Theory of change had really been this kind of if
you can build awareness, if you can provide education, tools
and training that will lead to action or all around
sustainable cities. So that had been evergreen's theory of change.
And we took that and we applied it to the
site itself. And. We worked with, again, a very collaborative
process and brought in experts to help facilitate this with
us. To really say, what is it that we're fundamentally
trying to do? How will we create this living lab.
How? Does that program. Embody the heritage and the brick
making history of this site. And how do these themes
then inform the nature of the design of the program
that happens down there. As I mentioned, it took us
eight years. A long time. Some people said, oh, I
thought it was the best project that never happened. Because
we were like, sits and starts and trying to get
out of the starting gate and figuring things out. And
so we started to do some community programming, and I
think 2007, three years before, we hadn't even broken ground
for construction yet. So that we did a farmers market,
we did some pop up gardening and programs, and so.
Yes. They helped us to say, hey, what will work?
Will people come? But they also put us on. The
map. And by putting us on the map, it was
very strategic because it helped us to get legitimacy. With
the public. It helped us to show donors that we
were indeed a real thing. And to help open their
purses. And both of those things helped to move forward.
City approval. So, yes, the visitor programming was lovely and
fun, and we learned from it, but it was strategic.
In terms of moving the project along. And we kept
moving. We kept trying to create. A big, complex site
like yours, how do you create spaces of scale? And
so we would bring in smaller containers, like inexpensive activations.
That people could kind of find a front door. This
flower was like a building tenant like kind of a
playful gesture that sort of pops out of the site
and you can see it as you're going by bathey
and so on. We would try to mobilize champions. And
create buzz. Prince Charles was coming. We pulled out all
the stops. To. Have a whole conference and events and
so on. That, again helped to move approvals. Along. We
did light touch, and they still do this sort of
work down there. We did light touch. Urban ecology and
created some significant geological. Artistic installations that would raise awareness
that this is indeed in a watershed. That's a watershed.
Wall, that one picture there. And moving to bigger activities
around local food systems and urban agriculture, again, very much
in the realm of sustainable cities. You can see this
building is, in fact, not dissimilar in some ways to
yours just in that it's a large, hulking space. And
our farmers market quickly became the largest local farmers market
in Toronto, and it's contributed millions of dollars to the
local food economy. And so smaller activities to larger ones.
Green City camps really working with the space heritage interpretation,
leaving a lot of the machinery in situ, creating ways
of representing the worker stories. It cost a lot of
money to fix the brick press there, but even the
interactions around kind of the worker stories. And experiences. They
don't need to be. Hugely expensive, and they do create
a real tone in terms of what matters. Who's been
there before us. Why does this site resonate for Toronto?
Just different ways of trying to open those conversations and
then larger scale events as well. There's been many TEd
talks down there. This is something called singularity. Uconnse. That
was hosted a large scale exhibit. So we moved into
bigger events as well as capacity and opportunity arose. So
those are just some of the ways that we activated
the site from a community perspective, ways that reflected. What
was there? And also ways that drove the business plan,
which I'll speak about in a sec. In terms of
planning and approvals. It was really helpful for us to
think about the site as a campus. I didn't really
appreciate that until, well, in oopsie, many years into. The
site's development that there are different kind of nodes across
the site. There's different buildings. And each of those kind
of plays a different purpose. There are many phases over
time as the need and as the opportunity align. And
so we didn't have to do it all at once.
We hired because this site was so much about Toronto.
And city building of Toronto. We hired a Toronto team
of designers. We received proposals. From. International firms. And that
was unflattering. But we ended up going with. A really
bona fide team of experts from Toronto and again, that
spoke the values of what we were trying to accomplish.
And given the scale and capacity it needed to be
a very collaborative process. And so we hired an architect
who had that kind of disposition. We could work with
25 sub consultants and so on. A lot of community
engagement in the design and allowing the design to be
iterative. And echoing back, what is it about this site
that's important to you? What is it? About relevant? What
is it about the qualities and the characteristics of this
space that you don't? Want to be lost through the
design process. It's nice to do. It builds more ownership,
it builds more voices. And I know even with the
flood they had this summer, there was, like a groundswell
of support for people to go down and help the
brickworks because it has become such a beloved institution in
the city. So, again, these are kind of nice to
do. Things. But there's a bigger picture as well in
terms of creating champions and advocates, so just moving from
the green. Sorry, the community work to the green design.
It is a lead platinum site. We employed all sorts
of strategies. This was the second phase of development that
we did about a $25 million redevelopment of the large
building there. That's a 53,000 square foot former kiln building.
And our ambition was to create. A zero carbon. Building,
or rather redevelopment. And so. I included this film because
this slide, because it shows some of. The scale again,
which you have, like, a large kind of tunnel like
shape. And how we broke that shape into different kind
of zones of action of activity for different programmatic functions
and uses. And how the green design you can see
a geothermal field was as part of that. So looking
at the site and the building. In its entirety. What
do you do with this big kind of shell of
a space? And then what are some of the strategies
that we will employ to get our zero carbon. So
this building. Has a geothermal they're about to put the
solar panels on at long last. Passing and heating cooling.
Like, really working with what's already there. And doing a
lot of modeling, to say. What's it going to take
to get. To a carbon zero carbon. And so putting
these strategies in service of hitting particular carbon reduction targets.
All of this modeling again, bringing in a good team.
But we got funds from the green, municipal funds from
the. Federation of Canadian Municipalities. Which is something that maybe
would be something you want to tap into. I mentioned
quickly our business plan. We had to make the site
financially self sustaining. There was no government grants. We were
a nontraditional developer. We were not building houses. As often
as the case with these projects. You do the heritage
stuff and then you build the towers around it to
be the business model to support the heritage. Preservation and
program work. Again because of the floodplain did not have.
The reality of creating housing. We had to create the
business model within the site itself. And so some of
the things that we did there, one is. A garden
shop, which kind of breaks even. And not a money
maker. Real estate. By creating in that one picture there,
that's the new building. That's the lead. Platinum building. In
the footprint of an old building, there's three stories of
new office space. And then rental space for events. And
that event space really was the big financial driver for
the site. Movie shoots, conferences. Weddings. All of those kinds
of things. That really provide. Collectively provide the revenue that.
Allowed Evergreen to provide the programs. I won't belabor how
we raise the money. It's a huge chapter unto itself,
but I will just say we needed innovator. Funders who
were not afraid of kind of an untested developer. In
a complex site. And so we found some funders who
are willing to get behind the idea because they were
inspired by what was possible. And then we also were
able to get some sizable public investments. We got $10
million from the Ontario. The government that came through the
Ontario Heritage Trust. Kind of out of the gates. And
by getting some of those early public investments that helped
to derisk private contributions that. Came in the fullness of
time. And just a few lessons learned. And I appreciate
I'm going through this quickly. But is this idea of
engaging communities early and often and to not just engage.
Communities, but listening and following through. When we started the
project, there were a lot of people who didn't like
us. There was a lot of people who just because
we represented change, And I think through our process of
engagement, we really showed that, no, we're actually really. Interested
in what ideas have come forward here and responding and
showing that. We were changing our plans, evolving, adapting in
response to what we were hearing, and again, That's more
than a nice thing to do, is ultimately it's quite
strategic. Focusing on the big picture. They haven't even finished
the site. It'll be years before they quote unquote. Finish
it. But you got to keep the big picture in
mind, the vision. But you also can only take it
one step at a time. And so creating milestones and
celebrating successes along the way. Were the only ways that
we could kind of feel like we were actually moving
along, because probably if people had said to Evergreen in
2002, do you know this is going to be a
$55 million project and take eight years, we would as
adult. Thank you very much. But. We don't have that
staying power, so. You get in, and then you got
to keep going. And asking for help. One of the
things evergreen did really well was. We had a sense
of our strength and weaknesses. But who could complement us?
When do you bring in the right people. A lot
of people. Volunteered their time or they were happy to
help in different ways just because they knew it was
a project that resonated, that it was an important project
for our city, and so we were very good at
kind of saying, hey, we don't actually know anybody who
can do economic modeling. Does anybody know who do economic
modeling? And so on and so forth. So just building
the team like that. This idea of revealing the site
over time and really respecting the heritage and the ecology
and not fighting it. We really learned how to work
with what was there, as opposed to being far more
interventionist. And this idea of being rigorous and that numbers
matter. Tripling your time expectations. We kept saying, we'll be
open in six months. Did we say six months? We
meant eight months. Like, eight years. So you got to
be ready that it's going to be a long haul
and that your budget is going to do all sorts
of scary things. And we had devalion engineer, and I
asked maybe like $85 million. Tweak, tweak, tweak, tweak, tweak.
And so, working all that in alignment with. Our capacity.
Where the demand was coming from in terms of what
felt like the right move once the sort of the
core stabilization. What are the kinds of interventions that we
can do beyond that are going to support the business
plan and the program. So those are some of the
ways. And we were scrappy, like we didn't say. No,
a lot of it was like, how might we do
this? How might we do this? How? Do we get
to? Yes. And I think if we didn't have that
kind of tenacious. Attitude. We probably would have been in
it for a few years and said, sorry, I can't.
Do it. It's too big. So just that spirit of
optimism and Emily. Should I wrap there? Should I go?
Yeah. So just a few more things. So that's our
brickwork experience. And I just thought. Given that I'm doing
a PhD in this area, that was all very practical
stuff. From. I worked at Evergreen from 20 years and
on that project for about 15, so that was like
all very practical stuff. This is. Now stepping back to
the ph. D. Work. And this quote really resonates. Because.
Again, the battle for are these sites protected and why
and who for and all that sort of stuff is
that it's really helpful to think of these as their
generative domain. They're not just contested, but their spaces, their
publicly useful space. Where we can think about our implications
in a complex past and a yet undetermined present. Future
part of me. A lot of these projects and the
ones I'm looking at are coming from bigger cities. The
high line in New York, the Tayton modern, the batter
seeds redevelopment in London. Projects where old industrial properties have
been redeveloped with millions of dollars and often what they're
doing as part of these cultural regeneration strategies is they're
contributing to tremendous gentrification. And that doesn't necessarily serve most
people. A couple of sites. Guttermoon Wereworth in Toronto, the
cold drop yards in London. UK, which are two sites
I'm doing my PhD on. These are examples of where
in these big cities. Oopsie. In these big cities. Sorry.
My finger moves. You can see. The cranes both around
the distillery and around cold drop yards. They're surrounded by
cranes as the kind of the economic model and. The
demand for housing. And. Are really being enabled because of
the heritage development and again, lots of benefits, but not
always. A benefit in service to communities. Because of the
unaffordability. A couple of projects that may be a bit
more relevant for Stratford because they are coming out. Of
smaller communities. One is this base, 31 out of Prince
Edward county and an old military area. Where they're starting
with huge community activations and an arts program ultimately to
create. A major housing development. It's just outside of Picton
and I think. Picton's? Population is about 30,000 as well.
Math mocha in north adams, massachusetts. A huge old factory
that played many purposes over the last century but transformed
into. A large art center. About 2 hours out of.
Boston. So. Different models exist outside of the large cities
as well for redeveloping these properties. And I guess I'll
leave it at that for now, if you will. Thank
you, Shauna. Is there any questions from members of the
city? Mark, thanks very much. That was great. Evergreen. Evergreen
Brickworks is a really big part of Toronto now, so
that's great testament to what you've done. I'm going back
to the practical a bit. $55 million budget. That was
all the building components of what you had to do.
55 million was the first phase, and the building was
about 40 million. And of that you said you got
10 million from the government. Yeah, we got 10 million.
From the province. Initially, we got 20 million from the
federal government and. We raised over 20 million from. Private.
Individuals and corporate. Okay, and. That sort of gets you
to the numbers that you need to do, and you're
required. To sort of break even on what you're doing,
because whatever you put in there has to sort of
be able to survive. And was there a lot of
infrastructure that you had to put up other than the
building part? Of it in terms of roads, environmental, all
that kind of stuff. Well, yes. One of the reasons
why 40 of the 55, because there's a lot of
studies. I don't know how much extra we had to
spend on environmental assessments, archaeology assessments, heritage. Many, many studies,
Evergreen footed the bill for anything that was on the
industrial pad. That's what? We had a head lease with
the city and the conservation authority for the industrial pad.
The city of Toronto helped with things off the industrial
pad. So new. Stacking lanes of a Bayview for safe
entry, new traffic lights, but. By and large, evergreen. Carried.
95% of what had to be done on the site.
With the city supporting things. The city has since done
a lot of work, for example, with the ravine system
and trying to create better pathways and trail connections and
so on. So we had a lease that was about
400 pages. Okay, thanks. Which is not recommended. Any other
questions for members? Ron. Again, thank you for your presentation.
I find it fascinating. Could you talk a little bit
more about partnerships? How you found partners, how you defined
a partner. If there was a buy in in terms
of finances or. Trades or whatever. I'm quite interested in
finding out what that might look like. Yeah. Because partner
is a big catch, all right? Yeah, I would say
the way I define partners. Our program partners or community
partners, and I'll talk about that in a sec. And
then some of them morphed into also business partners. So
the programmatic partner. So when I showed you Jamie Kennedy
kitchens in the gardener Museum, the Y and outward bound
at the beginning. They all started as people who were,
who were at the beginning were willing to lend their
names. Lend their logos, if you will, and their time
to helping us think through the project. And they brought
program energy on their own dime, down sometimes to do
various kinds of activations. And events. Because.
They had some skin in the game, but Evergreen really
had. Was carrying it. Right. But they were able to
kind of bring some of their equity and their brand
recognition and their capital to come and support what was
happening down there. We did not for that work have
agreements. Anything papered. Where we would start to paper things
would be when it would become more of. A lease
relationship. And so we had a restaurant tour. Who was
in the space he left recently, but for many years,
and he was a partner because he very much represented
the sort of the slow food principles. And so on.
But he paid rent. He got a percentage of. The
catering work and all that kind of stuff. In creating
those kinds of, and kind of evolving from a partner
relationship, which is the program and the community stuff. It's
high impact, but it's low risk. To. The more the
legal contract work, which you still like to think there's
still partners because they're still invested in the vision, but.
They're putting money on the table. As are we. Again,
there's still part and but a different scale of partnership.
We didn't have. A merger. There wasn't, like, that level
of partnership where you're actually really entwined they were more
sort of people who supported the vision and were participating
in different ways. Thank you. Sorry. With various levels of
risk and money involved. You need to cut your microphone.
Come up to there, Karen. Thank you. Following up. With
the people sitting at home. Following up on that. As
a partnership? That's a good question. Like, who went out
and said, gee, would you? Like to be a partner.
Because. The partnership committee doesn't have the legal entity to
say, sign here. So we're looking at where do we
go? To get these partners. And how far into the
legalities do we go when we meet them? So I'd
be interested to hear a little bit more about that.
Yeah. And I realized I didn't. Fully answer. How did
you find them? We went out because we went out
to people who. Once we had the vision again, like
this living center for sustainability. It's like, well, it's very
much a site about city building and clay gardener ceramics
museum. We want to have a strong food component because
that's such a part of sustainable cities. We went out
looking for partners who could complement the vision and the
program that we wanted to offer, and we didn't have
the expertise to do. So that was us seeking. That
was us saying, we need people who can, we need
organizations who can bring stuff we can't, right? And then
as. We got more momentum. We got approached more by
people saying, hey, can I do this or do that.
I guess maybe because to be a little rogue. At
the beginning. If their light touch kind of activations, and
you're just trying to work with people. To create a
vision. I don't think you need to get overly papered.
Right, and. Legal. As I say, when it would matter
would be. When they would be, for example, taking space.
Right. Sometimes there's a program partnership that's like you're going
to do. An event together. And it's not about the
buildings, per se, but it's an event. You could still
have an agreement that outlines rules and responsibilities. And again,
these things, you have to have a ton of trust.
In doing these things, they would matter, for example, more
again, when money is involved. So we did an event
with slow food Toronto for many years, it became a
big picnic at the brickworks. We did it for about
three or four years with slow food Toronto. And we
got to the point where we're like, oh, my goodness,
we need to actually paper this up because you're putting
money down. We're putting money down. Who's going to get
the profits? Who's going? To get bear the risk of
it doesn't make money, right? That's how we kind of
found our way through. Just a quick question. Just maybe
I miss it. I think you said that the site
is owned. By the conservation authority and managed by the
city of Toronto, but. Just, like, structurally. When you say
we, I assume you mean evergreen. Are you your own
nonprofit entity or. Is all of this developed or was
all this developed by the city? So this conservation authority
owns the land because it's the valley lands, and that's.
Part of the. Conservation act of Ontario. So that's kind
of in the provincial. Policy legislation. The city and the
conservation authority have, like, this 99 year agreement where the
city manages the land. That the conservation authority owns within
its borders. Evergreen came along as a third party developer
so that's why we didn't own the land. We had
a headlease to raise the money and operate a part
of the land, so. Evergreen is a nonprofit charitable organization.
Wholly independent of the government agency. Do you have an
arrangement with the city? That's my. 400 page lease, okay?
That lease allowed us to kind of do the construction.
And get to opening. And it was a 21 year
less a day lease because if it's over 21 years.
It triggers something in the appropriation act. And because the
site had already been expropriated. The government didn't want to
go there, obviously, and nor should they have. So it
was again. All the footwork that happens to make these
things happen. It was 21 years less a day. It's
the fine print. Any other questions from members of the
committee? Hi.
I was kind of interested. This thing is possessed. The
activation you did as the site was beginning. To come
to life. And you also noted that there's some physical
similarities in the actual space between what you have in
the grand trunk site. I'm just wondering if you have
any advice or suggestions or ideas that we can think
about as we look. To activate that site temporarily. Whether
it's types of uses, frequency of uses, seasonality, Different audiences,
different people, because we've got a fairly substantial space. And
we have time. So. Any advice you have would be
grately accepted. Yeah. And Emily, we started to talk about
that and be glad to talk about that more. From
now. If you are going to engage community partners to
help do it, as opposed to this group doing the
activations, I assume, right? I think one of the. And
maybe you do a solicitation process, or maybe you tap
a group on the shoulder because they're doing work on
history. And. That wonderful banner that's already there. Maybe you
want to work with groups however you select. Them. I
would just say, I guess a couple of things. One
is make it easy for them to get involved. Don't
do it. I mean, I'm somewhat facetiously here, but don't.
Do a 400 page lease. Make it easy for groups
to get involved. Because a lot of groups, they just
don't have the capacity. To. I think the city of
Toronto has gotten much better at doing partnership agreements because
of groups like Evergreen, having to kind of break the
mold. Eight years and $1 million are pro bono legal.
And if we didn't have the pro bono legal. So
a light touch activation should have a light touch. Support
mechanism. And sometimes it gets to with groups like they
don't have insurance. Because they don't have general liability insurance.
Will the city be willing to kind of hold that
for people? Is it a two page agreement, not a
25 page agreement? For light touch activations make it easy
for people to participate because they're going to. Bring their
networks, their brand and their equity that's going to ultimately
serve the project. So I would just try to think
about. How to remove barriers that make it easy, and
then in terms of what you want to do, I
think those are really creative and fun conversations. Thanks. I
saw the hand in the back. But any other members
of the committee? For steering. Working group chairs or staff
members. We don't normally open it up to the floor,
but if you want to. Sure. I found it all
very fascinating. I'm just dropped first. I actually grew up
in the water there, and I was in multiple different
cities, but I just wanted to say I was. Wondering,
is it wise to incorporate a few of the larger
partners first and really work on that? Development with the
offices. To start getting flip traffic to the area and
movement towards the area and into the area, into. The
grand trunk. Throw it. Is that a good. Point. My
sense is that you have to be working on both
levels. Right, because the little activations are nice for, like,
doors open. And a movie knife, but it doesn't move
the needle. And so I think at the same time,
the city needs to be working with the YMCA and
maybe the library, maybe Waterloo, right, to try to land
some of those, because. Those define the project materially. So
it's a bottom up top down thing that you're constantly
toggling. Between. Yeah. Create some of those new projects. And
the big idea is they land that they give the
future. In terms of the viability and will attract the
larger infrastructure dollars. Right. It's more of an art than
a science as well. Thank you so much. Emily? Yeah,
I just wanted to make one comment or two comments.
I guess I just really want to thank you, Shauna,
for coming to share this presentation with us today. I
know Sean and I spent some time together this afternoon
and chatted last week in advance of today and one
thing that you said, shauna, that really resonated with me.
Was this idea that. We sometimes think this stuff is
going to be linear. And I think when you were
talking about this. Sometimes when you present this stuff back,
it feels, Jonathan said like, yes. And people are like,
oh, you took this step, this step, this step. And
not to take your thunder, did we talk? About kind
of how you responded to that. It's like linear versus
how it actually felt. Yeah, I forgot to put in
that slide. So. Yes, it does. With the beauty of
hindsight. And then we did this, and then we. Did
that. And then this is. And it looks like it
was hugely intentional. Most days it felt like a snowstorm,
right. And. So when I was showing the slides show
with a community group or something like this slideshow. Earlier
this spring, community group that wants to do a campaign
of their own. I said I showed like this ball
of yarn. I said, most of the time it felt
like this. It did not feel linear, right. And it
did not feel like. We did not know. What we
did not know. That comes back to. Creating that culture,
an organizational culture or committee structure. However you're going to
work this to say. Okay, well, how do we adapt
to that new, how do we adapt to that information?
A fellow who was on our committee, a good friend
of Melanie, he would say. It's. Like you're throwing balls
up in the air. You just come throw balls in,
you drop. One art, grab another one, throw it up.
And so a lot of, especially in the formative stages
when you're trying to see, like, what can this building
hold? Like one of the reasons why our cough. Construction
were so because we wanted to do it all. And
then while we can't afford that. Scale. Scale, scale readap.
Readapot approvals. We had no idea the levels of approvals,
et cetera, et cetera. But this culture that's like, okay,
how might we do this? What do we learn from
that. What are we going to let go of? How
do we keep building more supporters than naysayers? And one
of the ways you do that is also by showing
that you're pivoting. Yes, we had master plans, and, yes,
we had project plans, and they helped to kind of
create a sense of direction. And kind of milestones, but
how that gets done? Is not linear. Thank you very
much, Shauna. I think that wraps up our questions on
behalf of the committee. And the city of a resident.
Thank you so much. Gift of our appreciation for coming
today. Okay. Thank you.
Item six is business arising from previous minutes. Item six,
one is the indigenous engagement consultation strategy, Kevin. And Una
are here to provide us an update on their work
and what we can expect in the coming weeks, so
I think unal invite you forward. Poor Kevin is not
here today unexpectedly. So Una is taking up the mantle
on her own today. Thank you. Chair. I just want
to give you sort of an update. From the overview
that we presented at the last meeting. We've kind of
drilled down into the different steps that we need to
take, and we're moving forward with those steps. With a
view to creating a consultation plan with indigenous people. So.
We're calling this? Well, it's obviously a pre consultation phase,
so we're. Calling this relationship building phase, if you like.
And as you heard in the land acknowledgment, Stratford is
land that. Is really, I guess, referred to by many
different First nations. So the first step for us is
identifying those various nations to be able to even identify
those indigenous organizations and stakeholders, including knowledge keepers. Elders, youth
treaty organizations, urban indigenous. Communities to ensure that we have
a comprehensive representation. We've done some sort of preliminary work.
With the city of Guelph, just in terms of trying
to get some information. But also trying to help us
understand what this process. Involves and being able to ensure
that we have representation of all of the folks that
identify as having moved through this land is paramount to
us, and so we're hoping to compile. A comprehensive list
of indigenous interestholders. Secondly, we're looking at. The land acknowledgment
itself. So once we've identified the interest, then. We can
be able to go back to the land. Acknowledgment and
actually identify those nations. And to have workshops. With project
teams on this committee, but also with planning department in
terms of those indigenous protocols. As we know, different nations
have obviously. Different, maybe competing interests, if you'd like, but
various ways of culture. So how do all of them
get represented. And then thirdly, it's the initial outreach, so
that would be working with the committee. To send formal
communication to indigenous governments and organizations. Outlining the project's scope
and its objectives and their right to participate in the
consultative process and to ensure that communication. Is clear and
how their input will influence decision making. And so that
will involve, obviously, drafting and sending formal limitations with the
follow up plan. For continuous engagements, and then we hope
to be able to identify what that sort of consultative
phase plan actually looks like, and so we'll be giving
you updates periodically. Any questions for Una? Yes. Add one
thing, because Kevin couldn't be here today. So really, the
intention of what? Una's described is kind of these immediate
next actions the team is going to be taking as
they prepare. A plan for you. Review. So the intention
is for the team to come back to this committee.
In October to share with you a draft plan. But
the steps that una's outlined here. Are really the things
that need to. Inform a draft plan. So what she's
described today are these things that are underway, right? Now
and are going to inform a draft plan that will
come to you for your consideration. So. That we just
wanted to be sure that everyone understood coming out of
last month that the things are happening right now. They're
underway, but the plan itself. You won't see for another
month until we meet again. Thank you very much, Una.
There's no questions. It's actually a question of. For this
committee to consider. I think I have a small understanding
of how deep and complex indigenous cultures are. And there
are a variety of them. As I understand it. They're
not always indigenous. Communities are not always in agreement with
each other. A variety of issues. And. I appreciate what
it is we're trying to do. We're trying to develop
protocols. But I note in the last minute, That there
is a wish to try to incorporate indigenous perspectives and
design and space use. This may be hugely over simplistic.
But I put it out there for consideration. Has any
thought been given to simply dedicating a space. For the
exclusive use of indigenous communities so that they can present
their own message or messages at their discretion rather than
us. Trying to determine, through Develop protocols, what it is
they're trying to say. Just give them an opportunity to
say it. One of the preliminary discussions that we had
with the casuenta two row, now group. Was myself and
Ray. I can't remember his surname. But we had spoken
with them and they had come up with a number
of ideas. Thinking about the space, thinking about. How their
culture could be represented in such a space. There were
ideas. From their perspective, and that involved some aspect of
what a friendship center might look like and what that
might entail. But that's one organization that we're working with.
But there are also other organizations. As well. So it's
like, how does everybody have a voice? What are the
people that need to come to the table in terms
of those that have interest? In Stratford as well as
this organization. Follow up question, Mr. Sheriff, shouldn't we let
them determine. Which groups should be represented rather than us
trying to determine that? Absolutely. But shouldn't all the groups
also understand that this is happening. I agree with that.
Yeah. That Stratford encompasses their land. We have a duty
to inform. Anything further for Una. Thanks so much. Appreciate
it. Thank you. Item 62 is with regard to the
draft 2025 budget for the grant Trump renewal project, and
Joan Thompson, the CEO, has taken some of the feedback
given at the last meeting and has an update with
regard to that. Joan over. To you. Thank you very
much. Through you, Mr. Chair. So we did hear the
concerns about the draft budget that was presented at the
last meeting. In response to this, we have incorporated the
GTR work plan for the budget into the overall budget
of my office and broaden the description of the various
items. So there is still going to be an envelope
of funds available. That will be presented to Councillor. There
were questions about that allocation. In particular for the installation
and servicing of the roads, as well as the design
work related to that. So this revised budget document provides
a high level overview of the grand truck work plan.
Those work plans have already been presented to you. They've
been presented to Councillor and. The budget relates to a
Q three and the Q four work plan that the
committee recently prepared. And endorsed. The budget document indicates that
the funds from the Grand Trunk reserve will be used
in accordance with. The approved work plan and at the
discretion of Councillor. So ultimately, it is still Councillor that
makes. The decisions as to the various items when they're
ready to move forward. This means that with Councillor direction
funds, because it's an envelope of funds can be allocated.
From the reserve fund to support the work plan as
needed. Also want to address questions about the capacity and
the staffing that were raised at the meeting. So again,
funds from the Grand Trunk reserve will also be allocated
to invest Stratford, which is our partner agency to support
staffing for this project. So as part of the invest
Stratford budget that comes forward to counci. Council for council's
approval. There is a sum of money included in that
to expand the staffing capacity to support this. New project.
This is again subject to approval from invest, Stratford Board
and Councillor approval through the budget process. And if there's
any questions. Any questions for Joan? Thank you very much
for the update. Item 63 is the grand trunk activation
animation update, and I'm going to turn it over to
Tim and Emily to give us some background with regard.
To it. So through the chair, I had a quick
presentation. Until tonight. Shauna Andrews. And my presentation was on
a lot longer, so some great points came. Out and
things that we are already looking at. Last meeting. I
know it was brought up about animation. There's interest in
the community to see something going on in there. The
mayor. Mayor Ritzma Emily Robson and my community services team
already had a meeting. That week to discuss that very
item. So we are discussing. Looking at what processes we
have to do to get this going. What's some of
the hurdles that we have to get over. There's some,
obviously looking at permits occupancy. Rate and other items. Just
looking at site remediation. What can we use? Maybe there's
parts of the site that we stay away from. There's
also sites where you say, you know what we have
fence it off, utilize those areas. So the community services
team, I should just bring up that. So manager Darcy
Drummen, manager of recreation marketing. Jeff Auden, our supervisor, recreation.
And then we have two other coordinators. We have our
event. Coordinator Kirsten Ridell. And our. Heather Denny as well
is in there. As well as. Getting all these names
in here, so. Lana Bose, who is our sports cultural
sponsorship coordinator. So the plan is to meet this week.
We are going to go back on the site, start
generating ideas as to what can go in there. I
think we have a municipal cultural plan. We have as
a documentation on what we can also incorporate within this
site on activation animation. And then come back to the
team and to come up with a process on how
do we contact and get this applications in or if
people have a request to do animation. What's the process.
So that's where coming out of Shauna's presentation, And through
Andrew's questions. Pull up. These are the things we're looking
at. Is how do we make it easy? We don't
want a 20 page document that people are just going
to turn away and not want to do it. So
making it easy, get groups involved. Insurance will definitely be
part of the process, whether we look at city issued
insurance that we can do or the group does it
on their own. Have, like I said, an easy agreement
to remove those barriers. And I think one thing that
I did talk to my team about is we don't.
Have to be the thought process on what goes in
there. The community has lots of ideas and once. We
just make a process on. This is how you contact
us. This is how we get these initiatives moving forward,
the rest will fall in place. So that's where we're
at. Any questions, I'd be happy to answer. Ron. Thank
you. Just a quick question. Do you have a sense
of a timeline on when activations such as? A low
level of activation might happen. Or could happen, looking at
our own plans, but I'm. Now trying to merge it
with what you're saying through the chair. I think part
of that would be. We question whether a winter activation
would be something that maybe we're not sure that's? Going
to be in there, but ideally, we would like to
get this moving quick. The talks out there. The interest
is out there. So I think once we get the
stop out, on site, see what's going on there, we
can start moving forward. And some of those low hanging
fruit that we can maybe do quick, easy wins. To
get that in, we would like to do sooner than
later, so. I would hope in my world, the fall
would be great. To get something out there, I would
agree. I know that there are several arts groups that
are very interested in doing something on the site again,
low level and. It would be a good beginning. Thank
you. So along with Tim's team and community services, The
part of this endeavor that I've picked up and I'm
working on in partnership with in destinations dratford. And Stratford
Summer Music is actually figuring out what would a footprint
in that building look like? So. The kinds of things
we're talking about is like, okay, if we use this
kind of footprint here. What are the actual safety measures
that need to be in place? So what we're working
at right now is like, okay, we've got engineered fencing,
and it's in this footprint. What needs to change? Like
there's some holes and. Stuff like pits in that area.
Those need to be filled up, and we're really lucky.
To have partners in both those organizations who have brought
some real expertise. So, for example, We're meeting. With expert
in health and safety who has worked on many projects
repurposing. She worked on one to repurpose an industrial site
that was unoccupied as a performance. Venue. So what we're
working on right now is what is. The parameters for
an event in this space and working out, like, what
does it actually cost to. Put those things in place
and then. What kind of activity does that permit? So
that's really active right now. We're expecting recommendations from. Her
name is Janet Celery on the health and safety measures,
and we're working up what an actual design looks like.
In the building for the space. I mean, the great
news is it's huge. So you can get a lot
of occupancy only using a very small portion of the
site. So that really limits the types of, like, we
don't have to fill every empty elevator. Shaft. We can
just deal with the space that's within the footprint. That
we've identified. So I'm really, really pleased to have. The
partnership from both those organizations in TIm's director Wolf team
working on it. So it's a really exciting moment. There's
lots of great momentum, and as we've said before, lots
of real interest in the community to use that space
and to just emphasize what Shauna said about part of
the reason this work is important is because. We need
it to be easy and accessible for community organizations to
use that space and not expect. A lot of heavy
lifting on their part to be able to mitigate the
risks on the site. Thanks. Very much.
Next item is six. Four discussion points came from the
real estate legal and finance working group and I do
know that Joan and Taylor have got them and are
prepared to walk through if that's okay, Frank. Should I
serve the commentary? Mr. Chair, if you'd like to give
an overview. First off, I'll start by saying thank you
very much and my apologies that I was unable to
attend the August 29 meeting. So thank you very much
for allowing this report to come. Forward to this September
meeting. Our group met in August. And, of course, from
the committee would be Paul and Mark. So thank you
for their input as well. As well as a good
group of skilled individuals. With good business acumen to be
that review type component. As this progresses. So, first off,
I'll also say thank you to Joan for a great
presentation on August. 29. I enjoyed watching it after the
fact and your budget update today. Thank you for that.
As well. It actually addressed one of the four questions
that we're in already, so I'm sure you did that
intentionally so that I wouldn't have to ask the question
now, but. Thank you. One of the things that is
interesting with the way that this organization is set up
is that we've got these silos of working groups, but
as you know, there's so. Much crossover between these working
groups that. Those chair meetings are very important. And the
intersection of development. And finance are where you're going to
find some of these questions and Steve Cooper and I
have met to talk about them as well. But maybe
I'll just stop there. Should I pose the questions, Mr.
Chair? I think they have them so we can walk
them through. Thank you very much, Joan Taylor, which everyone
would like. To take the lead. So if I understand
that the first question has to do with the environmental
consideration, So the short answer to the questions is yes
and yes because we are getting yes as we heard
with Sean. But there is more to the simple answers
of yes, yes, and yes. So if Taylor, if you
wanted to start with the environment. Sure. Absolutely. So we've
had a decent amount of experience over the last few
years looking to environal mental radiation for the existing building
block, which has given us some insight what to expect.
As we proceed. With the rest of the site. In
reality. How we proceed with remediation depends on various factors,
including. What is the interest from the development community? They
helped guide or dictate. What kind of condition they're looking
for to have a landon if they're going. To build
upon it, right? So some developers. Are more apt to
risk and would consider taking on remedial activities themselves. However,
some due to insurance or liability requirements, what have you
that are finance agencies are less prone to risk and
rather see the municipality take on the environmental remediation initiatives.
The city is fully able to proceed with such environmental
remediation. There is some funds available. If Councillor decides to
proceed in certain areas. To take on. Environmental assessment work
that is required. It also depends on which section of
the site or building that is being looked at there's.
Various levels of contamination that exists on the overall site.
And so. That would guide. How also we could. Proceed.
To be development ready. That's kind of it in a
nutshell. If there's any specific questions. Mr. Chairman, it seems
to me. We keep going around the mulberry bush. I
believe that. Not using euphemisms. So environmental considerations, let's call
it. What? It is. Talking about polluted or contaminated areas.
And it seems to be a common theme. Across a
number of working groups. I'm looking at page 21. The
agenda ad hoc or the infrastructure and environmental working group?
Second action item is prepare a report outlining environmental issues.
On the next page and page 22. It says a
concern is the discovery that only a partial site record
of site report with required remedial actions has been undertaken.
So we really don't know. I think. Where the polluted
or contaminated areas are. We don't know the extent of
it by reading this correctly. Sure. No. So the site
has had environmental investigations over decades, so there is a
lot of information. About where and what pollutants exist. The
question then becomes which parcels being looking to develop because
there's various levels of contamination. So some parts of the
site, there's very little and very little needed to be
done. To remediate the site. Other sections of site have
a lot more significant pollutants. Which require further remediation. Do
we have, Mr. Chairman? A complete. Investigation report. Of
all of the polluted or contaminated areas. The extent of
it. What it is. Yes, we do know. We don't.
Through the chair. Like I said, there's been extensive studies
for the years, so we have. A fairly good idea
of what pollutants are where. Through the entire site. Fairly
good idea. There's dozens of boreholes that have had been
investigated. And each identify specific levels of contamination that exist
within the site itself. So depending on the site, it
depends the type of container that exists. So we have
a good understanding of the historical use of a site
and based on history we know, quite likely. The source
of the contaminants because our boreholes are saying this is
the type of contaminant. And then it confirms historically that
was the function of use in that area. So that
will guide which kind of remediation proceeds, because each type
of contaminant will have a different response required. To make
it clean for the intended use. I'm not trying to
be difficult. I'm really not. Trying to understand. Again through
the chair. So. Is there a master plan showing.
What areas are contaminated with what? The extent of it.
And the second question, I suppose, would be what would
be the cost of remediation. Because what I'm getting back
to. Is. The use to which. A certain area can
be put. Is often determined by the extent of the
contamination. Could I just piggyback on that? Has an entire
phase two study been done on the entire site. I
believe there's been a phase two done for the entire
site, but it would probably be outdated at this point
because it's been years since the entire site has been
investigated. The focus in the last few years has been
predominantly on the Cooper building itself. As that's the focus.
For future development now. Picking back to the other. Questions
in terms of what's been investigated for the site, so.
If you look at the recent record of site condition
for the Cooper Building, Did an extensive historical assessment of
what has been investigated. So it shows a map of
all the boreholes that have been investigating the site, and
it's quite extensive. It helps guide. Where their investigation moves
forward. So, yes, there has been investigation for the entire
site. In the last few years where environmental assessments. Has
more been developed, has been on the Cooper building itself,
and that's where more investigation and more analysis been done
so that future development can occur on that section of
site. Mr. Chairman may I? Go ahead. Follow up. Thank
you. I'm out of my depth here. In terms of
the science, but seems to me logically the first thing
we need to do is get. A complete examination of
all of the areas. And an updated report, not just.
The building itself, but all of the areas. Find out
if. It's contaminated. B with what? And see what the
cost of remediation. And then if it goes to market.
We can say this area is clean or this area.
Is contaminated with this substance. And our understanding of cost
remediation is x number of dollars. Are you not interested?
I'll make this really quick. I think this is an
issue that keeps coming back and I think both for
the committee and for staff. I think it would be
very useful if somebody could come before the committee and
explain the step by step process of brownfield development, including
risk. Assessment, risk mitigation, risk sharing, all of this stuff
so that we all have a unified. Understanding of how
the process works, both from the staff perspective and the
regulatory perspective from the developer's perspective, because this site is
going to get developed in this contaminated soil on it
and I think instead of having 15 different perspectives on
how this work, because it all is subject to the
same regulatory approvals and the same development process. And there's
lots of precedents in Ontario of where brownfield development has
happened on contaminated soil. It's been remediated in all sorts
of different uses been built on. It be nice if
we could find a project like that we could review
and just so everybody. Could understand how it works. And
maybe have. People's concerns eased about how the process works,
who pays for it? What are the different financial models
for it and the different risk sharing models for it,
because I can see there's. A lot of hang ups
on this, and I think we should probably strive to
get past it so that. We can keep going, but
clearly this is one that's captured a lot of people's.
Imagination, so there's lots of precedents around. I'm sure that's
something we can manage. That's a suggestion. Three aims to
share. So hear what you're saying. So my advice, Mr.
Chair, is for this committee to make. A motion directing
staff to go and seek the expertise that they're looking
for. And go through that process. So I think the
motion would be that we ask staff to investigate. Presentation
with regard to the risk mitigation and the addressing of
environmental concerns and the inventory of those concerns on the
site and to help us develop a strategy to move
forward is that acceptable. All. You move it. Second. Mark
discussion on that. So I think that would be as
easy as getting golder, who did the reporting. To whoever
was head of golder at the time of doing the
reports to come in and do the presentation and a
summary of what's been investigated and what's yet to be
investigated. Thank you. Thompson. All those in favor of the
question? Thank you. Taylor back to you.
Is there further questions? That are being asked of me
at this time. Sorry. Is there anything else, Frank? Thank
you, Mr. Chair. It was a question in regards to.
The intersection again of development and finance. We are looking
at. Models that. Will be potential uses such that we
can defray some costs. And we're specifically talking about residential
and. When our intersection happens. Is the parking something that
staff Councillor will consider? For not only our environmental stewardship
but also reduction of vehicular dependency. Are we moving forward
with reduced parking requirements for residential development? That's ultimately. Question.
Thank you. So again, at the last meeting, we had
the presentation from the director of building and planning, who
talked about community benefits as well as parking. So just
to reiterate again, the answer is yes. The city would
certainly be supportive of reducing the parking requirements, particularly if
structured or underground parking facilities on site or off site
in the downtown core were constructed to absorb the demand
on the site. This would help maximize land use and
support sustainable development goals. Currently, parking reductions are considered on
a case by case basis and would ultimately require council's
approval with key considerations, including the community benefits offered, proximity
to transit, and as we already know, The transit hobby
is already on site, so we are well connected. The
overall environmental stewardship and the long term impact on downtown
parking availability. Yes, we would consider it. So I take
it from that comment that this would be a site
specific consideration. Ms Thompson. Or are you indicating that? This
would be a citywide type change. I think. It's both.
Because you can't take a look at the parking requirements
on site. If we wanted to reduce the parking on
site because we've got existing transit and we're wanting to
expand on the transit hub concepts that we also have
to take a look. At. If we're reducing the parking
there, where can we make up some of that? Parking
if it's needed. So we have to look at the
other existing municipal parking lots and the impact you have
to look at the parking system that we have as
a system, and it's not individual law. Because you make
some decisions on one, it may have an impact on
other. Parking lots, parking system. And the last thing we
want is to drive overflow par. Parking onto the residential
streets. So we are looking at the whole system. But
definitely. It will be specific. To what is needed on
the grand trunk that will be driven by the uses
there and the capacity on site. Any other questions, follow
up, if I may. Sure. Thank you. On the bonusing
and community benefits side. If I could dive into that
for just a second. Because it does make a significant
difference on the viability from a financial perspective, whether this
project is even feasible or not. And it's kind of
from a 30,000ft perspective. There's some apprehension from some of
the and. You probably. Obviously. Can't respond on behalf of
Councillor, but there has been some apprehension in the past.
To approve buildings of a higher number of stories. Let's
just say it that way. I cannot see that this
will be a viable project if we don't get the
higher. Number of stories, quite frankly, and. I don't know,
ultimately, what the question I would be asking. It's more
a question, I guess. Of what's council's flavor? For engaging
in something like that. Sorry. Maybe, Mr. Chair, I'll start.
So again, in talking about community benefits again, our director
of building and planning. The last meeting did talk and
do a presentation with respect to community benefits. How the
existing community benefits that are already in place for this
site. But looking at the future. So again, the city
is prepared to allow for community benefits as listed. Under
the existing official plan document, so it's already there. This
would need to include community benefit agreements or development agreement
as potential tools to secure the desired benefits. So as
part of that, the city is also open to expanding
these provisions to incentivize developers to maximize the property. However,
any final decisions on these matters rest with Councillor. While
the timeline as we understand it, for formalizing the development
vision extends to the end of 2025. If a financially
strong development meets the majority of the city's objectives. Councillor
in the city. May want to initiate discussions earlier. So,
again, that's a long answer, but it is yes. We
know that community benefits. And looking at the density and
the height over there is a discussion point. We have
been having some preliminary discussions overall with city Councillor with
respect to. Number of stories and heights across the community.
You've seen some developments come forward that are starting to
identify that we need to intensify. Especially when it's on
infill. I believe his worship. Yeah. And I'll echo most
of what Joan, Ms. Thompson has to say. I know
in council's visionary process early on, There was an absolute
understanding and support of both higher density and higher heights
with regards to the grand trunk site. In order to.
Be. Encouraged developers to be on site and therefore. Enhance.
The tax base from that work to support the public
spaces. Is it unanimous? No, but I would think that.
There's certainly an overall majority that would say on Councillor.
Yes, we understand. Higher density, higher. Heights on that location.
Thank you. Anything further. Is there anything Joan or Kaylee
wanted to be on that? Thank you very much. Item
seven. We'll go to report the working group. Staff of
base. Item seven one is partnership. Herb and Karen, do
you have any one? Partnership. Working group updates, training. We
did present one, but I don't see it in here.
So. Come on up to the microphone.
This report is for information only. Overview of previous month
and activities planned. On September the 15th, John Cassner Karen
Haslam visited the Rotary Club presentation. On October 17, John
Castner, Herb Classon will visit the Lions club. October the
21st, John Classen, Karen haslam and Herb Classon will visit
the Kawanis. Club. So we're doing a lot of service
clubs. They are starting up in September, and that's where
we are. October, visit and presentation to the Kinsman club.
That date is still waiting for them to get back
to me with a positive. Ron Dodson is part of
our working group, and he is working with the Perth
county players and the arts groups to see if partnership.
Can be established with the YMCA. Overview of coming months
the working group will continue to visit with the clubs
in Stratford area to see if they would like to
use the community space at the Gtr. That's where. We
are in the process right now. Thank you very much.
Any questions? Great. Thank you. Thank you. Item 72 is
the vision, architecture and planning working group. Melanie couldn't be
here. Emily is. There anything more to unless there's questions.
Item 73 is real estate, legal and finance. Franklin, do
we cover everything under six? Four? Thank you. Devin Ford,
John and Andrew communications, advocacy and civics engagement. Thank you.
Very briefly, Over the past. Sort of. Since the last
time we met, Andrew and I have updated the faqs
on the website to reflect the current environment. And also,
we've also updated the speaking points. They're currently in the
draft form. We're waiting for the city's decision regarding the
guiding principles. We think that's. A bit of a milestone
event at that point. The faqs will be updated. I've
reached out to Mike bytes, made a couple of what
I would call housekeeping changes. In the inter. Interim where
Mike has updated those. And then we've got a list
of a number of modifications. All. I would say clarification
and updated nature. So that's really the first change to
the faqs and to the speaking points. Since they were
first penned out of our working groups meeting last week,
one of the questions was given the updates and things
that have happened. For example, we talk about partners, and
there's a rhetorical question. What partners? So we can talk
with a little more clarity about the library. We talk
a little more clarity about the why. And also reflected
to an earlier agenda item provide a little more clarity
about the environmental condition of the property. And Steve Cooper
gave a good report for us at the working group
chairs meeting last week. I think he's going to speak
to it here. The other thing that the communications committee
is involved in. Is a further leveraging of the current
assets. There was a reference here by our first speaker
to talk about the timeline. Historical timeline that's. Currently in
place on the site. In addition to that, Again, Steve
Cooper referencing him. He commissioned a virtual walk through of
the property, which is on the website, but it's pretty
buried and. We like to do in consult with Mike
bytes to leverage a couple of those things to get
a bit of social media. Leverage for those and to
get a bit of activation for those. Just. As our
last. Report there. Thanks to Karen and Herb, who've done
a really good job on the partnership. Aspect of arranging
some speaking engagements for myself, for Andrew, and also. In
addition, The service clubs you spoke to. There was a
number of pop ups. Finally. Since this was written. And
referenced earlier in the agenda. Andrew has done some work
regarding the activation he's created. A form in consul with
city staff that it makes it easy and simple for
groups that may want to be involved. A pretty easy
form. Which Andrews worked on, which we can distribute in
the community. Once activation is a goal and we've got
a bit of more pathway there. John. Questions for John.
Ron. Just a quick one, John, and it's actually to
you and to Karen and Herb. I think when you've
been talking to the service clubs and groups and so
on, has there been anything that's come out that you
were surprised at or. You were. Well, yeah. Anything that.
That kind of made you go. Yeah, I think so.
I think the recurring question is it comes up at
the end of every at the end of every presentation,
almost without fail. I think that's what you're thinking. Is.
This is great. We're really excited with this. I've lived
here a long. Time, when can we see something happen?
And I think one of the. Levers that happens next
after that, or what are the tumblers that roll over?
Is the conversations we had at previous meetings about. Okay,
we should get something happening. We should get activation there.
We have the timeline? Do we do something with the
building? Do we take the steel off? Do we cut
some trees? Do we cut grass? Do we look at
less air? Those are things. That come up in the
meetings and they're under consideration as to what the future
use. May be is that something a developer would be
better to do, et cetera. But I think to that
point. That is the overriding response that comes out of
those meetings. I'd love to see something there, some indication
that there's more than meetings. And I think. That's why.
I'm really buoyed by the idea of the animation project
and the idea that we activate the place a little
bit? Thank you. Hopefully that's helpful. Thanks, John. Anything further?
Much? 75 is infrastructure, environment. Steve, would you like to
come for. Yeah. Thanks, everyone.
I didn't speak up earlier in regard to environmental because.
I want to try and put together a bit of
a report for the next meeting, and also I want
to make sure Taylor. Answered any of your questions or
concerns. I think it's really important. What was brought to
the group here is just, I think, it would be
good for this group to understand what. Some of the
restrictions are on the site in regard to environmental concerns.
But one thing to keep in mind, this is a
brown field, like this is an industrial site. That's being
developed. It's not a farmers field that we're plowing into.
And taking over farmland. So I think it's really important
to develop a brown field in the city. But there
are challenges with that. There are always challenges with brownfield.
I would like to bring a lot more information to
this group and also work with city staff. On making
sure that the message and the information we're giving is
clear. So I hope to have a better presentation for
the next meeting. Or as you've directed staff to do
that to fully understand it. There are some really good
things about the Strafford site, because the ground in this
area. Is very tight. Okay, so most of the contaminants
don't go deep. They're shallow, which is extremely important in
regard to costs and remediation. And as Taylor highlighted, there
are certain areas that are impacted. So a lot of
the conversation that we will have in the future, maybe
not necessarily today, is kind of a chicken and an
egg conversation. Which, what comes first, do we remediate? Now.
And spend the money, but we don't know what we're
going to be doing. With the site or what the
developer is going to be doing with the site in
the future. Or do we find out what they're going
to do first and then. It's what comes first. But
I think in some of the conversations that we've had,
I think it is a good point. At this stage
to understand some of the restrictions. And what the best
use of those areas are. So I'm not going to
talk about that today, but I'll promise to bring something.
Back to the next meeting. An overarching kind of look
at it, and some of our recommendations from the committee
that we formed. And I'll make sure I want to
have some conversation with staff before I do that. So
that there's some unity in what we're presenting. Questions for
Steve. Thank you. Thanks so much, Steve. Yeah, thank you.
7.6 is working group coordinators. Ray couldn't be here. Alan,
did you have anything. They had asked me to raise
a couple of issues. One was with regard to. Wanting
members of the partnership committee to be able to attend.
With Herb and Karen events, and I've suggested that's an
internal discussion to have. Amongst that group on how they
allocate the work. We continue that discussion. Thank you. Second
was he'd asked him if the meeting is returning. To
07:00 p.m. But we had explained to him in going
to 04:00 we get the full compliment of city staff
to be able to be here a lot. Of them
without the expense. We are broadcasting these meetings, so unless
there is a will of the group. To change who.
We want to stay at that timeline now. And the
last was just a correction, I believe. Emily, he provided
us in an email like it. Was admitted in piece,
but I'll follow up on that if there's nothing else.
At all I had from the working group. Staff update.
Emily? Yeah, I just have a couple of comments, just
as a reminder. So these working group reports that. Are
now in the agenda package, just a reminder of where
they came from. So there was discussion. At this meeting
in July about some of the challenges with information flowing
back and forth. So the chairs of the working groups
in pretty short order, we figured out a template for
these working group reports. And people have been whipping these
together for the purpose of not just whipping them together.
A lot of effort. Go into them. But the point
is, we're turning these around quickly, especially. August and this
month in September for the benefit. For the committee here
to see some of the work that's been going on
and for the working group chairs. So I really just
want to emphasize that we heard the comments that were
made in July about the flow of information. And the
working group reports, status reports that people are providing are.
In response to that, I also wanted to mention that
I did a different format this week. Or this month
for the staff update. And I took the work plan
that you all approved and went to Councillor in mid
August and provided the status or the work update as
it relates to those tasks in the work plan, so
they're not all strictly things that I personally did. It's
a combination of efforts on the city side and then
also with members of the. Working groups, so. There's room
to figure out better ways of doing this. We are
trying to be responsive. So always happy for any suggestions
on how you might like to see this information differently.
And I wanted to make a point, too. Tonight we
took an item that Franklin had questions that he raised.
In the context of his working group report and. We
made those a discussion item here at the Councillor tonight
to be able to delve into. Those. So you'll see
that both there's reports from the working groups that are
more status reports, and when there are items that need
to be discussed, they will come to the committee in
the main part of the agenda. A couple of other
things. We have our vision and guiding principles going to
Councillor on September 23, a week today, so that's the
last version that you all worked on that's going along
with the community. Insights, a report on the findings from
our community engagement that's going forward to Councillor next. Week,
and so I'll be sure to keep you posted on
when that goes or when that's approved or the comments.
From Councillor. And then one last thing Ray had, I
think he mentioned is at the last meeting. He found
this book really helpful. It's called Valley of the bird
tale. He mentioned it. Last month, you may recall. And
so he has 20 copies that he purchased. And. Were
provided by the author. So I've got a box here
and he asked me in. His absence to offer them
up to whomever is interested in them. It's called valley.
Of the bird tail, an indian reserve, a white town,
and the road to reconciliation. So you're. Welcome to take
a book if you would like that. I feel like
there was one more thing I was going to share.
But I'm just really grateful to all the working group
chairs in particular for pulling these reports together and for
the work that everyone's doing behind the scenes. Like he's
saying your things are due. I need them now. I
need them. I'm putting out their agenda. So I appreciate
all the work that everyone's put into it, so thank
you. Thank you. Our next item is under new business,
the youth. Representative. And Victoria want to give you update
on that. So staff contacted additional applicants. Who originally applied
for the position. Unfortunately, they were no longer interested. In
that youth representation position. So this fall we will be
re advertising the position with the anticipating participation of being
able to fill it. But at this time, none of
the current applicants were interested anymore. The clerk's office is
working. Is there anything further? If not, I'd take a
motion to adjourn and our next meeting is scheduled. For
October 21 at 04:00 p.m. In the chamber. Uber. Thanks,
Franklin. Mark seconded. All those in favor? Thank you.