[0:00] Okay, we're going to call this city
commission study session part one of the
[0:04] day to uh order. All please rise for the
pledge of allegiance.
[0:10] » I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the
[0:16] republic for which it stands, one nation
under God, indivisible, with liberty and
[0:22] justice for all.
And we begin this meeting as we do with
[0:26] our acknowledgement that the land on
which we gather is the territory of the
[0:29] Ottawa and Chipua peoples who have
stewarded this land through the
[0:32] generations. Thank you for your strength
and resilience in protecting this land
[0:35] and inspiring us to uphold our
responsibilities to do the same. And as
[0:39] we mentioned, this is our first study
session today. There will be a joint
[0:42] session with the planning commission
this evening at our usual 7 o'clock
[0:45] time. This is a time for us just to go
over our strategic plan with David from
[0:49] Future IQ. Uh thank you for coming back
again. We always look forward to seeing
[0:53] you and I will hand it over to Benjamin
to get the conversation started then.
[0:56] » Great. Thank you, Mayor Sham. I just
wanted to acknowledge that Mayor Prom
[0:59] Wilson indicated he's not able to attend
today's meetings. I want to thank the
[1:03] city staff leadership team for being
here. Uh I had shared in the cover memo
[1:07] that the objectives and key results
ultimately uh which will be adopted by
[1:11] the next city commission uh will guide
department level work plans and my
[1:16] co-creation with each department
director of their evaluations and those
[1:20] department level work plans. Um really
the goal the aim for today is for the
[1:26] commission to have a discussion. Uh
David's not going to do the dots on
[1:30] paper sort of thing. He's going to lead
us through this conversation and staff's
[1:34] going to work to distill what we hear
from you and then we'll bring that back
[1:38] uh to you, the language back uh as we
work to form these draft. OKAR so
[1:42] there's clarity along the way and I want
to thank everybody from the public as
[1:46] well as the candidates for city
commissioner are here too. And I'm
[1:49] looking forward to listening a whole
lot. Thank you. Y
[1:51] » and since we don't have a formal um kind
of mic with the clerk over there, she
[1:57] has it for her time, but I just wanted
to remind people to move the mic around
[2:00] as necessary. This is being recorded.
This isn't just for amplification. So,
[2:04] do try to move your mics around if
you're a bit further away from one so
[2:07] that your answers will be on on record.
And with that, I will hand it over to
[2:12] David who is miked.
>> Okay. Well, thank you, Mayor, Council,
[2:15] Commissioners. How are you? Glad to be
back. Um I actually think this is a
[2:19] great point in this conversation,
Benjamin. So to sort of echo your
[2:22] comments, I think this is a a really
important opportunity to take the work
[2:26] of the strategic planning which really
where we ended with the dashboard was s
[2:31] you know some recognition that there was
a set of priorities that the community
[2:34] was talking about that weren't really
well reflected in the city's operations
[2:38] at the at the current stage. So this is
I think the start of a number of
[2:42] conversations where we're going to
explore what would better alignment look
[2:46] like? what are the elements that you
think are are missing or need to be kind
[2:51] of enhanced? Um I do I do want to just
put in a sort of a a point here however
[2:56] that we're talking about
you know a whole city budget right now a
[3:00] fair bit of the city budget I don't know
what the exact figure but I guess it
[3:03] would be 60 or 70% of a city budget it's
going to be basically obligation and
[3:07] it's going to be things that you're
required to provide um the strategic
[3:12] planning work and the visioning work was
really I think looking at what you might
[3:17] call more the discretionary component
right so we didn't really get into the
[3:21] challenging the the the sort of basic
obligation work. So it's not the entire
[3:26] kind of component we're looking at. I
think that's always important to bear in
[3:28] mind that we're going to be talking
about some alignment, but we're not
[3:32] talking about everything that the
city's, you know, required to deliver
[3:35] and so on. I think that's part of what
we'll have to unpack as we go through
[3:38] this conversation. Um what I have um
I've got some data here I want to share
[3:43] with you the results from the survey
that I think everybody at the table here
[3:47] did take as well as a number of the
candidates. Um the point of that survey
[3:52] was really to get your first reaction
about how well aligned or not we are. Um
[3:58] and I I want to walk through today each
pillar. Um and I really am going to ask
[4:04] as commissioners that you like a
conversation. You know what would it
[4:08] look like if it was better? What do we
need to be doing differently to align
[4:11] better? So it's very much an exploration
today. It's not a a decision making. is
[4:16] not a kind of eliminating, but it's
trying to understand what in your mind
[4:21] as commissioners, if we've got a bit of
a gap between what we think we're
[4:25] currently doing and what we think we
should be doing, what does that look
[4:28] like? How do we close that gap? Um, to
show show you some of the data,
[4:32] obviously we're working with these uh
six strategic pillars that were
[4:35] developed through the strategic planning
process.
[4:39] Um, this was data from the strategic
planning process. So this was just
[4:44] looking at we were ranking the pillars
or we're asking the community to rank
[4:47] the pillars in terms of their positive
impact and they all came up as um as
[4:52] important that scale was a one to one to
five scale um the data from the survey
[4:57] and I want to present this really as
preliminary data and for commissioners
[5:01] this is in the material I did in the
output it's in front of you you can use
[5:04] that as a worksheet if you want um this
was asking the question about how well
[5:09] aligned um are the existing budget and
programs of the city with those pillars,
[5:16] right? Um, and one being not at all or
or sorry, very poorly aligned on the
[5:21] left hand side and 10 being very well
aligned on the right hand side. Um, I
[5:25] don't know what your take on that is,
but to me it looks like at best where on
[5:29] a few of them we're kind of maybe in the
middle, right? And as we actually go
[5:33] through the actions, you'll see it
degrade might not be the right word, but
[5:37] there there's less alignment as we go
through. So it was a little bit of a um
[5:42] an epiphany for me actually when I was
looking at this data um because as we go
[5:47] into it you'll see that there are some
areas where there's quite significant
[5:50] misalignment from uh what the budget and
programs are to what you think the city
[5:56] should be doing in reflecting the
community aspirations and it it did give
[6:00] me an insight into to how difficult it
must be to govern as commissioners in
[6:05] that environment where I think there's
and I've watched a number through your
[6:10] meetings and I've often had the sense
that there's oh it doesn't feel quite
[6:13] right we can't quite put our finger on
doesn't feel quite right and I think
[6:17] what this data is going to reflect is
that sort of sense of a tension between
[6:21] you know what you're being presented
with as commissioners from you know the
[6:24] budgets and programs and what you you
know reflect in the community see as uh
[6:29] as the priorities need to be
>> and the fact that we haven't even begun
[6:32] to build a budget with ease in mind
right like this is brand new so it's not
[6:36] surprising that there's
>> not a tremendous amount
[6:39] I think
>> yeah and it's not meant to be at all
[6:42] critical. I mean I think it's like I
mean you're a city obviously that's
[6:45] going through evolution right and you're
dealing with challenges today and the
[6:50] shifting social values and all those
things that are going on and so any city
[6:54] is going to be continually trying to
adapt and evolve as you go forward and
[6:58] that's point of the strategic planning
process was to let's recast our net for
[7:02] the next sort of five or 10 years. Um so
not surprisingly there's some
[7:06] misalignment. I think what I was
speaking to Benjamin is I think that
[7:09] there's some components there. There's
significant misalignment, right? And I
[7:13] think what we're going to have to, you
know, talk about at the table here is
[7:16] well, what does that look like? How do
we what do we need to be tweaking here
[7:19] to change that? So that's at the level
of the pillars, right? I really wanted
[7:23] to spend the time on each one. So the
first pillar was the proactively
[7:27] managing urban design. Obviously, this
was a really interesting and important
[7:31] pillar in the planning process. um the
and I'm going to show you data um at
[7:37] each one of these. So this was from the
dashboard which was the last piece that
[7:41] I presented to you. So under this pillar
we had these four uh action areas design
[7:47] future the corridors uh building
guidelines people centric street design
[7:52] um intentionally design more community
connection points. This was the sort of
[7:57] overall priority that was given by the
community in the prioritization survey.
[8:01] the scale being the darker the color the
higher the priority. Um we then did a
[8:06] sort of a subject very subjective I'll
say but an initial subjective kind of
[8:11] view of what's the city kind of doing
how sort of where does it fit in terms
[8:15] of progress against these action areas.
So the darker the color the more the
[8:20] substantial the the progress. Um and
obviously what started to jump out is we
[8:24] saw some kind of both alignment of you
know priorities and and progress but
[8:28] also some mismatches. Um what I did in
this survey and I asked you as well as
[8:34] the candidates to respond to um was how
well aligned do we think those uh at the
[8:40] level of those actions how well aligned
is the budget and programs to fulfill on
[8:44] those um action areas um and again one
being very poorly aligned um and 10
[8:51] being very well aligned. So you can see
there the some be able to get off the
[8:56] mark, right? And you'll see that as we
go through actually there'll be often
[8:59] there'll be one action that will be you
know perhaps quite low in a in a pillar.
[9:04] Um so I wanted to just this is about but
this is the data I'm going to show you
[9:08] for each of the the pillars. Um I think
I'd love to just kick it around the
[9:13] table. Right. So obviously proactively
proactively manage urban design was seen
[9:20] in the strategic planning as a really
important focus area. I think that was a
[9:24] lot about the the character and the you
know how do you just not become blah
[9:29] anywhere and how do you reser preserve
that sort of authenticity of your
[9:34] community. Um but by your own judgment
5.5 sort of the middle point on this um
[9:40] we're below below the center and
obviously leaning towards the polio
[9:45] line. Um I would love to just perhaps
and I'd like to do this for each one and
[9:49] we go around the table right and hear
from each of the commissioners. What do
[9:53] you think we need to be working on that
would make us better aligned? Right?
[9:58] What what do you think we need to be
thinking about to close that gap? And as
[10:02] you said, Benjamin, we're just going to
listen, right? And we'll obviously going
[10:05] to record this and transcribe it. We
will then take your sort of input and
[10:10] obviously, you know, I think the next
step is we'll be coming back with, well,
[10:13] here's a set of what budgets and
programs could look like. Does this
[10:16] better reflect things, right? But we
really just want to get your pulse,
[10:20] right? And maybe Jackie, we could if we
could start with you and I would just
[10:24] love to go around the table and just
give each of you a chance to say well
[10:28] what what do we need to be thinking
about at the level of budget and
[10:32] programs to get to get stronger
alignment with what are those priorities
[10:37] that come up and Jackie will go with you
and then Tim will come will bring around
[10:40] the table. So Jackie would you like to
take us away? Um well I think that uh
[10:45] obviously focusing on the lowest rated
which is localized building design
[10:50] guidelines. Um there are some
conversations in the planning commission
[10:54] that have started around that. Um
although at at this point um they kind
[11:01] of grew out of a discussion about
exterior cladding materials and what was
[11:07] appropriate and how to interpret what
was in our zoing code. So um if that is
[11:13] a starting point you know the question
is how how far can we take that? Can we
[11:20] um you know within the limitations of
the city charter which apparently uh
[11:28] minimizes our opportunity to use design
guidelines for one and two family
[11:35] dwellings.
But other structures within the city
[11:39] seem to me that they um we could find a
way to um
[11:46] develop some guidelines that would
achieve that preservation of character
[11:51] and authenticity that that was valued in
the prior research.
[11:56] » Yeah.
>> Okay.
[12:00] Tim,
[12:04] » uh, I'll try to make two quick comments
then. I guess I'll I'll start with the
[12:08] not optimistic, then go to the
optimistic one. So, the first uh, gets
[12:12] to design a future key corridors. Um,
planning commission had a corridor
[12:18] master plan 11 years ago, plus or minus,
which was great. Uh but to me it kind of
[12:24] shows that we can say as a community
this is what we want but then largely
[12:30] it's private land and when somebody just
keeps it in the family um because they
[12:37] want their grandchildren to have the
opportunity to develop that empty
[12:39] parking lot or that empty lot someday um
it can be frustrating for the community.
[12:45] So, I'm thinking of 8 Street and the big
corner there. Um, and I just recently
[12:50] heard that, yeah, the the owner, he
wants to be the, you know, for his kids
[12:55] sort of thing. And it's been decades.
So, that can be frustrating for the
[12:59] community because we don't have a lever
to push on. Like the the best thing is
[13:03] probably not from the city, but from the
community to try to use, you know, soft
[13:07] influence uh much like uh the land
conservancy does. they build
[13:11] relationships over decades uh to try to
move things forward and maybe eventually
[13:17] it happens. Um but that's not a very
satisfying answer to say oh maybe in a
[13:23] decade we can get an empty lot to be not
an empty lot. Um so that's the not so
[13:28] optimistic because I'm not sure what the
answer is to encourage private land
[13:32] owners to do something with their land.
Um the numbers three and four to me tie
[13:38] together in my mind at least with the uh
complete streets policy that'll be
[13:43] coming forward soon. Um and I'm very
encouraged by that. You know,
[13:48] Commissioner Stanley and the mayor
worked on an an earlier draft of that uh
[13:54] you know, a few years ago. Um but we got
sidelined for various reasons as a city.
[14:00] Uh, and then more recently, uh,
Commissioner Sha, Mayor Prom, and myself
[14:06] have been working on it with city staff,
uh, and made some real good progress.
[14:10] And I think even though it doesn't
address three and four in those words
[14:15] specifically, I think it's very much
tied to that because it's about, you
[14:18] know, all people being able to get
wherever it is they want to go and
[14:21] feeling comfortable. So, it again, in my
mind, ties to three and four pretty
[14:26] well. So, I'm optimistic for those.
Yeah, it's a it's a really good point
[14:30] because there is like the next step on
this is to think about what tools do we
[14:34] have, right? And you know what capacity
or limitations that we may confront as
[14:38] we go down this path. So, thank you.
>> Um I agree with uh Commissioner Werner
[14:45] about three and four. I think that the
complete streets policy and the advisory
[14:50] board, the future advisory board, we're
really moving forward on that and I hope
[14:54] the 1% uh budget allocation is still
valid.
[15:00] Please
um
[15:04] going up to number one, that's where I
see an issue because they we're working
[15:09] off a 2014 corridors master plan.
That's, you know, 11 years ago, like
[15:15] Commissioner Warner said. And, you know,
in particular, I'm uh worried about
[15:20] Seventh Street. You know, what kind of
corridor is that? Because that's those
[15:24] are the two quarters that that were
specifically called out in this staff
[15:29] generated. Uh how are we doing dashboard
summary thing? Um seventh street and
[15:35] fourth street. 14th Street. So, uh you
know, what kind of corridor is that? Do
[15:42] we need corridors that are more car
centric and other corridors that are
[15:45] more bike and pedestrian centric? Is
Cass a corridor to get north and south?
[15:50] Is is Union a corridor to get north and
south? I I think we need to dig to dig
[15:55] deeper into this. We need a better We
need a more current visioning of how we
[16:00] want to get around. People weren't
riding bikes as much as 11 years ago as
[16:04] they are now. Every year it's
exponentially taking off and which is a
[16:08] great thing, but we need safe ways to
get around town. Um, let's see. And then
[16:13] for the number two,
uh, I'm encouraged by the discussion
[16:18] going on planning commission right now
about materials and sticking to our guns
[16:23] as far as what kind of materials we're
going to use here in Traverse City. I'd
[16:27] also really like to look at pre-approved
ADA plans. Um, I think that would be
[16:32] something that
we may be able to just
[16:38] it may not cost much of anything at all
to have them made or to borrow them from
[16:43] somewhere and then we approve them and
then they are available for for our
[16:47] residents.
>> ADU ADU a
[16:51] » Yeah, ADU, not ADA. Yeah, sorry.
thinking. Yeah,
[16:58] » I'm seeing one and four as things that
we actually can do a little more since
[17:03] that is uh directly dealing with
planning for the future. Not that all of
[17:08] four items don't involve some planning
work. Uh but that is inherent to the
[17:15] goal of those two objectives is to
develop a plan like for number one in
[17:22] the master plan it identified several
key corridors and the planning
[17:26] commission has three of those on their
goals for this coming year. They've
[17:30] already dealt with uh part of the Union
Street corridor but 14th Street and West
[17:36] Front Street are identified in there. So
I'd say that that's aligned with what
[17:41] steps are already being taken. Uh two
and three, well three to a lesser extent
[17:47] because there are things we can change,
but we're not going to be making in the
[17:53] short term uh radical changes to what
our streets look like, our street
[17:58] network. we can change the alignment of
uh parking or the flow of traffic but as
[18:03] we've seen with state street that can be
a process that we learn from and it
[18:09] might require trials here and there and
number two although it is something that
[18:15] according to this data uh there's dis
more disalignment between where we are
[18:22] and where people think we should be with
our budget and programs
[18:28] A lot of that isn't something that we
can directly control to the same extent.
[18:33] Yes, we can put out guidelines, but that
will only affect what new construction
[18:38] happens. And somebody could be very
upset about
[18:43] um their neighbor uh doing a renovation
for their house that they put on all
[18:49] vinyl siding over a brick house and they
put on a metal roof and it clashes with
[18:54] the neighborhood. But if nothing that
they do required a building permit, then
[18:58] at no point would that actually touch
the city permitting and planning zoning
[19:02] process.
>> Okay, thank you.
[19:06] » Um, so lots of good points already. It's
nice coming towards the end. Um, so the
[19:10] one couple things the I appreciated
Jackie's statement basically because I
[19:14] think that's about where I'm at of the
uh building design opportunities.
[19:18] There's things we can work within. It's
starting from a much lower place so
[19:22] it'll take a lot longer to get there.
Um, but the corridors one is one that
[19:27] really stuck out to me because of really
being part of the eighth street
[19:31] redesign, the portion that did get done
a few years ago and knowing how many
[19:35] millions of dollars that took. And I
think Commissioner Warner makes an
[19:38] excellent point. We can't make private
property develop, but that is the point
[19:42] of economic development in corridors is
to try and spur that on to not have
[19:47] people sit on that property. But the
reality that is that costs a lot of
[19:51] money. And so that's where we get into
this budget prioritization is we have a
[19:54] certain amount that goes into streets
and repairs every year just because that
[19:58] is our obligation as a city. But the way
we've ever been able to make any kind of
[20:02] impact is through a lot of grants and a
lot of public opportunities that aren't
[20:06] internal. And so to do that we're going
to have to look at other creative
[20:10] sources. And you know that one I
remember eight street there were a lot
[20:13] of different grants that we used that
were kind of it was very straightforward
[20:17] but it it's kind of like when we talk
about uh the CBBG funding of like yeah
[20:22] this is going to help build pave a
parking lot but that parking lot money
[20:26] that we're paying for is now money that
can go into staffing that we're not
[20:28] allowed to fund and so sometimes we have
to be a little bit more creative and
[20:31] play with that. So, I'm hoping that
comes out in the budget process. But I
[20:35] think that does play a little bit into
three and four too though of the reality
[20:39] is the way we budget now and all the
infrastructure work we have to pick like
[20:43] catch up on after a generation is we
can't redo every street every time we
[20:49] touch one and some of it is a repave or
or you know tear it down. Some of it's a
[20:53] repave, some of it's a resurface. We
can't tear, you know, we have a lot of
[20:58] opportunities and we're seeing that this
summer on 9th 10th and in that core that
[21:01] area, but we have a lot of opportunities
to improve, but we can't always restart.
[21:05] And I think sometimes when we have
envisioning things like that out here
[21:10] and even wanting to move ahead on these
goals, we can tend to try and make
[21:16] everything that we acknowledge is a
repair into a total redo. And that might
[21:22] be part of the conversations we have to
have coming forward. If that truly is
[21:25] how we have to get to where we are, then
that might be the p something the public
[21:28] has to engage in and say, "Yeah, I'd
rather you do two streets on four, three
[21:32] blocks a year and leave my some potholes
just temporarily filled and not
[21:38] resurfaced." Or we have to just be a
little bit more realistic about what we
[21:42] can do when the projects are brought
forward to us. But that's on us as
[21:46] commissioners and the decision-making
body where staff's kind of doing what's
[21:51] recommended by standard protocol of
keeping our streets up and safe. Those
[21:55] are things bigger conversations we're
going to have to have in the context of
[21:58] this kind of more envisioned. So I'm I
sound like I'm not hopeful. I'm hopeful
[22:02] on all these. I think they're just
really big conversations we're going to
[22:05] have to have and could be some major
shifts in how we look at the budgeting
[22:08] going forward. So
>> thank you. thing.
[22:13] » So, uh, starting with the the corridor,
uh, topic, I think this is one that I
[22:20] want to hone in on because, uh, this
also to me ties into our ability to work
[22:25] with other municipalities. Grand
Traverse County um is putting forward a
[22:30] corridor development plan and that is
touching the townships, touches the city
[22:36] and it uh is focusing on effective and
efficient use of infrastructure and also
[22:43] protecting uh green spaces and areas uh
by by focusing development in these
[22:48] places where it is relatively speaking
uh what we need to have in place the
[22:53] sewer, the water etc is already there.
and so limiting some sprawl. And so I
[22:58] think if there is a a way to move that
forward, it will be uh in again tying
[23:06] that into working collaboratively
because our corridors don't stop at city
[23:10] limits. Yeah. Uh you know they are in
crossing into Garfield Township. They
[23:15] are crossing you know all every t single
one of our corridors it traverses into
[23:20] other municipalities. And so I think
that's a really important uh thing to to
[23:26] highlight and lift up is that we have
our corridor plan, master plan that's
[23:30] over a decade old, but this is currently
happening. These are conversations that
[23:33] are going on and making sure that the
city is part of those and at that table
[23:38] um moving those forward. Um so I think
that that was the one that really that
[23:43] spoke to me. And then you know we with
the people centric street design I'm
[23:47] glad to that the this um complete
streets is moving forward. you know, we
[23:51] did get some good momentum on that. And
I also I also think we als have have are
[23:56] recognizing the degree to which a lot of
our streets don't actually fall under
[24:01] city jurisdiction. You know, they are in
our city, but that they are there are
[24:04] limited thing. You know, we've heard
from the folks who live along Peninsula
[24:08] Drive and Eastern A about their
frustrations with their with their c the
[24:11] crosswalks available there. And so I
think there is some of this is also
[24:15] about greater communication around what
we do and do not have direct oversight
[24:21] of.
>> Yeah, good could good comment. And it
[24:25] was, you know, my final piece on this,
so thank you for sharing those thoughts
[24:29] is that these these actions largely came
from the community engagement, right?
[24:34] And they were framed to reflect the sort
of tenor of what we heard from the
[24:37] community. Um, and I think there's a
sort of a I I wouldn't mind just some
[24:41] sort of general thoughts on how you
think the approach should be on this
[24:46] when when at a at a community level most
people are very local based, right? I
[24:50] mean, they're talking about my
neighborhood, my I mean there was a
[24:54] strong kind of narrative about
neighborhood or my street or my crossing
[24:58] or whatever. Um, and and that what that
looks like and then yet at a city you've
[25:02] got to have these larger sort of
overarching, you know, sort of master
[25:06] plans and so on, right? And and I think
my observation has been that that's part
[25:11] of the disconnect at the moment is that
you know people are very concerned about
[25:14] their local and whether they don't feel
that gets reflected in the sort of
[25:18] larger master plan sort of approach. But
I do think that the sentiment that's
[25:23] beneath this is that somehow or other we
have to think about how as we talk about
[25:26] these topics it's like there's different
scales right and how do those scales
[25:31] connect together which was a little
about what you were just aiming to talk
[25:34] about right but I think that's a very
important thing any just general
[25:37] guidance on that sort of like how we
connect those pieces before we go to the
[25:41] next pillar
[25:47] » uh I think that that it's I think it's
in pillar too, isn't it? About
[25:52] neighborhood associations. I think that
uh deputy city manager Deb Allen's
[25:58] program, the president's club or
whatever it's I think that that's a big
[26:02] step towards answering questions like
that and
[26:06] » giving this more
uh global
[26:12] perspective to the neighborhoods of what
we can and can't do now.
[26:16] » Okay. May maybe also um you know a
reporting dashboard has been a part of
[26:22] this project from the big beginning and
making that as um accessible and and
[26:30] communicating the results from that
dashboard very broadly and frequently um
[26:36] might be a way to help people say oh
okay my crosswalk didn't get done but um
[26:43] citywide there were 25 crosswalks that
were upgraded and you know mine will
[26:49] come long. So u better reporting
>> of progress might might be helpful.
[26:56] » Yeah, I actually really understand that
because I mean we talk about these 10
[26:59] year plans or corridor plans of 20. Most
people aren't living in that kind of
[27:03] world, right? They're more interested in
what's So I think something that people
[27:07] could track what's going on
>> and see when when it's coming to their
[27:11] door could be really interesting and
useful.
[27:14] » Yeah. And the only thing I would add to
is um I put a part of this on the
[27:18] commission itself. I'll say us for
assembled one today and I've already
[27:22] seen improvements with this with staff
through things like the Bay Reef and
[27:25] others. But communicating what we can
and can't do ourselves as well. We, you
[27:31] know, staff is are the experts. They
live in it every day. They're
[27:34] professionals, often certified
professionals. A lot of us, I'm sure
[27:38] even our newer commissioners are feeling
like they've had a real um education on
[27:44] government parliament and the alphabet
soup we all use when we talk and
[27:48] everything else like that. But being
better in our public meetings like
[27:52] meetings are televised. We inter media
for our city. We have to be better. I
[27:56] think continue to be better. I think
it's gotten better in the last couple of
[27:59] years of saying not just here's what's
presented and anybody looking at it
[28:04] would say well why isn't this here or
why isn't my street on this and saying
[28:08] we we're paying for this with a grant
that only allowed this much space or
[28:12] we're doing this because it's the M dot
trunk line and the money only goes there
[28:15] that's why seventh street isn't being
touched or vice versa. So, I think we
[28:19] just have to do a little bit better. I
think continue to do better in
[28:23] communicating some of that to the public
as we're introducing some of these
[28:26] topics because a dashboard and
everything are good, but if if there's
[28:30] that missing important piece of where
funding andor um uh use of resources is
[28:36] coming from for a very good reason, the
public should know that as well.
[28:40] » Okay. All right. Thank you. Um let's
jump to the next pillar. Right. Um so
[28:46] this was Heather as you start to
introduce this is about the placemaking
[28:50] and neighborhood character. Um the
objective of protecting the character of
[28:53] the downtown the neighborhoods. Um here
we have these four uh action areas. So
[28:58] experience based approach to placem uh
elevating power the role of neighborhood
[29:04] associations
intentionally creating gathering and
[29:08] social spaces and then this uh enhanced
multimedia connectivity between the
[29:13] neighborhoods. You can see there on the
scoring that there was nothing really on
[29:17] this one that jumped as a high priority
by the in the community assessment.
[29:21] There were medium and and low, but
they're all relative, right? Because
[29:24] they're all on the list. So, they're all
on people's minds. Um, you can see the
[29:28] progress, the subjective assessment on
on progress. Um, if we look go to the
[29:33] survey, um, this one was actually
reasonably strong. I mean, they're
[29:38] they're not sort of over five and a
half, but there's no real kind of weak
[29:41] points in this, but but we do want to
think about how we elevate the whole
[29:45] performance of this pillar and the
actions that are in it. Um, and
[29:51] shall we just dive into this? Tim, maybe
we start with you this time. Go around
[29:56] from you, right?
[30:05] uh not to like beg off on the question
but I think when I took the survey I
[30:09] even commented about the complete
streets because again to me it ties in
[30:13] here at least uh number eight is you
know multimodal connectivity that's
[30:17] really what complete streets all about.
Um
[30:23] yeah, we like we as a community with the
uh the space on 8th Street um you know
[30:30] it's a it's a pilot. I think we still
consider it as a test case. Um
[30:36] but that addresses number seven. So
yes, like we're making progress and I
[30:43] think we've shown ourselves in the
community that this is an area that we
[30:47] can be more deliberate uh about and so
on this one I am more optimistic.
[30:52] » Okay.
Well, great.
[30:58] » Um I think that this one except for the
action six about neighborhood
[31:03] associations which I think we're making
progress on that one. All the rest of
[31:07] them I I think go back to corridors and
take again taking a look at what
[31:11] intentional corridors we want 11 years
on with the with all the bikes and uh
[31:18] the the increased density downtown and
that um and that that will help us
[31:24] discover new gathering places and uh the
best ways to get a you know uh Union
[31:33] Street goes to a golf course, C Street
goes to South Airport. So maybe cast
[31:36] street is better up and down and for
cars and that kind of thing. Um in the
[31:44] staff generated summary here it said
that they've made a lot of substantial
[31:49] progress on bringing an experience-based
approach to placemaking efforts.
[31:55] I I think that the east that east uh 8th
street has I think that's been a
[32:00] success. But I I I'm I'm
my hopes are definitely on the shoulders
[32:07] of the complete streets and the advisory
board there to to really bring true
[32:12] experienced
uh based approach to how we talk about
[32:18] mobility in town. Yeah, there was a lot
of interest that people talked about in
[32:23] terms of like there's one thing to have
the spaces, but then how do you activate
[32:26] them, right? And how do you how do you
make them truly a a neighborhood centric
[32:30] or you know a local ccentric experience.
So I think there's a sort of a subtext
[32:34] through a lot of this as well is that
push and pull in a tourism economy where
[32:39] you know you're having spaces that are
for locals as well. So I think you know
[32:43] we talked about that I think even some
of our final sessions about some of
[32:46] these corridors really could be are not
the not the touristentric but they're
[32:50] more the local centric
>> combined. Yeah.
[32:54] » Yeah. Um I'd say uh the first and last
five and eight are some things that we
[33:01] can be in a better role as the city
government from the top level to
[33:06] encourage throughout the city. Not that
neighborhood associations and local
[33:11] gathering spaces aren't important, and
they are, but if the idea is for those
[33:17] to be more organic and communitydriven,
then a neighborhood might decide that
[33:23] its neighborhood association is
primarily focused with the annual
[33:28] neighborhood barbecue and doesn't want
to get into the same uh extent of
[33:33] conversations about planning and zoning
that uh the neighborhood right next
[33:37] right across the street might be focused
on. Similarly, yes, we can try to create
[33:43] uh more uh gathering spaces, but who is
to say what that gathering space is and
[33:49] what uh how they fit into the broader
community.
[33:53] » Say um a church can be a wonderful
gathering space, but that's not a place
[33:57] for government to step in, nor is that a
space that would be inclusive of people
[34:03] that aren't members of that faith
community. Um, a preschool child care
[34:08] center can be a great place for
connecting of young parents and very
[34:13] necessary in parts of town that have
many young parents, but the people that
[34:18] don't have young parents aren't uh
connected through that social program.
[34:25] » Okay, thank you.
>> Um, yeah, I would I join in Heather
[34:28] saying I'm really happy the progress
that we're seeing with the neighborhood
[34:31] associations and making that more
centralized for communication. I'm
[34:35] didn't mention it last time, but overall
I'm also excited for the city commission
[34:38] to get the complete streets ad hoc
recommendations and start working on
[34:41] that to start solidifying some of that
for policy. Um, what I'm seeing though,
[34:46] like we've talked about the social
district on 8th Street, that's been
[34:49] mentioned a couple times here, that was
initiated by the businesses there. And
[34:55] while it's kind of not where I think
most people in Trevor City would think
[34:58] of where we people want to go hang out
and it's a probably a more local thing,
[35:02] I do see a lot of my Traverse Heights
neighbors there. But I also see a lot of
[35:05] people who are visiting especially from
different countries because they like
[35:09] the the feel of the sitting outside and
communal atmosphere there. So I I say
[35:14] that to say that I don't think any
corridor that we design will inherently
[35:17] stay local because I think any kind of
gatherings uh bring people around. But I
[35:22] think that that is where the state
budget-wise we could put more into this
[35:26] because look at what we did for you know
$35,000 I think it was or $60,000. it
[35:31] wasn't a huge lift for a social district
and created a great gathering space. Um,
[35:36] but I think that when we look at the
fact we don't have like a parks
[35:39] department programming and we do we
don't you know the social districts and
[35:43] things are really run by the local
businesses kind of like um what Tim was
[35:46] talking about activating. I think that's
an opportunity for us to do some more
[35:50] with budgeting. But I think it's also an
opportunity for the community to have
[35:52] more um stake in what they want to see
in their neighborhoods and the community
[35:56] itself because a lot of that is
privately based or um you know a certain
[36:01] amount of initiative to draw attention
to certain spaces within their area
[36:04] where we just don't you know we don't
have a kickball league happening at
[36:08] Effan Park for example or something. So
that's where the activating that space
[36:12] is really going to be something where I
think the community is going to have a
[36:14] real good chance to engage with us or
the body I should say and staff on
[36:19] creating new opportunities. So I think
this one's a kind of a low hanging fruit
[36:23] p uh actually budget-wise but it's also
a bigger lift on the community as
[36:27] opposed to our staff and ourselves.
>> Yeah. But it is that opportunity to to
[36:33] empower the community and really create
that partnership. You know what I think
[36:36] one of the other sort of overlays in all
this is that that there's been a real
[36:40] intention I think in the planning and
the outreach to build more trust and
[36:44] communication between the city and the
community. These type of things could be
[36:49] really practical and as you say could be
fairly lowcost ways to strengthen that
[36:53] partnership so that there's a you know a
more collaboration.
[36:58] me.
So I, you know, following up on what the
[37:03] mayor was discussing,
thinking about, for instance, the social
[37:07] district and how that emerged from local
business owners. Uh I across all of
[37:14] these uh categories I'm seeing an
opportunity for the city to be have
[37:19] clearer channels for groups of business
owners owners, a neighborhood
[37:24] association, um whatever the entity is
to bring forward an idea and to have
[37:31] some uh potentially to have some pot of
money, some funding in the budget
[37:35] allocated for we had talked about in uh
you know in one of the the design groups
[37:41] what uh you know we called it originally
was called tactical urbanism. Uh and so
[37:45] these very like lowcost
experiments
[37:50] uh in activating public spaces and so
you know I I
[37:56] being willing to try some things to see
so okay so your neighborhood association
[38:00] is saying you want to activate this uh
you know this piece of property maybe
[38:06] you want a a pocket park you know what
can we do for you know $5,000 or less uh
[38:11] you know or maybe it's $1,500 or less.
and being uh and then and to be able to
[38:18] have some sort of proof of concept uh as
we're you know as we are seeing with the
[38:22] piloting of the social district on 8th
Street. So I think there there have but
[38:27] having those channels be defined in a
way that they aren't currently. I think
[38:31] it's very opaque to people who are like
well we want to do this thing. Where do
[38:34] we start? Who do we talk to? Uh and if I
think if if that can be advanced then
[38:40] that would be uh we would be able to
make some more progress on these
[38:44] pillars.
>> Cool. Yeah. Right. Thank you.
[38:47] Um there's been conversation now a
couple of folks have mentioned the
[38:52] social district and um I
I believe the social district made use
[38:58] of um economic development funding and
it it was essentially an economic
[39:04] development proposition and um I'm sure
there are you know ways to um you know
[39:12] whether it's gathering data on foot
traffic or something that would help us
[39:16] to um
evaluate how effective that was as an
[39:21] economic development tool. What I would
like to see and what I think this pillar
[39:27] is saying to me is that not everything
needs to be framed in terms of economic
[39:33] development that um this is an
opportunity to
[39:38] shift our perspective to um quality of
life and specifically quality of life
[39:44] for residents.
So, I I believe, you know, the idea of
[39:51] coming to a neighborhood association and
saying, "We've got this pot of funds and
[39:56] what would benefit you the most? What
would most improve your quality of
[40:00] life?" And it will vary from
neighborhood to neighborhood depending
[40:05] upon the profile of the of the residents
who are there. But um for us to give
[40:12] equal weight to quality of life and
economic development I think is a really
[40:18] important attitude shift among
leadership.
[40:22] » I just interrupt to say kudos on that
because that is something I think has
[40:26] been quietly happening at the commission
level of how our policy is. But I
[40:29] appreciate you really articulating that
really clearly that I think everybody
[40:33] felt like things had to be wedged for
many decades even had to be wedged into
[40:37] economic development or some kind of
stimulus for tax base or something to do
[40:41] it. And I really appreciate sorry I just
had to jump in and say I really
[40:45] appreciate that you kind of are pointing
out that shift in perspective that's
[40:48] been there but not articulated so well.
So thank you. And if I can add to that
[40:53] too because it does come up later in the
data is that because you're such a
[40:56] strong visitation economy, the economic
development is often coupled to the
[41:00] visitation economy which is a double rub
for people right when you talk about
[41:04] quality of life. So that'll come up a
bit later on as well. I think that's a
[41:08] really powerful
>> and if I can say uh you know the
[41:12] visitation community the the tourists
that that's not that that's not quality
[41:18] of life that that's not for the people
who live here. You build a place where
[41:22] people love to live there. You have they
have great services. They have uh they
[41:28] have enough they have what they need
whether that's trails or green space. Um
[41:33] and and then you have economic
development. That's what makes economic
[41:37] development for the people who live
here. Economic development for tourism
[41:41] is a completely different thing.
>> Yeah. And and and we're going to revisit
[41:45] that in sustainable tourism. I I mean I
I do think that was another one of those
[41:49] overlay issues is that I think there's a
lot of appetite to explore the whole
[41:54] notion of sustainable tourism which is
repivoting actually the economic
[41:58] surround visitation economy. Right. This
is great. Benjamin, do you think we're
[42:04] getting what we need for our next ships?
>> I do. Yeah. Yeah. This is great. I
[42:08] appreciate the conversation.
>> All right. So, let's go to So, everybody
[42:12] waited on that, didn't they?
>> Y.
[42:14] » So, let's go to the next one. Um, kind
of different topic here, right? So, uh,
[42:18] this regional collaborative approach,
how do we think about managing
[42:22] resources, utilities, climate
adaptation, and leading on key issues
[42:26] ties into some of the things we're
starting to talk about in terms of
[42:28] regional corridors and so on. Um this
was something that I think surfaced
[42:33] through strategic planning and I
actually came up in the very first
[42:36] session the think tank session. Um and
there was this talk about that Traverse
[42:41] City needs to provide you know more
leadership right and I I guess we asked
[42:46] the question is it does Traverse City
have to step up and provide leadership
[42:49] or is it does it join other groups you
know and the and and I tested that all
[42:55] through the strategic planning process
because I knew it would have
[42:58] implications for how you operate as a
group of commissions but also the staff.
[43:03] Um and at least what I heard
overwhelmingly was were people saying
[43:07] well it needs to happen in a lot of
cases Traverse City the city of Traverse
[43:11] City is might be the one has to lead and
initiate on this um so let's dive into
[43:17] this right so um talking about fost's
regional collaborative approach um we
[43:22] can see there is a series of sort of
actions that were identified um the
[43:26] prioritization given by the community so
the the highest one was around the
[43:31] potential for uh shared government
services um but not really anything much
[43:37] happening at the level of current
progress was the subjective judgment. So
[43:41] you know I think and I think that
reflects the reality is that you
[43:44] obviously have been focused on your city
and that's what your job is as a set of
[43:48] commissioners. Um but I think the the
questions being asked about well do we
[43:53] take a bigger bigger approach. So when
we asked the question about the
[43:58] alignment between that fosting a
regional collaborative approach, you can
[44:01] see that these scored really low, right?
Um and that I think is reflective of
[44:06] that the lack of uh current progress
there which is all limited um by the
[44:12] subjective judgment. Um, this one here I
think is a really interesting and it's
[44:17] kind of like a real behavioral shift for
commissioners,
[44:23] staff because it and it's going to
require if you go down this path, it
[44:26] requires investment of time. You got to
build some equity. You're going to be
[44:30] having to deal with trade-offs. You
know, there's all that that goes into
[44:33] this. Um, would love to kind of get your
take on this in terms of, you know, how
[44:39] important how we tackle this. Um what do
you think it looks like in terms of
[44:43] closing the gap on alignment? Maybe
Heather, we can start with you.
[44:47] » Yeah, this is the this is a tough one.
Um well, in again in this staff
[44:52] generated, you know, summary critique
right at the top it says there is no
[44:58] current currently there is it's it's
incorrectly worded. There is no current
[45:03] regional collaboration map. I'm quoting
>> um
[45:09] » uh you know there's networks north or is
that what it's called? Networks
[45:12] northwest. I can't I can't see anything
in there as a just a normal person.
[45:16] There's nothing I can see. Um
the uh I don't know what the mobility
[45:22] planning organization is either. I don't
know what I think that this even though
[45:27] it's kind of a low prior priority from
the the residents, I think this is a
[45:32] really huge priority for the I think it
is a big and I was happy to hear my talk
[45:38] about the Grand Travis County putting
together the future cor corridor
[45:41] development plan. I I think that's
something that we need to be at least in
[45:45] the room for that. Um maybe the um the
county board of public works is a place
[45:53] to start where we're all talking. The
Michigan Township Association which I
[45:57] attend is really all u presentation
focused. So there's some networking that
[46:02] goes on. We chat a little bit but really
it's all about we have a presentation
[46:06] and then we go home. So we're not
talking to one another. I think that
[46:10] city needs representation on the airport
authority board. we are not there and
[46:15] it's right in our it's not even our
backyard. It's like our living room. Um
[46:22] as far as exploring potential for shared
government services, I I don't know what
[46:26] to say about that either. I mean, sure,
what do those look like? We actually
[46:31] unshared last year. We broke our IT off.
So, um, and as, uh, create a leadership
[46:38] team to advocate for the region. I
actually think Cher's Connect does a
[46:40] good job with this and we don't need to
spend it. We're already paying them to
[46:44] do it. And I think they're doing a good
job. They are actually advocating for
[46:48] people to come and live here and work
here and build businesses here. It's not
[46:52] Trevor City Tourism. That's not what
they're working on. So, I think we're
[46:55] okay there. But, I don't know. We We
need something, but I don't know what it
[46:59] is for the regional. We need a a
regional planning
[47:05] advisory board, but I don't know what
that looks like.
[47:08] » Yeah. Well, let's keep
>> echoing what Heather just said, it um
[47:14] the last point I'd say is better served
through Traverse Connect as a body than
[47:19] creating an additional structure.
uh if we had some leadership team that
[47:25] was not uh under the opaces of an
organization like Travers Connect, I can
[47:31] see it becoming very fraught with the
different representatives from different
[47:38] municipalities than trying to fight for
something that benefits their specific
[47:42] municipality or what they think their
voters want rather than the goal of
[47:48] having a regional and collaborative
approach.
[47:52] uh or shared government services. That
would be very nice if we could, but
[47:58] that's ultimately dependent on how
willing
[48:02] um or various uh community partners are
willing to play with each other. like
[48:09] uh yes, as Heather just said, we
separated our IT, but also we decided to
[48:17] start having ambulance service handled
by Traverse City Fire, which yes, that
[48:21] is government providing better service
for residents, but MMR uh had been and
[48:29] still is an ambulance service that does
cover multiple municipalities
[48:33] and therefore it had been a shared
service in that sense.
[48:38] Uh we do h need to have more
conversations about how the city and
[48:42] county can work together, but I'm not
even sure how many opportunities aside
[48:48] from there being mutual aid from fire
and police uh to have joint services
[48:56] with the city and the surrounding
townships.
[49:00] » Okay. uh or but I would say that 10
really needs uh more effort put into it
[49:08] because there can be
uh conversations
[49:14] that various organizations, various
levels of government have some role in
[49:19] it but uh it can be difficult to see the
whole big picture.
[49:23] Take for example what the city is going
to be doing with the Carnegie building.
[49:29] Um there we have a tenant the Crooked
Tree Arts Center that wants to continue
[49:34] being in this area. We have the library
that was thinking they have a plan for
[49:39] the future use of that space. Uh but so
we can decide what we want to do as a
[49:45] city but then there's two people I mean
two other organizations that aren't
[49:50] always in the same room as us and the
broader picture of
[49:55] okay if we want to have an art center
here if we want to have uh a museum or
[50:00] history interpretive site here
uh that isn't necessarily fixed to that
[50:06] one location. There could be other
locations both within and outside the
[50:10] city. Like
uh look at our neighbor right next door.
[50:15] NMC has a property on Borbin Lake which
is outside of the city that they are not
[50:21] using as much. that has a lot of vacant
or in future terms or assumed to be
[50:29] vacant uh area that
either of those entities uh a museum
[50:36] history center could be part of that
space, an art center could be part of
[50:39] that space. But if we don't have the
conversations where multiple
[50:45] organizations are actively talking to
each other, we don't see what the
[50:49] opportunities are and what will work
best for everybody.
[50:54] » So I I think that's great, right? I just
want to kind of reenter us too on what I
[50:58] what I think this pillar was about,
right? And to a degree, it is kind of
[51:02] working out those solutions, right? like
you know we've got this face and you
[51:05] know where's you know that's the
collaboration piece but but I think this
[51:09] was this pillar was really reflecting
this sort of unease that people had
[51:14] about a lot of the city of Traverse
City's future is being strongly
[51:21] influenced by the 85,000 people who live
in the region but don't live in the city
[51:25] right and and I think that was the sort
of you know your population is
[51:29] relatively small but you own the brand
right and all roads lead and so I think
[51:33] that is really what people were kind of
pushing on in the strategic planning the
[51:38] sense of how do we kind of bring people
together to guide a future sure it's in
[51:44] our self-interest right but how do we
bring people together to collaborate and
[51:47] you know it's thinking about resources
and things like that but I do I think
[51:51] that underneath this right the what this
pillar is about is about how do you kind
[51:56] of build that heft or that collaboration
to be able to make good choices together
[52:02] not be inadvertently competing or have
kind of different kind of directions by
[52:07] different entities, but that just I just
want to kind of recenter on that. So,
[52:11] » yeah. And so I I look at this and see
kind of from where the angle of the
[52:16] pillars coming from, which seems very
20,000 foot and very encompassing.
[52:20] » And what I I've noticed over the years
um and I'll the example I'll give is we
[52:25] were talking about affordable housing as
we always do as we should. Um, and I had
[52:30] asked, you know, is how can we can
everybody get together and just put
[52:35] together a list of what affordable
housing projects are on coming online,
[52:39] come, you know, due to come online,
started, blah, blah, blah. How does that
[52:43] not exist? Should we be funding that?
And I was told, well, oh yeah, the, you
[52:46] know, planners get together and talk
about that. And so they have that list.
[52:49] And now I think what we've seen in the
last couple of years, this was, this was
[52:52] probably six or seven years ago, um,
housing north is kind of stepping into
[52:55] that role, much like Traverse Connect
has stepped into some of these roles.
[52:58] And so I think one in the last couple of
years there's been improvements in
[53:03] finding these kind of brokers if you
will to bring everybody together. We can
[53:07] go back 101 15 years of Traverse City
sitting at the podium or at the DAS in
[53:12] our space saying well everybody should
come talk to us about housing arms
[53:16] crossed and waiting for everybody to
come to us and that's no and as was
[53:20] touched on by Heather and others like no
one government is gonna agency is going
[53:23] to bring everybody else together because
it's a push and pull of interest. And so
[53:27] you always need that kind of mediator or
or convenor of the conversations where I
[53:32] think also we have a lot of opportunity
that we've seen in very very recent
[53:35] times are things like our um housing and
homelessness task force or the QRT where
[53:40] these are very specified topics that are
bringing people together to work on the
[53:44] solutions and getting the right parties
at the table. And so I think it'd be
[53:48] great if we had a master list of
everybody who's doing everything in the
[53:51] community relating to different issues,
but that's just not a realistic
[53:54] resource, use of our resources or funds,
but I think um looking for more of the
[53:59] gatherers like Trevor's Connect, like
Housing North, having everybody work
[54:03] together to refine those to be more of
what we're looking for for our data
[54:06] collection and then convening the task
force with the experts to share the data
[54:12] that might already be shared because you
know all this is where I think the
[54:15] commission is more like the citizens as
we're supposed to be. We're not here in
[54:18] the offices every day. We're not in
staff meetings and we're not in a lot of
[54:22] the other types of meetings that happen
as part of people's day-to-day work. And
[54:25] so there's information gathering there
that does eventually come through when
[54:29] we're presented with a policy or we
convene a task force and we know who to
[54:33] ask or we're getting updates on this or
that. But there a lot of people are
[54:38] working on that a lot in con in you know
dayto-day and that's just something that
[54:42] we can do better when it's on relevant
task or relevant information. But I
[54:47] think at some point you know people are
doing this 40 hours a day and we have
[54:49] how many 100 plus staff people. I think
it would be impossible for us to distill
[54:53] down everybody that they're talking to
all the time and working with. But how
[54:56] do we do it on the relevant matters and
and comp convey that better again
[55:00] communicate better who's there? And I
think we've done that well with the
[55:02] housing task force of the list of
partners who are there, having them give
[55:05] updates, things like that, and seeing
that more maybe as we're seeing some of
[55:08] these more refined um or or specified
issues that are part of larger topics
[55:14] that we're tackling on a case- by case
basis. So do you think then at the level
[55:18] of sort of budget and programming that
to move the needle on this is really as
[55:24] commissioners that you're empowering
your staff and manager to be
[55:29] » be at the table on these institutional
groups or
[55:32] » Yeah, absolutely. And then you know
maybe there may maybe there starts to be
[55:36] a budget just the way that things are
going a budget line item for task force
[55:39] because those will ultimately cost extra
time and money and maybe an extra
[55:42] resource and we've figured out ways to
fund that in the past such as our social
[55:46] workers and such. So um you know I'm
being somewhat flippant by saying a a
[55:52] line item but that could that might be
how that gets conveyed in the budget
[55:55] because we also know our staff time is
valuable and you can't you know straws
[56:00] that break camel's backs. We definitely
don't want to break the camels. So yeah,
[56:04] » thanks.
>> Well, so I I just want to concur with
[56:07] the comments that have been made about
Traverse Connect being very effective as
[56:11] an advocate for our region. Um when
talking about some of the things that
[56:15] are going on at the county level, like
for instance, the corridor improvement
[56:18] plan, uh whomever is appointed from the
next city commission to sit on the
[56:22] economic development corporation will be
part of that conversation. And so to
[56:26] your point committing uh as you know the
city leadership that it's it is vital to
[56:31] be at those tables and to be in those
rooms uh talking about convening
[56:35] organizations
um to identify needs and solutions. The
[56:39] Grand Travers Regional Community
Foundation and Rotary Charities
[56:42] frequently have those kinds of events
that are and just community- based
[56:47] networking show up have a cup of coffee
have a conversation find out what's
[56:51] going on. So understanding that there
are in any given day a hundred different
[56:56] priorities that are coming across the
desk of our city's leadership uh knowing
[57:01] when those are occurring and committing
to attending those and to be a uh an
[57:06] accessible face uh for the city I think
will help move the needle and to the
[57:12] mayor's point if there is some kind of a
line item that emphasizes that
[57:16] commitment that's wonderful but I think
more globally the understanding that um
[57:22] the need to actually go and be in the
room even when the city isn't the person
[57:26] isn't the entity that is calling the
meeting. Um having a little humility
[57:31] about that.
>> Yeah. Okay. Great. Thank you.
[57:35] » Um I am uh drawn to number 12 about
creating a leadership team to advocate
[57:42] for the region. Um, while I admire um,
Traverse Connect's efforts for things
[57:50] like bringing new residents to the area,
the the scope and scale of what they're
[57:56] able to accomplish
is not enough to really move the needle.
[58:01] You know, the latest program, I think,
is funded
[58:05] with $50,000, which allows them to um
compensate
[58:11] 10 families or or, you know, um units to
move to a 10count area uh and commit to
[58:20] staying there for one year. and and so
that that that really isn't going to,
[58:26] you know, I I think affect have a have a
big impact uh on on what our employment
[58:33] picture looks like. I'm afraid that
there's a mismatch between the size of
[58:38] the issue and and the resources against
it. Um I admire what was done with um
[58:47] the use of NOS's for uh the homelessness
situation. They're acting as conveners.
[58:53] Um I have had a a long-term um positive
view of Networks Northwest just because
[59:03] they are a source of impartial data and
um whether they could help us to uh
[59:12] convene a group regionwide remains to be
seen, but they they are um Switzerland,
[59:20] you know, they're they're not um you
know pro anybody. They are they are
[59:25] there with the facts and I respect that.
Um but I think that there are are issues
[59:32] that could really impact and benefit
every government entity in our area. uh
[59:40] things like um the lodging tax, you
know, what state law restricts how
[59:47] lodging taxes are allocated and it isn't
funneled toward infrastructure or, you
[59:54] know, other other costs to the locality
of hosting these. you know that to me
[1:00:00] might be an issue that we could
come together around something that will
[1:00:07] benefit every entity in the area um has
I think some upside. So
[1:00:15] » yeah. Okay, great. Thank you. And I
think that's sort of getting to what I
[1:00:19] heard the community talking about, you
know, like you bit hard to put your
[1:00:23] finger on. Exactly. Right. But this sort
of sense of we got to we got to get our
[1:00:28] we got to have some heft, right? We got
to our voices got to be heard. We can't
[1:00:31] just get lost at the level of per capita
population, right? There are issues here
[1:00:36] we need other people to act on and we
might need some more inland. So Jim,
[1:00:41] » yeah, excellent comments all around. Um,
I guess from a high level, what I see
[1:00:47] here is, and Mitch touched on this, like
we've removed ourselves from some
[1:00:53] collaboration. We're working toward
collaboration and there's a lot of
[1:00:55] collaboration ongoing. Um, so what would
be helpful? Maybe it's what you were
[1:01:00] able to overhear David throughout the
process or maybe it's on a raw data is
[1:01:05] fostering a regional collaborative
approach for what like let's be more
[1:01:10] specific and understand and then as a
body say like we we probably have a
[1:01:14] consensus housing and homelessness
regional heft is another one but are
[1:01:19] there other ones that rise to the top
and there's consensus around because I
[1:01:24] think we're we might get stuck spinning
our wheels if we just talk about
[1:01:30] regional collaborative approach at
large, which is good, but we could spin
[1:01:37] our wheels for a long time. Whereas, if
we're talking about housing and
[1:01:40] homelessness, there's efforts going, we
could build on that. If it's
[1:01:46] » regional heft, yeah, like
>> try to pick maybe the top I'll make it a
[1:01:50] top three specific things to try to
collaborate on and build some momentum
[1:01:55] there. And then maybe in years to come
there'll be a fourth, fifth, and sixth
[1:01:59] Yeah, good good comment. I'll go back
through the data, but I top of mind the
[1:02:03] ones that I heard people talking about
were housing and homelessness was one.
[1:02:08] Um, I think climate adaptation was
another one. And you'll see that
[1:02:11] actually about like a regional climate
plan. Um, and I think that the impact of
[1:02:17] the transient lodging tax and tourism um
is another one, right? because I think
[1:02:22] that people saw you know you go through
Detroit airport and it goes go to
[1:02:25] Traverse City and right people in
Traverse City go we got enough right so
[1:02:28] there's a kind of disconnect there and I
think they were the three at least we
[1:02:32] heard a lot about and I think we could
sharpen this Benjamin as we go through
[1:02:35] into the next step by picking those out
because it is kind of like a it's more
[1:02:39] like a conceptual approach rather than a
set of clear kind of action steps all
[1:02:45] right let's jump to the next one um so
creating a complete community so this
[1:02:51] was one that we had a very we changed it
right at the end the name we flipped it
[1:02:55] didn't we this was about building social
economic systems um and I think you
[1:03:01] actually
too many jargony words
[1:03:05] » yeah and that's was a little bit of the
sort of sort of feedback we got at the
[1:03:09] very final session right and I actually
think this makes a lot more sense to
[1:03:12] people right um in terms of the action
areas this was a really interesting one
[1:03:16] right so this actually scored lower as a
pillar but we do we think we had that
[1:03:21] conversation. We thought it might be a
bit the name of it was was sort of a bit
[1:03:24] misleading for people. Um but the
community priority areas here big
[1:03:31] support on encourage more full-time
residents living in the core
[1:03:34] neighborhoods. That's like the primary
kind of core. That was a really strong
[1:03:38] issue for people. The sense of how do we
combat the nation or the the trend
[1:03:42] towards being sort of like seasonal
houses in these sort of high high value
[1:03:47] areas. And then the child the child care
capacity which was I think the highest
[1:03:54] rate of priority and the second highest
rate of priority. Um and you can see
[1:03:57] there on the current progress on the
city side these areas for that I think
[1:04:02] there's some significant opportunity for
thinking about new programming and
[1:04:07] budget allocations to reflect um what
the communities point to as priorities
[1:04:12] there. Um so in terms of the survey
results you can see these are really
[1:04:18] what I'd call degraded right I mean
there's there we don't have much
[1:04:22] alignment at all in fact they're
boosting the um child care capacity you
[1:04:27] know it's just we're we're clearly in
the realm of not at all aligned right um
[1:04:32] so I think this one is an area where
there's an interesting opportunity and I
[1:04:36] think it ties to what you were saying
too Jackie earlier about the quality of
[1:04:40] life component right Um so let's have a
let's have a crack at this one. Right.
[1:04:44] So we've got some you know four sort of
actions areas. There might be I mean
[1:04:49] these are just actions that the
community identified. I think these are
[1:04:52] going to morph a little but this whole
idea about how do we make those main
[1:04:56] neighborhood areas like truly livable
you know vibrant with you know people
[1:05:01] living there and so on. um this idea of
showcasing best practice solutions uh
[1:05:07] promoting equity and then this child
care capacity which is obviously a sort
[1:05:11] of key issue for people. So Mitch do you
want to take us away on this one? Uh
[1:05:17] child care is something that we've heard
a lot about but the city hasn't really
[1:05:21] stepped into the county did for a period
but it is something that is needed and
[1:05:31] it does tie into the fact that we do
have a lot of people that commute into
[1:05:35] this city uh without living here in part
because uh both housing expensive and
[1:05:42] childcare is limited here. So
that could potentially tie back to the
[1:05:48] top 13. If uh we have better child care
opportunities in Traverse City, then
[1:05:55] more of those people can feel that they
have a home where their young family can
[1:06:00] be.
>> Yeah.
[1:06:03] » Yeah. Thank you.
>> So, a couple on this one is um child
[1:06:07] care. We did actually used to do a
summer camp and I think that would be a
[1:06:09] low hanging fruit we could even do this
year for next year obviously
[1:06:14] » um that there's a template um I know
United Way reached out to me and other I
[1:06:19] think some others
>> who I'm sorry
[1:06:21] » United Way um a couple of months ago
because they are working on trying to
[1:06:25] both boost and bolster the use of tri
share in this community but also to just
[1:06:30] finding these summer solutions. Um, you
know, there's a lot of larger
[1:06:34] organizations that are trusted like the
YMCA and NMC that offer summer
[1:06:39] programming um that are out there and
there's even a group right now exploring
[1:06:44] a millillage for child care. So, there's
literally going to be an opportunity
[1:06:47] very likely in the next year to three
years for the people of Trevor City and
[1:06:51] Grand Traverse County to put their money
where their mouth is.
[1:06:53] » And it's relatively affordable
proposition from what the numbers are
[1:06:57] coming out, but there's a lot more work
being done on that. And then that would
[1:07:00] be the look of does is that investing in
programs and allowing them to expand
[1:07:03] because we do know that the um even with
the we a few years ago the city got rid
[1:07:08] of I think pretty much every restriction
we had locally on childcare and just
[1:07:11] defaulted to the states but the state
still has quite a bit and um and
[1:07:15] rightfully so we want children to be
safe obviously um but working as is
[1:07:21] there are there places where that can be
relaxed a little getting the startup can
[1:07:24] be very difficult there's some talks
about uh relaxing the laws on a micro
[1:07:29] scale so that rather than just being in
somebody's house, somebody could do it
[1:07:32] in a smaller building for space. Um, so
there are conversations happening around
[1:07:36] this, it's money and it's time and it's
policy and there's the right combination
[1:07:41] of forces coming together. So again, I
think the city bringing back summer camp
[1:07:44] with some of these other interested
parties potentially is something we
[1:07:49] could really have explored and probably
not be a huge lift. Um, but I would also
[1:07:53] say that one of in my my day job, if you
will, um, I'm actually working on a
[1:07:58] three-year grant with um, a team of four
on the governor's 60 by30 initiative.
[1:08:03] And that is the, um, governor's plan to
have every Michigander or 60% of
[1:08:07] Michiganders of college eligible age
have either a degree or certification.
[1:08:12] And the idea behind this is raising the
middle class. And so getting businesses
[1:08:16] to invest in trainings and
certifications and education for their
[1:08:20] employees, getting people who kind of
fell off the wagon or didn't continue
[1:08:24] into education to take advantage of a
lot of the programs that are out there
[1:08:27] through the state right now. And I say
this as there's a lot going on in a lot
[1:08:31] of our communities that are touching on
in our community already that are
[1:08:34] touching on some of these things because
we know to live here have to have a
[1:08:36] decent paying job in the city or we have
to, you know, it's part of our housing
[1:08:40] conversation too. the child care issue
isn't going to be solved by the city
[1:08:43] alone, but there are little things we
can do and there's other people out
[1:08:45] there that we can partner with to try
and elevate that conversation. and the
[1:08:50] so social equity and people living in
the core neighborhoods. That's I mean
[1:08:54] those are some econ those are people who
are the social equity especially I think
[1:08:58] we have a lot of good uh nonprofits in
our community doing that work and we
[1:09:01] just need to continue to support them
support initiatives when they come to us
[1:09:04] whether it's using the open space or
asking for proclamation those little
[1:09:08] things we do make a difference to the
bigger work that's being done by others
[1:09:11] in the community and uh the residents
and the core that's that's a cost issue
[1:09:16] that we're all we've all been struggling
and working with because you know it was
[1:09:21] I think there was a little bit of a
criticism of I think of David saying the
[1:09:24] visitation community versus tourism. But
I think we also have residents who live
[1:09:28] here five months of the year or four
months of the year that are people's
[1:09:32] neighbors that they see and they talk to
and they come to their neighborhood, you
[1:09:35] know, block party, but they're not
full-time residents here. And so that is
[1:09:39] that difference of the people that are
engaging and going to our schools and
[1:09:43] part of our economy. And so some of the
a lot of this is again those regional
[1:09:47] partners where we have to have some of
those um bigger conversations, but there
[1:09:51] are some this one I feel like has a
couple very tangible things that the
[1:09:54] city could do with our budget and align
with priorities better.
[1:09:58] » Yeah. C can I ask you is do you think
there's appetite to because I I
[1:10:03] personally think the encourage more
full-time residents living in the core
[1:10:06] neighborhoods. I understand the
sentiment, right, that people talk
[1:10:09] about.
>> Tough one to track because because
[1:10:12] you're really dealing with, you know,
people's individual rights and property
[1:10:15] rights, all that sort of stuff. Do you
think there's appetite to like push in
[1:10:19] on that in an like think about what
innovative approaches there could be or
[1:10:23] » I I think so. And I think it also is
something that my understanding right
[1:10:26] now, unless something's changed, is you
know, when you if you're a non-homestead
[1:10:30] resident, you pay more in tax, but that
all goes to TCAPS, the school district,
[1:10:33] which is good. We want to support our
schools, but we can as a city exercise a
[1:10:38] non-resident tax. And so, you know, is
that are there things like that that we
[1:10:43] again regionally with our partners like
Traverse Connect or something can
[1:10:46] advocate for as well as getting creative
with any changes in the law? Lauren, are
[1:10:50] you nodding your head? Yes or no? I'm
sorry.
[1:10:51] » I mean, it's something we could explore.
There are different there are different
[1:10:55] ways.
>> There are different things that we could
[1:10:58] explore, but I mean, it's really that's
a really tricky one to
[1:11:02] » Yeah. And so I think we have staff that
can get very creative and we have
[1:11:07] officials and community members who are
very creative. Um but we also have
[1:11:11] lancing so that limits us sometimes.
>> Yeah. Okay. Good. Thank you. Please.
[1:11:18] » So I I know that re of these that child
boosting child care capacity had a huge
[1:11:25] amount of uh of mass critical mass to
it. Um, and I'm going back to your point
[1:11:31] about micro centers. Until or unless the
state makes changes at that level, um, I
[1:11:38] think there is something to be said
about full-time encouraging full-time
[1:11:42] residents and boosting child care
through encouraging homebased care. Um,
[1:11:47] and if there are in and helping to if
there if there are still barriers with
[1:11:51] the density of homebased center or uh
other issues around zoning to be able to
[1:11:57] address that, but to if there are ways
to incentivize with developments, if we
[1:12:01] are offering a pilot for a development,
uh, is there a way to say to the
[1:12:06] developer and you know to really get to
maximize what we're willing to offer you
[1:12:10] for a pilot, uh, we would want you to
incentivize a unit for a homebased child
[1:12:17] care center. Uh this is something that
I've heard from actually from folks who
[1:12:21] work in the industry that they would
love to see this happening because where
[1:12:25] do we need most child more child care
centers in uh multifamily uh you know
[1:12:30] that makes a lot of sense to have it in
a multif family development. So I think
[1:12:34] that there is a way to connect those two
things together um and to move momentum
[1:12:39] on both of them.
>> Yeah. And it's not then the city
[1:12:42] necessarily doing it but you're
providing the enabling mechanisms.
[1:12:46] » Correct.
>> Yeah.
[1:12:48] » Thank you.
>> So left to my own devices this was this
[1:12:53] was my number one pillar.
>> Okay. And um because I think that um
[1:13:01] a community of full-time residents has
advantages in terms of quality of life
[1:13:08] that a that a hollowedout
community of of part-time or short-term
[1:13:13] residents or transitory residents um may
not. So, um I I am very interested in um
[1:13:24] exploring what kind of tools might be
available to us to encourage full-time
[1:13:29] residents. Um
I also am sensitive to the fact that
[1:13:35] we're hearing anecdotal
reports of um oh professionals, you
[1:13:42] know, doctors at Mson who turned down
jobs because they couldn't afford
[1:13:46] housing. Well, yes, housing prices are
high. Are salaries high enough?
[1:13:53] » So, I think that exploring
pay scales in Traverse City and um
[1:14:03] making making discrepancies between
Grand Traverse County and downstate
[1:14:09] counties and markets perhaps a little
more visible. you know, if we have a
[1:14:13] bully pulpit, that might be a place to
use it. Um, I am absolutely in favor of
[1:14:21] um
promoting Triricare wherever we can, the
[1:14:26] the summer camps definitely.
um looking for ways to um encourage
[1:14:35] whether through uh skill building or
financing
[1:14:39] um more child care locations. And I'm
not sure what that would take, but um
[1:14:48] you know, the lack of full-time
residents has this this knock-on effect
[1:14:53] on our school systems and our and our
retailers and our, you know, it just
[1:15:01] makes this strong seasonality of our
economy even worse. and and so I I see
[1:15:08] this as just a real urgent issue for the
quality of life overall.
[1:15:14] » Okay. Thank you.
>> Yeah. Um
[1:15:18] in the very early meetings I thought
this one this concept came out of the
[1:15:24] original thoughts about you know there
were a lot of talk about climate change
[1:15:27] and welloff people in other parts of the
countryside hey Traverse City looks good
[1:15:31] let's move there I can bring my business
work remotely whatever it might be. Um
[1:15:36] and so a lot of the discussion was
welloff people will be they are coming
[1:15:40] here and it will just accelerate and so
how do we stay a balanced community and
[1:15:45] that gets to some of uh all these words
that uh Heather referred to they get
[1:15:50] piled into there but I think on a a
simple or simp oversimplified basis it
[1:15:55] was let's remain a diverse community and
not just an aspen type of community in
[1:16:00] the future. Um, and so it will take hard
work and there aren't easy answers, but
[1:16:05] I think something a role that the city
could play better is uh as a clearing
[1:16:11] house to help current residents
understand what is available uh as far
[1:16:17] as assistance. Like there's a a USDA
section 504 uh program with significant
[1:16:24] amounts of money. like I'm going to
ignore the current state of the federal
[1:16:27] government, but there has been. And when
I spoke to somebody there several months
[1:16:30] ago, it was still in existence. Um, but
there's very low interest loans
[1:16:36] available there. And I believe the age
was 60 and above. You can get a $10,000
[1:16:41] grant even. So that's just an example.
And then there's, you know, uh, Trevor
[1:16:45] City Light and Power with Unbuilt
financing. There's a lot of programs in
[1:16:49] existence that I would guess a large
majority of our uh residents just aren't
[1:16:55] aware of. And it's not that
part of its marketing and packaging
[1:17:00] because this exists for everybody. It's
not like oh here's a hand they're not
[1:17:04] handouts like oh here's a handout
somehow. It's these exist for all of us
[1:17:08] for our community. Uh and we as a city
could maybe do a better job of I say
[1:17:14] clearing house. I don't know what the
right words are, but just uh helping to
[1:17:18] get the word out, spread the word, maybe
even help people fill out the paperwork
[1:17:22] somehow. You know, that that staffing,
etc. But u maybe there is a way to
[1:17:29] leverage what currently exists.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. And you know,
[1:17:34] just my personal opinion, so ignore it
if you choose, right? is that I I do
[1:17:38] think that that pressure for you as a
location. To me, it gives you about a
[1:17:44] fiveyear window, right? Your your
community character is going to get
[1:17:47] shaped dramatically by who comes here
and what radar you get on, right? And so
[1:17:53] you do have a a window when you perhaps
have the bully pulpit and things like
[1:17:57] that to be able to to create
expectations of if people move here or
[1:18:02] looking to move here, what does that
what does that come with it as a
[1:18:05] responsibility to be part of the
community? I mean there's a there's
[1:18:08] perhaps a whole range of creative things
you could think about. Um but I do think
[1:18:11] that that maintaining the sense of you
being a functioning community like a
[1:18:16] complete community. I I do and that's
one that's kind of easy to kind of kind
[1:18:21] of push off into the future because it's
not a pothole on the road and it's sort
[1:18:25] of it's more a trajectory. Um, but I do
think that's one as commissioners to
[1:18:31] really keep an eye on because the
character of your community could change
[1:18:34] and that's what that's what that
prioritization that's what I think the
[1:18:38] community was saying in that high
priority there about that you know might
[1:18:42] be it might be a sort of simplistic
approach just like let's find a way to
[1:18:46] stack more people in our common kind of
core neighborhoods but what they're
[1:18:49] really reflecting I think is a concern
about the the loss of community
[1:18:56] » um I I think that uh Commissioner
Wernner had a great point about some
[1:19:01] kind of public service workshops about
you know grants. Maybe you could fold in
[1:19:08] like the ADU you know plan thing. So we
have some kind of ongoing public service
[1:19:15] workshopy thing. Um it needs to be
budgeted of course. Um, I think that,
[1:19:22] uh, to your point, David, preserving
what we already have that people really
[1:19:27] like about this place, you know, our
trees, our access to recreation, safe
[1:19:32] streets, uh, great, uh, variety and
culture, um, good schools,
[1:19:39] all of those things, you know, just work
hard to make those things keep working
[1:19:43] like they are now. Um, we do have a wage
problem and maybe that needs some soft
[1:19:48] power behind it that we talk about it
more, you know, if if we can't if people
[1:19:53] can't afford here, people that we
actually need to be living here, then,
[1:19:58] you know, and we want people to be able
to maybe have a a rental and then they
[1:20:02] have a starter home, that kind of thing.
And that those options are pretty
[1:20:06] limited right now. I keep an eagle eye
on people who are claiming homestead
[1:20:12] status and maybe aren't really
homesteaders. U I've been told that that
[1:20:17] that actually does happen that the eagle
eye is there. Um and you know affordable
[1:20:25] housing for the service people who work
in our restaurants who
[1:20:29] you know most of the action takes place
in the summertime and then people get
[1:20:34] laid off. Uh our businesses try really
hard to keep those people on throughout
[1:20:38] the winter, but you know, it means that
they're not that they're bottom line is
[1:20:46] extremely thin trying to keep their
staff around and it doesn't help that
[1:20:50] our rents are so high. So, anything we
could do to help with that. Um as far as
[1:20:55] um the child care section, I think that
we've as far as Zoe is concerned, we've
[1:21:01] done everything we can to make it easy
to have child care. But I think I
[1:21:06] thought my uh Commissioner Stanley's
idea about incentives for homebased care
[1:21:13] was a great idea. That's a really good
idea. So maybe we can do something about
[1:21:19] that. Maybe that's part of this service
workshop program or every month it's
[1:21:25] about something else like
that's all I got.
[1:21:29] » Okay, great. Thank you very much. Um
two to go right. So um supporting
[1:21:36] environmental sustainability. So this is
that kind of bigger question about how
[1:21:40] we adapt to this changing world um
maintain a thriving ecosystem.
[1:21:46] um
few kind of really interesting actions
[1:21:49] rose to the surface, right? So this idea
of a sustainability plan that focuses on
[1:21:53] climate mitigation adaptation
uh research and replicate best practice
[1:21:58] sustainability um measures embed
environmental education visitor
[1:22:03] interface explore new visitation economy
funding sustain sustainability measures.
[1:22:08] So this will also kind of collapse over
a little bit actually into the to the
[1:22:13] year end economy which is the last
pillar. Um you can see here there was a
[1:22:17] bunch of pri high priority areas for the
community in this. So a number of the
[1:22:20] actions really jumped up. Um and the the
one where there was seem to be some
[1:22:26] progress was around the uh developing
the sustainability plan. Um clearly a
[1:22:31] deep value in this community. I mean
that just runs through the the core of
[1:22:35] it. Um but if we look at the data on uh
where we think we're doing in terms of
[1:22:41] alignment the budgets and programs uh
one being not at all aligned 10 being
[1:22:46] very well aligned you can see the the
numbers are are not your best scorec
[1:22:51] card right so and this is your your
assessment of that so there were areas
[1:22:55] here obviously where uh you saw that
there's there's obviously a lot of
[1:23:01] potential but there's also a lack of
alignment so may you want to take us
[1:23:05] Sure. Well, the first thing is I
absolutely agree that a plan of some
[1:23:09] kind um we did a climate action plan at
Traverse Lane Power that um you know
[1:23:15] different from what we're talking about
but not where I think
[1:23:19] this is where we get into in a lot of
discussions in the city commission level
[1:23:22] over the years where we hire I mean no I
just would say as a whole of the people
[1:23:28] that have been hired pretty much since I
started uh 10 years ago
[1:23:33] there's people know what they're getting
into with Traverse City. They know that
[1:23:36] we're an environmentally focused
community. They know that we're a
[1:23:39] community that tries to like have some
progressive values on things like this.
[1:23:43] And so that is where a lot of people are
our staff is starting from. And then
[1:23:48] there is a standard that varies from
elected body to elected body. You know,
[1:23:54] I think I've served with eight over the
last 10 years or seven. Seven or eight
[1:23:58] anyways. Um as well as what that means
to each person individually. And that's
[1:24:04] good. It keeps us at a high standard
because I think that is something that
[1:24:07] gets lost is Traverse City has a pretty
high standard for the state. If you
[1:24:10] travel around and you talk to people, we
are known and noted for the work we're
[1:24:14] doing. That's not a laurel we should sit
on. That's something we should
[1:24:17] continuously improve and push. But it
also means that it becomes very
[1:24:21] subjective when we're having especially
policy discussions of what that means to
[1:24:25] different people. And we've had heard it
argued about how we use the word
[1:24:29] sustainability, how we use, you know,
some of the more common accepted
[1:24:33] vernacular. And it's all very fair
convers critiques and conversations that
[1:24:38] need to be had. But I think having some
kind of an overarching plan with input
[1:24:43] that then at least everybody who knows
that when something comes to us from
[1:24:46] staff or something comes to us from an
initiative, it's coming from that base,
[1:24:51] right? I think it's and I think that's
something we have to do better on
[1:24:53] everything in the in our community.
Sometimes with our conversations, you
[1:24:56] know, we get questions sometimes, is
this legal? Well, nothing comes to us
[1:25:00] that hasn't been checked by our
attorney. Similarly, let's have
[1:25:03] something that reassures people that
minimally we've looked at these things.
[1:25:06] Now, the the body, the public then can
debate how could, you know, can we do it
[1:25:11] better? How do we budget for it to be
better? But knowing that there's these
[1:25:14] underpinnings of all everything coming
out of staff, that there's this agreed
[1:25:18] upon sentiment of this is what we mean
when we say we're bringing forth a
[1:25:22] policy that we feel meets our standards
environmentally as a community and as a
[1:25:26] city. I think that that's an important
baseline because otherwise it's going to
[1:25:29] be throwing everything at the wall and
seeing what sticks and arrows that may
[1:25:33] or darts that may or may not hit the
target depending on who's sitting in
[1:25:37] those seven seats and that's not the
best way for us to be effective and to
[1:25:41] get to the goals that we want to get to.
Um so that to me is the the very number
[1:25:46] one. Um you know the the a tourism or
the visitation economy and the tourism
[1:25:53] you know we know people come here for
that. We had this conversation I think
[1:25:56] at right here actually about in the
other room um about what does that mean
[1:26:00] and I think that ultimately again is a
lot of private industry but what can we
[1:26:05] do locally and explore that isn't um
yeah I wouldn't say you know punitive
[1:26:11] but what can we do to really encourage
our businesses through incentives
[1:26:14] through conversations through public
pressure to be more sustainable and in
[1:26:19] how they practice and what they do. Um,
so I think the, you know, kind of the
[1:26:25] the other three, the first three there,
17, 18, and 19, kind of all fall under
[1:26:29] us having a better baseline that we're
starting from because I think that's
[1:26:33] where some of the distrust is is, you
know, you have people, we have very
[1:26:36] active, engaged environmentalists in
this community. And so, you know, I
[1:26:39] think anything any commission could do
might never meet a high standard for
[1:26:42] that the that group of people. And
that's why it's great to have them in
[1:26:45] our community because they keep us
pushing. But let's at least have a
[1:26:47] baseline of people that we're starting
from.
[1:26:50] So can I dig into that just a little?
Right. So because and you were right.
[1:26:54] You said at the start that you know
people when they come here they know
[1:26:57] what they're getting into. Right. This
is a value that the community shares.
[1:27:00] Right.
>> But this data is your data and the
[1:27:04] candidates. Right. And does that say
that you don't feel like you're walking
[1:27:07] the talk? Is that or was that
>> Well, that's where I questioned I I
[1:27:12] think I rated this one higher than most
people because I looked at it through
[1:27:14] the lens again of we're talking
essentially what we're talking about to
[1:27:18] me to the stuff we're talking about the
disposable or the the discretionary
[1:27:22] funding that we have in our budget
because we have a lot of obligations and
[1:27:27] where we think that and I think that
that gets into we've talked about it in
[1:27:30] a couple of different arenas of where
people think that our staff is starting
[1:27:35] from and so I think that's a better that
comes down communication. But I think
[1:27:38] that's where having something
fundamental that we know is the baseline
[1:27:42] helps everybody gain that trust that
maybe because somebody might have had
[1:27:46] more conversations with our engineer or
our clerk or someone knows where they're
[1:27:52] at, it's you unless you have that
personal interaction, it becomes a they,
[1:27:56] right? It becomes an otherness. Okay?
>> And so trying to eliminate some of that
[1:27:59] otherness to say, listen, we know we're
all starting here. We know if you're if
[1:28:03] you're applying for a job here, this is
what you're you're buying into. if and I
[1:28:07] that was just for work by the way, not
the community or the for the staff, not
[1:28:10] just the community in general. Um, we
know that we we want to do more with our
[1:28:15] budget in this way, but what does that
look like? Because right now it's a
[1:28:18] project by project throwing a dart at it
or having a fight about us a sidewalk
[1:28:24] that's maybe relevant, but then are we
missing other things because we're
[1:28:28] getting focused on these projects that
are being brought forward that we're not
[1:28:30] doing enough with storm water, which we
know is something we're not doing enough
[1:28:33] with. And so let's like have this bigger
conversation so there's big this bigger
[1:28:37] underpinning that really that's why this
is one of the pillars for the budget
[1:28:41] right is we know that but on the small
scale and on the large scale things like
[1:28:45] storm water we need to do more but what
does that look and sound like that it
[1:28:50] isn't just arbitrary every year
depending on who seven people are
[1:28:53] sitting up there passing a budget. Yeah.
Yeah. I think it's, you know, that data
[1:28:58] also the way the actions were developed.
I think it's you're talking about staff
[1:29:03] coming knowing what they're buying into,
but people are also saying they want
[1:29:06] visitors to come and be part of the
solution. So,
[1:29:09] » so thank you. Please. So in terms of
budget, I would say we perhaps have been
[1:29:16] not as well aligned, but I think
programmatically or at least in terms of
[1:29:20] focus, there has been a lot of effort on
this around, you know, we've had two uh
[1:29:27] storm water ad hocs that have been very
active and you there's and again I think
[1:29:33] a lot of this comes down to what we uh
where we can use our for lack of a
[1:29:37] better word social capital to press some
levers to get uh others to to take
[1:29:42] action versus what we have the capacity
to mandate uh you know the the original
[1:29:48] storm water ad hoc we had the discussion
that this uh we couldn't have a utility
[1:29:52] because that would be considered a tax
um and you know things of that nature
[1:29:56] but I think that it's also you know we
every year we have the discussion about
[1:30:00] how much uh road salt we use and you
know there's been a 50% reduction and
[1:30:05] every year we talk about reducing that
further you so there this is a focus and
[1:30:11] I I also agree that having some like
very concrete sort of baseline you know
[1:30:15] a 50% reduction that's wonderful like
what where are we at what is our target
[1:30:20] you know do you know if we're talking
about getting to carbon neutrality you
[1:30:23] know where are we on that having if
there if there's a dashboard around that
[1:30:27] that so perhaps in terms of actual
budget allocations not hasn't been well
[1:30:32] aligned but there is work and has been
work happening here and there has been
[1:30:37] this is as to your point mayor uh
something that in the city of Traverse
[1:30:41] City there is there is a baseline uh you
know sort of expectation around this and
[1:30:46] so continuing to have those
conversations but get very concrete
[1:30:51] about what are the where what are the
areas where we can actually uh do
[1:30:57] something as a city uh that where are
where are the places we can have some
[1:31:02] mandates and some change some policies
and then where are the way ways we need
[1:31:07] to act more regionally to
to use some of those social pressures.
[1:31:13] » Very clear. Thank you.
>> It seems to me that this is the ideal
[1:31:20] issue um for regional collaboration. Um
we we are 8.2 square miles or whatever
[1:31:28] it is and surrounded by a much larger
area that
[1:31:34] you know we we need to do this together.
And uh
[1:31:40] it seems to me that this would
reach the the threshold of benefiting
[1:31:47] everyone. Everyone would have skin in
the game. everyone would experience
[1:31:51] benefits. And um you know perhaps if we
are um ahead of some of the other local
[1:32:00] government entities in our in our
actions in this area that maybe maybe we
[1:32:06] can act as a convenor or that we can um
you know leverage
[1:32:13] um input from local
water and environmental NOS's that um
[1:32:20] have been doing um quiet work for a long
time and uh to partner with them more
[1:32:28] more effectively.
>> Okay. Thank you.
[1:32:33] Yeah, there's uh two categories here in
my mind and they they do overlap from
[1:32:39] time to time and on certain topics, but
there's uh essentially water quality is
[1:32:44] one of our big things in Traverse City
and there were a lot of discussions
[1:32:47] during development of strategic plan. Uh
but also the climate crisis as another
[1:32:52] big topic and again there there is a ven
diagram where some things overlap. you
[1:32:56] know, certainly trees, storm water, uh,
intensity of events, things like that.
[1:33:01] Um, invasive species. Um, on the storm
water side though, like we as a city
[1:33:07] commission, I thought we did an
excellent job of starting the
[1:33:10] conversation about microlastics, you
know, with West End Beach and saying,
[1:33:13] "Hey, we don't want plastic netting
buried there that just degrades and ends
[1:33:18] up in the bay." Uh so there's topics
like that that
[1:33:22] their policy they won't take much as far
as budget but we could say you know what
[1:33:28] citywide for the city itself we don't
want to be using these materials sort of
[1:33:33] thing and adding to the microplastics
problems just as an example. Um but
[1:33:37] certainly storm water as we all know
whether uh for the many years that it's
[1:33:41] been addressed that is a serious
budgetary concern and then sanitary as
[1:33:45] well. Um so leaving that aside because
yeah it's budgetary and there's a lot of
[1:33:50] work to be done um and it will be
addressed but on the climate side I
[1:33:55] actually see that as more like the soft
power discussion um you know much like
[1:34:00] child care etc. We can't force this, but
we can ease the way. And to my comments
[1:34:06] on the previous topic, like that USDA
program, TC Light and Power, we as a
[1:34:12] city could act as a facilitator to help
with the bold idea of pilot
[1:34:16] electrification of homes in Traverse
City, and that would help current
[1:34:20] residents stay in their homes, you know,
lower their utility bills, etc., uh,
[1:34:24] improve insulation quality. Um so again
it might be a very small budgetary item
[1:34:29] for the city but it's more the
facilitator and bringing things together
[1:34:34] and having the knowhow you know working
with TC light and power and others uh to
[1:34:39] improve things for current residents um
and lead the way then on climate related
[1:34:45] things because we have like periodically
back in 2016 2018 and other times we
[1:34:50] kind of surge ahead and Traverse City
gets a lot of kudos statewide for what
[1:34:55] we're doing and then things calm down
and it takes a while. Okay, what's that
[1:34:59] next big thing? That could be that next
big thing that kind of puts us out there
[1:35:04] again and it's for the benefit of
residents.
[1:35:07] » Yeah. Yeah. Really good comments, too.
And I I I think that this is an area
[1:35:13] just again my my observation as the
outsider, right? I think this is an area
[1:35:17] that there's a lot of support for in the
community. And I loved your idea about
[1:35:21] like actually having concrete targets,
right? And and I know in the previous
[1:35:25] sort of goals and objectives, there was
sort of there was uh the topic was in
[1:35:30] there, but it wasn't really tied up in
in sort of really clear targets. And you
[1:35:34] know, I've I've watched a number of your
commission meetings where there's
[1:35:38] obviously, you know, there's individual
issues come in front of you, but they're
[1:35:42] lacking in the context of and I think
one was about permeable surfaces in a
[1:35:46] car park extension or something like
that, right? And I think that like
[1:35:49] getting really clear about some of those
fundamental values and and how you
[1:35:53] elevate those could really help I think
a lot of streamline a lot of those sort
[1:35:57] of decisions. So every decision is
contributing towards your goals towards
[1:36:01] some sort of you know environment of
sustainability and so on. But I I think
[1:36:06] there's an enormous area for of
innovation is potentially young.
[1:36:12] Um
I I think that a regional approach is
[1:36:16] important for this, but in fact, we are
at the bottom of the hill on the bay. I
[1:36:20] mean, we're like the drain and I don't
think we're doing a very good job. Um,
[1:36:25] TCOP has certainly made more progress
than I think the city has, even though
[1:36:30] TCLP is part of the city. But, um, like
that storm water plan that that the DDA
[1:36:35] had done maybe in 2018, it is a great
action plan and it's just sitting on the
[1:36:41] shelf. Nobody's done anything with it.
Uh, and that's that's really too bad.
[1:36:45] And um
uh it seems to me that we just start
[1:36:51] building like bio swells are just built
into when we when we reconstruct streets
[1:36:57] we're just always putting in because we
flood all over the city. So we just add
[1:37:01] bioells. Um let's see what else the uh
research and rep number 18 using
[1:37:09] practice for others. Absolutely. We, you
know, I think that I feel like I do
[1:37:14] research to look around to see what
other people are doing. People are doing
[1:37:17] amazing things all over. Like Holland
uses its wastewater treatment plant to
[1:37:22] melted snow. We have a wastewater
treatment plant city right in the middle
[1:37:26] of the city. I mean, that's a big that's
a big one, but you know, somebody could
[1:37:32] look into that and see how that's done.
Um
[1:37:36] the number 19 replicate uh get some
interface locations. This is a great
[1:37:42] idea and uh Commissioner Warner and I
are are working with the working on the
[1:37:47] um Brownbridge Trust. It's a big fund
that that we're looking to release $3
[1:37:53] million, looking to get the citizens to
approve releasing $3 million to uh
[1:37:59] enhance parks in the in the city. And
one of those is a really big plan for
[1:38:05] shore water uh shoreline restoration. So
the the um the plan would be to add in
[1:38:12] all theseformational
centers. Like why why are you planting
[1:38:16] dune grass that is sort of obstructing
my view uh of the bay? Well, we plant it
[1:38:22] so that the geese can't see that there's
grass on the other side and they don't
[1:38:27] poop all over the place. You know, just
that kind of thing. It's also maybe an
[1:38:31] opportunity uh to have sort of
interactive educational cultural kinds
[1:38:38] of you know clinch park is has lots of
space there. The open space has lots of
[1:38:43] space for those kinds of projects. I
don't know where that would go through
[1:38:47] parks and
um
[1:38:50] and as for the last one I I agree with
again with commissioner somebody about
[1:38:57] policy. You know we have the policy. all
the microplastics.
[1:39:01] But um
this is again I think this is a place to
[1:39:05] put soft influence.
You know, how do we get rid of single
[1:39:10] plastic use?
>> Yeah.
[1:39:11] » And all of our events? How do we
encourage our our uh service people to
[1:39:19] stop using single plastic use? Maybe
it's a bag. It's a tote bag that's made
[1:39:24] out of cloth that that you I don't know
that advertises we don't use plastic
[1:39:30] here or the city doesn't use plastic.
The city should make it a policy to stop
[1:39:35] using plastic. One more thing at the top
too is is there anything we can do to
[1:39:40] strengthen our construction codes so
that things like green roofs are
[1:39:45] promoted in some way because we can't do
it through zoning. I learned that the
[1:39:50] hard way.
Well, sorry to corrupt your dreams, but
[1:39:56] we also can't do any bans or regulations
on single least plastic because the
[1:40:00] state legislature,
>> this is a soft influence. That's what I
[1:40:03] said.
>> Yes. In their infinite wisdom,
[1:40:06] specifically prohibited local
municipalities or counties from having
[1:40:11] regulations on that. So yes, we could do
it for our own stuff, but the events
[1:40:17] where the city is serving food is a
relatively small share of those plastic
[1:40:22] plates and cups and forks that get used
in this community and
[1:40:27] uh even in our downtown.
But this pillar, I'm actually surprised
[1:40:32] that the ratings for alignment are so
low since on the previous slide, it's
[1:40:38] something that we both value strongly in
our community and we're putting a lot of
[1:40:43] effort into which rings up the question
for me, uh, do people think we're
[1:40:48] misaligned because we're not doing
things the way or not focusing on
[1:40:54] priorities the way that individuals
think that they should be? Like, we
[1:40:58] might be putting in electric car
charters and other people think we
[1:41:03] should be investing more in public
transportation instead or is it people
[1:41:09] thinking that we've done a lot but their
goals are aspiring to be even higher. So
[1:41:16] yes, we are setting at a standard uh
above many other communities in Northern
[1:41:22] Michigan, but how high a standard can we
actually set?
[1:41:28] Yeah.
>> All right. Thank you. Right. So, last
[1:41:32] one. Right. So, I presume you want to
allow a few minutes for public comment
[1:41:35] or questions at the end. So,
>> so let's do this one quick. Right. Um,
[1:41:40] so building a thriving year round
economy. Um, it's the final pillar. A
[1:41:44] lot of what's in this will have heard uh
people talk about. Um, the actions that
[1:41:50] surfaced in this embracing a sustainable
tourism approach. Um, and it's
[1:41:54] multifaceted. It's got the environmental
impact as well as the economic and the
[1:41:58] quality of life components. Um, high
priority from the community. Um,
[1:42:03] marketing to the remote workforce. We've
talked about that. Uh, recreational and
[1:42:07] resource related products and
businesses. Building on the specialized
[1:42:09] advanced manufacturing sector. Um, not
areas that there's been really a lot of
[1:42:14] work by the city u from the judgment uh
from the work we do with staff. Um
[1:42:20] here's your your data on this in terms
of how well aligned to um not at all
[1:42:26] aligned to very well aligned. Uh again
you can see that this is 5.3 was the
[1:42:31] only one that cracked over a five right
in the individual actions. Um and I
[1:42:36] think that talks to a lot of the work
the really good work that's been going
[1:42:38] on around that. But um my do you want to
take us away?
[1:42:43] » So
I think again this this along the
[1:42:50] climate feels like a very much a
regional
[1:42:54] issue and topic where we need to be
working collaboratively uh as you know
[1:42:59] thinking about advanced manufacturing.
Do we do we have even one industrial
[1:43:04] manufacturing park within the city
limits? We have so we have one
[1:43:08] » park
>> and a parks and the remainder are in
[1:43:11] surrounding townships but you know that
I think this looking at uh I'm I'm cons
[1:43:18] I have the concern about marketing us
for the remote workforce the remote
[1:43:22] workforce is here and um and in part
that is driving to a certain degree the
[1:43:27] lack of affordability in our housing.
they are bringing their Silicon Valley
[1:43:32] incomes to our real estate market and
where the folks that are working in jobs
[1:43:37] here are still earning half the pay for
the beautiful bay. Um although that is
[1:43:42] improving. So I do I do think that we
like where there's excitement around the
[1:43:47] blue economy, the uh electric boats
there and the specialized advanced
[1:43:51] manufacturing and again most of this
will be happening outside of city limits
[1:43:55] but making sure that the city has a seat
at the table and being uh in the
[1:44:00] conversation around the economic
development aspects of this and the
[1:44:03] impacts on the local residents, the
year-round residents who are already
[1:44:08] here is going to be key. Yeah,
absolutely. Yeah. Thank you.
[1:44:14] » Um just a cautionary comment about
targeting uh the remote workforce. Um if
[1:44:23] you look at the national numbers,
they're declining fairly rapidly. And um
[1:44:28] you know, our percept our local
perceptions may not match that because a
[1:44:33] big employer like Hagerty has such a a
fairly broad-based remote work policy.
[1:44:40] But um I I do think that um number 23
and the blue economy has a lot of legs
[1:44:50] and um I I would want to be sure that um
residents and resident benefits are um
[1:45:00] taken into consideration while this is
essentially an economic development
[1:45:06] initiative. Again, I want to see
balance. Um, you know, are there ways
[1:45:11] that residents can benefit from that
economic development and and be as
[1:45:18] specific as we can about that?
>> Yeah. Thank you.
[1:45:24] » Yeah. As far as building the thriving
year-round economy, I guess I'm I'm most
[1:45:28] in favor of
investing in
[1:45:32] what we have for our current residents.
um you know
[1:45:37] make what's good even better what make
make what's poor good like try to step
[1:45:42] everything up of what we currently have
and make it a better place I mean it's
[1:45:47] already it's a great place but there's
place there's opportunities for
[1:45:50] improvement and I guess I'm more in
favor of focusing on folks living here
[1:45:57] now we make it an even better place
people will hear that people will know
[1:46:02] and they will come and they will either
bring their job with them from Silicon
[1:46:06] Valley. You we're not going to stop them
or they'll move here and start a
[1:46:10] business etc. So to me that that's
economic development is we just make it
[1:46:16] an even better place than it already is
but with focus on current residents and
[1:46:22] others will continue to come because
word spreads.
[1:46:25] » Yeah. So sort of focusing on that core
value proposition.
[1:46:28] » Yeah.
>> And getting that crisp and that does the
[1:46:31] job for you.
>> Yeah. here. Here I second that. Um I
[1:46:35] think that the uh action 22
and such as it is because I've seen the
[1:46:42] numbers too. They're just plummeting.
Everybody has to go back to the office.
[1:46:46] And uh 23 that's Traverse Connect land.
24 is a regional issue like Commissioner
[1:46:53] Stanley said. I I agree. And 21 is um I
think it goes back to the last pillar,
[1:46:59] pillar five was it
>> about embedding and replicating
[1:47:03] education at visitor interface
locations. If if visitors come here and
[1:47:08] they don't know that we're interested in
sustainability then
[1:47:13] because we're not telling them, so let's
tell them. And that comes through signs
[1:47:17] and u better interactive kind of things.
And we have that whole big waterfront
[1:47:22] down there to put put stuff on.
And and the K Foster Museum, I mean,
[1:47:29] maybe that's also a place whatever goes
in there is more it's maybe we'd like to
[1:47:35] see something that's more centered on
what we're doing for the sustainability
[1:47:39] of Traverse City.
>> Yeah. You know, I think that's a bigger
[1:47:43] conversation the community is wanting to
have actually is about that evolution of
[1:47:47] the tourism economy
>> and that's hard to kind of surface when
[1:47:51] you're in a economy that is driven so
much by that sort of that economic
[1:47:55] driver. Uh but I certainly heard a lot
from the community and in the various
[1:48:00] sessions we had.
>> Yeah. And talking about tourism, yes,
[1:48:06] there are a lot of concerns about the
scale of tourism and how much this uh
[1:48:11] community promotes tourism continually,
but I'd say part of that is that so much
[1:48:17] of the impact of tourism is during three
months or especially two weeks of the
[1:48:23] summer. uh when if we did have some of
those people were here for a fall color
[1:48:30] tour, which leaves are starting to
change already. Hate to see this early,
[1:48:35] but seasons seasons
>> or coming up for spring uh cherry
[1:48:41] blossoms or uh we do have people that
come to Hickory Hills or to other ski
[1:48:46] resorts but enjoy here in the winter. We
are a season that we are a community
[1:48:51] that is beautiful in all four seasons
and that people have reason to visit
[1:48:54] here for all four seasons. And if
the marketing and promotion that does
[1:49:02] happen for this region can be trying to
spread those visitors out and to balance
[1:49:08] it so that it isn't as acutely taxing
our roads, our infrastructure,
[1:49:15] uh our stress levels trying to navigate
across town.
[1:49:18] that could be helpful.
And I see, yes, remote workers were a
[1:49:25] thing for a period of time. They've
declined. I see that as a potential
[1:49:32] cliff um for any municipality or region
that tries to go in that direction
[1:49:38] because currently
uh for various grants and uh programs if
[1:49:45] you're trying to get state federal MEDC
monies they have scorecards for how many
[1:49:53] employers you have in a given area what
is your housing portfolio and other
[1:49:57] metrics
that don't um have any accounting for
[1:50:02] remote workers. So,
>> uh for a project like lot O, if we're
[1:50:07] trying to redevelop that with Homestart
into housing, they check a box by saying
[1:50:12] it's in a downtown area and downtown is
defined as 29 consecutive storefronts
[1:50:18] along uh one or two main streets. Um it
they also check a box by saying you have
[1:50:24] x number of employers over 50 employees.
They check another box by saying you
[1:50:29] have one employer over 500. That
employer is Hagerty.
[1:50:34] And we don't have 500 people day in day
out at Hagerty. But because the numbers
[1:50:41] and haven't been changed to account for
how remote work is actually processed,
[1:50:47] that still shows up as 500 employees. If
they do change, we don't automatically
[1:50:54] get credit for um remote workers that
are working somewhere else but are in
[1:50:58] our community because they're not at a
single job site or in a central area,
[1:51:04] which would mean more people going to
your local cafe for on their lunch
[1:51:10] break. More people that will have um
happy hours at the same time that will
[1:51:15] similarly spend money in the local area.
people shopping at the same grocery
[1:51:20] stores.
[1:51:23] » Thank you. May I last word?
>> Sure. Um just a little one here. Um so
[1:51:29] first and foremost, um I'm actually
going to save the two words for the last
[1:51:32] part. I don't disagree with anything
that's been said, but a couple other
[1:51:35] thoughts on it. Um but building on the
specialized manufacturing sector um
[1:51:41] there's and it was been said that this
is a regional and it is but I think this
[1:51:45] is also a matter of recognizing you know
the comments been brought up a couple
[1:51:50] times now what if we hired somebody and
made it out had us a clearing house to
[1:51:54] help people through application
processes da da da da that it is a good
[1:51:58] idea and networks Northwest does it
NMCAA does it Michigan Works does it
[1:52:01] there's a lot of groups doing it that we
could probably partner with to bring in
[1:52:04] and have them have a day at the
governmental center, things like that.
[1:52:06] But I I come back to this because
Michigan Works, Networks Northwest,
[1:52:10] MMTC, there's a lot of organizations
here that are working on the
[1:52:14] manufacturing aspect that again when
we're talking about our soft power or
[1:52:17] we're talking having conversations, I
think it's important for us to be more
[1:52:21] aware of who's out doing what and that
those are more uh like MMTC is more and
[1:52:27] Michigan works to a point are more
manufacturing based, but there's a lot
[1:52:29] of organizations out there that are very
collective already that are trying to
[1:52:34] help move these conversations about
jobs. We just when we renewed our um
[1:52:38] Traverse Connect contract, part of the
conversation was the bigger conversation
[1:52:42] that started to happen with Travers
Connect, all the businesses
[1:52:44] participating is what are we doing about
wages and how are we going to make those
[1:52:48] sustainable? I know that the you know
they they just got that grant for the
[1:52:53] offsetting the the rent, but I will say
this, it might only be 50 people. I was
[1:52:57] talking to a nurse who's my friend's
girlfriend and he used to live here.
[1:53:01] He's moved too because of job reasons
and I said, "Yeah, you know, for the
[1:53:04] first couple first couple of years if
because of this, if you wanted to come
[1:53:07] take your nursing degree from Milwaukee
and move to Traverse City, there's this
[1:53:11] rent benefit." And that was something
that piqued her interest and she wanted
[1:53:14] to look at because the reality is it's
not just our service workers looking for
[1:53:17] affordable housing. It's our teachers,
it's our fire department, our firemen,
[1:53:21] it's our, you know, police officers.
It's not a you know that there's a very
[1:53:25] wide spectrum of people and so to that
end about the remote workers the other
[1:53:30] thing about remote working now is where
it is remaining they're paying national
[1:53:35] average not Silicon Valley prices
anymore. So again, that's not a terrible
[1:53:39] thing if you're saying, "Hey, we have
high speeded internet for TCLP, so move
[1:53:43] here instead of Paskki or move here
instead of, you know, a smaller
[1:53:47] community in the region where we are
more of a year-round economy." And it is
[1:53:50] something to talk about, but I don't
think it's something we have to lean
[1:53:52] hard into. Um, because there are a lot
of people out doing this work as part of
[1:53:57] our regional I agree with what everybody
said about it being a regional solution,
[1:54:00] but I think there's a lot of regional
work being done on it. We just need to
[1:54:03] educate ourselves better and be louder
proponents in that sector as well. Um,
[1:54:07] and then the other part that I was going
to talk about is the tourism. And I I
[1:54:12] hear a lot and I know it come it came
through at some of the sessions and and
[1:54:15] everything else. And I'm not saying it's
wrong at all. To David's point, you're
[1:54:20] seeing it out in Detroit for Pure
Michigan and come to Trevor City and you
[1:54:23] don't want anybody to come. I was born
and raised here. My mom was born and
[1:54:27] raised here. Trevor City is a tourist
economy. We shouldn't rely on it. It
[1:54:31] shouldn't be built to be bigger on that.
But people do come. And so where we need
[1:54:36] to do better, I think, is engaging with
Traverse City Tourism and other people
[1:54:39] who are in it. I think the sometimes
knee-jerk negative response and tone
[1:54:44] that people some people have or we have
kind of as these conversations or even
[1:54:47] the kind of sarcasm as part of some of
these conversations isn't going to
[1:54:51] benefit us long run. We know that
frankly they're an organization that
[1:54:54] brings a lot of people together. They're
two of our counties, ours and Benzy now.
[1:54:58] And also I mean they have a pot of
money. We know that there the tax the
[1:55:04] bed tax that gets assessed right now is
not ours, it's theirs. And so I think
[1:55:08] that there's more I've seen over the
last few years a much more of a
[1:55:12] willingness from them to come and say,
you know, what do what do you guys what
[1:55:15] are we doing? What do we need? And so to
that end, I think that there's that
[1:55:20] conversation that still needs to happen
on a bigger scale and a more earnest
[1:55:22] scale. And the other thing I would say
really quickly is unfortunately when we
[1:55:26] talk about the tourist tax, you would
think that we'd all be united in that
[1:55:29] and then every time something comes or
when I I testified in Lancing about
[1:55:32] that. Um there's a lot of municipalities
and townships that say, "Well, we don't
[1:55:37] want to tax because they might not come
people might not come here because of
[1:55:40] our city tax or our local tax and
they'll go to the next jurisdiction
[1:55:44] over." I think we in Traverse City know
that's not an issue, but we also have to
[1:55:47] bring I don't think that conversation
that it's a bigger conversation that we
[1:55:50] also I think have to use our influence
on a little bit more because I don't
[1:55:53] think it's the gimme that everybody
thinks it is outside of Southeast
[1:55:56] Michigan. So that's kind of my brain
dump on all of that. But so I think as
[1:56:01] far as budget alignment, there's not a
ton of budget alignment for us on that.
[1:56:04] I think the investment in Traverse
Connect helping us bring some of the
[1:56:07] jobseeking and and um focus on different
economies is good. Um, but I think we
[1:56:11] can all do it's a much more soft
influence item even though it's huge.
[1:56:17] » Okay. Thank you. Good final say. Um, so
next steps. So this has been fantastic,
[1:56:23] right? To be able to
>> 5:30 on the nose.
[1:56:25] » I know.
>> Yeah.
[1:56:27] » So I want to give you a minute for
questions as well, but I just just like
[1:56:30] next steps on this, right? Obviously, we
wanted to give you a chance to kind of
[1:56:33] just really talk from your kind of core
about your reaction to to these ideas
[1:56:38] that the community generated. Um, I
think this provides a lot of kind of
[1:56:43] overlay and nuance. Um, and what
Benjamin and I have been talking about
[1:56:47] is that our next step is we want to take
basically each one of these pillars and
[1:56:51] work it up as here as a I guess a
proposition for how the budgeting and
[1:56:57] the programming in the city could evolve
to get closer to it right now. We're
[1:57:01] looking 3 to 5 years out. So, it's not
like, you know, January it all flips,
[1:57:05] right? It's but it's going to get us
onto a trajectory. Um, and I think
[1:57:09] there's a really interesting set of
layers in here of like kind of hard
[1:57:12] budget and and sort of program issues,
but there's a lot that you talked about
[1:57:16] that's really about your voice and
influence. And I think that sort of may
[1:57:20] get expressed in sort of values and, you
know, sort of the the key objectives and
[1:57:25] um some of those things, not necessarily
straight into hard sort of key results,
[1:57:29] but we'll we'll work on that. And I
think the next time we come together,
[1:57:32] it'll be getting you to react to that.
Um, this is still a little bit draft
[1:57:36] because we have a couple of commissions
still to finish the survey and I know
[1:57:40] one of the candidates did it between I
downloaded the data this morning and
[1:57:43] today, right? So, we'll see whether we
can get the additional candidates to
[1:57:47] complete that. Um, but I think this was
a cracking good start to that
[1:57:50] conversation. So, Benjamin, thank you
for helping put this together.
[1:57:53] » Thank you. And I want to thank Colleen
Pavllio, too, for all of her work uh all
[1:57:56] along the way. And I just want to say
how much I appreciate the conversation
[1:58:01] that the commission had. The amount of
uh context and perspective that you
[1:58:04] shared I think is helpful and will I
hope give us something to come back to
[1:58:09] you with that you can help us make sure
that we're uh distilling what you're
[1:58:14] saying in the way that you meant it. So
thank you very much.
[1:58:17] » So we are this is a meeting and I want
to give people a chance to have their
[1:58:20] voice. Um we do have a meeting at 7
o'clock tonight. So, I'm going to ask
[1:58:24] with kindness that we do two minutes
public comment if anybody wants to. Um,
[1:58:28] we are going to be have continuing this
conversation. This is the very very
[1:58:32] first look and very first reactions.
There's potential for another survey.
[1:58:36] There's going to be more discussions on
each pillar as we talked about. There's
[1:58:39] going to be um just a lot more
discussions. This is a first glance. We
[1:58:43] want to hear if anybody has any overall
thoughts kind of like where we're at of
[1:58:46] our impressions. But I also um would ask
that kind of kind of keep that to your
[1:58:52] first reactions and not worry that
because you heard something here, it's
[1:58:54] inherently what you have to talk us out
of because I think there's a lot of a
[1:58:57] lot of big conversations that are h are
happening and ultimately it's going to
[1:59:01] be another body too that does some of
this. So, uh Sarah has her portable mic.
[1:59:05] I think someone will just if could
somebody could just bring it over to our
[1:59:07] audience and people just raise your
hands if you want it
[1:59:10] » uh want to speak and share any
information.
[1:59:13] » The only thing I ask is that you state
your name for me.
[1:59:16] » Yes.
[1:59:20] first.
>> Oh, see I said
[1:59:23] » I said two minutes and I scared
everybody. We can You can have three if
[1:59:26] you're home and have a dinner.
>> Yeah, right. We're all hungry.
[1:59:30] » Oh, yeah. I didn't pack pizza.
>> All right. Well, we look forward to
[1:59:34] seeing a lot of engaged people here. We
look forward to seeing I'm sure not all
[1:59:37] of you, but all of our future
conversations and um again
[1:59:43] your thank
you do anything else? No. Okay, I'm
[1:59:47] going to adjourn this meeting for
anybody who wants a part two. 7 o'clock
[1:59:49] tonight.