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All right, good evening everybody. It is
uh 5:31. This is the pre-aggenda meeting

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for the Time Spencer Board of Alderman
for our upcoming regular meeting next

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Tuesday night. So, this is uh our June
5th pre-aggenda meeting. We're called to

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order. We have um um all but two of our
members present this evening and then

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this lady is uh battled some back
problems tonight. So her in our prayers

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um and not sure about so hopefully she's
okay. We will go ahead and start with an

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invocation and the pledge of allegiance.
So if you will, we'll start with an

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invocation. Father God, we thank you
very much for nourishing rain that we've

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seen today. We thank you for all that is
going on in our town, progress that's

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being made. We thank you for uh the
folks that are here tonight. We look

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forward to hearing from them. We ask
that you be with us as we consider uh

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things like our upcoming budget for the
next fiscal year. We thank you for the

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staff that have put countless hours into
working to prepare this. And we ask you

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give wisdom, guidance, and discernment
to our board as we can this budget over

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the uh over the next week. And we ask
you all those that work within our town,

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keep them safe in their daily daily
work. And I hope them that they continue

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the work to the betterment of all of our
citizens and businesses. Amen. Please

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rise for the pledge of allegiance.
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

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United States of America and to the
republic for which it stands, one

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nation, indivisible, with liberty and
justice for all.

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Right. So, board, we have a couple
things going on this evening. Um the

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first will be a public hearing for our
proposed budget for fiscal year 2025 and

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2026. Uh we then also have um one budget
ordinance to consider this evening. And

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then finally, we will review the agenda
and set that agenda um in preparation

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for next Tuesday's regular meeting. All
right, Mr.

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anything you need to be aware of before
we get ready to move into the initial

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budget discussion?
Yes, sir. Okay. Very good. Uh we will go

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ahead and move into item three on our
pre-agenda meeting um agenda for the

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public hearing for the upcoming uh 2025
2026 uh budget year. Mr. Granstein will

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open for you and some initial comments.
Well, thank you very much mayor and

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members of the board. As you know, the
recommended budget was provided a few

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weeks ago. The recommended budget this
year

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totals just about $5 million. It
represents overall a 13% decrease from

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the current year budget and in the
general fund a 7% decrease. This was a

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particularly challenging budget where we
are not uh able to do all the things

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that we want to do and we're working as
hard as we can to make the best of it

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while looking forward to uh the growth
that we know is on the horizon. And uh

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there were a variety of questions and
discussion points that we had during uh

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the recommendation a few weeks back. We
have some additional information that

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can be provided. I don't know if you
want to go through any of that now or or

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kind of wait until we are on the other
side

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of any public comments we may receive
and then we can go through that. But

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pleasure of the board.

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Okay, I think that would be good. That
way uh if there's any clarification or

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anything like that would be
helpful. All right. All right. So, we

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will now officially open the public
hearing for the proposed fiscal year

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budget. We have three individuals signed
up to speak this evening. Is there

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anyone else before we begin that wishes
to sign up to speak this evening that

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hasn't signed up? All right. We'll uh
invite Miss Leslie Calbert forward. Uh

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as a reminder for folks, as you do come
forward, please state your name and

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address for the record. You will have
three minutes for public comment. We

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have a timer up on the screens um so
that you'll be able to see that.

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And I'll get that up here in a moment. I
timed it at home. I just had to talk

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fast. Perfect. All
right. You No, let me get my last

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sentence, please.

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My name is Wesley Talbert. I live at 308
North Salsbury Avenue. I have been a

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resident here since
2017. And I want to talk about the

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budget and I know that it's a struggle
and you work very hard on it. And I I

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just ask you to consider these things
going forward. Keep them in your mind

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all year long. Um I've heard recently
people say, "Oh, Spencer's going to be

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the next Canab. It's a lovely town. I
didn't. that if I wanted to live in

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Canapapolis, I would have bought there.
I chose Spencer because of its history,

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its character, and its community that
embodies resilience and

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hope because they held on in tough times
believing and trusting that better times

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would be coming. They held on their
generation.

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It was that palpable faith in the future
and their unique character that drew me

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to
Spencer. I bought here in 2017 and since

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then the appraised value of my house has
increased 67% and all I did was put

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paint on it and my tax in home insurance
has

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doubled. Our incomes are not keeping
pace with the assessments.

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Families that have held on here for
generations are being priced out of a

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town that they fought to keep alive.
It's not

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right. They are being replaced by
landlords and new investors who care

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nothing about our past or our future
only in the now. And I can speak to that

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question.
We relied on you to grow Spencer wisely

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to protect and improve our current
residents lives and property while

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judiciously adding to our infrastructure
and bringing us new

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residents. You all tell us of the grant
grant money for new expansions for

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Spencer and to drawing new residents,
but where is the grant money or the

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bonds or etc the funding for the
families that held on? We need to build

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on our strengths and our small town
character and values and measure that

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against the new growth. Our locals are
struggling to hang on. How much longer

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can you ask them to hang on without your
support or at least giving them a bonus?

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I implore you take another look at the
current budget and any future

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expenditures and avoid rate increases
and invest in something anything that

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our longtime residents need i.e.
roads, sidewalks, and possible some kind

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of funding for uh economically depressed
incomes. I think I did

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it. The park is nice and I love the
idea, but it's not was not on the not

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this park, but the park
scand. It's not costing us anything, but

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we still had to raise funds.
handing our historic commercial district

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homes over to we've got to bring in we
need streets and sidewalks to sell those

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homes and that is part of our unique
character. So I implore please consider

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Thank you
M. All right, next we have uh Greg

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Bennett.

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Hi, my name is Greg Bennett. I live at
406 South Hudson Avenue and I've been

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here since
2014. I don't have a speech and I agree

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with just about everything the lady said
before uh I got up here. Um, the thing

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that's stood out to me, I get the salary
vote and every municipality in this

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county has kept their taxes the same
whereas Spencer is the only one that's

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raising its tax and that concerns me.
I'm retired. I'm on a fixed income and

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my taxes went up 62% from 2022 to
2023, which is a significant

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amount. Um, I plan on living here until
I pass

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away. Uh, the value of my house has very
little meaning to me other than, you

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know, what my heirs may get for it, and
that's not going to benefit me in any

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way. But I'd like to see some control on
the property taxes

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town. Um, I've compared property taxes
to other municipalities in this county.

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Um, salt area is by far the highest, but
we're second

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highest and there's municipalities that
are much bigger or at least bigger than

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we are um whose tax rates are not as
significant as

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ours. So, I'd like to see some curve put
on um what our expenditures are in the

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future uh particularly in the in the
upcoming budget for those of us that

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really can't afford much of a tax
increase seeing as uh our economy looks

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like it's on the downturn to begin with.
So that's all I have to say. Thank you.

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Thank you.

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All right. Next is Carla Gray.

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Hey there. My name is Carla Gray. I live
at 211 North and I have lived in center

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for 22 and a half years. Um I don't
really have anything prepared, but I do

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have concerns about the budget. I took
extra time this afternoon and actually

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read the whole thing and I have a number
of questions. Um I know that you can't

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answer back right now, but I would
appreciate an answer to these um because

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they are important questions. I first
want to start by echoing I like

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everybody else have had a increase in my
property tax. Um, you know, we had

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Joanne and then Spencer and then the
little vehicle tax cut and now another

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increase and we're really not seeing a
lot of of benefits from those tax

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increases. Um, it the roads, sidewalks,
I'm not even going to bemoone all of

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those things, but there are some
concerns I have and I'd like again to

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hopefully get an answer to these. One of
the other things that I really want to

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point out, I understand that this is a
decrease in the budget, but I also want

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to point out to
Everybody, I know that y'all are aware

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of this that a lot of that decrease is
not a real decrease. It's ARPA funding

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decrease. And so there's a big
difference in what the budget was

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precoid and before ARPA funding and then
the funding that was was gotten for this

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town through ARPA and expended and where
we're at now. So that's that's kind of a

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false narrative to say that we've had a
really big decrease in the budget. ARPA

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funding was never intended to be
permanent. So it's a false narrative.

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But my questions are really why um is
there the move for code enforcement to

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go to the police
department? You know, I think that a lot

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of us have had issues and had questions
about code enforcement as it has been um

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lacking. Um, but why is it going to the
police department? Obviously, we have a

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lot of police. So, why is that
happening? Why is the resource officer

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positions no longer going to be
dedicated? Um, there's over $200,000

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when you look at the combined uh
different budget or there's over

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$200,000 in in contracted services. What
are those contracted services for? Uh

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and then my last one really is just a
general question which is more of a for

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me kind of an understanding of where the
budget is aligning. Um it you've got

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administratively that the this new park
position is going to be under the

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administrative organization yet the
funding is out of out of uh public works

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and that's just a clarification that I
have. Again I understand that this is

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difficult task and I appreciate that.
Um, I would like to see the budget

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really reviewed as a baseline budget,
not a budget that is now without proper

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funding. That's it. Thank you. Thank
you, Mr.

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All right, that's all we have signed up
this evening. And so with that, is there

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a motion to close the public hearing?
Move to close. All right. Motion to

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close public hearing. Is there
second by Mr. Muhamad? All in

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favor? All right. All opposed. All
right. Public hearing is now closed and

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we will then open it up for any
discussion or questions uh from the

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board and manager.

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Well, okay.
So, um I just want to provide a little

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context um because I know there has been
a ton of work that's gone in. I think

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our citizens acknowledge that. I think
we also recognize that the tax burden

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ultimately falls to our citizens and um
we do hear you and we recognize that

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when these tax increases are proposed,
they impact all of us. Um those of us

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sitting up here, we live in town too and
they impact us similarly. Um I think the

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other thing too that we need to
recognize is that they do impact

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different people in our community more
so than some more so than others. Um and

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we are very cognizant of that. Um I also
want to reiterate that our staff is

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cognizant of that too. So it's not like
that is not considered in the budgeting

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process or um we do recognize that we
have to live within our means. Um, one

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of the things I heard um, from one of
the speakers that, you know, I want to

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reiterate, we do recognize that we want
to maintain the charm of the small town

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character that the town of Spencer has,
but we also recognize that as a

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municipality, if you're not growing,
you're dying. Um, and so there has to be

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some balanced growth to that. And that
has been our goal and our strategy to

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make sure that we have that balanced
growth to where we are bringing new

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folks into our community. Uh that we are
promoting new businesses, new

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industries, things like that, but that
we're doing so with minimal impact to

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the character of our town and ultimately
minimal impact to the citizens that have

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have lived here, whether it be for four
years or whether it be for 22 years or

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more. Um the challenge that we face is
we're in a very interesting spot right

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now. Um those of you who know alluded to
the situation with the economy, but

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we've been very fortunate in the past
several years with a good economy that

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we've attracted a lot of attention from
folks like developers and things like

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that. And we have lots of projects like
that on the edges of our town that have

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recently annexed and come into our town.
Um, and a lot of those are larger

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industries and things like that, but
cost to serve is actually going to be

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lower than residential development.
That's a good thing. Um, some may say

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it's not, but for the longevity of our
town, it is a good thing. And for a tax

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rate, it's a good thing. And so for our
individual citizens, when it comes to

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your tax bill, that's a good thing. That
good thing has not happened yet. And I

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think we all realize that, but we see
signs of it. We see the truck stop

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filling in. you see um we get updates
from Mr. Blunt of the industrial and

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various development projects that are
happening. We have development on

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Hawkins down road. All of that stuff we
are going to eventually see the reap the

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rewards
of an example is China Earth. You may

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have seen in the paper they're with the
Macy's facility that they have. Um I

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think it's something
like I don't know

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$275,000 in additional revenue. Couple
million. Couple million 71%. 71%

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increase. So you think about the town of
Spencer. If our tax revenue was to

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increase 71% what that's going to do for
you as individuals and us as

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individuals, it means our property tax
rate would go down because we now have

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more revenue coming in. The expenses
maintain or stay the same roughly. And

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so what that then means is ultimately to
balance the budget tax rate goes down.

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There are a lot of municipalities and I
think Spencer used to do this where we

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kept the tax rate flat year after year
after year. And what we did was we

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relied and a lot of years we relied on
either fund balance or a lot of times we

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were actually charging residents and
then we put money back in the fund

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balance and building up the fund
balance. The reality is when you do

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that, we're not actually giving back to
the community, right? We're charging you

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for something in one year that you're
not getting that particular year or even

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maybe the next. So, what we've done is
made a strategy to where we're actually

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trying to keep fund balance at a
reasonable level, but not continuing to

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build it up and build it up and build it
up so that we don't have to so we don't

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have taxes higher than they need to. the
reality just like what was mentioned um

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insurance right your property insurance
has doubled it's done that for all of us

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it's the same thing with the town our
property insurance increases and there's

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a good bit of property we've had to add
additional staff one of the things that

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we heard a year ago was um a little over
a year ago there was concern over uh

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gunshots and things like that there was
concern over um drug activity and stuff

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like that and we responded We responded
by adding additional officers. And

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you'll look our our firefighters and our
police officers, they're here tonight.

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They showed up in force and I think they
showed up in force because one of the

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hard things and the hard realities of
this budget is that we cut out a

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potential um at least the proposed
budget cuts out a

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um to their salaries that would bring
them up above what the market averages

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based on our salary stud. That's a tough
pill to swallow. Well, we have a staff

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as good as as our staff that we have
here today. And so, you know, some of

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them are sitting here on the other fence
saying, "Well, we wish you to raise the

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taxes to be able to do those merit
increases." The reality is is it has to

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be a compromise. It has to be a
compromise between our community, our

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staff, and us as a board. Um, and so
what's been presented, you know, it's

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not ideal for anybody at this point in
time, but it's compromise that we've

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gotten to. we hear you and we'll go back
and consider and when it comes to

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Tuesday, you know, what we vote on or
what we ultimately end up doing. Um,

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it's going to consider all of that and
it's going to consider each side of it.

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What I want to point out though
is Spencer doesn't we as a town, we

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define your tax rate. We don't define
your tax value. That's rowing county and

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ultimately it's based off of market
conditions. And so market conditions two

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years ago
set what they appraised your our

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properties at and it was high, right? We
saw it go up. Now, I've heard from some

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some folks are seeing their appraisals
and things now being less than what they

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were two years
ago. That may be the case. Um, if the

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economy turns down, for sure it will
probably be the case. But the reality is

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we have to base our rate off of what the
appraised value is. So, what we do is we

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look at what expenses need to be each
year and then we have to make sure that

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we have revenue to match that for a
balance budget. If we don't, it means we

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have to do one of two things for both.
That's cut expenses and raise uh revenue

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and that comes by raising
taxes. We are projecting less of a sales

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tax increase because of that economic
downturn based on guidance we've gotten

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from the state of North Carolina and
municipalities. We projected less growth

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in sales tax than we've typically seen.
And so that means in order to keep up

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with rising gas and rising insurance and
you all of those things that are

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increasing for all of us at home,
they're increasing for the town as well.

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We have to find a way to offset that. So
that comes in cutting cost on one side,

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but unfortunately this year comes in
raising taxes slowly. So that's where I

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get back to all this development, right?
So, if we're to increase our tax revenue

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by 71% like Tonic Grove did, we we're
not having this discussion. The

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discussion we're having is we're
reducing your tax rate by

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X%. Unfortunately, it's not this coming
year and it may not be next year. But

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within the next two years, that's when
you're really going to see these

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projects coming online and that
additional tax revenue. That's when we

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get to start talking about reducing tax
rates. And so, you know, I sat up here

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at the beginning when we first started
this process and I said, "There's no way

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we can go up on our tax." And so, that's
what we worked from. That's what

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guidance we gave staff to work from was
find a way to make this happen without

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increasing. And y'all worked. I know
there were some midnight nights and some

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really late nights working to get this
information together and staff providing

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the information, but ultimately what
came out of it was the best

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recommendation that y'all follow for us
now to consider based on input that we

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heard from the community, the feedback
we've got from staff. Um, but you know,

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that's the recommendation. So, that's
what we're going to have to consider.

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So, you know, this is not something that
we just take lightly. It's not something

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that we want to just for a money grab.
Unfortunately, this is actually a tough

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year when it comes to the budget. Part
of that is, as Mrs. Gray said, you know,

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our ARPA funding is now gone away.
Um, the ARPA funding was a great thing.

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Uh, it allowed us to do a lot of
projects that we wouldn't have otherwise

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gotten to do. Um, it allowed us to
basically supplant funds, um, use funds

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that we would have used for staffing for
the purpose of some of these projects.

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Um, we've gotten to do some really
stuff. Now, we're having to take a step

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back and say, "All right, we've been
able to be really aggressive with these

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projects. We do need to slow that down a
little bit and um and take stock of it."

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But what I want to for folks to come
away from tonight

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is yeah, what's being recommended
doesn't feel good. Doesn't feel good to

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any of us. And I know it didn't feel
good for staff. Didn't feel good for

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staff have to propose a tax increase. It
also didn't feel good for staff to have

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to cut some of the things that we
proposed to cut. My commitment, as long

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as I am sitting in this chair, and I
think those around me would agree, our

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commitment is to make sure that we're
providing you with the services that you

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need to be a thriving and successful
community, that we're making sure that

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we're carrying forth the priorities of
the community, and that we're doing that

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as good stewards of the tax dollars that
we are putting in. Um, so all that to

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say is if we want to cut beyond the two
cent increase, if we want to not raise

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taxes, there would have to be cuts that
would happen. And my my question, I

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00:28:27,279 --> 00:28:34,480
guess, to the the citizens is what do
you want us to cut? Because what I heard

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tonight was not not not cutting stuff.
What I heard was more money's needed for

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00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:42,480
roads. More money is needed for a
variety of different things. Well, the

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reality is
beyond taxes increasing, there's not

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beyond things like bonds. Um, and I
heard that, you know, those are options,

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but ultimately that's going to cost our
citizens more. And so, that's something

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we have to really work.
I've talked enough,

300
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but yeah, go ahead. I'd like I've got
some comments I'd like to make. I've

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00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:08,720
spent a lot of hours looking at the
budget that was prepared by our

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00:29:06,559 --> 00:29:12,240
management and staff to make the best
use of the funds that will be available

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00:29:10,559 --> 00:29:16,559
for the operation of this town during
the next 12 months. I don't remember if

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I raised my hand when asked if it was a
consensus of the board not to increase

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00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:24,559
our tax rate a few meetings ago, but I
realized that when the federal monies

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ran out, we'd be faced with hard
decisions.

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This town's been able to do a lot of
great things in the last years and we've

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made progress so towards some lofty
goals. Much of what has been

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accomplished has happened because there
are people in our area who believed in

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the town of Spencer and who've been
generous in putting their money in

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projects that were identified. We have
used OPM other people's money for some

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of what you have seen and a lot of what
you see. I'm sure I'll leave out

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someone, but we've received grants and
gifts from the North Carolina Parks and

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Recreation Trust Fund, from the Carolina
Thread Trail, from Fred and Alice

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00:30:01,279 --> 00:30:08,799
Stanach Foundation, from the Canon
Foundation, Friends of Rowan, the Rowan

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00:30:06,399 --> 00:30:14,399
County Arts Council, the Margaret C.
Woodson Foundation, the North Carolina

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00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:19,600
Railroad, the Robertson Foundation, a
federal community block grant, grant

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00:30:17,039 --> 00:30:24,480
funding from the EPA Brownfields program
with Central Council, land and property

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00:30:22,559 --> 00:30:29,760
from Three Rivers Land Trust, and the
Yadkin Historical Museum Foundation.

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Spencer Presbyterian Church has made
space for our community garden. And the

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00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:38,440
list goes on and on and on to
acknowledge the many individuals and

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00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:43,520
families who have stepped up to help us
grow. We've used that opium of other

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00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:48,159
people's money to build a lovely park
with features that our citizens said

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00:30:45,279 --> 00:30:53,279
they wanted. We've won grants by adding
things to our projects that make Spencer

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a desirable place to live. We're more
working to bring more amenities to the

326
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community to encourage growth. We've
talked about summer programs for youth

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00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:06,720
here and events in our new park space.
It's been suggested that we delay adding

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00:31:04,799 --> 00:31:11,279
an employee to do an active living
program to the town. Our manager and

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00:31:09,679 --> 00:31:15,440
staff were sent back to the drawing
board to try and find more cost savings

330
00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:20,000
to keep our tax rate lower than the
projected two cent increase when the

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00:31:17,279 --> 00:31:24,880
numbers for the budget came up short. I
pulled out my 2024 ruining county

332
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:28,399
property tax notice and I saw the
evaluation on my property is

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00:31:28,679 --> 00:31:33,600
$227,531 and my tax bill for Spencer was

334
00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:44,080
$1,37656 based on 60.5 per 100. When I
take that same evaluation and calculate

335
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:48,559
the new amount with a tax rate of 62.5
cents per 100, my tax bill becomes

336
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:58,440
$1,422.7. That's a difference of
$45.51 more. And if I divide that by 12

337
00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:05,279
months, that's
$3.79 a month added taxes. You may not

338
00:32:02,399 --> 00:32:10,559
remember this, but a few years ago, we
the board lowered our tax rate. And I

339
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:15,840
was chastised by a longtime resident who
said, "You never lower the tax

340
00:32:13,159 --> 00:32:19,760
rate." I feel that we need to continue
the progress we started when I was

341
00:32:17,679 --> 00:32:24,640
elected to serve the citizens of Spencer
in 2019. I feel that we need to support

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00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:28,960
the employees that work for us and pay
them what they deserve. And we need to

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00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:33,600
continue to provide the best service we
can for our citizens. Yes, roads,

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00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:37,760
sidewalks, potholes, those are problems.
We know that. Additionally, we should

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honor those people who believe in the
future of Spencer and have made our

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00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:45,679
growth possible. I know that soon we
will have additional investments in our

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00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:51,200
community, which will increase our
revenues and bring in additional taxes

348
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:56,279
and grow our tax base. But until then, I
support a modest tax increase.

349
00:32:54,480 --> 00:33:00,559
Thank you, M. Sledge. Thank
you. board at this time. Are there other

350
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:07,240
is there other input, other questions,
other comments? Yeah, I I'll Mr. May, if

351
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:12,679
I may, just offer a couple of comments.
Um, first of all, it's nice to have you

352
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:19,919
all here tonight. That's good.
Um, I do think um, number one, I I don't

353
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:23,200
think our priorities are I think there's
a risk that we could leave here tonight,

354
00:33:21,519 --> 00:33:27,039
next week, and think that somehow
there's a division. There's not. I I

355
00:33:25,679 --> 00:33:30,799
everything that you've said I absolutely
agree with. Two years from now, this

356
00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:34,720
will not be a problem. Three years from
now, perhaps 12 months from now, this

357
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:38,399
will not be a problem. Um Miss Gray is
absolutely correct that that ARPA funds

358
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:41,679
are partly responsible for why we're
having this conversation. I mean, I

359
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:45,039
think we all agree. I think the question
is how do we address the next problem?

360
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:49,519
How do we address this particular
situation, right?

361
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:54,880
Um but also, I do think we have to keep
things in silos. Um Leslie, I absolutely

362
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:59,600
agree. Our roads are are not good. I I
I've talked about Fifth Street I don't

363
00:33:56,399 --> 00:34:03,760
know how many times, right? We But as I
I as we talked about with the community

364
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:08,399
walk up a few months ago, those are sens
of 60 years of neglect. It would take

365
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:12,720
millions and t tens of millions of
dollars to fix that. It's not going to

366
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:16,159
happen ne next month, next year, and a
decade from now. We'll probably still be

367
00:34:14,240 --> 00:34:20,000
having this conversation. It's just that
bad. And that's that's not your fault.

368
00:34:18,240 --> 00:34:25,520
It's not our fault. We have to fix what
60 years didn't fix. And that that's

369
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:28,879
that's the unfortunate truth, right? No,
sure. I'm just saying I mean I I mean

370
00:34:27,359 --> 00:34:34,639
you're absolutely right. We just that's
something we'll have to do really small

371
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:38,159
bites, right? Um and I also think, you
know, when I moved here and I I went to

372
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:42,879
school in Spencer, I didn't live here
until 2010. When I moved here, my house

373
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:46,480
was 40% less valuable than the same
house might have been sitting in rock or

374
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:50,399
granite or faith because no one wanted
to live here. This was a depressed

375
00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:54,960
community that had been frozen in time
since the shops packed up and left.

376
00:34:52,359 --> 00:34:58,160
Right? That's all changed and that's all
great. And I I've said it up here

377
00:34:56,480 --> 00:35:02,240
before. I don't think I ever saw that
happening 12 15 years ago. It's

378
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:05,520
wonderful that it's happened. And we all
deserve it. And the folks who've been

379
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:08,800
here for 20 or 30 or 40 or 60 or 80
years, you really really deserve it

380
00:35:07,359 --> 00:35:16,000
because you stuck it out and you made it
work, right? So, we have to we have to

381
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:18,800
remember that the momentary issue is not
a reflection of where we've been or

382
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:22,800
where we're going. Now, with that said,
I'm not going to support a 2% increase

383
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:26,520
or two not 2% a 2% increase just because
I told you last year that I was going to

384
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:33,839
60, but I wasn't going any higher. I'm
not. Now, what that means

385
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:37,920
unfortunately is, as you said, the only
way to reduce expenses is to cut

386
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:40,640
services. I mean, there's there's no
other math to make this work unless

387
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:45,359
we're gonna sell t-shirts or something,
which I'm open to that. That's cool. I

388
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:48,880
like t-shirts, but um or sell some, you
know, world's finest chocolate or

389
00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:55,520
something like that. I, you know, or
sell fruit like the B like that's right.

390
00:35:51,359 --> 00:35:59,760
Yeah. Sell fruit. So, you know, that's
that's the reality here. The the also

391
00:35:57,599 --> 00:36:04,000
the really unfortunate reality is that
staff with Mr. trans and this board

392
00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:09,200
before I was up here and our chiefs and
our employees have worked really really

393
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:14,160
hard to turn organizations that were not
in great shape five or six years ago

394
00:36:11,119 --> 00:36:19,119
into first class organizations that keep
you safe. And we've got to ask them to

395
00:36:17,599 --> 00:36:22,240
kind of take it on faith that we can
give them something that they maybe

396
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:27,839
thought they were going to get maybe in
12 months or 24 months from now. So

397
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:32,560
we've got to find a way to balance all
of that now. So hopefully they all say

398
00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:38,079
hang out with us for a little while
longer while we figure this out. Um

399
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:42,280
those lead to tough conversations. Um
and I you know I'm glad you guys are

400
00:36:39,599 --> 00:36:46,720
here too and we see you. We value you
and having four kids in my family here.

401
00:36:45,359 --> 00:36:52,320
I know you guys are going to keep us
safe. I appreciate what you do. So um

402
00:36:50,720 --> 00:36:57,599
we've got to find a way to balance all
of that. Um you know I I've we talked

403
00:36:56,079 --> 00:37:02,640
out some ideas in the last meeting. I
hope maybe those have stuck. Um I did

404
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:06,240
raise the issue of of of that position
maybe not doing it with parks. Not

405
00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:12,640
because we don't need it or I know we've
talked about that a few years but it's a

406
00:37:08,720 --> 00:37:15,520
situation where it's a it's a position
that's a hypothetical. I know maybe

407
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:18,079
we're interviewing people. I don't know
who those are. I don't know where

408
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:22,480
they're from. I have no idea. Honestly,
I'm glad I don't know. But we've got to

409
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:26,400
make sure to the extent we can we don't
raise the rate and at the same time keep

410
00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:31,359
those folks back they're happy because I
want them to keep keep us safe. Um and

411
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:35,040
you know I know that's a tough pill to
swallow. It's a little bit of a setback

412
00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:38,880
but um I I don't you know I don't think
there's a division among us up here.

413
00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:43,680
It's just about how do we get through
this bump in the road and then we'll be

414
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:47,760
off and running. And to that end, I
think you know what we are working on is

415
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:52,640
set up priorities that we developed
several years ago as a board. We've all

416
00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:57,359
done a lot of stuff making sure we're
moving those priorities forward and

417
00:37:54,079 --> 00:38:03,160
those priorities were what we heard from
our community. You recall back in early

418
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:07,680
2020, I guess.
Um we had the session at North Carolina

419
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:11,280
High School. we had the community show
up and the things we're doing now are

420
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:17,440
the things that our community told us
they want. Um and so we're working to

421
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:23,720
mess our priorities. Um I know you
brought up we would not move forward

422
00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:29,200
with that parks and recreation position.
Um, I'm of the opinion that well, yeah,

423
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:34,960
we could do that, but also I'm of the
opinion, but we've got to be really

424
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:38,960
careful about stepping back from all the
progress that has been made over the

425
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:42,079
last several years because, you know, I
I think I shared with y'all at one of

426
00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:49,440
our strategic planning retreats that we
did a an addage that uh that not to look

427
00:38:46,720 --> 00:38:54,400
back, but that we're not going back. Uh,
we're moving forward. And so we have to

428
00:38:51,520 --> 00:39:01,040
be what I don't want to do is backtrack
to take steps back from where we now all

429
00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:07,280
that say is we need to be very cognizant
about if we are at new position but keep

430
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:12,400
in mind some of our other departments
we've frozen some positions so it's a

431
00:39:10,720 --> 00:39:15,520
balancing act that between all of that
what I'm concerned about on the

432
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:21,680
recreation side is we've got all these
new facilities you heard from our

433
00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:25,200
residents too what program for that and
my concern is you're going to have

434
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:28,240
facilities sit for a year and their
program is happening and things like

435
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:32,079
that and then we're going to be right
back at the situation where our

436
00:39:30,240 --> 00:39:36,560
residents are asking why aren't you
doing anything with these

437
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:41,520
things so I do think that position is
important my opinion is we need to move

438
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:46,160
forward with it because we planned it
was part of the priorities been part of

439
00:39:43,599 --> 00:39:49,440
priorities for the last several years
you planned it in this this year's

440
00:39:48,240 --> 00:39:53,000
budget
timing wise we're at the point that it's

441
00:39:51,040 --> 00:40:00,079
likely going to happen at the beginning
of a that's an important thing it's an

442
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:05,680
easy cut it's easy to look at it and say
that's a nice chunk let's cut it but I

443
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:12,440
think the detriment some of the progress
that's been made I think will be not

444
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:17,839
I hear
you this is yeah this is one of the

445
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:21,520
toughest things I said y'all y'all voted
me in and gave me two more years. So,

446
00:40:19,839 --> 00:40:26,000
I've got two more years of budget stuff
to struggle with. And this is not easy.

447
00:40:24,240 --> 00:40:28,720
I'm telling you. I mean, we have staff
members who've been here till 3 in the

448
00:40:27,359 --> 00:40:32,640
morning trying to work through it,
trying to come up with answers. And I

449
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:38,480
can't tell you how many hours I've spent
with it. I'm, you know, I can't even

450
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:43,599
keep up with it. But anyway, um it's
tough. And I know that I, you know, I

451
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:51,040
live on fixed income. I'm retired. I
have social security and um I don't have

452
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:56,319
any other income u from a a partner. So
I mean I I see your point.

453
00:40:53,720 --> 00:41:02,079
Um there's just no easy access. Yeah.
You know and I I wanted to mention I

454
00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:06,640
know one of there was a comment made
about how our rate tax rate compares to

455
00:41:05,119 --> 00:41:11,359
somewhere like Salsbury or something
like that or other larger communities

456
00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:16,000
that have a much lower tax rate. There's
a reason for that and I

457
00:41:14,079 --> 00:41:19,680
But it's not an apples to apples
comparison. And the reason why is in

458
00:41:17,839 --> 00:41:24,480
much larger communities because they
have so many more people and so many

459
00:41:21,359 --> 00:41:30,319
more businesses and industries their tax
revenue is much much higher for the

460
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:35,359
services that they provide. And so, you
know, we're we're a much smaller

461
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:40,880
community with limited industry, limited
business. And so what we need to keep

462
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:46,000
our community safe and keep our
community running and functioning, uh

463
00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:49,760
the the cost, the unit cost is higher
than it would be in a much larger city.

464
00:41:48,160 --> 00:41:55,760
That's and that's just that's across the
board. All small towns are going to have

465
00:41:52,240 --> 00:42:01,280
that that challenge. Um there's a reason
some of the other municipalities haven't

466
00:41:57,599 --> 00:42:07,599
raised rates. Um Salsbury struggled.
Salsbury had to make some major cuts. Uh

467
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:12,319
county had to make some I believe some
major cuts and they pushed off some

468
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:18,880
projects that we uh East Spencer our
neighbors across across the way they did

469
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:24,359
a a huge increase last year so that they
didn't have to this year I don't even

470
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:30,319
remember it was
20 cent increase roughly that's huge but

471
00:42:28,560 --> 00:42:36,560
they did that for some of the same
reasons we did so that they can have a

472
00:42:32,079 --> 00:42:41,280
full-time fire staff just we do. Um, and
so we, you know, we we've tried to to

473
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:45,280
balance that out, not do as big a one
last year. But all that to say, trying

474
00:42:43,359 --> 00:42:49,520
to compare us to other communities, it's
a little tough. It's a little jaded.

475
00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:53,280
It's a little cloudy with how that
works. I think, and I've mentioned this

476
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:58,560
before, what we need to look at is what
is the return on investment that we're

477
00:42:55,280 --> 00:43:01,760
providing to our taxpayers. And I know
they want to see better roads. They want

478
00:43:00,079 --> 00:43:07,920
to see better sidewalks and those sorts
of things. What I also want folks to

479
00:43:04,720 --> 00:43:14,240
understand is that money, it could come
from your tax dollars. Um, and I guess

480
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:17,839
in a way it does at the state level, but
the reality is the money for roads and

481
00:43:16,079 --> 00:43:22,240
sidewalk repairs that comes from the
state. And the state gives us the same

482
00:43:20,319 --> 00:43:26,079
amount of money that they gave us over a
decade ago. And so what do you think's

483
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:32,319
happened? Material costs have gone up.
Labor costs have gone up. So we are able

484
00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:36,720
to do much less when it comes to road
repairs, road repaving, sidewalks, that

485
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:42,880
sort of thing than we were able to do a
decade ago. And so if you want to see

486
00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:46,560
that, I'll I'll I'll walk alongside you,
Raleigh. I'll write letters as well, but

487
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:52,319
we need to advocate for more funding
through our power bill. That's where the

488
00:43:48,319 --> 00:43:56,079
money for the road is happen. Um, but in
the absence of that, what we as a town

489
00:43:54,319 --> 00:44:00,640
are doing is we said, "All right, we're
gonna we have to package these

490
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:05,119
resurfacing." So, you'll see resurfacing
every two years roughly as opposed to

491
00:44:03,359 --> 00:44:09,280
every year like we used to be able to
do. Um, because we want to do as much

492
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:14,880
paving as we can at one time because you
get a better price from our contractors.

493
00:44:11,680 --> 00:44:18,880
What we talk about with public works is
in those off years rather than not doing

494
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:25,839
anything, we're going to invest some
money into things like pothole repair,

495
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:30,880
uh, cold sealing of cracks and things
like that. It's abandoning, but at least

496
00:44:29,119 --> 00:44:35,280
it's something to keep the roads
passible until we can

497
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:38,560
get. So, it's not like we're just
sitting back and we're not doing

498
00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:41,720
anything. We're trying to move the
needle forward while still being able to

499
00:44:40,720 --> 00:44:44,839
make sure
that

500
00:44:43,319 --> 00:44:49,280
so
it's it's a task. I think that's the

501
00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:55,440
message.
Uh Mr. Mayor, board and citizens, uh I

502
00:44:53,440 --> 00:45:00,400
just have a couple of things that I want
to add to uh these discussions tonight.

503
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:05,200
First of all, thanks to all of you for
being here and a big special thank you

504
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:12,400
to our fire and policemen for being
here. I'm glad all of you showed up. I'm

505
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:18,599
a p a retired public employee. I know
what it's like when salaries get frozen

506
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:23,599
and raises were taken back that you were
expecting, especially when you're

507
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:28,560
raising a family. I don't like it. When
there's been a promise made and a

508
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:35,119
commitment made, I think we need to do
as much as we can to honor it and keep

509
00:45:31,280 --> 00:45:39,359
it. Um, especially for our employees. We
probably have, and I'm going out on a

510
00:45:37,599 --> 00:45:44,800
limb here, but I think I'm probably
right. We probably have the best staff

511
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:51,119
in Rowan County. I'm not sure it's not
the best staff in the whole state. We

512
00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:55,440
have turned Sensor around. And it's not
been just us that's done it, and it's

513
00:45:53,040 --> 00:46:00,560
not just been our board that's done it.
The groundwork was being laid before we

514
00:45:57,839 --> 00:46:04,880
got on here. It's been a cumulative
process. But throughout all of this,

515
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:13,520
I've lived here in Spencer my whole
life. And I know taxes. I don't like

516
00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:18,000
paying high taxes either. None of us do.
I don't think our taxes are high

517
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:22,160
compared to what we get. I've talked to
people from all over the state because I

518
00:46:20,079 --> 00:46:28,240
have a lot of uh former students and
friends that live in places. They can't

519
00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:33,760
believe the services we provide. My
sister lives in Asheville and she pays a

520
00:46:30,720 --> 00:46:39,119
whopping big amount of taxes. They still
have to have their garbage carried off

521
00:46:36,079 --> 00:46:43,920
and paid for it. They have to pay to
have all their yard debris carried off.

522
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:49,040
She just cannot believe when she comes
here and sees that our town picks up

523
00:46:47,119 --> 00:46:55,599
bulk items
uh and does our garbage weekly and all

524
00:46:53,520 --> 00:47:00,400
of the brush and debris. that that's
something that most communities don't

525
00:46:57,200 --> 00:47:07,920
get without any cost. Uh and I remember
even in Spencer at one time we had to

526
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:12,560
pay to get any bulk items u taken off
and you had to come up here and pay them

527
00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:16,319
something then they come and look at it
and then they going to call you and tell

528
00:47:14,079 --> 00:47:21,839
you how much more you have to pay. That
was not fun. So, we've got a good system

529
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:26,960
right here. And but the thing that
really

530
00:47:22,839 --> 00:47:31,839
uh makes me proud, I'm on news sources
all the times and um I'm all the time

531
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:37,280
getting updates and news breakak and
smart news and everything. And one time

532
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:43,760
I saw an article that showed up. It said
fastest growing and wisest investment in

533
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:49,599
municipalities. Guess who was number one
in the whole state? Us.

534
00:47:47,440 --> 00:47:55,680
And just think about your property and
how it has grown in value. Now it's it's

535
00:47:52,560 --> 00:48:02,240
happened everywhere, but ours has really
really increased. So you all are a

536
00:47:59,440 --> 00:48:07,400
little bit wealthier there if you are a
property owner. So that's a good thing.

537
00:48:04,640 --> 00:48:11,800
But I remember when you couldn't sell a
honeymoon. I remember when I would go to

538
00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:18,480
gatherings and there were people from
other areas in this uh county and they

539
00:48:16,160 --> 00:48:23,760
talked down to us and would dare to talk
about Spencer and Northland schools to

540
00:48:21,119 --> 00:48:30,960
me. Well, that was a mistake and usually
I had to lose. Usually I got drugged out

541
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:35,200
by coach secret before I said anymore.
But you know, we don't have to defend

542
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:41,599
Spencer anymore. And for those of you
that have lived here a long time now, we

543
00:48:39,359 --> 00:48:46,880
have people pray for us and want to know
how we did it. Now, I still know that

544
00:48:44,319 --> 00:48:52,720
we're responsible to our citizens, but
we are also responsible to our employees

545
00:48:49,839 --> 00:49:00,400
and to our program and to this wonderful
park system that we have.

546
00:48:56,839 --> 00:49:04,680
So, I still hadn't 100% made up my mind,
but I know which way I'm leaning. And I

547
00:49:02,240 --> 00:49:13,280
think most of us probably
know and uh you know, I look at this

548
00:49:09,559 --> 00:49:19,720
and it's not when you do like Pat did
and average it out over a year, that's

549
00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:27,400
less than a a bag of candy you buy at a
store. I mean, and it I think it added

550
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:32,240
like $7 or something a month to a
$250,000 house in taxes. That's less

551
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:36,400
than a pack of cigarettes. I got to
think about stuff like that as like I

552
00:49:34,319 --> 00:49:42,640
said, I'm I'm looking at it also from
the public employee perspective because

553
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:47,680
if you're working for the public, you
don't get

554
00:49:44,040 --> 00:49:52,680
u rewarded often for doing a good job.
you just get more work to do on the same

555
00:49:50,079 --> 00:49:57,760
salary. And basically, that's how it
works. So, I'm looking at it from that,

556
00:49:55,359 --> 00:50:01,440
too. And I want to keep every employee
we

557
00:49:58,839 --> 00:50:10,559
have. I don't want them being siphoned
off by Davidson County, Meth

558
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:16,960
County, Paul, or any other place. We've
got we're competitive now. And I want to

559
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:21,400
say because we got top-notch people. And
I'm not saying we haven't always had

560
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:27,200
topnotch people, but they've been
stable. We're not losing as many as we

561
00:50:24,240 --> 00:50:31,280
used to do. When we first came on here,
how many vacancies did we have in that

562
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:37,680
police department?
A lot. And basically a volunteer fire

563
00:50:35,119 --> 00:50:43,440
department. And you don't attract
industry and

564
00:50:40,359 --> 00:50:49,920
um developers and everything by having a
volunteer fire department. You got to be

565
00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:55,160
able to offer the protection. And I feel
safe in these

566
00:50:51,640 --> 00:51:00,000
things. I don't ever worry about being
attacked. And I'm old now and I'm an

567
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:04,720
easy mark, but I don't ever worry about
I'm not saying it won't happen, but I

568
00:51:02,079 --> 00:51:09,280
don't worry about it. I mean, our
streets are clean. They may not be They

569
00:51:07,839 --> 00:51:13,520
might need to have some holes that need
to be patched up, but we've got these

570
00:51:11,599 --> 00:51:17,920
good people walking around, and I've
never felt

571
00:51:15,240 --> 00:51:23,760
intimidated. Um, you know, but we could
have gone the other

572
00:51:19,559 --> 00:51:28,480
way. So, I I'm leaning towards
supporting this and because I know

573
00:51:25,839 --> 00:51:34,280
what's coming in two years and I think
we'll be able to stop it or even

574
00:51:31,359 --> 00:51:41,000
decrease it.
remember who said you never decrease

575
00:51:36,559 --> 00:51:41,000
your taxes. Yeah, that's right.

576
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:51,359
First of all, everybody up on this board
is optimist. We got into this thing

577
00:51:48,240 --> 00:51:56,480
being optimistic about Spencer's future.
Like Petty and the rest of talking about

578
00:51:54,160 --> 00:52:00,400
at one time we couldn't sell a house.
I'd love to got out of Spencer at that

579
00:51:58,559 --> 00:52:04,800
time, but I couldn't because I couldn't
get true value.

580
00:52:02,319 --> 00:52:09,960
But we've done and we say we, I thought
about everybody in this group, they've

581
00:52:06,240 --> 00:52:16,720
done an outstanding group as far as
uh if you look at our budget, I've

582
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:20,880
studied it. Our biggest source is our
employees, our police department, fire

583
00:52:18,960 --> 00:52:26,079
department, maintenance department, and
our staff. And that's what makes

584
00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:29,960
it. If we didn't have good employees,
everybody would be upset.

585
00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:36,720
But at the same time, I'm looking at it
as an open mind like some of these

586
00:52:34,559 --> 00:52:43,440
people expressed. I've seen a lot of
communities where the tax rate has grown

587
00:52:40,319 --> 00:52:48,920
so far and so much that they can't
afford

588
00:52:44,359 --> 00:52:48,920
living and I'm concerned.

589
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:55,760
There's not everybody, you know, Spencer
is kind of a depressed town where, you

590
00:52:53,760 --> 00:53:03,359
know, at one time we could you could
afford living here and getting by, but

591
00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:09,920
uh everything has improved and that's
cost everything everybody cost things

592
00:53:07,359 --> 00:53:17,280
for everybody else. So, I am concerned
about it. As the mayor says, we've taken

593
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:21,920
gambles in the future and look at what
we've got.

594
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:28,400
It's amazing. If you told me eight years
ago we'd have all this, I'd be a new

595
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:32,640
fire truck, new garbage truck, new
beautiful town hall that we're in right

596
00:53:30,319 --> 00:53:39,839
now. I wouldn't believe it. I think it's
amazing. We do have to take

597
00:53:35,559 --> 00:53:46,160
G, but I'm questioning myself for the
maybe we need to take a pause maybe this

598
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:52,319
year and wait and see what's happen. But
this time, I'm just expressing my

599
00:53:48,720 --> 00:53:57,040
opening that I might consider holding
back on the expenses of this year. But

600
00:53:54,720 --> 00:54:02,400
at the same time, that's why I'm here.
I'm listening to every folks

601
00:53:59,400 --> 00:54:08,400
here. But the main thing, like I said,
what makes a town is our employee, and I

602
00:54:05,040 --> 00:54:15,559
appreciate what y'all do. Thank you. If
I may say, Mr. mayor, board, staff, and

603
00:54:12,960 --> 00:54:21,559
most of all the residents of the
town. Um, and being a resident here,

604
00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:26,640
Spencer for 20 some odd
years, we are all affected by this. It's

605
00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:32,720
almost like it's a double-edged sword.
We need to make sure that we keep these

606
00:54:30,240 --> 00:54:36,960
services that we have with the quality
of staff that we have because

607
00:54:37,160 --> 00:54:46,640
ultimately our number one priority is
the residents is the town. But in order

608
00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:50,880
for the town to continue to flourish and
hearing what my constituents up here

609
00:54:48,319 --> 00:54:55,040
were saying, I I can look back in the
past and of course I I probably wouldn't

610
00:54:53,440 --> 00:55:00,559
have thought that we would be where
we're at today 101 15 years ago in

611
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:04,720
reference to the town hall, the
different amenities that have taken

612
00:55:02,319 --> 00:55:08,880
place here in town. And if I'm wrong,
Mr. Mayor, some of the the roads and I

613
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:13,440
hear the concerns of the residents. Some
of the roads, the responsibility of that

614
00:55:11,359 --> 00:55:18,480
is not just on the town of Spencer, it's
also on the Department of

615
00:55:15,079 --> 00:55:22,640
Transportation. And I know we have we
have addressed some of those. There is

616
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:25,520
still some work that needs to be done.
And I mean, there always is going to

617
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:28,880
have to be work to be done in order for
the town to continue to flourish and not

618
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:34,240
die.
So, it's not an it's not an easy

619
00:55:31,520 --> 00:55:38,280
decision that has to be made because it
affects us as well.

620
00:55:41,040 --> 00:55:48,599
Mr. Cring, any clarifying remarks or
anything like that at this point?

621
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:57,520
that what what I'm happy to share based
on I guess some of the questions from

622
00:55:54,960 --> 00:56:02,559
last time and and this is published
within the agenda packet. There were

623
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:08,559
questions on a few different items. Uh
and

624
00:56:04,040 --> 00:56:15,599
so I'll just roughly uh give a few
highlights from that. But uh again there

625
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:22,000
was the questions around uh our ability
to implement the pay study. Um, first of

626
00:56:19,520 --> 00:56:27,359
all, uh, there there I have a chart
published in there that kind of shows a

627
00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:33,400
few different things and it shows it by
department and it and it shows it uh and

628
00:56:30,319 --> 00:56:38,000
and if you're on the packet,
it's there's a public hearing notice

629
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:42,599
published in the packet and then the
next page after that uh is where this uh

630
00:56:41,359 --> 00:56:48,559
information
is. Uh so currently we for the for the

631
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:54,799
recommended budget there is a proposal
of a flat uh increase for for all

632
00:56:51,599 --> 00:57:02,000
full-time staff of $1,200 next year
which is um an amount that's uh

633
00:56:59,079 --> 00:57:08,319
roughly kind of mid-range on our DI
program. And so for some that represents

634
00:57:05,920 --> 00:57:13,119
a little less than a typical year and
some that represents a little more and

635
00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:16,799
some it represents about about what
average but it's a flat rate for

636
00:57:14,640 --> 00:57:23,599
everybody no matter what your current
salary is. And of course that is a a

637
00:57:19,760 --> 00:57:26,599
best benefit to uh as a percentage to
those who

638
00:57:24,839 --> 00:57:31,920
are on
the first few stages of our of our pay

639
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:38,720
scale.
um that the cost of that is about

640
00:57:35,559 --> 00:57:44,160
$49,000. And of course, every time I say
a cost of a salary increase, you can add

641
00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:49,200
30% to it for the other benefits as
well. So that that is currently funded

642
00:57:46,240 --> 00:57:55,760
in the recommended budget for a total
cost of about 63 to $64,000.

643
00:57:53,359 --> 00:58:00,079
That's compared to if we were able to
implement the full market study that

644
00:57:58,240 --> 00:58:05,920
we've discussed several times. That
would have a price tag of about $200,000

645
00:58:02,720 --> 00:58:12,480
in salary changes. Add the 30% that's up
to

646
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:17,359
263. That that was pretty quickly not um
going to be able to be 100%

647
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:22,000
implementation. We evaluated a number of
scenarios through through the budget

648
00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:27,200
process to figure out uh you know where
we might be able to land and we were

649
00:58:25,040 --> 00:58:32,000
working towards a you know some sort of
partial implementation whether that

650
00:58:28,960 --> 00:58:36,640
meant uh you know phasing it in in
various ways throughout the fiscal year.

651
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:40,760
As an example, this chart shows an
incremental phase in that moves uh the

652
00:58:39,839 --> 00:58:45,359
increase
along uh at four increments through the

653
00:58:43,440 --> 00:58:49,839
fiscal year about every six or seven pay
cycles so that by March we've gotten

654
00:58:47,839 --> 00:58:56,280
folks up to where we want them to be.
That comes in at about 60% of the cost

655
00:58:53,119 --> 00:59:03,400
of the full study. Uh at about
124,000 125,000 again add the 30% that's

656
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:09,119
up to 161. And again,
ultimately it it was not an option that

657
00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:13,359
we were able to recommend without
further changes to our

658
00:59:11,079 --> 00:59:19,880
revenues. And so where again where we
landed um was uh about for including the

659
00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:26,760
benefits
um 60 about

660
00:59:22,920 --> 00:59:31,599
$64,000. And so the next column just
shows as a comparison. It says

661
00:59:29,440 --> 00:59:37,920
additional needed to fund incremental.
It shows the additional cost if we were

662
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:45,200
to
uh try to go from that flat one, 1200

663
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:50,640
plan to the incremental plan. So that
for example is a

664
00:59:47,319 --> 00:59:55,480
$75,000 additional and again add the 30%
it comes into about

665
00:59:52,520 --> 01:00:01,400
98,000. What I've done though is uh it's
shown as a whole but it's also shown uh

666
00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:11,319
by department. You can see all of these
scenarios by department. Um it's it's in

667
01:00:05,760 --> 01:00:17,040
there and published and and again it
shows because the 30% was being totaled

668
01:00:15,440 --> 01:00:23,200
along the bottom of that chart. It's
also totaled on there on the side. So uh

669
01:00:20,160 --> 01:00:27,920
you can understand either individually
or as a whole what that would look like.

670
01:00:26,160 --> 01:00:34,960
So, that's just one additional piece of
information and context uh in case

671
01:00:30,559 --> 01:00:40,640
that's helpful. Uh the active living
coordinator position that was funded in

672
01:00:38,000 --> 01:00:49,200
the current year budget uh but has not
yet been filled uh but we are in the

673
01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:55,040
process of doing so. Um but again that
there are not been anybody hired or any

674
01:00:51,440 --> 01:01:00,240
offers made. Um although we're close to
that point.

675
01:00:57,480 --> 01:01:04,240
Um that the cost of that position in
next year's budget is uh when you

676
01:01:02,720 --> 01:01:11,359
include all the benefits for that
position is about 63 and a half

677
01:01:07,559 --> 01:01:14,960
thousand. Um, another piece of
information that's published in in here

678
01:01:13,119 --> 01:01:21,119
based on the conversation from last time
was a conversation around board member

679
01:01:18,040 --> 01:01:25,440
stipens. Uh, so that that information is
published in there. That's a total cost

680
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:33,319
for the current uh for the coming fiscal
year of about just under $25,000 for the

681
01:01:28,880 --> 01:01:37,480
whole year for all of all of the elected
officials.

682
01:01:35,400 --> 01:01:42,319
Um,
and so that's that's there for just

683
01:01:40,280 --> 01:01:47,000
forformational purposes. Of course, it's
elsewhere in the budget document, but

684
01:01:43,920 --> 01:01:52,160
this was just to try to consolidate.
Um, we also had a little conversation

685
01:01:50,079 --> 01:01:56,640
about our bulky waste program and and
kind of concern over whether it was an

686
01:01:54,400 --> 01:02:04,400
issue of something that was driving up
our costs or people taking advantage of

687
01:01:59,280 --> 01:02:10,480
it. And um the the analysis came out
that it's actually uh had has a cost

688
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:15,920
from a tipping fee perspective. We were
able to isolate that the trucks on

689
01:02:12,799 --> 01:02:23,000
Thursdays that would be using that. And
the the the year's tipping fees for that

690
01:02:19,040 --> 01:02:31,480
program is about uh
$1,758 or about $146 a.

691
01:02:27,280 --> 01:02:36,000
And we also programmed in the the
the staff time

692
01:02:33,720 --> 01:02:40,640
involved. Of course, that's not an extra
cost. It's just a representative figure

693
01:02:38,079 --> 01:02:46,000
of the allocation of their their time.
But uh we have a crew of two that

694
01:02:43,119 --> 01:02:49,839
typically spends two to three hours once
a week on Thursdays collecting targeted

695
01:02:48,319 --> 01:02:52,799
items. They don't go up and down every
street looking for it because those

696
01:02:51,200 --> 01:02:58,640
items have already been identified
through the garbage collection process.

697
01:02:55,040 --> 01:03:06,480
Uh but we we estimate the the staff time
cost of that program to to be just under

698
01:03:02,920 --> 01:03:11,119
$4,000. Uh we did not identify fuel
expense as a significant cost. Although

699
01:03:09,599 --> 01:03:17,359
you know you are making a trip to the
landfill and back. Um but we we

700
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:23,200
determined that that wasn't a cost that
really needed to factor into this uh

701
01:03:20,000 --> 01:03:28,160
analysis. But uh but when you add that
together, you're you're just under

702
01:03:25,319 --> 01:03:35,119
$6,000 uh for the year for the what we
do with bulky waste. Uh we we believe

703
01:03:31,039 --> 01:03:40,160
that the cost is that cost is less than
the of course the value of the benefit

704
01:03:36,720 --> 01:03:43,839
provided by keeping the community uh
appearance clean and providing the

705
01:03:41,680 --> 01:03:49,480
higher level of service. So folks aren't
having to figure out other ways to

706
01:03:46,240 --> 01:03:55,200
dispose of these items.
Um there was uh questions about our

707
01:03:52,880 --> 01:04:00,799
Rusty Home Senior Center partnership and
the the senior programs that

708
01:03:57,640 --> 01:04:05,280
have happened over many years but in
recent years done in partnership with

709
01:04:02,240 --> 01:04:09,760
Rusty Home Senior Center. Uh we
currently work with them to provide a

710
01:04:07,680 --> 01:04:17,599
minimum of two catered lunch events per
year including entertainment. Um and as

711
01:04:13,359 --> 01:04:21,119
available uh they also are uh working to
provide other activities whether they be

712
01:04:19,440 --> 01:04:24,920
fitness classes for seniors or
educational or other social or other

713
01:04:23,920 --> 01:04:29,839
types of
programs. In May we had our most recent

714
01:04:28,319 --> 01:04:35,280
event. There's usually one in May, one
December. There were 100 seniors signed

715
01:04:32,640 --> 01:04:41,280
up for that event. Uh and so that's what
they prepared for. Uh there they had

716
01:04:38,559 --> 01:04:48,240
about 75 or 80 people actually attend.
So unfortunately there were some folks

717
01:04:44,160 --> 01:04:53,200
that didn't come. Uh don't really have a
an answer as to why or but it's

718
01:04:51,039 --> 01:04:58,240
unfortunate but you know for what they
prepared for it was about $20 a person

719
01:04:55,599 --> 01:05:03,200
for a full meal with drinks and dessert
entertainment and door prizes for those

720
01:05:00,319 --> 01:05:07,119
in attendance. Um staff believes that
this is a good value for what's provided

721
01:05:05,039 --> 01:05:12,720
for those seniors for those interactions
a couple times a year for all they get.

722
01:05:09,599 --> 01:05:17,599
The Rusty Holmes team has a they've done
a great job of bringing their team out

723
01:05:14,640 --> 01:05:21,440
to make it uh smooth and enjoyable. This
is something again our history of

724
01:05:19,680 --> 01:05:24,760
volunteers making things happen in
Spencer. For many years this program

725
01:05:23,200 --> 01:05:29,039
happened with volunteers putting it
together. Um that's become more

726
01:05:27,119 --> 01:05:34,160
challenging in recent years and this was
a great opportunity to partner with with

727
01:05:31,119 --> 01:05:39,440
our local senior services nonprofit to
make that happen.

728
01:05:36,799 --> 01:05:44,160
And then uh the other information that I
provided is related to our uh our grant

729
01:05:42,240 --> 01:05:48,559
programs that go through our community
appearance commission and and historic

730
01:05:46,319 --> 01:05:53,680
preservation commission related to the
Salsbury Avenue corridor improvements

731
01:05:51,039 --> 01:05:58,960
and our residential historic
preservation program.

732
01:05:56,200 --> 01:06:05,760
Uh you can see over the last several
years how uh those programs have

733
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:10,880
increased in the amount of funding that
has gone towards those. Historically

734
01:06:08,480 --> 01:06:16,000
each of the they were originally known
as residential and commercial facade

735
01:06:12,799 --> 01:06:19,000
grant programs. They had pots of $2,000
each and maximum matching grant awards

736
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:24,640
of
$500. And in the fiscal year 22, that

737
01:06:22,640 --> 01:06:28,880
increased dramatically
uh by an increase in the town

738
01:06:26,440 --> 01:06:34,799
contributions towards those programs. We
we started contributing $10,000 for each

739
01:06:32,000 --> 01:06:39,559
rather than $2,000 and and increase the
match uh the maximum matched to to 2,000

740
01:06:38,480 --> 01:06:45,200
instead of
500. And we also in that first year had

741
01:06:42,880 --> 01:06:51,520
an infusion of additional grant funding
from Duke Energy of 25,000.

742
01:06:48,039 --> 01:06:56,799
So we went from one year having $4,000
to dole out $45,000 the next year. But

743
01:06:55,119 --> 01:07:02,000
then it kind of flattened after that.
The last few years it had been $20,000

744
01:07:00,319 --> 01:07:08,000
each year. Then in the current fiscal
year uh during the budget approval

745
01:07:05,520 --> 01:07:15,559
process last year that went from 20 to
16,000 taking it from 10 to 8 into the

746
01:07:11,680 --> 01:07:22,000
grant programs. Now, typically we
have at times struggled to to get uh

747
01:07:18,960 --> 01:07:26,720
enough applicants to uh be awarded all
of those grant funds. You can you can

748
01:07:23,839 --> 01:07:32,000
see the next column in there in any
given year. We you know are roughly

749
01:07:29,680 --> 01:07:38,960
awarding about half of the grant funds
that are available. And then, you know,

750
01:07:35,119 --> 01:07:44,240
we're roughly uh having those grant
those awarded grants uh go to completion

751
01:07:42,240 --> 01:07:48,839
on when somebody actually does the work
and turns in their receipts for

752
01:07:45,799 --> 01:07:54,280
reimbursement. It's been
about you know 60 to 70% of those

753
01:07:52,000 --> 01:08:00,400
awarded grants
have especially over the last few years

754
01:07:57,039 --> 01:08:04,160
have gotten to the completion. Uh so
that's that's just some information. Uh

755
01:08:02,880 --> 01:08:07,039
there was a there was a question about
that. You can kind of see how that

756
01:08:05,599 --> 01:08:12,400
program's worked over the last few
years. In the current in the recommended

757
01:08:09,440 --> 01:08:19,000
budget, uh the recommendation is to uh
for for next year at least to return

758
01:08:14,799 --> 01:08:23,719
that to the more modestsized uh pot of
2,000 for each of those programs with

759
01:08:22,400 --> 01:08:27,920
max award of
$500. And you can see

760
01:08:28,440 --> 01:08:37,920
that again historically
Well, a year in fiscal year 21, we

761
01:08:34,319 --> 01:08:44,359
awarded half of the awarded 4,000. Uh
2,000 was awarded and 2,000 was expended

762
01:08:41,199 --> 01:08:44,359
to reimbursement.

763
01:08:45,440 --> 01:08:50,640
Question question. Yeah. And I I think
we we talked briefly about this last

764
01:08:48,719 --> 01:08:54,480
time. M asked about the contract
services because that I mean that is a

765
01:08:52,080 --> 01:09:00,560
pretty significant amount. It's about 8%
of the budget. We But just for for those

766
01:08:57,839 --> 01:09:06,880
playing along here at home, what what is
that? Sure. So, it's a it's a variety of

767
01:09:03,600 --> 01:09:11,480
things depending on where uh within our
administrative budget. That's how our

768
01:09:08,640 --> 01:09:17,359
our planning
services our planning services that we

769
01:09:14,480 --> 01:09:22,600
provide are done via contract services.
So, that's that's one example within the

770
01:09:19,520 --> 01:09:32,560
administrative budget. Um we
also uh have uh elements like uh in our

771
01:09:30,159 --> 01:09:38,480
in our public safety departments uh and
even even in our administrative

772
01:09:35,920 --> 01:09:43,719
sometimes it it is referring to some of
the software that we're using

773
01:09:41,480 --> 01:09:51,600
uh some of those
platforms. Uh in public works, it's uh

774
01:09:47,199 --> 01:09:57,360
mulch grinding. In the library, uh it uh
we have some in contract services for

775
01:09:54,080 --> 01:10:04,000
some of the events when uh contracting
out of folks to help provide those

776
01:10:00,760 --> 01:10:09,760
activities. Uh in the proposed recommend
uh recreation budget, uh same thing,

777
01:10:07,199 --> 01:10:18,080
some some level of contracted services
for programming activities. Um but in

778
01:10:14,440 --> 01:10:23,719
um in general those are those are some
of the things that are covered in that

779
01:10:20,480 --> 01:10:23,719
those services

780
01:10:24,000 --> 01:10:35,800
uh to some I mean not greatly but to
some extent they do

781
01:10:30,560 --> 01:10:35,800
I guess are these figures that

782
01:10:37,520 --> 01:10:44,640
yes I mean what you see uh in the
recommended budget is Uh really there

783
01:10:42,880 --> 01:10:50,159
there's actually some things that that
we have reduced uh we have reduced our

784
01:10:47,120 --> 01:10:59,560
planning services hours in some cases to
try to create some savings. Engineering

785
01:10:53,520 --> 01:10:59,560
services was cut that as well. Yeah.

786
01:11:01,040 --> 01:11:10,000
Peter, can you uh address for u our
citizens why code enforcement has been

787
01:11:07,520 --> 01:11:14,719
moved to the police department or there
seems to be some confusion? Sure. So,

788
01:11:12,719 --> 01:11:18,400
for several years, code enforcement has
been a function provided through our

789
01:11:16,800 --> 01:11:25,920
police department. The recommended
budget includes uh an adjustment to uh

790
01:11:23,520 --> 01:11:30,480
move our code officer to a sworn law
enforcement position. Uh our code off

791
01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:36,080
our current code officer happens to to
be a sworn law enforcement officer and

792
01:11:32,480 --> 01:11:41,000
works with has a reserve status with our
police department.

793
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:47,920
And the the idea is to provide some
flexibility. So, and it's also an

794
01:11:44,640 --> 01:11:54,000
ability to get a few more hours a week
of services. The code officers um on a

795
01:11:51,440 --> 01:12:00,159
40hour a week schedule. Our sworn law
enforcement officers are 42 hours or a

796
01:11:57,040 --> 01:12:05,600
week or 84 hours every two weeks. That's
about 100 extra hours of services a year

797
01:12:02,719 --> 01:12:13,199
that could be provided. Uh but the the
key thing is uh is the flexibility that

798
01:12:09,600 --> 01:12:18,560
would be possible through that position
of being able to respond if needed while

799
01:12:16,000 --> 01:12:22,120
while on duty as a code officer and some
of those other capacities.

800
01:12:23,199 --> 01:12:29,640
Can I say one other thing? Yeah. For
information for our public and

801
01:12:26,640 --> 01:12:36,560
everything else. The proposal is two
cents and we all know this on the board

802
01:12:32,880 --> 01:12:44,880
but just information for every penny if
we're deducting

803
01:12:39,640 --> 01:12:49,520
38,354 out of the so with that 2% we are
cutting little over

804
01:12:47,239 --> 01:12:54,560
74,000. That's what we're trying to cut
if we wanted to get the budget back to

805
01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:58,239
the previous year. So that's just
information good information for you to

806
01:12:56,719 --> 01:13:03,280
know.
Can you talk through I mean you got the

807
01:13:00,280 --> 01:13:10,880
summary talk through
the kind of cumulative example cuts that

808
01:13:07,679 --> 01:13:15,600
were made. There's a question of, you
know, have you cut? The answer is yes,

809
01:13:13,280 --> 01:13:20,560
we have cut out of the proposed budget.
And so can you kind of walk through what

810
01:13:17,760 --> 01:13:25,000
some of those proposed cuts are?
Understand that. Sure. So, and again

811
01:13:22,800 --> 01:13:30,640
kind of going going through
um through by the budget unit or the

812
01:13:27,880 --> 01:13:37,719
department for the recommended budget,
the the current recommended amount for

813
01:13:32,960 --> 01:13:47,920
governing body um is about
$25,000. Um that that budget

814
01:13:43,159 --> 01:13:52,880
um includes uh again historically quite
a few of our u the grant programs we've

815
01:13:51,280 --> 01:13:57,600
talked about but they also include
things that we we've got to have like

816
01:13:55,280 --> 01:14:04,239
accounting services for our audit legal
services uh dues and subscriptions to

817
01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:06,880
entities like uh the lead municipalities
and central line of council of

818
01:14:05,520 --> 01:14:12,000
governments and the chamber and that
sort of thing. And they also include the

819
01:14:09,040 --> 01:14:18,080
fees that we pay to the Rowan County tax
collector.

820
01:14:14,360 --> 01:14:22,320
$35,000 of that budget is is is that.
So, and of course, every municipality in

821
01:14:20,000 --> 01:14:28,480
the county contracts with the county for
that service rather than hiring their

822
01:14:24,679 --> 01:14:33,159
own person to be a tax collector. Uh
that fee has increased over the last

823
01:14:30,960 --> 01:14:42,040
several years. We've been on a
five-year plan of getting the fee to be

824
01:14:37,880 --> 01:14:48,760
1.5% of our revenue, tax revenue that's
collected. They we pay that back to them

825
01:14:44,719 --> 01:14:53,520
in this fee. Uh it's gone
up.15% each year for the last several

826
01:14:50,960 --> 01:14:57,440
years. So that amount that amount has
has gone up over the last several years.

827
01:14:55,840 --> 01:15:03,199
Mr. F, can I make a comment on that too?
And I know that looks like a big number

828
01:15:00,040 --> 01:15:06,719
and relative to our budget, it maybe is,
but for 35,000 less than a full-time

829
01:15:05,520 --> 01:15:10,880
equivalent position, we're getting a
whole department. I I know none of us

830
01:15:08,800 --> 01:15:16,000
like a tax man, so to say, but they do a
phenomenal job. And that's a that's a

831
01:15:12,719 --> 01:15:20,239
deal for the services they provide. So,
I mean that that's I know it's a big

832
01:15:18,159 --> 01:15:24,080
number, but I promise you if we try to
do that ourselves, it would be our

833
01:15:21,600 --> 01:15:27,920
entire budget. So I recently as part of
the mayor's association that I'm a part

834
01:15:25,679 --> 01:15:32,719
of, I recently was on an email chain
where different one mayor in the eastern

835
01:15:30,800 --> 01:15:36,960
part of the state was trying to find out
they were considering taking their house

836
01:15:35,199 --> 01:15:42,560
and so we started getting all these
numbers back and forth from folks and uh

837
01:15:39,280 --> 01:15:48,000
the 1.5% is a very reasonable rate. I
saw rates upwards of a lot of them were

838
01:15:45,760 --> 01:15:55,280
two two and a half%. I saw a couple that
were in the 5% which I thought was

839
01:15:50,040 --> 01:16:02,000
highly but uh Yeah, it's
so again about $200 to $5,000. We to get

840
01:16:00,000 --> 01:16:09,520
to the recommended budget identified
about $14,000 in cuts. Uh that included

841
01:16:06,719 --> 01:16:15,760
uh putting a pause on the mural program.
We have for several years had public art

842
01:16:12,320 --> 01:16:20,719
happening uh here primarily through uh
grants, but we have also budgeted some

843
01:16:17,840 --> 01:16:25,199
town funding to help with matches uh and
kind of get it started each year. But

844
01:16:22,640 --> 01:16:29,600
we've typically brought in grant funding
that exceeds uh the amount needed to

845
01:16:28,320 --> 01:16:34,520
actually do the work. But we've
typically funded as kind of our own

846
01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:40,159
start each year about
$5,000 uh $12,000 between both of the

847
01:16:37,920 --> 01:16:47,199
grant programs. We've been talking about
a reduction in the events uh line uh

848
01:16:43,760 --> 01:16:52,560
specifically about a $4,000 reduction in
what we're contributing towards

849
01:16:49,960 --> 01:16:58,080
Winterfest. Uh and part of that is due
to we're providing more now in terms of

850
01:16:55,760 --> 01:17:03,199
inind services with the with the park.
We're going to be providing uh

851
01:17:00,320 --> 01:17:09,040
facilities that will hopefully reduce
some of the costs on the organizers of

852
01:17:06,640 --> 01:17:15,840
of putting that event on and a reduction
in our available contingency of of

853
01:17:12,360 --> 01:17:22,239
$10,000. That amount really was I
considered it modest to begin with at

854
01:17:17,760 --> 01:17:27,920
about the last few years we've we've had
uh 15 or 20,000. right now what's

855
01:17:25,600 --> 01:17:32,320
recommended for next year at 5,000 in
contingency. So that's the what if in

856
01:17:30,159 --> 01:17:37,760
the budget. That's the what when
something pops up uh it's our ability to

857
01:17:35,360 --> 01:17:42,400
say okay here's an opportunity and we've
got this set aside that we can make use

858
01:17:40,080 --> 01:17:47,960
of. So the contingency for next year is
being recommended at $5,000 just in a

859
01:17:45,360 --> 01:17:56,719
effort to keep things as minimal as
possible. And um uh moving on to uh our

860
01:17:53,560 --> 01:18:01,760
administrative uh department,
uh we've identified

861
01:17:58,440 --> 01:18:06,600
$32,000 in in cuts to get to the
recommended amount

862
01:18:03,640 --> 01:18:12,880
uh ranging on
reducing reducing training and travel uh

863
01:18:09,560 --> 01:18:18,640
budgets, reducing uh funding to we
typically like to budget an amount uh

864
01:18:15,440 --> 01:18:22,880
for HVAC maintenance for this this
building has six units that if one of

865
01:18:21,280 --> 01:18:26,960
them goes out and we've already had to
replace one of them, uh because these

866
01:18:24,880 --> 01:18:32,880
these were existing units that were
upfitted, uh put back into service as

867
01:18:30,800 --> 01:18:37,840
part of the project, uh one of those
goes out, it's about $20,000 to replace

868
01:18:35,520 --> 01:18:42,400
it. And so rather than having to
scramble, we were fortunate the last few

869
01:18:40,880 --> 01:18:47,840
years that we kind of budgeted that
amount just in case it was if needed, it

870
01:18:45,120 --> 01:18:52,239
was there. Uh but in the you know that's
an example looking forward to this

871
01:18:49,360 --> 01:18:56,320
budget. You know what uh we're going to
we're not going to budget that much.

872
01:18:53,840 --> 01:19:01,120
We're going to maybe uh we reduce that
amount by about

873
01:18:57,719 --> 01:19:04,360
$10,000. Um and if something's needed,
we'll we'll have to figure it out when

874
01:19:02,640 --> 01:19:11,040
the time comes.
Um, we also uh and it's not reflected uh

875
01:19:09,280 --> 01:19:16,800
as a cut because of the way our budget
software works, but uh we were hoping to

876
01:19:13,679 --> 01:19:21,520
fund a part-time uh position to continue
that public art program that I talked

877
01:19:19,199 --> 01:19:26,080
about. Uh we're not able to recommend
that at this time. That's worth about

878
01:19:23,199 --> 01:19:33,600
115,000.
um our police department uh about

879
01:19:29,320 --> 01:19:42,000
$24,000 in uh in cuts for again things
like travel and training and uh but also

880
01:19:36,719 --> 01:19:46,520
u reducing the amount we have on uh uh
some of our contract services like

881
01:19:47,320 --> 01:19:54,080
uh including the uh having some funding
available if we need to do a code

882
01:19:52,000 --> 01:20:00,920
enforcement abatement reducing that
amount uh reding amount of tasers that

883
01:19:58,080 --> 01:20:08,320
uh we were planning to
replace and but the most significant

884
01:20:04,440 --> 01:20:15,600
area for police was a frozen position uh
with benefits that's worth almost

885
01:20:11,159 --> 01:20:20,880
$60,000. Uh two replacement vehicles uh
that's about $105,000 that we're just

886
01:20:17,920 --> 01:20:28,159
going to have to hold off right now. in
the fire department. There was about

887
01:20:24,360 --> 01:20:35,040
$65,000 reduction in in some uniform
items and some uh PPE bunker gear

888
01:20:32,040 --> 01:20:37,840
replacements. Um there were some
building maintenance needs at the fire

889
01:20:36,560 --> 01:20:43,199
station we would have liked to have been
able to do. We're going to have to hold

890
01:20:40,239 --> 01:20:47,800
off on those. We reduced that amount. Um
and then some maintenance on our reserve

891
01:20:45,600 --> 01:20:53,159
backup engine.
Um there was an amount produced there,

892
01:20:50,800 --> 01:21:01,199
but again the total was about
$65,000. And then

893
01:20:57,159 --> 01:21:05,360
um in in our um in our public works
department, there was a mower uh

894
01:21:03,679 --> 01:21:13,040
replacement that we're going to hold off
on for a year that's worth about

895
01:21:08,120 --> 01:21:17,679
14,000. Um, and then we there was a
budget request related to some

896
01:21:14,960 --> 01:21:22,640
maintenance on on our uh garbage truck,
our older garbage truck, uh, that we we

897
01:21:20,960 --> 01:21:28,400
had cut that one out, but we were able
to fund it um, in with savings in the

898
01:21:26,159 --> 01:21:32,880
current year budget. And there are a few
other items that uh, aren't necessarily

899
01:21:31,360 --> 01:21:36,400
on this list. We've actually worked
through some of them in the last few

900
01:21:34,400 --> 01:21:39,760
meetings where we've identified some
opportunities in the current year to

901
01:21:37,920 --> 01:21:46,320
take care of a few things and we were
able to um the departments had several

902
01:21:43,199 --> 01:21:52,400
items that they didn't even request and
so they're not showing up as a as a cut.

903
01:21:49,760 --> 01:21:57,040
But those are some of the examples.
What was the I know the number so they

904
01:21:55,120 --> 01:22:00,080
know the number. I know that from March
when we started planning this to the

905
01:21:58,639 --> 01:22:04,080
number you told us last month that we
had we had to work down from what's the

906
01:22:02,320 --> 01:22:09,159
difference? Well, it it we were looking
at about a million dollar gap that we

907
01:22:06,560 --> 01:22:14,000
started with in just and that was just
raw. Those are raw numbers. It was kind

908
01:22:11,760 --> 01:22:19,840
of the pre-ere request
um kind of stage that before everything

909
01:22:17,199 --> 01:22:23,920
was finalized of you know just going on
available revenues keeping everything

910
01:22:21,600 --> 01:22:29,280
the same and looking at you know all the
possibilities of requests.

911
01:22:27,199 --> 01:22:36,080
Um the other thing I think need to point
out right brought this up right is the

912
01:22:32,560 --> 01:22:40,480
ARPA funding we don't have that so you
know as far as these cuts you're going

913
01:22:38,639 --> 01:22:45,520
to see cutting some things but there
were conditions I guess over the past

914
01:22:42,480 --> 01:22:50,440
couple years with with that staff who've
done things like that. I think the thing

915
01:22:47,440 --> 01:22:55,239
that we need to keep in mind what are
increases that are proposed in the

916
01:22:52,400 --> 01:23:02,320
budget maybe offsetting some of
this the increase uh proposed two cent

917
01:23:00,159 --> 01:23:06,239
increase. One of the big things and I
think I had kind of forgotten about this

918
01:23:04,159 --> 01:23:10,800
and make sure our board and our citizens
remember this. Uh there is still uh

919
01:23:09,520 --> 01:23:16,480
additional
basically this coming year additional

920
01:23:13,760 --> 01:23:20,719
fire staff for the entire year because I
believe if I'm correct we budgeted

921
01:23:18,480 --> 01:23:25,440
basically for three positions for a
whole year and three positions for a

922
01:23:22,480 --> 01:23:30,560
half year. Is that right? Uh that was
the that that transition happened in the

923
01:23:27,920 --> 01:23:35,199
current Yeah. So we had we had fully
funded position in the current year

924
01:23:32,400 --> 01:23:39,360
we're in for fire. Uh the one of the big
changes though with fire budget is the

925
01:23:37,120 --> 01:23:46,080
new debt service for the new the new
fire truck um is is certainly

926
01:23:43,560 --> 01:23:49,960
um you know that that was one item
there. Um

927
01:23:50,719 --> 01:23:58,719
yeah. So Mr. Mayor, if I may just make a
a comment of the board and Mr. Franis

928
01:23:56,480 --> 01:24:01,600
and staff, as I said last week, I think
we all said this last time we were here.

929
01:24:00,159 --> 01:24:06,400
We appreciate what you've done. you guys
have have moved the mountain in six

930
01:24:03,760 --> 01:24:10,400
weeks. Um that was a big difference six
weeks ago. You guys have have got us

931
01:24:07,840 --> 01:24:15,360
down to we do some fine tweaking. So So
well done.

932
01:24:11,800 --> 01:24:21,040
Um you know regardless of how you slice
it, we're asking someone on faith to

933
01:24:18,960 --> 01:24:24,560
take a to take a haircut, right? To
tighten the budgets. I you know I I said

934
01:24:23,040 --> 01:24:28,719
it last time we were here. Mr. Mayor, I
know you were you were not here, but

935
01:24:25,840 --> 01:24:31,440
just for the for your benefit. I I mean
I don't want to put pressure on anyone

936
01:24:29,840 --> 01:24:35,920
up here, but I know how I feel. We need
to tighten, you know, and our stipens

937
01:24:33,679 --> 01:24:40,960
not you heard m Mr. Frenzy say it. The
whole siphon for all of us total is

938
01:24:37,400 --> 01:24:45,120
25,000 for the year. That that's it. Um
but as a good faith, I think we we've

939
01:24:43,199 --> 01:24:49,679
got a titan what we get. If we're asking
everyone else to titan, we've got to

940
01:24:46,480 --> 01:24:52,159
tighten. Um and I I mean I'm you know,
we can take that as low as y'all want to

941
01:24:50,960 --> 01:24:56,320
go. So I don't want to put any pressure
on anyone, but I mean if that's a to me

942
01:24:54,800 --> 01:25:01,199
that's leadership in good faith and and
we can't sit up here in good faith and

943
01:24:57,800 --> 01:25:05,440
ask these folks don't on to do
regardless of how we all vote. I mean

944
01:25:03,440 --> 01:25:08,800
someone's taking a haircut, right? And
they're are are not getting maybe what

945
01:25:07,040 --> 01:25:12,639
they'd hope they're going to get. We
we've got to do the same. So I've

946
01:25:10,639 --> 01:25:17,840
already donated mine. No. And you have.
Yeah. And you have the next three years.

947
01:25:15,440 --> 01:25:20,800
and you have and I you know that was
that was the documentation from from

948
01:25:19,360 --> 01:25:27,520
Miss Py today and we didn't know that so
we appreciate that. Um, so you know, you

949
01:25:24,400 --> 01:25:33,440
know, in my thought is is that at least
a third and that that's 78,000 bucks I

950
01:25:30,400 --> 01:25:38,880
think by my math over a year and I mean
and we can go no lower if you want to,

951
01:25:35,600 --> 01:25:44,560
but I don't want to put anyone on. I
agree with what you're saying because um

952
01:25:42,400 --> 01:25:50,639
well number one I I didn't even know
there was a sip when I ran. So that was

953
01:25:47,679 --> 01:25:54,480
a pleasant surprise and uh you're
getting a good bargain for your money.

954
01:25:52,560 --> 01:26:01,480
But I agree if everybody else is taking
a hit I want to take one

955
01:25:57,159 --> 01:26:09,760
too and we can talk about how much it
uh how much work on that.

956
01:26:06,639 --> 01:26:16,400
Yeah. I have one one other question uh
because Miss Gray asked about u the

957
01:26:12,560 --> 01:26:21,920
resource officer the grease um those
they won't be dedicated resource

958
01:26:18,560 --> 01:26:27,280
officers now is that so we're really
there's not a change in function uh

959
01:26:24,639 --> 01:26:33,040
right now our our compensation and
classification plan shows uh rather it

960
01:26:31,040 --> 01:26:37,679
shows a separate classification for
school resource officers. What we're

961
01:26:34,639 --> 01:26:41,520
recommending doing is not keeping that
as a separate

962
01:26:39,159 --> 01:26:44,880
classification. It's just an assignment.
Same thing for detective. It's not a

963
01:26:43,440 --> 01:26:51,199
separate classification. It's an
assignment. So then our rank structure

964
01:26:47,560 --> 01:26:55,440
of police officer, corporal, sergeant,
etc. functions as the classification.

965
01:26:53,760 --> 01:26:58,960
And whether you're assigned a patrol or
investigations or school resource

966
01:26:57,040 --> 01:27:04,000
officer, that that's what that's about.
So it's not uh we still are we still

967
01:27:02,159 --> 01:27:09,000
have three school resource officers
funded in the budget. Those are grant

968
01:27:06,199 --> 01:27:16,239
funded. Two of them are are funded at
100% including salary benefits, fuel,

969
01:27:12,320 --> 01:27:23,440
training, etc. Uh and uh one of them is
at about 85 or 86%. Uh and just just so

970
01:27:20,239 --> 01:27:27,360
folks understand that represents the the
funding that we get from Brilliance

971
01:27:25,199 --> 01:27:33,120
Albury schools and actually they get
other grant funding that they pass on to

972
01:27:29,840 --> 01:27:39,280
us and others. Uh that revenue for the
school resource officers uh is

973
01:27:35,920 --> 01:27:44,159
programmed in at $252,000.
I was that was my next question is

974
01:27:41,440 --> 01:27:49,600
because if we made any changes to their
their uh duty would lose some of the

975
01:27:46,800 --> 01:27:53,520
revenue from the school. We we certainly
value what our school resource officers

976
01:27:51,840 --> 01:27:59,600
do and and our ability to be in the
schools and we've got we've got them

977
01:27:56,159 --> 01:28:06,480
here today and u but no so there's no
change to the function. It's

978
01:28:02,280 --> 01:28:12,199
simply adjusting it the comp and class
structure to follow the rank structure.

979
01:28:08,960 --> 01:28:12,199
Thank you.

980
01:28:13,600 --> 01:28:17,159
Any other questions?

981
01:28:17,199 --> 01:28:24,960
Obviously, we'll have our work cut out
for us uh on Tuesday. We appreciate all

982
01:28:22,560 --> 01:28:29,560
the input. Thank you citizens who came
out, staff in here. Thank you for all

983
01:28:26,880 --> 01:28:35,440
the time that's gone into budgeting this
uh this cycle. And and I what I I guess

984
01:28:33,280 --> 01:28:41,239
what I'll say or ask and it sounds like
maybe we don't we are not quite there.

985
01:28:37,679 --> 01:28:47,360
We can either come back Tuesday
with an adjusted budget

986
01:28:44,199 --> 01:28:52,560
ordinance. Uh we of course there's
already a recommended budget ordinance.

987
01:28:50,000 --> 01:28:57,520
Uh if so the question is do you feel
like you want to consider an ordinance

988
01:28:55,360 --> 01:29:03,120
on Tuesday?
um whether it's as recommended or with

989
01:29:00,639 --> 01:29:08,320
requested changes that we can bring back
or is Tuesday going to be more of

990
01:29:06,080 --> 01:29:12,719
another workshop opportunity and then we
would need to have another meeting you

991
01:29:10,719 --> 01:29:17,480
know to consider voting on a budget
ordinance and that's kind of where we

992
01:29:14,000 --> 01:29:17,480
are in the process

993
01:29:20,560 --> 01:29:30,800
I think we need to think about some of
these things and you guys um do another,

994
01:29:27,760 --> 01:29:36,560
you know, run down of where we're headed
and then I don't know if we'll be ready

995
01:29:33,440 --> 01:29:44,080
to vote on Tuesday.
Is it possible by Tuesday if you have

996
01:29:40,000 --> 01:29:49,199
the current proposal as you have and
then a potential secondary ordinance

997
01:29:46,080 --> 01:29:53,960
that could also be considered that show
what it would look like at a 0%

998
01:29:56,800 --> 01:30:04,080
Well, it could, but we we would need
some direction on, you know,

999
01:30:02,639 --> 01:30:11,800
how to achieve that. That's right.
That's right. Which I

1000
01:30:06,520 --> 01:30:18,960
think we say 70,000 that we talking
$76,78. Yeah, if we cut the recreation

1001
01:30:15,760 --> 01:30:18,960
person, which is

1002
01:30:19,320 --> 01:30:26,679
$63,547, that would mean we may still
need to reduce the budget $13,161.

1003
01:30:28,400 --> 01:30:35,280
I'm not in favor of cutting that
position. I think we have to have it.

1004
01:30:32,000 --> 01:30:39,199
We've invested too much money into the
parks and the things that we have here.

1005
01:30:37,679 --> 01:30:43,120
One of the things that you said, Mr.
Miller, is that you'd like to see more

1006
01:30:40,800 --> 01:30:48,000
people use our parks in the
If we had somebody who was working with

1007
01:30:45,560 --> 01:30:52,000
those, we might have an opportunity to
have more.

1008
01:30:49,760 --> 01:30:56,000
We've also heard, you know, the need for
youth

1009
01:30:53,239 --> 01:31:01,600
program and that was an extent of the
position as well to help with that. I I

1010
01:30:59,920 --> 01:31:05,199
hear you. I'm concerned that if you
don't

1011
01:31:03,280 --> 01:31:10,320
So, if we don't cut the position, is
there any way that we can revisit the

1012
01:31:07,120 --> 01:31:10,320
salary amount for that

1013
01:31:10,760 --> 01:31:18,000
position? I mean I think you're
splitting that

1014
01:31:15,000 --> 01:31:23,600
right question is how what can you cut
to make a meaningful enough but that's

1015
01:31:21,120 --> 01:31:23,600
not going to

1016
01:31:23,639 --> 01:31:34,480
be do I know that puts you all in a
tight spot in terms of the folks who are

1017
01:31:30,920 --> 01:31:38,400
waiting whatever that means I don't I
don't we we know nothing about right I

1018
01:31:36,400 --> 01:31:42,080
we don't so I think I mean you should
give an update where you are like I

1019
01:31:40,560 --> 01:31:47,760
think you're you're to the point you're
ready to send an offer, but you pause.

1020
01:31:44,920 --> 01:31:52,880
So, I'm happy that I could share in a
way, but uh yes, so we we've gotten the

1021
01:31:50,760 --> 01:31:59,440
process through multiple rounds of
interviews to we were at the stage of of

1022
01:31:56,080 --> 01:32:05,120
being prepared to make an offer. um we
have uh let the folks involved in the

1023
01:32:02,000 --> 01:32:10,199
process know what's happening with this
uh and the budget discussions and that

1024
01:32:07,280 --> 01:32:14,760
we need more time uh
potentially through next Tuesday's

1025
01:32:12,800 --> 01:32:18,400
meeting to kind of
have a determination of whether we're

1026
01:32:17,199 --> 01:32:22,880
going to be able to move forward. So
that's kind of where they are where we

1027
01:32:20,639 --> 01:32:27,840
are with that process. But you feel
really good about the candidates.

1028
01:32:25,280 --> 01:32:34,320
We we had an outstanding candidate pool.
Um and we've enjoyed interacting with

1029
01:32:30,560 --> 01:32:38,719
candidates and I think Spencer would be
served well by any number of the folks

1030
01:32:36,880 --> 01:32:43,199
who are interested in working in our
organization in this capacity.

1031
01:32:41,520 --> 01:32:48,639
Mr. Mayor, if I may just make a comment
on that and I this is I guess from my

1032
01:32:46,239 --> 01:32:53,600
perspective a splitting of the baby as
it were. I I think as a matter and I you

1033
01:32:52,560 --> 01:33:00,239
probably know where I'm going to come
down on this as a matter of good

1034
01:32:56,840 --> 01:33:03,520
faith. I think we owe them an answer as
quick as possible. All right. I mean

1035
01:33:01,679 --> 01:33:07,360
because they're they no doubt have jobs
or other opportunities, right? I mean I

1036
01:33:05,920 --> 01:33:10,239
think we need to we need to resolve it
because that's the that's the elephant

1037
01:33:08,400 --> 01:33:14,480
in the room with regard to making this
budget or not in my view. I mean two

1038
01:33:12,639 --> 01:33:19,440
cent leave it whatever it is that's
where it's at. my perspective on that,

1039
01:33:17,600 --> 01:33:22,880
knowing nothing about the candidates,
wanting those programs, knowing and and

1040
01:33:21,360 --> 01:33:26,000
when we did the community walk back in
November, we got several pointed

1041
01:33:24,800 --> 01:33:29,520
questions. You have these wonderful
facilities. Why is no one using them?

1042
01:33:27,679 --> 01:33:33,880
Right? And and and those are absolutely
valid.

1043
01:33:31,199 --> 01:33:38,159
But from my perspective
today, for the next 12 months or or you

1044
01:33:36,639 --> 01:33:40,960
know, the next six months or whatever
whatever we're looking at what the

1045
01:33:39,840 --> 01:33:46,000
budget's going to be for the next
foreseeable

1046
01:33:42,120 --> 01:33:51,280
future, we're asking these folks out
here to either a open up their wallets

1047
01:33:48,400 --> 01:33:54,560
and pay more taxes and or we're asking
the folks in uniform out here to get a

1048
01:33:53,280 --> 01:33:59,040
little bit less than they they thought
they're going to get. But we're adding

1049
01:33:56,639 --> 01:34:02,400
this position and we I know we didn't
have the other the the mural position.

1050
01:34:01,120 --> 01:34:04,960
She's been with us for a long time,
right? And and we're not going to be

1051
01:34:03,520 --> 01:34:11,159
able to do that right now, at least as
as it was. I I just think it's it's a

1052
01:34:08,320 --> 01:34:16,159
matter of who we have and who we know
versus a hypothetical, and I'm just

1053
01:34:13,920 --> 01:34:21,280
running the cost benefit for me. The
benefit that that position may bring or

1054
01:34:18,239 --> 01:34:25,360
probably will bring may well and I'd say
probably will be offset by the detriment

1055
01:34:23,040 --> 01:34:28,080
of some of these nice folks. may get
offers elsewhere and they may go

1056
01:34:26,719 --> 01:34:31,040
elsewhere and all the work that we've
done and all the work that Mr. Francis

1057
01:34:29,920 --> 01:34:35,520
has done and all the work that our
chiefs have done to get these

1058
01:34:32,880 --> 01:34:39,679
organizations where they need to be may
begin to be undone and and I I'm I'm

1059
01:34:38,400 --> 01:34:44,560
really worried about I really am I'm
really worried about that. Um, and my

1060
01:34:43,199 --> 01:34:47,520
thought is as much as I want that
position, and I absolutely agree with

1061
01:34:46,000 --> 01:34:50,400
you. I I think there's there's always a
risk. Anytime you back up from doing

1062
01:34:49,280 --> 01:34:54,639
something, there's a risk that just
doesn't get done, right? We see that all

1063
01:34:51,920 --> 01:35:00,679
the time. But from my perspective is
that I'm really worried about the

1064
01:34:56,639 --> 01:35:06,560
negative impact will offset, surpass, or
exceed the the benefit, and then it

1065
01:35:03,920 --> 01:35:10,960
becomes a detriment, right? And so I I
just in my heart of hearts I believe

1066
01:35:08,800 --> 01:35:15,840
really honestly not even related to
whether we raise the tax rate or not.

1067
01:35:13,600 --> 01:35:20,320
We're still asking these folks to to
forestall that income benefit that they

1068
01:35:18,040 --> 01:35:23,199
deserve. And if we're going to do that,
I think we have to follow it up with

1069
01:35:21,920 --> 01:35:26,320
with not moving forward with something
else that we really want to do. It's

1070
01:35:24,480 --> 01:35:32,080
that's a big chunk of of what we're
asking the community to to invest in. So

1071
01:35:29,760 --> 01:35:35,440
I just in my heart of heart I believe we
just can't move forward that right now.

1072
01:35:33,440 --> 01:35:38,000
and and maybe, you know, I know we we
had a similar conversation last year

1073
01:35:36,880 --> 01:35:42,239
this time. We said, "Well, we'll do it
in January with with getting everything

1074
01:35:40,320 --> 01:35:46,000
done and getting it posted. We're now
back around a full year." And I I

1075
01:35:44,320 --> 01:35:52,320
understand we may that may happen again.
I I get that. Maybe not. Hopefully not.

1076
01:35:48,800 --> 01:35:57,920
But but as it sits right now, I I just I
I really believe we just we just can't

1077
01:35:54,800 --> 01:36:01,800
take that risk that doing a good thing
actually creates a a back and bad thing,

1078
01:36:00,719 --> 01:36:06,800
right?
Um, and and I do believe those folks

1079
01:36:04,639 --> 01:36:11,760
need that answer. They deserve that
whether we can do this or not. Um, and

1080
01:36:09,040 --> 01:36:18,080
obviously I'm I'm one and if if you all
feel differently, let's talk it out and

1081
01:36:14,880 --> 01:36:21,679
and we'll accept it. But I'm just I mean
and we will, right? I mean, you know,

1082
01:36:20,159 --> 01:36:26,239
because ultimately we do need that
position, but but these folks also need

1083
01:36:24,480 --> 01:36:32,159
what they deserve and we're not going to
be able to give it to them fully. And I

1084
01:36:29,360 --> 01:36:39,239
think that that has to some some
balance, right? That's just my fault. I

1085
01:36:35,520 --> 01:36:44,159
hear you and I think you're exactly
right. Except for the fact we're in a

1086
01:36:41,760 --> 01:36:49,520
position where like it's all about
compromise. It's all about figuring out

1087
01:36:46,960 --> 01:36:54,400
here's my concern, right? As we said for
several years, we need to do this. We've

1088
01:36:52,159 --> 01:37:00,960
added facilities
using OPM other people's money, not our

1089
01:36:56,800 --> 01:37:06,320
tax taxpayers money. um they've gotten a
whole lot of free infrastructure through

1090
01:37:03,440 --> 01:37:10,440
other people's money. But now there is a
time we've got to as a community and a

1091
01:37:08,480 --> 01:37:16,280
taxpayer step up and
actually fund what's going to help

1092
01:37:12,880 --> 01:37:21,440
activate those spaces because to
me people want to see a return on their

1093
01:37:18,800 --> 01:37:24,320
investment, right? That's one of the
clearest ways they're going to see

1094
01:37:22,880 --> 01:37:29,600
return on their investment where they
can come and participate in a concert, a

1095
01:37:26,960 --> 01:37:34,560
free concert at the at the park when
they can walk and stand back forest and

1096
01:37:31,920 --> 01:37:38,159
have somebody that has done program when
they can take their kids to activities

1097
01:37:36,480 --> 01:37:43,760
and things like that. And those are
things right now that by and large

1098
01:37:40,320 --> 01:37:48,480
there's not a lot of that happen. Um and
so to

1099
01:37:45,560 --> 01:37:54,159
me I think they get more bang for their
buck with that type of position than

1100
01:37:52,080 --> 01:37:58,080
maybe in some other area. It's more
visible. Maybe they're not more but it's

1101
01:37:55,920 --> 01:38:05,000
more visible. It's more tangible. that
they can can experience and touch and

1102
01:38:02,159 --> 01:38:10,560
realize they're getting something
for. Um, but I hear you right because

1103
01:38:08,800 --> 01:38:15,360
I'm totally with you on making sure
we're taking care of all of our staff.

1104
01:38:12,800 --> 01:38:18,560
Um, and we've frozen some positions in
some places.

1105
01:38:19,080 --> 01:38:27,040
Um, I've got a big problem though
continuing to kick the hand down early.

1106
01:38:24,480 --> 01:38:32,320
That's uh that's where we lose momentum.
That's where we backslide and that

1107
01:38:29,600 --> 01:38:38,639
backsliding is your only concern. Well,
you got that top-notch recreation

1108
01:38:34,880 --> 01:38:43,600
committee ready to go, right? And I
mean, we've got a super committee. A

1109
01:38:41,760 --> 01:38:48,880
number of our grants have been based on
the fact that, you know, we have we we

1110
01:38:45,760 --> 01:38:52,639
will have advisory people, we will have
program. to you know the points that

1111
01:38:51,360 --> 01:38:58,400
we've gotten through some of those
grants and then contingent on some of

1112
01:38:55,679 --> 01:39:03,280
the projects that we plan to offer.
Okay. I think everybody here agrees and

1113
01:39:01,440 --> 01:39:08,880
might think that I'm against this
recreation purp. No, I mean we've heard

1114
01:39:05,760 --> 01:39:13,960
like heard I think everybody is. All
right. So the next question is okay how

1115
01:39:12,080 --> 01:39:20,639
we going to make up for
76,000? That's the question. It's not.

1116
01:39:18,800 --> 01:39:24,880
Well, all right. So, I think the bigger
question is we know how we're going to

1117
01:39:22,080 --> 01:39:28,960
make up 76,000. Well, I mean, yes and
no. Okay.

1118
01:39:26,280 --> 01:39:32,480
Right. I think the bigger question here,
and this is something that ultimately

1119
01:39:30,400 --> 01:39:38,600
the board is going to have to vote on. I
don't have a vote on it, so it's going

1120
01:39:34,000 --> 01:39:44,159
to be up to y'all to decide is
is you'll be the tiebreaker. Are you

1121
01:39:41,920 --> 01:39:49,360
gonna vote on a twocent increase? you
going to vote yes for that or are you

1122
01:39:46,080 --> 01:39:53,840
going to say no, we want it to remain a
flat tax rate? I mean and I think that's

1123
01:39:51,600 --> 01:39:57,679
what it's going to come down to, right?
So I think that's what you have to to

1124
01:39:55,760 --> 01:40:02,719
know kind of and I think we know where
generally folks stand on stuff. And so

1125
01:40:00,400 --> 01:40:07,600
the question that Peter wants to know is
are you prepared as a board to go into

1126
01:40:04,960 --> 01:40:12,880
Tuesday to have that vote? You don't
have to be unanimous on right don't.

1127
01:40:11,119 --> 01:40:17,480
It's okay. I know we want to all be
unanimous on it, but we've sat up here

1128
01:40:15,280 --> 01:40:21,280
and we've talked through this and it's
we we're doing the work that needs to be

1129
01:40:19,920 --> 01:40:24,800
done, the discussion that needs to be
done, but ultimately it's going to have

1130
01:40:22,560 --> 01:40:28,320
to come down for a vote at some point. I
can't agree with that, but it's just

1131
01:40:26,639 --> 01:40:32,480
like Peter said, he's already put this
person off one

1132
01:40:29,960 --> 01:40:38,560
week. Definitely think we got to give
this person an answer this coming week.

1133
01:40:35,040 --> 01:40:43,760
Agree. If we don't, we don't look very
good.

1134
01:40:40,719 --> 01:40:48,199
And Peter, it's a reflection on Peter,
unfortunately, because Peter's one of

1135
01:40:45,280 --> 01:40:55,480
these people. So, I think we owe
Peter uh an answer Tuesday night. I

1136
01:40:51,520 --> 01:41:00,280
agree. Yeah, I do too. Thinking about
it, I think we'll be ready.

1137
01:41:02,480 --> 01:41:11,080
So, the question is, would you be
prepared to vote on an ordinance before

1138
01:41:05,920 --> 01:41:11,080
you Tuesday night? Either yes or no.

1139
01:41:11,600 --> 01:41:19,480
So what you read
that might change? It's pretty long.

1140
01:41:23,000 --> 01:41:32,840
So I I think I would be if if it's an
eitheror because if you if you reduce

1141
01:41:30,400 --> 01:41:38,960
the the position that we've been talking
about, if you don't

1142
01:41:35,560 --> 01:41:46,760
hurt, she can't hurt. Um, if you reduce
the the a the CAC and HBC 30,000 each,

1143
01:41:44,239 --> 01:41:52,320
if you
cut the Rusty homes in half, and if you

1144
01:41:50,400 --> 01:41:56,480
if we're addressing us, which I think is
6 or 7,000, that's $78,000. And my

1145
01:41:54,880 --> 01:42:04,119
math's rough, but I guess that's pretty
close. And I think you said 383* 2 is 68

1146
01:42:00,880 --> 01:42:04,119
is 76.

1147
01:42:07,280 --> 01:42:15,080
So the way this would go I think is if
you're voting on the ordinance before

1148
01:42:11,560 --> 01:42:20,239
you if you vote yes then
it's the majority votes no then what

1149
01:42:18,880 --> 01:42:26,360
comes out is you have to provide some
additional guidance to staff as to what

1150
01:42:22,800 --> 01:42:33,600
you want them to do to get a
budget and I think what you talk through

1151
01:42:29,119 --> 01:42:37,280
might be what repeat that again so
all right Well, yeah. If you cut the the

1152
01:42:35,520 --> 01:42:44,159
the coordinator position where that's
what 635 or 636 635.

1153
01:42:41,520 --> 01:42:50,080
Okay. If you cut the 23,000s from the
CAC, the CAC and the HBC, that's 6,000.

1154
01:42:47,920 --> 01:42:55,199
If you cut Roughly Homes in half, that's
2,000. That's reflective of the data

1155
01:42:52,080 --> 01:42:59,119
Peter had about the meals in the call.
And if you we're addressing that that

1156
01:42:57,440 --> 01:43:04,000
roughly third or whatever that we talked
about earlier up here that's seven or

1157
01:43:02,080 --> 01:43:10,280
thereabouts again again again rough math
that's

1158
01:43:06,280 --> 01:43:10,280
7800 more

1159
01:43:10,880 --> 01:43:20,840
now just keep in mind I I know every one
of those things that you said has a

1160
01:43:15,840 --> 01:43:27,040
direct and tangible benefit back to the
No right we all we

1161
01:43:23,719 --> 01:43:32,560
all Again, I think one of the few things
we discussed, how does it relate to the

1162
01:43:29,840 --> 01:43:32,560
majority of

1163
01:43:33,480 --> 01:43:41,600
people segments of
people and that's I think that's where

1164
01:43:39,360 --> 01:43:47,560
we're trying to please as many people as
possible. Well, everybody can take part

1165
01:43:44,560 --> 01:43:52,560
for most folks in the recreational
programs. Ry homes, we talked about

1166
01:43:50,639 --> 01:43:57,520
senior population that we have. We have
a large senior population who can take

1167
01:43:54,880 --> 01:44:01,840
advantage of that and experience that.
We have a large historic preservation

1168
01:43:59,760 --> 01:44:05,760
district, the largest continuous
district in the state, folks that could

1169
01:44:03,840 --> 01:44:10,400
potentially take advantage of that. So
these are programs that by and large

1170
01:44:07,360 --> 01:44:15,199
most of our communities can access. I
mean, you know, it's you look at you can

1171
01:44:12,960 --> 01:44:21,360
see it both ways, right?
So, so, so here is what my what I would

1172
01:44:17,600 --> 01:44:26,000
propose to you is board to you got the
staff recommendation. They put a whole

1173
01:44:23,679 --> 01:44:30,960
lot of time and energy into providing a
recommended budget to I would recommend

1174
01:44:28,719 --> 01:44:35,840
that you consider that and vote on that
on Tuesday. Be prepared to vote on that.

1175
01:44:33,760 --> 01:44:40,960
Pending the result of that, it either
passes with the two cent increase and

1176
01:44:39,199 --> 01:44:46,960
the fee increases that have been
proposed and the budget that's proposed

1177
01:44:43,840 --> 01:44:51,440
or if it's voted down, then you go back
and provide guidance to staff. And it's

1178
01:44:50,000 --> 01:44:59,199
likely that we will have to have a
follow-up meeting should it not pass to

1179
01:44:54,119 --> 01:45:04,400
then time to present the new budget. But
at that time then if if it were not to

1180
01:45:01,920 --> 01:45:08,679
pass on Tuesday, you would know what you
need to tell candidates for that new

1181
01:45:07,040 --> 01:45:15,320
position. I mean I think that's the
reasonable thing to do.

1182
01:45:12,159 --> 01:45:15,320
Thank you.

1183
01:45:17,520 --> 01:45:26,080
It's a lot. Thank y'all very much. Board
will vote on it on Tuesday.

1184
01:45:24,480 --> 01:45:30,719
The next thing we're going to move on
unless anybody has anything else budget

1185
01:45:28,920 --> 01:45:36,280
related. All right, we're going to move
to an item on this year's budget. Um,

1186
01:45:34,400 --> 01:45:41,719
and so Peter, I'll turn this over to
you. Um, it's for consideration of a

1187
01:45:40,800 --> 01:45:48,800
budget
amendment related to replacement of a

1188
01:45:45,600 --> 01:45:53,280
vehicle that was total.
Yes. And uh, and Chief File is here, of

1189
01:45:51,119 --> 01:45:57,440
course. Uh we talked about this a little
bit a few weeks ago. We were working on

1190
01:45:55,040 --> 01:46:01,920
finalizing the budget amendment for it
and it's ready for you tonight. But we

1191
01:45:59,440 --> 01:46:08,239
had a a vehicle that was identified that
was involved in an accident earlier in

1192
01:46:03,760 --> 01:46:13,679
the year and combined with uh insurance
proceeds and some available funding

1193
01:46:10,080 --> 01:46:20,400
within the existing police budget. uh we
are able to if this budget amendment

1194
01:46:17,199 --> 01:46:24,199
were approved tonight then Gile could
move forward with replacing that vehicle

1195
01:46:22,159 --> 01:46:31,840
with a available
uh 2025 Ford Explorer for a cost of

1196
01:46:29,280 --> 01:46:39,239
about 41,000
uh and then after the tax title and

1197
01:46:34,320 --> 01:46:39,239
upfit the full cost is about $51,649.

1198
01:46:39,600 --> 01:46:47,199
And so, as a reminder, we can let our
public know that this was the result. It

1199
01:46:44,400 --> 01:46:52,960
was bad guys fault that this wreck
happened. Yes. Um and so, um it's

1200
01:46:50,239 --> 01:47:00,920
unfortunate that it happened, but uh our
police officers were doing what

1201
01:46:55,000 --> 01:47:00,920
they do, protecting people.

1202
01:47:01,600 --> 01:47:06,400
Unfortunately, it's just the part that

1203
01:47:07,560 --> 01:47:12,800
sustain. So, you have budget ordinance

1204
01:47:13,880 --> 01:47:18,480
24-2. Are there any questions on

1205
01:47:18,679 --> 01:47:25,320
this? And if not, is there a motion to
adopt this?

1206
01:47:25,520 --> 01:47:33,560
Motion by Is there a second? Second.
Second by Mr. Miller. Any further

1207
01:47:30,440 --> 01:47:39,760
discussion? Hearing none. All in
favor? All opposed? Unless unanimous.

1208
01:47:37,360 --> 01:47:44,520
Thank you all. We will now move to
review of our June 10th agenda for

1209
01:47:42,239 --> 01:47:51,480
Tuesday night.
Um we'll uh do the call of order. Mayor

1210
01:47:47,760 --> 01:47:56,639
Proin will be presiding on Tuesday
night. Do we have a volunteer for the

1211
01:47:54,119 --> 01:48:01,159
invocation? Oh my. All right, Mr.
Mohammed. Thank you very much.

1212
01:47:59,679 --> 01:48:04,560
Mayor Kim will do the pledge of
allegiance. Then we'll have additions

1213
01:48:02,960 --> 01:48:09,119
and deletions and adoption of the
agenda. I see we have two additional

1214
01:48:06,800 --> 01:48:14,639
items I believe Peter that you want
added to the agenda related to uh mural

1215
01:48:12,400 --> 01:48:21,440
work. Is that correct? Yes. And Anna,
could you share the update on this one?

1216
01:48:18,639 --> 01:48:29,600
Um I don't have a lot of information on
it. Um it was last minute um addition

1217
01:48:26,119 --> 01:48:34,400
that Scott was hoping to add. If not
this month, then it could be pushed off

1218
01:48:32,080 --> 01:48:44,760
next month. Um but she just asked that
we put it before you all um and she

1219
01:48:37,760 --> 01:48:44,760
would be on um on Zoom on Tuesday.

1220
01:48:45,360 --> 01:48:52,960
But the the idea is that we have two
concept art

1221
01:48:49,320 --> 01:48:56,960
approvals for murals that do have
existing grant funding available for

1222
01:48:54,719 --> 01:49:03,000
them.
All right, board. You want to receive an

1223
01:48:58,719 --> 01:49:10,080
update on these items on Tuesday?
Okay. All right. uh board. I would

1224
01:49:05,679 --> 01:49:10,080
suggest that we add

1225
01:49:10,760 --> 01:49:19,920
that as
item I'd suggest we add that as item

1226
01:49:17,840 --> 01:49:27,280
nine right after item eight which is
where we're adopting a budget ordinance

1227
01:49:22,080 --> 01:49:32,080
for a Woodson Foundation uh grant
specific specific reporting approach.

1228
01:49:29,920 --> 01:49:35,600
Does that work? Yeah. So these would be
items 9 and

1229
01:49:39,719 --> 01:49:48,239
Okay. All right. We uh do have a few a
number of recognitions for end of year

1230
01:49:45,600 --> 01:49:54,000
uh student awards from the town for both
North Carolina Middle School. Um and

1231
01:49:51,119 --> 01:49:59,280
then also for student quarter for the
high school and the elementary school.

1232
01:49:56,239 --> 01:50:02,920
Mayor Pim will be acknowledging those
students. We have other any other

1233
01:50:01,520 --> 01:50:06,560
recognitions that will
be at Tuesday

1234
01:50:09,080 --> 01:50:16,480
meeting. Okay. Hearing none, we'll have
public comment and then we'll have our

1235
01:50:14,080 --> 01:50:21,199
consent agenda. Um right now the only
things on the consent agenda are

1236
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:28,639
approval of our minutes from May 8th um
in pre-aggenda on May 13th meeting and

1237
01:50:23,440 --> 01:50:32,480
our May 22nd uh budget uh workshop.
So, as we go through tonight, if there's

1238
01:50:30,480 --> 01:50:37,760
anything else you want to add to the
consent agenda, please let me know. Um,

1239
01:50:35,360 --> 01:50:43,360
and then so then item eight will be uh
budget ordinance for the Margaret C.

1240
01:50:40,400 --> 01:50:46,960
Woodson Foundation grant. Um, I suggest
leaving that as a regular agenda item.

1241
01:50:45,199 --> 01:50:51,119
Since Sky will be with us, she can give
an update on that. Okay. Next would be

1242
01:50:49,679 --> 01:50:55,760
to consider adopting the parks and
recreation advisory board bylaws. I

1243
01:50:53,679 --> 01:51:01,760
assume that Mr. Mars will be there to
provide an update on that on Tuesday.

1244
01:50:58,760 --> 01:51:06,760
Okay. And then we will consider adopting
ordinance 25-10 which is the upcoming

1245
01:51:04,080 --> 01:51:13,679
fiscal year budget that we talked
about. All right. Um and then of course

1246
01:51:10,960 --> 01:51:17,040
what we mentioned with the mural mural
concept

1247
01:51:14,920 --> 01:51:22,760
considerations and then beyond that we
have our departmental reports. So it's a

1248
01:51:19,679 --> 01:51:29,520
relatively light
Tuesday light light and lean significant

1249
01:51:27,119 --> 01:51:34,320
indecisions. Do I understand correctly
that you're not going to leave here?

1250
01:51:31,320 --> 01:51:40,719
Yeah, you do.
Okay. Did you plan that? No, I did not.

1251
01:51:37,040 --> 01:51:44,480
No, I did not. So in your tie breaker
work has called me away. In your

1252
01:51:42,719 --> 01:51:48,280
absence, who's the tie breaker? In my
absence, there's not a tiebreaker.

1253
01:51:48,800 --> 01:51:57,119
Mayor pro everybody gets to vote and so
in the event that there is a tie you

1254
01:51:53,280 --> 01:52:01,639
will have to reconvene and vote again
unless someone decides to well actually

1255
01:51:59,360 --> 01:52:07,480
I was going to say abstain from being
service but that's not we have to

1256
01:52:10,400 --> 01:52:16,480
unless you don't show up not
encouraging show up

1257
01:52:18,400 --> 01:52:25,000
All right. Um, departmental reports,
town manager report, and then requesting

1258
01:52:23,119 --> 01:52:29,080
comments from the
board.

1259
01:52:26,920 --> 01:52:33,599
Um, anything
else?

1260
01:52:30,679 --> 01:52:38,560
Okay. Um, so with that, is there a need
this evening to go into executive

1261
01:52:35,199 --> 01:52:44,800
session for any reason?
I did have a comment to make about an

1262
01:52:42,320 --> 01:52:48,719
event that will be happening before
before Tuesday. Tuesday. Okay. Yeah. All

1263
01:52:46,800 --> 01:52:53,199
right.
Um and I hope you all got the message

1264
01:52:51,280 --> 01:52:58,159
early this afternoon. Uh but the
Department of Transportation has invited

1265
01:52:55,760 --> 01:53:03,119
public officials throughout the town to
uh participate or to attend a ceremony

1266
01:53:00,960 --> 01:53:09,880
dedicating the Super Elizabeth do
highway. Um and that's tomorrow June 6

1267
01:53:08,320 --> 01:53:18,400
that
u so if you got the information there is

1268
01:53:12,880 --> 01:53:25,320
an RSVP on it. Um I have that RSVP to be
there anybody else who is able to come

1269
01:53:21,760 --> 01:53:25,320
is certainly welcome

1270
01:53:25,360 --> 01:53:35,119
and I know that the Salsbury delegation
had they had a group that was in Raleigh

1271
01:53:32,000 --> 01:53:38,719
earlier yesterday. at the chamber. I
think I got to meet

1272
01:53:38,840 --> 01:53:47,599
with that's exciting and welldeserved
honor to her. Another announcement

1273
01:53:46,080 --> 01:53:53,000
that's going to happen before our
meeting uh this

1274
01:53:49,480 --> 01:53:58,639
Monday 5 to 8 community
table community 10 table down here at

1275
01:53:55,960 --> 01:54:04,480
Fleming from what I understand this year
this time it's going to be a fish fry.

1276
01:54:01,040 --> 01:54:09,119
So, it should be great. And uh the price
is whatever you can pay. Now, the

1277
01:54:06,400 --> 01:54:14,400
standard price is $15 and it's
collected. That's per person, but anyone

1278
01:54:11,920 --> 01:54:20,480
is invited whether you can pay that,
more, or nothing. And there's no stigma.

1279
01:54:17,760 --> 01:54:24,639
No one knows who's paid or anything, but
it's a wonderful uh thing that's

1280
01:54:22,400 --> 01:54:29,920
bringing the community together. So,
please try to come and Pinocchio helps

1281
01:54:27,679 --> 01:54:35,119
with it, too. They have put together
this. I think this is number three or

1282
01:54:32,000 --> 01:54:40,800
four. They It's always the second Monday
of each

1283
01:54:36,760 --> 01:54:45,040
month. So try to come.
All right. We reach the end of tonight's

1284
01:54:43,119 --> 01:54:50,880
agenda. Is there a motion to adjourn? So
move. Motion by Mr. Mohammed. Is there a

1285
01:54:47,920 --> 01:54:55,000
second? Second.
Second by Mr. Miller. All in

1286
01:54:52,840 --> 01:55:01,719
favor? Right. All
opposed. All oppose. We stand. Thank you

1287
01:54:58,239 --> 01:55:01,719
all very much.