[9:10] the delaware house delaware
[9:12] housing department task force
[9:14] meeting is called to order in
[9:16] accordance with HCR74 members of
[9:18] the public can participate
[9:20] either in person or virtually
[9:22] through Zoom webinar the public
[9:22] can participate virtually by
[9:24] registering through the meeting
[9:25] link posted on the general
[9:28] assembly's website instructions
[9:28] for providing public comment are
[9:30] available on the website under
[9:31] this taskorce meeting's notice
[9:32] and we'll also be shared during
[9:34] the public comment portion of
[9:36] the hearing members of the
[9:37] public physically present for
[9:37] the meeting
[9:40] and would like to provide a
[9:42] comment may sign up on the
[9:44] speaker's list today's task
[9:44] force meeting will begin with
[9:46] roll call attendance and a task
[9:48] force meeting members present
[9:50] sorry for the hesitation we
[9:51] thought Senatoruckxton wasn't
[9:52] coming that he came right in
[9:53] time look at that
[9:57] coachchairharris present
[9:59] cochairhoffner
[10:00] presidentpresentative Smith
[10:01] SenatorBuxton
[10:06] ' ll be right back I'm gonna go
[10:09] get a suit and tie appreciate
[10:09] that
[10:13] uhrector heckles I'm here deputy
[10:14] secretary sheffert
[10:18] state planning director Edjill
[10:21] tro ll er generaliller
[10:26] deputyc deputy secretary cob
[10:27] right
[10:30] having a quorum present we will
[10:32] begin our task force the first
[10:35] agenda item is to vote on our
[10:37] previous minutes dated Thursday
[10:40] September2ieth2025 and Thursday
[10:41] December182025.
[10:46] people take a moment to look it
[10:47] over
[10:50] look them over
[10:51] push into a griff
[10:56] have a a motion to approve
[11:00] both sides all in favor say aye
[11:02] all opposed no
[11:06] having received the required
[11:10] number carries with that said
[11:13] our next agenda item is going to
[11:14] be with the delaware association
[11:17] of realtors their presentation
[11:20] gentle reminder reminder that
[11:22] you will have15 minutes give or
[11:23] take and then followed by a
[11:23] question and answer
[11:30] did we have two minutes to
[11:31] approve?
[11:34] yes said you said I'm sorry I'm
[11:35] sorry missed upper
[11:36] right good morning everyone
[11:42] thank you for the opportunity to
[11:43] speak with you today. my name is
[11:46] Wesley Stefaic and I am the CEO
[11:47] of the delaware association of
[11:48] Realtors. We represent the
[11:50] majority of delaware's licensed
[11:51] real estate professionals
[11:52] realtors working in all three
[11:54] counties at every price point in
[11:56] every community the state has
[11:59] cities small towns farmlands and
[12:01] of course the beaches we
[12:02] appreciate the seriousness with
[12:03] which you approach this issue
[12:04] and we want to share our on the
[12:06] ground perspective as the people
[12:07] who work in delaware's real
[12:07] estate marketplace every single
[12:08] day
[12:10] ex t slide please
[12:17] the delaware association
[12:18] Realtors exist to preserve,
[12:20] protect and advance the right of
[12:21] real property ownership fore
[12:24] every delawarean we call
[12:24] ourselves the voice of real
[12:26] estate in delaware and when we
[12:27] say real estate we mean all of
[12:29] it residential commercial
[12:29] property management and land
[12:32] today is about housing so we'll
[12:34] focus on that but for what it's
[12:35] worth knowing DAr represents
[12:37] every corner of the
[12:39] industrylongside our three local
[12:40] boards which is the newcastle
[12:42] County Board of Realtors the
[12:42] Kent County association of
[12:44] Realtors and the Sussex County
[12:46] Association realtors and in
[12:47] partnership with the national
[12:48] association of Realtors we
[12:50] support thousands of
[12:50] professionals whose daily work
[12:52] is helping people buy, sell and
[12:54] rent property the majority of it
[12:56] homes excuse me in every corner
[12:58] of the state just a quick note
[12:59] on the terms just so everyone's
[13:00] on the same
[13:02] page onlyly members of the
[13:04] national association of Realtors
[13:06] can call can use the title
[13:08] realtor and then and every one
[13:09] of our members is licensed by
[13:10] the delaware Realeststate
[13:12] Commission and they also
[13:12] subscribe to the national
[13:16] association's code of ethics not
[13:17] all real estate agents are
[13:19] realtors DAR counts the majority
[13:20] of the state's real estate
[13:22] licensees among our members so
[13:24] what you'll hear from me today
[13:24] reflects that experience of most
[13:26] professionals working in
[13:28] delaware's housing market the
[13:28] numbers are somewhere around I
[13:29] have4200 members
[13:31] and there's about
[13:34] 2000 more other types of
[13:36] licensees in the stateext
[13:36] slide please
[13:38] our members pretty much created
[13:40] and still facilitate delaware's
[13:42] real estate marketplace. They
[13:44] handle most of the transactions
[13:45] that occur in the state each
[13:46] year and every one of those
[13:47] transactions generates revenue
[13:49] through through the state realty
[13:50] transfer tax making our
[13:52] member's' daily work one of the
[13:54] engines of state revenueccording
[13:56] to the state's own June202ix
[13:58] revenue forecast from Dfa the
[13:58] realty transfersfer tax
[14:00] collections are projected
[14:02] at247.4 million this fiscal year
[14:04] climbing to258.4 million by
[14:06] fiscal year2028. that's nearly
[14:08] a quarter of a billion dollars a
[14:10] year flowing into the state
[14:12] budget generated directly by the
[14:14] transactions our members handle
[14:14] but our role goes beyond the
[14:17] closing table. Our members are
[14:18] very often the first people to
[14:20] tell a first time buyer that
[14:21] delaware offers down payment
[14:22] assistance through the delaware
[14:24] state housing Authority or that
[14:26] a transfer tax exemption exists
[14:28] for first time buyers that
[14:29] information does no good sitting
[14:30] in a brochure or simply on a
[14:32] website it does good when a
[14:33] realtor's able to put it in
[14:34] their client's hands in front of
[14:34] them
[14:36] ex t slide please
[14:40] we're investing our own
[14:42] resources not public funds in
[14:43] consumer education we're
[14:44] building a statewide housing
[14:46] resource website to help
[14:46] delaware delawareans find
[14:49] housing programs and educational
[14:51] materials in one place we're
[14:52] also launching a companion site
[14:54] focused on financial literacy
[14:55] for prospective buyers and
[14:57] you'll find the details of those
[14:58] websites in our written comments
[15:00] if you want to review them. I'm
[15:01] not going to say theurL's out
[15:02] loud but if you have my written
[15:04] comments you can find those and
[15:05] take a look for yourselves. They
[15:06] haven't launched yet but we got
[15:07] them up and running just so you
[15:08] can see what we'
[15:09] re working on
[15:11] uhA does not receive or
[15:12] administer any public housing
[15:14] funds our most significant
[15:17] resources are people a statewide
[15:18] network of realtors local boards
[15:20] and staff that reaches every
[15:21] community in delaware and we
[15:22] regularly volunteer that network
[15:24] in support of housing
[15:25] initiativesext slide please
[15:30] so we already work directly
[15:32] withdSHA our members volunteer
[15:32] their time in professional
[15:34] expertise and projects the
[15:36] authority manages we partner
[15:36] withdSHha and the homeme
[15:38] buildilders association to host
[15:40] the delaware real estate summit
[15:41] registration closes Friday if
[15:42] you're interested it's next
[15:44] Thursday so you can still sign
[15:46] up we partner to bring that
[15:48] so that the public and private
[15:50] sides of delaware real estate
[15:52] can share data and coordinate on
[15:53] solutions and every time we
[15:54] educate our own members
[15:56] aboutdSHA's loan programme
[15:57] products and assistance
[15:59] programs those members carry
[16:01] that knowledge into every
[16:02] community they serve in effect
[16:04] our membership functions as a
[16:05] statewide distribution network
[16:06] for the state's own housing
[16:09] programs I've also personally
[16:10] myself served on the
[16:10] stateffordable housing
[16:12] Production task forcece and
[16:12] we'll be on the new rights and
[16:14] responsibilitiesittee for
[16:15] landlords and enants which is
[16:16] getting started next next
[16:18] monthext slide please
[16:22] all right I can't come up here
[16:24] and not talk about it. I want to
[16:24] spend just a moment on the
[16:26] single greatest barriers our
[16:28] members see and that's the
[16:28] realty transfer tax at a
[16:32] combined rate of4% in most of
[16:33] delaware it's the highest state
[16:34] levelve transfer tax in the
[16:36] country collected at closing on
[16:38] top of the down payment on
[16:40] today's medium home price and I
[16:41] provided everybody a recent
[16:44] numbers in front of you on
[16:44] the today's meeting on home
[16:48] price of419450 dollars that's a
[16:48] transfer tax bill of
[16:49] roughly16,800 dollars
[16:53] or about $8400 for each the
[16:53] buyer and the seller
[16:57] the first time buyer reduction
[16:58] helps but it's capped at2000
[17:00] dollars and only applies to the
[17:00] first400,000 of value
[17:04] so for a lower or moderate
[17:06] income family that gap is often
[17:07] the difference between buying a
[17:08] home and remain remaining a
[17:08] renter
[17:11] and it's not a marginal line
[17:12] item the state's own forecast
[17:14] already counts on this tax to
[17:14] deliver close to a quarter
[17:16] billion dollars a year growing
[17:18] every year purely because our
[17:18] members keep closing
[17:19] transactions.
[17:22] the gap between owning and
[17:24] renting isn't just about
[17:25] transfer tax though it's about
[17:26] financial literacyc according to
[17:28] the Federal Reserve's2022 cons
[17:31] survey of consumer finances the
[17:34] median homeowner's net worth is
[17:37] roughly396,00 compared to
[17:40] just10,400 dollars for renters
[17:43] that's a gap of about38 times
[17:44] and it holds across nearly every
[17:45] age group
[17:48] that's part of why DAR is
[17:50] launching the financial literary
[17:52] literacy website for delawareans
[17:54] that I mentioned on the
[17:56] previous slides I know from my
[17:57] own experience I'm a former
[17:58] credit union chairman I served
[18:00] on the board of the delaware
[18:02] Mortgage Bankers association
[18:02] the delaware Council for
[18:04] Economic Education and I'm
[18:06] actually still supervisory
[18:06] chairman for a credit union here
[18:08] in delaware we know that just
[18:10] basic financial literacy eludes
[18:12] a lot of our friends and
[18:13] neighbors deer for it's
[18:14] everyday to improve the
[18:15] conditions for homeownership and
[18:15] more delaware delawareans
[18:18] can build generational wealth
[18:21] when my members and I raised
[18:22] concerns about the transfer tax
[18:26] you repeat what you just said
[18:28] please more specifically what's
[18:30] that just before you let into
[18:31] that
[18:34] you were explaining something
[18:34] about challenges in financial
[18:35] literacy
[18:38] right before that what was it
[18:40] that you were using as the
[18:42] example the survey of consumer
[18:44] what we yeah what was that
[18:47] soederalreserves it's the2022
[18:48] survey I believe it might be the
[18:51] last one the survey of consumer
[18:53] finances the median homeowner's
[18:56] net worth is roughly396,000
[18:58] compared to renters which
[18:59] is10,400 dollars
[19:04] so when my members and I raised
[19:06] concerns about the transfer tax
[19:06] it's just not abstract it's high
[19:08] nobodybody can dispute that and
[19:10] has to be paid at settlement it
[19:11] just can't be rolled into the
[19:12] mortgageext slide please
[19:16] realtors likely have the largest
[19:18] impact of any group in delaware
[19:21] to build generational wealth
[19:22] because we create and facilitate
[19:23] the marketplace through which
[19:24] most people acquire their single
[19:26] largest asset, their home we
[19:28] want a genuine partnership with
[19:29] the state not only in helping
[19:30] families get into homes small
[19:32] business buy a small businesses
[19:34] buy a building or larger
[19:36] businesses expand but in helping
[19:38] all of them stay here through
[19:39] coordinated outreach on
[19:41] foreclosure prevention homeme
[19:43] repair resources and just basic
[19:43] general consumer assistance
[19:46] our members are not observers in
[19:48] this market they are in it in
[19:50] every day in every community and
[19:51] when a policy makes a closing
[19:54] fall apart or policy or prices a
[19:54] first time buyers out of a
[19:56] neighborhood or makes the profit
[19:58] and loss statement no longer
[19:59] makes sense for businesses my
[20:00] members see it often long before
[20:02] it shows up in any state data
[20:04] sets that's why our interest in
[20:06] the state ins excuse me that's
[20:08] why our interests and the
[20:10] state's interests are aligned
[20:11] realtors succeed only when
[20:12] delawareans can buy, sell and
[20:13] keep their homes and properties
[20:16] a standing seat at the table
[20:17] whether through some sort of
[20:18] advisory role or simply
[20:20] consultation before
[20:22] rulemaking or lawmaking would
[20:24] cost the state little and help
[20:26] avoid unintended consequencesext
[20:27] slide please
[20:30] on the structural question
[20:32] before this task force I just
[20:34] want to be direct we believe the
[20:34] delaware state housing Authority
[20:36] is the best organization in the
[20:38] state to carry out the goals
[20:39] you're considering DSHA has
[20:40] decades of institutional
[20:42] knowledge established federal
[20:44] funding relationships and
[20:46] existing statewide programs
[20:47] rather than building a new
[20:48] department from scratch with the
[20:49] cost duplication and disruption
[20:51] that may entail we believe the
[20:52] state can accomplish its aims
[20:54] through a renaming or
[20:56] reorganization of the authority
[20:57] in many different ways paired
[20:57] with additional financial
[20:58] support for dedicated
[21:01] consumer assistance function if
[21:02] that is what you're seeking if
[21:04] these presentations that we've
[21:06] seen over the last few meetings
[21:07] have taught us anything. it's
[21:08] that state government already
[21:10] offers a wide range of housing
[21:12] related programs scattered
[21:12] across many different
[21:14] departments with no single place
[21:16] to find them all closing that
[21:18] gap is exactly why we were
[21:18] developing our website
[21:21] we're not finished with it like
[21:22] I said but if the state wants to
[21:24] take this on be our guest that's
[21:24] fine
[21:25] ex t slide please
[21:29] whateverever structure does
[21:32] emerge we do have one overriding
[21:33] concern the general assembly
[21:34] should not surrender its own
[21:35] authority by delegating
[21:37] rulemaking power that affects
[21:40] property owners to an executive
[21:41] agencycisions that touch the
[21:42] property rights of delawareans
[21:44] should remain with the people's
[21:46] elected representatives who
[21:48] directly answered to voters this
[21:49] is our most significant concern
[21:50] with any reorganization of
[21:51] government authority over
[21:53] housing and we urge this task
[21:54] force to make preservation of
[21:56] legislative authority and
[21:56] explicit principle in your
[21:57] recommendations
[21:58] ex t slide please
[22:02] if the goal's a onetop shop were
[22:02] any delawarean confined housing
[22:04] resources state provides as I
[22:06] said we don't believe that's a
[22:07] new department it requires a
[22:08] wellstaffed consumer hotline and
[22:11] a wellsign well designed website
[22:12] and like I said we're already
[22:14] building that ourselves we also
[22:16] think that maybe the211
[22:18] resources could be improved as
[22:19] well if the state does invest in
[22:21] new functions we recommend they
[22:22] be a consumer facing and service
[22:24] oriented navigation for
[22:26] assistance for first time buyers
[22:27] a clear front door to down
[22:28] payment and a repair programs
[22:29] and coord
[22:31] ination among the agencies and
[22:32] nonprofits that are already
[22:33] touch housing
[22:36] Next slide please delaware's
[22:37] housing challenge is
[22:38] fundamentally one of
[22:40] affordability and supply not
[22:43] insufficient bureaucracy look at
[22:44] where the market stands right
[22:46] now as of July delaware has
[22:50] had5760 active listings
[22:54] statewide sales1210 homes and5.5
[22:58] once.5 months of supply which we
[23:00] can actually say is a rather
[23:01] balanced market at this point in
[23:02] time. but the median sales price
[23:03] is up4.8% year over
[23:07] year to419,450 while sales
[23:10] volume is essentially flat up
[23:11] less than1% from a year ago.
[23:14] delawareans aren't staying out
[23:14] of the market because there's no
[23:16] state department to help them
[23:18] they're being simply priced out
[23:20] the most impactful steps the
[23:21] state can take are to lower the
[23:22] costs of buying a home starting
[23:24] with relief from the nation's
[23:24] highest
[23:28] transfer tax to support the
[23:28] production of new housing and to
[23:30] strengthen the agency that
[23:31] already does this work so
[23:34] well last slide and I just
[23:34] want to say thank you for your
[23:36] time today if you have any
[23:38] questions feel free but always
[23:40] consider the delaware state
[23:41] delaware association of realtors
[23:42] as a partner with any housing
[23:43] matters so thank you
[23:44] thank you any questions
[23:46] Director heckles
[23:52] first thanks the realtors are
[23:52] a great partner and in all of
[23:55] this with our first time
[23:56] home buyer mortgage program
[23:58] especially the sort of the
[24:01] flagship of homeownership atdSHA
[24:04] you talked about legislative
[24:04] authority
[24:08] and rulemaking power but
[24:10] vaguely is there anything that
[24:11] you have in mind about that that
[24:12] that would that would help me
[24:13] understand exactly what you mean
[24:14] there
[24:16] I believe where we're concerned
[24:18] if this new department is set up
[24:19] that they are now just
[24:22] rulemaking we believe that
[24:22] anything related to housing
[24:23] really should be a conversation
[24:25] in the legislature rather than
[24:26] going through the regulatory
[24:27] process for whatever topic
[24:30] I'm sure there's many we could
[24:32] talk about but you don't have a
[24:34] specific no the general concerns
[24:35] general concern yeah
[24:40] p re s ent ative s mi th
[24:44] thank you madam chairir Wes
[24:46] thanks for your presentation
[24:47] appreciate you bringing up the
[24:50] realty transfer tax I think
[24:50] we raised that to the highest in
[24:52] the nation the year before I was
[24:54] elected I think every year we've
[24:56] tried to put a bill forward to
[24:56] lower that we get I think
[25:00] in the arguments collectively in
[25:02] the building on exactly if
[25:04] that's a good or bad way of
[25:06] doing tax policy but at the end
[25:08] of the day it is hard earned
[25:08] money in every one of our
[25:11] constituents pockets that
[25:13] they're losing on that so it
[25:14] would be a proponent of of doing
[25:16] that knowing that we'd be giving
[25:18] that it was supposed to be a
[25:19] temporary tax kind of like the
[25:20] gross receipts tax but yet here
[25:22] we are with that too just to use
[25:24] that as an example I think it's
[25:26] hard to talk to people on our
[25:26] position sometimes and really
[25:27] advocate for that because
[25:30] what I've found in my short
[25:31] tenure long tenure whatever it
[25:34] is at this point is that once
[25:36] you get the money it's hard to
[25:37] then give it back but I just
[25:38] want to bring it full circle
[25:40] real quick if you give me a
[25:42] little leniency is I was door
[25:42] knocking talking to some
[25:45] constituents around that have
[25:47] adults with disabilities and one
[25:48] of the things that I was very
[25:50] daunting to me as we passed
[25:52] theigngnesbeac before I was
[25:54] elected as well but was an
[25:54] unfunded mandate that we still
[25:56] have yet to fulfill our promise
[25:57] on on paying direct
[26:00] support professionals and other
[26:02] to the what they should to
[26:02] deliver that service we should
[26:04] probably fulfill those promises
[26:06] first and lower things like this
[26:08] versus continuing to add new
[26:10] programs or new offices
[26:12] sometimes what I find adding the
[26:13] new office isn't necessarily the
[26:14] way to go it's the partnership
[26:16] model that is generally
[26:18] strengthening it because I find
[26:20] folks in your situation or your
[26:22] association market better
[26:24] than the government does so
[26:25] every time the government opens
[26:26] up a website markk that's not
[26:27] marketing marketing
[26:30] is putting dollars behind
[26:31] something so people know where
[26:33] to go as a onetop shop to do
[26:34] something so a website alone
[26:37] will not do that as you very
[26:38] well know so appreciate your
[26:41] conversation and hopefully we
[26:43] can do more around this but if
[26:44] we're not willing to put dollars
[26:46] behind where the office is like
[26:46] we do about so many other
[26:48] officess that we create we're
[26:50] probably just going to be back
[26:51] here again next year talking
[26:51] about the same thing so thank
[26:52] you
[26:54] you mind if
[26:57] I would say take a look at that
[27:00] website theurRL's in the written
[27:00] comments you know the goal
[27:04] for us is and and you've seen
[27:05] and heard that through the
[27:06] presentations that we've had is
[27:06] that
[27:08] there's so many different
[27:09] programs out there from many
[27:10] different departments and then
[27:12] there's so many other external
[27:14] programs also but there is no
[27:16] nice central database we're
[27:18] building that for our members
[27:19] right now but it's obviously
[27:20] open to the public and it's
[27:22] designed to be a public resource
[27:24] that's our small foray into
[27:26] trying to fix this problem to
[27:27] make
[27:28] all the information kind of more
[27:30] in one place so people can find
[27:31] it
[27:34] thank you so much any other
[27:38] questions Senator buxton sure
[27:40] appreciated the presentation
[27:41] the information and those types
[27:41] of things and
[27:44] I was at a function last night
[27:46] the realty transferred taxes it
[27:47] is easy to be celebrated
[27:50] but it is certainly not that
[27:51] easy to implement it's
[27:54] some million dollar hole in the
[27:55] budget which I'm in favor of
[27:58] I'm absolutely in favor of but
[28:00] in order to do that you're going
[28:02] to have to look at some serious
[28:04] decisions about what are we not
[28:07] going to to spend fund or expand
[28:08] or where we going to get the
[28:10] dollars from see just you really
[28:11] have to you can't it's not that
[28:13] simple to just say cla it back
[28:16] to3% right but if somebody sends
[28:18] a bill out my way that has that
[28:18] I am all in
[28:21] right so don't don't get it
[28:22] twisted but I really want if
[28:23] we're gonna go down that road
[28:24] let's have these real
[28:26] conversations about how we do
[28:27] that. I think there's other
[28:27] avenues
[28:30] if the pure intent the goal is
[28:34] the initial homeownership from
[28:34] first time home buyers
[28:38] let's really go all in let's not
[28:39] nickel and dimonmon at a half%
[28:40] let's not nickel and dime it it
[28:42] capping it at2000 let's
[28:45] let's have the state go all in
[28:45] when it comes to
[28:48] you know supporting home
[28:50] ownership for the first time
[28:52] homeowners so and I know there's
[28:54] some language out there in bills
[28:55] I was the sponsor of one
[28:58] but I really think that that
[28:59] it's a very popular thing to say
[29:00] I think it's an impactful and
[29:02] important thing to say what I
[29:04] think we need to do is take a
[29:05] couple of the decision makers
[29:06] that are in control the majority
[29:08] party and come down and come in
[29:10] with something very concrete
[29:11] that we can do next year
[29:12] specific to first timers but I
[29:14] will say this and this is
[29:15] important
[29:18] cause I'm having this
[29:18] conversation with my son
[29:22] and'm I'm a realtor so a realtor
[29:24] so I you know have people reach
[29:26] out to me how can you get my my
[29:28] child started and what I tell
[29:30] him is this think of it the same
[29:30] way we thought of degrees back
[29:31] in the day
[29:34] right where degrees where the
[29:35] end all to be
[29:37] if the market and the home that
[29:38] you're looking to get and the
[29:40] numbers that they produce when
[29:41] you buy
[29:41] don't add up
[29:46] then it is better to look at a a
[29:46] rental situation
[29:50] as long as you're taking the
[29:51] money if there is a savings to
[29:51] be had
[29:52] and invest in it
[29:56] the same way you do when you
[29:58] make a mortgage payment it
[30:00] typically comes back in an
[30:02] investment down the road because
[30:03] there's value in the home
[30:07] if you are in a rental situation
[30:08] where you can convince a young
[30:08] renter
[30:10] to invest in a market of sorts
[30:15] then you're not then you do have
[30:18] thatho that that income that
[30:19] household wealth that individual
[30:22] wealth that we talk about so I
[30:24] just really literally real
[30:25] conversations that I'm having
[30:26] with my son he's looking out
[30:27] there and trying to find a home
[30:30] to purchase and get started and
[30:31] when again I'm saying is
[30:35] if you're if you end up in a h
[30:36] he thinks your dream home and
[30:38] you're paying3600 dollars a
[30:40] month on a home that you have
[30:42] paid top dollar for that's not
[30:43] just be careful
[30:46] anyway so good conversation we
[30:46] had
[30:50] Senator Hfner
[30:53] thank you thank you for coming
[30:55] in today I hope you're enjoying
[30:57] your summer a a little bit so
[30:59] I'm excited about the pathways
[31:02] to keys website and how would
[31:04] that work with neighborhood good
[31:05] because you know over the years
[31:06] they've tried to do financial
[31:08] literacy to help people get into
[31:10] homes could it be like a
[31:12] combination type of thing yeah
[31:14] so what we've discovered is
[31:15] there are plenty of programs out
[31:16] there there's no lack of
[31:17] financial literacy programs for
[31:19] sure especially in delaware
[31:20] there's also many different
[31:20] programs that just operate
[31:24] as financial literacy schools if
[31:25] you will the state
[31:26] treasurer's office also has a
[31:28] great website that has a lot of
[31:30] resources. Our goal with this is
[31:31] to kind of consolidate it all in
[31:33] one place is kind of a navigator
[31:36] the path the pathway to try
[31:36] to figure out you know
[31:39] where someone fits in and then
[31:41] find the resources that already
[31:43] exist all we're doing is
[31:44] redirecting them and hopefully
[31:46] at the end of it they're
[31:48] working with a realtor that can
[31:49] help them through the rest of
[31:49] the process
[31:50] oh sorry
[31:53] did this idea like when we
[31:55] started this last year did that
[31:56] idea come out of that or you
[31:58] were already working on it yeah
[31:59] we were already working on it
[32:01] and was it very costly to get
[32:02] this website up and running
[32:08] not at all it's funny you
[32:10] know we talked about ai AI is
[32:10] definitely helping a lot with a
[32:12] lot of different things like
[32:14] this and now it doesn't cost
[32:16] that much it's just verification
[32:18] of information is the biggest
[32:20] time commitment to the project
[32:22] so that has to be done that is
[32:24] obviously costly in some ways
[32:26] but not developing a website
[32:28] anymore. OK so and then also the
[32:29] last part of
[32:32] we do have a lot of realtors so
[32:33] they're you marketing piece
[32:33] they're going out and meeting
[32:36] people and saying hey go go to
[32:38] this website and look to see
[32:41] where you're going to fall in
[32:44] are you going to do any other
[32:45] marketing piece to let people
[32:46] know this is out there
[32:50] it's not launched officially I
[32:51] wanted to share it with all of
[32:53] you but we're going to do a big
[32:54] marketing push around that
[32:56] website so people know where to
[32:56] go
[33:00] deputy secretary
[33:04] I felt like I wasn't going to
[33:07] talk this round but then a
[33:09] couple of questions so
[33:10] understanding what you said that
[33:12] delawareringers are outpriced or
[33:14] and then you talked about the
[33:18] real t transfer tax at4%
[33:20] a400,000 dollars home with the
[33:22] median income of delawareans
[33:26] is that on on par for with the
[33:26] medium income is
[33:30] so is it100,000 dollars
[33:32] for400,000 dollars home how much
[33:34] do you have to make or is are
[33:35] you saying that the realty
[33:38] transfer tax at4%16,000 dollars
[33:40] is what's out pricing
[33:40] delawareans just so I'm clear
[33:46] it's part of it for sure you
[33:47] have to have that cash at
[33:49] closing at settlement so you
[33:49] have to already be saving for it
[33:54] to get to that point you know
[33:55] you have to consider that
[33:57] everything else it costs to have
[33:59] property have a home too
[34:00] insurance rates are going
[34:02] through the roof across the
[34:04] state across the country
[34:04] everything else with local
[34:06] taxation right now is a big
[34:07] discussion so I'm not sure I'm
[34:07] answering your question but
[34:10] guess what other fact when I
[34:11] heard the median
[34:14] price for a home is41ine as
[34:16] thought about all the
[34:17] delawarenes that will never be
[34:18] able to hit that mark for where
[34:20] they are right now and what
[34:22] other tools we're trying to
[34:24] bring into the toolbox to get
[34:26] them to be able to even afford
[34:28] to be in that that sandbox to
[34:30] think about a400,000 dollars
[34:32] house what does that what does
[34:34] the universe look like in in the
[34:36] state's inventory if that's the
[34:37] median there are a lot of
[34:38] delawareans that will never be
[34:40] able to qualify for400,000
[34:41] dollars home that's not their
[34:41] reality and
[34:44] so what does that lower price
[34:46] point look like so that we can
[34:47] get more delawareans into home
[34:49] ownership yeah I can't say I can
[34:50] sit here right now and answer
[34:52] that it would just depend
[34:54] everyone's backgrounds
[34:56] everyone's needs and wants
[34:58] are going to be different I
[34:58] don't I can't sit here and give
[35:00] you a number for across the
[35:02] board it's something we can work
[35:03] on and gathering more
[35:04] information for sure but I can't
[35:05] do that right now
[35:08] p re s ent ative s mi th
[35:13] thank you madam chair just a few
[35:14] things to kind of level set us
[35:16] like one don't forget the
[35:18] competition for delawareans are
[35:20] people from New Jersey and
[35:22] Pennsylvania and others that
[35:24] have no problem paying any tax
[35:25] because they've just been paying
[35:26] double or triple that tax ever
[35:30] since while while simultaneously
[35:32] forcing a lot of delawareans to
[35:34] now pay higher tax after
[35:36] reassessment just to talk about
[35:38] like myself and others right we
[35:40] we we buy houses we try to you
[35:40] know
[35:43] have a place to establish our
[35:44] families our kids my personal
[35:47] mortgage has gone up over $800 a
[35:49] month afterristina took the
[35:52] additional10% insurance rates
[35:54] through the roof but the reason
[35:55] why the realty transfer tax is
[35:56] important for that is that is
[35:58] cash I have to have at closing
[36:00] so if you don't have a family
[36:02] member if you don't have that
[36:04] money on you and you don't have
[36:05] a family member that can gift
[36:06] that to you or you can't get a
[36:08] loan which then you're taking
[36:10] another loan out on a loan that
[36:11] you're about to take right
[36:13] you're already pricing yourself
[36:14] out of the market completely so
[36:16] there's very few things we're
[36:19] going to tangibly be able to do
[36:21] in this process in order to do
[36:22] that because of the way the
[36:24] market is from national force
[36:26] perspective when it comes to the
[36:28] insurance side the interest
[36:32] rate side I mean I will never
[36:34] redo my interest rate at this
[36:35] point because I got it during C
[36:38] coID when it was the smallest
[36:40] almost ever right and the same
[36:40] point
[36:42] to the rental side of it
[36:46] rentals are going up for
[36:48] delawareans that can't afford to
[36:50] buy homes either because a lot
[36:52] of people we like to go after
[36:54] kind of a large renter meaning
[36:56] they have multiple rentals
[36:58] like10 or more20 or more the
[37:00] problem is we also have a ton of
[37:01] people in our state that have
[37:04] one or two generally one because
[37:06] they're trying to keep it to
[37:07] provide for a loved one or
[37:08] somebody later in their life
[37:10] where they had to raise the rent
[37:12] on their rental for that renter
[37:13] because
[37:16] their price went up on their
[37:18] mortgage to provide it and so
[37:20] they're not making money off of
[37:20] that they have to raise it
[37:22] because their taxes their
[37:24] insurance and everything have
[37:25] gone up so we're also going to
[37:26] have that other issue with those
[37:28] types of people are going to
[37:30] sell cause they don't want to
[37:31] have to deal with the renter
[37:32] that has more rights than they
[37:36] do in order to get out of that
[37:37] market which is going to create
[37:38] another housing crisis as well
[37:40] so I just want to make sure we
[37:42] level set on all of those things
[37:42] because that's important when we
[37:43] think about things
[37:45] and tangible things that can be
[37:45] done on our level
[37:51] what is the reason why the
[37:52] transfer tax can't be rolled
[37:53] into the mortgage
[37:56] that's why I was asked this a
[37:58] couple of months ago and now
[37:58] they gave a better answer that
[38:00] I'm about to give the banks
[38:02] just won't do it it's that
[38:04] simple it's a risk already
[38:06] they have an asset they can take
[38:07] with the property they can't do
[38:07] that with the taxes
[38:13] senator buxton
[38:16] that's in a nutshell right there
[38:17] they're basing a loan on the
[38:18] value of the home the taxes is
[38:19] separate but
[38:24] it's an interesting relationship
[38:25] because I know we're not into
[38:25] this space
[38:27] but when you talk about
[38:28] affordable housing when you talk
[38:30] about government intervention
[38:32] and renting there's a direct
[38:34] causation relationship between
[38:36] state rental vouchers federal
[38:38] rental vouchers and the
[38:40] competition it creates in the
[38:42] market that it sets when it
[38:44] comes to rental units in the
[38:46] private sector that was just
[38:48] dealing with a client just the
[38:50] other day ine unit property all
[38:51] of them
[38:54] not all of them e of the ine are
[38:57] backed by government vouchers
[38:57] and
[39:01] he was talking about the current
[39:02] owner was talking about this the
[39:04] market the number that I'm
[39:05] charging is higher than the
[39:05] actual market would be
[39:08] because of the guaranteed number
[39:10] that the government's presenting
[39:12] so it's an interesting challenge
[39:14] that we have because we want
[39:16] folks to get it but when we do
[39:18] that we then the person that
[39:20] doesn't qualify for this has to
[39:22] pay more so it's worthy of a
[39:24] conversation to be had I want to
[39:25] say this
[39:25] delaware is unique
[39:29] that400ousand dollars number
[39:34] is an accurate number but you
[39:36] have to unpack it because of
[39:38] what you said you have folks
[39:40] coming down paying cash having
[39:42] the affordability problem not be
[39:44] theirs that's why you don't see
[39:46] gross stopping you would expect
[39:48] it to stop when we moved to a4%
[39:51] the argument was it was going to
[39:51] shut down development
[39:53] le ar ly that didn't happen
[39:56] so the fear factor of shutting
[39:58] it down isn't there because you
[40:01] have retirees coming in fueling
[40:02] the market but what is under
[40:04] that are people in delaware that
[40:06] can't afford the market now and
[40:10] so how do you fix it and and
[40:10] I really think that getting
[40:11] after it with the
[40:14] you know the first time
[40:15] homebuyers especially is really
[40:15] key
[40:18] making sure that folks are
[40:20] educated when it means to rent
[40:23] and setting up other means of
[40:24] building wealth until they're
[40:27] ready sometimes that wealth is
[40:30] developing a savings account so
[40:32] that they have a higher down
[40:34] payment that includes a pmI
[40:36] payoff20% these are all valuable
[40:38] things that a renter can
[40:39] actually get to
[40:42] so that when it's right when the
[40:44] time is right they're in a home
[40:44] that they want
[40:46] that they can then build
[40:48] an investment on because it
[40:49] takes a while
[40:51] to get to but that's education
[40:52] so
[40:54] anyway thank you
[41:02] so and speaking about the
[41:03] delaware
[41:06] that I've referred to sometimes
[41:06] the delaware market rate right
[41:10] there I have had conversations
[41:12] with property owners some some
[41:14] realtors around what it would
[41:16] look like to have like a cost
[41:18] disclosure again if if if costs
[41:20] for the owner is going up and
[41:22] we're saying hey it's unfair
[41:23] people are raising their prices
[41:25] too high and there needs to be a
[41:28] cap right but then we hear from
[41:29] the owners we we can't afford a
[41:30] cat because our prices are going
[41:32] up but then when we talk about
[41:34] well how do we figure out a
[41:36] delaware market rate and have a
[41:38] space where you disclose what
[41:38] your costs are to show
[41:40] that you're not just gouging
[41:42] folks people don't want that
[41:44] either and so like I I don't
[41:45] know I'm not putting you on the
[41:46] spot to have that answer but I
[41:48] do just want to throw out there
[41:50] that there is that space of
[41:51] trying to strike that balance
[41:53] knowing where you know how do we
[41:54] make sure we're protecting the
[41:56] property owner as well as the
[41:58] person who is renting or
[42:00] eventually going to own how
[42:02] do we make it so that it's
[42:04] actually delawareans dri driving
[42:05] up the costs and not
[42:06] corporations buying singlefamily
[42:08] homes or people coming from out
[42:08] of state
[42:12] purchasing homes as rental
[42:14] properties and not actually
[42:16] intending to live here you know
[42:18] what are the s where are the
[42:19] spaces where we can create that
[42:20] balance is something that I
[42:21] think is important kind of
[42:23] outside the purview of this task
[42:25] force but definitely things
[42:26] that we should be attacking and
[42:27] and appreciate you bringing
[42:28] that forward
[42:31] any other questions just good
[42:32] conversations for September3rd
[42:34] all right thank you so much
[42:44] next up we oh
[43:05] I thought we were upstairs and
[43:07] we were kind of chill upstairs
[43:14] moving on to the next agenda
[43:17] item housing alliance delaware
[43:22] and again fifteenin presentation
[43:22] followed by a question and
[43:23] answer
[43:28] Good morning
[43:32] the looks like a person there
[43:34] you go your name and position
[43:36] for the record please thank you
[43:38] for having me my name is Rachel
[43:38] Stucker I'm the director of
[43:41] Housing alliance Delaware we are
[43:43] a statewide nonprofit
[43:46] organization that works to
[43:48] address the issues of affordable
[43:49] housing and homelessness I
[43:50] appreciate the opportunity to
[43:50] come in
[43:52] talk with you all today. I
[43:54] really focused my presentation
[43:55] around a lot of the questions
[43:56] that were asked just about who
[43:58] we are and what we do and who we
[43:59] work with and how we partner
[43:59] with folks in the community
[44:02] but if you'd like um'm happy
[44:04] to weigh in on price gouging and
[44:06] other legislative issues if
[44:09] you'd like my opinions on those
[44:12] things as well so I'll just
[44:13] start by talking about who we
[44:14] are as I said we're statewide
[44:16] we're fairly small we are
[44:19] about14 full-time staff.alf of
[44:20] those staff members are working
[44:22] in the homeless helpline program
[44:23] which I'll talk about
[44:26] and we were actually formed
[44:28] in2016 as a result of the
[44:30] merging of two existing
[44:33] nonprofit organizations prior
[44:35] to201ix some of you may be
[44:36] familiar with the
[44:36] homemelesslanning co.
[44:40] it was created specifically
[44:42] to address homelessness and in
[44:42] response to the way that the
[44:44] federal government had
[44:44] structured how it
[44:48] gives funding to local
[44:50] communities for homelessness so
[44:52] it was created to respond to the
[44:54] federal government's funding
[44:56] structure to create a local
[44:58] structure through which that
[44:59] funding could come to delaware
[45:00] so it was very specific and
[45:04] focused on on that task. The
[45:06] other nonprofit organization
[45:07] that was part of the merger was
[45:08] the delawarehousing coalition
[45:12] the delawarehousing coalition
[45:12] was much more active
[45:14] inentonusssex counties than the
[45:16] homeless planning co although
[45:17] technically the homeless
[45:18] planning council was statewide
[45:21] and members of those
[45:23] boards one of them sits sits
[45:23] with us here today
[45:28] umrector heckles at the time
[45:30] was on the board of the
[45:30] homelesslanning co iss that
[45:32] correct or was it the coalition
[45:34] OK decided that merging the
[45:36] two nonprofits would be a good
[45:38] idea to bring together thefoable
[45:40] housing and homelessness issues
[45:42] under in the nonprofit sector
[45:44] under one organization which is
[45:45] howhousing alliance delaware was
[45:45] created
[45:50] and so what we've been trying to
[45:51] do since2016 I think
[45:54] as with a lot of things covid
[45:55] has made those things a little
[45:58] well maybe a little behind where
[45:59] where I would have envisioned we
[46:00] would be by now but to take
[46:02] those two missions of ending
[46:04] homelessness and solving the
[46:04] affordable housing crisis and
[46:05] really
[46:08] work on those simultaneously
[46:09] together as we know they are
[46:09] connected
[46:11] so
[46:16] our primary focus of our work is
[46:18] things happening at the state
[46:19] level so but we do partner
[46:21] with national nonprofit
[46:22] organizations and national
[46:24] advocacy organizations that are
[46:25] working to advance affordable
[46:26] housing and solve homelessness
[46:28] like the national lowcomehousing
[46:29] coalition and the
[46:29] nationalinstand Homelessness
[46:34] we operate four core programs.
[46:34] I'm going to start with the one
[46:36] that's the most confusing just
[46:38] to get it out of the way at
[46:39] least I think it's the most
[46:42] confusing the delaware continuum
[46:44] of careregrame. so when you hear
[46:45] us use the language delaware
[46:46] have you guys heard us talk
[46:47] about the delaware continuing of
[46:48] care you know it OK we could
[46:51] be talking about one of three
[46:53] different things but they all
[46:54] kind of mean the same thing so
[46:56] the delaware continuum of care
[46:58] is a membership group that
[46:58] anyone can join you all are
[46:59] welcome to join if you'd like
[47:02] anyone can join and be a member
[47:03] of the delaware continuum of
[47:06] carere. it means that you are
[47:08] working to address homelessness
[47:10] in the state of delaware so we
[47:11] very specifically target
[47:12] outreach to make sure we're
[47:14] representing lots of different
[47:14] right we have folks from the
[47:16] beaver health system folks from
[47:19] the justice system folks
[47:22] from education rights folks
[47:22] working in homeless service
[47:24] provider organizations and
[47:25] shelter programs folks from
[47:26] local governments are all
[47:28] members of the delaware
[47:28] continuum of care we have
[47:29] quarterly meetings there's a
[47:29] board
[47:32] a volunteer board that is voted
[47:34] on by the members that governs
[47:36] that structure right and that
[47:37] makes decisions for the COC
[47:40] so we're talking about a
[47:41] membership group that is
[47:43] statewide when we talk about
[47:44] the COC we're also talking about
[47:46] the system of care for people
[47:47] experiencing homelessness
[47:48] throughout the state of delaware
[47:50] so sometimes we say well the
[47:52] delaware COc is achieving xy and
[47:54] z when it comes to homelessness
[47:55] or isn't achieving xy and z when
[47:56] it comes to homelessness and
[47:57] when we use it that way what
[47:58] we're really talking about is
[48:00] the anyone who's providing a
[48:00] service to people experiencing
[48:01] homelessness in delaware
[48:04] is considered to be part of the
[48:05] delaware continuum of care
[48:06] regardless of what money they
[48:07] get, regardless of whether they
[48:08] operate with public funds or
[48:10] private funds they're part of
[48:11] the system of care supporting
[48:12] people experiencing homelessness
[48:14] and so that's sometimes we use
[48:15] the COC in that way as well
[48:19] and then of course the federal
[48:21] funds that we are responsible
[48:24] for bringing to delaware to
[48:24] support the work to address
[48:25] homelessness are called
[48:27] continuum of care funds so those
[48:28] are administered at the federal
[48:30] level it is the largest single
[48:32] bucket of funds to address
[48:33] homelessness in delaware last
[48:34] year
[48:37] yeah last year our award
[48:40] was11.8 million dollars and we
[48:42] are currently in the process of
[48:43] working through trying to
[48:45] continue to retain those funds
[48:45] to serve Delawareans which
[48:48] here's the whole thing we can
[48:50] talk about if you'd like
[48:51] going on with those federal
[48:53] funds but we are what's
[48:54] called the COC lead
[48:56] collaborative applicants so we
[48:58] are the entity that is the only
[49:00] entity that is responsible for
[49:02] and allowed to apply for those
[49:03] federal funds every community
[49:04] has to select an entity that
[49:06] applies for those dollars. We do
[49:08] not touch the money we help
[49:10] coordinate how nonprofits can
[49:12] apply for that money. we have a
[49:13] funding committee and a process
[49:16] we submit an application on
[49:20] behalf of of delaware to hu and
[49:22] the funds flowhud makes the
[49:23] final award decisions and funds
[49:24] flow directly to those
[49:26] nonprofits so we are not the a
[49:28] pass through organization in
[49:29] that way I think a lot of people
[49:29] think that we are
[49:33] so that's one that can be a
[49:35] little confusing that's the
[49:35] delaware COC
[49:38] we also operate the coordinated
[49:40] entry program for the delaware
[49:44] continuum of carere that's
[49:44] known locally as centralized
[49:46] intake or the homeless helpline
[49:52] that's the18333in bed number
[49:55] and happy to answer any
[49:58] questions about that program but
[50:00] I do want to so folks who are
[50:01] experiencing homelessness or in
[50:02] need of assistance can call that
[50:04] number and we do our best to try
[50:06] to help them understand whatre
[50:06] resources are available
[50:10] in their community. I do want
[50:11] to and and in some cases we're
[50:13] able to refer folks to resources
[50:14] the we do have a homeless
[50:16] helpline website on our webpage
[50:18] that I want to make you aware of
[50:20] it is a full listing of all
[50:21] of the homeless assistance
[50:22] resources in the entire state of
[50:23] delaware
[50:26] it may not include like a small
[50:28] program at a church that
[50:30] sometimes has some funds for
[50:30] like back rent
[50:33] sometimes and sometimes doesn't
[50:35] right it's not that localized
[50:36] and that specific but if you
[50:38] want to know what programs exist
[50:39] regardless of funding source in
[50:41] the state of delaware to serve
[50:42] people experiencing homelessness
[50:44] it should be on our website if
[50:46] it's not please let us know. We
[50:48] try to send folks towards that
[50:50] site to help them identify
[50:52] potential shelter programs or
[50:52] rental assistance programs that
[50:53] can help them
[50:56] one of the biggest challenges
[50:58] with operating that program is
[51:01] that most of those places don't
[51:03] have resources most of the time
[51:03] when most people need them
[51:06] so that is the biggest challenge
[51:07] that we faced with that program
[51:10] the next is the CMIs program
[51:14] it's delaware's homemeless
[51:16] Management Informationystem I'm
[51:17] sorry really quickly before you
[51:19] go just making sure we're on the
[51:21] same slide that you're on wasn't
[51:25] was just talking so if you can
[51:27] you pay'm still on four core
[51:28] program I'm still on four core
[51:30] programs and jumping around. I
[51:33] apologize o core programs and
[51:34] then when you go to the next one
[51:35] if you could just say next slide
[51:37] that way we know you repi thank
[51:38] you
[51:42] so the CIs program is
[51:44] basically the database where
[51:47] most data about homelessness is
[51:48] captured and stored here in
[51:50] delaware as a condition of
[51:52] receiving federal funds to
[51:54] address homelessness every
[51:55] community and in this case it's
[51:56] the state of delaware or
[51:57] statewide have to have some type
[51:58] of data system that collects
[52:00] certain information about
[52:01] homelessness and reports that up
[52:03] to Hhud which then reports it to
[52:04] Congress which then influences
[52:07] federal allocation and policy
[52:08] so we manage that data system
[52:14] we train over150 to200 staff
[52:14] working in homeless assistance
[52:15] programs all over the state
[52:16] shelters transitional housing
[52:18] programs rapid rehousing
[52:20] programs every year to use
[52:22] that system we provide technical
[52:24] assistance we have a you know
[52:26] self training portal we have a
[52:28] technical assistant staff so
[52:29] we're responsible for managing
[52:31] that data system as well and we
[52:32] can pull a lot of information
[52:34] out of that and then there's a
[52:34] lot of information we can't pull
[52:36] out of that so I always tell
[52:38] folks please reach out if you
[52:39] have questions about
[52:39] homelessness
[52:41] that you and we may or may not
[52:42] be able to provide you with an
[52:43] answer depending on if it's data
[52:44] that we capture in that system
[52:48] and then the next is policy and
[52:50] community education. this is
[52:52] where you all probably see us
[52:53] most out in the community we
[52:54] do have staff who work to
[52:57] educate the community support
[53:00] advocacy facilitate we
[53:00] facilitate the
[53:02] delawareffordablehousing
[53:02] coalitionroup and
[53:04] theusssexhousingroup through
[53:04] our policy and community
[53:06] education programme and I'm
[53:08] happy to answer any questions
[53:08] about those two particular
[53:09] groups of folks would like to
[53:10] know more
[53:11] ex t slide
[53:16] next slide
[53:22] wesley should have been more
[53:26] organized and were talking ok
[53:29] so as an organization so some
[53:30] questions were asked so most of
[53:32] our funds are federal
[53:33] followed by state funds and then
[53:35] private dollars and donations so
[53:36] the work that we do for the
[53:38] coordinated entry program the
[53:40] COC program the CIs3 out of four
[53:42] of our programs do rely
[53:44] heavily on federal dollars but
[53:45] we do get support from the state
[53:46] and others as well for those
[53:49] programs as I said we're
[53:50] about14 staff
[53:54] statewide and we none of what we
[53:55] do happens
[53:58] without partnering with others
[53:58] so across all of our programs
[54:00] even though like the day to day
[54:01] work of the three people working
[54:02] on the data system is very
[54:04] different than the day to day
[54:06] work of Sonia for example hi Soa
[54:09] that works very different
[54:11] it all is happening in
[54:12] partnership with people across
[54:13] the community in a lot of
[54:14] different ways and so that's how
[54:16] everything's really connected
[54:16] and it's all that focused on
[54:17] on our mission
[54:23] so for example with CMIS as I
[54:25] said we have over10200 or so
[54:28] users of the system representing
[54:30] I think about40 organizations
[54:32] throughout the state entering
[54:33] data about homelessness into the
[54:34] system tracking client outcomes
[54:36] tracking program outcomes and
[54:36] our staff are talking to their
[54:40] staff all the time every day
[54:41] and then we also do work for
[54:42] example with
[54:43] theusssexhousingroup where again
[54:44] it's a membership group of folks
[54:46] in Sussex County specifically
[54:47] interested in and focusing on
[54:48] affordable housing in Sussex
[54:50] County so those two things are
[54:51] very different but the
[54:52] whole point of both of those
[54:53] things is to be bringing people
[54:55] together to try to move things
[54:56] forward when it comes to
[54:57] homelessness and affordable
[54:57] housing
[55:00] to answer the question about
[55:02] our collaboration with DSHA and
[55:04] state partners we collaborate
[55:06] quite closely DSHA does
[55:07] provide some funding to support
[55:08] our work as the COC lead agency
[55:11] some operating dollars that
[55:14] are very helpful we also work
[55:15] closely with DSHA to inform
[55:17] homelessness policy and efforts
[55:20] across groups the DSHA for
[55:22] many years since I can remember
[55:23] I've been working in some way
[55:26] with this organization or its
[55:27] parent nonprofits for a
[55:29] little over12 years has always
[55:30] participated in the governance
[55:32] of the of housing alliance in
[55:32] terms of sitting on the board
[55:34] the governance of the continuum
[55:36] of care delaware state
[55:38] housing Authority staff sit on
[55:38] the funding committee of the
[55:39] delaware continuum of
[55:41] care to help make local funding
[55:42] decisions when we're applying
[55:44] for federal dollars and then we
[55:46] also participate in a lot of
[55:48] DSHA's initiatives I was on
[55:50] the or am on the interagency
[55:51] collaborative to end
[55:52] homelessness and served on
[55:53] theffordable housing task force
[55:56] so we work closely withdSHA
[55:58] we also work closely withdHSs
[56:00] but I would say there's room to
[56:02] grow there happy to talk more
[56:05] about that I think one of our
[56:06] biggest challenges and I'm
[56:06] really focusing on homelessness
[56:08] here because I know you've had a
[56:09] lot of other presenters
[56:09] talking
[56:11] about housing and affordable
[56:12] housing in different ways
[56:16] homeless assistant funding is
[56:18] well this past year was the
[56:19] largest it's ever been which is
[56:20] wonderful at the state level in
[56:22] terms of the state allocation
[56:24] between and and half million I
[56:26] think for homeless services in
[56:27] terms of what's allocated by the
[56:28] state and then plus what DSHA
[56:29] puts forward for the homeme for
[56:30] good program
[56:34] but it is scattered across a
[56:36] lot of divisions DHSs
[56:39] divisions DSHA then there's
[56:42] thehucdBgSG juris jurisdictions
[56:42] and the hu money that's flowing
[56:44] through those jurisdictions and
[56:45] then there's the COC money so
[56:46] similar to what you're talking
[56:48] about when it comes to housing
[56:50] issues broadly I think we have a
[56:51] similar challenge with the
[56:52] homelessness system the way
[56:54] the funding is distributed who
[56:55] controls what funding and it's
[56:57] not all aligned towards like the
[56:59] same goals so it's very
[57:00] common to hear someone who's
[57:01] working to address homelessness
[57:03] in the community say well this
[57:06] one funder says that I have to
[57:07] be focusing on employment and
[57:08] they want to see that everyone
[57:10] I'm working with is getting some
[57:11] type of employment but this
[57:12] other other funder that's
[57:14] funding the exact same program
[57:15] is focused on these other
[57:16] outcomes and I have to show them
[57:17] these other outcomes and how do
[57:18] I do both with my limited
[57:20] capacity and so one thing that I
[57:23] know that we and a lot of the
[57:24] homeless service providers would
[57:27] appreciate is a funder
[57:28] collaborative of some kind a way
[57:29] that those dollars and the
[57:30] people administering those
[57:31] dollars come together
[57:34] to make clear decisions about
[57:34] like what our priorities and
[57:36] goals are so that things are
[57:37] aligned and the providers who
[57:39] are doing this work know what's
[57:40] expected of them and and what to
[57:42] do and and how to move forward
[57:43] with getting the good outcomes
[57:44] for the people they're working
[57:46] with. so that would be one of
[57:48] our biggest challenges locally I
[57:49] think when it comes to making
[57:50] progress in addressing
[57:50] homelessness
[57:53] aside from the fact that we need
[57:53] more affordable housing and
[57:54] funding
[57:58] that's all I plan to share
[58:02] I could talk for a really long
[58:04] time about everything I
[58:06] mentioned som'm going to stop
[58:06] before before I do that
[58:12] Senator Hoffman thank you Rachel
[58:12] I think you've been in this
[58:14] space for about15 years maybe20
[58:17] years you've always been in this
[58:18] building since I've been in this
[58:18] building
[58:22] so one of the goals we wanted to
[58:23] do was have a system that
[58:26] everything's talking to each
[58:27] other but
[58:29] as we're hearing different
[58:30] people talk wouldn't it be
[58:32] better to have a system that's
[58:34] working in the background
[58:36] because when you're dealing with
[58:37] somebody who's homeless you also
[58:38] know they need medical care
[58:39] mental health care
[58:42] and then if the housing
[58:44] authority sees this that they
[58:46] have all these other needs then
[58:48] they could figure out like if we
[58:49] had something in the background
[58:50] and everybody was talking to
[58:52] each other we know the same
[58:54] person didn't call you and
[58:56] called the housing authority so
[58:57] we could start putting the
[58:58] pieces together. I don't know if
[59:00] we're going to be able to fund
[59:01] something that's out in the
[59:02] public but if we had something
[59:04] in the background working
[59:05] wouldn't that help out some of
[59:05] the agencies
[59:08] don't I'm so don't totally know
[59:10] what you mean by something in
[59:12] the backgroundd calls you
[59:16] you type in Fred's name now you
[59:18] saw on your screen but the
[59:20] public can't see it that Fred
[59:22] also called DHSs he called the
[59:24] housing authority also called
[59:25] local charities
[59:28] yes and then we could start
[59:31] pinpointing he's in a a crisis
[59:33] moment he's calling everyone
[59:36] yeah so is it fair to say you're
[59:37] asking kind of about data
[59:38] sharing on the back end so that
[59:40] we can see patterns of service
[59:42] usage and everyone's
[59:44] coordinating right yes so yes
[59:46] that would be great so yeah
[59:50] you said Fred Fredrank rank Fred
[59:52] the fly what's happening right
[59:54] now if we did a data share if
[59:55] we did a data match if we had
[59:56] our HMIS data and
[1:00:00] let's say Department of justice
[1:00:04] data and medicaid data and state
[1:00:06] serviceent data and we put all
[1:00:07] of that together we'd probably
[1:00:10] see almost every person in HMIs
[1:00:12] is being served by one of those
[1:00:13] systems as well or has touched
[1:00:14] one of those systems as well
[1:00:17] and yes I do think that would be
[1:00:18] extremely helpful so there are
[1:00:20] other in terms of figuring out
[1:00:22] how to actually solve people's
[1:00:22] problems
[1:00:26] I'll use Allegheny County as an
[1:00:30] example as as a community
[1:00:31] that has done this extremely
[1:00:32] well and they're very well known
[1:00:34] for this they actuallyu they did
[1:00:37] that and they created a this
[1:00:37] is how they decide
[1:00:40] of people experiencing
[1:00:41] homelessness in Allegheny
[1:00:41] countunty.
[1:00:44] there is not enough as we know
[1:00:46] housing resources to get people
[1:00:48] into housing and get the support
[1:00:50] they need services they need
[1:00:50] quickly
[1:00:52] so communities all over the
[1:00:54] country have to decide who gets
[1:00:55] what housing and when and it's
[1:00:56] not fun that's part of what we
[1:00:58] do at coordinated entry and it's
[1:01:02] not enjoyable at all to
[1:01:02] decide this person gets it and
[1:01:03] this person doesn't but there
[1:01:04] isn't enough
[1:01:06] so we're making those decisions
[1:01:08] every day what they have done is
[1:01:10] really put likes medical data
[1:01:12] hospital data department of
[1:01:14] justice data HMIs data together
[1:01:17] and seeing this person is the
[1:01:19] person who is in the hospital
[1:01:20] every few days for this chronic
[1:01:23] health condition on medicaid da
[1:01:24] da da da da we're gonna to
[1:01:24] prioritize this person for the
[1:01:26] next available supportive
[1:01:28] housing unit so there are ways
[1:01:30] that that data doesn't just
[1:01:31] function in the background as
[1:01:33] not that that's what you meant
[1:01:34] but as like for research it's
[1:01:36] used to make real world
[1:01:37] decisions about trying to get
[1:01:38] the most vulnerable people
[1:01:41] connected to the services I
[1:01:42] noticed that oh well
[1:01:46] secretckhockles knows this on
[1:01:47] when the tornado hit
[1:01:51] we there were three of us on the
[1:01:52] street talking to different
[1:01:54] people and then I was like oh
[1:01:55] you're great for interfaith I go
[1:01:56] run and get the women from
[1:01:58] interfaith they may see each
[1:01:58] other and they're like no we
[1:02:00] can't take that person we know
[1:02:01] that person
[1:02:02] they already went through our
[1:02:04] services and we can't that would
[1:02:06] have saved so much time if we
[1:02:08] had even on our phones some way
[1:02:10] of figuring it out than us
[1:02:11] running around the street
[1:02:13] calling Secretary heckles hey do
[1:02:14] you have this name do you have
[1:02:17] that name? so it was a lot of us
[1:02:18] I think the tornado really
[1:02:20] showed that we do need something
[1:02:22] in the background for the most
[1:02:26] vulnerable absolutely that makes
[1:02:26] sense
[1:02:28] and can I just respond to one of
[1:02:29] the last things you said
[1:02:33] because it gives me an
[1:02:34] opportunity to say I think
[1:02:36] focusing on people's immediate
[1:02:38] needs is really really important
[1:02:40] sheltercri services but that
[1:02:42] will never solve someone's
[1:02:44] homelessness it will it is a
[1:02:46] very important band aid that
[1:02:47] stops very
[1:02:52] not ok bleeding right so I'm not
[1:02:53] saying it's not important but
[1:02:54] really focusing
[1:02:58] a lot of effort on trying to
[1:02:58] figure out how to like fix the
[1:03:00] whole shelter system and why
[1:03:02] this person can't get into there
[1:03:03] but they can't get into there
[1:03:03] but they can't get into there
[1:03:08] I think efforts would be better
[1:03:09] focusing on how to get folks to
[1:03:12] housing and services not that
[1:03:13] it's not important but I think
[1:03:14] if there's a choice that's the
[1:03:16] one we would choose to focus on
[1:03:19] it it was a lot last week and
[1:03:20] then out of all the people we
[1:03:22] talked to we only I think we
[1:03:24] only got like three people into
[1:03:26] more of a program that at the
[1:03:29] end of ix0 days they'll be able
[1:03:30] to and am so sorry to be clear I
[1:03:32] was not talking about in the
[1:03:34] case of a natural disaster I was
[1:03:34] talking that but that
[1:03:36] brought that to light to the
[1:03:38] general public of what is
[1:03:39] actually going on right
[1:03:44] any other questions
[1:03:46] deputy secretary shepherd
[1:03:49] thank you madam chairir Hi
[1:03:50] Rachel
[1:03:52] one quick question and then
[1:03:54] just to follow up on something
[1:03:56] you mentioned iss the homeless
[1:03:58] helpline is that staffed after
[1:04:00] hours and on weekends it is not
[1:04:02] so that is you know something
[1:04:03] from the state service center
[1:04:04] side that I will hear
[1:04:08] occasionally is it's4:30 on a
[1:04:09] Friday. I've just had this
[1:04:11] family walk in they're homeless
[1:04:13] they need something and we call
[1:04:16] and and there's nothing there
[1:04:16] and I I don't know quite how to
[1:04:17] sol
[1:04:20] ve that other than using to the
[1:04:22] extent we can our hotel voucher
[1:04:24] to at least get that family in
[1:04:26] as quickly as possible and then
[1:04:28] try to work to maybe the back
[1:04:30] end onmon or or whatnot when
[1:04:32] they come back so are there
[1:04:34] any maybe plans or thought to
[1:04:38] how we might solve that after
[1:04:41] hours kind of issue yeah so
[1:04:44] I guess a couple of things so in
[1:04:46] delaware we do not have any
[1:04:46] shelters that are willing to
[1:04:50] take people at any time ums a
[1:04:52] lot of larger cities have
[1:04:52] shelters that are24/7 they'll
[1:04:54] like find someone on the street
[1:04:56] at2 a.m. who clearly needs
[1:04:56] shelter and the police will call
[1:04:58] and then they can pick them up
[1:05:00] and bring them to the24/7
[1:05:01] shelter. we don't have that in
[1:05:02] delaware there are some shelters
[1:05:04] that are willing to take people
[1:05:05] after hours in special
[1:05:05] circumstances
[1:05:08] if they have an opening when a
[1:05:08] police officer calls or
[1:05:10] something like that is
[1:05:11] happening but
[1:05:15] I think the first thing to
[1:05:18] figure out is how to increase
[1:05:19] the capacity of our shelter
[1:05:20] programs to allow for easier
[1:05:22] access
[1:05:24] we there are shelters so
[1:05:29] so that's number one2 about a
[1:05:29] little over a year ago
[1:05:32] we made a change at the
[1:05:33] homeless helpline we do not make
[1:05:34] direct referrals to most
[1:05:36] shelters in the state anymore
[1:05:36] because it just wasn't working
[1:05:40] so to your staff I would just
[1:05:41] say they can just call the they
[1:05:42] can and should just be calling
[1:05:42] the shelters directly and saying
[1:05:44] do you have any openings can you
[1:05:46] take this family they do not
[1:05:48] have to come through us in order
[1:05:49] to make that referral unless
[1:05:50] there's like central intake is
[1:05:52] no longer it's no longer central
[1:05:53] intake so this is why we've been
[1:05:56] trying to rework reframing it as
[1:05:58] the homeless helpline the
[1:05:59] access to emergency shel
[1:06:02] ter is no longer centralized.
[1:06:02] there are a couple of shelters
[1:06:04] in the state that will still
[1:06:06] only accept referrals from us
[1:06:06] because they preferred it that
[1:06:08] way but at this point we're
[1:06:10] primarily telling people here's
[1:06:12] other places to go here's other
[1:06:12] phone numbers to call
[1:06:14] we're always sending people to
[1:06:16] the state service centers so
[1:06:18] that's the other thing I
[1:06:20] would say is just because we're
[1:06:22] not the phone isn't operating
[1:06:24] doesn't mean you can't reach out
[1:06:25] and then your staff can't reach
[1:06:26] out and try to access shelter
[1:06:26] programs
[1:06:29] it's always been the case
[1:06:29] that folks could get into
[1:06:30] shelter after hours if there was
[1:06:32] shelter available we did at
[1:06:34] one point like the when we were
[1:06:36] closed you could just walk in
[1:06:38] like we never said like don't
[1:06:40] take people in after hours so
[1:06:40] that was also always the case
[1:06:41] after hours generally
[1:06:44] so but first I would focus on
[1:06:46] actually making resources
[1:06:47] available to folks who need them
[1:06:49] nights and weekends
[1:06:52] and then you did make a a
[1:06:54] comment about there being room
[1:06:58] to grow withdHSs so if that's
[1:07:00] a conversation you want to have
[1:07:01] outside of this then happy to
[1:07:02] set something up with you and
[1:07:04] and talk through that yeah that
[1:07:04] would be great
[1:07:06] heckles just back to the
[1:07:10] sort of open and closed hours
[1:07:14] even if you're closed do you
[1:07:16] have an ability to know when
[1:07:17] someone called I mean it's I
[1:07:20] guess I'm trying to decide or or
[1:07:22] figure out a message and yeah we
[1:07:24] use a phone call system similar
[1:07:24] to like211 we'll see what time
[1:07:26] the call came in they can leave
[1:07:28] a message theirir phone number's
[1:07:29] there etc but
[1:07:30] but we don't get back to them
[1:07:32] until the following even meaning
[1:07:33] to ask you and just haven't
[1:07:34] gotten to it yet but
[1:07:39] the2fohour nature of it you know
[1:07:41] is that something that is you
[1:07:42] know more necessary in a place
[1:07:43] like Philadelphia and New York
[1:07:44] City
[1:07:46] DC and you know out
[1:07:49] because the cost would be
[1:07:50] substantial to triple
[1:07:54] essentially or more the the
[1:07:55] amount of time that you're
[1:07:58] you're the service is open
[1:07:59] and if that's to catch a couple
[1:08:02] of people who you know a a
[1:08:03] year that might not be worth it
[1:08:04] but
[1:08:08] that so that that would be
[1:08:09] interesting to know if we have
[1:08:10] any any sort of data that says
[1:08:12] you know listen there are you
[1:08:13] know 1000 people who called
[1:08:14] after hours last year that would
[1:08:15] be a different conversation than
[1:08:16] if there are two
[1:08:18] that makes sense
[1:08:22] yeah the other thing I will say
[1:08:24] is if there's interest in
[1:08:25] something like that being
[1:08:26] open24/7 you know as you just
[1:08:27] said
[1:08:30] there has to be something to
[1:08:32] tell people or to offer people
[1:08:34] and currently even during the
[1:08:35] day there's very little to offer
[1:08:36] people so often what's happening
[1:08:38] when folks are calling us is
[1:08:38] they're we're giving them a
[1:08:40] phone number or like you're a
[1:08:42] single male in dover called over
[1:08:44] interface called wherever
[1:08:46] shepherd's place still kind of
[1:08:48] asking
[1:08:49] sort of also asking as we
[1:08:49] develop the
[1:08:52] you know processes and policies
[1:08:53] and procedures and mode of
[1:08:54] operation of the hopepe centers
[1:08:56] in inkentonusssex counties is
[1:08:58] that is that a piece of that
[1:08:59] that we need to
[1:09:04] emphasize or not don't and you
[1:09:05] know that's a like to see
[1:09:07] data and and and even if you
[1:09:10] guys have it that you know I
[1:09:11] presume at some point the state
[1:09:12] service center's closed too and
[1:09:13] they may not know so it's sort
[1:09:14] of like how do you know what you
[1:09:17] don't know if they can't reach
[1:09:18] service centers and you don't
[1:09:19] know that they're trying to
[1:09:21] reach us to to get housing if
[1:09:23] they're not able to you know
[1:09:24] call and you don't know if they
[1:09:25] left a message that you know so
[1:09:28] between us like how can we fill
[1:09:30] in the gaps and find out you
[1:09:32] know how much after hours time
[1:09:34] people really need the
[1:09:35] service it would be interesting
[1:09:39] so having worked in the
[1:09:40] delaware system for quite some
[1:09:43] time. I don't think it is a
[1:09:44] great use of resources to focus
[1:09:46] on expanding to24 hours mainly
[1:09:47] because
[1:09:52] if people suddenly without
[1:09:53] knowing it are becoming homeless
[1:09:53] in the middle of the night
[1:09:58] not always but frequently there
[1:10:00] is some police involvement and
[1:10:02] police often then are like that
[1:10:04] frontline worker who who knows
[1:10:06] the shelter down the street and
[1:10:08] it or has them work with a DV
[1:10:11] hotline to address the problem
[1:10:14] people have housingcuries and
[1:10:16] become homeless all the time but
[1:10:18] it's somewhat rare for someone
[1:10:20] to suddenly without any warning
[1:10:22] lose their housing in the middle
[1:10:23] of the night. I just wanted
[1:10:23] that's usually not not
[1:10:26] how it's happening
[1:10:26] right
[1:10:30] not that it never happens but
[1:10:34] playing director Edji
[1:10:38] yeah hi Rachel I'm just curious
[1:10:39] you moved away from the
[1:10:40] centralized intake to sort of
[1:10:42] more of a navigator role I'm
[1:10:44] sure there's a story about why
[1:10:45] that happened and you know it
[1:10:46] just would seem
[1:10:48] would seem like you know we're
[1:10:50] trying to organize things you
[1:10:50] know moving to a more
[1:10:51] centralized thing would be
[1:10:52] an option
[1:10:54] but but they're they're they're
[1:10:56] you know just briefly like
[1:10:58] what's the story and there's
[1:11:00] this new system of kind of a
[1:11:02] navigator role has that been
[1:11:04] more effective than the previous
[1:11:04] way you were doing it just
[1:11:06] curious yeah that's a really
[1:11:07] great question
[1:11:10] so there is a story and I'm
[1:11:11] going to make it short
[1:11:16] I would say that there's a
[1:11:16] couple main reasons why the
[1:11:18] centralized shelter access
[1:11:21] wasn't working
[1:11:24] one was that there was no
[1:11:28] what I talked about earlier
[1:11:29] there were no standard
[1:11:30] expectations for how programs
[1:11:33] would operate so some programs
[1:11:34] wouldn't take people in after2
[1:11:36] pm. because they didn't have
[1:11:38] enough staff. some programs
[1:11:40] wouldn't take people who were
[1:11:41] being exited from psychiatric
[1:11:43] facilities because they didn't
[1:11:44] have more than seve days' worth
[1:11:46] of their psych meds and they
[1:11:47] were concerned about that some
[1:11:50] places wouldn't take people like
[1:11:52] every place operates differently
[1:11:54] and so the idea of trying and
[1:11:56] there was no one entity that was
[1:11:57] respo
[1:11:58] n s ible for setting some basic
[1:12:02] right I'm not talking about some
[1:12:02] basic like this is how we're all
[1:12:06] going to operate so that when I
[1:12:07] think to your point Senator
[1:12:09] Hofner when you're with rank and
[1:12:10] you're like there's an open bed
[1:12:12] here for single men that that
[1:12:14] match results in rank getting
[1:12:16] that bed so what we were
[1:12:17] spending a lot of time doing was
[1:12:18] trying to get rank into the bed
[1:12:20] for single men and rank was not
[1:12:21] getting into the bed for single
[1:12:22] men
[1:12:24] and so it really was like
[1:12:26] hamster on a wheel
[1:12:28] the other thing
[1:12:32] I will say is lack of resources
[1:12:34] on the shelter program side is a
[1:12:36] huge part of why everyone
[1:12:38] operates so differently as well.
[1:12:40] people have to make do with
[1:12:41] what they have and oftentimes a
[1:12:42] lot of these programs are
[1:12:44] operating with volunteer support
[1:12:46] on donations from local you know
[1:12:46] churches or other faith
[1:12:48] communities and they don't
[1:12:52] the capacity to have that type
[1:12:54] of structure in a way that lends
[1:12:56] itself to like a really truly
[1:12:57] centralized or coordinated
[1:12:58] system is really challenging for
[1:12:58] folks
[1:13:02] so very poorly resourced system
[1:13:03] without
[1:13:06] a set of standards that we
[1:13:08] were kind of trying to force
[1:13:10] people to abide by but we don't
[1:13:12] fund them so it wasn't going
[1:13:13] well
[1:13:16] can't tell them what to do
[1:13:18] SenatorBuxton
[1:13:24] thank you and I appreciated the
[1:13:24] conversation it helps maybe
[1:13:26] get some clarity in what I'm
[1:13:27] thinking
[1:13:30] I appreciate your position I'm
[1:13:32] not in your seat so I have to
[1:13:32] respect the fact that you're
[1:13:34] doing this daily so I'm in the
[1:13:36] cheap seats or maybe I'm in my
[1:13:37] senate seat dealing with
[1:13:40] different situations from time
[1:13:41] to time
[1:13:44] but I'm challenged with what
[1:13:45] you're saying in the
[1:13:47] decentralization of it and I
[1:13:48] want to make sure I understand
[1:13:50] that she used the gentleman will
[1:13:51] call him rank
[1:13:52] and you were looking for
[1:13:57] where it is that you could place
[1:13:58] him and at the end of the day
[1:14:00] you were using up resources to
[1:14:02] find out that you couldn't place
[1:14:02] him there that was your
[1:14:04] reasoning for not doing that
[1:14:06] what happens to Frank if you're
[1:14:08] not there iss he doing it iss he
[1:14:09] the one that's struggling to
[1:14:11] find it on his own and and ends
[1:14:11] up in the same space you are
[1:14:15] yeah yeah so that that's the
[1:14:16] system and that has to stop I
[1:14:19] agree100% that has to stop
[1:14:22] because10 for you to say and no
[1:14:24] disrespect to you but for me to
[1:14:26] say I'll give you this scenario
[1:14:28] wasn't it was a little while ago
[1:14:30] I like to walk talk on my phone
[1:14:32] I'm down at the library if you
[1:14:33] don't know the library there's a
[1:14:34] lot of folks who are challenged
[1:14:36] with life that sit out there and
[1:14:38] so I'll be texting I'll just
[1:14:40] take it in this young man walks
[1:14:41] up he's got a little child2 3
[1:14:41] years old he's probably3
[1:14:43] 32 and I overhear
[1:14:46] overhear him he is distressed
[1:14:48] he's panicked he's on the phone
[1:14:51] he's he's arguing with someone
[1:14:52] because he hasn't gotten
[1:14:54] callbacks he doesn't know what
[1:14:55] to do and so ask him what's up
[1:14:58] come talk to me for a second he
[1:15:00] ends up upstairs fortunately I
[1:15:02] was able to call somebody
[1:15:03] because I'm a senator
[1:15:06] who was able to get somebody to
[1:15:07] pick up the phone
[1:15:09] and what I learned was this guy
[1:15:10] had just been released from the
[1:15:12] department oforrections. the
[1:15:14] mother of the child was in a
[1:15:16] hospital in a heroin induced
[1:15:18] coma of sorts and what's there
[1:15:19] is this
[1:15:22] this child
[1:15:26] he doesn't want any of this and
[1:15:27] a state that's saying
[1:15:28] I don't know what to tell you
[1:15:30] go find a tree in a tent
[1:15:35] and just we got to fix that that
[1:15:38] part so I argue about a system
[1:15:41] that I try to use right so in
[1:15:43] that I'm literally invested in
[1:15:44] the system we have
[1:15:46] while at the same time I'm
[1:15:47] complaining about the system
[1:15:48] that we have
[1:15:50] and so I hope that's our mission
[1:15:51] as we
[1:15:54] look at a hopepe center and we
[1:15:56] look at dealing with housing
[1:15:56] I've argued 1000 times
[1:15:59] that we've got to have a system
[1:15:59] that looks at
[1:16:02] housing the healthy and
[1:16:04] sheltering the sick
[1:16:06] because they are two different
[1:16:07] things
[1:16:10] and finding a robust system to
[1:16:12] treat the sick while also having
[1:16:14] the ability to lift up those
[1:16:14] that are
[1:16:18] not that are not housed but are
[1:16:19] capable of it
[1:16:20] two different systems you
[1:16:23] that's not fair because all I'm
[1:16:23] doing is just
[1:16:26] talking I'm not helping you but
[1:16:28] I want to help if you guys if we
[1:16:29] can work together I want to help
[1:16:32] 24 hours if we got to put
[1:16:33] somebody on call
[1:16:36] I don't know maybe we don't need
[1:16:37] a whole branch of government
[1:16:40] open but maybe we we we pay
[1:16:40] construction workers every
[1:16:43] single day to be on call when
[1:16:44] we've got some sort of whatever
[1:16:46] in the middle of the night let's
[1:16:48] pay a couple of folks that can
[1:16:48] just pick up the phone cause I
[1:16:49] don't want my staff
[1:16:52] to have to be the one and I
[1:16:54] don't want Frank to be given
[1:16:55] numbers it's when I talk to
[1:16:57] folks in about what it means to
[1:16:58] be a good public servant one of
[1:16:59] the things they always say is
[1:17:00] this
[1:17:02] never give someone a number to
[1:17:04] call when you can call for them
[1:17:05] they've called you for help
[1:17:07] you can the least you can do
[1:17:10] so let me see if I can help you
[1:17:12] out here expect a call back if
[1:17:14] you don't get one text me or
[1:17:16] text my my help ammy we need to
[1:17:18] build that type of system right
[1:17:20] if we can right or and if we
[1:17:21] can't build it in that's
[1:17:22] entirety where can we build it
[1:17:23] that works
[1:17:29] no offense 10% agree with almost
[1:17:29] everything you said
[1:17:34] I do think that folks who are
[1:17:36] sick can be or as housable as
[1:17:38] folks who are well so maybe we
[1:17:40] can talk about that more offline
[1:17:42] I don't think that there need
[1:17:44] to be two separate systems for
[1:17:46] folks who need treatment and
[1:17:48] help and those who don't I think
[1:17:49] everybody can be successful in
[1:17:50] housing with the right services
[1:17:52] and supports which is part of
[1:17:53] the issue
[1:17:56] but I will also say I100% agree
[1:17:58] with you I don't think that the
[1:18:00] way that the system is working
[1:18:00] right now is the way it should
[1:18:04] work I am a member of the
[1:18:05] intergency collaborative
[1:18:08] umrector heckel is the chair of
[1:18:09] the coordinated entry there's a
[1:18:10] whole subcommittee that's
[1:18:11] looking at coordinated entry
[1:18:13] this wholes how do people access
[1:18:15] know how to access get help
[1:18:16] accessing get help navigating
[1:18:18] resources that are there for
[1:18:20] people who are homeless and what
[1:18:22] I am hoping and looking at
[1:18:22] the chair that we will get
[1:18:23] out of
[1:18:26] that is a really a dedication to
[1:18:27] redesign and rethink how the
[1:18:30] whole thing works my staff
[1:18:31] who were answering the phone the
[1:18:32] state service center staff who
[1:18:33] are trying to help people
[1:18:35] navigate you at the library who
[1:18:36] are it doesn't work for anybody
[1:18:38] it's not working for anybody and
[1:18:39] most importantly not the person
[1:18:42] who needs the help so I agree
[1:18:42] and'm'm really hopeful we can
[1:18:43] put something different
[1:18:44] together.
[1:18:48] any other questions from me
[1:18:52] committee I have a a couple
[1:18:56] the idea of a rental housing
[1:18:57] registry has come up a lot I've
[1:18:57] been
[1:19:00] working around it I think you
[1:19:02] have a little bit or a couple
[1:19:04] others just curious for you
[1:19:07] what your perspective is on it
[1:19:08] what would it look like what
[1:19:09] would be its purpose?
[1:19:20] I brought this up didn't I? yeah
[1:19:24] I'm the one that brought this up
[1:19:24] didn't
[1:19:26] so you said
[1:19:28] so you that as an example I mean
[1:19:30] I think it's not I mean I think
[1:19:31] it's
[1:19:35] fairly simple so ok delaware's
[1:19:35] fairly small
[1:19:38] when you talk about a department
[1:19:40] of housings I'm going to get
[1:19:42] there but we need to talk
[1:19:43] about a potential department of
[1:19:44] housing or potential
[1:19:46] reorganization of how housing is
[1:19:47] addressed in the state
[1:19:52] some version of reorganization
[1:19:53] makes sense to me
[1:19:55] like it doesn't make sense to me
[1:19:58] and it wouldn't make sense to me
[1:20:00] that like the same entity that's
[1:20:01] like the housing finance agency
[1:20:02] for the state that's really
[1:20:03] focused on like getting the
[1:20:04] dollars out leveraging the low
[1:20:06] income housing tax credit like
[1:20:08] getting the apartments you know
[1:20:10] multifamily apartments built is
[1:20:12] the same entity that would
[1:20:14] handle like a rental registry
[1:20:16] because those are really
[1:20:18] different functions not that it
[1:20:19] can't be but
[1:20:22] I think there are some like
[1:20:22] really clear housing functions
[1:20:24] that are needed housing
[1:20:25] authority
[1:20:27] is very different than housing
[1:20:28] fining agency which is really
[1:20:29] different than an entity that
[1:20:30] would do something like have a
[1:20:32] rental registry and maybe act as
[1:20:34] like an ombudsman for housing
[1:20:35] problems so
[1:20:38] some of that happens at the
[1:20:40] local level I think through
[1:20:43] like license and inspection or
[1:20:44] like city government but local
[1:20:46] governments are so taxed that
[1:20:47] they think a lot of what's
[1:20:47] happening when folks have
[1:20:48] housing issues is that they're
[1:20:50] looking to the state for help
[1:20:52] and there's just like they're
[1:20:54] not getting that help with their
[1:20:56] housing issue and so in my mind
[1:20:58] a rental registry served so that
[1:20:59] at any given time we can say
[1:21:01] so it serves to me a client
[1:21:04] service customer service purpose
[1:21:05] iss that a dog yeah
[1:21:08] it serves a customer service
[1:21:10] purpose from that perspective
[1:21:12] but also like a policy purpose
[1:21:14] like we can say like we know who
[1:21:15] like what properties out there
[1:21:16] are taking
[1:21:17] subsidies
[1:21:20] and we want to partner with them
[1:21:22] to like solve family
[1:21:23] homelessness making that up but
[1:21:24] it would just let us know the
[1:21:26] landscape of what exists out
[1:21:28] there in the rental world in a
[1:21:30] similar way that I think maybe
[1:21:32] maybe we know the homeownership
[1:21:34] landscape a little better so
[1:21:35] that's the way I think of a
[1:21:35] rental registry.
[1:21:40] and this could be something tied
[1:21:41] in with the realtors because
[1:21:42] they know where the apartments
[1:21:45] are maybe I mean you all don't
[1:21:46] work with like large multifamily
[1:21:48] actors as much do you you're
[1:21:48] more like small
[1:21:52] I don't know
[1:21:54] they're very I don't think they
[1:21:55] they don't want a rental
[1:21:55] registry
[1:21:58] I don't think they would agree
[1:21:59] with me on that
[1:22:04] there is a part of your written
[1:22:06] testimony that says
[1:22:08] that
[1:22:11] the housing authority portions
[1:22:13] should stay separate from any
[1:22:13] entity
[1:22:17] I don't have a take either way
[1:22:18] on that just curious why you
[1:22:19] felt like we should definitely
[1:22:19] say that
[1:22:20] it just
[1:22:24] I just think that
[1:22:30] sorector heckles is wonderful. I
[1:22:31] think he wears too many hats
[1:22:34] I love that he wears the hats
[1:22:35] that he wears when I'm talking
[1:22:36] to him because he's great but to
[1:22:37] me I just
[1:22:40] don't understand why like in
[1:22:41] housing finance agency and a
[1:22:42] housing authority they're just
[1:22:44] so different like why not just
[1:22:45] every other housing authority in
[1:22:46] the state is a separate entity
[1:22:47] with its own director and its
[1:22:48] own board and like just like go
[1:22:49] like do that and let
[1:22:52] whatever it's called whether
[1:22:53] it's well you probably have to
[1:22:54] change the name of DSHA to
[1:22:56] something different because now
[1:22:56] it wouldn't be a housing
[1:22:58] authority but and think that's
[1:22:59] part of what's confusing about
[1:23:02] DSHA is that it's like
[1:23:04] performing multiple functions
[1:23:05] it's called a housing authority
[1:23:06] when most of what it does I
[1:23:08] don't know about most a lot of
[1:23:10] what it does is not be a housing
[1:23:12] authority. there's only this one
[1:23:13] part of it that is actually a
[1:23:13] housing authority
[1:23:16] I don't know it just doesn't
[1:23:18] make sense to me and then I
[1:23:20] think you could have like a
[1:23:20] director of the southern
[1:23:22] delawarehousing Authority in the
[1:23:23] same way you have a director of
[1:23:24] the Wilmington housing Authority
[1:23:25] and the newcastle County Housing
[1:23:26] Authority and the doverhousing
[1:23:26] Authority that would be its own
[1:23:28] separate entity doesn't need to
[1:23:30] be part of the state
[1:23:30] infrastructure in my opinion.
[1:23:35] then I kind of have a
[1:23:36] interesting way of asking the
[1:23:38] next question which might feel
[1:23:38] like I'm putting you on the spot
[1:23:40] a little but it's not
[1:23:40] intentional
[1:23:45] so I come from the community
[1:23:46] organizing world right and we
[1:23:48] have a theory of change of
[1:23:50] working your s way out of a job
[1:23:52] right and so in your space of
[1:23:54] of homelessness what are the top
[1:23:56] three reasons you're still
[1:23:56] employed in this space of ending
[1:23:58] homelessness and the
[1:24:00] the follow up question to that
[1:24:01] would be
[1:24:04] what do we have to do like what
[1:24:06] is the top thing that we have to
[1:24:07] do to
[1:24:09] make you unemployed in this
[1:24:09] space.
[1:24:14] yeah no no no offense taken at
[1:24:14] all
[1:24:16] no offense taken at all I talk
[1:24:18] about retirement a lot for
[1:24:19] someone who's not near
[1:24:19] retirement yet
[1:24:24] so something that we've
[1:24:26] talked a lot about in our space
[1:24:27] is that we should all be working
[1:24:29] to put ourselves out of a job
[1:24:30] so that's I don't take offense
[1:24:31] to that at all
[1:24:34] so it's a two part question why
[1:24:34] do I still have a job
[1:24:37] homelessness keeps growing
[1:24:42] a lot of the work that our
[1:24:43] non so homelessness keeps
[1:24:43] growing
[1:24:46] a lot of the work that our
[1:24:48] organization does is work that
[1:24:50] has to happen so either we're
[1:24:51] going to do it or someone else
[1:24:52] is going to do it we've been the
[1:24:53] ones doing it since
[1:24:56] and actually director heckles
[1:24:57] might know some of this history.
[1:24:58] When did the homemelesslanning
[1:24:59] council start doing all that
[1:25:00] like infrastructure COC work do
[1:25:01] you know
[1:25:02] ar th ack passed in
[1:25:07] right
[1:25:08] so since that time there's been
[1:25:12] a need for the state of delaware
[1:25:14] and other places it's county
[1:25:14] level you know because we're
[1:25:16] small like soilly has its own
[1:25:20] COC there's a western
[1:25:22] PennsylvaniaOC there's a city of
[1:25:23] phoenix CUC California has a
[1:25:24] million COCs in delaware it's
[1:25:27] just the delaware we have one we
[1:25:28] have to have someone has to do
[1:25:30] that job and that has been us
[1:25:32] since2009 or2010
[1:25:36] so that's two
[1:25:39] Can I just do two
[1:25:43] that's if that's what you think
[1:25:46] it takes yes I think he said
[1:25:48] but I'm going to stick with two
[1:25:50] and then the second part of the
[1:25:51] question was the three things
[1:25:52] we should do
[1:26:04] h
[1:26:07] trying to phone a friend I
[1:26:08] want to make sure I say the
[1:26:10] things I'm gonna whatever I say
[1:26:12] I'm going to regrett regret it
[1:26:13] don't gret it we're not holding
[1:26:14] you know you can leave and say
[1:26:15] hey we changed it yeah
[1:26:20] this is my chance ok I would
[1:26:22] say we need to
[1:26:26] rapidly produced more affordable
[1:26:27] housing
[1:26:30] rental housing in particular
[1:26:32] it'll bring everything down
[1:26:34] think the new homeowner market
[1:26:36] will open up rapidly produce
[1:26:38] more affordable rental housing
[1:26:42] we need to
[1:26:44] focus on getting people
[1:26:48] out of the homelessness system
[1:26:51] quickly versus getting them into
[1:26:52] the homelessness system quickly
[1:26:54] or both
[1:26:56] but I think what we've been
[1:26:58] focusing on in delaware for many
[1:27:00] many years has been getting how
[1:27:01] to get people in versus how to
[1:27:03] get people out so we either
[1:27:06] need to kind of switch or or try
[1:27:06] to make sure we're doing both at
[1:27:07] the same time
[1:27:08] and
[1:27:15] I think we need a statewide
[1:27:16] emergency rental assistance
[1:27:16] program.
[1:27:21] so that people we have about70%
[1:27:22] of people who experience
[1:27:24] homelessness in delaware and on
[1:27:25] any given year are people who
[1:27:25] are newly homeless
[1:27:28] and have not been homeless
[1:27:30] before and if we can keep people
[1:27:31] housed and keep them from
[1:27:32] becoming homeless we can have
[1:27:36] more resources to address folks
[1:27:37] who can't get out of it without
[1:27:37] help
[1:27:42] that's3
[1:27:43] what is affordable housing
[1:27:46] because everybody has different
[1:27:48] definitions so affordable
[1:27:50] housing
[1:27:52] director Edjill you were on
[1:27:53] the task force too didnn't we
[1:27:54] decide what affordable housing
[1:27:55] meant on the affordable housing
[1:27:57] production task force so we
[1:27:59] decided it was a housing that
[1:28:03] was affordable for households at
[1:28:08] 80% AMI and below for rental and
[1:28:12] for homeownership100% dammn so
[1:28:13] close120% AI and below and
[1:28:13] affordable means
[1:28:16] it's all based on your income so
[1:28:17] for every person it's different
[1:28:18] rental
[1:28:24] and12 for homeownership of the
[1:28:26] area median income so the
[1:28:28] unit is affordable to you if you
[1:28:29] are making that
[1:28:30] wage or below
[1:28:32] and affordable means you're not
[1:28:34] spending more than30% of your
[1:28:35] income on housing costs'll just
[1:28:38] add that that taskor report
[1:28:40] mattchott did a a sort of
[1:28:42] spreadsheet showing what that
[1:28:44] means in different the three
[1:28:44] counties in delaware and sort of
[1:28:46] has some examples of what the
[1:28:46] rent would be or the home
[1:28:47] ownership
[1:28:50] mortgage cost would be so that's
[1:28:52] a really good resource to
[1:28:53] something we should pull out and
[1:28:54] share more widely and probably
[1:28:56] should update it you know
[1:28:57] whenever new census numbers come
[1:28:59] out or or whatever but that that
[1:29:01] kind of gives you a sense of I'm
[1:29:03] very sad that I did not memorize
[1:29:05] that that spreadsheet but I mean
[1:29:08] but it's you know so it's it's
[1:29:08] it's it's powerful to
[1:29:13] and then the next fellow the
[1:29:16] getting them in quickly is one
[1:29:18] thing but when you say getting
[1:29:18] them out how
[1:29:20] how long are you saying people
[1:29:22] are staying and what is our our
[1:29:25] failure in in moving them on to
[1:29:28] the next phase in life so our
[1:29:30] failure I think is both approach
[1:29:31] and resources so
[1:29:34] a lot of people who become
[1:29:35] homeless
[1:29:38] their homelessness can be solved
[1:29:39] fairly quickly
[1:29:44] right away if we if someone is
[1:29:44] at that front door instead of
[1:29:45] working on like
[1:29:48] not that they don't need access
[1:29:48] to safe shelter but instead of
[1:29:49] working on
[1:29:50] you know we're spending
[1:29:53] we're doing an intake we're
[1:29:54] assessing all your service needs
[1:29:56] you're going to be here for30
[1:29:58] to90 days or120 days or whatever
[1:30:00] the program is and we're going
[1:30:00] to be working on all this stuff
[1:30:03] to get like the assessment is ok
[1:30:04] we're going to talk about all
[1:30:06] that stuff but like where did
[1:30:07] you live most recently? have you
[1:30:09] ever been homeless before? What
[1:30:10] is do you have a housing plan?
[1:30:12] what it like how do we get you
[1:30:14] connected to a housing whether
[1:30:15] that's a voucher program or a
[1:30:17] like like Srap or a public
[1:30:19] housing authority voucher or a
[1:30:20] continuum of care rapid
[1:30:21] rehousing voucher or like what
[1:30:21] are
[1:30:23] the potential resources for you
[1:30:24] and how are we getting you
[1:30:26] connected to that as quickly as
[1:30:28] possible which is a different
[1:30:30] lens than how are we making sure
[1:30:31] that you are successful in our
[1:30:31] program
[1:30:34] right we don't want you in our
[1:30:35] program we want to be out of a
[1:30:38] job right we want you in housing
[1:30:39] in the community with your
[1:30:39] family
[1:30:44] right so obviously we wouldn't
[1:30:44] take people we don't want them
[1:30:46] in our programs but you
[1:30:47] understand what I'm saying
[1:30:48] so are are we
[1:30:52] we spoke to somebody else had
[1:30:52] similar feelings to what you had
[1:30:54] so I don't want to fill in your
[1:30:56] thoughts with their thoughts but
[1:31:00] are you finding that that
[1:31:02] success rate has to do with
[1:31:04] knowledgeba like maybe not
[1:31:06] knowing how to budget and how to
[1:31:07] deal with you know emergencies
[1:31:10] sooner maybe a family history
[1:31:13] of you know homelessness cycles
[1:31:14] etc and dependency on systems
[1:31:18] and are are you suggesting at
[1:31:20] all that we build into it the
[1:31:22] ability to create maybe like
[1:31:23] resilience and in that education
[1:31:24] piece that allows you to to move
[1:31:27] past homelessness but I don't
[1:31:27] think that has
[1:31:30] to hap that can happen at the
[1:31:31] same time that you're working on
[1:31:32] housing it doesn't have to be
[1:31:33] one or the other
[1:31:38] if we have the resources right
[1:31:39] so and the other thing is
[1:31:39] everyone
[1:31:42] in my experience I like to say
[1:31:43] that there are two things that
[1:31:44] someone who is experiencing
[1:31:46] homelessness has in common with
[1:31:46] they all that everyone has in
[1:31:47] common who's experiencing
[1:31:48] homelessness
[1:31:50] they don't have housing and
[1:31:52] money for housing like otherwise
[1:31:53] they
[1:31:56] have housing and they don't
[1:31:58] have a support network of some
[1:32:00] somehow their support network
[1:32:01] has fallen aparthe that's family
[1:32:01] friends
[1:32:04] whether it's because they were
[1:32:05] recently incarcerated whatever
[1:32:06] the reason is their support
[1:32:08] network is falling apart
[1:32:10] and those are the only two
[1:32:11] things so part of what it is too
[1:32:11] is having
[1:32:14] like so when we talk about the
[1:32:14] continuum of care we talk about
[1:32:18] thesecri programs having the
[1:32:20] resources within that system to
[1:32:22] address everyone's needs as they
[1:32:23] are coming in because you're
[1:32:25] going to have people who have
[1:32:26] been housing insecure and
[1:32:28] homeless for many many years and
[1:32:30] you're going to have people who
[1:32:32] and aren't allowed back at
[1:32:34] the shelter and that inter what
[1:32:36] the services and housing that
[1:32:38] come to rank are going to be
[1:32:38] different than what is needed
[1:32:39] for
[1:32:43] Suzanne and who's never been
[1:32:43] homeless before and she
[1:32:48] lost her job at the hospital and
[1:32:48] couldn't pay rent and'm making
[1:32:49] that up
[1:32:54] so it's having a right now most
[1:32:57] not all but in many cases and
[1:32:57] a lot of homeless assistance
[1:32:58] programs people are working to
[1:32:59] keep people safe
[1:33:02] that is the they have the
[1:33:03] capacity to work to keep people
[1:33:04] safe and indoors
[1:33:08] they do not in many cases have
[1:33:10] the capacity to work to get
[1:33:12] people to the housing and
[1:33:13] services they need because they
[1:33:14] are focused on keeping people
[1:33:16] safe. so it's also a resource
[1:33:16] issue and a capacity issue.
[1:33:21] then I think my final question
[1:33:22] is when you mention the
[1:33:24] statewide rental assistance
[1:33:24] program
[1:33:28] don't we already kind of have
[1:33:32] something I feel like we are
[1:33:32] always sending people to a
[1:33:34] certain place sometimes we send
[1:33:37] them to nonprofits etc but again
[1:33:38] what is what is it that we're
[1:33:40] emergency rental assistance
[1:33:42] sorry to clarify so for folks
[1:33:44] who are facing eviction or
[1:33:46] housing instability so kind of
[1:33:48] like we had during covid
[1:33:49] although it could be
[1:33:50] a little different in terms
[1:33:52] of how it's managed but one
[1:33:56] place ok deputy secretary is
[1:33:56] nodding one place where folks
[1:33:57] can go to get their
[1:34:02] past due rent paid so that they
[1:34:03] don't have to lose their housing
[1:34:07] the way that the that system
[1:34:08] works right now is that there
[1:34:10] are a lot of different entities
[1:34:11] similar to I think everything
[1:34:12] we've been talking about today
[1:34:13] there are a lot of different
[1:34:14] entities that do a little bit
[1:34:15] so
[1:34:18] right now you go to the state
[1:34:20] serviceent you may or may not
[1:34:22] qualify for some there's some
[1:34:22] type of emergency assistance
[1:34:24] available there. the emergency
[1:34:26] assistance but it's500
[1:34:27] dollars4 dollars
[1:34:31] think it's about1200 dollars10
[1:34:32] dollars that does that include
[1:34:33] the hotel motel stay
[1:34:36] that is that is the the that's
[1:34:38] the that is the hotel motel
[1:34:40] voucher roughly1200 and it buys
[1:34:44] maybe221 days at the most can
[1:34:44] any of that be used for back
[1:34:45] rent?
[1:34:46] I thought there were some cases
[1:34:47] where folks could get back rent
[1:34:54] anyway now'm like program so
[1:34:56] there you know you can go there
[1:34:58] through there's some places
[1:34:59] in DHSS where you can get
[1:35:02] some background mostly you're
[1:35:04] going to cattholic
[1:35:06] charitieslutheranunityervices
[1:35:06] sometimes west end
[1:35:07] neighborighborhood house I don't
[1:35:07] know if they still do it or not
[1:35:10] and so you're going to these
[1:35:11] nonprofits that are getting
[1:35:14] funded in large part bydSHA I
[1:35:16] think but also their private
[1:35:18] organizations they raise funds
[1:35:20] or you know of a local church in
[1:35:22] your community because you're a
[1:35:22] member of the church and you can
[1:35:23] go there and they'll help you
[1:35:26] but if you're not you're you're
[1:35:27] calling one of these nonprofits
[1:35:28] in this place Owen Friendship
[1:35:30] House and this place is saying
[1:35:32] we do a500 dollars maximum
[1:35:33] you're two months behind rent
[1:35:34] you know an eviction's been
[1:35:35] filed against you your
[1:35:36] rent's2,000 dollars you owe4,000
[1:35:38] dollars. I can get500 from here
[1:35:39] but they won't give me that500
[1:35:40] until I show that I've gotten
[1:35:42] the other3500 so then what I
[1:35:43] have to do is I have to go to
[1:35:44] Luther community services and
[1:35:45] they're going to say ok well
[1:35:47] we'll give you500 too but not
[1:35:48] until you show us that you have
[1:35:49] the other3500
[1:35:52] and so people have to go to
[1:35:54] like7 or 8 places to get usually
[1:35:56] not the full amount people want
[1:35:57] the family to match it
[1:36:00] it would just really really
[1:36:02] really be great if folks could
[1:36:04] go to one place and say you know
[1:36:06] if I if I had2000 dollars I
[1:36:08] wouldn't be evicted can you just
[1:36:08] give me200 dollars
[1:36:09] I think that would
[1:36:12] be extremely helpful for a lot
[1:36:15] of reasons at one of the things
[1:36:17] we're doing right now at
[1:36:18] coordinated entry at the
[1:36:19] homemeless helpline as we're
[1:36:20] partnering with the cityity
[1:36:21] ofwilmington has a pot of funds
[1:36:23] it's using for back rent for
[1:36:23] emergency rental assistance
[1:36:26] and the organizations that
[1:36:27] receive those funds and we're
[1:36:28] making direct referrals for
[1:36:30] eligible households within like
[1:36:31] the city limits to that resource
[1:36:34] and the challenge has been that
[1:36:36] folks calling again rent's not
[1:36:38] like500 dollars a month or $600
[1:36:40] a month so even if someone's
[1:36:42] only one month behind we'll make
[1:36:44] the referral but not their their
[1:36:45] full need is not being met and
[1:36:46] then they're calling us back and
[1:36:47] saying well they said they'd
[1:36:48] help me but I still need help
[1:36:50] from someone else so there's no
[1:36:51] like one place to go
[1:36:54] and would you suggest the same
[1:36:56] thing for people who are
[1:36:58] falling behind on mortgages
[1:37:00] maybe they've lost their job and
[1:37:01] they can't keep up and they're
[1:37:02] in a similar situation
[1:37:06] do we still have a mortgage
[1:37:06] assistance program
[1:37:10] do we have that still
[1:37:12] or did that run out? wass that
[1:37:13] covid
[1:37:20] the covid era program yeah
[1:37:20] that was time limited at the
[1:37:22] federal level along with ERA
[1:37:24] and
[1:37:28] so currently we don't have a
[1:37:28] foreclosure
[1:37:30] prevention
[1:37:34] financing program there's
[1:37:34] housing counseling a lot of the
[1:37:38] one of the things that happened
[1:37:40] with covid was all of the
[1:37:42] programs that the mortgage
[1:37:43] servicers stood up
[1:37:44] and and they were really
[1:37:46] effective
[1:37:50] at at keeping people's
[1:37:51] keep people in their mortgages
[1:37:54] I think a lot of them are still
[1:37:56] running banks realize that
[1:37:56] they're a good way to avoid a
[1:37:57] foreclosure and
[1:38:02] banks don't want foreclosures
[1:38:04] either they're very expensive
[1:38:05] for them I I've
[1:38:08] not really jokingly said but
[1:38:10] sort of jokingly said if we had
[1:38:12] all of the tools in the mortgage
[1:38:15] industry that we had during
[1:38:18] covid in2010 as the financial
[1:38:22] crisis was starting and we
[1:38:24] probably wouldn't have had a
[1:38:24] global meltdown
[1:38:26] so those programs are still
[1:38:30] serving a lot of people any
[1:38:32] foreclosure or threat of
[1:38:34] foreclosure is is you know a
[1:38:35] dramatic thing for that
[1:38:35] individual
[1:38:40] big picture we're not seeing
[1:38:43] rates of foreclosure that are
[1:38:45] out of the norm you know during
[1:38:46] the financial crisis we were
[1:38:50] seeing you know somewhere
[1:38:51] around I think it was close I
[1:38:52] think we might have hit10 to12
[1:38:54] 1000 during one stretch per year
[1:38:56] and we're we're still sort of
[1:38:59] hovering around100 or so which
[1:39:01] is you know our gold during
[1:39:02] the financial crisis was to get
[1:39:04] to sort of a natural state at
[1:39:08] around22 to22und0 so we're
[1:39:10] actually in a very low those low
[1:39:10] interest rates that everyone got
[1:39:11] a few
[1:39:14] years back and and some
[1:39:16] other factors I think some of
[1:39:18] the institutionalized
[1:39:20] programs on the on the bank
[1:39:22] servicing side are are keeping
[1:39:23] those
[1:39:25] relatively low from a data
[1:39:25] standpoint
[1:39:29] so as someone who doesn't know
[1:39:30] as much about mortgage
[1:39:31] assistance as they do about
[1:39:32] homeless assistance I wanted to
[1:39:34] askrector heckles that as
[1:39:36] someone who doesn't have to
[1:39:37] think about budgeting yes
[1:39:40] think you should have that
[1:39:41] assistance available for
[1:39:41] homeowners too
[1:39:44] any other questions from the
[1:39:48] thank you so much thank you for
[1:39:49] having me
[1:39:57] right so for our fourth
[1:40:00] agenda item it was we were to
[1:40:02] be having presentations from
[1:40:03] the delaware ental housing
[1:40:08] folks to include Jeff Sheriton
[1:40:10] from the greaterwilmington
[1:40:10] housing provideviders and then
[1:40:14] also deborah Burgos from the
[1:40:15] apartment association
[1:40:16] unfortunately both were unable
[1:40:18] to attend today but they did
[1:40:20] submit their presentations
[1:40:22] for us to review they are
[1:40:24] available for the public to
[1:40:24] review as well so
[1:40:26] please take a moment
[1:40:30] to to look those over in the
[1:40:31] days to come
[1:40:36] I do ask of our committee if
[1:40:38] we want to take some time to
[1:40:39] have a little bit of back and
[1:40:39] forth
[1:40:43] there's any major takeaways I do
[1:40:44] want us to get into the space
[1:40:46] where we will have a first draft
[1:40:48] coming of our report and I would
[1:40:51] ask that by next Friday if we
[1:40:54] can have just I'm not asking for
[1:40:55] anything to be written up crazy
[1:40:56] right but some talking points
[1:40:58] around what you think are some
[1:41:00] key takeaways that you've
[1:41:02] have come to you over the last
[1:41:04] series of presentations that you
[1:41:06] would want to make sure that we
[1:41:08] have in a a first draft so
[1:41:09] that we can be certain that that
[1:41:09] first draft
[1:41:12] is something worthy of us having
[1:41:14] a more robust conversation about
[1:41:16] and having public comment on so
[1:41:18] that as we go into our
[1:41:21] subsequent drafts that we're
[1:41:22] already starting with a strong
[1:41:23] foundation
[1:41:27] any questions or comments around
[1:41:27] what I just mentioned Director
[1:41:28] heckel
[1:41:28] thank you
[1:41:34] process wise so how so if we
[1:41:38] submit ideas how do you see
[1:41:39] that unfolding at that task
[1:41:40] force the affordable housing
[1:41:42] supply task force
[1:41:44] we had a number of subcommittees
[1:41:46] that sort of rolled up
[1:41:48] recommendations we don't have
[1:41:48] that here
[1:41:53] but each recommendation was I
[1:41:53] think we voted on each one
[1:41:54] didn't we
[1:41:56] we ended up with71
[1:42:00] and so I'm just curious of
[1:42:02] what your thoughts are about
[1:42:04] sort of how how all of that
[1:42:06] works so think with the first
[1:42:07] draft there won't be
[1:42:08] recommendations the first draft
[1:42:10] will be bringing together all of
[1:42:12] the information this is what you
[1:42:14] know was presented these are the
[1:42:18] the key points that were made
[1:42:20] from that then we can say listen
[1:42:22] everything that we've considered
[1:42:24] these are recommendations we'll
[1:42:24] filter those out
[1:42:27] through some conversation public
[1:42:28] comment etc and then keep
[1:42:30] working whittling our way
[1:42:31] through to the in
[1:42:31] makes sense
[1:42:36] any other questions or comments
[1:42:37] on that
[1:42:38] senator Hoffmanman
[1:42:40] I kind of feel like it just in
[1:42:42] the discussions we were coming
[1:42:46] up with ideas and and like that
[1:42:46] should go into the report like
[1:42:48] we were talking about maybe you
[1:42:50] should take on more and give
[1:42:52] some of your other things off to
[1:42:53] some of the nonprofits
[1:42:56] do you feel like that I know
[1:42:58] it's been a long time since we
[1:42:59] met
[1:43:02] but as we were talking we we are
[1:43:02] realizing that your office is
[1:43:04] taking on things that you
[1:43:05] shouldn't be taking on
[1:43:07] yet your
[1:43:11] guidance on some of these things
[1:43:14] so what achel was saying I
[1:43:15] don't know where she went
[1:43:18] talking about the different
[1:43:19] directors and then like maybe
[1:43:20] you could oversee all the
[1:43:22] different directors and then we
[1:43:23] could start pulling things
[1:43:23] together that way
[1:43:28] that just in these conversations
[1:43:30] kind of ideas have been'll take
[1:43:30] that as a compliment because I
[1:43:32] thought the complaint was that
[1:43:32] we weren't doing enough
[1:43:34] so
[1:43:38] so ok season season two of the
[1:43:39] show is really interesting
[1:43:44] yeah yeah
[1:43:46] short I mean you know a lot of
[1:43:48] the stuff that that that we've
[1:43:50] talked about are things that
[1:43:52] that you know in different
[1:43:54] ways I think that you know we
[1:43:58] heard atdSHA and are doing
[1:44:00] differently now so I think it's
[1:44:02] really important as we go
[1:44:04] through this process to not only
[1:44:05] look at
[1:44:10] at at at the way things used to
[1:44:12] be but also look at how they
[1:44:14] are different just in the last
[1:44:16] couple of years and and
[1:44:20] the way that the the direction
[1:44:22] thatdSHA is going on on on
[1:44:23] things that maybe aren't quite
[1:44:24] done yet I mean homelessness
[1:44:27] I think is a perfect example and
[1:44:28] following up on on Rachel's
[1:44:29] presentation
[1:44:34] you know s stepping into a
[1:44:38] recreating a statewide entity
[1:44:40] with the interagency
[1:44:42] collaborative you know
[1:44:44] getting some sort of situation
[1:44:48] where we're level set on on the
[1:44:50] existing s the existing
[1:44:51] system breaking out into10
[1:44:52] different subcommittees to look
[1:44:54] at centralized intake and code
[1:44:56] purple and shelter capacity and
[1:44:58] prevention and exits right all
[1:44:59] of the things that achel just
[1:45:00] said
[1:45:02] you know we we know that we
[1:45:04] need to to be doing more work on
[1:45:06] that and DSHA is putting itself
[1:45:07] right to the middle of that
[1:45:10] all well you know also you
[1:45:12] know close to closer today
[1:45:14] than we were yesterday at least
[1:45:16] opening a hope center in Kent
[1:45:18] County and that changes that
[1:45:19] changes in my mind that changes
[1:45:20] everything but it certainly
[1:45:25] changes DSHA and so you know
[1:45:26] that's the kind of of stuff that
[1:45:28] I I think it's important to
[1:45:30] recognize yeah where we've been
[1:45:32] but also you know where the
[1:45:36] wheredSHA is is going as this
[1:45:37] committee makes its its
[1:45:37] recommendations
[1:45:42] any other questions or
[1:45:48] do we have any public comment
[1:45:52] people signed up for public
[1:45:53] comment sorry
[1:45:56] madam chair it's ok
[1:45:59] we currently do not have any
[1:46:02] in-person public comment I will
[1:46:03] inquire to see if we do have any
[1:46:06] virtual comments at this time
[1:46:10] we do have one son that
[1:46:11] misawayis
[1:46:18] Stevevanna unfortunately we are
[1:46:20] unable to hear you clear.
[1:46:22] do you hear me now? Yes we can
[1:46:23] thank you
[1:46:24] Lisa ri
[1:46:33] Hi good afternoon. my name is
[1:46:34] Lisa ice fromiddletown
[1:46:37] and I appreciate this
[1:46:38] opportunity to speak
[1:46:42] I want to first mention that
[1:46:43] taxpayers in delaware do not
[1:46:44] want another division to be
[1:46:48] formed and question why for
[1:46:49] existing housing authorities are
[1:46:51] not capable of managing
[1:46:52] affordable housing goals and the
[1:46:53] process to achieve them
[1:46:56] when taxpayers are experiencing
[1:46:58] increases in property school and
[1:47:00] business taxes we want to see
[1:47:03] responsible government spending
[1:47:05] because if legislators lowered
[1:47:05] property taxes
[1:47:08] housing would be affordable and
[1:47:11] consumer spending would increase
[1:47:12] which benefits the state
[1:47:12] financially
[1:47:15] Additionally as an advocate the
[1:47:16] thought of more wasteful
[1:47:18] spending stings my eyes because
[1:47:20] I can name hundreds of other
[1:47:21] ways to spend money that would
[1:47:22] directly catapult the state by
[1:47:23] assisting people to thrive
[1:47:26] Other states have created
[1:47:28] bipartisan legislation in order
[1:47:30] to provide affordable housing
[1:47:31] and I've created a document
[1:47:32] which I'll send in a few moments
[1:47:36] to share202ix legislation with
[1:47:38] you I placed oregon first
[1:47:40] because I advocated for housing
[1:47:42] in delaware for over two years
[1:47:43] and I feel like perhaps we
[1:47:43] should rest
[1:47:48] on what to see where our recent
[1:47:49] successful efforts lead us
[1:47:52] efforts to protect ventures in
[1:47:54] vast capacities have been
[1:47:56] largely successful very recently
[1:47:56] in delaware
[1:47:59] regarding building more housing
[1:48:01] to lower costs I know this is
[1:48:02] how economics are supposed to
[1:48:04] work. however as a farmer the
[1:48:06] price of hay would go up because
[1:48:08] there was too much rain and not
[1:48:08] enough rain and the prices never
[1:48:09] went down.
[1:48:11] Temporary taxes are never
[1:48:11] temporary either
[1:48:16] gar ding homelessness based on
[1:48:17] my studies and personal
[1:48:19] experience as a former homeless
[1:48:19] and active alcoholic
[1:48:22] I have found that harm reduction
[1:48:24] efforts that meet a person where
[1:48:27] they are should include street
[1:48:29] interventions with immediate
[1:48:30] transport available to treatment
[1:48:34] not a suggestion, not a pamphlet
[1:48:36] or an offer to call somebody.
[1:48:38] I'm talking about a car with an
[1:48:38] available bed at the end of the
[1:48:39] trip
[1:48:42] d d ition ally delaware needs
[1:48:43] more places to recover
[1:48:45] recovery and treatment are not
[1:48:45] the same
[1:48:51] Your2 minutes is up this
[1:48:52] concludes all virtual public
[1:48:52] comment
[1:49:00] thank youtevanna
[1:49:02] with that said I do want to just
[1:49:04] let the committee know that I'll
[1:49:06] be sending an email with some
[1:49:08] possible dates for us to have
[1:49:10] follow up meetings if folks
[1:49:12] could share which dates work
[1:49:13] best for them that would be
[1:49:14] helpful and then we can just
[1:49:16] lock those in and other than
[1:49:18] that we'll look forward to your
[1:49:20] submittal of pieces that you
[1:49:22] want to ensure that we have in
[1:49:23] the first draft of the report
[1:49:24] about the things again just the
[1:49:26] information we've gathered by
[1:49:27] September4th right
[1:49:30] thank you all all'll entertain a
[1:49:31] motion
[1:49:33] all right
[1:49:36] seeing no objections our meeting
[1:49:36] adjourns