Welcome, everyone. It is Tuesday, January 13, from a special
meeting of the council of municipality estrothroy. Caradock, roll call.
All are present. Are there any declarations of pecuniary? Interest.
Order to approve the agenda. I'm just going to ask
when we get there that we let the police service
present their budget before I speak to ours. Seem to
want to keep the police service sitting around. We'll make
that amendment. Motion to approve the agenda as amended. Deputy
mayor. Seconded by councilor Pam in. All in favor? A
motion carries. Item four, appointment of a chair. I'm actually
not going to do that initially when this went out.
I thought we'd be sitting as the budget committee, but
we're actually. Sitting as a special meet at a council,
so when I do want to speak, I'll. Be going
down there, actually. The deputy mayor will act as chair
for that portion of the meeting. Motion to go into
closed session. Yeah, go ahead. Are we on or off?
We're all in. I just asked for clarification on. That
when you say you're going to come down, is that
just to make a motion? No. You partake in the
conversation? When I can speak from there. You just can't
make the motion from there. Couch. I don't hate to
use the word optics. You should sit down there and.
Support staff. It is my proposed budget, so I just
thought in order for things to move more slowly. Better.
I'll just go sit down there when we present. The
budget. I'm just going to ask for clarification. Yeah, go
ahead. So there's no rule that says I have to
do that. I'm just doing. Better. Yeah, okay, I got
it. Because you're just presenting today. I'm just presenting councilor.
That's why I decide to support and make it easier.
I would do so. Motion to go in a closed
session at 432 for the following what I'd have pursued
is section 239. Two h. For the. Municipal act, as
amended, regarding information explicitly supplied and confidence to the municipality
by another level of government. M one item. Pursuant to
section 239, two B of the act, as amended, regarding
personal matters about identifiable individual. Individuals, including municipal or local
board employees. Motion to go into close. That remedy. Site
client, councilor Hippo, all in favor? That motion carries. Thank
you.
Everyone. Closed session adjourned. At 04:43 p.m. an. Open session.
Resume council met in closed session and considered matters that
it's not going to do so under the municipal act,
and it's listed on tonight's council agenda. During the closed
session. I have a few connections. One item. Regarding information
supplied and competency municipality by another level of government. Direction
was given to staff. One item presumed is section 239,
two B of the act regarding personal matters about identifiable
individual, including municipal employees. Direction was given to staff. Motion
of the direction and closed session be approved. Deputy mayor,
second by councilor pellet. All in favor? Motion carries. We
are now going to recess. For. Until 515 or 05:00.
Till 05:00. Recess until 05:00. All right. He goes pitball.
Second by councilor can. All in favor ocean carriers? Yes.
Welcome back, everyone. We'll now start with the budget presentation.
We're going to start with the 2026 proposed police services
budget. And just a comment. How this process is evolving,
you'll know that. In. The capital portion of the police
service budget. I had recommended not to go ahead. With
the police annex, but yesterday. Few of us received a
memo from the solicitor General, the minister of municipal affairs.
Telling us that under the strong mayor powers that the
mayor has, No business, for lack of a better word.
For fingerprints on the fleet budget. It would be the
normal course of action where council can make their recommendations,
but that came yesterday. But I am seeking clarity on
whether or not it spoke specifically. To operating, remove capital
or both. So the deputy mayor was with me today
when I spoke to the minister. Municipal affairs office. But
again, just to point out how this whole process. Is
kind of learn as you go on the full process.
With that, I'm going to determine. We have Matt Alm.
Do you want to come? Up, Matt. Matt hall, chair
of the police board and chief Campbell and deputy chief
Cushman. If he's needed, but I will turn it over
to you. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And thank you. Rest
of council for making the time to have me here
today. This is the first time I've had the opportunity
to speak with everybody. So. I'm just going to go
over a few of the things that led up to
kind of where we are with the budget this year.
Make some comments and then I'll pass. It over to
Chief Campbell, he can kind of do a deeper dive
into the budget. So 2025 was a big year of
growth for Stratford Caradox Police Service. We saw a large
population boom in town, and with that we had necessitated
us doing some hiring. Increase our staffing levels. A requirement
under the Community Safety and Policing act is that the
police board is required to ensure adequate and effective policing.
So one of the ways that we have done that
is to ensure that our staffing levels have kind of
kept up with population growth, and that's what we saw
in 2025. As well. Scps took on 911 services for
middlesex county. Answering any 911 calls outside of Strathroy Caradock
area. Another item. Is the ongoing planning for the expansion
that the mayor mentioned. The board voted on that budget
item in the January board meeting and approved it to
move forward. To council approval. As well. One of the
bigger factors. Leading up to our budget this year was
the new collective agreement was ratified at the end of
last year. A bit of a background on that. The
previous collective agreement. Was from 2021 to 2025. So we
all know 2021 was the beginning of Covid. We had
just ratified a very fair deal for our officers. Modest
increases throughout the year to keep up with inflation. As
soon as Covid kind of ramped up, inflation took off,
led the rising cost for everything. Struthercare police was tied
to our collective agreement. But other services started to see.
Higher increases that they were settling for kind of 2%
more on average per year than what our officers were
seeing. So what that did was last year when we
started looking at comparator groups for our officers is we
found that we were toward one of the, on the
lower end of the provincial average for salaries. So, in
order to ensure that we were remaining competitive and marketable,
For recruitment, we understood that we needed to bring everybody
up to a provincial average. So through the bargaining process.
We agreed to a 6% 1st year pay hike just
to get the officers up. And then modest increases out
to that to keep up with inflation. We don't anticipate
any. Further big jumps like that, but this is kind
of a one off year. Where we're seeing that bigger
increase. As well. Along with the increase in wages, there
was an increase. In the benefit package, which led to
increased operating costs. The recognition of mental health planned a
bigger role and there was a corresponding increase in benefits
provided to our officers. I always thought that. An ounce
of prevention is worth the pounded care. So if we
can take care of these problems, beforehand. You can keep
officers on the job. It's better bang for your buck.
That is about it for the kind of the high
level stuff that led to where we are. With the
budget. I will pass it over to the chief. He
can kind of do a deeper dive into the numbers.
And then open it up for questions. At the end.
Thank you. First of all,
Thanks. Jared hall. As I sit in here, my it
director is getting me linked into the sharing my speaking
notes. That will be made available to the rest of
council. While he's doing that, I do have some quick
summaries. I just wanted to sort of provide an opening
sort of comment or statement to counsel. Certainly in regards
to the 2026 budget presentation. So priorities from the office
of the Chief. This is probably my 9th or 10th
budget I've prepared as chief of the police service. Each
and every time. I've tried to hit on being consistent,
transparent. And equitable. We certainly want to operate as a
trusted cooperative partner within the municipal landscape, working to establish
and coordinate effective use of both human and financial resources
that enhance community safety and well being across our municipalities,
our regional borders and provincial landscape. Our community based police
service strives to earn the trust and respect of all
of our community. Members. And visitors alike as we work
towards organizational excellence. In delivering the highest standards through professionalism.
Dedication and empathy. And we are appreciative of the support
and the governance offered by our police services. Board and
the leadership of municipal Council, providing us with the appropriate
resources to meet our ever changing demands. And challenges affecting
community safety, both at the local, provincial, national. And it's
safe to say, even more so now at the international
level. So with that, I'm just going to sort of
embark on. Kind of moving. Through some of my talking
points in regards to this slide here. So with page
two build. An appreciating. That in the last year, both
municipal council and the police services board have undertaken. An
exercise to build out a strong and robust strategic plan.
Certainly our budget presentation. Aligned with the work that. Is
captured in our strategic plan. At the police service, including
alignment to our mission, the vision and the values. We
also have. Some very important strategic pillars about effective stewardship
of assets. Exemplary customer service. Promoting community safety, advancing technology
and innovation. And certainly excellence in our people and our
culture. Along with this, we have an organized. Organizational chart
that represents the 42 uniform members. In 17 civilian members
that make up our organization. In the next page. On
page three, there's a bit of a review of some
of the cost of policing. And this is spanning over
a four year window from 2022 to 2025. In it,
you'll see the revenues that we have worked with, the
expenses that. We have incurred. That are broken down into
various categories, including our general costs associated to our police
services board, administrative cost, uniform costs and our civilian members.
Over the course of the last four years, 2022 to
2025, we have incurred surpluses. In each of those four
years. A lot of that has to do with some
of the increases in revenue that. We have built in
and expanded over those years. Some of the savings on
the expenses. As you can appreciate, a vast majority of
our expenses are related to salaries and benefits and when
we have the absence of members from active duty. Those
are often the biggest areas where. We see an increase
in savings in regards to. Normal or ongoing expenses. In
regards to some of the cost of policing in regards
to capital projects. Again, A four year overview. Of both
the capital revenue and capital. Have occurred. That was me.
Sorry. Again, showing where we landed, or, sorry, landed at
the end of each particular year. This particular year. In
our proposed budget. There are. Some fairly substantial increases. And
again, the board. Chair has certainly highlighted some of those
areas where some of the increases. Occurred. I'd like to
give sort of just a quick review. Of both the
revenue sources and the expense drivers in, particularly for the
2026 year. In the one document that. Is here before
you. See that we have been very aggressive in seeking
grant funding opportunities to help fund. Our operations. Another area
where we experience a fairly substantial increase in revenue within
the provincial offenses. That is really money that is generated
from ticket revenue, which pre Covid. Was. A fairly decent
revenue number. Obviously, through the Covid period, it dropped off
substantially and we're now starting to see that return to
the pre Covid amounts the chair announced or talked about
some of the expansion in our fire, dispatch and 911
services. That has been very effective for our organization. In
creating better levels of service. But. It also has Earth.
The corresponding. Revenue sources that come with it, and we
are always getting inquiries from other areas. About potential interest
in expanding that area. Another area where we've seen or
have recovered wage and salary or, sorry, salary and benefit.
Cost is expanding our college Sakham and program at the
Ontario Police College. We currently have four senior members who
are on to condemns at the college where the police
service is getting full. Cost recovery back on both salaries
and benefits. And again. In 2026. We were successful in
receiving. Ng nine one funding for the 2026 year, which.
In our operating budget. Is actually being divided out. 570,000.
In operational expenses, 832,000 will be incurred in capital expenses.
It was a grant worth 1.4 million that we were
successful in getting some of the expense drivers. I want
to highlight that are in the 2026 budget. Salary increases
tied to the new collective bargaining agreement. Again that the
chair. Has skimmed over and talked about, and that's both
in both our uniform and our civilian members. Another area.
That's impacting expenses is our staffing model. I think it's
not a surprise to most that council that over the
last three to four years, we have gone on a
recruiting campaign, hiring very young, new, inexperienced members. As they
go through various class readjustments. Their salary has small bumps,
and they go. So we're seeing those impacts starting to
arrive. One of the areas in our operating budget this
year where we noticed a big increase was in some
of the benefit costs. There's been a new application of
a new percentage increase that along with some recalculations regarding
WSIB expenses that weren't being calculated. On. A previous. Graph
that we were using have been corrected. And that explains
why there has been some increases in some of those
benefit costs. We've also moved. Or operationalize our axon suite
of products. As we ventured into the use of axon
products, including body war and cameras and in card cameras.
Those were being captured in capital expenses through some discussions.
And ongoing consultation with the director of finance. We have
now operationalized those expenses, moving them into the operational. Budget
areas. There has been obviously a corresponding reduction in capital
cost and capital taxation as those have now been. Moved
into the operations. We've also ventured in 2025. And obviously.
Continuing on in 2026. The return of utilizing our own
IT resources and staff within Strathori cared police service. We
obviously operate a very unique industry. And the demands and
the challenges. And our certainly use of technologies. Has sort
of created an opportunity where we're best utilizing those resources
inside our own organization. We're also into year two of.
Accounting line where we are capturing any of the municipal
administrative services that we are receiving, specifically HR. Activities. That
occur through the director of HR and his team as
they help support the police service. That line appears again
in our operating budget. We've also created. A building debt
repayment expense line in our operating budget. In anticipation of
moving forward with our building annex. And again, I highlighted
that. In our operating budget and capital budget for 2026.
The separation of the NG 9111 grant funding that has
occurred. I also want to sort of just take a
little bit of time to speak to the building. Annex.
Last Thursday at a police services board meeting, we received
the final classity costing that was presented. At that meeting
a motion. Was made and passed by the board that
the board received the Strathary care dock police. Edition and
renovation class a budget report for information and approve it
for presentation to counsel for their approval. I want to
highlight for the council the strong, positive position that the
police service is in. We have over $1 million in
police reserves. We have over $540,000 in development charges, money
that. Is situated and available. To help us. Lessen some
of the impacts in moving forward. On the building annex.
We also have some understanding of the municipal debt structure
and that. There is at current, a fairly low. Municipal
debt ratio. We're also aware that there is a very
attractive interest rate opportunity that presents itself for moving into
the space of. Taking on additional debt. And we're also
very aware that there is a favorable building market. That
exists currently. Meaning there is really a low supply of
projects. And a heightened interest in general contractors looking for
projects. And that was made very clear last Thursday. During
the presentation by Mr. Holt of Alink, who has been
doing through his company a lot. Of work in prepping
us. For getting to the stage where the building annex.
Has the class a costing completed. Currently. The service. Has
invested and paid for well over $200,000 in regards to.
Money to get us to this stage. Of the costing.
The demands for the facility annexation have not gone away,
and I think it's important to maybe highlight for council
and the community some of what those demands were our
staffing, capacity growth not only in additional members. Challenges in
spacing in regarding to work areas, change rooms, and certainly
some of the parking limitations. We have. Operational readiness. Wintertime.
Often brings about challenges we have with weather or inclement
weather that challenges some of our operational readiness to respond
to calls, an onsite training spaces. Currently, we do a
lot of off site training where some of our members
sometimes are taken outside of our community, just so. That
they are able to complete some of the onsite train.
Operational effectiveness. Our 911 center is a very limited space
currently, and as we continue to take on more and
more. Opportunities to provide services. It is a busy center
in a very confined space. Additional to that is some
of the challenges we have with our indoor it space
just this past year we had. A couple of outages
regarding overheating in a space as the it closet. As
I like to call it is actually two former closets
that have been constructed to create a space. For an
IT server room. We're also up to looking to future.
Proof our building through the service expansion. That involves expanding
some of the community partner opportunities. One area that we
have existing relationships is with probation. And as well as.
A pre charge consultation. Crown, who spends time in our
building two to three days a week. We have an
opportunity to expand some of those partnerships and bringing in
additional partners, including victim services. As well as expanding some
of our dispatching service opportunities. I will also like to
highlight that one of the areas that we have some
challenges currently is with a virtual court suite. During the
Covid time, we had more and more opportunities where we
were being asked. To attend court virtually, and we have
some challenges with our current setup just to meet the
expectations. And requirement of the courtroom to ensure that we
have a virtual. Court room in our building that is
free of obstructions, challenges and other recording equipment that isn't
permitted as far as when you are providing. Those. Opportunities.
And more and more. We obviously are seeing more virtual
bail hearings than opportunities that are occurring. In our facility.
The next page after this highlights some of the grant
funding that I reference. Again, this is an opportunity that
we will continue to search and find rent funding opportunities
whenever they are available. For our organization to lessen certainly
some of the impacts in regards to taxation. And then
the last page again. It's already been sort of highlighted.
It's in relation to the authorities under the Community Safety
Policing act about the responsibilities for funding and the approval
pieces that have in both in the police services board
and ultimately at council. With that, I will pause and
certainly take questions from council in regards to our presentation.
Thank you. Chief. Thanks, chair hall, any questions? For any
of the two. Councilor Kenneth. Just, I guess, a general
question. Is there a formula for? Police officers per x
number of citizens or. I guess. How do you come
up with staffing needs, especially. On the officer side. Of
business. Through the mayor to councilor Kenneth. The traditional ratio
was called a cop to pop or cop to pop
ratio. So number of officers to a population. Over the
last, I would say five to ten years. The industry
had sort of moved away from. That index to more
of a calls for service and what really provides adequate
and effective policing response. Certainly what policing has evolved into
over a number of years is. A bigger suite of
services that you offer to your community. Outside of traditional
law enforcement. We are obviously involved in mental health calls,
homelessness, addiction, a lot of social unrest type calls. Those
are activities that we are capturing on a day to
day basis. To show what we are doing and how
we are providing services to our community so we're trying
to utilize that as a metrics. To be more reflective
of what does adequate and effective policing look like? What
are the community's expectations for a response time to get
to calls for service as opposed to a cop to
a pop ratio. I will highlight. I think one of
the challenges to a cop to pop metrics is a
community such as Sirothran Kerada. That has a lot of
people that reside here, but maybe live or sorry that
work outside the community. Conversely, we have a lot of
people who don't live in our community that come into
our towns, communities on a daily basis. To work, to
go to school. To attend services, whether it's the hospital
or other activities. So that's for me. It's a real
moving target, and I don't. Think that that's a real
accurate reflective ratio to use to come up with an
adequate staffing number. Councilor hippel. Excuse me. Thank you. Through
yourself to the chief. We're talking about junior officers. Graduating
their way up over. The last few years. I guess
with what councilor Kenneth was talking about a little bit.
I'm curious how our compliment. How your compliment is at
this time and are you happy with it and how
you see us moving forward with who you have. Now.
So through the mayor to councilor Hippol. We over the
last number of years. As we have added some numbers
incrementally, year over year, so that there wasn't. A large
up sea impact on the budget with salary increases, so
that was sort of one strategy we had was to
grow slowly. But reflective of where we were with. Our
increase in activities. We strategically looked at hiring younger. Less
expensive members coming into the organization. I may get in
trouble for making this analogy or reference, but. Our young
members are like having. Puppies around. They are very engaged,
very active. Wanting to be out doing things. And learning
as we go. It's been beneficial because. It has created
a culture within the organization. That has grown and has
become. Stronger because of. I think where we've gone with
our recruiting strategy. We've also targeted, and I mean in
a good way. New members who have a long history
to this community, perhaps grew up here, perhaps have moved
here. Are connected to our community not only in working
here, but. Through other areas. Family. Relationships activities which I
think boasts well for our organization. We are happy with.
Our complement numbers in how we have structured the organization.
We run uniform divisions of six members, so 24 uniform
members. I have two members dedicated for traffic enforcement. I
have a dedicated community services officer who also doubles as
a media officer, I have a member dedicated to mental
health calls. So on any given day, I have at
a disposal eight to nine uniform members available to provide
services, frontline services, if required. We have a strong cachet,
or core of criminal investigators, numbering up six that are
involved. In our criminal investigation and help provide those additional
support. Supports. I have a strong command staff team, and
we feel we are very well positioned and very well
staffed to provide the services. That we believe. That this
community deserves. Thank you. Councilor Pammer, I'm just wondering if
you could expand a little bit on the increases under
it expense, particularly the three lines that have a 220%
increase, 300% 352 could you explain why this year there's
such a drastic change in those lines? Again. If you
just give me a minute to grab my line by
line sheet, I think I. Know which area is here.
You might be rough.
Behind door number three, apparently.
So through the mirror to Councillor Pamer. I think the
three areas that. You might be referencing is information technology.
Contracted it and the. Axon Alpr. So the first two,
the 180,226, actually correspond directly to the NG 911 funding.
So the grant that we received, I think I highlighted
earlier that. 1.4 million grant funding. Some of it has
been divided into. Operational expenses. And some have been divided
out into capital expenses. The increases in those two areas,
up to 180,226. Are directly related to the NG 9111
project, so those are really one time, one year expense.
Increases that are covered are offset by the grant funding.
The 320,000. Is the moving of the axon from the
capital into the operational. Pieces. And so that taxation funding
that had been occurring. On the capital side has now
been adjusted. Into the operational side. Any other questions? Councilor
Derbyshire. Thank you. To the chief. That was kind of
my question. Was the NZ 91111? It takes, Grant. And
basically pays for itself. It doesn't really cost us to
run that program. Should it almost be its own separate?
Kind of project over here. Make it a little easier,
a little clear as to. What it kind of does
with its operation and its expenses. Or is it actually
all part of. Your whole budget. I guess to me.
I thought it was somewhat of a separately run kind
of program. But within the police services. I don't want
it skewing your numbers. I guess when we look at
it, right. Basically, it's money in, money out. Then that
works. But as it increase, it looks like your budget
is taking a real big increase. Even though. It's kind
of doing that on its own, I guess. Would be.
Maybe I'm not being clear. But I guess I just
like to see NG 911 kind of broken down in
its own operation. And expenses, I guess, would be. What
I was getting at, whether that's an option or not.
So through the mayor to councilor Derbyshire. Certainly. First of
all, It's been a long, ongoing project. This is maybe
year three of the NG 9111. Funding envelope. The previous
two years. When the it at Town hall was running
the project. That's where the revenues were showing and the
expenses were showing. I certainly appreciate, I think, what you're
referencing. And we've tried to be transparent. And show where
those expenses are occurring. In regards to the work that
is being undertaken. We are hoping that through the work
of our it staff that we will be able to
get to the finish line, hopefully in 2026. So this
may just be a one year sort of. Cycle where
we only have to show these numbers. I think maybe
going forward, if it spills. Into 2027. Maybe we can
give some. Consideration. To pushing those out into additional GL
lens. Follow up council jury. Yeah, and just on that,
I guess, through you to our director of finance. Now.
Was this? The grants that we didn't meet and had
to give back. In previous years. So. Yes, through the
chair, the council. We got grant money expecting to do
all this work. The issue. Is, and the chief can
attest to this, is there's a limited number of vendors
for these projects. And all those vendors. Excuse me. Those
vendors are going after each of the police services, so
whoever is highest in the ready. That's who gets them.
So that's why we ended. Up refunding, but. As you
just heard, we got 1.4 million this year to finish
that project. So in essence, we're getting that money back.
Councilor willsey. Got two questions. One of them was kind
of triggered by Councillor Derby's question. When we looked through.
We know that we're expanding dispatch services. We're doing. All
for the county now, and that continues to grow. The
question that sparked my interest is that he was explaining
that the NG 911 wouldn't make sense to have that.
Separate either as, like, a sub budget of yours, because
right now we've got approximately $10. Million budget only $8
million is coming tax because you're getting the revenue for
doing the 911 calls, and I know that works out
to be almost a wash, but would it? Make sense
so that when the public's looking at it, we don't.
See the dispatch portion as a policing cost, but that's
a self funding. It can be. A sub department or
something just for clarity and optics to see that. We're
not paying our police department 10 million a year out
of a $24 million. Legend. That's my first question, so
maybe I'll let you respond to that. So through the
mayor to Councilor Wilsey. So the operation, obviously, of the
911 center is part of police operations, obviously one of
their roles. Is as police dispatchers. Again. We try to,
I think. It's pretty obvious. We tried to create some
revenue streams regarding. The additional services, obviously, that we run
both. In fire dispatch at the county level, as you
mentioned, answering 911 calls at the county level, saving city
of London. I guess we are trying to be transparent
in showing that there is. This revenue that is created.
Through those activities. As well as. Creating some very distinct.
Expense lines for our civilian. Members. In the operating budget
to outline what costs we are incurring from. A staffing
component. In addition to some of. The hardware software costs
that appear in our IT related budget. So I think
that's what we're trying to accomplish. Is by. Showing where
we are as far as bringing in revenue. To run
the organization as well as where those expenses occur. Willsy.
And as a follow up, I think you've done a
good job. Like myself, where I look at the budget
and I can see the revenue. I know what finance
I'm looking for. I kind of know how to separate
that out and back it out. From it. But if
the general public, or someone who's not a counselor or
somebody who hasn't spent hours looking at your sheets. They're
not going to know that, so. It was more of
a formatting question, not how you're doing it, but if
we can just make that easier. And then that way
it's easy. We can know what's. Dispatch and. What's policing?
Same budget, everything else. Just displayed differently. The second question
I had was towards. The annex. I see it's not
in your capital budget for this year. So I'm just
wondering what your plan is as far as the police
board. When you would want to go forward with that.
Is that something? A 2026 project? We're going to see
later. Is it 27? Is it 28? It's not in
this year's capital, so I'm just wondering what the. Plan
is on when you feel like you'd want to be
moving forward with that, given your other comments earlier tonight.
I'll help you. It was in the police service board.
Budget reference. The police service board? Approved it. Until I
got the memo from this list or general telling me
strong mayors have no ability to touch the capital. It's
actually me cousin Wilson who took it out of the
town. Budget. So now I think it has to go
back in, given the memo we have today, but. It
initially was in the police service board. Okay, because their
capital budget that they presented here. It's not here. The
one that's in their item. Okay, they only have 1.4.
Million of capital for the year. On that question, then
they do want to do it in 26. Council, Brandon.
It was the intention of the board to go ahead
with the capital expenditure in 2026 with the class a
costing and go to tender as soon as possible. And
then the mayor did what he did. And then yesterday,
January 12, we received a memo from the solicitor general.
Indicating that. The mayor cannot just arbitrarily take that out
of a police board capital budget. So I guess in
terms of process right now, It really should. Be in
this budget as presented today. But given what happened yesterday
from the sister general, that's what changed things. So the
board voted to go ahead with it. The Merrick pulled
it. The solicitor general has said strong mayors can't do
that. There wasn't enough time. I guess maybe. To update
or change all of that for today, but I know
the board has voted to go. Ahead with it. And
it's the board's expectation that given the information from the
solicitor general that. The capital. Request from the police board
be put in front of council. And. That council. Would
then vote on the overall police board package, but not
individual line items, just the total amount. It's been kind
of a moving target with this new budget process. And
regulations coming out kind of on the fly. But that's
where we are. And I know we've been shooting a
lot of texts around saying, okay, well, in light of
what the mayor did. In light of what the celestial
general did. Where are we today? In terms of approving
a police. Board a budget. It's my understanding that with
the wish of the police board before the mayor acted,
that that come in front of this body today, and
it would be the idea that if we were approving
the police board budget that we'd be doing everything that's
on paper. Here. And in addition, the idea would be.
Giving the green light to the class A costing going
to the final stages. For request, for proposals to be
put out, for tendering to happen, and for construction to
begin. In this favorable construction season. Right now. As the
chief was saying. So I don't know where we are
tonight in terms of a vote, that's up for? I
guess the mary's chair of council determine where we are.
But the idea was that we would be recommending as
a police board that we go ahead. With project in
2026. Just for everybody. That memo wasn't aimed just at
the mayor of Strasbourne. That went everywhere. There are some
mayors who've done some rather drastic things. To the police
by themselves anyways. Go ahead, councilor. So I guess just
as a follow up to that, then being into your
budget. Mr. Mary. You could say that. You just want
to without calling specific lineup. It was just give them.
Their call it twelve and a half million they're asking
for and say that's why you got to figure out
how you're going to spend it, and you're not saying
different live Ms. You could still say that and keep
the budget the same as you've done it. Or you
could say, have your extra. So, ten and a half
million. Yeah. So I did see clarity today from the
ministry. As I said, clarity on whether or not it's
operating capital. The deputy mayor is with me and heard
the conversation, so I expect over the next day or
so to get clarity that it's both capital and operating.
I suspect it is both. Before we pull the trigger
on anything. They just want to ensure they were referencing
both. Custard Pelletman strictly from a process perspective, since you're
only presenting the budget tonight. We could add the request
in. We're not deciding that we're approving anything. Tonight. That
is correct. Council still has the authority to say yay
or nay to the final number only. So I would
suggest that we added in. As the board had originally
requested. It's not like it's a new project. It's not
like we didn't know. It wasn't happening. We all know
that the costing was being done. So I would suggest
we just added it in the request. If you require
that as a motion, then we're not going to take
any motions at council. This is just presentation. It'd be
further. Bring motions and that towards it, but we know
it's out there. Councilor Derbyshire. Thank you. I'm not going
to pick a part line items. I just want to
start by saying this is a budget meeting. What I
bring forward doesn't mean this is what I want to
happen. I just want to point out some budget things.
So I realize it's a place service board, and trust
me, I don't really. Want to anger the police service.
But. I do want to make some points as a
counselor. That when I look at. The 8.9 million from,
I'm going to say, the 2025 budget. Just because I
don't know exactly where that number ended up. And I
take that number. And I don't think NG 9111 had
any money in there. But I could be exactly wrong.
I don't know. I divide that by 10,500 households, which
is about what we have in stratroy care, doc. Is
as close as I can get because, again, we don't
have all those numbers. I get $857 per household for
this service, which. Probably is not bad. I'm going to
go with the comparator because I heard that earlier from
the chair where he compared wages. If I go to
our comparator of the OPP. Their 2025 cost per household
was 399. So I just want us to be aware.
Of where that is and what we're getting. For the
extra money. And. I totally understand. How long the service
has been here. We all have a deep attachment to
it, but I preference this to? I'm going to use
the farming. Term a combine. I've always driven a combine.
I've always owned a combine. A combine now is a
million dollars. So I don't have the acres anymore to
justify the million dollar combine. It's cheaper and more cost
effective for my farm to hire my neighbor. His trucks,
his trailers. And have that done that way. That doesn't
mean I don't want to sit in that combine and
combine and. I don't want to see it in my
shit. The emotional attachment to a combine. I get it.
Emotional attachment to the police force. I get it. But
from a business standpoint and a numbers standpoint, I do
believe this is something that honestly before we spend $9
million on an expansion. This is something that really needs
to be considered. From a business standpoint, not from. I
used to work here. This is the greatest. We do
have great people working here. I don't want to downplay
that. From a cost comparison. It doesn't work. And doesn't
it work? I do think that. 's a big gap.
We're not talking 50 or $60. That's a lot per
household. But again, like I say, I just want to
have a conversation about it. I don't want it to
be like, oh, Derbyshire wants to get rid of the
cops. I want to have an op. Sorry? The police.
Ended there. Any other call, Counselor Hippel. Through yourself. Actually,
I assumed that someone would bring that up because. These
are things that happen in communities when you have your
own. Police force and comparators are good things. You need
to talk about it. It needs to. Be brought up.
It needs to be discussed. And whether it's personal or
it's just numbers. It's still one of those things where
you do even though you can't compare. It because. It's
monetary and it's a business versus the personal side of
it, I think. It's hard not to sometimes. Only because.
With the amount of, and I am going to use
the mental health issues that we have. I don't know,
outside communities, because. I would be stepping outside my boundary
there. But within our municipality, the issues that we have.
It does. Bringing the personal side into it almost. As
necessary, because. They understand the community they know the community
they've been in, the community they work in. The community.
They know the businesses, they know the people. And you
have to have to have a bit of that personal
side of it to bring it into the comparators. That's
all I'm saying. But I do get what you're saying,
because if you don't, have the conversation. You can't talk,
right? But that's the only reason I wanted to say
something. Because it's good to bring them both together. Councilor
McGuire and councilor Pelletman, and we'll wrap up this portion.
Thank you. So. It's always the conversation to have, and
we've seen it happen across the province. Many, many times.
But I will say the comparison of the OPP to
Strathroy caradok play. Surface is an apples and an oranges
comparison. Yes, they both say police on their shoulders, but.
The way they do their work is completely different. So
the OPP province wide. So if you're taking. If they're
giving you a province wide number, that would be vastly
different. Than their number if they were policing in a
municipality. And we know that from looking where they've taken
over communities such as orange. Orangeville. I'm going from memory.
Ten years ago. But there's a number of you go.
Back and you can look and then you can start
to see. We compare the policing costs in a community.
So opt is not a comparator for strategy. Caradok police.
It never has been. There are comparators that they use
that would give you a better judgment. So. That scale
that suddenly tipped one way. I don't want the conversation
to start from that point because. That's not councilor coffin.
Councilor Pellkman. I do understand there's a cost difference.
From my time on the board. That promise might cost
difference include. Places like Adelaide, Mag. Where there's not a
whole lot of activity. Versus our municipality. And one of
the factors that you have to include is the fact
that we have a hospital here, and I myself. When
my mom was a frequent visitor to the hospital. Witnessed
four officers having to stand. Over. A person they had
brought in because he needed to be restrained and they
couldn't leave. Until. Whatever episode he was having. That's a
cause that a lot of municipalities don't have to bear.
Certainly things that you have to bring in discussion. Like,
we probably would still have to update our police station
because they wouldn't be able to use. The one out
of may have for the ingredients and service and the
increase in service or whatever. Service you get. Depends on
what you negotiate. And if you negotiate the bare bottom,
there's going to be times where there'll be no police
officers. In our municipality. I'm not sure that that's something
that we want. I know. Just speaking from one example,
from a business side of things. When I was working
for Superstore. There are full time security people at Superstore.
We were a target for professional fees. Where people would
regularly walk out with $1,000 plus worth of groceries. In
an op environment. We would have to sit on that
thief that was caught with two staff members. Until an
officer was available, which could be five or 6 hours,
whereas with the municipal service that is not a cost
that they would have to bear their officer there almost
immediately. So there's lots of things to consider. It's the
discussion that ever takes place. It's not just about the
final number. It's about what kind of service you want.
And what kind of services you have to provide in
the community. And one thing that I will say? For
having your own service. And this discussion really came out.
When. The carting issue was a big issue about ten
years ago. Is carding didn't take place in the Strathroy
caradock because. Our members knew who the people were. And
if they were pulling somebody over, it wasn't. Because it
was based on the race. It was because they knew
they weren't from our municipality. Just the fact that they
know the people. And I'll always say I never had
an appreciation until. Spending the time in the police services
board how much discretion an officer has to use in
a heartbeat. That affects someone's life. And I'm not sure.
That if it was one of my children. At the
age of 18 or 20. That I want an officer
that doesn't know the community dealing with the situation that
they've been in because they made a mistake. I would
rather have an officer that knows in her stands or
a community deal with them that's a personal point. But
the discretion that the officers got to use in very
short time period at the time of the incident. Is
immense and. You also want to make sure that they
have the resources available to them that shouldn't. Incident occur
in your own home? That they have the time to
be thorough and not make a mistake so that if
something does go to court. It doesn't fall apart because
the officer made a mistake on the scene. Scenes. Those
are all great points. They're all personal, they're all emotional.
The Orangeville case. I just want to clarify. I spoke
with Orangeville directly. Orangeville saved $4.5 million. You don't want
to get into that. The other thing is. We can't
change one line item here. So you all talk about,
oh, we're getting this service and we're getting this and
we're getting that. But you say OpP might not do
that, but on the other hand, you'll say, well, Opp
will build the service. Or you can build whatever service
you want, right? So on one hand, we're like, OPP
might not do that for us, but if you build
the same service and do the same comparison and come
up with the same money all you're left with are
these same stories where you go, well, I just want
a friendly. Face. I get it. When I spoke to
the OPP about it, they said they. Will transfer our
officers to OPP officers if they wanted. I'm just saying,
take the emotion out of it and look at it
from a business. Standpoint. And if you want to compare
apples to apples, then build the program like this and
say to the op? Here's what we want. What's it
cost? That's apples to apples, because police officers are police
officers and they're all trained and they're, all going to
do the same. Due diligence that they are trained to
do and be the people they are, whether it says
op or stratford care dock on their sleeve because that's
what they sign up for. And that's what they go
through school for. So that's all I'm saying to you.
We could build this program and opp. Could say, yeah,
it's $900 per household. Now we know we're getting better
service, better deal, better whatever. Out of our people. I
don't want this to be. Derbyshire wants to get rid
of our police force. I want it to be looked
at like it's? A business. Which it is. That's all
I'm asking. Don't. Put the whole emotional. Thing into it.
Thanks, councilor. And I think it's okay to say cops.
I don't think. You'll be offended by it. Chief deputy
chief chair hall, thank you for attending night and. We'll
reconvene. Thank you. So.
I should tell you, chief, in 1 minute I'm going
to come back and ask to sit where you are.
Sit and listen to ours. We'll now move to the
2026 proposed budget and with that I'm going to ask
the deputy mayor to take the chair seat.
What do we do? Can I just ask something before
we move on to the next one? What did we
establish with what we're doing with this police service board
meet or this police budget. Is it coming back as
the one that was voted in by the board, or
are we to work off of this for the next.
Till the next meeting. What did we determine out of
what happened here? Because they said this budget isn't right.
So what are we doing? Not through you. To whoever
wants to answer that. That's a really good question. And
probably that gentleman standing up back there and rejacket. Should
answer that one for us. We'll just wait for him
to take the seat. Yeah. No, just before we moved
on to our budget. I just wanted to know, how
do we. Analyze that one going forward, whether or not
we're going to put the cost of the building into
that document. Which I understand what you're asking. Different back
here. And thank for the question. I can answer that
chair. There are two ways that could go, counselor.
Counselor could bring. An amendment forward to add it in.
That's one way. The second way is I could. Get
my response back from the minister of municipal affairs saying
that I had no business taking it. Out and put
it back in. So we all know that for the
next meeting. So there's. Two ways I could go. Well,
I just want to ask this. If your proposed budget,
which I understand, you shouldn't have taken the line bar
out, right? But if your budget is, we're only giving
you 10 million this year. Would that mean? You put
that line budget back in and you say you find
out. Because that's what council, that's what we would have
the right to do, is say we're only going to
give you 10 million or ten point whatever million. Or
can the mayor not do that at all? Strictly a
council thing, so. Yeah, it's strictly. It would be strictly
a castle thing under. The strong mayors, it's going to
say 100% certain that the strong mayor can't. Touch the
operating budget, which I didn't do. Probably about 95% of
the strong mayor can't touch the capital, so that's pretty
well been determined. I guess my question is, does the
strong mayor have the same authority? Over that budget that
council would have. If not, then it has to go
back to what they voted on. Yes. Answer your question
directly. I have no authority over the police. Okay, so
then there's not even a debate. We just get the
one that they want presented to us. And then it's
council's duty to do whatever they want with it. Yes.
Okay. Just give me one moment here. I see. I
want to ask Rob a question. It seems to me
that if. There's. Refreshing. It should just be put back
in. I did hear the question pulled by the mayor
when he was talking to the ministry. And I was
doing a lot of reading on it today after talking
to Bowen and watching the emails go back and forth.
Here's my take of it. You may not agree, but
I believe that when the police service is board pushed
a budget through to us, That is the one we
should be dealing with tonight. Which is inclusive of the
10.5 and change. For the building annex. It's not in
there. I know. I understand. That's what I'm saying. It
should be that document. It would be 12 million. The
total capital. Right. Well, you would add that line item
back in. So the line item for. The building annex.
I think what we're going to find out coming back
and the way I feel about it anyways is not
because I'm sitting here, but sitting down there. Is that
the billing annex number should appear. In that document. And
then if, because we're not supposed to take line items
up and it's lineup. So it should be there. That
being said, the next part of this process after tonight.
Is council sitting and we do the written amendments that
process. And that's when we could start adjusting not line
items, but. Total budget. So the budget then goes. From.
Ten point whatever. To 21 million because the building has
to go back into it. It's been approved by the
board, councilor pammer. So my question then is. Or my
comment or question is why? So we're looking at. The
budget presented tonight is not the correct budget. It's not
going to be the actual budget. So why would we
spend time. When all the numbers are going to change
significantly and how we use reverse, et cetera, is there
any point? And even looking at this budget tonight, does
the mayor who's proposing the budget wish to withdraw and
then resubmit. It just seems odd to me. We're going
to talk. About. We're going to be at $10 million
out in this. Can I answer that? John has his
hand up, so. Fair question, counselor. I think. It does
affect it. But again, I'm not going to withdraw the
budget because the majority of it. Is. In this, the
poll. So I'm here after reading or getting the memo
from two ministers. My hat is as strictly as. The
present. The municipal budget this evening. The police budget. I
mean, we know there's going to be $12 million that
we're probably going to have to put into it. There's
a chance they may come. Back and say, yes, mayor,
you can remove a capital item at that point in
time. I will be leaving it out, and I'll leave
it up to the will and council. To put it
back in. If that's the ruling by the ministry. So
if they were to come back, that chance. Where they
say, yes, strong mirrors can remove capital items. That item
would still remain out. And then it would be the
will of council. So just 1 second, John, can we
move forward with the idea because they don't know exactly
how this is going to laid and all we're. Really
doing. Tonight is receiving these presentations. That's all you're doing.
Okay, but hang on. So then what we do is
move forward tonight because we have another budget in front
of us. In due course, we're going to find out
whether or not that line item could ever be removed.
If it could not be removed, then the budget goes
back to what Matt hauled and his board. Submitted to
counsel. And at the worst, we have to call a
quick meeting to receive that. Budget, put a motion in
place. To assume. It, and then. We'll continue on with
the process of having our meetings and doing the written
amendments. If the 10 million goes back in your debt
schedule is wrong, all your numbers start to change. Because
you're adding 10 million into the budget. Our municipal budget.
So every number that you've put up. Not every number,
but so many of them will change. Cost to change
or your percentage has to. Change, you're going to increase.
Your chair. Because I can explain that. Go ahead. John.
And then we got to find a way to move
forward because the clock is ticking and we're getting over,
John. Thank you very much. If that's okay. The annex,
the renovation. There's money in police service reserves, and the
rest would be borrowed over time, it would change the
debt schedules. However, it would not change the levy. Okay.
The amount of money that's being asked for on the
levee is going to remain the same in terms of
this year municipal budget so it's 9.88. I think and
it have about the same amount, say a 2% increase,
a 2% effect on the overall budget. So whether the
capital budget goes ahead or it doesn't go ahead for
the renovation, The levy on the police budget is going
to remain the same at 9.88. So it's not going
to change the numbers for this year, just not taxes.
Grant, you have a final word? I just have something
else on it. Councilor Willie. I'm using everybody's first name.
My apologies. Mine was on a different but related point
not necessarily on the police annex. Which is on the
budget pieces that we came through. There's a number where
the titles of the documents are draft and there's typos
and there's incomplete paragraphs. And descriptions aren't there. And the
tax calculation. I'm going to use the agriculture one. That
was off as well. The debt schedules are including interest
and principle and the outstanding. Principle. At the end of
the year, the numbers are wrong. There's mistakes on half
of the documents that are in front of us and
they say all draft and template. I just want to
ask again. Is the mayor comfortable that these are the
documents he wants, counsel? To look at with all of
those errors in them. And that's what we're going to
review when we're already changing? Councilor. What? I'm comfortable doing
this. Evening is presenting the budget as proposed. I'm very
comfortable presenting the numbers. So in terms of typos, If
they're going to change somebody's mind is what the numbers
are. I'll. Grant that there may be the word draft,
or maybe. Grammatical errors. But, councilor, I'm here tonight to
present a proposed budget, and that is. The key word
is proposed. Things like looking at the possibility of the
annex. We'd have other meetings that are to come up.
So if there are any concerns regarding. Grammatical errors or
typos or numbers that may be incorrect, bring them forward
to the director. Of finance or the manager of finance.
Buy them here tonight, Jared, just to present a proposed
draft. Budget. That's what I'm prepared to do. Chair. Okay.
Present your budget. Thank you. And I do, by the
way, I just want to comment. I do. Understand. Like
everybody. The questions and for life, or better word, the
Yanks regarding. The strong mayor powers and presenting the budget
I have just tried to follow. The process that's laid
out, and that is. The responsibility of the merit to
present a proposed budget. So that's what I am here.
To do this evening, but I'm going to start just.
I want to go over some. Numbers, and I'm going
to turn it over to Lindsay to go through and.
I want to thank the finance staff. I want to
thank director Dacon, manager Lasky, Lindsay and Amy for being
a great help. They've put up with a lot of
questions, even. As late as this morning or my coffee.
I ask some questions, so I am going to start.
Because now, knowing that. The mayor doesn't really have much
input or say. Into the police budget, I may have
asked to have that line item removed separately from what
I want to propose tonight. Because. Strong air is strictly
responsible for. The municipal budget. I just want to point
out and not begin to pick on my friends and
the police or the police board, which I'm a member
of. The 4.5% increase that we're proposing. 2.92 increase is
from policing. Only one point. 6%. Is municipal budget. So
if we were to go back and present this to
the public, whatever the number may be. May ask to
report. That separately of 1.6%. That is, the tax rate
increase or the municipal portion of the budget. A couple
of other numbers I want to point out before I
proceed, because the county today. Did approve. Their increase, which
is 3.78. We'll all recall that the municipal portion is
57%. 32% is the county and 10%. Is education tax.
When you roll all of those in. 3.8% increase on
the tax bill. Me, that seems to be a fairly
responsible budget. But I'm not going to go through the
entire presentation. I believe Lindsey would do that. But I
just want to tell you what my thought process was.
And this will answer the question as why I removed.
The police annex do. Things went through my mind. I
am aware of Councilor Derbyshire. I remember. The line you
used. We have a pretty good credit card. But you
don't want to run it up. So I did remove
a couple of things. From debt and you look at
the original documents. Staff had proposed Head street. I believe
that was a $6 million pen. Maybe eight is rather
significant. There are a few things that I feel we
need to do before we proceed with any big debt.
Again. Councilor Derbyshire is right. We have a credit card.
You'll see reference in the document both the debt policy
we need to complete the debt. Policy. We need to.
Complete the asset management plan. We need to understand what
all the projects are, rather than every year. Going through
picking and choosing plans. We need to project. We need
to have a four year, multi year budget on capital
so that was my thought process on the debt. I
am aware of those things. We have spent a lot
of money in the past few years. On capital. Roads,
fire stations. I just think we need to take a
bit of a pause on our debt. Really understand where
we are before we proceed any further. There was. One
other part that I had my finger on, and that
was. On parks and recreation. Every year we move. Aside
projects on parks and back. You look at some of
the projects. They've been lingering since 2020. Those weren't initially
approved. If you recall too. We had asked for parks
and get the wrong term, director Lilborn, but a part
condition report. That wasn't in the initial pass from staff.
I asked that all those items be put back in,
and I did so by asking. Let's use reserves. We
have a fairly healthy reserves of parks and recreation, but
to have items sit for five, six years and not
action them. That doesn't seem right to me. That was
one place where I had my finger on is let's.
Get those projects done and. I've kept an email under
my blotter on my desk since August from the folks
that are. The adult baseball that you got a Yorkview
park for, I believe ten years they've been asking for
another field fence and a warning track. Number of times.
This year, games are postponed because the dugouts and the
clay. They weren't initially in there. Let's put them in
part of what we have. To do is be aware
of what the community wants. The other finger that I
had on the pie, if you will, was 137. Frank
Street Council had initially approved $500,000 to go towards that
project. I asked that we include another $500,000. Taking money
out of reserves. Let's complete that project. Need to complete
that project for two reasons. It's important for us as
a. Municipal staff or run out of space here. We
all know that it's part of the service strategy. But
the community is asking for that to be done. So
when I went through the budget, I looked at it
from debt and what the community wants. Another area where
I put. My. Use term where I asked to be
included. Were for the two new staff members initially. Staff
left that out. I said we need to put those
back in because they're part of a strategy. We created
a strategy. A long term stopping strategy. To deviate from
that. We've made a plan. So the two that I
said we. Should be back in. We're the asset manager.
I believe that's needed. And also. The communications person. So
in terms of the overall. Budget. That was the influence,
if you will, a strong mayor. I put it on
just two things. Just watch your debt. Let's get the
debt policy in place. Let's understand the asset management. Let's
create a four year long term strategy. And let's do
some things for the community that they can see. Things
like parks. And that's all over. That's not just strategy
and War II in places there are parks that need
to be fixed. So that's what I did. Chair. So
with that. I'll turn over to Lindsay if you want
to go through the presentation. And I don't think we
need to do the death by PowerPoint chair, but we
can do it at a high level if you wish.
That would be better. Thank you. I know you. Hey.
Good evening, mayor, members of council. Thank you for having
me here tonight to present. This is my first council
presentation, so bear with me as I'm working through a
little bit of nerves, trying my best. Okay, so the
purpose of tonight's meeting, we're going to provide an overview
of. The proposed 2026 municipal budget. Although the overall responsibility
for the budget has now changed under the new legislation,
the journey we've followed this far. In preparing the budget
has been the same. Staff have worked collaboratively with the
mayor to prepare a budget that aligns with the municipality's.
Strategic priorities, supports essential services and delivers value for residents
of Strathricare. So our agenda for this evening includes a
quick recap of the budget process under the new strong
mayor powers comments on the overall economic and policy context.
A discussion of key financial challenges and strategic opportunities. And
what we're all here for, of course, the presentation of
the budget and we'll. Wrap up with some comments on
what it means for property owners in our community. And
provide a timeline for some next steps. So the December
15 meeting of council, you received a guide to the
strong mayor's budget. Providing information on the new legislation and
its impact on the budget process. Following the new framework,
our goal for this evening is to complete step one.
The mayor is introducing the proposed budget to council. At
the end of the presentation, we'll circle back to the
timeline and requirements for council, how we're going to move
forward. With the remaining steps and the budget goes up.
The 2026 proposed budget was prepared. Keeping in mind the
realities of our current economic landscape, we must consider the
impact of inflation and interest rate pressures. We're in competition
with other municipalities. For available funding for the province, and
increasingly it's on an application basis. We just don't get
sums of money. We have to apply for it provincially
and. Locally, we're seeing housing and demographic shifts, and through
asset management planning, we're increasingly aware of infrastructure funding gaps.
The municipality is facing incremental pressures which are driving up
the cost of operations there's. An expectations to maintain or
increase our levels of service, often with the same or
a decrease. In amount of resources. The service delivery review
that was conducted recently highlighted the need for additional staff.
If this was outlined in the four year staffing plan
that was presented to council. Under the plan to maintain
council's desired levels of service, it was recommended that six
new positions be created in 2026. But keeping in mind
the operating cost pressures. The proposed budget before you tonight.
I have includes three of the positions. One of them
is not. Scheduled to start till the fall or near
the end of 2026. That would be the either customer
service rep, but the asset analyst and the communications analyst
are for the full year. As our asset management plan
suggests, Strawberry Caradock be investing $13 million annually to address
capital requirements. Historically, we've been allocating approximately $3 million in
taxation annually to capital annual transfers. Are being made to
the asset management plan and the future needs reserved to
address infrastructure gaps. The proposed budget tonight. I think it's
$300,000 for a transfer. But it's important to note that
the infrastructure gap continues to be compounded by construction. Inflation.
So we do have a need to invest in capital.
It's there. The gas is growing more and more expensive
every year. This was just a quick slide showing the
correlation between. The CPI and our municipal cost growth in
the past two years. So the challenges from the current
economic landscape and cost pressures have also created some strategic
opportunities, reserves and debt need to be used strategically. The
mayor spoke a bit to that and a little bit
more on that later. Intergovernmental grants must be pursued to
fill in the funding gaps. Modernization and digitization of services,
along with regional collaboration, provides an opportunity for the municipality
to realize operational efficiencies. It is also important to continue
to diversify revenue streams and decrease reliance on property taxes.
So the first strategic opportunity just to touch on considering
the use of reserves and reserve funds. The municipality currently
has $44.6 million available in reserves and reserve funds. That
doesn't include any 2025 budgeted transfers or. The interest that
gets allocated every year. Those entries are still outstanding. At
Stratfordcare can be strategic. It is use of reserves and
reserve funds versus using property taxes. To address infrastructure gaps.
And the other opportunity that the mayor touched on was
the use of debt. We've paid down a considerable amount
of debt in the recent years, and all of this.
From debt will be repayed by the end of 2030.
Also the fir. The 20 and 24 fir. Suggested our
annual repayment limit of that would be 11.5 million. So
this demonstrates that we have the capacity to take on
debt, especially. To address these infrastructure deficits. And as the
mayor had suggested, it's important to be strategic. Finance department
plans to bring a debt policy to council in early
2026. Actually, I believe it. Might be at the next
meeting on the 19th. We're also in the process of
updating the municipality's long term financial plan, which will map
out the long term projected capital needs from all the
departments, so we'll have everything in one document. All the
needs over a certain period of time. So those two
documents will be very important tools. For councils to use
when prioritizing future capital needs. So now the reason we're
here. The 2026 proposed municipal budget. Combining both operations and
capital for looking at a consolidated tax rate increase of
4.53%. And due to increases in industrial and commercial sectors,
impact has projected our assessment growth to be 2.72% for
2026. In 2025, our growth rate was only 1%. So,
as you might recall, growth directly impacts the tax rate.
As assessment growth increases, the tax rate decreases. So, in
essence, We're able to abuse this assessment growth to spread
the tax needs over the larger assessment. Base. Now we'll
just jump into looking at the operating budget. Total $61.6
million. And of that, $26 million would be for property
taxes and 25.6 billion from other sources of revenue. So
this demonstrates the high reliance of the operating budget on
property taxes. It's just over half. This life is a
little hard to see, but just a quick snapshot of.
The most operating budgets for each department. And it shows
the taxation required and then also the non tax revenues.
So we have overall a requirement of $26 million, and
this would be a levy increase of 2.68 million from
2025. Or eleven point 48%. In the agenda package this
evening, there's a number of documents the 2026 proposed operating
budget. There's one that's the summary and one that's detailed
and also a budget template. If you refer to those
documents, we'll provide some background for this one. Here more
details. Just did a few slides just to kind of
break down. Where the 51.6 million coming from. So the
first slide here just shows it by the source of
revenue. This will show how the proposed operating budget will
be funding. So again, you can see that the operating
budget is highly reliant on property taxes at just over
50%. And the next largest source of revenue would be
the user fees at 37 point. Eight. The next line
here. We're just breaking down the amount. By department. So
the graph will show the funds to be how it
will be utilized throughout the municipality, and as you can
see, protective services, engineering and public works and municipal services
have the largest budgets in total 85%. And finally. This
last slide here is going to show the breakdown of
the budget by expense type. So just a snapshot of
how the money is going to be spent. So almost
45% of the municipal operating budget will go towards salaries
and benefits. Budgeted transfers to reserves of 18.7% are mostly
comprised of water and wastewater rate stabilization transfers as well
as transfers into the fleet reserve for various departments. There's
also services and rents about 16.8%. That would be for
contracted services, things like garbage collection, purchase of water. Now.
We'll go transition over to capital. The budget before you
today is 14 and a half million dollars and. Of
that asking for taxation of $2.1 billion. Actually is a
levy decrease of about 986,000 from last year. Since less
taxation is being proposed. An effort has been made to
finance the projects with reserves, grants and debt. Whenever province
so there's a list of notable projects on the slide
there. But a complete list of projects can be found
in the 2026 capital discussion document that was in the
agenda package, and there's also a section that. Shows additional
projects that were brought forward by departments but ultimately not
included in the capital budget. Just a couple of slides
here to show a breakdown of the 14 and a
half million. The first one is by department. So you
can see about 60% of the proposed projects are for
engineering and public works. About 19% has been allocated to
community services. As the mayor spoke, there was an effort
to clean up some parks and rec and arena projects.
Using departmental reserves and also the municipal services budget includes
a million dollars allocated to 137 Frank Street. So, finally,
this slide provides a breakdown of the 14 and a
half million by revenue source. Basically, it will show how
the capital projects will be financed for the year 35.4%.
Of projects will be financed via grants. So Osif. Community
Canadian Community building funds in NG 911. User fees are
comprised of water and sewer rates, which will be used
for EPW projects and it will finance about 19% discounted
projects. Almost two and a half million, or 17% of
projects will be financed by reserves. And as you can
see, taxation makes up a small component of the capital
budget. At only 14 and a half percent. So where
will the post taxation come from? An assessment base consolidating
both the proposed operating capital budgets and considering other sources
of revenue that are available for municipality that get applied
to the taxation and grants departments, the municipality will require
total taxation of just over $26 million for 2020. Six.
This graph here breaks down. That by property tax class.
So showing where the taxations will come from in our
community as you can see, three quarters of the municipal
tax base is comprised of residential properties, and this breakdown.
Is consistent with the 2025 assessment base as well. The
next slide here. The mayor spoke briefly about two it's
important to note that. The tax increase of 4.53 that
we're proposing. That only makes up a portion. Of the
tax bill. The municipality also collects levies for the county
and the province. In 2025, the percentages were 55% was
municipal. 32 was provincial. Sorry. County was 32 and province
was 13. And we're not expecting the percentages to change
very much for the year. And this slide here, what
does it mean for property owners? We've updated the slides
just to provide some clarification on what we originally sent
out versus for residential and farm rates. Property owners, Mr.
Ethra Caradock will see an increase of $36.42 for every
$100,000 of assessed value. For example, a $400,000 home would
see an increase of $145.68 a million dollar property. Farm
property would see an increase of 360 419 at the
residential rate. Or if you're looking just at a billion
dollars in farmland, it would be $91.05. And again. This
is just on the municipal portion of the taxital. We
just had one more slide for context. We just wanted
to include. The 2024 BMA municipal study. This chart ranks
the neighboring municipalities by their average 2020. Four property taxes
on a detached bungalow. Stress rotate is right in the
middle of the lower rank. There. Finally. We're just going
to wrap up with a quick timeline for the budget
process. Departments submitted their budgets over the summer. In the
fall, we spent delivering and refining them. And as mentioned
at the start of the presentation. Today marks the first
step in the new process. We're presenting the mayor's budget
to council following the new legislation, should council wish to
propose amendments to the budget. They must be submitted in
Wr. Writing to the clerk prior to the February 11
meeting. I believe a template was circulated today. Just to
track any limits. That way, a simple majority vote of
council is required for an amendment. To be added. The
mayor would then have ten days to be to an
amendment if he chose. To and council would have 15
days after that to overturn a mayor's veto and for
that, to have a two thirds vote of council would
be required. So we've tentatively set. February 23 and March
9 meetings to handle those two steps if they're required.
And yes, sorry. That was a lot. And a quick
presentation. Just open up. Any questions? I'm just going to
follow up with one thing. I'll maybe chair answer the
elephant in the room. I have no interest in using
libido powers. Way to look at it. So will a
council. There's something that I really want in the budget.
To incorbern upon me to convince poor other counselors to
vote along with me. So I will not be using
my veto chair. There you go. There you have it.
Thank you. Well done, Lindsay. You should be proud. A
lot of work went into it. So with that, my
understanding of the process is we receive. The presentation tonight.
The documents get received by counsel. And then, I mean,
we can ask clarifying questions this evening. But questions where
you want to do. Amendments need to be provided in
writing to the clerk. Is there a specified time period
prior so that they can get on the agenda? Generally
five days. Five days? Thinking that those questions need to
be drafted. Or really, it would be the amendments, the
requested amendments. Need to be drafted and put into the
clerk. Five days prior so that they can be properly
posted. And that's, I think, probably when the big discussion
happens at council. So I think tonight what we're looking
for is if there's clarifying questions. That we just need
to get sorted out. We still have to figure out
what next steps would be. But are there clarifying questions?
Errors, et cetera. So I'll start with Greg. I saw
your hand up. No, Frank. And was it bow? You
had your hand. Mine was just about the written thing.
Okay, so that's Greg and Frank and Donna and. Both.
And I'll try to do my best to use your
last name. Some counselor. Sorry. My first clarifying question is
just on the debt schedule we have. All the loans
are amortized. Over 30 years. That's a fire truck, road
and fire estate. And there's two roads projects there. Typically,
we've done roads 15 years and fire. Trucks at ten.
Our asset management plan says a road is only good
for 25 years. But we're financing it for 30, according
to the debt schedule. And the asset management also says
a truck is good for ten to 15 and we're
financing it for 30, so we're going to be paying
for that truck 20 years after we take it out
of service, so. I just want to make sure that
that was intentional or see if that was a mistake.
Just so I know, for my motion, I hear it.
Somebody from finance. So through the charity councilor Wolsey. So
all of those are proposed. So we haven't. Even entered
into any arrangements on any of those debts yet, so
those are basically just using numbers. Once we bring those
forward. In fact, all of those have to come forward.
To council. So with those. They'll be in but fire
trucks. You're correct. You can't go beyond. The useful life,
so those will be. I guess a different debt schedule,
and that's going to change the tax rate and everything.
Else then? So you're saying that that would change tax
rate for sure? Because we're going to be paying over
15 years or ten years instead of 30, so. Our
payments are going to change. And that's the entire debt
schedule, except for potentially the firewall. It will advertise over
a juiceable life, so. I appreciate that, council. I just
wanted to put it in the form of, like, a
question that. We can get an answer to or just
state that it's a comment and we can move on.
Director Deacon, did you want to answer that? Will all
the numbers then change? Are you going to change the
numbers accordingly? Through the chair to councilor Wolsey will update
those numbers. On that. Don't include both interest. Yeah, well,
you're looking at that. If we could just update the
Excel firms as well. Because currently. The established. Principal outstanding
includes the interest and the principal. It only includes the
principal. For updating it. We'll just update the whole sheet,
make it correct. Thank you. As I was just mentioning
to the chair. To the mayor. The interest rates. There
are 4.7, which. We're probably below now. These are done
back in 2023, I think. Or 2024. A lot of
these. So we'll update the interest rates, plus. The terms
as well. All right, council cash. Yeah. I guess I
want to go back to that police annex thing. I
think we have to make the assumption that's going to
be included. Because it's been submitted by the police Services
board. I would ask them sometime over the next few
days. We get? Something other. Or we're making the assumption
that. The whole would be about $9 million that needs.
To be while the projects tended to happen. I think
we've got reserves and. So a million and a half.
So say it's $9 million. Is that going to be?
I assume borrowed. And so how is that going to.
Impact everything. Can I ask? Because I know that's the
outstanding question. And it sounds like now the municipal budget
is going to have some outstanding questions that need to
be addressed. So I think at the end, once we
go around and kind of everybody asks their clarifying question,
then we have to determine next step and how those
council want to deal with next step and bring that
back. Is that fair? Well, that's fair. I think we
need to keep that in mind, too. Yes, we do.
Councilor pammer. I have to set a couple of little
questions. One was about the Strasbourg library carpet replacement. Going
to director Lilborn. That is the county's building, is my
understanding, and they run the library, so I'm. Just wondering
why we are replacing. Through the chair to councilor pammer.
The county is a tenant within our building, so if
a county pays a lease to us on a monthly
basis. So the carpet that's in there currently exceeds 25
years old. And is due to be replaced. Thank you
for clarifying. And the other question that I had. This,
I guess would go to direct. Ortiz. I didn't see
the downtown. Revitalization or infrastructure project anywhere listed, and I'm
just wondering where that is at. And. Where you see
that being placed in either this budget. Is there any
stage board in 2026? Or is it all being deferred
till later? I like direct. There's actually a good news
story in there and includes Mount Bridges. I'll ask. What's
the good news? I'll answer the question, then I'll let
the mayor share a good news story. About. Bridges. Because
that project is a carry forward from previous years. It
is not part of listed here, but it is in
the budget, so it is part of. The carry for
it, so we have about $200,000. Set aside for that
project. So part of the clarity regarding Mount Bridge, I
initially asked that we need to. Do the study for
the Mount Bridges downtown revitalization. I think that may have
got left. Out of maybe 50,000. So as part of
correcting this, we'll be adding those dollars back in. But
that'll come out of reserves. We ask just for the
study. From all bridges. Do you have anything else? Thank
you, Councilor Derbyshire. All right, so we're adding more stuff
in without, like, it's going to be very hard for
council. To analyze all this without. I know everything's. We're
going to figure it out, and then. It'll just get.
Anyways, it doesn't matter now. We'll figure it. Out at
the end of the meeting what council wants to do
us next steps with all of these questions, what council
wants to do with next steps. Okay, but let's get
all the questions out on the floor first. Then we'll
figure out how we're going to deal with it and
receive the information. So in our proposed. I'll just go
through. You. When we look at our capital. We have
the Mount bridges wastewater. Servicing, design and construction. Is that
the transformation from like, is that the switching from Roto
to. Open aeration. And I see. We only have 500,000.
500,000 budgeted for that. So I just wondered about that
one. The other one I wondered for is we don't.
Even have the lagoon. In stratroy. And that unless that
is the stratroy wastewater sledge handling facility, at 300,000. Councilor
Ortiz. Yeah. Thank you. Through the chair to councilor Derbyshire.
So that 500,000. That is for. The future. The large
scale design and construction for expansion. We anticipate that being
expended probably in a future year. So we have a
phase in approach for funding on that, so that'll probably
be going into wastewater reserves. The other project that you
were referring to? Well, the actual construction of. Switching it
over. Where's it? In this budget. That's the environmental assessment.
And. That's one point. We have that funded already. In
2020 from 2025. So then. That will then be coming
out of the water and wastewater. Reserves. All of it.
Right. That'll be the same. It'll be coming out of
there. Both those projects are part of the 2025, so
they're just carrying forward into 2026. These are all brand
new projects. These ones listed here. Councilor wilson. In that
same vein. On projects that council's already approved. I looked
through the capital list over the week, and there's projects
that have been approved and they're still using numbers from
2021. Beyond the numbers. Being like four or five years
old when you take a look at the numbers, and
the amount that's been set aside, there's a $12 million
liability. Even at the numbers from probably from 21 and
22 and 23 over the last five years of projects.
That council has approved and hasn't been built. What is
our plan to fund that $12 million shortfall? And that
number is only going to grow as we actually update
the prices from five years ago. I don't see anything.
In this budget or any of the previous budgets to
address that. And I got a second one on the
asset management plan deficit, but just want to know what
our plan is to address that 12 million. Dollar funding
liability. Through the chair to councilor wills. If you could
just send me your calculations how you got that 12
million. It's right on your document, on your capital. I'll
look it up here in one of the documents on
our sheet to make. But typically. The two wastewater treatment
plants are a good example. Those came in originally. Numbers,
original numbers came in. When we actually moved forward with
the project, those numbers were updated. So last year you
added money. To the mount breaches project you added money
to. The Strapberry project. In 2025, so those numbers get
updated as the project moves forward. I guess in addition
to that, if you want to look at the numbers
I'm talking about where I got that number from is
from your reserve. Reserve funds, trust funds and deferred. Revenue
analysis. The last page shows that we have approved 35
million in funding. And this is just on water and
wastewater project. It doesn't include any of the other ones
we've done. We approved 35.7 million. And some of those
projects are. It's not park house. Drive in there that
only has just over 2 million in funding for a
seven and a half. Million dollar project, and I know
some of that comes out of. Development charges. But when
you look at the budget allocated in the project, those
two line items there they only have 23 million to
cover. 37.5 million projects. I'm just wondering, those are all
water and wastewater approved projects. There's likely going to be
debt for that. But there's a $12 million gap that
I don't see addressed anywhere in the capital budgets or
in any of the documents in front of us. So
through the chair to council was. If I understand you're
using the reserve. Reserve fund. Trust fund security deposit analysis
report. Is that the one you're looking at? Yes, just
on the last page where you've got the water wastewater
projects allocated but unspent. The last section after everything. Then
your totals for that section. Give the proposed budget and
then what's been allocated. Right, so allocated. Is money that
has been allocated from the reserves. Going to. That last
section that chart the water wastewater project allocation. But unspent.
The proposed budget shows what the budget costs are. The
two columns show exactly what we're pulling out of the
reserves, so that is only. The reserve portion of the
funding for those projects. There'd be debt, there'd be grants,
there'd be all sorts of other. Things that get added
to come up. So using the example. Of the Mount
bridges. Wastewater treatment at 11 million proposed 11 million. We're
pulling over 10 million. Just over 10. Million other, the
sewers, so the balance would come out of grant. Or
other forms of funding. To bring up that we're just
showing what's coming out of reserves here. Yeah. And I
get that. And that's where I'm wondering if there's $12.
Million more in debt and grant somewhere else. That's not
anywhere in our lives. We're not showing that there's more.
Debt that we have to take on. We're just ignoring
that we have this $12. Million liability. It's not in
our debt schedule. We're not planning on paying for anything.
We don't know what grants we're applying for. We got
to come up with 12 million somehow, and it's not
reflected anywhere in the budget, and we're not planning for
it until he gets here. That's my point. And just
if that's our plan and that's how we want to
go ahead. Then I'll answer that, councilor. I think that's
part of my thought process. And we realize, however we
get there, We have some projects that need some funding,
whether it's debt, so that was my thought. Process, but
these are already approved projects from last year, so we're
just ignoring that there's 12 million that we might have
to do an additional debt this year. Through the chair.
Council will see. So I think what you need to
do is take this document. And compare it to the
actual capital budget, which actually shows each of those projects
and how we're funding them. It's just short in the
reserves, right? Answering the mayor, I guess. What? This document
that you're referring to, council. Looks at just the reserve
portion. So it'd be very similar to if you were
building a house. And you're saying, here's what I got
in my savings account. You show what you have in
your savings account. You're looking at the savings account. Obviously
you got other money set aside. You're going to take
a mortgage or other things to make up the difference.
And so if you take this just shows a reserve
amount. Doesn't show. That that doesn't show any grants that
are going against these. And I guess to follow up
on that, none of those projects show up on the
desk schedule. Either. So there's no debt. So everything is
grants for all of those projects. It does not come
out of reserves and there's no debt because it's not.
On the debt schedule. Everything is grants for all of
those projects. It has to be on the debt schedule
too, if you're paying for debt. That was kind of
my point, that they're not on the debt schedule. And
if it's debt and grant it's paying for it, that
means we're. Grants. We've got $12 million in grants coming
for those projects. Through the charity councilor Willsie. So if
you look at the Mount bridges wastewater treatment plant, for
instance, There is 11 million proposed budget. There's just over
10 million. So there's a million. This is coming from
another. Source. On that, and I would need to look
at. The capital budget to give you where that money
is coming from. That note there. The wastewater is negative
9 million in reserves. If you go up there, if
you take that 11 million out, it's negative 9 million.
That's just on the debts. If you scroll up to
where that is. So that 9 million has to come
from somewhere, and I know we've already said it's. Probably
coming from the water portion of things at this point.
That was kind of part of the discussion, but. There's
nowhere on here does it say how this does the
other thing we were told? Was. There's also a $6
million either loan or grant, plus. A $6 million loan
and a million dollar grant for this project. But because
it was approved midway through last year, it was going
to be put on to this. Budget so we could
see how this was going. But it's not here because
they're like, well, it was approved last year. But it
wasn't approved in last year's budget. We had put a
place marker because we love place markers. We put it
in. But now. There's nothing showing what these projects are
doing. So these projects, we improved last year. We don't
get to see how they're being done, how they're being
spent. Move forward. They should have probably been in the
proposed capital budget as part of it, even if it
is money and money out. It at least shows where
it's money and money out the same. As if we're
spending 9 million on the police thing and they have
a million in reserve. It still has to be somewhere
on this budget and show money and money out, even
if it is a wash. We got to see it
somewhere. So, director, if I may ask. A number of
questions I've imposed to you, mostly around water, wastewater. I
think both of these documents are coming back to us
in some sort of revised form. We'll figure that out
in a moment. Is there benefit to taking time to
putting your thought process together. To solidify that. In that
amended document. Through the chair to the chair. So these
documents will be amended. Obviously, we've got to add to
police annex. According to tonight. Will be updated, plus we
can update the 25 projects that carry forward. Part of
it is the 25 carry forward numbers haven't been closed
off yet because we're still in our 25 year end.
So as of the end of January, We're cutting off
our 25 so we can update all the projects from
2025. With the updated numbers, so that will be part
of what would come forward. At the next meeting on
11th, I believe it is. So. Council. The big question
is in my mind been raised by so many what
is our next steps and we have a police budget
that may or may not need a line item added.
Back in more than likely it needs it added back
in. And then a number of questions have been raised
about the municipal budget. Some clarifying questions. And I think
the director needs time to put all of that together.
Now, keep in mind that we have 30 days from
today to finish our process. Which is February the 11th.
We can have as many meetings as we want in
that period of time, but we have to be done
by February the 11th. It then goes back to the
mayor. So with that being said. I am thinking we
probably need to get these documents revised and back into
our hands. Sooner than February the 11th. Does anybody feel
differently or want to make comment to that? Because otherwise,
I think we need to be looking at another meeting.
Councilor Brennan. Cassill. The deadline for making amendments to hand
the clerk would be Friday, February the 6th. Because you
wanted to have five days before the 11th, is that
correct? So there's a date. The deadline for making amendments
heading into the clerk is February. The 6th. So my
thought is. By far. I'm not an expert in this.
I just reviewed those bullet points about the legislation, I
guess, is the better way to put it. We can
hold two or three meetings within that period of time.
But. Our last meeting has to be kind of put
together by February 6 so that we can do it
and have it completed. On the 11th because after that,
We lose carriage of the process. Correct. So, do we
want to do something quicker? Than that point in time.
Councilor Pam. I just have a question, perhaps for the
clerk, whoever's managing this process. It says here that. The
mayor proposes a budget that we receive and then council
can make amendments to the budget. I don't see where
it says here that the mayor could make amendments to
his budget. Is he part of council? He just is
included as party council. Okay, but. That has to be.
Okay, so then if he makes the changes and bring
it back to us, Then that would require a resolution.
Right? Correct. Because this budget is being presented now. It's
there, correct? We've identified some omissions and changes. So then,
if. The mayor makes an amendment, then we would have
to vote on accepting that amendment. Is that correct? Correct.
Just for clarification, then. So what Don is saying is
essentially we have to make amendments. To change everything we
just talked about now? Because it's been presented? I think
so. They can't just revitalize all of it. Which was
Donna's question. Do you want to hear some input and
then take it back and represent it. But now it's.
And the mayor said he wanted to present his budget.
Present. Okay, so here we said this would be my
question. Which was my original one. Back to the written
amendments. Is that just kind of what we're doing, or
is that part of this provincial new mandate that we
have to do written amendments, or could we make amendments
now? To have these changes done, being. That we're sitting
here right now, and that would speed this process up
as opposed to. Five of us making different amendments. Through
the chair to Councilor Gerber Shire. So although the legislation.
Doesn't specifically say yay or nay. As far as written
documentation. I have advised that we document the process by
written form through every step. Just to be clear and
concise, to make sure that all motions and amendments are
made and understood before voting. Okay. So then. If we.
Yeah, I guess. Then what we need to do is
make a list. Somebody write them out. The problem is,
when they ask about. What the financial implications are on
this. Would you just put, I don't know. Because I
don't really. What we want is just clarification. Then the
proper. Stuff put in, right? That's more. I kind of
agree with you. It's really not a great. Story. We're
trying to figure it out here, Councilor Brennan and then
the CAO. It's interesting with the language. It says council
can make amendments to the proposed budget. I don't believe
that means. A collective amendment. I think we're looking at
individual. Counselors. Can write up a written amendment which will
be given to the clerk before February 6, and then
they would be dealt with that at a February 11
meeting. It's not necessary for counsel as a whole to
collectively put together an amendment. Individual counselors bring forward amendments.
So it's an individual process by individual counselors, which will
be brought before council and considered collectively. So the need
for a meeting to make amendments does not exist. In
terms of. You don't need to be at a meeting
to make an amendment. You just write one up and
submit it to the clerk and it'll get dealt with.
February. 11. The question is, do we want to have
discussions about these amendments? That we're considering as individuals in
the time period between now and February 6, when we
will have to formally submit them. Well, my thought is.
With a number of conversations that have occurred this evening.
Your thought process is going to change dramatically. Let's take
the police budget. Yeah. Another 10 million into it. Your
thought process probably is going to change. Not saying your
fault would change, but your thought process is going to
achieve. Similarly with the municipal budget. Changes. And decisions made
at one meeting, and then you're going to leave again
and perhaps come. Back. Do you want to do it
all at one meeting, or do you want to get
more information? Clarification. Get that document in front of you.
And then. Finalize that one. We don't have the time
we used to have to deal with it. That's my
point. Councilor Pammer, councilor Dolphman, on that point, it would
look like the process and again looking to the clerk
to confirm. Is that we have one shot. 30 days
after the pro's budget to make changes or to request
changes, and then we either have to accept them or
not. And then there's a ten day sort of resting.
Period. It doesn't say. Then we can go back and
ask for another round. 30 days. How many times can
you. Is this just a one shot? Google deal. Because
that's why I'm worried about. Presenting the budget tonight as
is, knowing that. It's likely going to need amendments. Have
we wasted a whole shot at doing this or. Is
there more flexibility? I'm asking the clerk. So through the
chair to councilor Pammer. The first 30 days. Sorry today.
The bride's budget is presented in day one. Over the
next 30 days, you have up to 30 days up
until. That next meeting in February 11 to present, to
submit any amendments to be put on the agenda. To
be voted by a simple majority vote. But during that
30 day period, if council feels that in this instance
there's an updated. Budget documents that need to be provided
if you feel that you want to meet again, to
have that discussion. To clarify certain items or specific things
that can be done. It's at council's. Discretion for sure.
What I heard the clerk say is. You're essentially getting
a revised budget. Particularly on the police one. You're going
to get a revised budget. We're going to want to
receive that. And have 14 or 15 days to review
that before losing carriage of it on the 11th. That's
my thought process, but I could be wrong. I had
bo and Steve, and then I'll go down to the
mayor. So, Mike, I would just say this. The mayor
actually has till February 1 to introduce this budget. Today.
Was just the day that we picked to give us
a bit of time to move this forward. Right. If
we don't. I mean, I guess if this is his
presentation, but if he would. Like to make his presentation
back. And as long as he presents it before the
first can we then not. Let's say he presents it
January 16. Then we go 30 days from the 16th,
right? The only deadline is essentially the February 1 one.
Am I right in saying that after that, we moved
just on the dates and the timelines. If he gets
it correct, we can actually veto to shorten the distance
and move it forward. But right now, you have a
budget that. Needs all. I don't want to say complete
revision, but there's an awful lot that has to be
corrected for us to move forward with it. My question
is, can he just not say, look, I'm sorry? I'm
going to redo this, and I will represent it this
date, and then we move forward from that 30 days.
So, Madam Clerk, can we defer any motion to receive?
This. And give it back to the mayor using our
motions. Could we do a motion to. Refer it back
to the mayor. For. His budget? I don't know. So
we referred it back to you, Mr. Mayor, with at
least an answer to. The police. Annex line item. And
infill as much else as you've heard this evening and
then represent that. Document to us prior to the first.
And then council carries its 30 day. Hold of. For
that period of time. Is that easier, do you think?
I can do that. I understand. Maybe the safe way
I look at it, the overall budget, there's one major
item which. Is the police annex. But again. This is
like, a lot of legislation. You could drive a pickup,
you can drive the semi truck. Through the legislation if
you wanted. So hearing counsel, knowing that there is one
major. Item. In the will of council. I will.
Pull it back and come back in one week. Don't
need to present it. Right, so. Willow council. I think
I'm doing it because of the one main thing. Any
errors or omissions could be handled. But with the police
annex. I am willing to withdraw it for one week,
and we don't need to reconvene. We'll just reissue it
so I will start the clock counting. One week. That'll
have the answer. There's a reason why council is not
to delay it. It's more because the longer we delay
the budget process, the more we heard the municipality might
not be able to put things over tender. That is
the main thing. Some municipalities are already out there tendering
road projects and other things. So, that being said, I've
heard. Counsel, and this is fair. This is a new
process. I will present it back. Next week, one week
from today, we should have the answer regarding. The police
annex. That will be the big item. I can't see
it changing. The actual increase. What it's going to change
is. Our debt in the future, so I will do
that. That's at my discretion, and I will do that
chair. So then does that satisfy counsel? If the mayor
does, that reissues. It's one municipal budget, but you'll see
the police portion budget, and then you'll. See the municipal
budget all inclusive. And it'll be the date that that
is released to us that would start the 30 day
time period pursuant to the legislation. With the debt schedule.
Would then the plants that have been approved from last
year not be existing debt, even though. We know where
they're coming from and how they're coming off. Like the
debt schedule itself probably needs to be revised. I mean,
we have the principal and the interest being added together
and coming off the principal payment. So those principal numbers
are wrong. Right from Dock Duado. And that's probably not
a huge amount. But your numbers. We're still not dealing
with proper numbers. Director DACA will clean that up. No,
I understand, but I'm telling you, if somebody. Presented this
to me, like, if I went to an accountant and
they said, here you go. I mean, you'd be right
mad. And by all right. So we're doing when we
come to those existing projects, if they were approved last
year, Are they going to be on the existing debt
schedule now? Or no. Where do they go? Who will
let the director answer? Director Dick. So without looking at
the. I don't have that in front of me. So
if there was debt. It should have been on that
list. So we will take a look and make sure
that all the debt is showing on the debt. Schedule.
Okay, there's our answer. That the director is going to
take all the information and questions. Asked on tonight and
revise. The document or update the document accordingly. Councilor Wilsey
and councilor Hippol and then we'll call it just a
clarification. I think I remember this from last year. Any
of the projects that finish in 2025. Our first payment
will not be until the 2027 budget. So even though
we're taking on this debt now, all the projects now,
we're sitting up from 20. Four, so. There's been $12
million of debt that happened last year. If my numbers
are right. They might not be, but assume around $12
million of what projects we did in 25, we have
to pay debt on that, starting in 27. And then
if we do, the police now that won't finish next
year, so that'll likely be 28 we have to pay
on. That 10 million. So the approvals we're doing now
aren't actually changing our tax rate today. But we're taking
down the road where we have $12 million in new
debt that we're going to have to pay next year
from what we already did and then another. 10 million
a year after that. Hence the need for the debt
policy, councilor. Sounds like a credit card. Who's going to
give us. Okay, 1 second. Sorry. I
was asking the question about what motions we need to
complete the meeting and the clerk. Was just working away
on it, so we had a laugh there. About our
answer. Councilor Brennan. Councilor Kenneth. Council order. Hip hop. I'm
sorry, Sandy. Actually, I'm. Going to reverse it. Councilor Pitbull,
Councilor Candace, Councilor Brennan, she had her hand up before
and I missed. That's okay. It's actually just a really.
Easy question. The mayor has said a week from tonight,
so I'm assuming. Looking at our clerk. The 20 January.
Okay. Five. Okay, sorry. One week in a week. It's
really hard. We all have to look at our schedule.
So I need to make sure. But I think it's
just being released to us by that date. No meeting.
We're not meeting. That year. So my question to the
clerk, so people understand my thought process here. Is that?
To get out of this meeting and document what it
is that we've talked. About is. A motion to receive.
These reports for information. To refer. The budgets back to
the mayor. For amendment. I'll say a revision. Whichever word
you want to use. To have them returned. Released back
to council. Within seven days. Which would then start. The
30 day. Time period pursuant to the strong mayor's budget.
Timetable. So that would encapsulate everything that needs to occur.
The clerk said, I'm not sure we can do that.
I laughed because I said I'm not sure who's going
to give us heck. By doing it. Councilor Kenneth, did
you still want to ask the question? Well, I guess
a comment more on the whole debt thing. It sounds
to me like a lot of projects that we've done
so far. We've paid out of our own cash. And
we haven't gone out and got it loan for it
yet. And so I think we need. To. And perhaps
this agrees with councilor Wilson and councilor Derbyshire. I think
we need to. Start getting an idea of what kind
of debt payments the municipality is going to face moving
forward. Both in terms of principle and interest, because. That's.
When we go out and get these loans for projects
already completed, then the cash comes back in. From the
debt. Or the loan that's been received. And I think
we need to have an understanding of. When. And I
think Councilor Wilse mentioned that, too. An understanding. Of how
projects move forward. Like, for example, say we do the
police annex, I just throw that out there and it's.
A project that's going to start in 2026 and be
completed in 2027. And at that time, During the whole
construction process. We finance it internally, basically use our own
cash, and then we go. Out to market to get
a loan. And that's something new for the municipality because
depth has always been such a small portion. Of the
actual. Taxation cash. I guess that's used, if that makes
sense, what I'm saying, so. I think we need to
get a better handle on principal and interest payments moving
forward. If that makes sense, what I just said. So.
I think in addition, To the police annex being added.
I think we need to get a better idea. Of
debt, principal and interest payments moving forward and how you
see that external debt curve kind of going up over
the next number of years again, making I know we
haven't passed a debt policy yet, but again, having some
understanding and using the assumptions that vehicles are over x
number of years and roads over x number of years
and all that kind. Of stuff. So if that makes
sense, what I just said. Thank you, Councilor Brennan. I
agree. With all that assistant wondering whether the motion that
you outlined should include specifically that we're looking for the
inclusion of the capital renovations to the police headquarters, and
we're also looking for a revised or updated. Debt schedule
for the 20th. Those need to be included. Start to
draft a motion for it. I think that would move
that. By January 20, we receive. A revised.
Municipal budget from the mayor, which includes the renovations, the
capital renovations to the police headquarters, and a revised debt
schedule. Catch up before we go any further. She's typing
quickly. And we'll start it out. We receive this report
for information, we receive a report. Councilor Brennan. Just 1
second. Just. Everything that the deputy mayor said, but then
specifically that we received by January 20, I'm a revised
municipal budget from the mayor, which includes the capital renovation,
the police headquartered project and a revised debt schedule. From
the director of finance. I just want to let the
person catch up. Okay. Councilor Derbyshire. Councilor. I just want
to ask why we're receiving this. For information. Why we're
just. Not deferring it to get it updated on the
20th because at that point, what we're saying is we're
accepting this. As. Is not what you do when you
receive it for information as you accept it, it's. Now
logged in. Whereas if we don't accept it and send
it back. You're asking for better clarity. Sending it back.
We have to say we received something to send back.
I think, like we discussed this afternoon. In my anything
I've ever read, when we receive it for information, it
just means they get to buy it. But that's what
you're now filing, misinformation. We're asking for it to go
back and be revised so it doesn't start. The 30
day clock. That's the whole point to it. Wouldn't it?
Start it if you receive it. That's what I was
thinking. If you receive it today, it should start the
clock now. You're. The mayor says he's okay if it
doesn't start to clock. By then. Get her hands left.
I wish I knew the process better, councilor. I don't.
I'm. Just trying to get this meeting wrapped up. And
a pathway forward. I get it. Whatever. But I think
anytime that we're talking about documents, I think we have
to receive them. We usually do that. First receive the
documents, and then we have our discussions about it. Councilor
Felkman, did you have a comment before we move? I
did. So I just want to clarify what's a change
and what's not a change. So I. Think that. The
list of projects and stuff that's identified, if we were
to add or remove any of those to me. That's
a change. If we're seeking clarification on numbers to me.
That's not a change and can happen without motion. To
speed the process up. So if somebody points out a
glaring error and said, hey, this number is incorrect. It
should be able to be changed without a motion because.
It's not changing the budget that's being presented, it's just
making sure. That the numbers are being correct. Has nothing
to do with the motion that's just grafted now. Just
saying moving forward. If we discover. That. The numbers are
incorrect. Without adding or removing any items. We're not changing
the budget that's being proposed. We're just making sure the
information is correct. Okay. I agree with that. So within
seven days, we have documents that we're going to start
a 30 day clock. On. And. Amendments are to be
drafted and sent to the clerk basically as soon as
possible. We do have a meeting for February 11 scheduled,
which we can keep. It's probably a good idea to
keep it, see if we can deal with all the
amendments. That still leaves us seven days if we need
a second meeting. If not. We collapse the 30 day
at that point in time, because we can do that
and send it directly over to the mayor, which starts
his phase of the veal. Which he's already commented upon.
We don't have to keep 30 days, but we've got
it if we need. To come back for a second
meeting. Or a third meeting, as the case is. I
got it. A question of clarification on this amendment. Changing
numbers. Do I email everybody? Not my amendment. But do
I say? I say, look, there's a percentage change. Or
this didn't add up. Or maybe this number isn't right.
Does that go to all of council, so that we're
all aware of a number change? Obviously, I would send
my amendment to the clerk or whatever it lists on
this name, and then we would deal with the amendments.
At that meeting. But if we're talking about. Let's say
you notice the debt schedule just using it right now.
And the numbers are off. Do I email everyone and
say, hey, I think the numbers are off? On this.
Because we're not coming back to meet and meet and
meet. We're going to just analyze this ourselves and you're
going to have two more meetings we'd have. Time for
two more meetings if needed. But two thoughts. Good point.
Because then at least we all get to see the
conversation, but we have to be careful that we don't
engage. In. An unscheduled meeting by responding. As soon as
we start that email chain now. We're tell Madam Clerk
I think that's your realm of expertise. You're welcome. Thank
you. This is all very brand new territory, so. We're
just trying to navigate. I would definitely encourage you. If
you do find something of an error, then I would
encourage you. To contact the directors. I think it would
be helpful to keep counsel in the loop as long
as the deputy mayor said to keep it. Not engaging
like it would be advancing business or a meeting. But
if you're just pointing out something that you found, I
would encourage you to include everyone. So everyone is on
the same. Page. Yeah. Does that make sense? Does that
help at all? 100%. Is it better if when you
send your amendments to the clerk. If. There of a
fashion that she feels needs to be released immediately. She
could release them out. We don't comment about them. We
don't get into an email chain. We leave it to
the clerk. I'm afraid of an email chain getting going
and they happen quickly and easily. Councilor Kenneth, actually. So
we have a motion up on the floor. John made
a motion. Do we have a seconder for that motion?
Councilor of healthman, any other comment on the motion. Yes.
It's really on the motion. Uncovering. An addition error to
me isn't a change to the budget. To me. Saying
we need to drop that program or drop that. Project
or add that project to me that's making a change
to the budget, but correcting. An error. I don't really
see that as a change. So then, if it's just
an error that's been noted, And madam Clerk sent that
all out. Just so you know, councilor Kenneth noted an
error. It's grammatical or. That everybody knows we all don't
have to send in the same thing. But what we
don't want to do is get involved. In an email
chains because that's not proper. Councilor Brennan and then we're
going to call this to a vote. Here's a fun
idea. If we're all going to be grading up, maybe
we won't be, but let's say a few of us
write up written amendments that we're sending into the clerk
and we want other people to know about them when
we want to avoid email chains and all this sort
of stuff, and it's all going to be done by
February 11. There's nothing saying we couldn't have a meeting
on February the fourth. If you will. Where each of
us could bring in with us if we wanted to
a copy of our written amendment and we could just
say, hey, other members of council, here's three written amendments
that I have submitted, and I'm just going to let
you know about them in this meeting. And then we
could all do that. And if it turns out that
there were. A total of eleven amendments that were put
forward by all of us. We could take five minutes.
And talk about each one. We don't have to make
a decision, but at least everybody knows that amendments are
being proposed before we get to another meeting. I think
we do best when we sit down and meet with
each other physically. And if we have. A form that
we have to submit. Electronically to the clerk. Well. It
doesn't take an extra effort to maybe just print it
out at home or have it on your device and
come to a meeting. And just, even though it's already
been submitted. Each of us takes turns saying, here's an
amendment that I submitted. Does anybody want to talk about
it for five minutes. We're not looking about passing it
or making a motion, but let's just talk to each
other. About the amendments that we put in and have
that pre discussion before we get to a February 11
meeting when they're all on the table and we have
to make decisions. So I think we do best when
we sit and talk to each other, and I have
no objection to a meeting where we'd all sit down
and say, I might come in here. And say I
made no amendments. And maybe Steve's made two and he
reads them out and bose made five or one. Or
none. And that way everybody knows that other people have
made amendments and we have an opportunity to discuss them,
maybe not decide them that night. And then everybody goes
home and sleeps on it for a week. And then
we come to a February 11 meeting where the amendments
come up for votes. I just think that way we
avoid the whole email chain. It humanizes the process. So
hold that thought for a moment. There's a motion on
the floor. About receiving it for information. And then. Referring
it back to the mayor for revision. With the inclusion.
Of the police annex. And. The depth. Revised debt schedule.
Revised debt schedule. That's good. Looking for a debt schedule.
So on that motion. Seconded motion. All in favor? Opposed.
Did you vote in favor of it? Is abstain from
it. That carries. Okay, Mr. Mayor, and then we'll deal
with when the next meeting is going to be. Just
two comments. I'm glad everybody was looking that way, not
looking here because I was smiling, because I want to
tell the council why? We're not unusual. All the readings
that I have done on the strong mayor powers and
the presentation to council. Has elicited the same conversation, so
I would suggest. I know for a fact. Cambridge, their
council. There was frustration with the process. I believe it
was St. Mary, so we're not unusual. Deputy mayor. Every
council has wrestled with this in using the strong mayor
powers. And secondly, I'm glad to hear the discussion about
the debt and the debt policy, because that was kind
of my focus moving forward. Is. Everybody's mentioned it. Where
are we at with our debt and how are we
going? To use it moving forward. So again, smiling, because
I'm glad to hear all the discussion. About debt. So
that's it. Chair. Thank you. Yeah. It's not a good
situation trying to build the process while we're in the
process, but thank you. Sorry. I was going to say
it's not fun building the process. While we're in the
process. On this, but we got through it. So, next
meeting? When do you want the next meeting to be?
The third. You want? The 3 February. What day of
the week is that? Tuesday. A Tuesday. Tuesday the 3.
February at 430. No. Tuesday doesn't work for councilor Pammer.
No, the third. I have something booked, but I guess
I could try to change it. I'm the only one.
How about Wednesday the 28th? There's one tentatively booked by
staff for Wednesday the 28 or 30. Councilor Temple can't
make Wednesdays. Can we not just change the strategic priority?
One strategic priority sets. It starts at what time? Do
you want to meet? At. 430 to do the budget.
430 for a 30 minutes. Budget discussion prior to starting
strategic priorities. You won't get it done. 30 minutes. 30
minutes. It's just to say what amendments you're thinking about
bringing forward. And then we meet on the 11th. To
amered up. It still gives you seven days if you
wanted another one on the 20th. We could start at
430 and go till. No, we can't. Stretch it, like
do it all in one day rather than. Do it
twice. We're going to begin then on Monday. The 26
January at 430. For a continuation of the budget process.
Bring your amendments. We're good at that. Sorry. Clarification. Do
we bring our amendments or do we. Submit them ahead
of time. Well, submit them ahead of time, but bring
your amendments to the meeting. To discuss with everybody else
to tell everybody else what your amendments are. Instead of
circulating them outside of council, I was going to ask.
Put on an agenda then. Not until the February 11.
February the 11th. Are we live? On the 26th? Yeah.
What we like. Just for clarification, all the amendments are
going to be on the agenda. You can bring other
amendments later. We'll have a big discussion meeting on the
11th. But if you want to. But for that meeting,
we have to have them submitted early because we can't
discuss anything that's not on the agenda. My understanding from
councilor Brennan was not to just do a big discussion
about him, but to. Tell everybody. Here's what I'm thinking
of bringing forward. You can put your mind to it.
Go home, take a look. At what it is councilor
Brennan has commented on. Come back in on the 11th
and be prepared. To decide whether you want to move
that motion forward or not that amendment forward. And I
guess my point is, by council rules, unless it's on
the agenda, we can't talk. About it, right? That's just
what I'm getting for. Is there a deadline to submit
amendments for that meeting, or can we bring them in
and not let anybody know except the clerk, like, say,
on the Friday over the weekend before that meeting and
still discuss them, I think. You can bring those ones
in any time. I think you can just walk in
on that meeting. On the 26th. You can walk in
with your amendment in your back pocket if you want.
Submit it five days prior to the 11th to get
it on the agenda, and that's when council is going
to do their discussion, their deep dive on it and
hopefully make resolution. By vote and motion to the mayor.
Councilor pellman. Technically, would that not be a workshop? Not
a complete. Is that a workshop?
Council meeting. It'll be the same as special meeting, same
as. Just be a short special meeting. No motions be
that's a preparatory meeting to the 11th. Meeting is all
it is. Okay, motion to adjourn council. She said we
can't do that yet. No. There isn't a bylaw. I'm
looking for a motion. That bylaw number 426 receive 1st,
2nd, third and final reading. What is that? Just a.
Bylaw to approve proceedings of the meeting. Oh, I see.
It says that underneath there a bylaw to confirm the
proceedings at the special. Council meeting of the corporation Municipality
of Strathwide cared on somebody to make a motion councilor.
Kenneth, councilor Hippo. Thank you. All in favor? Path carries.
Motion to adjourn. Councilor Hippo, Councilor Kenneth, all in favor?
We stand adjourned 728, thank you. Good job, Mike.