[0:00] Afternoon
[0:10] [music]
[0:12] everybody. It is 3:02 on Wednesday,
[0:15] September 9th. I'd like to call this
[0:17] meeting of Tallahassee City Commission
[0:19] to order. We have full chambers today.
[0:21] It's great to see everybody. we have a
[0:23] full meeting and then we have uh the
[0:25] first of two um public hearings on the
[0:29] budget along with other issues that'll
[0:30] begin at 6 o'clock tonight. So, we have
[0:32] a full agenda today. Without further
[0:35] ado, let's go ahead and get started. It
[0:37] is my honor and privilege to introduce
[0:39] and to invite to the well the Reverend
[0:42] Dr. Gerald Mandrrell, uh the pastor of
[0:44] Life Changers Church of God in Christ.
[0:47] Dr. Mandrel, it's good to see you.
[0:48] Ladies and gentlemen, please stand for
[0:50] the invocation.
[0:54] Father, in the name of Jesus, Lord, we
[0:57] come before you with humble hearts and
[0:59] with humble minds, knowing that without
[1:01] you, we can do nothing. Even as it said
[1:04] in Psalm 1271, that if you don't keep
[1:08] the city,
[1:09] » The wakers, the watchers wake in vain.
[1:12] So God, we seek you today. We seek your
[1:15] presence. We seek your anointing uh to
[1:18] rest with us. We ask that you will bless
[1:20] our leaders that you will bring them
[1:22] into unity and harmony so that they can
[1:26] effectively manage this city, this
[1:29] community of believers. So God, we ask
[1:31] that your glory will rest upon us even
[1:34] as we do the business of the city of
[1:37] Tallahassee that favor come upon these
[1:40] your people so that we will serve them
[1:42] in righteousness and in truth and that
[1:45] your will will be done. And it's in
[1:47] Jesus name we pray. Amen.
[1:50] » Amen.
[1:50] » Ladies and gentlemen, if you will join
[1:52] me in the pledge of allegiance. I pledge
[1:54] allegiance to the flag of the United
[1:57] States of America and to the republic
[2:00] for which it stands, one nation under
[2:03] God, indivisible, with liberty and
[2:06] justice for all.
[2:13] » Special shout out. I see my dear friend,
[2:16] former school board member Joy Bowen has
[2:18] joined us today. It's great to see you,
[2:20] Joy. I hope you're doing well. Thanks
[2:22] for joining us in chambers. I hope I
[2:24] haven't missed any uh current or former
[2:27] electeds that might have joined us as
[2:29] well. All right, Mr. Manager, do we have
[2:31] any agenda modifications for today?
[2:34] » Yes, sir, Mr. Mayor.
[2:36] » Okay.
[2:36] » Um item 8.01 has been pulled uh the
[2:40] request of Commissioner Porter. That is
[2:42] your approval of the 2027 city
[2:44] commission meeting schedule.
[2:46] » Okay.
[2:46] » And then item 1001 which is the approval
[2:49] of the city manager employment
[2:51] agreement. The materials were added uh
[2:54] to that item.
[2:55] » All right. Any uh questions colleagues
[2:58] to the manager just simply on the
[3:00] modifications that are before us today.
[3:02] All right. If you all would care to join
[3:04] me down at the well for some
[3:06] presentations I would love to have you.
[3:27] Well, as we like to start all of our
[3:30] meetings off uh with some recognition,
[3:33] uh it is my honor and privilege to
[3:35] invite uh K. Ignatio uh Big Ben 211 and
[3:40] all of our friends that are here, please
[3:42] come join us as well for his special
[3:45] recognition.
[3:50] And as y'all are coming forward, let me
[3:52] just tell you, I think the work that you
[3:53] do is absolutely amazing, so vital to
[3:57] this community, and so proud to have you
[3:59] in chambers and allowing us to recognize
[4:02] you on this allimportant
[4:05] issue. Today,
[4:07] ladies and gentlemen, from the governing
[4:08] body of the city of Tallahassee, a
[4:10] proclamation. Whereas September is
[4:13] recognized nationally as suicide
[4:15] awareness and prevention month to raise
[4:16] awareness about mental health, reduce
[4:18] the stigma surrounding suicide,
[4:20] encouraging open conversations, and
[4:22] connect individuals and families with
[4:24] life-saving resources and support. And
[4:26] whereas millions of Americans experience
[4:29] suicidal thoughts, make suicide plans,
[4:31] or attempt suicide each year,
[4:33] demonstrating the ongoing need for
[4:35] prevention, intervention, compassionate
[4:37] care, and access to mental health
[4:39] services. And whereas suicide remains a
[4:42] significant public health concern,
[4:44] underscoring the importance of expanding
[4:46] access to behavioral health services,
[4:48] crisis intervention, suicide prevention,
[4:51] early intervention, and community
[4:53] education. And whereas suicide affects
[4:55] individuals and families throughout the
[4:57] city of Tallahassee, leaving a lasting
[4:59] impact on loved ones, friends,
[5:01] co-workers, classmates, neighbors, and
[5:04] the entire community. And whereas 211
[5:07] Big Ben, the designated regional
[5:09] provider of the 988 suicide and crisis
[5:11] lifeline, provides 24-hour crisis
[5:14] intervention, emotional support, suicide
[5:17] prevention services, and connections to
[5:19] behavioral health and community
[5:20] resources throughout North Florida. And
[5:22] whereas the city of Tallahassee proudly
[5:24] recognizes the dedicated crisis
[5:26] counselors at 211 Big Ben, who answer
[5:29] some of life's most difficult calls 24
[5:31] hours a day, 365 days a year, alongside
[5:34] volunteers, educators, health care
[5:37] providers, first responders, peer
[5:39] specialists, and community organizations
[5:41] working to prevent suicide, promote
[5:43] hope, reduce stigma, and connect
[5:45] individuals to life-saving support and
[5:47] resources.
[5:49] And whereas every person can make a
[5:50] difference by reaching out, listening
[5:52] with compassion, recognizing the warning
[5:54] signs of emotional distress, and
[5:56] reminding those who are struggling that
[5:58] they are not alone, that help is
[5:59] available, and that recovery is
[6:01] possible. Now therefore, I, John Evans
[6:03] Daily, by the authority vested in me as
[6:05] the mayor of the city of Tallahassee, do
[6:07] hereby recognize September as National
[6:10] Suicide Prevention Month and encourage
[6:12] all residents to promote hope, increase
[6:14] awareness of mental health resources,
[6:16] reduce stigma, and support those
[6:18] affected by suicide. And remember that
[6:21] one conversation can save a life.
[6:24] Written to the record in front of each
[6:25] and every one of you here today, signed
[6:27] with my signature, John E. daily dated
[6:30] September 9th, 2026.
[6:33] K, it is an honor to have you in
[6:36] chambers and present this proclamation.
[6:38] Micro,
[6:44] » Good afternoon everyone. I will make
[6:45] this brief. I know you all are here for
[6:47] all the other goodies on the agenda
[6:49] today, but I just want to say thank you
[6:51] to the city of Tallahassee for
[6:52] supporting 211 Big Ben and our efforts.
[6:55] 988 is nationwide. I don't know if you
[6:57] guys know that or not, but it's
[6:58] nationwide. You don't have to be in
[7:01] mental health crisis to call. You can
[7:03] call for a friend, a family member, a
[7:05] child, anyone that you don't really know
[7:08] how to approach them or talk to them
[7:10] about it. You can call 988. It's here
[7:13] 24/7, 365 days a year for you, your
[7:16] neighbors, and we are honored to answer
[7:18] that the call. Uh last fiscal year, we
[7:21] received about 5,988 calls. in on 211
[7:25] helpline, we received about 38,000
[7:28] calls. Um, so it's important we all talk
[7:30] about it, we get the word out, and make
[7:33] sure that no one faces a crisis alone
[7:35] just to reach out and call 988.
[7:38] » Yeah, I'd love to.
[8:22] All
[8:37] right. I would now love to invite my
[8:40] friend Leslie Powell Budro to please
[8:44] come forward to accept a proclamation on
[8:46] behalf of Legal Services of North
[8:48] Florida. Leslie, how you doing?
[8:56] Come join me. Come join. Ladies and
[8:58] gentlemen, from the governing body of
[9:00] the city of Tallahassee, a proclamation.
[9:02] Whereas Legal Services of North Florida
[9:04] was founded in Tallahassee on August
[9:06] 25th, 1976, advancing access to justice
[9:09] for 50 years by providing civil legal
[9:12] assistance to lowincome and vulnerable
[9:14] residents who otherwise could not afford
[9:16] representation. And whereas from its
[9:18] beginning in Florida's capital city,
[9:20] legal services in North Florida has
[9:22] grown to serve residents across the
[9:23] Florida panhandle, working to ensure
[9:26] that justice is not determined by a
[9:27] person's income, age, disability, or
[9:30] circumstance. And whereas throughout its
[9:32] history, Legal Services of North Florida
[9:35] has helped bridge the gap between the
[9:37] courts and the people they serve by
[9:38] providing critical legal help and
[9:40] matters involving housing stability,
[9:42] family safety, public benefits, consumer
[9:45] protection, healthc care access,
[9:47] veterans issues, and other essential
[9:50] civil legal needs. And whereas through
[9:52] legal advocacy, education, and
[9:54] partnerships with local governments,
[9:56] courts, human service providers, the
[9:58] legal community, volunteers, and
[10:00] supporters, Legal Services of North
[10:02] Florida has promoted fairness,
[10:04] stability, and opportunity for
[10:06] individuals and families. And whereas by
[10:08] serving children, older adults,
[10:10] veterans, survivors of abuse, people
[10:13] with disabilities, and families facing
[10:15] crisis, Legal Services of North Florida
[10:17] has strengthened communities and upheld
[10:19] the promise of equal justice under the
[10:21] law. And whereas the 50th anniversary of
[10:23] Legal Services of North Florida marks a
[10:26] significant milestone recognizing the
[10:28] organization's long-standing commitment
[10:30] to justice, service, and community
[10:32] impact. Now therefore, I, John Evans
[10:34] Daily, by the authority vested in me as
[10:36] the mayor of the city of Tallahassee, do
[10:38] hereby recognize the 50th anniversary of
[10:41] Legal Services of North Florida and
[10:43] commends its enduring dedication to
[10:45] expanding access to civil justice for
[10:47] the residents of Tallahassee and
[10:49] communities across North Florida. Read
[10:51] into the record in front of each and
[10:53] every one of you here today. Signed with
[10:55] my signature, John E. Dailyaly, dated
[10:57] September 9th, 2026. Leslie,
[11:00] congratulations on the 50th anniversary.
[11:04] [applause]
[11:07] » Um, thank you. Thank you, mayor. Um, and
[11:10] thanks, commissioners. Uh, uh, we
[11:13] started here in Tallahassee. And while
[11:15] we cover 16 counties now, this is this
[11:17] is home. This is we are we are woven
[11:20] into the to the to the history of
[11:22] Tallahassee. um having been started in
[11:24] partnership with First Presbyterian
[11:26] Church with a little bit of money that
[11:28] we've been able to really grow and
[11:30] flourish uh in order to support um the
[11:33] most vulnerable people in our community.
[11:35] No one should be worse off just because
[11:38] they get pulled into the court system
[11:40] and don't have a lawyer to help them.
[11:42] And that's what we're here to do. And we
[11:44] we are grateful for the partnership with
[11:45] the city. Um, always love working with
[11:47] the staff um, as we find ways to make
[11:50] sure that all of uh, its citizens are
[11:52] served. Um, want to thank some of our
[11:55] our our team here, Charlotte, our
[11:56] director of communications, and
[11:57] Michelle, our director of proono. Um, it
[12:00] takes a team of us to to do this work
[12:03] and I'm just grateful um, for this
[12:05] opportunity to celebrate this
[12:07] anniversary with y'all. So, thank you so
[12:08] much.
[12:09] » Excellent. May we get a picture? Yeah,
[12:10] absolutely. Please. [applause]
[12:58] ladies and gentlemen, it is my honor and
[13:01] privilege to invite all members
[13:04] Tallahassee Fire Department that is here
[13:06] in chambers or in the sound of my voice
[13:08] to please come join me and my colleagues
[13:11] colleagues at the well.
[13:17] [applause]
[13:18] Come on.
[13:23] [applause]
[13:32] Ladies and gentlemen, we have the best
[13:33] fire department in the nation right here
[13:35] in Tallahassee. It is an honor and a
[13:37] privilege to work with the chief and
[13:38] your dynamic, award-winning team each
[13:41] and every day. I also want you to know
[13:43] how appreciative not only of the best
[13:46] services in the nation that y'all
[13:48] provide. Uh I know that we will be
[13:50] spending time together on September
[13:52] 11th, you always do an incredible
[13:54] ceremony um honoring uh the tragedy that
[13:57] took place on September 11th. And thank
[13:59] you so much for the invitation to
[14:00] participate. And I would like to invite
[14:02] the public to come join us also at
[14:04] station one. and chief if you wouldn't
[14:06] mind in your remarks just reminding
[14:08] everybody the the the time and once
[14:11] again stating station one for the
[14:13] location so that everyone that is
[14:14] watching and listening
[14:16] join us. Ladies and gentlemen, from the
[14:18] governing body of the city of
[14:20] Tallahassee, a proclamation. Whereas the
[14:22] Tallahassee Fire Department is fully
[14:24] committed to ensuring the safety and
[14:25] security of all those living in and
[14:27] visiting Tallahassee. And whereas fire
[14:30] remains a serious public safety concern
[14:32] both locally and nationally and the
[14:34] presence of lithium ion batteries and
[14:36] many household devices introduce fire
[14:38] risks.
[14:40] And whereas most of the rechargeable
[14:42] electronics used in homes daily,
[14:44] including smartphones, tablets, laptops,
[14:46] power tools, ebikes, e- scooters, and
[14:48] toys are powered by lithium-ion
[14:51] batteries, which if mis misused,
[14:53] damaged, or improperly charged can
[14:55] overheat, start a fire, or explode. And
[14:58] whereas the National Fire Protection
[15:00] Association reports an increase in
[15:02] battery related fires, underscoring the
[15:05] need for public education on the safe
[15:07] use of lithium ion batteries and
[15:09] devices. And whereas the way lithium ion
[15:12] batteries devices are charged can make a
[15:14] difference in helping prevent home
[15:15] fires. And whereas safe charging
[15:17] includes using the cord and charger that
[15:19] came with your device or one approved by
[15:21] the manufacturer. And whereas residents
[15:23] are encouraged to understand that safe
[15:25] charging means making smart choices
[15:27] every time they plug in. And whereas
[15:29] Tallahassee Fire Department remains
[15:31] fully committed to reducing the
[15:32] occurrence of fires through prevention,
[15:34] safety education, and community
[15:36] outreach. And whereas the 2026 fire
[15:39] prevention week theme, charge into fire
[15:42] safety, safe charging is a superpower.
[15:45] Serves to remind all residents that safe
[15:47] charging can help reduce the risk of
[15:48] fires in homes and communities. Now
[15:51] therefore, I, John Evans Daily, by the
[15:53] authority vested in me as the mayor of
[15:54] the city of Tallahassee, do hereby
[15:56] proclaim October 4th through the 10th,
[15:59] 2026 as Fire Prevention Week and urge
[16:02] all residents of Tallahassee to practice
[16:04] safe charging habits and support the
[16:06] many public safety activities and
[16:08] efforts of the Tallahassee Fire
[16:09] Department and Emergency Services. Read
[16:12] into the record in front of each and
[16:13] every one of you here today, signed with
[16:15] my signature, John E. daily dated today,
[16:18] September 9th, 2026. Chief, it is truly
[16:21] an honor to present to you and the Talis
[16:23] Fire Department this proclamation. Thank
[16:25] you for all. [applause]
[16:31] So, thank you, Mayor, Commissioners, uh
[16:34] following up on your remarks, 911, this
[16:36] is the 25th year, uh since 911, and let
[16:41] us not forget the great sacrifice that
[16:43] the men and women made on that day. and
[16:46] we ask the public to come out and
[16:47] celebrate uh their efforts with us this
[16:51] Friday at 327 North Adam Street, which
[16:54] is our fire station one at 8:30. Uh it
[16:58] will be a short presentation, a very
[17:00] short walk as well, but we would love
[17:02] for the public to come and be a part of
[17:04] it. I also before I turned the podium
[17:06] over to division chief Anthony Espinosa
[17:09] uh in 1871 was the great Chicago fire
[17:14] and it was became very present that the
[17:17] importance of uniform fire safety
[17:19] standards in this country was necessary.
[17:23] So, fire departments and cities across
[17:27] the country developed uniform standards
[17:30] uh to enhance fire safety in our
[17:33] facilities, in our businesses and also
[17:36] in our homes. So, NFPA started a theme
[17:39] in 1922 and each year they identify a
[17:43] theme and fire departments all across
[17:45] this country, they design campaigns in
[17:48] line with that theme. So now I would
[17:50] like to ask Anthony Espinosa, our newly
[17:53] promoted division chief of fire
[17:55] prevention and fire marshall to come
[17:57] forward to talk about the history, this
[17:59] year's theme and the events we have
[18:01] planned. Thank you ma'am.
[18:05] [applause]
[18:08] » Thank you chief. Uh thank you mayor
[18:10] commission and manager. Um thank you all
[18:13] for recognizing fire prevention week.
[18:14] I'd like to recognize our team, fire
[18:16] prevention team. Captain Terrell Mloud
[18:18] and our inspectors and Captain Robert
[18:20] Clary and our public education team. I
[18:22] work beside these folks every day and
[18:24] it's a it's an honor. So, thank you all.
[18:27] Like Chief had said, since 1922, the
[18:29] NFPA has sponsored the public uh
[18:30] observance of fire prevention week.
[18:32] Three years later, uh President Calvin
[18:34] Kulage proclaimed fire prevention week a
[18:36] national observance. Uh that makes it
[18:38] the longest running public health
[18:41] uh campaign in uh in our country's
[18:44] history. Um public uh fire prevention
[18:47] week is observed each year during the
[18:48] week of October 9th because of the great
[18:50] Chicago fire. That fire resulted in more
[18:52] than 250 people losing their lives,
[18:54] 100,000 people becoming homeless and
[18:56] about 2,000 acres of land that have been
[18:59] burned. Like chief said, each year the
[19:01] NFPA focuses on a new campaign. This
[19:05] year is charge charge in the fire safety
[19:07] uh which focuses on charging habits that
[19:10] can reduce the risk of lithium ion
[19:12] battery fires.
[19:15] Some of the uh helpful tips that we can
[19:18] focus on is making sure that you use a
[19:20] quarter charger that come with your
[19:21] device. When your device is fully
[19:23] charged, unplug it. And uh if you can
[19:26] charge these devices outside as a father
[19:28] of a 14 and 10 year old son, um we've
[19:31] got plenty of these devices at the house
[19:33] and uh it is hard to do outside. And if
[19:35] you can't, make sure you don't block an
[19:36] exit when you're charging.
[19:39] Um more helpful tips can be found at
[19:40] nfpa.org. So, please visit that site.
[19:43] Um, I'd also like to invite everybody uh
[19:45] besides uh the 911 ceremony, we are
[19:48] going to have a touch a truck uh event
[19:49] on October 4th out at Bass Pro uh for
[19:52] during fire prevention week. So, please
[19:54] visit uh us out there. And we're also
[19:56] going to be visiting uh numerous schools
[19:58] um during that week uh to educate the
[20:00] public and and the and the youth out
[20:02] there. So, some of the stuff we got
[20:05] going on. Um, again, the Tallahassy Fire
[20:07] Department uh prevention division is
[20:09] fully committed to educating the public
[20:10] on life safety measures and partnering
[20:11] with the community through our fire
[20:13] prevention practices. Thank you all for
[20:15] allowing us to be here today and
[20:16] recognizing fire prevention week.
[20:19] [applause]
[20:29] Come home.
[21:23] Ladies and gentlemen, it is my honor and
[21:24] privilege to recognize former school
[21:26] board member Maggie Lewis Butler who is
[21:28] here with us today. Maggie, it's
[21:29] [applause] great to see you.
[21:32] Thanks for being here. [applause]
[21:35] And for the next presentation, I would
[21:37] like to invite Miss uh Helage Pina to
[21:40] please come join me, the uh principal of
[21:42] Riley Elementary School. Miss Porcina,
[21:44] it's great to see [applause] you.
[21:53] And all members of your team that are
[21:54] here, please come join us. Bring all
[21:57] your members that are here that would
[21:58] like to come up. That'd be great.
[22:01] Oh, it was dismissal time at school.
[22:03] Okay. But got it. Very important. Very
[22:06] important. Very important. Don't want to
[22:08] make the principal mad. That's for sure.
[22:10] You're
[22:10] » Right.
[22:11] » Great to see you. Thanks for being here
[22:12] with us. Ladies and gentlemen, from the
[22:14] governing body of the city of
[22:15] Tallahassee, a proclamation. Whereas
[22:17] John Gilmore Riley, born into slavery in
[22:20] Leyon County on September 24th, 1857,
[22:23] rose to bea to become a respected
[22:26] educator, entrepreneur, and civic leader
[22:28] whose dedication to education and
[22:30] service helped shape the Tallahassee
[22:32] community. And whereas through his
[22:34] leadership and unwavering belief in the
[22:36] power of education, John G. Riley
[22:38] inspired generations of students and
[22:40] left a legacy that continues to
[22:42] influence our community today. And
[22:44] whereas in 1951, John G. Riley
[22:48] Elementary School was established in his
[22:50] honor, ensuring that his lifelong
[22:52] commitment to learning, leadership, and
[22:54] opportunity would continue to inspire
[22:57] future generations. And whereas for 75
[23:00] years, John G. Riley Elementary School
[23:02] has served as a cornerstone of the
[23:04] community, shaping the lives of students
[23:06] while fostering academic excellence,
[23:09] perseverance, and resilience. And
[23:11] whereas generations of students,
[23:13] educators, families, and community
[23:15] members have contributed to the proud
[23:17] legacy of John G. Riley Elementary
[23:19] School, making it a place where history,
[23:21] tradition, and opportunity come
[23:23] together. Now therefore, I, John Evans
[23:26] Daly, by the authority vested in me as
[23:27] the mayor of the city of Tallahassee, do
[23:30] hereby celebrate and recognize the 75th
[23:33] anniversary of John G. Riley Elementary
[23:36] School and honor the enduring legacy of
[23:38] John Gilmore Riley, whose vision and
[23:40] commitment to education continues to
[23:43] inspire and empower future generations.
[23:46] Signed with my signature, John E.
[23:48] Dailyy, read into the record in front of
[23:50] each and every one of you here today.
[23:52] dated September 9th, 2026.
[23:55] Madam principal, congratulations and
[23:57] thanks for joining [applause] us.
[24:05] » Good afternoon everyone.
[24:06] » Good afternoon.
[24:07] » As I serve as the proud new principal of
[24:11] John G. Elementary School, I want to say
[24:13] thank you to the city of Tallahassee and
[24:16] as well as our mayor uh Daly and Mayor
[24:20] Richardson.
[24:22] Pro Tim. [laughter]
[24:24] Okay. So again, as I began this journey
[24:27] in July, my first task given to me by
[24:31] our teacher, Miss Sheila Barnes
[24:33] Williams, who's been at Riley for many
[24:36] years. She grew up in the elementary.
[24:39] She went to Riley Elementary School and
[24:41] she gave me a call and said, "Your first
[24:43] task is to celebrate the 75th year." It
[24:46] was her dream to do so. And I gladly
[24:49] made this dream come true. So, we will
[24:51] be celebrating um with um our our
[24:54] district on September 24th at 100 p.m.
[24:58] and then with the children on the 25th
[25:01] in a festival form on the 20 24th and
[25:04] then the 25th with the children. So, um
[25:07] if you want to be part of making history
[25:09] at Riley Elementary, I I welcome you to
[25:12] volunteer. You know, let's do the forms
[25:15] first through the leyon countychools.net
[25:17] so we can make sure that our children
[25:19] are safe. But we welcome each and every
[25:21] one of you to be part of history and to
[25:23] make dreams come true at John G. Riley
[25:25] Elementary. So, thank you. [applause]
[26:01] » [laughter]
[26:20] » Ladies and gentlemen, for our final
[26:22] presentation today, it is a distinct
[26:24] honor and privilege to welcome
[26:26] representatives
[26:27] of the Latterday Saints Church here in
[26:28] Tallahassee. Please come forward.
[26:31] President Ben Smith, President Mark
[26:32] Llewellyn, President Landon Mueller,
[26:34] Sister Brooke Beaser, Sister Sarah Zern,
[26:38] uh, Bishop Matt McCryus if he was able
[26:40] to join us, Brother Robert Ivy, Brother
[26:43] Greg Oaks, Brother Charlie Bowen, and
[26:45] Sister Claire Bowen as well, and any
[26:48] other members of the church that are
[26:50] here. And as they're coming forward, I
[26:52] have to tell you that uh I had the
[26:54] opportunity to host them in my office
[26:56] prior to the commission meeting. You
[26:58] know, the church is internationally
[27:00] famous um for their strong foundation u
[27:03] based on family and love and their
[27:06] geneal genealogical um uh assistance
[27:09] that they can provide. And as a surprise
[27:12] to me, they surprised me with the
[27:15] research of my family history. And it is
[27:18] absolutely amazing and I'm still
[27:21] speechless. And before I even begin with
[27:23] the proclamation of why we're here, I
[27:26] personally just want to say thank you
[27:27] again from the bottom of my heart. It it
[27:29] is very very meaningful. Thank you.
[27:34] Ladies and gentlemen, from the governing
[27:35] body of the city of Tallahassee, a
[27:37] proclamation. Whereas we firmly believe
[27:40] that the values of compassion, empathy,
[27:42] and community support are the foundation
[27:44] of a united harmonious society and
[27:46] fosters connections that transcend
[27:48] differences. And whereas the strength
[27:50] and prosperity of our cities, towns, and
[27:53] villages are based in the selflessness
[27:55] of its residents to serve and uplift one
[27:57] another. And whereas we acknowledge the
[28:00] profound impact that can be achieved
[28:02] when we extend a helping hand to our
[28:04] neighbors, especially those of diverse
[28:06] backgrounds in lifting them up and
[28:08] collectively working to improve lives.
[28:10] And whereas we nurture a culture of
[28:12] giving within our cities, emphasizing
[28:14] that volunteerism is not just a duty,
[28:17] but a source of personal fulfillment and
[28:19] community strength. And as we work side
[28:21] by side with and learn from each other,
[28:24] mutual understandings increases.
[28:26] misconceptions can be corrected and new
[28:29] friendships are built. And whereas we
[28:31] urge all citizens to care for one
[28:33] another, volunteer and engage in acts of
[28:36] service and kindness that contribute to
[28:38] our city's betterment and its
[28:39] inhabitants well-being, regardless of
[28:42] background or belief. And whereas the
[28:44] city of Tallahassee has joined a growing
[28:46] list of supporters, including the
[28:48] president of the National League of
[28:49] Cities and hundreds of leaders to date
[28:51] and making a commitment to volunteerism.
[28:54] And now therefore, I, John Evans Daily,
[28:56] by the authority vested in me as the
[28:58] mayor of the city of Tallahassee, do
[29:00] hereby recognize Just Serve in the city
[29:03] of Tallahassee and commits to promoting
[29:05] volunteerism, led leveraging
[29:08] justserve.org to make it easier for
[29:10] residents to find and engage in
[29:13] volunteer activities and will regularly
[29:15] acknowledge and celebrate the
[29:17] contribution of volunteers. Ladies and
[29:19] gentlemen, read into the record in front
[29:21] of each and every one of you here today,
[29:23] signed with my signature, John E.
[29:25] Dailyaly, dated September 9th, 2026.
[29:28] Please join me in recognizing the
[29:30] church. [applause]
[29:41] Mayor Daly, commissioners, neighbors,
[29:43] and friends, it's a distinct privilege
[29:46] to be with you today and recognize all
[29:48] of the good that happens in Tallahassee.
[29:50] We are grateful for this distinction of
[29:52] Tallahassee being recognized as a just
[29:55] serve city. A place where we can come,
[29:59] we can serve, we can lift up one
[30:01] another. we can bring our talents, our
[30:03] means, our skills, our time, help lift
[30:07] others and make others better in what we
[30:10] do. So, Mayor Daly, we're grateful for
[30:12] this. We're grateful for the opportunity
[30:13] to recognize just serve in Tallahassee.
[30:15] Justsserve.org
[30:17] contains many opportunities to go forth
[30:19] in the community, serve, and to lift
[30:22] others. Thank you so much.
[30:23] » Thank you. Thank you. It's absolutely
[30:26] gorgeous.
[30:28] Thank you so [applause] much.
[31:40] So ladies and gentlemen, I was telling
[31:41] my colleagues while we were taking the
[31:43] picture what an honor it is to be named
[31:45] a just served community. Out of roughly
[31:48] 19,500
[31:50] communities just in the United States
[31:52] alone, there are only a couple of
[31:55] hundred cities and only a handful in the
[31:58] state of Florida that are recognized as
[32:00] just served communities and we are one
[32:02] of them. So, it is a distinct honor and
[32:04] a privilege to be recognized and we
[32:06] appreciate everyone for coming today to
[32:09] help us celebrate.
[32:11] » Mr. Manager, do we have any
[32:12] announcements to come before the city
[32:14] commission at this time?
[32:15] » No, sir. Do we have any appearances by
[32:16] other governing boards or agencies or
[32:19] governments?
[32:20] » No, sir.
[32:21] » All right. We are on the consent agenda.
[32:23] Mr. Clerk, do we have any public comment
[32:25] on any of the consent items?
[32:27] » Uh, no, sir. Only on the item that was
[32:29] pulled.
[32:30] » Okay. Item that was pulled was
[32:32] previously 8.01. We will take it up as
[32:34] 9.01 in just a second. Colleagues, is
[32:37] there direction on the rest of consent?
[32:39] » Move forward.
[32:39] » Approval. Second.
[32:40] » Second. Mayor Pro Tim has properly moved
[32:42] the consent agenda seconded by
[32:44] Commissioner Williams Cox. Any further
[32:45] discussion? Seeing none, all those in
[32:47] favor signify by saying I.
[32:49] » All those opposed. Passes unanimously.
[32:52] 50. We are on item number 9.01,
[32:55] previously 8.01. Mr. Manager.
[32:59] » Mr. Mayor, this uh seeks the
[33:01] commission's approval for the calendar
[33:03] year 2027 city commission meeting
[33:06] schedule. The schedule the schedule as
[33:09] proposed and attached to your agenda
[33:11] includes one annual retreat as typical
[33:15] 12 regular meetings and three workshops
[33:18] for a total of 16 meetings in 2027.
[33:22] » All right. Uh Commissioner Porter Hold
[33:26] on just a second. Mr. Clerk, do we have
[33:28] public comment on this item?
[33:28] » We do have one speaker on the item.
[33:30] Mayor.
[33:30] » Hi. Uh, Commissioner Porter, do you want
[33:32] to do a quick introduction of why you
[33:34] pulled it and then we'll go to public
[33:35] comment or do you want to just go
[33:36] straight to public comment?
[33:38] » I'll be quick.
[33:39] » Okay.
[33:40] » I pulled it because I want to vote
[33:41] against it. I don't think that one
[33:43] meeting a month, 12 meetings is enough.
[33:46] I think we've we've suffered as a
[33:48] result, especially with the fact that we
[33:50] have limited public comment uh during
[33:53] non-aggenda items. So, that's why I
[33:55] pulled it. I know the city manager said
[33:57] as typical, but it's not what has been
[33:59] typical. We have slowly cut meetings
[34:02] over the years and we took this action a
[34:04] couple years ago, but I just want the
[34:06] public to know it's not necessarily
[34:08] what's typical for the city of
[34:09] Tallahassee.
[34:10] » Okay. So, Commissioner Porter, we will
[34:12] take public comment. When we're done
[34:13] with public comment, I will come back to
[34:15] you for a motion. Why don't you give it
[34:17] some thought of what you think is
[34:18] appropriate and uh we'll go from there.
[34:21] » Public comment, Mr. Clerk.
[34:23] » Thank you, Mayor. We have one speaker on
[34:24] the item, Stanley Sims as our first
[34:27] speaker. He already knows, but for
[34:28] everybody else in the audience, he'll
[34:30] have three minutes for remarks and he'll
[34:32] have a light that turns yellow in front
[34:34] of the mayor at 30 seconds, as well as a
[34:36] reminder from me. Thank you.
[34:38] » My name is Stanley Sims. I'm at 1320
[34:41] Barack Obama way.
[34:45] The ability,
[34:47] the opportunity
[34:50] to communicate with your local
[34:52] government
[34:55] is indeed
[34:58] a treasure.
[35:03] Now, some in America was born with this
[35:05] treasure.
[35:09] Some in America are in certain positions
[35:13] that they don't even need an appointment
[35:15] to meet with
[35:18] their elected officials.
[35:25] But I thank God today that there is
[35:29] something called the Constitution.
[35:34] We
[35:36] we
[35:39] the people
[35:41] that affords us,
[35:46] white, black, rich,
[35:51] or even poor like me,
[35:55] a chance and an opportunity
[35:59] to communicate with their government.
[36:05] And so what we have done today or about
[36:08] to do today is limit
[36:12] those opportunities.
[36:16] And we ask ourselves why people don't
[36:18] vote.
[36:22] We ask ourselves
[36:26] why people walk away with negative
[36:29] outlooks of government.
[36:34] I heard something from you, Commissioner
[36:36] Cox, that just rocked my spirit during
[36:39] the debate
[36:42] at the NEBA.
[36:44] The question was,
[36:48] and I'm summarizing in case Steve is in
[36:51] the audience and may sue me.
[36:55] The question was, "What is the greatest
[36:58] calamity that you think is at city
[37:02] hall?"
[37:06] Your response to that question was, "You
[37:09] didn't think
[37:11] » Local government
[37:13] understood.
[37:15] You didn't think people understood local
[37:18] how local government work."
[37:22] Limited
[37:24] There are opportunities to converse
[37:28] is not a productive step in the right
[37:30] direction.
[37:36] » No other speakers on the
[37:37] » Have no speaker. All right. So,
[37:39] Commissioner Porter, I will come to you.
[37:41] I actually agree that with a new
[37:43] commission, the need to meet and to
[37:46] educate and to familiarize is a very
[37:49] important thing. So, would you care to
[37:52] make a motion to amend this uh proposed
[37:57] schedule?
[37:58] » Sure. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I would like
[38:00] I would um move that we adopt the 20 27
[38:05] city commission meeting schedule um but
[38:08] with two meetings a month as
[38:11] » With two meetings a month. I mean,
[38:12] including our our July break, but
[38:17] with the frequency we met before we made
[38:19] these changes.
[38:20] » Does the uh schedule need to come back
[38:22] in a formal manner or are you just
[38:23] comfortable with having it, you know,
[38:25] letting staff figure out the two
[38:27] meetings a month and then emailing the
[38:28] schedule back out?
[38:30] » I think it can just come back to us on
[38:32] consent
[38:33] » At the next meeting.
[38:35] » All right. So, the motion on the table
[38:36] is to move from one meeting a month to
[38:38] two meetings a month. Uh still observing
[38:41] the summer recess and for it to come
[38:43] back on consent for next uh meeting.
[38:47] Second to the motion.
[38:49] » Second.
[38:50] » All right. Seconded by Commissioner
[38:51] Malow. Any further comment?
[38:53] » See none. All those in favor signify by
[38:55] saying I. I.
[38:56] » All those opposed. Passes unanimously.
[38:58] All right. We are on
[39:00] » Item number 10.01, the approval of the
[39:04] city manager employment agreement with
[39:06] the mayor and city commission. Uh
[39:08] colleagues, I will be presenting this
[39:11] item and then we will have public
[39:14] comment.
[39:15] Then we will enter in a discussion and
[39:18] we will see where it goes from there.
[39:20] Give me two seconds to get set up.
[39:32] Excellent. Okay, let me provide some
[39:34] background. On April 28th, as you
[39:37] recall, our city manager, Reese Go,
[39:39] announced his retirement as the city
[39:42] manager for the city of Tallahassee,
[39:43] which started the process of a national
[39:46] search for a new city manager. Uh, we
[39:49] hired an incredible consulting company
[39:51] that went through the process of
[39:53] advertising nationally, bringing in all
[39:55] the applications, doing the first vet of
[39:58] applications, and bringing us three uh
[40:01] potential candidates for full interview.
[40:03] We then each individually had the
[40:05] opportunity to sit down with those
[40:07] candidates and then the next day last
[40:10] Wednesday we had the opportunity to do a
[40:13] full interview and listen to the
[40:14] presentations of the top three
[40:16] candidates. All three candidates I think
[40:18] uh did a wonderful job and I think once
[40:20] again you will agree that uh we
[40:22] congratulate them all on putting their
[40:24] best foot forward on why they wanted to
[40:26] serve the city of Tallahassee as city
[40:28] manager. As a commission though, we
[40:31] decided to move forward to make an offer
[40:33] to Dr. Karen Jumville to be the next
[40:35] city manager of the city of Tallahassee
[40:37] where then I was given the direction as
[40:39] the mayor of Tallahassee to negotiate
[40:41] the contract. From there, let me tell
[40:43] you that as soon as we left the meeting,
[40:46] I immediately went and sat down with the
[40:48] director of human resources for the city
[40:49] of Tallahassee to discuss the contract
[40:52] negotiation to discuss what are the
[40:54] terms that we need to discuss moving
[40:56] forward to agree upon and what are some
[40:58] of the guidelines. From leaving the
[41:00] director of HR, I went directly to Lou
[41:02] Norll who is the acting city attorney. I
[41:05] asked him the same questions to provide
[41:07] his professional guidance and to provide
[41:09] his uh input on how the process should
[41:13] work and I greatly appreciate both of
[41:15] them. Over the course of the past week,
[41:17] I have been working with Dr. Jumville to
[41:19] come to an agreement on the proposed
[41:21] contract. As of yesterday, we have a
[41:24] verbal agreement that I will walk
[41:25] through in just a second. Once I had
[41:28] that verbal agreement, I immediately
[41:30] went back to the director of human
[41:32] resources, told her of the verbal
[41:34] agreement that we have and outlined the
[41:36] bullet points uh that were to be placed
[41:38] into the contract. I also had a chance
[41:40] to sit down with the city attorney, Amy
[41:42] Toman, allow her to know where we were
[41:45] with the agreement between Dr.
[41:46] Jumanville and myself. And then once uh
[41:50] then I believe the director of HR also
[41:53] got with uh Amy uh Toman, the city
[41:56] attorney. Once they signed off on it, it
[41:58] went to the city manager who then placed
[42:00] it on the agenda for public notice. As
[42:03] we know, I do not have the power to hire
[42:05] and fire myself, but I bring it back for
[42:07] full ratification. I will walk you
[42:10] through the contract, but let me explain
[42:11] the process. The contract is a verbal
[42:14] agreement between Dr. Gentlemenville and
[42:16] myself as mayor but myself I do not
[42:18] carry the weight. It's the ratification
[42:20] of the board. If we do not like the
[42:22] contract and reject the contract as
[42:24] presented then we can do one of two
[42:26] things. Normally as it was explained to
[42:29] me is we go back to the drawing board.
[42:30] You provide direction of negotiation
[42:34] points whether it's salary or or
[42:36] whatever it may be and then we see if we
[42:38] can come to an agreement and then I
[42:39] bring it back for ratification. But do
[42:42] we not necessarily take a vote to amend
[42:44] the contract? Or I guess we could um and
[42:48] then go back and negotiate as well.
[42:50] Correct.
[42:50] » I think we could do that, but it would
[42:52] then it would have to go back to Dr.
[42:53] Jumanville for approval, of course.
[42:55] » Sure. Of course. So, the contract that
[42:58] was uh that was used is our standard
[43:01] contract for appointed officials. And
[43:03] again, I want to thank the director of
[43:04] human resources and the city attorney's
[43:06] office for walking me through. The major
[43:09] points that I want to cover is number
[43:10] one, the start date. Ree, I want to
[43:14] publicly thank you once again for
[43:16] agreeing to stay on as the city manager
[43:18] through September 30th and serving as a
[43:20] city manager to get us through this
[43:22] budget cycle. The proposed start date
[43:24] that was agreed upon is October 1st,
[43:27] which also happens to be the beginning
[43:28] of the fiscal year. It is a clean start.
[43:31] Ree will take us through this budget
[43:33] cycle. Karen will start as city manager
[43:35] on October 1. that has been agreed upon.
[43:38] The starting salary is posted at
[43:41] $317,000.
[43:43] And where $317,000
[43:46] comes from is exactly where the position
[43:49] of city manager of what Rese would be
[43:52] making on October 1. Not a penny more,
[43:55] not a penny less, is the exact same
[43:58] amount. Now, I'm sure there's questions
[43:59] on why, how much, the whole nine yards.
[44:03] And I know that director of human
[44:04] resources is here and fully prepared to
[44:07] talk about where that falls within the
[44:09] professional standard of a city our size
[44:12] of a manager uh that runs all of the
[44:16] utilities. So I know that you're
[44:17] prepared if those questions come up, but
[44:19] is it fair to say that we are nowhere
[44:22] near the top of that professional
[44:24] standard? In fact, we are still in the
[44:27] lower tier, but it is the salary that
[44:29] has been agreed upon with Dr. Jumanville
[44:32] and myself to bring forward before the
[44:34] city commission.
[44:35] Obviously, uh, pretty standard 20 weeks
[44:38] of severance pay as authorized by
[44:39] section 215.425
[44:41] of Florida statutes. She has a, uh, 457
[44:46] retirement account with the city of
[44:49] Tallahassee. There was the question of
[44:52] whether she wanted a car allowance or to
[44:55] be able to drive one of the fleet cars
[44:58] of her choice. I appreciate the fact
[45:00] that she has chosen the route to go with
[45:03] a car allowance. If she went the route
[45:05] with the fleet, the city would be on the
[45:07] hook for car insurance, for fuel, for
[45:10] maintenance of that vehicle by going the
[45:13] route of a car allowance at $1,000 a
[45:15] month. Then that is her responsibility
[45:19] for insurance, for fuel, and for
[45:21] maintenance. But she gets to choose what
[45:23] vehicle she would want to drive versus
[45:25] what is in fleet. Finally, I want to
[45:28] discuss the termination provision in the
[45:30] city manager's contract. It requires an
[45:33] affirmative vote of twothirds majority
[45:35] of the city commission, not a simple
[45:37] majority of the city commission. This is
[45:40] something that I personally will take
[45:42] full ownership of and I strongly believe
[45:44] in. I think it depoliticizes the
[45:47] position of the of the city manager. I
[45:50] think it is needed. I have stood on this
[45:52] position for many many many years. When
[45:55] I served as the chairman of the county
[45:57] commission when Vince Long was hired, I
[46:00] led the charge then to change the county
[46:02] charter to make sure that it was
[46:04] included. And to this day, the
[46:07] termination procedure for the county
[46:09] administrator of Lyon County is a
[46:11] supermajority provision as well. Even to
[46:14] the point to where a couple of years ago
[46:16] when we changed the position and there
[46:18] is precedent here at the city commission
[46:20] when we changed the position of
[46:22] inspector general we put the termination
[46:25] language into the contract requiring a
[46:28] twothirds termination if we decided to
[46:31] separate with Dennis Sutton or whoever
[46:33] holds that position. It was then later
[46:37] added into the city charter. If you
[46:39] recall, I voted against that measure
[46:42] because I stated for the record at the
[46:44] time, and I still believe so today, that
[46:47] all four appointed officials should have
[46:50] a 2/3 majority in their contract for
[46:54] termination, and I still feel strongly
[46:56] about that. So, annual salary of
[47:00] $317,000,
[47:02] 20 weeks of severance pay, $1,000
[47:04] monthly automobile allowance, the city
[47:07] contribution to a 457 retirement
[47:09] account, the termination provision
[47:11] language of a supermajority, and the
[47:14] contract date starting on October 1 and
[47:17] ending on September 30th, 2031 to be
[47:19] ratified by the next commission. It is a
[47:21] five-year contract. That is pretty
[47:23] standard of what we provide as well.
[47:26] Those are the major bullet provisions.
[47:28] If I missed anything, I apologize. I am
[47:31] available for any questions on the
[47:33] points of the contract as proposed.
[47:36] Ultimately, it is the decision of this
[47:38] body to ratify it and whether we move
[47:40] forward in signature with Dr. Gmanville.
[47:43] I know we have public comment on this
[47:45] item. Are there any quick just questions
[47:48] of clarification before I go to public
[47:50] comment? All right, let's go to public
[47:53] comment. How many speakers do we have,
[47:54] Mr. Clerk? Mayor, we've got about 10 or
[47:56] 11 speakers on the item.
[47:57] » Sounds great.
[47:58] » The first speaker is Marcia Rule,
[48:01] followed by Ernie Payne.
[48:03] » Great.
[48:03] » As with Mr. Sims in our earlier
[48:05] comments, you'll have three minutes for
[48:06] your remarks.
[48:07] » Your name and address for the record,
[48:08] please.
[48:09] » Marshia Rule, live in Myers Park. Uh,
[48:12] three things. First, this is premature.
[48:14] There's no reason this has to be filled
[48:16] right away. Uh, mayor, you said you
[48:18] wanted to depoliticize this process. The
[48:20] way to do that is wait until after the
[48:22] election. Second, the expense uh out of
[48:26] line for cities of our size. We're not
[48:28] Tampa. And uh this is exactly the reason
[48:31] why so many of my neighbors are planning
[48:33] to vote three on vote yes on amendment
[48:36] three. I think it's misguided to do so,
[48:39] but this is exactly what people are
[48:41] rebelling against. And finally,
[48:43] regarding the twothirds majority, not
[48:45] only should the commission reject it,
[48:47] but so should the candidate. If a
[48:49] candidate cannot manage to keep three
[48:51] out of five commissioners satisfied that
[48:54] he or she is doing a good job, they
[48:56] should resign. They shouldn't wait to be
[48:57] fired. Thank you.
[48:59] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[49:01] » Ernie Payne is next, followed by Cotton
[49:04] Taylor.
[49:05] » All right. Your name and address for the
[49:07] record, please.
[49:09] » Ernie Payne, uh, 2006 East Indian Head
[49:12] Drive.
[49:14] Two years ago, this body considered a
[49:17] proposal for submitting a charter
[49:19] amendment to the ballot for the creation
[49:20] of the office of inspector general.
[49:23] The most significant part of that
[49:25] amendment according to the inspector
[49:26] general himself in response to a
[49:29] question by commissioner Williams Cox
[49:31] was in order to strengthen the was the
[49:34] requirement for a supermajority vote for
[49:36] removal from office in order to
[49:38] strengthen the necessary independence of
[49:40] that office.
[49:41] It was stated very clearly at that time
[49:44] that a charter amendment was required in
[49:46] order to change the charter language of
[49:49] serving at the pleasure of the city
[49:50] commission to serving to requiring a
[49:53] twothirds vote for removal. This was the
[49:56] same language that the charter used at
[49:57] that time for the city auditor, the
[49:59] treasurer clerk, and the city manager to
[50:02] define the employment terms of their
[50:04] offices.
[50:06] The proposal to send the charter
[50:07] amendment to the ballot was passed by an
[50:09] unusual 4 to1 vote [laughter] and the
[50:12] charter amendment was passed overwhelm
[50:14] overwhelmingly by the voters. The sole
[50:17] desenter among you was the mayor who
[50:20] stated that he opposed the ballot
[50:22] initiative because it was a massive
[50:23] change that should not be done in such a
[50:25] rush manner and there wasn't time to
[50:28] consider such a proposal before it went
[50:29] to the ballot. These words were spoken
[50:32] on April 24th, 2024, 6 months prior to
[50:36] the election.
[50:38] Now, just one week after the new city
[50:41] manager was appointed and the mayor made
[50:44] clear that he would be ne negotiating
[50:45] the employment contract, this contract
[50:48] was posted for public viewing just 24
[50:50] hours ago,
[50:52] providing for removal by a twothirds
[50:54] vote. Also, following the links to the
[50:58] city charter posted on the Talgov
[51:00] website, the language that was in the
[51:02] charter two years ago that the city
[51:03] manager serves at the pleasure of the
[51:05] city commission has been removed.
[51:08] Although there has been no intervening
[51:10] charter amendment,
[51:12] the legality of this is at best
[51:14] questionable, although having been given
[51:16] less than 24 hours to research this,
[51:19] even a qualified attorney, which I am
[51:21] not, would be hardressed to answer.
[51:24] Please delay approval of the employment
[51:26] contract. If this moves forward today in
[51:29] this form, you are not only degrading
[51:31] the public trust of the people of
[51:33] Tallahassee, you would also be doing a
[51:36] disservice to your new city manager who
[51:38] will be entering her new office under a
[51:40] cloud.
[51:42] » A cloud of your own creation
[51:45] for no conceivable purpose other than to
[51:47] politicize an office that the charter
[51:50] explicitly defines as non-political.
[51:53] Thank you.
[51:54] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[51:56] » Next speaker is Cotton Taylor.
[52:00] » Cotton Taylor. And then Yuri Gotchaw.
[52:03] » Your name and address for the record,
[52:05] please.
[52:07] » Yeah. My name is actually Coulson
[52:08] Taylor. I live at 631 East Call Street.
[52:11] » Apologies,
[52:11] » I guess. Uh yeah. Okay. Um so, like you
[52:15] said, I think you you said that it's
[52:17] going to be non it's non-political that
[52:19] the 4 to1 vote that that's why you put
[52:20] it in there. actually think it's very
[52:22] bad faith and actually very political on
[52:24] your part. Um [clears throat]
[52:26] I think that the charter says or at
[52:28] least from what I read is said that the
[52:30] city city manager should serve at the
[52:32] pleasure of the uh city commission and
[52:34] it seems like to me that that al that it
[52:36] implies a simple majority. Um so I'd
[52:38] like to see it keep like to see it kept
[52:40] that way as a show of good faith to the
[52:42] city of Tallahassee to the rest of the
[52:43] commissioners. Um so yeah, thank you
[52:45] very much. Our next speaker, please.
[52:48] » Yuri Gotch, followed by Sha Thomas.
[52:53] » Your name and address for the record,
[52:55] please.
[52:56] » Hello, my name is Uri Gotchock. Uh, the
[52:58] address is 218 Broward Street. Um, so I
[53:02] would like to first uh start by
[53:03] addressing you, Mr. Mayor. um in your
[53:06] discuss of the time that it took to
[53:08] pursue this candidate, at no point did
[53:11] you mention when you were taking input
[53:13] from the public. As somebody who is a
[53:15] member of Tallahassy's society or uh
[53:18] population, I feel very rushed and I
[53:20] felt like I did not get the opportunity
[53:22] to voice my opinion to say what I felt
[53:25] like the direction of the city and to
[53:26] make sure that that was going to be
[53:28] represented by the candidates. That
[53:30] includes go showing up to the event that
[53:32] happened last week which was posted one
[53:35] day before. It seems to be there's a
[53:36] long history of that. Now I wanted to
[53:39] come on and talk to this. I was going to
[53:40] ask you first of all whether or not you
[53:42] felt like you are not representing or
[53:45] you you no longer need the to represent
[53:47] the citizens of the of the public or the
[53:49] the opinions of the public. Whether or
[53:51] not you felt like you needed to listen
[53:53] to them and gather their input since you
[53:54] were not running for reelection. I would
[53:56] ask your your co- counselors if they
[54:00] would be able to stand on approving a
[54:04] contract with fewer votes than it would
[54:07] to eliminate that. That is, I think, the
[54:09] crux and the most important thing is
[54:11] that the reality is that given from what
[54:14] has happened from previous meetings,
[54:16] this it passes is going to pass with a
[54:18] 23 majority. And the reality is that it
[54:21] is a terrible policy to allow a lower
[54:25] burden of proof, a burden of a consent
[54:28] to approve a contract than to reject it.
[54:30] And that handicaps my ability as well as
[54:34] my fellow citizens ability to speak and
[54:38] see some level of repercussion if you
[54:41] guys make a decision that we don't agree
[54:43] with. So I ask very specifically about
[54:46] the requirement for the twothirds
[54:48] majority that you do not approve any
[54:51] contract that has that level of barrier
[54:54] where the barrier to approve it is lower
[54:56] than the barrier to undo it later on
[54:59] because you have handicapped the ability
[55:01] for myself as well as possible future
[55:05] city commissions. One that you will not
[55:06] be a member of and their ability to
[55:10] speak and rule on that. And because of
[55:12] that, I ask that you, if nothing else,
[55:15] strike that, but preferably take longer
[55:18] and provide opportunity for myself to
[55:21] show up to a meeting and actually meet
[55:23] the candidates. Because the reality is
[55:25] when I showed up to that meeting last
[55:26] week, I was in a situation where I felt
[55:28] like I was competing for the time. When
[55:30] I was having a conversation with your
[55:32] candidate, I was actually interrupted
[55:34] and told I had enough time by Mr. Sims
[55:37] because we were all trying to get some
[55:39] time in with the possible chief
[55:42] executive of our city. Thank you for
[55:44] your time.
[55:45] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please
[55:48] Thomas
[55:49] and then Mark Chandler.
[55:59] » Your name and address for the record,
[56:00] please.
[56:01] » John Thomas, 2113 Joiner Drive. Good
[56:04] evening, mayor and commissioners. I'm
[56:06] here to urge you to reconsider the
[56:08] proposed 3 thou 317,000
[56:11] annual salary and contract terms for the
[56:14] city manager. Let's be clear, this is
[56:16] not just a personal decision made by the
[56:18] mayor. It's a major financial and
[56:20] governance decision that could blind and
[56:23] bind Tallahassee for years. Residents
[56:26] deserve more than a lastm minute
[56:28] presentation of a contract with a
[56:30] five-year term severance, extra
[56:33] allowance, automatic renewals, and a
[56:35] provision requiring four or five four
[56:37] out of five commissioners to remove the
[56:39] city manager. Mayor Daly, if this
[56:42] proposal is truly the best interest of
[56:44] Tallahassee, then it should have been
[56:45] able to withstand full public scrutiny,
[56:48] not be rushed through under the radar,
[56:50] or presented as if the public should
[56:52] simply accept it. You would have done it
[56:54] your first term, not while you were not
[56:56] running for reelection if it was that
[56:58] important. The question is not whether
[57:00] the city manager's job matters. It does.
[57:03] The question is whether her pay should
[57:05] be that high. More than five 1.5 million
[57:09] in base pay over 5 years is the right
[57:11] priority when working families are
[57:13] concerned about affordability. when
[57:15] residents expect safe streets and
[57:17] reliable infrastructure and when city
[57:19] employees serving the public everyday
[57:21] need support and need support and
[57:24] competitive wages. This is not about
[57:27] only salary. It's about accountability.
[57:30] Under this proposed agreement, a future
[57:32] commission could have a 3-2 majority, an
[57:35] ordinary majority of an elected body and
[57:37] still be unable to remove the city
[57:40] manager. Four commissioners would have
[57:42] to agree. This is a serious restriction
[57:45] on the authority voters give their
[57:46] elected representatives. Mayor Daly and
[57:49] this commission should not use the final
[57:51] months of an outgoing political era to
[57:54] make it harder for future elected
[57:55] leaders to respond to the people of
[57:57] Tallahassee.
[57:59] If this contract is fair and necessary
[58:01] as it supports claims, then remove the
[58:04] four the four sorry four vote firing
[58:07] requirement, shorten the initial term,
[58:10] publish meaningful performance
[58:12] benchmarks and let a majority- elected
[58:14] commission retain the authority to make
[58:15] leadership changes. Tallassi deserves
[58:18] the transparency, accountability, and
[58:21] leadership that does not treat public
[58:22] trust like a procedure
[58:25] like an obstacle obstacle. Thank you.
[58:29] Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[58:30] » Mark Chandler is our next speaker,
[58:33] followed by Dot Enman Johnson.
[58:41] » Your name and address for the record,
[58:42] please.
[58:43] » My name is Mark Chandler. I live at 214
[58:45] West 4th Avenue.
[58:48] » So, one of the things that jumped out at
[58:49] me proposed contract was the thousand a
[58:52] month automobile allowance. According to
[58:55] the contract, the automobile allowance
[58:57] is quote intended to compensate the
[58:59] employee for use of her personal vehicle
[59:02] in connection with the performance of
[59:04] the employees work and other related
[59:07] employment duties.
[59:09] So, I'm not actually here to tell you
[59:11] that this needs to change or be stripped
[59:12] out of the contract, but I am here to
[59:14] ask you to just take a moment to
[59:16] consider
[59:19] that what this says about our built
[59:21] environment.
[59:23] Look, I think it's important for our
[59:24] city manager to get around town quickly
[59:26] and efficiently. Consider a scenario
[59:28] where she's got a meeting on campus and
[59:30] then a ribbon cutting ceremony across
[59:32] town and it's got to get back to
[59:34] downtown to the office. How's she going
[59:36] to do that?
[59:38] Well, she's going to drive. It's the
[59:40] obvious answer. It's obvious that she's
[59:44] not going to rent a scooter. Scooters
[59:46] aren't allowed on campus, clean plaza,
[59:49] or anywhere outside of a select
[59:50] centralized boundary. It's obvious to me
[59:53] that she's not going to take a bike
[59:56] while there may be painted bike lanes
[59:58] between all those destinations.
[1:00:01] She probably wouldn't feel comfortable
[1:00:02] riding that close to traffic.
[1:00:05] I doubt she would take Star Metro
[1:00:07] because the next bus doesn't come for
[1:00:10] almost an hour. and the city commission
[1:00:13] meeting that night. What if it lasts
[1:00:14] past 7 o'clock? I don't think the night
[1:00:17] bus takes her anywhere near her house
[1:00:18] probably.
[1:00:20] So, I would ask you to consider that
[1:00:23] we've effectively already made the
[1:00:25] decisions where $1,000 a month
[1:00:27] automobile allowance for the city
[1:00:29] manager is sadly the only obvious
[1:00:32] choice.
[1:00:35] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please. Our
[1:00:38] next speaker is Don Mcman Johnson who
[1:00:40] will be followed by Tiffany Hill.
[1:00:45] » Your name and address for the record,
[1:00:47] please.
[1:00:51] » Don Edinman Johnson, 2121 Trescott
[1:00:54] Drive.
[1:00:56] I congratulate the newly appointed city
[1:00:59] manager for her many years of excellent
[1:01:02] service to the city of Tallahassee.
[1:01:06] However, I strongly disagree with the
[1:01:10] rushed and flawed process that resulted
[1:01:14] in her appointment.
[1:01:17] I further oppose the language in her
[1:01:20] contract requiring a supermajority vote
[1:01:25] to hold her accountable to her contract.
[1:01:30] The only appointed official to date
[1:01:35] with that distinction
[1:01:37] is the inspector general and it required
[1:01:42] a ballot initiative and a vote by the
[1:01:46] public to make that possible.
[1:01:50] To date, there has been no change in the
[1:01:54] city charter that would allow that to be
[1:01:59] extended to the other three appointed
[1:02:03] officials.
[1:02:05] Further,
[1:02:07] the city manager contracts throughout
[1:02:11] Florida
[1:02:13] are at will employees
[1:02:16] requiring only a majority vote to hire
[1:02:21] and terminate.
[1:02:24] I question whether the contract complies
[1:02:28] with the Tallahassee
[1:02:30] city charter.
[1:02:33] This city
[1:02:35] has voted on numerous
[1:02:39] important issues facing the public and
[1:02:43] it only required to this date a majority
[1:02:48] vote of the city commission. It required
[1:02:52] only a majority vote to put her in
[1:02:56] office
[1:02:58] and it should require only a majority
[1:03:02] vote if there is a reason for a
[1:03:06] termination. Thank you.
[1:03:08] » Our next speaker, please.
[1:03:10] » Tiffany Hill is next and then Stanley
[1:03:12] Sims.
[1:03:23] your name and address for the record,
[1:03:25] please.
[1:03:25] » Hi, I am Dr. Tiffany Hill, um 1401 Lola
[1:03:29] Drive. Uh I'm standing before you today
[1:03:33] um to voice my strong opposition to the
[1:03:36] proposed employment agreement for our
[1:03:39] new city manager. Um while I'm going to
[1:03:42] respect um your selection process, um
[1:03:46] the contract before us is fiscally
[1:03:48] irresponsible and lacks the necessary
[1:03:51] safeguards to protect taxpayers of this
[1:03:54] city. First, let's talk about the
[1:03:56] salary. A base of 317,000
[1:04:00] is an incredibly high starting point.
[1:04:03] When we look at this figure, we have to
[1:04:06] ask does it include adjustments for
[1:04:08] rising cost of living and um that our
[1:04:12] residents are struggling
[1:04:15] and that our own re residents are
[1:04:17] struggling with. If this salary is being
[1:04:20] set in a vacuum without a clear
[1:04:22] transparent link to current economic
[1:04:24] realities and the performance
[1:04:26] benchmarks, we are doing a disservice to
[1:04:28] the public. So furthermore, I am deeply
[1:04:32] concerned by the inclusion of the
[1:04:35] thousand monthly automobile allowance.
[1:04:39] If you have a fleet on your property,
[1:04:42] um, and I'm sure, you know, with me
[1:04:44] being an outreach specialist that work
[1:04:46] for the federal government, rather I
[1:04:49] drove that car, not insurance, is
[1:04:51] actually going to be paid regardless.
[1:04:54] So, I don't see why a thousand monthly
[1:04:57] allowance is going to be allowed for
[1:04:59] somebody to drive their own vehicle.
[1:05:02] That is a lot considering that this
[1:05:05] person is already making um more than
[1:05:08] what um the current city manager and a
[1:05:12] lot of other city managers in the state
[1:05:15] of Florida are making. Perhaps most
[1:05:18] alarming, however, is the structure of
[1:05:20] this contract regarding accountability.
[1:05:23] We being asked to approve. You all are
[1:05:25] being asked to approve a five-year term
[1:05:28] that requires a twothird supermajority
[1:05:31] vote just to dismiss the city manager.
[1:05:34] By setting a such a high bar for
[1:05:36] termination, we are effectively
[1:05:39] stripping this comm that commission your
[1:05:42] commission of its ability to hold the
[1:05:45] city manager accountable.
[1:05:47] Finally, there is no mention of a
[1:05:49] probationary period. As a previous
[1:05:53] federal employee, we've always had at
[1:05:56] least a year probationary period because
[1:05:59] just because someone,
[1:06:01] » You're at 30 seconds
[1:06:02] » Worked in the city does not mean that
[1:06:04] they are capable of doing the job. So,
[1:06:07] you don't want to lock yourselves into
[1:06:11] um a contract that you cannot get out if
[1:06:13] this person is not performing. So
[1:06:16] therefore, I really would appreciate you
[1:06:19] all listening to the public at this time
[1:06:23] and tableabling it and taking it back to
[1:06:26] HR to reorganize this contract.
[1:06:29] » You're at three minutes.
[1:06:30] » Thank you.
[1:06:31] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please
[1:06:33] » Stanley Sims and then Jordan Strickland.
[1:06:36] And we have two more speakers following
[1:06:37] that. We've had a couple added.
[1:06:38] » Okay. Your name and address for the
[1:06:40] record, please.
[1:06:40] » Stanley Sims, still hanging out at
[1:06:42] Barack Obama way.
[1:06:49] First off, let me say um you know this
[1:06:54] Reese Well, this won't be our last time.
[1:06:57] We I'll see you October 5th down at
[1:07:00] Federal Building,
[1:07:03] but
[1:07:06] I had a conversation with two of your
[1:07:08] colleagues during the meet and greet.
[1:07:12] I walked I'm not going to give their
[1:07:14] names. I walked up to him and I said, "I
[1:07:17] bet you it really surprised you when I
[1:07:21] supported the pick of Karen."
[1:07:24] Little other stuff was said, but keep it
[1:07:27] there. [clears throat]
[1:07:28] He told me, he said, "In 10 years, I
[1:07:31] have expected the unexpected from you.
[1:07:38] Whatever I do, I stand on it publicly. I
[1:07:42] sign my name to it.
[1:07:46] I got calls. First, Mr. Mel, I had to
[1:07:50] let Miss Ernestine know that you weren't
[1:07:52] the mayor yet cuz she was upset cuz she
[1:07:55] said, "You told me change. This ain't no
[1:07:57] change."
[1:08:01] But I just don't understand, Mr. Mayor
[1:08:03] was after we all speak and if you'll
[1:08:06] write a note, how come the city manager
[1:08:09] gets the entitlement of the base salary
[1:08:12] of the person that she's feeling? Cuz my
[1:08:15] wife didn't get that when she was hired.
[1:08:19] I didn't get that. I didn't find out who
[1:08:22] was before me and how much they were
[1:08:24] paying. The city actually told me, "We
[1:08:27] can, even though you overqualify, we can
[1:08:30] only give you 10%."
[1:08:36] And I've got to withdraw my support for
[1:08:38] Karen because I don't think we can
[1:08:40] afford her.
[1:08:44] We just gave
[1:08:47] 171 city employees a paradise vacation.
[1:08:56] I don't even think Google give out
[1:08:59] $61,000
[1:09:01] pay raises.
[1:09:07] And then the other thing you have really
[1:09:10] placed her in a very peculiar spot. 30
[1:09:14] seconds.
[1:09:15] » And the reason I chose Karen because I
[1:09:18] thought that the least damage would be
[1:09:20] done with her.
[1:09:23] because it would be unfair for you to
[1:09:25] pick a new city manager and in the event
[1:09:29] they would have to undo it, it would be
[1:09:31] greater harm for people that live far
[1:09:33] away
[1:09:35] than someone here.
[1:09:38] You did a very disservice to Karen since
[1:09:41] you want to own negotiating this
[1:09:44] contract. You set her up. Thank you. Our
[1:09:47] next speaker, please.
[1:09:49] » Jordan Strickland, followed by Cheryl
[1:09:51] Collier Brown.
[1:09:57] » Your name and address for the record,
[1:09:58] please.
[1:09:58] » Jordan Strickland, uh, 2204 Altuna
[1:10:01] Drive, 32309.
[1:10:03] So, my name is Jordan Strickland. I was
[1:10:04] born and raised here in Tallahassee. And
[1:10:06] in 2016, I enlisted in the United States
[1:10:08] Air Force. And during that time, uh,
[1:10:11] they instilled three different core
[1:10:12] values in me. Integrity first, service
[1:10:14] before self, and excellence in all we
[1:10:16] do.
[1:10:17] I came back home to Tallahassee
[1:10:19] expecting to find those same values in
[1:10:20] the people who lead the city. But
[1:10:22] instead, I'm looking at a contract that
[1:10:24] would allow the city manager to only be
[1:10:26] removed on a supermajority vote.
[1:10:32] Let's be honest about the timing of
[1:10:33] this. The city is roughly two months
[1:10:35] away from an election that is probably
[1:10:37] going to reshape the look of this
[1:10:39] commission.
[1:10:41] And instead, sorry, instead I'm looking
[1:10:44] Sorry, sorry. Let's voters are about to
[1:10:47] have their say on who leads this city
[1:10:49] going forward. And instead of letting
[1:10:51] that election run its course, the
[1:10:52] majority of this commission is racing to
[1:10:54] lock in a decision that ties the hands
[1:10:56] of whoever comes next. That's not
[1:10:58] service before self. That's self before
[1:11:00] service.
[1:11:02] If this city manager is doing a good
[1:11:04] job, a future commission would have no
[1:11:06] reason to remove her.
[1:11:08] But if she isn't and if there's a real
[1:11:10] problem that comes forth, it would take
[1:11:14] four out of five of you to remove that
[1:11:16] individual. I don't believe that that's
[1:11:18] pro protecting stability. I think that's
[1:11:20] protecting a bad decision from
[1:11:22] accountability.
[1:11:24] You were elected to do a job. Part of
[1:11:26] that job is trusting the voters and
[1:11:28] trusting the people who come after you
[1:11:30] to make their own decisions. tying their
[1:11:32] hands because you're worried about they
[1:11:34] might not make the same decision that
[1:11:36] you would is the opposite of integrity.
[1:11:38] It's the opposite of service and it is
[1:11:41] the opposite of excellence. I ask for
[1:11:43] you to remove that clause, vote no,
[1:11:46] whatever you've got to do to it. Uh and
[1:11:48] let the people of Tallahassee elect a
[1:11:50] commission
[1:11:52] that they want to lead this city. Thank
[1:11:54] you. I yield my time.
[1:11:55] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please,
[1:11:57] » Cheryl Collier Brown,
[1:12:00] and she will be followed by Delila
[1:12:02] Pierre.
[1:12:08] » Name and address for the record, please.
[1:12:10] » West Boulevard Street. I figured you all
[1:12:12] could hear my teacher voice as I
[1:12:13] approach the I've sat here and listened
[1:12:16] through all of this and grant you
[1:12:20] there's some pros and cons
[1:12:22] whatever but it's time personally for me
[1:12:26] to say it's time to move on. The
[1:12:28] selection has been done. Uh we need to
[1:12:31] move on. Yes, the election is coming. It
[1:12:34] may change the diet the look of the city
[1:12:38] commission. All well and good. I think
[1:12:40] Karen will be a great choice being in
[1:12:42] store of the climate that has been going
[1:12:44] on regarding the commission meetings,
[1:12:46] commission elections, the selection of
[1:12:49] the city manager. So, let's move on. We
[1:12:52] got other things in the frying pan need
[1:12:55] to be fried and I'm waiting for us to
[1:12:57] get started with a new diet if it is and
[1:13:01] we'll deal with it then. I didn't have
[1:13:03] come up here to say yay or nay. I just
[1:13:05] come to add that I am happy. I'm ready
[1:13:08] for us to move on. It's time for other
[1:13:10] things to occur. Thank you.
[1:13:12] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[1:13:14] » Next speaker is Delilah Pierre.
[1:13:24] » Your name and address for the record,
[1:13:25] please.
[1:13:26] » Hi, my name is Delilah. I am a member of
[1:13:29] the Taci Alliance Against Racist and
[1:13:31] Political Repression, and my address is
[1:13:33] exempt. Uh, I'm here to talk about the
[1:13:35] new city manager candidate and I think I
[1:13:37] should just be forthright and
[1:13:38] straightforward. Let's think about the
[1:13:40] most cynical uh, way to view this. And I
[1:13:42] think the most cynical way to view this
[1:13:44] is that the reason why they're pushing
[1:13:45] through Karen Jumano, who I really don't
[1:13:48] know anything about, I can't say much
[1:13:49] about her. But the reason why they're
[1:13:50] pushing her in a process that's
[1:13:52] unprecedented is because instead of
[1:13:54] allowing the people of Tallahassee to
[1:13:55] have the time to think about a city
[1:13:57] manager candidate that's best for
[1:13:59] everyone, city commissioner John
[1:14:00] Dailyaly wants to appoint a city manager
[1:14:03] who's best for him before he leaves
[1:14:05] office. Now, unfortunately, due to the
[1:14:09] constant actions you've done, whether
[1:14:12] that's limiting public comment or making
[1:14:14] it more and more difficult for people to
[1:14:16] speak at the city commission meetings or
[1:14:17] using your power as mayor and at the dis
[1:14:20] to silence your fellow commissioners, I
[1:14:22] believe the most cynical option because
[1:14:24] your behavior shows the most cynical
[1:14:25] option is true. The city manager
[1:14:28] position is supposed to be a position
[1:14:29] that answers to the city commissioners.
[1:14:31] But city manager Reese Go during his
[1:14:33] entire appointment has only answered to
[1:14:35] himself and the rich in the city of
[1:14:36] Tallahassee. I can't think of one good
[1:14:39] thing he's done for the city except
[1:14:40] maybe he helped put up a few signs. I
[1:14:42] guess the city manager should not be a
[1:14:45] position that supersedes the rights and
[1:14:47] needs of the majority of people in
[1:14:48] Tallahassee. It should be a position
[1:14:50] that answers to the needs of people in
[1:14:52] Tallahassee. I want a city manager who's
[1:14:54] not getting a vote of 1 something by two
[1:14:56] members of the city commission. The only
[1:14:58] members of the city commission, by the
[1:15:00] way, who are the ones who stand against
[1:15:02] the city manager's constant alliance
[1:15:05] with the worst sectors of Tallahassee
[1:15:07] that prohibit and inhibit its
[1:15:09] development and stop our city from
[1:15:11] having everything that we need. This
[1:15:14] process needs to be more comprehensive.
[1:15:18] When we choose a city manager, there
[1:15:20] should be more public options for people
[1:15:22] to speak to them. And the public should
[1:15:24] have a chance to question the city
[1:15:26] manager candidate. I don't want to just
[1:15:27] see a park meet and greet from 4:00 to
[1:15:29] 6:00 p.m. on a Tuesday. I want to see a
[1:15:31] real process that gives people power
[1:15:34] that lets people have the say over who
[1:15:36] the city manager is. And if Karen is so
[1:15:38] great, then awesome. Let's have her here
[1:15:41] with everyone else so people can ask her
[1:15:44] questions and talk to her and see her
[1:15:46] approach and development for the city.
[1:15:48] But I feel that city commissioner John
[1:15:50] Dailyaly, city commissioner Curtis
[1:15:51] Richardson, and city commissioner Dian
[1:15:53] Williams Cox, who will most likely be
[1:15:54] the three yes votes for this position,
[1:15:57] don't really care that much about that.
[1:15:59] They care more about playing politics.
[1:16:02] They care more about submitting their
[1:16:03] power and they care more about having
[1:16:05] whatever dangerous effect on their city
[1:16:07] they can before inevitably some of them
[1:16:10] are pushed out of office. Thank you.
[1:16:13] » Our next speaker, please.
[1:16:14] » Mayor, that was the last speaker on this
[1:16:16] item.
[1:16:16] » Is there anybody else here in chambers
[1:16:18] that'd like to speak on this item?
[1:16:20] Anybody else that has not had the
[1:16:21] opportunity to speak that'd like to
[1:16:23] speak on this item? All right. We've had
[1:16:25] 11 public
[1:16:28] » Sorry.
[1:16:29] » Oh, sure. Please come join us. And if
[1:16:31] you wouldn't mind, just fill out a card
[1:16:33] after the fact and uh your name and
[1:16:35] address for the record, please.
[1:16:36] » Doug Han, I live at uh uh on Florida
[1:16:40] Avenue here. U just a quick note, uh
[1:16:44] federal mileage for business is 76 cents
[1:16:47] a mile. Uh at $1,000 a month, you're
[1:16:51] expecting your city manager to drive
[1:16:54] 15,789
[1:16:56] miles in performance of your duties
[1:16:58] rather than to be in the office. Thank
[1:17:00] you.
[1:17:00] » Thank you.
[1:17:03] [applause]
[1:17:08] » Any other public comment? Anybody else
[1:17:10] here that would like to speak?
[1:17:12] All right. To begin the uh conversation,
[1:17:15] I will go ahead and make the motion for
[1:17:16] option number one. Is there a second to
[1:17:18] the motion on the table for discussion?
[1:17:21] » Second.
[1:17:22] » Seconded by the mayor pro tent. Let's
[1:17:23] open it up for discussion. Commissioner
[1:17:25] Porter.
[1:17:26] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I'd like to start
[1:17:29] first of all just by saying as far as
[1:17:31] I'm concerned this has absolutely
[1:17:33] nothing to do with Dr. Dumanville. I
[1:17:35] wouldn't support this or any candidate
[1:17:38] even if it was one who I had supported
[1:17:41] um in in the vote in the process that we
[1:17:44] enacted last week. I do want to ask the
[1:17:47] city attorney to weigh in um on some of
[1:17:52] I I spoke to her this morning with with
[1:17:54] questions and concerns about the city
[1:17:56] charter and the contract and I wanted to
[1:17:59] hear I wanted to give her an opportunity
[1:18:02] to address that.
[1:18:03] » Madam Attorney Mor.
[1:18:05] » Thank you, Commissioner. So, as I
[1:18:07] mentioned, um the legal issue that is
[1:18:10] raised here, the guidance that we have
[1:18:13] is somewhat limited. um I'm unable to
[1:18:16] bring any opinions or case law that are
[1:18:19] exactly on point. Um so what I need to
[1:18:21] do is to sort of rely on general
[1:18:23] government concepts and precedent. So I
[1:18:26] think um the issue is is it I think the
[1:18:29] question that you're asking commissioner
[1:18:30] is it legal to require a supermajority
[1:18:34] in this context in this contract? Um and
[1:18:38] I think you know I'll start by saying
[1:18:39] our chart our charter is silent on that
[1:18:42] issue. There is nothing um in the
[1:18:45] charter that specifies when um the the
[1:18:49] city commission has to have a simple
[1:18:51] majority versus a super. It's just not
[1:18:53] addressed. Um and as you know, the the
[1:18:56] city manager serves at the pleasure um
[1:18:59] of the city commission. So I will say
[1:19:03] that you know the default interpretation
[1:19:06] of a charter provision that is silent is
[1:19:09] likely to be a um a simple majority. um
[1:19:12] and and the years of practice here at
[1:19:14] the city would also suggest that that
[1:19:17] the actions of the city commission are
[1:19:19] uh are by city by um simple majority. Um
[1:19:24] so if if that were true then you know
[1:19:27] the charter would prohibit um by
[1:19:30] implication you know a supermajority
[1:19:33] but again the charter is silent. though
[1:19:37] and there is no guidance I I was unable
[1:19:40] to locate any guidance that says with
[1:19:42] absolute certainty that at the pleasure
[1:19:45] means a simple majority. Um so I can't
[1:19:49] speak with uh certainty that there is
[1:19:52] not some some room for other
[1:19:54] interpretation. The other uh way of
[1:19:56] course of looking at it is that because
[1:19:58] there is no explicit prohibition then
[1:20:01] it's not prohibited um as a function of
[1:20:04] home rule uh and that the contract term
[1:20:08] for a supermajority for removal is um is
[1:20:12] simply that it's a it's a term of
[1:20:14] employment. So, um
[1:20:18] I think that argument may rely on the
[1:20:22] idea that the charter is sort of the
[1:20:24] minimum and uh that the city commission
[1:20:27] itself acting as a body has the
[1:20:30] authority to uh to impose different
[1:20:33] requirements on its on itself. Um I will
[1:20:38] say that as to the second point there
[1:20:40] have been recent examples of city
[1:20:44] commissions um Fernandina Beach is one
[1:20:47] and actually just last night Marathon
[1:20:49] Florida uh both passed their city
[1:20:52] councils passed um executive contracts
[1:20:56] with um the supermajority for removal.
[1:21:00] So that suggests to me not necessarily
[1:21:02] that that's right. those have not been
[1:21:05] tested yet. Um, so we don't have I don't
[1:21:08] have a case, you know, I don't have a
[1:21:10] Supreme Court decision that says that
[1:21:12] those were tested and the the court
[1:21:14] decided one way or the other, but they
[1:21:16] are precedent and they are and they are
[1:21:18] out there and I think it's I thought it
[1:21:19] was important to bring that to the
[1:21:21] commission's attention.
[1:21:22] » Commissioner Porter,
[1:21:24] » Thank you. So your legal opinion is that
[1:21:29] we have since
[1:21:32] since the inception of the city charter,
[1:21:34] we have interpreted that to mean a
[1:21:36] simple majority.
[1:21:39] » I don't know if I could say that in
[1:21:40] every case since the inception.
[1:21:42] » Okay. When have we not?
[1:21:44] » I can't identify over the course of
[1:21:46] history. I I don't know.
[1:21:47] » Okay. In the past, since you've been at
[1:21:49] the city of Tallahassee, have we ever
[1:21:50] interpreted that to mean anything but a
[1:21:54] simple majority?
[1:21:56] » I don't think we've ever been faced with
[1:21:57] this specific question, but probably not
[1:22:00] » On point. Two years ago when we changed
[1:22:03] the contract of the inspector general to
[1:22:05] a m uh supermajority based on your legal
[1:22:09] opinion that we could do it. And I was
[1:22:12] the lone descending vote because I
[1:22:13] thought we should do all
[1:22:14] » And was it not also legal? I've got the
[1:22:16] floor. Commissioner Porter Hull in just
[1:22:17] a second. I'm coming back to you in just
[1:22:18] a second.
[1:22:19] » So, yes, we can point to a specific
[1:22:22] example in recent history as of two
[1:22:25] years ago based on your legal opinion
[1:22:27] that we could do it and did do it. And
[1:22:30] then the Citizens Advisory Council for
[1:22:33] the Charter Review Commission then said,
[1:22:35] "We need to take this language and put
[1:22:37] it before the citizens to vote upon put
[1:22:40] it in the charter." And it passed.
[1:22:42] And I'm hoping that a future commission
[1:22:45] will follow the exact same steps and
[1:22:48] take the language of the city manager
[1:22:50] and a future charter review commission
[1:22:53] will put it in the charter as well. But
[1:22:56] to answer your question, yes, we do have
[1:22:58] a very specific example in recent
[1:23:00] history based on your legal opinion of
[1:23:03] the action that we took in regards to
[1:23:05] inspector general.
[1:23:06] » May I respond, Mr. May? Um I I don't
[1:23:09] recall I'm not saying that we didn't
[1:23:11] have a a conversation about this
[1:23:14] particular uh legal issue, but um the
[1:23:18] city uh inspector general's contract was
[1:23:21] not amended until after the um charter
[1:23:24] was passed. There was discussion about
[1:23:28] um his about the twothirds and how he
[1:23:31] considered that to be the the sort of
[1:23:33] best practice for inspector generals,
[1:23:35] but I I do not believe that the contract
[1:23:37] was actually amended until after the
[1:23:39] charter. Well, Madam Attorney, then
[1:23:41] we've got a conflicting opinion and I
[1:23:43] appreciate Commissioner Porter's uh
[1:23:45] position and I appreciate the advice
[1:23:47] that you gave her. The advice that the
[1:23:50] acting city attorney Lou Norell gave me
[1:23:51] a week ago when we met and the advice
[1:23:54] that you gave me yesterday when we met
[1:23:57] uh is contrary to the advice that you
[1:24:00] gave Commissioner Porter. Now, I am
[1:24:02] still of I am still of the opinion that
[1:24:06] we can and we should and I support the
[1:24:08] motion on the table under home rule
[1:24:10] authority in the Florida Constitution,
[1:24:12] anything that is not legislatively
[1:24:14] prohibited is allowed for local
[1:24:17] governments to establish their own
[1:24:18] principles. And under the same theory of
[1:24:21] our charter, unless legislatively
[1:24:24] prohibited in the city charter, we are
[1:24:26] allowed to move forward. Hence again the
[1:24:29] reason why we took action with the
[1:24:30] inspector general the way we did. The
[1:24:32] reason why there is no case law in state
[1:24:34] of Florida that you could find and point
[1:24:36] to. Another example, Bernandina Beach
[1:24:39] recently with their city attorney
[1:24:41] putting in supermajority language. As
[1:24:43] recently as last night with the city of
[1:24:46] Marathon putting in supermajority
[1:24:48] language with the hiring with the firing
[1:24:50] of their city manager contract as well.
[1:24:53] There is precedent. There's precedent
[1:24:55] here. Um, I believe our charter speaks
[1:24:58] to it because it doesn't prohibit it
[1:25:01] under home rule authority and I'm
[1:25:03] prepared to vote and move forward.
[1:25:04] Commissioner Porter, you have been
[1:25:05] generous with your time. You have the
[1:25:06] floor.
[1:25:07] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[1:25:11] I want to clarify for the public as well
[1:25:13] and for the record the reason that we
[1:25:17] move forward with a supermajority
[1:25:20] requirement for termination for the
[1:25:21] inspector general. The inspector general
[1:25:24] has the authority to investigate elected
[1:25:27] officials. Can you imagine being in the
[1:25:30] position of investigating your bosses?
[1:25:33] That's got to be really tough, right?
[1:25:35] You're probably not going to want to do
[1:25:36] it if you know how easily your bosses
[1:25:38] can fire you. So the best practice as
[1:25:41] recommended by the associations that
[1:25:44] represent inspectors general is not only
[1:25:47] that their termination be a
[1:25:49] supermajority but also that there be a
[1:25:52] cause. They have to be terminated with
[1:25:54] cause and there has to be an appeal
[1:25:56] process. The city manager is not
[1:26:00] designed to be independent. The
[1:26:02] inspector general is the city manager.
[1:26:05] The role is administrative.
[1:26:08] It is to serve at the pleasure of the
[1:26:10] city commission who the voters of
[1:26:12] Tallahassee elect.
[1:26:16] This is not a best practice. It is not
[1:26:18] recommended by the International City
[1:26:21] Managers Association. It is not
[1:26:23] recommended by the National Civic League
[1:26:26] who awarded us the Allameric City Award.
[1:26:30] I recognize that managers need
[1:26:32] protection. They need employment
[1:26:34] protection as does the ICMA. as does
[1:26:37] this National Civic League. That is why
[1:26:39] they are awarded very generous severance
[1:26:42] packages.
[1:26:44] 20 weeks. Do the math. $317,000
[1:26:48] starting salary. 20 weeks severance.
[1:26:52] This is a government. This is not a
[1:26:56] country club. We don't just do favors
[1:26:59] for people like this. No. And I'm not
[1:27:02] talking about anyone in particular. I'm
[1:27:04] genuinely not.
[1:27:06] No one's job is more important than the
[1:27:08] well-being and the voice of this
[1:27:11] community.
[1:27:12] » Amen.
[1:27:12] » Okay.
[1:27:18] I also genuinely believe, you know, we
[1:27:21] talk a lot about our council manager
[1:27:24] form of government that we have. When I
[1:27:27] was in graduate school, I thought I
[1:27:29] wanted to be a city manager. And I was
[1:27:31] given the Bee Herald Farmer Scholarship
[1:27:33] Award by the Florida City County
[1:27:36] Managers Association in recognition of
[1:27:39] of my my p my interest in city
[1:27:41] management and my my academic career up
[1:27:44] to that point. I really feel like this
[1:27:47] violates the spirit of the council
[1:27:50] manager form of government um that is
[1:27:54] intended to be responsive. Everything
[1:27:57] about our government, our system of
[1:27:59] government, Robert's rules of order is
[1:28:02] to to ensure that the minority are heard
[1:28:05] but that the will of the majority
[1:28:08] prevails.
[1:28:10] This does not change that. We already
[1:28:13] and no one in here probably is will come
[1:28:16] as a surprise that I have I have rated
[1:28:18] our current city manager with poor
[1:28:21] scores in his evaluations.
[1:28:25] He's been my city manager for the past
[1:28:27] six years. We already have a system that
[1:28:30] works.
[1:28:32] So, for this to come on the agenda and I
[1:28:36] I would like I I apologize, but I mean I
[1:28:38] feel like I need clarity from the city
[1:28:40] attorney because when I spoke to her
[1:28:42] this morning, you know, it was
[1:28:45] what what she relayed to me was that she
[1:28:47] was not part of this specific
[1:28:49] conversation
[1:28:50] » And that she spent the evening
[1:28:52] researching this herself. I'd also like
[1:28:54] to say to the governments, it is
[1:28:56] extremely rare to require supermajority
[1:29:00] and the city that I saw the cities one
[1:29:03] at least one of them that I researched
[1:29:04] that has that that recently passed it
[1:29:07] they did that because they were having
[1:29:08] trouble keeping city managers
[1:29:12] attracting city managers. So in all of
[1:29:14] this discussion, whether it's salary,
[1:29:16] whether it's the supermajority,
[1:29:19] you want of course to hire the best, to
[1:29:21] retain the best, but the the question
[1:29:24] needs to also be like, what purpose does
[1:29:27] this serve? Is there a problem that
[1:29:30] we're trying to fix here? There's a lot
[1:29:33] of talk about depoliticizing
[1:29:36] this process. On the one hand, I agree.
[1:29:38] On the other hand, this is politics.
[1:29:41] This is what we do. There will always be
[1:29:44] elections and I do think it's entirely
[1:29:46] inappropriate to tie the hands of future
[1:29:49] commissioners. Um, and I'm not even
[1:29:51] talking about in two months. I'm talking
[1:29:53] about in five or 10 years. There is no
[1:29:56] justification that I have heard that
[1:29:59] convinces me that decades of precedent
[1:30:03] that the professional associations that
[1:30:05] govern city managers across this entire
[1:30:09] country.
[1:30:11] There's no gives me no reason to think
[1:30:15] that this is a best practice that this
[1:30:16] is standard. And on top of all of that,
[1:30:19] we have to reckon with the fact that our
[1:30:22] city attorney doesn't really know
[1:30:24] because there is no precedent for this.
[1:30:27] It hasn't been legally tested. That
[1:30:30] opens us up to litigation
[1:30:33] and all kinds of other I don't even know
[1:30:35] why we would go down this direction with
[1:30:38] with that level of uncertainty. Um
[1:30:41] especially given the other concerns. So,
[1:30:45] I would
[1:30:47] I would like to make a a substitute
[1:30:49] motion and I'm I'm willing to compromise
[1:30:52] on everything else. I have said from the
[1:30:54] beginning I don't believe this process
[1:30:56] should have taken place before the
[1:30:58] election. I do not believe that um that
[1:31:02] salary is appropriate,
[1:31:05] but I'm willing to support a contract
[1:31:08] today
[1:31:11] with a simple majority for termination.
[1:31:13] So that would be my motion that we move
[1:31:16] forward with this contract agreement
[1:31:18] with the change that the termination
[1:31:21] does not require a supermajority vote.
[1:31:25] There is a mo a substitute motion on the
[1:31:27] table made by Commissioner Porter simply
[1:31:30] let me make sure I get this correctly
[1:31:32] maintaining all points of the contract
[1:31:34] and changing the termination language to
[1:31:36] a simple majority from a supermajority.
[1:31:39] » Yes.
[1:31:39] » Okay. Is there a second to the motion?
[1:31:41] » Second.
[1:31:41] » Second by Commissioner Melo. Comment
[1:31:45] » Commissioner Melo.
[1:31:45] » Uh thank you Mr. Mayor and um thank you
[1:31:48] for bringing the motion commissioner
[1:31:49] Porter. You know, to me, this entire
[1:31:53] process has been intentionally designed
[1:31:56] by the mayor to divide this commission
[1:31:59] every step of the way. Uh, the community
[1:32:01] spoke loud and clear. They wanted this
[1:32:03] decision to wait until after the
[1:32:05] elections. Five of the six candidates
[1:32:08] for office on the November ballot asked
[1:32:10] for the city commission to wait until uh
[1:32:13] after the election. Nevertheless, a
[1:32:15] majority wanted to move forward uh with
[1:32:17] this selection process. a simple
[1:32:19] majority 3-2. I respect the will of the
[1:32:23] majority of this board. When this came
[1:32:25] back, I requested that we we give a
[1:32:27] one-year contract to Dr. Jimville so the
[1:32:31] next commission could have an
[1:32:33] opportunity to get to know her, work
[1:32:34] with her for an entire year and then
[1:32:37] make a decision uh if they would like to
[1:32:39] move forward or if they'd like to go
[1:32:41] back to a search process. this provide
[1:32:43] continuity and stability for this
[1:32:45] government that is desperately uh
[1:32:47] needed. That compromise was rejected by
[1:32:50] a simple majority, a 3-2 vote of this
[1:32:54] board.
[1:32:56] For 200 years,
[1:32:59] city commission precedent, local code,
[1:33:01] and state law
[1:33:03] have shown that a simple majority is how
[1:33:06] a a city commission expresses its will.
[1:33:10] A contract
[1:33:12] cannot alter
[1:33:15] what's in the city charter. The city
[1:33:17] charter is the constitution of the city
[1:33:18] of Tallahassee. Just like a law that the
[1:33:21] governor passes can't change what's in
[1:33:23] the constitution and they get challenged
[1:33:24] and struck down. This is no different.
[1:33:27] The a contract inserting this into the
[1:33:30] contract can't change what's expressly
[1:33:32] laid out in the city charter. And it is
[1:33:35] not silent. The city charter says the
[1:33:38] city manager serves at the pleasure of
[1:33:41] the city commission. The pleasure of the
[1:33:43] city commission is a 3-2 vote. We have
[1:33:46] 200 years of history knowing what the
[1:33:48] pleasure of the city commission is on
[1:33:50] every item we we've ever discussed. The
[1:33:53] city commission has fired previous city
[1:33:56] managers on a 3 to2 vote, exercising the
[1:34:00] pleasure of the city commission. There's
[1:34:03] a long history in this government of how
[1:34:05] this operates. What this attempts to do
[1:34:08] is circumvent the charter review
[1:34:10] process. Mayor Daly called for a charter
[1:34:12] review process. There was a committee
[1:34:14] that brought forward recommendations.
[1:34:16] Commissioners brought forward individual
[1:34:18] recommendations as as well.
[1:34:21] Silent on whether we should change this
[1:34:23] rule. It was never brought forward for
[1:34:25] discussion. It was never put to the
[1:34:26] border voters which is required by the
[1:34:29] city charter to have changed. That is
[1:34:31] the power of the people. This is not our
[1:34:34] government. It's the people's government
[1:34:35] and that's dictated by uh the city
[1:34:38] charter. So what what what no matter
[1:34:40] what the vote is today, it's invalid.
[1:34:44] You can't add you can't take away powers
[1:34:46] of the city commission by way of
[1:34:48] contract language. It wouldn't stand up.
[1:34:51] So the question would be and and madam
[1:34:53] attorney a year from now if they pass
[1:34:56] this this this contract language and
[1:34:59] three commissioners move to terminate a
[1:35:02] city manager where does that leave the
[1:35:04] city of Tallahassee?
[1:35:06] » Madam Attorney
[1:35:07] » Thank you Mr. Mayor. I believe that um
[1:35:09] again I don't have um these are
[1:35:12] questions that are not you know at
[1:35:15] answered in current law. Um but I
[1:35:18] believe that in that circumstance that
[1:35:20] the city commission could could like
[1:35:23] they could any contract uh well not any
[1:35:25] contract but they could act with a 3-2
[1:35:28] uh majority to um to end the contract.
[1:35:32] But that would be a breach of the
[1:35:34] contract. That would be a breach of the
[1:35:36] provision of the contract that requires
[1:35:38] a supermajority to do so. That would
[1:35:40] mean that the um appointed the official
[1:35:43] who is the subject of the um contract
[1:35:46] would have breach of contract rights.
[1:35:48] Primarily they would be the severance
[1:35:50] pay which they that the contract
[1:35:52] provides to the um appointed official
[1:35:55] upon a termination without cause. But it
[1:35:58] is possible that there could be some
[1:35:59] other um contract uh damages that might
[1:36:03] be um recoverable. I I can't with the
[1:36:08] short notice I can't really give you
[1:36:10] what an example of what that might be,
[1:36:11] but it could cost the city more is is I
[1:36:13] guess my point if there's a breach of
[1:36:15] contract.
[1:36:16] » Sure. Okay. And and the point I'm making
[1:36:19] and confirmed by your opinion is this
[1:36:22] contract cannot change the authority
[1:36:24] expressly given to the city commission
[1:36:26] in the charter when we if that decision
[1:36:28] were made in the the future. The
[1:36:30] authority comes from the charter. It
[1:36:32] does not come from uh the contract. And
[1:36:34] since that authority cannot be changed
[1:36:36] in the contract, this is invalid
[1:36:39] language. And it's not just the city
[1:36:41] that would have to uphold to this. It
[1:36:43] would be up to anybody who enters a
[1:36:45] contract with a mun municipality needs
[1:36:48] to know the limitations of the city's
[1:36:50] contracting authority. We don't have the
[1:36:52] ability to put this into a contract
[1:36:54] because it's counter to our our our
[1:36:56] city's charter. Um so all all that to
[1:36:59] say um this commission will express its
[1:37:02] will. But I believe this has been wholly
[1:37:05] politicized by the mayor. Has never been
[1:37:08] about um an individual. For 200 years,
[1:37:12] this city has maintained the way it
[1:37:14] hires and fires its city manager in 60
[1:37:17] days before an outgoing uh mayor goes
[1:37:19] out, he wants to throw a monkey wrench
[1:37:21] in that whole process. It doesn't make
[1:37:23] any sense. uh the inspector general knew
[1:37:26] the the limitations of a contract in the
[1:37:29] city uh uh the city charter brought it
[1:37:33] forward brought it to the voters and it
[1:37:35] was approved. If this is a change this
[1:37:37] board would like to proceed, put it on
[1:37:39] the ballot, let the voters decide. Thank
[1:37:41] you, Mr. Mayor.
[1:37:42] » There is a substant motion on the table
[1:37:44] made by Commissioner Porter, second by
[1:37:46] Commissioner Matlo changing the termin
[1:37:48] termination language from a
[1:37:49] supermajority to a simple majority. Any
[1:37:52] other comments?
[1:37:54] Are we ready to vote?
[1:37:57] Okay. For the substitute amendment on
[1:37:59] the table, all those in favor signify by
[1:38:02] saying I.
[1:38:03] » I.
[1:38:03] » All those opposed?
[1:38:05] » Nay.
[1:38:06] » Nay.
[1:38:06] » And the substitute motion fails. Three
[1:38:09] to two with commissioner. [music]
[1:38:15] » We can if we can have order please, that
[1:38:17] would be great. Thank you. I appreciate
[1:38:19] it. And we are back on to the original
[1:38:22] motion. Commissioner Williams Cox, you
[1:38:24] are recognized.
[1:38:24] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Let me let me just
[1:38:26] be very clear. This is about Karen.
[1:38:31] It's her contract.
[1:38:32] » It's a contract between
[1:38:34] » Who who do you represent?
[1:38:36] » Okay. I'm going to ask one more time
[1:38:37] that if we could please have some order.
[1:38:40] We allowed the public to speak and we
[1:38:41] listen to everyone and we're under
[1:38:43] commission discussion. And please, if
[1:38:46] you would let us continue with the
[1:38:48] discussion with continue with the vote
[1:38:50] without the interruption from the
[1:38:51] audience, I'd appreciate that. I do not
[1:38:54] want to have to clear the chambers.
[1:38:56] Commissioner Williams Cox.
[1:38:58] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. This is about
[1:39:00] Karen. This is a contract that will have
[1:39:03] her name on it. This is a 27year city of
[1:39:07] Tallahassee employee currently serving
[1:39:09] as a deputy city manager. the terms of
[1:39:11] the contract excluding the the
[1:39:13] supermajority
[1:39:15] the money would be the same money that
[1:39:17] if Reese was going to continue to be
[1:39:19] here would be the money that he would
[1:39:21] earn. Point blank. There is a savings
[1:39:25] because Reese actually drives a fleet
[1:39:29] truck. Okay. Karen will be driving her
[1:39:33] own car with her $1,000 a month um u um
[1:39:38] allowance. But the but the the the
[1:39:43] the supermajority
[1:39:46] unfortunately is where we seem to be
[1:39:49] headed in this state and in this country
[1:39:52] because of the the political climate.
[1:39:55] Now what let's let's just be clear.
[1:39:57] Commissioner Matllo,
[1:39:59] you have been very vocal on social media
[1:40:02] about what you would do if you become
[1:40:04] mayor to the city manager that we would
[1:40:07] select. So
[1:40:10] you have put that out there. You said
[1:40:12] what you would do. So that doesn't sound
[1:40:15] like someone who is looking to move in
[1:40:18] this
[1:40:19] » Come to you in just a second.
[1:40:20] » That doesn't look that doesn't look like
[1:40:22] someone who is trying to bring this city
[1:40:24] together.
[1:40:25] » We're trying to stabilize this city by
[1:40:28] making sure we have some folks in place
[1:40:30] who know how to run this city because
[1:40:33] they've worked their way up through the
[1:40:34] city and know the different parts of the
[1:40:36] city. That to me is worth more than um
[1:40:41] any any any you know amount of money.
[1:40:45] Unfortunately, it is during a campaign
[1:40:48] season, but we cannot govern our
[1:40:51] community by campaigns. We've got to
[1:40:54] govern them by the stability of what
[1:40:57] residents expect us to have. This is a
[1:40:59] well-run city. Whatever you think about
[1:41:02] it that it it is a well-run city. I've
[1:41:05] worked with the 411 cities, towns, and
[1:41:07] villages, and folks want to know how are
[1:41:09] we doing what we're doing in
[1:41:10] Tallahassee. It is a great place to
[1:41:12] live, work, and play. And I I want to be
[1:41:14] a part of making sure that it continues
[1:41:17] in that way. And to depoliticize
[1:41:21] this for our appointed officials, all of
[1:41:25] them.
[1:41:26] » I believe this is the way to go. It's
[1:41:28] just that at this moment in time, cuz
[1:41:30] someone said to me, the timing, the
[1:41:32] timing is contract time. It's not
[1:41:34] election time. It's contract. It is time
[1:41:37] for a contract for a city manager. So
[1:41:40] you going in anybody I'm you know I'm
[1:41:43] not an attorney but I've done some
[1:41:46] contracts before and if you're going to
[1:41:47] do a contract you the terms of the
[1:41:48] contract are done at the time of
[1:41:50] negotiation and the negotiation has
[1:41:53] occurred and these are the terms that
[1:41:55] she has agreed to. Now, the other
[1:41:57] candidates may have found themselves in
[1:41:59] the same way because we heard from them
[1:42:01] that they've been watching and watching
[1:42:03] our commission our commission meetings.
[1:42:05] They've been watching what's happening
[1:42:06] in the city and some of them some folks
[1:42:08] decided not to apply. So, you're right,
[1:42:12] Commissioner Porter. Cities are having
[1:42:14] trouble attracting and keeping. Last
[1:42:17] night, someone got fired last night. A
[1:42:18] city manager got fired last night and
[1:42:21] and then they decided to do this. So, I
[1:42:23] I don't have a a problem supporting the
[1:42:27] super majority to keep our city moving
[1:42:31] forward together and to be a stable
[1:42:34] city. We're the capital city of the
[1:42:35] third largest state. We cannot fumble
[1:42:37] the ball on this. We cannot move
[1:42:40] backwards. We've got to go forward.
[1:42:41] Forward ever. Backwards never. And I
[1:42:45] just believe that this is the direction
[1:42:47] that we need to be going. It also not
[1:42:49] only stabilizes
[1:42:51] um the city, it stabilizes the workforce
[1:42:55] because people are working for these
[1:42:57] individuals and they need to know that
[1:42:59] their job is safe and secure no matter
[1:43:01] what who gets be who gets to become
[1:43:03] mayor or gets to become whatever. They
[1:43:05] need to know that their jobs are going
[1:43:07] to be in a safe place. All they got to
[1:43:09] do is do the job and be held
[1:43:10] accountable. And no, no, I don't think
[1:43:12] anyone here has a problem being held
[1:43:15] accountable to their job. Unfortunately,
[1:43:17] we have to now look at safeguards to
[1:43:21] protect people in their jobs so that
[1:43:23] they don't feel intimidated or harassed
[1:43:25] because I've heard that from some of
[1:43:27] them. So, that's where I stand. I
[1:43:30] support the motion on the table. What
[1:43:32] what what whatever happens happens. But
[1:43:35] I just believe that in my heart of
[1:43:37] hearts and in the research that I've
[1:43:39] done with the with around this state
[1:43:41] with people that I work with, mayors and
[1:43:42] commissioners from other cities, this is
[1:43:44] the direction that we're headed. It's
[1:43:46] unfortunate, [clears throat] but that's
[1:43:48] where we're headed. And we can stop it
[1:43:51] by doing what we need to do and not
[1:43:53] making these positions so um adept to
[1:43:57] the campaigns that are currently going
[1:43:58] on the politicization of of what we're
[1:44:02] doing here in our city. Elections and
[1:44:04] campaigns cannot run a city well. We've
[1:44:07] got to run this city professionally and
[1:44:10] so that people get what they need
[1:44:11] regardless of who sits in the mayor's
[1:44:13] seat or who sits in the commission seat.
[1:44:15] And that's where I stand.
[1:44:16] » Commissioner Matlo on point. I'm sorry.
[1:44:18] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh
[1:44:19] traditionally, a point of order is when
[1:44:22] another speaker is out of order and it
[1:44:23] gives you the opportunity to rule on
[1:44:25] that. Uh we should not be directing
[1:44:27] individual comments at other
[1:44:28] commissioners. It should be directed to
[1:44:29] the mayor. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. That's
[1:44:31] great advice for the past eight years,
[1:44:32] but we haven't upheld that either.
[1:44:34] Commissioner Porter,
[1:44:37] » You're the mayor, sir.
[1:44:39] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[1:44:41] Um, I don't know. I don't see Dr.
[1:44:45] Drummondville, but I I want to speak
[1:44:47] directly to you. This is your contract,
[1:44:50] as Commissioner Williams Cox just said.
[1:44:52] Um, I am asking you as a professional in
[1:44:55] your field and as the next res city
[1:44:57] manager who reports to us to reject this
[1:45:01] contract with a supermajority vote.
[1:45:05] So, I can't see you, but that is a
[1:45:07] direct question to Dr. Drummondville.
[1:45:10] » Now, I would like a response.
[1:45:13] » Uh, Dr. Jumanville is not in chambers
[1:45:16] right now.
[1:45:18] So, but I'm I'm sure she is probably
[1:45:21] watching out of chambers and we'll get
[1:45:22] back to you, Mayor Pro Tim.
[1:45:24] » Well, Mr. uh, Mayor, I would just
[1:45:26] suggest that
[1:45:29] if that Commissioner Porter, if that's
[1:45:31] the direction that you would want to go,
[1:45:34] then the negotiations I would think
[1:45:37] because that's what Miss Gilmanville,
[1:45:40] Dr. Gilmanville has agreed to,
[1:45:43] » Right? that it would have to go back to
[1:45:45] the negotiations and she at that point
[1:45:48] » Would have to say I can go forward
[1:45:51] without this provision in the contract.
[1:45:54] We can't sit here today and make that
[1:45:57] determination.
[1:45:58] The contract was agreed to in
[1:46:01] negotiations with the mayor
[1:46:04] » On point.
[1:46:05] » On point, Mr. Porter,
[1:46:07] » Why can't we why can't she just say I
[1:46:09] mean we we could have voted on my
[1:46:11] motion. We could have if that motion had
[1:46:13] passed that would have just been what it
[1:46:15] is and then she it's she still has to
[1:46:17] sign it. We can do whatever we I mean
[1:46:20] doesn't she miss city madam city
[1:46:22] attorney could we not if Dr. Jumville
[1:46:25] were here right now and she said I I
[1:46:28] reject the supermajority contract and I
[1:46:31] would like to ask that that be changed.
[1:46:34] Why couldn't we honor that?
[1:46:35] » Oh, we could but she has agreed to. I
[1:46:38] understand. But that but my point is we
[1:46:40] if she were here we could ask her that.
[1:46:44] » But she's not here so we can't ask her
[1:46:46] that and make that decision.
[1:46:48] » So it's the contract before us
[1:46:49] » For her
[1:46:50] » That she has agreed upon.
[1:46:51] » Right.
[1:46:52] » Mayor Pro Tim, you still have the floor.
[1:46:54] » Yeah. I you know
[1:46:56] it's just amazing to me that this is the
[1:46:59] sticking point in a contract for the
[1:47:03] city commission for the city of
[1:47:05] Tallahassee and the city manager, the
[1:47:08] selection of the city manager, the super
[1:47:11] majority to hire or fire the city. I I I
[1:47:15] just find it unbelievable that that's
[1:47:18] the sticking point. It's not the use of
[1:47:21] an automobile. It's not the salary. It's
[1:47:25] not the severance pay. It is
[1:47:29] a supermajority.
[1:47:32] I I would feel comfortable if if a
[1:47:36] supermajority were required because it
[1:47:40] suggests to this community that four
[1:47:42] people four people out of the five agree
[1:47:47] that this person needs to be removed
[1:47:50] from office. I don't think it's
[1:47:52] unreasonable.
[1:47:54] It says to this community that four
[1:47:57] individuals that we have elected
[1:48:01] agree that this person needs to be
[1:48:02] removed from office. One person
[1:48:06] different than a simple majority. I I I
[1:48:10] just find it unbelievable that this is
[1:48:12] the argument that we're having and can't
[1:48:15] move forward on that one issue. I'm
[1:48:19] going to support the motion. Uh, and if
[1:48:22] a a a commission in the future wants to
[1:48:25] change it, then we can do that. Uh but I
[1:48:29] think for right now we move forward with
[1:48:32] the contract that has been negotiated
[1:48:35] and agreed upon and that we don't sit
[1:48:38] here
[1:48:40] as a commission when we gave the mayor
[1:48:45] the authority to negotiate the contract
[1:48:48] with the person that we selected out of
[1:48:52] this process to be our next city
[1:48:56] commissioner or or city manager. I'm
[1:48:58] sorry. I I just don't feel like we're in
[1:49:00] a position to do that. Uh and like I
[1:49:03] said, I'm going to support the motion on
[1:49:06] the floor.
[1:49:06] » Motion on the tables for option number
[1:49:08] one made by the mayor, seconded by
[1:49:11] Remind me, was it Mayor Pro Tim or Mayor
[1:49:13] Pro Tim uh for the contract that's
[1:49:15] presented. Commissioner Metley, you have
[1:49:16] the floor.
[1:49:17] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um interesting
[1:49:19] debate today. I I would say um would it
[1:49:23] be unbelievable to require four votes of
[1:49:26] five to sell a community hospital?
[1:49:29] Would it be unbelievable to require four
[1:49:32] votes of five to sell a municipal uh
[1:49:35] golf course that are the burial grounds
[1:49:37] of former slaves from that plantation?
[1:49:39] Would it be unbelievable to require four
[1:49:43] votes to increase taxes year after year?
[1:49:47] Would it be unbelievable
[1:49:50] to require four votes to hire a city
[1:49:54] manager?
[1:50:00] This city has long been divided on a 3-2
[1:50:03] vote. There has never been an attempt
[1:50:06] for compromise. That's why the public is
[1:50:09] lashing out the way that it is today.
[1:50:12] Now, I want you to imagine a different
[1:50:13] scenario
[1:50:15] where decisions made by the city
[1:50:17] commission were not implemented. If
[1:50:20] three votes sold the hospital, but the
[1:50:22] city manager wouldn't move forward with
[1:50:24] that sale. If three votes sold the golf
[1:50:27] course and the city manager would not
[1:50:29] move forward with that sale.
[1:50:32] If three votes decided to terminate the
[1:50:34] agreement with the county to provide
[1:50:36] fire services, but the city manager
[1:50:39] refused to move forward, would that
[1:50:41] action? What then does the recourse of
[1:50:44] three votes on the city commission have?
[1:50:47] You would have a completely
[1:50:48] unaccountable city management that would
[1:50:51] require four votes to terminate for not
[1:50:54] following the direction of the majority
[1:50:57] of the body. That is wrong and cannot
[1:50:59] stand. We are [applause]
[1:51:05] we already see this action play out
[1:51:07] today as Commissioner Porter has made
[1:51:09] several motions that have passed this
[1:51:11] body that have never been brought
[1:51:12] forward by the city manager. We're still
[1:51:14] waiting to this day, but she has no
[1:51:16] recourse because there's not a majority
[1:51:19] of this body that has been willing to
[1:51:21] hold the city manager accountable. So,
[1:51:23] I'm not going to support the motion on
[1:51:25] the table because I can't support a
[1:51:26] contract that has an invalid language
[1:51:30] that is contrary to our city charter.
[1:51:35] But I will listen to the pleasure of the
[1:51:37] city commission. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[1:51:39] » Motion on the table for option number
[1:51:40] one made by the mayor, second by the
[1:51:42] mayor pro Tim. All those in favor of the
[1:51:44] motion on table signify by saying I.
[1:51:46] » All those opposed n. And the motion
[1:51:49] passes three to two with the mayor,
[1:51:51] mayor pro Tim and commissioner uh
[1:51:52] Williams Cox in the affirmative with
[1:51:55] commissioner Matlo and Commissioner
[1:51:56] Porter in the negative. Motion passes. I
[1:52:00] will execute the contract in writing
[1:52:03] with uh Dr. Jumville as soon as we can
[1:52:07] get together after this meeting. Uh
[1:52:09] Commissioner Porter for a question.
[1:52:11] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. I I meant to do
[1:52:13] this at the beginning of the meeting. I
[1:52:14] wanted to request
[1:52:16] um that we move item 1201
[1:52:20] to the end of policy formation and
[1:52:22] direction. It seems like 1201 might take
[1:52:25] more time and I don't want to keep 1202
[1:52:27] and 123 waiting.
[1:52:29] » Second.
[1:52:30] » Say that one more time. I'm sorry.
[1:52:32] » If we could move 1201.
[1:52:34] » Oh, sure. Yes. Yes. Yes.
[1:52:35] » End.
[1:52:36] » Take it up at the end. Sure. Absolutely.
[1:52:39] Uh without objection. Okay. Uh we are
[1:52:41] now on the introduction of ordinance
[1:52:43] number 11.01. Madame Attorney,
[1:52:45] » Thank you Mr. Mayor. Item number 11.01
[1:52:48] 01 is the introduction of ordinance
[1:52:50] number 26-Z-12,
[1:52:53] an ordinance of the city of Tallahass,
[1:52:55] Florida, amending the official zoning
[1:52:57] map of the city of Tallahassee, located
[1:52:59] on 3.75 acres located on the west side
[1:53:02] of Paul Russell Road, approximately 150
[1:53:05] ft north of the intersection with Paul
[1:53:08] Russell Road and Orange Avenue East. on
[1:53:11] the official zoning map of the city of
[1:53:13] Tallahassee changing the zoning
[1:53:14] classification of land from critical
[1:53:16] planning area to Paul Russell Road
[1:53:20] rightway abandonment planned unit
[1:53:22] development providing for conflicts
[1:53:24] severability and an affected date. The
[1:53:27] recommended action is option one.
[1:53:28] Introduce ordinance number 26-Z-12
[1:53:32] and set the first and only public
[1:53:33] hearing for October 21 at 6 pm in the
[1:53:38] city of Tallahassee city commission
[1:53:39] chambers at city hall.
[1:53:41] » All right. So there's no
[1:53:42] » Oh, Mr. Mayor, I'm sorry. Excuse me. If
[1:53:43] I could just make sure I comment that
[1:53:45] any exparte disclosures concerning this
[1:53:47] item are available via the hyperlink
[1:53:49] included in the agenda item as published
[1:53:51] in board docs.
[1:53:52] » Excellent. There's no action that needs
[1:53:53] to be taken. We always take a ceremonial
[1:53:55] vote just to add it into the uh record.
[1:53:58] Do we have any public comment on this
[1:53:59] item?
[1:54:00] » Richard Robbie here is to answer
[1:54:02] questions. So no,
[1:54:03] » I'll make a motion for the introduction.
[1:54:05] Is there a second? Second by Mayor Pro
[1:54:07] Tim. All those in favor signify by
[1:54:08] saying I. I.
[1:54:09] » All those opposed? Passes unanimously.
[1:54:11] 50. We're on item number 11.02. Madame
[1:54:14] Attorney.
[1:54:15] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Item number 11.02
[1:54:17] 902 is the introduction of ordinance
[1:54:19] number 26-15,
[1:54:21] an ordinance of the city of Tallahassee,
[1:54:23] Florida, amending sections 21-66,
[1:54:27] 21-284,
[1:54:29] 21-42,
[1:54:31] and 21-43
[1:54:33] of the code of general ordinances of the
[1:54:35] city of Tallahassee relating to water
[1:54:37] and sewer service, including applicable
[1:54:39] fees, charges, and rates, providing for
[1:54:42] conflicts, providing for severability,
[1:54:44] and providing an effective date. The
[1:54:46] recommended action is option one.
[1:54:48] Introduce ordinance number 26-15
[1:54:51] that reflects changes to water and
[1:54:53] wastewater rates, fees, and charges and
[1:54:56] set the first and only public hearing
[1:54:58] for the city commission meeting on
[1:55:00] September 23, 2026 at 6 p.m. in the city
[1:55:04] of Tallahassee city commission chambers
[1:55:06] at city hall.
[1:55:07] » Excellent. One more time, no formal
[1:55:10] action needs to be taken. We take
[1:55:11] ceremonial vote just added into the
[1:55:13] record. Any public comment on this item?
[1:55:15] » No, sir. I'll make the motion to accept.
[1:55:17] » Second,
[1:55:17] » Seconded by the mayor pro Tim,
[1:55:19] Commissioner Matlo for comment.
[1:55:20] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. And I recognize
[1:55:22] this is the introduction, so I'll save
[1:55:24] my comments uh till the the public
[1:55:25] hearing, but I did want to uh request,
[1:55:29] if not already, that the rate study be
[1:55:31] part of the agenda item as well as any
[1:55:34] information on the the sewer expansion
[1:55:36] cost associated with Bannerman Road and
[1:55:39] Meridian that we approved at our our
[1:55:40] last meeting. the the single largest
[1:55:43] thing I hear about utility bills is the
[1:55:45] sewer fees continue uh to increase.
[1:55:48] People are super concerned about this
[1:55:50] and I want to make sure we're we're
[1:55:51] looking to find uh savings in fees
[1:55:53] before increasing their bills yet again.
[1:55:55] Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[1:55:56] » So noted uh Mayor Pertmp.
[1:55:58] » Thank you uh uh Mayor. What I want the
[1:56:02] public that's here today to understand
[1:56:06] that we as a commission did not make
[1:56:09] those decisions on the increases. They
[1:56:13] were based on rate studies that were
[1:56:15] done by independent organizations.
[1:56:19] they have recommended just so that we
[1:56:22] have the funds so that we don't have to
[1:56:26] go back to the the uh residents who are
[1:56:30] using those services to to increase the
[1:56:33] fees. that it is an objective rating
[1:56:38] uh decision and the recommendation is
[1:56:40] made to us in order to make sure that we
[1:56:43] can still provide quality services to
[1:56:47] our t our fee paying uh public. And so
[1:56:51] that's how those decisions or what those
[1:56:54] decisions are being based on. Not what I
[1:56:57] think or feel, but an actual objective
[1:57:02] rating assessment by objective
[1:57:05] organizations that we use for that
[1:57:07] purpose.
[1:57:09] Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[1:57:10] » Excellent. Okay. Ceremonial vote. All
[1:57:13] those in favor of the motion on table
[1:57:14] signify by saying I. I.
[1:57:15] » All those opposed. Passes unanimously.
[1:57:17] 5-0. Any other introduction of
[1:57:19] ordinances come before us today?
[1:57:20] » No, Mr. Mayor,
[1:57:21] » We are on item number 12.02.
[1:57:24] Uh, Mr. Manager,
[1:57:25] » Mr. Mayor, our growth management
[1:57:27] director, John Reick, will introduce
[1:57:29] this item.
[1:57:35] » Thank you. Good evening, mayor and
[1:57:37] commissioners. At your direction, we
[1:57:39] brought before you this item requesting
[1:57:41] your approval to permanently rename a
[1:57:43] portion of West Virginia Street to
[1:57:45] recognize Reverend Dr. RB Holmes Jr. and
[1:57:48] his wife Dr. Gloria P. Holmes. Reverend
[1:57:51] Holmes has served for decades as pastor
[1:57:53] of the historic Bethl Missionary Baptist
[1:57:55] Church. Under his leadership, Bethl has
[1:57:58] expanded its role beyond of the church
[1:57:59] through initiatives focused on
[1:58:01] education, housing, economic
[1:58:03] development, financial opportunity, and
[1:58:06] community services. This includes the
[1:58:08] establishment and development of
[1:58:10] numerous community institutions and
[1:58:11] initiatives including Bethl Christian
[1:58:13] Academy, Steel Collins Charter Middle
[1:58:15] School, Steel Collins Allmale Charter
[1:58:18] Academy, Bethl Family Restaurant, Bethl
[1:58:21] Family Counseling Center, Housing for
[1:58:23] Senior Citizens of Bethl Towers, and the
[1:58:25] Carolina Oaks Subdivision for Firsttime
[1:58:27] Homeowners.
[1:58:29] Reverend Holmes' work has also supported
[1:58:31] economic development and financial
[1:58:32] opportunity in Frenchtown, including the
[1:58:34] establishment of the Frenchtown
[1:58:36] Financial Opportunity Center through a
[1:58:37] partnership between Bethl Missionary
[1:58:39] Baptist Church and local credit unions.
[1:58:43] His service has extended beyond
[1:58:44] Tallahassee through leadership in
[1:58:46] faith-based and civic organizations and
[1:58:48] appointments to university boards and
[1:58:50] statewide, excuse me, statewide
[1:58:52] policymaking body bodies by multiple
[1:58:54] Florida governors. His work has focused
[1:58:56] on strengthening families, expanding
[1:58:58] educational and economic opportunities,
[1:59:01] supporting the revitalization of
[1:59:02] Frenchtown community.
[1:59:05] Dr. Gloria P. Holmes has devoted decades
[1:59:08] to education and community service in
[1:59:10] Tallahassee and throughout Florida after
[1:59:12] receiving a doctorate in library and
[1:59:13] information studies from Florida State
[1:59:15] University. Her career has included
[1:59:17] service as an English teacher, library
[1:59:19] media specialist, director of
[1:59:21] educational media for Duvall and Leyon
[1:59:23] County public schools, and assistant
[1:59:25] dean in the college of education at
[1:59:26] Florida&M University. Dr. Holmes has
[1:59:29] also played an integral role at Bethl
[1:59:31] Christian Academy, established in 1992
[1:59:33] as an educational outreach of Bethl
[1:59:35] Missionary Baptist Church and located
[1:59:38] along West Virginia Street. She served
[1:59:40] in an administrative capacity at the
[1:59:42] academy for more than two decades and
[1:59:44] contributed to its administration,
[1:59:46] curriculum development, and educational
[1:59:48] mission. And in 2021, the academy named
[1:59:50] its library be the Dr. Gloria P. Holmes
[1:59:53] Media Center in recognition of her
[1:59:55] long-standing commitment to education,
[1:59:57] leadership, and service.
[1:59:59] Together, Reverend Dr. RB Holmes Jr. and
[2:00:02] Dr. Gloria P. homes have made
[2:00:03] significant contributions to the
[2:00:04] Frenchtown community and Tallahassee at
[2:00:06] large through education, faith-based
[2:00:08] leadership, community and economic
[2:00:10] development, housing, and service to
[2:00:12] families. The recommendation before you
[2:00:15] to rename West Virginia Street between
[2:00:16] North Adam Street to the east and North
[2:00:19] Copeland Street to the west to be
[2:00:20] doctors RB and Gloria P. Holm Street.
[2:00:23] This segment is a prop is approximately
[2:00:25] 2777
[2:00:27] ft in length. Total of 17 property
[2:00:29] owners are adjacent to the proposed
[2:00:30] segment and 282 addresses will be
[2:00:32] updated to reflect the renaming. With
[2:00:34] your approval, the renaming would
[2:00:36] officially go into effect starting
[2:00:37] October 24th this year. Available if you
[2:00:40] have any questions you this is an
[2:00:43] exciting agenda item for us.
[2:00:46] » Mr. Clerk, do we have any public
[2:00:48] comments?
[2:00:49] » Yes, sir. Or
[2:00:50] » Probably about a half dozen. Let me just
[2:00:52] start off by saying if you are here in
[2:00:54] strong support of this agenda item, will
[2:00:56] you please stand to be recognized?
[2:01:02] » Love it. It's great to have everyone
[2:01:03] here.
[2:01:05] [applause]
[2:01:08] [snorts] Uh I I have a feeling this will
[2:01:10] probably be one of the quickest votes
[2:01:12] that we will take, but we will move
[2:01:14] forward with the uh public comment.
[2:01:16] » Thank you, Mayor. Our first speaker is
[2:01:18] Liz Marberry
[2:01:21] and then James Matthews will follow.
[2:01:22] » Your name and address for the record,
[2:01:24] please.
[2:01:25] » Liz Marberry, 1363 East Tennessee
[2:01:28] Street. Good afternoon, Mayor
[2:01:30] Commissioners, and local citizens. On
[2:01:32] behalf of Live Communications, Inc., I'm
[2:01:34] offer I'm honored to offer our
[2:01:36] wholehearted support for Reverend Dr. RB
[2:01:38] Holmes Jr. and Dr. Gloria P. Holmes, two
[2:01:40] extraordinary servant leaders devoted to
[2:01:42] faith, family, community, and empowering
[2:01:44] others. For more than 50 years, the
[2:01:46] Capital Outlook has been more than a
[2:01:48] newspaper. It has been a voice for our
[2:01:50] community, a platform that has informed,
[2:01:52] encouraged, and inspired generations.
[2:01:54] Its pages have told the stories that
[2:01:55] mattered. We celebrated many
[2:01:57] accomplishments, addressed important
[2:01:59] issues, and have given people a place to
[2:02:01] be seen, heard, and valued. That same
[2:02:03] spirit of service is heard on our
[2:02:05] Hallelujah 95.3 FM radio station.
[2:02:08] Through outstanding programming and our
[2:02:10] amazing guest along with Reverend Holmes
[2:02:12] himself, our airways have provided
[2:02:14] meaningful conversations, information,
[2:02:16] encouragement, and connection.
[2:02:19] That is the very essence of Reverend and
[2:02:21] Dr. Holmes herself. God placed them
[2:02:25] placed in their hands to help somebody.
[2:02:28] God placed using what God has placed in
[2:02:30] their hands to help somebody else that
[2:02:32] at their service reaches far beyond the
[2:02:34] newspaper pages and radio microphones
[2:02:37] through Bethl Missionary Baptist Church,
[2:02:39] Christian education, community
[2:02:40] initiatives, advocacy, and their
[2:02:42] unwavering commitment to people. They
[2:02:44] have spent decades opening doors,
[2:02:45] building bridges, speaking to those who
[2:02:47] needed a voice, and creating
[2:02:48] opportunities for others. Their legacy
[2:02:51] is the people they helped, the lives
[2:02:52] they've touched, and the community they
[2:02:54] inspired. Reverend Dr. RB Holmes Jr. and
[2:02:56] Dr. Gloria P. homes more than deserve
[2:02:58] this recognition. We are truly grateful
[2:03:01] for this moment. We admire and respect
[2:03:03] them both. Live Communications, Inc.
[2:03:05] proudly offers its full support. Thank
[2:03:07] you, mayor and city commissioners for
[2:03:09] this opportunity.
[2:03:11] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[2:03:13] » James Matthews is next, followed by
[2:03:15] Sabrina Allen.
[2:03:16] » Your name and address for the record,
[2:03:18] please.
[2:03:18] » I'm James Matthews, 988 Vio Circle,
[2:03:22] Tallahassee 32312.
[2:03:26] Good afternoon, Mr. Mayor and members of
[2:03:29] the commission. It is my distinct
[2:03:31] privilege and honor to read this
[2:03:33] statement on behalf of Reverend Dr. RB
[2:03:35] Holmes, Jr. and Dr. Gloria P. Holmes, as
[2:03:38] they express their humble gratitude for
[2:03:41] this extraordinary recognition.
[2:03:44] On behalf of our family and ourselves,
[2:03:47] we give our deepest and most sincere
[2:03:49] appreciation for this incredible honor.
[2:03:52] Having a street named in honor is
[2:03:55] something we never imagine and we do not
[2:03:58] take it lightly. We receive this
[2:04:00] recognition with gratitude and humility.
[2:04:04] A street is more than a name on a sign.
[2:04:07] It provides a pathway that connects
[2:04:09] people. It is our prayer that our lives
[2:04:12] and service have helped create a pathway
[2:04:16] for others with encouragement to a young
[2:04:19] person, a strengthened family, a lifted
[2:04:22] community, an open door, or help for
[2:04:26] someone to believe tomorrow could be
[2:04:29] better than today. We thank God for the
[2:04:32] privilege of serving. God's gifts were
[2:04:35] never intended for us alone, but so that
[2:04:38] we might use them to bless and serve
[2:04:41] others. While our names may appear on
[2:04:45] this street, this honor does not belong
[2:04:47] to us alone. It belongs to our family,
[2:04:50] our beloved Bethl Missionary Baptist
[2:04:53] Church family, our friends and
[2:04:56] colleagues, and this wonderful community
[2:04:58] that has loved, supported, prayed for
[2:05:01] us, and traveled alongside us during
[2:05:05] this journey. We are extremely grateful
[2:05:08] to everyone who have made this
[2:05:10] recognition possible. Thank you for
[2:05:13] believing that our years of service were
[2:05:15] worth such an amazing tribute. Our
[2:05:19] prayers
[2:05:20] is that when people travel this street,
[2:05:24] they will see more than our names. We
[2:05:26] hope it inspires others to make a
[2:05:29] difference. Scripture reminds us for
[2:05:32] unto whomver much is given. Of him shall
[2:05:37] be much required. We have been blessed
[2:05:39] beyond measure. We desire to continue
[2:05:42] serving, giving, building, and helping
[2:05:45] others as long as God gives us strength.
[2:05:49] Thank you, city commissioners, for your
[2:05:51] consideration.
[2:05:52] And above all, to God be the glory for
[2:05:56] the great things he has done. God bless
[2:06:00] Reverend Dr. RB Holmes, Jr., and Dr.
[2:06:03] Gloria Price Holmes. Thank you,
[2:06:06] Commissioner.
[2:06:07] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[2:06:09] » Sabrina Allen
[2:06:12] is our next speaker. And then uh
[2:06:15] Claudette Herrell,
[2:06:17] » Your name and address for the record,
[2:06:19] please.
[2:06:19] » My name is Miss Sabrina M. Allen. Do you
[2:06:24] see the M on that paper that I signed?
[2:06:25] » Yes, ma'am.
[2:06:27] » You see it?
[2:06:28] » He did not. I did. I
[2:06:30] » Always use my middle initial. I am
[2:06:32] Sabrina M. Allen,
[2:06:35] Schumar Drive, Tallahassee, Florida.
[2:06:39] I was born and raised in the French town
[2:06:43] area when that entire side of town was
[2:06:48] blackowned and operated.
[2:06:52] Let us not lose our roots.
[2:06:56] Let the record show
[2:06:59] that I oppose renaming any more streets
[2:07:04] in French Town,
[2:07:06] uh, that area.
[2:07:09] The Frenchtown community is too
[2:07:11] important
[2:07:13] to the history of Leyon County for you
[2:07:17] all to tamper with renaming its streets.
[2:07:26] Let us not lose our roots.
[2:07:31] » Thank you.
[2:07:31] » Our next speaker, please.
[2:07:33] » Next speaker is Claudet Herrell and then
[2:07:36] Terrence Henson.
[2:07:44] » Your name and address for the record,
[2:07:45] please.
[2:07:47] » Dr. Claudet Herrell, 1017 at Ping Forest
[2:07:50] Drive. Good afternoon. Giving honor to
[2:07:54] God, Mayor Daly, Mayor Pro Tim,
[2:07:57] [clears throat] members of the city
[2:07:59] commission, city officials in the
[2:08:02] absence of Pastor Holmes and Sister
[2:08:05] Holmes, distinguished guest, and members
[2:08:09] of our community.
[2:08:11] I stand before you today with tremendous
[2:08:14] pride to support the renaming of a
[2:08:17] portion of West Virginia Street in honor
[2:08:21] of the Reverend Dr. RB Holmes Jr. and
[2:08:25] Dr. Gloria Price Holmes. For
[2:08:28] approximately 40 years, Dr. and Mrs.
[2:08:32] homes have devoted themselves to Bethl
[2:08:35] Missionary Baptist Church and this
[2:08:38] community not simply through words but
[2:08:41] through service, sacrifice, compassion,
[2:08:44] and action. One of the clearest examples
[2:08:48] of that commitment came during one of
[2:08:50] the most frightening periods our
[2:08:54] community has faced, the coid9 pandemic.
[2:08:59] While churches and communities has faced
[2:09:02] the coid9
[2:09:04] pandemic, while churches and communities
[2:09:06] were determining
[2:09:08] how best to respond, Dr. Holmes
[2:09:11] recognized that many of our most
[2:09:13] vulnerable citizen needed health care
[2:09:18] brought directly to them. He helped lead
[2:09:21] the effort to purchase Bethl's mobile
[2:09:24] medical unit which was launched into
[2:09:27] underserved communities during the
[2:09:29] pandemic.
[2:09:31] The the unit went where the people were
[2:09:35] through partnerships with physicians,
[2:09:38] nurses, universities, health care
[2:09:41] organizations, and community volunteers.
[2:09:45] Bethl brought screenings, vaccinations,
[2:09:49] health education, referrals, and other
[2:09:53] essential service directly to
[2:09:56] individuals and families who too often
[2:10:01] face barriers to health care.
[2:10:04] Recognizing the growing mental and
[2:10:06] emotional needs of our community, Bethl
[2:10:10] helped establish a mental health clinic
[2:10:14] and strengthen its partnerships with
[2:10:17] Appalache Center, mental health
[2:10:20] professionals, and other community
[2:10:23] partners.
[2:10:24] This comm this commitment created
[2:10:27] another doorway through which
[2:10:30] individuals and families could seek
[2:10:33] help, hope, and healing without shame
[2:10:38] and without judgment.
[2:10:40] » You're at about 15 seconds.
[2:10:41] » Through these 40 years of ministry, Dr.
[2:10:45] Gloria Holmes has faithfully stood
[2:10:48] beside him serving, encouraging,
[2:10:50] educating, nourishing, and helping build
[2:10:53] a legacy centered on faith, family,
[2:10:57] children, and community. Three minutes.
[2:11:00] » That is why. Thank you so much.
[2:11:01] » We are not simply honoring two people
[2:11:04] because they have service for 40 years.
[2:11:08] We are honoring what they did. I'm
[2:11:10] afraid your time is up with these
[2:11:12] communities.
[2:11:13] » Thank you,
[2:11:13] » Commissioners. I ask that you consider
[2:11:15] renaming the street. Thank you.
[2:11:17] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[2:11:18] » Next is Terrence Henson. Terrence Henson
[2:11:21] will be followed by Maisha Mitchell.
[2:11:30] » Your name and address for the record,
[2:11:32] please.
[2:11:32] » Terrence Henson, uh 107 Young Street. Uh
[2:11:37] she could have taken a couple of my
[2:11:38] minutes, so not going to be that long.
[2:11:41] Um, I just want to thank you all
[2:11:43] commissioners for your past continued
[2:11:46] partnership with Bethl Baptist Church,
[2:11:49] particularly uh in creating ways to
[2:11:52] reduce the affordable housing gap here
[2:11:55] in Tallahassee.
[2:11:57] Most of you are aware that Bethl's of
[2:12:00] BETHL's efforts to build 44 town homes
[2:12:04] and 10 single family homes on the Tharp
[2:12:08] Street site.
[2:12:10] city has made a huge financial
[2:12:12] commitment to this project. For BETHL's
[2:12:16] part, um they have committed to
[2:12:18] designate at at a minimum 10% of this
[2:12:22] project for affordable housing, not
[2:12:25] rentals, but home ownership. That's an
[2:12:27] important uh distinction.
[2:12:31] We're in a good place uh where we are
[2:12:33] now. Uh we're coming close to securing
[2:12:36] the site uh the permits from the city.
[2:12:39] so this project can move forward.
[2:12:42] Um,
[2:12:44] a heavier lift is coming and as we shift
[2:12:48] from our planning portion of this to the
[2:12:51] construction, Bethl's going to seek to
[2:12:54] re-engage with you as commissioners so
[2:12:56] we can discuss ways to get the
[2:12:58] infrastructure completed on this
[2:13:00] project. If we're success, excuse me, if
[2:13:03] we're successful in the completion of
[2:13:05] this endeavor, as I expect we will be an
[2:13:09] even larger project is
[2:13:12] » On the boards. Yes, sir.
[2:13:14] » Pause the time for a second. You know,
[2:13:15] we're talking about the street renaming.
[2:13:17] We're not
[2:13:17] » I am. Yeah. But I want to share just uh
[2:13:19] some of the thoughts.
[2:13:21] » Okay. With
[2:13:21] » Okay. I just want to make sure we're on
[2:13:23] track.
[2:13:23] » Yes, sir.
[2:13:24] » Okay.
[2:13:24] » I apologize for if it sounds like I'm
[2:13:27] off track, but this is about Dr. Holmes.
[2:13:29] This is about his legacy. This is about
[2:13:31] affordable housing. This is about the
[2:13:34] church's energy to get the affordable
[2:13:36] housing projects completed.
[2:13:39] So, if we're able to complete this Tharp
[2:13:42] Street project, we are going to seek to
[2:13:45] um build even more homes and they all
[2:13:49] are affordable homes. Uh up to 90 to 100
[2:13:52] homes are planned as well. So, again,
[2:13:56] thank you for your support in the past.
[2:14:00] Uh we will seek your support in the
[2:14:01] future for Bethl's missionary Baptist uh
[2:14:06] home affordable uh uh projects. Thank
[2:14:11] you.
[2:14:12] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[2:14:14] » Next speaker is Maisha Mitchell. She'll
[2:14:17] be followed by Daryl Alfred.
[2:14:24] » Your name and address for the record,
[2:14:26] please.
[2:14:26] » Yeah. Good afternoon. I'm Aisha
[2:14:28] Mitchell. 10009 Ellington Court,
[2:14:31] Tallahassee, Florida, and a long-term
[2:14:35] native resident of Frenchtown community.
[2:14:39] I am not here today to argue the point
[2:14:42] about whether this street should be
[2:14:45] named for Dr. Holmes or anyone else.
[2:14:50] What I say today is that it should not
[2:14:52] be named for anyone. It should remain as
[2:14:55] it is. Why would I say that? Because
[2:14:58] this street
[2:15:01] has more history than any of us living
[2:15:04] in this room. It has been his designated
[2:15:07] historically since the 1900s.
[2:15:12] Many of you have heard of the Green
[2:15:13] Book. The Green Book was designed as a
[2:15:17] motorist guide to African-American
[2:15:21] people traveling throughout the South.
[2:15:23] And why was it designed that way?
[2:15:25] because there was not too many places
[2:15:27] where we could go to rest, to get food,
[2:15:30] to have entertainment,
[2:15:32] even to have uh programs and services
[2:15:35] and extinguish people coming into our
[2:15:37] community. But guess what? It was
[2:15:39] Virginia Street that was named in that
[2:15:42] historic book. So when we start talking
[2:15:45] about naming, why should we why should
[2:15:48] we change the name for an individual no
[2:15:52] matter how much esteem we have for that
[2:15:54] person?
[2:15:55] when we should keep it as it is. Now, I
[2:15:58] realize that Commissioner Cox has
[2:16:00] Williams Cox has been uh very active in
[2:16:03] renaming our streets in our community.
[2:16:06] Some of us don't even know where we are
[2:16:07] now. I'm telling you, it's disorienting
[2:16:11] when you're trying to find your place.
[2:16:12] Some people came to the game and could
[2:16:14] not even find where their families lived
[2:16:16] because the names have changed so much.
[2:16:18] We've had three name changes in
[2:16:19] Frenchtown over the past three months.
[2:16:22] you know to the reverends Pharaoh that
[2:16:25] was formerly known as Central Street,
[2:16:28] Reverend Shephard formerly known as Dwey
[2:16:30] Street,
[2:16:32] Reverend Jax,
[2:16:35] Jesse Jackson, formerly known as
[2:16:36] Carolina Street, which now the work that
[2:16:40] Reverend Holmes did for Carolina Oaks
[2:16:43] doesn't exist. The history be written
[2:16:45] away because of that change of that
[2:16:47] name.
[2:16:49] And the other aspect now is we do
[2:16:51] another naming. It's going to wipe out
[2:16:53] Virginia Street's history and all the
[2:16:56] things that were on that street. You
[2:16:58] can't even imagine.
[2:16:59] » You're at 30 seconds remaining.
[2:17:00] » Okay. But I say no to the changing. It's
[2:17:03] nothing personal. It's about this is
[2:17:06] home and it's historic.
[2:17:08] » Thank you.
[2:17:09] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[2:17:11] » Next speaker is Daryl Alfred and then
[2:17:14] Kim Okconor.
[2:17:19] your name and address for the record,
[2:17:20] please.
[2:17:21] » Hey guys, my name is Daryl Alfred. I
[2:17:24] live at 814 West Tharp Street and uh I
[2:17:27] stand here today in opposition. Um
[2:17:31] I stand with I stand before you today in
[2:17:33] solidarity with the residents in
[2:17:35] opposition to the renaming of these
[2:17:36] streets. Virginia Street isn't just
[2:17:38] another street name. It's part of
[2:17:40] Tallahassy's history. During
[2:17:42] segregation, the Negro Motorist Green
[2:17:44] Book helped black travelers find places
[2:17:46] where they could safely eat, sleep, and
[2:17:48] travel without being turned away or
[2:17:49] putting themselves in danger. The Tuks
[2:17:52] Hotel on Virginia Street was part of
[2:17:54] that history. It gave black travelers a
[2:17:56] safe place to stay when something as
[2:17:58] basic as lodging wasn't guaranteed to us
[2:18:01] elsewhere. For that reason, it became a
[2:18:03] point of access with historical
[2:18:04] recognition in our city for black
[2:18:06] residents and visitors alike. that
[2:18:08] matters and I think there's a connection
[2:18:10] between access then and access now. Back
[2:18:12] then the issue was access to a hotel.
[2:18:15] Today it's access to the decisions that
[2:18:17] shape community. People who live in
[2:18:19] Frenchtown, grew up in Frenchtown and
[2:18:21] carry its history should know about a
[2:18:23] change like this before it's already
[2:18:24] headed toward a vote. They should have a
[2:18:27] meaningful opportunity to say whether
[2:18:28] they want it. This doesn't have to be an
[2:18:31] argument against honoring Doc uh
[2:18:33] Reverend RB and Gloria Holmes. We should
[2:18:37] honor them. I think we can all
[2:18:38] appreciate the many contributions the
[2:18:40] Reverend and First Lady have brought to
[2:18:41] our community. It just seems we can
[2:18:43] honor people without erasing or
[2:18:45] replacing another piece of black history
[2:18:46] to do it. Frenchtown has already
[2:18:49] experienced enormous changes in eraser
[2:18:51] in the past 20 years, and too often the
[2:18:53] people most connected to the
[2:18:54] neighborhood are brought into the
[2:18:55] conversation after decisions are already
[2:18:57] moving. That shouldn't happen here. If
[2:19:00] we're considering changing the name of a
[2:19:02] historic street, the community should be
[2:19:04] involved from the beginning. As with any
[2:19:06] decision, not informed at the end of a
[2:19:09] short runway for change, preservation
[2:19:11] and recognition don't have to compete,
[2:19:13] but on something this connected to
[2:19:15] Frenchtown's history, community consent
[2:19:17] should come first. Thanks.
[2:19:20] » Our next speaker, please. Next speaker
[2:19:22] is Kim Okconor.
[2:19:24] And mayor, this is the last speaker I
[2:19:26] have on the item.
[2:19:26] » Okay.
[2:19:39] your name and address for the record,
[2:19:41] please.
[2:19:41] » Kim O'Coner,
[2:19:44] 301 East Carolina Street.
[2:19:50] Um,
[2:19:52] I keep in I signed up for public
[2:19:56] comments way at the end addressed to
[2:19:58] nothing, but I just you all know how
[2:20:01] much I love Reverend Holmes and I just
[2:20:03] had to speak. But then when I heard when
[2:20:06] I heard before those ladies talked, when
[2:20:09] I heard um part of Virginia Street, I
[2:20:13] just thought, why not all of Duvall
[2:20:15] Street? you know, he came here from
[2:20:17] Duvall and that's a big long street and
[2:20:19] it's not Virginia Street. So, but I just
[2:20:22] uh any street any recognition for
[2:20:25] Reverend Holmes and he remembers me. I
[2:20:27] visited the church and when Michael
[2:20:29] Fagen was talking and uh he remembers me
[2:20:33] from 1983 when I was a death penalty
[2:20:36] activist and he came with Jesse Jackson
[2:20:39] and they went to govern when Jackson was
[2:20:42] a was 84 when he was running for
[2:20:46] president to campaign but they brought a
[2:20:49] letter from Scott King to the governor
[2:20:53] asking him to spare the life of a
[2:20:55] convicted did u civil rights civil right
[2:21:00] murderer civil rights activist. So just
[2:21:03] I couldn't miss this opportunity to say
[2:21:06] how much Reverend Holmes means to me of
[2:21:08] all I think
[2:21:13] [applause]
[2:21:16] » Mayor I have been given one additional
[2:21:18] speaker.
[2:21:18] » Okay our next speaker please. Uh,
[2:21:20] Zachary Bell.
[2:21:29] » My name is Zachary Bell. Uh, I believe
[2:21:30] my address is exempt first responder,
[2:21:33] but uh, one consideration I had, I'm not
[2:21:37] really pro or against this particular
[2:21:39] topic, but is this go into effect late
[2:21:41] October? Is this going to potentially
[2:21:43] affect anyone's voter registration right
[2:21:45] before November?
[2:21:47] um
[2:21:48] » That could be a problem for a number of
[2:21:50] residents, especially with their growing
[2:21:52] scrutiny on mail ballots. Thank you.
[2:21:54] » Our next speaker, please.
[2:21:56] » Mayor, that's the last speaker I have.
[2:21:58] » All right. Is there a motion to begin uh
[2:22:01] discussion? Commissioner Williams Cox.
[2:22:02] » Yes, sir. Um Mr. Mayor, I I move very
[2:22:06] proudly that we move forward with the
[2:22:08] renaming of um the portion of Virginia
[2:22:11] Street described for Reverend but for uh
[2:22:14] Drs. RB Holmes Jr. and his wife Gloria
[2:22:18] Price Holmes.
[2:22:19] » I will second it with Commission with
[2:22:21] the Mayor Pro Tim. Uh for comment,
[2:22:24] Commissioner Porter.
[2:22:25] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I um we all may
[2:22:28] have received the email from Deletri
[2:22:30] Hollinger who
[2:22:33] um made I think a great suggestion which
[2:22:35] was that we rename instead a portion of
[2:22:39] North Bernau Street. I think because of
[2:22:42] the concerns
[2:22:43] and and they're not not just because of
[2:22:45] concerns from residents, but because of
[2:22:47] the historic significance. Um I just
[2:22:50] wonder if we would consider moving
[2:22:53] forward with a change to Reno Street
[2:22:55] instead.
[2:22:58] And I want to just say very quickly, I
[2:23:00] want to thank I mean I won't repeat
[2:23:02] what's been said. This is nothing to do
[2:23:04] with um with doctors RB and Gloria
[2:23:08] Holmes, but I I I really think it would
[2:23:12] be a shame to rename
[2:23:14] West Virginia Street given that special
[2:23:17] history.
[2:23:19] » Thank you, Commissioner Williams.
[2:23:21] » On point. Thank you, Commissioner
[2:23:23] Porter. I'm I guess we we we're not
[2:23:27] trying to erase history. History is
[2:23:29] history and it it's well documented. But
[2:23:32] I think what we're doing is we're trying
[2:23:34] to honor honor some folks who've done
[2:23:36] tremendous work in that in that
[2:23:38] community in that area that brought
[2:23:40] great value and even more historic um u
[2:23:43] honor to um that area. So not trying to,
[2:23:48] you know, eliminate history. I I'm a you
[2:23:51] know big supporter of history um and
[2:23:53] love history. Um but um this is the the
[2:24:01] the synergy here is the
[2:24:05] portion of Virginia Street is the
[2:24:07] southern portion around the um family
[2:24:11] life center. On the north end of the
[2:24:14] family life center built by Bethl under
[2:24:16] the leadership of Reverend Holmes and
[2:24:17] his wife. on the north end is um
[2:24:20] Reverend Jesse Jackson Street and to the
[2:24:24] west end of it is um Martin Luther King
[2:24:28] and before it goes on to the others. So
[2:24:30] it's the the synergy of uh folks who
[2:24:33] have um made tremendous impact in our
[2:24:36] community in the world. And I think that
[2:24:38] the children who will continue to grow
[2:24:41] go and grow through the family lifesty
[2:24:46] um will know that history as well. But
[2:24:48] there's nothing to prevent us from
[2:24:50] teaching them the history of Frenchtown
[2:24:53] and other communities um around our our
[2:24:56] our city. So to that point, I'm I I did
[2:25:00] get Deletri's email as well.
[2:25:02] » Yeah.
[2:25:03] » Um but that is not the um that is not
[2:25:07] something that I would support.
[2:25:09] » Okay.
[2:25:09] » Mayor Pimp,
[2:25:10] » Thank you.
[2:25:11] » Okay. I wasn't done, Mr. Mayor.
[2:25:12] » Oh.
[2:25:14] » Uh she wasn't speaking on point. She was
[2:25:16] recognized to speak. You have had a
[2:25:18] chance.
[2:25:18] » I asked a question. She answered. I was
[2:25:20] still I still have
[2:25:21] » I apologize. You are correct. It is your
[2:25:23] time. I'm sorry.
[2:25:24] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um, and and I
[2:25:28] understand. I just think that especially
[2:25:29] given
[2:25:32] that Renault Street is named after a
[2:25:35] close confidant of Andrew Jackson, the
[2:25:37] first president of the territorial
[2:25:39] legislation.
[2:25:41] There's a pretty shameful racist history
[2:25:42] there. So, I think it would be just that
[2:25:44] much more befitting to rename that
[2:25:46] street. I I understand. I I I take your
[2:25:48] point. Um but regretfully I just don't
[2:25:51] think that I can support it today given
[2:25:54] given
[2:25:56] what I have learned and also just as a
[2:25:58] bigger message I don't want to be put in
[2:26:00] this position again um this has happened
[2:26:03] in the past where direction was given to
[2:26:06] rename Wish way this if there is
[2:26:09] historical significance
[2:26:11] that should be a part of this item that
[2:26:13] comes back to us so that we are not in
[2:26:15] this position I later found out that
[2:26:18] that street was incredibly significant
[2:26:20] to members of our Jewish community
[2:26:21] because Mayor Wanish was the first
[2:26:24] Jewish mayor of of Tallahassee. So, I
[2:26:28] didn't want to make these comments
[2:26:30] during this discussion, but since
[2:26:31] because I don't want to take away from
[2:26:33] the significance of this of this honor,
[2:26:37] but I do not want to be in this position
[2:26:40] again. If there is historical
[2:26:42] significance that the commission needs
[2:26:44] to know about when making a decision
[2:26:46] like this, including V West Virginia
[2:26:49] Street, it should be part of our agenda
[2:26:52] materials, not only for the commission,
[2:26:54] but for the public, so that we're not in
[2:26:56] this position again. Thank you,
[2:26:58] » Mayor Pim.
[2:26:59] » Thank you. Uh Mr. Mayor, I fully support
[2:27:04] uh the motion on the on the DAZ before
[2:27:09] the DAZ at this point. I fully support
[2:27:11] it apparently based on the comments that
[2:27:16] were presented to us by Mr. Matthews on
[2:27:20] behalf of doctors RB and Gloria Holmes.
[2:27:25] They have agreed to this uh and feel
[2:27:28] comfortable with it. Uh, and I think we
[2:27:30] should move forward with it. Um, to to
[2:27:34] put forth a recommendation at the last
[2:27:37] minute like this that came from one
[2:27:40] person, uh, I don't think is appropriate
[2:27:43] when you've got almost half a room here
[2:27:46] at the city commission chambers in
[2:27:48] support of what's being proposed here
[2:27:51] today. I feel like we should move
[2:27:53] forward with it. Uh, I understand your
[2:27:56] concerns, uh, Commissioner Porter, but
[2:27:59] to come with this at the last minute
[2:28:01] when Commissioner Williams Cox has made
[2:28:04] the motion, uh, there is tremendous
[2:28:06] support for it. Uh, I think we need to
[2:28:09] move forward uh, with what's been
[2:28:11] brought before us here today.
[2:28:14] » Mr. Porter,
[2:28:16] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And I just want to
[2:28:17] say I fully intended to come here
[2:28:19] supporting this item. I was not aware of
[2:28:22] the historical significance of that
[2:28:24] street. So, it was last minute
[2:28:26] information to me as well. So, I want to
[2:28:29] make that clear. It was it was never my
[2:28:31] intent to vote to vote against this. And
[2:28:34] respectfully, Commissioner Richardson, I
[2:28:36] mean, we just heard new we just heard
[2:28:40] not a single person speak in favor of a
[2:28:42] supermajority for the city manager's
[2:28:44] contract. So, [applause] I think it's
[2:28:46] important and I'm sure I'm sure and I I
[2:28:49] I cannot speak for the members here in
[2:28:52] the audience who are here to support
[2:28:53] this item, but I would guess that their
[2:28:56] interest is that that they're that these
[2:29:01] outstanding community leaders are
[2:29:02] recognized and honored and not that it
[2:29:04] be necessarily in in one
[2:29:08] street. I understand the historical
[2:29:09] significance of that of that area to to
[2:29:12] the ministry as well, but you know,
[2:29:15] that's just where I'm at and I
[2:29:16] apologize. Thank you.
[2:29:18] » All right. There is a motion on the
[2:29:19] table to uh accept uh option number one
[2:29:23] made by Commissioner Williams Cox,
[2:29:25] seconded by the mayor and Mayor Pro Tim.
[2:29:28] Uh Commissioner Matlo, you are
[2:29:29] recognized. [clears throat]
[2:29:30] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh I don't have
[2:29:33] strong feelings about which road gets
[2:29:35] renamed. Um, I do have strong feelings
[2:29:37] that we we rename a road in honor um of
[2:29:41] Dr. Gloria and RB Holmes. Uh, to me that
[2:29:44] I think Bruno does need to be renamed. I
[2:29:46] think Call Street needs to be renamed. I
[2:29:47] think there's a lot of roads in our
[2:29:48] community that have shameful history uh
[2:29:50] that we should be uh looking at. Um, and
[2:29:53] I understand what's being presented
[2:29:55] today is the will of of the majority.
[2:29:56] And I'm happy uh to support that because
[2:29:58] I do think we do need to make sure uh we
[2:30:01] continue to honor the people who have um
[2:30:04] invested uh their lives in improving uh
[2:30:06] the city of Tallahassee. Thank you, Mr.
[2:30:08] Mayor.
[2:30:09] » All those in favor of the motion on the
[2:30:10] table signify by saying I.
[2:30:12] » I.
[2:30:12] » All those opposed?
[2:30:14] » Nay.
[2:30:14] » And it passes 41 with Commissioner
[2:30:16] Porter in descent. We look forward to
[2:30:18] celebrating with you very soon.
[2:30:21] [applause]
[2:30:24] Colleagues, we have a long meeting ahead
[2:30:26] of us. We're going to go ahead and
[2:30:27] recess. We will come back at 6:00 for
[2:30:29] the public hearing.
[2:30:42] Gentlemen, I'd like to call this public
[2:30:44] hearing to order. It is 6:03 in the
[2:30:47] evening. Uh there are four of us in
[2:30:49] chambers and I know Commissioner
[2:30:50] Williams Cox is in route as we speak.
[2:30:54] Folks, we will take up uh 16.01 of the
[2:30:58] public hearing. 16.02 16.03 16.04.
[2:31:03] Once we are done with the public
[2:31:04] hearing, we will resort back to 12.03
[2:31:09] 12.01.
[2:31:11] Then we will take unagended speakers.
[2:31:13] Then we will have the sharing of ideas.
[2:31:15] Just so that everybody is clear on the
[2:31:17] schedule for this evening. Right now we
[2:31:19] are on 16.01, the first of two public
[2:31:21] hearings on the fiscal year 27 budget
[2:31:24] plan. Mr. Manager, I will turn it over
[2:31:26] to you for the budget presentation.
[2:31:28] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I'd like to
[2:31:30] recognize Robert Wigan. He is our
[2:31:32] director of resource management. He's
[2:31:35] here to provide a presentation and
[2:31:37] overview of this year's budget. He's
[2:31:39] joined by his staff. They've done a good
[2:31:42] job putting this together. U I'm very
[2:31:44] pleased with the budget. It's a
[2:31:46] challenging year. We've talked about
[2:31:47] that. You've given us good direction
[2:31:48] over the course of the year. Um and this
[2:31:52] starts to bring in the final steps as
[2:31:54] you mentioned the first of two public
[2:31:56] hearings that'll occur tonight. So with
[2:31:58] that, Mr. Mayor, I'll ask Robert to
[2:32:00] begin with his presentation.
[2:32:01] » Robert, before we begin, uh for eight
[2:32:04] years now, I've had the opportunity to
[2:32:06] work with you and the budget uh office
[2:32:09] uh on our budget cycles. Every year I am
[2:32:12] absolutely amazed and impressed by the
[2:32:14] level of professionalism and quite
[2:32:17] honestly expertise of you and your team.
[2:32:20] This will be our last budget that we
[2:32:22] have the opportunity to work with on a
[2:32:23] personal level. I want you to know how
[2:32:25] much I appreciate the hard work that you
[2:32:27] and your team does. You all are a
[2:32:30] nationally awardwinning and recognized
[2:32:33] budget office. You do incredible work
[2:32:35] during some very difficult times and I
[2:32:38] just want you to know on a personal note
[2:32:39] how much I appreciate it. go ahead with
[2:32:41] the presentation and uh we'll go from
[2:32:43] there.
[2:32:44] » Thank you very much, Mayor. Uh thank you
[2:32:46] uh for the introduction. Uh Mayor, city
[2:32:48] manager go um [clears throat]
[2:32:50] commissioners, appointed officials and
[2:32:52] members of the public who are here. We
[2:32:54] are here to talk about the city of
[2:32:56] Tallahassee fiscal year 27 uh budget
[2:32:59] adoption. This is our first public
[2:33:01] hearing. We'll have a second public
[2:33:02] hearing on September 23rd uh to to go
[2:33:05] through the final steps of adopting that
[2:33:07] fiscal year 27 budget. We've gotten here
[2:33:10] through um your strategic planning
[2:33:13] workshop, through three workshops of our
[2:33:16] own, as well as these two public
[2:33:18] hearings. Uh we have some very specific
[2:33:20] goals tonight. Um that we're conducting
[2:33:23] the first of the two public hearings. Uh
[2:33:25] the operating budget is $983 million.
[2:33:28] That's across 14 major funds. the
[2:33:31] general fund we pay the most attention
[2:33:33] to uh because it's the most constrained
[2:33:36] with property taxes only making
[2:33:39] [clears throat] 94% of what our police
[2:33:41] budget uh requires. Uh the the other 13
[2:33:45] funds are independent and stand alone
[2:33:47] among themselves. Uh this B budget we're
[2:33:50] bringing to is balanced. Uh some of the
[2:33:53] steps that we'll go through as goals
[2:33:54] will adopt the current mill rate of
[2:33:56] 4.4072.
[2:33:59] um that will ensure us a surplus of $2.5
[2:34:02] million ahead of the November property
[2:34:04] tax amendment vote and I'll get into
[2:34:06] more a little more details of that in
[2:34:08] the presentation. We'll ask you to
[2:34:10] approve new healthc care rates for
[2:34:12] calendar year 2027. Uh we're very
[2:34:15] comfortable where this positions
[2:34:17] employees within the city. As you'll
[2:34:19] remember, your direction was to was to
[2:34:21] mitigate the cost impacts over time. And
[2:34:24] we've maintained that uh uh at 20% paid
[2:34:27] by employees, 80% paid by by by uh the
[2:34:30] city. Um and there was just a minimal
[2:34:33] change of what the healthcare rates were
[2:34:35] from what we assumed and so so no need
[2:34:38] to adjust for the budget. Uh we'll ask
[2:34:40] you to adopt rate resolutions for solid
[2:34:42] waste and parking rates. And then uh and
[2:34:45] that's based on the financing the
[2:34:46] government policy where we want to
[2:34:48] ensure that those who are receiving the
[2:34:50] services are paying for those services
[2:34:53] uh rather than laying it on the feet of
[2:34:54] the uh residential and commercial
[2:34:56] property owners. Uh and then as you all
[2:34:59] know we introduced the water and
[2:35:00] wastewater ordinance for rates, fees and
[2:35:02] charges. Uh Commissioner Matlo uh we
[2:35:05] will bring those documents back that you
[2:35:07] asked for uh in the in the September
[2:35:09] 23rd uh uh uh uh hearing. uh and and
[2:35:14] appreciate that comment and thank you
[2:35:16] Commissioner Richardson for similar
[2:35:18] comments. Um
[2:35:21] as you well know uh the fiscal year 27
[2:35:24] budget highlights our strategic
[2:35:25] investments and high level services. We
[2:35:28] uh fund city services, staff and
[2:35:30] resources in accordance with the
[2:35:32] strategic plan priorities. public safety
[2:35:34] is a a a significant priority and this
[2:35:37] budget includes additional police
[2:35:39] officers and then continues your public
[2:35:41] safety wraparound services that support
[2:35:43] those officers. Uh we also uh are
[2:35:47] recognizing and celebrating this budget
[2:35:50] because it'll be the first time in 10
[2:35:52] years that we're entering a fiscal year
[2:35:54] with a balanced uh with a fully funded
[2:35:56] deficiencies fund. Um, we, as you well
[2:36:00] know, we we went through the housing
[2:36:01] crisis. We went through the pandemic.
[2:36:03] [clears throat] We've been through many
[2:36:04] storms. Uh, this is this has been built
[2:36:07] up over time as we've recovered uh from
[2:36:10] those storms and gotten reimbursed by
[2:36:12] FEMA. Uh, this has been restored as
[2:36:15] we've gone through uh certain land sales
[2:36:17] that have that are by policy go back to
[2:36:20] that deficiencies fund. And so it's very
[2:36:22] uh you know that that that direction
[2:36:25] that you've given us in multiple
[2:36:26] different agenda items where we've
[2:36:28] brought back that plan of how to restore
[2:36:30] the deficiencies fund was intentional
[2:36:33] and um you know uh very fiscally sound
[2:36:37] and we appreciate that direction and and
[2:36:39] uh we we we also want to recognize that
[2:36:42] we're entering this fiscal year in that
[2:36:44] capacity. I'll [clears throat] mention
[2:36:46] also that one of the reasons that we're
[2:36:48] recommending the to maintain the
[2:36:51] millillage at 4.072
[2:36:53] is that then gives us a head start on
[2:36:55] fiscal year 28. uh because of the cost
[2:36:59] savings that we're realizing from VSSI,
[2:37:01] because of the efficiencies and
[2:37:03] effectiveness that you've demanded of us
[2:37:05] on a regular basis, our sharpening of
[2:37:07] the pencil, um we're able to identify a
[2:37:10] surplus in fiscal year 27 because of the
[2:37:14] expenditures being reduced, that
[2:37:16] additional increment of $2.8 8 million
[2:37:19] between the roll back rate on a on a
[2:37:22] super maj on a majority vote versus a
[2:37:25] super majority vote um of the 4.4072
[2:37:28] military enables us to get a head start
[2:37:31] ahead of the um you know what we may see
[2:37:35] uh in in the homestead exemption uh vote
[2:37:38] in November.
[2:37:40] Um, as part of that recognition of what
[2:37:42] we do to be financially sound and
[2:37:45] responsible, Fitch Ratings has
[2:37:47] reaffirmed our city city's doubleA
[2:37:50] credit rating and stable outlook. Uh,
[2:37:52] they also cited the highest possible
[2:37:54] assessment for financial resilience. Uh,
[2:37:56] that takes the team of the 14 funds
[2:37:58] working together uh with the treasur
[2:38:01] clerk's office with your direction and
[2:38:03] uh part of that has to be the
[2:38:05] deficiencies fund being in a good state.
[2:38:08] Uh as you have directed in in the in the
[2:38:11] strategic plan uh we continue investing
[2:38:13] in electric vehicle infrastructure, fast
[2:38:16] charging technology and also across the
[2:38:18] organization uh energy efficient
[2:38:21] operations
[2:38:26] based [snorts] on financial based on the
[2:38:29] financing the government policy uh
[2:38:31] commission policy 224. We also strive to
[2:38:35] fully recover the costs from programs
[2:38:37] and services from those who benefit from
[2:38:39] the services. You know, a lot of our our
[2:38:42] utilities are volume based. They're
[2:38:45] frequency based. Um there are means to
[2:38:48] uh uh conserve and and and and reduce
[2:38:52] your utility bills, but there are
[2:38:54] specific rates and fees and charges that
[2:38:57] are only for certain uh entities within
[2:39:00] within the community. And so we want to
[2:39:02] make so sure that those specialized
[2:39:04] services are not subsidized by either
[2:39:06] residential or or small commercial
[2:39:08] customers. So uh what we're bringing
[2:39:11] forward in this in this fiscal year 27
[2:39:14] budget to balance it is solid waste
[2:39:16] rates that are set to fully recover the
[2:39:18] cost of services. Uh primarily that
[2:39:21] those cost of service increases are
[2:39:24] higher disposal fees charged by Leyon
[2:39:26] County. they're addressing that uh
[2:39:28] increased cost in their agenda item,
[2:39:30] their upcoming budget agenda item and
[2:39:31] and acknowledge that that that's a
[2:39:34] shared cost between the two entities. Uh
[2:39:36] we're also making recommendation to
[2:39:38] adjust fees to align with the rising
[2:39:40] cost of providing parking services. Uh
[2:39:42] it's a very valuable commodity and we
[2:39:44] want to make sure that we're
[2:39:45] representing the market well and that
[2:39:47] applies to city operated garages
[2:39:49] including Clayman Plaza and the East
[2:39:51] Side Garage. And then lastly uh based on
[2:39:54] the independent rate study uh from our
[2:39:56] consultant Lidos engineering we looked
[2:39:59] at fiscal year 26 as the baseline
[2:40:01] evaluated fiscal year 27 28 and 29 the
[2:40:05] cost of operations the cost of
[2:40:07] maintaining our system and then any
[2:40:09] improvements in that infrastructure.
[2:40:12] As such we're bringing forward nominal
[2:40:14] increases uh in the water fund about 25
[2:40:17] cents per month uh in the wastewater
[2:40:19] fund about $2.58. And as you'll well
[2:40:22] remember, we're ahead of the game with
[2:40:24] our advanced wastewater treatment uh
[2:40:27] because we know what how much of a
[2:40:29] valuable commodity our our our water
[2:40:31] system is and and the the aquifer that
[2:40:33] we use. Uh to give you assurance on a
[2:40:37] regular basis, we look at our municipal
[2:40:39] cost across this basket of goods. We
[2:40:43] compare ourselves then to similar
[2:40:45] communities and we see that we're we
[2:40:47] would remain within the third lowest
[2:40:49] among those 12 pure cities even with
[2:40:52] implementing these rate changes. And so
[2:40:54] we're comfortable bringing those
[2:40:55] forward.
[2:40:59] With that, um, I'll bring forward, um,
[2:41:02] uh, that with with with that as
[2:41:04] background, I'll bring forward that
[2:41:05] we'll ask you to take the actions that
[2:41:07] are listed under the public hearing
[2:41:09] steps to approve the tenative millage
[2:41:11] rate of 4.4072,
[2:41:13] the tenative DIA millage rate of 1 mil
[2:41:16] and then both of those by supermajority.
[2:41:19] Uh, we'll ask you to adopt the fiscal
[2:41:21] year to fiscal year 27 proposed
[2:41:24] operating and capital budgets as
[2:41:26] presented. uh uh approve the calendar
[2:41:29] year 27 health plan rates and then op
[2:41:32] adopt the resolutions for solid waste
[2:41:34] and parking rates. And again, just to
[2:41:36] repeat, the the final public hearing to
[2:41:38] consider these items are is in September
[2:41:40] 23rd at at 6:00 p.m. Uh as unless
[2:41:45] there's initial questions as we proceed,
[2:41:48] there's a statutoily direct order to
[2:41:50] ensure the budget is adopted and read
[2:41:52] into the record uh as the legislature
[2:41:55] has directed. Uh the process is
[2:41:57] conducted by the city attorney and we
[2:42:00] can proceed to open the public hearing
[2:42:01] at at your uh at your agreement.
[2:42:03] » Sounds great. Before we get into the
[2:42:05] formalities, are there any questions of
[2:42:09] simply clarification for Robert?
[2:42:13] » Madame Attorney.
[2:42:15] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um Florida statute
[2:42:18] section 200.065
[2:42:20] requires two public hearings to adopt
[2:42:22] the milligen budget. These hearings
[2:42:25] scheduled for today, September 9, and
[2:42:27] September 23rd, 2026, do not conflict
[2:42:30] with the county or school board public
[2:42:32] hearing dates. Specific actions required
[2:42:34] at this first public hearing in the
[2:42:36] required order of execution are
[2:42:38] delineated as follows. The proposed mill
[2:42:41] rate for fiscal year 27 is 4.472
[2:42:45] for the city of Tallahassee and 1.00 000
[2:42:49] for the downtown improvement authority
[2:42:52] which is more than the aggregate rolled
[2:42:54] back rate of 4.2782
[2:42:57] by 3.47%.
[2:43:00] Resolution number 26-R31
[2:43:04] which is provided
[2:43:06] uh to state the percentage and the
[2:43:08] tenative mill rate is above the rolled
[2:43:10] back rate is in attachment A. The title
[2:43:13] to the resolution setting forth the city
[2:43:16] commission's approvals are as follows.
[2:43:18] Resolution number 26-R31,
[2:43:21] a resolution establishing the millage
[2:43:23] rate for the fiscal year beginning
[2:43:25] October 1, 2026 and ending September 30,
[2:43:29] 2027 as 4.472
[2:43:33] mills for the city of Tallahassee and
[2:43:35] 1.0000
[2:43:37] mil for the downtown improvement
[2:43:39] authority. providing that the resulting
[2:43:41] aggregate millage rate of 4.4267
[2:43:44] mills exceeds the aggregate rolled back
[2:43:47] rate of 4.2782
[2:43:50] mills by 3.47%
[2:43:53] and providing an an effective date. The
[2:43:56] city commission will also consider
[2:43:58] resolution number 26R-32,
[2:44:01] a resolution adopting the operating and
[2:44:03] capital budgets for the city of
[2:44:04] Tallahassee and the operating budget for
[2:44:07] the downtown improvement authority for
[2:44:09] the fiscal year beginning October 1,
[2:44:11] 2026 and ending September 30, 2027,
[2:44:15] designating the sources of revenue and
[2:44:17] set appropriations and providing an
[2:44:19] effective date.
[2:44:23] The next steps are to allow public input
[2:44:25] on the city's proposed millillage and
[2:44:27] the city's proposed budget. If anyone
[2:44:29] has signed up to give public comment,
[2:44:30] they can speak on either the proposed
[2:44:32] millillage or the proposed budget for
[2:44:34] the city at this time. In compliance
[2:44:36] with Florida statute section 2200.065,
[2:44:40] the date of this hearing was included in
[2:44:42] the trim notice which was mailed to all
[2:44:44] property owners in August by the Leyon
[2:44:46] County Property Appraiser to advertise
[2:44:48] this hearing.
[2:44:50] » Mr. Clerk, do we have any public input
[2:44:52] on the city's proposed millillage of
[2:44:54] 4.4072
[2:44:55] in proposed budget?
[2:44:57] » Mayor, we have two speakers on 16001.
[2:45:00] Um, I think we should go ahead and call
[2:45:01] them now. They may comment on the budget
[2:45:03] as well as the millillage, but those two
[2:45:05] are Douglas Han and Brandon McIntyre.
[2:45:07] » Excellent.
[2:45:09] Your name and address for the record.
[2:45:11] You have three minutes.
[2:45:15] » My name is Douglas Han. I live at 2072
[2:45:18] Florida Avenue here in Tallahassee. I've
[2:45:20] been a citizen here for nine years.
[2:45:22] Leaving commissioner members, gun
[2:45:24] violence in Tallahassee and Lean County
[2:45:26] not only has a human cost, but it has an
[2:45:28] economic cost. Gun violence in the first
[2:45:31] nine months of this year is trending
[2:45:34] downwards, notably with only one death
[2:45:36] since early June. Although gun injuries
[2:45:38] and shootings are at a more modest
[2:45:40] decline, a good trend, but remember, we
[2:45:43] are looking at small numbers. They do
[2:45:45] seem to be in line with prepandemic
[2:45:47] numbers.
[2:45:50] Based on algorithms for Florida from the
[2:45:53] Pacific Institute for Research and
[2:45:55] Evaluation, gun violence to date this
[2:45:58] year has cost our community, families,
[2:46:01] businesses, and governments nearly $190
[2:46:04] million.
[2:46:07] Of that, almost $9.5 million from
[2:46:10] taxpayers. This includes six and a half
[2:46:13] millions for the criminal justice system
[2:46:16] and $2 million for police.
[2:46:21] What does this cost not include?
[2:46:24] Seven of 10 deaths by gun violence has
[2:46:27] been by suicide. That is not included in
[2:46:29] these figures.
[2:46:31] Shootings without death or injuries,
[2:46:33] like the shooting at the mall this
[2:46:34] weekend, involved the police and the
[2:46:37] courts. Those costs are not included in
[2:46:39] these figures. A 15-year-old is to be
[2:46:42] tried as an adult and this could easily
[2:46:45] have been a another mass shooting in
[2:46:48] Tallahassee who was young persons with
[2:46:52] no impulse control in a crowded mall.
[2:46:57] The cost of protecting you commissioners
[2:47:00] with metal detectors and guards
[2:47:03] downstairs protects you, but it's not in
[2:47:05] the cost. When you go home tonight, you
[2:47:09] may stop at Publix, pick up a gallon of
[2:47:11] milk, you will not be protected.
[2:47:15] Uh, when your children return a book to
[2:47:17] the library, you will not be protected.
[2:47:21] When your wife or your husband goes to
[2:47:24] vote in elections in November, they will
[2:47:27] not be protected.
[2:47:30] The community based violence
[2:47:33] intervention and prevention funds that
[2:47:36] we've had for the last five years have
[2:47:39] been eliminated by the Trump
[2:47:40] administration in April. We had almost
[2:47:44] 150
[2:47:46] one mill one.5 million
[2:47:49] uh grants from the federal government
[2:47:51] over five years.
[2:47:52] » You're at 30 seconds remaining.
[2:47:54] » Please,
[2:47:56] this was for local law enforcement. This
[2:47:58] is for the council for the status of men
[2:48:00] and boys and for the FSU studies. Go to
[2:48:03] the FSU department of uh criminal
[2:48:08] criminology and ask them what we can do.
[2:48:11] They have some answers. Thank you.
[2:48:14] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[2:48:16] » Next speaker is Brandon McIntyre.
[2:48:22] [clears throat]
[2:48:24] » Your name and address for the record,
[2:48:26] please. PO Box 511 Sneeze, Florida. My
[2:48:29] name is Brandon McIntyre and I'm a civil
[2:48:30] right advocate. Um, also a candidate for
[2:48:33] governor for Florida for 2028. Also a
[2:48:36] presidential candidate as well. So
[2:48:37] listen, I'm here to talk about property
[2:48:39] taxes today, guys. Um, good evening,
[2:48:41] council. My name is Brandon McIntyre, a
[2:48:43] citizen and a candidate for governor.
[2:48:44] I'm here tonight to put this on the
[2:48:46] record for the record for Ronda Santz.
[2:48:48] Nobody wants to talk to Let's Go
[2:48:49] Brandon, but guess what? I'm here today
[2:48:51] to talk to you guys. All right. All
[2:48:52] right. The proposal to abolish property
[2:48:54] taxes is unconstitutional, deceptive,
[2:48:56] and voids both the Florida's
[2:48:59] Constitution and United States
[2:49:00] Constitution. Article 7, Section 9 of
[2:49:02] the Florida Constitution requires local
[2:49:04] government to lever property taxes, but
[2:49:07] funds counties, municipalities, and
[2:49:09] schools. Abolishing them without the
[2:49:11] constitutional amendment is unlawful.
[2:49:13] Under the United States Constitution,
[2:49:15] article 1, section 10, the contract
[2:49:17] clause, abolishing property taxes will
[2:49:19] impair and the contract of local
[2:49:21] government that rely on the revenue. And
[2:49:23] the 14th amendment, the equal protection
[2:49:26] clause makes it unconstitutional to
[2:49:28] shift a burden onto working families
[2:49:31] throughout uh regressive taxes. The
[2:49:33] Supreme Court has already ruled this as
[2:49:36] already with Marberry versus Madison
[2:49:38] that any law repudent to the
[2:49:39] Constitution is void. Asking citizens to
[2:49:42] vote on something that is already void
[2:49:44] is a direct violation of public trust.
[2:49:47] Okay. I am submitting this notice for
[2:49:49] the record on the record so it can
[2:49:52] continue to be ignored. So it cannot
[2:49:53] continue to be ignored. You as a public
[2:49:56] officials are now on notice that this
[2:49:58] measure is unconstitutional. the people
[2:50:00] of Florida will not be deceived and we
[2:50:03] will not tolerate leaders who breaks the
[2:50:05] law and to uphold it as a constitutional
[2:50:09] oath. So I'm here to submit this
[2:50:11] constitutional notice for the record. I
[2:50:14] came here once upon a time a while back
[2:50:16] and submitted some constitutional notice
[2:50:18] as well and that also pertained about
[2:50:20] our flock cameras. That's go Brandon
[2:50:22] actually brought notice about the flock
[2:50:23] cameras tried to serve our governor
[2:50:25] Ronda Santz constitutional notice. No
[2:50:28] one wanted to listen. But now we here
[2:50:30] today stand in front of you. My
[2:50:32] administration would not be ignored. I'm
[2:50:33] Let's go Brandon.
[2:50:40] A relief for our Flidians and we deserve
[2:50:43] a relief, but property taxes is not it.
[2:50:47] Who's going to fund our schools? Who's
[2:50:49] going to fund the potholes in our roads?
[2:50:51] Who's going to do take care of our
[2:50:53] police officers? Public safety? who's
[2:50:56] going to pay their their salaries and
[2:50:57] their wages if we get rid of uh property
[2:50:59] taxes. See, it's hidden agendas in this
[2:51:03] whole motive even with the $250,000.
[2:51:06] Uh
[2:51:07] » You're at 30 seconds remaining. I
[2:51:09] accidentally reset the clock, but you're
[2:51:10] at two and a half minutes.
[2:51:11] » I love you, brother. Have a have a very
[2:51:13] blessed day. Thank you.
[2:51:18] » Our next speaker,
[2:51:18] » I don't have any other speakers on this
[2:51:20] item.
[2:51:20] » All right. At this time, I will close
[2:51:21] the public input on city's proposed mill
[2:51:24] and proposed budget. Madam Attorney,
[2:51:25] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. The next steps are
[2:51:27] to allow public input and commission
[2:51:29] discussion on the Downtown Improvement
[2:51:30] Authorities's proposed millage of 1.0000
[2:51:34] mill and the downtown improvement
[2:51:36] authorities proposed budget. If anyone
[2:51:38] has signed up to give public comment,
[2:51:40] they can speak on either the DIA's
[2:51:42] proposed millage or the proposed budget
[2:51:44] for the downtown improvement authority
[2:51:46] at this time. In compliance with Florida
[2:51:48] statute section 200.065, 065. The date
[2:51:51] of this hearing was also included in the
[2:51:52] trim notice which was mailed to all
[2:51:54] property owners in August by the Lyon
[2:51:56] County Property Appraiser to advertise
[2:51:58] this hearing.
[2:52:00] » Okay. At this time, Mr. Clerk, do we
[2:52:02] have any public input on the downtown
[2:52:04] improvement authorities DIA proposed
[2:52:06] millage of 1.00?
[2:52:09] » No, sir.
[2:52:11] » Anyone here that would like to speak on
[2:52:12] the DIA's proposed millage rate of 1.00?
[2:52:18] Seeing none, I will close the public
[2:52:20] input on the downtown improvement
[2:52:21] authorities proposed millillage and
[2:52:23] proposed budget commissioners. It is
[2:52:25] time for discussion on the city's
[2:52:27] proposed mill and proposed budget.
[2:52:36] » Go ahead. Yeah, Mayor Pro Tim.
[2:52:37] » Oh, thank sorry.
[2:52:38] » I would move staff recommendation option
[2:52:41] number one.
[2:52:42] » Okay. Option number one has been
[2:52:44] properly moved by the mayor pro Tim. Is
[2:52:46] there a second to the motion on the
[2:52:47] table?
[2:52:47] » Second. Seconded by Commissioner
[2:52:49] Williams Cox. Commissioner Porter,
[2:52:50] you're recognized for discussion.
[2:52:52] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I have a couple of
[2:52:54] questions.
[2:52:55] » Sure.
[2:52:58] » To you, Mr. Mc Yeah. Thank you.
[2:53:03] » Um,
[2:53:06] and thank you for all your work and and
[2:53:08] your staff's work on this budget. So, as
[2:53:11] we've discussed at previous meetings, we
[2:53:14] know that the federal government has
[2:53:16] provided notice to the city that over a
[2:53:18] million dollars in grant funds must be
[2:53:19] reimbursed
[2:53:21] um related to the HUD the lead abatement
[2:53:23] grant. Is this something that we have
[2:53:26] budgeted for
[2:53:28] or not? How do how do we handle that in
[2:53:30] in the budget?
[2:53:32] » Uh
[2:53:33] » Since [clears throat] I know that we're
[2:53:34] appealing, you know, how do we manage
[2:53:36] that?
[2:53:37] » Yes. uh we uh when we budget we we we
[2:53:40] want some certainty in what we're
[2:53:42] budgeting because uh we are so
[2:53:45] constrained in what funding that we
[2:53:47] have. We don't want to be in a position
[2:53:48] of setting aside monies that that uh
[2:53:51] when when we go through a process that's
[2:53:54] that's that we can accomplish and and be
[2:53:57] successful in that we have that money
[2:53:59] tied up. So that is not reflected in the
[2:54:02] budget at this time. But um whenever new
[2:54:05] priorities come along uh we work with
[2:54:08] the departments to make sure that we
[2:54:09] then we can accomplish those priorities.
[2:54:11] So we're we're we'll be fine with
[2:54:13] » Okay. So it's not currently in the
[2:54:15] budget but we are
[2:54:17] » Planning for it.
[2:54:18] » Okay.
[2:54:19] » Again we we want to we want to better
[2:54:21] understand the outcome before we we take
[2:54:23] action.
[2:54:25] » Okay. Thank you.
[2:54:28] the city made the decision to
[2:54:31] terminate or or not renew our fire
[2:54:33] services agreement with the county. Is
[2:54:37] where would I see the financial
[2:54:40] implications of that in our capital
[2:54:42] plan?
[2:54:45] » Um so the um the the interlocal
[2:54:48] agreement expires uh September 30th of
[2:54:51] 2028. Uh as we've worked through this
[2:54:54] pro process, we've identified 26 new
[2:54:58] positions that were focusing on uh the
[2:55:01] busiest stations uh in the department. U
[2:55:04] those eventually then uh with the
[2:55:08] expiration will be focused on city
[2:55:10] facilities. Um as we experience th the
[2:55:14] the placement of those positions, then
[2:55:16] we're also evaluating uh what resources
[2:55:19] are needed from a a station perspective.
[2:55:21] what resources are needed from a um from
[2:55:24] a vehicle perspective. Um you know the
[2:55:27] the focus of those positions was to
[2:55:30] increase safety in the fire department
[2:55:32] uh reduce response times and as you all
[2:55:35] know eventually accomplish an ISO
[2:55:38] improvement. Um uh you'll also recall
[2:55:41] that when the rates were implemented in
[2:55:43] fiscal year 26 uh we participated the
[2:55:47] city city of Tallahassee residents
[2:55:48] participated in that rate increase. Um
[2:55:51] uh we know that as we approach fiscal
[2:55:53] year 27 that will be a balanced budget.
[2:55:56] You would see that in the 5-year
[2:55:58] proforma where uh we are using the last
[2:56:01] of our reserves to balance that fiscal
[2:56:03] year 27 budget. Uh as we enter fiscal
[2:56:06] year 28 and the adoption of that budget.
[2:56:08] uh we'll bring to you at the strategic
[2:56:11] planning meeting at workshops our
[2:56:13] recommendation on how to close any gap
[2:56:15] that's there and then also how to how to
[2:56:18] close out that expiration of that
[2:56:19] contract.
[2:56:21] » Okay, thank you.
[2:56:23] Um
[2:56:26] I meant to actually ask this question.
[2:56:28] This would probably not be a question
[2:56:30] for you about the city manager contract.
[2:56:33] Does
[2:56:35] the $1,000
[2:56:37] a month vehicle allowance is that in
[2:56:41] addition to the the city purchasing a
[2:56:46] car for the city manager, the incoming
[2:56:47] city manager? Does anyone know? No.
[2:56:50] Okay. And the reason for the question is
[2:56:53] there was some reported about the cost
[2:56:55] of vehicles provided to city officials.
[2:56:57] Where is that in the budget?
[2:56:59] » Uh that
[2:57:00] » Where would I find that?
[2:57:00] » That's contained in each of the
[2:57:02] departments. each of the department's
[2:57:03] budget.
[2:57:04] » So when we uh I think uh two days ago we
[2:57:07] when when we p within two days of
[2:57:10] publishing the agenda, we uploaded into
[2:57:13] our online uh budgetary system the
[2:57:15] details of of this fiscal year 27
[2:57:18] budget. Uh as we enter the adoption of
[2:57:20] this, we'll do that again. And then by
[2:57:22] January uh I'm sorry, by December uh
[2:57:25] we're obligated by state statute but
[2:57:28] also by JFOA standards to publish the
[2:57:30] entirety of the budget. and and that's
[2:57:32] the talggov.com site that you see.
[2:57:34] » Okay. Okay. Thank you.
[2:57:38] Um that's all the questions I have for
[2:57:40] now. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[2:57:42] » Okay. There currently is a motion on the
[2:57:44] table for the approval of the city's
[2:57:45] millage rate of 4.4072
[2:57:47] mills as stated in resolution number
[2:57:49] 26-R31,
[2:57:52] attachment A. Recognizing that the
[2:57:54] proposed aggregate millage rate is more
[2:57:56] than the roll back rate of 4.2782
[2:57:59] by 3.47%.
[2:58:00] The motion was made by the vice mayor
[2:58:02] Curtis Richardson, Mayor Pro Tim Curtis
[2:58:04] Richardson, seconded by Commissioner
[2:58:06] Diane Williams Cox for comment.
[2:58:08] Commissioner Matlo.
[2:58:09] » Uh, thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh, Robert, I
[2:58:12] have a few questions as well.
[2:58:14] » Where where in the the budget is the
[2:58:17] revenue received from the sale of the
[2:58:19] hospital allocated?
[2:58:21] » Um, it's it's represented in the in the
[2:58:23] general fund.
[2:58:24] » Okay. Yeah.
[2:58:25] » So, in addition to the the tax increase,
[2:58:27] there's also $3 million represented in
[2:58:29] the general fund over what we had last
[2:58:31] year.
[2:58:32] » As you recall, when we began this
[2:58:34] process, we were estimating a 8 to10
[2:58:36] million budget. Um so, yes, that that is
[2:58:40] part of what has enabled us to be at at
[2:58:42] the point where where um we we can bring
[2:58:44] a balanced budget to you. Um the
[2:58:47] additional millage rate enables us to
[2:58:49] provide a surplus.
[2:58:50] » Okay. So the the hospital payments are
[2:58:52] in excess of $3 million and what we're
[2:58:55] putting into the deficiency fund I
[2:58:56] believe is 2.5. So we're actually
[2:58:58] spending $500,000 in excess of the
[2:59:02] millage rate increase just to balance
[2:59:03] the budget with the hospital payment.
[2:59:06] » Um I that I I don't necessarily
[2:59:10] it's not as easy as that inflow and that
[2:59:12] outflow. Um there are uh you know the
[2:59:16] increase in the millage rate um based on
[2:59:18] where we were in in September uh in in
[2:59:22] June um was an increase of $2.8 million.
[2:59:26] Um and so we have identified then what
[2:59:30] where we could trim the budget so that
[2:59:32] we could use that as surplus for the for
[2:59:35] the future.
[2:59:36] » Sure. So we're using the hospital
[2:59:37] revenues to shore up existing
[2:59:39] expenditures in the budget. Uh we're
[2:59:41] using the we're using that to balance
[2:59:44] the general fund. Yes. It's part of the
[2:59:45] revenue sources that we use.
[2:59:47] » Okay. Um can you walk us through the the
[2:59:50] buyout program? Uh my understanding was
[2:59:53] 170 some odd employees took it. Is that
[2:59:55] correct?
[2:59:56] » 171 took the program.
[2:59:58] » 171 took the buyout program. Okay. And
[2:59:59] that was meant to save 3 point or the
[3:00:02] cost of that was $3.9 million. Um the
[3:00:05] the initial cost was a savings of $14
[3:00:08] million. As we applied it to the budget,
[3:00:10] we we discussed that we that services
[3:00:14] could not be impacted. That was your
[3:00:15] direction that we were not reduced
[3:00:17] services um or or take shortcuts on
[3:00:19] services. And so we've gone through the
[3:00:21] process of evaluating or the departments
[3:00:24] have gone through the process of
[3:00:25] evaluating where those positions need to
[3:00:27] be replaced. As we entered the June
[3:00:30] agenda item, I think we quoted a 8.45
[3:00:33] four five million dollar number of what
[3:00:36] we expected the the real savings to be
[3:00:38] so that we wouldn't impact services. Uh
[3:00:41] we are continuing the departments are
[3:00:43] continuing to go undergo and it was
[3:00:45] intended that they would undergo that
[3:00:47] evaluation that management of how to
[3:00:49] operate with those positions that have
[3:00:51] left during all of fiscal year 27. So we
[3:00:54] have represented a reduction in the
[3:00:57] general fund of the $445
[3:01:00] million that you mentioned. Um and
[3:01:02] that's that also has created the surplus
[3:01:05] that we're seeing in fiscal year 27 and
[3:01:08] part of the recommendation of why then
[3:01:09] taking that millage rate uh to to
[3:01:11] balance the budget in fiscal year 28.
[3:01:14] » And so what was the total cost paid out
[3:01:16] to the employees that were bought out in
[3:01:19] addition to any expenses of covering
[3:01:21] health care for them as well? uh the the
[3:01:23] the total expenses were uh $25,000 per
[3:01:28] employee. Uh their salaries uh that they
[3:01:31] would have earned in that period of time
[3:01:34] uh offset that amount. Uh the same was
[3:01:37] true for their health care. Uh their
[3:01:39] health care would have been paid up
[3:01:40] through October uh you know first week
[3:01:43] of October based on how the fiscal years
[3:01:46] closed out. And so that healthc care
[3:01:48] coverage was was, you know, then matched
[3:01:52] what what we would have paid out to
[3:01:53] them.
[3:01:54] » Okay. So you don't have a total dollar
[3:01:56] amount that the buyout program cost us
[3:01:57] including healthare.
[3:01:58] » That was the $14 million that I
[3:02:00] mentioned.
[3:02:01] » 14 million is what it cost the city.
[3:02:04] That's the question.
[3:02:05] » No, the the the buyout per employee.
[3:02:08] Yes. the total the total cost of the
[3:02:10] buyout plus the health
[3:02:10] » The cost was neutral because we would
[3:02:12] have paid those employees over the last
[3:02:14] 6 to 12 weeks of their employment which
[3:02:17] matched the $25,000 payment that we gave
[3:02:19] them and the healthcare coverage that we
[3:02:21] that we that we covered.
[3:02:23] » Okay, then let's start there. Um so I
[3:02:26] know some of the buyout positions
[3:02:28] probably had to be filled immediately.
[3:02:30] We look at the entire command staff of
[3:02:32] TPD. I assume those had to be filled
[3:02:35] immediately. So we want to rely savings
[3:02:37] on those individual uh positions. So out
[3:02:40] of the total 171 positions, how many
[3:02:44] remain vacant?
[3:02:45] » Uh I don't have that number because it's
[3:02:47] a number that's still in in flux and
[3:02:50] still a number that's changing. As we
[3:02:52] identified the budget, we made certain
[3:02:54] assumptions of what we would represent
[3:02:56] in the general fund as a reduction in
[3:02:59] personnel services and and that's what
[3:03:01] you see in that budget. Uh that that
[3:03:03] that 4.4 45 million. That's less in
[3:03:07] personnel services. As far as positions,
[3:03:10] we have not. There's a personnel
[3:03:12] services schedule that shows the changes
[3:03:14] over time. We haven't fixed that at a at
[3:03:17] a absolute point in time. And so, we'll
[3:03:19] do that during fiscal year 27. And that
[3:03:22] was the intention as we proposed this
[3:03:24] program is we wanted to work through
[3:03:26] that process during the upcoming fiscal
[3:03:28] year.
[3:03:29] » So, of the vacant positions, are they
[3:03:31] funded in this budget? um the general
[3:03:34] fund positions are not and so we would
[3:03:36] have to work uh with those. And again,
[3:03:39] let me let me go back. The original
[3:03:41] buyout was 14 million. We assumed 8
[3:03:44] million accounting for some being
[3:03:45] rehired. Um and then um as we filled
[3:03:50] them, then we we're working with
[3:03:51] departments to make sure that we uh uh
[3:03:53] can can accommodate those budgetary
[3:03:56] requests.
[3:03:57] » So, how many of the positions have been
[3:03:58] refilled since the buyout? I'd have to
[3:04:01] turn to our HR director. I'm I'm aware
[3:04:04] of uh a double handful that were
[3:04:07] immediately filled. Uh
[3:04:10] » Can we provide that in please? Uh Mr.
[3:04:12] Manager.
[3:04:14] » Don, you want to come join us?
[3:04:17] » Those requests are are coming through
[3:04:19] HR. They're working with the departments
[3:04:22] and um we are getting the results but
[3:04:24] have not reflected the position changes
[3:04:26] in the budget.
[3:04:29] Commissioner, at this time as Robert
[3:04:30] said, the number is fluctuating, but um
[3:04:33] as we fill positions, we fill them at a
[3:04:35] lower rate. Um and we also reorgan
[3:04:37] organize the departments that they don't
[3:04:39] fill the same amount of positions that
[3:04:41] left. So we don't have a number at this
[3:04:42] time that is a permanent number for you.
[3:04:45] » We don't know the number of positions
[3:04:48] that were made vacant that have now been
[3:04:50] filled.
[3:04:50] » I don't have that number at right at
[3:04:52] this time. Um, I can get you the number
[3:04:54] of how many have been vacated and how
[3:04:57] many how many we have filled at this
[3:04:58] time.
[3:04:59] » Okay. Can we get that information at
[3:05:01] this budget hearing?
[3:05:03] » Okay.
[3:05:03] » Yeah, we'll we'll come with a a inflow
[3:05:07] number and and as a HR director said
[3:05:11] those numbers change a department will
[3:05:13] come to HR and say we want to refill
[3:05:16] this critical position and they'll talk
[3:05:18] through the process of is there another
[3:05:19] position that can be used to fill that
[3:05:21] at a lower rate. Right. And and that's
[3:05:23] the question, how many have been
[3:05:24] refilled, whether they're at a lower
[3:05:25] rate or not?
[3:05:26] » Yeah, I I know there's a double handful
[3:05:28] based on the first month of of the of
[3:05:30] the requests that have come from the
[3:05:32] from the few departments that I'm aware
[3:05:34] of.
[3:05:34] » Can you understand how it's difficult to
[3:05:36] understand if this buyout makes
[3:05:37] financial sense if we can't really
[3:05:39] understand the realized savings and
[3:05:40] positions that have been backfilled?
[3:05:42] Yeah, there I I will say this was an
[3:05:45] initial action and effort to get ahead
[3:05:47] of the of of where we may be in cutting
[3:05:51] programs and people. Um I'm confident
[3:05:54] that as we go through this process and
[3:05:56] we also get the feedback in November of
[3:05:59] what really will happen, we'll we'll
[3:06:01] work towards an absolute number.
[3:06:03] » Robert, let me jump in real quick. Mr.
[3:06:04] Manager,
[3:06:05] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Robert, um I I
[3:06:08] think it it probably should be said so
[3:06:11] you're in the process of approving a
[3:06:14] budget. That budget then cascades down
[3:06:16] into the variety of departments. Robert
[3:06:20] and his team, the directors, HR, u the
[3:06:24] vast majority of the positions that were
[3:06:26] vacated have not been filled and they've
[3:06:29] been zeroed out for budget purpose. They
[3:06:31] have not eliminated the FTE yet. That's
[3:06:33] what Robert's talking about.
[3:06:36] But the departments will not have the
[3:06:38] budget for those positions if they and
[3:06:41] they're we're going through that process
[3:06:42] of saying [clears throat] which ones are
[3:06:44] absolutely necessary. If we're pretty
[3:06:47] much at that point, we know that um
[3:06:50] where we need to be. And so if the
[3:06:52] budget is not available to the
[3:06:54] department, they won't be able to hire
[3:06:55] those positions. It won't be that they
[3:06:58] just continue to hire and overspend. It
[3:07:00] can't work that way. So that's what
[3:07:02] you're really firming up. Um,
[3:07:04] Commissioner, you mentioned the police
[3:07:05] department.
[3:07:07] That's maybe arguably the most critical
[3:07:10] department to make sure you have full
[3:07:12] staffing. Even with those positions that
[3:07:15] we move to immediately refill, it still
[3:07:19] resulted in a net vacancy in the
[3:07:22] department because that's one of the
[3:07:23] unique departments that hires almost
[3:07:26] exclusively from within. So, a promotion
[3:07:29] results in a vacancy as it cascades. And
[3:07:31] so there are net vacancies that now
[3:07:33] exist in the police department. And so
[3:07:37] the the positions as Robert's describing
[3:07:40] are somewhat fluid, but the budget is
[3:07:42] not. The budget will be absolute and the
[3:07:45] positions that haven't been filled have
[3:07:47] been zeroed. So the budget will control
[3:07:50] and constrain what positions are
[3:07:52] available to uh the departments. And so
[3:07:55] that's that's why you're getting the
[3:07:58] answers that you're getting. We've not
[3:08:00] taken an absolute hard approach. It
[3:08:02] never was a program that said any
[3:08:05] position vacated will be deleted
[3:08:08] that because we understand the
[3:08:09] expectation of the commission to
[3:08:11] maintain the levels of service. Uh the
[3:08:13] fact is we've done that because you've
[3:08:15] not heard any reduction in service and
[3:08:17] Robert and his team and all the
[3:08:19] department directors and HR directors
[3:08:21] have done a good job. But we're about to
[3:08:23] firm a budget
[3:08:25] and that budget will be absolute and
[3:08:28] it'll apply to every single department.
[3:08:30] » And truth be told, credit goes to the
[3:08:33] department directors. It goes to these
[3:08:35] individuals that are sitting in the
[3:08:37] audience because they're having to make
[3:08:39] sure they maximize these resources. And
[3:08:41] so that's kind of the art of the
[3:08:44] personnel management and the budget
[3:08:45] management. But the budget ultimately
[3:08:47] passed will constrain how much dollars
[3:08:49] we had to spend on personnel. I hope
[3:08:51] that helps a little bit. Thank you, Mr.
[3:08:53] Mayor.
[3:08:53] » Commissioner Matler.
[3:08:54] » Uh, thank you, Mr. Manager. And yeah,
[3:08:56] there's no confusion on vacancies and
[3:08:57] and the budget expenditures. The
[3:08:59] question is of the money that we've
[3:09:02] already spent for this buyout program,
[3:09:04] how many of those positions had to be
[3:09:06] backfilled. I recognize the budget
[3:09:08] before us also asked for um a a tax
[3:09:10] increase and is larger than the budget
[3:09:12] uh that we had uh uh previously. So, I'm
[3:09:15] trying to ascertain is did it make sense
[3:09:16] to do that buyout program? and I'm not
[3:09:18] really receiving enough information uh
[3:09:20] to be able to determine that. If you
[3:09:22] have a list of all the vacant positions
[3:09:25] that will be unfunded in this budget,
[3:09:27] that would be helpful. Um as well uh and
[3:09:30] I do want to ask a couple more questions
[3:09:32] while I have you Robert. Commissioner
[3:09:34] Porter me mentioned the HUD
[3:09:36] reimbursement. I know the letter we
[3:09:38] received from HUD said this money would
[3:09:40] be required to be reimbursed. So, but
[3:09:43] we're not budgeting to reimburse the
[3:09:45] federal government at this time.
[3:09:47] » No.
[3:09:48] Okay. And so when we get a definitive
[3:09:51] declaration to pay that, where will that
[3:09:53] money come from?
[3:09:54] » We'll we'll talk through that issue at
[3:09:57] that time.
[3:09:59] » But we we have a a budgetary
[3:10:03] um authority across uh multiple
[3:10:06] departments. Uh I imagine uh we'll look
[3:10:09] at uh where we are in the budget at that
[3:10:11] time to see what's been spent, what what
[3:10:13] remains and and what funds can be
[3:10:16] dedicated to that whatever that amount
[3:10:18] is.
[3:10:18] » So you believe at that time we would be
[3:10:20] able to identify midfiscal year a
[3:10:23] million dollars to reimburse federal
[3:10:24] government.
[3:10:25] » It's one of the strengths of the budget
[3:10:26] process is we come back on a quarterly
[3:10:28] basis uh in workshops to talk about
[3:10:30] where we are after the first quarter,
[3:10:32] the second, third quarter.
[3:10:34] » Okay. Thank you. Um it it sounds like to
[3:10:36] me that there's rooms for further
[3:10:38] reduction uh in this budget based on the
[3:10:40] information uh provided today. Um I know
[3:10:43] a lot of people had mentioned uh
[3:10:44] amendment three and this is kind of
[3:10:46] shoring up the accounts in case that
[3:10:49] that passes, but it feels like a bit of
[3:10:51] a self-fulfilling prophecy. uh what the
[3:10:54] people are asking us to do is get our
[3:10:56] fiscal house in order, stop increasing
[3:10:58] taxes at the rates we've seen year after
[3:11:01] year after year to where they think
[3:11:03] they're at a a breaking point. And I
[3:11:05] think the way we do that is a good faith
[3:11:08] effort by local government to reduce
[3:11:10] expenditures uh and to not continue to
[3:11:13] increase taxes uh again after uh again.
[3:11:16] So I did not support this military when
[3:11:18] it was uh proposed. I do support the
[3:11:20] roll back millage rate of 4.27. 2782.
[3:11:23] And so what I would propose is that we
[3:11:25] bring back um a budget that continues to
[3:11:29] tighten uh sharpen the pencil. I mean
[3:11:32] look at half percent across the board,
[3:11:34] 1% across the board by by department to
[3:11:37] bring this align and continue to shore
[3:11:38] up our our deficiencies deficiencies
[3:11:40] fund. So I'd make a substitute motion uh
[3:11:43] to adopt the roll back rate of 4.2782.
[3:11:47] Uh
[3:11:47] » That motion's not recognized. There's a
[3:11:49] very specific formula by Florida statute
[3:11:51] that we have to follow. So, we need to
[3:11:53] deal with the motion on the table first,
[3:11:54] Commissioner Matlo, and we will move
[3:11:56] through the process from there.
[3:11:58] » Commissioner Porter.
[3:11:59] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. [clears throat] I
[3:12:02] understand this is a specific process we
[3:12:04] have to follow. So, my question is,
[3:12:15] and I I know that it takes four to pass.
[3:12:17] My my question is whether
[3:12:20] I guess what I'm getting at frankly is
[3:12:24] I don't support this budget, but I am
[3:12:27] concerned about amendment three and
[3:12:31] frankly wish that we we have made
[3:12:34] motions in the past asking for budget
[3:12:37] options and those motions have never
[3:12:39] been successful. So my question is
[3:12:42] whether there is
[3:12:45] an option to do that at this point.
[3:12:47] » If this motion does not pass by a
[3:12:48] supermajority either 41 or a 50 then we
[3:12:52] will move to the roll back rate and
[3:12:54] there is a formula for that and I will
[3:12:56] entertain a motion on that particular
[3:12:59] uh millage rate and budget.
[3:13:02] » Thank you Mr. Mayor. My question was
[3:13:04] actually well I I guess I would like to
[3:13:06] hear the city attorney's opinion. Is my
[3:13:10] question clear?
[3:13:11] » It is not.
[3:13:12] » Okay. So, my question is
[3:13:19] » I'm sorry. Did you have something to
[3:13:20] say, Commissioner Richardson?
[3:13:21] » No, ma'am.
[3:13:22] » Okay,
[3:13:24] » We got the floor.
[3:13:25] » Um, so my question was in the past we
[3:13:28] have asked for basically budget options.
[3:13:31] Commissioner Matt Matlo has just said
[3:13:33] I'd like to, you know, we could see a 5%
[3:13:35] reduction across the board. My question
[3:13:38] is if those two things can come back to
[3:13:40] us at once for consideration at the next
[3:13:43] public hearing.
[3:13:44] » Not at this point if I'm correct. Right
[3:13:46] madam mayor I mean madam attorney.
[3:13:49] » Um
[3:13:50] so we have to go through this process of
[3:13:53] adopting the millillage and the budget
[3:13:55] » Right?
[3:13:56] » Um
[3:13:58] the so there are separate motions the mo
[3:14:01] the budget is separate. Um, I think it
[3:14:05] has to be I think the budget has to be
[3:14:07] adopted or not at this meeting.
[3:14:10] » Correct.
[3:14:10] » I I think I might rather refer to Robert
[3:14:13] though or or just confer with Robert to
[3:14:14] make sure that I'm correct on that. I
[3:14:17] think Commissioner Porter's question is
[3:14:19] could they come back could we come back
[3:14:21] at the next meeting with any amendments
[3:14:24] to the budget? Is that what you're
[3:14:26] asking?
[3:14:29] My question is, I mean, sort of. My
[3:14:32] question is, we have in the past, it's
[3:14:34] never been successful. It's always been
[3:14:36] a three-2 vote, asked for options to
[3:14:39] review
[3:14:40] um as it relates to the budget. So, my
[3:14:43] question is at this point, is that
[3:14:46] possible at the next hearing to
[3:14:49] accommodate Commissioner Matlo's
[3:14:50] request?
[3:14:53] » No. the the two options that there are
[3:14:57] opportunities for us to discuss programs
[3:14:59] and service levels um and and make
[3:15:02] changes to those programs and service
[3:15:04] levels
[3:15:05] recognizing that there have been
[3:15:07] requests to cut uh executive salaries or
[3:15:10] position uh uh uh certain departments.
[3:15:13] Those departments being allocated
[3:15:16] uh don't even come close to what we need
[3:15:20] in order to balance the budget. And so
[3:15:21] what we're bringing to you is a balanced
[3:15:23] budget with the best options possible
[3:15:25] for the millage rate uh that are
[3:15:28] dictated by the by the new uh state
[3:15:31] statute and and th those voting motions
[3:15:34] that the city attorney is walking
[3:15:35] through.
[3:15:36] » So commissioner, if I could just follow
[3:15:38] up, I I think at this point in the
[3:15:40] process, we're very bound by the
[3:15:43] statutory um steps, the budgetary
[3:15:46] options. Um, to the extent I'm I'm
[3:15:49] understanding what you're asking is
[3:15:51] probably something that has to have been
[3:15:53] done prior to today. Um,
[3:15:56] » And we did try.
[3:15:57] » I understand.
[3:15:58] » On point, Mr. Mayor.
[3:16:00] » Commissioner Matlo on point.
[3:16:01] » Um, Madam Attorney, if this budget gets
[3:16:04] rejected today, what is the next step?
[3:16:07] » The the budget or the millage rate?
[3:16:09] » The millage and the budget get rejected
[3:16:11] today, what is the next step? And what
[3:16:12] is the timeline to adopt a budget for
[3:16:15] the fiscal year?
[3:16:16] » I'll jump in. If this motion fails, I
[3:16:18] wholeheartedly uh plan on entertaining a
[3:16:20] motion for the roll back rate, which I
[3:16:22] think will have a majority. You've
[3:16:24] already [clears throat] stated you're in
[3:16:25] favor of the roll back rate. So, we will
[3:16:26] go through the legal process and the
[3:16:28] mayor uh the um the attorney will walk
[3:16:31] me through that. We have the script. We
[3:16:34] are fully prepared.
[3:16:35] » So, to answer Commissioner Porter's
[3:16:37] question, I understand the mill rate.
[3:16:40] Her question is, can the specifics of
[3:16:42] the budget be amended um at this point?
[3:16:44] And that answer should be yes. We have
[3:16:46] not adopted a final budget yet.
[3:16:49] » What we advertise for the budget and for
[3:16:52] the millillage rate has to be the exact
[3:16:54] same of what passes tonight.
[3:16:55] » Correct.
[3:16:56] » Versus what comes back. What I think to
[3:16:58] answer your question is remember we
[3:17:00] begin our budget process in January. The
[3:17:03] next commission will have plenty of
[3:17:05] opportunity to propose budget amendments
[3:17:06] throughout the fiscal year to address
[3:17:09] the needs as they come up. Whether
[3:17:10] amendment three passes or does not pass.
[3:17:13] I believe that is the appropriate time
[3:17:15] to amend the budget because we're at
[3:17:17] this point in the cycle. So, um you
[3:17:21] know, I intend to take a motion and
[3:17:23] hopefully get some type of consensus uh
[3:17:26] whether it's on the proposed millage
[3:17:27] rate as is or on the roll back rate so
[3:17:30] that we can advertise it and have a
[3:17:32] fully uh balanced budget passed by
[3:17:37] September 30th at the end of the fiscal
[3:17:39] year. Commission
[3:17:40] » And and thank you, Mr. Mayor. And that
[3:17:42] starts to clarify what I'm trying to say
[3:17:44] and answer Commissioner Porter's
[3:17:45] question. If we adopt the roll back
[3:17:47] rate, this city commission will still
[3:17:50] have to decide what that budget looks
[3:17:51] like, what gets removed, or what gets
[3:17:53] refunded. And there's still an
[3:17:54] opportunity to have that conversation or
[3:17:56] put it in part of a motion today of what
[3:17:58] budget would come back at the next. I
[3:18:01] think that those those individual
[3:18:03] whatever those changes are would have to
[3:18:06] be made tonight because we are under the
[3:18:09] deadline of advertising an amend we will
[3:18:13] have an amended budget if we adopt the
[3:18:16] if you adopt the roll back and so then
[3:18:19] we will bring back an amended budget
[3:18:22] » But it has to come back at the 23rd it
[3:18:24] has to be advertised and then it has to
[3:18:26] come back at the 23rd so I guess the
[3:18:28] answer is we don't have another
[3:18:30] opportunity
[3:18:31] at the 23rd is when it has to be uh
[3:18:34] decided. So any amendments would have to
[3:18:36] be done tonight.
[3:18:37] » I I understand that. Does that make
[3:18:38] sense? It makes perfect sense. And what
[3:18:40] what Commissioner Porter asked for, this
[3:18:42] could have been predicted because it was
[3:18:44] always going to require uh four votes to
[3:18:46] pass. She asked for a workshop to take
[3:18:48] place so we could hash out those details
[3:18:51] and make sure we had a balanced budget
[3:18:52] with a roll back rate. because that was
[3:18:54] rejected. City staff didn't even do the
[3:18:56] work to propose an alternative budget
[3:18:59] that fits the roll back rate and that's
[3:19:01] causing the confusion uh today. Thank
[3:19:02] you, Mr. Mayor.
[3:19:03] » Mr. Mayor,
[3:19:04] » Sure. M I need Robert to clarify this. I
[3:19:07] just want to make sure we're on the
[3:19:08] right page.
[3:19:10] » Paired with the adoption of the millage
[3:19:13] rate, you will also have to pass a total
[3:19:17] budget that will be balanced,
[3:19:18] » Right?
[3:19:19] » So there will we don't have to go back
[3:19:21] to the drawing board. Robert and team
[3:19:23] will be prepared tonight to present that
[3:19:25] total budget to coincide with the
[3:19:28] millage rate. So the millage rate we
[3:19:30] won't go back and retool
[3:19:32] at the roll back rate. Robert has a
[3:19:34] budget to present and you would adopt
[3:19:37] that tonight. [clears throat]
[3:19:39] There currently is a motion for approval
[3:19:41] of the city's millage rate of 4.4072
[3:19:44] mills as stated in resolution number
[3:19:46] 26-R31.
[3:19:48] The motion was made by the mayor pro Tim
[3:19:50] Curtis Richardson seconded by
[3:19:52] commissioner Diane Williams Cox.
[3:19:54] Commissioner Porter.
[3:19:55] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And I and I'll be
[3:19:57] brief. I do plan to support the proposed
[3:20:00] millage rate because I am concerned
[3:20:02] about the implications of amendment
[3:20:04] three if it passes. But I do want to
[3:20:07] reiterate again that that I really don't
[3:20:09] support this budget. I appreciate all
[3:20:11] the work that went into it, but I have
[3:20:14] said the same thing every year, every
[3:20:16] budget hearing, basically every budget
[3:20:18] workshop that I really think we need to
[3:20:21] re-evaluate many of our spending
[3:20:24] priorities. We talk about sharpening our
[3:20:26] pencils. Um, but somehow that effort
[3:20:29] still includes spending nearly $100,000
[3:20:32] on an employes's personal vehicle.
[3:20:34] That's the kind of thing that makes
[3:20:36] working people, many of whom are working
[3:20:38] multiple jobs to make end meet ends
[3:20:40] meet, wonder if this government is
[3:20:43] really working to meet their needs. It
[3:20:46] pushes people to support amendments like
[3:20:49] amendment three. Um, you know, and I
[3:20:53] could go on, but that's just the start.
[3:20:55] I I think there's a lot of good in this
[3:20:57] budget, but we continue to miss the
[3:20:58] mark. Just as an example, we gave
[3:21:01] unanimous direction years ago about
[3:21:03] implementing a mun a municipal child
[3:21:05] care system years ago. Where is that in
[3:21:08] this budget? That never even came back
[3:21:10] to us. Nearly one in four residents is
[3:21:13] living in poverty in Tallahassee. And we
[3:21:15] all know this. We've never even had a
[3:21:17] serious discussion about how to address
[3:21:20] that. We have the impact on poverty
[3:21:23] category in our strategic plan. Our
[3:21:25] stated goal isn't even to reduce
[3:21:28] poverty. It's to be a community partner
[3:21:30] that connects residents to resources
[3:21:33] that remove economic and social
[3:21:35] barriers. You know, a resource that can
[3:21:38] remove economic and social barriers, the
[3:21:40] city of Tallahassee.
[3:21:43] So,
[3:21:44] I wish that I were not in this position.
[3:21:47] I wish that there was a greater openness
[3:21:50] to compromise, to receiving input, to
[3:21:54] having a budget workshop. The
[3:21:56] implications here are huge. There's
[3:21:58] still so many questions about this
[3:22:00] budget. I feel very uncomfortable moving
[3:22:03] forward, which is why I will not be
[3:22:05] supporting the budget. Um, but I will I
[3:22:08] will support the proposed millage rate
[3:22:10] because I'm I'm concerned about the
[3:22:12] implications moving forward and feel
[3:22:14] that the residents of Tallahassee will
[3:22:17] want those services to continue and and
[3:22:20] will will need to be there to do that. I
[3:22:22] I think it's possible if we sharpen our
[3:22:24] pencils as well, but that's where I'm
[3:22:25] at. All right, it takes super majority
[3:22:28] to pass the resolution on the table
[3:22:30] according to new state law. There is a
[3:22:31] motion for approval of the city's
[3:22:32] millage rate of 4.4072
[3:22:35] mills as stated in resolution number
[3:22:36] 26-R31.
[3:22:39] Motion was made by the mayor pro Tim
[3:22:40] Curtis Richardson. Second by
[3:22:42] commissioner Diane Williams Cox. All
[3:22:44] those in favor of the mill of the motion
[3:22:47] on the table signify by saying I.
[3:22:49] » I.
[3:22:49] » And those opposed?
[3:22:51] » Nay. And it passes 4 to one with a super
[3:22:54] majority with Commissioner Matlo in
[3:22:57] descent. I would now like to request a
[3:22:59] motion for the approval of the city's
[3:23:00] budget appropriation as set forth in
[3:23:02] resolution number 26-R32.
[3:23:05] » So moved
[3:23:06] » Properly moved by the mayor pro Tim. Is
[3:23:08] there a second?
[3:23:08] » Second.
[3:23:09] » Seconded by Commissioner Williams Cox.
[3:23:12] » All right. All those in favor signify by
[3:23:14] saying I. I.
[3:23:15] » All those opposed
[3:23:18] 5 unanimously. I would now like to
[3:23:20] request a motion for the approval of the
[3:23:22] downtown improvement authorities
[3:23:24] tenative millage rate of 1.0000
[3:23:27] mil as stated in resolution number
[3:23:29] 26-R31
[3:23:31] attachment A in your package recognizing
[3:23:33] that the proposed aggregate mill rate is
[3:23:36] more than the roll back rate of 4.2782
[3:23:39] by 3.47%.
[3:23:42] Is there a motion?
[3:23:43] » So move Mr. Mayor
[3:23:44] » Probably moved by the mayor pro Tim. Is
[3:23:46] there a second?
[3:23:47] » Second.
[3:23:47] » Seconded by Commissioner Williams Cox.
[3:23:49] All those in favor signify by saying I.
[3:23:51] I.
[3:23:52] » All those opposed.
[3:23:53] » Passes unanimously. 5. I would now like
[3:23:56] to request a motion for the approval of
[3:23:58] the downtown improvement authorities
[3:24:00] budget as stated in resolution number
[3:24:02] 26-R32
[3:24:04] attachment B of your packet. Is there a
[3:24:07] motion?
[3:24:07] » So moved, Mr. Mayor.
[3:24:08] » Second.
[3:24:09] » Been properly moved by the mayor pro
[3:24:10] Tim, seconded by Commissioner Williams
[3:24:12] Cox. Any discussion? Seeing none. All
[3:24:14] those in favor signify by saying I. I.
[3:24:17] All those opposed passes unanimously.
[3:24:20] 5-0. I would now like to request a
[3:24:22] motion for the approval of the healthc
[3:24:24] care rapes option one as proposed.
[3:24:28] » Second.
[3:24:29] » Been proudly moved by the mayor pro Tim,
[3:24:31] seconded by Commissioner Williams Cox.
[3:24:32] Any further comment? Seeing none. All
[3:24:35] those in favor signify by saying I.
[3:24:37] » I. All those opposed. Passes
[3:24:39] unanimously. 5-0. Madame Attorney.
[3:24:42] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. To summarize, the
[3:24:43] city commission has tenatively approved
[3:24:44] the millage rate for both the city and
[3:24:46] the DIA and the expenditures and
[3:24:48] obligations of the city of Tallahassee
[3:24:50] and the DIA for the fiscal year
[3:24:52] beginning October 1, 2026 and ending
[3:24:55] September 30, 2027, designating the
[3:24:58] sources of revenue and appropriations. A
[3:25:01] public hearing on the final budget will
[3:25:02] be held on Wednesday, September 23rd,
[3:25:05] 2026 at 6 PM in the city of Tallahassee
[3:25:08] city commission chambers at city hall,
[3:25:10] at which time resolution number 26-R31
[3:25:14] setting the millage rate and resolution
[3:25:16] number 26-R32
[3:25:18] setting the budget will be presented for
[3:25:20] approval. Contingent upon commission
[3:25:23] action, the resolutions and required
[3:25:24] budget summary advertisement would be
[3:25:26] will be adjusted for all issues resolved
[3:25:28] as part of this agenda item. Uh at this
[3:25:31] time, uh Mr. Mayor, the city commission
[3:25:34] is scheduled as part of this agenda item
[3:25:35] to consider two proposed resolutions
[3:25:38] regarding solid waste rates and parking
[3:25:40] rates. If I may,
[3:25:42] » Please. The first of these two
[3:25:44] resolutions, resolution number 26R29
[3:25:47] adopting updated solid waste rates reads
[3:25:51] um a resolution of the city commission
[3:25:53] of the city of Tallahassee, Florida,
[3:25:54] establishing the schedule of residential
[3:25:56] and commercial rates for solid waste
[3:25:58] services pursuant to the general the
[3:26:01] code of general ordinances section
[3:26:02] 21-512
[3:26:04] and providing an effective date.
[3:26:06] » Mr. Clerk, do we have any public
[3:26:08] speakers on this item?
[3:26:10] » No, sir.
[3:26:12] Okay. Uh let's move into uh commission
[3:26:16] discussion. I am looking for a motion to
[3:26:18] approve resolution number 26-R29
[3:26:22] adopting updated solid waste rates. Is
[3:26:25] there a motion on the table?
[3:26:26] » So moved, Mr. Mayor.
[3:26:27] » Properly moved by the mayor pro Tim,
[3:26:29] seconded by Commissioner Williams Cox.
[3:26:31] Discussion.
[3:26:33] » Seeing none, all those in favor signify
[3:26:35] by saying I. I.
[3:26:37] » All those opposed? Passes unanimously.
[3:26:40] 5-0. Madam Attorney,
[3:26:41] » The second resolution is resolution
[3:26:43] number 26-R30
[3:26:45] adopting updated parking rates. The
[3:26:48] title of the resolution is a resolution
[3:26:50] authorizing public parking rates.
[3:26:53] » Are there any public speakers on this
[3:26:55] item, Mr. Clerk?
[3:26:56] » No, sir.
[3:26:57] » Colleagues, I am looking for a motion to
[3:26:59] approve resolution number 26-R30,
[3:27:01] adopting updated parking rates.
[3:27:03] » So move, Mr. Mayor.
[3:27:04] » Probably moved by the mayor pro Tim,
[3:27:06] seconded by Commissioner Williams Cox.
[3:27:08] Any further discussion? Seeing none. All
[3:27:10] those in favor signify by saying I.
[3:27:12] » I.
[3:27:12] » All those opposed.
[3:27:15] » Passes 41 with Commissioner Matlo in
[3:27:17] descent. Uh do we have any other
[3:27:20] business to come before us under the
[3:27:22] budget? Madame Attorney,
[3:27:24] » We do not, Mr.
[3:27:25] » This closes the public hearing on this
[3:27:26] item and once again the final public
[3:27:28] hearing on the budget is scheduled for
[3:27:30] September 23rd, 2026.
[3:27:34] We are now on item,
[3:27:36] » Mr. Mayor. Sure.
[3:27:38] » I didn't want to interrupt. Um, but I
[3:27:41] would like to vote I meant to vote
[3:27:42] against the budget. I thought we were
[3:27:44] voting on the DIA milligrate. I thought
[3:27:45] we were doing the mill rates first. So,
[3:27:47] can the record reflect that?
[3:27:49] » Say that one more time.
[3:27:52] » I intended to vote no on the budget. I
[3:27:55] thought when we voted on the budget that
[3:27:57] I was voting yes on the DIA's millage
[3:27:59] rate. So, I would like to ask that the
[3:28:02] record reflect a no vote on the budget,
[3:28:05] » Which was my intention. uh supermajority
[3:28:08] required simply for the millage rate or
[3:28:10] for the budget as well?
[3:28:11] » Uh not for the budget, just for the
[3:28:14] millage rate. Um but and Commissioner
[3:28:17] Porter would be entitled to change her
[3:28:20] vote with the consent of the body.
[3:28:22] » Do we need a motion to reconsider in
[3:28:24] » It's not really a motion to reconsider.
[3:28:26] It's just a motion to allow her to
[3:28:27] change her vote.
[3:28:28] » Okay. Without objection.
[3:28:29] » So move.
[3:28:30] » Unanimously approved. Uh we will change
[3:28:33] Commissioner Porter's vote to a nay vote
[3:28:35] on the budget. It passes 32 with
[3:28:38] Commissioner Matlo and Commissioner
[3:28:40] Porter in descent. The mayor, the mayor
[3:28:42] pro Tim, and Commissioner Williams Cox
[3:28:45] in favor.
[3:28:46] » I voted for the budget.
[3:28:47] » Oh, you did vote in favor. I'm sorry,
[3:28:48] Commissioner Matlo. Okay, let me
[3:28:50] restate. Commissioner Porter has voted
[3:28:53] against uh Commissioner Matlo,
[3:28:55] Commissioner Williams Cox. The mayor Bro
[3:28:57] Tim and the mayor voted in favor. It
[3:28:59] passes 41. Did I get that correct?
[3:29:01] » Yes.
[3:29:02] » Excellent. We're on item number 16.02.
[3:29:05] Madam Attorney,
[3:29:06] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Item number 16.02
[3:29:08] is the uh public hearing on ordinance
[3:29:11] number 26-11,
[3:29:13] an ordinance of the city of Tallahassee,
[3:29:15] Florida, amending section six of the
[3:29:18] charter of the city of Tallahassee to
[3:29:20] annex within the corporate area of the
[3:29:22] city of Tallahass, Florida, upon
[3:29:23] adoption of set ordinance, property
[3:29:26] being situated in Lyon County, Florida,
[3:29:28] in accordance with the voluntary
[3:29:29] annexation provisions of section 171.044
[3:29:32] 044 Florida statutes providing for
[3:29:35] severability conflicts and an effective
[3:29:37] date. The recommended opt action is
[3:29:39] option one conduct the first and only
[3:29:41] public hearing and accept accept staff
[3:29:43] recommendation to adopt ordinance number
[3:29:46] 26-11.
[3:29:48] » Excellent. Do we have any public comment
[3:29:49] on the saddle Mr. Clerk?
[3:29:51] » Mayor we have one speaker Gary Hunter
[3:29:53] presumably to answer questions. Okay,
[3:29:55] colleagues direction
[3:29:56] » Move staff recommendation option number
[3:29:58] one
[3:29:58] » Properly moved by the mayor pro Tim
[3:30:00] second by commissioner Williams Cox. Any
[3:30:02] further discussion?
[3:30:06] » Seeing none. All those in favor signify
[3:30:08] by saying I.
[3:30:09] » I.
[3:30:09] » All those opposed passes unanimously 40
[3:30:12] with Commissioner Porter out of chambers
[3:30:15] 16.03. Madam Attorney,
[3:30:17] » Thank you. Item number 16.03 is the
[3:30:19] second and final public hearing on the
[3:30:21] development agreement with Dr. Horton
[3:30:23] for portions of property within
[3:30:24] Southwood. The recommended action is
[3:30:26] option one, conduct the second and final
[3:30:28] public hearing on the development
[3:30:29] agreement and approve the agreement. I
[3:30:32] understand John Reddic, growth
[3:30:33] management director, is here um on this
[3:30:35] item if necessary.
[3:30:36] » Excellent. Do we have any public comment
[3:30:38] on this item?
[3:30:39] » Only speaker on this item is Aaron
[3:30:40] Tilton again presumably to answer
[3:30:42] questions.
[3:30:43] » All right, colleagues direction.
[3:30:45] » Move staff recommendation on option
[3:30:47] number one. probably move option number
[3:30:49] one by the mayor pro Tim, seconded by
[3:30:51] Commissioner Williams Cox. Any further
[3:30:52] discussion? Commissioner Matlo.
[3:30:54] » Uh, thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um, so I
[3:30:56] notice on the attachment it says that
[3:30:58] this uh was written by the developers
[3:31:01] attorney. Did the city's attorney's
[3:31:03] office uh write any part of this order?
[3:31:06] » Madam Attorney,
[3:31:08] » The Dr. Horton order?
[3:31:10] » Yeah. Or the agreement?
[3:31:11] » Uh, did we write any part of it?
[3:31:15] Um, no. It was the draft was written by
[3:31:19] uh Aaron Tilton.
[3:31:22] Um
[3:31:24] I'm I'm not sure on this one at what
[3:31:26] point our office was involved in
[3:31:28] reviewing it.
[3:31:29] » Okay. And
[3:31:30] » I'd have to ask
[3:31:31] » Mr. M um
[3:31:32] » Deputy I'd have to ask Deputy City
[3:31:33] attorney L Norval at what point he was.
[3:31:37] » All right, Mr. Matlo.
[3:31:39] » Um so what specifically does this
[3:31:42] agreement do?
[3:31:44] Madam Attorney,
[3:31:46] » So um
[3:31:49] again I guess I would ask uh John Reick
[3:31:52] if he could describe the development
[3:31:54] agreement and then I can follow up with
[3:31:56] any uh legal questions related to it.
[3:31:58] But
[3:31:58] » Mr. Reick, good to see you, sir.
[3:32:01] So this agreement uh was provided to to
[3:32:05] the city for consideration as the city
[3:32:07] attorney stated as written uh by the
[3:32:09] developers representatives. Uh and the
[3:32:12] agreement is essentially to state that
[3:32:15] Dr. Horton who uh as you know is working
[3:32:18] through permitting for development of
[3:32:20] three different tracks on the southern
[3:32:21] part portion of the Southwood uh DRRI.
[3:32:24] Uh they would like to have this where
[3:32:27] they they're assuming the role of the
[3:32:28] developer whereas the DRRI of course has
[3:32:31] St. Joe currently identified as the role
[3:32:33] of developer uh by way of doing that.
[3:32:36] And part of this is they're assuming the
[3:32:38] obligations of u roadway construction
[3:32:41] through these areas that are outlined in
[3:32:43] the Southwood DRRI. So what they are uh
[3:32:47] recognized the familiarity with the
[3:32:49] enforcement action associated with the
[3:32:51] southwood DRRI based on the obligation
[3:32:53] around the obligations to build those
[3:32:55] those roadways. Their proposal through
[3:32:57] this agreement is they'll assume the
[3:32:59] obligations uh that the developer at St.
[3:33:02] Joe would otherwise have had. They will
[3:33:04] commit to building them all in time. um
[3:33:06] they've you know through this would be
[3:33:08] held accountable if there was any uh any
[3:33:13] violation relative to what's outlined in
[3:33:16] the south of DRRI for those specific
[3:33:17] roadway segments. So this is Merchants
[3:33:19] Row and Artemis Way two portions of
[3:33:22] this. Um in return they wouldn't be held
[3:33:25] accountable or or exposed to um any
[3:33:28] enforcement action that may be a result
[3:33:31] of violations occurring outside of these
[3:33:34] tracks that they're developing. Okay.
[3:33:36] And and that's what I my question is
[3:33:37] about. So, uh the developers right to
[3:33:40] proceed said that they can proceed
[3:33:42] development on those specified lots even
[3:33:45] if the internal roads aren't built.
[3:33:48] » So, the the internals roads within what
[3:33:51] they're developing would have to be
[3:33:52] built certainly. And full transparency,
[3:33:55] they're they're they're working through
[3:33:56] that right now. The the development
[3:33:58] plans that they are doing right now um
[3:34:00] as part of their permitting process
[3:34:02] incorporate these roadways right now.
[3:34:04] So, it is dependent. I would I would say
[3:34:06] not only are they required to to build
[3:34:08] them, what they're proposing to do is
[3:34:10] very much dependent from a traffic
[3:34:12] analysis standpoint. It it doesn't
[3:34:14] happen without them building these
[3:34:15] roadways. So, that's all to say they
[3:34:18] would very much still be on the hook for
[3:34:19] what they are incorporating within their
[3:34:21] development scope.
[3:34:22] » And and St. Joe's the current owner and
[3:34:25] they're obligated to build those
[3:34:27] roadways.
[3:34:27] » They are the current owner. I I would
[3:34:30] also some of those questions to the to
[3:34:33] the representative the developer too on
[3:34:35] there any specifics. So I know as much
[3:34:37] as the city is in terms of the
[3:34:38] permitting process.
[3:34:39] » So so what is the benefit to the city?
[3:34:42] » I we would still I would say a net
[3:34:44] neutral in the sense we still are
[3:34:46] getting the the the roadway um the
[3:34:49] roadways built that we intended through
[3:34:52] our agreement with the DR within the
[3:34:53] DRRi. um the you know greater value to
[3:34:59] the home construction that's associated
[3:35:01] with it. Um but certainly from an
[3:35:03] infrastructure priority um the process
[3:35:06] or the progress that's being made right
[3:35:07] now uh towards constructing those
[3:35:09] roadways is in line with and ahead of
[3:35:11] schedule with what's stated in the
[3:35:13] Southwood DRRI.
[3:35:15] » And so have we done this type of
[3:35:16] agreement before? I'm not familiar with
[3:35:19] an agreement like this that would be a
[3:35:21] carval from an existing agreement uh
[3:35:25] with a I'll say a third party involved
[3:35:28] in
[3:35:29] » And so why are we doing this now
[3:35:32] » This this was provided to us and and
[3:35:35] ultimately you for consideration. So I
[3:35:37] think it in that nature we would look
[3:35:39] for your feedback as to whether it's
[3:35:40] appropriate or not.
[3:35:42] » Okay. And so this wasn't directed to be
[3:35:43] brought by the city commission who put
[3:35:44] it on the agenda.
[3:35:46] » Correct. This is the our typical
[3:35:49] procedure on a on a development
[3:35:51] agreement request or even amendment to a
[3:35:53] development agreement would be uh
[3:35:55] submitting a through growth management.
[3:35:56] There's a fee associated with that and
[3:35:58] then from there processing it for for
[3:35:59] the two public hearings for the for the
[3:36:01] city commission to consider.
[3:36:02] » So if I'm hearing you correctly, the
[3:36:04] process is for a developer to submit a
[3:36:07] fully written agreement and then have
[3:36:10] that brought to the city commission.
[3:36:12] » It is often uh produced that way.
[3:36:16] » Another question. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[3:36:17] » Sure. Absolutely. Um, I let me pipe up
[3:36:21] and say that we're at a point in the
[3:36:23] process as the process is described. No,
[3:36:26] commissioners do not ask for this
[3:36:28] individually. The way how the process is
[3:36:30] structured, it comes to us uh for
[3:36:32] consideration moving forward.
[3:36:34] Commissioner Matlo and um, Madame
[3:36:37] Attorney, I know that your office has
[3:36:38] had eyes on this and have looked at it.
[3:36:40] I know that you've been in and out a
[3:36:42] little bit lately. Uh, but I have full
[3:36:43] confidence in your legal team. Yes, I
[3:36:46] would like to
[3:36:46] » Particular issue and if we need to dive
[3:36:48] in, I know that Mr. Norll is here as
[3:36:50] well. If I can help answer any
[3:36:51] questions. I know you got caught off
[3:36:53] guard there for a second.
[3:36:54] » Oh, yes. Thank you.
[3:36:55] » But but I but I know that you all been
[3:36:57] engaged. So, there is a motion on the
[3:36:59] table made by the mayor prom for
[3:37:00] approval. Second by Commissioner
[3:37:01] Williams Cox. Mayor Pro.
[3:37:03] » Yeah. Just a quick question, Mr. Mayor.
[3:37:05] Is it is it my understanding that this
[3:37:08] helps us avoid the situation that we're
[3:37:10] currently in in Southwood with
[3:37:15] Yes, Commissioner. I believe that this
[3:37:17] development agreement would address that
[3:37:19] type of
[3:37:20] » So, it would behove behoove us then to
[3:37:23] agree to this type of uh agreement with
[3:37:27] the developer.
[3:37:28] » Correct.
[3:37:29] » That's your decision.
[3:37:30] » Okay.
[3:37:30] » On point, Mr. Mayor.
[3:37:32] » Commissioner Matler, then Commissioner
[3:37:33] Porter.
[3:37:34] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor, and and
[3:37:35] Commissioner Erdson. My view is it does
[3:37:37] uh the exact opposite. Um, it
[3:37:39] relinquishes uh our ability to use these
[3:37:42] parcels as part of enforcement against
[3:37:44] St. Joe to develop the roadway and
[3:37:46] allows these parcels to be developed uh
[3:37:49] no matter if those roadways get built or
[3:37:51] not. Mr. Mayor,
[3:37:52] » Mr. Porter.
[3:37:53] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. That's my reading
[3:37:55] as well. I would like to hear more from
[3:37:59] our city attorney as to why she believes
[3:38:01] the contrary.
[3:38:02] » Could I ask uh Mr. Noral to
[3:38:04] » Mr. Noral, please come join us for the
[3:38:05] fun.
[3:38:17] And I'll just say while while Mr.
[3:38:19] Norville is walking up, this is from the
[3:38:21] agreement. Under the agreement or from
[3:38:23] the item under the agreement, Dr. Horton
[3:38:24] would be allowed to continue development
[3:38:26] of its property regardless of the
[3:38:28] construction and completion status of
[3:38:30] other roads required by the Southwood
[3:38:32] Development of Regional Impact
[3:38:34] Development Order.
[3:38:36] » Mr. Mayor, if could could I have the
[3:38:38] question restated for me?
[3:38:42] » Commissioner Porter.
[3:38:43] » So, Commissioner Richardson's question
[3:38:45] was, "Do this does this agreement help
[3:38:48] us avoid what we are going through with
[3:38:51] St. Joe?"
[3:38:53] And the city attorney's answer was yes.
[3:38:57] But that's not how I read this
[3:38:59] agreement.
[3:39:01] It seems like it leaves St. Joe fully
[3:39:03] off the hook and the roads being built.
[3:39:07] I mean, I'll just start by asking, was
[3:39:09] this agreement prompted by the
[3:39:11] enforcement action against St. Joe? Is
[3:39:14] that why it's coming to us now?
[3:39:16] » So, Commissioner, I'd have to defer to
[3:39:18] somebody else. What I've understood, and
[3:39:20] I mean, at least what this this office
[3:39:22] saw is is that this uh there was an
[3:39:25] application that was submitted. Uh, it
[3:39:27] did come the draft agreement did come to
[3:39:29] the city attorney's office and it did go
[3:39:31] to growth management.
[3:39:34] » Okay. So, as to Commissioner
[3:39:36] Richardson's question, can you address
[3:39:38] that?
[3:39:39] » So, some of this may be just kind of
[3:39:41] practical application that others may be
[3:39:44] able to speak to better. I mean, as I
[3:39:46] understand it, part of this is to give
[3:39:48] some assurance to uh this developer here
[3:39:51] that they can go forward. Uh John may be
[3:39:54] able to speak to kind of where things
[3:39:55] are on permitting, but I as I understand
[3:39:58] it because of some uncertainty
[3:40:01] uh uh with the the uh enforcement action
[3:40:04] that this does give certainty to this
[3:40:06] developer to go forward with permitting
[3:40:08] to and to build uh homes and there there
[3:40:11] are the asurances that this Artemis Way
[3:40:13] and merchants would be.
[3:40:15] » Okay. Thank you.
[3:40:16] » Order.
[3:40:17] » Okay. Commissioner Williams Cox.
[3:40:19] » Thank you. Uh Mr. Mayor uh Erin Tilton
[3:40:21] is here and I think she's here. We might
[3:40:24] as well give her opportunity to explain
[3:40:25] since she's representing Dr. Horton.
[3:40:28] » Tilton, thank you for joining us.
[3:40:31] » Thank you for having me. Appreciate it.
[3:40:32] Uh Aaron Tilton, 106 East College
[3:40:35] Avenue, uh Sterns Weaver Miller on
[3:40:37] behalf of Dr. Horton. Um you know,
[3:40:39] commissioners, I think there are a
[3:40:40] couple of questions about Chapter 163
[3:40:42] development agreements generally. um
[3:40:45] they are used in pretty much every
[3:40:47] jurisdiction across the state to
[3:40:50] encourage private investment in capital
[3:40:52] infrastructure. And and the the way that
[3:40:56] you do that through a chapter 163
[3:40:57] agreement is you provide the applicant
[3:40:59] with assurances that if it makes these
[3:41:01] very significant investments in
[3:41:03] infrastructure that are going to be
[3:41:04] built out over time that those
[3:41:06] investments are not interrupted by
[3:41:09] changes in the in the status quo during
[3:41:11] the the course of the development. Um,
[3:41:14] sorry, Commissioner Porter.
[3:41:15] » No, I'm just I would like to be
[3:41:16] recognized when you finish. Okay. Thank
[3:41:18] you.
[3:41:19] » Um,
[3:41:21] so that's particularly important in a
[3:41:23] very largecale master plan community
[3:41:25] like Southwood again that has
[3:41:26] significant infrastructure that is built
[3:41:28] out over a long period of time. Um and
[3:41:31] so in protecting that the private
[3:41:34] investment what what the city
[3:41:36] additionally gets through a development
[3:41:37] agreement is another mechanism to
[3:41:40] enforce the applicant's infrastructure
[3:41:42] obligations. So you ask the question
[3:41:44] does this help us avoid a situation like
[3:41:46] we have with St. Joe in the future. You
[3:41:48] would have the same exact um you know
[3:41:50] enforcement capabilities under the DRRI
[3:41:53] development order with regard to the
[3:41:55] roadway obligations that Dr. Horton is
[3:41:57] agreeing to assume. You would also have
[3:41:59] contractual obligations and statutory
[3:42:02] remedies in addition to what's allowed
[3:42:04] in your DRI development order that you
[3:42:06] could enforce if those roadways are not
[3:42:08] completed. Under this agreement, Dr.
[3:42:10] Horton has to complete those
[3:42:11] improvements on the same schedule that
[3:42:13] is currently laid out in exhibit G to
[3:42:16] the DRRI and those are associated with
[3:42:18] MDR19 and 20. So they are in the pods
[3:42:22] that Dr. Horton will be developing. They
[3:42:24] are on the south side of the Southwood
[3:42:26] DRI. They are nowhere near Orange
[3:42:27] Avenue. Um,
[3:42:30] Dr. Horton has multiple, as you, as you
[3:42:32] noted, Commissioner Malo, they have
[3:42:33] multiple properties under contract
[3:42:35] within the Southwood DRRi. They have not
[3:42:37] asked for this development agreement to
[3:42:39] cover all of those properties. They've
[3:42:40] asked for it to cover the properties
[3:42:42] where they are building their own
[3:42:44] infrastructure independent of what St.
[3:42:46] Joe may have obligated in other places
[3:42:47] within the DR.
[3:42:50] » Commission Porter, you're recognized.
[3:42:54] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And I understand
[3:42:55] the point of a development agreement and
[3:42:57] I and I know that the roads are not that
[3:43:01] in question with St. Joe are not here. I
[3:43:03] do have to say it makes me
[3:43:05] uncomfortable. I mean I would prefer to
[3:43:07] hear from our own staff about the public
[3:43:09] benefit of an agreement like this and
[3:43:11] not from the developers attorney. But I
[3:43:13] do appreciate that explanation. But I I
[3:43:16] mean I think it is you know we have been
[3:43:18] through this before. I'll let this go
[3:43:21] because we still have other items to
[3:43:23] hear to hear from. But, you know, the
[3:43:26] way I see this, this is a giveaway to
[3:43:29] St. Joe. We frankly didn't do what we
[3:43:32] needed to do to make sure that that
[3:43:34] development agreement was upheld and now
[3:43:38] we're giving them an out because they
[3:43:40] don't want to develop that area anymore.
[3:43:43] So, I have concerns about this and
[3:43:45] concerns about this process, frankly.
[3:43:48] So, that's where I'm at. Thank you. I'm
[3:43:50] ready to move on.
[3:43:50] » Commissioner Porter, we can spend as
[3:43:52] much time as you'd like on this issue.
[3:43:53] So, I don't want you to feel rushed. If
[3:43:55] you have additional questions or
[3:43:56] comments, right back in. Commissioner
[3:43:58] Williams Cox.
[3:44:00] » Um, I think the net net is out of when
[3:44:02] all of this is said and done, how many
[3:44:03] homes are we're anticipating being
[3:44:05] built?
[3:44:09] » So, LSF11 and MDR20 are single family.
[3:44:12] 19 is both a combination of multif
[3:44:14] family and single family. Number
[3:44:20] » Around 800 units when you include multi.
[3:44:22] » Okay. So, how the city benefits is that
[3:44:25] we have a housing inventory that we're
[3:44:27] trying to
[3:44:27] » You do and it's also at a a price park a
[3:44:30] price point that does not currently
[3:44:32] exist in the market.
[3:44:33] » Right. So, that you know after all of
[3:44:35] this is said and done, the net net is
[3:44:37] that how we how it benefits the city and
[3:44:39] its residents is growing number of
[3:44:41] residents is housing. Um and and to help
[3:44:44] make it affordable because we have more
[3:44:46] housing in the inventory to be
[3:44:48] competitive with other other housing.
[3:44:50] » Absolutely, Commissioner. And I' I'd
[3:44:52] also say the alternative with the
[3:44:54] current situation with Southwood and St.
[3:44:56] Joe and potential non-compliance without
[3:44:58] something like a development agreement
[3:44:59] in place. You're essentially looking at
[3:45:02] no one is coming in to build in
[3:45:03] Southwood.
[3:45:04] » Thank you. Commissioner Matlo, you have
[3:45:06] questions.
[3:45:07] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. Yeah, just one.
[3:45:09] So, so what's your understanding of Dr.
[3:45:12] Horton's ability to develop on these
[3:45:14] lots with those other roads not being
[3:45:16] constructed that are not included?
[3:45:18] » With which other roads specifically? uh
[3:45:19] the Orange Avenue extension in
[3:45:21] Builtmore.
[3:45:22] » My understanding of their ability to
[3:45:24] build on these roadways today is that
[3:45:25] they are not covered by the
[3:45:26] non-compliance finding. So they would be
[3:45:28] able to build today. Now whether that
[3:45:30] non-compliance area is expanded in the
[3:45:32] future um is a is a big question mark.
[3:45:35] » Okay. And so I asked John the same
[3:45:37] question. What's the purpose of this
[3:45:39] agreement?
[3:45:39] » The purpose of this agreement is to
[3:45:41] provide stability for the significant
[3:45:42] investment that Dr. Horton is making in
[3:45:44] taking on those infrastructure
[3:45:46] obligations that would not otherwise be
[3:45:47] theirs.
[3:45:48] Okay. Uh, thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[3:45:50] » Got a motion on the table made by the
[3:45:52] mayor pro Tim, second by Commissioner
[3:45:54] Williams Cox. All those in favor of the
[3:45:55] motion signify by saying I. I.
[3:45:57] » All those opposed.
[3:45:59] » Passes three to two with Commissioner
[3:46:00] Matloo and Commissioner Porter against.
[3:46:02] We're on item number 16.4. Madame
[3:46:04] Attorney.
[3:46:06] » Uh, thank you, Mr. Mayor. This is the
[3:46:08] first of two um item number 16.04 is the
[3:46:11] first of two public hearings on the
[3:46:13] third amended and restated canopy
[3:46:15] development agreement. the second public
[3:46:17] hearing scheduled for September 23rd,
[3:46:19] 2026. The recommended action is option
[3:46:22] one, conduct the first public hearing on
[3:46:23] the development agreement and schedule
[3:46:25] the second and final public hearing for
[3:46:26] September 23rd, 2026 at 6 p.m. in the
[3:46:29] City of Tallahassee city commission
[3:46:31] chambers at city hall. Again, John
[3:46:33] Reick, uh, growth management director,
[3:46:35] will present this item or is available
[3:46:36] to answer questions.
[3:46:38] » Thank you, Mr. Clerk. Do we have any
[3:46:39] public comment on this item?
[3:46:40] » Mayor, again, I [clears throat] have two
[3:46:42] speakers on this item. I assume both to
[3:46:43] answer questions. Lynn Adams Takis and
[3:46:46] Aaron Tilton.
[3:46:48] » All right.
[3:46:52] Say that again.
[3:46:54] We're gonna get there in just a second.
[3:46:55] Yes, ma'am. Um, do either one of our
[3:46:58] public speakers want to speak?
[3:47:01] Okay. Excellent. Let's go with the
[3:47:03] presentation.
[3:47:07] » Thank you, mayor. I don't have a
[3:47:09] presentation on this. I am just availed
[3:47:11] for questions if we need to. Similar to
[3:47:13] the pri previous item, this was
[3:47:15] submitted for consideration to staff um
[3:47:17] stated this would be the first of of two
[3:47:19] public hearings. Your your recommended
[3:47:21] action is essentially to hold the per
[3:47:23] first public hearing and schedule the
[3:47:24] second. Um I think at this point the the
[3:47:27] proposal that was submitted to us the
[3:47:28] primary um the the primary uh component
[3:47:33] of of an amendment to the canopy
[3:47:35] development agreement uh would be
[3:47:37] amending the the developer's obligation
[3:47:40] um or or intent I should say to
[3:47:42] construct the roadway connection denso
[3:47:46] um at Mkasuki uh currently terminates
[3:47:49] essentially at the bounds of the Mkasuki
[3:47:51] greenway uh what is contemplated
[3:47:53] certainly the development agreement and
[3:47:55] the plan unit development to extend
[3:47:57] across the greenway and tie in with the
[3:47:59] existing uh where [snorts] Mayo
[3:48:01] currently approaches from the east or
[3:48:03] excuse me from the south into Suki. Uh
[3:48:07] so there are other components that that
[3:48:09] were submitted that have been submitted
[3:48:10] for consideration. Uh I'll say the bulk
[3:48:13] of it in terms of individual items is
[3:48:16] acknowledging a lot of obligations that
[3:48:18] were uh you know expected when this was
[3:48:21] originally drafted but have since been
[3:48:23] fulfilled. Um there's also uh proposed
[3:48:26] revisions to the the bus shelter
[3:48:30] requirements within it. There's a
[3:48:32] recognition of the uh termination of the
[3:48:36] inclusionary housing agreement which
[3:48:37] occurred in 2024. Um so with that I I
[3:48:41] would certainly uh
[3:48:44] hand off any questions of of the
[3:48:46] proposal and the the details behind it
[3:48:48] to the representative uh present for the
[3:48:50] developer. Um but with that from south
[3:48:53] side we would look for your direction uh
[3:48:55] on this proposal. Let's
[3:48:57] » Go back to public comment. Mr. Clerk
[3:49:00] » Two speakers on the item. Mayor uh Lynn
[3:49:02] Adams Takis.
[3:49:09] » Excellent. Your name and address for the
[3:49:10] record.
[3:49:11] » Lyn Adams Tacis 2133 Miller Landing
[3:49:14] Road. And unfortunately I don't have
[3:49:16] prepared comments so I just went ahead
[3:49:18] and brought this with me. Um, some of
[3:49:20] the main components of this developer
[3:49:22] agreement, which again is written by the
[3:49:25] developer in their best interest, is
[3:49:28] that road construction responsibilities
[3:49:30] will shift to taxpayers. And let's just
[3:49:32] all remember Wani Boulevard is already
[3:49:35] being built to help support these luxury
[3:49:38] developments.
[3:49:40] I think the original cost was supposed
[3:49:41] to be $78 million.
[3:49:44] Currently, it's at $22 million. is the
[3:49:47] most expensive of three major roadway
[3:49:49] projects going on for blueprint that all
[3:49:51] combined do about 15 miles of road, a
[3:49:54] little less, and over half a billion
[3:49:57] dollars. So, if we're looking for
[3:49:59] opportunities to help, you know, balance
[3:50:01] our budget. I think one of the main
[3:50:03] things I would look at is not taking
[3:50:05] over responsibilities for the public to
[3:50:08] pay for roads that the developer is
[3:50:10] obligated to do. uh Canopy would get
[3:50:12] reserved road capacity even if the roads
[3:50:15] become congested. The development can
[3:50:18] change without amending the agreement
[3:50:20] which also cuts the public out of making
[3:50:23] comments. The um agreement would lock in
[3:50:26] provisions for 15 years under the
[3:50:29] current development code. And I don't
[3:50:31] know if y'all have noticed, but we've
[3:50:32] had a lot of extreme heat days this
[3:50:34] summer. It is so dadum hot. And a big
[3:50:38] reason for that is because we keep
[3:50:40] taking all the trees out. And I know
[3:50:42] everybody's like, "Oh my gosh, a tree
[3:50:43] hugger." But trees matter and we have
[3:50:46] opportunities to keep more of them in
[3:50:48] what is our open space, green space,
[3:50:51] which right now lets you just clear
[3:50:53] everything out and put sod on it. And so
[3:50:55] we may, Lord willing, change our
[3:50:58] development code in the future to keep
[3:51:00] more of our forested areas in what is
[3:51:03] already set aside space. But under this
[3:51:06] new development code or de developer
[3:51:09] agreement, if we were to change that in
[3:51:11] the next 15 years, it won't matter
[3:51:14] because they won't be obligated to
[3:51:16] follow the new code. So, you're
[3:51:18] handcuffing a future commission. The
[3:51:21] other is that part of Wani Boulevard in
[3:51:24] this development agreement says it'll be
[3:51:28] six lanes. And I don't think a lot of
[3:51:30] people realize that what part of Wani
[3:51:33] Boulevard will be is equal to what we
[3:51:35] have on Thomasville Road. So there's a
[3:51:38] lot of important parts to this that I
[3:51:39] think you know the developers going to
[3:51:42] ride it in their best interest. And what
[3:51:44] we need y'all to do is to look out for
[3:51:46] our best interests.
[3:51:48] » And that is what I'm asking you to do.
[3:51:51] Please do not just vote for this next
[3:51:53] time it's up. actually look out for the
[3:51:56] public because right now Wani Boulevard
[3:51:58] is already a boon doggle. So, let's not
[3:52:02] add to it and let's not add to what
[3:52:05] taxpayers are paying and keep raising
[3:52:08] their taxes while we're giving
[3:52:10] developers a free ride. Thank you.
[3:52:16] » Next speaker is Aaron Tilton.
[3:52:21] » Your name and address for the record,
[3:52:22] please.
[3:52:22] » Thank you, commissioners. Aaron Tilton,
[3:52:24] 106 East College Avenue, Sterns Weaver
[3:52:26] Miller on behalf of the applicant. Um,
[3:52:28] as uh Mr. Reic mentioned, the item
[3:52:30] before you is an amendment to the
[3:52:31] development agreement for Canopy. That
[3:52:33] development agreement was originally
[3:52:34] approved in 2011. It's been amended just
[3:52:37] about once every five or six years since
[3:52:40] 2011. Uh, which again with a large-scale
[3:52:42] master plan community built out over a,
[3:52:45] you know, a decent span of time, that is
[3:52:49] fairly common. Um so the project had the
[3:52:52] development agreement has been amended
[3:52:53] in 2016 2020 and now 2026 you have this
[3:52:57] amendment before you. Um importantly
[3:52:59] there's no changes being proposed to the
[3:53:01] development program here. Uh this is
[3:53:03] really entirely clean up of existing
[3:53:05] obligations and clarification where
[3:53:08] we've realized over time that that was
[3:53:09] needed. I want to talk real quick about
[3:53:11] the roadway. Um, the origin of that
[3:53:14] extension of Dempsey Mayo across the
[3:53:17] greenway to connect to Mkasuki Road
[3:53:19] actually dates back to 1998. Uh, when
[3:53:21] the landowner initially conveyed the
[3:53:23] greenway to the trust for public land, a
[3:53:26] easement across the greenway was
[3:53:28] reserved for future roadway access. Uh
[3:53:30] in 2002 when the city and the county
[3:53:32] adopted the Wani critical area plan uh
[3:53:35] they adopted a policy that provided for
[3:53:37] road access at uh Mkasuki and Dempsey
[3:53:40] Mayo across the greenway within that
[3:53:42] reserved easement if it was determined
[3:53:45] by the local government that a
[3:53:46] connection would have a desirable impact
[3:53:49] on the Mkasuki Canopy Road. That issue
[3:53:52] came in front of your predecessors in
[3:53:54] 2006 that your predecessor commission
[3:53:57] based on an expert report and analysis
[3:53:58] that were submitted by the land owner
[3:54:00] found that that connection point would
[3:54:02] have a desirable impact and that was
[3:54:05] memorialized in a prior agreement we
[3:54:07] refer to as the amended and restated uh
[3:54:09] USA.
[3:54:11] That agreement says the city and owners
[3:54:14] agree that the owners shall be entitled
[3:54:17] to access Mkasuki Road at Dempsey Mayo
[3:54:20] within that reserved access easement. So
[3:54:22] sometime between 2006 and the present
[3:54:25] day, this narrative has has come forward
[3:54:29] that the developer is obligated to build
[3:54:31] that roadway. That was never the case.
[3:54:33] It's never been in the development
[3:54:34] agreement. It's never been in the PUD.
[3:54:37] It's never been in the Wani critical
[3:54:38] area plan. It has always been that the
[3:54:40] de developer is entitled to that access
[3:54:42] point based on a showing that they made
[3:54:44] to a prior commission of a desirable
[3:54:46] impact. Um, this came to a head, you may
[3:54:49] remember, a little bit over a year ago,
[3:54:51] the county commission on its own
[3:54:52] initiative took up an agenda item to
[3:54:54] talk about the the Masuki Canopy Road
[3:54:57] Greenway and this roadway in particular
[3:54:59] and got into a public discussion of
[3:55:01] actually designing that roadway through
[3:55:03] the greenway in which the developer was
[3:55:04] not at the table. There was of course
[3:55:08] quite a bit of public opposition to
[3:55:10] putting that roadway in place. That was
[3:55:12] the point at which we realized this
[3:55:15] narrative was out in the public that we
[3:55:17] were required to build the roadway and
[3:55:18] that we want needed to add this as one
[3:55:20] of the things we would clarify when we
[3:55:22] brought the development agreement
[3:55:23] forward for cleanup as we have done just
[3:55:26] about every 5 years since it was
[3:55:27] developed.
[3:55:28] » Thank you, M. If you'll just stick
[3:55:30] around if there's additional questions.
[3:55:32] » Next speaker, please.
[3:55:33] » Those are the only speakers on the item.
[3:55:35] » All right. All right, we're on
[3:55:36] commission discussion, direction.
[3:55:37] Remember, this is the first of two
[3:55:38] public hearings. Uh, it'll be coming
[3:55:40] back to us in September as well. There a
[3:55:43] motion to move forward. Commissioner
[3:55:45] Porter.
[3:55:46] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I would like to
[3:55:48] ask if Mr. Reic can come back up to
[3:55:51] answer some questions.
[3:55:52] » Reick. So, since the original PUB
[3:55:56] predates my time on the commission,
[3:55:59] can someone just address why the prior
[3:56:02] requirements were put into place
[3:56:04] originally?
[3:56:06] » The the requirements of
[3:56:09] » Of the development agreement. Just all
[3:56:11] of them. I mean, the all of them.
[3:56:12] » Sure. because it was all-encompassing
[3:56:15] and a lot of it predated the current
[3:56:17] developers involvement actually in this
[3:56:20] property and then they amended and
[3:56:21] restated as they assumed those
[3:56:23] obligations. So um I would say chiefly
[3:56:26] the largest was tied to
[3:56:29] um the buildout of Wani Boulevard. The
[3:56:31] developer got a lot of um they
[3:56:34] participated in the construction of that
[3:56:36] and in return got um the currency
[3:56:39] credits. They also um committed to for
[3:56:42] example the the transit facilities. They
[3:56:44] also again there was the inclusionary
[3:56:46] housing component which separately they
[3:56:48] benefited from that was related to our
[3:56:50] at that time it was our inclusionary
[3:56:52] housing ordinance. They benefited from
[3:56:54] density b entitlement bonuses
[3:56:56] essentially. So there the the net
[3:56:59] benefit and why the the city entered
[3:57:01] into the agreement um was was um pretty
[3:57:06] diverse in in reason but I would say the
[3:57:09] largest component of it um certainly
[3:57:11] financially was infrastructure related.
[3:57:13] There was a lot of I think there was
[3:57:15] even underground utilities included that
[3:57:17] as well. So um and then also
[3:57:21] recognized the uh location for the new
[3:57:24] senior center city got in return
[3:57:28] for their participation in this.
[3:57:30] » Okay. Thank you. Are there any cost
[3:57:32] impacts to the city by entering if we
[3:57:36] enter into this agreement or accept the
[3:57:38] amendment amendment agreement for for
[3:57:41] consideration um that we've recognized
[3:57:43] is that the uh city's
[3:57:48] currency certainly recognizing the
[3:57:50] developers you know debating their their
[3:57:53] real obligation to that versus we've
[3:57:56] certainly pro proceeded with the intent
[3:57:58] that it would be uh constructed in the
[3:58:00] sense of uh as part of the build out by
[3:58:03] the developers that our concurrency
[3:58:06] system you know modeling for example has
[3:58:08] assumed that that connection would be
[3:58:12] made case or you know within the the the
[3:58:16] time frame of this development order uh
[3:58:18] or development agreement excuse me. So,
[3:58:20] um that is one where essentially
[3:58:23] assuming a more connected roadway
[3:58:25] network meant for um I'll say a better
[3:58:28] assessment of traffic impacts because
[3:58:30] the the intent stated intent both within
[3:58:33] the the critical area plan and within
[3:58:36] development agreement and um is that
[3:58:39] that connection would be there to
[3:58:41] relieve traffic off of the Canopy roads
[3:58:43] to and improve the broader network. So
[3:58:46] to say since Canopy has been built out
[3:58:49] when we look at you know one let's say
[3:58:52] phase of residential construction we are
[3:58:55] modeling the traffic impacts of that
[3:58:56] based on the assumption that these that
[3:58:58] connection is going to be there um and
[3:59:01] we would have done that moving forward.
[3:59:02] So that is something for consideration
[3:59:04] where um
[3:59:06] the city may have had there may have
[3:59:08] been
[3:59:10] more impact concurrency impacts and
[3:59:12] traffic impacts from things that have
[3:59:13] had occurred already and would be you
[3:59:15] know will occur moving forward for the
[3:59:17] full buildout that the city needs to
[3:59:19] take consideration when looking at this
[3:59:22] proposal.
[3:59:23] » Okay. Thank you. So I want to make sure
[3:59:25] I understand. So
[3:59:30] there is an impact obviously if well let
[3:59:33] me back up for a second. So the
[3:59:35] concurrency calculation
[3:59:38] in the original agreement or the latest
[3:59:41] agreement assumed that Dempsey Mayo
[3:59:43] would be constructed.
[3:59:45] » Correct. So correct
[3:59:46] » We're looking at a let's say 100 homes
[3:59:49] that that may be built in a phase. We're
[3:59:52] assessing the traffic network that the
[3:59:54] demands it'll put on our network. And
[3:59:56] within that model, we have that
[3:59:58] connection made. So, it's assuming that
[4:00:00] cars would be able to exit that larger
[4:00:03] master development and go and access
[4:00:06] Mississippi.
[4:00:07] » Okay. And as far as I could tell, and I
[4:00:10] think you've just addressed this, I
[4:00:12] didn't see anything in this agreement
[4:00:14] that addresses the concurrency
[4:00:16] calculations directly other than
[4:00:18] language that reads to me to say we'll
[4:00:21] handle this later in a separate
[4:00:22] agreement. Is that accurate?
[4:00:24] » The language you're referring to is the
[4:00:25] extent of that. Okay.
[4:00:27] » Provided to us. Yes.
[4:00:28] » And may I ask, why would we do that? Why
[4:00:30] wouldn't we include it in this
[4:00:31] agreement?
[4:00:33] Frank, the commissioner would look at
[4:00:34] your direction on that. We wanted to to
[4:00:37] incorporate that and and assess that in
[4:00:39] more detail rather than evaluating it
[4:00:42] after the fact.
[4:00:44] » Okay.
[4:00:45] What And now just jumping forward a
[4:00:49] little bit to talk about the roundabout
[4:00:52] at the intersection of Wani and Dempsey
[4:00:54] Mayo.
[4:00:56] So this agreement
[4:01:00] would rem eliminate the roundabout or we
[4:01:04] wouldn't move forward with the
[4:01:05] roundabout. Is that correct?
[4:01:07] » I don't know that it necessarily changes
[4:01:09] the type of intersection if it does get
[4:01:11] built. Uh again, I think it's still
[4:01:13] contemplated another of excuse me, a
[4:01:16] number of other areas that it would be a
[4:01:18] roundabout. Um but the I think the
[4:01:21] change is that um essentially it may be
[4:01:26] someone else is stepping in to do that
[4:01:28] at work. It's the developers Not
[4:01:32] intending to do that.
[4:01:33] » Okay.
[4:01:35] I'm seeing shaking heads behind you.
[4:01:39] » Sure.
[4:01:39] » Yes, please.
[4:01:41] » Hilton comment.
[4:01:43] » Thank you. Apologies for interrupting.
[4:01:45] Um, so the way this agreement is
[4:01:47] drafted, we're not saying the developer
[4:01:49] is not going to build this connection.
[4:01:50] We are saying they are not obligated to
[4:01:52] build this connection. If at some point
[4:01:54] in the future it makes sense from a
[4:01:56] traffic standpoint, from a you
[4:01:58] development standpoint, all of all of
[4:01:59] those factors, it it may get built, it
[4:02:03] may get built by this developer. Um
[4:02:05] they're not they're they're simply we're
[4:02:06] simply clarifying because of the
[4:02:09] narrative that is out there in the
[4:02:10] public that this is not an obligation
[4:02:12] associated with this development. Um,
[4:02:14] and then to the concurrency question, I
[4:02:16] think that's one of the reasons we're
[4:02:17] not addressing concurrency now because
[4:02:19] this still may get built. If we're
[4:02:21] concerned about a concur concurrency
[4:02:23] refund, I can tell you this developer is
[4:02:25] also sitting on a couple million dollars
[4:02:26] in concurrency credit right now from
[4:02:27] other infrastructure they've built for
[4:02:29] this community. So, it's really not
[4:02:30] something that I would be concerned with
[4:02:33] at this point.
[4:02:34] » Okay. Thank you. Um,
[4:02:38] I am cons I am concerned about it, but I
[4:02:40] appreciate that response. Um, can you
[4:02:43] speak a little bit to
[4:02:46] why we are eliminating the minimum for
[4:02:48] transit shelters?
[4:02:50] I would like to hear from our staff.
[4:02:53] Thank you.
[4:02:56] » The
[4:02:57] » Why Yeah. Why did we accept that?
[4:03:00] » What is the rationale for the city for
[4:03:03] the public benefit?
[4:03:04] » Commissioner, I've I've
[4:03:06] » Mr. Mayor, I can I can help in
[4:03:07] » Mr. Manager, jump in, please.
[4:03:09] » I think Wayne might be able to help a
[4:03:10] little more. I believe in the original
[4:03:12] agreement it might have been five
[4:03:15] is what it was.
[4:03:16] » Three to five.
[4:03:17] » We now have more information on that
[4:03:19] based on the way the development has
[4:03:20] occurred and what our expectations could
[4:03:23] be in terms of shelters. And so I think
[4:03:25] it's a refinement of what we think could
[4:03:27] be added. That's why the number we're
[4:03:31] comfortable with the change in in the
[4:03:33] commitment. Wayne, do I have anything
[4:03:36] else to add to that? Wayneter.
[4:03:40] Bottom line, commissioner, is that if
[4:03:43] staff sees the need for five, we will
[4:03:45] get five because it's written in a way
[4:03:47] that it's going to be approved by the
[4:03:49] city um regardless of the number, but
[4:03:52] there may not be the need for five
[4:03:54] within that development.
[4:03:57] » Commissioner Porter,
[4:03:58] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[4:04:01] I think that, you know, we have now just
[4:04:03] gone through this process with St. Joe
[4:04:06] where there was there were questions and
[4:04:09] uncertainty there's so much uncertainty
[4:04:13] and this is an agreement like this as
[4:04:16] Miss Tilton
[4:04:18] explained is that it provides a benefit
[4:04:22] to the public through assurance mutually
[4:04:26] between the public the city and the
[4:04:29] developer. So, you know, these
[4:04:32] concurrency fees, these traffic impact
[4:04:34] fees are hundreds of thousands, if not
[4:04:37] millions of dollars. I'm not comfortable
[4:04:40] leaving that up to chance. Um,
[4:04:45] especially, with all due respect, when
[4:04:47] we've had issues with this developer,
[4:04:50] with I mean, [snorts] the gas the gas
[4:04:52] station issue, you know, this is not it
[4:04:54] is not my job to trust a developer. It
[4:04:57] is my job to put faith in our staff
[4:05:03] to represent the public interest when
[4:05:04] we're having these negotiations and
[4:05:06] these conversations.
[4:05:08] And I don't know, it feels a little bit
[4:05:11] rushed given that there are some
[4:05:13] outstanding questions
[4:05:15] um that I would feel much more
[4:05:17] comfortable
[4:05:20] moving forward with if we if we had
[4:05:23] answers to. So I would like to make
[4:05:27] a substitute motion.
[4:05:29] » There's no motion on the table.
[4:05:30] » Okay, then I'll make a motion. Um
[4:05:34] I also notice is there a staff
[4:05:35] recommendation
[4:05:37] on this item?
[4:05:40] » Commissioner, our only recommendation is
[4:05:42] to was to hold this public hearing
[4:05:44] certainly with the intent of of
[4:05:46] receiving your feedback and direction uh
[4:05:48] in response to what what's been put
[4:05:50] before you. And so our only
[4:05:51] recommendation is to schedule a second
[4:05:52] public hearing. Our recommendation was
[4:05:54] for the next September 23rd.
[4:05:56] » Okay. One other question. What is the
[4:05:59] impact? What what utilities would have
[4:06:01] run in the roadway along Dempsey Mayo?
[4:06:03] And does that impact other city plans?
[4:06:07] » Mr. Mayor, I think I
[4:06:08] » Sure Mr. help with that. The the utility
[4:06:12] easement and location is for the
[4:06:14] electric utility and so this agreement
[4:06:17] would contemplate that the developer
[4:06:19] would provide that access and and that
[4:06:22] that necessary um the easements
[4:06:24] necessary for that. this does clarify
[4:06:26] that is helpful to us as a city in the
[4:06:29] utility system
[4:06:31] um in that in those um easements and and
[4:06:34] placement of those utilities would be
[4:06:36] necessary for the next phase of their
[4:06:38] development. So we're we feel good about
[4:06:41] that because it provides clarity um that
[4:06:44] we can have access we get the rightway
[4:06:47] necessary and we work with the developer
[4:06:48] in the correct way to expand those
[4:06:50] utilities.
[4:06:52] » Okay, thank you. And then one final
[4:06:54] question I promise. So on page 14 under
[4:06:57] utilities
[4:06:59] um the new language says the respective
[4:07:02] obligations of the parties rel relative
[4:07:04] to the provision of natural gas to the
[4:07:06] canopy project including construction of
[4:07:08] the gas line along Wani Boulevard have
[4:07:10] been completed. So, it's my
[4:07:12] understanding from reading this that
[4:07:15] the developer had agreed to pay the city
[4:07:18] $165,000
[4:07:20] to be applied by the city toward the
[4:07:22] cost of installing the gas line along
[4:07:24] Milani Boulevard. So,
[4:07:27] I want clarification on this. [snorts]
[4:07:30] The gas line has been completed.
[4:07:33] The city incurred that expense and the
[4:07:37] developer had agreed to pay the city
[4:07:40] $165,000 to be applied
[4:07:43] for the cost of installing the gas line
[4:07:46] that is stricken. Was that did the
[4:07:50] developer apply? Was that amount applied
[4:07:53] to the city?
[4:07:55] » Mr. Mayor, I can I can answer that.
[4:07:56] » Mr. Manor,
[4:07:57] » Commissioner Porter, so that question
[4:07:59] was posed to the gas utility. That
[4:08:01] provision was an original provision in
[4:08:03] there. The developer did participate as
[4:08:05] needed to add the gas line. The gas
[4:08:08] utility has confirmed that all the work
[4:08:10] is done. I do not believe the money was
[4:08:12] paid because it was not necessary. The
[4:08:14] question was posed to the gas utility.
[4:08:16] Is it necessary? And they said no. So
[4:08:18] the request to remove it is an intent to
[4:08:21] clean it up because that work has been
[4:08:24] satisfied.
[4:08:25] » Okay. And can you just help me
[4:08:27] understand what does it mean that it's
[4:08:28] not necessary?
[4:08:30] Well, I'd have to ask somebody in the
[4:08:32] gas utility that answered it. Right. So,
[4:08:34] but the construction is taking place.
[4:08:36] The rightway was provided. That work is
[4:08:38] done and the gas utility was satisfied
[4:08:41] with that effort. This is now years ago.
[4:08:44] » Okay.
[4:08:46] So, did it not cost us money
[4:08:50] to provide natural gas or the the
[4:08:53] infrastructure? I just want to make sure
[4:08:55] I understand.
[4:08:57] » Yeah, it of course it would have cost
[4:08:58] some money. uh to the gas utilities as
[4:09:02] you might imagine to expand our main and
[4:09:04] when we do these development agreements
[4:09:07] it's providing for access you know other
[4:09:09] means and so that was satisfied by the
[4:09:12] developer um satisfactorily to the gas
[4:09:16] utility I guess is the best way I can
[4:09:18] say it.
[4:09:20] » Okay. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Um
[4:09:25] I I think and I appreciate
[4:09:28] staff's um explanations. I think it
[4:09:34] in the future I would love us to have a
[4:09:36] more comprehensive staff report. You
[4:09:38] know these are amend these are
[4:09:40] agreements that as everyone understands
[4:09:42] now you know go back many years. They're
[4:09:45] complicated agreements. would be really
[4:09:46] helpful if in our agenda materials it
[4:09:49] could just be like side by side here's
[4:09:51] what it did here's what it does. Um I
[4:09:53] understand I can read through the
[4:09:55] agreement as I did and there's
[4:09:56] strikethroughs. Um but this is a lot of
[4:10:00] money. I mean the implications of this
[4:10:01] are pretty significant. I don't like
[4:10:04] making decisions like this without
[4:10:06] having all the the information and
[4:10:08] understanding the the financial impact
[4:10:13] which according to this agenda material
[4:10:15] item says there is none. But it seems to
[4:10:18] me that there is one because we don't
[4:10:20] know at the very least we know there's
[4:10:22] one thing we don't know which is
[4:10:24] hundreds of thousands of dollars
[4:10:25] potentially and that's the concurrency
[4:10:27] fees. So, I'm not comfortable moving
[4:10:30] forward and I would um I would move that
[4:10:34] we do not for option two that we do not
[4:10:36] hold the first public hearing um and
[4:10:38] that you know staff can come back to us
[4:10:40] with this with at the very least the
[4:10:43] concurrency
[4:10:45] um figure factored in. I I'm not
[4:10:47] comfortable saying that that's just
[4:10:49] something we're going to figure out
[4:10:51] later in a separate agreement. So, is
[4:10:53] that is my motion clear? Option number
[4:10:55] two has been probably made by
[4:10:57] Commissioner Porter. Is there a second?
[4:10:59] » Second.
[4:10:59] » Second by Commissioner Matlo. You're
[4:11:01] recognized for comment.
[4:11:02] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um and Mr.
[4:11:04] Reick. The same question on the other
[4:11:06] item. The attachment says that this
[4:11:08] agreement was prepared by the developers
[4:11:11] attorneys. Um did your staff work on
[4:11:14] this agreement?
[4:11:15] » We did do a preliminary review of it. Um
[4:11:17] I think some of our feedback was
[4:11:19] pertaining to questions about
[4:11:21] concurrency impacts for this. Certainly
[4:11:24] um uh the city attorney as well was
[4:11:27] provided this agreement. Uh so I I I
[4:11:32] think our our next step in this and
[4:11:35] receiving it and and doing our review of
[4:11:37] it was also to place it in front of you
[4:11:39] and and look for direction on on
[4:11:41] something basically based on what was
[4:11:43] being considered proposed.
[4:11:45] » Okay.
[4:11:45] » And so did you make any edits or
[4:11:46] revisions to what was submitted by the
[4:11:48] developer?
[4:11:49] » We haven't directly made revisions on
[4:11:51] this. is something that was provided to
[4:11:53] us as it is.
[4:11:55] » Okay. Um,
[4:11:59] back to the the underlying question
[4:12:02] which I still wasn't clear. Does this
[4:12:04] eliminate the developer's obligation to
[4:12:06] build the Dempsey Mayo roadway?
[4:12:08] » Uh, I would state it as the developer is
[4:12:13] relinquishing their sole their sole
[4:12:15] entitlement to do it is probably a
[4:12:16] better way to phrase that. is they're
[4:12:18] currently entitled to do it like the
[4:12:20] city doesn't have the easement rights to
[4:12:21] go there and do if we wanted to
[4:12:22] ourselves. What they're proposing is to
[4:12:26] step back and say the city may can have
[4:12:28] easement rights to do so or separately
[4:12:31] um contract with the developer to do it
[4:12:32] or the developer as stated may decide to
[4:12:36] step up and do it their own on their
[4:12:37] own. So their their intent is to clarify
[4:12:42] their obligation on this and not
[4:12:44] necessarily relinquish an obligation.
[4:12:47] Okay. And so I mean I think that that
[4:12:48] makes it more unclear of what
[4:12:51] concurrency will look like, what traffic
[4:12:52] will look like, what utilities to these
[4:12:54] lots um will look like. I mean frankly
[4:12:57] on on first reading to me it looks like
[4:12:59] it's transferring financial
[4:13:01] responsibility away from the developer
[4:13:03] to the city uh government. That's an
[4:13:06] issue for me. It's an issue for me that
[4:13:08] we're operating in a way that developers
[4:13:09] attorneys draft these agreements and
[4:13:11] then we bring them to the city
[4:13:12] commission with no edits. It's makes me
[4:13:15] wonder who's actually looking after the
[4:13:17] city's best interest and I support the
[4:13:19] motion. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Thank you,
[4:13:20] » Commissioner Williams Cox.
[4:13:21] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I guess u Mr. Reic
[4:13:25] and Aaron, city manager, is this any
[4:13:29] different than any other process that
[4:13:31] we've done with with um items like this
[4:13:34] because it sounds like we've been doing
[4:13:37] this for years. Commissioner, if I if I
[4:13:39] can answer that,
[4:13:40] » Man. Andrew,
[4:13:40] » Just for a different voice, this is a
[4:13:43] really old development agreement that
[4:13:47] has been amended from time to time as
[4:13:49] the development has changed. Things are
[4:13:50] new, things have been satisfied, there's
[4:13:53] new information, and I think that's what
[4:13:55] you see. There's a kind of probably a
[4:13:58] natural cycle to that. Development
[4:14:00] agreements rarely are static. And that
[4:14:03] that's what you're seeing. In this case,
[4:14:05] there's clarification in terms of the
[4:14:06] roadway. I would tell you from my point
[4:14:09] of view.
[4:14:11] I'm not sure that road connection is
[4:14:13] ever made. You know, that probably is
[4:14:16] for some time in the future. There's
[4:14:17] been a lot of debate about it. There's a
[4:14:20] considerable amount of public opposition
[4:14:22] to that roadway, notably in the
[4:14:24] Westminster Oaks area. Um, they I think
[4:14:29] it's safe for me to say that they would
[4:14:31] wish that not to happen. So, I think
[4:14:34] this agreement provides that clarity of
[4:14:37] how that could work if the roadway was
[4:14:40] ever developed, which I would venture to
[4:14:42] guess is not likely. Um, but even with
[4:14:46] that, we need clarity on rightway and
[4:14:48] easements for utilities and other things
[4:14:50] because the development is expected to
[4:14:52] continue to go. So this this does
[4:14:55] provide clarity that's helpful to the
[4:14:56] city, that's helpful to the developer
[4:14:58] that is contemporary.
[4:14:59] » And I think that's how these agreements
[4:15:01] typically evolve.
[4:15:03] » I just don't want the public to think
[4:15:04] that the developer can come in and give
[4:15:06] us an agreement and we just go running
[4:15:08] with it without edits or anything like
[4:15:10] that. That's that happens later in the
[4:15:12] process in the in the um planning
[4:15:14] process. And for these like you said
[4:15:16] this this has been around since 1998,
[4:15:19] 2011 and here we are 2026. So, a lot of
[4:15:22] things have evolved and will continue to
[4:15:24] evolve. Um, I I just want to make sure
[4:15:26] that the public knows that we're not
[4:15:27] just taking what developers give us. Our
[4:15:30] staff, you know, very well capable of
[4:15:32] doing what needs to be done to make sure
[4:15:34] that we're following the laws and
[4:15:36] procedures that we follow with every
[4:15:38] development. We don't pick and choose
[4:15:40] who we who we pick on. We we we follow
[4:15:42] for everybody. And uh my my last my
[4:15:46] question is um is this not the public
[4:15:49] hearing? is I I thought this was the
[4:15:52] public hearing
[4:15:53] » And and then there needs there will be a
[4:15:55] second public hearing. So how
[4:15:57] » First
[4:15:58] » So how then could we um do do not hold
[4:16:02] first public hearing and
[4:16:05] » Start over
[4:16:07] » Provide direction to staff.
[4:16:09] » Well the motion on the table is
[4:16:10] basically to suspend action and not move
[4:16:12] forward with the second public.
[4:16:14] » Okay.
[4:16:14] » So that that's that's what's before us
[4:16:16] today. Commissioner Porter has I'm I'm
[4:16:19] summarizing Commissioner Porter that her
[4:16:21] motion is let's put a pause. We don't
[4:16:23] need to move forward with the second
[4:16:25] » The second public hearing.
[4:16:26] » Well well thank you for that
[4:16:28] clarification because I I cannot support
[4:16:31] that because 1998 2011 2026
[4:16:35] when does when does when does this when
[4:16:38] do we when do we when do we get going? I
[4:16:40] think we should proceed with the uh with
[4:16:43] it and get questions answered between
[4:16:44] now and uh September 23rd that from the
[4:16:48] developer, the uh growth management,
[4:16:50] attorney, manager, whomever, we have
[4:16:52] time to get that information before that
[4:16:55] second and final public hearing. So, uh,
[4:16:58] I think we need to we should move
[4:16:59] forward so that we have an opportunity
[4:17:01] to get those very good questions that
[4:17:03] were asked answered so that we are we're
[4:17:06] set then for the second public hearing
[4:17:08] and then we go from there.
[4:17:10] » Commissioner N Williams Cox is making a
[4:17:12] substitute motion for option number one.
[4:17:14] Well, seconded by the mayor pro Tim.
[4:17:17] » Um, on the substitute motion, this is
[4:17:20] the first of two. This development
[4:17:22] agreement has been going on for nearly
[4:17:24] 30 years now. We're over 30 years now.
[4:17:26] We do have some questions that I respect
[4:17:28] from our colleagues. We do need to work
[4:17:30] in the next two weeks to make sure to
[4:17:32] get it, but I'm not ready to pause quite
[4:17:34] yet while we're still in the discussion
[4:17:35] before moving forward to the second
[4:17:37] public. Commissioner Porter.
[4:17:38] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So, yes, I had
[4:17:42] questions, but it's my understanding
[4:17:44] that when this comes back to us, I mean,
[4:17:46] we're approving it. like we're not going
[4:17:50] to the the development agreement coming
[4:17:53] back to us for a second hearing is not
[4:17:54] going to address the concerns that I
[4:17:57] raised.
[4:17:58] » Well, we have a very robust discussion
[4:18:00] and you will have time between now and
[4:18:02] then to work with staff to get all of
[4:18:04] the questions answered that you have.
[4:18:06] » Right. But I just want to clarify that
[4:18:08] the language we approve today is the
[4:18:10] language that will be before us at the
[4:18:13] second public hearing and will not be
[4:18:15] able to be amended then because it would
[4:18:17] be considered I think a substantial
[4:18:19] amendment.
[4:18:20] » Is that accurate?
[4:18:21] » Yes. Madam City and if the uh if the
[4:18:25] answers are not satisfactory to this
[4:18:27] board and still egregious then they will
[4:18:29] be voted down at the time. These are
[4:18:31] serious issues that are being raised and
[4:18:33] discussed and this is a very big
[4:18:35] development agreement that dates over 30
[4:18:37] years. There is always the opportunity
[4:18:39] for it to be defeated at the next public
[4:18:40] hearing. Correct.
[4:18:42] » All those in favor of the substitute
[4:18:44] motion on the table made by Commissioner
[4:18:46] Williams Cox second by the mayor pro Tim
[4:18:47] signify by saying I.
[4:18:49] » I.
[4:18:49] » All those opposed.
[4:18:51] » Passes three to two with Commissioner
[4:18:52] Matlo and Commissioner Porter in
[4:18:54] opposition. Do we have anything else
[4:18:56] come before us at this public hearing?
[4:18:58] » No, Mr. Mayor.
[4:18:59] » Okay. We are on item number uh 12.03
[4:19:03] under policy formation and direction.
[4:19:05] Mr. Manager.
[4:19:07] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Let me introduce
[4:19:09] it. Christique, would you mind coming
[4:19:13] forward if I could ask you to
[4:19:14] participate?
[4:19:16] Commissioners, you'll recall at your
[4:19:18] last meeting, Commissioner Richardson
[4:19:20] actually asked for this item to come
[4:19:22] back. It involves the um Appalache Ridge
[4:19:26] Technology Center that's located at 937
[4:19:29] Kindle Drive. There's been [snorts] a
[4:19:31] request from and Christique, you correct
[4:19:34] me if I say this wrong. The Greater
[4:19:35] Appalache Ridge Estates Neighborhood
[4:19:37] Association.
[4:19:39] And Miss Henry, are you representing
[4:19:40] that group?
[4:19:41] » Yes, sir, I am.
[4:19:42] » And and Miss Henry has made the request.
[4:19:44] Uh we've got a full agenda item that
[4:19:46] talks about the facility, the nature of
[4:19:48] the ownership, the maintenance, the
[4:19:50] participation. as a technology center
[4:19:52] for youth uh in the history of it. Um
[4:19:56] » Mr. Mayor Tim, if I if I may, I think
[4:19:59] it's best to ask Miss Henry just to give
[4:20:01] us a quick summary of the request if you
[4:20:03] don't mind.
[4:20:04] » Okay.
[4:20:04] » And then Wayne Tedar is uh the staff
[4:20:07] member on this item.
[4:20:08] » Did you have a question?
[4:20:09] » My question is will there be a staff
[4:20:11] presentation?
[4:20:13] » Uh Mr. Tedar can summarize any matters
[4:20:16] you you would like um and we'll fill in
[4:20:20] any gaps that that may exist.
[4:20:24] » Miss Henry.
[4:20:26] » Okay.
[4:20:26] » Hey y'all. How y'all doing? [laughter]
[4:20:28] » Um [clears throat] first of all, thank
[4:20:30] you so much commission for taking this
[4:20:32] up as an item for consideration today.
[4:20:34] Um let me just give you a little bit of
[4:20:35] backdrop. Uh this item is the
[4:20:38] culmination of over 20 years of resident
[4:20:41] advocacy, resident engagement, and
[4:20:43] resident leadership within the Appalache
[4:20:45] Ridge and Greater Appalache Ridge, which
[4:20:47] is what we call the 10.02 census tract
[4:20:50] of Lyon County. Um the original
[4:20:53] neighborhood improvement planning
[4:20:54] process, which was adopted by the city,
[4:20:57] did a whole lot of things that created a
[4:21:00] lot of winds for the community. It
[4:21:01] addressed storm water management,
[4:21:03] traffic, and safety. It addressed issues
[4:21:06] related to flooding. Um, it addressed a
[4:21:08] whole lot of things and a whole lot of
[4:21:10] winds that we have seen metriculate into
[4:21:13] factors of value, increase in home
[4:21:15] ownership, increase in economic
[4:21:17] trajectory within that census track.
[4:21:20] Part of that conversation was this
[4:21:22] Appalache Ridge technology and learning
[4:21:25] center. When it was created, it was
[4:21:28] purchased with municipal funds, but it
[4:21:30] was funded through a partnership that
[4:21:33] was facilitated through an organization
[4:21:34] called the Community Renaissance
[4:21:36] Neighborhood Partnership. That community
[4:21:38] renaissance neighborhood partnership had
[4:21:40] over $60,000 of commitments from
[4:21:43] municipal partners, Leyon County, city
[4:21:45] Tallahassee, the state of Florida,
[4:21:47] Florida State University, as well as in
[4:21:49] kind personnel that came to the table
[4:21:51] and said we will fund the programmatic
[4:21:53] mission of this center as it relates and
[4:21:55] as it as it resonates in the voice of
[4:21:57] the residents who wanted it as a
[4:21:59] facility at that time when we used
[4:22:01] floppy discs and phone cords to get on
[4:22:04] the internet. Um so that just lets you
[4:22:06] know the context and the age of this ex
[4:22:09] of this work. Um when the economic
[4:22:12] recession hit the community programs
[4:22:14] were in full swing at the time of um
[4:22:16] launch in 2007 um reached youth within
[4:22:20] our community. We have generations of
[4:22:21] youth that are now employed by city and
[4:22:23] state and local government and
[4:22:24] businesses that went through the
[4:22:25] Appalachin Ridge Technology and Learning
[4:22:27] Center. There were much dollars, much
[4:22:30] grant writing that happened that
[4:22:31] benefited the work. But once the
[4:22:33] economic recession hit the hit the
[4:22:36] center, then we were at a place where we
[4:22:38] could where that CNRP model fell into uh
[4:22:43] decline. And so as a neighborhood
[4:22:45] association, we were faced with one
[4:22:47] option, not two, because we weren't
[4:22:49] going to close it down. That was the
[4:22:51] vision. That was the value. That was the
[4:22:53] voice of the residents resonating
[4:22:54] through the work of that center that
[4:22:56] would impact the generations to come. So
[4:22:59] under the management of uh Nita favors
[4:23:01] at the time she said Christique bring us
[4:23:03] a proposal from the neighborhood engage
[4:23:05] them and see what they want to do which
[4:23:07] is what we did. We came up with a
[4:23:09] resolution for the Gina Greater
[4:23:11] Appalache Ridge Neighborhood Association
[4:23:13] to become its own 501c3.
[4:23:16] In that process we worked very intently
[4:23:18] with the Tallahassee Lenders Consortium
[4:23:20] because we had grant dollars that we
[4:23:22] were attracting to the facility but
[4:23:24] because we weren't a 501c3 at the time
[4:23:26] we could not use them. So they engaged
[4:23:28] as our fiscal agent to fund programming
[4:23:31] to fund resource at that time. Through
[4:23:33] the city's leadership and partnership,
[4:23:35] we were able to arrive at a lease
[4:23:37] agreement during that time that that
[4:23:40] resonated and that spoke of what we
[4:23:42] wanted to do as a neighborhood
[4:23:43] association, how we would raise our
[4:23:45] capability and resources to be able to
[4:23:47] do it. And at the end of that lease,
[4:23:48] which started in 2016 and expired in
[4:23:50] 2019, we would be considered as the
[4:23:54] long-term owner or long-term site
[4:23:56] proprietor for that facility. Um, now
[4:24:00] let's take it from 2019 until now. So,
[4:24:03] we were at will as a tenant and were
[4:24:05] able to get liability insurance because
[4:24:07] you can't function as a center without
[4:24:09] those types of coverages. And so, we had
[4:24:12] those as line items. They were um sent
[4:24:14] forth to the city commission as a part
[4:24:16] of our budget. and how we spent quite
[4:24:18] frankly our facility dollars that we got
[4:24:20] through the city's continued $10,000
[4:24:22] commitment because remember when the
[4:24:24] recession hit all the other money left.
[4:24:26] The only money that remained was the 10
[4:24:28] that the city was given and they
[4:24:29] continued to give it. They also
[4:24:31] continued to work with us to address
[4:24:33] capital needs for the facility. They
[4:24:35] replaced the roof. They replaced the
[4:24:36] HVAC system. They worked with us to
[4:24:39] invest over $53,000 in site improvements
[4:24:43] that we curated grants in order to
[4:24:45] address not just the capital needs
[4:24:47] within the facility but also the
[4:24:49] technological need because we had
[4:24:51] computers with big screens and big
[4:24:53] banks. So we didn't want big back
[4:24:54] computers in our facility. So we were
[4:24:57] able to curate through partnership the
[4:24:59] donation of 24 units in partnership with
[4:25:01] figures communication and they gave us
[4:25:04] web-based platform computers that are
[4:25:06] posted up even now and were serviced in
[4:25:09] partnership again with KERS which is the
[4:25:11] Tallahassee board of realtors their
[4:25:13] technology component they came and did a
[4:25:16] complete assessment rewiring of the
[4:25:19] complete facility they did it at 60% of
[4:25:22] what they would do at value and we had
[4:25:24] written for that 60% in grants. Now,
[4:25:27] keep in mind, we are still operating
[4:25:29] without sight control as it relates to a
[4:25:32] renewed lease. We are functioning with
[4:25:34] insurance. And guess what? They said,
[4:25:37] "Hey, we need to renew. Where's your
[4:25:40] lease?"
[4:25:42] And we didn't have one.
[4:25:45] » This was 2024. This is at the foothills
[4:25:48] of a huge, huge launch of a community
[4:25:50] technology forum in partnership with
[4:25:53] Comcast where they gave us over $75,000.
[4:25:56] The previous year they gave us $50,000
[4:25:58] to implement the um the affordable
[4:26:01] connectivity program through the federal
[4:26:03] government and gave us 50 computers to
[4:26:06] give to residents who were in need. We
[4:26:08] used those funds to be able to do
[4:26:10] community techups. We partner with local
[4:26:12] computer repair companies and we brought
[4:26:14] residents in to bring their computers,
[4:26:16] either get them fixed or assess them for
[4:26:18] replacement with our laptops.
[4:26:21] Lots of great stuff, but we're still at
[4:26:25] will. We would like the history of the
[4:26:28] advocacy of this organization, the
[4:26:30] history of the resident voice as it
[4:26:31] relates to this facility to be heard
[4:26:33] tonight. And we will ask this commission
[4:26:35] to consider transferring the site to the
[4:26:38] neighborhood association gina as a 501c3
[4:26:41] nonprofit organization with deed
[4:26:43] restrictions that would speak to the use
[4:26:45] of the facility in perpetuity for the
[4:26:48] purposes identified within that
[4:26:50] neighborhood improvement plan. Also, we
[4:26:52] would love for y'all to continue to give
[4:26:54] us that $10,000 in partnership. Um, but
[4:26:57] that's not the major thing. The major
[4:26:58] thing is obtaining the site control
[4:27:00] necessary to execute fully our
[4:27:02] programmatic delivery um in the work of
[4:27:05] that center. I think it's important to
[4:27:06] understand also we we don't serve rich
[4:27:09] people.
[4:27:11] We serve people who we our neighborhood
[4:27:13] has a 45% poverty rate. We don't serve
[4:27:16] rich people. Our residents have that per
[4:27:19] capita income of $35,000. We don't serve
[4:27:22] rich people. But guess what? between
[4:27:25] 2008 and now we started out in our NIP
[4:27:29] with a 40 with a 52% home ownership
[4:27:32] rate. It dipped down based on the
[4:27:34] recession to 43%. But through
[4:27:36] programmatic delivery and continued
[4:27:38] engagement that has actually gone up and
[4:27:41] back to 53%. So the work of the
[4:27:44] neighborhood association continues and
[4:27:47] we want to make sure that we get another
[4:27:49] win tonight by getting site control
[4:27:52] access site control of that property so
[4:27:54] that we can fully execute our
[4:27:55] programmatic delivery for our grant our
[4:27:58] partners and seek additional resources
[4:28:00] to continue the vision of the residents
[4:28:02] of the Appalache Ridge Estates
[4:28:04] neighborhood. Thank you.
[4:28:06] » Commissioners are go ahead mayor's back.
[4:28:08] Are there any questions for Miss Henry
[4:28:11] any speaker?
[4:28:13] Is there do we have any speakers on this
[4:28:15] issue?
[4:28:16] » Mr. Mayor, Pro Tim, Mr. Mayor, if if I
[4:28:18] could. Okay. Just to make sure there's
[4:28:20] continuity. And by the way, Miss Henry,
[4:28:22] thank you. That was very clear. I think
[4:28:24] it was a good presentation.
[4:28:26] » If Mr. Tedar could explain the ownership
[4:28:28] that we have today, okay,
[4:28:30] » And how possibly a transfer via our real
[4:28:32] estate policy would work. I think that
[4:28:34] might be helpful to the commission.
[4:28:36] » Okay.
[4:28:37] » Good afternoon, commissioners. Um,
[4:28:41] in terms of if you direct staff to
[4:28:44] transfer this over to uh the the arena,
[4:28:50] um, it it would be just a simple
[4:28:51] direction uh for staff to work with a an
[4:28:55] agreement to do that transfer. I think
[4:28:57] during some of the briefings you had a
[4:28:59] question, have we done this uh somewhere
[4:29:01] before?
[4:29:01] » Uh, one of the places that we have done
[4:29:03] it is the NAACP building.
[4:29:05] » That's right. Uh I think in 2001 we
[4:29:07] purchased a piece of property for about
[4:29:09] $60,000.
[4:29:10] Uh 2004
[4:29:13] we approved a lease uh with the NAACP uh
[4:29:17] for an extended period of time. And then
[4:29:19] in 2020 uh you all directed staff to uh
[4:29:23] transfer the property uh to the NAACP
[4:29:26] uh with certain restrictions and those
[4:29:28] restrictions expire in 2031. Uh, another
[4:29:33] common question I think maybe occurred
[4:29:35] during some of the briefings was, have
[4:29:36] we done an appraisal of the site? We
[4:29:38] have not. Uh, looking at Zyo, uh,
[4:29:41] Zillow, uh, we know that there are some
[4:29:43] homes for sale in the area between
[4:29:46] 150,000 and $230,000.
[4:29:49] I would say this property would be on
[4:29:50] the very low end of that because it's
[4:29:52] not a single family home. So, in other
[4:29:54] words, to put it back into a single
[4:29:56] family home condition, you will need to
[4:29:58] spend a number of dollars to be able to
[4:30:01] do that. Uh, and then I think lastly, a
[4:30:03] question about uh the agreement and why
[4:30:06] we were doing monthtomonth and it really
[4:30:08] allowed the the services to continue out
[4:30:10] there until a situation like this
[4:30:13] occurs. Uh, now we're getting approach
[4:30:15] to say, hey, in order for us to do our
[4:30:17] job and be able to take in money and to
[4:30:19] do a better job out at that facility, we
[4:30:21] need to have long-term ownership. So, if
[4:30:23] it's a long-term lease, you direct me to
[4:30:26] do that and I will have staff write out
[4:30:28] a long-term lease. If it's to transfer
[4:30:30] the property, we can do that as well.
[4:30:32] It' be a simple work through the terms
[4:30:34] of the contract. And I would say like
[4:30:35] the NAACP, there's reverted clause. So,
[4:30:38] I would expect that if we transferred it
[4:30:40] to it, there would be a reverted clause
[4:30:42] to come back to the city if it ever
[4:30:43] exist ceased to exist or the association
[4:30:46] ceased to exist uh to operate this
[4:30:49] facility.
[4:30:55] All right.
[4:30:57] Any other public comment?
[4:30:58] » Yes, sir. We do have speakers on the
[4:31:00] item. Uh about a half dozen, maybe
[4:31:03] eight. Uh the first speaker would be
[4:31:05] Leroy Peek
[4:31:07] and then the second speaker will be
[4:31:08] Gregory James.
[4:31:10] » Your name and address for the record,
[4:31:11] please.
[4:31:12] » Leroy Peek. Public records exempt.
[4:31:16] I will certify this commission that I
[4:31:18] live within the corporate limits of the
[4:31:19] city of Tallahassee and have lived in
[4:31:20] this community since the fall of 1976.
[4:31:25] » Good evening.
[4:31:26] » Good evening.
[4:31:26] » I stand before you this evening as the
[4:31:28] president of the council of neighborhood
[4:31:29] associations of Tallahass Leon County.
[4:31:32] Um and I stand here in full support of
[4:31:35] the request coming from the greater
[4:31:37] Appalach Neighborhood Association.
[4:31:40] Um I'll summarize some of my comments.
[4:31:44] Kona exists
[4:31:46] because this community believes that
[4:31:48] residents organized,
[4:31:51] engaged, and empowered are the best
[4:31:53] stewards of their neighborhoods.
[4:31:56] This is the philosophy behind every
[4:31:58] neighborhood association that this city
[4:32:01] has recognized, partnered with, or
[4:32:03] funded.
[4:32:06] The Greater Appalachia Ridge
[4:32:08] Neighborhood, the state's neighborhood
[4:32:09] association, is put in a lot of work, a
[4:32:12] lot of resources.
[4:32:14] They've marshaled over $100,000 in
[4:32:16] volunteer labor.
[4:32:19] They've
[4:32:21] come up with in excess of $186,000 in
[4:32:24] grants and other funding for the past
[4:32:27] couple of years. They've advocated for
[4:32:29] the for the legislature for additional
[4:32:32] funding and support. This is the kind of
[4:32:35] thing we encourage all of our
[4:32:36] neighborhoods to do. Put in the work.
[4:32:39] seek resources outside of the city,
[4:32:42] outside of government.
[4:32:45] They put in the work.
[4:32:48] You You've heard the vision. It didn't
[4:32:51] come from outside of the neighborhood.
[4:32:53] It came from the neighborhood.
[4:32:55] And they're asking you
[4:32:58] to allow them to continue to do that
[4:33:00] work.
[4:33:02] And I, as the president of the Council
[4:33:04] of Neighborhood Associations, I stand
[4:33:05] here in full support of that. Thank you.
[4:33:08] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[4:33:10] » Next speaker is Gregory James, followed
[4:33:12] by Dodd Enman Johnson.
[4:33:16] Mr. James, then Dodd Enman Johnson.
[4:33:25] Name and address for the record, please.
[4:33:32] » Dinman Johnson, 2121 Trescot Drive.
[4:33:38] Uh I am opposed to
[4:33:42] a lease
[4:33:44] for this property
[4:33:47] because this center
[4:33:50] technology and learning center predates
[4:33:54] almost everybody up there on the dis.
[4:33:58] uh it's been there serving that
[4:34:03] community
[4:34:04] for
[4:34:07] couple of decades
[4:34:10] and uh I don't think you can compare it
[4:34:15] to the NAACP
[4:34:19] because it operates more like a
[4:34:22] community service center for the people
[4:34:26] there.
[4:34:29] A few years ago,
[4:34:32] the two the 32304
[4:34:36] census track
[4:34:39] was determined to be the lowest income
[4:34:43] census track in the state.
[4:34:47] The 32301
[4:34:50] was determined to be second in line.
[4:34:55] The residents of this area deserve
[4:35:00] to have that property and that center
[4:35:05] transferred.
[4:35:07] I would recommend
[4:35:09] or at least introduce
[4:35:12] two options.
[4:35:14] One to transfer it the ownership as the
[4:35:20] neighborhood is requesting.
[4:35:22] The second is to treat it like a
[4:35:25] neighborhood service center
[4:35:28] and the city provide the services for
[4:35:33] that center because there is no
[4:35:38] hope that forever they will be able to
[4:35:43] patch together the grants to keep this
[4:35:47] going.
[4:35:49] And Christic is a very passionate
[4:35:53] supporter.
[4:35:55] But if Christic
[4:35:58] ever decided
[4:36:00] she was not going to do that, who would
[4:36:04] be as passionate to step up and take on
[4:36:08] all of that responsibility
[4:36:11] for that center?
[4:36:12] » You're at 30 seconds. My recommendation
[4:36:15] is either the transfer I support what
[4:36:19] the neighborhood is asking for,
[4:36:22] but I think the city should take on more
[4:36:26] responsibility for the insurance and the
[4:36:30] support of that center. Thank you.
[4:36:33] » Our next speaker, please
[4:36:35] » Joyce Morgan, followed by Elton Thomas.
[4:36:39] » Your name and address for the record.
[4:36:41] Joyce Morgan, 926 Millard Street. As a I
[4:36:47] speak to you as an association member
[4:36:49] since the 1990s, the mid1 1990s, we
[4:36:53] appreciate the city's actions and the
[4:36:55] development and the fulfillment of the
[4:36:57] plans of the southside and also the
[4:37:00] Appalache Ridge estate plans. We
[4:37:03] understand that our current position is
[4:37:04] due in part to a lack of continuity and
[4:37:07] knowledge as to how the center operates
[4:37:11] and continues to operate in what we
[4:37:13] need.
[4:37:15] We have residents that we service from
[4:37:17] Appalache Ridge Estates, Lyn Haven, Fair
[4:37:21] View, Meridian Park, and Council Estates
[4:37:24] who are asking us what are we doing? But
[4:37:28] because we don't have site control and
[4:37:31] because we can't get the insurance, it
[4:37:34] would be irresponsible to open the
[4:37:36] center and have people come in and out.
[4:37:38] So, we're asking
[4:37:41] to please
[4:37:42] um at this point to grant our request
[4:37:47] for a transfer so that we can use the
[4:37:50] facility as it has been intended and as
[4:37:53] it has been used in the past. Thank you.
[4:37:55] Our next speaker, please.
[4:37:58] » Elton Thomas and then James Morgan.
[4:38:02] » Name and address for the record, please.
[4:38:04] » Elton E. Thomas.
[4:38:07] Address 806
[4:38:10] Apache Street. I'm coming to speak to
[4:38:13] you as a resident of Appalache Ridge.
[4:38:16] I've been in Appalache Ridge for about
[4:38:19] 40 something years now. I saw this
[4:38:22] project when it I was there when the
[4:38:24] project was started.
[4:38:26] The amount of um enthusiasm, the it it
[4:38:30] was like a boom when we first got the
[4:38:33] learning center put in the neighborhood.
[4:38:36] We had the children coming there after
[4:38:38] school every day. We had volunteers from
[4:38:40] the uh major universities there every
[4:38:43] day. Eventually, we got had adults
[4:38:45] coming because we were running programs
[4:38:47] not just for the children in technology.
[4:38:50] We were running programs to help adults
[4:38:54] manage or gain better skills for
[4:38:56] employment. A few years ago, it seemed
[4:38:59] like the second coming of the credit of
[4:39:02] the uh building after we had lost the um
[4:39:05] well, the the economy kind of put
[4:39:08] everything on a downside. Um 2024 looked
[4:39:12] like happy days were here again. Um but
[4:39:15] without control of the building those
[4:39:18] things
[4:39:20] have struggled or the things we're
[4:39:21] trying to do we're struggling to do that
[4:39:23] we spent a lot of money and to upgrade
[4:39:26] the building. We would ask you
[4:39:30] to give us the site control so that we
[4:39:32] can have the programs that we want. We
[4:39:34] can have the investment from third
[4:39:35] parties that were willing to assist us.
[4:39:39] So that's why I'm here just to ask you
[4:39:41] to give us control of the building. We
[4:39:43] would appreciate that. Thank you.
[4:39:46] » Our next speaker, please.
[4:39:48] » Next is James Morgan.
[4:39:50] Our last speaker,
[4:39:54] » James Morgan, 926 Philip Street. And I
[4:39:58] would like to yield my time, Mr. Kenry.
[4:40:03] [laughter]
[4:40:04] » Sir, we don't we don't excuse me. We
[4:40:06] don't yield the time. It's your time.
[4:40:09] We've had an opportunity to heard from
[4:40:10] Christique. So, go ahead and say your
[4:40:12] piece.
[4:40:16] » [laughter]
[4:40:18] » Okay. Well, I try to yield my time to
[4:40:20] Chris because she has the most
[4:40:22] information and has put in some
[4:40:24] incredible work and we would generally
[4:40:27] ask you to consider transferring
[4:40:31] the house to arena. Thank you.
[4:40:34] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please.
[4:40:36] » No further speakers on this item.
[4:40:37] » Colleagues, uh, Mayor Pim.
[4:40:40] » Thank you. Uh, Mr. Mayor, I I first of
[4:40:42] all want to thank uh Christique for the
[4:40:45] leadership that she's provided in
[4:40:46] getting us to this point, but all of the
[4:40:50] neighbors and volunteers who have worked
[4:40:53] tirelessly
[4:40:54] » To provide programs and services at that
[4:40:57] technology center. I've watched it uh
[4:41:00] [snorts] succeed and grow over the years
[4:41:03] and uh I I I know that the neighborhood
[4:41:07] association and the volunteers would do
[4:41:10] a tremendous job uh in providing
[4:41:13] services those continued services for
[4:41:16] the children and families uh in the
[4:41:19] Appalachia Ridge neighborhood but in the
[4:41:22] broader air service area that would be
[4:41:27] provided uh uh through that technology
[4:41:30] center. And so, Mr. Mayor, I would uh
[4:41:33] recommend that we work out an agreement
[4:41:36] with the Greater Appalache Ridge
[4:41:38] Neighborhood Association to transfer
[4:41:41] site control of that facility to that
[4:41:44] organization.
[4:41:45] » Second.
[4:41:45] » Second. Uh motion's been made for
[4:41:50] our team to work uh on the transfer
[4:41:53] agreement for site control. Uh seconded
[4:41:57] by Commissioner Williams Cox,
[4:41:58] Commissioner Williams Cox for
[4:42:00] discussion.
[4:42:01] » Thank you. And I I want to echo what
[4:42:03] Commissioner Richardson has said because
[4:42:04] I've watched it. I've visited a time or
[4:42:07] two and um I think it's it's been sorely
[4:42:10] missed
[4:42:10] » In in the in the neighborhood. And I
[4:42:13] think it is high time for you all to be
[4:42:15] able to do what you need to do uh to um
[4:42:18] continue to grow the the the children
[4:42:21] and the adults who uh who come there,
[4:42:24] you know, for educational purposes, job
[4:42:26] training, all of those kinds of things
[4:42:27] because we know that AI is here. Um
[4:42:30] there are opportunities for you to be
[4:42:31] able to do those kinds of things to help
[4:42:33] those students. Um um some of you know
[4:42:36] that my my husband is in the hospital at
[4:42:38] Shans and I'm heading there tonight
[4:42:39] after work after after this. But last
[4:42:43] night his nurse was telling us about her
[4:42:46] son who um is working at Google and he
[4:42:50] makes $30,000 a month.
[4:42:54] » $30,000 a month. Can you imagine how
[4:42:58] life-changing that would be for uh our
[4:43:01] children or our adults who who could get
[4:43:03] that kind of uh education and training?
[4:43:05] So, I see that I see that greatness can
[4:43:07] can happen right here in this facility.
[4:43:10] So, I wholeheartedly support the the
[4:43:12] transfer so that you all can control
[4:43:14] that destiny. But I also agree with um
[4:43:17] um
[4:43:20] Dian Johnson that Christique and and and
[4:43:23] Elton and all of you that you you have a
[4:43:26] you're just a bundle of energy and and
[4:43:28] passion. And I know you got a bench of
[4:43:31] folks coming behind you,
[4:43:33] » But we want to make sure that it
[4:43:34] continues to be that way. So I would I
[4:43:36] would ask for a a a freely amendment
[4:43:40] that we do provide some type of revert
[4:43:43] clause so that if something should
[4:43:45] happen you know 100 years from now
[4:43:47] whatever Christique you know is gone and
[4:43:50] she she's 100 but she's doing something
[4:43:52] else that [laughter] and and others that
[4:43:56] it it it still remain it still can come
[4:43:58] back to um to the city as as as a
[4:44:01] property. But I I wholeheartly support
[4:44:03] this transfer. I've I've seen it at
[4:44:05] work. I've seen the people doing the
[4:44:06] work. They're in very integral per uh
[4:44:09] individuals and go-getters. I also ask
[4:44:12] that u our grant staff also work with
[4:44:15] them to help them identify and be able
[4:44:17] to apply for grants to allow them to be
[4:44:20] able to fund some of the innovative
[4:44:23] things that I know will come out of this
[4:44:24] out of out of this this project.
[4:44:27] » Mayor Mayor Pro Tim,
[4:44:29] » Thank you. I I it was it was my intent
[4:44:31] that that reverter clause be in the
[4:44:34] contract, but if we need to do that as a
[4:44:37] an amendment to my motion, I would
[4:44:40] certainly accept that as a friendly
[4:44:42] amendment.
[4:44:43] » Great. As amended.
[4:44:44] » Okay. Yes,
[4:44:45] » I support it as well. It was a great
[4:44:46] idea.
[4:44:47] » Yeah.
[4:44:47] » For the comment, Commissioner Matlo.
[4:44:49] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh thank you
[4:44:50] for all the speakers today. You know, as
[4:44:52] we know, neighborhoods are only as
[4:44:54] strong as the people who care about them
[4:44:55] and are willing to show up for them. and
[4:44:57] I think it's been a great um uh facility
[4:45:00] over the years. I I recognize the need
[4:45:02] for a 2.0 uh so to speak. Um and happy
[4:45:05] to support the motion. Could have also
[4:45:07] gone the other way. There is there's a
[4:45:09] liability transfer. The city currently
[4:45:11] takes care of the roof and the HVAC and
[4:45:12] the plumbing and all those things that
[4:45:14] would get transferred to uh private
[4:45:16] ownership. What's important to me is we
[4:45:18] continue to keep the the public purpose,
[4:45:20] the public facility, which I believe is
[4:45:21] what the reverter clause uh speaks to.
[4:45:24] Uh so so keep up the great work. look
[4:45:26] forward to what it becomes and let us
[4:45:28] know if we can be helpful in the
[4:45:29] process. Thank you.
[4:45:30] » They might need a few pieces. You think
[4:45:32] » We can't talk about that here,
[4:45:34] [laughter]
[4:45:36] » Mr. Porter.
[4:45:38] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And I want to
[4:45:39] thank
[4:45:41] y'all for what you've been doing. Um,
[4:45:46] it sounds like amazing work. I haven't
[4:45:48] had the chance to to tour the facility
[4:45:51] um or meet with you, but it's really I I
[4:45:54] read through the proposal and it's
[4:45:56] really incredible work. Um I'm ready to
[4:46:00] I'll support the motion to see what
[4:46:02] comes back to us. I I I do have to say
[4:46:05] though that it I would like when these
[4:46:08] when we have these conversations
[4:46:10] I don't think the default should be to
[4:46:12] transfer or sell public assets if site
[4:46:16] control and a long-term lease would
[4:46:18] satisfy
[4:46:20] the
[4:46:22] concerns that is my preference to be the
[4:46:26] starting point. So, I'll support the
[4:46:28] motion, but in general,
[4:46:31] we've gone through this before with
[4:46:34] public assets and and I do believe that
[4:46:36] this is unique and different, which is
[4:46:37] why I'll support the motion to see what
[4:46:40] comes back to us. So, I want to
[4:46:41] understand what is coming back to us.
[4:46:43] Will there be when we transfer assets?
[4:46:47] I mean, I want to first of all know what
[4:46:49] we mean when we say transfer because we
[4:46:50] we use that term to mean a sale the last
[4:46:55] time we used that term. I think the um
[4:46:58] the position of the motion is we are
[4:47:00] going to transfer title. They're going
[4:47:01] to get the building and we're not
[4:47:02] selling it.
[4:47:03] » Yes.
[4:47:05] » That's the intent.
[4:47:06] » That's what's coming back.
[4:47:08] All those in favor of the motion on the
[4:47:10] table signify by saying I.
[4:47:12] » All those opposed.
[4:47:13] » Passes 50 unanimously. All right. We're
[4:47:17] on item number 12.01.
[4:47:20] » Mr. Manager.
[4:47:21] » Thank you, sir. Uh this topic came was
[4:47:25] discussed at your last meeting. You
[4:47:26] asked for additional information to come
[4:47:28] back uh regarding license plate reader
[4:47:33] uh technology. Uh Chief Revel and his
[4:47:36] staff including Assistant Chief
[4:47:38] Celeleski,
[4:47:39] Deputy Chief Mahoney and Director Low
[4:47:41] are here to answer any questions you
[4:47:44] have on that. You have a full
[4:47:46] comprehensive agenda item uh in your
[4:47:49] material tonight that covers a lot of
[4:47:51] ground. that covers ground beyond the
[4:47:52] license plate reader technology. And I I
[4:47:55] want to point out so you know whatever
[4:47:57] direction we take tonight that you
[4:48:00] provide tonight that we have two
[4:48:02] companies two brands of fixed uh license
[4:48:05] plate reader uh cameras. One being Flock
[4:48:08] which is very well known. The other one
[4:48:11] is a Motorola brand. They have they look
[4:48:14] different but they for all intents and
[4:48:16] purposes do the same thing. So, we're
[4:48:18] using two different brands of license
[4:48:20] plate reader technology. In your agenda
[4:48:22] material, though, it covers also public
[4:48:24] safety cameras. You'll recall lots of
[4:48:26] discussion about that. We utilize those
[4:48:29] in certain areas of our community. That
[4:48:31] information is available to our
[4:48:33] real-time crime center as well as the
[4:48:35] license plate reader data. We have
[4:48:38] traffic cameras at all of our
[4:48:39] intersections, 300 plus intersections in
[4:48:41] our community. that information is used
[4:48:44] by our traffic management system but
[4:48:46] also available to our real-time crime
[4:48:48] center. Uh as you also know there's been
[4:48:51] an effort to incorporate private cameras
[4:48:53] like ring cameras into that. that
[4:48:55] there's been over the last about six
[4:48:58] years there's been this confluence of
[4:49:01] video information that really has
[4:49:03] propped up our real-time crime center
[4:49:05] that we partner with the sheriff FSU
[4:49:08] FAMU FDLE uh to support the the use of
[4:49:12] that tech that emerging technology and
[4:49:14] crime fighting and discovery and
[4:49:15] locating of people.
[4:49:17] The experts that are here um they're
[4:49:20] here to answer questions. uh they all
[4:49:22] have a different role in this expertise
[4:49:24] about the data the data handling the
[4:49:26] access to the data the policies that we
[4:49:29] use I think in the agenda item you would
[4:49:32] have read u that TPD not unusual by the
[4:49:36] way is ahead of the game because you've
[4:49:39] heard a lot of discussion around the
[4:49:41] country and the state about the
[4:49:44] governance and the use of this
[4:49:46] information the access of the
[4:49:48] information and and TPD has a very
[4:49:50] robust policy I I think it's general
[4:49:52] orders 56 and how their um officers and
[4:49:55] others can access this how that can be
[4:49:57] used and so that's in your agenda
[4:49:59] material as well and then there's some
[4:50:02] anecdotal success stories that are in
[4:50:04] there u where crimes have been solved
[4:50:07] people have been located what we know is
[4:50:11] it's become the license plate reader
[4:50:13] technology and access has become
[4:50:15] fundamental in all of our violent crimes
[4:50:19] all of our homicide investigations s
[4:50:22] whether it ultimately is used or not, it
[4:50:25] is accessed immediately. It's become a
[4:50:28] tool, a standard tool, and it's helped
[4:50:29] us solve lots of crimes. You heard from
[4:50:32] the chief at the last meeting that uh we
[4:50:35] want to make sure that we're using
[4:50:36] things properly, that the the public
[4:50:39] trusts what we're doing, that we've got
[4:50:41] proper rules governing that, and that we
[4:50:44] manage oursel, that we audit and and um
[4:50:47] and govern oursel. And so that's
[4:50:49] happened at TBD. The the inquiries have
[4:50:52] to be noted, they're reviewed, they're
[4:50:54] validated to make sure that nobody's
[4:50:56] misusing this. We've heard stories from
[4:50:58] around the country where this kind of
[4:51:00] access has been misused. And I'm happy
[4:51:03] to say that's not the case here. Um, and
[4:51:06] that's in my estimation, kudos to TBD
[4:51:09] for having good rules and good training
[4:51:11] for the use of it. Uh but commission
[4:51:14] commissioners, we want to provide you
[4:51:15] this information as a followup to the
[4:51:17] discussion you had. We believe it's an
[4:51:19] important community discussion and
[4:51:22] there's been a lot of activity even
[4:51:23] since your last meeting.
[4:51:25] » Um the state of Florida has um issued an
[4:51:28] order to remove
[4:51:31] I believe it's might be limited to
[4:51:32] Flock. There's a little confusion. In
[4:51:34] other words, Flock's not the only brand
[4:51:35] of license plate reader cameras. Uh but
[4:51:39] they've issued an order to remove those.
[4:51:42] We do have some of our cameras in the
[4:51:44] state right away. I think it's in the
[4:51:46] order of six or so of the total 150ish
[4:51:51] that we have. And so that that activity
[4:51:53] is underway. Uh and then the sheriff uh
[4:51:56] Sheriff McNeel locally in Lyon County
[4:51:58] has ordered the suspension of the use of
[4:52:02] their cameras. I'm not sure what brands
[4:52:03] they have. And this the suspension uh
[4:52:07] essentially entails two things. uh
[4:52:09] removing the access and security of the
[4:52:12] users. So think about the ability to log
[4:52:14] into your computer. So that's easily
[4:52:16] suspended for all users and then
[4:52:19] stopping the video and recording of
[4:52:22] those cameras. And so that stops any
[4:52:24] data collection, that stops any access
[4:52:26] to the use of those license plate
[4:52:28] readers. and and clearly we work closely
[4:52:30] with the sheriff. We look work closely
[4:52:33] with FDLE and our university partners
[4:52:35] because of that confluence of
[4:52:37] information and and um uh data and
[4:52:40] intelligence in the real-time crime
[4:52:42] center. So we we wanted to provide you
[4:52:44] this information. Again, you have a full
[4:52:46] thorough report in your agenda. We want
[4:52:49] to be available for questions and then
[4:52:51] look forward to the direction of the
[4:52:53] city commission. Thank you, sir.
[4:52:55] » Thank you. Uh before I get to public
[4:52:57] comment, just point of clarification
[4:52:59] because if I was a betting man, I'd be
[4:53:00] willing to bet that we're going to
[4:53:01] suspend this tonight because of the
[4:53:03] action that's been taking place since
[4:53:05] the last meeting that we had with the
[4:53:06] governor suspending it and state uh
[4:53:09] roads and rideways. And then you got the
[4:53:10] sheriff's action as well and all of our
[4:53:12] community partners seem to not be
[4:53:14] adopting this. Are you looking for our
[4:53:16] direction to suspend this or why haven't
[4:53:19] we just taken the action to suspend it?
[4:53:21] » Mr. Mr. Mayor, let I think I can answer
[4:53:23] it, but I'm going to ask Director Lo to
[4:53:25] help me with this. U the value come
[4:53:29] forward, Jason, if you don't mind. The
[4:53:32] value and the use of the license plate
[4:53:35] reader technology, again, not limited to
[4:53:37] flock.
[4:53:38] » Sure.
[4:53:38] » It goes beyond flock.
[4:53:39] » Sure.
[4:53:40] » Has been the ability crossjurisdictional
[4:53:42] information access and location, which
[4:53:46] extends far beyond the state of Florida.
[4:53:48] Some of the information you saw in your
[4:53:50] agenda packet. And so, uh, while
[4:53:53] valuable, the more information, the
[4:53:54] connections you have, valuable, that in
[4:53:57] itself doesn't limit the value of the
[4:54:00] cameras, even if it was only within the
[4:54:03] city of Tallahassee. We do have the
[4:54:05] ability, it's configurable. We have the
[4:54:07] ability to say the information can only
[4:54:09] be had by the TPD officers, controlled
[4:54:13] by TPD officers, and not not used beyond
[4:54:16] our boundaries. That's still valuable.
[4:54:18] And so, um, we want to make sure that
[4:54:21] we're taking direction from the city
[4:54:23] commission.
[4:54:23] » Got it.
[4:54:24] » That's consistent with what the public
[4:54:26] would desire, but also sharing how we're
[4:54:29] using it, how it's being accessed, how
[4:54:31] it integrates beyond the city, the
[4:54:34] county, the state, and and elsewhere.
[4:54:36] So, I probably answered the question,
[4:54:38] but Director Low, is there anything else
[4:54:40] I should add to that?
[4:54:43] » You did a great job.
[4:54:43] » Oh, thank you. Uh hey, look, it's a
[4:54:46] completely different day since we met
[4:54:48] two weeks ago. There's been a lot of
[4:54:50] action with our community partners.
[4:54:52] First of all, I want to congratulate
[4:54:55] uh all of our agencies locally and
[4:54:57] especially TPD that we have not had one
[4:55:00] recorded case of abuse of what we're
[4:55:02] seeing going on across the country.
[4:55:04] » Nonetheless, this is a big issue out in
[4:55:07] society and we're all hearing about it
[4:55:09] right and left. And so again, if I was a
[4:55:11] betting man, we're we're going to do
[4:55:12] exactly what the sheriff did and we're
[4:55:13] going to suspend uh all action on on the
[4:55:16] flight cameras or those that we use that
[4:55:19] are similar to it. Um but I just want to
[4:55:22] make sure that we clearly identify first
[4:55:24] of all, you all did a great job with
[4:55:26] putting together the policies and
[4:55:27] procedures on how to operate. I'm very
[4:55:29] proud that we have an agency that did
[4:55:31] not have a single complaint of abuse.
[4:55:33] Period. Period. But at the same time, I
[4:55:37] think we need to suspend just because of
[4:55:39] the fact of our community partners and
[4:55:41] where we are in society until we get
[4:55:42] more answers and more comfortable moving
[4:55:44] forward. That's where I am before we
[4:55:45] move forward because I know we got a lot
[4:55:47] of people here that want to speak on
[4:55:49] this issue. And so, um, do we have any
[4:55:52] other questions before we get the public
[4:55:53] comment? Yeah. The the question that I
[4:55:56] have, Mayor, is it is this simply the
[4:56:01] suspension, which I would agree with,
[4:56:04] limited to the license plate readers, or
[4:56:08] would it apply to all of the cameras
[4:56:12] that we have available to us?
[4:56:14] » Specifically, what was the action that
[4:56:16] was taken by the sheriff's office?
[4:56:17] » Yes, sir. Thank you. That's that's a
[4:56:19] really good question, sir, and I
[4:56:21] appreciate that. I think if it's
[4:56:23] consistent with what the sheriff did,
[4:56:25] » Okay,
[4:56:25] » It would be the suspension of our fixed
[4:56:28] LPR cameras, which includes Flock and
[4:56:31] Motorola. Motorola has a different brand
[4:56:33] name, but it's the Motorola product,
[4:56:35] which is approximately
[4:56:37] 150 um LPR cameras.
[4:56:42] » And and Mr. Mayor, the reason I asked
[4:56:44] that question in particular, I I'm I'm
[4:56:46] I'm sure most of us are familiar with
[4:56:49] the fact that in the Bond community,
[4:56:52] » At one point we had an exorbitant uh
[4:56:54] crime rate in that neighborhood,
[4:56:58] » We we put cameras in the neighborhood
[4:57:01] and saw immediately a 30% reduction
[4:57:05] » In crime.
[4:57:07] In my own neighborhood, which is on the
[4:57:09] south side of town, uh we have had some
[4:57:12] issues with crime and my neighbors and I
[4:57:16] agreed to have
[4:57:18] the camera surveillance for our
[4:57:21] neighborhood. And so I just want to make
[4:57:23] sure that where we have
[4:57:28] I just want clarification as to whether
[4:57:31] or not we're we're going to suspend all
[4:57:33] of that surveillance
[4:57:35] uh or if it will be limited to the
[4:57:38] license plate reader.
[4:57:40] » Mr. Mr. Mayor, Mr. Mayor Pro Tim, it
[4:57:42] would be limited
[4:57:44] » If if you're acting consistent with the
[4:57:46] sheriff's actions.
[4:57:47] » Yes. and other similar actions. It would
[4:57:50] be limited to the license plate reader
[4:57:52] cameras.
[4:57:53] » The public safety cameras you
[4:57:55] referenced,
[4:57:56] » Yes,
[4:57:56] » They exist. They're in the they're
[4:57:58] available to the real time crime center.
[4:58:00] U that would we would presume those
[4:58:02] would continue to um operate.
[4:58:05] » Okay.
[4:58:05] » M Mr. Mayor,
[4:58:06] » Before we get Go ahead. Yes,
[4:58:08] Commissioner Williams Cox.
[4:58:09] » I I just I just wanted to um weigh in as
[4:58:12] well. Thanks for that again for that
[4:58:14] clarification. We're not talking about
[4:58:16] all cameras. and talking about flock and
[4:58:18] Motorola. Um there has been a flurry of
[4:58:21] activity. I have spoken to the chief.
[4:58:24] I've spoken to the sheriff. I've spoken
[4:58:26] to our local delegation of legislators.
[4:58:28] I've spoken to uh former um police
[4:58:31] officer. I've spoken to community
[4:58:32] members. I've even consulted chat GBT.
[4:58:36] And I'm telling you that um we're we're
[4:58:40] I think we're going to we're going to
[4:58:41] land in in the in the same place that we
[4:58:43] need to suspend um suspend these um the
[4:58:47] these these um this technology because
[4:58:50] we want to be able to uh provide public
[4:58:54] safety, but we also want to respect the
[4:58:57] civil liberties and and and privacy of
[4:58:59] individuals. But being a technologist,
[4:59:02] I'm looking over here at uh at my man
[4:59:04] Harold Lane and he's sitting there
[4:59:06] listening because I you got your got
[4:59:08] your finger on the switch. As soon as
[4:59:10] soon as a decision is made,
[4:59:13] it's it's shut off. So, thank you all
[4:59:15] for working together to to be ready to
[4:59:18] do what this commission um says to do.
[4:59:20] Thank you, Mr. Mayor, for
[4:59:22] » Sure. I want to get straight into public
[4:59:23] comment. We have 20 speakers. We have an
[4:59:25] hour of public comment on this item. So,
[4:59:27] let's jump right in. Uh Mr. Clerk.
[4:59:30] » Thank you, mayor. First speaker on the
[4:59:32] item, Tim Style Mueller,
[4:59:34] followed by David Derby.
[4:59:44] Thank you for hearing me.
[4:59:47] » Name and address for the record, please.
[4:59:49] » Tim Mueller, 911 Pow Trail. Uh, thank
[4:59:52] you for putting the item back on the
[4:59:53] agenda
[4:59:55] and thank you for considering
[4:59:56] suspension. I want to be very clear
[4:59:58] about the fact that suspension is not
[4:59:59] the same thing as removal. And frankly,
[5:00:01] if we're suspending use, if we're
[5:00:03] suspending use, they need to be covered
[5:00:06] as well because we don't own these. And
[5:00:08] as long as those lenses are exposed and
[5:00:10] those solar panels are working, those
[5:00:12] cameras are still sending information. I
[5:00:14] want to be clear about that.
[5:00:20] To my understanding,
[5:00:22] we are no closer to the revelation who
[5:00:25] exactly made the backroom deal that
[5:00:28] brought flop cameras to our community.
[5:00:33] As the adage goes, if you've done
[5:00:36] nothing wrong,
[5:00:38] you've got nothing to hide.
[5:00:40] So, here's my question.
[5:00:44] Why is this information not public
[5:00:46] record? to my understanding
[5:00:49] and if we're so much safer now,
[5:00:52] you should be standing behind your
[5:00:54] decision proudly.
[5:00:56] Uh and it's telling that to my
[5:00:59] understanding the people who made this
[5:01:00] decision are not.
[5:01:07] I'm finding it difficult to strike a
[5:01:09] measured and composed tone
[5:01:12] uh when you're out here installing what
[5:01:14] amounts to
[5:01:16] police surveillance state police state
[5:01:19] infrastructure.
[5:01:20] » I want to be very clear about the fact
[5:01:22] that I understand that these reduce
[5:01:23] crime that's a positive thing. Mhm.
[5:01:26] » What I'm asking you to consider is how
[5:01:28] this information and that that is being
[5:01:30] collected, this this infrastructure
[5:01:34] when normalized as background
[5:01:36] infrastructure
[5:01:38] essentially provides a potential
[5:01:40] authoritarian shift, authoritarian power
[5:01:44] grab with a turnkey tool to jail and
[5:01:52] neutralize, shall we say, opposition.
[5:01:56] This is not
[5:01:58] far-fetched at all. And I want to be
[5:02:01] clear about the fact that I find the
[5:02:03] fact I find it irresponsible that this
[5:02:06] decision was made behind the backs of
[5:02:08] the entire community. And some of the
[5:02:10] comments that I've heard made
[5:02:14] less so today, but two weeks ago gave me
[5:02:16] the impression that some of the people
[5:02:18] on this commission do not have a full
[5:02:21] understanding of the implication of what
[5:02:23] this technology represents. You're at 30
[5:02:25] seconds.
[5:02:27] » There's a petition and moratorum that uh
[5:02:29] the folks who I've been working with
[5:02:30] have been working on. It is a non vendor
[5:02:34] specific moratorum to be placed in
[5:02:36] perpetuity. Uh the language is currently
[5:02:38] being reviewed by a legislative policy
[5:02:40] expert.
[5:02:42] Please follow our lead on this and show
[5:02:45] respect for the privacy rights of our
[5:02:47] community. Yield my time.
[5:02:49] » Next speaker, please.
[5:02:50] » Next speaker is David Derby. David
[5:02:53] Derby. followed by Zachary Bell.
[5:02:57] » Name and address for the record, please.
[5:03:01] » David Derby, live on Mab Street and Mry
[5:03:04] Manor 32304.
[5:03:07] That's a famous zip code in Italian,
[5:03:10] isn't it?
[5:03:12] » Um, I'm very much against the cameras to
[5:03:14] be getgo. I understand, as one of my
[5:03:18] officers explained to me, it's a tool in
[5:03:19] their tool belt. Um, but the tool is too
[5:03:23] easily abused. It's too easily um
[5:03:26] metamorphed into other things. Not only
[5:03:29] do our police department have access,
[5:03:31] but I can guarantee you somebody can
[5:03:33] hack in there and record everything that
[5:03:35] they've got going on. Um, with AI,
[5:03:38] it's primed to hunt people, hunt your
[5:03:42] citizens. Um, there they have live
[5:03:45] streaming, not just picture taken, but
[5:03:47] live streaming. They identify vehicles,
[5:03:51] not just isoing plates. And then there's
[5:03:53] technology where they go into your
[5:03:55] vehicle and pick up all your electronics
[5:03:56] in your vehicle to ident and who's in
[5:03:58] there. I think this is a little bit of
[5:04:00] overreach.
[5:04:02] Um it's turning us into a surveillance
[5:04:04] state. Uh China started this stuff off.
[5:04:07] I don't know if y'all remember. I think
[5:04:08] it was the Hungar they started hunting
[5:04:11] and it made them really good at hunting
[5:04:14] the people and suppressing. Just like my
[5:04:16] colleague here just elaborated this can
[5:04:18] be used nefariously really really bad.
[5:04:23] Um insurance companies also use this to
[5:04:25] raise rate and deny coverages
[5:04:28] um along with your credit score. U
[5:04:31] vehicle uh profiles occupants what's the
[5:04:35] need for it? Um, it's a tool that's
[5:04:38] great to solve crime, but what are we
[5:04:40] doing all this information gathering on
[5:04:42] on honest citizens? I mean, I'm really
[5:04:45] really disappointed that we got this
[5:04:47] where I also like to know like he asked,
[5:04:49] how did we get here? How was was this
[5:04:53] grant and and our chief just decided to
[5:04:56] go put these cameras out or did he come
[5:04:58] and tell y'all we're going to do this?
[5:05:00] Um, and did you don't know to the extent
[5:05:02] of the surveillance when this came out?
[5:05:05] 150 cameras. That's an awful lot of
[5:05:07] surveillance. Why do I need to know? Why
[5:05:09] do TPD need to know where I'm going all
[5:05:11] around town and how I get home? It's
[5:05:13] none other business. You know, this
[5:05:16] supposed to be a free state, but it's a
[5:05:18] surveillance. It's turning into a
[5:05:19] surveillance state really quick. Uh how
[5:05:22] about false arrest? How do you make that
[5:05:24] up for somebody? How do you undo a
[5:05:26] cavity search?
[5:05:28] Could y'all anybody answer that one for
[5:05:30] me? I don't think you can. Um, I'm I'm
[5:05:32] glad to hear that there's been no abuse,
[5:05:34] but has there been any false arrest in
[5:05:37] Tallahassee?
[5:05:37] » You're at 30 seconds remaining.
[5:05:39] » I would like to see an accountability
[5:05:40] report every year on how this is going,
[5:05:44] how it's been impacted, what the good
[5:05:45] was, and if there's any bad, it needs to
[5:05:47] be highlighted.
[5:05:49] Um, you're losing the respect of your
[5:05:51] constituents. Um, we didn't have an
[5:05:54] opportunity to say we wanted this or
[5:05:56] not. So, I would appreciate y'all
[5:05:59] understanding that. Um the people have
[5:06:02] opinions and we elect you guys but
[5:06:04] somewhere in this it was lost.
[5:06:06] » Thank you very much.
[5:06:08] » Our next speaker please.
[5:06:09] » Next speaker Zachary Bell.
[5:06:14] » Don't see Zachary Bell. So Marsha Rule
[5:06:22] your name and address for the record
[5:06:23] please.
[5:06:23] » Marsha Rule Maple Drive here in
[5:06:25] Tallahassee. like to start out by saying
[5:06:28] you, you know, I'm here to speak against
[5:06:30] the cameras. Let's call them what they
[5:06:32] really are. They're not license plate
[5:06:34] readers. They capture everything that's
[5:06:37] in view. And that's just today's
[5:06:39] technology which can be updated without
[5:06:41] any of your knowledge. Um, one of the
[5:06:44] largest invasions of privacy of American
[5:06:46] citizens ever, and we didn't consent to
[5:06:49] it. There's been some discussion about
[5:06:52] abuses. I think it's abusive to have
[5:06:54] them out there in the first place. But
[5:06:57] even so, there are over, according to
[5:06:59] TPD's portal, over 1,300 organizations
[5:07:03] that can access Tallahassee information
[5:07:06] now. And of course, that can be abused,
[5:07:08] but that's not really the worst of it.
[5:07:11] Um, Flock can build any number Flock and
[5:07:13] other providers can build any number of
[5:07:16] data resale pro uh products. They can
[5:07:20] aggregate it with data from other
[5:07:22] brokers and they're selling our data.
[5:07:24] They're selling our lives. Uh foreign
[5:07:27] governments can track and buy, but you
[5:07:29] just get a subscription and purchase the
[5:07:31] data. And of course, the data can always
[5:07:35] be hacked and stolen and sold. And I'm
[5:07:38] sure some of you have gotten data breach
[5:07:40] notices maybe from um your bank or from
[5:07:45] TMH most recently. And those are only
[5:07:48] only the ones you know about. I
[5:07:50] guarantee you that there have been
[5:07:52] others and you can find out on the dark
[5:07:54] web.
[5:07:55] » But when you allow flock cameras and
[5:07:59] other camera readers into our community,
[5:08:02] you're allowing and encouraging the
[5:08:04] creation of data. Data that can be sold.
[5:08:08] Data that can be misused. Data that
[5:08:10] invades our privacy.
[5:08:13] » Thank you. Our next speaker,
[5:08:15] » Sean Thomas is the next speaker. Then
[5:08:16] Daryl Alfred.
[5:08:27] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:08:28] please.
[5:08:29] » Sean Thomas, 2113 Joiner Drive,
[5:08:32] Tallahassee, Florida. Good evening,
[5:08:34] mayor and commissioners. I urge you to
[5:08:36] end Tallahassee's block camera program
[5:08:38] and stop treating mass vehicle
[5:08:39] surveillance as a normal part of life in
[5:08:41] our city. CPD operates 155 automated
[5:08:46] license plate reader cameras, 80 flock
[5:08:48] cameras, and 75 vigilant cameras. That's
[5:08:51] what the 155 consists of. Someone
[5:08:54] getting paid $317,000
[5:08:56] should know this. Supporters call this a
[5:08:58] public safety tool, but public safety
[5:09:00] cannot cost at cannot come at the cost
[5:09:03] of turning every resident into a data
[5:09:05] point tracked when they go to work,
[5:09:07] attend church, visit a doctor, go to a
[5:09:10] protest, or see family and friends. The
[5:09:13] privacy risk are real. These systems can
[5:09:16] connect local vehicle data to a broader
[5:09:18] law enforcement network and move data is
[5:09:21] deeply personal and movement data is
[5:09:24] deeply personal. Sorry. Once a
[5:09:26] surveillance network exists, the
[5:09:28] question is not only how it is used
[5:09:30] today. The question is how it can be
[5:09:32] expanded, shared, or misused tomorrow.
[5:09:35] The state of Florida has already
[5:09:37] recognized that these cameras raised
[5:09:39] serious concerns. On August 31st, FDOT
[5:09:42] revoked permits for license plate
[5:09:44] readers and state highway rightways,
[5:09:46] ordered agencies to remove them within
[5:09:48] 30 days, and said it would stop stop
[5:09:51] approving new installation in those
[5:09:53] areas. Soon after, Sheriff Walt McNeel
[5:09:56] also followed suit. Tallahassee should
[5:09:58] not respond by looking for ways to
[5:10:00] preserve surveillance on every remaining
[5:10:02] city street. It should lead by
[5:10:04] protecting civil liberties. If police
[5:10:07] believe a vehicle is connected to a
[5:10:08] serious crime, they have investigative
[5:10:11] tools, witnesses, warrants, detectives,
[5:10:13] traditional camera footage, and target
[5:10:16] targeted searches. We don't not we do
[5:10:18] not need a permanent permanent citywide
[5:10:21] system that collects information on
[5:10:23] everyone's first and ask question later.
[5:10:26] I asked this commission to remove the
[5:10:28] cameras and in the city participation in
[5:10:30] the flock network, prevent future
[5:10:31] expansion and require deletion of data
[5:10:33] that is not tied to an active criminal
[5:10:36] investigation. We can support effective
[5:10:38] policing without accepting
[5:10:40] indiscriminate surveillance. Tallassi
[5:10:42] should choose safety with privacy, not
[5:10:44] safety at the expense of privacy.
[5:10:47] Commissioners, mayor, I recommend taking
[5:10:49] a look at the app quote unquote God's
[5:10:52] eye view and take a look at what the
[5:10:54] capabilities are when we talk about
[5:10:55] surveillance. Thank you.
[5:10:58] » Next speaker, please.
[5:10:59] » Daryl Alfred is our next speaker. Then
[5:11:01] Colton Taylor.
[5:11:10] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:11:11] please.
[5:11:12] » Good evening again. and I'm Dar Alfred
[5:11:14] of 814 West Tharp Street. Uh I'm
[5:11:17] standing here tonight in opposition to
[5:11:19] Flock ALPRs and mass surveillance at
[5:11:21] large. This technology got ahead of the
[5:11:23] public fast. Flock cameras were dis or
[5:11:26] deployed before most people or even many
[5:11:28] legislators had any real awareness of
[5:11:30] what these systems could become, how
[5:11:32] much information they could collect, or
[5:11:34] how easily that information could be
[5:11:36] shared. For that reason alone, automated
[5:11:38] license plate readers deserve a
[5:11:40] moratorum no different than the pause
[5:11:42] the community has called on large data
[5:11:44] centers. This week, a former openi open
[5:11:47] AI researcher just resigned from
[5:11:49] anthropic warned that even warned that
[5:11:53] even the people building these
[5:11:54] technologies believe they're moving
[5:11:56] dangerously fast. And yes, these cameras
[5:11:58] can help solve crimes. Of course they
[5:12:00] can. If we put a GPS tracker on every
[5:12:03] car in town, that'd probably help solve
[5:12:05] crime, too. We don't do that because
[5:12:07] public safety is not the only value of a
[5:12:09] free society it's supposed to protect.
[5:12:12] We have a fourth amendment for a reason
[5:12:14] and surveillance technology now being
[5:12:16] sold for civilian policing has already
[5:12:18] been deployed in Gaza. I don't want
[5:12:20] Tallahassee becoming another testing
[5:12:22] ground for technology moving from war
[5:12:24] zones into civilian life. There is a
[5:12:27] practical problem here too. Why keep
[5:12:30] spending public money building
[5:12:31] surveillance infrastructure whose
[5:12:32] constitutional and regulatory future is
[5:12:34] increasingly uncertain? Every one of
[5:12:37] these cameras represents public money,
[5:12:39] labor, materials, installation, and
[5:12:41] maintenance. If these systems are
[5:12:42] ultimately found to go too far, we've
[5:12:45] wasted all of this time. Get flock and
[5:12:47] surveillance technology out of
[5:12:49] Tallahassee and put our resources into
[5:12:50] things that actually prevent crime.
[5:12:53] young people, mental health services,
[5:12:55] housing stability, community activities,
[5:12:58] job creation, and business ownership.
[5:13:00] Build infrastructure that gives people
[5:13:02] lives worth living, and you prevent the
[5:13:04] violence that before it happens. Give
[5:13:06] neighbors pathways to ownership and
[5:13:08] stake, and you'll get stronger
[5:13:09] neighborhoods. A camera can tell you
[5:13:11] where something has gone wrong after
[5:13:13] it's already happened. It can't stop
[5:13:15] desperation and pain before it comes
[5:13:17] violence, or crime created through
[5:13:20] necessity or boredom. We have limited
[5:13:22] money, limited labor, and limited
[5:13:24] attention. We should stop spending all
[5:13:26] three teaching government how to watch
[5:13:28] us better and actually try to serve the
[5:13:29] public. Let's build a city that has less
[5:13:32] reason to watch us in the first place.
[5:13:34] Put a moratorium on these systems. Get
[5:13:35] them out of Tallahassee because we have
[5:13:38] far larger problems to solve. Thanks.
[5:13:42] » Next speaker, please.
[5:13:43] » Colton Taylor and then Simone Hickman.
[5:13:46] » Great name and address for the record,
[5:13:47] please.
[5:13:49] » Appreciate it. My name is Colton Taylor.
[5:13:51] I live at 631 East Call Street. Uh so
[5:13:54] communities across the country have seen
[5:13:56] our rights be violated on numerous
[5:13:57] fronts and these flaw cameras are
[5:13:59] especially concerning because not only
[5:14:00] do they infringe upon our rights, the
[5:14:02] technology can be used to track our
[5:14:03] every move. They say it's just for
[5:14:05] public safety, but we've seen the
[5:14:06] terrible consequences of how they've
[5:14:08] been exploited. Uh mass surveillance
[5:14:10] begets uh suppression and oppression. So
[5:14:13] my question is is do we want to live in
[5:14:14] a city under mass surveillance? Uh my
[5:14:16] answer is no, and yours should be too.
[5:14:18] Thanks. Our next speaker, please.
[5:14:20] » Simone Hickman.
[5:14:23] And then the next speaker will be
[5:14:24] Jonathan Gardner.
[5:14:28] » Name and address for the record, please.
[5:14:31] » Uh, it's Simone Hickman, 10154
[5:14:34] Rose Road. Uh, I live in a more rural
[5:14:37] area and every single road from my house
[5:14:40] is covered by flaw cameras. Uh my family
[5:14:43] and I can't even buy gas or groceries
[5:14:47] without the system recording our
[5:14:48] vehicles. So I was very glad to hear the
[5:14:51] governor announced that the cameras
[5:14:53] would be coming down. I'm grateful to
[5:14:56] Sheriff Walt McNeel for doing the same.
[5:14:59] I'm especially grateful to Jefferson
[5:15:01] County Sheriff M. McNeel for going above
[5:15:03] and beyond because when I drove to
[5:15:05] Monaceel this weekend, the cameras were
[5:15:08] covered with black trash bags.
[5:15:10] Interestingly,
[5:15:12] [applause]
[5:15:13] the cameras, from what I understand,
[5:15:15] can't actually be removed because they
[5:15:18] are still the property of the Flock
[5:15:20] Corporation, but they covered them with
[5:15:22] trash bags to reassure drivers that they
[5:15:25] weren't being tracked. That's how you
[5:15:27] build public trust with the community,
[5:15:29] not with a transparency portal written
[5:15:32] by Flock that honestly has very little
[5:15:35] useful information. Uh, Wakulla County
[5:15:38] is also getting rid of their cameras.
[5:15:41] I'm not sure why Tallahassee Police
[5:15:44] Department is holding out on this issue.
[5:15:47] The city of Berkeley, California, has
[5:15:49] been in the news lately because a memo
[5:15:51] was leaked where city attorneys
[5:15:54] discussed how the city may be liable in
[5:15:57] court for issues related to Flock.
[5:16:00] An independent study in Roseville,
[5:16:02] California, found that 71% of all
[5:16:05] license plates read by flock were read
[5:16:07] inaccurately. 71% failure rate. So, not
[5:16:11] only are these cameras a privacy
[5:16:13] nightmare, they are a liability
[5:16:15] nightmare, too. Innocent people are
[5:16:17] going to be hurt by these things and
[5:16:19] they are probably going to sue.
[5:16:22] Flock is now facing a class action
[5:16:25] lawsuit in Georgia. And let me just read
[5:16:28] you the charges they are facing. Count
[5:16:31] one, invasion of privacy. Count two,
[5:16:35] negligence.
[5:16:36] Count three, negligent design. Count
[5:16:39] four, failure to warn. And count five,
[5:16:42] emotional distress.
[5:16:44] The lawsuit also reveals that the
[5:16:46] cameras can actually photograph the
[5:16:48] occupants of vehicles.
[5:16:50] Block's newest model called the Condor
[5:16:53] is specifically designed to track human
[5:16:55] beings. It uses AI to identify people
[5:16:59] down to their tattoos and can even read
[5:17:01] their phone screens over their shoulder.
[5:17:04] » You're at 30 seconds remaining.
[5:17:05] » So that's what's coming next most
[5:17:07] likely. I think we're hitting an
[5:17:10] inflection point on surveillance in our
[5:17:12] society and you guys are really the
[5:17:14] frontline defenders of our privacy. So,
[5:17:17] thank you for listening.
[5:17:19] » Our next speaker, please,
[5:17:22] » Jonathan Gardner.
[5:17:24] And Matt Burke will then follow.
[5:17:28] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:17:29] please.
[5:17:31] » Hi there, Jonathan Gardner. Uh, 32309,
[5:17:33] uh, 3687 Donovan Drive. I do have some
[5:17:36] handouts. I'm a handout person. I don't
[5:17:37] know who who I should hand this to.
[5:17:38] » To the officer right there.
[5:17:44] » All right. So, that's a long set of
[5:17:46] documents, but I have prepared for the
[5:17:48] county and for you guys a personal
[5:17:50] report on some of this. And it's more
[5:17:52] than just flock cameras. Um, we're
[5:17:54] talking about surveillance tools in
[5:17:56] general. There is a market that is being
[5:17:58] built um for civilian domestic espionage
[5:18:03] that you can't put another name on it.
[5:18:05] Um, and with AI tools coming up on the
[5:18:07] last set of pages of that handout, um,
[5:18:09] there's an article by Wired of Flock's
[5:18:12] own um, what they have a AI chatbot that
[5:18:15] takes in all of this data from your
[5:18:18] license plate readers, um, from your
[5:18:20] drone cameras, from social media pieces,
[5:18:23] uh, and puts it all together and creates
[5:18:25] you a list of suspects based on what
[5:18:27] kind of information you're looking for.
[5:18:29] Um, I would definitely recommend looking
[5:18:31] into that. I think is the most striking
[5:18:33] and and forefront um portion of what
[5:18:36] this looks like. Um on the local level,
[5:18:39] I want to thank you guys for considering
[5:18:41] suspension. I think that we need to move
[5:18:43] towards something bigger than that. Um a
[5:18:46] previous speaker uh mentioned looking
[5:18:48] back and saying how did how was this set
[5:18:50] up? How was this done without real
[5:18:52] public input or public knowledge? Um I
[5:18:55] believe that these were set up last
[5:18:57] summer. I mean that's when the real
[5:18:58] explosion of them were and then it
[5:19:00] didn't get to you guys until December
[5:19:02] and there was a conversation in January.
[5:19:04] So I mean six months of of time where
[5:19:06] this is a big deal that now that
[5:19:08] everybody knows. Uh so I would like a a
[5:19:12] backwards look at that and then a
[5:19:13] forward look. I at a previous commission
[5:19:16] meeting put forward uh what Austin,
[5:19:18] Texas did and set forth a policy, a
[5:19:20] local policy um focusing on AI
[5:19:23] surveillance technologies and what the
[5:19:26] commission locally can set forth on
[5:19:28] policies for review before they're
[5:19:30] enacted um to do privacy impact
[5:19:34] assessments on what these technologies
[5:19:37] are doing and if they're effective. And
[5:19:39] really none of those questions have been
[5:19:41] asked at this commission until this
[5:19:43] became a big public outcrage over this
[5:19:45] year, maybe the past several months. Um,
[5:19:47] it looks very bad in terms of public
[5:19:50] trust when you have a year of this kind
[5:19:54] of level of surveillance just being
[5:19:55] enacted with nobody knowing and not
[5:19:58] having any public input. If we want
[5:20:00] this, sure, we can argue that they're
[5:20:02] great for solving crimes. As somebody
[5:20:05] previously said, GPS readers would be
[5:20:07] great for that, too. There's a reason
[5:20:09] that the Supreme Court made that a
[5:20:11] warrant warrantable search.
[5:20:13] » 30 seconds remaining.
[5:20:14] » And what Flock is and all these other
[5:20:16] people are really selling is a database
[5:20:18] that the police can access. It's not the
[5:20:20] cameras. I mean, the cameras are a big
[5:20:21] deal, but they've been around for a
[5:20:22] while. It's the database. It's the
[5:20:24] profiling. It's being able to track
[5:20:26] people. And that is what I think most
[5:20:28] people are really upset about. It's not
[5:20:30] the cameras that can help solve crimes.
[5:20:32] It is the database that profiles people.
[5:20:35] Thank you for considering suspension.
[5:20:36] Let's keep this conversation going.
[5:20:38] Thanks.
[5:20:38] » Our next speaker, please,
[5:20:39] » Matt Burke. [applause]
[5:20:43] Matt Burke.
[5:20:46] That Burke three times. Moving to PJ
[5:20:48] Perez.
[5:20:55] » Name and address for the record, please.
[5:20:59] » Good evening. PJ Perez, 32301.
[5:21:04] All right.
[5:21:08] So opposition to mass surveillance uh
[5:21:10] has bipartisan support nationwide,
[5:21:12] right? Flock is the poster child, but
[5:21:14] it's not the only threat. Our community
[5:21:17] has been expressing concern over these
[5:21:18] things for the better part of a year as
[5:21:20] we've been talking about. This invasive
[5:21:22] technology has been woven into our lives
[5:21:25] and we've taken it as the reality that
[5:21:27] we're just forced to accept. It's time
[5:21:29] for this commission to finally listen to
[5:21:31] the voices of the people.
[5:21:33] Over the past year, this commission has
[5:21:35] given away the hospital, given away
[5:21:37] Capital City Country Club, slashed
[5:21:40] unagended public speakers to 30 minutes,
[5:21:42] and now hot off the presses, some city
[5:21:44] manager contract hijinks to add to a
[5:21:47] pretty rough resume over the course of a
[5:21:48] year.
[5:21:51] It's time this commission, the
[5:21:52] government closest to the people, began
[5:21:53] to vote like it, right? As a high school
[5:21:56] social sciences teacher, I press on upon
[5:21:58] my students every day to get active in
[5:22:00] their community, especially in politics
[5:22:02] here at the local level. It's an
[5:22:05] essential project that we're all working
[5:22:06] on here together.
[5:22:09] Here, we can actually touch the
[5:22:10] government. It's not federal. It's not
[5:22:13] state. It's not disconnect. It's not
[5:22:14] abstract. It's here. It's everyone in
[5:22:16] this room. People coming around sharing
[5:22:19] each other's thoughts, signing
[5:22:21] petitions, gathering information. We're
[5:22:23] living amongst each other. We need to be
[5:22:25] listening to each other.
[5:22:27] We need to be able to show the next
[5:22:28] generation that their voice matters.
[5:22:31] Show them there's still hope in this
[5:22:32] city and in public service instead of
[5:22:35] pulling up the rear on this issue. I
[5:22:36] mean, we were behind the governor on
[5:22:38] this guys. The governor behind him.
[5:22:42] Strange. Nothing changed in two weeks.
[5:22:44] Mr. Mayor, y'all just weren't
[5:22:46] responsive. We had to wait for it to
[5:22:48] become a safe issue politically for us
[5:22:50] to act on this thing.
[5:22:53] This is not the way that our capital
[5:22:54] city needs to be acting, right? We need
[5:22:56] to be nimble and responsive. We're all
[5:22:59] right here. We see each other. We're all
[5:23:00] in flesh and blood. We can't wait for
[5:23:02] things to feel safe or be politically
[5:23:04] expedient. We need to do what's
[5:23:07] responsive to the community, to the
[5:23:08] people.
[5:23:10] So, I assure you, we need to be voting
[5:23:13] to cancel this contract with Flock and
[5:23:16] make it clear that no other vendor's
[5:23:18] camera should be able to fill that void.
[5:23:20] Thank you.
[5:23:23] » [applause]
[5:23:23] » Next speaker is Abdila Shakir
[5:23:36] and then the next speaker after this
[5:23:37] will be Dala Pierre.
[5:23:40] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:23:41] please.
[5:23:42] » Good evening, commissioners. My name is
[5:23:43] Abdil Skier, 1951 North Meridian Road.
[5:23:46] I'm here representing the ACLU of
[5:23:47] Florida. Our mission is to protect,
[5:23:49] promote, uh, sorry, to protect, defend,
[5:23:52] uh, uh, promote and expand the
[5:23:54] constitutional rights and civil
[5:23:55] liberties of all people in this country.
[5:23:58] We all deserve to be safe in our
[5:24:00] communities. But surveillance does not
[5:24:02] make us safe, and Americans don't
[5:24:04] surrender our privacy rights when we
[5:24:05] drive to work, drop the kids off at
[5:24:07] school, or go to church. Automatic
[5:24:09] license plate reader, ALPR, companies
[5:24:11] like Flock Safety, sell cameras that
[5:24:13] record and digitize license plate
[5:24:15] numbers and run them against hot lists.
[5:24:17] But that data can be stored and shared.
[5:24:19] And by doing so, it allows people to be
[5:24:21] tracked for as long as that data is
[5:24:22] retained. By the way, uh the TPD policy
[5:24:25] that you all have says that that data is
[5:24:26] retained for at least 30 days, even
[5:24:28] though Flock recently uh changed their
[5:24:30] default retention settings to 7 days.
[5:24:32] So, uh this can reveal very intimate and
[5:24:34] private details of a person's life.
[5:24:36] Every time we drive to a doctor's
[5:24:38] office, a place of worship, or a
[5:24:39] friend's home, we leave a trail. And the
[5:24:42] issue isn't just one snapshot. It's that
[5:24:43] enough snapshots can create a map of
[5:24:46] your life. They can record where we were
[5:24:48] and when we were there. And that can
[5:24:50] reveal our religious practices, our
[5:24:52] medical visits, political activities,
[5:24:54] personal relationships, our daily
[5:24:56] routines. This inescapable network of
[5:24:58] surveillance gives police around the
[5:25:00] country new power to track our movements
[5:25:02] without a warrant. By the way, putting
[5:25:04] our freedom to move freely in danger.
[5:25:06] This technology can be very easily
[5:25:08] abused. In Kansas, police used them to
[5:25:10] pursue a man who wrote a newspaper op-ed
[5:25:12] that was critical of the department.
[5:25:14] Here in Florida, in Pulk County, an
[5:25:16] officer was recently suspended after
[5:25:17] allegedly accessing the flock database
[5:25:19] 717 times over nearly two years to track
[5:25:23] his aranged wife. But we are not
[5:25:25] powerless. Communities across the
[5:25:27] country are rejecting these creepy
[5:25:29] cameras and winning. Cities and police
[5:25:31] departments are canceling their
[5:25:32] contracts with flock in response to
[5:25:34] public pressure, and Tallahassee must
[5:25:35] join that list. Everyday Americans are
[5:25:38] coming together across the political
[5:25:39] spectrum to reject this mass
[5:25:41] surveillance. We don't have to hold the
[5:25:43] same political beliefs to agree that
[5:25:45] it's wrong for the government to track
[5:25:47] everyone's movements just in case they
[5:25:49] may someday be suspected of something.
[5:25:51] And let's be clear, while Flock provides
[5:25:54] the most widely used ALPRs, they're not
[5:25:56] the only company trying to make a buck
[5:25:58] off of spying off of us. Axon, Vigilant
[5:26:01] Solutions, Genetic, Platesmart,
[5:26:02] Perceptics, those are just a few of the
[5:26:05] other major companies selling ALPRs to
[5:26:07] police, private companies, and others.
[5:26:09] It doesn't matter which creepy which
[5:26:10] company has its creepy cameras in our
[5:26:12] neighborhood. They all have the same
[5:26:14] problem. A lack of transparency and
[5:26:16] oversight into how they collect, store,
[5:26:18] and share our data and how to hold
[5:26:20] public and private actors accountable if
[5:26:21] they abuse it.
[5:26:22] » You're at 30 seconds.
[5:26:23] » Thank you. Uh we must protect our
[5:26:25] communities from these invasive cameras.
[5:26:27] Uh if the government suspects us of
[5:26:29] wrongdoing, they also need to get a
[5:26:31] warrant. Everyone in America has the
[5:26:33] right to move freely without being
[5:26:34] surveiled. No flock, no ALPRs, no
[5:26:38] exceptions, no excuses. Get these creepy
[5:26:41] cameras out of our communities now and
[5:26:42] tell these ALPR companies to get the
[5:26:45] flock out of Tallahassee.
[5:26:47] [applause]
[5:26:49] » Our next speaker, please.
[5:26:51] » Delila Pierre is next. Uh, followed by
[5:26:54] Robert Lee.
[5:26:55] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:26:56] please.
[5:26:57] » My name is Delila Pierre. My address is
[5:26:59] exempt. I'm a member of the Tallahassee
[5:27:01] Alliance Against Racist and Political
[5:27:02] Repression. And I want to say that
[5:27:04] police chief Lawrence Revel sitting
[5:27:06] right over there. Um, and the TSI Police
[5:27:08] Department are the last people we want
[5:27:10] possible to have access to flawed
[5:27:12] cameras because the TSI Police
[5:27:13] Department has again and again shown
[5:27:15] that they have a history of using
[5:27:16] surveillance technology to harass and
[5:27:19] spy on black and brown people in our
[5:27:20] city and TV has always responded
[5:27:22] negatively when asked to hold to take
[5:27:24] accountability for their actions. So TD
[5:27:27] says that um flock will be expanded to
[5:27:29] areas, at least it says in your agenda
[5:27:30] item, that flock will be expanded to
[5:27:32] areas that have historically experienced
[5:27:34] higher levels of criminal activity.
[5:27:36] That's a nice way for you to say black
[5:27:38] people. Um TBD has been caught using
[5:27:41] stingray technology in 2015 to spy on
[5:27:44] thousands of innocent bystanders. And
[5:27:47] all these investigations TPD made, they
[5:27:49] made no mention of using Stingray
[5:27:51] technology in any of their court filings
[5:27:52] or the judicial to the judicial
[5:27:54] authorities. Um, TBD also has a history
[5:27:58] of using his technology for things like
[5:28:00] the 287G agreement. The TY Police
[5:28:02] Department, although not having to,
[5:28:04] decide to sign on to the 287g agreement
[5:28:06] and work with them. Let's talk more
[5:28:08] about what TBD has done because TBD also
[5:28:10] was responsible for the conviction of
[5:28:12] Calvin Riley, a black man falsely
[5:28:14] convicted of a DUI when there was direct
[5:28:17] evidence that he was being set up by
[5:28:19] officer Kirstston Oliver who literally
[5:28:22] who took an alcohol bottle from his car,
[5:28:24] opened it, and then put it back in so
[5:28:26] she had the pretext to arrest him. So, I
[5:28:29] don't understand why you would think
[5:28:32] that an organization that barks against
[5:28:34] transparency, that an organization that
[5:28:36] fought for the removal of a citizens
[5:28:38] police review board, that openly
[5:28:40] celebrated working with war criminal
[5:28:42] Eddie Gallagher, who posed with a corpse
[5:28:45] and was convicted for it, that an
[5:28:47] organization where our police chief,
[5:28:49] Lawrence Revel, went to an anti-LGBTQ
[5:28:52] plus conference with a Tati police
[5:28:54] department shirt, and then y'all, city
[5:28:56] commissioners Dy Williams, Cox, Curtis
[5:28:58] Richardson John Dailyaly defended him. I
[5:29:00] have no idea why you would think that
[5:29:02] you have the right to surveil people in
[5:29:03] our community when time and time again
[5:29:05] when we ask for justice for victims of
[5:29:07] police brutality for immigrants and for
[5:29:09] people who are affected by your actions,
[5:29:11] you go through an internal investigation
[5:29:13] process that finds it that TBD is not in
[5:29:16] trouble. What kind of system is this
[5:29:19] where we already spend onethird of our
[5:29:21] budget on policing and you already have
[5:29:23] the real time crime center and a
[5:29:25] thousand other ways to surveil people to
[5:29:28] criminalize people to to detain people.
[5:29:32] As an organizer fighting for black
[5:29:33] liberation, I know these flaw cameras
[5:29:35] are damage to black communities in
[5:29:37] Tallahassee, to brown communities in
[5:29:38] Tallahassee. Our police department has
[5:29:40] shown time and time again that they
[5:29:42] don't care about accountability. And I
[5:29:44] Williams Cox, your time is coming up.
[5:29:45] Your seat is not secure, so you better
[5:29:47] be thoughtful when you make that vote
[5:29:49] today. Thank you.
[5:29:51] » Our next speaker, please,
[5:29:53] » Robert Lee.
[5:29:55] » And the next will be Lily Anderson
[5:29:56] Messing.
[5:29:57] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:29:58] please.
[5:30:00] » Uh, my name is Robert Lee. Uh,
[5:30:01] Tallahass, Florida 32303.
[5:30:04] Um, so I'm going to read off a few
[5:30:06] things uh from some recent news
[5:30:07] articles. Um, Brandon Upurch was just
[5:30:11] driving his Dodge Ram through Toledo
[5:30:13] when an AI camera changed his life
[5:30:15] forever. A Flock safety surveillance
[5:30:17] system misread a seven as a two on his
[5:30:19] license plate, trigger triggering a
[5:30:22] stolen vehicle alert that ended up with
[5:30:23] a police K9 tearing into his arm and
[5:30:25] dreadlocks. What should have been a
[5:30:27] routine drive became a nightmare of John
[5:30:29] Guns, dog bites, hospital visits, and
[5:30:32] jail time. All because a computer
[5:30:34] couldn't tell the difference between two
[5:30:35] numbers. On October 4th, 2025, Hakeim
[5:30:39] Dino attended his granddaughter's
[5:30:40] birthday party in Sanford, Florida. At
[5:30:42] the end of the night, he headed to his
[5:30:43] daughter's house. 8 miles down
[5:30:45] Interstate 4, a speeding car swerved
[5:30:46] across multiple lanes at over 100 miles
[5:30:48] an hour. It swiped Dino's motorcycle,
[5:30:51] then hit a Ford Focus, causing a pileup
[5:30:53] before driving away. Dino died at the
[5:30:55] scene, as did a county official and his
[5:30:58] wife. Witnesses said the speeding car
[5:31:00] was a Dodge Durango. Police found that a
[5:31:03] a flot camera, a type of automated
[5:31:05] license plate reader, had spotted a
[5:31:06] Durango nearby at the time. They
[5:31:08] arrested the owner, 23-year-old Lindseay
[5:31:10] Issacs. But Isaac wasn't involved in the
[5:31:12] crash, and officers had enough
[5:31:13] information at the time to exclude her
[5:31:15] as a suspect. Yet, she still spent two
[5:31:17] weeks in jail and faced the threat of
[5:31:19] life behind bars for months because
[5:31:21] police didn't use basic scrutiny and,
[5:31:23] you know, like just regular police work
[5:31:25] to be sure their cameras didn't
[5:31:26] implicate an innocent person. In 2020,
[5:31:30] Aurora, Colorado, notoriously held a
[5:31:32] black family, including small children,
[5:31:34] face down at gunpoint after an ALPR
[5:31:37] misidentified their SUV as a stolen
[5:31:39] motorcycle from another state. So, these
[5:31:42] cameras can't tell the difference
[5:31:43] between a car and a motorcycle or
[5:31:44] between two different state license
[5:31:45] plates.
[5:31:47] [clears throat]
[5:31:48] These cameras are not compatible with a
[5:31:51] free society.
[5:31:52] I understand the desire for safety, but
[5:31:55] creating a panopticon that surveils us
[5:31:58] at all times and all our of our
[5:31:59] movements is not safety. What creates
[5:32:02] safety is providing community resources,
[5:32:05] giving people the help that they need so
[5:32:07] that they're not desperate to, you know,
[5:32:09] figure out how to survive any way that
[5:32:11] they can. These cameras are security
[5:32:14] theater at best. Um, now obviously we've
[5:32:17] heard quite a bit about all the misuse
[5:32:19] of the cameras. officers all over the
[5:32:21] country stalking their ex-girlfriends,
[5:32:24] stalking their ex-wives, um stalking
[5:32:26] random women that they met who didn't go
[5:32:28] on a date with them. Um really weird
[5:32:30] stuff. Um but even beyond the misuse,
[5:32:34] the stories I said before,
[5:32:35] » 30 seconds remaining.
[5:32:36] » Just the simple existence of them is a
[5:32:39] problem. They make mistakes. This is not
[5:32:42] something that we should be acceptable
[5:32:44] accepting of. We shouldn't be surveiled
[5:32:46] at all times. We should be able to go
[5:32:47] about our movements. If we haven't done
[5:32:49] anything wrong, we shouldn't have to be
[5:32:51] worried about are we constantly being
[5:32:52] filmed by the city trying to, you know,
[5:32:55] track our movements everywhere that we
[5:32:56] go. So, please end this contract. I
[5:32:59] mean, don't be in conflict with the
[5:33:01] state and the county and countless other
[5:33:03] cities across Florida and the country
[5:33:05] that are suspending their contracts.
[5:33:06] Thank you.
[5:33:07] » Our next speaker, please.
[5:33:08] » Next speaker is Lily Anderson Messik,
[5:33:10] then Stanley Sims.
[5:33:13] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:33:14] please.
[5:33:14] » Lily Anderson Messics. Um, I live on
[5:33:18] West 6th Avenue, Tales 32303.
[5:33:21] And hi, I was Thank you guys for staying
[5:33:23] late and listening to us. I appreciate
[5:33:25] it. I was born here in Tallahassee at
[5:33:27] TMH and um, grew up here. Your u, Mayor
[5:33:30] Dailyaly, your mom, was one of my grade
[5:33:32] school teachers here in town and I'm
[5:33:35] just really frightened by these cameras
[5:33:38] that are going that are all over town.
[5:33:40] Um, I'm also a victim of sexual assault
[5:33:43] and I'm every time I leave my house now
[5:33:46] and I drive past these cameras at every
[5:33:49] street light, I don't know how many men
[5:33:51] are tracking my whereabouts. It's really
[5:33:55] concerning to me. This is a a stalker's
[5:33:59] and a domestic abuser's dream to have
[5:34:02] access to this type of information and
[5:34:05] they are using it that way. We're seeing
[5:34:07] cases in Florida and across the nation
[5:34:09] of these cameras being used to stalk and
[5:34:11] abuse women. Um I'm also a botonist and
[5:34:15] an ecologist and I spend a lot of time
[5:34:16] in, you know, secluded areas and I drove
[5:34:20] out to uh the Appalachic National Forest
[5:34:23] this week past um the Talas airport and
[5:34:26] I passed so many cameras. My entire
[5:34:29] route was tracked out there and it made
[5:34:32] me realize I'm in these secluded areas
[5:34:34] which I have historically always felt
[5:34:36] very safe in because I know how to
[5:34:38] handle myself in nature. But to know
[5:34:40] that I don't know how many strange men
[5:34:43] know where I am at all times and know
[5:34:45] that I'm in a secluded area that's scary
[5:34:48] to me. That's really frightening. Um
[5:34:51] it's also a roll out of mass
[5:34:53] surveillance across the nation that is
[5:34:55] happening in has been mentioned. This is
[5:34:57] data that is being stolen from us and
[5:35:00] being sold to we don't know who. It's
[5:35:03] just very scary. It's a tool that has
[5:35:07] too many. It's just too ripe for abuse.
[5:35:10] And we have rights. I have I believe I
[5:35:12] have a right to privacy in public. You
[5:35:15] know, I would like to have a reasonable
[5:35:17] right to privacy and not know that my
[5:35:18] data is being sold. I was really I
[5:35:21] wasn't able to attend the last
[5:35:22] commission meeting, but I was really
[5:35:23] dismayed at what happened at that
[5:35:25] commission meeting. I think it's really
[5:35:27] embarrassing that Dantis came out and
[5:35:30] and is against flock before our own
[5:35:32] commission is that's shocking to me. I
[5:35:36] never thought that would happen. And I
[5:35:38] also was really shocked and dismayed at
[5:35:41] uh Chief Rebel's attitude in that
[5:35:44] meeting and how he treated Commissioner
[5:35:45] Porter. I thought that was
[5:35:46] » You have 30 seconds remaining. So, um, I
[5:35:49] just wanted to express my concern. Thank
[5:35:50] you for listening. Have a good night.
[5:35:53] [applause]
[5:35:54] » The next speaker, please,
[5:35:55] » Stanley Sims. And then Lisa Sears.
[5:35:57] » My name is Stanley Sims. I'm still at
[5:36:00] 1320 Barack Obama way.
[5:36:05] First of all, let me say this because I
[5:36:06] don't get a chance to say, matter of
[5:36:08] fact, I've never had the opportunity to
[5:36:10] say it. I want to thank the governor,
[5:36:16] man.
[5:36:18] I want to thank him
[5:36:20] because if he can come to common sense
[5:36:22] on this, everyone should.
[5:36:27] But in my heart, I believe that if the
[5:36:29] governor would not have done what I've
[5:36:31] done, we would not be here today.
[5:36:36] The second thing I have a problem with,
[5:36:38] we keep using the word suspend.
[5:36:44] So that's for a time period. So, does
[5:36:47] that mean that this can come back?
[5:36:51] I also have heard some distortions.
[5:36:56] These flock them up cameras
[5:37:00] do not do facial recognition.
[5:37:03] They read license plates.
[5:37:08] Also, another distortion I want to clear
[5:37:10] up with with you, my good favorite
[5:37:12] friend, Mr. Curtis Richardson.
[5:37:15] Those cameras
[5:37:18] that we put up in neighborhoods
[5:37:22] are nothing compared to these flock
[5:37:25] cameras.
[5:37:25] » I never said there were
[5:37:27] » I didn't say you did. I didn't say you
[5:37:29] did.
[5:37:30] » Okay.
[5:37:32] » They operate
[5:37:34] totally different.
[5:37:37] This flock camera can track me from
[5:37:40] place to place. If I go to Wind Dixie,
[5:37:44] it could catch me. If I go to Publix, it
[5:37:47] could catch me. The cameras are
[5:37:50] stationary.
[5:37:53] So, I know I'm in a survey area, and
[5:37:56] those people in that area wanted that
[5:37:59] camera. So, I'm cool with that.
[5:38:02] Here's the other problem I have.
[5:38:08] You keep bragging about transparency,
[5:38:11] mayor.
[5:38:15] Why understand what's the hell is going
[5:38:17] on around here? Nobody
[5:38:21] Nobody
[5:38:23] explained to us.
[5:38:26] This is different also, Chief, our good
[5:38:29] friend, Chief,
[5:38:30] » 30 seconds, than pulling somebody's
[5:38:32] driving license.
[5:38:34] It is not the same.
[5:38:37] This is an invasion
[5:38:40] that is not really justified or
[5:38:45] been explained to the public.
[5:38:48] You have a right to be upset. And can I
[5:38:50] say this one more time? I want to thank
[5:38:52] the governor
[5:38:55] for making this move.
[5:38:58] I'm going home.
[5:39:00] » Our next speaker, please.
[5:39:01] » Lisa Sears is our next speaker.
[5:39:04] followed by Thomas Spears.
[5:39:09] » Your name and address for the record,
[5:39:10] please.
[5:39:12] » My name is Lisa Sears, zip code 32303.
[5:39:17] First, I want to thank the commissioners
[5:39:19] and the mayor for taking the stance that
[5:39:22] you are on this camera situation.
[5:39:25] Um, my major reasons for opposition are
[5:39:28] Fourth Amendment concerns, police
[5:39:30] misuse, immigration data sharing, mass
[5:39:34] immigration data sharing, and creeping
[5:39:36] mass surveillance and lack of
[5:39:38] transparency.
[5:39:40] Block cameras build national databases,
[5:39:42] perhaps even international,
[5:39:46] tracking the daily moves of just
[5:39:48] ordinary citizens without a warrant,
[5:39:52] which is actually const in
[5:39:53] unconstitutional.
[5:39:57] If you all insist
[5:39:59] on keeping the flock cameras, then let's
[5:40:05] use them on our public citizens, on our
[5:40:07] public servants.
[5:40:09] put them on the driveways, put them in
[5:40:11] their offices to ensure transparency and
[5:40:14] integrity.
[5:40:17] We have a pedto predatory administration
[5:40:20] and possibly the majority of the
[5:40:22] leadership in this world
[5:40:26] and we already seem to be implementing
[5:40:28] the Nazi playbook.
[5:40:30] So this is just another thing to
[5:40:32] weaponize against we the people.
[5:40:36] As an two simple examples, a woman was
[5:40:39] tracked in two different states in
[5:40:40] several states to criminally charge her
[5:40:43] for having an abortion.
[5:40:46] There was another older lady who was
[5:40:48] tracked in several states to go get pain
[5:40:51] medication at a dispensary that was not
[5:40:53] legal in her own state. Yet, not one of
[5:40:56] these flock cameras have helped track
[5:40:58] down one, not one predator in the
[5:41:00] Epstein files.
[5:41:04] as a mother and grandmother and
[5:41:06] volunteer of Tira and Grace Alliance in
[5:41:08] action which helps which helps humanity
[5:41:11] our human families that are in crisis
[5:41:13] which of course immigrant families are
[5:41:16] high on that list right now.
[5:41:19] I have seen our constitution being
[5:41:21] walked all over our rights being eroded
[5:41:24] the American dream going up in smoke
[5:41:27] that our immigrant ancestors believed in
[5:41:29] and were very grateful for. I see
[5:41:33] families being torn apart and people
[5:41:34] being imprisoned without due process,
[5:41:37] moved from prison to prison for profit.
[5:41:40] The misspelling of names, whether it's
[5:41:42] on purpose or poorly trained or
[5:41:45] incompetence by these poorly trained ICE
[5:41:48] agents.
[5:41:51] » Lord have mercy. I have so much to say.
[5:41:54] Well,
[5:41:57] as a mom and a grandmother and volunteer
[5:42:00] helping fellow humans, I am disappointed
[5:42:03] and baffled and even angry that you want
[5:42:06] to keep flockers in our city. Normally,
[5:42:09] I wouldn't say this. However, please
[5:42:11] follow the Santa's example and take them
[5:42:13] down.
[5:42:15] The next speaker, please Thomas Spears,
[5:42:19] followed by Brandon McIntyre.
[5:42:22] [snorts]
[5:42:27] name address for the record, please. Uh
[5:42:29] » Thomas Spears in 32303.
[5:42:32] It's very interesting that the
[5:42:33] conservative majority of the board are
[5:42:34] suddenly supporting suspending the flock
[5:42:37] cameras. They mention the actions of
[5:42:39] community partners. Why is the city
[5:42:41] commission following and not leading?
[5:42:44] And why is that the city is only moving
[5:42:45] after those community partners move? The
[5:42:48] community was out here at the last
[5:42:50] meeting. Why not listen to us?
[5:42:54] This issue was brought to a vote already
[5:42:57] and it was declined by the conservative
[5:42:58] majority 3 to2. I'm thinking a lot about
[5:43:01] a lot about 3 to2 votes. Selling the
[5:43:03] golf course with unmarked graves of
[5:43:05] enslaved black people on it and selling
[5:43:07] it for a song was done 3 to2. Selling
[5:43:10] the city's hospital without a full
[5:43:12] appraisal to the school with a billion
[5:43:14] dollar endor endowment done 3 to2.
[5:43:17] dozens of other votes, all done at the
[5:43:19] behest of the conservative majority of
[5:43:21] this commission, three to two, and that
[5:43:23] includes to stay on the contract with
[5:43:24] Flock, to continue to expand
[5:43:26] surveillance of all people of
[5:43:27] Tallahassee, despite the significant
[5:43:29] issues that that kind of surveillance
[5:43:30] has in general, despite the dozens of
[5:43:32] reports of police around the country
[5:43:34] abusing these systems to track their
[5:43:35] ex-girlfriends and ex-wives, and despite
[5:43:37] the ACLU saying that these surveillance
[5:43:40] programs do violate our constitutional
[5:43:42] right to privacy.
[5:43:44] The mayor keeps saying he doesn't want
[5:43:46] things in the dis to be political.
[5:43:49] When he or the conservative majority
[5:43:51] votes, whether it's on this board or as
[5:43:53] members of blueprint, not to support
[5:43:55] affordable housing, is that not
[5:43:56] political?
[5:43:58] When poverty is a poverty a policy
[5:44:00] choice and poverty is the source of
[5:44:02] crime, why does the mayor and the
[5:44:04] conservative majority support flot
[5:44:06] cameras to empower the badge and the gun
[5:44:08] over supporting the people?
[5:44:10] The truth of the matter is his
[5:44:12] statements of not wanting things to be
[5:44:13] political are a plain, insultingly
[5:44:15] obvious farce. This is the city
[5:44:18] commission, your five elected officials.
[5:44:19] Of course, it's political. It can't be
[5:44:21] anything else. The Tallahassee Alliance
[5:44:23] against racist and political repression
[5:44:25] stands with the people of Tallahassee
[5:44:27] against these flock cameras and demands
[5:44:29] that these surveillance systems be under
[5:44:30] the control of the people of
[5:44:31] Tallahassee, not just the police. We
[5:44:34] demand that all flot cameras be removed
[5:44:35] from the city. We demand that every
[5:44:37] instance of any department pulling in
[5:44:39] from a camera in Tallahassee be listed
[5:44:41] in a public database accessible without
[5:44:43] an explicit pull request. And we demand
[5:44:45] that when TPD misuses this system, they
[5:44:48] are held accountable by us, the people.
[5:44:50] All power to the people.
[5:44:53] [applause]
[5:44:54] » Our next speaker, please,
[5:44:55] » Brandon McIntyre. And then uh Yuri
[5:44:59] Gutshaw
[5:45:02] Box 511 Sneeze, Florida. My name is
[5:45:05] Brandon McIntyre. All right. Now, what
[5:45:07] now? Where do I need to start? Now,
[5:45:09] first and foremost, this is what I would
[5:45:10] like to say. The God that I serve is not
[5:45:14] Muslim. God that I serve is not a
[5:45:17] Christian. The God that I serve is not
[5:45:20] part of no denomination.
[5:45:22] He is love. He is unity. He's every
[5:45:26] fruit of every spirit. Okay? So, where
[5:45:29] we get division from? [snorts] why we've
[5:45:31] been so divided and want to watch one
[5:45:33] another when we're all full of sin
[5:45:35] guilt.
[5:45:37] So what I also want to say is this right
[5:45:39] here as your future governor for Florida
[5:45:42] when Brandon brought attention to these
[5:45:43] flock cameras when global worldwide
[5:45:46] known cuz I use it as my platform. I
[5:45:48] served you guys a constitutional notice
[5:45:49] about these actual things. You don't
[5:45:52] believe it? Go back and public record
[5:45:54] requested. So what I'm telling you all
[5:45:56] is this right here, right? for all the
[5:45:58] police officers. Y'all may say we don't
[5:46:00] have no crime yet in here. Have you been
[5:46:02] using the flock cameras? But once my
[5:46:04] team come here to the panhandle, we
[5:46:06] already been in Georgia. Once we come to
[5:46:08] the panhandle, there's a lot going to
[5:46:09] happen. Okay? If you haven't checked
[5:46:12] your tags yet, go to have I been
[5:46:14] flocked.com. They'll give you public
[5:46:16] records request as well. But listen, but
[5:46:18] they say it's a third party site. It's
[5:46:20] not accurate. That is wrong. This this
[5:46:22] is what I'm here to say because most of
[5:46:24] you officers
[5:46:25] want to go back and red redact the
[5:46:28] information and try to change your
[5:46:29] purpose of your investigation. It's not
[5:46:31] going to work. It's not going to work
[5:46:34] because the system has a mechanism that
[5:46:36] actually
[5:46:38] tracks the people and also put in the
[5:46:41] system where the officer put in a
[5:46:43] certain investigation, it automatically
[5:46:45] saves it. So if they go back and try to
[5:46:47] redact the information, guess what
[5:46:49] happens? It also saves that as well. So
[5:46:52] covering your tracks is not going to
[5:46:53] help you. Covering your ass, excuse my
[5:46:55] French, it's not going to help you
[5:46:57] because I've been tracked is for doing
[5:46:59] the right thing two plus years for no
[5:47:02] reason. Said because I ran for president
[5:47:04] of the United States, that's why you
[5:47:05] want to track me and investigate me.
[5:47:07] Well, guess what? We come to the
[5:47:08] panhandle and a lot of you going to go
[5:47:10] to jail. Not saying you guys, but
[5:47:12] listen, I'm going tell you something too
[5:47:13] as well. A lot of you sign uh NDAs,
[5:47:16] non-disclosurable agreements.
[5:47:18] That's going to hit the fan, too. our
[5:47:21] executive branch that allowed you guys
[5:47:23] to come in with this unlawful policy. It
[5:47:26] was unconstitutional. But we have a
[5:47:28] governor, right, that want to get rid of
[5:47:30] it. But I thought he was a lawyer. This
[5:47:33] isn't go past his desk. He signed off on
[5:47:36] it, too.
[5:47:37] » He know what's right to do for the
[5:47:40] better good of Florida. You think so?
[5:47:42] Guess what? He knew his time is coming
[5:47:45] to an end as well. Okay. So, guess what?
[5:47:48] A lot of people going to go to jail
[5:47:51] behind these flocks. Let's go Brandon on
[5:47:53] the ground. Fight for you guys. Thank
[5:47:55] you.
[5:47:57] » Y gotch. And this is the last speaker I
[5:48:00] have at this time.
[5:48:01] » Uh hello Gotchuk. Uh 3231 01
[5:48:04] Tallahassee, Florida. Uh I am not going
[5:48:07] to seek to try and enumerate all of the
[5:48:10] issues that have been laid out before
[5:48:12] me. What I am going to ask you guys to
[5:48:14] do is to take action because as it has
[5:48:16] been pointed out previously a suspension
[5:48:20] is not covering these and furthermore
[5:48:23] when it comes to Flock as well as the
[5:48:24] Motorola these are not the only cameras
[5:48:27] that are gathering data. This is my
[5:48:29] issue. My issue is that it's not just
[5:48:31] gathering data it's gathering data and
[5:48:33] then being put in the hands of private
[5:48:35] companies. And what I'm asking for you
[5:48:36] as my city commission is for you to not
[5:48:39] only monitor the the contracts with
[5:48:41] Flock as well as whatever the Motorola
[5:48:43] company is, but also look at the body
[5:48:46] cam footage. That's a service. My
[5:48:48] question to you all, and I don't know
[5:48:49] the answer, this is probably a question
[5:48:51] to our to our attorney, is
[5:48:54] when we pay for a service from that, is
[5:48:57] there something that prevents as well as
[5:48:59] any other cameras any third-party non
[5:49:03] non uh regulated
[5:49:05] age of private entities from using that
[5:49:08] information, that data. I don't know. I
[5:49:10] don't I think that that is something
[5:49:12] that the city commission should take up.
[5:49:14] And that is, I think, the utmost
[5:49:16] importance for me as a citizen. The idea
[5:49:19] that we need to have rights to the data
[5:49:23] that is collected on us and that those
[5:49:26] that data is also limited and restricted
[5:49:31] by the same laws that our law
[5:49:34] enforcement are required to follow when
[5:49:36] they serve a search and seizure on
[5:49:38] private property. I the the reality is
[5:49:41] that like I I I you know I give an
[5:49:44] address. I used to live at what was
[5:49:46] formerly 909 Central Street. uh for
[5:49:49] several years. While I was there, a new
[5:49:52] a new a new tenant moved in next door
[5:49:53] and they were selling drugs. I know this
[5:49:55] because they would try to sell drugs to
[5:49:57] people who were coming to visit me. That
[5:49:59] was reported by my landlord at multiple
[5:50:01] times. It got to the point where they
[5:50:02] had their power turned off and we they
[5:50:05] my landlord called the cops or called
[5:50:07] the TPD on that. As a result, they went
[5:50:09] over and they said, "Yeah, they're
[5:50:10] running a generator. We know it's loud.
[5:50:13] You got to call the code enforcement."
[5:50:14] And a week later, the place burned down.
[5:50:17] You know who was there in five minutes?
[5:50:20] The fire service.
[5:50:23] And and ultimately, I personally I feel
[5:50:25] like there was a missed opportunity that
[5:50:28] it doesn't see like putting cameras were
[5:50:30] going to do that because ultimately that
[5:50:32] house was raided during that time. It
[5:50:33] was done by the sheriff's department.
[5:50:35] » They arrested
[5:50:36] » 30 seconds remaining.
[5:50:37] » And during that time I it seems like the
[5:50:41] adage came true of if you want to call
[5:50:43] response, call the sheriff's department,
[5:50:45] not TPD. that ultimately that the the
[5:50:47] the the the signs were put out, people
[5:50:50] were warned, they were said, "Hey,
[5:50:52] there's some bad stuff going on here."
[5:50:53] It was very clear. And ultimately when
[5:50:56] there were police, there's such bad
[5:50:58] relations that the people in the
[5:51:00] neighborhood started yelling and
[5:51:01] screaming at the cops and there was
[5:51:03] conflict just by passers by and TPD
[5:51:06] needs to work on fixing that opposed to
[5:51:08] erecting new cameras to watch people.
[5:51:09] Thank you.
[5:51:10] » Our next speaker, please.
[5:51:12] » I have no other speakers on this item.
[5:51:14] Mayor.
[5:51:14] » All right. Commissioner Williams Cox.
[5:51:16] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor, and thank you all
[5:51:19] for your for your conversation. As I
[5:51:21] said earlier, I've done a lot of um
[5:51:23] research and homework as well. And so,
[5:51:25] at this point, I am ready to move
[5:51:27] forward with making the motion that we
[5:51:29] suspend um the use of Flock and Motorola
[5:51:33] cameras um in the city of Tallahassee to
[5:51:36] follow suit with um what our our
[5:51:38] partner, the sheriff, is is already
[5:51:41] doing. And at the last meeting, I
[5:51:43] mentioned that I didn't like the hodge
[5:51:45] podge of us um some doing this and some
[5:51:48] doing that, but to provide some
[5:51:49] consistency and what we're doing that we
[5:51:52] u move to suspend um the use of uh flock
[5:51:56] cameras as well as Motorola cameras.
[5:51:58] » I would second that motion, Mayor.
[5:52:00] » All right. Motion in a second. Motion
[5:52:02] made by Commissioner Williams, seconded
[5:52:04] by uh the mayor, Pro Tim. Further
[5:52:07] comment,
[5:52:10] Mr. Maloo.
[5:52:11] » Uh, thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh, I also
[5:52:14] drove to St. George Island this weekend
[5:52:16] and probably passed 25 bagged cameras.
[5:52:21] Um, it was great to see them bagged, but
[5:52:23] it was insane to see how many were in my
[5:52:26] drive between Tallahassee through a very
[5:52:28] rural community. I mean, you talk about
[5:52:31] mass surveillance. This is mass
[5:52:32] surveillance. Uh, I do want to, you
[5:52:36] know, we just took this item up two
[5:52:38] weeks ago. uh we didn't have the votes
[5:52:40] to get it passed. Sometimes leadership
[5:52:42] is going first. We brought this item up
[5:52:45] last December. Have been discussing it
[5:52:47] um as a a city uh commission, but I just
[5:52:50] to everybody who came out and spoke
[5:52:51] today who's been advocating on this
[5:52:53] issue, this decision is only changing
[5:52:56] because of you. Uh if you weren't
[5:52:59] advocating for this, you would not see a
[5:53:01] change on this commission today. And I
[5:53:03] know the majority of this commission
[5:53:05] tends to uh reject what the public is
[5:53:08] asking for time after time again, but
[5:53:11] you showed that the power of advocacy uh
[5:53:14] still works and if you continue to show
[5:53:16] up, you can see real change uh for your
[5:53:18] impacts. So, thank you. Thank you for
[5:53:21] that. I do have a couple questions or a
[5:53:24] question, Mr. Manager. the the budget
[5:53:27] today allocated $150,000 for ALPRS and
[5:53:32] the capital improvement plan. How will
[5:53:34] this decision impact that allocation?
[5:53:38] » Mr. Manager,
[5:53:41] » I'm not sure that level of detail, but
[5:53:44] um we clearly would not be spending
[5:53:47] additional money on ALPRs.
[5:53:49] It's entirely possible we could
[5:53:51] reprogram that for other technology,
[5:53:54] but if the commission moves forward with
[5:53:57] the decision that seems to be at hand,
[5:53:59] we would not spend money on ALPRs.
[5:54:03] » Okay. Thank you,
[5:54:04] » Mr. Mat.
[5:54:05] » Thank you. And is it still the city's
[5:54:07] position and the chief's position that
[5:54:09] they should remain?
[5:54:12] » Mr. Mayor,
[5:54:15] » I I think the TPD has has been very
[5:54:19] clear in terms of the value of the
[5:54:20] information,
[5:54:22] but at the same time, you heard the
[5:54:24] words from the chief
[5:54:26] last meeting and there was a request for
[5:54:29] this to come back that so there was
[5:54:32] quite a bit of effort put into the
[5:54:33] agenda item and you see no
[5:54:35] recommendation. We're seeking commission
[5:54:37] direction. TPD and myself and others, we
[5:54:41] believe this to be a policy issue.
[5:54:44] This update on LPRs and cameras and
[5:54:47] other technology has been provided over
[5:54:50] the years a dozen times. There's been
[5:54:53] investment added and and so TBD and law
[5:54:57] enforcement does believe in technology,
[5:55:00] but we believe this this rises to the
[5:55:03] level of public policy which is provided
[5:55:06] by the commission. So, you don't see a
[5:55:07] recommendation
[5:55:09] um other than seeking the direction of
[5:55:11] the commission?
[5:55:13] » Commissioner Metlo.
[5:55:14] » Uh thank you, Mr. Manager. I I know
[5:55:15] there was a lot of discussion at the
[5:55:17] last meeting about the right to privacy
[5:55:19] in public, but we really didn't uh ever
[5:55:21] really get to get into the issue of this
[5:55:24] being completely different. It doesn't
[5:55:26] give you the right to go back in time
[5:55:28] and trace the whereabouts of somebody uh
[5:55:30] for the past 30 days. That has nothing
[5:55:32] to do with what's clearly visible uh in
[5:55:34] in public. But going forward, I've heard
[5:55:36] the speaker's concerns. I've heard the
[5:55:38] motion. And I do think whether you can
[5:55:40] let me know if these are friendly
[5:55:41] amendments or um a substitute motion is
[5:55:44] required. But I think we need to be
[5:55:45] aggressive about this. I think that
[5:55:47] means black trash bags covering them by
[5:55:49] tomorrow within 24 hours.
[5:55:52] [applause]
[5:55:56] I think that means issuing the directive
[5:55:58] to move them from all city rightaways
[5:56:00] within 30 days as consistent with uh the
[5:56:02] governor's orders on state rightaways or
[5:56:04] the city will remove them if they're not
[5:56:06] removed by the owner within 30 days. And
[5:56:08] I think we need a policy to come back to
[5:56:11] the city commission that requires
[5:56:14] explicit city commission approval on any
[5:56:17] future uh surveillance technology moving
[5:56:19] forward. [applause] Is
[5:56:24] » That a friendly amendment uh
[5:56:26] Commissioner Williams Cox that we can
[5:56:28] support or do you want to have a
[5:56:30] separate uh substitute motion?
[5:56:32] » Um
[5:56:34] I for one am not in favor of riding
[5:56:37] around town seeing black bags all over
[5:56:40] the this city of Tallahassee.
[5:56:43] » When
[5:56:43] » Excuse us. Hey everybody, calm down.
[5:56:46] Just please. All right. I mean that
[5:56:48] that's just that's that's just where I
[5:56:50] am what I believe now knowing how
[5:56:53] technology works. When we say suspend
[5:56:56] that means it is turned off. It's not
[5:56:57] transmitting. It's not doing any of
[5:56:59] that. Um
[5:57:04] this is the second warning before I
[5:57:06] clear chambers for the rest of the
[5:57:07] evening. Okay.
[5:57:09] » Thank you.
[5:57:10] » So um is it's the why don't we why don't
[5:57:13] we do this? Why don't we react on the
[5:57:15] motion that I I have on the table and
[5:57:17] then if Commissioner Matlo wants to do a
[5:57:19] separate motion and he can do that
[5:57:21] » But he will be making a substitute
[5:57:23] motion that will be taken up first
[5:57:25] » And then if it fails then we will take
[5:57:27] up uh the original motion on the table.
[5:57:30] » Um okay so you do not want to accept it
[5:57:33] as a friendly amendment.
[5:57:34] » Okay. So Commissioner Matlo back to you.
[5:57:37] » Uh thank you Mr. Mayor. Uh, I make a
[5:57:39] substitute motion uh that we bag the
[5:57:41] cameras uh in the city within 24 hours.
[5:57:45] Uh, give 30 days for them to be removed
[5:57:47] or have the city remove them and bring
[5:57:49] back a city commission policy at the
[5:57:51] September 23rd meeting uh that requires
[5:57:54] explicit uh city commission approval for
[5:57:56] any new surveillance technology.
[5:57:59] » I'll second that. I have two questions.
[5:58:02] » Motion and a second. Commissioner
[5:58:03] Porter,
[5:58:04] » Thank you. And I'm not sure exactly who
[5:58:07] this question is for, but I think uh
[5:58:09] Commissioner Williams Cox for the
[5:58:11] original motion.
[5:58:13] I want to make sure that I understand.
[5:58:15] So, is it all ALPR
[5:58:18] cameras
[5:58:20] » Lock and Motorola?
[5:58:21] » Does that encompass all the
[5:58:24] ALPR cameras that we have?
[5:58:26] » That that's the entirety. There's
[5:58:29] there's 150ish
[5:58:31] a little over 150 fixed ALPR cameras
[5:58:35] made up of Flock and a Motorola brand.
[5:58:38] » Okay.
[5:58:38] » And they look different, different form
[5:58:40] factors. They all don't look the same,
[5:58:42] but that would be the entirety.
[5:58:45] » Okay. I I would ask if you would accept
[5:58:47] the friendly amendment to extend it to
[5:58:50] all ALPR cameras because I think that
[5:58:52] what we don't want is to just not that
[5:58:54] I'm assuming this would happen, but I
[5:58:56] think everyone would like the
[5:58:57] reassurance that we're not going to just
[5:58:59] sign a contract with another company
[5:59:01] with another provider.
[5:59:06] My question is, will the original
[5:59:09] amendment can it be amended to just say
[5:59:12] that we are suspending all ALPR cameras?
[5:59:16] » But we're on a substitute motion right
[5:59:17] now, not the original motion.
[5:59:19] » I understand that. I was just want to
[5:59:21] make sure that both he Commissioner
[5:59:23] Matlo did not speak to that.
[5:59:25] » Got it.
[5:59:25] » So I want to make sure what's included
[5:59:27] both in his motion and in the original
[5:59:29] motion. Got it.
[5:59:31] » Yes. My motion encompasses all LPRs.
[5:59:34] Thank you. Um, and then I also wanted to
[5:59:37] ask the city manager. This commission
[5:59:38] took action on June 10th to
[5:59:42] ask that Amnadam come back um with
[5:59:45] information about the Austin City
[5:59:48] Council Trust Act that they passed that
[5:59:51] had a framework
[5:59:53] um for how to deal with these kinds of
[5:59:57] surveillance tools. Is that item still
[5:59:59] coming back to us?
[6:00:01] Yeah, I believe that topic which has
[6:00:04] been consistent would be a retreat item
[6:00:06] topic. So I would I would expect that
[6:00:09] you can have that item back.
[6:00:11] » Okay. The intent was not that it come
[6:00:13] back to us at a retreat. The intent the
[6:00:15] direction was that it just come back to
[6:00:17] us at a regular meeting. So can it come
[6:00:19] back? I mean do I the motion should the
[6:00:22] » I'll amend my motion to include that
[6:00:23] information at the September 23rd
[6:00:25] meeting.
[6:00:25] » Okay. Okay. That's
[6:00:26] » I just want to make sure that we're not
[6:00:28] » Friendly amendment commission.
[6:00:29] » Okay. Thank you. Atlas's motion. Okay.
[6:00:34] » Mr. Mayor, may I
[6:00:36] » Sure.
[6:00:36] » I just just for clarity, um the the way
[6:00:40] we would immediately disable these is by
[6:00:43] turning the systems off
[6:00:46] and turning the cameras off. So, the
[6:00:48] access to the system,
[6:00:50] access to the data and the cameras,
[6:00:53] » Right?
[6:00:54] » To just just be clear, that's how we do.
[6:00:56] I haven't heard that action.
[6:00:58] Commissioner Williams Cox said that, but
[6:00:59] that's how we would do that very
[6:01:01] rapidly.
[6:01:01] » Sure.
[6:01:03] » I mean, that would be, you know, how we
[6:01:04] would disable that technology so it
[6:01:06] couldn't be accessed by us or anybody
[6:01:08] else.
[6:01:08] » And and is that is that the way the
[6:01:11] sheriff is doing it?
[6:01:12] » Yes.
[6:01:13] » And is that the way that the governor is
[6:01:17] state is doing it?
[6:01:18] » Yes.
[6:01:18] » Okay.
[6:01:19] » Yeah, that's the mo that's the fastest
[6:01:20] way to stop this technology.
[6:01:23] » Sounds good. All right. So, we got a
[6:01:24] substitute motion on the table that
[6:01:25] Commissioner Matlo has made that has
[6:01:27] been amended uh with friendly
[6:01:29] suggestions from Commissioner Porter and
[6:01:31] seconded by Commissioner Porter. Uh I am
[6:01:33] respectfully going to support the
[6:01:34] original motion on the table and not
[6:01:36] support the substitute motion. Uh all
[6:01:38] those in favor signify by saying I.
[6:01:40] » I.
[6:01:41] » All those opposed I.
[6:01:42] » And it fails 32 with the mayor, Mayor
[6:01:44] Pro Tim and Commissioner Williams Cox
[6:01:46] and descent with Commissioner Matlo and
[6:01:47] Commissioner Porter in favor. We are on
[6:01:49] the original motion made by Commissioner
[6:01:51] Williams Cox, seconded by the mayor pro
[6:01:53] Tim. All those in favor signify. Mr.
[6:01:55] Mayor,
[6:01:55] » Uh, Commissioner Matlo.
[6:01:57] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Just for
[6:01:58] clarification on the motion, um,
[6:02:00] suspension until which point and who has
[6:02:03] the authority to remove the suspension?
[6:02:05] » I could I could not hear you.
[6:02:07] » A suspension until when? And who has the
[6:02:09] authority to then remove the suspension
[6:02:10] and put them back into play?
[6:02:12] » Sure. It is my understanding that the
[6:02:14] action that is being proposed is the
[6:02:16] exact same action taken by the Leyon
[6:02:18] County Sheriff's Office. Correct.
[6:02:19] Exactly. So the question is, and I don't
[6:02:22] have the answer off the top of my head,
[6:02:23] but it's a suspension in per perpetuity.
[6:02:26] Chief, do you uh can you come and and
[6:02:28] help clarify
[6:02:30] the sheriff's actions so that as a
[6:02:32] community we are moving forward together
[6:02:35] uh with the suspension that he has put
[6:02:37] in place? Um
[6:02:40] » Yes, sir. Thank you, mayor, for the
[6:02:42] opportunity. Um the the suspension that
[6:02:45] the sheriff has done and that that I
[6:02:47] believe is where uh we're getting the
[6:02:49] direction here tonight um would be until
[6:02:52] such time as and and again, if I might
[6:02:55] take a little bit just of extra time, we
[6:02:58] just spent two days with the Florida
[6:03:00] police chiefs um discussing this exact
[6:03:02] issue. And there is a model statement
[6:03:05] coming. There's a model policy coming.
[6:03:07] And that information will be then used
[6:03:09] with the Florida Sheriff's Association
[6:03:12] and our legislators to bring forward
[6:03:14] legislation which will if in fact this
[6:03:17] moves forward direct how that is moved
[6:03:20] forward, how it's used, how it's
[6:03:21] protected, anything if it in fact goes
[6:03:23] forward at all. So what the sheriff has
[6:03:25] done and what what I assume you would be
[6:03:28] in agreement with doing would be to
[6:03:29] suspend this until such time is those
[6:03:32] those legislative efforts and those
[6:03:35] efforts of the FPCA and the FSA um come
[6:03:40] and set that national standard that we
[6:03:41] talked about two weeks ago um that we
[6:03:43] believe we're already very close to but
[6:03:46] it would formalize all that and put it
[6:03:49] in formal policy with IECP International
[6:03:51] Association of Chiefs of Police with the
[6:03:54] Florida Sheriff's Association, Florida
[6:03:55] Police Chief's Association, and create
[6:03:57] that national standard that everybody's
[6:03:59] looking forward to direct if and when
[6:04:01] this this technology can be used. So,
[6:04:04] you would be suspending it until such
[6:04:06] time as those guidelines were in place.
[6:04:08] » Understood. And the difference between
[6:04:10] the sheriff's office and this
[6:04:11] legislative body, sheriff being a
[6:04:13] constitutional officer that can make
[6:04:14] decision on his own. If we as a body
[6:04:17] decide to put in suspension, we cannot
[6:04:20] reinstate that program unless that item
[6:04:22] comes back before this commission with a
[6:04:24] positive vote unless directed otherwise.
[6:04:26] So to answer your question, Commissioner
[6:04:28] Matlo, if we take action tonight to
[6:04:30] suspend in order to reinstate,
[6:04:35] excuse me, it would have to take an
[6:04:36] affirmative vote of a future commission
[6:04:39] because I don't see this coming back in
[6:04:40] the next month and a half before the
[6:04:42] election.
[6:04:43] » Commissioner Matloo. Thanks, Chief.
[6:04:45] » Thank you, Chief. Yeah, and thank you
[6:04:46] for that clarification. Um,
[6:04:49] I can't believe I'm gonna say this, but
[6:04:50] I believe I'm more in line with what the
[6:04:52] governor ordered, which was uh must be
[6:04:56] removed by the permittee within 30 days
[6:04:59] of this date. If such removal has not
[6:05:01] occurred within the 30-day period, the
[6:05:03] department will remove any remaining
[6:05:04] devices subject to this memorandum. The
[6:05:07] governor has ordered them to come down,
[6:05:09] at least on state state highways. And so
[6:05:11] we are we are I don't know where that
[6:05:13] puts us politically in relationship to
[6:05:15] to the governor, but it seems like the
[6:05:17] governor has a lot more common sense
[6:05:18] about the threat um of this surveillance
[6:05:21] uh technology. But look, incremental
[6:05:23] progress is progress. I'll support the
[6:05:25] motion on the table, but I don't think
[6:05:27] um it's a total victory for people who
[6:05:29] don't want to see this come back in a
[6:05:30] year uh and go through this same process
[6:05:33] again. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[6:05:35] » Commissioner Porter, with the question.
[6:05:37] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor, and I intend to
[6:05:39] support the motion as well. I I would
[6:05:41] like to have the question answered. How
[6:05:43] did we get here
[6:05:46] since this did not come to a vote for
[6:05:48] the commission?
[6:05:50] » Uh Mr. Manager.
[6:05:51] » Yeah. Actually, Commissioner, there's
[6:05:54] been numerous votes by the commission.
[6:05:57] Okay.
[6:05:58] » On the video technology, license plate
[6:06:00] reader technology updates to the
[6:06:02] commission dating back till
[6:06:05] 2020.
[6:06:09] So all of the action has been done by
[6:06:11] the commission.
[6:06:11] » Correct.
[6:06:12] » Did we vote on entering into a flock
[6:06:15] contract?
[6:06:16] » Uh we did not enter into a flock
[6:06:18] contract.
[6:06:19] » That's right.
[6:06:20] » Contract. It's a derivative of the
[6:06:22] redspeed contract. Yes, you did.
[6:06:24] » We did.
[6:06:25] » Okay. So
[6:06:28] I don't understand
[6:06:30] » That that was legislative action. We did
[6:06:32] vote on that.
[6:06:32] » I know the red speed was. But so are you
[6:06:35] telling me that that is that red speed
[6:06:39] is
[6:06:40] » There's a relationship between red speed
[6:06:42] the availability of flock and you you
[6:06:44] acted on that contract then
[6:06:46] » Okay I know we acted on that contract I
[6:06:48] reviewed those items before we got here
[6:06:49] there's no mention of flock there's no
[6:06:51] mention of alprs
[6:06:53] » That that's the contract that's the
[6:06:55] contract that that
[6:06:58] is for the flock and then you've had
[6:07:00] other motor with updates so this
[6:07:02] commission's provided the ction. It's
[6:07:05] not been
[6:07:07] a few times, it's been numerous times.
[6:07:10] » All right, we got a motion on the table.
[6:07:11] We're going to take a vote. All those in
[6:07:12] favor of the motion made by Commissioner
[6:07:14] Diane Williams Cox, seconded by the
[6:07:16] mayor, Pro Tim, signify by saying I.
[6:07:18] » All those opposed and it passes
[6:07:21] unanimously. 50-0. We have nothing else
[6:07:23] to come before us. We are on agenda
[6:07:25] speakers. Mr.
[6:07:26] » Mr. Mayor,
[6:07:28] » Can we address Can I just take care of
[6:07:29] that item that we were going to take
[6:07:31] care of earlier? Do you want me to Mr.
[6:07:33] » Porter? You're recognized.
[6:07:34] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um, I would just
[6:07:37] like to the record to reflect my vote on
[6:07:41] the street renaming to be unanimous.
[6:07:44] » Well, I think we have to uh she wants to
[6:07:46] change her position and change the
[6:07:47] official vote on the street renaming for
[6:07:50] doctors.
[6:07:51] So, do I need to I need to take a motion
[6:07:54] to reconsider?
[6:07:55] » It's not again, it's Robert's rules
[6:07:57] refers to it as a if it's within the
[6:07:59] same meeting, it's not really a motion
[6:08:01] to reconsider. It does require um
[6:08:03] unanimous consent of the body to allow
[6:08:07] the commissioner to change her vote.
[6:08:08] » Commissioner Porter wants to change her
[6:08:10] vote on the renaming so that the vote
[6:08:11] reflects not a 41 but a 50 unanimous
[6:08:14] vote. Is there any objection? Seeing
[6:08:17] none, let the record reflect a 50
[6:08:19] unanimous vote in the renaming of the
[6:08:21] street in favor of the doctor's homes.
[6:08:23] We are on unagended speakers. Mr. Clerk,
[6:08:26] how many speakers do we have?
[6:08:27] » Have nine.
[6:08:28] » Nine speakers. Let's go.
[6:08:29] » First speaker, Bobby Nahome.
[6:08:33] followed by
[6:08:35] Michael Roano
[6:08:40] » Bobby, 576 East Call Street. I'm
[6:08:43] [clears throat] speaking to you all
[6:08:44] today about the need in our community
[6:08:45] for public access to tracks for running
[6:08:47] and exercise. Uh for many decades,
[6:08:50] Tallahassee residents had access to the
[6:08:52] tracks at our public high schools during
[6:08:54] evenings, weekends, and holidays when
[6:08:56] they're not being used for school
[6:08:57] activities, practices, or games. In
[6:09:00] 2020, the school district completely
[6:09:01] closed public access to these tracks.
[6:09:03] After lobbying the district, we got them
[6:09:05] to reopen the tracks in a limited
[6:09:08] capacity in 2023 and for a few months
[6:09:11] again in 2025. For almost an entire
[6:09:14] year, uh we had them reopened in 2025.
[6:09:17] However, this past June, the district
[6:09:19] once again closed public access. Our
[6:09:21] community now has no access to these
[6:09:23] tracks. This deprivives residents of
[6:09:25] safe places to exercise and young
[6:09:28] athletes of places to train for sports
[6:09:30] and athletic competitions outside of
[6:09:32] school hours. I along with others am
[6:09:34] once again working with the school board
[6:09:36] to find a permanent solution to reopen
[6:09:38] the tracks. The school board and
[6:09:40] superintendent have been receptive, but
[6:09:42] they have expressed that they could use
[6:09:44] help maintaining the tracks and
[6:09:45] bathrooms to accommodate public use. I
[6:09:48] believe it's time for the city of
[6:09:49] Tallahassee to partner with Leyon County
[6:09:51] Schools through a shared use agreement
[6:09:53] to help maintain these facilities and
[6:09:55] restore public access during designated
[6:09:58] hours when the tracks are not being used
[6:10:00] by the schools. Several schoolboard
[6:10:02] members and the superintendent are open
[6:10:03] to this idea and there is precedent for
[6:10:06] these shared use agreements. Florida
[6:10:08] statute 1013.101 101 passed in 2018 was
[6:10:12] specifically intended to encourage
[6:10:14] school districts and local governments
[6:10:16] to create shared use agreements to make
[6:10:18] outdoor school recreational facilities
[6:10:19] available to the public. Before the law
[6:10:22] was passed, a shared use task force was
[6:10:24] create was created to explore the
[6:10:26] benefits of local governments and school
[6:10:28] districts combining resources
[6:10:31] uh to make school facilities available
[6:10:32] to the public. The report became the
[6:10:34] basis for Florida statute 1013.101 101
[6:10:38] task force found that public access to
[6:10:40] the track can improve public health,
[6:10:42] help prevent vandalism by putting more
[6:10:44] people on school grounds during off
[6:10:46] hours, and conserve taxpayer dollars by
[6:10:49] preventing unnecessary duplication of
[6:10:51] facilities. This is relevant in our city
[6:10:54] here because we don't need to spend tax
[6:10:56] dollars on building more public tracks
[6:10:58] when we already have five high school
[6:10:59] tracks that sit vacant much of the time.
[6:11:02] It makes more sense for the city to work
[6:11:04] with the school district to make these
[6:11:05] existing facilities available to the
[6:11:07] public at designated hours. Florida
[6:11:10] statute 375.251
[6:11:12] provides liability protection for local
[6:11:14] governments and school districts that
[6:11:16] make recreational facilities available
[6:11:18] for public use. So liability associated
[6:11:20] with public use of these tracks is not
[6:11:22] an obstacle.
[6:11:23] » You're at 20 seconds remaining.
[6:11:24] » We had access to these tracks for
[6:11:26] decades and it worked. Presumably the
[6:11:28] city never built new tracks because we
[6:11:30] always had access. I'm asking for you
[6:11:32] all to work with Lyon County Schools to
[6:11:33] help restore public access to these
[6:11:35] tracks. Let's use the facilities we
[6:11:37] already have, save taxpayer dollars,
[6:11:39] promote public health, and give our
[6:11:41] community back the tracks that we were
[6:11:42] able to use for decades. Thank you.
[6:11:44] » Our next speaker, please.
[6:11:46] » Michael Roano.
[6:11:48] He'll be followed by uh Kim Okconor.
[6:11:50] » Name and address for the record, please.
[6:11:51] » My name is Michael Robano. Um 1325 West
[6:11:54] Thurp Street. Um hello. I came here to
[6:11:57] talk about football. um specifically
[6:11:59] game day traffic management by TPD.
[6:12:03] Um I'm a ride share driver, have been
[6:12:05] for a decade. I am in the trenches
[6:12:07] during game day when all this stuff
[6:12:09] happens.
[6:12:11] Um
[6:12:12] I'm specifically referring to traffic on
[6:12:14] game days and other events where TPD
[6:12:16] controls the flow of traffic. Currently,
[6:12:17] the game day's traffic situation is an
[6:12:19] unmititigated disaster. Closing roads
[6:12:22] down does not get people where they need
[6:12:24] to go. The same song and dance has been
[6:12:27] done for decades despite changing
[6:12:30] demographics. There are now thousands of
[6:12:31] people, thousands of people that live in
[6:12:33] that area in College Town. Shuffling
[6:12:36] everyone out to Appalache Parkway and
[6:12:38] closing all those roads makes no sense
[6:12:40] at all. People go to and from the game
[6:12:44] and cross
[6:12:46] the roads regularly and need to. The
[6:12:49] policy needs to be changed. It needs to
[6:12:50] be changed to where the roads are opened
[6:12:52] up and people are allowed to come in and
[6:12:54] out where they need to go. This would
[6:12:56] make it easier to get to and from the
[6:12:57] games. It would allow transportation. It
[6:12:59] would reduce the congestion that's
[6:13:01] created by TPD. It's it it's it's a
[6:13:05] problem that creates itself. There's a
[6:13:07] traffic jam that's coming into town from
[6:13:10] the people that are shuffled out to
[6:13:12] Appalache Parkway because they didn't
[6:13:13] get where they needed to go, right? They
[6:13:15] shut all these roads down. So now they
[6:13:16] go up. Well, now I'm out out on
[6:13:18] Appalachic Parkway, but I needed to
[6:13:19] really go to this hotel down here or
[6:13:20] whatever it is. So, we have a traffic
[6:13:23] jam coming into town and a traffic jam
[6:13:25] leaving town during game day because it
[6:13:28] makes no sense. And I go, "No, nobody
[6:13:30] talks about this. It's one of those
[6:13:31] things that's it's existed so long. I
[6:13:33] think people just do it because it's the
[6:13:35] thing that happens on game day, but it
[6:13:36] makes no sense. It makes no sense at
[6:13:38] all." Right? Right. So, it's just
[6:13:40] something I just wanted to bring up and
[6:13:42] hopefully, you know, people can just
[6:13:44] start talking about it because I don't
[6:13:46] think anybody talks about it. I think
[6:13:47] it's just something that's been done for
[6:13:48] so long and it makes no sense. Um,
[6:13:54] yeah. Yeah, that's pretty much it. I
[6:13:55] just wanted to see a re-evaluation and
[6:13:56] and again I mean I'm not even sure that
[6:13:58] you guys are the guys that talk about it
[6:14:00] but I think that you know it's a it's a
[6:14:02] partnership between the city TBD FSU
[6:14:05] um during game days um as part of a
[6:14:08] potential solution. I would think that
[6:14:11] um the real answer would not to be
[6:14:14] reduce the police presence but to
[6:14:16] instead of blocking roads off have
[6:14:18] police officers direct traffic as to
[6:14:21] where it needs to go. So instead of
[6:14:23] closing off lanes and arteries,
[6:14:25] » 30 seconds remain,
[6:14:26] » You have people shuffling that traffic
[6:14:28] to where it needs to go. Um,
[6:14:33] and again, I think you could do that
[6:14:35] with the exact same number of officers.
[6:14:36] I know you pull officers from literally
[6:14:38] counties from all over the place.
[6:14:39] Liberty Poke, Wacola, you name it. They
[6:14:41] come from all over just so they can
[6:14:43] stand on a road, twiddle their thumbs,
[6:14:44] and and nobody gets to go anywhere.
[6:14:47] » Um, hey, thanks a lot, guys. Our next
[6:14:50] speaker, please Kim O' Conor and then
[6:14:53] FA.
[6:15:04] Your name and address for the record,
[6:15:05] please.
[6:15:07] My name is Kim Okconor. I live at George
[6:15:11] Bell Dickinson. Uh here people giving
[6:15:15] their addresses, their zip code. I I
[6:15:17] didn't know that was sufficient, but I'm
[6:15:19] going to give my whole address because
[6:15:20] it's George Bell Dickinson, uh, 301 East
[6:15:24] Carolina Street, and I'm very proud to
[6:15:27] live there. I'm not as prepared as the
[6:15:30] two unagended speakers, but I will do my
[6:15:33] best, and it'll be over in three
[6:15:34] minutes. Um
[6:15:37] tomorrow,
[6:15:39] um Governor DeSantis has uh scheduled
[6:15:42] the uh 15th execution for 2026 of Daniel
[6:15:48] Conahan.
[6:15:50] Um in his first three years, he had zero
[6:15:54] executions. His next year, he had six.
[6:15:57] Next year after that, 2024, election
[6:16:00] year, had one. but he's been on a pair
[6:16:03] this last uh two years. 2025 as a record
[6:16:08] 19 and 2026. This will be number uh 15
[6:16:11] and it's only uh August. Um they on on
[6:16:17] September 1st they executed Harold Lucas
[6:16:22] and at the same time the governor was in
[6:16:27] Tampa at the Pepin Institute having a
[6:16:30] Republican fundraiser. I tried to find
[6:16:33] out what the cost they said it's similar
[6:16:35] to what they just had in Texas was
[6:16:37] 20,000 up but none of that is
[6:16:39] information. But while the execution is
[6:16:42] scheduled at 6 PM, he has a fundraiser
[6:16:44] in Tampa. Dantis, Byron Donald, Will
[6:16:47] Simpson,
[6:16:49] James Umeire, and Bla1 in Gouia. And so
[6:16:53] I just I have to just mostly speaking to
[6:16:56] the public out there, you know, that we
[6:16:59] do some things here at the Tallahassee
[6:17:00] Citizens Against the Death Penalty. Um
[6:17:03] at Good Sheeperd Church in the morning
[6:17:05] at 9:00 a.m. We'll have a program.
[6:17:08] That's 4665 Thomasville Road and then at
[6:17:11] 6 PM we gather at the governor's
[6:17:13] mansion. Um and he wasn't there on
[6:17:15] September 1st. We gather um so um and um
[6:17:21] we ring the bell. Beth brings the first
[6:17:23] Presbyterian bell and we bring it on
[6:17:25] every every name the um for the
[6:17:28] governor. So this be number 44.
[6:17:31] And um just this fundraiser thing in
[6:17:34] 2013, 13 years ago, September 10th, the
[6:17:38] same day, the anniversary of the day, I
[6:17:40] mean uh tomorrow's execution, the
[6:17:42] anniversary of the day that Pam Bondi
[6:17:44] got Rick Scott,
[6:17:46] » You have
[6:17:47] to um to reschedu u the execution of
[6:17:51] Marshall Lee Graves so she could have a
[6:17:53] fundraiser in Tampa. It's the only one
[6:17:55] I'm asking the commission but I am uh
[6:17:57] ask and then uh the next day September
[6:18:00] 11th citizens against Tallahassy
[6:18:02] citizens against death penalty will have
[6:18:04] a service of remembrance around the
[6:18:06] rotunda. I hope anybody out there
[6:18:09] anybody out there who would come and
[6:18:11] join us. I appreciate it so much. Thank
[6:18:13] you. Thank you and to be here to 10
[6:18:15] o'clock. I really appreciate you uh
[6:18:17] commissioners to the max.
[6:18:18] » Thank you. Our next speaker, please
[6:18:20] finet
[6:18:24] once, twice, uh,
[6:18:28] Carol.
[6:18:34] » Name and address for the record, please.
[6:18:37] » Uh, you already know. Uh, hey, this is
[6:18:39] Dar Alfred. I'm a resident at 814 West
[6:18:42] Tharp Street. I'm also a ride share
[6:18:44] driver, and I have some policy for that
[6:18:46] if you guys are interested in talking
[6:18:47] about it. It's on my site. Um, so
[6:18:50] Tallahassee has effectively created a
[6:18:52] charging desert for residents who drive
[6:18:54] Chattamo electric vehicles. You all got
[6:18:56] an email about it this past week. Uh, if
[6:18:59] you don't know what Chattamo is, it's
[6:19:00] one of the major DC fast charging plugs,
[6:19:02] most commonly used by Nissan Leafs and
[6:19:04] some earlier EVs. It's how my car fast
[6:19:07] charges. I've been driving mine since
[6:19:09] 2022. At the time, there was the promise
[6:19:12] of federal nevi funding that could cover
[6:19:13] up to 80% of new charging
[6:19:15] infrastructure. The Santis blocked it.
[6:19:18] Florida never really got it. So for four
[6:19:21] years, people like me have learned to
[6:19:23] walk or work around a limited network.
[6:19:25] Today, Tallahassee has roughly 40 CCS
[6:19:28] charging connections, about 52 Knax
[6:19:31] connections, and effectively one active
[6:19:33] Chattamo fast charger. I've driven 10
[6:19:36] hours, gotten back to Tallahassee, or
[6:19:38] gotten back gotten done at 4 in the
[6:19:40] morning and still couldn't go home
[6:19:42] because somebody else was charging. I've
[6:19:44] fallen asleep waiting. What should have
[6:19:46] been a 40-minute stop can turn into
[6:19:47] hours. Then recently, you guys opened
[6:19:50] the Cascades
[6:19:51] charging station with four fast chargers
[6:19:53] that work for my car. That was awesome.
[6:19:56] Leaf drivers cried tears of joy. I saw
[6:19:58] them because they were in my rearview
[6:20:00] mirror.
[6:20:02] Then just this past month, a maintenance
[6:20:04] crew came out. When they left, all four
[6:20:06] Chattamo connections were suddenly gone.
[6:20:08] Meanwhile, the state charger near the
[6:20:10] capital has been out because of
[6:20:11] construction and will be for the
[6:20:12] foreseeable future. Southwood is done.
[6:20:15] Uh Craft Nissan is the only single
[6:20:17] charger and it's private, so after hours
[6:20:19] you can't access it. So, someone coming
[6:20:22] in in Tallahassee late at night, working
[6:20:24] overnight like I have for years or
[6:20:26] living in an apartment without home
[6:20:27] charging can realistically find
[6:20:29] themselves with nowhere to go and
[6:20:30] stranded on the side of the road. This
[6:20:32] is what and what makes this worse is how
[6:20:35] the transition was handled. For a
[6:20:37] Chattamo driver, the answer is now
[6:20:38] basically go buy an adapter that costs
[6:20:40] around 800 bucks. A used, excuse me,
[6:20:43] that's backwards. A used Nissan Leaf is
[6:20:45] one of the most affordable ways for a
[6:20:46] working person to get into an electric
[6:20:48] car. Most people buying one don't have
[6:20:51] $800 sitting around to fix a problem
[6:20:53] they didn't create. I'm lucky to enough
[6:20:56] to have a regular outlet at home
[6:20:57] charging for 24 hours to get a full
[6:20:59] charge, guys. U but plenty of apartment
[6:21:02] residents don't even have that. So, my
[6:21:04] remedy is straightforward. restored
[6:21:06] Chattamo access at Cascades, whether
[6:21:08] that means restoring the Chattamo
[6:21:09] connections or providing compatible CCS
[6:21:11] to Chattamo adapters at the station. I'm
[6:21:14] not asking Tallahassee to stop
[6:21:15] modernizing. I'm asking to modernize
[6:21:17] without stranding people. If we're
[6:21:19] spending public money on transportation
[6:21:21] infrastructure, more people should be
[6:21:22] able to use it when we're done, not
[6:21:24] fewer. Um, the Tesla adapter to Cado is
[6:21:27] like 50 bucks. My adapter is 800 bucks
[6:21:30] and people like me can't afford it. Um,
[6:21:33] as far as while I have the little bit of
[6:21:34] time, 10 seconds, uh, we should have
[6:21:37] stations away from events, uh, you know,
[6:21:40] where Bajas is, at the fairgrounds, uh,
[6:21:44] the Governor's Square Mall where people
[6:21:45] can be diverted after events and not
[6:21:48] congest the center of town and create
[6:21:50] emergency problems.
[6:21:51] » Your time is up
[6:21:51] » In the center of town. Thank you. You
[6:21:53] two,
[6:21:53] » Next speaker, please.
[6:21:54] » Sean Thomas,
[6:21:57] then Lisa Sears.
[6:22:01] Name and address for the record, please.
[6:22:02] » Sean Thomas, 2113 Joiner Drive. Um, when
[6:22:06] I first wrote this, it was afternoon is
[6:22:08] now evening. Sorry for We've been here
[6:22:11] since now 10, so I know we're all tired.
[6:22:15] Um,
[6:22:17] my I I first wasn't going to do a agenda
[6:22:20] speaking item until I saw behavior on
[6:22:23] the commission that I thought I needed
[6:22:25] to point out. Um, so, Mayor Daly, let's
[6:22:28] start with you. Year after year, your
[6:22:31] colleagues, your colleagues on this very
[6:22:34] commission and outside groups have
[6:22:36] described the same pattern. Talking over
[6:22:38] women, belittling them in the chambers
[6:22:41] concerning the or cornering them in a
[6:22:43] hallway. You earned the nickname from
[6:22:45] me, and I hope it sticks. Daily, the
[6:22:47] king of mansplaining. That's not a
[6:22:50] punchline. It's what happens when
[6:22:52] someone with power treats with the woman
[6:22:54] on this commission like they're they're
[6:22:57] here to be managed instead of heard.
[6:22:59] That behavior doesn't play in this room.
[6:23:01] It sets the tone of how every
[6:23:03] department, every board, and every
[6:23:05] resident watching at home learns to
[6:23:07] treat each other and is the direct
[6:23:09] driver of the division in this city.
[6:23:12] Commissioner Williams Cox, first time in
[6:23:15] 8 years on this commission, you have
[6:23:16] achieved a runoff election that doesn't
[6:23:19] happen to someone the community feels is
[6:23:21] listening. You can rename Wanish Way,
[6:23:23] Pasco Street, West Carolina Street, and
[6:23:26] now push the four Virginia Street to
[6:23:29] four streets. And not one of those
[6:23:31] ribbon cutings fixes a pro a pothole,
[6:23:34] lowers a utility bill, or returns a
[6:23:36] resident's phone call. Streets are
[6:23:38] symbols. People need substance, and this
[6:23:41] runoff is the community telling you
[6:23:43] they've noticed the difference. You say
[6:23:45] we need to move forward about the city
[6:23:47] manager and that we have seen the city
[6:23:49] move forward. But under Mayor Daly,
[6:23:51] under your tenure and under Reese Code,
[6:23:53] we have seen a rise in robberies at gas
[6:23:55] stations. Block parties have to have TPD
[6:23:57] officers and drones to protect them from
[6:23:59] shootings. And city commission at city
[6:24:02] commission is urging churches to do a
[6:24:04] city hall's job. And commissioner
[6:24:08] Richardson, we've all heard it, quote
[6:24:10] unquote, I was born and raised on the
[6:24:12] south side. It's become a meme in this
[6:24:14] town because you reach for it every time
[6:24:16] your record gets questioned. As if
[6:24:18] geography excuses policy. It doesn't.
[6:24:21] The southside deserves a commissioner
[6:24:23] who fights for it with votes, not a
[6:24:25] hometown line recycled for cover while
[6:24:28] the public loses out.
[6:24:30] » You have 30 seconds.
[6:24:31] » Thank you. This dis sets the tone for
[6:24:33] the whole city. When residents watch a
[6:24:35] mayor talk down to his colleagues and
[6:24:37] commissioner dodge accountability
[6:24:39] accountability with a slogan and streets
[6:24:41] renamed while real problems sit
[6:24:42] untouched, they stop trusting each other
[6:24:45] and they stop trusting you. And that is
[6:24:47] how division gets manufactured in
[6:24:49] Tallahassee. Not by outsiders, not by
[6:24:52] Matlo, but by the conduct in this very
[6:24:55] room. We're asking you, or at least I
[6:24:57] am, treat each other with treat each
[6:24:59] other and with respect.
[6:25:01] » Thank you very much. Thank you so much.
[6:25:02] Take a seat. Our next speaker, please,
[6:25:04] » Lisa Sears.
[6:25:06] » Lisa Sears will be followed by Adila
[6:25:09] Pierre.
[6:25:12] » My name is Lisa Sears. 32303.
[6:25:16] Um, due to work, I wasn't able to arrive
[6:25:18] here until after the city manager topic.
[6:25:22] And when I got here and I was told what
[6:25:25] happened, I was in shock.
[6:25:28] I was like, "No, that can't be. That's
[6:25:30] ridiculous. what do they make up a new
[6:25:32] rule? And honestly, it is mind-boggling
[6:25:36] to me. And I was explained really
[6:25:40] briefly with the reason why y'all use
[6:25:42] that. It It doesn't make sense still.
[6:25:46] And to me,
[6:25:48] I am my truth is that to me that was
[6:25:53] very weak. That was like trying to hold
[6:25:56] on to power and make sure that the 32
[6:25:59] didn't go the other way on that
[6:26:01] particular person that you're putting
[6:26:03] there. And I'm not saying I don't like
[6:26:06] her. I don't know her. I hope that she's
[6:26:08] great, you know, and I hope that they
[6:26:10] work good with the new dynamics coming
[6:26:13] into town. But seriously, I I felt I
[6:26:18] needed to express my feelings as a
[6:26:20] citizen. That was disappointing. Our
[6:26:25] next speaker, please.
[6:26:26] » Delila Pierre is our final speaker.
[6:26:29] » Name and address for the record, please.
[6:26:32] » Delila Pierre, member of the Tahassee
[6:26:34] Alliance Against Racism Political
[6:26:35] Repression. Address exempt. I'm here to
[6:26:38] speak on behalf of the Tallahassee
[6:26:40] Students for a Democratic Society, a
[6:26:42] local organization um at FSU um that is
[6:26:46] being repressed by Florida State
[6:26:48] University um and has continued to be
[6:26:50] repressed by Florida State University
[6:26:52] for using their First Amendment rights.
[6:26:54] Um organizing is not a crime. The right
[6:26:57] to protest is not a crime. The right to
[6:27:00] speak out against injustice is not a
[6:27:01] crime, no matter how much you like it or
[6:27:03] don't like it. And time and time again,
[6:27:05] Florida State University has proven that
[6:27:07] they do see the right to organize as a
[6:27:10] crime. They criminalize and repress
[6:27:11] protesters. And now Florida State
[6:27:14] University students JJ Gluick and Kaden
[6:27:17] Rosa face the potential of having, you
[6:27:20] know, of being kicked off their own
[6:27:22] campus for doing nothing more than
[6:27:23] organizing against rape culture on
[6:27:25] campus. Florida State University claims
[6:27:28] that the real reason that this is
[6:27:29] happening is because they quote unquote
[6:27:33] harassed a member of campus, but this
[6:27:34] isn't what's happened. Florida State
[6:27:36] University students JJ Glue and Kaden
[6:27:39] Rosa are fighting for justice. They are
[6:27:42] organizers in our community who have
[6:27:45] fought side by side to see improvements
[6:27:47] in their school, in the lives of people
[6:27:49] in their schools. Meanwhile, Florida
[6:27:51] State University continues to suck up
[6:27:53] more of the resources, energy, and life
[6:27:56] of our city. They act like there's
[6:27:58] nothing that can get them in trouble.
[6:28:00] They act like they're invincible. And
[6:28:01] that's because they are treated like
[6:28:03] they are invincible. That's because our
[6:28:04] city commission constantly bends over
[6:28:06] backwards to give more funding, more
[6:28:08] money, and more resources to Florida
[6:28:11] State University. While Tallahassee
[6:28:14] students and Tallahassee residents
[6:28:15] starve, we lack access to the same
[6:28:17] qualities, the same health care, the
[6:28:20] same affordable rights, the same things
[6:28:22] that can essentially help people in the
[6:28:24] city live and thrive. So, I'm going to
[6:28:26] say specifically to commissioners Porter
[6:28:28] and Matt Low as commissioners who I
[6:28:30] think are on a more progressive trend in
[6:28:33] the city who have shown that they're
[6:28:34] more willing to stand for more
[6:28:36] substantive policy in the city. Speak
[6:28:38] out publicly in favor of these two
[6:28:41] students who are being repressed by
[6:28:42] Florida State University. This
[6:28:44] repression of the right to organize
[6:28:45] affects all of us and affects you as
[6:28:47] well because we know that Ronda Santz,
[6:28:50] that Trump, that the other reactionaries
[6:28:52] in power in our country are not just
[6:28:54] going to start with targeting student
[6:28:56] activism and end there. They're not just
[6:28:58] going to target community activists.
[6:28:59] They're not just going to target people
[6:29:00] who are fighting on the streets. They're
[6:29:02] going to target politicians as well.
[6:29:04] They're going to use their power to
[6:29:05] partisanly attack whoever they can. And
[6:29:08] if you don't stand with JJ and Kaden,
[6:29:11] they can't stand with you. But if you do
[6:29:13] stand with the people and stand against
[6:29:16] the attacks that we're seeing from
[6:29:17] Dantis and the Trump administration and
[6:29:19] Florida State University against
[6:29:21] students doing nothing more than
[6:29:23] fighting for their right to free speech,
[6:29:24] then we will stand with you. For the
[6:29:26] rest of you, I expect nothing. Let's
[6:29:29] continue to organize and fight for
[6:29:30] justice in our city and our community.
[6:29:32] Florida State University does not
[6:29:34] determine who has the right to speak.
[6:29:36] The students do.
[6:29:39] » The [applause] next speaker, please. I
[6:29:41] have no further speakers.
[6:29:42] » All right, we're on sharing of ideas. I
[6:29:44] got nothing. Mayor Pro Tim, Commissioner
[6:29:47] William Cox, Commissioner Matlo.
[6:29:49] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. If I can just
[6:29:50] address the three issues uh from public
[6:29:53] speakers um on the track uses uh with
[6:29:57] Leyon County Schools. It was mentioned I
[6:29:59] guess the tracks have been shut down to
[6:30:00] the general public. Uh my personal
[6:30:03] opinion is the school board and
[6:30:05] superintendent are asking us to renew a
[6:30:07] property tax to go into infrastructure.
[6:30:09] we all pay into that and those should be
[6:30:11] accessible to the public within reason,
[6:30:13] but I'm open to the idea of a shared use
[6:30:15] agreement within reason to allow access
[6:30:17] to the tracks again um for for city
[6:30:20] residents. Uh so I'd like to move we
[6:30:22] bring back an item um just contemplating
[6:30:24] the idea of a shared use agreement with
[6:30:26] Leyon County Schools to open the tracks.
[6:30:28] » Motion on the table uh to enter into an
[6:30:32] agreement with Leyon County Schools um
[6:30:36] for shared use agreement for their
[6:30:37] track. Is there a second to the motion?
[6:30:39] » I'll second the motion, but a point of
[6:30:41] clarification. It was I understood the
[6:30:43] motion to be to have an item come back,
[6:30:45] not to enter into a joint use agreement.
[6:30:47] » Yeah. To have an item come back. Okay. I
[6:30:49] I will respectfully definitely not be
[6:30:51] supporting this motion. That is Leon
[6:30:53] County School property. It should be
[6:30:55] open to the public and the fact that
[6:30:57] they are coming to us and they want us
[6:30:59] to pay to have their track open for
[6:31:02] public use.
[6:31:03] » Uh we concentrate on our parks and
[6:31:06] recreation. We have a joint use
[6:31:07] agreement for when we operate like Taly
[6:31:10] Parks and Recreation for like football
[6:31:11] and stuff and that's a very successful
[6:31:14] agreement at work. But for the shared
[6:31:16] use of just maintaining their facility
[6:31:19] for the track, I I can't go there. I I'm
[6:31:21] not interested. That's their
[6:31:23] responsibility and they need to take
[6:31:25] care of business. Uh Commissioner
[6:31:27] Williams Cox.
[6:31:29] » Um and I I'll say this, I've said this
[6:31:33] many times before. We have an agreement
[6:31:35] with Leon with Leyon County Schools for
[6:31:37] utilities. They owe us a million
[6:31:39] dollars. We haven't gotten it. So, I
[6:31:42] don't see how
[6:31:43] » Yeah, for fire. I don't see how um doing
[6:31:47] this type of agreement or having staff
[6:31:48] spend time with this knowing that we've
[6:31:51] got something with some real money on
[6:31:52] the line and they have not they told us
[6:31:55] they're not going to do it. So, I don't
[6:31:57] I just don't see where we have leeway to
[6:32:00] do to to do that. and having um gone to
[6:32:03] the school board in the past many many
[6:32:05] times to try to get a new high school
[6:32:06] built on the south side of Tallahassee
[6:32:09] um and it it didn't happen and and for
[6:32:11] many reasons. I just don't see where
[6:32:14] energy needs to be spent in doing that.
[6:32:16] Now, of course, if we have the city has
[6:32:19] u some facilities that can that are open
[6:32:22] to the public, we can direct folks there
[6:32:24] to to to get their exercise in. But I
[6:32:27] just don't think we need to be dipping
[6:32:29] into another uh governmental entity's uh
[6:32:31] business, especially owe us a million
[6:32:33] dollars.
[6:32:34] » So uh motion on the table made by
[6:32:36] Commissioner Matlo, second by
[6:32:37] Commissioner Porter to bring back an
[6:32:38] agenda item exploring the expansion of
[6:32:40] the shared use agreement to include
[6:32:42] public school tracks. All those in favor
[6:32:45] signify by I'm sorry, Mayor Pro Tim.
[6:32:48] Yeah. You know, just earlier tonight, we
[6:32:51] passed an increase in our millage rate
[6:32:54] and and a budget for the next fiscal
[6:32:57] year.
[6:32:58] » Nope. We
[6:32:59] » Level millage rate, but it was an
[6:33:01] increase in the budget
[6:33:02] » In in the budget. And so now we're
[6:33:05] talking about additional expense when we
[6:33:09] don't know what amendment three is going
[6:33:11] to look like. Correct. That
[6:33:13] » Could could cost us money. schools are
[6:33:16] exempt from the provisions of that
[6:33:18] amendment.
[6:33:20] » And uh I I just can't see us at this
[6:33:23] point agreeing to pay the expenses
[6:33:27] um to to have those facilities available
[6:33:31] to the public. I I think it's a
[6:33:33] responsibility of the school district
[6:33:36] and they should find the funds to uh to
[6:33:42] make those facilities available to the
[6:33:45] public as they have in the past.
[6:33:48] » Yeah. All those in favor of the motion
[6:33:49] on the table. Uh Commissioner Porter.
[6:33:51] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I I'll just add
[6:33:53] that we don't really know what it would
[6:33:55] cost and so that's why I support support
[6:33:59] this motion. I for it to come back to
[6:34:01] us.
[6:34:02] » All those in favor of something.
[6:34:04] » Commissioner Matlo.
[6:34:05] » Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. And so just for
[6:34:06] clarification, what public tracks are
[6:34:09] available through the city of
[6:34:11] Tallahassee to city of Tallahassee
[6:34:12] residents? Mr. Mander,
[6:34:15] Mr.
[6:34:16] » Mayor, I don't I don't know. I I'd have
[6:34:18] to get information on that. I could
[6:34:20] » I I don't believe there are any city
[6:34:21] tracks.
[6:34:22] » Uh well, we got Cascades Park, which is
[6:34:24] a 3.2 mile track around the holding
[6:34:26] facility. It's not the traditional track
[6:34:28] of what you're thinking of of track and
[6:34:30] field. We also maintain how many
[6:34:33] hundreds of miles of greenways and
[6:34:35] trails and
[6:34:36] » In the city it's over 70 miles
[6:34:38] » 70 miles and then including with the
[6:34:40] county
[6:34:41] » We have more much more
[6:34:43] » And we have and we have parks. I mean,
[6:34:45] you are correct. We do not uh to my
[6:34:47] knowledge operate the traditional track
[6:34:50] » That a high school does, but we do offer
[6:34:54] plenty of municipal facilities to be
[6:34:56] able to get out, run, and get exercise.
[6:34:58] Again, I strongly believe it is a county
[6:35:00] facility. The the I mean the schoolboard
[6:35:03] facility, the school board needs to find
[6:35:05] a way through their budget to keep their
[6:35:08] facility open and we do not need to be
[6:35:11] maintaining their tracks. Period. Okay,
[6:35:14] motion on the table. All those in favor
[6:35:16] of the motion signify by saying I. I. I.
[6:35:18] » All those opposed. I. And it fails. Two
[6:35:20] to three. With the mayor, mayor pro Tim
[6:35:22] and commissioner Williams Cox and
[6:35:24] descent. Commissioner Matlo and
[6:35:25] Commissioner Porter in favor.
[6:35:26] Commissioner Matlo, you have the floor.
[6:35:28] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So then I'd like
[6:35:29] to move that we bring back an agenda
[6:35:31] item uh outlining the public facilities
[6:35:34] available for track and field to the
[6:35:37] city Tallahassee residents.
[6:35:39] » Second.
[6:35:40] » Sure. Uh, isn't that part of the annual
[6:35:43] report that we produce every year
[6:35:45] through parks and recreation? What we
[6:35:46] maintain?
[6:35:50] » Yeah, I I believe the commissioner just
[6:35:52] said track and field and I think I think
[6:35:54] y'all just established that we don't do
[6:35:56] track and field. Maybe I'm
[6:35:57] misunderstanding the question.
[6:35:59] » We have walking and track and field
[6:36:02] being distinct, I guess.
[6:36:04] » Is that the question?
[6:36:05] » Yeah. I mean, the mayor's assertion was
[6:36:06] that there's plenty of ways to engage in
[6:36:08] that activity. So, I mean, we can
[6:36:10] outline the difference between track and
[6:36:11] field tracks that are available, what it
[6:36:13] would take to create a track for the
[6:36:15] cost to create a track for city of
[6:36:16] Tallahassee residents. Um, an idea of
[6:36:19] what that would cost if we wanted to add
[6:36:21] that into the budget.
[6:36:24] Okay. motion on the table to uh bring
[6:36:27] back an item to explore the opportunity
[6:36:28] of I I don't even want to go down this
[6:36:30] road to be quite honest with you at this
[6:36:32] point with uh trying to build a tracking
[6:36:35] facility
[6:36:37] when we have such a tight budget and
[6:36:38] amendment three is coming down the pipe.
[6:36:41] I just don't know if it's
[6:36:43] worth using staff time to track that. If
[6:36:46] you if you want just a list of the parks
[6:36:48] and recck facilities, we have that on
[6:36:50] the website and then the annual report.
[6:36:52] We do not have a traditional track in
[6:36:56] the sense of what the schools are
[6:36:58] operating. So outside of exploring the
[6:37:01] creation of a track that is municipally
[6:37:04] owned and operated,
[6:37:06] the information's there. Commissioner
[6:37:08] Matlo, it could all be provided in
[6:37:11] agenda item. That's the motion.
[6:37:12] » Okay.
[6:37:13] » What was the motion? Could you restate
[6:37:14] the motion? uh to bring back an uh
[6:37:17] agenda item illustrating track and field
[6:37:20] opportunities for city of Tallahassee uh
[6:37:23] residents and field facilities that are
[6:37:24] operated for that.
[6:37:26] » Okay, that activity.
[6:37:27] » All those in favor of the motion on the
[6:37:28] table signify by saying I
[6:37:29] » I.
[6:37:30] » All those opposed. I
[6:37:31] » Motion fails two to three with the
[6:37:33] mayor, mayor proim and commissioner
[6:37:34] Williams Cox and descent commissioner
[6:37:36] Williams Cox point. I I I think it's an
[6:37:38] easy list to provide.
[6:37:40] » Yeah. I mean online
[6:37:42] » I wouldn't want to spend staff time
[6:37:44] doing what we could do.
[6:37:45] » Correct. Correct. Commissioner Matley,
[6:37:47] you have the floor.
[6:37:48] » Uh thank you. Um I know game day traffic
[6:37:51] routes was mentioned and it's changed a
[6:37:53] million times over over my life. I don't
[6:37:56] pretend to understand the different
[6:37:57] reasonings for that, but if staff could
[6:37:58] just provide an update um by email of
[6:38:01] the traffic patterns, how they're
[6:38:03] measured, their efficiencies are are are
[6:38:06] measured just for better understanding.
[6:38:09] So, um, am I correct in assuming that
[6:38:13] it's actually Florida State University
[6:38:14] that contracts with Talis Police
[6:38:17] Department and all the other agencies
[6:38:19] for game day traffic because every year
[6:38:22] that's a big contract negotiation that
[6:38:24] goes through. So, Florida State would be
[6:38:26] the point person on the traffic patterns
[6:38:30] per se. I
[6:38:31] » No, I I Mr. Mayor, you're right. So the
[6:38:34] TPD provides a little over 100 officers,
[6:38:37] but it takes much more than that.
[6:38:39] » Sure.
[6:38:39] » So FSU contracts with TPD and the other
[6:38:42] agencies. Sheriff's office does
[6:38:44] different functions.
[6:38:46] » Um the traffic management I do believe
[6:38:49] TPD um can provide the details that of
[6:38:52] the flow of traffic kind of where the
[6:38:54] streets are blocked and those kind of
[6:38:56] things. It's manned and operated by a
[6:38:58] collection of officers, you know, that's
[6:39:02] through FSU. But but I I do believe that
[6:39:05] TPD could provide the the flow of
[6:39:06] traffic pattern.
[6:39:08] » Okay. If that helps.
[6:39:11] » For the record, I am comfortable with my
[6:39:13] pattern in and out and I park at the
[6:39:15] Southern Scholarship Foundation. I don't
[6:39:17] have any special parking or anything. Uh
[6:39:19] but you want to have a briefing on the
[6:39:22] traffic pattern of game day. Yeah, it
[6:39:24] can just be an email of
[6:39:25] » Oh, an email or how it was decided uh
[6:39:29] what the implications are, the
[6:39:30] efficiencies of it. Just those
[6:39:32] questions.
[6:39:32] » That'd be helpful. I'm not familiar with
[6:39:34] the ride share spots and and how they
[6:39:36] coordinate that. I'd be curious on that
[6:39:38] as well. Commissioner Williams,
[6:39:39] » On that on point there, I think it needs
[6:39:41] to be also considered by everybody that
[6:39:45] it is not a good idea to have two games
[6:39:49] on the same day at the same time.
[6:39:52] That is where the problem is. Many times
[6:39:55] it stretches our law enforcement. I
[6:39:58] don't care what kind of traffic plans
[6:39:59] you may have. But when you're trying to
[6:40:01] manage FAMU and FSU uh football games at
[6:40:04] the same time and understand it's going
[6:40:05] to happen another time this this season.
[6:40:08] » So if we just buckle up buttercup
[6:40:10] » And because it's it's it's it's not
[6:40:13] good. It's really not good. So getting
[6:40:15] that information would be good, but I
[6:40:16] don't know how what it's going to do.
[6:40:19] » We will have it. Do do do do do do do do
[6:40:21] do do do do do do do do do do do do do
[6:40:21] do do do do do do do do do do do do do
[6:40:21] do do do do do do do do you need an
[6:40:21] email I mean do you need motion for an
[6:40:23] email we'll we'll email
[6:40:26] » Send us Yeah.
[6:40:27] » Okay. All right. Sounds good.
[6:40:28] Commissioner Mer you have the floor.
[6:40:29] » Uh thank you. And and the final speaker
[6:40:31] mentioned the change in the chargers for
[6:40:33] Nissan Leafs.
[6:40:35] Have we changed those or how?
[6:40:38] We'll we'll look at that. That was an
[6:40:40] interesting comment he had. He has an
[6:40:42] old style charger. I think that was
[6:40:44] understood from his description.
[6:40:47] the chargers we put in at Cascades had
[6:40:49] that older plug and had been upgraded to
[6:40:51] the more current plug
[6:40:53] » Because of demand.
[6:40:54] » We just the way the cars are. I think I
[6:40:57] think what you heard him describe was he
[6:40:59] has a Nissan Leaf that has a very
[6:41:00] specific one, but we'll take a look at
[6:41:02] it. I think that was a good comment in
[6:41:03] terms of availability in terms of the
[6:41:05] stations we have because we've got the
[6:41:07] one um uh at Van Beern and we're
[6:41:11] building the one on Orange Avenue. So,
[6:41:13] um we'll see what we can do. I don't I
[6:41:16] don't know how that works, right? The
[6:41:17] adapter, but we'll certainly look into
[6:41:20] that. Okay. Uh, thank you, Mr. Mayor.
[6:41:22] Nothing further,
[6:41:23] » Mr. Porter.
[6:41:24] » Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I just have one
[6:41:26] item.
[6:41:28] Um,
[6:41:29] I would like to make a motion, and I'm
[6:41:31] not sure exactly
[6:41:34] the best way to do this, but that we I
[6:41:36] think it's important that we do
[6:41:38] something to recognize the historic
[6:41:40] significance of West Virginia Street um,
[6:41:44] and Frenchtown as a safe haven for black
[6:41:46] travelers. I think that was something
[6:41:47] that seemed important to the people
[6:41:49] there. Um, and for the record, I spoke
[6:41:51] to Reverend Holmes and he would have
[6:41:54] happily accepted the Bernau Street
[6:41:55] renaming. Um but since we didn't go in
[6:41:59] that direction, I think it would be
[6:42:00] important um if there is a way to to
[6:42:04] preserve that history that we that we
[6:42:07] do. So so whether I don't know what what
[6:42:10] options there are, but that would
[6:42:12] » I don't know if there's any insight from
[6:42:14] the the manager.
[6:42:16] » I would second that motion. that I did
[6:42:17] have some follow-up conversation um with
[6:42:20] u Miss Miss Daryl Scott and with Miss
[6:42:23] Maisha Mitchell
[6:42:24] » And uh offered the possibility of having
[6:42:27] um um something that that says formerly
[6:42:31] known as as well as having a marker that
[6:42:34] would identify all of the those
[6:42:36] historical uh businesses or entities
[6:42:39] that were there on on that on those
[6:42:41] streets.
[6:42:42] » All those in favor of the motion on the
[6:42:43] table signify by saying I. All those
[6:42:46] opposed passes unanimously. Commissioner
[6:42:48] Porter, you have the floor.
[6:42:49] » Thank you. That's all for me.
[6:42:50] » We stand ajourned.