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This is the convening here of the February 7th, 2024 meeting of the Planning Commission in St. Louis Park. We will begin with roll call. Jim Benike. Here, Katie Merton. Here, Matt Eckholm. Here, Mia Devaccia. Here, Tom Weber. Here, Jan Youngquest. Next item for the agenda is the approval of minutes. We are approving the minutes from two previous meetings.

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one on December 6th and the other on December 20th. Do we have any discussion, edits, or motions?

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So moved. Seconded.

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Have a motion and a second. All those in favor of approving the minutes say aye.

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Aye. Aye.

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All opposed. That carries. Next up on the agenda is our one public hearing for the evening and I just

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saw some folks coming in and just as you're coming in if you are interested in speaking at the hearing,

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there are some blue cards at that back table there with some pens feel free to fill out your name

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and all the information on there and bring it up either to Gary and Sean here and we will

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put you into the the speaking order as well. So for the folks here in the room I just want to let

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you know what we're going to do is first of all hear about the proposal from city staff then the

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commission is going to ask really clarifying questions details here and there and then we will open it up

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in the public hearing for public comments so again if you are interested in

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speaking fill out one of these blue cards and and we'll go from there so at

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that at that point this is a rezoning preliminary final plat and

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conditional use permit for 6013 and 6019 Cedar Lake Road and I will turn it over to

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city staff thank you chair members of the commission my name is Gary Morrison I'm

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The zoning administrator for the city, and I'll be presenting the applications for you tonight.

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The request that's before you is brought submitted to the city by Joshua Aaron, who's owner of the property.

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The properties are located at 6013 and 6019, Cedar Lake Road, and

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the applications before each other are rezoning of these properties from our three two family residents to our four multiple family residents.

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A preliminary and final plat of the combination of the two properties.

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The plan will be known as Cedar Heights Estates, and then a condition to use permit to construct

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a multiple family residence.

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The properties are identified on the aerial photo on the screen.

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There are four single family homes on the south side of Cedar Lake Road.

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The subject property is the two easterly property, properties.

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It's adjacent to the city's municipal water facility, and then of course the remaining two

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single family homes to the west.

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It backs up to a wetland, that's approximately 40 acres in an area, and of course single

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family homes to the north, and an office development to the east.

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The property again is on south side of Cedalic Road between Blackstone and Alabama, just west

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of the Zarathon roundabout.

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Tascal was pictured at the top right corner of the screen.

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Taking a quick look at the properties, we see that they are combined, 1.69 acres total,

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However, there's about 1.27 acres of dry land.

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The remaining land is wetland, which makes up

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the southerly quarter of the property.

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A lot combined is 175 feet wide.

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Approximately 430 feet deep, and then 310 feet

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from the front property line to the wetland edge.

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The elevation change is approximately 20 feet.

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Most of that elevation change happens just about

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as you get to the white line. So the majority of the property is relatively flat until you get to about the tree lines

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then it drops substantially.

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The proposal is to build a three-story apartment building.

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It's approximately 36 feet 10 inches tall. There is a three-foot pair put on top of it which raises it to about 39 feet 10 inches.

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Maximum height allowed for the gestorist is 40 feet.

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The apartment building would contain 36 units,

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The table that's on the screen which is also included in your packet shows the breakdown of the units

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Most of the units are one bedroom or studios

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There are nine two bedrooms or two bedrooms plus done combination

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Taking a quick look at the site plan. Just kind of give a quick rundown of it

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Cedar Lake Road is on the north part of the property. Of course, the wetland is highlighted in blue on the south end of the property

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Starting a Cedar Lake road. We have

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On street parking spaces that exist today, they will be reshaped and relocated, so they will be maintained.

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The horseshoe driveway with two access points, one in the west, one to the east. Within the horseshoe, we have four additional parking spaces up by the apartment building. One of those will be handicapped.

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A driveway access will run down the west property line to provide access to the undergone parking, and then three parking stalls at the very end of that driveway.

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The ground floor units will have direct access outside with paddios, interconnected with sidewalks on both sides of the building.

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The structure parking is below the structure, of course, and most of it is underground, as the north part is primarily rectangular in shape.

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However, the building itself, the apartment building that is visible above that parking structure, is relatively straight-long-long.

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the light not straight wall along the east side, but on the west side we have some building

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wall deviations creates some elevation and further distance from the west property

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lines. Some amenity space will be provided in the space created by the apartment building

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being moved a little bit more to the east and then of course the park structure below it

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in this area.

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Talking about the yards a little bit, the front yard requirement for this particular building

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is 36.9 feet. They're providing 63 and a half feet and if we look at how that relates to the

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buildings on either side, we have the two single family homes to the west and the city structure

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to the east, we see it is set back a little further. That is to make room for the horseshoe

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driveway in the parking but also some additional landscape to enhance the presence on the street.

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The rear setback is 25 feet minimum and they're providing a 180 feet to the rear property line

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and then 65 feet to the wetland.

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Side setbacks are a little more complicated to calculate.

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I made an attempt at explaining that in the packets before you.

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I won't go into that detail here today,

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although I'm going to say that the west side,

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the setbacks required minimum setbacks range from 18.5 feet

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to 38.5 feet.

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Since we are looking at one extended wall,

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which is the park structure,

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the entire park structure has to meet the maximum setback

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a 38.5 feet, which it does. It's set at 46 feet. And of course we have additional setback

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for that visible portion of the building above the ground, which shows ranges from 64 feet to 77 feet

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from that side property line. And then on the east side, we have a required setback,

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range from 15 to 35 feet, and the building is setback from 28 to 36 feet, so it meets the side

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setbacks are also. The building was intentionally positioned to get closer and meet the minimum setbacks

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on the east side so that the majority space could be preserved on the west side to provide more

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distance to the single family home to the west and of course to provide room for the driveway access

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and amenity space over there too.

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The minimum parking required for the development is 43 spaces.

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They are providing 51 spaces on site, 44 of those spaces are in the structure underneath

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the building, which is pictured on the right.

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There are seven parking spaces on the surface outside of the building, as noted before,

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three of them are at the end of the drive aisle on the south, four of them are in front of

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the building itself.

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There are additional three on-street parking spaces that technically count towards the required

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parking but as noted 43 spaces are required to provide a 51 on-site so if we add

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the three on-street parking spaces are up to 54. There are additional 43

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bike parking spaces provided and there are five level two electric vehicle

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charging stations provided with the capacity of adding 20 more.

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Landscaping

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meets code, they're required to meet 36 trees, they have 37 on-site between the

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existing and proposed. True replacement calculation is summarized on the screen.

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They're removing 162 caliber inches. They're required to replace 89 caliber inches.

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They are actually putting in 79 caliber inches remaining 10. They're going to do a cash and

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new dedication, which totals $2,250. The city will use that money to plant trees along the right

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away in parks in the area.

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The designed outdoor recreation area, otherwise known as Dora,

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is required for this development.

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12% of the land has to be set aside

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for recreational purposes for the tenants of the building.

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They're required to have 6,644 square feet.

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They're providing 7,463 in that area's broken down

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in the three areas.

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On the screen. One is up in front of the building along Cedar Lake Road, approximately 560 feet up there. A larger area is provided on the west side of the building, 2,200 square feet. That will include a lap pool and patio area. Then on the south part of the building is the majority of space with 4,600 square feet. That will be a mix of a dog run patio area and lawn for games and such.

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Stormwater treatment and retention is being met with an underground system.

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system on the south side of the building. The system is reviewed by the many how Creek

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Watershed District and of course the city and it does meet the standards. Some minor

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tweaks that need to be involved but there's no issues or hurdles that need to be overcome.

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The plant, the land is currently unplatted so it has to be platted before it can be combined.

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So we're looking to act on a preliminary and final plant combined process here.

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The plant

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With this dedication, we're asking for easements, the typical utility easements around the boundary,

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and then the larger easement you see on the to the south is large enough to contain

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the wetland, the floodplain, and a 20-foot buffer that is required by the watershed district

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along the wetland ditch.

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Park dedication is also required at 62,100, that includes 1500 per unit for park, and a trail

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dedication at 225 per unit.

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As

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noted, one of the applications is a rezoning.

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Properties currently zone R32 family residents.

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Apartment buildings are not allowed in this district.

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The R32 family residents allow single-family and two-family.

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So in order for an apartment building to be approved on this property,

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it has to be rezoned to our four multiple-family residents.

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We look at the zoning in the area.

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We see that to the north of Cedalic Road we have R2 single-family.

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The four existing single-family lots on the south side of Cedalic Road and the city property

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are zoned R3, two family residents. There's office development to the east and of course

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commercial development, a little further east, includes the Casco Home Depot area.

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Property to the south of the subject property is zoned parking open space.

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There is some R4 zoning district area, a little further to the east than

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and contains some town homes and apartment buildings.

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Property to the west is owned industrial.

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When we look at the comprehensive plan,

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we see that the four residential properties

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are guided medium density residential.

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The medium density residential corresponds

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with both the R3 and the R4 zoning districts.

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So a comprehensive plan amendment

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is not required for this rezoning.

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Within the staff report, you'll see several conditions

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that need be met for a condition-news permit.

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I won't go into detail in each of those,

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but it will summarize by simply stating

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that the staff finds that the design meets the code requirements.

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The plan is not detrimental to the health, safety,

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and general offer of the community.

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It is consistent with city plans and service capacity,

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and that includes traffic capacity on Cetule Lake Road.

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A lot of the comments received at the neighborhood meeting

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were concerns about traffic on Cetule Lake Road

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hand-parking in the area. So we did look at traffic cones, the history of traffic

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accounts on CLIC Road. And there's two segments we'll briefly talk about today.

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One segment is directly in front of the subject property. Another segment is

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further west adjacent to this one but basically extending east of Louisiana.

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But looking at this segment directly in front of the subject property,

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we note that the last traffic cone was done in 2020 which is of course the COVID year

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and the traffic's counts did drop considerably to 5,800.

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So we're going to look before that to get more of a trend

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of what's going on in Cedar Lake Road.

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And fortunately, they're taken every four years.

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So we're expecting traffic on to be taken this summer.

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So if we look at the count before the last traffic count before 2020

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was 2017, the count was 11,900.

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And as we continue to look past that every four years,

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we see that the traffic counts have been relatively stable.

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However, in around 11,500, 11,900 trips per day.

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So no real change along Cedar Lake Road, this segment, as we move further west, again,

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the segment that extends east of Cedar Lake Road.

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And I want to look at this one specifically because along that stretch we did have, in this time frame,

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the construction of the CNL apartments, so it's worth seeing what impact that had on that segment.

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So I'll start again with 2009.

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Questions for 12,600. In 2013, the traffic cons actually declined a little bit, to 12,200. Departments

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were built in 2015, and then the next cons were done in 2017, and the traffic cons actually

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declined a little more. They went down to 11,500.

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Many things impact the traffic cons,

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of course, but the traffic cons are a very real indication of the activity occurring on

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of the roads. So in talking to the engineering department with a Cedalic road, which was

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reconstructed in 2019, has a design capacity of 17,230, which is the projected traffic

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volume in 2040. And so they have no concerns of the 36 unit department building being constructed

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on the site.

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The neighborhood meeting was conducted on January 30, 2024. We had 18 people

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We'll sign in, a few people came in during the meeting.

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Comments were received in the letters that are in front of you in the staff report and

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also placed in front of you today are a really good summary of the comments that were

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received at that meeting.

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So I have nothing else to add other than say, please look at those comments and take those

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into consideration.

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So based on the application and the study conducted by the staff, chairs recommending that the

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chair conduct and close the public hearing.

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And I would recommend emotions to recommend approval of the submitted applications with

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the conditions as recommended by staff, which includes a park and trail dedication for

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the preliminary and final plat.

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And with that, I'll take any questions that you have.

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The applicant, Joshua Aaron, along with Sheldon Bird, Principal Architect, is here to answer

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any questions that you might have.

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And I believe they're also prepared to talk a little bit more about the building itself.

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Thank you so much. Do any members of the commission have any clarifying questions before we open the public hearing?

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I have a couple, Gary, if you don't mind going back, sorry, there, that one.

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The park dedication just to confirm that 62,000 that is paid for by the developer, is that correct?

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It is paid for by the developer.

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Yes. And then the Cedar Lake Road, the construction that's coming up by Louisiana with the roundabout and all of that, will that come down this far? Or is that not hard? That doesn't affect this area, does it?

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No, this section was completed in 2015 or 2019, I think I said 2019, so it won't come down this far.

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And then go back to the beginning where the rendering was of the building just to confirm that's the view if you're on Cedar Lake Road, is that right?

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It is, and I believe the architect will have more renderings for you. Great.

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Okay. Okay. Yeah. Commission director. Yeah. Thank you. Sorry. I just want to just clarify the rationale for the rezoning. Is that because we believe it is in line with our comprehensive plan for the city. And that's our justification.

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I correct, it is in line with the comprehensive plan, which is medium-density residential, which again accommodates both the R3 and the R4 district.

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Now you could find that in the current zoning R3 meets that the comprehensive plan also, so it's up to you as to whether or not you want to just determine to take the R4 zoning or keep it at the R3 because both of them are consistent with the comprehensive plan.

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For the public hearing, I just want to see if the developer in owner, do you want to talk now or at the end after all the comments are in?

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Do you have a preference going

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out?

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Do you want to, if you want to come up to the microphone and just say a few words, this should be inside the public hearing, Sean or no, should.

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Either way, okay, just introduce yourself and.

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Good evening, Shelvenberg with DVAR Architecture and we've been working with the developer and owner for

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last few months.

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A couple of things I'd like to just quickly point out.

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This is highlighting some of the introduction that Gary gave us, so thank you very much.

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For that, I think he covered most things.

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the first thing I'd like to talk about is sort of the why for the project, Josh was

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owned the property for 18 years and operated them as rental houses in that period.

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And I think through the years you sort of thought about some other ideas for the property.

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We know that the City of St. Louis Park in their comprehensive plan is looking for other

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ways to bring new residents to the area.

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St. Louis Park by and large is built out, so we have to look for

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and the comprehensive plan covers this.

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We have a couple of locations for some additional housing for people, as well as, obviously, places for people to work and other things. And the comprehensive plan says that they want to have them on transit corridors, places that are closer to either amenities or services and things. And I think that this property covers a lot of those bases. It's got, it's right next to the bike trail sidewalks.

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So your lake road has got transit on it, and then it's obviously close to the West End,

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which is just a little walk away.

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So in that regard, it checks a lot of those boxes and also gives the opportunity for people

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to have alternatives to take in a car.

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So they can bike walk in whatever to nearby uses to the West End and other areas, or even

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off to Louisiana in some of those commercial nodes.

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and so that's one part.

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The other is that what we've looked at doing with this project is creating

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some of the smaller scale housing that I think a lot of people are looking for.

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They don't necessarily, you know, when people are looking at housing,

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some people don't want to live in a residence with 150 people, 200 people, whatever.

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And they maybe want some places not quite as urban.

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And I think for the, you know, in the largest part,

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St. Louis Park offers that opportunity and here specifically at this site, it offers

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that transition where you're close enough that you can go to the west and or go to Louisiana

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and get all the services that you need and yet you're in a little more smaller scale area.

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And so the three-story project that we're proposing with 36 units gives people that choice and I think

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it does so by being sensitive to the neighbors, sensitive to the neighborhood, as well.

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And as Gary had mentioned, we are within the comprehensive plan, so within the larger

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scope of the planning for the city.

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The, just to reiterate, a couple items, is that in the sighting of the building, we have

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take in special care to provide a little more distance and separation from both the single

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family house to the west, as well as from the Sierra Lake Road bikeway and things.

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And then by way of an increase in more intensive landscape along the front, given that buffer

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to the building scale as it's a three story versus the one and two stories around.

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And lastly, just a quick overview of, I think you probably saw this in the proposal.

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But the project is largely stucco with some limited-fibre cement and metal panel.

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Finishes a lot of large windows and a lot of large balconies that give a little more expansive

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of space for people to enjoy the wetlands that everybody in the neighborhood enjoys as well.

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And I think that that concludes kind of the overview of the items I wanted to just hit

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on and I can answer any questions if you have any, otherwise.

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Any commissioner or commissioner members, any questions?

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Oh, commissioner Youngquist.

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here if you could just I think is probably around the 12th or 13th page to the

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renderings just to give a quick look those for the end so they're maybe more like

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21 or 20 as he's looking for this I want folks to know who are here are watching

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that the whole proposal exists online as well if you Google St. Louis Park Planning

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commission. So this view here, I'm on that page if you go to agendas and minutes fine today's

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date, this hall is there online as well. So go ahead. Thank you. Thank you, Chair. So this is

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a view as you'd recognize from Cedar Lake Road looking back toward from the north east looking

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more southwest. We have the drive up which provides some visitor parking and other things as well as

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and a place for service vehicles if they need to stop by the UPS to stop and do drop-offs

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as not going to interrupt the traffic that's on the Zurich Road.

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Next, here just a front view, more of a straight-on view, for that pedestrian access to the site

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with the main lobby in the front there in the middle with units above so that the community

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rooms and things front, Sierra Lake Road as well as a little bit to the west side.

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Next one, Gary. And then this is a view from the Northwest looking back toward the Southwest. It shows the drive down to the underground parking.

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And it shows some of landscaping and other improvements that we're making there. And then lastly, there's a view, I think, of the rear, but the backside of the building that's facing the wetland with the trail that walks out.

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around the building and connect some of the 90 spaces on the south side facing the wetland.

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That's all the last thing I guess I'd mention is that the shadow study that we had done,

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which is the next page, Gary,

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shows that from the city's criteria, those two in the box there are

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the most important where we're not getting close to neighboring buildings at the critical

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periods of the year.

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And then my final item that I add is that we do have fence screening on both east and

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west side, the west being the most important with the single family neighbor there.

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Any questions?

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Let me show you.

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I'm Chris at the question.

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Yeah, I've got a couple of clarifying questions.

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We'll start with the fencing because that's where you just left your statement.

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So the staff report says there's privacy fencing on the east and west.

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What type of material are you looking at?

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It's going to be a screen fencing.

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So it's either going to be a wood slat or maybe a metal slat or a slated fence, but it would

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be privacy screening.

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So they'll provide, you know, next to no vision through them.

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Right, with having the dry vial, right, adjacent to the property to the west, that's

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important.

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Exactly.

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Is there going to be fencing on the south side of the property to prevent people and pets

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from going into the wetland?

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There is a fence on the south side.

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It's intended though to be more transparent, more like a picket type fence.

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There's also a little retaining wall there, so it provides some safety for that as well.

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And then just one other question.

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Gary, can you go back to one of the front elevations, right there.

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So there's the landscaped area between Cedar Lake Road and the parking spaces.

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It's hard to tell from these.

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Is there a slight berm there?

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There is a slight berm.

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Okay.

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Okay.

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So the landscaping will be elevated.

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and then that's also true up closer to the building as well.

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Look at that up a little.

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Do you have a question, Medici?

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Yeah, I don't know if I saw any pictures.

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What's the building to the east again?

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Is it of a similar height?

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It's the building to the east is a city water treatment,

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I think, building and it's probably, I don't know, 18, 20 feet.

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It's like a short.

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It's shorter than this building, but it's

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It's more like story and a half to two story because it's more of a commercial type building.

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Any other questions?

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Okay.

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Yes.

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Go ahead.

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Sorry.

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I'll actually add clarification.

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Gary, the three story limit is that for the R4 zone or the R3 zone?

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The three stories of 40 feet is for the R4 district.

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The R3 is going to be more similar to the R1 and R2.

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30 feet to midpoint of the cable.

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I believe the R3 was 35 feet.

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35 feet to midpoint of cable.

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Two and a half stories, I think.

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Thank you.

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It's a five-foot difference.

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Thank you.

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And thank you everybody for your patience.

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These are kind of the nitty-gritty details we have to go through

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at this stage in the approval process.

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And we are going to now open up the public hearing

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to hear from anyone who's interested in speaking.

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I just want to reiterate, this is not the final vote tonight.

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This thing does not live or die today.

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This will then go to the city council, just letting you all know, so these do know what the process is.

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And I just want to set some expectations that the planning commission does not have as much leverage in some of the things we can and can't consider on whether to approve this.

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our task really is around whether this meets code, whether this meets all of those heights

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and all of those requirements that have been proposed. I'm not saying that to discourage

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you at all from speaking, we absolutely want to hear from you because those will be forwarded

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to the City Council.

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Absolutely. But I just wanted to manage expectations in that regard. And if you're able, please limit your comments to three minutes. So right now, at this time, as I open the public hearing, I have two comment cards. If you have any more, you can bring them to Gary or Sean, and they'll bring them up here as well, if you want to speak as well. With that, I will open the public hearing. And the first person I have here to come speak is Gary Burshide from 1604 Blackstone. Gary, are you here?

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I just

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speak into the mics and hand out because sometimes and we do have that just

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you know we have the handout right. Yes thank you go for it. Before I get on to

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this I noticed the traffic counts is almost maxed out compared to like the

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2017 2019. If you look at the 2020 numbers that's the year of the virus.

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Everybody

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the numbers are very low. And I just wanted to say that Cedar Lake Road is

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maxing out, or at least from my point of view, peak time is terrible. Anyway, on

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to the show. My name is Gary Burshite. I live at 1604 Blackstone Avenue. I've

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been there for 45 years. I've seen these projects. They come, they go, and for

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various reasons they die on the vine. The zoning, what they're proposing to go from

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eight units to 36 units is a one heck of a big step to go that high. Most of the neighborhood

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won't care if it was eight units. For other reasons, the question is, how do you put 36

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apartments into a unit piece of land. And this, how do you put the 36 units into

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the land of two houses that sat upon it? That's the big question. And from my

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point of view it's called a sardine effect. You put all the little fishes into a

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hand, and now you stack the hands up. And that's how you get the high densities, which

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according to Zornie whatnot, if it was gone to R4, they can do it.

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Considering that

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right across the street is all residential. That's a lot of density in a residential area.

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But next question I have, if a builder decides to buy two adjoining properties, whether

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it's in Lake Forest area or westward hills, they want to take the houses down and put

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a 36 unit apartment in those two neighborhoods, would you let them do it?

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I doubt it.

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I doubt it.

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So the question is, why are you doing it to us?

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There's two major design flaws with this project.

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It's a lack of parking.

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When you consider that a lot of these units will have married couples.

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They will have a car for him, car for her, and they'll drive two different directions.

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It'll be very quickly to fill up that parking space.

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And the question then is where do they park?

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Once it's full.

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They go into the neighborhood.

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that's the only place I can go. If they have friends over on Friday night and

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everybody's home, where do they park? You're going to max it out. And you can see on

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the map there that is filled over into the neighbor's hoods. So this magical

401
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:08,400
buffer area is broken because the neighbor is close to him. We'll have to put up

402
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with it. Oh yeah, Super Bowl parties coming up. A good example. The second flaw is I live

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at the bottom of that blackstone hill at 16th and blackstone. I don't know if you're

404
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:29,200
familiar with that doubt. But when the snow is falling over a period of time, that hill

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gets really slippery. And I've seen school buses, trucks, even a snow plow trying to make

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it up the hill. The snowflows come down the hill, but not up. So to go out of that parking

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ramp, they have to go up the hill, 20 feet to get out. Once the first car spins out,

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that's it. Until they get the car out of there, nobody goes anywhere. When they get to the

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top of the hill.

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There's a snow plow wash because that seat of the road is wide at that point. There's a lot of snow, a lot of ice, a lot of sand that's coming off those plows. So once I get to the top of the hill, can they make it through? I've been up there snow blowing over the years, and that's a mess.

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If you have any final thoughts, we'd love to hear them. If you have any final thoughts, the three minutes are up, but please feel free to give us any final thoughts.

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00:35:29,980 --> 00:35:54,060
Real quick, according to the 2020 census, there are 3,600 people in St. Louis Park that's living in poverty, but we need more reasonably priced, affordable homes, not upper scale places that would run $3,000 per month.

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Most people in poverty can afford it.

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And lastly, in my opinion of zoning for the sardine can stack project should be denied

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because there's simply too much and too little of a space.

416
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The only public purpose of this project is to make money for Josh at the expense of our

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neighborhood.

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Thank you.

419
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:20,820
Thank you, Gary, for that comment.

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and we do have your written statement as well.

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So we have that on hand here.

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Thomas Peterson, 6625, L.A. View Road.

423
00:36:33,630 --> 00:36:34,170
Good evening.

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00:36:34,650 --> 00:36:34,930
Good evening.

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We have very little control over global warming

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as people in 60-foot lots.

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This project, if it's rezoned, I recommend you table it

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for a year, a year and a half until Gary gets the whole act together for all of St. Louis Park

429
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rezoning all the different districts, getting rid of all the numbers and everything.

430
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And then after him and his staff look at it again, maybe we can give this a try.

431
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But right now I think we should table this for a year until all the zoning things get reworked.

432
00:37:17,570 --> 00:37:24,330
Second of all, the greenery of this building is zero.

433
00:37:25,630 --> 00:37:32,350
He wants to put in brackets for solar someday.

434
00:37:32,630 --> 00:37:35,370
It's the only green thing he's doing with this building.

435
00:37:36,390 --> 00:37:40,790
Planning commissions over this whole country can control a global warming

436
00:37:40,790 --> 00:37:42,750
and how much asphalt we put down.

437
00:37:42,750 --> 00:37:51,350
If this project ever goes through, which should have a green roof, it should have 25% recycled

438
00:37:51,350 --> 00:37:59,190
materials in building it, it should have bird sanctuary areas and butterflies, because

439
00:37:59,190 --> 00:38:05,030
right now, if you look at the Edward industrial park, if you block from here, from there,

440
00:38:05,030 --> 00:38:13,550
you're looking at a maximum of 5% grass. They took a whole swamp area and

441
00:38:13,550 --> 00:38:19,750
turned it into asphalt and flat top roofs. St. Louis Park is better than that

442
00:38:19,750 --> 00:38:26,270
we have hundreds of units a few blocks away that are empty and if you're

443
00:38:26,270 --> 00:38:32,150
going to go for a high-buck building, high-buck people would like a green

444
00:38:32,150 --> 00:38:37,590
building. They're part of the sales of it. You can live in a green building. We

445
00:38:37,590 --> 00:38:44,850
take all our gray water, the new technology, and reuse it. No water leaves the

446
00:38:44,850 --> 00:38:52,470
site on a grass area here. So green ruffs and everything. So I think we should

447
00:38:52,470 --> 00:38:59,030
move in a whole new direction with St. Louis Park because right now every time I walk

448
00:38:59,030 --> 00:39:05,470
through the industrial park at Edgewood, there's more of these landowners are cutting down trees.

449
00:39:07,410 --> 00:39:13,070
It's ridiculous and there's stipulations when they build these buildings they have to have

450
00:39:13,070 --> 00:39:18,670
trees, they have to keep them up and there's two properties down there with no grass.

451
00:39:20,330 --> 00:39:24,510
It's just asphalt and stuff and the global warming, there's just out of control.

452
00:39:24,510 --> 00:39:32,110
and new gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen, have control over what St. Louis Park does.

453
00:39:32,450 --> 00:39:38,370
We have enough apartment buildings, just matter if we want to go this route on this building,

454
00:39:38,610 --> 00:39:39,790
and I don't think we should.

455
00:39:41,330 --> 00:39:42,130
Thank you.

456
00:39:42,470 --> 00:39:43,830
Appreciate your comments.

457
00:39:44,610 --> 00:39:48,850
Next up, we have Dominique Versini of 6101, Cedar Lake Road.

458
00:39:49,690 --> 00:39:49,870
Hi.

459
00:39:50,010 --> 00:39:50,670
Hi, how are you?

460
00:39:52,550 --> 00:39:59,410
So, yes, I'm the owner of 6101 and I don't really personally care whether that building

461
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:29,660
I just wanted to give some opinion on I think it's a sad move. We're replacing the terms single family home with density, low density, high density. And I agree with the sardine thing. It's about packing a bunch of people. I moved here. I mean, I've lived in San Luis Park for 20 years, but I've moved there three years ago, thinking how nice, you know, those houses. I lived in apartments before. This I'm not saying that your building is not good looking.

462
00:40:29,660 --> 00:40:37,740
you know, but it's very generic. Everything looks alike. You walk in buildings. Everything looks identical. Everybody is packed together.

463
00:40:39,060 --> 00:40:41,620
No individuality. So that's one thing I wanted to say.

464
00:40:42,620 --> 00:40:50,420
I'm concerned about the wetland. I know it's there to stay. I know it cannot be destroyed or removed.

465
00:40:51,060 --> 00:40:56,360
But I see from my window the deer, the coyotes, you know the eagles. And of course it's kind of affected.

466
00:40:56,360 --> 00:41:01,780
You know, you have a bunch of people barbecuing late at night, you know, the noise, the light.

467
00:41:02,380 --> 00:41:04,020
So I wanted to mention that, too.

468
00:41:06,980 --> 00:41:14,620
And yes, it's just going to look like, you know, Lake Ahun, you know, those areas, all those big buildings.

469
00:41:14,980 --> 00:41:17,480
It looks like everywhere, you know, and a bunch.

470
00:41:17,620 --> 00:41:18,380
And people, it's true.

471
00:41:18,500 --> 00:41:20,560
People, I lived in apartments for 20 years.

472
00:41:21,060 --> 00:41:22,140
People don't stay long.

473
00:41:22,140 --> 00:41:26,620
The only people who stare at the people who can't afford having a baby they try to move out.

474
00:41:27,100 --> 00:41:31,920
These are young professionals who don't plan to have children, party, you know what I mean?

475
00:41:32,620 --> 00:41:35,260
I don't think it's an improvement for the neighborhood.

476
00:41:36,620 --> 00:41:37,060
Thank you.

477
00:41:37,240 --> 00:41:37,540
Thank you.

478
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:39,280
Appreciate it.

479
00:41:39,420 --> 00:41:43,220
Julia Alzen, 6010 Cedar Lake Road.

480
00:41:44,220 --> 00:41:44,600
Hello.

481
00:41:45,460 --> 00:41:49,120
So my house is the one with a pretty white driveway.

482
00:41:50,240 --> 00:41:50,560
Lovely.

483
00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:55,960
So I, uh, we've got our house. Yes. So I'm literally probably, I mean, I, I realize there

484
00:41:55,960 --> 00:42:00,280
will be else is affected, but me and Tate, who's to the right, if I'm standing this way,

485
00:42:00,420 --> 00:42:04,520
he can't be here today, um, probably really get affected probably the most because I'm

486
00:42:04,520 --> 00:42:08,760
like right front and center. So my front window is going to literally face all their windows.

487
00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:15,540
We spent, we bought the house December of 19, spent a whole lot of money widening our driveway,

488
00:42:15,540 --> 00:42:21,920
which City of St. Louis Park was nice about doing so for me it's more traffic it's I'm with them

489
00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:28,100
where I know the projections look like oh we can have more traffic. I leave at 830 in the morning

490
00:42:28,100 --> 00:42:34,200
with a wide driveway and sometimes it takes me two to three minutes just to even get out of my

491
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:40,360
driveway. Sometimes I have to take a left because I can't go right. I mean it's just and then I

492
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,620
end up like spending a couple more minutes trying to get to work because I have to go through the

493
00:42:43,620 --> 00:42:47,360
west end to go back around when I can't go down Louisiana. So for me it's more

494
00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:52,760
traffic. I just spent my Sunday morning cleaning up glass off the front of my

495
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:55,740
driveway because when people come in from the west end they drive they walk down

496
00:42:55,740 --> 00:43:01,700
my street and dump their their booze bottles all over our streets. So I spent I

497
00:43:01,700 --> 00:43:04,740
don't know like an hour on my Sunday morning clean up glass so I didn't run it

498
00:43:04,740 --> 00:43:09,400
over with my tires. So I feel like am I gonna get a little bit of that when I have

499
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:15,260
more traffic in front of my house. I mean, hard to know. But I mean, I moved to the West End.

500
00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:20,120
I don't have a little bit of a quiet life. Even though I'm on the seat of my home, I know what I

501
00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:24,380
bought. But just adding more people for me is just going to be more traffic. I have

502
00:43:25,220 --> 00:43:30,400
in front of my house, I have what's at like the brick that's really tall that the city put up.

503
00:43:30,700 --> 00:43:34,100
I don't need people sitting over there because they're hanging out with their friends. And this

504
00:43:34,100 --> 00:43:38,860
my front yard having cigarettes and beers and stuff because it's right out front of the apartment building

505
00:43:38,860 --> 00:43:41,520
Because maybe they want to hang out with some friends and they don't want to be in their apartment building

506
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:48,400
That's the kind of stuff that I look at and I have to look at it at my front window. So for me, that's kind of the big thing for myself. So

507
00:43:49,540 --> 00:43:51,720
Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate it

508
00:43:57,190 --> 00:44:01,030
Okay, next up. Don't sit down. Come on up

509
00:44:01,510 --> 00:44:06,050
Sue Mac is that five nine one two five nine one two cedar lake road. Yes

510
00:44:06,050 --> 00:44:10,630
So Sue Mac five nine one two cedar lake road. We've been there 15 years

511
00:44:10,630 --> 00:44:16,270
We are literally the roundabout when you're going west.

512
00:44:16,750 --> 00:44:18,630
There's four houses on that first block.

513
00:44:19,110 --> 00:44:20,270
We're the third one in.

514
00:44:20,710 --> 00:44:24,310
The only one on that block that has a driveway on Cedar Lake.

515
00:44:25,190 --> 00:44:29,250
So five years ago when they were redoing Cedar Lake,

516
00:44:30,670 --> 00:44:35,410
one of the main reasons for that area was the backup of the traffic

517
00:44:35,410 --> 00:44:37,010
because of that red light.

518
00:44:37,690 --> 00:44:43,850
it has really improved a lot until the last year or so.

519
00:44:44,150 --> 00:44:48,370
And I think it's because a lot of people are going back into the work for

520
00:44:48,370 --> 00:44:54,270
so the traffic is really picking up again on Cedar Lake at certain times of the day.

521
00:44:55,790 --> 00:44:58,850
My office, I work at home permanently now.

522
00:44:58,850 --> 00:44:59,970
So my...

523
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:05,880
Leader Lake, kind of kitty corner towards the roundabout. There are probably three, four times

524
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:13,820
a day that the traffic is backing up past the water treatment just to get around the roundabout.

525
00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:19,600
And that roundabout was supposed to alleviate a lot of that. The last year or so I have

526
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:27,320
noticed it has really increased my concern is, and when the roundabout was put in, we had

527
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:30,020
to give up being able to turn left out of our driveway

528
00:45:30,020 --> 00:45:31,440
because of the median.

529
00:45:31,660 --> 00:45:34,920
And we were 1,000% support if you go back in the meetings.

530
00:45:35,220 --> 00:45:37,180
I got up and I said, I'm supportive of that

531
00:45:37,180 --> 00:45:39,400
because it was the best for the neighborhood,

532
00:45:39,980 --> 00:45:40,820
the flow of traffic.

533
00:45:41,780 --> 00:45:44,400
I understand it's only 36 units.

534
00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:46,360
But like somebody else had said,

535
00:45:46,500 --> 00:45:50,140
that's at least probably 72 cars around.

536
00:45:51,380 --> 00:45:53,620
If it's two people that live in apartment,

537
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:56,660
each person probably has a car that doesn't sound

538
00:45:56,660 --> 00:46:03,440
like a lot but at certain times of the day it could really back up. The fire department

539
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:10,060
uses that as a thoroughfare so I mean adding additional cars I know it says that it

540
00:46:10,060 --> 00:46:16,220
could it could handle it but as somebody who sees it all day I'm not sure and then there's

541
00:46:16,220 --> 00:46:22,340
a lot of walkers there's a lot of bikers yes I know there's bike trails on there. There's

542
00:46:22,340 --> 00:46:26,880
still close calls. We've had a couple bicyclists get hit at the roundabout.

543
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:33,680
Coming off the side streets, the visibility is not the greatest. The side streets,

544
00:46:33,980 --> 00:46:38,780
you have, everybody has driveways. But again, those houses, they could have two or

545
00:46:38,780 --> 00:46:43,020
three cars. When there's a lot of snow, you go around the block like I have to go

546
00:46:43,020 --> 00:46:47,920
around the block. Oh God, I have to go around the block. And if you have people parked

547
00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:53,780
on the side of the road and there's snow you can't get through. I also want to say about the nature

548
00:46:53,780 --> 00:47:03,220
life. There are so many turkeys and squirrels and chipmunks and rabbits especially in that area

549
00:47:03,220 --> 00:47:10,060
right by the water treatment center because in the back it's completely open. His one house has been

550
00:47:10,060 --> 00:47:15,740
empty for a while. There is always turkeys in there. You put in a building like this, they're going to be

551
00:47:16,520 --> 00:47:23,080
The transient population is a concern. One of the reasons we bought the house is because it's a single family area.

552
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:29,320
We have how many buildings that they're cramming over where Olive Garden and all of that was.

553
00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:34,880
I walk over there and I'm actually really kind of surprised. The density over there.

554
00:47:35,460 --> 00:47:44,560
Now, if they were all full all the time and there was a need for more $3,000 a month, even $1,500 a month apartments I'd be fine.

555
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:50,760
I personally, if they want, if you want to approve anything and if you want to, I'm not

556
00:47:50,760 --> 00:47:54,600
against somebody doing something better with their property, I would personally love

557
00:47:54,600 --> 00:48:01,380
to see townhouses where you're going to encourage families and not just single family, single

558
00:48:01,380 --> 00:48:06,720
two income people, our school district will do better by having more families.

559
00:48:06,720 --> 00:48:12,680
It's one of the reasons we moved here 25 years ago from Pennsylvania solely to St. Louis

560
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:16,220
is park when we started looking to come to Minnesota because of the schools.

561
00:48:16,980 --> 00:48:18,780
We want to encourage families.

562
00:48:19,060 --> 00:48:22,480
More apartments are not going to encourage families.

563
00:48:23,740 --> 00:48:25,920
I think that's all I wanted to say.

564
00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:28,140
Yeah, I think that's it.

565
00:48:28,560 --> 00:48:28,920
Thank you.

566
00:48:29,060 --> 00:48:30,200
Thank you very much.

567
00:48:31,460 --> 00:48:33,000
Those are all the cars I have.

568
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:38,560
If there's anyone else, kind of speak now for everholder, well, no, actually not for

569
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:40,880
everholder piece because this is going to the City Council next.

570
00:48:41,540 --> 00:48:46,120
You're more than welcome to come up, sir, if you would mind introducing yourself and

571
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:49,040
you're telling us your address just for the record.

572
00:48:56,190 --> 00:48:57,030
But even council.

573
00:48:57,830 --> 00:48:57,930
Okay.

574
00:48:59,810 --> 00:49:04,410
I'm going to advocate for, and that's why can you just give your name and address real quick,

575
00:49:04,410 --> 00:49:04,710
sorry.

576
00:49:04,870 --> 00:49:10,390
Oh, my name is Todd Tills, my address is 6-0-1-9-Seat-O-Lake.

577
00:49:10,470 --> 00:49:10,750
Okay, great.

578
00:49:10,770 --> 00:49:11,250
Sorry about that.

579
00:49:11,250 --> 00:49:22,950
All right, I'm here to advocate for moving this project to another location, because I like St. Louis Park to grow.

580
00:49:24,950 --> 00:49:30,670
But the main factors against having it there is a lot of people already spoke about it, right?

581
00:49:31,150 --> 00:49:36,750
The wildlife and the wetlands, the traffic, the safety concerns, right?

582
00:49:36,750 --> 00:49:44,970
It's going to make people who don't live here, that building is going to be a target for people that want to go through cars, right?

583
00:49:45,070 --> 00:49:47,270
Try to sneak in the building and go through the garages.

584
00:49:48,010 --> 00:49:59,070
I've seen it multiple times and also there's a veteran on an oxygen tank that's going to lose his home because of this.

585
00:50:01,540 --> 00:50:10,120
And it's kind of messed up. He's been a loyal renter for probably two decades. And, um,

586
00:50:13,080 --> 00:50:20,920
beyond us that, that house is not, the landlord has not kept up with it. Is integrity, I would

587
00:50:20,920 --> 00:50:28,040
say, is reflected in all of his properties, which lacks kind of a terrible condition.

588
00:50:29,540 --> 00:50:32,100
So I, excuse me,

589
00:50:35,900 --> 00:50:46,780
as a veteran myself, I just kind of like, it hurts to see somebody end up losing for the profit of somebody who's selfish and can't take care of their own stuff.

590
00:50:48,820 --> 00:50:50,820
So yeah, traffic's a bad idea.

591
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:58,020
I've seen cars straight up go through that roundabout and have to pull them out myself.

592
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:11,060
Yeah, safety, major concern, and then, yeah, just who's going to be succeeding for this

593
00:51:11,060 --> 00:51:11,520
project?

594
00:51:12,180 --> 00:51:17,400
I think St. Louis Park could pick better people to make prosperous from all of this.

595
00:51:20,500 --> 00:51:23,690
Yeah, I would love to see it.

596
00:51:23,810 --> 00:51:28,910
It's beautiful, but in a different location where it could really help people.

597
00:51:30,130 --> 00:51:39,230
and not affect people that call St. Louis Park their home and force them out or like you know have

598
00:51:39,230 --> 00:51:45,670
people go through their houses and not their houses but like their garage spots right and breaking

599
00:51:45,670 --> 00:51:51,030
their cars and stuff. So I know there's an uptick in crime in St. Louis Park lately because of the

600
00:51:51,030 --> 00:51:56,830
populous growing and a lot of that is leaking from Minneapolis. So adding more people to St. Louis Park in

601
00:51:56,830 --> 00:51:59,070
in the right place would be a good idea,

602
00:51:59,290 --> 00:52:03,150
but yeah, thank you.

603
00:52:03,370 --> 00:52:03,670
Thank you.

604
00:52:04,330 --> 00:52:04,690
Thank you.

605
00:52:05,530 --> 00:52:08,010
Any other comments?

606
00:52:08,390 --> 00:52:09,470
If you have that card filled out,

607
00:52:09,590 --> 00:52:10,850
you can just bring it up here.

608
00:52:11,930 --> 00:52:13,730
Well, yeah, because we, it's just so we can

609
00:52:13,730 --> 00:52:15,190
for the record keeping on the backend.

610
00:52:15,390 --> 00:52:17,010
So introduce yourself at Gary.

611
00:52:18,070 --> 00:52:18,150
Sorry.

612
00:52:18,370 --> 00:52:19,710
Greg, Greg, sorry about that.

613
00:52:19,990 --> 00:52:20,610
Thanks for your time, everyone.

614
00:52:21,050 --> 00:52:21,750
My name is Greg.

615
00:52:21,870 --> 00:52:25,050
I own the house immediately next to the two subject

616
00:52:25,050 --> 00:52:29,190
properties there. I would just like to point out there's some pretty historic

617
00:52:29,590 --> 00:52:35,890
Elms, American Elms trees back on the lots. If any credence could be paid to those, I mean

618
00:52:35,890 --> 00:52:40,150
I know San Luis Park is subsidizing homeowners to try to maintain those trees on their own properties.

619
00:52:41,210 --> 00:52:46,310
So it does, it does seem like a bit of a waste to clear out that kind of thing. Especially

620
00:52:46,310 --> 00:52:52,650
there's one in front that I think is probably 70 to 100 years old that is really pretty and

621
00:52:52,650 --> 00:53:06,430
in good shape, and would provide some of the aesthetic and nature that we appreciate about the lot already, and some screening as well, so other than that, that's what I got.

622
00:53:06,710 --> 00:53:06,890
Thank you.

623
00:53:07,310 --> 00:53:07,890
Thank you.

624
00:53:12,570 --> 00:53:13,690
I didn't hear you.

625
00:53:13,710 --> 00:53:15,150
Is it possible to see the back fence?

626
00:53:15,570 --> 00:53:17,070
The back view, the view from the back.

627
00:53:19,860 --> 00:53:22,440
I don't think we have a rendering of what the fence will look like.

628
00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:26,840
We know it will be a fence, but we don't have a picture of what it will look like.

629
00:53:27,240 --> 00:53:29,220
Are there any other comments anyone else like to speak?

630
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:35,080
I would love to give an opportunity to folks who haven't spoken.

631
00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:39,900
And I would just also encourage you, sir, you could submit subsequent written comments.

632
00:53:39,900 --> 00:53:42,420
This again is going to the City Council next, just so you know.

633
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:45,640
So I'm just going to see if anyone else here.

634
00:53:47,800 --> 00:53:55,500
Okay. Well, with that, I am going to close the public hearing and turn it back to the

635
00:53:55,500 --> 00:54:01,360
commission for conversation. I think we have some conversation. So, should I bring a key?

636
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:13,040
I guess in my mind, this project is sort of marginal. I support the idea of increasing density

637
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:19,940
be along transit quarters, if it supports our goals of affordable housing.

638
00:54:21,460 --> 00:54:26,560
In this case, so I just wonder if the practice is just at least slightly too big.

639
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:32,080
One indication is just the seven surface parking spots.

640
00:54:32,120 --> 00:54:38,180
I think there is possibility of overflowing in the neighborhood, that's just one indication.

641
00:54:41,760 --> 00:54:57,620
Also, for converting single family homes, you know, we're going to start liking single family homes but if we do that, you know, I would like to see in support of affordable housing and I'm not sure this project really does that.

642
00:54:57,620 --> 00:54:59,780
So I'm

643
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:08,700
No, I'm required to vote against it unless, but I'll listen to other people's comments, too. Thank you, Commissioner. Anyone else? Any other comments?

644
00:55:11,060 --> 00:55:12,300
Rackle? Yeah.

645
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:29,660
Thanks for speaking, Todd. I certainly, of the comments, because I'm generally in support of a project like this. I think that it meets the needs of what we're looking for. I think the one thing that you said that really kind of bothered me is the

646
00:55:29,660 --> 00:55:34,940
the, um, the treatment of the previous tenants and how that's being handled, I think that

647
00:55:34,940 --> 00:55:37,420
that is unfortunate. And,

648
00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:46,340
uh, however, um, I think that that does need to be brought to

649
00:55:46,340 --> 00:55:51,880
the City Council's attention because that's not a criteria on which this body can determine

650
00:55:51,880 --> 00:55:56,520
whether this passes or fails tonight. But I did want to make a mention of it and say, please

651
00:55:56,520 --> 00:56:02,380
do attend the City Council meeting and, uh, speak further on that issue. Um, otherwise, um,

652
00:56:04,420 --> 00:56:10,820
I mean, when it comes to traffic, I mean,

653
00:56:12,940 --> 00:56:16,660
this is, we have a market-based housing system

654
00:56:16,660 --> 00:56:22,560
in this country, and I know that if I'm going to choose where to live, and I know I have

655
00:56:22,560 --> 00:56:26,940
two cars or three cars, I'm not going to rent somewhere that doesn't have a place for

656
00:56:26,940 --> 00:56:28,020
me to put those cars.

657
00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:32,700
I imagine that there will be a pricing scheme on the parking.

658
00:56:32,700 --> 00:56:38,560
It's not going to be free to just bring your car in for yourself or a guest. I

659
00:56:38,560 --> 00:56:44,700
Generally, I'm not concerned by the number of parking spaces for that reason alone

660
00:56:46,260 --> 00:56:54,580
Because if if I knew that I couldn't store my private property in a place that I was I was paying for I would not live there

661
00:56:54,580 --> 00:56:59,140
And I think that that's as we know that these are market rates not affordable housing

662
00:56:59,140 --> 00:57:04,840
we're not the people who are going to be moving in or moving in here by choice, they are not going

663
00:57:04,840 --> 00:57:08,540
to be subject to, well, I need to figure out how to make this work. And I'm going to hide my car

664
00:57:08,540 --> 00:57:14,680
wherever I can. It's, you know, it's choice housing. Like, somebody's going to make the decision,

665
00:57:14,700 --> 00:57:20,760
whether or not this, the parking scheme in this building works for them. And so, um,

666
00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:25,200
that's one of the reasons why I think that, like, I think this development is fairly thoughtful.

667
00:57:25,200 --> 00:57:32,640
and I think that it's a, as we're looking at places to add more housing in St. Louis Park,

668
00:57:32,660 --> 00:57:40,240
I do think that it belongs near the west end. It belongs near places with higher traffic

669
00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:47,380
roads as opposed to interior neighborhoods. So I'm in support of this project, and that's

670
00:57:47,380 --> 00:57:47,680
all I have.

671
00:57:49,020 --> 00:57:50,260
Any other members?

672
00:57:51,160 --> 00:57:51,820
Christian Derecha?

673
00:57:52,820 --> 00:57:54,780
Yeah, I have some thoughts I'd like to share.

674
00:57:55,080 --> 00:57:57,320
I really appreciate the dialogue.

675
00:57:57,320 --> 00:57:59,940
It's really awesome to hear from people in the community.

676
00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:04,820
But I want to just react to some comments.

677
00:58:05,420 --> 00:58:11,140
I would say overall, I'm also in favor of prioritizing housing over parking.

678
00:58:11,500 --> 00:58:16,700
So when I think about, you know, if it was just, you know, parking versus this,

679
00:58:16,700 --> 00:58:22,260
I would rather pick the option to create land and space for people to live,

680
00:58:22,460 --> 00:58:23,860
rather than for our cars to live.

681
00:58:24,220 --> 00:58:28,500
And so, to me, the parking is not as a strong argument for me.

682
00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:33,300
The traffic recognized that there's probably a larger question around traffic.

683
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:40,120
You know, say, you know, roughly there's 50 parking spots, one of the comments commented

684
00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:42,480
people leaving 10 times a day, which I think is a lot.

685
00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:49,380
500 trips a day that's like less than 4% of the total numbers if you use the

686
00:58:49,380 --> 00:58:56,800
2017 basis. That doesn't seem like an incredibly meaningful change in the

687
00:58:56,800 --> 00:59:00,780
traffic recognizing that yes okay maybe it's concentrated at certain times of

688
00:59:00,780 --> 00:59:07,260
day that feels like a little bit of a larger issue that would not be addressed

689
00:59:07,260 --> 00:59:09,980
here I don't basically I think this is kind of a drop in the bucket there.

690
00:59:11,380 --> 00:59:17,140
If there were specific constraints around how the site was designed around, we think

691
00:59:17,140 --> 00:59:21,660
that there would be backup of parking, that would be another thing, or backup of traffic,

692
00:59:21,900 --> 00:59:24,700
but I think that's not the case.

693
00:59:25,500 --> 00:59:33,420
I do want to react to some of the comments around just reiterating Commissioner Webber's

694
00:59:33,420 --> 00:59:38,960
points that, you know, I recognize this is rental, a lot of comments around single people,

695
00:59:39,300 --> 00:59:43,760
one single people are all supportive of our community too, people who don't want to have

696
00:59:43,760 --> 00:59:48,540
kids are also part of our community as well. They are also entitled to a place to live.

697
00:59:50,140 --> 00:59:55,900
And also it's not our role as planning commission to not pick up project just because we don't

698
00:59:55,900 --> 00:59:59,700
like how it looks. So, you know, I recognize those comments

699
00:59:59,700 --> 00:59:59,960
and surround.

700
01:00:00,940 --> 01:00:29,740
Aesthetics, but I think that's outside of our purview here. The one thing that I'm curious to hear, thoughts from the other commissioners on, is basically, when do we find it appropriate to rezone? I could see an argument to say the zoning of this is for R3, and thus only R3 should be here. Now, you might be aware, we are undergoing

701
01:00:29,740 --> 01:00:36,200
a large exercise to rezone the whole city and rethink these things. And so I could see an argument

702
01:00:36,200 --> 01:00:41,500
to say, table this until we do the rezoning or have a conversation around how this fits with our

703
01:00:41,500 --> 01:00:50,620
future zoning plans. I think that wouldn't be unreasonable. But the intention of our rezoning plans

704
01:00:50,620 --> 01:00:58,000
are to create opportunities for more density. But I could also, I could see us wanting to think

705
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:00,920
about this project in the context of that larger effort.

706
01:01:03,420 --> 01:01:10,540
And then, the two pieces that I would be curious to discuss with the developer are just

707
01:01:10,540 --> 01:01:16,500
around, I mean, bike safety, if there's something there that I don't, I don't have an answer,

708
01:01:16,620 --> 01:01:21,520
I don't think necessarily that there's opportunity, and I think there's bike parking and opportunities

709
01:01:21,520 --> 01:01:26,060
for people to have bikes there, but I'm not sure if there's something that can be done

710
01:01:26,060 --> 01:01:33,360
to address bike safety and I am compelled by the support of the tree preservation as well.

711
01:01:34,380 --> 01:01:39,440
And so I would be curious to see if there is anything we could do to support maintenance

712
01:01:39,900 --> 01:01:40,540
of those trees.

713
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:41,300
Yeah,

714
01:01:43,490 --> 01:01:45,770
there's any other comments from Commissioner Martin's.

715
01:01:47,860 --> 01:01:54,400
I just want to say that people are not inherently evil nor called to a life of crime because

716
01:01:54,400 --> 01:02:00,700
because they rent, they don't need your judgment and they are not less than you because they

717
01:02:00,700 --> 01:02:01,200
are renters.

718
01:02:04,300 --> 01:02:04,660
Michael?

719
01:02:05,460 --> 01:02:09,440
Commissioner DeVech, I'd actually like to respond to the thought on the zoning.

720
01:02:11,160 --> 01:02:16,240
I would, I think if this was in a vacuum and I would tend to agree it's like well we

721
01:02:16,240 --> 01:02:19,080
will aid the zone and say well that's the rules we said.

722
01:02:19,620 --> 01:02:23,680
I think the two conditions are one, we know that the City of St. Louis Park has five zones

723
01:02:23,680 --> 01:02:29,900
three of which are basically single-family home districts, and the kind of does really—the

724
01:02:29,900 --> 01:02:33,840
whole reason we're making the change and rethinking how the thick is because when people

725
01:02:33,840 --> 01:02:37,220
come to our community and they say, what am I allowed to build on a property that I'm

726
01:02:37,220 --> 01:02:42,100
looking to buy? They can't actually figure it out because it's very confusing. And it was

727
01:02:42,100 --> 01:02:50,060
made confusing by design by people in the past who were trying to rectify mistakes. I would

728
01:02:50,060 --> 01:02:54,880
say that because the second factor is that we have the comprehensive zoning plan.

729
01:02:55,020 --> 01:02:57,580
We have the comprehensive plan, the 2040 St. Louis Park plan.

730
01:02:58,120 --> 01:03:00,920
And that is saying that this is a meeting density area.

731
01:03:01,640 --> 01:03:07,700
So part of the comprehensive plan is bringing zoning as it existed prior to the passage of

732
01:03:07,700 --> 01:03:10,300
that plan in compliance with that plan.

733
01:03:10,760 --> 01:03:17,320
So while the entire city, we're working on the plan to bring compliance for the rest of

734
01:03:17,320 --> 01:03:24,380
districts this is we already know that this is going to change. This is not going to be there is not going to be an R3 in the future.

735
01:03:24,500 --> 01:03:33,240
This is going to be one of our new zones we're discussing. And so I think that I think whether it's our three or our four is

736
01:03:33,240 --> 01:03:38,340
almost a little academic because we know that it's going to fit into one of the zones that corresponds medium density in the future.

737
01:03:39,740 --> 01:03:44,140
So that's my thought on it. I would be open to hearing other thoughts as well.

738
01:03:48,010 --> 01:03:56,790
I agree. There was a large effort put forward to develop the comprehensive plan. The 20-year

739
01:03:56,790 --> 01:04:03,810
vision of how we want St. Louis Pertigaro and the zoning that is proposed here is consistent

740
01:04:03,810 --> 01:04:12,770
with those long range plans. I would like to talk about housing in general. There's a housing

741
01:04:12,770 --> 01:04:19,970
crisis in this country and in the front of the House, there was a big issue in Minnesota

742
01:04:19,970 --> 01:04:23,250
and the rest of the country has under-produced housing.

743
01:04:23,570 --> 01:04:34,150
When there was the recession in the late 2000s, production of housing slowed down tremendously,

744
01:04:34,590 --> 01:04:36,350
but growth did not.

745
01:04:36,350 --> 01:04:55,170
and we are trying to make up for that lack of development of housing and while this is a market rate development there's an under supply of housing adding any more housing is good to help for affordability of housing.

746
01:04:55,170 --> 01:04:59,970
So I appreciate folks coming out. I know you're very happy.

747
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:29,060
I'm passionate about your neighborhoods, but I'm going to be voting in favor of this because it's consistent with the comprehensive plan. And it also provides missing middle housing, which we are trying to achieve, which is a step between lower density and the large apartments that you see at West stand. And that's a tough nut to crack. And I'm happy to see this being proposed here. Any other comments?

748
01:05:29,060 --> 01:05:37,120
I would just add to what Commissioner Devachia was asking you, the big question of when

749
01:05:37,120 --> 01:05:42,400
is it appropriate to rezone and just to maybe use a few fewer words in Commissioner

750
01:05:42,400 --> 01:05:48,140
Accom did, it's if it's still within alignment of the 2040 plan, then it's okay to rezone

751
01:05:48,140 --> 01:05:48,820
and this is.

752
01:05:49,520 --> 01:05:55,120
So that's why I'm okay with the rezone in question, tabling until we're done with the

753
01:05:55,740 --> 01:06:01,520
I don't see that as feasible only because I feel like we would have to table every development

754
01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:06,460
before this commission, this calendar year, and I actually think most of what will become

755
01:06:06,460 --> 01:06:09,740
before this commission is probably going to be pretty non-controversial, so I would hate

756
01:06:09,740 --> 01:06:12,420
to stop those developments as well.

757
01:06:13,260 --> 01:06:17,680
It's a very important question to ask, but I just want to let you know what my thinking is

758
01:06:18,540 --> 01:06:19,160
as well.

759
01:06:20,420 --> 01:06:24,160
And I think as we've mentioned here, just for the focus here, and I'm appreciative of you

760
01:06:24,160 --> 01:06:28,440
being here it's I think you can probably tell we're not heading in the direction that

761
01:06:28,440 --> 01:06:32,880
you a lot of people in this room want but I also want you to know that's only because

762
01:06:32,880 --> 01:06:40,080
of the parameters under which we rule. I appreciate if you think that's a cop out I also appreciate

763
01:06:40,080 --> 01:06:47,520
if you understand that that is actually our mandate and to be in contact with your members

764
01:06:47,520 --> 01:06:53,720
members of the City Council, they are very receptive to comments like we heard here today

765
01:06:53,720 --> 01:07:00,100
sometimes, apparently the comments here, but what I would say is all of these comments

766
01:07:00,100 --> 01:07:06,800
are being forwarded, and I have seen moments on this commission, which again has this limited

767
01:07:06,800 --> 01:07:14,300
scope. I have seen moments when there is input like this. There are moments where sometimes

768
01:07:14,300 --> 01:07:18,280
Sometimes the developer, sometimes the owner, and sometimes the members of the City Council,

769
01:07:18,440 --> 01:07:21,340
their own accord, decide to maybe rethink things.

770
01:07:21,740 --> 01:07:25,860
I'm not saying that will happen here, but I want you to say it is not impossible as well.

771
01:07:26,100 --> 01:07:32,240
And so I'm trying to add on a hopeful note as well for those of you who may not like what I think we're about to do.

772
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:36,120
And so, but really thank you for being here tonight.

773
01:07:36,760 --> 01:07:42,480
If there's no other conversation, I will entertain a motion for this measure.

774
01:07:43,120 --> 01:07:44,940
or do you have, is this emotional comment?

775
01:07:44,980 --> 01:07:46,580
Oh, maybe additional comment, yeah.

776
01:07:46,580 --> 01:07:47,540
Okay, go ahead, go ahead.

777
01:07:47,720 --> 01:07:49,820
Yeah, when I was talking about parking before,

778
01:07:49,980 --> 01:07:52,960
about only seven parking lots of spots,

779
01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:57,000
it's not that I care about parking as much.

780
01:07:57,200 --> 01:07:58,440
I think there's not maybe that was the indication

781
01:07:58,440 --> 01:08:00,460
that it was the whole thing, which is kind of a little big.

782
01:08:00,760 --> 01:08:03,840
And at least my greatest possibility

783
01:08:03,840 --> 01:08:07,120
that visitor parking could overflow in the neighborhood.

784
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:09,940
So maybe it was more of this indication, maybe it's just

785
01:08:09,940 --> 01:08:10,560
a little big.

786
01:08:12,480 --> 01:08:16,180
But riding more housing, especially a transit corridor,

787
01:08:17,760 --> 01:08:21,680
is a good goal, I support.

788
01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:23,180
But I think there are other goals.

789
01:08:23,600 --> 01:08:27,320
We also want owner occupied housing.

790
01:08:27,720 --> 01:08:29,380
I guess the house is a bit rented now,

791
01:08:29,460 --> 01:08:31,660
but at least someone could buy me at some point

792
01:08:31,660 --> 01:08:32,680
and be owner occupied.

793
01:08:33,400 --> 01:08:37,980
And another goal is housing suitable for families.

794
01:08:39,340 --> 01:08:41,940
I don't think most families typically

795
01:08:41,940 --> 01:08:51,980
want to live in a apartment building, so I think there are other goals here, so I don't

796
01:08:51,980 --> 01:08:59,710
know that we've been in a rush to do this for this one property at this point.

797
01:09:00,470 --> 01:09:01,650
Okay, thank you.

798
01:09:02,230 --> 01:09:04,870
Do I have any motions on this measure?

799
01:09:11,800 --> 01:09:15,600
I motion to, do we want to do separate motions, right?

800
01:09:15,600 --> 01:09:18,320
You can do it all right, all the different ones.

801
01:09:21,760 --> 01:09:25,040
It's your decision, how to frame those things.

802
01:09:25,040 --> 01:09:30,320
I think I'll just do one by one for simplicity.

803
01:09:30,660 --> 01:09:33,120
I'd motion to recommend approval of the application

804
01:09:33,120 --> 01:09:37,380
to Reson 60, 13, and 16, 19, Cedar Lake Road,

805
01:09:38,080 --> 01:09:39,660
from our three two family residents

806
01:09:39,660 --> 01:09:41,820
to our four multiple family residents.

807
01:09:42,520 --> 01:09:43,800
And you have notes in front of you,

808
01:09:43,860 --> 01:09:45,840
so you may have to do the other motions to this.

809
01:09:45,840 --> 01:09:52,840
Okay, that's a motion. Do we have a second second we have a motion a second all those in favor say aye

810
01:09:53,440 --> 01:09:54,760
Aye all opposed

811
01:09:55,280 --> 01:09:55,540
nay

812
01:09:56,100 --> 01:09:59,740
The motion carries is there another motion on the floor yes

813
01:10:00,750 --> 01:10:30,570
I motion to recommend approval of the application for preliminary and final plat of cedar cedar heights of states with conditions recommended by staff. Motion, do we have a second? Second. The motion in a second, all those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed? Aye. Motion carries. And then there's one more. I motion to recommend approval of the application for a conditional use permit to allow a three-story 36-unit apartment building with conditions

814
01:10:30,570 --> 01:10:31,890
that's recommended by staff.

815
01:10:33,190 --> 01:10:35,550
We have a motion to, oh, was that it or?

816
01:10:36,050 --> 01:10:36,490
Yes.

817
01:10:36,690 --> 01:10:37,590
Okay. Do we have a second?

818
01:10:37,870 --> 01:10:38,250
A second.

819
01:10:38,750 --> 01:10:41,130
We have a motion and a second all those in favor say aye.

820
01:10:41,530 --> 01:10:41,910
Aye.

821
01:10:42,190 --> 01:10:42,590
Opposed?

822
01:10:43,030 --> 01:10:43,170
May.

823
01:10:43,710 --> 01:10:44,590
The motion carries.

824
01:10:45,230 --> 01:10:47,090
And that concludes this item of business.

825
01:10:47,710 --> 01:10:51,190
We do have a few other things that we're going to go through.

826
01:10:51,330 --> 01:10:52,670
You are more than welcome to state.

827
01:10:52,810 --> 01:10:53,810
It is scintillating stuff.

828
01:10:53,830 --> 01:10:54,770
I want to assure you.

829
01:10:55,330 --> 01:10:58,490
You are also free if that was what you were here for.

830
01:11:03,190 --> 01:11:09,190
This is planned to be brought to City Council for consideration on February 20th.

831
01:11:10,730 --> 01:11:16,970
And while this is the public hearing, the Council's policy is to accept testimony on items

832
01:11:16,970 --> 01:11:17,770
on the agenda.

833
01:11:18,070 --> 01:11:20,130
So if you would like to speak there as well, you may.

834
01:11:20,650 --> 01:11:24,830
But all the information that was collected during this meeting will be passed along in part

835
01:11:24,830 --> 01:11:27,210
of the package of the materials that they receive.

836
01:11:27,210 --> 01:11:32,910
And that's in this that's in this room again. It is in this in this room at six o'clock, right? Or is it it varies?

837
01:11:33,050 --> 01:11:35,510
I think six thirties that standard time. Okay.

838
01:11:36,350 --> 01:11:38,190
Thank you all for being here. I'll

839
01:11:42,160 --> 01:11:43,080
just give it a minute here.

840
01:11:43,920 --> 01:11:44,960
I'm just gonna give it a minute.

841
01:12:02,720 --> 01:12:03,000
I

842
01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:14,440
I'm going to come back to the meeting here. We only have a couple other things. Next item on the agenda is

843
01:12:14,440 --> 01:12:17,160
Is other business Gary?

844
01:12:18,380 --> 01:12:19,820
Yes, there is other business.

845
01:12:19,980 --> 01:12:21,340
Other Gary, is there any other business?

846
01:12:21,720 --> 01:12:27,480
Yes, Mr. Chair, there is other business, I'm sorry, it wasn't included in the packet

847
01:12:27,480 --> 01:12:30,260
but we sent an email out to you today.

848
01:12:30,980 --> 01:12:37,600
We do need to do a election of officers on the first meeting of the new year and so we're

849
01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:40,760
looking for folks that are interested in being the Chair and Vice Chair.

850
01:12:41,300 --> 01:12:49,280
If you could hold the election of officers today that would be wonderful and then it would be effective at your next regular meeting or next meeting.

851
01:12:49,920 --> 01:12:57,620
Well, let's start with chair. Does anyone want to volunteer or nominate someone to be chair? I'll just kind of open it up to the world.

852
01:12:58,040 --> 01:13:00,600
I like to volunteer. I wanted to nominate me at you.

853
01:13:01,580 --> 01:13:05,080
Well, that's all we can take up this whole side of the table with all of you.

854
01:13:06,340 --> 01:13:09,700
Any other nominations or volunteering?

855
01:13:11,500 --> 01:13:13,380
Well, I guess let's just make this formal then.

856
01:13:13,480 --> 01:13:17,860
All those in favor of making Commissioner DeBacha our new chair, say aye.

857
01:13:18,280 --> 01:13:18,660
Aye.

858
01:13:18,920 --> 01:13:19,000
Aye.

859
01:13:19,560 --> 01:13:19,980
All opposed?

860
01:13:21,540 --> 01:13:22,400
I'll keep it open.

861
01:13:22,680 --> 01:13:22,820
No.

862
01:13:25,040 --> 01:13:25,780
Thank you.

863
01:13:25,880 --> 01:13:30,060
Thank you all for my year as chair I've enjoyed it as well.

864
01:13:30,060 --> 01:13:37,000
So I'll do the same now for Vice Chair, do we have any volunteers or nominations open

865
01:13:37,000 --> 01:13:37,380
my care.

866
01:13:41,350 --> 01:13:41,750
I would.

867
01:13:41,950 --> 01:13:42,510
Yeah, nominate.

868
01:13:43,290 --> 01:13:43,450
Matt.

869
01:13:45,010 --> 01:13:46,310
I would second.

870
01:13:46,730 --> 01:13:49,510
I suppose I have to ask to if you accept.

871
01:13:50,110 --> 01:13:51,070
I do accept.

872
01:13:54,190 --> 01:13:58,750
I just want to also point out just for going forward that Commissioner Merton's and Commissioner

873
01:13:58,750 --> 01:14:03,070
young quiz have not served yet. I'm not saying that you shouldn't, but I'm just saying going forward.

874
01:14:03,650 --> 01:14:08,930
There is. There is a good. I'm sorry. I heard yes over here. You said no. Okay. Well, just so you know,

875
01:14:08,950 --> 01:14:12,830
there's a goal. There's a general goal that at some point you take a leadership position. So obviously

876
01:14:12,830 --> 01:14:18,270
don't worry about this here, but we would love to know that that's in your brain going forward.

877
01:14:19,010 --> 01:14:23,670
Okay. All those in favor of Commissioner Accom being our vice chair say aye. Aye.

878
01:14:23,670 --> 01:14:23,790
Aye.

879
01:14:24,150 --> 01:14:24,510
Opposed?

880
01:14:26,940 --> 01:14:27,820
OK, carries.

881
01:14:28,160 --> 01:14:28,760
I thought about it.

882
01:14:30,800 --> 01:14:32,460
Any other business, Sean?

883
01:14:32,700 --> 01:14:33,400
No other business.

884
01:14:33,920 --> 01:14:34,600
Any other communications?

885
01:14:35,040 --> 01:14:35,800
And out at this time, no.

886
01:14:36,060 --> 01:14:39,540
I accept to note that immediately following this regular meeting

887
01:14:39,540 --> 01:14:42,860
and we determined we are moving into a study session where

888
01:14:42,860 --> 01:14:45,140
we'll be discussing the zoning code update

889
01:14:45,820 --> 01:14:48,000
and expanding neighborhood housing options.

890
01:14:48,920 --> 01:14:49,060
Great.

891
01:14:49,380 --> 01:14:50,160
Anything else for anyone?

892
01:14:50,880 --> 01:14:53,100
With that, this meeting is adjourned.