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Okay. Welcome to the Snowmass Village Town Council Chambers. Today is October the 14th. It is 420. And this is the work session.

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But, Megan, please do roll call.

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Roll call for work session October 14th. Councilmember Fridstein.

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Here.

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Councilmember Merle.

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Here.

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Councilmember Schenck.

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Here.

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Councilmember Gustafson.

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Here.

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Mayor Madsen.

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I'm here.

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Thank you.

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All right. Thank you.

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So today we've got a discussion about our airport.

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We're going to have a presentation from Aspen Flyright,

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and also a whole lot of people for our local airport.

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So we'll start with Amory Lovens.

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Welcome, Amory.

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Good to have you here.

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We're starting a little bit late.

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One second.

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Amory on a mic.

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Well, thank you.

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I appreciate the invitation.

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Sorry I was delayed by an unannounced closed road.

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I'm going to summarize key facts for Aspen Flywright. Chuck Butler will discuss the two

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ballot measures for a total of 20 minutes, then 10 discussion followed by the same format

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with expansion advocates. Clint described your 83-minute session on July 17th with two leading

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expansion advocates, one of them on county staff, as the fact-based staff presentation,

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Supposedly official, neutral and accurate. I didn't hear it that way, neither did several council members who asked to hear the other side.

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And almost three months and two follow-ups later, I appreciated Clint's kind invitation.

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He calls today's sessions, both of them advocacy, the same length, hence manifestly fair.

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I think members and the public will have to decide whether giving the pro

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expansion side three point eight times more face time than its critics is fair

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and a good look but I'm glad to be here. All five of the airport groups in this

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taxonomy agree that our vital and beloved Aspen Airport is

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up-standard deteriorated and in need of upgrades. But which ones? Everyone wants

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a safe, clean, quiet, better Aspen Airport for all. But the three upper groups

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shown do not want the bigger planes that the lower two groups want to add.

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Bigger planes that are not needed to achieve any of those goals and that they

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don't want to mention because it's unpopular. They never mentioned the

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specific plane, the 130 to 160 seat Airbus 22300, for which the FAA wants

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their airport rebuilt. Our main airlines don't want it. The coalition

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Regional jets are the right size.

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It's not certified to fly here in the county's lead forecast

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or personally thinks it never will.

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But our airport would be redesigned for that double-sized plane,

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not for the 109-seat, 221-hundred that you'll hear about.

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Either one would open the floodgates.

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Now, since all groups agree on the modernization agenda except bigger planes

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and the other side conflates the two,

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I'm going to focus just on bigger planes,

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not on the consensus topics like the new runway terminal and transit integration.

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When those come up, please ask yourself, does this gold need bigger planes?

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It won't.

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Modernization works fine with just regional jets.

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Bigger planes are a bolt-on, not an unavoidably bundled package deal.

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I'm going to address safety, environment, overcrowding, regulation, and finance.

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Then Chuck will discuss the ballot measures.

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Aspen Flyrite can't do that as a 501-C3 Public Charity.

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Our respective groups are completely separate and independent addressing different topics.

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Aspen Flyrite does science, facts, and public education,

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and we carefully document our work at aspenflyrite.org.

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Now we're told that the new layout brings critical safety improvements on the ground and in the air,

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and that our airport does not meet FAA safety standards.

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Both statements are false.

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claims that the 400-foot runway taxiway separation is an FAA safety requirement

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amid the punchline if we want to bring in bigger planes, but our airport is now

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safe for the airplanes that can legally use it. No analysis shows that it

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has any safety problem or how expansion for bigger planes would fix that

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problem. FAA designed our 95-foot wingspan limit to be exactly as safe

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with our actual planes and layout, as with standard ones.

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That equivalent safety has worked fine for 25 years, there's no reason to change it.

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FEA said they wouldn't make us, you'll see the video, Deputy County Manager Rich Engelhard

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said two years ago that our airport is about as safe as it can possibly be.

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This month Bruce Gordon said as regards safety and the proximity of the taxiway to the

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runway, I personally have been flying in and out of this airport as an ATP commercial

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in CFII rated pilot to top levels for over 40 years had never felt the current

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distance to be a problem or felt unsafe. Now I think the word safety is being

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thrown around here as a magic incantation but not an actual need. The

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county was unable to show me any analysis of an actual safety problem.

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That's a myth. And I suppose theoretically wider separation or wider

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Their runways might make operations a little safer, but claiming that is really an attack

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on FAA safety standards, which don't call for those improvements for the planes we have.

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I'm not prepared to do that without strong evidence for which I can find no basis in

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practice or literature.

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Also bigger planes are not safer for basic reasons.

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the new United E175s will have better avionics.

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That's good. That's done.

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Now, the FAA does prohibit local enforcement of unjust discrimination

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between different aircraft type sizes or operators.

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So once we allow any bigger planes in, all that fit can come,

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even if they're dirty, noisy, and bad for climate,

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like the many hundreds of private 737s, A31920s,

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and many, many of other types.

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Bill Tompchich's misleading 737 post

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is almost all about implausible airline use,

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not the lighter private versions

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that are the real concern.

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Now, nobody knows or can know

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whether worse old private planes would add more harm

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than bigger new airline or private planes could subtract.

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So, net environmental effects

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are unknowable and unenforceable.

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But counting just airline planes' impacts,

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small fraction of all our flights. The county's official forecast plunks all

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six of the specific environmental goals that it's claimed to deliver or align

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with. Rather than falling at least 30% by 2030 in yellow, the red data show that

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noise would rise and then fall imperceptibly. Noise damaging nitrogen

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oxides would just keep rising and CO2 emissions would fall little or could

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rise with proposed new east coast routes.

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The other three goals are also missed.

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The environmental benefits of the county's plan have been quietly dropped from the modernization

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plan online and yet are still advertised as what it would do.

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These goals may however be met within a decade, then far surpassed by super quiet and

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Clean Plains, whose $118 billion global order book now has more electric than fueled planes,

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but the county has refused for two years to learn about them, and they're not in the forecast.

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They will leapfrog even the best fueled planes, like the 220-100, leaving our new airport

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potentially not fit for purpose, overbuilt for fueled planes that can no longer compete.

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And they will not need wider wingspans, as was thought until four years ago.

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New technology can reach any U.S. airport, even London, yet fit today's airfield.

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There's also a public health sleeper that worries me.

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Jet engines blast quintillions of dangerous nanoparticles toward the kids' ski school

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at the base of buttermilk and scatter them also onto the flight path.

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Nanoparticles are not regulated.

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Their levels added around the airport have not been measured.

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But our citizen science measurements of air quality last year concern me

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and should concern everyone because new medical science implicates nanoparticles in many serious

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conditions not previously described air pollution. How many more visitors can our communities

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value and values accept? The county forecasts 31 percent more business

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jets flights and airline passengers in the 20 years from 2022. The FAA forecasts three-fourths

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more airline passengers in 2050 than we strained to serve now and then forever more, it's pretty scary.

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That future threatens ever more queues, sign-ups, limits, blackout dates for all our activities

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that we need for a good life of viable workforce and strong families.

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And that's just the airline passengers, not the unknown and uncontrollable numbers arriving

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by the dominant private planes, especially forecasted charters with up to 60 seats that may or may not be used depending on market conditions.

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Are we full yet?

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See, if you don't think bigger planes will come, why build for them?

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If you think they will come, do you really think our elected officials will suddenly become able to halt the growth in STRs and other lodgings that really drive it?

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If not, why enable airport overgrowth so we can find out, irreversibly?

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Why create big permanent problems when we don't need to?

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And speaking of the community with deep gratitude and admiration to all the citizens who work so hard on ASE Vision,

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I'm sorry to report that it did not yield the robust consensus officially claimed.

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Three-fifths of its nearly 160 initial volunteers quit, many feeling herded.

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only 30% endorsed part and a handpicked 10% endorsed all of its findings.

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Nearly as many citizens opposed them, including two previous airport directors,

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former county commissioners, and top local pilots.

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So it's that basic lack of consensus despite tightly controlled information and process,

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that's why we are arguing now.

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Many folks assume we have no choice because the FAA has originally mandated

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a new airfield for very planes. That has never been true.

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Of course the FAA would like bigger planes for what it calls greater access, more planes and more kinds.

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A goal curiously not in its mission or objectives.

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Purocracies love standardization.

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The FAA likes to retire layout exceptions where it can.

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It rarely makes new ones, but there is no mandate to eliminate them and we couldn't.

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Aspen has 85 of them, any unfixable.

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The aviation mantra standardization equals safety is valid for and borrowed from operations,

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but it doesn't fit our airport layout situation.

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Our airport is necessarily unique.

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The FAA is constrained by both law,

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including its own rules and politics.

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Legally, it's on thin ice.

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It can choose to modify design standards

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when justified by unusual local conditions

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and acceptably safe.

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It must conform to local laws and regulations

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which are themselves an approved basis for modifying standards.

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Bittgen County citizens may soon clarify those rules.

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Aspen is United's most profit-intensive airport nationwide.

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It's the state's third busiest airport used by many of our nation's most wealthy

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and powerful individuals, vital to a community with exceptional political influence.

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With the FAA then really choose to block runway reconstruction

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to achieve trivial business jet access gains not requested by our airlines,

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offering no material safety benefits and inviting a potent political and perhaps legal backlash.

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I think rational adults would rethink.

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There is ample discretion and rationale for a reasonable resolution,

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much as occurred three decades ago,

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when the FDA wanted to abolish our night curfew but backed off.

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A reasonable resolution was reached.

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Of course, we had different commissioners then.

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Now, much does depend on the attitude of the powerful FAA, although we learned in 95 that

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its edicts can bend to political realities.

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18 months ago, the regional manager, John Bauer, addressed the BOCC in his sole public

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appearance here.

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And I asked him, if the county stops asking for bigger planes, can it keep the present

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airport layout modification standard, 95-foot wingspan limit?

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He twice said yes, but we would lose future discretionary grants.

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Well,

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I meant to play the other one first anyway. What do you want me to do?

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What? This one?

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What does that do?

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Sorry, I'm going to have to repeat those because we didn't have the sound on in your system.

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So what you said before, could you keep it the 95 foot wing span restriction as a rule that I think I've been fairly clear that we would probably at that time set your funding to, that it's not a rule.

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So if Chicago decided that it wanted to wait.

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So could you keep it the 95 foot wing span restriction, absolutely, but I think I've been fairly clear.

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So what you've said before, could you keep it the 95 full weeks ban?

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Why are you going on to the next slide?

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And what you've said so far is that could you keep it the 95 full weeks ban?

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I think I've been fairly clear that a lot of the cases we would probably have done.

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So that if the county decided that it wanted to wait

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and not go straight away for bigger than 95 foot, less than 118 airplanes, we could keep

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what we've got and continue the MOS. Is that correct?

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Yes, but there's caveats to that, right? I mean, we've talked about it. We're not

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going to provide anything other than your entitlement for any of that. So, yes, those

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are all decisions that are the county's decision to make.

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Thank you, and I'm afraid the two were playing on top of each other, but at the beginning

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of the second one, I talked about are you going to revoke our modification of standard?

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He said no.

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I said that was good.

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Now, in a later visit to FAA headquarters, John Peacock asked more senior FAA officials

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what they wanted, but he left out the if part of my questions.

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That of course elicited the opposite answer and deceived commissioners into assuming that Mr. Bauer's double offer here of FAA policy was wrong or overruled and they've dutifully ignored it ever since.

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But before I explain why we don't need his grants, let me briefly address the scary threats we hear of what the FAA could do if we resist.

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Expansionists threaten clawed back old grants, a downgraded airport that punishes us for not allowing bigger planes by restricting us to smaller planes, and a prohibition on simultaneous use of the runway and taxiway.

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That would dramatically cut peak capacity. Those threats are all fake.

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Mr. Bauer specifically dismissed the first two in the same recorded BOCC remarks.

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The third one is an indirect way to achieve the same aims as the second.

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It's even more hostile to the FAA's own core goals of safety efficiency and especially access.

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Now, any of these extraordinary actions would require an elaborate process triggered by an egregious violation of law or rule that no one is proposing.

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Importantly, the FAA has made none of these threats, as the county and its surrogates falsely imply.

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They were all made up by the county and its consultants to scare people.

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The FAA is powerful, but it's not unconstrained and it has rules.

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I think the way you tell it's fake is that the FAA is not making the threats

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and it's the only one that could carry them out.

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But doesn't our airport still need the discretionary grants

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it would lose by not letting in bigger planes?

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No.

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And that free money from all federal taxpayers comes with significant costs and risks.

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Each grant locks in another 20 years of the FAA behavior that's so troublesome now.

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And now the imminent billion-dollar FBO deal comes in time and in size to make that substitution work.

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In March, our financial analysis found that the proposed $100-plus million or more of FAA grants being urgently sought

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and now driving frantic county policy are not actually needed.

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Our April update confirmed and strengthened those findings.

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But right now, as the county pleads poverty, it's about to sign this billion-dollar contract

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with Atlantic Aviation for another 30-year monopoly on the FBO-serving private planes.

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The county's cost estimates show that its bigger airport would cost about $335 million.

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dollars, minus $195 in federal grants for a net of $130, formally $219, suddenly changed.

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FBO fees could pay the $8 million a year debt service with $15 million a year left over.

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On the same county cost estimates, our better airport with no grants, because no bigger

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planes, and $88 million lower construction costs the county tends to ignore, would cost

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$247 million, with annual debt service of $16 million on the same bond terms.

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The $29 million of annual FBO fees that Mr. Peacock revealed September 10th could aptly

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fund either approach.

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And then, of course, Atlantic's 54% higher offer than we assumed, plus lower interest

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rates made our findings even more conservative.

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Now the county is hoping for this 29 million a year of average FBO revenue, plus nine figure

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FAA grants.

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If they get both, then even if total cost rose to say a half billion dollars, debt service

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would become only 13 million a year on their plan, and the expected FBO fees could pay

252
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it with about 20 million a year left over.

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But airports are not allowed to accumulate a big surplus, and their income must all be spent on the airport.

254
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So they drown in money and have to slash fees, promoting still more growth.

255
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Perhaps that's why the county is now lobbying to remove that federal restriction,

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so those airport surpluses of about 20 million a year could be spent elsewhere.

257
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That makes this an awkward time to claim they can't afford to patch the runway.

258
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:06,280
Now the county's five attempts to discredit our financial analysis showing the grants aren't needed,

259
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cited in the readings page in your packet, all crashed when they ran out of truth.

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We use their own numbers. Arithmetic is not an opinion.

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Their fifth strikeout on September 10th claimed FBO revenue could support only a third the bonds that our better airport would need.

262
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We're about to publish a response to that.

263
00:22:27,120 --> 00:22:30,040
They reached this conclusion by assuming it.

264
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Without logical evidence, the consultant assumed high-risk, high-cost, tightly restricted junk bonds,

265
00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:40,500
as if not adding bigger planes somehow must add huge financial risk.

266
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They ignored the airport's dozen risk-reducing attributes, many of which the county touts for its bonds.

267
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:54,120
They ignored the nine proposed credit-enhancing measures that our five expert advisors thought adequate to achieve investment grade.

268
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So the county would structure its bonds for a 5% rate and probably a double A rating.

269
00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:05,780
Its hit job consultant assumed high risk and bad design to make our bonds unratable in up to 8.5%.

270
00:23:06,740 --> 00:23:11,700
Mr. Peacock at all also seriously misrepresented many other aspects of our analysis.

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I think all involved in that exercise should be embarrassed.

272
00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:17,880
So what should the BOCC do?

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00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:23,920
The 8 April update and strategy letter in your packet suggests a sensible way

274
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:30,580
forward. It's like this. Except Mr. Bauer's offer that you sort of saw

275
00:23:30,580 --> 00:23:34,380
just now on videotape basically they keep their grants we keep our layout.

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00:23:35,180 --> 00:23:38,840
Propose a new layout plan to rebuild the runway where it is at our own expense

277
00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:44,540
as soon as they let us making the FAA responsible for any delay. Move ahead

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00:23:44,540 --> 00:23:52,240
briskly to design a great new terminal and all the financing, offer to resubmit the valid

279
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:57,380
original forecast if needed for a consistent record, stop the disinformation campaign,

280
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and start rebuilding public trust.

281
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:07,520
We can then thank the FAA for continuing to keep it safe and politely decline its

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undesired services as Aspen's developer in chief.

283
00:24:10,900 --> 00:24:11,700
Could they refuse?

284
00:24:12,360 --> 00:24:15,700
Yes, but they're also bound to respect local laws and rules.

285
00:24:16,300 --> 00:24:18,900
So if the voters change those, the FAA must change too.

286
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:22,920
And our commissioners who all say they don't want bigger planes could make it so.

287
00:24:24,300 --> 00:24:27,440
Investing our own money at our own pace would regain planning independence

288
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:31,440
from a vitally safety-skilled federal agency that cares only about aviation

289
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,940
and seeks to impose its one-size-fits-all growth ambitions on our valley

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00:24:35,940 --> 00:24:39,360
without regard to any of our constraints' needs or conditions.

291
00:24:40,300 --> 00:24:54,180
Preserving our half-century of thoughtful growth management would be a giant step toward protecting our home, our community's character, and values, its real estate value, and our quality of life.

292
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One last thought. When we choose is as important as what we choose.

293
00:24:59,900 --> 00:25:06,260
It's unwise to make big airfield choices in this decade because urgently seeking those

294
00:25:06,820 --> 00:25:12,020
expiring federal grants risks building the wrong thing when we're in the middle of aviation's

295
00:25:12,020 --> 00:25:13,400
greatest revolution in history.

296
00:25:14,220 --> 00:25:18,320
Rushing airfield decisions is like accelerating your car into a snow squall.

297
00:25:18,660 --> 00:25:21,900
It's really prudent to slow down until you can see where we're going.

298
00:25:22,820 --> 00:25:27,720
United's recent order of planes that we were told didn't exist has secured commercial

299
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:33,180
service now for decades fitting our airfield and with better avionics that's

300
00:25:33,180 --> 00:25:37,880
good so there is no need to rush and every reason to wait while we rebuild

301
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,960
the runway at the terminal we have plenty of time to let the aviation

302
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:47,320
revolution unfold and learn what we really need and now thanks to the

303
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:52,680
vast FBO windfall but just in time we have the solid revenue to afford

304
00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:57,580
especially if the people and elected officials like you get informed and

305
00:25:57,580 --> 00:25:58,720
way in. Thank you.

306
00:26:02,070 --> 00:26:05,170
Thanks, Amy. Chuck, do you have a follow up?

307
00:26:26,300 --> 00:26:28,460
Can you hear

308
00:26:31,590 --> 00:26:53,490
me? Yes. Good. I'm also going to do this for myself. All right. This should work. My name is Chuck Butler. I am a Snowmass Village resident. So I have attended a number of these meetings virtually and I can't thank each one of you

309
00:26:53,490 --> 00:26:58,750
enough for what you do and your time here today, especially as it's campaign and election

310
00:26:58,750 --> 00:26:59,190
season.

311
00:26:59,790 --> 00:27:03,290
I don't envy any of you now that I've gotten a taste of what we're doing here.

312
00:27:03,650 --> 00:27:04,990
Thank you.

313
00:27:06,530 --> 00:27:15,580
I am one of the founding members

314
00:27:22,370 --> 00:27:24,290
of our airport, our vote.

315
00:27:25,250 --> 00:27:30,950
This started as a conversation over a year and a half ago with meeting some of our

316
00:27:30,950 --> 00:27:38,970
friends at Aspen Flyrite and suddenly getting sort of a new generation of locals politically

317
00:27:38,970 --> 00:27:39,550
interested.

318
00:27:41,130 --> 00:27:47,150
You know, we are, I'll say long time locals, I think that's very fair, you know, the core

319
00:27:47,150 --> 00:27:51,590
group that was involved with Citizens Against Bigger Planes and then ultimately, you know,

320
00:27:51,730 --> 00:27:57,830
stuck with us and are now in it for the long haul with our airport, our vote, are part

321
00:27:57,830 --> 00:28:00,890
of a grassroots movement that had like true organic growth.

322
00:28:01,210 --> 00:28:04,610
I say this, we volunteered our times, time, you know,

323
00:28:05,050 --> 00:28:09,150
not one local involved in this is being paid for their time,

324
00:28:09,450 --> 00:28:10,430
you know, their boots on the ground.

325
00:28:10,930 --> 00:28:13,330
And I think this is about people care, people are interested.

326
00:28:13,990 --> 00:28:15,430
You know, we got involved because it didn't feel

327
00:28:15,430 --> 00:28:16,810
like the board of county commissioners.

328
00:28:17,170 --> 00:28:19,770
We're hearing what we were, what was being said

329
00:28:19,770 --> 00:28:21,830
at meetings and we were strongly encouraged

330
00:28:21,830 --> 00:28:25,090
from people on both sides to get involved.

331
00:28:25,450 --> 00:28:26,710
And so that's why we're here.

332
00:28:26,710 --> 00:28:35,890
here. Some of you may have met me in the streets as over 30 of us circulated petitions in July.

333
00:28:36,750 --> 00:28:42,950
And we came back with over 1,200 signatures. I think it was 1,203. Might have been 1,207.

334
00:28:43,350 --> 00:28:48,890
Thousand on the nose were verified by the county clerk. And we very proudly were able

335
00:28:48,890 --> 00:28:54,170
to put this on the ballot. The first ever citizen led initiative of a change to the

336
00:28:55,330 --> 00:28:57,630
do want to bring up the homeral charter for one second.

337
00:28:58,390 --> 00:29:02,390
Some people in the community have criticized why we went that path,

338
00:29:02,590 --> 00:29:06,490
why we went that route on legal advice from numerous legal sources

339
00:29:06,490 --> 00:29:10,530
and in doing a lot of research. No up or down vote

340
00:29:10,530 --> 00:29:13,050
that we could come up with was legally enforceable.

341
00:29:13,750 --> 00:29:18,110
So changing the legal charter to put this in, put a matter into

342
00:29:18,830 --> 00:29:22,570
the hands of the voters was the best path forward.

343
00:29:22,570 --> 00:29:23,530
Excellent.

344
00:29:27,370 --> 00:29:32,890
Thank you. So where we stand on the airport? I think this is important for

345
00:29:32,890 --> 00:29:39,410
me to clear the air on this. We are for every positive change at the airport. The airport

346
00:29:39,410 --> 00:29:46,930
layout plan checks every box except for this agreement we're talking about is about the

347
00:29:46,930 --> 00:29:53,870
separation. So it's clear and on the record for this council and for anyone listening.

348
00:29:53,870 --> 00:29:58,910
you know, we know the runway is failing and we want a new runway, you know, we want to

349
00:29:58,910 --> 00:29:59,770
receive the FAA.

350
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:05,080
If that conversation can be had and if the Board of County commissioners can represent this

351
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:09,980
community the way that many think it can. If that's not the case, I'll defer to what

352
00:30:09,980 --> 00:30:18,960
Amory said and a lot of his research and studies and findings and presentation for, you know,

353
00:30:19,060 --> 00:30:23,160
breaking down those numbers. The elephant in the room and part of this conversation is the

354
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:27,880
billion dollars that is set to come in and it's plus minus but I'll say a billion dollars

355
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:31,840
that's set to come in via Atlantic over the next 30 years.

356
00:30:33,420 --> 00:30:38,120
We are for a safer, cleaner, better modern airport.

357
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:40,860
Nobody, it's an incredible amenity.

358
00:30:41,020 --> 00:30:43,880
We're lucky there's another ski town in this country,

359
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:47,860
to my knowledge, that has an airport less than half a mile.

360
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:49,880
End of a runway is less than half a mile from a ski resort.

361
00:30:50,140 --> 00:30:50,960
That's just incredible.

362
00:30:51,180 --> 00:30:52,140
So we're lucky to have that.

363
00:30:52,140 --> 00:30:58,520
And to say for people to say that we want this to go away,

364
00:30:58,580 --> 00:31:00,360
we want commercial service away, it's simply untrue.

365
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:01,880
We want the best for the community.

366
00:31:02,660 --> 00:31:06,320
And I think what really got a lot of us passionate about this

367
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:08,200
is that we want the community to have a say.

368
00:31:12,410 --> 00:31:15,330
That leads us to the ballot measures.

369
00:31:16,010 --> 00:31:17,570
So there's two ballot measures as you know.

370
00:31:18,230 --> 00:31:23,750
We represent 200 and 200, I can tell you,

371
00:31:23,750 --> 00:31:25,890
I've been walking, I've been going door to door.

372
00:31:25,970 --> 00:31:26,950
I've been part of our street team.

373
00:31:27,670 --> 00:31:32,110
And last night I spent my time just near your neighborhood

374
00:31:32,110 --> 00:31:35,730
and behind the rodeo in a stallion circle,

375
00:31:35,950 --> 00:31:36,490
I guess it's the neighborhood.

376
00:31:37,810 --> 00:31:40,550
What we are hearing and what people agree with

377
00:31:40,550 --> 00:31:43,590
and the reason we did this is that question 200,

378
00:31:44,270 --> 00:31:46,010
it blocks out the noise.

379
00:31:46,130 --> 00:31:49,690
This has nothing to do with the runway growth.

380
00:31:49,690 --> 00:31:53,670
But this is everything to do, question 200 does,

381
00:31:53,810 --> 00:31:56,450
about giving a voice to people on runway decisions

382
00:31:57,050 --> 00:31:59,050
and what the future of this valley might look like.

383
00:31:59,550 --> 00:32:00,410
That's the question.

384
00:32:00,650 --> 00:32:02,490
That is what it says on question 200.

385
00:32:03,110 --> 00:32:05,510
And this empowers, and we believe this,

386
00:32:05,990 --> 00:32:07,950
this empowers the board of county commissioners

387
00:32:07,950 --> 00:32:10,950
to speak on behalf of this community with the FAA.

388
00:32:11,630 --> 00:32:13,430
And I know there's been a process.

389
00:32:14,630 --> 00:32:17,010
I will credit to Jackie Francis

390
00:32:17,010 --> 00:32:18,850
and to everyone who involved in that,

391
00:32:18,850 --> 00:32:30,710
But we've heard now time and time again, whether it's from Mayor Tory and Aspen or any of a number of members of that group, of that board, the vision committee, sorry, that it was flawed.

392
00:32:31,010 --> 00:32:32,330
And I will leave it at that.

393
00:32:36,940 --> 00:32:41,420
I'm aware of our time so I do want to, you know, I'll be quick and I'll hand it off to the next group.

394
00:32:42,220 --> 00:32:51,000
one C is reactionary and problematic and it would have been great if it was

395
00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:55,680
simply a discussion over 200. We are now talking about one C and we have a

396
00:32:55,680 --> 00:33:00,940
position asking people to vote no on one C. This is asking the residents of

397
00:33:00,940 --> 00:33:06,660
Pickin County to vote away their right on the airport on airport matters. This

398
00:33:06,660 --> 00:33:10,820
is a historical right. Aspenites are the residents of Pickin County have

399
00:33:10,820 --> 00:33:12,500
voted on this airport four times.

400
00:33:13,140 --> 00:33:17,520
So again, you're asking to turn away this right,

401
00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:21,280
historical right, and ultimately hand this off

402
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:22,220
for the rest of time.

403
00:33:22,340 --> 00:33:23,260
This doesn't get undone.

404
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:27,220
Our group thinks that this puts special interest

405
00:33:27,220 --> 00:33:29,140
and growth ahead of community input.

406
00:33:30,540 --> 00:33:33,060
And I have a legal memo here,

407
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:35,560
which I'm gonna hand to each of you for review later.

408
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:36,980
We won't be reading this together.

409
00:33:36,980 --> 00:33:46,740
But I do have a memo from a legal team from Mark Ruskin and one of his partners, Nate Bruggeman.

410
00:33:48,420 --> 00:33:58,680
One see the way it's worded and if ultimately put into place, it risks violating the home

411
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:03,420
rule charter as well as the U.S. Constitution and the Colorado Constitutions.

412
00:34:03,420 --> 00:34:06,380
So I'll hand that out here in a second.

413
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:12,760
I want to leave you with the thought, you know, we appreciate it as a hectic time of year.

414
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:16,820
The election is a time of year that, you know, tensions are high.

415
00:34:17,340 --> 00:34:19,480
Half of our friends and family are on vacation.

416
00:34:19,740 --> 00:34:21,240
We got spring fall break coming up.

417
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:22,560
People are in and out of town.

418
00:34:23,180 --> 00:34:27,760
You know, this is an incredibly challenging time to be engaged, active.

419
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:29,740
I appreciate everybody's time.

420
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,000
I hope everybody gets out and votes.

421
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:37,400
And I hope that they can take a moment to read and understand what these ballot measures

422
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:40,940
are truly about, what they're saying, what they're asking people to do.

423
00:34:42,220 --> 00:34:50,400
And if 200 prevails and we then go to what would probably be a special election or an

424
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:55,380
election at some point in the near future with specifically an up or down on the runway,

425
00:34:55,380 --> 00:35:01,520
way, if the people speak, we win or lose, that's all we're looking for.

426
00:35:02,020 --> 00:35:06,100
And so I appreciate your time, I appreciate the community's time, and yeah, thank you

427
00:35:06,100 --> 00:35:06,440
so much.

428
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:07,400
Thank you.

429
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:08,060
Thank you so much.

430
00:35:08,100 --> 00:35:08,660
Thanks, Amri.

431
00:35:09,180 --> 00:35:10,200
I have a few questions.

432
00:35:10,740 --> 00:35:13,860
Yeah, I think everyone's going to have a couple of questions.

433
00:35:16,780 --> 00:35:17,620
Thanks, Chuck.

434
00:35:17,620 --> 00:35:18,900
So,

435
00:35:21,300 --> 00:35:27,040
I'm curious to know how you see the process happening.

436
00:35:27,420 --> 00:35:36,500
So, there was clearly a citizens advisory board that was, has been involved for over

437
00:35:36,500 --> 00:35:44,340
the last couple of years, and it was an extensive effort.

438
00:35:44,340 --> 00:35:45,220
If

439
00:35:48,770 --> 00:35:54,610
200 prevails, do you see that process happening again?

440
00:35:55,390 --> 00:36:01,530
We will then create another visioning committee to sort out the future of our airport.

441
00:36:02,890 --> 00:36:04,530
And so we're on the same page.

442
00:36:04,810 --> 00:36:09,470
He cannot answer any questions about the ballot, about either ballot measure.

443
00:36:10,130 --> 00:36:16,950
So if 200 prevails, I would envision that the existing airport layout plan,

444
00:36:16,950 --> 00:36:22,830
The current the one that is currently on its way through the approval process that that would get put to a vote

445
00:36:23,690 --> 00:36:28,510
So that they they are calling for a 400 foot separation. That would be what?

446
00:36:29,750 --> 00:36:32,110
With our verbiage would get put to a vote

447
00:36:33,270 --> 00:36:34,650
Does that make sense? Yeah

448
00:36:35,930 --> 00:36:41,030
Okay, yeah, no, so I do follow the airport advisory board

449
00:36:41,530 --> 00:36:46,510
I and two of my director colleagues sought membership on it, but we're turned down

450
00:36:46,950 --> 00:36:49,210
and I continue to follow it.

451
00:36:50,110 --> 00:36:56,440
It is notably not reviewed, not discussed,

452
00:36:57,660 --> 00:37:00,360
the major critique I did on the forecast.

453
00:37:00,620 --> 00:37:03,980
They simply voted without paying attention to it.

454
00:37:04,820 --> 00:37:11,160
And the same has been true for other sizable pieces of careful evidence submitted to it.

455
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:14,140
I don't think that's wise.

456
00:37:14,140 --> 00:37:19,420
I don't think it leaves the members as well informed as the BOCC needs them to be.

457
00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:27,060
And I recently had to actually admonish my friend, Dan Bartholomew, for saying some ridiculous

458
00:37:27,060 --> 00:37:29,660
things about advanced airplanes.

459
00:37:31,260 --> 00:37:36,740
I had just, as it happens, lectured on that subject at Stanford where the two top aero

460
00:37:36,740 --> 00:37:40,600
professors were there and found no errors.

461
00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:50,780
And I really was embarrassed that the AAB members, many of whom are dedicated and very competent,

462
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:57,160
are receiving wrong information and the public is unable to correct it by process design.

463
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:03,060
So I think in principle it could be a very valuable organization, but it's not there yet.

464
00:38:03,060 --> 00:38:09,900
it needs to be more independent and follow a really proper process of weighing all evidence.

465
00:38:11,460 --> 00:38:16,980
So, Amy, you're a consultant. I heard you say the other night you've been a consultant for 50 years.

466
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:22,560
The county brought in a number of consultants on this project as well.

467
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:28,040
You just don't agree with those consultants. Is that right?

468
00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:35,420
Not generically, some of them I think did a good job and are very capable. Some others

469
00:38:35,420 --> 00:38:41,200
I was not impressed with and I would not have hired them. But I think these matters should

470
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:48,160
be settled by reason based on evidence and documentation. That's what we provided. And

471
00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:54,300
whenever we criticize the consultants or anybody else's findings, if you go to

472
00:38:54,300 --> 00:38:59,940
are thousands of hours and hundreds of pages of research all online, you will find them

473
00:38:59,940 --> 00:39:06,600
laid out in proper scientific fashion. I'm a scientist by profession. I hope it's not

474
00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:14,000
immodest to say that Stanford's scopus analysis just placed me in the top two percent of

475
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:20,220
the world scientists. I take my professional obligations as a scientist seriously and

476
00:39:20,220 --> 00:39:22,820
And when I see error, I try to correct it.

477
00:39:23,460 --> 00:39:25,680
When I see truth, I support it.

478
00:39:25,940 --> 00:39:26,600
That's my job.

479
00:39:29,570 --> 00:39:30,050
Okay.

480
00:39:32,850 --> 00:39:33,850
Tommy, you had a question?

481
00:39:34,310 --> 00:39:35,570
Yeah, I have a couple questions.

482
00:39:36,610 --> 00:39:39,770
I fully appreciate how complex this is.

483
00:39:39,910 --> 00:39:45,950
I spent 18 months on their airport vision committee, endless meetings.

484
00:39:48,350 --> 00:39:53,530
So I understand the basic technology that we're talking about.

485
00:39:53,630 --> 00:39:56,110
I'm also an architect, I understand how things lay out.

486
00:39:56,290 --> 00:40:00,110
So I have a couple of really simple questions, Amory, for you.

487
00:40:00,230 --> 00:40:02,730
And if you give me simple answers, it'd be really helpful.

488
00:40:04,270 --> 00:40:08,930
So say we build, we all agree the runway has to be rebuilt.

489
00:40:09,070 --> 00:40:11,050
The ground under the runway is failing.

490
00:40:11,190 --> 00:40:12,270
It has to be rebuilt.

491
00:40:12,750 --> 00:40:17,750
And the only question is whether they bill it where it is, 320 feet of separation or move

492
00:40:17,750 --> 00:40:19,590
it 80 feet, center line 80 feet.

493
00:40:19,830 --> 00:40:21,730
That's the only issue we have here.

494
00:40:23,770 --> 00:40:31,010
So and I think it was unexpected but wonderful that they found the Embraer 175 and they juiced

495
00:40:31,010 --> 00:40:35,210
up the engine so it can operate here and they're coming here in December and they're

496
00:40:35,210 --> 00:40:40,250
going to operate for 15 or 20 years, whatever the lifetime of that is.

497
00:40:41,410 --> 00:40:50,390
So, if we build a new runway in the current location and commercial aviation will be using

498
00:40:50,390 --> 00:40:56,010
the E175 for 15, 20 years, whatever the lifespan is,

499
00:40:58,650 --> 00:41:00,690
the runway will last 40 or 50 years.

500
00:41:03,660 --> 00:41:10,970
What happens if when the Embraer can no longer operate here and the new planes that come out,

501
00:41:10,970 --> 00:41:14,850
and I know we don't know this but the new planes come out and they don't have

502
00:41:14,850 --> 00:41:21,530
smaller wingspans but they have larger wingspans than the 96 feet that we're

503
00:41:21,530 --> 00:41:29,180
allowed today would be allowed at the runway. Where are we at then? Then we get

504
00:41:29,180 --> 00:41:36,100
to revisit the question based on the actually longer than 20 normally 30 or

505
00:41:36,100 --> 00:41:42,540
40 plus year development of aviation since then. Now my own professional opinion

506
00:41:42,540 --> 00:41:49,900
closely following that world is that by then it will be a completely moot

507
00:41:49,900 --> 00:41:56,120
question because the very efficient electric planes not necessarily with

508
00:41:56,120 --> 00:42:01,660
longer wings will be cheaper to buy and cheaper to run. And I didn't hear what

509
00:42:01,660 --> 00:42:05,200
they're going to be shorter wingspan to longer wingspan. Some will be shorter

510
00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:11,420
because some might be longer. Some will be longer. Longer is the classical

511
00:42:11,420 --> 00:42:16,740
design solution. Until about four years ago that was thought to be the only design

512
00:42:16,740 --> 00:42:21,640
solution. We now know it's not because of actual flight testing and further

513
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:26,380
development of other types that can have shorter wings, can fit our airport

514
00:42:26,380 --> 00:42:29,720
and can have comparable capacity and range.

515
00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:33,660
And those are emerging incredibly quickly,

516
00:42:33,940 --> 00:42:36,900
on roughly the same time scale as a whole new airport, by the way.

517
00:42:40,500 --> 00:42:48,060
So, because the new planes by very wide opinion in the profession

518
00:42:48,060 --> 00:42:52,820
will be generally cheaper to buy and to build than fueled planes,

519
00:42:52,820 --> 00:42:57,560
including the better ones proposed here like the 221-100.

520
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:06,520
I think the fuel planes in the timeframe you're describing will have been really struggling to compete

521
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:15,840
and will be well underway in getting replaced by planes with enormously lower noise emission and pollution

522
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:17,860
than any fuel plane can be.

523
00:43:17,860 --> 00:43:25,020
So that was you're really speaking don't exist yet right they're not nobody's

524
00:43:25,020 --> 00:43:34,040
come up with a prototype yet no that's not correct there 80% of the world's top

525
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:39,120
25 aerospace companies are involved there are many prototypes I was just

526
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:44,320
looking at one in Sweden a couple of weeks ago just the day before its

527
00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:50,500
hang a roll out. That one does happen to have longer wings. Some others do not. Some

528
00:43:50,500 --> 00:43:58,120
I can talk about, some I can't. But it is a whole petting zoo which is featured in my

529
00:43:58,120 --> 00:44:03,920
latest Stanford lecture that's online. If you go to our essays, essay five, go two

530
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:08,580
things later, you'll find something called fossil free flight that gives you a lot

531
00:44:08,580 --> 00:44:12,660
of the supporting detail. It's moving incredibly quickly, but you're speaking

532
00:44:12,660 --> 00:44:19,240
I'm thinking correctly to the last point I made about it's important not just what we choose but when we choose.

533
00:44:19,720 --> 00:44:25,000
We don't need to make that decision now about whether to bring in bigger planes.

534
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:29,920
And I'm saying it's unwise to do so and we have time to make that decision.

535
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:36,300
So now we should rebuild the runway where it is, taking much more care with the geotechnical stuff.

536
00:44:36,660 --> 00:44:40,080
Any of the old cowboys would tell you that's a wet meadow with three streams in it

537
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:42,660
and it wasn't designed to build properly for that.

538
00:44:43,180 --> 00:44:46,840
So that's got to be done right. I hope the FAA can help us with that.

539
00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:52,400
But then we're set on commercial traffic for decades.

540
00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:54,520
You can argue about how many decades.

541
00:44:55,160 --> 00:44:58,160
Meanwhile, the aviation revolution unfolds,

542
00:44:58,240 --> 00:44:59,840
the fog clears, the mud settles.

543
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:03,120
And we get to make wiser decisions based on what we then were.

544
00:45:03,140 --> 00:45:05,780
I want to move this along just because we have got a lot to do tonight.

545
00:45:06,660 --> 00:45:10,720
Let me ask also a simple question.

546
00:45:11,700 --> 00:45:18,540
If we do move the runway, what are, in your mind,

547
00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:23,600
what will be wrong?

548
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:30,540
I mean, what are we worried about a year after it's completed, five years after it's completed,

549
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:38,660
15 years after it's completed? I mean, what is it that we are so worried about if we build this

550
00:45:38,660 --> 00:45:43,560
bigger runway? Because we know we're not going to have larger commercial planes for 15, 20,

551
00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:51,180
or 30 years, as you said. We're going to operate the 175s. So just tell me really

552
00:45:51,180 --> 00:45:57,960
simply one five fifteen years what is what are we worried about just to be

553
00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:03,240
clear many of the super efficient and electric planes are being our anteric

554
00:46:03,240 --> 00:46:09,100
service in this decade and even some in the next few years the smaller ones so

555
00:46:09,100 --> 00:46:14,880
that they are not 20 or 30 years out no but up but I think that I can't speak

556
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:19,620
for Sky West they've just invested in all these new embryo 175 they're not

557
00:46:19,620 --> 00:46:23,160
going to throw them away in five years they're going to operate them here unless

558
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:27,560
there's some really strong reason not to. I'm saying there there will be strong

559
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:33,860
economic and impact and other reasons to seriously consider whether to keep

560
00:46:33,860 --> 00:46:39,300
operating let alone. Well that's great. I mean they bring in more efficient

561
00:46:39,300 --> 00:46:43,320
quieter planes that's all better. They could operate down either

562
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:48,580
runways. But what's wrong with moving the runway? Let me take it on

563
00:46:48,580 --> 00:46:57,000
First of all, risk management is about minimizing regret at what you did you wish you hadn't

564
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:59,020
or what you didn't do you wish you had.

565
00:46:59,660 --> 00:47:03,300
So you're asking me to look back from that perspective.

566
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:09,760
And I would say one of our regrets could be that we wasted $88 million in a lot of

567
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:18,080
hassle building an airplane, excuse me, building an airfield design for airplanes that are

568
00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:21,600
no longer the future of aviation but will be getting phased out.

569
00:47:21,900 --> 00:47:26,760
But let me just stop you there, because I don't mean to interrupt, but moving the runway

570
00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:34,880
80 feet, centerline, is not going to change the operation of the runway, just slightly

571
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:41,240
slightly larger planes but other than that it's not in any way changing as you

572
00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:44,960
said the operation of the airport as opposed to if you keep the runway or

573
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:49,960
according according to the county's budget estimates it actually does incur

574
00:47:49,960 --> 00:47:56,020
an additional eighty eight million dollars or so of course of airfield cost

575
00:47:56,020 --> 00:47:59,800
of other kinds moving other stuff around okay I didn't want to get into the

576
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:03,040
costs. I'm trying to talk about the practical, physical things.

577
00:48:03,260 --> 00:48:11,680
So there is significant money involved. Secondly, by moving the runway, we would have opened

578
00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:20,260
up the airport to all kinds of airplanes up to a 118-foot wingspan. Anything that can

579
00:48:20,260 --> 00:48:24,760
get here, there might be a weight limit, would be able to. We couldn't stop it.

580
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:27,760
we couldn't ensure any of the outcomes we wanted.

581
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:34,240
There are arguments about what the net effect is, and the answer is nobody can know, but

582
00:48:34,780 --> 00:48:42,900
we do know that under the county's plan, that is the airline planes that it expects to operate

583
00:48:42,900 --> 00:48:44,500
and not counting any private ones.

584
00:48:44,620 --> 00:48:45,440
Yes, the A220.

585
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:46,480
It certainly is, yes.

586
00:48:47,260 --> 00:48:48,020
And later the two planes.

587
00:48:48,020 --> 00:48:53,520
Was it designed for the projective planes, the A220, whether or not it ever shows

588
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:53,780
up?

589
00:48:53,780 --> 00:48:59,380
the 300 we're designing around, including all those and looking at how many fly in

590
00:48:59,380 --> 00:49:05,580
which year according to their approved forecast, that's the environmental table I showed showing

591
00:49:05,580 --> 00:49:12,520
that all six of the environmental goals in the core community thing flunk. They are

592
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:20,300
not satisfied as the advertisements say. And that's why I think the posted airport

593
00:49:20,300 --> 00:49:27,180
modernization goals drop those 30% drop goals. They're not in there anymore. There's only a vague

594
00:49:27,180 --> 00:49:32,840
goal, so any improvement is a win and sufficient. I don't think that's what the community had in mind.

595
00:49:34,500 --> 00:49:39,660
I'm still not hearing just sort of a clear answer that if we build a bigger runway, we're going to

596
00:49:39,660 --> 00:49:48,160
get 27, 37s landing here every week or so. We don't know because we can't tell. There are

597
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:54,980
many hundreds of, shall we say, offensive or unsuitable big old dirty noisy planes in

598
00:49:54,980 --> 00:49:59,700
private ownership. Some of those owners would like to come here. It's not just the 737.

599
00:49:59,700 --> 00:50:04,200
There are quite a few other types, but all those types were lumped together in one category

600
00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:09,100
that the forecasters did not detail. So we couldn't tell how many they expect to

601
00:50:09,100 --> 00:50:14,940
come. So it's on the private side. That's all on the private side. Because you couldn't

602
00:50:14,940 --> 00:50:18,820
operate a big plane fully loaded with commercial passengers, they can't operate

603
00:50:18,820 --> 00:50:23,760
here, right? Well, probably not. But if you have six passengers on it, you can land one.

604
00:50:23,900 --> 00:50:27,640
Probably not, but I think one of the points missed in Bill's comparison, which

605
00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:34,840
has 13 slides on airline 737s nobody's worried about, and one really sketchy

606
00:50:34,840 --> 00:50:38,560
slide on the private ones that everyone should worry about. He didn't

607
00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:42,900
mention that the private ones are usually much lighter. Yeah. And that

608
00:50:42,900 --> 00:50:47,620
that means more kinds can come in than could if they were commercial. Thanks for spotting that.

609
00:50:48,160 --> 00:50:52,020
And I think just to tack on to that, we're talking about

610
00:50:52,020 --> 00:50:57,500
widening a runway for a handful of newer cleaner planes and leaving the back door open to these

611
00:50:58,100 --> 00:51:05,220
dozen hundreds of planes that will be dirtier, older and louder. And I think from a commercial

612
00:51:05,220 --> 00:51:11,280
side we know that A220, Delta has those. You know, SkyWest United American do not,

613
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:14,720
from what we know, plan to fly those in anytime soon,

614
00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:16,720
I will defer to someone like Bill

615
00:51:16,720 --> 00:51:20,220
or someone else who has maybe a little bit more expertise

616
00:51:20,220 --> 00:51:24,760
on that, but that eight to 20s, I think it's 109 seats.

617
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:28,760
There's also talk of more directs from elsewhere.

618
00:51:29,160 --> 00:51:31,200
So that could, we could see a game there.

619
00:51:31,700 --> 00:51:33,640
I don't wanna linger on that too much.

620
00:51:33,860 --> 00:51:37,940
I do think to simplify it, more planes,

621
00:51:38,140 --> 00:51:39,980
a wider runway means more planes.

622
00:51:39,980 --> 00:51:44,920
no matter how you look at it means more people and that that will then add to any

623
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:47,680
of a number of the challenges that we've talked about whether it's you know

624
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:51,840
you know traffic housing and so there were a switch to the 220 instead of the

625
00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:57,500
Embraer 175 so we have a lot quieter less polluting planes. There's no

626
00:51:57,500 --> 00:52:05,060
question we can get some like 220s quieter and in some respects

627
00:52:06,720 --> 00:52:12,080
environmentally better, but not NOx planes. At the same time, however, unavoidably, we

628
00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:16,960
would get other private kinds of planes we don't want that are worse, and nobody knows

629
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:17,880
what the balance will be.

630
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:20,060
Okay. Thank you.

631
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:21,600
He did touch on it.

632
00:52:21,600 --> 00:52:23,140
We need to move on. Thanks a lot.

633
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:29,020
Yeah. So, I mean, I guess to your point, Chuck, there's only a certain number of

634
00:52:29,020 --> 00:52:33,840
operations that can happen in an hour, right? So we're not guaranteed to have more

635
00:52:33,840 --> 00:52:34,320
flights.

636
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:36,500
And may I just one last thought then?

637
00:52:36,580 --> 00:52:42,180
So I think the number one threat to commercial service is widening in the runway, which allows

638
00:52:42,180 --> 00:52:42,880
for more planes.

639
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:44,900
We have 83% private service right now.

640
00:52:45,360 --> 00:52:47,860
Commercial planes don't get priority on landing here.

641
00:52:48,420 --> 00:52:53,400
I think with more private planes landing here, coming here, this runway being available

642
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:59,080
to them, we risk seeing that commercial service go down to, I don't know what the numbers

643
00:52:59,080 --> 00:52:59,360
are.

644
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:00,420
But thank you.

645
00:53:00,740 --> 00:53:03,640
I want to make sure that we're keeping an eye on our time here.

646
00:53:04,240 --> 00:53:05,760
So I mean, I think it's safe to say

647
00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:08,400
there's a fair amount of speculation going on here.

648
00:53:08,500 --> 00:53:10,020
There's a lot that we don't know.

649
00:53:10,940 --> 00:53:13,180
Amy, you provide a lot of important information.

650
00:53:13,500 --> 00:53:14,720
There's a lot to unpack there.

651
00:53:14,900 --> 00:53:17,560
And, Chuck, I appreciate what you had to say as well.

652
00:53:19,220 --> 00:53:20,640
So thank you guys for coming.

653
00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:23,100
I think we need to provide the other side

654
00:53:23,100 --> 00:53:25,300
with an opportunity to present their case.

655
00:53:25,660 --> 00:53:27,460
But again, I appreciate you guys being here.

656
00:53:27,460 --> 00:53:33,400
Well, thank you for asking and let me compliment this group because this is actually a more

657
00:53:33,400 --> 00:53:39,260
substantive discussion than any other elected body in the valley has held with us.

658
00:53:39,540 --> 00:53:40,160
Thank you.

659
00:53:40,200 --> 00:53:40,860
Thanks for that.

660
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:42,620
You're here.

661
00:53:42,760 --> 00:53:43,420
Appreciate it.

662
00:53:43,640 --> 00:53:44,060
Thank you.

663
00:53:44,240 --> 00:53:44,920
Thank you for coming.

664
00:53:45,160 --> 00:53:45,380
Thanks.

665
00:53:45,820 --> 00:53:46,640
George and Michael.

666
00:53:58,390 --> 00:54:00,930
I could start while Michael's setting up.

667
00:54:02,010 --> 00:54:03,330
For the record, I'm George Newman.

668
00:54:03,930 --> 00:54:05,810
I'm a former Pickett County Commissioner.

669
00:54:05,810 --> 00:54:08,470
actually George why don't you just hang on a second so we'll make sure everybody

670
00:54:08,470 --> 00:54:10,910
can hear what you got going great

671
00:54:14,940 --> 00:54:17,520
thanks George go ahead I'm a former

672
00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:22,320
Picking County Commissioner has been involved with the airport for the 12

673
00:54:22,320 --> 00:54:28,500
years that I served I was involved with the runway extension in 2009 the reason

674
00:54:28,500 --> 00:54:35,980
that runway was extended safety I was involved with the 2016 airport layout

675
00:54:35,980 --> 00:54:41,960
plan and also the latest one. So I just want to go back to the future for a few

676
00:54:41,960 --> 00:54:42,580
minutes here.

677
00:54:45,100 --> 00:54:52,300
2016 we approved an airport layout plan submitted to the FAA and

678
00:54:52,300 --> 00:54:57,160
it was approved. It went through the normal public process just like public

679
00:54:57,160 --> 00:55:03,580
process that you go through with any issues that come before you. At the

680
00:55:03,580 --> 00:55:06,480
end of that process we started to get some feedback from the community

681
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:11,320
saying that they did not really understand what was happening and they

682
00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:15,800
wanted to be able to take a step back and get more involved and get more

683
00:55:15,800 --> 00:55:16,300
information.

684
00:55:18,330 --> 00:55:27,230
We asked the FAA if we could do another process to look at a

685
00:55:27,230 --> 00:55:34,030
community-based process to develop a new airport layout plan. This was

686
00:55:34,030 --> 00:55:40,390
really unprecedented. The FAA had never heard of any community doing such a process just

687
00:55:40,390 --> 00:55:45,110
in terms of trying to update an airport layout plan. But they gave us permission to do it,

688
00:55:45,970 --> 00:55:53,870
which was great. So then what we did was we sent out information to anyone who was interested

689
00:55:53,870 --> 00:56:02,570
in serving on this new process to get involved. Some of you were involved. We had over 120

690
00:56:02,570 --> 00:56:07,950
citizens representing a cross-section of the entire, not only the entire art community,

691
00:56:08,090 --> 00:56:14,270
but also from the Valley, Burlington Valley. They worked hard diligently for over 16 months.

692
00:56:15,130 --> 00:56:23,530
They were able to learn, to ask questions, to educate themselves from a variety of experts

693
00:56:23,530 --> 00:56:29,730
that we brought in from around the country concerning all types of airport operations.

694
00:56:29,730 --> 00:56:35,050
In addition, we also have one group, we have five different groups, we have one group that

695
00:56:35,050 --> 00:56:41,650
just dwelled on the idea of community character and how would the airport layout plan that

696
00:56:41,650 --> 00:56:46,510
they were discussing impact, effect, be positive or negative for the community.

697
00:56:47,090 --> 00:56:49,090
That was an important component.

698
00:56:51,700 --> 00:57:00,360
So unprecedented for the FAA, unprecedented for I think for any elected body in the

699
00:57:00,360 --> 00:57:05,500
Peking County, whether it be Snowmass Village, City of Aspen, or the Board of County Commissioners.

700
00:57:05,900 --> 00:57:11,900
We have never, I've never seen a process, a community process that involves so many people,

701
00:57:12,900 --> 00:57:16,680
took so long, has so much information provided to them.

702
00:57:17,620 --> 00:57:25,860
And out of that process came over 50 recommendations that were labeled the common ground recommendations

703
00:57:26,140 --> 00:57:28,620
that were presented to the Board of County Commissioners.

704
00:57:28,620 --> 00:57:35,200
I was on the board at that time, and we accepted those recommendations and passed that airport

705
00:57:35,200 --> 00:57:37,280
layout plan onto the FAA.

706
00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:45,460
Now as what was discussed already, some of the main components of those over 50 goals

707
00:57:45,980 --> 00:57:49,360
led to four or five top goals.

708
00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:51,840
We've heard it, but I'll repeat it.

709
00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:57,420
Safety was number one, improved the safety of our airport and our airfield.

710
00:57:57,420 --> 00:58:03,820
Second was to reduce greenhouse gas emissions and pollutants by at least 30 percent.

711
00:58:04,380 --> 00:58:08,220
Third was to reduce noise by at least 30 percent.

712
00:58:08,980 --> 00:58:14,040
Fourth was to develop an interconnected mass transit system between the airport,

713
00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:19,620
Aspen and Snowmass that would take vehicular trips off the highway.

714
00:58:19,620 --> 00:58:29,380
way. And last was to manage employment by our values from our community. So this was

715
00:58:29,380 --> 00:58:39,420
not a county plan. This was and is a community plan. Build up from the bottom up by the community

716
00:58:39,980 --> 00:58:41,160
and for the community.

717
00:58:43,660 --> 00:58:47,880
Michael will sort of, Michael will talk about a lot of the things

718
00:58:47,880 --> 00:58:54,200
that went into that plan and certainly will be able to defuse some of the statements that

719
00:58:54,200 --> 00:58:55,040
you've heard today.

720
00:58:55,520 --> 00:59:00,300
And the last one I just want to say because there has been a lot of misinformation presented,

721
00:59:01,460 --> 00:59:04,640
whether it's been on purpose or not, I'm not going to say.

722
00:59:05,320 --> 00:59:15,120
But that last slide was really indicative of how misinformed they are presenting to

723
00:59:15,120 --> 00:59:15,700
the community.

724
00:59:15,700 --> 00:59:18,920
So the last slide talked about

725
00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:28,960
the that that the Peking County Board of

726
00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:33,980
County Commission's ballot initiative was unlawful, went against a home road

727
00:59:33,980 --> 00:59:40,860
charter, and even unconstitutional. Well if some of you saw today's Aspen

728
00:59:40,860 --> 00:59:47,440
Daily News, Peking County Commissioners refuted that statement and I'll just

729
00:59:47,440 --> 00:59:48,760
read that to you if you haven't seen it.

730
00:59:50,040 --> 00:59:55,980
The Pickett County Commissioners reject the recent claim by the group, our airport, our

731
00:59:55,980 --> 00:59:57,820
vote that the language

732
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:07,220
of the ballot question 1C is unconstitutional. The language of 1C, which reaffirms Pickett County's

733
01:00:07,220 --> 01:00:14,500
authority to implement a plan to make safety and other improvements to the Aspen-Pickett County

734
01:00:14,500 --> 01:00:23,820
Airport, was thoroughly researched and legally vetted before it was placed on a ballot. The

735
01:00:23,820 --> 01:00:28,080
Language is legally sound, and the county stands behind it.

736
01:00:29,480 --> 01:00:32,160
The public should know that the argument that one see

737
01:00:32,500 --> 01:00:38,100
is somehow unconstitutional or violates the county home

738
01:00:38,100 --> 01:00:39,980
room is without merit.

739
01:00:41,260 --> 01:00:43,480
That's just one example of the misinformation

740
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:45,400
that's being presented to you.

741
01:00:45,900 --> 01:00:50,840
This is a simple presentation.

742
01:00:51,780 --> 01:00:54,860
It's not a lot of mumble jumble, it's not a lot of numbers.

743
01:00:55,360 --> 01:01:00,200
It's just straightforward, factual, and we'll be able to respond quickly and efficiently

744
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:01,120
to any questions.

745
01:01:01,540 --> 01:01:02,800
So, I'll turn this over to Michael now.

746
01:01:05,520 --> 01:01:06,420
Is your microphone on?

747
01:01:07,280 --> 01:01:07,760
Green light?

748
01:01:08,220 --> 01:01:11,080
Oh, it was a light green, and now it's a break.

749
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:11,860
Okay, all right.

750
01:01:14,340 --> 01:01:17,880
So, I'm Michael Miracle, I'm here on behalf of a whole lot of people for a better

751
01:01:17,880 --> 01:01:18,280
airport.

752
01:01:18,280 --> 01:01:25,440
And there's some redundancy in some of what I'm going to flash on the screen and what George said,

753
01:01:25,440 --> 01:01:27,600
so I'm going to try not to repeat things.

754
01:01:29,340 --> 01:01:35,580
But as Amory pointed out, we are all in agreement on many things.

755
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:45,080
And I want to try to speak to you as elected officials who are responsible for managing the well-being of A-town.

756
01:01:45,080 --> 01:01:49,240
and you've been elected to do so, and I think you do an excellent job.

757
01:01:50,280 --> 01:01:54,760
This is fundamentally a conversation about failing infrastructure,

758
01:01:55,460 --> 01:01:59,880
and I'm sure you know that fixing infrastructure is not easy.

759
01:02:01,560 --> 01:02:05,880
The last major airfield and terminal upgrades were over 40 years ago.

760
01:02:06,780 --> 01:02:13,440
Our part is out of date, and we all agree, all parties agree on that now,

761
01:02:13,440 --> 01:02:15,160
but I want to be clear about something.

762
01:02:15,980 --> 01:02:18,100
That was not always the case.

763
01:02:18,500 --> 01:02:21,040
This idea that everybody is agreeing on everything

764
01:02:21,040 --> 01:02:25,360
except for the runway widening and the runway taxi separation

765
01:02:25,360 --> 01:02:26,860
is not true.

766
01:02:27,400 --> 01:02:30,480
I was on the community character working group.

767
01:02:30,760 --> 01:02:32,200
Tom, you were on the vision committee.

768
01:02:33,800 --> 01:02:37,560
This attrition and this lack of faith

769
01:02:37,560 --> 01:02:40,380
and this criticizing of the process that you're hearing,

770
01:02:41,100 --> 01:02:42,140
there's a reason for that.

771
01:02:42,140 --> 01:02:50,080
That's because there were a lot of people who were part of that process, who were dug in at a hard no to everything on day one.

772
01:02:50,460 --> 01:02:59,000
No new terminal, no new runway. CRJ 700 can continue into the foreseeable future, and by that they meant decades.

773
01:02:59,240 --> 01:03:00,300
Not forever, but decades.

774
01:03:01,260 --> 01:03:07,200
Over time, everyone, more and more people became aware that, oh, actually we did a terminal tour.

775
01:03:07,200 --> 01:03:12,360
The terminal needs to be replaced. Then it became, do the terminal not the runway?

776
01:03:12,860 --> 01:03:17,240
This has been a slow evolution to this level of consensus that we're at now,

777
01:03:17,420 --> 01:03:19,300
where there's only one point of disagreement.

778
01:03:19,800 --> 01:03:23,440
But the reason that there was attrition during the common ground process

779
01:03:23,440 --> 01:03:28,160
is because people realized that the know-to-everything position was untenable,

780
01:03:28,160 --> 01:03:29,460
so they dropped out.

781
01:03:32,680 --> 01:03:38,160
And I want to speak to just a couple more things in the process.

782
01:03:39,800 --> 01:03:45,540
One of which is that this fleet mix, the forecasting has come up a lot.

783
01:03:46,060 --> 01:03:50,660
So the FAA requires that you do a forecast, a defensible forecast.

784
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:53,840
Amory questions the validity of it. That's fine.

785
01:03:54,260 --> 01:03:58,940
The thing that I think is being confused here is that the forecast is in many ways

786
01:03:58,940 --> 01:04:01,120
is being presented as if it's a goal,

787
01:04:01,540 --> 01:04:04,500
like that we are striving to achieve

788
01:04:04,500 --> 01:04:07,420
the FAA's accepted forecast numbers.

789
01:04:07,880 --> 01:04:12,440
As a reminder, the community proposal was a 0.8% growth.

790
01:04:12,860 --> 01:04:17,260
We went, as a community, as low as we reasonably could,

791
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:19,280
and the FAA said, that's too low,

792
01:04:19,400 --> 01:04:21,160
that's indefensibly low.

793
01:04:21,640 --> 01:04:24,520
So what the forecast is, it's not a goal,

794
01:04:24,860 --> 01:04:26,640
it's a forecast, it's a tool

795
01:04:26,640 --> 01:04:33,960
that allows you to plan in a reasonable and responsible way for the future that could potentially come.

796
01:04:34,280 --> 01:04:40,040
But to represent it like we are all striving for that level of employment increase,

797
01:04:40,280 --> 01:04:44,020
and it's attempting that the FAA is forcing that down our throat,

798
01:04:44,020 --> 01:04:47,280
and there's some degree of inevitability to it, is not true.

799
01:04:47,520 --> 01:04:51,260
It's not a goal. It's a tool to plan responsibly with.

800
01:04:54,890 --> 01:05:00,070
On the question of funding, this is a reason to do this now.

801
01:05:00,370 --> 01:05:06,350
There is an urgency here because big federal funding sources are expiring.

802
01:05:07,090 --> 01:05:11,790
It's not about chasing money, it's about being financially responsible.

803
01:05:12,330 --> 01:05:15,410
You have to do this, everyone agrees, you have to replace the terminal in the runway.

804
01:05:15,890 --> 01:05:19,330
Why not take free money to do it?

805
01:05:19,330 --> 01:05:26,590
And I'll speak to the FBO as well, but just to be clear, the county brought in consultants

806
01:05:26,590 --> 01:05:29,230
to analyze various financial plans.

807
01:05:30,270 --> 01:05:39,310
I think it's a bit outrageous to imply that they're all lying or wrong, because why would

808
01:05:39,310 --> 01:05:39,950
they do that?

809
01:05:40,050 --> 01:05:40,970
What is their motivation?

810
01:05:41,630 --> 01:05:46,870
Again, I think as elected officials, I would hope that you would hear those kinds

811
01:05:46,870 --> 01:05:53,630
of accusations against your fellow elected officials with a bit of a cringe, because I

812
01:05:53,630 --> 01:05:57,590
think that you bring in consultants to try to understand things all the time, and you

813
01:05:57,590 --> 01:06:01,470
probably, you may ask questions, but you take them on their merits.

814
01:06:03,030 --> 01:06:09,690
And then on the idea of funding this via FBO revenues, first of all, the consultants

815
01:06:09,690 --> 01:06:14,650
analyzed that and said that the county does not have the bonding capability to

816
01:06:14,650 --> 01:06:18,970
use that revenue to bond at the dollar amounts that they need to to spend the

817
01:06:18,970 --> 01:06:22,550
kind of money that you will need to spend on the terminal the runway I think

818
01:06:22,550 --> 01:06:29,930
that the second more perplexing aspect of it is that it is a using the FBO as

819
01:06:29,930 --> 01:06:36,610
your as your principal funding mechanism ties your funding source to the

820
01:06:36,610 --> 01:06:41,870
thing that the opponents say they want less of which is private planes so

821
01:06:41,870 --> 01:06:48,370
So if you're saying let's fund it over here from this source that is the thing we want

822
01:06:48,370 --> 01:06:53,890
less of, it makes it a lot harder to kind of pursue getting less of it, which you really

823
01:06:53,890 --> 01:06:57,750
can't do in any way because the FAA has a strict non-discrimination clause.

824
01:07:02,550 --> 01:07:08,450
So on this funding, because this is a critical component, and Atami brought that up I think

825
01:07:08,450 --> 01:07:09,450
in some of your questions.

826
01:07:09,450 --> 01:07:17,330
The FAA has categorically stated in writing to the county that without an approved airport

827
01:07:17,330 --> 01:07:25,290
layout plan they will no longer provide any grants for current needs or future needs for

828
01:07:25,290 --> 01:07:27,990
the airfield or the terminal period.

829
01:07:29,630 --> 01:07:35,070
The contract that the county is currently working with with Atlantic has some big

830
01:07:35,070 --> 01:07:35,490
numbers.

831
01:07:35,490 --> 01:07:43,450
however Atlantic has in that contract written that if the county does not

832
01:07:43,450 --> 01:07:51,490
abide by the FAA's rules in terms of standardization those dollars will be

833
01:07:51,490 --> 01:07:56,430
reduced substantially substantially I just clarify ask a question for

834
01:07:56,430 --> 01:08:01,890
clarification you say standardization does that mean moving the runway is that

835
01:08:01,890 --> 01:08:07,070
requirement for the FBO? It's a requirement for the county to receive

836
01:08:07,070 --> 01:08:12,930
money and it's a requirement that the FBO has put in there that if the county is

837
01:08:12,930 --> 01:08:22,330
not in accordance with the FAA's standardization measures that Atlantic

838
01:08:22,330 --> 01:08:27,530
will reduce the amount that they're contract to arrange with the county.

839
01:08:28,090 --> 01:08:34,170
I'm sorry, I don't want to disrupt you, but you said we need to get an approved airport

840
01:08:34,170 --> 01:08:34,870
layout plan.

841
01:08:35,850 --> 01:08:40,970
Will the FAA approve an airport layout plan that does not move the runway?

842
01:08:41,550 --> 01:08:43,370
Do we know yes or no on that?

843
01:08:43,650 --> 01:08:49,330
Let me take this, just because here is a direct quote from a letter sent by John Bauer

844
01:08:49,330 --> 01:08:53,990
this summer, not going back to April 2023, a more recent correspondence.

845
01:08:54,650 --> 01:09:02,450
The FAA will not approve any future ALPs that do not meet the 400 foot runway taxiway separation standard, period.

846
01:09:02,590 --> 01:09:03,090
Pretty clear.

847
01:09:03,470 --> 01:09:03,630
Yeah.

848
01:09:06,130 --> 01:09:15,230
And if same correspondence, if ASC, the Aspen Airport, chooses to reconstruct the runway in its current location,

849
01:09:15,490 --> 01:09:20,930
the modification of standard will be terminated and the county will no longer have an approved ALP.

850
01:09:20,930 --> 01:09:27,150
So it's pretty unambiguous, I think. That is me reading direct quotes.

851
01:09:27,150 --> 01:09:27,810
Sure it sounds that way.

852
01:09:30,770 --> 01:09:36,710
And the reason that they are so dug in on this is because of safety.

853
01:09:37,030 --> 01:09:41,330
This idea that they're trying to force bigger plans on us is simply not true.

854
01:09:42,070 --> 01:09:49,610
They're doing away with modifications to standard because there actually is an aspect to standardization that is good.

855
01:09:50,430 --> 01:09:52,790
You know, I liken it to a basketball hoop.

856
01:09:53,270 --> 01:09:59,810
You go to every basketball arena in the NBA and the hoop's 10 feet tall and you can go

857
01:09:59,810 --> 01:10:02,030
through your free throw motion and hit a free throw.

858
01:10:02,590 --> 01:10:09,790
By being fully to ADG3 standards, we will have the dimensions of other ADG3 runways

859
01:10:09,790 --> 01:10:16,150
and it makes it more predictable the pilots know what they're doing better.

860
01:10:16,150 --> 01:10:21,330
They're landing on an airfield similar to the one they've landed on elsewhere.

861
01:10:23,340 --> 01:10:27,310
A 150-foot wide runway is safer.

862
01:10:27,650 --> 01:10:32,270
There are less excursions off the side than a 100-foot wide runway.

863
01:10:32,890 --> 01:10:38,290
We are now, these Embraer E175s have 95-foot wingspans.

864
01:10:39,170 --> 01:10:42,370
That's 95% of the 100-foot wide runway.

865
01:10:42,370 --> 01:10:48,690
And when we go to 150 feet and we have a 118 foot maximum, that is a smaller percentage

866
01:10:48,690 --> 01:10:51,190
of the runway that that plane will be taking up.

867
01:10:51,390 --> 01:10:53,890
And the same is true for the runway taxiway separation.

868
01:10:54,550 --> 01:10:59,250
They want more room for the planes to land on, and they want the planes to be further

869
01:10:59,250 --> 01:11:02,210
apart so they don't bump into each other, which happens.

870
01:11:02,310 --> 01:11:06,430
It happened in Atlanta a few months ago where a plane's whole tail got knocked

871
01:11:06,430 --> 01:11:08,890
off because they ran into each other like this.

872
01:11:10,290 --> 01:11:16,130
And, you know, Amory mentioned that there are 85 modifications to standard at the airport.

873
01:11:16,330 --> 01:11:22,710
That's true. And there are some of them that won't go away, despite the FAA wanting to get

874
01:11:22,710 --> 01:11:28,290
rid of the modifications to standard. But their number one and two priorities,

875
01:11:28,570 --> 01:11:35,530
their sort of non-negotiables, are safety and access. So those are the two things

876
01:11:35,530 --> 01:11:39,570
they're not going to let you do. They're not going to let you violate their safety

877
01:11:39,570 --> 01:11:45,010
standards. Amri is right, the airport is not currently unsafe, but it can be made safer.

878
01:11:45,970 --> 01:11:54,310
And the access question, you know, the community produced a recommendation that really did try

879
01:11:54,310 --> 01:12:00,910
to limit growth and limit future fleet mix in a way that the FAA said, that's just

880
01:12:00,910 --> 01:12:06,170
too obviously discrimination, but as it turns out we don't need to worry about it that much

881
01:12:06,170 --> 01:12:08,610
anyway and I'll explain why.

882
01:12:10,490 --> 01:12:21,090
So these goals George mentioned that reduce greenhouse gases, net zero terminal, greener

883
01:12:21,090 --> 01:12:23,970
planes, and then a few more direct flights.

884
01:12:24,530 --> 01:12:30,370
Something that hasn't come up today is, and again, Amory took the time to figure

885
01:12:30,370 --> 01:12:37,810
this out in detail, and that is to recognize that there is a 98% correlation between bed

886
01:12:37,810 --> 01:12:45,410
base and inplanements. So it's fairly understood and accepted that bed base is the ultimate

887
01:12:45,410 --> 01:12:57,780
governor of tourism volume. And on this managed growth question, you know, he asks

888
01:12:57,780 --> 01:13:04,840
If jurisdictions are going to be able to regulate short-term rentals, that's a question for you guys.

889
01:13:05,060 --> 01:13:06,960
And I think if you want to, you can.

890
01:13:07,740 --> 01:13:09,440
The city of Aspen has done it.

891
01:13:10,640 --> 01:13:16,320
Glenwood Springs started digging in and regulating short-term rentals in 2012.

892
01:13:17,160 --> 01:13:21,000
And in two years, they reduced the number of short-term rentals in their community by 30%.

893
01:13:21,000 --> 01:13:23,740
It can be done. Communities do it all over the place.

894
01:13:23,740 --> 01:13:29,920
We are having sensible conversations about bed base in this community and the idea that the

895
01:13:31,270 --> 01:13:38,690
Airport modernization will lead to a proliferation of short-term rentals that no jurisdiction can control is

896
01:13:39,540 --> 01:13:45,980
Speculated and it's demonstrably false because jurisdictions have regulated them

897
01:13:45,980 --> 01:13:47,160
on

898
01:13:48,360 --> 01:13:53,360
the question of plain size both both commercial

899
01:13:53,740 --> 01:14:02,360
and private. So we know that the immediate term future plane is going to be the Embraer

900
01:14:02,360 --> 01:14:11,680
E175. It doesn't meaningfully move the needle on climate and emissions. There's a slightly

901
01:14:11,680 --> 01:14:16,460
better on one, slightly worse on the other, but it doesn't move it towards our goals.

902
01:14:18,940 --> 01:14:23,440
That A22100, Tom, that you mentioned, that's the plan that the whole common ground

903
01:14:23,440 --> 01:14:28,680
recommendation was aiming at. Delta is all in on this plane, so it will come here.

904
01:14:28,740 --> 01:14:33,800
They'd be flying it here tomorrow if they could. The 109 passengers is nine

905
01:14:33,800 --> 01:14:38,040
passengers more than the BAE 146, which served this market for a long time.

906
01:14:38,340 --> 01:14:41,760
You want to explain what that plane was? That was the plane before the

907
01:14:42,680 --> 01:14:53,360
So it was coming to this market, so nine more passengers, but this Airbus A22100 is the quietest

908
01:14:53,360 --> 01:14:58,520
plane flying in the United States, quietest commercial plane, excuse me, flying in the

909
01:14:58,520 --> 01:14:59,320
United States today.

910
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:05,460
I won't pull it out and read it to you, but the mayor of Newport Beach, California in 2019

911
01:15:05,460 --> 01:15:11,860
sent a letter to Delta Airlines. This is a community that suffers from quality of life impacts from

912
01:15:11,860 --> 01:15:16,080
its airport noise and emissions and have been trying to figure out how to deal with that for a long

913
01:15:16,080 --> 01:15:24,800
time. This mayor woman wrote a, she wrote a letter to Delta Airlines profusely thanking them for

914
01:15:24,800 --> 01:15:29,620
bringing the A22100 into the community. She said it was a cause for widespread

915
01:15:29,620 --> 01:15:33,680
celebration and that they would be sharing the news far and wide. That may

916
01:15:33,680 --> 01:15:39,160
not be a perfect direct quote. On the big private question, you don't actually

917
01:15:39,160 --> 01:15:43,280
have to engage in wild speculation as is being done on this because there are

918
01:15:43,280 --> 01:15:48,560
other airports that have very wealthy communities that are currently fully

919
01:15:48,560 --> 01:15:53,180
Airport Design Group 3 that these planes could be landing at. So if they

920
01:15:53,180 --> 01:15:57,060
were out there and the numbers you're being told they'd be showing up at Jackson

921
01:15:57,060 --> 01:16:01,380
in great numbers and they'd be showing up in Vale at great numbers but they're

922
01:16:01,380 --> 01:16:06,100
not so the same thing that is happening with the commercial aircraft is

923
01:16:06,100 --> 01:16:10,120
happening with the private aircraft which is over time they are going to

924
01:16:10,120 --> 01:16:15,820
get quieter and cleaner and then in terms of like no one is really arguing

925
01:16:15,820 --> 01:16:18,260
that the big commercials are going to come because they just don't make

926
01:16:18,260 --> 01:16:24,440
economic sense for this market, but you could get the occasional, you could get some direct

927
01:16:24,440 --> 01:16:29,920
flights from East Coast cities that are currently aren't served from us, say New York and D.C.

928
01:16:30,540 --> 01:16:36,540
But from a climate perspective, that is a big win. New York is one of our top two markets

929
01:16:36,540 --> 01:16:41,720
already. They're coming here already. They just take a two leg flight from through Chicago

930
01:16:41,720 --> 01:16:46,800
through Denver to get here. By eliminating one of the takeoff legs, which burns

931
01:16:46,800 --> 01:16:53,600
a disproportionate amount of fuel for a flight, you reduce the greenhouse gas emissions of

932
01:16:53,600 --> 01:16:55,780
that total travel substantially.

933
01:16:59,740 --> 01:17:08,980
So this does sound like a really shocking kind of worst case scenario.

934
01:17:10,180 --> 01:17:11,280
This could happen.

935
01:17:12,640 --> 01:17:18,240
But this, so, Emery put up a few things that, you know, the downgrade to airport design

936
01:17:18,240 --> 01:17:23,440
group 2 could happen if we don't have an approved ALP or this sterilization.

937
01:17:23,720 --> 01:17:29,160
But again, John Bauer said, if you choose not to reconstruct the runway in its current

938
01:17:29,160 --> 01:17:32,160
location, the modification to standard will be terminated.

939
01:17:33,000 --> 01:17:38,420
That then could set off a sequence of events because the 95-foot wingspan restriction

940
01:17:38,420 --> 01:17:43,800
is no longer enforceable because it's tied to that modification to standard

941
01:17:43,800 --> 01:17:47,940
which allows you to have a 320 foot separation between runway and taxiway

942
01:17:47,940 --> 01:17:55,860
versus the 400 foot. So it could go away. And John Bauer has alluded to this.

943
01:17:55,980 --> 01:17:59,200
He has said it to the county. It has come up in multiple public meetings.

944
01:17:59,460 --> 01:18:02,360
Bill Thompson and Dan Bartholomew talked to you about it when they

945
01:18:02,360 --> 01:18:07,840
presented here that that would mean that any design group three plane up

946
01:18:07,840 --> 01:18:16,280
to 118 feet could land at the airport, but only if the taxiway, the airfield is sterilized,

947
01:18:16,380 --> 01:18:23,260
which would mean no planes on the taxiway, and it would dramatically reduce the air traffic

948
01:18:23,260 --> 01:18:32,600
volume, and it would really do real demonstrable harm to any aspect of your community that

949
01:18:32,600 --> 01:18:34,720
depends on regular visitation.

950
01:18:41,260 --> 01:18:44,520
And just, do you want to take this or may I keep going?

951
01:18:44,960 --> 01:18:45,800
You're on a roll.

952
01:18:48,240 --> 01:18:55,200
If 1C passes, it just reauthorizes the county commissioners to be able to do the thing that they do.

953
01:18:55,600 --> 01:19:02,780
And Bill, you asked a great question of, okay, well, if you get 200 and not sit 1C, what do you do?

954
01:19:03,320 --> 01:19:08,120
Well, you would say, okay, well, how do we get something that the community would be okay with?

955
01:19:08,120 --> 01:19:11,420
and that the FAA is going to potentially agree to.

956
01:19:11,900 --> 01:19:17,500
You would do the best way to do it would be to do the exact same thing that we just did.

957
01:19:17,720 --> 01:19:23,180
It would be to bring people together, roll up their sleeves, try as hard as they can

958
01:19:23,180 --> 01:19:30,080
to come up with a values-informed proposal and then do your best to see it through.

959
01:19:31,440 --> 01:19:38,840
So there is, to me, I'm sorry to say, but this is kind of a stop-the-steal sort of thing,

960
01:19:38,920 --> 01:19:42,880
which is a very public process unfolded.

961
01:19:43,060 --> 01:19:46,200
It was, as George said, incredibly community informed.

962
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:50,840
All of the concerns were raised. They were addressed.

963
01:19:51,140 --> 01:19:54,980
I was in the meetings. I watched it happen to say that they were just dismissed

964
01:19:54,980 --> 01:20:01,620
or that some corrupt consultant just gave the answer that whoever wanted to hear,

965
01:20:02,480 --> 01:20:04,800
the commissioners really tried hard.

966
01:20:05,060 --> 01:20:09,560
They all ran on slow-to-no-growth platforms, right?

967
01:20:09,660 --> 01:20:11,720
Nobody's banging the drum for growth here.

968
01:20:12,860 --> 01:20:17,920
And then the airport opponents did not get the outcome that they wanted,

969
01:20:17,920 --> 01:20:20,760
so they said we want to do it again on different terms,

970
01:20:20,800 --> 01:20:23,360
and we're going to go a direct democracy route.

971
01:20:23,360 --> 01:20:29,040
But you're going to have to get an approved ALP somehow and if you want it to be community informed

972
01:20:29,580 --> 01:20:36,300
You know, it would be smart to support the community informed one that is trying to make its way through the process right now

973
01:20:39,020 --> 01:20:43,520
So so the idea that was presented. Well, why don't we just pause this?

974
01:20:43,820 --> 01:20:47,240
You know, why don't we just start a whole nother process like Michael says?

975
01:20:47,740 --> 01:20:53,600
Why don't we try to figure out how the county is going to try to pay

976
01:20:54,480 --> 01:21:00,480
for a new airfield because it won't be coming from the feds, from the FAA.

977
01:21:02,400 --> 01:21:06,440
Bonding, the county's going to be limited. They may be able to come up with a

978
01:21:06,440 --> 01:21:13,520
way to bond long-term just to restructure the airfield, but that's

979
01:21:13,520 --> 01:21:17,800
it. There won't be any money for ongoing maintenance. There won't be any,

980
01:21:17,960 --> 01:21:21,560
certainly no money for a new terminal, modernized terminal, which the entire

981
01:21:21,560 --> 01:21:26,580
community wants. All of you flying in the flyout, you've got family flies in the

982
01:21:26,580 --> 01:21:31,080
flyout, you guess. You know what it's like in a winter time when when flights get

983
01:21:31,080 --> 01:21:35,180
canceled, what that terminal looks like, it's completely outdated, needs to be

984
01:21:35,180 --> 01:21:41,000
modernized. We have the ability, we have the ability right now to to be

985
01:21:41,000 --> 01:21:45,700
able to utilize some additional money that the FAA has another bucket of

986
01:21:45,700 --> 01:21:52,160
money from Biden's Infrastructure and Inflation Reduction Act.

987
01:21:52,640 --> 01:21:55,860
There's money there that could fill the gap between the 10%

988
01:21:55,860 --> 01:21:57,920
that the FAA will provide for the new terminal

989
01:21:58,280 --> 01:21:59,780
and the cost of that new terminal.

990
01:22:00,300 --> 01:22:02,700
Those funds go away in 2026.

991
01:22:03,400 --> 01:22:05,420
The county has already lost the opportunity

992
01:22:05,420 --> 01:22:06,460
for the first round.

993
01:22:07,120 --> 01:22:11,320
And in fact, this past year, last May,

994
01:22:11,460 --> 01:22:13,700
when the county had to do some bandage work,

995
01:22:14,440 --> 01:22:16,580
They couldn't utilize FAA grants.

996
01:22:16,780 --> 01:22:21,160
That came out of the airport revenue fund at a cost of about $7 million.

997
01:22:22,820 --> 01:22:29,460
Next May, the airport's going to be closed for an additional week longer to, again, do some band-aids.

998
01:22:30,120 --> 01:22:35,600
That money has to, at this point, come out of the airport revenue fund because the FAA is not going to fund it.

999
01:22:36,060 --> 01:22:37,360
So it comes down to safety.

1000
01:22:37,840 --> 01:22:40,020
It comes down to modernization.

1001
01:22:40,280 --> 01:22:41,260
It comes down to funding.

1002
01:22:41,260 --> 01:22:42,800
and it comes down to timing.

1003
01:22:44,820 --> 01:22:48,060
Snowmass, you've got a growing, thriving community.

1004
01:22:48,920 --> 01:22:50,180
Your bed base is growing.

1005
01:22:50,980 --> 01:22:54,960
The airport is a key gateway to your community,

1006
01:22:55,060 --> 01:22:57,200
for yourselves, for your friends, for your guests.

1007
01:22:58,660 --> 01:23:00,940
It's, you know, the airport is an integral part

1008
01:23:00,940 --> 01:23:04,280
of the economic and social fibric of your community.

1009
01:23:04,740 --> 01:23:07,480
Why wouldn't you want to look towards the future

1010
01:23:07,480 --> 01:23:14,460
and ensure that your community has that ability to maintain, continue to thrive, and continue to grow.

1011
01:23:15,840 --> 01:23:21,900
It's not rocket science. You don't have to be a national physicist. It's just common sense.

1012
01:23:23,240 --> 01:23:30,420
And I think, you know, some of the, maybe some of the instinctual pushback that you hear on the airport,

1013
01:23:30,880 --> 01:23:36,480
Chuck kind of spoke to a little bit, which is just, we don't need more of anything that it's going to lead to more.

1014
01:23:36,480 --> 01:23:43,940
And as I said, bed base is the established, understood governor of visitor volume.

1015
01:23:44,340 --> 01:23:48,700
But then let's ask ourselves, how could things maybe be made better by the airport?

1016
01:23:49,240 --> 01:23:52,260
George alluded to this idea of transit connectivity.

1017
01:23:52,500 --> 01:23:56,360
But for me, this has been the one that I've been most excited about all along,

1018
01:23:56,400 --> 01:24:01,460
which is currently fewer than 5% of people who use the airport

1019
01:24:01,460 --> 01:24:05,100
use public transportation to get to and from Aspen and Stomass.

1020
01:24:05,100 --> 01:24:06,320
There's a reason for that.

1021
01:24:06,480 --> 01:24:11,980
The buses are luggage incompatible, it's out on the highway, it's poorly signed, right?

1022
01:24:12,600 --> 01:24:16,740
But we know, you all know, Alyssa really knows because she works as an ambassador helping

1023
01:24:16,740 --> 01:24:22,560
people find their way, getting off the buses, that we have a highly transit-cultured visitor

1024
01:24:22,560 --> 01:24:22,920
base.

1025
01:24:23,260 --> 01:24:28,180
We have an incredible head start on people's willingness to get on public transportation,

1026
01:24:28,720 --> 01:24:33,020
possibly for the only week in their lives while they're here and get to the scariest.

1027
01:24:33,020 --> 01:24:39,320
We know that they do it all winter long from front to get to and from the scary is it is not in any way

1028
01:24:39,320 --> 01:24:43,260
Unreasonable to think that if we had a great transit system that was luggage compatible

1029
01:24:43,800 --> 01:24:47,640
Or that where you could check your luggage all the way through to the hotel

1030
01:24:47,640 --> 01:24:52,460
Which is in the common ground proposal that is one of the many many

1031
01:24:53,200 --> 01:24:56,780
Excellent ideas that is in this community generated document

1032
01:24:56,780 --> 01:25:02,260
Then you just get on to the bus with a carry-on and you get into Aspen

1033
01:25:02,260 --> 01:25:03,640
You might need to take a

1034
01:25:04,980 --> 01:25:12,240
Down-Towner to get to your Airbnb or whatever, but that's we're thinking 20 30 years into the future

1035
01:25:12,240 --> 01:25:15,460
You know, there's going to be autonomous vehicles. This is

1036
01:25:16,400 --> 01:25:20,960
The future we want and to to try to say let's let's slow it down

1037
01:25:20,960 --> 01:25:26,780
Let's let's hold off on embracing the future is is the very definition of short-sighted

1038
01:25:30,370 --> 01:25:32,970
Thanks guys appreciate it. It's

1039
01:25:36,490 --> 01:25:42,550
I think one of the really important keys to this is both the funding and the safety.

1040
01:25:43,690 --> 01:25:51,570
I mean, Emery gave us some good numbers, but from what we've seen from John Peacock,

1041
01:25:52,010 --> 01:25:57,910
he's very clear about the bonding and how much funding we can actually get for the airport.

1042
01:25:58,650 --> 01:26:03,870
You know, it's clear we could either do the airport or the terminal, but not both.

1043
01:26:05,510 --> 01:26:07,030
The runway or the terminal.

1044
01:26:07,490 --> 01:26:08,570
Sorry, the runway or the terminal.

1045
01:26:10,150 --> 01:26:18,070
And so, and I think it's really, I hate when anybody wants to make a decision based on fear,

1046
01:26:18,450 --> 01:26:23,270
like if we're just afraid of something because of something that could potentially happen.

1047
01:26:23,630 --> 01:26:26,810
I don't think we're making a rational decision coming from the right space.

1048
01:26:37,340 --> 01:26:53,740
At this point, to mean what kind of, my question is if the county commissioners are and the

1049
01:26:53,740 --> 01:26:59,120
the original community-based process was so valuable

1050
01:26:59,120 --> 01:27:04,780
and really willing to listen to all of the community voice,

1051
01:27:05,340 --> 01:27:09,680
why there's concern about having a vote by the people

1052
01:27:10,160 --> 01:27:13,740
to accept the airport layout plan.

1053
01:27:15,440 --> 01:27:16,200
Well, they're not.

1054
01:27:16,480 --> 01:27:19,400
I mean, the public has the ability to vote.

1055
01:27:20,100 --> 01:27:22,840
The Board of County Commissioner has put that on a ballot.

1056
01:27:22,840 --> 01:27:32,520
But it's to give them the power to do it themselves, not for the community to actually look at the plan and approve it or not.

1057
01:27:33,400 --> 01:27:38,400
The community has had a chance to look at the plan and they have the opportunity to vote on it on one C.

1058
01:27:39,040 --> 01:27:45,420
They can support one C or they can vote against one C and the community then has had that opportunity to vote.

1059
01:27:45,420 --> 01:28:03,420
It seems like that if you vote on 100, then that gives the community the right to vote and that 1C gives the commissioners just more power.

1060
01:28:04,080 --> 01:28:08,260
It doesn't give the commissioners more power. It reaffirms the power they already have.

1061
01:28:08,260 --> 01:28:15,400
As a sponsor of the Pickin County airport, having received hundreds of millions of dollars

1062
01:28:15,400 --> 01:28:21,940
and grants over the last 40 years, they have obligations because of those grant assurances.

1063
01:28:22,360 --> 01:28:27,200
And they are liable legally if they don't fulfill those obligations.

1064
01:28:27,720 --> 01:28:28,980
So it just reaffirms.

1065
01:28:29,360 --> 01:28:32,560
Now if the community doesn't like that, they can vote down.

1066
01:28:32,940 --> 01:28:34,040
They can vote down on it.

1067
01:28:37,360 --> 01:28:41,140
Frankly, the commissioners had put the ballot on first.

1068
01:28:41,820 --> 01:28:45,500
We would have only had one up-and-down vote, I'm sure.

1069
01:28:47,860 --> 01:28:53,300
The opposition wanted the commissioners to put one on, and frankly they didn't do it.

1070
01:28:53,320 --> 01:28:55,760
They should have, in my view.

1071
01:28:57,780 --> 01:29:05,940
200 says we want the ability to vote and so you passed 200 and now you still have

1072
01:29:05,940 --> 01:29:11,740
another vote. One seat gives the public the opportunity to vote up or down right

1073
01:29:11,740 --> 01:29:19,200
now. And just as a reminder which may not be all that public they

1074
01:29:19,200 --> 01:29:24,040
had to call them in the espantines but the Pickham County Democrats, you know

1075
01:29:24,040 --> 01:29:31,200
This is voted, their board of directors voted unanimously to say no to 200 in very strong

1076
01:29:31,200 --> 01:29:40,400
terms because they don't view it as particularly pro-democracy and that there is no alternative

1077
01:29:40,400 --> 01:29:41,780
plan on the table.

1078
01:29:42,060 --> 01:29:48,820
It is not about giving the people the right to decide on the airport.

1079
01:29:49,040 --> 01:29:51,340
It's about slowing this process down.

1080
01:29:51,340 --> 01:29:59,540
It's about saying, I don't believe in representative democracy to arrive at a...

1081
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:08,740
Good answer to a complex question that a very large group of people spent a tremendous amount of time working on.

1082
01:30:11,720 --> 01:30:12,980
Can I ask a question?

1083
01:30:15,680 --> 01:30:21,320
I mean, it's all pretty simple. We all know we need a new terminal. We all know we need a new runway.

1084
01:30:21,520 --> 01:30:24,900
It's a question of where the runway is. I mean, that's what we're talking about.

1085
01:30:24,900 --> 01:30:33,780
Now, can you shed a little light on, I mean, Henry says, you know, the FBO contract over

1086
01:30:33,780 --> 01:30:38,340
30 years is going to generate a billion dollars, and we can pay for everything.

1087
01:30:40,060 --> 01:30:49,440
And the county is saying, well, we can pay for the FBO revenues would pay for the runway

1088
01:30:50,090 --> 01:30:52,360
or the terminal, we can't do both.

1089
01:30:52,820 --> 01:30:57,180
No, personally, I like to hear what you say, but personally, I mean, I like free money,

1090
01:30:57,520 --> 01:31:01,600
you know, why would you use all your money when somebody's going to give you money?

1091
01:31:01,900 --> 01:31:08,400
But just explain to me the difference, clearly, you know, right people on both sides, what

1092
01:31:08,400 --> 01:31:13,860
is the discrepancy, you know, Emery's group says, yeah, we can fund it all in counties

1093
01:31:13,860 --> 01:31:14,860
saying we can't.

1094
01:31:14,900 --> 01:31:17,140
So where is the discrepancy there?

1095
01:31:17,140 --> 01:31:27,020
Well, I'll start. The discrepancy is that, again, I have not seen a contract. They certainly

1096
01:31:27,020 --> 01:31:33,880
have not seen a contract. The county has just given Atlantic an extension to work out the

1097
01:31:33,880 --> 01:31:40,420
contract and see what this vote is going to be, because if the vote goes in favor

1098
01:31:40,420 --> 01:31:45,520
of the opposition, Atlantic is going to reduce the amount that they're going to grant

1099
01:31:45,520 --> 01:31:47,140
to the county substantially.

1100
01:31:50,470 --> 01:31:55,670
So the county staff, the professional staff, the finance

1101
01:31:55,670 --> 01:32:05,490
committee, the airport aviation consultant group out of Chicago have gone through the

1102
01:32:05,490 --> 01:32:11,710
numbers, looked at all the alternatives and told the county this is what you're able

1103
01:32:11,710 --> 01:32:15,730
to do and this is what you're not able to do. I don't know those exact numbers but

1104
01:32:15,730 --> 01:32:23,050
But I know that the county's airport revenue that they generate could not cover the debt

1105
01:32:23,050 --> 01:32:26,270
service on a bond for the amount that is needed.

1106
01:32:28,810 --> 01:32:35,690
Yeah, I mean, I defer to the analysis that was done, right, by real professionals who

1107
01:32:35,690 --> 01:32:38,650
I am not going to sit here and call corrupted.

1108
01:32:40,270 --> 01:32:44,230
I mean, I guess it really comes down to representative government.

1109
01:32:44,230 --> 01:32:49,570
I mean this is a this is a complex issue and there's been a lot of people who

1110
01:32:49,570 --> 01:32:53,670
spent a lot of time on it and the reason why we elect officials is so they can

1111
01:32:53,670 --> 01:33:01,070
dig into it and really get the best solutions for the community and so I

1112
01:33:01,750 --> 01:33:05,550
think that it's important that the commissioners have that opportunity to

1113
01:33:05,550 --> 01:33:12,430
represent the people. You represent your constituents, your

1114
01:33:12,430 --> 01:33:18,390
constituents of the Board of County commissioners. The Democratic Party when

1115
01:33:18,390 --> 01:33:24,030
we talked to the chair they were not as concerned about the airport what they

1116
01:33:24,030 --> 01:33:30,490
were concerned about is representative government and to start to put a wedge

1117
01:33:30,490 --> 01:33:34,650
in a homeroom charter by adding an amendment to sort of work their way

1118
01:33:34,650 --> 01:33:38,790
through legally in terms of trying to get this petition forward they didn't

1119
01:33:38,790 --> 01:33:47,850
buy it. And I don't buy it either. You either have a representative government elected by

1120
01:33:47,850 --> 01:33:53,710
the people, for the people, or you have a direct democracy where every issue just throws out

1121
01:33:53,710 --> 01:33:54,170
on a boat.

1122
01:33:54,550 --> 01:33:58,170
Did the local Republicans have an opinion on this?

1123
01:33:58,350 --> 01:34:02,910
They are supporting 1C as well and opposing 200.

1124
01:34:03,450 --> 01:34:04,950
So they're the same as the Democrats.

1125
01:34:04,950 --> 01:34:05,170
it.

1126
01:34:05,350 --> 01:34:08,450
It's like the one thing both parties agree on.

1127
01:34:09,810 --> 01:34:16,430
And no surprise, of course, the Aspen Chamber Resource Association representing the business

1128
01:34:16,430 --> 01:34:24,070
community is supporting 1C opposing 200, Snowmass doesn't really have a chamber.

1129
01:34:24,910 --> 01:34:32,330
So I don't know how you can get the business community to provide that input, but I'm

1130
01:34:32,330 --> 01:34:37,250
assuming that the business community is as concerned, whether it be the lodges, the retail,

1131
01:34:38,250 --> 01:34:44,230
even the service, because they will all be either positively affected or negatively affected.

1132
01:34:44,770 --> 01:34:48,950
I just want to add on ACRA, you know, that people might hear that and be like, well,

1133
01:34:48,990 --> 01:34:54,630
of course, they're supportive. They did extreme due diligence on this. You know, they did

1134
01:34:54,630 --> 01:35:00,670
not come to this decision reflexively in any way. They did a member survey,

1135
01:35:00,670 --> 01:35:07,530
They went and did door-to-door meetings, and if you look at their release that describes

1136
01:35:07,530 --> 01:35:10,310
their endorsement, why they're no-on-two hundred-

1137
01:35:10,310 --> 01:35:10,530
I'm sorry.

1138
01:35:10,550 --> 01:35:11,230
What are you talking about?

1139
01:35:11,830 --> 01:35:12,330
Acra.

1140
01:35:12,510 --> 01:35:13,030
Acra.

1141
01:35:13,710 --> 01:35:18,550
And there's a data set that's attached to it that is all the survey results, including

1142
01:35:18,550 --> 01:35:21,350
all of the comments made by their businesses.

1143
01:35:21,650 --> 01:35:27,430
You can see that they did not arrive at the decision reflexively, but it is overwhelming.

1144
01:35:27,430 --> 01:35:33,270
It's like 80% in favor of moving forward with the approved ALP.

1145
01:35:34,330 --> 01:35:38,770
Well, we're going to have a presentation that we're going through our budget,

1146
01:35:39,030 --> 01:35:44,710
and Snowmass Village spends about $9 million a year to attract people to this village.

1147
01:35:45,310 --> 01:35:49,550
So we're heavily invested in the tourist-based economy.

1148
01:35:50,350 --> 01:36:00,430
So it's, you know, there's a lot of people out there saying they're concerned about growth and we are as well.

1149
01:36:00,550 --> 01:36:02,830
We want to make sure that Snowmass Village is inviting.

1150
01:36:03,570 --> 01:36:06,690
We have just one more question about growth.

1151
01:36:06,870 --> 01:36:13,570
I think when you were mentioning that the growth projections were not goals,

1152
01:36:13,570 --> 01:36:20,510
that the growth goal was actually like less than 1% is that yeah so that so

1153
01:36:20,510 --> 01:36:25,770
that the there was a growth goal that came out of the original common ground

1154
01:36:25,770 --> 01:36:34,410
the citizens product that was then and that goal was 0.8% per year per year

1155
01:36:34,410 --> 01:36:39,870
and then the FAA basically said that that is an unrealistic goal based on

1156
01:36:39,870 --> 01:36:47,270
your your past growth rates so just for your forecasting tool it has to be more

1157
01:36:47,270 --> 01:36:52,890
realistic and I think it ended up being 1.3 still on the low end of what they

1158
01:36:52,890 --> 01:36:58,610
considered their acceptable range but but I again I want to emphasize that it's

1159
01:36:58,610 --> 01:37:04,630
not a goal it is a forecasting tool so and they just said you know it's like

1160
01:37:04,630 --> 01:37:08,970
if you're gonna buy a house for your daughter you say like how big you think

1161
01:37:08,970 --> 01:37:14,670
your family is going to be like you're going to have at least one kid we hope but probably

1162
01:37:14,670 --> 01:37:21,090
not ten and like so let's get you a three bedroom right like it's just it's just responsible

1163
01:37:21,090 --> 01:37:27,930
thinking about the future looking at the past as a kind of a you know to identify some

1164
01:37:27,930 --> 01:37:31,450
trends lines for what you might see but it's not a goal.

1165
01:37:31,450 --> 01:37:39,370
And was there any conversation about how to keep it to that lower percentage?

1166
01:37:40,110 --> 01:37:42,450
Yeah, sorry. Thank you. We should have mentioned that.

1167
01:37:42,750 --> 01:37:51,030
So one of the pieces that's in the plan, the common ground proposal, is this idea of flexible gates.

1168
01:37:51,350 --> 01:37:58,110
So currently the airport has eight gates, but the new terminal would have eight that could flex down to six

1169
01:37:58,110 --> 01:38:03,870
so that if a larger passenger plane came in, a gate would effectively shut down,

1170
01:38:04,110 --> 01:38:10,830
which would sort of help keep that employment number at a lower rate over time.

1171
01:38:11,370 --> 01:38:20,130
And it was, again, in terms of really taking this growth question and this sense of overwhelm that people are feeling very seriously,

1172
01:38:20,790 --> 01:38:26,550
basically they said, how many ways can we come at attempting to control growth via the airport?

1173
01:38:26,550 --> 01:38:40,570
And there are certain aspects or certain tactics that the FAA just would not allow for, like the blatant discrimination on aircraft side or proposing a growth rate that just didn't meet their standards.

1174
01:38:41,110 --> 01:38:44,410
So the flexible gates was one that's making it through.

1175
01:38:44,670 --> 01:38:51,270
And it's a win for people who are concerned about growth, which is everyone.

1176
01:38:51,610 --> 01:38:55,270
There's nobody banging the drum for lots more people, there just isn't.

1177
01:38:55,270 --> 01:39:00,850
Well, that's interesting because you hear about that the FA will won't let you limit the number of

1178
01:39:00,850 --> 01:39:05,770
Flights, right, but they will let you limit the gates

1179
01:39:05,770 --> 01:39:13,450
It appears to right right the county has the ability in the terminal to limit the gates and the gates is a misnomer because right now

1180
01:39:13,450 --> 01:39:15,910
There are no gates. There's just some painted lines

1181
01:39:15,910 --> 01:39:22,950
The new airport layout plant has real gates just like you would see a DIA

1182
01:39:22,950 --> 01:39:31,390
So then the county then has the ability to either remove a gate, close it down, or expand a gate.

1183
01:39:31,970 --> 01:39:38,930
So that is an important guardrail, and that's part of the airport layout plan that's in front of the FAA right now.

1184
01:39:40,170 --> 01:39:42,230
Interesting. Thanks.

1185
01:39:43,150 --> 01:39:47,450
Okay. I want to be fair to both parties, so we provide the same amount of time.

1186
01:39:47,450 --> 01:39:49,470
Just one last closing comment.

1187
01:39:49,650 --> 01:39:49,910
Go ahead.

1188
01:39:49,910 --> 01:39:56,930
We have got support from our elected – from all of our elected officials up and down the

1189
01:39:56,930 --> 01:39:57,250
valley.

1190
01:39:57,570 --> 01:40:03,410
Every mayor has supported this except one who is still spooing lies and misinformation.

1191
01:40:04,150 --> 01:40:11,070
So we ask that you join your other fellow elected officials and pass a resolution supporting

1192
01:40:11,070 --> 01:40:11,770
1C.

1193
01:40:12,010 --> 01:40:12,450
Thank you.

1194
01:40:13,090 --> 01:40:13,830
Thank you so much.

1195
01:40:13,830 --> 01:40:14,250
Thanks, George.

1196
01:40:14,450 --> 01:40:14,870
Thank you.

1197
01:40:14,930 --> 01:40:15,370
Thanks, everybody.

1198
01:40:15,730 --> 01:40:16,470
Can I make one quick comment?

1199
01:40:16,470 --> 01:40:24,430
So, I am so grateful for all these conversations and we're so blessed to be in a community

1200
01:40:24,430 --> 01:40:31,710
with so many individuals that are engaged in intentional organization and just engaged in

1201
01:40:31,710 --> 01:40:34,550
the thought process and reading everything that's out there and available.

1202
01:40:35,390 --> 01:40:41,570
And I do highly appreciate all the elected officials and their input and all the individuals

1203
01:40:41,570 --> 01:40:46,790
that have put in time to, you know, create these informed organizations around this topic.

1204
01:40:47,790 --> 01:40:53,510
What I really look forward to seeing from everyone is the healing process

1205
01:40:53,510 --> 01:40:57,070
after this ballot issue goes one way or the other.

1206
01:40:57,550 --> 01:41:00,910
So I look forward to seeing how we're all going to come together around that.

1207
01:41:01,670 --> 01:41:06,370
That's a wonderful note to end on. I promise you I'll be part of that.

1208
01:41:07,990 --> 01:41:10,830
All right. Thank you. Thank you.

1209
01:41:14,830 --> 01:41:20,450
Okay. So great conversation. Good information. Appreciate

1210
01:41:20,830 --> 01:41:29,730
all that. We do have the Aspen City Council, the Pickham County commissioners, the mayor

1211
01:41:29,730 --> 01:41:37,030
of Glenwood, Carbondale, and Basalt supporting 1C.

1212
01:41:39,110 --> 01:41:41,590
I would like to see the

1213
01:41:41,590 --> 01:41:46,890
Snowmass Village Council also support 1C. I don't think we can do that today, though.

1214
01:41:47,250 --> 01:41:52,210
We're a work session, right? You can't vote. If you want a direction to

1215
01:41:52,210 --> 01:41:57,210
prepare a resolution, you can do that. What I'm suggesting is we have a

1216
01:41:57,210 --> 01:42:00,930
Resolution drafted for consideration at the next council meeting. I'm

1217
01:42:04,840 --> 01:42:06,540
willing to have a resolution drafted

1218
01:42:06,540 --> 01:42:13,740
I but I would like to take the next week to really think about the statements that were made tonight and hear from others in the community

1219
01:42:13,740 --> 01:42:19,080
Great. Yeah, I agree. Got more to process now. Okay

1220
01:42:27,370 --> 01:42:34,730
Please do send us an email and you can find that at to SV under the government section contact the council

1221
01:42:42,080 --> 01:42:45,940
You should have a recording available directly as soon as tomorrow, right?

1222
01:42:46,200 --> 01:42:48,080
It's less than 24 hours.

1223
01:42:52,420 --> 01:42:53,300
Before next week.

1224
01:42:56,100 --> 01:42:56,480
Monday.

1225
01:42:57,220 --> 01:42:57,240
Sorry.

1226
01:42:58,160 --> 01:42:59,100
Week from today, yes.

1227
01:43:01,440 --> 01:43:01,840
Four.

1228
01:43:01,980 --> 01:43:02,460
Four o'clock.

1229
01:43:03,220 --> 01:43:03,360
Yeah.

1230
01:43:03,560 --> 01:43:05,420
Well, probably before that, to get it in the packet, right?

1231
01:43:05,620 --> 01:43:09,600
Well, if you would like your public comment included in the packet, I would need it by

1232
01:43:09,600 --> 01:43:14,180
Wednesday afternoon at the closed business so that I can include it in the packet on Thursday.

1233
01:43:14,180 --> 01:43:14,500
first day.

1234
01:43:17,970 --> 01:43:26,370
All right. Thank you all very much. Thank you. All right. Moving on our next topic

1235
01:43:26,370 --> 01:43:34,950
on the agenda is we're going to have a discussion about our mall transit center and some potential

1236
01:43:34,950 --> 01:43:38,250
improvements there. Sam, welcome. Hi.

1237
01:43:41,300 --> 01:43:42,520
Can you share my screen?

1238
01:43:47,840 --> 01:43:49,520
All right. There we go.

1239
01:43:49,520 --> 01:43:56,880
Let's come up. Hi, Sam Guarino, Transportation Director. We've also got Alex Jock with SEH

1240
01:43:56,880 --> 01:44:04,180
on the line. If you all remember this summer, we came to discuss going to the public with

1241
01:44:04,180 --> 01:44:09,700
the designs that we had so far, some strategies around how we might engage the public to

1242
01:44:09,700 --> 01:44:16,700
get some feedback on what we had. During that meeting, Mayor Madsen brought up a thought

1243
01:44:16,700 --> 01:44:22,200
for another design for us to look at. Council agreed that it was worth us

1244
01:44:22,200 --> 01:44:27,220
taking a look at, so we took it back to SEH to make sure that it was something

1245
01:44:27,220 --> 01:44:34,320
that would be possible for us to work with. This design here, as you see, is

1246
01:44:34,320 --> 01:44:41,120
the existing Lot 6. The green buses are village shuttle buses. This would

1247
01:44:41,120 --> 01:44:49,480
allow us to have six village shuttle bus bays with exterior loading. They would be

1248
01:44:49,480 --> 01:44:54,840
going in through that lower entrance and out through the upper entrance. It would

1249
01:44:54,840 --> 01:44:59,780
also have two spots for buses to be staged. The turning movements work.

1250
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:07,220
It is a possibility that we could look into this design. There would be some questions, of

1251
01:45:07,220 --> 01:45:13,460
course, around pedestrian flow, if it was a direction that we'd like to go. There, you'll

1252
01:45:13,460 --> 01:45:22,300
see this drawing here has a pedestrian underpass suggested that would go into where the elevators

1253
01:45:22,300 --> 01:45:29,800
had been shown in previous plans to get people across the street without having to interact

1254
01:45:29,800 --> 01:45:30,380
with vehicles.

1255
01:45:33,680 --> 01:45:36,400
So I'll stop there and ask if you guys have any questions about

1256
01:45:36,400 --> 01:45:41,240
this design. Just two questions. Yeah go ahead. And this assumes you're leaving

1257
01:45:41,240 --> 01:45:45,240
Raftal owner doing the incremental improvement. This assumes the incremental

1258
01:45:45,240 --> 01:45:50,560
improvements. And the second question is what do you do with the 54 cars from

1259
01:45:50,560 --> 01:45:55,540
Lot 6? Well and I so I think and this is a question that we had not yet

1260
01:45:55,540 --> 01:45:59,620
answered on the two-level design either which is I think why we wound

1261
01:45:59,620 --> 01:46:09,100
up with coming up with this Lot 6 design. If this is a, the spots in Lot 6 are a challenge

1262
01:46:09,100 --> 01:46:13,380
that we're going to have to meet, whether it means they go away or they need to go somewhere

1263
01:46:13,380 --> 01:46:22,060
else, both the two level design and the Lot 6 solutions have that same problem, so that's

1264
01:46:22,060 --> 01:46:25,060
what we thought would make sense to bring to the public.

1265
01:46:25,060 --> 01:46:27,100
So what are your, you guys' recommendation?

1266
01:46:27,480 --> 01:46:30,220
We had a, I'm sure the public would like to have those.

1267
01:46:30,320 --> 01:46:31,460
Yeah, probably, huh?

1268
01:46:31,560 --> 01:46:32,720
So, I mean, where are the options?

1269
01:46:34,560 --> 01:46:39,080
You know, we haven't delved too far into

1270
01:46:39,080 --> 01:46:42,340
what a design for more parking spaces could look like.

1271
01:46:42,780 --> 01:46:45,000
I mean, the obvious first option

1272
01:46:45,000 --> 01:46:46,820
is to not replace the parking spaces.

1273
01:46:47,220 --> 01:46:49,440
But like you say, public probably

1274
01:46:49,440 --> 01:46:50,740
wouldn't be super happy with that, right?

1275
01:46:51,060 --> 01:46:51,960
We'd lose our heads.

1276
01:46:52,360 --> 01:46:53,850
I think that you've-

1277
01:46:53,850 --> 01:47:00,670
And the drawings that we received from you, Councillor Fritztein, you had some suggestions

1278
01:47:00,670 --> 01:47:07,250
for some covered parking in Lot 5 with that lower section covered, and I think that there

1279
01:47:07,250 --> 01:47:09,530
was even one that had covered parking in Lot 4 as well.

1280
01:47:10,010 --> 01:47:14,650
So that's a possibility, although it does add structures to the numbered lots.

1281
01:47:16,490 --> 01:47:20,110
That's as far as we've gone, I don't know why.

1282
01:47:20,110 --> 01:47:27,370
One thing I would add to this is this lot six plan versus the two-struck the two-level plan are kind of apples to apples

1283
01:47:27,370 --> 01:47:32,530
They don't they both lose the same amount of parking and so I understand but I just question what

1284
01:47:33,230 --> 01:47:39,150
Yeah, so we're I mean that's why I mean our initial recommendation was start start with the rafter and

1285
01:47:39,790 --> 01:47:43,630
That then melded into the two-level which molded into this one

1286
01:47:43,630 --> 01:47:47,750
And so we haven't solved it and in order for what we're recommending tonight

1287
01:47:47,750 --> 01:47:52,710
is let's take this out get public feedback and see how much that matters the loss of the parking.

1288
01:47:53,290 --> 01:47:58,490
And then you know whether it's the two level plan this plan or just the initial plan we can get that

1289
01:47:58,490 --> 01:48:05,630
feedback and see what how y'all want to proceed but that's we haven't solved both all three or two

1290
01:48:05,630 --> 01:48:12,250
of these three options lose the same amount of parking. Yeah I think that uh I mean I'm really

1291
01:48:12,250 --> 01:48:18,310
not wild about anything that we're looking at right now. My initial reaction was that

1292
01:48:18,310 --> 01:48:26,910
maybe this could be another solution if we're okay with giving up the parking. But the more

1293
01:48:26,910 --> 01:48:35,910
I looked at it, I'm just like, geez, the pedestrian access is not great. The intention

1294
01:48:35,910 --> 01:48:41,910
when we started this whole process was really to try to answer some goals, right?

1295
01:48:42,750 --> 01:48:51,850
Reduce the duration of construction, reduce the impact for sure. How do we put all

1296
01:48:51,850 --> 01:48:57,970
the pedestrians and the buses in one place so that getting on public

1297
01:48:57,970 --> 01:49:05,710
transit is easy? And how do we build it so that you know it's a pedestrian

1298
01:49:05,710 --> 01:49:08,490
and first type of infrastructure.

1299
01:49:11,180 --> 01:49:19,000
Some of the thoughts that I had as I was looking at these different designs was, should we

1300
01:49:19,000 --> 01:49:21,340
be prioritizing RAFTA?

1301
01:49:22,320 --> 01:49:29,480
Should RAFTA be at the upper station there, or should that be for the village shuttles?

1302
01:49:30,080 --> 01:49:36,480
I mean, we have about equal number of transit uses on each, right?

1303
01:49:37,160 --> 01:49:39,780
And 6040 would be a better 6040?

1304
01:49:40,160 --> 01:49:40,640
6040.

1305
01:49:40,760 --> 01:49:41,900
60 or after 40, yes.

1306
01:49:42,260 --> 01:49:42,540
That seems fair.

1307
01:49:43,140 --> 01:49:45,100
I mean, that's off the cuff, but probably close.

1308
01:49:45,200 --> 01:49:47,300
So there's somewhere in the vicinity.

1309
01:49:50,100 --> 01:49:56,560
So, I mean, the village shuttles can operate in a much smaller space than the raft of buses.

1310
01:49:56,560 --> 01:50:05,560
buses. So if we were going to turn buses around, maybe it's better to focus on turning the shuttles

1311
01:50:05,560 --> 01:50:12,720
around and have the raft of buses go through lot six.

1312
01:50:17,230 --> 01:50:22,650
The turning radius is just looking at it. I think it would be a real challenge for the raft of buses.

1313
01:50:22,850 --> 01:50:25,910
I don't know that specifically, but it doesn't look like it's going to work.

1314
01:50:25,910 --> 01:50:36,410
So, you know, and I kind of thought the same thing, but in the design for the two level design, we have the road going down and around and through the bottom a lot six.

1315
01:50:38,850 --> 01:50:51,110
So, is that a better use of space if we have, you know, public transit raft to getting picked up lower, you know, maybe.

1316
01:50:52,190 --> 01:50:59,790
And I'm just kind of throwing it out there to think about because I just want to make

1317
01:50:59,790 --> 01:51:06,570
sure if we're going to go about this, we can do it in a way that is really,

1318
01:51:08,850 --> 01:51:09,650
it kind of

1319
01:51:09,650 --> 01:51:13,390
tackles all those goals that we wanted to achieve.

1320
01:51:13,870 --> 01:51:20,470
And I think we kind of got there with the original plan, but we got clear message from

1321
01:51:20,470 --> 01:51:23,350
on the planning commission that it was too big

1322
01:51:23,350 --> 01:51:26,010
of a piece of infrastructure.

1323
01:51:28,340 --> 01:51:28,740
So,

1324
01:51:31,260 --> 01:51:33,600
I don't know, I don't feel like we're there yet,

1325
01:51:33,720 --> 01:51:38,890
but I think there's something that we can do.

1326
01:51:41,130 --> 01:51:43,110
And I think that's kind of where we're saying,

1327
01:51:43,490 --> 01:51:44,490
let's start with input.

1328
01:51:44,910 --> 01:51:46,130
I mean, because I don't know.

1329
01:51:46,950 --> 01:51:48,930
And I mean, if that idea, the raft idea

1330
01:51:48,930 --> 01:51:51,510
comes out in lot six, then let's hear that.

1331
01:51:52,110 --> 01:51:53,990
I mean, I don't want to speak too much

1332
01:51:53,990 --> 01:51:55,390
for Sam or staff, I will.

1333
01:51:55,390 --> 01:51:59,610
I guess it will take the pleasure of doing that for things like something, I mean that's

1334
01:51:59,610 --> 01:52:03,810
what, that incremental step of something and then the now, and then the, in my mind the

1335
01:52:03,810 --> 01:52:07,930
question is, and then in light of what's next after that is not known yet.

1336
01:52:08,210 --> 01:52:12,150
I think we all agree something, but is it in light of the next step being the two

1337
01:52:12,150 --> 01:52:16,390
levels of the solution or the lot six solution or some solution we haven't heard from yet.

1338
01:52:16,750 --> 01:52:21,190
But we want to make sure whatever gets designed for that first step accommodates such

1339
01:52:21,190 --> 01:52:21,450
two and three.

1340
01:52:21,450 --> 01:52:27,390
I would suggest before we went to the public that we would really think all

1341
01:52:27,390 --> 01:52:32,230
these through and have an answer like to the 54 cars of lot six and things like

1342
01:52:32,230 --> 01:52:38,810
that. It's number one number two because if you go with you know incomplete

1343
01:52:38,810 --> 01:52:43,830
information you're not gonna get clear answers and things are gonna spin

1344
01:52:43,830 --> 01:52:44,210
around.

1345
01:52:47,030 --> 01:52:50,670
We're gonna have some different makeup of council in three

1346
01:52:50,670 --> 01:52:56,010
weeks and I would say this is sort of our aspirant airport issue and I would just suggest

1347
01:52:56,010 --> 01:53:02,650
that we it's good to see all this but I was just we don't take any action until we know

1348
01:53:02,650 --> 01:53:08,290
what the new council is and there may be some new opinions and I just don't think we should

1349
01:53:09,750 --> 01:53:13,090
jump into something now because we're going to have a new council that's going to be

1350
01:53:13,090 --> 01:53:17,090
in place for two years that'll have to deal with whatever this is.

1351
01:53:17,090 --> 01:53:17,630
I

1352
01:53:20,580 --> 01:53:26,240
mean, I'm concerned about going too deep into another study even though without a study

1353
01:53:26,240 --> 01:53:30,520
we really don't have the information we need to address what you're suggesting the user

1354
01:53:30,520 --> 01:53:34,520
experience and the opportunities to try various options.

1355
01:53:37,180 --> 01:53:45,220
But I wonder too, if it isn't worth sharing just these very preliminary concepts with

1356
01:53:45,220 --> 01:53:49,700
perhaps planning commission in the interim as opposed to getting another

1357
01:53:49,700 --> 01:53:54,360
study going and just see what they might think because we've got some good minds

1358
01:53:54,360 --> 01:53:58,460
in the room and they've looked at many transit options for many years so

1359
01:53:58,460 --> 01:54:03,340
perhaps without spending money on another study they could kind of look

1360
01:54:03,340 --> 01:54:08,200
at this and because it's a new idea and it's it's worth merit and it's

1361
01:54:08,200 --> 01:54:13,540
worth exploring and while we're you know looking at potentially a new makeup

1362
01:54:13,540 --> 01:54:14,120
above council.

1363
01:54:16,430 --> 01:54:21,350
I would say planning commission and the public. I mean I

1364
01:54:21,350 --> 01:54:27,010
don't know what else we need to be able to what other information we need right

1365
01:54:27,010 --> 01:54:33,870
now to get public feedback honestly. I mean because I think they're I don't know

1366
01:54:33,870 --> 01:54:41,390
but probably going to look at it in a more big picture scenario and and so

1367
01:54:41,390 --> 01:54:46,630
So they're going to weigh the things that we already know, like it's going to, you know,

1368
01:54:47,350 --> 01:54:51,610
a plan will shut down the road for a period of time.

1369
01:54:51,730 --> 01:54:53,310
We kind of know how long that's going to be.

1370
01:54:53,410 --> 01:54:59,290
We know, we know a lot of stuff because we've gone through this and these are just some

1371
01:54:59,290 --> 01:55:03,490
some tweaks to, to some previous plans, I would say.

1372
01:55:05,290 --> 01:55:10,770
So I would be fine with going ahead with what we have and talking to the public.

1373
01:55:10,770 --> 01:55:13,070
I would just add to that, because if I was the public,

1374
01:55:13,230 --> 01:55:15,510
the first thing I'm going to ask is, where's lot six?

1375
01:55:16,110 --> 01:55:17,650
And I think we have to have an answer.

1376
01:55:17,830 --> 01:55:18,870
We need to have a few.

1377
01:55:18,950 --> 01:55:20,070
What's the first thing you're going to answer?

1378
01:55:20,070 --> 01:55:20,770
Where's lot six?

1379
01:55:20,990 --> 01:55:22,430
What happened where I parked my car?

1380
01:55:22,930 --> 01:55:23,170
Oh, the parking.

1381
01:55:23,350 --> 01:55:25,090
So we need to have an answer to that,

1382
01:55:25,310 --> 01:55:26,870
or we may have some options or something.

1383
01:55:26,990 --> 01:55:29,650
We just can't go and say, oh, we haven't thought about it.

1384
01:55:30,090 --> 01:55:32,430
I think we have one more step.

1385
01:55:32,890 --> 01:55:34,610
There is no federal money to build a parking lot.

1386
01:55:34,810 --> 01:55:35,130
What's that?

1387
01:55:35,230 --> 01:55:36,310
There's not federal money.

1388
01:55:36,410 --> 01:55:36,710
I understand.

1389
01:55:37,010 --> 01:55:40,150
So it would be you guys, us as a town,

1390
01:55:40,150 --> 01:55:45,130
saying we're gonna put that money towards it I just don't see how we can can

1391
01:55:45,130 --> 01:55:49,910
you park where the village shuttles are now could you do parking there you could

1392
01:55:49,910 --> 01:55:53,390
I mean I think I mean you guys can correct me if I'm wrong that one of the

1393
01:55:53,390 --> 01:55:57,890
ideas of moving the rat or the shuttle out to the lot six is provide for the

1394
01:55:57,890 --> 01:56:01,770
redevelopment of the mall so yes you could but I don't think that's gonna

1395
01:56:01,770 --> 01:56:07,870
achieve that goal can I ask a question Susan just a thought and so public

1396
01:56:07,870 --> 01:56:12,470
outreach versus like business and stakeholder meetings and I kind of see

1397
01:56:12,470 --> 01:56:16,350
those as different I mean I agree we need both for sure but perhaps business

1398
01:56:16,350 --> 01:56:20,270
and stakeholder meeting could happen first yeah because that's a little more

1399
01:56:20,270 --> 01:56:23,910
big picture and and maybe they've thought through some of these things and

1400
01:56:23,910 --> 01:56:27,150
we're not putting it right out to the public without in front answers to a

1401
01:56:27,150 --> 01:56:31,870
lot of imperative questions well and really that those were the I feel

1402
01:56:31,870 --> 01:56:38,210
like the voices that we heard about the previous transit center plan were

1403
01:56:38,210 --> 01:56:42,570
planning commission and the businesses. So I think that's logical. A lot of the

1404
01:56:42,570 --> 01:56:47,230
businesses we didn't hear from till the 11th hour which is why you know getting

1405
01:56:47,230 --> 01:56:51,490
that buy-in now or at least opening that conversation now I think it's a

1406
01:56:51,490 --> 01:56:58,810
great way to start. I think what differentiates lot six from the

1407
01:56:58,810 --> 01:57:04,150
rest of the lot is the fact that people can easily park in those lots and then

1408
01:57:04,150 --> 01:57:10,470
go into grab something at a restaurant or at a store and so you lose that sort

1409
01:57:10,470 --> 01:57:17,330
of timed parking which okay you could put it down a daily for a very short

1410
01:57:17,330 --> 01:57:22,850
amount of time possibly till it gets redeveloped but that's and then if you

1411
01:57:22,850 --> 01:57:27,050
turn the other lots into the time parking then you create just

1412
01:57:27,050 --> 01:57:31,430
pedestrians coming further up more frequently so I don't know that it's

1413
01:57:31,430 --> 01:57:37,170
like solving a lot of the problems and I do think that it is going to be a

1414
01:57:37,170 --> 01:57:41,250
question and I know that we might not have a perfect answer but I think we

1415
01:57:41,250 --> 01:57:46,490
have to at least have some options of what we would do to replace that parking

1416
01:57:46,490 --> 01:57:53,870
because that is that is so well utilized. I would really recommend that we

1417
01:57:53,870 --> 01:57:59,650
We have some options for that, for discussion at this group, before we go to the public,

1418
01:57:59,950 --> 01:58:05,670
and we do it when the first meetings, when we have whatever the new makeup of the council

1419
01:58:05,670 --> 01:58:12,910
is, because some of us aren't going to be here, and some new people be here, and they're

1420
01:58:12,910 --> 01:58:16,130
going to be there for two years, and they're going to be dealing with it, and I don't

1421
01:58:16,130 --> 01:58:20,170
think it's something, because if we're three months out, I wouldn't be saying

1422
01:58:20,170 --> 01:58:22,310
this, but we're three weeks away from the election.

1423
01:58:22,830 --> 01:58:27,390
So, I think we should just make that an agenda for an early meeting.

1424
01:58:28,610 --> 01:58:39,050
Yeah, I mean, I think we should really try to think out of the box on this and try to figure out, you know, how do we meet all those goals?

1425
01:58:39,930 --> 01:58:49,290
You know, I realize there's no money for parking lots, but, you know, Tom at one time said, well, why don't we just, you know, do tier parking?

1426
01:58:49,290 --> 01:58:54,170
So what if the tiered, what if people could park underneath in lot six and

1427
01:58:55,570 --> 01:59:01,250
There's a platform there and maybe it's Jay Shoemaker's idea that he presented for the mall

1428
01:59:01,250 --> 01:59:07,330
But maybe that shifts out to the to lot six. I mean, I don't have the answers

1429
01:59:07,330 --> 01:59:12,830
But I I'm kind of seeing that we don't have the answer yet

1430
01:59:13,990 --> 01:59:15,190
and so

1431
01:59:16,210 --> 01:59:20,590
I was going to put it back on you, Sam, say like, what can be done here?

1432
01:59:22,590 --> 01:59:29,310
Our answer remains, do the raft to start there, see what it looks like, and then the question

1433
01:59:29,310 --> 01:59:30,970
for you guys is, what's next?

1434
01:59:31,270 --> 01:59:35,190
And if the answer is, this group's not going to decide what's next, hold your horses,

1435
01:59:35,750 --> 01:59:36,570
we can hold our horses.

1436
01:59:37,270 --> 01:59:41,010
I'm just saying for three weeks, hold your horses, hold your horses, be my technical

1437
01:59:41,010 --> 01:59:46,950
turn for the night but I mean we're happy to hold the horses but we're going to need direction from

1438
01:59:46,950 --> 01:59:52,370
you all on what that looks like because I mean I hope what I said was there's no federal money

1439
01:59:52,370 --> 01:59:59,610
for parking lots because if the council said hey protecting those 70 spaces was a priority there's

1440
01:59:59,610 --> 01:59:59,810
money.

1441
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:05,340
We just rearranged the capital plan. I mean, we could, you guys just have to say, that's the priority.

1442
02:00:05,660 --> 02:00:11,740
And when this plan was discussed, we said you're going to lose 60 space. I'm just going to say 60, I don't know the number.

1443
02:00:11,900 --> 02:00:13,480
I thought it was 54, but...

1444
02:00:13,480 --> 02:00:15,020
54, sorry. I keep running my number.

1445
02:00:15,200 --> 02:00:16,480
But I'm...

1446
02:00:16,480 --> 02:00:18,000
We know how people party.

1447
02:00:18,020 --> 02:00:19,340
I mean, I...

1448
02:00:19,340 --> 02:00:19,580
60.

1449
02:00:20,960 --> 02:00:21,360
Just...

1450
02:00:21,880 --> 02:00:28,880
I'd be hesitant to just go ahead with the raft incremental without even thinking about the next steps,

1451
02:00:28,880 --> 02:00:35,860
because to me that's not a plan. The ground might be part of a plan, but I think we need

1452
02:00:35,860 --> 02:00:37,860
to think the whole thing through and know what we're doing.

1453
02:00:41,060 --> 02:00:45,520
But the next council, I might not be here. The next council might have different views.

1454
02:00:46,060 --> 02:00:50,440
And if the next council wants to be super supportive of redevelopment of the mall,

1455
02:00:50,540 --> 02:00:53,920
that might make one decision. If the next council does not want to be, they may make

1456
02:00:53,920 --> 02:00:58,420
a different decision. So I'm tracking with you. But if there are the three options,

1457
02:00:58,420 --> 02:01:00,180
We just wanted to start talking about it.

1458
02:01:00,180 --> 02:01:02,260
Why don't you just flip through them since you got them up there?

1459
02:01:06,230 --> 02:01:07,450
You've seen the other ones before.

1460
02:01:08,130 --> 02:01:09,230
Let's just remind us.

1461
02:01:10,850 --> 02:01:14,270
I just don't be surprised if you don't see anything new and exciting here.

1462
02:01:14,970 --> 02:01:16,770
Not that it's not exciting. Everybody loves transit.

1463
02:01:17,070 --> 02:01:18,670
I was told that somebody here.

1464
02:01:21,330 --> 02:01:24,230
This is the RAFTA Depot incremental improvement plan

1465
02:01:24,230 --> 02:01:29,110
with the five RAFTA buses, three along the...

1466
02:01:29,110 --> 02:01:32,350
Let me just ask you, has Raft have seen this and said,

1467
02:01:32,390 --> 02:01:33,390
yeah, we can do that?

1468
02:01:33,590 --> 02:01:34,610
They have seen it.

1469
02:01:34,870 --> 02:01:36,370
Those tones are so tight.

1470
02:01:36,630 --> 02:01:38,450
They have seen it and said, yeah, we can do it.

1471
02:01:38,630 --> 02:01:41,070
They've said, give us as much space as you possibly can.

1472
02:01:41,210 --> 02:01:41,530
OK.

1473
02:01:42,490 --> 02:01:45,090
I see a lot of bent up buses, but you know.

1474
02:01:46,310 --> 02:01:49,150
And that, I'll move on to the next one.

1475
02:01:49,210 --> 02:01:51,490
But I do think that one of the things that

1476
02:01:51,490 --> 02:01:54,570
would be really good for me to start doing now

1477
02:01:54,570 --> 02:01:58,090
would be to have some more show some of these drawings

1478
02:01:58,090 --> 02:02:02,510
to some to people like Rafta and at least get moving absolutely at least get

1479
02:02:02,510 --> 02:02:06,890
their feedback I'm so David they say from no that doesn't work for us there's no

1480
02:02:06,890 --> 02:02:10,430
point in wasting our time with it because I hear the three weeks it makes

1481
02:02:10,430 --> 02:02:15,070
sense I do want to keep it moving in that direction because the faster we

1482
02:02:15,070 --> 02:02:19,790
can get something moving forward the better chance we have of keeping some

1483
02:02:19,790 --> 02:02:26,070
money I totally agree but if it I mean if those tolerances are really tight

1484
02:02:26,070 --> 02:02:31,650
and Rafta needs more space and we could run the road through the bottom a lot

1485
02:02:31,650 --> 02:02:38,270
six and open that up for Rafta you know maybe that's helpful. Now you're talking about big

1486
02:02:38,270 --> 02:02:43,470
money right to move the road, move carriageway. Yeah that doesn't, yeah I'm

1487
02:02:43,470 --> 02:02:49,170
concerned that that's not quite as incremental as this could be. Well that's

1488
02:02:49,170 --> 02:02:57,690
I mean, I don't disagree with you, but the thought is how do we improve, like how can

1489
02:02:57,690 --> 02:02:59,110
we make that a pedestrian area?

1490
02:02:59,270 --> 02:03:06,490
And if the road as shown there doesn't go right by the front of the mall, we can take the

1491
02:03:06,490 --> 02:03:08,910
pedestrians out of it, I think that would be really helpful.

1492
02:03:09,450 --> 02:03:12,690
I mean, we know that we're going to have the most, we already have the most pedestrian

1493
02:03:14,170 --> 02:03:17,110
vehicle interactions right on that corner of Lot 6.

1494
02:03:17,110 --> 02:03:18,030
The

1495
02:03:28,680 --> 02:03:33,920
scheme that solves most of the problems is the two-level scheme. It really resolves a lot of issues.

1496
02:03:33,920 --> 02:03:35,220
Well, except for the parking.

1497
02:03:35,900 --> 02:03:46,360
No, you can double-deck lot five, and you're right there, you know, and you're done.

1498
02:03:48,740 --> 02:03:50,080
Can I ask you a question, Sam?

1499
02:03:50,340 --> 02:03:50,520
Sure.

1500
02:03:50,820 --> 02:03:58,620
And the Rafter Transit slide you had before, where it says, you know, Bay Four.

1501
02:03:58,620 --> 02:04:02,880
If it's in use, Bay 3 will not be able to leave, Bay 4 can pull into Bay 1.

1502
02:04:03,380 --> 02:04:09,380
Is that a fact or is that someone's going to have to know which goes first?

1503
02:04:10,220 --> 02:04:14,980
It's similar to how it is now where if you have those first two buses are the only ones

1504
02:04:14,980 --> 02:04:19,020
that can move and until they move, none of the buses behind are going to go anywhere.

1505
02:04:19,680 --> 02:04:25,200
So it would require busier times if you actually had buses in all five of those positions,

1506
02:04:25,200 --> 02:04:30,680
means, a road supervisor to be there to help direct buses into bays.

1507
02:04:31,100 --> 02:04:35,680
But again, it's essentially the same situation as they have now when all of those bays are

1508
02:04:35,680 --> 02:04:35,920
full.

1509
02:04:36,880 --> 02:04:39,320
Buses need other buses to move before they can get out.

1510
02:04:39,520 --> 02:04:45,240
They do, but I think my concern still remains, it's like sometimes you have people getting

1511
02:04:45,240 --> 02:04:53,340
on bus four and bus three or two is trying to leave and those people are crossing

1512
02:04:53,340 --> 02:04:53,980
diagonally.

1513
02:04:53,980 --> 02:04:57,960
I mean I've seen it happen and I know you say some people say well

1514
02:04:57,960 --> 02:05:00,440
Oh bus four is usually just the down Valley bus

1515
02:05:00,440 --> 02:05:03,560
But there are times when it's not just the down Valley bus

1516
02:05:03,560 --> 02:05:10,860
There are also times that I have seen Rafta pull up where that bus is like drawn in like at this really weird angle

1517
02:05:10,860 --> 02:05:15,520
And let people off in the middle of the road. I think what would be great for for me

1518
02:05:15,520 --> 02:05:21,940
Bring it to Rafta operations and say how would you use these five spaces if you had them?

1519
02:05:21,940 --> 02:05:26,160
and and and get that feedback from them because we don't have that feedback at

1520
02:05:26,160 --> 02:05:29,300
this point we know that they've said yeah we could we could do this this we

1521
02:05:29,300 --> 02:05:33,520
could work with this but I don't know is for always going to be a loading spot is

1522
02:05:33,520 --> 02:05:37,560
it only going to be an unloading and go is it I don't know the answers to those

1523
02:05:37,560 --> 02:05:41,500
questions Sam why don't you take them all the schemes we have for the

1524
02:05:41,500 --> 02:05:48,080
rafter to them as a double the double that one this one right and get their

1525
02:05:48,080 --> 02:05:53,760
feedback. That is the next step that I'd like to go down. We hadn't done that yet. That

1526
02:05:53,760 --> 02:05:56,640
was part of our public outreach process, but I'm saying if we're going to wait for the

1527
02:05:56,640 --> 02:05:59,000
rest of the public outreach, I would like to go to them.

1528
02:05:59,020 --> 02:06:06,040
Rectify a technical response. Give them dimensions and have them say yes or no. There are buses.

1529
02:06:07,220 --> 02:06:13,200
And again, I mean how, Alyssa, our council member, Shank, has some very pointed questions

1530
02:06:13,200 --> 02:06:16,520
about how they would use these areas, and I think that would be a fair question.

1531
02:06:16,520 --> 02:06:22,020
Well, I mean there are times when it's busy and there's a RAFTA supervisor there and there

1532
02:06:22,020 --> 02:06:29,940
are times when there isn't and a lot of these drivers are new and it can just get really

1533
02:06:29,940 --> 02:06:30,300
messy.

1534
02:06:30,800 --> 02:06:39,940
So I think one of the reasons why the old plan, I mean obviously the actual design

1535
02:06:39,940 --> 02:06:44,160
of it and the amount of service space it took up was one thing.

1536
02:06:44,160 --> 02:06:47,000
but I think safety, and Jay's sitting back there

1537
02:06:47,000 --> 02:06:48,460
and he commented a million times,

1538
02:06:48,620 --> 02:06:50,140
you're having people cross in front of buses.

1539
02:06:50,480 --> 02:06:53,340
This plan still has people crossing in front of buses,

1540
02:06:53,600 --> 02:06:56,000
which is what I know it's an incremental plan,

1541
02:06:56,160 --> 02:06:58,940
but that is one of the top priorities

1542
02:06:58,940 --> 02:07:01,100
that we wanted to make was the safety

1543
02:07:01,100 --> 02:07:03,100
of the pedestrians and the buses.

1544
02:07:04,000 --> 02:07:05,980
So I think we just really need to make sure

1545
02:07:05,980 --> 02:07:09,760
that Rafta feels comfortable with or without

1546
02:07:09,760 --> 02:07:12,120
a supervisor there that this can be executed

1547
02:07:12,120 --> 02:07:14,780
in a way that's not going to put anyone in harm's way.

1548
02:07:16,220 --> 02:07:16,660
Okay.

1549
02:07:19,860 --> 02:07:20,240
Easy.

1550
02:07:22,060 --> 02:07:22,740
Always is.

1551
02:07:23,500 --> 02:07:24,760
All right.

1552
02:07:28,830 --> 02:07:29,390
What's that?

1553
02:07:29,930 --> 02:07:31,090
That's, we got our direction.

1554
02:07:31,290 --> 02:07:32,210
Yeah, I think we got our direction.

1555
02:07:32,450 --> 02:07:32,610
Okay.

1556
02:07:32,710 --> 02:07:34,770
Unless there's any other questions or anything else you guys.

1557
02:07:34,910 --> 02:07:38,990
But we'll keep inching something for, we'll feel free to show some of these things.

1558
02:07:39,450 --> 02:07:40,910
There'll be nothing formal for feedback.

1559
02:07:41,450 --> 02:07:44,430
And we'll wait for you guys to tell us when you want to schedule it.

1560
02:07:45,270 --> 02:07:47,750
sounds good and we're not yet scheduling any public

1561
02:07:47,750 --> 02:07:52,610
I mean we'll we again we might do something informally but it's not going to

1562
02:07:52,610 --> 02:07:57,730
be a formal anything well I mean well what do you want to do that well I'm

1563
02:07:57,730 --> 02:08:02,270
sure we'll talk to Rafta we'll talk to Rafta we want to talk to Rafta I would

1564
02:08:02,270 --> 02:08:06,450
assume we I mean this is in a public meeting so we will get contacted by

1565
02:08:06,450 --> 02:08:10,870
people to see this and that was but we're not going to have a hey be here

1566
02:08:10,870 --> 02:08:17,110
at 3.30 or here's a formal survey but I'm confident we will be contacted. Let me see these please.

1567
02:08:17,390 --> 02:08:20,950
There's a number of people that are one all the time and so that's.

1568
02:08:21,590 --> 02:08:26,290
Yeah and I think that I mean I just I'm excited to have an open house and kind of a meeting

1569
02:08:26,290 --> 02:08:31,650
form out of stakeholders because those one-on-ones that's where information gets confused and

1570
02:08:31,650 --> 02:08:39,290
you know ideas aren't tossed around and sometimes mistakes get made when we misunderstand

1571
02:08:39,290 --> 02:08:43,490
each other. So when we're all in the same room it's better. We will stand by for you

1572
02:08:43,490 --> 02:08:51,690
all to tell us when you want this re-engaged. Okay. Thanks. Hey Sam. All right,

1573
02:08:51,770 --> 02:08:57,990
moving on and we're gonna take a look at the 2025 budget and we're gonna look

1574
02:08:57,990 --> 02:09:02,510
get the tourism, the EAB request, the GID.

1575
02:09:03,370 --> 02:09:05,110
Sam, don't knock that box over.

1576
02:09:06,770 --> 02:09:08,330
I'm having an issue.

1577
02:09:09,590 --> 02:09:11,110
That's everything there.

1578
02:09:11,430 --> 02:09:13,030
Cameron, help me again.

1579
02:09:13,470 --> 02:09:16,270
For some reason, I cannot stay on.

1580
02:09:17,730 --> 02:09:18,850
Why bumped up?

1581
02:09:19,610 --> 02:09:23,660
We're doing this again twice.

1582
02:09:27,400 --> 02:09:33,400
Yeah, this new version of Granicus is not great.

1583
02:09:33,720 --> 02:09:37,940
I hate that the screen is smaller like you can't even get full screen on it.

1584
02:09:38,020 --> 02:09:39,760
I thought he was going to start us off.

1585
02:09:41,560 --> 02:09:43,900
I'm just going on the website.

1586
02:09:44,420 --> 02:09:44,960
Is that what you're doing?

1587
02:09:45,340 --> 02:09:45,840
Thank you again.

1588
02:09:46,060 --> 02:09:48,000
I just find it a much easier flow.

1589
02:09:48,780 --> 02:09:54,640
And then I just take my notes and open them, and I couldn't make some crazy, and gave it up.

1590
02:09:54,740 --> 02:09:55,980
So you just...

1591
02:09:55,980 --> 02:09:58,380
I take my notes in like a word document.

1592
02:09:59,220 --> 02:10:00,240
Yes, you're having a go.

1593
02:10:05,860 --> 02:10:06,960
So Julia, take your time.

1594
02:10:07,700 --> 02:10:08,220
Oh my god.

1595
02:10:08,700 --> 02:10:09,340
I'm just kidding.

1596
02:10:09,600 --> 02:10:10,120
No, I'm kidding.

1597
02:10:10,360 --> 02:10:11,460
I was making a time jump.

1598
02:10:11,460 --> 02:10:11,480
I was just kidding.

1599
02:10:11,480 --> 02:10:11,840
I was making a time jump.

1600
02:10:12,120 --> 02:10:13,840
It's totally funny in my own way.

1601
02:10:13,860 --> 02:10:15,440
I just told that you were going to start it off.

1602
02:10:16,000 --> 02:10:16,360
I apologize.

1603
02:10:16,500 --> 02:10:17,140
I'm sorry.

1604
02:10:17,680 --> 02:10:18,120
I apologize.

1605
02:10:18,360 --> 02:10:18,980
I'm so sorry.

1606
02:10:19,800 --> 02:10:20,020
Thank you.

1607
02:10:20,660 --> 02:10:25,060
So this is our second series of free budget presentations.

1608
02:10:26,160 --> 02:10:30,840
Tourism department makes two verbal presentations to you in a year, two written presentations.

1609
02:10:31,480 --> 02:10:35,820
We always kind of roll this budget presentation into one of their presentations to you all.

1610
02:10:36,400 --> 02:10:42,240
So with that, I know this is Julie's first budget presentation to you.

1611
02:10:42,640 --> 02:10:44,600
She's prepped, she's ready to go, and I'll shut up.

1612
02:10:49,560 --> 02:10:54,320
I think you all know what we do, but just for the people who don't, Snowmass Tourism

1613
02:10:54,320 --> 02:10:58,000
positions Snowmass Knowledge as the world class resort that it is.

1614
02:10:58,800 --> 02:11:03,600
We also just got last year's, you know, number one resort in the U.S. and Canada, so we've

1615
02:11:03,600 --> 02:11:06,560
got some great accolades making our job easier, but we work hard.

1616
02:11:07,180 --> 02:11:12,560
We do that by leveraging creative marketing strategies, hosting special events, and coordinating

1617
02:11:12,560 --> 02:11:16,640
group sales efforts, which are really important to our tourism economy, filling in those need

1618
02:11:16,640 --> 02:11:22,100
periods. We work to attract visitors to resort and give them memorable experiences to keep

1619
02:11:22,100 --> 02:11:27,020
them coming back through our guest services, and ultimately our goal is that we are bolstering

1620
02:11:27,020 --> 02:11:32,540
and supporting the local economy through our efforts. I'll do the numbers very quickly.

1621
02:11:32,720 --> 02:11:37,640
Some of you may have seen these recently. Looking at how we have fared through May

1622
02:11:37,640 --> 02:11:43,280
through October, so what we call summer season, our paid occupancy is at 39.4 percent.

1623
02:11:43,340 --> 02:11:46,920
I just ask you before we go, what is the database?

1624
02:11:47,240 --> 02:11:48,160
Is this lodging?

1625
02:11:48,440 --> 02:11:49,940
Does it include short-term rentals?

1626
02:11:50,440 --> 02:11:51,820
Does it include condos?

1627
02:11:52,060 --> 02:11:53,160
I mean, what is here?

1628
02:11:53,160 --> 02:11:57,460
This is lodging, which would include condos, and it's anybody who participates in our

1629
02:11:57,460 --> 02:12:03,540
desk to metrics that measure occupancy ADR, which is the average daily eight and

1630
02:12:03,540 --> 02:12:05,320
rev par, so it's anybody who participates.

1631
02:12:05,320 --> 02:12:08,920
So probably not short-term rental, people do it with online services.

1632
02:12:09,180 --> 02:12:09,860
It's a good question.

1633
02:12:10,020 --> 02:12:11,840
99% sure STR is not in there.

1634
02:12:11,880 --> 02:12:12,820
Yeah, I don't think so.

1635
02:12:12,840 --> 02:12:14,620
I'm 99% sure there's no STRs.

1636
02:12:15,360 --> 02:12:15,840
Okay.

1637
02:12:16,320 --> 02:12:16,560
Yeah.

1638
02:12:16,960 --> 02:12:17,140
Fine.

1639
02:12:17,620 --> 02:12:25,000
Are there other major hotel or developments that are not included in deaths and metrics?

1640
02:12:25,740 --> 02:12:32,260
I mean, there are other agencies like AIR DNA that would measure specifically short-term

1641
02:12:32,260 --> 02:12:35,960
rentals, which is a program that we could look at if we felt like that data was really

1642
02:12:35,960 --> 02:12:42,420
valuable to us, but des dimetrics, who we pull from right now, will measure any hotel

1643
02:12:42,420 --> 02:12:45,840
or condo that's participating, which should be most of them, but I don't actually know

1644
02:12:45,840 --> 02:12:46,940
that answer off the top of my head.

1645
02:12:47,780 --> 02:12:51,360
So we should have most of the hotel and condo properties, but not the short-term

1646
02:12:51,360 --> 02:12:51,900
rentals.

1647
02:12:53,680 --> 02:12:57,860
So looking at this, you can see we're just a couple percent up on, you know, not

1648
02:12:57,860 --> 02:13:03,320
huge numbers there for summer, ADR, average daily rate, what a visitor pays for a hotel

1649
02:13:03,320 --> 02:13:08,920
is pretty flat, and the revenue per available room, the total revenue is up a couple points.

1650
02:13:09,200 --> 02:13:10,880
This is as of the latest report.

1651
02:13:13,140 --> 02:13:17,780
Jumping with any questions as I go, by the way, this graph that I look at every month

1652
02:13:17,780 --> 02:13:22,020
shows us how we're faring per month, and you can see here where the growth opportunities

1653
02:13:22,020 --> 02:13:22,420
are.

1654
02:13:22,640 --> 02:13:27,200
June and September and October are pretty low, July and August are looking pretty

1655
02:13:27,200 --> 02:13:31,460
strong, which is typical of our summer pattern. And so when we look at this, we look at what

1656
02:13:31,460 --> 02:13:35,880
strategic initiatives we can do to help fill in those more need periods. And that's where

1657
02:13:35,880 --> 02:13:41,140
I mentioned things like group sales and special events that complement and try to bolster these

1658
02:13:41,640 --> 02:13:48,360
occupancy rates. In terms of winter, this is how we are pacing as of the latest report,

1659
02:13:48,380 --> 02:13:52,580
which is August 31st. So it's certainly not how we're going to finish, but looking

1660
02:13:52,580 --> 02:13:57,520
at November through April. We are pacing a couple points ahead in our year-over-year

1661
02:13:57,520 --> 02:14:02,560
occupancy. Our average daily rate looks pretty strong at 4% ahead and total

1662
02:14:02,560 --> 02:14:07,720
revenue is 6.2% ahead. Again, we look at these every month, so this is just how

1663
02:14:07,720 --> 02:14:12,400
we're pacing. You can see there what a visitor at this point is paying for a

1664
02:14:12,400 --> 02:14:14,740
room per night. We're at 7.43.

1665
02:14:16,880 --> 02:14:19,840
Is it a 2% variance? Like it's a

1666
02:14:19,840 --> 02:14:27,500
0.6% variance. 0.6 is the total revenue and the 4% is the variance in what the

1667
02:14:27,500 --> 02:14:36,200
rate is the 714 to 743. At the top right number 2.1% is that something's not right

1668
02:14:36,200 --> 02:14:47,880
right 29.6% projected over 29.0. That's yeah we're just yeah we're about 0.6

1669
02:14:47,880 --> 02:14:55,980
266 is 2.1% over, yeah, not huge numbers there, but we are pacing ahead, which is good.

1670
02:14:57,020 --> 02:14:57,820
And again, looking.

1671
02:15:00,540 --> 02:15:05,700
You can see December is not super strong month for us, which is typical in resort communities

1672
02:15:05,700 --> 02:15:10,580
because people wait until the holidays to come. January, February look pretty strong, and you

1673
02:15:10,580 --> 02:15:14,780
can see that we are pacing ahead of last year, but you can also see we have quite a ways

1674
02:15:14,780 --> 02:15:20,320
to go to reach kind of our average occupancy. The gray line is the historical occupancy

1675
02:15:20,320 --> 02:15:25,740
we've seen, and the one on the right is where we usually land, which is about 56

1676
02:15:25,740 --> 02:15:27,080
percent for the winter season.

1677
02:15:28,160 --> 02:15:32,000
And are you still seeing people waiting longer and longer to book?

1678
02:15:32,380 --> 02:15:32,820
We are.

1679
02:15:32,980 --> 02:15:35,600
We're doing some things to incentivize bookings.

1680
02:15:35,640 --> 02:15:40,340
So we just did a flash sale in collaboration with the Aspen Skiing Company in Accra and

1681
02:15:40,340 --> 02:15:42,300
Snowmass was the clear winner in that.

1682
02:15:42,480 --> 02:15:45,240
So we're incentivizing people to book in September.

1683
02:15:46,400 --> 02:15:50,980
And out of, I think it was 28 bookings we got, 26 of them went to Snowmass.

1684
02:15:51,200 --> 02:15:54,740
And the reason for that is because we incentivize people to book for longer stays

1685
02:15:54,740 --> 02:15:59,120
and snow mass winds that formula for visitors because we have more condo

1686
02:15:59,120 --> 02:16:03,260
properties and more ski and ski out. So we're working on people booking earlier

1687
02:16:03,260 --> 02:16:07,140
particularly was very strong for international market the strongest

1688
02:16:07,140 --> 02:16:11,720
market for that flash sale was actually Argentina that was partially based

1689
02:16:11,720 --> 02:16:15,080
on the way it was promoted by ski company to their international tour

1690
02:16:15,080 --> 02:16:20,080
operators but we are working to get earlier bookings and I would hope at

1691
02:16:20,080 --> 02:16:25,680
the next report we'd see, you know, some of these numbers fill in earlier than, you know,

1692
02:16:25,740 --> 02:16:32,100
the last-minute bookings, and certainly international visitors tend to book earlier than a domestic

1693
02:16:32,100 --> 02:16:37,040
visitor who might come up for a shorter stay from a closer destination, but trying to close

1694
02:16:37,040 --> 02:16:40,500
in that booking pattern by some of the strategic initiatives we're doing.

1695
02:16:43,570 --> 02:16:47,870
In terms of our budget, this is – I believe you have these numbers in front of you.

1696
02:16:47,870 --> 02:16:57,590
revenue. Our total projected revenue is the $14,907,000, and our projected budget for tourism

1697
02:16:57,590 --> 02:17:08,310
is $9.4 million, which leaves the $5.4 million for the housing fund. But as you've probably

1698
02:17:08,310 --> 02:17:16,570
heard for 2025, the housing fund is actually looking at a $7.1 million allocation, which

1699
02:17:16,570 --> 02:17:22,850
which would be the 5.4 million you see there when you minus the tourism expenses from the

1700
02:17:22,850 --> 02:17:29,050
total revenue and then the 1.7 from reserve funds to total the 7.1 going to housing.

1701
02:17:30,390 --> 02:17:39,390
Of that 7.1, 3.35 million is allocated for future housing opportunities, 3 million for

1702
02:17:39,390 --> 02:17:44,630
debt service for the draw site and 750,000 for debt service for the snow mass center.

1703
02:17:46,490 --> 02:17:52,010
You'll see at the bottom of this budget summary, we've got very healthy reserves, 30%, which

1704
02:17:52,010 --> 02:17:56,370
equals 4.4 million is put away for emergency funds.

1705
02:17:57,190 --> 02:18:04,610
The funds that are restricted for tourism prior to the 2023 vote is at 7.5 million,

1706
02:18:04,610 --> 02:18:10,970
which is a very healthy reserve for our organization and then the housing fund

1707
02:18:10,970 --> 02:18:15,270
or the funds available are being spent down to get to that 7.1 million for

1708
02:18:15,270 --> 02:18:19,190
housing allocation. Can you just pause for a second? What's that other what

1709
02:18:19,190 --> 02:18:24,710
3 million in housing Clint? I mean I understand that the reserve for the

1710
02:18:24,710 --> 02:18:30,990
draw site and for buying the center site but there was another 3 million for

1711
02:18:30,990 --> 02:18:39,570
Housing CIP so we that in the tourism fund we we the way I think about it is there's I can't see that for I'm sorry

1712
02:18:39,570 --> 02:18:44,230
But there's 15 million coming in the first nine and a half goes to tourism

1713
02:18:44,230 --> 02:18:49,810
Everything else is set aside for housing. And so we've got three million for draw seven fifty four

1714
02:18:51,570 --> 02:18:57,730
The land behind the center what's left over was towards the capital goes goes towards the capital for any kind of future housing projects

1715
02:18:59,010 --> 02:19:06,350
The 3.3 million is a transfer into the CIP fund and then any housing projects that are

1716
02:19:06,350 --> 02:19:12,650
in the CIP fund may be funded from that and if not, then it goes into a separate reserve

1717
02:19:13,200 --> 02:19:14,890
and set aside for future housing.

1718
02:19:15,030 --> 02:19:19,410
So we're going to be building up the reserve in the CIP fund for capital projects.

1719
02:19:19,690 --> 02:19:21,010
It's a savings account for future housing.

1720
02:19:21,010 --> 02:19:21,750
Yeah, all right.

1721
02:19:24,020 --> 02:19:26,360
This graph just shows you revenues over expenses

1722
02:19:26,360 --> 02:19:29,700
every year, the first one being the 2024 budget

1723
02:19:29,700 --> 02:19:32,240
and the right side being the 2025 budget,

1724
02:19:32,660 --> 02:19:34,600
not showing huge growth.

1725
02:19:36,480 --> 02:19:37,620
The next slide will-

1726
02:19:37,620 --> 02:19:39,480
A slight drop in revenue, is that right?

1727
02:19:41,040 --> 02:19:43,600
The middle one is actually the budget

1728
02:19:43,600 --> 02:19:44,580
versus the projection.

1729
02:19:46,300 --> 02:19:49,500
So the middle graph is 2024 projected

1730
02:19:49,500 --> 02:19:56,080
And the first one is the actual 2024 budget, and then the last graph is the 2025 projection.

1731
02:19:56,400 --> 02:19:59,580
All right, so budget is usually a little conservative, right?

1732
02:19:59,880 --> 02:20:08,140
Yeah, so then revenue is a little bit lower than what was projected in 2024 by very little.

1733
02:20:10,440 --> 02:20:18,480
This shows you the revenue, marketing, and lodging tax is projected to be 3% year over year,

1734
02:20:18,480 --> 02:20:22,180
which is a nice conservative estimate based on what we're seeing in terms of

1735
02:20:22,180 --> 02:20:27,400
pace which I think is smart because it's nice to you know budget

1736
02:20:27,400 --> 02:20:30,660
conservatively and know that the money is going to come in versus the other way

1737
02:20:30,660 --> 02:20:36,560
around. Also on this page you'll see under expenditures I'll basically take

1738
02:20:36,560 --> 02:20:41,220
you through because the marketing the funds available for tourism the budget

1739
02:20:41,220 --> 02:20:44,540
is relatively flat I'm going to take you just through where we've made

1740
02:20:44,540 --> 02:20:48,020
changes on the budget for your understanding on the variances I'm in

1741
02:20:48,020 --> 02:20:51,740
And one thing I wanted to call out here is the personnel expenses, which I don't have

1742
02:20:51,740 --> 02:20:59,460
a separate slide for, are about 4% up year-over-year for salary increases and benefit increases.

1743
02:21:00,180 --> 02:21:05,740
And then I'll take you through the changes on the marketing, special events, and PR

1744
02:21:05,740 --> 02:21:06,200
side.

1745
02:21:06,700 --> 02:21:11,280
All are relatively flat, but I'll take you through the changes that we made there.

1746
02:21:11,440 --> 02:21:16,440
Marketing is slightly up, and special events is slightly down, which I'll explain to

1747
02:21:16,440 --> 02:21:22,400
and PRs lightly up so what is it in the miscellaneous under revenues there's a

1748
02:21:22,400 --> 02:21:28,620
miscellaneous line item for 600 that's interesting come okay thanks nice to

1749
02:21:28,620 --> 02:21:34,900
do special events ever generate any revenue or is that no no not to my

1750
02:21:34,900 --> 02:21:38,940
knowledge I don't know if it would just be sales tax growth it there's no we

1751
02:21:39,500 --> 02:21:42,100
I kind of assumed they didn't, but I just want to know.

1752
02:21:42,320 --> 02:21:44,900
We pay producers to come, essentially.

1753
02:21:46,720 --> 02:21:50,120
We are attracting visitors and getting them to come back.

1754
02:21:50,140 --> 02:21:50,820
Event producers.

1755
02:21:51,280 --> 02:21:51,480
Yes.

1756
02:21:52,340 --> 02:21:52,520
Yes.

1757
02:21:53,620 --> 02:21:55,020
It's not a real event.

1758
02:21:55,500 --> 02:22:00,120
And this slide just compares the budget revenues and expenditures year over year.

1759
02:22:00,260 --> 02:22:06,080
If you look at the expenditures, we are looking at about $369,000 more in tourism

1760
02:22:06,080 --> 02:22:08,600
funding than last year.

1761
02:22:08,600 --> 02:22:11,640
So, relatively small number in the scheme of the overall budget.

1762
02:22:11,920 --> 02:22:13,560
And as I said, I'll take you through those now.

1763
02:22:16,080 --> 02:22:22,600
This is just sort of the budget at a glance showing you kind of the numbers for 25 against

1764
02:22:22,600 --> 02:22:23,220
24.

1765
02:22:23,600 --> 02:22:29,240
I'll talk about the, again, the changes we're making on the tourism budget, the 900,000

1766
02:22:29,240 --> 02:22:32,800
that's coming from capital to projects in the next year.

1767
02:22:33,640 --> 02:22:38,080
As I mentioned, there's 7.1 million in total going to housing.

1768
02:22:38,080 --> 02:22:47,320
And I wanted to call out on the bottom of the slide just that the revenue or the sorry the expenditures in tourism are staying relatively flat

1769
02:22:47,320 --> 02:22:52,560
but what you can see growing which I think is smart is the allocation to housing over the last three years.

1770
02:22:52,580 --> 02:22:59,200
So it was 4.6 million in 2023 and then 5 million and then 7.1 for 2025.

1771
02:22:59,200 --> 02:23:08,600
The CIP of 900,000 is that for the Macedon and for the Skittles Skittles and for yeah

1772
02:23:08,600 --> 02:23:12,480
and I'm going to take you through those now and so here's just where we made

1773
02:23:12,480 --> 02:23:19,220
variances on the budget that total up well that 396 or about $400,000 under

1774
02:23:19,220 --> 02:23:23,040
group sales we have a hundred and ninety thousand dollar increase and that

1775
02:23:23,040 --> 02:23:27,020
I believe was discussed with council around this time last year or at some

1776
02:23:27,020 --> 02:23:34,120
point last year. It is a really unique opportunity for Snowmass to bring in one of the largest

1777
02:23:35,040 --> 02:23:41,440
industry events. MTS stands for Mountain Travel Symposium. It brings in about 800 professionals

1778
02:23:41,440 --> 02:23:46,940
in the ski industry from about 35 countries. It's ideally placed on the calendar the second

1779
02:23:46,940 --> 02:23:52,700
week of April, so a time when business is pretty low. And it is basically all

1780
02:23:52,700 --> 02:23:56,780
the suppliers and buyers of travel in the ski market.

1781
02:23:57,260 --> 02:23:58,940
So it's a really important group for us.

1782
02:23:59,360 --> 02:24:04,860
The ROI on this will be huge in terms of actually the room nights in April, but it will have

1783
02:24:04,860 --> 02:24:08,260
a much longer play in terms of the exposure that we're giving all these international

1784
02:24:08,260 --> 02:24:09,040
ski buyers.

1785
02:24:09,600 --> 02:24:13,180
And we are partnering with Aspen Skiing Company on this initiative.

1786
02:24:13,260 --> 02:24:17,560
It will be a huge event for us the second week of April, following another event that

1787
02:24:17,560 --> 02:24:20,180
we have in April as the DAV, the Disabled Vet.

1788
02:24:20,180 --> 02:24:25,500
So it'll really lend itself to a very strong April, but it is a pay-to-play to bring this group in

1789
02:24:28,210 --> 02:24:35,030
Under marketing as I mentioned the budgets relatively flat the only additional budget we added was $50,000

1790
02:24:35,890 --> 02:24:40,150
To increase some summer advertising to the build the drive markets

1791
02:24:40,150 --> 02:24:46,170
We are as you heard from the airport people heavily reliant on air service and our visitors coming in on direct flights

1792
02:24:46,170 --> 02:24:47,370
And we'd like to build

1793
02:24:47,990 --> 02:24:51,250
more of awareness for the drive market which we know they pass a lot of

1794
02:24:51,250 --> 02:24:55,390
resorts on the way to us and really it's partly in preparation for the

1795
02:24:55,390 --> 02:25:00,770
potential airport closure in 2026 which is slated for I believe an eight month

1796
02:25:00,770 --> 02:25:09,410
closure and the new runway wherever it is well if there is a new runway that

1797
02:25:09,410 --> 02:25:12,790
fits other guests it'll be an eight month but that's the plan summer of

1798
02:25:14,210 --> 02:25:17,690
I'll tell you, I'll tell you in a couple of weeks, I'll tell you in a couple of weeks.

1799
02:25:18,070 --> 02:25:20,370
We're waiting to plan for it, but we're planning for it.

1800
02:25:21,230 --> 02:25:25,750
So we do have an increase there to build the drive market business.

1801
02:25:26,330 --> 02:25:32,350
The ice age discovery, while the budget did decrease, that's because we have that money

1802
02:25:32,350 --> 02:25:36,550
coming out of capital for the project for the mastodons, and we do still have budget

1803
02:25:36,550 --> 02:25:40,270
there to continue the ice age story, but that budget went down from last year when

1804
02:25:40,270 --> 02:25:42,910
We had a significant budget allocation

1805
02:25:42,910 --> 02:25:45,530
for some of the projects we did this year.

1806
02:25:46,190 --> 02:25:48,310
And then we did slightly increased support

1807
02:25:48,310 --> 02:25:51,850
under public relations for the international campaign.

1808
02:25:52,170 --> 02:25:55,470
We currently are working in the UK and Mexico

1809
02:25:55,470 --> 02:25:57,070
and seeing great success in that.

1810
02:25:57,510 --> 02:25:59,170
We are looking at some strategy

1811
02:25:59,170 --> 02:26:00,610
for potentially adding a market

1812
02:26:00,610 --> 02:26:03,350
or co-opping with the Colorado Tourism Office

1813
02:26:03,350 --> 02:26:04,890
and the Aspen Skiing Company

1814
02:26:04,890 --> 02:26:08,090
for some additional PR in the international markets.

1815
02:26:08,090 --> 02:26:10,090
It's, did you have a question?

1816
02:26:10,930 --> 02:26:12,930
No, because they're really important to us, so.

1817
02:26:14,670 --> 02:26:17,570
Guest services, this was more of a money move

1818
02:26:17,570 --> 02:26:18,430
than a money ad.

1819
02:26:18,510 --> 02:26:20,410
We didn't actually have a budget for guest services.

1820
02:26:20,590 --> 02:26:21,790
It was under special events,

1821
02:26:21,910 --> 02:26:24,010
and I wanted to more accurately reflect the budget

1822
02:26:24,010 --> 02:26:26,650
and have guest services have its own line item.

1823
02:26:27,630 --> 02:26:29,470
A bulk of that is the S'mores program,

1824
02:26:29,470 --> 02:26:33,690
which really is a huge signature touch for our visitors.

1825
02:26:34,170 --> 02:26:36,070
I would encourage all of you to go down

1826
02:26:36,070 --> 02:26:40,110
to the s'mores in the season and see the delight on the visitors and locals faces that that

1827
02:26:40,110 --> 02:26:40,990
program brings.

1828
02:26:41,350 --> 02:26:46,030
And so I really just move that out of events into guest services, which is why the events

1829
02:26:46,030 --> 02:26:50,170
budget looks like it went lower, but it was kind of a money move, and there's, you know,

1830
02:26:50,250 --> 02:26:52,670
just some very small changes in the events program.

1831
02:26:53,310 --> 02:26:55,490
Are the s'mores about half of that budget?

1832
02:26:55,870 --> 02:27:00,650
The s'mores are about $75,000, so it's a big chunk of it, yeah.

1833
02:27:00,650 --> 02:27:04,070
Yeah, it's not Jeep and marshmallows have gone up a pair of them.

1834
02:27:05,890 --> 02:27:07,350
Question about the S'mores?

1835
02:27:07,650 --> 02:27:07,750
Yeah.

1836
02:27:07,910 --> 02:27:09,510
I mean, I've witnessed it.

1837
02:27:09,750 --> 02:27:14,450
I know how the line, especially after Ski School, gets out.

1838
02:27:15,630 --> 02:27:16,110
TNM.

1839
02:27:17,090 --> 02:27:18,670
TNM is Travel and Meetings.

1840
02:27:19,070 --> 02:27:23,410
So it's just for the guest services department, you know, to have meetings, to, you know,

1841
02:27:23,450 --> 02:27:23,750
experience.

1842
02:27:24,330 --> 02:27:27,350
They go around Snowmass and experience new restaurants and things.

1843
02:27:27,490 --> 02:27:28,710
So it's just a very small budget.

1844
02:27:28,710 --> 02:27:30,910
it, like I said, the bulk of that is the S'mores program.

1845
02:27:32,890 --> 02:27:37,370
So I feel like when we first came across the idea of the S'mores

1846
02:27:37,370 --> 02:27:41,010
and doing that, I don't know that it was intended to last

1847
02:27:41,010 --> 02:27:42,190
as long as it's lasted.

1848
02:27:42,830 --> 02:27:46,610
I mean, do we feel that there is a timeframe for this?

1849
02:27:46,750 --> 02:27:49,010
I know it's wildly popular, but then I've also

1850
02:27:49,640 --> 02:27:51,750
heard from people that own businesses

1851
02:27:51,750 --> 02:27:57,470
that it is taking away from their business opportunity

1852
02:27:57,470 --> 02:28:06,070
after skiing. Yeah and I've heard the same. Well I will say that I think from my

1853
02:28:06,070 --> 02:28:09,830
six months here it seems that the s'mores are like other destinations who

1854
02:28:09,830 --> 02:28:13,550
have that signature thing that makes guests feel really special it's it's an

1855
02:28:13,550 --> 02:28:17,290
important part of our brand and I kind of had the same question when I came

1856
02:28:17,290 --> 02:28:20,070
into the job and then I started hearing some of the testimonials and

1857
02:28:20,070 --> 02:28:24,090
feedback from visitors and the guest service staff about how this little

1858
02:28:24,090 --> 02:28:28,750
touch, you know, in the scheme of the budget and the overall efforts really makes them feel

1859
02:28:29,290 --> 02:28:35,570
really welcomed and really special. I do understand that some businesses feel like they were doing

1860
02:28:35,570 --> 02:28:41,750
s'mores and we took that away from them. But the other goal around this s'mores program was to

1861
02:28:41,750 --> 02:28:46,570
keep people in the village versus like taking off from skiing. So it's just like a nice feel

1862
02:28:46,570 --> 02:28:50,890
good for people to hang out, you know, kids and adults to have s'mores. And the idea was

1863
02:28:50,890 --> 02:28:52,570
is that people would spend longer in the village

1864
02:28:52,570 --> 02:28:54,950
and not that they would take business away.

1865
02:28:55,930 --> 02:28:59,910
The SMORES program also is right now contracted

1866
02:28:59,910 --> 02:29:01,030
to a local business.

1867
02:29:01,030 --> 02:29:03,610
So there is somebody providing that to us

1868
02:29:03,610 --> 02:29:06,630
and making the cost, covering their costs for that.

1869
02:29:06,770 --> 02:29:08,530
So that money is going back to a business.

1870
02:29:09,070 --> 02:29:10,510
And I think the question's been asked,

1871
02:29:10,590 --> 02:29:13,310
are we gonna go to RFP and be able to open it up

1872
02:29:13,310 --> 02:29:14,770
to another business at some point?

1873
02:29:15,830 --> 02:29:17,970
I personally wouldn't say it needs to go away,

1874
02:29:18,050 --> 02:29:20,370
but I'm open to hearing those conversations,

1875
02:29:20,370 --> 02:29:22,430
which I understand some businesses are against it.

1876
02:29:22,690 --> 02:29:25,730
And at those businesses, that's why we have a tourism board.

1877
02:29:25,890 --> 02:29:28,130
Come and tell them that there are concerns about it,

1878
02:29:28,150 --> 02:29:29,550
and let the tourism board discuss it,

1879
02:29:29,550 --> 02:29:32,250
because I would venture to say the vast majority

1880
02:29:32,250 --> 02:29:33,950
of the tourism board is very supportive

1881
02:29:33,950 --> 02:29:35,550
of the program and likes the way it operates.

1882
02:29:35,770 --> 02:29:38,470
And so if an individual business had that issue,

1883
02:29:39,750 --> 02:29:41,250
that would be the place, I think,

1884
02:29:41,290 --> 02:29:42,210
to start that conversation.

1885
02:29:42,710 --> 02:29:45,770
Yeah, I mean, listen, in a place that's so expensive

1886
02:29:45,770 --> 02:29:48,950
and nothing is ever free, like, you know,

1887
02:29:48,950 --> 02:29:52,950
between the hot cider, which they don't do anymore on top of the mountain and the bars and

1888
02:29:53,690 --> 02:29:59,630
Having this I mean I I it serves the need. I see the kids. I think it's great

1889
02:30:00,000 --> 02:30:04,480
And I personally feel like it's added that sort of special touch.

1890
02:30:05,180 --> 02:30:11,920
And I think the people that actually serve this more really like it, like the interaction with the kids is really cute.

1891
02:30:13,540 --> 02:30:17,560
It's just more of, you know, is there a longevity to it?

1892
02:30:18,160 --> 02:30:23,380
Because I don't know that when we started it, it was intended to be that way.

1893
02:30:23,800 --> 02:30:25,420
I think it was more like something different.

1894
02:30:25,420 --> 02:30:27,320
Yeah, I think everything's open to discussion

1895
02:30:27,320 --> 02:30:29,720
and feedback and if it doesn't work

1896
02:30:29,720 --> 02:30:31,620
for the kind of majority of people,

1897
02:30:31,720 --> 02:30:32,780
we can certainly look at it.

1898
02:30:32,880 --> 02:30:35,080
I do think it's really nice to have that signature touch

1899
02:30:35,080 --> 02:30:37,860
where the visitors get something, people love free things

1900
02:30:37,860 --> 02:30:39,280
and they love, I think, how it makes them

1901
02:30:39,280 --> 02:30:41,540
feel really welcome, but it could be something else too.

1902
02:30:43,160 --> 02:30:44,780
I think if we took it away, it would be.

1903
02:30:45,240 --> 02:30:47,320
Yeah, it's kind of hard to take something away.

1904
02:30:47,420 --> 02:30:48,760
But I'm wondering if there's something,

1905
02:30:49,280 --> 02:30:50,680
if people are waiting in line

1906
02:30:50,680 --> 02:30:52,960
for the s'mores with their kids,

1907
02:30:52,960 --> 02:30:59,700
is there something that we could then do that we could give them to incentivize

1908
02:30:59,700 --> 02:31:05,220
them to then go infrequent one of the businesses like either go and sit and

1909
02:31:05,220 --> 02:31:08,460
have a drink or get an appetizer or something I don't know what that would

1910
02:31:08,460 --> 02:31:14,500
look like I just feel like I don't know I mean yeah they made a statement for what

1911
02:31:14,500 --> 02:31:19,780
they wait around I mean more than five minutes oh yeah they're lined up until

1912
02:31:19,780 --> 02:31:24,580
the door is open oh yeah it's in base village especially the line is really

1913
02:31:24,580 --> 02:31:31,380
yeah I've seen it on the mall I haven't seen 330 330 yeah like an hour an hour I

1914
02:31:31,380 --> 02:31:38,180
think yeah yeah using that to activate the next like what's next yeah the idea

1915
02:31:38,180 --> 02:31:44,500
was to bridge yeah the idea was to bridge you know the ski experience to you

1916
02:31:44,500 --> 02:31:47,740
know operate your dinner experience and have something these people from

1917
02:31:47,740 --> 02:31:50,920
Let's just go back to their lives, jump in the hot tub.

1918
02:31:51,080 --> 02:31:55,480
Or jump on a bus, and I'd say if a business had an idea like that, if they wanted to walk

1919
02:31:55,480 --> 02:31:59,260
up and down and give dollar off coupons for whatever, we're fine with that.

1920
02:31:59,460 --> 02:32:04,620
We know we do this to support them, and so if a business has got an idea on how to

1921
02:32:04,620 --> 02:32:08,660
attract or better utilize that line that's waiting for us more, we're all ears, but

1922
02:32:08,660 --> 02:32:10,320
some of the stuff we've got to rely on them to do.

1923
02:32:10,680 --> 02:32:14,520
To the mall's credit, they put in an extra fire pit because they want it in a certain

1924
02:32:14,520 --> 02:32:14,860
spot.

1925
02:32:14,860 --> 02:32:19,220
I mean, a lot of people understand the importance of it and are working towards it.

1926
02:32:19,420 --> 02:32:19,860
Yeah.

1927
02:32:20,240 --> 02:32:21,160
No, I think it's great.

1928
02:32:21,280 --> 02:32:28,340
I'm just wondering maybe if we could capitalize it on it a little bit more to benefit the other

1929
02:32:28,340 --> 02:32:28,740
vendors.

1930
02:32:29,180 --> 02:32:29,300
Yeah.

1931
02:32:29,620 --> 02:32:33,060
And yes, it is keeping people there, but like how long is it keeping people there?

1932
02:32:33,160 --> 02:32:37,840
I mean, I've seen people grab their s'more sticks and then eat them as they're walking

1933
02:32:37,840 --> 02:32:38,740
to the bus stop.

1934
02:32:40,380 --> 02:32:41,520
So I don't know.

1935
02:32:41,740 --> 02:32:43,080
I think it's just something to explore.

1936
02:32:43,380 --> 02:32:43,520
Yeah.

1937
02:32:43,520 --> 02:32:49,540
I'm happy to I'm open to feedback and happy to discuss it too because I really kind of came in at the tail end of ski season

1938
02:32:49,540 --> 02:32:53,980
So I didn't see it activated as much a big picture if it's one of those things that said

1939
02:32:54,800 --> 02:32:56,840
Motivates them to come to snowmass next year

1940
02:32:57,660 --> 02:33:03,860
Everybody wins right? Yeah, everybody does one. I mean I've heard guest services people say that people have said that's the reason

1941
02:33:03,860 --> 02:33:08,380
They come back to snowmass which sounds a little over the top, but it is like a thing

1942
02:33:08,380 --> 02:33:12,440
And it's a thing with the kids, it's a thing with adults too, I've seen it.

1943
02:33:12,520 --> 02:33:15,160
And there are people in this world that have never had a s'more.

1944
02:33:15,680 --> 02:33:17,420
And so it's very exciting.

1945
02:33:18,560 --> 02:33:21,940
And now we have s'more socks, so it's part of our brand.

1946
02:33:22,280 --> 02:33:24,020
But we're not stuck with it, we can always look at changing.

1947
02:33:24,600 --> 02:33:24,920
Socks.

1948
02:33:26,920 --> 02:33:30,880
And it is a signature, I mean like I think Beaver Creek and Bale Hand out cookies.

1949
02:33:31,120 --> 02:33:32,600
Yeah, I was going to use that as an example.

1950
02:33:32,840 --> 02:33:35,420
And they're known for that, you know, the smell of warm cookies.

1951
02:33:35,420 --> 02:33:40,400
It's part of their like making people feel good at that competition ours is

1952
02:33:40,400 --> 02:33:45,140
s'mores which are better than cookies. It was a community competition. Oh yeah

1953
02:33:45,140 --> 02:33:49,300
people submitted their their cookie recipes and then they narrowed it down to

1954
02:33:49,300 --> 02:33:54,080
have Romani and then they would come on opening day and you'd have to bake like

1955
02:33:54,080 --> 02:34:00,020
a thousand cookies and then they would vote on who would be the winner and

1956
02:34:00,020 --> 02:34:04,220
And then that person became the cookie of the resort for the year.

1957
02:34:05,240 --> 02:34:08,800
Is it one or two businesses that get the contract for this morse?

1958
02:34:08,960 --> 02:34:13,280
Right now it's going through one business, but I think that we would probably want to

1959
02:34:13,280 --> 02:34:14,240
rotate it to be fair.

1960
02:34:15,160 --> 02:34:16,980
It's been different businesses over the years.

1961
02:34:17,120 --> 02:34:21,200
And we have put it out at least twice that I can remember putting out the RFU process.

1962
02:34:21,900 --> 02:34:22,960
It's the edge has it now.

1963
02:34:23,220 --> 02:34:23,800
The edge has it.

1964
02:34:23,940 --> 02:34:26,640
I think they're in year two, if I remember it.

1965
02:34:27,020 --> 02:34:30,420
It used to be, I can't remember, but it's been a couple of different businesses.

1966
02:34:30,640 --> 02:34:34,100
We put it out, and for the first couple of years, we actually did it, and then we realized

1967
02:34:34,100 --> 02:34:36,120
that wasn't smart, and we started making it out.

1968
02:34:36,220 --> 02:34:38,820
A slow grueling was for a while.

1969
02:34:39,360 --> 02:34:40,700
So anyway, it's been, we bit it out.

1970
02:34:41,980 --> 02:34:43,860
Can I ask another question on guest services?

1971
02:34:44,200 --> 02:34:44,340
Yeah.

1972
02:34:44,780 --> 02:34:51,980
So is this where the contract for face painting, and that's not a special event.

1973
02:34:52,300 --> 02:34:53,220
Oh, it isn't a special event.

1974
02:34:53,340 --> 02:34:53,480
Yeah.

1975
02:34:53,480 --> 02:35:00,280
So the guest services budget just represents the SMORES program the ACEs hikes and the like uniforms for the

1976
02:35:00,280 --> 02:35:02,520
Staff and you know

1977
02:35:02,520 --> 02:35:06,840
They're a small budget for them to go around and have meetings and try things and you know

1978
02:35:06,840 --> 02:35:11,260
Experience snowmass so that they can fully talk about it and they go try something new

1979
02:35:12,700 --> 02:35:16,560
So this really all of these funds were in the budget existing

1980
02:35:16,560 --> 02:35:22,880
I just moved them out of special events to guest services so that we can accurately reflect what we're spending on the guest service experience

1981
02:35:23,480 --> 02:35:27,660
Because I mean I kind of feel like that is a guest service as well.

1982
02:35:28,240 --> 02:35:28,860
The face painting?

1983
02:35:31,720 --> 02:35:32,000
Yeah.

1984
02:35:32,600 --> 02:35:36,240
I mean I'm just, if you're moving things around, probably to explore.

1985
02:35:36,660 --> 02:35:40,640
I mean this is literally, there's nine, nine or thirteen.

1986
02:35:41,380 --> 02:35:43,020
I can't remember any guest service employees we have.

1987
02:35:43,680 --> 02:35:44,180
I think nine.

1988
02:35:44,440 --> 02:35:49,480
This is those people that sit in the trailer, I mean it's very specific to this one

1989
02:35:49,480 --> 02:35:53,900
thing that, you know, where's the bathroom, well I don't want to, where's the bathroom,

1990
02:35:53,900 --> 02:35:54,820
How do they catch a bus?

1991
02:35:55,520 --> 02:35:57,240
Where to lift a good office, that kind of stuff.

1992
02:35:57,920 --> 02:35:59,740
These are just the things to me that made sense

1993
02:35:59,740 --> 02:36:02,120
to put into guest services as a guest service initiative.

1994
02:36:02,320 --> 02:36:03,520
And they also manage these things.

1995
02:36:03,680 --> 02:36:05,340
Special events manages the face painting

1996
02:36:05,340 --> 02:36:06,960
and the other activations like that.

1997
02:36:07,120 --> 02:36:07,900
So that's in their budget.

1998
02:36:08,920 --> 02:36:11,640
The last change is another new line item

1999
02:36:11,640 --> 02:36:13,080
I called industry relations.

2000
02:36:13,900 --> 02:36:17,140
And it is for, I'm gonna talk to you today

2001
02:36:17,140 --> 02:36:18,580
about the destination management plan.

2002
02:36:18,680 --> 02:36:20,680
So it's covering the cost of facilitating that.

2003
02:36:21,400 --> 02:36:25,440
There's also budget in there to facilitate new ideas that come out of the destination

2004
02:36:25,440 --> 02:36:28,680
management plan because we don't want to come up with great ideas and have zero

2005
02:36:28,680 --> 02:36:31,100
budget to implement them in year one.

2006
02:36:31,880 --> 02:36:35,420
And also I know when I came into this position there was a goal to have more

2007
02:36:35,420 --> 02:36:36,320
community engagement.

2008
02:36:36,860 --> 02:36:39,380
So we've, you know, putting some of the tourism talks in person,

2009
02:36:39,840 --> 02:36:43,500
some of the business after hours so that we can engage with the community

2010
02:36:43,500 --> 02:36:44,780
and other industry events.

2011
02:36:44,860 --> 02:36:46,540
There wasn't a specific budget for it.

2012
02:36:46,540 --> 02:36:49,100
So I called it out in this industry relations line item.

2013
02:36:49,100 --> 02:36:55,060
And so these things I just went through represent that $400,000 change in the budget.

2014
02:36:57,260 --> 02:37:01,080
So unless there's any questions, I was going to move into the capital projects that represent

2015
02:37:01,080 --> 02:37:03,160
that $900,000 budget allocation.

2016
02:37:04,620 --> 02:37:09,240
I don't think there's any breaking news here, but the first one is the Macedons by

2017
02:37:09,240 --> 02:37:10,340
artist Jen Lewin.

2018
02:37:11,440 --> 02:37:17,640
There is $250,000 between this year and next year's budget for the design, fabrication,

2019
02:37:17,640 --> 02:37:23,300
and installation. I'm super excited to bring this project to them all. I think it really

2020
02:37:23,300 --> 02:37:29,380
brings the Ice Age discovery story to life for the visitors with life-size mastodons and

2021
02:37:29,380 --> 02:37:33,900
also meets the Council's goal to engage with the community and to really have a sense

2022
02:37:33,900 --> 02:37:40,280
of place in everything that we do. So I think you've seen the renderings. They're going

2023
02:37:40,280 --> 02:37:45,020
to be really pretty amazing right outside the view line there. And also a pretty

2024
02:37:45,020 --> 02:37:50,560
cool story. The artist is a very hot name right now and the fabrication of them is very

2025
02:37:50,560 --> 02:37:56,680
interesting. The mama is made out of recycled ocean plastic. And as you can see here, I

2026
02:37:56,680 --> 02:38:02,040
think you can see visitors will be able to walk into the mastodon. And the inside of

2027
02:38:02,040 --> 02:38:09,120
the mastodon will be featuring infinity LED mirrors. And those mirrors will feature

2028
02:38:09,120 --> 02:38:12,020
the flora of the Ice Age era.

2029
02:38:12,540 --> 02:38:16,380
So it's gonna be a very interactive, cool exhibit

2030
02:38:16,380 --> 02:38:19,160
that I think, again, will really create a sense of place

2031
02:38:19,160 --> 02:38:21,160
and bring that Ice Age story to life.

2032
02:38:21,860 --> 02:38:22,800
Here's another one.

2033
02:38:23,200 --> 02:38:26,220
The interior of Mama can also be lit up

2034
02:38:26,220 --> 02:38:28,160
with different colors, so it could be themed

2035
02:38:29,080 --> 02:38:31,260
like the Empire State Building comes to mind

2036
02:38:31,260 --> 02:38:33,140
if you wanted to light it up with different colors.

2037
02:38:34,500 --> 02:38:37,320
And our goal is to have it be very interactive

2038
02:38:37,320 --> 02:38:39,920
and have it be a really focal point for the visitor.

2039
02:38:41,340 --> 02:38:42,920
And just on that one, we're still

2040
02:38:42,920 --> 02:38:44,380
waiting for property permission.

2041
02:38:44,560 --> 02:38:45,860
That's the one last thing we're waiting for,

2042
02:38:45,980 --> 02:38:47,740
is to get property owner permission to put it there.

2043
02:38:48,020 --> 02:38:48,480
Getting what?

2044
02:38:48,760 --> 02:38:49,780
Property owner permission.

2045
02:38:50,420 --> 02:38:52,180
From the view line, and then we

2046
02:38:52,180 --> 02:38:54,400
are going to move to final contract with the artist.

2047
02:38:55,000 --> 02:38:57,300
And so we had initially said it'd be installed in summer,

2048
02:38:57,340 --> 02:38:58,900
but we're thinking it'll probably more like fall,

2049
02:38:59,120 --> 02:39:00,660
as we finalize those agreements

2050
02:39:00,660 --> 02:39:03,480
so that we can give the artist appropriate time

2051
02:39:03,480 --> 02:39:04,320
for the fabrication.

2052
02:39:04,980 --> 02:39:06,260
And then, oh, go ahead.

2053
02:39:06,540 --> 02:39:06,820
Do you ask?

2054
02:39:06,820 --> 02:39:13,560
The $250,000 that's in the budget for that, will that cover, is that exactly what's needed

2055
02:39:13,560 --> 02:39:15,860
to cover creating the art and installing it?

2056
02:39:15,860 --> 02:39:20,040
That should cover everything, the design of it, the fabrication of it, and the installation.

2057
02:39:20,680 --> 02:39:24,100
There be anything left over for, I don't believe so.

2058
02:39:25,900 --> 02:39:28,060
Will there be interpretive signage as well?

2059
02:39:30,100 --> 02:39:30,960
That's a good question.

2060
02:39:31,160 --> 02:39:33,400
I don't know that we've talked about signage, it's something we could definitely

2061
02:39:33,400 --> 02:39:33,880
discuss.

2062
02:39:34,640 --> 02:39:35,260
It's necessary.

2063
02:39:35,260 --> 02:39:40,240
because I would think we'd want to tie it back to the story I think yeah one

2064
02:39:40,240 --> 02:39:42,240
it's interesting you mentioned that because that's kind of what I was

2065
02:39:42,240 --> 02:39:47,660
getting as their room for any little bits and pieces to be added to the other

2066
02:39:47,660 --> 02:39:51,420
things like signage there would be organic feature around it to bring some

2067
02:39:51,420 --> 02:39:55,840
warmth and yeah well and it can be added to the walk like if you scan the

2068
02:39:55,840 --> 02:40:00,180
QR code and it tells you the locations could be added to that yeah I

2069
02:40:00,180 --> 02:40:03,260
would think that'd be in conjunction with like the art map and you know

2070
02:40:03,260 --> 02:40:07,320
all the signage that's going around that and this will be added to that and you

2071
02:40:07,320 --> 02:40:10,240
know I think that'll be part of that program. Some little sign that lets you know

2072
02:40:10,240 --> 02:40:16,700
this is the size of a mammoth you know and why it's important and all that. I mean why

2073
02:40:16,700 --> 02:40:21,020
I don't have to do it through the QR code and this and that and just something

2074
02:40:21,020 --> 02:40:26,120
really dumb and simple. People may not know why we have mammoths in the middle of our mall.

2075
02:40:26,380 --> 02:40:31,880
They're gonna know now. My other question is I mean I feel like some of

2076
02:40:31,880 --> 02:40:36,320
art that we have around the village isn't as easily accessible in terms of like

2077
02:40:36,320 --> 02:40:45,800
people walking by it all the time so security wise I mean how sturdy are these

2078
02:40:45,800 --> 02:40:50,580
things like is it like a snowball goes into it and creates a problem are we

2079
02:40:50,580 --> 02:40:55,120
gonna have any sort of surveillance you know camera on it I mean I'm asking

2080
02:40:55,120 --> 02:41:00,280
because I I know the reality that sometimes things yeah I know we talked

2081
02:41:00,280 --> 02:41:03,860
about that with the bears too, like are people going to start climbing on them and I mean

2082
02:41:03,860 --> 02:41:08,440
I think these are made for some wear and tear, they're huge and they're super solid.

2083
02:41:09,220 --> 02:41:13,380
The baby's made out of chrome, they're not going to be damaged easily I don't think,

2084
02:41:13,500 --> 02:41:14,780
but I think it's a fair question.

2085
02:41:15,500 --> 02:41:20,260
I don't know that we've talked about security cameras, but we can certainly discuss security

2086
02:41:20,260 --> 02:41:22,600
and how to make sure that they stay protected.

2087
02:41:23,240 --> 02:41:28,160
Yeah, I mean I think it's a big investment, we've waited for a long time to be able

2088
02:41:28,160 --> 02:41:35,080
to do something like this and I don't know I think we need to make sure it

2089
02:41:35,080 --> 02:41:39,420
stays protected the best we can yeah no I think it's a good discussion as much as

2090
02:41:39,420 --> 02:41:42,480
you don't want to believe that people are going to do bad things like you know

2091
02:41:42,480 --> 02:41:48,760
yeah ice sculptures that we had there were amazing but you know you come back

2092
02:41:48,760 --> 02:41:54,200
the next day and somebody's broken them off right yeah no I think it's a fair

2093
02:41:54,200 --> 02:41:57,120
I think it's a fair question and we want to make sure like you said it's

2094
02:41:57,120 --> 02:42:00,760
good big investment to make sure that they stay and they're made already be

2095
02:42:00,760 --> 02:42:03,640
cameras I don't know about the mall security I don't know if there's already

2096
02:42:03,640 --> 02:42:08,720
cameras and something that could be adjusted I happen to know that it's been

2097
02:42:08,720 --> 02:42:12,240
thought about and be we will without going through the whole thing yes we

2098
02:42:12,240 --> 02:42:15,700
know that it's important to have that that was my main question I could help

2099
02:42:15,700 --> 02:42:20,100
you earlier sorry you were doing so good I didn't want to jump in on you

2100
02:42:20,100 --> 02:42:24,580
she's doing great I know that's why I didn't want to zip in it yeah I mean I

2101
02:42:24,580 --> 02:42:27,460
I don't know everything yet, but I'm working on it.

2102
02:42:28,960 --> 02:42:32,080
Super excited to the other capital investment

2103
02:42:32,080 --> 02:42:33,900
is, again, really significant.

2104
02:42:34,260 --> 02:42:36,200
It's our signature Thursday night concerts

2105
02:42:36,200 --> 02:42:38,200
that create so much engagement with the community

2106
02:42:38,200 --> 02:42:39,440
and visitors and locals.

2107
02:42:40,340 --> 02:42:43,480
It is a significant investment of $500,000

2108
02:42:43,480 --> 02:42:45,480
between this year and next year's budget,

2109
02:42:45,680 --> 02:42:48,640
but our stage for the Thursday night concerts

2110
02:42:48,640 --> 02:42:50,560
has come to the end of its lifespan.

2111
02:42:51,280 --> 02:42:57,540
It is past its kind of structural integrity and it really is time to upgrade it to past safety inspections.

2112
02:42:58,400 --> 02:43:00,960
I'm super excited about the new stage that we're bringing.

2113
02:43:01,440 --> 02:43:03,020
It's a mobile stage.

2114
02:43:03,580 --> 02:43:08,880
So it essentially sort of flips open versus taking days to build.

2115
02:43:09,600 --> 02:43:15,920
So while the investment is significant in the long term, this will require less labor to set up and less labor to dismantle.

2116
02:43:16,260 --> 02:43:18,900
And it will be movable if we wanted to move it somewhere.

2117
02:43:19,680 --> 02:43:24,580
and it is a state-of-the-art stage so I'm really excited to upgrade that. I think

2118
02:43:24,580 --> 02:43:28,880
it'll be great experience for not only the audience but for the artists coming

2119
02:43:28,880 --> 02:43:35,600
in and with that the audio system has been kind of had some challenges. The

2120
02:43:35,600 --> 02:43:41,120
current audio system is 30 years old and the sound isn't reaching the

2121
02:43:41,120 --> 02:43:45,700
second half of the hill so we're upgrading the new audio as well to

2122
02:43:45,700 --> 02:43:50,680
really, you know, be in line with all the modern technology we have for sound and stage.

2123
02:43:51,720 --> 02:43:55,060
And here's just an example of the stage.

2124
02:43:55,360 --> 02:43:59,080
This is, you know, branded for somebody else, but we can brand it obviously with Snowmass,

2125
02:43:59,580 --> 02:44:00,400
any sponsors.

2126
02:44:00,880 --> 02:44:06,520
And it's, you know, like I said, it's a mobile stage that will require less work

2127
02:44:06,520 --> 02:44:07,440
and less maintenance.

2128
02:44:07,460 --> 02:44:09,220
Does this thing just sort of pops up from a trailer?

2129
02:44:09,480 --> 02:44:11,520
I mean, I might be overstating the ease of it.

2130
02:44:11,620 --> 02:44:12,140
I don't know.

2131
02:44:12,140 --> 02:44:16,740
They're like the one that they have at Jazz Aspen, they like crank open sort of in it just

2132
02:44:16,740 --> 02:44:17,160
all.

2133
02:44:17,300 --> 02:44:22,220
Yeah, it sort of just pops open versus I understand the previous stage did take a number of days

2134
02:44:22,220 --> 02:44:26,220
to build and dismantle, so this will just be easier in the long run, it'll require

2135
02:44:26,220 --> 02:44:29,980
less labor hours and less time to put up and take down.

2136
02:44:30,560 --> 02:44:35,400
So if we wanted to have a concert at the rodeo, for example, we could do that.

2137
02:44:35,400 --> 02:44:36,180
It's not that mobile.

2138
02:44:36,720 --> 02:44:38,360
I don't think you can move it like daily or anything.

2139
02:44:38,560 --> 02:44:39,080
No, no, no.

2140
02:44:39,080 --> 02:44:44,920
We could move it like say after the I mean I don't want to speak because I don't know you know the details of the

2141
02:44:44,920 --> 02:44:51,060
Logistics of it, but it does sound like we could move it like say after the Thursday night concert series to the rodeo

2142
02:44:51,060 --> 02:44:53,400
Lot and do an event down there

2143
02:44:53,400 --> 02:44:59,980
Which is pretty cool versus dismantling it for days and then like resetting it up and these are the sort of state of the

2144
02:45:11,420 --> 02:45:17,460
And then the last capital project is the $400,000 annual contribution for the eventual replacement

2145
02:45:17,460 --> 02:45:20,360
of these Skittles. So that's just a transfer.

2146
02:45:23,250 --> 02:45:27,850
And then the last thing I wanted to talk to you, the most newest, exciting thing we're working

2147
02:45:27,850 --> 02:45:30,790
on that you've heard a little bit about, and I just wanted to take you a little bit more

2148
02:45:30,790 --> 02:45:34,850
through the process and what it means for Snowmass is the destination management plan.

2149
02:45:36,510 --> 02:45:40,890
Here's just a textbook definition of what does a destination management plan or destination

2150
02:45:40,890 --> 02:45:41,810
management mean.

2151
02:45:42,030 --> 02:45:45,530
It's the coordinated management of all the elements that make up a tourist destination

2152
02:45:46,070 --> 02:45:49,850
to really enhance its overall appeal, success, and long-term sustainability.

2153
02:45:50,910 --> 02:45:55,810
This graphic just shows you the types of things that we're looking at in a destination

2154
02:45:55,810 --> 02:45:56,830
management plan.

2155
02:45:57,150 --> 02:45:59,550
It's not just about the marketing and attracting visitors.

2156
02:45:59,550 --> 02:46:01,710
It's about really engaging with the community.

2157
02:46:02,290 --> 02:46:05,950
It's about doing an assessment of our destination, our strengths and our weaknesses.

2158
02:46:06,370 --> 02:46:10,990
It's taking all the data that we already have and putting that into the mix.

2159
02:46:11,490 --> 02:46:15,390
And I'm going to take you a little bit through the process of what that looks like.

2160
02:46:17,190 --> 02:46:20,870
A little bit about destination management plans, and some of you may have heard this

2161
02:46:20,870 --> 02:46:23,830
if you came to tourism talks or some other meetings because we have been engaging

2162
02:46:23,830 --> 02:46:28,430
already in the community, but it is like a really broad holistic look at assessing

2163
02:46:28,430 --> 02:46:30,750
and strategizing around a tourism destination.

2164
02:46:31,410 --> 02:46:35,850
It'll build a roadmap to support the long-term health of SNOMAS and the well-being not only

2165
02:46:35,850 --> 02:46:37,390
for visitors, but for the community.

2166
02:46:38,030 --> 02:46:42,390
It's a very participatory process, which I'll take you through kind of what that looks

2167
02:46:42,390 --> 02:46:42,750
like.

2168
02:46:43,170 --> 02:46:48,010
It'll involve all key stakeholder groups, elected officials as yourself, and key decision

2169
02:46:48,010 --> 02:46:50,150
makers, as well as our community residents.

2170
02:46:51,950 --> 02:46:56,710
And as mentioned here, it's going to be cognizant of our budget, which we have

2171
02:46:56,710 --> 02:47:02,910
really good resources for and our funding mechanisms and what we actually can implement

2172
02:47:02,910 --> 02:47:04,970
and what we can't implement.

2173
02:47:06,150 --> 02:47:11,530
We contracted, we put out an RFP, we got 10 proposals and we contracted with Roadmap

2174
02:47:11,530 --> 02:47:12,210
Consulting.

2175
02:47:12,390 --> 02:47:13,930
I'm really excited to work with them.

2176
02:47:14,030 --> 02:47:18,050
They are based locally in Carbondale, but they have put together a team of professionals,

2177
02:47:18,450 --> 02:47:23,750
some that are not local, that really I think did the best job at responding to the RFP.

2178
02:47:23,750 --> 02:47:29,750
One thing that I was very definite about is I wanted it to be an actionable and succinct

2179
02:47:29,750 --> 02:47:30,730
plan that's measurable.

2180
02:47:31,150 --> 02:47:35,830
Some destination management plans can be very long and, you know, I don't want it to be

2181
02:47:35,830 --> 02:47:39,170
something that sits on a shelf and is like nobody reads it because it's 100 pages.

2182
02:47:39,350 --> 02:47:42,790
So I really want to come up with really a five-year roadmap.

2183
02:47:43,250 --> 02:47:45,610
We're using five years as a baseline.

2184
02:47:45,950 --> 02:47:49,270
It could, you know, have longer tactics, too, that we might want to look at in the

2185
02:47:49,270 --> 02:47:49,970
longer term.

2186
02:47:49,970 --> 02:47:55,730
But really looking at sort of short, mid, and long range goals for the destination and

2187
02:47:55,730 --> 02:47:58,930
something that we can action and the Council will be able to measure against as well.

2188
02:47:59,590 --> 02:48:03,850
As it says here, it will have a defined vision and mission for the destination with specific

2189
02:48:03,850 --> 02:48:05,350
goals, strategies, and tactics.

2190
02:48:05,850 --> 02:48:07,370
And it will identify needs.

2191
02:48:07,570 --> 02:48:11,930
It might be things like destination development, which would mean like do we want new products

2192
02:48:11,930 --> 02:48:17,410
for our visitors, new initiatives, and really just looking at enhancing the visitors,

2193
02:48:17,410 --> 02:48:21,390
but it will also take in consideration the needs of the community as well.

2194
02:48:22,010 --> 02:48:25,890
And again, it will define what implementation looks like. It will have a timeline and it will

2195
02:48:25,890 --> 02:48:31,970
identify the budget needs. So my hope is that the plan also times really well with a five-year

2196
02:48:31,970 --> 02:48:36,690
budget that we put together to say that we've identified some priorities for the destination

2197
02:48:36,690 --> 02:48:42,770
and we can also look at budgeting against those in sort of a proactive and long-term way.

2198
02:48:44,430 --> 02:48:48,690
In terms of stakeholder engagement, we've already started the process and I wanted to

2199
02:48:48,690 --> 02:48:52,450
take you through what's already been happening and what is still going to be happening.

2200
02:48:53,090 --> 02:48:57,310
And some of you were, I know, part of this, so in September we kicked off the process.

2201
02:48:57,590 --> 02:49:01,450
We had meetings with the tourism board and with our various committees, the group sales

2202
02:49:01,450 --> 02:49:06,230
committee and the marketing advisory, sorry, it says the marketing advisory board, that's

2203
02:49:06,230 --> 02:49:10,690
actually the marketing advisory committee, and we did a community tourism talks at

2204
02:49:10,690 --> 02:49:16,430
the collective in September. Right now we are working on two surveys. We're just finalizing

2205
02:49:16,430 --> 02:49:23,290
those this week. We hope to start distribution of those next week. One is specifically targeted

2206
02:49:23,290 --> 02:49:28,270
to snow mass residents and one to tourism stakeholders and ask them a series of questions

2207
02:49:28,270 --> 02:49:33,730
about how they feel about the destination. It's about 30 questions long, you know, how

2208
02:49:33,730 --> 02:49:37,730
they feel about the future of the destination, what's important to them. And we're going

2209
02:49:37,730 --> 02:49:42,950
to have those surveys distributed from next week, probably through mid-December to really

2210
02:49:42,950 --> 02:49:49,110
get as much community participation as possible. Those will go out through the TOSV website

2211
02:49:49,110 --> 02:49:54,730
and through our tourism stakeholder newsletters, social media, and various other outlets

2212
02:49:54,730 --> 02:49:57,410
to make sure we get as much participation in those as possible.

2213
02:49:58,150 --> 02:50:00,390
And they are drafted already? Are they ready?

2214
02:50:00,390 --> 02:50:02,710
They're in draft form, and we're looking to finalize those this week.

2215
02:50:02,990 --> 02:50:04,050
Can we see them?

2216
02:50:04,510 --> 02:50:06,050
No, thank you.

2217
02:50:06,970 --> 02:50:10,210
We are also working in response to the RFP I put together.

2218
02:50:10,550 --> 02:50:12,510
We're working on two focus work sessions.

2219
02:50:12,870 --> 02:50:16,710
They probably won't take place in November, but we are putting the teams together for

2220
02:50:16,710 --> 02:50:21,970
a sustainability workforce and a DEIA specific workforce session.

2221
02:50:22,630 --> 02:50:26,890
So there should be some goals that come out of this plan that are specific to sustainability

2222
02:50:26,890 --> 02:50:31,990
and DEIA, and again, mid and longer term goals.

2223
02:50:32,730 --> 02:50:33,310
DEIA.

2224
02:50:33,310 --> 02:50:40,050
DEIA is diversity, equity, inclusion, and accessibility, and it is an important part

2225
02:50:40,050 --> 02:50:41,490
of what the work that tourism does.

2226
02:50:41,730 --> 02:50:46,630
So to include things like making visitors and locals all feel more welcome, things like

2227
02:50:46,630 --> 02:50:52,550
accessible travel, looking at, you know, visitors with disabilities, whether they're

2228
02:50:52,550 --> 02:50:56,450
hidden or physical, are they welcome in our community, are there ways we can make

2229
02:50:56,450 --> 02:51:03,730
more welcoming diversity in our marketing diversity in our product and you know our tourism product

2230
02:51:03,730 --> 02:51:09,590
and things like that so they're pretty broad topics the initial work sessions will look at them

2231
02:51:09,590 --> 02:51:15,310
kind of holistically sustainability is also a very broad topic it could be sustainability in

2232
02:51:15,310 --> 02:51:20,870
terms of our environment our trails our natural resources but it's also the sustainability

2233
02:51:20,870 --> 02:51:25,130
of the well-being of our community and the sustainability of our tourism economy so

2234
02:51:26,490 --> 02:51:34,170
The plan is to have sort of an overall work session and then I see different types of goals coming out of those sessions that will require further work

2235
02:51:34,170 --> 02:51:36,470
Because they're both very broad topics

2236
02:51:37,790 --> 02:51:41,470
And then in December, we're working on two community visioning workshops

2237
02:51:41,470 --> 02:51:47,850
We have penciled in December 3rd and 4th and I'll send you an invite with all the details December 3rd

2238
02:51:48,710 --> 02:51:54,970
Is planned as an afternoon session our thought is you know, hopefully people are out skiing on some great powder by then

2239
02:51:55,710 --> 02:52:03,310
And then they come down and we have something at base village where we invite the community to come weigh in on these different topics.

2240
02:52:03,550 --> 02:52:07,610
And then we host like a happy hour, so it'd be casual, it'd be open to anybody.

2241
02:52:08,210 --> 02:52:12,250
It'd be sort of like an open house feeling like if you can't stay for two hours, you don't have to.

2242
02:52:12,310 --> 02:52:17,010
But we really want to invite the community to come in and all of you to come in and be part of the plan.

2243
02:52:17,010 --> 02:52:22,050
and then December 4th we will probably hold something here or in more of a

2244
02:52:22,050 --> 02:52:28,630
conference room setting focused on more of our tourism stakeholders and so

2245
02:52:28,630 --> 02:52:34,090
those two will be really key feedback loops for this plan along with those

2246
02:52:34,090 --> 02:52:39,670
surveys. We're also looking at about 10 to 15 individual interviews with key

2247
02:52:39,670 --> 02:52:42,370
stakeholders and we're just putting that list together. We want to make

2248
02:52:42,370 --> 02:52:46,210
sure we have a really broad spectrum of stakeholders that will have

2249
02:52:46,210 --> 02:52:49,910
different thoughts about the future of snowmass and those will be individual

2250
02:52:49,910 --> 02:52:53,510
interviews with our consultant roadmap and they'll be about 45 minutes in

2251
02:52:53,510 --> 02:52:58,810
length and so all of that will go into the plan. So then I assume when you do

2252
02:52:58,810 --> 02:53:02,650
all this then there's a draft yeah it'll be brought to us well the chance

2253
02:53:02,650 --> 02:53:07,930
to weigh in on it yes all this is very impactful on the community. Yes

2254
02:53:07,930 --> 02:53:12,870
absolutely what's not listed here is that there will be a work session with

2255
02:53:12,870 --> 02:53:17,290
council there'll be what I don't work sessions the right word but a session

2256
02:53:17,290 --> 02:53:21,350
a meeting is calling a meeting figure the format yeah there's also going to be a

2257
02:53:21,350 --> 02:53:28,250
meeting engaging the department heads the 10 department heads and then what's not

2258
02:53:28,250 --> 02:53:31,970
calendared out yet but in the new year is exactly what you said is that we will

2259
02:53:31,970 --> 02:53:36,310
have a draft plan that's presented to these various including yourselves and

2260
02:53:36,310 --> 02:53:39,990
these various committees and then time for feedback on the plan before we go

2261
02:53:39,990 --> 02:53:44,110
to a final plan and the final one would need to be approved by council.

2262
02:53:44,430 --> 02:53:44,790
Eventually.

2263
02:53:45,130 --> 02:53:45,250
Yeah.

2264
02:53:45,990 --> 02:53:46,950
And the tourism board.

2265
02:53:47,330 --> 02:53:48,030
And the tourism board.

2266
02:53:48,330 --> 02:53:48,510
Sure.

2267
02:53:49,450 --> 02:53:54,350
And these work sessions would be sometime coming up November based.

2268
02:53:54,750 --> 02:53:59,470
The sustainability and DEIA, we're working on those lists of who we want on those

2269
02:53:59,470 --> 02:53:59,970
work sessions.

2270
02:54:00,350 --> 02:54:03,390
Again, we want to have like a broad base of different people.

2271
02:54:04,290 --> 02:54:05,690
Anybody's welcome to join those.

2272
02:54:05,950 --> 02:54:09,290
And then I don't know that the meetings will actually be held in November.

2273
02:54:09,290 --> 02:54:16,350
they may be kind of formalized in November, sometime in November, December, avoiding obviously

2274
02:54:16,350 --> 02:54:16,850
the holidays.

2275
02:54:17,410 --> 02:54:18,550
So we're just...

2276
02:54:19,850 --> 02:54:26,610
And then for council, I believe post-election we'll schedule a session to come and do some

2277
02:54:26,610 --> 02:54:32,190
planning on that as well, and then in Q1 of next year we'll be more of a draft plan

2278
02:54:32,190 --> 02:54:37,890
will be presented, you know, time for review and then more of a final plan with the

2279
02:54:37,890 --> 02:54:41,430
of the final plan being completed sort of March, April,

2280
02:54:42,010 --> 02:54:44,730
but some flexibility on that if it takes longer,

2281
02:54:45,150 --> 02:54:47,330
we obviously are, you know, want to get it right

2282
02:54:47,330 --> 02:54:49,230
and want to get the input that we think is important

2283
02:54:49,230 --> 02:54:49,890
to this plan.

2284
02:54:50,710 --> 02:54:52,410
So I'm really excited about this work.

2285
02:54:53,410 --> 02:54:56,950
It's kind of new work and I think in the last five

2286
02:54:56,950 --> 02:54:59,630
or so years, the tourism industry has really taken

2287
02:54:59,630 --> 02:55:00,430
a different approach.

2288
02:55:01,270 --> 02:55:03,490
And I know some of the stakeholders have said

2289
02:55:03,490 --> 02:55:04,790
like why are you doing this?

2290
02:55:05,530 --> 02:55:08,590
and some people are like questioning the why

2291
02:55:08,590 --> 02:55:11,970
and it's really important that we are not just coming up

2292
02:55:11,970 --> 02:55:13,790
with strategy that works for the tourism board

2293
02:55:13,790 --> 02:55:15,290
or the tourism department,

2294
02:55:15,510 --> 02:55:17,270
but it's really a community-based plan

2295
02:55:17,270 --> 02:55:19,810
and that is I think a trend in the last five years

2296
02:55:19,810 --> 02:55:21,570
that the tourism industry is really looking at

2297
02:55:21,570 --> 02:55:23,130
like what's good for the visitor

2298
02:55:23,130 --> 02:55:24,390
also has to be good for the community

2299
02:55:24,390 --> 02:55:25,930
because you have to have that holistic look

2300
02:55:25,930 --> 02:55:28,790
at the community and residents and visitors

2301
02:55:28,790 --> 02:55:30,590
both having really good experiences

2302
02:55:30,590 --> 02:55:32,190
and so I'm excited to do this work

2303
02:55:32,190 --> 02:55:36,930
with both the community and our tourism stakeholders to come up with the plan and then bring it

2304
02:55:36,930 --> 02:55:40,030
to, you know, have you guys input in the work and then bring it to you.

2305
02:55:41,130 --> 02:55:41,450
Awesome.

2306
02:55:41,790 --> 02:55:47,810
That's such an influence from Snowmass's history of resort community efforts for balance.

2307
02:55:48,250 --> 02:55:48,430
Yeah.

2308
02:55:48,750 --> 02:55:49,550
I think it'll be great.

2309
02:55:49,770 --> 02:55:50,790
I think it'll be a great process.

2310
02:55:50,950 --> 02:55:52,330
And like I've told people, it should be fun.

2311
02:55:52,510 --> 02:55:53,130
It should be engaging.

2312
02:55:53,290 --> 02:55:57,030
And it should be inspiring because as you've seen at some of the, you know, tourism

2313
02:55:57,030 --> 02:56:00,090
talks and things, it's talking about like, what is your ideal future look like?

2314
02:56:00,090 --> 02:56:07,150
And that's really what we want to strive for is a place that visitors love and come back to and that community is

2315
02:56:07,150 --> 02:56:11,090
You know feels like that we have their best interest at heart and we're working for them, too

2316
02:56:13,030 --> 02:56:16,370
And I think that's the end of it unless there's any questions

2317
02:56:18,070 --> 02:56:18,870
Question about

2318
02:56:20,710 --> 02:56:26,190
Our capital projects, how much do we have in the budget for the Skittles? How much is have we banked so far?

2319
02:56:28,250 --> 02:56:29,330
Boy, let's see

2320
02:56:31,270 --> 02:56:38,090
I want to say it's something over 2 million, like 2.6, 2.8, something like that.

2321
02:56:38,330 --> 02:56:39,630
I'm going under. I'm going to do four.

2322
02:56:40,430 --> 02:56:40,750
Let's see.

2323
02:56:41,990 --> 02:56:42,670
They're fries.

2324
02:56:43,350 --> 02:56:51,050
Well, at the end of this year, it'll be 2.8 because there's about 2.4 at the ending balance,

2325
02:56:51,130 --> 02:56:55,270
but that assumes we spend 400,000, which we're not going to this year.

2326
02:56:55,610 --> 02:56:59,250
So that'll make it 2.8 and plus another four next year.

2327
02:56:59,250 --> 02:57:06,330
So we have 2.8 allocated for a Skittles replacement in the savings account. Yeah, yeah

2328
02:57:07,330 --> 02:57:12,170
And I'll be I thought we'd save more than that by now, but no no it's been four hundred a year for

2329
02:57:12,690 --> 02:57:14,850
five years six years, so that's

2330
02:57:16,210 --> 02:57:21,370
Yeah, and some yeah because in the beginning when we were transferring over

2331
02:57:21,650 --> 02:57:25,830
400,000 it was to pay also for any projects that tourism had

2332
02:57:26,470 --> 02:57:31,370
So the whole 400 wasn't set aside in those beginning years and I guess we've

2333
02:57:31,370 --> 02:57:34,650
spent some on it as well right we had to put a new rope on and we had some

2334
02:57:34,650 --> 02:57:40,510
maintenance and well that's where this is the one of the other topics is just

2335
02:57:40,510 --> 02:57:45,630
to run through the GID budget real quick and that's where those expenses are

2336
02:57:45,630 --> 02:57:49,650
and then to see if there was any other questions in the packet because next

2337
02:57:49,650 --> 02:57:56,870
week you know we should be able to wrap it up by doing the CIP fund and then

2338
02:57:56,870 --> 02:58:02,750
adoption on the 6th. And Julia just as far as the Macedon's go have you

2339
02:58:04,550 --> 02:58:09,350
involved the Arts Advisory Board at all? Oh yeah they yeah sorry I failed to say

2340
02:58:09,350 --> 02:58:13,690
that but they unanimously approved the project and are very excited about it

2341
02:58:13,690 --> 02:58:13,830
Yeah.

2342
02:58:13,950 --> 02:58:15,210
I mean, it looks great.

2343
02:58:15,430 --> 02:58:16,450
Yeah, I'm excited for it.

2344
02:58:16,470 --> 02:58:17,470
Can you pull up the jig?

2345
02:58:17,730 --> 02:58:18,290
Any other questions?

2346
02:58:21,390 --> 02:58:23,670
On one special events or just events,

2347
02:58:24,070 --> 02:58:26,330
how much flexibility does the budget

2348
02:58:26,330 --> 02:58:28,170
allow for new ideas?

2349
02:58:29,030 --> 02:58:31,590
If it's not scheduled now, is there

2350
02:58:31,590 --> 02:58:34,330
any room for events to come in?

2351
02:58:34,690 --> 02:58:34,950
Yeah.

2352
02:58:35,170 --> 02:58:38,750
Yeah, we do build some contingency in both the winter

2353
02:58:38,750 --> 02:58:40,430
and summer events budget.

2354
02:58:40,430 --> 02:58:45,810
budget, and then we do have some contingency in the destination marketing plan process

2355
02:58:45,810 --> 02:58:46,290
as well.

2356
02:58:46,650 --> 02:58:51,250
So depending on, you know, what ideas come out of that, we will probably have to prioritize

2357
02:58:51,250 --> 02:58:54,850
because there's not a huge budget attached to it, but I wanted to make sure we had

2358
02:58:54,850 --> 02:59:00,350
some monies to support ideas that, you know, were kind of a low-hanging fruit or the

2359
02:59:00,350 --> 02:59:01,490
shorter-term ideas.

2360
02:59:01,730 --> 02:59:04,130
So there's, you know, some different opportunities there.

2361
02:59:04,890 --> 02:59:08,830
And typically, I mean, unless it's a small event, a lot of events, if you're bringing

2362
02:59:08,830 --> 02:59:12,290
in a new event isn't probably going to happen in the same budget year if it's, you know,

2363
02:59:12,370 --> 02:59:15,870
a big signature event that would take some time to build, so it could be budgeted in

2364
02:59:15,870 --> 02:59:20,450
future years, but we do build contingency and all those line items to, you know, facilitate

2365
02:59:20,450 --> 02:59:21,910
new ideas and some innovation.

2366
02:59:27,420 --> 02:59:27,820
Great.

2367
02:59:28,200 --> 02:59:28,600
Thank you.

2368
02:59:29,080 --> 02:59:29,260
Yeah.

2369
02:59:29,400 --> 02:59:29,800
Good info.

2370
02:59:30,180 --> 02:59:30,560
Thank you.

2371
02:59:30,740 --> 02:59:31,520
It's good stuff going on.

2372
02:59:31,580 --> 02:59:32,140
Thanks very much.

2373
02:59:32,580 --> 02:59:32,880
Thank you.

2374
02:59:34,840 --> 02:59:38,000
So we'll try to wrap this up quickly.

2375
02:59:38,300 --> 02:59:40,280
Let's look at the GID budget first.

2376
02:59:40,960 --> 02:59:42,520
It's page 165.

2377
02:59:42,520 --> 02:59:47,500
And this is just kind of an overview. We don't have to put our GID hats on right now. No, no

2378
02:59:48,300 --> 02:59:55,340
Clint thought that this might be a good idea to go ahead and get through this budget and then we'll do adoption as the

2379
02:59:55,340 --> 02:59:57,440
GID board on November 6th

2380
02:59:57,440 --> 02:59:59,960
We won't have to go back through this. Okay, great

2381
03:00:00,000 --> 03:00:02,040
And if there are questions, we'll be ready for them.

2382
03:00:03,720 --> 03:00:12,120
So the couple of things just to point out, you will be doing a GID revised budget also on the 6th.

2383
03:00:12,420 --> 03:00:19,840
If you look down the 2004 variance column, it's mostly for two lines down there.

2384
03:00:20,400 --> 03:00:27,620
The Skittles, the SkyCab operating is going to end up over budget by $13,000.

2385
03:00:35,160 --> 03:00:44,100
dollars. The winter hours, we were the winter operating hours were scheduled originally budgeted

2386
03:00:44,100 --> 03:00:51,180
to end at 9 o'clock and they actually ended at 9 30. So we had an extra half hour to pay

2387
03:00:51,180 --> 03:01:00,020
those same hours are budgeted for in 2025 and then the other big increase was the

2388
03:01:00,020 --> 03:01:08,180
snow melting for lower carriageway so that is over by 37,000 most of that is

2389
03:01:08,180 --> 03:01:15,520
Black Hills gas and it had to do with the work that Ann and the team were

2390
03:01:15,520 --> 03:01:22,240
doing on the vaults and they had to run the snow melting greater and longer than

2391
03:01:22,240 --> 03:01:32,900
what they had anticipated. So it's those two lines. In 2025 that one that'll be a

2392
03:01:32,900 --> 03:01:37,740
separate resolution that you'll be adopting. Property taxes the mills stay

2393
03:01:37,740 --> 03:01:43,040
the same if you recall that's six mills and it'll stay that way until the

2394
03:01:43,040 --> 03:01:51,680
bonds paid off, where's the town's assessed value only went up less than 1% the assessed

2395
03:01:51,680 --> 03:01:58,060
value because of new construction for the GID went up 12.4%.

2396
03:01:58,760 --> 03:02:01,440
So we have some additional income coming in.

2397
03:02:02,340 --> 03:02:05,020
Interest income will be decreased.

2398
03:02:06,020 --> 03:02:15,760
the expenses are like 5% increases like I said the sky cab that increases the

2399
03:02:15,760 --> 03:02:20,740
same hours but we're anticipating that the ski company will increase their

2400
03:02:20,740 --> 03:02:30,540
rates I have budgeted 7% for that and then snow melting will go down next year

2401
03:02:30,540 --> 03:02:37,460
and anticipates because we won't be running the snowmountain for that long. So that is

2402
03:02:37,460 --> 03:02:48,280
the GID budget because the vault will be fixed hopefully sometime in 2025. Any questions on

2403
03:02:48,280 --> 03:02:53,420
that budget? I had a question about the Skittles. I

2404
03:02:55,630 --> 03:02:59,170
mean all the way in 20, what is it, in

2405
03:03:00,430 --> 03:03:01,930
Is that what the year is?

2406
03:03:03,190 --> 03:03:06,710
Yeah, it shows it's like $445,000.

2407
03:03:07,030 --> 03:03:09,890
I'm increasing it by 7% every single year

2408
03:03:10,570 --> 03:03:14,090
because their payroll and their benefit costs go up

2409
03:03:14,900 --> 03:03:18,010
as well as any of their operating costs, so.

2410
03:03:21,310 --> 03:03:23,910
But I know we've talked about it before

2411
03:03:23,910 --> 03:03:27,130
and we received emails from Pat Kieffer about SkiCo

2412
03:03:27,130 --> 03:03:32,350
contributing more, contributing to the summer skittles.

2413
03:03:34,350 --> 03:03:36,150
Right, well so that's me and you guys

2414
03:03:36,150 --> 03:03:37,410
when you adopted the master plan,

2415
03:03:37,530 --> 03:03:39,510
the mountain master plan, they're required to come back

2416
03:03:40,090 --> 03:03:42,470
at the end of December with a framework for that

2417
03:03:42,470 --> 03:03:44,150
and so we don't have that yet.

2418
03:03:44,650 --> 03:03:47,910
But once we do, this will, I mean, hopefully it's gonna,

2419
03:03:48,030 --> 03:03:51,830
I mean, the fact is, is that it is a pinnacle

2420
03:03:51,830 --> 03:03:53,810
whether it's in the winter or the summer

2421
03:03:53,810 --> 03:03:55,650
and I don't think they can deny that

2422
03:03:55,650 --> 03:03:57,250
and I think a lot has changed on the mountain

2423
03:03:57,250 --> 03:04:00,150
and I really think that they need to be paying more

2424
03:04:00,150 --> 03:04:01,330
of a fair share for the summer.

2425
03:04:02,090 --> 03:04:02,710
Yeah, agreed.

2426
03:04:03,090 --> 03:04:06,050
So, three of the five of you guys got this update from me

2427
03:04:06,050 --> 03:04:08,570
and so I owe you some, we continue those discussions.

2428
03:04:09,110 --> 03:04:12,690
We expect you guys to, we expect something

2429
03:04:12,690 --> 03:04:15,750
to come back from the ski company by the end of December

2430
03:04:15,750 --> 03:04:17,390
to hit that master plan requirement,

2431
03:04:17,950 --> 03:04:20,610
but it's going to be, it's not automatic in their mind,

2432
03:04:20,710 --> 03:04:21,250
that's for sure.

2433
03:04:23,450 --> 03:04:25,210
There's a number of funding sources they want us

2434
03:04:25,210 --> 03:04:29,390
to look at. There's a lot of expansion ideas of the GID. There's a lot of different things.

2435
03:04:29,650 --> 03:04:37,790
And so, anyhow, that is still being worked on actively, but this budget does not reflect

2436
03:04:37,790 --> 03:04:39,270
the X. We don't have an agreement on place.

2437
03:04:39,470 --> 03:04:41,190
And it won't impact this budget, probably.

2438
03:04:41,490 --> 03:04:47,750
I mean, theoretically, I guess, if we struck a deal and got to work, potentially, but

2439
03:04:51,750 --> 03:05:00,310
I mean what point does it make sense for the GID to take over operations of the skittles?

2440
03:05:01,930 --> 03:05:07,470
Will we pay for it? What do you mean? Rather than having the ski company run it.

2441
03:05:08,070 --> 03:05:11,450
Well they're trained to do it, so the town would have to hire...

2442
03:05:11,450 --> 03:05:16,690
That would mean off the cup that'd be tough because I don't know how to run a ski lift

2443
03:05:16,690 --> 03:05:20,890
Tonight I'd have to hire someone to do that and there's just a level of expertise that

2444
03:05:20,890 --> 03:05:21,530
we don't have.

2445
03:05:23,010 --> 03:05:25,710
But would it be the town or would it be the GID?

2446
03:05:27,150 --> 03:05:30,890
Yeah, I mean it would be the GID funding it and I'm assuming the GID would then contract

2447
03:05:30,890 --> 03:05:35,570
with the town just like the GID contracts with the town for the finance department

2448
03:05:35,570 --> 03:05:39,710
and the town manager and legal, I mean it's the same people just a different funding

2449
03:05:39,710 --> 03:05:40,110
source.

2450
03:05:41,610 --> 03:05:46,970
And if we hired – I don't know how many employees it takes to run that, but two on

2451
03:05:46,970 --> 03:05:50,950
the bottom, two on the – I would imagine it takes at least six people to run that as

2452
03:05:50,950 --> 03:05:51,910
many hours as it does.

2453
03:05:52,850 --> 03:05:58,390
I mean, it would just take – we could work through that, but we've never even considered

2454
03:05:58,390 --> 03:05:59,030
it to this point.

2455
03:06:00,170 --> 03:06:05,670
And I have to go back and reread the operating agreement, the 2004 operating agreement.

2456
03:06:05,670 --> 03:06:11,430
But I think what it says is Key Company runs it and the GID pays for it, but I'd have to go back.

2457
03:06:11,650 --> 03:06:14,810
There's decades of agreements behind that.

2458
03:06:15,010 --> 03:06:18,230
And so I'm not even close to preparing to answer that question.

2459
03:06:19,270 --> 03:06:19,710
Okay.

2460
03:06:21,750 --> 03:06:30,030
And so the last thing for tonight is you've got a lot of information at our last budget meeting

2461
03:06:30,030 --> 03:06:33,050
for all the changes that were occurring in the budget.

2462
03:06:33,050 --> 03:06:38,130
and you know we hit some of these beginning pages in the budget which

2463
03:06:38,130 --> 03:06:45,450
actually you know summarizes a lot of information and if we're going to do the

2464
03:06:45,450 --> 03:06:51,170
CIP next week I just want to make sure that after you've looked at the packet

2465
03:06:51,170 --> 03:06:58,730
now for maybe two weeks and if you had any other questions on anything else in

2466
03:06:58,730 --> 03:07:06,470
the packet. Don't assume that we won't have some next week on this. This is it. Speak now.

2467
03:07:06,850 --> 03:07:10,170
And I'll ask questions to smidge differences. If there's something you want more information

2468
03:07:10,170 --> 03:07:15,190
on or more detail, we just need to, I mean, if you tell us in advance, we could be prepped

2469
03:07:15,190 --> 03:07:19,150
for you. I have one that, not directly what we've

2470
03:07:19,150 --> 03:07:23,270
looked at, but something I'd like you to do some research for our next meeting.

2471
03:07:24,090 --> 03:07:26,370
And this has to do with the rodeo.

2472
03:07:27,370 --> 03:07:30,810
We've heard from the community people are not happy with the way it looks.

2473
03:07:31,550 --> 03:07:34,610
I like to have some money in the budget for next year

2474
03:07:35,270 --> 03:07:38,010
to do major landscaping around it.

2475
03:07:39,990 --> 03:07:42,490
Look at maybe painting the stands

2476
03:07:43,490 --> 03:07:47,070
and having some sort of a gate at the entrance

2477
03:07:47,070 --> 03:07:51,590
off of the roundabout so you just don't look into the dirt field.

2478
03:07:52,490 --> 03:07:58,490
My guess would probably be $250,000 for something like all that, but I think we should look at it.

2479
03:07:58,490 --> 03:07:59,650
We'd get some money in the budget.

2480
03:08:00,070 --> 03:08:08,810
And I'd be curious about some kind of awnings to go over the stands.

2481
03:08:09,830 --> 03:08:16,950
There are good examples of organic, like, structured, structural options.

2482
03:08:17,150 --> 03:08:19,770
That can give it a more organic, I know it's big,

2483
03:08:19,770 --> 03:08:27,270
But I'd be curious to know about that because that's another way to kind of lessen the the visual impact. I think it'll make it look bigger, actually.

2484
03:08:27,830 --> 03:08:34,570
Well, I'll show you the example that I'm talking about. Yeah, if we're bringing that topic into the conversation.

2485
03:08:35,270 --> 03:08:43,710
I know the Parks, Open Space and Trails poster committee started that discussion last week. And so they have the same concept.

2486
03:08:43,710 --> 03:08:48,130
and so next week if you guys say hey we know there's not a solution yet but let's

2487
03:08:48,130 --> 03:08:52,510
plug in pick your dollar amount for and we're just taking a number I hope you

2488
03:08:52,510 --> 03:08:55,690
have a little more information we just started last week so I don't have a

2489
03:08:55,690 --> 03:08:58,930
whole lot of numbers yet but yeah we knew that's a topic of conversation and

2490
03:08:58,930 --> 03:09:03,090
I mean obviously you know painting is an option and for sure you can paint

2491
03:09:03,090 --> 03:09:08,210
aluminum but I mean that would that kind of feedback next week we don't

2492
03:09:08,210 --> 03:09:11,650
need to solve it but let's get some money in the budget if we all agree

2493
03:09:11,650 --> 03:09:15,830
As you as a council say yes, we should find some way to make that grandstand appearance

2494
03:09:15,830 --> 03:09:19,390
less and whatever, that's great direction and we can plug something in.

2495
03:09:19,470 --> 03:09:23,590
Do I like to hear what the poster board came up with last week?

2496
03:09:23,790 --> 03:09:27,990
Well, they literally threw, one of the poster board members told me, they just kind of

2497
03:09:27,990 --> 03:09:31,710
threw it out at the end as like food for thought, like start thinking about it.

2498
03:09:31,870 --> 03:09:34,810
So I'm sure it's probably going to be a discussion for the next time.

2499
03:09:34,810 --> 03:09:38,650
I know it was a late agenda item and I know that the meeting went way long and

2500
03:09:38,650 --> 03:09:39,530
I, yes.

2501
03:09:39,530 --> 03:09:45,170
It was more like think about it come back with some ideas. It is a topic that they're interested in let's think about enough

2502
03:09:45,170 --> 03:09:49,530
That we can put a number in the budget, you know, but I think we I think we really should

2503
03:09:50,250 --> 03:09:56,010
Think about like what that entryway is gonna look like because I mean

2504
03:09:56,630 --> 03:10:01,330
We saw some drafts where there was there was much more of a kind of a facade

2505
03:10:01,830 --> 03:10:08,610
When you came around the roundabout and I think even if there's like some planting on the corner of the

2506
03:10:09,270 --> 03:10:14,070
I think that was softening it, but I think there's, you know, I think there's some stuff

2507
03:10:14,070 --> 03:10:16,930
that we can do to just kind of make that experience better.

2508
03:10:17,790 --> 03:10:19,250
Like I said, we're doing this solvable.

2509
03:10:19,450 --> 03:10:23,690
Let's have a reasonable number in the budget so we can work on it next year.

2510
03:10:24,930 --> 03:10:27,490
We, whoever here can work on it next year.

2511
03:10:31,500 --> 03:10:33,700
That's a great example of those kinds of projects.

2512
03:10:33,860 --> 03:10:36,660
If you've got to plug them in, yes, please, let's know it's a priority.

2513
03:10:38,820 --> 03:10:42,840
I apologize, I wasn't here at the last meeting, so I have a question that might have already

2514
03:10:42,840 --> 03:10:53,520
been, I don't think it was, but with the snow mass in exterior, so there's carryover from

2515
03:10:53,520 --> 03:11:00,260
this past year, what was accomplished and what was budgeted for last year for the exterior

2516
03:11:00,260 --> 03:11:01,820
improvements on this?

2517
03:11:02,620 --> 03:11:05,540
$2 million total is budgeted to date.

2518
03:11:06,040 --> 03:11:07,380
The only thing that's been completed is the roof.

2519
03:11:07,980 --> 03:11:11,000
When we put the budget, which was $200,000 or $300,000.

2520
03:11:12,080 --> 03:11:12,400
Originally?

2521
03:11:12,940 --> 03:11:14,320
No, we just did the roof this last year.

2522
03:11:14,800 --> 03:11:16,940
Let me just say $300,000, I can't remember the number.

2523
03:11:17,580 --> 03:11:20,180
And so what we were hoping to do is get much further along

2524
03:11:20,180 --> 03:11:22,160
in the rails and the doors.

2525
03:11:22,800 --> 03:11:26,300
And when we put it out to bid, we learned that we didn't have

2526
03:11:26,300 --> 03:11:27,740
the details that the contractors needed.

2527
03:11:27,880 --> 03:11:29,080
So we needed to pull the bid back.

2528
03:11:29,680 --> 03:11:31,220
And so we were, when we put the budget together,

2529
03:11:31,220 --> 03:11:36,620
We anticipated having a million spent and a million to go and I don't think we're gonna have that million spent this year

2530
03:11:36,620 --> 03:11:38,440
And so we will end up rolling over

2531
03:11:38,440 --> 03:11:45,120
1.7 million or one I can't remember the roof cost but that difference we will roll over more money to next year's project

2532
03:11:45,120 --> 03:11:54,460
And so that's exterior improvements. Will that include landscape? Yes improvements along the pathway of the benefit and so I think we've got

2533
03:11:55,200 --> 03:11:56,560
I'm doing the budget from my head

2534
03:11:56,560 --> 03:11:59,520
It's like about 250 or 200 for that park area.

2535
03:11:59,960 --> 03:12:02,740
And if you've been up there in the last two weeks or so,

2536
03:12:03,220 --> 03:12:04,500
we have started doing this.

2537
03:12:04,560 --> 03:12:06,840
There's this significant clenering, whatever.

2538
03:12:07,480 --> 03:12:09,360
We know the water feature needs to be improved.

2539
03:12:10,300 --> 03:12:12,260
If you've been there before, the stairway,

2540
03:12:12,700 --> 03:12:13,600
of course you've been there before,

2541
03:12:13,740 --> 03:12:16,140
but I mean, if the stairway used to end in the cul-de-sac

2542
03:12:16,680 --> 03:12:18,620
and snow would always get pushed over into that

2543
03:12:18,620 --> 03:12:19,500
and so it didn't work,

2544
03:12:19,980 --> 03:12:22,040
that stairway is gonna be moved to end up

2545
03:12:22,040 --> 03:12:24,060
closer to the front door of the snow mess in.

2546
03:12:24,060 --> 03:12:28,520
And so that that stairway can become a year-round, that walkway can become year-round.

2547
03:12:29,180 --> 03:12:32,060
So all those kinds of things are being worked through right now.

2548
03:12:32,380 --> 03:12:39,580
And will that budget expand to include further improvements down the Benedict Trail, or is

2549
03:12:39,580 --> 03:12:41,000
that just that?

2550
03:12:41,380 --> 03:12:46,600
The way the council appropriated it was snow mess in, so it's just that block, call it.

2551
03:12:46,920 --> 03:12:52,440
And do we have anything in the budget for anything more on Benedict Trail?

2552
03:12:53,040 --> 03:12:53,540
Not right now.

2553
03:12:54,180 --> 03:12:57,580
Essentially right now it's private property, not essentially, it is private property.

2554
03:12:58,760 --> 03:13:03,900
So if you all said, hey, we want to really find ways to improve the Benedict Trail,

2555
03:13:04,940 --> 03:13:09,180
we could start doing that, but at this point it's all that property.

2556
03:13:09,360 --> 03:13:11,840
There's an easement that you can walk through on the sidewalk,

2557
03:13:12,300 --> 03:13:16,140
but we don't own anything to make improvements to besides because we bought the inn,

2558
03:13:16,740 --> 03:13:17,780
we own that property there.

2559
03:13:19,760 --> 03:13:22,300
But again, that would be another good example if you said, hey,

2560
03:13:22,300 --> 03:13:28,140
this is something we want to be looking at start planning for and thinking about I

2561
03:13:28,140 --> 03:13:31,520
mean there could be easements acquired and all sorts of ways to do things but

2562
03:13:31,520 --> 03:13:35,540
that needs to be a priority set by y'all I mean honestly I think it's an

2563
03:13:35,540 --> 03:13:39,520
incredible experience for visitors and locals alike and we used to use it all

2564
03:13:39,520 --> 03:13:43,680
the time and now it's not connected anymore it's disconnected and it

2565
03:13:43,680 --> 03:13:49,920
really I think could be an incredible walkable feature to our town that

2566
03:13:49,920 --> 03:13:54,700
keep you off the sidewalk from you know I agree as a kid I used to do that for the

2567
03:13:54,700 --> 03:13:59,860
time right but the question now is because everybody's different attitudes about

2568
03:13:59,860 --> 03:14:05,640
strangers and stuff that you know with the people that own those easements or

2569
03:14:05,640 --> 03:14:11,960
own that area that we need to walk through are they agreeable to improving

2570
03:14:11,960 --> 03:14:17,480
it or they saying we don't want people from our house yeah I think that would

2571
03:14:17,480 --> 03:14:26,540
be step one yeah well we had a walk-through scheduled I mean it's it's

2572
03:14:26,540 --> 03:14:31,320
a way different trail now than it was yeah it's just it really does go close

2573
03:14:31,320 --> 03:14:37,500
to a lot of condos there's you know it's just like some you know some stone

2574
03:14:37,500 --> 03:14:44,500
steps in places it's not yeah it's not what it once was but it could be I

2575
03:14:44,500 --> 03:14:45,720
I mean, if we wanted it to be.

2576
03:14:45,880 --> 03:14:48,640
So really the question would be, should we put some money

2577
03:14:48,640 --> 03:14:51,840
into the budget to study it, like $100,000 or so?

2578
03:14:52,080 --> 03:14:53,360
And so you've done that.

2579
03:14:53,640 --> 03:14:55,600
If you remember when we did the Connect in the Nodes, which

2580
03:14:55,600 --> 03:14:58,000
we put, I think, believe $400,000 to start with,

2581
03:14:58,580 --> 03:14:59,960
that's one of the nodes in the bank.

2582
03:15:19,980 --> 03:15:24,920
We have dollars for next, that will be in next year's budget?

2583
03:15:25,280 --> 03:15:27,440
I'm too far off the cup, but yes, I think we could.

2584
03:15:27,680 --> 03:15:29,220
But again, if that's something to think about,

2585
03:15:29,340 --> 03:15:31,960
let us come back to you with a plan and we can say,

2586
03:15:32,040 --> 03:15:33,240
here's what we think we should do with this.

2587
03:15:37,250 --> 03:15:39,190
Why don't you just, at the next meeting,

2588
03:15:39,450 --> 03:15:42,590
just throw out at something that is what we might consider.

2589
03:15:42,670 --> 03:15:44,650
And what I'm hoping is that I remember this correctly

2590
03:15:44,650 --> 03:15:47,310
and we've got a big chunk and we just need to execute

2591
03:15:47,310 --> 03:15:49,390
the next phase of that plan to get the next phase going.

2592
03:15:49,650 --> 03:15:49,950
Okay.

2593
03:15:50,370 --> 03:15:50,770
All right.

2594
03:15:50,890 --> 03:15:52,550
But I don't want to commit to that without remembering.

2595
03:15:53,350 --> 03:15:55,530
Well, in the meantime, it might be interesting to just

2596
03:15:55,530 --> 03:16:02,710
explore, you know, what accessible routes we even could accomplish to connect that if

2597
03:16:02,710 --> 03:16:08,630
it's not, you can't connect it because we've got private entities that are not going to

2598
03:16:08,630 --> 03:16:12,150
welcome that then it might be a moot point, but it'll be interesting.

2599
03:16:12,230 --> 03:16:16,290
Right, and that's why if I'm remembering a right in our dollars that first thing we

2600
03:16:16,290 --> 03:16:20,170
might spend money on is let's get an easement, let's do a survey, let's find out where

2601
03:16:20,170 --> 03:16:23,690
all the easements are, let's find out where our rights are, let's find out where

2602
03:16:23,690 --> 03:16:25,450
of those roadblocks may or may not be,

2603
03:16:25,910 --> 03:16:27,410
and that might be that first step.

2604
03:16:27,490 --> 03:16:31,210
I mean, like, how much request do we just get all that information?

2605
03:16:32,190 --> 03:16:34,170
I mean, I think I'd like to see that in the budget.

2606
03:16:35,190 --> 03:16:36,750
And so we'll get some numbers.

2607
03:16:36,930 --> 03:16:38,390
I think I just got the information.

2608
03:16:38,530 --> 03:16:39,910
At least we know what we got.

2609
03:16:40,730 --> 03:16:42,250
Loan of money in there to study it.

2610
03:16:42,250 --> 03:16:44,470
We'll be walking through these next week,

2611
03:16:44,530 --> 03:16:46,610
and Anne will be here as well, so.

2612
03:16:47,110 --> 03:16:49,650
But I think we need to do some outreach to those property

2613
03:16:49,650 --> 03:16:52,570
owners as well, because we don't want to end up

2614
03:16:52,570 --> 03:16:53,050
in a lawsuit.

2615
03:16:53,050 --> 03:17:03,030
Oh, definitely. But I think we first need to understand who owns this. Do we own this? Do they own that? Do we have an easement before we talk to them?

2616
03:17:03,150 --> 03:17:11,090
That's all I'm saying. Let's do our homework, whatever it takes to do that, and then we can talk to people if there's something we want to do. Definitely.

2617
03:17:12,750 --> 03:17:18,550
I just remember I was really excited about it until I went and started walking in and I was like, you know, not sure.

2618
03:17:18,550 --> 03:17:25,110
Recently you mean yeah, I mean it's just because you know what it was you end up being dropped out like in like in a middle

2619
03:17:25,110 --> 03:17:29,770
No, yeah, because they took out those steps and stuff. Yeah, right. I agree

2620
03:17:33,470 --> 03:17:39,730
I'm the agenda for tonight. It did mention the eab request. Are we gonna talk about that?

2621
03:17:40,650 --> 03:17:44,890
Was that tonight or I can't remember it well unless I looked at something wrong

2622
03:17:44,890 --> 03:17:49,570
But you were okay. I'm sorry. I was I'm got disoriented because I was not okay

2623
03:17:49,570 --> 03:17:56,050
It did say that on there. So let me go to that real quick and I'm gonna do that so the obviously the

2624
03:17:57,550 --> 03:18:01,690
EAP obviously that is obvious. They did make a request for a position to y'all

2625
03:18:02,690 --> 03:18:08,530
And I and it was not in the budget and so the idea that I'd like to put forward is that we

2626
03:18:10,030 --> 03:18:13,650
include an additional $300,000 from the REAP fund,

2627
03:18:14,010 --> 03:18:16,230
that's what we talked about, the REAP fund,

2628
03:18:17,230 --> 03:18:19,670
for potential consulting services

2629
03:18:19,670 --> 03:18:21,190
to help reach those goals.

2630
03:18:21,490 --> 03:18:23,070
The third point largely was,

2631
03:18:23,470 --> 03:18:25,930
hey, there's a lot of things we should be doing more of

2632
03:18:26,530 --> 03:18:29,410
and I think we all would all agree,

2633
03:18:29,710 --> 03:18:33,250
making advances towards those goals are a very good idea,

2634
03:18:33,850 --> 03:18:37,270
but hiring a full-time position is difficult.

2635
03:18:37,270 --> 03:18:43,210
And so, if we came back to you all without necessarily a plan of action, but a budget

2636
03:18:43,210 --> 03:18:49,310
number to say, here's a chunk that we could do, and a sustainability plan is, it's either

2637
03:18:49,310 --> 03:18:52,870
eight or 12 steps, and I'm blanking what it is, but there's ways to do that.

2638
03:18:53,330 --> 03:18:57,690
And CORE does, they focus on buildings, and that's two of the 10 potentially.

2639
03:18:58,290 --> 03:19:01,270
And so, maybe we do something with CORE, or maybe we do something with somebody else,

2640
03:19:01,610 --> 03:19:06,090
but we say, okay, what parts of the sustainability plan do you want to tackle,

2641
03:19:06,090 --> 03:19:11,810
and work with the AB on that and use it as a consulting service rather than a full-time employee.

2642
03:19:13,550 --> 03:19:18,810
I'm going to agree with that. I think it's hard to bring somebody in that role

2643
03:19:18,810 --> 03:19:22,110
and give them real authority into an existing organization.

2644
03:19:22,610 --> 03:19:24,410
Well, not necessarily have a whole department.

2645
03:19:24,770 --> 03:19:28,310
I mean, when you look up city of Aspen and they have like 10 people or something like that.

2646
03:19:28,310 --> 03:19:29,230
Yeah, but evolve over time.

2647
03:19:29,570 --> 03:19:33,830
Right. I mean, it's like two hours of Greg's week.

2648
03:19:35,110 --> 03:19:45,670
But did you, does EAB have you discussed this idea with them versus like hiring a full-time

2649
03:19:45,670 --> 03:19:46,090
person?

2650
03:19:46,490 --> 03:19:46,930
I have not.

2651
03:19:47,190 --> 03:19:50,890
I mean, I think one of their points when they came to talk to us is they just wanted to

2652
03:19:50,890 --> 03:19:55,790
make sure there was someone that was here that was sort of coordinating between all the

2653
03:19:55,790 --> 03:19:56,470
different departments.

2654
03:19:56,650 --> 03:19:59,690
I mean, that was my takeaway from what they said when they came.

2655
03:20:00,830 --> 03:20:05,190
Yes, that's how I understand it also, and I honestly think that would be a very difficult

2656
03:20:05,190 --> 03:20:06,450
position to hire for.

2657
03:20:06,990 --> 03:20:11,490
And I mean, to the director's credit, I mean, you can talk to Julie or Ann, when they think

2658
03:20:11,490 --> 03:20:17,110
about their projects, they do think about environmental issues, and that's when we're doing the

2659
03:20:17,110 --> 03:20:20,110
design for housing, we know that we should be going towards electrical.

2660
03:20:20,850 --> 03:20:24,930
These are not foreign concepts to any of us, and so I don't know if that coordination

2661
03:20:24,930 --> 03:20:25,770
needs to happen.

2662
03:20:25,770 --> 03:20:30,330
And I think somebody telling us what's the best next step would be great.

2663
03:20:30,650 --> 03:20:33,450
I mean, we know that our biggest carbon footprint,

2664
03:20:33,790 --> 03:20:35,950
the biggest component of our carbon footprint is building heat.

2665
03:20:36,390 --> 03:20:37,710
And so how do you get rid of that?

2666
03:20:38,110 --> 03:20:39,510
You green it up with electricity.

2667
03:20:39,870 --> 03:20:40,450
And how to do that?

2668
03:20:40,590 --> 03:20:42,610
It takes physical dollars to convert.

2669
03:20:42,770 --> 03:20:43,490
It just takes money.

2670
03:20:44,650 --> 03:20:46,250
Well, isn't this really what we did with CORE?

2671
03:20:47,810 --> 03:20:50,110
Well, they explored four buildings.

2672
03:20:50,350 --> 03:20:52,970
So yeah, CORE has recently, in the last month,

2673
03:20:52,970 --> 03:20:58,190
giving us an assessment on how to do one of our buildings in, I believe, three private

2674
03:20:58,190 --> 03:21:03,690
buildings, and how do you do that, and so that is done, and CORE would be happy to continue

2675
03:21:03,690 --> 03:21:04,290
that forward.

2676
03:21:04,910 --> 03:21:09,810
It's expensive, or I think there's other components of sustainability.

2677
03:21:11,390 --> 03:21:15,950
There's composting, there's lots of, like I said, there's ten other ways we can go,

2678
03:21:16,610 --> 03:21:20,750
and if CORE's the answer, then the AB can say, hey, let's get CORE to do the buildings.

2679
03:21:20,750 --> 03:21:25,430
If that's where we want to make that investment, they can make that recommendation and I'm

2680
03:21:25,430 --> 03:21:30,090
just kind of saying rather than hiring a person to kind of work through these things, this

2681
03:21:30,090 --> 03:21:34,090
might be the perfect chance to bring in a consultant to help us lead that effort, whatever

2682
03:21:34,090 --> 03:21:38,670
it might be, whether it's core with building sustainability, whether it's something else

2683
03:21:38,670 --> 03:21:39,610
that we find is a good idea.

2684
03:21:39,630 --> 03:21:46,030
It might be a good workshop session early in the year with EAB and if we want to

2685
03:21:46,030 --> 03:21:50,110
bring a consultant or a facility, but just look at all the things that we're doing,

2686
03:21:50,110 --> 03:21:56,290
all things we could be doing and set some priorities and direction instead of just sort of not quite

2687
03:21:56,290 --> 03:22:02,930
clear what we're doing. Maybe hear from department heads too on where they're at. I feel like part

2688
03:22:02,930 --> 03:22:10,610
of what they were looking for is accountability meaning you know we don't just say oh yes we

2689
03:22:10,610 --> 03:22:19,950
want to do that but there's some ways to measure or you know even police how we're doing things

2690
03:22:19,950 --> 03:22:27,670
And so, as long as a consultant can provide that I feel like then that could be accomplishing

2691
03:22:28,570 --> 03:22:30,130
what they maybe want to see.

2692
03:22:32,390 --> 03:22:37,390
And accountability, I don't know that a consultant can do that, but I mean it's, like somebody

2693
03:22:37,390 --> 03:22:42,070
observed earlier, we don't put a lot of staff time towards it, I mean it's just, we haven't.

2694
03:22:42,210 --> 03:22:46,370
And so if you all said this is going to be a priority and we're going to spend more

2695
03:22:46,370 --> 03:22:47,350
on it, we can do that.

2696
03:22:47,530 --> 03:22:49,350
That's where you guys get paid the big bucks for.

2697
03:22:49,350 --> 03:22:53,850
Well, I feel like they could say this is how you do accountability, not necessarily.

2698
03:22:54,090 --> 03:22:55,210
They would be the ones doing it.

2699
03:22:55,550 --> 03:23:02,190
But again, that's why after knowing that you received the presentation, assuming you'd

2700
03:23:02,190 --> 03:23:07,590
want some kind of way to be responsive to that request, the idea was let's use REAP

2701
03:23:07,590 --> 03:23:09,670
dollars and use an outside consultant.

2702
03:23:09,950 --> 03:23:11,550
And again, that was my response.

2703
03:23:12,970 --> 03:23:16,470
I love to have a work session where we just sort of can talk about all the stuff

2704
03:23:16,470 --> 03:23:21,470
up at VAB here unless you have a free willing sort of conversation.

2705
03:23:21,930 --> 03:23:24,070
And are we going to get a report from CORE on those?

2706
03:23:24,610 --> 03:23:25,110
We've got it.

2707
03:23:25,130 --> 03:23:25,870
I've got it in my e-mail.

2708
03:23:26,390 --> 03:23:27,750
We can forward it on to you for sure.

2709
03:23:28,270 --> 03:23:31,410
But let's, I think we should put it on the agenda so we can review it.

2710
03:23:32,930 --> 03:23:35,310
Oh, let me get it to you to read first and then a little bit.

2711
03:23:35,370 --> 03:23:36,550
And if you still want to do that.

2712
03:23:36,610 --> 03:23:37,070
It's lengthy.

2713
03:23:37,990 --> 03:23:38,690
I mean, I'm sorry.

2714
03:23:39,210 --> 03:23:39,910
Let me get it to you.

2715
03:23:40,090 --> 03:23:41,150
I'll email it to you tomorrow.

2716
03:23:41,430 --> 03:23:43,410
I just want to make sure if we're making that kind of investment,

2717
03:23:43,610 --> 03:23:44,690
we're getting something out of it.

2718
03:23:45,230 --> 03:23:49,690
And so let me forward it to you, and then once you guys want to get it scheduled, absolutely

2719
03:23:49,690 --> 03:23:50,150
we'll do that.

2720
03:23:50,230 --> 03:23:52,950
But I'd like you to look at it first before we get that scheduled.

2721
03:23:53,190 --> 03:23:53,430
Thanks.

2722
03:23:56,180 --> 03:23:56,440
Okay.

2723
03:24:00,450 --> 03:24:01,170
Anything else?

2724
03:24:04,790 --> 03:24:05,050
Yeah.

2725
03:24:05,290 --> 03:24:09,430
And to make an answer point, if there is other things or whatever that we try to find

2726
03:24:09,430 --> 03:24:13,010
that sweet spot between not killing anyone's insides and making sure you get the detail

2727
03:24:13,010 --> 03:24:13,310
you want.

2728
03:24:13,430 --> 03:24:15,450
So if there are other things, please let us know.

2729
03:24:15,750 --> 03:24:19,750
Otherwise, next week will be capital improvement budget.

2730
03:24:20,710 --> 03:24:21,110
Okay.

2731
03:24:22,490 --> 03:24:23,190
Okay.

2732
03:24:23,590 --> 03:24:24,410
Alright. Thank you.

2733
03:24:25,030 --> 03:24:26,690
Thank you. Thank you both.

2734
03:24:28,860 --> 03:24:30,920
Alright. We're adjourned.

2735
03:24:31,260 --> 03:24:32,460
We're adjourned. Thank you.

2736
03:24:32,880 --> 03:24:34,560
Alright. Thanks everybody.