[0:02] Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. I'd
like to welcome you to our regularly
[0:06] scheduled meeting of the council of the
municipality of Temp Center. The day is
[0:11] Monday, July the 20th, 2026
and the time is just sneaking up to 5:00
[0:19] p.m. and I would like to call this
meeting to order.
[0:23] Uh there are no adjust additions to the
agenda that I'm aware of. Um, so a uh an
[0:31] approval of the minutes or the agenda as
circulated from the members of council.
[0:36] Uh, a mover and a second. Moved by
councelor Heman and seconded by
[0:41] councelor Locki. All in favor? And that
carries.
[0:49] Any disclosure of pecunary interest from
the members of council?
[0:57] » Yep. Your worship. uh 7.1 um because I
work for advanced drainage systems as a
[1:02] director of finance and um there's
potential benefits. So I'll declare a
[1:07] cont conflict of interest on that one.
>> And councelor Hman,
[1:11] » I'd like to declare an indirect conflict
of interest with uh item 6.2
[1:17] as I'm employed by licensed alcohol
manufacturer.
[1:23] » Thank you. Any announcements that the
members of council would like to make? I
[1:29] don't have one this evening. No. Okay.
[1:38] So at this time we do have a uh
delegation presentation from Strathroy
[1:44] Hospice uh fundraising for a new
facility and um Darren Mala vice chair
[1:51] of Strathroy Hospice is in attendance to
present. So if you would like to come
[1:57] ahead whenever you're ready just come to
the stand there. Yeah, you can stand at
[2:02] the podum if you like or you can use the
the uh the desk there. Your choice.
[2:10] Okay.
And for the microphone, right, just push
[2:15] in the center till it it turns red and
you're good to go.
[2:18] » Perfect.
>> Thanks. Go ahead.
[2:21] » Thank you very much and good evening. Um
um mayor and members of council. Um my
[2:26] name is Darren McCall. I am the I'm very
proud to say I am the vice chair of
[2:30] Strathroy Hospice. Um we we have been uh
working um for a hospice in our
[2:37] community uh for a couple years now. Um
and I'm here today because um I want to
[2:44] make something very clear right up from
the front and that is although Stthroy
[2:48] Hospice is the name of our charity, we
are not Strawy's Hospice. We are um we
[2:54] want to be the hospice for the county
and we want to be the the the first
[2:58] hospice in hopes that um uh places like
Temp Center uh will also have a hospice
[3:04] one day to help with your community in
this area as well and be used as a
[3:09] roadmap. Um, so tonight I'd like to
share with you um our project and how
[3:15] it's important uh to again to not only
um our community but the county as a
[3:20] whole um and where we are today.
[3:31] So currently there are no residential
hospices in the county. um as we as you
[3:36] know there obviously London being your
your closest or Woodstock uh uh from
[3:40] here. So when families reach a point
where hospice is needed uh they often
[3:44] have very few choices. Many are faced to
travel outside the county remain in
[3:49] acute hospital beds enter long-term care
homes or try to manage complex care at
[3:55] home. And these are some of the most
difficult times in famil family's lives.
[3:59] Residents of Middle Sex County deserve
the same opportunity to receive
[4:02] compassionate end of life care close to
home as residents in neighboring
[4:05] communities. The need for hospice
continues to grow. Our population, as
[4:10] you all know, is are aging. More
residents are living longer with
[4:14] illnesses such as um cancer, heart
disease, COPD, dementia, and
[4:21] neurological diseases.
[4:27] So hospicees hospice care strengthens
our health care system. Patients no
[4:32] longer uh require hospital treatment can
receive specialized comfort focused care
[4:37] in a homelike environment. That means
better use of hospital beds, few
[4:42] emergency visits, reduce health care
costs, and better outcomes for the
[4:47] patients and their families. Hospice
complements hospitals and long-term
[4:52] care. They're not to replace them.
Uh, as a side note, I um long-term care
[4:58] was my career for over 32 years. In
fact, I actually wanted uh a long-term
[5:04] care home in uh the Dorchester area back
when Strathmir Lodge County home was uh
[5:10] being rebuilt and asked why not have two
and have one for this side of the
[5:14] county. But unfortunately, that didn't
happen. But I'm hoping that today and
[5:19] moving on that healthc care we can make
some differences because the county is
[5:23] where I've I've been most in my career
and my life and I want to be able to see
[5:27] this flourish.
Next slide please. So who will our
[5:33] hospice serve? Although we are currently
as I mentioned Strathroy this is going
[5:37] to serve um the county. Now I understand
and I respect the fact that um you know
[5:42] you're probably a good uh 45 minutes
away from Strathroy Keradok area where
[5:47] our hospice is being located but again I
want to make it very clear that
[5:51] hopefully this would be a road map and a
stepping stone so that we can get um uh
[5:56] a hospice in other parts of the county
and I'll get to that in a little bit.
[6:02] So our hospice will serve uh residents
throughout the county. uh families
[6:06] shouldn't have to leave their community
just to receive compassionate care. and
[6:09] the map on I think on the next slide
um coming uh the map actually I'll show
[6:15] you in a minute we'll uh we'll show you
the different regions but this slide
[6:19] here shows us and we are the number one
there from Middle Sex London um you see
[6:24] the red we have uh been noticed in 2024
that there was a hospice gap of 38 beds
[6:32] for the London Middle Sex area that has
now increased to 48 beds 10 beds are
[6:39] slated to come into London. So then that
leaves us with the 38 for the county and
[6:44] we're looking for five beds for our
hospice. So 33 beds will be the balance
[6:49] of what is needed in the county. Um so
again as I as I've been saying that the
[6:55] need is certainly going to be there to
have a hospicees in in different parts
[6:59] of of Middle Sex County.
[7:05] Next slide please.
So
[7:09] what we want to do here is is provide
the the gap um of at least five beds.
[7:15] Now the five beds that we've applied
for, we've applied for an expression of
[7:19] interest back in October of 2024. Um we
are still working with the ministry to
[7:25] um to get us those beds. But there are
other ways um avenues that to be able to
[7:29] open a hospice without um getting
official grants from from the Ministry
[7:34] of Health. Um so those are the things
that we are constantly working at. Uh
[7:38] right now we are uh in the process and
um u madame mayor you'll be um on county
[7:44] council uh we'll be there um asking for
support at county council because um
[7:49] we've had Strathroy Kerok has approved
um um us to move forward and designate a
[7:57] portion of our agricultural land that is
being donated by one of our associate
[8:02] members um to the hospice and u we're
looking at having that change from
[8:07] agricultural AL to institutional um
which was a big hurdle for us and uh
[8:11] we're hoping that uh county council will
also u give us their blessings and we
[8:16] can move forward with this project.
Next slide.
[8:22] » I'd like to share with you um if you
don't mind a story that one of our board
[8:26] members um had to deal with herself
personally and this started eight years
[8:30] ago and was the one of the main reasons
that we spearheaded this um this project
[8:35] for Strathro Hospice.
[8:44] My family holds hospice very near and
dear to our hearts. During a time of
[8:50] profound sadness, hospice gave us peace
and strength. In Rick's final days, we
[8:57] were able to focus on Rick and each
other and not be consumed with trying to
[9:02] manage his care and pain.
Rick wanted to die at home.
[9:08] Unfortunately, our family home, as like
most homes, was not suited for a
[9:14] hospital bed and all medical equipment
that Rick would require.
[9:19] During conversations with our children,
we all wanted to keep the memories of
[9:24] their childhood home happy.
When we all came to the decision to make
[9:29] hospice our choice, we were not able to
get Rick into the closest hospice which
[9:34] was in London. Our next option was
either Kitchener or Waterloo or Windsor.
[9:41] We qualified for these out of area
hospices only because we had extended
[9:46] family in these areas. But this meant we
would have to leave our own community of
[9:51] Strathroy. We had no choice. And the day
we got the call to go to Leard Hospice
[9:57] in Cambridge, we left. When we arrived
at hospice, we were greeted by such a
[10:03] beautiful setting, a homelike
environment with medical palletive staff
[10:08] and volunteers who cared for Rick and
all his family. The staff and volunteers
[10:14] at hospice are angels that walk among
us. I truly believe this. Because of my
[10:20] family's hospice experience, my sister
and brother-in-law both now volunteer.
[10:27] I remember the hospice doctor telling
me, "Mrs. Steffler, we will not win this
[10:32] war, but we will win the battle of
pain." He told me, "Brick's pain was
[10:38] coming from multiple areas, and we would
treat all the areas differently." Within
[10:44] 15 minutes of arriving at hospice,
Rick's pain was finally under control.
[10:49] He never experienced another horrific
pain crisis again. In Rick's final days,
[10:56] we never had to leave his side. Hospice
was set up for whatever any of us
[11:02] needed.
Rick passed away peacefully in a
[11:05] beautiful sun room, surrounded by his
family, just like he wanted, in a
[11:11] homelike setting, not cramped in a
hospital ward. Our family will be
[11:16] forever grateful and changed by our
hospice experience.
[11:20] It is our hope and dream that hospice
will one day be available for all
[11:25] Strathroy area residents who need it.
[11:37] So again, no family in Middle Sex County
should have to make a journey outside of
[11:42] their community and that's our focus.
[11:49] Next slide, please.
[11:54] Oh, that's okay.
[12:01] I can go ahead and continue. So this
project has made tremendous progress. Uh
[12:05] we've received letters of support from
variety of healthc care uh uh leaders
[12:10] across our region which is um it is a
must for us to be able to have those
[12:15] recommendations to receive our hospice
from the ministry hospice beds from the
[12:19] ministry of health. um and include these
hospice uh or sorry these healthcare
[12:24] leaders are Middle Sex Ontario Health,
Sarnia Lamp, Ontario Health Team,
[12:28] Ontario Health at Home, Middle Sex
Hospital Alliance. These organizations
[12:33] recognize that the hospice is missing an
essential piece of healthcare in our
[12:37] county. Their support also strength
strengthens our ministry of health
[12:40] application. This project is no longer
just an idea. It is well supported by
[12:45] healthcare initiatives that is moving
forward.
[12:49] amount raised to date. As of today,
we've raised over $ 1.55 million. And
[12:54] this is due to the incredible support
that we've received, not just from
[12:57] Strathroy Kerodok, but from many
surrounding communities.
[13:02] Our vision, um,
that's okay. No worries. Our vision is
[13:08] to build approximately 8,000 square foot
home. And I want to say a home because
[13:13] it's going to look just like a home. We
don't want it to look like an
[13:16] institution um or or life scene looks
like almost like a community center. We
[13:22] want it to look like you're walking into
a nice beautiful home. Um each of the
[13:26] rooms will be private rooms with an
adjoining area for family, extended
[13:30] family to to be a part of. Um each of
those rooms will be open with a double
[13:36] set doors that lead out to a walkway and
the walkway will lead you to the pond.
[13:41] Um this beautiful um uh property that is
being donated um sits amongst um rural
[13:49] part of the area um where you're
surrounded by trees and nature and it is
[13:54] the perfect place to be able to um um
enjoy the you know enjoy the peace and
[14:00] the quiet and just be in touch with your
family and friends.
[14:04] Um, we will also include comfortable
family spaces, reflection gardens,
[14:08] peaceful outdoor areas, access to the
beautiful pond, as I mentioned, and care
[14:13] that supports physical, emotional, and
spiritual needs. We're also making um uh
[14:18] an a major effort to um to tie in our
Aboriginal communities as well because
[14:23] there is a a gap um for for their
communities and we want to make sure
[14:27] that we look after um their needs as
well. So this hospice will become a
[14:33] lasting legacy of compassion for our
community and other communities in the
[14:38] county.
[14:41] » So luck
that's all right. Um I was going to
[14:47] introduce this to the board, but that's
all right. U our board consists of um uh
[14:51] different um different professions such
as healthcare uh like myself and uh Dr.
[14:58] for Tyler Damon, who's our um uh board
me board chair. Uh he's also a
[15:03] chiropractor, accountants, um uh funeral
home um staff. So, it's it's a
[15:10] well-versed uh group of individuals with
a common goal.
[15:15] This one, if you can go back one slide,
if you don't mind. So, this here um uh
[15:20] gives you an idea of what the uh the
concept that we have looks like. The
[15:25] yellow boxed area is approximately five
acres out of the 100 acres um that is
[15:31] being donated. So the the farm will
still be intact uh with about 95
[15:36] workable uh acres on their farm.
[15:43] Next slide.
[15:47] So the impact to Millsex County um
municipal support sends a powerful
[15:52] message. It demonstrates your commitment
to healthy communities, supporting
[15:56] seniors, supporting caregivers,
improving healthcare access, and
[16:00] ensuring that residents can remain close
to home at end of life. We also hope
[16:04] that this hospice becomes a model that
helps the communities across Milk County
[16:08] establish future hospice services. So
tonight, I'm asking for your support.
[16:12] support for our ministry health
application and support for bringing
[16:16] hospice closer to home and support for
ensuring that no family has to leave
[16:21] leave the county to receive
compassionate care of end of life.
[16:24] Residents of of Temp Center deserve
access to compassionate and end of life
[16:28] care as well and that is going to be one
of our goals. Thank you for your time
[16:32] and I'd love to answer any questions you
may have.
[16:37] » Thanks Mr. Mccelik. I appreciate your
presentation this evening. I'll turn it
[16:41] over to council now to see if they have
any questions for you. Um, anyone from
[16:45] council with a question? Councelor
Crockett.
[16:49] » Uh, thank you, mayor. Thank you for your
presentation and coming in this way. Um,
[16:53] I appreciate you clarifying that, uh,
Strathroy, um, isn't just the intended
[16:59] location. Um, I'll bet the physical
location, um, but opening it up to the
[17:05] rest of county. Um, you had mentioned
that you've raised 1.55 million to date.
[17:11] I was just curious uh what your end goal
was because you didn't see the slide,
[17:15] but
>> our Yeah, great question. Our end goal
[17:17] is 5 million.
>> Okay. Um uh we do have an off thereord
[17:23] uh type of um approached by um a family
that once the the land has been
[17:30] completely um severed and in the hands
of of our charity that um uh there'll be
[17:36] a substantial donation that will
hopefully get us to about the $4 million
[17:39] mark.
>> That's wonderful. Um and just my final
[17:42] uh question is in regards to the
capacity. you had mentioned that you're
[17:46] hoping to have five beds, correct? Five
beds.
[17:49] » Um would that be growing
>> on that is so that's what you're going
[17:54] to be building for the five beds.
>> Correct.
[17:57] » And then you had alluded during your
presentation that you would be um
[18:02] I would say willing to assist with
future hospices in the future. And I
[18:07] think that's something that we could
really get behind um in support of that
[18:12] because as you mentioned um Strothroy is
a little bit of a distance but we are
[18:17] still part of the same county um and
obviously much closer than the
[18:21] alternative options outside of London
Middle
[18:25] » for sure. And and I do want to say that
although you are a bit of a distance um
[18:31] and this is your community um that
doesn't mean to say that you couldn't
[18:35] have family members access that
especially if it's something that um you
[18:39] know London is full or Woodstock is
full. If there is a bed they need it. Um
[18:43] the way we want it to work is um if
you're if you have an application from
[18:49] London and you have an application from
the county and you only have one bed, we
[18:52] take the county.
>> Okay. Um, and especially knowing that we
[18:57] want to be able to really preserve the
right of of rural rural part of of of
[19:02] our community and you know, if you are
if you were born and raised on the farm
[19:08] and farm most of your life then and you
know and you want to be able to to end
[19:12] your life in that kind of rural
environment, you should be able to.
[19:17] Thank you.
>> Thanks, Councelor Crockett. Anyone else
[19:21] question? Uh, councelor Locki. Uh yeah,
through your worship. Yeah, thank you so
[19:25] much um for coming here to present to
us. It's such a needed needed service
[19:30] and also thank you for all the
volunteers in this project. Um I was
[19:33] just curious what sort of time frame
that you had for this project.
[19:38] » Uh again, great question. Um a lot of
it's going to depend on the ministry. Uh
[19:43] once we can get over this next hurdle of
of um uh county giving us the blessings
[19:48] um move forward with severing the
property and it's in the charitable name
[19:52] uh we write a business plan to the to
the Ministry of Health um which we've
[19:57] already been drafting and working on. Um
and as if you have any indication how
[20:02] the ministry of health works, it could
be a slow process, but we are um you
[20:07] know we we have a lot of support from
our MPP and and municipalities really
[20:12] pushing for this because again there is
that need. Um you know we we've already
[20:17] been told numerous times in the past
couple months that you know I wish you
[20:21] were open now because we need it. You
know I've got this person or we have
[20:25] this person in our family and and it's
tough. Yeah. Um the other question that
[20:29] I have is that uh so if there's an over
capacity so um if you have more um needs
[20:35] than you have beds available how is it
uh decided who gets the beds?
[20:40] » Well again as as as we mentioned that we
um a lot of it it's going to be criteria
[20:44] is going to be based with the doctors in
terms of um you know how end of life you
[20:49] know doctors will look at your your
situation and say you know it could be
[20:53] two or three weeks versus somebody
that's two or three months. Okay. So
[20:56] that's one of the the you know the the
medical part of things. The other one as
[21:00] I mentioned before is when you have two
applicants and one may be from the city
[21:03] and one may may not be then we're going
to you know look after the one that's in
[21:07] our county first.
>> Okay. But um in terms of people in the
[21:11] county like there won't be any
preference given to Stthroy versus other
[21:15] communities. It'll all be equal.
>> Yeah. No, as far as we're concerned and
[21:18] again unless unless the ministry tells
us otherwise um that's how we want to
[21:23] proceed with that. Okay.
>> Thank you.
[21:24] » You're very welcome.
Councelor Haymon.
[21:28] » Thank you, Worship. Um,
the uh the presentation is marked to be
[21:35] received for information. Would it be
helpful to have a a letter of support or
[21:40] is this more of a
>> That is one of the one of the asks would
[21:43] be definitely be wonderful if we can get
a letter of support from Temp Center in
[21:48] support of of our of our hospice and
even put in I would even suggest to put
[21:52] in the letter that hopefully it will be
um you know used as a as a call it a
[21:57] stepping stone a road map you know um um
an opportunity so that um TM center will
[22:03] eventually have a hospice for your
community as
[22:07] So is that part of the recommendation or
does it would that be need to be made
[22:14] additionally?
>> It can just be added as part of the
[22:16] recommendation to receive it. Just
receive it and that a letter of support
[22:20] um hospice be sent would like a letter
sent to you sir or
[22:24] » you can address it to me. That's that's
fine.
[22:27] » Okay. Well, I I would like to make that
amendment or make that motion
[22:33] amend the uh recommended motion.
>> Um before we call for that, I just
[22:38] wanted to ask a question myself,
>> please.
[22:41] » The $5 million
uh targeted goal that you have, does
[22:45] that include any is that just the
building or does that um include any
[22:51] wages for staff or
>> any of that sort of thing?
[22:56] » Yeah. So the so um the five million is
for the building and the furnishings. So
[23:02] the way it works with hospice uh which
is different than than long-term care is
[23:06] they will the ministry will give you
funding operational funding for direct
[23:11] nursing care only. So um so let's say
for a director of care your PSWs
[23:18] anything that's direct care will get
funded by the ministry. um
[23:23] housekeeping, um executive director,
your utilities, and all of the other
[23:28] things not related to nursing um will be
100% funded by our fundraisers and and
[23:34] the charity.
Um so they min they being the ministry
[23:39] expects um hospices to um to basically
fund raise um probably equivalent to
[23:46] about $800,000 a year for for our five
beds.
[23:50] Okay, thank you very much. That answers
the question. Um, so we have uh we have
[23:56] a mover on the um on the for the
recommended motion with the addition of
[24:02] the letter of support. A seconder for
that motion. Councelor Locki. All in
[24:06] favor?
>> Good.
[24:09] » Thank you very much.
>> There you go.
[24:11] » Thank you.
>> Thank you very much. Um my sister died
[24:13] in hospital so this is very close to my
home. So having something where people
[24:21] can die with a little bit more dignity
than you get in hospital. So
[24:25] » So if I and I I my condolences for you
and and um this is actually the second
[24:30] presentation I had it sort of hit a
little home. I just did one in Gleno
[24:35] last week and somebody had to leave
because again it was she was dealing
[24:39] with something that was very similar and
it was it was just very difficult to go
[24:42] through. I will mention this. Somebody
asked what's the difference between
[24:47] hospital and hospice considering you can
get palative care in a hospital. U my
[24:52] answer was was you know not to be overly
blunt is the fact that you can't compare
[24:56] the two. Um a hospital is obviously very
institutional. Um you could very well
[25:01] have two three other people in your
room. Um it's not private. Uh it doesn't
[25:06] give you the the peaceful you know
one-on-one atmosphere that that you
[25:10] would hope for. Um, and also they don't
have the staffing ratios as we would
[25:14] have in hospice. Um, like on a day shift
you're pretty much on a onetoone basis.
[25:19] Uh, which is exactly what you want. Uh,
if I was a family member needing care,
[25:23] that's what I would do.
>> Well, again, I thank you very much for
[25:28] coming in. This is a was a very good
presentation. Thank you.
[25:36] All
[25:43] right. So, we'll move on now to 6.2 on
um on our agenda. Uh Mr. Dino Tassi,
[25:51] alcohol sales at the outdoor recreation
complex.
[25:57] And uh
go ahead. So, it's the same sort of
[26:02] thing. You push that center button there
and then uh when it glows red, you're
[26:06] you're good to go.
>> All right. This is very hard to follow
[26:13] after that presentation,
but emotional.
[26:20] Um
my name's Carla Dassie. This is my
[26:24] husband, Dino Dassi. We run the
concession booth at the Field of Dreams.
[26:31] Um, we've called the concession booth
um, Grill and Chill and we're here
[26:36] tonight to ask for permission to have a
liquor license at the Grill and Chill.
[26:43] We've had customers asking, is it
possible we could have a beer with our
[26:48] pizza and watch a game? And well,
obviously we said no, not yet, but we
[26:54] too feel like it would be a good idea to
be able to have a a liquor license. I
[27:00] think it would add to the Field of
Dreams. Um, we feel it's a good
[27:06] addition. We feel like it may even bring
out some people from Doorchester to go
[27:11] up and maybe watch some of the ball
games. I too was unaware of the uh
[27:17] caliber of ball that's being played out
there. Like it's a real high-end
[27:24] caliber. They play in many different
areas like throughout Ontario. So, we've
[27:29] got a really beautiful field up there.
And if anybody I feel was to be
[27:36] responsible enough for a liquor license,
I do feel it would be Dino. He ran the
[27:44] fat olive for eight years. We had a
liquor license there. We never had any
[27:49] infractions.
Um, and again, if you know Dino, he's
[27:54] very responsible. He's family
orientated.
[27:58] Uh he's always giving back to the
community. I know when he had the Fat
[28:02] Olive, he always sponsored the uh
Ringette team. He always participates in
[28:07] the parades that Doorchester has. And um
correct me if I'm wrong, but we ran the
[28:14] concession booth up there during COVID
when they didn't have anybody else to
[28:19] run the booth at that time. We gave it
up after just to focus on the fat. All
[28:24] of
But um Dino has now that we don't have
[28:28] the fat all up, he's spent a lot of time
and energy into trying to improve the
[28:34] concession booth at the Field of Dreams.
He's brought in a fire brick pizza oven,
[28:41] flat tops, brought in a lot of good
quality food. You know Dino, his
[28:46] hamburgers are from the butcher. If you
know Dino, he is always giving quality.
[28:52] Um, we just feel like it's a good idea
and we're just here tonight just to ask
[28:58] permission to proceed with a liquor
license. If you say yes, that's great.
[29:04] And if it's no, that's okay, too. We're
just here to ask. And um, and if you
[29:10] have any questions, we're more than
happy to answer any of the questions you
[29:14] may have about if we had a liquor
license.
[29:20] » All right. Thank you. Um, what I'm going
to do is, uh,
[29:27] I'll see if there are any comments or
questions from the members of council
[29:32] um, on this one.
Do do we want to do that before we go to
[29:36] your your report, Steve, or
[29:45] » I might as well do my report then
questions for anybody.
[29:48] » Sure. Absolutely. Go ahead.
Okay. Thank you. Through you, your
[29:53] worship, uh you have before you report
CSF021-26
[29:58] regarding the DASIS request to sell
alcohol at the outdoor recreation
[30:01] complex, more commonly known as the ORC.
Uh at this time, I will summarize uh
[30:07] information beyond what the DASIS have
provided just now, thereby providing
[30:11] council with all the information
possible to make an informed decision.
[30:14] As part of our thorough consideration of
this request, staff has received input
[30:18] from county legal and our insurance
provider regarding what updates the
[30:22] existing facility lease agreement would
require in the event council supports
[30:26] the request. These amendments to the
lease would help to mitigate potential
[30:30] exposure to risk for the municipality
with the five key recommended updates to
[30:34] this lease agreement outlined starting
on the bottom of page three of the
[30:37] report. These changes address compliance
with the municipal alcohol policy, AGCO
[30:42] requirements, indemnification terms,
insurance requirements, safe storage and
[30:48] security of alcohol on site along with
addressing risk of loss. A draft of the
[30:53] proposed revised facility lease
agreement is attached to this report.
[30:57] Another avenue that staff explored to
provide as much information as possible
[31:01] was to reach out to the key youth sports
associations that play on our sports
[31:05] fields in tempm center including the ORC
for their opinion on this matter. If you
[31:10] refer to the other attachment to the
report, you will see the reply I
[31:12] received from Adam Stern representing
the great lake Canadians who is not
[31:17] opposed to the sale of alcohol at the
York. This attachment also provides a
[31:21] joint reply on behalf of Dorchester
Soccer Club and Tame's Center Minor
[31:25] Soccer. uh besides their identification
of existing concerns which staff are
[31:31] working on and will take into
consideration with the upcoming update
[31:34] to our municipal alcohol policy. This
joint minor soccer response to this
[31:40] opportunity is an opposition to alcohol
being served from our concession stands
[31:44] at our community parks and sports
facilities with them providing five
[31:49] reasons why they felt that was the case
which you can read towards the bottom of
[31:53] that attachment. In addition to the
attached feedback, after this agenda was
[31:58] published, um I received feedback from
Thorndale Minor Soccer and their reply
[32:02] was um as follows. We haven't had any
issues that I've known about and
[32:08] whatever is decided we will work will
work for us. Um for more input, I
[32:14] reached out to the other municipalities
in Middle Sex County. Uh none of them
[32:18] currently sell alcohol at their parks or
outdoor recreation concession stands.
[32:23] While some of them do have alcohol sales
within their arenas, whether in a
[32:27] dedicated space like we do in our blue
line room or concession stand in their
[32:31] arena. Um, in addition, one of my
contacts at Middle Sex London Health
[32:37] Unit noticed the report on our agenda
this past Friday night and um sent me
[32:42] some of their literature called Reducing
Alcohol Harms, a primer for
[32:46] municipalities, which our clerk then
shared with council via email this
[32:50] morning. I can expand on that email if
you wish. Um the background section of
[32:56] the report outlines other factors to
take into consideration specifically
[33:00] required steps if council supports it.
Uh the pros of this opportunity and any
[33:05] cons of this opportunity. So for first
of all for required steps um the dassis
[33:11] uh in order for the dassis to sell
alcohol at the ORC council would need to
[33:15] pass a resolution permitting alcohol
licenses at the ORC. Council would need
[33:20] to direct staff to amend the lease
agreement accordingly and uh Mr. Dassi
[33:24] would have to apply to AGCO for a
permit. Potential benefits with
[33:28] permitting sale of alcohol at the ORC
include uh besides what the Mrs. Dassi
[33:33] has already outlined uh increased
revenues and sustainability for the
[33:36] tenants uh an additional uh option for
patrons to enjoy and uh as well we have
[33:43] the opportunity for a test run for the
balance of this year as the current
[33:46] facility lease agreement expires at the
end of September. So should council
[33:50] choose to support it we can see how it
goes and then decide accordingly before
[33:53] extending the lease or considering
extending the lease. Uh potential risks
[33:58] uh of permitting uh alcohol sales are
basically uh various risks with
[34:03] intoxication for anyone who drinks too
much. Uh that can include property
[34:07] damage, altercations, personal injury
and motor motor vehicle incidents. Uh
[34:13] which can then lead to the municipality
and the business being held liable. Um
[34:18] even though within our facility lease
agreement uh we are named as an
[34:23] additional insured under uh the grills
insurance. So we are covered in that
[34:28] regard but that doesn't stop people from
coming after municipalities.
[34:32] Um
so again uh other risks again just if
[34:38] people are intoxicated would be risk of
facility damage by anyone um any
[34:44] attempts to maybe break into the
facility to steal alcohol beyond hours.
[34:47] uh increased exposure of youth to
consumption of alcohol
[34:51] um
and uh increased potential increased
[34:56] maintenance whether that just be clean
up of of solo cups thrown around,
[35:00] vandalism, property damage, etc. Um with
that being said, I'm happy to answer any
[35:05] questions that council may have at this
time. uh with the report's
[35:08] recommendations being first of all to
receive this report for information and
[35:13] then secondly to either maintain the
status quo of no alcohol sales at the
[35:17] ORC or to approve the sale of alcohol at
the ORC and direct staff to amend the
[35:22] facility rental agreement to permit the
sale of alcohol at the concession stand
[35:26] at the ORC.
>> Thanks Mr. McDonald for your report. Um
[35:32] I'm going to turn it over to to council
then for questions. Council Crockett.
[35:37] Thank you, mayor. Thank you for coming
in. Um, and thank you for taking over
[35:40] the concession stand. Um, I think you
articulated it well that there is a
[35:46] caliber of baseball there that I think a
lot of people don't know about. Um, as
[35:49] well as the other draws of just the
general baseball and soccer that takes
[35:52] place at that facility. Um, so I
understand both the appeal and the
[35:57] hesitations around this. Um my real
question I guess is really just around
[36:05] um the
proposed hours of operation where
[36:10] alcohol would be served. Uh whether this
would be on a regular basis or just for
[36:14] special events. Um I was just kind of
wanting your understanding on that.
[36:20] » Uh we'd probably do it on a regular
basis as they're there pretty much every
[36:23] night. uh on the weekends maybe a little
longer because they're there from 9:00
[36:29] in the morning, but we can start at
whatever time see fit.
[36:34] » Thank you. Um I think in just
conclusion is that
[36:40] there's alcohol kind of permitted
everywhere these days it seems um to be
[36:46] the thing to do uh from our provincial
government anyways. Um, and I know that
[36:52] there's special instances that we have
even at the diamonds here in Dorchester
[36:56] where the Lions Club have been permitted
for special tournaments, etc. to sell.
[37:00] So, to me, I think that I don't
personally have a problem with this and
[37:05] I respect that your experience um, being
a business owner and someone who
[37:11] understands the rules and regulations
around alcohol sales. Um, it's quite
[37:14] comforting that you'd be kind of the
guinea pig um, for us to um, explore
[37:19] this. So, thank you.
>> Thanks, Councelor Cockett. Uh, councelor
[37:24] Locky. Uh, yep, here you worship. I
don't have a question. I just would like
[37:27] to, uh, give my opinion on the matter.
So, um, like I recognize that the county
[37:32] sent the primer and, you know, reminded
us all of the risks of of alcohol. Um,
[37:37] but I believe that the benefits may
outweigh the risks. Uh, because, you
[37:41] know, having a beer and a hot dog at at
a baseball game, it's just a thing that
[37:46] people enjoy. And
I think that if you um have it served by
[37:52] people that are smart serve trained, uh
it can be enjoyed more responsibly
[37:57] rather than the risk of people sneaking
it in. Um I also agree that you know the
[38:02] province already does a really good job
at uh you know curtailing the risk.
[38:07] There's a lot of liability to
establishments. Um smart served um
[38:11] servers are very very well trained. um
there's extreme penalties on alcohol
[38:16] infections and they do an excellent job
of public awareness and um for that
[38:22] reason also that it is be excellent for
our tourism and economic growth. So I
[38:27] I'm in support.
Thank you councelor Laki. I'm going to
[38:32] offer a few comments myself and a couple
of questions. Um, I think, uh, just from
[38:38] what's come to me, there's a concern
about little kids, you know, when
[38:42] they're out there for their for their
soccer games and that sort of thing. So,
[38:47] will you be ser if this goes through,
would you be serving alcohol in sort of
[38:52] a specific area where or would people be
able to get a beer and wander the entire
[39:00] » whatever you guys, however you want it
done. However,
[39:03] » I've had the uh AGCO out there. They're
fine property being licensed or if you
[39:08] want just a certain spot, that's fine,
too.
[39:10] » Okay. And so, in terms of hours where
where uh alcohol would be served, would
[39:17] it does do you have any idea sort of?
>> Well, basically right now we're running
[39:21] for food. We're running 5 till 8:30
during the week.
[39:24] » Then on the weekends, we're running from
9 till 8:30. Then
[39:28] » we're obviously open when there's
tournaments out there. start at 9 or 10
[39:31] according to the tournaments.
>> Okay.
[39:33] » But in general, if it's just normal be
like 5 till 8:30 and then on the
[39:38] weekends all day.
>> Okay.
[39:42] » Um the the one thing that does come to
my mind is the fact that
[39:48] this is a this is a sort of a worldclass
facility with lots of other things going
[39:54] on with it. It's always been a concern
of mine that there is no um real
[39:59] incentive to business owners to u you
know sort of keep the money in the
[40:05] municipality rather than it be spread
out. So um I think what you're after and
[40:11] the improvements that you've made are
are um are good. I think I would be
[40:17] supportive of this as long as you know
that there are certain um monitors that
[40:22] are put in place. Um I don't think in my
experience at these parks and that sort
[40:28] of thing that there's an overabundance
of alcohol use particularly when the
[40:35] young kids are around. So, um,
from an economic standpoint of view, I I
[40:41] I do support your request now that I've
heard your your, uh, presentation.
[40:47] So, if that's a conclusion to the
comments, councelor Hman's not here,
[40:54] then I know he can't. So anyway, um we
the motion that we have before us is
[41:01] that council receives the delegation
from DTASY regarding alcohol sales at
[41:06] the outdoor recreation complex. So
that's the first of our motions. Uh a
[41:12] mover and a seconder for that one. Uh
Councelor Locky and Councelor Crocky.
[41:18] And all in favor and that carries. And
then um you've done your uh report
[41:25] Steve. So that um we have two here that
report number CSF-021-26
[41:34] request to permit alcohol sales at the
OC stand be received for information and
[41:41] that council approve the sale of alcohol
at the OC and direct staff to amend the
[41:48] facility rental agreement to permit the
sale of alcohol at the concession booth
[41:54] in the OC.
moved by councelor um Locky and seconded
[41:59] by councelor Crockett. So all in favor,
>> thank you for coming in tonight.
[42:05] Appreciate it.
>> Thank you.
[42:07] » Thanks.
[42:39] Okay, number seven on our agenda is a
public meeting regarding drainage and
[42:44] it's a uh to consider the Thorndale
industrial drain. So an overview of the
[42:50] work. Are you Mr. Rayin? Do I did I
pronounce that right? Okay, pretty well
[42:57] but not there.
Okay, you go ahead whenever you're
[43:02] ready.
[43:13] » Uh thank you your worship. Uh we are
pleased to present a report tonight here
[43:16] on the Thorndale Industrial Stormwater
Management Improvements here. Um this is
[43:21] a section 4 request under the drainage
act petition um by the road authority
[43:26] specifically for Ideal Drive and Gerald
Parkway. Um there was ongoing issues
[43:32] with the the system here. There's
currently storm sewers that outlet into
[43:36] private ditches which outlet into um old
extraction pits and then soak away into
[43:41] the ground. So both the upper temps
river conservation authority and the
[43:45] ministry and the environment have
identified that as not a suitable outlet
[43:48] for the industrial water and the road
water that leaves the site. So this was
[43:53] essentially an appointment directed by
these situations. Um and also to provide
[43:57] proper drainage and legal drainage for
the road as currently it's going through
[44:01] a private system which the municipality
cannot maintain if there's issues in the
[44:05] future if there's debris in that dam or
if sediment builds up. Same with these
[44:09] extraction pits. So the uh purpose of
this report was to convert uh the south
[44:14] open channel here the municipal or the
current private ditch there into a
[44:18] municipal ditch. would provide um the
legal ability for the municipality to
[44:22] maintain it. It's there's not a lot of
work being proposed on this drain. It's
[44:26] more to allow it to be maintained in the
future. It was constructed under an
[44:30] engineered drawing from um SPM. It was
constructed in approximately 2016 um and
[44:37] uh is in fairly good condition. There's
not not a lot of work to it. The the
[44:42] bigger issue here are these extraction
pits, these existing extraction pits on
[44:46] the west. There's two of them which
these channels empty into. Um they are
[44:50] um semi-rehabbed particularly the north
pond but the south pond is very much in
[44:55] an active construction state. So this
would be to convert these into active
[44:58] storm water management ponds. Make sure
they meet health and safety standards
[45:02] for safe slopes and things like that.
Make sure they're doing their intended
[45:06] function of providing the water quality
need. Um part of it that came through
[45:11] here is to clay line these these ponds
to make sure that the water is not
[45:16] exfiltrating but rather using the proper
outlet. Uh in 2010 um Stantech had
[45:23] designed a storm water outlet um for
this area. However, it's never been
[45:27] connected to it's never been utilized
due to the cost here. So this proposal
[45:31] is to make use of that outlet connect
the north pond to that and then have a
[45:35] pipe connection between these two ponds.
We did investigate taking a piped outlet
[45:41] directly from the south pond into the
temps river. However, due to the minimal
[45:45] cost um savings and UTRCA was not
supportive of that approach. Um we
[45:51] figured for the a couple percent on the
total cost of this project, it was
[45:54] easier to stay in the route which they
were supportive of. Um so that's a quick
[45:59] overview of the uh project here. Um
there was significant consultation
[46:06] undertaken here with the affected land
owners. Um there are a couple active
[46:11] gravel pits here um between the two
ponds here. So uh we had reviewed their
[46:15] extraction pits, the rehabilitation
plans and designed the uh cross
[46:20] connection pipe there to work work with
their future land use to uh make sure
[46:24] that the landowner wasn't feeling the
impacts of having you know that in a
[46:28] location they didn't want. So we've kind
of hugged the property line there. um
[46:31] and taken not the direct the you know
the most direct route but the route that
[46:35] made the most sense for the land owner.
We've also talked with the largest
[46:39] portion of undeveloped lands there. Um
we talked with their engineering team to
[46:43] get their proposed layout to make sure
that what we were designing would work
[46:46] for their future development plans there
of the system. Um so we've designed this
[46:52] system to up to and including the 250ear
storm. So that's what our current
[46:56] regulations are for for both upper temps
and the ministry. Um, so this will
[47:02] provide both quantity and quality
control and a proper legal outlet for
[47:06] all the lands currently served by this
and any future lands to be serviced by
[47:09] this. And there's almost 300 acres
that's served by this system. Um, so
[47:14] it's a quite large system here. Um,
there's 16 pages of drawings here that
[47:20] are attached to this report. They detail
the works to be completed and also um
[47:26] incorporate that that south open channel
for future maintenance. Um the total
[47:31] cost of this construction and report is
approximately $2.2 million and that
[47:37] includes um allowances for the affected
properties and the um through
[47:43] consultation with staff. It has been
decided that the appropriate cost
[47:47] recovery mechanism for this would be
through future charges to the developing
[47:50] lands under bylaw under the municipal
act. meaning that the municipality would
[47:54] pay the cost today and then the cost
would be recovered as lands develop
[47:58] here. Um to make sure that there isn't a
burden on those lands, you know, lands
[48:02] that haven't developed yet would have a
large cost to date for something they
[48:06] may not recover for a very long time. Um
but we wanted to make sure this is, you
[48:10] know, looking forward and making sure it
is able to provide the level of service
[48:13] that is needed to develop those lands.
Um and if there's any questions, I'd
[48:17] welcome them through you.
>> Thanks very much.
[48:22] Okay. So, um, are there any questions
from affected land owners who may be in
[48:28] the room? Okay. If you'd like to come to
the podium here and ask your question,
[48:35] if you could just state your name and
your property address, please.
[48:44] » 21735
Road.
[48:48] » And your name, please?
>> Philip Coots. KUDSK,
[48:51] I've gone through these plans.
We're already being charged for
[48:56] something that doesn't exist, will never
exist because our homes have been there
[49:02] for well over 75 years for the most
part.
[49:07] Never needed a storm sewer. Don't need
one now.
[49:11] Never will. And from what I've looked at
these plans, none of this attaches to
[49:17] any of our properties. Rob, Roy, they
also are being affected by this.
[49:26] There's there's no reason to be charging
us for anything for something we cannot
[49:30] use or nor will ever be able to use
according to these plans.
[49:37] » Any response?
>> Uh yes, thank you your worship. Uh I
[49:42] there is no assessment to you. There's
no cost to you. There would only be cost
[49:47] to people as they develop in the future.
So I'm uncertain on
[49:53] » well
>> what you're building here somewhere. I
[49:57] can show you myself.
[50:16] » Just while you're looking, I think Mr.
Craraven, our director of public works,
[50:20] has a response.
>> Yeah. T Thank you, worship. I I believe
[50:23] that the charges that you're speaking of
is a storm water rates charge that
[50:27] everybody inside the urban boundary of
Dorchester and Thorndale beginning last
[50:32] year are being charged. Um that's a
paperwork I think it dropped off to your
[50:36] place. The storm sewers in the village
of Thorndale.
[50:40] You drive on them.
Okay.
[50:46] » Okay. everybody inside the urban
boundary um was charged at storm sir um
[50:51] beginning last year. That's that's those
are the charges that you're seeing on
[50:54] your on the water.
[50:58] » Just just as a as an aside to this, I I
think they're different matters. This
[51:03] one the the report that we've just
received is regarding drainage. Um the
[51:09] the issue you're raising is about storm
source. So they're they're not related
[51:15] in this particular instance.
>> Well, he's talking about putting in a
[51:20] storm sewer. I'm getting a charge for a
storm sewer.
[51:24] » I think it's drainage works
>> be because of the storm sewer that
[51:27] you're you're paying for. You are not
being assessed what all the uh
[51:32] undeveloped properties are in this area.
So because you're paying that up by
[51:37] monthly charge, you're away from these
these charges here that they're speaking
[51:40] of.
till when till the township takes it
[51:46] over and then I have to pay more.
[51:52] » Uh I I'm not sure how to answer that
question.
[51:57] » I I would suggest we try to move on and
maybe he could reach out to staff after
[52:01] the meeting. Okay. Um try to discuss
this further because it's does not
[52:05] appear related to the report at hand.
>> All right then. Thank you.
[52:11] Is there anyone else?
[52:18] Is there anyone else in the chambers who
wishes to speak to the issue?
[52:23] Again, if you could just state your
names and your property address.
[52:26] » Yeah. Hi, it's Jules Patton. Um, I don't
have the exact blue number, but we're
[52:29] the South Pond. Basically, they want to
put the
[52:33] » Um, yes. So right now there's a ditch
that they made through our property and
[52:39] now the water gets just dumped at the
back of our property as of right now. So
[52:42] when it floods everyone's water comes on
ours. We're working with the township.
[52:46] We want this all to go through. It's
just that the price of that they're
[52:50] taking our land is kind of value
$65,000
[52:55] which is kind of not acceptable.
So either we lower development charges
[53:01] down to nothing
>> or this bond before
[53:07] » in this particular case. Um that will be
dealt with at the next meeting. So or or
[53:13] a subsequent meeting in any case.
>> We're not going to let it go through.
[53:16] » So there yeah we we have the next
meeting would be a court of revision and
[53:21] that in that opportunity is is is to
talk about the assessments. This one um
[53:27] this one is just to um um have the
engineers report on the work that that's
[53:33] to be done in the geographic location.
>> Um so did I answer the the CIO may have
[53:41] a response as well. Hang on one moment.
>> Sure. Yeah. And I sorry I I was just
[53:47] going to note that I think the engineer
can speak specifically to um the report
[53:52] this evening uh and may have a response
to the question you've raised um in some
[53:58] part.
>> Yeah, we brought this up.
[54:01] » We're for it. We want we wanted to turn
this industrial and make money in the
[54:04] town for everyone factories,
>> but in order to get people out to
[54:08] Thorndale, we have to lower our
development charges. Not what you're
[54:12] saying char.
[54:20] » Okay, Mr. Viken, would you like to
provide your response?
[54:24] » Yes, thank you, your worship. Um, for as
far as allowances, allowances are um a
[54:30] topic of discussion today. Um,
assessments, you are, you're correct,
[54:34] would be a matter for quarter revision,
but allowances, compensation for land
[54:38] taken should be discussed at tonight's
meeting. um as they form part of the
[54:42] project. Um and if you would like I can
speak to I can respond there.
[54:47] » Absolutely. Why don't you go ahead?
>> Thank you. As as the patents have said
[54:51] here, yes, we've had multiple
conversations both us and the
[54:53] municipality previously on the
compensation for the land value here. Um
[54:59] specifically, um there has been a um a
let's call it a disconnect in the value
[55:06] of the land here for both the municipal
ditch here and the storm water
[55:11] management pond here. Um as it currently
sits, these lands already have these
[55:16] features. These features were built as a
community system when these previous
[55:20] developments took place to service these
lands. They existed.
[55:26] What do you mean?
It was not it was not done through a
[55:32] formal please let me finish and then if
you want to answer questions that would
[55:35] be appropriate afterwards. Um they were
done to serve these areas to provide
[55:40] enough depth and capacity to serve these
areas. So this land was already taken.
[55:45] This land was already built upon. Um
this land you know physically cannot be
[55:49] taken out out of you know these ditches
cannot be removed. This water from all
[55:54] these properties will have nowhere to
go. Um the whole intent of these ditches
[55:58] were to serve the roads and the lands.
Um which the previous owner then severed
[56:02] these lands and then sold these to make
money. Um so this was all part of the
[56:07] existing system on these properties
prior to the purchase um from the
[56:11] patents here. So this was existing. What
we have given them compensation is
[56:15] there's a little bit of land on the
south pond that we're expanding it
[56:18] beyond what was there historically. So
we're expanding the footprint of what uh
[56:24] what's been there historically and
that's what we have provided an
[56:27] allowance for. Um we provide an
allowance of 33% higher than what they
[56:32] purchased the property for in in 2020.
So we took the land value that on a per
[56:37] acre basis that they paid for the whole
parcel um through the land registry. Our
[56:41] office prated it by 33% to accommodate
for some inflation and some land value
[56:46] growth um and then gave them
compensation for that additional land
[56:49] that has was taken. So that was how we
have come up with our land. Um it was an
[56:54] existing situation that was on the
property when it was purchased couldn't
[56:58] physically be removed without
significant you know infrastructure to
[57:03] offset or rebuild that. So we don't
think there is a um is a value that
[57:08] should be attributed to that um land
that was already an existing already
[57:13] dedicated to these uses prior to
purchase. Um also um there is you know a
[57:20] significant benefit to this property too
as a whole because without these um
[57:25] without these upgrades and these
necessary improvements there will not be
[57:29] any further development of these lands.
The MACP and the UTRCA are very clear
[57:34] that this is not an acceptable outlet
for storm water and will not approve any
[57:38] more further development in this area
without this being rectified. So, um I I
[57:43] struggle to see how fixing the solution
is making the property less valuable.
[57:49] » Yeah, we just want to get it done right,
but we also want to bring in clients in
[57:54] order to buy if it's if we build a pond.
[57:59] So,
>> are you talking about additional
[58:01] development charges over in Nevada?
>> Well, if we if you turn this pond in,
[58:04] it's for the use of industrial land.
People are going to be dumping their
[58:08] water in there. So, right now,
>> without getting charged, they're dumping
[58:13] it on my on our land. We're paying
taxes. This water is getting dumped on
[58:16] our land. There's no been never been an
agreement for this ditch they put in. It
[58:19] was just the guy that owned it before
dug a ditch and let the water run under
[58:24] this property. We bought it and then we
said, "Hey, where's the agreement?"
[58:28] There is no agreement and we're fine
with that. It was just that we were
[58:31] trying to do an industrial park there,
but in order to get clients there or
[58:36] people don't want to buy it, our
development charges are high in order to
[58:38] put buildings there. So, we're asking
we're getting low number for our value
[58:42] of our land, which is going to be about
20 acres that they're taking from us.
[58:46] And if you guys want to have tax money
from industrial land, buildings,
[58:50] companies that come in here like St.
Thomas has no development charges for
[58:53] industrial land. None. That's why
they're making huge deals right now with
[58:57] big companies. So, I'm just saying we're
getting stuck with the 67 thou. I don't
[59:02] know. Would you could you buy a lot for
20 acres for 67,000 anywhere? No. I I
[59:07] just find kind of low number, but again,
I'm trying to work with the township. I
[59:11] I want like I bought it for specifically
we're servicing it right now to sever
[59:14] off two lots. We're we're in we want to
get this going for you guys for the
[59:19] township with people, but we said we
need a little bit more money than
[59:22] 67,000.
And if that's the case or no development
[59:25] charges. So when I go to try to bring
factories into Thorndale, I have a
[59:29] little bit of leverage to say, "Hey,
come to Thorndale, build a factory
[59:33] here." There's no development charges.
I've been to St. Thomas. I've talked to
[59:36] the mayor there. The mayor has they have
no that's why they're they're doing so
[59:38] much work there.
>> All right. Um
[59:45] not sure that we can address this right
here. Um, is there anything else that
[59:51] talk? Um, okay. I'll turn it over to
councelor Hman here.
[59:55] » Okay. Thank you, Wor. And um
uh thank you for trying to bring jobs
[1:00:02] and industrial lands to the village of
Thorndale. I think that I think that's
[1:00:08] important and I think that's kind of why
we're here today. That's the big goal
[1:00:13] that I believe the majority of people
are uh getting behind and uh yes that it
[1:00:20] does contribute to the tax base it
contributes employment lands all these
[1:00:24] good things. Um
so if you're looking for reductions in
[1:00:30] development charges that is something
that we cannot do as a council at this
[1:00:35] point in time.
>> That's fair to your attention that's all
[1:00:39] » the Yes. But no, I'm I'm not just trying
to kick the can beyond this meeting is
[1:00:44] in terms of the mech direct mechanism.
This council has already set the fees
[1:00:49] and bylaw charges for this year and
because it's an election year that'll be
[1:00:53] a whole separate council and we don't
have the ability to change those at this
[1:00:57] time. So I think that is a good
discussion in terms of what is the the
[1:01:02] structure and under which we are trying
to attract development. can we can
[1:01:06] discuss it after the election here and
have a bylaw just on something
[1:01:11] » that I think if that's the way you want
to purs pursue this that would be the
[1:01:16] appropriate time
>> and um I think there's these these
[1:01:20] different conversations are also
connected to each other right so we've
[1:01:24] had a number of different developments
come to council and in many of those
[1:01:29] instances the developer frontends much
of the infrastructure that we're talking
[1:01:34] about this is somewhat unique because
there is the drain, there is the lack of
[1:01:38] documentation as as you've outlined. But
in these instances, we look at the facts
[1:01:43] on the ground and that's what's made
this a compromising position in terms of
[1:01:47] the water flowing into your property,
right? And that's
[1:01:51] » right. We're just we're trying to get a
fair number. I find that the numbers low
[1:01:54] like the people that drew up this
drawing is getting 160ome,000
[1:01:59] and we're getting 67,000. I just find it
kind of weird the balance of of the land
[1:02:03] and I just, you know, I've been dealing
with the water for over five years
[1:02:07] pumping it out. We it floods our roads
that we can't even get into our
[1:02:11] property. But again, we've been trying
to work with everybody because we we are
[1:02:14] seeing the big picture. We want to turn
this industrial park. So, we're trying
[1:02:17] to work with everyone
>> and you know, we just deal with it. We
[1:02:20] go about our way.
>> But again, I'm just saying the value
[1:02:23] that they're putting the land at, I just
find it kind of low. That's all.
[1:02:26] » I I don't think I'm out of line by
saying that. If this were a residential
[1:02:30] subdivision, the developer would put in
all the land for the storm water pond
[1:02:34] out of their own pocket, right? And
>> so
[1:02:40] and and I understand that the
[1:02:45] » Yeah,
[1:02:49] » that could be a big issue.
They're allowing everybody to dump their
[1:02:54] water off untreated as in this
treat
[1:03:02] and it was sort of fuel or anything.
>> So this is the Ministry of Environment
[1:03:06] and that's they they they assess the
poller who is generating the pollution.
[1:03:11] You know that's that's a completely set
separate set of regulations but it
[1:03:17] so as developers you know that this
increases the total value of your
[1:03:20] portfolio and your asset. We are we
understand we're
[1:03:24] » that's the came about which we can't
discuss today about development charts.
[1:03:29] » I I I think I think what this is this is
moving a little beyond what we can do
[1:03:34] tonight.
>> So um I think there are going to have to
[1:03:38] be other sort of side discussions on on
this before uh council can
[1:03:44] » that's totally fine. Just wanted to
bring it up to your attention but just
[1:03:48] so we everyone knows where we're at.
That's all
[1:03:50] » and I appreciate that all
>> we
[1:03:53] » we're just trying to use that as
leverage to help people that buys
[1:03:55] factories. If we could use that our land
being so low then hey let's offset it
[1:04:00] with development charges that's all
we're sort of trying to negotiate here
[1:04:04] just so that we can help and bring sales
and factories to Thorndale
[1:04:08] » but that's not something we can do so
right here. So um do you have anything
[1:04:14] else that you'd like to address through
the engineer while he's here? Okay. All
[1:04:18] right. Um, obviously this is a a fairly
big topic. I know it's a little behind
[1:04:24] the the uh it's a little behind, isn't
it? So, okay. Um, thank you very much
[1:04:31] for your comments. I appreciate that. Is
there anyone else in the room who is
[1:04:35] affected by this who wanted to speak?
[1:04:40] » Okay.
[1:04:43] Okay. I just wanted to give you guys
what my understanding for this if you
[1:04:47] want to talk the if you for council if
you want to deal with these allowances
[1:04:52] from my just reading about this um I'll
admit I haven't dealt with someone
[1:04:57] complaining about their allowances
before you council has the ability to
[1:05:01] send the report back to the engineer
basically or terminate it you guys just
[1:05:05] so you guys are aware you don't have the
ability to change allowances
[1:05:11] » through your worship yes Uh there would
be three three options tonight. It would
[1:05:15] be to proceed with the report as
presented. Refer it back to us to make
[1:05:20] um an adjustment to the allowances with
um your suggestion on on what you think
[1:05:26] we uh need to consider more on or
terminate the petition. Um based on the
[1:05:33] fact that you know both the land owners
and the municipality all seem to be on
[1:05:37] board with the physical works, I don't
think that option three is the
[1:05:41] resolution. So it's essentially
>> it doesn't fix the problem if it Right.
[1:05:45] » that that's correct. And
>> um just to add a little bit more input
[1:05:50] here, it's you know we we struggled with
whether we should even be providing
[1:05:54] allowances to these owners. Essentially
they have a land parcel they would like
[1:05:58] to develop that they can physically not
develop because the MECP is saying that
[1:06:02] there are infractions on their property
that need to be rectified for further
[1:06:06] development. So um it it we struggled to
for the fact that we are essentially
[1:06:13] fixing the problem that's going to
benefit them and then still providing
[1:06:16] them some allowance. Some it certainly
doesn't seem fair to buy all you know uh
[1:06:22] probably somewhere around 12 15 acres
that is either storm water pond or ditch
[1:06:27] on their properties. That is an existing
situation that they knew about when they
[1:06:31] purchased the property. property was
sold extremely cheap due to these
[1:06:34] ongoing issues and they were aware of
these when they purchased purchased this
[1:06:38] or I could only forecast that they were
aware of them because the property was
[1:06:42] extremely cheap which only makes sense
because of the known issues. Um so um
[1:06:48] that's uh kind of my final inputs on
these allowances.
[1:06:52] » Okay, thanks very much. Um
so is there anyone else before we move
[1:06:59] on? Is there anybody else who's affected
by this who would like to speak to the
[1:07:03] matter?
Okay. Uh I'm not seeing anything. Excuse
[1:07:07] me, gentlemen. Could you just keep your
conversations
[1:07:11] um outside the chambers or
um now? So,
[1:07:17] uh
>> Oh, you you wanting to speak again?
[1:07:22] » Yes, please.
>> On the same matter, the drainage manner.
[1:07:25] » Yes.
>> Okay. I worked in a plastic injection
[1:07:28] molding company and they are the ones
that are polluting the wind to cool down
[1:07:34] the pipe as it comes out. They run water
over it. That way there it doesn't, you
[1:07:40] know, hot piece of plastic just doesn't
melt on the floor. So they're constantly
[1:07:45] using the water and then dumping it into
the pond. So ideal drainage is the root
[1:07:52] of this problem. Okay, that
>> how they ever got a permit to do this is
[1:07:58] beyond me.
>> Respectfully, that is something that's
[1:08:01] happened in the past and it's not
something that we can deal with. We have
[1:08:04] to deal with the matter at hand. So, I
do thank you for getting an
[1:08:09] environmental report of what's coming
out of that train right now.
[1:08:13] » I I don't know that that enters into
this discussion, but I'll turn it over
[1:08:18] to the engineer.
>> Uh, thank you through you. Um
[1:08:23] specifically
um the majority of this work is for the
[1:08:26] south pond which ideal drainage does not
drain into. They will utilize the outlet
[1:08:30] of the north pond but specifically most
of this most of this drainage area goes
[1:08:34] through the south pond um and is the
cross connection between. So ideal
[1:08:39] pipe is currently not even in this south
pond. However um if you do have concerns
[1:08:44] about you know water quality I encourage
you to reach out to the ministry. That
[1:08:48] is not a municipal issue. It's not
something the council can um really
[1:08:54] react on. So if you have concerns, reach
out to the ministry can down the road
[1:09:00] up in North Pond.
>> I think sir, he's just trying to outline
[1:09:04] the fact that there are some things that
are a little beyond our jurisdiction.
[1:09:08] » So
>> Well, I I don't think so. It's an
[1:09:10] environmental disaster.
>> Deal with it.
[1:09:14] Um,
so if there's no one else to speak to
[1:09:18] this, is there anyone who would like to
add or remove their names to the
[1:09:22] petition?
[1:09:27] Okay, I'm not seeing anyone there. So,
are there any other questions from the
[1:09:33] members of council?
>> Councelor Cockett.
[1:09:38] » Uh, thank you, Mayor. I don't
particularly have a question. And I
[1:09:41] think we're all in the agreement that
something needs to be done. Um, as I was
[1:09:46] saying to Travis earlier, my typical
stance on drainage requests is if you
[1:09:52] request it, you likely need it. Um, and
this is very much the case on that. Um,
[1:09:57] I think that there is a lot of history
of kind of what brought us here today.
[1:10:02] Uh, that is muddying the waters a little
bit. And I just want to say thank you
[1:10:07] for putting together this report. I know
that it's um I think substantial as well
[1:10:13] as um a bit more cumbersome than I think
everyone wants uh for this. But
[1:10:22] ultimately we are being directed by the
ministry and UTRCA on this. So our hands
[1:10:27] are kind of tied and um for the future I
think we kind of just need to nip this
[1:10:32] in the bud and uh move forward on this.
So thank you.
[1:10:37] Thanks, Councelor Crockett. So, at is
there anyone else wishing to comment or
[1:10:43] councelor Heman?
>> Yeah. So, just to be clear that those
[1:10:48] who will be assessed benefit are
primarily the industrial users of this
[1:10:53] future outlet. They are not adjacent
residents who are not going to say
[1:10:58] receive the same benefit
[1:11:02] » through your worship. Uh yes the only
people who will contribute financially
[1:11:07] to this would be future developers. So
anybody who would develop industrial
[1:11:12] lands in this in this area this 300 acre
par or 300 acre block. Um there is not
[1:11:17] anticipated to be any cost recovery from
either residential properties or
[1:11:21] existing industrial that have been
constructed based off the history here.
[1:11:26] Um we we're not sure um what approvals
were or were not given, but uh based off
[1:11:32] that fact, it doesn't seem fair to
retroactively ask them to to fix their
[1:11:36] outlet after they've already, you know,
already constructed their facility and
[1:11:39] got the approvals they thought were
necessary at the time.
[1:11:42] » And that that is because of a lack of a
traditional outlet in the form of an
[1:11:46] official drain that encompasses the
current topography and layout.
[1:11:52] uh that is uh that's not even called a
traditional but an acceptable outlet. Um
[1:11:59] groundwater infiltration is not an
acceptable outlet for industrial um
[1:12:04] storm water is known to have
contaminants at times. I'm not saying
[1:12:09] that there are known issues on these
sites, but they do not want that seeping
[1:12:12] into the ground causing groundwater
issues. So there was in 2010 a storm
[1:12:18] storm sewer outlet that was constructed
um down to the river by Stantech and
[1:12:22] this is connecting that and making
utilization in accordance with the plan
[1:12:26] that they had essentially the plan they
had laid the groundwork for in 2010.
[1:12:31] » Okay. So, I just want to connect some of
the dots here because I think that there
[1:12:34] are people who may not be paying into
the drainage
[1:12:39] assessment but are paying their storm
water fees and see a connection between
[1:12:44] these two things. And I think that is uh
valid and highly convoluted
[1:12:50] because the way that these things are
fund regulated by the province is that
[1:12:54] we are not able to fund them outside of
storm water activities unless there is
[1:13:00] you know a traditional agricultural
drain. So we're using this drainage
[1:13:06] assessment mechanism to recover the
upfront costs for this. We are financing
[1:13:11] it through the reserve funds and the
storm water fees which will then be
[1:13:15] recollected
through the
[1:13:19] some assessment and also through future
development fees. That's the whole
[1:13:23] conversation that we've been having in
disparate elements. Is that correct?
[1:13:28] » That is more or less correct. Yes.
>> Yes. And that and so for those who
[1:13:32] believe they may not directly benefit
from this storm water project, the fact
[1:13:37] that we are conducting storm water
improvements and infrastructure in on a
[1:13:44] continuous basis is what benefits the
urban area.
[1:13:49] Thank you.
>> Okay, everyone done? All right, then. So
[1:13:57] the decision before us then is that
report number DR00009-26
[1:14:03] prepared by the drainage superintendent
dated July 20th, 2026 concerning a
[1:14:09] meeting to consider the Thorndale
Industrial Storm Management uh report be
[1:14:15] received for information and that the
Thorndale Industrial Stormwater
[1:14:20] Management Report as prepared by Spread
Associates dated December the 4th of
[1:14:25] 2025. Five be received and adopted. A
mover into seconder. Moved by councelor
[1:14:31] Crockett and seconded by councelor
Haymon. And all in favor?
[1:14:37] Thanks very much for your attendance
here tonight.
[1:14:40] » Yes. Thank you very much.
>> Oh, I right. We have to send a date for
[1:14:44] the court of revisions. Um the date for
the the uh the uh county. Let's see now.
[1:14:51] What is the date you were thinking? So
it needs to be the week of August 10th
[1:14:56] to keep within and so we either need
three or five members depending on who's
[1:15:00] here. It will be a separate meeting and
held virtually.
[1:15:04] » Okay. And the deputy mayor has agreed to
be part of the court of revision. So two
[1:15:09] other people who would be willing to
serve.
[1:15:13] Um no you can't. Um okay. Uh counselors
Lockett counselors Crockett and uh Heid.
[1:15:21] Okay. and a date. Jen, have you got a
>> what works best for
[1:15:27] you guys? Staff are amiable to when it
works best for you.
[1:15:31] » Does the engineer have any issues or
conflicts?
[1:15:34] » Any Yeah.
>> No, thank you. Um we between Mike and
[1:15:39] myself, we will be able to accommodate.
However, um if you do need to change the
[1:15:45] timeline a little bit there, the act
reads 40 days from the mailing of the
[1:15:50] bylaw. So you could delay the mailing of
the bylaw a week or two if you wish to
[1:15:54] push it onto a regular.
>> We need to get this done before the
[1:15:57] 21st.
>> Yeah,
[1:15:59] » no problem. Thank
>> sorry. This is a bit different because
[1:16:02] of the election. So sorry about that. Um
>> August, does there is there a specific
[1:16:09] time? Do you want to do it in the
evening or do you want to do it during
[1:16:13] the day time? I know you work during the
day.
[1:16:17] » Yeah,
>> evening 5:00 PM work for you guys. Do
[1:16:21] you want we'll just do it virtually?
>> It will be virtual. Um just it's just
[1:16:27] easier but
>> Okay. So just show just so everybody is
[1:16:32] completely aware. So the the court of
revision will meet on August the 10th at
[1:16:37] 5:00 pm virtually.
>> Yes. And I just need the motion to
[1:16:41] appoint the members.
>> Okay. So uh a motion to appoint the
[1:16:45] members. Councelor Lock uh Crockett
rather and I guess councelor human can
[1:16:52] you second the motion to okay so
all in favor
[1:16:59] all right and that carries thanks very
much
[1:17:02] » thank you
>> thank you
[1:17:05] okay
so now we're going to move into agenda
[1:17:10] item number eight uh public
participation meetings regarding
[1:17:13] planning um and The motion reads that
the council adjourn its regular meeting
[1:17:20] at 6:17 p.m. and move into public
participation meetings pursuant to the
[1:17:26] planning act to consider applications
listed on the July 20th, 2026 regular
[1:17:32] council agenda. A mover and second moved
by councelor Locky and seconded by
[1:17:37] councelor Heman. All in favor?
And that carries.
[1:17:45] So the first item is the proposed plan
of subdivision application 39T-C26001
[1:17:54] and the property address is 30004
Westchester Bourne otherwise known as
[1:18:00] county uh road 74 and an overview by our
planner Alana Cortex. Go ahead.
[1:18:07] » Thank you worship through you. So the
purpose of this application is to create
[1:18:12] industrial lots for the future
development of the subject lands. The
[1:18:16] purpose of tonight's meeting is to
provide an overview of the proposal and
[1:18:20] also to receive any comments from
council and the public and staff will
[1:18:24] return at a future meeting with a
recommendation after reviewing all
[1:18:28] comments and technical studies. So, the
lands are designated rural industrial
[1:18:32] and natural heritage system according to
the official plan and they're zoned M2
[1:18:37] rural industrial as well as
environmental protection. Um, so the
[1:18:41] rural industrial designation is intended
to accommodate dry industrial uses such
[1:18:46] as warehousing, contractor's yards, and
truck terminals. So the sub subdivision
[1:18:52] proposes 13 industrial blocks, one storm
water management block, one open space
[1:18:58] block, one new looped road, two future
road connection blocks, and three
[1:19:04] reserve blocks along um Westchester.
So the proposed industrial blocks range
[1:19:10] from 2 to 4.45 45 acres and all lots
would be serviced by private wells and
[1:19:15] septic systems as municipal services are
not available. Um so a 3.68 acre storm
[1:19:22] water management pond is proposed and
the environmental protection lands are
[1:19:27] contained within the open space block
and will not be developed and there's a
[1:19:31] 30 m uh buffer that's shown on the draft
plan.
[1:19:36] So a transportation impact study,
servicing report and archaeological
[1:19:40] assessment were submitted. Uh the
archaeological assessment concluded that
[1:19:44] the subject lands do not contain
archaeological potential and no further
[1:19:48] assessment is required. Uh the
transportation um impact study and
[1:19:53] servicing report are undergoing
third-party review uh third-party peer
[1:19:57] review. The Upper Tam's River
Conservation Authority has confirmed
[1:20:01] that previously mapped regulated areas
do not meet the definition of regulated
[1:20:05] features. So the Upper Tempts River
Conservation Authority have recommended
[1:20:09] that these features be removed from the
regulated areas mapping. Um so agency
[1:20:14] comments were received from public
works. Um so the request for truck
[1:20:20] turning templates and confirmation of
adequate radi. Um the county engineer
[1:20:25] provided comments. Um access must align
with Bradley Avenue. Uh turning lanes
[1:20:30] required, no additional access points
permitted. The chief building official
[1:20:34] advised demolition permits would be
required for the existing house on the
[1:20:37] property. And um the septic and well for
that house must be decommissioned.
[1:20:42] Emergency services spoke to street
naming and 911 addressing requirements.
[1:20:46] Exxon Mobile um advised no
infrastructure is present, so no
[1:20:51] concerns. Um, and those were all the
agency comments received at this time
[1:20:55] and no public comments have been
received to date. So staff recommend
[1:20:59] that the report be received for
information and that staff be be
[1:21:02] directed to provide a subsequent report
which evaluates the application and
[1:21:07] takes into account all the public and
agency comments received with a
[1:21:10] recommendation for council's
consideration at a future meeting. Thank
[1:21:14] you.
>> Thanks very much, Alena. Um, is there
[1:21:19] any additional information to be
provided by either the owner or the
[1:21:23] agent?
Go right ahead.
[1:21:28] And you're Caitlyn?
>> I am. Yes. Yes. Thank you. Uh, through
[1:21:31] your worship. My name is Caitlyn
Crowley, uh, planner with Selinka Primo
[1:21:34] and the agent for this application. Um,
I just wanted to thank Elena for the
[1:21:37] overview. She did do a good job of just
kind of giving you a summary of the
[1:21:40] proposal. Um I just wanted to add that
um subject to the decision we would be
[1:21:44] subject to subdivision conditions um
which we would have to obviously satisfy
[1:21:48] in order to um execute the subdivision.
Um so I just wanted to note a lot of the
[1:21:53] detailed design for the actual
subdivision would be subject to a future
[1:21:56] detailed design phase and would be each
block would be also subject to site plan
[1:22:00] approval. Um we do intend for each of
the blocks to be compliant with the
[1:22:03] zoning bylaw. if they are sold in the
future. Um, anybody wanting to deviate
[1:22:08] from the bylaw would be required to
submit a zoning bylaw amendment. Um, I'm
[1:22:11] also available to answer any questions
tonight. Thanks.
[1:22:13] » Thank you very much, Caitlyn. Um, does,
uh, let's see now. Uh, any public
[1:22:19] questions? Anyone in the uh, gallery or
online who may want to comment or ask
[1:22:25] questions?
Would you like to come up to the and um,
[1:22:30] state your name and your property
address, please? Oh, can you turn the
[1:22:34] microphone on?
>> Sorry.
[1:22:38] » Just good.
>> We got to turn this thing on.
[1:22:42] » Say that again. So,
>> okay. I'm Lesley Pierce.
[1:22:46] » Okay.
>> I reside 3038 Westchester Barn.
[1:22:52] All righty. I guess I'll start with my
most important concern being the
[1:22:59] decrease in property value because it's
a residence as opposed to industrial.
[1:23:04] I'm going to be surrounded three sides
by this park.
[1:23:10] Um,
and I'm wondering about the quality of
[1:23:14] life. Of course, we're not going to have
the peace that we used to have, but it
[1:23:18] is what it is. Uh I don't know who gets
to decide um what industries are
[1:23:26] permitted adjacent to my property or
like either side behind.
[1:23:34] So
then there's possible light noise, dust
[1:23:39] pollution,
uh, and whether or not there would be a
[1:23:45] buffer or something between my residence
and the goings on of this industrial
[1:23:51] park.
So,
[1:23:54] and being a shift worker, well, I kind
of sleep in the day and like you can't
[1:24:01] really make a noise complaint during the
day.
[1:24:04] unfortunately, but it is what it is.
And then the ground water runoff. Um,
[1:24:12] without the crops there, there's going
to be more
[1:24:16] water running from the higher ground
down to my lower level,
[1:24:21] possibly contaminating wells or maybe
even depleting wells depending on how
[1:24:26] many wells are going to be drilled in
the neighboring area. So, that's
[1:24:30] basically my concerns.
[1:24:35] Okay, thank you very much.
>> Thank you.
[1:24:39] » Any uh responses to any of the concerns
raised,
[1:24:44] » Kaitlyn?
[1:24:48] Yes, thank you your your worship. Um I
can't necessarily speak to property
[1:24:52] value or quality of life. Um but in
terms of the industries, um it would be
[1:24:56] sub so the the owner of the property
currently owns the entire property. um
[1:25:00] as the subdivision gets subdivided and
sold off um those industries would have
[1:25:04] to again like I said comply with the
zoning bylaw but in terms of the
[1:25:07] specific nature of the industries um
that would be subject to to the owner
[1:25:11] and who he decides to sell it to. So um
he would essentially control who the who
[1:25:16] the uh subdivision blocks get sold to.
Um with regards to light noise and dust
[1:25:21] pollution um that would be subject to
the future site plan uh approval
[1:25:24] applications for each of the blocks. Um
each one would be subject to to provide
[1:25:28] a phototric plan which would not allow
any light pollution off the individual
[1:25:33] blocks. Um similar noise and dust would
be required because this would be a
[1:25:36] rural industrial subdivision. Um they
would be subject to a likely a noise and
[1:25:41] dust study uh through the site plan
approval application. And then in terms
[1:25:45] of groundwater runoff um our engineers
AGM did provide a um detailed servicing
[1:25:50] report. Um it does go into quite a bit
of detail just with regards to on-site
[1:25:54] water, storm water. Um so we do have a
stormwater management pond on the
[1:25:58] property and all flows
um post development would be required to
[1:26:03] be better or improved um from
pre-development flow. So we would be
[1:26:06] improving the situation um post
development. Um so I just wanted to make
[1:26:11] those few notes. Um thank you.
>> Okay. Thank you very much.
[1:26:18] Is there anyone else who want to uh make
a ask a question or make a comment? No.
[1:26:24] And no one online then, Sarah. Okay. All
right. Um, any questions from the
[1:26:30] members of council on this application?
Councelor Crockett.
[1:26:36] Thank you, Mayor. Uh, thank you, Elena
and Caitlyn, for um your kind of
[1:26:42] overview of that and thank you for
bringing those concerns forward. I think
[1:26:45] they're pretty typical, especially in
your specific area um since your
[1:26:50] neighboring lands are uh zoned uh rural
industrial. Um with that, I was
[1:26:56] wondering whether um Atlanta could just
expand on uh what the rural industrial
[1:27:02] zoning could potentially include. Um it
might give you peace of mind. It might
[1:27:08] not. Um but just of what could
potentially be out there. And then I
[1:27:12] just uh wanted to also ask when the um
when the property itself was zoned from
[1:27:20] agricultural to rural industrial when
that took place because although it
[1:27:24] looks um and is currently being farmed
um the zoning has uh been changed for my
[1:27:31] knowledge for some time
[1:27:37] through your worship to councelor
Crockett. Um so the property is
[1:27:41] currently zoned M2 rural industrial um
and it permits a range of uses um but
[1:27:46] dryindustrial uses in nature. So um a
tradesman shop, a service shop, a
[1:27:51] sawmill, truck terminal, vehicle repair
garage, warehouse. Um so there are a
[1:27:56] number of different uses that would be
permitted there. Um but they would, you
[1:28:00] know, the development of each of those
blocks would be subject to the site plan
[1:28:03] control process as Caitlyn mentioned. Um
so that would you know address buffering
[1:28:10] and and that sort of thing. Um with
regard to when the lands were zoned um
[1:28:16] to M2, um I can speak to when the lands
were redesated. Um so they were
[1:28:21] redesated from agricultural to
industrial in 2014 um as part of the
[1:28:27] 5-year review um for the official plan.
Um, so we would think that the the
[1:28:33] reasoning happened um around that time
as well. Thank you.
[1:28:39] » Thank you for that. Um, my second
question pertains to uh, as you
[1:28:43] mentioned, the laneways, that wasn't the
wording you used, but the, um, access
[1:28:48] points, I guess, from the proposed
subdivision out to neighboring lands. I
[1:28:53] was just wondering, does that then allow
for potential expansion into neighboring
[1:28:58] lands? Um should that agreement come
forward or is it kind of a standalone um
[1:29:04] subdivision
[1:29:09] » through you your worship to councelor
Crockett? Um so the subdivision does
[1:29:13] take into account potential future
expansion by including two future
[1:29:18] rightway blocks. Um but the inclusion of
any lands as part of the industrial
[1:29:25] designation would need to go through the
planning process. So, at this time, it's
[1:29:29] just kind of planning ahead potentially,
but that doesn't mean that those lands
[1:29:33] are going to be um included in this
subdivision um or or anything like that.
[1:29:38] The storm water management um will be
just for this subdivision and and
[1:29:43] everything with this development is uh
just related to what's being proposed at
[1:29:48] this time.
>> Okay. And my final question pertains uh
[1:29:51] falling down house on the property and
I'm wondering how that will be addressed
[1:29:54] and perhaps even a timeline um should
this be uh going through this evening
[1:30:02] through you your worship to councelor
Crockett. Um so part of the CBO's
[1:30:06] comments was um that the house be uh
demolished um and removed as part of a
[1:30:12] draft plan condition. So that would
definitely be included as a a draft plan
[1:30:17] condition. Thank you.
[1:30:23] » Anyone else from council with question?
Okay, seeing none, the there if there's
[1:30:30] no further discussion, the public
participation meeting is now closed and
[1:30:34] we move to the decision uh that report
number PDS-034-26
[1:30:41] with respect to application for proposed
draft plan of subdivision 39T-C2601
[1:30:49] as requested by um 1,303629
Ontario Limited for 30004 Westchester
[1:30:57] Borne County Road 74 be received for
information and that planning staff be
[1:31:03] directed to provide a subsequent report
evaluating the said application taking
[1:31:08] into account all public and agency
comments received with the
[1:31:12] recommendation for council's
consideration at a future future
[1:31:16] meeting. A move um moved by uh councelor
Lachi and seconded by councelor Heman.
[1:31:24] All in favor?
And that carries. Thanks very much.
[1:31:33] Next item on the agenda is item 8.2, the
official plan amendment application
[1:31:40] 01-26
and zoning bylaw amendment application
[1:31:45] Z8-26
for the property at 6545 tofog street.
[1:31:51] So, um, Elena, you're up again. Go
ahead.
[1:31:55] » Thank you. Worship through you. So the
purpose and effect of the official plan
[1:31:59] amendment is to redesate uh a portion of
the subject lands from the agricultural
[1:32:04] designation to the extractive industrial
designation. And the purpose of the
[1:32:08] zoning bylaw amendment is to reszone a
portion of the property from
[1:32:12] agricultural to extractive industrial.
And the effect of both is to permit the
[1:32:17] expansion of an existing sand and gravel
pit. Um so the existing tripar street
[1:32:22] pit which is located on the west side of
the subject lands and um this is
[1:32:26] otherwise prohibited. Um so the purpose
of tonight's meeting is to provide an
[1:32:31] overview of the proposal and receive any
comments from council and the public and
[1:32:36] staff will return at a future meeting
with a recommendation after reviewing
[1:32:39] all comments and technical studies.
So the subject property is approximately
[1:32:45] 21 hectares or 42 acres um and is
located on the south side of Trafalar
[1:32:50] Street west of Hunt Road. The lands are
currently used for agricultural purposes
[1:32:54] and contain um some natural heritage
features including significant woodlands
[1:32:58] and a portion of the north Dorchester
swamp. The applicant is proposing to
[1:33:03] expand the existing Tfalger pit which is
located on the west side um to allow the
[1:33:08] expansion. Um so the applicant is
requesting the official plan amendment
[1:33:13] to redesate the property to allow um
extractive industrial uses and um to
[1:33:18] reszone the property to also allow for
um extractive industrial uses. So the
[1:33:24] proposed expansion area is approximately
11 hectares in size um with about 9.4
[1:33:29] hectares being used for extraction. The
operation would involve the extraction
[1:33:34] of sand and gravel and would function as
an expansion of an existing pit. The
[1:33:38] applicant has indicated that access
would continue to use the the access
[1:33:43] would be um the existing entrance um to
the trfalar pit and um operating hours
[1:33:49] are proposed to be from Monday to Friday
7:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m. Saturday from
[1:33:54] 7:00 a.m. to 12:00 p.m. and no
operational or Sunday or Sundays or
[1:33:58] statutory holidays.
Um so this proposal um seeks uh below
[1:34:05] the water table extraction as as well as
above water table extraction. Um so with
[1:34:11] respect to oh so several comments were
uh or sever several technical studies
[1:34:16] were submitted in support of this
application um and those include a
[1:34:21] hydrogeeology study um natural heritage
and archaeology as well as an
[1:34:26] agricultural impact assessment and staff
will be discussing peerreview
[1:34:30] requirements with the applicant. Um so
with respect to agency comments um
[1:34:34] received um we've received comments from
the Upper Tempts River Conservation
[1:34:38] Authority and they've indicated they
have no objections to the applications.
[1:34:42] Um no concerns were identified by the
county engineer or the drainage
[1:34:46] superintendent and public works also
advised no concerns and no public
[1:34:50] comments have been received to date. So
following tonight's um public
[1:34:54] participation meeting, staff will
continue reviewing the applications and
[1:34:58] any comments received and a future
report will be brought forward with an
[1:35:02] evaluation and recommendation for
council's consideration. So staff
[1:35:06] recommend that the report be received
for information and that planning staff
[1:35:10] be directed to return with a subsequent
report and recommendation at a future
[1:35:14] meeting. Thank you.
>> Thank you very much, Alena. Um, okay.
[1:35:20] So,
is the um are the owners
[1:35:25] in here at all or the up
which is Oh, there you are. I'm sorry.
[1:35:32] Go right ahead whenever you're ready.
>> Thank you, your worship, and thank you,
[1:35:36] Elena, for providing the overview. Uh,
my name is Melanie Horton. I'm a
[1:35:40] registered professional planner with
Cher Planning and I'm the agent for
[1:35:45] patent aggregates and soils limited
who's the applicant in this uh case. Uh
[1:35:50] I do have a presentation so I'm going to
attempt to share my screen here.
[1:35:56] Hopefully you can see that.
Um, I'll do my best not to duplicate um
[1:36:02] the information that Alena has provided
in the overview, but I really wanted to
[1:36:06] just provide a few highlights of the uh
operations and rehabilitation plan and
[1:36:12] just some details about the related
aggregate resources act application. So,
[1:36:18] let me see if I can
figure out how to get to the next slide
[1:36:22] here.
There we go. Uh so as uh as was
[1:36:27] described in the overview, the site is
located at 6545 Trafalgar Street, part
[1:36:32] 17 concession 2. It's on the south side
of Trfalar, just west of Elgen Road and
[1:36:36] southwest of Tempsford. The existing pit
that's to the west of the site operates
[1:36:40] under license uh 626167.
Um that site has a licensed area of 27.3
[1:36:48] hectares and as was mentioned this
proposed pit expansion would be for an
[1:36:53] area of 11 he 11 hectares which is um
approximately half the 21 hectares of
[1:36:57] the of the parcel uh that we're looking
at today. The property is currently in
[1:37:02] agricultural use contains an aggive
agricultural field and is bounded by a
[1:37:08] tree line to the west and wood lots to
the south and east. At the south end of
[1:37:13] the property, there's the provinially
significant Dorchester swamp. And I
[1:37:17] think if you noticed on the um the
zoning image that uh was in Atlanta
[1:37:22] Atlanta's report, that uh feature is
zoned environmental protection. It is
[1:37:26] outside of the area that's proposed for
extraction.
[1:37:32] So what you see uh on this slide here is
just an excerpt from the aggregate
[1:37:36] resources act site plan and it shows the
sequence of operations. So essentially
[1:37:42] uh the intent would be to take the sand
and gravel from above and below the
[1:37:47] water table moving from west towards the
east part of the site in two areas. Uh
[1:37:53] the this resource is uh it's a very high
quality sand and uh patent aggregates
[1:37:58] and soils uses a lot of this resource to
supply uh bedding sand primarily for
[1:38:03] dairy operations in the area.
Um progressive rehabilitation will occur
[1:38:09] uh according to the requirements of the
aggreate resources act and uh so as an
[1:38:14] area's re is depleted of sand and gravel
rehabilitation occurs uh as they move to
[1:38:20] the next area. The undisturbed areas
would remain in agricultural use and the
[1:38:25] proposed tonnage limit here is 150,000
tons per year that would be combined
[1:38:30] with the existing license. So the
existing license also has a limit of
[1:38:35] 150,000 per year. So that wouldn't be
doubled. We we they just maintain that
[1:38:39] uh that same limit um uh with this
additional uh expansion. The hours of
[1:38:45] operation, as mentioned, were 7:00 a.m.
to 7:00 p.m. on weekdays and 7:00 a.m.
[1:38:49] to noon on Saturdays. And as also
mentioned, the proposed entrance would
[1:38:53] be through the existing pit onto
Trfalder Street.
[1:38:59] And the rehabilitation plan as you can
see here would uh with the below water
[1:39:03] extraction would create a pond on the
site. Uh the pond would be uh almost 6
[1:39:10] hectares so 5.7 hectares uh with 1.2
hectares of wetland around the edges of
[1:39:15] that pond and then 2.5 hectares of
meadow uh along the side slopes of the
[1:39:20] pond. So you can see uh on the image
there that uh represents the pond that
[1:39:25] would be created. The shoreline
plantings would uh be primarily uh
[1:39:30] native wetland plants and tree species.
[1:39:37] And just a couple of uh as as mentioned
there were a number of technical studies
[1:39:40] that were submitted uh both with the
planning act application and with the
[1:39:44] aggregate resources act application. And
just uh very high level some highlights
[1:39:50] from those reports. Um so the setbacks
that were recommended through the
[1:39:55] natural environment report include 15 m
setback from the woodland uh and a
[1:40:01] minimum 50 m buffer along the edge of
the wetland and there would be of course
[1:40:04] silt control measures which are typical
for uh extraction that's in proximity to
[1:40:09] a wetland area. Um there also some
proposed plantings and those details are
[1:40:14] all uh outlined on the on the site
plans. There are also uh four
[1:40:20] groundwater monitoring wells. You can
see them on the top image. So they're
[1:40:24] surround the site. Two on the east side
uh one at the southwest corner and then
[1:40:28] one one up near street. And those uh uh
track the water levels um around the
[1:40:36] site quarterly.
That's a fairly typical uh condition for
[1:40:40] below water aggregate operation. Uh just
to point out one other thing. You can
[1:40:45] kind of see on the image on the bottom
there, those are the contours. So
[1:40:49] there's a fairly high ridge in the
center of the site, the west west center
[1:40:52] of the site and it slopes down towards
the east part of the site. And as
[1:40:56] mentioned, it is a fairly uh rich sand
deposit uh that's thickest in that part
[1:41:02] of the property.
And just lastly, I just wanted to
[1:41:07] highlight uh the related aggregate
resources act application or ARRA we
[1:41:12] call it. uh my colleagues uh Bernie
Jansen and Samantha Brown from
[1:41:15] Harrington McCabvern are heading that uh
part of the process. Um they have made
[1:41:20] the application for a license under the
Aggate Resources Act and the Ministry of
[1:41:24] Natural Resources is currently reviewing
that. Uh the applicant did host a public
[1:41:30] information meeting back in May and
there was a comment period under the
[1:41:34] ARRA. It's a 60-day public comment
period, public and agency comment
[1:41:38] period. Uh and that ended June 15th. So
as a result of that uh there were
[1:41:43] comments uh provided by ministry of
environment conservation parks ministry
[1:41:48] of natural resources and upper temp's
region conservation authority or river
[1:41:52] conservation authority. There were no
concerns identified with either the
[1:41:56] natural environment or hydro geology
report and associated recommendations.
[1:42:01] uh M&R has asked for some changes to the
site plans and that's fairly typical uh
[1:42:07] in this day and age that MR is um very
specific about the wording on site plans
[1:42:13] to ensure that they're clear and
particularly that they're enforceable.
[1:42:18] So there were some suggestions made and
Harrington Macabin is working through
[1:42:22] those changes uh right now and as part
of that uh circulation there were no
[1:42:27] public objections that were received.
So, that's I think that's my last slide.
[1:42:32] Uh, happy to happy to answer any
questions you may have this evening.
[1:42:37] » Thanks very much, Miss Horton. Um, I
I'll now ask if is there anyone in the
[1:42:42] uh gallery or online who wishes to ask
questions or comment? Okay. All righty.
[1:42:48] Um, so I will turn it over to the
members of council in case they have
[1:42:52] any.
No questions from council.
[1:42:58] If there's no the discussion. The public
participation meeting is now closed and
[1:43:03] we'll move to the decision portion. A
mover and a seconder that report number
[1:43:08] PDS031-26
[1:43:11] with respect to the applications for
official plan amendment 01-26
[1:43:16] and zoning bylaw amendment Z826 as
requested by patent aggregates and soils
[1:43:22] limited for 6545 to Fogger Street be
received for information and that the
[1:43:28] planning staff be directed to provide a
subsequent report evaluating the said
[1:43:33] applications taking into count all
public and agency comments received with
[1:43:39] a recommendation for council's
consideration at a future meeting.
[1:43:44] Okay. Moved by councelor Heman and
seconded by councelor Locki. All in
[1:43:49] favor?
And that carries.
[1:43:54] » Thank you.
>> Thank you.
[1:43:56] Um, temporary use bylaw amendment
application Z1-26
[1:44:01] for property 24054
Heritage Road. It's item number 8.3 on
[1:44:07] your uh pre-irculated agenda.
So again, um, you're busy tonight.
[1:44:17] Okay, you go ahead when you're ready.
>> Thank you. Your worship through you. So
[1:44:21] the purpose and effect of this
application is to permit two single
[1:44:25] detached dwellings on the subject lands
for a temporary period not to exceed 3
[1:44:30] years while a new dwelling is being
constructed. So the applicants are
[1:44:34] proposing to construct a new dwelling
while the while temporarily retaining
[1:44:38] the existing dwelling during during the
construction process. And because the
[1:44:42] agricultural a zone only require or only
permits one dwelling on a lot, temporary
[1:44:47] zoning is required to allow both
dwellings to exist at the same time. So
[1:44:51] the planning act permits municipalities
to authorize temporary uses for periods
[1:44:56] up to 3 years. And temp's official plan
um contemplates situations where two
[1:45:01] homes temporarily temporarily exist on a
property while the replacement dwelling
[1:45:06] is being constructed. So planning staff
have reviewed the application and are
[1:45:10] satisfied that the proposal is temporary
in nature is compatible with the
[1:45:14] surrounding area can be adequately
serviced and will not create adverse
[1:45:18] impacts on neighboring properties or the
broader agricultural area. So to ensure
[1:45:23] the temporary nature of the approval is
maintained, the applicant will be
[1:45:27] required to enter into a temporary use
agreement with the municipality and the
[1:45:31] agreement requires the existing dwelling
to be removed following following
[1:45:35] occupancy of the new dwelling and
includes a security deposit to ensure
[1:45:39] compliance.
So the application was circulated to
[1:45:44] relevant agencies. No objections were
received and the comments can be found
[1:45:48] within the report. In addition, um, no
public comments have been received to
[1:45:53] date. Staff note, while there is a staff
report regarding options for temporary
[1:45:58] use provisions to be heard later
tonight, this request was brought
[1:46:02] forward by the applicant with the
understanding that changes may be coming
[1:46:05] to the temporary use process. Staff are
satisfied that the proposal is
[1:46:10] consistent with the provincial planning
statement, conforms to the county and
[1:46:14] temp center official plans, and
represents appropriate planning. So
[1:46:19] staff uh recommend approval of the
application um and that the associated
[1:46:24] temporary use agreement be executed and
um that council considers the
[1:46:28] implementing bylaw. Thank you. I'm here
to answer any questions.
[1:46:32] » Thank you. Alena,
is anyone in the chambers or online who
[1:46:37] want to ask questions or comment?
Okay.
[1:46:43] Any questions from the members of
council?
[1:46:47] All right, no questions. So, we'll close
the public participation meeting
[1:46:53] and the the decision is um attached to
your agenda that the report be received,
[1:47:00] etc.
moving moved by councelor Hman and
[1:47:06] seconded by councelor Crockett. All in
favor and that carries.
[1:47:15] So, a mover and a seconder that the
planning public participation meetings
[1:47:20] adjourn at 6:47 p.m. in order to sit as
a committee of adjustment under the
[1:47:26] planning act to consider minor variance
applications listed on the July 20th,
[1:47:32] 2026 regular council agenda.
Moved by councelor Loy,
[1:47:38] second I'm sorry, moved by councelor
Crockett and seconded by councelor
[1:47:42] Locki. All in favor?
[1:47:47] And that carries. Sorry.
[1:47:52] Okay. All righty. So, this is a um item
number nine on your um committee of
[1:48:01] adjustment agenda
9.1, a minor variance application A6-26
[1:48:09] for the property at 5338 Marian Street.
and we'll look to Aaron to present.
[1:48:17] » Thank you very much your worship. So the
next application before the committee
[1:48:21] this evening again is for 5338 Marian
Street in Dorchester. The purpose and
[1:48:27] effect of this application is to seek
relief to permit the construction of a
[1:48:30] pool house and shed which both exceed
the maximum floor area and height for
[1:48:35] accessory buildings in the R1-15 zone.
Specifically, the applicant is proposing
[1:48:40] to construct a pool house that is 58.7
square meters in size and a detached
[1:48:45] shed that is 117.98
meters squared for a combined floor area
[1:48:51] total of 176.69
uh square meters, whereas the zoning
[1:48:56] bylaw permits a maximum floor area of 90
square meters or 75% of the floor area
[1:49:01] of the dwelling, whichever is lesser.
The application also requests to permit
[1:49:05] a height of 5.28 28 m for the pool house
and 6.2 m for the detached shed, whereas
[1:49:11] accessory buildings are limited to 5 m
in height in the R1-15 zone. The subject
[1:49:18] lands are located on the north side of
Maran Street, east of Claraara Street in
[1:49:21] Dorchester. The property is
approximately two 2,395.9
[1:49:26] meters in size and approximately 30
meters of frontage along Marian Street.
[1:49:31] The subject lands are currently vacant,
but the applicants have submitted a
[1:49:34] building permit to construct a two-story
dwelling, which is approximately 390.5
[1:49:40] square meters in gross floor area and a
height of approximately 11 m from grade
[1:49:44] to peak. The dwelling will be
constructed on private well and septic
[1:49:48] surfaces. There is a municipal drain
which runs east west across the frontage
[1:49:52] of the property. This restricts the
septic system from being located in the
[1:49:56] front yard. And so to prop properly
accommodate the proposed structures, the
[1:50:00] septic bed is to be separated into two
parts in the rear yard, which can be
[1:50:04] seen on the site plan that is attached
to my report. In addition to the new
[1:50:08] dwelling, the applicant is proposing to
construct an ingground pool with pool
[1:50:12] house and a detached shed in the rear
yard. The structures would exceed again
[1:50:17] the maximum permitted floor area of
accessory buildings in a residential
[1:50:20] zone. This is currently limited to 90
square meters in size or 75% of the
[1:50:26] floor area of the dwelling whichever is
lesser. So based on the size of the
[1:50:30] dwelling that is proposed the maximum
permitted floor area is 90 square meters
[1:50:35] as 75% of the floor area of the house
would be 292
[1:50:39] m. The applicant has advised that the
pool house would contain a changing
[1:50:43] area, related pool equipment, and a
covered seating area. And the detached
[1:50:47] shed would contain a golf simulator,
which is why the size and height
[1:50:50] increases requested. Um, in total, the
applicant has advised that the law
[1:50:55] coverage of all buildings and structures
would be approximately 14%. The subject
[1:50:59] lands are designated residential in our
official plan and zoned a sightspecific
[1:51:04] residential first density R1-15 zone in
our zoning bylaw.
[1:51:10] So the uh planning act provides uh
[1:51:22] sorry Erin I I think we we've lost audio
or did we lose you entirely
[1:51:32] » that the principal dwelling will be
larger
[1:51:44] Did we lose you again, Erin?
>> I'm so sorry. Can is it okay if I turn
[1:51:50] my camera off? I am having a an unstable
internet evening.
[1:51:54] » Oh, okay.
Do you want to turn your camera on
[1:51:58] there?
>> Yes. Yes.
[1:52:03] » Okay. Shall I continue?
Yeah, sure. We can hear you. It's just
[1:52:07] there was a little glitch there. Go
ahead.
[1:52:09] » Sorry about that. Uh, so my forecast
analysis was primarily based on the fact
[1:52:15] that the principal dwelling would be
taller and larger than the accessory
[1:52:19] buildings uh as proposed. Um, the height
increase for both the pool house and the
[1:52:24] detached shed uh is nominal in my
opinion uh specifically given the
[1:52:29] proposed height of the single detached
dwelling. the fact that they would be
[1:52:33] located in the rear yard and the fact
that they would not contain a second
[1:52:38] story so that overlook or private
privacy concerns for neighboring
[1:52:42] properties would not be affected.
Furthermore, uh the overall lot coverage
[1:52:46] of all buildings and structures on the
property is proposed to be approximately
[1:52:50] 14%.
Which remains substantially below the
[1:52:53] permitted lot coverage of 35%. So I do
not appear it would not appear to be um
[1:52:59] an overdevelopment of the site from a
visual perspective. I would also note
[1:53:05] that the uh combined
um accessory building lot coverage is
[1:53:10] cumulative and it is spread across two
separate accessory buildings which would
[1:53:15] limit uh the visual appearance of these
two separate structures um being the
[1:53:22] dominant structures on the property. So
with that being said, the application
[1:53:26] was circulated as per the requirements
of the planning act. Uh we did not
[1:53:30] receive any comments or concerns from
any agencies or departments and I did
[1:53:34] not receive any public comments on the
application as well. So that being said,
[1:53:38] my recommendation this evening is uh
that the minor variance be granted
[1:53:43] subject to one condition and that is
that the dwelling is constructed as per
[1:53:47] approved plans submitted by Everest
Estate Homes dated March 20th, 2026. The
[1:53:52] only reason why uh I'm requiring that
condition is that my analysis was very
[1:53:58] much based on the fact that the house
would be of a specific size and height.
[1:54:03] So I'm happy to answer any questions if
council has any this evening. Thank you.
[1:54:08] » Thanks very much Aaron. Um so is there
anyone in the chambers who wishes to
[1:54:13] speak? Yes. Do you want to stand up and
tell us your name? And are you the
[1:54:18] builder?
>> Yeah, it's through you your worship. I'm
[1:54:20] Nathan Cook. uh the builder of Everest
Estate Homes.
[1:54:23] » Okay.
[1:54:26] » Any additional comments you over and
above the planning report?
[1:54:29] » No, I want to thank Aaron for her
thorough report. Uh it was uh well done
[1:54:33] and I appreciate this uh the support for
moving the uh the motion forward and I
[1:54:38] look forward to council support as well.
And I'm happy to answer any questions
[1:54:42] anyone may have.
>> Okay. Thank you.
[1:54:45] » All right. Uh and there's uh let's see.
I guess that is it. any so I'm assuming
[1:54:51] there's no one in the council chamber
two months and no one online. Okay. So
[1:54:55] we'll turn it over then if there are any
questions from the members of the
[1:54:59] committee.
[1:55:02] Okay. All righty. So if there's no
further discussion we will close the
[1:55:07] public uh participation hearing and move
to the discussion. It's fairly lengthy.
[1:55:12] It's appended to your uh to your agenda.
Um I'll give you a moment.
[1:55:22] And it's online.
Okay. A mover in secondary if you're
[1:55:27] ready. Moved by councelor Crockett and
seconded by councelor Locki. All in
[1:55:33] favor? And that carries. Thanks for your
attendance here tonight.
[1:55:42] The next item is 9.2 two, minor variance
application A7-26
[1:55:47] for the property at 3558 Elgen Road.
Overview of the uh planner and again um
[1:55:54] Miss Bes
if you're still around there.
[1:55:58] » I am. Thank you very much.
>> Go ahead Erin whenever you're ready.
[1:56:04] » So the purpose and effect of uh these
minor variance applications, there's
[1:56:09] technically two. we have separated them
into two separate um motions this
[1:56:14] evening to try to keep the two uh
specific variances separate. So the
[1:56:20] first one A7-26
is looking to seek relief from the
[1:56:23] zoning bylaw to permit a a minimum lot
area of approximately 28 hectares
[1:56:28] whereas a minimum lot area of 40
hectares is required within the
[1:56:31] agricultural zone. The variance is
required as a condition of consent
[1:56:36] application B2125
which approved the conveyance of
[1:56:39] approximately 0.37 hectares from the
subject farm to the abuing residential
[1:56:44] property municipally known as 3558 Elgen
Road. The second application this
[1:56:49] evening is A826
and this is seeking relief from the
[1:56:53] zoning bylaw to permit two existing
residential accessory buildings to
[1:56:57] remain in front of a future single
detached dwelling on the lands
[1:57:00] municipally known as 3558 Elgen Road.
The subject lands associated with minor
[1:57:06] variance application 87-26
are the uh 28.37 hectare farmlands
[1:57:13] located on the southeast corner of Crom
Drive and Elgen Road. The property
[1:57:17] contains an industrial soil and gravel
operation in the northwest corner as
[1:57:21] well as proincially significant
wetlands, significant woodlands uh which
[1:57:26] are all regulated by the upper temps
river conservation authority as well as
[1:57:30] uh cash crop production on the balance
of the land. On March uh 9th of this
[1:57:35] year, council considered my planning
report PDS-011-26,
[1:57:41] which regarded the consent application
to convey the 0.37 hectares from the
[1:57:47] subject farm to the uh abuing
residential property. Staff recommended
[1:57:51] refusal of the application and as a
result did not provide a draft list of
[1:57:55] conditions. Uh however, council did
direct staff to uh prepare a recommended
[1:58:00] list of conditions for consideration at
a subsequent meeting which was brought
[1:58:04] forward on March 23rd of this year under
a separate report. Uh I did provide a
[1:58:09] list of conditions of approval which
were approved by council. One of those
[1:58:15] conditions was that the owner must
obtain relief from the minimum lot area
[1:58:19] requirement of the agricultural a zone
as the uh retained farm parcel which is
[1:58:25] which was 28
um sorry 28.37 hectares and it was
[1:58:32] losing uh approximately 0.37 hectares
and moving uh being reduced more than
[1:58:38] the 40 hectares. Therefore, a minor
variance application is required. Um,
[1:58:44] the purpose of the approved lot
condition is to enlarge the existing
[1:58:48] residential parcel to accommodate the
future construction of another single
[1:58:52] detached dwelling. The new dwelling is
proposed to be located further from
[1:58:56] Elgen Road than the existing residence
and this would result in the existing
[1:59:01] residential accessory buildings being
situated in front of the dwelling and
[1:59:05] closer to the front lot line which is
not permitted in our zone in our zoning
[1:59:09] bylaw. So the applicant has also made
the application A826
[1:59:14] to permit this arrangement in the
future. The residential property at
[1:59:19] 35588 Elgen Road has an area of
approximately 0.36 hectares. Upon
[1:59:25] completion of consent application B2125,
the lot would increase in size to
[1:59:30] approximately 0.73 hectares in size. So
I did want to note that the uh original
[1:59:36] planning recommendation for the consent
application was refusal. Um, I am of the
[1:59:41] opinion that the proposal resulted in
the unnecessary loss of approximately
[1:59:46] 0.37 hectares of productive agricultural
land for residential purpose purposes.
[1:59:51] This is not consistent with the
provincial planning statement or in
[1:59:54] conformity with our official plans. Um,
and although council did ultimately
[1:59:58] approve the consent application, um, my
recommendation or my planning opinion
[2:00:03] regarding the appropriateness of the
proposal has not changed. Um so that is
[2:00:07] why under the four tests of minor
variance in my analysis section um I did
[2:00:13] not find support for the four tests. Um
specifically with application for minor
[2:00:18] variance A7 the variance would
permanently recognize an undersized
[2:00:23] agricultural parcel which results in the
removal of productive farmland for
[2:00:27] residential purposes. The proposed
reduction is not associated with a legal
[2:00:31] or technical reason contemplated by the
provincial policy, but rather
[2:00:35] facilitates a continued expansion of an
existing residential lot.
[2:00:39] Further for application of minor
variance A8-26,
[2:00:44] I did want to note that uh test number
two is the variance and appropriate use
[2:00:48] of the lands. I did find support for
this test um from a site planning
[2:00:53] perspective relocating the principal
dwelling further from Elgen Road which
[2:00:57] is a county road. This would improve the
residential setback from the road itself
[2:01:01] and provide a more desirable location
for the future dwelling. The proposed
[2:01:06] variance would allow the existing
accessory buildings to remain in place
[2:01:09] uh avoiding the need to relocate or
demolish the existing structures. And in
[2:01:13] this that respect I am of the opinion
that uh the second test of minor
[2:01:17] variance can be um accommodated. However
um under the the planning act the four
[2:01:25] tests must all be satisfied in order to
find support for a minor variance
[2:01:30] application. Um, as outlined in my
report, I do remain of the opinion that
[2:01:35] the proposed variances facilitate the
continued loss and fragmentation of
[2:01:40] prime agricultural land and establish a
site layout that does not represent good
[2:01:44] planning. Um, so therefore, my
recommendation uh this evening is
[2:01:50] refusal of both applications. I noted
the reasons um in my report and did want
[2:01:57] to note that the reasons for A826 did
not include the second test which is the
[2:02:03] appropriateness um test. So I'm happy to
answer any questions that council may
[2:02:08] have this evening.
>> Thanks very much a um Aaron. I
[2:02:13] appreciate that. Um any additional
information from the from the agent or
[2:02:20] the applicant?
Hey,
[2:02:45] I don't know. Did this question asked
before? There's nobody online wishing to
[2:02:49] speak this either.
Any questions or comments from the
[2:02:54] committee members? Go for
>> Thank you, worship. And I'd just like to
[2:02:59] thank the um the planner for the
presentation and I understand that we
[2:03:03] put you in a awkward position in the
past and that you are being consistent
[2:03:08] with the professional standards of your
discipline and uh I think that you know
[2:03:13] the basis on which it was approved in
terms of this being you know a a like a
[2:03:19] common sense use of the land and I think
if you look at it as part of
[2:03:26] an accessory use and accommodating that
and that the proposed lot that resulting
[2:03:32] from the the severance would uh be
within the overall rural uh residential
[2:03:38] guidelines. I think this is I think this
makes sense. And just for fun, if you
[2:03:44] look at all of the other things that we
looked at this night this night, I think
[2:03:48] this would be the smallest amount of
fragmentation that will occur.
[2:03:58] I'm sorry. Anyone else? Councelor
Crockett.
[2:04:01] » Uh thank you. Thank you for your
comments, Tom. Um I would have to agree
[2:04:05] with that. Um but I think further to
that is we uh when we passed the
[2:04:11] conveyance back in March, we had uh
these specific conversations um at both
[2:04:16] of the meetings in regards to um
uh in regards to uh the changing of
[2:04:24] property lines um as well as the
accessory buildings being in front or
[2:04:29] rather beside uh the proposed uh
dwelling in the future. So with that, um
[2:04:36] I would like to move um a motion to
grant the minor variance. Um but if
[2:04:43] there's
>> Yes, I can read the reasons. Do you want
[2:04:46] me to read the whole thing?
>> You don't have to read the whole thing.
[2:04:50] Um as long as you're good with A7 and A8
and then just give us some reasons.
[2:04:55] » Uh perfect. So I will go forward with
moving in a mo a motion to grant both
[2:04:59] the minor variance of A7 and A8. The
reasons being uh that it maintains the
[2:05:04] intent and purpose of the official plan.
Its council has already approved the
[2:05:08] principle of this law addition through
consent application B2125.
[2:05:13] It maintains the intent and purpose of
the zoning bylaw. It's desirable for the
[2:05:18] appropriate development of the land as
this fulfills a condition of consent
[2:05:23] B21-25
and the reduction is minor in nature and
[2:05:28] does not alter the agricultural
character of the error area or conflict
[2:05:31] with the farming operation.
[2:05:36] » Thanks councelor Crocker. a seconder
with that motion.
[2:05:42] Council human and all in favor and that
carries. Okay. Thank you. Thanks for
[2:05:48] attendance here.
[2:05:54] Um a uh a mover and a seconder that the
committee of adjustment adjourn at 7:05
[2:06:01] p.m. and council reconvene its regular
meeting. Moved by councelor Locky and
[2:06:07] seconded by councelor heman. All in
favor? And that carries.
[2:06:13] So we move on to the approval of the
previous me uh minutes. That is the
[2:06:18] meeting of Monday June 29th 2026 to be
approved as circulated. Councelor uh
[2:06:26] Crockett and Councelor Locky. All in
favor?
[2:06:31] And that carries.
Items on the consent uh consent agenda
[2:06:38] um are listed, I'm sorry, are received
for information in one motion. Council
[2:06:43] members may request that one or more
items be separated for further action.
[2:06:48] Anyone wanting to pull anything from
consent agender?
[2:06:56] Councelor Locki and Councelor Crockett.
All in favor, don't scratch your head.
[2:07:03] It counts as
All right. And reports of departments,
[2:07:09] uh, item number 12.1,
PDS03726,
[2:07:15] options to review temporary use
provisions, and uh, Lindseay Nur, your
[2:07:21] planner to present.
[2:07:27] » Good evening, everybody. Uh the report
before you was prepared in response to
[2:07:32] council's direction to review whether
there may be a more streamlined approach
[2:07:37] to situations where a proponent is
building a new house on a lot and wishes
[2:07:41] to remain in the existing until at such
a time the new dwelling is ready to be
[2:07:46] occupied. Um, currently because our
zoning bylaw only permits one dwelling
[2:07:51] on a lot, anyone wishing to do this, um,
will have to go through a temporary use
[2:07:57] zoning bylaw amendment, as we're all
familiar with. Um, that process
[2:08:00] currently requires a temporary use
application, which is a total of $1,200,
[2:08:06] uh, a security deposit of $5,000, and a
registered agreement requiring the
[2:08:11] removal of the original dwelling once
the new home is occupied. Um after a
[2:08:15] wholesome review, everyone does it a
little bit differently and calls it a
[2:08:19] million different things. Um but some
things are all rooted in the same
[2:08:24] trends. So some municipalities um rather
than requiring a planning application uh
[2:08:29] would administer it through the building
department and property owners enter
[2:08:34] into a demolition agreement provide a
financial security tied to the estimated
[2:08:39] demolition cost and are required to
remove the existing dwelling shortly
[2:08:43] after occupying the new one. Uh the
agreement is then registered on title
[2:08:48] which still provides strong enforcement
mechanisms should the owner fail to
[2:08:52] comply. So after reviewing the
approaches um I believe there's merit in
[2:08:56] modernizing temp's process for owners
staff and council ease applications
[2:09:03] could be administered through a
delegated process tied to a building
[2:09:06] permit um while still requiring those
registered agreements and appropriate
[2:09:10] securities to ensure that the original
dwelling is removed. So this approach
[2:09:15] would reduce costs, reduce
administrative burden on applicants. As
[2:09:18] you know, there's a 20-day uh notice
period for any zoning bylaw amendments
[2:09:23] um and eliminate unnecessary planning
applications for what are generally very
[2:09:27] straightforward uh requests that allow
staff to process these applications way
[2:09:32] more efficiently. Um at the same time it
maintains the important safeguards that
[2:09:37] protect the municipality namely
registered agreements, financial
[2:09:40] securities, clear timelines and
enforcement provisions that ensure that
[2:09:45] not only the permanent dwelling is
occupied with the old dwelling will be
[2:09:50] removed. Accordingly, staff are
recommending that council receive this
[2:09:54] report for information and direct staff
to prepare the necessary housekeeping
[2:09:58] amendments uh for consideration at a
future date. Thanks.
[2:10:04] Thank you very much, Lindsay. Um, any
questions, comments from council? Uh,
[2:10:10] did you have your hand up? No.
Go ahead.
[2:10:14] » I just want to say thank you and I
support the staff recommendation.
[2:10:22] » Thank you, your worship, and uh, thank
you to
[2:10:27] Lindsay uh, for preparing this. And uh I
think we had an example today how this
[2:10:31] would uh have saved us a bit of time. Um
so I think that this serves all parties
[2:10:36] involved and it's a good step forward.
Um I just have one wrinkle that I'd like
[2:10:43] to run across uh the desk here which is
um I know we have had discussions uh at
[2:10:51] different points in time about um
subordinating secondary dwellings in the
[2:10:57] context of ARUS and how some properties
having smaller uh primary dwellings but
[2:11:05] seeking to replace them while retaining
that structure and I know we are seeking
[2:11:12] guidance from the county on how uh best
to do this but I I know that there was
[2:11:18] uh potentially a test case with respect
to Mr. Jameson on Marion and um I know
[2:11:24] that um if we require them to enter into
a demolition agreement at the beginning
[2:11:30] then that would potentially close that
uh opportunity uh from the get-go. So I
[2:11:36] don't see that as a reason to deny this
proposal. I just want to flag it and
[2:11:42] that you know if we we do this um we are
closing that door and maybe there might
[2:11:48] be an opportunity to figure out an
accommodation once that total uh pathway
[2:11:55] becomes clear.
[2:11:59] » Thanks Councelor Haymon.
Jennifer, would you like to speak to
[2:12:04] this?
[2:12:07] » Thank you, your worship and through the
council. Um, so what I'm aware of is
[2:12:12] that county council has recently
um had their official plan approved and
[2:12:18] it is now in place. They do include some
ARU policies which would allow for
[2:12:23] potentially a planning application that
would um consider
[2:12:30] um having a second dwelling as an ARU.
And so whether or not that's the first
[2:12:34] dwelling or the second dwelling, but
that's potentially a possibility if a
[2:12:38] planning application is made before this
temporary use process takes place. So
[2:12:43] somebody could come forward with an
intention, get a planning approval, and
[2:12:47] that would be available.
through your worship. So am I correct in
[2:12:52] assuming that that may be a separate
application process altogether not
[2:12:57] requiring this vehicle?
>> That's correct. Yes.
[2:13:04] » Okay. Anyone else?
In that case, then a mover and a
[2:13:08] seconder to receive the report and that
council direct staff to prepare the
[2:13:13] necessary draft zoning bylaw amendment
for consideration at a future council
[2:13:18] meeting to implement the recommended
approach to temporary use provisions for
[2:13:23] replacement dwellings.
Moved by councelor Crockett, seconded by
[2:13:27] councelor Locki and all in favor
and that carries.
[2:13:36] Um
are you going to Okay. The next one is
[2:13:41] 12.2 on your agenda. Um the MLPS
temporary use for fire station number
[2:13:48] two. We'll ask the CEO to present.
Thank you uh your worship and through to
[2:13:55] councel on behalf of my colleague um
Chief Dorin. This is an opportunity that
[2:14:01] has presented itself while the uh MLPS
does some upgrades at another facility
[2:14:08] and they had a conversation about
potential use of uh an existing facility
[2:14:14] that we own. Um, so the chief has had
conversations with director McDonald and
[2:14:19] myself. Um, and we thought it was a
reasonable concept to put forward for a
[2:14:24] very short period of time and we'd like
to see that for us and I'm recommending
[2:14:28] it to council that um, an agreement for
a short period of time be entered into
[2:14:33] and that staff be able to negotiate that
giving given the timelines we're
[2:14:38] looking.
[2:14:42] » Thank you. Um any um any questions or
comments from council on this?
[2:14:50] » Councelor Hman.
>> I think it's always good to work with
[2:14:53] our other uh emergency service providers
and it is nice that that would also mean
[2:14:58] that there'd be some operating base
closer to our community. So it's a good
[2:15:03] good suggestion. Thank you, Steph.
[2:15:34] Thank you. Excuse me. Thank you,
worship. report PW--022
[2:15:38] um 26 Shields Lane vehicle length
restriction recommends prohibiting
[2:15:42] vehicles longer than 10.5 meters from
crossing the railway crossing at Shields
[2:15:47] Lane and amending the parking traffic
bylaw 21-2024
[2:15:52] schedule G accordingly. Uh the changes
follow a June 1st 2026 collision at
[2:15:58] Shields Lane grade crossing involving a
CN freight train and a triacle truck. no
[2:16:03] serious injuries or toxic spills were
reported. Uh or a review under Transport
[2:16:09] Canada grade crossing regulations
identified that sighteline requirements
[2:16:13] depend on the designed vehicle used with
a Transport Canada safety inspection.
[2:16:19] Sorry. Used um Transport Candy Transport
Canada safety inspector agreed upgrading
[2:16:25] the design vehicle to a medium singleuse
truck would improve safety for longer
[2:16:30] agricultural service type vehicles.
Updating the grade crossing data and
[2:16:36] required signage which should be
happening tomorrow morning. Um and the
[2:16:40] bylaw documentation are being finalized
and remaining data upgrades will be
[2:16:45] submitted to the transport to transport
Canada before the July 28th 26 2026
[2:16:51] deadline. Have any questions? I'd be
happy to answer them.
[2:16:55] » Thanks Mr. Craraven. Any questions from
council?
[2:17:00] » I think in light of what happened this
is a good move.
[2:17:03] » Lucky.
>> Okay. a mover and a seconder to receive
[2:17:07] this um report and authorize the fire
chief to negotiate a temporary facility.
[2:17:13] You Oh, I'm sorry. I dropped down that
line again. Um the report number PW022
[2:17:20] Shield 26 Shields lanes vehicle length
re restriction be received for
[2:17:25] information
that vehicles with a length greater than
[2:17:30] 10.5 m be prohibited to cross the
railway crossing on Shields Lane and
[2:17:35] that council consider the bylaw
amendment bylaw 212024
[2:17:42] parking and traffic bylaw in bylaw
section of the agenda.
[2:17:46] Moving the second move by uh councelor
Heman and seconded by councelor
[2:17:52] Crockett. All in favor and that carries.
So the next one is item 12.4 FS014-26
[2:18:04] request permanent doubling of the
Ontario community infrastructure fund
[2:18:09] and we'll look to our director of
financial services. Mr. Clark, may you
[2:18:14] » through you mayor. This report seeks
council support for an MFOA resolution
[2:18:19] requesting that the province permanently
maintain the current enhanced OC if
[2:18:24] funding level beyond 2026. Uh Temp
Center currently receives just under
[2:18:29] $860,000
annually through OCF if making it one of
[2:18:34] the municipality's most significant and
predictable sources of infrastructure
[2:18:38] funding.
These funds help support the renewal of
[2:18:42] existing bridges, roads, water,
wastewater, and storm water
[2:18:45] infrastructure while reducing pressures
on tax, reserves, rates, and debt. Staff
[2:18:51] are recommending council endorse the
resolution and forward it to the
[2:18:55] province for consideration. I'd be happy
to take any questions.
[2:18:59] » Thanks, Mr. Clark. Any questions from
council?
[2:19:04] » No. Okay. Uh then a mover and a seconder
for the um uh
[2:19:12] motion as appended to your agenda.
Councelor Heman and Councelor Locky. All
[2:19:18] in favor? And that carries.
[2:19:24] And again, we'll turn to Mr. part for
item number 12.5, the FS016-262025
[2:19:32] operating and capital budget monitoring
report
[2:19:38] through you mayor. This report presents
the municipality's 2025 year end
[2:19:42] operating and capital budget results and
for the first time a formal capital
[2:19:47] project closing report. The operating
results reflect a relatively balanced
[2:19:52] year-end position. uh property tax
supported deficit is approximately
[2:19:56] 87,000. This will be funded from the tax
stabilization reserve. A water rate
[2:20:02] supported surplus of approximately
149,000 to be transferred to the water
[2:20:07] capital reserve and a wastewater rate
supported surplus of approximately
[2:20:12] 244,000
to be transferred to the wastewater
[2:20:16] capital reserve. Council will also
notice a new capital project closure
[2:20:21] component. While council approves
capital budgets annually, completed
[2:20:26] capital projects have not historically
been brought forward in a consolidated
[2:20:30] report for formal closure. The purpose
of this process is to improve
[2:20:34] transparency, strengthen financial
reporting, and ensure that completed
[2:20:39] projects are formally closed with any
uncommitted funding returned to its
[2:20:43] original source for future capital needs
and consideration.
[2:20:47] This year, administration is
recommending the closure of 33 completed
[2:20:51] capital projects uh which you'll find on
appendix uh C representing approximately
[2:20:57] 17.3 million in approved budget with net
surplus funding of approximately 1.9
[2:21:03] million being released back to reserves,
reserve funds, and other funding
[2:21:08] sources. The report also provides
council with an update to on the overall
[2:21:14] life-to-date capital program and
highlight sever several emerging
[2:21:18] financial pressures that will be
important considerations during future
[2:21:22] budget deliberations.
I'd be pleased to answer any questions
[2:21:26] from council on this report or
appendically.
[2:21:29] » Thank you very much for the report and I
have a feeling that councelor Locky
[2:21:34] might have a question or two. Go ahead.
Uh yeah, through your ship. I actually
[2:21:38] got all my c my questions addressed
earlier, but um this is fantastic and I
[2:21:43] really appreciate you giving us this
much needed transparency on the capital
[2:21:48] closing projects. Um and I just want to
make a comment regarding the wastewater
[2:21:52] reserve. So, you know, we continue to
see um you know, favorable variances in
[2:21:57] wastewater. And so it's just something
to kind of call out publicly for the
[2:22:02] next term of council when it's time to
set rates that we may want to consider,
[2:22:06] you know, continuing to freeze uh the
wastewater rates because we're continue
[2:22:10] to, you know, just add surplus and so we
may not need to have the rates as high
[2:22:14] as they need to be.
[2:22:18] » Thank Thanks Laki. Was there anyone else
wishing to comment on the report?
[2:22:25] » Yeah, I I do think this is a nice um
update especially this time of year
[2:22:30] because I know our directors have been
busy with projects and so it's nice to
[2:22:33] see the amount of uh capital works that
have been committed and uh get a little
[2:22:38] bit more of a preview as to what a uh
the next council will see at their
[2:22:42] budget deliberations. So thank you for
this added step.
[2:22:47] » Thanks councelor Hman and I I appreciate
it too. The uh increase the reporting in
[2:22:52] finance department is really
appreciated. So, uh, if there's nothing
[2:22:57] else and we'll move to, um, get a mover
and a seconder for the agend, the, uh,
[2:23:03] uh, motion on this on agenda. Council Li
has mover and seconder, council Heman.
[2:23:10] All in favor? And that carries and I
understand we need a short recess, too.
[2:23:17] Okay, five minutes, people. We will
recess and then be back here at um uh
[2:23:24] 7:28.
[2:28:48] Ladies and gentlemen, 7:28 and we're
back online and resuming our council
[2:28:53] meeting. Um, excuse me.
The next item on the agenda is 12.6 6
[2:29:02] CSF-020-26
[2:29:07] live barn contract
[2:29:11] » through you your worship uh you have
>> you have before you report PSF020-26
[2:29:17] regarding the request to enter into an
agreement with Live Barn Inc. whereby
[2:29:21] they would install live streaming
equipment at our two ice rinks. LiveBarn
[2:29:25] has partnered with over 100
municipalities across Ontario and is in
[2:29:29] over 4,000 ranks across North America.
I've heard back from the four other
[2:29:34] municipalities within Middle Sex County
that have already partnered with Live
[2:29:38] Barn uh with no issues or concerns from
them. Uh the way that this arrangement
[2:29:42] would work is that Live Barn installs
video cameras that automatically track
[2:29:46] or follow the play on the ice. Families
then have the option to buy a live barn
[2:29:50] membership in order to be able to live
stream the games, practices,
[2:29:54] competitions, uh, etc. with the
municipality receiving a portion of that
[2:29:59] revenue. The main reason that Live Barn
is a consideration tonight is to provide
[2:30:03] sports families that use our ice pads
with the opportunity to watch from
[2:30:08] anywhere when they cannot attend in
person. This is a higher level of
[2:30:11] service. Livebarn was very open uh to
revising their boilerplate agreement to
[2:30:18] meet those recommendations of our lawyer
uh as outlined within the comment
[2:30:22] section of the report. Uh in
installation takes 3 to 6 months and if
[2:30:26] approved we would work on a live
streaming policy to be in place before
[2:30:31] then which I have already initiated
talks with county IT in regards to um
[2:30:37] the municipality's commitments in this
proposed agreement are outlined on page
[2:30:40] three. uh should you have any questions
on those. Uh we can expect approximately
[2:30:45] $2,000 in annual revenue following our
first full season of offering live barn
[2:30:49] at the facility. Besides the cost of
hydro, other municipal costs are
[2:30:54] administration of the system and
potential liability which is reduced in
[2:30:58] being named as an additional insured by
live barn. And I'm happy to answer any
[2:31:03] questions you may have at this occasion.
>> Thanks Mr. McDonald. Any questions for
[2:31:09] members of council? Council Gman.
>> Thank you, worship. I think that's a
[2:31:13] really neat, novel idea. Occasionally my
son will tune into our live streams. So
[2:31:18] this is probably more entertaining for
most people than
[2:31:22] um
but on a I guess on a serious note is is
[2:31:28] there like because I know that like
these are children's activities and is
[2:31:32] there any assurance that it is you know
limited access to parents and that you
[2:31:38] know you have uh the safety of the
individuals is considered in terms of u
[2:31:45] access to you know people's activity.
>> Uh yes uh through the mayor there's uh
[2:31:51] various options uh and the municipality
controls all of them. So once we're set
[2:31:55] up first of all we can black out any
particular period of time that isn't to
[2:32:01] be viewed by anyone. Secondly if there's
a user group that only wants say it's a
[2:32:06] family reunion and they don't want the
standard live barn customers who they
[2:32:10] don't know to be watching their family
have a skate on the ice. They could
[2:32:14] instead we could limit the family
reunion to be viewed by certain Live
[2:32:18] Barn members. Like say they've got Ma
and Opa over in Europe. We could set it
[2:32:22] up that only Ma and Opa can can watch
that portion of Live Barn. So there's
[2:32:27] options for that. We can also we would
also put it in hibernation mode over the
[2:32:30] non ice season. So nothing is streaming
at all during that time. But otherwise
[2:32:35] for normal things like say minor hockey,
should minor hockey agree to it, then
[2:32:40] anyone who's a live barn member can can
view minor hockey just like anyone can
[2:32:46] come into the arena and watch the game
live.
[2:32:52] » Anyone else with a question? Councelor
Lock.
[2:32:56] » Uh yeah, through your worship. Um, so
I'm just curious why we chose this
[2:32:59] vendor and if we received any other
proposals.
[2:33:04] » So, uh, through the mayor, they
approached us. Uh, they're the most
[2:33:07] heavily used one. Uh the one that we had
explored earlier um at the request of
[2:33:12] the Dorchester Dolphins was a different
group um NBC Sports Engine and uh as the
[2:33:19] Dolphins and their league was being
mandated to live stream their games
[2:33:23] through that provider, that provider was
unwilling to change one letter of their
[2:33:29] agreement with our lawyer having various
requested required changes. So, we did
[2:33:34] not proceed with that uh provider. While
Live Barn, when I mentioned to them that
[2:33:40] I don't want to paint the dolphins into
a corner, I spoke with the dolphins.
[2:33:43] Live barn is that's fine. If if the
dolphins are able to and the
[2:33:48] municipality is able to approve
something with the other provider or
[2:33:51] anyone else for the dolphins, that's
fine. So, these guys are really
[2:33:54] flexible. This isn't about making money.
It's certainly not a money generator
[2:33:59] when we've got some admin costs. It's
just about us uh providing a higher
[2:34:03] level of service and and live barn is uh
very experienced at doing that.
[2:34:08] » Thanks
uh councelor Cockett.
[2:34:13] Uh thank you for that. I think it's an
interesting concept to explore,
[2:34:19] especially because people are um
out and about more often and yet still
[2:34:26] very in tune to what teams uh are doing.
Um I think one of my questions is in
[2:34:33] regards to recording. Um, can do we know
if live barn subscribers are able to
[2:34:41] keep records of games or is it just a
live stream taking place
[2:34:48] » through the mayor? Um, you are also able
to go through archives and find previous
[2:34:54] games and whatnot. And the one thing I'm
not sure on but I'm happy to look into
[2:34:57] is I would assume because it is very
flexible for our control. I would assume
[2:35:02] that we would be able to remove things
from archives if we wanted or if a team
[2:35:06] wanted or whatever. Um the other thing I
should expand on a bit is so each person
[2:35:12] who pays for a membership for Live Barn,
if they scan our QR code, then we get
[2:35:17] 20% of that revenue. And even though
they're paying our through our QR code,
[2:35:23] they can then watch Live Barn when their
kids or grandkids or nieces and nephews
[2:35:29] play in any other live barn facility
across North America. So it opens up
[2:35:35] your ability to follow your teams or
your kids or grandkids wherever they
[2:35:39] play in a facility that has Live Barn.
And then just a follow-up question on
[2:35:46] that and I believe you touched on it,
but um
[2:35:50] we would obviously need to make
amendments to our ice rental agreements
[2:35:54] letting them know that this would be
taking place and I assume there'd be
[2:35:58] like an optin opt out function as well.
Would we uh require additional signage
[2:36:05] since video recording would be taking
place in the arena?
[2:36:08] » Great questions. Thank you. Yeah. So,
first of all, signage is required and it
[2:36:12] is provided by LifeBar. They'll provide
us with as many signs as we want. So, if
[2:36:16] we don't want to paint a wall, we could
cover it in the signs. Um, and then as
[2:36:21] for one of our responsibilities is to
make all the user groups where Live Barn
[2:36:25] would potentially be on to make them
aware in advance that that is there.
[2:36:30] They all have the option to opt out. Um,
and then we'd be responsible to black it
[2:36:35] out for them. And uh yeah, we would
include it in the agreement as part of
[2:36:39] the awareness campaign.
>> Just excuse me through you your worship
[2:36:44] to councelor Crockett. I just we did a
privacy impact assessment on live barn
[2:36:49] before we got to this point and their
answer about downloading data. It is
[2:36:54] allowed. However, there are mechanisms
in place to restrict it in that live
[2:36:58] barn users do not have that do not have
an acti active subscription cannot
[2:37:02] download any video files and those that
have one are subject to only a monthly
[2:37:07] quota of minutes of video to download
and once they have reached those quota
[2:37:11] that month they are prevented from
further downloading any more video
[2:37:15] files. So they actually can't download
an entire game because it says it's a
[2:37:19] small amount. So just snippets I would
assume so people can use it for
[2:37:23] recruitment videos but that would be
why.
[2:37:28] » Okay. Thank you to the clerk. Um,
councelor Heman
[2:37:32] » and I I don't expect a resolution or you
know really response but it's is it may
[2:37:39] be something to consider amending fees
and charges if there is this additional
[2:37:43] service that we may be able to provide
and if there is an additional
[2:37:46] administrative uh burden in doing some
of these activities that like it added
[2:37:52] you know you mentioned uh omopa over in
Europe or whatnot like that takes a
[2:37:57] little bit more staff time and maybe
these are things that we want to
[2:38:00] consider with our rental uh agreements
and or feaser.
[2:38:06] » Uh good comment. And to that point, a
couple of thoughts is first of all, I'd
[2:38:09] look into what other municipalities are
doing in that regard as well as what we
[2:38:14] could do initially if we kick it off for
this fall as we can do kind of a time
[2:38:18] study on what kind of impact it is
having on staff time and then decide
[2:38:22] accordingly.
[2:38:26] Thank you for your com comments,
councel, and thank you to uh director
[2:38:30] McDonald. Um are we ready to move to the
motion? Okay. So, we have the
[2:38:36] recommended motion before us that report
number CSF-02026
[2:38:43] be received for information
and that council approved the venue
[2:38:48] agreement substantially in the form
attached to the report with Live Barn
[2:38:53] and that council authorize the mayor and
clerk to execute the attached venue
[2:38:57] agreement with Live Barn. Move in a
second. Moved by councelor Heman and
[2:39:02] seconded by councelor Crockett. All in
favor?
[2:39:06] And that carries.
Uh, next one. Um, Mr. McDonald, we're
[2:39:11] going back at you. Uh, project
implementation agreement with Great
[2:39:16] Lakes Canadians for field.
>> Uh, thank you. As council will recall at
[2:39:22] the previous meeting, council approved
staff proceeding with negotiating an
[2:39:26] agreement with Great Lake Canadians for
upgrading the Field of Dreams infield to
[2:39:30] artificial turf with Great Lake
Canadians paying for this $400 to
[2:39:34] $500,000 project beyond the $85,000 in
current available funds that the
[2:39:39] municipality would make available to
help with this cost. Uh this report
[2:39:44] repeats the various benefits of an
artificial turf infield. So I won't get
[2:39:47] into them at this time but happy to
expand if you wish. Uh temp center's
[2:39:52] responsibilities for this project are
final approval on all details, releasing
[2:39:57] the available funds to Great Lake
Canadians to assist with the cost. Uh
[2:40:01] two prep work items of some drainage
repairs and terminating some sprinkler
[2:40:05] lines. um allowing Great Lake Canadians
to sell naming and sponsorship rights
[2:40:10] for future improvements with those
payments still being made to Temp
[2:40:13] Center. Um our issuing of donation
receipts were eligible and accepting
[2:40:20] current infield materials at our
landfill. Uh this report was expedited
[2:40:24] due to the desired project schedule
starting in just three weeks uh with no
[2:40:29] other council meeting scheduled between
now and then. This has resulted in both
[2:40:32] parties still working towards amicably
uh finalizing a few details of the
[2:40:37] agreement. Uh staff would only move
forward should this be approved. Um with
[2:40:42] any changes to the agreement uh being
supported by our lawyer. As a result,
[2:40:48] I'm not sure if the wording of one of
the recommendations needs to be changed.
[2:40:52] I think we're okay with the fact that
there's a few tweaks to follow. Um
[2:40:56] during review and discussion of this
project with finance, it was determined
[2:41:00] that moving forward, it would be in the
municipality's best interest to revise
[2:41:04] one term of our existing partnership
agreement with Great Lake Canadians. So
[2:41:08] that's not this project agreement, but
our five-year partnership agreement. I
[2:41:12] have since discussed this need with
Great Lake Canadians, and we will be
[2:41:15] meeting with them to discuss and
finalize the proposed change, which
[2:41:18] would then come back to council for
approval. Basically what this is around
[2:41:22] is to minimize the impact on our annual
budget. We need to ensure a portion of
[2:41:27] sponsorship funds raised via our
ballpark uh sponsorship is retained for
[2:41:32] repairs and maintenance of these
amenities as opposed to the entire
[2:41:36] amount being held for improvements and
expansions. And I'm happy to answer any
[2:41:40] questions you may have at this time.
>> Thanks, Mr. McDonald. Any questions from
[2:41:44] council?
[2:41:48] » Go. No, I just think that it's it's good
that we're working with them on a on an
[2:41:53] enhancement to an existing facility. I
know they've presented twice about their
[2:41:57] ambitions for increased uh capacity. So,
I think this is a good way to, you know,
[2:42:04] trying to meet them halfway with our
within our means and obviously they have
[2:42:09] a passionate group of people that they
believe they can fund raise with and so
[2:42:13] I don't think we want to stand in the
way of that ambition. So, this is a good
[2:42:17] compromise. Thank you, Director
McDonald.
[2:42:20] » Thanks, Councelor Haymon. Anyone else?
Okay, we're going to be moving to the
[2:42:25] meeting about uh the motion, but there's
a slight adjustment in the word writing,
[2:42:29] so I'm going to ask the clerk to read it
out. Just to address uh director
[2:42:33] McDonald's uh statement about the fact
that the agreement may have a slight
[2:42:38] tweak, we just the last paragraph would
be and that council hereby authorized
[2:42:42] the mayor and clerk to execute the
project implementation agreement with
[2:42:46] Great Lakes Canadian Baseball, Inc.
substantially in the form attached to
[2:42:50] report CSF23-26.
Um and then all the rest is the same. It
[2:42:55] just is we won't be making any material
changes. It's just some general slight
[2:42:59] changes and we want you to know it's not
exactly the same as this.
[2:43:03] » All right. Do we have a mover and a
second? Um moved by councelor Crockett
[2:43:07] and second by councelor Locky. And all
in favor?
[2:43:12] And that carries. All right. We'll ask
the uh CEO to uh present on item number
[2:43:18] 12.8 procurement services agreement with
Middle Sex County.
[2:43:23] » Certainly through you madame mayor to
council. This is a formal agreement for
[2:43:30] the office that the county has set up a
few years ago that allows the local
[2:43:35] municipalities as well as the county to
have dedicated staff for procurement.
[2:43:40] So, we have jumped on to this at the
beginning of this year having some of
[2:43:45] our procurements through the county's
office as early as January once and once
[2:43:52] the budget was set. that all of them
since April have gone through county
[2:43:57] office. The county recently uh developed
a an or county council endorsed the uh
[2:44:05] agreement that you see before you.
They've shared that with our staff late
[2:44:09] June and I've put council a report
together so that uh we could authorize
[2:44:15] and formalize this arrangement that and
I will note this is already funded
[2:44:20] through the county level. a levy. It's
not an additional cost to 10 center
[2:44:25] taxpayers.
[2:44:29] » Thank you. Um any questions or comments
regarding this item?
[2:44:35] » He just think that you know if we
partner on this service that hopefully
[2:44:40] it gives our directors a little bit more
slack in their their schedule. they
[2:44:45] still have to manage a large amount of
projects but uh if this can be an
[2:44:49] assistance in vendor management I think
that gives us some capacity to achieve
[2:44:54] all of the things that we have set out
for ourselves.
[2:44:58] » All right. If there are no other
questions then um a mover and seconder
[2:45:03] for the um motion on your u recirculated
agenda. Councelor Lock and Councelor
[2:45:11] Crockett. All in favor
and carries.
[2:45:18] Reports of committees. Item number 13 on
your agenda. Items listed under reports
[2:45:24] of committees are approved by council in
one motion. Council members may request
[2:45:29] that one or more items be separated for
further action. And unless there's
[2:45:34] something like
council,
[2:45:37] uh if I could, I'd just like to make a
comment regarding 13.1.
[2:45:42] Um, I just want to thank everyone for
coming out to Canada today. It was hot.
[2:45:48] Um, hot is an understatement. It was uh
very hot. Um, but thank you to the Lions
[2:45:56] Club. I think our fireworks were the
best year yet. It was pretty spectacular
[2:46:00] to see the amount of people that were
there. Um, and so with that behind us, I
[2:46:05] just want to remind everyone that
Cornfest is taking place on Saturday,
[2:46:09] September 12th, and we have uh a very
special local guest joining us for
[2:46:17] entertainment that will be announced
shortly. So, yay.
[2:46:21] Thank you.
I don't think I'm going to volunteer for
[2:46:25] corn chalking again this year because
I'm a decided loser.
[2:46:34] Okay. Um, councelor human.
>> I still have my trophy.
[2:46:38] » Um, I knew
>> so do I.
[2:46:41] Uh,
>> oh,
[2:46:43] » game on.
>> I don't have a trophy. Okay. Thank you
[2:46:47] very much, people. So, a mover and a
second to receive those reports.
[2:46:52] Councelor Crockett and Councelor Locky.
Favor and carries. Okay.
[2:47:00] a brief report from me for activities.
It's maybe a little bit lighter than
[2:47:07] some. Um I'm outlining my activities
from the last report. over in and above
[2:47:15] regularly scheduled meetings involving
10 center council and middle sex county
[2:47:19] council. I attended three meetings of
the Kettle Creek Conservation Authority
[2:47:24] VI advisory board, the library advisory
board, one session of emergency
[2:47:30] management planning committee in case of
any emergency that might involve the
[2:47:36] municipality, a meeting of SCORE and a
very u enlightening tour of the B
[2:47:44] facility led by um the director Jill
Smith. And accompanying on the tour was
[2:47:50] um Minister Black and some of his staff
as well where we outlined um the need
[2:47:56] for uh to be able to use the respit
bits. Um there's a lack of funding on
[2:48:02] that one. Um in addition um I attended
the um local schools uh graduation
[2:48:09] ceremonies both for the secondary school
and the public school graduation. And I
[2:48:15] had a um um It was a real pleasure to
hand out the the various awards
[2:48:20] presented by the municipality to these
young people and we have received some
[2:48:25] very nice um uh thank you note.
Um so
[2:48:31] I think that that will wrap everything
up for that report. Um,
[2:48:38] so any unfinished business,
any notices of motion,
[2:48:46] new business.
All right. So, moving down to number 18,
[2:48:52] the bylaw section that bylaws uh move
into secondary that bylaws 57-2026
[2:49:00] through 63206
be read the first, second, and third
[2:49:04] time. And finally be adopted and that
bylaw 64-2026
[2:49:11] be given first and second reading.
Councelor Lock and Councelor Heman, all
[2:49:19] in favor
and that carries.
[2:49:24] Um,
no close session.
[2:49:32] Confirmatory bylaw being a bylaw to
adopt confirm and ratify matters dealt
[2:49:37] with by resolution of the municipality
of temp center and that uh mover in the
[2:49:43] secondary that bylaw 65-206
being the confirmatory bylaw be read a
[2:49:50] first second and third and final time
and be adopted.
[2:49:54] Councelor Locky and councelor Crockett
all in favor.
[2:49:59] Okay. And our next meetings uh will be
August the 31st uh Monday at 5:00 p.m.
[2:50:06] followed by Monday, September the 14th
at 5:00 p.m. at the Thorndale Lions
[2:50:12] Community Center.
So that being said, a mover and seconder
[2:50:18] to adjourn tonight's meeting at 7:49
p.m. Councelor Eman and Councelor
[2:50:25] Crockett. And all in favor?
Thank you ladies and gentlemen.