[0:40] Hello.
[0:43] So, um, so I'm Sage, the planning
[0:45] director. Um, just here to give a brief
[0:48] intro. Uh so first off, thank you
[0:50] everybody for coming and um continuing
[0:52] to uh work on this project on the CAC.
[0:56] Um so uh just first off, you do have a
[1:00] number of desk items. Um most were
[1:02] emailed to you ahead of time as they
[1:05] were received. I just want to note there
[1:07] were two additional desk items that came
[1:09] in after 5:00 today. Um and those have
[1:11] been provided for you and they're all in
[1:13] front of you. And so,
[1:16] uh, just want to note that, um, you
[1:18] know, why we're here tonight and, um,
[1:21] we're getting close to the midway of
[1:23] this process and it's important that,
[1:26] uh, the town provides an update to the
[1:28] town council. So, we've had, uh, two, I
[1:32] think, um, well attended and a lot of
[1:35] input at the last two CAC meetings. Uh
[1:38] and from that um there have been some
[1:42] you know very general design concepts
[1:45] prepared um in response to some of the
[1:48] feedback that we received uh before we
[1:52] presented that information to the
[1:53] council. We wanted to make sure the CAC
[1:55] members had a chance to look at it and
[1:57] provide some recommendations. So that
[1:59] was the main purpose of this extra
[2:01] meeting, this extra CAC meeting tonight.
[2:04] Um, and then I just uh so we will be
[2:07] going to the town council at their next
[2:10] meeting on Tuesday, next Tuesday.
[2:13] The And then just a reminder for
[2:15] everyone, you know, the town center area
[2:17] plan, it's a long range planning
[2:19] document that is focused on a particular
[2:22] area in town. Um, it is a policy
[2:24] document. So you know at the end of this
[2:27] process there will be policies that will
[2:30] guide the town set priorities for
[2:34] different action items for the town to
[2:36] pursue.
[2:37] Um that policy document is not
[2:42] um something that will implement any
[2:45] specific idea to the fine granular
[2:48] detail. So that what you have before you
[2:50] tonight are just general design concepts
[2:54] of things that the town may consider in
[2:56] some kind of abstract form. Um and if
[3:00] ultimately adopted by the town council
[3:03] uh different policies to pursue some
[3:06] different options and in the future any
[3:10] options that the town council pursue or
[3:14] any policies that direct the town to
[3:16] pursue different options I will still
[3:18] have input on those granular details. um
[3:22] everything that you have before you
[3:23] tonight again is just kind of concept
[3:26] visions to look at um and provide some
[3:29] feedback on. So just remember we're not
[3:31] voting or deciding if this actual design
[3:35] is going to be implemented or not but
[3:37] looking at it more of a holistic kind of
[3:40] policy concept review. So I just want to
[3:43] reiterate that. But um with that again,
[3:46] thank you all for coming and I'll turn
[3:47] it over to um Good City Company who has
[3:51] been assisting us with this process.
[4:01] All right, thanks Sage. Thanks for the
[4:03] welcome. Good to see everyone again. Um
[4:06] we really appreciate you all taking time
[4:08] to be a part of this process. As Sage
[4:10] pointed out, we had a couple of um
[4:12] really successful, productive,
[4:14] respectful meetings uh so far. So, we
[4:17] want to keep building on that momentum.
[4:19] Um next slide.
[4:22] So, for tonight, the agenda, um we had
[4:26] the welcome in the opening from Sage and
[4:29] myself. Then I'll jump into a quick
[4:31] refresher on the project, uh what we've
[4:33] done so far, where we're going next, and
[4:35] what we want to get out of this effort.
[4:37] Um then for the really the line share of
[4:39] the meeting, we're going to focus on
[4:41] transportation ideas. Like Sage said, we
[4:43] have a couple of ideas. You know, you
[4:45] guys had some really good feedback in
[4:46] December. We heard that feedback um and
[4:49] we then we developed some concepts that
[4:51] we'd love to kind of just chat about
[4:52] with you all to refine them. Um and then
[4:55] to give you just the chance to take a
[4:57] you know, take a stab at them before we
[4:58] go to council next week. Um so we're
[5:00] really going to focus on those concepts
[5:02] for most of the meeting. Uh then we'll
[5:04] briefly at the end kind of leave a
[5:06] little bit of a time to touch base about
[5:08] housing. Um really important topic. We
[5:10] talked about it a little bit at the last
[5:12] meeting, but we'd like to come back to
[5:14] it again at the end of this meeting.
[5:16] Then we'll have public comment and I'll
[5:19] sort of um talk about where we're going
[5:21] next after this meeting and then we'll
[5:24] wrap it up and we'll hopefully get out
[5:26] of here earlier than last time.
[5:28] Next slide.
[5:30] Okay, so here we are kind of in our
[5:32] timeline. Uh the big giant star there is
[5:35] our meeting tonight. We had already like
[5:38] we mentioned two meetings. We had one
[5:40] last July and we had one in December. Um
[5:44] and we were originally going to go
[5:46] straight ahead to town council and kind
[5:48] of present, you know, what we've talked
[5:50] about with this group, but we figured
[5:52] since we had sort of the time and space
[5:55] to talk with you before we went to
[5:56] council, we're going to go ahead and add
[5:58] tonight's meeting. um to give you the
[6:02] opportunity to share the input with us
[6:04] that then we can then carry forward to
[6:05] council. Um and then what we'll be doing
[6:08] after that is we'll launch into kind of
[6:09] a fuller phase of community engagement
[6:11] like we did last time. We'll have a
[6:13] survey, some popups, uh openhouse
[6:16] workshop, and then we'll be back with
[6:18] the CAC again uh to kind of take stock
[6:20] of what we heard from the public in that
[6:22] last meeting. Um and then to kind of
[6:24] keep refining the ideas and the policies
[6:26] as Sage said as we kind of move forward
[6:28] towards a more refined policy effort and
[6:31] then we'll go into environmental review.
[6:33] Um
[6:35] so uh next slide.
[6:38] So at the last meeting um we presented
[6:42] we kind of talked through a list of we
[6:44] call them outcomes you call them
[6:46] objectives or guiding principles but
[6:47] this is kind of what we as a town want
[6:50] to get out out of this effort. Um, so we ran through this list last time. We
[6:55] had a couple of good ideas from the
[6:56] group here about edits to this list. We
[6:58] made most of those edits. And so we just
[7:00] wanted to kind of put this up again uh
[7:03] just to reflect your feedback and to
[7:05] give you one more chance just to kind of
[7:06] weigh in on this. I think um we're
[7:09] generally in agreement on this, but I'll
[7:11] stop just for a moment if anyone has any
[7:13] kind of clarifying questions or comments
[7:16] um on these outcomes that we're all
[7:18] working towards. Richard Sure.
[7:26] » Is that
[7:30] some sort of process?
[7:37] What is that?
[7:39] >> Uh yeah, it'll be it'll be a squa
[7:41] process. The exact nature of which I
[7:43] think it'll depend upon the alternatives
[7:46] that we study um for the town center.
[7:49] how much housing we look at. Uh most
[7:52] likely it'll be a regular squa process
[7:55] where we go through, you know, the the
[7:58] different topic areas um to some degree.
[8:00] I think there'll be some amount
[8:03] um that we can tear off of the work done
[8:06] um for the housing element. Um but I
[8:09] think we'll get we'll talk about that
[8:11] more at our next meeting. We'll come
[8:13] with a very I think more clear approach
[8:15] about SQA. It does depend a bit on where
[8:18] we go with um how much housing we look
[8:22] at in the in the plan area.
[8:24] >> And Troy, I'll just uh for everyone just
[8:26] to uh remind everyone to please make
[8:28] sure you speak closely into the
[8:30] microphones and one for the folks in the
[8:32] room, but most importantly for the folks
[8:34] that are joining us on Zoom, the only
[8:36] way they're going to hear you is if that
[8:37] you actually speak really closely into
[8:39] the microphones. So, thanks.
[8:41] >> Yeah, good point, Sage. Daniel.
[8:44] >> So, So, I have one topic that I feel
[8:49] like is a little bit abyss for this list
[8:51] that I just wanted to put in front of
[8:52] the group. Um, I attended one of the
[8:54] council meetings in January and an
[8:56] organization called LAFCO, which is an
[8:58] arm of San Monteo County that audits the
[9:00] health of the town cities presented to
[9:03] us on the kind of what's the health of
[9:04] Woodside. Um, on the financial side of
[9:08] things, so our budget is about $12.5
[9:10] million a year.
[9:12] um 51% of our budget comes from property
[9:15] taxes, which is really unusual in the
[9:17] county. That's normally 15 or 20%.
[9:19] There's not a lot we can do about it,
[9:21] right? That revenue source. Um our next
[9:24] biggest revenue source is permitting and
[9:25] fees. We have very little sales tax,
[9:28] very little business taxes, no hotel tax
[9:31] that most of the other cities make a
[9:33] towns make a lot of money on. Um and so
[9:35] why do I bring this up? Well, our police
[9:37] services cost $3 million a year and
[9:39] they're projected to grow way faster
[9:42] than our town revenue and LAFCO in this
[9:45] meeting raised an alarm that said by
[9:46] 2030 we may be looking at a million
[9:48] dollar shortfall in our budget which is
[9:50] kind of where Pole Valley is right where
[9:52] they're in financial trouble. So the
[9:54] question I had that comes out of that is
[9:57] should one of our desired outcomes or
[9:59] goals for the town center project be to
[10:01] try to focus on having the town center
[10:03] generate revenue for the town as a
[10:05] priority? Um is that a way to close that
[10:09] gap that's inevitably coming if it's not
[10:11] just the next four years it's certainly
[10:13] in the scope of this project. So that's
[10:15] something I wanted to put on the table
[10:16] is do we need a number 12 which is one
[10:19] of our goals needs to be to design the
[10:22] town center as a revenue generator for
[10:24] the town as as fitting with the rest of
[10:26] our principles but really think about
[10:27] because I don't know where else we can
[10:29] go find revenue in the town of Woodside
[10:32] if we have that shortfall. So that's
[10:34] what that's what I wanted to put on the
[10:35] table.
[10:36] >> Uh that's great great idea. Um,
[10:39] why don't we take that down? And, um, I
[10:43] don't see any reason why not to add that
[10:45] there. Um, unless we have any other
[10:47] ideas about that thought or any others
[10:50] on the outcomes list.
[10:56] » Number 11 is um, the end of it doesn't
[11:00] make complete sense to me. Offer more
[11:02] flexibility to land owners and explore
[11:05] allowing residential development
[11:08] uses. Maybe we should
[11:09] >> in in commercial spaces. Is that what
[11:12] you mean?
[11:13] >> Well, I think that's the crux of this
[11:15] process is exactly to what degree do we
[11:18] allow residential. So, it's kind of hard
[11:20] for I think for us to nail down the
[11:22] outcome of that discussion. Um, so I was
[11:24] kind of we're leaving that a little bit
[11:26] open-ended there.
[11:27] >> Yeah, that one seemed a little
[11:28] >> open. Yeah, like everything else seemed
[11:30] pretty clear, but that one was just so
[11:32] vague. And if that's our whole process,
[11:34] I'm not sure exactly what that one's
[11:37] doing.
[11:38] >> Sure.
[11:39] >> So, quick comment. In other cities and
[11:41] municipalities, residential typically is
[11:45] a cost. It is not a uh revenue
[11:49] generator. So, in light of the comment
[11:51] made here and the ad of 12, I think
[11:54] there's an impact on 11.
[11:58] Yeah, there could be, I think, some
[12:00] tradeoffs there that we'll have to think
[12:02] about. Um,
[12:05] >> I mean, to me, these are all goals. Oh,
[12:09] sorry, not even goals. They're
[12:10] opportunities. It says explore allowing
[12:13] residential. Doesn't say force it.
[12:15] Doesn't say you have to do it. Doesn't
[12:16] say anything. There's no mandate. It
[12:18] says explore it. That's all it says. So,
[12:21] I don't think they're actually in
[12:21] conflict at all because we can encourage
[12:23] more businesses to have more uh, you
[12:26] know, taxable revenue for the town while
[12:28] still allowing land owners to make use
[12:30] of their land as they want, including
[12:32] exploring residential uses. I don't
[12:33] think they're in conflict at all.
[12:37] >> Well said.
[12:40] Any other thoughts?
[12:43] All right.
[12:45] So, let's jump into tonight's
[12:50] sort of main course. Um, transportation
[12:52] improvement concepts. And when we say
[12:55] transportation, we really mean
[12:57] everything. Cars, bikes, horses, people,
[13:00] and also the public spaces by those
[13:03] transportation spaces, public spaces.
[13:05] So, trans transportation is kind of a,
[13:07] you know, catchall, but we're talking
[13:09] about a couple of different things here
[13:11] tonight. Um, and as Sage mentioned that
[13:14] really this is still conceptual. We're
[13:16] still kind of throwing ideas out there,
[13:18] visioning. We're not making final
[13:20] decisions. Um, we're going to take what
[13:23] we hear with tonight, share it with the
[13:26] council, um, help inform kind of the
[13:29] next meeting that we have with this
[13:30] group. Um, but we'll have at least two
[13:32] more meetings with y'all to kind of
[13:34] finalize these ideas and other ideas
[13:37] that we're, you know, talking about.
[13:40] um before we finalize the plan which
[13:42] will kind of capture the policy input
[13:44] that this group has worked on. Um so in
[13:47] front of you you all have a a handout.
[13:49] It's the large 11 by7 sheet that you
[13:53] have. Um you can use that to basically
[13:55] kind of follow along our ideas. We kind
[13:57] of have these five areas that we're
[13:59] going to go through one by one and talk
[14:00] about each area. So there's a a page for
[14:03] each of those areas uh that kind of sums
[14:06] up the ideas. You can mark down
[14:08] additional comments on this form if you
[14:10] want. If you, you know, don't get a
[14:12] chance to say it, you can mark that down
[14:14] and hand it back to us. Um, or you can
[14:16] just use this to kind of follow along as
[14:18] Ryan goes through the different areas.
[14:21] Um, but just that's just basically kind
[14:24] of a presentation aid for you guys to
[14:25] have as we go through this tonight. Um,
[14:27] so Ryan's going to get up here in a sec
[14:29] and he's going to go through each of
[14:30] these areas. We'll do a very brief
[14:32] presentation about kind of the ideas.
[14:34] Then we'll pause for discussion debate.
[14:36] Um, and then we'll maybe have a little
[14:38] show of hands voting about kind of some
[14:40] of the ideas and which ones you guys
[14:42] think are more more promising and not.
[14:45] Um, so with that, I'll hand it over to
[14:46] Ryan.
[14:51] » Thanks, Troy.
[14:54] Okay. Uh, this won't be short, so we'll
[14:58] get started. Uh, next slide, Troy. So,
[15:01] the really important thing to remember
[15:02] tonight is we have put these ideas out
[15:05] there to get as much feedback from all
[15:07] of you as possible. And what's really
[15:10] exciting about these meetings is when
[15:11] you actually discuss these things
[15:12] amongst yourselves because it usually
[15:14] unears more thinking. And the more
[15:16] thinking that we get on the table, the
[15:18] better we'll be able to find consensus
[15:20] with your interests, with the uh
[15:22] administration's uh interests, and also
[15:24] with the community's interests. So
[15:26] that's kind of the big process that
[15:28] we're aiming towards is incorporating as
[15:30] much feedback and the trade-offs, making
[15:33] decisions about the trade-offs to get to
[15:34] the right consensus.
[15:37] So I'll go through these this slide kind
[15:39] of outlines some of the key issues that
[15:41] we can look at tonight. Uh number one,
[15:43] Woodside and Kinyatta and Mountain Home
[15:45] intersection is a bit challenging. We
[15:48] heard that from all of you and the
[15:50] community as well. So we've come up with
[15:52] some ideas about that. Uh it's unsafe to
[15:56] cross Woodside Road in a lot of number
[15:58] of different places for pedestrians,
[15:59] horses, and bikes. Uh traffic moves too
[16:03] fast near the school and often uh from actually from Whiskey Hill into
[16:08] town as well. Uh there's no pathway on
[16:12] the north side of Woodside Road for the
[16:14] students uh to walk. At least it's not
[16:16] consistent. In some cases there's a
[16:18] walkway, in some cases there's drainage,
[16:20] in some cases there's parking. Uh we
[16:22] want to talk about um some of the
[16:25] parking issues in and around Robert's uh grocery where you're you're parking
[16:30] right in front and then also the
[16:32] difficulty of turning left on Whiskey
[16:33] Hill. There's traffic coming from both
[16:35] directions. It's not a controlled
[16:37] intersection and it can get a little
[16:39] hairy up there if you're trying to make
[16:40] a left onto it. Uh and then also it's not comfortable to get from the
[16:45] east side to the town center without a
[16:47] car. So that's kind of our our last
[16:49] issue there. Next slide.
[16:52] So to kind of categorize these
[16:54] discussions, we broke it up into five
[16:56] areas. Uh each one kind of touches on
[16:59] different things and they can kind of
[17:02] work in isolation, but I think they work
[17:04] better in concert with each other
[17:05] ultimately. So we'll be thinking about
[17:08] how the solutions for A and B and C and
[17:10] D could put potentially kind of work all
[17:12] together and create a a better town
[17:15] center environment. But we'll start off
[17:17] with Woodside West Woodside Road uh
[17:20] section A.
[17:23] Uh important thing to keep in and Sage
[17:25] mentioned this earlier. These are long
[17:27] range ideas. There's a whole process
[17:29] before anything gets implemented where
[17:31] they survey. You look where the
[17:33] utilities are. You look where the
[17:34] property lines are in great detail. So,
[17:37] and there's a whole public process that
[17:38] goes with actually implementing these
[17:40] ideas. But we've put together kind of
[17:42] vision concepts. So the big idea and
[17:46] we'll decide which of those seem to make
[17:48] sense. Um projects are ideally funded by
[17:52] grants town work uh town public works
[17:55] capital improvements or CALR. Uh we are
[17:58] trying to keep uh you know investments
[18:01] not not falling on the private property
[18:03] owners. Um again implementing these will
[18:07] require additional analysis review and
[18:08] sign off by CALR. And then we want to
[18:11] partner with land owners as much to kind
[18:14] of facilitate uh the ideas that kind of
[18:16] work for everybody. Next slide.
[18:21] So we'll start with the western Woodside
[18:23] Road. And this really uh spans from just
[18:26] past little store past the church all
[18:29] the way up to Robert's. And it's an
[18:31] interesting stretch of road. You have
[18:33] two different conditions for the bike
[18:34] lanes. you have kind of a a varying
[18:38] condition on the sidewalk on the south
[18:40] side and then the shoulder takes all
[18:42] kinds of different forms uh on the north
[18:44] side. So, we'll go to the next slide.
[18:46] Like Woodside, it's very unique. So,
[18:49] it'll have to be studied block by block
[18:51] in a lot of detail, but there were some
[18:53] sensitive areas that were revealed when
[18:55] we talked to uh the community and that
[18:58] really pertained to um the school, the
[19:01] little store, the church, and uh coming
[19:04] up to Robert's. Um so, this is the
[19:07] existing section here. Again, you'll see
[19:10] that there's a multi-use trail that in
[19:13] some places is really well defined. In
[19:15] other places, it's a bit rough. uh on
[19:18] the on the the right side here which is
[19:20] the school side. Uh the shoulder is
[19:23] around four feet. You got 12 foot travel
[19:26] lanes where the first one is actually
[19:28] shared with the bikes. The second one is
[19:31] clear of the bikes and you have a
[19:32] dedicated bike lane and then you have
[19:34] that shoulder that varies along the way.
[19:36] Next slide.
[19:40] So right now it is somewhat of an unsafe
[19:43] environment for the elementary school
[19:44] students. um vehicles at times do go
[19:47] over the speed limit and speed down this
[19:49] corridor. Uh and there's a lack of
[19:52] parking for the commercial uses at the
[19:54] church and at little store. Um so some
[19:57] of the CAC feedback that we had before
[20:00] was the elementary students pedestrian
[20:02] bicycles were tied up uh for the top
[20:05] priority to fix uh and we want to really
[20:09] fix the speeding issues that are along
[20:11] that stretch of road. Next slide.
[20:14] Some of the kind of broad ideas on here
[20:17] is starting with the pedestrian, how do
[20:19] we improve things on the north side and
[20:21] then how do we improve things on the
[20:22] south side of the street. In some of the
[20:24] areas around the school, they're already
[20:26] fairly nicely improved. Um, but it's
[20:30] when you start heading west from the
[20:32] school that things get a little
[20:33] irregular. So, looking at really
[20:36] formulizing formalizing the pedestrian
[20:39] um or the pedestrian and equestrian
[20:41] improvements along this corridor. Um, so
[20:44] enhance the existing path on the south side and look for opportunities to
[20:48] create a new multi-use path on the north
[20:50] side. Uh, in and around the school zone
[20:53] treatments, we have some a couple
[20:55] different concepts there that are
[20:56] additive. You can look at doing all of
[20:58] them or just some of them. Uh, and so
[21:01] let's let's go to the next slide, Troy.
[21:05] So traffic calming uh they've already
[21:08] started your your city's uh already done
[21:10] quite a bit to start traffic calming uh
[21:13] with high visibility crosswalks the
[21:15] rapid flashing beacons uh bike lane on
[21:18] one side the posted speed limit and we
[21:21] noticed tonight that there's the speed
[21:22] check uh digital readout which is really
[21:24] great that's very very helpful. Uh so
[21:28] the first concept is to bracket it up a
[21:30] notch. Uh narrow the lanes to 11 ft wide
[21:34] which is not an uncommon dimension uh
[21:36] for for vehicles to travel. It narrows
[21:38] up the feeling of the road a little bit.
[21:40] So people do tend to drive slower in
[21:42] those environments. Um create safer
[21:45] crossing points at Albon and new
[21:47] crossings at Fox Hollow and Miramontes.
[21:50] Um you know natural connection points
[21:52] for the neighborhoods. Uh and then look
[21:55] at uh curb extensions where there's a
[21:57] really strong definition of where the
[21:59] car uh has to go when they turn the
[22:01] corner. So there's no cutting the corner
[22:03] or where pedestrians might be standing.
[22:05] Uh speed bumps, raised crosswalks. Uh do
[22:08] folks understand the difference between
[22:10] a a raised crosswalk speed table and a speed bump? Uh if not, let me know
[22:16] and we can walk through that. It's a
[22:18] nice device. It creates a really nice
[22:20] crosswalk for pedestrians and it really
[22:22] forces the cars to slow down without
[22:24] that jolt that you get with the regular
[22:26] speed bump. Um, and then school zone
[22:28] visual treatments are really great if
[22:30] you can play up the visibility of the
[22:32] crosswalk as much as possible and really
[22:34] get people's attention, which is getting
[22:36] harder in cars, um, with as many visual
[22:39] cues and suggestions. We think that's
[22:41] really important. So, these are kind of
[22:42] like the base recommendations. Next
[22:45] slide.
[22:48] Uh the concept two is if we can uh let's
[22:52] really formalize the multi-use trails on
[22:54] either side of the road. This is going
[22:56] to take a really careful study on the
[22:57] north side to look at where the power
[22:59] lines are or the power poles are where there's big trees or where they're
[23:03] not big trees and then there's the
[23:04] drainage. So that would take a lot of
[23:06] study, but it would be a great long-term
[23:08] goal for the city to achieve um
[23:10] pedestrian safe travel on both sides of
[23:12] the street. the southside on the side of
[23:15] the school is actually uh I think it's
[23:18] quite implementable. Uh it's it's not
[23:20] far off from where it is today. So I
[23:22] think that's a good thing if we can buy
[23:24] ourselves some space take some space
[23:27] away from the cars and you know get two
[23:31] dedicated bike lanes. It wouldn't be for
[23:34] the entire length because there are some
[23:35] trees some really old trees that
[23:37] encroach and narrow the roadway. But if
[23:40] we could, you know, beyond those trees
[23:42] which are closer to the school going
[23:44] west, if we could implement dedicated
[23:46] bike lanes so that a cyclist, you know,
[23:49] has a symmetrical street layout, they
[23:51] know that they're going this way on a on
[23:53] a dedicated bike lane and coming back on
[23:54] a dedicated bike lane, which is kind of
[23:56] a clear use of the street for them.
[23:59] Uh, next slide.
[24:03] So, Little Store, uh, you know, it's a
[24:05] great asset for the community. uh
[24:07] provides services uh without going all
[24:10] the way into the center. Uh right now
[24:12] it's there's a very nicely defined
[24:15] parking lot off the street, but there's
[24:17] some kind of ambiguous zones on either
[24:20] side of the store that could be parking,
[24:21] maybe they're not parking. There's some
[24:23] wood stumps, there's signage that says
[24:24] no. So going through a process where you
[24:28] really define what legally is in the
[24:29] public right away, what can legally be
[24:32] used as parking for the store and trying
[24:34] to make it easy and safe for um cars to
[24:38] park uh and also uh dedicating space for
[24:42] the bikes to travel on dedicated bike
[24:44] lanes I think would be a worthwhile um
[24:48] effort to clarify all of that. Next
[24:50] slide.
[24:52] So, this shows uh in plan kind of what
[24:55] we're thinking. Uh little stores there
[24:58] in the white outline with the parking
[24:59] lot to the right and just kind of
[25:01] creating a more formalized uh sidewalk
[25:04] or you know path environment. Uh have
[25:07] clearly defined parking and then
[25:10] narrowing the travel lanes to 11 feet
[25:13] gives room for 5ft bike lane and six
[25:15] foot upgraded DG path on the south side.
[25:20] Next slide.
[25:23] So before we jump into the the next
[25:25] session, I thought it'd be good to kind
[25:27] of hear from all of you on this. What
[25:29] are people's initial reactions to the
[25:32] concepts? Um, you know, share us share
[25:34] with us what you're you're thinking.
[25:37] Harley,
[25:41] » I'm all for anything that makes it safer
[25:43] for pedestrians and the students and
[25:47] bicyclists and stuff. Um I do have a
[25:50] question from one point on one of the
[25:53] other slides. It said implemented was
[25:56] posted speed limit lowered to 15 miles
[25:58] per hour. Is there an update about CALR
[26:02] and lowering the speed limit near
[26:04] school?
[26:06] >> Not yet.
[26:09] >> Yes. Uh Lewis, public works director. Um
[26:12] the request to reduce speed uh on what
[26:15] side road in front of the elementary
[26:16] school was submitted to CALR. Um, I'll
[26:18] be meeting with Calrance on Monday and
[26:20] get an update on that, but we did submit
[26:22] that request.
[26:29] » Yes, Steve. Um, yeah, I I mean, I wrote
[26:32] this in my letter, but I'll try to throw
[26:34] it quickly. I I the uh your diagram
[26:36] shows a 5-ft bike lane immediately
[26:39] adjacent to parked cars, which is really
[26:41] dangerous. And um I went not sure
[26:44] there's actually enough room for bike
[26:46] lanes in this section.
[26:48] and and the existing path near the
[26:50] school is a sidewalk really. It's not,
[26:53] you know, state and federal standards
[26:55] call for 12 feet a width for shared
[26:57] paths that are two-way. And so, um, you
[27:00] know, these are substandard and I think
[27:02] dangerous. So, I think balancing
[27:05] everything out, we'd actually do better
[27:07] to narrow the traffic lanes to slow
[27:09] people down and to and to get rid of the
[27:12] bike lanes alto together and have a
[27:13] 12-oot shared use path on one side with
[27:17] frequent crosswalks and ways to get to
[27:19] the crosswalks on the north side.
[27:22] >> Great.
[27:24] Any other comments,
[27:27] >> uh, yeah, I think I'm glad to see a lot
[27:28] of these. I know on circulation
[27:30] committee we've been talking about
[27:30] various ideas like this for years. So
[27:32] it's very good to see it holistically. I
[27:34] think the uh I agree with Steve's
[27:37] comments generally about you know where
[27:39] there's enough space and there isn't. I
[27:41] do I know the north side uh sidewalk or
[27:43] path there's another use for that which
[27:46] is there there's families that live up
[27:47] Monty's Audi Fred etc who have to
[27:50] literally walk through a ditch or have
[27:52] to cross the road at a non-crosswalk to
[27:54] get to school or to get to town center
[27:55] because there's actually no place to
[27:56] walk unless you walk opposite traffic in
[27:58] the bike lane which is both illegal and
[28:00] dangerous. So I think trying to find
[28:02] whatever we can to do it there obviously
[28:04] will be expensive. There's drainage
[28:05] concerns and it's not going to be a
[28:06] project we start tomorrow but I think
[28:08] support for it is great. I think the
[28:10] crosswalks are another thing to have
[28:11] support from people in that area. Again,
[28:13] if you actually go out there and look, I
[28:15] used to think it was not that bad. And
[28:16] then when I went out there with a parent
[28:17] a couple times, it's people are speeding
[28:19] and they're not waiting for you. And
[28:20] frankly, you're you're walking across
[28:22] the road without a crosswalk, so they're
[28:23] not expecting you. Um, so no, I think
[28:25] those are good ideas. I think the one
[28:26] thing to be cautious of with lane
[28:27] narrowing is obviously Cal has to
[28:30] approve it. That is a highway. Um, lots
[28:32] of people in Woodside have trailers,
[28:33] right? Obviously horse trailers, utility
[28:35] trailers, those are wider. There's
[28:37] usually 102 inches wide. Um, so we just
[28:39] want to make sure we don't create a
[28:40] situation where people just knock it
[28:41] into things or or driving across a lane,
[28:44] right? Like sometimes on that narrow
[28:46] bridge on 84 trailers will drive across
[28:48] because they want to keep a buffer to
[28:49] that wall on the side. So that could,
[28:51] you know, inadvertently cause a problem.
[28:52] So that's something to be aware of in
[28:54] narrowing in an area like this as
[28:56] opposed to maybe like a residential
[28:57] street where you're not going to have
[28:58] heavy traffic,
[28:58] >> right? Could make one more. I mean, the
[29:01] lanes are already 11 ft near the school.
[29:03] The the sidewalk project narrowed the
[29:05] lanes there. So, Kellr approve that.
[29:08] We're already living with that and I
[29:10] haven't heard complaints about those
[29:11] lanes being too narrow.
[29:14] >> So, a couple a couple of other comments.
[29:16] So, like EANO, we look at this stuff in
[29:18] circulation all the time, right? So, I
[29:20] maybe a little more detail um on the
[29:22] traffic calming stuff. You guys are
[29:24] going to be very thoughtful about our
[29:26] equestrian community. So, horse trailers
[29:28] and speed bumps don't mix at all, right?
[29:32] So, we would have to have I I don't know
[29:34] how we're going to handle that. Um, uh,
[29:37] same idea with Narrow we talked about
[29:39] earlier. Um, I think that we all want to
[29:42] have safety for the kids.
[29:43] >> Mhm.
[29:43] >> Woodside Road is also a primary wildfire
[29:45] evacuation route,
[29:46] >> right?
[29:47] >> So, whatever we do needs to we just need
[29:49] to make sure we don't accidentally
[29:51] reduce capacity so people die in a
[29:52] wildfire, right? Trying to get down from
[29:54] the hill. Um, I would extend this to
[29:57] Kings Mountain. It would be silly to
[29:59] have a beautiful six foot wide DG path
[30:02] that stops at the little store because
[30:04] the trails go on Kings Mountain and
[30:06] that's that's a that's right where the
[30:09] current trail dies, right?
[30:10] >> Right in front of the little street. So,
[30:12] it's just such an easy opportunity to
[30:13] connect to the King's Mountain trail
[30:15] network. Um the just to in back your
[30:18] head, the town engineer was very
[30:19] concerned about drainage on the north
[30:20] side when this has been brought up. So,
[30:22] they were talking about it being very
[30:23] expensive because of having to reroute
[30:26] drainage compared to making it great on
[30:28] the south side. Um, I think an an urgent
[30:32] project that we're thinking about in
[30:33] circulation, but you guys could help
[30:34] with simply publishing clarity about
[30:37] rules. So, we have, you know, residents
[30:39] who put no parking signs up in the
[30:41] public right of way because they don't
[30:42] like the little store parking, right?
[30:44] And that's not probably great behavior.
[30:46] So, you know, who's allowed to park
[30:48] where in Woodside is people don't really
[30:50] know and it's not well signed and why.
[30:52] Um, same thing about who's allowed to
[30:53] use the trails there. So, we have
[30:55] examples of equestrians telling kids on
[30:58] bikes get off the trail, right?
[31:00] >> Get on public trails. And so, we just,
[31:02] you know, what's allowed, I think, is
[31:04] really important to so people know
[31:06] because people want to follow the rules.
[31:07] They just don't know.
[31:08] >> Yeah. Clear signage stating directly
[31:10] what's permissible, what's not
[31:12] permissible, and who can use the
[31:14] facilities. That's great. Thank you.
[31:16] >> I would echo what Mr. Ducker just said
[31:18] and then also add that probably step one
[31:21] would be applying a fair amount of TLC
[31:25] to the existing trail um along Woodside
[31:28] Road on the south side because on a day
[31:31] like today it is very swampy.
[31:33] >> Yeah.
[31:34] >> And the drainage is not good. And fixing
[31:36] the drainage on that and making it a 365
[31:41] day a year path would be really useful.
[31:44] Lyle, that's interesting because in a
[31:46] sense all of these improvements could
[31:48] also go through a phasing process, you
[31:50] know, so what's your absolute top, you
[31:53] know, priority that needs to happen
[31:55] ASAP? Let's write that down. And then
[31:58] what's what are the nice to haves? Like,
[32:00] okay, in a perfect world with unlimited
[32:02] funding, we could do X, Y, and Z. Or
[32:05] just I think categorizing where your
[32:06] priorities are would be really great.
[32:08] >> Formalizing the parking as pointed out
[32:11] would be good. The other thing as far as
[32:14] additional crosswalks,
[32:16] if you were going to prioritize, it
[32:18] would be easier to justify um something
[32:21] where Miramar Montes is versus Fox
[32:23] Hollow, which is a dead-end road that
[32:25] doesn't have a particular amount of um
[32:29] either of the four forms of traffic
[32:31] coming in and out of it.
[32:32] >> Okay.
[32:35] >> Yes, Richard.
[32:36] >> So, uh great comments here and I agree
[32:38] with all of them. Does the sale of the
[32:42] site next door to the elementary school
[32:45] in any way impact the location of the
[32:49] improvements that you show on slide 12?
[32:53] >> Go back to slide 12.
[32:55] >> So there's been a sale of that large
[32:58] parcel immediately west and adjoining
[33:01] the school. though and that's got a fair
[33:05] bit of frontage and right now it's shown
[33:07] with school zone treatments. Does that
[33:10] sale potential sale and potential use or
[33:14] development change any of this? It's a
[33:16] minor point but
[33:17] >> yeah I think as the vision for that site
[33:20] evolves and what the school intends to
[33:23] do with it the sensitivity is going to
[33:25] be access you know how is that site
[33:28] moving people how are they moving people
[33:30] onto that site is it through extending
[33:32] circulation that's already connected to
[33:34] the school or will they be looking at
[33:36] curb cuts or widening curb cuts and uh
[33:40] and then also land use intensity so I
[33:43] think at this stage um the priority
[33:45] ities of creating safe travel for
[33:48] pedestrians, horses, and bikes can stay
[33:51] consistent. And then we'll keep an eye
[33:53] on that and see where it goes as they
[33:55] reveal more of their thinking.
[34:03] » Back to uh the little store area and um
[34:07] you asked about priorities. Um, so I'm a
[34:10] resident up near that area and walk by
[34:14] there daily and it is extremely
[34:17] dangerous. Now there are so many people
[34:20] coming in and out of the little store,
[34:22] crossing the road there, kids, you know,
[34:24] adults, um, all during the day while the
[34:27] store is open. And I mean, I have seen
[34:30] people almost get hit. Um, certainly
[34:33] traffic does speed up once it leaves the
[34:36] school. It is clearly marked. All the
[34:38] crosswalks are great at the school for
[34:41] 25 and um cars just speed up because
[34:44] there are no signs that say it's still
[34:47] 25 until you hit uh past Kings Mountain
[34:50] Road or at Kings Mountain Road. So I
[34:53] think a priority be besides certainly
[34:55] parking delineating parking but also
[34:58] putting in at least one crosswalk
[35:01] whether it's at uh Fox Hollow enabling
[35:05] people to cross the street to get to
[35:08] their cars um wherever they are along
[35:10] there or Mariamontes.
[35:12] um a crosswalk is needed and uh
[35:16] preferably just a simple 25 mph sign
[35:21] right around Miramonte's Fox Hollow
[35:24] again telling people this is still a 25
[35:27] mph speed zone.
[35:29] >> Great. So, do you think uh the Fox
[35:32] Hollow Road or the Little Store, a
[35:35] crosswalk right at Little Store or in
[35:39] instead of Fox Hollow, does that make
[35:40] more sense in your mind or do you think
[35:43] >> I think either is fine? I mean, whatever
[35:46] you think would be easier to get uh
[35:49] past.
[35:50] >> Okay.
[35:50] >> Um just something there needs to be
[35:53] there. Um, it Fox Hollow is so close to
[35:57] the little store that even I think it
[35:59] wouldn't people would still walk those
[36:02] few, you know, feet to get to Fox Hollow
[36:05] to cross
[36:05] >> to use a safe cross. Yeah.
[36:08] >> Great.
[36:08] >> But either way.
[36:10] >> Yeah.
[36:10] >> Thanks, Vanessa. Yeah.
[36:12] >> Uh, should we
[36:13] >> Oh, great.
[36:14] >> Yes, Carolyn.
[36:15] >> Hi. Uh, just a question about the
[36:18] village hub parking that's suggested
[36:20] here as well. There was a helpful
[36:21] diagram for the little store, but uh I
[36:23] didn't see one for the space on the
[36:25] north side along Village Hub. Is that
[36:28] just because it's more self-explanatory
[36:30] or
[36:31] >> uh
[36:31] >> were there specific recommendations that
[36:33] you had?
[36:34] >> The the there's signage right now at
[36:36] Village Hub that I believe says no
[36:38] parking at certain times. Um but Troy,
[36:42] let's look at that. We'll take some
[36:44] pictures tonight and at least document
[36:46] exactly what the rules are in that spot
[36:48] because I remember I had to park way
[36:50] down Woodside Road when we did the popup
[36:52] at the Village Hub because the parking
[36:54] was not allowed along the street there.
[36:57] Um
[37:00] uh let's let's hear from Sue.
[37:03] >> Hi.
[37:04] Would the bike lane by foot also count
[37:08] as roadway?
[37:11] So, say for a firet truck.
[37:13] >> Yes. Okay.
[37:14] >> Yeah. If they needed that extra, there
[37:16] would not be any ballards or barriers
[37:18] between those two environments. And a
[37:21] lot of times in that configuration where
[37:24] there's um an adjacent bike lane, the
[37:27] cyclist will like to pass slower bike
[37:29] cyclists and they'll go into the roadway
[37:31] to get around those guys rather than
[37:33] trying to do it all in the five feet.
[37:35] So, there's no barriers between the two.
[37:37] >> Okay. So legally, if we're saying a road
[37:39] has to be 26 foot wide for a fire truck
[37:43] going to a 30 foot tall, taller
[37:45] structure, we could say this road as
[37:48] pictured.
[37:49] >> Definitely. Yeah, they can put the feet
[37:50] down uh on the fire truck rig because
[37:53] you basically have 30 plus feet to work
[37:55] with.
[37:56] >> Yeah. Thanks.
[37:59] » I just wanted to call out a pray praise
[38:01] for the school's own treatment uh
[38:03] designation. I know one thing we've
[38:04] identified is the the school is actually
[38:06] quite good at hiding itself. So it's
[38:08] kind of follows a woodside design
[38:09] aesthetic of being subordinate to the
[38:11] land. It's almost too good and so people
[38:13] who don't know it's there until you are
[38:14] literally on top of it, you do not know
[38:16] there's a school there. So things we can
[38:17] do to make that more obvious are very
[38:18] good.
[38:19] >> Excellent.
[38:22] Great. Uh we'll keep going then on to
[38:25] area two. Oh, really quick, Troy. Do you think we should do the vote or
[38:32] >> Yeah, just out of curiosity, uh just do
[38:34] a quick show of hands for everyone who
[38:36] supports the north side path.
[38:46] » We can do a priority list maybe.
[38:48] >> Yeah. Well, it's just interesting to see
[38:50] kind of I think
[38:51] >> Totally.
[38:53] >> million,
[38:54] >> right?
[38:54] >> It's a It's a maybe. Well, absolutely.
[38:57] >> Okay, that's good feedback. I think we
[38:59] have pretty good uh support for the
[39:02] first concept, the street calming and the slowing down. Um, how about the
[39:06] last idea, the marked on street parking?
[39:09] How many hands for that one?
[39:12] >> Most most.
[39:14] >> Great.
[39:14] >> Okay, perfect. Thanks, guys.
[39:17] All right, next area.
[39:20] >> So, uh, Woodside Kinata Woodside Road,
[39:23] Kinyatta Road, Mountain Home Road. This
[39:25] is one of the kind of major arrival
[39:28] points in the city or the town and uh it
[39:31] is a slightly organic intersection. I
[39:34] think 100 years ago it was probably a
[39:36] lot slower and a lot easier to navigate.
[39:38] Um but there's a lot more traffic that
[39:40] doesn't necessarily live in Woodside,
[39:42] but they go through this space and so
[39:44] there's quite a bit of activity here.
[39:46] And so looking at a a way to really
[39:49] create a lot more visual clarity for a
[39:51] pedestrian uh for a motorist for a bike
[39:54] or horse on where you should actually be
[39:57] uh in this zone. So let's go through the
[40:00] next slide.
[40:02] So these are some of the existing
[40:04] conditions that we have. Uh there are
[40:07] two slip lanes. uh one uh on coming off
[40:11] of Kenyatta Road to make a a right past
[40:13] Kinyatta Corners and then one coming off
[40:16] Mountain Hob Road making a right on the
[40:17] Woodside. And those are intentionally
[40:20] designed to keep traffic flow going
[40:22] really easily. Uh but they also create
[40:25] somewhat of a challenge for pedestrians
[40:27] just you know another another road to
[40:29] cross and getting in and around this
[40:31] hub. uh the sight lines and visibility.
[40:35] There are times where you're making a
[40:37] right off Woodside Road on the Mountain
[40:39] Home and you may not realize that
[40:42] somebody's backing out of Robert's
[40:43] Grocery. So, there's some concerns with
[40:45] that. Um and then also there's just some
[40:48] traffic congestion that comes with all
[40:50] of these traffic movements coming
[40:52] together at this one spot.
[40:54] Uh there's a lack of crosswalks. If
[40:57] you're coming from um uh Gilbert's
[41:00] property going across over Robert's
[41:02] Grocery, uh there isn't a crosswalk um
[41:06] to the Alec Donald Park and then on over
[41:09] to Roberts. So you're it's just not
[41:12] super clear on where the safest path is
[41:15] for pedestrians at this moment in time.
[41:17] So there's some opportunities, I think,
[41:18] to improve and make things a lot clearer
[41:21] for folks so that cars know what to
[41:22] expect and pedestrians know how to get
[41:25] there. Um, we did some initial com uh
[41:28] concepts or discuss some initial
[41:30] comments in our last meeting which is
[41:32] leave it alone. Um, minor improvements,
[41:35] comprehensive redesign and a roundabout.
[41:38] was not popular. Um,
[41:41] comprehensive redesign was. So we moved
[41:43] forward with some different ideas on how
[41:45] to do a comprehensive redesign. These
[41:48] are not complete finalized concepts by
[41:50] any means. These are ideas that came out
[41:53] of discussions with all of you and we
[41:55] should beat them up tonight. And
[41:57] actually some of you have provided some
[41:59] really really constructive helpful
[42:00] comments in your emails already. So
[42:03] let's keep those going and and talk
[42:05] about them. So next slide.
[42:08] So the first one minor configuration and
[42:11] there's some optionality in this but one
[42:14] of the uh things that actually was very
[42:16] clear in the community outreach process
[42:18] was people were not real excited about
[42:20] the slip lane off of Mountain Home Road.
[42:22] And so as you get into that lane and
[42:24] make a right, you're still worried about
[42:26] traffic coming down Woodside Road. And
[42:28] so by making the right turn really only
[42:31] happened in one spot at where Mountain
[42:33] Home touches Woodside Road seemed like a
[42:36] kind of a consensus move and the folks
[42:39] that we talked to. So it also opens up a
[42:42] lot of land because we're taking all
[42:44] that square footage where the slip lane
[42:45] was and now we get to do things with it
[42:47] that are oriented for pedestrians
[42:49] um or public space. And so what we have
[42:52] here on the screen, this is kind of
[42:54] option one where we leave the center
[42:57] line of mountain home road alone. So
[43:00] traveling mountain home is the same as
[43:02] you are today, but on either side of it,
[43:05] we've clarified where the pedestrians
[43:08] belong and where the cars belong by
[43:10] creating well- definfined sidewalks.
[43:12] There is a loss of a couple parking
[43:14] spaces right in front of Robert's
[43:16] Grocery and we put them across the
[43:18] street and added one. But essentially,
[43:21] we've also added crosswalks that now
[43:23] connect um an expanded basically Alec
[43:27] Donald Park doubled in size from about
[43:29] 3,000 ft to 6,000 square ft. And we now
[43:33] have crosswalks that carry that
[43:35] pedestrian traffic along Woodside Road
[43:37] all the way to the corner of Robert's
[43:38] Grocery where they can then cross a
[43:41] Woodside Road over to Kinyatta Corners.
[43:44] So kind of a no-brainer super simple
[43:46] pedestrian path which is kind of what
[43:48] we're shooting for just to make it as
[43:50] easy as possible. And then if you look
[43:53] at where Mountain Home Road um engages
[43:57] the parking access for Gilbert's, we've
[43:59] created another crosswalk there just so
[44:02] there's a nice pedestrian loop. Uh cars
[44:04] are really slowing down and we've kind
[44:06] of suggested even maybe considering like
[44:09] a cobblestone or some kind of textured
[44:11] paving um where the parking is to really
[44:14] slow down the car movement in that zone.
[44:17] Um this is showing reversed backend
[44:20] parking. It could still be 90 degree.
[44:24] This was just an idea we wanted to run
[44:25] by folks and see if it made sense. This
[44:28] allows folks to open up the back of
[44:29] their car directly to the store and not
[44:32] take the cart out in the traffic. So, we
[44:34] thought there might be some advantages
[44:36] to that.
[44:38] Uh, yes.
[44:41] complaints are there
[44:42] >> for accident.
[44:44] >> How many complaints are there if any for
[44:48] accidents that would relate to all the
[44:51] things that you've just mentioned around
[44:52] the stores?
[44:53] >> So, in the community outreach process,
[44:56] people did convey that it is difficult
[44:58] as a pedestrian to get from one side of
[45:01] Woodside.
[45:01] >> No, I asked you, have there been any I
[45:03] should have been more clear, maybe. Has
[45:04] anybody ever been hurt or hit or
[45:06] whatever? Not that I
[45:08] >> I'll hand that to Sage. Uh,
[45:15] » hi, Melissa Cardelli, acting town
[45:17] manager. We asked the sheriff's office
[45:19] for some data for reported collisions
[45:22] for Woodside Road, Kinyatta Road, and
[45:24] Mountain Home Road uh between January
[45:26] 1st, 2024 to uh yesterday, April 20th,
[45:29] 2026. And
[45:34] there's 10 10 incidents.
[45:37] >> Melissa, can you be specific? Like is it
[45:40] around this the store itself?
[45:42] >> Uh I have street names here. So I have
[45:45] Kinyatta Road and Woodside Road. I have
[45:47] an address uh 750 Mountain Home Road. I
[45:50] have Kinyatta Road, Woodside Road.
[45:51] Mountain Home Road. Mountain Home Road
[45:54] at Cedar Lane.
[45:55] >> Save your Save your breath cuz I don't
[45:56] know. I mean, I'm talking about the
[45:58] store.
[45:59] >> Uh
[46:00] >> these would not tell me if it just says
[46:02] Woodside Road and Kinyatta Road. So it's
[46:04] just at the intersection.
[46:06] >> Well, that's quite a distance.
[46:08] I'm just trying to be specific about how
[46:11] dangerous that this is. I mean, you're
[46:14] talking about a store that's been there
[46:16] a long time. I haven't really heard of
[46:19] many accidents there where people and it may be wonky. Maybe they're getting
[46:23] out and people are putting thing, you
[46:25] know, packing them into their car as
[46:27] they get in.
[46:29] I I don't understand. And it see it
[46:31] seems um that we're just assuming a lot
[46:33] of things and then maybe you'd be making
[46:36] a hit on the store to change it around.
[46:38] >> Well, I think I think we're trying our
[46:40] best. It's not that we're we're
[46:42] responding to the community input that
[46:46] pedestrian circulation could be safer.
[46:50] And so that's
[46:50] >> What do you mean it could be safer?
[46:52] Everything could always be safer. When
[46:54] you walk out of here tonight, it's been
[46:56] raining. It could be safer if it didn't
[46:58] rain.
[46:59] >> Yeah.
[46:59] >> Okay. So, you have to watch out tonight
[47:01] everybody when you leave. We could go on
[47:03] and on and on about what's safer. But so
[47:07] far, we have a track history of
[47:10] we've lived here 60 years in this town.
[47:13] So, I'm just trying to think how many
[47:15] times have I heard of anybody getting
[47:17] hurt coming out of Roberts or coming out
[47:19] of our place or wherever. I
[47:21] >> I think it's a very fair discussion to
[47:23] have as to what level of comfort is
[47:26] appropriate and what the trade-offs are.
[47:30] Um,
[47:30] >> trade-offs. What's the trade-offs? Just
[47:32] changing everything downtown. Is that
[47:34] it?
[47:35] >> Uh, no. I mean, we can talk about
[47:37] trade-offs in very quantitative terms.
[47:40] You know, one is you pick up two
[47:42] crosswalks, you lose two parking spaces
[47:45] uh in front of the store. So, there's
[47:47] kind of a a quantitative way perspective
[47:49] to look at it there. um you know for 20
[47:53] years I worked in the world of retail
[47:56] and there's a customer perspective on it
[47:58] in terms of uh you know what's
[48:01] comfortable for um you know different
[48:04] people different size of groups uh
[48:06] people with strollers all things like
[48:09] that so there's there's a lot of
[48:10] thinking and and I just I'd love to hear
[48:13] I mean it's it's a it's a great
[48:16] discussion to have and that's why we're
[48:17] here tonight so yeah truly
[48:25] is on.
[48:26] >> Oh, I can't I couldn't see the red.
[48:28] Okay. Oh, there it is. It was hidden.
[48:30] Um,
[48:32] I walk in this intersection very
[48:34] frequently and I am a huge advocate of
[48:37] those pedestrian crosswalks personally,
[48:40] but just also watching kids do it and
[48:43] there's a game of Frogger going on right
[48:45] now. So, however we're going to approach
[48:48] this, I think those crosswalks are
[48:50] critical. Um,
[48:53] >> I also frequently drive in this small
[48:56] area between Mountain Home Road and
[48:58] Woodside Road and already the cars
[49:01] backing in backing out and the cars
[49:04] going on Woodside Road. It's It's pretty
[49:06] tricky. I really, while it looks elegant
[49:09] on the page, I can't imagine it
[49:11] happening from both sides. I think it
[49:13] would be quite problematic.
[49:15] Um, so I would raise that concern. And
[49:19] um, the park looks quite cute here. I'm
[49:22] not sure if it would actually be
[49:24] utilized very much with, you know,
[49:27] traffic on all three sides of it. So,
[49:31] um, I would mention that as well, but in
[49:33] terms of the crosswalks, I think those
[49:36] are amazing.
[49:37] >> Great. Uh Troy, let's um go through the
[49:40] next two images really quick and then we
[49:42] can go back to
[49:44] and I guess there's one option where we
[49:46] could go through all three options and
[49:48] then do comments or but what what do you
[49:52] prefer
[49:54] >> that? Okay. So we'll go through the
[49:56] we'll go through this fairly quickly
[49:57] then and then we'll come back and we can
[50:00] go over each option. Uh so this uh I
[50:04] modeled it uh in the computer and
[50:07] there's a lot of gray change on this
[50:09] site so we'd have to be really careful
[50:10] about that. But this shows Alec Donald
[50:14] Park expanded to about 6,000 square ft
[50:16] from what it is today which is about
[50:18] 3,000. Um so definitely addressing
[50:22] traffic noise is important. Buffering
[50:24] the movement creating a nice respit from
[50:27] all that intensity. I think I do think
[50:30] with a good landscape designer, it's
[50:31] entirely possible and there's precedent
[50:33] for something like that. Um, but let's
[50:36] go through the next two concepts. And
[50:38] the three concepts are meant to be
[50:39] really different to try and gather as
[50:42] much feedback from you as possible. This
[50:44] is the view kind of looking from the
[50:46] hill um towards the the park just to
[50:49] kind of give you an idea of the scale of
[50:50] it. So, it's quite a bit bigger. Um, so
[50:53] there's some opportunity for programming
[50:55] that you don't currently have for
[50:57] different kinds of seating environments,
[50:59] different kinds of vegetation and trees
[51:01] and things. Uh, one of the, you know,
[51:04] initial goals was let's create um an
[51:07] opportunity for public gathering space
[51:09] in the city. So it seemed getting rid of
[51:11] the slip lane and taking advantage of
[51:13] some of this this dirt was a an
[51:15] opportunity for that. Next slide.
[51:19] So this concept here also is somewhat
[51:22] meant to be very minimal in terms of the
[51:24] traffic center lines for the street
[51:26] alignments, keeping all of that roughly
[51:28] the same, but creating opportunities for
[51:31] better crosswalk and connectivity. And
[51:33] this one takes uh an approach where the
[51:37] parking that was in front of Robert's
[51:38] Grocery Grocery gets relocated to where
[51:42] Alec McDonald Park was. And then the
[51:44] Alec McDonald Park gets relocated to
[51:46] directly adjacent to the front entry of
[51:49] Robert's Grocery. So grabbing a
[51:52] sandwich, hanging out with friends,
[51:53] doing stuff like that, or coming from
[51:55] Kiana Quarters, just crossing the
[51:57] crosswalk, you've got a a nice little
[51:59] crossroads intersection there to to
[52:02] gather. This plaza is about 3,000 square
[52:05] ft. So it's almost a direct trade for
[52:07] your existing Alec Donald Park, which is
[52:10] 3,000 for this right next. It's um it is
[52:14] smaller than the previous concept and
[52:16] it'll smaller than the next concept. Um
[52:20] so this is just a quick sketch of of how
[52:22] that would kind of feel and scale. It's
[52:25] not it's not insignificant in size for a
[52:28] kind of a retail environment plaza.
[52:30] That's a not sometimes having something
[52:33] that's a little smaller can actually
[52:34] make it feel a little more bustling and
[52:35] vibrant. Um so that's kind of the
[52:38] concept there. Some of the challenges
[52:40] that were noted with this is now the
[52:42] carts are going across the street and
[52:44] that's kind of the big obvious one
[52:45] that's that's quite problematic. So, uh,
[52:49] next slide. And so this is a different
[52:52] view of that. Again, the the idea behind
[52:55] this scheme and the previous scheme was
[52:58] if we're not changing street alignments,
[53:00] maybe these are a little easier to
[53:02] implement. Um but the next one we tested
[53:05] that theory based on some concepts that
[53:08] Steve provided. Um and then Alta, our
[53:11] transportation consultant, took those
[53:14] ideas and you know kind of worked with
[53:16] some of the constraints that we
[53:17] revealed. And so this was a concept
[53:19] where Mountain Home Road actually curves
[53:22] and it basically imagining uh imagine
[53:25] widening the slip lane. So, we take the
[53:28] slip lane that's there, we widen it into
[53:30] a two-way street, and then align it with
[53:34] the uh Kinyatta uh lane intersection
[53:39] um in terms of creating one uh
[53:41] crosswalk, one, you know, simple
[53:43] intersection there. And then the
[53:45] interesting byproduct of this is you
[53:48] create this Alec Donald Plaza that's
[53:50] about 6,000 square ft. So, it's double
[53:52] the size of the previous one. And then
[53:55] you really tighten up the intersection
[53:57] where Kinyatta Road and Woodside Road
[53:59] come together. So now you've got just a
[54:01] very simple T intersection. Traffic
[54:04] movements are much simpler there. And
[54:06] the pedestrian crossing zone gets much
[54:08] smaller. So we were able to move the
[54:10] curb out and the area that says
[54:12] landscape um on the right side of
[54:14] Kinyatta Road is a substantial expansion
[54:17] of that that land area there. So there's
[54:20] some interesting opportunities in terms
[54:22] of people arriving at Kinyatta Road.
[54:24] there could be a really great signage
[54:25] moment at the park. Um the landscape
[54:28] area at the the other side of the
[54:30] street, they start to create a gateway
[54:32] on both sides of Woodside as you enter
[54:34] the uh the commercial core. And so let's
[54:38] go to the next slide.
[54:41] And so just so you kind of have an idea
[54:42] of how this feels in 3D, um this one
[54:46] here retains the pull-in parking. It's
[54:48] just not directly in front of the store.
[54:50] It's just off to the side. Um, it does
[54:53] introduce a se a second stop sign, a
[54:56] second intersection. So you'd have
[54:57] Kinyatta Road and Woodside Road and then
[55:00] you would have the Kinyatta Lane and
[55:02] Woodside Road intersections, both with
[55:04] stop signs.
[55:06] Uh, so this is also kind of working in
[55:08] conjunction with the idea that we're
[55:10] slowing down traffic on Woodside Road up
[55:12] to Whiskey Hill. So, and then that's the other view looking from Kin Kinyatta
[55:19] Road.
[55:20] So, these are the three options kind of
[55:24] next to each other. Um, concept one
[55:28] about 6,000 square feet. It's across the
[55:31] street. Uh, concept two, you've got the
[55:35] plaza heart up against the the Robert's
[55:38] Grocery, uh, but no changes to the
[55:40] street alignment. And then concept three
[55:42] is kind of a it's a major surgery where
[55:45] we reroute the road. Um, but we kind of
[55:48] revealed this opportunity for a large
[55:50] plaza directly adjacent to the grocery
[55:53] store and then also maintain the pool
[55:55] and parking.
[55:56] So,
[55:58] um, yes,
[55:59] >> when I'm looking at this, I can't stand
[56:02] it. By the way, I'm thinking about this
[56:05] is serving
[56:06] a lot of people that don't live here and
[56:10] you know we this is the people that live
[56:12] in Woodside and to think that there'd be
[56:14] a big park there with people throwing
[56:17] their paper down and you know their
[56:19] sandwich they didn't finish eating and
[56:20] all that to create something like that
[56:24] in the middle of town. You think that's
[56:26] a nice thing? I I I don't I just don't I
[56:30] think it's stupid. Sorry.
[56:32] >> Public
[56:32] >> I'm not sorry.
[56:33] >> Public open space does exist in a lot of
[56:36] towns
[56:38] and and but where I'm going with this is
[56:41] you're absolutely right. They require a
[56:43] lot of care and maintenance and
[56:45] attention. They're not free. Uh they
[56:48] require a yearly budget. You have to
[56:50] take care of them. And there's a lot of
[56:52] discussion about the um and the
[56:55] discussion is on both sides of the coin
[56:58] about what their value is to the
[56:59] community. and how they're used by both
[57:02] residents and non-residents and how they
[57:04] either generate or don't generate
[57:06] business for the properties and value
[57:08] for the properties that are near it. So,
[57:10] I think that's what we're here tonight
[57:12] is to kind of hear your thoughts on
[57:14] those ideas. Um, and you know, there's
[57:18] always option zero, which is leave it
[57:20] exactly the way it is. Um, so let's u
[57:24] keep talking. I'll stop talking. You
[57:25] keep talking.
[57:28] Yes, Carolyn.
[57:30] I would be in favor of concept one for
[57:34] two reasons. One is the expansion of the
[57:36] footprint of the park to 6,000 square
[57:39] feet, but also because it makes the or
[57:43] it's the only one that really separates
[57:45] the park from the market. And I think
[57:48] that in concepts two and three, while I
[57:50] like the idea of creating some sort of
[57:53] plaza that can be an extension of the
[57:56] market or or you know where you would go
[57:58] to potentially eat your sandwich, it
[58:00] would to me feel like it was kind of
[58:02] private property or it belongs to
[58:04] Roberts or it's maybe not as welcoming
[58:07] to others like do I have to purchase
[58:10] something in order to sit there? Um you
[58:13] know those kinds of questions that
[58:14] someone could ask themselves. And then
[58:16] being directly adjacent like in two and
[58:19] three, would Roberts then be somewhat
[58:22] not responsible for cleaning because we
[58:24] just heard what was said, but like maybe
[58:26] their staff looks around and they would
[58:28] feel compelled to do a little bit more
[58:29] maintenance than they otherwise would if
[58:31] there was the separation. Um, also with
[58:34] the larger footprint, some of the
[58:37] objectives the committee identified
[58:38] earlier like having that public
[58:40] gathering space, doing popups, a farmers
[58:43] market, that seems more conducive in
[58:46] concept one.
[58:47] >> Great. Thank you. Um, I'd like to I have
[58:50] a completely different attitude than
[58:53] both previous speakers. I think having
[58:55] the public space adjacent to the store
[58:58] is where people meet casually, coming
[59:00] and going. It's not I don't think this
[59:01] is the kind of public space where people
[59:03] go to for an intentional event unless
[59:05] it's a farmers market. But h I think it
[59:08] would be dead unless it was next to
[59:10] where people are walking anyway. So
[59:12] having it next to the store is way
[59:14] better. I think um and uh I think this
[59:18] is the kind of space we were looking for
[59:20] in in two and three. on on one and two.
[59:24] I'm worried that the configuration of
[59:27] the intersection is just as problematic
[59:31] as it is now practically. Um I think
[59:33] it's important to move traffic through
[59:35] this intersection more quickly and I
[59:37] think simplifying it as I don't know
[59:40] what Alta thinks about this but my
[59:42] impression is that there's a lot of
[59:44] confusion because the the intersection
[59:46] is so complicated and that simplifying
[59:48] it would move traffic through more
[59:50] quickly. And I don't care that much that
[59:53] people have to stop multiple times like
[59:56] I think they should on multiple
[59:57] crosswalks on the entire town center.
[1:00:01] It's if we get rid of the backup the big
[1:00:03] backup point which is here. I think it
[1:00:06] would reduce the the the through trip
[1:00:09] even if people are going slower on the
[1:00:11] way. I think that's what I'm hoping for.
[1:00:14] >> Great. Thank you Steve Richard.
[1:00:17] >> So two comments. So one is I would argue
[1:00:19] here you have the biggest pallet
[1:00:22] available to the town given the right
[1:00:25] ofways. So I see a value in when we
[1:00:29] perhaps get a little bit further in
[1:00:31] delineating that property line between
[1:00:33] private and public here. It's a little
[1:00:36] bit surprising because as I said in the
[1:00:39] email that I sent out today, the one
[1:00:41] that made it into the desk items, this
[1:00:44] is a very unusual intersection with the
[1:00:48] town's property going through nearly all
[1:00:51] of Robert's. So you have this huge,
[1:00:55] relatively speaking, amount of land on
[1:00:57] which to work. And so it gives you the
[1:01:01] opportunity to control the concepts more
[1:01:04] so than almost anywhere else. So that's
[1:01:06] one comment. Second is we've heard
[1:01:08] there's a constraint on finances.
[1:01:11] There's a fair bit of improvement work
[1:01:14] here. Who pays for that? I I don't think
[1:01:16] given how long I've been here, the town
[1:01:19] is going to pay for this. This has got
[1:01:20] to be privately funded. Is it funded by
[1:01:23] Roberts or is it funded by Roberts and
[1:01:26] private citizens who live here? I'm not
[1:01:29] sure either of those concepts will work
[1:01:32] here. So I think that tends to favor
[1:01:35] something like concept one despite the
[1:01:38] logic Steve laid out. So my gut feel is
[1:01:43] you're not going to find private
[1:01:45] citizens who will fund this. So and
[1:01:47] you're not going to get Roberts to fund
[1:01:49] it. So that's my gut.
[1:01:51] >> Great. Thank you, Richard Assan.
[1:01:54] >> Uh yeah, so I'm going to echo out
[1:01:56] various people. Um, I think I agree with
[1:01:57] Caroline separating the public space
[1:02:00] from the store. While Steve's
[1:02:02] functionally correct, I think from a
[1:02:03] welcoming standpoint, it's more this is
[1:02:05] a public space. It doesn't just like the
[1:02:07] confusion with the roadside trails, you
[1:02:09] have to have some separation or signs to
[1:02:11] demonstrate to people where they should
[1:02:12] and should not be and where they're
[1:02:13] allowed to be. So that's so for me that
[1:02:15] number one's the only one that does
[1:02:16] that. Um, I more crosswalks is fantastic
[1:02:20] and I think in my opinion I agree with
[1:02:23] Steve in the sense that when you want to
[1:02:24] get traffic through here quickly because
[1:02:26] you know it's one thing on a weekday
[1:02:27] school drop off whatever but weekends
[1:02:29] everyone who's been here sunny Saturday
[1:02:31] or Sunday in June and it's back to the
[1:02:34] highway across the highway or the other
[1:02:37] way up back there you know to the the
[1:02:39] bottom of the hill. So making this as
[1:02:42] much as we want to make safe spaces
[1:02:44] pedestrians, bicyclists etc. We need to
[1:02:46] acknowledge the reality that the cars
[1:02:49] are the predominant form of
[1:02:50] transportation here. That most of them
[1:02:52] probably aren't from Woodside and we
[1:02:54] can't put a gate up on 84 and keep them
[1:02:56] out. So unless somebody wants to pose
[1:02:58] that, go ahead. Um and so we have to
[1:03:00] accommodate that to make it faster
[1:03:02] because none of us want to be stuck. Oh
[1:03:04] crap, it's stuck. It's taking me 45
[1:03:05] minutes to go home and it should take me
[1:03:07] five. Um I think keeping the slip lane
[1:03:08] on Kinyatta is extremely important. um
[1:03:11] you have the island so pedestrians have
[1:03:12] a safe space to kind of get to and then
[1:03:14] have two short crosswalks. Um I know in
[1:03:16] the mornings to school drop off there
[1:03:17] has to be I don't know a quarter of the
[1:03:19] kids probably live in that direction and
[1:03:21] are getting driven to school. So I think
[1:03:22] again you want to keep that slip lane.
[1:03:24] Um and again in the evenings right
[1:03:27] people are coming using as a cut
[1:03:28] through. So we want to keep it quick but
[1:03:30] safe for cars. I'm a supporter of one
[1:03:32] myself. Um and I will add one more. We
[1:03:35] have to be very cautious with the spots
[1:03:37] at the corner as they're laid out
[1:03:39] currently. I think they're fundamentally
[1:03:40] deficient because they block sight
[1:03:42] lines, especially if you have a truck
[1:03:43] there, you cannot see around it. So, the
[1:03:45] number of spots that are should be taken
[1:03:46] out of the corner needs to be studied
[1:03:48] and kind of logically laid out. Thank
[1:03:50] you.
[1:03:50] >> Great. Thank you.
[1:03:53] >> Yes, Lyall.
[1:03:53] >> I wanted to echo what Ean had just
[1:03:56] mentioned. Um what any solution needs to
[1:04:00] address the fact that from going
[1:04:03] eastbound on Woodside Road and looking
[1:04:06] towards the stop line um going north on
[1:04:09] Mountain Home Road there is no direct
[1:04:11] line of sight and any solution has to
[1:04:13] solve that and unfortunately it does not
[1:04:16] look like concept 2 um addresses that.
[1:04:20] Um, getting rid of the slip lane from
[1:04:23] Mountain Home onto Woodside Road is an
[1:04:26] interesting idea. Um, as a practical
[1:04:29] matter, I understand where Leanne's
[1:04:31] coming from, but right now, every day at
[1:04:34] lunchtime and especially on the
[1:04:36] weekends, there are a bunch of bikers
[1:04:39] that are out there on the park, which is
[1:04:42] essentially a traffic island, and
[1:04:44] they're eating their sandwiches, and
[1:04:46] they're probably leaving litter. and
[1:04:48] whether we do nothing or do any of the
[1:04:50] three concepts that is still going to be
[1:04:52] happening.
[1:04:53] >> Um the one technical point uh you would
[1:04:56] have to think about is if you get rid of
[1:04:58] the slip lane off of Mountain Home Road,
[1:05:01] you would need to radius the turn at the
[1:05:05] four-way stop so that a semi-tra coming
[1:05:07] out of Roberts from the back can get on
[1:05:10] to Woodside Road and get back to the
[1:05:11] freeway.
[1:05:12] >> Yeah, definitely.
[1:05:15] Great. Dan,
[1:05:16] >> so one of the top things I heard from
[1:05:19] our residents, you know, kind of east of um 280 is that this idea of
[1:05:25] public spaces is really important to
[1:05:26] them so they can come to town and have a
[1:05:28] space to hang out and if they buy a
[1:05:30] sandwich at Roberts, a place to sit and
[1:05:32] eat. So that that makes me gravitate
[1:05:34] towards the one and three and I
[1:05:35] understand the arguments on both sides.
[1:05:37] The the primary for me is this idea of
[1:05:39] having public space in downtown Woods
[1:05:41] that I think is really important. I like
[1:05:43] that little parklet that you have in
[1:05:45] concept 3 across the street.
[1:05:47] >> The idea that you could have some you
[1:05:48] could even have some public art in that
[1:05:50] as a gateway into the town. I think it'
[1:05:52] be beautiful. Um Christine didn't make
[1:05:54] it tonight, but I think there's an
[1:05:55] opportunity or have a discussion with
[1:05:57] her aunt Leanne who are their two
[1:05:58] property owners there about what do they
[1:06:01] think because it's um for example, one
[1:06:04] of the big things that's missing in
[1:06:05] downtown is a bathroom. There's no
[1:06:07] restroom. There used to be one at
[1:06:08] Roberts. I think it's no longer open.
[1:06:10] So, you know, is there some deal to be
[1:06:13] done here with, hey, let's have the town
[1:06:14] provide this large patio and Christine,
[1:06:17] are you willing to keep it clean and
[1:06:18] provide a restroom in return? She may
[1:06:20] say, no, absolutely not. I don't know.
[1:06:22] But is there some I think you need to
[1:06:24] have a public private discussion like
[1:06:26] that that might guide how do you get
[1:06:28] funding and how do you keep it clean and
[1:06:29] all that? And same thing with Leanne.
[1:06:31] You know, we don't want to we they need
[1:06:33] to decide they want to do this. Yep.
[1:06:35] >> Right. So,
[1:06:36] >> don't even put me in there, but um
[1:06:38] Christine and I are pretty close.
[1:06:40] >> Yeah, totally.
[1:06:42] >> I don't know if she sees this better
[1:06:43] like this. Does this bring a lot more
[1:06:45] people to the store?
[1:06:48] >> Right now, it's it's a it's I just don't
[1:06:52] think it belongs here. I think there's
[1:06:54] other places that we have such a
[1:06:55] beautiful town and so many beautiful
[1:06:57] places could get a little more
[1:07:01] rather than sticking it in front of a
[1:07:02] grocery store. No. Is there like a
[1:07:05] peaceful place?
[1:07:06] >> Is there is there is there a place you
[1:07:08] do you have something in mind? Like do
[1:07:10] you have something in mind that's a
[1:07:11] place downtown where people could
[1:07:13] gather?
[1:07:15] >> No.
[1:07:23] it's okay. Thank you. Um my husband
[1:07:27] would love that if he never could hear
[1:07:28] me. Um he's sitting right there. Aha,
[1:07:31] Bill. I'm bringing this home and now
[1:07:33] you're really going to hear it.
[1:07:36] >> Um, so what did you just ask me about,
[1:07:38] Christine?
[1:07:39] >> I No, I just asked if you had some other
[1:07:41] if you like the idea. You may not like
[1:07:43] the idea of a public gathering place
[1:07:45] somewhere downtown. Um,
[1:07:46] >> well, I love I think public gatherings
[1:07:48] are great, but I was going to say, thank
[1:07:50] you just reminded me. I thought across
[1:07:52] the street it kind of goes on in the
[1:07:54] middle of the place there. It's really
[1:07:55] kind of cool. Everybody's out there and
[1:07:57] they're safe off the street and there's
[1:08:01] garbage cans there to get rid of your
[1:08:03] stuff and you're buying things in the
[1:08:06] store. Hers I guess it's her it's
[1:08:07] Christine's place and the and the um I
[1:08:10] forget the name of our dear friends on
[1:08:12] the corner that own the uh food place.
[1:08:16] But um I I just think it's idiotic. I
[1:08:19] can't stand looking at this. Sorry. just
[1:08:22] don't seems too um like you're in
[1:08:25] another state or another country or
[1:08:27] something.
[1:08:30] Julia.
[1:08:32] >> Um I really do value the public space,
[1:08:36] but in thinking of what our primary goal
[1:08:39] is um and acting on behalf of our
[1:08:42] neighbors and the other residents of
[1:08:44] Woodside,
[1:08:46] I think the most important thing to them
[1:08:48] to Assan's point is moving quickly
[1:08:50] through this intersection. And the
[1:08:53] biggest frustration is when we are stuck
[1:08:55] at this intersection. And unfortunately,
[1:08:58] I think all three of these concepts will
[1:09:00] make it worse. Not having the slip lanes
[1:09:03] is going to be a problem. Having cars
[1:09:05] backing in, um, I can't envision that
[1:09:08] any of them would make it faster. I know
[1:09:11] that we said no to a roundabout. Given
[1:09:14] the choice between these three and a
[1:09:16] roundabout, I'm wondering if many people
[1:09:19] would actually say roundabout might be
[1:09:21] better. Um, and given the choice between
[1:09:24] the three of them and status quo, I'm
[1:09:26] not speaking for myself necessarily, but
[1:09:29] I do think there might be a strong
[1:09:30] support even of status quo because while
[1:09:34] I do value this land um in these public
[1:09:37] spaces, I think it would be to the
[1:09:39] detriment of quick moving traffic. Um,
[1:09:42] and last point, I think there was an
[1:09:44] area where we approved a gazebo or
[1:09:46] something. I don't know exactly where
[1:09:48] that is, but I think it's behind here or
[1:09:50] something. Maybe that would be a close
[1:09:52] but not um impacting traffic place to
[1:09:56] have uh public space.
[1:09:58] >> Great.
[1:10:01] >> Yes, Sue.
[1:10:03] >> I think one and two have not solved the
[1:10:05] problem of what Lyall mentioned, the car
[1:10:08] in front of Roberts going eastbound on
[1:10:11] Woodside Road at the Mountain Home. More
[1:10:14] so than not, I think people double dip.
[1:10:16] They go two at a time there. while the
[1:10:18] other three lanes are deciding who's
[1:10:19] going to go next. They're just shooting
[1:10:21] through there. So, we really need to
[1:10:23] solve better uh visibility there. Um
[1:10:28] con concept two may work, but you would
[1:10:31] need to I think bevel or cut off that
[1:10:35] you've made the problem worse. I think
[1:10:37] concept 3 is neat, but I don't mind the
[1:10:40] slip lane at all. But then my question
[1:10:42] would be if we're now going to have to
[1:10:45] stop twice. I I must go two, four, six
[1:10:48] times a day through this intersection
[1:10:50] and now I'm going to stop in Kenyatta.
[1:10:52] I'm going to turn left on Woodside Road.
[1:10:55] I'm going to go a couple of cars.
[1:10:56] Hopefully there's no backup and stop
[1:10:58] again. So I'm not going to like that. So
[1:11:02] is the So tell me about that
[1:11:05] intersection at Kenyatta Lane. When I
[1:11:08] come off of Kenyatta Lane, am I only
[1:11:10] allowed to turn right or now? Is that
[1:11:12] going to be a two-way road? So, if I'm
[1:11:14] coming through Mountain Home Road, can I
[1:11:16] go through that intersection onto
[1:11:17] Kenyatta Lane? Maybe not. And if I'm
[1:11:22] coming down Kenyatta Lane, can I also
[1:11:24] then turn left onto Woodside Road? So,
[1:11:29] if I can turn left onto Woodside Road,
[1:11:33] being a resident, I know the cut
[1:11:34] through. I'm going to go down Laquesta
[1:11:36] to or turn left on Laqua right on
[1:11:39] Kenyatta Lane and bypass the Kenyatta
[1:11:43] Woodside Road altogether. So you're
[1:11:46] going to add more traffic on Kenyatta
[1:11:48] Lane if you do that. So I do not like
[1:11:52] the idea of stopping twice through that
[1:11:54] intersection. That's just my opinion.
[1:11:57] Thank you.
[1:11:58] >> Thank you, Sue.
[1:12:01] Any other comments? I was gonna thank
[1:12:04] you Sue for mentioning that. I think two
[1:12:05] stop signs and that much that close
[1:12:07] proximity again with the weekend traffic
[1:12:09] and whatnot will just potentially become
[1:12:12] an even bigger disaster which then
[1:12:13] defeats the purpose of getting people
[1:12:14] through there quickly. That's just my
[1:12:16] guess. Traffic engineer should confirm
[1:12:17] that.
[1:12:18] >> Great. Thank you, Richard.
[1:12:21] >> Uh so say it's concept zero leaving it
[1:12:24] at status quo. Are there changes given
[1:12:27] the town's fee title ownership changes
[1:12:29] that can be made to the parking at
[1:12:31] Roberts by the town?
[1:12:36] Jean, uh,
[1:12:39] that might be a question for you is
[1:12:41] basically does this town have any
[1:12:44] jurisdiction to take the dangerous
[1:12:47] parking spaces at the corner of Robert's
[1:12:50] being that they might be or they are in
[1:12:52] the public rightway and make that a
[1:12:55] safer intersection.
[1:12:58] >> I'll start to answer and then I can
[1:12:59] defer to Lewis if he has anything to
[1:13:01] add. My understanding is that's public
[1:13:03] rightway. It's it's not owned in fee
[1:13:05] titled by the town. It's it's public
[1:13:06] right away and controlled by Calrans is
[1:13:08] my understanding.
[1:13:12] » And I echo that. I don't think I have
[1:13:13] any more to add. It is a public right
[1:13:15] away and um it is currently just being
[1:13:18] controlled by uh CALR.
[1:13:23] » So a followup, where does Calrans stop
[1:13:26] then on Mountain Home Road and where
[1:13:28] does the towns right away begin?
[1:13:32] Again,
[1:13:35] my understanding is that's all Calrans
[1:13:37] right of way.
[1:13:39] >> Your question is how essentially how
[1:13:41] wide is the CALR right ofway and how far
[1:13:43] down Mount home does it extend.
[1:13:44] >> Yeah,
[1:13:45] >> we sitting here tonight we can't answer
[1:13:47] that question, but we we can follow up
[1:13:48] and see um what we can figure out about
[1:13:50] that so we can give you specific
[1:13:52] measurements.
[1:13:52] >> Yeah. So my general thought is the town
[1:13:55] may have e title ownership to quite a
[1:13:58] bit or all of the land underneath those
[1:14:01] parking stalls. And doesn't that give
[1:14:04] perhaps leverage to the town with
[1:14:07] Roberts to perhaps convince Roberts that
[1:14:10] hey making a change or changes here to
[1:14:13] these parking stalls that are at times
[1:14:17] unsafe
[1:14:19] um may be wise and warranted. So again,
[1:14:22] I'm back on status quo, but maybe
[1:14:24] there's a tweak or a change that
[1:14:26] increases safety at very little cost, no
[1:14:30] cost to the town. Perhaps
[1:14:36] » one of the considerations in this
[1:14:37] concept zero, which we could add, is uh
[1:14:41] in concept one, you can actually leave
[1:14:44] the parking adjacent to Roberts as it
[1:14:46] is. you know, that's the existing street
[1:14:48] right away and you don't have to add the
[1:14:50] parking on the park, though it might
[1:14:53] serve folks that want to spend time in
[1:14:55] the park. The really qu the the big
[1:14:58] question mark I'd like to hear back from
[1:15:00] all of you on is is it important to have
[1:15:02] a crosswalk going from the corner of of
[1:15:07] um Alec Donald Park along Woodside over
[1:15:10] to um uh the crosswalk that leads to
[1:15:14] Kinyatta Corners across going across
[1:15:16] Mountain Home. Troy, do you want to just
[1:15:19] drag the cursor on it? So because this
[1:15:22] is where right now we've taken out, you
[1:15:25] know, a parking space to open up
[1:15:27] visibility and it also allows a
[1:15:30] crosswalk to come across there. And so
[1:15:33] that, you know, at a minimum you could
[1:15:35] leave the slip lane uh you know going uh uh making a right on the
[1:15:41] woodside. This one already still has the
[1:15:44] slip lane going on the Kinyatta. You
[1:15:46] could have the 30,000 square foot A
[1:15:49] park, but you could have a crosswalk
[1:15:52] that gets people along that frontage and
[1:15:55] then do a proper cross crosswalk at the
[1:15:57] slip lane for pedestrians so that
[1:16:00] there's clear pedestrian path from uh
[1:16:03] along Woodside Road. And that might be
[1:16:05] an option zero. Um, an alternate to
[1:16:09] option zero would be to take concept
[1:16:12] one, return the parking more status quo
[1:16:16] on Roberts, um, but lose the slip lane,
[1:16:20] lose the one slip lane. So, that would
[1:16:22] be another option.
[1:16:27] So, let's go to the next slide.
[1:16:31] So, uh, we've covered the first bullet.
[1:16:34] Um, show of hands. Uh which concept do
[1:16:38] you support? No change.
[1:16:40] >> Maybe we can say that option zero is
[1:16:42] >> option zero.
[1:16:43] >> Minimal. You know we were talking about
[1:16:45] >> it's not nothing but it's maybe the
[1:16:47] minimal possible change. Let's say
[1:16:49] that's the first option.
[1:16:51] >> Okay. So we could go no change option
[1:16:53] zero concept and then option one, two,
[1:16:55] and three. How's that? All right. So
[1:16:58] we'll start with Oh, go ahead, Carly.
[1:17:00] >> You have a question about option zero.
[1:17:04] Um,
[1:17:05] has the intersection been studied
[1:17:09] with the flow of traffic? And have they
[1:17:14] looked at how you could make it safer?
[1:17:18] Cuz I mean, I've probably gone through
[1:17:20] that intersection a billion times. My
[1:17:24] commute is the school to Glenwood. And I
[1:17:28] mean,
[1:17:28] >> so these three concepts were run through
[1:17:31] our transportation consultant, Alta.
[1:17:34] And the third option was actually kind
[1:17:37] of entirely their authorship and their
[1:17:40] aim was to increase pedestrian crossing
[1:17:44] to its safest condition possible was to
[1:17:47] bring out um to bring Kinata road in
[1:17:50] more to 90° angle so you don't have that
[1:17:53] obtuse uh angle there. So bring it in at
[1:17:56] a 90, tighten the pedestrian crossing as
[1:17:59] much as possible and then uh separate
[1:18:03] Mountain Home from the Kinyatta
[1:18:04] intersection so that the Mountain Home
[1:18:07] traffic which is less than the Kinyatta
[1:18:10] road traffic does not impact that
[1:18:13] Woodside Kinyatta flow. So that was kind
[1:18:16] of their concept on option three to
[1:18:19] smooth the transportation flow of cars
[1:18:22] through that area. So there was um you
[1:18:25] know so that that was kind of the idea
[1:18:27] but all three of these were run through
[1:18:29] Alta and um you know the first option
[1:18:33] really did not have much impact you know
[1:18:36] deleting the slip lane there's still um
[1:18:39] there's visibility issues with the ex
[1:18:41] the slip lane as it is today both for
[1:18:43] pedestrian conflict and for vehicle
[1:18:45] conflict because it's hard to see
[1:18:47] oncoming traffic. Um so they felt like
[1:18:51] the um option one was kind of you know
[1:18:55] not a lot even though you lose the slip
[1:18:56] lane there's not a major impact on the
[1:18:58] traffic flow. Um concept two same thing
[1:19:01] they're they they move the same for the
[1:19:03] cars. And then option three was they
[1:19:06] felt that the traffic flow at Kenyatta
[1:19:09] and Woodside would be much better
[1:19:11] offsetting the impacts at the Kinyatta
[1:19:14] Lane uh mountain home intersection. I'd
[1:19:17] be curious to see what the Mountain Home
[1:19:20] residents how they would feel taking
[1:19:22] that slip lane away. I'm sure that it
[1:19:26] keeps the flow of traffic going from
[1:19:30] that street to Kenyatta going, right? Um
[1:19:36] I several times a week people are
[1:19:39] blowing through that intersection, not
[1:19:41] stopping at the stop signs and it's even
[1:19:43] worse on the weekends because it's out
[1:19:45] oftowners. It's not people that are
[1:19:47] aware of
[1:19:48] >> Yeah.
[1:19:49] >> the 10-way stop or however many people
[1:19:52] are stopping at the same time. Um, and
[1:19:56] Glenn would too, like Glennwood and
[1:19:57] Kinata. People are, my husband has
[1:20:01] multiple clips of people nearly t-boning
[1:20:05] him or other cars that are coming onto
[1:20:09] Kenyattas. So, it's just the amount of
[1:20:11] traffic that is increasing due to
[1:20:16] Google ways,
[1:20:18] traffic on the the freeways. It's
[1:20:22] I I appreciate all of these concepts and
[1:20:25] thank you for taking the time to make
[1:20:27] them. But living in this town and going
[1:20:30] through that intersection every day, all
[1:20:32] day,
[1:20:33] >> 20 times a day,
[1:20:36] I feel like personally, in my opinion,
[1:20:40] just
[1:20:42] concept zero, but making it safer,
[1:20:45] whatever little adjustments you need to
[1:20:47] make so people have better visibility or
[1:20:50] however,
[1:20:52] I don't know, that's I feel like would
[1:20:55] be hit. Steve
[1:20:57] >> on concept three had you show a stop
[1:21:00] sign eastbound on Woodside Road. Is that
[1:21:03] necessary? It seems like it's awfully
[1:21:05] close to the intersection whereas the
[1:21:07] other direction it doesn't seems like
[1:21:09] you could not have
[1:21:11] >> Can you go back to the plan for three
[1:21:13] that has all the stop stuff on it?
[1:21:17] >> So your question Steve is is the stop
[1:21:20] sign necessary at where Mountain Home
[1:21:23] touches Woodside?
[1:21:25] >> Exactly. the eastbound on Woodside Road.
[1:21:27] Is that stop sign necessary? Since it's
[1:21:29] so close to the intersection,
[1:21:31] seems like you have a short a short
[1:21:33] stacking distance there back to Kinyatta
[1:21:35] Road. Eliminating it wouldn't make it a
[1:21:38] lot more dangerous.
[1:21:40] >> Well, then I don't know how you'd get
[1:21:42] out of Mountain Home Road, right? You'd
[1:21:43] have to wait. You'd have to wait.
[1:21:45] >> You have to wait for a gap that's caused
[1:21:47] by people taking turns at the
[1:21:48] intersection, which is close by.
[1:21:51] >> Uh that's an interesting idea, actually.
[1:21:54] um that could be looked at, but I think
[1:21:56] that and Sue raised it too, the the
[1:21:59] movements of people on Kenyatta Lane
[1:22:02] would not be something we'd want to
[1:22:03] encourage with this a concept. So, if
[1:22:06] this were concept move forward, I think
[1:22:08] we would want to certainly we have there
[1:22:11] we have like a left or a left and right
[1:22:13] only from Mountain Home. So, you can't
[1:22:15] cut through Kinata Lane, but you might
[1:22:17] have to do that the other end as well.
[1:22:18] So, so hope folks wouldn't cut down
[1:22:20] Kenyatta and then take the left out. So,
[1:22:23] I think this could use a little
[1:22:25] refinement, but um there is a scenario
[1:22:29] where I could see no stop sign, I guess,
[1:22:30] on wood side, but um that would again be
[1:22:33] a trade-off, I think, of of throughput
[1:22:35] versus
[1:22:37] connectivity.
[1:22:40] » Great.
[1:22:40] >> Yeah, we got some more.
[1:22:42] >> Uh actually, let's hear from Steve
[1:22:44] Patrick.
[1:22:47] Yeah, I think everybody's comments
[1:22:49] really terrific and it's certainly
[1:22:52] changed my thought about which way to
[1:22:55] look at anything. It's probably coming
[1:22:56] in here. I thought option three seemed
[1:22:58] pretty good, but option three seems like
[1:23:00] it'd be a nightmare for people coming
[1:23:02] off Mountain Home Road wanting to do
[1:23:03] Kinata Road and then I think looking at
[1:23:07] option one uh the diagonal back in
[1:23:10] parking, somebody comes out of those
[1:23:11] parking spaces, how are they going to
[1:23:13] actually go back out Kinata Road? I
[1:23:15] mean, other unless you're going down it
[1:23:18] that the diagonal parking doesn't I
[1:23:21] think kind of work. I think probably
[1:23:24] looking at all these options I
[1:23:27] definitely think option three is really
[1:23:29] nice. It creates a nice park, a nice
[1:23:30] plaza, people hang out, but now we
[1:23:32] haven't addressed kind of the thing that
[1:23:34] drove probably this whole thing. We're
[1:23:36] not increasing any parking. So now we're
[1:23:39] going to get
[1:23:41] 20 30 people. Now I love people coming
[1:23:43] in here from out of town. I mean, we
[1:23:45] live in a wonderful place and it's our
[1:23:47] duty to kind of make it
[1:23:50] >> you know for everybody in the community,
[1:23:52] not just woodsiders. However, where are
[1:23:55] these people going to park? I mean,
[1:23:57] >> we we haven't done anything to address
[1:23:59] that, right?
[1:24:00] >> So, probably looking back, probably a
[1:24:03] modification or option zero makes most
[1:24:05] sense. Make the intersection safer.
[1:24:08] Maybe get rid of the slip lane coming
[1:24:09] off Mountain Home Road to expand the
[1:24:11] potential of um you know getting some
[1:24:14] more space.
[1:24:16] >> Um yeah, concept one uh so that that
[1:24:20] right turn can be made you know by a
[1:24:23] truck. So if you get rid of the slip
[1:24:24] lane I think somebody brought up you
[1:24:25] need to bring semis come out of back of
[1:24:28] Roberts they'd never be able to make
[1:24:30] that Uturn um unless they you know
[1:24:33] >> rub up against the north side of
[1:24:35] Woodside Road. We can definitely we have
[1:24:38] the software for the truck movements and
[1:24:40] I think I've shown like a 30 foot radius
[1:24:42] but what you're asking is really
[1:24:44] interesting the parking impact of an
[1:24:47] attraction itself the the square
[1:24:50] >> you know the uh so what's interesting is
[1:24:53] if we took this concept here um and
[1:24:56] returned the 90°ree pool in parking
[1:24:59] which there's plenty of room to do that
[1:25:00] in front of Robert's um the parking
[1:25:03] across the street could serve the park
[1:25:06] and that's on public property,
[1:25:08] >> right? So get if you I don't want to say
[1:25:10] get rid of but if the slip lane
[1:25:12] disappears maybe that would give the
[1:25:15] opportunity to have basically 90°
[1:25:17] parking on both ways. the 90 degree
[1:25:19] fireground both ways and the seems that
[1:25:22] the crosswalk coming from Kinyatta Road
[1:25:26] side to the Robert side if it even was
[1:25:29] pushed further east I guess so that the
[1:25:33] cars actually stop closer to the
[1:25:35] intersection of where uh Mountain Home
[1:25:38] Road intersects
[1:25:41] it kind of gets rid of a little bit of
[1:25:42] the blind spot so they're pulling up
[1:25:45] much further kind of where the mailbox
[1:25:47] is the mailbox still So you pull up. So
[1:25:50] the uh that crosswalk coming from the
[1:25:52] island at Kenyatta Road and Woodside
[1:25:54] Road kind of intersects much further
[1:25:57] east so that the cars actually stop
[1:25:59] further east. So when they look to the
[1:26:01] right, they're actually looking down um
[1:26:05] Mountain Home Road rather than a you
[1:26:08] know a cars with a blind spot.
[1:26:12] Um yeah. So yeah, that crosswalk there.
[1:26:14] Yeah, move that to there. I do think
[1:26:17] it's important to have the crosswalk on
[1:26:19] the south side of Woodside Road. I don't
[1:26:22] know who I think people can walk around
[1:26:25] to get up. They don't need a crosswalk
[1:26:28] necessarily from uh the Alex Mandala
[1:26:31] Park corner straight across. I mean, it
[1:26:32] doesn't get you anywhere. It gets you to
[1:26:34] the, you know, the baby Jesus thing.
[1:26:36] It's just not it gets you nowhere. So,
[1:26:40] Steve, the the the really neat thought
[1:26:43] that you're sharing here is taking that
[1:26:45] crosswalk over to Kinyatta Corners and
[1:26:48] shifting that to the right, you know, so
[1:26:50] that that car now where the S is is not
[1:26:54] that one, the to the left. Troy, like if
[1:26:57] we're stopping that car
[1:27:00] >> further. Yeah. Like right there and that
[1:27:02] crosswalk comes down. That's a huge
[1:27:05] improvement. That's a really beautiful
[1:27:08] idea. I like that a lot. Um, and then
[1:27:12] >> that wasn't my idea. That was Steve
[1:27:14] Patrick's idea. We'll call it the
[1:27:16] memorial the Steve Patrick crosswalk.
[1:27:20] Anyhow, um, but yeah. No, I think what
[1:27:23] we need to do is go back. We need to
[1:27:25] create an option zero that restores the
[1:27:28] 90°ree parking in front of Roberts. Um,
[1:27:32] but creating a safe zone for a crosswalk
[1:27:35] and then rethinking the position of that
[1:27:37] crosswalk that goes over to Kinyata
[1:27:39] Corner so that the cars are coming a lot
[1:27:42] further into that mountain home view
[1:27:44] corridor. That would be really cool.
[1:27:47] Yeah.
[1:27:48] >> And do we really need to have two
[1:27:50] crosswalks there? If we only had the one
[1:27:52] crosswalk, it might enable us to push
[1:27:54] the cars further off the road.
[1:27:57] >> You mean uh
[1:27:58] >> like going through the park? We've got
[1:28:00] one on Woodside Road and then we've got
[1:28:02] one underneath the word Alec Donald
[1:28:04] Park. We've got two crosswalks.
[1:28:08] >> Oh. Uh the lower and the
[1:28:12] >> Oh, the two crosswalks connecting to
[1:28:14] Roberts. I see. The lower one. Um I
[1:28:16] think we need the upper one. Uh because
[1:28:18] that's going to be the primary path of
[1:28:20] traffic to Kinata Corner.
[1:28:22] >> Agreed.
[1:28:22] >> But the lower one is definitely
[1:28:24] optional. Um,
[1:28:27] and that would give back one more
[1:28:29] parking space.
[1:28:30] >> I think the lower one is used quite by
[1:28:33] town staff walking to the store.
[1:28:35] >> Well, and actually, so we do have a
[1:28:38] couple more things to talk about. Um,
[1:28:40] and what's interesting is these concepts
[1:28:42] can work together. And so the the shared
[1:28:45] street concept that we're going to cover
[1:28:47] in the next section which um Richard
[1:28:50] kind of turned us on to uh which is a
[1:28:52] really interesting concept could work
[1:28:54] really well with the lower crosswalk. So
[1:28:57] I think there's a a process where we're
[1:29:00] going to go through a lot more steps
[1:29:01] about which ideas, you know, survive the
[1:29:05] next stage. And then as we see which
[1:29:08] ideas survive for each area, we're going
[1:29:11] to look for those pieces because this is
[1:29:13] we can pull ideas from other schemes
[1:29:15] that don't get picked and start matching
[1:29:18] the successful components to the overall
[1:29:20] vision. And so if we do end up looking
[1:29:23] at that shared street concept um that
[1:29:25] lower crosswalk might be relevant.
[1:29:28] >> Okay. So we'll go to the next se
[1:29:30] section.
[1:29:30] >> Quick quick vote.
[1:29:32] >> Oh
[1:29:32] >> yeah. So any merit in not taking a vote
[1:29:36] but instead directing good city company
[1:29:39] and urban field design to go back and
[1:29:41] tweak concepts zero and one and then
[1:29:46] present those two concepts to the CAC to
[1:29:50] the group ask for a quick vote back. um
[1:29:54] allowing you all to go to the town
[1:29:57] perhaps with updates on those two
[1:30:00] concepts together with perhaps concept
[1:30:03] two and three and the vote.
[1:30:06] >> Sure. Yeah, we could uh we don't need to
[1:30:08] make a movement here, a motion here or
[1:30:10] anything, but I think it sounds like the
[1:30:12] general agreement is for us to create a
[1:30:14] concept zero plus
[1:30:18] that does the littlest possible to
[1:30:21] enhance safety, I think is what I'm
[1:30:22] hearing. Um, but we'll keep some of
[1:30:25] these other ideas alive to show to
[1:30:26] council that we've had the discussion,
[1:30:28] but I think the group here uh is
[1:30:31] expressing a support for a new option
[1:30:33] that we can create and bring to council.
[1:30:35] >> I think we'll modify option one to show
[1:30:38] the 90° parking, you know, restore as
[1:30:40] much of that as possible. Um, and then
[1:30:43] have the parking and the shifted
[1:30:46] crosswalk that that Steve Patrick
[1:30:48] brought up. And then option zero will
[1:30:51] just look at some minor touches perhaps
[1:30:54] moving the crosswalk as well that Steve
[1:30:56] mentioned to improve the visibility but
[1:30:59] retain the slip lane going towards
[1:31:01] Whiskey Hill off of Mountain Home. So
[1:31:04] that will be the the first option. Yeah.
[1:31:07] Or zero zero option
[1:31:09] >> like to add that the slip lane has is I
[1:31:11] mean I ride a bicycle through there
[1:31:12] quite a bit and it's really scary
[1:31:14] because cars can't see me coming. It's
[1:31:16] such a a low angle. It's super dangerous
[1:31:18] for bicyclists going up Woodside Road
[1:31:20] and and uh I I' I'd really love to see
[1:31:23] it gone.
[1:31:25] >> Great. Okay, let's uh jump to the next
[1:31:28] one. Troy, moving on.
[1:31:31] >> So, it's only 6:45. This is awesome.
[1:31:34] You're making great time.
[1:31:37] >> All right. Uh area C, Central Woodside
[1:31:40] Road. Um, and then so what we have here,
[1:31:44] we have a couple concepts and, uh, I'll
[1:31:46] walk through them. Uh, and let's go to
[1:31:49] the next one, Troy. So,
[1:31:53] when we looked at this, there were a lot
[1:31:54] of ideas in the past studies at Woodside
[1:31:57] on how to transform or formalize
[1:32:00] Woodside Road a little bit into a more
[1:32:03] obviously pedestrian friendly
[1:32:04] environment or perhaps even a more main
[1:32:07] street environment. Um, and so we
[1:32:10] discussed, you know, no change, minor
[1:32:12] improvements, new frontage road, full
[1:32:14] main street, and the the more we looked
[1:32:17] at it, the the big changes are really, hard. Uh, they're hard from a
[1:32:21] financial perspective, they're hard from
[1:32:23] a civil engineering perspective.
[1:32:26] And so what we've done is we've
[1:32:28] developed a concept where it would be
[1:32:30] entirely the the question is if a
[1:32:34] landowner came to the city and said um
[1:32:38] you know I'm going to provide parking on
[1:32:40] my site in a different form than a
[1:32:42] pooling 90 degree parking stall off of
[1:32:45] Woodside Road. What are my options? And
[1:32:48] so in the next slide um go ahead. We
[1:32:52] looked at what would um if a landowner
[1:32:56] elected to remove that pool in parking,
[1:33:00] what could this how what would the
[1:33:01] impacts be on the overall environment?
[1:33:05] And so uh you know in this intermittent
[1:33:09] sequence where say two develop uh two
[1:33:11] land owners decide to um utilize that
[1:33:15] land for redevelopment and I think it
[1:33:17] would really these buildings have been
[1:33:19] improved upon fairly recently which
[1:33:21] Richard you pointed out. Uh so the
[1:33:23] likelihood of redevelopment you know
[1:33:26] that's a a speculative thing but in the
[1:33:29] event that one of these do in the future
[1:33:32] uh how would we guide that vision? Um,
[1:33:35] and is there an option where you could
[1:33:38] create a main street if the landowner
[1:33:41] elected to not have that pull in parking
[1:33:44] and go with the um uh public parking
[1:33:47] along the curb and then provide the
[1:33:50] other parking that they need internal to
[1:33:52] their site which of course comes with
[1:33:54] costs and and all those things. Uh so
[1:33:56] let's go to the next slide.
[1:33:59] So assumptions, streetscape and pool and
[1:34:02] private parking only evolves if owner
[1:34:03] voluntary redevelops and opts into the
[1:34:06] new parallel configuration. This goes
[1:34:08] back to that very like second slide
[1:34:11] which talks about what options can we
[1:34:14] give the owners. And so this is if an
[1:34:16] owner is going to explore residential
[1:34:18] uses on the second level or a new
[1:34:20] development,
[1:34:22] this could be an option that we provide
[1:34:24] them, which is to reconfigure, get more
[1:34:26] land for the building and reconfigure
[1:34:29] the parking. Uh the new developments are
[1:34:32] parked to code requirements on site for
[1:34:34] parking demand. And then parking on the
[1:34:36] north side of Woodside Road can only
[1:34:38] happen if at some point the entire
[1:34:40] street's transformed and the center lane
[1:34:42] is no longer needed to pull into pull in
[1:34:44] parking. So there's a lot of really big
[1:34:47] ifs. And Richard wrote beautiful letter
[1:34:49] that kind of outlined in a lot of detail
[1:34:51] some of the um constraints and impacts
[1:34:54] that a developer would have to go
[1:34:56] through in order to get to this outcome.
[1:34:59] Uh this is something that we kind of
[1:35:01] heard over and over again from the
[1:35:02] community feedback, a desire for kind of
[1:35:04] a formal main street in Woodside. I
[1:35:07] think we can share with them the
[1:35:08] constraints and the difficulties of
[1:35:10] that, but we can also share with them
[1:35:12] that it is technically difficult but
[1:35:16] physically possible. So, next slide.
[1:35:21] So, this assumes that each property has
[1:35:24] uh forgone their pull-in parking off of
[1:35:26] Woodside Road and converted to a public
[1:35:30] parked uh condition. At that point, the turn lane off of Woodside Road would
[1:35:35] not be needed and you could achieve a
[1:35:38] formalized, you know, uh more regular
[1:35:41] main street with parallel parking, uh a
[1:35:45] 5-ft bike lane with a three-foot buffer.
[1:35:47] So you'd have parallel parking 8 ft and
[1:35:51] then you'd have your two 12T through
[1:35:53] lanes and then another 8T uh and then
[1:35:56] your 7T for parallel parking and a
[1:35:58] pathway on the top. Uh next slide.
[1:36:04] And so this would be your arrival moment
[1:36:07] into town. And again, these are all
[1:36:10] measures to help slow and calm traffic
[1:36:13] going into the into the town.
[1:36:16] uh the purple boxes that implies that property has been redeveloped. It
[1:36:21] could apply to all of them, but you
[1:36:24] know, this is a very hypothetical
[1:36:27] concept and it's something that we're
[1:36:30] mostly looking to is this an option that
[1:36:32] you would allow a developer to pursue
[1:36:34] who owns that property and wants to
[1:36:36] change that that street parking format.
[1:36:39] And if they did, what would you ask of
[1:36:42] them in return in terms of sidewalk
[1:36:44] width, planting, and things like that?
[1:36:46] >> Do you have a guess
[1:36:49] if I own one of those purple boxes,
[1:36:52] >> what it's worth before and after this
[1:36:54] change? Just a rough is it is worth 2x
[1:36:57] or 4x or what does that mean?
[1:36:59] >> Developers get really upset when
[1:37:00] architects proclaim
[1:37:02] >> I get it, but we but this is like the
[1:37:04] crux but this is the crux of the matter,
[1:37:06] right?
[1:37:07] >> It is. And it's it's a little bit this
[1:37:09] is something where so uh we do do
[1:37:12] downtown master plans but we always work
[1:37:15] with the developer consultant on those
[1:37:17] projects to understand the economics and
[1:37:19] the feasibility of it. So this is
[1:37:22] something where that's a great question
[1:37:23] and that's an important question and
[1:37:25] Richard you've definitely asked this
[1:37:27] question. Um,
[1:37:27] >> yeah. So, to take an example, 2979's
[1:37:31] building is 4,000 square feet, 2,000
[1:37:34] each floor plate, and it's one of the
[1:37:36] larger buildings there. It's been
[1:37:38] renovated, in my opinion, to the nines.
[1:37:40] The exterior's been entirely re-shaved.
[1:37:43] Interiors taken to the studs, done in
[1:37:46] several stages, done to a very high
[1:37:49] standard. JP Morgan Chase spent
[1:37:51] threequarters of a million dollars on
[1:37:52] the improvements. We tear that all down.
[1:37:54] We write that all off and then we start
[1:37:56] a new. We start a new by putting parking
[1:38:00] on the lower level because we have to
[1:38:03] park the building inside the property
[1:38:06] line and we have no more parking on
[1:38:08] Woodside Road and perhaps we have less
[1:38:11] parking in the rear and perhaps we lose
[1:38:14] the handicap spot that we have for the
[1:38:16] village doctor. It's not clear. The
[1:38:19] scale here is extremely small. If you
[1:38:23] were talking about a much bigger
[1:38:26] footprint, if one entity owned all
[1:38:29] purple boxes and maybe the little
[1:38:31] building at the end and the Gilbert
[1:38:33] Center and the Pioneer, then you have
[1:38:36] scale and size and scope. And so these,
[1:38:39] you know, uh technically difficult,
[1:38:43] physically
[1:38:45] possible improvements can be leveraged
[1:38:47] over a much greater square footage. I
[1:38:50] have never seen anything in 45 years
[1:38:53] that I've been doing real estate and
[1:38:54] construction. I've never seen anything
[1:38:57] like this. The scale is too small. It's constrained too much. It was set in
[1:39:04] concrete almost a hundred years ago with
[1:39:07] the buildouts of these buildings and it
[1:39:09] was studied to the nines in the late 80s
[1:39:13] and the town and the property owners got
[1:39:16] themselves into deep trouble. We were
[1:39:18] one of the only property owners who
[1:39:19] didn't sue the town. The town had
[1:39:22] multiple cases of litigation. Had a
[1:39:24] recall election. The mayor moved to
[1:39:27] Seattle. It was so bad. And the vice
[1:39:29] mayor
[1:39:31] >> baited away. It's really it's really not
[1:39:33] going to work. I laid that out in 23
[1:39:36] points. So
[1:39:37] >> this this is where I want to stress that
[1:39:39] we're you know this is not a mandate.
[1:39:42] You know this is simply
[1:39:45] if a developer has the brilliant idea to
[1:39:48] come to the table despite all these
[1:39:50] constraints and say I actually don't
[1:39:52] need the pool in parking what would you
[1:39:54] want in return and what this does it
[1:39:56] outlines a method in which you could
[1:39:59] over time deliver a streetscape that's
[1:40:03] more conducive to a formalized u main
[1:40:05] street and that's that's really all this
[1:40:08] is and Richard I do agree that um it's
[1:40:11] really hard to pull pull anything off
[1:40:13] with this fine grain lot scale that
[1:40:15] exists here. Uh the only place I've seen
[1:40:18] it happen and actually they didn't have
[1:40:20] to rebuild the sidewalks or anything was
[1:40:21] Carmel, you know, where they've tear
[1:40:24] torn down small buildings and put back
[1:40:26] up small buildings. And I still don't
[1:40:28] quite understand how they made that work
[1:40:29] even there, but um that's kind of the
[1:40:32] case study for that kind of development
[1:40:34] pattern, but it's really uncommon. So,
[1:40:38] um, we wanted to put this out there
[1:40:39] because it was something that did come
[1:40:41] up with the public. And I think it's
[1:40:43] important to qualify the idea with what
[1:40:46] the real constraints are. And I think
[1:40:48] between your contributions and I think
[1:40:51] what we've done, we've kind of outlined
[1:40:54] uh, you know, how hard it is and but
[1:40:58] this is this is what it would look like
[1:41:00] if that development was achieved over
[1:41:02] time. So that's kind of the base of it.
[1:41:06] Um the next concept is not an eitheror.
[1:41:10] This is something that could happen
[1:41:12] tomorrow I think. Uh so let's go to the
[1:41:15] next one.
[1:41:17] And so this was a really interesting
[1:41:18] idea that came from several
[1:41:20] stakeholders. Um we discussed it first
[1:41:23] with Richard and uh Troy and I were
[1:41:26] walking it tonight and we did some
[1:41:28] updated exhibits. Uh but essentially
[1:41:31] what this imagines is, you know, the
[1:41:35] back side is almost a second front side
[1:41:39] and several of the commercial buildings
[1:41:41] have created facades and entries that
[1:41:44] are on a quiet creek uh without any of
[1:41:46] the traffic noise impacts of Woodside
[1:41:48] Road. And it connects city hall better.
[1:41:52] Uh and it ties you all the way to
[1:41:53] Robert's Grocery. And gosh, that
[1:41:55] crosswalk might make sense if you get
[1:41:57] all the way over there. So this uh
[1:42:00] concept here basically hinges on I think
[1:42:03] a really important idea. And if you see
[1:42:06] that red line that's kind of halfway
[1:42:09] through the property that would cut off
[1:42:11] the through traffic circ circulation to
[1:42:15] really quiet the street to vehicular
[1:42:17] traffic.
[1:42:19] >> So that would cut it off to cars and
[1:42:21] trucks but not pedestrians and not
[1:42:24] bikes.
[1:42:24] >> Right. Yeah.
[1:42:25] >> And horses. Um
[1:42:27] >> horses. Correct. Right. Three getting
[1:42:29] through.
[1:42:29] >> So the idea is that if you eliminate the
[1:42:31] through traffic for vehicles, the only
[1:42:34] folks driving that shared street are the
[1:42:35] folks that happen to be parking into
[1:42:37] those spaces.
[1:42:39] So the cut off point though would have
[1:42:42] to be accessible for emergency vehicles
[1:42:44] that would need to get through. So
[1:42:46] designing that gate carefully and we're
[1:42:49] looking at it today. Maybe the gate
[1:42:51] angles this way. There's some different
[1:42:53] ways to do it. So uh Troy, let's go to
[1:42:56] the next slide.
[1:42:59] So, we took a photo uh in the upper left
[1:43:02] and then this takes that same photo, but
[1:43:05] it overlays basically a strip of
[1:43:07] cobblestones and it could be intricate
[1:43:10] or very minimal in its paving style and
[1:43:12] design. But it basically sends a message
[1:43:15] that through the texture uh of the
[1:43:17] rumble of the of the pavers um and
[1:43:20] potentially you know very slight speed
[1:43:22] tables and other traffic slowing devices
[1:43:25] that this zone is safe for a pedestrian
[1:43:28] in a comfortable place for a pedestrian
[1:43:30] to connect to the trail network or
[1:43:33] connect to Robert's Grocery or to
[1:43:35] connect to the the stores and shops at
[1:43:36] Gilbert's um and then on over to the
[1:43:39] Pioneer Hotel or City Hall. Uh
[1:43:43] if you go to the next slide,
[1:43:46] if you uh take the paving all the way to
[1:43:49] the buildings, it can kind of be an even
[1:43:52] more complete environment. And there are
[1:43:54] examples of these shared streets in
[1:43:56] Washington State, um California. There's
[1:43:59] places where this has been done. And
[1:44:01] then this is kind of all over Europe. Um
[1:44:03] but it's not without its challenges.
[1:44:05] It's really important that visual uh
[1:44:08] cues and communication to the cars to
[1:44:10] look out that pedestrians come first um
[1:44:13] are crucial for for safety. One of the
[1:44:16] challenges with the businesses on this
[1:44:18] side of uh of the block is that the
[1:44:22] connectivity of the sidewalk has to
[1:44:24] navigate a lot of grade changes. So,
[1:44:26] it's not ADA. Uh there's steps, there's
[1:44:28] stairs, and some places you land on a
[1:44:30] sidewalk that's like a couple feet deep.
[1:44:33] So those things aren't really great for
[1:44:36] a prominade, but slowing the street way
[1:44:39] down um and and paving it with a special
[1:44:42] decorative paver could really tra
[1:44:44] transform the atmosphere and create a
[1:44:47] sense of place uh along this side and
[1:44:49] maybe it would encourage more of the
[1:44:51] businesses to activate that side of
[1:44:54] their building in response. So um next
[1:44:59] slide.
[1:45:02] So,
[1:45:03] uh, what are your your additional
[1:45:05] comments to the the concept shown?
[1:45:11] Richard, go for it.
[1:45:13] >> Yeah. So, I made a couple comments in
[1:45:14] the letter. If we could go back two
[1:45:16] slides. I would suggest that this slide
[1:45:20] be updated because the photo in the top
[1:45:23] left is not the actual conditions. It
[1:45:26] fails to show the village pub outdoor
[1:45:28] eating. And that's pretty important to
[1:45:31] show you've got it on the next slide,
[1:45:34] but you don't have it on the first. So,
[1:45:36] it's that consistency that's pretty
[1:45:38] important. On the first slide, 17, it
[1:45:41] looked to me when I looked at it and
[1:45:43] zoomed in, it looked like you were going
[1:45:45] diagonal parking as you got further down
[1:45:50] the drive lane there. I couldn't tell.
[1:45:52] It looked like you were contemplating
[1:45:54] only having parking on the south side.
[1:45:56] Again, I I'm just saying there's value
[1:45:59] in clarity.
[1:46:00] >> We updated the So, this photo we took
[1:46:03] tonight
[1:46:05] and uh updated it with the paving down
[1:46:08] the center and we took this photo
[1:46:09] tonight and updated it with the paving
[1:46:12] down the center.
[1:46:13] >> Okay. So, these have changed since the
[1:46:16] ones we got
[1:46:17] >> in response to your comment, Richard.
[1:46:19] >> I see. Okay. So I I've already made the
[1:46:22] comment in the letter, but that handicap
[1:46:24] stall, we've spent so much time and
[1:46:27] money creating that handicap stall for
[1:46:30] the village doctor, making certain it
[1:46:32] was to the nines perfect to allow
[1:46:35] patients with mobility issues, access,
[1:46:38] ingress, and egress. So that parking
[1:46:40] along the backside there that we've got
[1:46:42] is really important to us.
[1:46:45] >> Thank Thank you.
[1:46:47] >> Okay.
[1:46:48] >> Could I make a
[1:46:49] >> Yes, Steve. Um, yeah, I I love this
[1:46:51] idea. There was a time when the book and
[1:46:54] bean the book and coffee shop was down
[1:46:56] there and and that back of those
[1:46:58] buildings at the lower level was much
[1:46:59] more active. And I'd love to see that
[1:47:02] restored. And it would also connect
[1:47:04] nicely with a if we had a really a 12-
[1:47:08] foot multi-use coming up Woodside Road
[1:47:11] from the school, this would be a way
[1:47:13] that people could get away from traffic
[1:47:15] and and walk through town.
[1:47:17] >> Yep. As far as Woodside Road goes, um it
[1:47:20] seems to me that having parallel
[1:47:22] parking, you know, really loses a lot of
[1:47:25] parking spots. I think that huge expanse
[1:47:27] of asphalt on Woodside Road is a great
[1:47:29] opportunity to pit parking where we
[1:47:32] already have paving. If in the eastbound
[1:47:34] direction there was backend diagonal
[1:47:37] parking, I think would be actually safer
[1:47:39] than parallel parking and you'd get a
[1:47:42] lot more cars in. And I think it's
[1:47:44] really important to restore the parking
[1:47:45] on the north side because we still have
[1:47:47] a deficit of parking and I'd hate to see
[1:47:51] a lot of parking interior. The parking
[1:47:53] lots I think are really destructive to
[1:47:55] pedestrian spaces.
[1:47:57] >> Great. Thank you, Steve. Yeah.
[1:48:01] >> Yes, Sue.
[1:48:03] >> I for one will miss the center turn lane
[1:48:06] like into the post office into the gas
[1:48:09] station. And I know you'll hate me, but
[1:48:12] I do like the cut through, especially if
[1:48:15] it's uh, you know, a weekend. So, when
[1:48:18] I'm coming down Mountain Home, I do
[1:48:20] sometimes I'm going to the post office,
[1:48:21] so I'm going to go the back way instead
[1:48:22] of sit at Mountain I mean at Whiskey
[1:48:25] Hill, wait at the stop sign to turn, I'm
[1:48:28] going to go the back way to the post
[1:48:29] office. But most of the time I'm using
[1:48:31] that cut through, it's because I'm
[1:48:33] really going to those particular places.
[1:48:35] I might leave the post office and go to
[1:48:37] the bank. Easier than going up Woodside
[1:48:40] Road.
[1:48:52] » Oh, I mean, hate me because I'm I'm
[1:48:53] going behind the buildings. I'm sorry.
[1:48:56] Um I'm using the cut through behind the
[1:48:59] buildings that you're now going to make
[1:49:00] a pedestrian friendly.
[1:49:02] But
[1:49:03] >> well the I mean the the idea is that the
[1:49:06] So Troy, can you go back to the map?
[1:49:10] >> So the orange zone represents where cars
[1:49:14] cut through from Whiskey Hill all the
[1:49:17] way to Robert's Grocery right now on the
[1:49:19] screen.
[1:49:20] >> Correct.
[1:49:20] >> So that's the path that cars take,
[1:49:22] >> right? And so what this is saying is
[1:49:25] that and and what you're observing Sue
[1:49:27] is that we're blocking off the cut
[1:49:29] through traffic in order to minimize the
[1:49:31] car presence. Not eliminate it, but
[1:49:34] minimize it. But yeah, we would in in
[1:49:37] essence lose your
[1:49:39] um unofficial street that connects
[1:49:42] Whiskey Hill to Mountain,
[1:49:43] >> right? Because if it's the weekend and
[1:49:45] there's a lot of traffic or the
[1:49:48] people going to the beach, I mean,
[1:49:50] Woodside Road can really get busy. If
[1:49:52] I'm buzzing by the mail office or the
[1:49:56] post office, I'll just go the back way
[1:49:57] to the bank. So, that's just a little I
[1:50:00] mean,
[1:50:01] >> sadly, that's not a street, Sue.
[1:50:04] >> Excuse me.
[1:50:06] >> Sadly, that's not a street. You're going
[1:50:08] through someone's parking lot.
[1:50:10] >> But it but it looks like a street.
[1:50:15] I I would venture to say I can't be the
[1:50:18] only one sitting here tonight that
[1:50:20] hasn't done that.
[1:50:21] I will freely admit I do it too, but
[1:50:24] it's still not a stream.
[1:50:26] >> So, so I know what the when what the
[1:50:28] residents want for sure is a bigger
[1:50:31] variety of consumer oriented retail, you
[1:50:33] know, and these build we I feel like
[1:50:35] we're losing track of that, right? It's
[1:50:37] >> that's a big thing that people want is
[1:50:39] they want more I can go to town here and
[1:50:42] get the things I need and shop. So, so
[1:50:44] to me the big issue in all this is is
[1:50:46] from the property owner's perspective if
[1:50:47] we do either one of these and I heard
[1:50:50] you say the first one's untenable fine
[1:50:52] but I I don't think it's even worth
[1:50:54] almost not worth talking about unless
[1:50:55] you're like yeah I'd be happy to go add
[1:50:57] more on the shared street I can imagine
[1:50:59] in my building doing whatever
[1:51:01] improvements I need to do to have a
[1:51:04] yogurt shop or a yoga studio or
[1:51:06] something that's open on that that'll
[1:51:08] draw more pedestrians and draw more
[1:51:10] residents in. Right. And so that to me
[1:51:12] that's like the core issue of this is I think it's cool great idea as long as
[1:51:18] we're we the property owners are willing
[1:51:20] to build kind of some vibrancy and
[1:51:22] retail outlets there that'll make it a
[1:51:25] cool street for people to walk on.
[1:51:26] Otherwise it's like what's the point?
[1:51:29] That's that would be my thing.
[1:51:35] » Yeah. But I'm just mean it's like a lot
[1:51:37] of people really people really want
[1:51:39] that's the feedback we got was the
[1:51:41] residents really want to be able to go
[1:51:42] here and have another restaurant option
[1:51:45] and have an ice cream shop and have a
[1:51:46] yoga studio and have some more stuff
[1:51:48] like that that they could go visit and
[1:51:50] so we can get that as part of this
[1:51:52] awesome.
[1:52:00] Yeah, but the question would be like are
[1:52:02] there can you reorient so there could be
[1:52:05] stores that face that like those kind of
[1:52:07] shops that face and you know one
[1:52:09] building's already ordered the right way
[1:52:10] but these guys in the middle would have
[1:52:12] to orient you know back towards that
[1:52:14] street.
[1:52:26] » But but that's what I that's why I bring
[1:52:27] it up, right? It is like if that's if we
[1:52:29] can get that awesome cuz this cool super
[1:52:32] cool idea. If we can't
[1:52:34] then what's the point
[1:52:37] isn't the
[1:52:40] >> So some more comments. There's been a
[1:52:42] lot said here. So this to me this back
[1:52:45] lane fits in really well with what the
[1:52:48] town has done since termination of the
[1:52:51] Woodside uh road Whiskey Hill Road
[1:52:54] Parking Assessment District. And that is
[1:52:56] when buildings came forward to redevelop
[1:52:59] there was a concerted effort to orient
[1:53:01] them towards the back.
[1:53:04] >> So we at our building at 2979 we opened
[1:53:06] up that lower level. So instead of the
[1:53:10] front that we had with book and bean it
[1:53:13] was a much more open lightfilled space
[1:53:16] that attracted a concierge doctor who
[1:53:19] took part of this space and then took it
[1:53:20] all. So, pretty big book of business
[1:53:23] over the last 20 years plus. Um, our
[1:53:27] other building though at Millstone, it's
[1:53:29] a solid masonry wall. We have no way to
[1:53:33] create space there. We'd have to exit.
[1:53:35] We'd have to tear down the building. So,
[1:53:37] we added an architectural feature
[1:53:40] designed by Steve on the ramp. when we
[1:53:42] closed off the ramp at the town's
[1:53:44] direction. But there's a building that
[1:53:46] has, you know, a very tiny footprint,
[1:53:48] 1,200 square feet with sitting on uh
[1:53:52] soil that would need to be excavated to
[1:53:55] orient it towards the rear. So I think
[1:53:57] with Village Pub, there's been a big
[1:53:59] change. So when the district was in
[1:54:02] throws, Village Pub was up on Woodside
[1:54:05] Road, an entrance restaurant overlooking
[1:54:08] Woodside Road. When that was sold, torn
[1:54:11] down and rebuilt, they put it
[1:54:13] downstairs, kitchen in the back, and
[1:54:15] then they had this opportunity during
[1:54:18] COVID to put seating out back. I don't
[1:54:20] think much else is going to change
[1:54:22] because the Gilbert's built new on the
[1:54:25] end, east end, and they don't have the
[1:54:27] same topography that the other buildings
[1:54:30] have. And then the little building in
[1:54:32] between ours and the village pub is
[1:54:34] very, very tiny. And it's been done to
[1:54:37] the nines more more so than anything
[1:54:39] we've done. I mean, he really did a
[1:54:41] great job. He's not going to redo that
[1:54:44] again. I mean, it's about as oriented
[1:54:46] towards the rear as possible. So, you
[1:54:48] have a limited number of buildings,
[1:54:50] limited footprint, and you've had this
[1:54:52] effort over 20 years when capital's been
[1:54:54] deployed to orient it towards the back.
[1:54:57] >> So, final comment though.
[1:54:59] >> Okay.
[1:54:59] >> With retail leasing, drive counts count.
[1:55:04] You don't have drive counts in Woodside.
[1:55:06] You never will. You have demographics.
[1:55:08] You have income levels that support
[1:55:10] robust retail, but you don't have drive
[1:55:13] counts. And drive counts matter
[1:55:14] everywhere in leasing in the United
[1:55:16] States. And I've been at it for 45
[1:55:18] years. So, I've seen it done. It can be
[1:55:21] done. It won't be done here. It you just
[1:55:24] don't have the population, the density,
[1:55:27] and the drive count.
[1:55:29] Dan, the other agenda with this concept
[1:55:33] is if you cannot achieve uh the
[1:55:36] formalized pedestrian sidewalk that
[1:55:38] creates a continuity on Woodside Road,
[1:55:41] can we create continuity in an area that
[1:55:44] has less friction uh you know in terms
[1:55:46] of cost? And so can you go to that first
[1:55:49] slide? Kind of the most minimal way to
[1:55:53] do this is just take the center section
[1:55:55] of asphalt and texture it and um try and
[1:55:59] take that texture all the way to where
[1:56:02] that you know it could optionally stop
[1:56:05] at the red gate and you take the
[1:56:07] equestrian trail behind Gilbert's or if
[1:56:11] you wanted to extend this and it went
[1:56:13] around Gilbert's to tie into the the
[1:56:16] post office and the uses there that
[1:56:18] would be an option too to discuss. So,
[1:56:21] but I think, you know, this ties to the
[1:56:23] museum, it ties to the city hall, it
[1:56:26] ties to the village pub. There's, you
[1:56:28] know, a collection of some uses there.
[1:56:31] Uh, but the predominant agenda is really
[1:56:34] giving pedestrians like a nice place to
[1:56:35] walk. So, yes,
[1:56:44] picking picking up the equestrian.
[1:56:47] It would be in front of the Gilbert
[1:56:49] Center lean.
[1:56:50] >> The paving area would be the shared
[1:56:51] street would go around the front of
[1:56:55] Gilbert Center potentially, but where
[1:56:58] the red line is drawn on the map is
[1:57:00] where folks can pick up the equestrian
[1:57:03] trail and walk safely to uh Roberts and
[1:57:08] that's there today. So, it picks up on
[1:57:10] some existing trail network. Um I'm
[1:57:13] saying like basically you could
[1:57:26] Leanne, could you use the microphone,
[1:57:27] please?
[1:57:29] >> Fallen in to the dirt that had to be
[1:57:32] It's It's very deep and that's behind
[1:57:36] our whole building there.
[1:57:37] >> Yeah.
[1:57:38] >> And so it should be left alone because
[1:57:40] that's what it is.
[1:57:41] >> Yeah. this and I don't think the
[1:57:43] neighbor behind us would enjoy the fact
[1:57:45] that all of a sudden a ton of cars or
[1:57:47] people were now walking.
[1:57:49] >> No, we are not proposing any changes to
[1:57:51] that trail at all in this idea. This
[1:57:54] idea takes the concept of just changing
[1:57:57] the paving surface along where the cars
[1:57:59] drive, not where they park, but where
[1:58:02] they drive to create a zone that
[1:58:04] pedestrians could walk along with slow
[1:58:08] traffic. So anyhow, just just trying to
[1:58:11] clarify what we're showing.
[1:58:13] >> It's clear as mud.
[1:58:16] >> Two more quick comments.
[1:58:17] >> Okay.
[1:58:18] >> One is this concept really takes that
[1:58:21] back area to where it was prior to the
[1:58:25] town's approval of Gilbert Center. The
[1:58:28] town obligated Gilbert Center, the
[1:58:29] Gilberts, to remove that retaining wall
[1:58:33] that then blocked traffic from exiting
[1:58:37] Gilbert Center and heading east. So that
[1:58:40] was created at the direction of the
[1:58:42] town, but it didn't really matter at the
[1:58:44] time because there was a retaining wall
[1:58:46] behind the pub and the retaining wall
[1:58:49] held traffic westbound at the pub,
[1:58:52] eastbound at that west side of the pub.
[1:58:55] that was removed when the town approved
[1:58:58] the pub and created this throughway. And
[1:59:01] yes, at times it may be infrequently
[1:59:03] used, but at times it is really heavily
[1:59:06] used. School times in particular see a
[1:59:09] lot of cut through traffic and it is
[1:59:11] sometimes high-speed stuff. So we added
[1:59:15] speed bumps, engineered speed bumps
[1:59:17] approved by the town public works
[1:59:19] department after review to slow things
[1:59:21] down.
[1:59:23] Some of those vehicles are pretty heavy.
[1:59:25] They take those speed bumps at speed.
[1:59:28] They don't care. So, they fly over them.
[1:59:30] It is not pedestrian friendly in my
[1:59:33] opinion now. And so, the idea is let's
[1:59:36] make it more pedestrian friendly and put
[1:59:38] cars back on the road where they should
[1:59:40] be.
[1:59:41] >> No, I'd like to say something about
[1:59:43] that. We had speed bumps on our whole
[1:59:47] road. They've been torn up three times
[1:59:49] by bicyclists. wasn't new, was it?
[1:59:54] Uh he would he wouldn't destroy
[1:59:56] property. He But anyway, that they've
[1:59:59] gotten torn up every time. So, we don't
[2:00:01] have them in there anymore. No more
[2:00:03] speed bumps. But nobody's speeding
[2:00:05] through Gilbert Center. Not if we caught
[2:00:08] them. If you're speeding there, did you
[2:00:10] look funny when you I said that? But u
[2:00:13] No. and and behind we're going to close
[2:00:16] that off because people are coming and
[2:00:18] they have no sight distance when they
[2:00:20] come from let's say up at the pub and
[2:00:23] coming down they don't see around and
[2:00:26] that's just how our building is built
[2:00:27] there.
[2:00:28] >> Mhm.
[2:00:29] >> And so it's not a good deal in the back
[2:00:32] there. I don't think you can get as many
[2:00:35] joy as much joy out of that as you
[2:00:37] think.
[2:00:40] So, should I take that to mean you
[2:00:42] support closing that off or you do not
[2:00:45] support?
[2:00:46] >> I don't want to clo I just want to leave
[2:00:47] it alone the way it is. People know that
[2:00:50] people that walk there if they're coming
[2:00:52] where are they coming from to come down
[2:00:54] to the post office? We have the post
[2:00:56] office right there for anybody to get on
[2:00:58] to right away.
[2:01:00] >> We have parking spaces.
[2:01:01] >> So, here I would argue Leanne's got veto
[2:01:05] rights. So without Leanne in tow,
[2:01:08] >> well, why don't we take a vote on all
[2:01:11] the ideas and let's go from there. Um I
[2:01:13] think we've had some really good
[2:01:15] discussion, but let's just kind of lay
[2:01:16] out these ideas. We have a couple of
[2:01:18] ideas that are not necessarily
[2:01:20] contradictory. I think some of these are
[2:01:21] complimentary. Um but let's just do a
[2:01:23] quick show of hands. Um because I think Leanne's supportive of this idea
[2:01:28] ultimately, I think. Um but let's just
[2:01:30] start with the kind of the front side of
[2:01:33] Woodside Road. Do we support allowing
[2:01:36] basically develop properties to change
[2:01:39] their parking from the 90 degree to the
[2:01:42] on street parallel parking? Do we
[2:01:43] support that? Yes or no?
[2:01:47] >> Not so much. Oh. Oh, got one timid.
[2:01:50] >> You lose too much.
[2:01:52] >> Well, you do.
[2:01:57] park all but actually I was wondering
[2:01:59] how do you suggest people get from
[2:02:01] parking on the north side of Woodside
[2:02:04] Road across Woodside Road so they could
[2:02:07] I mean if we have all these cars there
[2:02:09] because we're adding cars there Steve
[2:02:11] >> I I I think
[2:02:12] >> how are people going to run across
[2:02:13] >> that's that's part of the traffic coming
[2:02:15] I think there should be an additional
[2:02:17] two crosswalks here from the north side
[2:02:20] the the trees should be be between the cars it should be parallel on the
[2:02:25] north side and back in diagonal on the
[2:02:27] south side. If you we're not going to
[2:02:29] get this retail use as intensely if we
[2:02:32] lose all this parking. I mean, I think
[2:02:34] we need it already. And and the more
[2:02:37] parking we can keep on the street, the
[2:02:39] more we're going to encourage these
[2:02:41] retail uses.
[2:02:44] Appreciate the comment. I just
[2:02:48] not I mean we're supposed to be voting
[2:02:49] but I guess my other comment was I like
[2:02:51] the whole concept of enhancing the
[2:02:54] walking path but realistically what's
[2:02:56] left I mean there's the village pub when
[2:03:00] we reoriented that so it faced the back
[2:03:03] I was actually at the meeting I remember
[2:03:04] very clearly somebody told me you don't
[2:03:06] put the village pub downstairs we're
[2:03:07] going to go bankrupt nobody's going to
[2:03:09] be down there well it obviously worked
[2:03:11] but that space is used up the um the
[2:03:16] concier's doctor, that space is used up.
[2:03:19] Richard said that concrete wall behind
[2:03:22] that the old Philip 66 station that's
[2:03:24] used up. So there aren't really too many
[2:03:28] reasons people are going to be walking
[2:03:29] down there. Now I think your sketch is
[2:03:32] really beautiful. The watercolor is
[2:03:33] really nice, but who's going to walk
[2:03:36] down there? I mean, I don't know. Will
[2:03:38] cut cottage. I don't even know what's in
[2:03:41] there, but it doesn't look like that's
[2:03:43] going to open up for retail. You know,
[2:03:44] the thing next to the village. What's
[2:03:46] the your building there at the corner?
[2:03:48] >> Perkins office.
[2:03:50] >> Perkins.
[2:03:51] office. I don't
[2:03:53] >> benchmark.
[2:03:54] >> I can't I I think, you know, as we've
[2:03:56] been pointed out, we're talking about
[2:03:58] long-term planning and none of this has
[2:04:01] to happen. And we're I mean, Richard's
[2:04:02] building that used to be a gas station.
[2:04:04] I think there's an incredible potential
[2:04:07] there to to to have, you know, to to to
[2:04:10] keep the pedestrian pathway continuous
[2:04:12] on Woodside Road and to have a lot more
[2:04:14] building there on two levels, three
[2:04:16] levels. And and I think in the long
[2:04:19] term, we've got to make these things are
[2:04:22] possible, forcing anybody to do it.
[2:04:25] Making it possible really opens up
[2:04:28] opportunities.
[2:04:29] We should have a long-term vision that
[2:04:32] makes more possible.
[2:04:34] I think that's well said Steve. I think
[2:04:36] just what when we're think when we're
[2:04:37] here in this room today right we're
[2:04:38] looking at oh it's you know it's this
[2:04:40] business it's this business but if we
[2:04:41] look down in the future things can might
[2:04:44] happen someone you know might buy a
[2:04:46] property change over property so this is
[2:04:48] a little bit less about you know this
[2:04:50] exact business I can't see it changing
[2:04:53] over but it's a little bit taking a step
[2:04:55] into the world of what could happen in
[2:04:57] 10 years or 20 years um there are real
[2:05:01] constraints you guys are you know
[2:05:03] helpfully expressing
[2:05:07] Should we just go through the last one?
[2:05:09] Uh or do you want to
[2:05:11] >> Yeah, maybe let's just finish out kind
[2:05:12] of the voting because I'm interested
[2:05:14] just to see where folks are in terms So,
[2:05:16] the first idea there was not I didn't
[2:05:19] see any hands really. Um how about
[2:05:21] adding
[2:05:21] >> just one hand?
[2:05:22] >> Yeah, just one hand. How about adding
[2:05:23] back parking onto Woodside Road?
[2:05:27] >> Oh, the north side.
[2:05:29] >> Yeah, on the north side of Woodside
[2:05:30] Road.
[2:05:33] that the cost of the Senate drone line.
[2:05:36] >> That would be the tradeoff.
[2:05:38] >> So, we would object strongly to that and
[2:05:40] it's highly likely if that went through,
[2:05:42] we'd file suit against CalR and the town
[2:05:46] guaranteed.
[2:05:48] We lose access, Lisbon access to 2989,
[2:05:52] the Gilberts lose access in the center,
[2:05:55] we'd file suit.
[2:05:56] >> Okay, we'll take that as a no vote.
[2:05:59] Um, no. That's that's good feedback, but
[2:06:02] >> sorry, I'm gonna I agree with you, but
[2:06:04] I'm going to object to your approach.
[2:06:05] >> He's asking for a vote. This is a public
[2:06:08] process with people who are selected to
[2:06:09] be here. The vote should be taken.
[2:06:11] >> I agree with your opinion, but we can't
[2:06:13] squash the vote. So, he should take his
[2:06:15] vote,
[2:06:15] >> right? I agree with your comment, but I
[2:06:17] raised my hand for a while there while
[2:06:19] quite a bit of commentary was going back
[2:06:21] and forth over a number of topics which
[2:06:23] skip the center drive lane which been
[2:06:25] made clear in the exhibits that if that
[2:06:28] goes that's the only way to get parking
[2:06:30] on the north side. If that goes we
[2:06:32] suffer damages and we won't sit back and
[2:06:35] allow that to happen. Period.
[2:06:39] So
[2:06:40] >> recognize that somebody has the same.
[2:06:46] » I'm I'm not sure that it isn't possible
[2:06:49] to have leftterm pockets and still have
[2:06:52] parking on the north side. I'm not sure.
[2:06:55] You know, if we look at 11 foot lanes in
[2:06:58] both directions from from Whiskey Hill
[2:07:01] Road to Kings Mountain Road with with
[2:07:03] shared
[2:07:05] I mean if you get rid of the bike lanes,
[2:07:07] you got another 10 another 16 ft.
[2:07:10] >> Typically how cities do it is they wipe
[2:07:12] out the parallel parking to make room
[2:07:14] for the turn lane for the length of two
[2:07:16] or three cars. But I think turnets we
[2:07:19] could get the parking and get left turn
[2:07:21] parkets park pockets and get trees in
[2:07:24] the middle of the road and and I think
[2:07:25] with careful design all of that's
[2:07:27] possible. There's yeah the challenge I
[2:07:31] think in the interim is all the pool and
[2:07:33] parking for the businesses along
[2:07:35] Woodside Road are going to need that
[2:07:37] turn lane only in the event that those
[2:07:40] properties redeveloped and we lost um uh
[2:07:45] the need for that uh 90° pull in parking
[2:07:49] off Woodside that um you know you
[2:07:52] wouldn't need the entire street to have
[2:07:54] that turn lane
[2:07:55] >> if if you had if you had a left turn
[2:07:58] park. If you had back in diagonal
[2:08:00] parking and you had turn lane, one or
[2:08:03] two turn lanes, people could make a
[2:08:05] Uturn and back into the parking spots.
[2:08:09] So, let's do a vote really quick. Just I
[2:08:11] mean, we still have some bandwidth in
[2:08:14] this project left to, you know, refine
[2:08:17] ideas, change exhibits, and work on
[2:08:19] things. But let's wrap up the vote
[2:08:21] because we still have another section uh
[2:08:24] to cover. So, um
[2:08:27] let's do a quick vote on the uh street
[2:08:31] >> sheriff hands for the north side
[2:08:33] parking.
[2:08:34] >> Yeah.
[2:08:35] >> And then we'll do shared street.
[2:08:38] >> So, real quick, if you're no on parking
[2:08:41] on the north side, um in the event that
[2:08:45] there's uh that the the turnpocket
[2:08:48] solution could be solved,
[2:08:51] uh raise your hand.
[2:08:53] You thoroughly confused us.
[2:08:55] >> Yeah, I didn't.
[2:08:56] >> It is confusing. How about we need to do
[2:08:58] an exhibit showing that you could add
[2:09:00] the parking on the north side with the
[2:09:01] turn lane.
[2:09:02] >> Okay. Well, let's let's assume that the
[2:09:05] current trade-off is the loss of the
[2:09:08] center turn lane. Who's in favor of
[2:09:10] adding the parking on the north side? If
[2:09:12] that's the case,
[2:09:14] >> losing the turn lane
[2:09:16] >> one.
[2:09:16] >> Okay, great. Let's as a team make an
[2:09:20] experiment and see if there are is any
[2:09:22] way to add
[2:09:24] both uh to do pocket turn pockets plus
[2:09:27] parallel parking. So we will take a look
[2:09:29] at that. Um sounds like there's some
[2:09:31] interest in that. Um okay, how about the
[2:09:33] shared street? How um how do we feel
[2:09:36] about the backside shared street
[2:09:38] concept? Who supports that?
[2:09:40] >> Simplicit in that cutting off being able
[2:09:43] to drive continuously through.
[2:09:44] >> Yeah.
[2:09:52] Great.
[2:09:55] >> All right.
[2:09:57] And I think there's, you know, we can
[2:10:00] also talk about Dry Creek Trail um
[2:10:02] improving that, but that's sort of a
[2:10:03] separate idea. I think more important
[2:10:05] are the bigger ideas. All right. Great.
[2:10:07] That's good direction. And we'll take a
[2:10:09] closer look at the north at the at the
[2:10:12] road and see what is possible.
[2:10:15] All right, let's move on to area D,
[2:10:18] Whiskey Hill Road.
[2:10:20] >> Great. Let's go to the next slide. So,
[2:10:23] the predominant issues here is as you're
[2:10:26] coming from the freeway entering into
[2:10:28] town, a lot of folks are not slowing
[2:10:30] down. So, if you're on Whiskey Hill Road
[2:10:33] trying to to make a left turn into town,
[2:10:36] you're dealing with fairly high speed
[2:10:38] traffic traveling fast from the freeway
[2:10:41] and then traffic speeding up going
[2:10:43] towards the freeway. So, uh we looked at
[2:10:47] a couple concepts here to introduce uh
[2:10:50] kind of a controlled a way to control
[2:10:52] the intersection to improve its safety
[2:10:54] for both pedestrians and and motorists.
[2:10:57] Uh we talked about the concepts in
[2:11:00] general at first uh you know no change
[2:11:03] crosswalk and flashers three-way stop
[2:11:05] sign roundabout and so the CAC was split
[2:11:08] between a crosswalk with flashers or um
[2:11:12] and a three-way stop sign and then a
[2:11:14] roundabout was not favored. Um next
[2:11:17] slide.
[2:11:20] So, this represents uh a three-way stop
[2:11:23] and essentially what you're seeing on
[2:11:25] the north side of the intersection is an
[2:11:27] enteron lane that goes into that
[2:11:30] property uh and accesses the parking in
[2:11:33] the back through the the little tunnel
[2:11:35] it has. Um so, in this situation here,
[2:11:39] we're creating a moment where traffic
[2:11:42] coming from the freeway stops and it
[2:11:45] will slow traffic before it heads into
[2:11:47] town. Uh, and it would make it a lot
[2:11:49] safer and easier for folks to make a
[2:11:51] left on the Kinyatta, I'm sorry, on the
[2:11:53] Woodside Road coming from Whiskey Hill.
[2:11:56] Um, and then, uh, let's go to the next
[2:12:00] slide.
[2:12:02] So, this was the concept that there were
[2:12:04] a lot of concerns about roundabout
[2:12:05] safety. Um, and so it does fit um, the
[2:12:11] site, a mini roundabout. And basically a
[2:12:14] mini roundabout has uh uh the motorist
[2:12:17] is really focused on one oncoming car at
[2:12:20] a time. So you're you're not worried
[2:12:23] about two-way traffic flow. You're
[2:12:24] really just worried about one-way
[2:12:26] traffic flow. And so there's basically
[2:12:28] less uh you know different things to
[2:12:31] focus on. And there's a lot of research
[2:12:33] and data that shows that these modern
[2:12:36] roundabouts are actually a lot safer and
[2:12:39] have a lot less decision points than
[2:12:42] both standard standard intersections and
[2:12:45] um older roundabout designs that weren't
[2:12:47] quite as pedestrian oriented. These both
[2:12:50] have pedestrian refuges and then they
[2:12:52] neck down where the pedestrian crosses
[2:12:54] so they have a very short crossing
[2:12:56] point. Uh, this does not require stop
[2:12:59] sign coming into town, but it does it
[2:13:02] does slow traffic and it does facilitate
[2:13:05] um traffic from Whiskey Hill onto
[2:13:07] Woodside in both directions easier than
[2:13:10] it is today. It would also visually
[2:13:14] reduce the the amount of pavement uh
[2:13:16] increase the streetscape
[2:13:19] uh and kind of create a nice gateway
[2:13:21] moment into into the town. So we wanted
[2:13:25] to show these side by side so that um we
[2:13:28] could kind of compare the two. One is
[2:13:30] pretty straightforward and traditional
[2:13:32] uh and then the other has uh the
[2:13:34] roundabout concept.
[2:13:36] Uh so let's go to discussion.
[2:13:40] Yes.
[2:13:42] >> Okay. Thank you for making me first. I
[2:13:44] have lots of opinions on this one. This
[2:13:46] was actually brought to us in
[2:13:47] circulation years ago and there is
[2:13:50] actually a solution on the table that
[2:13:51] none of these Calrans has accepted it at
[2:13:53] the behest of Stacy Sevil who had
[2:13:54] advocated for it. They just haven't
[2:13:56] implemented it yet. Um I'll get to that
[2:13:58] in a second. My first question is is
[2:13:59] that roundabout Calrance truck legal?
[2:14:03] Uh, so Alta designed this so that it was
[2:14:06] emergency vehicle and and truck legal.
[2:14:08] And that center 56 foot fully mountable
[2:14:12] truck apron is set up so that a truck
[2:14:15] can go over that without an impact. It's really a graphic, you know, kind of
[2:14:20] visual cue with a very slight rise in
[2:14:22] it. So you won't want to go over it, but
[2:14:25] going over it really isn't a problem at
[2:14:27] all. But does that mean that you know
[2:14:28] construction trucks, delivery trucks are
[2:14:30] intended to go over it because they
[2:14:31] can't make the regular turn?
[2:14:33] >> Uh it's not an obstacle for them. So if
[2:14:36] they have to take a tight basically
[2:14:38] their radius can work by going over that
[2:14:41] without tipping their truck over or
[2:14:43] being an
[2:14:44] >> impediment, but that means now you're
[2:14:45] going to get tire marks and noise and
[2:14:47] stuff. It see Okay, I'll leave that to
[2:14:50] Calr and design. It seems to me like it
[2:14:52] may not fit.
[2:14:54] >> That's a technical thing. someone has
[2:14:55] the information to figure that out. So,
[2:14:58] I do not support the stop sign because
[2:15:00] again, more stop signs through this
[2:15:01] area. I don't think while again it will
[2:15:03] help certain safety things, it will slow
[2:15:05] things down and we'll all be hating
[2:15:06] ourselves on that sunny Saturday when
[2:15:08] traffic is backed up to the wazoo. The
[2:15:11] solution we came up with was to add a
[2:15:13] two-way center turn lane right on on
[2:15:16] your concept one, right where it says
[2:15:18] turn lane, but it faces in towards the
[2:15:21] business next to the gas station. If
[2:15:22] you're making a left from Whiskey Hill
[2:15:24] towards downtown Woodside, if you could
[2:15:26] pull into a center turn lane pocket, you
[2:15:28] only have to clear one direction of
[2:15:30] traffic at a time. So you make the left
[2:15:32] turn, you pause. Now you're merging with
[2:15:34] traffic that you should have sight lines
[2:15:36] on and you can see the current challenge
[2:15:38] is you have traffic coming from two
[2:15:40] sides up hills. You're checking both. I
[2:15:42] drove there today and you get stuck.
[2:15:44] Yeah. The center turn lane, which
[2:15:46] currently you cannot enter from this
[2:15:47] direction, solves that problem with just
[2:15:49] paint, minimal changes, and it leaves
[2:15:51] the flow the same. And it doesn't have
[2:15:53] any of the again, I like roundabouts. I
[2:15:54] don't know if it'll work here.
[2:15:56] >> So officially, Calrans has accepted
[2:15:58] this. Lord knows if the person who
[2:15:59] accepted it is still there.
[2:16:01] >> Yeah, it's a different discussion. Um,
[2:16:03] but to me, that was the most simple,
[2:16:04] elegant solution. Minimal changes, no
[2:16:07] stop signs, and it makes it easier and
[2:16:09] safer. I do support a crosswalk
[2:16:10] potentially lit actually because when
[2:16:12] people go to cross there, nobody sees
[2:16:13] them. So, I think a flashing RFB
[2:16:15] crosswalk there is a great idea. The
[2:16:17] center turn lane to me was the simplest,
[2:16:19] most elegant idea. I just want to put it
[2:16:20] out there.
[2:16:21] >> Great.
[2:16:22] >> Yeah, I think we should definitely add
[2:16:24] that.
[2:16:25] >> Send you guys.
[2:16:27] >> Great.
[2:16:27] >> Can I Can I ask a clarifying question?
[2:16:29] >> Yes, Julie.
[2:16:30] >> That like when we're coming from the
[2:16:31] side streets onto El Camino in certain
[2:16:34] places, that's the same. Okay. Yeah,
[2:16:36] that's a great idea. Basically, you can
[2:16:38] you could pause in the middle of the
[2:16:40] street safely, not break a rule, and
[2:16:43] then wait till essentially clear the
[2:16:45] next lane. So, you're doing one at a
[2:16:46] time.
[2:16:47] >> How Woodside Road works east of east of
[2:16:50] 280.
[2:16:52] >> It's like a merge lane, like a center
[2:16:54] merging lane, right?
[2:16:55] >> I actually really like the three-way
[2:16:57] stop, but I think it it should I mean,
[2:16:59] it's is an important place to slow
[2:17:01] people down coming into town. I think we
[2:17:04] want to set the the tone as soon as
[2:17:06] people come in. But I think I would
[2:17:07] modify it so that Woodside Road when
[2:17:10] you're westbound kind of inflex to the
[2:17:13] left so it gives you kind of an equal
[2:17:15] choice to drive down Woodside Road or
[2:17:17] Whiskey Hill Road. I think that would
[2:17:19] help divert a lot of traffic away from
[2:17:21] Town Center, which I think is consistent
[2:17:23] with the other things we're trying to to
[2:17:26] accomplish in this Town Center plan. And
[2:17:29] uh and I think, you know, a kind of
[2:17:31] equilateral three-way triangle here
[2:17:33] would be an easy intersection for people
[2:17:35] to navigate, but would give the clue
[2:17:37] that you're coming into town center and
[2:17:39] slow down.
[2:17:41] >> Thank you, Steve. Caroline,
[2:17:44] >> I really like this option that's just
[2:17:46] been brought up or doesn't sound like
[2:17:48] it's new, but you know that you've
[2:17:49] raised tonight to have that
[2:17:52] uh turn lane in the other direction or
[2:17:55] bumping out so that you can safely come
[2:17:57] and pause. I do that almost every day on
[2:18:00] Alpine Road um by Lera Oaks and and Lera
[2:18:03] Biancinis.
[2:18:05] The concern I see as a driver in that
[2:18:08] area is that sometimes the runway isn't
[2:18:10] long enough or doesn't feel long enough
[2:18:13] because you have to accelerate from a
[2:18:16] stop
[2:18:18] and cut in in front of cars, especially
[2:18:21] the ones coming from 280 into town.
[2:18:25] As you're coming out of the little
[2:18:26] pocket, it would feel like the runway
[2:18:29] would have to be long enough. and at
[2:18:32] least how it's shown there with the
[2:18:33] entry and exit to Chevron
[2:18:36] and this parking lot I guess or I guess
[2:18:39] that's the bank and pioneer but it
[2:18:41] doesn't seem like it's long enough and
[2:18:43] that's just one concern is that like you
[2:18:45] need a little bit of time to be able to
[2:18:47] accelerate and compete with the cars
[2:18:49] coming at you from the left and then the
[2:18:51] ones coming from behind you to merge in
[2:18:54] safely and I've found that the ones on
[2:18:56] Alpine
[2:18:58] by Biancini's Questa those are um really
[2:19:01] difficult a lot of times and it makes
[2:19:03] everyone slam on their brakes thinking
[2:19:05] someone's about to pull into the
[2:19:08] traffic.
[2:19:09] >> Great. Thank you, Carolyn.
[2:19:13] » Okay, any other comments?
[2:19:17] >> I have one about the uh stop signs.
[2:19:19] We're all complaining because it's a
[2:19:21] long run coming up from down the hill
[2:19:23] and there are many trucks in the morning
[2:19:24] and I drive it a lot as well. But if
[2:19:27] we're stopped anyway, what about if
[2:19:29] there is a stop sign? It's not going to
[2:19:31] cause us any further delay. It's just
[2:19:33] going to pause us so someone else could
[2:19:35] get out and make the turn into the lane.
[2:19:38] I don't see it as another stall.
[2:19:40] >> Thank you.
[2:19:44] Any other concepts or thoughts? Should
[2:19:47] we go on to the next slide?
[2:19:51] All right. Show of hands. Which concept
[2:19:53] do you support? uh son's com uh concept
[2:19:57] which he'll send to us and we'll get up
[2:20:00] there uh which includes the merger uh
[2:20:03] turn lane. Uh do we want to see hands of
[2:20:06] support to what he described?
[2:20:08] >> Yeah.
[2:20:11] >> Okay.
[2:20:11] >> There's a three-way stop.
[2:20:15] >> Couple three. Great. Okay. Mini
[2:20:18] roundabout.
[2:20:22] » Okay. I actually I think it was brought
[2:20:24] up.
[2:20:26] >> I don't know if that roundabout I mean
[2:20:29] >> talk about semis going around that thing
[2:20:31] the one that has to go when they're
[2:20:32] going eastbound. I don't think they can
[2:20:35] make that turn if you put that slide up.
[2:20:37] >> I mean you ever drive a 60 foot long
[2:20:39] truck?
[2:20:40] >> Uh it that it's got to go up Whiskey
[2:20:43] Hill Road and then back down Woodside
[2:20:45] Road.
[2:20:47] Did they really?
[2:20:48] >> So, Alta um did the design of the
[2:20:51] roundabout. They do roundabouts all over
[2:20:53] the country. And we could ask them, it's
[2:20:57] a great question, and you won't be the
[2:20:58] only one who asks it. So, we could ask
[2:21:01] them to add the truck movement
[2:21:04] simulation um and how a semi or or horse
[2:21:08] trailer um being pulled behind a a truck
[2:21:12] would would get around that. I think
[2:21:14] that's valid. Um,
[2:21:19] okay.
[2:21:24] » Julie,
[2:21:25] >> um, I I mean, if if I'm just looking at
[2:21:28] this in isolation, I like
[2:21:30] Assange's idea about the pulloff, but
[2:21:33] I'm wondering if um it would be worth if
[2:21:36] we're considering one, maybe two
[2:21:38] roundabouts. If we were gonna have two,
[2:21:41] I would think it would be more
[2:21:42] compelling because you get used to that
[2:21:44] pathway. And I know that Stanford did
[2:21:47] this and I have to think they thought
[2:21:49] long and hard about it. And while I
[2:21:51] don't intuitively like them, I'm from
[2:21:52] Massachusetts, they're a nightmare
[2:21:54] there. But um it works well when I'm on Stanford's
[2:22:00] campus and I know they're careful about
[2:22:02] their pedestrians and their students. So
[2:22:03] I wonder if it's worth like small case
[2:22:05] study for to educate us in this and to
[2:22:08] understand if two roundabouts might be
[2:22:10] our most beneficial approach even though
[2:22:12] we all viscerally feel negatively about
[2:22:16] them.
[2:22:16] >> I I did an overlay of of one of the
[2:22:19] Stamford roundabouts on Kinata Woodside
[2:22:21] intersection and it goes pretty much
[2:22:24] from from their building to the corner
[2:22:27] of Roberts. It just isn't enough room
[2:22:29] for it. They're way bigger than what
[2:22:30] would fit in either of these locations.
[2:22:34] So, one one element of this that we
[2:22:36] didn't talk about that I like is the
[2:22:39] whether we did the the the version zero
[2:22:41] or the version one is that you've
[2:22:43] created a better corner here across from
[2:22:46] the bank pioneer. Again, a potentially a
[2:22:49] place for some public art or a gateway
[2:22:51] to the town that could work with the
[2:22:54] Nissan Turn Lane as well too, right? So,
[2:22:56] but the more of these things that'll
[2:22:58] kind of define the town center and have
[2:23:00] the ability to put something cool there.
[2:23:03] >> Yeah, I like that. That's a nice idea.
[2:23:05] >> Great. Thank you,
[2:23:08] >> Troy. Anything else?
[2:23:09] >> I think that's good feedback. And let's
[2:23:13] move on to our last area.
[2:23:17] >> So, uh this is our last area. I think
[2:23:21] it's a fairly short discussion. Uh this
[2:23:24] is basically from Whiskey Hill out
[2:23:26] towards the freeway connecting to the
[2:23:28] east side. Let's go to the next slide.
[2:23:32] So initial feedback members highlighted
[2:23:35] the need to improve access from East
[2:23:37] Woodside by upgrading pedestrian bike
[2:23:39] connections and facilities. Uh cars were
[2:23:42] voted as the highest mode priority
[2:23:44] followed by bicycles. Um so in the uh
[2:23:49] concept one that we're showing here uh
[2:23:51] you have a total width of 45 to 48 ft
[2:23:54] and uh bike lane on the the side going
[2:24:00] out towards uh going east and then
[2:24:03] inboard we would have uh the multi the
[2:24:06] bike lane plus a multi-use pave path in
[2:24:09] the shoulder. Uh the challenge is that
[2:24:11] the street section transforms
[2:24:14] substantially between Whiskey Hill and
[2:24:17] the freeway itself. So uh there are
[2:24:20] varying cost implications that go with
[2:24:22] creating uh pedestrian connectivity
[2:24:24] along that. Um and then the second
[2:24:28] concept was to reopen the pedestrian
[2:24:30] tunnel under I280.
[2:24:33] Um is there another slide, Troy? I think
[2:24:36] that was just a short one. Yeah, that's
[2:24:38] basically it. So I think you know those
[2:24:41] are kind of two ideas to uh there's
[2:24:44] limited options in a way on on this
[2:24:47] stretch of road for enhancing the
[2:24:49] facilities. Um but if there's interest
[2:24:53] in exploring the multi-use paved path um
[2:24:58] you know a closer look at all those
[2:24:59] shoulder conditions would determine you
[2:25:02] know where does it get really expensive
[2:25:04] to expand that shoulder to accommodate
[2:25:07] that movement. Are you thinking of that
[2:25:08] on the on the uh south or the north side
[2:25:12] of what's
[2:25:12] >> north? Excuse me. Excuse me. North the
[2:25:15] north side where the shoulder is wider
[2:25:18] >> on the north side. So the Okay. So the
[2:25:20] opposite of where
[2:25:21] >> tunnel
[2:25:22] >> that's that why they're talking about
[2:25:23] the tunnel that's over. Yeah.
[2:25:25] >> You could connect that up then with the
[2:25:26] tunnel.
[2:25:27] >> The path that's going from Alama to 280
[2:25:29] is on the south side, right?
[2:25:34] » On the other side of the freeway.
[2:25:36] >> Yes. So there's a So the town is getting
[2:25:38] ready to install a pathway on the south
[2:25:40] side of
[2:25:41] >> Woodside Road from the high school
[2:25:43] basically to 280.
[2:25:44] >> Okay.
[2:25:45] >> And so there would need to be a cross do
[2:25:47] a cross over and then switch to the
[2:25:49] north side, but just wanted to make sure
[2:25:50] you guys knew that.
[2:25:51] >> Yeah, that's a good point.
[2:25:52] >> Yeah, thank you.
[2:25:53] >> Um and I don't know that the tunnel's
[2:25:55] closed.
[2:25:56] >> I think it's open, but it's not there's
[2:25:59] not great connectivity to it, but you
[2:26:01] can I think you can walk through there
[2:26:02] today.
[2:26:03] >> Okay. Maybe it's a question of
[2:26:04] enhancement and sort of rehab.
[2:26:07] >> The problem is it really doesn't go
[2:26:09] anywhere is that the the pro the
[2:26:10] challenge with the tunnel is there's not
[2:26:12] good connectivity to Woodside Heights or
[2:26:14] to this new path that's getting fixed.
[2:26:16] So if if it'd be a nice way to create
[2:26:18] connectivity from Woodside Heights to
[2:26:20] Town Center, I'm sorry, Woodside Hills
[2:26:22] with the addition of there would need to
[2:26:24] be some new um access because the only
[2:26:27] way to get through is almost all the way
[2:26:28] to Barkley Park. So there's not any cut
[2:26:31] through currently that could get you to,
[2:26:33] you know, kind of the middle of Woodside
[2:26:34] Hills. That's that will be the challenge
[2:26:35] in this model.
[2:26:37] >> So people aren't using it currently.
[2:26:40] >> There's a limited limited use
[2:26:42] pedestrians. I don't think there's any
[2:26:43] equestrians anymore that use it, but
[2:26:45] it's very limited because it's hard to
[2:26:47] get to the tunnel from Woodside Hills.
[2:26:50] You can either do it through Barkley
[2:26:52] Park or there's a fenced off alleyway
[2:26:55] that's a like a P Genesis access to it
[2:26:57] that's hard to squeeze through.
[2:26:59] And to come through Barklay Park, you
[2:27:02] have to go through the holes in the
[2:27:03] fence.
[2:27:04] >> Yeah. So, it's a long So, it's not great
[2:27:06] to It's a great idea.
[2:27:08] Love the idea of connectivity between
[2:27:10] what and the residents are would like
[2:27:11] connectivity under the freeway to Town
[2:27:13] Center,
[2:27:14] >> but I think it's very separate than this
[2:27:16] idea, which is think about a safe route
[2:27:18] to school for kids going from town
[2:27:20] center to Woodside High,
[2:27:22] >> right? Which wouldn't inv you couldn't
[2:27:23] involve the tunnel.
[2:27:24] >> They're completely independent ideas.
[2:27:26] >> Yeah, they're two separate ideas. I I
[2:27:29] think it would be great if if the shared
[2:27:31] use path could stay on the south side,
[2:27:33] but the road is right up against the
[2:27:35] bank there. It would be if it if money
[2:27:38] weren't an object, you just move the
[2:27:40] road over 8 ft and pit it on that side.
[2:27:42] But I think money probably is a huge
[2:27:44] object in this case. So, we're going to
[2:27:47] need two crosswalks to
[2:27:48] >> people can cross.
[2:27:50] >> Okay, great.
[2:27:53] All right. Any other comments on this
[2:27:56] before we Yes, Sue.
[2:27:59] >> For me, it would be helpful to see a
[2:28:00] bird's eyee view of Woodside Road from
[2:28:03] the little store or or Kings Mountain to
[2:28:06] Whiskey Hill so I could see the tur the
[2:28:10] deterred lanes and you know we've seen
[2:28:12] in segments but see how everything
[2:28:14] continues together. Thank you.
[2:28:16] >> Great. Yeah, we'll definitely get there
[2:28:18] as soon as we start piecing the
[2:28:20] different ideas together. For sure.
[2:28:22] Um,
[2:28:23] >> yeah, I think that's a great idea. That
[2:28:25] could be something in the final plan
[2:28:26] that really paints the picture of what
[2:28:28] the vision that we want to see for this
[2:28:30] whole area. I think that'll
[2:28:31] >> the pieces will fit together a little
[2:28:33] better there.
[2:28:35] All right. Um, well, this is kind of all
[2:28:37] the ideas we put on the table tonight.
[2:28:39] You guys had some new ideas that um
[2:28:42] we're going to add into the mix and a
[2:28:44] couple that we're going to kind of
[2:28:45] modify and generate new ideas. So,
[2:28:47] really, really helpful feedback. Um,
[2:28:51] thank you for that. Um, so I know we're
[2:28:54] a little over time. Um, but we're just
[2:28:57] going to do a quick uh housing
[2:29:00] discussion and then we'll move to public
[2:29:02] comment and closing.
[2:29:04] >> Um, so just quickly uh I'll choose this.
[2:29:07] It's fine. Um, so just quickly kind of
[2:29:10] pulling ourselves back over to housing.
[2:29:12] Um, I know we had a lot of talk about
[2:29:15] transportation at this meeting and the
[2:29:17] last meeting, but also housing has been
[2:29:18] on our agenda. Um, and so I think we're
[2:29:21] aware of some of the key issues is that
[2:29:23] there's a lot of constraints and we were
[2:29:25] talking about some of them tonight about
[2:29:26] why um, properties may not de develop or
[2:29:30] redevelop. Um, we have small parcels, we
[2:29:33] have zoning, we have parking
[2:29:35] requirements, other restrictions, you
[2:29:37] have the ballot measures which limit
[2:29:39] your building heights. Um, so before we
[2:29:41] even talk about those purple boxes, we
[2:29:43] would need to talk about um, building
[2:29:45] heights and ballot measures. Um,
[2:29:47] adaptive reuse is not really currently
[2:29:50] allowed. Um, workforce housing is not
[2:29:53] really a thing. Um, and as we all know,
[2:29:56] the housing we're were here in part
[2:29:58] largely because the housing element
[2:30:00] asked us to look at housing in the town
[2:30:03] center and you know, we took the
[2:30:04] opportunity to look at parking and
[2:30:06] transportation as well. But, uh,
[2:30:08] originally housing was sort of the
[2:30:10] genesis for this effort. Um and you know
[2:30:13] we we went out to the community in the
[2:30:16] first sort of phase and there was a lot
[2:30:18] of split opinions um kind of down the
[2:30:20] middle on housing. Um so that's where we
[2:30:23] are today. Um so last time we met as a
[2:30:27] group and we kind of ran out of time at
[2:30:29] the end to to talk about housing. So we
[2:30:32] sent you guys home with a little
[2:30:33] homework um and a survey and so kind of
[2:30:36] just wanted to circle back on that and
[2:30:39] kind of report out the results. Uh we
[2:30:42] asked you know should this group should
[2:30:44] housing be allowed in the town center
[2:30:46] and overall um you know over threearters
[2:30:49] of you said yes uh for one reason or
[2:30:52] another. The biggest reason being the
[2:30:54] design of that housing um being
[2:30:57] important and that it's aligned with you
[2:30:59] know some of the needs um workforce
[2:31:02] needs and other needs that we were
[2:31:04] talking about. Um, so just kind of
[2:31:06] putting that back out to the group. That
[2:31:08] was the consensus. Um, of course there
[2:31:11] are some folks who are no unsure. Um,
[2:31:14] but that was kind of where we landed.
[2:31:16] And then specifically we asked, you
[2:31:19] know, okay, yes, housing, well, what
[2:31:21] does that mean to you? Um, and generally
[2:31:25] most folks fell in the twostory range
[2:31:28] being what felt right. Few folks said,
[2:31:31] you know, keep it lower and a few folks
[2:31:33] said keep it go higher to go three
[2:31:35] stories. Um but there was generally um
[2:31:40] not interest in in larger scale
[2:31:42] developments and there was some other
[2:31:45] comments about you know how it's
[2:31:46] important that we'll need to provide
[2:31:48] parking um for for new housing.
[2:31:52] So um that was the feedback we received
[2:31:55] and now this chart is just I'll just
[2:31:56] summarize it briefly but I just wanted
[2:31:58] to kind of convey that as you know we've
[2:32:00] been talking here a lot of these ideas
[2:32:02] are are longer term concepts and
[2:32:05] policies that will ultimately result in
[2:32:07] something but this plan itself does not
[2:32:10] build housing per se or build a new road
[2:32:13] per se but we're going to go through
[2:32:14] this process we'll have these meetings
[2:32:17] we'll go through a sequel process we'll
[2:32:19] adopt the plan which which will contain
[2:32:21] policy statements and then those could
[2:32:24] result in the first step being
[2:32:26] potentially a ballot measure to change
[2:32:28] some of the current ballot measures in
[2:32:30] place. Um that would be a prerequisite
[2:32:33] for certain types of housing
[2:32:34] development. There are also options that
[2:32:37] could proceed with just zoning action by
[2:32:39] staff or council. um that wouldn't
[2:32:42] necessarily require ballot measures, but
[2:32:44] you could have a ballot measure followed
[2:32:45] by a zoning change and then that would
[2:32:47] result in either the private property
[2:32:50] owner choosing voluntarily of their own
[2:32:52] desire to redevelop under a new zoning
[2:32:55] regime or in the case of if it's a
[2:32:58] public property like the village hill,
[2:32:59] the town would you partner with a
[2:33:01] developer. Um, but just to lay out kind
[2:33:03] of the steps here that starts with
[2:33:05] policy, it goes potentially to the
[2:33:07] ballot box, then it goes to zoning
[2:33:10] changes, and then we see development
[2:33:12] itself. So, we're a few steps removed um
[2:33:15] from that. Uh, but with that, I just
[2:33:18] wanted to give ourselves a little bit
[2:33:19] more space and time to talk about
[2:33:21] housing. Um, if there's any additional
[2:33:23] feedback that you particularly would
[2:33:26] like for us to convey to the council as
[2:33:28] we go next week, um, now is the time to
[2:33:31] share it with us. Um, so I'll just open
[2:33:34] the floor there.
[2:33:39] » Yeah. So, a bunch of comments. I think
[2:33:41] it would be wise as the town to focus uh
[2:33:46] particular attention on parcels the town
[2:33:50] controls. The town holds fee title to
[2:33:53] whether that's village hill or it's the
[2:33:56] parcel adjoining town hall. I I would
[2:33:59] prioritize those. I think those have the
[2:34:02] most potential where the town staff has
[2:34:06] full power. No incentives are needed.
[2:34:09] the town could perhaps contribute some
[2:34:13] part or all of that land to a developer,
[2:34:16] allowing that developer to step in and
[2:34:20] presumably as a nonprofit fund the
[2:34:22] buildout of housing. Uh it eliminates
[2:34:26] the third party. It eliminates a third
[2:34:28] party uh private property owner. I'm not
[2:34:31] saying it can't be done on private
[2:34:33] property, but again, Town Center is
[2:34:35] very, very small, relatively small with
[2:34:39] a number of parcels that are extremely
[2:34:41] small. And today, we haven't focused on
[2:34:44] the bigger parcels owned by private
[2:34:46] property, presumably because they've
[2:34:48] gone through the same process others
[2:34:51] have gone through. They've already been
[2:34:52] built out. They're already occupied. Um,
[2:34:55] there's likely going to be no change. So
[2:34:57] that tells me if I'm the town, it's wise
[2:35:00] to focus on those parcels where I have
[2:35:02] control and in town center there are two
[2:35:04] of them. Uh second is at the beginning
[2:35:08] of the meeting we talked about Sage
[2:35:09] talked about policy setting policy and
[2:35:12] yet I don't see that on this final
[2:35:15] slide. So my idea would be it may be
[2:35:18] wise to add something in here about
[2:35:21] policy. Maybe that's a separate line, a
[2:35:24] separate option. Option four, step one.
[2:35:28] I don't know, but you may want to flush
[2:35:31] that all out. Oh, okay. So, yeah. So, I
[2:35:36] haven't seen this. So, the earlier ones,
[2:35:38] okay, council approves zoning changes.
[2:35:41] Okay. But I still don't see policy
[2:35:44] updates. I see zoning changes in option
[2:35:48] three and four. So my idea would be to
[2:35:50] add a fifth option.
[2:35:52] >> Sure.
[2:35:53] >> Good point.
[2:35:53] >> Final item. What's going to town council
[2:35:57] and when is it going? Is it a does it
[2:36:00] require a staff report by good city
[2:36:03] company? A staff report by Sage and O
[2:36:05] overview by stage and Sage. And when
[2:36:09] does that go out? When does the public
[2:36:11] see it?
[2:36:12] >> Are you asking about next week's
[2:36:13] meeting? Yeah. And staff, do you want to
[2:36:15] or do you want me to take that?
[2:36:19] So the staff report will be worked on uh
[2:36:21] I believe between Good City and the and
[2:36:25] uh Sage we will have a combined staff
[2:36:27] report and the agenda packet will go out
[2:36:29] no later than this Friday and the
[2:36:31] meeting is on Tuesday, April 28th at 7
[2:36:35] p.m.
[2:36:36] >> Great. Thanks.
[2:36:44] Um, I apologize if we've seen this in
[2:36:47] the past, but I think it's hard to say
[2:36:50] yes or no without having a sense of the
[2:36:52] magnitude. I can't remember how many um
[2:36:56] units the town has to build, how many
[2:36:58] they have agreed upon in different
[2:37:00] places, whether those are still moving
[2:37:02] forward or not. Are we talking five or
[2:37:05] 100 units in town? Um, I think that's
[2:37:08] all really important context. Uh,
[2:37:11] because yeah, maybe some two-story
[2:37:12] buildings to have a few apartments is
[2:37:14] one thing, but you know, it it really it
[2:37:17] really changes depending on um that
[2:37:20] order of magnitude.
[2:37:22] And um
[2:37:25] when you get to some of the public
[2:37:27] spaces, I think that we also have to
[2:37:30] think about the trade-offs that we've
[2:37:32] been talking about in terms of keeping
[2:37:34] Woodside rustic and having gathering
[2:37:37] spaces and protecting our trails and our
[2:37:39] equestrian areas. Um, I live close to
[2:37:42] Village Hill and I know that all of the
[2:37:44] neighbors in that area and those around
[2:37:47] Mountain Home would feel, you know,
[2:37:50] really wronged in so many ways if there
[2:37:52] were to be development there, never mind
[2:37:55] what it would do to the character of our
[2:37:57] town to lose that area with the horses.
[2:38:03] So quick ad, I agree with that statement
[2:38:05] in full and I think it ties back to the
[2:38:07] statement I made at the very first
[2:38:10] meeting. The town has the best
[2:38:12] affordable housing site available to it.
[2:38:15] It's at Kinyatta College. The state
[2:38:17] really needs to step in here and satisfy
[2:38:20] that requirement itself. Utilities are
[2:38:24] there, storm drains are there, sewers
[2:38:26] are there, water, electric, power, it's
[2:38:30] all set to go. You have all those
[2:38:33] engineering constraints. Again,
[2:38:35] technically possible
[2:38:37] but difficult.
[2:38:40] Uh you have it all in place there. So it
[2:38:43] almost seems to me like the best
[2:38:45] solution perhaps in parallel is a
[2:38:47] political solution behind closed doors
[2:38:50] with the state to trade something for
[2:38:53] the state to step in and take that land
[2:38:56] and use it. It's gorgeous. affordable
[2:39:00] housing up there would make so much
[2:39:02] sense and change the requirement to
[2:39:05] accommodate a town like Woodside that is
[2:39:07] very unique with parcels that are
[2:39:09] predominantly built out, highly rural,
[2:39:13] hardly any commercial to its detriment.
[2:39:15] It relies on property taxes. Um where's
[2:39:18] that housing going to go in sufficient
[2:39:21] numbers? This is an edict from on high
[2:39:24] at rates that make no sense in this
[2:39:26] town. They make no sense in Athetherton
[2:39:28] either. It's crazy. There's an incentive
[2:39:31] though to work behind closed doors with
[2:39:33] the state to do something. I'd love to
[2:39:36] see you guys do something up there uh
[2:39:40] state and town design something great.
[2:39:45] » Great. Any other thoughts about town
[2:39:47] center housing?
[2:39:49] >> So, I I liked the direction in our last
[2:39:53] meeting where this went. I I felt like
[2:39:55] there was some consensus that said well
[2:39:57] you saw the numbers there which was
[2:40:00] don't force anybody to do anything but
[2:40:03] allow for appropriately designed denser
[2:40:05] housing in the town center corridor
[2:40:07] which broadly would be from aces to kind
[2:40:10] of down by Kings Mountain along Woodside
[2:40:11] Road right there's there um over the
[2:40:14] next 25 years if I'm a property owner
[2:40:17] and all of a sudden my land is worth two
[2:40:19] or three times as much because I can add
[2:40:21] you know I can either keep it a single
[2:40:23] family home or add a little bit of
[2:40:25] density again in with in moderation.
[2:40:27] Nobody's talking about San Mateo or
[2:40:29] crazy big stuff. I I felt like that was
[2:40:32] a pretty good compromise and would be if
[2:40:35] I was a homeowner along Woodside Road,
[2:40:36] I'd kind of all of a sudden my land's
[2:40:38] worth three times more, I'd feel pretty
[2:40:40] good about it. Um, and I discussed that
[2:40:42] with a bunch of a bunch of residents and
[2:40:44] people thought that made sense. Um the other thing that you know happened
[2:40:50] recently was a couple of council
[2:40:52] meetings ago there were kind of a we had
[2:40:54] a very full room of pitchforks and
[2:40:56] torches over this um proposal to uh take
[2:41:01] CALR land and build a highdensity
[2:41:03] housing on it um off of Farm Hill. And
[2:41:06] so, you know, about 40 I just think we I
[2:41:08] want to make sure we're all sensitive to
[2:41:10] about 40% of the town's residents live
[2:41:12] in Woodside Hills and Woodside Heights
[2:41:14] east of 280 and they feel crammed down
[2:41:17] on where all of the dense housing. They
[2:41:20] feel like it's all being stuck on them.
[2:41:21] And so the the Kinata Roads, I think,
[2:41:23] far enough away maybe there's some more
[2:41:25] insulation, but those guys feel like,
[2:41:27] you know, how come the rest of Woodside
[2:41:29] isn't taking on its fair share and doing
[2:41:31] some anywhere else? And so I just wanted
[2:41:34] to make sure you guys understood those
[2:41:35] feelings coming from 40% of our
[2:41:37] residents that they're they're like it's
[2:41:39] just seems silly to them. We wouldn't do
[2:41:41] a little or some in the town center
[2:41:43] corridor because it just you know it's where would be walkable to retail
[2:41:47] and walkable to the store and where
[2:41:49] you'd put town employees, all that kind
[2:41:51] of stuff. So that's the that's the
[2:41:53] sentiment I get from our residents,
[2:41:54] those two things.
[2:41:58] But I think for housing that the town
[2:42:02] would be well served to look, you know,
[2:42:04] to the missing middle as they say in
[2:42:06] planning for housing to to allow people
[2:42:09] much like Dan is saying to allow people
[2:42:11] to do more on their houses particularly
[2:42:14] if it's in good locations to
[2:42:16] transportation and utilities and
[2:42:18] whatnot. I think instead of trying to
[2:42:20] look for projects the town can build
[2:42:22] except for maybe a few. Uh if we if we
[2:42:26] change zoning to allow uh higher
[2:42:29] densities in the right locations and let
[2:42:32] people do that on a small scale, we're
[2:42:34] going to be much better served than
[2:42:35] institutionalsized
[2:42:37] projects. Uh I think there's some
[2:42:39] evidence that that uh you know one-off
[2:42:42] projects with small numbers of units is
[2:42:45] actually cheaper to build than than mega
[2:42:47] projects. This is mega projects depend
[2:42:49] on public funding, but it's cheaper to
[2:42:52] build ADUs basically or forplexes for
[2:42:54] that matter.
[2:43:00] » I don't have much to add. I think Daniel
[2:43:02] said it very well. I mean, the the
[2:43:04] impact has to be spread around. Now I
[2:43:06] get Richard thinks that it's great to
[2:43:08] put it all at Kinyatta College unless
[2:43:10] you live next to Kinyatta College and
[2:43:12] it's not necessarily
[2:43:14] I I know the people who live near
[2:43:16] Village Hill think that it's going to be
[2:43:19] an abortion to put something on Village
[2:43:21] Hill but that load has to be spread
[2:43:23] throughout town. Now, I appreciate that,
[2:43:26] you know, we've seen Village Hill
[2:43:28] vacant, or at least I've seen it vacant
[2:43:30] for 68 years, but, you know, things
[2:43:32] might need to change and, you know,
[2:43:34] somebody might have to look at that.
[2:43:36] And, you know, I, you know, I don't
[2:43:39] think you can pack them all into one
[2:43:41] person's district or one certain area in
[2:43:43] this town. I think it's got to be spread
[2:43:45] throughout. And like Steve Buben says,
[2:43:48] um, maybe there's got to be more like a
[2:43:51] overall town zoning overlay. So, right
[2:43:53] next to your house, somebody could put
[2:43:55] up a 4unit, you know, multif family
[2:43:57] thing. It's it should be throughout
[2:44:00] town. I mean, we're seeing it with
[2:44:02] actually I guess you can have four ADUs
[2:44:04] in your main residence. We're already
[2:44:06] looking at five. So, you know, that's
[2:44:10] maybe the the way it should go. But I
[2:44:11] don't think anything should be a sacred
[2:44:13] cow. I think you know it's village hill
[2:44:15] or it's this you know parcel next to the
[2:44:18] museum where the gazebo somebody
[2:44:20] mentioned the gazebo that was going I
[2:44:22] think down in the there's a valley here
[2:44:24] below the uh the museum but uh I think everybody's
[2:44:31] going to have to see some intense
[2:44:34] housing intensity but it shouldn't be
[2:44:35] just
[2:44:37] pushed out to one area so
[2:44:44] It's not. It's idiotic. But you're now
[2:44:46] actually
[2:44:48] what the state wants is idiotic, which
[2:44:50] Richard pointed out, but I don't know.
[2:44:52] We are living in a state that maybe some
[2:44:55] things are idiotic.
[2:44:57] >> Okay. Well,
[2:45:00] >> now back to the one of the on the slide
[2:45:03] of one of the choices was adaptive
[2:45:05] reuse. And actually you brought it up at
[2:45:07] one of the meetings that you'd be cons
[2:45:09] Nobody came to you and said, "Well, how
[2:45:11] about if I want to open up the hotel and
[2:45:13] put housing up there or put something on
[2:45:15] top of Gilbert Center?" So I think the
[2:45:18] >> Yeah. So
[2:45:20] >> not under our watch,
[2:45:22] >> but I think adaptive reuse of those
[2:45:24] areas in town center, I mean, and so it
[2:45:27] kind of goes against what Richard says.
[2:45:29] Nobody's going to want to modify their
[2:45:32] current structures. Um, but maybe
[2:45:34] somebody here would. So, or as you were
[2:45:38] saying, Troy, you know, we're looking at
[2:45:40] a plan that's got to last the next 50
[2:45:42] years. So,
[2:45:45] if the possibilities are there, it could
[2:45:48] make a big difference. So, that's what
[2:45:51] that's got to be decided. Now,
[2:45:53] >> I would echo the remarks of the last few
[2:45:55] speakers about um having the council
[2:45:58] seriously consider
[2:46:01] um having a zoning overlay to allow
[2:46:03] individual property owners to develop a
[2:46:06] single family lot to something more
[2:46:08] intense like a forplex, something along
[2:46:11] those lines. Um, it's probably also
[2:46:14] worth pointing out that unfortunately
[2:46:17] when we start talking about multifamily
[2:46:19] housing,
[2:46:21] the reality is if you
[2:46:25] um lots that are developed more
[2:46:27] intensely,
[2:46:28] um, implicit in that is they have to be
[2:46:32] um, very adjacent to a sewer line and
[2:46:35] that really geographically limits what
[2:46:38] parts of Woodside that burden falls on.
[2:46:41] And that just unfortunately for Woodside
[2:46:44] that's reality.
[2:46:58] All right. Um appreciate the feedback.
[2:47:00] Lots of good thoughts. Um I think we can
[2:47:02] take these different ideas and opinions
[2:47:05] and carry these forward faithfully to
[2:47:07] the council. Um and then we'll circle
[2:47:10] back with this group next time. Um just
[2:47:13] for your information, there's some talk
[2:47:14] been some talk about kind of financial
[2:47:16] feasibility and all that. We we are
[2:47:18] doing our team some analysis of um
[2:47:21] residential feasibility, what it would
[2:47:24] look like for a site to realistically
[2:47:26] develop with residential. So I think
[2:47:28] that will help a little bit provide some
[2:47:30] color with some of the questions Dan and
[2:47:32] Richard were talking about in terms of
[2:47:33] is it really realistic? And we'll have a
[2:47:35] little bit more clarity on that. um when
[2:47:38] we come back. But I think for that now,
[2:47:41] unless there's any clo closing comments,
[2:47:43] we'll move to the public comment
[2:47:46] section. Julie,
[2:47:55] » and just a note for those online, if you
[2:47:57] would like to make a comment, please use
[2:47:58] the raise hand feature and we'll call on
[2:48:00] you when it's your turn to speak.
[2:48:03] >> Thalia Lubin, is this word? Thalia
[2:48:05] Luben. um sort of bits and pieces of
[2:48:08] comments. Um
[2:48:12] if if we can do anything to slow or stop
[2:48:16] the through traffic in Woodside,
[2:48:19] um I think that would alleviate a lot of
[2:48:22] problems. Um you could put in four stop
[2:48:25] signs as far as I'm concerned and maybe
[2:48:27] it would go on ways that you can't cut
[2:48:30] through town when northbound 280 is
[2:48:33] backed up. We live off Kinyatta Road and
[2:48:35] there's days where I can't even get onto
[2:48:38] Kinyatta Road. Uh I did go to Jean
[2:48:41] Savvery and ask her about this whole
[2:48:44] ways situation. She says those are
[2:48:46] public roads. We can't really do
[2:48:48] anything
[2:48:50] to change the mapping and when the
[2:48:52] freeway shuts down. Um
[2:48:56] I So that's one idea. Uh maybe we need
[2:48:59] to back out and look at a master plan
[2:49:01] and try to divert traffic Whiskey Hill,
[2:49:04] Sand Hill to Portola Road. So if you
[2:49:07] want to go to La Honda and you're coming
[2:49:09] through Woodside,
[2:49:11] that's going to be your best route
[2:49:12] because the rest of town is going to
[2:49:14] have too many narrow lanes and stop
[2:49:16] signs. So I'd like to kind of look at
[2:49:18] the bigger picture of this whole thing.
[2:49:22] Um,
[2:49:23] other idea to Sue's point, I think if
[2:49:26] the back alley were turned into a a more
[2:49:30] pleasant street,
[2:49:32] you would be okay to park there and walk
[2:49:34] to the bank from the post office, maybe,
[2:49:37] you know. So, so I think the concept is great. Um, another idea is we, Steve
[2:49:45] and I have visited a lot of revamped
[2:49:47] downtowns and they have this backend
[2:49:50] parking. Right now, all of us pull out
[2:49:53] of perpendicular
[2:49:55] parking when we back out. And I can tell
[2:49:58] you when I'm at Robert's, if I'm on
[2:50:00] Mountain Home side, I back in cuz I have
[2:50:02] a little car and I can't see coming out
[2:50:06] if I'm backing out. If I could take all
[2:50:09] of you to one of these diagonal backin
[2:50:12] parking situations that we've seen in
[2:50:14] some of these downtowns, I think you
[2:50:17] would all really like it. It really
[2:50:19] works. And it's it's much easier if
[2:50:22] you're heading this direction to back in
[2:50:23] at an angle and then when you get in,
[2:50:26] you can see before you when you're going
[2:50:29] out. Um, and finally, I want to say a
[2:50:32] big thank you to the consultants. Um, I
[2:50:34] think they've done a great job and as an
[2:50:37] architect I hear some of you, some of
[2:50:40] your comments are like they've already
[2:50:42] built it and look out. And I think what
[2:50:45] we're trying to do here is come out with
[2:50:47] a master plan that will last for a long
[2:50:50] time. There may be changes in ownership,
[2:50:52] different buildings, different
[2:50:54] situations.
[2:50:55] Um,
[2:50:57] so I'd like to see us come out with a
[2:50:59] what I call a conceptual master plan
[2:51:01] that we can refer to and and implement
[2:51:05] incrementally
[2:51:06] and as situations change, we can have
[2:51:09] more feedback. But um I I would
[2:51:13] appreciate all of your comments, but I'd
[2:51:15] like you to keep your minds open for
[2:51:17] other possibilities and how to feed off
[2:51:19] each other with your ideas so that we
[2:51:22] can make Woodside better, safer,
[2:51:24] prettier. Um some of you may remember
[2:51:27] that Calrans came through and widened
[2:51:30] from Hiendas to Roberts when 280 was
[2:51:33] going in. We had no choice about that.
[2:51:36] we have a choice about this and we can
[2:51:38] all have input and and make it better.
[2:51:41] So, thank you.
[2:51:47] » Moving to the speakers online, um Lee
[2:51:50] Prince.
[2:51:59] Good evening.
[2:52:02] Uh my name is Lee Prince. I am a land
[2:52:04] use attorney representing Roberts. I
[2:52:07] want to thank everyone for the good
[2:52:09] discussion tonight regarding these
[2:52:10] transportation concepts. Some of the
[2:52:13] concepts made this evening, some of the
[2:52:15] comments made this evening that led to
[2:52:17] the direction to reook at the area B
[2:52:19] concepts are similar to the comments I
[2:52:21] will make on behalf of Roberts, the main
[2:52:23] property owner impacted by these
[2:52:25] proposals.
[2:52:27] Before I get to specific comments on
[2:52:29] area B, I want to note that the
[2:52:31] objective to prioritize residents over
[2:52:33] visitors by limiting parking contradicts
[2:52:36] the priority to provide for resident
[2:52:38] amenities like outdoor dining that
[2:52:40] require more parking to be viable, both
[2:52:42] from a municipal code parking
[2:52:44] requirement perspective and from a
[2:52:46] financial feasibility perspective.
[2:52:48] Roberts is intimately familiar with the
[2:52:50] financial difficulties associated with
[2:52:52] the impact of limited parking in this
[2:52:54] commercial area of town. And from
[2:52:56] Robert's perspective, the concept
[2:52:58] proposals for area B, rather than being
[2:53:01] an improvement, will place a burden on
[2:53:03] Roberts, which I heard the consultant
[2:53:04] say is not the goal of these concepts.
[2:53:09] Moving the concepts in area B forward
[2:53:12] should be paused until the Roberts and
[2:53:14] the town can dig into the issue of the
[2:53:16] size of the private parcel and the scope
[2:53:18] of the public right ofway. Roberts has
[2:53:20] information that contradicts the
[2:53:22] depiction of the parcel, not including
[2:53:23] the full market property, as it is
[2:53:25] generally understood. Roberts is unaware
[2:53:28] that the town owns any of this land.
[2:53:30] Until these issues are resolved, it is
[2:53:32] difficult to plan and understand what
[2:53:34] options may be reasonable or legally
[2:53:36] possible. With respect to parking, even
[2:53:39] if the number of parking spaces is
[2:53:41] retained, Roberts is opposed to moving
[2:53:43] the parking away from the store or
[2:53:45] across the street from the store. Both
[2:53:47] from an operational and safety
[2:53:48] perspective, think customers carrying
[2:53:50] grocery bags, and from an economic
[2:53:53] perspective, as fewer people may
[2:53:54] patronize the market if they are
[2:53:56] concerned about finding parking and or
[2:53:57] crossing the street. Roberts is
[2:54:00] concerned that the parking as these
[2:54:02] concepts propose it will get used for
[2:54:04] other purposes, not for market parking
[2:54:06] with no enforcement mechanism, which
[2:54:08] would further constrain the market's
[2:54:10] parking and negatively impact the store.
[2:54:13] Roberts is also concerned about
[2:54:14] programming for any adjacent park. This
[2:54:17] programming could impact availability of
[2:54:19] parking spaces for the market. A farmers
[2:54:22] market will take away from Robert's
[2:54:23] customer base. This happens every week
[2:54:25] at the Portola Valley store on Thursday
[2:54:28] when the town hosts the farmers market.
[2:54:30] To answer the question presented
[2:54:32] earlier, Christine is not interested in
[2:54:34] these gathering spaces adjacent to the
[2:54:36] market. Perhaps this type of space could
[2:54:38] be moved consistent with measure A near
[2:54:40] town hall. Trucks cannot back on
[2:54:43] Woodside. Trucks cannot get back on
[2:54:45] Woodside Road without the slip lane,
[2:54:47] which will impact the concept one. Um, I
[2:54:50] would recommend that the town take a
[2:54:51] step back from these concepts and work
[2:54:53] one-on-one with Christine to develop a
[2:54:55] solution that would be amenable to the
[2:54:56] market and its operations. I really
[2:54:59] appreciate your time this evening. Thank
[2:55:00] you.
[2:55:11] There are no other raised hands online.
[2:55:28] My name is Bill Gilbert. I'm the other
[2:55:29] half. Um,
[2:55:33] what I heard a lot of ideas and that,
[2:55:35] but I support Roberts, Christine
[2:55:38] Roberts, and her concerns, and I would
[2:55:40] hope you folks work with her to get it
[2:55:44] resolved. Uh, number one, I had uh bumps
[2:55:50] put in my easement going down the back
[2:55:52] here. They've been torn up by the
[2:55:55] vigilantes of the bicycles.
[2:56:00] I think we need permanent bumpers there.
[2:56:02] It's It's a town easement and I I
[2:56:05] haven't asked, but I am going to ask and
[2:56:07] I think that'll mitigate the speed back
[2:56:10] there, which is very dangerous. I I I'm
[2:56:13] here every day when I'm in in town and
[2:56:16] they uh they just speed certain people
[2:56:20] speed back there like 30 40 miles an
[2:56:23] hour. It's unbelievable. So if the
[2:56:26] bumpers were permanent asphalt like you
[2:56:29] have, I think that would mitigate that.
[2:56:33] And then on Mountain Home Road, will you
[2:56:36] exit our property down there? If you I
[2:56:40] don't know if you can do this, but if
[2:56:41] you can make some u uh speed changes
[2:56:45] where they make them speed uh downgrade
[2:56:48] to 10 miles an hour, then that would
[2:56:51] help a lot because these guys when they
[2:56:53] get off work, they just zip through
[2:56:56] there. Also, at the stop sign uh down
[2:56:59] here at Roberts, they're waiting there
[2:57:02] like race cars. Some of these guys look
[2:57:04] at it at five o'clock. You can't get out
[2:57:07] of here. They're coming up, they come
[2:57:09] out the stop sign, they're coming 30, 40
[2:57:12] miles an hour within a few feet. So I I
[2:57:16] you know, either the enforcement of the
[2:57:18] sheriffs or some uh downgrading of the
[2:57:23] miles per hour. So that's all I got to
[2:57:26] say. Thank you.
[2:57:31] » That was my husband who was in the San
[2:57:34] Francisco Police Department for 30
[2:57:35] years. And part of that time you you led
[2:57:39] the traffic stuff going on there. Yeah.
[2:57:43] Okay. I know it was only one year
[2:57:45] because you were a wild man all the rest
[2:57:46] of the time. He's well known. Anyway,
[2:57:50] he's a legend in the San Francisco
[2:57:52] Police Department, but um everything he
[2:57:56] just said is so true. I forgot to find
[2:57:59] out what's happening from is it
[2:58:03] at the end of our parking lot before we
[2:58:06] go over to Christine's
[2:58:10] to the left. What is that street? Is
[2:58:12] that Mountain Home Road?
[2:58:14] >> Okay. The Is there any kind of a stop
[2:58:16] sign or anything there? Because you we
[2:58:19] have no sight distance there. Anybody
[2:58:21] coming out of our parking lot there?
[2:58:24] Can't see who's coming at them because
[2:58:26] there's a bunch of trees or or built
[2:58:30] wooden things. Not from our property,
[2:58:31] but there. I don't know. Does anybody
[2:58:34] know anybody in the town know about
[2:58:36] that? When you come out of Mountain Home
[2:58:38] Road and you and then you're just about
[2:58:41] to hit back of Christine's restaurant. I
[2:58:45] mean,
[2:58:45] >> come over bridge.
[2:58:46] >> Pardon me. Yeah. when they come over the
[2:58:48] bridge, there's no sight distance coming
[2:58:50] out of our place at all. So, I don't
[2:58:53] know what you can do there. But,
[2:58:54] >> yeah, that could be part of the we
[2:58:57] talked about maybe a crosswalk there or
[2:58:59] some other it'll depend on the the
[2:59:02] >> crosswalk because there's no sight
[2:59:04] distance or
[2:59:05] >> Right. Okay. Maybe it's a crosswalk with
[2:59:07] a stop sign or a flasher. I think it it
[2:59:09] could tie into our um conversation with Christine and and I think we can
[2:59:14] take that take that into under
[2:59:16] advisement as we move forward. So
[2:59:19] >> maybe Lewis can can confirm this, but
[2:59:21] I've heard that the town is looking at
[2:59:24] replacing the bridge there on Ry Creek
[2:59:26] Roach and uh Roberts if that were were
[2:59:30] moved, you know, further east and it
[2:59:32] would give a lot more room for that. We
[2:59:34] could be an opportunity to straighten
[2:59:36] that whole situation out.
[2:59:39] Yeah. Um Steve is correct. Um that
[2:59:42] project, the bridge project, uh Mountain
[2:59:44] Road Bridge, uh over Dry Creek, it is on
[2:59:46] the current draft CIP. Um that's on our
[2:59:50] proposed CIP. So that's something that
[2:59:52] the town would like to look at. Um doing
[2:59:54] something with the bridge itself. In
[2:59:56] terms of um Leanne's question about
[2:59:58] signage, I think the town can definitely
[3:00:00] take a look at that. Maybe through
[3:00:01] circulation committee, we can evaluate
[3:00:03] the signage over there.
[3:00:08] We have another raised hand online. Um
[3:00:11] Christine Roberts, you may speak.
[3:00:18] Can you guys hear me?
[3:00:20] >> Yes, we can.
[3:00:21] >> Okay. Hi. Um sorry I couldn't be there
[3:00:23] in person uh this evening, but I I did
[3:00:25] catch most of the
[3:00:28] um comments. Um and uh there were some
[3:00:35] interesting ideas presented.
[3:00:37] I I think my takeaway from especially my
[3:00:41] part of the project which turned out to
[3:00:44] be um a lot larger when I joined the
[3:00:49] committee. I had no idea that um
[3:00:55] the idea was uh to take away parking
[3:00:58] from my my business. I mean, I I'm
[3:01:01] absolutely kind of stunned
[3:01:04] um that this was presented and seems to
[3:01:08] be okay
[3:01:10] um with the majority of people
[3:01:13] to um includes uh side uh crosswalks
[3:01:20] and stuff. Um,
[3:01:23] so while I I agree there are some issues
[3:01:28] with the intersection
[3:01:30] and a park uh parking space on the
[3:01:33] corner and people back out.
[3:01:36] Um, that that row of parking is just
[3:01:39] essential for my business. To move it
[3:01:42] anywhere else
[3:01:45] uh would be it just wouldn't it wouldn't
[3:01:48] be acceptable uh to me.
[3:01:51] um
[3:01:53] and to put in the backwards 90 degree
[3:01:57] angle or whatever that parking is. Um we
[3:02:00] know we would lose at least three spots.
[3:02:02] It would take out the palm tree that's
[3:02:05] been there for almost a hundred years.
[3:02:08] Um
[3:02:10] so I I look forward to having more
[3:02:12] conversations about this. Um but this
[3:02:16] just was not what I expected to to come
[3:02:18] out of this committee.
[3:02:21] um or this project.
[3:02:23] So, um I mean that's about all I have to
[3:02:26] say at this point.
[3:02:39] » I have a quick question.
[3:02:40] >> Raise hands online.
[3:02:47] » All right. Um thank you Christine. Thank
[3:02:49] you for participating and uh we'll look
[3:02:51] forward to continued conversations with
[3:02:53] you. Um so with that uh did I hear a
[3:02:57] question? Yeah.
[3:02:59] >> Just wondering there was no mention we
[3:03:02] had been discussing uh outdoor dining
[3:03:05] options at our last meeting. Is that
[3:03:08] something that's going to be carried
[3:03:09] through and discussed?
[3:03:12] >> Yeah, great question. So, um, I'll go
[3:03:14] ahead and put up my final couple of
[3:03:17] slides here because, um,
[3:03:20] tonight we were really focused, laser
[3:03:22] focused on transportation. Um, but, uh,
[3:03:26] you know, last time we talked, we talked
[3:03:28] about, um, parking, public space,
[3:03:30] transportation, and housing on land use
[3:03:33] all at once. So, um, what we have on our
[3:03:37] docket is, as you know, we have our
[3:03:39] meeting next Tuesday, a week from
[3:03:41] tonight with council where we'll give
[3:03:43] them really the feedback from this
[3:03:46] group, from the three meetings with this
[3:03:47] group, everything we've heard and
[3:03:48] everything we heard from the community
[3:03:50] in our surveys, and our popups. Um, as I
[3:03:53] said, we'll be doing some residential
[3:03:55] financial feasibility analysis. Um,
[3:03:58] after this council meeting, we'll really
[3:04:00] launch into the next phase of
[3:04:01] engagement. Our survey will be open in
[3:04:03] May. At the next meeting with this
[3:04:06] group, we'll come back to review the
[3:04:07] results of that community engagement,
[3:04:09] but also to to circle back on some of
[3:04:11] the other topics like public space and
[3:04:14] housing that we just didn't get to
[3:04:15] tonight. Um, and then the next meeting
[3:04:18] with the council will be to really
[3:04:20] confirm what we're going to study for
[3:04:22] SQA, what's our SQA approach and our
[3:04:25] scenarios, and then that will kick off
[3:04:28] the EIR. Um and then there'll be another
[3:04:30] final meeting with this group as we're
[3:04:32] kind of putting together the final plan
[3:04:33] to kind of look at it as a group uh the
[3:04:36] policy direction and the concepts but
[3:04:37] that will come later in this year. Um so
[3:04:41] yeah just putting this up again right
[3:04:43] now we have council engagement another
[3:04:46] meeting with this group and then we'll
[3:04:48] go into environmental review. So, we
[3:04:50] probably won't meet with folks here for
[3:04:52] um a couple months, but um you're we
[3:04:57] invite you to come to the council
[3:04:58] meeting next week and share your ideas,
[3:05:00] but we will do our best to convey the
[3:05:03] sentiments of this group and the
[3:05:05] concerns, comments, feedback from this
[3:05:07] group to council um next week. So, with
[3:05:10] that, uh yeah, one quick final
[3:05:13] >> follow on the last comment. Um where are
[3:05:17] we with outdoor dining? And I think that
[3:05:19] may have something to do with a lawsuit
[3:05:21] that town is currently working with and
[3:05:25] maybe we could find out where that is
[3:05:27] right now because the parking that was
[3:05:30] kind of approved by the council and by
[3:05:32] the town got kind of turned around at
[3:05:36] the last minute. So where I think that's
[3:05:39] holding up the outdoor dining is
[3:05:41] certainly at you know bucks and the
[3:05:45] village bakery.
[3:05:47] So the hearing on that was concluded um
[3:05:49] a couple of months ago. The judge asked
[3:05:51] for some additional briefing which has
[3:05:52] all been turned in and we are all just
[3:05:54] awaiting um her decision at this point
[3:05:56] which I assume we will get within the
[3:05:58] next 30 to 60 days at the outside.
[3:06:03] >> And I just uh want to again thank
[3:06:05] everybody for coming. Um and just to
[3:06:07] reiterate again, you know, we're looking
[3:06:09] for this this is a process to create a
[3:06:11] long range planning document. It will
[3:06:15] guide the town with priorities and
[3:06:18] different uh programs to apply. So
[3:06:22] things like outdoor dining and parking
[3:06:24] standards and whether there's
[3:06:26] flexibility for housing of adaptive
[3:06:28] reuse or you know apartments upstairs or
[3:06:30] different things like that, those are
[3:06:32] all again these are going to be things
[3:06:34] that are policy driven. So the final
[3:06:36] document will tell us if we want to
[3:06:37] explore these things further and any
[3:06:40] zoning changes um that come with you
[3:06:44] know expanding making more flexibility
[3:06:48] uh for outdoor dining for different
[3:06:50] types of uses maybe removing some of the
[3:06:52] red tape we talked about some of our
[3:06:54] earlier meetings you know I always use
[3:06:56] the example our code says you need a
[3:06:58] conditional use permit for an ice cream
[3:06:59] store um and so you know we can the goal
[3:07:03] will be coming out of this document to
[3:07:05] then set priorities where we'll start to
[3:07:07] get down into more of the details on
[3:07:09] these specific issues and every zoning
[3:07:12] code change. Um, and a lot of these
[3:07:15] items will be before the public for
[3:07:18] refined comments and and implementation
[3:07:20] at that point. So again, thank you for
[3:07:22] coming and we look forward to kind of
[3:07:24] creating this policy document together
[3:07:26] that looks, you know, forward for the
[3:07:28] next 10, 20 or more years.
[3:07:32] >> Thank you, Sage. And if you have
[3:07:33] comments on your forms you want to turn
[3:07:35] into us, go ahead and and and fill it
[3:07:38] hand those back to us. But uh appreciate
[3:07:40] all the comments and conversation today.
[3:07:42] Thanks all.