At this time, I'd like to call to order the special Joint Council, City Council,
and Tomal Economic Development Corporation meeting for August 21st,
2026. The time now is 100 pm. >> And at this time, I will call to order
the August 21st, 2026 special joint meeting of the Pal Economic Development
Corporation Board of Director Pal City Council. And it is called to order at 1
p.m. >> Right now, we're going to move to public
comments and receipt of petitions. At this time, anyone will be allowed to
speak on any matter other than personal matters or matters under litigation for
a length of time not to exceed 3 minutes.
No council or board discussion or action may take place on a matter until such
matter has been placed on the agenda and posted in accordance with a law GC551
spot 042. With no objection, consil council
remarks shall not be profane, vulgar, and abusive. if you guys already know
that and um no personal attacks will be tolerated. Thank you for your
cooperation. We have anybody that's wants to speak.
» Yes, sir. First one is Esther Marina. >> Marina, please give us your full name
and address, please. >> Esther Mera 515 Kane Street.
I remember the very first time I ever came to this council room to speak to
the council. It was the day the TDC brought in here their consultant from
New York to present their plan for the venue and the room was completely full.
The lobby was completely full. The people showed up to oppose that plan
because we love this town. And today I am here to say thank you. Thank you to
this council. Thank you for supporting and for voting down this development. We
are honored to have you as our representatives. I also remember that
first day when Lisa Coington was here acting simultaneously as the council
woman that she is and the president of the TDC. She said she sat there and then
she crossed over and argued at length in favor of the TDC's. How is this ethical?
It's like looking at a soccer game where the referee is also playing for one of
the teams. Will Lisa Coington finally recuse herself?
Last time I spoke here, I presented how the TDC has kept the community in the
dark to pursue its own agenda. Apparently, they didn't like that
because shortly afterward, the TDC expelled me from the community advisory
board. At the TDC, apparently free speech has consequences.
But the TDC has had its chance and it has failed. It has wasted hundreds of
thousands of community dollars on consultants. Its salaries and operating
costs are astronomical and it has repeatedly antagonize the community. I
want to acknowledge also that there are very honorable people, very honorable
people serving at the TDC boards and I have seen them become uncomfortable with
the course its leadership is taken. But the fact still remains that the TDC has
already developed virtually all the available land in Tumble and at this
point is just like a cancer with nowhere left to grow and now trying to consume
the very heart of Tombal. Tumble deserves better than that. Maybe it is
time to say goodbye to an organization that has become expensive,
untrustworthy, and deeply out of touch with the
community it is supposed to serve. And this is not just talk. 1,000 signatures
can put this on the ballot. 10,000 signatures. Tombal can easily do that.
The time has come to put the future of Tombal back where it belongs, in the
hands of this council and the people of Tombal. Thank you.
» Thank you. >> Do we have another person?
» Yeah. Next, we have John Reed. >> Mr. Reid, your name and address.
I know what it is. [laughter] Um,
I'm I'm uh stalling till I get my phone open. I'm John Reid uh 515 Kain Street.
Um, today I came here uh to thank the
council um for your position taken on the Legacy Square project going forward.
I appreciate it. You listen to the community and the community I know
appreciates being heard. I'd also like to thank the community. Um, there were a
lot of people who have been coming out here repeatedly spending their time
putting putting out their ideas for what should happen here and we don't all
agree but everyone deserves the right to be heard and I thank everybody. Um, I um
wanted to talk about investing in Tombball because that's sort of part of
the nature of this whole project and I think um the original uh the feasibility
study presented by Duncan Webb when he presented it he said uh there will be no
return on investment the it's not possible you have to raise the money to
do all this and then rent it. Um, that sounds rough. Uh, I say invest less,
have more fun, find out what the community wants. And I'm also here to
clear up a few things about makerpace and community centers because I've been
involved with them and I've gone to see them. Um, maker spaces, I'm not going to
say they make money because they're nonprofit, but they they build up money.
Uh the Maker Barn right up the street here has a 9month waiting list to get
in. And uh that should tell you that people are waiting nine months to pay
their dues. It's a viable, workable organization. Most community
centers are generate positive revenue. They're not supported by tax dollars.
Some are there. There are definitely some, but most not. Um, and the nice
thing about these things is that they can be um, evolved into what fits the
community the best. And I think that's what we're all really here hopefully to
talk about is how we're going to invest best in the community.
And this is an investment that kind of goes beyond economic de uh, investment.
And frankly, I think the economic investment of the previous grand plan is
bankruptcy. And I think that a much more modest plan
and a plan that invests in the community is a far better plan. It brings people
down here. Uh it gets them together. It lets retired people teach skills to
other people. It gives space for crafts, children's activities, artists, music,
all those things. >> Sir, that's your time.
» That's my time. >> Thank you, Mr.
» You get the idea. >> Thank you so much to everyone.
» Next, we have Kristen Hec.
» Name and address Hec. >> Oh, that's
» Kristen Hecra. Uh first and foremost, I do want to
sincerely thank the members of city council who have listened to the
residents and recognized the concern surrounding this project.
Um it does mean a lot when our elected officials actually listen to the people
they represent. Most of you have earned the respect you deserve.
As a lifetime resident who truly cares about preserving the character of
Tombbo, I do want to find ways for our community
to grow in a way that makes sense. I don't believe a large music hall
or additional parking lots are what Tombbo needs
really. I would much rather see green space that we have left and where
possible maybe even add more. We have spent countless dollars on studies and
plans prepared by people who in my opinion they don't have Tombbo's best
interest at heart. At this point, I question
really whether the TDC is serving the direction this community actually wants.
Really, in my opinion, the TDC has become irrelevant to Tombal's future,
and I will firmly stand behind a citizen petition to dissolve it completely.
As the founder and president of the Tombball Preservation Society, I would
personally love to develop or help develop a Tombbo heritage and
agricultural corner. if we turn this property into a community center uh or
an art market concept. Um Tombbo has such a rich history, you
guys, and from the railroad and agriculture to the oil boom that helped
shape our town. I think we have an opportunity to tell a story in a way
that is fun and meaningful for the next generation.
I love to see historic photographs and displays highlighting Tomba's oil,
railroad, farming, and ranching history alongside an interactive agricultural
area where children can learn about farm animals and where their food actually
comes from. We could involve our local FFA and 4H
students. They need that. Um, we need to allow them to bring animals and teach
children and families about different breeds of livestock, agriculture, and
the work that goes into raising them. This is really something I would
personally love to be involved with. Preservation isn't only about protecting
what is still standing. It's about making sure the next generation
understands where to came from. We don't need to turn turn to something else.
Let's invest in what makes Tombball Tombball. Thank you.
Next we have Kendall Wolf.
» Name and address
» Indel Wolf 504 Kain Street. >> Thank you.
» Thank you. Today I want to begin with something I
believe extremely is extremely important. saying thank you to those who
listened to the residents of Tombbo who heard our concerns and who took the time
to consider what this proposal would actually mean for the people who live
here and who ultimately voted against the Sorry, I lose my place. Okay, thank
you. You did not simply cast a vote. You demonstrated that the voices of the
residents still matter. And I want you to understand that your decision was
noted noticed. It mattered and it gave many of us a renewed sense of faith that
our elected officials can still listen to the people they represent.
Because this fight has never been about being against progress. It has never
been about being against homba and it certainly hasn't been about
being against the arts, entertainment or economic development. It is about what
kind of development belongs in this particular place. We are talking about a
historic part of downtown Tombbo. We are talking about a property with deep
historical and personal significance to families in this community. We are
talking about the former First Baptist Church property and the surrounding
neighborhood, not just an empty empty parcel of land sitting on the outside of
town. The proposal has consequences beyond what can be placed on a
presentation board. A large music venue brings traffic. It
brings parking demands. It brings noise. It br it changes the character of the
surrounding area. And when additional parking is proposed to accommodate that
development, the impact does not simply disappear,
it gets pushed outward into the surrounding community. This is why
residents had continued to speak. And that is why I'm asking this council not
to make persistence mistake persistence for opposition to progress. We are
present because we care about Tombbo.
When one person has leadership role in an in entity advancing or supporting a
development concept and simultaneously holds an elected position responsible
for considering matters involving that development, the public has every right
whether to ask to ask whether the pro process is sufficiently
independent and transparent. And even when every action is technically
permissible, the appearance of divided interests interests matters. Our local
government should not merely avoid actual conflicts. It should avoid
situations that cause residents to reasonably question whether they are
receiving an impartial prog process. This is not an attack. This is
accountability. And to those that have continued pushing this proposal despite
the overwhelming concerns raised by residents, I want to say this as plainly
and professionally as I possibly can. You are not entitled to our silence
simply because you disagree with us. You are not entitled to reshape a historic
neighborhood and then tell people who live there that they should simply
accept it. You are not entitled to call something community development while
disregarding the community when they tell you that they do not want that
particular development. >> Miss Wolf, that's your time. Thank you.
» Thank you, Miss L. >> Who do we have next?
» Next, we have Lisa Daniels. >> Miss Daniels. Name, address, all the
particulars. >> Yeah. Here. Um, Lisa Daniels, 403 EP
Street. I'm at the corner of North Oak in EPS. And my backyard is the backyard
of the metal building in the back. The um I don't forget what it's called, what
it's wants to be called. Anyway, I look at it every morning. Um, good afternoon
TDC and members of the Tombball City Council. I want to thank you for
listening to the residents who have expressed concerns about the proposed
development next to our homes. Your willingness to hear us and consider
other possibilities really shows that citizen involvement matters in Tombball.
For those living beside this property, these plans are more than drawings on
paper. These decisions will affect our home traffic safety, property values,
and quality of life. First, I want to state that I continue
to remain opposed to any large amplified music venue and the additional parking
lots needed to support it. That type of intensive use is not compatible with
established uh residential neighborhoods.
However, I do support development that benefits Tombal while respecting nearby
homes. A thoughtfully designed cultural arts venue in maker space could provide
opportunities for local artists, crafts people, students, families, and small
businesses. I hope the city will welcome formal proposals explaining how these
ideas could be brought to fruition. I also believe that a small portion of the
property could accommodate brick walk up town homes designed to complement
architecturally the surrounding area. This would generate additional property
tax revenue and would also create a base of residents who would regularly shop um
eat at the nearby restaurants and participate in events. Finally, please
consider uh making future meetings more accessible because some are held during
the workday and many residents cannot attend in person. My ask is that could
the city look into offering a team's meeting or another live video option
allowing residents to watch and provide comments remotely. Lastly, I believe
that thoughtful development and neighborhood protection do not have to
be opposing goals through collaboration, creativity, and public participation. I
believe we can achieve both. Thank you for your time, all of you, your service
to um Tombball community and consider continued consideration to the
residents, especially the ones most directly involved. Thank you.
» Thank you, Miss Daniels. >> Next, we have Victoria Hernandez.
» Name and address, please. Uh, Victoria Hernandez, 12715
High Drive in Tomball, Texas. Good afternoon, council members and
Tombball EDC. My name is Victoria and I am a Tomball resident and I'd like to
speak about Legacy Square. First, I'd like to make one thing very clear. I
absolutely love live music. Uh, live music actually shaped my early career.
I've worked in many venues oper many venue operations including White Oak
Music Hall in Houston. So I know firsthand the energy and economic
activity a great venue can provide a city. I I honestly do. But I also know
the realities that come with it. Traffic, parking, neighborhood concerns,
and the responsibility of balancing a destination with the people who call
this neighborhood a home. I'm not here to argue that a music venue
is a bad idea. It's not. We have plenty of them around.
I think those conversations are important, but I believe we're asking
the wrong question here in terms of what can we put into this church?
The better question is, what can we put here that creates the greatest return
for the city of Tombal? Because a handful of homes will benefit from will
benefit the families who live in them. A successful venue will benefit its
patrons and the businesses around it. But what if Legacy Square could do more?
What if it could be a creative and cultural center? A place where artists
can teach, students can learn, nonprofits can gather, entrepreneurs can
test ideas, and small businesses can showcase their
work. And neighbors have a reason to come together.
I say that as someone whose boots are actively on the ground already doing
this in Tombball. I live in Tombball. I play in Tombball. I work in Tombball. I
spend every penny here in Tombball. In spirit of that, I'm actually wearing a
Tombball ISD shirt because this morning I joined Pine Street Eats and Sweets
across the street as we gifted 115 breakfast sandwiches on fresh homemade
biscuits to welcome the teachers back to school. I don't say that for recogna
recognition. I say that because it demonstrates something very important.
The willingness to invest in one another is already here. What we lack is the
infrastructure that will help that spirit grow further. That's why I
believe creativity shouldn't be viewed simply as entertainment. It is our
economic infrastructure. A creative center doesn't have to compete with m
with music. Music can very well be a part of the infrastructure. Residential
development doesn't have to disappear from the conversation either. But Legacy
Square is a rare opportunity in the heart of our historic downtown. So I
hope we evaluate every proposal by one simple. Miss Hernandez, special time.
Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Hernandez.
» Next, we have Eric Sundon.
» Name and address, sir. >> Hi, I'm Eric Sundon. Um, I live about 20
minutes away, but it's actually Houston. Um, it's 15303 Parkville Drive, Houston.
Um, but I love Tombball. I love it more than Houston, that's for sure. So, I was
a member of the Da Vinci Gallery for 5 years and became the director and would
love to see another gallery in in Tombball. We have at the Tombow Art
League just about 150 artists and they're all anxious to get to a spot
where they can hang their art and sell it and show it. So, I think that uh
looking at Fellowship Hall and I I know it's not a revenue thing that you guys
are so concerned about, but we could take I'm connected to 200 artists. We
could put 200 artists in there for $50 a month and make $10,000 a month in that
space. I mean, as it stands right now. So, um, I wanted to mention that and
make sure that that everybody's aware that we're actively looking for a space
to land. We would love it. Tomball Art League um, goes out of Lonear College,
which is not, you know, not in the proper in the Tomball, Oldtown Tombball
that we want, but all of those artists would love to be in a spot tomorrow. I'm
telling you, they would love it. So, I just wanted to mention that. And also,
I'm finishing the first prototype street train and it's almost finished. So, so
I'm going to be parading that around so everybody can see it. So, anyway, thank
you very much. >> Thank you, Mr. Sundan.
» Is there anybody in the audience that didn't sign up that would like to speak?
» Yes, sir. name at F Street, right across the street from Lisa. Um, I'm just kind
of improving this. I'll make it quick. I've been a witness to a few
conversations. What I haven't heard anything about is the traffic in the
north side of uh on the north side of EP uh Main Street. I drive an F-150 pickup.
When I drive down my street, if there's a Honda Civic, one of us has to scoot
over and stop. And so, I just want to put that out there. you're bringing all
this foot traffic in and car traffic. You're going to have to widen the roads
and you're going to have to add sidewalks. So, I just want to put that
awareness out there. And uh I'll probably have more to say at the next
meeting, but that's all I got for now. Uh and also, I do want to ditto the uh
gratitude. I was at a meeting for the TEDC couple months ago. A lot of us
spoke and I feel like we were hurt. So, I just want to say thank you for that.
» Thank you. [clears throat] Is there anyone else that would like to
speak? No. Well, we'll move on to the next
item. Councilman Coington,
» do business consideration and possible action by Tombal EDC to approve the
Tombal Economic Development Corporation fiscal year 2026 2027 budget.
Right into the public hearing. Okay. The we will have a public hearing
on this item. The public hearing for this item will open at 1:23 p.m. The
board will now hear from anyone who would like to speak for or against the
proposed budget. If you'd like to speak, uh, please come
to the podium and state your name and address and you have three minutes.
Nope. Okay. Since there are no comments, then we're going to close the public
hearing at 1:24 PM.
» So EDC board. Is there a motion to approve the Tava Economic Development
Corporation fiscal year 2026 2027 budget?
» Motion. >> Second.
» Questions or comments? I will make a note there uh are three changes to this
budget based on the conversation that we had with council at the last meeting.
The first change is a reduction in the Legacy Square line item from 2 million
to 750,000. The second is a reduction in the South
Live Oak line item from 600,000 to 350,000
and then a removal of any funds for property acquisition. So those are the
three changes in this budget before you today. Thank you.
» Okay. So if there's no Thank you. Thank you for that, Kelly. If there's no more
comments or questions, then I'm going to call for the vote. All those in favor,
please say I. >> I.
» Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously.
The >> next item we're going to consider is
consideration and possible action by Tom Ball City Council to approve the Tomball
economic. >> I'm sorry, Mayor for Tim. We've got an
action by the city council to approve the Tom.
» That's where I'm going to now. >> Oh, I thought I'm sorry. on day three.
My bad. >> Yeah, I'm sorry.
» Okay, no worries. Uh consideration possible action by Tomball City Council
to approve the Tomball Economic Development Corporation fiscal year 2026
2027 budget. Is there a motion to approve the
Tomball Economic Development Corporation fiscal year 2026 2027 budget?
» Motion. Second
discussion. >> Do we need Lauren? Do we need to read
this or anything out loud so everybody can hear it or
» just go with it? >> You just go with it.
» She's posted on the internet for >> Yeah.
» days. But Lisa, the just like the lady didn't know that you can uh go on an
internet and watch every one of our meetings. There's people out there don't
understand that we can do that today. You can go on the internet. They post a
site so that you can see these meetings. I think you're I know I watch TEDC
meetings from my home. I don't attend them because I don't want to get a
quorum going. And you can watch our meetings every time we have one. It's
they're recording it right now. >> And that's one reason that we're so such
a stickler about people coming to the podium because if you're in the
audience, you can't hear. Uh oh. Well, definitely we need to but I
know that one of the speakers today asked about having Zoom or Teams
available since our meeting today is unfortunately scheduled at this time due
to very unfortunate circumstances. It was not intended to be during the
workday. It was supposed to be last Monday night at 9. Um
there were things that happened that none of us wanted. Um but what and you
can't but what we have not ever done is allowed public comments from that right
that's the difference >> correct well
» right >> yes correct
» suppose that could be discussed but people can submit them in advance if
they can't make it then they can submit it in advance and they'll be read into
the record >> and then they can still
» I would like to thank uh EDC Kelly Violet you guys for uh changing those
three items that we we had great discussions on property acquisitions and
obviously South Live Oak and Legacy Square. Um you're probably wondering why
we reduced the cost on all those or the appropriated amount. The purpose was
we're going to work closely together with each other to find out so that
we're both getting what we want. you the the citizens council and EDC and uh we
have agreed that they would come back to us with budget amendments for the
dollars so that we can in essence be in agreement on every expenditure made. So
we want to thank EDC for working with us on that
» one other thing. >> Yes sir.
You can go out for bids on your stuff, but I thought you had told me you don't
go out for bids that y'all do something else.
» We No, we've typically gone out for bids when we've done stuff. We don't we don't
have to follow the same procurement policy that the city does, but we
typically have just because of being more cautious.
» Okay. So, this demolition, >> you talk about RFPs.
» I'm talking about when we go out for de demolition, you can actually go to
multiple companies. >> We will do an RFQ for the demolition.
Yes. That's what I and then you >> and the and the council will see that
RFQ. >> That's what we were want to see. You
just answered my question. Thank you very much. Young lady,
» can I just clarify your question? Were you asking if the EDC goes out for RFQS
for large projects at all or if the EDC does it when there's no money in the
budget for it? I was under the impression that you
couldn't even go out for a bid, that you had to do something else because I'd
been told that some way and or it wouldn't have been in my mind. And so I
misunderstood something that was told to me.
» I I understood that also. I understood that too. I was told that.
» Still don't understand the question. Do you mean at all ever even when there's
plenty of money in the budget or you say >> I was told you cannot go out for a bid
that >> and everything and so was he? Yeah, I
was told that >> at a different time and so I
misunderstood the way it was stated, I guess.
» Okay, that would definitely not have come from anybody on the EDC board or
within the EDC. >> No, it come from Miss Kelly.
» So, don't make statements that you don't know.
» Are you talking like I said twice now?
» Councilman. Okay, guys. Councilman Parr, you have anything to add? Nope. No.
» Any >> Are you referring to RFQ versus a RFP?
Because there's there's a different process for both.
» Request for proposal versus request for quote
» qualifications. I apologize. >> I just know that when we were talking
about the getting the New York company, I asked why didn't we go out for bids
for that? And I was told we couldn't. >> Right. And that's the same thing he'd
been told in the past. >> Professional services is what you're
talking about. Professional services, you can go out for request for
qualifications. You can't go out for a request for a proposal based on the
actual um cost of the project. Same thing with with architects and
engineering services. It's the process is a RFQ, not an RFP.
» Yeah. >> Okay. Lauren,
» is that correct? That's what you were trying to explain to us for the meeting,
» correct? >> Okay.
» Okay, >> that's all I need to get clear.
» We're good. We're clear with that, everyone.
» Okay. Can we call for the vote?
I
» yours is down. >> Okay.
» Motion carried. Five. >> Thank you. We're going to move on to the
next item. Discussion and direction regarding the
Tombball Legacy Square project. So
to you guys >> for discussion
» I think >> I would well go ahead. I would like to
preface though that Monday night at council a directive was given from city
council to EDC. So
what we're going to I guess now listen to what you want to add to that.
» I I don't know that we would add anything.
» Yes sir. I think I think it's a clarification as to what exactly um was
meant by commence transition to multifunctional
uh facility that will also serve as a community center. So when we met
yesterday for 3 hours plus with our advisory committee, the question that
continued to circle was what exactly does that mean? What does it look like?
So what we want to do is define what the parameters are and we'll operate within
those parameters. So it doesn't mean that we're going to do a live music
music venue with ZZ Top and we're going to be overly concerned about
the the actual what's going to go on there, but we just want to set
parameters and understand what those parameters are. So with the with the six
motions that were made Monday night that we weren't present to actually discuss
» well >> had I been here
» can I can I clarify that though >> but I I was
» okay go ahead >> okay thanks
we were Friday when we had the meeting there was general conversation among the
whole city council it didn't appear that there was a consensus on Friday but
Monday We we only had we had a consensus and a written statement as to how we
would proceed without our input on Monday.
» Okay. But can I ask a show of hands on the EDC board that did have a consensus
with this list of six items? >> This wasn't this wasn't our list.
» No, I realize that. But per our discussion last Friday,
» that was that was not clear. There was multiple conversations going on on
Friday about different things that may or may not occur at the facility is what
I understood at Legacy School. >> Yes, sir. But I just want a show of
hands if the board agrees or disagrees with this list. If they agreed per our
conversation, >> I think we agree with some clarity.
That's all we're asking for is just clarity. That's
» So you do agree with these six bullet points. But but in order to go through
one through six, number one has to be answered first as to what building A
looks like, what does it contain, how do we operate it, because what you've asked
for is a a full P&L statement as to how we'd operate the facility. But if we
don't know what it looks like and what it's going to be and what we can and
can't operate there, it's really hard to come to those conclusions.
So I think we're all in agreement. A fine arts facility is acceptable. That
would be what we've discussed. But we don't want a live music venue with loud
noises. It was never going to be that. That's what a consultant came up with
and what others came up with. And that's been rejected by us. So fine arts
facility, Pearl Fincher Museum. Th this was rejected yesterday. Is that what
you're saying? >> Rejected as a live music venue of 800 to
a,000. that's been rejected for quite a while. So,
» okay. >> So, all we want is the opportunity to
present a plan to you with options and but just know what the parameters are in
building A. What can we operate, what we cannot operate so that we have a clear
path forward with that because we have a resolution from last July that says we
can operate it as a cultural and fine arts venue. So, but we need to kind of
get down to the nitty-gritty as to what that looks like, what's going to be
allowable, what's not. And ultimately, the discussion may be it's not viable
because we can't pull in the right operator to make it feasible for them.
If that's the case, then we need to kind of make a left turn or right turn and
figure out which way we need to go. and it may ultimately end up in the sale up.
The sale of it is going to have all kinds of future problems that are going
to domino because we can't sell it to a developer and give up 313 parking spaces
because they if they develop that, we're losing the parking. So, that's not
really a viable option either. So, we got to come up with a solution, but we
want an understanding as to what we can do there, what we can't, so we can work
on the rest of the direction that y'all presented to us. I guess that's the best
way. And I I'll turn it over to you if you got questions.
I think we were pretty clear that we wanted a event center that would also
double as the civic center or act as the community center, I'm sorry. And that's
why we were going back to EDC to see, okay, what functionality, what can we do
within those realms? We're pretty leaving it pretty wide. We want to
narrow it down. We've narrowed it down to that.
We've made it pretty clear we did not want a music venue to disturb all the
citizens there in this in that area. So what can we do within those
parameters to appease the citizens as well as the
council? So, I know I'm not being real clear and concise because I haven't sat
here and thought I mean, we've thrown a lot of things up against the wall, but
until we get dollars on it and figure out what we can, we don't we don't know.
That's why we're looking for your expertise. Well, but I think I think
Councilman, we can't determine what you want until you set the borders because
we could we could work this thing for a week and go over numbers and they may
all be for not. If we really don't know what we're trying to hone in to get to.
So, if you say no live music venue, we're not going to have a performing
company come in and lease the facility. So be it. Then we narrow the perspective
as to what we are going to have. The sweet spot for the for the facility will
be somewhere between 550 on the down floor, 150 on the upper floor as it
stands right now, 700 seats. If that's too much and we determine we need to
come down, then we need to know from you guys, are we going to come down to 600?
Are we going to come down to 500? There was a discussion yesterday, we bring it
down to 300. So the question is where do we go? What's viable for that? and then
what do we present to operators in order to get these the revenue stream and the
cost structure done. So that's what we're trying to do. There is a a a real
fine point in that if we go to 700 it's going to require additional parking.
Okay. If we do retail or something else in the back as well that's going to
expand the parking. If the facility is 500, 550, 600, we have adequate parking
right now that we can operate under. So those are the type of things we need to
do. Otherwise, we're going to spend a lot of time kind of graining through
numbers that aren't really going to be viable to the project.
So I guess what I'm asking for community center also just to comment I think on
September 21 we have a meeting with Harris County about the community center
over at the park. Is that correct? >> Correct.
» So if that goes forth as a community center, do we need another community
center in the middle of Tombball on a prime piece of real estate? Is that what
we want to do? Is that an excuse for that facility to put another community
center in? >> I'll hand that off to Mr. done again. He
knows how long our community center that's going in is not going to be our
community center and the park. It's going to be the counties.
» Correct. >> And so you have to schedule everything
to the county. >> So it's not ours.
» Okay. >> This one would be ours.
» Okay. >> Okay. When it comes to it, I don't want
to touch the upstairs of the because we're not going to build I don't think
we've got the money to put an elevator in and all like that and we don't want
to widen it to bring it out. I know there is the chamber. They've talked to
me. You know, they need a bigger space, but the that we don't need the parking
there. We don't need the additional parking. We need to take what we've got.
Danny, uh, and I I was told I mean, I read Facebook. I don't post on it, but I
was told that y'all even took a vote about tearing it down. There was a
motion about tearing it down. Is that true?
» There was a motion. It was never voted on,
» but was there a motion in a second? Yeah,
» I think it was out of frustration, frankly, because we've been there.
» That's good. I mean, I just want you to know
» that is something that could happen. >> It could happen.
» Yeah, I agree. But why don't we go small steps now and see what happens if a
community center and when I say an event center, I'm not talking about putting
musical, but have it where you could have You're already using it now for
some art, aren't you? >> Some theater,
» but they sing. They make >> But that's not what I'm talking you. The
music doesn't bother anybody. You can shut the music off in the building. Paul
knows. I know. We've got a music venue right beside us that we can't hear.
» I understood. >> As long as they keep the doors closed
and you have the set, you don't hear the music there. So, it's not that. It's the
parking, the lighting, all that stuff that will interrupt that neighborhood
that I can't vote for. Right. So, I'm trying to give you a directive right
now. I'm telling you that I want to keep it smaller than I don't want to do mess
with the addict. This is Dane. This is not the council talking. This is Dane
talking. This has been going on, you said for the last 6 months. No, it's
been going on for years about what's going to happen. You haven't been
involved in it. >> I have. 26 years. I was at that church
for 10 before I ever got on here. >> Well, I'm talking about what's going on
now. Wayne still sell it. Yeah. >> That it we got sold. How long did it
take y'all to sell that? It was eight years on the market before TDC bought.
» That's what I'm saying. So, nobody wants that.
» That's correct. So, we need to understand from you what we could build
because >> I'm telling you right now, not messing
with the ad the second floor. >> Yeah.
» Don't mess with it. Widen the stage. Take it back so you can have more area.
Flatten the floor out so you can do multiple things in it. That's what I
would do. I don't know what the council wants to do. I can't go talk to them.
Well, I'm glad I'm glad you're actually saying all of this because this is the
dialogue that we needed before we got the resolution or we would define this a
little bit. >> But that's what I would like to say.
» Okay. And I do listen to the citizens. I don't listen to the people that don't
live next to it, right? >> Cuz people that don't live next to it,
they can understand, oh, you can do anything you want to in it
» and make all the noise, all the parking, all that. But when you live next to
something, >> right,
» it makes a difference. And it's not like, you know, I use the example,
people come in and fuss and gripe when they move into next to an airport. Oh,
the airplanes, you need to shut them down. You need to shut up. These people
live there already and now we're trying to change it and we need to work around
those people. >> Understood. I I agree with that. Two
comments that you said community center in the back fellowship hall.
» No, I didn't say that. I said in the main hall.
» In the main hall. Okay. >> Yeah. Just like when it's real.
» I want to see something. I'd like to see individuals that that Mr. Reid talked
about go and see if they can make a maker's mark there. You've got other
offices. The mayor, she's not here right now, but she wants a uh m not a museum,
but archives. >> Archives. There's a room there that
could you could use that. We could tie it into the museum and make all that a
green area there. our her focus is just take baby steps. Let's don't throw we
can throw money all day long, but and then we're going to end up having to pay
for it. We don't want to do that. We want to take baby steps. Let it grow
naturally. If it grows, hey, we win. If it doesn't, then we can go to plan B,
but right now, let's take those baby steps.
» So, when we talk about the makers mark and whatever we're going to do in
building F, the north building. >> Yes, sir. If we're going to do that, one
of your cautisles here was the project will not be subsidized by the city nor
us. We don't want the liability, nor do we want to subsidize that.
» Correct. >> So, how do you turn that to where it's
profitable to where it's not just come another line item on our budget or we
have to come to you to say, "Hey, it cost us $250,000 to operate that."
is we we need to talk about that because if you don't want that liability, nor do
we want that liability. So, it needs to pay for itself somehow. So, is it a
community project or is it a revenue project? That's really what it boils
down to. And if it is a community project, then y'all vote on it and say
that just knowing that we're going to come back and it's going to have to be
subsidized or there's going to have to be grants or donations because we can't
have it both ways. We got to either have an income project or we got to have a
community project. It's got to be one or the other.
» Have we talked to anybody that would be willing to
form a committee or group to look at what it would do? Have we talked to
anybody like that? Have y'all talked to anybody like that? I know I haven't.
» I know. We have We've had preliminaries. We have uh Kelly and I've met with
Paradigm Construction. >> No, I'm not talking about the
demolition. I'm talking about the demolition,
» the maker mark or whatever you call the thing.
» No, no, we haven't gone through the space.
» I'm thinking about drinking right now >> because
» for, if you think about it, for a year we were going to be we were going to do
the whole project and then we got off in this studio $48 million,
» right? >> A complete BS plan. I agree with that.
That was before my time >> and I would have never accepted or
approved that. So, we got to get back down to brass tax. We're going to
operate from ground up, zero up, and we'll come back and appropriate as
needed. But we need some guidelines to what we can do and we can't do. Here's
the last thing I'm just going to add. If we don't go get an operator like a face
to where it's acceptable to them in in auditorium A, they are associated and
connected at the hip with Pearl Fincher. Finer comes back and says, "Oh, well,
you're not going to go forward with stu with a with face." venture might also
pull out because if we don't have a master plan for that whole project, it
may not be conducive to them to move that way. They're very interested right
now. Face is very interested, but we got to put the best step forward. What is it
going to look like overall? What are we going to go do on North Oxford or what
are our options on North Oxford? It might be JV with a development company
to put in makaker mark, retail space, professional services, coffee shops,
whatever it might be. >> And that's that's the third point,
right? >> Yeah.
» That's point three. Point A is determine what auditorium A is. Second one is
» go forward with the uh Pearl Fenture plan to either get a memo of
understanding or tenant agreement that we know they're going forward. And then
thirdly, it's determined best use for North Oxford F building.
» Right. >> I think that's where really where we're
what we're asking. >> Well, you keep bringing up options like
face. That's the first time I've ever heard that. So, we don't know anything
about these types of things you're bringing to the table. And until they're
presented to us, we can't guide either because we don't know what you're being
exposed to. >> Council, a year ago, we had an open
house at the fellowship hall. We had 230 people. If we gold starred everything
that was up there, the over overwhelming majority of people wanted a performing
arts center. Face is just one of the companies that's that's actually
approached us. It may not be the ones we end up going with, but they have shown
positivity in moving forward. It may not be the best deal for us. It may not be
the best deal for the city, but it's just one of those options that's out
there. when the word gets out that we've kind of got the parameters set how big
the auditorium is, they're going to put their numbers down on paper to see if
they can make it work for them because it's not just making us work. Remember,
we're not getting there's no revenue off of ticket sales to the EDC. All we're we
are just a tenant landlord combination. There's no overrides in those type of
things. So, we're only getting rental income for those developments and that's
it. Councilman McN, you have anything? Council, do you have anything to add?
» Um, I just want to agree with what Dne had to say. Um, if the parking that we
had there already, that's kind of where we draw where we determine our seats is
the parking we have, the the street access that we have, so we don't disturb
the residents over in that area. Um but yeah, it's a difficult decision because
it's when you buy any commercial building, you fix it up and you hope
someone will come will come lease that out and rent it out. So, um we can fix
it up and hope for the best, but we just we have to make a decision and talk to
the people that we have that may be interested to keep them in the loop
because we don't want to lose anything moving forward.
» I I would still like to see step one >> be the demolition of the buildings that
are not going to be used. cut the power off.
» We cut the any potential repairs or any >> aspect of having basically an abandoned
building sitting there. >> You're right. I think we got to take
those baby steps, keep moving forward. We don't know what's going to fall in
our laps. >> But if we do it, you know, we we don't
know either. So, we're looking for your guidance, but we know that's the first
step we want to take. >> And then we just don't know what else
will come along. And you start bringing these things to prof your face and all
that. Maybe things fall in place, but we don't know.
» Well, we we have someone National Youth Theater has reached out to us for a
February performance in the main auditorium. So, then we got to we got to
weigh this. >> Yeah.
» We want the $5,000 in revenue for that or do we want to go for with the demo
because it's going to affect that. So, we have to look at those type of things.
So, we're we're really at the crossroads to determine are we going to shut down
renting it because we're going to do the demo because we can't have both things
going on at the same time. So there's some tough decisions that's got to be
made. >> No, and I I agree those are those are
items that I think we need to discuss in the future once we start moving down the
road. But I think we all need to be in agreement that we've given a directive.
Let's move forward with it. And as these things come across, we we get we have
these discussions again to move to the next step. Garcia, uh council, we have
this entity that wants to rent this place in October. Do we really want to
start demolition right now? And those are tough decisions we're have to make
and but we don't know until those things we have contract potential contracts in
hand to do it or these people are just thinking about it. Does that make sense?
» It does. >> But we we need clarity on a
» okay for you on the fa the theater. Somebody was telling me when and again I
was wrong about the bidding so I'm probably wrong about this. um that these
theater companies want aerials where they can do aerials that cost a lot of
money to start bracing stuff up for that and everything. So is is that part of
the face deal that they're wanting aerials the theaters?
» I don't know that we've gotten to that point with them. It's going to be more
local and regional versus national. That was the whole studio red study which
reject reject reject. >> Okay. So that that's not part point part
point part point part point part point
part point part point part point part point part point part
» we we don't have the real estate to do that frankly completely changed the
footprint was going to have to be pushed out the back and the front just to
accommodate that. So I would say the answer is no
» and in order to do that we'd have for like a fly tower we'd have to cut the
roof and do a really expensive so and that was something that the feasibility
study recommended not to do. >> Okay. And when you talk about the stars
the gold stars were you there? I was the whole
» You notice how that some people took a handful of stars and stuck them all at
the same place? >> I I've already requested
to Kelly once we get the parameters set as to our direction between joint
counsel here that we have a second open house to get the feedback.
» I think that that >> and we give one star.
» We give them one star. You get a star going in if you use it or lose it.
That's it. >> That's fine with me. I'd go along with
that. We've done these open houses before and not just y'all. We had a
couple here and people would take and say, "Yeah, I want more restaurants or
more of this." >> It's called stuff in the box.
» Amen. >> Yeah.
» Right. >> Yeah. Well,
» I'm uh in the I like Mr. Par. We've already talked about this before that we
move forward with step one, >> the demolition. And then unless you guys
have know something we don't know why we can't, we move forward. That's your
first point. >> Demolition was step four.
» So >> yeah, but that's right. Boy, would they
aren't listed in the order that obviously we can't we have to do that
first. So >> okay, so I'm going to I'm going to set
one more parameter for you. We've got preliminary estimates for the
demolition, but the other estimate that we're probably going to come back and
tack on is to say if, and this is an if with quotation marks, if we were to
level North Oxford and start over on retail or whatever that space would be,
what would be the additional cost of that demo as well, just so we have it in
our pocket right now. >> Okay? because there may be some
economies of scale where we get more fencing, permitting, time, the whole
bit. It may not be the way we want to go, but I think we should look at as an
option. >> Yeah.
» Okay. >> Any questions? Any other questions?
» Lisa has got some call on. No, I was I was sorry.
um which is that I believe that since we're all here together and we have
everybody in the room that we should get more clarity on how the uh the main
sanctuary could double as a community center because what we've just spent the
last 10 15 minutes talking about is the EDC talking to various tenants for lack
of a better term who would come in and rent the facility and operate it. But if
it is doubling as a community center, then that means that now the city is a
tenant. So in order to talk to any potential operators, we need to have a
lot more clarity on what we would explain to them as well, you're also
going to need to share it with the city in these ways. And and that's confusing.
And sure, you know, we spent over an hour on that yesterday talking in
circles of well, let's just move forward. And then we kept saying, yeah,
but how do we do that with it being that community center? How do we do that with
it being a community center? And that's really a showstopper until we understand
better what that looks like because I don't know how it could be financially
viable for any operator if they're also having to give it up on a weekly basis
for Zumba and Bingo and AP presentations. Like it's it's it it's
got to have a balance. >> A community center would require a flat
floor. When when we look this afternoon, you'll see the slope.
» Yeah. So, the cost of just flattening the floor out may be prohibitive to do
that. That's why I brought up the community center possibly. We got lots
of square footage on North Oxford. That might be the better place to do it for
the community center because replacing the community center we had, even if we
doubled it, it's what 10,000 square feet.
» The current one, >> current community center is
» maybe 4,000. >> No, our community center. our community
center >> 3 4,000 maybe
» I doubt if it bad >> post
» stand by >> so let's just say if we've made it
12,000 we tripled the size of it >> right
» we've got almost 40,000 square feet on North Oxford that's already flat so it
lends itself to do the community center more so there on one end of the other
then restructure the floor which then would be a negative for performing arts
center. >> So that's that's where our dilemma is.
» Good point. A good idea. >> I think that's good points to talk
about, but these are things we've never talked about.
» We've never talked about >> I've never heard a cost on what
flattening floor because I would put a false floor in it
» is what I would do. >> I don't know structurally if we can uh
that I recall I think that that building was done in '92.
Um, >> that's when I was going there.
» Yeah. 92. But and so I don't know if there's peers under there. I don't know
structurally what it will or won't do. So we'll we'll look at it and see, but
we can get someone out to give us that estimate. That's really going to be the
left or the right turn. >> I think that's something we need to do
first is get a estimate because that could throw all this community center
out the door like you said. >> Well, I just think it relocates
» on the community center is we could do land swaps
» where we could do that. Yeah, sure. >> On the back part.
» Yeah. I don't I mean, we need a better community center than we have today.
» Sure. >> And I'm sure there's people they're
sitting here that would love to have our community center today to make
restaurants out of and to do that kind of stuff. Our
current community center is 4200 4,000 square feet
» of usable or that's of offices and everything.
» I think that's everything. >> That's everything.
» Yeah.
» Thank you. >> And this one here is 42,0002.
» No, but 4,000 4,200 versus 40,000. >> I was going to saying this is okay.
» 10 times. >> Okay.
And we agree that we do have directives out there. Now, we're going to go to the
next step, walk the place, decide, look at our negatives and positives,
determine what we can and can't do, and move forward from there.
» Absolutely. >> It'll get more clarity to everybody
involved. >> Can can I interject something real
quick? Uh, [clears throat]
at at what point in time do we determine what number are we willing to go in the
hole on this on? Cuz that's uh I'm one of the ones that voted to to demo this
thing. I don't think that's any secret. Uh cuz I'm all
» the banker. >> Yeah, cuz I'm all about if is it going
to make money because my understanding of the EDC is jobs, retention, and sales
tax. And every time I sit down and put
numbers to this to this project, it makes my head explode. Uh so when we're
talking about leveling the floor, not leveling the floor out, we're looking at
probably, and again, I don't know because we don't have bids, but roughly
going on averages what it costs to rehab a building. We're we're pushing $5
million to rehab this building. So, at what when are we going to say,
» you know, 8 million in this is enough or seven million is this is enough as as
the EDC board or and you guys are going to give approval. Are y'all okay with
us? Is the public okay with us going in a hole so deep with
money we get from sales tax that they're paying? At what point in time do we draw
the line and say this is all we're going to quote lose on this property that
we're never ever going to get back. Nobody's going to buy this, especially
if we have to subsidize it. >> Right.
» Uh the meeting yesterday, I was told and it was great news that the maker space,
not Mark, but maker space. It's a great com. I'm not against that. I have
absolutely and none nobody on this board. We have absolutely no vested
interest on what goes in here. You know, we had a meeting yesterday and
on Facebook I've been called inferred as being stupid, a onetrick pony.
» Help for idiot. >> Idiot shouldn't be on this board on
Facebook. I don't What is that about? Because I'm stating a position which is
not what he he didn't want to hear it. But we have to have that conversation
about how much money are we willing to dump into this project and never get
back. >> Well, what I'm keeps concerning me or
what I don't understand is we have had children's recital in there. Why can't
we continue to use those facilities for those kind of events and more events?
Why why can't we take baby steps? Why do we have to spend $5 million? We're
already having kids in there, so there must be structurally sound other than
liability to be crazy to have in the main art.
» But somebody just said, let's look at at flattening the floor. Why would you
flatten the floor if you're going to use useful for performing arts?
» Reiterate, it was not in the main sanctuary.
» It was not in the main sanctuary. >> It was
» It was in the main sanctuary. their Saturday event was.
» But the the thing is I I want to bring up one more thing on with Danny just so
that we're clear on this. Any project you look at, you have to look at the
exit strategy. Our deal is not to own assets long-term. It's to turn them
over, make a profit, or move on to the next project if it's viable. So if we've
spent 5 million in it, 4.6 acquisition, and whatever the cost of the consultants
are, we put another five in it. We're in at 10. just putting five in it. In three
to five years, if we wanted to get out and we haven't done a reno on that,
who's going to pay us $10 million for that piece of property?
There's nobody. They would have already bought it.
» That's right. >> That's why we want to take baby steps.
» But then we get drugged through the streets because we wasted taxpayers
money. >> I got it.
» That's coming. And I'm telling you right now,
» it's already been said. >> Yeah. But we're not wasting it. We we
have we have these we're not we have to get these feasibility studies. The guy
was from New York but he didn't say it was going to be he knew the area. He
knew it completely. It was 60,000 bucks. Did it help us? Probably not that much.
But it's something that we have to do by the guidelines that were set on by the
EDC. We can't just There's so many rules on this thing because it's our charter
that we can't just operate as a normal business. Our hands are tied on like
these bids. It sounds ridiculous to me that we can't bid something out by a
dollar amount. So, I just >> Councilwoman McNa, you had something to
say. >> It's It's getting confusing. I don't
even know what a flat floor. Why? You said a community center would have to
have a flat >> if if you were to go into any
auditorium, a convention center, you're going to have a flat floor to put tables
up, curtains, >> have some type of MC kind of like what's
the what's the place on 249? uh the theater like that. That's a flat floor
venue, right? Versus an auditorium that's got a slope, which you need for
people to be able to see the stage. There's other things you can do. If you
flat floor it, which means we'd have to build out the whole stage differently.
It's got to be raised or people can't see on a flat for venue to see a
performing arts. It's difficult. It's It becomes a bad hybrid is what it does. So
either or you have anything you want to add to that?
» Just that I feel like the council is not fully understanding the difficult
situation that these items are putting the EDC board and the EDC advisor the
legacy square advisory committee in because I sat there yesterday,
Councilman Parr sat there yesterday and listened. You know, we participated too,
but mostly listening to this this advisory committee work so
hard to try to develop something viable within the within the parameters of
these six motions that are are too vague. They are. I know you said you
want to leave it vague on purpose, but it it [clears throat] I mean that it was
just it was three hours of discussions and I watched this group try so hard. I
mean, every single bit of brain power brought into that room which was
enormous and everybody loves to ball and everybody wants the best and everybody
wants to listen to the residents, but we also have to make make money and
everything has to pay for itself. Nothing can operate unless it pays for
itself. Hands down. >> I don't mean it pays for itself because
it brings more tax dollars in. It has to pay for itself. That's it. And and and
it and it's just and it seems so simple. Oh, just take baby steps. It it seems so
simple and and we can just adjourn here today and go forward and try again and
just keep coming back. And that's an alternative and that's probably where
we're headed, right? It's just most most >> C
line item for this. >> I don't I disagree with that. I I think
we can get direction from you guys >> just by setting Shelley mentioned
parking's the hot spot. Traffic congestion's a hot spot. Councilman Parr
brought up there's things we could do for traffic and con congestion during
any type of performance over there. barricades, police, whatever we've got
to do to help the congestion to get people in and out of the the venue over
there, that can be done. But if we say it's 600, 600, that that right there
defines who we can go talk to, what we can and can't do there. I'll tell you,
Tomball pageant, Tomball, Miss Tombball Pageant, that's not big enough. So,
they're going to stay at at uh Real Life or they'll stay at Salem at other
venues. It's not big enough for them. So then we we got to just really kind of
pair down what we could and couldn't do in that facility. Then the the the
tenants become less limited. So that's really what we're facing. So
let let's let's first redefine bu number one building a main sanctuary
remove any reference to it being used as a community center because the cost to
flatten that floor are prohibitive. >> Yeah. But we don't know that right now.
Wait, >> we can do that.
» The I can the dollars that it's going to take to flatten that floor
» are absurd. Let's look at moving the the use of
building F >> the Oxford
using a portion of it as a community center
» and then the rest of it make it maker space or what whatever else you guys are
looking at doing with that that back space.
» I say we're flexible in that regards. But I just find it ironic once we issued
a directive Monday. Now we're getting all these ideas coming at us. Well, we
didn't have anything until we till we got a till we issued a directive. This
is what we want EDC to do. I >> I don't think we knew. I mean, for a
year we've been discussing this and it was going to be a community center, city
hall. Who knew? So, >> it's just the point that it's been
sitting there for so long. So the only thing council felt we need to give a
directive of what we want to get off the snide to have that facility start adding
money to the city's coffers. >> Well, the church only moved out last
year. Number one, the church has been in there since la till last year and the
CDC had set up a situation in which we thought we were going to get input and
that was at the strategic planning retreat. like we thought that so we we
have asked we we wanted this very much so
» how much revenue is Pearl Fenture bringing to us
» we don't know that was what >> how long's it been that y'all been
talking to Pearl Fenture >> they had a board meeting that was
delayed last month they had a board meeting that was delayed last month I
think it's due >> it's supposed to be in the next couple
of weeks >> because I mean this is I mean I've heard
Pearl Fenture for six eight months >> okay not us
» but they have a board that they have to address as well and so their strategic
IC planning session got moved back. That's what we were waiting on was was
feedback from their strategic planning session. I just heard back from their
executive director this week that it got pushed back.
» Can you explain to me what venture actually is going to be bringing
» as as far as monetary or >> rent the old chapel?
» What? Say that again. I'm sorry. >> Explain to me what they are supposed to
be putting into the old chapel. Pearl venture. So, it would be very similar to
what they have now. It it >> I've never been to.
» It's a It's a full fine arts museum. So, you you walk through different rooms.
You've got fine art on the wall. You've got sculptures. You've got different um
educational components. So, they have a lot of schools that come in and do
different things. They they do classes. They do different events.
» Small chapel's big enough for that. >> They're in about 4,000 square feet now.
So, our small chapel is about the same size.
» Okay. And you have no idea what kind of revenue they'd be.
» We we don't yet. No. >> The gentleman that was here a minute
ago, I think he's left already, the art guy, he was talking He was talking about
There he is. He's talking about $10,000 a month. Will Pearl Fincher be doing
something like that or a lot more? >> I I don't know. I don't want to speak
for them because the county would be involved in that. We We've talked about
hot funds and whatnot and I don't want to throw a number out and be completely
wrong. One other addition on the Pearl Fenture is they have expressed I met
with Kelly with Pearl Fenture. They they have expressed an interest to put in
some type of what would you call it a um banquet glass banquet hall on the back
of the chapel. So they would have a place to put um serving food and our
derves and have little fundraiser type things. That's one thing that they would
wanted us to consider because they can't do that in their current setting. But
there's >> they want us to put a more money into
it. >> It's not the us. They just wanted to
know if that would be considered. >> Well, that's what I'm saying. But there
if we'd consider putting more money into it,
» not necessarily our money, Councilman. What I'm saying is that they wanted to
know if there was enough room real estate to do that. And we said yes. When
we look today, you'll see it actually attaches right on the back of the
chapel. They currently don't have that uh option. So they're saying they would
bring money but we've never heard how many zeros are there. Okay.
» So we don't know yet. >> But they are very interested. But they
are like I mentioned earlier they were directly intertwined with the boards of
face. >> Some people serve on both boards.
» Okay. >> So it's a very sensitive and moving
conversation. So, it's possible that they wouldn't
want to be there without the other, one without the other.
» That hasn't come out yet, but it certainly could. That that the high
donation people and the hideboard people are actually on both in some cases.
» And we're talking about the 1949 and the sanctuary. So,
» which could be not bad news if we have someone who wants to lease out both and
we're good. And then we just talk about the fellowship Paul and what we're going
to do with that >> and the demo, right? and the demo. Yeah,
» but can we go and do the demo and get that out of the way?
» I think so. And make Yeah, >> thank you. I just
» I said that I agree with what you just >> But that's that's valuable information
you guys are giving us to I know we've had these conversations, but how close
are we really? Is it a reality? >> Or is this something we're going to be
sitting here in another six months and a year? Because I promise you, if we're
here next year again talking about this, it's these five people's fault. Okay?
It's our fault >> because we're not taking action.
» Figured himself too. That that's >> all five of us because we're just
sitting here. >> Here's the timeline. Here's the
timeline. We were supposed to meet in early May, got pushed to the end of May.
We met with them in June. They were supposed to have a board meeting in
July. Didn't occur. So now we're waiting on their August board meeting. So it's
not us. Kelly's reaching out to them. my tapper every week about it saying, "Hey,
find out where they are. Find out where they are because I want to know what the
dollars are, too." Because it's either out of their pocket or out of our
pocket. Do we really want to do that? >> Yeah.
» So, and if the county's bringing money to help, which is what we've heard, then
that's even a better deal. But there's always there may be caveats attached to
that. We don't know what those look like yet either. So, we so we're we're trying
to go down that road and provide you that information. We just don't have it
all yet, but we're trying.
I I move or I think the thought process I think we made good headway here but
until we start eliminating some items go look at it understand more what you guys
want to do that we table this for another discussion to further you know
dive into >> direction to move forward with tearing
down the building >> well I thought we had done yeah we've
already agreed to do that I thought we did that last week
» as long as long as it's captured up here that the direction just move forward
with tearing down the building. >> Correct.
» Got the >> And I agree.
» And no, you know, of any shape, size, or form, right? No, no, no live music.
» You you know there's >> Would you say live music?
» Building B, building E, building >> choir in there.
» Yeah. I'm talking about >> I'm talking about bringing in
» an act. >> Yeah,
» that's huge because the whole time I've been on the board, it's been live music.
Live music live music. >> Hold up. Let's Let's stop real. I I just
want a show of hands. Who wants to start with the demolition cuz I want it just
completely transparent. Okay. >> Thank you.
» Can we also agree that we're going to try and pinpoint 600 to 650 depending on
what the what the buildout looks like. I >> I don't think we can make that judgment
call right now. >> I definitely don't want to make that
judgment call. >> Okay.
» Not at this time. >> No.
» About the number of people, >> right?
» Yeah. Right. cuz I don't want to add parking.
» No, but we said the 600 doesn't require adding parking.
» 75. >> Okay. So, do 500 or less.
» It's a it's a it's a balance. And each each space has to kind of park itself.
So, the the parking requirement for the main sanctuary is one parking space per
four seats. That's at its current capacity, it's 175 stalls. We have 313
stalls out there today. So without doing like that area where the playground was
without turning that into more parking, if we left the parking the way it is
today, you could keep the 700 seats. What that reduces is the amount of
square footage that you have that's leasable in the fellowship hall. So, it
reduces it down to about 23,000 ft² versus about 32,000 ft² to keep all the
parking in the existing parking lots and spaces as they are today without adding
anything. >> Yeah, the the analysis you did and and
gave to us uh just on >> and and thank you for doing that.
And just so the uh public knows, we have requested that they commence plans for
parking lot in which is behind the depot so that it takes some of that congestion
away from that area and just to find out if that helps with everything to
alleviate that congestion. So we are working on that too.
I have a it's more of a it's not a technical question or or wanted to hear
from I feel like I do that on the board but this has been a really productive
conversation and I think that conversations like this need to happen
probably more often to to so everyone can
continue to be on the same page because from what I'm understanding it seems
there's been a lot of work that's been done from from Wayne from from the
advisory committee that hasn't been communicated to council. Um and I'm
wondering how we can better the better the communication between the board and
council so that you all aren't hearing the things for the first time or if you
are it's it's not you know six months after those conversations have happened.
So wanted to throw out the possibility of meeting join jointly meeting with
these two bodies more often. I'm not not suggesting every single month, but once
once a quarter, once every six months, something like that. Just so that we all
continue to stay on the same page and that no one's surprised by anything. I
know there's a lot of stuff. I know there's a lot of things that have that
that time people's time and this is a lot of time to be spent on this, but
this reporting to the public, we all want to get be sure that we get it
right. [clears throat] >> Okay. Ju just to clarify, we had two
city council people in the advisory committee that have been on there since
we formed it. So both both Lisa >> Danny was on there. He had to step away
for a while. Lisa filled that spot, but Ry's been on there the whole time as
well. So we have had council people on there. I think the big misnomer in the
whole project from the get-go was we had a consultant that completely blew this
thing out of the water and it was like the Titanic going down and it set off
all the bells and whistles and it was a reject from the minute I stepped on in
May of 25. Wasn't going that way. Was not going to get approved. So that's and
I I've said it before I think three meetings back and I said it at strategic
planning. We have hit the reset button. We're all on board to go from a groundup
approach, but we just need the parameters to we're not out going with
six different versions of this. Let's narrow the scope down to where it's two
or three versions that we can all get our hands around and kind of go forward
with that. I know one of the main issues was we're being very selective with our
words because one of our main concerns is that we say we're okay with something
and now we're having events till 10:00 every weekend because it's called some
kind of a recital and now we've got this problem to deal with because I guarantee
you the citizens are going to come to city hall to hammer the council not EDC
» and we need to make sure their voice is heard and that we don't allow allow
whatever we want to call this event and it's every weekend at 10:00
» but it's within our parameters. You see what I'm getting at?
» I I I I think some of the issues because most of it's going to revolve around
traffic. >> I think some of those issues could be
mitigated through barricading streets that lead in through the residential
areas and and push everything out toward Main Street down two streets. Well, I
don't know if the citizens would like that either. You know, that restricts
their in and out. >> That's
two streets that have very few residential buildings left on
them. They're all They've all been converted to a um
» retail >> commercial.
Pine Street would be one.
» I'm trying to remember what the next one to the Oak.
So you would block off all the ones come off.
» We we would block the street. We would block the streets.
» We're going to pay the city to do that. >> Yeah. I mean we we do it for German
fest. >> Yeah. But
» I don't like I'm not gonna go for it. >> I don't like that idea.
» I don't like that at all. >> Councilwoman Mna. Yeah. That be one way
to mitigate the issue. >> Yeah. That and even like EP Street right
there. Y'all know one car. >> That's right. It's it's a I don't know
if we could do oneway streets just >> was talking about his truck. It's a dy.
» You have to get over right. You do even if somebody's walking
that's that needs to be looked at that traffic oneway street something. Even if
we didn't have a place that that street's pretty small.
» And then you got to realize too when you start doing that the lighting has got to
change there. >> Yeah. You've got to start talking about
the cost of lighting that parking lots up and the walking the sidewalks you've
got to build to do it so you can walk. You're talking about adding cost to the
city now that we can't afford. And the the lighting, it's got to be
done if you're going to right now. They don't have to light it up because nobody
meets at night. They're very church only did. The parking lots do have parking
lot lighting. >> Not enough lighting.
» Not enough. But there is lighting. >> Add lights. And you can call them what
are they night something or where >> like the dark sky.
» Dark sky. That's the word. It don't work.
» My whole backyard's lit up right now where I can walk outside anytime and see
anything. I want >> dark sky light.
» You got that right. >> I've seen those dark skylights. They go
straight down. I bet their dark sky lights aren't the good ones. Maybe. I
don't know. I haven't been over there. I hardly even
» I figured you knew what kind they were. >> All right. I think we've had really good
discussion here. I want to table this conversation for a future period so we
can nail down some more items so we can be a little bit more selective on the
our direction on what we want to do. I think we have a good parameter of what
we're looking at wanting to do. Uh we've got at least a list that we can start
from and move forward. But I I think we need to just stick to our guns and move
forward. And I just don't want to be talking about this again next year.
» May I ask what? So if we did decide that we're going to move forward with a
demolition, is that mean we're going to move forward
with some quotes, >> right? That's what
» they're going to get some quotes on that demolition.
» Okay. >> Yeah. They they've already got at least
a parameter of about a half million dollars to tear it down. and that's what
we put in the budget form. >> Okay.
» Okay. Any other discussion?
Thank everyone for coming out. I hope we answered a lot of the public's questions
and feel free anytime to reach out and we'll tell you what we know. Thank you
so much. >> Is there a motion to adjurnn the EDC?
» All those in favor? >> Is there a motion to adjurnn?
» She did already did it.
I don't have to do it again.
» The meeting is a