any sort of contribution

1002
01:10:51,600 --> 01:10:54,870
from schools at all on the extra money we gave them towards this?

1003
01:10:55,530 --> 01:10:57,120
Or does it have to be town budget?

1004
01:10:58,860 --> 01:11:03,060
It has to be town budget. It's the police budget that would need to be supported.

1005
01:11:03,510 --> 01:11:06,451
Even though it's SRO that we're looking to go for or to

1006
01:11:08,010 --> 01:11:08,550
replenish?

1007
01:11:09,210 --> 01:11:11,460
Well, historically, it's come from the town side.

1008
01:11:11,580 --> 01:11:16,020
I haven't asked the schools to commit to this at all.

1009
01:11:18,540 --> 01:11:19,350
I think there are certainly

1010
01:11:20,670 --> 01:11:26,310
consequences there as well, and we certainly have a not very

1011
01:11:27,299 --> 01:11:32,640
elegant temporary solution to this, and then we can have that ongoing

1012
01:11:32,670 --> 01:11:33,510
conversation.

1013
01:11:34,920 --> 01:11:39,180
I think some of the

1014
01:11:41,370 --> 01:11:45,240
math or equation or calculation for the schools is that

1015
01:11:46,680 --> 01:11:52,560
if they could potentially lose hundreds of thousands of dollars more

1016
01:11:52,860 --> 01:11:54,900
without some investments that they're making, so

1017
01:11:59,400 --> 01:12:01,650
it would be a net negative. I would be in a worse position.

1018
01:12:01,770 --> 01:12:02,010
Sure.

1019
01:12:02,100 --> 01:12:06,270
So not just matching the grant, but then putting other positions in danger.

1020
01:12:06,360 --> 01:12:08,820
So we just have to understand how it all fits together.

1021
01:12:09,180 --> 01:12:11,731
I'm definitely deeply concerned, as I mentioned earlier.

1022
01:12:11,790 --> 01:12:17,191
But I think I kind of separate myself from pretty much everyone in this room.

1023
01:12:17,520 --> 01:12:21,300
I interact with pretty much every one of our officers, and I think we're so

1024
01:12:21,360 --> 01:12:24,330
fortunate to have who we have, including our chief.

1025
01:12:24,540 --> 01:12:25,350
Mm-hmm.

1026
01:12:25,500 --> 01:12:27,360
I think that we

1027
01:12:28,560 --> 01:12:32,701
definitely need to support our police department based on what we're being told

1028
01:12:32,790 --> 01:12:35,310
from the chief. And again, it was just juveniles.

1029
01:12:37,860 --> 01:12:39,540
That's just the tip of the iceberg, I guess.

1030
01:12:39,780 --> 01:12:40,020
Mm-hmm.

1031
01:12:41,610 --> 01:12:44,941
Yeah. It's very sobering. I really appreciate the points.

1032
01:12:45,270 --> 01:12:46,110
Mm-hmm.

1033
01:12:46,170 --> 01:12:48,270
I am concerned about,

1034
01:12:49,560 --> 01:12:53,280
and I totally want to figure out if there's a way we can find money.

1035
01:12:53,340 --> 01:12:58,530
This reminds me so much of the conversation we had not but a few months ago about

1036
01:12:58,560 --> 01:13:01,470
our accreditation in the library. Everybody wants it.

1037
01:13:01,830 --> 01:13:07,770
They want what they want, but there's got to be a recognition that there's a price

1038
01:13:07,800 --> 01:13:13,410
we're paying here, and the price will be without a human

1039
01:13:13,441 --> 01:13:18,691
resources director, and how we will work that out and what that will look like in

1040
01:13:18,810 --> 01:13:22,350
one year, in two years, in three years for our administration.

1041
01:13:22,860 --> 01:13:28,770
When you talk about thin staffing, I think I'm seeing that in conversations I've

1042
01:13:28,830 --> 01:13:33,810
had and contact I've had with different department heads that we're seeing this

1043
01:13:33,900 --> 01:13:39,810
across the board. And I don't have an answer for it, but I'm concerned

1044
01:13:39,870 --> 01:13:40,260
about it.

1045
01:13:42,300 --> 01:13:46,951
Yeah, I will say that with the HR position, this was something that we hoped to

1046
01:13:46,981 --> 01:13:49,500
have the fiscal year to figure out. So we don't have that solution.

1047
01:13:49,590 --> 01:13:49,740
So

1048
01:13:51,870 --> 01:13:53,820
we will have to figure it out anyway, so

1049
01:13:55,170 --> 01:13:57,600
I guess hearing the immediate need,

1050
01:13:59,100 --> 01:14:01,560
if we're talking about impact on the community,

1051
01:14:02,760 --> 01:14:05,100
we're talking about life safety, we're talking about staff safety,

1052
01:14:06,420 --> 01:14:08,280
we have to make these choices, so.

1053
01:14:12,645 --> 01:14:13,305
Anyone else?

1054
01:14:15,106 --> 01:14:15,345
Sure.

1055
01:14:17,145 --> 01:14:19,545
Hi. Julie Gentile, Appropriations Committee.

1056
01:14:20,265 --> 01:14:20,745
So Jen,

1057
01:14:23,385 --> 01:14:24,285
sorry, Chief.

1058
01:14:25,545 --> 01:14:25,695
Yeah.

1059
01:14:27,525 --> 01:14:33,465
27 is our number of officers. You have one out on injured on duty,

1060
01:14:34,305 --> 01:14:38,985
then you just had a retirement. You have one on military leave, and you have an

1061
01:14:39,076 --> 01:14:40,725
opening that's been seven months.

1062
01:14:42,076 --> 01:14:44,265
Does that mean we have 23 officers currently?

1063
01:14:47,895 --> 01:14:49,755
It's always a moving target.

1064
01:14:50,445 --> 01:14:50,835
But roughly.

1065
01:14:50,865 --> 01:14:51,405
I think we're

1066
01:14:52,725 --> 01:14:53,235
paying

1067
01:14:55,695 --> 01:14:57,735
28 officers right now.

1068
01:14:58,125 --> 01:14:58,425
Okay.

1069
01:14:59,265 --> 01:15:02,475
But we have 24 officers working.

1070
01:15:03,225 --> 01:15:03,435
Okay.

1071
01:15:05,326 --> 01:15:09,555
And then my second question, of course, we'll be meeting later this week, but my

1072
01:15:09,615 --> 01:15:14,326
second question would be if you've had an opening for seven months and no takers-

1073
01:15:14,505 --> 01:15:14,745
Mm-hmm

1074
01:15:14,745 --> 01:15:18,555
... and we're going to have two positions open, what do we hope to change?

1075
01:15:20,025 --> 01:15:24,106
Should the grant come through and we get to offer those two positions, what

1076
01:15:25,576 --> 01:15:26,985
do you think will change in the-

1077
01:15:27,645 --> 01:15:28,335
The applicant pool?

1078
01:15:28,335 --> 01:15:29,356
... applicant pool? Yes.

1079
01:15:29,895 --> 01:15:32,356
Because we won't be looking for a trained officer.

1080
01:15:32,715 --> 01:15:34,095
We'll be looking for

1081
01:15:35,505 --> 01:15:39,375
an officer that is untrained, which does take time and expense.

1082
01:15:39,435 --> 01:15:44,445
The academy starts in March, so we really need to start that recruitment now to be

1083
01:15:44,505 --> 01:15:50,295
able to make a job offer in January to see how things shake out

1084
01:15:51,375 --> 01:15:52,515
with these grants.

1085
01:15:53,775 --> 01:15:53,895
If

1086
01:15:55,305 --> 01:15:59,985
we are successful in getting the grants and the funding, we'd be ready to hire a

1087
01:16:00,015 --> 01:16:02,205
new officer and send them to the academy.

1088
01:16:05,805 --> 01:16:10,576
And new officers, untrained officers, are willing to take a risk on a community,

1089
01:16:10,635 --> 01:16:15,195
but you're not willing as much to take a risk to leave a neighboring community when

1090
01:16:15,255 --> 01:16:20,925
you'll be the low officer on the seniority list and

1091
01:16:20,985 --> 01:16:23,385
potentially looking at a layoff.

1092
01:16:25,755 --> 01:16:27,645
Because they know they'll get a job someplace else.

1093
01:16:33,856 --> 01:16:35,356
Any other comments on this?

1094
01:16:37,995 --> 01:16:43,305
I guess my only comment is that, Lisa, I trust you to not offer a trade that you

1095
01:16:44,445 --> 01:16:46,875
can't stand.

1096
01:16:48,465 --> 01:16:52,005
And so if you're supporting this, then I would support you in it.

1097
01:16:53,835 --> 01:16:53,925
Yeah,

1098
01:16:58,875 --> 01:17:02,115
I don't like it, but I don't like what the officers are facing even more.

1099
01:17:02,715 --> 01:17:02,925
Yep.

1100
01:17:03,375 --> 01:17:05,055
And I wish I had

1101
01:17:07,695 --> 01:17:10,515
the ability to do this five times, but I don't .

1102
01:17:12,255 --> 01:17:18,045
So this is just a tip of the iceberg, but it shows you that every

1103
01:17:19,125 --> 01:17:19,785
move like this,

1104
01:17:21,435 --> 01:17:26,295
the impact is significant. Just to comment on what you said, Carol, about

1105
01:17:27,826 --> 01:17:32,865
staff need Fridays to catch up. Well, I've heard from the public, well, if you're

1106
01:17:32,925 --> 01:17:36,615
open to the public one day less, you should receive 20% less pay.

1107
01:17:36,975 --> 01:17:42,076
And when you have departments that have gone from three to two, or four to two, or

1108
01:17:42,135 --> 01:17:47,115
two to one, you literally have people that are doubling their amount of work or

1109
01:17:47,985 --> 01:17:53,775
increasing it by 50% or 30%. So, to say that they're going to get a break

1110
01:17:53,835 --> 01:17:59,175
from customer-facing work on Fridays when their

1111
01:17:59,205 --> 01:18:01,425
customer-facing employees have been eliminated,

1112
01:18:02,865 --> 01:18:08,595
we still have a town to operate. So I do want the public to understand that the

1113
01:18:08,655 --> 01:18:09,255
employees,

1114
01:18:10,965 --> 01:18:16,215
I know it's easy to say, "Oh, give everybody a 20% reduction." Most are facing a

1115
01:18:16,275 --> 01:18:21,285
pretty significant and sizable increase in job duties, which is not feasible.

1116
01:18:21,915 --> 01:18:24,465
People are not working 80 hours a week. They might be working 60.

1117
01:18:25,425 --> 01:18:28,965
They might be working 60 anyways and then having these additional duties.

1118
01:18:29,415 --> 01:18:34,005
So you then have to spend additional time figuring out what can't get done, and you

1119
01:18:34,066 --> 01:18:37,785
also have to figure out ways in which to accommodate those kinds of changes and

1120
01:18:37,816 --> 01:18:39,135
then communicate those changes. So

1121
01:18:40,965 --> 01:18:44,835
again, I don't necessarily know if the public is really seeing-- They're probably

1122
01:18:44,865 --> 01:18:49,695
not seeing the pain that is happening, but there are a lot of implications for not

1123
01:18:49,845 --> 01:18:54,975
operating a community properly and with the police department being one of the top

1124
01:18:55,995 --> 01:18:58,035
huge immediate impacts on the public.

1125
01:18:58,395 --> 01:18:58,576
So,

1126
01:19:00,045 --> 01:19:03,106
I know it's easy to say it's a priority, we want to make these investments, we can

1127
01:19:03,135 --> 01:19:04,515
make these moves, but

1128
01:19:05,835 --> 01:19:11,775
today is just a Band-Aid, and there are certainly ideas, and there

1129
01:19:11,865 --> 01:19:13,965
are actions that we are going to work on.

1130
01:19:15,045 --> 01:19:16,845
There's a commitment that I have to

1131
01:19:19,155 --> 01:19:23,415
not go below the existing staffing for patrol.

1132
01:19:23,925 --> 01:19:27,795
But we have a study that basically says we need to increase it.

1133
01:19:27,856 --> 01:19:31,215
We have comms with other communities that actually say we need to find growth.

1134
01:19:32,535 --> 01:19:37,845
Right now, the day is just to try to restore some of the school resource support.

1135
01:19:38,115 --> 01:19:38,385
But

1136
01:19:40,185 --> 01:19:45,826
I just want to say, it's an indication to the public of where we are, and that at

1137
01:19:46,606 --> 01:19:49,635
points in the future, we are going to need the public to help step up and be part

1138
01:19:49,665 --> 01:19:51,585
of the conversation and to be part of the solution.

1139
01:19:52,576 --> 01:19:56,865
And we also need to show the public because I don't think they really understood

1140
01:19:57,255 --> 01:20:01,095
what we're facing when they also had to make these pretty significant decisions on

1141
01:20:01,515 --> 01:20:04,275
whether they were going to increase their own tax bill.

1142
01:20:04,365 --> 01:20:06,465
So again, important conversations.

1143
01:20:06,795 --> 01:20:07,875
I just want to elevate it,

1144
01:20:09,285 --> 01:20:14,326
and to make sure it's not just something that is happening in silos.

1145
01:20:14,385 --> 01:20:14,566
So

1146
01:20:16,275 --> 01:20:18,345
I don't know how

1147
01:20:19,816 --> 01:20:23,085
because we're still just dealing with the shortfalls from last year to this year.

1148
01:20:23,715 --> 01:20:26,265
We have now additional shortfalls that we're facing this year.

1149
01:20:26,805 --> 01:20:28,066
We're still trying to figure it out.

1150
01:20:29,085 --> 01:20:33,885
And we're also being asked, do this initiative, do that thing. Reach out.

1151
01:20:33,945 --> 01:20:36,225
Have this or that.

1152
01:20:36,795 --> 01:20:39,375
Yeah, we're trying. We're doing our best, I will say.

1153
01:20:42,856 --> 01:20:44,085
Jeff, can I just make a comment?

1154
01:20:45,255 --> 01:20:45,645
Sure.

1155
01:20:46,606 --> 01:20:51,645
So, I really appreciate the chief coming in and giving those stats.

1156
01:20:51,705 --> 01:20:53,475
As scary as they are and

1157
01:20:55,245 --> 01:20:59,685
as alarmed as we all should be about some of those stats, and again, those are, as

1158
01:20:59,745 --> 01:21:03,345
she pointed out, just dealing with the youth in our community.

1159
01:21:03,735 --> 01:21:08,655
I can't imagine what the remainder of the stats and the calls look like that the

1160
01:21:08,685 --> 01:21:10,695
department has to face on a daily basis.

1161
01:21:12,735 --> 01:21:18,076
I appreciate them because I think it allows everybody to really understand what's

1162
01:21:18,106 --> 01:21:19,816
going on in town and what they're seeing.

1163
01:21:20,685 --> 01:21:25,455
I think there is a disconnect from what our officers in town have to see or deal

1164
01:21:25,485 --> 01:21:28,755
with on a daily basis and what we see as residents.

1165
01:21:28,845 --> 01:21:33,975
Just we see them having cars pulled over, some minor traffic stops, but

1166
01:21:34,965 --> 01:21:35,145
the

1167
01:21:36,856 --> 01:21:39,465
calls and the incidents that the chief was describing,

1168
01:21:41,085 --> 01:21:41,326
they're

1169
01:21:43,515 --> 01:21:45,645
a real part of what's going on in our community.

1170
01:21:46,335 --> 01:21:49,425
And again, that's just a portion of what they're seeing.

1171
01:21:49,545 --> 01:21:54,405
So I think that we all should be concerned because not only is it a safety issue

1172
01:21:54,495 --> 01:22:00,345
for the individuals involved in those calls, but it's also a real safety issue

1173
01:22:00,435 --> 01:22:02,115
for the officers who are responding.

1174
01:22:02,235 --> 01:22:02,385
So,

1175
01:22:03,765 --> 01:22:07,245
thank you, Chief, for taking the time to give us all of that information, and I

1176
01:22:07,335 --> 01:22:13,215
think Lisa hearing information like this from different departments really

1177
01:22:13,275 --> 01:22:18,435
paints a real picture of what's going on in town and some of

1178
01:22:20,235 --> 01:22:24,915
the priorities or what we need to figure out of how to move forward and how to

1179
01:22:24,975 --> 01:22:27,255
ensure the safety of our community.

1180
01:22:34,335 --> 01:22:38,326
And I think it's important to just-- I'll just add one more thing that for some

1181
01:22:39,106 --> 01:22:42,345
stability for the next sort of year two, three of the grant,

1182
01:22:43,725 --> 01:22:48,645
we will continue to see savings, significant savings for the next two years because

1183
01:22:48,705 --> 01:22:54,615
of the dispatch change. So, we put in about a quarter of the dispatch

1184
01:22:54,795 --> 01:22:59,326
budget in this year's budget because we're still transitioning But

1185
01:22:59,475 --> 01:23:03,915
we're not going to have that the next two years, so that will help sustain these

1186
01:23:04,005 --> 01:23:09,795
positions. But it also means that we have both the need to sustain

1187
01:23:09,975 --> 01:23:15,945
the DOJ grant and to also figure out, because we're going to have to start paying

1188
01:23:16,035 --> 01:23:19,215
into the Westfield dispatch in year four.

1189
01:23:20,415 --> 01:23:25,395
So I'm just saying, we never solve a problem definitely, but we do have a

1190
01:23:25,425 --> 01:23:31,365
multi-year plan to sustain this. Which is as much for

1191
01:23:31,455 --> 01:23:35,175
you as it is for our police force to kind of know that

1192
01:23:36,405 --> 01:23:40,665
we're not looking at layoffs in the police department unless something crazy

1193
01:23:40,725 --> 01:23:41,115
happens.

1194
01:23:43,245 --> 01:23:46,606
500% increase in health insurance is a whole another story that we can never know,

1195
01:23:47,324 --> 01:23:48,285
because I can't guarantee everything.

1196
01:23:48,316 --> 01:23:54,045
But we do have plans to look at these grants, to make these significant

1197
01:23:54,106 --> 01:23:56,745
restructuring changes, to look at those

1198
01:23:58,095 --> 01:24:00,915
sustainability over the next few years, so I just want to make sure you know that.

1199
01:24:06,525 --> 01:24:08,775
So do you need a vote from us? Do you need us-

1200
01:24:09,375 --> 01:24:10,515
I have two motions for you.

1201
01:24:11,925 --> 01:24:17,505
I move to support the hiring of an additional officer if the town receives the DOJ

1202
01:24:17,566 --> 01:24:18,525
grant this fall.

1203
01:24:20,955 --> 01:24:21,316
Second.

1204
01:24:23,835 --> 01:24:25,155
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

1205
01:24:25,455 --> 01:24:25,665
Aye.

1206
01:24:26,175 --> 01:24:26,505
Carol?

1207
01:24:26,715 --> 01:24:27,045
Aye.

1208
01:24:27,106 --> 01:24:27,585
Kevin?

1209
01:24:28,066 --> 01:24:28,275
Aye.

1210
01:24:28,515 --> 01:24:29,085
Priscilla?

1211
01:24:29,835 --> 01:24:30,106
Aye.

1212
01:24:31,365 --> 01:24:34,275
Aye. Unanimous. Onto our second motion.

1213
01:24:34,695 --> 01:24:39,165
So I didn't include the domestic violence grant in this motion.

1214
01:24:39,856 --> 01:24:42,316
Can you remind me when we might receive word about that?

1215
01:24:44,685 --> 01:24:50,505
That grant is due in the end of October, so likely we would

1216
01:24:50,566 --> 01:24:55,125
not find out until the end of December on that grant.

1217
01:24:55,185 --> 01:24:56,265
That's one of the Byrne-

1218
01:24:57,375 --> 01:24:57,615
East-

1219
01:24:57,735 --> 01:24:59,505
VAWA. Yep.

1220
01:25:01,725 --> 01:25:05,295
Can I just ask the board to consider whether you want to move to support the VAWA

1221
01:25:05,356 --> 01:25:06,195
grant as well?

1222
01:25:10,455 --> 01:25:11,805
Absolutely. I do.

1223
01:25:11,865 --> 01:25:12,615
Yeah.

1224
01:25:14,745 --> 01:25:14,835
So-

1225
01:25:15,225 --> 01:25:15,615
Okay.

1226
01:25:16,755 --> 01:25:16,965
Okay.

1227
01:25:18,255 --> 01:25:23,055
I move to support the application for the,

1228
01:25:24,375 --> 01:25:25,335
what's the name of the grant?

1229
01:25:25,845 --> 01:25:30,165
State VAWA, Violence Against Women Act grant.

1230
01:25:30,195 --> 01:25:33,255
Violence Against Women Act grant.

1231
01:25:34,155 --> 01:25:34,545
Second.

1232
01:25:36,106 --> 01:25:37,665
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

1233
01:25:37,875 --> 01:25:38,175
Aye.

1234
01:25:38,235 --> 01:25:38,715
Carol?

1235
01:25:38,805 --> 01:25:39,015
Aye.

1236
01:25:39,525 --> 01:25:39,915
Kevin?

1237
01:25:40,125 --> 01:25:40,335
Aye.

1238
01:25:40,395 --> 01:25:40,935
Priscilla?

1239
01:25:41,535 --> 01:25:41,775
Aye.

1240
01:25:42,765 --> 01:25:45,885
Aye. Unanimous. Thank you. Chief, thank you very much.

1241
01:25:45,915 --> 01:25:50,205
Thank you for your support. I'll be having a meeting next week with Appropriations

1242
01:25:50,235 --> 01:25:50,265
and-

1243
01:25:50,265 --> 01:25:51,195
Thank you for everyone who's watching

1244
01:25:51,345 --> 01:25:53,115
... we'll do another deep dive.

1245
01:25:53,385 --> 01:25:54,585
Yeah. Thank you.

1246
01:25:54,675 --> 01:25:58,545
Okay. Do you want to look at the second motion to be able to fund the match?

1247
01:25:59,025 --> 01:26:01,515
I moved to... Oh.

1248
01:26:04,725 --> 01:26:04,935
No.

1249
01:26:05,175 --> 01:26:05,475
Nope.

1250
01:26:05,925 --> 01:26:07,425
Thank you so much for coming in.

1251
01:26:09,945 --> 01:26:10,755
Yeah. Thank you.

1252
01:26:11,175 --> 01:26:16,185
I move to support holding off on hiring a human resources director in fiscal year

1253
01:26:16,395 --> 01:26:21,555
2027, and direct the funds to support the match to the DOJ grant.

1254
01:26:21,856 --> 01:26:22,275
And VAWA.

1255
01:26:22,395 --> 01:26:23,025
And the-

1256
01:26:23,595 --> 01:26:24,856
The AWA, VAWA

1257
01:26:25,035 --> 01:26:25,785
... VAWA grant.

1258
01:26:26,985 --> 01:26:27,375
Second.

1259
01:26:29,055 --> 01:26:30,645
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

1260
01:26:30,735 --> 01:26:30,945
Aye.

1261
01:26:31,335 --> 01:26:31,635
Carol?

1262
01:26:31,935 --> 01:26:32,235
Aye.

1263
01:26:32,295 --> 01:26:32,625
Kevin?

1264
01:26:32,955 --> 01:26:33,106
Aye.

1265
01:26:33,405 --> 01:26:33,856
Priscilla?

1266
01:26:34,545 --> 01:26:34,785
Aye.

1267
01:26:35,805 --> 01:26:37,365
Aye. Unanimous. Thank you.

1268
01:26:39,015 --> 01:26:40,365
Thank you for your clarification, Lisa.

1269
01:26:41,175 --> 01:26:45,525
Okay, next item under new business, we have the town meeting warrant draft.

1270
01:26:49,125 --> 01:26:50,805
Has everybody had a chance to take a look at that?

1271
01:26:55,005 --> 01:26:57,585
Lisa, I'm curious why marijuana hasn't made this.

1272
01:26:57,645 --> 01:27:00,645
Are we waiting for Bylaw Review Committee? Is that why we're doing that?

1273
01:27:01,455 --> 01:27:04,395
So at the last meeting, we discussed holding this off until annual town meeting.

1274
01:27:04,725 --> 01:27:06,285
Oh, right. Thank you.

1275
01:27:08,235 --> 01:27:13,365
I guess the question about that is the board received memos from public safety and

1276
01:27:13,425 --> 01:27:14,025
public health,

1277
01:27:15,975 --> 01:27:19,995
and we haven't discussed it, but at some point in time, there should be a

1278
01:27:20,055 --> 01:27:23,175
discussion about that. You might want to get input about...

1279
01:27:24,465 --> 01:27:28,455
You might want to get further input from the public, do a listening session.

1280
01:27:29,655 --> 01:27:32,925
You might want to recommend or send it to planning, right?

1281
01:27:32,985 --> 01:27:35,356
For them to then draft a bylaw as well.

1282
01:27:35,985 --> 01:27:36,255
So,

1283
01:27:38,205 --> 01:27:41,595
there's a lot of steps when it comes to looking at something like this that-

1284
01:27:41,925 --> 01:27:42,106
Okay

1285
01:27:42,375 --> 01:27:47,445
... the board should consider. But holding off until town meeting gives us time to

1286
01:27:47,475 --> 01:27:47,895
do that.

1287
01:27:51,106 --> 01:27:51,525
Carol.

1288
01:27:51,645 --> 01:27:55,606
So I had a question about the citizens' initiative,

1289
01:27:56,985 --> 01:27:57,435
to

1290
01:27:59,295 --> 01:28:00,435
the recall petition.

1291
01:28:03,435 --> 01:28:08,025
It's quite lengthy, a lot of legalese here, a couple pages long.

1292
01:28:10,545 --> 01:28:12,675
Should we vote on something like this?

1293
01:28:12,765 --> 01:28:16,245
Do we know that this is something that is legal?

1294
01:28:18,705 --> 01:28:18,826
We

1295
01:28:20,385 --> 01:28:21,316
specifically said-

1296
01:28:21,375 --> 01:28:21,945
Yeah

1297
01:28:21,945 --> 01:28:27,345
... that our town lawyers couldn't help them draft this

1298
01:28:27,405 --> 01:28:28,066
petition.

1299
01:28:29,295 --> 01:28:33,735
But should it be passed by town meeting, is it something that

1300
01:28:34,816 --> 01:28:37,275
works, that is in-

1301
01:28:38,745 --> 01:28:40,725
Well, the policy was that now that it's been submitted,

1302
01:28:42,375 --> 01:28:46,695
staff and select board can use our best judgment to

1303
01:28:47,895 --> 01:28:52,005
review this. So it's appropriate for us to run this by legal.

1304
01:28:52,095 --> 01:28:56,385
So legal does have this draft here, so this draft has not been vetted.

1305
01:28:57,076 --> 01:29:02,865
Now, legal can come back and say article six or eight, something that we initiated

1306
01:29:02,925 --> 01:29:04,155
has to look like this, or

1307
01:29:05,595 --> 01:29:08,715
here's how you need to amend the wording.

1308
01:29:08,865 --> 01:29:12,525
We cannot change the wording of a citizen petition.

1309
01:29:13,215 --> 01:29:13,576
Mm-hmm.

1310
01:29:13,635 --> 01:29:15,795
But we can get legal advice on

1311
01:29:17,985 --> 01:29:21,615
whatever their comments are, whether it's they feel like it

1312
01:29:23,054 --> 01:29:26,475
is... I don't know what exactly they would say because every petition is different.

1313
01:29:26,835 --> 01:29:27,076
But,

1314
01:29:28,365 --> 01:29:28,635
you know.

1315
01:29:34,755 --> 01:29:34,995
Cool.

1316
01:29:36,705 --> 01:29:38,566
Yeah. Bylaw review's meeting tomorrow.

1317
01:29:38,655 --> 01:29:44,265
I know that they've been working on the last citizen petition that was

1318
01:29:44,326 --> 01:29:47,715
forwarded to them. I don't know if they're going to be commenting specifically on

1319
01:29:47,775 --> 01:29:50,025
this either, but these are all things that

1320
01:29:51,705 --> 01:29:55,305
when this is finalized in two weeks for your review, you'll have more information.

1321
01:29:55,395 --> 01:29:59,955
So this is your opportunity to at least answer some questions, get some clarity.

1322
01:30:00,045 --> 01:30:02,715
Maybe there are certain things that we're missing on here.

1323
01:30:02,835 --> 01:30:03,675
You can just let me know.

1324
01:30:07,395 --> 01:30:08,805
Any comments on this at all?

1325
01:30:10,066 --> 01:30:14,685
I have concerns about Article 10, the data center bylaw.

1326
01:30:14,745 --> 01:30:15,076
Mm-hmm.

1327
01:30:17,085 --> 01:30:18,645
Based on discussion that we've had tonight.

1328
01:30:18,915 --> 01:30:19,066
Right.

1329
01:30:19,066 --> 01:30:20,925
I don't know how other members are feeling about that.

1330
01:30:21,945 --> 01:30:22,185
Well, I

1331
01:30:23,715 --> 01:30:24,645
personally think

1332
01:30:25,935 --> 01:30:31,035
that it needs to go under review. I think we can call it a one-year moratorium, and

1333
01:30:31,066 --> 01:30:36,285
I don't know if that's a town meeting vote or not, but I do think that we have to

1334
01:30:36,345 --> 01:30:40,095
study this further before we just say we banned all data centers because-

1335
01:30:41,685 --> 01:30:42,765
Yeah, we need to look into this

1336
01:30:42,795 --> 01:30:43,875
... it's not defined.

1337
01:30:43,935 --> 01:30:44,055
Right.

1338
01:30:44,085 --> 01:30:47,535
And I think even the citizen who wrote the letter

1339
01:30:49,515 --> 01:30:55,335
suggested that possibly a wholesale ban puts us in an-

1340
01:30:55,635 --> 01:30:55,905
Mm-hmm

1341
01:30:55,905 --> 01:30:57,705
... uncomfortable legal position.

1342
01:30:58,035 --> 01:31:01,005
Yeah. The staff isn't ready to make a recommendation.

1343
01:31:01,425 --> 01:31:03,135
The staff doesn't have a draft right now.

1344
01:31:03,705 --> 01:31:07,875
The planning board public hearing is going to happen after you would vote on

1345
01:31:07,965 --> 01:31:09,255
finalizing the warrant, so-

1346
01:31:09,795 --> 01:31:09,945
Mm

1347
01:31:09,945 --> 01:31:15,435
... this would be the time to make that decision of saying, "Let's take this off

1348
01:31:15,495 --> 01:31:17,655
the warrant." You don't have to say it has to go on the annual town meeting

1349
01:31:17,685 --> 01:31:22,035
warrant, but let's take this off just like we did with marijuana, and study it

1350
01:31:22,095 --> 01:31:22,455
further.

1351
01:31:22,905 --> 01:31:23,085
Mm.

1352
01:31:23,145 --> 01:31:23,475
Great.

1353
01:31:23,745 --> 01:31:25,635
Great. I agree with that, yeah.

1354
01:31:25,665 --> 01:31:26,175
Yeah. Great.

1355
01:31:26,295 --> 01:31:26,385
Yeah.

1356
01:31:26,415 --> 01:31:26,745
Do you want to hold on that?

1357
01:31:26,805 --> 01:31:27,345
I think so.

1358
01:31:29,145 --> 01:31:29,535
No, because-

1359
01:31:29,566 --> 01:31:30,106
So you'll vote on?

1360
01:31:30,106 --> 01:31:31,305
... you'll vote on the final warrant.

1361
01:31:31,395 --> 01:31:31,485
Okay.

1362
01:31:31,485 --> 01:31:35,085
I think now this is getting feedback, and we'll take it off.

1363
01:31:35,115 --> 01:31:36,495
Priscilla, did you have something to say? I'm sorry.

1364
01:31:36,615 --> 01:31:38,085
I was just going to say I agree with that.

1365
01:31:38,175 --> 01:31:40,875
I think that this shouldn't be on there right now.

1366
01:31:40,905 --> 01:31:45,975
There's too many unknowns, and more information that we need to gather before

1367
01:31:46,875 --> 01:31:47,895
we move forward with that.

1368
01:31:52,035 --> 01:31:54,645
Anything else related to the warrant as presented?

1369
01:32:00,585 --> 01:32:01,845
I don't have any questions.

1370
01:32:06,249 --> 01:32:08,109
Anything else you need from us, Lisa? That's it?

1371
01:32:08,410 --> 01:32:10,029
No, that's it. That was good feedback.

1372
01:32:10,120 --> 01:32:10,929
All right. Thank you.

1373
01:32:12,309 --> 01:32:17,679
Okay, we are now onto One West Main Street, which we are going to push off until

1374
01:32:17,739 --> 01:32:19,299
our October 26th meeting.

1375
01:32:19,449 --> 01:32:19,870
Actually,

1376
01:32:21,549 --> 01:32:23,919
so I'm just bringing Anne over.

1377
01:32:24,429 --> 01:32:24,579
Oh.

1378
01:32:24,789 --> 01:32:30,459
There's a few different nuances to this conversation, one of which does need to be

1379
01:32:30,489 --> 01:32:31,239
discussed tonight.

1380
01:32:31,629 --> 01:32:31,749
Okay.

1381
01:32:32,289 --> 01:32:36,339
We brought this forward to the board various times to keep you informed about the

1382
01:32:36,370 --> 01:32:39,039
status of this property. This is the property that's next to the library that

1383
01:32:41,319 --> 01:32:42,039
had collapsed,

1384
01:32:43,329 --> 01:32:48,399
and Anne had been working on the Brownfields Grant.

1385
01:32:48,459 --> 01:32:54,339
I'm just trying to think of where the memo is.

1386
01:32:55,509 --> 01:33:00,099
There's a memo in the packet that is up for discussion tonight

1387
01:33:01,389 --> 01:33:05,349
that is from our director of planning conservation and our building commissioner,

1388
01:33:07,479 --> 01:33:13,359
recommending that we pursue action under Massachusetts General Law Chapter 143,

1389
01:33:13,419 --> 01:33:14,169
Section 5,

1390
01:33:15,399 --> 01:33:19,359
which is to appoint a three-member board to

1391
01:33:20,739 --> 01:33:24,999
initiate a process of pursuing demolition and cleanup of the site.

1392
01:33:26,829 --> 01:33:27,069
So,

1393
01:33:29,469 --> 01:33:32,709
this particular Massachusetts General Law allows us to

1394
01:33:33,939 --> 01:33:39,759
form this board that would consist of a surveyor, fire chief, and a quote unquote,

1395
01:33:40,209 --> 01:33:41,559
"disinterested person."

1396
01:33:44,319 --> 01:33:50,229
And we would want the board to support this tonight so that we could get the

1397
01:33:50,289 --> 01:33:52,959
ball rolling in case we do have the opportunity to

1398
01:33:54,579 --> 01:34:00,399
help to force or take further stronger legal action to make the building safe and

1399
01:34:00,639 --> 01:34:02,709
hopefully, ultimately usable and viable.

1400
01:34:05,199 --> 01:34:06,099
Do you want to bring Anne over?

1401
01:34:06,879 --> 01:34:09,939
Anne is here. Anne, did I forget anything pertinent?

1402
01:34:11,469 --> 01:34:13,870
No, I think you covered everything perfectly.

1403
01:34:15,189 --> 01:34:15,849
Anne, welcome.

1404
01:34:16,629 --> 01:34:16,959
Hello.

1405
01:34:20,229 --> 01:34:24,039
So that's all you need for us? You need a vote from us on that?

1406
01:34:24,910 --> 01:34:28,449
Yeah. So, the vote would be to create this three-person board.

1407
01:34:29,019 --> 01:34:31,149
Again, that's part of that Massachusetts General Law.

1408
01:34:31,329 --> 01:34:33,339
Folks, we can bring it up if you want to look at it further.

1409
01:34:33,399 --> 01:34:37,689
But, again, fire chief, surveyor, disinterested person appointed by the building

1410
01:34:37,719 --> 01:34:41,559
commissioner to pursue the demolition and cleanup of One West Main Street.

1411
01:34:41,799 --> 01:34:44,349
So there's a motion on the packet to do that.

1412
01:34:51,489 --> 01:34:53,079
It's the one in red, Carol, if you want to.

1413
01:34:53,229 --> 01:34:56,019
Okay. I'm just looking at it, waiting for somebody else. Okay.

1414
01:34:56,139 --> 01:35:00,699
I move to create a three-person board consisting of a fire chief, surveyor, and a

1415
01:35:00,789 --> 01:35:06,129
disinterested person appointed by the building commissioner and to pursue

1416
01:35:06,189 --> 01:35:09,189
demolition and cleanup of One West Main Street.

1417
01:35:09,579 --> 01:35:09,939
Second.

1418
01:35:12,069 --> 01:35:13,749
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

1419
01:35:14,109 --> 01:35:14,349
Aye.

1420
01:35:14,919 --> 01:35:15,339
Carol?

1421
01:35:15,429 --> 01:35:15,609
Aye.

1422
01:35:16,209 --> 01:35:16,689
Priscilla?

1423
01:35:17,289 --> 01:35:17,499
Aye.

1424
01:35:18,249 --> 01:35:18,549
Kevin?

1425
01:35:18,849 --> 01:35:19,089
Aye.

1426
01:35:19,539 --> 01:35:20,468
Aye. It's unanimous.

1427
01:35:20,739 --> 01:35:22,419
I just want to thank Anne and Jason-

1428
01:35:22,509 --> 01:35:22,629
Yeah

1429
01:35:22,629 --> 01:35:28,029
... for just being so diligent. This is a very complex project, and they have not

1430
01:35:28,059 --> 01:35:31,449
let go. So thank you. Thank you both for that. And more to come on this.

1431
01:35:31,719 --> 01:35:32,229
Thank you, Anne.

1432
01:35:32,919 --> 01:35:33,519
You're welcome.

1433
01:35:36,549 --> 01:35:36,819
Okay.

1434
01:35:38,979 --> 01:35:40,599
So that's all we needed for One West Main?

1435
01:35:40,839 --> 01:35:41,169
Yes.

1436
01:35:41,229 --> 01:35:41,319
Okay.

1437
01:35:41,379 --> 01:35:43,239
Next up is the state election warrant.

1438
01:35:43,989 --> 01:35:46,359
Okay. Next up is the state election warrant.

1439
01:35:50,049 --> 01:35:52,660
I don't know if more needs to be said. We've got an election.

1440
01:35:53,439 --> 01:35:54,429
This is pretty straightforward.

1441
01:35:54,489 --> 01:35:58,479
Thankfully just a state election and not a dual election on the third.

1442
01:36:00,069 --> 01:36:04,329
I move to approve the November 3rd, 2026 state election warrant as presented.

1443
01:36:05,019 --> 01:36:05,439
Second.

1444
01:36:06,189 --> 01:36:08,439
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

1445
01:36:08,529 --> 01:36:08,769
Aye.

1446
01:36:08,829 --> 01:36:09,339
Carol?

1447
01:36:09,429 --> 01:36:09,609
Aye.

1448
01:36:09,699 --> 01:36:10,059
Priscilla?

1449
01:36:10,629 --> 01:36:10,870
Aye.

1450
01:36:11,529 --> 01:36:11,829
Kevin?

1451
01:36:12,039 --> 01:36:12,549
Aye.

1452
01:36:12,609 --> 01:36:13,539
Aye. Unanimous.

1453
01:36:13,899 --> 01:36:14,049
Great.

1454
01:36:14,199 --> 01:36:15,009
You'll need your signatures.

1455
01:36:15,099 --> 01:36:18,309
I do. So because I remember that we need you to sign that red folder.

1456
01:36:18,339 --> 01:36:19,359
I can do that. Okay.

1457
01:36:21,309 --> 01:36:23,229
Town accounting services.

1458
01:36:26,709 --> 01:36:30,249
Our longtime town accountant is retiring at the end of the month.

1459
01:36:31,449 --> 01:36:35,679
We have advertised the position as a finance director/town accountant.

1460
01:36:36,969 --> 01:36:37,299
We

1461
01:36:38,799 --> 01:36:41,919
have not moved anybody beyond the initial

1462
01:36:43,449 --> 01:36:49,269
interviews at this point in time, so I want to go to plan B, which is to make

1463
01:36:49,329 --> 01:36:54,219
sure that we have interim town accountant services on board to make sure that we

1464
01:36:54,249 --> 01:36:54,459
can

1465
01:36:55,839 --> 01:37:00,189
set the tax rate, get the taxes out, et cetera, because there is likely going to be

1466
01:37:00,279 --> 01:37:05,439
a gap between the retirement and getting a suitable person on board.

1467
01:37:08,589 --> 01:37:12,160
I would like the board to just acknowledge that this is--

1468
01:37:13,809 --> 01:37:17,679
I believe the town has done this at least once or twice in the past.

1469
01:37:18,309 --> 01:37:21,160
So this is not an unfamiliar

1470
01:37:22,689 --> 01:37:25,089
procedure for the town or for other towns.

1471
01:37:25,539 --> 01:37:31,329
So I put together some RFPs that I would like to issue tomorrow for

1472
01:37:31,419 --> 01:37:33,039
interim town accounting services.

1473
01:37:34,239 --> 01:37:38,529
We would advertise it. People would have to submit a sealed proposal.

1474
01:37:38,589 --> 01:37:42,519
So both a proposal for qualifications and a sealed price proposal.

1475
01:37:43,629 --> 01:37:49,359
You have to gauge them on their quality responses first and then

1476
01:37:49,749 --> 01:37:52,629
the one you choose, you can then open up the sealed proposal, which is different

1477
01:37:52,689 --> 01:37:52,929
than

1478
01:37:54,279 --> 01:37:56,620
doing-- Like asking three quotes.

1479
01:37:57,819 --> 01:38:00,609
This is something where you don't want to just get the cheapest person.

1480
01:38:00,669 --> 01:38:02,529
You want to make sure that you outline qualifications.

1481
01:38:02,620 --> 01:38:05,859
So that process is a bit more complicated and therefore it takes a little bit more

1482
01:38:05,949 --> 01:38:10,149
time, but I wanted to get your endorsement to do this.

1483
01:38:11,919 --> 01:38:12,399
Questions?

1484
01:38:13,839 --> 01:38:14,319
Carol.

1485
01:38:14,410 --> 01:38:19,839
Is there a contract that we will have to sign that we'll be bound to if we do find

1486
01:38:19,899 --> 01:38:22,839
somebody to hire? How does that work?

1487
01:38:22,929 --> 01:38:26,049
Yeah. The way an RFP would be written is that this is interim services.

1488
01:38:26,169 --> 01:38:28,569
The sealed bid price would be on an hourly basis.

1489
01:38:29,049 --> 01:38:33,399
So we would control the number of hours that are necessary to get the work done.

1490
01:38:34,689 --> 01:38:38,799
We have that over a certain period of time, and then we can have provisions to

1491
01:38:38,858 --> 01:38:39,669
terminate that.

1492
01:38:43,899 --> 01:38:45,160
You're not trying to be the accountant?

1493
01:38:47,469 --> 01:38:48,309
Come on, Lisa.

1494
01:38:49,929 --> 01:38:52,809
Let's try another hat. Give me four more years to

1495
01:38:54,099 --> 01:38:54,910
figure that one out.

1496
01:38:57,370 --> 01:38:58,929
Any other questions or comments on this?

1497
01:39:01,299 --> 01:39:03,639
I think it's a good safety net. Yeah.

1498
01:39:04,660 --> 01:39:10,419
I move to support the hiring of an interim town accountant services.

1499
01:39:10,689 --> 01:39:10,989
Second.

1500
01:39:13,029 --> 01:39:14,559
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

1501
01:39:14,739 --> 01:39:15,099
Aye.

1502
01:39:15,160 --> 01:39:15,489
Carol?

1503
01:39:15,669 --> 01:39:15,879
Aye.

1504
01:39:15,999 --> 01:39:16,449
Priscilla?

1505
01:39:16,989 --> 01:39:17,169
Aye.

1506
01:39:18,189 --> 01:39:18,489
Kevin?

1507
01:39:18,639 --> 01:39:18,789
Aye.

1508
01:39:19,269 --> 01:39:24,939
Aye. It's unanimous. Thank you. Okay, we are now onto old business.

1509
01:39:25,059 --> 01:39:27,160
We have the retreat recap.

1510
01:39:32,439 --> 01:39:35,169
So I thought that the retreat was pretty productive.

1511
01:39:35,259 --> 01:39:39,939
We held it here, I believe, on September 26th. It was here at the senior center.

1512
01:39:41,049 --> 01:39:42,219
Lots of great discussion,

1513
01:39:43,959 --> 01:39:48,669
mostly centered around what we have ahead of us. A lot of great feedback.

1514
01:39:49,689 --> 01:39:53,349
I don't know if any other member wants to weigh in on what their experience was.

1515
01:39:53,589 --> 01:39:59,079
Yeah. Thought it was positive. Definitely eye-opening on my end, being new to this,

1516
01:39:59,169 --> 01:40:02,139
and definitely opened my eyes to a few things.

1517
01:40:02,469 --> 01:40:05,169
So I think it was good and look forward to doing it again.

1518
01:40:07,629 --> 01:40:12,489
Yeah. Just want to comment. It's nice to be able to see you all tonight, and the

1519
01:40:12,549 --> 01:40:16,419
rearrangement of the tables is something that we talked about because we all

1520
01:40:16,479 --> 01:40:20,379
noticed it was nice that we could see each other while we were talking during the

1521
01:40:20,439 --> 01:40:20,889
retreat.

1522
01:40:22,089 --> 01:40:24,339
So I'm already appreciating that, so thank you.

1523
01:40:24,669 --> 01:40:24,819
Yeah.

1524
01:40:26,469 --> 01:40:28,959
I thought the conversations were really enlightening.

1525
01:40:29,559 --> 01:40:33,669
It was really nice that we had time to go into depth on some of the deeper issues

1526
01:40:34,089 --> 01:40:36,160
that we're struggling with in town.

1527
01:40:36,639 --> 01:40:37,719
But one really

1528
01:40:38,979 --> 01:40:43,299
interesting point that I heard that I had not heard before

1529
01:40:45,729 --> 01:40:51,399
was the comment that in 1982 when Prop 2.5 was

1530
01:40:51,519 --> 01:40:57,219
passed in the state of Massachusetts, South Hadley's budget was already

1531
01:40:57,279 --> 01:41:02,949
probably lean, and that's why we seem to be struggling

1532
01:41:03,039 --> 01:41:06,699
more than some of the other towns that were in a better position.

1533
01:41:07,059 --> 01:41:09,789
I was going to ask you to say something more about that, Lisa.

1534
01:41:11,679 --> 01:41:16,120
Yeah. There are towns that are significantly smaller than us in population that

1535
01:41:16,179 --> 01:41:16,479
have

1536
01:41:18,249 --> 01:41:23,949
Basically a taxable limit that is 15 million or

1537
01:41:24,008 --> 01:41:28,239
more above us. So, and then they have then the ability to raise

1538
01:41:29,709 --> 01:41:35,349
twice as much per year, because basically everybody was kind of frozen in

1539
01:41:35,379 --> 01:41:41,109
place almost 50 years ago. So if we had been like maybe 100 years ago or

1540
01:41:41,319 --> 01:41:46,749
20 years ago, happened to have a different size tax base, and then it was frozen,

1541
01:41:46,870 --> 01:41:50,949
it would be a different story. So some of it was a little sort of arbitrary and

1542
01:41:50,979 --> 01:41:56,349
capricious when it happened. But I think some folks keep asking, "What's the issue?

1543
01:41:56,410 --> 01:42:01,569
Are we wasting too much money? Are we not bringing enough revenue in?" The

1544
01:42:02,079 --> 01:42:05,919
majority of our budget comes from taxation or tax base, and our tax base is

1545
01:42:08,139 --> 01:42:14,109
more than $10 million smaller, even incorporating the fire districts, than smaller

1546
01:42:14,139 --> 01:42:17,769
communities around us. So I'm not saying there are other communities that aren't

1547
01:42:17,799 --> 01:42:20,529
necessarily comparable, but small tax base.

1548
01:42:20,979 --> 01:42:26,950
We also, in this town, pay less for comparable properties than surrounding

1549
01:42:26,979 --> 01:42:31,419
communities. So that is part of the issue, is that from a revenue standpoint, small

1550
01:42:31,479 --> 01:42:32,140
tax base,

1551
01:42:33,489 --> 01:42:36,969
limitations on increasing it, people do pay less taxes here.

1552
01:42:37,059 --> 01:42:42,549
So we spin some of it as a positive if we can, that you would be paying more

1553
01:42:42,609 --> 01:42:46,359
taxes in other communities if you had comparable property.

1554
01:42:46,719 --> 01:42:51,249
But it's just a structural issue that we're dealing with, and it can only be

1555
01:42:51,339 --> 01:42:54,309
changed with a prop two and a half increase.

1556
01:42:54,338 --> 01:42:58,749
So then if you have communities that start off at the same starting place and one

1557
01:42:58,779 --> 01:43:04,089
community has passed an increase, even if it was once every decade, they would've

1558
01:43:04,120 --> 01:43:08,380
had four or five increases that would've put them at a much better financial

1559
01:43:08,409 --> 01:43:13,479
footing than we would've, too. So, that was also pointed out by the budget task

1560
01:43:13,509 --> 01:43:14,649
force as part of the issue, is

1561
01:43:17,019 --> 01:43:21,339
the law came in at a point where that was not great for the town, limited our

1562
01:43:21,399 --> 01:43:23,649
growth, and then we've also never passed an override.

1563
01:43:25,059 --> 01:43:30,939
But I'd be curious because, and again, '82 was before I really became

1564
01:43:30,969 --> 01:43:33,669
involved with town politics and just town

1565
01:43:34,989 --> 01:43:36,009
entities in general. But-

1566
01:43:36,069 --> 01:43:37,630
You were pretty little in 1982.

1567
01:43:38,799 --> 01:43:43,630
I was, yeah. Sorry. But I'd be curious to hear what new growth numbers were from

1568
01:43:45,279 --> 01:43:47,380
that time period to where we are now.

1569
01:43:47,409 --> 01:43:49,450
Because we all keep talking about new growth, right?

1570
01:43:49,509 --> 01:43:52,749
So new growth, during my tenure at the water department, I can tell you,

1571
01:43:54,069 --> 01:43:58,209
the amount of subdivisions that went in under my tenure was a lot. Was a lot.

1572
01:43:58,239 --> 01:43:58,390
But it

1573
01:44:00,729 --> 01:44:03,249
did have an impact on the schools like we all talk about, for sure.

1574
01:44:03,580 --> 01:44:09,489
The town back in the '70s made a huge investment in the interceptor sewer

1575
01:44:10,149 --> 01:44:14,229
that opened up South Hadley development for a lot of properties that if we didn't

1576
01:44:14,259 --> 01:44:18,609
have that today, we'd be in a worse position. Well, I'm not sure.

1577
01:44:18,700 --> 01:44:22,089
We probably would have less houses and maybe less impact on the schools.

1578
01:44:22,149 --> 01:44:26,229
But there's a lot of occurrences that have happened in South Hadley that I would be

1579
01:44:26,289 --> 01:44:27,249
curious on the numbers.

1580
01:44:27,819 --> 01:44:27,909
Yeah.

1581
01:44:28,479 --> 01:44:34,149
Because there was a time when I first began, either just before select board or on

1582
01:44:34,179 --> 01:44:38,080
the select board, I was questioning the need to actually use new growth.

1583
01:44:38,200 --> 01:44:41,830
Like why did we have to use... And at that time, I'm just going to use a number

1584
01:44:41,890 --> 01:44:45,009
that I think I remember is $800,000 in new growth.

1585
01:44:45,669 --> 01:44:51,609
And I said, "Well, why can't we just tuck that somewhere rather than trying to

1586
01:44:51,700 --> 01:44:57,580
implement it or infuse it into the next year's budget?" And I really never got a

1587
01:44:57,609 --> 01:45:00,999
solid answer, and lo and behold, it was infused and here we are.

1588
01:45:01,059 --> 01:45:05,109
But, those are just conversations that I've had along my way.

1589
01:45:05,589 --> 01:45:09,009
So we have done this analysis before. I just threw it up on the screen.

1590
01:45:09,999 --> 01:45:14,229
You can look at all 361 different towns, and you can look at new growth numbers

1591
01:45:14,259 --> 01:45:20,140
going back to 2003, and you could select comparable community.

1592
01:45:20,169 --> 01:45:22,179
I know you can't see it, but I'm just telling you how to get it.

1593
01:45:22,959 --> 01:45:28,029
So you go to the state page, or you just Google Massachusetts new growth by town,

1594
01:45:28,089 --> 01:45:31,989
and the link will come up, and you can just submit South Hadley all the years.

1595
01:45:33,130 --> 01:45:35,109
So just going back to here,

1596
01:45:36,789 --> 01:45:39,729
new growth applied to levy limit, you can see that it's...

1597
01:45:41,469 --> 01:45:47,259
Let's see. We've got 300 and 305 were in 2005, 312, 304 in

1598
01:45:47,259 --> 01:45:48,549
'27, 2018.

1599
01:45:50,109 --> 01:45:54,370
Again, we're not going back to the '80s or '90s.

1600
01:45:54,399 --> 01:45:54,609
Sure.

1601
01:45:55,209 --> 01:45:56,559
But at least in this

1602
01:45:57,999 --> 01:46:03,880
25-ish year snapshot, it's been pretty consistently low, very low

1603
01:46:04,089 --> 01:46:05,289
these past few years.

1604
01:46:07,659 --> 01:46:08,649
Okay.

1605
01:46:08,769 --> 01:46:14,169
We did another slide, I think maybe within the last three meetings, where I showed

1606
01:46:14,229 --> 01:46:16,719
new growth in Longmeadow, East Longmeadow,

1607
01:46:22,599 --> 01:46:24,580
East Hampton, maybe one other community.

1608
01:46:25,179 --> 01:46:30,819
And their new growth numbers were double, triple, quadruple ours, and

1609
01:46:30,849 --> 01:46:32,349
consistently so it's per year.

1610
01:46:36,219 --> 01:46:36,339
Hmm.

1611
01:46:38,380 --> 01:46:40,239
I didn't even know we had that. I think it's great info, though.

1612
01:46:40,330 --> 01:46:41,109
I will take a look at that.

1613
01:46:41,200 --> 01:46:42,309
Yeah, you can search.

1614
01:46:44,049 --> 01:46:46,419
If you want to say like what's everybody's meals tax?

1615
01:46:47,499 --> 01:46:49,509
What's everybody's motor vehicle excise tax?

1616
01:46:49,630 --> 01:46:53,709
You can compare all the local receipts for all the years from any community that

1617
01:46:53,739 --> 01:46:55,809
you want. There's a ton of information up here.

1618
01:46:57,249 --> 01:47:00,279
I think we might've done a little primer a couple years ago.

1619
01:47:01,059 --> 01:47:04,779
We can certainly do another one again, just on how to navigate the state website.

1620
01:47:06,130 --> 01:47:10,599
But again, if you kind of want the quick answer to say, well, how's new growth

1621
01:47:10,659 --> 01:47:14,589
been? We might be able to look up numbers beyond this with our own records, but,

1622
01:47:16,419 --> 01:47:17,739
and again, it's

1623
01:47:19,870 --> 01:47:25,659
very superficial or very cursory for me to just say low new growth, low tax levy.

1624
01:47:25,719 --> 01:47:27,609
But the numbers are what the numbers are.

1625
01:47:27,729 --> 01:47:27,909
Sure.

1626
01:47:28,239 --> 01:47:31,719
The equation for revenues and expenses for municipalities in Massachusetts are

1627
01:47:31,749 --> 01:47:35,080
essentially the same. We can have all this information because you can compare and

1628
01:47:35,109 --> 01:47:39,159
contrast, so we definitely have areas in which we just have a fundamentally

1629
01:47:39,279 --> 01:47:43,418
structured, small revenue base that is hard to grow.

1630
01:47:44,918 --> 01:47:48,578
But again, we go back, we had five years of no health insurance increases.

1631
01:47:48,819 --> 01:47:52,870
There's so many different dynamics that contributed to where we are today.

1632
01:47:53,019 --> 01:47:53,019
Yeah.

1633
01:47:53,080 --> 01:47:53,259
So,

1634
01:47:54,549 --> 01:47:58,689
the one thing that I had suggested, and I'm glad it's in the notes, is that to

1635
01:47:58,719 --> 01:48:02,589
possibly based on Lisa's amount of time, I know she's taking on a lot of duties,

1636
01:48:02,649 --> 01:48:02,979
but the

1637
01:48:04,509 --> 01:48:08,589
TA and the select board member, not necessarily the chair, sitting down to have a

1638
01:48:09,880 --> 01:48:14,140
coffee hours periodically with public to kind of fill them in on what's going on.

1639
01:48:14,200 --> 01:48:17,319
I think that... And I was thinking about it when Sarah Edelman was here.

1640
01:48:17,380 --> 01:48:17,830
She had the

1641
01:48:19,239 --> 01:48:22,029
symposium of understanding. She had something like that.

1642
01:48:22,120 --> 01:48:23,229
So I think

1643
01:48:25,569 --> 01:48:29,799
from a transparency standpoint and moving forward, I think if we could energize

1644
01:48:29,859 --> 01:48:32,709
that and if, again, if Lisa's available, great.

1645
01:48:32,799 --> 01:48:37,569
If not, if it's two members of the select board versus that filling in, I think

1646
01:48:37,630 --> 01:48:38,649
that that would be a great

1647
01:48:40,179 --> 01:48:41,409
morale booster for the town-

1648
01:48:41,890 --> 01:48:42,069
Yep

1649
01:48:42,069 --> 01:48:43,120
... personally. So.

1650
01:48:43,149 --> 01:48:47,739
Yeah, I'm looking to establish my office hours for the rest of the calendar year.

1651
01:48:48,339 --> 01:48:51,549
So once I do that, I will send that out to all of you, and you can

1652
01:48:52,809 --> 01:48:53,709
first come first serve.

1653
01:48:53,769 --> 01:48:53,830
Okay.

1654
01:48:53,859 --> 01:48:54,729
Kind of a quorum, please.

1655
01:48:58,839 --> 01:49:01,089
Yeah. Anything else from the retreat?

1656
01:49:04,899 --> 01:49:06,189
I thought it was great. I

1657
01:49:07,749 --> 01:49:11,529
was thinking when we were listening to the chief, I'm going to jump back a little

1658
01:49:11,589 --> 01:49:16,809
bit. I was listening to the chief, and I was remembering months ago, there was a

1659
01:49:16,870 --> 01:49:22,029
spreadsheet that you did, Lisa, that showed staffing levels going back.

1660
01:49:22,089 --> 01:49:27,130
We're talking about going back in historical records, where we were in town

1661
01:49:27,159 --> 01:49:27,789
government.

1662
01:49:28,059 --> 01:49:28,209
Mm-hmm.

1663
01:49:28,509 --> 01:49:33,249
I can't remember how far back they went, but I would love to pull that forward and

1664
01:49:33,309 --> 01:49:37,870
have a look at that. Because I think that's important for us to recognize, is that,

1665
01:49:38,890 --> 01:49:44,830
consistently over the last 20 years, we have been making cuts along the way.

1666
01:49:45,279 --> 01:49:47,890
And I'm really concerned

1667
01:49:49,450 --> 01:49:52,809
about what that looks like for the employees that we have.

1668
01:49:52,839 --> 01:49:58,120
We have some really excellent, outstanding long-serving people that are now doing

1669
01:49:58,179 --> 01:50:02,709
the jobs of another person and trying to fit it all in.

1670
01:50:02,830 --> 01:50:08,200
And if they retire or they go somewhere else to get more money

1671
01:50:08,289 --> 01:50:09,939
or just burn out,

1672
01:50:11,439 --> 01:50:12,549
I'm not really sure

1673
01:50:13,929 --> 01:50:15,039
how that's going to look.

1674
01:50:15,999 --> 01:50:16,120
Yeah.

1675
01:50:16,299 --> 01:50:17,559
Oh, it wasn't that long ago.

1676
01:50:19,149 --> 01:50:24,039
It feels like a million years ago. But, August 11th, it is attached to

1677
01:50:24,069 --> 01:50:29,499
the August 11th agenda. So here's the PowerPoint where we did a

1678
01:50:29,559 --> 01:50:35,331
10-year staffing review, proposed changes, and then also we- We did this

1679
01:50:35,361 --> 01:50:38,571
quick comparison with East Hampton, Long Meadow, East Long Meadow.

1680
01:50:38,602 --> 01:50:43,701
So you'll see that the new growth numbers there, ours is 125K in the budget.

1681
01:50:44,211 --> 01:50:50,121
East Hampton is 200, Long Meadow is 350, East Long Meadow is five. We budget 125.

1682
01:50:50,602 --> 01:50:54,261
We have a hard time meeting it. I will say that places like East Long Meadow budget

1683
01:50:54,321 --> 01:50:55,911
five, and they come in at over a million.

1684
01:50:56,391 --> 01:50:59,751
So there's also the budget number, but there's also, in reality, what they actually

1685
01:50:59,811 --> 01:51:02,451
get with the tax base.

1686
01:51:03,711 --> 01:51:07,911
So we're at 34. East Hampton is now more comparable.

1687
01:51:08,032 --> 01:51:09,321
Again, you've got to add in the districts.

1688
01:51:10,551 --> 01:51:11,931
Look at Long Meadow, East Long Meadow.

1689
01:51:12,022 --> 01:51:15,982
Again, their populations are smaller, but their tax base is 60 million and 55

1690
01:51:16,011 --> 01:51:19,431
million. So that's $20 and $25 million more.

1691
01:51:20,091 --> 01:51:20,571
Take off

1692
01:51:21,772 --> 01:51:24,051
that difference to accommodate for our districts.

1693
01:51:24,081 --> 01:51:26,871
That's still a lot more money, right?

1694
01:51:26,901 --> 01:51:26,901
Yeah.

1695
01:51:26,931 --> 01:51:31,941
That's more than what we've asked for, for an override to help us with the next

1696
01:51:31,971 --> 01:51:32,631
five years. So,

1697
01:51:34,071 --> 01:51:39,801
if we had been captured all those years ago and we had a $60 million tax base,

1698
01:51:40,792 --> 01:51:42,111
we wouldn't be asking for an override.

1699
01:51:43,761 --> 01:51:47,542
Again, I'm sure there's significant differences between the two.

1700
01:51:47,841 --> 01:51:53,301
Long Meadow also pays a lot more in taxes per year, and they have other factors as

1701
01:51:53,331 --> 01:51:58,431
well. But, these are all good to understand how things go, because I do feel like

1702
01:51:58,881 --> 01:52:02,211
it's quick to say, "You're doing it wrong. You're not operating correctly.

1703
01:52:02,241 --> 01:52:06,201
You're spending too much money. There's a lot of waste." There's definitely areas

1704
01:52:06,232 --> 01:52:08,061
in which we can make significant reduction.

1705
01:52:08,091 --> 01:52:12,440
There's no way that we can reduce or cut our way to prosperity.

1706
01:52:13,671 --> 01:52:19,191
There's no way that we can cut our way to making sure that we have good governance

1707
01:52:19,221 --> 01:52:20,121
and operations. So,

1708
01:52:21,471 --> 01:52:24,831
folks just have to know how we do operate here.

1709
01:52:25,611 --> 01:52:29,931
And I'm sorry that the two people who were here who were talking about new growth

1710
01:52:29,991 --> 01:52:33,831
have left, because I really think that that is a priority for us.

1711
01:52:34,941 --> 01:52:34,941
Yeah.

1712
01:52:35,001 --> 01:52:40,341
I think we've seen that with the support of town meeting for the Route 202 corridor

1713
01:52:41,482 --> 01:52:46,911
zoning changes. I think, it's hard to make big changes fast.

1714
01:52:47,841 --> 01:52:53,571
But I think, overall, I think our community is looking for ways to increase our

1715
01:52:53,631 --> 01:52:57,861
tax base to help with our new growth. It just takes time.

1716
01:52:58,221 --> 01:52:58,461
Yep.

1717
01:52:59,691 --> 01:53:04,431
So anyways, just a lot of great information, but it's hard for people to find.

1718
01:53:04,941 --> 01:53:06,982
We don't even remember exactly when the meeting was, so-

1719
01:53:07,761 --> 01:53:07,971
Oh, yeah

1720
01:53:08,001 --> 01:53:09,441
... we want to make it easy to navigate.

1721
01:53:10,761 --> 01:53:13,341
Thank you for that, Lisa. Bringing that up so fast.

1722
01:53:15,111 --> 01:53:16,071
Anything else, retreat?

1723
01:53:17,301 --> 01:53:21,651
Moving on. We are now on to select board subcommittees.

1724
01:53:24,261 --> 01:53:30,111
So a major part of the discussion at the retreat was potentially forming

1725
01:53:30,561 --> 01:53:34,941
subcommittees or at least thinking about additional ways that the select board

1726
01:53:35,001 --> 01:53:35,241
could

1727
01:53:36,711 --> 01:53:41,241
expand their public engagement. So just to,

1728
01:53:42,801 --> 01:53:46,282
I know it's getting to a late hour, but just to go through these one by one.

1729
01:53:48,290 --> 01:53:51,352
I know the school committee has a negotiation subcommittee.

1730
01:53:51,772 --> 01:53:55,881
I don't necessarily think we need that at the moment, but we do, because we're not

1731
01:53:55,911 --> 01:54:00,022
going to have an HR director, I certainly would like to gauge your interest on

1732
01:54:00,081 --> 01:54:04,461
whether a select board member or two would like to join me in the collective

1733
01:54:04,522 --> 01:54:09,951
bargaining negotiations. These often happen during working hours, so I do want to

1734
01:54:10,311 --> 01:54:14,961
know that not everybody can do that. They happen in person. They're not Zoom.

1735
01:54:16,732 --> 01:54:17,241
And then,

1736
01:54:19,282 --> 01:54:22,221
my contract is up at the end of the fiscal year, so,

1737
01:54:24,681 --> 01:54:25,941
I don't know. There's different ways to do it.

1738
01:54:25,971 --> 01:54:28,161
But certainly, you could either assign

1739
01:54:30,022 --> 01:54:33,411
a chair, vice-chair, or both, or you could assign somebody else who might be

1740
01:54:33,471 --> 01:54:34,401
interested in working

1741
01:54:35,661 --> 01:54:38,901
to ensure that town administration services continue

1742
01:54:39,261 --> 01:54:44,811
beyond the fiscal year. So, we'll sort of work one by one.

1743
01:54:44,871 --> 01:54:50,241
We'll work on the people negotiations side right now, and then we can move on to

1744
01:54:50,331 --> 01:54:53,421
other ideas for committees or actions.

1745
01:54:55,461 --> 01:55:00,051
So when is the next collective bargaining? When is that going to be needed?

1746
01:55:00,352 --> 01:55:04,221
Is that something we need to appoint now or in a month, or?

1747
01:55:04,311 --> 01:55:09,381
Yeah, so the Unit A and B is up at the end of this fiscal year.

1748
01:55:09,501 --> 01:55:14,482
So, it would usually be, this would be the time now that we would establish a game

1749
01:55:14,511 --> 01:55:15,321
plan, and then,

1750
01:55:16,732 --> 01:55:20,961
within the next few months, reach out to Unit A and B and begin those negotiations

1751
01:55:22,581 --> 01:55:25,251
at the very latest. So, that's happening now.

1752
01:55:25,371 --> 01:55:30,801
Next year, again, if you want to review the process next year, we would be

1753
01:55:30,861 --> 01:55:33,261
negotiating both DPW and police.

1754
01:55:36,171 --> 01:55:37,282
And then the following year, you get a break.

1755
01:55:42,532 --> 01:55:46,431
But no matter my interest in the subject, I'm about to have a job transition, and

1756
01:55:46,461 --> 01:55:50,661
so I don't think I can commit to in-person meetings during the workday right now.

1757
01:55:50,811 --> 01:55:51,561
I'm really sorry.

1758
01:55:53,032 --> 01:55:54,352
Are you looking to establish those tonight?

1759
01:55:55,191 --> 01:55:55,611
Nope.

1760
01:55:55,641 --> 01:55:56,691
No. Ah.

1761
01:55:56,991 --> 01:55:58,881
I think that input tonight

1762
01:56:00,772 --> 01:56:03,532
or questions, we can discuss those tonight.

1763
01:56:07,071 --> 01:56:10,011
So in terms of ledges, I think I brought this up, and it's probably the wrong time

1764
01:56:10,042 --> 01:56:15,621
to bring it up because there's only one year left on IGM's contract, is that I

1765
01:56:15,681 --> 01:56:18,441
brought up the idea of a revolving fund, much like Watery Brook.

1766
01:56:19,641 --> 01:56:21,741
And what else has a revolving fund in town?

1767
01:56:23,751 --> 01:56:24,171
How is it-

1768
01:56:24,261 --> 01:56:27,801
It's an enterprise, so I don't believe you can have a revolving fund within an

1769
01:56:27,861 --> 01:56:28,251
enterprise.

1770
01:56:29,032 --> 01:56:30,651
I basically was bringing it up because

1771
01:56:32,181 --> 01:56:36,292
the ledge's budget is X amount of dollars, and when they have tournaments, they

1772
01:56:36,352 --> 01:56:42,051
have to purchase product, which basically cuts into that budget,

1773
01:56:42,591 --> 01:56:44,542
and then they get it on the return side of things.

1774
01:56:44,602 --> 01:56:44,721
But,

1775
01:56:46,161 --> 01:56:50,602
and whether or not it makes sense is to have a separate account where they could

1776
01:56:52,011 --> 01:56:56,061
purchase food, beverages, yada, yada, yada.

1777
01:56:56,391 --> 01:57:02,180
So it depends, right? So when we develop the latest RFP, you have the

1778
01:57:02,211 --> 01:57:06,680
ability to change the dynamic of the contract so that they take on the risk.

1779
01:57:07,161 --> 01:57:07,161
Okay.

1780
01:57:07,221 --> 01:57:12,921
So they would choose to pay for it, and then

1781
01:57:12,982 --> 01:57:14,691
receive the income for those services.

1782
01:57:15,381 --> 01:57:19,701
We would have guarantees of minimum expenditures for things like maintenance and

1783
01:57:19,761 --> 01:57:21,201
marketing, things like that.

1784
01:57:21,232 --> 01:57:21,232
Okay.

1785
01:57:21,292 --> 01:57:26,151
So if we want to keep the existing contract, what you're saying would be a

1786
01:57:26,211 --> 01:57:29,061
conversation, but we also need to decide whether we want to shift the risk-

1787
01:57:29,421 --> 01:57:29,751
Understand

1788
01:57:29,751 --> 01:57:30,321
... and reward.

1789
01:57:31,042 --> 01:57:31,852
For a new contract.

1790
01:57:32,181 --> 01:57:32,272
Yeah.

1791
01:57:32,331 --> 01:57:35,121
Yes. That's why I said I don't know if it was the right time to bring it up, so.

1792
01:57:35,331 --> 01:57:41,091
Yeah. And then separately, but integrated, figure out based on community

1793
01:57:41,151 --> 01:57:46,641
feedback, budgets, political desires, and et cetera, business decisions,

1794
01:57:47,841 --> 01:57:52,611
what investments do we want to support? What changes?

1795
01:57:52,671 --> 01:57:57,651
A lot of stuff at Ledges hasn't been touched since the original investment.

1796
01:57:57,741 --> 01:58:02,121
We've obviously been making a lot of recent improvements, but that is a

1797
01:58:02,211 --> 01:58:08,151
comprehensive conversation. You could, if you want, you could just make

1798
01:58:08,211 --> 01:58:11,511
capital do it, but capital would probably need a subcommittee as well.

1799
01:58:12,831 --> 01:58:16,761
You probably want to have at least one or two of you on that committee because it

1800
01:58:16,792 --> 01:58:17,602
is a big decision.

1801
01:58:18,921 --> 01:58:22,431
Do we want to try to reactivate the golf commission?

1802
01:58:22,641 --> 01:58:24,651
Is that a role that they could play?

1803
01:58:26,001 --> 01:58:29,121
The golf commission didn't make these kinds of decisions.

1804
01:58:29,151 --> 01:58:29,151
No.

1805
01:58:29,181 --> 01:58:29,961
These are pretty...

1806
01:58:32,211 --> 01:58:34,551
It's not the kind of decisions they typically make.

1807
01:58:34,581 --> 01:58:38,032
So you could certainly revive a golf commission, change the

1808
01:58:41,181 --> 01:58:41,931
mission of it.

1809
01:58:44,241 --> 01:58:49,491
Or you could say, like, "If a golf commission is in charge of this, but we need to

1810
01:58:49,522 --> 01:58:54,381
do this quicker," you're just basically saying people will be part of a golf task

1811
01:58:54,441 --> 01:58:54,891
force-

1812
01:58:55,641 --> 01:58:55,641
Yeah

1813
01:58:55,671 --> 01:58:59,391
... appointed to do this very specific thing that needs to happen within the next

1814
01:58:59,421 --> 01:59:02,782
few years that would be different than their ongoing obligations.

1815
01:59:02,961 --> 01:59:03,081
Yeah.

1816
01:59:03,141 --> 01:59:06,232
And then also figure out whether you want to establish a golf commission on top of

1817
01:59:06,292 --> 01:59:06,501
that.

1818
01:59:06,741 --> 01:59:09,921
Right. Well, I'm just thinking of all these roles.

1819
01:59:12,681 --> 01:59:15,951
I think it would be important for not only for the select board to get involved,

1820
01:59:16,011 --> 01:59:21,982
but also if the public were involved, there could be other eyes and other ears in

1821
01:59:22,042 --> 01:59:22,792
the community.

1822
01:59:22,821 --> 01:59:23,421
Yes.

1823
01:59:23,482 --> 01:59:24,532
Is that a fair-

1824
01:59:24,681 --> 01:59:24,772
Yeah

1825
01:59:24,772 --> 01:59:27,022
... expectation or plan?

1826
01:59:27,441 --> 01:59:31,911
The ledge subcommittee was envisioned as something similar to a cross between a

1827
01:59:31,971 --> 01:59:35,602
budget task force and the school building committee.

1828
01:59:36,441 --> 01:59:39,982
So it's different than a school committee, right?

1829
01:59:40,011 --> 01:59:41,421
It's different than a golf commission.

1830
01:59:41,542 --> 01:59:41,782
Sure.

1831
01:59:42,111 --> 01:59:44,272
I'm sure ledges gets public input every day.

1832
01:59:46,203 --> 01:59:48,213
No, but this isn't the kind of-

1833
01:59:48,243 --> 01:59:48,903
That's not the kind of-

1834
01:59:49,083 --> 01:59:49,323
Right.

1835
01:59:50,553 --> 01:59:51,363
That like, yeah.

1836
01:59:52,563 --> 01:59:53,523
If we're making decisions, I

1837
01:59:55,653 --> 01:59:58,893
have no problem on the personnel and/or alleges if-

1838
01:59:59,733 --> 02:00:03,033
I think that would be great because I don't feel like personnel or alleges is in my

1839
02:00:03,063 --> 02:00:03,694
wheelhouse.

1840
02:00:04,383 --> 02:00:07,263
Okay. Kevin, do you have any interest in any of the following?

1841
02:00:09,184 --> 02:00:11,703
I can help out with the negotiations personnel.

1842
02:00:12,993 --> 02:00:13,293
Okay.

1843
02:00:13,924 --> 02:00:16,773
That's what I did for 15 years when I was union president.

1844
02:00:20,463 --> 02:00:23,133
And again, we can think about-- I think-

1845
02:00:23,163 --> 02:00:23,313
Yeah

1846
02:00:23,313 --> 02:00:27,663
... the suggestions are excellent, but we can review this again and have you guys

1847
02:00:27,754 --> 02:00:29,523
think about it if there's anything that you want to...

1848
02:00:30,843 --> 02:00:32,853
Well, I'm interested in public engagement.

1849
02:00:32,973 --> 02:00:38,343
I think that's something that falls into the realm of my skill set.

1850
02:00:40,203 --> 02:00:44,674
So my recommendation for that, because we did look at the Belchertown

1851
02:00:44,733 --> 02:00:48,213
communications model, which I think is a little different than what we talked

1852
02:00:48,303 --> 02:00:48,633
about.

1853
02:00:48,723 --> 02:00:48,934
Mm-hmm.

1854
02:00:49,684 --> 02:00:53,703
So my recommendation would be to direct the town administrator to outline a public

1855
02:00:53,733 --> 02:00:56,643
engagement committee for discussion at our next meeting.

1856
02:00:56,944 --> 02:00:57,483
Okay.

1857
02:00:57,543 --> 02:01:02,463
And make sure that we go over, is this like a task force?

1858
02:01:02,523 --> 02:01:03,453
Is this a full subcommittee?

1859
02:01:05,883 --> 02:01:10,083
Because I think the Belchertown model, they appoint a committee.

1860
02:01:10,143 --> 02:01:14,254
It doesn't necessarily consist of select board members and that therefore it's not

1861
02:01:14,313 --> 02:01:15,184
a true subcommittee.

1862
02:01:15,424 --> 02:01:15,543
Mm-hmm.

1863
02:01:15,603 --> 02:01:19,863
So there's different ways you can do it, but that public engagement conversation,

1864
02:01:20,163 --> 02:01:23,643
it wasn't enough at the retreat. I think we need a fuller discussion.

1865
02:01:23,853 --> 02:01:27,243
Okay. Priscilla, do you have any interest in anything at this time?

1866
02:01:28,113 --> 02:01:32,223
Yeah. I would be interested in the personnel negotiations and the economic

1867
02:01:32,283 --> 02:01:32,853
development.

1868
02:01:34,684 --> 02:01:37,444
So we can't have three members, right?

1869
02:01:38,853 --> 02:01:41,733
Well, I don't think we're going to appoint everybody tonight.

1870
02:01:41,763 --> 02:01:43,083
I think you're indicating your interest.

1871
02:01:43,174 --> 02:01:44,254
Okay. Got it.

1872
02:01:44,254 --> 02:01:46,893
Yeah. And we'll plan it out at the next-

1873
02:01:47,283 --> 02:01:47,463
Sure

1874
02:01:47,613 --> 02:01:48,333
... the next one.

1875
02:01:50,343 --> 02:01:53,073
If everybody says they want to be interested, and then you've only created two

1876
02:01:53,133 --> 02:01:58,053
committees and you could do more, you suddenly want to create 20 tonight, part of

1877
02:01:58,083 --> 02:02:03,184
it is just figuring out exactly how much you all want to do and what structure that

1878
02:02:03,273 --> 02:02:07,053
is, and then we'll get it as a whole and kind of come up with a game plan, which we

1879
02:02:07,083 --> 02:02:09,424
could do at the next meeting. I'll give you an example.

1880
02:02:09,483 --> 02:02:09,603
So

1881
02:02:10,803 --> 02:02:13,593
again, public engagement is going to be very different if you wanted to make it a

1882
02:02:13,624 --> 02:02:17,434
subcommittee of the board or if you wanted to appoint a committee of interested

1883
02:02:17,493 --> 02:02:20,133
people in which one of you would maybe be a liaison to.

1884
02:02:20,883 --> 02:02:23,613
Different levels of work, which enables you to do something else.

1885
02:02:25,263 --> 02:02:29,733
A finance subcommittee is very different because that is hands-on work versus

1886
02:02:30,813 --> 02:02:33,453
appointing somebody to be a liaison to the appropriations committee-

1887
02:02:34,263 --> 02:02:34,653
Mm-hmm

1888
02:02:34,653 --> 02:02:37,323
... or changing the appropriations committee to be like capital planning, where you

1889
02:02:37,353 --> 02:02:40,413
appoint somebody to it, but that's a whole larger ballgame.

1890
02:02:40,713 --> 02:02:46,263
Or saying that more informally, we have appropriations committee members

1891
02:02:46,323 --> 02:02:49,863
assigned to different sets of departments. So, and say, "You know what?

1892
02:02:49,953 --> 02:02:55,263
I'm interested in finding out more about the library or planning or..." And then

1893
02:02:55,323 --> 02:02:59,343
you're just letting me know, and I will then include you in the email chain with

1894
02:02:59,374 --> 02:03:02,674
the existing appropriations members and the existing department heads so that you

1895
02:03:02,703 --> 02:03:05,853
can choose to join and be scheduled-

1896
02:03:06,333 --> 02:03:06,453
Sure

1897
02:03:06,453 --> 02:03:06,993
... as part of the-

1898
02:03:06,993 --> 02:03:07,083
Cool.

1899
02:03:07,113 --> 02:03:12,184
And that's like a 60 to 90 day thing right now. So again, that's more immediate.

1900
02:03:13,383 --> 02:03:14,403
So I don't think, yeah.

1901
02:03:14,493 --> 02:03:17,853
I feel like we're already reinventing the wheel with the finance appropriations

1902
02:03:17,913 --> 02:03:22,413
committee, and it's almost like a liaison is better the way to do it.

1903
02:03:22,863 --> 02:03:23,073
Yeah.

1904
02:03:24,093 --> 02:03:29,103
At this point, maybe we can assess it after a year of doing the work.

1905
02:03:30,993 --> 02:03:31,413
Perfect.

1906
02:03:33,093 --> 02:03:34,353
Well, it's a work in progress, right?

1907
02:03:34,504 --> 02:03:36,273
And economic development, yeah.

1908
02:03:38,103 --> 02:03:42,303
Having a liaison to the committee doesn't preclude any of you from getting involved

1909
02:03:42,363 --> 02:03:44,523
or knowing more or wanting to know. Just letting you know.

1910
02:03:45,243 --> 02:03:45,424
Right.

1911
02:03:45,573 --> 02:03:46,233
If you wanted to.

1912
02:03:46,263 --> 02:03:48,843
You're already a liaison to several committees.

1913
02:03:53,583 --> 02:03:54,573
Well, anything else on this?

1914
02:03:56,434 --> 02:03:58,533
Yeah. The economic development committee.

1915
02:03:59,434 --> 02:04:03,903
Again, we talked about it at the retreat, but we really did define a mission or

1916
02:04:03,963 --> 02:04:04,983
scope of what that would be.

1917
02:04:05,434 --> 02:04:05,463
Mm-hmm.

1918
02:04:07,263 --> 02:04:11,913
So again, if these are of interest, then we would flush this out at the next

1919
02:04:11,944 --> 02:04:12,243
meeting.

1920
02:04:12,783 --> 02:04:16,983
Cool. I'm interested in that one, too. The economic development one.

1921
02:04:19,473 --> 02:04:20,553
Sure. We can all work it out.

1922
02:04:20,703 --> 02:04:21,783
We can work it out.

1923
02:04:22,143 --> 02:04:22,563
Yep.

1924
02:04:22,743 --> 02:04:23,553
It's not a race.

1925
02:04:23,883 --> 02:04:29,583
Yeah. Cool. Okay, I think that brings us to a motion to

1926
02:04:29,643 --> 02:04:30,063
adjourn.

1927
02:04:31,083 --> 02:04:31,833
I move to adjourn.

1928
02:04:32,493 --> 02:04:32,913
Second.

1929
02:04:33,573 --> 02:04:35,583
All those in favor, roll call. Renee?

1930
02:04:35,674 --> 02:04:35,823
I.

1931
02:04:35,913 --> 02:04:36,393
Carol?

1932
02:04:36,543 --> 02:04:36,723
I.

1933
02:04:36,783 --> 02:04:37,293
Priscilla?

1934
02:04:37,924 --> 02:04:38,043
I.

1935
02:04:38,793 --> 02:04:39,273
Kevin?

1936
02:04:40,323 --> 02:04:40,353
I.

1937
02:04:40,444 --> 02:04:44,254
You're unanimous. Thank you, all. Thank you, Lisa. Thank you, Kristen.

1938
02:04:44,343 --> 02:04:47,374
And thank you, SHCTV. Enjoy your evening.