1 00:00:06,799 --> 00:00:09,360 We ready to go, Julie? 2 00:00:09,360 --> 00:00:11,840 Okay. 3 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:15,200 This is the call to order for the April 4 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:18,960 15, 2026 meeting of the Town of Woodside 5 00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:21,119 Planning Commission. We'll start with 6 00:00:21,119 --> 00:00:45,030 the Pledge of Allegiance. 7 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:46,719 Roll call, please. 8 00:00:46,719 --> 00:00:47,680 >> Chair Weaver, 9 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:48,399 >> present. 10 00:00:48,399 --> 00:00:49,840 >> Vice Chair Gar. 11 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:51,440 >> Commissioner Evans. 12 00:00:51,440 --> 00:00:53,120 >> Commissioner Gonko here. 13 00:00:53,120 --> 00:01:01,270 >> And Commissioner Tober is noted absent. 14 00:01:01,280 --> 00:01:03,840 Are there any changes to the agenda as 15 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:07,510 published? 16 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:09,439 » There are no changes to the agenda. Uh 17 00:01:09,439 --> 00:01:11,280 you do have desk items for the one 18 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:12,720 public hearing item we have tonight and 19 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:13,760 I'll go through that during the 20 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:16,240 presentation. 21 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:19,200 >> Um given there are no changes to the 22 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:21,920 agenda, we will move on to the public 23 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:26,560 comment period. This is a chance for 24 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:29,040 people to make public comments about 25 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:31,840 items which are not on tonight's agenda, 26 00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:33,600 but which are of interest to the town of 27 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:36,240 Woodside and its planning commission. 28 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:39,600 Um, public comments are limited to five 29 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:42,159 speakers maximum of three minutes each 30 00:01:42,159 --> 00:01:44,400 at the beginning of the meeting and if 31 00:01:44,400 --> 00:01:48,960 we have more um um speakers, those would 32 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,040 be deferred to the end of the meeting. 33 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:53,759 Items not on the agenda cannot be 34 00:01:53,759 --> 00:01:55,759 addressed in detail or acted upon 35 00:01:55,759 --> 00:01:58,479 tonight, but can be referred to staff 36 00:01:58,479 --> 00:02:02,479 and potentially put on a future agenda. 37 00:02:02,479 --> 00:02:05,119 So, given those restrictions, is there 38 00:02:05,119 --> 00:02:08,080 anyone present in the room or on Zoom 39 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:10,560 that would like to speak on a topic not 40 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:14,710 on tonight's agenda? 41 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:17,760 » We have three raised hands online. Um, 42 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:23,430 I'm going to start with FAD. 43 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:27,830 » Hello. Can you hear me? 44 00:02:27,840 --> 00:02:28,720 » Yes. 45 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:31,120 >> Hello. 46 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:32,400 Can you hear me? 47 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:35,040 >> Yes, we can hear you. 48 00:02:35,040 --> 00:02:38,720 >> Yes. My name is Fad and I need your 49 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:42,160 help. I'm feeling very weak. I haven't 50 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:46,160 been able to get up off the floor for 45 51 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:50,400 minutes to an hour. I ate Del Taco and 52 00:02:50,400 --> 00:03:16,149 now 53 00:03:16,159 --> 00:03:25,350 Okay, let's move on to the next speaker. 54 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:31,670 » Let's go ahead and mute that speaker. 55 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:41,830 PLEASE mute the Thank you. Thank you. 56 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:48,229 And let's move on to our third speaker. 57 00:03:48,239 --> 00:04:06,390 Okay, the next speaker is Ben Rodriguez. 58 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:10,000 Okay. Um, 59 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,439 please mute, please mute that speaker. 60 00:04:13,439 --> 00:04:16,639 Um, is there anyone present in the room 61 00:04:16,639 --> 00:04:19,440 that would like to speak on a topic not 62 00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:21,680 on tonight's agenda, but which is 63 00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:23,440 relevant to the town of Woodside or its 64 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:31,189 planning commission? 65 00:04:31,199 --> 00:04:34,720 Uh there being no raised hands or anyone 66 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:36,720 stepping up to the microphone, we will 67 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:39,840 at this point close the public comment 68 00:04:39,840 --> 00:04:41,360 period. 69 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:43,120 And I believe the next item on the 70 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:45,759 agenda is a presentation from Hip 71 00:04:45,759 --> 00:04:51,510 Housing. 72 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:52,720 » Okay. 73 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:55,600 You can um use the red lever and 74 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:57,680 move the microphone up and down so it's 75 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:02,629 at a convenient height for you. 76 00:05:02,639 --> 00:05:03,520 » Oh, okay. 77 00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:06,720 >> Is that better? I don't know if it's 78 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:08,320 >> It's on. 79 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:11,199 >> Okay, it's on. All right, great. Um, 80 00:05:11,199 --> 00:05:12,479 good evening, commissioners. My name is 81 00:05:12,479 --> 00:05:14,160 Laura Finuki. I'm the director of 82 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:15,919 programs at HIP Housing. I want to thank 83 00:05:15,919 --> 00:05:18,080 Sage for inviting me to your meeting 84 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:19,600 tonight. I have a short presentation 85 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:21,360 about the work that HIP Housing does in 86 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:23,759 the community. Um, so Julie's going to 87 00:05:23,759 --> 00:05:26,160 be advancing our slides. So, um, HIPP 88 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:28,240 housing, uh, st HIP stands for human 89 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:29,840 investment project. That's the legal 90 00:05:29,840 --> 00:05:32,160 name of our organization. Um, and our 91 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:34,240 mission is to invest in human potential 92 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:36,240 by improving the housing and lives of 93 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:38,000 people here in San Monteo County. We've 94 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:40,160 been doing that work um, for over 50 95 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:45,029 years. Next slide. 96 00:05:45,039 --> 00:05:47,680 So, HIP Housing offers four housing 97 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:49,680 programs and we also own and manage 98 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:50,880 properties. So, I'm going to touch 99 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:53,120 briefly on each one. Our first program 100 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:56,000 is our housing resource hub. Um, we take 101 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:59,120 in about uh 3,000 calls a year from 102 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:01,199 members of the community that want to 103 00:06:01,199 --> 00:06:03,759 learn about hip housing andor affordable 104 00:06:03,759 --> 00:06:06,160 housing here in San Monteo County. And 105 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:08,400 so, we create resources to share that 106 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:11,520 information with them. We have a weekly 107 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:13,440 community eblast where we list 108 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:16,160 affordable housing openings and we email 109 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:18,560 that out to the community. Um, we also 110 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:20,960 create a Google site where we list 111 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:22,800 update every two weeks affordable 112 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:25,360 housing waiting list openings. And then 113 00:06:25,360 --> 00:06:27,600 we have a resource packet that we 114 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:29,759 provide clients um that contact our 115 00:06:29,759 --> 00:06:31,919 organization that help them navigate how 116 00:06:31,919 --> 00:06:33,600 to apply to the county subsidized 117 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:35,759 housing portal, how to apply to the 118 00:06:35,759 --> 00:06:38,160 doorway portal, which is a portal that 119 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:40,160 um announces affordable housing waiting 120 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:42,240 list openings and then also HIP 121 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,759 housing's portal. Next slide. 122 00:06:45,759 --> 00:06:48,639 Our housing readiness program is rel uh 123 00:06:48,639 --> 00:06:50,479 relatively new. We started this program 124 00:06:50,479 --> 00:06:53,199 about two years ago in the response to 125 00:06:53,199 --> 00:06:55,680 the fact that we were seeing many many 126 00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:57,680 older adults, very low-income older 127 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:00,319 adults who didn't qualify income-wise 128 00:07:00,319 --> 00:07:02,880 for our home sharing program but still 129 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:05,039 needed help with finding housing in our 130 00:07:05,039 --> 00:07:07,360 community. Um we find that most older 131 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:09,360 adults have been in stable housing for 132 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:11,599 many years and then suddenly something 133 00:07:11,599 --> 00:07:13,360 has happened. either the landlord that 134 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:14,800 they were living with has moved out of 135 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,120 the area or their housing is getting 136 00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:19,280 sold or their rent's being raised and 137 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:21,360 they're suddenly plunged into Sano 138 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:23,599 County's kind of crazy housing market 139 00:07:23,599 --> 00:07:26,720 and learning how to navigate that. So, 140 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:28,880 we meet with clients to help them 141 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:31,199 understand what they're eligible for and 142 00:07:31,199 --> 00:07:33,280 help them apply to this the county 143 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:35,759 subsidized housing portal and also the 144 00:07:35,759 --> 00:07:38,240 doorway portal. Um, we have a 145 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:39,840 collaboration with the Department of 146 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,560 Housing, um, where we actually have some 147 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:45,280 scholarship funding to provide a housing 148 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:47,120 scholarship to an older adult that's 149 00:07:47,120 --> 00:07:48,960 exiting one of the county operated 150 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:51,199 shelters. Um, the county is having a 151 00:07:51,199 --> 00:07:53,680 really hard time moving clients out of 152 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:55,759 the shelters for their intended purpose 153 00:07:55,759 --> 00:07:58,639 of stay, which is mostly like 90 days. 154 00:07:58,639 --> 00:08:00,479 um we find that older adults don't have 155 00:08:00,479 --> 00:08:02,879 the ability to increase their income and 156 00:08:02,879 --> 00:08:05,680 so they remain in the shelters and so 157 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:07,919 our housing scholarship helps to move 158 00:08:07,919 --> 00:08:09,360 out of the shelters into something 159 00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:11,759 that's more permanent and affordable. So 160 00:08:11,759 --> 00:08:13,840 this is a relatively new program of ours 161 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:16,240 and we're seeing it grow exponentially 162 00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:17,919 with the number of seniors that are 163 00:08:17,919 --> 00:08:19,680 experiencing homelessness for the first 164 00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:23,199 time. Okay, next slide. Our third 165 00:08:23,199 --> 00:08:25,280 program is our self-sufficiency program. 166 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:26,879 This is a program for low-income 167 00:08:26,879 --> 00:08:29,199 families with dependent children. Um we 168 00:08:29,199 --> 00:08:31,280 provide housing and coaching support for 169 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:34,000 a year to five years um for the adults 170 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:36,080 that are enrolled in school or a 171 00:08:36,080 --> 00:08:38,479 vocational program. Uh we have some 172 00:08:38,479 --> 00:08:40,320 families that are living independently 173 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:42,240 in their own unit here in San Mato 174 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:44,399 County and we help to provide a housing 175 00:08:44,399 --> 00:08:46,160 scholarship for them while they're in 176 00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,120 school. And then Hip Housing also owns 177 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:51,440 three houses that we built. Two are in 178 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:53,760 Redwood City and one is in San Carlos. 179 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:55,600 Um they are six-bedroom, three bath 180 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:58,000 homes and we usually have two to three 181 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:00,080 families share the home. Uh the 182 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:01,760 department of housing of San Monteo 183 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,000 County helps to subsidize the rent. So 184 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:05,920 the rent is very affordable for very 185 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:08,240 low-income families. Um so we have some 186 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:09,760 families that start in that housing 187 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:11,440 model and then some families that go 188 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:13,920 into independent living and we provide 189 00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:15,839 coaching and wraparound support for the 190 00:09:15,839 --> 00:09:18,480 families. Uh usually 40 to 50 families a 191 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:20,880 year that we're serving in that program. 192 00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:23,279 Next slide. Uh, so in addition to our 193 00:09:23,279 --> 00:09:24,399 housing programs, I'm going to talk 194 00:09:24,399 --> 00:09:26,320 about our home sharing program last. Um, 195 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:28,959 but we do also own and manage property 196 00:09:28,959 --> 00:09:31,360 here in Sonteo County. We have over 500 197 00:09:31,360 --> 00:09:33,600 units of affordable housing, mostly 198 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:35,200 studio, onebedrooms, and some 199 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:37,519 two-bedroom units. Um, some of the 200 00:09:37,519 --> 00:09:39,519 properties are project based section 8. 201 00:09:39,519 --> 00:09:41,200 So, the tenants pay roughly a third of 202 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:43,519 their income on rent and the other units 203 00:09:43,519 --> 00:09:46,080 are below market rate. We also do 204 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:47,680 property management for various 205 00:09:47,680 --> 00:09:50,080 entities. So we have relationships with 206 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:52,880 the Rotary Club of Sonteo. Uh we manage 207 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:54,480 two of their affordable housing 208 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:56,640 properties, Rotary Hosienda and Rotary 209 00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:59,519 Floritas in Sonteo. Um we also manage 210 00:09:59,519 --> 00:10:01,920 properties for the city of Foster City. 211 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:03,680 And we have some collaborations with 212 00:10:03,680 --> 00:10:05,440 market rate developers that have 213 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:06,880 affordable units within their 214 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:08,720 development and we partner with them to 215 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:10,560 do tenant selection and income 216 00:10:10,560 --> 00:10:12,240 certification. 217 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:13,600 Um, we don't do a lot of new 218 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:15,040 construction, but we do have a new 219 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:16,640 construction project going on right now 220 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:19,200 in downtown San Carlos. Um, we had a 221 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:20,800 six-unit apartment building that we 222 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:22,720 owned for years, and we partnered with 223 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:24,880 the city and Eden Housing, another 224 00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:28,640 nonprofit, uh, to uh, construct 33 units 225 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:30,959 of affordable housing. So, it's going to 226 00:10:30,959 --> 00:10:33,040 be a mix of one, two, and threebedroom 227 00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:34,640 units, which we're really excited about 228 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:36,320 because we don't have any three-bedroom 229 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:38,320 units in our portfolio, and we have very 230 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:40,880 few two-bedroom units. So that um 231 00:10:40,880 --> 00:10:42,399 property is still under construction. 232 00:10:42,399 --> 00:10:44,880 It's right downtown in San Carlos and 233 00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:46,399 hope to be finished with that in 234 00:10:46,399 --> 00:10:49,760 October. Okay, next slide. Um but what 235 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:51,360 we're most known in the community for is 236 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:53,200 our home sharing program. This was the 237 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:54,640 first housing program that the 238 00:10:54,640 --> 00:10:57,760 organization started back in 1979. 239 00:10:57,760 --> 00:10:59,519 And it's a program where we interview 240 00:10:59,519 --> 00:11:01,839 homeowners or renters that have extra 241 00:11:01,839 --> 00:11:04,000 space. Um they either have a room for 242 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:05,760 rent in their home or an accessory 243 00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:08,240 dwelling unit. Um and then we help to 244 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:10,160 match them with a home seeker who 245 00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:12,240 usually of a family size of one or two 246 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:14,800 persons. Um this program serves all of 247 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:17,600 Sonteo County and we get funding support 248 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:19,760 from the town of Woodside and also all 249 00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:22,000 of the cities in Sonteo County including 250 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,880 the county of Sono. We're also included 251 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:28,160 in all of the city's housing elements as 252 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:30,959 a way to provide um affordable housing 253 00:11:30,959 --> 00:11:32,880 options through our home sharing 254 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:35,360 program. Um and we provide technical 255 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:37,200 assistance to other organizations 256 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:38,959 throughout the country that are 257 00:11:38,959 --> 00:11:40,399 interested in starting home sharing 258 00:11:40,399 --> 00:11:42,800 programs in their community. Um in fact 259 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:45,600 here in California we have um have 260 00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:47,519 probably close to 30 home sharing 261 00:11:47,519 --> 00:11:49,680 programs throughout the state and we've 262 00:11:49,680 --> 00:11:51,040 helped a lot of them with their 263 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:52,480 technical assistance and launching 264 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:55,279 programs in their community. We do have 265 00:11:55,279 --> 00:11:57,839 a collaborations sorry my slide got cut 266 00:11:57,839 --> 00:11:59,680 off here. We have collaborations with 267 00:11:59,680 --> 00:12:01,920 the town of Athetherton and Hillsboro. 268 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:04,000 And since creating this presentation, we 269 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,480 also are now partnering with um uh 270 00:12:06,480 --> 00:12:09,200 Portola Valley and San Bruno on their 271 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:12,480 ADU program. So, we have um 272 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:14,480 collaborations where we meet with town 273 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:17,600 staff every month to talk about outreach 274 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:19,680 activities to really increase the 275 00:12:19,680 --> 00:12:21,680 visibility of HIPPO's home sharing 276 00:12:21,680 --> 00:12:24,160 program to encourage homeowners that 277 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:26,880 have ADUs to register them with our home 278 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:29,600 sharing program. um because we can help 279 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:31,920 do the tenant screening, the income 280 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:34,399 certification, help discuss what the 281 00:12:34,399 --> 00:12:36,320 rent is going to be, put together a 282 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:38,399 living together agreement, and are very 283 00:12:38,399 --> 00:12:40,160 involved in the home in the housing 284 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:42,160 arrangement, whether it's a home 285 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:43,760 provider that's renting a room or an 286 00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:46,000 accessory dwelling unit. So, we meet 287 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:47,839 with town staff every month to talk 288 00:12:47,839 --> 00:12:50,000 about outreach. Um we're like for 289 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:52,320 Athetherton, we do a lot of their um 290 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:54,320 events like Earth Day, their national 291 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:57,120 nightouts. Um we partner with like 292 00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,760 school districts in Menllo Park. We do 293 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:02,880 social media uh posts. We do we host 294 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:05,040 home owner homeowner events where we 295 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:06,480 invite the homeowners to come learn 296 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,200 about our program. So we have um a lot 297 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:10,800 of activities that we do in each 298 00:13:10,800 --> 00:13:12,639 jurisdiction to really kind of raise the 299 00:13:12,639 --> 00:13:14,880 visibility of our program um to 300 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:16,880 encourage homeowners with ADUs and 301 00:13:16,880 --> 00:13:20,399 rooms. Uh next slide. Um, so this is 302 00:13:20,399 --> 00:13:23,200 just a a snapshot of of like kind of our 303 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:25,600 screening process if folks really want 304 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:27,519 to understand like what's the difference 305 00:13:27,519 --> 00:13:29,839 between going just doing this online or 306 00:13:29,839 --> 00:13:32,240 finding roommates or tenants in other 307 00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:34,639 ways. But we're very hands-on. So we do 308 00:13:34,639 --> 00:13:36,399 the screening, we do background checks, 309 00:13:36,399 --> 00:13:38,000 we do have reference checks, we do 310 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:40,399 income certifications, we complete a 311 00:13:40,399 --> 00:13:42,399 living together agreement, and we main 312 00:13:42,399 --> 00:13:44,000 maintain follow-up support for the 313 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:45,920 duration of the match. Um, in 314 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:47,519 Athetherton right now, we have two 315 00:13:47,519 --> 00:13:49,360 matches. So, they're both are senior 316 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:51,360 homeowners that have accessory dwelling 317 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:54,320 units. Um, and they're both matched with 318 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:56,800 um older adults. Um, we have one match 319 00:13:56,800 --> 00:13:58,480 in the town of Hillsboro that's been 320 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:00,800 together for almost 6 years. Um, it's 321 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:03,199 with a senior retired couple. They have 322 00:14:03,199 --> 00:14:06,079 a two-bedroom ADU and they rented it to 323 00:14:06,079 --> 00:14:08,560 a local teacher who was in jeopardy of 324 00:14:08,560 --> 00:14:10,320 losing her housing and having to leave 325 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,240 the state. And so now she's been able to 326 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:14,639 remain in her community. Um, so that's 327 00:14:14,639 --> 00:14:16,720 kind of the beauty of of this kind of 328 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:19,920 relationship. Uh, next slide. Again, 329 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:22,320 just some examples of who homeshares. 330 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:24,480 So, we have a lot of school district 331 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:26,880 personnel who are uh registered with our 332 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:29,760 home sharing program. In fact, about 11% 333 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:32,079 of our home seekers uh work for school 334 00:14:32,079 --> 00:14:33,920 districts. Um, so we have a lot of 335 00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:35,760 educators that get recruited to this 336 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:37,440 area, but they they can't find 337 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,760 affordable housing. Um, and so the 338 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:41,600 option of either renting a room or an 339 00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:44,720 ADU becomes much more affordable. Uh, 340 00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:47,040 next slide. 341 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:49,839 Um, and so, you know, for for our home 342 00:14:49,839 --> 00:14:52,560 providers that have the ADU or room for 343 00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:54,880 rent, it really helps to keep them 344 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:57,120 affordable in their own home. We have 345 00:14:57,120 --> 00:15:00,000 most about 60% of our home providers are 346 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,560 older adults. So, they may live alone. 347 00:15:02,560 --> 00:15:05,360 They may be on a retirement income and 348 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,519 they have extra space in their in their 349 00:15:07,519 --> 00:15:09,360 home or they have an accessory dwelling 350 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:11,360 unit and they want to put that empty 351 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:13,680 space to good use. So, this is one way 352 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:16,079 to not only help them remain independent 353 00:15:16,079 --> 00:15:17,920 in their home, but also to help them 354 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:20,320 financially as well. Um, and for our 355 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:22,240 home seekers, you know, the average rent 356 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:24,240 of a one-bedroom apartment here in this 357 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:26,320 community, I mean, we see people that 358 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:29,360 are renting for like 2700 to 3500 for a 359 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:32,160 one-bedroom apartment. And so, our our 360 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:34,160 room rentals and our ADUs are 361 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:36,399 significantly lower cost. And so, it 362 00:15:36,399 --> 00:15:38,480 helps to make make an affordable housing 363 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:40,880 arrangement for them. And it keeps our 364 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:43,120 workforce local. There's a statistic 365 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:45,680 that over 60% of people who work here in 366 00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:47,920 San Monteo County commute from outside 367 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:50,079 of the area. So, it really helps to 368 00:15:50,079 --> 00:15:52,560 maintain the um the viability of our 369 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:55,440 community by keeping our workforce low. 370 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:57,759 Okay, next slide. And this is my contact 371 00:15:57,759 --> 00:16:00,240 information. Um we're happy to partner 372 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:02,240 with the town of Woodside on our 373 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:03,920 affordable housing programs. We thank 374 00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:06,800 the town for our subfunding support and 375 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:08,560 I'm happy to answer any questions if you 376 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:10,800 have any about our organization. Thank 377 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:13,600 you. 378 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:18,310 >> Does anyone have questions for Laura? 379 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:20,800 » So one question. So once again, what is 380 00:16:20,800 --> 00:16:22,880 where does the funding come for your 381 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:23,600 services? 382 00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:26,480 >> Yes. So for our housing programs, it's a 383 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:28,959 variety of funding streams. So we get 384 00:16:28,959 --> 00:16:30,639 support from all the cities here in the 385 00:16:30,639 --> 00:16:32,560 Sanonteo County. We get funding from the 386 00:16:32,560 --> 00:16:34,800 county of Sanonteo. Also, um we have 387 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:38,000 private foundation support. Um we also 388 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:40,000 do, you know, annual events and we have 389 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:42,800 fundraising efforts and donations. Um 390 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:44,639 but what's really important is that that 391 00:16:44,639 --> 00:16:46,399 because we own and manage property here 392 00:16:46,399 --> 00:16:49,600 in Sano County, our rental income also 393 00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:52,320 is a sustainable s source of funding for 394 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:55,199 our programs. So the funding that we 395 00:16:55,199 --> 00:16:57,440 take from our property side helps to pay 396 00:16:57,440 --> 00:16:59,519 for all the administrative costs of our 397 00:16:59,519 --> 00:17:02,160 programs. Um, so that 100% of 398 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:04,079 contributions goes directly to client 399 00:17:04,079 --> 00:17:06,240 services. 400 00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:10,549 >> You 401 00:17:10,559 --> 00:17:12,240 » Laura, thank you very much for your 402 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:15,120 presentation and for the great work that 403 00:17:15,120 --> 00:17:16,640 you folks do in the community. 404 00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:17,839 >> Thank you so much. 405 00:17:17,839 --> 00:17:19,199 >> Thank you, Laura. We'll be in touch. 406 00:17:19,199 --> 00:17:23,189 Thank you. 407 00:17:23,199 --> 00:17:26,000 » Okay. The next item on tonight's agenda 408 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:29,919 would be um the terms of chair and vice 409 00:17:29,919 --> 00:17:31,760 chair of the planning commission run for 410 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:33,520 two-year terms and 411 00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:35,120 >> minute I think we have the minutes 412 00:17:35,120 --> 00:17:36,000 first. 413 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,160 >> Oh whoops. We have a consent calendar 414 00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:41,440 item first which is approval of the 415 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:46,480 minutes of our March 4th 2026 meeting. 416 00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:49,600 So, if any commissioners, members of 417 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:53,679 staff, or members of the public have any 418 00:17:53,679 --> 00:17:57,200 errors, emissions, additions, or 419 00:17:57,200 --> 00:17:59,120 clarifications 420 00:17:59,120 --> 00:18:03,520 that need to be made to the um minutes 421 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:08,160 as published, now is your chance to 422 00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:15,110 um ask that those changes be made. 423 00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:18,000 comes to that we would take a motion to 424 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,600 approve the minutes of the March 4 425 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:20,799 meeting. 426 00:18:20,799 --> 00:18:22,320 >> Make a motion to approve the minutes 427 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,200 from the meeting. 428 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:27,600 >> Second motion. 429 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:28,480 >> Chair Weaver. 430 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:28,880 >> Yes. 431 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:29,840 >> Vice Chair Gar. 432 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:30,320 >> Yes. 433 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:32,480 >> Commissioner Evans. Commissioner 434 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:33,280 Gonerko. 435 00:18:33,280 --> 00:18:36,710 >> Yes. 436 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:39,520 Given that it is time to move on to 437 00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:42,400 election of a new chair and vice chair 438 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:44,880 of the planning commission. 439 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:49,200 So taking this in order um we would 440 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:51,919 entertain motions from the planning 441 00:18:51,919 --> 00:18:55,440 commission members for a new nominee for 442 00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:56,880 chair of the planning commission for the 443 00:18:56,880 --> 00:19:00,870 next two years. 444 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,799 I nominate uh Matt Gar for chair of the 445 00:19:04,799 --> 00:19:06,240 planning commission for the next two 446 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:08,799 years. 447 00:19:08,799 --> 00:19:13,669 >> Second. 448 00:19:13,679 --> 00:19:14,960 » Sarah Weaver. 449 00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:16,000 >> Yes. 450 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:17,840 >> Vice Shar. 451 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:19,120 >> Commissioner Evans. 452 00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:19,600 >> Yes. 453 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:20,880 >> Commissioner Gonco. 454 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:24,640 >> Yes. 455 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:27,679 So you guys can get up and the two of 456 00:19:27,679 --> 00:19:33,270 you trade seats. 457 00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:53,510 » Oh, nobody there. 458 00:19:53,520 --> 00:20:04,150 Yeah, very engaging on YouTube. 459 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:08,400 Okay, I need to bring my agenda up. 460 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:10,160 >> So, take uh next is we'll take 461 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:12,160 nominations for the vice chair for the 462 00:20:12,160 --> 00:20:18,390 next two years. 463 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:20,240 Would anyone like to make a motion? 464 00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:22,320 for 465 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:24,880 vice chair of the 466 00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:28,559 >> So, I'd like to nominate Alex Talber as 467 00:20:28,559 --> 00:20:30,159 vice chair for the planning commission 468 00:20:30,159 --> 00:20:34,230 for the next two years. 469 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:37,039 » He's not not present, but 470 00:20:37,039 --> 00:20:39,280 >> second. 471 00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:41,600 >> It's acceptable. If if for some reason 472 00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:43,520 he would decline, we could follow up 473 00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:44,720 with that the next meeting, but it's 474 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:46,080 totally acceptable to have a nomination 475 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:51,430 without him prison. Okay. 476 00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:53,440 I think I heard a second from 477 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:55,440 >> um I will second that. 478 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,200 >> Uh Chair Gar, 479 00:20:57,200 --> 00:20:58,640 >> yes. 480 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:00,080 >> Commissioner Evans, 481 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:00,480 >> yes. 482 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:02,000 >> Commissioner Ganco, 483 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:02,559 >> yes. 484 00:21:02,559 --> 00:21:03,760 >> Commissioner Weaver, 485 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:12,230 >> yes. 486 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:13,840 » Okay. 487 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:16,080 Uh with that I believe we will move on 488 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:18,320 to the next item on the agenda which is 489 00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:20,320 the uh the review of the resolution of 490 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:22,240 intention and recommendation to amend 491 00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:26,480 the municipal code chapters 151 and 153 492 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:28,720 uh regarding ADUs. So shall we move on 493 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:29,360 to that? 494 00:21:29,360 --> 00:21:32,640 >> Congratulations and thank you chair Gar. 495 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:36,480 >> Um so what uh so as I mentioned earlier 496 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:38,080 we received a number of desk items and 497 00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:39,280 I'll kind of go through those through 498 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:42,320 topic. Um, my proposal here tonight is 499 00:21:42,320 --> 00:21:45,440 to uh for me to present kind of on each 500 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:48,320 section and then I'll ask for questions 501 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,640 from the planning commission and answer 502 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:53,679 any questions. Um, once we're done with 503 00:21:53,679 --> 00:21:55,280 the presentation and questions and 504 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:57,440 answers from the commission. We'll have 505 00:21:57,440 --> 00:21:59,120 the public provide any input they'd like 506 00:21:59,120 --> 00:22:01,760 to provide and then after that the 507 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:03,840 planning commission can deliberate, ask 508 00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,000 more questions, provide to some 509 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:07,520 conclusion. 510 00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:11,440 So, with that, I will um pull what I'm 511 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,480 going to do is just pull up the the 512 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:16,720 draft ordinance language and we can kind 513 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,280 of just go through it and as it's uh 514 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:20,880 written. 515 00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:24,080 And so, the first uh and maybe I should 516 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:27,679 back up just a bit. Um some may recall 517 00:22:27,679 --> 00:22:32,320 uh back in uh June 23ish 518 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:34,400 um there was a study session provided by 519 00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:36,799 the planning commission uh that went 520 00:22:36,799 --> 00:22:41,120 over a number of different topics uh to 521 00:22:41,120 --> 00:22:44,080 look how the town could increase to 522 00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,240 modify its regulations that would 523 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:48,320 increase flexibility and help increase 524 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:51,919 the production of ADUs. Um so over the 525 00:22:51,919 --> 00:22:57,039 years the town has provided um different 526 00:22:57,039 --> 00:23:00,240 ordinance changes that um have provided 527 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,440 flexibility and um we have had members 528 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:04,799 of the public already taking advantage 529 00:23:04,799 --> 00:23:07,760 of some of those uh ordinances. And so 530 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:11,120 we just will be continuing to work on 531 00:23:11,120 --> 00:23:14,159 looking at challenges that people have 532 00:23:14,159 --> 00:23:18,000 um to creating ADUs and looking at how 533 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,960 the town can modify its regulations to 534 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,120 maintain consistency with state law as 535 00:23:23,120 --> 00:23:24,480 well as to go even further than state 536 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:27,919 law in some circumstances. Um and so 537 00:23:27,919 --> 00:23:30,799 that is uh what is before us tonight. We 538 00:23:30,799 --> 00:23:32,320 are going to go through some additional 539 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,960 items uh that could provide more 540 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,120 flexibility um reduce some of the 541 00:23:37,120 --> 00:23:38,799 challenges that people have to construct 542 00:23:38,799 --> 00:23:43,600 ADUs. And um we will start tonight with 543 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:47,600 an order. And so in chapter 151 is our 544 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,159 site development chapter of the 545 00:23:50,159 --> 00:23:52,480 municipal code. That's what it's called. 546 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:54,480 Um the best way to think of that chapter 547 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,360 of the code, it primarily deals with 548 00:23:57,360 --> 00:24:00,799 grading, drainage, and driveways. Um and 549 00:24:00,799 --> 00:24:04,880 so the town of Woodside um currently 550 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:06,720 restricts properties to having one 551 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,440 driveway onto their property, although 552 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:11,200 there is a process for planning 553 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:13,360 commission approval of a second driveway 554 00:24:13,360 --> 00:24:15,679 exception. Um that process has been in 555 00:24:15,679 --> 00:24:18,000 place for a number of years, albeit it 556 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:21,440 has been modified from time to time. Um 557 00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:24,960 and there has been uh some requests from 558 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:26,960 the public interest I think from 559 00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:29,360 planning commission and council related 560 00:24:29,360 --> 00:24:32,159 to providing some relief to that 561 00:24:32,159 --> 00:24:34,320 requirement for a public hearing process 562 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:37,679 if a second driveway is to serve an ADU. 563 00:24:37,679 --> 00:24:42,000 So what we've done uh is provide a an 564 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:43,679 administrative process. that would not 565 00:24:43,679 --> 00:24:48,000 require a public hearing for ADUs to be 566 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:50,320 able to install a second driveway under 567 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:52,640 certain circumstances. So, what we see 568 00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:54,640 initially here, this is just cleanup 569 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:57,120 language for our existing driveway 570 00:24:57,120 --> 00:24:59,679 exception process. 571 00:24:59,679 --> 00:25:02,559 And this section, excuse me, this 572 00:25:02,559 --> 00:25:04,559 following section here is the proposed 573 00:25:04,559 --> 00:25:06,880 language for um allowance for an 574 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:08,720 administrative second driveway exception 575 00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:12,480 process for ADUs. um we've kept a lot of 576 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:16,000 the same kind of safety goals uh in 577 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,039 place um from the initial exception 578 00:25:19,039 --> 00:25:22,080 process. So with all driveways there has 579 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,039 to be um they have to meet certain line 580 00:25:25,039 --> 00:25:27,520 of sight and safety standards. Uh 581 00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:29,360 whether it's a singular driveway or a 582 00:25:29,360 --> 00:25:31,919 second driveway. Uh these are things 583 00:25:31,919 --> 00:25:34,400 that a line of sight distance study 584 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,120 something uh an engineer would prepare. 585 00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:39,440 They look at curvatures of the road. 586 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,440 They look at the speed limits on the 587 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,000 road um and they provide a sight 588 00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,159 distance analysis is what it's called 589 00:25:46,159 --> 00:25:47,919 which then is reviewed by our uh 590 00:25:47,919 --> 00:25:49,840 engineering department. So we would keep 591 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:53,600 that obviously in place. Um we are 592 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:56,640 looking at you know 593 00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:57,840 whenever we're trying to provide 594 00:25:57,840 --> 00:25:59,600 additional flexibility we also want to 595 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,400 be careful of um people taking advantage 596 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,520 it of it for things that aren't directly 597 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,240 related to the construction of an ADU. 598 00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:10,640 And there are many instances where it 599 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:12,400 just makes more sense to have a second 600 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:15,039 driveway for an ADU. Um some extreme 601 00:26:15,039 --> 00:26:17,679 examples and very easily to uh imagine 602 00:26:17,679 --> 00:26:20,240 examples. We have some properties um 603 00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:23,120 that are bisected by a creek. Um so 604 00:26:23,120 --> 00:26:25,200 example there's properties on Manzanita 605 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:27,679 that back all the way up to Whiskey Hill 606 00:26:27,679 --> 00:26:30,640 and they are biseected by a creek. Um, 607 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:32,480 say you have your house on Manzanita, 608 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,279 but you'd like to do an ADU off Whiskey 609 00:26:35,279 --> 00:26:36,960 Hill. Instead of building a bridge 610 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:39,360 across the creek, um, one could do a 611 00:26:39,360 --> 00:26:41,600 second driveway. An instance like that, 612 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:42,960 it would make a lot of sense for that 613 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:46,000 ADU to not have to go through a special 614 00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:49,520 hearing process for that. Um, so we've 615 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:51,600 looked at things like if someone is 616 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:54,640 proposing a second driveway to access an 617 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,840 ADU, uh, that would would require less 618 00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:00,080 paving than just say extending a small 619 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:01,360 extension off of their existing 620 00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:03,039 driveway. That would be something that 621 00:27:03,039 --> 00:27:05,200 would be looked at. 622 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:09,200 Um, we look at that's only proposed uh, 623 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:10,799 the driveway is only proposed to serve 624 00:27:10,799 --> 00:27:13,200 the ADU. um we want to make sure it's 625 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:16,080 not kind of a tangent to really serve 626 00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:17,919 something else or the main residence on 627 00:27:17,919 --> 00:27:20,000 the property. Um so it's specifically 628 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,520 focused for that. Um and then the number 629 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:25,919 four is really just trying to minimize 630 00:27:25,919 --> 00:27:27,279 the appearance of these second 631 00:27:27,279 --> 00:27:30,720 driveways. So often people will have um 632 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:32,240 fencing on the property. If they have no 633 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:33,679 fencing, that's fine. They don't need to 634 00:27:33,679 --> 00:27:35,679 have fencing. Um, but if they do have 635 00:27:35,679 --> 00:27:38,880 fencing, uh, try to have that vehicle 636 00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,919 gate look as close to the m fencing as 637 00:27:41,919 --> 00:27:44,640 possible with minimal pylons. Um, and 638 00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:47,360 that would kind of minimize the visual 639 00:27:47,360 --> 00:27:49,200 appearance of this second driveway, 640 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:50,880 which has always been a concern about 641 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:54,480 additional driveways on the property. Um 642 00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:59,520 there are some instances even one of the desk items I know of a property they 643 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:03,039 have an old historic um pylon that's not 644 00:28:03,039 --> 00:28:05,039 used as a driveway now. In those 645 00:28:05,039 --> 00:28:06,480 instances we wouldn't make them tear 646 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:09,440 that out and put in a a regular fence um 647 00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:11,120 if they were proposed to use that for a 648 00:28:11,120 --> 00:28:13,200 second driveway. Uh but the idea is to 649 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:14,720 really just maintain the character that 650 00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:18,880 exists now. Um and then uh number five 651 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,919 is just you know clarifying that we 652 00:28:21,919 --> 00:28:25,919 should not be um proposing these uh 653 00:28:25,919 --> 00:28:27,360 second drive is environmentally 654 00:28:27,360 --> 00:28:29,840 sensitive areas or in areas that are 655 00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:31,919 really sign have really significant 656 00:28:31,919 --> 00:28:34,320 steep slopes um immediately adjacent to 657 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:36,399 the drive. It would cause some real 658 00:28:36,399 --> 00:28:38,399 carving into a hillside and significant 659 00:28:38,399 --> 00:28:42,799 retaining walls. Um, and the last one is 660 00:28:42,799 --> 00:28:45,200 just indicating that if you already have 661 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,080 two driveways, um, we wouldn't use this 662 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:50,799 process for a third or fourth driveway. 663 00:28:50,799 --> 00:28:53,919 Um, so we do have, uh, we received out 664 00:28:53,919 --> 00:28:56,159 of the different desk items we have, we 665 00:28:56,159 --> 00:28:59,200 received, um, three items specifically 666 00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,919 related to this topic. Uh, and all of 667 00:29:01,919 --> 00:29:05,279 them shared the same, uh, uh, idea and, 668 00:29:05,279 --> 00:29:06,960 um, staff is very open to that idea. 669 00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:09,520 they are suggesting, hey, you know, this 670 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,320 ordinance is works. It just does it. It 671 00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:14,880 says only for one ADU and let's say 672 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:17,520 someone was building two ADUs. Um they 673 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:18,720 were grouping them near each other to 674 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:20,960 come off this proposed second driveway. 675 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:24,080 Um staff sees no issue with that. If 676 00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:26,080 it's acceptable to the commission, we 677 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:28,559 can easily um if acceptable to the 678 00:29:28,559 --> 00:29:30,799 commission uh literally, you know, 679 00:29:30,799 --> 00:29:33,600 taking away the word a right here and 680 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:35,520 making all our references to accessory 681 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:40,159 dwelling units. Um so just to go back, 682 00:29:40,159 --> 00:29:42,799 um so we remove this and then we can 683 00:29:42,799 --> 00:29:44,159 make the references to accessory 684 00:29:44,159 --> 00:29:46,880 dwelling units plural. Um and if that 685 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:48,960 was something that the commission is 686 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:52,240 interested in, uh we could make that 687 00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:54,320 change. Um so with this just on this 688 00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:56,320 particular topic there's any questions 689 00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:59,279 of the commission um for staff be happy 690 00:29:59,279 --> 00:30:09,510 to answer any of those questions. 691 00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:13,679 Um, yeah. So, couple of things in in 692 00:30:13,679 --> 00:30:16,240 some of the the letters and also in my 693 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:20,000 own experience, the the when you're 694 00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,399 designing these, there was this request 695 00:30:22,399 --> 00:30:23,679 for the fire department to be able to 696 00:30:23,679 --> 00:30:26,559 drive in and turn around. Um, and for me 697 00:30:26,559 --> 00:30:28,640 and a lot of less than 10,000 square 698 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:30,399 feet, seemed ridiculous to even get that 699 00:30:30,399 --> 00:30:31,600 question, but it was a question I had to 700 00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:33,679 go deal with and get a response on. um 701 00:30:33,679 --> 00:30:37,200 for these larger lots that have do have 702 00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:39,039 large properties 703 00:30:39,039 --> 00:30:41,600 with with something that has a ADU 704 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:43,600 that's sort of close to an edge and has 705 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:45,679 its own own driveway. 706 00:30:45,679 --> 00:30:48,320 >> Um should we be saying something about 707 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:50,000 that kind of ridiculous statements of 708 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:51,440 needing a firetruck to come in and turn 709 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:52,159 around? 710 00:30:52,159 --> 00:30:54,960 >> I So we will the firetruck has its 711 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:57,120 standards and people will need to meet 712 00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,399 fire district standards. Um if it's uh 713 00:31:00,399 --> 00:31:03,200 with regards to our local standards, if 714 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:05,039 the fire district does require a 715 00:31:05,039 --> 00:31:07,600 firetruck turnaround, we do have 716 00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:11,120 exemptions in our um paved area section. 717 00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:13,520 So the turnaround itself uh doesn't 718 00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:15,039 count against their paved area 719 00:31:15,039 --> 00:31:16,960 standards. Sometimes if people have a 720 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:18,399 really long driveway, they have to 721 00:31:18,399 --> 00:31:20,559 actually do a turnout as well. Well, 722 00:31:20,559 --> 00:31:22,720 yeah. I mean, I get I get if it's a if 723 00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:24,480 it's a long driveway and it's back part 724 00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:25,440 of the property and the property is 725 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:27,200 three acres big, but if they're going to 726 00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:29,360 put the ADU on the on the corner, is 727 00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:30,000 that 728 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:31,840 >> So, I guess what you're saying is the 729 00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:34,320 fire truck turnaround rule is not in the 730 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:34,880 town. 731 00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:36,480 >> That's correct. Yeah. So, we wouldn't 732 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:37,679 want to put that something in our 733 00:31:37,679 --> 00:31:39,919 municipal code directly related to that. 734 00:31:39,919 --> 00:31:43,200 Um, so in those instances and where it 735 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:45,360 may not be required, it's something we 736 00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:47,440 can help support that applicant with the 737 00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:49,360 fire district. Um but it is a fire 738 00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:50,480 district requirement. Yeah. 739 00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:54,399 >> Um second is uh in some of the letters 740 00:31:54,399 --> 00:31:55,760 they talked about having multiple 741 00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:58,399 driveways for multiple ADUs. Are we 742 00:31:58,399 --> 00:31:59,840 thinking that's a bad idea? 743 00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:03,600 >> Um at this point the town has never 744 00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:05,360 contemplated allowing more than two 745 00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:10,080 driveways on a property. And so um the 746 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:12,480 idea is really to ensure that people can 747 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:16,320 have easy access to a proposed ADU. And 748 00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:18,640 so if they are proposing new if they 749 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:20,799 have existing ADUs, they obviously are 750 00:32:20,799 --> 00:32:23,360 existing and have access to those units. 751 00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:27,279 Um for proposed ADUs, uh they should be 752 00:32:27,279 --> 00:32:29,600 looking at grouping those uh together 753 00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:31,600 with their proposed second driveway or 754 00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:35,919 access off their primary driveway. Um 755 00:32:35,919 --> 00:32:38,399 staff hasn't really analyzed looking at 756 00:32:38,399 --> 00:32:40,080 a third or fourth driveway because 757 00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:42,240 people want multiple separate driveways 758 00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:44,240 for multiple different ADUs. We'd really 759 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:45,600 try to encourage people to hear that 760 00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:46,799 hasn't come up yet. 761 00:32:46,799 --> 00:32:49,679 >> Uh, no, we haven't had any significant 762 00:32:49,679 --> 00:32:51,760 concerns or challenges that people have 763 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,600 run into for that. 764 00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:55,600 >> Um, okay. And my last question may not 765 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:58,000 be related to this specifically, but 766 00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,240 I've read somewhere that there's either 767 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:02,159 a state law being contemplated or 768 00:33:02,159 --> 00:33:04,080 debated about being able to 769 00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:06,320 automatically carve out ADUs from a 770 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:08,640 certain lot. Is that something that the 771 00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:10,640 town has thought about yet? um in terms 772 00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:12,480 of for sale 773 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,880 >> for for separation of ownership sort of. 774 00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,200 >> Yeah. So there is a state law that 775 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:20,720 allows for um cities to optionally 776 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:24,559 decide if they want to uh provide a 777 00:33:24,559 --> 00:33:27,279 mechanism in which people can purchase 778 00:33:27,279 --> 00:33:29,919 an ADU separate from the primary unit 779 00:33:29,919 --> 00:33:32,000 while it's still one property. The town 780 00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:35,039 council has not opted to uh uh look at 781 00:33:35,039 --> 00:33:37,039 an ordinance for that at this time. 782 00:33:37,039 --> 00:33:38,480 >> There's an option for the town. 783 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:40,080 >> Yeah. So the state law it's not a 784 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:42,720 mandatory requirement. Um it's a state 785 00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,679 law that they provided uh that is an 786 00:33:45,679 --> 00:33:47,519 option. It's an option that cities can 787 00:33:47,519 --> 00:33:48,960 pursue. 788 00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:51,440 >> That's my son. If he calls three times 789 00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:52,320 >> understood. 790 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:56,070 >> Thank you. 791 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,039 » Okay. Sage. Um what I do have one 792 00:33:59,039 --> 00:34:01,600 question on this one and that's on 793 00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:04,320 criteria three. 794 00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:07,679 um the the draft language uh that's in 795 00:34:07,679 --> 00:34:12,960 there is only serve the proposed ADU. 796 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:17,040 If this goes into municipal code and 797 00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,520 you're making a literal interpretation 798 00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:21,280 of that, 799 00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,159 then that would theoretically 800 00:34:24,159 --> 00:34:25,919 bar 801 00:34:25,919 --> 00:34:29,280 a proposed second driveway that served 802 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,480 the ADU, but then it just coincidentally 803 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:35,760 happened to provide better access to a 804 00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:39,119 pool house or a 805 00:34:39,119 --> 00:34:42,320 um storage building or a barn or 806 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:45,599 something like that given that the 807 00:34:45,599 --> 00:34:48,320 intent that you outlined 808 00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:50,639 was 809 00:34:50,639 --> 00:34:54,000 to of these changes is to make it easier 810 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:58,640 to create ADUs and the second driveway 811 00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:01,440 would be the one and would be the 812 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:04,079 primary means of access 813 00:35:04,079 --> 00:35:06,880 um to an ADU that would be in a location 814 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:10,560 that would otherwise be um inaccessible. 815 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:13,680 Um, my suggestion would be to consider 816 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,320 tweaking the language to instead of 817 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:19,520 saying only serve the ADU, 818 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:22,720 um, to say that the driveway is needed 819 00:35:22,720 --> 00:35:25,440 to provide a practical means of access 820 00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:32,069 to the proposed ADU. 821 00:35:32,079 --> 00:35:33,680 » Totally open to that there. We don't 822 00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:35,520 find significant concern that we can 823 00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:37,520 look at modifying that language. Yes, it 824 00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:40,560 would just be to make the language 825 00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,200 better fit what seems to be the intent 826 00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:43,680 of this. 827 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:45,119 >> Well, that makes sense. You know, there 828 00:35:45,119 --> 00:35:48,000 might be times in which um you know, 829 00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:50,560 somebody does this short driveway to an 830 00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:53,839 ADU, but yet they can spur off of that 831 00:35:53,839 --> 00:35:56,079 to connect to their primary driveway. 832 00:35:56,079 --> 00:35:57,680 And as with some of the letters that 833 00:35:57,680 --> 00:35:59,760 we've seen, just internal more 834 00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:02,400 circulation um provides better fire 835 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:04,640 safety and things of that nature. Um 836 00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:06,880 yeah, we're definitely open to that. Um 837 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,440 and um with that I'll note, you know, 838 00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:10,560 we're going to get through some of the 839 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:12,880 other comments too tonight. Um some of 840 00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:14,800 the other items that are suggested from 841 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:16,720 the public are necessarily directly 842 00:36:16,720 --> 00:36:18,880 related to some of these things. And 843 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,359 what I want to note is 844 00:36:21,359 --> 00:36:23,440 um the council schedule is very full in 845 00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:25,680 the near future. Uh so we don't have a 846 00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:27,280 specific date in which we're going to 847 00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:29,520 the council. Uh we know that we wouldn't 848 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,320 come to the council before June. Um and 849 00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:34,960 so with tonight's conversation uh with 850 00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:38,000 these ideas, what I would like to do is 851 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,000 um get the direction from the planning 852 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:43,760 commission at the end and we can uh what 853 00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:45,920 I would propose to do is bring this back 854 00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:48,400 probably the second meeting in May um 855 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,400 that we could show any of these changes 856 00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:52,160 that are made uh based on the comments 857 00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:53,680 that we heard tonight and this would be 858 00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:55,359 one of them um should the rest of the 859 00:36:55,359 --> 00:36:57,119 commission agree to that. 860 00:36:57,119 --> 00:37:04,630 >> That's all I had. 861 00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:06,800 Okay. So, the the questions I have, so 862 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,680 first on on pylons, can you just 863 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:11,280 describe a little bit more what we what 864 00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:13,599 we mean by pylons versus fences? And 865 00:37:13,599 --> 00:37:15,599 >> Sure. So, a pylon is going to be a 866 00:37:15,599 --> 00:37:18,720 support for a gate that will be kind of 867 00:37:18,720 --> 00:37:22,480 the hinge for the gate. Um, and so, uh, 868 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:24,640 when doing a pylon, you might have a 869 00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:28,079 wooden wire fence and just a, you know, 870 00:37:28,079 --> 00:37:30,400 12 inch squared wood post probably is 871 00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:32,240 going to support your gate, but having 872 00:37:32,240 --> 00:37:35,119 some type of minimal metal post as 873 00:37:35,119 --> 00:37:38,720 opposed to, um, another, you know, 2x 874 00:37:38,720 --> 00:37:42,160 two or 3x3 stone pylon. Um, the idea is 875 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:43,760 to blend it more into the existing 876 00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:46,960 fence. So, that's the intent with that. 877 00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:48,800 And I think my other question was with 878 00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:52,240 respect to the burner on a connection. 879 00:37:52,240 --> 00:37:54,320 So I I think I don't know that there's 880 00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:57,599 any net new question on this but um I 881 00:37:57,599 --> 00:38:00,320 think considering the ability to have 882 00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:02,960 circulation for the driveway to I I 883 00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:04,640 think I mean I think the intent needs to 884 00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:07,760 be look the driveway is to serve a net 885 00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:09,920 new ADU that's being built but if it 886 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,560 connects on site that that really does 887 00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:14,400 feel like the type of thing that um 888 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,560 >> yeah no look at given the comments we 889 00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:18,160 heard tonight and the from the desk 890 00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:20,320 items it's very reasonable request and 891 00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:22,400 something that we will uh focus this on 892 00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:24,960 when we bring this back. 893 00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:29,109 >> That's that's all I had. 894 00:38:29,119 --> 00:38:31,200 » And Sage, how we're going section by 895 00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:31,839 section. 896 00:38:31,839 --> 00:38:33,599 >> Yes. Yes. So, I'll I'll just continue to 897 00:38:33,599 --> 00:38:34,560 move on here. Okay. 898 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:36,720 >> Um I'm not going to go into these in 899 00:38:36,720 --> 00:38:38,320 detail. These are just definitions. 900 00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:41,119 We've made some modifications. Um these 901 00:38:41,119 --> 00:38:42,880 are really to make sure we are up to 902 00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:44,880 date with current state law. Uh so, 903 00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:46,800 we've made modifications. Our 904 00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:49,040 definitions were in pretty good shape. 905 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:50,480 Um, we've just made some minor 906 00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:52,560 clarifications. Um, and there are really 907 00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:54,079 no substantive changes to these 908 00:38:54,079 --> 00:38:56,240 definitions. Um, so unless there's any 909 00:38:56,240 --> 00:38:58,560 questions, I'll just move on to the 910 00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:02,790 next. 911 00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:04,720 » So the go ahead. 912 00:39:04,720 --> 00:39:08,160 >> Sorry. The the efficiency kitchen. 913 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:11,440 >> So we are making a change there with 914 00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:15,119 respect to cooking. Correct. Um this is 915 00:39:15,119 --> 00:39:18,880 uh clarifying what a uh 916 00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:21,760 it didn't include the cooking piece 917 00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:26,079 before and um it just said well it said 918 00:39:26,079 --> 00:39:29,520 appliances for food preparation and this 919 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,960 is looking at something that a permanent 920 00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,440 cooking facility. So this is a term used 921 00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:36,880 and so the question is when you're doing 922 00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:39,920 an ADU you know do I have a stove? do I 923 00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:41,440 have, you know, you can have a wet bar, 924 00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:43,599 but that's not a kitchen. Um, so that 925 00:39:43,599 --> 00:39:46,000 wouldn't qualify as an ADU. Whereas an 926 00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:48,320 ADU, they have permanent cooking 927 00:39:48,320 --> 00:39:51,040 facilities. And uh what that has been 928 00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:53,200 taken into 929 00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:57,440 um is that it's essentially uh uh when 930 00:39:57,440 --> 00:39:59,520 you install a stove, an oven, it 931 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:01,920 requires venting. And so that's 932 00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:03,200 something that does require a building 933 00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:06,160 permit. Um so the town has always looked 934 00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:07,760 at what is a permanent cooking facility. 935 00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:09,119 It is something that's going to require 936 00:40:09,119 --> 00:40:11,040 the venting. And what we wanted to 937 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:13,839 clarify in this efficiency kitchen is 938 00:40:13,839 --> 00:40:16,000 that someone could have that, but they 939 00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:17,839 could have other just cooking 940 00:40:17,839 --> 00:40:20,880 appliances. So, as many of us, including 941 00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:22,400 myself, you know, we buy all these 942 00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:25,680 different, you know, ways to cook um 943 00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:27,359 that are just kind of plug-in appliances 944 00:40:27,359 --> 00:40:29,119 that are threein- one and can do all 945 00:40:29,119 --> 00:40:31,440 these different things. Um so, if people 946 00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:32,640 are doing something like that, they 947 00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:35,359 don't have to have the oven or the the 948 00:40:35,359 --> 00:40:36,880 venting. Um, we just want to make sure 949 00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:38,720 that they have some cooking appliances 950 00:40:38,720 --> 00:40:43,510 as part of it. So, it's clarifying that. 951 00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:45,839 » Okay. So, it and and it reads may or may 952 00:40:45,839 --> 00:40:46,720 not include a permanent 953 00:40:46,720 --> 00:40:48,960 stove/conventional oven. Does it read 954 00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,920 elsewhere that any cooking appliances 955 00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:53,280 are required? 956 00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:55,119 >> It's just a cooking facility with 957 00:40:55,119 --> 00:40:59,520 appliances as the leadin to that. Um, 958 00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:01,440 so it it which means the cooking 959 00:41:01,440 --> 00:41:03,200 facility 960 00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:05,839 may or may not be a permanent cooking 961 00:41:05,839 --> 00:41:06,640 facility, 962 00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:09,520 >> right? 963 00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:11,520 Yeah. I think it's I I wonder if we 964 00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:14,960 should maybe consider clarifying what a 965 00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:17,280 cooking facility actually is. Part of 966 00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:18,880 the reason I ask is when I was getting 967 00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:21,760 final, I had a temporary set of 968 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:23,920 appliances and was told by the inspector 969 00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:25,520 that I didn't need them and go ahead and 970 00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:28,000 return them. So it was sort of unclear 971 00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:29,680 uh there in terms of is that required. 972 00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:32,240 So I think it would be good to just 973 00:41:32,240 --> 00:41:34,079 specify what a cooking facility. 974 00:41:34,079 --> 00:41:36,000 >> Yeah. So they should have I mean 975 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,240 inspected I mean the venting and stuff 976 00:41:38,240 --> 00:41:40,160 would have had is what's really getting 977 00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:42,960 permitted as opposed to uh the 978 00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:45,839 installation of the stove itself. Um so 979 00:41:45,839 --> 00:41:48,560 if someone hasn't you know if their 980 00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:50,720 plans show for that venting in that 981 00:41:50,720 --> 00:41:52,319 cooking facility that would be what's 982 00:41:52,319 --> 00:41:55,680 inspected. Um 983 00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:57,680 >> okay. So we are saying that the venting 984 00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:58,480 is required 985 00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:00,640 >> that we're saying for an efficiency 986 00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:02,720 kitchen you can have it but you don't 987 00:42:02,720 --> 00:42:04,960 have to and the efficiency kitchens are 988 00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:08,400 directly related to the JADUs whereas if 989 00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:10,480 you're doing a regular ADU you're going 990 00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,200 to do a permanent cooking facility 991 00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:14,640 you're not going to just have the 992 00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:15,760 appliances 993 00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:19,040 >> okay I think my questions 994 00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:20,880 >> we want to ensure that the permanent the 995 00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:22,640 ADUs 996 00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:24,960 will always have a cooking facility as 997 00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:26,880 part of it Okay. Do we have a definition 998 00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:28,240 of cooking facility in the code 999 00:42:28,240 --> 00:42:29,440 somewhere or is that something? 1000 00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:31,280 >> It's just the the permanent It's the 1001 00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:33,839 permanent cooking. We do have a 1002 00:42:33,839 --> 00:42:35,839 definition of cooking facility and it's 1003 00:42:35,839 --> 00:42:38,240 the permanent I'd have to look at the 1004 00:42:38,240 --> 00:42:39,520 exact words, but something we've worked 1005 00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:41,839 with the building department on. Um, and 1006 00:42:41,839 --> 00:42:43,680 it's the venting itself which makes it 1007 00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:45,119 permanent. 1008 00:42:45,119 --> 00:42:47,599 >> Okay. Yeah. I think it may be helpful to 1009 00:42:47,599 --> 00:42:49,440 just clarify what the reference is to 1010 00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:51,200 that just for readability of the code 1011 00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:53,040 because I know actually talked with a 1012 00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:54,240 number of folks who get confused over 1013 00:42:54,240 --> 00:42:59,589 this one. 1014 00:42:59,599 --> 00:43:01,520 We'll look at look at how to better 1015 00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:07,670 clarify that. 1016 00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:09,599 Um, okay. If there's no other questions, 1017 00:43:09,599 --> 00:43:13,839 we'll move on. Um, okay. So, floor area. 1018 00:43:13,839 --> 00:43:16,160 Um this is something that in the study 1019 00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:18,079 session from the planning commission as 1020 00:43:18,079 --> 00:43:20,720 well as town council and from residents 1021 00:43:20,720 --> 00:43:22,319 and we've seen in some letters here 1022 00:43:22,319 --> 00:43:26,960 tonight um that to uh currently the code 1023 00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:29,920 indicates that everyone u every lot 1024 00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,319 doesn't have to count um up to 800 1025 00:43:32,319 --> 00:43:35,839 square ft for ADUs on a property and 1026 00:43:35,839 --> 00:43:38,000 people have asked to uh increase that 1027 00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:42,160 exception and so what we've done is to 1028 00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:46,160 clarify uh to propose that people, you 1029 00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:48,000 know, up to 1,200 square f feet, so 1030 00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:50,240 giving people another 400 square f feet 1031 00:43:50,240 --> 00:43:52,240 that could be applied to ADUs on their 1032 00:43:52,240 --> 00:43:54,400 property that would not account against 1033 00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:56,319 our maximum resin size or their total 1034 00:43:56,319 --> 00:43:59,760 floor area allowed on the property. Um, 1035 00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:03,680 we've had um some letters here. We have 1036 00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:06,800 at least um you know, five of the 1037 00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:09,040 letters tonight. two of them kind of 1038 00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:11,280 just generally supported any increase 1039 00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:14,319 whereas the other three uh specifically 1040 00:44:14,319 --> 00:44:16,400 spoke to 1041 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:18,960 um looking at the increase up to 1500 1042 00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:22,079 square f feet. Um so uh in looking at 1043 00:44:22,079 --> 00:44:24,079 this change and we're specifically just 1044 00:44:24,079 --> 00:44:26,960 looking at D1 right now when looking at 1045 00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:30,160 this change staff contemplated you know 1046 00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:32,800 the town does allow AD to use up to 1500 1047 00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:36,319 square ft. Um, this isn't directly 1048 00:44:36,319 --> 00:44:38,400 changing anything for that. It's just 1049 00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:40,960 simply saying that people get an extra 1050 00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:44,400 400 square feet in previously um that 1051 00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:47,599 they for an ADU, meaning they could use 1052 00:44:47,599 --> 00:44:49,440 that 400 square ft somewhere. If they 1053 00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:51,680 use it for an ADU, they could use that 1054 00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:54,480 somewhere else on their property. Um, we 1055 00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:56,560 could simply change it for all lots up 1056 00:44:56,560 --> 00:45:00,560 to 1500 square ft. Uh we do know that 1057 00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:04,000 when this first came into play, the 800 1058 00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,160 was specifically because town had to 1059 00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:09,760 require at least an 800 foot unit 1060 00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:13,040 on smaller lots. I mean, adding another 1061 00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:15,520 700 square ft on top of the 800 going to 1062 00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:19,359 15, you know, could seem a bit much to 1063 00:45:19,359 --> 00:45:23,280 some neighbors, say. Um so uh but it's 1064 00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:24,720 up to the commission if they want to 1065 00:45:24,720 --> 00:45:27,359 just up the number to 1500 ft² leave it 1066 00:45:27,359 --> 00:45:30,480 at 1,200 reduce it below that whatever 1067 00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:33,280 um you may find to be adequate. Um 1068 00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:35,680 another thing that could be looked at is 1069 00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:39,599 we could hold a number for lots that are 1070 00:45:39,599 --> 00:45:42,880 um an acre less than an acre in size and 1071 00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:45,200 then properties that are larger maybe 1072 00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:47,839 provide those with a larger exception. 1073 00:45:47,839 --> 00:45:50,079 um that would have less impacts when 1074 00:45:50,079 --> 00:45:52,640 they have larger properties. Uh so those 1075 00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:54,800 are just two different ideas, but uh 1076 00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:56,160 there are members of the public that 1077 00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:57,920 have asked to increase that exception up 1078 00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:01,520 to 1500 square ft. And um if there's any 1079 00:46:01,520 --> 00:46:03,440 questions on that, you know, can let me 1080 00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:08,240 know. Um also, you know, again, we'll have public input and at the end 1081 00:46:08,240 --> 00:46:10,480 you can deliberate where you want to go 1082 00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:11,839 with that in particular, but there's 1083 00:46:11,839 --> 00:46:16,470 questions, I'm happy to answer those. 1084 00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:18,720 Um, so we'll discuss it later. 1085 00:46:18,720 --> 00:46:20,160 >> Yeah. In terms of Yeah. So if there's 1086 00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:22,000 questions to answer, now would be the 1087 00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:24,240 time. But yes, in terms of discussion, 1088 00:46:24,240 --> 00:46:26,079 be good to get everybody's input and 1089 00:46:26,079 --> 00:46:27,839 then the commission can decide where 1090 00:46:27,839 --> 00:46:31,990 they want to end with that item. 1091 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:35,680 Okay. Um, okay. So looking at D2, this 1092 00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:38,880 is a new section. Um, this is out of new 1093 00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:42,000 state law. And what I'll do is kind of 1094 00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,000 just jump a little bit ahead to kind of 1095 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:48,160 intertwine this with E1. Um, initial 1096 00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:49,839 some of the initial state laws that have 1097 00:46:49,839 --> 00:46:53,920 passed uh required cities to allow for 1098 00:46:53,920 --> 00:46:57,359 up to 150 square foot expansions to 1099 00:46:57,359 --> 00:46:59,280 provide ingress and egress when creating 1100 00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:03,200 a JADU. And that has been in our code. 1101 00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:06,160 The um state law has now been changed. 1102 00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:08,640 They don't explicitly call out the JADU 1103 00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:11,440 anymore, but they do explicitly call out 1104 00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:14,960 um the need for this 150 foot expansion 1105 00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:17,760 uh for ADUs. So, we want to make sure 1106 00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:19,680 that that is in our code consistent with 1107 00:47:19,680 --> 00:47:24,160 state law. And the language in here 1108 00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:27,200 is is consistent with state law. 1109 00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:28,640 Meaning, sometimes people are just 1110 00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:30,640 trying to add an extra 150 square feet, 1111 00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:32,079 but all they need to do is put a door 1112 00:47:32,079 --> 00:47:37,040 in. Um, and you know, 150 ft be a 1113 00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:40,560 bedroom. Um, so what we've used is the 1114 00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:42,319 state law language to say yes, you can 1115 00:47:42,319 --> 00:47:44,960 go up to the 150 square ft um, if it's 1116 00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:47,680 necessary. Uh, but if you're already 1117 00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:49,920 maxed out and you just need to carve out 1118 00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:51,359 a little bit area. We have some 1119 00:47:51,359 --> 00:47:53,599 instances people are like raising plate 1120 00:47:53,599 --> 00:47:54,960 heights a little bit and it's affecting 1121 00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:56,960 their floor area the way we do floor 1122 00:47:56,960 --> 00:48:02,400 area here. Um, we want to make sure that flexibility is there. So that's the 1123 00:48:02,400 --> 00:48:05,040 proposal using the same language uh just 1124 00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:06,800 to clean up the J AU stuff. We don't 1125 00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:08,640 want to take that away even though state 1126 00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:11,200 law um doesn't explicitly require it 1127 00:48:11,200 --> 00:48:13,680 anymore. But so this is what we proposed 1128 00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:20,150 for those two expansions if needed. 1129 00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,079 » So state law does not have any 1130 00:48:22,079 --> 00:48:23,920 requirements with this 150 at this 1131 00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,160 point. it for the JADU. It doesn't 1132 00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:28,079 explicitly call that out anymore, but it 1133 00:48:28,079 --> 00:48:30,000 does now explicitly call it out for the 1134 00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:33,599 ADU. Um that we have to h allow for some 1135 00:48:33,599 --> 00:48:36,480 expansions to create these ADUs. Um so 1136 00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:38,559 if someone has an attached ADU, they're 1137 00:48:38,559 --> 00:48:41,200 proposing. Um again, we have other 1138 00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:42,960 instances where people are converting 1139 00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,280 buildings and they might need to bump 1140 00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:47,280 out a little area. We're starting to 1141 00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:49,200 deal with things on hillsides that kind 1142 00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:52,000 of create some situations sometimes. Um, 1143 00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:55,359 and so this is will be consistent with 1144 00:48:55,359 --> 00:48:58,480 state law. Um, and so we're just making 1145 00:48:58,480 --> 00:48:59,520 sure we have that in our code. 1146 00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:02,240 >> So the the effect of this is to say you 1147 00:49:02,240 --> 00:49:04,960 get the 150 if you're already maxed out. 1148 00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:06,559 If you're not already maxed out, you 1149 00:49:06,559 --> 00:49:08,160 don't get the 150 because it counts 1150 00:49:08,160 --> 00:49:09,599 towards the TFS. 1151 00:49:09,599 --> 00:49:11,599 >> Correct. And you you would just get what 1152 00:49:11,599 --> 00:49:14,000 is just necessary to provide that 1153 00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:17,200 ingress egress to that unit. 1154 00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:19,280 >> So would would this create then an 1155 00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:22,720 incentive to sort of 1156 00:49:22,720 --> 00:49:24,640 phase construction projects in a way 1157 00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:26,880 that people build up to the maximum with 1158 00:49:26,880 --> 00:49:30,240 a it could hold back of 150 which then 1159 00:49:30,240 --> 00:49:31,920 leads to construction projects that last 1160 00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:34,720 longer. 1161 00:49:34,720 --> 00:49:37,520 it. If people want to phase development 1162 00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:40,160 in a way to get an extra 150 square 1163 00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:52,150 feet, that's something that could occur. 1164 00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:54,880 » Move on. This is all existing language 1165 00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:57,040 in our code. 1166 00:49:57,040 --> 00:50:01,040 Um, okay. So this is something that just 1167 00:50:01,040 --> 00:50:03,520 really hasn't been addressed in our code 1168 00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:06,000 um since we've been implementing ADU 1169 00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:07,599 ordinances 1170 00:50:07,599 --> 00:50:10,640 um you know ADUs. So there's this term 1171 00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:13,119 used basic setbacks in our code. So 1172 00:50:13,119 --> 00:50:14,960 that's kind of your normal setbacks that 1173 00:50:14,960 --> 00:50:16,880 are required you know that everyone's 1174 00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:18,559 kind of used to your side setbacks, 1175 00:50:18,559 --> 00:50:21,359 front setbacks, rear setbacks. Um 1176 00:50:21,359 --> 00:50:23,680 whereas everyone has kind of come to 1177 00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:26,960 learn now that uh you know an ADU can be 1178 00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:28,720 as close as four feet to a side or rear 1179 00:50:28,720 --> 00:50:32,079 property line. And the question starts 1180 00:50:32,079 --> 00:50:34,079 to become how large can those overhangs 1181 00:50:34,079 --> 00:50:37,440 be? Um, you know, our code currently to 1182 00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,480 put ADUs aside, um, before any of these 1183 00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:42,559 changes to state law, and still 1184 00:50:42,559 --> 00:50:46,480 currently, um, a house can have a 6-foot 1185 00:50:46,480 --> 00:50:48,240 encroachment into a front or rear 1186 00:50:48,240 --> 00:50:50,480 setback for an overhang or other types 1187 00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:53,200 of features like balconies, um, and go 1188 00:50:53,200 --> 00:50:55,839 three feet into a side or rear setback. 1189 00:50:55,839 --> 00:50:58,079 Well, you have an ADU that's 4T away 1190 00:50:58,079 --> 00:51:02,240 from a side property line. Um, you know, 1191 00:51:02,240 --> 00:51:04,319 how far should that be able to go into 1192 00:51:04,319 --> 00:51:08,319 that four feet? Um, and you know, eaves 1193 00:51:08,319 --> 00:51:10,640 are functional obviously for drainage in 1194 00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:12,640 many cases and construction and they're 1195 00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:14,960 also a very common design feature. You 1196 00:51:14,960 --> 00:51:18,400 can design things without eaves. Um, but 1197 00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:20,800 with that, what we wanted to do was 1198 00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:23,200 clarify that, you know, we've had some 1199 00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:25,040 people trying to do these large patio 1200 00:51:25,040 --> 00:51:27,839 covers with an ADU. And so, you have 1201 00:51:27,839 --> 00:51:30,640 this 800 square foot unit and now 1202 00:51:30,640 --> 00:51:33,119 they're trying to do, you know, another 1203 00:51:33,119 --> 00:51:36,559 700 square ft of covered patio um really 1204 00:51:36,559 --> 00:51:40,640 enlarging this structure. And, um, we've 1205 00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:42,079 really had to look at these things case 1206 00:51:42,079 --> 00:51:45,280 by case. And what we believe to be very 1207 00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:48,000 reasonable is just to clarify that once 1208 00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:49,599 you're starting to encroach into your 1209 00:51:49,599 --> 00:51:51,920 basic setbacks for an ADU and getting 1210 00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:54,079 closer to your neighbors properties that 1211 00:51:54,079 --> 00:51:57,760 you keep those um to a maximum of 18 in. 1212 00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:01,520 Um and so that is what is proposed for 1213 00:52:01,520 --> 00:52:04,480 this section five here. Um for section 1214 00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:07,599 six again this is just kind of another 1215 00:52:07,599 --> 00:52:09,359 reasonable concept you know that we've 1216 00:52:09,359 --> 00:52:11,760 run into with permitting ADUs over the 1217 00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:14,480 years. So, you know, HVAC units are most 1218 00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:17,200 common. Uh sometimes have people with 1219 00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:19,520 tankless water heaters that get attached 1220 00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:22,400 to the building on the exterior wall. 1221 00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:26,000 And um what we've done just at the staff 1222 00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:28,319 level, uh we've really had to just make 1223 00:52:28,319 --> 00:52:31,920 an interpretation call here because 1224 00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:35,200 we we can't deny an ADU because they 1225 00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:38,480 have an HVAC unit that's next to it. Um, 1226 00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:40,160 you know, if someone's proposing an 800 1227 00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:42,800 foot ADU that's 4T from a side or rear 1228 00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:44,720 property line, you know, you don't have 1229 00:52:44,720 --> 00:52:48,800 an HVAC unit that's 40t away. Um, it's 1230 00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:52,800 just I'm not an HVAC specialist. Um, but 1231 00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:54,160 my understanding it should be as close 1232 00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:57,839 to the building as possible. Uh, and 1233 00:52:57,839 --> 00:53:00,079 that so what we've done is saying, hey, 1234 00:53:00,079 --> 00:53:01,200 look, you can have your mechanical 1235 00:53:01,200 --> 00:53:02,720 equipment. It's serving this unit. It 1236 00:53:02,720 --> 00:53:04,319 makes sense, but you can't be any closer 1237 00:53:04,319 --> 00:53:06,720 than 4T to a side or rear property line. 1238 00:53:06,720 --> 00:53:08,160 So, we just wanted to make sure that 1239 00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:09,839 it's clear in the code that it is 1240 00:53:09,839 --> 00:53:12,559 allowed and that you just keep those 1241 00:53:12,559 --> 00:53:15,760 particular features um within line of 1242 00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:17,200 kind of the intent and spirit of the 1243 00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:20,000 state law to say ADUs can be as close as 1244 00:53:20,000 --> 00:53:22,720 4T. So, if you are in a corner where we 1245 00:53:22,720 --> 00:53:24,640 have two sides, one's four feet from the 1246 00:53:24,640 --> 00:53:26,960 side, one's four feet from the rear, 1247 00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:28,640 then you just need to put it on one of 1248 00:53:28,640 --> 00:53:30,720 the other two sides that doesn't make it 1249 00:53:30,720 --> 00:53:32,640 any closer than four feet to the side 1250 00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:34,880 property line. Um, so that's the intent 1251 00:53:34,880 --> 00:53:37,520 behind number six. So there's any 1252 00:53:37,520 --> 00:53:40,559 questions for five or six? 1253 00:53:40,559 --> 00:53:41,920 >> One question is how do we define 1254 00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:43,839 immediately adjacent? 1255 00:53:43,839 --> 00:53:46,000 >> Um 1256 00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:50,559 next to um it is against I mean we we 1257 00:53:50,559 --> 00:53:53,040 can define a distance of how far it can 1258 00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:56,960 be away. Um you know if that's preferred 1259 00:53:56,960 --> 00:53:57,520 we 1260 00:53:57,520 --> 00:53:59,520 >> within 12 inches of or something. 1261 00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,160 >> Yeah. I just you know again I'm not a an 1262 00:54:02,160 --> 00:54:04,480 expert in mechanical equipment. Um, I 1263 00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:07,200 could do a little bit of uh um further 1264 00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:09,200 discussion with the building department. 1265 00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:13,200 Um, to me, you know, 1266 00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:16,079 they if someone's putting something 20 1267 00:54:16,079 --> 00:54:19,119 ft away from it, 5t away, I mean, that's 1268 00:54:19,119 --> 00:54:20,480 pretty clear. It's not immediately 1269 00:54:20,480 --> 00:54:22,640 adjacent, but um, we'll talk to the 1270 00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:24,559 building department and see if it makes 1271 00:54:24,559 --> 00:54:26,480 sense to there. There may be some 1272 00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:28,240 requirement of how close it has to be. 1273 00:54:28,240 --> 00:54:29,760 Um, so we can look at that a little bit 1274 00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:31,359 closer, too. Okay. 1275 00:54:31,359 --> 00:54:45,510 >> Thank you. 1276 00:54:45,520 --> 00:54:48,960 moving right along. 1277 00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:50,640 It's just cleanup language, just 1278 00:54:50,640 --> 00:54:53,040 clarifying state law changes. We follow 1279 00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:55,440 the new codes. 1280 00:54:55,440 --> 00:55:00,319 Um, okay. So, um, this is something that 1281 00:55:00,319 --> 00:55:04,000 it's kind of what we were making this 1282 00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:06,000 change someone in relation to increasing 1283 00:55:06,000 --> 00:55:09,760 the the TFA uh, exception. And 1284 00:55:09,760 --> 00:55:12,079 currently, this was put in place in the 1285 00:55:12,079 --> 00:55:16,079 code um because under state law that if 1286 00:55:16,079 --> 00:55:18,559 you can't you can't have a local zoning 1287 00:55:18,559 --> 00:55:21,680 regulation that would amount to making 1288 00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:23,520 it infeasible for someone to construct 1289 00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:28,000 an 800 foot unit. And uh further it used 1290 00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:31,680 to um state law used to say that you 1291 00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:35,280 could impose a front setback. Now it has 1292 00:55:35,280 --> 00:55:37,280 language that you can impose a front 1293 00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:39,839 setback but if that makes it infeasible 1294 00:55:39,839 --> 00:55:43,040 to construct the unit um that the towns 1295 00:55:43,040 --> 00:55:45,520 h cities have to make an exception to 1296 00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:48,640 that. So we've in past ordinances we've 1297 00:55:48,640 --> 00:55:51,280 removed the the hard restriction on the 1298 00:55:51,280 --> 00:55:54,480 front setback. Um, and what we've looked 1299 00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:57,200 at is providing a little bit more 1300 00:55:57,200 --> 00:55:59,839 flexibility for ADUs for staff to work 1301 00:55:59,839 --> 00:56:03,280 with folks in unique circumstances. Um, 1302 00:56:03,280 --> 00:56:06,240 our our past, you know, kind of easy 1303 00:56:06,240 --> 00:56:08,319 example of this was saying, hey, what if 1304 00:56:08,319 --> 00:56:10,079 kind of the only place to put an ADU was 1305 00:56:10,079 --> 00:56:12,799 in a slope and nexus of 35%. You know, 1306 00:56:12,799 --> 00:56:14,559 staff should be able that's kind of a 1307 00:56:14,559 --> 00:56:16,400 local zoning thing and staff should be 1308 00:56:16,400 --> 00:56:19,040 able to provide some flexibility there. 1309 00:56:19,040 --> 00:56:21,040 Well, since then, we've changed our code 1310 00:56:21,040 --> 00:56:23,119 to allow ADUs to be in slopes and nexus 1311 00:56:23,119 --> 00:56:25,520 35%. So, that's not my go-to example 1312 00:56:25,520 --> 00:56:28,160 anymore. Um, but I will suggest a couple 1313 00:56:28,160 --> 00:56:30,559 things which also does relate to a desk 1314 00:56:30,559 --> 00:56:33,680 item that I'll get to at the end. Um, 1315 00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:36,000 that there's uh one of the more common 1316 00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:39,359 examples is paved area surface coverage. 1317 00:56:39,359 --> 00:56:41,760 Um, when you have a new ADU, at a 1318 00:56:41,760 --> 00:56:43,920 minimum, you have to have there's 1319 00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:46,799 building code requirements for landings 1320 00:56:46,799 --> 00:56:49,839 outside of exit doors. Um, so there's 1321 00:56:49,839 --> 00:56:52,480 going to have to be some type of patio, 1322 00:56:52,480 --> 00:56:55,119 porch, something that that meets, but if 1323 00:56:55,119 --> 00:56:57,359 someone's maxed out on paved area, the 1324 00:56:57,359 --> 00:56:59,040 town has allowed this exception in the 1325 00:56:59,040 --> 00:57:02,000 past based on this. Um, so that's an 1326 00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:04,240 area in which flexibility could be done, 1327 00:57:04,240 --> 00:57:06,400 but it was limited to only units that 1328 00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:09,280 were 800 square ft. So if someone was 1329 00:57:09,280 --> 00:57:11,760 proposing to do a 900 ft²,000 square 1330 00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:15,280 foot unit that staff would still say 1331 00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:17,119 still have to go do a variance for 1332 00:57:17,119 --> 00:57:19,200 something like that. And so what we're 1333 00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:21,200 trying to do and same goes with the 1334 00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:23,200 front setback. We have another project. 1335 00:57:23,200 --> 00:57:26,240 It's a great example. The house is on 1336 00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:29,040 the San Andreas fault. The property 1337 00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:31,359 behind it is a creek that splits it from 1338 00:57:31,359 --> 00:57:34,559 another piece of the property behind it. 1339 00:57:34,559 --> 00:57:37,040 And really the only place to put an ADU 1340 00:57:37,040 --> 00:57:39,280 is in the front setback. And so we've 1341 00:57:39,280 --> 00:57:41,920 worked with them under this uh exception 1342 00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:43,839 and consistent with state law that they 1343 00:57:43,839 --> 00:57:47,359 can do an 800 foot unit in that area. Um 1344 00:57:47,359 --> 00:57:48,960 but because that that gets them outside 1345 00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:51,920 of the fault zone area. And what we're 1346 00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:55,520 looking here is just um if uh the 1347 00:57:55,520 --> 00:57:57,440 commission and council agree that it 1348 00:57:57,440 --> 00:57:59,839 provides staff with flexibility to look 1349 00:57:59,839 --> 00:58:01,440 at some of our local zoning centers. 1350 00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:03,920 someone wants to do up to a,200 foot 1351 00:58:03,920 --> 00:58:06,640 unit. That gives us more, 1352 00:58:06,640 --> 00:58:08,400 we we could have flexibility with that 1353 00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:11,680 unit, not just up to 800 square f feet. 1354 00:58:11,680 --> 00:58:13,200 Um, 1355 00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:16,160 so, uh, we're just proposing to 1356 00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:19,440 increase, um, the flexibility that staff 1357 00:58:19,440 --> 00:58:22,480 can provide, uh, in I don't want to say 1358 00:58:22,480 --> 00:58:25,040 wave zoning standards, but modify zoning 1359 00:58:25,040 --> 00:58:27,839 standards, uh, when necessary, um, 1360 00:58:27,839 --> 00:58:29,680 because that is the feasible place to 1361 00:58:29,680 --> 00:58:31,920 put the ADU. So that's what this is 1362 00:58:31,920 --> 00:58:35,190 proposing. 1363 00:58:35,200 --> 00:58:37,200 » This is just to make sure they don't if 1364 00:58:37,200 --> 00:58:40,960 it's truly unable to be put on the fault 1365 00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:41,760 line, 1366 00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:44,480 >> then it they don't need to come to ASRB 1367 00:58:44,480 --> 00:58:46,319 and planning to get it approved. 1368 00:58:46,319 --> 00:58:48,640 >> Right. So in the case that I that I 1369 00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:50,799 cited, you know, right now they could do 1370 00:58:50,799 --> 00:58:54,079 the 800 ft into the front setback. Um, 1371 00:58:54,079 --> 00:58:55,920 but if this was changed the way it's 1372 00:58:55,920 --> 00:58:57,760 proposed, they could make that unit up 1373 00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:00,880 to,200 square feet as opposed to 800. 1374 00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:02,559 Um, so it provides a little bit more 1375 00:59:02,559 --> 00:59:04,880 flexibility at the staff level without 1376 00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:06,079 having to go through the variance 1377 00:59:06,079 --> 00:59:08,640 process. 1378 00:59:08,640 --> 00:59:11,520 >> And just to to confirm that, so we were 1379 00:59:11,520 --> 00:59:14,160 talking about the 800 to,200 earlier, 1380 00:59:14,160 --> 00:59:15,040 which is 1381 00:59:15,040 --> 00:59:18,240 >> what are folks titled to. This one is an 1382 00:59:18,240 --> 00:59:20,079 additional layer of flexibility. There's 1383 00:59:20,079 --> 00:59:22,319 no reason this couldn't stay at 800. 1384 00:59:22,319 --> 00:59:23,760 >> That's correct. That's correct. 1385 00:59:23,760 --> 00:59:25,440 >> They want to do a larger one. They'd 1386 00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:27,440 come essentially to planning for 1387 00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:29,440 >> That is correct. Yes. So you you know 1388 00:59:29,440 --> 00:59:31,440 you could still exempt more square 1389 00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:34,000 footage from the TFA and hold this at a 1390 00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:39,430 different number. 1391 00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:41,839 » And and how how are folks demonstrating 1392 00:59:41,839 --> 00:59:44,240 the infeasibility of construction? 1393 00:59:44,240 --> 00:59:45,520 What's the standard for that? 1394 00:59:45,520 --> 00:59:49,200 >> Um we we don't want to make it 1395 00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:52,160 overburdensome. Um so uh typically 1396 00:59:52,160 --> 00:59:54,000 people are going to need surveys and 1397 00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:56,079 typically people have surveys those will 1398 00:59:56,079 --> 00:59:57,920 be a big help in identifying some of the 1399 00:59:57,920 --> 01:00:02,160 constraints. Um when someone you know 1400 01:00:02,160 --> 01:00:04,240 whether it's an ADU or a house you just 1401 01:00:04,240 --> 01:00:06,720 can't build a new one on a fault line. 1402 01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:09,359 Um so people that are on or near fault 1403 01:00:09,359 --> 01:00:10,480 lines they're going to have to 1404 01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:11,839 demonstrate that anyway through 1405 01:00:11,839 --> 01:00:14,400 geotechnical investigations. Uh so we 1406 01:00:14,400 --> 01:00:17,280 look at those um pieces of information. 1407 01:00:17,280 --> 01:00:19,680 Uh we look at um you know 1408 01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:21,440 environmentally sensitive areas 1409 01:00:21,440 --> 01:00:23,119 primarily in Woodside where we deal with 1410 01:00:23,119 --> 01:00:25,440 the stream corridors. Um so those are 1411 01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:27,599 easily identifiable. 1412 01:00:27,599 --> 01:00:29,200 We'll we'll go do a site visit if 1413 01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:31,200 necessary to kind of look at where the 1414 01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:35,520 top of bank may be for um property. So 1415 01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:38,240 uh we we we like to keep it open because 1416 01:00:38,240 --> 01:00:41,200 we want it to be a low bar uh in terms 1417 01:00:41,200 --> 01:00:43,760 of those pro providing that it's not 1418 01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:46,400 feasible. Um, we had another example. 1419 01:00:46,400 --> 01:00:49,520 Someone else strumman showed us that 1420 01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:53,680 they could fit 1500 square feet um, you 1421 01:00:53,680 --> 01:00:56,799 know, outside of a front setback, but 1422 01:00:56,799 --> 01:00:59,839 now they want to just move that into the 1423 01:00:59,839 --> 01:01:02,079 front setback. And well, I'm saying, 1424 01:01:02,079 --> 01:01:03,520 well, you just showed us that you could 1425 01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:06,319 put it you could meet the front setback, 1426 01:01:06,319 --> 01:01:09,920 so I don't so that is not a problem. Um 1427 01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:12,720 so so we try to just keep it very simple 1428 01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:15,520 at those kind of basic issues. Uh steep 1429 01:01:15,520 --> 01:01:19,040 slopes uh faults um and environmentally 1430 01:01:19,040 --> 01:01:20,720 sensitive areas tend to be the biggest 1431 01:01:20,720 --> 01:01:23,750 constraints. 1432 01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:25,680 » And so as they're going through the 1433 01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:28,559 process it's a matter of they they they 1434 01:01:28,559 --> 01:01:31,200 make this case directly to 1435 01:01:31,200 --> 01:01:32,000 >> that's correct. 1436 01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:33,359 >> They're kind of a stage gate like how 1437 01:01:33,359 --> 01:01:34,559 does that 1438 01:01:34,559 --> 01:01:36,880 >> Yeah. No. So the, you know, I mean, 1439 01:01:36,880 --> 01:01:39,520 sometimes people can just show up one 1440 01:01:39,520 --> 01:01:40,880 day and never talk to us and put on 1441 01:01:40,880 --> 01:01:42,880 their plans and here's my reasoning. Um, 1442 01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:44,720 but we encourage people to meet with us 1443 01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:47,520 and often we'll meet with folks once if 1444 01:01:47,520 --> 01:01:50,799 not many times. And so, um, yes, if they 1445 01:01:50,799 --> 01:01:52,960 have some issue, hey, look, you want to 1446 01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:54,880 put it here. sometimes it's the only 1447 01:01:54,880 --> 01:01:57,200 place they can put the septic system to 1448 01:01:57,200 --> 01:01:59,440 serve the ADU whereas okay you could fit 1449 01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:01,119 the ADU there but now you can't put the 1450 01:02:01,119 --> 01:02:03,040 septic system anywhere else because it 1451 01:02:03,040 --> 01:02:05,200 can only be in that location and so 1452 01:02:05,200 --> 01:02:06,559 that's another thing that we kind of 1453 01:02:06,559 --> 01:02:09,520 look at with folks um so yeah we try to 1454 01:02:09,520 --> 01:02:11,680 just be very open and reasonable with 1455 01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:15,200 people um and providing um you know that 1456 01:02:15,200 --> 01:02:17,119 they'll explain their situations to us 1457 01:02:17,119 --> 01:02:18,880 and like I said we're happy to do site 1458 01:02:18,880 --> 01:02:21,200 visits and whatever we can to help u 1459 01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:24,000 make it very clear um And you know it's 1460 01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:25,200 also very clear when we make that 1461 01:02:25,200 --> 01:02:27,200 determination if the neighbor has a 1462 01:02:27,200 --> 01:02:28,799 concern we can say this is how we got to 1463 01:02:28,799 --> 01:02:30,559 that. 1464 01:02:30,559 --> 01:02:32,480 >> And so it mentions the planning director 1465 01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:34,319 shall determine which regulations may be 1466 01:02:34,319 --> 01:02:34,960 written. 1467 01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:37,839 >> Is is it also true that the 1468 01:02:37,839 --> 01:02:39,920 basically if if the planning director 1469 01:02:39,920 --> 01:02:42,319 determines it is not feasible. That's 1470 01:02:42,319 --> 01:02:43,680 also your call. 1471 01:02:43,680 --> 01:02:46,319 >> That's correct. Right. So you're you're 1472 01:02:46,319 --> 01:02:48,880 showing that it's not feasible and we'll 1473 01:02:48,880 --> 01:02:51,040 concur with that or we'll say wait you 1474 01:02:51,040 --> 01:02:53,119 can fit that size unit here. So now 1475 01:02:53,119 --> 01:02:55,760 there's more if we up the square footage 1476 01:02:55,760 --> 01:02:58,079 there's more flexibility for that for 1477 01:02:58,079 --> 01:03:00,559 there's there's the same flexibility for 1478 01:03:00,559 --> 01:03:04,000 a larger unit. 1479 01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:07,119 Okay, makes sense. Um sorry a lot of my 1480 01:03:07,119 --> 01:03:08,480 comments are having having gone through 1481 01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:10,160 processes and just trying to understand 1482 01:03:10,160 --> 01:03:12,079 the the precision. it might be useful 1483 01:03:12,079 --> 01:03:14,079 here to specify that it's a planning 1484 01:03:14,079 --> 01:03:17,680 director call on that and um I don't 1485 01:03:17,680 --> 01:03:18,960 know if there's if there's something 1486 01:03:18,960 --> 01:03:21,839 about what feasibility means or what 1487 01:03:21,839 --> 01:03:24,720 folks are supposed to present um that's 1488 01:03:24,720 --> 01:03:25,839 probably helpful because I think like 1489 01:03:25,839 --> 01:03:27,599 for variances it's quite clear usually 1490 01:03:27,599 --> 01:03:30,160 like there's a form etc like how does 1491 01:03:30,160 --> 01:03:32,319 one determine feasibility would probably 1492 01:03:32,319 --> 01:03:42,549 be quite helpful to applicants 1493 01:03:42,559 --> 01:03:46,960 Great. Thank you. Okay. Um, so we're 1494 01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:48,960 going to move on here to the number of 1495 01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:53,280 ADUs on a property. Um so as many may 1496 01:03:53,280 --> 01:03:55,920 recall um what came out of part of the 1497 01:03:55,920 --> 01:03:59,520 housing element was that on properties 1498 01:03:59,520 --> 01:04:02,400 that are an acre or larger that the town 1499 01:04:02,400 --> 01:04:05,520 would allow amend our codes to allow 1500 01:04:05,520 --> 01:04:08,240 uh three ADUs and a JDU so a total of 1501 01:04:08,240 --> 01:04:11,039 four ADUs on a property plus a house. um 1502 01:04:11,039 --> 01:04:12,960 that was in a very specific I believe 1503 01:04:12,960 --> 01:04:16,079 the the state uh HCD was looking for us 1504 01:04:16,079 --> 01:04:18,079 to just implement that into the SR 1505 01:04:18,079 --> 01:04:21,599 district and um when we moved that 1506 01:04:21,599 --> 01:04:24,160 through the process um I definitely know 1507 01:04:24,160 --> 01:04:25,920 at the council level and I think at the 1508 01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:27,839 planning commission as well but there 1509 01:04:27,839 --> 01:04:30,319 was um saying hey look if we're going to 1510 01:04:30,319 --> 01:04:32,319 allow this for lots of a certain size we 1511 01:04:32,319 --> 01:04:34,319 should just allow it on all lots of that 1512 01:04:34,319 --> 01:04:36,799 size and so that's what the town did so 1513 01:04:36,799 --> 01:04:38,160 the town went a little bit beyond what 1514 01:04:38,160 --> 01:04:40,559 the state had required of 1515 01:04:40,559 --> 01:04:43,520 and allowed uh these three ADUs plus a 1516 01:04:43,520 --> 01:04:47,119 J8U on uh parks that are an acre or 1517 01:04:47,119 --> 01:04:50,480 larger. So there's a part of the 1518 01:04:50,480 --> 01:04:53,280 government code known as government code 1519 01:04:53,280 --> 01:04:55,520 section 66323. 1520 01:04:55,520 --> 01:04:58,319 Um the state will often refer to these 1521 01:04:58,319 --> 01:05:00,960 as stateex exempt ADUs. 1522 01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:03,119 And 1523 01:05:03,119 --> 01:05:07,039 under this state code, every property 1524 01:05:07,039 --> 01:05:14,559 has to allow three ADUs in this these three different types. So one is a 1525 01:05:14,559 --> 01:05:16,240 JADU 1526 01:05:16,240 --> 01:05:18,880 and one is you have to allow a 1527 01:05:18,880 --> 01:05:21,680 conversion of space. So that could be a 1528 01:05:21,680 --> 01:05:25,440 conversion of a storage building, a 1529 01:05:25,440 --> 01:05:28,559 detached garage, a barn as we noted with 1530 01:05:28,559 --> 01:05:31,200 our last amendment. Um it could be a 1531 01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:34,000 conversion of part of your residence. Um 1532 01:05:34,000 --> 01:05:35,839 and so this is a conversion of space. 1533 01:05:35,839 --> 01:05:38,400 The state you have to allow the JADU. 1534 01:05:38,400 --> 01:05:39,920 You have to allow the conversion of 1535 01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:43,359 space. And then the third one is one 1536 01:05:43,359 --> 01:05:45,920 we've kind of been accustomed to is that 1537 01:05:45,920 --> 01:05:48,240 every property has to be allowed to have 1538 01:05:48,240 --> 01:05:52,160 at least one de new detached ADU that's 1539 01:05:52,160 --> 01:05:56,319 uh can be 800 square ft and 16 ft tall 1540 01:05:56,319 --> 01:05:58,480 and as close as 4t to a side or rear 1541 01:05:58,480 --> 01:06:00,480 property line. So, we've changed our 1542 01:06:00,480 --> 01:06:02,079 code to make sure it's clear that people 1543 01:06:02,079 --> 01:06:04,319 can implement that type of unit. Um, 1544 01:06:04,319 --> 01:06:06,559 that type of unit doesn't get held to 1545 01:06:06,559 --> 01:06:08,559 the 11 foot plate height limit, just 1546 01:06:08,559 --> 01:06:11,760 gets to go up to the 16 ft. And what 1547 01:06:11,760 --> 01:06:13,920 we've done here with this section of the 1548 01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:16,640 code, um, because the code currently 1549 01:06:16,640 --> 01:06:19,440 allows folks to have one JADU and one 1550 01:06:19,440 --> 01:06:22,559 attached or detached ADU, 1551 01:06:22,559 --> 01:06:24,480 we're saying if people want to be 1552 01:06:24,480 --> 01:06:26,480 consistent with state law with these 1553 01:06:26,480 --> 01:06:29,119 three types of JADs that are quote 1554 01:06:29,119 --> 01:06:31,680 unquote the stateex exempt ADUs, they 1555 01:06:31,680 --> 01:06:33,359 can have those three units because it is 1556 01:06:33,359 --> 01:06:36,960 allowed by state law. Um and so we you 1557 01:06:36,960 --> 01:06:39,839 know the town could just say everyone's 1558 01:06:39,839 --> 01:06:41,520 allowed to you know those pro those 1559 01:06:41,520 --> 01:06:43,280 smaller properties can have more that's 1560 01:06:43,280 --> 01:06:45,839 another option. Um what we were doing as 1561 01:06:45,839 --> 01:06:47,280 we've kind of done with this is trying 1562 01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:50,000 to provide more flexibility taking 1563 01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:52,240 somewhat smaller steps um incremental 1564 01:06:52,240 --> 01:06:55,520 steps to be careful of how impactful it 1565 01:06:55,520 --> 01:06:58,319 could be to neighboring properties. Um 1566 01:06:58,319 --> 01:07:02,960 and so uh so we're explicitly clarifying 1567 01:07:02,960 --> 01:07:05,119 although it says one Jedu and one 1568 01:07:05,119 --> 01:07:07,599 attached or detached if you want the 1569 01:07:07,599 --> 01:07:11,039 three you follow what is allowed by the 1570 01:07:11,039 --> 01:07:14,400 government code section. 1571 01:07:14,400 --> 01:07:16,160 So that is the proposal for this 1572 01:07:16,160 --> 01:07:18,160 particular 1573 01:07:18,160 --> 01:07:19,920 >> that's an asterct. Is there is the 1574 01:07:19,920 --> 01:07:22,079 asterk up higher? 1575 01:07:22,079 --> 01:07:23,839 >> Um no I appreciate the point that's an 1576 01:07:23,839 --> 01:07:26,640 asterct and like no this is oh sorry yes 1577 01:07:26,640 --> 01:07:28,880 that thank you because you're very point 1578 01:07:28,880 --> 01:07:30,319 it's very important to always have the 1579 01:07:30,319 --> 01:07:32,880 asterct. So yes it is right here. Yeah. 1580 01:07:32,880 --> 01:07:34,559 No no you don't want to have just an 1581 01:07:34,559 --> 01:07:37,359 asterisk without whatever. So um that 1582 01:07:37,359 --> 01:07:40,640 yes that's the placement of it. 1583 01:07:40,640 --> 01:07:43,680 So they get this limitation to JDU and 1584 01:07:43,680 --> 01:07:45,839 one detached or attached. But there's 1585 01:07:45,839 --> 01:07:48,240 this asterct saying if you're following 1586 01:07:48,240 --> 01:07:50,160 what's allowed by government code, you 1587 01:07:50,160 --> 01:08:00,710 can have the three. 1588 01:08:00,720 --> 01:08:04,000 So um this number six is just to also 1589 01:08:04,000 --> 01:08:06,480 clarify um what's allowed by section 1590 01:08:06,480 --> 01:08:09,839 66323 which um what I just mentioned. 1591 01:08:09,839 --> 01:08:13,520 So, um, if people are, uh, converting a 1592 01:08:13,520 --> 01:08:17,749 portion of their main dwelling, 1593 01:08:17,759 --> 01:08:21,120 someone could convert a barn, 3,000 foot 1594 01:08:21,120 --> 01:08:23,120 barn to an ADU. 1595 01:08:23,120 --> 01:08:25,920 Under 66323, 1596 01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:27,520 the 1597 01:08:27,520 --> 01:08:31,040 um, it doesn't specify the size in which 1598 01:08:31,040 --> 01:08:34,400 you can convert a building. So, with a 1599 01:08:34,400 --> 01:08:36,159 main residence, 1600 01:08:36,159 --> 01:08:39,520 someone could say, "I want to convert 1601 01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:42,319 3,000 out of my 8,000 foot house into an 1602 01:08:42,319 --> 01:08:45,759 ADU." And under 66323, 1603 01:08:45,759 --> 01:08:48,480 that would be allowed. 1604 01:08:48,480 --> 01:08:50,799 What we're stating here is if someone 1605 01:08:50,799 --> 01:08:53,679 has already used that conversion under 1606 01:08:53,679 --> 01:08:55,520 66323, 1607 01:08:55,520 --> 01:08:58,159 they can still have an attached ADU, but 1608 01:08:58,159 --> 01:09:00,799 it can't be larger than 1500 square ft. 1609 01:09:00,799 --> 01:09:02,319 So they wouldn't do the conversion of 1610 01:09:02,319 --> 01:09:06,799 the 3000 and add the 1500 foot attached 1611 01:09:06,799 --> 01:09:09,120 ADU. That's the primary example what 1612 01:09:09,120 --> 01:09:13,040 this is getting at. Um so uh so because 1613 01:09:13,040 --> 01:09:15,679 we have standards in our code for 1614 01:09:15,679 --> 01:09:19,440 attached ADUs. Um that's a little bit 1615 01:09:19,440 --> 01:09:21,839 further down but that that's the that's 1616 01:09:21,839 --> 01:09:23,679 the point of what this is doing here. 1617 01:09:23,679 --> 01:09:25,440 saying, "Hey, look, you can convert 1618 01:09:25,440 --> 01:09:29,759 larger spaces. That's allowed, but 1619 01:09:29,759 --> 01:09:32,640 can't convert multiple large spaces." 1620 01:09:32,640 --> 01:09:34,640 Um, so if you want that additional 1621 01:09:34,640 --> 01:09:36,640 attached ADU, you would follow the 1622 01:09:36,640 --> 01:09:40,080 maximum standard for that attached ADU 1623 01:09:40,080 --> 01:09:42,640 since you've already converted 1624 01:09:42,640 --> 01:09:45,040 over that. If you converted an,000 ft 1625 01:09:45,040 --> 01:09:49,120 building to an ADU and it meets code, 1626 01:09:49,120 --> 01:09:59,830 that wouldn't impact this. 1627 01:09:59,840 --> 01:10:01,920 is just clarification language of 1628 01:10:01,920 --> 01:10:03,760 the proper code sections being 1629 01:10:03,760 --> 01:10:15,750 referenced. 1630 01:10:15,760 --> 01:10:19,520 Um this is uh I mean straight out of 1631 01:10:19,520 --> 01:10:21,360 state law. We're just clarifying and 1632 01:10:21,360 --> 01:10:23,760 making sure that everything here um is 1633 01:10:23,760 --> 01:10:33,430 consistent with the state law. 1634 01:10:33,440 --> 01:10:38,149 Just again clarifications. 1635 01:10:38,159 --> 01:10:41,440 So, um this is our our last piece of the 1636 01:10:41,440 --> 01:10:45,280 um proposed ordinance. Um 1637 01:10:45,280 --> 01:10:48,159 through the housing element, uh we have 1638 01:10:48,159 --> 01:10:50,560 a program that look at developing some 1639 01:10:50,560 --> 01:10:53,600 type of amnesty program for ADUs, uh 1640 01:10:53,600 --> 01:10:55,520 unpermitted ADUs and how they can be 1641 01:10:55,520 --> 01:10:57,840 legalized. 1642 01:10:57,840 --> 01:10:59,360 And 1643 01:10:59,360 --> 01:11:01,360 from a planning standpoint, it's it's 1644 01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:02,719 been a bit of a struggle to figure out 1645 01:11:02,719 --> 01:11:04,239 how best to implement something like 1646 01:11:04,239 --> 01:11:05,840 that because a lot of what we've already 1647 01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:08,080 built into our code makes it pretty easy 1648 01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:09,600 and straightforward to convert a 1649 01:11:09,600 --> 01:11:11,840 building. So, if someone had a detached 1650 01:11:11,840 --> 01:11:14,159 garage, even under our laws, if you've 1651 01:11:14,159 --> 01:11:15,840 converted a garage, you don't have to 1652 01:11:15,840 --> 01:11:19,920 replace the parking. Um, and so from a 1653 01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:21,920 zoning standpoint, a lot of the 1654 01:11:21,920 --> 01:11:24,239 conversion issues have already been 1655 01:11:24,239 --> 01:11:27,360 addressed. Um what it the the struggle 1656 01:11:27,360 --> 01:11:31,600 has been really with um ensuring people 1657 01:11:31,600 --> 01:11:33,440 that have done something that's 1658 01:11:33,440 --> 01:11:34,960 unpermitted that they comply with 1659 01:11:34,960 --> 01:11:37,280 building code regulations. 1660 01:11:37,280 --> 01:11:40,239 And you know we could say it's okay to 1661 01:11:40,239 --> 01:11:43,520 convert your garage into an ADU. You've 1662 01:11:43,520 --> 01:11:44,800 already done it. Now come in for 1663 01:11:44,800 --> 01:11:47,760 permits. Zoning wise it's pretty clear 1664 01:11:47,760 --> 01:11:50,080 we almost have nothing to look at. um 1665 01:11:50,080 --> 01:11:51,600 but then they get hit with the building 1666 01:11:51,600 --> 01:11:55,679 code requirements and that's been a real 1667 01:11:55,679 --> 01:12:00,880 um problem for folks. And so in 2024 1668 01:12:00,880 --> 01:12:04,080 uh the state passed what was known as AB 1669 01:12:04,080 --> 01:12:06,159 2533 1670 01:12:06,159 --> 01:12:08,239 since been replaced just for a 1671 01:12:08,239 --> 01:12:12,480 reumbering. Um but uh it is now this new 1672 01:12:12,480 --> 01:12:16,159 government code section 66311.7. 1673 01:12:16,159 --> 01:12:20,480 And what we're doing here is that's state law. It needs to be 1674 01:12:20,480 --> 01:12:23,280 implemented. There is for units that 1675 01:12:23,280 --> 01:12:26,159 were constructed prior to January 2020. 1676 01:12:26,159 --> 01:12:28,239 I know people will question how do you 1677 01:12:28,239 --> 01:12:30,640 always identify when it was built if 1678 01:12:30,640 --> 01:12:33,920 something was unpermitted. Um 1679 01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:36,560 there's certain building techniques that 1680 01:12:36,560 --> 01:12:37,840 the building department will look at, 1681 01:12:37,840 --> 01:12:41,920 but that the town has a checklist. Um, 1682 01:12:41,920 --> 01:12:44,960 in terms there's still a level of health 1683 01:12:44,960 --> 01:12:46,880 and safety requirements that need to be 1684 01:12:46,880 --> 01:12:49,840 met, but uh, it may not require every 1685 01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:51,679 little detail that would say be for new 1686 01:12:51,679 --> 01:12:55,520 construction today. And that checklist 1687 01:12:55,520 --> 01:12:58,480 has been developed. Um, we have a member 1688 01:12:58,480 --> 01:12:59,840 of the public here who's actually been 1689 01:12:59,840 --> 01:13:03,360 really great and builds ADUs and helps 1690 01:13:03,360 --> 01:13:05,199 us go through some of this stuff and has 1691 01:13:05,199 --> 01:13:07,360 different examples. Um, and she can 1692 01:13:07,360 --> 01:13:09,840 maybe speak to that too tonight. Uh but 1693 01:13:09,840 --> 01:13:13,280 there's we are we want to ensure that we 1694 01:13:13,280 --> 01:13:16,000 are implementing that process. So it's 1695 01:13:16,000 --> 01:13:19,120 primarily a building department function 1696 01:13:19,120 --> 01:13:21,440 from the planning department standpoint. 1697 01:13:21,440 --> 01:13:22,719 We are working with the building 1698 01:13:22,719 --> 01:13:24,880 department to make sure that function is 1699 01:13:24,880 --> 01:13:27,760 in place and that we try to make it as 1700 01:13:27,760 --> 01:13:31,199 clean and smooth as possible. Um 1701 01:13:31,199 --> 01:13:33,760 we just simply wanted to just like our 1702 01:13:33,760 --> 01:13:35,520 preapproval program that we did 1703 01:13:35,520 --> 01:13:37,440 previously. We wanted to keep the 1704 01:13:37,440 --> 01:13:39,760 language very simple. We wanted to make 1705 01:13:39,760 --> 01:13:43,040 sure that it is functional and that the 1706 01:13:43,040 --> 01:13:45,600 building department um makes sure it 1707 01:13:45,600 --> 01:13:47,600 implements the laws, but we have some 1708 01:13:47,600 --> 01:13:49,440 flexibility to continue working on the 1709 01:13:49,440 --> 01:13:50,800 process and make it as clear as 1710 01:13:50,800 --> 01:13:53,360 possible. Um we do have some desk items 1711 01:13:53,360 --> 01:13:56,880 that spoke to that tonight. And 1712 01:13:56,880 --> 01:13:59,840 um the one the one suggestion that came 1713 01:13:59,840 --> 01:14:03,360 out of those desk items um was asking 1714 01:14:03,360 --> 01:14:07,600 for uh the town uh to pro to be able to 1715 01:14:07,600 --> 01:14:11,840 provide a building uh building inspector 1716 01:14:11,840 --> 01:14:14,320 inspection of the unit prior. Um it's 1717 01:14:14,320 --> 01:14:17,920 very good point. you know, if you know, 1718 01:14:17,920 --> 01:14:19,600 once you spend a bunch of money 1719 01:14:19,600 --> 01:14:21,520 designing plans and then you realize you 1720 01:14:21,520 --> 01:14:22,880 have other stuff that you have to figure 1721 01:14:22,880 --> 01:14:25,040 out and that's just going way beyond 1722 01:14:25,040 --> 01:14:26,560 what you ever thought you were going to 1723 01:14:26,560 --> 01:14:28,400 have to do. 1724 01:14:28,400 --> 01:14:31,040 Um people who want to enter this process 1725 01:14:31,040 --> 01:14:33,920 in good faith uh and legalize these 1726 01:14:33,920 --> 01:14:38,000 unpermitted units uh should have some 1727 01:14:38,000 --> 01:14:42,560 mechanism to help minimize any um down 1728 01:14:42,560 --> 01:14:44,000 the road problems that that may have 1729 01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:47,199 been unforeseen initially. The state law 1730 01:14:47,199 --> 01:14:52,400 does state uh does indicate that um that 1731 01:14:52,400 --> 01:14:53,920 jurisdictions 1732 01:14:53,920 --> 01:14:56,159 um basically have to allow they don't 1733 01:14:56,159 --> 01:14:58,640 have to they can't require it, but they 1734 01:14:58,640 --> 01:15:02,719 have to allow uh for property owners to 1735 01:15:02,719 --> 01:15:04,880 come in with a third-party general 1736 01:15:04,880 --> 01:15:06,960 contractor inspection. So, someone can 1737 01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:08,640 go hire a general contractor on their 1738 01:15:08,640 --> 01:15:10,800 own. They can use the checklist that the 1739 01:15:10,800 --> 01:15:13,280 town provides and they can provide them 1740 01:15:13,280 --> 01:15:16,719 with feedback. I believe what is in in 1741 01:15:16,719 --> 01:15:18,560 so that's in place. People are allowed 1742 01:15:18,560 --> 01:15:20,640 to do that. They can always hire someone 1743 01:15:20,640 --> 01:15:24,000 on their own. Um I believe what is being 1744 01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:26,640 suggested in the desk items we received 1745 01:15:26,640 --> 01:15:29,360 tonight was actually having a town 1746 01:15:29,360 --> 01:15:33,520 inspector go out there. Um and 1747 01:15:33,520 --> 01:15:35,840 you know to me it's it's something talk 1748 01:15:35,840 --> 01:15:38,239 with the building department. We look at 1749 01:15:38,239 --> 01:15:40,320 capacity. We look at is should there be 1750 01:15:40,320 --> 01:15:43,199 a cost associated with it? And I look at 1751 01:15:43,199 --> 01:15:46,000 this more of a policy decision. Um so 1752 01:15:46,000 --> 01:15:48,400 it's something that uh you know with the 1753 01:15:48,400 --> 01:15:50,239 desk items and if the town on the 1754 01:15:50,239 --> 01:15:52,159 planning commission would like us to to 1755 01:15:52,159 --> 01:15:54,239 talk with the council further is to 1756 01:15:54,239 --> 01:15:56,480 bring this to the town council and 1757 01:15:56,480 --> 01:15:58,080 indicate 1758 01:15:58,080 --> 01:15:59,920 you know what that might cost the town 1759 01:15:59,920 --> 01:16:03,440 to do. Does the town want to implement a 1760 01:16:03,440 --> 01:16:05,600 cost for that? Currently we wave most 1761 01:16:05,600 --> 01:16:09,840 building permit fees for ADUs. Um but 1762 01:16:09,840 --> 01:16:11,920 and I'll note that our building 1763 01:16:11,920 --> 01:16:13,600 inspectors are contract building 1764 01:16:13,600 --> 01:16:16,719 inspectors. Um and so we really look at 1765 01:16:16,719 --> 01:16:20,000 this as a policy decision. Does the town 1766 01:16:20,000 --> 01:16:22,880 want to um 1767 01:16:22,880 --> 01:16:25,520 look at that cost and capacity uh is 1768 01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:27,679 really the two questions. So do our 1769 01:16:27,679 --> 01:16:30,000 building inspectors have capacity? Is 1770 01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:32,480 that just a matter of um expanding the 1771 01:16:32,480 --> 01:16:34,560 contract uh with the current company 1772 01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:38,320 that holds the building inspections? Um, 1773 01:16:38,320 --> 01:16:40,480 but I I would suggest it's not something 1774 01:16:40,480 --> 01:16:43,280 that we should necessarily codify. Uh, 1775 01:16:43,280 --> 01:16:45,760 so it gives the town the flexibility to 1776 01:16:45,760 --> 01:16:51,280 implement things like this. Um, but to put in our code that the town shall 1777 01:16:51,280 --> 01:16:54,239 provide a building inspection, I really 1778 01:16:54,239 --> 01:16:56,719 think it's a um a good policy decision 1779 01:16:56,719 --> 01:16:58,800 for the town council. Uh, if that's 1780 01:16:58,800 --> 01:17:00,239 something they want to implement, they 1781 01:17:00,239 --> 01:17:02,480 could do that by resolution. Uh, and it 1782 01:17:02,480 --> 01:17:04,400 wouldn't have to be codified. and every 1783 01:17:04,400 --> 01:17:05,920 time it gets changed, we have to change 1784 01:17:05,920 --> 01:17:08,159 the code. 1785 01:17:08,159 --> 01:17:10,400 >> Are there actually any penalties for 1786 01:17:10,400 --> 01:17:12,320 having one and not getting it permitted? 1787 01:17:12,320 --> 01:17:13,840 >> Um, it's a good question. So, if 1788 01:17:13,840 --> 01:17:16,000 someone's following this process, no. 1789 01:17:16,000 --> 01:17:19,360 Um, you know, typically prior to this 1790 01:17:19,360 --> 01:17:22,960 process, um, if someone builds something 1791 01:17:22,960 --> 01:17:26,000 uh without permits, um, it could incur 1792 01:17:26,000 --> 01:17:28,560 three times the permit fee. Um, should 1793 01:17:28,560 --> 01:17:30,239 note we wave most of the permit fees for 1794 01:17:30,239 --> 01:17:31,679 ADUs. So, 1795 01:17:31,679 --> 01:17:33,280 >> three times zero. Okay. 1796 01:17:33,280 --> 01:17:35,920 >> Um, so, so the town does not have 1797 01:17:35,920 --> 01:17:37,840 significant fines uh for anything like 1798 01:17:37,840 --> 01:17:40,950 this. 1799 01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:42,480 » I agree with you on the on the no need 1800 01:17:42,480 --> 01:17:44,080 to put in the code thing. I mean, this 1801 01:17:44,080 --> 01:17:46,800 does seem like a town policy of I think 1802 01:17:46,800 --> 01:17:48,719 we kind of want these, right? We want 1803 01:17:48,719 --> 01:17:50,239 people to permit them and get them in 1804 01:17:50,239 --> 01:17:51,280 their numbers. 1805 01:17:51,280 --> 01:17:53,760 >> Um, and so almost like having a 1806 01:17:53,760 --> 01:17:55,920 international amnesty for anybody 1807 01:17:55,920 --> 01:17:58,080 >> and and some sort of onbudsmanship to 1808 01:17:58,080 --> 01:17:59,280 get them to the point where they're 1809 01:17:59,280 --> 01:18:00,640 coded safe that 1810 01:18:00,640 --> 01:18:05,679 >> Yeah. No, that that's the point. uh it increases more housing, legitimate 1811 01:18:05,679 --> 01:18:08,880 housing as well as safer housing. So um 1812 01:18:08,880 --> 01:18:11,120 for that reason, the goal is really to 1813 01:18:11,120 --> 01:18:14,640 try to continually, you know, make this 1814 01:18:14,640 --> 01:18:15,360 uh easier. 1815 01:18:15,360 --> 01:18:17,679 >> Do you guys know where they are? 1816 01:18:17,679 --> 01:18:20,719 >> No, I No, I would say no. Um you know, 1817 01:18:20,719 --> 01:18:23,679 we if if there is a complaint that comes 1818 01:18:23,679 --> 01:18:25,840 in, the code enforcement process has 1819 01:18:25,840 --> 01:18:28,080 started. Um and that's simply to get 1820 01:18:28,080 --> 01:18:31,199 someone into compliance. 1821 01:18:31,199 --> 01:18:32,880 The question I have based on and based 1822 01:18:32,880 --> 01:18:36,800 on the desk item and so someone comes 1823 01:18:36,800 --> 01:18:39,679 forth goes into this program 1824 01:18:39,679 --> 01:18:42,080 they get hit with a set of code code 1825 01:18:42,080 --> 01:18:45,199 issues the cost spirals are they able to 1826 01:18:45,199 --> 01:18:47,280 pull back or it's once they've started 1827 01:18:47,280 --> 01:18:49,040 the process 1828 01:18:49,040 --> 01:18:51,040 >> it's a good question uh so we had 1829 01:18:51,040 --> 01:18:54,159 someone come in uh prior to this state 1830 01:18:54,159 --> 01:18:56,159 law being in place um they just want to 1831 01:18:56,159 --> 01:18:58,320 come in hey you guys need adus I'll do 1832 01:18:58,320 --> 01:19:00,159 that and they've 1833 01:19:00,159 --> 01:19:03,199 uh they've come in, they, you know, had 1834 01:19:03,199 --> 01:19:04,880 some issues. They were drawing the plans 1835 01:19:04,880 --> 01:19:07,199 themselves. They still needed to come up 1836 01:19:07,199 --> 01:19:08,960 to certain building code requirements. 1837 01:19:08,960 --> 01:19:10,560 Um I did reach out to them since it's 1838 01:19:10,560 --> 01:19:12,159 been in place. I don't know. I think 1839 01:19:12,159 --> 01:19:14,159 they may have sold their property, but 1840 01:19:14,159 --> 01:19:16,640 um it wasn't a code enforcement case. It 1841 01:19:16,640 --> 01:19:18,080 wasn't something that was an inquiry 1842 01:19:18,080 --> 01:19:19,840 that was brought to the town for 1843 01:19:19,840 --> 01:19:22,719 enforcement. Um so because of that, the 1844 01:19:22,719 --> 01:19:26,080 town is reactive to inquiries. We did 1845 01:19:26,080 --> 01:19:30,310 not pursue code enforcement. 1846 01:19:30,320 --> 01:19:31,920 If there's health and safety violations 1847 01:19:31,920 --> 01:19:34,320 that the town is made aware of, building 1848 01:19:34,320 --> 01:19:36,159 department will look at those to ensure 1849 01:19:36,159 --> 01:19:39,990 that those are corrected. 1850 01:19:40,000 --> 01:19:41,440 We're looking at, you know, you want to 1851 01:19:41,440 --> 01:19:43,600 make sure there's not wiring hanging out 1852 01:19:43,600 --> 01:19:47,120 everywhere, things of that nature. 1853 01:19:47,120 --> 01:19:50,320 Just one policy question that occurs to 1854 01:19:50,320 --> 01:19:53,040 me with respect to the prospect of the 1855 01:19:53,040 --> 01:19:54,800 building department going out and doing 1856 01:19:54,800 --> 01:19:56,719 pre-insspection 1857 01:19:56,719 --> 01:19:59,679 of unpermitted ADUs 1858 01:19:59,679 --> 01:20:01,199 is 1859 01:20:01,199 --> 01:20:04,320 in in in addition to whether 1860 01:20:04,320 --> 01:20:07,600 uh um um there would be a charge for 1861 01:20:07,600 --> 01:20:10,719 this service, it would be also whether 1862 01:20:10,719 --> 01:20:13,280 it would just be a verbal report by the 1863 01:20:13,280 --> 01:20:17,280 inspector or if a written report is 1864 01:20:17,280 --> 01:20:20,800 provided and then also 1865 01:20:20,800 --> 01:20:25,120 if that written report is going to by 1866 01:20:25,120 --> 01:20:27,360 its existence 1867 01:20:27,360 --> 01:20:30,400 um be an implicit statement by the 1868 01:20:30,400 --> 01:20:32,480 building department or the town on 1869 01:20:32,480 --> 01:20:34,320 limiting the scope of the required 1870 01:20:34,320 --> 01:20:37,199 changes 1871 01:20:37,199 --> 01:20:41,920 because it sort of um 1872 01:20:41,920 --> 01:20:44,080 I mean doing renovations it's a big can 1873 01:20:44,080 --> 01:20:46,640 of worms So, 1874 01:20:46,640 --> 01:20:50,080 um um scope creep is always an issue. 1875 01:20:50,080 --> 01:20:53,600 And is the town be um going to be on the 1876 01:20:53,600 --> 01:20:55,840 hook if the building inspector initially 1877 01:20:55,840 --> 01:20:57,440 said something didn't have to be done 1878 01:20:57,440 --> 01:20:59,840 and then 1879 01:20:59,840 --> 01:21:01,920 um things changed? 1880 01:21:01,920 --> 01:21:07,120 >> Yeah. No, I I I So, from what I hear is 1881 01:21:07,120 --> 01:21:09,120 would that say I don't have to fix 1882 01:21:09,120 --> 01:21:10,880 something that I didn't see behind the 1883 01:21:10,880 --> 01:21:13,199 wall? And I think the answer is no. 1884 01:21:13,199 --> 01:21:14,719 there's still a possibility that you may 1885 01:21:14,719 --> 01:21:17,040 have to fix more. Uh there are certain 1886 01:21:17,040 --> 01:21:19,840 things that would not be inspected um 1887 01:21:19,840 --> 01:21:21,679 like things that are behind a wall when 1888 01:21:21,679 --> 01:21:24,480 someone opens up a wall uh to make 1889 01:21:24,480 --> 01:21:26,880 certain modifications. So there are a 1890 01:21:26,880 --> 01:21:30,239 lot of in the checklist kind of call you 1891 01:21:30,239 --> 01:21:34,960 know there's some uh um the right word 1892 01:21:34,960 --> 01:21:38,320 not caveats necessarily but uh it would 1893 01:21:38,320 --> 01:21:40,400 the inspection is based on what was seen 1894 01:21:40,400 --> 01:21:44,159 and inspected and people will need to be 1895 01:21:44,159 --> 01:21:46,320 aware that there could be additional 1896 01:21:46,320 --> 01:21:48,719 items uh that could come into play that 1897 01:21:48,719 --> 01:21:50,960 just aren't identifiable by that 1898 01:21:50,960 --> 01:21:57,669 inspection. 1899 01:21:57,679 --> 01:22:01,120 So, so that goes through the proposals. 1900 01:22:01,120 --> 01:22:04,320 Um, I do want to s question on actually 1901 01:22:04,320 --> 01:22:06,400 the prior one before we got here, which 1902 01:22:06,400 --> 01:22:07,679 was 1903 01:22:07,679 --> 01:22:11,120 >> in bottom of page 13. 1904 01:22:11,120 --> 01:22:13,120 >> Owner occupancy is required in any 1905 01:22:13,120 --> 01:22:15,120 residence that contains a junior ADU 1906 01:22:15,120 --> 01:22:17,840 except as described below. 1907 01:22:17,840 --> 01:22:22,639 So if you build a J jadu, 1908 01:22:22,639 --> 01:22:24,960 you have to stay in your house for life. 1909 01:22:24,960 --> 01:22:28,480 >> No. Um the owner of the property has to 1910 01:22:28,480 --> 01:22:30,880 live in one of the units. So if you sell 1911 01:22:30,880 --> 01:22:34,320 your property that the own whoever owns 1912 01:22:34,320 --> 01:22:35,760 the property has to live in one of the 1913 01:22:35,760 --> 01:22:41,120 two units. So if right so if if somebody 1914 01:22:41,120 --> 01:22:44,560 say I I build a JDU 1915 01:22:44,560 --> 01:22:47,199 I have a job requirement that brings me 1916 01:22:47,199 --> 01:22:49,040 to Chicago 1917 01:22:49,040 --> 01:22:51,440 I have to sell the house 1918 01:22:51,440 --> 01:22:55,360 >> or you wouldn't rent out the JADU 1919 01:22:55,360 --> 01:22:57,520 >> can't rent out the JADU can rent out the 1920 01:22:57,520 --> 01:22:58,080 rest of the 1921 01:22:58,080 --> 01:22:59,520 >> because the JDU will be part of the 1922 01:22:59,520 --> 01:23:02,239 house it's always part of the house um 1923 01:23:02,239 --> 01:23:04,320 it's the JDU is something that gets can 1924 01:23:04,320 --> 01:23:07,920 be closed off Um, so that's kind of the 1925 01:23:07,920 --> 01:23:13,280 idea of JADUs that, you know, you have a shared door that you can 1926 01:23:13,280 --> 01:23:15,760 close. Even a JADU, you don't have to 1927 01:23:15,760 --> 01:23:18,639 have its own bathroom. Um, a JADU can 1928 01:23:18,639 --> 01:23:20,719 actually share a bathroom with the rest 1929 01:23:20,719 --> 01:23:25,120 of the house. Um, and so the the idea of 1930 01:23:25,120 --> 01:23:27,199 J8s when they first came up is that I 1931 01:23:27,199 --> 01:23:29,520 have this extra bedroom. I can close it 1932 01:23:29,520 --> 01:23:32,080 off and I can put in this little 1933 01:23:32,080 --> 01:23:34,639 efficiency kitchen and then so that way 1934 01:23:34,639 --> 01:23:37,040 it just turns into the house. 1935 01:23:37,040 --> 01:23:38,239 >> Yeah, I think I'm just struggling with 1936 01:23:38,239 --> 01:23:40,080 the language on this because it it 1937 01:23:40,080 --> 01:23:42,239 really reads maybe it's just me, but it 1938 01:23:42,239 --> 01:23:45,440 reads as if 1939 01:23:45,440 --> 01:23:47,600 the fact that there's a Jadu requires 1940 01:23:47,600 --> 01:23:49,600 that owner occupancy is required for the 1941 01:23:49,600 --> 01:23:52,159 life of this structure, 1942 01:23:52,159 --> 01:23:57,110 which seems problematic. 1943 01:23:57,120 --> 01:23:58,400 » Understood. We'll look at that a little 1944 01:23:58,400 --> 01:24:03,520 bit closer. Um the the intent is that 1945 01:24:03,520 --> 01:24:07,679 you don't you don't rent out two units, 1946 01:24:07,679 --> 01:24:09,920 the JDU and the house that you have 1947 01:24:09,920 --> 01:24:12,560 someone on site. 1948 01:24:12,560 --> 01:24:15,679 this one. Well, it is part of this comes 1949 01:24:15,679 --> 01:24:17,600 out of the state law which is why you 1950 01:24:17,600 --> 01:24:19,040 get into these requirements about 1951 01:24:19,040 --> 01:24:21,520 government agencies and land trust and 1952 01:24:21,520 --> 01:24:24,560 um so I'll look at a couple things at 1953 01:24:24,560 --> 01:24:26,800 one to make sure that this is more clear 1954 01:24:26,800 --> 01:24:28,960 and then two if the town wants to pursue 1955 01:24:28,960 --> 01:24:30,320 it maybe saying hey we just don't even 1956 01:24:30,320 --> 01:24:32,880 want to have this requirement in place 1957 01:24:32,880 --> 01:24:35,520 um if I'll double check it may be that 1958 01:24:35,520 --> 01:24:37,199 the state law doesn't require that you 1959 01:24:37,199 --> 01:24:40,000 have that in place and so I'll look at 1960 01:24:40,000 --> 01:24:42,080 one making this more clear shall we keep 1961 01:24:42,080 --> 01:24:44,880 it in place and two Is there the option 1962 01:24:44,880 --> 01:24:46,960 to just remove the requirement 1963 01:24:46,960 --> 01:24:49,440 completely? Um, and if that's an option, 1964 01:24:49,440 --> 01:24:51,040 we'll present that as well. 1965 01:24:51,040 --> 01:24:52,560 >> Makes sense. Yeah, I think that the 1966 01:24:52,560 --> 01:24:53,600 clarification that would be helpful 1967 01:24:53,600 --> 01:24:56,239 would be I think exactly what you said, 1968 01:24:56,239 --> 01:25:00,560 which is it also wouldn't be required if 1969 01:25:00,560 --> 01:25:01,840 the owners I'm not going to say this 1970 01:25:01,840 --> 01:25:02,800 right, but the owner is not trying to 1971 01:25:02,800 --> 01:25:04,960 rent out two units, right? Like if they 1972 01:25:04,960 --> 01:25:07,840 can rent out the whole thing 1973 01:25:07,840 --> 01:25:09,840 uh 1974 01:25:09,840 --> 01:25:14,629 but not carve it up. Yep. 1975 01:25:14,639 --> 01:25:24,550 So um 1976 01:25:24,560 --> 01:25:27,440 okay so what I'd like to also now just 1977 01:25:27,440 --> 01:25:31,280 to um continue with is 1978 01:25:31,280 --> 01:25:34,960 we've received a few desk items um that 1979 01:25:34,960 --> 01:25:38,639 were not uh directly interwoven with 1980 01:25:38,639 --> 01:25:41,040 what we were doing today 1981 01:25:41,040 --> 01:25:43,600 and uh I'd like to bring up a couple and 1982 01:25:43,600 --> 01:25:45,360 thankfully Steve Patrick is here tonight 1983 01:25:45,360 --> 01:25:48,480 so we can help um bring up his items. He 1984 01:25:48,480 --> 01:25:51,760 brought up two items. Um one was related 1985 01:25:51,760 --> 01:25:56,400 to paved area and uh possibly allowing a 1986 01:25:56,400 --> 01:25:58,560 larger exception for paved area related 1987 01:25:58,560 --> 01:26:01,760 to ADUs. Uh so a very good question. 1988 01:26:01,760 --> 01:26:03,600 It's actually something thought about. 1989 01:26:03,600 --> 01:26:06,480 Um we as I noted a little bit earlier 1990 01:26:06,480 --> 01:26:08,719 that that wouldn't be a restriction in 1991 01:26:08,719 --> 01:26:11,199 and of itself to construct an ADU. we 1992 01:26:11,199 --> 01:26:14,560 have that flexibility. Uh but um during 1993 01:26:14,560 --> 01:26:17,520 deliberation, if the the planning 1994 01:26:17,520 --> 01:26:18,719 commission would like us to actually 1995 01:26:18,719 --> 01:26:21,280 carve out, he suggested 1500 square ft 1996 01:26:21,280 --> 01:26:24,000 of additional paved area, um we'd be 1997 01:26:24,000 --> 01:26:25,520 happy to explore that further and bring 1998 01:26:25,520 --> 01:26:28,320 that back. Uh if we want to look at some 1999 01:26:28,320 --> 01:26:30,880 specific uh additional square footage of 2000 01:26:30,880 --> 01:26:32,560 exemption that's directly related to the 2001 01:26:32,560 --> 01:26:36,560 construction of an ADU, um we're don't 2002 01:26:36,560 --> 01:26:39,360 have any significant concern for that. I 2003 01:26:39,360 --> 01:26:41,600 think the I think it's a great point and 2004 01:26:41,600 --> 01:26:45,679 very needed. Um my question would be do 2005 01:26:45,679 --> 01:26:47,920 you have any data as to what would be 2006 01:26:47,920 --> 01:26:48,719 needed? 2007 01:26:48,719 --> 01:26:50,080 >> That's a very good question. That's 2008 01:26:50,080 --> 01:26:51,840 something we could provide. Like I said, 2009 01:26:51,840 --> 01:26:54,480 you know, it will it will change, right? 2010 01:26:54,480 --> 01:26:57,199 So I think I think it's like you have to 2011 01:26:57,199 --> 01:26:59,600 have at least by like a three foot out 2012 01:26:59,600 --> 01:27:01,920 landing from your doors and so there's 2013 01:27:01,920 --> 01:27:03,199 certain things like that. But if you 2014 01:27:03,199 --> 01:27:04,880 only have two small doors, maybe that's 2015 01:27:04,880 --> 01:27:06,880 >> But it also includes the driveway, 2016 01:27:06,880 --> 01:27:08,719 >> right? There's certain things. I mean, 2017 01:27:08,719 --> 01:27:10,159 you don't necessarily have to have a 2018 01:27:10,159 --> 01:27:13,199 driveway all the way up to an ADU. Um, 2019 01:27:13,199 --> 01:27:15,040 you know, so there's certain things, but 2020 01:27:15,040 --> 01:27:17,760 what we could just look at is, you know, 2021 01:27:17,760 --> 01:27:19,600 you look at, okay, let's say someone has 2022 01:27:19,600 --> 01:27:23,600 a, you know, a 10x4 walkway for, you 2023 01:27:23,600 --> 01:27:26,080 know, that distance and then has roughly 2024 01:27:26,080 --> 01:27:28,480 some additional square footage around an 2025 01:27:28,480 --> 01:27:31,440 ADU. Um, you know, the town can just 2026 01:27:31,440 --> 01:27:33,360 make a decision that it wants to make 2027 01:27:33,360 --> 01:27:35,760 sure you get at least the minimum and 2028 01:27:35,760 --> 01:27:37,840 could go up to 2029 01:27:37,840 --> 01:27:39,679 whatever seems to be a reasonable square 2030 01:27:39,679 --> 01:27:41,760 footage. Uh so we can come back with a 2031 01:27:41,760 --> 01:27:44,159 little bit more clarification on what 2032 01:27:44,159 --> 01:27:46,960 some bare minimums might look like. Uh 2033 01:27:46,960 --> 01:27:49,600 and then you know what a little bit more 2034 01:27:49,600 --> 01:27:51,440 reasonable maybe you know okay you have 2035 01:27:51,440 --> 01:27:53,360 your landing outside your door but maybe 2036 01:27:53,360 --> 01:27:56,159 they should be allowed a 9 by9 patio or 2037 01:27:56,159 --> 01:27:59,520 something like that you know. Um 2038 01:27:59,520 --> 01:28:02,480 >> separate question from all the stuff I 2039 01:28:02,480 --> 01:28:05,280 had a question around garages for ADUs. 2040 01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:07,600 Has anybody tried to add a garage to 2041 01:28:07,600 --> 01:28:08,960 ADU? 2042 01:28:08,960 --> 01:28:11,920 >> So, a garage to an ADU is a couple 2043 01:28:11,920 --> 01:28:13,600 things to look at. So, talking about a 2044 01:28:13,600 --> 01:28:16,960 detached ADU, the town still has a limit 2045 01:28:16,960 --> 01:28:20,719 of 1500 square ft of a an accessory 2046 01:28:20,719 --> 01:28:24,400 structure. Um, so if someone wanted to 2047 01:28:24,400 --> 01:28:27,440 uh use part of that accessory structure 2048 01:28:27,440 --> 01:28:29,040 limit as a garage, they would have a 2049 01:28:29,040 --> 01:28:32,159 smaller ADU or they could just have a 2050 01:28:32,159 --> 01:28:34,480 garage right next to their 1500 foot 2051 01:28:34,480 --> 01:28:36,880 structure um that wouldn't be part of 2052 01:28:36,880 --> 01:28:38,320 separate. 2053 01:28:38,320 --> 01:28:40,719 >> So it's a it's a matter of does the town 2054 01:28:40,719 --> 01:28:43,840 want to allow for larger structures 2055 01:28:43,840 --> 01:28:46,960 um that would include garages? It's 2056 01:28:46,960 --> 01:28:50,400 something that uh we h it it hasn't 2057 01:28:50,400 --> 01:28:52,560 people have asked about in the past but 2058 01:28:52,560 --> 01:28:55,199 it hasn't become any significant hurdle 2059 01:28:55,199 --> 01:28:57,360 or challenge to someone building an ADU. 2060 01:28:57,360 --> 01:29:01,600 >> If we if we talk about a 1500 2061 01:29:01,600 --> 01:29:02,800 it's a discussion item. 2062 01:29:02,800 --> 01:29:05,040 >> Sure. I mean, one one thing I'll just 2063 01:29:05,040 --> 01:29:07,440 note is that 2064 01:29:07,440 --> 01:29:10,400 to have a structure with an ADU and it's 2065 01:29:10,400 --> 01:29:13,360 larger, someone builds a garage, they 2066 01:29:13,360 --> 01:29:15,840 may come in later and say, "You have to 2067 01:29:15,840 --> 01:29:17,440 allow me to convert that garage into 2068 01:29:17,440 --> 01:29:20,560 part of my ADU." 2069 01:29:20,560 --> 01:29:23,760 So, it's it's the balance of trying to 2070 01:29:23,760 --> 01:29:27,360 provide some reasonable, 2071 01:29:27,360 --> 01:29:28,880 you know, 2072 01:29:28,880 --> 01:29:30,880 >> there's also a balance of rats eating 2073 01:29:30,880 --> 01:29:31,600 wiring. 2074 01:29:31,600 --> 01:29:34,080 >> Yep. Understood. Yeah. Yeah. No. Yeah. 2075 01:29:34,080 --> 01:29:35,440 The town 2076 01:29:35,440 --> 01:29:37,199 >> 1500 foot like my house when I bought it 2077 01:29:37,199 --> 01:29:40,639 was 1,400 bedrooms. We had a twoar shed 2078 01:29:40,639 --> 01:29:42,960 >> y sort of thing. So 2079 01:29:42,960 --> 01:29:44,320 >> they're actually making a living unit 2080 01:29:44,320 --> 01:29:48,080 for a separate family. 2081 01:29:48,080 --> 01:29:49,360 >> Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely something we 2082 01:29:49,360 --> 01:29:52,080 can think about more. Um and yeah, under 2083 01:29:52,080 --> 01:29:53,520 deliberation if that's something you 2084 01:29:53,520 --> 01:29:56,480 want us to look at increasing the sizes, 2085 01:29:56,480 --> 01:29:59,600 uh we can bring that back as well. 2086 01:29:59,600 --> 01:30:02,400 Um so so that's one item that was 2087 01:30:02,400 --> 01:30:05,440 brought up by uh Mr. Patrick. Um the 2088 01:30:05,440 --> 01:30:07,040 other item is something that he's 2089 01:30:07,040 --> 01:30:09,760 actually brought up in the past and um 2090 01:30:09,760 --> 01:30:13,199 we did think about this definitely. Uh 2091 01:30:13,199 --> 01:30:16,719 we we last time we amended the code, we 2092 01:30:16,719 --> 01:30:19,120 looked at amending we did amend the code 2093 01:30:19,120 --> 01:30:22,719 to allow for taller ADUs on downward 2094 01:30:22,719 --> 01:30:26,400 sloping lots from from public rightways. 2095 01:30:26,400 --> 01:30:27,920 And 2096 01:30:27,920 --> 01:30:30,880 um he's brought up the the point of well 2097 01:30:30,880 --> 01:30:32,800 you should allow on ups sloping lots 2098 01:30:32,800 --> 01:30:35,360 too. And one of the examples that I 2099 01:30:35,360 --> 01:30:37,920 think I most grasp from this is you have 2100 01:30:37,920 --> 01:30:39,520 a driveway kind of leading up to a 2101 01:30:39,520 --> 01:30:42,560 flatter area on this ups sloping lot. 2102 01:30:42,560 --> 01:30:44,880 You have this ADU that's kind of you 2103 01:30:44,880 --> 01:30:48,000 know now inward facing towards this 2104 01:30:48,000 --> 01:30:51,120 flatter part but they're now on this 2105 01:30:51,120 --> 01:30:52,880 downward slope and the downward slope is 2106 01:30:52,880 --> 01:30:54,960 facing the right of way. Shouldn't that 2107 01:30:54,960 --> 01:30:57,679 be allowed to be taller? Um, I really 2108 01:30:57,679 --> 01:31:00,000 appreciate actually that he's also 2109 01:31:00,000 --> 01:31:01,840 provided some suggested code language. 2110 01:31:01,840 --> 01:31:03,280 That's always very helpful for us to 2111 01:31:03,280 --> 01:31:05,840 kind of understand how that could work. 2112 01:31:05,840 --> 01:31:08,239 Um, this is something that, you know, if 2113 01:31:08,239 --> 01:31:10,320 the if the commission would like us to 2114 01:31:10,320 --> 01:31:13,360 explore further, I would. Uh, I some of 2115 01:31:13,360 --> 01:31:15,199 the just a little bit hesitation and why 2116 01:31:15,199 --> 01:31:18,000 it didn't make it into this um go around 2117 01:31:18,000 --> 01:31:19,520 was, 2118 01:31:19,520 --> 01:31:20,800 you know, you could talk about it just 2119 01:31:20,800 --> 01:31:24,400 based on a size of a property. Um, the 2120 01:31:24,400 --> 01:31:27,360 real intent was to be careful of 2121 01:31:27,360 --> 01:31:30,000 allowing very tall ADUs that are very 2122 01:31:30,000 --> 01:31:31,920 visible and imposing from the rightway 2123 01:31:31,920 --> 01:31:34,400 or sometimes to a neighboring property 2124 01:31:34,400 --> 01:31:37,590 and 2125 01:31:37,600 --> 01:31:39,520 just the size of the property sometimes 2126 01:31:39,520 --> 01:31:42,880 may not be the answer. Um, maybe 2127 01:31:42,880 --> 01:31:45,440 distance from a property line. Um, maybe 2128 01:31:45,440 --> 01:31:48,320 really looking at the the height of it, 2129 01:31:48,320 --> 01:31:50,880 you know, should it be allowed to be as 2130 01:31:50,880 --> 01:31:53,600 tall in the back? um what should go 2131 01:31:53,600 --> 01:31:55,280 should be allowed to go into that space 2132 01:31:55,280 --> 01:31:57,760 at the bottom. Um the way we did the 2133 01:31:57,760 --> 01:32:00,960 downward sloping lots, we said that we 2134 01:32:00,960 --> 01:32:04,480 don't take our plate height multiplier 2135 01:32:04,480 --> 01:32:06,159 measurement on the downward sloping 2136 01:32:06,159 --> 01:32:08,400 lots. If the lower level is not for 2137 01:32:08,400 --> 01:32:11,440 living space, um but if you want to make 2138 01:32:11,440 --> 01:32:13,440 it living space, it's okay. But we're 2139 01:32:13,440 --> 01:32:14,960 going to then use the multiplier and 2140 01:32:14,960 --> 01:32:16,400 that's going to go into the overall size 2141 01:32:16,400 --> 01:32:18,480 of that building. I think it would be 2142 01:32:18,480 --> 01:32:20,080 good to look at because when I built 2143 01:32:20,080 --> 01:32:23,520 mine um it was really hard to fit in the 2144 01:32:23,520 --> 01:32:26,239 plate height and my the 80 was still 2145 01:32:26,239 --> 01:32:27,199 below my front door. 2146 01:32:27,199 --> 01:32:27,840 >> Yeah. 2147 01:32:27,840 --> 01:32:29,360 >> Base of it. So it like it 2148 01:32:29,360 --> 01:32:30,560 >> there was a lot of Yeah. 2149 01:32:30,560 --> 01:32:31,840 >> lot of squeezing that had to happen. 2150 01:32:31,840 --> 01:32:32,800 >> So yeah. So 2151 01:32:32,800 --> 01:32:34,719 >> very short garage and a very short 2152 01:32:34,719 --> 01:32:35,199 >> Yep. 2153 01:32:35,199 --> 01:32:38,080 >> house. Yep. Understood. So So yeah. So 2154 01:32:38,080 --> 01:32:39,760 it's definitely a point. I think you 2155 01:32:39,760 --> 01:32:41,760 know I really appreciate the code and 2156 01:32:41,760 --> 01:32:43,920 I'd actually start to the suggestion if 2157 01:32:43,920 --> 01:32:45,280 the commission wants to look at that. 2158 01:32:45,280 --> 01:32:47,600 start with that and then look at, you 2159 01:32:47,600 --> 01:32:49,360 know, maybe providing a couple of guard 2160 01:32:49,360 --> 01:32:50,960 rails that the commission may want to 2161 01:32:50,960 --> 01:32:53,679 consider. Um, but that that was just the 2162 01:32:53,679 --> 01:32:56,159 main initial concern was, okay, let's 2163 01:32:56,159 --> 01:32:58,719 make sure that this works for what we're 2164 01:32:58,719 --> 01:33:00,639 intending it for. 2165 01:33:00,639 --> 01:33:02,320 >> Look at that further. 2166 01:33:02,320 --> 01:33:04,400 >> Going back to the you mentioned more 2167 01:33:04,400 --> 01:33:06,080 paved area 2168 01:33:06,080 --> 01:33:07,760 >> where where is that? I didn't see that 2169 01:33:07,760 --> 01:33:08,639 in the letter. 2170 01:33:08,639 --> 01:33:11,679 >> Oh, he had he submitted a second one. 2171 01:33:11,679 --> 01:33:13,280 There's two letters. Yes. Yeah. So, he 2172 01:33:13,280 --> 01:33:15,280 made me a a second email that actually 2173 01:33:15,280 --> 01:33:16,400 just came in right before the meeting 2174 01:33:16,400 --> 01:33:17,920 and I I'm pretty sure everyone got a 2175 01:33:17,920 --> 01:33:19,280 copy of it. 2176 01:33:19,280 --> 01:33:19,840 >> Um, 2177 01:33:19,840 --> 01:33:20,800 >> just came in. 2178 01:33:20,800 --> 01:33:23,199 >> Well, no, I'm sorry. It should Yeah. So, 2179 01:33:23,199 --> 01:33:25,760 yeah. Yeah. So, um, so yes. No, he 2180 01:33:25,760 --> 01:33:27,920 brought that up as well and and you 2181 01:33:27,920 --> 01:33:30,400 know, it's paved. He even brought it up. 2182 01:33:30,400 --> 01:33:32,400 He even kind of specifically mentioned, 2183 01:33:32,400 --> 01:33:34,719 you know, on our SCP lots, most of them 2184 01:33:34,719 --> 01:33:37,280 are allowed a 9,000 square foot minimum. 2185 01:33:37,280 --> 01:33:39,760 Um, I'm sorry, maximum for paved area. 2186 01:33:39,760 --> 01:33:42,880 And so, uh, you know, looking at some 2187 01:33:42,880 --> 01:33:45,840 additional clearcut paved area exemption 2188 01:33:45,840 --> 01:33:48,480 for ADUs. Be happy to look at that if 2189 01:33:48,480 --> 01:33:52,239 the commission would like us to. 2190 01:33:52,239 --> 01:33:55,520 Um, and then I do want to mention um 2191 01:33:55,520 --> 01:33:58,560 this other desk item. Uh, it's, uh, 2192 01:33:58,560 --> 01:34:01,040 comes in from Steve Luben. Um, I really 2193 01:34:01,040 --> 01:34:03,840 commend him for this idea. I totally 2194 01:34:03,840 --> 01:34:06,800 understand where he's coming from. Um 2195 01:34:06,800 --> 01:34:10,080 he's he's talked about looking at uh all 2196 01:34:10,080 --> 01:34:12,960 of the R1 zoning in a similar way to how 2197 01:34:12,960 --> 01:34:15,440 it was changed for the Glenn's. The 2198 01:34:15,440 --> 01:34:17,840 Glenn's is in an R1 zoning district and 2199 01:34:17,840 --> 01:34:19,600 as many are aware, I'm sure at least two 2200 01:34:19,600 --> 01:34:21,840 of you directly are aware given the 2201 01:34:21,840 --> 01:34:24,239 detailed um hearings we went through 2202 01:34:24,239 --> 01:34:28,560 then um that you know should something 2203 01:34:28,560 --> 01:34:30,560 like that or just immediately apply that 2204 01:34:30,560 --> 01:34:33,280 to all the R1 districts in town and that 2205 01:34:33,280 --> 01:34:35,120 could help provide some more flexibility 2206 01:34:35,120 --> 01:34:39,040 for ADUs. Uh so while I do think it's a 2207 01:34:39,040 --> 01:34:41,679 it's something worth exploring, it's a 2208 01:34:41,679 --> 01:34:42,960 little bit outside of the realm that's 2209 01:34:42,960 --> 01:34:45,120 directly related to ADUs. It's a little 2210 01:34:45,120 --> 01:34:47,840 bit larger of a process. U we want to 2211 01:34:47,840 --> 01:34:49,360 look at, you know, the different R1 2212 01:34:49,360 --> 01:34:54,560 areas. Uh but a point well taken. Um you 2213 01:34:54,560 --> 01:34:56,719 know, I I just don't know how it would 2214 01:34:56,719 --> 01:34:58,639 totally weave into this ordinance. 2215 01:34:58,639 --> 01:35:00,320 >> Yeah, that that makes sense. It was also 2216 01:35:00,320 --> 01:35:03,440 interesting there the um the size of the 2217 01:35:03,440 --> 01:35:05,920 lots in Palm Circle are also 2218 01:35:05,920 --> 01:35:07,760 non-conforming to me. It was it was kind 2219 01:35:07,760 --> 01:35:09,760 of another glands in a lot of ways. 2220 01:35:09,760 --> 01:35:11,360 >> It is. It is. No. And you look at the 2221 01:35:11,360 --> 01:35:13,440 Emerald Lake Hills, they have an R1 area 2222 01:35:13,440 --> 01:35:15,920 which shares a lot of the similar areas. 2223 01:35:15,920 --> 01:35:18,320 And then some of our other R1 areas are 2224 01:35:18,320 --> 01:35:20,000 kind of right here in the main town 2225 01:35:20,000 --> 01:35:22,560 corridor. Get over to by Prospect 2226 01:35:22,560 --> 01:35:26,639 Street. Um, and so it's definitely worth 2227 01:35:26,639 --> 01:35:28,159 looking into, but I think it's a little 2228 01:35:28,159 --> 01:35:29,760 bit needs a little bit more holistic 2229 01:35:29,760 --> 01:35:32,239 approach to it. 2230 01:35:32,239 --> 01:35:33,840 So with that, that concludes my 2231 01:35:33,840 --> 01:35:37,040 presentation. Um, and think we've gone 2232 01:35:37,040 --> 01:35:38,880 through the questions. If you have any 2233 01:35:38,880 --> 01:35:40,000 other additional questions this time, 2234 01:35:40,000 --> 01:35:42,000 otherwise we can roll up to public and 2235 01:35:42,000 --> 01:35:43,520 then we can go back to deliberation for 2236 01:35:43,520 --> 01:35:48,550 more questions if you have any. 2237 01:35:48,560 --> 01:35:50,719 » All right, we will go ahead and open uh 2238 01:35:50,719 --> 01:35:52,400 public comment then. Is there are there 2239 01:35:52,400 --> 01:35:54,560 members of the public here in the room 2240 01:35:54,560 --> 01:35:56,159 or on Zoom who would like to make a 2241 01:35:56,159 --> 01:36:00,870 comment? 2242 01:36:00,880 --> 01:36:03,679 » I'll go first. 2243 01:36:03,679 --> 01:36:06,480 >> Good evening. I'm Steve Patrick. I live 2244 01:36:06,480 --> 01:36:09,520 at 732 West Glway Lake. Congratulations, 2245 01:36:09,520 --> 01:36:12,800 Chairgar, on the appointment as 2246 01:36:12,800 --> 01:36:15,600 chairman. Quite a few years ago, I sat 2247 01:36:15,600 --> 01:36:18,880 there and it's, you know, I don't it was 2248 01:36:18,880 --> 01:36:20,480 I was going to say thankless, but it's 2249 01:36:20,480 --> 01:36:23,600 not. I mean it uh 2250 01:36:23,600 --> 01:36:24,320 >> after today 2251 01:36:24,320 --> 01:36:25,679 >> you got to put your fingerprints on 2252 01:36:25,679 --> 01:36:30,480 everything for a while and then it's great that all of you do the public 2253 01:36:30,480 --> 01:36:32,239 service thing. That's what's needed in 2254 01:36:32,239 --> 01:36:34,239 this town and in all towns and all 2255 01:36:34,239 --> 01:36:36,960 communities. So appreciate all your work 2256 01:36:36,960 --> 01:36:41,040 on that uh as missionaries. Um actually 2257 01:36:41,040 --> 01:36:43,040 just kind of piggybacking on what Sage 2258 01:36:43,040 --> 01:36:45,119 just went over the two points I had and 2259 01:36:45,119 --> 01:36:47,600 I think he was pretty clear. I think 2260 01:36:47,600 --> 01:36:51,440 that um there should be some provision 2261 01:36:51,440 --> 01:36:56,000 for the UPS sloped lots and if there's 2262 01:36:56,000 --> 01:36:58,719 enough as he says guard rails and I kind 2263 01:36:58,719 --> 01:37:00,719 of pointed out potential guard rails 2264 01:37:00,719 --> 01:37:02,480 that would be there like the lot should 2265 01:37:02,480 --> 01:37:05,040 be big enough and actually even in the 2266 01:37:05,040 --> 01:37:08,159 way it's written now um with the 2267 01:37:08,159 --> 01:37:11,199 provision for setbacks that structure 2268 01:37:11,199 --> 01:37:13,360 would have to follow actually setbacks 2269 01:37:13,360 --> 01:37:16,080 not ADU setbacks so it couldn't be you 2270 01:37:16,080 --> 01:37:18,000 know 4T from the back property line or 2271 01:37:18,000 --> 01:37:19,280 four feet from the side property line. 2272 01:37:19,280 --> 01:37:20,719 It would have to follow all normal 2273 01:37:20,719 --> 01:37:25,679 setbacks and uh you know I actually the 2274 01:37:25,679 --> 01:37:28,239 reason it really came to light was we're 2275 01:37:28,239 --> 01:37:31,840 working on a project and it's the the 2276 01:37:31,840 --> 01:37:33,360 driveway goes all the way up to the back 2277 01:37:33,360 --> 01:37:34,719 of the property and then from the 2278 01:37:34,719 --> 01:37:36,239 property it does slope down to the 2279 01:37:36,239 --> 01:37:39,040 street but the ADU would be well within 2280 01:37:39,040 --> 01:37:41,440 the or well beyond the 50ft front 2281 01:37:41,440 --> 01:37:45,440 setback. So it's no more imposing than 2282 01:37:45,440 --> 01:37:47,840 even a you know the main house the main 2283 01:37:47,840 --> 01:37:49,199 residence could be. It just happens to 2284 01:37:49,199 --> 01:37:50,880 be the way this was configured over the 2285 01:37:50,880 --> 01:37:54,000 last probably 40 50 years. So it seems 2286 01:37:54,000 --> 01:37:56,159 there should be some provision to allow 2287 01:37:56,159 --> 01:37:58,960 something with kind of unique 2288 01:37:58,960 --> 01:38:01,679 circumstance and actually uh you know 2289 01:38:01,679 --> 01:38:04,480 sites that are 35% it is somewhat 2290 01:38:04,480 --> 01:38:07,040 unique. I mean, they're they're there 2291 01:38:07,040 --> 01:38:10,320 and seems like they're uh more con the 2292 01:38:10,320 --> 01:38:12,239 more constrained sites are starting to 2293 01:38:12,239 --> 01:38:15,440 appear as building sites now with ADUs. 2294 01:38:15,440 --> 01:38:18,000 So, uh having done this for 40 years in 2295 01:38:18,000 --> 01:38:21,360 town, I realized that this ADU provision 2296 01:38:21,360 --> 01:38:23,280 is really opening up the possibility for 2297 01:38:23,280 --> 01:38:25,360 people to, you know, have family homes 2298 01:38:25,360 --> 01:38:28,480 and, you know, uh expand that 2299 01:38:28,480 --> 01:38:30,880 possibility. The other one that kind of 2300 01:38:30,880 --> 01:38:32,560 came up and I apologize that I didn't 2301 01:38:32,560 --> 01:38:34,719 get it as a desk item sooner, but it was 2302 01:38:34,719 --> 01:38:36,560 kind of late in the day and I just kind 2303 01:38:36,560 --> 01:38:39,520 of realized that, you know, we actually 2304 01:38:39,520 --> 01:38:41,119 was discussed in great length about 2305 01:38:41,119 --> 01:38:43,280 second driveways. Well, how do you do a 2306 01:38:43,280 --> 01:38:45,600 second driveway if you're primarily I 2307 01:38:45,600 --> 01:38:48,159 said an SPC site where you're only 2308 01:38:48,159 --> 01:38:50,080 allowed 9,000 square feet and if you 2309 01:38:50,080 --> 01:38:52,239 have a driveway that has to go up and 2310 01:38:52,239 --> 01:38:54,080 then you brought up the fire department 2311 01:38:54,080 --> 01:38:55,600 requirement that you have to do a 2312 01:38:55,600 --> 01:38:58,000 turnaround in front of your new ADU 2313 01:38:58,000 --> 01:39:00,800 because you got to be so far and it's 2314 01:39:00,800 --> 01:39:03,600 really impossible. So what you have to 2315 01:39:03,600 --> 01:39:05,840 look at investigating is well we'll tear 2316 01:39:05,840 --> 01:39:07,520 out their front walkway and we'll tear 2317 01:39:07,520 --> 01:39:10,719 out the pool patio and we'll put gravel 2318 01:39:10,719 --> 01:39:13,440 around this and it's just seems like 2319 01:39:13,440 --> 01:39:15,760 it's not the intent as if you're going 2320 01:39:15,760 --> 01:39:17,280 to allow ADUs and you're going to allow 2321 01:39:17,280 --> 01:39:19,360 second driveways and I don't want to say 2322 01:39:19,360 --> 01:39:20,719 going to allow I think it's wonderful 2323 01:39:20,719 --> 01:39:22,560 that we're allowing ADUs second 2324 01:39:22,560 --> 01:39:26,080 driveways and actually four ADUs on a 2325 01:39:26,080 --> 01:39:28,080 property plus the main house and then 2326 01:39:28,080 --> 01:39:31,119 still limit the uh impervious surface 2327 01:39:31,119 --> 01:39:35,840 area to 9,000 ft on an SCP lot. It it 2328 01:39:35,840 --> 01:39:39,199 really doesn't calculate. And uh so I'd 2329 01:39:39,199 --> 01:39:41,040 love it to have you consider that. I 2330 01:39:41,040 --> 01:39:43,440 think the work that's uh staff has done 2331 01:39:43,440 --> 01:39:45,920 and all your deliberations, it's 2332 01:39:45,920 --> 01:39:49,679 wonderful. I appreciate it. Um and as 2333 01:39:49,679 --> 01:39:51,760 Sage pointed out, there is an 2334 01:39:51,760 --> 01:39:56,880 opportunity to kind of work this over the next month, which is useful. It 2335 01:39:56,880 --> 01:39:59,119 doesn't have to be a knee-jerk reaction. 2336 01:39:59,119 --> 01:40:01,119 and said, "No, we just can't absorb that 2337 01:40:01,119 --> 01:40:03,520 much at this time." I think it's really 2338 01:40:03,520 --> 01:40:05,440 worthwhile that, you know, Sage is going 2339 01:40:05,440 --> 01:40:08,560 to be able to rework some verbiage in 2340 01:40:08,560 --> 01:40:10,639 there and make it work for more people 2341 01:40:10,639 --> 01:40:14,320 in town to have, you know, enjoy family 2342 01:40:14,320 --> 01:40:16,560 properties. So, thanks for your time and 2343 01:40:16,560 --> 01:40:23,910 your consideration. 2344 01:40:23,920 --> 01:40:26,320 » Good evening. I'm Carrie Diller, 50 2345 01:40:26,320 --> 01:40:30,400 Prospect, uh, homeowner and ADU owner. I 2346 01:40:30,400 --> 01:40:32,880 also am the founder of Inspired ADUs, 2347 01:40:32,880 --> 01:40:35,760 uh, a architecture firm focused on ADUs. 2348 01:40:35,760 --> 01:40:38,320 I think we've just permitted over 300 in 2349 01:40:38,320 --> 01:40:41,199 the Bay Area and we have 13 active going 2350 01:40:41,199 --> 01:40:43,600 in Woodside. Um, it's been amazing 2351 01:40:43,600 --> 01:40:46,320 working with Sage and the team um, to 2352 01:40:46,320 --> 01:40:48,639 get those going, interpret this crazy 2353 01:40:48,639 --> 01:40:50,960 state law that's changing every few 2354 01:40:50,960 --> 01:40:53,679 minutes. Um, so I just wanted to give a 2355 01:40:53,679 --> 01:40:55,520 couple other points for consideration as 2356 01:40:55,520 --> 01:40:58,000 you start your debate on the up on the 2357 01:40:58,000 --> 01:41:00,159 topics we've discussed tonight. So the 2358 01:41:00,159 --> 01:41:02,880 second driveway is super uh I think it's 2359 01:41:02,880 --> 01:41:06,000 a super important thing to make these um 2360 01:41:06,000 --> 01:41:08,560 units really function improve the fire 2361 01:41:08,560 --> 01:41:11,119 access. Um that's a real big point. So, 2362 01:41:11,119 --> 01:41:14,320 I think a simple clarity of of trying to 2363 01:41:14,320 --> 01:41:16,080 add more ADUs and not limiting the 2364 01:41:16,080 --> 01:41:18,880 driveway to only serving one ADU or 2365 01:41:18,880 --> 01:41:20,719 saying specifically what it should be 2366 01:41:20,719 --> 01:41:22,560 serving, uh, I think would be great. 2367 01:41:22,560 --> 01:41:24,800 Just a simple clarification of that code 2368 01:41:24,800 --> 01:41:28,960 at that number three. Uh, the 150 foot 2369 01:41:28,960 --> 01:41:31,119 exemption to add on for egress and 2370 01:41:31,119 --> 01:41:32,960 ingress is a strange one that came about 2371 01:41:32,960 --> 01:41:35,280 a long time ago, but we are actually 2372 01:41:35,280 --> 01:41:37,760 seeing um the need for it, especially 2373 01:41:37,760 --> 01:41:39,440 with some of the barn conversions we're 2374 01:41:39,440 --> 01:41:42,000 doing in town. in order to not change 2375 01:41:42,000 --> 01:41:44,320 the footprint and the integrity of the 2376 01:41:44,320 --> 01:41:46,639 barn, but to make it a usable, habitable 2377 01:41:46,639 --> 01:41:49,119 place. Um, that weird little code is 2378 01:41:49,119 --> 01:41:51,360 actually proving to be helpful in a lot 2379 01:41:51,360 --> 01:41:54,080 of ADUs we're doing because the state 2380 01:41:54,080 --> 01:41:57,280 limited that code to ingress and egress. 2381 01:41:57,280 --> 01:41:58,880 It's a little more hard to manipulate 2382 01:41:58,880 --> 01:42:00,719 and make it into these extra bedrooms 2383 01:42:00,719 --> 01:42:02,480 and things. And I think we are seeing 2384 01:42:02,480 --> 01:42:04,800 historically through the years of of 2385 01:42:04,800 --> 01:42:07,440 permitting it to use that it is helping 2386 01:42:07,440 --> 01:42:09,920 um if it helps at all on the mechanical 2387 01:42:09,920 --> 01:42:12,080 equipment. Typically those mini split 2388 01:42:12,080 --> 01:42:15,199 systems are about 6 in off a unit and 2389 01:42:15,199 --> 01:42:17,760 can be up to about 20 ft for the line 2390 01:42:17,760 --> 01:42:20,960 set. So you have some play in terms of 2391 01:42:20,960 --> 01:42:22,560 what's immediate and not if that's 2392 01:42:22,560 --> 01:42:24,960 helpful. Um 2393 01:42:24,960 --> 01:42:30,000 I would also support uh raising that 800 2394 01:42:30,000 --> 01:42:32,719 uh to 1,200 in regard to the flexibility 2395 01:42:32,719 --> 01:42:34,560 that the planning department has for 2396 01:42:34,560 --> 01:42:37,440 lots. Um it was the second upgrade from 2397 01:42:37,440 --> 01:42:40,560 the 8 to 1200. Um there are a lot of 2398 01:42:40,560 --> 01:42:42,560 lots in Woodside that have really unique 2399 01:42:42,560 --> 01:42:44,880 like our home for example is a flag lot. 2400 01:42:44,880 --> 01:42:47,199 So although we have a large parcel the 2401 01:42:47,199 --> 01:42:50,480 area where we can do units based on 2402 01:42:50,480 --> 01:42:53,360 septic and then the fire overlay. So 2403 01:42:53,360 --> 01:42:55,280 fire department has requirements in 2404 01:42:55,280 --> 01:42:57,920 terms of how um far you can go to be 2405 01:42:57,920 --> 01:42:59,679 reached by a fire truck to make the 2406 01:42:59,679 --> 01:43:02,159 project viable. Um and so sometimes 2407 01:43:02,159 --> 01:43:04,320 putting those units closer to the front 2408 01:43:04,320 --> 01:43:06,719 or in the front yard is improving 2409 01:43:06,719 --> 01:43:08,800 overall life safety and I don't think is 2410 01:43:08,800 --> 01:43:12,639 necessarily um making a problematic 2411 01:43:12,639 --> 01:43:14,400 architectural contribution. And I think 2412 01:43:14,400 --> 01:43:16,080 if the planning director and department 2413 01:43:16,080 --> 01:43:18,480 have a say on that that moving that to 2414 01:43:18,480 --> 01:43:24,000 1,200 is is an excellent thing to do. Um 2415 01:43:24,000 --> 01:43:27,679 and then finally on the legalization, thing has been very 2416 01:43:27,679 --> 01:43:30,480 complicated and there's a real gap uh 2417 01:43:30,480 --> 01:43:33,679 between actually getting units legalized 2418 01:43:33,679 --> 01:43:36,000 and what the state's done so far. The 2419 01:43:36,000 --> 01:43:37,920 state has made a long checklist. There's 2420 01:43:37,920 --> 01:43:40,239 a short checklist and a long checklist. 2421 01:43:40,239 --> 01:43:42,320 But what they did as they often do is 2422 01:43:42,320 --> 01:43:44,880 leave a lot of ambigu ambiguity in the 2423 01:43:44,880 --> 01:43:46,880 language. So it says that the authority 2424 01:43:46,880 --> 01:43:49,119 having jurisdiction in terms of the 2425 01:43:49,119 --> 01:43:53,119 inspectors can approve something if it 2426 01:43:53,119 --> 01:43:55,280 if the health and wellness and life 2427 01:43:55,280 --> 01:43:58,639 safety of the occupants is not harmful. 2428 01:43:58,639 --> 01:44:02,320 So it's um very difficult. The current 2429 01:44:02,320 --> 01:44:03,840 process we've been going through is that 2430 01:44:03,840 --> 01:44:05,679 a client has to hire us. We have to 2431 01:44:05,679 --> 01:44:07,679 design the whole thing then submit it to 2432 01:44:07,679 --> 01:44:09,760 the town. Then we get feedback from 2433 01:44:09,760 --> 01:44:13,440 building which is asking us to x-ray 2434 01:44:13,440 --> 01:44:14,960 slabs or prove that there's 2435 01:44:14,960 --> 01:44:16,960 waterproofing or appropriate rebar. 2436 01:44:16,960 --> 01:44:18,719 Well, we have several structures from 2437 01:44:18,719 --> 01:44:21,040 the 40s and 50s that obviously are not 2438 01:44:21,040 --> 01:44:23,280 going to have any of those things. And 2439 01:44:23,280 --> 01:44:25,440 if the clients are required to scrape 2440 01:44:25,440 --> 01:44:27,119 the whole thing, lift it up, put in a 2441 01:44:27,119 --> 01:44:28,320 new foundation, they're not going to 2442 01:44:28,320 --> 01:44:31,679 legalize it. So, um there is a lot of 2443 01:44:31,679 --> 01:44:33,679 other ways that inspectors could go out 2444 01:44:33,679 --> 01:44:35,360 in the field. I do think it could be 2445 01:44:35,360 --> 01:44:37,280 something that's a paid for service that 2446 01:44:37,280 --> 01:44:39,199 could either then be reimbured if you 2447 01:44:39,199 --> 01:44:42,000 permit the unit or just be a paid for 2448 01:44:42,000 --> 01:44:45,119 service because um people are living in 2449 01:44:45,119 --> 01:44:46,960 these units. Fire department doesn't 2450 01:44:46,960 --> 01:44:49,119 necessarily know they're there. Um 2451 01:44:49,119 --> 01:44:50,880 you're not necessarily getting tax 2452 01:44:50,880 --> 01:44:53,760 assessment on them for the tax income. 2453 01:44:53,760 --> 01:44:55,920 Uh, and there are a lot of things that 2454 01:44:55,920 --> 01:44:58,080 this inspection could catch like faulty 2455 01:44:58,080 --> 01:45:01,280 wiring, like plumbing or uh limited 2456 01:45:01,280 --> 01:45:03,360 windows or doors for life safety that 2457 01:45:03,360 --> 01:45:05,199 could be improved. But there are some 2458 01:45:05,199 --> 01:45:07,520 considerable things that if a slab isn't 2459 01:45:07,520 --> 01:45:08,800 cracked, if there's no water 2460 01:45:08,800 --> 01:45:11,360 infiltration, if it looks sound and 2461 01:45:11,360 --> 01:45:12,719 whole and people have been living there 2462 01:45:12,719 --> 01:45:15,360 for 20 years, that it's probably okay to 2463 01:45:15,360 --> 01:45:18,560 keep going. So, um I think it's not a 2464 01:45:18,560 --> 01:45:20,480 planning, but if the uh planning 2465 01:45:20,480 --> 01:45:22,800 commission made a recommendation to city 2466 01:45:22,800 --> 01:45:24,480 council that they adopt something like 2467 01:45:24,480 --> 01:45:27,280 this, it could really there are a lot of 2468 01:45:27,280 --> 01:45:30,239 illegal units um in Woodside. And I 2469 01:45:30,239 --> 01:45:31,520 think it would be a great way to get 2470 01:45:31,520 --> 01:45:33,520 your numbers up, but also just make 2471 01:45:33,520 --> 01:45:36,159 healthier living for people um and make 2472 01:45:36,159 --> 01:45:38,159 it reasonable because otherwise they're 2473 01:45:38,159 --> 01:45:41,119 too intrepidacious to to move forward. 2474 01:45:41,119 --> 01:45:43,760 Um thank you. And I also support Steve's 2475 01:45:43,760 --> 01:45:46,400 um ideas of ex extending the paving and 2476 01:45:46,400 --> 01:45:49,440 thinking about the slope sites. We're um 2477 01:45:49,440 --> 01:45:52,159 we're just working on one on Glenn Craig 2478 01:45:52,159 --> 01:45:53,600 this morning that could use a little 2479 01:45:53,600 --> 01:45:55,280 help on that one. So, thank you very 2480 01:45:55,280 --> 01:45:57,679 much. 2481 01:45:57,679 --> 01:46:00,080 >> One one followup question maybe to to 2482 01:46:00,080 --> 01:46:03,119 Sage or or or yourself. The fire 2483 01:46:03,119 --> 01:46:05,440 department requirements for is that 2484 01:46:05,440 --> 01:46:08,960 distance from a road to the structure or 2485 01:46:08,960 --> 01:46:10,320 that hasn't come up in any of the 2486 01:46:10,320 --> 01:46:11,760 projects. So, there's a couple different 2487 01:46:11,760 --> 01:46:13,600 pieces with fire. There's a distance 2488 01:46:13,600 --> 01:46:15,600 from the hydrant to the property. And 2489 01:46:15,600 --> 01:46:16,960 then there's a distance from where the 2490 01:46:16,960 --> 01:46:19,119 fire truck can come onto the property or 2491 01:46:19,119 --> 01:46:22,080 park. And then there's a a hose distance 2492 01:46:22,080 --> 01:46:24,719 from the fire truck where the hose has 2493 01:46:24,719 --> 01:46:27,760 to get to the rear side of the ADU. 2494 01:46:27,760 --> 01:46:31,360 >> So, if that exceeds 150 ft, uh, so 2495 01:46:31,360 --> 01:46:32,880 there's a bunch of different numbers. 2496 01:46:32,880 --> 01:46:35,920 they'll save you the the but if either 2497 01:46:35,920 --> 01:46:38,159 of those two things get exceeded you can 2498 01:46:38,159 --> 01:46:40,800 require hydrant which makes some 2499 01:46:40,800 --> 01:46:44,080 projects not plausible for clients andor 2500 01:46:44,080 --> 01:46:47,360 um fire sprinklers or both or a fire 2501 01:46:47,360 --> 01:46:49,440 turnaround which some properties don't 2502 01:46:49,440 --> 01:46:52,480 support. So it it can really limit kind 2503 01:46:52,480 --> 01:46:54,080 of the area of where you could actually 2504 01:46:54,080 --> 01:46:56,400 build an ADU which you don't necessarily 2505 01:46:56,400 --> 01:46:58,480 see at the planning side of things. 2506 01:46:58,480 --> 01:47:04,550 Yeah. 2507 01:47:04,560 --> 01:47:06,080 For those online, please use a raise 2508 01:47:06,080 --> 01:47:07,360 hand feature if you'd like to make a 2509 01:47:07,360 --> 01:47:11,430 comment. 2510 01:47:11,440 --> 01:47:14,159 I see no raised hands 2511 01:47:14,159 --> 01:47:17,990 comments in the room. 2512 01:47:18,000 --> 01:47:20,159 All right, that we will go ahead and 2513 01:47:20,159 --> 01:47:22,320 close public comment and move on to 2514 01:47:22,320 --> 01:47:24,880 commissioner deliberation. So, we have a 2515 01:47:24,880 --> 01:47:28,000 lot of things go through. Uh maybe we'll 2516 01:47:28,000 --> 01:47:31,119 go sort of one by one the same same way 2517 01:47:31,119 --> 01:47:32,800 that that that Sage had done for the 2518 01:47:32,800 --> 01:47:36,800 initial presentation. And 2519 01:47:36,800 --> 01:47:38,880 Sage, can can we do something where 2520 01:47:38,880 --> 01:47:42,159 you're helping take notes of where do we 2521 01:47:42,159 --> 01:47:44,400 land on each issue and then we do motion 2522 01:47:44,400 --> 01:47:45,360 at the end? 2523 01:47:45,360 --> 01:47:47,440 >> Sure. Yeah. Yeah. No, I think we can go 2524 01:47:47,440 --> 01:47:49,440 through each issue and maybe get a straw 2525 01:47:49,440 --> 01:47:51,920 poll um from the commission. It's worth 2526 01:47:51,920 --> 01:47:53,199 moving forward and then Yes. 2527 01:47:53,199 --> 01:47:55,280 >> And then we do a 2528 01:47:55,280 --> 01:47:56,560 we do one of these things where you read 2529 01:47:56,560 --> 01:47:57,840 out the laundry list and 2530 01:47:57,840 --> 01:47:58,480 >> Sounds good. 2531 01:47:58,480 --> 01:47:59,920 >> Down we go. We don't we don't have to 2532 01:47:59,920 --> 01:48:01,520 decide language today. 2533 01:48:01,520 --> 01:48:03,840 >> No, it Yeah. What you'll do is give us a 2534 01:48:03,840 --> 01:48:06,880 motion um you'll be providing a motion 2535 01:48:06,880 --> 01:48:09,360 with direction to staff um to come back 2536 01:48:09,360 --> 01:48:10,800 with specific items. 2537 01:48:10,800 --> 01:48:12,880 >> So we would make 2538 01:48:12,880 --> 01:48:13,199 >> Yeah. 2539 01:48:13,199 --> 01:48:15,440 >> So it'll sort of ratify the 2540 01:48:15,440 --> 01:48:15,920 recommendations. 2541 01:48:15,920 --> 01:48:17,199 >> Those are things that we'll come back 2542 01:48:17,199 --> 01:48:19,760 with and we'll we'll renotice it for the 2543 01:48:19,760 --> 01:48:22,159 public when that when that we nail down 2544 01:48:22,159 --> 01:48:24,560 the date. We we'd shoot for the second 2545 01:48:24,560 --> 01:48:27,440 meeting in May. Okay. 2546 01:48:27,440 --> 01:48:30,159 >> All right. 2547 01:48:30,159 --> 01:48:33,920 So in that case, let's go back to 2548 01:48:33,920 --> 01:48:35,760 >> and I could even just, you know, what 2549 01:48:35,760 --> 01:48:38,080 I've taken so far and just as we go 2550 01:48:38,080 --> 01:48:39,920 through a section. So the first item we 2551 01:48:39,920 --> 01:48:42,080 were talking about was the second 2552 01:48:42,080 --> 01:48:47,119 driveways. Um we wanted to look at um 2553 01:48:47,119 --> 01:48:48,719 that 2554 01:48:48,719 --> 01:48:50,880 uh one that it can serve more than one 2555 01:48:50,880 --> 01:48:52,960 proposed ADU. Um so we want to make sure 2556 01:48:52,960 --> 01:48:57,920 that that's clarified. Um and then also 2557 01:48:57,920 --> 01:49:00,880 we want to make sure that 2558 01:49:00,880 --> 01:49:03,600 uh that there's more flexibility um in 2559 01:49:03,600 --> 01:49:05,440 the language specifically in the finding 2560 01:49:05,440 --> 01:49:09,119 number three uh that would 2561 01:49:09,119 --> 01:49:11,199 if there's kind of incidental access to 2562 01:49:11,199 --> 01:49:13,600 another building um that wouldn't be 2563 01:49:13,600 --> 01:49:15,760 something that would hold it up or also 2564 01:49:15,760 --> 01:49:18,159 even if it connects to some other 2565 01:49:18,159 --> 01:49:26,550 circulation system on the property that shouldn't be a limitating factor. 2566 01:49:26,560 --> 01:49:30,159 folks. So, deliberation wise, do we all 2567 01:49:30,159 --> 01:49:32,000 >> I'm supportive of those? 2568 01:49:32,000 --> 01:49:35,679 >> I'm good. Additional that. 2569 01:49:35,679 --> 01:49:38,950 >> Okay, 2570 01:49:38,960 --> 01:49:40,880 » supportive. Any any additional things we 2571 01:49:40,880 --> 01:49:43,040 want to add to that? 2572 01:49:43,040 --> 01:49:43,679 >> Okay, 2573 01:49:43,679 --> 01:49:44,159 >> great. 2574 01:49:44,159 --> 01:49:46,080 >> All right, let's move on. The next one 2575 01:49:46,080 --> 01:49:49,199 um was just going into our definitions 2576 01:49:49,199 --> 01:49:51,600 um and that was looking at more of the 2577 01:49:51,600 --> 01:49:55,280 clarification of uh the permanent stove 2578 01:49:55,280 --> 01:49:57,199 um versus a non-permanent cooking 2579 01:49:57,199 --> 01:49:59,360 facility. We'll look at see how we we'll 2580 01:49:59,360 --> 01:50:00,800 talk to the building department see if 2581 01:50:00,800 --> 01:50:02,159 there's any more clarification that we 2582 01:50:02,159 --> 01:50:03,440 can make that a little bit better. 2583 01:50:03,440 --> 01:50:05,040 >> Perfect. 2584 01:50:05,040 --> 01:50:06,800 >> Everyone good with that? 2585 01:50:06,800 --> 01:50:11,590 >> Okay. 2586 01:50:11,600 --> 01:50:14,239 And we hit the 150. 2587 01:50:14,239 --> 01:50:15,920 No, excuse me. The 1,200. 2588 01:50:15,920 --> 01:50:18,400 >> Yeah. So, the there the question is um 2589 01:50:18,400 --> 01:50:20,159 and I don't know that we got any real 2590 01:50:20,159 --> 01:50:22,639 significant feedback on that. Um was 2591 01:50:22,639 --> 01:50:24,960 that right now we're proposing to exempt 2592 01:50:24,960 --> 01:50:27,360 up to 1,200. So, the first question is 2593 01:50:27,360 --> 01:50:30,800 should we exempt it up to,200? Um or do 2594 01:50:30,800 --> 01:50:33,440 you want to increase that up to 1500? Uh 2595 01:50:33,440 --> 01:50:35,040 if you wanted to increase it higher than 2596 01:50:35,040 --> 01:50:39,040 1,200, um you know, do you want to say 2597 01:50:39,040 --> 01:50:40,800 yeah, that's okay, but maybe only for 2598 01:50:40,800 --> 01:50:42,960 properties that are an acre or larger. 2599 01:50:42,960 --> 01:50:44,400 Um, so those were some of the ideas 2600 01:50:44,400 --> 01:50:47,360 floated. 2601 01:50:47,360 --> 01:50:50,639 >> Yeah. Yeah. So I actually like the 2602 01:50:50,639 --> 01:50:53,280 concept of 1500 because that says one 2603 01:50:53,280 --> 01:50:55,040 big bedroom, two small bedrooms. So 2604 01:50:55,040 --> 01:50:59,679 family, two kids uh would fit that. 2605 01:50:59,679 --> 01:51:00,880 That's the size of our house when we 2606 01:51:00,880 --> 01:51:04,080 first bought it. Um 1,500 would have 2607 01:51:04,080 --> 01:51:08,159 been hard to put into my Glenn's lot. Um 2608 01:51:08,159 --> 01:51:12,080 we put in eight. Eight. eight was a big 2609 01:51:12,080 --> 01:51:14,480 1,200 wouldn't have really fit. 1,500 2610 01:51:14,480 --> 01:51:16,960 definitely wouldn't fit. So, so I I 2611 01:51:16,960 --> 01:51:18,960 think that for those that can have 2612 01:51:18,960 --> 01:51:22,400 1,200, maybe that that is a ceiling for 2613 01:51:22,400 --> 01:51:24,800 smaller lots and then 1,500 for the 2614 01:51:24,800 --> 01:51:26,480 bigger lots maybe something I'd toss out 2615 01:51:26,480 --> 01:51:27,920 there. That's that see it seems 2616 01:51:27,920 --> 01:51:29,520 reasonable. I mean, if if if the whole 2617 01:51:29,520 --> 01:51:34,080 town, if you're a SR, whatever what the 2618 01:51:34,080 --> 01:51:37,440 one is, if that's up to 1500, why not 2619 01:51:37,440 --> 01:51:39,119 have that be consistent across the code 2620 01:51:39,119 --> 01:51:41,360 for all the large lots? 2621 01:51:41,360 --> 01:51:43,360 Um, 2622 01:51:43,360 --> 01:51:44,960 >> and this one, ju just to make sure we're 2623 01:51:44,960 --> 01:51:47,520 all on the same page. This is not You 2624 01:51:47,520 --> 01:51:50,000 can still build an ADU up to 1500, 2625 01:51:50,000 --> 01:51:52,159 right? This is about the the increased 2626 01:51:52,159 --> 01:51:53,440 TFA. 2627 01:51:53,440 --> 01:51:54,960 >> Yes. 2628 01:51:54,960 --> 01:51:57,119 I kind of think that the town wants it 2629 01:51:57,119 --> 01:51:58,560 seems like we we're all leaning towards 2630 01:51:58,560 --> 01:52:02,080 making their first ADU free from a TFA 2631 01:52:02,080 --> 01:52:04,400 point of view. Um and so if the large 2632 01:52:04,400 --> 01:52:07,679 lots can make 1500 then fits then why 2633 01:52:07,679 --> 01:52:09,760 not? The small lots I just don't think 2634 01:52:09,760 --> 01:52:11,520 it'll fit 2635 01:52:11,520 --> 01:52:17,510 with a Houston house. 2636 01:52:17,520 --> 01:52:19,599 I would actually am in the strange 2637 01:52:19,599 --> 01:52:23,360 position of wanting to keep it at 1,200 2638 01:52:23,360 --> 01:52:26,960 because as was pointed out um I mean 2639 01:52:26,960 --> 01:52:30,320 1500 square feet that's one master two 2640 01:52:30,320 --> 01:52:33,040 smaller bedrooms that could hold a 2641 01:52:33,040 --> 01:52:35,679 family of four. There are lots of 2642 01:52:35,679 --> 01:52:38,320 tracked houses in the East Bay and in 2643 01:52:38,320 --> 01:52:41,599 Redwood City that fit that description. 2644 01:52:41,599 --> 01:52:43,760 And 2645 01:52:43,760 --> 01:52:46,000 that sort of 2646 01:52:46,000 --> 01:52:48,239 calling that an edu seems like a really 2647 01:52:48,239 --> 01:52:50,560 bit of a stretch. 2648 01:52:50,560 --> 01:52:54,159 If you have a property that's already 2649 01:52:54,159 --> 01:52:59,840 been developed and maxed out on TFA 2650 01:52:59,840 --> 01:53:02,719 for the main residence or whatever, 2651 01:53:02,719 --> 01:53:06,719 giving essentially being able to drop an 2652 01:53:06,719 --> 01:53:10,159 extra track home in there, I can see 2653 01:53:10,159 --> 01:53:12,400 from an affordable housing and policy 2654 01:53:12,400 --> 01:53:14,239 standpoint 2655 01:53:14,239 --> 01:53:16,159 that 2656 01:53:16,159 --> 01:53:18,880 at one level that's desirable, 2657 01:53:18,880 --> 01:53:21,760 but on the other hand, It is essentially 2658 01:53:21,760 --> 01:53:24,320 we're talking about dropping another 2659 01:53:24,320 --> 01:53:28,719 small home rather than an ADU on there. 2660 01:53:28,719 --> 01:53:32,320 And if you're planning a building site, 2661 01:53:32,320 --> 01:53:36,000 if you want to 2662 01:53:36,000 --> 01:53:39,920 drop an additional 300 square ft of TFA 2663 01:53:39,920 --> 01:53:41,599 elsewhere, you know, like give up a 2664 01:53:41,599 --> 01:53:45,840 garage space or give up a pool house or 2665 01:53:45,840 --> 01:53:49,520 whatever, so that you're not maxed out. 2666 01:53:49,520 --> 01:53:52,880 then you can have your 1500 square feet. 2667 01:53:52,880 --> 01:53:59,189 Um, it's not an issue that 2668 01:53:59,199 --> 01:54:01,360 is 2669 01:54:01,360 --> 01:54:03,840 make or break for me, but my inclination 2670 01:54:03,840 --> 01:54:09,669 would be to limit it to 1,200. 2671 01:54:09,679 --> 01:54:12,080 » Yeah, it's interesting. I'm thinking 2672 01:54:12,080 --> 01:54:14,159 back to all the the Glenn's hearings 2673 01:54:14,159 --> 01:54:16,800 that we had at Sage. you brought all the 2674 01:54:16,800 --> 01:54:18,239 great memories back of of all the time 2675 01:54:18,239 --> 01:54:20,880 here spent and and it's I mean if we if 2676 01:54:20,880 --> 01:54:23,599 we also think about the mulative 2677 01:54:23,599 --> 01:54:26,000 what what have we added up over time 2678 01:54:26,000 --> 01:54:29,119 it's actually it is quite a bit I will 2679 01:54:29,119 --> 01:54:30,880 absolutely admit I was one of the people 2680 01:54:30,880 --> 01:54:33,199 pushing for flexibility in the Glenns 2681 01:54:33,199 --> 01:54:34,320 it's interesting so I mean let's just 2682 01:54:34,320 --> 01:54:36,639 take an example right like 7,000T lot 2683 01:54:36,639 --> 01:54:38,960 would have been 2684 01:54:38,960 --> 01:54:44,320 a 1700T home you we added 400 for a 2685 01:54:44,320 --> 01:54:47,599 garage plus Um I think 800 for the ADU 2686 01:54:47,599 --> 01:54:50,080 plus this is now sort of going to say it 2687 01:54:50,080 --> 01:54:52,159 would be another if we did go to 1500 2688 01:54:52,159 --> 01:54:54,480 another 700 2689 01:54:54,480 --> 01:54:58,400 to your point Darren these like fill up 2690 01:54:58,400 --> 01:55:02,560 >> right and and they they fill up with 2691 01:55:02,560 --> 01:55:05,199 things as they are before adding more 2692 01:55:05,199 --> 01:55:08,159 square footage. I think we want to be I 2693 01:55:08,159 --> 01:55:10,800 just think we want to be mindful of kind 2694 01:55:10,800 --> 01:55:13,679 of to Ly to your point like once there 2695 01:55:13,679 --> 01:55:16,719 is that much on a small lot it does 2696 01:55:16,719 --> 01:55:18,000 start to 2697 01:55:18,000 --> 01:55:19,840 >> what do we 2698 01:55:19,840 --> 01:55:23,520 sorry I think back there it was like can 2699 01:55:23,520 --> 01:55:27,119 you fit even a family on the lot right 2700 01:55:27,119 --> 01:55:30,080 um and then I think we're now it's 2701 01:55:30,080 --> 01:55:32,320 definitely getting to be a lot 2702 01:55:32,320 --> 01:55:35,599 >> is is there is there a guard rail on uh 2703 01:55:35,599 --> 01:55:38,560 you know % of lot has a house footprint 2704 01:55:38,560 --> 01:55:39,760 on it. 2705 01:55:39,760 --> 01:55:43,760 >> Um the Woodside does not have like a lot 2706 01:55:43,760 --> 01:55:46,000 coverage, a building coverage only in 2707 01:55:46,000 --> 01:55:47,360 the commercial district but not in 2708 01:55:47,360 --> 01:55:49,280 residential. There's just your floor 2709 01:55:49,280 --> 01:55:51,280 area limit. 2710 01:55:51,280 --> 01:55:53,520 >> It seems like that might be a way to 2711 01:55:53,520 --> 01:55:57,760 constrain uh so we don't have know two 2712 01:55:57,760 --> 01:55:59,119 square feet around the edge of the 2713 01:55:59,119 --> 01:56:00,800 property that's that's grass and 2714 01:56:00,800 --> 01:56:02,719 everything else is a building which I 2715 01:56:02,719 --> 01:56:05,199 think is not our goal. 2716 01:56:05,199 --> 01:56:08,560 So with with the state mandates 2717 01:56:08,560 --> 01:56:11,119 I think maybe quite so if you have 2718 01:56:11,119 --> 01:56:12,960 multiple ADUs so we're talking about 2719 01:56:12,960 --> 01:56:15,040 three four on a site 2720 01:56:15,040 --> 01:56:17,360 >> those are on eight lots that are giant 2721 01:56:17,360 --> 01:56:18,159 right 2722 01:56:18,159 --> 01:56:20,719 >> not necessarily right so if you add up 2723 01:56:20,719 --> 01:56:23,040 multiple ADUs that each have say a 4 2724 01:56:23,040 --> 01:56:26,080 foot setback is each one of these 2725 01:56:26,080 --> 01:56:26,560 subject 2726 01:56:26,560 --> 01:56:28,320 >> and I'll just remind folks to just if 2727 01:56:28,320 --> 01:56:29,840 you speak into the microphones more just 2728 01:56:29,840 --> 01:56:30,880 for folks online 2729 01:56:30,880 --> 01:56:35,360 >> yeah so so is each one subject object to 2730 01:56:35,360 --> 01:56:37,599 town setbacks at that point or 2731 01:56:37,599 --> 01:56:39,440 >> Yeah. So what what the town has allowed 2732 01:56:39,440 --> 01:56:43,520 is, you know, up to 800 into the setback 2733 01:56:43,520 --> 01:56:45,679 and then this could with this change 2734 01:56:45,679 --> 01:56:48,639 could allow up to 1,200 into the setback 2735 01:56:48,639 --> 01:56:49,199 um 2736 01:56:49,199 --> 01:56:51,040 >> in into the town setback. 2737 01:56:51,040 --> 01:56:52,880 >> That's the other the other ones there. 2738 01:56:52,880 --> 01:56:54,159 There's all these other different state 2739 01:56:54,159 --> 01:56:56,239 laws, but generally speaking, let's say 2740 01:56:56,239 --> 01:56:58,719 you want to do three detached ADUs, one 2741 01:56:58,719 --> 01:57:00,560 of them could go into the basic setback. 2742 01:57:00,560 --> 01:57:01,840 The other two would meet the setback. 2743 01:57:01,840 --> 01:57:06,880 >> Only one could. Yeah. Um, and so just to the point, this is again we're 2744 01:57:06,880 --> 01:57:10,239 looking at exempting floor area. So now 2745 01:57:10,239 --> 01:57:12,880 if someone gets more square footage 2746 01:57:12,880 --> 01:57:15,360 exempt from their ADU, so they already 2747 01:57:15,360 --> 01:57:17,840 have 1500 square feet, they can now add 2748 01:57:17,840 --> 01:57:21,199 more square footage onto their house. 2749 01:57:21,199 --> 01:57:22,960 >> And so so it's, you know, it's that 2750 01:57:22,960 --> 01:57:24,400 balance and that's why we didn't go to 2751 01:57:24,400 --> 01:57:26,560 the full 1500 trying to look at this 2752 01:57:26,560 --> 01:57:28,880 incremental step um to allow more 2753 01:57:28,880 --> 01:57:30,159 exemption. That was something that was 2754 01:57:30,159 --> 01:57:32,880 asked for. Uh but we thought kind of 2755 01:57:32,880 --> 01:57:35,520 adding you know 50% more. 2756 01:57:35,520 --> 01:57:37,119 >> Yeah. But they they they can't expand 2757 01:57:37,119 --> 01:57:39,679 the main residence 2758 01:57:39,679 --> 01:57:42,400 without doing the they can use 2759 01:57:42,400 --> 01:57:43,679 >> correct. Yeah. Yes. 2760 01:57:43,679 --> 01:57:44,800 >> Have the ADU to get 2761 01:57:44,800 --> 01:57:46,400 >> correct. You only get to exempt it from 2762 01:57:46,400 --> 01:57:48,080 the ADU. But just say someone's maxed 2763 01:57:48,080 --> 01:57:51,599 out now with a 1500 foot ADU. Um you 2764 01:57:51,599 --> 01:57:55,520 know you'll getting more exemption. 2765 01:57:55,520 --> 01:57:58,159 Now you'll be counting less. that I can 2766 01:57:58,159 --> 01:58:00,960 easily envision people that come in and 2767 01:58:00,960 --> 01:58:03,119 they'll do a doover and they'll 2768 01:58:03,119 --> 01:58:05,840 redevelop a property where they come up 2769 01:58:05,840 --> 01:58:08,560 right to the limit on floor area and 2770 01:58:08,560 --> 01:58:12,239 paved area, no edus. Then they'll come 2771 01:58:12,239 --> 01:58:15,119 back and they're essentially adding a 2772 01:58:15,119 --> 01:58:16,800 three-bedroom house on top of that. 2773 01:58:16,800 --> 01:58:18,800 That's a freebie 2774 01:58:18,800 --> 01:58:21,679 and that's been their plan all along. 2775 01:58:21,679 --> 01:58:23,360 Um 2776 01:58:23,360 --> 01:58:25,920 1,200 2777 01:58:25,920 --> 01:58:29,669 Sure. 2778 01:58:29,679 --> 01:58:33,119 Yeah, I I think and certainly I'm more 2779 01:58:33,119 --> 01:58:36,400 comfortable with 1,200 than 15. 2780 01:58:36,400 --> 01:58:39,760 Um I think if we if we did go to 15, I 2781 01:58:39,760 --> 01:58:41,360 think there should likely be a lot size 2782 01:58:41,360 --> 01:58:44,719 attached to it, but at the same time 2783 01:58:44,719 --> 01:58:48,470 >> I start 2784 01:58:48,480 --> 01:58:51,040 like Exactly. Yeah. And I mean to to 2785 01:58:51,040 --> 01:58:55,040 Lyle's point sizewise I mean there there 2786 01:58:55,040 --> 01:58:58,239 is flexibility within 1,200 2787 01:58:58,239 --> 01:59:00,320 think to make a it's it's not 2788 01:59:00,320 --> 01:59:02,639 necessarily a large house but it it can 2789 01:59:02,639 --> 01:59:06,159 be a two threebedroom. Uh and then they 2790 01:59:06,159 --> 01:59:07,760 can make those trade-offs on you know do 2791 01:59:07,760 --> 01:59:09,679 they want to allocate 300 feet to a a 2792 01:59:09,679 --> 01:59:11,679 onecar garage or not. 2793 01:59:11,679 --> 01:59:14,000 >> What is what is the if you had two acre 2794 01:59:14,000 --> 01:59:16,400 lot how how build big could the 2795 01:59:16,400 --> 01:59:19,760 residence be? It depends on the zoning. 2796 01:59:19,760 --> 01:59:21,280 Zonings have different, but generally 2797 01:59:21,280 --> 01:59:23,920 speaking, let's say an SR zoning, it's a 2798 01:59:23,920 --> 01:59:26,719 1acre minimum. And in that zoning 2799 01:59:26,719 --> 01:59:28,960 district, in 1 acre, you're going to get 2800 01:59:28,960 --> 01:59:31,280 about a little under 8,000. So if you 2801 01:59:31,280 --> 01:59:32,960 had two acres, you're going to be 2802 01:59:32,960 --> 01:59:35,199 getting closer to like 15,000. 2803 01:59:35,199 --> 01:59:36,719 >> 300 is pocket change then. 2804 01:59:36,719 --> 01:59:40,080 >> And 3 acre lots, you know, they're have 2805 01:59:40,080 --> 01:59:42,080 a smaller percentage, but yet they're 2806 01:59:42,080 --> 01:59:44,719 still getting closer to the 12,000. Um 2807 01:59:44,719 --> 01:59:47,280 you go into the hills there in the 2808 01:59:47,280 --> 01:59:48,960 western hills there's different they 2809 01:59:48,960 --> 01:59:51,280 have lower percentages um but if they 2810 01:59:51,280 --> 01:59:52,719 have a very large lot they could still 2811 01:59:52,719 --> 01:59:56,870 have more square feet. 2812 01:59:56,880 --> 01:59:59,520 So currently Sage there is no difference 2813 01:59:59,520 --> 02:00:01,760 on a lot that's exactly one acre 2814 02:00:01,760 --> 02:00:03,440 compared with something that's 10,000 2815 02:00:03,440 --> 02:00:05,520 square feet as far as the number of ADUs 2816 02:00:05,520 --> 02:00:07,199 that you can build and the size 2817 02:00:07,199 --> 02:00:10,320 >> there there is um currently that right 2818 02:00:10,320 --> 02:00:12,560 now if you're an acre or larger you get 2819 02:00:12,560 --> 02:00:15,199 the three ADUs plus a JADU and if you're 2820 02:00:15,199 --> 02:00:16,000 less than an acre 2821 02:00:16,000 --> 02:00:18,480 >> well I'm talking about the ones that are 2822 02:00:18,480 --> 02:00:20,000 an acre or less. 2823 02:00:20,000 --> 02:00:22,960 >> Yeah. So the smaller ones right now 2824 02:00:22,960 --> 02:00:26,080 >> under state law you still get those 2825 02:00:26,080 --> 02:00:27,920 three that I was talking about right but 2826 02:00:27,920 --> 02:00:29,760 if someone wants to go outside of that 2827 02:00:29,760 --> 02:00:31,280 because we allow larger and more 2828 02:00:31,280 --> 02:00:34,880 flexibility um they could do one ADU and 2829 02:00:34,880 --> 02:00:36,960 one JADU and the ADU could be attached 2830 02:00:36,960 --> 02:00:38,000 or detached 2831 02:00:38,000 --> 02:00:40,080 >> or the conversion also and the 2832 02:00:40,080 --> 02:00:40,719 conversion also 2833 02:00:40,719 --> 02:00:42,960 >> if they if they followed yes for all the 2834 02:00:42,960 --> 02:00:45,520 specific standards they could do that 2835 02:00:45,520 --> 02:00:48,400 >> okay there's a huge difference between 2836 02:00:48,400 --> 02:00:51,760 a.99 acre and a 7,000 ft. 2837 02:00:51,760 --> 02:00:54,950 >> Yep. 2838 02:00:54,960 --> 02:00:57,199 » You add all these pieces up and it it 2839 02:00:57,199 --> 02:00:59,679 starts to become like how many ADUs do 2840 02:00:59,679 --> 02:01:02,960 you need? Like it's starting to get like 2841 02:01:02,960 --> 02:01:04,719 I don't know like with with if you take 2842 02:01:04,719 --> 02:01:07,280 >> Yeah. But but the number of ADUs has has 2843 02:01:07,280 --> 02:01:09,199 not really skyrocketed. I mean we're 2844 02:01:09,199 --> 02:01:13,360 under our our allocation for the you 2845 02:01:13,360 --> 02:01:15,360 know 2031. 2846 02:01:15,360 --> 02:01:16,800 >> Yeah. They they take time. I mean we 2847 02:01:16,800 --> 02:01:18,560 just heard you know one one individual 2848 02:01:18,560 --> 02:01:22,000 has 13 projects under under I mean they 2849 02:01:22,000 --> 02:01:23,199 are getting bill but 2850 02:01:23,199 --> 02:01:24,560 >> that's a major that's a major 2851 02:01:24,560 --> 02:01:25,040 individual. 2852 02:01:25,040 --> 02:01:26,880 >> Yeah we're we're there's some more we 2853 02:01:26,880 --> 02:01:28,800 are seeing numbers increase. I mean 2854 02:01:28,800 --> 02:01:31,360 since um you know prior to our housing 2855 02:01:31,360 --> 02:01:33,119 element we did a four-year average that 2856 02:01:33,119 --> 02:01:36,320 was 15 units per year. Um since then 2857 02:01:36,320 --> 02:01:38,880 with a lot of these different changes uh 2858 02:01:38,880 --> 02:01:42,239 we've uh averaged over 20 per year. Um 2859 02:01:42,239 --> 02:01:44,320 we're getting you know last you know 2860 02:01:44,320 --> 02:01:46,480 January we had no permits issued in 2861 02:01:46,480 --> 02:01:50,960 March we had five ADUs issued um and so 2862 02:01:50,960 --> 02:01:53,920 uh you know it's we are seeing more 2863 02:01:53,920 --> 02:01:56,080 units coming out with some flexibility 2864 02:01:56,080 --> 02:01:57,199 question is how much 2865 02:01:57,199 --> 02:01:59,840 >> yeah and that's the hang that's the 2866 02:01:59,840 --> 02:02:03,280 flexibility that's already in in place 2867 02:02:03,280 --> 02:02:06,159 >> I just I I'm actually remembering a lot 2868 02:02:06,159 --> 02:02:07,360 of the discussions we had when we were 2869 02:02:07,360 --> 02:02:09,520 looking at these sort of two three years 2870 02:02:09,520 --> 02:02:11,920 back and um I I think it was it was 2871 02:02:11,920 --> 02:02:13,280 Marilyn at the time was making the point 2872 02:02:13,280 --> 02:02:15,840 that like, hey, how much do we really 2873 02:02:15,840 --> 02:02:18,080 want to unilaterally 2874 02:02:18,080 --> 02:02:20,400 add leniency knowing that the 2875 02:02:20,400 --> 02:02:22,880 regulations are going to continue in 2876 02:02:22,880 --> 02:02:25,280 that direction from Sacramento? So, I 2877 02:02:25,280 --> 02:02:26,719 mean to a large extent I only expect 2878 02:02:26,719 --> 02:02:29,360 that to be more just the way that the 2879 02:02:29,360 --> 02:02:30,880 sort of tea leaves are going or the 2880 02:02:30,880 --> 02:02:33,199 trends have been going. Not that past 2881 02:02:33,199 --> 02:02:35,599 results are guarantees of future or 2882 02:02:35,599 --> 02:02:42,320 whatever, but at the same time, I I I don't like 1500 from that 2883 02:02:42,320 --> 02:02:45,360 standpoint. Um, even 1,200 and it feels 2884 02:02:45,360 --> 02:02:46,800 like there's going to be some regulation 2885 02:02:46,800 --> 02:02:49,119 that goes beyond that anyway. I don't 2886 02:02:49,119 --> 02:02:50,719 know that that's a flexibility we need 2887 02:02:50,719 --> 02:02:52,800 to offer. So, personally, I'm not 2888 02:02:52,800 --> 02:02:54,080 convinced we need to do anything on 2889 02:02:54,080 --> 02:02:55,920 this. Um, I'm not comfortable going 2890 02:02:55,920 --> 02:02:57,920 beyond 1,200. I can probably get to 2891 02:02:57,920 --> 02:02:59,360 1,200. 2892 02:02:59,360 --> 02:02:59,760 >> Okay. 2893 02:02:59,760 --> 02:03:01,679 >> Being being okay. So we've heard, you 2894 02:03:01,679 --> 02:03:03,840 know, mostly sounds consistent with 2895 02:03:03,840 --> 02:03:06,480 straw poll on looking at just keeping it 2896 02:03:06,480 --> 02:03:09,840 at 1200 or any further direction. 2897 02:03:09,840 --> 02:03:13,520 >> Yeah, I I would go maximum 1,200 and 2898 02:03:13,520 --> 02:03:16,400 then in the future if we see trends 2899 02:03:16,400 --> 02:03:18,080 developing in a certain direction, it 2900 02:03:18,080 --> 02:03:19,760 could always be changed. We can always 2901 02:03:19,760 --> 02:03:24,080 have a another ordinance passed uh as 2902 02:03:24,080 --> 02:03:26,000 far as stipulations for in either 2903 02:03:26,000 --> 02:03:29,280 increasing it or keeping it the same. I 2904 02:03:29,280 --> 02:03:31,440 mean, we have that flexibility. So, I 2905 02:03:31,440 --> 02:03:33,920 certainly wouldn't be a proponent to go 2906 02:03:33,920 --> 02:03:36,719 up to 1500 at this point. 2907 02:03:36,719 --> 02:03:38,400 >> Yeah. Our take was take kind of take 2908 02:03:38,400 --> 02:03:40,560 initial steps. It's a little harder to 2909 02:03:40,560 --> 02:03:42,320 pull back on those once you've gone a 2910 02:03:42,320 --> 02:03:42,880 certain point. 2911 02:03:42,880 --> 02:03:47,040 >> Yeah. 100%. But you still, 1200 or I'm 2912 02:03:47,040 --> 02:03:49,679 good with 1,200. 2913 02:03:49,679 --> 02:03:51,920 I'm with perspective of what's possible 2914 02:03:51,920 --> 02:03:53,360 in larger lots. Yeah. They don't they 2915 02:03:53,360 --> 02:03:54,480 don't need extra. 2916 02:03:54,480 --> 02:03:57,040 >> Okay. Great. So, okay. We'll have um uh 2917 02:03:57,040 --> 02:04:00,000 no further direction on that item. 2918 02:04:00,000 --> 02:04:01,280 We're leaving it at 12:0. 2919 02:04:01,280 --> 02:04:03,840 >> Yep. Let's leave that one. Let that one. 2920 02:04:03,840 --> 02:04:13,440 >> Okay. Um the other item that we heard uh some 2921 02:04:13,440 --> 02:04:16,639 feedback on this was a roof overhangs 2922 02:04:16,639 --> 02:04:18,400 where heard no feedback there, but you 2923 02:04:18,400 --> 02:04:20,400 can let us know if you have any. and the 2924 02:04:20,400 --> 02:04:22,639 mechanical equipment was looking at to 2925 02:04:22,639 --> 02:04:24,800 try to better clarify the immediately 2926 02:04:24,800 --> 02:04:27,119 adjacent term. Um, but if there's 2927 02:04:27,119 --> 02:04:30,400 anything further, let us know. 2928 02:04:30,400 --> 02:04:32,400 >> Roof overhangs. Does anyone have passion 2929 02:04:32,400 --> 02:04:34,400 there or seem good? 2930 02:04:34,400 --> 02:04:37,840 >> No passion on overhangs. 2931 02:04:37,840 --> 02:04:41,440 >> Yeah, I think that that seems good to me. I do like the the 2932 02:04:41,440 --> 02:04:44,400 specification of just these subjective 2933 02:04:44,400 --> 02:04:47,199 things are just hard for people within 2934 02:04:47,199 --> 02:04:48,880 when it's not sort of clearly defined. 2935 02:04:48,880 --> 02:04:50,719 So this be great. 2936 02:04:50,719 --> 02:04:53,040 >> Um 2937 02:04:53,040 --> 02:04:55,280 so then we moved on to we were looking 2938 02:04:55,280 --> 02:04:57,360 at the exception. So this is their plan 2939 02:04:57,360 --> 02:05:01,040 director exception and uh heard comments 2940 02:05:01,040 --> 02:05:03,440 on 2941 02:05:03,440 --> 02:05:05,440 um looking at kind of clarifying 2942 02:05:05,440 --> 02:05:09,280 feasibility. And then also uh whether or 2943 02:05:09,280 --> 02:05:11,440 not it's built into this ordinance or if 2944 02:05:11,440 --> 02:05:13,280 the town kind of looks more in kind of 2945 02:05:13,280 --> 02:05:15,599 like a form or steps that people can 2946 02:05:15,599 --> 02:05:18,480 kind of follow to kind of how best to 2947 02:05:18,480 --> 02:05:22,960 approach um the need to 2948 02:05:22,960 --> 02:05:24,960 uh provide their their kind of 2949 02:05:24,960 --> 02:05:28,560 feasibility analysis. And again we're trying to keep it very simple and 2950 02:05:28,560 --> 02:05:32,080 objective. Uh so uh we can look at 2951 02:05:32,080 --> 02:05:34,960 clarifying the feasibility statement in 2952 02:05:34,960 --> 02:05:36,960 the ordinance and then also maybe 2953 02:05:36,960 --> 02:05:40,800 accompanied with um some draft handouts 2954 02:05:40,800 --> 02:05:43,040 uh that we could provide folks. I 2955 02:05:43,040 --> 02:05:45,679 >> think when I read the language I also 2956 02:05:45,679 --> 02:05:47,679 maybe clarified that it's the planning 2957 02:05:47,679 --> 02:05:50,239 director who would certify feasibility 2958 02:05:50,239 --> 02:05:52,480 not feasibility. Um I think it was it 2959 02:05:52,480 --> 02:05:54,560 was sort of subject didn't seem like it 2960 02:05:54,560 --> 02:05:57,520 was a very clear sage doubt shout 2961 02:05:57,520 --> 02:05:59,760 declare it feasible unfeasible and make 2962 02:05:59,760 --> 02:06:02,480 a record known sort of thing some way to 2963 02:06:02,480 --> 02:06:06,000 make sure it's truly a staffed decision 2964 02:06:06,000 --> 02:06:07,520 by planning director that has to sign 2965 02:06:07,520 --> 02:06:09,679 off on it. 2966 02:06:09,679 --> 02:06:13,599 >> That makes sense to me as well. 2967 02:06:13,599 --> 02:06:15,119 >> This what I'm not sure we should 2968 02:06:15,119 --> 02:06:19,040 increase to be honest. Um I mean we are 2969 02:06:19,040 --> 02:06:22,080 I guess 2970 02:06:22,080 --> 02:06:25,040 I I think some degree of oversight might 2971 02:06:25,040 --> 02:06:26,480 not be a bad thing. I mean, when we're 2972 02:06:26,480 --> 02:06:29,040 talking about 1,200, it does start to be 2973 02:06:29,040 --> 02:06:32,800 >> it's it's getting closer to home than 2974 02:06:32,800 --> 02:06:36,159 sort of smaller ADU. 2975 02:06:36,159 --> 02:06:38,320 >> I mean, there is the we we should there 2976 02:06:38,320 --> 02:06:39,440 is a variance process. 2977 02:06:39,440 --> 02:06:41,920 >> We could also have the plan director 2978 02:06:41,920 --> 02:06:43,280 sign off on it. by signing off and 2979 02:06:43,280 --> 02:06:44,480 meaning presenting to planning 2980 02:06:44,480 --> 02:06:46,400 commission that you know what what was 2981 02:06:46,400 --> 02:06:49,520 declared feasible like type of like out 2982 02:06:49,520 --> 02:06:51,199 >> I think it's basically a variance though 2983 02:06:51,199 --> 02:06:52,400 at that point because it's coming and 2984 02:06:52,400 --> 02:06:54,000 making findings etc 2985 02:06:54,000 --> 02:06:55,360 >> so they would still have that 2986 02:06:55,360 --> 02:06:58,000 flexibility to to come in present 2987 02:06:58,000 --> 02:06:59,360 findings 2988 02:06:59,360 --> 02:07:02,639 >> question for sage and also for gene I 2989 02:07:02,639 --> 02:07:04,639 mean there's an exception to every rule 2990 02:07:04,639 --> 02:07:07,679 right so if you had I mean if we limited 2991 02:07:07,679 --> 02:07:09,760 it to 800 2992 02:07:09,760 --> 02:07:12,880 and there was a lot that had some unique 2993 02:07:12,880 --> 02:07:15,440 features and everybody ended up 2994 02:07:15,440 --> 02:07:19,360 scratching their heads and yes there was 2995 02:07:19,360 --> 02:07:24,960 uh the only way to do the allowed uh you 2996 02:07:24,960 --> 02:07:27,760 know structure uh was to put it in the 2997 02:07:27,760 --> 02:07:30,079 front setback we could do that via 2998 02:07:30,079 --> 02:07:31,679 variance correct 2999 02:07:31,679 --> 02:07:32,880 >> that's correct 3000 02:07:32,880 --> 02:07:36,880 >> and given the fact that 3001 02:07:36,880 --> 02:07:39,280 the planning commission is not 3002 02:07:39,280 --> 02:07:43,119 overwhelmed with 3003 02:07:43,119 --> 02:07:44,960 um having two meetings a month where 3004 02:07:44,960 --> 02:07:46,960 we're doing three variances at every 3005 02:07:46,960 --> 02:07:49,520 meeting. I mean, we're doing very few of 3006 02:07:49,520 --> 02:07:52,480 these, we could tolerate handling those 3007 02:07:52,480 --> 02:07:54,320 exemptions. 3008 02:07:54,320 --> 02:07:56,000 That that's that's similar to the 3009 02:07:56,000 --> 02:07:58,480 support I was trying to Yeah, there's 3010 02:07:58,480 --> 02:08:00,000 still that flexibility. So, we're not 3011 02:08:00,000 --> 02:08:00,880 saying no. 3012 02:08:00,880 --> 02:08:01,280 >> Yeah. 3013 02:08:01,280 --> 02:08:04,480 >> Right. I I do think I don't know. I 3014 02:08:04,480 --> 02:08:07,440 think given how much things are 3015 02:08:07,440 --> 02:08:10,320 changing, it is worth still looking at 3016 02:08:10,320 --> 02:08:12,000 some of those pieces in terms of how how 3017 02:08:12,000 --> 02:08:15,119 it builds out and 3018 02:08:15,119 --> 02:08:16,880 I would I would probably be more 3019 02:08:16,880 --> 02:08:17,920 comfortable with this one being a 3020 02:08:17,920 --> 02:08:22,159 variance process. So heard uh comments 3021 02:08:22,159 --> 02:08:24,960 about keeping it at 800 and 1,200 was 3022 02:08:24,960 --> 02:08:28,079 the proposal and just just for 3023 02:08:28,079 --> 02:08:30,159 discussion purposes 1,000 square feet. 3024 02:08:30,159 --> 02:08:36,880 Nothing just to the direction to bring that back. 3025 02:08:36,880 --> 02:08:38,480 >> Yeah, I would I would probably say keep 3026 02:08:38,480 --> 02:08:41,679 800 on this one. Oops. 3027 02:08:41,679 --> 02:08:44,880 >> And on a an exception basis. 3028 02:08:44,880 --> 02:08:47,280 >> Yeah. And that would that would always 3029 02:08:47,280 --> 02:08:50,079 be available. Yeah, 3030 02:08:50,079 --> 02:08:53,119 >> just just to clarify, this allows uh 3031 02:08:53,119 --> 02:08:55,679 planning department to 3032 02:08:55,679 --> 02:09:00,239 uh declare declare it is unfeasible 3033 02:09:00,239 --> 02:09:03,280 to to work it without a variance. If 3034 02:09:03,280 --> 02:09:04,719 it's less than 800, they could do it 3035 02:09:04,719 --> 02:09:06,320 themselves. If it's more than 800, they 3036 02:09:06,320 --> 02:09:08,320 come talk, right? Which is which is 3037 02:09:08,320 --> 02:09:09,040 asis. 3038 02:09:09,040 --> 02:09:09,440 >> Yep. 3039 02:09:09,440 --> 02:09:10,960 >> Oh, 3040 02:09:10,960 --> 02:09:11,280 got it. 3041 02:09:11,280 --> 02:09:11,679 >> Yep. 3042 02:09:11,679 --> 02:09:13,199 >> Except we probably should still clear. 3043 02:09:13,199 --> 02:09:15,119 >> We're still looking at the clarity part. 3044 02:09:15,119 --> 02:09:18,000 Just the the number. We'll keep it 800. 3045 02:09:18,000 --> 02:09:24,310 Okay. 3046 02:09:24,320 --> 02:09:25,920 » I didn't hear any comments on the 3047 02:09:25,920 --> 02:09:28,079 changing the number of units for this 3048 02:09:28,079 --> 02:09:30,560 government code section 66323. I mean 3049 02:09:30,560 --> 02:09:32,639 essentially the code the other option 3050 02:09:32,639 --> 02:09:35,280 would be just allow more ADUs on the 3051 02:09:35,280 --> 02:09:36,800 smaller properties but from what I've 3052 02:09:36,800 --> 02:09:41,760 heard think there's a move for that. Um 3053 02:09:41,760 --> 02:09:43,360 so I'm sorry Sage which particular 3054 02:09:43,360 --> 02:09:43,920 language 3055 02:09:43,920 --> 02:09:46,000 >> sorry this was just uh this is on it's 3056 02:09:46,000 --> 02:09:48,719 on uh page 10. It's the table. 3057 02:09:48,719 --> 02:09:50,239 >> The the asterisk we discussed. 3058 02:09:50,239 --> 02:09:51,920 >> Yeah, the asterisk. Exactly. Exactly. 3059 02:09:51,920 --> 02:09:53,840 So, that's something that's allowed 3060 02:09:53,840 --> 02:09:55,679 already by state law and we're just 3061 02:09:55,679 --> 02:09:56,880 making sure it's clarified in 3062 02:09:56,880 --> 02:10:02,629 >> We're just clarifying it. Nope. 3063 02:10:02,639 --> 02:10:05,679 » Okay, I think we're good there. 3064 02:10:05,679 --> 02:10:08,639 >> Um 3065 02:10:08,639 --> 02:10:12,960 Oh, so now we're on page 13. 3066 02:10:12,960 --> 02:10:14,880 Um and this is just about the owner 3067 02:10:14,880 --> 02:10:17,119 occupancy. And so there's two items 3068 02:10:17,119 --> 02:10:20,239 we're going to look at um to clarify 3069 02:10:20,239 --> 02:10:23,360 that um if it's not owner occupied that 3070 02:10:23,360 --> 02:10:26,560 only the house would be rented out. Um 3071 02:10:26,560 --> 02:10:29,199 and we're also going to look at if 3072 02:10:29,199 --> 02:10:31,199 there's even a requirement to have to 3073 02:10:31,199 --> 02:10:34,079 have owner occupancy um by state law. 3074 02:10:34,079 --> 02:10:35,599 And if there's not, we'll provide that 3075 02:10:35,599 --> 02:10:36,800 option as well. 3076 02:10:36,800 --> 02:10:39,119 >> And then sub I mean a sublet would still 3077 02:10:39,119 --> 02:10:42,159 be allowable under this, right? 3078 02:10:42,159 --> 02:10:44,560 Well, you can always have sublets going 3079 02:10:44,560 --> 02:10:45,920 on under the table. So, 3080 02:10:45,920 --> 02:10:47,199 >> yeah, I I don't know what we're trying 3081 02:10:47,199 --> 02:10:48,800 to achieve with this one is is kind of 3082 02:10:48,800 --> 02:10:50,159 the thing I would 3083 02:10:50,159 --> 02:10:52,000 >> strike. 3084 02:10:52,000 --> 02:10:54,639 It just seems like there's all these we 3085 02:10:54,639 --> 02:10:56,000 don't need it and you can supp 3086 02:10:56,000 --> 02:10:58,880 >> I think that's one of his action items 3087 02:10:58,880 --> 02:11:00,960 where Yeah. So, and because this is what 3088 02:11:00,960 --> 02:11:02,960 Jean is reminding me that we think the 3089 02:11:02,960 --> 02:11:05,119 state might require that you have have 3090 02:11:05,119 --> 02:11:07,440 this in place. So, we're going to double 3091 02:11:07,440 --> 02:11:09,840 check that um based on the new updated 3092 02:11:09,840 --> 02:11:11,520 laws. We just want to double check that. 3093 02:11:11,520 --> 02:11:13,199 If it is, we'll let you know and we'll 3094 02:11:13,199 --> 02:11:14,960 make sure we have some clarity. And if 3095 02:11:14,960 --> 02:11:16,320 it's not, we'll provide you with the 3096 02:11:16,320 --> 02:11:17,360 option 3097 02:11:17,360 --> 02:11:22,709 >> to remove it. 3098 02:11:22,719 --> 02:11:29,360 » Okay. Then we are um really down to uh 3099 02:11:29,360 --> 02:11:34,079 the um we'll we'll just 3100 02:11:34,079 --> 02:11:36,480 look at you know we understood that this 3101 02:11:36,480 --> 02:11:38,560 is a policy uh decision kind of looking 3102 02:11:38,560 --> 02:11:40,800 at the town inspectors for the amnesty 3103 02:11:40,800 --> 02:11:44,320 program. Um, 3104 02:11:44,320 --> 02:11:46,000 does the planning commission in their 3105 02:11:46,000 --> 02:11:48,639 recommendation to town council want to 3106 02:11:48,639 --> 02:11:50,239 recommend that the town council explore 3107 02:11:50,239 --> 02:11:52,000 the idea of the town having town 3108 02:11:52,000 --> 02:11:54,880 inspectors, whether it's for a fee or or 3109 02:11:54,880 --> 02:11:56,079 not, it's something the town council 3110 02:11:56,079 --> 02:11:57,599 could consider? It's it's just part of 3111 02:11:57,599 --> 02:11:59,119 what you would be recommending to the 3112 02:11:59,119 --> 02:12:00,159 planning commission. 3113 02:12:00,159 --> 02:12:01,199 >> That would that be a separate 3114 02:12:01,199 --> 02:12:02,400 recommendation from this? 3115 02:12:02,400 --> 02:12:03,760 >> It's what we would do is just build it 3116 02:12:03,760 --> 02:12:06,400 into the resolution itself. Um, it 3117 02:12:06,400 --> 02:12:08,239 wouldn't be in the actual ordinance 3118 02:12:08,239 --> 02:12:10,880 language. Um it will just be something 3119 02:12:10,880 --> 02:12:12,960 that we could say, you know, this is 3120 02:12:12,960 --> 02:12:14,960 what the planning commission recommended 3121 02:12:14,960 --> 02:12:17,119 uh for the town council to explore to 3122 02:12:17,119 --> 02:12:18,719 help assist people with unpermitted 3123 02:12:18,719 --> 02:12:24,960 ADUs. I mean, from my perspective, it's nice to have a friend who can kind 3124 02:12:24,960 --> 02:12:26,719 of help you through this complex 3125 02:12:26,719 --> 02:12:28,960 process. Uh so an inspector could be 3126 02:12:28,960 --> 02:12:30,560 good for that. I do think it's 3127 02:12:30,560 --> 02:12:32,480 important. We we talked about sort of 3128 02:12:32,480 --> 02:12:35,520 the if we do a program like this just 3129 02:12:35,520 --> 02:12:37,599 limiting the the liability because to 3130 02:12:37,599 --> 02:12:40,079 the earlier point like if they miss 3131 02:12:40,079 --> 02:12:42,719 something and folks discover it we don't 3132 02:12:42,719 --> 02:12:44,560 want to you know be on the on the hook 3133 02:12:44,560 --> 02:12:46,560 for that and it's probably unfair to 3134 02:12:46,560 --> 02:12:48,400 have a contract inspector you know 3135 02:12:48,400 --> 02:12:50,480 liable for that 3136 02:12:50,480 --> 02:12:53,440 >> right and as noted the town I people can 3137 02:12:53,440 --> 02:12:55,360 always hire their own general 3138 02:12:55,360 --> 02:12:57,760 contractors and they can give them their 3139 02:12:57,760 --> 02:12:59,119 recommendations something that 3140 02:12:59,119 --> 02:13:00,480 >> yeah I think we need to frame it as an 3141 02:13:00,480 --> 02:13:02,400 advisory service or something of that 3142 02:13:02,400 --> 02:13:03,040 nature. 3143 02:13:03,040 --> 02:13:04,719 >> But but definitely encourage the amnesty 3144 02:13:04,719 --> 02:13:06,159 because we we should have these 3145 02:13:06,159 --> 02:13:07,920 properties 3146 02:13:07,920 --> 02:13:09,679 on on the list and registered so we know 3147 02:13:09,679 --> 02:13:11,040 that they exist and if they're on fire 3148 02:13:11,040 --> 02:13:14,320 that they get out and they 3149 02:13:14,320 --> 02:13:16,239 >> Yeah. And and we're not making any 3150 02:13:16,239 --> 02:13:19,199 decisions on that part. I believe right 3151 02:13:19,199 --> 02:13:21,040 >> just simply moving forward a 3152 02:13:21,040 --> 02:13:23,199 recommendation to the council council 3153 02:13:23,199 --> 02:13:25,840 town council. So when we bring this back 3154 02:13:25,840 --> 02:13:28,320 um we can just provide that small 3155 02:13:28,320 --> 02:13:29,760 recommendation into the resolution 3156 02:13:29,760 --> 02:13:32,719 itself. I think it's great. Yeah. Um so 3157 02:13:32,719 --> 02:13:35,199 then uh there's just two other items 3158 02:13:35,199 --> 02:13:36,719 that we're going to talk about if you'd 3159 02:13:36,719 --> 02:13:39,920 like us to look into further and that is 3160 02:13:39,920 --> 02:13:43,040 um uh specifically exempting additional 3161 02:13:43,040 --> 02:13:45,760 paved area um as it relates to 3162 02:13:45,760 --> 02:13:48,320 construction of ADUs. Um and the other 3163 02:13:48,320 --> 02:13:51,760 piece was uh looking at um potentially 3164 02:13:51,760 --> 02:13:54,000 allowing for some height increases for 3165 02:13:54,000 --> 02:13:57,360 ups sloping lots 3166 02:13:57,360 --> 02:14:00,400 >> or both those I would say the paved area 3167 02:14:00,400 --> 02:14:02,560 one kind of similar with with my points 3168 02:14:02,560 --> 02:14:06,480 on cumulative impact uh 3169 02:14:06,480 --> 02:14:08,480 it would be good maybe so I I support 3170 02:14:08,480 --> 02:14:12,000 looking at it um also 3171 02:14:12,000 --> 02:14:15,199 you know if that yields 3172 02:14:15,199 --> 02:14:16,880 90% 3173 02:14:16,880 --> 02:14:19,199 >> surface coverage with paved area. That 3174 02:14:19,199 --> 02:14:20,239 feels like a bad outcome. 3175 02:14:20,239 --> 02:14:20,960 >> Yeah, we could we could 3176 02:14:20,960 --> 02:14:22,320 >> So, we may want to have some kind of a 3177 02:14:22,320 --> 02:14:24,639 cap. Yeah. Being mindful of the 3178 02:14:24,639 --> 02:14:26,320 >> Yeah, we could definitely look at that. 3179 02:14:26,320 --> 02:14:29,440 >> No clue as to whether 1,500 would be the 3180 02:14:29,440 --> 02:14:31,199 right number or not. 3181 02:14:31,199 --> 02:14:32,639 >> Yeah. And that that was just something 3182 02:14:32,639 --> 02:14:34,480 brought up by a member of the public. 3183 02:14:34,480 --> 02:14:34,800 Yes. 3184 02:14:34,800 --> 02:14:37,599 >> And so, uh I think in terms of Yeah. Do 3185 02:14:37,599 --> 02:14:39,119 you want you know, all you have is 3186 02:14:39,119 --> 02:14:40,480 building and paving. 3187 02:14:40,480 --> 02:14:42,239 >> Yeah. I mean, because you add all this 3188 02:14:42,239 --> 02:14:45,040 up. And what was mentioned too was, you 3189 02:14:45,040 --> 02:14:46,239 know, some of these larger lots in the 3190 02:14:46,239 --> 02:14:48,400 SCP areas, they're already restricted to 3191 02:14:48,400 --> 02:14:51,360 9,000, whereas, you know, lots in a 1 3192 02:14:51,360 --> 02:14:54,000 acre lot, you know, over in, uh, 3193 02:14:54,000 --> 02:14:56,000 Woodside Hills, they can have 15,000 3194 02:14:56,000 --> 02:15:00,079 square ft. Um, and so we can kind of 3195 02:15:00,079 --> 02:15:02,960 look at some of the lot size issues, um, 3196 02:15:02,960 --> 02:15:05,520 and then maybe some caps, uh, for those 3197 02:15:05,520 --> 02:15:06,560 kind of exemptions. 3198 02:15:06,560 --> 02:15:08,480 >> It might be helpful also when we 3199 02:15:08,480 --> 02:15:10,079 consider this next if it's if it's 3200 02:15:10,079 --> 02:15:11,760 possible to look at maybe just example 3201 02:15:11,760 --> 02:15:13,280 scenarios. try to we'll try to yeah 3202 02:15:13,280 --> 02:15:13,679 provide 3203 02:15:13,679 --> 02:15:15,520 >> you know what I mean like maybe say you 3204 02:15:15,520 --> 02:15:19,599 know a 7,000 foot lot if it were to be 3205 02:15:19,599 --> 02:15:21,199 maxed out with all the things that we're 3206 02:15:21,199 --> 02:15:23,360 approving like what does that look like 3207 02:15:23,360 --> 02:15:26,560 because at a certain point 3208 02:15:26,560 --> 02:15:28,639 >> we have to help with Sacramento we also 3209 02:15:28,639 --> 02:15:30,480 have to uphold general plan and if we 3210 02:15:30,480 --> 02:15:33,599 get 95% paved area we are not doing our 3211 02:15:33,599 --> 02:15:35,599 job upholding the general plan also so I 3212 02:15:35,599 --> 02:15:37,360 think that balancing you could just see 3213 02:15:37,360 --> 02:15:38,480 what that looks like for 3214 02:15:38,480 --> 02:15:41,840 >> yeah so 5,000 to 10,000 to 15,000 that 3215 02:15:41,840 --> 02:15:43,199 We don't have to do that many scenarios 3216 02:15:43,199 --> 02:15:44,800 but some that I think just helps us 3217 02:15:44,800 --> 02:15:45,440 visualize it. 3218 02:15:45,440 --> 02:15:46,400 >> Visualize this. 3219 02:15:46,400 --> 02:15:47,840 >> So yeah, no we'll we'll take that 3220 02:15:47,840 --> 02:15:49,599 direction. Um so we'll explore it 3221 02:15:49,599 --> 02:15:51,040 further and bring some stuff back for 3222 02:15:51,040 --> 02:15:51,760 you. Awesome. 3223 02:15:51,760 --> 02:15:54,639 >> Okay. I would explore it further, maybe 3224 02:15:54,639 --> 02:15:57,840 come up I mean see what number would be 3225 02:15:57,840 --> 02:16:00,239 reasonable that would make most projects 3226 02:16:00,239 --> 02:16:03,520 work and then 3227 02:16:03,520 --> 02:16:05,679 um once again I mean if you get the 3228 02:16:05,679 --> 02:16:08,639 exception to the rule 3229 02:16:08,639 --> 02:16:09,840 uh you can always go through the 3230 02:16:09,840 --> 02:16:11,440 variance process. 3231 02:16:11,440 --> 02:16:13,840 >> Yeah. And if somebody needs an extra 200 3232 02:16:13,840 --> 02:16:16,159 square feet of paved area to be able to 3233 02:16:16,159 --> 02:16:18,960 have a, 3234 02:16:18,960 --> 02:16:21,840 >> you know, paved access to the ADU, then 3235 02:16:21,840 --> 02:16:25,830 I mean 3236 02:16:25,840 --> 02:16:27,360 » that would be the presumption that that 3237 02:16:27,360 --> 02:16:29,599 would pass. And we still for the 800 3238 02:16:29,599 --> 02:16:31,199 square foot unit, you know, if someone 3239 02:16:31,199 --> 02:16:33,840 that's all someone can fit or that's 3240 02:16:33,840 --> 02:16:36,080 what they're they need some extra paved 3241 02:16:36,080 --> 02:16:38,479 area to do that 1800 square foot unit 3242 02:16:38,479 --> 02:16:40,240 that town staff still has some 3243 02:16:40,240 --> 02:16:41,519 flexibility there. 3244 02:16:41,519 --> 02:16:41,920 >> Yeah. 3245 02:16:41,920 --> 02:16:43,120 >> And that was based on the section we're 3246 02:16:43,120 --> 02:16:46,559 just debating about 800 to,200. 3247 02:16:46,559 --> 02:16:48,559 >> Right. And then so I guess we didn't 3248 02:16:48,559 --> 02:16:50,160 talk that much about the the height 3249 02:16:50,160 --> 02:16:50,880 piece that 3250 02:16:50,880 --> 02:16:52,160 >> So this is the last piece. 3251 02:16:52,160 --> 02:16:55,200 >> Yeah. So on that one, 3252 02:16:55,200 --> 02:16:58,960 I I I like that the proposal limits 3253 02:16:58,960 --> 02:17:00,880 based I I think the language was well 3254 02:17:00,880 --> 02:17:02,639 written that it's it's limited to not 3255 02:17:02,639 --> 02:17:05,280 make any structure that's more impactful 3256 02:17:05,280 --> 02:17:07,679 than the previous main residence could 3257 02:17:07,679 --> 02:17:12,559 have been. So that that part feels good. 3258 02:17:12,559 --> 02:17:15,200 Seems reasonable to consider it to me. 3259 02:17:15,200 --> 02:17:18,000 >> Folks think 3260 02:17:18,000 --> 02:17:20,240 explore it. 3261 02:17:20,240 --> 02:17:24,319 Yeah, we we can explore some language if all of you are kind of in agreement 3262 02:17:24,319 --> 02:17:27,439 with that any 3263 02:17:27,439 --> 02:17:28,800 opposition. 3264 02:17:28,800 --> 02:17:30,000 >> No. 3265 02:17:30,000 --> 02:17:32,080 >> Okay, I think we're good with exploring 3266 02:17:32,080 --> 02:17:32,719 that. 3267 02:17:32,719 --> 02:17:35,760 >> So, we walked through everything um with 3268 02:17:35,760 --> 02:17:36,160 this 3269 02:17:36,160 --> 02:17:38,559 >> talk about the go 3270 02:17:38,559 --> 02:17:42,000 >> the height slope Glenn's versus the R 3271 02:17:42,000 --> 02:17:42,800 the R1's. 3272 02:17:42,800 --> 02:17:45,280 >> Yeah. So I mean with that that's 3273 02:17:45,280 --> 02:17:46,399 >> a separate part of the 3274 02:17:46,399 --> 02:17:51,840 >> it's it's it's well um more than just 3275 02:17:51,840 --> 02:17:56,000 ADUs. Um and so whereas that in and of 3276 02:17:56,000 --> 02:17:58,240 itself could help with flexibility on 3277 02:17:58,240 --> 02:18:02,559 ADUs. Um it's more about you know could 3278 02:18:02,559 --> 02:18:04,479 my house be closer to a property line 3279 02:18:04,479 --> 02:18:07,040 like what we did in the Glenn's um and 3280 02:18:07,040 --> 02:18:10,479 so that uh very good point. And I am 3281 02:18:10,479 --> 02:18:12,800 extremely point well taken but it 3282 02:18:12,800 --> 02:18:13,840 >> different project. 3283 02:18:13,840 --> 02:18:15,760 >> Yeah. I think it it encompasses much 3284 02:18:15,760 --> 02:18:16,960 more than just ADUs. 3285 02:18:16,960 --> 02:18:18,880 >> Yeah. And my recommendation there would 3286 02:18:18,880 --> 02:18:20,399 be 3287 02:18:20,399 --> 02:18:23,200 R1 is probably not the scope. It's 3288 02:18:23,200 --> 02:18:26,639 probably more like the the Glenn's was a 3289 02:18:26,639 --> 02:18:30,000 sort of coherent well or an area where 3290 02:18:30,000 --> 02:18:32,319 there's a common issue of a 3291 02:18:32,319 --> 02:18:34,319 concentration of non-conforming lots, 3292 02:18:34,319 --> 02:18:36,800 right? And we have others. It seems like 3293 02:18:36,800 --> 02:18:38,719 Palm Circle is one of those. Yeah. 3294 02:18:38,719 --> 02:18:40,000 >> So, I would suggest we're just more 3295 02:18:40,000 --> 02:18:42,080 mindful of the granularity and boundary 3296 02:18:42,080 --> 02:18:44,000 of that study rather than saying like 3297 02:18:44,000 --> 02:18:45,280 all R1 blank. 3298 02:18:45,280 --> 02:18:46,800 >> Yes. No, for sure. And that's something 3299 02:18:46,800 --> 02:18:48,080 well, you know, it's it's in working 3300 02:18:48,080 --> 02:18:49,840 with the town council on priorities and 3301 02:18:49,840 --> 02:18:51,359 what the, you know, the various 3302 02:18:51,359 --> 02:18:52,639 different work items that 3303 02:18:52,639 --> 02:18:54,559 >> it feels like it would be another like 3304 02:18:54,559 --> 02:18:58,080 agendaized Glenn's style thing, right? 3305 02:18:58,080 --> 02:19:00,639 With a defined scope of which which lots 3306 02:19:00,639 --> 02:19:01,840 are in. 3307 02:19:01,840 --> 02:19:04,319 >> Okay. So, so with that, um, we because 3308 02:19:04,319 --> 02:19:06,160 we're just bringing stuff, we got a 3309 02:19:06,160 --> 02:19:08,240 direction from you. We didn't have any 3310 02:19:08,240 --> 02:19:11,519 like split issues on any of these. Um we 3311 02:19:11,519 --> 02:19:13,120 are just going to explore the different 3312 02:19:13,120 --> 02:19:15,120 things based on the direction given. We 3313 02:19:15,120 --> 02:19:17,760 do not need a motion. Um we just we've 3314 02:19:17,760 --> 02:19:19,920 taken all the notes. We've looked at um 3315 02:19:19,920 --> 02:19:21,599 the consensus made by the planning 3316 02:19:21,599 --> 02:19:23,840 commission and um 3317 02:19:23,840 --> 02:19:25,359 >> we will bring all this stuff back to you 3318 02:19:25,359 --> 02:19:28,080 to explore further and uh maybe for an 3319 02:19:28,080 --> 02:19:29,599 adoption of a recommendation of the town 3320 02:19:29,599 --> 02:19:30,319 council. 3321 02:19:30,319 --> 02:19:31,359 >> Sounds great. Yeah, I think these 3322 02:19:31,359 --> 02:19:33,040 scenario just final thought and I know 3323 02:19:33,040 --> 02:19:34,559 I'm maybe just repeating myself but 3324 02:19:34,559 --> 02:19:36,000 these scenarios I think are going to be 3325 02:19:36,000 --> 02:19:37,920 helpful because we're saying things like 3326 02:19:37,920 --> 02:19:40,880 we like going from 800 to,200 but not 3327 02:19:40,880 --> 02:19:42,479 1500 but we're also sort of thinking 3328 02:19:42,479 --> 02:19:45,359 that without the cumulative impact. So I 3329 02:19:45,359 --> 02:19:47,760 just think that'll be important for us 3330 02:19:47,760 --> 02:19:49,680 to look at with a fresh set of eyes on 3331 02:19:49,680 --> 02:19:51,520 terms of what it is. 3332 02:19:51,520 --> 02:19:53,120 >> Cool. 3333 02:19:53,120 --> 02:19:53,680 Anything else? 3334 02:19:53,680 --> 02:19:56,319 >> Um so that uh that would conclude this 3335 02:19:56,319 --> 02:19:59,840 item. Um, and 3336 02:19:59,840 --> 02:20:02,000 there's just a couple of um, if you want 3337 02:20:02,000 --> 02:20:03,680 to move on to the agenda. I think we 3338 02:20:03,680 --> 02:20:05,200 just have director's report. 3339 02:20:05,200 --> 02:20:06,640 >> All right, let's move on to director's 3340 02:20:06,640 --> 02:20:09,200 report. Thank you for the cube. 3341 02:20:09,200 --> 02:20:12,080 >> And, um, apologize, I don't have those 3342 02:20:12,080 --> 02:20:13,359 right here in front of me, but 3343 02:20:13,359 --> 02:20:17,359 essentially uh, the 3344 02:20:17,359 --> 02:20:30,469 my computer died. Um, 3345 02:20:30,479 --> 02:20:34,479 yeah so so what what I'll report is um 3346 02:20:34,479 --> 02:20:37,520 you know we uh I know in February I 3347 02:20:37,520 --> 02:20:41,840 think Thank you very much Jim. Um so uh 3348 02:20:41,840 --> 02:20:44,479 so you know what we've kind of the 3349 02:20:44,479 --> 02:20:46,640 primary thing of these reports that I 3350 02:20:46,640 --> 02:20:48,640 think has been most interesting is just 3351 02:20:48,640 --> 02:20:50,960 looking at um the number of permits were 3352 02:20:50,960 --> 02:20:54,080 issued uh per month. And so, uh, this 3353 02:20:54,080 --> 02:20:56,880 one in February, the town issued, uh, 3354 02:20:56,880 --> 02:20:59,520 three permits for ADUs and one for new 3355 02:20:59,520 --> 02:21:01,680 single family dwelling. 3356 02:21:01,680 --> 02:21:06,080 And then, as I noted in, um, March that 3357 02:21:06,080 --> 02:21:09,120 we have uh, we had six ADUs. One of them 3358 02:21:09,120 --> 02:21:11,680 was a J AU, but we had six ADUs in March 3359 02:21:11,680 --> 02:21:14,960 and one single family dwelling. Um, so 3360 02:21:14,960 --> 02:21:17,439 whereas we had none issued in January, 3361 02:21:17,439 --> 02:21:18,880 but you know, people are coming off the 3362 02:21:18,880 --> 02:21:20,399 holidays, you know, there's different 3363 02:21:20,399 --> 02:21:22,080 reasons maybe why that was a lower 3364 02:21:22,080 --> 02:21:23,920 number. Uh, but as we progress through 3365 02:21:23,920 --> 02:21:26,640 the summer, um, you know, if we can keep 3366 02:21:26,640 --> 02:21:29,760 up four to six plus ADUs a month, that 3367 02:21:29,760 --> 02:21:31,840 would be great. 3368 02:21:31,840 --> 02:21:33,359 >> And so with that, that concludes my 3369 02:21:33,359 --> 02:21:35,680 report. Um, I don't have anything 3370 02:21:35,680 --> 02:21:39,910 further to add this time. 3371 02:21:39,920 --> 02:21:41,680 » All right. Well, if we're all done, we 3372 02:21:41,680 --> 02:21:46,840 will go ahead and adjourn. Thank you.