1 00:00:00,560 --> 00:00:02,480 Good evening. I would like to call the 2 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:05,839 July 13, 2026 Hillyard City Council 3 00:00:05,839 --> 00:00:08,160 Committee of the Whole meeting to order. 4 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:10,880 Would the clerk please call the role? 5 00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:11,749 >> Mr. Betts 6 00:00:11,749 --> 00:00:11,759 » Mr. Betts 7 00:00:11,759 --> 00:00:12,790 >> here. 8 00:00:12,790 --> 00:00:12,800 » here. 9 00:00:12,800 --> 00:00:14,390 >> Vice President Katon 10 00:00:14,390 --> 00:00:14,400 » Vice President Katon 11 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:15,589 >> here. 12 00:00:15,589 --> 00:00:15,599 » here. 13 00:00:15,599 --> 00:00:16,790 >> Miss Parker Jones 14 00:00:16,790 --> 00:00:16,800 » Miss Parker Jones 15 00:00:16,800 --> 00:00:17,269 >> here. 16 00:00:17,269 --> 00:00:17,279 » here. 17 00:00:17,279 --> 00:00:18,230 >> Miss Razul 18 00:00:18,230 --> 00:00:18,240 » Miss Razul 19 00:00:18,240 --> 00:00:19,269 >> here. 20 00:00:19,269 --> 00:00:19,279 » here. 21 00:00:19,279 --> 00:00:22,230 >> Mr. Teter is excused. Miss Vermillion 22 00:00:22,230 --> 00:00:22,240 » Mr. Teter is excused. Miss Vermillion 23 00:00:22,240 --> 00:00:22,630 >> here. 24 00:00:22,630 --> 00:00:22,640 » here. 25 00:00:22,640 --> 00:00:23,670 >> And President Cole 26 00:00:23,670 --> 00:00:23,680 » And President Cole 27 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:26,390 >> here. Council has copies of the June 28 00:00:26,390 --> 00:00:26,400 » here. Council has copies of the June 29 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:28,960 22nd, 2026 committee of the whole 30 00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:30,720 meeting minutes. Are there any changes 31 00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:33,200 or corrections? 32 00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:34,640 Hearing none, these minutes are approved 33 00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:36,960 as submitted. There's one item of 34 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:38,640 business on tonight's agenda, which is 35 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:41,040 an update and discussion on ebikes and e 36 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:42,640 scooters. Um, with that, I'll turn it 37 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:44,800 over to city manager Roush. 38 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,110 >> Thank you, President Cole. We're going 39 00:00:47,110 --> 00:00:47,120 » Thank you, President Cole. We're going 40 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:49,520 to get this presentation queued up here. 41 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:50,879 I'm trying something a little bit 42 00:00:50,879 --> 00:00:53,920 different. I can drive if uh it's Nope, 43 00:00:53,920 --> 00:00:55,920 you're good. We're um I've used 44 00:00:55,920 --> 00:00:57,760 PowerPoint in the past, but this is a a 45 00:00:57,760 --> 00:00:59,840 different kind of a tool called Prey, 46 00:00:59,840 --> 00:01:02,559 which uh is a little bit more animated 47 00:01:02,559 --> 00:01:05,360 in some respects, but um I'll walk you 48 00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:07,119 through actually. Could you hit your 49 00:01:07,119 --> 00:01:09,920 escape key, please? 50 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:12,400 Thank you. 51 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:15,840 Let's go back here real quick. 52 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:17,920 There we go. You got to get to the part 53 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,640 that actually shows the title. So, um, I 54 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:22,640 wanted to provide council and the public 55 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:24,720 with just an update on sort of where we 56 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:26,640 are in this conversation with respect to 57 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:29,600 ebikes, ecooters, and let's say 58 00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:31,920 microobility devices. It's a pretty 59 00:01:31,920 --> 00:01:34,479 broad um, umbrella. So, of course, you 60 00:01:34,479 --> 00:01:35,840 know, just to help illustrate the point, 61 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:38,400 we have here a picture of said example 62 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,200 of said device uh, which is an e 63 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:43,600 scooter. But I think the first and most 64 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:44,960 important place to start in this 65 00:01:44,960 --> 00:01:46,640 conversation is to really define our 66 00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:48,880 terms. So there's a term all over our 67 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:51,040 code, micromobility, and you'll see this 68 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:53,439 term other places as well. And that 69 00:01:53,439 --> 00:01:55,360 immediately in my mind at least conjures 70 00:01:55,360 --> 00:01:58,479 questions like micro micro what? Because 71 00:01:58,479 --> 00:02:01,680 a micromobility device can uh 72 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:04,719 encompasses a wide range of things with 73 00:02:04,719 --> 00:02:07,439 wheels. Some of them have pedals, some 74 00:02:07,439 --> 00:02:09,679 of them don't. Some of them require 75 00:02:09,679 --> 00:02:13,200 human power, some of them don't. and our 76 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:16,080 um our staff and our attorneys uh in in 77 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:18,480 consultation collaboration with other 78 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:21,120 municipalities as well have helped to 79 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:23,680 pull together a matrix of some examples 80 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:25,280 of what these kinds of vehicles look 81 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:27,280 like. And so to start out here, of 82 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:28,720 course, we have the very familiar 83 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:30,239 bicycle 84 00:02:30,239 --> 00:02:32,640 as well as a class one and two ebike, 85 00:02:32,640 --> 00:02:34,080 which those are the bikes that generally 86 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:36,560 go less than 20 m an hour with a motor 87 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:39,760 assist. A class 3 ebike uh generally 88 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:42,239 will go up to I believe it's 28 m an 89 00:02:42,239 --> 00:02:44,160 hour. And then you have all sorts of 90 00:02:44,160 --> 00:02:45,840 other devices on wheels. Those could be 91 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:49,599 skateboards, rollerblades, scooters, 92 00:02:49,599 --> 00:02:51,519 electric skateboards, electric versions 93 00:02:51,519 --> 00:02:54,480 of all of these things, golf carts, high 94 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:57,440 and low speed, motorized bicycles and 95 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:01,120 mopeds, miniature motorcycles. Uh we 96 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:03,840 have here shared and rented microobility 97 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:05,680 devices. If you've ever been, I think 98 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:08,000 Cincinnati has some, the the Lime 99 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:09,920 bicycles or I know out in DC they're 100 00:03:09,920 --> 00:03:12,400 popular as well. Personal assisted 101 00:03:12,400 --> 00:03:14,400 mobility devices, just the devices that 102 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:16,800 folks are using to get around every day. 103 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:18,319 And then I've got down here at the 104 00:03:18,319 --> 00:03:21,040 bottom things like Emotos, uh, which are 105 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:23,840 available on Amazon, which are are kind 106 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:28,080 of a, um, a not well-defined, uh, mashup 107 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:29,519 of some of these things, too. You can go 108 00:03:29,519 --> 00:03:31,440 out and and buy them from Costco or 109 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:33,120 Amazon, for example. Or another thing 110 00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:34,879 that's not listed here would be things 111 00:03:34,879 --> 00:03:36,720 like a hoverboard that have maybe one 112 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:38,560 wheel or like a segue. You can rock them 113 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:41,280 back and forth and go from there. I 114 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:43,200 think the the main idea here though is 115 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:45,599 that that's a lot of different kinds of 116 00:03:45,599 --> 00:03:47,120 vehicles and a lot of different 117 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:49,760 permutations of wheels and motors and 118 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,640 etc. that are all being used on our 119 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:56,319 infrastructure. And so we have the I 120 00:03:56,319 --> 00:03:58,239 think the great advantage of living in a 121 00:03:58,239 --> 00:03:59,680 community that's been very diligent 122 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:01,519 about building infrastructure for 123 00:04:01,519 --> 00:04:03,760 different kinds of uses. So everything 124 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:07,280 from you know um nature trails. I have a 125 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:09,040 couple from Hillyard proper but we have 126 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:10,720 some nature trails, gravel trails, 127 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,920 shared use paths. Uh this of course is a 128 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,079 good example of some some kids riding in 129 00:04:16,079 --> 00:04:18,560 town. Some of these connect to parks 130 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:21,120 like Hillyard Station Park. um other 131 00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:23,600 other folks are using bike lanes and 132 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:25,520 shoulders of roads to commute to and 133 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:27,680 from work. So you got a lot of different 134 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:31,120 kinds of vehicles moving through and in 135 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:32,800 our community on a lot of different 136 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:35,199 kinds of infrastructure. And then we 137 00:04:35,199 --> 00:04:37,520 think about who's actually riding them 138 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:39,120 and that's a lot of different kinds of 139 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:40,880 people and a lot of different kinds of 140 00:04:40,880 --> 00:04:44,000 sets of circumstances. So, um, I was out 141 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:46,320 actually Saturday. I went from my house 142 00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:48,320 down and just kind of went exploring a 143 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:50,160 little bit and went all the way south 144 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:52,240 and hopped into Columbus on Robert's 145 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:54,720 Road. And so, you've got ballards and 146 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:56,560 really protected lanes out there. But 147 00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:59,199 while I was out, I saw kids on scooters. 148 00:04:59,199 --> 00:05:02,320 I saw family cycling. Um, I saw folks 149 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:04,320 running errands on on these kinds of 150 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:06,720 devices, too. So, there's a lot of 151 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:08,240 different contexts whether it's for 152 00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:10,720 exercise or recreation or trying to get 153 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:13,600 to a place um or kids just out and about 154 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:16,160 in the community that people are using 155 00:05:16,160 --> 00:05:18,240 these vehicles, 156 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:20,080 which is sort of a long-winded way of 157 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:22,960 saying this is a lot of stuff being used 158 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:25,039 throughout the community in a lot of 159 00:05:25,039 --> 00:05:28,000 different ways. And so when we tend to 160 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,320 hear feedback about this issue, we tend 161 00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:32,160 to hear that feedback from a wide 162 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:34,240 variety of angles 163 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:36,240 um about, you know, how people are using 164 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:40,560 it and and then generally what the some 165 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:41,840 questions about what the current rules 166 00:05:41,840 --> 00:05:43,680 and regulations about these vehicles 167 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:45,840 are. So I want to give staff a lot of 168 00:05:45,840 --> 00:05:48,160 credit. Andrea and her team, Lety, Dan, 169 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:50,960 Chief, um, everybody's been kind of 170 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:52,400 knocking their heads together trying to 171 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:55,280 kind of sort of synthesize on some level 172 00:05:55,280 --> 00:05:57,280 what the current rules and regulations 173 00:05:57,280 --> 00:05:59,919 say when it comes to these vehicles and 174 00:05:59,919 --> 00:06:01,280 how they should be used in the 175 00:06:01,280 --> 00:06:04,319 community. And Community Relations built 176 00:06:04,319 --> 00:06:06,160 a little web page, and if folks haven't 177 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:09,120 seen it yet, it's right under the um the 178 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:12,880 big menu under residents, there's ebike 179 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,840 safety down here. Uh but in a nutshell, 180 00:06:15,840 --> 00:06:18,160 the goal of creating this web page was 181 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:20,479 to just sort of outline a snapshot about 182 00:06:20,479 --> 00:06:23,120 currently speaking in our current codes 183 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:24,800 and ordinances and how those intersect 184 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:27,199 with state law today, 185 00:06:27,199 --> 00:06:29,039 what kind of are the rules about how 186 00:06:29,039 --> 00:06:31,759 these can be operated and where. So I 187 00:06:31,759 --> 00:06:33,039 won't go through and read you this 188 00:06:33,039 --> 00:06:34,479 entire web page, but I'll kind of hit 189 00:06:34,479 --> 00:06:35,840 some of the highlights here very 190 00:06:35,840 --> 00:06:38,000 quickly, which is that um there are 191 00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:40,080 multiple sections of our code that 192 00:06:40,080 --> 00:06:42,319 address where and how these vehicles can 193 00:06:42,319 --> 00:06:46,560 be used. One of the most um one one of 194 00:06:46,560 --> 00:06:47,919 the bigger sections I should say is 195 00:06:47,919 --> 00:06:50,000 chapter 373 which involves the traffic 196 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:52,240 code and there's a whole section about 197 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:54,639 ebikes, mopeds, scooters and these kinds 198 00:06:54,639 --> 00:06:56,720 of of vehicles. There are other sections 199 00:06:56,720 --> 00:06:58,800 of our code that talk about specifically 200 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:00,479 with parks and how these things can be 201 00:07:00,479 --> 00:07:03,280 used in parks. But for the time being, I 202 00:07:03,280 --> 00:07:04,639 think it's instructive to just kind of 203 00:07:04,639 --> 00:07:07,039 look at the traffic code pieces of this 204 00:07:07,039 --> 00:07:10,080 and to think about how the traffic code 205 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:12,000 currently defines them. So, we just 206 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:13,919 talked about what a broad spectrum of 207 00:07:13,919 --> 00:07:16,400 vehicles this can include. Um, our 208 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:19,199 definitions tend to focus on ebikes and 209 00:07:19,199 --> 00:07:21,759 then other microobility devices, if you 210 00:07:21,759 --> 00:07:25,039 will. So, we we follow the same 211 00:07:25,039 --> 00:07:26,800 classification structure as the state. 212 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:28,240 So, everything from a class one to a 213 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:32,639 class 3 ebike. um other a a any other 214 00:07:32,639 --> 00:07:35,599 vehicle um is a it is a low-speed 215 00:07:35,599 --> 00:07:37,759 micromobility device if it weighs less 216 00:07:37,759 --> 00:07:40,479 than 100 lb, if it has handlebars, and 217 00:07:40,479 --> 00:07:42,720 if it's propelled uh by a motor or human 218 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:44,479 power. But you'll notice like even in 219 00:07:44,479 --> 00:07:46,319 that definition, the requirement that it 220 00:07:46,319 --> 00:07:48,960 has handlebars sort of excludes some of 221 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:50,479 the vehicles that we've talked about or 222 00:07:50,479 --> 00:07:52,400 that we've seen out in the community. 223 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:53,919 So, I think there are opportunities 224 00:07:53,919 --> 00:07:55,680 coming our way to look at this 225 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:57,680 definition and how we're defining things 226 00:07:57,680 --> 00:07:58,800 that are maybe a little bit more 227 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:00,639 encompassing than what's currently in 228 00:08:00,639 --> 00:08:02,800 the code. 229 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:05,919 As far as where folks can ride, the the 230 00:08:05,919 --> 00:08:08,479 main idea here is that class one and two 231 00:08:08,479 --> 00:08:10,560 ebikes, which if you will are the slower 232 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:13,360 versions, um can go on streets and they 233 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:15,120 can also go on shared use paths. If you 234 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:17,680 go if you have a fast ebike, a class 3 235 00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:20,319 that can go up to 28 miles an hour, you 236 00:08:20,319 --> 00:08:21,759 can keep th you can ride those on 237 00:08:21,759 --> 00:08:24,000 streets and shared use paths, but that's 238 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:25,599 where some of our extra requirements 239 00:08:25,599 --> 00:08:27,199 start to kick in. You're supposed to be 240 00:08:27,199 --> 00:08:29,919 16. You're supposed to wear a helmet um 241 00:08:29,919 --> 00:08:33,120 because the bike can do more. 242 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:35,440 You um are currently allowed to ride on 243 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:38,000 sidewalks if your motor is not engaged. 244 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:41,360 And um and as far as that you excuse me 245 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:43,760 as far as the other regulations here go 246 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,800 um the generally speaking ebikes, 247 00:08:46,800 --> 00:08:49,600 scooters, motorized vehicles are 248 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:52,080 prohibited in parks including Hillary 249 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:53,600 Hillyard Station Park and first 250 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:56,399 responders park um unless you are in a 251 00:08:56,399 --> 00:08:58,320 bike lane. So if you're in HSP, you're 252 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:00,000 supposed to basically stay in that bike 253 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,120 lane as you're progressing through. 254 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:04,480 Again, the only age and helmet 255 00:09:04,480 --> 00:09:05,839 requirement that we have right now to 256 00:09:05,839 --> 00:09:08,640 speak of is being 16 to operate a class 257 00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:11,040 3 ebike and that you have to wear a 258 00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:13,200 helmet. But I will say that throughout 259 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,040 this code, if you go through and look at 260 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:19,040 it, there are all sorts of reminders 261 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:21,120 candidly throughout the code that riders 262 00:09:21,120 --> 00:09:22,800 have responsibilities as well. So, 263 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:24,000 you're allowed to take these vehicles 264 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:25,200 out onto certain kinds of 265 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:26,640 infrastructure, but you're supposed to 266 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:28,640 be yielding to pedestrians. You're not 267 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,040 supposed to be riding dangerously. So, 268 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:33,680 at night, um, you know, or like trying 269 00:09:33,680 --> 00:09:35,680 to get too close to people, u, you're 270 00:09:35,680 --> 00:09:37,440 supposed to yield to pedestrians, those 271 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:39,120 sorts of things. If you're riding 272 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:41,440 recklessly or unsafeely, the code 273 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:44,080 already provides that we can stop you, 274 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:46,160 intervene, have a conversation, and talk 275 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:47,519 about how you may be violating the 276 00:09:47,519 --> 00:09:49,680 current code. 277 00:09:49,680 --> 00:09:51,839 Um, 278 00:09:51,839 --> 00:09:53,600 so one of the things that we have done 279 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:55,920 to try to remind folks about what the 280 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:59,200 current rules are is to replace some of 281 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:01,360 the signs out at at Hillyard Station 282 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,120 Park. And here's a good example of a of 283 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:04,720 a snapshot of one of those signs that 284 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:06,560 was replaced. 285 00:10:06,560 --> 00:10:09,279 Um, we have taken some other steps that 286 00:10:09,279 --> 00:10:10,640 I'll get to here in just a couple of 287 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:13,279 minutes. But the main idea is we're 288 00:10:13,279 --> 00:10:14,560 trying to create an awareness, 289 00:10:14,560 --> 00:10:16,240 especially at Hillyard Station Park and 290 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:18,800 at first responders, that splash pads, 291 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:21,279 for example, are not the intended 292 00:10:21,279 --> 00:10:24,959 infrastructure for scooters. Um, trying 293 00:10:24,959 --> 00:10:26,720 to create those spaces where pedestrians 294 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:29,040 can congregate and feel safe in those 295 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:31,440 areas without having people buzz 296 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:33,839 through, buzz by, or otherwise create 297 00:10:33,839 --> 00:10:37,190 disturbances. 298 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:38,800 So, I'm going to come back to this web 299 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:41,760 page here in just a second, but this uh 300 00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:43,200 we have some feedback here that we'll 301 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:45,360 get to, but I think the main idea is 302 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:47,920 that reflecting on sort of what that 303 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,160 current code says today, I think it 304 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:53,040 captures pieces of what vehicles are out 305 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:54,800 there and where they can ride, but it's 306 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:58,160 not necessarily as encompassing as maybe 307 00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:00,720 um it could be, especially given where 308 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:02,560 the market's going and how many of these 309 00:11:02,560 --> 00:11:05,200 vehicles come and go for sale on the 310 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:09,190 internet and everything else. 311 00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:12,399 Give me one second here. All right. When 312 00:11:12,399 --> 00:11:14,640 we think about who's using these and 313 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:19,519 where and in what context, anecdotally, 314 00:11:19,519 --> 00:11:21,920 um I will I would submit that a lot of 315 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:24,000 the feedback that we get about improper 316 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:26,800 usage tends to be on in the younger 317 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:29,680 crowd. in the crowd that's out kind of 318 00:11:29,680 --> 00:11:31,360 out of the house, you know, especially 319 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:33,600 now that it's summertime. Um, they're 320 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:35,040 out visiting the parks. They're doing 321 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:36,959 other things. They're using this, yes, 322 00:11:36,959 --> 00:11:39,120 to get from point A to point B. But a 323 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:41,040 lot of the behaviors that I that we have 324 00:11:41,040 --> 00:11:42,560 heard about or I should say I've heard 325 00:11:42,560 --> 00:11:44,880 about have tended to involve, you know, 326 00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:46,640 somebody younger than 18 who's just 327 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:48,240 getting too close to infants and 328 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:51,440 toddlers on splash pads. Um, or who is 329 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:53,120 who's maybe not paying as much attention 330 00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:54,959 as they should on a sidewalk and getting 331 00:11:54,959 --> 00:11:56,320 too close to somebody who's coming out 332 00:11:56,320 --> 00:11:59,279 of a business. those sorts of things. I 333 00:11:59,279 --> 00:12:01,279 don't know that the issue has been with 334 00:12:01,279 --> 00:12:05,200 commuters as much or with uh folks out 335 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:06,880 uh you know wearing the Lycra trying to 336 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:09,600 bust out miles on a on a weekend ride. 337 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:13,839 Um certainly you know um interactions 338 00:12:13,839 --> 00:12:15,680 happen between all of these groups and 339 00:12:15,680 --> 00:12:17,760 pedestrians and other users of trails 340 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:20,480 and the roadway. Um, but anecdotally, 341 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:21,839 most of the feedback I think that we've 342 00:12:21,839 --> 00:12:23,519 gotten in the last since I've been here 343 00:12:23,519 --> 00:12:25,279 the last couple of months has been about 344 00:12:25,279 --> 00:12:27,040 the kids. 345 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:29,920 So, what do we do about that? First 346 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:31,600 thing is we replaced all the signs in 347 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:34,800 Hillary Station Park. As I said, um, the 348 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:37,839 police department has two SRO's who have 349 00:12:37,839 --> 00:12:39,440 been on bike patrols all summer long, 350 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:41,360 and we've had a concerted effort of 351 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:44,720 trying to engage with the kids out on 352 00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:47,360 these devices as we've seen them. Uh, I 353 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:49,279 want to give Rita's a shout out because 354 00:12:49,279 --> 00:12:51,600 they gave us several hundred coupons. It 355 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:55,680 was 500 plus um that we meaning the 356 00:12:55,680 --> 00:12:58,240 police department and some staff in R&P 357 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:01,519 have proactively passed out to kids on 358 00:13:01,519 --> 00:13:03,680 these devices who've demonstrated good 359 00:13:03,680 --> 00:13:05,920 responsible behavior. We've passed out 360 00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:08,720 all the coupons that we were given. So, 361 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:10,560 we've done quite a lot of engagement on 362 00:13:10,560 --> 00:13:12,399 the on the carrot end of things just to 363 00:13:12,399 --> 00:13:15,920 try to visit, remind, educate um what 364 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:18,079 good writership looks like and how to 365 00:13:18,079 --> 00:13:20,000 operate on this infrastructure in a way 366 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:21,519 that's responsible and doesn't make 367 00:13:21,519 --> 00:13:24,320 people feel uneasy. 368 00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:26,240 At the same time, one of the ordinances 369 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:27,680 that will come before you this evening 370 00:13:27,680 --> 00:13:30,240 for a first reading uh involves some 371 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:32,000 very straightforward changes that we 372 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,760 could make to the code to chapter 373 373 00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:39,839 that I think are a first cut at um at 374 00:13:39,839 --> 00:13:41,519 trying to get ahead of this issue in a 375 00:13:41,519 --> 00:13:43,279 way that will let us be more proactive 376 00:13:43,279 --> 00:13:45,760 in the future. Uh so, for example, one 377 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:47,920 of the one of the uh provisions of this 378 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:50,000 ordinance would require helmets for any 379 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:52,399 rider who's under 18 regardless of any 380 00:13:52,399 --> 00:13:54,480 vehicle that they're on. So if an 381 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:56,880 officer or somebody in at R&P who's out 382 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:59,519 working downtown sees a kid without a 383 00:13:59,519 --> 00:14:01,519 helmet, that creates a backing in the 384 00:14:01,519 --> 00:14:02,959 code for them to have a conversation to 385 00:14:02,959 --> 00:14:04,880 say, "Hey, it is a code requirement that 386 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:06,079 you need to be wearing something if 387 00:14:06,079 --> 00:14:08,240 you're clear if they're a minor." The 388 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:10,399 second thing the ordinance would do is 389 00:14:10,399 --> 00:14:13,120 clarify that parents are responsible um 390 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:14,800 at the end of the day for the actions of 391 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:16,399 their minor children. So, the ordinance 392 00:14:16,399 --> 00:14:19,040 would prohibit a parent from recklessly 393 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:22,079 um in enabling their child to go out um 394 00:14:22,079 --> 00:14:23,839 and operate one of these vehicles in a 395 00:14:23,839 --> 00:14:26,480 way that endangers somebody. And the 396 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:28,240 third thing is it would create the 397 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:29,760 ability for the police department to 398 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:31,680 impound these vehicles if they're being 399 00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:33,600 operated in a reckless manner. And what 400 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:35,680 that would look like potentially is 401 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:37,760 let's say a child maybe is warned or 402 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,399 something and they continue to misbehave 403 00:14:40,399 --> 00:14:42,000 on the device. The police department 404 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:43,680 could take it and hold that until a 405 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:45,440 parent or guardian came to come pick it 406 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:48,160 up. All of these changes I think are 407 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:51,279 geared really at a at a broader issue 408 00:14:51,279 --> 00:14:53,440 which is starting a conversation in the 409 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:55,279 community not just about what our code 410 00:14:55,279 --> 00:14:58,399 says but what about our expectations are 411 00:14:58,399 --> 00:15:01,440 as a community of each other. So to the 412 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:03,839 extent that yes, there's an enforcement 413 00:15:03,839 --> 00:15:05,920 element here, there's an there's a piece 414 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:09,360 of this that might require um police 415 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:11,120 officers or R&P staff to have 416 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:12,880 conversations. That's important. And 417 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:14,160 it's important that we have the backing 418 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:16,560 in the code to do that. But I also think 419 00:15:16,560 --> 00:15:18,639 it's important to equip our parents and 420 00:15:18,639 --> 00:15:21,040 to equip the schools and even the kids 421 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:23,519 that are out operating these vehicles 422 00:15:23,519 --> 00:15:25,440 with something that just demonstrates 423 00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:27,360 what our understanding about responsible 424 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:29,600 wrership looks like in this community. 425 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:31,680 Um, and that we're going to we we 426 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:33,360 believe that these things are important 427 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:35,360 and have codified them in the code as a 428 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:37,040 way of saying here's here's a base 429 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:38,880 expectation 430 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:40,399 candidly in a way that we do kind of for 431 00:15:40,399 --> 00:15:42,399 drivers as well. You know, we we 432 00:15:42,399 --> 00:15:44,399 establish speed limits. We all agree 433 00:15:44,399 --> 00:15:46,560 we're going to adhere to those. Um, does 434 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:48,959 everybody all the time? Absolutely not. 435 00:15:48,959 --> 00:15:51,279 But the point is we've agreed that in 436 00:15:51,279 --> 00:15:52,639 general these are the principles by 437 00:15:52,639 --> 00:15:58,389 which we're going to drive our cars. 438 00:15:58,399 --> 00:16:01,839 So what's coming next I think is the the 439 00:16:01,839 --> 00:16:03,600 ordinance that before you is that is 440 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:05,920 before you this evening later on is sort 441 00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:07,920 of the first blush at things that I 442 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:10,079 think we could do relatively quickly. We 443 00:16:10,079 --> 00:16:12,000 could get to a second reading then in uh 444 00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:14,480 late August get that on the books and 445 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:17,040 then start to do messaging and education 446 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:19,519 from there. I do think there's a bigger 447 00:16:19,519 --> 00:16:21,201 conversation here when we zoom 448 00:16:21,201 --> 00:16:23,360 [clears throat] out and think about sort 449 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:25,440 of the problem in general, if you will, 450 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:27,120 which is that there's a piece of this 451 00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:29,360 that involves how are we defining these 452 00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:32,560 vehicles in the first place. Um, is it 453 00:16:32,560 --> 00:16:34,480 and and I think some of this really 454 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:36,720 depends on trying to get a sense from 455 00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:38,240 the community about what feels 456 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:39,759 intuitive. 457 00:16:39,759 --> 00:16:42,560 Uh, because I don't know, I'm speaking 458 00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:44,320 only for myself. I don't know that 459 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:45,680 there's much of a difference between a 460 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:48,079 set of rollerblades and a skateboard, 461 00:16:48,079 --> 00:16:50,720 you know, or or a scooter necessarily. 462 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:53,440 Um, maybe an e scooter that can go a 463 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:56,079 little bit faster is is something else. 464 00:16:56,079 --> 00:16:58,639 But where I'm going with that is 465 00:16:58,639 --> 00:17:01,360 depending on how folks intuitit this and 466 00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:03,920 think about it. Um, we should try to 467 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:06,400 modulate the code so that it meets 468 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:09,520 people uh where they where they are in 469 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:10,799 terms of how we're thinking about this. 470 00:17:10,799 --> 00:17:12,400 In other words, does it make sense to 471 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:14,559 make distinctions for every one of those 472 00:17:14,559 --> 00:17:17,600 categories in the code if folks by and 473 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:19,199 large think of all these things as one 474 00:17:19,199 --> 00:17:22,319 big bucket of vehicles regardless of the 475 00:17:22,319 --> 00:17:24,720 flavor if you will. So how we define 476 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:28,079 micro micromobility devices is one 477 00:17:28,079 --> 00:17:30,400 thing. The second thing is to think 478 00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:33,679 about where these devices are being 479 00:17:33,679 --> 00:17:35,760 operated and to get some feedback, I 480 00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:38,320 think, from the public about what the 481 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:41,440 expectation is or ought to be. Um, in 482 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:44,240 other words, if it makes more sense to 483 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:46,640 to permit some kinds of vehicles to go 484 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:48,720 in some places but not others, for 485 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:52,160 example. Um, I don't know that, you 486 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:54,320 know, permitting, just as a parent, I 487 00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:56,720 wouldn't want my kid taking an e-cooter 488 00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:00,000 on a an unpaved, very narrow nature 489 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,080 trail. You know, it makes more sense to 490 00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:04,080 keep it on maybe a sidewalk or a shared 491 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:06,640 use path. Um, but there are maybe 492 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:08,720 certain kinds of infrastructure that 493 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:10,640 it's more important to prioritize 494 00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:12,160 pedestrians, for example, or something 495 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:14,480 like that. So thinking about that and 496 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:16,880 also trying to balance that against I 497 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:18,880 think the reality that we have a very 498 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:21,440 strong network of different kinds of 499 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:23,679 infrastructure that people are using to 500 00:18:23,679 --> 00:18:26,640 commute to shop to go do recreational 501 00:18:26,640 --> 00:18:28,960 things. And so we want to weigh these 502 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,760 things effectively where we're enabling 503 00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:34,720 people to go do that to save car trips 504 00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:36,160 um you know to be healthy when they're 505 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:37,679 out and about and and doing their 506 00:18:37,679 --> 00:18:39,520 business but also accommodating 507 00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:41,600 different kinds of vehicles that may go 508 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:43,919 across that infrastructure. The third 509 00:18:43,919 --> 00:18:47,039 thing is what speed, operation limits, 510 00:18:47,039 --> 00:18:49,120 or what reckless behavior, if you will, 511 00:18:49,120 --> 00:18:52,160 might look like. And to try to gain a 512 00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:55,360 sense of that in order to help to help 513 00:18:55,360 --> 00:18:57,679 bake that into the code as well, so that 514 00:18:57,679 --> 00:19:00,320 we're giving, I think, everybody in the 515 00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:03,679 community if a sense of what what 516 00:19:03,679 --> 00:19:06,400 recklessness is, what too fast is on a 517 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:08,559 sidewalk versus a shared use path or a 518 00:19:08,559 --> 00:19:11,200 road. Um, and really to gather that 519 00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:13,280 feedback from as many different kinds of 520 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:16,400 groups as we can. So, we, you know, we 521 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:18,640 have a list of HOAs, for example, that 522 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:21,200 we can do some outreach to. Um, I had 523 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:23,039 the good fortune of meeting, I think 524 00:19:23,039 --> 00:19:26,080 it's, um, it might be Bill with the 525 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,080 cycle shop that's moving into downtown 526 00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:30,080 Hillyard. Um, and had a great 527 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:31,440 conversation with him when I first 528 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:33,120 started a couple months ago about this. 529 00:19:33,120 --> 00:19:35,600 So trying to get feedback from those 530 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:37,919 stakeholders is important as well as our 531 00:19:37,919 --> 00:19:40,080 boards and commissions. So at last 532 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:42,160 month's ESC meeting had a great 533 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:44,400 conversation with the team there about 534 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:46,320 this very issue and balancing the 535 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:48,640 sustainability elements of this with the 536 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:50,480 safety and and other concerns that 537 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:52,720 people have. Um ARPAC or any of the 538 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:54,720 other groups that we have trying to ga 539 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:56,720 gauge those that feedback and those 540 00:19:56,720 --> 00:19:58,480 perceptions I think helps round out the 541 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:00,320 conversation. 542 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:02,400 online feedback is important and I'll 543 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:05,520 come back to this page briefly. Um 544 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:07,919 Andrea graciously built in we'll call it 545 00:20:07,919 --> 00:20:09,840 an informal survey. So there are some 546 00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:12,080 comment boxes and these are live right 547 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:14,400 now so folks can go out and share some 548 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:17,039 thoughts about these exact questions. Uh 549 00:20:17,039 --> 00:20:19,120 what how should we be defining micro 550 00:20:19,120 --> 00:20:21,440 mobility devices? Are there any kinds of 551 00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:23,039 vehicles we should be excluding? Are 552 00:20:23,039 --> 00:20:24,880 there places these vehicles should never 553 00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:28,000 go? uh what speed limits or behavior are 554 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:29,440 appropriate based on the kinds of 555 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:31,840 infrastructure. And we can ask these 556 00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:34,320 sorts of questions um of course to folks 557 00:20:34,320 --> 00:20:36,640 that fill out this form online, but also 558 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:38,320 to all these other groups and 559 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:39,919 potentially even do some sort of an 560 00:20:39,919 --> 00:20:42,320 in-house uh we could do an event at the 561 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:44,000 well or a world cafe or something like 562 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:45,679 that where we have an evening where 563 00:20:45,679 --> 00:20:47,039 people can come out, give their thoughts 564 00:20:47,039 --> 00:20:48,480 and opinions and gather all this 565 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:50,640 feedback together. 566 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:52,400 I think the idea then would be to take 567 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,320 some of that and to really analyze it 568 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:56,159 and step back and look at it and see 569 00:20:56,159 --> 00:20:59,280 what key themes come out of that. Um, 570 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:01,919 and to then take that feedback and to 571 00:21:01,919 --> 00:21:04,320 start to tee up other suggested code 572 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:06,159 changes that the community might want to 573 00:21:06,159 --> 00:21:07,679 see. 574 00:21:07,679 --> 00:21:09,919 Uh, so that could mean more detailed 575 00:21:09,919 --> 00:21:12,000 code updates. maybe an update that 576 00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:14,000 actually goes ahead and redefineses 577 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:16,159 microobility across all of our code 578 00:21:16,159 --> 00:21:18,559 sections and seeks to unify the traffic 579 00:21:18,559 --> 00:21:20,320 pieces with the parks pieces and 580 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:22,559 everything else. The other thing I think 581 00:21:22,559 --> 00:21:25,280 we we are intending to look at through 582 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:27,600 this conversational lens is how we 583 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:29,840 operate our own special events. So, I 584 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:32,799 was at uh celebration last week. It was 585 00:21:32,799 --> 00:21:34,559 very crowded because we had a Taylor 586 00:21:34,559 --> 00:21:36,799 Swift cover band. They did an excellent 587 00:21:36,799 --> 00:21:39,280 job. Um, but there were kids there on 588 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:41,039 scooters and a couple of times I didn't 589 00:21:41,039 --> 00:21:43,280 see anybody do anything that in my own 590 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:44,640 view I thought was too reckless, but 591 00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:46,320 they were kind of zipping in between 592 00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:49,440 pedestrians every now and then. And I 593 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:51,440 think that creates questions like should 594 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:53,440 we develop rules that say something like 595 00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:55,520 when the city is sponsoring an event at 596 00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:57,360 Hillyard Station Park, you have to walk 597 00:21:57,360 --> 00:21:59,360 a device through the park just during 598 00:21:59,360 --> 00:22:02,159 that event window. Or maybe we require 599 00:22:02,159 --> 00:22:04,240 things like a corral. So you have to 600 00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:07,120 park the device at a designated area. 601 00:22:07,120 --> 00:22:08,720 It's like checking your luggage. You get 602 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:10,640 a tag, you can come pick it up later. 603 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:12,000 Those kinds of things are things we 604 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:13,760 could think about. 605 00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:15,919 We also take that feedback then and and 606 00:22:15,919 --> 00:22:18,080 design or develop some educational 607 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:20,159 outreach materials that we can use to 608 00:22:20,159 --> 00:22:21,679 round out how we're talking about it 609 00:22:21,679 --> 00:22:23,840 online, but also to engage the schools 610 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:25,679 and our other partners in the community, 611 00:22:25,679 --> 00:22:28,240 other businesses um just to help get the 612 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:31,600 messaging out about uh what the what the 613 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:34,480 evolution of rules might look like uh in 614 00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:36,000 terms of where these things can go and 615 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:40,630 how they should be operated. 616 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:42,880 At the end of the day, I think the goal 617 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:44,880 is to get to a place where we've had 618 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:46,640 this conversation across all these 619 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,039 different dimensions. And we've looked 620 00:22:49,039 --> 00:22:50,640 at that feedback and come up with 621 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,280 something that's more well defined in 622 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:55,120 terms of what the community expectation 623 00:22:55,120 --> 00:22:56,720 is about what these things are and how 624 00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:58,799 they should be used. We can bake those 625 00:22:58,799 --> 00:23:01,360 changes into our ordinances, into our 626 00:23:01,360 --> 00:23:04,080 codes. Um, and that allows us then to 627 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:06,080 clarify the messaging and the education 628 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:10,159 pieces about what is legal, what is not, 629 00:23:10,159 --> 00:23:12,159 what the enforcement expectations are, 630 00:23:12,159 --> 00:23:13,919 what we can reasonably accomplish in 631 00:23:13,919 --> 00:23:15,919 terms of enforcement. 632 00:23:15,919 --> 00:23:18,159 And then I can also take that, we as 633 00:23:18,159 --> 00:23:20,159 staff can take that and carry that 634 00:23:20,159 --> 00:23:22,320 forward uh, in terms of our 635 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:23,919 conversations with other regions and 636 00:23:23,919 --> 00:23:26,240 with the state. Later this week on 637 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,080 Thursday, the Dayton region is meeting. 638 00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:29,840 a lot of the cities and city managers 639 00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:32,159 over there are gathering together to 640 00:23:32,159 --> 00:23:34,480 come up with um they're having a 641 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,240 basically a series of short meetings to 642 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:39,120 develop a model ordinance if you will 643 00:23:39,120 --> 00:23:42,000 for how ebikes, emotos and vehicles like 644 00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:45,039 this can be regulated. Um I'm not sure 645 00:23:45,039 --> 00:23:46,240 I'll be interested to see where that 646 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:48,480 goes because everybody's codes are so 647 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:49,840 different. I don't know that one 648 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:51,600 ordinance is going to capture all of 649 00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:53,280 this in every community. But I think a 650 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:55,120 set of principles about how we talk 651 00:23:55,120 --> 00:23:57,200 about it, how we define it, how we 652 00:23:57,200 --> 00:23:58,880 communicate it is something that's 653 00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:01,760 really relevant. So I intend to take the 654 00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:03,760 outcome of this conversation and stay 655 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,159 plugged into that one. And then we can 656 00:24:06,159 --> 00:24:09,200 carry the common themes of all of that 657 00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:11,520 forward over to the state house. So, 658 00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:13,679 there is a bill that was introduced um 659 00:24:13,679 --> 00:24:16,080 this session, HB948, 660 00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:19,200 which as currently drafted would require 661 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,520 basically almost a driver's ed or some 662 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:23,760 education that would have to be 663 00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:25,760 performed in order to ride some of these 664 00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,640 vehicles. And it would also task ODOT 665 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:30,480 with creating a task force to look at 666 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:32,240 additional statewide regulations that 667 00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:34,400 might make sense. But I think there are 668 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,240 other things that we could potentially 669 00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:39,120 advocate for or with other regions 670 00:24:39,120 --> 00:24:41,039 suggest to the legislature that might be 671 00:24:41,039 --> 00:24:44,080 helpful. So a statewide education 672 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:46,159 requirement I think certainly has uh 673 00:24:46,159 --> 00:24:49,679 some legs. It would be difficult if we 674 00:24:49,679 --> 00:24:51,440 had one set of education standards and 675 00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:53,600 Upper Arlington had another and Dublin 676 00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:55,600 had a third set and Gehana didn't 677 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,320 require any at all. And then as a parent 678 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:00,240 I would be really confused as to what 679 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:02,640 I'm supposed to do. Um, the other thing 680 00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:04,400 the state could help with, candidly, is 681 00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:06,640 sales and what vehicles are even allowed 682 00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,039 to be sold in the state of Ohio. Uh, 683 00:25:09,039 --> 00:25:10,400 because some are being sold right now 684 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:12,799 that are not defined at all in our in 685 00:25:12,799 --> 00:25:15,600 our code or in the state code. Uh and 686 00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:16,880 then the third piece of course would be 687 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:18,880 a licensing registration piece 688 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,760 potentially where um if especially if if 689 00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:25,279 ODOT is looking at how to register these 690 00:25:25,279 --> 00:25:27,360 vehicles or require some type of license 691 00:25:27,360 --> 00:25:29,840 especially if they can go really fast u 692 00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:31,039 that would provide a level of 693 00:25:31,039 --> 00:25:34,159 consistency statewide that would be I 694 00:25:34,159 --> 00:25:35,679 think more efficient more effective than 695 00:25:35,679 --> 00:25:38,559 we could be on our own as well. 696 00:25:38,559 --> 00:25:41,039 So to boil all that down, I think that 697 00:25:41,039 --> 00:25:42,799 when we look at the forest of vehicles 698 00:25:42,799 --> 00:25:44,960 that's out there and how we try to get 699 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:47,520 ahead of this issue, uh what's before 700 00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:49,440 you this evening is sort of the first 701 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:51,679 bite at that apple and trying at least 702 00:25:51,679 --> 00:25:54,320 to get a a bit more clarity about safety 703 00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,640 standards, the parental role in some of 704 00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:58,720 this, and then our ability to impound 705 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:01,120 these vehicles um if they're really 706 00:26:01,120 --> 00:26:04,000 being misused. And then I think what's 707 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:06,000 coming over the coming weeks and months 708 00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:07,520 is really a conversation with our 709 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:09,120 community that crosses all those other 710 00:26:09,120 --> 00:26:11,919 dimensions and that we will take that 711 00:26:11,919 --> 00:26:14,720 feedback in, distill it down and then 712 00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:16,799 bring you a set of recommended changes 713 00:26:16,799 --> 00:26:20,080 to our codes um and keep that 714 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:21,840 conversation going as far as what that 715 00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:25,120 looks like both here across you know the 716 00:26:25,120 --> 00:26:27,360 western and central regions of Ohio and 717 00:26:27,360 --> 00:26:29,200 then out at the state legislature as 718 00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:30,480 well. 719 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,400 So, I know I've just talked non-stop for 720 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:34,960 like 25 minutes. [laughter] 721 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,520 Um, but I am certainly happy to answer 722 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,760 any questions that you have. I think the 723 00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:41,600 feedback question for you all from staff 724 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,919 this evening would be, um, does that 725 00:26:43,919 --> 00:26:46,400 plan make sense in your view? Would you 726 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:48,640 prefer a different kind of an approach? 727 00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:50,960 Um, or are there elements of this that 728 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:52,640 you want us to pay particular attention 729 00:26:52,640 --> 00:27:03,269 to as the process unfolds? 730 00:27:03,279 --> 00:27:05,760 Um, I I like the plan. Um, you know, the 731 00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:07,520 the community feedback, just getting 732 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,960 folks together to try to um distill 733 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:13,919 everything before we actually apply some 734 00:27:13,919 --> 00:27:15,600 additional rules. I I do like that a 735 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:17,360 lot. Um, I do have a couple questions 736 00:27:17,360 --> 00:27:20,799 though. Um, in the in the in the slide 737 00:27:20,799 --> 00:27:23,440 set here, it said it seems to indicate 738 00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:25,840 that 739 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:29,360 it says class one and two may be 740 00:27:29,360 --> 00:27:31,679 operated on streets 741 00:27:31,679 --> 00:27:33,840 except for the freeway and shared use 742 00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,720 paths. I'm I'm assuming that also that 743 00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:39,360 includes the the scooters, class one and 744 00:27:39,360 --> 00:27:43,760 two. Um, are are they allowed on the 745 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,960 sidewalks? Um, you know, and it's it's 746 00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:48,960 something about ebike ebikes may be 747 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:51,279 operated on sidewalks 748 00:27:51,279 --> 00:27:53,039 when 749 00:27:53,039 --> 00:27:55,679 uh using pedal power only, right? And 750 00:27:55,679 --> 00:27:57,200 that makes sense because that that's 751 00:27:57,200 --> 00:27:58,960 part of the problem. you've got folks, 752 00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,360 you know, zipping down um the main 753 00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:04,240 street sidewalks where, you know, I 754 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,000 happen to know someone who's a barber in 755 00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:07,120 the barber shop there. And he said 756 00:28:07,120 --> 00:28:08,799 there's so many times people almost get 757 00:28:08,799 --> 00:28:11,279 hit as they're opening the door and kid 758 00:28:11,279 --> 00:28:13,039 whether it's one of those motorcycle 759 00:28:13,039 --> 00:28:14,640 looking ones or even just a scooter 760 00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:16,799 that's zipping along at 20 or more miles 761 00:28:16,799 --> 00:28:19,120 per hour, almost hits an elderly 762 00:28:19,120 --> 00:28:20,559 gentleman, you know, who just got his 763 00:28:20,559 --> 00:28:21,200 haircut, 764 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:23,750 >> right? Um, 765 00:28:23,750 --> 00:28:23,760 » right? Um, 766 00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:26,000 so the the ebikes are supposed to be 767 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,159 pedled if they're on the sidewalk, as I 768 00:28:28,159 --> 00:28:30,320 understand it. What about the scooters? 769 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:31,919 I mean, because I I'll tell you what, I 770 00:28:31,919 --> 00:28:33,520 I I happen to live on Heather Ridge 771 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:35,600 Drive where there's one of those u the 772 00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:37,440 speed monitoring devices that tells you 773 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:39,919 what your speed is. And I just c saw a 774 00:28:39,919 --> 00:28:42,000 kid that just is zipping down the middle 775 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:45,039 of the road, you know, actually behind a 776 00:28:45,039 --> 00:28:49,039 vehicle. And it uh it u it said that he 777 00:28:49,039 --> 00:28:54,080 was going 25 miles an hour. Um so what 778 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:55,679 what do they do? I I don't know if you 779 00:28:55,679 --> 00:28:57,919 can just push those along like a regular 780 00:28:57,919 --> 00:29:00,399 scooter or 781 00:29:00,399 --> 00:29:02,149 >> Yeah, I think some of them you don't 782 00:29:02,149 --> 00:29:02,159 » Yeah, I think some of them you don't 783 00:29:02,159 --> 00:29:03,679 have to power them at all with your 784 00:29:03,679 --> 00:29:05,520 feet. You can either twist the handle or 785 00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:07,440 there's a button that'll just make I 786 00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:09,120 mean it'll it'll shut off. 787 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:10,149 >> Um but 788 00:29:10,149 --> 00:29:10,159 » Um but 789 00:29:10,159 --> 00:29:12,230 >> if they're on the sidewalk, is that too 790 00:29:12,230 --> 00:29:12,240 » if they're on the sidewalk, is that too 791 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:13,840 fast for a sidewalk? because you've got 792 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:15,120 little kids, you know, I happen to have 793 00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:17,200 grandkids who ride their bikes on the 794 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,039 sidewalk, five years old, and and there 795 00:29:19,039 --> 00:29:20,640 have been many, many occasions where 796 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:22,240 these kids have just zipped right around 797 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:23,520 them and 798 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:25,430 >> uh kind of scared of them. 799 00:29:25,430 --> 00:29:25,440 » uh kind of scared of them. 800 00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:26,630 >> Yeah, I think that's I think your 801 00:29:26,630 --> 00:29:26,640 » Yeah, I think that's I think your 802 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:28,399 point's well taken. And those things are 803 00:29:28,399 --> 00:29:31,679 heavy, too. Um and so you we've got a 804 00:29:31,679 --> 00:29:33,360 situation where people can take vehicles 805 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:35,760 that have some weight to them and and 806 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:37,279 especially on a sidewalk, which is 807 00:29:37,279 --> 00:29:40,399 narrower. Um there's less room less room 808 00:29:40,399 --> 00:29:43,039 to maneuver, right? Um, one of the 809 00:29:43,039 --> 00:29:44,480 things I think though too as well to 810 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:46,720 build on that point is that, you know, 811 00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:48,480 even if I'm riding a pedal powered bike 812 00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:51,840 that has no motor on it, if I'm if I'm 813 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,240 careening down a sidewalk at 20 25 miles 814 00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,039 an hour, I can do a lot of damage, too. 815 00:29:57,039 --> 00:30:00,080 you know, it's in in terms of the some 816 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,039 of this I think boils down also to how 817 00:30:03,039 --> 00:30:06,799 fast to your point and where um because 818 00:30:06,799 --> 00:30:08,799 if folks are writing them in a way that 819 00:30:08,799 --> 00:30:12,320 is reckless um or too quick based on the 820 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:14,640 design of either the sidewalk or the 821 00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:16,320 path, that's really where these 822 00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:18,320 opportunities to have really bad 823 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:20,240 accidents kind of come into play. I 824 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:21,440 would say the difference though between 825 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,360 the the pedal powered regular just 826 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:27,279 regular bike and these bikes is that 827 00:30:27,279 --> 00:30:29,029 >> it requires some effort 828 00:30:29,029 --> 00:30:29,039 » it requires some effort 829 00:30:29,039 --> 00:30:29,430 >> Yeah. 830 00:30:29,430 --> 00:30:29,440 » Yeah. 831 00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:31,350 >> to go 20 miles an hour on a bike. 832 00:30:31,350 --> 00:30:31,360 » to go 20 miles an hour on a bike. 833 00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:31,909 >> That's fair. 834 00:30:31,909 --> 00:30:31,919 » That's fair. 835 00:30:31,919 --> 00:30:34,230 >> But these, you know, I my wife and I 836 00:30:34,230 --> 00:30:34,240 » But these, you know, I my wife and I 837 00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,480 were were actually riding down the 838 00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:38,799 sidewalk, you know, just pedaling along, 839 00:30:38,799 --> 00:30:40,640 probably doing about six or eight miles 840 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:43,840 an hour. And this a young young kid 841 00:30:43,840 --> 00:30:46,080 about 12 years old said asked if he 842 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:47,760 could pass. He was on a one of these 843 00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:50,159 scooters. He passed us and I'm telling 844 00:30:50,159 --> 00:30:53,279 you within 10 seconds he was 100 yards 845 00:30:53,279 --> 00:30:54,320 ahead of us 846 00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:56,630 >> just I mean he was he was polite and 847 00:30:56,630 --> 00:30:56,640 » just I mean he was he was polite and 848 00:30:56,640 --> 00:30:57,919 everything like that but they they can 849 00:30:57,919 --> 00:31:00,640 go really fast and it requires really no 850 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:01,520 effort 851 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:02,389 >> to do that 852 00:31:02,389 --> 00:31:02,399 » to do that 853 00:31:02,399 --> 00:31:04,710 >> right 854 00:31:04,710 --> 00:31:04,720 » right 855 00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:06,389 >> no that's a fair point and I think that 856 00:31:06,389 --> 00:31:06,399 » no that's a fair point and I think that 857 00:31:06,399 --> 00:31:08,320 that is something that we I would look 858 00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:10,320 at least to get some feedback on part of 859 00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:13,120 the enforcement challenge becomes as the 860 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:15,360 as the motors get smaller 861 00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:17,830 >> and they get you know kind of woven into 862 00:31:17,830 --> 00:31:17,840 » and they get you know kind of woven into 863 00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:19,919 the chassis of the device, it becomes 864 00:31:19,919 --> 00:31:21,600 more and more and more difficult for 865 00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,679 somebody, for an officer, whoever else 866 00:31:23,679 --> 00:31:26,399 to even know whether it's whether it's 867 00:31:26,399 --> 00:31:29,200 motorized at a glance. Um, and so that's 868 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,760 where I think it's the multi-dimension 869 00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:33,760 part of this comes into play. There's a 870 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,080 piece of this that probably does 871 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:38,399 probably does rely on is it motorized or 872 00:31:38,399 --> 00:31:40,799 is it not? Um, there's also a piece of 873 00:31:40,799 --> 00:31:42,960 it that's just in terms of educating 874 00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:44,320 kids about how much damage they can do 875 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:46,640 if they are going too fast. Um, that 876 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:48,000 speaks to this too. So 877 00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:49,669 >> yeah, it it is a conundrum. There there 878 00:31:49,669 --> 00:31:49,679 » yeah, it it is a conundrum. There there 879 00:31:49,679 --> 00:31:52,480 are a lot of strange moving parts to 880 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:53,919 this one. It's going to be difficult for 881 00:31:53,919 --> 00:31:56,880 us to to to tackle and but I appreciate 882 00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:58,799 your work and the work of all all the 883 00:31:58,799 --> 00:32:01,440 staff uh for taking it on. 884 00:32:01,440 --> 00:32:04,070 >> Thanks. [clears throat] 885 00:32:04,070 --> 00:32:04,080 » Thanks. [clears throat] 886 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:07,190 >> Um yeah, I have a couple comments. I um 887 00:32:07,190 --> 00:32:07,200 » Um yeah, I have a couple comments. I um 888 00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:11,360 I've had people talk to me about kids on 889 00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:12,960 the bikes and the speeds that they go 890 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:15,679 and um the people that have talked to me 891 00:32:15,679 --> 00:32:17,279 were not concerned about themselves. 892 00:32:17,279 --> 00:32:19,120 They were only ever concerned about the 893 00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,440 kids, which I find um helpful and 894 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:23,279 interesting in this whole thing that's 895 00:32:23,279 --> 00:32:26,080 so confusing. Um but I also wanted to 896 00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:28,159 make sure that we we think about 897 00:32:28,159 --> 00:32:30,480 pedestrians in all of this, you know, 898 00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:32,640 and and how quickly can they possibly 899 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:36,000 get out of the way. Um, and so while 900 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:37,919 you're looking for more input, I've I've 901 00:32:37,919 --> 00:32:39,679 written some notes about other places 902 00:32:39,679 --> 00:32:41,519 and other people's that that we should 903 00:32:41,519 --> 00:32:43,360 include and when we're doing having 904 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:44,480 these discussions. 905 00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:45,029 >> Excellent. 906 00:32:45,029 --> 00:32:45,039 » Excellent. 907 00:32:45,039 --> 00:32:45,430 >> Thank you. 908 00:32:45,430 --> 00:32:45,440 » Thank you. 909 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:49,190 >> Thank you. 910 00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:50,880 » Um, so first of all, thank you very much 911 00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:52,159 for all the work that you all have put 912 00:32:52,159 --> 00:32:54,720 into this so far. Um, one of the things 913 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:56,480 I'm really curious about is have we 914 00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:58,799 engaged with Hillyard City Schools to 915 00:32:58,799 --> 00:33:02,000 talk about how it's impacting them in 916 00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,080 their property? like when kids are 917 00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:06,640 riding to to school or from school, 918 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:08,159 things like that. I mean, have we 919 00:33:08,159 --> 00:33:09,840 engaged with them yet? I mean, I heard 920 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:11,039 you kind of say we're going to do an 921 00:33:11,039 --> 00:33:13,200 educational outreach, but I feel like 922 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:15,039 they are a huge partner that we need to 923 00:33:15,039 --> 00:33:17,760 start with at the at the very um 924 00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,000 beginning of the conversation because 925 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,159 that those students are going to ride 926 00:33:22,159 --> 00:33:24,000 those scooters or those ebikes on our 927 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:25,360 sidewalks, our roads, and then they're 928 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:26,880 going to end up at the school and then 929 00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:30,000 leave. And so, I think it would be 930 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:31,519 really important that we engage them 931 00:33:31,519 --> 00:33:33,360 now. So, I don't know how have we done 932 00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:34,080 that yet. 933 00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,070 >> So, we had at the last meeting of the 934 00:33:36,070 --> 00:33:36,080 » So, we had at the last meeting of the 935 00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:39,200 township schools and city um Dave 936 00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:41,039 Stewart was there and I did ask him if 937 00:33:41,039 --> 00:33:42,960 they had any data or metrics about how 938 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,640 many kids were writing these to school 939 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:46,559 or just the general patterns that they 940 00:33:46,559 --> 00:33:48,799 had seen and my recollection is he did 941 00:33:48,799 --> 00:33:50,080 not have much that was readily 942 00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:51,919 available. He said they had much better 943 00:33:51,919 --> 00:33:54,240 statistics about pedestrians and actual 944 00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:56,159 walkers, but that that was a 945 00:33:56,159 --> 00:33:58,399 conversation that we should absolutely 946 00:33:58,399 --> 00:34:01,279 have. And so, um, to your point, I I 947 00:34:01,279 --> 00:34:03,039 intend to keep that going and to keep 948 00:34:03,039 --> 00:34:05,360 them pretty close as this continues to 949 00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:06,240 unfold. 950 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:08,310 >> Well, and I I also would wonder if they 951 00:34:08,310 --> 00:34:08,320 » Well, and I I also would wonder if they 952 00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:09,280 haven't 953 00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:11,349 >> maybe got gotten enough of a sense yet 954 00:34:11,349 --> 00:34:11,359 » maybe got gotten enough of a sense yet 955 00:34:11,359 --> 00:34:13,599 because the number of scooters and 956 00:34:13,599 --> 00:34:15,200 things that I've seen this summer 957 00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:16,960 compared to previous summers, it has 958 00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:18,240 just exploded. 959 00:34:18,240 --> 00:34:20,629 >> So, it may just be like they're just a 960 00:34:20,629 --> 00:34:20,639 » So, it may just be like they're just a 961 00:34:20,639 --> 00:34:22,159 little bit behind. So, I think it's 962 00:34:22,159 --> 00:34:24,320 really important that we keep them in 963 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:28,079 the loop there. Um when we're talking 964 00:34:28,079 --> 00:34:30,639 about the helmet piece, 965 00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:33,589 >> um why would we want to become more 966 00:34:33,589 --> 00:34:33,599 » um why would we want to become more 967 00:34:33,599 --> 00:34:37,520 restrictive than what like is currently 968 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:39,520 being required? 969 00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,000 Like why I mean I get safety. I get that 970 00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:44,639 we want to do that, but is that going to 971 00:34:44,639 --> 00:34:47,520 be as enforcable? Is it going to 972 00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:50,320 potentially create an equity issue like 973 00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:52,560 for some parents if they have they may 974 00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:55,200 not be able to get the helmet for their 975 00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:56,720 kids or the or if we're going to hold 976 00:34:56,720 --> 00:34:59,359 parents liable. Kid left the house with 977 00:34:59,359 --> 00:35:02,079 a helmet but they were caught downtown 978 00:35:02,079 --> 00:35:03,680 without a helmet and now we're going to 979 00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:06,320 hold a parent liable for this. So I I'm 980 00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:09,119 I'm a little concerned about making a 981 00:35:09,119 --> 00:35:11,119 broad sweep of saying now everyone needs 982 00:35:11,119 --> 00:35:12,880 to have a helmet if they're under the 983 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,520 age of 16. 984 00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:17,680 I think that's a fair point. I think two 985 00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:20,320 two responses to that. One would be in 986 00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:22,400 terms of the equity piece. U one of the 987 00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:23,680 things that we've talked about is trying 988 00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:26,400 to engage other partners to look at 989 00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:28,480 something like a bike rodeo or a helmet 990 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:30,640 giveaway or some other ways that we can 991 00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:32,640 connect folks who might not have access 992 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:34,640 to that resource to be able to to get 993 00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:37,520 them one. Um and so that's certainly 994 00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:39,680 something that we will keep plumbing. 995 00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:42,960 Um, as far as the uh the requirement 996 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:46,240 itself, I think that um at least 997 00:35:46,240 --> 00:35:47,680 speaking for myself, and I don't know, 998 00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:48,880 Chief, you're welcome to weigh in on 999 00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:51,359 this if you'd like, but um when we're 1000 00:35:51,359 --> 00:35:53,280 thinking about an officer's ability to 1001 00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,079 sort of approach or to engage that the 1002 00:35:56,079 --> 00:35:58,320 helmet is an immediately visible thing 1003 00:35:58,320 --> 00:35:59,599 that you either know that they're 1004 00:35:59,599 --> 00:36:01,760 wearing one or they're not. And so if 1005 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:04,160 the behavior is maybe a little bit uh is 1006 00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:06,560 it reckless or no, do I have the backing 1007 00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:09,440 in the code to to start a conversation, 1008 00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:11,280 if they're not wearing a helmet and 1009 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,200 that's a clear requirement in the code, 1010 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:15,440 it just creates some backing for anybody 1011 00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:17,520 that wants to enforce or to engage that 1012 00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,280 child. Um it doesn't mean they're going 1013 00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:20,800 to get a citation. It doesn't mean we're 1014 00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:21,920 going to go after the parents 1015 00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:24,000 necessarily. It just means that that's 1016 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:25,920 an expectation that's been codified and 1017 00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:27,520 then that way you start a conversation 1018 00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,160 from there. Um but you know to your 1019 00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:32,480 point um every place does it a little 1020 00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:34,320 bit differently. So I know our draft 1021 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,520 ordinance I think we we went with age 18 1022 00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:39,280 just because that's you know the age of 1023 00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:41,040 majority basically. Some of our 1024 00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,920 neighbors I think are age 16. Um and I 1025 00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:46,000 don't want to put words in Thaad's mouth 1026 00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:48,800 but I believe that if council wanted to 1027 00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:51,280 change if council wanted to change the 1028 00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:53,359 age would that require another first 1029 00:36:53,359 --> 00:36:55,040 reading or we could they could basically 1030 00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:57,920 move to uh to adjust that now. correct 1031 00:36:57,920 --> 00:36:59,670 >> that could be amended now without having 1032 00:36:59,670 --> 00:36:59,680 » that could be amended now without having 1033 00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:04,480 to do a new legislative process. 1034 00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:07,109 >> Could I chime in on that? 1035 00:37:07,109 --> 00:37:07,119 » Could I chime in on that? 1036 00:37:07,119 --> 00:37:09,040 May maybe not required necessarily for 1037 00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:10,400 just regular bicycles, but for the 1038 00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:13,280 ebikes that can go 25 miles an hour in 1039 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,640 the scooters because I mean I think 1040 00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:18,240 there's there's quite a difference on, 1041 00:37:18,240 --> 00:37:19,920 you know, a kid riding around on a bike 1042 00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:22,480 probably going 6, eight, maybe 10 miles 1043 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:24,240 an hour on a bike, whereas these 1044 00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:26,000 scooters, like I said, I've seen them 1045 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,320 going 25 miles an hour, 1046 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,030 >> right? uh where if you know you wreck 1047 00:37:31,030 --> 00:37:31,040 » right? uh where if you know you wreck 1048 00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:33,280 you wreck on well you're going 25 miles 1049 00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:36,240 an hour and it's going to mess mess you 1050 00:37:36,240 --> 00:37:38,000 up. 1051 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:39,190 >> I'm not sure if that answered your 1052 00:37:39,190 --> 00:37:39,200 » I'm not sure if that answered your 1053 00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:42,000 question though, but the a Campbell Soup 1054 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:43,520 version would be it becomes another way 1055 00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:45,040 to engage. You know, 1056 00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:47,109 >> I appreciate that it is a very visible 1057 00:37:47,109 --> 00:37:47,119 » I appreciate that it is a very visible 1058 00:37:47,119 --> 00:37:48,640 piece. I see Chief who's nodding his 1059 00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:50,480 head back there. So, I appreciate that. 1060 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:52,240 Um, I guess the way the language is 1061 00:37:52,240 --> 00:37:54,960 written makes me worried that then we're 1062 00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,200 going to have parents receiving 1063 00:37:57,200 --> 00:37:59,119 misdemeanors for their stu for their 1064 00:37:59,119 --> 00:38:02,720 children not wearing the helmet. And I I 1065 00:38:02,720 --> 00:38:04,400 I do want to hold our parents 1066 00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:06,480 responsible. As parents, we should be 1067 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:08,240 responsible for our children. But I just 1068 00:38:08,240 --> 00:38:11,280 also I know kids are kids and they they 1069 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,599 you know sneak out of the house when the 1070 00:38:13,599 --> 00:38:15,200 mom and dad says always wear it, but 1071 00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:16,880 then they go and mom and dad aren't 1072 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:18,240 aware that they weren't wearing it and 1073 00:38:18,240 --> 00:38:19,839 then they're they're finding themselves 1074 00:38:19,839 --> 00:38:37,990 with a misdemeanor. It feels 1075 00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:39,680 » good evening. Um, one of the things that 1076 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:42,720 we do now and and we always stress is is 1077 00:38:42,720 --> 00:38:44,400 we issue warnings. We do a written 1078 00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:46,800 warning and we record that information. 1079 00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:49,040 um a lot of lower level misdemeanors, 1080 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:51,200 things that are are not violent, but uh 1081 00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:53,040 something that we feel that a warning 1082 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:55,839 will handle. Um that's the route we 1083 00:38:55,839 --> 00:38:58,480 normally take to begin uh an enforcement 1084 00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,200 action with. I I would perceive that 1085 00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:04,000 that's the type of um of action we would 1086 00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:06,400 take for something like this as well. Um 1087 00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:08,640 if we catch someone without a helmet on, 1088 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:10,560 we may stop, we may engage, we may 1089 00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:12,880 educate, we may issue a written warning, 1090 00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,040 and all that says is, "Hey, you violated 1091 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:16,400 this 1092 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:18,640 don't do that again. Uh we have that 1093 00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:20,320 information. If we happen to uh 1094 00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:21,920 re-engage with that kid some point in 1095 00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,240 the future, we have that information. We 1096 00:39:24,240 --> 00:39:26,000 may issue a citation at that second 1097 00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:29,200 point or, you know, we may try and, you 1098 00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:32,400 know, a little stronger um messaging uh 1099 00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:35,520 to them. But yeah, I I I don't see us 1100 00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:36,880 see a kid without a helmet, they're 1101 00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:38,560 going to get a ticket. 1102 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:41,109 >> How would you ensure that the parent was 1103 00:39:41,109 --> 00:39:41,119 » How would you ensure that the parent was 1104 00:39:41,119 --> 00:39:42,560 aware that they received a written 1105 00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:44,079 warning? Um 1106 00:39:44,079 --> 00:39:45,270 >> because I know my kids wouldn't have 1107 00:39:45,270 --> 00:39:45,280 » because I know my kids wouldn't have 1108 00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:48,000 told me. 1109 00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:51,430 >> Yeah. I mean, yeah, I mean that that is 1110 00:39:51,430 --> 00:39:51,440 » Yeah. I mean, yeah, I mean that that is 1111 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:53,520 tough. Um I I would say the other thing 1112 00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:55,760 that we have still is we have our 1113 00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:57,680 diversion program with with uh 1114 00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:00,320 juveniles. Um so that doesn't mean they 1115 00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:02,000 may get a ticket, but we may hold on to 1116 00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:03,680 it if they can complete a safety program 1117 00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:05,599 or something that there's a way to that. 1118 00:40:05,599 --> 00:40:07,040 That that way a parent is being 1119 00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:08,960 notified. But um that would be 1120 00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:10,320 secondary. I would start off with the 1121 00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:11,760 written warning first. 1122 00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:14,470 >> Okay. And if I may, with regard to the 1123 00:40:14,470 --> 00:40:14,480 » Okay. And if I may, with regard to the 1124 00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:16,560 par parental responsibility, one thing 1125 00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:20,240 that's in that uh proposed section is a 1126 00:40:20,240 --> 00:40:22,320 standard of of recklessness on the part 1127 00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:24,240 of the parent. So it's not a strict 1128 00:40:24,240 --> 00:40:27,839 liability offense. Um, when one of the 1129 00:40:27,839 --> 00:40:31,040 officers, if an officer were to write a 1130 00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:32,960 citation under this code, there would 1131 00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:35,599 have to be some additional 1132 00:40:35,599 --> 00:40:37,680 attendant circumstance that they would 1133 00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:39,520 articulate to say why they believe the 1134 00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:42,240 parent was reckless in this case with 1135 00:40:42,240 --> 00:40:45,920 allowing their child to violate a a 1136 00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:48,560 provision of this ordinance. So I think 1137 00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:52,240 that even in a you know a ticket happy 1138 00:40:52,240 --> 00:40:55,520 scenario, you wouldn't have parents just 1139 00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:57,839 getting citations left and right. It 1140 00:40:57,839 --> 00:41:00,000 would have to be a 1141 00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:01,920 a relatively 1142 00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:06,240 bad circumstance showing some knowing 1143 00:41:06,240 --> 00:41:09,920 indifference or indifference to a to a 1144 00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:12,560 known threat uh that the child would be 1145 00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:16,400 out violating the ordinance. 1146 00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:18,160 Not to belabor the point to but I also 1147 00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:20,960 think on some level the the proposed 1148 00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:23,760 ordinance is really intended to put 1149 00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:26,560 tools into the toolbox and but as a 1150 00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:28,400 practical matter we don't have enough 1151 00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,599 officers out you know out and about on 1152 00:41:31,599 --> 00:41:35,040 patrol to to go site every parent whose 1153 00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:37,040 kids not wearing a helmet. You know it's 1154 00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:38,960 it's more about creating those 1155 00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:40,800 mechanisms for an officer to have a 1156 00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:44,079 conversation if one needs to be had. Um 1157 00:41:44,079 --> 00:41:48,079 and and sure if there's um I mean I mean 1158 00:41:48,079 --> 00:41:52,000 I suppose that if uh a a an individual 1159 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:53,920 or a child was being reckless and they 1160 00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:55,680 were warned and they kept doing it and 1161 00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:57,680 kept doing it and of course then we 1162 00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:59,520 would have other tools empoundment for 1163 00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:02,000 example to then have a parent come by 1164 00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:03,680 and grab the vehicle so we can talk to 1165 00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:06,319 the parent directly. Um it's more about 1166 00:42:06,319 --> 00:42:10,319 creating that that system so that we can 1167 00:42:10,319 --> 00:42:11,920 have a conversation at a series of 1168 00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:15,119 levels. um rather than just passing out 1169 00:42:15,119 --> 00:42:22,309 citations necessarily. 1170 00:42:22,319 --> 00:42:23,680 » Thank you. Thanks for all the work you 1171 00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:25,359 guys are doing. I know this is um a new 1172 00:42:25,359 --> 00:42:26,880 thing for all of Hillyard and all of the 1173 00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:29,040 city. Um just a couple things that I 1174 00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:31,599 just crossed my mind and when especially 1175 00:42:31,599 --> 00:42:33,920 when Kathy was saying about um the 1176 00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:36,240 schools. Um, I know we have this uh 1177 00:42:36,240 --> 00:42:39,119 safety town program which is teaching uh 1178 00:42:39,119 --> 00:42:41,760 kids about uh safety around uh you know 1179 00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:44,160 on on their bikes and and around town. 1180 00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:46,560 Um I I could see something like this 1181 00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:49,359 needed with the ebikes and having a 1182 00:42:49,359 --> 00:42:51,599 program if you plan on riding your bike 1183 00:42:51,599 --> 00:42:54,800 your ebike to school and of course we 1184 00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:56,240 have to have a place to store them. So, 1185 00:42:56,240 --> 00:42:58,000 we kind of have to know um in 1186 00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:00,160 conjunction with the schools how this is 1187 00:43:00,160 --> 00:43:04,800 going to um be um how if you know how 1188 00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:06,480 prevalent this is going to be this 1189 00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:08,720 school year. So, I think that if if I 1190 00:43:08,720 --> 00:43:10,960 don't know if it's too late now to have 1191 00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:13,680 a program like Safety Town, but hey, if 1192 00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:16,720 you plan on riding your ebike to school 1193 00:43:16,720 --> 00:43:19,040 this school year, uh we'd like to have 1194 00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:22,000 like a session with you and to go over 1195 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:24,079 some rules and regulations and where you 1196 00:43:24,079 --> 00:43:26,319 can ride it. I think if we tell people 1197 00:43:26,319 --> 00:43:27,839 where they can ride it as opposed to 1198 00:43:27,839 --> 00:43:29,839 where you cannot ride it, I think that's 1199 00:43:29,839 --> 00:43:31,440 a little bit more positive way. And then 1200 00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:32,880 so they can say, "Okay, I know I can go 1201 00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:34,720 here and this is where I can ride it." 1202 00:43:34,720 --> 00:43:36,560 Um, and the kids would know this is how 1203 00:43:36,560 --> 00:43:38,240 they can get to school, maybe a path. 1204 00:43:38,240 --> 00:43:40,720 And if they can't think of a a path that 1205 00:43:40,720 --> 00:43:42,720 is, you know, permissible to ride their 1206 00:43:42,720 --> 00:43:44,319 bike, then I think we have to address 1207 00:43:44,319 --> 00:43:47,119 that, too. And having our our trails to 1208 00:43:47,119 --> 00:43:48,720 trails really connected is important, 1209 00:43:48,720 --> 00:43:50,240 especially if these ebikes are going to 1210 00:43:50,240 --> 00:43:53,599 continue. Um, so I I mean those are just 1211 00:43:53,599 --> 00:43:56,960 some options I thought that we can um 1212 00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:59,760 propose to uh the kids that are that own 1213 00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:01,520 these. Yeah, 1214 00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:02,950 >> that's great feedback. That's exactly 1215 00:44:02,950 --> 00:44:02,960 » that's great feedback. That's exactly 1216 00:44:02,960 --> 00:44:04,800 what I would intend to talk to Mr. 1217 00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:05,920 Stewart about 1218 00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:07,349 >> the school district is how do we start 1219 00:44:07,349 --> 00:44:07,359 » the school district is how do we start 1220 00:44:07,359 --> 00:44:09,599 to weave those conversations together? 1221 00:44:09,599 --> 00:44:11,109 >> Yeah. And I don't know if it's too late 1222 00:44:11,109 --> 00:44:11,119 » Yeah. And I don't know if it's too late 1223 00:44:11,119 --> 00:44:12,640 to have a program like that for these 1224 00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:14,400 kids or in the summer. I don't know. 1225 00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:16,710 >> Yeah. I'd have to ask him. And I on some 1226 00:44:16,710 --> 00:44:16,720 » Yeah. I'd have to ask him. And I on some 1227 00:44:16,720 --> 00:44:18,240 level though I think that your point's 1228 00:44:18,240 --> 00:44:20,880 well taken. anything that we can do um 1229 00:44:20,880 --> 00:44:22,560 particularly if council were to advance 1230 00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:24,400 the ordinance this evening about helmets 1231 00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:25,839 like that would be a pretty easy thing 1232 00:44:25,839 --> 00:44:28,480 to begin messaging um any other more 1233 00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:31,839 detailed stuff um may we we may message 1234 00:44:31,839 --> 00:44:33,119 later in the year but we would at least 1235 00:44:33,119 --> 00:44:35,359 have that conversation going and have a 1236 00:44:35,359 --> 00:44:36,960 pipeline to get the message out. 1237 00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:41,510 >> Yeah. Thanks. 1238 00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:45,040 » Thank you again. Um, I had a question 1239 00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:46,720 about, [clears throat] 1240 00:44:46,720 --> 00:44:48,720 um, when you started the the 1241 00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:51,040 presentation, we were reading off of the 1242 00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:53,119 website, which was talking about class 1243 00:44:53,119 --> 00:44:55,119 one and class 2's having a maximum speed 1244 00:44:55,119 --> 00:44:58,400 of 20. Um, but I did a little checking 1245 00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:01,599 today and um, apparently they go up to 1246 00:45:01,599 --> 00:45:04,480 28 miles per hour, the class ones and 1247 00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:08,079 class 2s and some of them actually 1248 00:45:08,079 --> 00:45:11,920 are allegedly able to go faster is what 1249 00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:14,880 I saw online. Um, now I spoke with our 1250 00:45:14,880 --> 00:45:17,359 local bike shop. He said bike shops are 1251 00:45:17,359 --> 00:45:21,040 only allowed to sell one and two. Um, 1252 00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:23,119 but you know people can easily buy 1253 00:45:23,119 --> 00:45:25,280 online. So, I'm sure we're getting a 1254 00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:29,920 wide variety of um speeds on those 1255 00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:31,040 bikes. 1256 00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:33,190 >> Yes, council member. So, the the 1257 00:45:33,190 --> 00:45:33,200 » Yes, council member. So, the the 1258 00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:35,119 definitions for those devices where the 1259 00:45:35,119 --> 00:45:37,440 20 for class one and class 2 and the 28 1260 00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:40,800 for class 3 that was set by state law um 1261 00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:42,480 that basically every city in the state 1262 00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:45,520 has copied. The state law also requires 1263 00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:47,440 a sticker on those devices. So, if it's 1264 00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:50,240 a true class one or class 2 device, 1265 00:45:50,240 --> 00:45:51,839 it'll have a sticker on it. and those 1266 00:45:51,839 --> 00:45:54,640 are maxed out at 20. The class three is 1267 00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:57,119 what's maxed out at 28 and has a little 1268 00:45:57,119 --> 00:45:58,880 higher safety precautions under state 1269 00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:02,560 law and Hillyard law right now. But I 1270 00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:04,800 have also been reliably told from the 1271 00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:06,480 law enforcement community that people 1272 00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:08,960 can mess with the governor on the 1273 00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:10,720 devices to make them go faster, but 1274 00:46:10,720 --> 00:46:12,480 that's not a legal way to operate those 1275 00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:13,280 devices. 1276 00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:15,750 >> Council, this Joe Bachelor, he's 1277 00:46:15,750 --> 00:46:15,760 » Council, this Joe Bachelor, he's 1278 00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:17,270 >> Oh, I'm sorry. 1279 00:46:17,270 --> 00:46:17,280 » Oh, I'm sorry. 1280 00:46:17,280 --> 00:46:18,309 >> He's an attorney. 1281 00:46:18,309 --> 00:46:18,319 » He's an attorney. 1282 00:46:18,319 --> 00:46:20,470 >> This this is my colleague Joe Bachelor. 1283 00:46:20,470 --> 00:46:20,480 » This this is my colleague Joe Bachelor. 1284 00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:24,480 Um he has become our resident expert at 1285 00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:28,560 FBT Gibbons on um micromobility devices 1286 00:46:28,560 --> 00:46:31,440 of all kinds to either his delight or 1287 00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:34,079 chagrin depending upon uh the moment we 1288 00:46:34,079 --> 00:46:35,520 catch him. 1289 00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:36,069 >> Awesome. 1290 00:46:36,069 --> 00:46:36,079 » Awesome. 1291 00:46:36,079 --> 00:46:38,150 >> Joe's been Joe, you were instrumental in 1292 00:46:38,150 --> 00:46:38,160 » Joe's been Joe, you were instrumental in 1293 00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:39,440 helping to pull together some of the 1294 00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:41,680 Matrix information that we showed this 1295 00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:43,680 evening. So yeah, 1296 00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:46,150 >> it's a fun time. 1297 00:46:46,150 --> 00:46:46,160 » it's a fun time. 1298 00:46:46,160 --> 00:46:48,790 >> Okay. So, so if I go to a local bike 1299 00:46:48,790 --> 00:46:48,800 » Okay. So, so if I go to a local bike 1300 00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:53,670 shop, I and 1301 00:46:53,680 --> 00:46:55,599 Thank you. 1302 00:46:55,599 --> 00:46:58,720 Um, I would 1303 00:46:58,720 --> 00:47:01,119 find that these bikes only have a 1304 00:47:01,119 --> 00:47:04,880 maximum posted speed of 20. Correct. 1305 00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:06,790 >> Yes. If the store is selling it how 1306 00:47:06,790 --> 00:47:06,800 » Yes. If the store is selling it how 1307 00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:08,400 they're supposed to under state law. 1308 00:47:08,400 --> 00:47:09,359 Yes. 1309 00:47:09,359 --> 00:47:09,829 >> Okay. 1310 00:47:09,829 --> 00:47:09,839 » Okay. 1311 00:47:09,839 --> 00:47:11,190 >> And the difference between the one and 1312 00:47:11,190 --> 00:47:11,200 » And the difference between the one and 1313 00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:14,000 two is the two helps you get to 20 1314 00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:15,440 regardless of whether you're pedaling or 1315 00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:17,520 not. the class one you have to pedal to 1316 00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:20,000 get the assist to get up to 20. 1317 00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:21,910 >> Okay. 1318 00:47:21,910 --> 00:47:21,920 » Okay. 1319 00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:23,599 For specific questions on the 1320 00:47:23,599 --> 00:47:25,040 legislation, do you want to wait until 1321 00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:28,640 the actual meeting to do those? 1322 00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:29,990 >> I don't have a strong preference. We 1323 00:47:29,990 --> 00:47:30,000 » I don't have a strong preference. We 1324 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:31,200 have a little bit of time now. I think 1325 00:47:31,200 --> 00:47:33,119 we can go ahead and if you've got them. 1326 00:47:33,119 --> 00:47:33,750 >> I I do. 1327 00:47:33,750 --> 00:47:33,760 » I I do. 1328 00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:35,270 >> Yeah, that'd be great. 1329 00:47:35,270 --> 00:47:35,280 » Yeah, that'd be great. 1330 00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:39,910 >> Okay. Um 1331 00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:41,599 um 1332 00:47:41,599 --> 00:47:43,760 uh 1333 00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:46,319 under 373.04 1334 00:47:46,319 --> 00:47:48,960 in the legislation, it's talking about 1335 00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:52,720 turning a certain direction. I'm sorry I 1336 00:47:52,720 --> 00:47:58,560 don't have that up the um letter B, but 1337 00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:01,280 when I was reading it, 1338 00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:03,440 I was thinking which direction are you 1339 00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:04,800 talking about? Are you talking about 1340 00:48:04,800 --> 00:48:06,880 turning, making a right turn? Are you 1341 00:48:06,880 --> 00:48:08,720 talking about making a left turn? And 1342 00:48:08,720 --> 00:48:21,430 that was again 373.04B 1343 00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:25,750 is in boy. 1344 00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:29,760 This is where um 1345 00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:31,280 you can move moving from the right side 1346 00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:33,760 of the roadway if a dedicated turn lane 1347 00:48:33,760 --> 00:48:35,599 is present. Was that the section you're 1348 00:48:35,599 --> 00:48:36,240 referencing? 1349 00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:39,990 >> Yes, that letter B. Uhhuh. 1350 00:48:39,990 --> 00:48:40,000 » Yes, that letter B. Uhhuh. 1351 00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:43,510 >> Um. 1352 00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:43,920 » Okay. 1353 00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:45,510 >> Is that currently how a bicycle can 1354 00:48:45,510 --> 00:48:45,520 » Is that currently how a bicycle can 1355 00:48:45,520 --> 00:48:46,640 operate 1356 00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:47,109 >> right 1357 00:48:47,109 --> 00:48:47,119 » right 1358 00:48:47,119 --> 00:48:48,950 >> now? I mean, I ride bikes and if you are 1359 00:48:48,950 --> 00:48:48,960 » now? I mean, I ride bikes and if you are 1360 00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:50,319 riding along the right side of the road, 1361 00:48:50,319 --> 00:48:52,079 if there's a lefthand turn lane, you can 1362 00:48:52,079 --> 00:48:53,760 move into that turn lane, you have that 1363 00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:55,920 right to do that. That That's exactly 1364 00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:59,760 right. And that black text is current 1365 00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:01,280 law under our ordinances. 1366 00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:02,870 >> Right. Right. No, I realize that I've 1367 00:49:02,870 --> 00:49:02,880 » Right. Right. No, I realize that I've 1368 00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:05,040 never read our text. Understand. 1369 00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:07,510 >> This is my first time. Um. 1370 00:49:07,510 --> 00:49:07,520 » This is my first time. Um. 1371 00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:09,910 >> Yes. And when I was re reading it, I was 1372 00:49:09,910 --> 00:49:09,920 » Yes. And when I was re reading it, I was 1373 00:49:09,920 --> 00:49:12,480 picturing a left turn lane, but I wonder 1374 00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:15,359 if we can clarify that in in here so 1375 00:49:15,359 --> 00:49:17,200 that we all understand what we're 1376 00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:19,680 talking about versus 1377 00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:23,119 a right turn or 1378 00:49:23,119 --> 00:49:24,549 >> Mhm. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's 1379 00:49:24,549 --> 00:49:24,559 » Mhm. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's 1380 00:49:24,559 --> 00:49:25,680 absolutely something that we can look 1381 00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:27,440 at. I mean, part of this conversation, I 1382 00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:29,040 think, is about, especially when it 1383 00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:30,720 comes to how vehicles are being operated 1384 00:49:30,720 --> 00:49:32,640 in the roadway, which is like what this 1385 00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:34,880 section is dealing with, making sure we 1386 00:49:34,880 --> 00:49:36,400 have a clear understanding of that in 1387 00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:38,400 general. So, I'm happy to add that to 1388 00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:39,119 the list. 1389 00:49:39,119 --> 00:49:42,390 >> Letter C, right below that, um it talks 1390 00:49:42,390 --> 00:49:42,400 » Letter C, right below that, um it talks 1391 00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:45,440 about um 1392 00:49:45,440 --> 00:49:50,240 to writing more than to a breast. Um, 1393 00:49:50,240 --> 00:49:52,480 and I know it's been my experience out 1394 00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:56,720 on the paths that if you ride more than 1395 00:49:56,720 --> 00:49:59,280 two a breast, um, you're taking up the 1396 00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:02,319 whole path and 1397 00:50:02,319 --> 00:50:04,480 we're not allowing for people coming in 1398 00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:08,240 the opposite direction. 1399 00:50:08,240 --> 00:50:11,520 So I think the exception there would be 1400 00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:13,280 you're only allowed well according to 1401 00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:17,280 this code off the cuff um you're not 1402 00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:19,040 supposed to ride more than two a breast 1403 00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:21,040 unless you are on a path that is 1404 00:50:21,040 --> 00:50:24,000 specifically dedicated to 1405 00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:26,240 uh set aside for the exclusive use of 1406 00:50:26,240 --> 00:50:29,359 bicycles or ebikes or motorcycles. I'm 1407 00:50:29,359 --> 00:50:31,359 not aware that we have any 1408 00:50:31,359 --> 00:50:32,800 infrastructure like that that is 1409 00:50:32,800 --> 00:50:34,880 exclusively for bicycles. a lot of our 1410 00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:36,960 our shared use paths accommodate 1411 00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:38,640 pedestrians 1412 00:50:38,640 --> 00:50:40,230 >> um and other users as well. So I think 1413 00:50:40,230 --> 00:50:40,240 » um and other users as well. So I think 1414 00:50:40,240 --> 00:50:42,960 in general the prohibition against two a 1415 00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:47,990 breast would apply everywhere. 1416 00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:51,040 » Okay. So it's not like we're saying sure 1417 00:50:51,040 --> 00:50:53,440 you can do three or four a breast or 1418 00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:55,589 >> correct because we don't have any like 1419 00:50:55,589 --> 00:50:55,599 » correct because we don't have any like 1420 00:50:55,599 --> 00:50:58,720 specifically dedicated bicycle paths. 1421 00:50:58,720 --> 00:51:00,319 All of the paths are shared use paths 1422 00:51:00,319 --> 00:51:02,880 for bicycles um and pedestrians. 1423 00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:07,030 >> Okay. All right. 1424 00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:08,559 » It's only Well, that's the other thing, 1425 00:51:08,559 --> 00:51:10,559 too, is this uh this section title 1426 00:51:10,559 --> 00:51:12,960 governs um primarily the roadways 1427 00:51:12,960 --> 00:51:14,790 >> on roadway. Okay. So, not a shared use 1428 00:51:14,790 --> 00:51:14,800 » on roadway. Okay. So, not a shared use 1429 00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:15,920 path. Got it. 1430 00:51:15,920 --> 00:51:20,630 >> All right. That makes sense. Um 1431 00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:23,119 then I I don't know. I thought I kept 1432 00:51:23,119 --> 00:51:26,000 reading letter F and I wasn't quite sure 1433 00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:28,079 what that was saying. If you could 1434 00:51:28,079 --> 00:51:35,910 clarify, someone could clarify that. 1435 00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:37,760 Is that just saying you have to yield to 1436 00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:39,440 the bicycle? 1437 00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:40,150 >> They're there. 1438 00:51:40,150 --> 00:51:40,160 » They're there. 1439 00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:42,069 >> So it is 1440 00:51:42,069 --> 00:51:42,079 » So it is 1441 00:51:42,079 --> 00:51:45,200 So if you're turning, 1442 00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:48,640 yes, you have to yield to the bicycle. 1443 00:51:48,640 --> 00:51:50,319 Um 1444 00:51:50,319 --> 00:51:53,119 obviously so you don't cut off and hit 1445 00:51:53,119 --> 00:51:56,000 the bicycle or t-bone the bicycle. 1446 00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:59,280 the the last the very last um phrase 1447 00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:02,480 provided that the person is not passing 1448 00:52:02,480 --> 00:52:05,359 stopped vehicles on the right side and 1449 00:52:05,359 --> 00:52:07,920 is not visible to turning traffic. 1450 00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:09,829 >> I believe that that is trying to make an 1451 00:52:09,829 --> 00:52:09,839 » I believe that that is trying to make an 1452 00:52:09,839 --> 00:52:12,160 accommodation for 1453 00:52:12,160 --> 00:52:14,880 if the if the bicycle rider is riding in 1454 00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:16,079 such a way that they're not making 1455 00:52:16,079 --> 00:52:18,000 themselves visible. So, if you have 1456 00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:19,680 parallel parking on a street and if 1457 00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:23,119 there's room where the um or if you have 1458 00:52:23,119 --> 00:52:25,440 a 1459 00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:27,359 stopped traffic on a street and the 1460 00:52:27,359 --> 00:52:29,280 bicycle is on the right side and is not 1461 00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:31,680 visible, then this law is not going to 1462 00:52:31,680 --> 00:52:34,960 hold the turning vehicle 1463 00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:38,800 responsible for not yielding to that 1464 00:52:38,800 --> 00:52:41,680 bicycle rider who has put themselves in 1465 00:52:41,680 --> 00:52:43,440 a position not to be seen. 1466 00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:45,750 >> I see. Okay. All right. That makes 1467 00:52:45,750 --> 00:52:45,760 » I see. Okay. All right. That makes 1468 00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:47,040 sense. 1469 00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:50,960 Um, do do we require any kind of hand 1470 00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:52,720 signaling like if you're riding on the 1471 00:52:52,720 --> 00:52:55,359 roadway from 1472 00:52:55,359 --> 00:52:58,319 from bicyclists? 1473 00:52:58,319 --> 00:53:01,349 >> I believe in general it is a best 1474 00:53:01,349 --> 00:53:01,359 » I believe in general it is a best 1475 00:53:01,359 --> 00:53:04,790 practice. 1476 00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:06,559 » Yeah, I don't I don't know that there is 1477 00:53:06,559 --> 00:53:08,319 a specific requirement in the code. I 1478 00:53:08,319 --> 00:53:10,559 would need to look. But um as somebody 1479 00:53:10,559 --> 00:53:12,400 that just registered for Pelatonia, I 1480 00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:14,240 can tell you they're very upfront about 1481 00:53:14,240 --> 00:53:16,079 observing the rules of the road and 1482 00:53:16,079 --> 00:53:18,240 general courtesy and etiquette. Um so 1483 00:53:18,240 --> 00:53:19,520 there's a lot of conversation out there 1484 00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:21,440 about best practices, but I would need 1485 00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:23,359 to look [snorts] in our code 1486 00:53:23,359 --> 00:53:25,280 specifically. 1487 00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:26,549 >> Okay. 1488 00:53:26,549 --> 00:53:26,559 » Okay. 1489 00:53:26,559 --> 00:53:29,520 Um, 1490 00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:31,760 so 1491 00:53:31,760 --> 00:53:34,160 if I'm writing on a shared use path and 1492 00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:37,520 I I was looking at letter H on this one, 1493 00:53:37,520 --> 00:53:39,920 um, I don't have to wear a helmet then 1494 00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:41,920 if I'm on a shared use path. 1495 00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:44,870 >> No, the uh the the section here H is 1496 00:53:44,870 --> 00:53:44,880 » No, the uh the the section here H is 1497 00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:47,040 would basically require anybody that's 1498 00:53:47,040 --> 00:53:49,920 on a roadway operate operating a bike, 1499 00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:51,520 ebike, or any one of the devices that 1500 00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:53,200 we've talked about to be wearing a 1501 00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:55,760 helmet if they are under age 18. There's 1502 00:53:55,760 --> 00:53:57,680 a similar code change, I believe it's in 1503 00:53:57,680 --> 00:54:00,800 the next section that governs um similar 1504 00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:02,720 rules on shared use path. There's a 1505 00:54:02,720 --> 00:54:05,119 almost a copy paste of that blue section 1506 00:54:05,119 --> 00:54:07,359 H that would also require helmets for 1507 00:54:07,359 --> 00:54:10,000 any riders of these vehicles uh if they 1508 00:54:10,000 --> 00:54:11,760 are under age 18 on other 1509 00:54:11,760 --> 00:54:13,280 infrastructure. 1510 00:54:13,280 --> 00:54:17,349 >> Okay, great. Um 1511 00:54:17,349 --> 00:54:17,359 » Okay, great. Um 1512 00:54:17,359 --> 00:54:21,520 under the section 373.10 10 electric 1513 00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:26,400 bicycles. A2 said highway 1514 00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:29,839 and I was wondering 1515 00:54:29,839 --> 00:54:31,920 should we have it say roadway versus 1516 00:54:31,920 --> 00:54:33,599 highway? I don't know. I think of a 1517 00:54:33,599 --> 00:54:36,240 highway as like a freeway or a higher 1518 00:54:36,240 --> 00:54:42,079 speed road. Um 37310 A2. 1519 00:54:42,079 --> 00:54:43,829 >> Kelly will answer this one. 1520 00:54:43,829 --> 00:54:43,839 » Kelly will answer this one. 1521 00:54:43,839 --> 00:54:45,589 >> Okay. Good evening, council members. So 1522 00:54:45,589 --> 00:54:45,599 » Okay. Good evening, council members. So 1523 00:54:45,599 --> 00:54:47,760 that language is consistent with exactly 1524 00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:51,119 what OC describes it. And so at this 1525 00:54:51,119 --> 00:54:52,480 point we're just going with what the 1526 00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:54,800 description of OC. But what was 1527 00:54:54,800 --> 00:54:56,400 discussed this evening is we believe 1528 00:54:56,400 --> 00:54:58,480 that there will be changes given the 1529 00:54:58,480 --> 00:55:00,240 feedback that we get over the next few 1530 00:55:00,240 --> 00:55:02,400 months that this section regarding the 1531 00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:04,480 operation of class one, class 2, class 3 1532 00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:07,599 on roadway on electric bic or on shared 1533 00:55:07,599 --> 00:55:11,520 use pass will be um will be changed. 1534 00:55:11,520 --> 00:55:14,800 Currently class one, class 2 and class 3 1535 00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:16,800 the way our code is currently written 1536 00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:19,200 are allowed on shared use paths on 1537 00:55:19,200 --> 00:55:21,680 roadways everywhere. We are getting back 1538 00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:24,640 to where Ohio revised code is that pulls 1539 00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:26,880 class 3 bikes a little bit away from 1540 00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:30,559 that. So that's why the use the word 1541 00:55:30,559 --> 00:55:33,119 highway was used because it matches OC 1542 00:55:33,119 --> 00:55:35,359 and so we're starting at that baseline 1543 00:55:35,359 --> 00:55:38,000 and then we will further evaluate it 1544 00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:39,599 moving forward. 1545 00:55:39,599 --> 00:55:43,589 >> Okay. Thank you. 1546 00:55:43,599 --> 00:55:47,270 That's it. 1547 00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:49,839 » Okay. Oh, yeah. Go ahead. 1548 00:55:49,839 --> 00:55:52,549 >> Um, thank you for putting all those new 1549 00:55:52,549 --> 00:55:52,559 » Um, thank you for putting all those new 1550 00:55:52,559 --> 00:55:55,599 signage up. That's that's makes it very 1551 00:55:55,599 --> 00:55:58,160 clear. Um, you know, who's not allowed 1552 00:55:58,160 --> 00:56:00,720 to be riding around uh in Hillyard 1553 00:56:00,720 --> 00:56:02,559 Station Park. But my my I'm wondering, 1554 00:56:02,559 --> 00:56:04,319 are we going to put that same signage in 1555 00:56:04,319 --> 00:56:07,359 some of our other parks? 1556 00:56:07,359 --> 00:56:08,789 >> I think that's a conversation that we 1557 00:56:08,789 --> 00:56:08,799 » I think that's a conversation that we 1558 00:56:08,799 --> 00:56:10,559 can certainly have. happy to evaluate 1559 00:56:10,559 --> 00:56:13,280 that and look at it. I it um the con the 1560 00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:15,599 convenient thing about HSP is that it's 1561 00:56:15,599 --> 00:56:18,559 very contiguous. Um I would just want to 1562 00:56:18,559 --> 00:56:20,960 be really deliberate about how I'm I'm 1563 00:56:20,960 --> 00:56:22,400 thinking of a much larger park like 1564 00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:23,920 municipal park for example with where 1565 00:56:23,920 --> 00:56:25,359 you have a lot more trails running 1566 00:56:25,359 --> 00:56:27,520 through there. Um trying to kind of 1567 00:56:27,520 --> 00:56:30,319 regulate and then sign where we do and 1568 00:56:30,319 --> 00:56:32,640 don't want other vehicles could be a 1569 00:56:32,640 --> 00:56:34,880 much bigger endeavor. Um but I think 1570 00:56:34,880 --> 00:56:36,319 your point's well taken. It's something 1571 00:56:36,319 --> 00:56:36,799 to 1572 00:56:36,799 --> 00:56:39,030 >> my my example is um just at Heather 1573 00:56:39,030 --> 00:56:39,040 » my my example is um just at Heather 1574 00:56:39,040 --> 00:56:40,160 Ridge Park, 1575 00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:41,270 >> my neighborhood. 1576 00:56:41,270 --> 00:56:41,280 » my neighborhood. 1577 00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:44,069 >> Um I was down there with my my grandson. 1578 00:56:44,069 --> 00:56:44,079 » Um I was down there with my my grandson. 1579 00:56:44,079 --> 00:56:45,599 There a bunch of other little kids there 1580 00:56:45,599 --> 00:56:47,599 playing on the equipment. Yet there were 1581 00:56:47,599 --> 00:56:50,400 these kids who came in with with uh you 1582 00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:52,000 know they were probably 8 n 10 years 1583 00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:55,440 old. They were on electric scooters in 1584 00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:57,599 amongst the playground equipment riding 1585 00:56:57,599 --> 00:56:59,680 around it around and round and I kept 1586 00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:01,040 having to tell my grandson, "Don't get 1587 00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:02,559 on the slide right now because there's a 1588 00:57:02,559 --> 00:57:04,640 kid zooming around right there." I'm 1589 00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:06,720 just talking about like a sign posted 1590 00:57:06,720 --> 00:57:08,640 right right in front of the the 1591 00:57:08,640 --> 00:57:11,040 playground equipment at our parks to to 1592 00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:12,640 keep them out of there. 1593 00:57:12,640 --> 00:57:13,030 >> Yep. 1594 00:57:13,030 --> 00:57:13,040 » Yep. 1595 00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:14,230 >> You know, just to keep the little ones 1596 00:57:14,230 --> 00:57:14,240 » You know, just to keep the little ones 1597 00:57:14,240 --> 00:57:14,720 safe. 1598 00:57:14,720 --> 00:57:16,309 >> Yep. We can look at that, too. And that 1599 00:57:16,309 --> 00:57:16,319 » Yep. We can look at that, too. And that 1600 00:57:16,319 --> 00:57:17,920 actually brings up one other final point 1601 00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:19,440 just with respect to infrastructure, 1602 00:57:19,440 --> 00:57:23,119 too. We have had um some feedback about 1603 00:57:23,119 --> 00:57:24,799 maybe looking at something like a bike 1604 00:57:24,799 --> 00:57:26,720 park or a skate park or some other sort 1605 00:57:26,720 --> 00:57:28,960 of destination that kids may want to go 1606 00:57:28,960 --> 00:57:31,200 to. Um, I think that's also a 1607 00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:33,680 conversation to be had in the sense that 1608 00:57:33,680 --> 00:57:36,319 um, it, you know, a bike park is is 1609 00:57:36,319 --> 00:57:38,240 probably more of like a BMX, not 1610 00:57:38,240 --> 00:57:40,240 necessarily a motorized kind of 1611 00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:42,319 endeavor, but to the extent that kids 1612 00:57:42,319 --> 00:57:44,400 are looking for places to do little 1613 00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:46,319 jumps and do other things, whether 1614 00:57:46,319 --> 00:57:47,760 they're on a scooter or a skateboard or 1615 00:57:47,760 --> 00:57:49,599 whatever, um, I think that's also part 1616 00:57:49,599 --> 00:57:51,200 of the conversation, too, about maybe 1617 00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:53,520 creating a destination point or a focal 1618 00:57:53,520 --> 00:57:55,280 point for them to direct some of that 1619 00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:57,119 energy. 1620 00:57:57,119 --> 00:57:58,960 So, 1621 00:57:58,960 --> 00:58:01,109 >> all right. Well, thank you so much. Um, 1622 00:58:01,109 --> 00:58:01,119 » all right. Well, thank you so much. Um, 1623 00:58:01,119 --> 00:58:03,200 I I do think this is the right approach. 1624 00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:04,640 I like that it's collaborative, that 1625 00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:06,960 we're working iteratively as a council, 1626 00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:09,920 as a community um as we further define 1627 00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:12,319 what safety means for all of us. So, 1628 00:58:12,319 --> 00:58:13,920 yeah, looking forward to next steps and 1629 00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:15,359 thank you all so much for all your work 1630 00:58:15,359 --> 00:58:18,240 as a team. Um, items for discussion. 1631 00:58:18,240 --> 00:58:19,920 Does council have any other items to 1632 00:58:19,920 --> 00:58:21,599 discuss this evening during this 1633 00:58:21,599 --> 00:58:24,640 committee of the whole? Seeing none, u 1634 00:58:24,640 --> 00:58:26,319 Mr. Roush, do you have any additional 1635 00:58:26,319 --> 00:58:27,920 city manager updates for this committee 1636 00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:28,720 of the whole? 1637 00:58:28,720 --> 00:58:31,270 >> I've probably talked enough, but I 1638 00:58:31,270 --> 00:58:31,280 » I've probably talked enough, but I 1639 00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:32,400 appreciate your time and it's good 1640 00:58:32,400 --> 00:58:34,880 feedback for all of us. So, thank you. 1641 00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:36,549 >> All right. I would entertain a motion 1642 00:58:36,549 --> 00:58:36,559 » All right. I would entertain a motion 1643 00:58:36,559 --> 00:58:38,640 and a second to adjurnn this meeting. 1644 00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:39,190 >> So, move. 1645 00:58:39,190 --> 00:58:39,200 » So, move. 1646 00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:39,990 >> Second. 1647 00:58:39,990 --> 00:58:40,000 » Second. 1648 00:58:40,000 --> 00:58:41,589 >> All in favor say I. 1649 00:58:41,589 --> 00:58:41,599 » All in favor say I. 1650 00:58:41,599 --> 00:58:42,069 >> I. 1651 00:58:42,069 --> 00:58:42,079 » I. 1652 00:58:42,079 --> 00:58:44,309 >> Oppose. Same sign. This meeting is 1653 00:58:44,309 --> 00:58:44,319 » Oppose. Same sign. This meeting is 1654 00:58:44,319 --> 00:58:46,400 adjourned. We'll begin a regular meeting 1655 00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:50,119 around 6 p.m.