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The council time available, October 27th, at 5 p.m. to order, and look for a motion to adopt the agenda as circulated.

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Second.

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Recording in progress.

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All in favor?

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Motion carried.

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At the end of council business, public will be provided an opportunity to address council during public question period.

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Questions must be restricted to items that are on the current agenda, and each question must be limited to two minutes.

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And water matters. Move right into the capital operating budget.

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CFO.

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Thank you, Your Worship.

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Solanely, Council is required to develop a five-year financial plan.

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This year it goes from 26 to 23, which includes both operating and capital.

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With respect to utility rate bylaws, which were water, sewer, and parcel taxes,

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those need to be adopted before December 31st.

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So the report that's in your package, and I've got a PowerPoint

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summarizes the operating and capital expenditures, utility rates proposed

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for Rado and Sula over the 26 to 30 period and so purposes to inform counsel seek feedback

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before returning to a future council meeting with

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draft utility rate with a draft utility rate bylaw for counsel to review.

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So we jump into the PowerPoint.

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So the agenda and I think that the slides might we'll see how they go. I think two are inverted, but I've got review of the 2025 projects just to give council an update on where we are with 2025.

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What's projected to carry forward into 2026 and this will likely change between now and year end because stuff happens in projects that we thought we're going to start and complete might be delayed.

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but right now this is the projected carry-forward going to the budget

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principles and then dive into the sewer capital budget operating budget then

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move over to water and then talk about the the rate increases what the reserves

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look like and did some comparison with where everyone sits as of today this

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isn't what's being proposed sort of across the region but at least you can

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and see kind of where the rates sit as of today.

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And then the timeline going forward.

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So budget principles,

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we didn't change these from last year.

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So water and sealers should be borne

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by the users of the service

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and not subsidized by general property taxes.

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We treat the water as one water service.

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So that means the residential

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as well as the non-farm and irrigation,

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It's treated as one water service.

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Rates should be set to ensure adequate reserves.

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Should anticipated expenses come forward.

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And should we have a grant opportunity present itself, we have our cost share set aside in the bank.

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We try to compare our rates to local communities that are similarly sized.

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And then, of course, maintenance of service continuity and public safety should underlie proposed capital and operating expenditures.

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That should be what's driving us when we prepare the budget.

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The ranking, we haven't changed any of that, so I won't go through that slide in detail.

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But we rank projects from P1 all the way through to P5.

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The P1 are the critical ones that Director of Operations feels is, you know, we need to do.

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And then it goes downward from there. So, 2025, these are all the water and sewer projects.

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I just put them all onto one slide and I just highlighted the ones that are being carried

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forward. There's another slide that shows you them. But you can see pretty ambitious plan

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this year was 2.8 million rounding up in terms of capital expenditures on water and sewer.

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We're not quite there yet and there'll be some carryover from this, but these are the projects

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that Public Works has undertaken during 2025.

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And I'm happy if there's any questions to

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tell us what that is. It's probably going to come on the next slide. I notice the

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The difference between the numbers on this slide and the next slide, and I wonder what the reason was.

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It shows a carryover topping, like pollination, life cycle upgrades, 695,000.

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Very popular truth flow meter, 30,000, but on the next slide, one is 500,000 and the other one is 10,000.

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Through the Mayor to Councillor Mattis, I think this slide is showing the budget.

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And then the actual on the next side is where they what they think they'll be out at the end of the year so with topping

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I know

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Directive operations feels probably 500 will be left to carry forward in the in the next year

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So it's probably just a timing

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Yes

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Through the mayor to council as yeah, we've we've actually just shut down talking today

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So we've ordered the pumps. We've got some materials and things like that

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But we'll be starting the decommission of everything over the next three months on our end

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And then the electricals will be

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Starting in February completed in March back up and running in April

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So we had to wait till the end of the season to do all of this work until the station was shut down

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This

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is the slide that we're referring to

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So those are just the cave amount I'm carrying over into the next year

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And those numbers are fluid.

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They might change depending on what bills come in and what public works can get accomplished.

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So the 26 to 30 sewer projects are here.

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And this year what I focused on in terms of the detail, you see all the projects here for the five years,

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that I focused on the coming slides on just 2026 because I always think that's probably the most relevant

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and because that's what we base the rates on for this year.

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So I sort of zoom in on those,

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but if there's any of the projects that are on this list,

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the other attachment that was in your package

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has all the projects for water and sewer

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in numerical order.

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And so we can bounce back and forth.

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If you said in 2028,

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can you tell me more about project X,

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Director of Operations would be able to speak to things,

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but I didn't want to take you through five years

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worth of projects, project by project at this point.

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But this is the whole university.

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You can see the six million over five years on sewer,

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but for 2026, we're proposing 1.7 million.

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And on the overhead,

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You can see where the priority was set and then where the proposed funding sources and that funding source can can vary as well because we haven't you know

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We have several sources of funding with the town, but this is just what's proposed at this point

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So for the sewer projects for 2026 these are the four big ones that are on the

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the docket so snow coming Avenue and

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And it's 447,000 Main Street veterans to school is 170,000.

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Those are both funded by grants.

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We have the grant application in for some welcoming.

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So we're waiting.

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I'm not sure what the timeline is when we're here,

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whether we were successful,

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but I know there's a lot of interest in those grants.

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So we'll be competing against all the other municipalities

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in the regional districts.

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So, but I always expect we're going to get something.

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It's just how much will be for us.

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The two coming out of the capital fund are upgrading the compactor room

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and then the high lift upgrade.

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There was a 408,715.

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I circled the two P1 projects just because I put risk to service continuity

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just because whenever I see a P1 project,

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project because those are ranked by public works as critical and we're doing them subject

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to grant right now, so if we don't get the grant, we can't do the project and then I

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worry because it's rated critical. So I just put that as an alert through the mail to

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wouldn't that trigger something like debt?

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Exactly.

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And that's, yeah, we'll have to find another source.

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We have kind of three, if you think of,

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we have grants that are coming that are in play right now.

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We have debt, which we can borrow.

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And then we still have money in community works fund

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and growing communities fund.

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So we have a few options.

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It's not that we don't have options.

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it's just those are all difficult trade-offs because I know you never know

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what's coming in terms of you know a large project that the town might want

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to undertake but we do have options I just put it as a concern because it's

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not you know it's not it's getting done subject to changing something.

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Yeah thank you just for clarity those where it says funding source the grants

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grants are possible, we might be good in grants, but we haven't been really secure in all the

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projects.

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That's correct.

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Thank you, Rishabh.

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So what is the process then, because these are slated for 2026, so obviously if we prove

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the budget, we want these to go ahead.

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So if we don't get the grants, do you come back to us to look at alternatives right away

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and see how we can move it forward?

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I'm through the matter to answer.

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We have that option. We can come back and say the grant didn't come in.

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We can do the project by going into the, say, fall borrowing for debt or taking it out of the two funds that I mentioned.

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You can do that sort of at the time we find out or you could do it during the budget process to say,

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well, we want this to go through this fund, but if we get the grant, cancel that.

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that you could do it prospectively so it doesn't have to come back to council. Either way would

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work.

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I think it would be important to do that now. I think that if these are priority one, we

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should have a backup plan in place if the grants don't come through. If we do feel like these

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need to happen in 2026. I don't know what the rest of council thinks about that.

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I think these projects have been put off for a few years already and I'm not sure one more year is the right answer either, but if necessary that is an option.

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I totally agree that we should have another plan in place, but we haven't done that in the past, doesn't mean we shouldn't do it in the future.

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I don't know how long have these projects been on the books, how long have we had the engineering finished on these?

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Two years.

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Yeah, so we've done this. We've pushed them off for at least two years.

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I also just add that we need to see what water carries in the old forest as well.

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Sorry, we need to see what?

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We need to see what the water capital has in the store for us as well,

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because I doubt everything there is funded either.

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Councillor Matys?

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I want to make a little, maybe it's there somewhere.

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What is, we're spending $1.74 on capital this year.

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What can we spend last year?

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A boat.

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I have to get back to you on that. It wasn't much dissimilar. Just let me look here.

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Through the mirror, I just want to add a note to those two projects have a very large impact with water and road work as well.

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As we know, this is Milka Mean Project's 2.7 million. The Main Street Project is 3 million plus.

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So there's a monstrous impact, not just sanitary,

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to those two projects as far as dollars go.

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And the mayor's right as when we look at the water,

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kind of where we're at with what we're looking at

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for those projects this year.

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Didn't include the water in those two,

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not thinking that we'd be moving forward

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with those two major projects.

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Water will reflect sort of four P1s

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that we consider our must do

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And so Comaine and Main Street are not part of that water, so just just wanted to point that out and keep that in mind

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you might be draining a fund without realizing that we're draining a fund if we don't get

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three grants in a row or something like that.

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So to me it makes more sense to have the conversation again.

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So Mattis?

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In a lot of these projects that I've read through, there's also a component of drainage

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that we talked about, storm surge and that sort of thing, and given that probably the

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sewer system runs 24-7, it's difficult to scope, but do we have the capability

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or is there anything in our budgeting to do some scoping on some of our water lines to see just how

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bad they are? You know, we felt that that was a mistake that we made on one of our other projects

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and similar with our drainage. Can we, in the dry season, should we not be scoping those

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and take a look at what is the condition of it, but maybe we don't need to replace them yet?

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Through your worship to Councillor Matys. So you're referring

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Time to camera the domestic water lines.

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Water and drainage and sewer, if possible.

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Yeah, so there was a comprehensive program done in 2016 to assess a ton of these sanitary sewer projects are part of that, essentially, and what was found in cameraing that.

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It's very easy to camera storm and sanitary. A little bit more difficult.

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So I had basically $200,000 next year in investigating the secondary reservoir feed.

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That's just that one water main.

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We're looking at a couple hundred thousand dollars just to investigate that, and that's about a kilometer long.

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Basically, you have to cut into that water main.

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You have to camera it, disinfect it, get it back online, repair it.

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It's very difficult compared to storm and sanitary.

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They have access points.

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They have manholes and they're gravity mains.

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So it's not full pipe, it's not full pressure,

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and then obviously all of the disinfection requirements

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with the domestic mains.

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There's very few companies that do it.

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There's a lot of different ways

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to analyze pipe thickness and stuff.

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There's a lot of new technology coming out.

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I don't think it's really perfected yet,

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but you can put like sauna balls down a hydrant kind of thing

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and kind of shoot it through your system.

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It gives you some data,

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but it's not video documentation.

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It gives you pipe thicknesses

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and maybe deficiencies in your main.

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Nothing's really perfected as of yet.

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The biggest thing, the company that,

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well, the process that I would like to do

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is be prepared when we do do those investigations,

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be prepared to actually line the pipe.

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You know, like go through, spend the money

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to actually investigate it.

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So say it's a million dollar project,

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we spend the $200,000 to cut into the pipe,

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to video the pipe, which is part of the process

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of sift lining.

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And if the pipe is that deteriorated,

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Well, you have everything down open cut into not disinfected again all of that

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You actually line the pipe complete the project because we got we got that other project done in actually two weeks for 900 meters

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So that's kind of the process on the water means it's just it's very difficult to do you know

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00:17:06,180 --> 00:17:09,180
The technology isn't really there and they're always full they're always running

233
00:17:19,660 --> 00:17:23,000
I should determine the condition before we say we need to replace it.

234
00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:36,520
The, through the Merida Councilor Mattis, the 2025 budget for sewer was $938,000.

235
00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:41,540
It's what we budgeted, $938,000 going up to 1.7 this year.

236
00:17:49,140 --> 00:17:53,500
This is the Smokamine Avenue sheet, and this is just a sheet you would have seen in your

237
00:17:53,500 --> 00:17:57,220
PDF package with all the projects listed numerically.

238
00:18:03,370 --> 00:18:06,190
This is Main Street on the sewer side.

239
00:18:06,190 --> 00:18:06,970
This

240
00:18:13,180 --> 00:18:15,020
is the rationale for the compactor upgrade.

241
00:18:19,740 --> 00:18:23,480
I'm not sure what year our equipment is, but they don't make parts for it anymore.

242
00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:26,560
So I imagine it's quite...

243
00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:28,680
I can give a bit of an update to that as well.

244
00:18:30,420 --> 00:18:33,200
So the compactor was installed in 2011.

245
00:18:34,660 --> 00:18:36,740
Unfortunately, they don't make parts for it anymore.

246
00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:39,400
They're on the third generation of the compactor.

247
00:18:39,860 --> 00:18:43,320
They can fabricate them at a very, very expensive price,

248
00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:48,580
and just the one sort of part and it would take months to do that. We have some issues

249
00:18:48,580 --> 00:18:53,700
as well with the MCC and the PLC and communications and stuff like that that we would be redoing

250
00:18:53,700 --> 00:18:59,360
with the compactor. But the compactor is basically what takes all of the sewer solids. So it

251
00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:04,760
compacts that down, puts it through like a corkscrew and we actually bag that, put

252
00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:09,100
it in the garbage bins and take it to the landfill every week. So that compactor is

253
00:19:09,100 --> 00:19:14,060
a major part of our sewer system on how we deal with the solids that come in to public

254
00:19:14,060 --> 00:19:14,340
works.

255
00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:25,180
The next project is the high lift upgrade.

256
00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:26,000
I

257
00:19:28,300 --> 00:19:30,540
can add to that one too, Mayor.

258
00:19:31,740 --> 00:19:33,860
So it was constructed in 1983.

259
00:19:34,940 --> 00:19:35,880
It's 42 years old.

260
00:19:36,620 --> 00:19:41,240
The existing equipment is at the end of life at the risk of failure that includes

261
00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:45,560
the control panel, the PLC and the HMI and the power supply components and the motor

262
00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:48,700
or starter contactors and associated equipment

263
00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:52,580
to prevent excessive emergency service costs

264
00:19:52,580 --> 00:19:53,760
due to failure of equipment,

265
00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:56,380
provide redundancy by upgrading the system

266
00:19:56,380 --> 00:19:59,480
with capabilities of connecting a backup power generator

267
00:20:00,060 --> 00:20:02,140
and reduce operating costs by the installation

268
00:20:02,140 --> 00:20:04,240
of energy efficient VFDs as well.

269
00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:06,360
So what we're looking to do is a complete upgrade to that.

270
00:20:08,180 --> 00:20:11,880
The transfer switch for the new actually water gen set.

271
00:20:12,860 --> 00:20:14,400
The reason we put that in as one

272
00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:16,220
one is the critical piece of infrastructure.

273
00:20:16,460 --> 00:20:19,520
Public Works, we only have two days of effluent storage

274
00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:20,940
before we have to pump up to topping.

275
00:20:21,420 --> 00:20:22,420
That's what this pump does.

276
00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:24,600
It pumps the effluent up to topping

277
00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:25,800
into the aeration ponds.

278
00:20:26,860 --> 00:20:28,280
So without this running,

279
00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:29,780
we only have two days storage before

280
00:20:29,780 --> 00:20:31,700
we have some major, major issues

281
00:20:31,700 --> 00:20:33,460
and try and figure out how we get it

282
00:20:33,460 --> 00:20:34,400
from here up to topping.

283
00:20:35,140 --> 00:20:39,080
That backup gen set that we just got last week, actually,

284
00:20:39,540 --> 00:20:40,880
for the water backup,

285
00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:48,020
up. It actually will power this while we dismantle everything. So it will actually be pumping

286
00:20:48,020 --> 00:20:52,420
everything for us every couple of days up to topping and keep for the couple of months

287
00:20:52,420 --> 00:20:56,520
that all of this work takes will actually be powering that station for us and keeping

288
00:20:56,520 --> 00:21:00,860
everything running and up to speed. So that gives you a little bit more explanation on

289
00:21:00,860 --> 00:21:01,120
that one.

290
00:21:16,290 --> 00:21:19,370
Well, I thought Council Madison was putting his hand up.

291
00:21:19,910 --> 00:21:24,210
Well, I was tempted to ask a question here. I'm just trying to find if it's

292
00:21:24,210 --> 00:21:25,950
It's actually there, oh, there it is.

293
00:21:27,050 --> 00:21:27,550
Yeah,

294
00:21:31,670 --> 00:21:32,070
question?

295
00:21:35,730 --> 00:21:36,290
We'll continue.

296
00:21:38,370 --> 00:21:39,990
I was also going to mention this,

297
00:21:40,090 --> 00:21:40,710
the milk and meat avenue,

298
00:21:40,910 --> 00:21:44,770
where obviously that's tied to the housing initiative

299
00:21:44,770 --> 00:21:46,530
to be able to open up more capacity

300
00:21:46,530 --> 00:21:52,430
to do for buildings on a lot.

301
00:21:52,770 --> 00:21:55,810
So that's the other kind of key piece of that project.

302
00:22:00,490 --> 00:22:02,770
So this is the operating budget for 2026.

303
00:22:04,390 --> 00:22:09,010
I just put the no at the bottom because someone will look at that and say, well, two million

304
00:22:09,010 --> 00:22:13,670
in revenue and 2.2 million in expenses, you're running a deficit, but we really aren't.

305
00:22:13,730 --> 00:22:17,750
If you add back the depreciation, which is non-cash, it's balanced.

306
00:22:19,110 --> 00:22:25,450
And you can see the transfer to reserve that we're budgeting 772 compared to 613 last

307
00:22:25,450 --> 00:22:25,770
year.

308
00:22:25,870 --> 00:22:33,010
And you can kind of see over the four years what we've put into reserves each

309
00:22:33,010 --> 00:22:33,310
year.

310
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:43,820
The operating budget was built based on status quo staffing just for

311
00:22:43,820 --> 00:22:50,600
council's information, no proposed staffing changes to the service and we've

312
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:54,660
budgeted in the collective agreement increase that's kicking in January 1st

313
00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,380
which this year is 3%. This

314
00:23:01,930 --> 00:23:06,510
is our initial proposal for sewer rates for

315
00:23:06,510 --> 00:23:15,910
We're going over the five years, so you can see we have 7% budgeted for 2026, 11% in 2027

316
00:23:15,910 --> 00:23:18,010
proposed, and then going through percent.

317
00:23:18,430 --> 00:23:22,410
And you can see the reserve balance, if you look at the fourth line capital reserve,

318
00:23:22,790 --> 00:23:29,970
we dropped down to 11,000 in reserves, then up to 16, then it gets better, and if you

319
00:23:29,970 --> 00:23:35,090
look at 29 and 2030, you'd say, wow, we're 1.1 and 1.2, they're quite healthy, but

320
00:23:35,090 --> 00:23:41,730
But the reason why that is, is what drives the source of funds for capital projects.

321
00:23:42,050 --> 00:23:49,030
So in the box you can see in 29 and 30, those are overstated because we're relying on grant

322
00:23:49,030 --> 00:23:49,370
funding.

323
00:23:50,230 --> 00:23:54,770
There were critical projects in 27 and 28 that were marked P1.

324
00:23:55,310 --> 00:24:01,350
And if I put those to come out of the capital fund, then we would drive the reserve

325
00:24:01,350 --> 00:24:02,470
into a negative balance.

326
00:24:02,470 --> 00:24:09,470
So, didn't put them in under capital, but of course then that makes it look like you have more capital left.

327
00:24:09,690 --> 00:24:15,910
I mean the other thing which I think Councillor Mattis mentioned, you can always defer a project later on.

328
00:24:16,010 --> 00:24:22,050
So those critical ones in 27 and 28 could get pushed when there's more money in the reserve,

329
00:24:22,190 --> 00:24:30,190
but if they're truly critical, they probably should try to stay in the year that they've been planned for.

330
00:24:30,990 --> 00:24:38,570
but that's always a, you know, council always has that option at their, but there's a, you know,

331
00:24:38,750 --> 00:24:43,270
that option comes with risk that this could be a year that something breaks.

332
00:24:49,850 --> 00:24:54,370
And these are the current 2025 rates, so these aren't the rates, these are our rates

333
00:24:54,370 --> 00:25:00,970
compared with everyone else's rates today. We don't have the rates that each of the

334
00:25:00,970 --> 00:25:06,950
municipalities are proposing, but I would imagine there will be some proposing increases, some

335
00:25:06,950 --> 00:25:14,290
proposed fairly large increases last year, larger than what we had in our budget, but

336
00:25:14,290 --> 00:25:17,530
you can see we're sitting at about 587.

337
00:25:17,990 --> 00:25:26,250
So we're kind of below our soys in summerland, but certainly more expensive than the peach

338
00:25:26,250 --> 00:25:35,450
lands and and Princeton's and Carameas of the world. So I took our 587 and assumed if we

339
00:25:35,450 --> 00:25:41,270
if we had a 7% increase what would that look like and really that put us would increase

340
00:25:41,270 --> 00:25:49,250
us to 629 and so if you look at here 629 we would still be below Soyuz and Summerland

341
00:25:49,250 --> 00:25:55,470
and we don't know what their rates they're going to propose for 2026 but it's not

342
00:25:55,470 --> 00:26:04,400
It doesn't change our position regionally and what that would amount to in terms of the annual cost.

343
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:13,040
It's about $42 a year which is $3.50 a month and it doesn't seem like a lot but I know we have people on limited income

344
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:19,380
and they would make a case that any amount is money that they won't be spending on something else.

345
00:26:19,380 --> 00:26:26,800
so but it's tried to keep the increase modest you know to keep our reserves on

346
00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:31,180
side but keep the you know most of the projects going forward and

347
00:26:35,570 --> 00:26:36,270
that's it for

348
00:26:36,270 --> 00:26:44,350
the sewer piece. Thank you. That's another question. These charts are based on grant

349
00:26:44,350 --> 00:26:50,950
approval for the sewer and I guess for water too. How would it change if we

350
00:26:50,950 --> 00:26:55,490
don't get those grants because the economic environment doesn't look too

351
00:26:55,490 --> 00:27:06,210
healthy with the government. I'm just wondering how these reserves and per cost

352
00:27:06,210 --> 00:27:09,710
to a homeowner would change if we could filter that out on a different slide

353
00:27:09,710 --> 00:27:16,490
next time so get a better view if the grants aren't available or don't come

354
00:27:16,490 --> 00:27:17,830
through if that's possible?

355
00:27:18,590 --> 00:27:21,710
Yeah, through the Mayor to Councilor Dalla-Wallet,

356
00:27:21,810 --> 00:27:25,110
I think it just depends what we choose to do

357
00:27:25,110 --> 00:27:25,990
to carry those projects.

358
00:27:26,110 --> 00:27:28,670
If you said debt, if we're taking debt,

359
00:27:28,850 --> 00:27:31,530
then of course that's not going to affect,

360
00:27:32,890 --> 00:27:34,350
it's gonna provide the capital,

361
00:27:34,450 --> 00:27:36,130
but it's gonna eat into your operating funds.

362
00:27:36,610 --> 00:27:39,390
And if your operating funds are paying debt service costs,

363
00:27:39,590 --> 00:27:43,030
that'll be less money available to go into reserve.

364
00:27:43,030 --> 00:27:48,850
So you certainly have that at your disposal.

365
00:27:49,310 --> 00:27:55,030
If you take a couple of the other reserves that we have, that would have no impact.

366
00:27:55,170 --> 00:28:02,110
But of course, that's opportunity cost because those reserves can be used for a myriad of different projects

367
00:28:02,110 --> 00:28:08,050
from roads to buildings to anything, not anything you could imagine,

368
00:28:08,050 --> 00:28:12,150
but certainly there's a lot of flexibility with the Community Works Fund and with the

369
00:28:12,150 --> 00:28:20,510
Growing Community Fund, so it's just, we can do that, it just leaves us money for other

370
00:28:20,510 --> 00:28:20,810
things.

371
00:28:21,910 --> 00:28:27,730
Yeah, because on that chart proposed sewer rate increases, you know, 7.11, and then drops

372
00:28:27,730 --> 00:28:34,850
to 3.33, that's, we're making a kind of a good case scenario here, that this is

373
00:28:34,850 --> 00:28:45,590
This is how it's going to happen, but if it doesn't happen like that, it won't go to 333 in 28, 29, 30, it might be another 777, right?

374
00:28:48,660 --> 00:28:48,920
Yes.

375
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:51,920
And these charts took like a really good scenario happening.

376
00:28:53,180 --> 00:28:58,080
Yeah. I mean, you've got options. I mean, it can go a lot of different ways.

377
00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:03,780
This way is trying to show the, like if the P, if the projects,

378
00:29:03,780 --> 00:29:10,000
And of course, it's hard when you're looking at 27 and 28 to say, well, we'll take on debt for those projects.

379
00:29:11,860 --> 00:29:15,660
That'll impact, you know, that'll lower the amount that goes into reserves.

380
00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:21,980
But you'd probably get more projects done because you can see the spending drops down.

381
00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:24,940
Like we're doing one point, we're proposing 1.7 this year.

382
00:29:25,380 --> 00:29:29,520
But you can see, but this is all, this is just the spending out of the reserve, right?

383
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:36,340
you can see it dropped down to 750 and then a couple, you know, 200,000 and 275 in the last two years.

384
00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:38,800
Thank you.

385
00:29:39,020 --> 00:29:39,560
Grace.

386
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:44,060
Thank you, Worship. Just a question about a couple of the projects that aren't 2026.

387
00:29:44,460 --> 00:29:49,940
One of them is the Fairview to Sawmill main replacement for 2027,

388
00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:55,160
and then way further down the line was the reclaimed water main replacement.

389
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:58,980
So, I'm wondering if we've looked at SIPP or CIPP for those.

390
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:12,220
As well, or if they've gone, if they're beyond that point, or why, because I know for some of the other projects, like the Sanitary Main McKinney Road has SIPP or CIPP, but the others are, looks like they're recommending replacement instead.

391
00:30:29,900 --> 00:30:31,180
The other, the other PDF.

392
00:30:42,670 --> 00:30:51,810
Yes, through, sorry, through the, just wrapped my head around, I can't really see that sheet head size, and that's way too small. Sorry, through the Mayor to Councilor Grace.

393
00:30:51,810 --> 00:30:57,750
the 900,000 I think that's basically we still need to do that sanitary main but

394
00:30:57,750 --> 00:31:02,410
that's on the current fair view to station like to co-op basically that

395
00:31:02,410 --> 00:31:07,170
actually sewer main has like grout or something poured in it when I did the

396
00:31:07,170 --> 00:31:10,710
co-op project we actually tried to camera that the camera got stuck I

397
00:31:10,710 --> 00:31:15,210
couldn't even camera the entire thing it's a six inch sewer main and we

398
00:31:15,210 --> 00:31:20,010
have about four inches essentially it's it's like a grout slurry at the

399
00:31:20,010 --> 00:31:20,990
bottom of that or something.

400
00:31:21,450 --> 00:31:22,970
And like I say, the camera got stuck.

401
00:31:23,170 --> 00:31:24,090
This sheet's up there now.

402
00:31:24,350 --> 00:31:25,630
I think if that's the one you're looking for.

403
00:31:25,790 --> 00:31:26,130
Yeah.

404
00:31:26,830 --> 00:31:27,830
Oh, I'm sorry.

405
00:31:28,090 --> 00:31:28,950
I'm talking the wrong one.

406
00:31:29,210 --> 00:31:30,470
But that is, stations another one.

407
00:31:30,750 --> 00:31:31,870
This is actually our major,

408
00:31:33,050 --> 00:31:36,130
this is our major main by 210 Co-op,

409
00:31:36,270 --> 00:31:37,670
that right away that goes from Fairview

410
00:31:37,670 --> 00:31:40,670
by the water park through to 210 Co-op.

411
00:31:41,170 --> 00:31:42,470
It's a big toilet clay pipe.

412
00:31:42,910 --> 00:31:45,830
And it's basically, is this the gravity one or,

413
00:31:46,030 --> 00:31:48,250
sorry, John, can you just go back up or for Sheller?

414
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:54,500
not that far. Thank you.

415
00:31:56,540 --> 00:31:59,520
Just wanted to make sure it's, I think it's, yeah, collection

416
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:03,400
network. This is the gravity, so we have two mains that go should, we have a force main,

417
00:32:03,460 --> 00:32:06,000
we have an eight inch force main that goes through that right away, but, and we have

418
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:11,540
this 300-vitallic clay gravity pipe. So this takes all of this, we're from the

419
00:32:11,540 --> 00:32:16,780
other side of the bridge, essentially. And it's down, we, what we know from the

420
00:32:16,780 --> 00:32:19,000
in Victoria Clay is most likely it's taking on water.

421
00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:21,040
And this is down in the water table.

422
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,900
So we tie in the co-op, which was down in the water table.

423
00:32:24,260 --> 00:32:26,060
We've stopped out of length outside of the roads.

424
00:32:26,180 --> 00:32:27,780
We don't affect all the new road and the paving

425
00:32:27,780 --> 00:32:28,400
and everything else.

426
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:31,640
And we've tied in a little bit down the pathway,

427
00:32:32,100 --> 00:32:34,320
but this is sort of slated as a major project

428
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:34,920
for replacement.

429
00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:38,060
And it would only be the sewer cost associated to that

430
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:40,240
just because it's within a right of way.

431
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:42,980
And it's just fair to you to co-op basically.

432
00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:44,060
Yeah.

433
00:32:44,060 --> 00:32:50,620
I guess it's safe to presume that relining has been looked at as a possibility with all of these and we're gonna try to go in

434
00:32:50,620 --> 00:32:53,740
That direction if we can but if it's sort of beyond that point, then we're looking at replacement

435
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:57,260
Yeah, and through the design portion of this

436
00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:01,840
What we looked at with co-op was the integrity of the pipe as well in the water

437
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:05,320
The toughest part is in the water table you it has to be a dry pipe to line

438
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:07,840
And when it's in the water table and taking on water

439
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:10,680
We actually camera co-op and it literally got to a point

440
00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:15,120
it just dove down and it was full of water. You couldn't see anything. So the

441
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:19,440
top portion that we didn't do is possibly able to line the top portion of

442
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:24,720
Co-op up by the shopping center. Similar to this we might be able to line half of it

443
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:28,380
and then replace half of it sort of that water table side of things but we would

444
00:33:28,380 --> 00:33:33,160
definitely investigate that. The design is put into the same year as well so

445
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:36,930
part of the design we would do that investigation and ensure what we're

446
00:33:36,930 --> 00:33:37,370
to do there.

447
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:44,020
What's the matter? What is our current borough and rate roughly?

448
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:48,380
To borrow one in. MFA is charging us these days?

449
00:33:49,780 --> 00:33:57,200
Through the mayor. Councilor Mattis, it is I think around 4% maybe a little bit. I could

450
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:01,820
go on the website quickly. I just wondered if you had a rough number, so 4%. So just

451
00:34:01,820 --> 00:34:06,800
for council's benefit, a 1% increase where it's up to about $20,000. It's very

452
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:13,660
similar to taxes, surprisingly enough. So if you borrow a million dollars, it's a 2%

453
00:34:13,660 --> 00:34:16,900
represents 2% increase in the budget.

454
00:34:32,860 --> 00:34:34,720
So that's the sewer portion.

455
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:35,780
Yeah, we'll have to continue with water.

456
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:41,920
He knows that we're dealing with it. We

457
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:44,180
would deal with sewer first, and I

458
00:34:49,170 --> 00:34:52,190
don't remember him giving me an exact time personally.

459
00:35:06,990 --> 00:35:11,290
We'll start at 4 o'clock right on the dock, or sorry, 3 o'clock right on the dock.

460
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:16,500
Thank you.

461
00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:20,400
Your worship, so now we're on to the water budget.

462
00:35:21,720 --> 00:35:28,900
So this slide outlines the five years of water projects proposed together with funding,

463
00:35:28,900 --> 00:35:35,960
funding, proposed funding source and priority. As I did with sewer, focused on the projects

464
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:43,100
for 2026, but we can pull up the detail for any of the projects over the five-year plan.

465
00:35:43,740 --> 00:35:49,260
And I should also say that the Director of Operations, which is in your handout of PDF,

466
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:55,580
shows you the 10-year plan. So we're actually working now with a 10-year plan, which

467
00:35:55,580 --> 00:36:00,240
which is good. So we have more of a long-range plan in terms of sewer and water, but we only

468
00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:06,000
show you like the five years that are relevant for the budget purpose. But you do have the

469
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:13,780
things that Public Works is envisioning for those out years, getting ten years for a

470
00:36:13,780 --> 00:36:14,860
full ten-year picture.

471
00:36:20,390 --> 00:36:24,790
So for 2026 the projects were continuing to replace water meters.

472
00:36:26,730 --> 00:36:32,910
The Semilkamine Avenue is in there because that project is a complete project, water, sewer, and road.

473
00:36:33,130 --> 00:36:42,110
So when you see the general budget in a couple of weeks for capital, you'll see the road portion of Semilkamine coming up as well.

474
00:36:42,790 --> 00:36:47,910
And we've applied for a grant for the Semilkamine piece. We haven't applied for a grant for Main Street.

475
00:36:47,910 --> 00:36:52,830
We could only, with that grant that we applied for, there was only, we could only apply for

476
00:36:52,830 --> 00:36:53,410
one project.

477
00:36:53,890 --> 00:37:02,470
So that was deemed the project that would deal with the housing issue or give us more upside

478
00:37:02,470 --> 00:37:03,970
on the housing side.

479
00:37:06,490 --> 00:37:07,770
Main Street and veterans.

480
00:37:08,650 --> 00:37:09,390
I've got a question.

481
00:37:11,070 --> 00:37:11,590
Sorry.

482
00:37:12,390 --> 00:37:17,030
Through on water meters, I noticed your funding, but then the other day we were talking

483
00:37:17,030 --> 00:37:22,570
about there's some money in the water meter replacement fund. Remember we were talking about

484
00:37:22,570 --> 00:37:27,930
using that money not very long ago? So I want to know how much that is and isn't that what we

485
00:37:27,930 --> 00:37:34,730
should be using that for? To either the mayor of the council and director of operations can kick

486
00:37:34,730 --> 00:37:39,750
in too but what we're doing is we're going to have funds carried over in the water meter

487
00:37:40,430 --> 00:37:43,170
this year, that'll carry into 2026.

488
00:37:44,530 --> 00:37:48,550
So the money that's not spent, like the money that's been spoken for for the meters,

489
00:37:49,650 --> 00:37:53,770
but we don't spend will carry into 2026, four meters.

490
00:37:54,490 --> 00:38:01,730
Like that money, once it's allocated, it stays there unless we come forward and say,

491
00:38:01,790 --> 00:38:04,770
we want to change the allocation and move it.

492
00:38:04,770 --> 00:38:10,430
And in the last meeting, we decided to pay for the – I'm telling you, Rockliff was

493
00:38:10,430 --> 00:38:12,210
the project, if memory serves me correctly.

494
00:38:12,630 --> 00:38:14,670
We were taking that money instead of the water meters.

495
00:38:14,790 --> 00:38:17,710
We proposed let's cut the water meter budget down.

496
00:38:18,090 --> 00:38:22,870
But based on Council's feedback, we left the water meter budget alone and took it

497
00:38:22,870 --> 00:38:29,790
out of community works funding for the bank that was $65,000 to complete Rockliff,

498
00:38:29,990 --> 00:38:33,350
the extra work that Director of Operations was doing with the Rockliff well.

499
00:38:33,350 --> 00:38:35,230
If that's what you're speaking to.

500
00:38:35,430 --> 00:38:36,450
Yeah, that's what I'm speaking to.

501
00:38:36,690 --> 00:38:36,750
Yeah.

502
00:38:36,750 --> 00:38:37,470
How much is in that?

503
00:38:38,170 --> 00:38:39,190
Do you know off the top of your head?

504
00:38:39,650 --> 00:38:40,530
I don't know.

505
00:38:40,530 --> 00:38:41,950
Through your worship to Councillor Michelle,

506
00:38:42,150 --> 00:38:44,590
there's approximately going to be about $180,000 carryover.

507
00:38:44,590 --> 00:38:44,930
That's in that.

508
00:38:45,070 --> 00:38:45,590
That's in that.

509
00:38:45,810 --> 00:38:46,070
Yeah.

510
00:38:46,390 --> 00:38:49,330
I'm actually looking to purchase water meters right now.

511
00:38:49,430 --> 00:38:50,990
So as of December 31st,

512
00:38:51,030 --> 00:38:53,790
there'll probably be about $100,000 that's carried over.

513
00:38:54,450 --> 00:38:54,590
Okay.

514
00:38:54,590 --> 00:38:58,050
And we'll have about 175 water meters in stock

515
00:38:58,570 --> 00:39:00,630
to replace the 5-8 meters.

516
00:39:00,630 --> 00:39:05,050
Because when I was looking down the funding, where all the funding is coming grants, it's

517
00:39:05,050 --> 00:39:05,690
water capital.

518
00:39:06,590 --> 00:39:11,750
So I thought, well, jeez, there's money in that, so why not use that for part of it?

519
00:39:15,410 --> 00:39:22,010
Your worship, I would much rather utilize that money for rock cliff irrigation, to be

520
00:39:22,010 --> 00:39:22,210
honest.

521
00:39:22,730 --> 00:39:28,330
I'm extremely concerned that if that rock cliff irrigation goes down, we'll get

522
00:39:28,330 --> 00:39:28,670
to that.

523
00:39:28,910 --> 00:39:33,710
But yeah, I'll put my case forward when we get to that.

524
00:39:33,710 --> 00:39:38,470
point. I'm still a little confused because if we've got a water meter replacement fund, I think that

525
00:39:38,470 --> 00:39:41,730
that's what we should be using it for. We shouldn't be moving that money around because we need it

526
00:39:41,730 --> 00:39:46,310
somewhere else. We're not. I don't agree with that. I think that there's a fund there for that

527
00:39:46,310 --> 00:39:50,850
and I remember setting it up a couple of years. I can't remember when we did it because we knew

528
00:39:50,850 --> 00:39:54,450
we were going to have to start replacing these water meters. I don't think that we should be,

529
00:39:54,690 --> 00:40:00,510
I mean, to me anyway, that's what it should be used for. Well, let's just keep it, it's

530
00:40:00,510 --> 00:40:05,890
noted. Let's keep track of it and there's some more information to come because the majority

531
00:40:05,890 --> 00:40:10,170
of the budget is unfunded anyway. So we're going to be looking for sources.

532
00:40:10,670 --> 00:40:13,030
Councillor Grace. Thank you, Worship. So just to clarify though,

533
00:40:13,230 --> 00:40:18,370
is there a specific put aside fund for the water meters like a reserve or is it just

534
00:40:18,370 --> 00:40:23,030
that there's a line item with an allotted amount for water meters coming out of water

535
00:40:23,030 --> 00:40:27,010
capital? Through the MetaCouncilor, Grace, you're right. That's what. There's not

536
00:40:27,010 --> 00:40:28,430
there's not a water meter fund.

537
00:40:28,870 --> 00:40:31,770
It's a line item that we allocate the dollars to,

538
00:40:31,950 --> 00:40:33,870
but if we don't spend those dollars,

539
00:40:34,210 --> 00:40:36,090
they carry us forward to the next year

540
00:40:36,090 --> 00:40:37,850
if director of operations,

541
00:40:38,070 --> 00:40:39,550
that's with any of our capital projects.

542
00:40:40,290 --> 00:40:43,070
He looks at the end of the year and I try to say,

543
00:40:43,130 --> 00:40:44,410
well, what's finished and what's not.

544
00:40:44,970 --> 00:40:46,310
And if a project's not finished,

545
00:40:46,350 --> 00:40:48,710
we carry it forward because you don't want to lose

546
00:40:48,710 --> 00:40:51,070
that money and not be able to finish the project.

547
00:40:51,170 --> 00:40:54,150
So with water meters, the money that we don't spend,

548
00:40:54,150 --> 00:41:00,810
And we'll get spent on water meters in a future year unless we come back and say, well, we

549
00:41:00,810 --> 00:41:07,330
want to move it, which we suggested last meeting, which Council decided not to move it to keep

550
00:41:07,330 --> 00:41:09,750
it in water meters, which is what we've done.

551
00:41:11,590 --> 00:41:12,230
Councilor Mattis?

552
00:41:12,370 --> 00:41:13,570
So I'm confused.

553
00:41:13,790 --> 00:41:16,750
We don't have an actual water meter reserve set up.

554
00:41:17,190 --> 00:41:17,350
No.

555
00:41:17,670 --> 00:41:22,330
And all of the other capital items that if we come in under budget on those items

556
00:41:22,330 --> 00:41:27,650
in a particular year, where does the money go? Does it not go into general water reserves?

557
00:41:28,190 --> 00:41:28,390
Yes.

558
00:41:28,990 --> 00:41:34,050
And that is where this water meter money should be going as well. And then if we need to draw

559
00:41:34,050 --> 00:41:40,250
out of that general water reserve for water meters, then that's what we do. But it shouldn't

560
00:41:40,250 --> 00:41:46,990
be following that line item because somewhere along the line you have to get your budget

561
00:41:47,570 --> 00:41:51,970
exactly right because you want that balance on that particular line to reach zero.

562
00:41:51,970 --> 00:41:59,730
It should never have a carryover every year, it should go into the reserve, and then you draw from the reserve to buy the water meters that you require.

563
00:42:01,130 --> 00:42:04,170
Am I misunderstanding how our system works?

564
00:42:05,130 --> 00:42:07,690
Through the Mayor and Councillor Mattis.

565
00:42:07,990 --> 00:42:14,870
No, I mean, I think the budget, say the budget this year or last year was $300,000 for water meters.

566
00:42:15,290 --> 00:42:18,430
If at the end of the year we haven't spent the $300,000,

567
00:42:18,430 --> 00:42:21,870
Normally we do, if the Director of Operations tells me,

568
00:42:22,550 --> 00:42:28,570
I'm going to spend that money in 2026, then I carry it forward.

569
00:42:29,110 --> 00:42:31,570
If there's a project, say one of the other projects,

570
00:42:31,670 --> 00:42:33,790
say it comes in, what happens?

571
00:42:33,990 --> 00:42:34,970
It comes in under budget.

572
00:42:35,470 --> 00:42:37,950
That money just goes into, if we don't spend it,

573
00:42:38,050 --> 00:42:39,590
it goes into reserve.

574
00:42:40,790 --> 00:42:44,450
Once the project is complete, then the funds are freed up.

575
00:42:45,010 --> 00:42:46,510
That hasn't been spent.

576
00:42:46,510 --> 00:42:54,010
It goes into the reserve to top it up, but in the case of water, the information from

577
00:42:54,010 --> 00:42:58,450
Director of Operations is I'm going to use that money for meters, so I wouldn't.

578
00:42:58,850 --> 00:43:00,210
I would carry it forward.

579
00:43:00,550 --> 00:43:01,010
But you could.

580
00:43:01,090 --> 00:43:08,670
You could say what you don't spend goes into general funds, but then we've dropped

581
00:43:08,670 --> 00:43:09,150
the budget.

582
00:43:09,250 --> 00:43:11,470
You can see the water meter budget this year is 150.

583
00:43:12,290 --> 00:43:13,550
So we have dropped the budget.

584
00:43:13,550 --> 00:43:19,230
But that's because, you know, the amount that we thought we could replace, you know,

585
00:43:19,270 --> 00:43:26,670
practically speaking with the resources and the local talent in terms of installers outside of public works

586
00:43:26,670 --> 00:43:29,550
wasn't available to be that ambitious.

587
00:43:29,910 --> 00:43:35,530
So we've dropped the budget back for this year, which frees up capital, water capital.

588
00:43:36,270 --> 00:43:41,410
But I don't, I mean, with what we carry forward, I think, I mean, director of operations,

589
00:43:41,410 --> 00:43:55,230
I can't put words in his mouth, but with what's carried forward plus 150, you know, at the end of the year, you may not have any money you may have spent 150 plus what's carried forward.

590
00:43:55,530 --> 00:44:03,830
So 2027 will be, you know, a new budget for water, like another budget allocation for water meters, if you know what I mean.

591
00:44:04,110 --> 00:44:05,550
What was the budget last year?

592
00:44:06,270 --> 00:44:06,690
300.

593
00:44:07,590 --> 00:44:14,430
And we said we didn't have the capability to install 300 so we ended up with so we lowered the budget to 150.

594
00:44:15,690 --> 00:44:24,850
I thought I just heard you say that we didn't have the local talent to put it in from staff so we lowered the budget this year to 150.

595
00:44:25,630 --> 00:44:31,710
So does that mean we only installed 150,000 worth last year because that's all we have the capability for,

596
00:44:31,710 --> 00:44:37,790
which would have created $150,000 carryover, which should fund this year's budget.

597
00:44:38,010 --> 00:44:40,430
There shouldn't be another ask for $150,000.

598
00:44:40,950 --> 00:44:41,470
That's right.

599
00:44:42,770 --> 00:44:46,090
I think this will all make sense through your worship to Councilor Mattis.

600
00:44:46,150 --> 00:44:49,190
This will make a lot of sense, I think, once we get through this entire thing.

601
00:44:50,550 --> 00:44:52,430
The rationale, a couple of things.

602
00:44:52,590 --> 00:44:57,230
One is we kind of heard Council wanting to keep that money within water meters, right?

603
00:44:57,230 --> 00:44:59,970
So there's going to be about $180,000 right now.

604
00:45:01,060 --> 00:45:05,300
We did not have the manpower to be able to replace all of these. We've actually been hiring plumbers.

605
00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:09,720
So we've kept up with the failed meters and replacements as they fail this year.

606
00:45:10,500 --> 00:45:15,980
That came to the tune of about $120,000 by the end of the year. Right now we're about $110,000 is to spend.

607
00:45:16,620 --> 00:45:25,440
There's a $180,000 proposed carryover. When I'm proposing we're down to 74 meters left, we've had about $191,000 at the start of last year.

608
00:45:26,140 --> 00:45:30,580
I'm proposing to buy another 100 before there's a 10% increase in January again with the current

609
00:45:30,580 --> 00:45:31,460
money that we have.

610
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:34,420
That'll put us down to, it's about $80,000 for that.

611
00:45:34,720 --> 00:45:36,640
That'll put us down to $100,000 remaining.

612
00:45:37,180 --> 00:45:42,080
So if you put that $100,000 onto the 150, we have about $250,000 for next year.

613
00:45:43,880 --> 00:45:48,740
And essentially, you'll kind of see in the rationale, so there's rock cliff irrigation,

614
00:45:48,740 --> 00:45:54,760
which I'm extremely concerned about, honestly pulling up on us, to be honest.

615
00:45:55,740 --> 00:45:57,480
So it's $1.1 million.

616
00:45:57,880 --> 00:46:01,820
When I worked out this budget, it wasn't reflected as dead.

617
00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:04,480
I took that into place as that we're going to replace that.

618
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:10,700
So I've slashed everything that I could to actually get to that point to replace the critical things

619
00:46:10,700 --> 00:46:14,740
and put the water meters down to $150,000 instead of $300,000.

620
00:46:15,340 --> 00:46:18,180
We've taken out design projects, we've taken out PLCs,

621
00:46:18,180 --> 00:46:24,080
We've taken out gate valve replacements anything else that we could kind of do because I'm so concerned about Rockliffe irrigation

622
00:46:25,140 --> 00:46:28,660
Literally in my write-up. It's a 400 amp service. It's in there

623
00:46:28,660 --> 00:46:35,000
So all three pumps that are running are 588 amps a couple years ago. We had a breaker blow up and burn out

624
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:40,040
There is no replacements. We bagged in board and found one to replace that particular breaker

625
00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:44,640
But it made basically burnt when we put the ionizer into that

626
00:46:45,240 --> 00:46:50,760
station, we actually had to add another transformer to actually power a 30 amp breaker to get the

627
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:57,280
ionizer up and running in that station. It's built in 1975, it's never been upgraded, and

628
00:46:57,280 --> 00:47:01,000
it pushes 9,000 gallons a minute. If that pump station goes down, we don't have an irrigation

629
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:05,880
season. So it's one of my biggest, biggest concerns, but it's a really, really big dollar

630
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:10,480
amount. So when I put this together, that's what I looked at. What can we do to still

631
00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:17,240
keep everything going, keep the water meter replacements going, praying that $250,000

632
00:47:17,240 --> 00:47:21,560
would be enough, and we'd not up to 400 or something in half to possibly borrow for more

633
00:47:21,560 --> 00:47:21,920
of that.

634
00:47:22,380 --> 00:47:25,540
But I think if when we look at the numbers and kind of what's remaining, I think we're

635
00:47:25,540 --> 00:47:30,280
deficient about roughly $500,000 to actually complete those four projects and include

636
00:47:30,280 --> 00:47:31,460
the rock lift irrigation.

637
00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:35,740
But that's kind of the rationale on $150,000, just to clarify things.

638
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:40,760
And the water meter program is, if you look at the five-year plan, you can see it does

639
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:45,360
carry on in 27, 28, 29, and then tails off in 2030.

640
00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:52,000
But every year going forward, we have set proposed $300,000.

641
00:47:57,170 --> 00:47:58,210
Back to this slide.

642
00:47:58,350 --> 00:48:04,110
So I think the waplif irrigation is the one Kelly's referring to, the $1.1 million

643
00:48:04,110 --> 00:48:04,970
that you can see.

644
00:48:04,970 --> 00:48:13,830
and I have grant funding slash debt there, just because of the directive operations feelings

645
00:48:13,830 --> 00:48:14,850
about that project.

646
00:48:15,010 --> 00:48:16,170
I just didn't leave it at grant.

647
00:48:17,570 --> 00:48:21,310
I think that project needs to go forward.

648
00:48:22,270 --> 00:48:27,990
The other projects out of the capital funds for 2026 are Hester Creek Piping and Flow

649
00:48:27,990 --> 00:48:37,750
meter for 285,000 and then the well decommissioning plan for 30,000. Same point about the P1 projects

650
00:48:37,750 --> 00:48:47,050
dependent on grant to move forward, but really the Rockliff I would propose debt. If there's

651
00:48:47,050 --> 00:48:52,650
another grant that was brought forward, I think we found out about it last week, specifically

652
00:48:52,650 --> 00:48:56,950
specifically for irrigation systems or for farming.

653
00:48:57,130 --> 00:49:01,850
We finally released a program, so we're going to be applying for that,

654
00:49:03,850 --> 00:49:08,790
which for Rockliff, but I think if that grant isn't successful,

655
00:49:09,290 --> 00:49:13,190
we should probably think about whether we should borrow money in the fall.

656
00:49:13,370 --> 00:49:15,410
The fall borrowing, I guess, would be the timing.

657
00:49:16,430 --> 00:49:17,330
Councilor Grayson, a question.

658
00:49:17,550 --> 00:49:18,170
Thank you, Rishabh.

659
00:49:18,290 --> 00:49:22,110
Yeah, I just want to clarify, because on here you've got Rockliff as

660
00:49:22,110 --> 00:49:26,550
grant funding in debt, but in the main budget, like the 86-page document, you've got it listed

661
00:49:26,550 --> 00:49:27,350
as water capital.

662
00:49:29,150 --> 00:49:33,130
In the original, that's just a timing thing in the original slide with the detail.

663
00:49:33,670 --> 00:49:36,530
That's what, you know, when Kelly proposed it, it was, well, it's coming out of capital

664
00:49:36,530 --> 00:49:37,690
because we have to do it.

665
00:49:38,130 --> 00:49:43,270
But when I was preparing the budget, I'm always trying to balance the reserves and

666
00:49:43,270 --> 00:49:47,610
try to keep us from going upside down and it would have put us upside down.

667
00:49:47,610 --> 00:49:53,250
So that's and then we found out about the grant this new grant for irrigation for farming

668
00:49:53,250 --> 00:49:56,950
And so that that was the change that I made but

669
00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:11,700
There's no questions on like more detail on the well commission decommissioning

670
00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:18,600
Our Hester Creek I didn't have a question on that what what is entailed what we're gonna shut it

671
00:50:19,260 --> 00:50:22,920
Maybe explain that better. I didn't really get a full explanation by reading this

672
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:25,260
Sorry, could you repeat your question?

673
00:50:25,660 --> 00:50:27,440
Well, while decommissioning, there's three of them.

674
00:50:27,620 --> 00:50:30,440
Yes, sorry, through your worship to Councilor Michelle.

675
00:50:30,720 --> 00:50:32,660
So that's decommissioning.

676
00:50:33,240 --> 00:50:34,600
There's one at Black's age,

677
00:50:34,700 --> 00:50:36,040
so it's literally a concrete pad,

678
00:50:36,060 --> 00:50:38,200
but it does have an opening still to the aquifer

679
00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:39,100
that they dip into.

680
00:50:39,680 --> 00:50:42,140
So it actually, basically when we did

681
00:50:42,140 --> 00:50:44,260
our source protection plan and working through that,

682
00:50:44,440 --> 00:50:45,660
these are straws to the aquifer.

683
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:48,900
So whatever happens, it's literally a direct straw

684
00:50:48,900 --> 00:50:50,440
to our drinking water.

685
00:50:50,440 --> 00:50:55,000
whether it's a diesel spill or whatever that might be, that's essentially what

686
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:59,140
these things are that we're at risk of them not being capped off. So there's

687
00:50:59,140 --> 00:51:04,020
there's Tuckling with P1, a station that is not utilized anymore, it's like a 15,

688
00:51:04,460 --> 00:51:09,460
it's literally been decommissioned, well it's not been in use for probably about

689
00:51:09,460 --> 00:51:16,360
20, 30 years I would say, and there is the CPR as well. So it's decommissioning

690
00:51:17,080 --> 00:51:24,600
those three wells, and so you need approval from the province to be decommissioned well

691
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:28,800
now, and that's working through this process with our hydrogeologists to work through that

692
00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:32,120
process with the province to get permission to decommission those three wells, and then

693
00:51:32,120 --> 00:51:38,580
next year I have a budget to literally dismantle, get rid of the pump hoses, and cap everything

694
00:51:38,580 --> 00:51:42,520
off and get rid of the concrete pads and decommission those three wells.

695
00:51:51,500 --> 00:52:00,780
That's the lines well this is CPR okay, so CPR we're not using for not at all isn't CPR the one that had all that

696
00:52:01,620 --> 00:52:07,200
Uranium through your worship to the director. Yeah, with your any problems. Yeah. Yeah, correct

697
00:52:07,980 --> 00:52:09,980
Okay, I thought we'd be using that one

698
00:52:11,260 --> 00:52:17,780
Just to my own knowledge that I thought it was Lyons Park that had the uranium

699
00:52:18,860 --> 00:52:20,600
Are they both the same well, or are they actually

700
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:22,060
how close are they located together?

701
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:24,380
Through your worship, they're at the Iranians of Lyons Park.

702
00:52:25,060 --> 00:52:28,140
So Lyons, the other well, they utilize for irrigation.

703
00:52:28,460 --> 00:52:29,800
The Lyons well that you talked about,

704
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:32,200
so they both got basically shut down because of uranium,

705
00:52:32,680 --> 00:52:35,940
but the Parks and Rec utilized it for irrigation for Lyons.

706
00:52:36,200 --> 00:52:38,820
And then CPR has been inactive for numerous years.

707
00:52:39,540 --> 00:52:40,520
So they're already cobwebs.

708
00:52:40,700 --> 00:52:42,940
We had very, very hard, it was troublesome

709
00:52:42,940 --> 00:52:44,460
to try and get into that building, to be honest.

710
00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:47,600
But that is by the tourism building, yeah.

711
00:52:47,600 --> 00:52:50,980
That little building, that little building right there, that CPR, yeah.

712
00:52:58,390 --> 00:53:03,830
These are the four capital projects proposed, the detail.

713
00:53:04,310 --> 00:53:04,530
The

714
00:53:12,310 --> 00:53:14,470
less than a serious. See a typo in there.

715
00:53:16,390 --> 00:53:16,910
This

716
00:53:22,730 --> 00:53:26,410
is the operating budget proposed for 2026.

717
00:53:28,290 --> 00:53:33,050
The budgets, as I made the point with the sewers balanced on a cash basis.

718
00:53:33,150 --> 00:53:35,090
It's just appreciation. You have to add it back.

719
00:53:36,510 --> 00:53:44,970
budgets based on status quo staffing for water service, so no additions or deletions to staff,

720
00:53:45,410 --> 00:53:47,210
and those

721
00:53:49,450 --> 00:53:50,310
are the questions.

722
00:53:51,070 --> 00:53:55,610
I had a chance to bring this up with you briefly during the break.

723
00:53:55,850 --> 00:54:02,590
When I look at this budget, the revenue side, when I look at 5% increase,

724
00:54:03,370 --> 00:54:10,250
20-25 budget at 3.5 million, 5% would be $175,000.

725
00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:16,980
And yet the difference is only $31,000. Why is it not

726
00:54:16,980 --> 00:54:25,020
showing $140,000 more? Similar question with parcel taxes. If we're increasing parcel taxes by

727
00:54:25,020 --> 00:54:28,780
at 5%, why are they going down in 2026?

728
00:54:30,980 --> 00:54:34,800
Yeah, through the Mayor to Councilor Mattis,

729
00:54:35,160 --> 00:54:39,760
the 2025 budget, I think the 2026 numbers you're seeing

730
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:42,580
is based on what we do every year is kind of reset

731
00:54:43,700 --> 00:54:45,880
the revenue side in terms of how the utility,

732
00:54:46,200 --> 00:54:47,440
like the number of properties,

733
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:52,060
and we kind of reset it to what the actuals are

734
00:54:52,060 --> 00:54:54,120
in terms of revenue.

735
00:54:54,120 --> 00:55:12,080
And so I think that's why you're seeing a you're not seeing the variance in the 2025 like you're not seeing that percentage increase because the 2025 budget had more units I guess I think of units like houses or meters of cubic meters of

736
00:55:13,060 --> 00:55:19,020
service flowing through it than when we reset it this year to what the actuals were.

737
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:20,980
So you're not going to see that lift.

738
00:55:21,980 --> 00:55:27,660
To budget, you're not going to see the same lift because I think we did an audit,

739
00:55:27,880 --> 00:55:33,100
I know on the parcel taxes and corrected some properties that were getting charged

740
00:55:33,100 --> 00:55:37,900
that shouldn't be charged and some of the farm irrigation came back

741
00:55:37,900 --> 00:55:46,240
and water was turned off where we were charging them so some of the revenue I guess we budgeted

742
00:55:46,240 --> 00:55:52,480
to collect isn't collectible just because of corrections we made to try to make to do an audit

743
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:58,460
we went back and did an audit and tried to true up the numbers to make them tie to track to

744
00:55:58,460 --> 00:56:06,020
actual but so it throws the 2025 numbers off when you're comparing to 2026 but the 2026

745
00:56:06,020 --> 00:56:12,380
numbers that you're seeing there do have the proposed rate increase in them that that I'm entirely

746
00:56:13,060 --> 00:56:20,060
confident on. I understand that with the parcel tax is when I look at the 2025 year date and the 2024

747
00:56:20,060 --> 00:56:28,840
actual we've actually gone down quite a bit and we're headed for under three million. I think

748
00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:34,800
there's more parcel tax to hit though in the fourth quarter. This is year to date the year

749
00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:40,900
to date for 2025 isn't the whole year I think it's 29 it's only three quarters I

750
00:56:40,900 --> 00:56:46,560
get that but when I take a quarter of 2.3 million yeah that's about $600,000

751
00:56:47,380 --> 00:56:53,800
that still leaves us below 3 million last year was 3.3 almost this year is

752
00:56:53,800 --> 00:57:00,120
going to be 10% less than that well and I think the year to date that you're

753
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:04,160
seeing on this slide I think that we're still some utility entries that

754
00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:10,040
weren't booked when I pulled the actuals. So I think the numbers are higher than that.

755
00:57:11,160 --> 00:57:16,060
Because I looked at the year, like the actual year to date to try to see where we would end

756
00:57:16,060 --> 00:57:21,520
the year and it's coming close. You know, it's not that far off in terms of there's

757
00:57:21,520 --> 00:57:24,300
not a big miss on the revenue side.

758
00:57:26,940 --> 00:57:29,940
We really don't have the number in front

759
00:57:29,940 --> 00:57:35,360
of us to say that what the 5% increase is based on to drive that 3.5 or 2.

760
00:57:36,040 --> 00:57:41,040
Yeah, it's based on, it's based on truing up to the actual, like I can go, I can read

761
00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:41,560
through them.

762
00:57:41,580 --> 00:57:42,600
But it's not here.

763
00:57:42,860 --> 00:57:43,080
No.

764
00:57:43,300 --> 00:57:44,320
No, the detail is way.

765
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:48,480
It's, you know, the number of cubic meters and the number of, you know, 5-8s connections.

766
00:57:49,180 --> 00:57:53,000
It's very detailed in terms of, they have probably...

767
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:53,840
We can't even base it on...

768
00:57:53,840 --> 00:57:55,520
So many race, race codes though.

769
00:57:55,520 --> 00:57:58,620
You know, I understand now that we can't even base it on last year's number on

770
00:57:58,620 --> 00:57:59,080
this chart.

771
00:57:59,080 --> 00:57:59,880
Yeah, no.

772
00:58:01,750 --> 00:58:03,530
Council Schaefer and then Council Grace.

773
00:58:04,050 --> 00:58:04,790
Thank you, Your Worship.

774
00:58:05,710 --> 00:58:08,330
Yeah, a question through to the CFO.

775
00:58:09,770 --> 00:58:14,770
I noticed on this page the principal payments

776
00:58:15,650 --> 00:58:20,490
and the interest payments have gone down quite a bit

777
00:58:20,490 --> 00:58:25,770
into next year to the tune of about 228.

778
00:58:27,050 --> 00:58:33,910
So that means to me that we've paid something off or could you explain that?

779
00:58:34,270 --> 00:58:37,010
Through the Mayor to Councillor Schaefer. Yes, that's exactly.

780
00:58:37,150 --> 00:58:39,010
That was a good observation on your part.

781
00:58:39,150 --> 00:58:44,490
One of the, some of the debt that we're carrying is going to be paid off this year.

782
00:58:44,650 --> 00:58:47,650
I think it's the, what's called the TENS water system.

783
00:58:48,030 --> 00:58:50,150
That debt is going to get retired.

784
00:58:50,470 --> 00:58:53,490
So that's why you see the pickup in reserve too,

785
00:58:53,490 --> 00:58:57,370
because, of course, if the expenses drop, that puts more money into reserve.

786
00:58:58,170 --> 00:59:03,450
That'll disappear if we borrow money, of course, but that's why you see the drop-off because

787
00:59:03,450 --> 00:59:08,890
we actually have paid off another one of our outstanding debts over the last two years

788
00:59:08,890 --> 00:59:09,250
we've had.

789
00:59:10,670 --> 00:59:12,950
This is a large one that's coming out this year.

790
00:59:15,610 --> 00:59:15,930
Grace?

791
00:59:16,890 --> 00:59:17,370
Thank you, Your Worship.

792
00:59:19,150 --> 00:59:22,710
So looking at, so part of the rock cliff,

793
00:59:23,930 --> 00:59:26,210
like we're gonna be upgrading the pump house

794
00:59:26,210 --> 00:59:27,390
part of that rock cliff project.

795
00:59:27,470 --> 00:59:28,450
And then there's two others,

796
00:59:28,730 --> 00:59:31,030
Tecal Newet in 2028 and Hester in 2029.

797
00:59:31,550 --> 00:59:33,750
I'm wondering if we've considered,

798
00:59:34,370 --> 00:59:35,830
I mean, I don't know if we wanna front load

799
00:59:35,830 --> 00:59:36,930
that much money into the budget,

800
00:59:37,010 --> 00:59:39,230
but bundling those just for sort of economies,

801
00:59:39,430 --> 00:59:41,390
the scale of procurement of equipment

802
00:59:41,390 --> 00:59:43,510
and contractors of doing them in tandem

803
00:59:44,070 --> 00:59:46,530
could provide any kind of cost savings.

804
00:59:52,070 --> 00:59:57,690
Yeah, through your worship to Councilor, Councilor Grice, there would probably be minimal savings.

805
00:59:59,230 --> 00:59:59,970
A lot of it is...

806
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:07,980
We have a lot of equipment. There's one. And obviously we know those prices kind of fluctuate and continue to kind of go up, especially anything I need to get out of the states right now that's only available there.

807
01:00:09,340 --> 01:00:17,140
And a lot of our equipment is, a lot of the pumps, that type of thing. It's either that or we go to China and it's just not as good a product.

808
01:00:17,580 --> 01:00:23,680
It is definitely cheaper, but I worry about the longevity. We won't get the same lifespan that we're getting out of our pump hoses now.

809
01:00:23,680 --> 01:00:26,060
and it's just sort of detrimental to that.

810
01:00:28,060 --> 01:00:30,500
There would probably be some minor savings,

811
01:00:30,760 --> 01:00:33,760
but not a lot, just because they're two separate projects

812
01:00:34,180 --> 01:00:36,460
at two separate times, depending on when we shut them down,

813
01:00:36,600 --> 01:00:40,140
that type of thing, so there wouldn't be a ton of savings

814
01:00:40,140 --> 01:00:45,820
by doing that, and it's obviously a very large cost

815
01:00:45,820 --> 01:00:47,760
as well to kind of team them up into one year,

816
01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:49,760
just kind of with where reserves are right now.

817
01:00:50,760 --> 01:00:53,420
I think I'll be revisiting this all over again

818
01:00:53,420 --> 01:00:58,200
and kind of trying to sort of space some of this stuff out as best as we can and just those

819
01:00:58,200 --> 01:01:05,160
ones that complete failure and catastrophic, you know, to that extreme is really what I'm

820
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:09,120
going to be going for until we kind of get ahead of this wave, unfortunately.

821
01:01:09,720 --> 01:01:10,340
Thank you.

822
01:01:12,710 --> 01:01:13,430
Closer to Madis.

823
01:01:13,670 --> 01:01:13,910
Thanks.

824
01:01:14,770 --> 01:01:21,070
Does this 2026 budget include the principal and interest on that proposed 1.1 million

825
01:01:21,970 --> 01:01:22,770
of borough?

826
01:01:24,780 --> 01:01:33,360
So in natural fact, this sheet with the numbers that aren't at the top and the numbers that aren't at the bottom really isn't very useful.

827
01:01:34,520 --> 01:01:35,600
I hate to say it.

828
01:01:42,480 --> 01:01:49,640
I was going to say I think some of those decisions have to be made today and then when this comes back we'll see those numbers reflected in what we decide to do.

829
01:01:49,820 --> 01:01:51,340
So this is kind of an interim thing.

830
01:01:52,200 --> 01:01:58,900
You can estimate what the cost in interest payment and principles going to be.

831
01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:05,000
You can probably have that discussion a little bit, but we're going to have to decide whether we're going to do the project

832
01:02:05,000 --> 01:02:07,580
and if we're going to do the project, how much debt are we going to do?

833
01:02:07,700 --> 01:02:09,980
Are we going to fund it from somewhere else where we don't have debt?

834
01:02:10,460 --> 01:02:12,280
There's a few decisions that need to be made.

835
01:02:13,860 --> 01:02:19,240
One, if we do the fall borrowing, that won't hit till 2027 anyway on the budget. It's not

836
01:02:19,240 --> 01:02:25,400
going to be a 2026 issue. If we borrow the money in the fall, the first payments will

837
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:30,920
hit in 2027. So it will be a 2027. That's where it will show up in the budget. But it's

838
01:02:30,920 --> 01:02:36,320
not in the budget. Councillor Matys is correct because I was waiting to know which

839
01:02:36,320 --> 01:02:36,740
direction.

840
01:02:44,230 --> 01:02:52,390
So in terms of the proposed increases, we put 5% in for 2026 across the board with

841
01:02:52,390 --> 01:02:59,450
the one water system principle. We didn't do anything different for irrigation compared

842
01:02:59,450 --> 01:03:05,910
to domestic. And you can see a larger increase proposed in 2028. And it's just to build

843
01:03:05,910 --> 01:03:13,210
the reserves back up relative to where we're spending our money and you can see

844
01:03:13,210 --> 01:03:18,630
the budgeted spending going forward and that's coming out of the reserve not out

845
01:03:18,630 --> 01:03:22,910
of other funds but you can see the the budgets a little over a million dollars

846
01:03:22,910 --> 01:03:27,110
every every year with the exception of 2026.

847
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:34,100
Councillor Matys. Do we know what it will cost us to borrow 1.1 million?

848
01:03:34,100 --> 01:03:35,120
That

849
01:03:38,090 --> 01:03:42,090
we can calculate that 20

850
01:04:03,340 --> 01:04:03,860
years.

851
01:04:04,240 --> 01:04:04,740
You

852
01:04:07,560 --> 01:04:08,940
could share with the rest of the class.

853
01:04:10,340 --> 01:04:16,420
I was just saying to Councilor Mattis, if we end up deciding to borrow for it,

854
01:04:16,820 --> 01:04:19,380
it won't have the impact on rates that doing it will,

855
01:04:19,580 --> 01:04:21,260
because obviously it's going to amaturize it.

856
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:24,840
So it'll be over 15 years or whatever.

857
01:04:25,200 --> 01:04:28,280
So the impact on your rates is going to be a lot less than trying to fund it,

858
01:04:30,440 --> 01:04:33,800
And if we can get grant and then borrow part of it, it might help.

859
01:04:34,980 --> 01:04:46,260
So 1.1 million in principal, an interest rate of 4.17% will be annual debt payments of $73,185 to be exact.

860
01:04:46,660 --> 01:04:48,140
Split between principal and interest.

861
01:04:48,680 --> 01:04:51,380
Yeah, that's the total debt, so yeah.

862
01:04:52,700 --> 01:04:54,280
20, I think.

863
01:04:54,340 --> 01:04:54,700
How many years?

864
01:04:54,700 --> 01:04:58,220
Oh, sorry. And that's with a 25-year amortization.

865
01:04:58,980 --> 01:05:01,360
I can do it for 20 years, if you'd rather.

866
01:05:01,620 --> 01:05:03,360
No, that number works.

867
01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:12,780
And just to follow up on that through the Chair would be fair to say that looking at our total operating revenue of 4.3 million,

868
01:05:12,980 --> 01:05:15,780
that 1% represents $40,000.

869
01:05:16,880 --> 01:05:21,860
So in order to service this debt, we'd be looking at a 2% increase, give or take.

870
01:05:21,860 --> 01:05:25,700
For that piece. Yeah, if you segregated it that way. Okay.

871
01:05:35,470 --> 01:05:37,690
These are the residential comparisons

872
01:05:38,410 --> 01:05:45,570
Current state. This is without any of the proposed increases that a municipalities may be bringing forward for their 2026 budget

873
01:05:46,430 --> 01:05:49,950
So you can see us sitting at 720 305

874
01:06:00,090 --> 01:06:01,210
So we're a

875
01:06:01,210 --> 01:06:04,110
close to us and summer land is higher.

876
01:06:06,590 --> 01:06:10,010
If we did a 5% increase, the homeowner piece would

877
01:06:10,010 --> 01:06:17,850
go from $7.23 to $7.59 or $36 a year, which is $3 per month. And our rates, if you modeled

878
01:06:17,850 --> 01:06:23,890
that increase in, our rates would remain lower than a source in summer land. And I'm assuming

879
01:06:23,890 --> 01:06:29,490
those rates will be going up in a source in summer land. So if they froze their rates

880
01:06:29,490 --> 01:06:31,630
and our rates went up, we'd still be lower than them.

881
01:06:33,680 --> 01:06:39,720
On the irrigation side, this is just the proposed irrigation increases which fall in line with

882
01:06:39,720 --> 01:06:40,260
the residential.

883
01:06:41,220 --> 01:06:45,640
And these are some of the projects that are coming related to irrigation just for council's

884
01:06:45,640 --> 01:06:46,040
information.

885
01:06:50,050 --> 01:06:56,290
So the irrigation comparisons, we just did an assumption based on a fixed 10-acre

886
01:06:56,290 --> 01:06:56,690
parcel.

887
01:06:58,070 --> 01:06:59,910
And I'd have to look, I can't recall.

888
01:06:59,910 --> 01:07:06,430
We have assumed a certain whether we're available because a couple of municipalities had a variable rate built into their rate structure.

889
01:07:07,050 --> 01:07:11,370
So we assumed a certain amount of irrigation.

890
01:07:12,730 --> 01:07:17,510
So you can see where we're sitting with 3,175 relative to,

891
01:07:19,130 --> 01:07:28,370
Penticton seems unusual at 19, but we did contact the municipality and, you know, ask them theoretically if we had a farm.

892
01:07:29,190 --> 01:07:31,010
This is, you know, what were the rates that would apply.

893
01:07:31,750 --> 01:07:33,770
So I'm not sure why Penticton.

894
01:07:34,850 --> 01:07:39,710
I wonder about that, but we did check with them on that.

895
01:07:44,070 --> 01:07:46,630
Do they have any actual farms that are paying now?

896
01:07:46,630 --> 01:07:47,750
Because then those farmers are out of business.

897
01:07:47,790 --> 01:07:49,150
Yeah, well, that's that one.

898
01:07:50,310 --> 01:07:51,010
They're out of business.

899
01:07:51,690 --> 01:07:53,170
There's the orchards and vineyards

900
01:07:53,170 --> 01:07:55,910
don't pay for enough to ever justify that kind of a water

901
01:07:55,910 --> 01:07:56,110
rate.

902
01:07:56,610 --> 01:07:59,890
Even ours is getting to the point where I get a lot of phone

903
01:07:59,890 --> 01:08:01,130
calls, and I'm sure Pinter does.

904
01:08:01,350 --> 01:08:03,950
You know, when they actually, people don't pay attention

905
01:08:03,950 --> 01:08:05,950
to what's going on until we get good bill in the mail.

906
01:08:06,970 --> 01:08:08,210
Didn't pay attention real quick.

907
01:08:08,350 --> 01:08:10,590
And they go, why is there a water rate?

908
01:08:10,690 --> 01:08:11,510
How can I afford this?

909
01:08:11,830 --> 01:08:14,330
Because what farmers get isn't going up.

910
01:08:15,010 --> 01:08:16,170
If anything, it's going down.

911
01:08:16,170 --> 01:08:19,970
So anyway, I'm wondering why as soon as it's so low.

912
01:08:20,050 --> 01:08:21,190
Probably just because I have, yeah.

913
01:08:24,990 --> 01:08:30,950
That's an error because there's a big kind of pullback.

914
01:08:31,430 --> 01:08:33,510
It's over 4,000, 4,500 I think.

915
01:08:34,650 --> 01:08:39,550
We can go back and check, but I know we did call, you know,

916
01:08:39,650 --> 01:08:43,190
because we had the initial chart and then the numbers looked funny.

917
01:08:43,190 --> 01:08:48,890
So we had staff call the, the municipality's like a couple of the municipalities.

918
01:08:49,290 --> 01:08:53,410
So I'll double check on, on a story as if you're sure that the-

919
01:08:53,410 --> 01:08:55,310
Positive, it's not a letter.

920
01:08:56,090 --> 01:09:00,890
And are they fixed or do they have a variable component that we missed in our analysis?

921
01:09:01,630 --> 01:09:02,250
So a fixed?

922
01:09:04,850 --> 01:09:06,010
It might be the residential level.

923
01:09:06,190 --> 01:09:06,390
It

924
01:09:12,150 --> 01:09:15,270
would be for their, their, their two systems, right?

925
01:09:15,530 --> 01:09:20,050
That they have water counselors for, just outside of the town boundary.

926
01:09:20,750 --> 01:09:23,790
I don't know how they're doing their fair stewardship.

927
01:09:25,190 --> 01:09:28,290
We'll definitely check that and bring back the comparison.

928
01:09:28,490 --> 01:09:32,630
As this goes along, we'll hear what the other municipalities are proposing

929
01:09:32,630 --> 01:09:36,250
in terms of rate increases, because I haven't looked,

930
01:09:36,690 --> 01:09:38,310
I haven't seen anything on that yet.

931
01:09:40,740 --> 01:09:43,420
In actual fact, we have to make sure that our rates are equal,

932
01:09:43,720 --> 01:09:46,460
but at the same time, we've got to make sure that our farmers

933
01:09:46,460 --> 01:09:48,620
and all of them are made competitive with other farmers.

934
01:09:48,620 --> 01:09:55,360
And I used to use the exact example of Kelowna because it was it was they were had a huge advantage because it was from

935
01:09:56,260 --> 01:09:57,060
Reservoirs in the hills

936
01:09:58,220 --> 01:10:04,460
You know, it was their cheap, you know, I mean we got to make sure our water our farmers can survive. That's a big bill

937
01:10:05,340 --> 01:10:09,840
Anyway, you know, I mean, it's it's a big percentage of what they get for their product

938
01:10:09,840 --> 01:10:12,760
So we dive, you know every year I'm sitting here

939
01:10:13,400 --> 01:10:17,880
Found this message because I'm hearing it from the guys that it's hard to pay those bills, you know

940
01:10:17,880 --> 01:10:20,400
I mean, yeah, I don't know what the solution is,

941
01:10:20,440 --> 01:10:24,560
but we're gonna talk a bit about Rockliff

942
01:10:24,560 --> 01:10:26,640
and 1.1 million dollars.

943
01:10:27,900 --> 01:10:29,360
And anyway, when we get there,

944
01:10:29,420 --> 01:10:30,540
I got some questions about it.

945
01:10:30,800 --> 01:10:31,300
And then let's go.

946
01:10:33,560 --> 01:10:36,040
Thank you, Worship, in response to that,

947
01:10:36,140 --> 01:10:36,680
I understand that.

948
01:10:36,700 --> 01:10:38,420
And we go through this discussion every year,

949
01:10:38,520 --> 01:10:39,760
and every year we fight to keep

950
01:10:40,320 --> 01:10:41,860
the water rates down for the farmers,

951
01:10:41,980 --> 01:10:43,540
keep the water rates down for the farmers,

952
01:10:44,120 --> 01:10:46,160
and every year we're faced with the same situation

953
01:10:46,160 --> 01:10:47,320
where we don't have enough money.

954
01:10:48,700 --> 01:10:53,040
So somewhere along the line we have to change that balance a little bit, I hate to say it,

955
01:10:53,080 --> 01:10:55,140
but that balance needs to change somewhat.

956
01:10:55,720 --> 01:11:00,080
I recognize it's not an easy business, I totally appreciate that.

957
01:11:00,980 --> 01:11:05,720
It's not easy living in town, paying for water either on a fixed income or anything else,

958
01:11:06,160 --> 01:11:12,580
but nonetheless we increase those rates and you made the comment and I appreciate that

959
01:11:12,580 --> 01:11:14,500
is that the users have to pay.

960
01:11:14,500 --> 01:11:15,200
On

961
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:34,140
this side, I've just shown the impact for all of her on a 10 acre parcel, so it would

962
01:11:34,140 --> 01:11:44,080
go up $159 per year, or $1325 per month, but that's with a 5% increase.

963
01:11:44,420 --> 01:11:47,940
It's an annual pick up of $159.

964
01:11:50,420 --> 01:11:56,720
Through the CFO, is that 5% based on borrowing for that 1.1?

965
01:11:56,720 --> 01:12:02,520
I'm a little confused because in the budget the way I read it through, it's not going to try and fund it.

966
01:12:03,440 --> 01:12:07,700
So if we borrow, then what is that? I mean, there's got to kind of have...

967
01:12:07,700 --> 01:12:10,080
I didn't answer that question as to what it really...

968
01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:15,060
You know, if we decide to borrow, is it 5% or is it 3% to be able to balance the budget?

969
01:12:15,940 --> 01:12:18,960
You know, so what is that 5% based on it?

970
01:12:19,080 --> 01:12:23,240
What I read through here was that we were going to try and fund it, whether through grants or through water capital.

971
01:12:23,240 --> 01:12:25,380
So that's how you came to that 5%?

972
01:12:25,800 --> 01:12:27,860
Or did you come to the 5% based on borrowing?

973
01:12:28,340 --> 01:12:31,180
And you just told us it was $75,000 annually.

974
01:12:31,620 --> 01:12:33,220
So that obviously is going to change the numbers.

975
01:12:34,120 --> 01:12:39,580
Through the mayor to come from a shell, it'll adjust them marginally

976
01:12:39,580 --> 01:12:42,540
because you can see if you look at the water rate, this is consolidated.

977
01:12:43,080 --> 01:12:48,320
So all service, you can see our reserve is going to 268.

978
01:12:48,320 --> 01:12:57,800
So if you say, well, we're going to lose $70,000 to principal and interest payments in 2027,

979
01:12:58,580 --> 01:13:06,900
that reserve, you know, the $36,000 in 2028, well, hit one 2027, you know, that would drop to 200.

980
01:13:07,580 --> 01:13:11,160
You know how the, because you're going to have less, put less in reserve if you have

981
01:13:11,160 --> 01:13:17,020
more operating expenses. So would I change the rate from, I guess your question is,

982
01:13:17,020 --> 01:13:23,720
what I changed the rate from 5% to 4% or 3% if we borrowed. Our reserves are marginal

983
01:13:23,720 --> 01:13:29,480
at best, so I don't know if I would say that would make the rate lower, because I think

984
01:13:31,650 --> 01:13:36,810
the rates probably need to, unless government, because we only have so much we can borrow

985
01:13:36,810 --> 01:13:46,650
too. We have a limit. We're not there, but we're coming up against where increases

986
01:13:46,650 --> 01:13:50,690
are going to have to happen to get some of these projects done?

987
01:13:52,940 --> 01:13:53,440
Tell us a minute.

988
01:13:53,880 --> 01:13:58,780
The water system is not subject to the same borrowing limits as the rest of the municipality.

989
01:13:59,680 --> 01:14:02,040
The water system can borrow what they need.

990
01:14:02,920 --> 01:14:09,540
So that is not that we want to go into debt any more than we need to, but that's not

991
01:14:09,540 --> 01:14:11,820
a consideration when it comes to the water system.

992
01:14:12,900 --> 01:14:16,700
I just want to say that we should get that clarified, because I understand that

993
01:14:16,700 --> 01:14:21,980
we don't need to go to the electorate, because if one solid was dissolved, there was a propasion

994
01:14:21,980 --> 01:14:26,660
put in there that you didn't have to go to the electorate, but I wasn't aware that we

995
01:14:26,660 --> 01:14:30,660
could borrow whatever we wanted, so we should clarify that. I don't have the answer to it,

996
01:14:30,660 --> 01:14:35,140
so I can't say definitely yes or no to that. We should look into it.

997
01:14:35,660 --> 01:14:37,800
I thought we had a limit on it.

998
01:14:38,060 --> 01:14:46,140
I assume that the debt capacity is a debt capacity, and you don't need to get electoral

999
01:14:46,140 --> 01:14:51,760
ascent for borrowing for utilities but I could be I could I'd need to look into

1000
01:14:51,760 --> 01:14:54,960
that to confirm because the

1001
01:14:58,990 --> 01:14:59,730
question to

1002
01:15:21,580 --> 01:15:27,000
I'm interested to know, like, future lobbying with UBCM and stuff like that and the challenge

1003
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:32,780
with the high water rates, is there a way through taxation or income tax to be able to

1004
01:15:32,780 --> 01:15:41,020
have farmers, you know, be able to write off more than that? Or, I don't know, but I mean,

1005
01:15:41,100 --> 01:15:46,040
it's an expense, so if it goes up, they're ready, they're able to write that off against

1006
01:15:46,040 --> 01:15:47,640
the profit of their farms. Okay.

1007
01:15:47,880 --> 01:15:51,820
Yeah, it's not expensive like any other, it's not expensive like fertilizer or trees

1008
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:53,560
or...

1009
01:15:56,310 --> 01:16:02,990
Yeah, just to answer that question there is a way because on your taxes you see fire library and everything else

1010
01:16:02,990 --> 01:16:09,710
If you want more residents of BC the four million five million did pitch in downtown, Vancouver and the bigger cities

1011
01:16:09,710 --> 01:16:14,610
There could be a line item on everybody's taxes where it's four dollars

1012
01:16:15,270 --> 01:16:17,570
Whatever that works out to to help

1013
01:16:17,570 --> 01:16:21,950
the agriculture in British Columbia pay for some of the

1014
01:16:23,510 --> 01:16:25,190
Something you know it's a future thing

1015
01:16:26,310 --> 01:16:28,870
You didn't propose before, but you just left off the matter.

1016
01:16:29,730 --> 01:16:30,450
Thank you, Richard.

1017
01:16:30,990 --> 01:16:33,250
Yeah, I'm wondering too, if there's any precedent for,

1018
01:16:33,390 --> 01:16:36,030
I mean, the same that we do with like our class rate

1019
01:16:36,030 --> 01:16:38,870
multipliers, if anything's been done similarly

1020
01:16:38,870 --> 01:16:42,230
between irrigation residential water,

1021
01:16:47,010 --> 01:16:48,530
like to adjust the tax rate,

1022
01:16:48,730 --> 01:16:51,190
or to adjust the increase,

1023
01:16:51,370 --> 01:16:53,730
or like something following a similar model.

1024
01:16:55,210 --> 01:16:56,070
I'm through the minute.

1025
01:16:56,470 --> 01:16:58,830
To answer the question, in terms of the multipliers,

1026
01:16:58,990 --> 01:16:59,790
there's a multiplier.

1027
01:16:59,790 --> 01:17:02,910
are obviously for farm, so you're saying we could somehow,

1028
01:17:03,290 --> 01:17:04,570
but there's not, the tax burden,

1029
01:17:05,210 --> 01:17:07,590
the actual property tax burden on the farms is not,

1030
01:17:07,670 --> 01:17:10,610
there's not a lot of revenue there.

1031
01:17:11,830 --> 01:17:14,050
I'd have to look, but it's not like it's a,

1032
01:17:14,330 --> 01:17:16,850
residential is, you know, residential and business

1033
01:17:17,490 --> 01:17:20,910
and large industry are three big ones

1034
01:17:20,910 --> 01:17:22,830
with residential and business being the two

1035
01:17:22,830 --> 01:17:26,050
and then other, their farm and recreational

1036
01:17:26,050 --> 01:17:27,370
are pretty small.

1037
01:17:27,370 --> 01:17:31,490
So, you're right. You could adjust that to make less of a tax burden.

1038
01:17:33,490 --> 01:17:39,630
Certainly, to pick up the $159 increase, I mean, I guess that's, you know, you could do that.

1039
01:17:39,910 --> 01:17:43,370
I don't know if that's the answer, but just kind of spitballing.

1040
01:17:43,850 --> 01:17:45,390
I'll just offer some thoughts on that.

1041
01:17:45,550 --> 01:17:47,110
Not the UBCM.

1042
01:17:47,430 --> 01:17:52,030
Summerland's been leading the charge with having a lot of farm properties

1043
01:17:52,810 --> 01:17:55,330
and not getting very much tax from those properties

1044
01:17:55,330 --> 01:18:02,390
yet having a lot of utility costs delivering water and sewer out to farms in remote areas in their district.

1045
01:18:03,410 --> 01:18:06,490
And the Ministry of Agriculture has been working with them.

1046
01:18:07,170 --> 01:18:08,390
I did attend a meeting there.

1047
01:18:08,990 --> 01:18:12,950
They are looking at different things, nothing concrete at this point,

1048
01:18:13,010 --> 01:18:15,370
but they do recognize that as a significant problem.

1049
01:18:15,870 --> 01:18:20,010
Looking at the threshold that you need to make to be able to maintain farm status,

1050
01:18:20,130 --> 01:18:24,390
those type of things, because there seems to be a lot of people that are slipping kind of,

1051
01:18:24,390 --> 01:18:30,890
Like you can get farm status with very little income being generated and either they need

1052
01:18:30,890 --> 01:18:33,930
to up that or else they need to be taxed at a different rate.

1053
01:18:34,270 --> 01:18:39,570
So something that's getting more discussion, especially in places like Summerland and Lower

1054
01:18:39,570 --> 01:18:43,150
Mainland, those type of things, it's definitely a conversation that's happening.

1055
01:19:03,500 --> 01:19:09,160
So that's the capital and operating for water and sewer service.

1056
01:19:09,160 --> 01:19:11,360
So the

1057
01:19:14,110 --> 01:19:21,470
next version will come back at the next meeting and I will put the debt, the burrowing

1058
01:19:21,470 --> 01:19:32,190
in for that project in the next version as well will bring the proposed, unless Council

1059
01:19:32,190 --> 01:19:39,150
wishes differently, but the proposed increases into a draft bylaw for Council's consideration

1060
01:19:39,150 --> 01:19:50,410
at the next meeting. Or I can come back with a different scenario that you have that option

1061
01:19:50,410 --> 01:19:51,310
at your avail.

1062
01:19:53,740 --> 01:19:56,140
Just go to Councillor Benjamin that you had your hand up first.

1063
01:19:56,540 --> 01:19:57,160
Sure. I'm

1064
01:19:59,180 --> 01:20:04,560
just going to ask a question specifically to the Director of Operations just about the,

1065
01:20:16,190 --> 01:20:21,790
So it sounds like the issues that are urgent this year

1066
01:20:21,790 --> 01:20:23,750
have been ongoing for a couple of years.

1067
01:20:24,030 --> 01:20:26,670
Like is there something that pushed it over the line

1068
01:20:26,670 --> 01:20:31,050
to make it drop dead urgent in 2026?

1069
01:20:31,450 --> 01:20:32,910
When it wasn't in 2025?

1070
01:20:33,450 --> 01:20:35,310
Or sorry, not the pumps, if you'd like to say it.

1071
01:20:35,950 --> 01:20:38,230
This is how you're worshiped to Councilor Grice,

1072
01:20:38,610 --> 01:20:39,730
or sorry, Councilor Vintemela.

1073
01:20:41,330 --> 01:20:43,090
It's literally just sort of picking

1074
01:20:43,090 --> 01:20:44,310
those priorities each year.

1075
01:20:44,310 --> 01:20:50,470
This is born radar, but looking at it as sort of that highest priority and where we're at right now with the irrigation

1076
01:20:50,470 --> 01:20:55,230
This is the number one pump hosts. It literally pumps as much as two other pump hosts

1077
01:20:56,470 --> 01:21:01,690
So looking at the sort of different priorities. That's why I actually had I actually had tuckle new it for this year

1078
01:21:01,690 --> 01:21:07,790
I've pushed that to 2027 because I really want to get in town taking care of in the sense of the pump hosts

1079
01:21:07,790 --> 01:21:10,830
We've dealt with rock cliff. Obviously. There's some issues and hiccups there

1080
01:21:11,690 --> 01:21:16,990
We're dealing with that, but we do have sort of our main domestic pump posts in town upgraded.

1081
01:21:17,390 --> 01:21:19,170
Feel comfortable with that. There's no worries.

1082
01:21:20,410 --> 01:21:24,010
Looking at sort of the same thing on the irrigation side is that main pump station

1083
01:21:24,010 --> 01:21:28,970
that pushes sort of, you know, to some of the pump posts, it's three times the amount of water.

1084
01:21:29,390 --> 01:21:31,410
It's just a critical piece of infrastructure.

1085
01:21:31,930 --> 01:21:36,050
And more of this is just the ionizers and the screen that we install in the arm

1086
01:21:36,050 --> 01:21:40,230
and just learning more about the capacity we're at with that particular pump station.

1087
01:21:40,230 --> 01:21:45,150
really really scares staff for sure and how what that would mean to an

1088
01:21:45,150 --> 01:21:46,010
irrigation season.

1089
01:21:48,930 --> 01:21:53,750
My question was kind of along the same lines in other words it

1090
01:21:53,750 --> 01:21:58,030
seems like we're at the budget time we're always we all these crisis you

1091
01:21:58,030 --> 01:22:02,270
know we have this oh my god it's all gonna fall apart yet it's been going on

1092
01:22:02,270 --> 01:22:06,210
and also another question we don't run all three pumps there do all three

1093
01:22:06,210 --> 01:22:10,450
pumps were at the same time? To push the 9,000? Or is it staged?

1094
01:22:11,910 --> 01:22:16,610
Through your worship counselor, Michelle, I think originally, I think they were staged

1095
01:22:16,610 --> 01:22:20,990
and that's why there's only a 400 amp service. To the capacity that pushes now, we have all

1096
01:22:20,990 --> 01:22:25,410
three pumps running at all the time. So we've got a 200 horsepower and two 150s and they're

1097
01:22:25,410 --> 01:22:31,370
running all the time. So the demand is also picked up, I think, over the years.

1098
01:22:32,810 --> 01:22:37,570
And it literally, that's just what we need to keep that up, is that thing running all the time?

1099
01:22:38,730 --> 01:22:39,590
Further to that?

1100
01:22:39,770 --> 01:22:43,370
Yeah, I'm just curious as to how demand is kind of picking up on that pump station.

1101
01:22:43,510 --> 01:22:45,350
We must have all the data and charts and everything.

1102
01:22:45,790 --> 01:22:53,510
Because a lot of the practices that orchard is, and also vineyards especially, use less water.

1103
01:22:54,830 --> 01:22:55,450
We know that.

1104
01:22:56,070 --> 01:22:57,270
That's what we do as farmers.

1105
01:22:57,850 --> 01:23:00,530
We implement practices that use less water.

1106
01:23:00,530 --> 01:23:06,290
So I'm just curious where that demands coming from because I don't think we've had any expansion of acreage in that in number two

1107
01:23:06,290 --> 01:23:10,210
You know in that pump hose. So I don't yeah, I'm just I just

1108
01:23:10,950 --> 01:23:16,890
I'm frustrated that we sit here as a council. We've got this we are always told that we have this thing that's gonna every year

1109
01:23:16,890 --> 01:23:19,970
That's gonna, you know, I mean that one year was lying the pipe

1110
01:23:19,970 --> 01:23:23,330
I'm you know, I'm going back to it because it was like a crisis, you know

1111
01:23:23,330 --> 01:23:28,790
There's other projects in here like replacing the AC piping, you know, I was I was reading through them

1112
01:23:28,790 --> 01:23:29,550
and they're quite expensive.

1113
01:23:30,410 --> 01:23:33,490
Once again, you know, we're being told on the AC piping.

1114
01:23:33,830 --> 01:23:35,030
I'm gonna go to that because I have

1115
01:23:35,030 --> 01:23:36,310
no questions about it.

1116
01:23:36,550 --> 01:23:38,550
That it's at the end of its life expectancy

1117
01:23:38,550 --> 01:23:39,830
and I did a quick Google search.

1118
01:23:40,070 --> 01:23:42,950
It's anywhere between 50 to 75 years on AC piping,

1119
01:23:43,210 --> 01:23:45,390
depending on soil types and whatever.

1120
01:23:45,930 --> 01:23:47,690
So once again, I think we should be testing.

1121
01:23:48,410 --> 01:23:50,210
I said that that year with the other,

1122
01:23:50,430 --> 01:23:51,210
we should be testing.

1123
01:23:51,730 --> 01:23:53,970
I don't, you know, somebody should give me a report

1124
01:23:53,970 --> 01:23:56,390
that says, okay, this AC pipe has been tested

1125
01:23:56,390 --> 01:23:58,270
and it'll last another 15 years

1126
01:23:58,270 --> 01:24:00,110
it's got to be replaced within two years.

1127
01:24:00,910 --> 01:24:02,550
You know, we can make better decisions as a council

1128
01:24:02,550 --> 01:24:04,030
if I have that information.

1129
01:24:04,630 --> 01:24:05,990
I don't like crisis management.

1130
01:24:06,810 --> 01:24:08,690
It seems like we've got, you know,

1131
01:24:08,850 --> 01:24:10,490
now it's, now it's rocket aggregation

1132
01:24:10,490 --> 01:24:11,830
that we've got to do right now.

1133
01:24:12,370 --> 01:24:14,230
You know, I'm not saying we don't have to do it.

1134
01:24:14,530 --> 01:24:15,610
I'm not saying that at all,

1135
01:24:15,750 --> 01:24:19,030
but I'm saying that it's better for me anyway

1136
01:24:19,030 --> 01:24:21,350
to be able to plan, you know,

1137
01:24:21,530 --> 01:24:22,750
and see what's coming in the future.

1138
01:24:22,930 --> 01:24:24,450
And that's what I thought we did every year

1139
01:24:24,450 --> 01:24:25,810
with all these capital schedules.

1140
01:24:25,810 --> 01:24:32,010
It's just, it's frustrating that we've got these crisis that happen and yet we keep planning

1141
01:24:32,010 --> 01:24:33,910
every year for longer range.

1142
01:24:34,710 --> 01:24:34,930
Anyway.

1143
01:24:37,280 --> 01:24:37,800
Mr. Shepard.

1144
01:24:38,100 --> 01:24:38,420
Thank you.

1145
01:24:38,920 --> 01:24:47,720
I can appreciate what Councillor Michelle is saying, but thinking about these three

1146
01:24:47,720 --> 01:24:52,400
wells that are being decommissioned, I understand that there are different reasons

1147
01:24:52,400 --> 01:25:02,120
for each of them, but with now the crisis of the war cliff well, and that's a huge burden

1148
01:25:02,120 --> 01:25:09,460
on that well to try to pump that much, but we talked to, I can't remember, maybe it was

1149
01:25:09,460 --> 01:25:18,790
last year's budget time, about the need for a new well at some point, and now there's

1150
01:25:18,790 --> 01:25:25,250
going to be a big bump up in the budget and definitely get this is irrigation

1151
01:25:25,250 --> 01:25:30,030
from the canal not from a well this is irrigation from the canal you're

1152
01:25:30,030 --> 01:25:34,890
confusing it to I think councilor Schaefer this is rock if well as well no I

1153
01:25:34,890 --> 01:25:39,890
don't know but he's saying I was just wondering if there is a timeline for

1154
01:25:39,890 --> 01:25:42,690
you know possible new well through

1155
01:25:47,270 --> 01:25:51,330
your worship to to council Schaefer right

1156
01:25:51,330 --> 01:25:54,970
Right now there is, it's about 10 years out, it needs to be monitored.

1157
01:25:55,990 --> 01:25:59,130
We've looked at a lot of our water conservation, a lot of things that we're trying to do.

1158
01:25:59,230 --> 01:26:03,230
We're trying to defer that, that is one of the big items, we're trying to defer that

1159
01:26:03,230 --> 01:26:05,730
sort of to that 20 years of when we need to do well.

1160
01:26:06,370 --> 01:26:12,430
We tend to have a plan of location and that type of thing, but true engineering basically

1161
01:26:12,430 --> 01:26:14,390
has proven out that we're okay for now.

1162
01:26:14,990 --> 01:26:18,950
I do have that at the tail end of sort of the 10 year to kind of do that investigation

1163
01:26:18,950 --> 01:26:24,790
again, but we're sort of seven to ten years out before we need to look at that.

1164
01:26:25,810 --> 01:26:28,390
Demand needs to go up. I think housing needs to come into place.

1165
01:26:28,690 --> 01:26:32,350
A lot of different things will affect that, and only time is going to justify that.

1166
01:26:33,170 --> 01:26:36,990
When I look at all of the composts out there, all of the irrigation

1167
01:26:36,990 --> 01:26:41,850
composts are in the 70s. Tuckle Nuit sort of starts in 83 and up.

1168
01:26:41,850 --> 01:26:48,630
Rockcliff was 91. Miller, I think, is 2008. Buchanan is 2016.

1169
01:26:49,190 --> 01:26:52,150
So when you actually look at our domestic pump posts, we're in pretty good shape.

1170
01:26:52,710 --> 01:26:58,150
And literally, in that 10-year plan, I do have all the irrigation pump posts in that 10-year plan.

1171
01:26:59,190 --> 01:27:01,150
And this is information coming from staff.

1172
01:27:04,390 --> 01:27:07,630
And I trust they're the ones that are out there every single day

1173
01:27:07,630 --> 01:27:10,910
and what I've observed and what we've added to that pump post with the INI.

1174
01:27:10,910 --> 01:27:13,390
So if that pump hose goes down, the ionizer goes down.

1175
01:27:13,510 --> 01:27:15,490
So never mind the pump hoses, we still have running.

1176
01:27:15,910 --> 01:27:17,470
That ionizer on the south goes down.

1177
01:27:17,590 --> 01:27:18,550
We have an algae problem.

1178
01:27:18,910 --> 01:27:21,530
I mean, it escalates and escalates and escalates from there.

1179
01:27:22,010 --> 01:27:24,570
So, and forgive me, but I've only been here

1180
01:27:24,570 --> 01:27:25,270
two and a half years.

1181
01:27:25,690 --> 01:27:27,570
And in the five year capital plans

1182
01:27:27,570 --> 01:27:29,870
from water and sewer in 2018, 2019,

1183
01:27:30,590 --> 01:27:32,170
I have every single project in here.

1184
01:27:32,350 --> 01:27:34,930
These projects that I'm introducing aren't in that plan.

1185
01:27:35,070 --> 01:27:37,130
And this is why I wanna be able

1186
01:27:37,130 --> 01:27:38,530
to do our own asset management

1187
01:27:38,530 --> 01:27:42,890
and be able to track that and be able to implement that and sort of be live and updated all of

1188
01:27:42,890 --> 01:27:43,210
the time.

1189
01:27:43,430 --> 01:27:48,390
As staff comes up with these situations and these issues, I can update that we can adjust

1190
01:27:48,390 --> 01:27:50,250
our budget and adjust our ten-year plan.

1191
01:27:50,670 --> 01:27:52,330
And that's what I'm trying to get to with this.

1192
01:27:52,830 --> 01:27:56,710
And I apologize that some of this is reactive, but it's honestly, it's what I'm learning

1193
01:27:56,710 --> 01:28:01,290
month-on-month basis to what's actually happening in the field and where staff

1194
01:28:01,290 --> 01:28:03,750
is at that operates this system every single day.

1195
01:28:03,750 --> 01:28:08,150
And that's what's driving a lot of these changes in the 5-year and the 10-year capital.

1196
01:28:08,750 --> 01:28:15,590
And honestly, it's going to continue to do that because the more I learn, the more critical situations, we only have so much money.

1197
01:28:16,090 --> 01:28:22,390
And I understand last year we talked about the Victoria Clay and the AC Pipes, and it's 60 years old.

1198
01:28:22,770 --> 01:28:24,910
It falls into that 50 to 75-year time frame.

1199
01:28:25,430 --> 01:28:28,810
I brought it up that, hey, we have $100 million in pipe replacement here.

1200
01:28:29,050 --> 01:28:30,410
Are we going to have to do that today?

1201
01:28:30,990 --> 01:28:32,790
No, but we're going to have to do that in the future.

1202
01:28:32,790 --> 01:28:36,050
It's just like a new well that's going to cost six, seven, eight million dollars.

1203
01:28:36,450 --> 01:28:40,570
So all of this is coming and all I'm trying to do is actually keep our infrastructure

1204
01:28:40,570 --> 01:28:44,190
that pumps the water out of the ground or pushes the water to irrigation into fields,

1205
01:28:44,330 --> 01:28:44,810
that type of thing.

1206
01:28:45,170 --> 01:28:48,030
Running, to me that's the critical infrastructure right now so we can move it.

1207
01:28:48,370 --> 01:28:49,250
We can always fix a pipe.

1208
01:28:50,150 --> 01:28:54,030
If a pipe collapses and we have catastrophic well then that's when we come back to

1209
01:28:54,030 --> 01:28:55,310
council on an emergency situation.

1210
01:28:55,590 --> 01:28:59,890
But right now the critical things to me is what the lift stations, the pump houses

1211
01:28:59,890 --> 01:29:03,430
that push and process our water and our sewer.

1212
01:29:03,710 --> 01:29:05,110
That's our major concentration

1213
01:29:05,110 --> 01:29:06,750
and that's what I'm trying to put forward.

1214
01:29:07,470 --> 01:29:07,990
Thank you.

1215
01:29:08,730 --> 01:29:09,250
Councilor Grace.

1216
01:29:09,810 --> 01:29:10,390
Thank you, Worship.

1217
01:29:10,590 --> 01:29:11,590
I know you touched on it too,

1218
01:29:11,650 --> 01:29:12,950
but I was gonna sort of remind us

1219
01:29:12,950 --> 01:29:15,190
of this robust asset management plan

1220
01:29:15,190 --> 01:29:16,610
that we're working on too that's coming

1221
01:29:16,610 --> 01:29:18,310
that will hopefully help better inform

1222
01:29:18,310 --> 01:29:21,490
our capital planning as we go forward.

1223
01:29:21,810 --> 01:29:23,710
I was gonna ask, just as a reminder,

1224
01:29:23,930 --> 01:29:25,370
because I can't remember sort of where we're at

1225
01:29:25,370 --> 01:29:26,630
in that process right now,

1226
01:29:26,990 --> 01:29:28,930
of building that new asset management plan.

1227
01:29:30,230 --> 01:29:36,110
Through your worship to you, Councillor Grace, we've literally just purchased that asset portion.

1228
01:29:36,350 --> 01:29:40,070
So we're looking to move forward with that, and then we've applied in the SPF grant on

1229
01:29:40,070 --> 01:29:41,430
that asset management side.

1230
01:29:41,890 --> 01:29:46,590
We applied for the budget program and the, was the other one, sir?

1231
01:29:46,770 --> 01:29:48,070
Staff to input the stuff.

1232
01:29:48,350 --> 01:29:54,730
Yes, and also for a one year hire to actually input and sort of expedite that into the

1233
01:29:54,730 --> 01:29:56,370
assets because it's all data driven.

1234
01:29:56,370 --> 01:29:59,850
So to get all of our assets into that program, that's the key.

1235
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:04,360
And then go from there. But we budgeted for the budget software, and there was another one

1236
01:30:04,360 --> 01:30:05,200
that went with that, John.

1237
01:30:07,760 --> 01:30:10,580
So I just lost it. But anyways, there was two pieces of software

1238
01:30:10,580 --> 01:30:17,680
that go hand in hand through PSD citywide, through that process. And then that's getting

1239
01:30:17,680 --> 01:30:21,020
all of that moving forward. And then our asset management is basically live and can

1240
01:30:21,020 --> 01:30:26,780
be updated at all the time. So we're waiting on that grant at this point, but we do have

1241
01:30:26,780 --> 01:30:31,240
that asset portion and we are moving through that training and we'll be starting to populate

1242
01:30:31,240 --> 01:30:32,480
some of that. Absolutely.

1243
01:30:32,980 --> 01:30:37,040
To follow up with I mean, when do you feel like that's going to be to a point where

1244
01:30:37,040 --> 01:30:40,880
then that's going to be able to sort of fully inform our budget process going forward?

1245
01:30:41,920 --> 01:30:48,960
If we got approval for the staff member, I would estimate three years. If we don't

1246
01:30:48,960 --> 01:30:53,640
get approval for the staff member, honestly, I think we're pushing five, six years.

1247
01:30:53,640 --> 01:30:59,700
I mean, I think some of it will be there, but we won't be complete and be able to everything won't be in there and everything

1248
01:30:59,700 --> 01:31:02,360
I mean it budget-wise as well

1249
01:31:02,960 --> 01:31:07,120
This software will replace the Excel sheets and stuff that we're utilizing right now

1250
01:31:08,080 --> 01:31:13,640
So it's all a process, but I think I think you know within that three-year time frame if we've got everything

1251
01:31:13,640 --> 01:31:17,760
We asked I think we'll be very close. That staff member was going to be grant funded though

1252
01:31:17,760 --> 01:31:22,000
That's correct. We get that grant and we're looking for the staff member over still waiting to hear back on the ground

1253
01:31:22,000 --> 01:31:25,880
I'm talking with the grant writer. We're a couple of months out. It's a federal grant,

1254
01:31:25,960 --> 01:31:30,800
but it's pushed through UBCM. And a lot of the times through the UBCM stuff, we get results

1255
01:31:30,800 --> 01:31:37,300
or at least answers a lot sooner than we do just it's a federal grant. So towards the

1256
01:31:37,300 --> 01:31:39,100
end of this year, we're hoping to hear something.

1257
01:31:39,400 --> 01:31:40,140
Thank you.

1258
01:31:42,780 --> 01:31:44,080
I'll go to CAO and then Councilman.

1259
01:31:46,080 --> 01:31:51,140
Yes. You worshiped over to Councillor Grice. There is a terms of reference being put

1260
01:31:51,140 --> 01:31:55,080
together for an asset management committee, which will include a member of council as

1261
01:31:55,080 --> 01:31:55,300
well.

1262
01:31:55,880 --> 01:31:57,300
So, somebody will be-

1263
01:31:57,300 --> 01:31:57,980
Does this sound so interesting?

1264
01:31:59,700 --> 01:32:00,160
Noted.

1265
01:32:01,420 --> 01:32:02,080
That's the best.

1266
01:32:02,520 --> 01:32:03,380
Thank you, Worship.

1267
01:32:03,600 --> 01:32:09,440
Is it possible to go back to the scenario increases water, proposed

1268
01:32:12,960 --> 01:32:13,880
water rate increases?

1269
01:32:14,080 --> 01:32:19,000
I look when I hear $100 million in pipe to be replaced, I look at a $10 million well,

1270
01:32:19,560 --> 01:32:24,640
and then I look at this sheet and I know that if Councilor Michelle and Councilor Dolly

1271
01:32:24,640 --> 01:32:31,500
Wall and whatever other faces are around the table when we hit 2028 we're going to be short of cash

1272
01:32:31,500 --> 01:32:38,820
once again as we are every other year and there will be a fight to raise a 10% percent. The

1273
01:32:38,820 --> 01:32:45,400
question I ask as a councilor is there any appetite to change the numbers in 2026 and 2027

1274
01:32:45,400 --> 01:32:51,720
to mitigate the increase in 2028, possibly provide some more money to pay

1275
01:32:51,720 --> 01:32:58,380
debt for that pump house, and also possibly provide some money for looking

1276
01:32:58,380 --> 01:33:02,360
at our pipes and the condition of those pipes so that maybe it will save us

1277
01:33:02,360 --> 01:33:06,920
money and give us flexibility down the road. I don't know what that will cost

1278
01:33:06,920 --> 01:33:11,840
and I guess as a supplementary question or whatever to ask staff if we could

1279
01:33:11,840 --> 01:33:17,460
look into what would they need every year to do inspections on our pipes, you know, so

1280
01:33:17,460 --> 01:33:21,840
that we can do, we don't have the asset management program, but maybe we can do some things to

1281
01:33:21,840 --> 01:33:27,400
push some of those expenses further out because we're always short of cash when it comes to

1282
01:33:27,400 --> 01:33:33,840
water every single year. And we fight to keep the rates down and fight to keep the rates

1283
01:33:33,840 --> 01:33:38,620
down and we go through this every year because we keep the rates down. I hate to say it,

1284
01:33:38,620 --> 01:33:49,940
But maybe it's time that we look at 7% in 2026 and 7% in 2027 and 7% in 2028 instead of a 10% in 2028.

1285
01:33:50,580 --> 01:33:58,860
And it might make your fight easier in 2027 and 2028 when you ask for to change from 7 to 5 as opposed from 10 to 5.

1286
01:34:01,170 --> 01:34:09,380
Except that this council in the last number of years has not lowered it from what staff has proposed.

1287
01:34:10,240 --> 01:34:14,300
That statement you just made is incorrect. We do not sit here and fight and drop it.

1288
01:34:14,640 --> 01:34:15,980
It's being what staff is proposing.

1289
01:34:16,440 --> 01:34:20,800
Some of the right investors might not have voted for that, but it still has gone through what staff is proposing.

1290
01:34:22,140 --> 01:34:24,200
So that's an ink. I don't.

1291
01:34:24,920 --> 01:34:32,940
And staff is proposing 5%. I guess we have to decide if we're going to fight to lower it, or if we're going to agree to that.

1292
01:34:33,560 --> 01:34:38,100
I mean, definitely not in favor of an increase in it. Absolutely not.

1293
01:34:41,350 --> 01:34:48,910
Yeah, I just want to say that if we hire it now, staff is always talking about possible

1294
01:34:48,910 --> 01:34:58,330
grants that come through, and then we're over collected in the present rather than the future.

1295
01:34:58,750 --> 01:35:03,690
And right now the economic climate doesn't line up with higher rate increases, perhaps

1296
01:35:03,690 --> 01:35:04,590
in the future it does.

1297
01:35:14,830 --> 01:35:20,850
I'm just thinking when you were talking about the irrigation rates, the other aspect of that

1298
01:35:20,850 --> 01:35:24,890
grant I was speaking to that we're going to be applying for is the money.

1299
01:35:25,490 --> 01:35:31,490
One of the things you can't apply money for or apply to give money for is to put bidders

1300
01:35:31,490 --> 01:35:34,090
on farm irrigation.

1301
01:35:34,930 --> 01:35:40,410
That's one of the things that the government's saying is an applicable,

1302
01:35:40,410 --> 01:35:41,830
uneligible expenditure.

1303
01:35:44,050 --> 01:35:46,890
So that's just something for Council to, because that's

1304
01:35:46,890 --> 01:35:50,130
an expensive, I think the Director of Operations told me, that's an expensive

1305
01:35:50,130 --> 01:35:57,450
undertaking if we ever wanted to do it. So this could be an opportunity for

1306
01:35:57,450 --> 01:35:59,710
that, if there's a benefit.

1307
01:36:02,330 --> 01:36:04,370
We've had this discussion in the past and the

1308
01:36:04,370 --> 01:36:08,130
amount of money that it would cost. I mean we don't need more debt.

1309
01:36:10,270 --> 01:36:11,870
We don't

1310
01:36:11,870 --> 01:36:16,030
example with the residential meters there's a huge cost going forward after

1311
01:36:16,030 --> 01:36:19,070
you even install them so I mean we've got a lot of dentists at town we're not

1312
01:36:19,070 --> 01:36:22,610
going to go borrow five or six or seven million dollars while I'm here to put

1313
01:36:22,610 --> 01:36:26,350
water meters in for irrigation we've got flow controls it's not like we've got

1314
01:36:26,350 --> 01:36:31,050
an open pipe farmers are restricted in how much water they can use so it's not

1315
01:36:31,050 --> 01:36:34,530
you know I'm not going to be in favor of ever spending that kind of money to

1316
01:36:34,530 --> 01:36:37,890
go and meet our water rates for farmers when we have flow controls that

1317
01:36:37,890 --> 01:36:41,450
or balancing our pumping needs with what the farmers use.

1318
01:36:43,770 --> 01:36:45,530
Yeah, this was a grant opportunity.

1319
01:36:46,110 --> 01:36:48,750
Yeah, it wasn't borrowing, I think.

1320
01:36:49,430 --> 01:36:51,990
I'm not sure if it's 100% funded that.

1321
01:36:55,740 --> 01:36:56,260
Councilor Mattis.

1322
01:36:56,420 --> 01:36:58,060
Just very quickly, I think my councilman

1323
01:36:58,060 --> 01:37:00,220
shalls more concerned with the 300,000 a year

1324
01:37:00,220 --> 01:37:03,320
to maintain them down the road and staff to go.

1325
01:37:03,480 --> 01:37:08,300
Yeah, it's sometimes it's great to get it for free.

1326
01:37:23,590 --> 01:37:26,830
I guess if there's nothing else,

1327
01:37:29,260 --> 01:37:31,080
that's the end of my report.

1328
01:37:31,680 --> 01:37:34,040
Can I just just one second have a couple more,

1329
01:37:39,120 --> 01:37:39,500
please?

1330
01:37:43,030 --> 01:37:47,970
I thought it was to do with the AC pipe and the longevity of the other 10.

1331
01:37:48,170 --> 01:37:50,930
I thought I read him here somewhere that they were 50.

1332
01:37:51,290 --> 01:37:56,350
They were approaching 50 years old, yet the director said it's 60, so I'd like to clarify that.

1333
01:37:57,090 --> 01:37:58,710
Because in the report it said 50.

1334
01:38:07,840 --> 01:38:09,640
Yeah, I did. I'd made notes.

1335
01:38:10,260 --> 01:38:10,500
Yeah,

1336
01:38:17,350 --> 01:38:17,630
here we go.

1337
01:38:21,870 --> 01:38:24,750
I can open it and look at it when it does show up.

1338
01:38:31,010 --> 01:38:31,490
Yeah,

1339
01:38:34,310 --> 01:38:37,170
so in the report it says 50, so I just want to clarify that.

1340
01:38:37,950 --> 01:38:38,970
What number is that?

1341
01:38:39,630 --> 01:38:46,790
For the AC pipe, on this one on page 7086 it says 200 millimeter AC pipe.

1342
01:38:47,290 --> 01:38:52,830
as two years remaining, 50 years in brackets, so is it 50 or is it 60?

1343
01:38:52,830 --> 01:38:54,570
That's only a piece of it.

1344
01:38:54,810 --> 01:38:55,050
Yeah.

1345
01:38:55,370 --> 01:39:00,010
Yeah, so it's been through a 65 or 75 kind of thing that was put in the ground.

1346
01:39:00,170 --> 01:39:02,630
So like it's all probably 60 on.

1347
01:39:03,070 --> 01:39:06,290
But every single piece of pipe has been put in at a different time.

1348
01:39:06,450 --> 01:39:07,610
So that particular one?

1349
01:39:09,030 --> 01:39:11,290
Is 50 according to your report, correct?

1350
01:39:12,390 --> 01:39:12,410
Yeah.

1351
01:39:12,870 --> 01:39:13,010
I

1352
01:39:26,550 --> 01:39:26,950
think we're done.

1353
01:39:27,570 --> 01:39:27,830
We're done.

1354
01:39:27,830 --> 01:39:29,450
I will call for a motion to adjourn.

1355
01:39:29,730 --> 01:39:29,750
Yeah.

1356
01:39:31,070 --> 01:39:31,550
Move second.

1357
01:39:31,630 --> 01:39:32,150
Move second.

1358
01:39:32,270 --> 01:39:32,610
All in favor?

1359
01:39:34,010 --> 01:39:36,650
We have another meeting coming for

1360
01:39:39,430 --> 01:39:39,690
this.

1361
01:39:40,810 --> 01:39:43,290
We have something for the meeting that we just...

1362
01:39:43,290 --> 01:39:44,830
There was a...

1363
01:39:44,830 --> 01:39:45,190
We

1364
01:39:51,780 --> 01:39:53,240
decided on that yet.

1365
01:39:53,460 --> 01:39:53,700
Thank you.