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5:00 p.m. and we are at the Canyon

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Community Center for the July 15th

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meeting the Springdale Planning

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Commission. From the town we have

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Eugenie Ya Iikum, Nyall Connelly and

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April Radits and Tom Dansancy. On the

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dis we have Jorge Hernandez, Zion

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National Park representative, Rich

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Swanson, myself, Jennifer McCulla, Paul

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Zimmerman, Koshbati, and Melissa Labour.

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Terry Krushki is out tonight. Caution

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Melissa, I'd ask I'd like to ask you to

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vote in tonight's proceedings. Thank

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you. Is there agent a motion to approve

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tonight's agenda?

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>> I move we approve tonight's agenda.

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Second

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>> motion by Paul, second by Rich. All in

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favor?

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>> Rich I.

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>> Jennifer I.

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>> Paul I.

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>> Hash I.

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>> Melissa I.

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>> Motion passes. Are there any general

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announcements from the town?

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» I I think most of the planning

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commissioners are familiar with our two

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cent events and we are bringing uh The next in our installment of two cents

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events is the 2acre two cent where we

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will get your two cents about the 2acre

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property adjacent to the town hall that

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the town acquired several years ago. Um

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the town had been working towards

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developing a medical clinic on that site

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and the town council is reconsidering

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that and is looking for input on um what

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could be developed on those two acres.

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So that will be on Thursday, July 30th

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at 900 a.m. and that will be here. We'll

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start here in the community center and

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we'll do a little field trip of the

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site. So um we'd love to see you there

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Thursday, July 30th, 9:00 a.m. starting

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here at the community center.

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» Any other announcements?

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Are there any declarations of conflict

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of interest?

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There are none. For tonight's agenda, we

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have two non-action items. The first is

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a discussion about potential changes to

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the land use code that will be necessary

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following adoption of the wildland urban

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interface zone. Sta staff contact is

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Eugenia Ekam and Eugenia will be

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presenting.

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» Thank you. Uh this item is a

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continuation of the discussion the

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planning commission had on its May 1st,

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2026 meeting regarding the wildland

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urban interface code. Uh the purpose of

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this report today is to highlight

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potential conflicts between the town's

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land use ordinance and the WOI code and

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to present draft ordinance language for

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the commission's consideration.

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Following the previous discussion, the

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staff reviewed the commission's comments

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and fed evaluated the relevant sections

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of the code and we prepared a draft

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ordinance language addressing the

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potential conflicts that were

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identified. The report primarily focuses

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on two discussion topics which is

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building construction materials and

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landscape requirements regarding

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defensible space. for the building

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materials. Staff uh prepared draft

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amendments that would prohibit wood roof

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shingles and roots uh the wood siding

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and continue to allow timber structural

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elements while we also uh agreed to add

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cement board siding as an approved

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building material for landscaping. Staff

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presented two options regarding the

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existing tree replacement requirement

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that is in the code. uh as well as we

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propose amendments to the minimum tree

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planting requirements within the town's

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adopted RUI zone. So overall, the staff

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is looking for direction from the

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commission through this discussion to

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receive feedback and to determine the

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preferred way to move forward with this

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uh in order to prepare a final ordinance

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amendment. And I'm happy to answer any

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question from the commission.

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>> Are there any questions for Eugenia?

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Okay, planning commission will move into

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discussion.

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Just a important discussion. One

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question on the um let's start with the

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wood roof. Although I'm not against

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saying it's not an approved material,

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but are we trying to limit that or we or

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should we be focused on requiring new

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buildings to have a certain ignition

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rating? Because I think the code doesn't

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say you can't have a wood roof. It just

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gives you really bad ignition rating if

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you do.

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» Yes, you are correct. The wooi code does

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give give you options right uh for

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parameters. Um in discussion with our

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building inspector

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um he recommended that wood shingles are

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particularly problematic in terms of

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wildfire and it it might be best to just

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get rid to prohibit them in this

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instance. But you are correct that the

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WO code it does give you options. Um but

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yeah in discussion with him we he

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recommended that would probably be a

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good move just to prohibit them. I I

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have no problem with that. I'm just

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curious. And then do we add anything

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ordinance that says we want to require a

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certain ignition resistance on new

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building because that would just cover a

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lot of things but probably a little more

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headache because it would have to be

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analyzed by someone.

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So, our building inspector uh reviews

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the plans for building code compliance,

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which is separate from our kind of

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zoning title 10 stuff that that the

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planners do and that the planning

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commission uh is is involved in. So, as

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far as the details of those ignition

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resistant materials [snorts]

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and structure in structures, that's captured by the building code

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review. And so, the the purpose of this

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is generally just to to identify

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situations where there may be a conflict

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between title 10 and um

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and the WOOI code.

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I would say in general I support

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the removing of the wood shingles,

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moving move wood sighting from the list.

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Um, also continuing with the heavy

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timber structural beams and elements and

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then actually adding the cement

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boarding, this cement board siding

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to the list.

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So, the only question I have on the wood

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siding is I know that house that was

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just built at the end of Kosava, I

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believe, is wood siding. It's reclaimed

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wood. Um,

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and I I look at that as like, okay,

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that's the I like the looks. It's nice

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as as long as you're willing to take on

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a new construction, the added ignition

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resistance and the added requirements.

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Do we want to prevent that kind of

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structure? Is it I I definitely see wood

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shingles are higher risk because of

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things falling on them? I'm not sure

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about wood siding.

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>> Yeah, sure. So, I think wood wood

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sighting um is is going to be more

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flammable than than other materials, of

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course. And I I think we could keep it

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in the code and then if if following a

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review under the building code, a

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building is not compliant with WOOI, we

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could, you know, it would stop right

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there. Um,

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but if you wanted to kind of go one step

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further and and remove wood siding from

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the approved materials, that's an

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option. So, um, I either way, it's going

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to get picked up in the building code

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review. Um, but this this could be a way

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of maybe nixing some more dangerous

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materials

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at at the outset.

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And I'm mixed on this one. That's why I

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wanted to bring it up because I the only

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reason I would like maybe getting rid of

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it, but I don't know if this would

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guarantee it is I like the idea of

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reducing the defensible space.

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You know, if you have an IR1, I think

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you can stick to 30 feet. If the wood

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siding, which IR2, I think that goes to

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50 ft.

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So, by reducing the fencable space, we

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are probably preserving some more of our

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trees and greenery,

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which would be a plus for that. But

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again, I don't know if wood siding put

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you over that threshold or not.

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Yeah. And and I think it kind of it'll

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come down to sight specific assessments

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that we'll have to do on on each permit

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application that comes through. Um so

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you know you we we could leave it in the

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code that wood sighting is is approved

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and then kind of in that sight specific

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assessment during the building code uh

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we may determine that it's not going to

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be appropriate in that case. Um so it's

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you know either way is a viable route

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for you.

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I don't know if I'm giving a lot of

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input either except just asking

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questions. But this is why I would what

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bring it up again. You know, if we could

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add

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the idea is if we add an IR requirement

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to the building that would sort of

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minimize the defensible space,

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which I don't know, maybe people don't

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think that's a good idea, def minimizing

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defensible space. I'm just thinking that

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makes it easier. uh and less work will have to be done cleaning

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up trees in the 30 to 50 feet

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or 30 to 100 feet if you're really bad.

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>> I think it's just a good idea anyways to

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remove it

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considering the risk.

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I also want to in addition to that touch

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on one of Terry's notes which is um

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potentially removing wood from the list

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of ex acceptable fence or wall material

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which to me seems to make sense in the

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scope of all of this.

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I I would have to ask, you know,

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I don't know, a wood fence because

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they're pretty popular, I think, in some

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areas.

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What is the fire risk? Because it's not

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against your house.

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It is more fuel for a fire.

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But I don't understand the risk that

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would pose to a house.

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>> Yeah. So I think the Wooie assessment

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will is kind of based on your your

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property. Um so

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I suppose it's kind of similar to to

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wood siding. I guess the the risk of a

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wooden fence which is not right by your

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house is less than wood on your house.

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So it it's maybe less of a risk. Um but

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I I think

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um you know I think it could be a valid

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thing to to prohibit. I mean, wood is a

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very popular fencing material, so it may

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make it challenging for people to more

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limiting for people to

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get fencing for their homes. So, that

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may be something to think about before

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prohibiting wood as as a fence material.

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>> That's a good point because it's not

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only the wood fence, it's finding people

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to install. A metal fence takes

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some welding.

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You know, it's a different set of equip

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equipment needed

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acceptable

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>> or less accessible to customer or people

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>> which creates another fire hazard.

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>> What was that?

275
00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:40,720
>> Which would create another fire hazard

276
00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:42,320
if they're welding the fence.

277
00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:44,959
>> That's good point.

278
00:13:44,959 --> 00:13:47,600
>> Now, when I was researching this, I ran

279
00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:52,079
across something that um I think if I

280
00:13:52,079 --> 00:13:53,839
interpreted correctly said that vinyl

281
00:13:53,839 --> 00:13:55,519
fencing is not permitted. Is that

282
00:13:55,519 --> 00:13:58,000
correct?

283
00:13:58,000 --> 00:13:59,519
What kind?

284
00:13:59,519 --> 00:14:01,440
>> Vinyl.

285
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,279
>> Yeah, that is correct. Yeah. And vinyl

286
00:14:03,279 --> 00:14:06,320
siding is is per is prohibited in the

287
00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:07,120
code.

288
00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:08,800
>> Siding, I understand, but it also

289
00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:12,480
extended it to fencing, I think. So, if

290
00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:15,120
uh if that's correct then and we take

291
00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:17,440
wood off of there, you know, there's not

292
00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:20,639
a whole lot of uh you know, it's going

293
00:14:20,639 --> 00:14:23,199
to be stone or metal. Um both of which

294
00:14:23,199 --> 00:14:24,880
are much more expensive than vinyl or

295
00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:28,800
wood. So, um,

296
00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:30,000
that'sation.

297
00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:31,360
>> Yeah. And actually, in thinking through

298
00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:33,519
the fence situation,

299
00:14:33,519 --> 00:14:37,120
uh, when we had the fire chief out,

300
00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,839
he talked a lot about space in between

301
00:14:39,839 --> 00:14:41,920
fuel.

302
00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:45,509
And so,

303
00:14:45,519 --> 00:14:47,839
a fence,

304
00:14:47,839 --> 00:14:50,639
you know, if it was if, you know, you

305
00:14:50,639 --> 00:14:53,199
wouldn't want brush right up against it.

306
00:14:53,199 --> 00:14:55,839
there would have to be it would just

307
00:14:55,839 --> 00:14:58,639
become part of the fuel but the fence

308
00:14:58,639 --> 00:15:01,920
itself is not actually

309
00:15:01,920 --> 00:15:05,839
um you know it's just a linear

310
00:15:05,839 --> 00:15:07,360
not a cluster of

311
00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:08,880
>> yeah I mean and that's [clears throat] I

312
00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:10,240
mean I think that's a good point because

313
00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:12,079
a fence typically you've got a single

314
00:15:12,079 --> 00:15:13,680
point of contact with the house

315
00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:14,240
>> right

316
00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:16,720
>> it's a linear extension that you know if

317
00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:18,720
it catches fire somewhere else

318
00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,760
eventually may be a burn but um in

319
00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:25,600
wildland fires. I think the the major

320
00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:28,880
and it appears to be in the in the WOOI

321
00:15:28,880 --> 00:15:31,279
ordinance. The the primary consideration

322
00:15:31,279 --> 00:15:34,079
is the the movement of the fire quickly

323
00:15:34,079 --> 00:15:38,560
across great expanses. Um and which is

324
00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:40,800
big trees and brush and you know large

325
00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:43,600
things that are and ching wood shingled

326
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,600
roofs that sort of thing where they're

327
00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:48,959
large uh either

328
00:15:48,959 --> 00:15:51,839
generators of embers that fly or

329
00:15:51,839 --> 00:15:54,000
receivers of embers that fly fly that

330
00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:57,680
then you know catch fire. So a fence is

331
00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:00,160
probably doesn't normally fit into those

332
00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:01,839
categories. It will catch fire if

333
00:16:01,839 --> 00:16:04,880
there's fire up against it. Um, it may

334
00:16:04,880 --> 00:16:07,360
catch fire if an ember lands on it.

335
00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:10,959
Maybe not, depending upon the age of the wooden fence and the type of

336
00:16:10,959 --> 00:16:12,880
wooden fence. But [clears throat]

337
00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:21,430
anyway,

338
00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,079
so in summary,

339
00:16:24,079 --> 00:16:27,199
I'm thinking allow wooden fences.

340
00:16:27,199 --> 00:16:28,079
>> Yeah, I think I

341
00:16:28,079 --> 00:16:29,360
>> Yeah, after talking it through, I

342
00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:30,480
>> just want to make sure we're all on the

343
00:16:30,480 --> 00:16:30,800
same.

344
00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:33,600
>> Yeah. Yeah.

345
00:16:33,600 --> 00:16:35,279
the woodsiding. I'm not sure what to

346
00:16:35,279 --> 00:16:37,519
say. I would like to say it loud, but

347
00:16:37,519 --> 00:16:40,160
I'm I'm very open to that one.

348
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:42,959
>> Well, having personal experience in a

349
00:16:42,959 --> 00:16:46,320
wildfire and

350
00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:48,639
70 80% of my neighbors houses burning

351
00:16:48,639 --> 00:16:51,680
down, my house being constructed out of

352
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,639
wood sighting and my house survived.

353
00:16:54,639 --> 00:16:56,160
Nothing else on the property survived,

354
00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:58,320
but the house was still standing when we

355
00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:01,600
got back. Um, it brought into my mind

356
00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:03,680
question about, gee, maybe this stuff

357
00:17:03,680 --> 00:17:07,120
isn't as bad as it's made out to be. Um,

358
00:17:07,120 --> 00:17:08,880
the wooden shingles, I feel pretty

359
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:11,120
strongly that those are those are

360
00:17:11,120 --> 00:17:15,760
problematic. Um, the wooden siding, you

361
00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:17,600
know, my personal experience, I said, as

362
00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:20,319
I said, you know, it it um while

363
00:17:20,319 --> 00:17:22,880
mystifying it, it did a pretty darn good

364
00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:25,679
job of not burning the house down. That

365
00:17:25,679 --> 00:17:28,240
being said though, about a year later, I

366
00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:29,840
tore it all off and replaced it with

367
00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:37,669
Stuckco. So, [laughter]

368
00:17:37,679 --> 00:17:39,280
I kind of feel torn about the wood

369
00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:42,240
sighting, too, because

370
00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:44,720
also from personal experience, I know

371
00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:47,360
that the

372
00:17:47,360 --> 00:17:50,480
riskiest material was what was on the

373
00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:53,679
roof, not on the sides of the house.

374
00:17:53,679 --> 00:17:55,039
And I see a lot of the modern

375
00:17:55,039 --> 00:17:57,120
architecture where they like the wood

376
00:17:57,120 --> 00:17:59,200
just not the whole thing is wood, but

377
00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:02,160
they use it as an accent. So it it's not

378
00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:03,600
covering a lot of the house. So we're

379
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,160
taking away that accent from residents

380
00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:08,160
and architects.

381
00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:10,080
>> I mean, I had potted plants up against

382
00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:12,559
the wood siding, contacting the wood

383
00:18:12,559 --> 00:18:14,559
siding that were turned to reduced to

384
00:18:14,559 --> 00:18:17,039
ash, and the wood siding didn't have a

385
00:18:17,039 --> 00:18:20,160
mark on it, which was mystifying. But,

386
00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:24,000
you know, a flaming 30ft palm tree about

387
00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,919
6 ft away. Again, the wood siding wasn't

388
00:18:27,919 --> 00:18:31,120
the windows um cracked and broke from

389
00:18:31,120 --> 00:18:32,640
the heat, but the wood siding wasn't

390
00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:33,840
affected. So,

391
00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:35,520
>> well, that's a pretty strong statement.

392
00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:37,679
>> I don't know. It's kind of weird, but I

393
00:18:37,679 --> 00:18:44,230
did take it off later.

394
00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:47,120
I mean, in general, yeah, wood sighting

395
00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:51,120
seems riskier, but does it make sense to

396
00:18:51,120 --> 00:18:53,840
like how much more of it of a risk is

397
00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:56,320
it? I

398
00:18:56,320 --> 00:19:01,029
Yeah,

399
00:19:01,039 --> 00:19:02,559
» I mean, I think in general, it's better

400
00:19:02,559 --> 00:19:05,039
to make build houses out of

401
00:19:05,039 --> 00:19:07,120
non-combustible material, but that's

402
00:19:07,120 --> 00:19:07,840
>> right.

403
00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:10,720
>> That's either difficult or expensive to

404
00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:12,880
do depending on on what it is. there's

405
00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:15,200
there are there are better materials now

406
00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:16,880
because of the prevalence of these kinds

407
00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:26,789
of situations but um yeah I don't know

408
00:19:26,799 --> 00:19:28,960
with that said I I will give a thumbs up

409
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:30,799
to the cement board siding so people

410
00:19:30,799 --> 00:19:32,000
have that as an option.

411
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,240
>> Yeah.

412
00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:35,200
>> Say that again.

413
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:36,960
>> I said with that said I still would want

414
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:39,360
to give the cement board siding

415
00:19:39,360 --> 00:19:39,679
>> Yeah.

416
00:19:39,679 --> 00:19:41,600
>> a thumbs up to make that acceptable.

417
00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:49,909
>> Yeah. I think that's true.

418
00:19:49,919 --> 00:19:53,919
» Does the staff have um any idea like how

419
00:19:53,919 --> 00:19:58,240
much riskier would site like it

420
00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:01,600
if the risk outweighs

421
00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:05,430
allowing?

422
00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:10,720
» Yeah. So, um I I can't admit to being a

423
00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:17,679
great expert on this. Um, I would say if you're not comfortable about banning

424
00:20:17,679 --> 00:20:19,760
it outright,

425
00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:23,200
um, these properties when when we're

426
00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:24,880
reviewing the plans, the building

427
00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:28,080
inspector and and Eugenia and myself

428
00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:30,240
will be reviewing them for WI code

429
00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:33,200
compliance, which includes, you know,

430
00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:34,720
defensible space and all these other

431
00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:37,840
things that you're aware of. So,

432
00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:42,310
>> if um [clears throat]

433
00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:44,880
Yeah, there there may be circumstances

434
00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:47,520
where wood siding is is going to pass

435
00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:49,840
the WOOI code because other factors have

436
00:20:49,840 --> 00:20:51,919
been met. And so if you're if you're

437
00:20:51,919 --> 00:20:54,159
more comfortable with leaving that as an

438
00:20:54,159 --> 00:20:57,360
option, it's it's still going to be

439
00:20:57,360 --> 00:20:59,200
caught through the building code review

440
00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:01,760
if if there potentially would be a

441
00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:03,760
problem. So it's just a thought.

442
00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:05,120
>> I I'm comfortable with that.

443
00:21:05,120 --> 00:21:07,760
>> I'm I'm good with that.

444
00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:09,440
>> Um so then

445
00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:11,200
>> we we put on Niles. Now it's his

446
00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:12,720
problem.

447
00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:15,039
>> Yeah. [laughter]

448
00:21:15,039 --> 00:21:18,240
Um so with the building material then

449
00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:22,240
we're at moving wood roof shingles.

450
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:25,200
Um continue to allow heavy timber

451
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:27,360
structural beams and elements. Continue

452
00:21:27,360 --> 00:21:30,400
allowing wood siding and adding cement

453
00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,480
board siding to the list of approved

454
00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:34,640
materials.

455
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:38,240
I should probably have a dumb question.

456
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:43,840
like the 2x4 material that you see the lacked things that I see a lot in

457
00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:46,960
like the under ease

458
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:49,360
what are they under the eaves in that is

459
00:21:49,360 --> 00:21:53,520
that considered thick

460
00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,919
not necessarily no um and

461
00:21:57,919 --> 00:22:00,799
we did like kind of trim and those sorts

462
00:22:00,799 --> 00:22:02,880
of features

463
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:07,520
um yeah we we didn't include those in

464
00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:12,400
kind of our assessment of this. Um,

465
00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:14,240
so that that is something you could

466
00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:17,280
consider um

467
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:19,760
if you wanted to to look at those kind

468
00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:22,000
of trim materials.

469
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:25,679
>> I was just wondering what was considered

470
00:22:25,679 --> 00:22:27,360
>> the heavy beams kind of.

471
00:22:27,360 --> 00:22:28,559
>> Yeah.

472
00:22:28,559 --> 00:22:31,600
So th those are more kind of I

473
00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:35,280
think that's talking more about those um

474
00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:37,280
kind of bigger structural beams and

475
00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:39,200
ornamental

476
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:40,480
um

477
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:42,000
>> it's been a while but I thought those

478
00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:44,799
thick 2x4 thick

479
00:22:44,799 --> 00:22:47,600
>> elements in the the uh the code the

480
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:52,480
woody code were uh considered okay

481
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:54,400
but don't quote me on that. That's from

482
00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:56,240
my memory.

483
00:22:56,240 --> 00:22:58,559
So I I may need to plead ignorance on

484
00:22:58,559 --> 00:23:00,559
that.

485
00:23:00,559 --> 00:23:03,440
But uh I I know the bigger the bigger

486
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:07,120
beams are are allowed under the WOI

487
00:23:07,120 --> 00:23:09,280
code.

488
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:12,789
So

489
00:23:12,799 --> 00:23:15,120
» and what about um trim work around

490
00:23:15,120 --> 00:23:21,270
windows?

491
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:25,120
» Yeah. So again, um I probably need to

492
00:23:25,120 --> 00:23:28,080
defer to our building inspector on that.

493
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:31,600
Um I think all of these materials you

494
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,320
can get fire rated materials and they

495
00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:39,360
can you know pass the assessment. Um

496
00:23:39,360 --> 00:23:42,240
so okay well we're allowed the siding.

497
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:44,880
So those right now are probably

498
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:46,640
sort of combined with that.

499
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,559
>> That's how I was looking at it.

500
00:23:48,559 --> 00:23:53,669
>> Yeah. But I was just curious for future

501
00:23:53,679 --> 00:23:56,720
Okay, thank you.

502
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:58,559
>> Question. If I have a tree on my

503
00:23:58,559 --> 00:24:01,120
property that I have to remove for wooi

504
00:24:01,120 --> 00:24:04,240
purpose, you know, guidance or whatever,

505
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,400
do I need a

506
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:09,440
permit or replant trees two to one

507
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:13,039
somewhere else or do I just take it out?

508
00:24:13,039 --> 00:24:15,440
>> Do you want to talk about that, Eugenia?

509
00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:18,720
>> Yeah. So the options that we presented

510
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:23,120
was to uh if it's within the town's

511
00:24:23,120 --> 00:24:26,400
boundary wooi boundary we uh had the

512
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,039
option of either like you if you take it

513
00:24:29,039 --> 00:24:32,080
off you don't have to replace it as the

514
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:34,799
as if you're making a development there

515
00:24:34,799 --> 00:24:39,840
and the other option was to um make a

516
00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:42,880
let me check the other option is to

517
00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:44,720
remove the existing tree requirement

518
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:47,840
from the land ordinance alto together

519
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,799
and not have uh

520
00:24:50,799 --> 00:24:53,600
not have yeah not have it there. I don't

521
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:54,320
think

522
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:55,919
>> but

523
00:24:55,919 --> 00:24:58,320
I read I read that to be though in new

524
00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,600
construction or remodeling uh purposes

525
00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:02,880
is that

526
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:04,480
>> if I've just got a tree there next to my

527
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:05,760
house and I got to take it out do I have

528
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:08,720
a problem or not? So I whether we didn't

529
00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:11,120
ask uh the staff we didn't we looked at

530
00:25:11,120 --> 00:25:14,159
it just in any kind of a tree

531
00:25:14,159 --> 00:25:16,559
replacement in the Wii boundary doesn't

532
00:25:16,559 --> 00:25:18,799
have to be replaced. That's how we

533
00:25:18,799 --> 00:25:20,159
looked at it. We didn't look at it in

534
00:25:20,159 --> 00:25:23,840
terms of uh a renovation or a new

535
00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:26,240
development. So as far as it's in the

536
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:27,919
bound within the boundary if it's

537
00:25:27,919 --> 00:25:29,840
removed it doesn't have to be replaced.

538
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:31,360
That is one of the options that we

539
00:25:31,360 --> 00:25:32,240
presented as that.

540
00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:33,679
>> Yeah I realized that.

541
00:25:33,679 --> 00:25:35,600
>> Yeah. What what is the current code?

542
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:37,120
Because I see trees disappearing

543
00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:38,159
already.

544
00:25:38,159 --> 00:25:40,159
>> So, it's right in front of you on this

545
00:25:40,159 --> 00:25:43,120
screen is uh is where this requirement

546
00:25:43,120 --> 00:25:47,840
is and the pink text here is the

547
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:50,480
suggestion the suggested change that

548
00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:53,520
would remove that that requirement. But

549
00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:56,320
as the code is at the moment, native

550
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:59,919
vegetation greater than 6 ft in height

551
00:25:59,919 --> 00:26:01,919
um

552
00:26:01,919 --> 00:26:05,360
if it's removed uh should be replaced

553
00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:08,640
2:1 if it's native vegetation. And

554
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:12,159
that's it doesn't specify in the code.

555
00:26:12,159 --> 00:26:14,799
Um well, it just says must be preserved

556
00:26:14,799 --> 00:26:17,039
during all grading and construction

557
00:26:17,039 --> 00:26:19,279
activities. you were asking about.

558
00:26:19,279 --> 00:26:20,960
>> So if I'm cut if I just go out and cut a

559
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:22,799
tree down, that's is that a grading or a

560
00:26:22,799 --> 00:26:29,669
construction activity?

561
00:26:29,679 --> 00:26:32,240
» I wouldn't interpret as [laughter] maybe

562
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:34,000
I'm confused.

563
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:36,320
>> Yeah. I mean I I think in practical

564
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,960
terms we're

565
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,279
we don't have the capacity to check

566
00:26:41,279 --> 00:26:45,360
everybody's yards for every tree. Um, so

567
00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:48,240
th this is generally going to come up on

568
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:49,520
redevelopment.

569
00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:49,919
>> Okay.

570
00:26:49,919 --> 00:26:50,480
>> Of sites.

571
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:51,360
>> That's kind of what I thought. All

572
00:26:51,360 --> 00:26:51,760
right.

573
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:52,320
>> Yeah.

574
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,279
>> So I got confused by that. So I

575
00:26:55,279 --> 00:26:57,360
understand you can't enforce it,

576
00:26:57,360 --> 00:26:59,840
>> but technically according to our law,

577
00:26:59,840 --> 00:27:03,760
our ordinance, you should replace it.

578
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:06,400
>> Well, that was my question. I didn't see

579
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:09,200
anywhere in the existing code that said

580
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:11,200
if I just go cut my tree down that I

581
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,679
have to do anything about it other than

582
00:27:13,679 --> 00:27:17,120
take the trash away.

583
00:27:17,120 --> 00:27:21,039
>> So the the verbiage is um these natural

584
00:27:21,039 --> 00:27:22,880
features must be preserved during all

585
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:24,960
grading and construction activities.

586
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:26,880
>> Yeah. So cutting my tree down is I

587
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:28,960
wouldn't that to be construction or

588
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:30,400
grading because I'm not moving the dirt.

589
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:34,080
I'm just now if I go um

590
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,400
dig the stump up, maybe you could

591
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,480
interpret that to be a grading activity.

592
00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:40,240
But if I just cut it off the ground,

593
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:42,559
leave the stump there and let it, you

594
00:27:42,559 --> 00:27:46,240
know, go away over time.

595
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:48,400
>> Yeah. I mean, I I think it probably

596
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:51,120
envisage more significant

597
00:27:51,120 --> 00:27:54,399
kind of construction

598
00:27:54,399 --> 00:27:56,080
>> because this is just right now a

599
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:58,000
proposal. This is not changing our code.

600
00:27:58,000 --> 00:27:59,919
And I think we're okay. But the reason

601
00:27:59,919 --> 00:28:02,000
this is an important question is people

602
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,000
are meeting with the fire marshal chief

603
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:06,399
or whatever and he's saying you should

604
00:28:06,399 --> 00:28:08,559
take down that tree and they're taking

605
00:28:08,559 --> 00:28:11,840
down the tree which is fine. I mean

606
00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:13,440
I want to make sure that was not in

607
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,520
violation of some code. If so we'd have

608
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:17,760
should change that ASAP but that does

609
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,240
not seem to be the case.

610
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:21,919
So

611
00:28:21,919 --> 00:28:23,840
yeah, I mean what what this is mostly

612
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,919
envisaging is so our WOOI boundary um

613
00:28:27,919 --> 00:28:29,440
covers

614
00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:31,840
part of a lot of the Anastasia Plateau

615
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:33,840
subdivision and Valley View Drive and

616
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,640
that area. Um

617
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:40,080
when new development comes forward in

618
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:43,840
those areas and um Jennifer will know

619
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:45,120
about this personally when she was

620
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,679
building her house a few years ago. Um,

621
00:28:47,679 --> 00:28:50,559
if there are trees on your lot uh that

622
00:28:50,559 --> 00:28:52,159
you have to remove during construction,

623
00:28:52,159 --> 00:28:55,039
you have to plant two in replacement.

624
00:28:55,039 --> 00:28:58,799
>> And th those pads are are quite limited.

625
00:28:58,799 --> 00:29:02,559
Um, and so what often happens is that

626
00:29:02,559 --> 00:29:05,120
you to to meet that requirement, you

627
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:07,120
have a lot of replacement trees kind of

628
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:12,480
right around your house. And that's quite an obvious contradiction.

629
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:14,799
And so the the proposed language here is

630
00:29:14,799 --> 00:29:18,080
that that that replacement requirement

631
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:21,120
would not exist within the WOI boundary

632
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:22,880
so that you're not kind of running into

633
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,039
that conflict.

634
00:29:25,039 --> 00:29:26,799
>> I I'm I'm going to agree with that, but

635
00:29:26,799 --> 00:29:28,960
I do have a question.

636
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:30,799
Just the red area is the boundaries or

637
00:29:30,799 --> 00:29:34,480
is that just a high risk boundary?

638
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:40,240
So the town council adopted

639
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:42,799
this as our WOOI boundary for the town.

640
00:29:42,799 --> 00:29:45,840
So this this is the area in this red

641
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:50,240
shaded area is the area where we have to

642
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,440
apply the WOOI code um in our plan

643
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:54,559
reviews.

644
00:29:54,559 --> 00:29:56,000
>> I think we're going to have to add some

645
00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:59,600
verbiage to that. So my question is,

646
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:02,880
what happens if my property is split in

647
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:04,640
half?

648
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,440
of it's in, half of it's out. What

649
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:09,919
happens if my house is out, but my

650
00:30:09,919 --> 00:30:12,720
accessory building or another house that

651
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,520
I'm building is in? How do we deal with

652
00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:17,679
those situations?

653
00:30:17,679 --> 00:30:19,919
>> Yeah, it might be good to to clarify

654
00:30:19,919 --> 00:30:25,510
that in in the language in some way.

655
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,159
Yeah, we we can look at how We could

656
00:30:28,159 --> 00:30:30,399
tweak the language to make that clear.

657
00:30:30,399 --> 00:30:31,919
>> It was hard to tell on this picture. And

658
00:30:31,919 --> 00:30:33,600
to to be honest, I'm fully in it, so

659
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:36,159
this does not apply to me, but I did see

660
00:30:36,159 --> 00:30:37,919
it, you know, at least one lot, maybe

661
00:30:37,919 --> 00:30:41,919
more, that it is split down the middle.

662
00:30:41,919 --> 00:30:45,919
Uh we approved the um workhouse overlay

663
00:30:45,919 --> 00:30:49,200
zone. I believe that new house would be

664
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:52,240
in the the uh the red area, but the

665
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:54,559
existing house is outside.

666
00:30:54,559 --> 00:30:56,240
So, I'm just highlighting this. I think

667
00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:57,679
we Yeah,

668
00:30:57,679 --> 00:30:59,600
>> you want to clarify some of that.

669
00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:01,679
>> I think that's a good a good point that

670
00:31:01,679 --> 00:31:04,720
we need to know how we would apply it in

671
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:08,230
those circumstances.

672
00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:10,799
» I have a question. Um, remind me the

673
00:31:10,799 --> 00:31:14,960
origin of the code stating that it had

674
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:17,679
to be two to one. Was it um an

675
00:31:17,679 --> 00:31:20,640
opportunity to enhance landscape or was

676
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:23,279
it that because of the risk that the

677
00:31:23,279 --> 00:31:25,520
plant or tree may die?

678
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:27,440
Yeah, my understanding is that when

679
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:30,000
you're um [clears throat] it's kind of

680
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:31,600
the latter. So that when you're

681
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:34,000
replacing plants that the the chances of

682
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:36,000
them establishing and being successful

683
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,279
are less and so that the two

684
00:31:39,279 --> 00:31:41,679
replacements is to kind of account for

685
00:31:41,679 --> 00:31:44,399
that

686
00:31:44,399 --> 00:31:47,760
>> because I agree with removing the

687
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:51,279
requirement in the WOI zone.

688
00:31:51,279 --> 00:31:56,720
Um, but I also wanted to talk about what

689
00:31:56,720 --> 00:32:01,600
if it everywhere else it was one to one

690
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:05,039
and I don't know if you see or know like

691
00:32:05,039 --> 00:32:08,320
how many actually end up not surviving.

692
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,880
I just know on our property

693
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,760
we had to remove 11. So we planted 22

694
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:16,640
trees which was a lot and not a single

695
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:19,679
one that has died. they are all alive

696
00:32:19,679 --> 00:32:21,519
and and well and

697
00:32:21,519 --> 00:32:22,480
>> good job.

698
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:23,919
>> Well, thank you. But at some point

699
00:32:23,919 --> 00:32:25,600
they're going to start running into each

700
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:27,039
other and we're going to have to remove

701
00:32:27,039 --> 00:32:29,039
things because we are in the high-risisk

702
00:32:29,039 --> 00:32:32,720
zone. Um but I'm just wondering if in

703
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:34,480
general

704
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:38,159
um from my experience onetoone might

705
00:32:38,159 --> 00:32:40,000
make sense but maybe that's a unique

706
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:41,840
situation that ours survived. I don't

707
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,950
know.

708
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:48,240
Yeah, I think um

709
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:52,159
I think in my opinion I think it's um

710
00:32:52,159 --> 00:32:53,760
location dependent because in the area

711
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:55,519
you're at where you're constrained in

712
00:32:55,519 --> 00:32:57,679
terms as N said earlier and constrained

713
00:32:57,679 --> 00:32:59,039
where you can plant those are all

714
00:32:59,039 --> 00:33:01,279
compressed into a smaller area it'd be

715
00:33:01,279 --> 00:33:03,120
really difficult to meet that as you as

716
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:05,360
you learned. Um there's other places

717
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:07,440
where you know they're large pieces of

718
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:08,880
property where they're doing a small

719
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:10,880
construction over here and they can

720
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:16,080
easily plant trees somewhere else and help us retain a village atmosphere

721
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:20,159
by doing so. Um but you know if you're

722
00:33:20,159 --> 00:33:23,120
in the wildland urban interface zone you

723
00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:25,679
know and the fire people say you need to

724
00:33:25,679 --> 00:33:29,679
take the trees out um it sort of

725
00:33:29,679 --> 00:33:31,519
nonsensical to say you got to plant more

726
00:33:31,519 --> 00:33:33,840
of them. Um

727
00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:36,880
because you know those people are you I

728
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:38,960
mean you know my discussions with the

729
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:41,440
wildland fire

730
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:42,960
captain or whatever that was you know

731
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,640
came out and did inspections was you

732
00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:45,760
know you don't have to necessarily take

733
00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:47,919
the tree out. They recommend you know

734
00:33:47,919 --> 00:33:49,679
they they'd like not to have trees there

735
00:33:49,679 --> 00:33:51,760
but they recognize the the value of

736
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:55,039
having trees and so sometimes a better

737
00:33:55,039 --> 00:33:57,840
solution is to you know um trim the tree

738
00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:00,240
up from the ground and thin it at the

739
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:02,000
top so that

740
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:03,760
They they were seem more concerned about

741
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:06,240
because the type of fire that comes here

742
00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:08,320
is not the big forest fire where you got

743
00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:10,560
high pine trees and that sort of thing,

744
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:12,480
but it's a very fastmoving brush fire

745
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:14,240
that comes through and they want the

746
00:34:14,240 --> 00:34:15,599
tree high enough from the ground so that

747
00:34:15,599 --> 00:34:17,520
the brush fire moves through. It doesn't

748
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:19,760
catch the crown of the tree on fire and

749
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:24,639
cause greater damages. So, um, yeah,

750
00:34:24,639 --> 00:34:26,720
>> I'm actually okay with it maintaining

751
00:34:26,720 --> 00:34:30,000
the 2 to one, um, just because of what

752
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:31,520
you said, like it could just be an

753
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:33,280
overall benefit to the community.

754
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:33,599
>> Yeah.

755
00:34:33,599 --> 00:34:34,960
>> Because there are some houses in my

756
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:39,359
neighborhood that removed one tree and they planted two and two is nice.

757
00:34:39,359 --> 00:34:42,079
>> Yeah. Now, and maybe we want to look

758
00:34:42,079 --> 00:34:44,159
further than this and say, "Hey, there's

759
00:34:44,159 --> 00:34:47,119
areas where uh we could we could make a

760
00:34:47,119 --> 00:34:48,639
change to existing code that says, hey,

761
00:34:48,639 --> 00:34:50,800
if you're in an area like Anastasia and

762
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:52,639
you got to plant 22 trees and you only

763
00:34:52,639 --> 00:34:55,839
have space to plant 12, um why are we

764
00:34:55,839 --> 00:34:58,480
making you do that?"

765
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:01,599
Or maybe we because I think the town is

766
00:35:01,599 --> 00:35:04,400
the um

767
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:08,400
conservator on the on the uh greater

768
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:12,640
area there. Maybe we u you know you go

769
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:14,880
to the town and the town allows you to

770
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:17,280
plant part of those 22 trees somewhere

771
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:20,640
in the in the surrounding area. Um I

772
00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:22,000
don't know.

773
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:24,640
>> Yeah, it can get complicated very fast.

774
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:29,510
I thought about this a lot.

775
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:35,280
Um so I myself would

776
00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:38,400
support just uh maintain the existing

777
00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:41,680
tree replacement except for

778
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:43,440
the risk areas.

779
00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:45,359
>> Yeah. So option one I guess right?

780
00:35:45,359 --> 00:35:47,760
>> Yeah

781
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:50,640
>> I I tend to agree. Now what that does is

782
00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:54,000
that basically

783
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:57,599
exonerates Anastasi plateau which you

784
00:35:57,599 --> 00:35:58,880
know I think we're saying that's

785
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:00,560
probably a reasonable thing to do maybe.

786
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:01,839
I don't know.

787
00:36:01,839 --> 00:36:03,359
>> We have to be careful with that because

788
00:36:03,359 --> 00:36:05,839
not the whole plateau is in the zone.

789
00:36:05,839 --> 00:36:06,960
>> So we are right

790
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:08,480
>> I mean this is

791
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:10,400
>> this is where we're at but one neighbor

792
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:12,960
might have to replace trees

793
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:16,400
>> and the neighboring lot is exempt.

794
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:18,960
>> Well but it's all in the WOOI. It's

795
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:19,599
>> No, it's not.

796
00:36:19,599 --> 00:36:21,200
>> It's not.

797
00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:23,359
>> I looked at that last picture. Well,

798
00:36:23,359 --> 00:36:25,520
almost all of it, I guess. Maybe I'm

799
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:26,079
missing.

800
00:36:26,079 --> 00:36:27,760
>> If you zoom in there, you can see

801
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:29,359
there's structures outside of it in

802
00:36:29,359 --> 00:36:30,640
roads.

803
00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:33,280
>> Yeah. So, that that scenario that that

804
00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:35,599
Rich is talking about is is a

805
00:36:35,599 --> 00:36:37,359
possibility that you have somebody

806
00:36:37,359 --> 00:36:39,680
across the road that needs 22

807
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:41,440
replacement trees.

808
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:45,040
>> So, that that is true.

809
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,599
So there's the whole area

810
00:36:47,599 --> 00:36:49,520
on the bottom part of that map.

811
00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:50,320
>> I see now.

812
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,880
>> Yeah. Where there's a lot of houses. I

813
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:55,040
don't understand it, but

814
00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:56,400
>> that's what it is.

815
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:57,680
>> Whole thing doesn't make a lot of sense

816
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,960
to me, but

817
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:03,920
>> um

818
00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:06,400
yeah. So they would still have the 2 to1

819
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:10,630
requirement.

820
00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:12,880
» I don't have enough knowledge. I mean,

821
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:15,920
what you say makes sense to me. I don't

822
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:20,000
know if the town has any other input on

823
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,240
the success or

824
00:37:22,240 --> 00:37:25,040
heartache of doing 2:1 as a general

825
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:27,839
rule.

826
00:37:27,839 --> 00:37:31,280
>> I I think the intention behind the 2:1

827
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:33,440
is is good and I think on the whole it's

828
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:35,760
probably served the town well. H I

829
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:37,520
think, you know, having trees in our

830
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:40,640
properties is has all sorts of benefits.

831
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:43,040
Um but I think this is one instance

832
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:48,160
where uh it's problematic with wildfire

833
00:37:48,160 --> 00:38:03,430
mitigation. So

834
00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:05,280
I'm not sure to go with that. Jennifer,

835
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:09,119
I I I will say that the re in the the

836
00:38:09,119 --> 00:38:11,280
zone, I would definitely say it has to

837
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,760
be taken out. Like we said, if if

838
00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:15,200
they're saying cut the tree down, you

839
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:19,349
can't say put two more in

840
00:38:19,359 --> 00:38:21,200
» and then leaving the [clears throat]

841
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:26,069
two to one for everything else

842
00:38:26,079 --> 00:38:27,440
» just because I don't have enough

843
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:29,440
information to make a sound.

844
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,200
>> I mean, I am a person like I just said

845
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,680
that had to experience planting all of

846
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,720
those yet. I still support the two to

847
00:38:36,720 --> 00:38:39,760
one because I I I don't believe that I

848
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:41,040
think that that was kind of a unique

849
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:47,670
situation for the most part

850
00:38:47,680 --> 00:38:52,240
and I I believe that uh most people in

851
00:38:52,240 --> 00:38:56,000
the community support that too

852
00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:07,349
from my what I

853
00:39:07,359 --> 00:39:10,160
Is everybody

854
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:13,359
caution Melissa? Does that make sense?

855
00:39:13,359 --> 00:39:15,280
>> Yeah.

856
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:17,359
>> I'm going on you guys experience. I live

857
00:39:17,359 --> 00:39:23,280
in a an apartment. So, um but

858
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:25,119
two different scenarios. I mean,

859
00:39:25,119 --> 00:39:25,920
>> yeah.

860
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:29,829
>> One is

861
00:39:29,839 --> 00:39:34,310
Yeah,

862
00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:36,720
» most of spring bill is unique.

863
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:39,680
>> It's true. [laughter]

864
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:42,960
>> Do you have enough to go on Eugenia with

865
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:44,800
that discussion?

866
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:45,280
>> Yes.

867
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:48,480
>> Any questions of us that could help in

868
00:39:48,480 --> 00:40:00,230
moving forward or clarification?

869
00:40:00,240 --> 00:40:02,400
Do we hit all the points? That's

870
00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:04,400
>> so there's just one additional point you

871
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:06,560
want might want to look at. So this is

872
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:10,480
in the landscape chapter where um we

873
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:14,240
propose some additional language. So um

874
00:40:14,240 --> 00:40:16,240
in the

875
00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:18,400
there's minimum amounts of trees that

876
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:20,480
are required to be planted in certain

877
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:25,359
zones. Um and so following on in a

878
00:40:25,359 --> 00:40:28,880
similar vein, um we've proposed some

879
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:31,280
language here that says these minimum

880
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:33,440
quantities do not apply to properties

881
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:36,000
within the town's adopted wildland urban

882
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:40,160
interface zone. So it's just um where

883
00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:44,880
you have um the requirement for one tree

884
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:46,400
for every thousand square feet of

885
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:50,640
landscape area. those requirements to

886
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:52,880
remove those requirements from within

887
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:54,800
the wubby zone kind of for the same

888
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:57,520
reasons that we've discussed.

889
00:40:57,520 --> 00:40:59,359
>> I think so.

890
00:40:59,359 --> 00:41:00,640
>> I think we have to.

891
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:04,069
>> Yeah.

892
00:41:04,079 --> 00:41:06,800
Okay.

893
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:08,800
You guys good?

894
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:11,760
Thank you. Now moving on to the second

895
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:14,160
non-action item, a discussion about

896
00:41:14,160 --> 00:41:17,359
potential changes to section 1018 of the

897
00:41:17,359 --> 00:41:19,200
code to improve water efficiency and

898
00:41:19,200 --> 00:41:20,720
landscape.

899
00:41:20,720 --> 00:41:22,800
Staff contact is Nile Connelly. Nile

900
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:24,480
will be presenting.

901
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:26,240
>> Thank you.

902
00:41:26,240 --> 00:41:30,319
So this is a new but familiar discussion

903
00:41:30,319 --> 00:41:34,319
item. So um water conservation is a

904
00:41:34,319 --> 00:41:37,040
perennial issue for communities such as

905
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:40,400
ours. um and it can be a very

906
00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:43,119
complicated and potentially overwhelming

907
00:41:43,119 --> 00:41:47,359
topic to address. So

908
00:41:47,359 --> 00:41:51,040
the intention behind kind of tonight's

909
00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:53,920
discussion and the staff report was

910
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:55,839
rather than having a broad discussion

911
00:41:55,839 --> 00:41:58,400
about water conservation more generally

912
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:01,200
was to

913
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:04,240
kind of put it into some little

914
00:42:04,240 --> 00:42:06,240
bite-sized chunks that that we could

915
00:42:06,240 --> 00:42:11,200
maybe address one at a time. And so, um,

916
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:14,720
this specific conversation is focusing

917
00:42:14,720 --> 00:42:17,040
on landscaping.

918
00:42:17,040 --> 00:42:18,560
Um,

919
00:42:18,560 --> 00:42:21,440
and so some potential change changes

920
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:23,599
that we could incrementally make to

921
00:42:23,599 --> 00:42:25,680
improve water efficiency and water

922
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:29,119
conservation in our town. Um, so there's

923
00:42:29,119 --> 00:42:32,319
a few ideas proposed. Um,

924
00:42:32,319 --> 00:42:34,400
not all of them may be practical, but

925
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:36,800
it's it would be great to get your input

926
00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:40,400
on this. So, some of the ideas that um

927
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:44,480
were suggested in the report are um

928
00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:46,800
removing the prohibition on artificial

929
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:49,839
turf. Um artificial turf is not

930
00:42:49,839 --> 00:42:51,599
permitted in the town if it's visible

931
00:42:51,599 --> 00:42:55,040
from off the property. Um,

932
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:59,359
so in in some instances, um,

933
00:42:59,359 --> 00:43:02,240
you know, a a homeowner or a business

934
00:43:02,240 --> 00:43:04,720
that would probably prefer to have

935
00:43:04,720 --> 00:43:07,040
artificial turf,

936
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:08,560
um,

937
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:11,119
needs to have real turf and then they're

938
00:43:11,119 --> 00:43:13,200
watering it and that kind of thing that

939
00:43:13,200 --> 00:43:16,720
it may be worth rethinking that policy.

940
00:43:16,720 --> 00:43:20,160
Um, another possibility could be uh

941
00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:22,160
limiting the amount of grass that can be

942
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:24,000
used in commercial properties within

943
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:26,880
their landscaping. Um, or even

944
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:29,440
potentially some limitations on grass in

945
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:32,560
residential zones, although there's um,

946
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:34,240
you know, there's other factors to

947
00:43:34,240 --> 00:43:36,960
consider there. Uh, we've had some

948
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:39,359
comments from Commissioner Zimmerman and

949
00:43:39,359 --> 00:43:43,680
Kushki. Um, and those have been printed.

950
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:46,160
I think you've got copies of those that

951
00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:49,920
also raise some valid points. Um,

952
00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:53,520
so my recommendation to the commission

953
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:59,200
would be to keep this discussion

954
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:02,240
focused on some simple kind of bite-size

955
00:44:02,240 --> 00:44:05,440
adjustments rather than having a wider

956
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:07,599
conversation about water conservation

957
00:44:07,599 --> 00:44:09,680
tonight. but just to think about maybe

958
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:11,440
some of these changes to our landscape

959
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:15,040
ordinance that could incrementally

960
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:18,560
um push us in the right direction. Um

961
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:37,430
but I'm happy to answer any questions or address any thoughts you have.

962
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:39,200
We want to start off with what we have

963
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:43,119
here or the other one I would

964
00:44:43,119 --> 00:44:45,040
here to discuss would be the um

965
00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:46,319
artificial turf.

966
00:44:46,319 --> 00:44:48,720
>> Yeah, that's um go ahead because I have

967
00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:50,560
some

968
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:53,119
>> so um you know I actually have

969
00:44:53,119 --> 00:44:57,359
artificial turf um in my previous house

970
00:44:57,359 --> 00:45:02,400
and I haven't I mean honestly it is very

971
00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:05,440
nowadays they are very good-looking.

972
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:08,720
Um, I don't see a problem with it for

973
00:45:08,720 --> 00:45:10,800
residents that want it is especially if

974
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:13,200
you have animals, it's very durable.

975
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:16,160
Probably a little hot,

976
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:20,160
but I'm looking for a negative.

977
00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:23,520
>> Uh, I agree that they're they've come a

978
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:27,839
very long way and there they look great.

979
00:45:27,839 --> 00:45:30,720
Um, I'm wondering though if still

980
00:45:30,720 --> 00:45:33,520
putting some limitations on it, like

981
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:36,800
some areas have it allowable in the

982
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:39,839
backyard but not the front yard or a

983
00:45:39,839 --> 00:45:42,800
certain square footage of it in back or

984
00:45:42,800 --> 00:45:45,599
front or just overall.

985
00:45:45,599 --> 00:45:49,589
Um,

986
00:45:49,599 --> 00:45:51,359
I just don't know that I've seen I've

987
00:45:51,359 --> 00:45:54,880
seen small backyards covered in it.

988
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:58,160
Um, I haven't seen like large areas

989
00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:04,480
covered in it. And so in my mind, I just don't

990
00:46:04,480 --> 00:46:06,880
see a large area

991
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:09,920
looking that great, but I don't I can't

992
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:12,240
picture one.

993
00:46:12,240 --> 00:46:13,520
>> I hear what you're saying. That's why I

994
00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:14,880
want to bring this up.

995
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:17,520
>> So,

996
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:20,000
like, did you have a small yard that was

997
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:21,520
>> Yeah, it's in San Jose. So, it's a

998
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:22,240
smaller yard

999
00:46:22,240 --> 00:46:27,040
>> and I've seen it in small yards and

1000
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:29,599
integrated with landscaping and it seems

1001
00:46:29,599 --> 00:46:31,520
fine.

1002
00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:35,190
Um,

1003
00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:36,640
my daughter happens to live in a

1004
00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:38,560
neighborhood where they there's you can

1005
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:40,880
have it in your backyard

1006
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:43,920
and I have to say I don't love the yards

1007
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:46,720
that have it in the back, but you don't

1008
00:46:46,720 --> 00:46:50,240
really have to look at it. Um,

1009
00:46:50,240 --> 00:46:53,040
>> I There's a house that's up this road

1010
00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:56,000
that has artificial grass and it it

1011
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:58,400
looks nice with the landscape. It's not

1012
00:46:58,400 --> 00:46:59,119
big.

1013
00:46:59,119 --> 00:46:59,599
>> Small.

1014
00:46:59,599 --> 00:47:01,920
>> It's small, but it's there for their

1015
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:02,880
pets. So,

1016
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:03,839
>> yeah,

1017
00:47:03,839 --> 00:47:07,040
>> I think it's better for them and it

1018
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:08,640
looks really nice. I thought it was real

1019
00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:10,880
at first, but then I noticed that it was

1020
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:11,680
artificial.

1021
00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:12,720
>> Yeah.

1022
00:47:12,720 --> 00:47:14,160
>> I don't know how to make these rules.

1023
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:16,240
The one concern I have is I don't want

1024
00:47:16,240 --> 00:47:17,839
people just to take it and roll it out

1025
00:47:17,839 --> 00:47:20,480
and say, "Well, it's allowed. Here it

1026
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:21,599
is,

1027
00:47:21,599 --> 00:47:23,280
>> right? Have a certain standard. And how

1028
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:25,520
do how do we state that

1029
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:27,280
>> because it can look really bad if not

1030
00:47:27,280 --> 00:47:27,920
done well.

1031
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:30,000
>> Yeah.

1032
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:31,920
I mean, and over time it can

1033
00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:34,400
degrade and and if it's not maintained

1034
00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:36,800
or replaced, then it can look badly. But

1035
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:38,960
my bigger concern with artificial turf,

1036
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:40,880
it's been this way for I've felt this

1037
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:42,560
way for considerable amount of time and

1038
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:46,640
you're seeing more um more about it in

1039
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:48,640
the press is that you know especially in

1040
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:53,359
an area like this it um taking natural

1041
00:47:53,359 --> 00:47:56,079
spaces and converting them to artificial

1042
00:47:56,079 --> 00:47:59,119
turf and I include grasses in natural

1043
00:47:59,119 --> 00:48:02,560
spaces. Um the grass is is cooling to

1044
00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:04,880
the environment. artificial turf and

1045
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:07,280
cement and hardcapes is not cooling to

1046
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:09,920
the environment. And um you know we

1047
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:12,079
we've there's been a movement and this

1048
00:48:12,079 --> 00:48:14,480
movement is about trying to preserve or

1049
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:17,920
conserve water. Um I I don't think we've

1050
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:19,599
adequately

1051
00:48:19,599 --> 00:48:23,520
in general addressed the impact of the

1052
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:28,079
environmental heating uh as a water

1053
00:48:28,079 --> 00:48:31,599
um user as much as we probably should be

1054
00:48:31,599 --> 00:48:34,160
because you know are we really in the in

1055
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:36,079
the big bigger picture are we conserving

1056
00:48:36,079 --> 00:48:40,319
water by uh making things generate more

1057
00:48:40,319 --> 00:48:42,400
heat around us because we may find that

1058
00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:44,480
we're not because you we use the water

1059
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:46,559
in a different way evaporates or you

1060
00:48:46,559 --> 00:48:49,200
know not a different consideration. So

1061
00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:52,240
>> that's a good point. I I think there are

1062
00:48:52,240 --> 00:48:54,240
artificial turfs out there now that

1063
00:48:54,240 --> 00:48:57,200
address that. I don't know exactly what

1064
00:48:57,200 --> 00:48:59,200
that looks like.

1065
00:48:59,200 --> 00:49:01,520
Um

1066
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:03,440
and

1067
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:06,160
I would say maybe it's hotter if they

1068
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:09,520
put concrete there as opposed I you know

1069
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:10,000
I

1070
00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:12,640
>> um some of the artificial turf I mean

1071
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:14,400
you don't want to walk on it barefoot.

1072
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:14,880
Yeah,

1073
00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:16,640
>> especially when it's 100° outside. You

1074
00:49:16,640 --> 00:49:18,800
don't walk on concrete barefoot. Some of

1075
00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:24,400
the some of the cool coat uh materials

1076
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:26,160
that goes on top of concrete can

1077
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:28,079
actually

1078
00:49:28,079 --> 00:49:30,160
help with that and you where you can

1079
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:33,200
walk on it in when it's hot out. But um

1080
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:35,040
none of those are as good as having just

1081
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:37,520
plain old grass ground because

1082
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:41,119
>> um you know plain old grass is is pretty

1083
00:49:41,119 --> 00:49:43,440
cool especially if it's in the shade.

1084
00:49:43,440 --> 00:49:47,599
Um, so I'm I'm generally not in favor of

1085
00:49:47,599 --> 00:49:49,760
moving from grasses to artificial

1086
00:49:49,760 --> 00:49:51,119
substances whether they

1087
00:49:51,119 --> 00:49:52,480
>> Well, and also in general it's not

1088
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:54,559
really fitting

1089
00:49:54,559 --> 00:49:58,079
>> in the desert like it's not a natural

1090
00:49:58,079 --> 00:49:59,760
landscape,

1091
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:02,640
>> but then you know um you know you can

1092
00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:04,000
make the same argument if you're going

1093
00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:07,839
to take the the um cool grass out and

1094
00:50:07,839 --> 00:50:09,760
put a bunch of gravel down or something

1095
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:11,040
of that nature, you're going to end up

1096
00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:13,520
with the same kind of problem.

1097
00:50:13,520 --> 00:50:17,359
I would lean towards allowing

1098
00:50:17,359 --> 00:50:20,240
a certain amount.

1099
00:50:20,240 --> 00:50:22,000
I don't know exactly what that amount

1100
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:26,240
would be. Just some some

1101
00:50:26,240 --> 00:50:28,800
small area that would be beneficial for

1102
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:31,200
pets or

1103
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:32,720
like I said integrated with other

1104
00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:37,030
landscaping.

1105
00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:41,349
And

1106
00:50:41,359 --> 00:50:43,359
I don't know how turf, [clears throat]

1107
00:50:43,359 --> 00:50:45,440
artificial turf is rated. If we could

1108
00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:46,800
somehow put some kind of standard

1109
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:49,680
attached to it.

1110
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:51,440
>> Yeah. So, there's definitely some

1111
00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:53,839
research we can do. Um I've I've done

1112
00:50:53,839 --> 00:50:57,440
some preliminary research on artificial

1113
00:50:57,440 --> 00:51:00,640
turf and it's true. Um it's not all

1114
00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:02,880
created equally. There is kind of

1115
00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:06,559
different grades. Um, it has improved a

1116
00:51:06,559 --> 00:51:10,000
lot over the years. Um, but yeah, it's

1117
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:12,480
certainly not a silver bullet. It's not

1118
00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:14,559
hoay for artificial turf. Everywhere

1119
00:51:14,559 --> 00:51:17,599
should be artificial turf. It's maybe an

1120
00:51:17,599 --> 00:51:23,359
option for uh someone um who wants a

1121
00:51:23,359 --> 00:51:26,960
kind of a zeroscaped landscaped area but

1122
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:29,920
wants a little bit of green to

1123
00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:33,119
lighten it up a little bit. So

1124
00:51:33,119 --> 00:51:37,839
perhaps um one option could be to for us

1125
00:51:37,839 --> 00:51:41,040
to go away and [snorts] explore how

1126
00:51:41,040 --> 00:51:48,960
um yeah we how it could be included in a landscape area but not kind of

1127
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:52,160
unlimited sades of it. and and we could

1128
00:51:52,160 --> 00:51:55,280
also potentially look at if there's

1129
00:51:55,280 --> 00:51:57,200
different types of gradings of

1130
00:51:57,200 --> 00:51:59,200
artificial turf or different qualities

1131
00:51:59,200 --> 00:52:03,040
and see if we could explore how that

1132
00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:04,960
could address the concerns.

1133
00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:06,000
>> That would be great.

1134
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:07,920
>> Yeah. I'd be curious too on if you look

1135
00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:11,760
at areas that have a lawn, what kind of

1136
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:14,079
shape are they in? Do they look decent?

1137
00:52:14,079 --> 00:52:15,680
Would it be an improvement for

1138
00:52:15,680 --> 00:52:19,040
artificial turf or are they all in

1139
00:52:19,040 --> 00:52:21,760
pretty good shape? and we're not really

1140
00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:23,680
changing anything besides getting rid of

1141
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:25,280
some nice green grass and replacing it

1142
00:52:25,280 --> 00:52:26,720
with plastic.

1143
00:52:26,720 --> 00:52:29,040
>> I I think the only advantage really is

1144
00:52:29,040 --> 00:52:31,839
on water conservation. I think a a real

1145
00:52:31,839 --> 00:52:34,800
lawn is always going to be nicer for

1146
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:36,960
many reasons. It's going to like I I

1147
00:52:36,960 --> 00:52:38,720
have artificial turf in my in my

1148
00:52:38,720 --> 00:52:42,880
backyard and it it's fine, but a real

1149
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:50,079
lawn would probably be nicer. Um but yeah, if we're kind of looking at

1150
00:52:50,079 --> 00:52:51,760
this from the perspective of water

1151
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:54,160
conservation and maybe giving some

1152
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:59,839
options um to reduce water usage, it it

1153
00:52:59,839 --> 00:53:03,599
could be kind of an option that we could

1154
00:53:03,599 --> 00:53:15,109
offer to people.

1155
00:53:15,119 --> 00:53:19,349
um

1156
00:53:19,359 --> 00:53:21,839
the memo that I sent out um that you've

1157
00:53:21,839 --> 00:53:23,280
all received, you know, in that I

1158
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:24,880
recommended that the planning commission

1159
00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:27,359
consider combining landscape and water

1160
00:53:27,359 --> 00:53:29,440
conservation with a review of open space

1161
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:31,920
code because they're I think they're

1162
00:53:31,920 --> 00:53:33,839
very much linked together. you know, the

1163
00:53:33,839 --> 00:53:36,960
town general plan

1164
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:40,400
and open space plan, you know, have have

1165
00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:44,240
uh stated, you know, basically that it

1166
00:53:44,240 --> 00:53:46,800
the town wants to retain and promote

1167
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:49,280
open spaces and anything we do with

1168
00:53:49,280 --> 00:53:50,720
regard to conservation, water

1169
00:53:50,720 --> 00:53:52,240
conservation,

1170
00:53:52,240 --> 00:53:55,200
um that limits that going to you could

1171
00:53:55,200 --> 00:53:56,960
be very detrimental to the retention of

1172
00:53:56,960 --> 00:53:58,880
open spaces over time. So, we have to be

1173
00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:01,520
very careful in that regard. So to to to

1174
00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:04,079
look at one independently of the other I

1175
00:54:04,079 --> 00:54:06,000
think probably might not be the best way

1176
00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:08,079
of going about it. So anything we do

1177
00:54:08,079 --> 00:54:11,359
with regard to uh water landscape and

1178
00:54:11,359 --> 00:54:13,359
water conservation should take all of

1179
00:54:13,359 --> 00:54:15,920
that into effect because um or

1180
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:18,240
consideration because they are

1181
00:54:18,240 --> 00:54:21,119
>> fall outside of landscaping or is it

1182
00:54:21,119 --> 00:54:22,559
included in that?

1183
00:54:22,559 --> 00:54:26,640
>> Well um in you know there's open spaces

1184
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:29,200
in the valley residential zone that are

1185
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:34,640
um based on um strict interpretation of

1186
00:54:34,640 --> 00:54:36,400
the way the code's written, you know,

1187
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:38,400
it's it's called landscaping. It's not

1188
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:39,680
called open space, it's called

1189
00:54:39,680 --> 00:54:42,319
landscaping. So, if we change, you know,

1190
00:54:42,319 --> 00:54:44,720
water conservation in landscaped areas,

1191
00:54:44,720 --> 00:54:47,200
we're indirectly affecting the ability

1192
00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:50,240
to to maintain or create open spaces

1193
00:54:50,240 --> 00:54:54,069
over time.

1194
00:54:54,079 --> 00:54:57,599
And you know I cited some some uh

1195
00:54:57,599 --> 00:55:00,880
examples of that in my diet tribe but

1196
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:04,069
you know

1197
00:55:04,079 --> 00:55:08,000
» does it make sense just to exclude

1198
00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:10,319
open space

1199
00:55:10,319 --> 00:55:12,000
>> in in the scenario that you're talking

1200
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:13,680
about does it would you say it would

1201
00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:16,720
make sense to exclude open space? Well,

1202
00:55:16,720 --> 00:55:20,000
I I mean that's one way to do it, but I

1203
00:55:20,000 --> 00:55:23,200
think I think um realistically at some

1204
00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:24,240
point we're going to have to look at the

1205
00:55:24,240 --> 00:55:26,079
two together and in in the bigger

1206
00:55:26,079 --> 00:55:28,720
picture and rather than just do it

1207
00:55:28,720 --> 00:55:30,240
independently and say, "Okay, we're just

1208
00:55:30,240 --> 00:55:32,400
going to do this one thing right now."

1209
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:35,200
Um because you know I think I you know

1210
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:39,040
when I read through um some of this you

1211
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:42,000
know I I immediately started to look at

1212
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:44,720
things and say well if we do that then

1213
00:55:44,720 --> 00:55:46,079
um it's going to create this problem

1214
00:55:46,079 --> 00:55:48,880
over in the open space area and so we we

1215
00:55:48,880 --> 00:55:50,000
don't want to necessarily do that

1216
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:51,920
without doing something about the you

1217
00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:54,079
know preservation open spaces because

1218
00:55:54,079 --> 00:55:56,000
and you know I mean even in the even in

1219
00:55:56,000 --> 00:55:59,200
the intro it says um the overwhelming

1220
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:00,880
majority of water usage in Springdale is

1221
00:56:00,880 --> 00:56:02,720
for irrigation and So, we should review

1222
00:56:02,720 --> 00:56:04,000
our landscaping standards, see if they

1223
00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:05,599
can be more effectively promote water

1224
00:56:05,599 --> 00:56:10,240
conservation. Well, I I would venture to

1225
00:56:10,240 --> 00:56:13,680
guess that most of that irrigation or a

1226
00:56:13,680 --> 00:56:15,520
very large part of that irrigation goes

1227
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:18,400
to open space properties, properties

1228
00:56:18,400 --> 00:56:20,720
that are either an agricultural

1229
00:56:20,720 --> 00:56:23,200
uh whether they be in agricult zoning or

1230
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:24,880
their residential zoning under

1231
00:56:24,880 --> 00:56:26,559
agricultural purposes, which is

1232
00:56:26,559 --> 00:56:27,839
something we need to think about as

1233
00:56:27,839 --> 00:56:30,799
well. But um you know there's you know

1234
00:56:30,799 --> 00:56:34,000
the the um

1235
00:56:34,000 --> 00:56:37,599
water shares users um predominant usage

1236
00:56:37,599 --> 00:56:41,119
for them is is in is irrigation of

1237
00:56:41,119 --> 00:56:44,480
pastures or that sort of thing. And so

1238
00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:47,760
um if we're you know while it's true the

1239
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:53,680
over I think the the ratio of um town

1240
00:56:53,680 --> 00:56:57,359
user irrigation and

1241
00:56:57,359 --> 00:57:00,710
um

1242
00:57:00,720 --> 00:57:02,880
water shares users is about twothirds

1243
00:57:02,880 --> 00:57:05,680
water shares to one third town. Um and

1244
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:08,720
so if twothirds of the of the water goes

1245
00:57:08,720 --> 00:57:11,040
to watershed users, obviously the

1246
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:13,520
overwhelming majority is used for that

1247
00:57:13,520 --> 00:57:17,119
purpose. Um and then within I think even

1248
00:57:17,119 --> 00:57:20,160
within the town uh

1249
00:57:20,160 --> 00:57:21,920
you know what we would think may might

1250
00:57:21,920 --> 00:57:24,079
be town users are probably some of the

1251
00:57:24,079 --> 00:57:28,160
large um hotels or that sort of thing.

1252
00:57:28,160 --> 00:57:33,599
And they've got large expanses of grass or or other landscaped areas

1253
00:57:33,599 --> 00:57:36,079
there. but they're they're watering

1254
00:57:36,079 --> 00:57:38,240
those with irrigation water shares as

1255
00:57:38,240 --> 00:57:40,160
opposed to purchasing water from the

1256
00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:42,880
town, which is why they can probably do

1257
00:57:42,880 --> 00:57:45,839
as much as they can in that regard. So

1258
00:57:45,839 --> 00:57:47,680
again, you know, we have to take all of

1259
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:53,349
that in consideration. So

1260
00:57:53,359 --> 00:57:55,040
I I'm just going to say good job putting

1261
00:57:55,040 --> 00:57:57,839
all that together and I I totally agree.

1262
00:57:57,839 --> 00:57:59,440
After I read this, I was very concerned

1263
00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:00,960
of losing the open space.

1264
00:58:00,960 --> 00:58:04,240
>> Yeah. But like you said, if if we say,

1265
00:58:04,240 --> 00:58:06,720
"Well, they're exempt."

1266
00:58:06,720 --> 00:58:08,319
The next biggest user is probably

1267
00:58:08,319 --> 00:58:11,440
businesses and hotels.

1268
00:58:11,440 --> 00:58:12,640
And what are we going to do with them?

1269
00:58:12,640 --> 00:58:13,680
Because they're probably using most of

1270
00:58:13,680 --> 00:58:15,440
their waters in

1271
00:58:15,440 --> 00:58:18,000
>> Well, the the water that the hotels are

1272
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:21,040
using that aren't for irrigation

1273
00:58:21,040 --> 00:58:24,240
is cooler water, which is not what this

1274
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:27,280
is about. So, they're that's being

1275
00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:31,680
that's controlled in a different set of the code. So we can we can look

1276
00:58:31,680 --> 00:58:33,200
at just the irrigation part of it

1277
00:58:33,200 --> 00:58:36,240
without impacting their ability to you

1278
00:58:36,240 --> 00:58:40,559
know feed and and shower and bathe and

1279
00:58:40,559 --> 00:58:43,920
you know clean the properties but

1280
00:58:43,920 --> 00:58:45,599
because most of them well I shouldn't

1281
00:58:45,599 --> 00:58:49,440
say most many of them are using uh well

1282
00:58:49,440 --> 00:58:52,000
irrigation water for the outside and

1283
00:58:52,000 --> 00:58:53,839
water shares for most of that

1284
00:58:53,839 --> 00:58:56,240
>> but I look at as water is water so I

1285
00:58:56,240 --> 00:58:58,559
guess where I was going is if you take

1286
00:58:58,559 --> 00:59:00,240
those things away the people we're

1287
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:01,760
hurting are the residents that really

1288
00:59:01,760 --> 00:59:04,160
aren't using that much water anyways.

1289
00:59:04,160 --> 00:59:05,920
>> You I'm sorry. You think there's not

1290
00:59:05,920 --> 00:59:07,839
>> So if we say we want open space, which I

1291
00:59:07,839 --> 00:59:08,400
agree with.

1292
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:08,880
>> Yeah.

1293
00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:11,599
>> So go ahead, water that. We're not going

1294
00:59:11,599 --> 00:59:14,720
to be able to um restrict internal usage

1295
00:59:14,720 --> 00:59:16,079
of water.

1296
00:59:16,079 --> 00:59:19,200
>> So how much water is really left

1297
00:59:19,200 --> 00:59:21,119
and who are we really

1298
00:59:21,119 --> 00:59:22,960
>> my understanding is the town did a a

1299
00:59:22,960 --> 00:59:24,480
study on that in the last number of

1300
00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:25,760
years and they've determined that

1301
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:28,079
there's a lot of water for the next 20

1302
00:59:28,079 --> 00:59:29,359
years. No, that doesn't

1303
00:59:29,359 --> 00:59:32,640
>> No, no. I meant how much water usage,

1304
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:35,760
meaning that the residents that, you

1305
00:59:35,760 --> 00:59:38,000
know, live in the town of Springdale.

1306
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:40,000
>> I don't see them watering a lot,

1307
00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:41,040
>> right?

1308
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:44,559
>> So, how much water are we saving and all

1309
00:59:44,559 --> 00:59:46,640
we're doing is inconveniencing a lot of

1310
00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:47,920
our residents and I don't think we're

1311
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:49,839
going to get that far as far as the

1312
00:59:49,839 --> 00:59:52,720
savings. I think I'm agreeing with you.

1313
00:59:52,720 --> 00:59:53,440
>> Yeah.

1314
00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:59,839
So what of the conservation

1315
00:59:59,839 --> 01:00:04,559
items listed? I mean the one that I see

1316
01:00:04,559 --> 01:00:06,160
would be a benefit for everybody

1317
01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:09,040
including open space irrigation systems

1318
01:00:09,040 --> 01:00:11,920
being designed to water um efficiently

1319
01:00:11,920 --> 01:00:14,960
and avoid overspray and overflow. That's

1320
01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:17,599
not limiting their water. It's probably

1321
01:00:17,599 --> 01:00:20,720
actually helping their watering

1322
01:00:20,720 --> 01:00:22,400
situation.

1323
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:24,720
Um

1324
01:00:24,720 --> 01:00:26,480
I don't see anything though that really

1325
01:00:26,480 --> 01:00:33,349
is actually limiting the volume.

1326
01:00:33,359 --> 01:00:35,200
» Well, there's a number of things on on

1327
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:37,599
you know this the staff's uh notes here

1328
01:00:37,599 --> 01:00:39,440
that you know 80% of plants in landscape

1329
01:00:39,440 --> 01:00:41,359
are required to be water conserving

1330
01:00:41,359 --> 01:00:44,000
species. Um

1331
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:47,200
that's that's a good thing. Um we should

1332
01:00:47,200 --> 01:00:48,880
be doing that. But if you're in if you

1333
01:00:48,880 --> 01:00:53,680
look at it agricultural areas um

1334
01:00:53,680 --> 01:00:56,960
the and if the next bullet says before I

1335
01:00:56,960 --> 01:00:58,319
continue on that the next bullet says

1336
01:00:58,319 --> 01:01:00,400
the town holds a list of approved plants

1337
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:02,079
approved plant species which are native

1338
01:01:02,079 --> 01:01:03,599
and drought tolerant.

1339
01:01:03,599 --> 01:01:07,200
>> Um and

1340
01:01:07,200 --> 01:01:09,920
that's also true. But if you look at

1341
01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:11,920
some of the pasture areas that are out

1342
01:01:11,920 --> 01:01:13,520
there, you know, there's there's large

1343
01:01:13,520 --> 01:01:18,000
pastures where um

1344
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:21,520
grasses that are used for forage or food

1345
01:01:21,520 --> 01:01:24,480
for for livestock are, you know, being

1346
01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:26,480
cultivated there. And some of those are

1347
01:01:26,480 --> 01:01:29,920
alalfa. Alfa is not on the list. There's

1348
01:01:29,920 --> 01:01:32,559
other fescues and buffalo grasses that

1349
01:01:32,559 --> 01:01:34,559
are on the list and some of some of the

1350
01:01:34,559 --> 01:01:38,880
pastures use that. But um to try to take

1351
01:01:38,880 --> 01:01:42,799
uh the alalfa, which is a arguably a

1352
01:01:42,799 --> 01:01:45,040
better food source for most of the

1353
01:01:45,040 --> 01:01:46,559
depending on the type of animal you

1354
01:01:46,559 --> 01:01:48,799
have, to try take that away from them,

1355
01:01:48,799 --> 01:01:50,319
it'd be very difficult.

1356
01:01:50,319 --> 01:01:52,000
>> So would there be a way of listing

1357
01:01:52,000 --> 01:01:54,079
exceptions for those types of things you

1358
01:01:54,079 --> 01:01:56,480
just mentioned? Well, it could be and

1359
01:01:56,480 --> 01:01:58,079
that's maybe that's why and that's kind

1360
01:01:58,079 --> 01:01:59,680
of why I'm saying we got to look at them

1361
01:01:59,680 --> 01:02:01,599
together is because one way to do this

1362
01:02:01,599 --> 01:02:03,359
is say, hey, if you know if we're

1363
01:02:03,359 --> 01:02:06,799
looking at um land that's being uh

1364
01:02:06,799 --> 01:02:09,520
that's somehow defined as open space

1365
01:02:09,520 --> 01:02:12,240
within the residential zones, which we

1366
01:02:12,240 --> 01:02:14,240
we'd have to do. there's some some way

1367
01:02:14,240 --> 01:02:15,920
we'd have to figure out how to do that

1368
01:02:15,920 --> 01:02:17,599
and say, okay, they get some certain

1369
01:02:17,599 --> 01:02:19,440
exceptions if they're, you know, if

1370
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:23,760
they're using those as open spaces uh in

1371
01:02:23,760 --> 01:02:28,079
somehow in an agricultural uh manner,

1372
01:02:28,079 --> 01:02:30,559
you know, it's okay to plant alpha alpha

1373
01:02:30,559 --> 01:02:32,400
or we add alphaalfpha to the list of

1374
01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:34,960
approved plants in in those particular

1375
01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:36,880
types of areas. I'm not saying I don't

1376
01:02:36,880 --> 01:02:38,079
think you'd want to do that everywhere,

1377
01:02:38,079 --> 01:02:40,400
but you could say it in certain areas

1378
01:02:40,400 --> 01:02:42,160
and make it open it up so that they've

1379
01:02:42,160 --> 01:02:44,160
got a a little more leeway there that

1380
01:02:44,160 --> 01:02:47,280
doesn't discourage them from from, you

1381
01:02:47,280 --> 01:02:47,440
know,

1382
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:49,200
>> I I personally I don't want to limit

1383
01:02:49,200 --> 01:02:51,760
what you can plant on those open areas.

1384
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:55,920
If they're feeding animals livestock,

1385
01:02:55,920 --> 01:02:58,559
put what works for them because I think

1386
01:02:58,559 --> 01:03:00,480
if the town character likes the

1387
01:03:00,480 --> 01:03:01,599
livestock.

1388
01:03:01,599 --> 01:03:03,440
>> Well, that's true. But the other thing

1389
01:03:03,440 --> 01:03:05,440
you have to be aware of too is you know

1390
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:10,400
um the uh the there's significant amount

1391
01:03:10,400 --> 01:03:14,400
of water that is that is needed to

1392
01:03:14,400 --> 01:03:17,280
farm or undertake agriculture or

1393
01:03:17,280 --> 01:03:19,200
whatever. So, if you've got a large

1394
01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:21,599
pasture, say a 5 acre pasture, you need

1395
01:03:21,599 --> 01:03:24,480
about 800,000 gallons a month at a

1396
01:03:24,480 --> 01:03:28,160
minimum to water that um to keep it uh

1397
01:03:28,160 --> 01:03:30,000
the grass, you know, whatever kind of

1398
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:30,559
grass is.

1399
01:03:30,559 --> 01:03:32,079
>> I'm confused of where you're going with

1400
01:03:32,079 --> 01:03:33,839
this.

1401
01:03:33,839 --> 01:03:35,839
I'm just saying we need to be un we need

1402
01:03:35,839 --> 01:03:38,319
to look at them together and be

1403
01:03:38,319 --> 01:03:40,079
understanding of what some of those

1404
01:03:40,079 --> 01:03:41,599
constraints are as opposed to just

1405
01:03:41,599 --> 01:03:43,039
saying hey we're going to make some

1406
01:03:43,039 --> 01:03:45,440
changes and and then without considering

1407
01:03:45,440 --> 01:03:47,280
that it's going to have a could have a

1408
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:48,799
significant impact on this other

1409
01:03:48,799 --> 01:03:51,599
>> yeah and I'm agreeing with that that's

1410
01:03:51,599 --> 01:03:52,960
>> but I'm saying you take out the big

1411
01:03:52,960 --> 01:03:55,359
users and I don't want to go through and

1412
01:03:55,359 --> 01:03:56,880
put all kinds of restrictions in for

1413
01:03:56,880 --> 01:03:58,240
someone that's really not using that

1414
01:03:58,240 --> 01:04:01,599
much water like for example the uh spray

1415
01:04:01,599 --> 01:04:04,640
overflow from sprinkler systems. Well,

1416
01:04:04,640 --> 01:04:05,920
that probably occurs with people

1417
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:08,319
watering lawns. How much of that is

1418
01:04:08,319 --> 01:04:10,559
there? How much are we really how much

1419
01:04:10,559 --> 01:04:12,880
is there to get? You know, I'm not going

1420
01:04:12,880 --> 01:04:16,799
to stop someone, you know, has a field

1421
01:04:16,799 --> 01:04:18,799
that has a big sprint uh sprayer.

1422
01:04:18,799 --> 01:04:20,160
They're going to have overshoot. I know

1423
01:04:20,160 --> 01:04:22,559
it happens. I see it.

1424
01:04:22,559 --> 01:04:24,000
>> Well, there are but you know, at the

1425
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:25,440
same time, there are things that those

1426
01:04:25,440 --> 01:04:27,680
users can do to to mitigate some of

1427
01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:28,480
that, you know,

1428
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:30,079
>> but that that's going to be a cost to

1429
01:04:30,079 --> 01:04:32,880
them. It is a cost but it's but it

1430
01:04:32,880 --> 01:04:34,640
>> and I really don't want to burden them

1431
01:04:34,640 --> 01:04:35,359
more.

1432
01:04:35,359 --> 01:04:40,079
>> No, but I I think um you know there's some reasonable things to do. I

1433
01:04:40,079 --> 01:04:43,359
mean you know in you know you know my

1434
01:04:43,359 --> 01:04:46,000
community the community owns a 5 acre 5

1435
01:04:46,000 --> 01:04:48,720
and a half acre parcel that's planted as

1436
01:04:48,720 --> 01:04:50,960
a pasture and one of the things we found

1437
01:04:50,960 --> 01:04:53,599
out was that um we were consuming much

1438
01:04:53,599 --> 01:04:55,119
more water than we really needed to

1439
01:04:55,119 --> 01:04:57,119
because we were manually turning the

1440
01:04:57,119 --> 01:04:59,119
valves on and off and we were relying on

1441
01:04:59,119 --> 01:05:00,880
people to do that. sometimes other

1442
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:02,400
things got in the way and they didn't

1443
01:05:02,400 --> 01:05:04,640
weren't able to do that. And so we spent

1444
01:05:04,640 --> 01:05:07,520
a you know a significant amount of money

1445
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:09,520
converting over to an automated system.

1446
01:05:09,520 --> 01:05:12,880
So now it's all you know on timers and

1447
01:05:12,880 --> 01:05:15,200
whatnot. And so the timers want can you

1448
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:16,960
know control when the water goes on and

1449
01:05:16,960 --> 01:05:21,280
off and we're well within the the uh you

1450
01:05:21,280 --> 01:05:22,799
know requirements for lack of a better

1451
01:05:22,799 --> 01:05:24,319
term of you know what we should be

1452
01:05:24,319 --> 01:05:26,960
doing. we're we're actually using less

1453
01:05:26,960 --> 01:05:30,319
than uh what some of the agricultural

1454
01:05:30,319 --> 01:05:32,160
people are suggesting. I think that's

1455
01:05:32,160 --> 01:05:35,039
part of that's because the the area is

1456
01:05:35,039 --> 01:05:37,280
smaller than what we thought it was.

1457
01:05:37,280 --> 01:05:40,960
But, you know, um we're using probably

1458
01:05:40,960 --> 01:05:43,039
half as much as we used to use 5 years

1459
01:05:43,039 --> 01:05:45,359
ago. And then significant, but now

1460
01:05:45,359 --> 01:05:46,880
you're going to go to the the farmer or

1461
01:05:46,880 --> 01:05:49,359
the person that has, you know, a pasture

1462
01:05:49,359 --> 01:05:50,799
with cattle

1463
01:05:50,799 --> 01:05:52,640
>> and required them to make an investment

1464
01:05:52,640 --> 01:05:54,240
to upgrade their system, which is

1465
01:05:54,240 --> 01:05:56,079
probably going to cost more than yours

1466
01:05:56,079 --> 01:05:57,280
because it's much bigger.

1467
01:05:57,280 --> 01:06:00,000
>> It may it may or it may not. Um, it

1468
01:06:00,000 --> 01:06:01,920
depends. And and some of those, you

1469
01:06:01,920 --> 01:06:04,079
know, I mean, those people are not

1470
01:06:04,079 --> 01:06:06,240
necessarily unwilling to to do that. I

1471
01:06:06,240 --> 01:06:07,520
mean, you know, we all live in this

1472
01:06:07,520 --> 01:06:09,119
earth together and there many of them

1473
01:06:09,119 --> 01:06:10,880
that are willing to conserve and, you

1474
01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:12,240
know, there's benefits to that. some

1475
01:06:12,240 --> 01:06:13,440
farmers are some of the most

1476
01:06:13,440 --> 01:06:16,000
conservation ob you know aware people

1477
01:06:16,000 --> 01:06:19,520
that that I've known. Um so if there are

1478
01:06:19,520 --> 01:06:21,440
you know good

1479
01:06:21,440 --> 01:06:23,599
uh methods or habits that we can

1480
01:06:23,599 --> 01:06:25,520
encourage them to do I think generally

1481
01:06:25,520 --> 01:06:30,799
they'll be willing to adopt that. But so we shouldn't just write it off and

1482
01:06:30,799 --> 01:06:36,480
say hey you got a big user so we're going to you know um

1483
01:06:36,480 --> 01:06:37,920
you know leave you outside the fence and

1484
01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:39,200
you can do whatever you want. I don't

1485
01:06:39,200 --> 01:06:40,559
think that's the right choice either. I

1486
01:06:40,559 --> 01:06:42,720
think we need to do consider both sides.

1487
01:06:42,720 --> 01:06:44,079
So,

1488
01:06:44,079 --> 01:06:45,839
>> could I offer a few suggestions?

1489
01:06:45,839 --> 01:06:46,720
>> Sure.

1490
01:06:46,720 --> 01:06:50,559
>> So, um I I think this is a really good

1491
01:06:50,559 --> 01:06:54,160
conversation because um

1492
01:06:54,160 --> 01:06:56,319
you know those those pastures and those

1493
01:06:56,319 --> 01:06:58,880
kind of semi-aggricultural parts of town

1494
01:06:58,880 --> 01:07:01,520
are a really treasured part of a

1495
01:07:01,520 --> 01:07:04,240
community, right? They're really part of

1496
01:07:04,240 --> 01:07:08,720
the landscape that we all love. Um and

1497
01:07:08,720 --> 01:07:12,079
um those are all with the exception of

1498
01:07:12,079 --> 01:07:14,240
Trees Ranch, those are all zoned valley

1499
01:07:14,240 --> 01:07:15,119
residential.

1500
01:07:15,119 --> 01:07:19,680
>> Yeah. So to Paul's point, if we do

1501
01:07:19,680 --> 01:07:23,760
introduce uh restrictions on turf for

1502
01:07:23,760 --> 01:07:26,720
natural grass in valley residential

1503
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:29,920
zones, you could you're essentially

1504
01:07:29,920 --> 01:07:33,119
applying them to those areas and that

1505
01:07:33,119 --> 01:07:35,760
could potentially mean that you know

1506
01:07:35,760 --> 01:07:38,000
their ability to stay in that kind of

1507
01:07:38,000 --> 01:07:41,039
semi-aggricultural state may be may be

1508
01:07:41,039 --> 01:07:46,559
difficult. Um, one one thought is

1509
01:07:46,559 --> 01:07:50,240
um you could put the valley residential

1510
01:07:50,240 --> 01:07:54,480
zone to one side for the time being and

1511
01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:57,039
look purely at the commercial

1512
01:07:57,039 --> 01:07:58,640
landscaping

1513
01:07:58,640 --> 01:08:04,079
um requirements. So, um, and introduce

1514
01:08:04,079 --> 01:08:07,280
some greater restrictions on grass

1515
01:08:07,280 --> 01:08:09,119
within the commercial zones, within

1516
01:08:09,119 --> 01:08:11,839
those commercial properties, h

1517
01:08:11,839 --> 01:08:14,880
potentially limit grass to functional

1518
01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:16,640
areas. And there's some ways you could

1519
01:08:16,640 --> 01:08:19,199
define that to recreation or that kind

1520
01:08:19,199 --> 01:08:22,000
of thing. Um

1521
01:08:22,000 --> 01:08:23,839
and

1522
01:08:23,839 --> 01:08:25,839
the benefit of doing something that is

1523
01:08:25,839 --> 01:08:30,480
that when when we do get a um a

1524
01:08:30,480 --> 01:08:32,560
commercial redevelopment of a property

1525
01:08:32,560 --> 01:08:36,400
where the landscape is being redeveloped

1526
01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:39,359
um we can you know get some gains as far

1527
01:08:39,359 --> 01:08:41,759
as water efficiency there. We've had a

1528
01:08:41,759 --> 01:08:44,000
few redevelopments of commercial

1529
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:47,679
properties in the last few years that um

1530
01:08:47,679 --> 01:08:49,839
they the finished product looks great.

1531
01:08:49,839 --> 01:08:51,520
They're really beautiful projects, but

1532
01:08:51,520 --> 01:08:54,239
there's a lot of there's a lot of grass

1533
01:08:54,239 --> 01:08:59,679
that's just there to look at. Um and

1534
01:08:59,679 --> 01:09:03,520
perhaps they could still look great with

1535
01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:05,920
water-wise landscaping.

1536
01:09:05,920 --> 01:09:07,520
They could look just as nice with water

1537
01:09:07,520 --> 01:09:09,679
wise landscaping as they do with grass.

1538
01:09:09,679 --> 01:09:12,000
and we'd be saving a lot of water. So

1539
01:09:12,000 --> 01:09:14,000
that that could be one area that you

1540
01:09:14,000 --> 01:09:15,520
could focus on that might be a little

1541
01:09:15,520 --> 01:09:18,080
bit easier than

1542
01:09:18,080 --> 01:09:20,719
kind of imposing restrictions in the

1543
01:09:20,719 --> 01:09:24,000
residential zones for the discuss for

1544
01:09:24,000 --> 01:09:28,390
the reasons you've outlined.

1545
01:09:28,400 --> 01:09:30,159
» Do we have an idea of how much water

1546
01:09:30,159 --> 01:09:32,719
that would save?

1547
01:09:32,719 --> 01:09:38,309
>> I don't have any figures to hand.

1548
01:09:38,319 --> 01:09:40,640
So, I mean, we we could look a little

1549
01:09:40,640 --> 01:09:42,880
bit, but I mean, I think if you drive

1550
01:09:42,880 --> 01:09:44,880
through the commercial areas of town,

1551
01:09:44,880 --> 01:09:47,040
you'll see lots of lawns that need

1552
01:09:47,040 --> 01:09:50,319
regular watering. And so, I think

1553
01:09:50,319 --> 01:09:52,640
incrementally as those properties

1554
01:09:52,640 --> 01:09:56,000
redevelop and adjust, um, over time, you

1555
01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:58,480
could make some real savings on water. I

1556
01:09:58,480 --> 01:10:05,830
think

1557
01:10:05,840 --> 01:10:08,000
» is the town is the town on a schedule

1558
01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:10,719
for a water to water the grass?

1559
01:10:10,719 --> 01:10:12,400
>> Yes.

1560
01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:15,280
Well, the the users are on the schedule.

1561
01:10:15,280 --> 01:10:16,000
>> I don't Yeah,

1562
01:10:16,000 --> 01:10:19,920
>> I'm not sure I'm not sure if the

1563
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:21,920
watershed users are on the same schedule

1564
01:10:21,920 --> 01:10:26,000
or not. Um, my my empirical observation

1565
01:10:26,000 --> 01:10:27,840
is that they kind of water when they

1566
01:10:27,840 --> 01:10:29,679
feel like they can, they want to,

1567
01:10:29,679 --> 01:10:32,080
>> because I I I drive to work every

1568
01:10:32,080 --> 01:10:36,159
morning at 6:00 a.m. and I see the same

1569
01:10:36,159 --> 01:10:39,199
>> grass being watered almost every day.

1570
01:10:39,199 --> 01:10:41,280
So, I'm like,

1571
01:10:41,280 --> 01:10:43,920
is it on a schedule or are they should

1572
01:10:43,920 --> 01:10:49,189
be on a schedule or

1573
01:10:49,199 --> 01:10:51,440
» And the other the other Go ahead, Tom.

1574
01:10:51,440 --> 01:10:53,120
Are you Melissa, are you referring to

1575
01:10:53,120 --> 01:10:54,960
When you say town, are you referring to

1576
01:10:54,960 --> 01:10:57,040
just like town- owned properties or just

1577
01:10:57,040 --> 01:10:58,640
general properties within the town of

1578
01:10:58,640 --> 01:10:59,280
Springdale?

1579
01:10:59,280 --> 01:11:01,920
>> Just general properties. I see them. I

1580
01:11:01,920 --> 01:11:04,800
see the water just every morning, same

1581
01:11:04,800 --> 01:11:06,080
time,

1582
01:11:06,080 --> 01:11:08,000
>> and I'm like I'm not sure if it's on a

1583
01:11:08,000 --> 01:11:09,280
schedule because we're talking about

1584
01:11:09,280 --> 01:11:10,960
this and then I'm a little confused

1585
01:11:10,960 --> 01:11:13,840
because I don't know anything about the

1586
01:11:13,840 --> 01:11:16,800
water schedule or anything because

1587
01:11:16,800 --> 01:11:18,800
again, I live in the apartment and we

1588
01:11:18,800 --> 01:11:20,080
have a drip line. So

1589
01:11:20,080 --> 01:11:22,320
>> yeah, that's a good question and and

1590
01:11:22,320 --> 01:11:23,840
it's a little complex. I think as Paul

1591
01:11:23,840 --> 01:11:24,880
was about to answer that, you know,

1592
01:11:24,880 --> 01:11:26,960
there are some properties that are um

1593
01:11:26,960 --> 01:11:30,239
irrigate with water through the

1594
01:11:30,239 --> 01:11:32,960
irrigation company. They have set

1595
01:11:32,960 --> 01:11:34,560
watering times when they are supposed to

1596
01:11:34,560 --> 01:11:37,040
water. There are other um properties

1597
01:11:37,040 --> 01:11:40,000
that water with um water that they

1598
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:43,440
purchase through the town. Um and and so

1599
01:11:43,440 --> 01:11:45,120
it just it kind of depends on which

1600
01:11:45,120 --> 01:11:46,400
where you're getting your water and what

1601
01:11:46,400 --> 01:11:48,239
the schedule is. I think the point of

1602
01:11:48,239 --> 01:11:50,960
what Nile is trying to to say is you

1603
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:53,120
shouldn't be watering your grass every

1604
01:11:53,120 --> 01:11:55,600
day at 6:00 am in the morning. And if

1605
01:11:55,600 --> 01:11:57,920
there's a way that we can encourage

1606
01:11:57,920 --> 01:12:01,520
people not to do that, that's that's the

1607
01:12:01,520 --> 01:12:04,080
goal, right? So that that's that's what

1608
01:12:04,080 --> 01:12:05,280
we're trying to do here.

1609
01:12:05,280 --> 01:12:08,080
>> That clarifies a little bit for me. So

1610
01:12:08,080 --> 01:12:11,679
because I was a little confused,

1611
01:12:11,679 --> 01:12:14,880
>> do you know the does the town what

1612
01:12:14,880 --> 01:12:16,800
schedule does the town adhere to? their

1613
01:12:16,800 --> 01:12:19,120
own schedule or do they have are they

1614
01:12:19,120 --> 01:12:23,830
have they selected one of the others?

1615
01:12:23,840 --> 01:12:25,199
» I should know the answer to that

1616
01:12:25,199 --> 01:12:26,480
question, but I don't.

1617
01:12:26,480 --> 01:12:27,199
>> That's okay.

1618
01:12:27,199 --> 01:12:29,280
>> Um, so I I will find that out for you.

1619
01:12:29,280 --> 01:12:31,520
>> Okay, good.

1620
01:12:31,520 --> 01:12:33,040
>> I'm going to go back to the idea. I

1621
01:12:33,040 --> 01:12:35,040
mean, the the best one of the great way

1622
01:12:35,040 --> 01:12:37,600
to conserve water is to get rid of the

1623
01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:40,960
lawn and just plant native plants,

1624
01:12:40,960 --> 01:12:43,360
but I don't know how we'd want to

1625
01:12:43,360 --> 01:12:46,080
enforce that. you know, we can show

1626
01:12:46,080 --> 01:12:48,719
pictures, examples.

1627
01:12:48,719 --> 01:12:52,640
I mean, it's actually beautiful and it encourages wildlife and everything

1628
01:12:52,640 --> 01:12:54,640
else.

1629
01:12:54,640 --> 01:12:56,880
>> So, we want to go want to like mandate

1630
01:12:56,880 --> 01:12:59,199
that type of landscaping.

1631
01:12:59,199 --> 01:13:00,719
>> So, so I think the way that it work

1632
01:13:00,719 --> 01:13:04,080
would work is if if the town were to

1633
01:13:04,080 --> 01:13:05,920
make amendments to our landscaping

1634
01:13:05,920 --> 01:13:10,560
ordinance to to restrict grass and and

1635
01:13:10,560 --> 01:13:13,600
that kind of thing. Um

1636
01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:16,640
all ordinances are are futurefacing,

1637
01:13:16,640 --> 01:13:19,920
right? So they would only apply as

1638
01:13:19,920 --> 01:13:22,000
people start redeveloping pro

1639
01:13:22,000 --> 01:13:24,960
properties. So it by changing this

1640
01:13:24,960 --> 01:13:27,840
ordinance, it wouldn't mean that all of

1641
01:13:27,840 --> 01:13:29,840
the commercial properties suddenly need

1642
01:13:29,840 --> 01:13:32,320
to get rid of their grass. It would just

1643
01:13:32,320 --> 01:13:34,560
mean that over time as redevelopment

1644
01:13:34,560 --> 01:13:37,440
happens um

1645
01:13:37,440 --> 01:13:39,440
there would be

1646
01:13:39,440 --> 01:13:41,120
you know the landscaping the commercial

1647
01:13:41,120 --> 01:13:42,960
properties would over time become more

1648
01:13:42,960 --> 01:13:44,640
and more

1649
01:13:44,640 --> 01:13:45,280
um

1650
01:13:45,280 --> 01:13:47,280
>> so that's really limiting space you have

1651
01:13:47,280 --> 01:13:53,669
for grass

1652
01:13:53,679 --> 01:13:56,800
» um Rich that's a great question about

1653
01:13:56,800 --> 01:13:58,080
hey if we if we pass all these

1654
01:13:58,080 --> 01:14:00,480
ordinances what really is the impact

1655
01:14:00,480 --> 01:14:02,400
right because we can say no more grass,

1656
01:14:02,400 --> 01:14:03,679
but then we have to wait for all these

1657
01:14:03,679 --> 01:14:05,679
properties to redevelop. And how long is

1658
01:14:05,679 --> 01:14:07,520
that going to take? Well, one of the

1659
01:14:07,520 --> 01:14:09,679
things that that is available to the

1660
01:14:09,679 --> 01:14:13,040
town if you pass an ordinance that has

1661
01:14:13,040 --> 01:14:15,520
certain water conservation elements to

1662
01:14:15,520 --> 01:14:17,360
it, many of which you're discussing

1663
01:14:17,360 --> 01:14:20,640
tonight through the water Washington

1664
01:14:20,640 --> 01:14:22,560
County water conservation district,

1665
01:14:22,560 --> 01:14:24,480
property owners can get a rebate for

1666
01:14:24,480 --> 01:14:26,159
removing their grass. And so then there

1667
01:14:26,159 --> 01:14:28,719
becomes a financial incentive for them

1668
01:14:28,719 --> 01:14:32,080
to get that that or to remove the grass.

1669
01:14:32,080 --> 01:14:35,360
That incentive is only available

1670
01:14:35,360 --> 01:14:38,640
if the town adopts an ordinance that has

1671
01:14:38,640 --> 01:14:40,000
some of these water conservation

1672
01:14:40,000 --> 01:14:41,440
elements to it. So, I think that's

1673
01:14:41,440 --> 01:14:44,400
another reason why um Nile and Eugene,

1674
01:14:44,400 --> 01:14:46,400
you're reading this to you tonight, is

1675
01:14:46,400 --> 01:14:50,400
to perhaps um qualify property owners in

1676
01:14:50,400 --> 01:14:52,800
the town of Springdale to receive that

1677
01:14:52,800 --> 01:14:54,719
incentive from the Washington County

1678
01:14:54,719 --> 01:14:56,320
Water Conservancy District to remove the

1679
01:14:56,320 --> 01:14:58,159
grass. That way, we don't have to wait

1680
01:14:58,159 --> 01:14:59,760
until properties are redeveloped. We can

1681
01:14:59,760 --> 01:15:01,440
get faster action on it.

1682
01:15:01,440 --> 01:15:04,159
>> Yeah. The the unfortunate aspect of that

1683
01:15:04,159 --> 01:15:07,120
is well if it's something that somebody

1684
01:15:07,120 --> 01:15:09,120
wants to do and is budging to do that

1685
01:15:09,120 --> 01:15:13,280
anyway, it's a good uh little extra for

1686
01:15:13,280 --> 01:15:17,520
them. But the cost to replace well to to

1687
01:15:17,520 --> 01:15:20,320
naturalize the land is it's almost

1688
01:15:20,320 --> 01:15:22,320
impossible to take the gr remove the

1689
01:15:22,320 --> 01:15:24,880
grass and replant it to look like the

1690
01:15:24,880 --> 01:15:27,679
natural spaces around us. Um those

1691
01:15:27,679 --> 01:15:30,159
spaces have developed over hundreds of

1692
01:15:30,159 --> 01:15:34,080
years and they're basically because uh

1693
01:15:34,080 --> 01:15:36,239
there's no neighboring properties

1694
01:15:36,239 --> 01:15:42,000
blowing you know outside seeds in the park fights with this all the time.

1695
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:44,000
They're they're out there trying to kill

1696
01:15:44,000 --> 01:15:46,800
the invasive species and the town is

1697
01:15:46,800 --> 01:15:48,719
doing the same thing. If you try and

1698
01:15:48,719 --> 01:15:50,400
just

1699
01:15:50,400 --> 01:15:52,480
cut take the grass out, you basically

1700
01:15:52,480 --> 01:15:54,960
have to uh sterilize the land almost and

1701
01:15:54,960 --> 01:15:57,679
then come in and and plant new plants

1702
01:15:57,679 --> 01:15:59,840
and it's extremely cost prohibitive to

1703
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:01,280
do that. Um

1704
01:16:01,280 --> 01:16:02,719
>> I I don't know if I fully agree with

1705
01:16:02,719 --> 01:16:04,239
that. You you rip the grass out, you

1706
01:16:04,239 --> 01:16:07,600
till it, you put in new plants.

1707
01:16:07,600 --> 01:16:08,239
>> Yeah. And then

1708
01:16:08,239 --> 01:16:09,760
>> I can say that that's what I've done.

1709
01:16:09,760 --> 01:16:11,920
the old weeds and the old roots and

1710
01:16:11,920 --> 01:16:13,840
stuff start coming back up and you end

1711
01:16:13,840 --> 01:16:15,840
up with lots of weeds and and it doesn't

1712
01:16:15,840 --> 01:16:18,400
look like the natural spaces around us.

1713
01:16:18,400 --> 01:16:20,320
It can be especially if you're on a if

1714
01:16:20,320 --> 01:16:22,000
you're in a small garden area, you can

1715
01:16:22,000 --> 01:16:24,560
it's it's doable if you're on a large uh

1716
01:16:24,560 --> 01:16:26,000
piece of property. It's very very

1717
01:16:26,000 --> 01:16:27,760
difficult to do that. So

1718
01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:31,120
>> So can that happen anyways without any

1719
01:16:31,120 --> 01:16:33,199
ordinanced

1720
01:16:33,199 --> 01:16:35,040
>> ordinances? Like if they do it, can they

1721
01:16:35,040 --> 01:16:35,520
get

1722
01:16:35,520 --> 01:16:36,480
>> the rebates?

1723
01:16:36,480 --> 01:16:37,440
>> Yeah.

1724
01:16:37,440 --> 01:16:39,600
>> So not at the moment. No, because the

1725
01:16:39,600 --> 01:16:41,920
town would first need to adopt that

1726
01:16:41,920 --> 01:16:43,679
model ordinance from the water

1727
01:16:43,679 --> 01:16:45,920
conservancy district for our town to

1728
01:16:45,920 --> 01:16:47,520
qualify for that.

1729
01:16:47,520 --> 01:16:51,440
>> And um I guess maybe it'd be helpful to

1730
01:16:51,440 --> 01:16:55,520
see the that ordinance, right?

1731
01:16:55,520 --> 01:16:57,760
>> Yeah, we can I I can bring details of

1732
01:16:57,760 --> 01:16:58,480
that

1733
01:16:58,480 --> 01:17:00,560
>> the next time. The the commission

1734
01:17:00,560 --> 01:17:03,120
discussed it a couple of years ago.

1735
01:17:03,120 --> 01:17:05,920
>> Okay. Uh there's so there there's some

1736
01:17:05,920 --> 01:17:08,320
of these standards that we've talked

1737
01:17:08,320 --> 01:17:09,760
about this evening and then there's

1738
01:17:09,760 --> 01:17:12,239
other things like recirculating hot

1739
01:17:12,239 --> 01:17:14,880
water systems for your shower and that

1740
01:17:14,880 --> 01:17:17,199
kind of thing that are are part of it as

1741
01:17:17,199 --> 01:17:22,229
well.

1742
01:17:22,239 --> 01:17:23,920
» I think that would be worthwhile to look

1743
01:17:23,920 --> 01:17:26,800
out and see if it's Yeah.

1744
01:17:26,800 --> 01:17:28,880
The the other question I had is about

1745
01:17:28,880 --> 01:17:32,640
this. Um I feel like there's a conflict

1746
01:17:32,640 --> 01:17:36,480
going on here. So we'd like water

1747
01:17:36,480 --> 01:17:39,360
conserving species, but we also want

1748
01:17:39,360 --> 01:17:42,080
fire resistant species. They typically

1749
01:17:42,080 --> 01:17:43,840
are not the same thing. To be fire

1750
01:17:43,840 --> 01:17:46,320
resistant needs a lot of water contact

1751
01:17:46,320 --> 01:17:48,640
content in the plant, which means you

1752
01:17:48,640 --> 01:17:52,480
have to give it water. If you want low

1753
01:17:52,480 --> 01:17:54,159
drought tolerant, that's going to be a

1754
01:17:54,159 --> 01:17:55,760
drier plant. it's going to be more prone

1755
01:17:55,760 --> 01:17:58,080
to fires. I don't know how to balance

1756
01:17:58,080 --> 01:18:00,239
that.

1757
01:18:00,239 --> 01:18:02,640
>> That's the joy of planning. Lots of

1758
01:18:02,640 --> 01:18:06,800
competing priorities.

1759
01:18:06,800 --> 01:18:08,320
Um,

1760
01:18:08,320 --> 01:18:09,600
so yeah, I don't

1761
01:18:09,600 --> 01:18:11,920
>> right now I'm I'm leaning toward fire

1762
01:18:11,920 --> 01:18:13,440
resistant,

1763
01:18:13,440 --> 01:18:16,080
but that is not going to be good for

1764
01:18:16,080 --> 01:18:17,600
>> I mean there's things you can do to be

1765
01:18:17,600 --> 01:18:19,199
better with water, you know, drip system

1766
01:18:19,199 --> 01:18:22,320
and things like that. I think there are

1767
01:18:22,320 --> 01:18:24,960
a number of options when it comes to

1768
01:18:24,960 --> 01:18:29,920
choosing plants like cactuses or

1769
01:18:29,920 --> 01:18:30,880
um

1770
01:18:30,880 --> 01:18:33,120
>> okay I need a screen because I want to

1771
01:18:33,120 --> 01:18:35,440
get rid of some plants some what are

1772
01:18:35,440 --> 01:18:37,440
they tumeric turmeric or whatever they

1773
01:18:37,440 --> 01:18:39,679
are but I need to replace them with a

1774
01:18:39,679 --> 01:18:41,120
screen so that's not going to be a

1775
01:18:41,120 --> 01:18:43,280
cactus

1776
01:18:43,280 --> 01:18:45,120
>> I don't know all the plant names but I

1777
01:18:45,120 --> 01:18:47,120
know that there there are some that are

1778
01:18:47,120 --> 01:18:48,400
drought

1779
01:18:48,400 --> 01:18:51,040
>> drought tolerant And

1780
01:18:51,040 --> 01:18:53,840
um I know we mostly what we planted

1781
01:18:53,840 --> 01:18:58,239
around our house are drought tolerant.

1782
01:18:58,239 --> 01:19:02,000
Um but they're not like black brush.

1783
01:19:02,000 --> 01:19:04,239
They're not flammable like that. They

1784
01:19:04,239 --> 01:19:07,679
have green leaves and flowers and um but

1785
01:19:07,679 --> 01:19:10,800
they take very little water. So I I

1786
01:19:10,800 --> 01:19:12,480
don't know if there's a lot, but I know

1787
01:19:12,480 --> 01:19:16,080
that there are a number of choices when

1788
01:19:16,080 --> 01:19:18,480
it comes to landscaping like that.

1789
01:19:18,480 --> 01:19:20,400
succulents and those sorts of plants.

1790
01:19:20,400 --> 01:19:23,440
>> Yeah. And even some of the grasses

1791
01:19:23,440 --> 01:19:25,360
um they don't take a lot of water and

1792
01:19:25,360 --> 01:19:28,880
they stay green like the taller grasses

1793
01:19:28,880 --> 01:19:31,600
and they're not again not flammable like

1794
01:19:31,600 --> 01:19:34,400
brush would be

1795
01:19:34,400 --> 01:19:37,360
>> or or junipers.

1796
01:19:37,360 --> 01:19:39,840
>> Rich in in for your specific instance a

1797
01:19:39,840 --> 01:19:41,440
desert willow would be a fantastic

1798
01:19:41,440 --> 01:19:44,320
choice because it has the similar

1799
01:19:44,320 --> 01:19:46,239
screening that your tamarisk do

1800
01:19:46,239 --> 01:19:48,719
currently. It uses much less water and

1801
01:19:48,719 --> 01:19:52,400
it is um not it's it's fire resistant.

1802
01:19:52,400 --> 01:19:53,840
It's not a it's not a combustible

1803
01:19:53,840 --> 01:19:56,159
species. So for your specific location,

1804
01:19:56,159 --> 01:19:57,520
you could you could investigate the

1805
01:19:57,520 --> 01:19:59,760
desert willow.

1806
01:19:59,760 --> 01:20:03,199
Um okay. See, there's always trade-offs.

1807
01:20:03,199 --> 01:20:05,120
So the desert willow may work, it may

1808
01:20:05,120 --> 01:20:07,120
not. There may be things, but the my

1809
01:20:07,120 --> 01:20:09,120
point is is there seem to be this

1810
01:20:09,120 --> 01:20:12,320
conflict. You know, you can't find the

1811
01:20:12,320 --> 01:20:13,679
perfect you might not be able to find

1812
01:20:13,679 --> 01:20:15,600
the perfect plant to do what you need to

1813
01:20:15,600 --> 01:20:18,470
do.

1814
01:20:18,480 --> 01:20:20,640
So when it says you know some things

1815
01:20:20,640 --> 01:20:24,239
were what does it mean to say required

1816
01:20:24,239 --> 01:20:26,960
to be water conserving what does that

1817
01:20:26,960 --> 01:20:30,709
really mean?

1818
01:20:30,719 --> 01:20:34,960
So that this these this these bullet

1819
01:20:34,960 --> 01:20:37,760
points are already actually in our code.

1820
01:20:37,760 --> 01:20:42,000
Um, and so we we have a list of plants

1821
01:20:42,000 --> 01:20:46,159
um that are that are water conserving.

1822
01:20:46,159 --> 01:20:49,360
Um, if people want to use other plants

1823
01:20:49,360 --> 01:20:52,400
um, you know, from a staff perspective,

1824
01:20:52,400 --> 01:20:54,400
we do a little bit of research. You

1825
01:20:54,400 --> 01:20:56,320
know, we're not botists, but we do a

1826
01:20:56,320 --> 01:20:57,920
little bit of research to make sure that

1827
01:20:57,920 --> 01:21:02,640
they're water conserving. And that's kind of you know we do our best

1828
01:21:02,640 --> 01:21:10,870
to to make sure that that we apply that.

1829
01:21:10,880 --> 01:21:12,880
Yeah. So water conserving usually more

1830
01:21:12,880 --> 01:21:14,560
fire

1831
01:21:14,560 --> 01:21:17,760
prone unless you have very limited

1832
01:21:17,760 --> 01:21:22,159
selection the overlap of firerone and

1833
01:21:22,159 --> 01:21:24,239
water conserving the list.

1834
01:21:24,239 --> 01:21:30,070
>> I don't know if that list really exists.

1835
01:21:30,080 --> 01:21:33,600
Sorry. The the approved plant list,

1836
01:21:33,600 --> 01:21:35,679
there's a concern that they're all

1837
01:21:35,679 --> 01:21:37,120
flammable. Is that your

1838
01:21:37,120 --> 01:21:39,280
>> Yeah. Are they all

1839
01:21:39,280 --> 01:21:41,520
>> I I don't know that there's necessarily

1840
01:21:41,520 --> 01:21:44,480
as big of a

1841
01:21:44,480 --> 01:21:47,440
either or. I I think there are plants

1842
01:21:47,440 --> 01:21:49,199
that are drought tolerant that aren't

1843
01:21:49,199 --> 01:21:53,360
necessarily super flammable. Um, that's

1844
01:21:53,360 --> 01:21:57,920
that would be my [snorts] understanding that it it

1845
01:21:57,920 --> 01:22:00,159
doesn't necessarily have to be a black

1846
01:22:00,159 --> 01:22:03,120
or white tradeoff.

1847
01:22:03,120 --> 01:22:04,880
I know when the fire chief came to our

1848
01:22:04,880 --> 01:22:06,719
house, we have a lot of variety of

1849
01:22:06,719 --> 01:22:09,840
plants and he flat out told us that the

1850
01:22:09,840 --> 01:22:13,360
main concern was clearing out the brush

1851
01:22:13,360 --> 01:22:15,360
and and

1852
01:22:15,360 --> 01:22:18,719
um limiting or cutting up the junipers.

1853
01:22:18,719 --> 01:22:20,800
>> Yeah. Beyond that, he was pointing to

1854
01:22:20,800 --> 01:22:22,560
other lots of plants saying, "Not

1855
01:22:22,560 --> 01:22:24,000
worried about that. Not worried about

1856
01:22:24,000 --> 01:22:27,520
that." And it it was quite a few plants,

1857
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:31,430
different species.

1858
01:22:31,440 --> 01:22:33,520
But I hear you too. There is definitely

1859
01:22:33,520 --> 01:22:35,760
a conflict going on too with some plants

1860
01:22:35,760 --> 01:22:39,600
that do take a lot of water and

1861
01:22:39,600 --> 01:22:44,950
um or not and they're flammable.

1862
01:22:44,960 --> 01:22:48,320
I'm wondering at this point if we should

1863
01:22:48,320 --> 01:22:51,040
like so we have asked for more

1864
01:22:51,040 --> 01:22:53,920
information on the turf

1865
01:22:53,920 --> 01:22:56,480
um and some information

1866
01:22:56,480 --> 01:23:01,440
about um the model of the regulations

1867
01:23:01,440 --> 01:23:03,520
for watering.

1868
01:23:03,520 --> 01:23:06,800
Um, if we want to talk about just some

1869
01:23:06,800 --> 01:23:10,080
of these other potential

1870
01:23:10,080 --> 01:23:14,560
um ideas, limiting grass and lawn areas,

1871
01:23:14,560 --> 01:23:17,520
uh, restricting water features

1872
01:23:17,520 --> 01:23:20,080
and time of day. Does anybody have any

1873
01:23:20,080 --> 01:23:22,159
thoughts on

1874
01:23:22,159 --> 01:23:24,560
those specifically? Any of them? Well,

1875
01:23:24,560 --> 01:23:27,760
the I think I like um

1876
01:23:27,760 --> 01:23:33,199
Nile's idea that we maybe focus on for now we focus on the commercial areas

1877
01:23:33,199 --> 01:23:38,719
because it probably bigger payoff and less complexity in terms of the open

1878
01:23:38,719 --> 01:23:39,280
spaces.

1879
01:23:39,280 --> 01:23:41,840
>> Yeah. No, I agree. I'm just as far as

1880
01:23:41,840 --> 01:23:43,760
>> because if you like grass areas for

1881
01:23:43,760 --> 01:23:44,639
commercial

1882
01:23:44,639 --> 01:23:46,639
>> Well, if you look at if you look at the

1883
01:23:46,639 --> 01:23:49,199
open spaces, those are grass areas.

1884
01:23:49,199 --> 01:23:51,440
>> They're also regulated in terms of time

1885
01:23:51,440 --> 01:23:52,159
of day.

1886
01:23:52,159 --> 01:23:54,320
>> But I'm just saying like if we What

1887
01:23:54,320 --> 01:23:56,880
about for commercial

1888
01:23:56,880 --> 01:23:58,960
limiting grass and lawn areas? What

1889
01:23:58,960 --> 01:23:59,920
would that look like?

1890
01:23:59,920 --> 01:24:03,280
>> Well, there's going to be uh for for new

1891
01:24:03,280 --> 01:24:06,159
com I mean and you know I think one of

1892
01:24:06,159 --> 01:24:09,199
the things that have to be careful of is

1893
01:24:09,199 --> 01:24:11,280
you know this is talking about what's

1894
01:24:11,280 --> 01:24:12,639
going to happen in the future as opposed

1895
01:24:12,639 --> 01:24:14,880
to what's now. So people that have large

1896
01:24:14,880 --> 01:24:17,440
grass areas now are probably not going

1897
01:24:17,440 --> 01:24:19,920
to be necessarily subject to this but

1898
01:24:19,920 --> 01:24:21,679
people that are going to make changes

1899
01:24:21,679 --> 01:24:24,639
for the future would be. So um we want

1900
01:24:24,639 --> 01:24:27,600
we don't want to dissuade desirable

1901
01:24:27,600 --> 01:24:29,600
looking properties. So we have to be

1902
01:24:29,600 --> 01:24:31,280
careful in that regard. But we've got a

1903
01:24:31,280 --> 01:24:34,159
more we have more flexibility in in uh

1904
01:24:34,159 --> 01:24:35,360
looking at that. So for commercial

1905
01:24:35,360 --> 01:24:38,719
properties is probably uh you know if we

1906
01:24:38,719 --> 01:24:40,239
focus on that and try and figure out a

1907
01:24:40,239 --> 01:24:41,920
way to make sense out of that that might

1908
01:24:41,920 --> 01:24:44,400
be real helpful and we and we probably

1909
01:24:44,400 --> 01:24:46,080
will learn some things in that process.

1910
01:24:46,080 --> 01:24:49,040
So because what what I think in doing

1911
01:24:49,040 --> 01:24:50,560
that what what we should do is look at

1912
01:24:50,560 --> 01:24:53,679
what the existing commercial property

1913
01:24:53,679 --> 01:24:56,000
in in some you know examples are and try

1914
01:24:56,000 --> 01:24:59,199
and evaluate are we is that something we

1915
01:24:59,199 --> 01:25:00,960
want to see in the town and if it is

1916
01:25:00,960 --> 01:25:02,239
something we want to see then how are we

1917
01:25:02,239 --> 01:25:04,400
going to craft the code to make that

1918
01:25:04,400 --> 01:25:07,199
happen again in the future as opposed to

1919
01:25:07,199 --> 01:25:09,280
you know if it's something we don't want

1920
01:25:09,280 --> 01:25:10,880
we can dissuade that so we're not going

1921
01:25:10,880 --> 01:25:12,560
to get that but we want to encourage

1922
01:25:12,560 --> 01:25:13,920
something that's going to be more that

1923
01:25:13,920 --> 01:25:16,000
is going to be beneficial and meet the

1924
01:25:16,000 --> 01:25:16,880
requirements. So,

1925
01:25:16,880 --> 01:25:18,320
>> so I guess what I'm wondering at this

1926
01:25:18,320 --> 01:25:20,320
point is what is what is it that we need

1927
01:25:20,320 --> 01:25:22,800
to be considering and what do we need

1928
01:25:22,800 --> 01:25:26,960
what information do we need for the to

1929
01:25:26,960 --> 01:25:30,400
talk about those considerations?

1930
01:25:30,400 --> 01:25:32,800
I think it I think it's a difficult

1931
01:25:32,800 --> 01:25:36,239
question because if you look at um you

1932
01:25:36,239 --> 01:25:38,320
know I don't remember where it says it

1933
01:25:38,320 --> 01:25:41,600
but you know when I look at um

1934
01:25:41,600 --> 01:25:45,920
you know that list uh well for back up

1935
01:25:45,920 --> 01:25:48,560
above the first list says irrigation

1936
01:25:48,560 --> 01:25:50,080
systems must be designed to water

1937
01:25:50,080 --> 01:25:53,760
efficiently and over avoid overspray and

1938
01:25:53,760 --> 01:25:57,199
overflow. um

1939
01:25:57,199 --> 01:25:59,760
how how do we define what's watering

1940
01:25:59,760 --> 01:26:01,840
efficiently? Because the code doesn't

1941
01:26:01,840 --> 01:26:03,440
tell you what watering efficiently

1942
01:26:03,440 --> 01:26:05,840
means. Um you know, somebody could

1943
01:26:05,840 --> 01:26:07,360
interpret that to say, "Well, I dumped a

1944
01:26:07,360 --> 01:26:08,560
lot of water on my grass and it's

1945
01:26:08,560 --> 01:26:09,840
growing really good." So that's pretty

1946
01:26:09,840 --> 01:26:11,440
efficient. You know,

1947
01:26:11,440 --> 01:26:12,320
>> other people are probably going to

1948
01:26:12,320 --> 01:26:13,440
interpret that and the town probably

1949
01:26:13,440 --> 01:26:15,040
interprets that to say, "Well, use less

1950
01:26:15,040 --> 01:26:16,320
water doing that and see if you can get

1951
01:26:16,320 --> 01:26:18,480
it to look just as well." Um

1952
01:26:18,480 --> 01:26:19,840
>> sir, do you think that needs to be

1953
01:26:19,840 --> 01:26:24,239
changed? Well, I you know, I I think um

1954
01:26:24,239 --> 01:26:27,600
the way it's written right now probably

1955
01:26:27,600 --> 01:26:29,920
isn't sufficient for us to regulate very

1956
01:26:29,920 --> 01:26:32,719
well. Uh maybe maybe you've been doing

1957
01:26:32,719 --> 01:26:36,400
that uh or trying to do that, but when I

1958
01:26:36,400 --> 01:26:37,679
look at it, you know, that's the

1959
01:26:37,679 --> 01:26:39,679
statement down the last bullet on the

1960
01:26:39,679 --> 01:26:43,040
screen up there. Um that's pretty much

1961
01:26:43,040 --> 01:26:47,189
straight out of 1089

1962
01:26:47,199 --> 01:26:50,400
and that's so that's the code. So, how

1963
01:26:50,400 --> 01:26:52,159
do you how do you interpret that when

1964
01:26:52,159 --> 01:26:53,440
somebody comes and says, "This is what

1965
01:26:53,440 --> 01:26:56,639
my system's going to look like."

1966
01:26:56,639 --> 01:26:59,120
>> Yeah, it's a good point. It's it's maybe

1967
01:26:59,120 --> 01:27:00,960
not super clear and it's something that

1968
01:27:00,960 --> 01:27:04,719
we could look at. Um,

1969
01:27:04,719 --> 01:27:06,800
>> and maybe that's part of what we do if

1970
01:27:06,800 --> 01:27:08,560
we're looking at at the commercial

1971
01:27:08,560 --> 01:27:10,159
things and say, "Okay, let's let's take

1972
01:27:10,159 --> 01:27:12,320
a look at what that means, you know,

1973
01:27:12,320 --> 01:27:14,800
because it's it is open to some

1974
01:27:14,800 --> 01:27:16,639
interpretation. So if we can look at a

1975
01:27:16,639 --> 01:27:18,800
you know what examples of efficient

1976
01:27:18,800 --> 01:27:20,960
watering systems are and say okay this

1977
01:27:20,960 --> 01:27:23,440
is a good way to do this and we want to

1978
01:27:23,440 --> 01:27:26,480
encourage that much like you know uh

1979
01:27:26,480 --> 01:27:28,480
recirculating water systems where you

1980
01:27:28,480 --> 01:27:31,840
you're reusing this the hot water um is

1981
01:27:31,840 --> 01:27:34,639
beneficial. So there's probably ways to

1982
01:27:34,639 --> 01:27:37,120
do that.

1983
01:27:37,120 --> 01:27:39,920
If you if you talk to

1984
01:27:39,920 --> 01:27:42,239
um

1985
01:27:42,239 --> 01:27:45,040
agricultural people, farmers in

1986
01:27:45,040 --> 01:27:47,760
particular, you know, they have

1987
01:27:47,760 --> 01:27:51,360
developed ways to water very efficiently

1988
01:27:51,360 --> 01:27:54,480
because it's economically beneficial to

1989
01:27:54,480 --> 01:27:56,085
>> Yeah.

1990
01:27:56,085 --> 01:27:59,360
[snorts] So, not to say that those, you

1991
01:27:59,360 --> 01:28:02,080
know, those methods apply necessarily in

1992
01:28:02,080 --> 01:28:05,280
some of the, you know, the places in the

1993
01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:08,080
commercial districts, but maybe they do.

1994
01:28:08,080 --> 01:28:10,320
>> Yeah, I agree. It would be useful for

1995
01:28:10,320 --> 01:28:13,199
there to be more definition to water

1996
01:28:13,199 --> 01:28:15,520
efficiently and avoid overspray and

1997
01:28:15,520 --> 01:28:18,320
overflow. Is that something staff can

1998
01:28:18,320 --> 01:28:21,040
look at some language for?

1999
01:28:21,040 --> 01:28:23,440
I mean, as I stated before, one of the

2000
01:28:23,440 --> 01:28:26,000
>> one of the things that was most helpful

2001
01:28:26,000 --> 01:28:28,880
when, you know, on the the plot we've

2002
01:28:28,880 --> 01:28:31,040
got down there is, you know, looking at

2003
01:28:31,040 --> 01:28:32,639
and saying, "Hey, you know,

2004
01:28:32,639 --> 01:28:36,159
>> the biggest uh waste of water is because

2005
01:28:36,159 --> 01:28:39,760
the gentleman that we, you know, had

2006
01:28:39,760 --> 01:28:41,600
tasked with turning the water on and

2007
01:28:41,600 --> 01:28:44,159
off, uh, he'd turn it on and then he'd

2008
01:28:44,159 --> 01:28:47,199
go to work in the park and then thinking

2009
01:28:47,199 --> 01:28:49,120
he was going to be back three hours

2010
01:28:49,120 --> 01:28:51,199
later and he could turn it off and he'd

2011
01:28:51,199 --> 01:28:52,800
get caught doing something else in the

2012
01:28:52,800 --> 01:28:55,040
park and then he'd uh forget about it

2013
01:28:55,040 --> 01:28:56,800
and on the way home he'd go, "Oh, the

2014
01:28:56,800 --> 01:28:58,880
water's still running down the street."

2015
01:28:58,880 --> 01:29:00,960
And he'd turn the water off after eight

2016
01:29:00,960 --> 01:29:04,560
or nine or 10 hours possibly. And so

2017
01:29:04,560 --> 01:29:06,000
tremendous amount of water was being

2018
01:29:06,000 --> 01:29:10,470
wasted um

2019
01:29:10,480 --> 01:29:12,719
wasted in

2020
01:29:12,719 --> 01:29:15,440
well

2021
01:29:15,440 --> 01:29:17,360
curious how many use cases are like that

2022
01:29:17,360 --> 01:29:17,760
though.

2023
01:29:17,760 --> 01:29:19,440
>> What's that? Most people have cuz most

2024
01:29:19,440 --> 01:29:21,040
of you drive at 6:00 in the morning. You

2025
01:29:21,040 --> 01:29:22,320
see how the sprinklers on, you know

2026
01:29:22,320 --> 01:29:23,679
they're all on timers.

2027
01:29:23,679 --> 01:29:25,360
>> Not necessarily. You'd be surprised.

2028
01:29:25,360 --> 01:29:31,270
Yeah.

2029
01:29:31,280 --> 01:29:32,639
» Is

2030
01:29:32,639 --> 01:29:34,480
>> I I would say many of them are. I'm

2031
01:29:34,480 --> 01:29:34,800
sure.

2032
01:29:34,800 --> 01:29:37,920
>> Is timing something that's we should

2033
01:29:37,920 --> 01:29:43,120
talk about the regulations as time

2034
01:29:43,120 --> 01:29:44,880
or

2035
01:29:44,880 --> 01:29:47,520
>> Yes. But it again that's complicated

2036
01:29:47,520 --> 01:29:50,960
because um and it and the question uh

2037
01:29:50,960 --> 01:29:53,199
that I would ask there is you know the

2038
01:29:53,199 --> 01:29:55,120
commercial users what type of commercial

2039
01:29:55,120 --> 01:29:57,679
user are they are they a irrigation

2040
01:29:57,679 --> 01:30:00,480
waterhares user are they a town

2041
01:30:00,480 --> 01:30:04,960
secondary irrigation user because the large users based on the size of

2042
01:30:04,960 --> 01:30:07,920
your the pipe that you're using um are

2043
01:30:07,920 --> 01:30:09,280
restricted

2044
01:30:09,280 --> 01:30:11,440
>> uh the big it's called big water users

2045
01:30:11,440 --> 01:30:13,920
if you look at the town schedule um

2046
01:30:13,920 --> 01:30:16,239
they're restricted to only water between

2047
01:30:16,239 --> 01:30:19,679
10:00 a.m. and 6 pm on Thursday and

2048
01:30:19,679 --> 01:30:21,840
Sunday from 10:00 a.m. to Monday at

2049
01:30:21,840 --> 01:30:24,480
10:00 a.m. So, if you took the and I

2050
01:30:24,480 --> 01:30:26,000
kind of pointed that out in the thing,

2051
01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:30,000
if you took the the recommendation on uh

2052
01:30:30,000 --> 01:30:31,440
on this list to say we're going to

2053
01:30:31,440 --> 01:30:33,840
restrict it so you can't water between

2054
01:30:33,840 --> 01:30:37,120
10:00 a.m. and 8:00 pm, um that means

2055
01:30:37,120 --> 01:30:38,639
they can't water on Thursday at all.

2056
01:30:38,639 --> 01:30:41,280
They can only water on part of Sunday

2057
01:30:41,280 --> 01:30:44,080
and early Monday. uh and it reduces

2058
01:30:44,080 --> 01:30:47,679
their their watering schedule down to 14

2059
01:30:47,679 --> 01:30:50,480
hours per week. Um that they're able to

2060
01:30:50,480 --> 01:30:54,159
water on only one day and that's not

2061
01:30:54,159 --> 01:30:56,239
going to be sufficient to maintain a

2062
01:30:56,239 --> 01:30:58,480
pasture of any kind. The grass will die

2063
01:30:58,480 --> 01:31:00,960
after two maybe three days. Even even

2064
01:31:00,960 --> 01:31:02,400
the current schedule where it's

2065
01:31:02,400 --> 01:31:05,040
Thursdays and Sundays, you know, the

2066
01:31:05,040 --> 01:31:07,600
grass is getting pretty scorched looking

2067
01:31:07,600 --> 01:31:10,639
>> out for commercial.

2068
01:31:10,639 --> 01:31:13,520
same same thing because if but again

2069
01:31:13,520 --> 01:31:16,080
that's that goes to the question you

2070
01:31:16,080 --> 01:31:17,440
know the first question you have to ask

2071
01:31:17,440 --> 01:31:19,360
for that is what kind of schedule are

2072
01:31:19,360 --> 01:31:21,120
they on are they subject to those same

2073
01:31:21,120 --> 01:31:24,800
restrictions um and and frankly I don't

2074
01:31:24,800 --> 01:31:27,760
know if that schedule's codified or not

2075
01:31:27,760 --> 01:31:30,159
or if it's just a

2076
01:31:30,159 --> 01:31:32,080
suggestion but

2077
01:31:32,080 --> 01:31:34,480
>> I I think it's a really valid point that

2078
01:31:34,480 --> 01:31:37,440
if we are introducing time of day

2079
01:31:37,440 --> 01:31:39,840
limitations that we need to make sure

2080
01:31:39,840 --> 01:31:41,520
that it lines up properly with the

2081
01:31:41,520 --> 01:31:44,080
irrigation schedules and recognizing

2082
01:31:44,080 --> 01:31:48,239
that that's um there's some complexity

2083
01:31:48,239 --> 01:31:50,320
with that because there's different

2084
01:31:50,320 --> 01:31:59,280
water sources. So um yeah, I think if if you think this is a good idea to

2085
01:31:59,280 --> 01:32:02,639
restrict it by day, we can we can kind

2086
01:32:02,639 --> 01:32:04,400
of dive into that detail and see if

2087
01:32:04,400 --> 01:32:06,239
there's any conclusions

2088
01:32:06,239 --> 01:32:10,000
>> or if not then we won't.

2089
01:32:10,000 --> 01:32:13,199
>> I to me it sounds like

2090
01:32:13,199 --> 01:32:15,199
given what both of you were talking

2091
01:32:15,199 --> 01:32:19,040
about like it may not make sense to put

2092
01:32:19,040 --> 01:32:21,760
to have those restrictions on

2093
01:32:21,760 --> 01:32:26,719
To some extent it does. I mean you'll find that you know generally most

2094
01:32:26,719 --> 01:32:29,040
water conser agencies are trying to get

2095
01:32:29,040 --> 01:32:32,480
you to limit or do your watering hours

2096
01:32:32,480 --> 01:32:34,560
or your watering during hours where it's

2097
01:32:34,560 --> 01:32:36,719
not the middle or the heat of the day

2098
01:32:36,719 --> 01:32:38,320
because a lot of water is at lost to

2099
01:32:38,320 --> 01:32:39,040
evaporation.

2100
01:32:39,040 --> 01:32:41,679
>> But are they already doing that?

2101
01:32:41,679 --> 01:32:43,280
>> They may be or may not. You know that's

2102
01:32:43,280 --> 01:32:44,719
why you're you know your observation

2103
01:32:44,719 --> 01:32:46,239
that said 6 in the morning there

2104
01:32:46,239 --> 01:32:48,000
everybody's watering. There's a reason

2105
01:32:48,000 --> 01:32:49,520
for that is because the water is going

2106
01:32:49,520 --> 01:32:51,120
into the ground as opposed to going into

2107
01:32:51,120 --> 01:32:51,679
the air.

2108
01:32:51,679 --> 01:32:53,120
>> So, I guess that would be good

2109
01:32:53,120 --> 01:32:55,520
information for us to have.

2110
01:32:55,520 --> 01:32:56,960
>> Okay. Well, yeah, we can investigate

2111
01:32:56,960 --> 01:32:58,960
whether there's anything that would make

2112
01:32:58,960 --> 01:32:59,840
sense.

2113
01:32:59,840 --> 01:33:00,239
>> Yeah.

2114
01:33:00,239 --> 01:33:02,480
>> With all of those constraints.

2115
01:33:02,480 --> 01:33:09,030
>> Perfect.

2116
01:33:09,040 --> 01:33:10,639
It would be interesting to know where

2117
01:33:10,639 --> 01:33:13,040
our big water usage is to know what to

2118
01:33:13,040 --> 01:33:14,719
target.

2119
01:33:14,719 --> 01:33:14,880
I'm

2120
01:33:14,880 --> 01:33:17,440
>> sort of lost you on like

2121
01:33:17,440 --> 01:33:19,280
Yeah, we can nickel and dime a lot of

2122
01:33:19,280 --> 01:33:21,440
things, but where where where are we

2123
01:33:21,440 --> 01:33:29,830
really using all our water?

2124
01:33:29,840 --> 01:33:31,600
» Yeah.

2125
01:33:31,600 --> 01:33:33,600
So

2126
01:33:33,600 --> 01:33:36,400
in in as Nile mentioned, this this

2127
01:33:36,400 --> 01:33:39,280
topic's been before the commission a

2128
01:33:39,280 --> 01:33:42,159
year or two ago and and we brought some

2129
01:33:42,159 --> 01:33:44,800
data to the commission about where the

2130
01:33:44,800 --> 01:33:47,040
water was using was being consumed and

2131
01:33:47,040 --> 01:33:49,920
which types of users were consuming the

2132
01:33:49,920 --> 01:33:51,840
most amount of water. We can certainly

2133
01:33:51,840 --> 01:33:56,320
bring that again to you. Um I as Nile

2134
01:33:56,320 --> 01:33:58,239
mentioned at the beginning at the outset

2135
01:33:58,239 --> 01:34:00,080
that's all you know good information to

2136
01:34:00,080 --> 01:34:02,800
have as as Nile mentioned at the outset

2137
01:34:02,800 --> 01:34:06,719
what what we're trying to do here is say

2138
01:34:06,719 --> 01:34:10,239
within the context of the land use arena

2139
01:34:10,239 --> 01:34:11,520
which is what the the planning

2140
01:34:11,520 --> 01:34:13,679
commission does with within the context

2141
01:34:13,679 --> 01:34:16,480
of regulating land use are there things

2142
01:34:16,480 --> 01:34:19,440
that can be done to encourage better use

2143
01:34:19,440 --> 01:34:22,800
of water overall so I'm I'm not sure

2144
01:34:22,800 --> 01:34:24,080
that the commission needs needs to

2145
01:34:24,080 --> 01:34:26,080
really get down into the into the

2146
01:34:26,080 --> 01:34:29,920
nitty-gritty of of looking at this

2147
01:34:29,920 --> 01:34:31,440
particular

2148
01:34:31,440 --> 01:34:33,440
use scenario versus this other

2149
01:34:33,440 --> 01:34:35,199
particular use scenario or this this

2150
01:34:35,199 --> 01:34:37,040
type of user versus this type of user.

2151
01:34:37,040 --> 01:34:39,760
Rather, in general, when we're

2152
01:34:39,760 --> 01:34:44,159
regulating land use, what can we do to

2153
01:34:44,159 --> 01:34:47,120
um encourage better water conservation?

2154
01:34:47,120 --> 01:34:50,800
So, yes, we can get you that that that

2155
01:34:50,800 --> 01:34:53,199
figures, those figures, and I'd

2156
01:34:53,199 --> 01:34:55,520
encourage you to kind of think in

2157
01:34:55,520 --> 01:34:57,600
general terms,

2158
01:34:57,600 --> 01:35:01,040
how how can we do a better job of of

2159
01:35:01,040 --> 01:35:03,120
managing and using our water,

2160
01:35:03,120 --> 01:35:04,560
>> okay? And and I get that and I

2161
01:35:04,560 --> 01:35:05,840
appreciate that and I'm not trying to be

2162
01:35:05,840 --> 01:35:07,360
difficult, but like there's a question

2163
01:35:07,360 --> 01:35:09,199
on fountains

2164
01:35:09,199 --> 01:35:10,800
and I'm sitting here going, geez, how

2165
01:35:10,800 --> 01:35:12,639
many people really have fountains? But

2166
01:35:12,639 --> 01:35:14,480
we can go through a bunch of effort to

2167
01:35:14,480 --> 01:35:15,600
try to figure out how to limit

2168
01:35:15,600 --> 01:35:18,320
fountains. What am I gaining for that?

2169
01:35:18,320 --> 01:35:20,880
Is that is that a big use? And then I

2170
01:35:20,880 --> 01:35:22,080
have to look at well where do I see

2171
01:35:22,080 --> 01:35:25,920
fountains? I see it at a an Airbnb.

2172
01:35:25,920 --> 01:35:27,679
Well, do I want to say that they can't

2173
01:35:27,679 --> 01:35:30,239
have that anymore or new Airbnbs can't

2174
01:35:30,239 --> 01:35:31,920
have a feature like that? New

2175
01:35:31,920 --> 01:35:34,239
businesses. And it's hard to answer that

2176
01:35:34,239 --> 01:35:37,040
question without knowing,

2177
01:35:37,040 --> 01:35:38,800
you know, is that really something

2178
01:35:38,800 --> 01:35:42,870
that's using a lot of water?

2179
01:35:42,880 --> 01:35:44,560
Yeah. So, we are definitely not going to

2180
01:35:44,560 --> 01:35:47,360
be able to get you data on how on on

2181
01:35:47,360 --> 01:35:49,040
water use for fountains in the tank.

2182
01:35:49,040 --> 01:35:51,040
Yeah. We we we do not have that granular

2183
01:35:51,040 --> 01:35:53,280
that that level of of granular data. We

2184
01:35:53,280 --> 01:35:56,000
can get you data on in general what a

2185
01:35:56,000 --> 01:35:58,159
residential connection uses, what a

2186
01:35:58,159 --> 01:36:00,080
commercial connection uses, we we can

2187
01:36:00,080 --> 01:36:02,239
provide you that level of data. If

2188
01:36:02,239 --> 01:36:04,480
you're looking for how much do we lose

2189
01:36:04,480 --> 01:36:06,400
from evaporation from pools, how much

2190
01:36:06,400 --> 01:36:10,719
does a a fountain use, we don't have

2191
01:36:10,719 --> 01:36:14,000
that data and and we can't get it.

2192
01:36:14,000 --> 01:36:16,400
>> Some of some of that stuff is in a

2193
01:36:16,400 --> 01:36:18,480
general sense is available for for

2194
01:36:18,480 --> 01:36:24,560
example evaporation of pool pools. you can that's dependent upon the surface area

2195
01:36:24,560 --> 01:36:27,760
of the pool, the heat or the and the uh

2196
01:36:27,760 --> 01:36:29,360
climate, you know, if it's a drought

2197
01:36:29,360 --> 01:36:32,000
area or humid area, that sort of thing.

2198
01:36:32,000 --> 01:36:34,239
Um, and you know, you can you can figure

2199
01:36:34,239 --> 01:36:36,880
make those calculations and so we can

2200
01:36:36,880 --> 01:36:38,320
the difficulty there would be trying to

2201
01:36:38,320 --> 01:36:39,840
figure out how big are the pools around

2202
01:36:39,840 --> 01:36:41,600
town, you know,

2203
01:36:41,600 --> 01:36:43,760
>> this is a pool, this is a fountain.

2204
01:36:43,760 --> 01:36:45,760
>> That's one of my complaints is we allow

2205
01:36:45,760 --> 01:36:46,560
pools,

2206
01:36:46,560 --> 01:36:47,679
>> but we're going to say you can't have a

2207
01:36:47,679 --> 01:36:49,040
fountain. a pool is going to be a lot

2208
01:36:49,040 --> 01:36:50,000
worse than a fountain.

2209
01:36:50,000 --> 01:36:52,800
>> Yeah. And and and again, I think the in

2210
01:36:52,800 --> 01:36:54,239
general, these are the kinds of

2211
01:36:54,239 --> 01:36:56,239
questions to have for the commission,

2212
01:36:56,239 --> 01:36:58,960
right? Is hey, could we save some water

2213
01:36:58,960 --> 01:37:01,360
if we don't allow fountains? Sure, we

2214
01:37:01,360 --> 01:37:06,639
could. is from from your um uh position

2215
01:37:06,639 --> 01:37:08,719
as as the planners for the town of

2216
01:37:08,719 --> 01:37:11,920
Springdale, is that a is this is the

2217
01:37:11,920 --> 01:37:13,920
potential water savings from not having

2218
01:37:13,920 --> 01:37:16,239
a few fountains

2219
01:37:16,239 --> 01:37:20,480
worth the uh community character impacts

2220
01:37:20,480 --> 01:37:22,400
of not having fountains? Those are the

2221
01:37:22,400 --> 01:37:24,239
kind of decisions that you need to make,

2222
01:37:24,239 --> 01:37:29,910
right? and understanding that that

2223
01:37:29,920 --> 01:37:32,080
the the total impact of of removing all

2224
01:37:32,080 --> 01:37:33,600
fountains in Springdale in the grand

2225
01:37:33,600 --> 01:37:34,960
scheme of things is going to be pretty

2226
01:37:34,960 --> 01:37:36,960
minimal in terms of water conservation

2227
01:37:36,960 --> 01:37:39,280
and also every drop saved is is

2228
01:37:39,280 --> 01:37:40,880
important. Right? So those are the kind

2229
01:37:40,880 --> 01:37:42,239
of questions you that I think are

2230
01:37:42,239 --> 01:37:43,600
important to have and I think you can

2231
01:37:43,600 --> 01:37:46,320
have those questions without real hard

2232
01:37:46,320 --> 01:37:49,600
data on the water use because it's

2233
01:37:49,600 --> 01:37:51,679
either going to be estimates as as Paul

2234
01:37:51,679 --> 01:37:54,080
mentioned um you know using some

2235
01:37:54,080 --> 01:37:57,440
algorithm to to come up with them um and

2236
01:37:57,440 --> 01:37:58,719
we're just not going to get really good

2237
01:37:58,719 --> 01:37:59,920
hard data for you on that.

2238
01:37:59,920 --> 01:38:02,159
>> Yeah. Well, and also maybe we don't it

2239
01:38:02,159 --> 01:38:04,320
doesn't I don't think always have to be

2240
01:38:04,320 --> 01:38:06,800
something that's already a problem but

2241
01:38:06,800 --> 01:38:08,800
avoiding

2242
01:38:08,800 --> 01:38:09,119
>> sure

2243
01:38:09,119 --> 01:38:10,960
>> to happen in like so when it comes to

2244
01:38:10,960 --> 01:38:13,600
the water feature thing maybe it's some

2245
01:38:13,600 --> 01:38:15,119
I don't know what the number is but a

2246
01:38:15,119 --> 01:38:17,920
large amount of water you know many

2247
01:38:17,920 --> 01:38:21,920
gallons that you know a property decides

2248
01:38:21,920 --> 01:38:25,280
to wants to put in like a waterfall with

2249
01:38:25,280 --> 01:38:27,600
a river going down to another waterfall

2250
01:38:27,600 --> 01:38:30,560
that goes into a little fish pond or

2251
01:38:30,560 --> 01:38:32,960
something and that's a a lot of water

2252
01:38:32,960 --> 01:38:36,639
and while we're putting um this added

2253
01:38:36,639 --> 01:38:39,920
language in maybe it makes sense just

2254
01:38:39,920 --> 01:38:41,920
you know for future like that that is

2255
01:38:41,920 --> 01:38:45,199
something that's doesn't make sense and

2256
01:38:45,199 --> 01:38:46,560
you know where we're trying to conserve

2257
01:38:46,560 --> 01:38:47,840
where we can

2258
01:38:47,840 --> 01:38:50,400
>> I mean I think lo Las Vegas is a great

2259
01:38:50,400 --> 01:38:52,400
example of that I mean you've got

2260
01:38:52,400 --> 01:38:54,719
properties there that are

2261
01:38:54,719 --> 01:38:58,880
>> huge users of fountains um in a very

2262
01:38:58,880 --> 01:39:01,040
drought out. Uh, [snorts]

2263
01:39:01,040 --> 01:39:02,639
>> so it could just be simple

2264
01:39:02,639 --> 01:39:03,280
>> area,

2265
01:39:03,280 --> 01:39:05,520
>> no water features

2266
01:39:05,520 --> 01:39:08,960
over 100, I don't know, whatever number.

2267
01:39:08,960 --> 01:39:11,440
>> My problem with that is I'm going to say

2268
01:39:11,440 --> 01:39:12,480
you can't have that, but you're going to

2269
01:39:12,480 --> 01:39:14,000
have that big pool.

2270
01:39:14,000 --> 01:39:17,280
>> Well, I I I think we just put in what

2271
01:39:17,280 --> 01:39:19,119
makes sense to to me. It doesn't make

2272
01:39:19,119 --> 01:39:21,119
sense to tell people they can't have

2273
01:39:21,119 --> 01:39:25,280
pools in this area, but one way we could

2274
01:39:25,280 --> 01:39:29,600
save water is limiting water features.

2275
01:39:29,600 --> 01:39:31,040
Yeah, but they're also limiting their

2276
01:39:31,040 --> 01:39:34,719
rights to have a a water feature.

2277
01:39:34,719 --> 01:39:36,719
If it's really beneficial, I could get

2278
01:39:36,719 --> 01:39:38,320
behind it, but I can't say it's really

2279
01:39:38,320 --> 01:39:39,040
beneficial.

2280
01:39:39,040 --> 01:39:40,880
>> Well, I would say it's everything's a

2281
01:39:40,880 --> 01:39:43,040
balance because that's kind of what the

2282
01:39:43,040 --> 01:39:45,280
code is all about is coming up with the

2283
01:39:45,280 --> 01:39:48,800
best balance of what serves the people

2284
01:39:48,800 --> 01:39:50,880
of the community

2285
01:39:50,880 --> 01:39:53,840
best. And

2286
01:39:53,840 --> 01:39:55,440
>> so, because the fountain looks like it's

2287
01:39:55,440 --> 01:39:56,960
using a lot of water, we're going to

2288
01:39:56,960 --> 01:39:59,440
take it out. Well, I don't know if it is

2289
01:39:59,440 --> 01:40:00,880
using a lot of water. My guess is

2290
01:40:00,880 --> 01:40:05,440
>> we can't we can't find that out easily.

2291
01:40:05,440 --> 01:40:08,080
>> I'm to me it's an an area that you could

2292
01:40:08,080 --> 01:40:10,000
save water that I don't think there

2293
01:40:10,000 --> 01:40:11,520
would be a lot of heartache in the town

2294
01:40:11,520 --> 01:40:14,000
about. I mean, maybe somebody would be

2295
01:40:14,000 --> 01:40:15,600
disappointed that was building

2296
01:40:15,600 --> 01:40:17,199
something. I I just think it's something

2297
01:40:17,199 --> 01:40:20,320
to look at when we're putting water. It

2298
01:40:20,320 --> 01:40:22,560
would be interesting to see. I my

2299
01:40:22,560 --> 01:40:24,239
opinion is that's probably a pretty

2300
01:40:24,239 --> 01:40:27,520
common thing that you see is limited

2301
01:40:27,520 --> 01:40:29,920
water features

2302
01:40:29,920 --> 01:40:34,080
or the amount of water in water features

2303
01:40:34,080 --> 01:40:36,560
in areas that are putting together

2304
01:40:36,560 --> 01:40:48,229
ordinances for conserving water.

2305
01:40:48,239 --> 01:40:51,679
So I think you know

2306
01:40:51,679 --> 01:40:53,920
we can look at that kind those kinds of

2307
01:40:53,920 --> 01:40:55,840
things if it's not something that makes

2308
01:40:55,840 --> 01:40:58,960
sense or there's not a problem so we

2309
01:40:58,960 --> 01:41:03,520
don't feel like we need to address it.

2310
01:41:03,520 --> 01:41:06,719
>> Yeah. I mean I think that's a

2311
01:41:06,719 --> 01:41:08,400
I think that's going to be a hard area

2312
01:41:08,400 --> 01:41:10,320
be for a number of reasons. one, it's

2313
01:41:10,320 --> 01:41:11,920
going to be hard to quantify, but you

2314
01:41:11,920 --> 01:41:15,679
know, but it's also gonna generate a lot

2315
01:41:15,679 --> 01:41:17,280
of

2316
01:41:17,280 --> 01:41:21,760
um emotion,

2317
01:41:21,760 --> 01:41:23,520
>> right? Well, and it could get

2318
01:41:23,520 --> 01:41:26,560
complicated, too.

2319
01:41:26,560 --> 01:41:29,360
>> My pool has a water feature, but it's a

2320
01:41:29,360 --> 01:41:30,880
part of my pool, so

2321
01:41:30,880 --> 01:41:33,840
>> Yeah. So, you got to dig up your pool,

2322
01:41:33,840 --> 01:41:35,840
>> turn it off, you know. I mean, there's

2323
01:41:35,840 --> 01:41:37,679
communities in California that have done

2324
01:41:37,679 --> 01:41:39,440
that sort of thing where basically

2325
01:41:39,440 --> 01:41:41,920
legislate you can't have that anymore.

2326
01:41:41,920 --> 01:41:43,600
It doesn't go over real well, I don't

2327
01:41:43,600 --> 01:41:46,639
think. But, you know, I mean, the parks

2328
01:41:46,639 --> 01:41:48,159
got a whole bunch of water wasting

2329
01:41:48,159 --> 01:41:49,520
features. They had some, you know,

2330
01:41:49,520 --> 01:41:51,760
earlier yesterday or, you know, those

2331
01:41:51,760 --> 01:41:55,119
things called waterfalls. You know, they waste a whole lot of water because

2332
01:41:55,119 --> 01:41:56,719
it all evaporates before it hits the

2333
01:41:56,719 --> 01:41:59,440
ground, you know. So, I don't think

2334
01:41:59,440 --> 01:42:01,760
anybody would want to legislate that,

2335
01:42:01,760 --> 01:42:04,639
though. No.

2336
01:42:04,639 --> 01:42:06,639
What I was looking for is, you know, I

2337
01:42:06,639 --> 01:42:08,800
don't see a big bang for the buck there.

2338
01:42:08,800 --> 01:42:10,239
I do see a bang for the buck, but I

2339
01:42:10,239 --> 01:42:11,679
don't know what to do with it

2340
01:42:11,679 --> 01:42:14,960
>> of trying to maybe change the ordinances

2341
01:42:14,960 --> 01:42:16,480
to

2342
01:42:16,480 --> 01:42:19,280
reduce the amount of um grass to have

2343
01:42:19,280 --> 01:42:22,320
more water resistant

2344
01:42:22,320 --> 01:42:24,960
um landscaping.

2345
01:42:24,960 --> 01:42:27,920
I do see that being a big benefit that's

2346
01:42:27,920 --> 01:42:30,159
worth going after.

2347
01:42:30,159 --> 01:42:31,440
And that's what we're looking for. Which

2348
01:42:31,440 --> 01:42:33,119
one of these have the big which one of

2349
01:42:33,119 --> 01:42:35,199
these should we put time into which

2350
01:42:35,199 --> 01:42:36,719
gives us the biggest benefit?

2351
01:42:36,719 --> 01:42:38,639
>> That's I think that's what we need to

2352
01:42:38,639 --> 01:42:39,119
do, right?

2353
01:42:39,119 --> 01:42:40,719
>> Yeah, I agree.

2354
01:42:40,719 --> 01:42:42,880
>> I mean, figure out a way to get the, you

2355
01:42:42,880 --> 01:42:45,199
know, the people that, you know, turn

2356
01:42:45,199 --> 01:42:47,360
their water on in the morning and don't

2357
01:42:47,360 --> 01:42:49,600
turn off until nighttime because they

2358
01:42:49,600 --> 01:42:52,080
forgot. Figure out a way to help them,

2359
01:42:52,080 --> 01:42:54,239
you know, make do conservation. I don't

2360
01:42:54,239 --> 01:42:56,480
think anybody's going to disagree.

2361
01:42:56,480 --> 01:42:57,760
turn telling somebody that you got to

2362
01:42:57,760 --> 01:42:59,600
turn your fountain off because it use 50

2363
01:42:59,600 --> 01:43:02,000
gallons extra a month is probably not

2364
01:43:02,000 --> 01:43:03,920
worth our time to do it if if we find

2365
01:43:03,920 --> 01:43:06,719
that to be the case. So, and sort the

2366
01:43:06,719 --> 01:43:08,480
hard part is going to be sort of sorting

2367
01:43:08,480 --> 01:43:10,400
through and figuring out what are those,

2368
01:43:10,400 --> 01:43:12,800
you know, low hanging fruit that we can

2369
01:43:12,800 --> 01:43:13,360
attack.

2370
01:43:13,360 --> 01:43:15,119
>> And is there any information that would

2371
01:43:15,119 --> 01:43:18,320
help as in determining

2372
01:43:18,320 --> 01:43:22,719
what that would be? we could follow

2373
01:43:22,719 --> 01:43:26,159
um whatever the 8% of the total lot size

2374
01:43:26,159 --> 01:43:29,920
was. I guess maybe that was St. George.

2375
01:43:29,920 --> 01:43:32,639
>> Uh but it's not is it lot size or the

2376
01:43:32,639 --> 01:43:34,239
required

2377
01:43:34,239 --> 01:43:35,760
um

2378
01:43:35,760 --> 01:43:37,119
landscaping area.

2379
01:43:37,119 --> 01:43:39,440
>> Well, that's a St. George requirement,

2380
01:43:39,440 --> 01:43:40,400
not a spring.

2381
01:43:40,400 --> 01:43:42,159
>> That was an example. So, how how do we

2382
01:43:42,159 --> 01:43:45,600
come up with a number that makes sense?

2383
01:43:45,600 --> 01:43:51,109
>> But, you know, Yeah.

2384
01:43:51,119 --> 01:43:55,199
So I agree that seems like

2385
01:43:55,199 --> 01:43:58,719
an important water conserving effort

2386
01:43:58,719 --> 01:44:02,480
limiting grass and lawn areas.

2387
01:44:02,480 --> 01:44:05,600
>> So yeah, I mean if you've got a 5,000

2388
01:44:05,600 --> 01:44:09,119
square foot lot you building a house on

2389
01:44:09,119 --> 01:44:12,639
you and you can only have 8% of it with

2390
01:44:12,639 --> 01:44:17,119
grass, that's a pretty small lawn.

2391
01:44:17,119 --> 01:44:21,040
We got to be careful those sort of and if you've got a large open space

2392
01:44:21,040 --> 01:44:23,600
that is all grass, how does that factor

2393
01:44:23,600 --> 01:44:26,000
in? If we say, okay, now you can only

2394
01:44:26,000 --> 01:44:28,320
have 8% of that large open space be

2395
01:44:28,320 --> 01:44:31,280
grass. Um I'm not sure what that means

2396
01:44:31,280 --> 01:44:32,560
because I don't know how they're going

2397
01:44:32,560 --> 01:44:34,960
to they're going to stop watering it and

2398
01:44:34,960 --> 01:44:36,800
it's going to turn into weeds. Nobody's

2399
01:44:36,800 --> 01:44:38,080
going to like that. So,

2400
01:44:38,080 --> 01:44:39,600
>> do you know of any information that

2401
01:44:39,600 --> 01:44:42,320
could help us?

2402
01:44:42,320 --> 01:44:44,239
So,

2403
01:44:44,239 --> 01:44:46,080
as far as um

2404
01:44:46,080 --> 01:44:51,360
>> how much grass So, if I could just

2405
01:44:51,360 --> 01:44:53,040
summarize where I I think we're at.

2406
01:44:53,040 --> 01:44:54,320
>> Yes, please. We've been all over the

2407
01:44:54,320 --> 01:44:54,800
map.

2408
01:44:54,800 --> 01:44:56,159
>> No, it's been it's actually been a

2409
01:44:56,159 --> 01:44:59,920
really great conversation. So, um we

2410
01:44:59,920 --> 01:45:01,840
started off talking about artificial

2411
01:45:01,840 --> 01:45:06,639
turf. The general consensus is that we

2412
01:45:06,639 --> 01:45:09,440
should allow it, but we want some

2413
01:45:09,440 --> 01:45:12,159
limitations on that. So, we're going to

2414
01:45:12,159 --> 01:45:15,600
do a little bit of digging into that.

2415
01:45:15,600 --> 01:45:19,109
Um,

2416
01:45:19,119 --> 01:45:23,199
we've decided that for now, as far as

2417
01:45:23,199 --> 01:45:25,679
limiting grass, we're going to focus on

2418
01:45:25,679 --> 01:45:27,840
commercial properties rather than

2419
01:45:27,840 --> 01:45:31,119
residential for now because there's kind

2420
01:45:31,119 --> 01:45:33,600
of bigger problems that could

2421
01:45:33,600 --> 01:45:35,920
potentially arise there.

2422
01:45:35,920 --> 01:45:38,320
Um,

2423
01:45:38,320 --> 01:45:41,679
we're going to look at the WA Washington

2424
01:45:41,679 --> 01:45:44,960
County Water Conservancy District rebate

2425
01:45:44,960 --> 01:45:47,520
program again to to see if that's

2426
01:45:47,520 --> 01:45:50,239
something we want to explore again.

2427
01:45:50,239 --> 01:45:52,880
Um,

2428
01:45:52,880 --> 01:45:55,840
uh, we're going to look at the text

2429
01:45:55,840 --> 01:45:58,480
where it talks about

2430
01:45:58,480 --> 01:46:00,639
irrigation systems being efficient to

2431
01:46:00,639 --> 01:46:02,800
figure out if there's a if that could be

2432
01:46:02,800 --> 01:46:05,119
tightened up in some way.

2433
01:46:05,119 --> 01:46:07,840
Uh we're going to investigate irrigation

2434
01:46:07,840 --> 01:46:10,159
schedules and see if the time of day

2435
01:46:10,159 --> 01:46:13,280
watering restrictions would be feasible

2436
01:46:13,280 --> 01:46:16,159
or worth doing.

2437
01:46:16,159 --> 01:46:18,000
Um

2438
01:46:18,000 --> 01:46:22,080
water features seemed like that was

2439
01:46:22,080 --> 01:46:24,159
maybe something we're not going to look

2440
01:46:24,159 --> 01:46:28,480
at right now. Um and then Okay. And then

2441
01:46:28,480 --> 01:46:31,600
so your your question there about

2442
01:46:31,600 --> 01:46:36,560
the city of St. George uh 8%.

2443
01:46:36,560 --> 01:46:40,400
Um I I would suggest that if we're only

2444
01:46:40,400 --> 01:46:44,639
looking at commercial properties that

2445
01:46:44,639 --> 01:46:46,320
we [snorts]

2446
01:46:46,320 --> 01:46:49,440
the sensible thing might be to only

2447
01:46:49,440 --> 01:46:53,119
allow grass in functional areas and we

2448
01:46:53,119 --> 01:46:55,199
have a definition for that that we can

2449
01:46:55,199 --> 01:46:57,360
work at. So that's you know recreational

2450
01:46:57,360 --> 01:47:01,600
type areas and then we I think the 8% in

2451
01:47:01,600 --> 01:47:06,719
St. George is focused on residential properties in

2452
01:47:06,719 --> 01:47:10,080
recognition that you know it people do

2453
01:47:10,080 --> 01:47:14,480
want a bit of grass. Um I I feel like if we're focusing on commercial

2454
01:47:14,480 --> 01:47:16,800
properties then maybe maybe that

2455
01:47:16,800 --> 01:47:20,480
percentage is not is not actually

2456
01:47:20,480 --> 01:47:23,760
relevant for us. I I could also for the

2457
01:47:23,760 --> 01:47:27,119
next meeting um you know provide some

2458
01:47:27,119 --> 01:47:30,159
examples of water efficient landscaping

2459
01:47:30,159 --> 01:47:32,239
around town just to provide some visuals

2460
01:47:32,239 --> 01:47:34,960
of what things can look like and kind of

2461
01:47:34,960 --> 01:47:37,600
good solutions that if if that would be

2462
01:47:37,600 --> 01:47:39,600
helpful at all.

2463
01:47:39,600 --> 01:47:40,000
>> Yes.

2464
01:47:40,000 --> 01:47:42,000
>> Yeah.

2465
01:47:42,000 --> 01:47:44,960
>> And I agree with the

2466
01:47:44,960 --> 01:47:47,119
functional grass

2467
01:47:47,119 --> 01:47:51,119
and whatever that definition is.

2468
01:47:51,119 --> 01:47:53,360
I'm we don't have any regulations or

2469
01:47:53,360 --> 01:47:58,639
ordinances on watering right now, do we?

2470
01:47:58,639 --> 01:48:01,520
>> On when you can

2471
01:48:01,520 --> 01:48:03,440
or how you can if it's an automated

2472
01:48:03,440 --> 01:48:06,800
system versus a nonuto.

2473
01:48:06,800 --> 01:48:09,119
>> I think there's just the general it

2474
01:48:09,119 --> 01:48:11,360
should be efficient. I I don't know that

2475
01:48:11,360 --> 01:48:19,350
there's anything more than that yet.

2476
01:48:19,360 --> 01:48:20,960
Yeah, I didn't see anything that says it

2477
01:48:20,960 --> 01:48:23,520
needs to be automated either.

2478
01:48:23,520 --> 01:48:24,800
>> That might be something we want to look

2479
01:48:24,800 --> 01:48:26,400
at. You know, if you're going to an

2480
01:48:26,400 --> 01:48:28,320
efficient system would have some sort

2481
01:48:28,320 --> 01:48:29,600
of, you know,

2482
01:48:29,600 --> 01:48:31,199
>> automation,

2483
01:48:31,199 --> 01:48:33,360
>> artificial intelligence for lack of a

2484
01:48:33,360 --> 01:48:34,639
better term associated with it. You

2485
01:48:34,639 --> 01:48:41,109
know, a little timer.

2486
01:48:41,119 --> 01:48:44,320
We do that with lighting, but you know,

2487
01:48:44,320 --> 01:48:46,960
and even that's difficult, but I think

2488
01:48:46,960 --> 01:48:48,719
having in the code would be beneficial

2489
01:48:48,719 --> 01:48:52,310
potentially.

2490
01:48:52,320 --> 01:48:54,800
» Yeah, we can look into that.

2491
01:48:54,800 --> 01:48:57,360
>> And is there any

2492
01:48:57,360 --> 01:48:59,040
So, I'll just give an example. I can go

2493
01:48:59,040 --> 01:49:00,800
by some houses and they have big stakes

2494
01:49:00,800 --> 01:49:03,199
that spray water over the hoses or over

2495
01:49:03,199 --> 01:49:06,159
their plants. Well, I know everyone

2496
01:49:06,159 --> 01:49:08,719
pretty I think anyways that a drip

2497
01:49:08,719 --> 01:49:11,440
system would be more effective.

2498
01:49:11,440 --> 01:49:12,800
But it's hard to make an ordinance

2499
01:49:12,800 --> 01:49:14,320
that's going to require someone to rip

2500
01:49:14,320 --> 01:49:15,840
out what they have and put in a drip

2501
01:49:15,840 --> 01:49:18,639
system. Is there any type of other than

2502
01:49:18,639 --> 01:49:20,880
rebate from Washington County? Is there

2503
01:49:20,880 --> 01:49:25,360
anything else that we can do to promote

2504
01:49:25,360 --> 01:49:27,199
use of, hey, if you go have a drip

2505
01:49:27,199 --> 01:49:28,800
system,

2506
01:49:28,800 --> 01:49:30,239
you get this benefit? But I don't know

2507
01:49:30,239 --> 01:49:31,520
what that is. But I'm trying to figure

2508
01:49:31,520 --> 01:49:34,480
out how to encourage people to do this

2509
01:49:34,480 --> 01:49:36,239
without putting a financial burden on

2510
01:49:36,239 --> 01:49:37,679
them that hey, you have to rip out what

2511
01:49:37,679 --> 01:49:40,719
you have and change it. I'm into I guess

2512
01:49:40,719 --> 01:49:42,639
residential so I apologize but

2513
01:49:42,639 --> 01:49:44,800
>> yeah sure so incentivizing those sorts

2514
01:49:44,800 --> 01:49:51,760
of things. Yeah I think maybe we could uh ponder on some ideas for

2515
01:49:51,760 --> 01:49:54,960
that. I think um

2516
01:49:54,960 --> 01:49:56,719
when we're looking at the details of

2517
01:49:56,719 --> 01:49:59,760
irrigation systems I'm in the back of my

2518
01:49:59,760 --> 01:50:02,639
mind I'm thinking kind of at plan review

2519
01:50:02,639 --> 01:50:06,159
stage that level of detail

2520
01:50:06,159 --> 01:50:09,360
may be quite challenging. Um, so that

2521
01:50:09,360 --> 01:50:12,480
just the practicality of of that may be

2522
01:50:12,480 --> 01:50:15,600
a little bit challenging, but I yeah, I

2523
01:50:15,600 --> 01:50:17,760
think that's I like the idea of trying

2524
01:50:17,760 --> 01:50:19,679
to incentivize

2525
01:50:19,679 --> 01:50:21,520
drip systems and those sorts of things

2526
01:50:21,520 --> 01:50:23,600
that are going to be more efficient. And

2527
01:50:23,600 --> 01:50:26,000
>> I don't know for businesses if because I

2528
01:50:26,000 --> 01:50:27,360
always think residential I have a hard

2529
01:50:27,360 --> 01:50:30,000
time switching to business. Maybe for

2530
01:50:30,000 --> 01:50:32,560
businesses that are remodeling,

2531
01:50:32,560 --> 01:50:36,480
can we put requirements like that in?

2532
01:50:36,480 --> 01:50:38,159
Well, the other the other consideration

2533
01:50:38,159 --> 01:50:40,719
too is that um

2534
01:50:40,719 --> 01:50:42,000
different plants have different

2535
01:50:42,000 --> 01:50:44,000
requirement or different methods of

2536
01:50:44,000 --> 01:50:46,480
taking the water in. So in some in some

2537
01:50:46,480 --> 01:50:48,639
cases the drip systems are very

2538
01:50:48,639 --> 01:50:50,560
efficient and effective. Other types of

2539
01:50:50,560 --> 01:50:52,800
plants you need to spray over a larger

2540
01:50:52,800 --> 01:50:54,880
area because the root extends out. You

2541
01:50:54,880 --> 01:50:56,719
need to get you can't just drip in one

2542
01:50:56,719 --> 01:50:58,960
spot and have the plant absorb the water

2543
01:50:58,960 --> 01:51:00,080
as efficiently. So

2544
01:51:00,080 --> 01:51:02,000
>> well like grass for instance. Well,

2545
01:51:02,000 --> 01:51:03,520
grass is one example, but there's, you

2546
01:51:03,520 --> 01:51:05,600
know, like citrus trees, for example,

2547
01:51:05,600 --> 01:51:07,520
typically they'll have emitters that are

2548
01:51:07,520 --> 01:51:08,880
near the trunk of the tree that spray

2549
01:51:08,880 --> 01:51:10,719
outwards to a larger area because that's

2550
01:51:10,719 --> 01:51:11,360
where

2551
01:51:11,360 --> 01:51:13,280
>> they have rings and that, but again, all

2552
01:51:13,280 --> 01:51:14,880
this costs money, too. And

2553
01:51:14,880 --> 01:51:15,600
>> what's that?

2554
01:51:15,600 --> 01:51:17,199
>> I said there are solutions because they

2555
01:51:17,199 --> 01:51:19,280
have like drip holes that you can put in

2556
01:51:19,280 --> 01:51:21,040
a ring around. But you but you can't

2557
01:51:21,040 --> 01:51:22,239
what you what you don't want to do is

2558
01:51:22,239 --> 01:51:23,360
write something that says you can only

2559
01:51:23,360 --> 01:51:26,000
have a drip system because the strict

2560
01:51:26,000 --> 01:51:27,840
interpretation of that says oh I can't

2561
01:51:27,840 --> 01:51:29,199
have a citrus tree because it's not

2562
01:51:29,199 --> 01:51:31,280
going to it's not going to survive very

2563
01:51:31,280 --> 01:51:34,239
well especially in this climate. So not

2564
01:51:34,239 --> 01:51:36,960
that there's well there are some around

2565
01:51:36,960 --> 01:51:38,320
there's apple trees too. I don't know

2566
01:51:38,320 --> 01:51:40,719
how the apple trees are watered. It'd be

2567
01:51:40,719 --> 01:51:44,159
interesting to find out.

2568
01:51:44,159 --> 01:51:47,599
They're probably on some sort of area

2569
01:51:47,599 --> 01:51:51,920
spray, but in the root area,

2570
01:51:51,920 --> 01:51:54,480
but that can be defined as a as a low

2571
01:51:54,480 --> 01:51:56,159
pressure

2572
01:51:56,159 --> 01:52:00,000
uh system that you know like that uses

2573
01:52:00,000 --> 01:52:03,440
drip type emitter, small small heads,

2574
01:52:03,440 --> 01:52:05,280
small emitters as opposed to ones that

2575
01:52:05,280 --> 01:52:10,070
spray over large vast areas.

2576
01:52:10,080 --> 01:52:12,000
Maybe to the point we can start thinking

2577
01:52:12,000 --> 01:52:15,280
of some of these for the commercial,

2578
01:52:15,280 --> 01:52:17,040
see how they go over before we start

2579
01:52:17,040 --> 01:52:19,199
thinking we're going to put this to the

2580
01:52:19,199 --> 01:52:20,800
residential areas.

2581
01:52:20,800 --> 01:52:22,000
>> I think that was probably took me a

2582
01:52:22,000 --> 01:52:24,800
while to get that.

2583
01:52:24,800 --> 01:52:27,679
>> Yeah, I think we can look at the at how

2584
01:52:27,679 --> 01:52:30,880
we can if there's ways we can require

2585
01:52:30,880 --> 01:52:35,199
irrigation systems to be more water-wise

2586
01:52:35,199 --> 01:52:48,229
and can see how practical that might be.

2587
01:52:48,239 --> 01:52:55,510
thoughts.

2588
01:52:55,520 --> 01:52:57,280
Do you feel like you have enough to go

2589
01:52:57,280 --> 01:52:59,679
on to bring back to us?

2590
01:52:59,679 --> 01:53:01,119
>> Yeah, thank you. That was really

2591
01:53:01,119 --> 01:53:02,159
helpful.

2592
01:53:02,159 --> 01:53:02,960
>> Yeah, thank you.

2593
01:53:02,960 --> 01:53:04,080
>> That's good because I thought we were

2594
01:53:04,080 --> 01:53:07,188
just more confusing than else.

2595
01:53:07,188 --> 01:53:09,270
>> [laughter]

2596
01:53:09,280 --> 01:53:12,080
» It's all good. It's good to hear all the

2597
01:53:12,080 --> 01:53:15,750
different ideas.

2598
01:53:15,760 --> 01:53:18,159
» No more discussion. Is there a motion to

2599
01:53:18,159 --> 01:53:20,159
adjourn?

2600
01:53:20,159 --> 01:53:22,000
>> Motion to adjourn. Let me

2601
01:53:22,000 --> 01:53:23,199
>> second.

2602
01:53:23,199 --> 01:53:26,960
>> Motion by Paul, second I motion by Rich,

2603
01:53:26,960 --> 01:53:29,119
second by Paul. All in favor?

2604
01:53:29,119 --> 01:53:29,840
>> Rich I.

2605
01:53:29,840 --> 01:53:30,960
>> Jennifer I.

2606
01:53:30,960 --> 01:53:33,760
>> All I k I.

2607
01:53:33,760 --> 01:53:38,390
>> Meeting is adjourned.

2608
01:53:38,400 --> 01:53:40,960
Um, hey, just a PSA

2609
01:53:40,960 --> 01:53:44,320
for you all.