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Good morning. We are live streaming and recording the August

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25th, 2026 Committee of the Whole Meeting. Our building has

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a single stage fire alarm in the event of an

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emergency or activation of the fire alarm, please exit the

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building through the nearest safe exit, assemble in the East

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Parking area by the Georgian Trail and the Weaver Valley

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Outreach and await further instructions. For individuals requiring special assistance,

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please let a staff member know. Thank you. Oh, sorry,

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is there a technology issue? No. Yep, we're good. Okay,

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just making sure our audio is correct. Excellent, thank you

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very much, Madam Deputy Clerk. I'd now like to call

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to order this committee the whole meeting of Tuesday, August

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25th, 2026. At this point in time, whether virtual or

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here in the chamber, please direct your attention to the

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Deputy Clerk who willed us in the traditional territory acknowledgement.

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We would like to begin our meeting by recognising the

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First Nations Meety and Inuit Peoples of Canada as traditional

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stewards of the land. The municipality is located within the

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boundary of Treaty 18, region of 1818, which is a

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traditional land of the Anishanobik on Deshunde - Ntt -

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Weindat Peoples. Thank you, Madam Deputy Clerk. And now, please

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join us for a moment of reflection.

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Thank you. Madam Deputy Clerk, could you please confirm our

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Council Members this morning? Certainly, Madam Mayor. I confirm that

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all members of Council are present today in Council Chambers.

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Excellent. So we'll move on to item A2. It's recommended

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that the Agenda of August 25th, 2026, be approved of

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circulated, including any items to be added to the agenda.

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May ask for a mover in a seconder. So moved.

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Second, Madame Mayer. Moved by the Dipney Mirror, seconded by

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Councillor McKinley. Any discussion. Okay, Madam Deputy Clerk, please call

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that vote. That vote is open.

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That. Boat is closed. And that motion is carried 7

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- 0. Item A3, note in accordance with the municipal

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conflict of interest Act and the Town Procedural Bylaw 2026

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- 44. Council members must file a written statement of

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the interest and its general nature with the clerk for

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inclusion on the registry. Madam Deputy Clerk, did you receive

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any declarations? I have not, Madam Mayor. Okay, seeing no

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hands raised. We'll move on to the recommendation of A4

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that the Committee of the Whole Minutes of June 30th,

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2026 be adopted as circulated, including any revisions to be

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made. May I ask for mover in a seconder? So

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moved, thank you. Moved by Councillor Ardell. Second. Second and

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by The Deputy Mayor. Any discussion. Madam Deputy Clerk, please

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call that vote. The vote is open.

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Hopefully I assist. The affirmative, please. Thank you. That vote

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is close. And that motion is carried 7 - 0.

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At this point in time, we were able to direct

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our attention to Section B, which is Staff Reports Deputations

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and Correspondence. The First Portion of Today, which will be

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chaired for Operations by Councillor McKinley. Councillor McKinley, you help

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the chair. Thank you, Madam Mayor. So item B1, we

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have no deputations for this section. We do have a

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written comment, so I'm gonna read the Public Comment period

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regarding matters, included in the Operations Portion of the Meeting.

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Each speaker is a lot of three minutes. Note, in

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accordance with the Town Procedural Bylaw 2026 - 44, 10

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minutes is allotted at the beginning and end of each

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section of the Committee of the Whole Meeting to receive

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Public Comments regarding matters included on the Agenda. Each person

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shall provide their name and address and is required to

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address their comments to the chair. Comments shall not refer

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to personal litigation or potential litigation matters, or be in

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response to matters that have been the subject of a

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Public meeting. It being noted that the verbal commenting period

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has ended. Written correspondence may still be received in response

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to matters that have been the subject of a Public

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Meeting. If a person is unable to personally attend the

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meeting or during any period, we're an emergency has been

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declared to exist in the municipality. They shall provide their

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Public comments and writing to the clerk in advance of

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the meeting for the clerk to read on behalf of

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the author during the Public Comment period. Now, Madame Deputy

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Clerk, you've indicated we have a written one, so I'll

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go to a written one first. And if anyone in

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the gallery would like to speak, we'll go to them.

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Please go ahead. Thank you, Mr. Chair. So these comments

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are from Scott Finley, Blue Mountains Rate Pairs Association. After

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reviewing The Most recent Staff Report, OPS 26035 regarding Craig

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Leith Wastewater Treatment Plant upgrades. That staff are now proposing

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that the sourcing of debt so that the above project

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may proceed. As reserves are exceptionally low, and we have

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recently been turned down for grant application under the Provincial

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Health and Safety Water Stream Fund for the Combined Seven

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Projects Totally in 45 million. Based on recent history and

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the current state of our balance sheet, we expect that

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this will not be the last such request for financing,

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which leads us to the following questions. One, based on

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cost estimates using recently completed 30 percent design drawings combined

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project is now proposed to be 8. 2 million over

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budget. Where will the incremental funding come from and what

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is the final cost estimates for all seven components of

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the project? Two, currently we do not have a director

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of finance nor a director of operations. What is the

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timeline to replace these positions? And should we not wait

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until we have those senior resources in place before proceeding

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on any project whose money estimate is above plan? Three,

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The larger question is not borrowing capacity of the town,

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but whether we should be borrowing money at all. The

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BMRA believes this is, that should be answered by the

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newly elected town council and the decision to proceed on

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projects that require financing should be made by the newly

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elected Town Council supported by 10 - year debt projections.

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Thank you for your consideration. Thank you, Madam Dekr. Now

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I'll look to the gallery. If the one in the

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chambers that would like to make a comment. Going once,

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going twice. Okay, I will close that portion. The agenda.

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Now, we have a correspondence. First piece of correspondence and

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item B 3. 1. We have the Blue Mountains Bay

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Street Reconstruction Project, dated August 14th, 2026 for the period

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of August 17th to 21st, 2026. We'll get that up

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on the screen, and I'll look for any hands. Oh,

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and I'll get my screen texture. Uh, Councillor Porter, go

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ahead. Yes, thank you through the chair. Um, so this

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is a project update. I also note, and I understand

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from residents during this time that there was a water

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break in the temporary water pipe. Which the contractor installed

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buried. And I certainly don't think was necessary. So I'm

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wondering what, um, I'm wondering why it happened. And how

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it won't happen again. Okay. Manager Kershaw, or do we

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have, um, our coordinator on the line? Or go ahead,

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Andrew Kershaw. That's who you, Mr. Chair. So we did

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have a break in the temporary water main. I can't

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guarantee it won't happen again. Uh, it's a water main.

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We have breaks in our water main, um, periodically throughout

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the town, whether they're buried or whether they're a temporary

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water main. Our water department was there on site, and

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it was repaired within 45 minutes. This was addressed quickly.

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There was, it was properly flushed. There was no consideration

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for water quality issues. It was addressed, it happens. And,

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uh, staff responded appropriately. I like a follow - up,

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please. Follow up. So please correct me, I understand from

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the residents I spoke to that was the contractor that

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broke the line. Of Gershaw. Therefore, and as I said,

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it is bright blue. It's raw and blue. It's fair

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size, and they installed the line. How will they not

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break it again? Manager Crowchelle, if you can answer that,

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I'm not sure. I wasn't there. Uh, through you, Mr.

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Chair, so you're correct. It was broken by the contractor.

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Uh, our water staff did respond, and they repaired it

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as quickly as possible. I can't guarantee it won't happen

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again. It is big construction. Uh, and big equipment, and

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it's a two inch line. We're doing our best. And

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there are no guarantees that a water main will never

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break in the town again. It's the nature of infrastructure.

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We do our best to maintain it. We monitor it

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quite quickly. So when there's a water main break, we

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will see pressures drop and our reservoirs start to start

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to drop quickly. We do have reserves that we enables

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free flowing water out of the pipe. So there is

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no water quality issues. Uh, we did maintain positive pressure.

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And Staff responded as quickly as they possibly could to

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repair the break. So I'm going to ask for another.

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CAO Smith. Yeah, through the chair, we just add that

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I think the key thing is, is it relates to,

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and I think when the grand scheme, the project as

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well, is that I don't think we've had too many

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breaks that have been associated with work, particularly when you're

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in such a tight space as it relates to bay.

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I do know that there's always that follow up or

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that those, those meetings that I occur with the contractor

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with respecting, you know, safe and effective work within that,

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uh, area as well. So the fact that it was

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repaired within that 45 minute time period is, I think,

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is definitely a credit to staff to be in responsive

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and demonstration of, uh, I think, uh, I think, uh,

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oversight of the project, uh, yeah, it is a challenge,

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I think, being on site and looking at some of

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the complexities that have to be navigated. I'm much more

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concerned if, uh, there was a major gap in service

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for an extended period of time. But the repair did

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occur in a timely way. And I do know Stafford

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were on that in a, promptly. Thank you, CAO Smith.

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Now Council Reporter, just to wrap up and we've got

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some more, uh, questions here from other members. Go ahead.

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Does the contractor reimburse the town for the time staff

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spent? CEO Smith or Andrew Kershaw? Or do you want

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to get back to us on that. Through you, Mr.

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Chair. So we do track time that we spend on

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capital projects. There's a lot of time that Staff time

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dedicated to capital projects. The cost of the repair was

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insignificant. But we, we do track our time. I'm not

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exactly sure if we're reimbursed, uh, by the, at the

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end of the day, it's one taxpayer. And we're paying

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for the entire construction as well as maintaining services as

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well as paying for staff time. But we do track

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our time for capital projects. The manager Kershaw. C. O.

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Smith, did you want to see your mic skewed? Yeah.

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To the chat, I would just add that this wouldn't

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be, say, the nature of the work because there was

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the break that occurred on behalf of the contractor that

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say the contractor build back the town as it relates

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to added costs as associated with the break. That's not

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certainly not the case in this regard. Thank you, C.

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O. Smith. So going to move on to Councillor Maxwell.

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Thank you, Chair. And, um, I guess, Allison, I'm not

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sure if this is in your wheelhouse or not, but,

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um, here's a resident sending some correspondence. And I don't,

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I'm not going to say her name right now. But

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it's on the corner of Elgan and Bay. And she

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was concerned about the entrance into her property. I don't

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know of all the entrances been addressed. But, um. If

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you could say answer that would be great. Okay. Okay.

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Mensch your Kershaw. Through you, Mr. Chair. I believe are

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we talking about a driveway that was essentially two tracks,

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two gravel tracks, uh, so the situation being there that,

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uh, when we reconstruct a street, especially when we put

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storm sewers in, we do pay the aprons. So the

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ends of the driveways, we do pave them. Uh, we

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don't leave them gravel. Being that when there's a storm

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system, a storm collection system, we don't want gravel in

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our storm systems. So it is necessary to pave the

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ends of the apron. So we'll pay from the edge

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of asphalt on the road up to the property line.

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And we maintain it driveways as they were like same

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width as they previously were prior to construction. We do

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have photos and we've taken measurements of every driveway, every

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entrance. And we are trying to maintain them, but it

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has been paved up until the property line. And there

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is a little buffer of gravel from the edge of

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Asphalt to where it returned to the two, um, gravel

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tracks. With a grass up the middle. Follow up Council

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Maxwell. No, that's, that's fine. Thank you. Okay. Thank you.

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Councillor Hope. Thank you very much Chair McKinley. So this,

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I think this request comes under either of the two

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items that are in the, in the gene, so I'm

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going to raise it now. Residents are concerned about the

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safety of the, of the water. We're hearing from them.

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And they'd like to see the water tested. Some have

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fears about even swimming. Uh, some have fears about their

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drinking water. Um, we have heard from the neighbourhood, they

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have asked for that. And, uh, I'm wondering, uh, when

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00:19:18,994 --> 00:19:23,853
that can be executed through Mr. Chair to Ms. Kershaw.

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And Ja Kershaw. So let's start off with something I

236
00:19:28,037 --> 00:19:30,917
want to make very clear here. Our drinking water is

237
00:19:31,178 --> 00:19:34,437
safe. Our drinking water goes The Drinking Watt through our

238
00:19:34,477 --> 00:19:37,637
water treatment plant. It's tested thoroughly and it is very

239
00:19:37,818 --> 00:19:41,077
safe. So there are no questions about the safety of

240
00:19:41,117 --> 00:19:43,877
our drinking water. That's off the table. There is no

241
00:19:43,978 --> 00:19:51,237
question about that. So when it comes to testing, direction,

242
00:19:51,237 --> 00:19:54,277
uh, we, the town has hired a second environmental company

243
00:19:54,298 --> 00:19:58,197
to oversee the works there. So the contractor themselves, clear

244
00:19:58,197 --> 00:20:01,557
way, they had hired an environmental company to monitor the

245
00:20:01,578 --> 00:20:06,917
construction in compliance with our permits. So the one company

246
00:20:08,058 --> 00:20:10,677
working on behalf of the contractor, ensuring that we're staying

247
00:20:10,698 --> 00:20:15,077
within the environmental requirements of our permits. The town is

248
00:20:15,098 --> 00:20:17,557
higher to second one on terrorists. And they are out

249
00:20:17,557 --> 00:20:20,117
there on behalf of, so it's a third party testing

250
00:20:20,218 --> 00:20:22,997
company. And they're out there, uh, we meet with them

251
00:20:23,037 --> 00:20:26,757
regularly. They have been out. They've tested. The testing that

252
00:20:26,757 --> 00:20:32,357
we're doing is turbidity, uh, suspended solids, water temperature, dissolved

253
00:20:32,397 --> 00:20:36,197
oxygen. We will not be testing for bacteria. It's a

254
00:20:36,237 --> 00:20:40,357
surface water. There is bacteria. There's micros. There's decoli. There's

255
00:20:40,357 --> 00:20:42,917
total coliform. We test our raw water coming into the

256
00:20:43,018 --> 00:20:46,997
drinking water plant every week. And we know it's existing.

257
00:20:47,098 --> 00:20:52,037
It's a surface water source. And the other request that

258
00:20:52,077 --> 00:20:56,677
we've had is for heavy metals. It's not warranted. It's

259
00:20:56,677 --> 00:21:01,317
not part of our permitting. We're following Georgia Bay is

260
00:21:01,578 --> 00:21:06,197
crown land. The lake bottom is crown land. The agency

261
00:21:06,197 --> 00:21:09,896
that gave us our permissions to do the work. They've

262
00:21:09,997 --> 00:21:13,656
asked us to test for turbidity. We have online turbidity

263
00:21:13,917 --> 00:21:17,096
monitors out floating in the water right now. They're recording

264
00:21:17,437 --> 00:21:20,616
a hundred percent all the time. And that data's being

265
00:21:20,656 --> 00:21:24,456
tracked. We've also been taking additional samples. They've been going

266
00:21:24,717 --> 00:21:29,816
in through the, uh, consultant for the contractor's environmental company

267
00:21:30,397 --> 00:21:33,536
and through the third party that we've also hired. So

268
00:21:33,536 --> 00:21:36,669
I think we're meeting the requirements of testing. Okay. Going

269
00:21:36,669 --> 00:21:38,469
to go over. Thank you, Major Khrushchev. I'm going to

270
00:21:38,469 --> 00:21:41,788
go over to OCAO Smith. You have your hand. Through

271
00:21:41,788 --> 00:21:44,268
the chair. Just a point clarity as well. Just I

272
00:21:44,268 --> 00:21:47,228
know with the corresponds being tied to Bang Grey, that

273
00:21:47,268 --> 00:21:49,948
question related to, uh, I think the water quality out

274
00:21:49,988 --> 00:21:52,268
in the bed. That's more so reflective of the outfall

275
00:21:52,268 --> 00:21:55,248
project. So just for an agenda standpoint, it's a bit

276
00:21:55,248 --> 00:21:57,608
of a delineation on the update specific to Bay and

277
00:21:57,649 --> 00:22:02,148
Grey versus what is the related to the outfall. So

278
00:22:02,148 --> 00:22:05,308
I do know we have some other, um, I think

279
00:22:05,308 --> 00:22:08,028
items speaking to that outfall project, which may be more

280
00:22:08,028 --> 00:22:11,628
of the time to further discuss some of the issues

281
00:22:11,668 --> 00:22:15,268
there. The next piece of correspondence is the fall. So

282
00:22:15,268 --> 00:22:20,108
yeah, so follow up. So we'll cover that later, like

283
00:22:20,108 --> 00:22:23,128
in five minutes. But, uh, first of all, then, uh,

284
00:22:23,128 --> 00:22:27,628
thank you very much. It's through you, Mr. Chair. Really

285
00:22:27,628 --> 00:22:31,468
appreciate the fact that no one questioned whether there was

286
00:22:31,569 --> 00:22:33,788
compliance. So I want to be very clear about that.

287
00:22:33,788 --> 00:22:38,188
We don't, no need to feel that that's being challenged.

288
00:22:38,209 --> 00:22:42,268
The point of the matter is communication with residents. She's

289
00:22:42,268 --> 00:22:45,228
been an ongoing issue with this project. So why can't

290
00:22:45,249 --> 00:22:48,748
they know exactly what we've just heard now? So if

291
00:22:48,748 --> 00:22:50,988
we have to wait till we talk about the outfall,

292
00:22:50,988 --> 00:22:56,348
then that's fine. But residents, they're living with this every

293
00:22:56,348 --> 00:23:01,548
day. And they're worried about whether their grandchildren or our

294
00:23:01,649 --> 00:23:04,988
safe swimming. I mean, these are all, whether they're fears

295
00:23:05,028 --> 00:23:11,068
to whether they're logical or not, doesn't make any difference.

296
00:23:11,068 --> 00:23:13,788
They need to have some kind of confidence. So I

297
00:23:13,788 --> 00:23:17,448
think that we need to be sharing this information. Um,

298
00:23:17,489 --> 00:23:20,748
that, that we're required to do anyway, uh, with the

299
00:23:20,849 --> 00:23:24,728
residents. So again, I hope that we consider that. And

300
00:23:24,728 --> 00:23:26,588
I guess we'll take it up under OPO. Thank you.

301
00:23:27,169 --> 00:23:29,948
C. S. Smith. Yes, sir. Terry. To your point around

302
00:23:30,529 --> 00:23:33,228
it coming up is more so to reinforce delineation between

303
00:23:34,289 --> 00:23:37,468
Bay and Grey and the Ofal, just a separate project.

304
00:23:37,508 --> 00:23:39,288
Just wanted to provide a little bit of that, uh,

305
00:23:39,288 --> 00:23:44,229
that clarity. Thank you, C. O. Smith. Okay. Um, so

306
00:23:44,970 --> 00:23:47,189
seeing no further hands, we have a motion to receive

307
00:23:47,210 --> 00:23:50,926
this piece of correspondence. So I moved. Moved by the

308
00:23:50,926 --> 00:23:56,183
Deputy Mayor Secondard. Second by Madam Mayor. And another question,

309
00:23:56,183 --> 00:23:58,743
uh, Councillor Hope? Yes. I was wondering if there's agreement

310
00:23:58,764 --> 00:24:01,063
that there will be some kind of sharing with the

311
00:24:01,084 --> 00:24:05,303
residents about the water reports that we're receiving as part

312
00:24:05,343 --> 00:24:12,263
of the process. I know that they are, oh, sorry

313
00:24:12,604 --> 00:24:15,383
CAO Smith. Yeah. Through the chair, we did, and I

314
00:24:15,383 --> 00:24:18,423
know we did provide some comms previously just with respect

315
00:24:18,463 --> 00:24:21,543
to the expanded scope of the water testing that was

316
00:24:21,583 --> 00:24:24,663
completed by also I'm aware of some further corresponds that's

317
00:24:24,663 --> 00:24:27,303
come forward around, uh, and I think getting a little

318
00:24:27,303 --> 00:24:29,623
bit more detail with respect to the scope of that

319
00:24:29,644 --> 00:24:32,343
testing, which we can do another round or at least

320
00:24:32,364 --> 00:24:34,983
some, some broader comms associate with that. So I think

321
00:24:35,804 --> 00:24:37,783
and actually I think what would be helpful is, is

322
00:24:37,783 --> 00:24:40,343
further to manage a Kershaw's point as well as the,

323
00:24:40,383 --> 00:24:43,383
the challenge on broadening it to such a degree where

324
00:24:43,484 --> 00:24:46,903
you're now looking at other factors beyond the outfall that

325
00:24:46,903 --> 00:24:49,863
influence water behaviour. So for example, things such as E.

326
00:24:49,863 --> 00:24:52,263
coli and other elements to which, um, is not so

327
00:24:52,303 --> 00:24:55,383
much, it's very difficult in such a grand or such

328
00:24:55,383 --> 00:24:57,863
a large scale as the bay as well as the

329
00:24:57,884 --> 00:25:00,503
other elements that impact that quality such as the beaver

330
00:25:00,543 --> 00:25:03,703
river, uh, and other matters as well. But, uh, yes,

331
00:25:03,703 --> 00:25:05,543
to, to your point, we will put something further out

332
00:25:05,583 --> 00:25:08,483
with respect to the scope of the water testing. And

333
00:25:08,483 --> 00:25:13,438
we'll share that, uh, uh, today. Appreciate that. An ongoing

334
00:25:13,619 --> 00:25:17,678
water testing as I gather from, um, uh, manager Kershaw

335
00:25:18,339 --> 00:25:20,478
that needs to be shared, I think with the residents

336
00:25:20,739 --> 00:25:22,958
that this is well in hand. And this is how

337
00:25:23,139 --> 00:25:26,561
it's well in hand. So that they, they can, uh,

338
00:25:26,762 --> 00:25:29,861
feel more comfortable about everything that's going on around them.

339
00:25:29,962 --> 00:25:33,301
Yeah. Through the chair, absolutely. We can reinforce that messaging.

340
00:25:33,301 --> 00:25:36,501
Thank you. I appreciate it. Okay. Thank you, Mr. CAO.

341
00:25:36,501 --> 00:25:39,381
Thank you Councillor Hope. Okay. We have The motion that

342
00:25:39,722 --> 00:25:42,661
council, The Tumble Mountains received for information, The Blue Mountains,

343
00:25:42,661 --> 00:25:46,661
Bay Street Reconstruction Project dated August 14th, 2026 for the

344
00:25:46,701 --> 00:25:50,261
period of August 17th to 21st of 2026. It has

345
00:25:50,261 --> 00:25:52,901
been moved by the Deputy Mayor and seconded by The

346
00:25:53,082 --> 00:25:56,149
Mayor. Signal further hands, Madam Deputy Clerk, can you call

347
00:25:56,149 --> 00:25:57,669
that boat please? The vote is open.

348
00:26:10,633 --> 00:26:13,172
Is closed. And that vote is carried with all present

349
00:26:13,212 --> 00:26:17,072
voting in the affirmative. When we vote 3. 2, the

350
00:26:17,072 --> 00:26:21,092
Blue Mountains Outfall Pipe Assembly and installation project dated August

351
00:26:21,132 --> 00:26:24,612
14th, 2026 for the period of August 17th to 21st,

352
00:26:24,612 --> 00:26:29,438
2026. Councillor Hope, you want to, I'll just go to

353
00:26:29,438 --> 00:26:32,898
you first. Thank you. Thank you, Chair Kindle. Carried over.

354
00:26:32,919 --> 00:26:35,218
Go ahead. Thank you. I appreciate that. So we have

355
00:26:35,399 --> 00:26:37,458
then, I think probably I'll just turn the chair over

356
00:26:37,799 --> 00:26:41,618
to chair. Excuse me. I'll turn, look to the CAO

357
00:26:41,618 --> 00:26:44,978
for his comment sent on the outfall. We have, he's

358
00:26:44,978 --> 00:26:47,218
referring to a different piece of correspondence, which is from

359
00:26:47,258 --> 00:26:51,058
all of the residents. And it's quite a, um, quite

360
00:26:51,098 --> 00:26:53,698
a serious request that I think we, you know, we

361
00:26:53,698 --> 00:26:56,258
would appreciate hearing what the CEO has to say about

362
00:26:56,298 --> 00:27:01,812
that. Thank you. Uh, C. A. Smith. Oh yeah. Through

363
00:27:01,812 --> 00:27:04,612
the chair, similar to just my, my prior comments with

364
00:27:04,633 --> 00:27:07,412
respect to that corresponds received as well, just in terms

365
00:27:07,412 --> 00:27:11,092
of the, uh, request to expand some of the scope,

366
00:27:11,092 --> 00:27:14,212
the testing, our position is. And I think is, is

367
00:27:14,252 --> 00:27:17,012
to look at providing that, uh, greater clarity with regards

368
00:27:17,052 --> 00:27:19,172
to what is being tested currently as part of that

369
00:27:19,353 --> 00:27:22,692
expanded scope that a manager Kershaw did note was a

370
00:27:22,713 --> 00:27:26,452
separate ad from on this, uh, on this project as

371
00:27:26,452 --> 00:27:30,292
well as I think recognising and providing that, uh, informationing

372
00:27:30,473 --> 00:27:33,872
on the limitations to what can be tested versus, uh,

373
00:27:34,633 --> 00:27:37,572
what we certainly can look at doing to ensure that

374
00:27:38,153 --> 00:27:41,732
what's directly relayed to the OFAL is being properly managed

375
00:27:42,073 --> 00:27:44,932
and being controlled for. So, uh, we will, as I

376
00:27:44,932 --> 00:27:48,612
mentioned, we will put that, uh, out today. And we

377
00:27:48,612 --> 00:27:51,972
do have a, uh, comedian information session that will be

378
00:27:51,972 --> 00:27:55,572
occurring on the, uh, later this week on the Friday,

379
00:27:55,572 --> 00:27:57,492
which will be another great chance here directly from the

380
00:27:57,833 --> 00:27:59,972
Consolants, which are the experts as it relates to doing

381
00:28:00,073 --> 00:28:02,752
these types of works, uh, to further explain, you know,

382
00:28:02,873 --> 00:28:06,772
those, uh, those measures to ensure that, uh, The Outfall

383
00:28:07,033 --> 00:28:11,812
is being carried out in a safe manner. Follow up

384
00:28:11,833 --> 00:28:14,132
Councillor Hope? Yes, thank you very much. So just looking

385
00:28:14,172 --> 00:28:17,972
at the correspondence, I see there is a concern about

386
00:28:18,313 --> 00:28:23,814
E. coli in total colder forms. And so. I think

387
00:28:23,814 --> 00:28:27,254
the residents in the correspondence or in the communication that

388
00:28:27,355 --> 00:28:31,414
you've been referring to, they should understand that we're talking

389
00:28:31,414 --> 00:28:36,034
about surface, uh, issues versus deeper in the water. Um,

390
00:28:36,034 --> 00:28:38,694
so I'm hoping that the full explanation. I understand that

391
00:28:38,715 --> 00:28:41,474
we've got the meeting and appreciate it very much. But

392
00:28:41,474 --> 00:28:45,014
I think that this letter is from all the residents.

393
00:28:45,014 --> 00:28:47,814
It's a pretty serious letter. And I think we need

394
00:28:47,854 --> 00:28:51,174
to get, we need to answer very specifically all of

395
00:28:51,174 --> 00:28:56,774
these concerns. So even though, um, from a water science

396
00:28:56,955 --> 00:29:01,494
perspective, some of the questions are handled differently in different

397
00:29:01,494 --> 00:29:05,445
ways. Uh, I think we need to explain that. Thank

398
00:29:05,445 --> 00:29:10,165
you. In the communication. Thank you. Okay. CEO Smith. Do

399
00:29:10,165 --> 00:29:12,565
you have a response to that or manage a crucial?

400
00:29:12,605 --> 00:29:14,165
No through the chair. That's, yeah, no, we can take

401
00:29:14,165 --> 00:29:17,236
that away. And that's good feedback. Thank you. Okay. Thank

402
00:29:17,236 --> 00:29:22,438
you. Uh, Councillor Porter, go ahead. Yes. Thank you. Yes.

403
00:29:22,438 --> 00:29:26,598
Thank you. And through the chair. So having been down

404
00:29:26,638 --> 00:29:31,318
there because I've been asked to go, um, you see

405
00:29:32,379 --> 00:29:37,376
the, um. The water changes colour as you go out.

406
00:29:37,376 --> 00:29:40,416
It does. And it's coming from the east and is

407
00:29:40,416 --> 00:29:43,296
coming from grey street and is now down to like

408
00:29:43,317 --> 00:29:47,356
at least the fourth house. And it is moving. And

409
00:29:47,797 --> 00:29:55,804
they're concerned. And it, um, the more detail, you know,

410
00:29:55,905 --> 00:29:58,124
supporting will Councillor Hope and you have set. The more

411
00:29:58,164 --> 00:30:04,254
detail they receive, the better. But I think it. Feel,

412
00:30:04,254 --> 00:30:06,014
and quoting what they say. So the front of their

413
00:30:06,054 --> 00:30:08,494
houses are all torn up. They haven't been to park.

414
00:30:08,494 --> 00:30:11,614
They're having to move. Some people have difficulty walking. And

415
00:30:11,614 --> 00:30:13,134
then they go out the back and they're scared to

416
00:30:13,174 --> 00:30:15,294
go out in the water. There's kids who have their

417
00:30:15,294 --> 00:30:16,974
children go out in the water. And this is actually

418
00:30:17,155 --> 00:30:19,694
the nicest weather for this type of activity that we

419
00:30:19,715 --> 00:30:23,374
have. So they feel a bit sandwiched in the middle.

420
00:30:23,374 --> 00:30:26,734
And they're concerned about the colour. This is new to

421
00:30:26,755 --> 00:30:30,494
their water. They haven't had this before. And there's been

422
00:30:31,075 --> 00:30:34,054
issues as a result of the work on grocery. I

423
00:30:34,054 --> 00:30:39,534
don't think this was anticipated. And people in the absence

424
00:30:39,534 --> 00:30:43,214
of information in the absence of reassurance, this is where

425
00:30:43,235 --> 00:30:48,250
people go. It is, it is natural. It's not uncommon.

426
00:30:48,250 --> 00:30:52,890
Um, because they don't know it's okay. They're being told

427
00:30:53,071 --> 00:30:56,250
we're doing everything we're supposed to do from a regulation

428
00:30:56,351 --> 00:31:03,450
perspective. Um, but they don't know, um, if that's good

429
00:31:03,471 --> 00:31:07,450
enough, if that's the minimum, like they just don't out.

430
00:31:07,450 --> 00:31:11,210
And, um, so I'm putting forward, I have made suggestions

431
00:31:12,511 --> 00:31:16,570
to you that is testing be considered. I would be

432
00:31:16,751 --> 00:31:18,810
interesting to know what the price of it is in

433
00:31:18,810 --> 00:31:20,890
the schema things. Like how big, how big of a

434
00:31:20,930 --> 00:31:23,690
price tag is this to maybe to provide these people

435
00:31:23,730 --> 00:31:26,410
with the reassurance that they need given that they've got

436
00:31:26,431 --> 00:31:28,170
stuff going on in the front door and the back

437
00:31:28,170 --> 00:31:33,003
door. So, um, perhaps this will be, this will come

438
00:31:33,003 --> 00:31:37,007
out on the meeting on Friday. Thank you. Okay. Um.

439
00:31:38,669 --> 00:31:44,770
Councillor Maxwell. Thank you Council Porter. Councillor Maxwell. Thank you,

440
00:31:44,770 --> 00:31:53,942
Chair. Just wondering. If. You know, the

441
00:31:54,043 --> 00:31:57,602
water, the water normally when it comes out of the

442
00:31:57,602 --> 00:32:02,352
beaver river. Moves from the Weber River down towards Collingwood.

443
00:32:02,352 --> 00:32:06,624
That's where the current's going. But we've had some significant

444
00:32:07,045 --> 00:32:13,664
rain events upstream in the Bieber River. And we've dam

445
00:32:13,704 --> 00:32:18,224
up there, uh, up around slab down that's been breached.

446
00:32:18,224 --> 00:32:20,864
And there's been a ton of silt has moved downstream.

447
00:32:21,808 --> 00:32:25,387
I'm not saying that totally it, but it may have

448
00:32:25,427 --> 00:32:29,654
been a factor in this as well. Um, so I

449
00:32:29,694 --> 00:32:31,414
just, you know, I don't know how it's very difficult

450
00:32:31,675 --> 00:32:35,734
to determine exactly where things come from. Um, we can

451
00:32:35,734 --> 00:32:37,894
do our best. But I just want to throw that

452
00:32:37,915 --> 00:32:40,534
in there because, uh, you know, we have to look

453
00:32:40,534 --> 00:32:45,334
at everything when we're looking at things. So anyway, Allison,

454
00:32:45,334 --> 00:32:47,974
I'll just leave that with you. Mensch your Kershaw. Do

455
00:32:47,974 --> 00:32:51,014
you have a response to that? Yeah. Three, Mr. Chair,

456
00:32:51,014 --> 00:32:55,094
uh, do you Councillor Maxwell? Um, there are impacts from

457
00:32:55,134 --> 00:32:58,614
the Beaver River. We live in an area where we

458
00:32:58,715 --> 00:33:02,434
have a number of fringe creeks that deposit in the

459
00:33:02,555 --> 00:33:05,334
bay when we have heavy rain events. We can see

460
00:33:05,334 --> 00:33:07,654
them clearly from one end of the town to the

461
00:33:07,654 --> 00:33:12,848
other, the impacts from heavy rain events. Uh, the dredging

462
00:33:12,888 --> 00:33:16,928
activity is disturbing the clay. There's no doubt about it.

463
00:33:16,968 --> 00:33:22,288
There is a clay layer within the lake bottom that

464
00:33:22,309 --> 00:33:30,251
is being disturbed through the dredging activity. Forms very, very

465
00:33:30,352 --> 00:33:34,331
fine particles and it forms like a colloidal. So it

466
00:33:34,432 --> 00:33:37,211
hangs in the water for a long time. It doesn't

467
00:33:37,472 --> 00:33:41,371
settle out quickly. Uh, we see that in different areas,

468
00:33:41,371 --> 00:33:45,531
but the dredging is affecting the turbidity of the water.

469
00:33:45,531 --> 00:33:49,291
We do have limits that we have to stay within.

470
00:33:49,291 --> 00:33:51,451
And we are working with our agencies to make sure

471
00:33:51,792 --> 00:33:56,011
that because they oversee the lake bottom and it's crown

472
00:33:56,032 --> 00:34:02,171
land to make sure we're not impacting beyond what we're

473
00:34:02,211 --> 00:34:07,591
allowed to, um, one of the biggest requirements, what our

474
00:34:07,591 --> 00:34:13,131
agencies are looking for is protecting habitat protecting fish populations

475
00:34:13,152 --> 00:34:17,051
protecting the, um, the life that does take place in

476
00:34:17,051 --> 00:34:22,995
the lake bottom. It's very difficult. It's a very challenging

477
00:34:23,176 --> 00:34:26,585
project. And there are a lot of impacts. We've got

478
00:34:26,585 --> 00:34:29,565
to remember that the beaver river runs through a number

479
00:34:29,586 --> 00:34:35,725
of areas of farmland. And we do spread manure. It

480
00:34:35,725 --> 00:34:39,885
is a pretty common practice throughout, uh, grey County. It's

481
00:34:39,986 --> 00:34:44,765
not uncommon for a rural communities across the province and

482
00:34:44,805 --> 00:34:47,805
across the country. Uh, that will have an impact on

483
00:34:48,306 --> 00:34:53,085
E. coli and total coliforms in your surface water intakes.

484
00:34:53,085 --> 00:34:55,805
Um, and that's why as a drinking water for managing

485
00:34:55,826 --> 00:34:59,305
or drinking water system, we have different requirements for, um,

486
00:34:59,906 --> 00:35:04,285
treating and measuring E. coli and total coliform in our

487
00:35:04,285 --> 00:35:07,165
drinking water system. Then if we were a groundwater system

488
00:35:07,426 --> 00:35:11,518
or treatment trains different. A surface water is impacted by

489
00:35:11,619 --> 00:35:15,255
a number of different inputs. Whether it be rain or

490
00:35:15,516 --> 00:35:19,015
coming through the valley, uh, but the dredging activity definitely

491
00:35:19,116 --> 00:35:23,407
is having an impact on the bay. Follow up Councillor

492
00:35:23,428 --> 00:35:27,846
Maxwell. No. Uh, thank you very much, Allison. Okay. Thank

493
00:35:27,846 --> 00:35:31,966
you, manager Kershaw. Signal for their hands. Do we have

494
00:35:32,067 --> 00:35:36,046
anybody would like to move to receive this correspondence? I

495
00:35:36,046 --> 00:35:38,926
will move. Move by the mayor. Oh, second. Second by

496
00:35:38,947 --> 00:35:41,086
Mr. Deputy Mayor that council of the Town Blue Mountains

497
00:35:41,107 --> 00:35:45,566
receives for information Blue Mountains, Oakfall Pipe, assembly and installation

498
00:35:45,587 --> 00:35:50,126
project update dated August 14th, 2026 for the period of

499
00:35:50,387 --> 00:35:53,966
August 17th to the 21st of 2026. It's been dually

500
00:35:53,987 --> 00:35:58,853
moved and seconded any further questions. Seeing none, Madam Deputy

501
00:35:58,893 --> 00:36:00,853
Clerk, you may call that vote, please. That vote is

502
00:36:00,893 --> 00:36:09,038
open. For me. Thank you, Councillor Maxwell.

503
00:36:13,673 --> 00:36:16,545
And that boat is closed. And that vote is carried

504
00:36:16,545 --> 00:36:19,105
with all present voting in the affirmative. We move on

505
00:36:19,145 --> 00:36:23,265
to item B 3. 3, Gary Tile, resident regarding reconstruction

506
00:36:23,286 --> 00:36:29,028
of appeal street. Mr. Deputy Mayor, go ahead. Thank you,

507
00:36:29,068 --> 00:36:30,708
Mr. Chair, through you. I guess a question for the

508
00:36:30,729 --> 00:36:36,148
CAO in place of the director operations. Uh, Mr. Towel

509
00:36:36,188 --> 00:36:40,768
raises some points of talking about infrastructure, much needed, um,

510
00:36:41,209 --> 00:36:43,748
upgrades. So that's not the argument point. I think the

511
00:36:43,929 --> 00:36:45,828
urban standard, and I know that, you know, we have

512
00:36:45,868 --> 00:36:49,008
certain mechanisms in place for ever standard in that. Um,

513
00:36:49,008 --> 00:36:53,028
but based on the topography and the historical areas of

514
00:36:53,068 --> 00:36:56,948
the town, when a new director of Ops is in

515
00:36:57,049 --> 00:37:01,588
const, Mr. CO, do you see opportunities to maybe take

516
00:37:01,628 --> 00:37:03,348
a look at project by project? I know we look

517
00:37:03,348 --> 00:37:07,028
at it project project, but not one size fits all.

518
00:37:07,028 --> 00:37:12,633
That would be my question to you. Mr. CAO. Uh,

519
00:37:12,734 --> 00:37:15,193
yes, through the chair. And I think even, uh, for,

520
00:37:15,233 --> 00:37:18,233
from any projects, they're based on the geography or based

521
00:37:18,233 --> 00:37:20,633
on this historical standards to which a lot of this

522
00:37:20,633 --> 00:37:24,233
infrastructure is designed to sometimes the natural impediments to, to

523
00:37:24,233 --> 00:37:26,233
make it to a standard of that we would, we

524
00:37:26,254 --> 00:37:29,013
would practice today. Uh, so I would say that, uh,

525
00:37:29,454 --> 00:37:31,993
I think there is a degree of that that goes

526
00:37:31,993 --> 00:37:35,513
into any, um, uh, project scope. But certainly when we

527
00:37:35,513 --> 00:37:39,073
do have onboard a new director of operations, that is

528
00:37:39,073 --> 00:37:41,513
something that is a theme. And I think a focal

529
00:37:41,534 --> 00:37:44,473
point relates to any initiative that I think will need

530
00:37:44,473 --> 00:37:46,153
to be top of mind, at least when it comes

531
00:37:46,153 --> 00:37:49,833
to even initially designing that scope is to have those

532
00:37:49,934 --> 00:37:54,073
conversations, particularly at the budget, be it a budget or

533
00:37:54,094 --> 00:37:57,353
in terms of getting to that initial design phase is

534
00:37:57,353 --> 00:38:00,233
to say, okay, what is really in terms of practical

535
00:38:00,414 --> 00:38:03,273
as it relates to making sure that, you know, it

536
00:38:03,313 --> 00:38:05,473
is to standard that can promote safety. It's going to

537
00:38:05,473 --> 00:38:08,393
promote reliability in the system versus what is something to

538
00:38:08,414 --> 00:38:11,273
which will be a standard that, you know, doesn't imperil

539
00:38:11,313 --> 00:38:15,113
the town's ability to have those, uh, reliable systems in

540
00:38:15,113 --> 00:38:17,433
place. But at the same time still kind of marry

541
00:38:17,433 --> 00:38:20,713
into, uh, that, uh, that character of that, uh, of

542
00:38:20,713 --> 00:38:22,793
that area. So it is, uh, yeah, it is a

543
00:38:22,814 --> 00:38:25,913
focal point as it relates to how we carry out

544
00:38:25,953 --> 00:38:30,073
these reconstructions moving forward. And sometimes it is also based

545
00:38:30,073 --> 00:38:33,993
on or where the influences are comments and feedback we

546
00:38:34,033 --> 00:38:37,673
get from external agencies such as MTO such as utilities,

547
00:38:37,673 --> 00:38:41,353
which we have limited control onto say that, uh, what

548
00:38:41,374 --> 00:38:44,393
they may request for. Because I know, for example, hydropoles

549
00:38:44,433 --> 00:38:46,793
is one case in point, which we don't necessarily as

550
00:38:46,833 --> 00:38:48,793
a town have much control as it relates to the

551
00:38:48,894 --> 00:38:51,913
placement of a hydropause or really on the design elements

552
00:38:51,934 --> 00:38:54,953
there. So, uh, but to the degree we can is

553
00:38:54,953 --> 00:38:56,873
to say to Council is around, you know, what this

554
00:38:56,873 --> 00:39:01,033
is an option, right? Is to look at, uh, modifying

555
00:39:01,054 --> 00:39:04,713
to reflect on that character. Follow up Mr. Deputy Mayor.

556
00:39:04,713 --> 00:39:07,273
Yes. Thank you. Um, this year I answered half my,

557
00:39:07,313 --> 00:39:09,813
my follow - up question with the utilities. You know,

558
00:39:09,813 --> 00:39:12,793
sometimes again, we've limited input with the utilities, but I

559
00:39:12,793 --> 00:39:15,433
think we need to further those conversations saying, is there

560
00:39:15,473 --> 00:39:22,313
an opportunity in this area to have larger lines, maybe

561
00:39:22,313 --> 00:39:25,673
buried cable? I think those conversations, even though they may

562
00:39:25,713 --> 00:39:28,233
not get the end result, at least we should have,

563
00:39:28,233 --> 00:39:29,753
I'm not saying we don't. We should be, that should

564
00:39:29,753 --> 00:39:32,633
be a focal point to have those conversations up front.

565
00:39:32,633 --> 00:39:34,033
And then we have to recognise too, if we do

566
00:39:34,033 --> 00:39:36,913
want a sidewalker, a trail, the road has to be

567
00:39:36,913 --> 00:39:41,673
that much wider or, or for drainage. We do need

568
00:39:41,713 --> 00:39:44,153
the curbs. So there's, it's just, I think it's just

569
00:39:44,153 --> 00:39:46,473
a matter of, you touched on it with character to

570
00:39:46,513 --> 00:39:48,713
neighbourhood. And then if we can get that tie in

571
00:39:48,713 --> 00:39:51,873
with the utilities, a little bit, um, more pressure. I

572
00:39:51,873 --> 00:39:55,033
think that would really help. Um, alleviate some concerns as

573
00:39:55,073 --> 00:39:59,833
we are doing some of these, um, fixes and reinfructure

574
00:39:59,873 --> 00:40:02,713
projects. So I'd appreciate that that's always a theme as

575
00:40:02,753 --> 00:40:05,673
we move forward. CEO Smith. No through chair. Thank you.

576
00:40:05,673 --> 00:40:08,713
That's good feedback. Thank you. Great. Okay. Thank you. Uh,

577
00:40:08,713 --> 00:40:16,120
Councillor Maxwell. Go ahead. Thank you chair. And yeah, Mr.

578
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:19,240
Towell did bring up some interesting points here. Um, I

579
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:24,840
took the opportunity on the weekend to walk down Peace

580
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:29,432
Street North with a couple of retired landscape architects. And,

581
00:40:29,432 --> 00:40:31,832
um, you know, I was surprised to win and ran

582
00:40:31,832 --> 00:40:35,112
into some of the residents that, especially I've high bluff

583
00:40:35,133 --> 00:40:38,632
lane. They said they really like the wide sidewalks because

584
00:40:38,653 --> 00:40:41,992
of, uh, you know, for baby buggies and different things

585
00:40:42,032 --> 00:40:46,712
like that. So, but then, you know, and then I

586
00:40:46,712 --> 00:40:50,312
also took a walk down Bay Street East. And they

587
00:40:50,312 --> 00:40:53,832
have a different way of looking at things. So I

588
00:40:53,832 --> 00:40:59,272
think the conclusion was this. And I think, cause everybody

589
00:40:59,312 --> 00:41:01,752
brings up character all the time and we've never defined

590
00:41:01,792 --> 00:41:06,760
it ever. And I'm actually thinking about doing a notice

591
00:41:06,861 --> 00:41:11,160
of motion on that because we're, you know, after with

592
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:16,440
the landscape architects, uh, look at soft landscaping for current

593
00:41:16,461 --> 00:41:22,056
and future infrastructure projects. That, you know, trying to preserve

594
00:41:22,096 --> 00:41:27,736
the character neighbourhood character and identity. So you may, I

595
00:41:27,837 --> 00:41:30,536
may bring that forward and see, okay, but I'll just,

596
00:41:30,536 --> 00:41:32,936
uh, leave it at that. Thank you. C. O. S.

597
00:41:32,976 --> 00:41:36,068
Smith, do you have a response to that. Yeah. Through

598
00:41:36,068 --> 00:41:38,468
the chair. I think, uh, one of the initiatives here

599
00:41:38,508 --> 00:41:41,108
is to ensure that when we look at capital projects

600
00:41:41,129 --> 00:41:44,308
as well or any project in general that there is

601
00:41:44,348 --> 00:41:47,348
an integration of various perspectives into the design of those

602
00:41:47,529 --> 00:41:50,528
elements whereby, for example, in Peel Street North, where you

603
00:41:50,528 --> 00:41:52,368
do have a park nearby, or you look at, you

604
00:41:52,368 --> 00:41:55,428
know, some of the other, um, other factors that may

605
00:41:55,468 --> 00:41:58,308
influence, uh, what that may look like or what those,

606
00:41:58,308 --> 00:42:01,028
uh, risks might be 20 years down the line, such

607
00:42:01,028 --> 00:42:04,028
as nearby developments. So I think that is always, I

608
00:42:04,028 --> 00:42:05,748
think the challenge when we look at say a green

609
00:42:05,788 --> 00:42:08,068
field type of development or green field type of project

610
00:42:08,329 --> 00:42:10,288
where you do not have the same. I think, uh,

611
00:42:10,969 --> 00:42:14,388
I think, uh, difficulties or challenges as you do in

612
00:42:14,388 --> 00:42:17,588
more of an existing type of, uh, redevelopment of a,

613
00:42:17,628 --> 00:42:20,388
of a space. But we always, and I think that's

614
00:42:20,388 --> 00:42:23,108
something that, you know, we continue this improvement in the

615
00:42:23,108 --> 00:42:26,548
sense of, uh, ensuring that we have those, uh, you

616
00:42:26,548 --> 00:42:29,428
know, to the point around landscaping is, you know, well,

617
00:42:29,428 --> 00:42:31,028
may not be, you know, they say the driver of

618
00:42:31,028 --> 00:42:33,988
the projects to get a water or sanitary pipe installed

619
00:42:34,409 --> 00:42:36,288
is to say, well, what are some of those, um,

620
00:42:36,729 --> 00:42:40,148
associated impacts and how do we modify that scope understanding

621
00:42:40,249 --> 00:42:42,468
budget's always going to be a limitation or do we

622
00:42:42,468 --> 00:42:45,028
say is this is part of a, this will influence

623
00:42:45,068 --> 00:42:47,508
a future plan. So we don't want to do anything.

624
00:42:47,508 --> 00:42:49,348
I think my, the Risk on my end is ensuring

625
00:42:49,388 --> 00:42:52,468
whatever we do basically shapes the course of what that

626
00:42:52,729 --> 00:42:54,868
park may look like in the future or what that,

627
00:42:54,868 --> 00:42:58,388
uh, how the limitations may be opposed on some other

628
00:42:58,409 --> 00:43:02,388
type of future development or community initiative that's being in,

629
00:43:02,388 --> 00:43:04,628
uh, moves forward. So I think that is definitely the

630
00:43:04,809 --> 00:43:07,108
ideal kind of state to which we have that type

631
00:43:07,148 --> 00:43:12,930
of fulsome perspective when it comes to these projects. Okay.

632
00:43:15,313 --> 00:43:20,489
All right. No. Follow up to that. Council supporter. Go

633
00:43:20,489 --> 00:43:25,272
ahead. Yes. Thank you. And through the chair, I would

634
00:43:25,272 --> 00:43:30,992
ask, um, it might be Miss Cameron to go down

635
00:43:33,413 --> 00:43:37,072
where it says, um, subject request for Council Meeting Agenda

636
00:43:37,093 --> 00:43:40,272
item. I want to look at the, um, pick slides

637
00:43:40,312 --> 00:43:46,424
first. Distinus comparison.

638
00:43:51,716 --> 00:43:54,415
So I think, no, not that way going too far.

639
00:43:55,645 --> 00:43:58,504
This. This is really what Peel Street look like before.

640
00:43:59,875 --> 00:44:03,390
You can barely count Powell. You barely see a pole.

641
00:44:06,121 --> 00:44:09,120
And this is what was presented at the PEC. And

642
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:12,660
then if we, is it scroll up or scroll down?

643
00:44:12,660 --> 00:44:17,446
I get, so whatever. This is, okay, stop. And the

644
00:44:17,486 --> 00:44:19,206
next slides actually worse. This is what we have now.

645
00:44:19,907 --> 00:44:25,001
Uh, which residents are. You know, they do call, they'd

646
00:44:25,001 --> 00:44:28,276
like to rename the place polls right now. Um, there

647
00:44:28,537 --> 00:44:31,655
is so many pools. In comparison. And I mean, you

648
00:44:31,655 --> 00:44:33,495
don't even have to count. It's just on a visual.

649
00:44:35,533 --> 00:44:38,392
I did speak with Mr. Chile. I've spoken with a

650
00:44:38,392 --> 00:44:43,061
number of people down there. And so part of the

651
00:44:43,162 --> 00:44:45,621
conversation and trying to understand. And at the corner of

652
00:44:45,882 --> 00:44:50,661
high bluff and peel, there is four light fixtures holes

653
00:44:51,082 --> 00:44:58,263
of different sizes. There's four on a corner. Is. Knowing

654
00:44:58,263 --> 00:45:00,983
that you have ab cor on one side and hydro

655
00:45:01,004 --> 00:45:06,890
one on the other. And. I also, um, no alignment

656
00:45:06,930 --> 00:45:09,690
who works for Hydro One and they're given instructions by

657
00:45:10,031 --> 00:45:14,250
the example was the city of Hamilton where hydropulse goal.

658
00:45:14,290 --> 00:45:16,650
He actually just texted me the copy because he's aligned.

659
00:45:16,650 --> 00:45:21,370
That's what he does. Um, so taking that into account,

660
00:45:21,370 --> 00:45:23,210
I thought I'm going to call the Ontario Energy Board

661
00:45:23,311 --> 00:45:27,328
and distoss them the question. I asked them the question.

662
00:45:27,328 --> 00:45:29,968
And in this scenario where you have Ebcor and Hydro

663
00:45:29,989 --> 00:45:33,648
on different sides of the road as a provider. Do

664
00:45:33,688 --> 00:45:35,728
they have to have separate polls? The answer is no.

665
00:45:36,921 --> 00:45:39,620
Can they share polls? Yes. You can put anything on

666
00:45:39,641 --> 00:45:41,380
a pole. You can put a light, you can put

667
00:45:41,401 --> 00:45:44,912
rogers. You can put every on the pool. And while

668
00:45:45,173 --> 00:45:52,032
the municipality isn't required, nothing stops the municipality from talking

669
00:45:52,213 --> 00:45:55,392
to all the players and saying, and I reference the

670
00:45:55,413 --> 00:45:59,312
previous picture. This is what we have before. This is

671
00:45:59,312 --> 00:46:01,232
what we're going to do. Is there any way you

672
00:46:01,272 --> 00:46:07,863
guys can work together so it's least disruptive. And. There

673
00:46:07,884 --> 00:46:12,091
is, there's nothing stopping the town from doing that. So

674
00:46:12,192 --> 00:46:14,411
I want to ask, did any of that happen in

675
00:46:14,451 --> 00:46:17,931
this project? Because to say something can happen in the

676
00:46:17,971 --> 00:46:20,331
future projects is easy. And I think that's important that

677
00:46:20,331 --> 00:46:24,171
they do. But did anyone think about the ascetics of

678
00:46:24,272 --> 00:46:27,051
the street and how the volume of poles would change

679
00:46:27,152 --> 00:46:30,737
it so much. It looks like an urban street. So

680
00:46:30,777 --> 00:46:34,417
I'm just asking the question. Did that cross anybody's mind?

681
00:46:36,322 --> 00:46:38,701
CEO Smith. I don't know. Yeah. I believe we do

682
00:46:38,701 --> 00:46:40,781
have Mike Campbell on the line that might be able

683
00:46:40,781 --> 00:46:43,181
to speak to in terms of the coordination, uh, with

684
00:46:43,202 --> 00:46:45,901
the, uh, utilities. So perhaps Mike can able to provide

685
00:46:45,922 --> 00:46:47,261
some context in that regard.

686
00:46:55,844 --> 00:46:57,743
Yeah. It's do I want me to just dance this

687
00:46:57,743 --> 00:47:04,193
question. Go ahead, Mr. Campbell. Yes. Through you, uh, chair.

688
00:47:04,834 --> 00:47:08,813
Uh, designs were kind of separate. You've got poles for

689
00:47:09,314 --> 00:47:13,293
streetlights and you've got the poles for, uh, Rogers and

690
00:47:13,314 --> 00:47:21,354
Hydro. So we, we had the hydro poles upgraded. I'm

691
00:47:21,354 --> 00:47:25,534
not sure that like the polls that the new Hydro

692
00:47:25,574 --> 00:47:28,774
poles that are in are taller than they used to

693
00:47:28,774 --> 00:47:32,014
be. And they're not as brown as they used to

694
00:47:32,014 --> 00:47:34,494
be. So I could do a, I mean, we could

695
00:47:34,534 --> 00:47:38,574
do a, um, a review of this of where the

696
00:47:38,595 --> 00:47:41,214
polls were in the past where the poles are in

697
00:47:41,254 --> 00:47:44,424
the currently. But you had one design for hydro to

698
00:47:44,424 --> 00:47:48,504
get their hydro lines in place. And Rogers is also

699
00:47:48,504 --> 00:47:51,624
on the pole line. And we used, um, then you've

700
00:47:51,624 --> 00:47:54,904
got the lighting design for the street done. And they're

701
00:47:54,925 --> 00:47:59,864
done separately. And you have to have lights at certain

702
00:47:59,904 --> 00:48:04,984
locations. And we're possible we put lights on the new

703
00:48:05,005 --> 00:48:07,304
Hydra poles, but we also had to put some new

704
00:48:07,344 --> 00:48:10,674
lights in. So there was no, there was no lighting

705
00:48:10,775 --> 00:48:14,994
there before. Um, maybe just at the, I think there

706
00:48:14,994 --> 00:48:18,303
was, there was a light at Cameron Street. And then

707
00:48:18,303 --> 00:48:21,823
there were two lights at one at Timberlain and wanted

708
00:48:21,844 --> 00:48:26,703
high bluffling, but they were the smaller, um, uh, development

709
00:48:26,743 --> 00:48:29,423
lights rather than the Cobra heads that we're putting in

710
00:48:29,463 --> 00:48:34,623
on, on Peel Street. So there could be a marginal

711
00:48:34,644 --> 00:48:38,603
amount of overlighting at Timberlane and high bluff lane, but

712
00:48:38,644 --> 00:48:44,623
that would have to be assessed. So really it's the,

713
00:48:44,623 --> 00:48:46,703
we've got the new polls for Hydro and we've got,

714
00:48:46,743 --> 00:48:48,943
we had to put some poles in where the hydro

715
00:48:49,044 --> 00:48:52,987
poles didn't line up to where we needed. Uh, light

716
00:48:53,027 --> 00:48:57,047
installed. I mean, we can, if you want, we can

717
00:48:57,047 --> 00:49:01,187
go back and do a post mortem on this. But

718
00:49:03,228 --> 00:49:07,527
the designs were really separate parties designing things. One, the

719
00:49:07,567 --> 00:49:11,047
lighting design bar are consultant. And two, the, the hydro

720
00:49:11,087 --> 00:49:16,339
design by Appco. Councillor Porter, do you have a follow

721
00:49:16,379 --> 00:49:18,899
up? Uh, yes, I do. Cause I've been down the

722
00:49:18,899 --> 00:49:20,979
street one of the people complain there are no lights

723
00:49:21,019 --> 00:49:25,411
that work at night. That's what I've heard. Some lights

724
00:49:25,411 --> 00:49:29,411
are on pole. Some aren't. Some are on separate poles.

725
00:49:29,411 --> 00:49:35,011
Um, my question was though that at any time did

726
00:49:35,011 --> 00:49:41,011
the municipality say to Ebco or hydro with respect to,

727
00:49:41,011 --> 00:49:43,411
can we work together? Cause this is what the street

728
00:49:43,451 --> 00:49:48,034
looked like before. And this is, and we don't, we'd

729
00:49:48,034 --> 00:49:49,714
like you to look as close to this as possible.

730
00:49:52,047 --> 00:49:56,986
So we didn't have, um, cause the stark contrast in

731
00:49:56,986 --> 00:50:01,686
the number of polls. And they're on both sides. And

732
00:50:01,727 --> 00:50:04,426
they are, I mean, residents have counted the polls. They've

733
00:50:04,426 --> 00:50:09,546
counted this spaces between the poles there. And it really

734
00:50:10,367 --> 00:50:12,966
given all the vegetation, everything that was taken out. You

735
00:50:12,966 --> 00:50:15,386
go down that street and you just see these poles

736
00:50:15,426 --> 00:50:17,786
sticking out of the ground. And they don't understand why

737
00:50:17,807 --> 00:50:23,146
it happened that way. So as I said, the municipality

738
00:50:23,247 --> 00:50:28,586
is not obligated, but there is nothing stopping a municipality

739
00:50:28,607 --> 00:50:31,926
by working with Hydro One EP Corps to say, how

740
00:50:31,926 --> 00:50:35,495
can we work together. To maybe have it look like?

741
00:50:35,495 --> 00:50:38,195
As similar as it did before. And I'm asking, did

742
00:50:38,195 --> 00:50:40,896
that happen. And if it takes a post - mortem

743
00:50:40,936 --> 00:50:42,576
to get to the answer, then I'm happy to move

744
00:50:43,237 --> 00:50:47,099
a motion to Undertape one. Do you have a response

745
00:50:47,099 --> 00:50:51,749
to Mr. Campbell. Sure. Uh, through Mr. Chair. I don't

746
00:50:51,789 --> 00:50:55,729
think, no, we never had a meeting between Hydro, uh,

747
00:50:55,850 --> 00:51:00,309
between hardware, one EPCOR and the lighting designers. That wasn't

748
00:51:00,349 --> 00:51:03,189
done. It's, I'm not sure if it's, if it's commonly

749
00:51:03,189 --> 00:51:09,011
done anywhere. We've got a, the town has a lighting

750
00:51:09,051 --> 00:51:11,891
standard for the street. So you've got your lighting designers

751
00:51:11,931 --> 00:51:15,934
working with that. And you also had the hydro and

752
00:51:15,955 --> 00:51:19,694
Rogers. They've got to get their lines in place. And,

753
00:51:19,694 --> 00:51:21,694
you know, they, they did their design and put their

754
00:51:21,694 --> 00:51:25,804
polls in. Just as another follow - up, Madam, Mr.

755
00:51:25,804 --> 00:51:30,653
Chair. Is did MTE talk to them. Well, that's the,

756
00:51:30,653 --> 00:51:35,262
that's the lighting designer. That's the empty. Is who is,

757
00:51:35,262 --> 00:51:40,607
who is the engineer then for this? And. Through you,

758
00:51:40,607 --> 00:51:44,847
Mr. Chair, Vince Pugliese with the MTE is the, the,

759
00:51:44,887 --> 00:51:50,536
the lead designer for, um, The project. Council Porter, are

760
00:51:50,536 --> 00:51:54,156
you, excuse me, that's, I asked if MTE had had

761
00:51:54,196 --> 00:51:57,226
the discussions. You said they were the lighting people. You're

762
00:51:57,266 --> 00:52:03,570
saying now they were the engineers. Through your Mr. Chair.

763
00:52:03,570 --> 00:52:09,410
Yeah. MTE is the main designer and they had a

764
00:52:09,410 --> 00:52:12,450
subcontractor working on the electrical lighting.

765
00:52:35,632 --> 00:52:36,261
That. Aired anything.

766
00:56:38,831 --> 00:56:39,610
Test test test.

767
01:03:01,506 --> 01:03:03,805
Are we repaired? Okay, two minutes.

768
01:04:21,260 --> 01:04:24,039
All right, Madam Clerk or Madam Deputy Clerk, we are

769
01:04:24,060 --> 01:04:30,315
our microphone situation has been repaired. For now. We'll call

770
01:04:30,315 --> 01:04:33,623
the meeting back to order. We are reconvened. Council Supporter.

771
01:04:34,552 --> 01:04:40,079
Please finish with your comment or your question. Through the

772
01:04:40,079 --> 01:04:43,615
chair, I was just waiting for an answer. From Mr.

773
01:04:43,876 --> 01:04:46,415
Campbell as to how we ended up with all these

774
01:04:46,596 --> 01:04:53,392
polls. And did MTL have any conversations as they were,

775
01:04:53,392 --> 01:04:56,032
the designer? Did they have any conversations? Was there any

776
01:04:56,072 --> 01:04:58,352
thought put into it? Because I think what gets me

777
01:04:58,613 --> 01:05:00,592
is you have these pictures on the pick. This is

778
01:05:00,773 --> 01:05:03,312
the before. Then we have the after, and the Star

779
01:05:03,333 --> 01:05:06,432
Contrast, and really was that necessary. That's the bottom line.

780
01:05:08,706 --> 01:05:17,139
Mr. Campbell, do you have a response to that? Sir,

781
01:05:17,139 --> 01:05:25,351
Mr. Campbell, you are muted. Apologise. Sorry about that. There

782
01:05:25,692 --> 01:05:31,671
was an coordination between the Hydro design and MTE and

783
01:05:31,692 --> 01:05:36,231
their subcontractor that did the electrical design is Mighten Engineering.

784
01:05:37,960 --> 01:05:42,023
There wasn't a conversation between the two. Hydros got their

785
01:05:42,063 --> 01:05:44,803
mandate, which is to get power down that street. And

786
01:05:44,803 --> 01:05:48,183
the lighting designer has his mandate to light the street

787
01:05:48,364 --> 01:05:53,703
to the requirements of the Towns Engineering Standards. Where possible

788
01:05:54,284 --> 01:06:01,843
they put the Cobra heads on the existing, this new

789
01:06:01,964 --> 01:06:06,966
Hydropoles. And where they needed other lighting, they put them

790
01:06:06,987 --> 01:06:11,446
on, and it didn't line up with the Hydra Pole

791
01:06:11,446 --> 01:06:17,051
locations. They put in new polls for Cobra headlights. There's

792
01:06:17,152 --> 01:06:20,251
16 lights that were installed. Six of them are on

793
01:06:20,352 --> 01:06:24,070
utility poles and tender on new poles. That's how we

794
01:06:24,070 --> 01:06:26,863
got to where we are today. Okay, thank you, Mr.

795
01:06:27,284 --> 01:06:30,783
Campbell. Councillor Porter, will you be alluding to a motion

796
01:06:30,964 --> 01:06:35,023
for an examination of the process on this? Yes, I

797
01:06:35,023 --> 01:06:38,543
will, but what I need, what I would just would

798
01:06:38,543 --> 01:06:41,823
like to understand through the chair is you say there

799
01:06:41,863 --> 01:06:50,240
was no coordination. Between the players. Through you, Mr. Chair,

800
01:06:50,741 --> 01:06:54,560
there wasn't a coordination meeting. How can we locate the

801
01:06:54,661 --> 01:06:58,640
hydropoles to best light the streets? They're two separate design

802
01:06:58,741 --> 01:07:02,960
exercise. The Hydro is, they're mandated is to get power

803
01:07:02,981 --> 01:07:06,320
down that street. And on the other side, the lighting

804
01:07:06,360 --> 01:07:09,680
design is separate, where they, where they could use a

805
01:07:09,701 --> 01:07:13,680
hydropol to mount a light they did. And other than

806
01:07:13,680 --> 01:07:19,040
that, but there's not a coordination between those two. They're

807
01:07:19,080 --> 01:07:24,011
two separate design exercises. Okay. So I just have one

808
01:07:24,051 --> 01:07:27,371
final comment, but I do understand that your title is

809
01:07:28,352 --> 01:07:35,620
Senior Project Capital Project Coordinator. Thank you. So I will

810
01:07:35,660 --> 01:07:38,740
be drafting, yes. Thank you. Okay, you're drafting a motion.

811
01:07:38,740 --> 01:07:40,580
Thank you, Councillor Porter. We're going to move on to

812
01:07:41,081 --> 01:07:45,302
Councillor Ardell. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I'm just wondering,

813
01:07:45,302 --> 01:07:48,742
we've had this discussion at the beginning of this Council

814
01:07:48,843 --> 01:07:53,462
term from an area down in Craig Leaf. And they

815
01:07:53,723 --> 01:07:58,082
wanted their designs a little bit different, because now, and

816
01:07:58,082 --> 01:08:01,542
I think it was windfall, they wanted sidewalks they wanted.

817
01:08:01,542 --> 01:08:06,582
All the urban standards, whereas other places in Craig Leaf,

818
01:08:06,582 --> 01:08:09,862
like the rules standards. And now that more and more

819
01:08:09,902 --> 01:08:12,902
people are moving up and they have children, yes, they,

820
01:08:12,942 --> 01:08:15,542
and I ask that question many years ago, what happens

821
01:08:15,563 --> 01:08:19,382
when you start to age in place, and you want

822
01:08:19,382 --> 01:08:21,622
to go, and maybe you're on a walker, you're in

823
01:08:21,622 --> 01:08:24,822
a wheelchair, and you don't have a sidewalk, or you

824
01:08:24,822 --> 01:08:28,342
don't have outdoor lighting. So things are changing, and I'm

825
01:08:28,363 --> 01:08:32,342
just wondering if we could have different rule in urban

826
01:08:32,363 --> 01:08:39,522
standards designs so that different parts of the town, you

827
01:08:39,522 --> 01:08:44,422
know, like Craig Leaf is developing, and the development happening.

828
01:08:44,422 --> 01:08:46,662
But maybe we should have a, you know, different standards

829
01:08:47,083 --> 01:08:50,342
and ask the communities at that time, or the developers.

830
01:08:50,342 --> 01:08:52,182
What are we going to be designing here? Like, can

831
01:08:52,182 --> 01:08:57,022
we have down in Craig Leaf? Some of them have

832
01:08:57,083 --> 01:09:00,582
some really decorative lighting, some of them don't. Some have

833
01:09:00,683 --> 01:09:04,242
sidewalks, some don't, some have curves, some don't. So, um,

834
01:09:04,283 --> 01:09:08,242
I'm in rule, so I don't have anything. So, um,

835
01:09:09,163 --> 01:09:12,502
it's, everybody's to their own choice. I choose to live

836
01:09:12,542 --> 01:09:16,182
on an Apple farm. That's my life. So, um, you

837
01:09:16,182 --> 01:09:18,822
know, I don't have water and sewer either. So those

838
01:09:18,862 --> 01:09:23,462
are what happens when things get upgraded. And I think

839
01:09:23,462 --> 01:09:27,782
we should have, though, I'm just maybe to Mr. CO,

840
01:09:27,782 --> 01:09:31,062
Adam Smith, could we do some different designs throughout the

841
01:09:31,243 --> 01:09:36,982
different types of our community? Because, you know, we have,

842
01:09:36,982 --> 01:09:41,142
you know, Craig Leaf is changing down the Craig Leech

843
01:09:41,182 --> 01:09:44,262
Village, which goes along Highway 26 to when they start

844
01:09:44,302 --> 01:09:48,102
to develop some of those projects down there. Do they

845
01:09:48,142 --> 01:09:53,542
want all this urban standards with these huge poles and

846
01:09:53,582 --> 01:09:56,102
lights? And can we look at something different down there

847
01:09:56,763 --> 01:10:00,262
as opposed to, and Cameron Street, too, the same thing?

848
01:10:00,262 --> 01:10:03,262
Like, why do we have to have just, this is

849
01:10:03,262 --> 01:10:07,222
what's going to happen. And I think because we are

850
01:10:07,243 --> 01:10:10,982
a unique town. And we should be giving the town

851
01:10:11,323 --> 01:10:15,122
people opportunities to choose how they want to live. And

852
01:10:15,122 --> 01:10:17,622
I've been down cameras street. I have friends on camera

853
01:10:17,622 --> 01:10:20,742
street, and now I know I'm sort of looking at

854
01:10:20,782 --> 01:10:27,462
these poles, and maybe it is Hydro with these streetlights.

855
01:10:27,462 --> 01:10:30,102
They're pretty big. So, you know, it's sort of, I'm

856
01:10:30,123 --> 01:10:34,182
just wondering if we can look at two different types

857
01:10:34,222 --> 01:10:38,662
of design elements for this town. Thank you. Okay, thank

858
01:10:38,662 --> 01:10:41,942
you, Councillor Ardell, CAO Smith. Do you want to comment

859
01:10:41,982 --> 01:10:45,702
on the Urban Design and the rural designs that we

860
01:10:45,702 --> 01:10:49,542
have? For engineering standards? Yeah, through the chair. So we

861
01:10:49,542 --> 01:10:52,662
do delineate between urban and rural with our current standards.

862
01:10:52,662 --> 01:10:55,942
I think the challenge becomes is to what the perspectives,

863
01:10:55,942 --> 01:10:58,582
particularly in the community as it relates to what is

864
01:10:58,582 --> 01:11:00,742
rural versus what is urban. And I think that's what

865
01:11:00,843 --> 01:11:04,182
we were confronted with. I also are background study too,

866
01:11:04,182 --> 01:11:06,982
delineates on, you know, future state to say, Hey, this

867
01:11:07,163 --> 01:11:09,302
road, even though it says rural now, but in the

868
01:11:09,302 --> 01:11:13,142
future, based on population growth, based on, um, on those

869
01:11:13,163 --> 01:11:15,862
projections, that it is to be upgraded to an urban

870
01:11:15,902 --> 01:11:17,702
standard. So we have to be, particularly when we use

871
01:11:17,723 --> 01:11:20,022
DCs, we have to be cognizant of what's in our

872
01:11:20,062 --> 01:11:23,462
background studied, and sure, we're using that money with the

873
01:11:23,502 --> 01:11:26,982
intent of that study. And then in conjunction with our

874
01:11:27,022 --> 01:11:29,782
engineering standards. So there is a bit of difficulty to

875
01:11:29,822 --> 01:11:32,742
say that, you know, where, um, and that's, I think,

876
01:11:32,742 --> 01:11:34,902
the challenge we've seen a lot of these projects around,

877
01:11:34,902 --> 01:11:38,162
you know, noting the, for the engineering standards themselves. And

878
01:11:38,162 --> 01:11:39,622
when we start to go down the route as it

879
01:11:39,662 --> 01:11:42,742
relates to, um, picking and choosing a where these standards

880
01:11:42,923 --> 01:11:45,522
end up applying, right? Whereas it's just saying, you know,

881
01:11:45,563 --> 01:11:48,022
and that's the challenge, right? When you look at my

882
01:11:48,022 --> 01:11:51,602
one example around Greenfield versus Reconstruction is to say, you

883
01:11:51,602 --> 01:11:54,262
know, engineering standards that we apply quite rigorously pertaining to

884
01:11:54,443 --> 01:11:57,302
developments. When we uphold them to a certain standard, we

885
01:11:57,323 --> 01:12:00,182
also want to hold ourselves to that same standard in

886
01:12:00,182 --> 01:12:02,502
terms of applying it. But, uh, so we do have

887
01:12:02,502 --> 01:12:04,822
that language in our engineering standards, but I mean, made

888
01:12:04,822 --> 01:12:07,702
to that point is that the inception of projects can

889
01:12:07,723 --> 01:12:10,422
always consider as it relates to, you know, where are

890
01:12:10,422 --> 01:12:13,542
the risks is to say modifying that type of design.

891
01:12:13,542 --> 01:12:15,622
And maybe if it's to be incongruent with our engineering

892
01:12:15,643 --> 01:12:18,582
standards, which, you know, that could be council's right as

893
01:12:18,622 --> 01:12:21,142
it relates to modifying that, but where we have less

894
01:12:21,243 --> 01:12:23,942
wiggle room is to say, well, if it is inconsistent

895
01:12:23,982 --> 01:12:27,782
with the standards by, say, external agencies or by Jessica

896
01:12:27,822 --> 01:12:30,342
Engineering practice, we want to ensure we're not putting the

897
01:12:30,342 --> 01:12:33,042
municipality at risk. Um, so that is some, you know,

898
01:12:33,083 --> 01:12:36,502
good conversation as it relates to project scopes moving forward,

899
01:12:36,502 --> 01:12:39,362
particularly for capital. Uh, is to say, is, you know,

900
01:12:39,403 --> 01:12:42,582
how do we look at those modifications in a manner

901
01:12:42,603 --> 01:12:45,542
that, uh, at least when we know at early appointed

902
01:12:45,542 --> 01:12:48,742
time, or we've identified that those types of perspectives there

903
01:12:48,923 --> 01:12:50,262
is to say, well, can we do this a little

904
01:12:50,262 --> 01:12:53,142
bit differently? Or is there, you know, Hey, we do

905
01:12:53,182 --> 01:12:56,182
have, usually on annual basis, a reviewer of our standards

906
01:12:56,222 --> 01:12:59,142
to see what may need to change. But, uh, it

907
01:12:59,182 --> 01:13:02,022
does become difficult when you look at trying to pick

908
01:13:02,123 --> 01:13:04,582
and choose. And I think trying to marry against expectations

909
01:13:04,603 --> 01:13:10,940
on what is rural versus what is urban. Councillor Ardell?

910
01:13:10,980 --> 01:13:13,580
Yes. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair and for any

911
01:13:13,620 --> 01:13:17,660
new development, definitely. But for parts of our rural down

912
01:13:17,660 --> 01:13:21,500
towards Cameron Street down, you know, Bay Street, different things

913
01:13:21,681 --> 01:13:26,140
we should be looking at different ways of doing things.

914
01:13:26,140 --> 01:13:28,780
Or, you know, Orchard Park, we, you know, we did

915
01:13:28,801 --> 01:13:31,020
a design years ago on there and people didn't like

916
01:13:31,121 --> 01:13:33,740
it. So, um, yeah, I just think we should have

917
01:13:34,161 --> 01:13:38,925
different types of design. That's a Councillor Adele. Thank you.

918
01:13:38,946 --> 01:13:41,245
Yeah. Let's, uh, I'll just keep us on track for

919
01:13:41,245 --> 01:13:45,165
this correspondence to do with Peel Street North. Um, but

920
01:13:45,186 --> 01:13:49,965
I do Mr. Campbell, if you wanted to, uh, weigh

921
01:13:49,965 --> 01:13:51,565
in on this, I do recall that there was quite

922
01:13:51,565 --> 01:13:54,445
a bit of compromise that was, that was done on

923
01:13:54,485 --> 01:13:58,657
this street. Is that not correct, Mr. Campbell? Uh, three

924
01:13:58,657 --> 01:14:01,297
years, Mr. Chair, yes, there was a, there was an

925
01:14:01,297 --> 01:14:05,137
extensive process of coming up with, uh, this unique road

926
01:14:05,158 --> 01:14:08,017
cross section, uh, we went through the first process of

927
01:14:09,558 --> 01:14:12,977
select determining whether, um, a rural road cross section would

928
01:14:13,017 --> 01:14:17,377
work or as laid out in the development charges background

929
01:14:17,398 --> 01:14:20,797
study. This was supposed to be developed as a, uh,

930
01:14:20,998 --> 01:14:23,777
the town's urban standard, which at a 1. 5 metre

931
01:14:23,817 --> 01:14:27,937
wide sidewalk, uh, 8. 5 metre wide asphalt. Um, it

932
01:14:27,977 --> 01:14:31,197
is a unique situation because you're trying to fit, um,

933
01:14:32,438 --> 01:14:34,577
you might maybe call it a round peg into a

934
01:14:34,617 --> 01:14:36,577
square hole, but you're trying to fit a road into

935
01:14:36,598 --> 01:14:43,057
an existing, um, um, lay of the land. And the,

936
01:14:43,097 --> 01:14:46,337
the rural road cross section just wouldn't work because the,

937
01:14:46,438 --> 01:14:51,457
the resultant ditch depth to drain the road structure would

938
01:14:51,478 --> 01:14:55,217
have backslopes well on deprivate property. So this was a

939
01:14:55,958 --> 01:14:59,377
compromise of we went down to seven metre wide road.

940
01:14:59,377 --> 01:15:02,457
We looked at three different types of a sort of

941
01:15:02,457 --> 01:15:06,662
an urban rural. Feel of the road. And this was

942
01:15:06,763 --> 01:15:10,482
the one that was selected. So that this was, Oh,

943
01:15:10,482 --> 01:15:12,422
it added, uh, and I'm more than a year to

944
01:15:12,422 --> 01:15:17,702
the project and it was, uh, extensive consultation. And this

945
01:15:17,702 --> 01:15:20,902
was the road selection, the road section that was selected.

946
01:15:22,716 --> 01:15:27,159
Thank you, Mr. Campbell. Okay. Madam Mayor, go ahead. Thank

947
01:15:27,159 --> 01:15:30,919
you. Through you the chair to add to Councillor Adeles

948
01:15:30,959 --> 01:15:34,039
Remarks, I think when I look at the correspondence and

949
01:15:34,039 --> 01:15:37,079
I'm looking at the correspondence ask, it's simply to reflect

950
01:15:37,500 --> 01:15:40,119
on moving forward and how we might. So I think

951
01:15:40,140 --> 01:15:42,759
there are some good points raised by Councillor Adele that

952
01:15:42,780 --> 01:15:46,039
each and every scenario may be different and that we

953
01:15:46,039 --> 01:15:49,239
should have different options and choices moving forward. I think

954
01:15:49,260 --> 01:15:51,799
it's very helpful to have taken this in. This is

955
01:15:51,799 --> 01:15:54,519
now another example that can be demonstrated in the town

956
01:15:54,780 --> 01:15:57,959
when the next decision making happens. What is it that

957
01:15:57,999 --> 01:16:00,119
works here? What is it that doesn't? What would make

958
01:16:00,140 --> 01:16:03,239
sense in that particular occasion? I think the CAO has

959
01:16:03,239 --> 01:16:06,519
added some good details too that, um, above all as

960
01:16:06,519 --> 01:16:09,639
well, the reason we can't return to the way that

961
01:16:09,660 --> 01:16:12,599
things used to look is because standards have changed. Safety

962
01:16:12,620 --> 01:16:14,999
standards have changed. We need to be able to deliver

963
01:16:15,340 --> 01:16:18,199
securely minimize risk of the town that we're delivering everything

964
01:16:18,220 --> 01:16:21,559
we need, whether it's light at certain increments, whether it's

965
01:16:21,559 --> 01:16:25,319
the widened sidewalk, all of these things, the correspondent is

966
01:16:25,359 --> 01:16:27,939
simply asking that we take this into reflection of the

967
01:16:27,939 --> 01:16:30,199
future. So I can support a motion that would take

968
01:16:30,220 --> 01:16:34,279
that recommendation from the correspondence and keep it in place

969
01:16:34,380 --> 01:16:37,079
that we can deliver. Um, I have no problem with

970
01:16:37,119 --> 01:16:39,239
the way in which the staff has coordinated this project

971
01:16:39,740 --> 01:16:42,179
because there are so many moving pieces to this. And

972
01:16:42,179 --> 01:16:45,959
as we've heard examples about couldn't just take a cookie

973
01:16:45,959 --> 01:16:48,839
cutter example and make it fit here, everything had to

974
01:16:48,879 --> 01:16:50,999
be this. But what about if we did it this

975
01:16:50,999 --> 01:16:54,359
way? It's been a long Folsom, thoughtful process. And I

976
01:16:54,359 --> 01:16:56,759
appreciate the staff and being able to coordinate not just

977
01:16:56,759 --> 01:16:59,399
the decisions that we make, but also that there are

978
01:16:59,399 --> 01:17:02,439
entities with the utilities that we don't get to control.

979
01:17:02,439 --> 01:17:07,225
Thank you. Thank you, Madam Mayor. Councillor Hope. Yes, thank

980
01:17:07,225 --> 01:17:13,945
you. You know, building on all parts of this conversation,

981
01:17:14,526 --> 01:17:17,465
Councillor Porter and I took a trip down to Southampton

982
01:17:18,046 --> 01:17:21,065
to see what they had done on what they called

983
01:17:21,326 --> 01:17:24,665
cottage roads. It was very impressive how they were able

984
01:17:24,705 --> 01:17:30,745
to take a street above the size of Bay Street

985
01:17:31,646 --> 01:17:35,465
and simply, uh, keep to the same size of street,

986
01:17:35,465 --> 01:17:39,545
keep to the same character being a big word in

987
01:17:39,545 --> 01:17:41,465
the Tom of Mountain Mountains. So that's really what we're

988
01:17:41,505 --> 01:17:44,425
talking about is maintaining our character. So when we have

989
01:17:44,446 --> 01:17:48,905
something like this where we look like Toronto or Mississauga

990
01:17:48,905 --> 01:17:51,705
or whatever, that's not what people came up here for.

991
01:17:51,726 --> 01:17:54,745
They, they came up, uh, for the character of the

992
01:17:54,766 --> 01:17:58,745
community. So there was an opportunity here to maintain the

993
01:17:58,785 --> 01:18:02,345
character didn't exactly happen. So I think what we want

994
01:18:02,345 --> 01:18:04,465
to do is to be very careful in future. So

995
01:18:04,526 --> 01:18:08,825
it might mean engineering standards for, uh, for cottage road

996
01:18:08,846 --> 01:18:11,925
style, which there is a prototype for that from, um,

997
01:18:12,126 --> 01:18:15,065
from Southampton. And I'm sure probably other municipalities have taken

998
01:18:15,166 --> 01:18:19,405
it as well. But, um, we've had a lot of

999
01:18:19,406 --> 01:18:23,625
learning between Bay Street and Peel Street. Let's take it

1000
01:18:23,806 --> 01:18:26,985
and let's communicate well with our staff. And at the

1001
01:18:26,985 --> 01:18:32,025
same time ask, but most importantly, communicate with the community.

1002
01:18:32,025 --> 01:18:35,705
So if there's the right public consultation, then we don't

1003
01:18:35,726 --> 01:18:41,385
have this after. Everything can come out before, which is

1004
01:18:41,425 --> 01:18:45,625
what, uh, I think we should strive for. And it

1005
01:18:45,625 --> 01:18:49,385
seems to be with reconstruction where it's most important because

1006
01:18:49,385 --> 01:18:52,105
what was there before isn't looking like, what is there

1007
01:18:52,105 --> 01:18:54,905
now? And that's the character part. That's why people move

1008
01:18:54,926 --> 01:18:58,726
up here. And of course love being here. Thank you.

1009
01:18:59,307 --> 01:19:01,126
So I guess what my follow - up would be

1010
01:19:01,467 --> 01:19:06,226
is, um, can we look into this? And two. And

1011
01:19:06,226 --> 01:19:10,886
I think we asked, I recall, um, after Councillor Porter

1012
01:19:10,886 --> 01:19:13,126
and I must have gone a couple of years ago.

1013
01:19:13,126 --> 01:19:18,406
So, um, what through you, um, Mr. Chair, uh, to

1014
01:19:18,446 --> 01:19:22,966
the CAO, what can be done to explore what Southampton

1015
01:19:23,006 --> 01:19:27,846
has done or what the cottage road, um, protocol where

1016
01:19:27,846 --> 01:19:29,366
that is at the moment and how we might be

1017
01:19:29,406 --> 01:19:33,366
able to, uh, take the learnings from other municipalities. Thank

1018
01:19:33,366 --> 01:19:37,149
you. All right. Mr. CAO, with you can answer within

1019
01:19:37,149 --> 01:19:39,789
the context of, uh, this is, this is a piece

1020
01:19:39,789 --> 01:19:42,509
of correspondence to do with peel street north and reflecting

1021
01:19:42,530 --> 01:19:45,869
upon our finished product. Please go ahead and we have

1022
01:19:45,970 --> 01:19:47,509
a motion. We need to get on the floor. We

1023
01:19:47,509 --> 01:19:49,549
have a lot of other reports to do to please

1024
01:19:49,549 --> 01:19:52,058
go ahead. Yeah. Through the chair. And there has been

1025
01:19:52,479 --> 01:19:56,038
previous direction with respect to that type of analyst and

1026
01:19:56,038 --> 01:19:59,618
study. And just with some, some recent turnover, I would

1027
01:19:59,618 --> 01:20:03,658
say. We're looking at shuffling some of that work as

1028
01:20:03,759 --> 01:20:05,498
it relates to getting that going. We do have a

1029
01:20:05,498 --> 01:20:09,098
proposal with respect to something similar to, uh, what was

1030
01:20:09,098 --> 01:20:11,978
done in the Southampton area. And, uh, we are working

1031
01:20:12,319 --> 01:20:16,858
out reviewing that with the new lead for that project.

1032
01:20:16,898 --> 01:20:21,258
But, uh, I once say it's the solution to making,

1033
01:20:21,258 --> 01:20:23,418
uh, everyone happy is with respect to some of these

1034
01:20:23,418 --> 01:20:26,058
designs, but that is in flight. And, uh, we're just

1035
01:20:26,058 --> 01:20:31,121
looking to get that, uh, that moving. I mean, I

1036
01:20:31,121 --> 01:20:33,521
think this is a very important point. We're following what

1037
01:20:33,521 --> 01:20:36,781
the community is looking for. So, um, well, this has

1038
01:20:36,781 --> 01:20:39,361
been going on for a little while. Um, you know,

1039
01:20:39,462 --> 01:20:41,841
for the last couple of years, this discussion has gone

1040
01:20:41,841 --> 01:20:46,801
on. So I'm really hoping that, um, we can have

1041
01:20:47,462 --> 01:20:50,561
a better car route than just that we're talking about

1042
01:20:50,582 --> 01:20:54,001
it. You know, what, what, what is staff doing about

1043
01:20:56,822 --> 01:21:00,801
bringing forward cottage road protocols, however you want to call

1044
01:21:00,801 --> 01:21:04,401
it. And, um, getting council's busing on it. Thank you.

1045
01:21:05,071 --> 01:21:07,450
Yeah. Through the chair, I think my expectation is associated

1046
01:21:07,490 --> 01:21:10,410
with this project is BV atendendum or it'd be some

1047
01:21:10,450 --> 01:21:13,770
type of, uh, as it relates to our engineering standards,

1048
01:21:13,770 --> 01:21:16,490
which we bring back to council. So, uh, just working

1049
01:21:16,591 --> 01:21:18,710
on get that once again, that project in flight, but

1050
01:21:18,710 --> 01:21:20,970
I am keen to move on it before, before the

1051
01:21:20,970 --> 01:21:23,010
end of the year, uh, and to what you'll be

1052
01:21:23,010 --> 01:21:26,570
able to report back to council on what some of

1053
01:21:26,570 --> 01:21:29,419
the results of that study. Thank you very much. Okay.

1054
01:21:29,600 --> 01:21:32,459
Councillor Porter, do you have your motion into the Deputy

1055
01:21:32,560 --> 01:21:36,059
Clerk? I see your hand Councillor Maxwell. You've had a

1056
01:21:36,080 --> 01:21:39,019
question and a follow - up. We need to move

1057
01:21:39,059 --> 01:21:41,259
along. I'll get to your question after the motions on

1058
01:21:41,259 --> 01:21:42,939
the floor unless you'd like to second it. We have

1059
01:21:43,040 --> 01:21:48,219
a motion from Councillor Porter that Town Blue Mountains receives

1060
01:21:48,259 --> 01:21:52,619
for information on the July 17th, 2026 correspondence from Gary

1061
01:21:52,720 --> 01:21:56,779
Tile. Resident regarding a reconstruction of Peel Street and that

1062
01:21:56,800 --> 01:22:00,139
Council, or sorry, and that, uh, The Peel Street North

1063
01:22:00,139 --> 01:22:03,979
Reconstruction Project has resulted in a significant increase in the

1064
01:22:04,019 --> 01:22:07,259
number of utility poles and related streetscape infrastructure compared to

1065
01:22:07,600 --> 01:22:11,019
the pre - construction condition. And that residents have expressed

1066
01:22:11,120 --> 01:22:15,019
concerns regarding the visual impact streetscape character. And overall appearance

1067
01:22:15,200 --> 01:22:19,339
of the Reconstructed Corridor and that it is important for

1068
01:22:19,600 --> 01:22:23,979
both Council and residents to understand how the final design

1069
01:22:24,240 --> 01:22:27,899
evolved, what decisions were made during the planning and implementation

1070
01:22:28,560 --> 01:22:33,099
and whether alternative approaches were considered. Therefore, council direct staff

1071
01:22:33,099 --> 01:22:36,859
to Undertake and Report back on a post project review

1072
01:22:37,040 --> 01:22:41,579
of the Peel Street North Reconstruction Project, specifically addressing, one,

1073
01:22:41,619 --> 01:22:44,379
the number and location of utility poles that existed prior

1074
01:22:44,419 --> 01:22:47,979
to Reconstruction compared to the number and location installed as

1075
01:22:48,160 --> 01:22:52,619
part of the final project. Two, the decision - making

1076
01:22:52,720 --> 01:22:56,859
process that led to the final utility and streetscape configuration,

1077
01:22:56,859 --> 01:23:01,499
including the roles of the town, utility providers, consultants, contractors,

1078
01:23:01,499 --> 01:23:07,419
and regulatory agencies. Three, whether the alternative designs or utility

1079
01:23:07,440 --> 01:23:11,739
arrangements were considered to minimize the number of poles and

1080
01:23:11,920 --> 01:23:17,579
associated streetscape visual intrusion. And if so, why they were

1081
01:23:17,680 --> 01:23:22,859
not pursued. Four, any changes made during detailed design or

1082
01:23:22,899 --> 01:23:27,339
construction that resulted in additional poles being installed beyond the

1083
01:23:27,440 --> 01:23:34,539
original state. Five, opportunities for reducing pole, proliferation and improving

1084
01:23:35,120 --> 01:23:40,779
streetscape design on future road reconstruction projects. And six, recommendations

1085
01:23:40,819 --> 01:23:44,859
for council consideration to ensure future projects better balance infrastructure

1086
01:23:44,960 --> 01:23:51,079
requirements with community aesthetics, design, objectives, and resident expectations. And

1087
01:23:51,120 --> 01:23:55,419
further that Staff Report back to Council before October 6,

1088
01:23:55,459 --> 01:23:59,339
2026 with the findings of the review and any recommended

1089
01:23:59,760 --> 01:24:04,139
improvements, uh, to the town's project planning, design review and

1090
01:24:04,139 --> 01:24:09,139
utility coordination processes for reconstruction capital projects. Oh, a second

1091
01:24:09,139 --> 01:24:12,379
then. That has been moved by Councillor Porter and seconded

1092
01:24:12,379 --> 01:24:14,939
by Councillor Maxwell. First and foremost, I'm going to go

1093
01:24:14,979 --> 01:24:18,999
to, um, director, or sorry, not director, CEO Smith, The

1094
01:24:18,999 --> 01:24:22,699
timeline, uh, that is something that can be worked with.

1095
01:24:22,699 --> 01:24:27,922
That's what jumps out to me first. Yeah. Through the

1096
01:24:27,922 --> 01:24:30,182
chair, I believe we do have a committee, The Whole

1097
01:24:30,443 --> 01:24:34,702
that precedes on, is on the October 6th date, so

1098
01:24:34,702 --> 01:24:36,182
which I think we should be able to have sufficient

1099
01:24:36,363 --> 01:24:39,542
time to bring that report back. But I'll talk to

1100
01:24:40,123 --> 01:24:42,582
following this meeting speak to the project team on that,

1101
01:24:42,582 --> 01:24:45,382
uh, on that, uh, on the timeline. Okay. Thank you

1102
01:24:45,422 --> 01:24:49,573
for Meek. You're not clear. Councillor Porter, go ahead. Yes.

1103
01:24:49,573 --> 01:24:51,333
I am through the chair of two things I want

1104
01:24:51,333 --> 01:24:54,097
to say. It can be on or before. I'm willing

1105
01:24:54,137 --> 01:24:57,377
to extend it to October 6th. If it comes then,

1106
01:24:57,417 --> 01:25:00,337
that's fine. Cause that's a cow. Second of all, through

1107
01:25:00,337 --> 01:25:02,577
the chair, I'd like to build on what pouncer hopes

1108
01:25:02,598 --> 01:25:06,813
it. The funding for the cottage streets project was in

1109
01:25:06,813 --> 01:25:10,173
the 2025 budget. I did follow up with several times

1110
01:25:10,213 --> 01:25:16,013
with the former Director of Operations. And so it's coming

1111
01:25:16,034 --> 01:25:20,533
up because it was discussed before the 2025 budget. So

1112
01:25:21,394 --> 01:25:26,013
I think, and I realised that there has been change.

1113
01:25:26,013 --> 01:25:31,936
But before that, there had been a year. And this

1114
01:25:31,976 --> 01:25:34,656
is kind of, um, it's quite important. There was an

1115
01:25:34,677 --> 01:25:38,656
allocation of funny. It wasn't a budgeting concern. Um, I

1116
01:25:38,677 --> 01:25:41,856
know they've had conversations with them. And they are an

1117
01:25:41,896 --> 01:25:44,976
engineering firm paradigm that did them in Southampton that just

1118
01:25:44,976 --> 01:25:47,456
seemed to have a different point of view. Um, and

1119
01:25:48,037 --> 01:25:52,016
in Southampton has many similar characteristics to us in the

1120
01:25:52,056 --> 01:25:56,656
sense of street layout. They have, um, similar or smaller

1121
01:25:56,677 --> 01:26:00,736
right away. Their cottages get, you typically get demolished bigger

1122
01:26:00,736 --> 01:26:05,616
homes built. Um, but they really maintained and kept that.

1123
01:26:05,616 --> 01:26:09,056
And so I would like to see that wrapped up

1124
01:26:09,077 --> 01:26:11,776
sooner than later because it's been something that's been hanging

1125
01:26:11,877 --> 01:26:17,856
there. Um, and could benefit, um, reconstruction projects. Thank you.

1126
01:26:18,837 --> 01:26:21,826
Ciosmith, do you have a response to that? Yeah. Through

1127
01:26:21,826 --> 01:26:24,226
the chair, as I mentioned previously, we are, we are

1128
01:26:24,226 --> 01:26:27,746
committed to working through that project and getting that going

1129
01:26:27,786 --> 01:26:33,965
this year. Thank you. Councillor Maxwell. Go ahead. Thank you,

1130
01:26:34,005 --> 01:26:38,445
Chair. And thank you, Councillor Porter, for this. What I

1131
01:26:38,445 --> 01:26:42,925
was going to build on, uh, Mr. Campbell's, uh, comment

1132
01:26:43,026 --> 01:26:48,445
that, um, the utilities job is to sell their product.

1133
01:26:49,550 --> 01:26:54,609
Now I'm just wondering when they're selling their product, do

1134
01:26:54,609 --> 01:26:56,969
they also offer the fact that you can maybe have

1135
01:26:57,070 --> 01:27:00,489
underground or you can have poles. Cause I know when

1136
01:27:00,489 --> 01:27:04,009
the private world, I can have an underground service or

1137
01:27:04,009 --> 01:27:06,970
I can have a poles. So I'm just wondering if

1138
01:27:07,071 --> 01:27:11,050
that option was ever brought up to the public and

1139
01:27:11,090 --> 01:27:16,522
two council for us to consider as an option. For,

1140
01:27:16,522 --> 01:27:22,828
uh, Peel Street. Or even bastard. Mr. Campbell, I'm sorry.

1141
01:27:22,828 --> 01:27:25,708
Okay, Mr. Councillor Maxwell, Mr. Campbell, uh, do you care

1142
01:27:25,748 --> 01:27:28,088
to comment on that? I'm sure it's wildly expensive, but

1143
01:27:28,449 --> 01:27:31,430
go ahead wherever you went. You've disappeared for my screen.

1144
01:27:41,383 --> 01:27:44,392
Uh. Mr. Campbell, you're having, uh, there you are. I

1145
01:27:44,432 --> 01:27:54,163
think you're muted. Sorry. Uh, chair had turned things off.

1146
01:27:54,163 --> 01:28:00,218
Um, we. Just did The Last Council. There was a

1147
01:28:00,218 --> 01:28:03,578
question came up in the last Council about, um, hardening

1148
01:28:03,679 --> 01:28:09,098
the town's infrastructure by burying existing, um, hydro and communication

1149
01:28:09,119 --> 01:28:13,018
lines. Uh, and we looked at that at, uh, for

1150
01:28:13,199 --> 01:28:18,938
Tharnberry West phase one. And the, uh, it's, it's something

1151
01:28:18,978 --> 01:28:22,458
on the order of, it was more than a million

1152
01:28:22,498 --> 01:28:27,454
dollars per kilometer to bury a hydro system. And there's,

1153
01:28:27,494 --> 01:28:29,774
if there's things that come out of that as well,

1154
01:28:29,814 --> 01:28:33,134
you've got houses that are going to have to rework

1155
01:28:33,174 --> 01:28:36,574
their electrical systems because now they're having a buried service

1156
01:28:36,595 --> 01:28:40,094
rather than overhead service. So it gets pretty complicated and

1157
01:28:40,134 --> 01:28:44,494
it was at that time it was, um, basically we

1158
01:28:44,534 --> 01:28:48,894
looked into it really expensive to do. And they said,

1159
01:28:48,894 --> 01:28:51,774
thanks. I don't think we can add millions of dollars

1160
01:28:52,035 --> 01:28:56,894
to our capital reconstruction projects. So specifically looking at the

1161
01:28:57,155 --> 01:29:01,054
question was never asked on Peel Street, but it would

1162
01:29:01,094 --> 01:29:05,534
cost to put things underground. That wasn't, that never came

1163
01:29:05,534 --> 01:29:09,728
up. Because we'd just been through the exercise with Thornberry

1164
01:29:09,728 --> 01:29:13,888
West. And it was, it's just impractical to consider that.

1165
01:29:13,888 --> 01:29:18,048
So to answer the question, was it was putting the

1166
01:29:18,088 --> 01:29:22,448
infrastructure, the utility infrastructure underground appeal street. That was never

1167
01:29:22,469 --> 01:29:28,978
specifically done. Councillor Maxwell. Thank you, Mr. Campbell. Yeah, no,

1168
01:29:28,978 --> 01:29:31,938
I appreciate that. Uh, Mr. Campbell, uh, but I do

1169
01:29:31,959 --> 01:29:37,693
believe it should be an option. To, for Council to

1170
01:29:37,714 --> 01:29:41,533
consider. And the Public, that's all. It shouldn't be just

1171
01:29:41,573 --> 01:29:44,548
flat bang. That's the way it is. I do, I

1172
01:29:44,588 --> 01:29:47,908
would like to see it presented to the Public and

1173
01:29:47,948 --> 01:29:54,044
to a Council. Thank you. Okay. Thank you Councillor Maxwell.

1174
01:29:54,044 --> 01:29:56,604
Uh, Deputy Mayor Barneau, go ahead. Uh, thank you. Um,

1175
01:29:56,785 --> 01:29:59,564
through the chair. And as we kicked off this conversation,

1176
01:29:59,564 --> 01:30:03,244
I was talking about coordination with utility and then taking

1177
01:30:03,265 --> 01:30:06,364
a look at, uh, different standards. Um, you know, we've

1178
01:30:06,404 --> 01:30:09,084
talked about cottage roads and things like that. Um, I've

1179
01:30:09,124 --> 01:30:11,324
read the guidelines over the past few years from soggy

1180
01:30:11,345 --> 01:30:14,844
inshores, uh, where that's governed. In this case, the project

1181
01:30:14,945 --> 01:30:18,604
scope changed. We did a seven metre, um, asphalt roadway.

1182
01:30:18,604 --> 01:30:22,924
Cottage roads are 3. 3 each side to 3. 5,

1183
01:30:22,924 --> 01:30:25,724
which is, you know, 6. 6 to seven. So we're

1184
01:30:25,745 --> 01:30:29,724
almost within the cottage road. As much as, um, I

1185
01:30:29,724 --> 01:30:33,484
think the issue is on the utility side of this,

1186
01:30:33,484 --> 01:30:36,604
the extra polls we had to have for street lighting,

1187
01:30:36,604 --> 01:30:39,404
uh, for hydros. So I think that coordination can go

1188
01:30:39,404 --> 01:30:42,104
a little bit further. Um, but we had to, you

1189
01:30:42,104 --> 01:30:45,484
know, adapt Georgia Trail parking in this. Um, many of

1190
01:30:45,484 --> 01:30:48,924
the residents were worried about the safety. So remember we

1191
01:30:48,924 --> 01:30:51,724
had to reprofile the peak of the road. So the

1192
01:30:51,724 --> 01:30:54,844
lot that went into this, this design, all that being

1193
01:30:54,865 --> 01:30:57,604
said, if we can coordinate better with the utilities, I

1194
01:30:57,604 --> 01:31:01,084
think is key factor. And that is, that is buried

1195
01:31:01,084 --> 01:31:04,604
within the, um, within the Carter George guidelines from Soggy

1196
01:31:04,604 --> 01:31:07,404
Insures is a utility tie in. Cause I think if

1197
01:31:07,444 --> 01:31:10,124
there wouldn't have been that many hydro poles, overall we

1198
01:31:10,385 --> 01:31:12,764
did delay this project almost year and the Public Consultation

1199
01:31:13,345 --> 01:31:15,804
was huge. And we tried to fit in everything that

1200
01:31:15,804 --> 01:31:18,924
the Public wanted hence the seven metre road, the two

1201
01:31:18,924 --> 01:31:20,924
point, you know, we looked at the malt, looked at

1202
01:31:20,964 --> 01:31:22,284
multi - use trails at the time. We looked at

1203
01:31:22,305 --> 01:31:25,644
the street lighting standards. Um, reprofiling the peak. And then

1204
01:31:25,644 --> 01:31:28,484
restoration of, um, disturbed areas when there had to be

1205
01:31:28,484 --> 01:31:31,004
some brush cutting. So a lot of those things have

1206
01:31:31,044 --> 01:31:33,564
been addressed. But at the end of the day, are

1207
01:31:33,604 --> 01:31:36,364
the residents happy. And I think the utility side of

1208
01:31:36,364 --> 01:31:39,164
it, which is less at our control, but maybe a

1209
01:31:39,164 --> 01:31:42,044
better coordination. We'll be able to, and maybe this report

1210
01:31:42,084 --> 01:31:44,204
will be able to show us as we move forward

1211
01:31:44,225 --> 01:31:47,804
in the future. Um, if we take something that's going

1212
01:31:47,804 --> 01:31:50,044
to be an urban standard, but is there a mod

1213
01:31:50,545 --> 01:31:53,084
in that section? So I think the CAO committed to

1214
01:31:53,084 --> 01:31:56,684
that with his new director of Ops comes on board

1215
01:31:56,945 --> 01:31:59,884
and we can look in each project as a silo

1216
01:32:00,065 --> 01:32:03,564
as opposed to, um, just, just as a blanket brush.

1217
01:32:03,564 --> 01:32:05,324
So I'd be able to support the motion because I

1218
01:32:05,324 --> 01:32:10,647
think it will, um, reflect forward for next projects. Okay.

1219
01:32:10,647 --> 01:32:13,047
Thank you, Mr. Deputy Mayor. All right. We have had

1220
01:32:13,047 --> 01:32:16,407
a Folsom discussion on that. Let's Staff wanted to respond.

1221
01:32:16,407 --> 01:32:20,247
I'm not seeing any indication. We're going to, uh, call

1222
01:32:20,247 --> 01:32:22,967
that boat, please, Madam Deputy Clerk. The vote is open.

1223
01:32:26,191 --> 01:32:27,770
For me. Thank you, Councillor Maxwell.

1224
01:32:38,182 --> 01:32:43,485
That boat is closed. That vote is carried with, uh,

1225
01:32:44,486 --> 01:32:49,565
Councillor Hope, Councillor Maxwell, myself, Councillor Porter, Deputy Murgnon, and

1226
01:32:49,606 --> 01:32:54,785
Councillor Ardell voting affirmative and Adam Mayer Matrosofts voting in

1227
01:32:54,966 --> 01:32:59,173
the negative. Now we'll move on to item B 4

1228
01:32:59,834 --> 01:33:04,113
points. Uh, sorry. B 3. 4. Acting recording secretary, the

1229
01:33:04,113 --> 01:33:07,973
Blue Mountains OPP Detachment Board regarding solutions of support traffic

1230
01:33:07,994 --> 01:33:11,413
calming and speed mitigation techniques. If you have any questions

1231
01:33:11,914 --> 01:33:18,718
regarding this piece of correspondence. Deputy Mayor, please go ahead.

1232
01:33:18,899 --> 01:33:21,198
Uh, thank you very quickly. This is an easy one.

1233
01:33:21,238 --> 01:33:24,638
Just with the, um, removal of photo radar. They're just,

1234
01:33:24,638 --> 01:33:27,998
uh, from what I've gathered, we're looking for additional funding,

1235
01:33:27,998 --> 01:33:30,238
um, different misspellers, look at additional funding from the province

1236
01:33:30,419 --> 01:33:33,358
to help with other mitigation measures. So I think it's

1237
01:33:33,358 --> 01:33:36,958
just a matter of letter of support on this. And

1238
01:33:36,998 --> 01:33:39,198
then, um, if that's what council's will is. So when

1239
01:33:39,238 --> 01:33:41,678
you're ready to move, I'd move that we support this,

1240
01:33:41,678 --> 01:33:45,198
uh, recommendation. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Jeff. A second. Seconded

1241
01:33:45,238 --> 01:33:50,387
by Council Reporter. Thank you. Councillor Maxwell. Go ahead. Oh,

1242
01:33:50,387 --> 01:33:53,347
thank you, Chair. I was just kind of wondering what

1243
01:33:53,528 --> 01:33:56,947
counts are L1 does to do with this. But anyway,

1244
01:33:56,947 --> 01:34:00,867
so anyway, um, so I was reading the correspondence, North

1245
01:34:00,888 --> 01:34:07,427
Granville and Merrickville are pretty similar to our little town

1246
01:34:07,467 --> 01:34:10,787
here. So, um, I can see what they're thinking about

1247
01:34:11,128 --> 01:34:14,227
for tourism and speeding and all those kinds of things.

1248
01:34:14,227 --> 01:34:20,859
So I support this. Okay. Now Councillor Adele, I didn't

1249
01:34:20,859 --> 01:34:22,859
see if your hand went on. I saw The Mayor's

1250
01:34:22,859 --> 01:34:25,019
hand go up. So I'll put her and I do

1251
01:34:25,059 --> 01:34:27,819
sit on the board. So, um, I'll let The Mayor

1252
01:34:27,819 --> 01:34:29,579
go first and then I can go second. Thank you.

1253
01:34:30,160 --> 01:34:33,430
Madam Mayor, please go ahead. Thank you. Through you the

1254
01:34:33,430 --> 01:34:36,310
chair. Yes. Um, Councillor Dela and I, uh, you know,

1255
01:34:36,811 --> 01:34:39,190
had good reflection and thought and discussion and move these

1256
01:34:39,230 --> 01:34:42,150
motions because, uh, what it's trying to do here is

1257
01:34:42,571 --> 01:34:45,010
the province has said, okay, we get those of you

1258
01:34:45,010 --> 01:34:47,070
that were using photo radar. You need some sort of

1259
01:34:47,371 --> 01:34:51,270
financial compensation to do some other things. This ass that's

1260
01:34:51,270 --> 01:34:54,390
come through the OPP boards, but also is being reflected

1261
01:34:54,731 --> 01:34:59,590
in support from the appropriate municipalities those two municipalities that

1262
01:34:59,611 --> 01:35:03,510
form that detachment Board have simply said, look, it makes

1263
01:35:03,531 --> 01:35:06,390
sense then that those of us who don't use photo

1264
01:35:06,430 --> 01:35:09,190
rate are also have access to funds to be able

1265
01:35:09,190 --> 01:35:15,030
to improve safety and speed reduction program. So that is

1266
01:35:15,030 --> 01:35:17,670
the simple asset. It's done in fairness that just because

1267
01:35:17,670 --> 01:35:20,310
we didn't have photo radar. We'd still like to be

1268
01:35:20,350 --> 01:35:22,390
able to have an opportunity to be able to pursue

1269
01:35:22,390 --> 01:35:24,630
that. And I'd like to pass it to my colleague

1270
01:35:24,651 --> 01:35:28,870
on the detachment Board Councillor Adele. Thank you Madam Mayor

1271
01:35:28,910 --> 01:35:31,510
Councillor Ardell. Go ahead. Thank you Mr. Chair. And yes,

1272
01:35:31,510 --> 01:35:34,710
I agree with everything. Madam Mayor has said. We thought

1273
01:35:34,731 --> 01:35:38,390
this would be better circulated through our council and see

1274
01:35:38,430 --> 01:35:41,910
if we could get support for this. So, um, yes,

1275
01:35:41,910 --> 01:35:44,150
I was hoping that I could move this, but that's

1276
01:35:44,331 --> 01:35:47,270
fine. It doesn't matter. It's been moved in duly seconded.

1277
01:35:47,270 --> 01:35:49,996
So we will discontinue on. Thank you very much. Okay.

1278
01:35:51,303 --> 01:35:55,522
Thank you, Councillor Ardell. So the motion is that count

1279
01:35:55,522 --> 01:35:59,602
move by the Deputy Mayor and seconded by Council Reporter.

1280
01:35:59,602 --> 01:36:02,162
That council, the Talboy Mountains received for information that July

1281
01:36:02,263 --> 01:36:06,082
18th, 2026 correspondence from the Acting Recording Secretary of the

1282
01:36:06,082 --> 01:36:10,482
Blue Mountains OPP Detachment Board regarding resolutions of support, traffic

1283
01:36:10,503 --> 01:36:14,162
calming and speed mitigation techniques. And that Council supports the

1284
01:36:14,162 --> 01:36:18,962
recommended resolutions of support traffic calming and speed mitigation techniques.

1285
01:36:18,962 --> 01:36:21,367
Any further questions on the motion on the floor. Seeing

1286
01:36:21,388 --> 01:36:25,691
none. Madam Deputy Clerk, please call that hope. Is open.

1287
01:36:37,158 --> 01:36:40,831
Councillor Porter, my I assist. I voted affirmative. Thank you.

1288
01:36:40,831 --> 01:36:45,035
Thank you. That mot is post. A vote is carried

1289
01:36:45,075 --> 01:36:47,995
with all present voting in the affirmative. Now we will

1290
01:36:47,995 --> 01:36:51,195
go on to item B 4. Sorry. Yeah. Yeah. B4.

1291
01:36:51,216 --> 01:36:57,195
1. Block 29 register plan 16m - 14 deeming bylaw

1292
01:36:57,376 --> 01:37:03,252
recommendation OPS. 26. 046. Mr. Campbell, I believe you brought

1293
01:37:03,292 --> 01:37:07,201
this report forward or is Mr. CAO taking it. Mr.

1294
01:37:07,302 --> 01:37:15,511
Campbell. Uh, yes. 3U Mr. Chair. It's a fairly the

1295
01:37:15,511 --> 01:37:22,071
report's fairly simple. We sold Glock 29 to 189 Peel

1296
01:37:22,071 --> 01:37:25,991
Street. Uh, their entrance wasn't going to work. So this

1297
01:37:25,991 --> 01:37:34,804
was, uh, this is discussed in multiple Staff Reports. Are

1298
01:37:34,844 --> 01:37:37,584
there any questions that, uh, Council has on the, uh,

1299
01:37:37,625 --> 01:37:41,345
on the report. I will pose that for you, uh,

1300
01:37:41,466 --> 01:37:45,105
Mr. Campbell. We have a Councillor Maxwell. You have your

1301
01:37:45,105 --> 01:37:48,645
hand up. Go ahead. Not really a question. It's kind

1302
01:37:48,645 --> 01:37:51,365
of a bit of a request, I guess. Um, Mr.

1303
01:37:51,405 --> 01:37:54,805
Campbell, could you put a map up there on the,

1304
01:37:54,805 --> 01:37:58,325
uh, board forest. So the Public and C where this

1305
01:37:58,325 --> 01:38:01,744
is. Just, I know we know, but perhaps they don't

1306
01:38:01,784 --> 01:38:05,744
know. I don't believe it's part of the source materials.

1307
01:38:05,744 --> 01:38:15,628
And Mr. Campbell is remote. Yeah. I can't. So. I'm

1308
01:38:15,668 --> 01:38:18,188
sorry, I can't, I can't pull anything up for you.

1309
01:38:19,975 --> 01:38:24,664
Okay. Okay. Then we know. Thank you. Any further questions

1310
01:38:25,245 --> 01:38:30,924
regarding this report. All right. Well, we have a recommended

1311
01:38:30,945 --> 01:38:34,924
motion that Council receive Staff Report OPS dot 26. 046

1312
01:38:35,105 --> 01:38:40,044
entitled block 29 register plan 16M dash 14 deeming bylaw

1313
01:38:40,084 --> 01:38:43,564
recommendation. And that Council and Act, a deeming bylaw pursuant

1314
01:38:43,564 --> 01:38:48,444
to section 50 bracket 4 end bracket of the planning

1315
01:38:48,465 --> 01:38:52,444
act to deem block 29 registered plan 16m - 14

1316
01:38:53,505 --> 01:38:55,804
as not being a registered block within a plan of

1317
01:38:55,844 --> 01:38:59,205
subdivision. Do I have a mover? So moved. It's moved

1318
01:38:59,205 --> 01:39:02,485
by Councillor Ardell, seconder. I will second. Second by Madam

1319
01:39:02,485 --> 01:39:05,535
Mayor. I don't see any further hands. Madam Deputy Clerk,

1320
01:39:05,535 --> 01:39:07,615
you may call that boat, please. The vote is open.

1321
01:39:20,164 --> 01:39:23,034
That boat. Is closed. That vote is carry with all

1322
01:39:23,215 --> 01:39:25,514
President voting in the affirmative. We'll now move on to

1323
01:39:25,535 --> 01:39:28,874
item B 4. 2, drinking water analysis for PFAS or

1324
01:39:28,895 --> 01:39:38,281
PFAS PFAS OPS dot 26. 034 manager Kershaw. I will

1325
01:39:38,281 --> 01:39:43,354
give you the floor. Go ahead. Drew, you Mr. Chair.

1326
01:39:43,354 --> 01:39:46,854
So the town undertook some PFOS testing in July, uh,

1327
01:39:47,215 --> 01:39:51,114
which, we tested both the treated and the raw water

1328
01:39:51,535 --> 01:39:57,754
coming into our treatment plant. So just bear with me,

1329
01:39:57,754 --> 01:40:06,282
sorry. Health Canada currently has a drinking water objective. So

1330
01:40:06,282 --> 01:40:10,402
it's not a limit. It's an objective for PFOS of

1331
01:40:11,143 --> 01:40:15,122
30 micrograms per litre. So that's parts per trillion based

1332
01:40:15,122 --> 01:40:20,322
on the sum of 25 specific people PFOS compounds to

1333
01:40:20,362 --> 01:40:23,682
be detected in drinking water. Uh, this is not the

1334
01:40:23,722 --> 01:40:27,522
objective is not a regulatory limit. However, it's a benchmark

1335
01:40:27,562 --> 01:40:31,602
for drinking water systems. We found that through basically through

1336
01:40:31,703 --> 01:40:36,402
both samples, most of the compounds were below the method

1337
01:40:36,442 --> 01:40:39,922
detection limit. So we, uh, have no way they're below

1338
01:40:39,962 --> 01:40:43,426
that they can actually analyse for. Uh, we had a

1339
01:40:43,426 --> 01:40:47,266
total sum of about two parts per trillion of, of

1340
01:40:47,527 --> 01:40:51,586
the identified 25 elements. Our compounds. If you have any

1341
01:40:51,607 --> 01:40:54,306
questions, please let me know about this testing. Okay. Thank

1342
01:40:54,306 --> 01:40:57,266
you manager Kershaw. Any questions to, manage your Kershaw for

1343
01:40:57,367 --> 01:41:02,849
this report. Councillor Hope, go ahead. Yes. Thank you. Thank

1344
01:41:02,889 --> 01:41:08,129
you for performing the test. Um, I think we want

1345
01:41:08,129 --> 01:41:10,289
to be clear, like based on what the report is

1346
01:41:10,289 --> 01:41:15,649
saying that under financial impacts, um, the concern here and

1347
01:41:15,649 --> 01:41:19,089
the reason for asking for the PFAS, uh, has to

1348
01:41:19,089 --> 01:41:22,769
do with the fact that there is the Mephritank range,

1349
01:41:22,769 --> 01:41:26,529
which is just north of us. And the work going

1350
01:41:26,569 --> 01:41:29,249
on there. And we know that it's one of Canada's

1351
01:41:29,289 --> 01:41:32,449
most contaminated sites. So that's why we're checking for the

1352
01:41:32,550 --> 01:41:37,169
drinking water, or sorry, looking for PFAS, which basically is

1353
01:41:37,270 --> 01:41:42,929
often a byproduct always a byproduct from a military training

1354
01:41:42,929 --> 01:41:47,249
unit. And it's, you know, the forever chemicals. They're very,

1355
01:41:47,289 --> 01:41:50,769
very dangerous. So the fact that there's been an increase,

1356
01:41:50,769 --> 01:41:54,849
I'm surprised that we now have two. And I don't

1357
01:41:54,849 --> 01:42:01,729
know which ones they are, um, that are above the

1358
01:42:01,910 --> 01:42:05,009
parts per trillion. So I'll ask for a clarification in

1359
01:42:05,009 --> 01:42:07,649
a minute about that. I see you shaking ed. That's

1360
01:42:07,689 --> 01:42:11,169
what I'd understood. That there's so, it seems to be

1361
01:42:11,209 --> 01:42:14,689
an increase. Um, but as I said, that's my, one

1362
01:42:14,729 --> 01:42:17,569
of my questions. Um, okay. Well, why don't we get

1363
01:42:17,590 --> 01:42:20,889
into that? Manage your Kershaw. Would you clarify that? I

1364
01:42:20,889 --> 01:42:24,529
heard two parts per trillion. Two parts per trillion. There's

1365
01:42:24,569 --> 01:42:29,889
no really significant increase. There's, you're at the method detection

1366
01:42:29,990 --> 01:42:34,209
limit. That's as low as you can test. So it's

1367
01:42:34,209 --> 01:42:37,169
the same about the same as from the previous analysis

1368
01:42:37,190 --> 01:42:41,969
that we did. So the health Canada objective is a

1369
01:42:42,009 --> 01:42:46,449
total of 30 parts per trillion. And we're seeing about

1370
01:42:47,110 --> 01:42:52,209
two for the total sum of the 25 compounds and

1371
01:42:52,209 --> 01:42:55,801
only two of those compounds. We were able to test

1372
01:42:56,222 --> 01:42:59,721
because they were above the method detection limit. So the

1373
01:42:59,761 --> 01:43:02,361
method detection limit is as low as you can go.

1374
01:43:02,361 --> 01:43:06,921
It's not, it's below 30. It's that's, that's the science

1375
01:43:07,262 --> 01:43:10,601
that's available today to be able to analyse for that

1376
01:43:10,702 --> 01:43:18,393
particular compound. We're very, very low. Really low. It's so

1377
01:43:18,414 --> 01:43:20,873
low. It barely registers is what you're saying. It doesn't

1378
01:43:21,054 --> 01:43:23,632
for most of the compounds. It didn't register. That's right.

1379
01:43:23,893 --> 01:43:28,912
Right. Uh, and that was, thank you. Uh, but there

1380
01:43:28,952 --> 01:43:31,392
is a trend because the last time when we had

1381
01:43:31,392 --> 01:43:40,033
it done, it was even lower is my point. You

1382
01:43:40,033 --> 01:43:43,713
know, it seems to be that there's been an uptick.

1383
01:43:43,713 --> 01:43:45,953
And I guess that's my question. I'm not a scientist.

1384
01:43:45,953 --> 01:43:48,193
I don't pretend to be. But at the same time,

1385
01:43:48,193 --> 01:43:51,153
I'm very worried about a drinking water. And councillors are

1386
01:43:51,153 --> 01:43:56,273
responsible for drinking water. Personally, responsible. So, uh, you know,

1387
01:43:56,294 --> 01:43:59,153
this is not a concern to be blown off. This

1388
01:43:59,254 --> 01:44:04,033
is, you know, this is PFSAs. They're PFAs are forever

1389
01:44:04,073 --> 01:44:07,753
chemicals. We are located. We're located. And we want to

1390
01:44:07,753 --> 01:44:11,038
watch very carefully. No matter what the cost is. For

1391
01:44:11,038 --> 01:44:13,998
the testing. We want to be watching for any trends,

1392
01:44:13,998 --> 01:44:17,438
especially since the boring holes being done right now by

1393
01:44:17,478 --> 01:44:19,758
TCE. So we don't know what the impact is on

1394
01:44:19,798 --> 01:44:23,518
the water. So as I understand it from the report

1395
01:44:23,518 --> 01:44:25,198
that we did the year before, which I would have

1396
01:44:25,198 --> 01:44:27,678
been great to have had a comparison then for those

1397
01:44:27,678 --> 01:44:30,238
of us that don't have the knowledge. If you think

1398
01:44:30,278 --> 01:44:33,078
that it's the same as it was before, then I

1399
01:44:33,078 --> 01:44:36,205
think that's what needed to be said. So is it

1400
01:44:36,306 --> 01:44:39,845
the same. Or is there an increase from what I

1401
01:44:39,885 --> 01:44:44,312
read? Councillor Hope. To you, Mr. Chair. No, there has

1402
01:44:44,352 --> 01:44:49,381
been no significant increase. No. Okay. Which wish it had

1403
01:44:49,381 --> 01:44:54,020
said that. Secondly, because we're reading this is not, not

1404
01:44:54,020 --> 01:44:58,180
easy. The second thing that concerns me about this report

1405
01:44:58,281 --> 01:45:01,900
is under financial impacts, which is on page three, in

1406
01:45:01,900 --> 01:45:06,820
which is written PFA's analysis and drinking water does not

1407
01:45:06,820 --> 01:45:09,620
have a direct financial impact. However, if this becomes a

1408
01:45:09,641 --> 01:45:12,580
regulated compound for a drinking water system, there will be

1409
01:45:12,620 --> 01:45:15,780
financial impact due to the high cost of analysis. So

1410
01:45:16,601 --> 01:45:19,520
when we have discussed the cost of analysis in the

1411
01:45:19,520 --> 01:45:22,820
past, it was my understanding. It was 1400 dollars in

1412
01:45:22,860 --> 01:45:26,731
total. Could you please confirm that that is the case?

1413
01:45:26,832 --> 01:45:29,131
Managed Kershaw. Through you, Mr. Chair, the cost of this

1414
01:45:29,171 --> 01:45:33,531
analysis was 1039 dollars for both samples. So if we

1415
01:45:34,032 --> 01:45:36,091
were going to test this regularly, we'll have to increase

1416
01:45:36,432 --> 01:45:44,321
our water testing budget. Oh, budget. I mean, I just,

1417
01:45:45,302 --> 01:45:47,521
what can be more important right now than to be

1418
01:45:47,561 --> 01:45:51,121
checking for forever chemicals in our drinking water. And to

1419
01:45:51,121 --> 01:45:54,561
call this, uh, that this should get in our way,

1420
01:45:54,561 --> 01:45:58,521
the high cost of analysis, Councillor Hope, I'm going to

1421
01:45:58,742 --> 01:46:01,601
just jump in here and say that, uh, there's no

1422
01:46:01,622 --> 01:46:05,441
indication that we're not checking it. We are checking it.

1423
01:46:05,441 --> 01:46:09,041
We're mandatory. All right. Counter, manager, crucial. S misunderstood what

1424
01:46:09,081 --> 01:46:11,161
I said. The chair is misunderstood. What I said. I

1425
01:46:11,161 --> 01:46:14,081
am talking about that, that it's been put forward that

1426
01:46:14,582 --> 01:46:17,521
it's a high cost of analysis. So should there be

1427
01:46:17,542 --> 01:46:20,641
future analysis? So what, what that sentence is doing is

1428
01:46:20,822 --> 01:46:26,401
discouraging future, uh, requests for, for PFA analysis because of

1429
01:46:26,742 --> 01:46:29,521
quote, the high cost of analysis. Councillor. So I find

1430
01:46:29,542 --> 01:46:33,521
it, I find it, uh, getting close to misleading. Thank

1431
01:46:33,521 --> 01:46:37,480
you. Thank you for clarifying your question. Okay. I'm going

1432
01:46:37,480 --> 01:46:40,760
to say that first and second manager Kershaw. I'm sure

1433
01:46:40,781 --> 01:46:44,040
what this means is that it is raising the budget

1434
01:46:44,221 --> 01:46:48,120
for what we normally allot for for testing. That's what

1435
01:46:48,381 --> 01:46:51,400
the financial impact sessions for. Please go ahead. So this

1436
01:46:51,501 --> 01:46:55,800
test is, is higher priced significantly higher priced than our

1437
01:46:55,840 --> 01:46:58,520
average run of the mill testing E. coli total coliform

1438
01:46:58,541 --> 01:47:04,200
heavy metals organics. It is higher. There will be an

1439
01:47:04,240 --> 01:47:09,060
impact and we will increase as per the direction, uh,

1440
01:47:09,421 --> 01:47:12,040
previously in the year to test this when we do

1441
01:47:12,040 --> 01:47:15,880
our yearly samples. We will increase our budget for testing.

1442
01:47:15,880 --> 01:47:19,160
Every line item in our budget is mapped out. We've

1443
01:47:19,200 --> 01:47:22,200
done essentially a zero base budgeting and we, we know

1444
01:47:22,200 --> 01:47:25,640
what the cost of our sampling is. It's a broken

1445
01:47:27,661 --> 01:47:30,280
GL code. And we'll be raising it to cover the

1446
01:47:30,301 --> 01:47:33,850
cost of this. So far. So what does that sound

1447
01:47:33,871 --> 01:47:35,850
punitive? I mean, really what we want to do here

1448
01:47:36,031 --> 01:47:39,130
is to protect our drinking water from a very obvious

1449
01:47:39,151 --> 01:47:43,530
situation. So on a, on a budget as large as

1450
01:47:43,570 --> 01:47:46,890
the water budget, fine. It's a thousand dollars a year.

1451
01:47:46,911 --> 01:47:49,290
I want to be very clear. We're not talking about

1452
01:47:49,391 --> 01:47:52,010
every month or every day. So we're talking about a

1453
01:47:52,050 --> 01:47:54,970
thousand dollars. And so to, to position it as a

1454
01:47:55,010 --> 01:47:58,890
high cost of analysis, certainly against the risk is something

1455
01:47:58,930 --> 01:48:03,370
that I find concerning. And I'll, um, and, um, that's

1456
01:48:03,391 --> 01:48:06,490
fine. Let's put it into the budget for next year

1457
01:48:07,311 --> 01:48:11,850
then. And I hope that that is clearly made as

1458
01:48:11,850 --> 01:48:14,490
a line item so that we're all clear that testing

1459
01:48:14,530 --> 01:48:17,450
for PFSA in future is going to be a line

1460
01:48:17,490 --> 01:48:19,610
item in the budget of a thousand dollars Thank you.

1461
01:48:20,271 --> 01:48:24,902
CEO Smith. Through the chair. Just a couple pieces. I

1462
01:48:24,902 --> 01:48:27,582
think one as it relates to obligations under the safe

1463
01:48:27,683 --> 01:48:30,622
drinking water act. I know that even as staff too

1464
01:48:30,662 --> 01:48:34,622
that we also have a fiduciary responsibility as it pertains

1465
01:48:34,662 --> 01:48:37,182
to protecting the health and safety of our, of our

1466
01:48:37,222 --> 01:48:40,542
water supply. So what are reinforced even on annual basis

1467
01:48:40,963 --> 01:48:43,262
from a top management meeting. We do have those discussions

1468
01:48:43,763 --> 01:48:46,942
are where the emergent risks as relays to water supply

1469
01:48:46,963 --> 01:48:50,222
and talk about any type of mitigation measures that do

1470
01:48:50,222 --> 01:48:52,222
need to take place. I think to the point around

1471
01:48:52,723 --> 01:48:55,622
the, once the staff of recommended is that based on

1472
01:48:55,622 --> 01:48:58,862
the testing to date based on the, uh, the, the,

1473
01:48:58,862 --> 01:49:02,222
uh, mandatory requirements from the ministry health as well is

1474
01:49:02,262 --> 01:49:05,262
to say that, you know, we don't necessarily recommend that

1475
01:49:05,523 --> 01:49:07,502
testing, but to the point of the cost is to

1476
01:49:07,502 --> 01:49:09,662
say depends on how the, the extent to which we're

1477
01:49:09,662 --> 01:49:11,302
going to be doing this testing. If it's going to

1478
01:49:11,603 --> 01:49:13,982
be something that we're doing on a monthly basis versus

1479
01:49:14,003 --> 01:49:17,022
something that's more of an annual test. But the results

1480
01:49:17,123 --> 01:49:19,902
today have not given those flags to say from a

1481
01:49:19,923 --> 01:49:23,822
particularly from, you know, from my perspective is to indicate

1482
01:49:23,862 --> 01:49:26,062
that no, no, we do need to test it on,

1483
01:49:26,062 --> 01:49:27,502
say a monthly basis. And that's where we get into

1484
01:49:27,523 --> 01:49:29,902
the, to the costs, right? Is to say each test

1485
01:49:30,163 --> 01:49:33,182
relative to our other testing that's occurred, say even at

1486
01:49:33,222 --> 01:49:36,942
that, uh, even just over a thousand dollars to get

1487
01:49:36,942 --> 01:49:39,582
that done is that cumulatively over 12 months if we're

1488
01:49:39,582 --> 01:49:42,302
doing it on monthly basis, that is more significant than

1489
01:49:42,323 --> 01:49:45,262
safest annual exercise. So Council can direct as it relates

1490
01:49:45,262 --> 01:49:49,882
to, uh, to, uh, to, uh, pursuing further testing. But

1491
01:49:50,003 --> 01:49:52,862
the cost comes into play when it comes to the,

1492
01:49:52,862 --> 01:49:55,662
uh, comes into the extent or to the, to the

1493
01:49:55,662 --> 01:49:59,014
number of tests that we want to complete. Thank you,

1494
01:49:59,014 --> 01:50:02,774
Mr. CAO. Follow up, please. You can have, yes, go

1495
01:50:02,774 --> 01:50:04,214
ahead with your follow - up. I've got to move

1496
01:50:04,214 --> 01:50:07,334
on to Councillor Max. Yes. So what we don't want

1497
01:50:07,374 --> 01:50:12,614
to see anymore is hyperbolizing a yearly request. Nothing has

1498
01:50:12,635 --> 01:50:16,834
gone to monthly at all. It's not been raised. But

1499
01:50:16,834 --> 01:50:21,174
so, by putting that forward, this high cost when it

1500
01:50:21,195 --> 01:50:24,534
hasn't been present or been requested seems to be not

1501
01:50:25,115 --> 01:50:29,334
exactly a fair reaction to a very simple yearly request

1502
01:50:29,755 --> 01:50:35,662
to have the forever chemicals tested in any waters. But

1503
01:50:35,662 --> 01:50:37,902
certainly when we're at risk because of what's going on

1504
01:50:38,243 --> 01:50:44,542
just north of us. So thank you for the explanation.

1505
01:50:44,542 --> 01:50:47,102
And I certainly look forward to, uh, to the budget

1506
01:50:47,283 --> 01:50:50,542
item. Thank you. Okay. Thank you, Councillor Hope. Unless you

1507
01:50:50,563 --> 01:50:53,262
had a response to that, CAO Smith. Go to Councillor

1508
01:50:53,302 --> 01:51:01,569
Maxwell. Thank you, Chair. And thank you.

1509
01:51:05,130 --> 01:51:09,589
Smith for that on the obligation under the safe water

1510
01:51:09,629 --> 01:51:16,034
drinking act. I'm just wondering. Where do natural recurring elements

1511
01:51:17,655 --> 01:51:21,890
and microplastics fit into this. That fall into the safe

1512
01:51:21,930 --> 01:51:27,649
water drinking act. Do we know. Manager Kershaw. Uh, they're

1513
01:51:27,689 --> 01:51:30,929
emerging contaminants. Uh, they're not regulated at this point in

1514
01:51:30,969 --> 01:51:35,329
time. We meet our regulatory requirements. We test everything that

1515
01:51:35,350 --> 01:51:39,089
is required under the safe drinking water act. Schedule 23

1516
01:51:39,110 --> 01:51:41,489
and 24 are sent out every year. Uh, we do

1517
01:51:41,830 --> 01:51:45,409
it March, April. Every year with a surface water intake,

1518
01:51:45,409 --> 01:51:48,049
we're required to test that once a year. Had we

1519
01:51:48,070 --> 01:51:50,449
been a well system. We'd be required to test it

1520
01:51:50,449 --> 01:51:53,489
every five years. But we are a surface water intake

1521
01:51:54,310 --> 01:51:59,249
and it's tested every year, uh, for scheduled 23, 24.

1522
01:51:59,249 --> 01:52:02,289
So that's your inorganics and your organics. But the merging

1523
01:52:03,510 --> 01:52:07,889
contaminants are not a requirement right now. We do address,

1524
01:52:07,889 --> 01:52:11,009
we do review the emerging contaminants and additional risks to

1525
01:52:11,049 --> 01:52:14,449
the drinking water system through our drinking water quality management

1526
01:52:14,489 --> 01:52:17,069
system. And we do a risk review every year. And

1527
01:52:17,069 --> 01:52:20,449
we look at what's coming down the pipe, what's being

1528
01:52:20,470 --> 01:52:25,409
regulated through environment Canada. But the safe drinking water act

1529
01:52:25,430 --> 01:52:28,090
does not require them at this point in time. Oh,

1530
01:52:28,090 --> 01:52:32,401
up Councillor Maxwell? No answered perfectly. Thank you. Okay. Thank

1531
01:52:32,441 --> 01:52:35,601
you. Seeing other hands. We have a recommended motion that

1532
01:52:36,022 --> 01:52:39,841
council receive Staff Report OPS dot 26. 034 - Entitled

1533
01:52:39,881 --> 01:52:46,131
Drinking Water Analysis for PFAS. Yeah. Pfas for their information.

1534
01:52:46,171 --> 01:52:48,945
Do I have a mover. I will move. Move by

1535
01:52:49,046 --> 01:52:53,745
Madam Mayor, secondary. I'll second. Second by Mr. Deputy Mayor.

1536
01:52:53,745 --> 01:52:56,305
Seeing no further hands. Madame Deputy Clerk may call that

1537
01:52:56,326 --> 01:52:58,996
vote, please. That vote is open.

1538
01:53:07,865 --> 01:53:13,661
Affirmative, please. Thank you, Councillor Porter. Not vote is closed.

1539
01:53:14,242 --> 01:53:16,861
That would have carried with all seven members voting in

1540
01:53:16,901 --> 01:53:19,501
the affirmative. We'll move on to item B 4. 3

1541
01:53:19,922 --> 01:53:26,934
2025 water and wastewater capacity report OPS 26. 033. Manage

1542
01:53:26,934 --> 01:53:30,604
your Kershaw. You have the floor. Through you, Mr. Chair.

1543
01:53:30,604 --> 01:53:33,324
So this report is a report that's required by Grey

1544
01:53:33,364 --> 01:53:38,604
County for, um, allocation for drinking water and wastewater systems.

1545
01:53:38,705 --> 01:53:41,404
It's prepared every year. And it is available. The full

1546
01:53:41,444 --> 01:53:43,964
report is on our website. And I'd like to highlight

1547
01:53:44,065 --> 01:53:47,864
a few areas. If you could go down to, uh,

1548
01:53:47,985 --> 01:53:53,057
where we talk about the water system, it's about. If

1549
01:53:53,057 --> 01:53:55,217
you just don't mind slide scrolling down.

1550
01:54:05,635 --> 01:54:07,854
Like this, actually, if you don't mind going all the

1551
01:54:07,854 --> 01:54:12,953
way down to attachment one. I believe. Oh no, I'm

1552
01:54:12,993 --> 01:54:16,414
sorry. I'm sorry we did miss it. I'm looking for

1553
01:54:16,454 --> 01:54:22,217
the big pie chart here. It's on the top of

1554
01:54:22,318 --> 01:54:28,318
page four. There we go. So our drinking water system,

1555
01:54:28,318 --> 01:54:32,558
you can see that we have 11, 000, 110 units

1556
01:54:32,739 --> 01:54:37,678
either allocated or connected to our drinking water system. There's

1557
01:54:38,019 --> 01:54:42,238
2, 800 units that are reserved and 2, 200 that

1558
01:54:42,259 --> 01:54:46,478
are available for reservation. This includes both what we can

1559
01:54:46,518 --> 01:54:49,518
produce at the water treatment plant and what we take

1560
01:54:49,558 --> 01:54:53,518
from Collingwood for maximum day of 1250 cubic metres a

1561
01:54:53,518 --> 01:54:57,669
day. We are getting a little tight on drinking water

1562
01:54:57,930 --> 01:55:01,909
capacity. If we consider that we increase the units by

1563
01:55:01,949 --> 01:55:05,229
about 200 units a year, year over year based on

1564
01:55:05,229 --> 01:55:08,869
a 10 year rolling average, that gives us, uh, about

1565
01:55:08,890 --> 01:55:12,389
10 years, eight years for comfort zone, uh, before we

1566
01:55:12,429 --> 01:55:15,829
have to be looking at an additional drinking water supply.

1567
01:55:15,829 --> 01:55:19,829
Also identified through this report is the Aerohead water booster

1568
01:55:19,829 --> 01:55:25,429
station that transfers water from the water plant to everything

1569
01:55:25,770 --> 01:55:30,549
in Craig Leith. Uh, everything east of Aerohead Road must

1570
01:55:30,589 --> 01:55:33,669
go through the arrowhead booster station with the current capacity

1571
01:55:33,690 --> 01:55:39,589
of that station. We have availability for 86 more units.

1572
01:55:39,589 --> 01:55:44,149
And that's based on everything that we know that is

1573
01:55:44,490 --> 01:55:50,049
already allocated or, or reserved, uh, that's not a lot

1574
01:55:50,049 --> 01:55:55,269
of water. It is tight. Can you actually urine wastewater?

1575
01:55:55,269 --> 01:55:58,068
Now, can you please stay on the water. Thank you.

1576
01:55:58,729 --> 01:56:01,868
Uh, I am concerned about the arrowhead booster station. It

1577
01:56:01,868 --> 01:56:07,028
is undergoing a construction. We do not anticipate that's construction

1578
01:56:07,209 --> 01:56:10,388
will be done until next year. Uh, that will take

1579
01:56:11,209 --> 01:56:14,308
the firm capacity of that station up from 68 litres

1580
01:56:14,329 --> 01:56:17,828
a second to 100 litres a second. However, our trans,

1581
01:56:17,828 --> 01:56:21,588
our transmission main cannot support the 100 litres a second

1582
01:56:21,628 --> 01:56:24,708
going into that station. The town has to look for

1583
01:56:24,809 --> 01:56:28,068
every opportunity that we can to, uh, twin our main

1584
01:56:28,249 --> 01:56:31,108
between our water plant and the east end. So every

1585
01:56:31,289 --> 01:56:34,068
reconstruction, whether it be Bay Street, which we did thread

1586
01:56:34,249 --> 01:56:38,828
in a secondary, uh, trunk main through Lakewood Drive, we

1587
01:56:38,828 --> 01:56:41,908
are proposing to thread a secondary, uh, trunk main through

1588
01:56:41,908 --> 01:56:45,108
that. We have to take every opportunity. We can to

1589
01:56:47,369 --> 01:56:52,068
incorporate secondary trunk means to the eastern end. It is

1590
01:56:52,108 --> 01:56:55,188
a challenging water system. We do know that during irrigation

1591
01:56:55,769 --> 01:56:59,188
times of year, uh, this, we're just kind of coming

1592
01:56:59,228 --> 01:57:02,148
off the shoulder of it now. Our water plant is

1593
01:57:02,169 --> 01:57:06,868
running full out. And we are struggling to keep up.

1594
01:57:06,868 --> 01:57:11,343
Our irrigation. Takes up a lot of our drinking water

1595
01:57:11,524 --> 01:57:14,463
system. We'll go from about 5, 000 cubic metres a

1596
01:57:14,463 --> 01:57:17,423
day up to almost 12, 000 cubic metres a day

1597
01:57:17,444 --> 01:57:22,197
coming out of that plant. It's a hard push. I

1598
01:57:22,197 --> 01:57:24,197
just want you to be aware that we are reaching

1599
01:57:24,298 --> 01:57:29,397
our limitations. So if you can scroll down to the

1600
01:57:29,498 --> 01:57:32,837
Thornberry Wastewater treatment, the Tarnberry wastewater treatment plant now.

1601
01:57:41,577 --> 01:57:46,884
Right there. Yep. So the design capacity for this wastewater

1602
01:57:46,884 --> 01:57:51,204
treatment plant is based on our newly expanded treatment plant.

1603
01:57:51,204 --> 01:57:53,844
Although we will not be able to fully realise this

1604
01:57:53,884 --> 01:57:57,844
capacity until we get this outfall built. The existing outfall

1605
01:57:57,844 --> 01:58:01,364
does not permit the capacity of the plant. However, I

1606
01:58:01,404 --> 01:58:04,724
did the calculations based on getting that done as it

1607
01:58:04,724 --> 01:58:09,280
will be done this year. So as you can see,

1608
01:58:09,280 --> 01:58:16,635
we're. I'm sorry, I can't read that for. About 3,

1609
01:58:16,635 --> 01:58:20,315
700 units connected or allocated to the Thornberry Wastewater Treatment

1610
01:58:20,656 --> 01:58:24,475
Plant almost 1, 500 that are reserved and 1700 that

1611
01:58:24,496 --> 01:58:27,915
are available for reservation. We have started in the design

1612
01:58:28,176 --> 01:58:31,115
work for the phase 1B expansion of the treatment plant.

1613
01:58:31,115 --> 01:58:34,475
However, we may take that design and shelf it and

1614
01:58:34,976 --> 01:58:37,835
not undergo construction at this point in time, but it's

1615
01:58:37,835 --> 01:58:40,235
good to have the design in our back pocket and

1616
01:58:40,275 --> 01:58:43,635
ready to go should there be a funding available. So

1617
01:58:43,635 --> 01:58:46,795
we are working through that design right now. Uh, some

1618
01:58:46,835 --> 01:58:49,915
of the limitations within this treatment plant right now are

1619
01:58:49,936 --> 01:58:52,935
the Meal Street Pumping Station, which is under construction. Uh,

1620
01:58:52,935 --> 01:58:56,315
we've just signed the contract and we'll be construction. We'll

1621
01:58:56,315 --> 01:58:59,190
be commencing shortly. Uh, and then we'll go down to

1622
01:58:59,230 --> 01:59:01,990
the next one is The Craig Leth Wastewater Treatment Plant.

1623
01:59:03,292 --> 01:59:08,385
Right there. This one we have lots of capacity. This

1624
01:59:08,406 --> 01:59:11,165
is a big plant. So we have about 6, 000

1625
01:59:11,165 --> 01:59:16,465
units connected or allocated 2, 500 that are reserved and

1626
01:59:16,566 --> 01:59:19,265
almost 5, 000 that are available for reservation. We're running

1627
01:59:19,286 --> 01:59:22,625
at about 42 percent capacity. One of our biggest limitations

1628
01:59:22,726 --> 01:59:25,505
for this plant is our Craig Leith Main Lift Station.

1629
01:59:25,505 --> 01:59:27,985
It is under construction right now. And we anticipate the

1630
01:59:28,086 --> 01:59:31,745
construction to be reaching substantial performance by the end of

1631
01:59:31,745 --> 01:59:35,745
the year. So, uh, in the Craig Leetheria, we're doing

1632
01:59:35,846 --> 01:59:39,745
fairly well. So in order to maximize our, either our

1633
01:59:39,846 --> 01:59:43,105
water system or our wastewater system, we need to address

1634
01:59:44,726 --> 01:59:47,505
our drinking water leaks. Our leaks within our system and

1635
01:59:47,505 --> 01:59:49,425
they can both be on the private side and on

1636
01:59:49,425 --> 01:59:53,185
the Public side. We did have a new addition to

1637
01:59:53,446 --> 01:59:58,465
staff. A water technologist who is focused on strictly leak

1638
01:59:58,465 --> 02:00:01,425
detection and I and I reduction. So inflow and infiltration

1639
02:00:01,686 --> 02:00:07,345
reduction into the wastewater treatment system collection system. We have

1640
02:00:07,446 --> 02:00:11,065
had some really good successes in the last year. We

1641
02:00:11,126 --> 02:00:14,705
have reduced our water loss by over five percent in

1642
02:00:14,705 --> 02:00:18,505
the last year. And we are seeing a reduction, a

1643
02:00:18,505 --> 02:00:21,345
small reduction in our INI. So our peaking factors are

1644
02:00:21,385 --> 02:00:25,837
reducing. In the last year. And we will continue to

1645
02:00:25,858 --> 02:00:28,957
move ahead. I do want to give a nice shout

1646
02:00:28,997 --> 02:00:31,197
out to our drinking water operators. They did find a

1647
02:00:31,197 --> 02:00:34,297
fairly significant leak in our drinking water system in the

1648
02:00:34,297 --> 02:00:38,557
last couple of months. And it's equivalent to about 500

1649
02:00:38,578 --> 02:00:40,477
cubic metres a day. So this was a really good

1650
02:00:40,658 --> 02:00:44,637
find and it has been, has been repaired. So we

1651
02:00:44,677 --> 02:00:48,157
are working towards that, but we are coming up against

1652
02:00:48,578 --> 02:00:51,597
capacity in our water system, our wastewater. We have a

1653
02:00:51,597 --> 02:00:53,677
bit of breathing room. Please let me know if you

1654
02:00:53,677 --> 02:00:56,237
have any questions about this report or if you like

1655
02:00:56,338 --> 02:00:59,757
the full actual capacity report. It is available on our

1656
02:00:59,797 --> 02:01:02,397
website, but I don't usually provide that through, through the

1657
02:01:02,437 --> 02:01:06,821
Council meeting. Thank you, manager Kershaw. Uh, we're going to

1658
02:01:06,821 --> 02:01:09,261
kick it off with Deputy Mayor. Go ahead. Thank you

1659
02:01:09,522 --> 02:01:12,141
Councillor McKinley. Yes. Chair, through you to Ms. Kershaw. Thank

1660
02:01:12,141 --> 02:01:16,941
you, Allison. More focusing on the ILI. We're looking at

1661
02:01:17,282 --> 02:01:21,101
the infrastructure leakage index. Uh, we're looking around 24 percent

1662
02:01:21,282 --> 02:01:24,221
if my math is right when we look at non

1663
02:01:24,322 --> 02:01:28,061
- revenue water versus, um, real leaks. So I see

1664
02:01:28,101 --> 02:01:31,901
a significant reduction as we move forward both in brakes

1665
02:01:32,322 --> 02:01:35,181
and in leaks detection. Do you attribute all that to

1666
02:01:36,002 --> 02:01:38,301
the, um, to the scoping we've been doing to the

1667
02:01:38,341 --> 02:01:42,621
new technologist. And will we see a trend continue to

1668
02:01:42,642 --> 02:01:46,061
get within, um, even better standards than that 24 percent.

1669
02:01:48,251 --> 02:01:50,050
Do you miss a truck go ahead. To you, Mr.

1670
02:01:50,171 --> 02:01:53,910
Chair. Actually, we've taken some pretty aggressive action in the

1671
02:01:53,950 --> 02:01:57,590
last year. Uh, we've started monitoring, uh, putting bulk metres

1672
02:01:58,811 --> 02:02:03,350
at condo development. So before we, we didn't have bulk

1673
02:02:03,390 --> 02:02:06,070
metres going into private lands where there are a number

1674
02:02:06,070 --> 02:02:13,430
of residential units. And by doing this, we've been able

1675
02:02:13,430 --> 02:02:20,870
to find some connections to irrigation systems that were not

1676
02:02:20,891 --> 02:02:26,070
being metred or build, uh, so that's a significant find

1677
02:02:26,070 --> 02:02:30,470
for us. These are challenging installations. We're digging up. We're

1678
02:02:30,470 --> 02:02:33,110
putting a big chamber in the ground and installing a

1679
02:02:33,150 --> 02:02:37,110
metre. But it's proving to be really worthwhile. And I

1680
02:02:37,211 --> 02:02:42,470
really have to thank, uh, our previous director Quinlan who

1681
02:02:44,571 --> 02:02:48,470
was instrumental and really providing as funds and the motivation

1682
02:02:48,510 --> 02:02:51,430
to really get some of this done, uh, but the

1683
02:02:51,430 --> 02:02:56,831
water team has been very aggressive. Our new position is

1684
02:02:56,852 --> 02:02:58,911
working on it. But I wouldn't say he's fully up

1685
02:02:58,911 --> 02:03:03,231
to speed in addressing all of the, uh, water loss.

1686
02:03:03,231 --> 02:03:07,311
This is what we've saw that took place over 2025.

1687
02:03:07,311 --> 02:03:10,111
And I'm hoping that we continue to see this trend

1688
02:03:10,452 --> 02:03:13,711
of at our water loss reducing because that buys his

1689
02:03:13,711 --> 02:03:17,688
capacity. And that's, that's what we need. So we do

1690
02:03:17,709 --> 02:03:21,448
continue to work hard and reconstruction of Bay Street Thornberry

1691
02:03:21,469 --> 02:03:24,808
West, all these old areas of town where the infrastructure

1692
02:03:24,909 --> 02:03:28,088
is leaking is making a big difference. It's really helping

1693
02:03:28,189 --> 02:03:32,808
us out. It's, it's really, uh, we're seeing some significant

1694
02:03:32,848 --> 02:03:38,585
improvements. Follow up Deputy Mayor. Just thank you, Mr. Chair

1695
02:03:38,686 --> 02:03:40,985
through. So do you see an opportunity to get us

1696
02:03:41,025 --> 02:03:43,705
from, cause we're in the good range to get into,

1697
02:03:43,705 --> 02:03:45,985
I think we're at 2. 5 in that range. I

1698
02:03:45,985 --> 02:03:48,585
think the benchmarking is to an under, um, to move

1699
02:03:48,625 --> 02:03:52,345
to the next category. Do you see that? Um, as

1700
02:03:52,345 --> 02:03:55,385
possible taking, you know, the mitigation measures, uh, I think

1701
02:03:55,566 --> 02:04:01,625
some of the recommended are better pressure management active leakage

1702
02:04:01,625 --> 02:04:04,825
control practices. And of course, improve network maintenance. Do you

1703
02:04:04,865 --> 02:04:07,385
see an opportunity to get to that number the next

1704
02:04:07,385 --> 02:04:14,179
year or two. Manager Kershaw. I would definitely like to

1705
02:04:14,280 --> 02:04:16,739
think that we do have the opportunity to get there.

1706
02:04:16,739 --> 02:04:20,419
We are working very hard to improve our leaked detection.

1707
02:04:21,681 --> 02:04:24,460
It is a challenging system. We do have a very,

1708
02:04:24,500 --> 02:04:28,220
very challenging system. It's long. It's linear. We have a

1709
02:04:28,220 --> 02:04:32,460
lot of estate type lots with long, uh, service connections.

1710
02:04:32,460 --> 02:04:34,300
So from the main to the house where it's not

1711
02:04:34,401 --> 02:04:39,180
metred, there's a big setback and the potential for a

1712
02:04:39,180 --> 02:04:43,580
lot of loss within, within the private lands as well.

1713
02:04:43,580 --> 02:04:46,700
Um, and we're right along a shoreline so that when

1714
02:04:46,740 --> 02:04:49,420
we do have a leak in the water system, it

1715
02:04:49,420 --> 02:04:52,220
can go away unnoticed. It just slips away into the

1716
02:04:52,241 --> 02:04:57,820
bay. Being a shale type, uh, Terra firmer, it gets

1717
02:04:57,860 --> 02:05:02,140
away quite quickly and doesn't surface. It isn't forced up

1718
02:05:02,561 --> 02:05:04,700
where we are able to identify that. But we are

1719
02:05:04,721 --> 02:05:07,660
using a lot of different technologies. We still are maintaining

1720
02:05:08,161 --> 02:05:12,040
our, our leak detection contract or contractors being out. And

1721
02:05:12,040 --> 02:05:15,500
he listens to every curb stop, every valve. And he's

1722
02:05:15,500 --> 02:05:21,260
listening for leaks. Um, and additionally, we have PVC pipes.

1723
02:05:21,260 --> 02:05:24,018
A lot of our pipes are PVC. The sound does

1724
02:05:24,018 --> 02:05:26,498
not travel with a leak as well as like a

1725
02:05:26,538 --> 02:05:30,391
ductile iron pipe. We have our challenges, but we are

1726
02:05:30,431 --> 02:05:33,549
working hard at it. Yeah. Thank you for that, especially

1727
02:05:33,549 --> 02:05:35,149
with the with the shale. It's hard to see water

1728
02:05:35,170 --> 02:05:37,549
going into water. Maybe we can look for green grass

1729
02:05:38,530 --> 02:05:40,089
on the driveways on the way in for that. But

1730
02:05:40,089 --> 02:05:41,949
no, it's been a great job from getting to the

1731
02:05:41,989 --> 02:05:43,789
number that we have been over the past few years.

1732
02:05:43,789 --> 02:05:46,795
Thank you. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Jepheni Mayor. Councillor Hope,

1733
02:05:46,795 --> 02:05:49,895
go ahead. Yes. Thank you very much through you, Mr.

1734
02:05:49,936 --> 02:05:53,675
Chair, uh, to manage your Kershaw for this really important

1735
02:05:53,696 --> 02:05:56,555
information. Because I think it's going to be guiding a

1736
02:05:56,555 --> 02:06:00,075
lot of our decisions for a long time. So we

1737
02:06:00,336 --> 02:06:03,975
want to look at this capacity very, very carefully. And

1738
02:06:04,896 --> 02:06:06,395
you'll remind it, we want to make sure we have

1739
02:06:06,416 --> 02:06:08,955
our numbers right. I'm not saying they're wrong at all.

1740
02:06:08,955 --> 02:06:10,955
We want to make sure we have our numbers right.

1741
02:06:10,995 --> 02:06:15,315
So what's drawing my eye is allocated units. Because I

1742
02:06:15,315 --> 02:06:19,755
know from a planning perspective, we're still counting in castle

1743
02:06:19,776 --> 02:06:23,675
Glenn. And I think, um, and, and, and so, so

1744
02:06:23,776 --> 02:06:26,695
we are. But I think there are certain ones. And

1745
02:06:26,695 --> 02:06:30,155
I think there was some discussion even about some carsburg

1746
02:06:30,155 --> 02:06:33,335
numbers in, but maybe I'm mistaken with budget. But, um,

1747
02:06:34,016 --> 02:06:38,635
but I'd like to understand what allocated units means and

1748
02:06:38,635 --> 02:06:42,235
to Ms. Kershaw's 200 units a year. I don't think

1749
02:06:42,256 --> 02:06:44,395
we're going to reach that this year. I don't think

1750
02:06:44,395 --> 02:06:47,115
we're going to get anywhere near 200 units. And maybe

1751
02:06:47,216 --> 02:06:50,155
if the CAO would speak to that. So if we're

1752
02:06:50,195 --> 02:06:53,115
at a hundred a year, that's going to mean we

1753
02:06:53,296 --> 02:06:56,755
can, we can build the structure later on. Of course

1754
02:06:57,376 --> 02:07:00,875
there's construction, the increase in construction costs that also is

1755
02:07:00,896 --> 02:07:03,035
a part of all of this. So the longer we

1756
02:07:03,075 --> 02:07:04,795
put it off, the more we have to pay for

1757
02:07:04,795 --> 02:07:08,155
it. But what I think the Public is looking for

1758
02:07:08,176 --> 02:07:11,355
because of what's happened in the past is a very

1759
02:07:11,376 --> 02:07:17,755
carefully structured, uh, well - supported numerically accurate decision on

1760
02:07:17,776 --> 02:07:21,955
what we actually need for particularly a water infrastructure. So

1761
02:07:22,336 --> 02:07:27,435
through you, Mr. Chair, to the CAO as, um, the

1762
02:07:27,536 --> 02:07:30,795
director of planning, at this point you're feeding the numbers

1763
02:07:31,216 --> 02:07:37,475
I gather to the water group. So allocated units. Is

1764
02:07:37,475 --> 02:07:40,635
that something that we could look at again, uh, or

1765
02:07:40,635 --> 02:07:42,395
do you feel that you've done some betting on that

1766
02:07:42,416 --> 02:07:45,675
number? Thank you. See you. Smith. Yeah. Through the chair

1767
02:07:45,696 --> 02:07:48,235
can certainly start. And then perhaps manager Kershaw can add

1768
02:07:48,275 --> 02:07:49,835
to it. So when it comes to, you know, for

1769
02:07:50,096 --> 02:07:52,475
allocation and I think that something, you know, an example

1770
02:07:52,475 --> 02:07:55,435
is a for, you know, Castle Glen whereby that's not

1771
02:07:55,696 --> 02:07:58,715
been allocated. Right. So you want, that doesn't, that, that

1772
02:07:58,736 --> 02:08:01,675
site also doesn't have reservation. And all you'll see in

1773
02:08:01,675 --> 02:08:05,115
the Folsom reports was bound within our, our official plan

1774
02:08:05,136 --> 02:08:07,595
policy is the staging that we do have. And that

1775
02:08:07,595 --> 02:08:10,955
is where there is that work and coordination between planning

1776
02:08:11,056 --> 02:08:14,155
and water wastewater to understand, you know, when we're compiling

1777
02:08:14,256 --> 02:08:17,095
this report is to note, you know, what is, uh,

1778
02:08:17,376 --> 02:08:21,595
what's, what's within this, this classification system. So, uh, we,

1779
02:08:21,635 --> 02:08:23,675
but, you know, to the, to the point is that,

1780
02:08:23,675 --> 02:08:25,835
uh, when we, we do need to look at tools

1781
02:08:26,176 --> 02:08:30,155
as it relates to, to manage that managing that allocation.

1782
02:08:30,155 --> 02:08:32,795
I do know I still have a, uh, draft allocation

1783
02:08:33,056 --> 02:08:36,355
bylaw that I'd still like to move forward as, as

1784
02:08:36,355 --> 02:08:39,195
an example of a tool to utilise, to, to support

1785
02:08:39,376 --> 02:08:42,855
some of the, uh, the constraints we do have. Uh,

1786
02:08:42,855 --> 02:08:44,635
and I would say that, you know, from these graphs

1787
02:08:44,675 --> 02:08:46,795
as well is that, you know, and something that's within

1788
02:08:46,816 --> 02:08:49,915
more of the Folsom report and maybe it's not so,

1789
02:08:49,915 --> 02:08:54,315
uh, is so apparent visually here is around the constraints

1790
02:08:54,355 --> 02:08:57,435
we have from the command side. So from magic Herschaw's

1791
02:08:57,435 --> 02:09:00,235
point around, you know, this long linear system and the

1792
02:09:00,235 --> 02:09:03,755
difficulties as it relates to, uh, having the necessary infrastructure

1793
02:09:03,776 --> 02:09:07,035
being at pumping stations or otherwise, that's where we say

1794
02:09:07,216 --> 02:09:09,435
even to say, whoa, we may have these number of

1795
02:09:09,456 --> 02:09:11,755
available units at the plant, but we may not have

1796
02:09:11,776 --> 02:09:14,715
the ability to actually get that, be it the water

1797
02:09:14,816 --> 02:09:17,915
or the sanitary through the necessary pumping stations or through

1798
02:09:17,955 --> 02:09:21,275
those pipes, uh, which creates a bit of a mercury

1799
02:09:21,376 --> 02:09:23,595
story on where we actually stand in terms of providing

1800
02:09:23,635 --> 02:09:26,195
that allocation. But when it comes to new developments, we

1801
02:09:26,256 --> 02:09:29,835
always exercise is, and this report is utilised, but it

1802
02:09:29,835 --> 02:09:32,795
needs to be taken its entirety to say that just

1803
02:09:32,816 --> 02:09:35,155
because we have space or units at the plant, we

1804
02:09:35,155 --> 02:09:37,675
do need to have that downstream analysis to say, Hey,

1805
02:09:37,675 --> 02:09:39,755
well, how is it going to get to the plant?

1806
02:09:39,755 --> 02:09:42,075
So when we look at constraints, be it, um, even

1807
02:09:42,075 --> 02:09:44,475
at the Craig Leaf wastewater plant whereby, you know, we

1808
02:09:44,475 --> 02:09:46,555
do have a report here talking about the long point

1809
02:09:46,736 --> 02:09:49,915
reconstruction and the works there. Well, the corregly plant does

1810
02:09:49,955 --> 02:09:52,715
have that available capacity. So once again, it's a challenge

1811
02:09:52,736 --> 02:09:54,955
of actually getting it there, right? And to, to relieving

1812
02:09:54,976 --> 02:09:57,195
some of those, uh, and that is certainly a major

1813
02:09:57,296 --> 02:10:00,235
area of focus in terms of our own capital program

1814
02:10:00,576 --> 02:10:02,715
is investing in that. On top of looking at things

1815
02:10:02,736 --> 02:10:06,235
such as INI, looking at ways to address irrigation as

1816
02:10:06,256 --> 02:10:10,075
another, uh, another pressure point to, to really maximize the

1817
02:10:10,096 --> 02:10:13,035
space we have and hopefully mitigate that capital program as

1818
02:10:13,035 --> 02:10:16,235
well. And as eliminated its entirety, but perhaps it allows

1819
02:10:16,275 --> 02:10:19,435
us to defer certain projects or to, uh, to look

1820
02:10:19,435 --> 02:10:20,795
at doing them in a, in a, in a different

1821
02:10:20,835 --> 02:10:24,075
way. But maybe Andrew Kershaw may want to add a

1822
02:10:24,075 --> 02:10:28,035
little bit more. Inter Kershaw. Strew you, Mr. Chair. So

1823
02:10:28,035 --> 02:10:32,395
to answer your question allocated units, they're either connected units.

1824
02:10:32,395 --> 02:10:34,475
So a unit that's already connected has water waste water

1825
02:10:34,515 --> 02:10:37,675
to the house. Can't connect. So a parcel of land

1826
02:10:37,715 --> 02:10:42,155
say you have a vacant lot services go right by

1827
02:10:42,195 --> 02:10:44,715
a house. They can connect at any time. So that,

1828
02:10:44,755 --> 02:10:50,555
that they're given allocation. So committed, um, subdivision, that they

1829
02:10:50,736 --> 02:10:53,435
have, uh, achieved basic services. They're connected to the town

1830
02:10:53,456 --> 02:10:57,338
system. They're committed. Uh, they're not turning back. So that's

1831
02:10:57,599 --> 02:11:01,798
an allocation. And then we also have another category, uh,

1832
02:11:02,079 --> 02:11:06,218
not, not fronting, not serviced, but an existing, um, building

1833
02:11:06,479 --> 02:11:09,178
lot is there. And they do have the potential to

1834
02:11:09,199 --> 02:11:14,758
connect. So that, that's what's in the allocation. So, and

1835
02:11:14,758 --> 02:11:20,858
you did mention Clarksburg prior to doing the expansion at

1836
02:11:20,858 --> 02:11:24,538
the wastewater treatment plant. The town had an agreement with,

1837
02:11:24,538 --> 02:11:28,538
uh, The County of Grey, because the county is involved

1838
02:11:28,578 --> 02:11:31,498
in the allocation when it comes to new developments that

1839
02:11:31,498 --> 02:11:36,618
we were allowed to overallocate and not include the Clarksburg

1840
02:11:37,599 --> 02:11:44,191
potential. We, we've now met that, uh, condition of the

1841
02:11:44,372 --> 02:11:47,391
expansion. So now we have to include those into our

1842
02:11:47,431 --> 02:11:50,511
numbers. So they are included when we look at the

1843
02:11:50,551 --> 02:11:53,831
water and wastewater systems that they can connect. Because we

1844
02:11:53,831 --> 02:11:57,191
have done EAs and we have considered connecting them. So

1845
02:11:57,191 --> 02:12:00,351
they are, uh, not in the allocated, but I believe

1846
02:12:00,692 --> 02:12:05,071
we do, uh, look at those numbers through the potential

1847
02:12:05,892 --> 02:12:09,484
to connect to the system. Follow us. Follow up, uh,

1848
02:12:09,484 --> 02:12:12,464
Councillor. Oh, thank you. Um, thank you to both of

1849
02:12:12,464 --> 02:12:16,064
you for, for this, um, this is looking more like

1850
02:12:16,104 --> 02:12:18,064
an art than a science in terms of trying to

1851
02:12:18,064 --> 02:12:20,864
figure this out. I mean, I personally would like to

1852
02:12:20,904 --> 02:12:26,384
see, um, where the allocated units are coming from with

1853
02:12:26,384 --> 02:12:30,304
the numbers are. And, uh, The Reserved units I gather

1854
02:12:30,344 --> 02:12:33,504
are by a certain portion that needs to be set

1855
02:12:33,504 --> 02:12:36,384
aside. So we'll leave that alone. But we have things

1856
02:12:36,405 --> 02:12:41,424
like developers who aren't necessarily going through with their commitments,

1857
02:12:41,424 --> 02:12:43,424
uh, we've got a lot of things that could be

1858
02:12:43,424 --> 02:12:46,144
happening right now that could have an impact on our

1859
02:12:46,184 --> 02:12:50,464
capacity or on our allocation. Um, so, um, I just

1860
02:12:50,504 --> 02:12:53,104
think that we need to look at this much more

1861
02:12:53,144 --> 02:12:57,344
carefully. I'm not saying you aren't. I think more information

1862
02:12:57,765 --> 02:13:01,344
available to council would be really, really important so that

1863
02:13:01,344 --> 02:13:04,384
we can make a better call because the big difference

1864
02:13:04,485 --> 02:13:07,664
between needing, uh, I think it was a planton eight

1865
02:13:07,704 --> 02:13:12,415
years or versus maybe it's 12 years. Uh, because of

1866
02:13:12,455 --> 02:13:15,775
the growth. And I'm just pulling out numbers. But that

1867
02:13:15,796 --> 02:13:19,135
from a planning perspective, the numbers and building up a

1868
02:13:19,175 --> 02:13:20,815
reserve fund and so on, it makes a big difference

1869
02:13:20,836 --> 02:13:23,295
to have that time. And I think it's time that

1870
02:13:23,295 --> 02:13:25,375
we need right now so that we can be putting

1871
02:13:25,476 --> 02:13:28,735
money aside and be in a better position. So we're

1872
02:13:28,735 --> 02:13:32,415
not borrowing, which is clearly not what the Public wants.

1873
02:13:32,415 --> 02:13:36,055
So, um, I'm just wondering through you, Mr. Chair, if

1874
02:13:36,116 --> 02:13:39,935
we could have more detail on the allocated units. Madden

1875
02:13:39,935 --> 02:13:43,135
for Kershaw for drinking waters. So thank you. All of

1876
02:13:43,135 --> 02:13:48,015
the units counts. I've worked tirelessly with our planning department.

1877
02:13:48,015 --> 02:13:50,975
Jean Postman, I have worked very closely together with her

1878
02:13:51,015 --> 02:13:56,295
GIS to determine who has allocation, who has reserved. So

1879
02:13:56,516 --> 02:13:58,975
a development that's not moving ahead, they may have reservation.

1880
02:14:00,237 --> 02:14:04,216
Until they actually get, so a development in process is

1881
02:14:04,256 --> 02:14:07,896
in the reservation category. It's not in the allocated until

1882
02:14:07,936 --> 02:14:10,136
they have basic services and they're connected and we have

1883
02:14:10,237 --> 02:14:15,418
the, uh, subdivision agreement already confirmed. Then they move into

1884
02:14:15,599 --> 02:14:18,778
allocation. The 200 units a year though, that's based on

1885
02:14:18,959 --> 02:14:21,898
a 10 year rolling average. It's hard to take year

1886
02:14:21,898 --> 02:14:24,058
over year. We had some years where we had 400

1887
02:14:24,098 --> 02:14:26,698
units connected to our drinking water system. That's why we

1888
02:14:26,738 --> 02:14:28,698
take a 10 year rolling average. We don't just look

1889
02:14:28,698 --> 02:14:31,898
at the last year or, or the last two years.

1890
02:14:31,898 --> 02:14:37,898
We look at what's coming, what has been historically increased

1891
02:14:38,319 --> 02:14:41,936
year over year. Okay. So just to final, so thank

1892
02:14:41,936 --> 02:14:45,056
you. Lots of good learning here. Um, so I see

1893
02:14:45,096 --> 02:14:48,176
the point about needing to understand what's in the reserve

1894
02:14:48,176 --> 02:14:50,416
as well. And it's very helpful to know the Clerksburg

1895
02:14:50,456 --> 02:14:55,296
units are there, which is 400, 300, 400 units or

1896
02:14:55,296 --> 02:15:00,176
more. Six. Or 600 units. And, um, so through you,

1897
02:15:00,176 --> 02:15:03,376
Mr. Chair, could we, could we have a breakdown of

1898
02:15:03,477 --> 02:15:08,896
where the allocated and the reserve units are designated so

1899
02:15:08,896 --> 02:15:13,136
that we can start to make more informed decisions about,

1900
02:15:13,136 --> 02:15:16,976
uh, what we need with costly infrastructure. Thank you. Manager

1901
02:15:17,016 --> 02:15:20,416
Kershaw. Through you, Mr. Chair, the full breakdown, it's in

1902
02:15:20,416 --> 02:15:23,616
a spreadsheet in the complete report that's posted on our

1903
02:15:23,616 --> 02:15:27,216
website. It's on the second last page. There's a, we

1904
02:15:27,237 --> 02:15:30,096
break it down by area. So it would be craig

1905
02:15:30,096 --> 02:15:36,576
leaf. Clerksburg Castle Glenn Osler rural Thornberry, Thornberry West, Camper

1906
02:15:36,677 --> 02:15:39,216
Down, I'm not sure if we break it. I don't

1907
02:15:39,256 --> 02:15:42,016
think we break it down into Laura Bay. It's just,

1908
02:15:42,016 --> 02:15:45,116
uh, Thornberry West, but they all are broken down. And

1909
02:15:45,397 --> 02:15:53,216
it's additionally broken down into connected, allocated, reserved, future lands.

1910
02:15:53,216 --> 02:15:55,296
And then the total amount that we need to service

1911
02:15:55,336 --> 02:15:59,136
the primary settlement area of the town of Blue Mountains.

1912
02:15:59,136 --> 02:16:01,216
Excellent. I look forward to going through those numbers. Thank

1913
02:16:01,256 --> 02:16:04,268
you. Okay. Thank you. CEO Smith. I did see your

1914
02:16:04,308 --> 02:16:06,508
hand or you're OK? Okay. Uh, we're going to move

1915
02:16:06,508 --> 02:16:15,322
on to Councillor Maxwell. Thank you, Chair. Okay. Question for

1916
02:16:15,362 --> 02:16:21,576
Alliston. So, you know, building on that, we're definitely in

1917
02:16:21,616 --> 02:16:25,736
a period of saving and not spending. We all know

1918
02:16:25,736 --> 02:16:32,854
that, I think. The question is, Allison, if we maximize

1919
02:16:34,315 --> 02:16:41,053
strong maintenance programs. And conservation measures, can we hold off

1920
02:16:42,194 --> 02:16:46,973
a new infrastructure in order to protect our taxpayers and

1921
02:16:46,973 --> 02:16:53,596
their citizens until the economy turns around. Andrew Crewshaw.

1922
02:16:58,678 --> 02:17:03,177
The answer is yes. It's, it's through Mr. Chair. So

1923
02:17:03,177 --> 02:17:07,037
the answer is there is a potential to reduce, uh,

1924
02:17:07,638 --> 02:17:13,377
some of the needed infrastructure needs. Um, but it would

1925
02:17:13,377 --> 02:17:17,417
be something like in the order of no irrigation, no

1926
02:17:17,417 --> 02:17:21,057
putting water on grass, no treated water going on grass.

1927
02:17:21,057 --> 02:17:23,857
The city of Vancouver has done that. You can water

1928
02:17:24,038 --> 02:17:26,577
your shrubs. You can water your flowers. You can water

1929
02:17:27,158 --> 02:17:32,097
vegetable gardens. But a hundred percent ban on irrigation of

1930
02:17:32,198 --> 02:17:35,457
treated water on grass. So there is a potential there.

1931
02:17:35,457 --> 02:17:38,337
That would really increase our capacity at our water treatment

1932
02:17:38,438 --> 02:17:44,368
plant. But it's not a pleasant, it's not a pleasant

1933
02:17:44,368 --> 02:17:47,968
outcome. I, we do have a lot of irrigation systems.

1934
02:17:47,968 --> 02:17:51,888
We have taken an aggressive approach this year to try

1935
02:17:51,888 --> 02:17:56,688
to curb the peak with our bylaw. We do find

1936
02:17:56,709 --> 02:17:59,328
that there are people that you're a gate a heck

1937
02:17:59,368 --> 02:18:03,668
of a lot. And I mean, unbelievable. In the order

1938
02:18:03,668 --> 02:18:07,408
of 42 or 48 cubic metres a day, which is

1939
02:18:07,509 --> 02:18:10,608
an enormous amount of water to be putting on grass,

1940
02:18:10,608 --> 02:18:14,528
um, so there are opportunities there. We have to remember

1941
02:18:15,269 --> 02:18:18,608
though, infrastructure such as water and wastewater has to be

1942
02:18:18,709 --> 02:18:22,448
built before houses can be built. We can't have houses

1943
02:18:22,488 --> 02:18:27,168
with portaes. We need houses that are connected have available,

1944
02:18:27,168 --> 02:18:30,768
uh, capacity at our water and wastewater systems. We can't

1945
02:18:30,869 --> 02:18:34,048
wait to enlarge a wastewater treatment plant until the sewage

1946
02:18:34,048 --> 02:18:36,768
is arriving at the door. It's too late. We're going

1947
02:18:36,768 --> 02:18:40,368
to have sewers back up in basements. We don't want

1948
02:18:40,709 --> 02:18:42,848
infrastructure that's too big. We don't want to do it

1949
02:18:42,949 --> 02:18:46,448
too far ahead of time. We want our infrastructure sized.

1950
02:18:46,448 --> 02:18:49,008
We'd like to be running in like that 60 percent

1951
02:18:49,349 --> 02:18:52,448
zone, 50, 60 percent of the capacity of the plant

1952
02:18:52,709 --> 02:18:55,168
We don't want a huge plant. They're hard to manage.

1953
02:18:55,168 --> 02:18:57,408
There's too much work. We don't want to maintain pumps

1954
02:18:57,408 --> 02:19:01,488
that we're not using. We want our infrastructure sized to

1955
02:19:01,528 --> 02:19:04,622
meet the growth in the next 10, 15 years. And

1956
02:19:04,643 --> 02:19:07,342
when we do build infrastructure, we want it built in

1957
02:19:07,382 --> 02:19:10,462
a way that it can be enlarged easily so that

1958
02:19:10,462 --> 02:19:13,662
we build platforms and pipes in pumping stations that we

1959
02:19:13,702 --> 02:19:15,582
can throw another pump in when we need to. We

1960
02:19:15,622 --> 02:19:18,142
don't have to reconstruct a wet well. We want our

1961
02:19:18,182 --> 02:19:20,862
water plant to be able to put a bigger pump

1962
02:19:20,883 --> 02:19:24,782
in, put another rack in of, uh, Paul membranes or

1963
02:19:24,803 --> 02:19:31,342
whatever membrane we end up with. But build the concrete

1964
02:19:31,363 --> 02:19:34,622
and steel to meet the 100 year mark, but build

1965
02:19:34,662 --> 02:19:39,102
the pumps and the, uh, internal capacities that have a

1966
02:19:39,123 --> 02:19:42,862
shelf life of 2025 years so that we're meeting that

1967
02:19:43,043 --> 02:19:45,982
2025 year deadline. And when the pumps are coming at

1968
02:19:46,083 --> 02:19:49,002
the end of life at that point in time, our

1969
02:19:49,002 --> 02:19:51,022
growth is keeping up that we can just replace the

1970
02:19:51,123 --> 02:19:55,441
pumps to a bigger size pump. I'll answer your question

1971
02:19:55,542 --> 02:19:57,281
Councillor Maxwell. You have a follow up. I do have

1972
02:19:57,321 --> 02:20:01,121
a follow - up. Go ahead. Okay. So thank you

1973
02:20:01,121 --> 02:20:04,248
for that answer. Okay. Cause that. Speaks to a lot

1974
02:20:04,248 --> 02:20:08,668
of things even last night. Okay. So my question is

1975
02:20:10,209 --> 02:20:18,168
though. Wood watering your lawn fall into a core service.

1976
02:20:20,269 --> 02:20:25,768
Because I know water, delivery water and wastewater. But where

1977
02:20:26,029 --> 02:20:30,556
do we want to do aesthetics here. What is the,

1978
02:20:30,556 --> 02:20:33,996
what we deliver quarter services here in this town. Where's

1979
02:20:34,036 --> 02:20:39,016
the magic line where we start saying to people, you

1980
02:20:39,016 --> 02:20:45,453
know, what is core and not core here. And I

1981
02:20:45,474 --> 02:20:48,813
shall you, Mr. Chair. I would say that, um, that's

1982
02:20:48,813 --> 02:20:51,773
a nice to have, uh, it's, it's nice to have.

1983
02:20:51,773 --> 02:20:54,173
It's not a must do. It's not an essential service

1984
02:20:54,994 --> 02:20:59,613
to have irrigation on lawns. Uh, but it's, it's a

1985
02:21:00,114 --> 02:21:02,173
something that we have provided for a number of years.

1986
02:21:02,692 --> 02:21:07,837
And it's a nice to have. All right. Councillor Maxwell.

1987
02:21:07,837 --> 02:21:10,077
Yeah. So I guess what I'm going to comment is

1988
02:21:10,818 --> 02:21:16,175
that in this new world we're entering. We may not,

1989
02:21:16,215 --> 02:21:17,615
it may not be a nice to do that we

1990
02:21:17,796 --> 02:21:21,808
can no longer provide. Through you, Mr. Chair. We do

1991
02:21:21,848 --> 02:21:26,208
have, uh, water conservation methods measures in place right now

1992
02:21:27,429 --> 02:21:31,248
for our irrigation. And we can water every other day.

1993
02:21:31,248 --> 02:21:34,368
I know, I believe it's orange field. They, they are

1994
02:21:34,368 --> 02:21:36,368
watering. I believe once a day, I could be wrong,

1995
02:21:36,368 --> 02:21:40,848
but I believe it's, so they're allowed to water one

1996
02:21:40,848 --> 02:21:44,288
day a week. That's it. Not every other day. Just

1997
02:21:44,288 --> 02:21:48,048
one day every week. So there are measures. And our

1998
02:21:48,048 --> 02:21:51,008
next level of conservation measures that are within our drinking

1999
02:21:51,029 --> 02:21:55,728
water, uh, bylaw would take us to that next level

2000
02:21:56,149 --> 02:22:00,349
so that we could water once, once a week. Okay.

2001
02:22:00,370 --> 02:22:03,309
Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. I don't see any

2002
02:22:03,349 --> 02:22:06,029
further hands. We have a recommended motion that Council receive

2003
02:22:06,210 --> 02:22:11,389
Stafford for OPS 26. 033 entitled 2025 Water and Wastewater

2004
02:22:11,429 --> 02:22:15,229
Capacity Report for their information. Do I have a mover?

2005
02:22:15,490 --> 02:22:18,669
I will move. Move by the mayor. I'll second. Second

2006
02:22:18,690 --> 02:22:22,933
by, uh, Councillor Ardell. I see no further hands. Madam

2007
02:22:22,954 --> 02:22:25,413
Deputy Clerk, you may call that boat, please. The vote

2008
02:22:25,413 --> 02:22:25,653
is open.

2009
02:22:46,022 --> 02:22:47,761
No vote is closed. That vote is carried with all

2010
02:22:48,262 --> 02:22:51,615
seven members present voting in the affirmative. Now we'll move

2011
02:22:51,615 --> 02:22:56,335
on to item B4. 4 Craiglith Wastewater Treatment Plant upgrades.

2012
02:22:59,076 --> 02:23:05,592
035. Manage your Kershaw. You have the floor. Through you,

2013
02:23:05,592 --> 02:23:07,912
Mr. Chair. So the town has received the 30 percent

2014
02:23:08,333 --> 02:23:12,552
design packages and the 30 percent design cost estimates for

2015
02:23:12,592 --> 02:23:15,992
the long, uh, for the upgrades to the Craig Leith

2016
02:23:16,032 --> 02:23:19,832
Wastewater treatment plant. And those upgrades include seven scopes of

2017
02:23:19,872 --> 02:23:22,912
work. Uh, the linear works on long point road, of

2018
02:23:22,912 --> 02:23:26,472
which I've already provided Council with the 30 percent design

2019
02:23:26,493 --> 02:23:29,832
estimate. The construction of a lift station at the Craig

2020
02:23:29,832 --> 02:23:33,352
Lethways Water Treatment Plant. Construction of Accepted to receiving station

2021
02:23:33,392 --> 02:23:36,392
at the Craig Leth Wastewater Treatment Plant, screening and grip

2022
02:23:36,392 --> 02:23:40,072
removal at the, at the plant replacement of the existing

2023
02:23:40,173 --> 02:23:43,432
motor control centre. So the MCCs at the Treatment Plant

2024
02:23:44,253 --> 02:23:47,512
and replacing an upsizing of the backup generator as well

2025
02:23:47,512 --> 02:23:50,512
as replacing the existing blowers at the treatment plant. So

2026
02:23:50,512 --> 02:23:55,400
if you scroll down to the bottom of page. I'm

2027
02:23:55,440 --> 02:24:04,525
not sure. Three. We have the breakdown. As you can

2028
02:24:04,525 --> 02:24:07,665
see, some costs went up a lot more went up.

2029
02:24:07,665 --> 02:24:10,531
Some came down. So the linear works as you were

2030
02:24:10,571 --> 02:24:13,971
aware. It had gone up almost 17 percent went up

2031
02:24:14,072 --> 02:24:19,891
51 percent. The septage receiving station almost 80 percent. The

2032
02:24:19,912 --> 02:24:26,251
screening and grit removal 18 percent The motor control. It

2033
02:24:26,251 --> 02:24:29,091
went down almost 70 percent The backup generator went down

2034
02:24:35,832 --> 02:24:39,811
the estimate had increased about 20 percent design

2035
02:24:45,992 --> 02:24:50,771
What we're dealing with and our consultants also reviewed other

2036
02:24:50,952 --> 02:24:55,651
estimates that were coming in for similar type work and

2037
02:24:55,672 --> 02:24:59,251
seeing what the market would bear If you have any

2038
02:24:59,352 --> 02:25:03,251
questions, please direct them towards me Thank you manager crusha

2039
02:25:03,352 --> 02:25:04,851
CEO Smith. I'm going to toss it over to you

2040
02:25:05,032 --> 02:25:12,756
if you had any further comments. Now through the chair

2041
02:25:13,097 --> 02:25:14,916
I just leave it to council if there's any questions

2042
02:25:15,177 --> 02:25:17,316
and comments in between manage your Kershaw and I happy

2043
02:25:17,316 --> 02:25:19,796
to address them Thank you all right. Thank you CEO

2044
02:25:19,817 --> 02:25:26,453
Smith Councillor Ardell you have the floor. Thank you Mr.

2045
02:25:26,474 --> 02:25:30,293
Chair and if we could scroll back down to page

2046
02:25:30,634 --> 02:25:36,871
three. And four. If you add up all of the

2047
02:25:37,052 --> 02:25:41,191
figures I get a different figure than 42 million I

2048
02:25:41,292 --> 02:25:49,321
get 45 million. Is there an error there or what

2049
02:25:49,422 --> 02:25:55,574
is that Major Kershaw is having a technical issue. Oh

2050
02:25:55,995 --> 02:26:01,598
your mics are out. There you go.

2051
02:26:09,355 --> 02:26:12,608
Uh Through you Mr. Chair. Actually that is a there

2052
02:26:12,648 --> 02:26:14,608
is near and there when I put those numbers in

2053
02:26:14,869 --> 02:26:18,987
they included The engineering. So that that's why they increase

2054
02:26:19,808 --> 02:26:22,507
and the next column is just the construction costs That

2055
02:26:22,528 --> 02:26:25,627
was my ear I'm sorry There was a lot of

2056
02:26:25,808 --> 02:26:29,547
staff reports going through in a short time So it's

2057
02:26:29,547 --> 02:26:34,427
45 million then The next column is 30 percent design

2058
02:26:36,368 --> 02:26:40,187
50 million is The construction cost Just the construction cost

2059
02:26:40,368 --> 02:26:43,067
We've already paid we've already got committed funds for the

2060
02:26:43,067 --> 02:26:47,227
engineering and that's right through Uh The end of warranty

2061
02:26:47,267 --> 02:26:50,747
for the engineering So what is our end figure then

2062
02:26:50,787 --> 02:26:55,387
for increase or decreases Then it'd be different at 19.

2063
02:26:55,488 --> 02:26:58,907
5 now Well actually the 42 million is the construction

2064
02:26:59,248 --> 02:27:03,467
cost Oh okay the 42 million does not include engineering

2065
02:27:03,888 --> 02:27:08,507
The engineering was added in the individual line items So

2066
02:27:08,547 --> 02:27:12,432
it is it's roughly a 20 percent increase. So 23

2067
02:27:12,453 --> 02:27:17,174
cent increase. Okay so it's not decreasing its increasing Okay.

2068
02:27:18,667 --> 02:27:21,366
On the total of the seven scopes of work Yes.

2069
02:27:22,310 --> 02:27:25,800
Okay thank you. Do you have a follow - up

2070
02:27:26,021 --> 02:27:29,600
Councillor Eidell I'm not right now I'll let other people

2071
02:27:30,261 --> 02:27:33,760
I'm just still doing figures here Thank you Yep No

2072
02:27:33,800 --> 02:27:37,120
problem I can come back to you Uh Councillor Porter

2073
02:27:37,160 --> 02:27:41,119
go ahead. Yes thank you and through the chair and

2074
02:27:41,159 --> 02:27:44,399
thank you Ms. Kershaw because I actually did the motion

2075
02:27:45,060 --> 02:27:49,671
That resulted in this report. Because I had concerns about

2076
02:27:50,092 --> 02:27:55,407
long point. Um, back then. Um. I have some questions

2077
02:27:55,668 --> 02:28:01,007
Because I've gone back and I'm missing one page on

2078
02:28:01,007 --> 02:28:02,927
the report that I had printed out What I'm going

2079
02:28:02,927 --> 02:28:07,228
to go and find it here. Yes it's page five.

2080
02:28:11,476 --> 02:28:16,147
When it talks about the wastewater. Existing units It actually

2081
02:28:16,328 --> 02:28:20,707
states here that this The concrete and steel constructed to

2082
02:28:20,747 --> 02:28:24,707
support The full build out of sewers of the sewer

2083
02:28:24,808 --> 02:28:32,770
washed. Approximately 5500 units. Whereas I'm just going to go

2084
02:28:32,770 --> 02:28:39,633
through all my concerns here So whereas. In one of

2085
02:28:39,633 --> 02:28:43,313
the grant applications It talks about the full build out

2086
02:28:43,313 --> 02:28:47,921
of the Craig Leaf Sewer shed. Would account for 17,

2087
02:28:49,142 --> 02:28:57,419
380. In another spot It counts that the full build

2088
02:28:57,459 --> 02:29:00,619
out of the Craig Neeth wastewater surface area is 14,

2089
02:29:00,960 --> 02:29:10,795
016. And I realised it says here that. So

2090
02:29:11,536 --> 02:29:16,075
The first number here, the 17, 380 came from The

2091
02:29:16,336 --> 02:29:24,019
Water and Wastewater Capacity Assessment 2022 year report. And one

2092
02:29:24,019 --> 02:29:32,019
of the grant applications was around The Hughes. Was full

2093
02:29:32,059 --> 02:29:37,219
build - out of Craig Leth Wastewater Services 14, 116,

2094
02:29:37,219 --> 02:29:41,699
and that there was already 5, 518 existing equivalent units

2095
02:29:41,739 --> 02:29:47,306
currently connected. And then Mill Street Pumping Station within the

2096
02:29:47,487 --> 02:29:50,266
Hughes had said about The full build - out Down

2097
02:29:50,306 --> 02:29:56,289
of Blue Mountains. Um... Relating to Mill Street was 9,

2098
02:29:56,289 --> 02:30:01,160
100 units. When you even talk about The 14, not

2099
02:30:01,201 --> 02:30:04,860
the 17 I mean we're getting up to 24, 025,

2100
02:30:04,900 --> 02:30:06,460
000 units And I don't think we have that many

2101
02:30:07,361 --> 02:30:10,380
So if I go back to page 5 I want

2102
02:30:10,380 --> 02:30:13,900
to know what the sewer watershed is Sewershed is that

2103
02:30:13,940 --> 02:30:18,540
Sony's supporting 5, 481 units in the long - term

2104
02:30:18,641 --> 02:30:20,220
and what long - term is in terms of years.

2105
02:30:21,972 --> 02:30:26,890
Major Khrushchev. So you're talking about some different sewer sheds

2106
02:30:27,311 --> 02:30:30,890
Uh... When we talk about The Craig Let's Wastewater Treatment

2107
02:30:30,991 --> 02:30:33,130
Plant Sewer Shed We're including what's Coming in through The

2108
02:30:33,311 --> 02:30:37,130
Craig Leth Wastewater Craiglyth Maine Lift Station and The Long

2109
02:30:37,151 --> 02:30:42,250
Point Road Lift Station So the two separate entities Uh...

2110
02:30:42,751 --> 02:30:45,770
So the long point road Sewer Shed Uh... Of which

2111
02:30:45,871 --> 02:30:49,690
we're talking about The 5, 000 5, 500 will include

2112
02:30:50,671 --> 02:30:55,290
Um... Windfall Uh... Coming down Grey Road 21 I believe

2113
02:30:55,391 --> 02:31:01,128
some of Second Nature goes through there. Uh... And anything

2114
02:31:01,168 --> 02:31:05,368
that we develop beyond Uh The Intersection of Grey Road

2115
02:31:05,368 --> 02:31:09,368
19 and 21 were Tease Pleases are the previous T's

2116
02:31:09,469 --> 02:31:12,888
please So that will include Castle Glen It will also

2117
02:31:13,069 --> 02:31:18,408
include Some servicing that we will be providing Uh... To

2118
02:31:19,069 --> 02:31:23,848
Clearview Township We are looking at providing services Additionally to

2119
02:31:24,029 --> 02:31:28,909
Clearview and a little tiny bit of Collingwood Um. Well

2120
02:31:29,090 --> 02:31:32,944
when we're building this. Because... We may as well If

2121
02:31:32,944 --> 02:31:35,264
we're building a pipe And we have the capacity at

2122
02:31:35,264 --> 02:31:38,303
the plant Why not take their revenues. Like they're gonna

2123
02:31:38,303 --> 02:31:41,263
have to pay for part of The cost of constructing

2124
02:31:41,284 --> 02:31:44,463
everything that we're constructing When we talk about The Craig

2125
02:31:44,564 --> 02:31:49,823
Leth... Wastewater Treatment Plants Sewershed We also include Everything That

2126
02:31:49,863 --> 02:31:52,303
comes in through Craig Leaf Main Lift Station Which would

2127
02:31:52,303 --> 02:31:54,463
be The Village at Blue And each one of those

2128
02:31:54,884 --> 02:31:58,783
Hotel Units is equivalent to the residential unit So when

2129
02:31:59,124 --> 02:32:02,223
we start talking about 24, 000 units That's not out

2130
02:32:02,263 --> 02:32:05,263
of line Of what we anticipate in our full build

2131
02:32:05,364 --> 02:32:10,782
- out. We review these every year through our wastewater

2132
02:32:10,822 --> 02:32:16,462
capacity Assessment Report The report that just Uh... Our previous

2133
02:32:16,502 --> 02:32:20,622
report That went to Council Uh... We look at every

2134
02:32:20,643 --> 02:32:25,902
development lands and what potentially can be serviced in these

2135
02:32:26,003 --> 02:32:32,668
lands We look at... The area of the land And

2136
02:32:32,668 --> 02:32:37,788
we minus... The hazard lands that are on the lands.

2137
02:32:39,716 --> 02:32:42,495
And then we look at what is buildable... What is

2138
02:32:42,535 --> 02:32:46,735
a buildable area? And what is our Town density? Whether

2139
02:32:46,735 --> 02:32:48,735
or not a developer comes in and builds to The

2140
02:32:48,916 --> 02:32:54,095
full density That's what changes That's Where our numbers are...

2141
02:32:54,116 --> 02:32:57,455
They're not concrete Because not every builder builds to the

2142
02:32:57,495 --> 02:33:01,055
maximum potential density But that's what we design our systems

2143
02:33:01,076 --> 02:33:06,575
for So between 2022 and 2026 or 2025 There have

2144
02:33:06,575 --> 02:33:08,895
been some developments that were built That did not build

2145
02:33:08,996 --> 02:33:12,575
to the full density But we allowed for that density

2146
02:33:13,236 --> 02:33:17,295
through these studies And when we're building infrastructure But once

2147
02:33:17,316 --> 02:33:19,775
it's built And we know what The density is That's

2148
02:33:19,775 --> 02:33:22,185
when the numbers start to change. Follow - up So

2149
02:33:22,206 --> 02:33:24,905
yes Because I will... I have more than a follow

2150
02:33:24,945 --> 02:33:27,385
- up Because I wanted to know what long -

2151
02:33:27,385 --> 02:33:31,305
term meant in terms of timing Because I didn't get

2152
02:33:32,366 --> 02:33:36,025
it Because I guess I would like... I think that

2153
02:33:36,065 --> 02:33:38,905
was on page 8 I wanted to know What does

2154
02:33:38,945 --> 02:33:42,855
long - term mean. Mensch Crucial Go ahead In terms

2155
02:33:42,855 --> 02:33:45,895
of years Like you have a series of You know

2156
02:33:46,636 --> 02:33:49,415
short Medium whatever What do they mean in going out

2157
02:33:50,156 --> 02:33:52,135
You never know if you're - 10 20 And then

2158
02:33:52,135 --> 02:33:55,495
full build out of a primary Settlement area So I

2159
02:33:55,495 --> 02:33:58,375
guess the question for me And I do have a

2160
02:33:58,375 --> 02:34:00,215
motion I would like to put forward I'll just make

2161
02:34:00,215 --> 02:34:04,159
that noted Okay Thank you. Because I have real concerns

2162
02:34:04,199 --> 02:34:07,012
about this. I have more concerns than when I made

2163
02:34:07,052 --> 02:34:11,811
The original motion. How far out are we building. How

2164
02:34:11,912 --> 02:34:14,531
far out are we building And we know building is

2165
02:34:15,352 --> 02:34:20,770
flat. A lot of builders say nothing's gonna happen We're

2166
02:34:20,810 --> 02:34:23,970
in more uncertainty as of 1159 on Friday night than

2167
02:34:23,991 --> 02:34:30,162
we've been in before. And The user fees come when

2168
02:34:30,183 --> 02:34:33,202
it's done The development charges come when the houses are

2169
02:34:33,242 --> 02:34:36,802
bailed In the meantime And I see from another chart

2170
02:34:36,823 --> 02:34:41,682
here All the annual debt payment Which amounts to over

2171
02:34:42,903 --> 02:34:47,959
3700, 000. A rough estimate is for every 200... That's

2172
02:34:47,999 --> 02:34:51,583
the annual servicing debt charge. If you have to pay

2173
02:34:51,844 --> 02:34:53,903
And if I'm wrong someone can correct me as I

2174
02:34:53,903 --> 02:34:58,309
go along. Approximately just short of a quarter of a

2175
02:34:58,309 --> 02:35:02,807
million raises the tax levy by one percent. You're well

2176
02:35:02,807 --> 02:35:05,127
in the double digits of attacks increase Just for this

2177
02:35:05,148 --> 02:35:09,527
project And the hug's dead in there that I don't

2178
02:35:09,527 --> 02:35:13,753
understand. And it's not about And the chart says The

2179
02:35:13,793 --> 02:35:16,652
Town can have all the capacity in the world. To

2180
02:35:17,873 --> 02:35:22,837
take debt on. It's The people in this room The

2181
02:35:22,837 --> 02:35:24,997
people sitting around the table Anyone that lives in the

2182
02:35:25,098 --> 02:35:29,679
Bloom Mountains are owns property It's 0 affordability. To service

2183
02:35:29,679 --> 02:35:33,519
that debt There's very different questions That the Town's ability

2184
02:35:33,620 --> 02:35:37,519
to have an amount of debt They get the line

2185
02:35:37,559 --> 02:35:39,759
of credit Whatever you want to call it That's their

2186
02:35:39,860 --> 02:35:43,459
financial measure. People fund in the bill The taxpayer They

2187
02:35:43,480 --> 02:35:48,348
have what's called an affordability measure. And what I'm calculating

2188
02:35:48,609 --> 02:35:51,628
when I look at that amount of debt Divided by

2189
02:35:52,289 --> 02:35:56,515
is I'm hitting like 15 16 percent. So I'd like

2190
02:35:56,515 --> 02:36:01,075
that clarified Because I wanted to know what the contingency

2191
02:36:01,115 --> 02:36:05,720
was And there's some verbiage around that. Debt is also

2192
02:36:05,741 --> 02:36:09,385
The cost of a project. The carrying charges to service

2193
02:36:09,425 --> 02:36:12,745
the debt before it is used is in effect a

2194
02:36:12,766 --> 02:36:16,808
cost. When you build a house The financing is a

2195
02:36:16,848 --> 02:36:19,156
cost. Because you have to pay and you don't really

2196
02:36:19,156 --> 02:36:21,396
get a lot forward Except for that you have cash

2197
02:36:21,436 --> 02:36:26,916
flow So I'm extremely concerned about And I don't understand

2198
02:36:27,977 --> 02:36:30,276
all the different numbers that have gone in the different

2199
02:36:30,297 --> 02:36:35,925
application forms. They because the variety of them And just

2200
02:36:36,186 --> 02:36:39,205
and by and saying this is in the long point

2201
02:36:39,386 --> 02:36:42,325
Watershed Where we only know the numbers for the Quith

2202
02:36:42,365 --> 02:36:44,325
Water Shad I think we need a lot more detail

2203
02:36:44,365 --> 02:36:46,885
to know what we're doing And when it comes down

2204
02:36:46,986 --> 02:36:50,165
to the other component of the motion So I'd like

2205
02:36:50,165 --> 02:36:54,105
the numbers Um... That we have. Reconciled So we know

2206
02:36:54,145 --> 02:36:56,345
the numbers we're working at Like how many houses are

2207
02:36:56,345 --> 02:36:59,156
currently serviced? How many are going to get built. And

2208
02:36:59,337 --> 02:37:02,676
when they're going to get built Because I'm not sure

2209
02:37:02,697 --> 02:37:06,836
if the community wants to bankroll Infrastructure for 20 years

2210
02:37:06,937 --> 02:37:10,644
out. That's a really good question I think And it's

2211
02:37:10,684 --> 02:37:16,212
a difficult question. Because I know you're Alison. You can't

2212
02:37:17,033 --> 02:37:21,644
manufacture sewer capacity on demand. So there has to be

2213
02:37:21,745 --> 02:37:24,604
some give and take But that's subject to some conversation

2214
02:37:25,345 --> 02:37:28,204
The other thing is the value engineering And I think

2215
02:37:28,625 --> 02:37:33,644
there is... Staff appear to be willing to consider phase

2216
02:37:33,684 --> 02:37:37,004
in. I think value engineering exercises needs to consider that

2217
02:37:37,665 --> 02:37:39,724
What do we do to build now and what do

2218
02:37:39,724 --> 02:37:42,524
we need to do to build later? Because they're very

2219
02:37:42,564 --> 02:37:46,444
different Because the debt cost you put that annual debt

2220
02:37:46,465 --> 02:37:48,524
cost on a tax levy is permanent for the length

2221
02:37:48,545 --> 02:37:50,844
of the whatever mortgage you want to call it It

2222
02:37:50,884 --> 02:37:53,723
doesn't go away. And it detracts some other things people

2223
02:37:53,824 --> 02:37:56,043
might want to have in the town It's serious money.

2224
02:37:56,555 --> 02:37:58,934
So and I'd like to do that And I want

2225
02:37:58,934 --> 02:38:02,732
to know what the cost is going to be. Going

2226
02:38:02,753 --> 02:38:06,892
out Like you say The engineering costs have been covered

2227
02:38:06,993 --> 02:38:10,892
for the project Is that money that's already earmarked on

2228
02:38:10,932 --> 02:38:13,572
a reserve Or is this money that is going to

2229
02:38:13,572 --> 02:38:15,932
have to be funded by future debt? I don't know.

2230
02:38:16,846 --> 02:38:19,625
But I have real problems with this And I cannot

2231
02:38:19,665 --> 02:38:22,185
just receive this I have emotion I want to put

2232
02:38:22,185 --> 02:38:25,065
it forward It can go for Council of Discussion But

2233
02:38:25,086 --> 02:38:29,225
this is really a high stakes financial discussion Okay in

2234
02:38:29,225 --> 02:38:31,465
my mind Excuse me Thank you council supporter I've heard

2235
02:38:31,486 --> 02:38:34,905
your question We need to let manage your Kershaw answer

2236
02:38:34,926 --> 02:38:38,825
some of the questions that you've put into your statement

2237
02:38:38,865 --> 02:38:41,545
there So we're going to do that first and foremost.

2238
02:38:42,681 --> 02:38:46,521
Andrew Kershaw Please go ahead. Three you Mr. Chair I'm

2239
02:38:46,521 --> 02:38:48,121
sorry You're going to have to bear with me I

2240
02:38:48,121 --> 02:38:50,521
can't remember all the questions Honestly I was trying to

2241
02:38:50,561 --> 02:38:52,521
write them down But I'm doing the best I can

2242
02:38:53,022 --> 02:38:56,441
So the engineering costs included in I believe in the

2243
02:38:56,481 --> 02:39:01,001
2023 2024 budget It was approved We're spending that This

2244
02:39:01,001 --> 02:39:03,241
is how we got these estimates This is how we

2245
02:39:03,281 --> 02:39:06,681
got to 30 percent design The money is has been

2246
02:39:07,982 --> 02:39:12,121
It's in a BVR It's locked away So that The

2247
02:39:12,161 --> 02:39:18,228
engineering is covered Number one. Bear with me I understand

2248
02:39:18,329 --> 02:39:22,788
The costs are crazy We when we build When we

2249
02:39:22,788 --> 02:39:25,668
build a Wet will say When we're building a sewage

2250
02:39:25,689 --> 02:39:30,068
pumping station Sewage comes into a Wet well We have

2251
02:39:30,089 --> 02:39:32,228
two choices We can put pumps down in the Wet

2252
02:39:32,249 --> 02:39:35,588
Well Which is cheaper Or we can build a Wetwell

2253
02:39:35,628 --> 02:39:39,748
Drywell Where the pumps sit in a dry area We

2254
02:39:39,849 --> 02:39:41,808
get longer life out of the pumps When you get

2255
02:39:41,808 --> 02:39:46,131
to bigger pumping stations. We look at what well drywall

2256
02:39:46,232 --> 02:39:48,771
configuration But we only want to build that Wet Well

2257
02:39:48,792 --> 02:39:52,211
once We only want to build that In the ground

2258
02:39:52,251 --> 02:39:55,571
structure once So that will be built for full capacity

2259
02:39:56,152 --> 02:39:59,331
We will put pumps in there that are sized for

2260
02:39:59,331 --> 02:40:04,894
today. So that and to see that the next 15

2261
02:40:04,915 --> 02:40:10,047
years worth of growth Uh. That is a cost saving

2262
02:40:10,047 --> 02:40:12,367
measures Because as those pumps We don't want to put

2263
02:40:12,628 --> 02:40:14,527
pumps in that are going to meet the full build

2264
02:40:14,548 --> 02:40:19,167
out of the Of the shed Because by the time

2265
02:40:19,188 --> 02:40:22,127
those pumps come to the end of life We will

2266
02:40:22,308 --> 02:40:24,847
not have seen that capacity We will not have seen

2267
02:40:24,847 --> 02:40:28,367
The flows that are required So and we don't want

2268
02:40:28,367 --> 02:40:30,367
to have extra pumps there that we have to exercise

2269
02:40:30,548 --> 02:40:34,154
and maintain Just in case we get that flow. I

2270
02:40:34,194 --> 02:40:36,794
can't predict what's going to Who's going to build what

2271
02:40:36,834 --> 02:40:40,074
today or tomorrow? This isn't We are in a little

2272
02:40:40,074 --> 02:40:42,794
bit of an unusual situation The Town of Blue Mountains

2273
02:40:43,455 --> 02:40:47,114
has seen Uh, slowdowns in growth for a year or

2274
02:40:47,154 --> 02:40:49,674
two But then it picks right back up And this

2275
02:40:49,855 --> 02:40:52,714
we're in that lull right now We're definitely in that

2276
02:40:52,975 --> 02:40:56,672
lull. We're not the same We don't see the same

2277
02:40:56,933 --> 02:40:59,392
growth and the same growth patterns that they do in

2278
02:40:59,432 --> 02:41:03,772
Toronto We're a totally different dynamic And one of the

2279
02:41:03,772 --> 02:41:07,392
things that goes through my mind is that We're at

2280
02:41:07,432 --> 02:41:08,992
the stage where we're seeing a lot of the baby

2281
02:41:09,733 --> 02:41:15,712
boomers Retire and relocate here Has that wave ended or

2282
02:41:15,712 --> 02:41:17,632
will it continue? We are at the end of the

2283
02:41:17,813 --> 02:41:22,432
baby boomer retirement phase It's the next phase that our

2284
02:41:22,432 --> 02:41:25,712
retiring that is a much smaller amount of The population

2285
02:41:26,213 --> 02:41:28,832
So will we see a growth return? I don't know

2286
02:41:29,253 --> 02:41:31,712
I don't know I can only go on What I

2287
02:41:31,712 --> 02:41:35,312
know we need And based on the past 10 15

2288
02:41:35,493 --> 02:41:40,275
20 years of growth. Is the best that we have?

2289
02:41:40,696 --> 02:41:43,475
We don't have 2020 vision into the future to see

2290
02:41:43,515 --> 02:41:46,355
what's coming down the pipe We do know that infrastructure

2291
02:41:46,456 --> 02:41:49,715
projects such as these Do not happen overnight They don't

2292
02:41:49,736 --> 02:41:52,915
happen in a year There's a lot of work A

2293
02:41:52,915 --> 02:41:54,435
lot of work in these And I know the numbers

2294
02:41:54,456 --> 02:41:57,715
have gone up But that's reflective of the type of

2295
02:41:57,896 --> 02:42:00,515
engineering that we're doing We're doing a lot of background

2296
02:42:00,536 --> 02:42:09,315
information We're doing legal surveys We're doing groundwater surveys boreholes

2297
02:42:10,056 --> 02:42:12,995
to really understand What the conditions are so that we

2298
02:42:13,035 --> 02:42:16,595
can put a really good solid tender out there Uh,

2299
02:42:17,096 --> 02:42:21,955
for construction We're also very worried about tariffs And the

2300
02:42:22,056 --> 02:42:25,235
fuel prices And that's why some of these numbers seem

2301
02:42:25,496 --> 02:42:28,035
really escalated It's because of the state of the world

2302
02:42:28,216 --> 02:42:31,235
right now We're seeing huge tariffs We're seeing oil prices

2303
02:42:31,275 --> 02:42:34,515
going out through the roof There are some really serious

2304
02:42:34,776 --> 02:42:38,675
concerns about projects like this I understand what you're saying

2305
02:42:38,696 --> 02:42:41,955
about The debt load and the cost of this project

2306
02:42:43,976 --> 02:42:47,955
It's... We have to be able though to accept growth

2307
02:42:48,296 --> 02:42:54,755
If we look at our... Our mission statement Our municipal

2308
02:42:54,776 --> 02:43:00,195
strategy One of the key pillars there is to ensure

2309
02:43:00,296 --> 02:43:04,995
our infrastructure is resilient to accept growth And if we

2310
02:43:05,035 --> 02:43:07,635
don't have the foresight to look ahead and to see

2311
02:43:07,656 --> 02:43:10,835
where our limitations are We're going to be in trouble

2312
02:43:10,936 --> 02:43:13,395
We're not going to meet one of our goals is

2313
02:43:13,435 --> 02:43:18,671
to be able to accept growth. I'm sorry if I've

2314
02:43:18,692 --> 02:43:22,131
missed some of your other questions. I Just like to

2315
02:43:22,131 --> 02:43:23,571
have a follow - up Please And I know I

2316
02:43:23,611 --> 02:43:25,871
spoke because there's a lot in here There's a lot

2317
02:43:25,871 --> 02:43:28,931
of unanswered questions And thank you very much. I think

2318
02:43:29,192 --> 02:43:33,651
what I'm looking for in this is that Uhzik Klee

2319
02:43:33,672 --> 02:43:36,851
We need referring to the strategic plan It is about

2320
02:43:36,891 --> 02:43:40,211
The financial health of the town It is about making

2321
02:43:40,552 --> 02:43:44,131
evidence - based decisions We're at D - level and

2322
02:43:44,131 --> 02:43:49,000
we're over A up. Ep We got three more to

2323
02:43:49,000 --> 02:43:51,560
go I wouldn't be surprised if it's way more Even

2324
02:43:51,581 --> 02:43:55,320
with the value engineering I'm just looking at can we

2325
02:43:55,901 --> 02:43:59,400
sort of build as we grow and how you would

2326
02:43:59,440 --> 02:44:02,600
do that You talk about The Wet Well That's the

2327
02:44:02,600 --> 02:44:04,680
big infrastructure But it's how many pumps go in there

2328
02:44:04,701 --> 02:44:07,240
at the time And how many you can do. The

2329
02:44:07,240 --> 02:44:10,600
scenario But like nothing's happening right now And it is

2330
02:44:10,701 --> 02:44:14,650
The burden then falls on the taxpayer. Not the users

2331
02:44:14,690 --> 02:44:17,770
of the system The taxpayer Which is rural and urban

2332
02:44:17,951 --> 02:44:20,730
rural people don't get to turn the top on And

2333
02:44:20,911 --> 02:44:23,530
have the waist go down a waist pipe And I'm

2334
02:44:23,570 --> 02:44:26,570
just saying In the sense of the different numbers we

2335
02:44:26,671 --> 02:44:29,610
have of units When you look at the Hughes funding

2336
02:44:29,650 --> 02:44:33,610
application You look at that Uh, water application You did

2337
02:44:34,351 --> 02:44:37,130
last June And you look at The numbers here And

2338
02:44:37,231 --> 02:44:41,610
the wastewater capacity They're all different And I think we

2339
02:44:41,791 --> 02:44:45,530
need a reconciliation Like what are the numbers we're dealing

2340
02:44:45,530 --> 02:44:49,050
with and we work with them And we project it

2341
02:44:49,090 --> 02:44:52,326
out. Because that's the way it can be more evidence

2342
02:44:52,347 --> 02:44:55,286
- based And what is the cost if we move

2343
02:44:56,587 --> 02:44:59,366
So when you in that page 8 If you move

2344
02:44:59,467 --> 02:45:02,086
from a short - term to a longer - term

2345
02:45:02,086 --> 02:45:04,166
build Act What is the cost of the community to

2346
02:45:04,427 --> 02:45:07,606
bankroll? What is the cost? We don't know And yes

2347
02:45:07,707 --> 02:45:11,926
The 19 - point 1 million was a hit A

2348
02:45:11,926 --> 02:45:14,326
burn And I learned quick And I just see this

2349
02:45:14,507 --> 02:45:16,806
happening again and coming with a surprise And I'm not

2350
02:45:16,846 --> 02:45:20,326
prepared whether I sit here or I'm a taxpayer You'll

2351
02:45:20,366 --> 02:45:24,486
have me come do deputations Is the we need to

2352
02:45:24,526 --> 02:45:28,566
make informed decisions that is transparent to the public So

2353
02:45:28,606 --> 02:45:30,946
how much is each extra amount of build - out

2354
02:45:31,147 --> 02:45:34,006
gonna cost us? And why? And that's what I want

2355
02:45:34,006 --> 02:45:36,726
to see And I want to see not just value

2356
02:45:36,766 --> 02:45:39,286
engineering as a blanket I wanted to have some direction

2357
02:45:40,347 --> 02:45:43,446
And I also want to know The Public needs to

2358
02:45:43,446 --> 02:45:46,406
know And this is maybe for Chickadee for finance to

2359
02:45:46,406 --> 02:45:48,446
help you out It's how much is this going to

2360
02:45:48,446 --> 02:45:50,813
cost in debt. And how long do we get locked

2361
02:45:50,853 --> 02:45:54,341
in for the debt. And that's money that just is

2362
02:45:54,341 --> 02:45:56,421
gone And it can't be used for parks and all

2363
02:45:56,421 --> 02:45:58,930
the other. Things people want to do That's what I

2364
02:45:58,951 --> 02:46:00,770
want to see And I have it all written down.

2365
02:46:02,742 --> 02:46:06,241
Through Mentha Crushaw And then I have CAO Smith that

2366
02:46:06,281 --> 02:46:08,321
would like to speak to you So some of this

2367
02:46:08,422 --> 02:46:11,841
supports growth And some of this is asset replacement When

2368
02:46:11,881 --> 02:46:15,681
we look at the blowers The backup generator The MCCs

2369
02:46:15,942 --> 02:46:18,561
Although they're going to facilitate some of the growth They

2370
02:46:18,822 --> 02:46:20,801
all We also need those to keep that plant running

2371
02:46:20,902 --> 02:46:23,441
We need to stay in compliance We need to run

2372
02:46:23,542 --> 02:46:26,321
good wastewater treatment plants We need to protect The natural

2373
02:46:26,361 --> 02:46:30,961
environment in Public Health The MCC Sir Existing The Blowers

2374
02:46:31,462 --> 02:46:34,321
Uh... The Grit Removal The Grip Removal is really a

2375
02:46:34,342 --> 02:46:38,481
health and safety Uh... Consideration If you saw how we

2376
02:46:38,502 --> 02:46:43,121
deal with grit and Debris collection at The Wastewater Treatment

2377
02:46:43,161 --> 02:46:46,801
Plant It is not a pretty operation We have operators

2378
02:46:46,902 --> 02:46:49,681
that go out twice a day And manually Rake Off

2379
02:46:49,681 --> 02:46:54,778
screens. In all weather In the middle of winter And

2380
02:46:54,799 --> 02:46:58,778
they're up on top of these basins And not very...

2381
02:46:58,778 --> 02:47:02,858
Not a very pleasant Uh... Health Environment Health and safety

2382
02:47:02,879 --> 02:47:03,338
environment.

2383
02:47:35,831 --> 02:47:38,530
That is not good municipal planning to have a sceptage

2384
02:47:38,570 --> 02:47:42,190
receiving station in the middle of a residential area. The

2385
02:47:42,190 --> 02:47:45,170
oars and the issues that create for the residents is

2386
02:47:45,170 --> 02:47:48,130
not very pleasant. This should be at the wastewater treatment

2387
02:47:48,231 --> 02:47:53,330
plant. We're also considering, and I've had correspondence from residents

2388
02:47:53,991 --> 02:47:57,010
about constructing an RV dumping station. We do have a

2389
02:47:57,050 --> 02:48:00,770
huge tourist population that come into this town and they

2390
02:48:00,770 --> 02:48:04,730
need somewhere to unload their RVs when they're coming. So

2391
02:48:04,730 --> 02:48:11,090
we will be building that with the sceptage receiving station.

2392
02:48:11,090 --> 02:48:15,890
Additionally, we have other counties, Simco County in particular, that

2393
02:48:15,911 --> 02:48:19,250
have contacted us about delivering leachate to this wastewater treatment

2394
02:48:19,511 --> 02:48:22,690
plant. We have the capacity at this wastewater treatment plant

2395
02:48:23,751 --> 02:48:28,030
to deal with the lead sheet from Simcoe County. And

2396
02:48:28,030 --> 02:48:30,850
it's a good revenue stream. And we should be banking

2397
02:48:30,890 --> 02:48:34,130
that. The cost of the septage receiving station, we hope,

2398
02:48:34,130 --> 02:48:37,250
will be revenue, will be revenue zero, because we will

2399
02:48:37,290 --> 02:48:40,770
be increasing the revenues that we're collecting at the Wastewater

2400
02:48:40,770 --> 02:48:46,452
Treatment Plant. Okay, thank you, Manja Kershaw. CAO Smith. Through

2401
02:48:46,452 --> 02:48:49,092
the chair, I just, I think you need to reinforce

2402
02:48:49,113 --> 02:48:51,892
as it relates to this report. And I think underpinning

2403
02:48:51,932 --> 02:48:55,072
it is the evidence, right? And I think what, you

2404
02:48:55,072 --> 02:48:57,012
know, when we look at projections themselves, and the only

2405
02:48:57,113 --> 02:48:58,772
going to be so much in terms of a degree

2406
02:48:58,812 --> 02:49:02,452
of confidence, when we look at those longer term projections,

2407
02:49:02,452 --> 02:49:03,972
to the point earlier that was made as part of

2408
02:49:03,972 --> 02:49:07,092
the Capacity Report is that a lot of this is,

2409
02:49:07,092 --> 02:49:10,612
yeah, when we look at lands, our designated, or earmark

2410
02:49:10,633 --> 02:49:13,172
has released density or what those lands potentially have the

2411
02:49:13,673 --> 02:49:17,172
capability of housing as relations units. But we really don't

2412
02:49:17,172 --> 02:49:20,772
know until there's an active development application that comes forward

2413
02:49:20,812 --> 02:49:25,732
to embed within that design. I think what is an

2414
02:49:25,753 --> 02:49:28,372
important piece to recognise and what this reports brought forward

2415
02:49:28,412 --> 02:49:31,172
here in the prior report brought forward? Was the execution

2416
02:49:31,193 --> 02:49:34,972
of a value engineering study in the design phase? So

2417
02:49:34,972 --> 02:49:38,292
that's a reflection as it relates to the prior projects

2418
02:49:38,633 --> 02:49:41,492
within the Bay Grey and Mill Street. There's a sense

2419
02:49:41,492 --> 02:49:43,652
that we should never be new in these studies kind

2420
02:49:43,652 --> 02:49:47,492
of after you've already have the design stud, design completed.

2421
02:49:47,492 --> 02:49:50,052
Do it now while the design is ongoing. And a

2422
02:49:50,052 --> 02:49:52,452
lot of the considerations, I think that Councillor Pores put

2423
02:49:52,473 --> 02:49:54,532
forward. I'd like to embed within the scope of that

2424
02:49:54,873 --> 02:49:57,332
exercise to understand. And I think to the point around

2425
02:49:57,753 --> 02:50:00,692
phasing is to look at, and the combination between what

2426
02:50:00,793 --> 02:50:04,212
is ASTRA replacement versus on what is driven by growth,

2427
02:50:04,212 --> 02:50:06,852
into which there could be different time requirements for those

2428
02:50:06,852 --> 02:50:08,932
different scopes in which they can be spread out over

2429
02:50:09,033 --> 02:50:11,252
several years? Or does it all need to be done

2430
02:50:11,433 --> 02:50:14,932
at the present time? We can also look in the

2431
02:50:14,932 --> 02:50:17,092
deeper dive as a relationship material is to release to

2432
02:50:17,092 --> 02:50:19,092
the types of pumps we use. So there is definitely

2433
02:50:19,513 --> 02:50:22,612
going to be a comprehensive exercise in conjunction with the

2434
02:50:22,713 --> 02:50:25,332
engineering that is ongoing. But to when we look at

2435
02:50:25,353 --> 02:50:27,972
from a budget standpoint, that's kind of the intent with

2436
02:50:27,993 --> 02:50:30,532
this report is to say that we're not proceeding to

2437
02:50:30,793 --> 02:50:34,292
construction with the 50 million mark this year. That is

2438
02:50:34,292 --> 02:50:36,212
something that we're going to need to consider as part

2439
02:50:36,212 --> 02:50:38,772
of those future budget years or what we as Staff

2440
02:50:38,812 --> 02:50:41,332
are prepared to bring forward a council is analysis around

2441
02:50:41,372 --> 02:50:43,812
the options. I think we hear loud and clear, especially

2442
02:50:43,993 --> 02:50:46,452
with some of the numbers and troubling numbers pertaining to

2443
02:50:46,873 --> 02:50:50,292
how that may impact our debt capacity moving forward is

2444
02:50:50,292 --> 02:50:52,532
we need to look at how can we modify this

2445
02:50:52,572 --> 02:50:55,732
design to be within the means of both the taxpayers,

2446
02:50:55,732 --> 02:50:57,652
as well as the rate users. But we also need

2447
02:50:57,652 --> 02:51:00,372
to look at other tools as well, including a new

2448
02:51:01,433 --> 02:51:03,892
wastewater rate study to ensure our rates are reflective of

2449
02:51:03,932 --> 02:51:06,852
what those asset replacement needs are, as well as looking

2450
02:51:06,892 --> 02:51:09,972
at through development charge front ending agreements. We know that

2451
02:51:10,233 --> 02:51:12,372
DCs and one of the big issues here, we are

2452
02:51:12,372 --> 02:51:15,332
not collecting them in a timely way, especially given the

2453
02:51:15,673 --> 02:51:19,012
current environment. We also know the legislative changes that really

2454
02:51:19,513 --> 02:51:22,532
look at back loading as it relates to the timing

2455
02:51:22,633 --> 02:51:25,812
which makes even more difficulty in terms of a certainty

2456
02:51:25,833 --> 02:51:28,092
of when this revenue is going to come forward. So

2457
02:51:28,153 --> 02:51:30,852
through front ending agreements, if it is really dependent on,

2458
02:51:30,852 --> 02:51:33,492
say, those growth needs is looking at the industry to

2459
02:51:33,532 --> 02:51:36,772
come forward as it relates to using or providing credits

2460
02:51:36,812 --> 02:51:39,972
for, uh, for that work that is so dependent on

2461
02:51:40,393 --> 02:51:44,212
these projects embarking. So I think that's something to really

2462
02:51:44,713 --> 02:51:46,932
just be clear for councils that we are in that

2463
02:51:47,593 --> 02:51:49,812
we take heed of as a relations to the fiscal

2464
02:51:49,993 --> 02:51:52,532
constraints. And we also know that there's more to come

2465
02:51:52,532 --> 02:51:55,652
to modify that number because frankly, yes, to 50 million

2466
02:51:55,993 --> 02:51:59,812
is creates anxiety. No one on the Stas end as

2467
02:51:59,812 --> 02:52:00,932
it relates to how we are going to be able

2468
02:52:00,932 --> 02:52:02,932
to afford it as well as how that impacts other

2469
02:52:03,033 --> 02:52:06,532
projects and going into the more of the discretion items,

2470
02:52:06,532 --> 02:52:08,052
which I think a lot of folks want to see

2471
02:52:08,052 --> 02:52:11,012
done really to our parks recreational amenities and things like

2472
02:52:11,052 --> 02:52:14,212
that when we're so focused. There's so much resources have

2473
02:52:14,212 --> 02:52:17,332
to go into what is critical related to maintaining our

2474
02:52:17,433 --> 02:52:20,372
assets or accommodating the growth that goes into our water

2475
02:52:20,393 --> 02:52:24,708
wastewater systems. Thank you, CEO Smith. All right. Now I'm

2476
02:52:24,729 --> 02:52:29,361
going to go on to Deputy Mayor Barneau. Thank you,

2477
02:52:29,401 --> 02:52:34,401
Mr. Chair, through you. And, um, looking at this in

2478
02:52:34,441 --> 02:52:36,721
its totality, looking at long - term debt when we're

2479
02:52:36,721 --> 02:52:41,841
at 30 percent engineering is hard to do. Um, by

2480
02:52:41,881 --> 02:52:45,441
a couple of questions I do have is, um, first

2481
02:52:45,441 --> 02:52:48,481
and foremost, each year of projects delayed, we averaged three

2482
02:52:48,521 --> 02:52:57,201
to five percent increases That being said, looking at the

2483
02:52:57,222 --> 02:52:59,201
scope of the phasing of this, we have to look

2484
02:52:59,241 --> 02:53:01,841
at the long - term financial roadmap as well as

2485
02:53:01,841 --> 02:53:07,520
the infrastructure. We have over a billion dollars. In infrastructure.

2486
02:53:07,520 --> 02:53:10,080
And then to maintain that, even if you take at

2487
02:53:10,080 --> 02:53:18,560
a, between one and one five percentile dollars in infrastructure,

2488
02:53:18,560 --> 02:53:20,800
because it's, say, two thirds of our equipment or our

2489
02:53:20,800 --> 02:53:25,560
infrastructure, um, asset management's in great shape. The third, as

2490
02:53:25,781 --> 02:53:29,000
we progress in age, we need to reflect that. So

2491
02:53:29,061 --> 02:53:31,920
it's not all new build. It's also maintaining the asset

2492
02:53:31,960 --> 02:53:34,680
management. So we need a good roadmap for each. So

2493
02:53:34,680 --> 02:53:38,400
I guess my question, um, Ms. Kershaw is, um, number

2494
02:53:38,440 --> 02:53:42,382
one is. At declass engineering, um, do we see that

2495
02:53:42,563 --> 02:53:45,742
increase? We've seen that before. So are we comfortable with

2496
02:53:45,923 --> 02:53:48,302
D - class or do we see that escalating number

2497
02:53:48,342 --> 02:53:52,622
one? Number two is our, my percentage on construction increase

2498
02:53:53,283 --> 02:53:56,622
on an analysed basis, um, by postponing a project accurate.

2499
02:53:58,444 --> 02:54:02,607
Thank you, Crucial. Go ahead. After you, Mr. Chair, I'm

2500
02:54:02,607 --> 02:54:04,707
going to answer your last question first because it's most

2501
02:54:04,728 --> 02:54:09,881
president in my mind. Six years ago, we would have

2502
02:54:09,902 --> 02:54:16,961
said we see both two percent increase. And tariffs. So

2503
02:54:16,961 --> 02:54:19,481
I think three to five percent would be very low.

2504
02:54:19,502 --> 02:54:22,921
I think we probably up around 10 percent increase when

2505
02:54:22,921 --> 02:54:25,401
we consider what's going on in the world economy and

2506
02:54:25,582 --> 02:54:29,961
we're supplies come from, uh, when we look at infrastructure,

2507
02:54:30,062 --> 02:54:33,881
especially, uh, linear infrastructure, so much of it is dependent

2508
02:54:33,881 --> 02:54:37,161
on hydrocarbons, whether it be PVC pipe or the asphalt

2509
02:54:38,382 --> 02:54:42,441
or there's a huge impact based on the price of

2510
02:54:42,441 --> 02:54:46,681
the oil, a barrel of oil. So I would think

2511
02:54:46,721 --> 02:54:49,081
that we might be up around 10 percent per year

2512
02:54:51,422 --> 02:54:55,401
and delaying, we'll drive the costs up. When we consider

2513
02:54:55,662 --> 02:54:58,761
we're at 30 percent design, I will use an analogy

2514
02:54:58,782 --> 02:55:01,961
from, um, a council reporter about being in health care.

2515
02:55:01,961 --> 02:55:10,761
This is like walking into your emergency room. Uh, running

2516
02:55:10,782 --> 02:55:18,281
tests. So we're at 30 percent design We've done a

2517
02:55:18,281 --> 02:55:22,761
lot of pre - assessments, uh, like the, this is

2518
02:55:22,761 --> 02:55:25,321
when we undertake all our studies and up to the

2519
02:55:25,502 --> 02:55:31,561
30 percent design My wishful, my, my heart, uh, hopes

2520
02:55:31,561 --> 02:55:34,841
it doesn't increase, but my brain tells me it will.

2521
02:55:34,841 --> 02:55:40,521
We always find more unknowns as we go, uh, what

2522
02:55:40,542 --> 02:55:44,521
is the cost of that piece of equipment? Whoa, what's

2523
02:55:44,521 --> 02:55:46,601
the pipe that we required to connect that piece of

2524
02:55:46,641 --> 02:55:50,521
equipment to the rest of the system. We're tying in

2525
02:55:50,542 --> 02:55:53,321
every piece of wire and everything else in the costs

2526
02:55:53,321 --> 02:55:56,441
of every other component that's required. We get into the

2527
02:55:56,702 --> 02:55:59,641
nitty gritty when we start getting into 90 percent So

2528
02:55:59,641 --> 02:56:02,801
we really know what we're, what we're dealing with. But

2529
02:56:03,142 --> 02:56:07,041
we are trying to be conservative and use a healthy

2530
02:56:07,081 --> 02:56:11,281
estimate. We did look at the estimate that the tender

2531
02:56:11,321 --> 02:56:14,721
bids that we received from Mill Street for the for

2532
02:56:14,761 --> 02:56:17,681
the pumping station and we looked, because when we get

2533
02:56:17,782 --> 02:56:22,401
a tender bid, uh, we look at everybody who submitted

2534
02:56:22,441 --> 02:56:26,641
this a bid to do that job. And it is

2535
02:56:26,662 --> 02:56:29,761
broken down into the different components, whether it be electrical,

2536
02:56:29,761 --> 02:56:35,121
mechanical, concrete, uh, structural. And we did compare, uh, the

2537
02:56:35,121 --> 02:56:37,521
costs of that and the volumes and the size of

2538
02:56:37,521 --> 02:56:40,481
the pumps and everything else. So we are really trying

2539
02:56:40,481 --> 02:56:44,721
to do a very good, a very thorough investigation at

2540
02:56:44,761 --> 02:56:48,001
the 30 percent design. But I can't tell you it's

2541
02:56:48,041 --> 02:56:51,281
going to go down. Follow up Mr. Predier. Yeah. Thank

2542
02:56:51,281 --> 02:56:53,121
you for that. And you know, I see just that

2543
02:56:53,161 --> 02:56:55,921
alone, The One Rock we're talking about and the 2.

2544
02:56:55,921 --> 02:56:59,841
2 million dollars just because physically what's there. Um, so

2545
02:56:59,942 --> 02:57:03,281
if we go from, um, looking at the 30 percent

2546
02:57:03,321 --> 02:57:10,721
design, am I right from memory that we'd be probably

2547
02:57:10,742 --> 02:57:14,721
in the contingency 2025 percent at that level is that

2548
02:57:14,721 --> 02:57:19,521
about right? I have read some papers where they say

2549
02:57:19,622 --> 02:57:24,401
a D classes minus 25 percent plus 50 percent. But

2550
02:57:24,662 --> 02:57:28,241
we run plus or minus 25 percent based on a

2551
02:57:28,262 --> 02:57:37,571
D class. Thank you. Councillor Maxwell, go ahead. Thank you

2552
02:57:37,752 --> 02:57:41,971
chair. Um, I have some questions. I guess there are

2553
02:57:42,011 --> 02:57:45,731
more, cause I think everybody's been talking about finance here.

2554
02:57:45,832 --> 02:57:48,202
I think I'm going to talk about is. Some illegal

2555
02:57:48,863 --> 02:57:54,202
which translates into finance and the first question I'm going

2556
02:57:54,202 --> 02:57:58,522
to ask is, are we legally mandated to grow by

2557
02:57:58,522 --> 02:58:02,321
the province. Yes or no. And then I'll move on

2558
02:58:02,502 --> 02:58:07,062
to this devil. Major Gersha or CAO Smith. You want

2559
02:58:07,062 --> 02:58:12,233
to take a stab at that. Through the chair, yes.

2560
02:58:12,273 --> 02:58:16,073
We do have obligations around accommodating growth. When we look

2561
02:58:16,073 --> 02:58:19,333
at other tools at Municipalities had to employ when, uh,

2562
02:58:20,174 --> 02:58:22,633
say there is not the necessary, the ability to look

2563
02:58:22,673 --> 02:58:27,113
at expanding, say, capacity. There's been interim control bylaws and

2564
02:58:27,113 --> 02:58:30,073
things like that. But they've always been tied to study

2565
02:58:30,654 --> 02:58:33,353
or an analysis that would be required to further support

2566
02:58:33,934 --> 02:58:36,873
that growth being, uh, to be enabled and to, to

2567
02:58:36,873 --> 02:58:39,893
the future. So, uh, we, we cannot look at, uh,

2568
02:58:40,574 --> 02:58:43,833
a practice as it relates to essentially, uh, not pursuing

2569
02:58:44,414 --> 02:58:48,233
these expansions to supply and essentially looking at indefinite development

2570
02:58:48,414 --> 02:58:50,553
freeze. We would be, uh, that would be a risk

2571
02:58:50,553 --> 02:58:56,820
to the municipality. Follow up Councillor Maxwell. Yeah, I do.

2572
02:58:57,241 --> 02:59:04,209
Okay. So. Um, yeah. What I'm looking at is, um.

2573
02:59:06,252 --> 02:59:10,711
On the MTO, uh, refusing permission across I - 26.

2574
02:59:13,915 --> 02:59:18,737
If we realign the water course. We're going to have

2575
02:59:18,737 --> 02:59:22,657
to go meet a whole lot of regulatory compliance with

2576
02:59:22,758 --> 02:59:27,697
agencies, whether it's conservation authorities or ministry of this and

2577
02:59:27,737 --> 02:59:31,517
that. So that's going to add to some. Legal burden.

2578
02:59:33,958 --> 02:59:39,308
The other one I'm wondering about too is. Some, uh,

2579
02:59:40,469 --> 02:59:45,088
maybe ongoing agreements that we have currently with maybe subdivisions.

2580
02:59:45,995 --> 02:59:49,334
Um, we have front ended. Have they funded any of

2581
02:59:49,334 --> 02:59:54,136
the growth at all. Do we know. That's where you,

2582
02:59:54,136 --> 02:59:56,856
Mr. Chair. Go ahead. Okay. So let's go back to

2583
02:59:56,896 --> 03:00:01,496
the MTO intersection. Uh, we started, um, meetings with the

2584
03:00:01,496 --> 03:00:04,376
MTO beginning of this year to figure out how to

2585
03:00:04,376 --> 03:00:08,296
get the sewers across Highway 26 on grey road 21.

2586
03:00:10,256 --> 03:00:13,915
The ministry came back, um, Ministry of Transportation, uh, came

2587
03:00:13,955 --> 03:00:16,875
back and said, we are undertaking an EA and environmental

2588
03:00:16,875 --> 03:00:19,435
assessment right now to determine how we're going to control

2589
03:00:19,536 --> 03:00:24,315
that intersection, whether it be around about or signalized intersection.

2590
03:00:24,315 --> 03:00:26,475
When we started our discussions with them, they said we

2591
03:00:26,515 --> 03:00:28,555
have not come to a conclusion on how we're going

2592
03:00:28,555 --> 03:00:32,295
to control that intersection. But however, we do it, the

2593
03:00:32,295 --> 03:00:36,695
work will be done in 2027. And your sewer better

2594
03:00:36,695 --> 03:00:39,255
not be in our way. If your sewer is in

2595
03:00:39,276 --> 03:00:42,695
our way when we go to Reconstruction, you will pay

2596
03:00:42,716 --> 03:00:47,095
for every day that we delay their construction. So MTO

2597
03:00:47,116 --> 03:00:48,855
have made it quite clear that they do not want

2598
03:00:49,036 --> 03:00:53,575
our infrastructure in their intersections. In order to accommodate that,

2599
03:00:53,575 --> 03:00:57,895
we are taking this sewer up. We'll be travelling at

2600
03:00:58,236 --> 03:01:03,635
West along the side of Highway 26. To get beyond

2601
03:01:03,976 --> 03:01:06,275
their intersection. The sewer will dip down and go below

2602
03:01:06,296 --> 03:01:09,155
the water course. And then once we're beyond their water

2603
03:01:09,336 --> 03:01:13,715
course, it'll cross over, cross north, across Highway 26. And

2604
03:01:13,715 --> 03:01:17,235
then we will travel back east along the north shore

2605
03:01:17,235 --> 03:01:20,995
of Highway 26 and go underneath the water course again.

2606
03:01:20,995 --> 03:01:24,355
And then start down Grey Road 21. Our long point

2607
03:01:24,456 --> 03:01:27,715
road to ensure that our gravity sewer is not in

2608
03:01:27,896 --> 03:01:31,555
their intersection. We also had some communications with calling wood.

2609
03:01:31,555 --> 03:01:34,115
Callingwood have a water main that comes to an end

2610
03:01:34,155 --> 03:01:37,635
at Silver Creek Drive on Grey Road 21. And we

2611
03:01:37,635 --> 03:01:40,315
said, Hey, we're going to be crossing Highway 26. Do

2612
03:01:40,315 --> 03:01:42,755
you want us to put in a sleeve for your

2613
03:01:42,755 --> 03:01:47,955
water main? A long point road. Right now, the town

2614
03:01:47,995 --> 03:01:50,435
of Blue Mountains provides water to the Collingwood residence on

2615
03:01:50,435 --> 03:01:53,555
the end of Longpoint Road. And when we started looking

2616
03:01:53,595 --> 03:01:57,395
at costs calling would say, no, I think we'll undertake

2617
03:01:57,395 --> 03:01:59,955
that work at another time. We're not going to participate

2618
03:01:59,976 --> 03:02:03,075
in that work. So that, that the cost of that

2619
03:02:03,176 --> 03:02:08,915
work has increased. That was the most significant increase to

2620
03:02:08,955 --> 03:02:13,395
the linear works. And I believe we added almost 1.

2621
03:02:13,416 --> 03:02:17,475
5 kilometers of water main or sewer main by having

2622
03:02:17,496 --> 03:02:20,435
to do the jog round. So that was the significant

2623
03:02:20,616 --> 03:02:24,842
cost to the linear works. Oh, I'm losing my mind

2624
03:02:24,863 --> 03:02:27,962
today. I forgot in your second question. I'm sorry. Go

2625
03:02:27,962 --> 03:02:32,471
ahead. I wondered if we had any agreements that were

2626
03:02:32,511 --> 03:02:40,682
locked down that, you know, maybe a close session. With

2627
03:02:40,722 --> 03:02:43,162
her. Through you, Mr. Chair. So we haven't done any

2628
03:02:43,343 --> 03:02:46,042
pre - servicing agreements in the Craig Leith area for,

2629
03:02:46,082 --> 03:02:50,282
for water sewer. We have been pre - building it

2630
03:02:51,343 --> 03:02:55,242
for development to come in to support, uh, resilient growth.

2631
03:02:58,388 --> 03:03:01,167
Cool. Yes. Councillor Maxwell. Yeah. Okay. So I just want

2632
03:03:01,167 --> 03:03:06,440
to make a comment, I guess. So. The financial risk

2633
03:03:07,341 --> 03:03:10,600
and the legal risk seemed to be fairly high on

2634
03:03:10,621 --> 03:03:16,686
this project. Anyway, it looks like, you know, we're at

2635
03:03:16,726 --> 03:03:19,566
30 percent, but we have no idea what the cost

2636
03:03:19,587 --> 03:03:21,406
will be at a hundred percent. We do not want

2637
03:03:21,446 --> 03:03:26,766
another episode like the last time. And it looks like

2638
03:03:26,787 --> 03:03:31,827
we're heading that direction. So, um, anyway, um, I'll have

2639
03:03:31,827 --> 03:03:33,747
to have a look at see what Councillor Porter has

2640
03:03:33,928 --> 03:03:40,892
her emotion here. Thank you. Uh, yeah, men's Turshaw in

2641
03:03:40,892 --> 03:03:45,052
response. Uh, so I guess I want to comment through

2642
03:03:45,052 --> 03:03:48,252
you, Mr. Chair. I'll provide a few comments. Um, this

2643
03:03:48,353 --> 03:03:51,532
project we were proposing to go to a valued engineering

2644
03:03:51,572 --> 03:03:55,852
at 30 percent design That should eliminate, uh, any extras

2645
03:03:56,273 --> 03:04:00,732
or unnecessary costs. We will look at maximizing our design

2646
03:04:02,673 --> 03:04:07,372
and being very conservative of what we install to make

2647
03:04:07,372 --> 03:04:12,652
sure we're utilising the user rates dollars as best we

2648
03:04:12,652 --> 03:04:15,692
can in the taxpayers, Money the best we can. So

2649
03:04:17,633 --> 03:04:19,932
our next step with this project is to undertake a

2650
03:04:20,033 --> 03:04:22,892
30 percent design review. Additionally, we do have a risk

2651
03:04:22,913 --> 03:04:26,492
registry going on with this project. And we understand the

2652
03:04:26,492 --> 03:04:33,052
risks of the decisions that we're being made for this

2653
03:04:33,073 --> 03:04:40,290
project. So, um, previous projects, I don't believe, uh, we're

2654
03:04:40,290 --> 03:04:44,690
communicated 30, 60, 90 percent design estimates. This is a

2655
03:04:44,730 --> 03:04:48,290
request of council and we're proceeding to make those publicly

2656
03:04:48,311 --> 03:04:51,730
available and available to council to understand where we're at

2657
03:04:51,730 --> 03:04:58,717
with projects. Final question Maxwell. We got to get to

2658
03:04:58,717 --> 03:05:00,877
a mark. Thank you, Gerald. Okay. Thank you for that,

2659
03:05:00,877 --> 03:05:05,197
Elsin. So when they do the value engineering and they,

2660
03:05:05,197 --> 03:05:08,557
they're going to stand behind what they say that 100

2661
03:05:08,597 --> 03:05:14,537
percent. Magiswalk. So valued engineering is an exercise where we

2662
03:05:14,537 --> 03:05:17,337
look at what was designed. And this is, is this

2663
03:05:17,337 --> 03:05:20,697
the best solution? Is this the best life cycle costing?

2664
03:05:20,697 --> 03:05:25,177
Is this the best infrastructure to install to reduce risk

2665
03:05:25,198 --> 03:05:30,377
of both construction issues and long - term issues to

2666
03:05:30,478 --> 03:05:37,097
the town? It's not about, uh, examining this cost and

2667
03:05:37,137 --> 03:05:40,777
saying that this cost is a hundred percent guaranteed at

2668
03:05:40,777 --> 03:05:47,177
the end of warranty. Things do change during construction. When

2669
03:05:47,177 --> 03:05:50,377
you're in this kind of construction, there are decisions that

2670
03:05:50,398 --> 03:05:57,497
are made that change minor, the minutiae within the project.

2671
03:06:00,971 --> 03:06:05,590
A fairly frequently. But we have contingencies that we roll

2672
03:06:05,630 --> 03:06:08,950
with that because we haven't maybe identified every single light

2673
03:06:08,971 --> 03:06:13,270
bulb or things like that. Valued engineering does not guarantee

2674
03:06:13,611 --> 03:06:16,790
the price. Valued engineering tells us that we're getting the

2675
03:06:16,790 --> 03:06:22,310
best value, the best life cycle costs, the best product,

2676
03:06:22,310 --> 03:06:27,175
uh, or the most. Cost effective product for, for our

2677
03:06:27,196 --> 03:06:35,766
taxpayers dollars. Okay. Thank you, manager Kershaw. So I don't

2678
03:06:35,787 --> 03:06:38,806
see any further hands. Councillor Porter did indicate she had

2679
03:06:38,846 --> 03:06:40,806
a motion. I'm going to look to Adam Deputy Clerk

2680
03:06:41,147 --> 03:06:42,806
to put that motion up on the board so I

2681
03:06:42,806 --> 03:06:45,126
can read it aloud for everybody to hear and absorb

2682
03:06:45,867 --> 03:06:49,926
that council, receive Staff move by Council Reporter. That Council

2683
03:06:49,966 --> 03:06:54,326
receive Staff Report OPS dot 26. 035 entitled Craig Leith

2684
03:06:54,366 --> 03:07:02,086
Wastewater Treatment Plant Upgrades. And that Council Direct Staff to

2685
03:07:02,107 --> 03:07:08,806
report back to Council with a reconciliation, validation and, sorry,

2686
03:07:09,307 --> 03:07:14,486
consolidation of all existing approved committed allocated, reserved and future

2687
03:07:14,507 --> 03:07:19,366
wastewater units associated with the Craig Leaf sewer shed and

2688
03:07:19,387 --> 03:07:23,606
Craig Leith Wastewater Treatment Plant Service area. And that the

2689
03:07:23,627 --> 03:07:27,686
report include a comparison of the unit counts equivalent unit

2690
03:07:27,947 --> 03:07:34,253
count allocations. Servicing assumption, this growth forecast and a full

2691
03:07:34,354 --> 03:07:38,653
build - out projections utilised in. One, The long point

2692
03:07:38,754 --> 03:07:45,053
road, environmental assessment to the water and wastewater capacity assessments.

2693
03:07:45,053 --> 03:07:49,853
Three, development charge studies. Four, health and safety water stream

2694
03:07:50,514 --> 03:07:58,733
HSWS funding applications five housing, enabling, water, systems, HEWS funding

2695
03:07:58,754 --> 03:08:04,615
applications. Six wastewater servicing studies. Seven growth management forecasts and

2696
03:08:04,876 --> 03:08:09,495
eight all related infrastructure planning documents. And that staff identify

2697
03:08:09,596 --> 03:08:13,815
and explain any discrepancies between these documents and provide a

2698
03:08:13,996 --> 03:08:20,775
reconciled estimate of one existing service units to approved and

2699
03:08:20,775 --> 03:08:26,695
committed units, three registered, but unbuilt units for allocated or

2700
03:08:26,796 --> 03:08:32,215
reserved capacity. Five, future growth units. And six total full

2701
03:08:32,255 --> 03:08:38,323
build - out units. Together with the anticipated realization timeline

2702
03:08:38,344 --> 03:08:41,403
for those units in five - year increments, zero to

2703
03:08:41,403 --> 03:08:44,403
five, five to 10 years, 10 to 15 years, 15

2704
03:08:44,443 --> 03:08:47,763
to 20 years. And beyond 20 years, including the assumptions

2705
03:08:48,264 --> 03:08:54,163
supporting each forecast. And that Staff specifically identify and quantify

2706
03:08:54,264 --> 03:08:59,523
any overlap duplication or double counting of housing units, equivalent

2707
03:08:59,544 --> 03:09:05,443
units, servicing allocations, growth forecasts or capacity assumptions across grant

2708
03:09:05,483 --> 03:09:12,720
applications. Development charge studies. Servicing strategies, environmental assessments, infrastructure studies,

2709
03:09:12,720 --> 03:09:17,040
and wastewater planning documents. And that Council Direct the Value

2710
03:09:17,080 --> 03:09:21,760
Engineering and third - party review assignment to utilise the

2711
03:09:21,781 --> 03:09:26,000
validated growth forecast servicing assumptions and build - out projections

2712
03:09:26,341 --> 03:09:31,040
as the basis for evaluating build now versus build as

2713
03:09:31,080 --> 03:09:38,000
growth accures scenarios. And further that no recommendation regarding ultimate

2714
03:09:38,661 --> 03:09:43,520
infrastructure sizing, construction phasing, or long - term borrowing, B

2715
03:09:43,560 --> 03:09:47,760
- brought forward to council until the growth forecast full

2716
03:09:47,760 --> 03:09:52,240
- builded assumptions, implementation, timelines, and servicing allocations have been

2717
03:09:52,421 --> 03:09:58,320
reconciled and validated, and that Staff provide a comprehensive financial

2718
03:09:58,421 --> 03:10:02,320
analysis of the borrowing requirements associated with the Craig Leith

2719
03:10:02,341 --> 03:10:08,366
Wastewater Treatment Plant upgrades project. Including the validated growth forecast

2720
03:10:08,547 --> 03:10:15,206
and face implementation options. And then the analysis include one

2721
03:10:15,627 --> 03:10:20,406
total anticipated debt principle under each scenario to annual debt

2722
03:10:20,427 --> 03:10:25,206
servicing payments three, total financing and interest costs over the

2723
03:10:25,307 --> 03:10:30,326
life of the debt for impacts wastewater reserve funds five

2724
03:10:30,427 --> 03:10:36,723
development charge funding assumptions and anticipated collection timing. Six. Sensitivity

2725
03:10:36,904 --> 03:10:40,243
analysis for low growth, medium growth, and full build -

2726
03:10:40,243 --> 03:10:44,243
out scenarios, and seven, The Impact on Wastewater rates and

2727
03:10:44,243 --> 03:10:48,163
the equivalent impact of the municipal tax levy expressed in

2728
03:10:48,424 --> 03:10:53,043
both annual percentage terms and dollar values, and that the

2729
03:10:53,144 --> 03:11:00,243
report compare the financial implications of one, a full build

2730
03:11:00,283 --> 03:11:04,883
- out scenario to a phased growth triggered scenario, three,

2731
03:11:04,883 --> 03:11:09,603
a minimum infrastructure required today scenario, and for a build

2732
03:11:09,643 --> 03:11:13,843
- out as growth scenario occurred, sorry, for a build

2733
03:11:13,883 --> 03:11:17,523
- out, or build - as - growth occur scenario.

2734
03:11:17,523 --> 03:11:20,803
And that the report clearly identified the financial exposure to

2735
03:11:21,144 --> 03:11:26,003
existing taxpayers and wastewater rate pairs should projected growth, development

2736
03:11:26,043 --> 03:11:29,923
charge revenues, or other growth - related revenues fall to

2737
03:11:30,024 --> 03:11:34,796
materialize within the timelines assumed. And further that the Council

2738
03:11:34,836 --> 03:11:40,476
require any future recommendation regarding Project Scope sizing, phasing, or

2739
03:11:40,897 --> 03:11:44,556
borrowing to include a clear statement of the estimated annual

2740
03:11:44,737 --> 03:11:51,116
debt payment total financing cost and corresponding impact on wastewater

2741
03:11:51,156 --> 03:11:54,636
rates and the municipal tax levy. I'll suck at the

2742
03:11:54,636 --> 03:12:00,913
motion. That has been seconded by Councillor Hope. Any further

2743
03:12:00,934 --> 03:12:08,024
discussion on this motion? CEO Smith, go ahead. Through the

2744
03:12:08,024 --> 03:12:11,064
chair, I don't necessarily have concerns with anything the section

2745
03:12:11,104 --> 03:12:13,464
pertain to the financial analysis piece, which I think will

2746
03:12:13,485 --> 03:12:17,024
be important for those future budgetary decisions. But I do

2747
03:12:17,024 --> 03:12:21,064
struggle a little bit as it relates to the gross

2748
03:12:21,064 --> 03:12:23,624
scenarios and the analysis tied to the various studies in

2749
03:12:23,624 --> 03:12:27,544
terms of reconciling different amounts, because they think through what

2750
03:12:27,544 --> 03:12:32,664
we rely on the comprehensive servicing analysis. Or, Dynajya Kershaw

2751
03:12:32,704 --> 03:12:34,504
has privileged you provided, as well as the fact that

2752
03:12:35,005 --> 03:12:37,624
when we look at elements such as even long point

2753
03:12:37,664 --> 03:12:41,304
EA, that EA was done 20 years ago. So those

2754
03:12:41,304 --> 03:12:44,344
numbers won't be reflective of the current realities. And I

2755
03:12:44,344 --> 03:12:46,824
think that's the key piece is, that's my concern in

2756
03:12:46,824 --> 03:12:50,504
terms of that Folsom information is that, of course, there

2757
03:12:50,504 --> 03:12:52,584
will be caveats. So we'll be differences in the numbers

2758
03:12:52,605 --> 03:12:55,224
we have, because all these studies are done at certain

2759
03:12:55,264 --> 03:12:58,504
periods of time, and our forecasts are always revised based

2760
03:12:58,504 --> 03:13:02,344
on developments that are ultimately allocated. Ultimately, we do have

2761
03:13:02,605 --> 03:13:05,384
emerge, such as even in lands that maybe within a

2762
03:13:05,424 --> 03:13:08,184
future secondary plan area. So I really struggle as it

2763
03:13:08,184 --> 03:13:11,784
relates to how much definitive information we could provide beyond

2764
03:13:11,885 --> 03:13:15,704
what's already portrayed through these servicing analysis report. Um, which

2765
03:13:15,885 --> 03:13:19,224
is our most point in time analysis of where things

2766
03:13:20,205 --> 03:13:23,144
are currently stand, even with the grant submissions themselves. Once

2767
03:13:23,144 --> 03:13:25,624
again, they're point in time projections as it relates to

2768
03:13:25,645 --> 03:13:28,804
where things stand. But I just struggle bringing that, you

2769
03:13:28,804 --> 03:13:31,944
know, level of detail and degree of information and about

2770
03:13:32,125 --> 03:13:36,964
whether that's really doable versus the, um, I think the

2771
03:13:36,964 --> 03:13:39,744
other components on the financial analysis. And I'm going to

2772
03:13:39,744 --> 03:13:42,784
go to Councillor Porter to clarify her motion. Yes, so

2773
03:13:42,925 --> 03:13:46,504
just want to clarify in the sense of if the

2774
03:13:46,504 --> 03:13:50,984
long point, as you say, road environmental assessment, all you,

2775
03:13:50,984 --> 03:13:52,904
all I would expect as a result of this motion

2776
03:13:52,925 --> 03:13:55,704
is, um, due to the age of it report is

2777
03:13:55,744 --> 03:13:58,943
no longer relevant done. I'm not looking for you to

2778
03:13:58,983 --> 03:14:02,303
explain things that aren't relevant. I do think the two

2779
03:14:02,343 --> 03:14:06,303
funding applications are relevant, particularly one was only done a

2780
03:14:06,303 --> 03:14:09,743
year ago. And the other one, I would say to

2781
03:14:09,783 --> 03:14:11,623
some extent, got us in the mess we are. So

2782
03:14:11,924 --> 03:14:15,103
they are relevant as to what was used. Um, if

2783
03:14:15,103 --> 03:14:18,223
the study is relevant, it's fine. If it's too old,

2784
03:14:18,263 --> 03:14:21,903
it's not relevant. An explanation one or two sentences is

2785
03:14:21,924 --> 03:14:25,103
fine. The problem I had is that there are different

2786
03:14:25,124 --> 03:14:30,898
numbers. There's different numbers. And we have to have one

2787
03:14:30,938 --> 03:14:37,910
set of numbers that we use. And, um, that was

2788
03:14:37,910 --> 03:14:41,713
my big thing. Is around the watershed numbers. And I

2789
03:14:41,713 --> 03:14:46,033
had looked at the Excel spreadsheet that Ms. Kershaw reported

2790
03:14:46,054 --> 03:14:49,313
to in that perhaps can be just put in there.

2791
03:14:49,313 --> 03:14:51,393
I'm plunked in. This is what they are. But I

2792
03:14:51,393 --> 03:14:53,073
think it's fair to say, you don't want to look

2793
03:14:53,113 --> 03:14:56,353
it application forms for grants. And look at Staff Reports

2794
03:14:56,614 --> 03:15:01,545
and the numbers are different. People know it should be

2795
03:15:01,606 --> 03:15:04,225
what a number is. And the numbers don't change that

2796
03:15:04,246 --> 03:15:06,505
drastically. That you're getting up to a future bill of

2797
03:15:06,646 --> 03:15:10,002
23, 000 and something. Like, and it's trying to figure

2798
03:15:10,103 --> 03:15:16,200
out what are we funding to. And if you, um,

2799
03:15:16,321 --> 03:15:21,180
the refurbishment of existing is seen as, um, that to

2800
03:15:21,180 --> 03:15:24,460
me shouldn't get bundled because this is really a seven

2801
03:15:24,500 --> 03:15:27,100
project bundle when we weren't going to bundle things anymore

2802
03:15:28,001 --> 03:15:31,740
is what is actually the reconstruction and what is new

2803
03:15:31,761 --> 03:15:35,467
construction? What is the cost. Because people have an easier

2804
03:15:35,568 --> 03:15:38,027
time knowing that they need to have this to continue

2805
03:15:38,288 --> 03:15:41,307
the service they have, but they're less likely to want

2806
03:15:41,307 --> 03:15:44,507
to pay debt for services that are coming who know

2807
03:15:44,547 --> 03:15:50,167
when. You know, I think there is some, you know,

2808
03:15:50,167 --> 03:15:53,595
if you want any more clarification, it's fine. But, um,

2809
03:15:54,596 --> 03:15:57,195
some things, if they're not relevant, they're not relevant. And

2810
03:15:57,316 --> 03:16:01,247
ticket often, it goes. Okay. Thank you Council Reporter. Manager

2811
03:16:01,247 --> 03:16:07,279
Kershaw. Some of the numbers change, uh, for things like

2812
03:16:07,540 --> 03:16:09,919
campus of care. It was very high density on a

2813
03:16:09,919 --> 03:16:13,119
small piece of property that we were incorporating at some

2814
03:16:13,119 --> 03:16:16,319
point in time. And then we were not incorporating. Additionally,

2815
03:16:16,359 --> 03:16:21,039
we see a huge development just in their secondary plan

2816
03:16:21,140 --> 03:16:23,519
that has gone from 1200 units. And I believe it's

2817
03:16:23,540 --> 03:16:28,439
come down a bit. When we look at, when I

2818
03:16:28,439 --> 03:16:33,279
write the capacity report, when if there's certain new developments

2819
03:16:33,279 --> 03:16:36,839
that are thrown in, uh, I believe in 2023, I

2820
03:16:36,839 --> 03:16:41,439
included sites B E and F at the village. That's

2821
03:16:41,479 --> 03:16:44,479
a huge amount of capacity change. And it changes from

2822
03:16:44,580 --> 03:16:46,959
year to year. If you look at year over year

2823
03:16:46,980 --> 03:16:50,079
of the, of the capacity report and you look at

2824
03:16:50,079 --> 03:16:53,119
the allocations and the total amount of usage, it does

2825
03:16:53,159 --> 03:16:55,679
go up and down. It does slide depending on the

2826
03:16:55,700 --> 03:17:00,399
density of, of what builders actually build. And, uh, some

2827
03:17:00,439 --> 03:17:03,039
of the special projects that come down, such as campus

2828
03:17:03,079 --> 03:17:06,639
of care. And when we looked at the, the long

2829
03:17:06,820 --> 03:17:11,199
point road sewer shed, we were also incorporating units from

2830
03:17:11,780 --> 03:17:16,619
beyond our municipal boundaries within the town of Collingwood. And

2831
03:17:16,660 --> 03:17:20,911
Clearview Township. Which we should be, we should be trying

2832
03:17:20,932 --> 03:17:25,871
to reduce the cost on the individual users on the

2833
03:17:25,871 --> 03:17:29,391
system. So our numbers are not always, we're not comparing

2834
03:17:29,572 --> 03:17:33,231
apples and oranges and all these different studies. That's part

2835
03:17:33,231 --> 03:17:36,671
of the problem is that when we look at a

2836
03:17:36,671 --> 03:17:39,631
funding application, we're looking at how many users we're servicing

2837
03:17:39,652 --> 03:17:43,231
within our municipality when we're looking at an EA and

2838
03:17:43,231 --> 03:17:46,351
we're going to service beyond our municipal boundary. We incorporate

2839
03:17:46,372 --> 03:17:50,031
those, those numbers as well. And they, they, the long

2840
03:17:50,071 --> 03:17:53,871
point road did delineate the number of users per piece

2841
03:17:53,911 --> 03:17:59,231
of property that could be serviced by the treatment plant,

2842
03:17:59,231 --> 03:18:01,803
the lift station at the plant. Okay. Thank you, manager

2843
03:18:01,803 --> 03:18:05,003
Kershaw. Um, going to go to Madam Mayor. Go ahead.

2844
03:18:05,934 --> 03:18:09,493
Thank you. Three of the chair to CAO Smith. Um,

2845
03:18:09,493 --> 03:18:13,273
thank you. You've already delineated some of the differences in

2846
03:18:13,313 --> 03:18:16,233
the ask in terms of the financial side. Um, we

2847
03:18:16,414 --> 03:18:18,713
are in the operations portion of Committee the whole. We

2848
03:18:18,713 --> 03:18:22,153
don't have the benefit of, of the financial team being

2849
03:18:22,174 --> 03:18:26,553
able to respond. My question through the chair is this

2850
03:18:26,654 --> 03:18:29,673
list of ask how doable is it in the Staff

2851
03:18:29,854 --> 03:18:33,193
workload that they currently have in Operations, but also with

2852
03:18:33,374 --> 03:18:36,473
finance. I'll have to look to you as a CAO

2853
03:18:36,513 --> 03:18:38,993
to think in terms of who would need to be

2854
03:18:38,993 --> 03:18:41,993
involved in this. And knowing that every time we ask

2855
03:18:42,094 --> 03:18:45,673
for a new report, we are prioritizing it and bumping

2856
03:18:45,713 --> 03:18:48,553
something else down the road. So my question would be

2857
03:18:48,734 --> 03:18:51,353
within that context, um, what is going to have to

2858
03:18:51,374 --> 03:18:56,153
wait if this work, this, this package of work is

2859
03:18:56,193 --> 03:19:02,411
completed ahead of other scheduled work. C. S. Smith. Yes.

2860
03:19:02,411 --> 03:19:05,451
And through the chair, yeah, certainly wouldn't be a report,

2861
03:19:05,451 --> 03:19:06,731
at least as a reads right now that I would

2862
03:19:06,731 --> 03:19:08,731
be able to bring back next cycle. This would be

2863
03:19:08,731 --> 03:19:10,891
something that, uh, I think to the point around in

2864
03:19:10,891 --> 03:19:14,731
terms of even from a, uh, financial analysis standpoint, I'm

2865
03:19:14,752 --> 03:19:18,531
really leaning on actually looking into the 2027 budget. I

2866
03:19:18,531 --> 03:19:20,371
think to that most of my orderlier point, I think

2867
03:19:20,592 --> 03:19:24,411
there's some, you know, the request made is say preclude

2868
03:19:24,912 --> 03:19:28,411
that came after the more so the analysis on the

2869
03:19:28,672 --> 03:19:32,011
unit counts would be a hundred percent a consideration when

2870
03:19:32,011 --> 03:19:35,611
it goes into the 2027 budget process pertain to anything

2871
03:19:35,872 --> 03:19:38,891
further advancing the long point road work. So I think

2872
03:19:38,891 --> 03:19:41,211
we have the benefit of time right now as it

2873
03:19:41,251 --> 03:19:44,011
relates to the existing budget that's been approved. The existing

2874
03:19:44,432 --> 03:19:47,931
value engineering exercise that we still need to, uh, to

2875
03:19:47,952 --> 03:19:50,691
complete on this, uh, on this project. And that'd be

2876
03:19:50,691 --> 03:19:52,331
my hope is I'd be more so something that we

2877
03:19:52,331 --> 03:19:54,171
would have to go into a new term at Council

2878
03:19:54,672 --> 03:19:58,571
into 2027 in conjunction with any further ask that may

2879
03:19:58,571 --> 03:20:00,651
be required as a relates to budgets. So I would

2880
03:20:00,691 --> 03:20:03,051
not be able to bring anything back probably likely within

2881
03:20:03,051 --> 03:20:06,091
this with term pertaining to it. Um, it would have

2882
03:20:06,131 --> 03:20:08,571
to be something that we factor in as part of

2883
03:20:08,611 --> 03:20:13,702
our 27 budget deliberations. Follow up, Madam Mayor. Yes. Thank

2884
03:20:13,702 --> 03:20:15,222
you. Through the chair, if I may have a follow

2885
03:20:15,222 --> 03:20:17,862
up then directed to manager Kershaw in terms of the

2886
03:20:17,963 --> 03:20:22,982
operations portion of this ask, um, again, the same question,

2887
03:20:23,323 --> 03:20:25,942
how much staff time would be involved in producing the

2888
03:20:25,942 --> 03:20:30,502
answers to this given the acknowledgement from staff that so

2889
03:20:30,502 --> 03:20:32,502
many of the pieces of the puzzle do move and

2890
03:20:32,502 --> 03:20:35,862
some of the, it's not an easy. I think it

2891
03:20:35,862 --> 03:20:38,342
was Apple's. You said it was an apples to apples

2892
03:20:38,603 --> 03:20:42,262
that the comparison and what projects on our, on our

2893
03:20:42,302 --> 03:20:44,262
operation staff are now going to have to be put

2894
03:20:44,302 --> 03:20:47,462
on hold while this information gets bumped up the queue.

2895
03:20:49,264 --> 03:20:51,803
Major Kershaw. Go ahead. First off the cue would be

2896
03:20:51,824 --> 03:20:56,283
I'd have to delay the third party, the valued engineering

2897
03:20:56,384 --> 03:21:00,443
assignment or the third party review. And one of the,

2898
03:21:00,443 --> 03:21:03,403
I just want to note in here, uh, we were

2899
03:21:03,443 --> 03:21:07,563
planning on doing a third party review or a valued

2900
03:21:07,603 --> 03:21:11,063
engineering assignment, not both. I see you had and, uh,

2901
03:21:11,664 --> 03:21:13,883
so it would be one or the other. So that

2902
03:21:13,923 --> 03:21:19,083
would definitely be bumped. It's a heavy workload to produce

2903
03:21:19,123 --> 03:21:22,363
this. Uh, and it's also planning Staff. I'll be spending

2904
03:21:22,403 --> 03:21:24,683
a lot of time with planning staff. This is going

2905
03:21:24,683 --> 03:21:28,443
to, to land on my shoulders. So I've got a

2906
03:21:28,443 --> 03:21:30,523
few capital projects that are on the goal right now

2907
03:21:31,424 --> 03:21:37,524
that, uh, we'll end up being delayed. And. It's not

2908
03:21:37,705 --> 03:21:41,970
doable in the, in the next couple council cycles. To

2909
03:21:41,991 --> 03:21:47,020
be honest. Okay. Thank you, Chair. Okay. Thank you, Madam

2910
03:21:47,020 --> 03:21:50,536
Mayor. Uh, Mr. Deputy Mayor, go ahead. Uh, thank you.

2911
03:21:50,576 --> 03:21:52,776
Just listen to the conversation. I think we're all, we

2912
03:21:52,816 --> 03:21:54,856
all want the same thing. We want a financial roadmap

2913
03:21:54,957 --> 03:21:57,896
that's going to give us good operational infrastructures. We move

2914
03:21:57,896 --> 03:22:02,216
forward. That being said, to me, this, the motion is,

2915
03:22:02,216 --> 03:22:03,496
this is some good elements here that we need the

2916
03:22:03,496 --> 03:22:06,616
information on. But I think we're being far too prescriptive.

2917
03:22:06,616 --> 03:22:07,816
And I haven't even had a chance to review it.

2918
03:22:07,816 --> 03:22:10,176
It's hard to just looking at it on screen. We

2919
03:22:10,176 --> 03:22:11,816
haven't had the benefit of reviewing it ahead of time

2920
03:22:12,237 --> 03:22:14,616
or the Public reviewing it for that matter as well.

2921
03:22:14,616 --> 03:22:18,696
So there's just too much in here for me to

2922
03:22:18,736 --> 03:22:22,408
be able to support the full motion. We, if we

2923
03:22:22,669 --> 03:22:26,008
could split dissections, but then we'd be here for another

2924
03:22:26,029 --> 03:22:29,848
two hours. So it's, it's not a matter of putting

2925
03:22:29,949 --> 03:22:32,088
extra work on staff because if it does, it takes

2926
03:22:32,128 --> 03:22:34,168
the time. But this is something that's going to be

2927
03:22:34,168 --> 03:22:38,968
looked at through the 2027 capital project anyways. Um, so

2928
03:22:39,149 --> 03:22:42,488
having those, uh, true numbers on allocation, having the true

2929
03:22:42,488 --> 03:22:46,568
numbers on asset management, uh, and the reserves, like even

2930
03:22:46,568 --> 03:22:50,888
looking at the five year increments of five, five years,

2931
03:22:50,888 --> 03:22:54,328
five to 10 years. That's usually community stretch out a

2932
03:22:54,328 --> 03:22:56,328
little bit further than that beyond 25 years. They look

2933
03:22:56,328 --> 03:22:59,528
to a 50 year Bilbo at the, at their end

2934
03:22:59,568 --> 03:23:03,928
result. So I agree. We shouldn't have, you know, we

2935
03:23:03,928 --> 03:23:06,568
shouldn't have any overlap duplication. It should be true numbers

2936
03:23:06,669 --> 03:23:09,608
that we need to work with. But doing this report,

2937
03:23:09,608 --> 03:23:12,488
pushing off the value engineering, um, or third party review

2938
03:23:12,488 --> 03:23:15,448
of projects that are already approved in the queue for

2939
03:23:15,549 --> 03:23:21,328
capital concerns me. Um, so I'd like to know, I

2940
03:23:21,328 --> 03:23:25,838
guess from the mover. There's too much information here for

2941
03:23:25,878 --> 03:23:27,838
Staff to be able to take it back digested, even

2942
03:23:27,838 --> 03:23:29,838
for the Public and even for council right now to

2943
03:23:29,838 --> 03:23:34,958
be able to give a true vote on this, from

2944
03:23:34,958 --> 03:23:37,198
my opinion at this point. So I guess to the,

2945
03:23:37,238 --> 03:23:39,518
through the chair to the mover is looking at this

2946
03:23:39,939 --> 03:23:42,638
as a totality, was this something that you were looking

2947
03:23:42,638 --> 03:23:46,718
at through the capital project and was it anticipated that

2948
03:23:46,979 --> 03:23:51,598
the third party value engineering would be delayed. Council Porter.

2949
03:23:53,115 --> 03:23:56,654
Through the chair, uh, to the Deputy Mayor, no, I

2950
03:23:56,654 --> 03:23:59,894
wasn't anticipating it would be delayed. You can do whatever

2951
03:24:00,075 --> 03:24:03,414
you want. I would personally think the value engineering would

2952
03:24:03,454 --> 03:24:07,014
be, would be better. I purposely did not put a

2953
03:24:07,054 --> 03:24:11,014
date for it to be returned because I respect that.

2954
03:24:11,014 --> 03:24:13,174
It's just that I think when we do something like

2955
03:24:13,195 --> 03:24:16,214
this, we have to work with a set of solid

2956
03:24:16,395 --> 03:24:21,094
numbers. Solid numbers for what are we paying for that's

2957
03:24:21,094 --> 03:24:24,871
required today. Within a year. And what are you wanting

2958
03:24:24,892 --> 03:24:27,031
us to pay for that you're not looking that there

2959
03:24:27,052 --> 03:24:30,071
isn't going to be, um, users for 20 years. It

2960
03:24:30,111 --> 03:24:32,791
needs to be separated out. It needs to be separated

2961
03:24:33,052 --> 03:24:38,871
out, as you say, what is, um, refurbishment versus new.

2962
03:24:38,871 --> 03:24:43,591
And we don't know that right now. So, um, we,

2963
03:24:43,591 --> 03:24:47,351
and we also, it just says there's no way is

2964
03:24:47,351 --> 03:24:49,111
transparent to the public how that's going to hit their

2965
03:24:49,212 --> 03:24:51,874
pocketbook. And that's not fair. I mean, I shouldn't have

2966
03:24:51,874 --> 03:24:57,670
to figure it out using a spreadsheet. And think about

2967
03:24:58,331 --> 03:25:02,150
how that, and it's put there. And it should come

2968
03:25:02,171 --> 03:25:05,230
towards the budget because if that's what it's going to

2969
03:25:05,230 --> 03:25:06,630
cost is going to be trade - offs because you

2970
03:25:06,630 --> 03:25:09,190
can't have everything because you're going to be hitting 25,

2971
03:25:09,190 --> 03:25:13,756
30 percent tax increase. So it wasn't meant to delay

2972
03:25:13,796 --> 03:25:16,156
the value engineering. As I see the value in that

2973
03:25:16,177 --> 03:25:22,316
at this time as opposed to retrospectively. So, but we,

2974
03:25:22,316 --> 03:25:25,116
and I'm happy, I think we need to know these

2975
03:25:25,156 --> 03:25:28,556
things going in. The new council, whoever sits here, needs

2976
03:25:28,596 --> 03:25:32,879
to know these things going into the budget. Because I

2977
03:25:32,879 --> 03:25:35,679
think we sort of, in some ways I see it's

2978
03:25:35,719 --> 03:25:38,799
from blind faith that it will be okay. Well, that

2979
03:25:38,839 --> 03:25:42,108
went out the window last year on December 15th. So

2980
03:25:42,129 --> 03:25:45,548
this is one way we have a set of numbers.

2981
03:25:45,548 --> 03:25:48,668
If the numbers change, then that's a variance to the

2982
03:25:48,689 --> 03:25:52,108
project. So that's what I'm looking at. And I purposely

2983
03:25:52,209 --> 03:25:54,428
didn't put a date because the budget won't come to

2984
03:25:54,428 --> 03:25:56,428
the new year. So it gives you lots of time.

2985
03:25:57,399 --> 03:26:01,585
Pollo up, uh, Mr. Deputy Mayor. Uh, no, and I,

2986
03:26:01,585 --> 03:26:04,185
and I, and I get that. And I, this is

2987
03:26:04,185 --> 03:26:06,225
something that we'll be looked at through the 2027 capital

2988
03:26:06,265 --> 03:26:09,585
budget. And we're using actual numbers. You need to, otherwise

2989
03:26:09,585 --> 03:26:12,225
we can't do a true financial road wrapper who has

2990
03:26:12,225 --> 03:26:15,665
ever, um, planning for the next four, eight, 12 years

2991
03:26:15,705 --> 03:26:17,985
out. It's just there's, I think there's too much in

2992
03:26:18,086 --> 03:26:21,505
this motion to be able to even, um, for Staff

2993
03:26:21,545 --> 03:26:24,145
to tackle it. There's, there's a lot of great key

2994
03:26:24,246 --> 03:26:26,385
points and numbers that we need to get. But I

2995
03:26:26,385 --> 03:26:31,265
think the verbal doesn't need to be there or is

2996
03:26:31,305 --> 03:26:35,025
confusing or contradictory. Or even at the, even looking at,

2997
03:26:35,025 --> 03:26:40,465
um, financial long - term debt facilities is that on

2998
03:26:40,465 --> 03:26:43,185
today's number, is that an assumption it won't be built

2999
03:26:43,286 --> 03:26:46,065
for two years. And so we're adding 10 percent of

3000
03:26:46,105 --> 03:26:49,265
your compounding per year. Once we get to 60 percent

3001
03:26:49,305 --> 03:26:51,665
engineering with the scope of the project changed. So I

3002
03:26:51,705 --> 03:26:54,065
don't, I want to make sure we have the right

3003
03:26:54,086 --> 03:26:56,625
numbers in there. Of course, for the, um, allocation of

3004
03:26:56,726 --> 03:27:01,425
houses, the allocations of water, um, looking at like some

3005
03:27:01,465 --> 03:27:02,945
great key points. And here's where we go further down

3006
03:27:02,985 --> 03:27:05,025
into the motion. There's just, I think too many things

3007
03:27:05,366 --> 03:27:07,745
that may conflict with each other. If you pull down

3008
03:27:07,785 --> 03:27:13,121
a little bit further, um. Even, uh, The Bill now

3009
03:27:13,222 --> 03:27:17,361
versus Bilder's growth, as Allison said, you know, it's not,

3010
03:27:17,361 --> 03:27:19,761
it's not an off the shelf plug and play situation

3011
03:27:20,182 --> 03:27:22,001
when we're looking at trunk lines. You need to have

3012
03:27:22,502 --> 03:27:27,361
that in place. Um, and then this, this section I

3013
03:27:27,361 --> 03:27:29,921
think is going to be, um, is going to be

3014
03:27:29,921 --> 03:27:33,601
greatly affected by timing. So we're, we're now seeing at

3015
03:27:33,641 --> 03:27:36,321
August about the time you do the capital budget. Then

3016
03:27:36,321 --> 03:27:38,721
you look at by the time this is actually built,

3017
03:27:38,721 --> 03:27:42,321
I think the numbers won't be accurate. And then that,

3018
03:27:42,321 --> 03:27:43,841
we're going to get ourselves into a scenario where we

3019
03:27:43,841 --> 03:27:46,721
need to have the full at least 60 percent class

3020
03:27:47,382 --> 03:27:51,841
engineering we're at as well as, uh, what scope and

3021
03:27:51,881 --> 03:27:55,921
range. And then prioritization of those seven capital, uh, the

3022
03:27:55,921 --> 03:27:58,961
scopes with, sorry, the seven scope priorities within that capital

3023
03:27:59,001 --> 03:28:01,681
project. So I think the few things that we, they

3024
03:28:01,681 --> 03:28:04,081
won't be able to do. And I don't want to,

3025
03:28:04,081 --> 03:28:07,261
this to come back, especially to a new council. And

3026
03:28:07,702 --> 03:28:11,601
with confusion, I think a well - rounded capital budget

3027
03:28:11,622 --> 03:28:14,401
plan coming forward. I think Staffs heard everything we need

3028
03:28:14,502 --> 03:28:18,241
to see or whatever council needs to see. So I

3029
03:28:18,241 --> 03:28:20,321
think that is just a little bit too much in

3030
03:28:20,321 --> 03:28:25,780
here. On a carryover basis going to this capital budget.

3031
03:28:25,780 --> 03:28:28,260
It's just, just, just my opinion. Okay. Thank you, Mr.

3032
03:28:28,281 --> 03:28:34,025
Deputy Mayor. I'm going to go to Councillor Maxwell. Thank

3033
03:28:34,065 --> 03:28:37,879
you, Chair. Anyway, I'm going to give you the reasons

3034
03:28:37,980 --> 03:28:42,396
why I support this. And I wish you actually had

3035
03:28:42,497 --> 03:28:47,276
more in. But anyway, okay. So the reason I'm supporting

3036
03:28:47,297 --> 03:28:51,116
this is I think we, a lot of us were

3037
03:28:51,116 --> 03:28:54,716
at the, you know, all candidates meeting. And the Public

3038
03:28:56,417 --> 03:29:03,676
and the taxpayers are asking, you know, for greater oversight

3039
03:29:05,217 --> 03:29:08,796
on the delivery of projects. And they want to stress

3040
03:29:08,836 --> 03:29:11,216
test on these things. They want us to put them

3041
03:29:11,256 --> 03:29:14,816
under the maker scope and they do not want another

3042
03:29:16,277 --> 03:29:20,377
boondoggle like the ice time. And so anyway, this is

3043
03:29:20,377 --> 03:29:24,857
why I'm supporting this because this is putting everybody's feet

3044
03:29:24,857 --> 03:29:30,488
to the fire. So that we can get. You know,

3045
03:29:30,488 --> 03:29:36,660
a project delivered. That meet maximum stress test. That's really

3046
03:29:36,660 --> 03:29:39,620
what it's about. This reminds me of the financial breakdown

3047
03:29:39,721 --> 03:29:43,060
we had in 2008 when the feds brought in, this

3048
03:29:43,060 --> 03:29:45,408
stress test on the banks. You know, you got to

3049
03:29:45,408 --> 03:29:47,568
do these things. So anyway, I'm just going to leave

3050
03:29:47,608 --> 03:29:50,528
it at that. But that's, I'm supporting this motion. Thank

3051
03:29:50,568 --> 03:29:56,123
you. Thank you Councillor. Uh, Councillor Hope. Thank you, Chair

3052
03:29:56,123 --> 03:29:59,563
McKinley. And thank you again to Councillor Porter for this

3053
03:29:59,584 --> 03:30:02,643
motion. Um, and I'm certainly going to support it. I

3054
03:30:02,643 --> 03:30:05,083
was the seconder as well. I'm wondering if, uh, it

3055
03:30:05,083 --> 03:30:08,843
would be useful that since we're not far from lunchtime,

3056
03:30:08,843 --> 03:30:12,268
that this motion be printed out. So that everyone can

3057
03:30:12,369 --> 03:30:14,908
see it. Um, I listen very carefully because I was

3058
03:30:14,908 --> 03:30:17,868
thinking there was a lot of boxes being ticked off

3059
03:30:18,449 --> 03:30:22,388
for me. So, uh, as I heard the motion, I

3060
03:30:22,529 --> 03:30:25,068
could roll along with it. So I think that for

3061
03:30:25,169 --> 03:30:27,468
those, I don't think it's confusing when you have a

3062
03:30:27,468 --> 03:30:30,188
chance to, to look at it, uh, and I don't

3063
03:30:30,188 --> 03:30:32,908
think it, so the fact that it's long doesn't change

3064
03:30:32,929 --> 03:30:36,828
the fact that it's meaningful and important. And I agree

3065
03:30:37,249 --> 03:30:43,048
absolutely with Councillor Maxwell. We're all rightly so. You know,

3066
03:30:43,048 --> 03:30:49,677
the Public wants due diligence oversight. And numbers that are

3067
03:30:49,717 --> 03:30:52,931
real. So I see that what Councillor Porters put together

3068
03:30:53,352 --> 03:30:57,811
is going to provide us with this with just that.

3069
03:30:57,811 --> 03:31:01,091
So that's why I am on the motion and I

3070
03:31:01,091 --> 03:31:03,571
hope that this has passed because I think it's a

3071
03:31:03,571 --> 03:31:09,245
really important initiative to get things straightened out. Um, what

3072
03:31:09,245 --> 03:31:15,245
I'm also, um, keenly aware of is the complexity of

3073
03:31:15,426 --> 03:31:20,497
this project. Given the background of Bay Street and the

3074
03:31:20,497 --> 03:31:26,177
fact that the KPMG review talked about the complexity of

3075
03:31:26,278 --> 03:31:31,137
a three scope program, let alone a seven scope program.

3076
03:31:31,137 --> 03:31:34,737
If I, if I've got the analogies right, and the

3077
03:31:34,737 --> 03:31:38,497
fact that based on what KPMG has said, we really

3078
03:31:38,537 --> 03:31:42,177
do need to up our game in a huge way

3079
03:31:43,318 --> 03:31:46,337
on our, our ability to deliver capital projects. So we

3080
03:31:46,337 --> 03:31:50,257
don't have a directive operations, which I know the CAO

3081
03:31:50,297 --> 03:31:54,497
is carefully pursuing. How are we going to handle capital

3082
03:31:54,497 --> 03:31:57,537
projects as even up in the air? There's, there's so

3083
03:31:57,537 --> 03:32:01,217
much, uh, to consider, uh, in terms of the other

3084
03:32:01,398 --> 03:32:04,797
side, on the implementation side. And we've been given, uh,

3085
03:32:05,158 --> 03:32:09,137
through KPMG, we've been given a very close, um, review

3086
03:32:09,177 --> 03:32:12,497
of what council needs to ask for and what staff

3087
03:32:12,518 --> 03:32:16,177
needs to be pursuing in terms of stage gates and

3088
03:32:16,177 --> 03:32:18,817
all the elements that they need to, uh, to be

3089
03:32:18,817 --> 03:32:21,777
looking at. So in terms of looking at this project

3090
03:32:22,118 --> 03:32:27,857
from a timing perspective, I would argue we're in basic

3091
03:32:27,878 --> 03:32:33,365
team building process. And that takes time. As well. Um,

3092
03:32:33,486 --> 03:32:37,705
so, and we, and as council and certainly under the

3093
03:32:37,726 --> 03:32:40,665
gun from the Public, we need to follow that KPMG

3094
03:32:40,686 --> 03:32:43,865
report. And whatever amount of time that takes, all the

3095
03:32:43,865 --> 03:32:46,505
recommendations that have come from that report as well. So

3096
03:32:48,286 --> 03:32:52,005
this motion, one part of the complexity, we've got, uh,

3097
03:32:52,286 --> 03:32:55,305
number of elements to unravel, but I think that this

3098
03:32:55,326 --> 03:32:58,025
is the next place to start by ensuring we have

3099
03:32:58,065 --> 03:33:02,505
the right numbers. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Manager Kershaw.

3100
03:33:02,505 --> 03:33:05,793
You indicated you'd like to respond. I did through you,

3101
03:33:05,793 --> 03:33:08,033
Mr. Chair. So when we look at the breakdown between

3102
03:33:08,534 --> 03:33:12,193
asset replacement and DC reserves, that'll come through the budget

3103
03:33:12,374 --> 03:33:15,713
process. We do a fairly thorough investigation when we're looking

3104
03:33:15,753 --> 03:33:19,953
at replacing assets, whether they're supporting growth or whether we're

3105
03:33:19,993 --> 03:33:24,513
just replacing the asset. So that section as to what

3106
03:33:24,534 --> 03:33:28,433
portion is asset replacement or our existing users are paying

3107
03:33:28,473 --> 03:33:35,313
for what is for new users will be done, that

3108
03:33:35,313 --> 03:33:37,553
that exercise is done through the budget process. That's all

3109
03:33:37,553 --> 03:33:40,193
I wanted to add. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. C.

3110
03:33:40,193 --> 03:33:45,277
A. Smith. Through the chair, just to be clear as

3111
03:33:45,317 --> 03:33:48,077
it relates to, you know, as it relates to kind

3112
03:33:48,077 --> 03:33:51,757
of a strong project management framework and methodology underpinning this

3113
03:33:51,778 --> 03:33:54,157
project, I think my concern, and as I noted earlier,

3114
03:33:54,258 --> 03:33:57,917
it doesn't really necessarily go into the analysis side on

3115
03:33:57,917 --> 03:34:00,717
the financial piece, which a hundred percent agree as when

3116
03:34:00,717 --> 03:34:03,517
we look at coming to budget and how this project's

3117
03:34:03,557 --> 03:34:05,117
going to unfold. We're going to want to capture all

3118
03:34:05,117 --> 03:34:07,677
that for, for council. And I think as I know,

3119
03:34:07,677 --> 03:34:10,317
I think that is, that is good information. It's more

3120
03:34:10,338 --> 03:34:12,797
so around the body of work going into all these

3121
03:34:12,898 --> 03:34:17,357
previous studies to which I can definitively say right now,

3122
03:34:17,357 --> 03:34:19,357
I don't believe the outcome is going to result and

3123
03:34:19,357 --> 03:34:21,517
to say, Oh wow, you know, based on these assumptions

3124
03:34:21,618 --> 03:34:23,757
that we are now looking at the fact that we

3125
03:34:23,797 --> 03:34:25,757
don't need to look at the lift station or we

3126
03:34:25,757 --> 03:34:28,237
don't need to do that gravity sewer. That's my concern

3127
03:34:28,237 --> 03:34:30,237
with the body of it is to say it's not

3128
03:34:30,418 --> 03:34:33,437
going to definitively change what this scope is, is looking

3129
03:34:33,477 --> 03:34:36,797
like we have to rely on the current assessments that

3130
03:34:36,818 --> 03:34:41,677
we have. And if the difference, even of say zero

3131
03:34:41,717 --> 03:34:44,557
to a hundred units around those forecasts that once again

3132
03:34:44,818 --> 03:34:47,397
will not be in the grand scheme of things, a

3133
03:34:47,397 --> 03:34:50,797
major change as a relation to the overall overall design.

3134
03:34:50,797 --> 03:34:53,757
So that's really what I just want to reinforce on

3135
03:34:53,778 --> 03:34:56,397
what's, you know, practical or what could be done within.

3136
03:34:56,397 --> 03:34:58,397
I think that's relevant for the purpose of moving this

3137
03:34:58,418 --> 03:35:01,757
project forward in a, in a way that's reflective of,

3138
03:35:01,757 --> 03:35:04,317
I think, our fiscal capacity, which I think the, the,

3139
03:35:04,317 --> 03:35:08,077
the blow sections of the resolution do address. It's just

3140
03:35:08,077 --> 03:35:10,557
more so, I think the, the deep dive around the

3141
03:35:10,658 --> 03:35:14,357
various studies, which managed your Kershaw's point. It's going to

3142
03:35:14,357 --> 03:35:16,957
require other staff, particularly in the planning side. And I'm

3143
03:35:16,957 --> 03:35:21,553
just wary of what that outcome will ultimately be. Okay.

3144
03:35:21,553 --> 03:35:26,600
Thank you, CEO Smith. Councillor Ardell. You have not spoken

3145
03:35:26,701 --> 03:35:31,018
yet. So you have the floor. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

3146
03:35:31,018 --> 03:35:35,391
And no. And, uh, and this is very complex. And

3147
03:35:35,492 --> 03:35:38,271
I know when we started our term, there was some

3148
03:35:38,612 --> 03:35:44,001
complex. Concepts that happened in the term before us. And

3149
03:35:44,001 --> 03:35:47,861
then we were having to face them ourselves. And then

3150
03:35:48,922 --> 03:35:52,981
we got criticized for them. And it wasn't our doing.

3151
03:35:52,981 --> 03:35:56,341
So depending on who's going to be sitting at this

3152
03:35:56,341 --> 03:36:01,061
table next could be nobody or it could be some.

3153
03:36:01,061 --> 03:36:04,421
And I wouldn't want to have the same scenario roll

3154
03:36:04,421 --> 03:36:09,381
out for them as well. So I think having this,

3155
03:36:09,482 --> 03:36:12,421
this motion here, it is very complex. I would like

3156
03:36:12,461 --> 03:36:15,301
to break for lunch soon and maybe have it read

3157
03:36:15,341 --> 03:36:18,621
over it at lunchtime and then bring it back. So

3158
03:36:18,621 --> 03:36:22,661
we get a thorough understanding of what it does do.

3159
03:36:22,661 --> 03:36:26,821
But I, I wouldn't want to approve something that all

3160
03:36:26,861 --> 03:36:31,136
of a sudden then we get blamed for it. Because,

3161
03:36:31,136 --> 03:36:33,456
Oh, that was the old council or we didn't do

3162
03:36:33,477 --> 03:36:36,336
our due diligence. And I want to make sure we

3163
03:36:36,437 --> 03:36:39,616
are doing our due diligence because we are all taxpayers

3164
03:36:39,637 --> 03:36:41,856
or we wouldn't be sitting at this table. So we

3165
03:36:41,957 --> 03:36:45,616
want to make sure that we're going about it at

3166
03:36:45,717 --> 03:36:50,816
the right way and timeframes. And when I read The

3167
03:36:50,856 --> 03:36:54,336
Whole Thing, I quickly went down and reread it again.

3168
03:36:54,336 --> 03:36:58,016
But there was no timeframe on it. So that's why,

3169
03:36:58,016 --> 03:37:00,736
um, I think then we can give this some real

3170
03:37:00,776 --> 03:37:05,696
good, um, thought. And, you know, really go over it

3171
03:37:05,736 --> 03:37:08,496
with a fine - toothed comb. And then I know

3172
03:37:08,677 --> 03:37:13,056
of that delays the third party or the value engineering.

3173
03:37:13,056 --> 03:37:17,456
So it be. We brought in value engineering at the

3174
03:37:17,456 --> 03:37:20,816
end of another project. So let's just get this right

3175
03:37:20,856 --> 03:37:25,376
for the taxpayers in the town. And, uh, yeah, I,

3176
03:37:25,376 --> 03:37:28,816
I will be supporting this as well. It's just that

3177
03:37:29,237 --> 03:37:32,096
we need to make sure we're doing everything that we

3178
03:37:32,136 --> 03:37:36,700
can for the taxpayers. Thank you, Councillor Del. Uh, CAO

3179
03:37:36,740 --> 03:37:41,008
Smith. Through the chair, just being cognizant at the time.

3180
03:37:41,008 --> 03:37:43,408
And we still have quite a heavy agenda on the

3181
03:37:43,589 --> 03:37:46,688
PDS side of things too. It's a suggestion around potentially

3182
03:37:46,709 --> 03:37:49,808
amending it to allow for at the Council meeting, give

3183
03:37:49,989 --> 03:37:51,648
it a, you know, a bit of time and perhaps

3184
03:37:51,829 --> 03:37:54,448
be it for, for the mover as well as with

3185
03:37:54,488 --> 03:37:58,768
respect to amending it simply to allow for, for that

3186
03:37:58,808 --> 03:38:02,768
motion, be brought forward at council versus having to further

3187
03:38:02,949 --> 03:38:05,408
deliberate on this. Just ensure that we can keep on

3188
03:38:05,429 --> 03:38:08,048
moving as a release. All the various items that we

3189
03:38:08,309 --> 03:38:10,856
do need to address today. And that is next week.

3190
03:38:14,330 --> 03:38:17,509
Sorry. The, the following week. Yeah. Two weeks. Sorry. Two

3191
03:38:17,549 --> 03:38:22,549
weeks. Yes. Councillor Porter. I'm quite happy to bring the

3192
03:38:22,549 --> 03:38:25,749
motion forward at Council as long as I, I'm able

3193
03:38:25,749 --> 03:38:28,309
to do that. I, they say I get first refusals.

3194
03:38:29,254 --> 03:38:31,473
So it will still be my motion. But I'm happy

3195
03:38:31,574 --> 03:38:34,769
taking away and rework it. I'm happy to put it

3196
03:38:34,809 --> 03:38:38,842
out so you can put it on the agenda. Okay.

3197
03:38:38,842 --> 03:38:41,242
Thank you for that council reporter. I have no problem

3198
03:38:41,242 --> 03:38:46,330
with that myself. Matt, I'm Deputy Clerk. Procedurally. How do

3199
03:38:46,330 --> 03:38:51,530
we proceed procedurally? How do we proceed with deferring emotion

3200
03:38:51,631 --> 03:38:57,938
this motion to, Pardon. Thank you, Mr. Chair. So according

3201
03:38:57,959 --> 03:39:01,938
to the procedural bylaw, motion or mending motion maybe withdrawn

3202
03:39:01,938 --> 03:39:04,737
by the mover. Um, by the mover, sorry, with the

3203
03:39:04,777 --> 03:39:07,857
consent of the seconder at any time before the amendment

3204
03:39:07,897 --> 03:39:15,259
tour decision. Okay. Okay. Mr. Chair, sorry, Madam Deputy Clerk.

3205
03:39:15,259 --> 03:39:20,059
Can we not just defer B - 4 - 4

3206
03:39:20,320 --> 03:39:24,619
Craigli Water Treatment Plan upgrades represent design update OPS 26035.

3207
03:39:25,939 --> 03:39:29,518
To be heard at the September 8th Council meeting? Nothing

3208
03:39:29,558 --> 03:39:32,638
goes away. They don't pull back the motion. We're just

3209
03:39:32,638 --> 03:39:35,498
deferring the whole topic. I think that, is that, uh,

3210
03:39:35,939 --> 03:39:39,109
procedurally accurate. Um, I think it would work especially if

3211
03:39:39,149 --> 03:39:42,949
Council Pat U unanimously passed a motion to that effect.

3212
03:39:42,970 --> 03:39:46,709
Okay. So hearing that is the mover, does a mover

3213
03:39:46,749 --> 03:39:50,069
approve the deferral of this to for your motion to

3214
03:39:50,069 --> 03:39:53,769
carry over. Yes. And I can work with it. And

3215
03:39:53,769 --> 03:39:57,149
I'll bring forwards any, um, modifications to simplify. Thank you.

3216
03:39:57,410 --> 03:40:00,269
Okay. Thank you. And the seconder, I'm sorry, I can't

3217
03:40:00,290 --> 03:40:03,309
remember who the secondary is now. Oh, secondary is Councillor

3218
03:40:03,410 --> 03:40:07,869
Hope. Would you queue your mic and pontificate your acceptance

3219
03:40:07,869 --> 03:40:11,893
of that. I'll share my acceptance that's for sure. Thanks.

3220
03:40:12,074 --> 03:40:16,869
Okay. Thank you. So that being said, the motion will

3221
03:40:16,890 --> 03:40:20,229
just be that we, uh, item B 4. 4. Sorry,

3222
03:40:20,229 --> 03:40:22,709
Mr. Jarfeen, eh? I just have had some feedback from

3223
03:40:22,749 --> 03:40:25,509
the clerk. Um, so she would suggest a motion come

3224
03:40:25,549 --> 03:40:29,669
forward today for council for consideration at council. Otherwise it

3225
03:40:29,709 --> 03:40:35,408
could be rewarded. That's right. So confirmation from the clerk?

3226
03:40:35,408 --> 03:40:43,413
Yes. We have confirmation from Adam Clerk. So we have

3227
03:40:43,434 --> 03:40:47,333
item B 4. 4, Craigli Wastewater treatment plant upgrades 30

3228
03:40:47,373 --> 03:40:52,903
percent design update OPS dot three 035. That Council, the

3229
03:40:52,903 --> 03:40:56,363
Town Blue Mountains agrees to defer Agenda item B 4.

3230
03:40:56,403 --> 03:40:59,803
4 until the September 8th, 2026 Council meeting. Do I

3231
03:40:59,803 --> 03:41:03,897
have a mover. I'll move that. Move by Councillor Adele.

3232
03:41:03,897 --> 03:41:07,704
Second by Councillor Porter. You further discussion on that. Seeing

3233
03:41:07,744 --> 03:41:12,188
none. Adam Deputy Clerk, please call that vote. Thank you.

3234
03:41:12,188 --> 03:41:21,414
That vote is open. Affirmative for me. Thank you, Councillor

3235
03:41:21,435 --> 03:41:27,630
Maxwell. And that vote is closed. And that vote is

3236
03:41:27,811 --> 03:41:31,210
carried with all seven present voting in the affirmative. Now

3237
03:41:31,651 --> 03:41:35,470
it is seven after one. I'm going to call a

3238
03:41:35,651 --> 03:41:38,350
lunch break until one 45. Is that enough time for

3239
03:41:38,771 --> 03:41:42,330
staff. And everyone involved? Okay. Then we'll be on break

3240
03:41:42,351 --> 03:41:45,690
until 145. Thank you. Turn your microphones off and your

3241
03:41:45,690 --> 03:41:45,850
cameras.

3242
04:20:44,746 --> 04:20:49,371
It is 146. Councillor Maxwell if you take your seat

3243
04:20:49,552 --> 04:20:52,478
we'll be able to continue. We have a Corum.

3244
04:21:03,661 --> 04:21:06,339
All right. Madam Deputy Clerk we have a quorum of

3245
04:21:06,440 --> 04:21:08,299
council I will have you confirm that we have a

3246
04:21:08,299 --> 04:21:10,419
quorum of Council and we will move forward Thank you

3247
04:21:11,080 --> 04:21:13,779
Mr. Chair I confirm that we have a quorum of

3248
04:21:13,819 --> 04:21:17,299
Council Thank you Madam Deputy Clerk So we will move

3249
04:21:17,299 --> 04:21:20,019
on to item B 4. 5 which is extended work

3250
04:21:20,200 --> 04:21:28,179
hours TWA WATP Outfall OPS dot 26. 047 Manager Kershaw.

3251
04:21:29,566 --> 04:21:34,167
You have the floor. You Mr. Chair this report is

3252
04:21:34,207 --> 04:21:40,967
coming to Council for their information So our contractor who's

3253
04:21:40,967 --> 04:21:47,127
installing the outfall at the extension of grey road Grey

3254
04:21:47,167 --> 04:21:53,285
Street in Thornberry. Has asked for extended work hours The

3255
04:21:53,285 --> 04:22:03,285
extended work hours The municipal act permits bylaws to be

3256
04:22:03,325 --> 04:22:06,965
enforced within our municipal boundaries if the contractor is working

3257
04:22:07,786 --> 04:22:10,405
beyond our municipal boundary i. e. out in the water

3258
04:22:11,386 --> 04:22:15,205
Our municipal bylaws do not apply therefore our noise bylaw

3259
04:22:15,205 --> 04:22:18,645
does not apply Beyond the shoreline so the contractor will

3260
04:22:18,645 --> 04:22:22,485
be working Extended hours so that'll be from seven to

3261
04:22:22,525 --> 04:22:27,925
nine at night every night from Monday to Friday and

3262
04:22:27,946 --> 04:22:30,965
full day on Saturday and the half day on Sunday

3263
04:22:31,306 --> 04:22:35,759
as previously agreed. So this information this report is for

3264
04:22:36,020 --> 04:22:38,159
Council Information Please let me know if you have any

3265
04:22:38,180 --> 04:22:41,119
questions Thank you manager Khrushaw C. O. Smith did you

3266
04:22:41,119 --> 04:22:43,679
want to add anything before I Throw it open to

3267
04:22:44,100 --> 04:22:47,498
members of committee. No through the chair I decided to

3268
04:22:47,519 --> 04:22:49,978
this report I think it just emphasizes the criticality of

3269
04:22:50,079 --> 04:22:53,818
meeting that fisheries window and to ensure that At least

3270
04:22:53,919 --> 04:22:56,298
to the extent possible that we were able to avoid

3271
04:22:56,639 --> 04:22:59,578
having to extend this into another construction year where I

3272
04:22:59,578 --> 04:23:02,618
think all eager to have this project concluded and And

3273
04:23:02,879 --> 04:23:06,218
to have the site fully remediated into and to move

3274
04:23:06,258 --> 04:23:10,855
forward Thank you Okay Thank you Mr. CAO. Do we

3275
04:23:10,855 --> 04:23:13,255
have any questions for members of committee I don't see

3276
04:23:13,295 --> 04:23:19,941
any hands yet. Oh Councillor Porter go ahead. Yes, thank

3277
04:23:19,941 --> 04:23:25,381
you through the chair So just respect to The project.

3278
04:23:26,409 --> 04:23:32,323
And The outfall and the concerns around this. I just

3279
04:23:32,904 --> 04:23:36,223
want to guess no Is this the last ask. I

3280
04:23:36,223 --> 04:23:38,783
mean I think I think Bay Street residents have had

3281
04:23:38,823 --> 04:23:43,744
a lot. They have the road and there was the

3282
04:23:44,965 --> 04:23:50,144
out of hours working There's been concessions made on that

3283
04:23:50,565 --> 04:23:53,584
and yes I also understand The water is outside of

3284
04:23:53,624 --> 04:23:58,704
our municipal territory But as the construction is and our

3285
04:23:59,285 --> 04:24:02,784
The road construction is moving towards the intersection It's three

3286
04:24:02,824 --> 04:24:06,544
houses down Uh, from grey street now that compound thing

3287
04:24:06,584 --> 04:24:08,624
So I'm just wondering is there anything else that's going

3288
04:24:08,624 --> 04:24:11,024
to come out that they're going to be asked to

3289
04:24:11,205 --> 04:24:16,902
have to live with. That people can reasonably foresee. Yeah

3290
04:24:17,163 --> 04:24:20,102
through the chair I can serve Start and then manage

3291
04:24:20,102 --> 04:24:21,702
your Kershaw may be able to add on to it

3292
04:24:21,723 --> 04:24:24,102
And it's difficult to predict I mean the window that

3293
04:24:24,142 --> 04:24:27,782
we have right now to the to the September At

3294
04:24:27,782 --> 04:24:31,702
least September 25th date is the windows to which Uh

3295
04:24:31,803 --> 04:24:34,182
my hope is that Uh we would not need to

3296
04:24:34,283 --> 04:24:37,622
come back to Council on any further schedule changes or

3297
04:24:37,622 --> 04:24:40,262
anything of that nature But my commitment is more so

3298
04:24:40,283 --> 04:24:43,542
around that transparency and ensuring that both Council and Public

3299
04:24:43,643 --> 04:24:46,982
know if there are some other changes or any alterations

3300
04:24:47,163 --> 04:24:49,862
to schedule or means Uh related to the to the

3301
04:24:49,883 --> 04:24:53,302
project that we're fully communicating that and uh... Doing that

3302
04:24:53,723 --> 04:24:56,982
in a transparent fashion But perhaps manager Kershaw want to

3303
04:24:57,022 --> 04:25:01,979
add anything Uh... Further to those comments. Ministry you have

3304
04:25:01,979 --> 04:25:08,875
anything to add. Oh. You're. Yeah.

3305
04:25:14,037 --> 04:25:20,095
Microphone's not. On. There. We go. That one works. That

3306
04:25:20,095 --> 04:25:27,086
one. Through you Mr. Chair. No we will keep counsel

3307
04:25:27,107 --> 04:25:29,646
abreasted of what's going on with The construction on a

3308
04:25:29,646 --> 04:25:33,406
weekly basis However We don't anticipate any more ask So

3309
04:25:33,406 --> 04:25:36,526
I don't think there's in the day they could potentially

3310
04:25:36,547 --> 04:25:40,606
work We are having an information session of community information

3311
04:25:40,867 --> 04:25:43,966
session this Friday in the chambers from one till 230

3312
04:25:45,507 --> 04:25:47,966
And we'll be here to answer any questions The Public

3313
04:25:48,006 --> 04:25:51,326
may have But other than that I don't have a

3314
04:25:51,347 --> 04:25:54,446
crystal ball So I don't know what the future may

3315
04:25:54,486 --> 04:25:58,429
hold But I hope that they're no more ass. Okay.

3316
04:25:58,708 --> 04:26:02,351
Thank you. Manager Kershaw Follow - up Uh Council Reporter.

3317
04:26:03,850 --> 04:26:08,368
Not at this time. Okay Councillor Maxwell. Oh thanks I

3318
04:26:08,408 --> 04:26:10,768
just have a little question Go ahead Thank you Chair.

3319
04:26:12,113 --> 04:26:15,132
Do we have a duty to consult with First Nations

3320
04:26:15,172 --> 04:26:22,096
on this. Major Kershaw We have 3U Mr. Chair Through

3321
04:26:22,096 --> 04:26:25,696
the design The design of this We did thoroughly consult

3322
04:26:25,717 --> 04:26:30,656
with First Nations We sent out Notifications We shared within

3323
04:26:30,656 --> 04:26:35,856
the Marine Uhreen Archaeological Assessment The Land Archaeological Assessment Part

3324
04:26:35,896 --> 04:26:41,056
1 and Part 2 We reached out to about I'm

3325
04:26:41,056 --> 04:26:45,136
going to estimate about 15 First Nation Groups And that

3326
04:26:45,176 --> 04:26:47,296
some that we know are more active We did send

3327
04:26:47,336 --> 04:26:51,216
them registered letters And then additionally we did send out

3328
04:26:51,256 --> 04:26:55,696
some additional communication Um... Because we knew that they would

3329
04:26:55,736 --> 04:27:00,096
be interested in participating in some of the archaeological assessments

3330
04:27:00,757 --> 04:27:04,976
So we essentially we sent them a blank invoice and

3331
04:27:04,997 --> 04:27:06,736
said Tell us a cost for you to attend this

3332
04:27:07,397 --> 04:27:10,736
So First Nations were here They did witness The archaeological

3333
04:27:10,837 --> 04:27:15,216
assessments Uh stage 2 When we're doing the screening Um...

3334
04:27:15,216 --> 04:27:19,616
We have met our obligation Uh... Consult with First Nations.

3335
04:27:20,528 --> 04:27:24,027
Follow Up Council Maxwell No, that's fine Thank you Okay.

3336
04:27:25,420 --> 04:27:27,159
I don't see any other hands So we have a

3337
04:27:27,199 --> 04:27:31,719
recommended motion that Council receives Staff Report OPS 26. 047

3338
04:27:31,820 --> 04:27:37,079
entitled Extended Work Hours TWWTP Outfall for their information Do

3339
04:27:37,119 --> 04:27:39,479
I have a mover? I will move Move by the

3340
04:27:39,519 --> 04:27:44,958
mayor. Secondar Second by the Deputy Mayor. Seeing go further

3341
04:27:44,958 --> 04:27:47,278
hands Madam Deputy Clerk You may call that hope please

3342
04:27:47,459 --> 04:27:48,158
The vote is open.

3343
04:28:05,937 --> 04:28:10,338
Council Reporter Meiisist. Uh vote in the affirmative It hasn't

3344
04:28:10,378 --> 04:28:14,615
popped up yet Thank you that vote is close. And

3345
04:28:14,655 --> 04:28:17,735
that vote is carried with all seven members Present voting

3346
04:28:17,735 --> 04:28:21,356
in the affirmative. Thank you now We will move two

3347
04:28:21,396 --> 04:28:24,876
item B5 Public comment period regarding matters including The Operation

3348
04:28:25,217 --> 04:28:27,516
Portion of the meeting Each speaker is a lot of

3349
04:28:27,537 --> 04:28:30,876
three minutes These are Commons in response to what has

3350
04:28:31,057 --> 04:28:34,156
transpired so far I see one Please come up to

3351
04:28:34,156 --> 04:28:36,956
the microphone and state your name and address And you

3352
04:28:36,956 --> 04:28:43,261
have three minutes. Oh.

3353
04:28:50,015 --> 04:28:50,474
Momentarily.

3354
04:29:04,154 --> 04:29:07,520
You were red You're ready to go. Go ahead. My

3355
04:29:07,560 --> 04:29:10,160
name is Debbie Cross Gill and I'm from Clarksburg And

3356
04:29:10,200 --> 04:29:14,560
I want to speak to B - 42 The Drinking

3357
04:29:14,560 --> 04:29:19,131
Water. And B - 4 - 3 The Capacities Report

3358
04:29:20,352 --> 04:29:23,531
Um... With regard to the Drinking Water I want to

3359
04:29:23,632 --> 04:29:29,051
emphasize That this is a core service of this Municipality

3360
04:29:29,792 --> 04:29:33,211
It is essential that we have to have drinking water.

3361
04:29:34,705 --> 04:29:39,320
And that. In these days with climate change Et cetera

3362
04:29:40,461 --> 04:29:45,693
Water is not going to be unlimited. And even in

3363
04:29:45,733 --> 04:29:49,213
the report The Ms. Kershaw gave She was mentioning that

3364
04:29:49,554 --> 04:29:52,622
there could be a time. That The limit is happening

3365
04:29:52,662 --> 04:29:58,165
on that. Um. I also think it's very important when

3366
04:29:58,186 --> 04:30:04,325
you were discussing The PFAs And that Councillor Maxwell brought

3367
04:30:04,325 --> 04:30:09,685
up about The Microplastics Although it is not considered important

3368
04:30:09,725 --> 04:30:12,885
to do that at this time I would far rather

3369
04:30:12,906 --> 04:30:17,359
see money spent. On making sure that we were drinking

3370
04:30:17,780 --> 04:30:23,459
healthy water. That wasn't filled with microplastics or PFAs or

3371
04:30:23,499 --> 04:30:27,962
any other chemicals. Then spending it on some of the

3372
04:30:28,002 --> 04:30:32,602
other things I've seen Being asked of council to invest

3373
04:30:32,783 --> 04:30:38,881
money in. That's just My comment on that. Um I

3374
04:30:38,881 --> 04:30:42,867
think you missed an opportunity. In the capacity report with

3375
04:30:42,968 --> 04:30:49,195
regard to Ms. Kershaw mentioning about The irrigation. That is

3376
04:30:49,216 --> 04:30:54,316
a huge number. Of water that is being used for

3377
04:30:54,497 --> 04:31:00,948
something that is not a core service. Irrigation for lawns

3378
04:31:02,169 --> 04:31:08,545
is a want. I have had a lawn that this

3379
04:31:08,545 --> 04:31:13,048
year during this hot summer. I've never watered once. There's

3380
04:31:13,069 --> 04:31:20,265
no need for it. You could do a whole Environmental

3381
04:31:20,846 --> 04:31:26,298
Um... Component. Clover could be There are many drought resistant

3382
04:31:26,399 --> 04:31:30,858
plants that could be planted If people want a green

3383
04:31:30,879 --> 04:31:34,954
facade in front of their home Thank you. Thank you

3384
04:31:34,954 --> 04:31:38,087
Ms. Carlscope And you would be saving us money. Thank

3385
04:31:38,087 --> 04:31:43,888
you. From the other side of the room. To the

3386
04:31:43,888 --> 04:31:49,213
back. Yes Come up. No problem.

3387
04:31:59,829 --> 04:32:02,300
You're. Ready to go. You just have to state your

3388
04:32:02,300 --> 04:32:04,380
name and your address And uh... You have three minutes.

3389
04:32:05,119 --> 04:32:08,618
Alright My name's Aaron McLeod and I am from 200

3390
04:32:08,799 --> 04:32:11,447
Bay Street East. And I just wanted to comment on

3391
04:32:11,788 --> 04:32:18,285
the Grey Street Outfall pipe. So I have had a

3392
04:32:18,306 --> 04:32:21,645
front row seat to all the construction that's happening in

3393
04:32:21,645 --> 04:32:24,205
the water And there are definitely some concern I'm concerned

3394
04:32:24,245 --> 04:32:27,742
about these new hours that they've asked for. The first

3395
04:32:27,763 --> 04:32:32,302
time it was understandable because mistakes happened Projects fall behind

3396
04:32:33,043 --> 04:32:37,664
That's understandable. But the new hours They're very late in

3397
04:32:37,664 --> 04:32:40,784
the evening So 9 PM The Stark Wait What are

3398
04:32:40,784 --> 04:32:42,384
they going to do at that point? I have a

3399
04:32:42,405 --> 04:32:46,544
6 month old We are living with very loud construction

3400
04:32:46,805 --> 04:32:50,624
on both sides And he is not a fan We

3401
04:32:50,624 --> 04:32:53,264
are not a fan And it's not just during construction

3402
04:32:53,525 --> 04:32:57,744
hours Like the barge bangs against the waves during the

3403
04:32:57,744 --> 04:33:00,987
evenings and is very loud. I get that this needs

3404
04:33:00,987 --> 04:33:04,107
to happen We all want it done But at what

3405
04:33:04,208 --> 04:33:07,867
cost I mean I'm kind of going insane And my

3406
04:33:07,867 --> 04:33:12,654
baby's not liking it either. And also I think it's

3407
04:33:12,694 --> 04:33:14,814
a little concerning The amount of mistakes that they've made

3408
04:33:14,835 --> 04:33:20,014
Like I've watched them Like the silt barriers that failed

3409
04:33:20,054 --> 04:33:23,294
the first time The deep six contractors came to our

3410
04:33:23,294 --> 04:33:26,734
house and apologised And that was really nice But we

3411
04:33:26,774 --> 04:33:29,454
watched them build them out again And then this past

3412
04:33:29,494 --> 04:33:32,574
weekend fail again And now the styrofoam back on our

3413
04:33:32,595 --> 04:33:37,109
beach again So that is a concern. And I think

3414
04:33:37,109 --> 04:33:40,389
it's a little embarrassing for that company Because they are

3415
04:33:40,730 --> 04:33:44,469
a company that specializes in work across The country and

3416
04:33:44,469 --> 04:33:47,509
in oceans And they can't seem to understand Georgia M.

3417
04:33:47,509 --> 04:33:52,508
Bay waters. So I think there are a number of

3418
04:33:52,548 --> 04:33:57,548
problems And I just wonder if anyone's Uh, following up

3419
04:33:57,588 --> 04:34:00,988
with these issues And if there's anyone on site That

3420
04:34:01,329 --> 04:34:06,668
is monitoring The progress Because they are quite behind And

3421
04:34:06,689 --> 04:34:11,075
I want to know why that is. And because we

3422
04:34:11,176 --> 04:34:13,854
want it done. I mean And I don't want to

3423
04:34:13,854 --> 04:34:18,315
listen to it anymore. Um Yes that's what I have

3424
04:34:18,315 --> 04:34:24,227
to say. Thank you. Okay Thank you. Anyone else. In

3425
04:34:24,227 --> 04:34:32,247
the gallery. In response. Going once. Going twice. I will

3426
04:34:32,348 --> 04:34:35,207
close this portion and hand the chair back to The

3427
04:34:35,548 --> 04:34:38,781
mayor Thank you. Thank You Councillor McKinley So we are

3428
04:34:38,781 --> 04:34:40,621
now going to move on since we've just had our

3429
04:34:40,661 --> 04:34:42,621
lunch We're going to move on to planning and building

3430
04:34:42,962 --> 04:34:46,141
Uh which will be chaired by Councillor Hope and we

3431
04:34:46,181 --> 04:34:48,381
will continue to sit until we can clear off this

3432
04:34:48,381 --> 04:34:50,941
agenda We do not have the luxury of pushing items

3433
04:34:50,962 --> 04:34:53,901
to further Committee The holes at this point in the

3434
04:34:54,002 --> 04:34:57,021
end of term Because next The next committee The whole

3435
04:34:57,442 --> 04:35:00,621
section Uh the agenda is already full from things that

3436
04:35:00,642 --> 04:35:04,301
have been moved earlier So with that Let's get to

3437
04:35:04,301 --> 04:35:08,192
it and The chair is yours Councillor Hope. Yes, thank

3438
04:35:08,192 --> 04:35:12,421
you No pressure. Uh Welcome everyone to Planning and Building

3439
04:35:12,461 --> 04:35:16,821
Services Uh, we're going to start with B6 Deputations B.

3440
04:35:16,922 --> 04:35:21,621
6. 1 Rick Crouch Broker South Beast International Reen update

3441
04:35:21,621 --> 04:35:25,781
on the local housing market Um, Rick You have 10

3442
04:35:25,802 --> 04:35:31,861
minutes There'll be a ring at nine minutes And then

3443
04:35:31,901 --> 04:35:33,941
you'll know you have a minute left Plus the timer

3444
04:35:33,981 --> 04:35:36,981
you can see as well Thank you Good afternoon Honourable

3445
04:35:37,021 --> 04:35:39,381
Mayor and members of Kanzel Thanks for having me I'm

3446
04:35:39,642 --> 04:35:42,661
Rick Crouch I reside at 1. 11 Faircrest Lane and

3447
04:35:42,701 --> 04:35:47,301
Clerksburg And as the Council Remember mentions I am a

3448
04:35:47,301 --> 04:35:50,341
broker Wrestle Beach International Realty And I'm here on behalf

3449
04:35:50,762 --> 04:35:53,061
not only Sotheby's but of the one point association of

3450
04:35:53,082 --> 04:35:55,621
realtors Normally I don't use Notes But Stay I'm going

3451
04:35:55,621 --> 04:35:58,821
to make an exception Um Our members And first of

3452
04:35:58,821 --> 04:36:01,861
all a clarify We have 2700 members Uh... They are

3453
04:36:01,861 --> 04:36:05,781
not all local Our profession has gone through Um... Many

3454
04:36:06,042 --> 04:36:10,501
mergers So we cover The area from Guelph Owe to

3455
04:36:10,541 --> 04:36:14,261
here on Perth on the Lake Urin side Grey Bruce

3456
04:36:14,282 --> 04:36:17,621
Own Sound Including Bruce Peninsula Rhonda Bottom of the Bay

3457
04:36:17,642 --> 04:36:20,261
Here up through Midland Penetang all the way to Perry

3458
04:36:20,261 --> 04:36:22,901
Sound and then over into The Muscokas and part of

3459
04:36:22,922 --> 04:36:27,941
Halliburton Um... So our members in Aetymarket C housing every

3460
04:36:28,042 --> 04:36:30,581
day at the street level Uh... They work with young

3461
04:36:30,922 --> 04:36:33,061
families trying to enter the housing market the first time

3462
04:36:34,202 --> 04:36:37,061
Seniors may be looking to retire to this area Or

3463
04:36:37,082 --> 04:36:40,741
to perhaps downsize And we also work with local employers

3464
04:36:40,922 --> 04:36:44,741
that are concerned about The housing Uh... The available to

3465
04:36:44,762 --> 04:36:47,861
any workforce That they may have or are looking at

3466
04:36:48,042 --> 04:36:50,501
setting up in the area As well as we help

3467
04:36:51,162 --> 04:36:55,061
residents trying to continue to afford living in the community

3468
04:36:55,482 --> 04:36:58,021
And maybe it's also to expand to a larger house

3469
04:36:58,442 --> 04:37:01,541
or the elderly They're looking to downsize to something smaller

3470
04:37:02,202 --> 04:37:04,741
Um... Today I'd like to provide counsel Which is the

3471
04:37:04,741 --> 04:37:08,021
brief update on the local housing market Share some regional

3472
04:37:08,282 --> 04:37:12,661
Public opinion research that we had conducted And identified several

3473
04:37:12,682 --> 04:37:15,141
opportunities where we believe we can build on what The

3474
04:37:15,242 --> 04:37:20,581
Township here has already done to approve Housing affordability Uh...

3475
04:37:20,621 --> 04:37:22,821
So if I want to begin by just giving you

3476
04:37:22,821 --> 04:37:25,541
a brief look at The local housing market To give

3477
04:37:25,541 --> 04:37:27,541
you a better sense of where would the current market

3478
04:37:27,642 --> 04:37:30,981
is And we really have to go back to Uh...

3479
04:37:31,322 --> 04:37:34,501
Three or four years back to when Ontario went through

3480
04:37:34,522 --> 04:37:38,101
significant change Not only locally here and no alian Ontario

3481
04:37:38,442 --> 04:37:41,861
But across Canada And it basically started with the COVID

3482
04:37:41,901 --> 04:37:45,061
- 19 pandemic Uh... You know that triggered the whole

3483
04:37:45,242 --> 04:37:48,821
concept of working from home We saw mass influx of

3484
04:37:48,861 --> 04:37:52,421
people that were able to leave the GT area Move

3485
04:37:52,461 --> 04:37:54,981
up here Maybe it was to a home They already

3486
04:37:55,021 --> 04:37:58,341
owned as a secondary property or a weekend condo Uh...

3487
04:37:59,002 --> 04:38:02,821
And it also historically Uh had very low interest rates

3488
04:38:02,842 --> 04:38:05,141
at the time Which allowed them to make a move

3489
04:38:05,962 --> 04:38:11,061
Uh... In 19... In 2019 The median sale price for

3490
04:38:11,101 --> 04:38:13,541
a single - family home in the town of Blue

3491
04:38:13,581 --> 04:38:19,301
Mountains with 792, 000 By 2022 that number had reached

3492
04:38:19,322 --> 04:38:24,181
over 1. 5 million So that's almost a doubling in

3493
04:38:24,181 --> 04:38:27,061
a three - year time frame Now we compare that

3494
04:38:27,162 --> 04:38:30,261
to the area in general And I cover from Midland

3495
04:38:31,002 --> 04:38:35,061
Sorry Meford overthrew Grey Highlands Townlewoo Mountains Collingwood Clear View

3496
04:38:35,322 --> 04:38:38,581
And with Sega Beach Uh... The median sale price today

3497
04:38:38,842 --> 04:38:43,941
is 686, 000 So the 1. 3 million here in

3498
04:38:43,941 --> 04:38:47,781
the Town of the Mountains is significantly higher Uh... Since

3499
04:38:47,802 --> 04:38:52,101
then The market has clearly softened It's weaker Uh... Sales

3500
04:38:52,141 --> 04:38:54,341
from compared to a couple years ago We're down about

3501
04:38:54,442 --> 04:38:59,861
35 percent And some of the area Hardished hit is

3502
04:38:59,901 --> 04:39:02,821
in the higher end homes Um... At the same time

3503
04:39:03,562 --> 04:39:06,901
while sales are down The inventory of property is listed

3504
04:39:06,941 --> 04:39:10,757
for sale as about a 10 - year high. Just

3505
04:39:10,797 --> 04:39:13,317
to compare in the town of Blue Mountains Sales last

3506
04:39:13,317 --> 04:39:17,637
year were 187 homes Single family homes Na condos included

3507
04:39:18,058 --> 04:39:27,477
Uh... Compared to 443 and 2020 367 - 2021 And

3508
04:39:27,477 --> 04:39:30,037
basically on the sales that we've seen this year To

3509
04:39:30,077 --> 04:39:33,797
the end of July We're sitting at 86 units I

3510
04:39:34,138 --> 04:39:37,557
forecast We may end up somewhere 1 150 By the

3511
04:39:37,557 --> 04:39:41,317
end of the year So they the local market data

3512
04:39:41,498 --> 04:39:46,357
shows are considerably higher listing inventory And during the pandemic

3513
04:39:46,397 --> 04:39:49,557
Then what we had during the pandemic era And it

3514
04:39:49,738 --> 04:39:53,157
certainly signalling a return to a more ballast market There's

3515
04:39:53,418 --> 04:39:56,597
buyers out there Uh... They have a lot more to

3516
04:39:56,637 --> 04:40:01,397
look at They're constrained more by higher mortgage rates And

3517
04:40:01,658 --> 04:40:04,757
that in turn has also impacted pricing During the pandemic

3518
04:40:05,898 --> 04:40:09,477
sale prices were often triggered by multiple offers You know

3519
04:40:09,898 --> 04:40:13,637
10 or 15 people combating for the same house The

3520
04:40:13,658 --> 04:40:17,317
ultimate sale price was off 103 to maybe 105 percent

3521
04:40:17,658 --> 04:40:20,917
above their asking price Where back down now to the

3522
04:40:21,098 --> 04:40:25,477
95 to 97 percent range which pretty much signals a

3523
04:40:26,058 --> 04:40:29,317
ballast market So as of as of now There are

3524
04:40:29,498 --> 04:40:34,197
257 active listings Single family homes Intown of Blue Mountains

3525
04:40:35,498 --> 04:40:39,557
160 of those are over 1 million dollars That's 62

3526
04:40:39,658 --> 04:40:42,117
percent of what's on the market is over a million

3527
04:40:42,157 --> 04:40:45,637
dollars And then from a million 5 to 2 million

3528
04:40:45,738 --> 04:40:49,077
2 million to 3 3 millimeter over You know those

3529
04:40:49,178 --> 04:40:51,957
those make up the balance So you've got in the

3530
04:40:51,957 --> 04:40:55,637
case of 27 listings over 3 million That's 11 percent

3531
04:40:55,637 --> 04:41:00,997
of the market By comparison overall Uh right now in

3532
04:41:01,018 --> 04:41:05,317
those six municipalities I mentioned there's about 66 listings over

3533
04:41:05,357 --> 04:41:08,460
3 million dollars Last year total sales were 15. So

3534
04:41:08,481 --> 04:41:12,210
we're talking four years of inventory basically. Uh So this

3535
04:41:12,391 --> 04:41:16,530
trend has continued as I mentioned into 2026 with more

3536
04:41:16,631 --> 04:41:20,450
supply on The resale market The numbers I'm quoting do

3537
04:41:20,450 --> 04:41:23,250
not include sales that builders do direct This is simply

3538
04:41:23,351 --> 04:41:26,930
mls data Uh, but the key is that a more

3539
04:41:26,951 --> 04:41:30,530
balanced market has not meant that we've returned to Uh,

3540
04:41:30,871 --> 04:41:34,690
market affordability for most people So for many local workers

3541
04:41:35,191 --> 04:41:38,370
young families First time buyers a 1. 3 million dollar

3542
04:41:38,391 --> 04:41:42,850
house is completely beyond the realm of them buying Even

3543
04:41:42,890 --> 04:41:44,730
if they're willing to pay it They're not going to

3544
04:41:44,730 --> 04:41:49,570
get bank right dancing for an overpriced house So affordability

3545
04:41:49,610 --> 04:41:53,250
remains a real central concern facing local residents when it

3546
04:41:53,250 --> 04:41:56,290
comes to housing And then O council here is focused

3547
04:41:56,330 --> 04:42:00,690
on finding solutions to that Uh challenge At one point

3548
04:42:00,690 --> 04:42:04,210
we provide ourselves on supporting our elected officials and civil

3549
04:42:04,231 --> 04:42:08,450
servants with expert advice guidance and data that I've just

3550
04:42:08,450 --> 04:42:11,250
shared on Helping you address You know the local housing

3551
04:42:11,351 --> 04:42:14,450
market and to help make and to also help consumers

3552
04:42:14,631 --> 04:42:20,210
make You know sound You know policy and decision making

3553
04:42:20,391 --> 04:42:24,971
as whether they're selling or buying. Earlier this year and

3554
04:42:24,971 --> 04:42:27,371
I think you've received a copy of this We actually

3555
04:42:27,472 --> 04:42:31,531
engage and partnered with nanos research one of Canada's largest

3556
04:42:31,552 --> 04:42:37,531
research in polling firms Together information from residents across the

3557
04:42:37,792 --> 04:42:42,891
one - point region now in in full disclosure Their

3558
04:42:42,912 --> 04:42:46,651
documentation and the research they did was own sound Collingwood

3559
04:42:47,072 --> 04:42:50,651
and concardin can curtain some within a different market But

3560
04:42:50,752 --> 04:42:54,491
certainly you know anything that Collingwood shared from their perspective

3561
04:42:55,472 --> 04:42:57,851
Really kind of dovetails with what we would expect to

3562
04:42:57,891 --> 04:42:59,691
find in Town of Blue Mountains I mean let's face

3563
04:42:59,792 --> 04:43:04,251
it where sistering municipalities So while the research did not

3564
04:43:04,251 --> 04:43:08,011
include dedicated Public Opinion specifically from Town of Blue Mountains

3565
04:43:08,032 --> 04:43:12,891
Nanos Research did serve a their survey did provide useful

3566
04:43:13,632 --> 04:43:17,691
context of attitudes towards the housing market in the immediate

3567
04:43:17,691 --> 04:43:22,453
area. So amongst the almost 800 people they surveyed Uh...

3568
04:43:30,714 --> 04:43:35,893
Housing and housing cost was 11 percent dealt with health

3569
04:43:35,933 --> 04:43:44,693
care So results really demonstrate kind of the common tensions

3570
04:43:45,034 --> 04:43:49,893
or opinion shared amongst the various communities across Southern Georgian

3571
04:43:49,933 --> 04:43:54,213
Bay So if we look at Collywood for example 10

3572
04:43:54,394 --> 04:43:58,933
9 of 10 Collingwood residents rated their community positively as

3573
04:43:58,933 --> 04:44:00,773
a great place to live I think we would find

3574
04:44:00,813 --> 04:44:02,613
the same thing here in that Town of the Mountains

3575
04:44:03,274 --> 04:44:05,253
Great place to live great police to raise a family

3576
04:44:05,914 --> 04:44:10,613
But only 12 percent of people in Collywood positively viewed

3577
04:44:11,194 --> 04:44:17,173
Uh... The purchase of a home of being realistic founded

3578
04:44:17,434 --> 04:44:20,133
being poor I think the same thing we would see

3579
04:44:20,173 --> 04:44:23,173
the same results that we zeroed in just on Town

3580
04:44:23,173 --> 04:44:27,013
of Blue Mountains But overall 84 percent are concerned about

3581
04:44:27,674 --> 04:44:32,453
whether their kids The next generation or if their retirees

3582
04:44:32,453 --> 04:44:34,653
an area whether they're their grandchildren would be able to

3583
04:44:35,034 --> 04:44:37,813
forward a house And not necessarily in this area But

3584
04:44:37,914 --> 04:44:43,093
elsewhere in Canada So housing affordability homelessness and infrastructure also

3585
04:44:43,114 --> 04:44:47,813
emerged as leading Uh, municipal priorities So are these results

3586
04:44:47,813 --> 04:44:49,893
should not be intended as polling of the Town of

3587
04:44:49,914 --> 04:44:53,573
the Mountains residents They certainly provide some good regional contents.

3588
04:44:54,378 --> 04:44:57,797
So similar to Public Opinion Research 1 point also worked

3589
04:44:57,818 --> 04:45:01,477
in conjunction with looking at other solutions from other municipalities

3590
04:45:01,818 --> 04:45:05,477
We did put forth a booklet at one point released

3591
04:45:05,978 --> 04:45:10,917
on basic homes Strengthening communications Communities rather a review of

3592
04:45:10,938 --> 04:45:14,517
administrable housing policy best practices across the one - point

3593
04:45:14,517 --> 04:45:18,357
region This point reviewed about 10 minutes of Powell Dee's

3594
04:45:18,357 --> 04:45:20,597
across the area Again Town of Blue Mountains was not

3595
04:45:20,618 --> 04:45:23,317
one of them But it was based against the Canada

3596
04:45:23,498 --> 04:45:28,917
mortgage and housing Corporations housing Accelerator fund best practices And

3597
04:45:28,938 --> 04:45:30,917
we found in there You know a lot of what

3598
04:45:30,957 --> 04:45:34,357
other municipalities had done Troy and at force and work

3599
04:45:34,397 --> 04:45:39,557
on housing affordability So certainly the town has established and

3600
04:45:39,557 --> 04:45:43,077
affordable housing at target here Developed a housing action plan

3601
04:45:43,658 --> 04:45:48,437
Expanded permission for additional housing units created The housing within

3602
04:45:48,778 --> 04:45:53,797
reach community involvement and is Advancing forward relative to admissible

3603
04:45:53,818 --> 04:45:58,597
lands that may be available Planning modernization and streamlined approvals

3604
04:46:00,058 --> 04:46:05,172
Mr. Crocher you almost done. Yep Okay thank you So

3605
04:46:05,273 --> 04:46:07,012
I just like to like to just sum up by

3606
04:46:07,433 --> 04:46:12,228
saying that. You know the challenge now is really about

3607
04:46:12,489 --> 04:46:15,508
The delivery And that's it's you know The policies are

3608
04:46:15,508 --> 04:46:19,428
there Some of the planning is there But without executing

3609
04:46:19,468 --> 04:46:22,468
that It's nothing more than a wish list You know

3610
04:46:22,489 --> 04:46:24,148
And so that's one of the key things that we

3611
04:46:24,249 --> 04:46:27,028
felt was worth forth Bringing forth at this point in

3612
04:46:27,068 --> 04:46:31,828
time Especially with emerging Municipal election coming upon us Um,

3613
04:46:31,849 --> 04:46:33,988
thanks very much for having me And I'm certainly open

3614
04:46:33,988 --> 04:46:37,527
to answer any questions you may have. Thank you Mr.

3615
04:46:37,548 --> 04:46:40,887
Coach I see that we have one hand up Um

3616
04:46:42,348 --> 04:46:47,312
Councillor Maxwell move The floor. Thank you sir for the

3617
04:46:47,333 --> 04:46:52,856
deputation Much appreciated Um I got a question. Um because

3618
04:46:52,877 --> 04:46:55,705
you're really close to the market obviously. Are you seeing

3619
04:46:57,566 --> 04:47:02,585
buyers trying to offset their purchase cost by You know

3620
04:47:02,585 --> 04:47:07,199
using a bed and breakfast model or STAs. And are

3621
04:47:07,239 --> 04:47:10,719
some of them willing You know to create a maybe

3622
04:47:10,759 --> 04:47:14,472
a granny flat or a basement apartment. Because I mean

3623
04:47:14,493 --> 04:47:16,872
if the cost is high and then you may want

3624
04:47:16,872 --> 04:47:19,032
to try to offset things So I got a follow

3625
04:47:19,032 --> 04:47:22,872
- up after Yeah Certainly the question of STAs comes

3626
04:47:22,872 --> 04:47:26,712
up particularly in the condo market Um, one of the

3627
04:47:26,752 --> 04:47:30,552
issues there And I've had some involvement there because I've

3628
04:47:30,552 --> 04:47:33,832
sold condos or even some single family homes in the

3629
04:47:33,832 --> 04:47:37,912
past that some people bought as investments And I either

3630
04:47:37,952 --> 04:47:41,112
tried to do short - term accommodations through like VRBO

3631
04:47:41,293 --> 04:47:45,992
or Airbnb Uh that creates an issue with revenue Canada.

3632
04:47:46,611 --> 04:47:50,670
Particularly with the condominium market So revenue CAD is basically

3633
04:47:50,931 --> 04:47:54,510
taking the position that any property that is available to

3634
04:47:54,691 --> 04:47:57,230
rent Never mind if it is If it's available to

3635
04:47:57,331 --> 04:48:00,190
rent on a shirt as a short - term accommodation

3636
04:48:00,691 --> 04:48:03,390
more than 50 percent of the time The sale of

3637
04:48:03,390 --> 04:48:06,149
that property will be HST taxable. That has a big

3638
04:48:06,189 --> 04:48:09,029
number You know Ice fold economy on behalf of a

3639
04:48:09,050 --> 04:48:12,789
client who had bought it in 2003 Um, he used

3640
04:48:12,810 --> 04:48:16,069
it himself personally rented it out a bit When we

3641
04:48:16,069 --> 04:48:19,189
sold it back in I guess it was around 2021

3642
04:48:20,170 --> 04:48:23,029
It sold for over 800, 000 That property was HST

3643
04:48:23,050 --> 04:48:26,377
taxable. He ate the HST He had benefit from the

3644
04:48:26,478 --> 04:48:30,057
rental income Um... But you know ADing HST onto anything.

3645
04:48:31,223 --> 04:48:35,042
Adds a big price And so the tendency more is

3646
04:48:35,082 --> 04:48:39,202
now people think looking at a basement Department or maybe

3647
04:48:39,223 --> 04:48:43,042
building a unit in their backyard I had a contractor

3648
04:48:43,063 --> 04:48:46,482
that did a kitchen renovation for us last year One

3649
04:48:46,482 --> 04:48:49,122
of his working on a project for a client They

3650
04:48:49,143 --> 04:48:52,562
had like a small kind of a large shed in

3651
04:48:52,562 --> 04:48:54,882
the backyard They turned into a one bedroom apartment Which

3652
04:48:54,983 --> 04:48:58,322
you know many municipalities are welcome The opportunity and allowing

3653
04:48:58,362 --> 04:49:00,802
that to be done That was one way to address

3654
04:49:01,383 --> 04:49:05,602
and create a good Affordable unit for somebody So we

3655
04:49:05,623 --> 04:49:09,202
always encourage people if there's any kind of rental activity

3656
04:49:09,703 --> 04:49:12,642
And I see listings all the time on You know

3657
04:49:12,903 --> 04:49:15,522
where it's a house in the Tanabago Mountains Or it's

3658
04:49:15,703 --> 04:49:18,482
a condominium And the agent is saying Oh it's easily

3659
04:49:18,903 --> 04:49:21,682
rentable No it's not You have to be licensed And

3660
04:49:21,682 --> 04:49:24,002
you may not get a license depending on how many

3661
04:49:24,042 --> 04:49:28,082
other properties are around you So the real estate community

3662
04:49:28,122 --> 04:49:30,642
has to be very cognizant about what the rules are

3663
04:49:31,703 --> 04:49:34,082
and advise people Accordingly and above and be all We

3664
04:49:34,122 --> 04:49:36,482
always advise them talk to your lawyer Talk to your

3665
04:49:36,522 --> 04:49:41,075
account. Because you need to get especially The taxation issues

3666
04:49:41,115 --> 04:49:44,515
cleared Especially when the raven UCA has taken such an

3667
04:49:44,555 --> 04:49:48,587
aggressive posture. Even Even buying something and putting in a

3668
04:49:48,587 --> 04:49:52,027
company name Even if it's resale real estate A company

3669
04:49:52,067 --> 04:49:55,480
name will trigger it It's HST applicable. And I'll buyer

3670
04:49:55,520 --> 04:49:58,040
doesn't want to pay HST You know But somebody has

3671
04:49:58,080 --> 04:50:01,753
to. Thank you follow - up One follow - up.

3672
04:50:02,405 --> 04:50:06,598
Go ahead Yeah thank you Um... Thank you Chair. So

3673
04:50:07,819 --> 04:50:09,638
you know over the I don't know since maybe the

3674
04:50:09,739 --> 04:50:16,234
80s. Um house became an investment other than a place

3675
04:50:16,234 --> 04:50:20,516
to live. It became a second income in a lot

3676
04:50:20,516 --> 04:50:23,739
of cases. Are we starting to see that unravel now.

3677
04:50:26,228 --> 04:50:28,687
I could probably relate that I moved here in 1985

3678
04:50:28,788 --> 04:50:31,807
I was transferred up here by Goodyear Canada to work

3679
04:50:31,847 --> 04:50:34,527
out of the Colley With Hose plant I lived in

3680
04:50:34,548 --> 04:50:37,007
a new house that my wife and I at the

3681
04:50:37,007 --> 04:50:39,167
time Owen for one year in Aurora We moved up

3682
04:50:39,167 --> 04:50:42,116
here. There was no appreciable difference in housing price I

3683
04:50:42,116 --> 04:50:44,116
mean We spend every dollar We took out of Aurora

3684
04:50:44,156 --> 04:50:45,716
host to move up here And I was to buy

3685
04:50:46,297 --> 04:50:50,596
a modest little host on Mountain Road And uh... We

3686
04:50:50,636 --> 04:50:52,996
then moved to a larger home We lived in that

3687
04:50:53,177 --> 04:50:56,756
for five years Uh Here's a good example of how

3688
04:50:56,937 --> 04:51:00,036
The market can shift I had bought the house for

3689
04:51:00,537 --> 04:51:04,276
165, 000 It was a new house Young couple had

3690
04:51:04,276 --> 04:51:06,596
built it They got in over their heads I bought

3691
04:51:06,636 --> 04:51:09,476
the house for 165, 000 Living it for five years

3692
04:51:10,457 --> 04:51:13,956
finished it built a deck Landscaped It at that point

3693
04:51:13,977 --> 04:51:16,436
in time I was running a manufacturing business down in

3694
04:51:16,617 --> 04:51:20,996
Barry But lived in Collywood Got transfer the US 1992

3695
04:51:21,497 --> 04:51:25,556
Similar now Inter streets were higher The economy was uncertain

3696
04:51:25,897 --> 04:51:29,462
I sold that house for 160, 000. 5, 000 less

3697
04:51:29,502 --> 04:51:32,102
than what I paid The market value at the time

3698
04:51:32,123 --> 04:51:36,182
was about 300, 000 I was moving back and forth

3699
04:51:36,203 --> 04:51:40,982
between here and Chicago Weekly living in a company provided

3700
04:51:41,003 --> 04:51:44,742
apartment And, uh, finally The President Company Sir Rick just

3701
04:51:44,782 --> 04:51:46,342
blow the house off and we'll make up the difference

3702
04:51:46,382 --> 04:51:48,902
So in reality I got a little over 200, 000

3703
04:51:49,083 --> 04:51:51,302
for it But I lived in a house for five

3704
04:51:51,342 --> 04:51:55,382
years put money into it Including sweat equity and solid

3705
04:51:55,403 --> 04:51:58,182
of the 5, 000 dollar loss During the COVID period

3706
04:51:58,843 --> 04:52:02,182
We never in a two - year period sought any

3707
04:52:02,363 --> 04:52:05,702
price reductions go through our MLS system Right things were

3708
04:52:05,742 --> 04:52:08,822
selling for over - the - asking price Now it

3709
04:52:08,822 --> 04:52:11,862
is not uncommon to see 30 to 40 price reductions

3710
04:52:11,963 --> 04:52:19,410
a week. And they're not 5, 000 dollar reductions They're

3711
04:52:19,450 --> 04:52:25,410
102 and 300, 000 dollars I'm aware of one property

3712
04:52:25,671 --> 04:52:29,010
that's actually closing today It's sold for 1 million dollars

3713
04:52:29,111 --> 04:52:33,320
less than they're asking price A million dollars. Well below

3714
04:52:33,360 --> 04:52:37,562
the replacement cost. But that's what the willing buyers prepare

3715
04:52:37,602 --> 04:52:39,962
to pay So that's the kind of market that we're

3716
04:52:40,002 --> 04:52:43,322
in right now And you know It's fitting through The

3717
04:52:43,322 --> 04:52:46,122
presentation earlier You know when you're dealing with water and

3718
04:52:46,303 --> 04:52:50,738
wastewater. Don't be planning on any rap and growth. In

3719
04:52:50,738 --> 04:52:53,138
the next I think 3 - 5 years I mean

3720
04:52:53,239 --> 04:52:57,218
look at the economy right now Look at the... What's

3721
04:52:57,218 --> 04:52:59,698
going on between CAD and the US on the economy

3722
04:53:00,359 --> 04:53:02,578
We're not going to see a turnaround And the fact

3723
04:53:02,578 --> 04:53:06,098
is we got to app where we probably never should

3724
04:53:06,119 --> 04:53:10,898
have Where praises went from 790, 000 Town of Wild

3725
04:53:10,938 --> 04:53:12,818
Mountains to a million 5 And now it's down to

3726
04:53:12,858 --> 04:53:16,258
a million 3 Who's to say the 750 or 800

3727
04:53:16,759 --> 04:53:19,778
is a more realistic price. And that's where we actually

3728
04:53:20,039 --> 04:53:22,818
are seeing an increase in sales right now is kind

3729
04:53:22,818 --> 04:53:26,338
of in that 5 to 800, 000 price range Yeah

3730
04:53:26,759 --> 04:53:29,178
we're seeing a little bit of increase between 1, 5

3731
04:53:29,178 --> 04:53:31,976
and 2. But we're talking two or three houses, not

3732
04:53:31,976 --> 04:53:35,916
two or 300, you know But it was interesting having

3733
04:53:35,937 --> 04:53:39,036
gone through that period of time where you saw no

3734
04:53:39,076 --> 04:53:42,396
price reductions It was a seller's market There was competing

3735
04:53:42,577 --> 04:53:48,381
buyers Limited inventory. And historically low interest rates. And I

3736
04:53:48,381 --> 04:53:50,541
was cautioned people Look if you don't have to buy

3737
04:53:51,522 --> 04:53:53,948
Don't. Because you're going to get a better deal And

3738
04:53:53,948 --> 04:53:56,908
two or three years And you know Banks are extremely

3739
04:53:57,089 --> 04:53:59,388
cautious right now They don't want to own a house

3740
04:54:00,049 --> 04:54:03,308
That's that They're that they're underwater on because the seller

3741
04:54:03,969 --> 04:54:07,948
over the seller overbought So We're still having an issue

3742
04:54:08,129 --> 04:54:10,668
with sellers There's a lot of sellers that Well I

3743
04:54:10,689 --> 04:54:13,628
need this It doesn't matter what you need This is

3744
04:54:13,628 --> 04:54:16,188
where your house is valued based on the eyes of

3745
04:54:16,689 --> 04:54:23,066
today's buyer As well as the lenders. Thank you Madam

3746
04:54:23,106 --> 04:54:27,900
Mayor. Thank you through the chair Um thank you very

3747
04:54:27,940 --> 04:54:31,340
much It was very interesting A very interesting read in

3748
04:54:31,380 --> 04:54:34,460
an anticipation And you've shared some more details verbally I

3749
04:54:34,641 --> 04:54:37,660
could appreciate that in some cases You weren't able to

3750
04:54:37,681 --> 04:54:41,020
do an actual isolated View of the Blue Mountains and

3751
04:54:41,020 --> 04:54:43,500
other times it's looking But what you describe is very

3752
04:54:43,540 --> 04:54:46,060
much that South Georgia May area And it's a very

3753
04:54:46,060 --> 04:54:50,220
comparable area So my question through the chair is Um...

3754
04:54:51,201 --> 04:54:55,340
You reference workforce housing And How much of an insight

3755
04:54:55,601 --> 04:54:59,020
or a lens And maybe it's part anecdotal talking to

3756
04:54:59,060 --> 04:55:02,140
potential clients who are in the workforce age range Or

3757
04:55:02,180 --> 04:55:04,060
how much of this data that you've been able to

3758
04:55:04,641 --> 04:55:08,940
Uh, dissect is related to the location of that workforce

3759
04:55:08,940 --> 04:55:11,980
housing So that it's close to the potential work Um...

3760
04:55:12,561 --> 04:55:15,820
Especially in a date age when we're all encouraging Active

3761
04:55:15,820 --> 04:55:19,660
Transportation For example Or if it's rental Um... Or even

3762
04:55:19,681 --> 04:55:21,500
First - time buyers who are really trying to cut

3763
04:55:21,761 --> 04:55:24,860
their monthly costs There may be only one vehicle between

3764
04:55:25,521 --> 04:55:28,300
two people that are working Or perhaps no vehicle So

3765
04:55:28,801 --> 04:55:31,420
do you have any further insight You can add to

3766
04:55:31,441 --> 04:55:34,140
what you've already presented with us in terms of location

3767
04:55:34,180 --> 04:55:38,162
of hosing And location of potential work. Yeah I think

3768
04:55:38,263 --> 04:55:41,362
certainly And I gave it a couple of examples My

3769
04:55:41,402 --> 04:55:44,082
younger brother retired from The Pulking The Glass Company back

3770
04:55:44,263 --> 04:55:46,962
last fall So he had been the quality assurance Department

3771
04:55:46,962 --> 04:55:49,922
for a number Years And uh... They hired a replacement

3772
04:55:49,962 --> 04:55:51,842
for him It was a lady that was moving up

3773
04:55:51,842 --> 04:55:55,122
from wealth Uh... They hired her She came up here

3774
04:55:55,383 --> 04:55:57,122
Looked at housing in the air She was I can't

3775
04:55:57,122 --> 04:55:58,722
afford to live here But she turned out in a

3776
04:55:58,722 --> 04:56:03,042
position Uh... Certainly I think with the cost of transportation

3777
04:56:03,863 --> 04:56:06,642
Even just from a fuel standpoint When I think Like

3778
04:56:06,642 --> 04:56:10,162
I committed for five years from callingwood to Barry I

3779
04:56:10,162 --> 04:56:11,762
wouldn't want to be doing it now I think I

3780
04:56:11,802 --> 04:56:14,162
know what it caused me in gas then I wouldn't

3781
04:56:14,183 --> 04:56:16,962
want to do it now Uh... I wouldn't want to...

3782
04:56:17,002 --> 04:56:19,842
I never had an issue getting to work at home

3783
04:56:20,183 --> 04:56:23,202
You know Even through the winter When some of my

3784
04:56:23,202 --> 04:56:25,682
colleagues in my office couldn't get home and bury You

3785
04:56:25,682 --> 04:56:30,082
know But I think certainly You know Public transportation is

3786
04:56:30,122 --> 04:56:33,522
an issue Certainly I think when we see an awful

3787
04:56:33,522 --> 04:56:35,602
lot of the people moving to the area If they

3788
04:56:35,602 --> 04:56:38,802
don't currently reside here They're an elderly couple They won't

3789
04:56:38,842 --> 04:56:41,842
They want to downsize They maybe want to cut one

3790
04:56:41,882 --> 04:56:45,922
vehicle Uh... One of them still may be working You

3791
04:56:45,922 --> 04:56:48,882
know I'm getting lots of rumbling these days But people

3792
04:56:49,063 --> 04:56:50,882
that say Oh I'd love to apply for a job

3793
04:56:50,983 --> 04:56:53,442
But the Costco and with Sega Beach It's too far

3794
04:56:54,183 --> 04:56:57,122
You know I don't have a car There's no Public

3795
04:56:57,303 --> 04:57:00,002
Trans Trans Transportation You know to get me there So

3796
04:57:01,063 --> 04:57:04,082
that's a big factor When I think of When I

3797
04:57:04,122 --> 04:57:06,802
lived on Mountain Road and drove to Goodyear There wasn't

3798
04:57:06,842 --> 04:57:09,202
so much as a traffic light Never mind to stop

3799
04:57:09,543 --> 04:57:12,082
So I know So it was a pretty easy commute

3800
04:57:12,183 --> 04:57:16,722
You know it's not And I did I did participate

3801
04:57:16,762 --> 04:57:19,682
in an economic roundtable in Collingwood back a couple of

3802
04:57:19,682 --> 04:57:21,682
months ago And they were reaching out trying to figure

3803
04:57:21,682 --> 04:57:24,322
out You know what kind of businesses Can we attract

3804
04:57:24,343 --> 04:57:28,922
here. And their number one goal was a book manufacturing

3805
04:57:29,583 --> 04:57:31,562
I said You're not going to attract manufacturing here I

3806
04:57:31,903 --> 04:57:35,002
can't manufacturing brought me here Goodyear And at the time

3807
04:57:35,183 --> 04:57:37,722
there was a shipyards It was Goodyear There was harding

3808
04:57:37,762 --> 04:57:41,242
carpet There was Kaufman Front They're gone And regardless of

3809
04:57:41,282 --> 04:57:44,362
what you do or what our government does or what

3810
04:57:44,383 --> 04:57:47,882
Donald Trump claims The manufacturing is not only gone from

3811
04:57:47,903 --> 04:57:50,762
this area It's gone from North America It's not Coming

3812
04:57:50,863 --> 04:57:53,962
back And my point was what you should be trying

3813
04:57:54,002 --> 04:57:57,402
to attract here is You know The type of job

3814
04:57:58,223 --> 04:58:01,722
that can also afford the housing here Whether it's insurance

3815
04:58:01,743 --> 04:58:05,162
companies Maybe it's people within the healthcare industry You know

3816
04:58:05,343 --> 04:58:08,042
that sort of thing We're too far off of 400

3817
04:58:08,143 --> 04:58:12,362
series highway for manufacturing There's no rail service And you

3818
04:58:12,362 --> 04:58:14,762
know And then I said The other part of it

3819
04:58:14,783 --> 04:58:17,482
was which coincided with what I've talked about You know

3820
04:58:17,743 --> 04:58:21,242
any employment opportunities And this came up at the candidates

3821
04:58:21,263 --> 04:58:23,322
meeting last night Which I was at at the Marsh

3822
04:58:23,322 --> 04:58:26,442
Street Centre You know Any kind of employment - driven

3823
04:58:26,463 --> 04:58:30,120
opportunities has to coincide with affordable housing. When I brought

3824
04:58:30,120 --> 04:58:33,160
that up at the meeting I was told There's not

3825
04:58:33,160 --> 04:58:35,320
much we can do about affordable housing That was the

3826
04:58:35,341 --> 04:58:38,236
response of the town. I said Well you haven't gotten

3827
04:58:38,257 --> 04:58:41,196
much hope Then of attracting employment when you can't do

3828
04:58:41,217 --> 04:58:46,041
something to deal with the Affordable Housing issue. And you

3829
04:58:46,041 --> 04:58:50,761
know you've got talentable mountain Blue Mountains Resort being one

3830
04:58:50,801 --> 04:58:54,000
of the biggest employers in the area. They've got to

3831
04:58:54,181 --> 04:58:57,840
create some of their own employment housing Because it isn't

3832
04:58:57,861 --> 04:59:01,840
being done with the principal level And that's just You

3833
04:59:01,840 --> 04:59:05,360
know That's the way our economy overall has happened over

3834
04:59:05,381 --> 04:59:09,420
the years And uh... There's only four countries in the

3835
04:59:09,420 --> 04:59:12,800
world where housing is escalated in the price the way

3836
04:59:12,821 --> 04:59:17,857
ours is Canada. The UK New Zealand Where I've been

3837
04:59:18,118 --> 04:59:23,143
in Australia Ironically four Commonwealth countries. Uh... You know I

3838
04:59:23,724 --> 04:59:25,783
periodically go back on and I look up my house

3839
04:59:25,884 --> 04:59:28,583
that I had outside Chicago I look at what I

3840
04:59:28,604 --> 04:59:30,903
sold it for in 1996 when I moved back here

3841
04:59:31,324 --> 04:59:33,783
to what is worth now It went up two or

3842
04:59:33,823 --> 04:59:35,905
three percent of year. We went up with the Inflation

3843
04:59:36,006 --> 04:59:37,985
Rate It didn't go up 50 percent in six months

3844
04:59:38,246 --> 04:59:42,385
Like what we were seeing here during COVID Mr. Crouch

3845
04:59:42,646 --> 04:59:45,185
Would you mind address addressing with The Mayor had asked

3846
04:59:45,446 --> 04:59:50,385
Yeah sorry So so yeah the factors like that I

3847
04:59:50,385 --> 04:59:53,025
do have one client He resides up here on The

3848
04:59:53,046 --> 04:59:56,705
weekends I actually sold another property on Cleric Street He

3849
04:59:56,806 --> 05:00:00,145
owns 11 condos in Cranberry They're all full - time

3850
05:00:00,166 --> 05:00:03,558
rentals. Periodically I show them for him when he's not

3851
05:00:03,558 --> 05:00:06,478
here Everybody that I've showed them to you know I

3852
05:00:06,478 --> 05:00:08,978
say So what brings you the area? Well it was

3853
05:00:08,978 --> 05:00:11,158
one couple She had gotten a job as a nurse

3854
05:00:11,259 --> 05:00:14,598
at the Collingwood Hospital Uh... Often it's a younger couple

3855
05:00:15,099 --> 05:00:17,478
of them got a job at Blue Mountain Or maybe

3856
05:00:17,518 --> 05:00:20,278
one of the private ski cloves Uh... One guy had

3857
05:00:20,278 --> 05:00:22,838
gotten a job Managing one of the fast food restaurants

3858
05:00:23,499 --> 05:00:26,678
Another guy was actually got a two - year contract

3859
05:00:26,779 --> 05:00:29,298
with The Town of Collywood to address some of the

3860
05:00:29,419 --> 05:00:33,798
road infrastructure work So these are all people jobs is

3861
05:00:33,838 --> 05:00:36,438
what drew them to the area Which got me into

3862
05:00:36,459 --> 05:00:40,198
this area back in 1995 I'm a skier Uh... I

3863
05:00:40,219 --> 05:00:41,958
jumped at the chance to get out of the Toronto

3864
05:00:42,539 --> 05:00:46,118
But the even if the job opportunities are here They've

3865
05:00:46,139 --> 05:00:48,118
got to find a place to live And that tends

3866
05:00:48,118 --> 05:00:51,533
to be one of the bigger challenges. Thank you follow

3867
05:00:51,573 --> 05:00:55,265
up Madam Mayor. Nope No thank you Also but it

3868
05:00:55,265 --> 05:00:57,825
was a good point too About The Costa Commuting and

3869
05:00:57,825 --> 05:00:59,825
how we can't just rely on people living in one

3870
05:00:59,865 --> 05:01:03,025
community and fulfilling a job in another one Because of

3871
05:01:03,126 --> 05:01:08,410
the escalating gas cost for example Thank you. Depumir Go

3872
05:01:08,410 --> 05:01:11,530
ahead Thank you Madam Chair through you Thanks Rick for

3873
05:01:11,570 --> 05:01:15,826
the update on the local market. You're from your point

3874
05:01:15,826 --> 05:01:17,746
of view You're looking at this through a resale lens

3875
05:01:17,786 --> 05:01:20,466
or development lens Because the couple different ask You know

3876
05:01:20,466 --> 05:01:23,026
when we're building houses are building purpose built or having

3877
05:01:23,047 --> 05:01:25,586
developers do that And you know things we can do

3878
05:01:25,586 --> 05:01:29,506
with the CIP and Accelerant permit in that So to

3879
05:01:29,546 --> 05:01:33,826
help with The Affordability Index Um... Because the province doesn't

3880
05:01:34,807 --> 05:01:38,626
Classify a Table Housing under Provincial Policy Statement They do

3881
05:01:38,807 --> 05:01:43,106
social housing Uh... And... But not attainable housing Affordable in

3882
05:01:43,127 --> 05:01:46,386
that... So differently So from a resale I guess You

3883
05:01:46,386 --> 05:01:49,666
know from a realtor resale point of view How can

3884
05:01:49,706 --> 05:01:53,586
that market help get people in? What's the incentive there

3885
05:01:53,626 --> 05:01:59,266
for somebody to I guess buying below market? Or what

3886
05:01:59,287 --> 05:02:01,746
are your thoughts on how that resale market can help

3887
05:02:02,007 --> 05:02:05,880
get people into attainable type housing. Yeah I mean I

3888
05:02:05,920 --> 05:02:07,960
think certainly one of the things that's been faced over

3889
05:02:08,000 --> 05:02:11,800
the years is Like the development charges Um I can

3890
05:02:11,840 --> 05:02:14,120
think of years ago I sold a two - acre

3891
05:02:14,160 --> 05:02:17,400
lot down on the 12 side road So nothing there.

3892
05:02:18,556 --> 05:02:21,575
And the developmentaries is running over from 18 to 22,

3893
05:02:21,575 --> 05:02:24,215
000 Depending on what the individual was going to build

3894
05:02:24,255 --> 05:02:26,695
So he still had to drill the well Put in

3895
05:02:26,876 --> 05:02:29,255
a septic You know and drive away and everything else

3896
05:02:29,756 --> 05:02:33,015
Okay his question was so what am I getting from

3897
05:02:33,015 --> 05:02:35,735
my 20, 000 dollars Well the right to build a

3898
05:02:35,775 --> 05:02:39,335
house was kind of it And uh... You know when

3899
05:02:39,436 --> 05:02:43,895
you're faced with costs like that How can you build

3900
05:02:43,935 --> 05:02:48,055
a reasonable dwelling Mead all the obligations You know whether

3901
05:02:48,095 --> 05:02:52,775
it's paying the development fees and build something that's affordable

3902
05:02:52,796 --> 05:02:55,175
Even there was something that you could rent out Because

3903
05:02:55,196 --> 05:02:58,455
the way you necessarily charge The amount of money that

3904
05:02:58,636 --> 05:03:02,375
you would need to generate that back So in a

3905
05:03:02,375 --> 05:03:04,615
case with my client He gets he gets 18 or

3906
05:03:04,615 --> 05:03:07,175
50 dollars a month for a one bedroom That includes

3907
05:03:07,516 --> 05:03:11,975
heat and air conditioning because it's not separately mated So

3908
05:03:11,996 --> 05:03:14,615
the tenant pays their own hydro pays their own cable

3909
05:03:14,716 --> 05:03:19,575
Whatever The two bedrooms he gets 2250 That's even a

3910
05:03:19,575 --> 05:03:21,895
lot of money You know I was you know I

3911
05:03:21,895 --> 05:03:23,415
was I remember the first time I took on a

3912
05:03:23,415 --> 05:03:25,415
mortgage at 600 dollars a month and I were like

3913
05:03:25,455 --> 05:03:27,175
Oh my god what have I done How am I

3914
05:03:27,175 --> 05:03:31,175
ever going to pay for this? So somehow You know

3915
05:03:31,276 --> 05:03:33,495
it's and I understand the need You know for the

3916
05:03:33,495 --> 05:03:37,280
development charges from a revenue standpoint for the municipalities. But

3917
05:03:37,461 --> 05:03:40,160
you know it ultimately affects You know the bottom line

3918
05:03:41,621 --> 05:03:43,760
And I mean even today And I've got a good

3919
05:03:44,421 --> 05:03:47,280
I got a good handle on construction We've done three

3920
05:03:47,320 --> 05:03:49,920
projects at our own house here in Clarinsburg in the

3921
05:03:49,941 --> 05:03:52,320
last four years I've gotten Billy permits from the mall

3922
05:03:52,501 --> 05:03:54,800
So I didn't do anything illegally Uh So I know

3923
05:03:54,901 --> 05:03:58,080
the costs And when I see You know I mean

3924
05:03:58,080 --> 05:03:59,760
I can look at houses right now for sale on

3925
05:03:59,781 --> 05:04:02,400
brewstreet I could build out for less I'm not gonna

3926
05:04:02,501 --> 05:04:05,440
why would I buy this for a million dollars You

3927
05:04:05,440 --> 05:04:08,320
know again often it's somebody got in over their heads

3928
05:04:08,501 --> 05:04:10,160
and paid too much and now they're trying to get

3929
05:04:10,181 --> 05:04:14,480
out And but I think overall and certainly we've seen

3930
05:04:14,661 --> 05:04:18,720
material costs come down some since COVID But you know

3931
05:04:19,701 --> 05:04:23,060
not ultimately probably where it should be. And you know

3932
05:04:23,401 --> 05:04:25,940
it's interesting if you do follow the US real estate

3933
05:04:26,041 --> 05:04:29,700
market And the television shows where you look at a

3934
05:04:29,740 --> 05:04:32,020
house and it's 450 And they're well that host is

3935
05:04:32,060 --> 05:04:34,660
here There'd be one in front of the four You

3936
05:04:34,660 --> 05:04:37,020
know And so somehow I think there needs to be

3937
05:04:37,881 --> 05:04:41,220
There needs to be an initiative certainly at the provincial

3938
05:04:41,220 --> 05:04:46,500
level to make house building more More affordable for people

3939
05:04:46,921 --> 05:04:50,180
at all price points And regardless of municipality they're in

3940
05:04:50,921 --> 05:04:54,660
But I think especially at the level For the first

3941
05:04:54,700 --> 05:04:59,300
time buyer And there's some younger generation that they don't

3942
05:04:59,321 --> 05:05:02,020
care about owning a house There's a younger generation that

3943
05:05:02,060 --> 05:05:04,820
doesn't care about driving a car So they're probably never

3944
05:05:04,841 --> 05:05:06,820
going to leave down down Toronto Toronto Because they need

3945
05:05:06,820 --> 05:05:08,980
that Public transit to get to work to get to

3946
05:05:09,020 --> 05:05:12,440
the grocery stores. But for people up here Uh, you

3947
05:05:12,440 --> 05:05:14,420
know my son and his wife bought one of the

3948
05:05:14,420 --> 05:05:17,400
new townhomes over in that subdivision in Meford He works

3949
05:05:17,661 --> 05:05:20,040
a known sound She works in Hollywood So it's kind

3950
05:05:20,040 --> 05:05:22,520
of midway for both of them They go in at

3951
05:05:22,560 --> 05:05:25,080
the ground level They got a great price Their first

3952
05:05:25,120 --> 05:05:27,720
time buyers It'll by no means be their last house

3953
05:05:27,741 --> 05:05:29,720
But it was a good entry - level point for

3954
05:05:29,741 --> 05:05:32,840
them to get into a three - bedroom Townhouse with

3955
05:05:32,941 --> 05:05:37,260
a garage full basement for just over 300, 000. Like

3956
05:05:37,281 --> 05:05:39,740
that's a great deal Do you have a follow -

3957
05:05:39,740 --> 05:05:41,740
up? Yeah Just very quickly So I do appreciate it

3958
05:05:41,761 --> 05:05:44,140
again We're talking new there as well Right So I

3959
05:05:44,140 --> 05:05:46,940
was just wondering in the resale market is one of

3960
05:05:46,940 --> 05:05:50,460
the solutions you're thinking of is also Um... Purchase for

3961
05:05:50,561 --> 05:05:53,980
rental as investment to help get people into a house

3962
05:05:54,481 --> 05:05:56,460
as opposed to home ownership Is that part of your

3963
05:05:56,500 --> 05:05:59,260
thought process? Yeah I mean certainly we get asked that

3964
05:06:00,481 --> 05:06:04,140
and You know Because people often ask me are instructing

3965
05:06:04,161 --> 05:06:07,180
colleagues get the same question Um... If I was to

3966
05:06:07,220 --> 05:06:09,900
put a basement If I was put a basement apartment

3967
05:06:09,940 --> 05:06:12,940
in or do a unit in the backyard You know

3968
05:06:13,121 --> 05:06:15,740
how rentable would it be? And often the comment is

3969
05:06:16,241 --> 05:06:18,780
we would need that rental income to afford this house

3970
05:06:18,961 --> 05:06:21,820
To help make the mortgage payment, you know? So the

3971
05:06:21,820 --> 05:06:25,820
fact that there's more opportunity to do that now As

3972
05:06:25,820 --> 05:06:28,620
well as the demand there so that once you finish

3973
05:06:28,660 --> 05:06:32,380
that basement apartment Even if it's maybe adding onto your

3974
05:06:32,401 --> 05:06:35,100
house with a separate granny flout or whatever you want

3975
05:06:35,100 --> 05:06:37,100
to call it The fact that they can do it

3976
05:06:37,601 --> 05:06:39,740
Knowing that they can put it on the market and

3977
05:06:39,740 --> 05:06:43,324
quickly get it rented. You know that's a bonus Because

3978
05:06:43,324 --> 05:06:45,164
to invest that money and then to sit there for

3979
05:06:45,204 --> 05:06:48,204
six months to a year When no rental income You

3980
05:06:48,204 --> 05:06:50,844
know they really got to take a hard look at

3981
05:06:50,844 --> 05:06:53,644
the math to see if that pays or not But

3982
05:06:53,665 --> 05:06:56,764
certainly a lot of them Yeah the rental becomes a

3983
05:06:56,785 --> 05:06:59,724
key item to make that house affordable for them just

3984
05:06:59,745 --> 05:07:04,322
to buy You know. And that especially applies to the

3985
05:07:04,983 --> 05:07:09,682
condominia market because they're often used only frequently and Cody

3986
05:07:09,703 --> 05:07:11,842
rented out Well yes you can but then there's a

3987
05:07:11,842 --> 05:07:15,361
mentioned earlier that triggers EHST issue. So yeah Thank you.

3988
05:07:15,954 --> 05:07:20,321
Councillor Porter. Yes Thank you and through the chair And

3989
05:07:20,321 --> 05:07:23,921
thank you very much for bringing this forward And I

3990
05:07:23,921 --> 05:07:28,321
think The comment I most welcome is when I believe

3991
05:07:28,361 --> 05:07:30,881
to be true myself is There's not a lot going

3992
05:07:30,881 --> 05:07:33,013
to happen in the next three to five years. The

3993
05:07:33,034 --> 05:07:35,173
one thing I wanted to ask as you're talking about

3994
05:07:35,354 --> 05:07:38,053
residential homes is because where I live in the Town

3995
05:07:38,634 --> 05:07:41,893
I know of I haven't checked the real estate lately

3996
05:07:41,893 --> 05:07:44,373
But I go by for sales science on a regular

3997
05:07:44,474 --> 05:07:48,373
basis There's two on landsdown one of the corner just

3998
05:07:48,413 --> 05:07:50,693
by food land And I think the one that was

3999
05:07:50,874 --> 05:07:53,493
a little bit green development still for sale Do you

4000
05:07:53,533 --> 05:08:00,456
see any movement on development properties. From what I see

4001
05:08:01,197 --> 05:08:04,376
No, it seems to be pretty slow Um, I mean

4002
05:08:04,397 --> 05:08:07,576
I think for example of a good example might be

4003
05:08:07,997 --> 05:08:11,176
like crigly thridge For example You know the roads went

4004
05:08:11,216 --> 05:08:13,096
in and the streets are all layer and there has

4005
05:08:13,117 --> 05:08:16,367
a shovel hasn't got in the ground since. Uh, another

4006
05:08:16,407 --> 05:08:19,407
example And this is just outside the municipality But back

4007
05:08:19,508 --> 05:08:23,567
about five years ago I sold large Acorage just the

4008
05:08:23,567 --> 05:08:25,887
other side of Kirsty Beach Road was typically not as

4009
05:08:25,887 --> 05:08:28,607
the Irwin property I sold that to Park Bridge Properties

4010
05:08:28,868 --> 05:08:31,407
Yeah There's engineering science up there But you see them

4011
05:08:31,447 --> 05:08:34,527
putting a shovel in the ground No The other day

4012
05:08:34,628 --> 05:08:37,167
I was at a meeting at the clubhouse in Laura

4013
05:08:37,188 --> 05:08:40,687
Bay I drove The subdivision I wonder with a fire

4014
05:08:40,788 --> 05:08:45,565
West End Which is now owned by Gravegald Holmes. It's

4015
05:08:45,565 --> 05:08:48,845
just gathering dust and growing weeds There The developers are

4016
05:08:49,106 --> 05:08:51,085
smart enough to know that now is not the time

4017
05:08:51,125 --> 05:08:53,805
to be embarking on a major project And I think

4018
05:08:53,805 --> 05:08:56,925
that could be two or three years down the road

4019
05:08:57,186 --> 05:09:00,365
Especially right now when the huge inventory of properties for

4020
05:09:00,386 --> 05:09:03,885
sale That would have to be absorbed before it would

4021
05:09:03,885 --> 05:09:06,445
be worthwhile for a developer to start on another major

4022
05:09:06,626 --> 05:09:09,805
project And I think that would have to coincide with

4023
05:09:10,546 --> 05:09:13,085
drug creation in the market Um... A lot of people

4024
05:09:13,346 --> 05:09:15,965
that moved up here during the work from home transition

4025
05:09:17,106 --> 05:09:18,925
Now they're required to go back to work And maybe

4026
05:09:18,965 --> 05:09:20,525
not full - time But we've got to be in

4027
05:09:20,525 --> 05:09:23,085
the office in Toronto One, two, three days a week

4028
05:09:23,506 --> 05:09:25,565
I think that's one of the reasons why so many

4029
05:09:25,586 --> 05:09:28,845
of the places on the market today were bought during

4030
05:09:29,106 --> 05:09:33,165
2021 And people overpaid And to me it's no coincidence

4031
05:09:33,205 --> 05:09:35,805
that here we are three five years later Those mortgages

4032
05:09:35,805 --> 05:09:38,365
are coming up for renewal Not at one point eight

4033
05:09:38,386 --> 05:09:40,765
or two percent but five And we can't afford this

4034
05:09:41,266 --> 05:09:45,148
and sorry We had a downsize to something else. Thank

4035
05:09:45,148 --> 05:09:49,796
you. Farm - up Council Reporter. No, I'm fine Thanks

4036
05:09:49,817 --> 05:09:51,876
Okay, thank you I'm going to go to cancer Ardell

4037
05:09:51,977 --> 05:09:53,956
who isn't at a chance to ask a question And

4038
05:09:53,977 --> 05:09:58,889
if Councillor Maxwell for going for a second pass. Do

4039
05:09:58,929 --> 05:10:02,569
we really need to? Go for a second pass? Okay

4040
05:10:02,830 --> 05:10:05,689
needs to be quick Okay Thanks Council Ardell Alright Madam

4041
05:10:05,689 --> 05:10:07,689
Chair Thank you very much I think you answered my

4042
05:10:07,870 --> 05:10:10,249
question I was going to ask was on the developers

4043
05:10:10,289 --> 05:10:13,689
How do we get developers here to do affordable housing?

4044
05:10:13,689 --> 05:10:17,289
Real affordable housing Um, and But if we've got an

4045
05:10:17,329 --> 05:10:20,969
inventory of houses that people aren't getting rid of There's

4046
05:10:21,009 --> 05:10:23,609
no way I know somebody who sat at this table

4047
05:10:24,830 --> 05:10:27,049
Two councils ago And he put up the idea that

4048
05:10:27,470 --> 05:10:30,889
maybe we should be buying some Townhouses that are already

4049
05:10:31,070 --> 05:10:34,089
on the market And then turning them into rentals for

4050
05:10:34,129 --> 05:10:37,609
people And that may be The Opportunity then to get

4051
05:10:37,710 --> 05:10:41,449
some workplace housing But it's not really The Municipality's job

4052
05:10:41,489 --> 05:10:44,729
to do workplace housing I'm in the Apple Industry I

4053
05:10:44,729 --> 05:10:47,289
have to supply my own workplace housing And I have

4054
05:10:47,289 --> 05:10:49,929
to build it And it's very expensive when you're housing

4055
05:10:50,110 --> 05:10:53,209
22 men Um, and I will say men only because

4056
05:10:53,230 --> 05:10:56,309
we don't mix Um... But you know It's a lot

4057
05:10:56,309 --> 05:10:58,329
of money to be able to do all that So

4058
05:10:59,070 --> 05:11:04,009
I think now, you know, and Collingwood's done some great

4059
05:11:04,350 --> 05:11:08,089
jumps and leaps of getting affordable housing But that those

4060
05:11:08,129 --> 05:11:10,969
came to fruition You know about a year or a

4061
05:11:10,969 --> 05:11:12,569
year and a half ago When they had already started

4062
05:11:12,670 --> 05:11:16,969
to build Or there was some affordable housing or attainable

4063
05:11:16,990 --> 05:11:20,009
housing That a developer, and I won't mention his name

4064
05:11:20,190 --> 05:11:24,089
But when The price came in They're not attainable, like

4065
05:11:24,089 --> 05:11:26,889
2200, 2, 400 a month Who can afford that? People

4066
05:11:27,070 --> 05:11:30,569
in Collingwood can't afford that So I think I've got

4067
05:11:30,590 --> 05:11:35,529
the picture here of what we had in attainable housing

4068
05:11:35,790 --> 05:11:37,849
that I sat on for a few years Um, but

4069
05:11:37,950 --> 05:11:41,289
we couldn't come up with any ideas or solutions So

4070
05:11:41,390 --> 05:11:44,969
I think, as you're saying, that there's out there right

4071
05:11:44,969 --> 05:11:47,769
now So, and the developers are not ready to dig

4072
05:11:47,809 --> 05:11:50,569
in But I did wonder I saw that price in

4073
05:11:50,609 --> 05:11:54,329
Meford I'm wondering how they are managing who the developer

4074
05:11:54,910 --> 05:11:57,209
is out there So if you have any ideas You

4075
05:11:57,209 --> 05:12:00,089
can email us It's certainly, they're synchro EMIX I know

4076
05:12:00,350 --> 05:12:03,609
my son's neighbours in there are a mix of younger

4077
05:12:03,649 --> 05:12:06,569
people as well as retirees So they seem to be

4078
05:12:06,750 --> 05:12:10,009
attracting both Um, I think the fact that it's a

4079
05:12:10,009 --> 05:12:13,589
short distance for someone to commute to Owen Sound, the

4080
05:12:13,589 --> 05:12:16,809
way my son does, you know, is easy But it's

4081
05:12:16,809 --> 05:12:18,649
kind of a Catch - 22 situation You know There's

4082
05:12:18,689 --> 05:12:23,769
no point in developing affordable housing if the jobs You

4083
05:12:23,769 --> 05:12:27,529
know? And then, you know without the Affordable Housing How

4084
05:12:28,270 --> 05:12:31,369
do you attract the jobs? This is why I said

4085
05:12:31,409 --> 05:12:33,349
at the meeting I was out in Collywood How, you

4086
05:12:33,349 --> 05:12:35,369
know, they have to work hand in hand And the

4087
05:12:35,369 --> 05:12:37,129
answer I got from Mr. Howley was there's not much

4088
05:12:37,169 --> 05:12:39,849
we can do But Affordable Housing And yet You know

4089
05:12:39,950 --> 05:12:41,689
they're reaching out to me asking me How do we

4090
05:12:41,729 --> 05:12:45,369
attract jobs? And more importantly, what kind of jobs can

4091
05:12:45,390 --> 05:12:50,969
we attract here? And my point at the time was,

4092
05:12:50,969 --> 05:12:54,809
you know It's again There's certainly - odd job opportunities

4093
05:12:54,809 --> 05:12:59,209
out there And even to cite examples, like say what

4094
05:12:59,230 --> 05:13:03,058
revenue of Canada has done in Sudbury. Where the OVP

4095
05:13:03,079 --> 05:13:07,378
move their headquarters to Aurelia And it was interesting earlier

4096
05:13:07,959 --> 05:13:10,658
You know during the break I was talking to former

4097
05:13:10,759 --> 05:13:14,098
Mary Terry Geddes here And I recounted to him a

4098
05:13:14,098 --> 05:13:15,938
meeting We had a number of years ago when John

4099
05:13:15,978 --> 05:13:19,458
Tory was running for Premier and Terry called me late

4100
05:13:19,498 --> 05:13:21,938
one afternoon to come to a meeting And they asked

4101
05:13:21,938 --> 05:13:25,058
me what kind of jobs could we create here? And

4102
05:13:25,079 --> 05:13:27,778
I turned to John Turry I said Why have you

4103
05:13:27,778 --> 05:13:31,378
got thousands of Ontario government employees at Queens Park or

4104
05:13:31,378 --> 05:13:33,858
in Toronto When they'd love to be up here They

4105
05:13:33,959 --> 05:13:37,698
could be up here You don't have to move raw

4106
05:13:37,698 --> 05:13:41,058
materials in off 400 series Highway and finish goods out

4107
05:13:41,879 --> 05:13:44,258
And John turned to Terry and said What were we

4108
05:13:44,298 --> 05:13:47,458
just talking about? An hour ago And I was what

4109
05:13:47,479 --> 05:13:50,875
Derry 25 - 30 years ago. And nothing's happened since,

4110
05:13:50,875 --> 05:13:54,635
you know? Uh... You know There's been different municipal campaigns

4111
05:13:54,675 --> 05:13:59,195
talking about bringing back automotive Parts manufacturing And they're unattainable

4112
05:13:59,296 --> 05:14:01,835
goals You know So somehow the two have to work

4113
05:14:02,656 --> 05:14:06,715
hand in hand And I think I think municipalities You

4114
05:14:06,715 --> 05:14:11,355
know personally can do more To attract... You know, jobs

4115
05:14:12,256 --> 05:14:15,115
that allow the houses here that exist Even at some

4116
05:14:15,115 --> 05:14:19,378
of the inflated praises. Are affordable Because the job They're

4117
05:14:19,378 --> 05:14:23,058
coming in can afford to pay them, you know? Council

4118
05:14:23,058 --> 05:14:25,298
Sardell? No, that's it Thank you very much Thank you

4119
05:14:25,479 --> 05:14:29,378
very Councillor Maxwell very quick question Yeah I do, just

4120
05:14:29,378 --> 05:14:33,962
a real quick one Okay. On the whole idea about

4121
05:14:34,703 --> 05:14:42,037
for this workforce housing. How. Okay, I don't want to

4122
05:14:42,037 --> 05:14:44,972
see a person just being a renter. How can they

4123
05:14:45,073 --> 05:14:49,372
build up equity and workforce housing? Because when I hear

4124
05:14:49,412 --> 05:14:52,492
The word work first Howosing I... Something comes up by

4125
05:14:52,492 --> 05:14:56,572
my mind Like mining camps and logging camps You know?

4126
05:14:56,833 --> 05:14:58,332
I don't think we want to go back to there

4127
05:14:58,833 --> 05:15:02,012
And dentured servants So how do we allow young people

4128
05:15:02,753 --> 05:15:07,625
That actually create equity and workforce housing. I don't think

4129
05:15:07,806 --> 05:15:10,025
they can create equity to work for housing I think

4130
05:15:10,126 --> 05:15:13,225
I think what allows them to do And again My

4131
05:15:13,246 --> 05:15:15,305
son and his wife are a good example They moved

4132
05:15:15,345 --> 05:15:17,225
up here They had no jobs They wanted to get

4133
05:15:17,326 --> 05:15:20,105
out of the city Uh... For about 8 years they

4134
05:15:20,145 --> 05:15:23,465
rented The Upper Floor of a Raised Bungalow in Collingwood

4135
05:15:23,505 --> 05:15:26,585
They paid 1600 dollars a month They were both... They

4136
05:15:26,686 --> 05:15:31,145
both secured Good jobs And you know that fairly affordable

4137
05:15:31,646 --> 05:15:33,545
Housing that they rented A lot of them to put

4138
05:15:33,646 --> 05:15:37,225
The money aside To make a 30 40, 000 dollar

4139
05:15:37,406 --> 05:15:40,505
down payment on the Townhouse that they bought in Meford

4140
05:15:40,606 --> 05:15:43,545
So So I think it's more of a... It's a

4141
05:15:43,585 --> 05:15:45,785
stepping stone You know They can come here for the

4142
05:15:45,806 --> 05:15:49,545
work They can find an affordable place to live Although

4143
05:15:49,566 --> 05:15:54,025
renting is not... It's not inexpensive Uh... Barry is probably

4144
05:15:54,025 --> 05:15:57,065
one of the highest rental markets in Canada And yet

4145
05:15:58,126 --> 05:16:01,065
My steps under his wife Living a large house down

4146
05:16:01,065 --> 05:16:02,985
there He has a good job She has a good

4147
05:16:03,025 --> 05:16:06,425
job And hopefully with the rent They're paying They're putting

4148
05:16:06,425 --> 05:16:09,465
money aside That they'll be able to eventually afford a

4149
05:16:09,465 --> 05:16:13,305
house So I don't think a Sea Equity in that

4150
05:16:13,566 --> 05:16:16,025
housing that's provided to them Often it's going to be

4151
05:16:16,065 --> 05:16:21,305
affordable You know housing Uh... But hopefully it gets some

4152
05:16:21,305 --> 05:16:23,865
of the marketplace Where they have a good job They

4153
05:16:24,046 --> 05:16:26,985
attan You know good history in terms of You know

4154
05:16:27,086 --> 05:16:30,345
their credit Uh... Maybe they advance from their through their

4155
05:16:30,385 --> 05:16:34,185
jobs Maybe higher position at Blue Mountain Resort or wherever

4156
05:16:34,225 --> 05:16:36,825
it might be And if they're smart enough They're not

4157
05:16:36,846 --> 05:16:40,025
spending that money They're putting aside four down payment on

4158
05:16:40,065 --> 05:16:43,545
a house Provided of course There's an affordable host They

4159
05:16:43,545 --> 05:16:45,465
can put it down payment on down the road When

4160
05:16:45,646 --> 05:16:48,105
they're ready And that seems to be the missing gap

4161
05:16:48,126 --> 05:16:52,282
right now. Okay Thank you Thank you for your question

4162
05:16:52,623 --> 05:16:57,082
Councillor Maxfall Thank you Mr. Crouch Even lots of information

4163
05:16:57,583 --> 05:17:00,922
and lots of background Uh At this point We need

4164
05:17:00,922 --> 05:17:04,122
to put up the motion Please Uh... That Council The

4165
05:17:04,223 --> 05:17:07,882
Town Blue Mountains receives The Deputation of Rick Crouch Broker's

4166
05:17:07,882 --> 05:17:10,922
Health Beast International Regarding an update on The local Housing

4167
05:17:11,023 --> 05:17:17,060
Market may have a mover in the secondary. Council Reporter

4168
05:17:17,161 --> 05:17:20,180
and second - at - bancer McKinley Any further discussion.

4169
05:17:21,412 --> 05:17:24,351
Now let's call the vote then please The vote is

4170
05:17:24,391 --> 05:17:26,044
open. There we go.

4171
05:17:37,815 --> 05:17:42,422
Please Thank you Councillor Porter Nat vote is post. Thank

4172
05:17:42,422 --> 05:17:44,902
You that motion is carried 7 - 0 with everyone

4173
05:17:44,923 --> 05:17:47,302
in the chambers Thank you very much Mr. Crouch Thank

4174
05:17:47,302 --> 05:17:50,910
you. No we'll move on to B. 6. 2 We've

4175
05:17:50,950 --> 05:17:54,990
got Terry Getty's Project Coordinator in Chris Malms E... Excuse

4176
05:17:54,990 --> 05:17:59,856
me Walmsley. Of The Biden Group Regarding The Grey Road

4177
05:17:59,896 --> 05:18:03,456
19 Workforce Uh... Housing So gentlemen You have 10 minutes

4178
05:18:03,717 --> 05:18:06,416
And the one - minute warning I'll be watching Thank

4179
05:18:06,416 --> 05:18:11,082
you Thank you. First of all Uh thank you. Chair

4180
05:18:11,263 --> 05:18:16,448
Hope. Your worship Deputy Mayor and members of Council. I

4181
05:18:16,448 --> 05:18:21,168
have listened intently To your presentation since 9 30 this

4182
05:18:21,208 --> 05:18:23,648
morning And they brought back a lot of memories Some

4183
05:18:23,749 --> 05:18:27,968
not good like crypto Spiridium Et cetera Councillor Ardell You

4184
05:18:27,968 --> 05:18:34,448
remember Exactly Uh We're here today to basically ask you

4185
05:18:34,789 --> 05:18:39,808
to Advance this MZO during this term of Council. I'm

4186
05:18:39,989 --> 05:18:41,568
gonna start with that And then I'm gonna come back

4187
05:18:42,149 --> 05:18:47,448
to that again at the end. First of all. Listening

4188
05:18:47,488 --> 05:18:51,460
to your discussion today. You can't build anything until you've

4189
05:18:51,500 --> 05:18:54,020
done the science on the land. And you can flush

4190
05:18:54,041 --> 05:18:58,696
the toilet and drink the water. We've done that We

4191
05:18:58,696 --> 05:19:02,536
have done working with your staff Intensive studies You can

4192
05:19:02,576 --> 05:19:06,136
see and I won't belabor Our deputation file But you

4193
05:19:06,176 --> 05:19:11,307
can see that. Uh Secondly Council Reporter You requested of

4194
05:19:11,488 --> 05:19:14,027
us to work for the MV's work with the MBCA.

4195
05:19:14,422 --> 05:19:17,761
We had an extremely positive day with them And then

4196
05:19:17,761 --> 05:19:21,921
they came back and continued their studies Of course And

4197
05:19:22,422 --> 05:19:27,521
to Chris Walmsley's credit We also had torrential rain that

4198
05:19:27,521 --> 05:19:32,444
day. So we walk through The land that was water.

4199
05:19:33,812 --> 05:19:36,031
And The land that wasn't And it was an excellent

4200
05:19:36,052 --> 05:19:40,671
opportunity for them to see Uh... What actually would happen

4201
05:19:40,932 --> 05:19:44,160
in such a circumstance. I Want to stress again and

4202
05:19:44,160 --> 05:19:48,320
thank you for listening to our Deputation Uh... Earlier last

4203
05:19:48,320 --> 05:19:52,434
year. This is an MZ 0 A ministerial zoning order.

4204
05:19:53,129 --> 05:19:56,788
It does not take away the control of the municipality.

4205
05:19:57,641 --> 05:20:03,940
The detailed planning process still continues The MZ O basically

4206
05:20:04,121 --> 05:20:08,145
changes the zoning on the land. We would be looking

4207
05:20:08,326 --> 05:20:10,865
to get that land zones so that we can build

4208
05:20:11,686 --> 05:20:16,820
612 units of workforce housing. Workforce listening to Mr. Crouch

4209
05:20:17,881 --> 05:20:20,500
and understanding having grown up in this area How that

4210
05:20:20,681 --> 05:20:28,820
term has changed greatly from industrial to now Uh... Recreational

4211
05:20:29,001 --> 05:20:33,900
service And of course Uh... Young professionals. All of whom

4212
05:20:33,900 --> 05:20:37,514
can't afford to buy home. I know young docks who

4213
05:20:37,615 --> 05:20:40,234
currently are existing in our community You can't do that

4214
05:20:40,575 --> 05:20:47,290
Young police officers Et cetera. So having said that. We

4215
05:20:47,471 --> 05:20:50,410
believe very much so that this will be a phased

4216
05:20:50,450 --> 05:20:53,930
project Stressing that again phased Rome was not built in

4217
05:20:53,970 --> 05:20:57,290
a day Right now If you're kind enough to move

4218
05:20:57,330 --> 05:21:01,050
this forward We're still looking at probably two years before

4219
05:21:01,551 --> 05:21:04,730
shovel can go in the ground Councillor Ardell's point about.

4220
05:21:05,300 --> 05:21:09,519
Municipalities It's not their obligation to build workforce housing is

4221
05:21:09,540 --> 05:21:13,874
correct. Just like it's not your obligation to build social

4222
05:21:13,975 --> 05:21:18,670
housing That's a county responsibility. We believe in the fact

4223
05:21:18,710 --> 05:21:22,430
that Mr. Boris Byrne Who was the president of the

4224
05:21:22,451 --> 05:21:27,598
Biden Group? We'll be paying for this The question Councillor

4225
05:21:27,598 --> 05:21:31,118
Maxwell asked about equity Well there's definitely equity for him

4226
05:21:31,379 --> 05:21:34,638
because he's insured in terms of his own businesses and

4227
05:21:34,678 --> 05:21:37,518
the businesses and Thornberry and the So Georgian base Surrounding

4228
05:21:37,518 --> 05:21:40,078
that area That they know that they'll have a place

4229
05:21:40,118 --> 05:21:43,345
for their workforce to work. To live and then work.

4230
05:21:45,558 --> 05:21:50,257
So my political experience asking you today When you come

4231
05:21:50,297 --> 05:21:55,906
to consider. B. 6. 2. We're asking you to consider

4232
05:21:56,327 --> 05:22:00,722
option one. Because what it comes down to if you

4233
05:22:00,743 --> 05:22:04,482
direct option one It still must go forward to the

4234
05:22:04,663 --> 05:22:09,762
minister and by experience I'm working with the hospital lands

4235
05:22:09,762 --> 05:22:15,547
and Collingwood. Which we were successful. The bureaucracy at Queens

4236
05:22:15,587 --> 05:22:18,027
Park still has to work with your Bureau of crats.

4237
05:22:19,442 --> 05:22:22,061
In terms of determining whether or not we meet The

4238
05:22:22,162 --> 05:22:25,633
need of what the municipality has stated. And I want

4239
05:22:25,633 --> 05:22:31,873
to say very strongly Congratulations to your CIO and Mr.

4240
05:22:32,134 --> 05:22:36,273
Posma and your engineering staff Because they were very difficult

4241
05:22:36,534 --> 05:22:39,793
to work with because they held us to the metal

4242
05:22:40,134 --> 05:22:43,793
And we believe we met those standards So by asking

4243
05:22:43,894 --> 05:22:47,217
for you to move forward now. We are ensuring that

4244
05:22:47,478 --> 05:22:51,057
at least it'll get to the minister probably for approval

4245
05:22:51,798 --> 05:22:55,377
After Christmas Knowing the way things move if we're lucky.

4246
05:22:56,217 --> 05:22:58,116
If we don't get it to the minister this year

4247
05:22:58,777 --> 05:23:01,236
We're looking at at least another year And when I

4248
05:23:01,236 --> 05:23:05,236
look at The fact that we are all discussing workforce

4249
05:23:05,276 --> 05:23:08,790
housing. I think that's an important thing to keep in

4250
05:23:08,790 --> 05:23:11,833
mind. So I'm going to close by letting Chris, who's

4251
05:23:11,833 --> 05:23:14,393
the director of Operations He would also like to speak

4252
05:23:15,134 --> 05:23:20,283
And then I'll come back quickly. Thank you. Um... I

4253
05:23:20,283 --> 05:23:24,123
just wanted to tie together Uh... A lot of the...

4254
05:23:24,384 --> 05:23:29,883
Comments, uh, pieces that I've heard all day Um... It

4255
05:23:29,923 --> 05:23:37,724
seems like the... Competing... goals... And wanting to have workforce

4256
05:23:37,764 --> 05:23:39,644
houses and kind of a chicken in the egg scenario

4257
05:23:40,145 --> 05:23:45,084
Where... Where... Businesses are needed to support The local economy

4258
05:23:45,745 --> 05:23:50,904
Um... Staffing is a difficult ask Um... And a lot

4259
05:23:50,904 --> 05:23:54,444
of businesses are being forced to put large capital into

4260
05:23:55,025 --> 05:23:59,404
buying And renting their own... Places to their own staff

4261
05:23:59,825 --> 05:24:02,960
In order to staff their own businesses. It's exponentially more

4262
05:24:03,061 --> 05:24:09,965
difficult when... It's seasonal. Um... And trying to have a

4263
05:24:09,965 --> 05:24:13,725
business that's sustainable Uh... Year over year and deal with

4264
05:24:13,746 --> 05:24:20,256
seasonal influxes with Staff and housing. And the point earlier

4265
05:24:20,357 --> 05:24:24,576
that was made about multiple professionals Young professionals trying to

4266
05:24:24,576 --> 05:24:28,256
come up to this Uh... And live up in the

4267
05:24:28,437 --> 05:24:34,576
Blue Mountains area Um... Biggest Opportunity wasn't necessarily The jobs

4268
05:24:34,616 --> 05:24:36,976
available It was whether they could afford to live here.

4269
05:24:37,753 --> 05:24:40,212
Um... To speak to a couple of the points Uh...

4270
05:24:40,953 --> 05:24:43,412
For getting their foot in the door Um... I think

4271
05:24:43,433 --> 05:24:48,532
that having a workforce housing project build like this 600

4272
05:24:48,572 --> 05:24:52,932
units roughly Uh... Proposed at this time would allow people

4273
05:24:53,513 --> 05:24:58,932
Young professionals service industry Um... Doctors PSWs to come up

4274
05:25:00,073 --> 05:25:03,732
and put roots into the community And accept the jobs

4275
05:25:03,732 --> 05:25:08,392
that are available at the time. And then save And

4276
05:25:08,392 --> 05:25:12,232
then as businesses are able to release some of their

4277
05:25:12,573 --> 05:25:14,792
properties That they have and put back into the market

4278
05:25:15,613 --> 05:25:19,992
It kind of fulfills Um... The next level of investment

4279
05:25:20,013 --> 05:25:22,312
back into the community Once people are here and working

4280
05:25:23,533 --> 05:25:26,312
I Don't think people really want to live this area

4281
05:25:26,813 --> 05:25:31,592
I think that once we've established that Precedent and the

4282
05:25:32,493 --> 05:25:36,016
lifestyle. Uh... I think it helps to fulfill not only

4283
05:25:36,037 --> 05:25:38,656
the economic side But also the future growth of the

4284
05:25:38,677 --> 05:25:45,820
community. The project As Terry mentioned Um... We'll be funded

4285
05:25:46,001 --> 05:25:53,051
purely by private funds. So this is a solution and

4286
05:25:53,072 --> 05:25:56,811
answer to a problem in a crisis That's currently ongoing.

4287
05:25:57,565 --> 05:26:02,344
Um... And as he mentioned We're hopeful that... An MZO

4288
05:26:02,525 --> 05:26:06,504
Um... Consideration Can move forward So we can look to

4289
05:26:07,725 --> 05:26:12,584
provide a very targeted and specific response to this Uh...

4290
05:26:12,845 --> 05:26:20,666
Ongoing issue and problem. Thanks. Thank You Chris. So just

4291
05:26:21,247 --> 05:26:23,546
to reiterate again What we would like to do is

4292
05:26:24,287 --> 05:26:26,986
to ask for you to look at Option 1 Which

4293
05:26:27,026 --> 05:26:30,506
would ensure of course The Public Meeting... Which is all

4294
05:26:30,506 --> 05:26:32,666
part of The Planning Process Where you get more Input

4295
05:26:32,847 --> 05:26:35,786
back from The Public Uh... Just a reminder that we

4296
05:26:35,826 --> 05:26:38,186
did hold a Public Meet Meeting in Thornberry And we

4297
05:26:38,186 --> 05:26:41,226
did hold some of you attended And we also did

4298
05:26:41,647 --> 05:26:46,545
hold one in The village itself. And... We had very

4299
05:26:46,566 --> 05:26:49,505
positive response The only one question that came out of

4300
05:26:49,505 --> 05:26:52,865
the village Which I think is important was some individuals

4301
05:26:52,905 --> 05:26:57,565
thought It was social housing It's not social housing. It's

4302
05:26:57,586 --> 05:27:01,645
workforce housing And defining workforce housing today It's anything from

4303
05:27:01,986 --> 05:27:05,885
a young professional Uh... Right through to someone who's a

4304
05:27:05,925 --> 05:27:11,237
young server at The Port Everywhere. Or Fabrica You name

4305
05:27:11,258 --> 05:27:13,799
The Great Restaurants up here. So. Thank You very much

4306
05:27:14,220 --> 05:27:18,399
Your Worship And... We're here to answer any questions. Thank

4307
05:27:18,399 --> 05:27:21,599
You very much Thank you I apologise Councillor Colt Yes

4308
05:27:21,700 --> 05:27:24,959
Chair Hope Chair Hope Yeah no problem So I see

4309
05:27:24,999 --> 05:27:26,779
that we have some hands up So first of all

4310
05:27:26,900 --> 05:27:30,559
Councillor Maxwell Then The Madam Mayor Go ahead Yeah Thank

4311
05:27:30,559 --> 05:27:35,504
you Chair And thank you for the deputation. Um I

4312
05:27:36,085 --> 05:27:42,250
have This question. Well two actually Um Have You did

4313
05:27:42,250 --> 05:27:47,105
you read The Auditor General's Report On the recent... MZ

4314
05:27:47,126 --> 05:27:50,225
O's... What their view of the myths But I'll leave

4315
05:27:50,265 --> 05:27:53,954
it at that. I Never read The Audi The General's

4316
05:27:53,994 --> 05:27:55,714
report But I can tell you that I do know

4317
05:27:55,735 --> 05:28:03,814
that The minister Uh... It's very strong Minister. Clark started

4318
05:28:03,854 --> 05:28:07,931
it. And our new current minister have very strong feelings

4319
05:28:07,952 --> 05:28:11,451
about The fact that you as a council And we

4320
05:28:11,712 --> 05:28:15,051
did in Collingwood Have The right to put in a

4321
05:28:15,072 --> 05:28:18,171
checks and balance So I do know that in the

4322
05:28:18,211 --> 05:28:23,889
beginning Some MZOs were abused. And I now know that

4323
05:28:23,990 --> 05:28:29,969
The ministers, Minister Flack And previous ministers have Mr. Calandra

4324
05:28:30,550 --> 05:28:34,745
have put very strict controls around that. So I'm very

4325
05:28:35,006 --> 05:28:39,305
comfortable in saying that An MZ O is most definitely

4326
05:28:39,486 --> 05:28:44,025
in the control of the municipality Okay That's fair I'm

4327
05:28:44,065 --> 05:28:46,825
just going by what The Auditor General said Because I

4328
05:28:46,926 --> 05:28:50,665
do believe that's another point of view And you as

4329
05:28:50,665 --> 05:28:54,105
a Previous But I'm also admitting that I also know

4330
05:28:54,126 --> 05:28:57,145
that some were not followed through on the way They

4331
05:28:57,185 --> 05:29:00,345
should have and minister Calandra if you followed that government

4332
05:29:01,566 --> 05:29:05,225
minister at the time Was very serious in directing that

4333
05:29:05,246 --> 05:29:07,785
those should be rescinded And in the case of the

4334
05:29:08,046 --> 05:29:12,345
Collingwood One For example We placed in line Which I

4335
05:29:12,385 --> 05:29:15,814
was proud to do as a former mirror. That a

4336
05:29:15,814 --> 05:29:19,014
division on those lands are not followed Then Council has

4337
05:29:19,054 --> 05:29:22,774
the right to rescind those Have that MZ O rescinded.

4338
05:29:22,814 --> 05:29:27,652
It's not about land speculation. Okay Well thank you on

4339
05:29:27,652 --> 05:29:31,514
that point Thank you. Second question Yeah because it was

4340
05:29:31,535 --> 05:29:34,167
just a lead into what I'm doing here Okay. So

4341
05:29:34,668 --> 05:29:40,150
what controls could the municipality put in place. To guarantee

4342
05:29:40,571 --> 05:29:46,870
That the Avellin won't become S - TAs or luxury

4343
05:29:46,891 --> 05:29:48,950
apartment buildings Because a lot of people have asked that

4344
05:29:48,971 --> 05:29:53,985
question It's an excellent question Council at Maxwell. Uh... First

4345
05:29:54,006 --> 05:29:56,145
of all I want to go back to the fact

4346
05:29:56,246 --> 05:29:59,745
that The MZ O only changes the zoning on the

4347
05:29:59,926 --> 05:30:04,495
land. You then control what's going to happen in the

4348
05:30:04,756 --> 05:30:08,534
site plan. And the detailed planning process that follows that.

4349
05:30:09,768 --> 05:30:11,907
The one control that I personally would put on it

4350
05:30:12,488 --> 05:30:16,250
And I've discussed this with The team. If the vision

4351
05:30:16,290 --> 05:30:19,130
on the land is not followed through on And you

4352
05:30:19,130 --> 05:30:23,913
will see that very early. And Council has a Opportunity

4353
05:30:24,014 --> 05:30:27,513
to rescind that You can look at other opportunities too

4354
05:30:27,614 --> 05:30:33,518
if you want. Before it's carried through on. Chair Hope

4355
05:30:33,558 --> 05:30:36,558
used the term committed earlier in the discussion around water

4356
05:30:36,979 --> 05:30:46,468
and development. We are committed to getting this done. Councillor

4357
05:30:46,508 --> 05:30:50,788
Porter mentioned The term uncertainty and where we're at right

4358
05:30:50,828 --> 05:30:56,083
now We are in very uncertain times. Mr. Crouch mentioned

4359
05:30:56,264 --> 05:31:01,923
The fact that we are in a situation Whereby Chair

4360
05:31:01,963 --> 05:31:06,206
Hope can we stick to the deputation. Sorry. Sorry Let's

4361
05:31:06,246 --> 05:31:08,766
go on to thank you We'll go on to Madam

4362
05:31:08,806 --> 05:31:13,441
Mayor. We're in a situation that Mr. Hold on I

4363
05:31:13,481 --> 05:31:16,721
think we've been asked to move forward So I'm going

4364
05:31:16,721 --> 05:31:18,721
to go on to the mayor Thank you Okay Thank

4365
05:31:18,721 --> 05:31:24,565
you. Okay, then I guess I have two questions Um

4366
05:31:24,826 --> 05:31:27,765
Thank you through the chair My first question is Um...

4367
05:31:28,106 --> 05:31:31,205
I've appreciated very much all the background documentation that's available

4368
05:31:31,226 --> 05:31:36,005
on the website Certainly the connection technologic development is there

4369
05:31:36,186 --> 05:31:38,405
The answers are there to look at One question I

4370
05:31:38,426 --> 05:31:41,925
have is with the recent visit Site visit of NVCA

4371
05:31:43,786 --> 05:31:47,365
and the resulting Uh... Reporting that we've seen both from

4372
05:31:47,626 --> 05:31:50,725
staff as well as what was submitted by you as

4373
05:31:50,765 --> 05:31:55,045
the proponents Um... There was some... And maybe this was

4374
05:31:55,045 --> 05:31:57,925
part of The Craig Leth The Craig Leaf Public Public

4375
05:31:57,965 --> 05:32:01,685
Input Session... There was some discussion about You know What

4376
05:32:01,725 --> 05:32:04,485
is The Community Impact in terms of it's a large

4377
05:32:04,506 --> 05:32:07,685
property There's some beautiful areas there Which NVCA would have

4378
05:32:07,685 --> 05:32:10,965
identified about which will not be built on But what

4379
05:32:10,965 --> 05:32:14,565
kind of discussion or what have you learned since you

4380
05:32:14,565 --> 05:32:17,045
last came forward to us about The Concept About a

4381
05:32:17,045 --> 05:32:19,845
circular trail For example going around the property so that

4382
05:32:20,026 --> 05:32:23,205
not just the 600 resins Not just the 600 units

4383
05:32:23,386 --> 05:32:25,925
would be able to benefit But that it will become...

4384
05:32:26,586 --> 05:32:30,565
A community impact imprint on The amenities that are available

4385
05:32:30,826 --> 05:32:34,104
there to everyone that lives in a gut area. First

4386
05:32:34,144 --> 05:32:37,224
of all trails were committed to any type of trails

4387
05:32:37,645 --> 05:32:40,344
That's the connectivity that we have in So George and

4388
05:32:40,384 --> 05:32:44,296
Bray I speak with great experience there. Do you want

4389
05:32:44,296 --> 05:32:48,616
to answer any of the Harris question on what the

4390
05:32:48,637 --> 05:32:52,696
buildings are going to be? Yeah So I think the

4391
05:32:53,117 --> 05:32:57,656
good section that we've left for tree Uh... That we

4392
05:32:57,656 --> 05:33:00,696
could look into doing different trails and connect to the

4393
05:33:01,037 --> 05:33:04,216
greater trail system Um right on grey road 19 there

4394
05:33:04,397 --> 05:33:08,696
So we've allocated quite a bit of amenity space Uh...

4395
05:33:09,197 --> 05:33:12,235
As well as connecting to future trails. And as well

4396
05:33:12,235 --> 05:33:17,240
as across the street existing trails. Okay Thank you Might

4397
05:33:17,280 --> 05:33:23,480
also your worship Uh... There will be guidelines in terms

4398
05:33:23,501 --> 05:33:27,197
of the architecture. And there will be a team managing

4399
05:33:27,858 --> 05:33:31,757
team management to ensure that it is workflowsizing No BNBs

4400
05:33:31,778 --> 05:33:35,623
Not Reynolds for skiers Et cetera. Mr. Byrne has made

4401
05:33:35,663 --> 05:33:39,323
total commitment to that. Okay Thank you Second question Madam

4402
05:33:39,363 --> 05:33:41,883
Mayor Certainly then I will ask a second question Because

4403
05:33:41,904 --> 05:33:44,683
we did hear a very related deputation just prior to

4404
05:33:45,984 --> 05:33:49,003
Bigger scope So to zero in on this particular deputation

4405
05:33:49,344 --> 05:33:53,723
The material has been shared online But if... In response

4406
05:33:53,763 --> 05:33:56,443
to The discussion that we've had about needing to have

4407
05:33:56,544 --> 05:34:00,683
The workforce housing in the right location Uh... My question

4408
05:34:00,704 --> 05:34:03,083
through the chair is could you please underscore the connection

4409
05:34:03,744 --> 05:34:07,563
about what you're trying to do What you are what

4410
05:34:07,584 --> 05:34:10,923
your group is trying to do specifically to fill a

4411
05:34:10,963 --> 05:34:14,123
specific need We heard generalities earlier I'd like to hear

4412
05:34:14,123 --> 05:34:18,997
that specifics Thank you Okay. Connectivity is everything. And as

4413
05:34:18,997 --> 05:34:21,797
Mr. Crouch said a moment ago gas prices are up

4414
05:34:21,898 --> 05:34:23,637
and has my mother told me they're not coming back

4415
05:34:23,677 --> 05:34:26,881
down once they go up. Uh the reality is that

4416
05:34:27,542 --> 05:34:33,441
we are going to be looking at Uh The whole

4417
05:34:33,481 --> 05:34:38,161
opportunity A for parking for those who can't afford cars

4418
05:34:38,982 --> 05:34:43,604
And most importantly for connectivity through Public Transit. And the

4419
05:34:43,604 --> 05:34:47,924
location where they are the buildings will be located in

4420
05:34:47,924 --> 05:34:52,084
the village There will be connectivity back to The workforce

4421
05:34:52,265 --> 05:34:54,804
that's needed in the village through either a trail system

4422
05:34:55,225 --> 05:35:00,484
or busing Uh... For those who have jobs up in

4423
05:35:00,524 --> 05:35:03,604
Tharnberry or Collingwood or whatever That will be a parking

4424
05:35:03,644 --> 05:35:11,689
situation. Thank you Alright, thank you Councillor Porter. Yes, thank

4425
05:35:11,689 --> 05:35:15,641
you. So I sit on another West Saga Conservationist Yes

4426
05:35:15,641 --> 05:35:18,739
I know. Okay. Anyways Thank you very much for your

4427
05:35:18,920 --> 05:35:21,779
deputation And I'm actually glad that you have been here

4428
05:35:21,880 --> 05:35:23,619
for most of the day So you would have heard

4429
05:35:24,520 --> 05:35:28,739
The earlier conversations where I expressed my concern about how

4430
05:35:28,779 --> 05:35:32,019
we're going to pay for The infrastructure Infrastructure that will

4431
05:35:32,019 --> 05:35:35,586
support this MZO. It's going to be a big cost.

4432
05:35:36,313 --> 05:35:42,052
So my question to you is because really The residents

4433
05:35:42,052 --> 05:35:44,532
of this town through their tax levy would have to

4434
05:35:44,633 --> 05:35:49,598
bankroll it. So with this development If you as you

4435
05:35:49,598 --> 05:35:53,278
do You want an MZO Have you considered front loading

4436
05:35:53,379 --> 05:35:57,198
any infrastructure costs to assist us in this process? Because

4437
05:35:57,198 --> 05:36:02,682
the GCs are now not collectible to occupancy. My I'm

4438
05:36:02,703 --> 05:36:06,202
known as the mayor who had The model that development

4439
05:36:06,202 --> 05:36:11,722
pays for development Council Reporter Then I expect you That's

4440
05:36:11,823 --> 05:36:14,042
a very fair question on your part But at the

4441
05:36:14,042 --> 05:36:16,202
same time I think that's something that would have to

4442
05:36:16,242 --> 05:36:19,162
be discussed with Mr. Burn The President I think is

4443
05:36:19,162 --> 05:36:23,162
a very fair question It for me it is the

4444
05:36:23,583 --> 05:36:26,922
question for me as far as I'm concerned because otherwise

4445
05:36:30,143 --> 05:36:31,882
Because right now, because you heard today I have very

4446
05:36:32,303 --> 05:36:36,750
big concerns about constructing in the event of planning. And

4447
05:36:36,790 --> 05:36:38,190
I'm one of these that I didn't need to be

4448
05:36:38,371 --> 05:36:40,270
told today that nothing's going to happen for a couple

4449
05:36:40,270 --> 05:36:43,310
of years So it is a big ticket item for

4450
05:36:43,411 --> 05:36:45,230
this town too I would and I'm going to use

4451
05:36:45,230 --> 05:36:48,830
the word bankroll Because that's what it is dret Waiting

4452
05:36:49,091 --> 05:36:51,747
for DCs to come in. And not knowing what's going

4453
05:36:51,747 --> 05:36:53,667
to happen with them So I guess I'm just sort

4454
05:36:53,667 --> 05:36:56,707
of saying with this development If you're asking for an

4455
05:36:56,747 --> 05:36:59,187
MZO looking to have some skin in the game that

4456
05:36:59,208 --> 05:37:01,667
if you need The infrastructure You play a role in

4457
05:37:01,707 --> 05:37:06,408
helping that happen. I understand that I also understand The

4458
05:37:06,589 --> 05:37:10,361
importance of workforce to a municipality. And I understand the

4459
05:37:10,401 --> 05:37:13,801
tax roles Lots of experience around that But I also

4460
05:37:14,062 --> 05:37:17,081
understand the essence and the spirit of community is still

4461
05:37:17,081 --> 05:37:19,561
based on supporting the workforce So that is a very

4462
05:37:19,561 --> 05:37:24,921
good question around the support financially That's one would go

4463
05:37:24,961 --> 05:37:29,269
back to Mr. Byrne. I just want to go on

4464
05:37:29,290 --> 05:37:31,269
I'd just like you to be made clear I'm very

4465
05:37:31,450 --> 05:37:35,382
supportive of workforce housing. And I have worked with McPherson

4466
05:37:35,403 --> 05:37:39,062
Builders as they have developed their concept I also introduced

4467
05:37:39,323 --> 05:37:42,822
home opportunities to The Town for Workforce Housing for St.

4468
05:37:42,822 --> 05:37:47,062
Louis Vis originally So I... These don't question my support

4469
05:37:47,102 --> 05:37:49,702
for work Process No I wasn't questioning you I was

4470
05:37:49,742 --> 05:37:51,742
uniting you and I together in the fact that we

4471
05:37:51,803 --> 05:37:55,622
support workforce hosing Okay Thank you Thanks very much On

4472
05:37:55,622 --> 05:37:58,982
to Council Sardell please Great Thank you Um and through

4473
05:37:58,982 --> 05:38:03,702
the chair Just on the continuation of the infrastructure Mr.

4474
05:38:03,723 --> 05:38:08,022
Getty's Um... When we develop five of those Um... Developments

4475
05:38:08,443 --> 05:38:12,162
Windfall Um... It was in second nature Then it was

4476
05:38:12,162 --> 05:38:15,382
something else And there was five developers that came And

4477
05:38:15,422 --> 05:38:20,102
they contributed 20 million dollars to upgrade and get the

4478
05:38:20,142 --> 05:38:25,222
infrastructure there So along with Councillor Porter I think that's

4479
05:38:25,643 --> 05:38:28,502
what as a town I have that experience sitting here

4480
05:38:29,083 --> 05:38:32,502
That maybe that's the other discussion So you would have

4481
05:38:32,502 --> 05:38:35,782
to take that away as well And I think it's

4482
05:38:35,822 --> 05:38:39,702
a very good point My second point would be If

4483
05:38:39,702 --> 05:38:42,422
we put an MZ O on this We did that

4484
05:38:42,443 --> 05:38:46,182
at 120... We didn't The Council Previous Put an MZ

4485
05:38:46,283 --> 05:38:49,382
O on it Just before we came in And then

4486
05:38:49,643 --> 05:38:52,022
they deliberated Then it went to a chia Then the

4487
05:38:52,062 --> 05:38:54,902
chia came off Now it's an MZ0 But that M

4488
05:38:54,902 --> 05:38:58,582
said Oh it's still on there And I was told

4489
05:38:59,083 --> 05:39:04,102
that we cannot take this off And I had discussions

4490
05:39:04,683 --> 05:39:10,102
Um... And... At AMO And I was just recently elected

4491
05:39:10,123 --> 05:39:14,502
to The Caucus again at Amos So congratulations by the

4492
05:39:14,502 --> 05:39:17,702
way I've got some experience in some connections over all

4493
05:39:17,702 --> 05:39:22,102
these years with people there So that's where I'm a

4494
05:39:22,102 --> 05:39:26,102
little confused with speaking with MPP Flak Um... Of how

4495
05:39:26,283 --> 05:39:30,102
these MZOs are going to work Because how do we

4496
05:39:30,142 --> 05:39:32,902
get that off? Because we've got a property out there

4497
05:39:33,883 --> 05:39:36,502
that Well it must be shovel ready too That's the

4498
05:39:36,542 --> 05:39:39,862
newest thing I agree But newest If I can't get

4499
05:39:39,862 --> 05:39:43,762
ready Councillor Ardell Another extremely valid point One of the

4500
05:39:43,762 --> 05:39:45,942
conditions that I know what I would put on It

4501
05:39:45,982 --> 05:39:52,737
would be a timeline. Timeline to construction. Yes And if

4502
05:39:52,737 --> 05:39:56,643
that doesn't work. Those were the old days Those conditions

4503
05:39:56,744 --> 05:40:00,163
can be there now Timeline the construction Timeline to the

4504
05:40:00,184 --> 05:40:05,342
vision Timeline to the commitment. Most important thing is that...

4505
05:40:05,843 --> 05:40:08,142
I'm involved in this because of the passion for it.

4506
05:40:09,255 --> 05:40:14,914
The reality is that Mr. Byrne is attempting to fulfill

4507
05:40:14,935 --> 05:40:20,164
a need with private money. The municipality and share obligation

4508
05:40:20,585 --> 05:40:24,244
as council to ensure that the community municipality has not

4509
05:40:24,244 --> 05:40:28,115
put at risk. Put those conditions in. You can work

4510
05:40:28,155 --> 05:40:30,595
with your staff to do that What we're asking today

4511
05:40:31,016 --> 05:40:36,275
is you consider option one Which will allow that to

4512
05:40:36,536 --> 05:40:38,355
happen Chris You want to see it? Sorry I just

4513
05:40:38,376 --> 05:40:42,035
wanted to say one quick thing Just about Umfructure and

4514
05:40:42,075 --> 05:40:46,595
additional Um of the places you're referencing are for quite

4515
05:40:46,616 --> 05:40:51,915
larger homes and If it gets factored in, then I

4516
05:40:51,915 --> 05:40:54,675
think that increases the cost the overall cost of the

4517
05:40:54,696 --> 05:40:58,835
units The rental would increase with it Uh... Kind of...

4518
05:40:59,496 --> 05:41:03,555
To scale. Um... So it is something we can consider

4519
05:41:03,976 --> 05:41:06,895
However I think it'll increase the overall rent in the

4520
05:41:06,895 --> 05:41:11,155
feasibility of the project remaining Workforce Housing Um... And also

4521
05:41:12,056 --> 05:41:15,155
talking about Um... All day about The kind of flat

4522
05:41:15,656 --> 05:41:19,555
and people not necessarily building right now Um... We're still

4523
05:41:19,555 --> 05:41:22,595
proposing to build and move forward with it So earlier

4524
05:41:22,616 --> 05:41:26,955
they had mentioned only 100 units roughly This year, a

4525
05:41:26,955 --> 05:41:32,115
slight decrease over Uh... And... You know the... I apologise

4526
05:41:32,136 --> 05:41:36,195
The First Women Forest The gentleman mentioned Correct Mr. Crouch

4527
05:41:36,216 --> 05:41:39,555
Excuse me Um mentioned that Um... You know He doesn't

4528
05:41:39,595 --> 05:41:42,755
see anything being flat for the next two to three

4529
05:41:42,755 --> 05:41:46,995
years Um So we're proposing a solution Um... That would

4530
05:41:48,856 --> 05:41:53,555
solve housing crisis for workforce housing Um... We can definitely

4531
05:41:53,736 --> 05:41:55,875
look into the other piece But again I think it's

4532
05:41:55,875 --> 05:41:58,755
just gonna inflate the overall cost of the project Um

4533
05:41:59,176 --> 05:42:01,555
And if we don't have a need with the capacity

4534
05:42:01,976 --> 05:42:04,355
If the capacity is down Uh... Maybe we can do

4535
05:42:04,395 --> 05:42:06,595
it in a phased approach and allow us to slowly

4536
05:42:06,616 --> 05:42:11,155
build in and structure as other things come online Towards

4537
05:42:11,176 --> 05:42:15,866
the natural development of upgrades. Yeah And don't get me

4538
05:42:15,906 --> 05:42:18,826
wrong I'm all about workplace housing Mr. Gettys You know

4539
05:42:18,826 --> 05:42:22,426
that I had two daycares And my families needed You

4540
05:42:22,426 --> 05:42:24,746
know They need a daycare And they needed workplace housing

4541
05:42:24,767 --> 05:42:30,626
So it is in order Um... But I have to

4542
05:42:31,407 --> 05:42:34,586
go back to the ministry and get some more of

4543
05:42:34,586 --> 05:42:38,106
my questions answered from Mr. Flack Because I have a

4544
05:42:38,106 --> 05:42:40,986
direct pipeline now So I can get some answers But

4545
05:42:41,407 --> 05:42:44,586
yeah, it'll be interesting to see So thank you Okay

4546
05:42:44,927 --> 05:42:47,946
On to the Deputy Mayor Thank you Madam Chair Through

4547
05:42:47,986 --> 05:42:51,306
you Um In regards to you know when you People

4548
05:42:51,346 --> 05:42:54,826
hear the initial MZO Those are scary three initials for

4549
05:42:54,826 --> 05:42:59,466
people Um other residents and things like Um... Because they're

4550
05:42:59,466 --> 05:43:02,586
not sure What happens because they feel all permissions come

4551
05:43:02,626 --> 05:43:05,626
off the land We did declare a housing crisis in

4552
05:43:05,626 --> 05:43:07,866
the community Um... We're nowhere near hitting any of these

4553
05:43:07,887 --> 05:43:12,426
targets Everybody has talked about since Before my time on

4554
05:43:12,466 --> 05:43:16,826
council Ray pairs You know housing Housing Housing So What

4555
05:43:17,407 --> 05:43:18,906
And I won't get into the specifics of the report

4556
05:43:18,927 --> 05:43:20,826
Because we're gonna be discussing that in the options available

4557
05:43:20,927 --> 05:43:23,146
to us and what one does as leads to a

4558
05:43:23,146 --> 05:43:25,786
Public Meeting and not make any commitments But I guess

4559
05:43:26,367 --> 05:43:28,826
my question to you is in my concern is This

4560
05:43:29,007 --> 05:43:31,706
is directly across from now What was going to be

4561
05:43:32,127 --> 05:43:38,106
I think The original concept of the area I think

4562
05:43:38,287 --> 05:43:41,946
people thought about secondary residents Um skiing And that's become

4563
05:43:41,986 --> 05:43:44,986
a community now Similar to we have in Laura Bay

4564
05:43:45,087 --> 05:43:49,546
Clarksburg Thornberry So this directly Um in that same area.

4565
05:43:50,103 --> 05:43:54,402
How do you feel the fit into the community Putting

4566
05:43:54,903 --> 05:43:58,642
612 I think it is units into there with some

4567
05:43:58,823 --> 05:44:01,602
height densities that are only seen at the village I

4568
05:44:01,642 --> 05:44:03,282
know you said you're going to take it away from

4569
05:44:03,282 --> 05:44:06,002
the road You're going to step the building But fitting

4570
05:44:06,042 --> 05:44:08,082
into the I don't want to use it where character

4571
05:44:08,183 --> 05:44:10,242
like we always do But fitting into the character of

4572
05:44:10,282 --> 05:44:12,722
the community Which is now a school bus jobs and

4573
05:44:12,762 --> 05:44:15,522
things like that And it's already a very busy intersection

4574
05:44:16,183 --> 05:44:18,642
Yeah a lot of the structure and the design of

4575
05:44:18,642 --> 05:44:23,442
the whole project is based around First of all Exciting

4576
05:44:23,463 --> 05:44:25,362
place for people to live Uh they want to be

4577
05:44:25,463 --> 05:44:28,482
passionate and excited about living there But also the surrounding

4578
05:44:28,482 --> 05:44:31,922
community As well as creating its own little community Uh,

4579
05:44:31,943 --> 05:44:36,642
as well So we're looking at doing commercial and stuff

4580
05:44:36,743 --> 05:44:40,722
in there to try and create a kind of self

4581
05:44:40,762 --> 05:44:44,962
- sustained Uh... Quick shops and stuff like that Um,

4582
05:44:45,002 --> 05:44:47,042
but I think how it integrates in as far as

4583
05:44:47,383 --> 05:44:50,882
look and appeal Um We're not looking for a drastic

4584
05:44:51,063 --> 05:44:56,082
variance It's to go with the surrounding community and the

4585
05:44:56,183 --> 05:45:00,242
appearance Uh... kind of everything around Um... And to try

4586
05:45:00,263 --> 05:45:03,257
and integrate in as best we can. Thank you Just

4587
05:45:03,257 --> 05:45:05,977
a quick follow - up Go ahead Yeah Thank you

4588
05:45:05,977 --> 05:45:07,977
for that In a community with a community Another Committee

4589
05:45:07,998 --> 05:45:11,657
is great So do you anticipate I could see people's

4590
05:45:11,657 --> 05:45:13,897
fear saying Oh this is going to be You know

4591
05:45:13,897 --> 05:45:17,097
dorm rooms And people work You know Just Where do

4592
05:45:17,137 --> 05:45:19,417
you and not to get too far into the detailed

4593
05:45:19,518 --> 05:45:22,537
minutiae of the design But do you see families living

4594
05:45:22,958 --> 05:45:27,017
there Um... You know The server at the port I

4595
05:45:27,198 --> 05:45:29,737
know virtually all of them So they are with families

4596
05:45:29,918 --> 05:45:31,897
and married And children who will go to school and

4597
05:45:31,897 --> 05:45:33,977
things like that So is that part of the anticipation

4598
05:45:34,238 --> 05:45:35,577
you see of this community that you're going to build

4599
05:45:35,678 --> 05:45:39,097
for the workforce housing? Correct Yeah so we're looking at

4600
05:45:39,358 --> 05:45:41,977
one two and three bedroom units So different size families

4601
05:45:42,398 --> 05:45:49,497
and different Different ability for each home to house each

4602
05:45:49,518 --> 05:45:53,925
family. Thank you. And deputy Mayor There would also be

4603
05:45:53,965 --> 05:45:58,422
amenities put in place for those families. Councillor McKinley Thank

4604
05:45:58,422 --> 05:46:00,822
you for your patience Go ahead No problem Thank you

4605
05:46:01,323 --> 05:46:03,622
Madam Chair and through you to the gentleman Thank you

4606
05:46:03,662 --> 05:46:07,542
for your presentation I greatly appreciate the opportunity that you're

4607
05:46:07,582 --> 05:46:11,302
bringing forward Uh So the At the end of the

4608
05:46:11,302 --> 05:46:15,222
day at like As Mr. Crouch had said with real

4609
05:46:15,262 --> 05:46:18,582
estate You know it's all location location location So to

4610
05:46:18,582 --> 05:46:21,142
me this fits the bill It's right on a transit

4611
05:46:21,182 --> 05:46:24,582
route It's not right beside a whole bunch of people's

4612
05:46:24,622 --> 05:46:28,102
homes with five stories looking down into their Uh because

4613
05:46:28,102 --> 05:46:31,302
I do recall an initial discussion about that This is

4614
05:46:31,302 --> 05:46:35,382
a different design A different take Now I know it's

4615
05:46:35,422 --> 05:46:37,302
there again Uh madam chair I'm going to stick to

4616
05:46:37,403 --> 05:46:42,342
parameters of the request here Um, but do you propose

4617
05:46:42,443 --> 05:46:46,582
that because for design wise I did read how it's

4618
05:46:46,763 --> 05:46:49,142
or I reread really refresh my memory there that it's

4619
05:46:49,403 --> 05:46:53,702
uh... To be The wedding cake or the staged Now

4620
05:46:53,803 --> 05:46:56,902
is that in the same manner to mirror across the

4621
05:46:56,942 --> 05:46:59,622
street at the corner of windfall with that That is

4622
05:46:59,622 --> 05:47:04,102
a particular design that has several stories that you that

4623
05:47:04,203 --> 05:47:07,522
is integrated so well that you can't really notice. Is

4624
05:47:07,522 --> 05:47:11,522
that the intent You're a hundred percent correct The first

4625
05:47:11,522 --> 05:47:15,842
building is along 19 would be three stories Right And

4626
05:47:15,882 --> 05:47:18,082
knowing I was a situation and Collingwood with people that

4627
05:47:18,122 --> 05:47:21,122
I know and love dearly Uh, they have an apartment

4628
05:47:21,162 --> 05:47:23,442
building behind them where they can't vote on their own

4629
05:47:23,442 --> 05:47:27,152
deck. We're not going to let that happen Right. Right

4630
05:47:28,933 --> 05:47:30,752
I'm not here to pick the petunias to go into

4631
05:47:30,773 --> 05:47:35,952
planters either Exactly Um, but Sorry through you Madam Chair.

4632
05:47:37,881 --> 05:47:39,860
I'm not trying to be funny I'm just saying like

4633
05:47:39,900 --> 05:47:44,100
I can appreciate Um I you know I appreciate what

4634
05:47:44,121 --> 05:47:46,900
you're bringing forward and the fact that as we recall

4635
05:47:47,241 --> 05:47:48,900
You're you know it's not a five story building That's

4636
05:47:49,241 --> 05:47:52,100
that no matter what buffering or what kind of trees

4637
05:47:52,201 --> 05:47:54,340
might be put in You'd still be looking right down

4638
05:47:54,521 --> 05:47:57,940
into somebody's backyard or their back windows So this is

4639
05:47:57,940 --> 05:48:02,100
not it Um just as a follow - up or

4640
05:48:02,140 --> 05:48:05,620
quickly Madam chair Uh the Public Engagement you had with

4641
05:48:05,641 --> 05:48:09,060
the couple of properties that are nearby Um, did they

4642
05:48:09,721 --> 05:48:14,500
participate in the engagement process so far So far Yeah,

4643
05:48:14,500 --> 05:48:17,380
we did a bunch of active surveys Uh in different

4644
05:48:17,380 --> 05:48:20,420
communities So we did Collingwood Blue Mountain as well as

4645
05:48:20,521 --> 05:48:23,620
Thornberry Uh, business owners and got their feedback on it

4646
05:48:24,041 --> 05:48:27,780
Uh, as well as the home right in the middle

4647
05:48:27,820 --> 05:48:31,380
that used to own the property as well Um, they

4648
05:48:31,561 --> 05:48:37,191
sold it to us and our residing there. Once they

4649
05:48:38,172 --> 05:48:40,191
passed It was their family home So they want to

4650
05:48:40,191 --> 05:48:43,191
stay there But they know the idea and the scope

4651
05:48:43,231 --> 05:48:46,791
and what the plan is And they're excited about it.

4652
05:48:47,714 --> 05:48:51,853
Yeah Okay I appreciate that Uh very much that you

4653
05:48:51,853 --> 05:48:55,453
know you've gone that extra mile to Engage the people

4654
05:48:55,474 --> 05:48:58,413
that would be You know that are directly affected by

4655
05:48:58,594 --> 05:49:01,613
any kind of a build Whether it's three stories, five

4656
05:49:01,634 --> 05:49:04,813
more stories, five stories Or any kind of stories Uh,

4657
05:49:05,234 --> 05:49:07,853
just a final one Madam Chair And I won't I

4658
05:49:07,893 --> 05:49:11,453
won't belabor this But at the end of the day

4659
05:49:11,874 --> 05:49:14,253
You know I appreciate what you're I appreciate what you're

4660
05:49:14,253 --> 05:49:16,413
bringing forward And I'm all for it Because at the

4661
05:49:16,413 --> 05:49:18,653
end of the day You're talking about You know We

4662
05:49:18,914 --> 05:49:22,493
know that, you know along with agriculture is a tourism

4663
05:49:22,674 --> 05:49:26,893
is our main driver Is like agriculture is one of

4664
05:49:26,933 --> 05:49:30,653
the biggest drivers Um, but our tourism is what's going

4665
05:49:30,653 --> 05:49:35,533
to carry us through these turbulent darkened lonely times And

4666
05:49:35,714 --> 05:49:39,053
that's where in order to buffer or to facilitate that

4667
05:49:39,954 --> 05:49:42,653
These folks need a place to stay So I'm all

4668
05:49:42,693 --> 05:49:45,457
for it Thank you. Thank You Council McKinley Um that

4669
05:49:45,718 --> 05:49:50,977
leaves me for questions Um first one is you mentioned

4670
05:49:51,798 --> 05:49:56,497
busing And I'm going to add in services So is

4671
05:49:56,518 --> 05:50:00,337
that a consideration that you'll be providing bussing services To

4672
05:50:00,358 --> 05:50:05,857
the workforce or to specific members of the workforced So

4673
05:50:06,038 --> 05:50:09,777
far right now we have proposed bus within the community

4674
05:50:09,958 --> 05:50:14,097
like a stop Um, we have Bike racks and things

4675
05:50:14,097 --> 05:50:17,777
like that as well Um Depending on we've had initial

4676
05:50:17,878 --> 05:50:25,217
talks with different businesses and in the village And a

4677
05:50:25,217 --> 05:50:29,537
lot of them are interested in quite large numbers I

4678
05:50:29,577 --> 05:50:32,657
could foresee them doing something for a bus to connect

4679
05:50:33,398 --> 05:50:36,977
Um, but it's still early in the planning But it

4680
05:50:36,977 --> 05:50:41,590
has been discussed already, yes. Okay, thank you And that

4681
05:50:41,691 --> 05:50:44,710
I'm hopefully integrated with other busing solutions Other transit solutions

4682
05:50:46,011 --> 05:50:49,190
It would be integrated with the Collingwood Blue Mountain Lincoln

4683
05:50:49,611 --> 05:50:52,950
Okay Thank you very much And the second one Normally

4684
05:50:52,950 --> 05:50:55,510
we don't include Staff when it's a deputation But since

4685
05:50:55,550 --> 05:50:57,430
I'm The chair I'm going to take advantage of that

4686
05:50:57,931 --> 05:51:01,270
So through myself I'm going to ask C. R. C.

4687
05:51:01,270 --> 05:51:03,590
A. O. I think it's very important that we have

4688
05:51:03,931 --> 05:51:08,390
correct information about MZ O's So it is my understanding

4689
05:51:08,811 --> 05:51:12,790
as it is out of Councillor Dell as well That

4690
05:51:12,790 --> 05:51:18,230
once an MZO is granted on property It cannot be

4691
05:51:18,251 --> 05:51:22,550
lifted That's been our experience And I'm just wondering through

4692
05:51:22,550 --> 05:51:26,710
me to CAO Do you have a comment on that

4693
05:51:27,291 --> 05:51:32,434
please. Uh Yes through the chair It would likely be

4694
05:51:32,455 --> 05:51:35,314
at the minister's discretion In terms of if it was

4695
05:51:35,495 --> 05:51:37,954
to be lifted to the point earlier There's been some

4696
05:51:38,135 --> 05:51:42,274
changes governing Uh MZ O's to which Uh... And that's

4697
05:51:42,274 --> 05:51:45,714
something We remain kind of in certainly the staff report

4698
05:51:45,975 --> 05:51:50,674
Maybe could Outline this as well in understanding the conditions

4699
05:51:50,775 --> 05:51:52,994
That could be applied Den Zedos Because that was not

4700
05:51:53,034 --> 05:51:59,113
previously The Previously The case. Yeah then That's what we're

4701
05:51:59,153 --> 05:52:01,353
living with right now So I think for our audience

4702
05:52:01,393 --> 05:52:04,393
We want to make sure that they have the full

4703
05:52:04,734 --> 05:52:08,713
background Uh... And look forward to the Staff Report Okay

4704
05:52:08,734 --> 05:52:12,643
Thank you very much. Councillor Maxwell We're going We're talking

4705
05:52:12,824 --> 05:52:17,946
second pass Do we really need it? Battery Snap Yeah

4706
05:52:17,986 --> 05:52:22,855
Thank you It's very snappy. Okay Thank you Great Council

4707
05:52:22,855 --> 05:52:25,584
Artel You have another one. I do too Okay Alright

4708
05:52:25,765 --> 05:52:29,344
obviously then I need to accept a second No it's

4709
05:52:29,344 --> 05:52:31,424
okay I'll accept a second Pass I have to offer

4710
05:52:31,525 --> 05:52:34,544
to all members of Council Go ahead Thanks for Maxwell.

4711
05:52:36,448 --> 05:52:41,307
So So you're going to be the owner The Biller

4712
05:52:41,347 --> 05:52:46,402
of this building The product. Uh proponent of It's under...

4713
05:52:46,402 --> 05:52:49,752
Yes. Yeah Okay. So and the idea is to create

4714
05:52:49,773 --> 05:52:54,232
workforce housing for I'm assuming Blue Mountain and the Blue

4715
05:52:54,272 --> 05:52:57,512
Mountain Village Is that correct? Uh The Community The Greater

4716
05:52:57,512 --> 05:53:01,592
Community And we're planning on utilising it as well Yes

4717
05:53:02,253 --> 05:53:09,146
Also it would include Collingwood Thornberry Instrounding Area. So the

4718
05:53:09,186 --> 05:53:14,876
Workforce Housing is also going to serve as Collingwood. Okay

4719
05:53:15,857 --> 05:53:18,556
The region I would hope that we all think as

4720
05:53:18,556 --> 05:53:22,203
regionalists And we supported you. Know from day to time

4721
05:53:22,203 --> 05:53:27,834
anywhere Okay. Thank you But the reality is is that

4722
05:53:28,255 --> 05:53:34,474
you have a plant Agnora Which is beside basically not

4723
05:53:34,514 --> 05:53:36,474
that far from where it's going to be built And

4724
05:53:36,474 --> 05:53:38,554
I will guarantee you that a lot of residents who

4725
05:53:38,594 --> 05:53:42,411
currently live in Thornberry Potentially work in that plant. It

4726
05:53:42,752 --> 05:53:46,331
just like in Collingwood We have many people who work

4727
05:53:46,352 --> 05:53:49,656
at the village in Blue Mountain and vice versa. So

4728
05:53:49,696 --> 05:53:51,896
when it comes to housing I do not look upon

4729
05:53:52,157 --> 05:53:54,536
that as a political issue I look upon it is

4730
05:53:54,536 --> 05:53:58,056
something to provide for people And that's been the statement

4731
05:53:58,077 --> 05:54:00,920
that I gave to Mr. Byrne. Okay Thank you Council

4732
05:54:00,960 --> 05:54:03,560
Ardell Uh yes I'll be very quick So when we

4733
05:54:03,600 --> 05:54:08,280
bring families into this workplace housing Uh Mr. Getty You

4734
05:54:08,280 --> 05:54:11,080
being a principal previously How do we get the schools

4735
05:54:11,080 --> 05:54:14,040
to even talk to us? Because we need a school

4736
05:54:14,141 --> 05:54:16,520
in Craig Neef And if we're going to have lots

4737
05:54:16,541 --> 05:54:20,760
more children with 615 homes We need a school So

4738
05:54:20,861 --> 05:54:23,160
would you be willing to go to the board for

4739
05:54:23,200 --> 05:54:29,720
us? You so deem that we would be there to

4740
05:54:29,741 --> 05:54:33,909
support you with The increase that student population. Thank you.

4741
05:54:34,683 --> 05:54:39,302
Thank you very much With no portables Uh I don't

4742
05:54:39,323 --> 05:54:41,622
see any other hands I do want to grant everyone

4743
05:54:41,883 --> 05:54:45,521
Oh Madam Mayor Go ahead. Thank you Well just I

4744
05:54:45,622 --> 05:54:48,801
just would like to revisit just for clarity The comment

4745
05:54:49,302 --> 05:54:52,721
So I am hearing through the chair to The deputance

4746
05:54:52,822 --> 05:54:55,521
if you could just confirm What I'm hearing is that

4747
05:54:55,542 --> 05:54:58,801
this is very much about residents of the Blue Mountains

4748
05:54:58,982 --> 05:55:01,841
Finding something affordable to live in so that they are

4749
05:55:01,881 --> 05:55:05,121
close enough to their workplace their workplace may be within

4750
05:55:05,121 --> 05:55:07,281
the Town Blue Mountains It may be something that's on

4751
05:55:07,321 --> 05:55:10,001
the outlie But here they are in our town trying

4752
05:55:10,041 --> 05:55:12,241
to stay in our town and can't find a reasonable

4753
05:55:12,262 --> 05:55:18,283
place to live Is that correct? Thank you. Okay Thank

4754
05:55:18,323 --> 05:55:22,117
you Madam Mayor. Anyone else. Because I can see that

4755
05:55:22,157 --> 05:55:24,677
we wanted The second pass Alright If we could please

4756
05:55:24,677 --> 05:55:28,037
have the motion put up Thank you challenge Thank you

4757
05:55:28,037 --> 05:55:31,877
very much Gentleman Both of you And the motion I'm

4758
05:55:31,877 --> 05:55:34,197
looking for mover in a second Moment that Council The

4759
05:55:34,237 --> 05:55:37,157
Town Blue Mountains receives the Deputation of Terry Gede's Project

4760
05:55:37,338 --> 05:55:41,717
Coordinator Cold Coordinator And Chris Walmsley Director of Operations The

4761
05:55:41,818 --> 05:55:45,317
Byte - em Group regarding Grey Road 19 Workforce Housing.

4762
05:55:45,317 --> 05:55:47,077
Who's a mover in a secondary? So move Madam Chair

4763
05:55:47,658 --> 05:55:52,243
Council Second And seconded by The Mayor. I Don't see

4764
05:55:52,243 --> 05:55:55,043
any hands up for any further discussion So I'll call

4765
05:55:55,043 --> 05:55:56,403
the boat Avote is open.

4766
05:56:16,745 --> 05:56:20,083
The vote is closed. Thank you That motion is carried

4767
05:56:20,184 --> 05:56:23,621
7 - 0 with everyone in the chamber. Alright Thank

4768
05:56:23,621 --> 05:56:25,941
you very much Now we're moving on to the Public

4769
05:56:26,202 --> 05:56:29,221
Comment period I'm aware that there are some members of

4770
05:56:29,261 --> 05:56:32,101
the Public Who would like to speak It's regarding matters

4771
05:56:32,202 --> 05:56:34,501
included in the planning and building portion of The Meeting

4772
05:56:35,162 --> 05:56:37,461
Before I read this Did we have a... We do

4773
05:56:37,461 --> 05:56:42,216
our respect Um... Respectful behaviour. Um... Reeding earlier this morning

4774
05:56:42,477 --> 05:56:45,225
Right We did not actually. Madam Jay We did not

4775
05:56:45,566 --> 05:56:46,905
Okay I'm going to ask you to go ahead with

4776
05:56:46,945 --> 05:56:49,195
that first Thank you. And then I'll do mine.

4777
05:57:01,647 --> 05:57:03,946
Before we begin I would like to remind everyone The

4778
05:57:04,047 --> 05:57:06,106
Town of The Blue Mountains is committed to maintain a

4779
05:57:06,127 --> 05:57:10,186
safe Respectful and professional environment for all meetings and interactions

4780
05:57:10,287 --> 05:57:13,786
involving Council, the Public and Townstaff And accordance with the

4781
05:57:13,807 --> 05:57:19,866
Town's Respectful Public Interactions Policy PUL COR 2207 Courteous and

4782
05:57:19,906 --> 05:57:23,786
Respectful Communication is required at all times Behaviour that is

4783
05:57:23,826 --> 05:57:27,786
disruptive inappropriate or disrespectful will not be tolerated This includes

4784
05:57:27,967 --> 05:57:32,106
any comments or conduct that is threatening harassing discriminatory or

4785
05:57:32,127 --> 05:57:35,786
abusive All speakers are expected to address council and staff

4786
05:57:35,967 --> 05:57:39,146
respectfully and keep comments focused on the matter before Council

4787
05:57:39,567 --> 05:57:42,506
If these expectations are not met The chair may issue

4788
05:57:42,506 --> 05:57:44,986
a warning direct the speaker to stop or take further

4789
05:57:45,007 --> 05:57:48,106
steps to maintain order and ensure The meeting can proceed.

4790
05:57:50,204 --> 05:57:54,023
Thank you Madam Deputy Clerk Um... Every speaker is allotted

4791
05:57:54,044 --> 05:57:57,703
Three minutes and there'll be a bell when you've got

4792
05:57:57,724 --> 05:58:02,983
one minute left Uh And this is The Pradyute In

4793
05:58:02,983 --> 05:58:07,143
accordance with the Town Procedural bylaw 2026 - 44 10

4794
05:58:07,143 --> 05:58:09,143
minutes is allotted at the beginning and end of each

4795
05:58:09,164 --> 05:58:11,223
section of the Committee of the whole meeting To receive

4796
05:58:11,564 --> 05:58:15,463
Public comments regarding the matters included on the agenda Each

4797
05:58:15,503 --> 05:58:18,183
person shall provide their name and address and is required

4798
05:58:18,183 --> 05:58:21,383
to address their comments to the chair Comments shall not

4799
05:58:21,423 --> 05:58:26,023
refer to personal litigation or potential litigation matters Or being

4800
05:58:26,124 --> 05:58:28,263
response to matters that have been the subject of a

4801
05:58:28,263 --> 05:58:31,463
Public meeting It being noted that the verbal commenting period

4802
05:58:31,484 --> 05:58:35,543
has ended. Written correspondence may still be received in response

4803
05:58:35,583 --> 05:58:37,303
to matters that have been The subject of a Public

4804
05:58:37,404 --> 05:58:40,743
Meeting If a person is unable to personally attend the

4805
05:58:40,764 --> 05:58:43,463
meeting or during any period where an emergency has been

4806
05:58:43,503 --> 05:58:46,823
declared to exist in the municipality They shall provide their

4807
05:58:46,863 --> 05:58:49,143
Public comments and writing to the clerk in advance of

4808
05:58:49,143 --> 05:58:51,383
the meeting where the clerk to read on behalf of

4809
05:58:51,383 --> 05:58:55,223
the author during the Public Comment period So first of

4810
05:58:55,223 --> 05:58:57,983
all Madam Deputy Clerk Have you received any comments? We

4811
05:58:57,983 --> 05:59:00,583
have not for the station anymore Uh and in the

4812
05:59:00,684 --> 05:59:02,663
chamber hands up those of you who would like to

4813
05:59:02,663 --> 05:59:06,452
make a comment. Okay Just one member of the chamber

4814
05:59:06,873 --> 05:59:10,772
Okay Alright thank you very much Uh If you'd like

4815
05:59:10,772 --> 05:59:13,492
to come forward again three minutes with a little minute

4816
05:59:13,532 --> 05:59:15,492
warning And if we could have your name and your

4817
05:59:15,492 --> 05:59:18,852
address Please Um I'm Angela Greenway and I live at

4818
05:59:19,193 --> 05:59:23,602
135 Claire Glenn in The Town of Blue Mountains. Uh

4819
05:59:23,623 --> 05:59:27,202
I'm a member of the South Glen Rate Pairs Association.

4820
05:59:28,282 --> 05:59:31,221
As local residents we are expressing our concerns regarding The

4821
05:59:31,322 --> 05:59:37,412
proposed MZO for grey road 19 housing development. To be

4822
05:59:37,412 --> 05:59:40,452
clear We are not opposed for this property to be

4823
05:59:40,452 --> 05:59:44,404
used for workforce or attainable housing. In fact our preference

4824
05:59:45,305 --> 05:59:49,524
is to work closely with the developers To know what's

4825
05:59:49,524 --> 05:59:52,564
going on from the ground up and see a successful

4826
05:59:52,665 --> 05:59:56,641
outcome for all. What we are asking for is that

4827
05:59:56,742 --> 05:59:59,521
any development proceed in a manner that is consistent with

4828
05:59:59,542 --> 06:00:02,961
the standards and policies established by our official plan and

4829
06:00:02,961 --> 06:00:07,521
bylaws Particularly as they pertain to height density setbacks and

4830
06:00:07,521 --> 06:00:11,681
environmental protection The applicant is asking for an MZO on

4831
06:00:11,721 --> 06:00:16,001
a proposal that can best be described as vague and

4832
06:00:16,041 --> 06:00:20,237
lacking important details. The applicant appears to want to fast

4833
06:00:20,258 --> 06:00:24,157
- track the process to avoid red tape which promotes

4834
06:00:24,258 --> 06:00:27,935
a build now and plan leader approach to development. That

4835
06:00:27,975 --> 06:00:30,175
should be raising red flags with everyone in this room.

4836
06:00:31,860 --> 06:00:35,039
Specifically we would like counsel to address the following four

4837
06:00:35,039 --> 06:00:40,481
items. Number one. This proposed disproposal represents a significant deviation

4838
06:00:40,521 --> 06:00:44,241
from the official plan Staff note in their report that

4839
06:00:44,342 --> 06:00:48,081
the proposed density is 65 units per hectare compared with

4840
06:00:48,121 --> 06:00:52,641
the 10 units per hectare maximum Generally applicable to surrounding

4841
06:00:52,681 --> 06:00:56,401
areas and that heights of up to six stories are

4842
06:00:56,422 --> 06:01:00,241
proposed where council's general direction has been three stories with

4843
06:01:00,262 --> 06:01:04,001
four or five stories contemplated only in very specific circumstances

4844
06:01:04,982 --> 06:01:08,961
Because the proposal remains conceptual and illustrative in nature at

4845
06:01:09,001 --> 06:01:12,081
a recent open house in Craig Leith in May Staff

4846
06:01:12,121 --> 06:01:15,361
were unable to answer even the most basic questions Including

4847
06:01:15,462 --> 06:01:18,561
the number of buildings anticipated to be four or five

4848
06:01:18,561 --> 06:01:22,212
or six stories in height. Number two this is a

4849
06:01:22,313 --> 06:01:26,772
future secondary plan area without a secondary plan Staff themselves

4850
06:01:27,033 --> 06:01:31,412
identified the appropriateness of granting these site - specific permissions

4851
06:01:31,673 --> 06:01:34,852
in advance of the future secondary plan process as an

4852
06:01:34,852 --> 06:01:39,412
issue requiring further review We believe that broader planning work

4853
06:01:39,452 --> 06:01:42,052
should inform a development of this magnitude rather than having

4854
06:01:42,153 --> 06:01:46,692
one property established permissions in advance of that process Number

4855
06:01:46,713 --> 06:01:51,092
three what about the unresolved infrastructure impacts staff have identified

4856
06:01:51,113 --> 06:01:55,172
issues regarding well - in wastewater capacity Offsite infrastructure requirements

4857
06:01:55,993 --> 06:02:01,092
traffic and access stormwater management parks emergency services and schools

4858
06:02:01,513 --> 06:02:05,172
as all requiring further review Most importantly the NVCA has

4859
06:02:05,212 --> 06:02:09,052
not formally commented on this project. Number four how does

4860
06:02:09,092 --> 06:02:11,692
this proposal align with the First Pillar of the Strategic

4861
06:02:11,732 --> 06:02:15,292
Plan to deliver transparent effective and evidence - based governance

4862
06:02:15,473 --> 06:02:17,932
and decision - making? Not only do we see a

4863
06:02:17,972 --> 06:02:20,892
decision being made here without much evidence I'm almost done.

4864
06:02:22,444 --> 06:02:24,023
Not only do we see a decision being made here

4865
06:02:24,124 --> 06:02:27,063
without much evidence and MZO has significant long - term

4866
06:02:27,324 --> 06:02:31,703
and irreversible implications It can establish site - specific land

4867
06:02:31,703 --> 06:02:35,863
uses and development parameters including density building height setbacks environmental

4868
06:02:35,903 --> 06:02:40,183
protection boundaries and can prevail over conflicting municipal zoning provisions

4869
06:02:41,004 --> 06:02:43,943
Giving these powers it is difficult to reconcile the pursuit

4870
06:02:43,943 --> 06:02:47,703
of an MZO MZO with a proposal that is incomplete

4871
06:02:47,724 --> 06:02:51,463
and does not conform to the town's official bylaws or

4872
06:02:51,564 --> 06:02:54,823
Town's official plan and existing bylaws How is it possible

4873
06:02:54,844 --> 06:02:59,063
that council could support or take any steps towards an

4874
06:02:59,103 --> 06:03:02,903
extraordinary planning mechanism such as an MZO before the town's

4875
06:03:02,903 --> 06:03:06,023
planning staff by their own admission have not even completed

4876
06:03:06,044 --> 06:03:09,623
their review Bottom line is this application feels more like

4877
06:03:09,724 --> 06:03:12,983
a project sketched on a napkin than a clear organised

4878
06:03:13,084 --> 06:03:16,023
and detailed plan staff are being asked to seriously consider.

4879
06:03:17,291 --> 06:03:20,230
As residents we deserve the opportunity to understand in detail

4880
06:03:20,270 --> 06:03:23,270
what is actually being proposed How it conforms to the

4881
06:03:23,291 --> 06:03:26,150
town's planning framework and what the implication will be for

4882
06:03:26,171 --> 06:03:30,790
the surrounding community and environment This is especially important given

4883
06:03:30,790 --> 06:03:33,990
that the MZO takes planning away from the community and

4884
06:03:34,251 --> 06:03:37,110
council which gives people with no ties to this community

4885
06:03:37,531 --> 06:03:41,110
the ability to make decisions for this community In addition

4886
06:03:41,291 --> 06:03:43,350
in MZO is not something that can be appealed to

4887
06:03:43,390 --> 06:03:46,710
the OLT so residents loof all loose all ability to

4888
06:03:46,750 --> 06:03:50,847
ask for changes. We appreciate that Council has declined this

4889
06:03:50,868 --> 06:03:54,127
request multiple times in the past with respectfully ask that

4890
06:03:54,468 --> 06:03:57,167
is elected leaders and stewards of our community You choose

4891
06:03:57,188 --> 06:04:00,767
option three at this time and until a detailed transparent

4892
06:04:00,868 --> 06:04:04,287
and fully supported development plan is brought forward through the

4893
06:04:05,108 --> 06:04:08,767
Mississippi Planning process In closing considering the vagueness of the

4894
06:04:08,788 --> 06:04:12,607
proposal and the multitude issues still is unresolved We have

4895
06:04:12,788 --> 06:04:16,287
one final an important question to ask What is it

4896
06:04:16,287 --> 06:04:22,092
we are actually moving forward on. Okay, thank you very

4897
06:04:22,132 --> 06:04:26,892
much There's no interplay Uh... with Public Comments There's no

4898
06:04:26,993 --> 06:04:31,932
exchange with Council Any further members of the chamber who

4899
06:04:31,953 --> 06:04:34,012
would like to speak at this time just checking again.

4900
06:04:35,557 --> 06:04:39,335
Going twice. Going thrice and now I'm gonna close Public

4901
06:04:39,596 --> 06:04:42,535
comment now and we'll move on to yes Sorry Madam

4902
06:04:42,535 --> 06:04:45,495
chair We do have a member of the Public Virt

4903
06:04:45,495 --> 06:04:50,575
Virtual He may Mr. Lampressofer But he may want to

4904
06:04:50,575 --> 06:04:53,135
speak at the next Public Common period But I do

4905
06:04:53,135 --> 06:04:55,658
want to mention he is on there. Thank but not

4906
06:04:56,159 --> 06:04:59,578
I can still close the Public comment period Or does

4907
06:04:59,578 --> 06:05:02,964
Mr. Lampresthorfer wish to speak. Um if he would raise

4908
06:05:02,985 --> 06:05:06,905
his hand if he does. I'm sorry I can't see

4909
06:05:07,406 --> 06:05:12,017
No So we could catch Oh there's his hand. There's

4910
06:05:12,057 --> 06:05:14,577
a sand Okay Mr. Lamprestor for you have The floor

4911
06:05:14,598 --> 06:05:19,560
for three minutes Go ahead. B turn on your camera

4912
06:05:19,821 --> 06:05:20,360
too please.

4913
06:05:36,213 --> 06:05:46,150
Is that a Richard you're muted. We can't hear you

4914
06:05:46,251 --> 06:05:47,350
Mr. Lamper Sofer.

4915
06:06:02,362 --> 06:06:04,981
Wonder if at this point Madam Deputy Clerk If you

4916
06:06:04,981 --> 06:06:09,221
could Let Mr. Lampresurfer know that he has another opportunity

4917
06:06:09,802 --> 06:06:15,623
Uh speak comment. Period at the end I'm sorry that

4918
06:06:17,084 --> 06:06:20,434
That we haven't been able to connect. Okay I'm going

4919
06:06:20,434 --> 06:06:25,258
to move on then. Um so on to B. 8

4920
06:06:25,679 --> 06:06:29,738
correspondence there is none Now we're moving on to bean

4921
06:06:29,839 --> 06:06:32,778
point nine Staff Reports And the first one is B.

4922
06:06:32,818 --> 06:06:37,338
9. 1 Recommendation report land exchange request Navy your street

4923
06:06:37,378 --> 06:06:42,058
west and tenth line slash B. Restreet South PBS 0.

4924
06:06:42,098 --> 06:06:45,991
2 6. 061. And who in the staff would like

4925
06:06:45,991 --> 06:06:49,931
to take that on. Ms. Marwa Go ahead. Thank you

4926
06:06:50,112 --> 06:06:53,211
good afternoon Council members and everyone present My name is

4927
06:06:53,312 --> 06:06:56,971
Deksha Marwaha Senior Planner with the Town This report is

4928
06:06:56,992 --> 06:07:01,211
regarding the request to purchase Napier Street Rhode Alons The

4929
06:07:01,211 --> 06:07:04,971
request was made by Mr. Lampresthorfer Who owns the adjacent

4930
06:07:04,992 --> 06:07:07,691
property at the corner of the 10th line and B

4931
06:07:07,691 --> 06:07:10,999
- Re streets south. If the proposed land exchanges approved

4932
06:07:11,340 --> 06:07:15,943
the applicant would acquire the road allowance. In exchange the

4933
06:07:15,964 --> 06:07:18,583
town would acquire the triangular parcel at the corner of

4934
06:07:19,004 --> 06:07:22,583
10th line and beaver street Um and information report on

4935
06:07:22,623 --> 06:07:25,783
this matter was brought forward at the April 28th Cal

4936
06:07:25,884 --> 06:07:30,103
meeting Where two options were presented to Council Council Directed

4937
06:07:30,204 --> 06:07:34,183
Staff to proceed with option 2b which was to Initiate

4938
06:07:34,223 --> 06:07:38,503
the process to declare the road allowance surplus And involve

4939
06:07:38,543 --> 06:07:42,164
the Town's traffic technologist in the process. Following the information

4940
06:07:42,585 --> 06:07:45,124
report a Public Meeting was held in June and no

4941
06:07:45,164 --> 06:07:48,564
comments and objection were received as part of the Town's

4942
06:07:48,585 --> 06:07:53,764
review process Staff received comments from Operations Division The Comments

4943
06:07:53,804 --> 06:07:57,284
noted that the that exchanging the road allowance for a

4944
06:07:57,284 --> 06:08:00,964
triangular corner parcel may provide benefit for future intersection needs

4945
06:08:01,625 --> 06:08:05,444
Um There are no immediate improvements Um, to the Intersect

4946
06:08:05,465 --> 06:08:08,244
There are no immediate improvements to the intersection Our planned

4947
06:08:08,265 --> 06:08:12,244
and there are no projects identified But the land exchange

4948
06:08:12,265 --> 06:08:14,964
would provide the town with an opportunity to secure the

4949
06:08:15,545 --> 06:08:19,924
triangular parcel for potential future improvements rather than relying on

4950
06:08:19,945 --> 06:08:27,456
a future purchase or negotiations. Following the closure the road

4951
06:08:27,496 --> 06:08:30,656
allowance will be zoned development and open space in accordance

4952
06:08:30,656 --> 06:08:34,496
with the towns zoning bylaw And any future development would

4953
06:08:34,536 --> 06:08:38,496
have to comply with the applicable zoning Overall Staff are

4954
06:08:38,496 --> 06:08:41,856
recommending that the road allowance be transferred to the applicant

4955
06:08:42,117 --> 06:08:45,776
in exchange for the triangular parcel Um, we also have

4956
06:08:46,437 --> 06:08:50,016
make the traffic technologies joining us virtually and that's it

4957
06:08:50,056 --> 06:08:52,176
from a presentation Thank you and happy to answer the

4958
06:08:52,197 --> 06:08:59,742
questions. Thank you Ms. Marowa I am looking for some.

4959
06:09:00,482 --> 06:09:06,426
Comments or questions from council at this point. We do

4960
06:09:06,447 --> 06:09:09,626
have the motion on the board Okay Councillor Porter go

4961
06:09:09,626 --> 06:09:12,986
ahead I'll move the recommended motion Thank you cancer Porter

4962
06:09:13,247 --> 06:09:17,706
and Second Madam Chair Second by Councillor McKinley And Madam

4963
06:09:17,706 --> 06:09:19,226
Depe Clerk if you'd like to read out The motion

4964
06:09:19,327 --> 06:09:24,558
please. Certainly madam chair The Council receive Staff Report PBS

4965
06:09:24,899 --> 06:09:31,038
26... oh sorry. 061 entitled recommendation report land exchange request

4966
06:09:31,379 --> 06:09:35,118
Napier Street West and 10th line slash beaver street south

4967
06:09:35,459 --> 06:09:37,518
And that Council enacted by a lot to stop up

4968
06:09:37,619 --> 06:09:40,398
and close the Napier Street West road allowance and deem

4969
06:09:40,398 --> 06:09:43,198
The land surplus to the needs of the corporation And

4970
06:09:43,379 --> 06:09:46,638
that Council approved the transfer of the Napier Street West

4971
06:09:46,659 --> 06:09:49,278
road allowance to the Applicant with the lands to be

4972
06:09:49,379 --> 06:09:52,718
merged with the applicant's property in exchange for the transfer

4973
06:09:52,758 --> 06:09:55,598
of the triangular parcel owned by the Applicant at the

4974
06:09:55,619 --> 06:09:58,798
corner of 10th line and beaver street south to the

4975
06:09:58,819 --> 06:10:02,543
corporation of the Town of Blu Mountains. Thank you very

4976
06:10:02,583 --> 06:10:07,861
much I don't see any further hands for. Do you

4977
06:10:07,861 --> 06:10:12,430
wish. I could make a comment on this page I

4978
06:10:12,430 --> 06:10:17,150
just want I just wanted to ask The Planner Um

4979
06:10:17,491 --> 06:10:22,270
normally we pay our costs in the applicant pays their

4980
06:10:22,451 --> 06:10:27,120
cost Is that not correct? Or is it different in

4981
06:10:27,120 --> 06:10:29,920
this case? Are we paying his costs or is he

4982
06:10:29,920 --> 06:10:33,757
paying his gospel. Sorry the applicant will pay the cost

4983
06:10:34,338 --> 06:10:37,437
Right yeah Yes that's what I thought Okay I think

4984
06:10:38,018 --> 06:10:40,477
there was some discrepancies on that Thank you very much

4985
06:10:42,258 --> 06:10:44,397
Okay Thank you very much I think at this point

4986
06:10:45,378 --> 06:10:48,397
Uh fleet your hands down Okay Thank you I don't

4987
06:10:48,397 --> 06:10:51,517
see any other hands So I'm going to ask Deputy

4988
06:10:51,538 --> 06:10:53,517
Clerk to call the vote please vote is open.

4989
06:11:02,500 --> 06:11:07,190
That. Boat is closed. Thank you that motion is carried

4990
06:11:07,230 --> 06:11:10,710
with all members of Council or of the committee Present.

4991
06:11:10,710 --> 06:11:13,670
Moving on to the next Staff Report V. 9. 2

4992
06:11:14,011 --> 06:11:20,710
Assumption report Second nature phase 3 PBS. 26. 046 Thank

4993
06:11:20,710 --> 06:11:28,714
you. And if you could state your name and remember

4994
06:11:28,735 --> 06:11:31,451
our stuff Go ahead. My name is Ahmed Khalil I'm

4995
06:11:31,451 --> 06:11:35,051
a development engineering reviewer I'm here today to present the

4996
06:11:35,152 --> 06:11:39,884
Assumption Report for Second Nature Phase 3. The Report recommends

4997
06:11:39,884 --> 06:11:43,164
that cancel Act Byla to approve full acceptance and assumption.

4998
06:11:43,681 --> 06:11:47,740
Of the Public Works Constructed and installed within Oh sorry

4999
06:11:47,761 --> 06:11:49,980
Sir Could you speak up a little more Thank you

5000
06:11:50,001 --> 06:11:53,660
Yeah within registered plan of subdivision 16 M - 69

5001
06:11:54,481 --> 06:11:57,500
And that cancel in Acta byla to assume the streets

5002
06:11:57,540 --> 06:12:02,300
of registered plan 16 amp - 69 for Public Use.

5003
06:12:03,984 --> 06:12:08,043
As an overview The subdivision agreement between Skyline Blue Mountain

5004
06:12:08,043 --> 06:12:14,105
Developments and the Town was stated September 23 2019. And

5005
06:12:14,206 --> 06:12:18,767
it provided for the assumption of the subdivision. Upon review

5006
06:12:18,767 --> 06:12:22,687
by development engineering staff and by consultation with other Town

5007
06:12:22,727 --> 06:12:29,508
Departments The agreement terms have been satisfied for assumption. Development

5008
06:12:29,548 --> 06:12:32,948
engineering staff have determined that all developer applications have been

5009
06:12:32,988 --> 06:12:36,958
met. As noted in the certificate of final acceptance Under

5010
06:12:37,539 --> 06:12:43,279
the subdivision agreement. The second nature subdivision was developed in

5011
06:12:43,940 --> 06:12:47,279
three phases Phase one and two were previously assumed by

5012
06:12:47,319 --> 06:12:54,637
the town in 2022. For the analysis I'll highlight that

5013
06:12:54,658 --> 06:12:58,077
the certificate of final acceptance was issued on July 23rd

5014
06:12:58,418 --> 06:13:04,397
2026 and Consultation with other town departments Uh, that all

5015
06:13:04,437 --> 06:13:07,917
works have been completed as set out Um, on the

5016
06:13:07,938 --> 06:13:15,470
attached assumption Acceptance checklist. Um, choose attachment 2. The quantities

5017
06:13:15,510 --> 06:13:18,830
of Public Works infrastructure to be assumed Uh, are provided

5018
06:13:19,011 --> 06:13:24,821
in the report Uh, that's page 3 for reference. And

5019
06:13:24,842 --> 06:13:28,501
also the subdivision agreement provided for a road guarantee which

5020
06:13:28,682 --> 06:13:34,493
will expire on July 23rd 2031. Um The road guarantee

5021
06:13:34,533 --> 06:13:38,173
security will continue to be retained beyond assumption Until the

5022
06:13:38,194 --> 06:13:43,307
road guarantee period expires and the term is satisfied. A

5023
06:13:43,408 --> 06:13:46,587
draft bylaw has been prepared to initiate the following and

5024
06:13:46,608 --> 06:13:50,671
is provided as attachment 4. Number 1 All the Public

5025
06:13:50,772 --> 06:13:54,911
Works Constructed and installed in accordance with the subdivision agreement

5026
06:13:55,252 --> 06:13:59,871
for registered plan 16 m - 69 Including the traffic

5027
06:13:59,972 --> 06:14:04,580
control devices shown on that proved drawings. And trail within

5028
06:14:04,681 --> 06:14:11,300
land subject to walkway eastment Registration number GY180991 are hereby

5029
06:14:11,340 --> 06:14:16,868
accepted and is humed. Number 2 Springside crescent Cattail Crescent

5030
06:14:17,049 --> 06:14:21,508
Stonely Drive Readway and Silwater Crescent as shown on registered

5031
06:14:21,769 --> 06:14:25,742
plan 16 amp. 69. Are hereby ACM for Public Use

5032
06:14:26,083 --> 06:14:29,022
And number three that the town assumes all dedicated blocks

5033
06:14:29,603 --> 06:14:34,382
within registered plan 16 and. 69 S - listed there.

5034
06:14:36,851 --> 06:14:40,830
Finally for Public Engagement in Advance of the Staff Report

5035
06:14:40,851 --> 06:14:43,950
being brought to the Committee of the Hall Development Engineering

5036
06:14:43,971 --> 06:14:48,190
has provided a notice of assumption Uh... Two residents within

5037
06:14:48,230 --> 06:14:52,510
development being assumed This notice of assumption is included as

5038
06:14:52,611 --> 06:14:57,874
attachment 3 and was posted on the Town's website. On

5039
06:14:57,914 --> 06:15:04,077
July 15 2026. Um. Thank you. That's all happy to

5040
06:15:04,117 --> 06:15:09,161
take any questions. Thank you Mr. Kyle. Questions from council.

5041
06:15:14,522 --> 06:15:18,456
Uh. The Dippy Mirror Go ahead Thank you Madam Chair

5042
06:15:18,477 --> 06:15:22,919
through you Uh. Thank you for the report Just an

5043
06:15:22,959 --> 06:15:26,999
assumption checklist It didn't list The trail and the connectivity

5044
06:15:27,039 --> 06:15:30,279
through Montre That even though it's not in the assumption

5045
06:15:30,380 --> 06:15:32,359
list because we're not assuming it That has been done

5046
06:15:33,020 --> 06:15:37,665
and completed to development engineering's standard. Through the chair Yes

5047
06:15:39,046 --> 06:15:42,785
The Walkway was constructed through the golf course Um... As

5048
06:15:42,806 --> 06:15:48,145
pedestrian connection between The second nature phase 3 and Plateau

5049
06:15:48,246 --> 06:15:51,745
e - subdivision And the land is not part of

5050
06:15:52,086 --> 06:15:57,505
the registered PS 16 M69 And that's why Um... That

5051
06:15:57,526 --> 06:16:02,385
walkway is meant was registered and conveyed to the town.

5052
06:16:03,474 --> 06:16:09,543
Okay great Thank you. Thank you Councillor Porter. Yes Thank

5053
06:16:09,583 --> 06:16:11,783
you Um I just like to thank you for a

5054
06:16:11,783 --> 06:16:18,326
very comprehensive and complete report. Thank you council Porter. Uh

5055
06:16:19,627 --> 06:16:22,206
I don't see any other hands I don't know if

5056
06:16:22,206 --> 06:16:24,006
we could have the motion put on the screen Please.

5057
06:16:25,020 --> 06:16:29,855
That would be great. Thank you And the motion reads

5058
06:16:29,855 --> 06:16:34,495
that Councillor receive Staff Report PBS. 26. 046 entitled Assumption

5059
06:16:34,596 --> 06:16:38,895
Report Second Nature Phase 3 The Council Act a bylaw

5060
06:16:38,895 --> 06:16:42,255
to approve full acceptance and assumption The Public Works Constructed

5061
06:16:42,436 --> 06:16:46,895
and installed within registered plan of subdivision 16M - 69

5062
06:16:47,556 --> 06:16:49,695
And the Council and Act of bylaw to assume the

5063
06:16:49,695 --> 06:16:54,335
streets of registered Plan 16M - 69 Republic youth namely

5064
06:16:54,436 --> 06:16:59,535
Springside Crescent Cacktail Crescent Stonely Drive Readway And still water

5065
06:16:59,636 --> 06:17:01,615
crescent Could I have a mover in a seconder please?

5066
06:17:01,796 --> 06:17:05,455
So move Okay I heard Councillor Ardell and I heard

5067
06:17:06,836 --> 06:17:13,028
Uhr McKinley. Thank you very much. Any further discussion. At

5068
06:17:13,049 --> 06:17:15,828
this point Alright then I'll ask the Deputy Clerk to

5069
06:17:15,868 --> 06:17:24,524
call the vote Please vote is. Thank you. Ne vo.

5070
06:17:24,444 --> 06:17:27,834
Is closed. And the motion is carried with all members

5071
06:17:27,874 --> 06:17:30,634
of the Committee Present Thank you very much Mr. Khalil

5072
06:17:31,535 --> 06:17:37,034
B. 9. 3 Recommendation Report Application for zoning bylaw amendment

5073
06:17:37,055 --> 06:17:40,714
People care long - term care And McPherson rental housing

5074
06:17:40,754 --> 06:17:44,874
PBS. 26. 063 And who's going to be taking that

5075
06:17:45,935 --> 06:17:48,794
Alright Mr. Posma Madam Chair I asked her why don't

5076
06:17:48,794 --> 06:17:50,474
we can we take a break because we have just

5077
06:17:50,514 --> 06:17:57,504
two reports to go Sure. Back at 5'2 or... Okay

5078
06:17:57,525 --> 06:18:00,384
Alright Thank you So we'll all be back at 355

5079
06:18:01,045 --> 06:18:03,584
Thank you very much Turn your cameras off Please and

5080
06:18:03,584 --> 06:18:11,144
your microphones. That was really cool.

5081
06:18:29,434 --> 06:18:31,701
Testing. Testing. No.

5082
06:30:10,492 --> 06:30:13,071
Okay, Madam Deputy Clerk, it is 355, and we do

5083
06:30:13,071 --> 06:30:22,439
have a quorum sitting at the table. Thank you. Madam

5084
06:30:22,479 --> 06:30:22,919
Mayor.

5085
06:30:38,176 --> 06:30:43,442
Thank you for that break, Madam Mayor. Thank you. Sorry,

5086
06:30:43,463 --> 06:30:50,882
Madam Chair. Moving on to our next section, which is

5087
06:30:52,023 --> 06:30:57,202
B. 9. 3, recommendation report, application for zoning bylaw amendment,

5088
06:30:57,202 --> 06:31:00,722
people care long - term care and McPherson rental housing

5089
06:31:00,823 --> 06:31:05,282
PBS - 0. 26. 063, and Mr. Postman, as I

5090
06:31:05,282 --> 06:31:08,904
recall, is taking that. Go ahead. Thank you. Yes, thank

5091
06:31:08,904 --> 06:31:11,744
you, Madam Chair. So my name is Sean Postma. I

5092
06:31:11,744 --> 06:31:13,384
am the manager of Community Planning here with The Town

5093
06:31:13,405 --> 06:31:15,224
of Blue Mountains, and I'll be providing an overview of

5094
06:31:15,645 --> 06:31:20,984
today's report. So this report does consider two coordinated zoning

5095
06:31:21,024 --> 06:31:24,984
bylaw amendment applications located in Craig Leith and Grey Road

5096
06:31:25,024 --> 06:31:29,144
19 area. The first application is for 192 - bed

5097
06:31:29,405 --> 06:31:32,904
three - story, long - term care home proposed by

5098
06:31:33,005 --> 06:31:38,184
people care. This project is located, obviously, on Town Lance,

5099
06:31:38,184 --> 06:31:40,584
directly adjacent to the Craig Leaf Fire Hall that is

5100
06:31:40,584 --> 06:31:44,703
currently under construction. At the same time, we're also considering

5101
06:31:44,724 --> 06:31:47,983
an application for zoning bylaw amendment from McPherson Home Farm

5102
06:31:48,404 --> 06:31:52,063
that is proposing purpose - built rental units, which consists

5103
06:31:52,063 --> 06:31:57,103
of 112 units on block 238, which is adjacent to,

5104
06:31:57,103 --> 06:31:59,343
directly adjacent to the fire hall and long - term

5105
06:31:59,444 --> 06:32:02,863
care home site, and is located on block. 238, which

5106
06:32:02,863 --> 06:32:10,146
is part of the home farm, original subdivision lands. By.

5107
06:32:10,240 --> 06:32:14,208
Home farm. So yeah, this report does deal with these

5108
06:32:14,248 --> 06:32:16,928
two applications. There was a separate Public meeting that was

5109
06:32:16,968 --> 06:32:19,728
considered at the same time for a telecommunication tower on

5110
06:32:19,728 --> 06:32:22,128
the fire hall lands. However, that will be reviewed under

5111
06:32:22,149 --> 06:32:27,014
a future staff report. So these applications, these two applications

5112
06:32:27,035 --> 06:32:31,094
are being considered together, because since we first started this

5113
06:32:31,195 --> 06:32:34,454
process, both the proponents, their project teams in the town

5114
06:32:34,635 --> 06:32:38,694
have been working collaboratively together to advance both these projects

5115
06:32:38,715 --> 06:32:45,134
forward. We've been having joint recurring regular occurring meetings, as

5116
06:32:45,134 --> 06:32:49,094
well as prompt and quite coordinated responses between all parties.

5117
06:32:49,134 --> 06:32:52,534
So there has been full cooperation between all the groups,

5118
06:32:52,534 --> 06:32:54,934
and it has led to an extremely efficient file review

5119
06:32:55,915 --> 06:32:59,974
while still maintaining our minimum requirements in standard requirements as

5120
06:32:59,974 --> 06:33:03,554
part of our planning review process, Planning Act requirements, and

5121
06:33:03,554 --> 06:33:06,374
the detailed analysis that's involved with reviewing these types of

5122
06:33:06,395 --> 06:33:11,590
applications. These two particular sites, as described in the report,

5123
06:33:11,590 --> 06:33:15,190
our link through much of the infrastructure, the long -

5124
06:33:15,190 --> 06:33:17,350
term care project does rely on elements that will be

5125
06:33:17,350 --> 06:33:20,310
delivered through the broader home farm development. And this includes

5126
06:33:20,331 --> 06:33:26,870
things like sanitary sewer, municipal water, stormwater infrastructure, future Public

5127
06:33:26,891 --> 06:33:30,230
Road. And in turn, the home farmlands will also accommodate

5128
06:33:30,331 --> 06:33:33,190
certain servicing and stormwater connections also needed for the long

5129
06:33:33,230 --> 06:33:36,950
- term care facility. Both of these properties are currently

5130
06:33:37,291 --> 06:33:40,870
zoned development D. So they both do require a zoning

5131
06:33:40,910 --> 06:33:44,310
bylaw amendment in order to permit the use. The People

5132
06:33:44,331 --> 06:33:47,350
Care Long - Term Carolina's, the recommendation before you today

5133
06:33:47,451 --> 06:33:51,430
is to rezone the property to an institutional eye zone,

5134
06:33:51,430 --> 06:33:55,910
as well as implementing an exception and holding provisions in

5135
06:33:55,910 --> 06:34:00,630
addition to that institutional zone. The proposed zoning, which is

5136
06:34:00,630 --> 06:34:03,830
included as attachment to the report, would permit the long

5137
06:34:03,870 --> 06:34:06,470
- term care home. And we'd also include site -

5138
06:34:06,470 --> 06:34:09,990
specific provisions addressing a maximum building height of 12 metres

5139
06:34:10,411 --> 06:34:14,550
and three stories, reducing the loading space requirement down to

5140
06:34:14,811 --> 06:34:20,630
two, providing modified barrier - free parking dimensions, flexibility for

5141
06:34:21,131 --> 06:34:25,870
retaining wall if required through the detailed engineering design, as

5142
06:34:25,870 --> 06:34:28,470
well as relief from the usual requirement for frontage onto

5143
06:34:28,491 --> 06:34:32,390
an open and maintained municipal road. For the McPherson Rental

5144
06:34:32,430 --> 06:34:35,830
Housing Lance, the recommendation here is to rezone those lands

5145
06:34:35,851 --> 06:34:39,270
from the development D - zone to the residential R2

5146
06:34:39,310 --> 06:34:43,510
zone, as well as providing similar exception in holding provisions.

5147
06:34:43,851 --> 06:34:46,470
In addition to that, residential zone, there's also a proposal

5148
06:34:46,510 --> 06:34:49,350
to put these lands in an open space zone to

5149
06:34:49,371 --> 06:34:53,830
recognise the OpenSpace lands associated with the remainder of block.

5150
06:34:53,830 --> 06:34:59,659
238. The zoning that's attached to this report here also

5151
06:34:59,659 --> 06:35:03,739
recognises some site - specific exceptions. The first is to

5152
06:35:04,160 --> 06:35:07,179
require that these lands be used for purpose - built

5153
06:35:07,600 --> 06:35:11,419
rental tenure. So tying in the purpose - built rental

5154
06:35:11,459 --> 06:35:16,619
model into the zoning. Also establishing the maximum 112 units,

5155
06:35:16,619 --> 06:35:18,699
as well as site - specific parking and road frontage

5156
06:35:19,120 --> 06:35:25,362
provisions. Similar to the People Care site. For both properties,

5157
06:35:25,402 --> 06:35:28,242
there's also a holding symbol that is proposed. And the

5158
06:35:28,282 --> 06:35:31,762
holding symbol, they do mirror each other for both sites.

5159
06:35:31,943 --> 06:35:35,122
Essentially what it does is it prevents the construction of

5160
06:35:35,122 --> 06:35:38,162
the principal buildings until the town is satisfied that certain

5161
06:35:38,423 --> 06:35:41,922
works and matters are resolved and secured. So these are

5162
06:35:41,943 --> 06:35:43,922
essentially conditions that are applied that would need to be

5163
06:35:44,023 --> 06:35:50,242
satisfied before construction could begin. The holding provision would allow

5164
06:35:50,263 --> 06:35:54,482
for certain limited site works, including things like pre -

5165
06:35:54,482 --> 06:35:57,522
servicing, some early grading, and things like that. But essentially

5166
06:35:57,783 --> 06:36:00,882
no building construction could start until that holding H is

5167
06:36:00,922 --> 06:36:03,762
removed. I also want to note as well that both

5168
06:36:03,943 --> 06:36:07,362
proponents McPherson and, people care, are actively working to satisfy

5169
06:36:07,383 --> 06:36:12,002
those holding each provisions. There are two requirements. One is

5170
06:36:12,023 --> 06:36:16,402
for a road access agreement. Uh, this is to cover

5171
06:36:16,423 --> 06:36:18,882
off the fact that both these properties do not have

5172
06:36:19,223 --> 06:36:22,242
frontage onto an open and maintained municipal road. So this

5173
06:36:22,503 --> 06:36:24,882
road access agreement would just be a temporary measure to

5174
06:36:25,303 --> 06:36:28,722
fill that void until those public roads are constructed as

5175
06:36:28,762 --> 06:36:31,442
part of the home farm subdivision. So they are in

5176
06:36:31,442 --> 06:36:33,602
the long term. They will be provided, so this is

5177
06:36:33,602 --> 06:36:37,602
just a temporary fix for that. The second component to

5178
06:36:37,642 --> 06:36:39,842
the Holy Nage is just to ensure that the necessary

5179
06:36:39,943 --> 06:36:44,002
services are available. Uh, so there is current work going

5180
06:36:44,042 --> 06:36:46,962
on right now. We do expect conclusion on this within

5181
06:36:47,002 --> 06:36:49,042
the next couple of weeks, and that is just to

5182
06:36:49,082 --> 06:36:54,162
confirm that available municipal water and sanitary sewer capacity will

5183
06:36:54,183 --> 06:36:58,335
be available to both those sites. So as I had

5184
06:36:58,375 --> 06:37:01,135
said, uh, both these proponents are actively working to satisfy

5185
06:37:01,156 --> 06:37:04,975
those two requirements. And should they be satisfied before council

5186
06:37:04,975 --> 06:37:08,829
would enact the bylaw on September 8th. Staff can bring

5187
06:37:08,869 --> 06:37:13,049
forward a revised bylaw, removing those holy needs requirements, and

5188
06:37:13,049 --> 06:37:15,629
provide that update to council at that time so that

5189
06:37:15,629 --> 06:37:17,949
the most up - to - date and relevant bylaw

5190
06:37:18,050 --> 06:37:23,336
is enacted at time of approval. Uh, The Elimination of

5191
06:37:23,376 --> 06:37:26,616
that Holding H provision would also support a faster approval

5192
06:37:26,717 --> 06:37:29,416
time rhyme, as it would remove the need for a

5193
06:37:29,517 --> 06:37:32,936
future staff report, as well as Council Enactment of a

5194
06:37:32,976 --> 06:37:38,811
holding H bylaw to lift the holding age bylaw. So

5195
06:37:39,232 --> 06:37:42,571
the Staff Report does contain our policy review. I'm not

5196
06:37:42,592 --> 06:37:45,131
going to go through it in a lot of detail,

5197
06:37:45,131 --> 06:37:48,091
uh, but we have reviewed provincial policy statement Niagara Scarpman

5198
06:37:48,131 --> 06:37:49,931
Plan, The Great County Plan, and the Town of Blue

5199
06:37:49,931 --> 06:37:53,371
Mountains official plan. We do note that the people care

5200
06:37:53,392 --> 06:37:56,411
site is already designated institutional, so there is no need

5201
06:37:56,451 --> 06:38:00,011
for any official plan amendment. Uh, the key planning considerations

5202
06:38:00,032 --> 06:38:03,211
in this review, uh, mostly deal with the compatibility with

5203
06:38:03,251 --> 06:38:06,411
the Craig Leaf context. The proposed three - story 12

5204
06:38:06,432 --> 06:38:09,531
- metre building is a modest increase over the general

5205
06:38:09,552 --> 06:38:12,811
11 - metre framework that otherwise applies to the remainder

5206
06:38:12,851 --> 06:38:16,171
of the recreational resort area. Uh, and in this case

5207
06:38:16,352 --> 06:38:19,931
as well, Stafford satisfied that the institutional designation, uh, the

5208
06:38:19,952 --> 06:38:24,331
building's community serving, uh, function, the ability to address landscaping

5209
06:38:24,371 --> 06:38:28,651
buffering and building placement through site plan review, do provide

5210
06:38:28,752 --> 06:38:31,931
an appropriate basis to support this zoning bylaw amendment at

5211
06:38:31,931 --> 06:38:36,541
this time. For the McPherson proposal. Um, one of the

5212
06:38:36,541 --> 06:38:39,041
key questions that we looked at was whether block 238

5213
06:38:39,081 --> 06:38:42,321
should be assessed as an isolated parcel, or whether it

5214
06:38:42,321 --> 06:38:45,201
should be considered as part of the home farm broader

5215
06:38:45,241 --> 06:38:48,241
subdivision lands. Uh, in the report, you will find that

5216
06:38:48,582 --> 06:38:52,001
Staff's opinion is that it should be considered, uh, that

5217
06:38:52,041 --> 06:38:54,721
block 238 should be considered within the larger home farm

5218
06:38:54,761 --> 06:38:58,721
land base. Uh, this is because the original OLT decisions

5219
06:38:58,761 --> 06:39:03,121
that implemented this development did anticipate development on these lands.

5220
06:39:03,121 --> 06:39:06,961
However, no formal approvals were provided at that time. However,

5221
06:39:07,001 --> 06:39:09,761
that block does remain part of the draft approved subdivision

5222
06:39:09,801 --> 06:39:13,681
framework and also relies on the broader development for roads,

5223
06:39:13,681 --> 06:39:18,801
servicing, stormwater, parks, trails, and open space. Staff also did

5224
06:39:19,142 --> 06:39:23,201
a fresh calculation on the density. Uh, the home farm

5225
06:39:23,241 --> 06:39:27,761
lands can accommodate up to 438 units through those calculations.

5226
06:39:27,761 --> 06:39:30,721
Uh, so the original home farm development consists of 215

5227
06:39:30,761 --> 06:39:34,481
units. So those units are already approved. Uh, the rental

5228
06:39:34,502 --> 06:39:38,881
housing would increase, or provide an additional 112 units for

5229
06:39:38,902 --> 06:39:42,161
a total of 327. And it is noted that home

5230
06:39:42,182 --> 06:39:45,201
farm does own some additional future development lands, particularly down

5231
06:39:45,241 --> 06:39:49,201
below the Ridge, um, that haven't been under any consideration,

5232
06:39:49,201 --> 06:39:52,169
uh, at this time. Uh, we did have a Public

5233
06:39:52,270 --> 06:39:56,549
Meeting on June 30th. Generally, it was positive reception, uh,

5234
06:39:56,549 --> 06:39:59,449
to this proposal. Uh, there was a general acknowledgement for

5235
06:39:59,489 --> 06:40:01,609
the need for both rental housing and long - term

5236
06:40:01,609 --> 06:40:04,729
capacity within the town. Uh, a lot of questions and

5237
06:40:04,769 --> 06:40:07,689
comments that came forward. We're focused on parking snow storage

5238
06:40:07,950 --> 06:40:13,749
drainage access connectivity landscaping and other built form considerations. Uh,

5239
06:40:14,190 --> 06:40:18,169
there's questions with regarding the rental housing operation and also

5240
06:40:18,350 --> 06:40:20,889
with regards to the overall building height of the long

5241
06:40:20,990 --> 06:40:24,409
- term care. Uh, so we have reviewed these matters.

5242
06:40:24,409 --> 06:40:26,249
Uh, and we still continue to review a number of

5243
06:40:26,249 --> 06:40:30,169
these matters through our site plan review process. Um, these

5244
06:40:30,209 --> 06:40:35,369
on site considerations are generally implementation matters. Um, particularly with,

5245
06:40:35,369 --> 06:40:38,729
uh, with regards to servicing and required onsite work to

5246
06:40:38,750 --> 06:40:43,529
implement the project, uh, so these are continuing to be

5247
06:40:43,569 --> 06:40:47,739
reviewed through our active site plan approval, um, submission. I

5248
06:40:47,840 --> 06:40:50,219
can report at this time that that site plan application

5249
06:40:50,240 --> 06:40:53,819
has been submitted and it has already completed its first

5250
06:40:53,840 --> 06:40:56,779
round of review. Uh, so there is some additional information

5251
06:40:56,960 --> 06:40:59,739
that has been requested by Town Staff as well as

5252
06:40:59,760 --> 06:41:03,179
outside agencies. Uh, the primary issue still revolve around the

5253
06:41:03,219 --> 06:41:06,699
water and sanitary capacity. And again, uh, those will be

5254
06:41:06,720 --> 06:41:09,339
reviewed in the next couple of weeks and hopefully it

5255
06:41:09,339 --> 06:41:15,659
can be concluded. Um, and as well, next steps after

5256
06:41:15,760 --> 06:41:18,139
that, after the site plan would be a site plan

5257
06:41:18,179 --> 06:41:21,179
agreement to be entered into to identify the actual works

5258
06:41:21,219 --> 06:41:23,819
that are going to occur on those sites. Uh, and

5259
06:41:23,840 --> 06:41:27,339
from that agreement, authorization will be available for that development

5260
06:41:27,360 --> 06:41:30,139
to proceed to building permit and to allow construction to

5261
06:41:30,240 --> 06:41:34,334
begin. Uh, so in summary, uh, we are of the

5262
06:41:34,374 --> 06:41:37,534
opinion that these two coordinate applications are appropriate. They represent

5263
06:41:37,795 --> 06:41:41,054
sound lane use planning and advance important community objectives related

5264
06:41:41,094 --> 06:41:44,734
to long - term care. Rental housing supply, uh, and

5265
06:41:44,734 --> 06:41:48,574
general development for the, um, Craig Leaf community. So staff

5266
06:41:48,595 --> 06:41:51,614
do recommend that committee support this proposal in bylaw amendment

5267
06:41:51,614 --> 06:41:55,214
for both people care as well as the McPherson home

5268
06:41:55,235 --> 06:41:58,894
farm rental housing sites, subject to the site - specific

5269
06:41:58,934 --> 06:42:01,694
provisions and holding conditions that have been identified in the

5270
06:42:01,694 --> 06:42:05,054
Staff Report. I'm happy to answer any questions that committee

5271
06:42:05,094 --> 06:42:12,921
may have. Thank you very much, Mr. Posma. Our manager

5272
06:42:13,662 --> 06:42:16,681
POSMA and questions, okay, first of all, it looks like

5273
06:42:16,702 --> 06:42:20,281
the Deputy Mayor. Thank you, Madam Chair. Through Councillor Hope

5274
06:42:20,321 --> 06:42:24,841
as chair, Sean, just to be clear on section, paragraph

5275
06:42:24,862 --> 06:42:28,539
two of the recommended motion. Site - specific exceptions to

5276
06:42:28,579 --> 06:42:32,779
building height, loading space retaining, all that applies to holding

5277
06:42:33,200 --> 06:42:37,819
H54 symbol. It permits only limited site work until you're

5278
06:42:37,819 --> 06:42:41,499
satisfied of the town satisfied. So the limited scope of

5279
06:42:41,539 --> 06:42:46,059
work is prescriptive, I would assume, until, um, those improvements

5280
06:42:46,059 --> 06:42:49,019
have been addressed and have been approved by, uh, satisfaction

5281
06:42:49,059 --> 06:42:50,859
of the town. Can you just extrapolate that a little

5282
06:42:50,859 --> 06:42:55,097
bit for me. Yes, certainly. So, uh, The Holy Nate

5283
06:42:55,097 --> 06:42:57,097
symbol would not allow any construction of the new buildings

5284
06:42:57,137 --> 06:43:00,297
to occur until such time as those holding age conditions

5285
06:43:00,398 --> 06:43:03,417
are met. Uh, so those two conditions were one, confirmation

5286
06:43:03,457 --> 06:43:06,057
of available water and sewer capacity. And number two was

5287
06:43:06,078 --> 06:43:09,817
that temporary road access agreement in order to access that

5288
06:43:09,998 --> 06:43:13,177
site. Uh, so those two things are currently under review

5289
06:43:13,758 --> 06:43:16,297
and hopefully should be wrapped up shortly. Uh, if they

5290
06:43:16,297 --> 06:43:19,177
aren't, uh, the holding H is recommended to be included

5291
06:43:19,198 --> 06:43:22,057
as part of the bylaw. And it would allow only

5292
06:43:22,238 --> 06:43:24,857
limited site works to occur. So this would be things

5293
06:43:24,897 --> 06:43:28,357
like rough grading, uh, installation of, uh, some of the

5294
06:43:28,558 --> 06:43:32,777
pre - servicing. So underground pipes, curbs load lift of

5295
06:43:32,817 --> 06:43:35,417
asphalt. Some of those preparation works in order to get

5296
06:43:35,438 --> 06:43:38,537
the site ready for construction, uh, by no building permits

5297
06:43:38,638 --> 06:43:42,937
would be available until that holding H is those conditions

5298
06:43:42,958 --> 06:43:46,217
are met in a bylaw is lifted to lift that

5299
06:43:46,398 --> 06:43:51,193
holding H symbol. Just a quick follow up. And thank

5300
06:43:51,214 --> 06:43:54,073
you. Thank you. Thank you to the chair for that.

5301
06:43:54,073 --> 06:43:57,273
Um, and the confidence of Town Staffing discussions on the

5302
06:43:57,294 --> 06:43:59,993
boots on the ground level. Do we see this based

5303
06:43:59,993 --> 06:44:03,120
on seasonality. Being an issue or do we see it

5304
06:44:03,141 --> 06:44:07,161
coming to fruition enough in a very near future. Like

5305
06:44:07,182 --> 06:44:12,813
the conditions that we're talking about. Like I said, the

5306
06:44:12,813 --> 06:44:14,973
proponents in the town are working quite quickly to try

5307
06:44:15,013 --> 06:44:18,093
to satisfy these conditions. And if they can be satisfied

5308
06:44:18,114 --> 06:44:21,773
before September 8th, when this, you know, potentially a bylaw

5309
06:44:21,794 --> 06:44:24,893
could be, um, enacted by council. Uh, we would update

5310
06:44:25,154 --> 06:44:28,013
council at that time whether they were, uh, they were

5311
06:44:28,013 --> 06:44:31,373
completed. But in terms of time frame, yes. Things are

5312
06:44:31,394 --> 06:44:34,013
pointing in the direction that these could be completed. Thank

5313
06:44:34,013 --> 06:44:40,167
you. Thank you. Uh, on to Councillor Ardell. Thank you,

5314
06:44:40,167 --> 06:44:43,847
Madam Chair. And just we've talked a lot about water

5315
06:44:44,188 --> 06:44:48,327
and sewer, so, um, I know here that, uh, they

5316
06:44:48,367 --> 06:44:53,447
were given written confirmation that was provided by the town.

5317
06:44:53,447 --> 06:44:58,361
And the, oh my goodness, what's going on. Here? And

5318
06:44:58,942 --> 06:45:05,001
so how long will that finalise then? That's my basic

5319
06:45:05,262 --> 06:45:09,081
question. When can we get this finalised, the water and

5320
06:45:09,081 --> 06:45:12,281
sewer? Because it's been the capacity has been allocated to

5321
06:45:12,321 --> 06:45:17,481
them, but any works requiring, um, provided such capacity or

5322
06:45:17,481 --> 06:45:21,321
secured through the appropriate approvals. So what other approvals are

5323
06:45:21,361 --> 06:45:25,431
we waiting for? Go ahead, manager Cosma. Guys, thank you.

5324
06:45:25,431 --> 06:45:28,791
So, uh, there's two components to this. One is plant

5325
06:45:28,831 --> 06:45:31,911
capacity and available for the plant to actually receive those

5326
06:45:32,012 --> 06:45:35,031
flows. Uh, so that piece has been confirmed. The second

5327
06:45:35,052 --> 06:45:37,251
piece though is the conveyance system. So how do you

5328
06:45:37,251 --> 06:45:40,551
actually get the water from the plant to the site

5329
06:45:40,972 --> 06:45:43,831
and the sanitary from the site back to the sewage

5330
06:45:43,871 --> 06:45:46,551
treatment plant? So it's that second part that's currently under

5331
06:45:46,572 --> 06:45:49,591
review right now with the engineers and we're anticipating results

5332
06:45:49,772 --> 06:45:52,231
in the next couple of weeks. Uh, so that's a

5333
06:45:52,231 --> 06:45:54,451
critical piece that we do need to make sure, uh,

5334
06:45:54,451 --> 06:45:56,831
is, is in place in order to be able to

5335
06:45:56,972 --> 06:46:01,271
service, properly service both of these, uh, developments. Uh, and

5336
06:46:01,271 --> 06:46:03,351
then to the second part of your question, the remaining

5337
06:46:03,452 --> 06:46:05,911
pieces is the site plan approval. So this is the

5338
06:46:06,092 --> 06:46:10,631
technical engineering design to ensure that these lands can accommodate

5339
06:46:10,671 --> 06:46:14,631
the design that's being proposed for both of these report

5340
06:46:14,671 --> 06:46:19,831
before you today is only dealing with the zoning framework.

5341
06:46:19,831 --> 06:46:22,231
So establishing the land uses and some of the parameters

5342
06:46:22,492 --> 06:46:24,711
that's related to it, but it's the site plan stage

5343
06:46:24,972 --> 06:46:28,391
that's still active, still under review, uh, needs to be

5344
06:46:28,431 --> 06:46:34,629
completed. Oh, so just to follow up to that then.

5345
06:46:34,629 --> 06:46:39,109
So would they go over the ridge and then down

5346
06:46:39,530 --> 06:46:48,951
or would they go out to 19. To Councillor Ardell.

5347
06:46:48,951 --> 06:46:52,211
The servicing strategy is to bring both the water, uh,

5348
06:46:52,252 --> 06:46:54,791
and the sanitary to the connections available on Grey Road

5349
06:46:54,791 --> 06:47:00,210
19. Thank you. Thank you Council Sardell. Now any further

5350
06:47:00,311 --> 06:47:09,061
questions. Well, Councillor Maxwell, go ahead. Thanks. Chair.

5351
06:47:10,768 --> 06:47:16,907
Sean, just asking something about where Councillor, Ardell, was asking

5352
06:47:16,947 --> 06:47:20,987
about water allegations. I would assume that the fire department

5353
06:47:22,048 --> 06:47:27,787
is prioritized above most people, most anything in order to

5354
06:47:27,888 --> 06:47:36,686
obtain water, correct? It would be both, uh, obviously both

5355
06:47:36,707 --> 06:47:40,846
sites will ensure that there's adequate water supply to service

5356
06:47:40,867 --> 06:47:43,146
the sites as well as all the other related, uh,

5357
06:47:43,347 --> 06:47:46,526
works such as firefighting and all the other water requirements

5358
06:47:46,566 --> 06:47:49,256
that would be necessary. But, um, both sites would have

5359
06:47:49,256 --> 06:47:51,656
to be met. As it stands right now, the fire

5360
06:47:51,757 --> 06:47:54,616
hall commitments are already there. They're already recognised. So that's

5361
06:47:54,616 --> 06:47:57,336
not being proposed to be taken away. Uh, the modelling

5362
06:47:57,357 --> 06:47:58,776
work that's being done now is to make sure that

5363
06:47:58,877 --> 06:48:01,016
in addition to the fire hall and everything else that's

5364
06:48:01,037 --> 06:48:03,476
existing, uh, The long - term care home and the

5365
06:48:03,476 --> 06:48:09,556
rental housing site can both be serviced. Okay. Thank you.

5366
06:48:11,472 --> 06:48:13,931
Um, we have the motion on the screen. Are there

5367
06:48:13,971 --> 06:48:19,734
any other questions. Printed? Thank you very much. And seconded

5368
06:48:19,734 --> 06:48:23,334
by, sorry, now I understand why you watch me. Thank

5369
06:48:23,334 --> 06:48:26,214
you. Um, if you could please read out the motion,

5370
06:48:26,214 --> 06:48:30,761
um, Madam Deputy? Sure thing, Madam Chair. That Council receive

5371
06:48:30,862 --> 06:48:37,001
Staff Report PBS 26. 063 entitled recommendation report application for

5372
06:48:37,041 --> 06:48:41,081
zoning by law amendment, people care long - term care

5373
06:48:41,182 --> 06:48:45,081
and McPherson rentalhous. And that Council and Actazoning bylaw amendment

5374
06:48:45,081 --> 06:48:47,721
for the people care long - term care lands that

5375
06:48:47,902 --> 06:48:51,081
reazones the subject lands from development de - zone to

5376
06:48:51,081 --> 06:48:57,321
the institutional i - 161 - H54 zone provides site

5377
06:48:57,361 --> 06:49:01,001
- specific exemptions to the building height, loading space, retaining

5378
06:49:01,502 --> 06:49:05,801
wall, road frontage, and barrier - free parking requirements and

5379
06:49:05,841 --> 06:49:09,481
applies the holding H. 5. 4 symbol that permits only

5380
06:49:09,982 --> 06:49:13,241
limited site works to incur until such time as any

5381
06:49:13,241 --> 06:49:17,001
necessary servicing and or road access improvements have been addressed

5382
06:49:17,001 --> 06:49:20,281
to the satisfaction of the town. And that council enact

5383
06:49:20,302 --> 06:49:23,481
is owning bylaw amendment for the McPherson slash home farm

5384
06:49:23,521 --> 06:49:27,401
rental housing lands that rezones the subject lands from the

5385
06:49:27,582 --> 06:49:31,401
development D zone to the residential R2 - 162 -

5386
06:49:31,742 --> 06:49:35,721
H55 and open space OS zones, provide sites - specific

5387
06:49:35,742 --> 06:49:39,961
exemptions to recognise purpose - built rental housing, total unit

5388
06:49:39,961 --> 06:49:43,721
counts, minimum parking and road frontage requirements, and applies the

5389
06:49:44,142 --> 06:49:48,041
holding H. 5. 5 symbol that permits only limited site

5390
06:49:48,081 --> 06:49:52,041
works to occur until such time has any necessary servicing

5391
06:49:52,222 --> 06:49:55,561
and or road access improvements have been addressed to the

5392
06:49:55,561 --> 06:49:59,031
satisfaction of the town. Thank you. That's been moved in

5393
06:49:59,031 --> 06:50:01,751
seconded. I see no further comments, so let's call the

5394
06:50:01,791 --> 06:50:05,726
vote, please. Madam Deputy Clerk. That vote is open.

5395
06:50:24,778 --> 06:50:29,287
My assist. Uh, affirmative police. Thank you. That vote is

5396
06:50:29,287 --> 06:50:32,905
closed. Thank you. The motion is carried with all members

5397
06:50:32,945 --> 06:50:38,025
of the committee present. We're on to the last Staff

5398
06:50:38,025 --> 06:50:42,505
Report of this section, B. 9. 4. Information report, request

5399
06:50:42,545 --> 06:50:48,105
for minister, zoning order, residential workforce slash rental housing 796.

5400
06:50:48,105 --> 06:50:53,605
060 grey road 19 PBS - 0. 26. 066, and

5401
06:50:53,605 --> 06:50:57,021
that is manager P. S. well. Take it away, thank

5402
06:50:57,021 --> 06:51:00,248
you. As think about it, uh, so once again, my

5403
06:51:00,269 --> 06:51:02,168
name is Sean Postwell. I am the manager of Community

5404
06:51:02,208 --> 06:51:04,088
Planning here with the Town of Blue Mountains, and I

5405
06:51:04,088 --> 06:51:07,002
will be giving a brief overview on this report. Uh,

5406
06:51:07,042 --> 06:51:10,842
so this report is with regards to a request for

5407
06:51:10,943 --> 06:51:14,602
Council Support of a minister zoning order, or MZO for

5408
06:51:14,642 --> 06:51:19,549
lands municipally known as 796. 060 grey road 19. Uh,

5409
06:51:19,549 --> 06:51:23,629
the report is provided for information and direction on process.

5410
06:51:23,629 --> 06:51:25,869
Uh, right now it does not request a decision today

5411
06:51:26,050 --> 06:51:29,989
on whether Council supports or not support the MZO. It

5412
06:51:29,989 --> 06:51:31,949
is really just set up what the next steps are

5413
06:51:33,170 --> 06:51:36,462
and to receive council direction. Uh, the purpose of this

5414
06:51:36,563 --> 06:51:39,982
report really is to provide an outline of the request

5415
06:51:40,022 --> 06:51:44,462
that's been received, summarized Council's previous direction, provide an update

5416
06:51:44,462 --> 06:51:47,182
on the engagement, uh, that has been completed so far

5417
06:51:47,203 --> 06:51:51,982
with Nada Osaga Valley Conservation Authority. Identify matters requiring further

5418
06:51:52,003 --> 06:51:56,382
review and to present five options for Council's consideration in

5419
06:51:56,382 --> 06:52:00,914
terms of being able to move forward. Um, it's already

5420
06:52:00,914 --> 06:52:05,474
been described. This subject property is about 9. 95 hectares

5421
06:52:07,335 --> 06:52:11,314
in area. It's located in Craig Leith immediately south of

5422
06:52:11,815 --> 06:52:16,114
the cross winds Boulevard Great Road 19 intersection, just south

5423
06:52:16,114 --> 06:52:19,512
of Windfall. In the applicant is requesting Council Support for

5424
06:52:19,533 --> 06:52:23,032
an MZ O to permit a purpose - built rental

5425
06:52:23,053 --> 06:52:26,712
housing community intended to contribute to the supply of rental

5426
06:52:26,973 --> 06:52:29,872
and workforce housing serving the Blue Mountain Village area, as

5427
06:52:29,872 --> 06:52:34,008
well as the surrounding community. Uh, The Summitted Concept Plan

5428
06:52:34,109 --> 06:52:38,408
does show approximately 612 rental apartment units at a density

5429
06:52:38,429 --> 06:52:42,408
of 65 units per hectare. Uh, the proposal does include

5430
06:52:42,749 --> 06:52:47,288
apartment style buildings ranging from three stories along Grailroad 19,

5431
06:52:47,288 --> 06:52:50,488
stepping up to six stories further into the site. And

5432
06:52:50,488 --> 06:52:54,488
also anticipates some limited resident - serving commercial uses as

5433
06:52:54,488 --> 06:52:58,502
well as accessory uses. It is important to emphasize that

5434
06:52:58,523 --> 06:53:01,382
the current concept plan that's been submitted with this proposal

5435
06:53:01,643 --> 06:53:05,362
is illustrative only. Uh, if an MZO were issued, the

5436
06:53:05,362 --> 06:53:10,002
final layout building placement, site servicing, landscaping access, parking, uh,

5437
06:53:10,283 --> 06:53:12,822
grading and other detailed matters may change within the limits

5438
06:53:12,822 --> 06:53:15,142
of the MZO and would further be subject to subject

5439
06:53:16,283 --> 06:53:21,721
approvals. So Council had previously received a deputation on this

5440
06:53:21,822 --> 06:53:25,561
request back in November of 2025. It was at that

5441
06:53:25,561 --> 06:53:28,361
time that council directed staff to return with the Staff

5442
06:53:28,361 --> 06:53:32,281
Report regarding potential conditional support and to engage with the

5443
06:53:32,542 --> 06:53:36,441
NVCA before bringing that report forward. So this report is

5444
06:53:36,481 --> 06:53:40,441
really to address that last council direction. Uh, since that

5445
06:53:40,462 --> 06:53:43,561
time, the applicant has submitted a substantial package of technical

5446
06:53:43,662 --> 06:53:49,001
studies. This includes planning justification, uh, draft MZO, concept plans,

5447
06:53:49,041 --> 06:53:55,481
servicing stormwater studies, transportation, parking materials, environmental studies, housing archaeological

5448
06:53:55,822 --> 06:54:00,570
geotechnical and other reports and studies. Uh, so full details

5449
06:54:00,610 --> 06:54:03,690
on this application submission, including all these studies reports and

5450
06:54:03,730 --> 06:54:06,710
plans. They have been posted to the town website. Uh,

5451
06:54:06,831 --> 06:54:10,810
notice has been provided to the general public, uh, through

5452
06:54:10,810 --> 06:54:13,930
the project subscribers list. Um, so anyone that's been subscribed

5453
06:54:13,970 --> 06:54:16,890
to that, uh, webpage, uh, would have been received notice

5454
06:54:16,890 --> 06:54:19,370
of this report in the additional information that's available on

5455
06:54:19,410 --> 06:54:21,932
the website. Uh, at the same time, we have also

5456
06:54:22,193 --> 06:54:25,452
just circulated all the materials to all town internal departments

5457
06:54:25,473 --> 06:54:27,932
as well as external agencies so that they can begin

5458
06:54:28,193 --> 06:54:32,534
their, their review. I wanted to talk a little bit

5459
06:54:32,655 --> 06:54:35,154
in terms of, uh, The MZO itself in terms of

5460
06:54:35,154 --> 06:54:37,894
what it does and what it does not do. Uh,

5461
06:54:37,894 --> 06:54:41,194
so administer zoning order is a provincial zoning regulation made

5462
06:54:41,234 --> 06:54:43,914
by the Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing under Section

5463
06:54:43,935 --> 06:54:46,874
47 of the Planning Act. So this is a zoning

5464
06:54:47,615 --> 06:54:50,074
or a provincial regulation. So I know the question had

5465
06:54:50,114 --> 06:54:53,114
come up earlier in terms of kind of municipality simply

5466
06:54:53,154 --> 06:54:56,794
rescind or eliminate an MZO. And the answer is, is

5467
06:54:56,834 --> 06:54:59,994
it can't, uh, because it's an issued provincial regulation, it

5468
06:55:00,095 --> 06:55:03,914
does require ministers approval to rescind that MZ O. However,

5469
06:55:04,175 --> 06:55:08,394
if the municipality, um, no longer supports that MZO or

5470
06:55:08,415 --> 06:55:11,034
wishes to have it rescinded, a request can be made

5471
06:55:11,074 --> 06:55:13,754
to the province, but the decision ultimately rests with the

5472
06:55:13,775 --> 06:55:18,380
province on that. If an MZO is issued, it could

5473
06:55:18,380 --> 06:55:23,020
establish site - specific development permissions, such as permitted uses,

5474
06:55:23,020 --> 06:55:26,860
uh, density, building heights, setbacks, as well as the environmental

5475
06:55:26,900 --> 06:55:31,820
protection areas. And an MZO would prevail over top oficial

5476
06:55:32,081 --> 06:55:35,961
plan policy and other zoning bylaw requirements. Uh, so an

5477
06:55:36,001 --> 06:55:39,401
MZ O can really accelerate the establishment of zoning permissions.

5478
06:55:39,401 --> 06:55:42,841
However, it is not an approval for construction. All right,

5479
06:55:42,841 --> 06:55:45,081
so even if an MZ O is issued, the project

5480
06:55:45,121 --> 06:55:49,241
will still require a number of downstream approvals. So things

5481
06:55:49,281 --> 06:55:52,341
such as applications for subdivision of LAN to actually, you

5482
06:55:52,341 --> 06:55:55,321
know, divide the lands up, uh, may be required site

5483
06:55:55,361 --> 06:55:57,881
plan approval, uh, including all the details and the technical

5484
06:55:57,902 --> 06:56:01,721
design. Uh, so these applications, some rest with the county,

5485
06:56:01,721 --> 06:56:04,041
some rest with the town, uh, but would still require

5486
06:56:04,081 --> 06:56:08,281
those local approvals after an MZ 0, um, would be

5487
06:56:08,302 --> 06:56:11,420
enacted. Uh, part of those processes as well include the

5488
06:56:11,441 --> 06:56:15,980
detailed engineering review. Any other agreements that may be required

5489
06:56:16,481 --> 06:56:20,220
serving agreement, uh, site plan agreements, things of that nature.

5490
06:56:20,220 --> 06:56:23,260
Plus any other applicable permits, uh, that may be required.

5491
06:56:23,260 --> 06:56:26,940
So these would include things like NVCA permits, uh, great

5492
06:56:26,980 --> 06:56:31,100
County Transportation permits, as well as your standard building permits.

5493
06:56:32,237 --> 06:56:37,816
Now the MZO decision, that ultimately rests with the province

5494
06:56:37,816 --> 06:56:40,216
of Ontario. So the municipality, uh, does not have the

5495
06:56:40,237 --> 06:56:45,176
authority to enact an MZO. That does rest ultimately with,

5496
06:56:45,216 --> 06:56:48,616
with the province. However, as part of the revised MZO

5497
06:56:48,637 --> 06:56:54,696
process, uh, municipal consultation, Public Consultation is now a requirement.

5498
06:56:54,696 --> 06:56:58,776
Uh, so if Council were to support or not support,

5499
06:56:58,776 --> 06:57:02,856
uh, the MZO, a Council Resolution would be required just

5500
06:57:02,856 --> 06:57:07,256
to inform the province in terms of the municipalities position

5501
06:57:09,197 --> 06:57:11,976
and would be taken under consideration in a provincial decision.

5502
06:57:13,479 --> 06:57:16,658
Now we have reached out to the province regarding sort

5503
06:57:16,658 --> 06:57:19,778
of some of the more specific details on the MZ

5504
06:57:19,818 --> 06:57:22,178
O process. And we're looking to hold meeting shortly on

5505
06:57:22,178 --> 06:57:25,698
that. Uh, and depending on council's direction today as well,

5506
06:57:25,698 --> 06:57:28,018
that'll help us inform some of the questions that we

5507
06:57:28,058 --> 06:57:31,138
will have for the province, um, sure, this application proceed

5508
06:57:31,319 --> 06:57:35,776
forward. With regards to the NVCA engagement, that was a

5509
06:57:35,776 --> 06:57:39,616
critical piece to Council's direction back in November. Uh, so

5510
06:57:39,877 --> 06:57:42,416
Town Staff has been working with the NVCA as well

5511
06:57:42,416 --> 06:57:44,816
as the county, the applicant, and as well as the

5512
06:57:44,997 --> 06:57:48,976
applicant technical teams. Uh, so there has been substantial work

5513
06:57:49,077 --> 06:57:51,936
that's been done now to deal with some of the

5514
06:57:51,976 --> 06:57:57,696
NBCA matters. Some of the environmental constraints on that site.

5515
06:57:57,696 --> 06:58:00,576
Uh, that primary focus of that work has been identifying

5516
06:58:00,677 --> 06:58:07,616
and refining wetland boundaries, natural hazard boundaries. In order to

5517
06:58:07,656 --> 06:58:10,736
establish a defined building envelope. Because the site does have

5518
06:58:10,776 --> 06:58:13,376
a number of constraints on it. I was really critical

5519
06:58:13,397 --> 06:58:15,616
to be able to complete that science on those lands

5520
06:58:15,797 --> 06:58:18,576
in order to be able to define those, uh, lot

5521
06:58:18,616 --> 06:58:23,304
development boundaries. Uh, The current submission does identify areas for

5522
06:58:23,645 --> 06:58:27,624
proposed environmental protection as well as those areas that are

5523
06:58:27,664 --> 06:58:31,064
available for development. I can report that based on the

5524
06:58:31,085 --> 06:58:34,664
technical discussions with the NVCA and the county and the

5525
06:58:34,704 --> 06:58:40,504
applicants team, uh, that those, uh, environmental and hazard boundaries,

5526
06:58:40,504 --> 06:58:43,544
as shown in the current materials, generally reflect the constraints

5527
06:58:43,645 --> 06:58:47,415
that were identified through that technical review. So those boundaries

5528
06:58:47,916 --> 06:58:51,832
have substantially been pinned down, uh, and agreed to. Although

5529
06:58:51,853 --> 06:58:55,032
these boundaries have not been signed off by the NBCA,

5530
06:58:55,032 --> 06:58:57,992
uh, we will be requesting their formal review and sign

5531
06:58:58,013 --> 06:59:01,672
off through our technical review process. And that's the normal,

5532
06:59:01,672 --> 06:59:05,592
uh, way to get those, that final confirmation. Uh, so

5533
06:59:05,632 --> 06:59:08,072
that confirmation will come with the review of all the

5534
06:59:08,072 --> 06:59:11,712
other technical reports and studies that have been provided. If

5535
06:59:11,773 --> 06:59:16,552
there are any outstanding environmental requirements, mitigation measures, permit requirements

5536
06:59:16,733 --> 06:59:19,512
or other changes, uh, they would be identified through that

5537
06:59:19,613 --> 06:59:23,032
circulation process. And we'll also be, uh, included as part

5538
06:59:23,032 --> 06:59:25,272
of a future staff report to this, uh, to this

5539
06:59:25,293 --> 06:59:29,841
council. Uh, so the Staff Report does identify some key

5540
06:59:29,862 --> 06:59:35,841
issues requiring further review. Uh, this includes the planning framework.

5541
06:59:35,841 --> 06:59:38,401
Just taking a look at the appropriateness of establishing these

5542
06:59:38,422 --> 06:59:43,121
permissions by way of MZO in advance of a future

5543
06:59:43,142 --> 06:59:45,841
secondary plan process. Uh, I'm not going to go through

5544
06:59:45,862 --> 06:59:48,081
all of these in great detail. They are all included

5545
06:59:48,182 --> 06:59:52,301
here, uh, on page six of the Staff Report, um,

5546
06:59:52,301 --> 06:59:54,721
but these are sort of the critical things that we'll

5547
06:59:54,721 --> 06:59:57,901
be evaluating as part of that, that first review. Uh,

5548
06:59:57,901 --> 07:00:02,881
obviously looking at, uh, compatibility, uh, and community character, environment,

5549
07:00:02,982 --> 07:00:10,241
natural hazards, uh, municipal infrastructure servicing transportation, connectivity, uh, and

5550
07:00:10,241 --> 07:00:12,801
as well, uh, reviewing some of the housing and community

5551
07:00:12,841 --> 07:00:16,241
benefit components. And a lot of this came out of

5552
07:00:16,281 --> 07:00:18,561
the Public Meeting as well, but just getting, uh, further

5553
07:00:18,662 --> 07:00:22,721
information on rental tenure, how the rental arrangements are going

5554
07:00:22,721 --> 07:00:27,601
to work. Workforce housing objectives, long - term affordability arrangements,

5555
07:00:27,601 --> 07:00:31,879
things of that nature. In terms of next steps, we

5556
07:00:31,900 --> 07:00:35,319
are looking to provide notice of application. Uh, that it

5557
07:00:35,319 --> 07:00:39,639
has been received. All the submission materials have been uploaded

5558
07:00:39,679 --> 07:00:43,479
to the town website. And we have initiated their development

5559
07:00:43,519 --> 07:00:48,279
review process. So all the materials have been circulated and

5560
07:00:48,279 --> 07:00:52,039
are currently under review. Uh, following this, we are looking,

5561
07:00:52,039 --> 07:00:55,159
uh, to confirm council's next steps, uh, in terms of

5562
07:00:55,180 --> 07:00:58,919
the available five options. I'll discuss in a second here.

5563
07:00:58,919 --> 07:01:02,759
Um, and that includes proceeding to a Public meeting collection

5564
07:01:02,759 --> 07:01:06,679
of final review comments, collection of Public Input. And then

5565
07:01:06,679 --> 07:01:10,426
ultimately preparing a recommendation report. Uh, so if we can

5566
07:01:10,466 --> 07:01:12,826
go to the next page, uh, just to outline the

5567
07:01:12,927 --> 07:01:16,346
five options that are available to Council. Uh, so option

5568
07:01:16,386 --> 07:01:19,786
one is essentially to proceed on an expedited review and

5569
07:01:19,807 --> 07:01:23,066
consultation schedule. Uh, so we have heard from the deputation

5570
07:01:23,087 --> 07:01:25,146
today that they are looking to try to get a

5571
07:01:25,167 --> 07:01:29,706
recommendation report within this term of council. It is a

5572
07:01:29,706 --> 07:01:32,426
very aggressive schedule to try to achieve that as we

5573
07:01:32,466 --> 07:01:35,786
have just received all the materials now. And, uh, we

5574
07:01:35,786 --> 07:01:38,026
don't know yet just what may come out of that

5575
07:01:38,047 --> 07:01:41,866
technical review of those, uh, those materials. However, having said

5576
07:01:41,906 --> 07:01:44,266
that, there are requirements for things like a Public Meeting

5577
07:01:44,306 --> 07:01:47,946
that could be expedited and information reports can follow after

5578
07:01:47,986 --> 07:01:53,066
that. Um, and, um, uh, but that really would look

5579
07:01:53,106 --> 07:01:55,946
at trying to prioritize this, uh, over any other project

5580
07:01:56,127 --> 07:01:59,606
within the town and in the planning department's workload, uh,

5581
07:01:59,647 --> 07:02:01,786
to be able to achieve some of these, uh, these

5582
07:02:01,826 --> 07:02:06,426
targets. Option two is to receive the request into defer

5583
07:02:06,426 --> 07:02:10,266
the Public Meeting to the incoming Council. So we could

5584
07:02:10,287 --> 07:02:15,546
receive the request and defer that, uh, Public meeting to

5585
07:02:15,586 --> 07:02:17,786
the next council. So it would be the next council

5586
07:02:17,786 --> 07:02:19,546
that would be here in the comments that come in

5587
07:02:21,327 --> 07:02:24,986
and be, and receive the information from the applicant and

5588
07:02:24,986 --> 07:02:28,506
as well receive the Public comments. Um, that would delay

5589
07:02:29,807 --> 07:02:33,786
the Public Meeting until likely December or perhaps early 2027

5590
07:02:33,967 --> 07:02:36,406
for the earliest Public Meeting Date with the next, uh,

5591
07:02:36,607 --> 07:02:41,109
next available council. Option three is to not support the

5592
07:02:41,290 --> 07:02:44,229
MZO request and to not proceed with a town led

5593
07:02:44,269 --> 07:02:51,109
public meeting. Uh, so this would communicate council's preferred process.

5594
07:02:51,109 --> 07:02:53,509
However, would not prevent the applicant from making a request

5595
07:02:53,549 --> 07:02:57,189
directly to the province. Uh, a resolution of Council providing

5596
07:02:57,229 --> 07:02:59,749
the reasons for this position would be requested and can

5597
07:02:59,770 --> 07:03:03,109
be forwarded to the province for further consideration. If an

5598
07:03:03,130 --> 07:03:05,909
MZO request is still submitted to the province for, for

5599
07:03:05,930 --> 07:03:12,680
consideration. Four is to proceed with a Public Meeting now,

5600
07:03:12,680 --> 07:03:15,560
likely within this term of council and to continue to

5601
07:03:15,661 --> 07:03:19,000
process, uh, this request for MZO through our normal planning

5602
07:03:20,061 --> 07:03:23,960
review timelines. Likely we could hold a Public Meeting with

5603
07:03:24,000 --> 07:03:27,080
this term of Council. However, recommendation report would likely come

5604
07:03:29,581 --> 07:03:32,480
early 2027 at its earliest just to be able to

5605
07:03:32,941 --> 07:03:37,371
follow our normal processing timelines. An option five, we've put

5606
07:03:37,371 --> 07:03:40,591
in here as well, uh, is to receive additional feedback

5607
07:03:40,631 --> 07:03:43,951
from council. If there is further direction to invite a

5608
07:03:44,052 --> 07:03:48,271
revised phase or more limited request, uh, obviously there's some,

5609
07:03:48,271 --> 07:03:51,151
um, there's a lot in the request that's being proposed

5610
07:03:51,191 --> 07:03:54,591
here. Uh, so option five does allow for some council

5611
07:03:54,591 --> 07:03:57,551
feedback at this time. Um, which we could then return

5612
07:03:57,572 --> 07:04:00,431
back to the applicant for consideration in terms of a

5613
07:04:00,471 --> 07:04:05,901
revised proposal. So that pretty much sums up my, my

5614
07:04:06,002 --> 07:04:09,581
report. Um, again, we're just hoping that this report provides

5615
07:04:09,682 --> 07:04:12,141
a clear understanding of the scope and significance of the

5616
07:04:12,242 --> 07:04:17,981
request before our four councils'consideration. Uh, and planning staff really

5617
07:04:18,002 --> 07:04:20,361
are seeking direction at this time from council and the

5618
07:04:20,361 --> 07:04:23,341
preferred option in order to advance the review of this

5619
07:04:23,442 --> 07:04:26,701
project. So that wraps up my presentation. I'd be happy

5620
07:04:26,741 --> 07:04:30,871
to answer any questions. Thank you very much, manager Postma.

5621
07:04:30,911 --> 07:04:33,331
I've got lots of the borders all lit up, but

5622
07:04:33,331 --> 07:04:38,271
I think we have to do an administrative. We have

5623
07:04:38,271 --> 07:04:40,951
to extend our working hours to, I'm going to suggest

5624
07:04:41,212 --> 07:04:44,259
till five o'clock. And if we're shorter on time, then

5625
07:04:44,259 --> 07:04:46,979
that's even better. So if I could place have a

5626
07:04:46,979 --> 07:04:50,899
motion, I'll work on that. Yes. Okay. So I, okay.

5627
07:04:51,296 --> 07:04:56,849
So I can proceed or, okay. So the first hand

5628
07:04:57,030 --> 07:05:02,096
that was that was. Cancer porter, but she, something that's

5629
07:05:02,096 --> 07:05:06,127
happened with my numbers. Cause it's now showing. Oh, okay.

5630
07:05:06,167 --> 07:05:10,847
So it's Councillor McKinley then. It's first. Okay. Excuse me.

5631
07:05:11,108 --> 07:05:15,487
Thank you, Madam Chair. It's through you to the clerks.

5632
07:05:15,487 --> 07:05:18,527
If we could go to the bottom of page seven,

5633
07:05:18,527 --> 07:05:21,727
I think that what is really, really, really important for

5634
07:05:22,228 --> 07:05:24,687
all of us that are here in the chambers and

5635
07:05:24,687 --> 07:05:27,807
those that are watching is the bottom paragraph that says

5636
07:05:27,828 --> 07:05:30,687
Council may consider any of the following options respecting the

5637
07:05:30,788 --> 07:05:34,537
timing and process for the MZO request. And it should

5638
07:05:34,577 --> 07:05:38,857
be bold and metallic and big letters. No decision on

5639
07:05:39,038 --> 07:05:42,377
support or non - support of the MZO is requested

5640
07:05:42,478 --> 07:05:46,137
through this information report. I think that's a very key

5641
07:05:46,398 --> 07:05:50,217
element to this. And it also is referred to again

5642
07:05:50,798 --> 07:05:54,457
in option one, which if we can just roll down

5643
07:05:54,558 --> 07:06:00,297
to option one, please. It says it again that this

5644
07:06:00,337 --> 07:06:05,057
option would not bind counsel to support the MZO. So

5645
07:06:05,057 --> 07:06:07,897
it gives us a measure to be able to carefully

5646
07:06:08,158 --> 07:06:12,377
move forward with a planning of Public meeting or Public

5647
07:06:12,638 --> 07:06:15,257
or us leading a Public meeting. I think it's a

5648
07:06:15,257 --> 07:06:18,217
great idea. We can get all the input from everyone

5649
07:06:18,257 --> 07:06:21,177
else involved. So I support that a hundred percent. Thank

5650
07:06:21,177 --> 07:06:27,242
you. Thank you. Then I see that Council Reporter is,

5651
07:06:27,242 --> 07:06:31,361
I'm sorry, excuse me, Madam Mayor, you're next. Thank you.

5652
07:06:31,361 --> 07:06:33,201
Through you the chair, I have some questions for Mr.

5653
07:06:33,382 --> 07:06:37,521
Posma in regards to the presentation that he's just made.

5654
07:06:37,521 --> 07:06:40,001
Um, so yes, of course, we are creatures of the

5655
07:06:40,041 --> 07:06:42,881
province. So the minister could decide to go ahead and,

5656
07:06:42,881 --> 07:06:48,321
um, carry on with NMZO without our participation. But we

5657
07:06:48,342 --> 07:06:52,641
can also provide conditions so we could, if I can

5658
07:06:52,681 --> 07:06:57,441
confirm with Mr. Posma then that we could, should we,

5659
07:06:57,441 --> 07:07:01,201
and I concur with the reading of Councillor McKinley, none

5660
07:07:01,201 --> 07:07:04,081
of this is actually asking us to bind ourselves to

5661
07:07:04,262 --> 07:07:06,961
a support of the MZO. But if we get through

5662
07:07:06,982 --> 07:07:10,481
the process, whenever that is, whatever that is, when the

5663
07:07:10,481 --> 07:07:12,481
information is in front of us, when we've heard the

5664
07:07:12,582 --> 07:07:17,681
Public comment, if we were to outline conditions in our

5665
07:07:17,862 --> 07:07:23,181
letter of support for the MZO, then the MZO, the

5666
07:07:23,181 --> 07:07:27,601
minister could then reflect those conditions in the MZO. And

5667
07:07:27,601 --> 07:07:30,881
then if those conditions were not met, would that then

5668
07:07:31,862 --> 07:07:35,878
null and void the MZO. So let's say the minister

5669
07:07:36,139 --> 07:07:39,558
hears there are some certain conditions that are important, like

5670
07:07:39,558 --> 07:07:43,318
retaining the vision and it not turning into, um, chalet

5671
07:07:43,339 --> 07:07:46,518
rentals, but that it stays true to the workforce housing

5672
07:07:46,619 --> 07:07:50,998
that's being proposed. Um, that's just an example. Then we

5673
07:07:50,998 --> 07:07:54,278
get down the road and something is not met in

5674
07:07:54,278 --> 07:07:58,758
the conditions. What happens then in the minister's office at

5675
07:07:58,798 --> 07:08:02,469
that point with the MZO. That's my question to Mr.

5676
07:08:02,650 --> 07:08:08,549
Prosmo. Go ahead. Um, as an excellent question, it really

5677
07:08:08,549 --> 07:08:11,669
depends on how the conditions are set up. Um, we

5678
07:08:11,770 --> 07:08:15,109
want to make sure first and foremost that the MZO

5679
07:08:15,210 --> 07:08:18,629
that's developed, uh, would be able to implement that proposed

5680
07:08:18,650 --> 07:08:21,669
development. Um, because it essentially reads similar as a zoning

5681
07:08:21,770 --> 07:08:24,549
bylaw, uh, in terms of how those lands are to

5682
07:08:24,549 --> 07:08:28,069
be developed. So things like boundaries can't shift and some

5683
07:08:28,069 --> 07:08:30,549
of the provisions can't shift. Uh, with regards to the

5684
07:08:30,589 --> 07:08:33,269
conditions themselves, yeah, they would be required to be met

5685
07:08:33,370 --> 07:08:37,269
before building permit would be, would be available. However, once

5686
07:08:37,290 --> 07:08:40,549
those conditions are met construction can begin. That MZO does

5687
07:08:40,589 --> 07:08:44,309
stay with those lands. However, once the construction is completed,

5688
07:08:44,309 --> 07:08:47,589
um, you can't have conditions that would retroactively try to

5689
07:08:47,610 --> 07:08:52,389
pull those permissions away. Um, so really the timing piece,

5690
07:08:52,389 --> 07:08:54,789
we have to meet sort of those, those stages where

5691
07:08:56,090 --> 07:08:59,660
either before the MZ always issued or before construction. Okay.

5692
07:08:59,700 --> 07:09:02,300
Thank you. May have a follow up. Go ahead. Uh,

5693
07:09:02,321 --> 07:09:06,300
thank you. Uh, that answers that provide some clarification. Thank

5694
07:09:06,300 --> 07:09:10,780
you very much. Um, I am on the same wavelength

5695
07:09:10,801 --> 07:09:14,020
as Councillor McKinley who is supporting option one. I would

5696
07:09:14,020 --> 07:09:16,220
very much like to hear what members of the Public

5697
07:09:16,561 --> 07:09:18,860
think at this point. There's been a phenomenal amount of

5698
07:09:19,041 --> 07:09:23,980
information that's been, that's been, um, provided by both the

5699
07:09:24,020 --> 07:09:26,860
proponent and the response of a report that's come through

5700
07:09:27,041 --> 07:09:30,140
staff since the last time they came forward to us.

5701
07:09:30,140 --> 07:09:33,980
And I think it was December 2025. We asked questions.

5702
07:09:33,980 --> 07:09:36,620
I heard answers today. Yes, there will be more questions

5703
07:09:37,041 --> 07:09:39,260
and more answers, but that's why I'm very interested in

5704
07:09:39,300 --> 07:09:41,500
the process of Option 1 is to get to that

5705
07:09:41,601 --> 07:09:46,380
next steps of questions and answers and input. Um, because

5706
07:09:46,380 --> 07:09:49,980
this is a private entity that is offering to meet

5707
07:09:50,081 --> 07:09:54,940
a community need, a desperate community need in our community.

5708
07:09:54,980 --> 07:09:57,100
They're not asking us to build this. They're not asking

5709
07:09:57,281 --> 07:09:59,580
us to put money into this. They're asking to walk

5710
07:09:59,681 --> 07:10:03,420
with us in terms of the process of enabling and

5711
07:10:03,460 --> 07:10:06,380
allowing this to happen. So I would not expect somebody

5712
07:10:06,481 --> 07:10:10,540
to have, I would not expect somebody to have absolutely

5713
07:10:11,041 --> 07:10:14,860
everything down on the dotted line at this point because

5714
07:10:15,041 --> 07:10:17,900
they're at risk. They're spending time and money preparing all

5715
07:10:18,161 --> 07:10:21,100
this documentation because they see the need in it as

5716
07:10:21,100 --> 07:10:23,740
much as we see the need in affordable housing for

5717
07:10:23,761 --> 07:10:26,940
workforce. So I would very much like to be able

5718
07:10:26,940 --> 07:10:30,460
to continue this process and this dialogue. And hear from

5719
07:10:30,881 --> 07:10:33,660
members of the Public hear more information from the proponents

5720
07:10:34,161 --> 07:10:37,380
hear more reflection from staff and to be able to

5721
07:10:37,380 --> 07:10:39,820
have a fulsome plate in front of us to make

5722
07:10:39,860 --> 07:10:42,860
a decision. So that's why I'm in favor of Option

5723
07:10:42,881 --> 07:10:46,220
1. Thank you. Thank you Madam Mayor. On to then

5724
07:10:46,260 --> 07:10:53,161
Council Reporter. Yes. Thank you. And through the chair. And

5725
07:10:53,161 --> 07:10:57,719
thank you very much, Mr. Postma for this. Staff Report.

5726
07:10:58,838 --> 07:11:03,937
So I'm undecided right now which option because I take

5727
07:11:03,977 --> 07:11:06,717
the thing they are asking us to spend money. The

5728
07:11:06,717 --> 07:11:09,377
infrastructure needs to be there. The infrastructure is not there.

5729
07:11:09,377 --> 07:11:11,457
I mean, it says it's further review, but there is

5730
07:11:11,497 --> 07:11:15,857
no, the infrastructure is not there to support 612 units.

5731
07:11:16,383 --> 07:11:19,162
Uh, hence I asked the question today, you know, what's

5732
07:11:19,162 --> 07:11:22,696
their skin in the game with front loading. So, um,

5733
07:11:24,097 --> 07:11:27,476
and I went to one of the meetings. Actually, it

5734
07:11:27,476 --> 07:11:30,076
was at the LE Shore and there was, um, maybe

5735
07:11:30,257 --> 07:11:33,436
five people there. That were the Public. I can, I

5736
07:11:33,476 --> 07:11:35,116
can even name who they were because there was that

5737
07:11:35,156 --> 07:11:39,676
few. I'm not sure. I would actually, and sitting on

5738
07:11:39,676 --> 07:11:42,356
the board member as a board member of MVCA, I

5739
07:11:42,356 --> 07:11:45,405
want to see what they have to say. Um, cause

5740
07:11:45,445 --> 07:11:49,949
this is, this is an interesting piece of land. And

5741
07:11:49,989 --> 07:11:52,429
I want to make sure what's built there is done

5742
07:11:52,690 --> 07:11:59,837
right. Um, and I have been, um, monitoring that because

5743
07:11:59,837 --> 07:12:02,317
I go to the board, I ask, you know, have

5744
07:12:02,317 --> 07:12:05,897
they have, has there been any discussions? Um, so, uh,

5745
07:12:06,018 --> 07:12:09,517
regarding NBCA. So that, so there's a number of things.

5746
07:12:10,711 --> 07:12:15,060
Because we get one public meeting, correct? Mr. Posma, right.

5747
07:12:15,886 --> 07:12:18,505
And this is big. And I don't want another campus

5748
07:12:18,545 --> 07:12:21,225
to care that, you know, people don't wake up one

5749
07:12:21,265 --> 07:12:23,705
day and figure out what's going on. And I said

5750
07:12:23,745 --> 07:12:26,025
that before when they were here, when they talked about

5751
07:12:26,046 --> 07:12:29,305
the infrastructure and sewer, I don't want people to kilometers

5752
07:12:29,326 --> 07:12:31,945
away realising their street's going to get ripped up because

5753
07:12:31,945 --> 07:12:35,385
they have to put a pipe down there. Because certainly

5754
07:12:35,726 --> 07:12:38,665
Bay Street didn't see it coming peel or Peel Street

5755
07:12:38,665 --> 07:12:40,905
South. Nobody saw that coming, even though they were very

5756
07:12:41,006 --> 07:12:44,345
supportive of the long - term care there. I would

5757
07:12:44,385 --> 07:12:47,545
like to have a Public Meeting where there's less questions

5758
07:12:49,166 --> 07:12:53,781
that still remain in this report. So the Public can

5759
07:12:53,882 --> 07:12:57,175
ask. More questions about other things. I don't want to

5760
07:12:57,175 --> 07:13:00,415
go and there's unknowns and the proponent is there still

5761
07:13:00,436 --> 07:13:04,927
doesn't know. That's what I'd like to see. It is

5762
07:13:04,967 --> 07:13:09,577
getting close to the end of term. Um, so, and

5763
07:13:09,577 --> 07:13:12,587
I'm not sure what the delays were. Because they were

5764
07:13:12,587 --> 07:13:15,737
here a long time ago, first time. Um, but I

5765
07:13:15,737 --> 07:13:17,417
would like them to come and be able to be

5766
07:13:17,598 --> 07:13:20,581
in more of a position to inform the Public. As

5767
07:13:20,682 --> 07:13:23,213
to what's going to happen. As opposed to the Public

5768
07:13:23,394 --> 07:13:26,813
asking them questions, which the report hasn't still been able

5769
07:13:26,813 --> 07:13:31,498
to answer. I'm not against it. I'm just thinking there

5770
07:13:31,498 --> 07:13:35,091
isn't just much transparency. From the proponent as I feel

5771
07:13:35,192 --> 07:13:38,034
there needs to be. This is a big ask. And

5772
07:13:38,034 --> 07:13:40,214
part of me that's driving this is, is this a

5773
07:13:40,214 --> 07:13:43,174
big infrastructure ask? And we've already talked about that extensively

5774
07:13:43,995 --> 07:13:47,044
about how much it's going to cost in debt. And

5775
07:13:47,044 --> 07:13:55,634
everybody pays. So, um, so I would actually, I want

5776
07:13:55,634 --> 07:13:59,074
to make sure some of these key issues are tidied

5777
07:13:59,074 --> 07:14:02,594
up. Um, if they, I want to know if they're

5778
07:14:02,594 --> 07:14:05,794
going to front load some of the servicing. I want

5779
07:14:05,815 --> 07:14:08,354
it to see what MBA has to say. So people

5780
07:14:08,375 --> 07:14:10,594
know what land is and isn't going to get built

5781
07:14:10,634 --> 07:14:15,274
on. And, um, the environmental concerns. Cause we do. We

5782
07:14:15,274 --> 07:14:18,354
have environment as well as housing in the strategic plan.

5783
07:14:20,037 --> 07:14:22,096
Um, I want to have a better idea. So that's

5784
07:14:22,197 --> 07:14:24,736
where I'm Coming from, not just a public meeting. Okay.

5785
07:14:24,917 --> 07:14:26,736
We'll arrange it. Get it over with. I think it

5786
07:14:26,736 --> 07:14:29,536
has to be very meaningful to the full - time

5787
07:14:29,536 --> 07:14:32,016
residents for a variety of reasons that have been said

5788
07:14:32,016 --> 07:14:38,250
today. So it's because in this sense, a lot of,

5789
07:14:38,250 --> 07:14:39,650
and I'll go back to the campus of care. A

5790
07:14:39,650 --> 07:14:41,530
lot of the visioning everything was down behind a closed

5791
07:14:41,530 --> 07:14:43,610
door and we all know it. Because it was advertised

5792
07:14:43,650 --> 07:14:47,210
on the presentation. It's already being done. This is an

5793
07:14:47,210 --> 07:14:51,210
opportunity to do this one right. Have everything open, transparent

5794
07:14:51,631 --> 07:14:54,010
questions us. So you and it's a way of managing

5795
07:14:54,431 --> 07:14:58,170
change as well. This is changed to potential, um, part

5796
07:14:58,170 --> 07:15:04,290
of the town. And people sometimes need to be taken

5797
07:15:04,391 --> 07:15:06,770
through the change, but through that process, they have questions

5798
07:15:06,951 --> 07:15:10,983
they want to have answered. And without, with the things

5799
07:15:11,084 --> 07:15:13,623
still being vague and the Staff reported a Public Meeting,

5800
07:15:13,623 --> 07:15:16,503
depending on when it's called, I don't think that's fair

5801
07:15:16,543 --> 07:15:19,373
to the Public. Especially as they may have to bankroll

5802
07:15:19,413 --> 07:15:23,693
some of the infrastructure. Thank you. Thank you, Council Reporter.

5803
07:15:23,693 --> 07:15:28,487
And onto the Depu Mayor. Thank you, Madam Chair, through

5804
07:15:28,487 --> 07:15:32,407
you. Uh, a couple of questions. One, has there on

5805
07:15:32,407 --> 07:15:35,167
the 612 units, we have to remember these are be

5806
07:15:35,167 --> 07:15:36,727
added to the tax role. And I'm not saying whether

5807
07:15:36,727 --> 07:15:39,527
it's going to go through or not. But, um, has

5808
07:15:39,708 --> 07:15:45,607
already been, um, requested discussion on development charges from the

5809
07:15:45,647 --> 07:15:50,649
proponent. Uh, this time, no, there have not been any

5810
07:15:50,910 --> 07:15:54,649
discussions on development charges. Uh, we do know that development

5811
07:15:54,670 --> 07:15:57,289
charge Act has changed substantially in the last little while.

5812
07:15:57,289 --> 07:16:01,289
Um, so there may be rebates or discounts, uh, based

5813
07:16:01,289 --> 07:16:05,880
on the rental housing tenure. Thank you. And then the

5814
07:16:05,981 --> 07:16:08,120
follow up question is I'm trying to be careful with

5815
07:16:08,120 --> 07:16:10,900
this because we need to hear from the public, um,

5816
07:16:11,181 --> 07:16:14,985
more than anybody on this, um, so. All the options

5817
07:16:15,406 --> 07:16:19,945
listed just for clarity purposes. Do not bind this council

5818
07:16:19,945 --> 07:16:22,745
or next council to support an MZO. You're looking to

5819
07:16:22,785 --> 07:16:28,025
take it to a public meeting. Is that there are

5820
07:16:28,065 --> 07:16:31,785
opportunities here. There's five different options, but the ones that,

5821
07:16:31,785 --> 07:16:33,665
um, would go to a Public meeting, none of them

5822
07:16:34,366 --> 07:16:36,505
buying. It's just, it's just having a public meeting for

5823
07:16:36,526 --> 07:16:43,397
clarity purposes. Yeah. So three of the options are to

5824
07:16:43,437 --> 07:16:45,957
move to a Public meeting. Uh, so that would be

5825
07:16:45,957 --> 07:16:49,877
the next step in this, in this process. Um, option

5826
07:16:49,917 --> 07:16:53,477
three does recognise not to support that MZO request and

5827
07:16:53,477 --> 07:16:56,597
do not move to a Public meeting. Um, so if

5828
07:16:56,597 --> 07:16:58,917
Council wants to take a position now in terms of

5829
07:16:59,098 --> 07:17:02,357
not supporting that MZO, uh, there's no need to sort

5830
07:17:02,357 --> 07:17:05,397
of continue on those, those next steps. And then option

5831
07:17:05,418 --> 07:17:11,557
five, was the consideration for any other, um, Council sort

5832
07:17:11,557 --> 07:17:15,117
of directed changes to the proposed plan, uh, prior to

5833
07:17:16,058 --> 07:17:18,037
sort of finalising it and moving to a Public meeting.

5834
07:17:19,337 --> 07:17:24,745
Okay. Thank you. Thank you. And on to Council Sardell.

5835
07:17:28,154 --> 07:17:33,926
Thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to see a

5836
07:17:33,966 --> 07:17:35,926
Public Meeting, but I would definitely like to hear from

5837
07:17:36,427 --> 07:17:39,846
NVCA as well. Being past chair of NVCA and sat

5838
07:17:39,867 --> 07:17:45,686
there for eight years. I have lots of environmental concerns

5839
07:17:46,107 --> 07:17:48,726
and different things. And we notice that on another property

5840
07:17:49,467 --> 07:17:52,646
close to there. So, you know, we were told we

5841
07:17:52,686 --> 07:17:56,706
couldn't do anything. So, um, I'm, I'm still, you know,

5842
07:17:56,907 --> 07:18:00,646
hoping that we won't have those concerns, but I really

5843
07:18:01,307 --> 07:18:05,026
would like to hear from NVCA. I really would. Um,

5844
07:18:05,026 --> 07:18:07,926
and then have it there. So I'm surprised they've been

5845
07:18:07,926 --> 07:18:10,886
dealing with this for a while, but sometimes the board

5846
07:18:10,926 --> 07:18:13,526
doesn't get to hear some of the things. I've learned

5847
07:18:13,526 --> 07:18:16,886
that from being there for eight years. Um, so that

5848
07:18:16,886 --> 07:18:20,326
they would just proceed. But I think in this case,

5849
07:18:20,326 --> 07:18:24,966
um, representative as Councillor Porter, I'm just wondering, are you

5850
07:18:25,227 --> 07:18:28,566
on bi - monthly meetings now? Or sorry, Madam Chair,

5851
07:18:28,566 --> 07:18:32,679
if I could ask that. Go ahead. If I could,

5852
07:18:32,679 --> 07:18:34,759
if you were on bi - monthly meetings or when's

5853
07:18:34,759 --> 07:18:37,639
your next meeting at MVCA. Next meeting is the end

5854
07:18:37,639 --> 07:18:40,839
of September. We have two meetings. Uh, we didn't meet

5855
07:18:40,940 --> 07:18:48,209
in July in September. And it wasn't. In the sense

5856
07:18:48,390 --> 07:18:50,849
it's been a considerable period of time since they were

5857
07:18:50,889 --> 07:18:55,959
here before. And I know I asked a board meetings

5858
07:18:56,380 --> 07:18:58,599
have they been in contact and it wasn't maybe I

5859
07:18:58,599 --> 07:19:02,393
would say until somewhat more recent. Right. Okay. To continue?

5860
07:19:02,414 --> 07:19:05,993
Yeah. So I'm just wondering, you know, they've had this

5861
07:19:06,174 --> 07:19:08,953
for a while. There's, you know, they do have planners

5862
07:19:09,294 --> 07:19:11,753
and I would just like to hear from their planners

5863
07:19:11,854 --> 07:19:15,033
because if they found something else or whatever, we need

5864
07:19:15,054 --> 07:19:19,729
that piece of the puzzle. First. And definitely we could

5865
07:19:19,769 --> 07:19:22,289
be going ahead with a Public meeting, but we really

5866
07:19:22,390 --> 07:19:26,689
need that. I would just not enjoy being on the

5867
07:19:26,950 --> 07:19:30,369
11th hour and go, Oh, well, we found something else.

5868
07:19:30,369 --> 07:19:36,446
And that's what really concerns me here. So, um, yeah,

5869
07:19:36,547 --> 07:19:39,646
I'm, you know, with the Deputy Mayor, we could proceed

5870
07:19:39,686 --> 07:19:43,646
to a Public Meeting. And I call it prices subdivision

5871
07:19:43,686 --> 07:19:47,086
still. Sorry. I'm old school. Um, but, um, and hear

5872
07:19:47,086 --> 07:19:49,406
what the, you know, get a Public Meeting. We need

5873
07:19:49,406 --> 07:19:52,526
to hear what the people down there want or see

5874
07:19:52,627 --> 07:19:55,726
or whatever. But we do need workplace housing as well.

5875
07:19:55,907 --> 07:20:00,446
It's, everybody needs it. Um, and maybe, you know, like

5876
07:20:00,446 --> 07:20:02,686
the way it's going to like mountain house is all

5877
07:20:02,726 --> 07:20:06,126
step back. And, you know, the way that was developed,

5878
07:20:06,126 --> 07:20:08,526
you know, you get some development like that. And you

5879
07:20:08,566 --> 07:20:11,726
wouldn't see it at prices subdivisions. So, you know, and

5880
07:20:11,747 --> 07:20:15,006
then it's a great fix for the municipality is a

5881
07:20:15,006 --> 07:20:18,897
great fix for everybody. I'm just concerned within VCA. Not

5882
07:20:18,937 --> 07:20:21,817
getting back to us. So those are my comments. So

5883
07:20:21,817 --> 07:20:24,257
thank you. And I see Mr. Posma's hands up. Thank

5884
07:20:24,257 --> 07:20:27,860
you. Go ahead, Mr. Postma. Yeah. I just wanted to

5885
07:20:28,121 --> 07:20:31,940
clarify sort of the position of the NVCA. I can

5886
07:20:32,041 --> 07:20:35,680
report that, uh, both the town, uh, the county, the

5887
07:20:35,680 --> 07:20:39,380
applicant and their team and the NVCA have done substantial

5888
07:20:39,401 --> 07:20:42,180
work right now to actually serve a. So the physical

5889
07:20:42,201 --> 07:20:46,900
stakes in the ground delineating, you know, the wetland features,

5890
07:20:46,900 --> 07:20:50,140
the natural hazard areas. The areas for environmental protection. So

5891
07:20:50,361 --> 07:20:54,180
a lot of that work has already been completed. We

5892
07:20:54,201 --> 07:20:57,940
don't receive formal sign off until a formal submission is

5893
07:20:57,980 --> 07:21:02,320
made. And that circulated for final comment. So, you know,

5894
07:21:02,320 --> 07:21:04,420
to try to get an NVCA formal sign off at

5895
07:21:04,420 --> 07:21:07,780
this point, uh, is likely not going to occur. It's

5896
07:21:07,780 --> 07:21:10,960
not until we go through the former circulation process, but

5897
07:21:10,960 --> 07:21:14,500
I can report that in principle the NVCA is satisfied

5898
07:21:14,681 --> 07:21:17,300
with the boundaries, uh, and a lot of the work

5899
07:21:17,340 --> 07:21:22,737
that's already been completed. Council. Did you? Um, yes, I'm

5900
07:21:22,758 --> 07:21:26,097
just trying to, okay. So it's a 9. 95 Hector's

5901
07:21:26,198 --> 07:21:30,817
in how many actors is there for wetlands, sorry. Was

5902
07:21:30,857 --> 07:21:32,657
it two? I saw it somewhere in here.

5903
07:21:41,115 --> 07:21:44,214
I just can't find that again. Um, yeah, I just,

5904
07:21:44,214 --> 07:21:47,014
as long as if it's been mapped out and surveyed

5905
07:21:48,155 --> 07:21:51,174
and they've given that in principle, do we have it

5906
07:21:51,174 --> 07:22:00,920
at writing. Do we need an MOU. At this stage,

5907
07:22:00,920 --> 07:22:03,400
it's really to refine those boundaries, right? It is to

5908
07:22:03,400 --> 07:22:05,880
do the science, to do the site visits, to actually

5909
07:22:06,141 --> 07:22:09,800
stake and do the survey work to confirm those boundaries.

5910
07:22:09,800 --> 07:22:13,240
Uh, so that work has been done. Um, it's some

5911
07:22:13,280 --> 07:22:16,520
of the mitigations from the compensation, uh, and if there's

5912
07:22:16,520 --> 07:22:18,840
anything else that may come out of the final site

5913
07:22:18,880 --> 07:22:22,600
plan as well, right in terms of, the opportunities to

5914
07:22:22,781 --> 07:22:26,440
square off things that may impact environmental protection areas, like

5915
07:22:26,440 --> 07:22:30,920
there's some flexibility. Uh, there's opportunities for compensation. So the

5916
07:22:30,920 --> 07:22:33,880
number of different factors that could be implemented before that

5917
07:22:33,901 --> 07:22:37,720
final design, but all of those would require formal sign

5918
07:22:37,760 --> 07:22:41,240
off as well as permits from Nawasaga before construction could

5919
07:22:41,261 --> 07:22:44,440
begin. So Madam Chair, just one more question to Mr.

5920
07:22:44,480 --> 07:22:48,120
Postman then. So price is subdivision was flooded many, many

5921
07:22:48,120 --> 07:22:50,840
times. Um, and we've all, and we did have a

5922
07:22:50,840 --> 07:22:55,400
lot of problems going way back. So that's been resolved.

5923
07:22:55,400 --> 07:22:58,840
So at the back of this property, is there that

5924
07:22:58,840 --> 07:23:01,880
much flooding back there or is it not as bad

5925
07:23:01,920 --> 07:23:08,197
as what price of subdivision went through. Go ahead, Mr.

5926
07:23:08,378 --> 07:23:10,917
Posma. Yeah, I don't have any of the technical details

5927
07:23:11,018 --> 07:23:13,477
in terms of the flooding constraints. I know it has

5928
07:23:13,517 --> 07:23:17,717
been evaluated. Price is subdivision is located. It's not directly

5929
07:23:18,058 --> 07:23:21,537
adjacent to this site. It is a slightly removed, uh,

5930
07:23:21,578 --> 07:23:26,594
but the flooding concerns definitely have been evaluated. Thank you.

5931
07:23:26,634 --> 07:23:35,110
Councillor Maxwell. Thanks, Madam Chair. Well, okay. So anyway, the

5932
07:23:35,131 --> 07:23:41,117
doubt that we need like workforce housing. I'm just trying

5933
07:23:41,157 --> 07:23:48,477
to understand this Public Meeting. When we say Public Meetings,

5934
07:23:48,477 --> 07:23:53,538
Sean, do we. Is it just the general neighbourhood that

5935
07:23:53,578 --> 07:23:57,378
we invite or is it, um, all the commenting agencies

5936
07:23:58,439 --> 07:24:00,338
and those that we have a duty to consult with.

5937
07:24:03,881 --> 07:24:09,799
Or do consultation with me. Uh, yeah, so there's, there's

5938
07:24:09,839 --> 07:24:12,919
a couple components to the Public Consultation. So the province

5939
07:24:12,959 --> 07:24:16,599
has their own notice requirements on as an ERO posting.

5940
07:24:16,599 --> 07:24:19,879
So it'll be posted there. Um, we also have Air

5941
07:24:19,919 --> 07:24:23,939
Town Notice policy as well that we would follow. Um,

5942
07:24:23,939 --> 07:24:27,799
so advertising in the, uh, Blue Mountains review, um, we

5943
07:24:27,980 --> 07:24:31,239
generally would do a circulation within, uh, 400 feet of

5944
07:24:31,279 --> 07:24:34,599
the property to adjacent landowners. Uh, as well, we do

5945
07:24:34,639 --> 07:24:37,079
the e - blast. So we get noticed out on

5946
07:24:37,180 --> 07:24:40,599
many, many different fronts. And again, we've got all information

5947
07:24:41,100 --> 07:24:44,199
posted to the website. So anybody that has any interests,

5948
07:24:44,199 --> 07:24:48,019
uh, all the information is there. They can subscribe, um,

5949
07:24:48,019 --> 07:24:50,999
to get regular updates, uh, so we will reach out

5950
07:24:51,020 --> 07:24:57,054
through those, those channels. Go ahead. Second question. Okay. Okay.

5951
07:24:57,075 --> 07:24:59,777
So I'll just get a question there. Sean, what makes

5952
07:24:59,878 --> 07:25:06,494
this property uniquely different than T's, please. And would we

5953
07:25:06,494 --> 07:25:08,574
be able to apply for an MZ O in her

5954
07:25:08,574 --> 07:25:17,417
own property. To the first question with regards to differences

5955
07:25:17,457 --> 07:25:21,017
from the T's police, um, I think the similarities in

5956
07:25:21,017 --> 07:25:24,057
terms of some of the natural hazards, it's definitely wet

5957
07:25:24,478 --> 07:25:29,157
in that general area. Um, they are separate properties, uh,

5958
07:25:29,278 --> 07:25:31,817
so they would have separate issues that, that would need

5959
07:25:31,817 --> 07:25:34,857
to be reviewed based on, you know, the sites themselves.

5960
07:25:35,344 --> 07:25:37,643
In terms of applying for an MZO on our own

5961
07:25:37,744 --> 07:25:42,363
lands, um, it's a good question. I've never considered that

5962
07:25:42,363 --> 07:25:46,523
one before, um, but the town does have multiple tools.

5963
07:25:46,523 --> 07:25:50,683
Right. Uh, Council can enact bylaws itself. Um, bylaws must

5964
07:25:50,683 --> 07:25:54,603
conform to the official plan, uh, but in MZ O

5965
07:25:55,024 --> 07:25:59,856
has applied for by the town. I wouldn't rule it

5966
07:25:59,856 --> 07:26:05,140
out. Well, I just, we just seem to have a

5967
07:26:05,140 --> 07:26:08,260
little bit difficulty doing something on T's, please. So that

5968
07:26:08,441 --> 07:26:12,888
might help us. That's all. Thank you. So before we

5969
07:26:12,888 --> 07:26:15,208
go to a second class, if you don't mind second

5970
07:26:15,248 --> 07:26:17,528
past, Madam Chair, I was just going to indicate a

5971
07:26:17,528 --> 07:26:21,213
motion. I like, no, no, I like to sweep. Yeah.

5972
07:26:21,253 --> 07:26:23,533
I'd like to speak, um, from my, for the first

5973
07:26:23,794 --> 07:26:26,933
pass. And then we'll, we'll look at a motion. I

5974
07:26:26,933 --> 07:26:30,312
know we have to think about time. So. As many

5975
07:26:30,312 --> 07:26:33,672
people in the room know we had, we had a

5976
07:26:33,712 --> 07:26:35,912
tough evening last night with the Public. There were some

5977
07:26:35,912 --> 07:26:38,632
very clear messages that were given. And that's what's resonating

5978
07:26:38,672 --> 07:26:42,392
with me right now. And I'm thinking that, uh, we've

5979
07:26:42,392 --> 07:26:46,072
got some really interesting, strong components. So we first of

5980
07:26:46,072 --> 07:26:51,512
all have the workforce housing, which of course the town

5981
07:26:51,533 --> 07:26:54,792
wants to be working with. We have very willing and

5982
07:26:54,832 --> 07:26:59,592
interested neighbours who want to, who want to work together,

5983
07:26:59,592 --> 07:27:02,792
which is something that should not be taken for granted.

5984
07:27:02,792 --> 07:27:06,792
But we have not much money. The town does not

5985
07:27:06,893 --> 07:27:12,072
have much money, uh, for this. So we've exhausted our

5986
07:27:12,112 --> 07:27:17,272
reserves. Uh, so as the third party of this whole,

5987
07:27:17,272 --> 07:27:22,712
uh, project, if we want to expedite it, we've got

5988
07:27:22,712 --> 07:27:25,752
to have help. We've got to have participation. I don't

5989
07:27:25,773 --> 07:27:30,392
see how we can be moving forward for 612 units.

5990
07:27:30,392 --> 07:27:32,792
And all that would be involved with the infrastructure without

5991
07:27:32,813 --> 07:27:36,792
participation from the proponent. So to my mind, I think

5992
07:27:36,813 --> 07:27:39,032
that has to be worked on first. And I think

5993
07:27:39,032 --> 07:27:42,512
that that's what the public wants us to do. We

5994
07:27:42,893 --> 07:27:47,192
before we spin the money before we move forward. Let's

5995
07:27:47,192 --> 07:27:50,712
make sure that we have the infrastructure capability. However, that

5996
07:27:50,752 --> 07:27:55,552
is delivered. So I'm interested in, and I want to

5997
07:27:55,552 --> 07:27:57,672
be, first of all, very encouraging, because I think the

5998
07:27:58,013 --> 07:28:01,112
opportunity here. But I think first of all, we need

5999
07:28:01,112 --> 07:28:04,272
to know how much is this going to cost. So

6000
07:28:04,493 --> 07:28:07,192
how much is it going to cost to connect to

6001
07:28:07,232 --> 07:28:11,432
the 612 units? How much it will be proponent be

6002
07:28:11,432 --> 07:28:16,632
willing to participate. And then from there, we get a

6003
07:28:16,653 --> 07:28:20,712
confirmation letter from NVCA. At the same time, that doesn't

6004
07:28:20,813 --> 07:28:25,592
stop, of course, uh, conversations going on with a proponent.

6005
07:28:25,592 --> 07:28:29,032
Um, so I would tend to be looking at option

6006
07:28:29,293 --> 07:28:34,472
five, which we invite a revised phased, um, not necessarily

6007
07:28:34,512 --> 07:28:37,832
limited request, but we have a different conversation than we've

6008
07:28:37,872 --> 07:28:42,632
had before. And I realised that there's a planning protocols.

6009
07:28:42,632 --> 07:28:45,832
And I don't know where this one fits in. But,

6010
07:28:45,832 --> 07:28:48,392
um, I do think that it's the only way that

6011
07:28:48,432 --> 07:28:51,672
we can move forward. Uh, and I do, I would

6012
07:28:51,672 --> 07:28:54,072
love to see Public Meeting, but I take Councillor Reporters

6013
07:28:54,973 --> 07:28:58,232
point, I think a couple of members here have said

6014
07:28:58,493 --> 07:29:00,792
we want to see what the proponent is looking to

6015
07:29:00,792 --> 07:29:05,197
do. We've learned that the hard way. So we'd really

6016
07:29:05,197 --> 07:29:07,997
like to see what, what, what they have in mind.

6017
07:29:07,997 --> 07:29:13,637
So these conversations, um, need to happen. I think before

6018
07:29:13,637 --> 07:29:16,797
we can move forward, even to a Public meeting. Because

6019
07:29:16,797 --> 07:29:18,877
the Public is going to want to know, how is

6020
07:29:18,917 --> 07:29:21,501
this going to be paid for. So I'm wondering how

6021
07:29:21,762 --> 07:29:28,861
does this suggestion fit into planning protocols. Through me too.

6022
07:29:28,882 --> 07:29:32,701
Manager Postma. Thank you, Madam Chair. In terms of our

6023
07:29:32,802 --> 07:29:38,461
planning protocols, MZ O's, there's less requirements than a traditional

6024
07:29:40,082 --> 07:29:44,301
planning approval or planning application. However, the problem does look

6025
07:29:44,402 --> 07:29:49,661
for, um, the municipalities direction and resolution on this matter

6026
07:29:50,962 --> 07:29:54,061
and does suggest things like public consultation should, should take

6027
07:29:54,082 --> 07:29:57,581
place. How that's done, uh, is up to Council in

6028
07:29:57,581 --> 07:30:01,421
terms of how they want to complete that, that process.

6029
07:30:01,421 --> 07:30:05,661
So to have an inform, an information meeting beforehand to

6030
07:30:05,701 --> 07:30:08,061
have a public meeting, these are all options that are

6031
07:30:08,101 --> 07:30:12,701
available to council. At a minimum, we would recommend a

6032
07:30:12,701 --> 07:30:15,261
Public meeting, but it can be built on from there.

6033
07:30:17,018 --> 07:30:20,517
Okay. I certainly didn't bring MZ Owen to my conversation.

6034
07:30:20,557 --> 07:30:23,157
I certainly think that the MZO should be something for

6035
07:30:23,197 --> 07:30:26,037
the new council. So whereas I'm concerned and I'm ZO

6036
07:30:26,077 --> 07:30:29,877
lines up with the limitations on a lame council in

6037
07:30:29,877 --> 07:30:31,317
any case. I don't think we should be making that

6038
07:30:31,418 --> 07:30:34,357
kind of call for the next council. Uh, what I

6039
07:30:34,357 --> 07:30:36,277
want to know is can we have these kinds of

6040
07:30:36,378 --> 07:30:40,357
conversations that we haven't had before with proponents? So how,

6041
07:30:40,357 --> 07:30:42,577
how, you know, we want to expedite this project. How

6042
07:30:42,577 --> 07:30:45,237
can you help us? Otherwise, we're going to be saving

6043
07:30:45,258 --> 07:30:49,157
for years to try and make this work, uh, because

6044
07:30:49,157 --> 07:30:52,837
we don't have the resources to do otherwise. So is

6045
07:30:52,837 --> 07:30:54,917
that the kind of conversation, I guess, to make it

6046
07:30:54,917 --> 07:30:56,917
more clear. Is that the kind of conversation that the

6047
07:30:56,957 --> 07:31:01,317
planning department would have with the proponent? And, uh, and

6048
07:31:01,317 --> 07:31:03,317
I have no problem with the Public Meeting, but let's

6049
07:31:03,418 --> 07:31:06,757
bring some meat to the Public Meeting. Let's bring information

6050
07:31:07,498 --> 07:31:10,917
about the plans and how, uh, what is required for

6051
07:31:10,957 --> 07:31:13,157
the infrastructure. So it means the town needs to say

6052
07:31:13,578 --> 07:31:16,517
how much this is going to cost as much as

6053
07:31:16,517 --> 07:31:18,797
it can. And at the same time, what kind of

6054
07:31:18,938 --> 07:31:23,877
participation can be expected from the proponent in the interests

6055
07:31:23,877 --> 07:31:25,797
of trying to move this forward as much as we

6056
07:31:25,797 --> 07:31:32,686
can. Thank you. Team Madam Chair, I do see two

6057
07:31:32,707 --> 07:31:36,926
potential options here. Uh, one is the standard Public meeting.

6058
07:31:36,926 --> 07:31:39,326
Uh, it does give an opportunity for the proponent to

6059
07:31:39,427 --> 07:31:43,386
come and present their materials, um, and, and, you know,

6060
07:31:43,427 --> 07:31:46,926
an overview of their project, the vision, all those components.

6061
07:31:46,926 --> 07:31:50,206
That's our normal Public Meeting process. Uh, but it kind

6062
07:31:50,206 --> 07:31:52,126
of puts counsel in Public on the spot to be

6063
07:31:52,126 --> 07:31:55,406
able to respond at, at that time, uh, second option

6064
07:31:55,427 --> 07:31:59,246
is to request, um, from the developer, perhaps a deputation

6065
07:31:59,286 --> 07:32:03,166
beforehand to provide some of that information, um, earlier on

6066
07:32:03,187 --> 07:32:07,886
in the process, either in conjunction with a Public meeting,

6067
07:32:07,886 --> 07:32:10,766
um, or ahead of Council deciding whether to proceed with

6068
07:32:10,867 --> 07:32:13,726
a Public meeting. Um, but all of those of course

6069
07:32:13,766 --> 07:32:17,140
come with their own timeframes and their own requirements. And

6070
07:32:18,681 --> 07:32:22,260
we'll proceed as Council Cease Fit. So that wasn't quite

6071
07:32:22,441 --> 07:32:29,140
an option. Then basically have the proponent prepare first bring

6072
07:32:29,140 --> 07:32:32,260
the information and then have the Public Meeting? Is that

6073
07:32:32,601 --> 07:32:35,840
where you were going? Yeah. So the two options. One

6074
07:32:35,840 --> 07:32:38,260
was just to go straight to a Public Meeting allowing

6075
07:32:38,281 --> 07:32:40,900
the proponent to present their materials and to receive Public

6076
07:32:41,161 --> 07:32:44,420
comment at the same time. Or option two was to

6077
07:32:44,601 --> 07:32:50,420
request that the applicant make a deputation beforehand allow the

6078
07:32:50,441 --> 07:32:56,260
materials to be presented. That informing stage to occur. Uh,

6079
07:32:56,521 --> 07:33:01,591
have the Public Meeting. Okay. Um, thank you. I know

6080
07:33:01,692 --> 07:33:04,631
we've got a list here, but I think the second

6081
07:33:04,671 --> 07:33:08,211
option is one of interest where we then have, um,

6082
07:33:09,612 --> 07:33:12,391
uh, we get the information through the deputation. We can

6083
07:33:12,391 --> 07:33:15,331
have the kind of exchange that we head today. Uh,

6084
07:33:15,331 --> 07:33:17,751
and then from there, we can then move on to

6085
07:33:18,172 --> 07:33:21,511
a deputation. But those are my thoughts onto my colleagues.

6086
07:33:21,511 --> 07:33:28,752
Um, uh, Councillor McKinley. Oh, yes, I'm sorry. I didn't

6087
07:33:28,752 --> 07:33:31,432
have my glasses on. CAO, go ahead. Yes, through the

6088
07:33:31,472 --> 07:33:33,832
chair. And just maybe some, uh, context as well. Cause

6089
07:33:33,832 --> 07:33:35,512
I think what we've been attempting to do through this

6090
07:33:35,533 --> 07:33:38,312
project as well is to apply or mirror as much

6091
07:33:38,352 --> 07:33:40,312
as we can as it relates to how any other

6092
07:33:40,493 --> 07:33:43,912
general application under the planning Act would be, uh, would

6093
07:33:43,933 --> 07:33:46,712
be handled. So I think when we look at, especially

6094
07:33:46,712 --> 07:33:50,072
what's available or the, the studies and the available information

6095
07:33:50,253 --> 07:33:55,192
that we already have publicly displays on our web portal

6096
07:33:55,853 --> 07:33:57,912
is, uh, I think we're getting pretty close as it

6097
07:33:57,912 --> 07:34:00,852
relates to what we generally expect from a proponent, um,

6098
07:34:00,852 --> 07:34:03,592
in terms of a complete application. I mean, that trigger

6099
07:34:03,613 --> 07:34:05,752
point to going to a Public meeting. But that might

6100
07:34:05,752 --> 07:34:08,392
be my question over to, may Mr. Postman can add

6101
07:34:08,392 --> 07:34:10,432
a little bit further to that to say based on

6102
07:34:10,493 --> 07:34:13,192
assessment of what's been submitted thus far in comparison to

6103
07:34:13,533 --> 07:34:16,632
any other application at the town that, you know, generally

6104
07:34:16,632 --> 07:34:19,112
speaking, we be in the place here where there is

6105
07:34:19,693 --> 07:34:22,632
at least enough information to go to that, uh, Public

6106
07:34:22,653 --> 07:34:26,152
meeting or if there would be a risks that Mr.

6107
07:34:26,173 --> 07:34:30,555
Postman may identify at this point in time. Go ahead,

6108
07:34:30,595 --> 07:34:33,755
Mr. Postman. Yeah. Just to add to that, um, I

6109
07:34:33,755 --> 07:34:36,535
would agree. Uh, in terms of the technical studies, uh,

6110
07:34:36,656 --> 07:34:39,195
the submission that's been made, it appears that this would

6111
07:34:39,456 --> 07:34:42,635
be the equivalent of a complete application on a similar,

6112
07:34:42,635 --> 07:34:44,955
you know, traditional planning application. So we do have all

6113
07:34:45,056 --> 07:34:48,795
the information through that traditional planning route, uh, the next

6114
07:34:48,835 --> 07:34:51,895
step would be to move to a Public meeting. Um,

6115
07:34:51,895 --> 07:34:57,493
so that would be the normal course of action. Okay.

6116
07:34:57,493 --> 07:35:03,949
Um, not. But I think injecting, um, somewhere along the

6117
07:35:03,949 --> 07:35:08,269
line and they're here today. What's the offer in terms

6118
07:35:08,269 --> 07:35:12,829
of helping us expedite the project together, uh, by assistance

6119
07:35:12,930 --> 07:35:17,459
financial assistance with, with the infrastructure. That's my, my comment.

6120
07:35:20,667 --> 07:35:22,286
And I actually, I think we're going to have to

6121
07:35:22,347 --> 07:35:29,606
extend this. Yeah. So let's extend to 515, maybe 530.

6122
07:35:29,606 --> 07:35:31,126
And if we end early. Is that OK with everyone

6123
07:35:31,147 --> 07:35:34,406
here? I'll move that. Okay. Thank you from the Depu

6124
07:35:34,406 --> 07:35:37,446
Mayer and I think second in a daisy council reporter's

6125
07:35:37,627 --> 07:35:40,966
hand. And so did you say 530? Yes, 530 please.

6126
07:35:42,907 --> 07:35:45,366
And the motion is that Council waves, the provisions of

6127
07:35:45,366 --> 07:35:47,686
the procedural bylaw to allow the meeting to continue beyond

6128
07:35:48,187 --> 07:35:54,301
the seven hour limit to 5 30 LPM. Moved by

6129
07:35:54,341 --> 07:36:01,658
the Depumier, seconded by Councillor Porter. Any further discussion. Okay.

6130
07:36:01,839 --> 07:36:04,698
Uh, let's call the boat, please. Vote is open.

6131
07:36:14,628 --> 07:36:17,963
The vote is close. Thank you. That motion is carried

6132
07:36:18,144 --> 07:36:22,043
7 - 0 with all committee members present. Now Councillor

6133
07:36:22,083 --> 07:36:29,516
McKinley. Returned. Is it okay there we go. Uh, yeah.

6134
07:36:29,516 --> 07:36:32,396
So thank you, Madam Chair. I was just, if I

6135
07:36:32,396 --> 07:36:34,636
put my hand up because it's getting on on the

6136
07:36:34,676 --> 07:36:36,996
day and we needed to get to a motion, I

6137
07:36:36,996 --> 07:36:40,236
was going to move to getting emotional on the floor.

6138
07:36:40,236 --> 07:36:42,636
But if the more discussion going to happen, then there'd

6139
07:36:42,636 --> 07:36:45,796
be more discussion. I just wanted to indicate that. We

6140
07:36:45,796 --> 07:36:48,412
need to get moving on this. Certainly. And thank you.

6141
07:36:48,412 --> 07:36:51,292
I think if we could, um, see what evolves for

6142
07:36:51,313 --> 07:36:54,172
a motion. Appreciate that we want to get this. We

6143
07:36:54,193 --> 07:36:56,252
want closure. Are you open for a motion or are

6144
07:36:56,252 --> 07:36:59,292
you since you would have a discussion? I'd like more

6145
07:36:59,292 --> 07:37:01,532
discussion. And then I'll come back to you for a

6146
07:37:01,572 --> 07:37:07,401
motion. How's that? Um, then I've got Madam Mayor. Thank

6147
07:37:07,401 --> 07:37:12,041
you. Um, I, well, when Councillor McKinley moves, I will

6148
07:37:12,081 --> 07:37:15,481
second the motion for option number one. Um, my question

6149
07:37:15,521 --> 07:37:20,121
through the chair, um, Mr. Postma or, or the CAO.

6150
07:37:20,121 --> 07:37:25,381
But, um, is if we proceed to Public Meeting, the

6151
07:37:25,381 --> 07:37:27,881
proponents have been sitting here all day listening to all

6152
07:37:27,881 --> 07:37:31,081
of this input and all of this questions. They will

6153
07:37:31,081 --> 07:37:34,121
make a presentation at the Public Meeting. It is up

6154
07:37:34,142 --> 07:37:36,681
to their prerogative to be able to answer as many

6155
07:37:36,702 --> 07:37:42,121
questions as early in the game as possible. So is

6156
07:37:42,121 --> 07:37:44,041
there anything preventing them from doing that? I don't see

6157
07:37:44,142 --> 07:37:47,241
the point of waiting for it to come back in

6158
07:37:47,281 --> 07:37:51,481
another deputation than go to Public Meeting when they're hearing

6159
07:37:51,582 --> 07:37:54,521
the concerns. They're hearing the questions. They're hearing the comments.

6160
07:37:54,521 --> 07:37:56,961
They're hearing the support. They're hearing everything. Leave it up

6161
07:37:57,001 --> 07:38:00,321
to them to be responsible to bring those answers forward

6162
07:38:00,582 --> 07:38:02,881
in the Public Meeting. Is there anything preventing them through

6163
07:38:02,921 --> 07:38:09,103
the chair to Mr. Potsma from doing that. Uh, the

6164
07:38:09,364 --> 07:38:12,383
preventing them from, from doing that, no. Um, it's actually

6165
07:38:12,484 --> 07:38:15,023
an expectation that we put on applicants that they do

6166
07:38:15,204 --> 07:38:19,343
provide their vision, uh, and they present their, their proposals

6167
07:38:19,844 --> 07:38:23,590
in great detail to the public and to council. Thank

6168
07:38:23,590 --> 07:38:26,962
you. And one follow - up, please. Go ahead. Um,

6169
07:38:27,003 --> 07:38:31,542
then also at Public Meeting, um, in the, when we've

6170
07:38:31,542 --> 07:38:37,542
had other public meetings following the process, if between now

6171
07:38:37,643 --> 07:38:41,462
and that Public meeting, the MVCA puts a letter and

6172
07:38:41,483 --> 07:38:44,742
confirms what you've shared with us verbally, we can hear

6173
07:38:44,782 --> 07:38:48,822
that at the Public Meeting as well. The agencies, will

6174
07:38:48,822 --> 07:38:51,142
they make a presentation or will they submit? Cause I

6175
07:38:51,142 --> 07:38:54,902
know usually we hear these agencies have responded with X.

6176
07:38:55,378 --> 07:39:00,001
Thank you. Uh, yeah. So once a Public meeting is

6177
07:39:00,022 --> 07:39:03,361
confirmed, we do circulate notice. And we do request comments

6178
07:39:03,862 --> 07:39:06,161
ahead of time of that Public Meeting. Comments can come

6179
07:39:06,161 --> 07:39:09,101
in at or after the Public Meaning as well. Uh,

6180
07:39:09,101 --> 07:39:13,681
however, definitely with the Nautilus Saga Valley Conservation Authority. It's

6181
07:39:13,681 --> 07:39:15,121
will be working with them to try to get those

6182
07:39:15,302 --> 07:39:19,495
comments in time for that meeting. Thank you Madam Mayor

6183
07:39:19,916 --> 07:39:24,668
onto Kill Supporter. Yes. Thank you. And through the chair,

6184
07:39:24,668 --> 07:39:27,708
I just really want to go through a few logistics

6185
07:39:27,748 --> 07:39:32,392
here. So the next council meeting is September 8th. I'll

6186
07:39:32,432 --> 07:39:35,512
just differ to the Deputy Clerk. And the last Council

6187
07:39:35,552 --> 07:39:44,631
meeting of this term is October 13th. October 19th. 19th.

6188
07:39:45,018 --> 07:39:49,729
Okay. If you have a Public Meeting, you're required to

6189
07:39:49,769 --> 07:39:53,009
give notice of 20 days. 20 days won't start till

6190
07:39:53,110 --> 07:39:55,889
after the September 8th. And that depends how fast it

6191
07:39:55,889 --> 07:39:59,329
gets out. Do you really think logically and given the

6192
07:39:59,350 --> 07:40:02,929
timeframe that a report has to be in to the

6193
07:40:03,030 --> 07:40:08,699
clerk's office in advance of an agenda release. Logistically, just

6194
07:40:08,699 --> 07:40:12,528
looking at the math, can it be done? Because I

6195
07:40:12,528 --> 07:40:18,841
don't think so. Staff members would like to answer that.

6196
07:40:18,841 --> 07:40:24,003
Thank you. I can take a stab at that one

6197
07:40:24,424 --> 07:40:27,123
because we have a quick, sorry. We have looked quite

6198
07:40:27,123 --> 07:40:29,283
closely at the calendar in terms of what it is

6199
07:40:29,304 --> 07:40:32,549
that we can achieve, uh, with our notice requirements. Uh,

6200
07:40:32,549 --> 07:40:35,349
it is extremely tight. And it would mean essentially that

6201
07:40:35,370 --> 07:40:39,989
the application as submitted is perfect and ready to go.

6202
07:40:39,989 --> 07:40:42,309
Uh, however, depending on the scale and the number of

6203
07:40:42,349 --> 07:40:45,189
issues or concerns or comments that we receive back on

6204
07:40:45,189 --> 07:40:48,069
that, um, depending on how long it takes to address

6205
07:40:48,170 --> 07:40:51,669
those, we'll obviously add to that, uh, to that timeline.

6206
07:40:51,669 --> 07:40:53,829
Um, and really we don't know what those comments are

6207
07:40:53,850 --> 07:40:56,309
going to be until after, uh, after we receive all

6208
07:40:56,309 --> 07:41:02,388
the comments through that, uh, Public Meeting Notice. Okay. Thank

6209
07:41:02,388 --> 07:41:06,245
you very much. Um, just like to have a follow

6210
07:41:06,266 --> 07:41:09,365
- up. It appears the last Council Meeting is October

6211
07:41:10,106 --> 07:41:13,445
13th. Yes. Which is you've got five weeks from the

6212
07:41:13,485 --> 07:41:16,325
next Council meeting five weeks and you have 20 days

6213
07:41:16,346 --> 07:41:20,662
to get public notice. I don't think you can do

6214
07:41:20,683 --> 07:41:23,462
it and get it out and get all the questions

6215
07:41:23,803 --> 07:41:30,846
asked. And it's, and I, um, it's too tight. It's

6216
07:41:30,867 --> 07:41:36,194
a shame the proponent come earlier. Thank you. Okay. I

6217
07:41:36,194 --> 07:41:40,434
just want to confirm I'm hearing from my colleagues that

6218
07:41:40,474 --> 07:41:43,394
October 13th is the day, the last date before the

6219
07:41:43,415 --> 07:41:47,714
election. And, um, and we're hearing from the Deputy Clerk,

6220
07:41:47,714 --> 07:41:51,978
it's the 19th. So just confirming that it's, sorry, what

6221
07:41:51,978 --> 07:41:56,778
was it? It used at October 16th. 13th. It's not

6222
07:41:56,879 --> 07:42:03,031
on our calendar for the 19th. 19th is empty. Is.

6223
07:42:03,183 --> 07:42:06,051
The 11th. 12th. So we've deposed the. Time.

6224
07:42:14,666 --> 07:42:17,685
My apologies, this, what I am looking at is incorrect.

6225
07:42:18,869 --> 07:42:23,168
Okay. So October 13th then. So to Councillor Porter's point,

6226
07:42:23,429 --> 07:42:27,276
there's even less time. Okay. Just to be clear, there's

6227
07:42:27,276 --> 07:42:30,343
five weeks. To be clear. Yes. And you require 20

6228
07:42:30,383 --> 07:42:34,851
days to release the Public Notice. 20 days. Five weeks.

6229
07:42:35,762 --> 07:42:41,501
Is 35 days. So the, just wondering, um, nothing would

6230
07:42:41,541 --> 07:42:45,430
stop the proponent from doing another deputation. No, I'm just

6231
07:42:45,470 --> 07:42:48,070
saying you hold a Public meeting by timing the notices

6232
07:42:48,251 --> 07:42:51,670
get out after September 8th Council meeting, which is 20

6233
07:42:51,710 --> 07:42:55,190
days. Yes. Then minus the time for the next council

6234
07:42:55,230 --> 07:42:58,790
meeting, you have 15 days to hold the Public Meeting,

6235
07:42:58,790 --> 07:43:01,707
do the poor, get it on the agenda. Right. So

6236
07:43:01,707 --> 07:43:06,587
the Public Meeting may be certainly a problem. Um, but

6237
07:43:06,768 --> 07:43:09,707
if the proponent wishes to communicate with Council, they can

6238
07:43:09,707 --> 07:43:12,747
always do that through deputation. Just want to make that

6239
07:43:13,008 --> 07:43:18,443
clear. Okay. The Depumir. Madam Clerks on the line. No,

6240
07:43:18,443 --> 07:43:22,413
The Clerk Clerk. Oh. Madam Clerk. Oh, yes. Oh, go

6241
07:43:22,413 --> 07:43:27,288
ahead, Madam Clerk. Madam Clerk in the office. Yeah. In

6242
07:43:27,328 --> 07:43:31,407
the office. You can hear me. Okay. Yes. Great. Uh,

6243
07:43:31,428 --> 07:43:33,487
thank you through you, Madam Chair. I thought I would

6244
07:43:33,527 --> 07:43:37,147
chime in, um, to the discussion if, okay. I'm just

6245
07:43:37,147 --> 07:43:40,367
looking at the calendar. And yes, uh, they're the meeting

6246
07:43:40,407 --> 07:43:43,167
date of October the 19th Council meeting date was adjusted

6247
07:43:43,207 --> 07:43:46,607
to the 13th because it fell within the voting period.

6248
07:43:46,607 --> 07:43:50,207
So, uh, that the Deputy Clear kid, uh, correctly corrected

6249
07:43:50,228 --> 07:43:54,927
that date. And with respect to notice, so any recommendations

6250
07:43:55,028 --> 07:43:58,207
made today will be considered by council at the September

6251
07:43:58,388 --> 07:44:03,298
8th Council meeting. So the notice policy does provide that

6252
07:44:03,479 --> 07:44:07,138
21 days notices required of a Public meeting. So the

6253
07:44:07,138 --> 07:44:11,458
next Public Meeting, following September the 8th, um, is September

6254
07:44:11,799 --> 07:44:17,218
the 29th. So that is 21 days from the eighth.

6255
07:44:17,218 --> 07:44:21,038
So if, if today the Committee of the whole, um,

6256
07:44:21,799 --> 07:44:26,478
recommended that Public Meeting Beheld, I'm certain that the, uh,

6257
07:44:26,679 --> 07:44:30,158
planning department would have the notice ready to go. And

6258
07:44:30,158 --> 07:44:33,378
as soon as if council endorsed that on the eighth

6259
07:44:33,378 --> 07:44:35,938
of September, that notice would be released to the Public

6260
07:44:36,039 --> 07:44:39,538
on the eighth of September. Uh, thus providing the 21

6261
07:44:39,559 --> 07:44:43,138
days notice. And the Public Meeting could be held. Again,

6262
07:44:43,138 --> 07:44:45,258
this is all with Council's approval. I just want to

6263
07:44:45,258 --> 07:44:49,618
provide the information. Um, so the 21 days notice could

6264
07:44:49,658 --> 07:44:55,138
be achieved for a September 29th Public Meeting. Following that

6265
07:44:55,959 --> 07:44:58,658
there would have to be some grace because the next

6266
07:44:59,079 --> 07:45:02,578
committee of the whole cycle falls the very following week.

6267
07:45:02,578 --> 07:45:06,338
So there would have to be, um, concessions made there

6268
07:45:06,378 --> 07:45:10,338
as to whether Council, uh, would allow the planning department

6269
07:45:10,359 --> 07:45:12,898
to provide their follow - up staff report to that

6270
07:45:12,938 --> 07:45:17,207
Public meeting, um, on the revised agenda. I can answer

6271
07:45:17,228 --> 07:45:21,159
any further questions if you'd like. Thank you. I think

6272
07:45:21,420 --> 07:45:24,839
the next question is probably for the planning department. Can

6273
07:45:24,879 --> 07:45:28,359
you handle that schedule if it were set on September

6274
07:45:29,020 --> 07:45:33,674
the 28th or 29th. It's a special meeting. We're set

6275
07:45:33,714 --> 07:45:39,678
then. How would you manage that? Thank you. Uh, I'll

6276
07:45:39,699 --> 07:45:42,158
be first to admit that it's a very, very aggressive

6277
07:45:42,259 --> 07:45:45,358
schedule. Um, I know what the experience that we've had

6278
07:45:45,379 --> 07:45:47,838
with even the long - term care home and the

6279
07:45:47,878 --> 07:45:52,078
McPherson Project, which we have expedited as quickly as possible.

6280
07:45:52,078 --> 07:45:54,958
Um, you know, it's still taking us four to five

6281
07:45:54,998 --> 07:45:56,958
months to get through, you know, to the point where

6282
07:45:56,958 --> 07:46:00,478
we are today. Uh, so trying to have all the

6283
07:46:00,739 --> 07:46:03,998
cards fall exactly in place, uh, on the day is

6284
07:46:05,299 --> 07:46:11,528
it's not impossible, but it's the closest thing. Too. Well,

6285
07:46:11,528 --> 07:46:14,168
thank you. I'm going to continue with the thoughts from

6286
07:46:14,349 --> 07:46:17,288
other members of the committee. So Defumir, you're up next.

6287
07:46:19,596 --> 07:46:24,295
Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, going to Public Meeting is

6288
07:46:24,335 --> 07:46:27,335
paramount to me because number one, the town keeps on

6289
07:46:27,375 --> 07:46:31,815
turning, who's ever read these seven seats. It doesn't matter.

6290
07:46:31,815 --> 07:46:34,215
The budget still goes Operation still go. Planning still goes

6291
07:46:34,255 --> 07:46:37,255
everything still goes on. So even the Public Meeting and

6292
07:46:37,356 --> 07:46:39,815
even we might hear the Public Meeting 200 people saying

6293
07:46:39,855 --> 07:46:41,255
this is the worst idea in the history of the

6294
07:46:41,255 --> 07:46:43,895
world. It's easy to make a decision. It may be

6295
07:46:43,895 --> 07:46:47,735
more information is needed, maybe more, um, investigations. It may

6296
07:46:47,775 --> 07:46:53,175
be more, um, input or consultation with the development team.

6297
07:46:53,175 --> 07:46:55,175
But I see nothing wrong with going to Public Meeting

6298
07:46:55,996 --> 07:46:58,355
because questions may arise from that Public Committee. That's the

6299
07:46:58,355 --> 07:47:00,095
whole point of having Public Meeting is not to be

6300
07:47:00,156 --> 07:47:02,375
prescriptive ahead of time is to get the input from

6301
07:47:02,396 --> 07:47:05,735
the meeting saying, I'm the neighbour. I'm worried about flooding.

6302
07:47:05,735 --> 07:47:07,575
I'm worried about the SNC or I think it's a

6303
07:47:07,575 --> 07:47:11,655
great idea because, you know, my kids work at Foodland

6304
07:47:11,756 --> 07:47:13,795
and they could, they could live here. And, you know,

6305
07:47:14,156 --> 07:47:16,775
just drive 15 minutes to work. So having a public

6306
07:47:16,796 --> 07:47:22,695
meeting, um, depending, I'm not worried about the timing because

6307
07:47:22,796 --> 07:47:24,455
the Poeting of the Public meetings to get the Public

6308
07:47:24,556 --> 07:47:28,455
comments. And the questions. And then you guys take them

6309
07:47:28,556 --> 07:47:31,015
like we do every Public meeting circulate them and you

6310
07:47:31,015 --> 07:47:32,775
might say, listen, we got a lot of concerns here

6311
07:47:33,356 --> 07:47:34,455
or a lot of people think this is a great

6312
07:47:34,455 --> 07:47:37,255
idea, but that's the whole point of a Public Meeting.

6313
07:47:37,255 --> 07:47:38,855
Not what we can think of, what the Public wants

6314
07:47:38,855 --> 07:47:41,095
to tell us. So I'm all for going to the

6315
07:47:41,095 --> 07:47:43,495
Public Meeting. And if it, you know, in the timelines

6316
07:47:43,516 --> 07:47:45,095
may be tight. And it may be pushed into the

6317
07:47:45,095 --> 07:47:48,295
next Council. I don't know. But having a Public meeting

6318
07:47:48,316 --> 07:47:50,855
without any bind you in MZ O whatsoever, just getting

6319
07:47:50,855 --> 07:47:52,455
the input on people, whether they think that's a good

6320
07:47:52,455 --> 07:47:55,335
idea. That's the most democratic thing I could think of.

6321
07:47:55,335 --> 07:47:57,495
And that's the most, um, community - based thing I

6322
07:47:57,495 --> 07:48:00,215
can think of. So I'd be in favor of scheduling

6323
07:48:00,236 --> 07:48:01,895
the Public Meeting going ahead and see what people think

6324
07:48:02,076 --> 07:48:04,615
and what questions they want answered to bring back in

6325
07:48:04,655 --> 07:48:06,295
as part of the follow - up report. Is that

6326
07:48:06,295 --> 07:48:08,935
option one then you can? That's an option one. That's

6327
07:48:08,975 --> 07:48:10,775
option one I was thinking of. Okay. Thank you very

6328
07:48:10,815 --> 07:48:14,215
much. Uh, and then I see Councillor Maxwell. So I'm

6329
07:48:14,255 --> 07:48:16,855
getting ready for a motion after cancelar Maxwell. Thank you.

6330
07:48:17,436 --> 07:48:20,835
Thank you. And yes, I'm all for Public Meeting. Um,

6331
07:48:21,836 --> 07:48:25,655
I just like to understand something Mr. Poesmo. So when.

6332
07:48:27,772 --> 07:48:32,551
How many comedy agencies and organisations and studies will be

6333
07:48:32,551 --> 07:48:37,519
involved or have made available. To the Public. So they

6334
07:48:37,620 --> 07:48:39,919
can actually have a look at this and say, Oh,

6335
07:48:39,919 --> 07:48:42,079
I didn't know that. Oh, I'm for that. Oh, I

6336
07:48:42,079 --> 07:48:45,716
didn't know that. Like, I think all the information has

6337
07:48:45,756 --> 07:48:48,676
to be on the table on every site, whether it's

6338
07:48:48,697 --> 07:48:52,356
the people who want to build or whether the agencies,

6339
07:48:52,356 --> 07:48:55,476
the Public. So we can have an honest look at

6340
07:48:55,497 --> 07:48:58,686
the whole thing. And the Deputy Mayor said so that

6341
07:48:58,726 --> 07:49:02,637
everybody can make, have an opinion. With a good or

6342
07:49:02,677 --> 07:49:08,223
bad. That's the way it works. Okay. Thank you very

6343
07:49:08,263 --> 07:49:13,663
much Councillor Maxwell. So then, um, Councillor McKinley has expressed

6344
07:49:13,663 --> 07:49:16,503
a wish for a motion. Madam Chair, I would like

6345
07:49:16,503 --> 07:49:22,343
to move option one. Thank you. Okay. Option one. So

6346
07:49:24,404 --> 07:49:27,983
that would read then direct Star. So it's option one

6347
07:49:28,023 --> 07:49:33,800
is proceed on an expedited review in consultation schedule. Okay.

6348
07:49:33,800 --> 07:49:35,960
So we're not going to repeat it. So is there

6349
07:49:36,000 --> 07:49:39,000
a seconder? I think Madam Mayor, you yes, I indicated

6350
07:49:39,000 --> 07:49:42,840
that I would second. Yes. Madam Mayor did indicate that.

6351
07:49:42,840 --> 07:49:45,717
I think we should read out the option. Um, I

6352
07:49:45,818 --> 07:49:49,797
will direct staff to proceed with an Accelerated review scheduled

6353
07:49:49,837 --> 07:49:53,217
a special Public Meeting at the earlyest available opportunity. And

6354
07:49:53,338 --> 07:49:56,437
if necessary schedule special committee of the whole and or

6355
07:49:56,538 --> 07:50:00,437
council meetings to accommodate the applicant's requested timelines. Staff would

6356
07:50:00,477 --> 07:50:04,437
complete circulation in return with a recommendation report and intend

6357
07:50:04,477 --> 07:50:06,757
on completing this process before the end of this term

6358
07:50:06,797 --> 07:50:09,797
of council. This option would not bind council to support

6359
07:50:10,138 --> 07:50:15,557
the MZO. That's what option one reads. Um, comments on

6360
07:50:15,658 --> 07:50:20,672
the motion. No comments. Um, I have a comment on

6361
07:50:20,773 --> 07:50:26,429
the motion. I'm wondering if, um. As part of Staff's

6362
07:50:26,429 --> 07:50:32,509
recommendation report that they provide some kind of estimate or

6363
07:50:32,610 --> 07:50:37,413
a breakdown of what the infrastructure requirements would be. Uh,

6364
07:50:37,834 --> 07:50:41,354
and, and if possible, the costs. Or, you know, roughly

6365
07:50:41,695 --> 07:50:44,794
the costs as part of the recommendation report. I don't

6366
07:50:44,794 --> 07:50:48,227
think it has to be enshrined in the motion. Is

6367
07:50:48,267 --> 07:50:51,538
the mover okay with that addition. It's not in the

6368
07:50:51,538 --> 07:50:53,698
motion. So I guess I'm, I guess I'm just suggesting

6369
07:50:53,738 --> 07:50:59,589
it. I'm sorry. I'm, I'm, I'm trying to follow what

6370
07:51:00,890 --> 07:51:03,269
you're making an amendment to this motion? No, I'm not

6371
07:51:03,269 --> 07:51:07,029
doing anything like that. I'm just saying as without putting

6372
07:51:07,050 --> 07:51:11,349
it into the motion, I'm just adding the request that

6373
07:51:11,610 --> 07:51:16,309
the recommendation report from staff include some kind of estimate

6374
07:51:16,410 --> 07:51:19,589
of what needs, what is required from an infrastructure perspective

6375
07:51:20,970 --> 07:51:28,769
to, to create the subdivision or of the development. And

6376
07:51:28,769 --> 07:51:33,867
if we could get an approximate cost. I would post

6377
07:51:33,888 --> 07:51:39,085
that to staff if that's. OCL Smith. Oh, go ahead.

6378
07:51:40,243 --> 07:51:43,638
Yes. Thank you, CO Smith. Through the chair. I can

6379
07:51:43,659 --> 07:51:45,718
take a crack at the response and then maybe lean

6380
07:51:45,718 --> 07:51:48,598
on Mr. Postman to provide any further information. But I

6381
07:51:48,598 --> 07:51:51,318
think really, you know, with going into the Public meeting,

6382
07:51:51,318 --> 07:51:53,638
I mean, generally when we would do is that we

6383
07:51:53,659 --> 07:51:56,438
compile all the comments. And we'd also, and when it

6384
07:51:56,438 --> 07:51:59,398
comes to servicing analysis, that's really fundamental to the, to

6385
07:51:59,438 --> 07:52:02,918
the recommendation report that Staff ultimately do bring. We do

6386
07:52:02,958 --> 07:52:05,238
know when it comes to, and this is where we're

6387
07:52:05,339 --> 07:52:08,358
going to need to say for further understand as it

6388
07:52:08,358 --> 07:52:10,998
relates to conditions that could be applied to any MZO

6389
07:52:11,579 --> 07:52:13,398
is to know, you know, where are the bounds to

6390
07:52:13,438 --> 07:52:16,358
it? And to say, I think through that recommendation report,

6391
07:52:16,379 --> 07:52:19,478
there would always be a section pertain to water and

6392
07:52:19,478 --> 07:52:23,638
sanitary capacity alongside, uh, any constraints that the municipality may

6393
07:52:23,659 --> 07:52:25,718
have. And we would need to look at what the

6394
07:52:25,758 --> 07:52:27,798
options exist as what. And one of them could be

6395
07:52:27,899 --> 07:52:30,598
saying that it may be premature as it relates to

6396
07:52:30,638 --> 07:52:33,318
the analysis based on what those constraints are. Or it

6397
07:52:33,318 --> 07:52:35,558
could say that there are some further works that are

6398
07:52:35,558 --> 07:52:40,358
required, but that's why we have a condition related to,

6399
07:52:40,358 --> 07:52:43,238
um, certain works being completed until such a time in

6400
07:52:43,278 --> 07:52:45,798
which permits could be issued or anything of that nature.

6401
07:52:45,798 --> 07:52:48,198
But perhaps Mr. Postman can, can provide a little bit

6402
07:52:48,198 --> 07:52:56,019
more, more detail to that. Now, I think that essentially

6403
07:52:56,280 --> 07:53:00,111
covers it. It's really, um. Yeah, actually, I don't have

6404
07:53:00,111 --> 07:53:07,755
anything else to add. Sorry, I didn't hear you. I'm

6405
07:53:07,776 --> 07:53:11,035
sorry. I didn't have anything else to have. Thank you.

6406
07:53:11,456 --> 07:53:16,315
Selemith provided. Okay. Thank you. Uh, and I see that

6407
07:53:16,336 --> 07:53:19,675
the premiere has a santa through the chair, just a

6408
07:53:19,675 --> 07:53:22,635
question. We already have a scheduled Public Meeting Set in

6409
07:53:22,635 --> 07:53:26,155
our calendars for the 29th. So are you anticipating doing

6410
07:53:26,195 --> 07:53:29,815
another meeting or incorporating that day? Because there's a lot

6411
07:53:30,816 --> 07:53:33,035
luck going on with us trying to get information done.

6412
07:53:33,503 --> 07:53:35,402
And cow meetings and that. So we already do have

6413
07:53:35,423 --> 07:53:37,722
one. Is that the date you were shooting for? For

6414
07:53:37,762 --> 07:53:42,496
clarity. Yes. That is correct. September 29th. Okay. And can

6415
07:53:42,496 --> 07:53:43,856
I just have a follow - up question of something

6416
07:53:44,517 --> 07:53:47,036
that you started? To the, this is to, through the

6417
07:53:47,036 --> 07:53:49,616
chair to the CAO. CAO, we have 11 zones of

6418
07:53:49,637 --> 07:53:54,336
DC availability. Um, so I guess my question would be,

6419
07:53:54,336 --> 07:53:57,616
even if, uh, some of this in a secondary plan,

6420
07:53:57,616 --> 07:53:59,856
but it's within the zone. I believe it's in the

6421
07:53:59,896 --> 07:54:04,336
Craig Leith area boundary. Still, even though it's a secondary

6422
07:54:04,357 --> 07:54:09,136
plan, it's still within one of our zones, correct? Through

6423
07:54:09,136 --> 07:54:16,298
the chair, that's correct. Thank you. Uh, Councillor Porter. Yes.

6424
07:54:16,338 --> 07:54:18,778
Through the chair, just building on what the Deputy Mayor

6425
07:54:18,799 --> 07:54:20,858
said, I don't really feel an option one. We need

6426
07:54:20,858 --> 07:54:25,916
to say if necessary schedule, special meetings. No. I can't.

6427
07:54:25,916 --> 07:54:27,756
And if that remains, I will not vote for this.

6428
07:54:27,857 --> 07:54:30,794
There is set dates and timelines. I'm just not going

6429
07:54:30,794 --> 07:54:34,791
to have something else. Just pop up. Option one is

6430
07:54:35,212 --> 07:54:37,751
for Town Clerk has confirmed it can be held on

6431
07:54:37,791 --> 07:54:40,280
that day. So I think it's redundant to have that.

6432
07:54:42,983 --> 07:54:47,842
Okay. Um, so then, um, so the motion itself just

6433
07:54:47,842 --> 07:54:51,122
refers to option one. And so the gym one says,

6434
07:54:51,122 --> 07:54:53,682
if necessary schedule is special committee of the whole and

6435
07:54:53,682 --> 07:54:56,562
our council meetings. Okay. So you want that removed? I

6436
07:54:56,602 --> 07:55:00,164
want it removed because it's not necessary. All right. Uh,

6437
07:55:00,265 --> 07:55:02,644
Councillor McKinley, you're the mover. Do you agree to that?

6438
07:55:04,313 --> 07:55:07,012
If everything is lined up fine. I'm sure that was

6439
07:55:07,033 --> 07:55:11,972
just intentionally indentated whenever the report was written and processed.

6440
07:55:11,972 --> 07:55:15,412
So having not known this being the second day back

6441
07:55:15,513 --> 07:55:17,652
from the summer break. I'm sure that was just a

6442
07:55:17,753 --> 07:55:21,972
clerical for administrative addition, correct? I'm just asking that quickly

6443
07:55:22,012 --> 07:55:31,693
through you, Madam Chair, to the staff. Microphone. Oh.

6444
07:55:32,730 --> 07:55:35,541
There we go. Okay. Uh. Yeah, no, that was essentially

6445
07:55:35,562 --> 07:55:39,701
just a placeholder in case we needed that flexibility. Then

6446
07:55:39,701 --> 07:55:41,701
that being said, Madam Chair, yes, I'm fine to remove

6447
07:55:41,741 --> 07:55:45,574
that. Strike that small portion as it was just a

6448
07:55:45,614 --> 07:55:49,013
placeholder. So. I'm just wondering not to take any more

6449
07:55:49,034 --> 07:55:52,853
time, but if we're going to be winnowing things down,

6450
07:55:52,853 --> 07:55:55,733
direct Staff to proceed with an Accelerated review, schedule a

6451
07:55:55,994 --> 07:56:02,453
special, uh, schedule Public Meeting for September 29th.

6452
07:56:05,986 --> 07:56:10,379
To accommodate the applicant's requested timelines. In other words, take

6453
07:56:10,419 --> 07:56:15,259
out that whole reference. That's fine with me. Better mayor.

6454
07:56:15,259 --> 07:56:18,699
Do you understand? Secondary, it says if necessary. So it

6455
07:56:18,699 --> 07:56:20,859
doesn't say that it's required. So I actually don't see

6456
07:56:20,960 --> 07:56:23,099
a problem with the wording the way that it's worded.

6457
07:56:24,337 --> 07:56:27,436
And we've heard that the process is quite possible to

6458
07:56:27,436 --> 07:56:31,636
do within the normal timeframe. Great. It was just, if

6459
07:56:31,636 --> 07:56:35,576
necessary. And it's specifically says that. So a secondary, you

6460
07:56:35,576 --> 07:56:39,874
want to keep the current wording. Yes. Okay. All right.

6461
07:56:40,482 --> 07:56:44,781
So the motion reads, um, the official motion, I read

6462
07:56:44,821 --> 07:56:47,981
out the entire option one, but the motion itself moved

6463
07:56:47,981 --> 07:56:52,461
by Councillor McKinley seconded by, um, Mayor Makrosoft that Council

6464
07:56:52,501 --> 07:56:56,781
received Staff Report PBS 0. 2, 6. 066 entitled Information

6465
07:56:56,802 --> 07:57:01,821
Report, Request for Minister Zoning Order, residential workforce slash rental

6466
07:57:01,861 --> 07:57:07,181
housing 796 060 grey road 19. And that Council Direct

6467
07:57:07,221 --> 07:57:10,061
Staff to proceed with option one as identified in planning

6468
07:57:10,082 --> 07:57:16,168
staff report PBS 0. 26. 066. So the motion stands,

6469
07:57:16,168 --> 07:57:20,888
uh, with Councillor McKinley in The Mayor. And I see

6470
07:57:20,928 --> 07:57:26,320
that the comments can't supporter. Yes. I have two comments.

6471
07:57:26,320 --> 07:57:29,840
Um, one is so the wording stands that special meetings

6472
07:57:29,840 --> 07:57:33,666
can be convened. Cause that's what option one says as

6473
07:57:33,666 --> 07:57:37,266
identified in the report. Yeah. That's, that's how, that's how

6474
07:57:38,887 --> 07:57:41,486
the mover, well, I don't know where the mover. The

6475
07:57:41,486 --> 07:57:45,026
seconder is not willing to change. Okay. So I asked

6476
07:57:45,207 --> 07:57:48,706
him, I also heard Madam Clerk say that it made

6477
07:57:48,807 --> 07:57:51,106
the report may need to go on a revised agenda.

6478
07:57:52,090 --> 07:57:54,069
So what I want to see when it's a revised

6479
07:57:54,109 --> 07:57:56,709
agenda, the Public get less notice to provide written comments

6480
07:57:56,970 --> 07:58:00,738
which are available after a Public Meeting. Which means they

6481
07:58:00,778 --> 07:58:04,338
get it on Thursday, but legally they're not allowed to

6482
07:58:04,359 --> 07:58:07,978
submit correspondence or a reputation or anything that's written. So

6483
07:58:07,978 --> 07:58:11,827
I'd like that waved. So that they can submit some.

6484
07:58:11,827 --> 07:58:19,179
Yes. Thank you. Go ahead. Start creating all that. Okay.

6485
07:58:19,219 --> 07:58:25,979
Um, Clerk in the office. Go ahead, Ms. Giles. And

6486
07:58:25,979 --> 07:58:28,139
my apologies, uh. Thank you, Madam Chair. I thought that

6487
07:58:28,139 --> 07:58:31,739
was directed at me. Sorry for jumping in. So yes,

6488
07:58:31,739 --> 07:58:36,619
the Public does have an opportunity to provide correspondence in

6489
07:58:36,640 --> 07:58:42,539
response. Um, Council Reporter is correct in that those correspondences

6490
07:58:42,560 --> 07:58:46,299
would not be included on a revised agenda, but keep

6491
07:58:46,339 --> 07:58:49,339
in mind that correspondence or comments in response to a

6492
07:58:49,379 --> 07:58:52,459
Public Meeting, the comments are to be made at the

6493
07:58:52,480 --> 07:58:55,739
Public Meeting. All of the comments are to be attached

6494
07:58:55,840 --> 07:58:59,899
to that follow - up staff report for Council's consideration.

6495
07:59:01,368 --> 07:59:05,427
So through the chair, I accept that, but it's always,

6496
07:59:05,427 --> 07:59:09,199
you can always submit a written comment. And the people,

6497
07:59:09,199 --> 07:59:10,959
if it's on the revised agenda, they would not be

6498
07:59:10,959 --> 07:59:17,575
able to provide a written comment potentially in time. I,

6499
07:59:17,575 --> 07:59:18,855
correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see that

6500
07:59:19,196 --> 07:59:23,255
it's ever in anywhere that the Public comment can't be

6501
07:59:23,276 --> 07:59:27,755
submitted as correspondence to be put on the agenda. Clerk

6502
07:59:27,795 --> 07:59:29,435
just says it has to be written and not verbal.

6503
07:59:30,657 --> 07:59:33,274
Clerk Drows, what are your comments on that. Thank you.

6504
07:59:33,314 --> 07:59:37,594
Um, Madam Chair. So yes, the correspondent Public comments cannot

6505
07:59:37,594 --> 07:59:40,394
be made. That's correct. Um, verbal comments cannot be made

6506
07:59:40,575 --> 07:59:43,914
in response to a Public Meeting Notice. But correspondence can

6507
07:59:43,914 --> 07:59:46,434
be submitted. Now keep in mind the follow - up

6508
07:59:46,495 --> 07:59:50,074
Staff Report, if planning is able to achieve meeting that

6509
07:59:50,175 --> 07:59:54,234
October 6th Committee of the Whole Meeting, there is also

6510
07:59:54,255 --> 07:59:57,594
an opportunity to provide the comments to the October 13th

6511
07:59:57,615 --> 08:00:01,434
Council meeting when the final decision is made by, by

6512
08:00:01,455 --> 08:00:04,714
Council, again, if we're able to meet that October 6th

6513
08:00:04,714 --> 08:00:07,754
Committee of the Whole meeting. So the follow - up,

6514
08:00:07,754 --> 08:00:12,554
to be clear, correspondences, Deputations, et cetera, can be submitted,

6515
08:00:12,554 --> 08:00:16,154
but, um, it would be late for the October 6th

6516
08:00:16,154 --> 08:00:18,314
Committee of the Whole, but there is always the October

6517
08:00:18,415 --> 08:00:21,724
13th Council meeting. So just to follow up through the

6518
08:00:21,764 --> 08:00:25,324
chair regarding correspondence. So if correspondences submitted and it's on

6519
08:00:25,345 --> 08:00:28,524
the Council agenda and it's related to the Public Meeting,

6520
08:00:28,524 --> 08:00:33,093
can it be pulled for discussion? You're making the point

6521
08:00:33,434 --> 08:00:36,335
that it can be. Excuse me through the chair. I'm

6522
08:00:36,335 --> 08:00:41,075
asking in advance. Oh, I'm sorry clerk Charles. Thank you.

6523
08:00:42,491 --> 08:00:48,150
Thank you. So in response to the question, the correspondence,

6524
08:00:48,150 --> 08:00:50,630
the decision needs to be made through the consideration of

6525
08:00:50,731 --> 08:00:56,230
the staff report. So if there are corresponden to the

6526
08:00:56,251 --> 08:00:59,830
agenda regarding the Public Meeting, uh, response to the Public

6527
08:00:59,851 --> 08:01:02,530
Meeting Notice and the follow - up Staff Report, the

6528
08:01:02,530 --> 08:01:09,377
decision is made. When council discusses the Staff Report. Now

6529
08:01:09,418 --> 08:01:12,637
the correspondences can be pulled and discussed, but there'd be

6530
08:01:12,637 --> 08:01:15,157
no decision made and response to those. They would basically

6531
08:01:15,178 --> 08:01:19,264
be received for information. Through the chair, that's fine. I

6532
08:01:19,264 --> 08:01:20,784
just wanted to know if they could be pulled for

6533
08:01:20,824 --> 08:01:23,995
discussion. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. So we have a

6534
08:01:23,995 --> 08:01:26,835
motion on the floor. It's been moved in seconded. I

6535
08:01:26,835 --> 08:01:29,195
don't see any hands for any further discussion. So shall

6536
08:01:29,235 --> 08:01:31,915
we call the boat, please? My vote is open.

6537
08:01:58,657 --> 08:02:01,676
And that boat is closed. Thank you. That motion is

6538
08:02:01,716 --> 08:02:05,062
carried seven nothing with all members of the committee. Here.

6539
08:02:05,922 --> 08:02:10,201
Um, now I think we, um, are at the end

6540
08:02:10,242 --> 08:02:15,323
of our section with the exception of Public Comet. And

6541
08:02:15,363 --> 08:02:18,443
we hands up to if there needs to be public

6542
08:02:18,464 --> 08:02:20,763
comment anybody wants to make a public comment at this

6543
08:02:20,763 --> 08:02:26,092
point. Anything received, Madam Deputy Clerk? No, and I confirm

6544
08:02:26,132 --> 08:02:29,452
that Mr. Lampre Stoffer has confirmed he does not want

6545
08:02:29,492 --> 08:02:35,052
to provide anymore. Right. Okay. Thank you. So going once,

6546
08:02:35,052 --> 08:02:38,412
and nobody wishes to speak confirming that going twice, going

6547
08:02:38,753 --> 08:02:41,452
thrice. So I'm going to close Public comment and turn

6548
08:02:41,473 --> 08:02:45,421
the agenda over to Madam Mayor. Thank you very much,

6549
08:02:45,421 --> 08:02:48,021
Councillor Hope. So item C, new and unfinished business. We

6550
08:02:48,021 --> 08:02:50,541
do not have any committee of Council Reports to entertain

6551
08:02:50,962 --> 08:02:53,101
it. Item C2 is a call for any notices of

6552
08:02:53,101 --> 08:02:57,581
motion. Are there any notices in motion? Very, very quick.

6553
08:02:57,842 --> 08:03:01,273
I've already set them into the clerk. Okay. Uh, number

6554
08:03:01,313 --> 08:03:06,958
one Public Safety and Public Trails. Number two, the use

6555
08:03:06,998 --> 08:03:11,678
of soft landscaping within current and feature infrastructure projects to

6556
08:03:11,779 --> 08:03:18,710
assist and reconstructing neighbourhood character and identity. Number three, regular

6557
08:03:18,811 --> 08:03:22,950
inspections and maintenance of roads, bridges, and culverts to improve

6558
08:03:23,451 --> 08:03:31,352
Public Safety, snow, assault management. The overall infrastructure preservation. And

6559
08:03:31,633 --> 08:03:38,272
wildlife management within rural and urban areas. Okay. Thank you.

6560
08:03:38,272 --> 08:03:41,632
Council Reporter, did you have your Andres? Yes. I just

6561
08:03:41,632 --> 08:03:44,992
have a notice of motion regarding Bay Street Reconstruction. I'll

6562
08:03:44,992 --> 08:03:50,701
submit it on Thursday. Okay. Thank you. Anyone else. Okay.

6563
08:03:50,722 --> 08:03:53,261
We will continue on then. And we do not have

6564
08:03:53,282 --> 08:03:56,781
any items added to the agenda. Our next meeting dates.

6565
08:03:56,781 --> 08:03:59,181
The next Public Meeting is September 1st. The next Council

6566
08:03:59,181 --> 08:04:02,941
meeting is September 8th. And then Madam Deputy published in

6567
08:04:02,981 --> 08:04:06,121
the Agenda, it refers to the 28th and 29th. But

6568
08:04:06,322 --> 08:04:08,861
actually our next committee, The Whole Cycle is September 14th

6569
08:04:08,901 --> 08:04:17,822
and 15th, correct? Yeah, we do have, yeah. Metropologist. Okay.

6570
08:04:17,822 --> 08:04:21,022
So September 14th is the next committee. The whole cycle

6571
08:04:21,123 --> 08:04:24,942
and September 15th, which means that the emotion to adjourn,

6572
08:04:24,942 --> 08:04:26,622
it's recommended that this committee, the whole does now adjourn

6573
08:04:27,443 --> 08:04:31,502
at 529 p. m. to meet again on September 15th,

6574
08:04:31,542 --> 08:04:34,862
2026 Town Hall Council Chambers in virtually or at the

6575
08:04:34,883 --> 08:04:37,102
call of the chair. So move, Madam Chair. Thank you.

6576
08:04:37,142 --> 08:04:42,259
Move by Councillor McKinley. Secondary by Council Saradell. Any discussion

6577
08:04:42,299 --> 08:04:45,619
on a German, seeing none, Madame Deputy Clerk, please call

6578
08:04:45,659 --> 08:04:54,038
that vote. No vote is open. Please. You. Can't, sir.

6579
08:04:55,446 --> 08:04:59,665
McKinley. Affirmative. Thank you cancel reporter. Oh, there it goes.

6580
08:05:06,562 --> 08:05:09,519
My boa. Is closed. And that motion is carried 7

6581
08:05:09,700 --> 08:05:10,719
- 0. Thank you very much, everyone.