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We want to grab a seat. There's some over here, some over here, some back there, for those of you that are interested.

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Can we please have a roll call?

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In the gallery,

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cozy, here, and Mayor Rueda. Thank you. Next on the agenda, we have a report on the posting of the agenda. Acting clerk, could you please let us know if the agenda was posted according to the state requirements?

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The agenda was posted in a point to state requirements.

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Thank you.

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Okay, moving on.

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We have a approval of the agenda.

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Do I have any comments on the agenda or a motion for approval?

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Let's see if the microphone works.

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Is there a second?

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Okay, all in favor?

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Aye.

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Opposed?

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Great.

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Well, we're off to the start here.

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Good evening and welcome to all of you who have come to join us for this

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important discussion. Can you all hear me okay? No? All right, I'll try and talk

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but board out. Okay, we appreciate your attendance.

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It's great to see so many engaged residents. And thank you to all of those who sent emails to us in advance. I try to respond to all of those that at least I received was they came in the last hour. So thank you for sharing your thoughts on this important matter. I'd also like to thank the school district for finding this site for us. We wanted to find something that was larger than council and this was the only room that was available.

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So, my kids went to elementary school here, so it's kind of nice to be back on the other

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side.

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They were usually on the stage.

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We are going to have a bit of a different month today because we're not in council chambers

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and so we're going to deal with the technology but we've got this figured out and if you'll

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just bear with us, that would be great too.

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Okay,

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so

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we're here tonight to talk about the cycle of our housing element and just as

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a refresher, housing elements are anything new.

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The fifth cycle ran from 2013 to 2021.

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This cycle runs from 2021 to 2009.

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What is different in which why this is more prevalent or visible to the community is the requirements placed on our city have changed.

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In the last cycle, we only needed to find 16 potential sites for housing units, so 16 was doable.

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Now we have to find 199 potential unit sites plus a 15% buffer, so it's a much bigger undertaking than what we've had to do in the past.

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We've got a big crowd here. We want to hear from all of you. If you want to talk, you're going to get a chance to talk.

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And so because we've got such a big crowd, as we, as you step up, we're going to ask that to the extent possible if you could try and keep your comments to three minutes or less.

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If somebody has stated something that you also want to talk about, if you could reference that or say, diddo, but anything just so that we can be respectful of your time and trying to keep moving here.

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We know that many of you are unhappy about specific locations that are under consideration.

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I get that, we get that.

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The challenge is there is a solution that's going to make everyone happy

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and so we're trying to do the best we can to meet the requirements placed on us by Sacramento

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while taking into account the various needs of our community.

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So, let's talk a little bit about how the meeting is going to go tonight.

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We're going to have a brief presentation by staff and our consultant regarding the

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requirements and the criteria that HDD, and I can't remember what the acronym means,

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but anyway, that's the organization that oversees the housing elements and is responsible

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for approving every city's housing element.

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So we'll get a brief presentation on the criteria and the sites that are under review.

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There's really a small solution set for our city.

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We've got a built-out city and we've got a lot of open space and we've got a lot of private

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land that has de-restrictions.

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And so Gina's going to talk to us about what's within that solution set.

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Following that council members will ask clarifying questions of staff and then when those questions

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are done we're going to open up for public comment.

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As I said, if you want to speak, we're here to hear it.

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We have a standing microphone here so we don't have to pass a microphone around.

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You all don't have to line up and rush the line.

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We're going to hear everyone.

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So, you know, enjoy your seat for a while and then as the line gets to a reasonable length

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or the length that you're willing to stand for, then go ahead and join in line.

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We are all passionate about our city.

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We are all passionate about the locations and character and the sights in our city.

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We get that.

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I do ask, though, that as each person speaks, that we are respectful of them.

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That we're not fooling, we're not sharing, we're not clapping.

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If you don't have the microphone, please don't speak.

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There will be an opportunity for you to speak.

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And then finally, you know, speakers get one bite at the apple, so we ask that there are no repeat speakers.

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we do

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We are, as I said, we've got a three-minute clock timer. It's really a guideline and to kind

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of give you a sense for what's going on. I know what you're stressed about it. You can

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even go over a little bit. That's fine, but we really do want to try and be respectful

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of each other and each other's time. Our intent tonight is to make a decision on which

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sites to include in our submission to HCD, even with sites selected, and for

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women area approved by HCD, the housing element will not be final until we have

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resumed the selected sites. That is a requirement placed on our city by HCD and

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other cities like us that are laid in submitting and getting approval of their

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housing element. Concerned with HDD review and rezoning, Council has directed staff to

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provide proposals for developing objective design standards which will help us retain

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some local control over the characteristics of future building. We're doing everything

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we can to comply with state mandates while maintaining the character of our city.

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So that's

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the layout of what's going on.

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Right now, we're going to turn to staff for a staff report.

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What's going to happen here is because the screen comes down so that we're not like the

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Wizard of Oz, hide behind the screen.

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We're going to come down and sit in these chairs here.

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And then when we come back up here, that means there's five more chairs up for grass for

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people who want to have a seat.

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But carefully.

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there are still some seats up here raise your hand

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so one more time, if there is a seat next to you raise your hand, I have a gentleman there, I have a woman there, I have a chair here, I have a chair here

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Anyone else? Got any seat available? We're all friends, we're all neighbors. We can get

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cozy. Okay, we're coming down.

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And

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members of the city council, before Gina gives the presentation on the housing element of what I like

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to do tonight is like to give you a brief background of what's going on throughout the process.

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at your number 14 meeting the City Council approved the

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seminal of a partial draft not related to the size of the

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left hand and site analysis for HCD informal review. Also the

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City Council directed staff to discuss with HCD as many sites

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as possible for consideration, including previous housing

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element sites including churches. Gina's going to go into further detail regarding those sites.

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The City Council did at your regular meeting of January 23rd of 2024 discuss viable sites that

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were discussed with HCD and staff also provided a brief description of three viable sites.

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Following the discussion, the Council directed staff to schedule a special City Council meeting

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which is tonight to further analyze and or select potential sites acceptable to HCD for

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inclusion into the City's six-cycle housing element.

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The presentation will go into further detail.

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Also, as part of the site, a mixed use overlay is proposed for the site with the

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The Jansettee range of 25 to 3rd place, the Jansettee range of 25 to 3rd place, the Jansettee range of 25 to 3rd place.

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And it's being used to calculate the den cities. Objectives that kind standards will also be created, which Mayor Murdoch mentioned once the resounding process occurs. The city's commercial zone does allow the residential uses.

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Any churches that are proposed as viable sites and are included in the housing.

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will require a resumption commercial, which allows for the resident's child.

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Also, I wanted to bring to your attention Todd Leishman with BBK is on Zoom, along with Trevor Russ and his in the audience.

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And we'll be available to answer any questions.

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At this point, I'd like to hand over to Gina, who will be giving a presentation.

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Good

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evening.

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All right.

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Good evening.

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We're not getting canceled members and members of the community.

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So again, I'm going to reiterate that some of the criteria for this site's inclusion.

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I'm going to write into it.

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And this is really a recap of the meeting that occurred on January 23rd of this year.

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So, among many of the criteria that HVD considers, of course, some of these are access to high

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performing student jobs, access to amenities, available infrastructure, proximity to transit,

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and that could just mean a bus stop, doesn't have to be a high-quality bus corridor, a site

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between the size of one-half acre and 10 acres and the ability to accommodate at least 16 units.

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Other criteria are sites with obsolete uses, sites with large vacancies such as open space,

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a lot of shrubbery, large open parking spaces, parking areas, older buildings with signs of

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different maintenance sites with one owner versus many owners and

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again as we

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reiterate at every meeting there are severe consequences for non-compliance

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and the state does monitor every city to determine whether they are in compliance

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those cities that are not are reported to the attorney general and the courts can

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and imposed fines of up to $100,000 per month.

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Also, there's a lot of potential funding.

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There are plenty of grants out there

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that could potentially fund infrastructure in the city.

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The city would be ineligible for those funds.

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And last, there is a possibility of the builder's remedy

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and to, I

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think that it was brought up at the last meeting, but basically what that means

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is that a developer with a viable affordable housing project that needs certain criteria

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can come in and bypass the zoning ordinance and the general plan as long as they meet

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the affordable housing criteria set before and by the state.

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So the city would not.

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Okay. Sorry about that. I appreciate it. Thank you. Just holler like that.

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Okay. So this is a recap of the sites inventory proposed at the last city council meeting. So there were three sites that were identified in addition to a huge

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So, accessory dwelling units, we were proposing 80 over the course of the next eight years,

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so 10 per year, and the 40 single or 41 single family detach lots throughout the city.

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And I want to emphasize that those single family lots are just being proposed as they are,

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single family.

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Those were not anticipated to be rezoned.

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I don't know if that was ever made clear in the past, but just for clarification those would just be as they are.

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It's an inventory of land that is available for housing for all income levels and above moderate is an income level.

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So, site one, the Malaga Cove site, site two, the Lunata Bay site, and three, the first

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church of Christ scientists, and we'll get into those three particular sites in the next

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slide.

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So the Malaga Cove site was proposed with the overlay, a mixed use overlay of 25 to 30D

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for acre, or two parcels, that roughly equal to 0.68 acres, and they would accommodate

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at 11 low and very low and 6 moderate units. So 70, a couple units, and I'm pointing

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that out because each site that is used in the housing element that accommodates low and

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very low income units,

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much you have to accommodate at least 16 units.

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I said that before when I'm reiterating it so that it makes a little bit more sense.

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So if we try to use any density less than 25 dwellings for acre, we would not meet the

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threshold to use that site.

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Moving on to the Linada Bay Cadios building.

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This was also proposed with an overlay zone.

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It's also pump 68 acres and has the same amount of units, 11 very low and low and 6 moderate.

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And I'll take the time now to emphasize what the mix use overlay zone means

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that would allow the existing uses to continue in a mixed use fashion. The current zone,

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the commercial zone that's in the, on the books now in the city, does allow for this condition,

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allows for up to 24.9 willingness for acre mixed with commercial.

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So, the proposal was in line at the minimum entity with the city.

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And the third site that was proposed at the January 23rd meeting was the first Church of Christ scientist.

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And this is two parcels that equate to 4.68 groups.

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Now, you'll see the slide has two density ranges listed.

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So there were some options for the site because it does not have current commercial uses.

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To save time, the city could propose just one overlay zone and overlay all are used the

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same overlay zone for all sites, which would have been a 25 to 30 d per acre zone, which

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would result in 75 low and very low and 41 moderate income units, or if the city chose

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to have a separate 100% residential zone, they could choose to go with a lower density starting

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that 20 deeper acres of a range of 20 to 25 deeper acres.

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That would result in 60 low and very low and 32 moderate in computer.

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Now moving on, before I continue, I want to emphasize that any site that you see in this slideshow is really just a representation of all of the sites that we have looked at. Doesn't mean that it's going to be included automatically. It doesn't mean that anything other than we've looked at the site.

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and it has potential to accommodate the city's re-innovation.

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So we want to make sure that that was the purpose of this meeting,

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is to let the community know that together, staff,

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meet the consultant and communication with the former ad hoc committee

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and the sanitaries we looked at several sites throughout the city so that we

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were making the best choice for the community. So you may remember that we did

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look at City Hall. There's one parcel, 1.72 acres. However this is zone open

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space. We won't go into the logistics of that, but it is. At the end, we can talk

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a little bit about the open-fraze designation. But this site would yield plenty

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of units, and would have been a viable site with some rezoning that we can

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discuss a little bit more later.

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Also, we looked at the Malaga Cope area and its

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So there are really two separate areas.

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So you get the site number one, Malagicoze Plaza 1.

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It's 14 total parcels, 1.62 acres.

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The Malagicoze 2 area is 7 parcels and 1.48 acres.

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So currently there are this little spot here

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is what you already saw in the second slide. But we've also looked at the rest of the sites.

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So, oops,

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previously, in your last two housing cycles, these sites were included.

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Moving on, we looked at the St. Francis Episcopal Church site. There's one total parcel,

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So, 2.84 acres,

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we are uncovering that.

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We've seen records that are zone R1.

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We've seen records that are zone open space.

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So, that is a fact-finding mission.

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There are lots of records.

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According to the LA counter assessor,

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it's zone commercial.

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We

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did look at a six acre portion of the Palisbury United School District site, just up the

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street.

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So the entirety of that parcel is 14.87 acres, and we notice that there's six acres,

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you know, looks like roughly half, but it's a little less than half that would, there's just

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a lot of open space in symbolic fields and that would have allowed the existing buildings

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to remain. That is an open space. We also looked at a six-acre portion of PV Middle School

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and in the same condition that it would have had allowed for the school and sports field

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to remain that total size is a whopping 45.92 acres. So you see that entire site we saw this

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little tiny spot here.

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Again it's open space. We also looked at Georgia on the park. It's a 10-acre park

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And we looked at potentially just 6-8 acres.

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Don't open space.

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Again, we looked at the existing multi-family sites.

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So, there are multi-family zone RM in the Malaga Cova area.

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And in the Lunata Bay area. So, I actually, it's easy. I'm kind of pointing at it. So, there are four

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total sites in Malagico. These are the only four sites in the Malagico Reset of RN District that could

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accommodate additional units beyond what's already, so it's already built out. All these other

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parcels are built up beyond the allowable 24.9

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dwellings per acre. I think the average is about 35

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dwellings per acre for the entire,

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calculated among all the existing residential.

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And then there's only one site in the Lunata Bay area

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that would accommodate additional units.

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So, in that show, there are 11 existing units

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you would net seven new units in Malaga code.

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In Lunata Bay, there are two existing units.

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You can net two more.

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We did look at vacant parcels throughout the city

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to determine if there was any feasibility

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and rezoning to the RM zone

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because you have some large vague and property.

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So these are just examples.

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So we've got the, this particular site is 1.17 acre.

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If you rezone that to the RM zone,

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you could even, we were considering a lesser density,

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you know, instead of having 24.9,

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you could have gone to 20, and still accommodated the requirements of the state, saying it with the site.

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These are just, we're showing you examples that they're income again, reiterating these are just some of the parts are for the vacant lots,

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We're not going to show you all the vacant lots, but these are typical of many of the existing vacant single family residential lots within the city that had potential to be up zone to multi family.

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And now we're getting to the open space.

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We wanted to spend just a minute describing the process to rezone open space.

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So if we were the city made the decision to rezone an open space parcel to accommodate

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residential, it would require rezoning.

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So this would require a simple majority of voters voting, yes, on a ballot measure.

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And that would change the zone, and it would require a special election.

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However, during the October 10th meeting, it was brought up and considered.

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and due to the tardiness of the housing element and the pressure to get this done and the

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compliance schedule being almost two years behind, it was decided to table any consideration

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of re-zoning open space. And lastly, just a little bit on what these re-zoned overlay zones mean.

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Again, so there are two potential overlay zones that could accommodate the arena.

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one would be the mixed use at 25 to 30 views per acre.

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Again, the current non-residential uses could continue.

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And any other non-residential use could come in.

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It's not 100% housing.

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With a housing opportunity overlay zone,

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we would propose a lower density at a minimum of 20.

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and it doesn't even have to go up to 30 to 20 to 25 feet per acre and that would

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also allow the existing use. It's an overlay zone and that would be a hundred

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percent commercial or a hundred percent residential no commercial. So permitted

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the uses for bold.

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All of the overlay zones, in addition to what this would already be in the base zone, would be multi-family housing, supportive housing,

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single-room occupancy units, emergency shelters, and transitional housing. And the last four uses that I mentioned have already been approved in the zoning ordinance, those are required by the state.

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Again, any rezone property will be subject to objective design standards that are forthcoming

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and those we know we all have a limit of three stories, a limit of 35, high and other design

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standards to be determined. They will help shape any future development that comes in.

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The city has the authority to create these standards that are in line with the zoning

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ordinance. They just have to be able to accommodate the density that is prescribed.

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00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:19,520
And again, the current zoning ordinance, as is infomercial, allows residential uses with

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00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:29,140
the CUP, up to 24-point knowing, so just re-emphasizing that it's very, what we're proposing

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is very much in line with what is already existing, and that concludes the presentation.

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housing

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and community development.

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Okay, we're going to move on now to first off thank you Gina and Cheryl for the information

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that you shared with everyone and we're going to move on to council asking and clarifying

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the questions so do you want to start off Jim can everyone hear me or yes yes I'll try

295
00:38:23,250 --> 00:38:27,660
to talk really loudly so I wouldn't think Gina again for this presentation I want to

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I did before ask any questions, I just wanted to give a little background in case folks didn't understand Gina is a consultant that the city is hired council member camps at the other end and I were an ad hoc committee that worked with Gina for almost a year as we were working on towards this and she's been really a great partner.

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It's important to understand that everything she was presenting, she presented an exhaustive list of everything that is possible, and that's exactly the direction we gave her, we said.

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The state has this mandate to us. The state requires us to re-zone to support a certain amount of new housing, and our direction to her was can you go and identify all the possible sites that the state would accept.

299
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And so that list that she showed you, she was really showing you that exhaustive list that is exactly what we were looking for.

300
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In our city, that's a very short number of properties.

301
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If you exclude, I mean, she showed a couple of single-family lots that were large, but I think most folks would agree that that's probably not the kind of direction we would go.

302
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We wouldn't want to re-zone a single-family lot to support multifamily housing.

303
00:39:40,260 --> 00:39:46,080
And so we're limited to, in addition to that, we also have deed restrictions that restrict

304
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a number of things, and maybe there's a property throughout the city, and so that creates

305
00:39:50,120 --> 00:39:50,980
challenges also.

306
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:57,620
We're really ultimately limited to a couple of places, and it's mostly churches and the

307
00:39:57,620 --> 00:39:59,680
a couple of commercial areas that we have.

308
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And so that's really what we, at this point, the city council's had many meetings about this. We've discussed this at length, and we're trying to figure out what the community wants us to do in that regard. The state requires us to submit this housing element. The state will, the State Department of Housing Community Development approves the housing element. And as long as we do not have a compliant housing element,

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and the city remains at risk to development

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that we wouldn't otherwise want.

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And I want to put that into context.

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Gina led her presentation with a slide

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where she talked about some of the risks.

314
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She talked about $100,000 a month fine

315
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that the city could have.

316
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And a lot of that sounds kind of abstract,

317
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but I want to put in to give you a very concrete example

318
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of the kind of thing that can happen if we don't make progress.

319
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We don't go to the same again

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to get a compliant housing element.

321
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So, two weeks ago, in Rancho Palace Verde's, they had an application under what is called

322
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Builders Remedy for a multi-family housing development in the vicinity of Silver Spur Elementary.

323
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In the middle of a single-family neighborhood, there happens to be a flat lot that happens

324
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to be about five acres, most of it, unbuildable because it's in a ravine, surrounded by single

325
00:41:29,020 --> 00:41:38,860
family houses on all sides. The current zoning in Rancho Palsbury's allows a single family house on that lot,

326
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but because they do not have a compliant housing element, the developer who purchased that for about $300,000,

327
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they bought the lot for next to nothing because it's not even really a great lot for a single family home,

328
00:41:50,280 --> 00:42:01,200
has submitted an application to develop four, seven story buildings on top of four story parking garages,

329
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which will block the views for about ten houses if it's built, and obviously it's way out of character for the neighborhood.

330
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And the reason I bring this up is that this is the state's, you know, we do not comply.

331
00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:19,640
We really have to comply.

332
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Compliance, if we don't comply, the alternative is that developers could buy, you know, a

333
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nice two-acre lot that, you know, on the sale of the mar and put up, you know, five stories

334
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or whatever they want there.

335
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And so I want to urge people to, as we look at, we're going to be talking about all the various

336
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sites that we can submit for this. Keep that in mind because our goal here is to submit

337
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a compliant housing element to get the state to say yep, you have complied and to follow

338
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the law in the state of California so that we can avoid some of these penalties that you

339
00:42:56,600 --> 00:42:59,260
have outlined and that one is one of the more submitted ones.

340
00:43:03,540 --> 00:43:05,900
The was one other point I wanted to beg I.

341
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It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, this gave me, but, in any event.

342
00:43:13,460 --> 00:43:20,460
Yeah, so, you know, on the, the, for those of you who don't know, just to add a little color to the comment

343
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that you made about areas that are zoned to O.S. or open space.

344
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Those are anything that was owned by the city from about sometime in the mid 80s, their

345
00:43:29,260 --> 00:43:37,760
zone to OS, it requires a ballot initiative in order to rezone them.

346
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Our housing element will not be deemed compliant until the zoning is complete.

347
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So among the reasons that we haven't considered those, besides the fact that I think most folks

348
00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:54,220
here, probably treasure their open space, is that the complexity of rezoning that is so

349
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high, it's unlikely that we could get that done in a reasonable amount of time.

350
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And you'd have to go and educate 50 plus percent of folks in convincing that this was

351
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:06,560
the right location, and it's very hard to do.

352
00:44:07,260 --> 00:44:13,420
So with that, I'm trying to think about any questions, most of the stuff I've seen before

353
00:44:13,420 --> 00:44:14,980
I think it's really fantastic.

354
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:20,820
I'll defer to my colleagues on questions.

355
00:44:20,820 --> 00:44:22,400
I'll probably come back with questions in a moment.

356
00:44:23,780 --> 00:44:24,360
Thank you.

357
00:44:24,580 --> 00:44:27,540
I'm going to make one more plug for anyone who wants to sit down.

358
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:30,680
We do have these risers at the front.

359
00:44:30,940 --> 00:44:31,940
They're not the most comfortable.

360
00:44:33,340 --> 00:44:35,480
But at least the little kids might like them.

361
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:37,700
I just want to give options.

362
00:44:37,940 --> 00:44:39,980
I apologize that there's not enough space.

363
00:44:39,980 --> 00:44:44,000
is just the largest room that the school district had available to us for this evening.

364
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:50,740
I do have two questions, because what I liked about Gina's presentation was we asked

365
00:44:50,740 --> 00:44:59,560
her, scour the city, and tell us what possible signs there are, just do an exhaustive search.

366
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:28,260
And I actually think there are probably a couple of areas that were in your presentation, and so I just want to clarify that. My recollection is that some of the other sites that you looked at were the city concessions, and that you found that those are also open space. And so is that correct then, another area that you did look at? Because I know residents have said, well, what about the stables, or what about some of the other areas?

367
00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:35,780
You're talking about the stable sites and yeah, it's all open space, right?

368
00:45:36,020 --> 00:45:36,660
Okay, thank you.

369
00:45:37,060 --> 00:45:42,520
And then the other thing that I've heard residents talk about is we have, particularly

370
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:50,260
in La Nave, we currently have a couple of sections of apartment buildings, or condos, or you

371
00:45:50,260 --> 00:45:53,120
know, basically, you know, multi-family units.

372
00:45:53,120 --> 00:45:58,860
And one of the ideas that I've heard put forth is, well, why don't we just extend those?

373
00:45:59,060 --> 00:45:59,120
Right?

374
00:45:59,180 --> 00:46:01,420
We've already got apartment buildings there.

375
00:46:01,620 --> 00:46:03,760
Why don't we just extend them down the road?

376
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:10,420
And I believe that staff looked at those and found that the adjacent sites were too small

377
00:46:10,420 --> 00:46:13,220
to fit or to meet that half acre.

378
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:17,420
And so then you'd have to consolidate too many sites and too many owners.

379
00:46:17,420 --> 00:46:21,620
But I think you talked about that at that last meeting and that correct as well

380
00:46:22,260 --> 00:46:24,800
Right, so they would the more

381
00:46:25,400 --> 00:46:29,820
Lock consolidation comes into play and then with the small size

382
00:46:29,820 --> 00:46:32,480
And they're just invisible

383
00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:36,080
So so the point I'm trying to make is

384
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:44,560
Council staff residents we really have tried to look under every rock we can and as Jim said

385
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:48,600
that there's just a limited number of questions?

386
00:46:50,160 --> 00:46:52,620
I think I might be heard on this microphone yet.

387
00:46:54,440 --> 00:46:56,840
For staff, I think two terrifying questions.

388
00:46:57,620 --> 00:47:01,600
One, I've received a lot of questions around objective standards.

389
00:47:02,300 --> 00:47:08,500
And in the development of those objective standards, could you help us all understand exactly what those

390
00:47:08,500 --> 00:47:20,560
In addition to the overlay sites that they also covered, ADUs, that they involved in existing residents, what exactly do those standards cover and what do they relate to?

391
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:36,480
So you could, well, we'll leave the ADUs out for now, but you could apply them to have a special section for existing residents if you so choose.

392
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:48,840
But ultimately, you want to be able to design for the future.

393
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:57,740
And you want to be able to, if somebody comes in with an SB 35 application, SB 35 is another

394
00:47:57,740 --> 00:48:02,560
bill that allows fine-right affordable housing.

395
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:05,880
If somebody comes in and meets the criteria,

396
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:15,600
you want to be able to say yes, I have objective design standards and here's the criterion that you need to meet.

397
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:24,640
Let me take it one step further. We presently in our city have a process that runs through our planning commission which is not a ministerial approval.

398
00:48:25,060 --> 00:48:31,100
It involves neighborhood compatibility so that when someone's going to build a home, it involves consulting the neighbors going through a process.

399
00:48:31,100 --> 00:48:35,220
Today, I have to do that for my single family residents.

400
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:39,860
80 youths of specific sizes can be installed

401
00:48:39,860 --> 00:48:41,400
with ministerial approval.

402
00:48:42,420 --> 00:48:45,480
Would the objective standards allow us

403
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:50,000
to place standards on those 80 youths so that, for example,

404
00:48:50,820 --> 00:48:52,760
if someone was building a single family residence

405
00:48:52,760 --> 00:48:55,420
that complied with all those requirements and was approved?

406
00:48:56,060 --> 00:48:58,220
Someone couldn't come in and just build a three-story

407
00:48:58,220 --> 00:49:01,020
A.D.U. and their backyard and block my view that's in front of

408
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:04,640
me.

409
00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:13,340
A.D.U. there are new laws with A.D.U.s that we probably don't want to get into right now.

410
00:49:14,740 --> 00:49:15,300
But...

411
00:49:15,300 --> 00:49:20,660
So the singular question is, can objective design standards be applied on A.D.U.?

412
00:49:22,400 --> 00:49:24,220
With limitations. Yes.

413
00:49:36,820 --> 00:49:42,000
I just wanted to make one more come because I remembered what I was thinking earlier.

414
00:49:42,220 --> 00:49:45,380
I want to make sure that folks understand that the exercise that we're going through

415
00:49:45,380 --> 00:49:55,880
is up to planning and zoning exercise only which means that for example if we are

416
00:49:55,880 --> 00:49:59,820
commercial building for an overlay zone that would confer additional

417
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:29,980
No right on the private property owner. It does not mean that the private property owner is obligated

418
00:50:29,980 --> 00:50:40,880
We have to speak to how many units can be built at various income levels, ranging from very low income all the way to market rate.

419
00:50:42,340 --> 00:50:51,700
But the actual zoning that happens does not specify anything related to income monetization.

420
00:50:51,700 --> 00:50:59,300
So, for example, if we were rezoning, if we put an overlay that was, as part of our housing

421
00:50:59,300 --> 00:51:05,240
on, it was intended to provide low-income housing in one area, the private property owner

422
00:51:05,240 --> 00:51:10,260
would actually be able to use that to build market rate apartments if they wanted to.

423
00:51:10,500 --> 00:51:16,880
So, to understand these things, because it may inform your opinion of what the downstream

424
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:19,660
extreme effects of the overlay would be.

425
00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:23,420
Are that church representative here at the same time?

426
00:51:23,580 --> 00:51:25,420
We're still in the council questions.

427
00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:26,460
He'll just hold you.

428
00:51:26,500 --> 00:51:27,840
You'll get an opportunity to speak.

429
00:51:29,040 --> 00:51:30,520
Any other council questions?

430
00:51:34,690 --> 00:51:40,590
It seems like a missing piece is the zoning of the St. Francis

431
00:51:40,590 --> 00:51:41,630
Episcopal Church.

432
00:51:41,810 --> 00:51:43,550
Where are we with resolving that?

433
00:51:50,200 --> 00:51:52,320
No, the current zone.

434
00:51:52,320 --> 00:52:00,580
The unofficial map will the official map shows it as residential R1.

435
00:52:01,840 --> 00:52:10,860
There's another map that says it's open space, and there's the CUNY assessor that says it's commercial.

436
00:52:18,080 --> 00:52:25,800
I assume it was not over at the O.B. OS designation was created in whatever 1984-1985.

437
00:52:27,160 --> 00:52:34,120
It was created by a city where it was passed in the 80s and it specifically said it would

438
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:38,960
to me to apply to properties that were owned at the time, so it wasn't

439
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:41,400
that it was owned by the city, it wasn't owned by the city at the time.

440
00:52:41,460 --> 00:52:41,860
No, it did.

441
00:52:41,860 --> 00:52:42,780
Probably not in a way.

442
00:52:43,160 --> 00:52:44,120
It is residential.

443
00:52:44,660 --> 00:52:44,800
Yeah.

444
00:52:45,020 --> 00:52:45,820
It is residential.

445
00:52:45,860 --> 00:52:47,080
It's like open space.

446
00:52:48,080 --> 00:52:53,960
Well, and there is a small portion as you saw the properties not not

447
00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:54,400
regular.

448
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:59,980
There is definitely an indentation of something that is open space, okay?

449
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:03,420
So does it have, so if it's R1, then does it have a CUB on it?

450
00:53:08,250 --> 00:53:13,830
I don't know when it was built. It may have been built before the city was incorporated in which kids, yeah, I mean, you know.

451
00:53:14,650 --> 00:53:17,370
Speaking of the playgrounds.

452
00:53:19,790 --> 00:53:21,310
Well, the playgrounds.

453
00:53:21,570 --> 00:53:24,250
It is open to the big playgrounds, let's see.

454
00:53:25,730 --> 00:53:26,690
The playgrounds.

455
00:53:28,670 --> 00:53:33,370
The playground is actually a parkland's encouragement, but that's not the subject.

456
00:53:37,230 --> 00:53:42,270
Yes, yes, I'm not going to remind people. David, did you have any questions you wanted to ask?

457
00:53:44,970 --> 00:53:47,430
Okay, so David says Jim covered all his questions.

458
00:53:52,730 --> 00:53:57,790
One of the things that you also have to understand, picking up on what Jim was talking about earlier about,

459
00:53:58,710 --> 00:54:06,390
An owner has to have a desire to re-develop or sell or somehow take an action.

460
00:54:07,510 --> 00:54:15,650
And they still have the opportunity to use market rate rent rent rent rentals if that's what they choose to do.

461
00:54:16,010 --> 00:54:25,670
With the cost of land in our city, the return on investment for a developer or a person that's interested in investment property

462
00:54:25,670 --> 00:54:32,370
makes it extremely, extremely difficult to make the numbers work on a lot of these projects.

463
00:54:33,110 --> 00:54:35,510
And I think we have to keep that also in the back of our mind.

464
00:54:38,610 --> 00:54:43,530
Okay, we're going to move to the next portion of the agenda which is public comment.

465
00:54:43,850 --> 00:54:45,550
So I know a lot of you have questions.

466
00:54:46,070 --> 00:54:49,750
We need to keep this orderly so that everyone can hear.

467
00:54:50,370 --> 00:54:53,050
So we've got a microphone here at a podium.

468
00:54:53,750 --> 00:54:59,760
and if whoever wants to ask a question, you can go ahead.

469
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:09,420
Form a short line, and then we'll just keep listening to people's comments as the answer I did mean questions. It was comments. It's public comment.

470
00:55:30,260 --> 00:55:30,820
Thanks.

471
00:55:31,760 --> 00:55:33,660
Hello, my name is Sharon McCandless.

472
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:35,820
I'm the Director of Town and Country Nurses School,

473
00:55:36,100 --> 00:55:39,360
which is located on the St. Francis Church property here.

474
00:55:41,060 --> 00:55:44,880
Town and Country Nurses School has been in business for the last 65 years,

475
00:55:45,580 --> 00:55:47,120
in the Palisbury's community.

476
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:50,300
For the last 40 years, we've been in Palisbury's states,

477
00:55:50,900 --> 00:55:53,380
serving mostly in Palisbury's state's residence.

478
00:55:54,340 --> 00:55:58,660
Last spring, when the 2023 April housing element draft was released,

479
00:55:58,660 --> 00:56:03,200
It refers to the St. Francis Church site as an underutilized church property.

480
00:56:03,900 --> 00:56:10,100
But not only is this church site run by St. Francis Church, but it's also utilized by

481
00:56:10,100 --> 00:56:13,780
Town and Country Nursery School five days a week, seven hours a day.

482
00:56:14,460 --> 00:56:19,340
Between the St. Francis Church property and Town and Country, this site is utilized seven

483
00:56:19,340 --> 00:56:20,060
days a week.

484
00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:26,040
Sites included in the housing element must mean specific criteria established by the HCD.

485
00:56:26,040 --> 00:56:34,680
One being, sites with obsolete uses and or vacancies, large open parking areas and underutilized areas.

486
00:56:35,420 --> 00:56:38,720
The St. Francis Church site obviously does not meet this criteria.

487
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:44,460
Town and Country has leased the educational building at St. Francis Church for the last 22 years.

488
00:56:45,500 --> 00:56:51,800
Our lease is up in 2020 and we're currently working on a lease that would extend over the next 15 years.

489
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:55,080
This shows the great relationship that we have with the church.

490
00:56:55,940 --> 00:56:58,640
Also, our school employs 40 staff members,

491
00:56:59,020 --> 00:57:01,820
which makes it one of the larger employers in California to the states.

492
00:57:02,600 --> 00:57:05,340
We educate 190 children there each year.

493
00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:09,700
I have done my research on the history of the housing element document,

494
00:57:10,120 --> 00:57:12,280
and current Californian bills that have passed.

495
00:57:12,840 --> 00:57:16,080
And I've talked to other city attorneys about how California has made

496
00:57:16,080 --> 00:57:19,680
a very difficult for cities to get the housing element document approved.

497
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:24,540
So I do want to say to the council, I do empathize with what you're all going through.

498
00:57:25,660 --> 00:57:32,680
But we all have our job and my job is to and my priority is to make sure this is

499
00:57:32,680 --> 00:57:37,340
beloved preschool town and country continues to exist on the St. Francis Church side

500
00:57:37,340 --> 00:57:41,380
for many more years to come and is able to carry on the town and country philosophy,

501
00:57:41,800 --> 00:57:45,020
educating children and parents to make the world a better place.

502
00:57:45,020 --> 00:57:45,760
As

503
00:57:53,150 --> 00:57:57,890
a result, we can please, sorry, just not clap and not have outbursts, it'll just keep things moving.

504
00:57:58,050 --> 00:57:59,510
I agree, I agree with my commitments.

505
00:58:01,190 --> 00:58:05,190
Putting St. Francis Church on the list of sites that will be re-zoned from the

506
00:58:05,190 --> 00:58:09,530
Slays Overlay zoning will make St. Francis Church a target in the future.

507
00:58:10,030 --> 00:58:14,250
The state may decide in the future that these sites may have to sell or redevelop,

508
00:58:14,650 --> 00:58:16,150
or maybe even worse, imminent domain.

509
00:58:17,010 --> 00:58:19,430
So we do not want to run that risk.

510
00:58:19,430 --> 00:58:22,950
This unique special preschool is generational.

511
00:58:23,510 --> 00:58:26,730
Many of the parents that enroll their children there have attended there as well.

512
00:58:27,330 --> 00:58:29,410
We have been around for the last 65 years,

513
00:58:29,830 --> 00:58:33,090
and I want to make sure that we are still in existence 65 more years to come.

514
00:58:33,890 --> 00:58:38,030
Please do consider not putting St. Francis Church property on the list of sites of the housing element.

515
00:58:38,490 --> 00:58:38,870
Thank you.

516
00:58:40,670 --> 00:58:41,410
Thank you.

517
00:58:41,410 --> 00:58:47,490
next. Before I begin I would like to know if there's a representative from the

518
00:58:47,490 --> 00:58:53,110
first Church of Christ's Scientistia. Is there anyone here from the first

519
00:58:53,110 --> 00:58:59,210
Church so there on your list that they're not here? Okay great wonderful.

520
00:59:01,370 --> 00:59:09,590
Somebody here? Okay great I'd like to speak to you afterwards. Thank you. Hi my name

521
00:59:09,590 --> 00:59:15,730
Lisa Turing, and I live on Ponderous Selain, which is across the street from the

522
00:59:15,730 --> 00:59:21,050
first Church of Christ scientist. We just learned about this three days ago

523
00:59:21,050 --> 00:59:25,510
through a friend of mine who lives on Rolling Ridge Road, which is Raine Rancho

524
00:59:25,510 --> 00:59:32,350
Palsfordes. Now why aren't ends? Then there's also Rolling Meadows Road. We have

525
00:59:32,350 --> 00:59:38,490
spoken with residents also in Palsfordes' States next to this proposed project.

526
00:59:38,490 --> 00:59:44,330
none of us were informed by the city at all about your intentions. This has

527
00:59:44,330 --> 00:59:48,890
tremendous ramifications for the value of our property. I have heard that our

528
00:59:48,890 --> 00:59:54,210
property could decrease in value by about a third depending on the size of

529
00:59:54,210 --> 00:59:59,130
building that goes up. The people that can be transitional.

530
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:28,040
This means that there could be criminals and drug addicts. This is not a corner that is even for multi-unit housing. It's a small residential section, mostly in our side of the street. We have 15 feet between our homes for the most part. We have larger spaces and rolling those the states. This thing, this is a monstrosity at a corner that has horrific traffic problems to begin with.

531
01:00:28,040 --> 01:00:33,400
I do not understand why it was all of a sudden put on the table in January and none of us were

532
01:00:33,400 --> 01:00:39,140
even notified by you. Were cities notified? Did you notify Roland L. States? Did you notice

533
01:00:39,140 --> 01:00:45,880
the five Rancho Palace forties? I did, this is an embarrassed mature city that you best

534
01:00:45,880 --> 01:00:52,060
to let us know that you're even considering this. And I'd like to know out from this church,

535
01:00:52,060 --> 01:00:57,920
whether or not they intend to sell. Now, first church of Christ scientists sold after telling

536
01:00:57,920 --> 01:01:03,940
residents up in Volvedere, which is a suburb of San Rafael, they said that they

537
01:01:03,940 --> 01:01:09,580
were going to sell and then they turn around and they sell sold. And so I'm

538
01:01:09,580 --> 01:01:14,600
very concerned the state is allowed to put up to 250 units on some of these

539
01:01:14,600 --> 01:01:20,940
larger sites. They only can have to put in much parking. This is unreal that you

540
01:01:20,940 --> 01:01:23,920
You guys are accepting this, and we need to sue the state.

541
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:30,400
There's no reason for it to say that it's absolutely absurd for the palace for the

542
01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:31,700
peninsula for goodness' sake.

543
01:01:32,040 --> 01:01:35,860
We have residents here who have lived here for 50 plus years like myself.

544
01:01:38,150 --> 01:01:43,330
I don't know why you're bending over and how telling just Sacramento of all places.

545
01:01:44,190 --> 01:01:48,490
But I wish that you guys would show some function and do something about this.

546
01:01:48,490 --> 01:01:55,550
Gina, I'm sure you're a lovely consultant, but it would have been nice if you got around to the neighborhoods and asked the neighbors what they thought.

547
01:01:55,870 --> 01:01:57,290
There are three houses on the corner.

548
01:01:57,610 --> 01:01:59,150
We're not going to keep this personal place.

549
01:01:59,570 --> 01:02:01,050
Okay, I guess that.

550
01:02:01,210 --> 01:02:08,610
But if you guys did not go around and consult us, and if you think that we're going to take this lying down, think again.

551
01:02:13,410 --> 01:02:16,590
We're going to come church, town and country, and sacred sites.

552
01:02:16,610 --> 01:02:16,930
Thank you.

553
01:02:17,230 --> 01:02:18,010
I'm real.

554
01:02:18,270 --> 01:02:18,550
Thank you.

555
01:02:18,730 --> 01:02:19,590
That's a struggle landmark.

556
01:02:27,620 --> 01:02:32,000
I'm kind of glad that I'm getting to go up front a little bit, because I think that

557
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:37,000
people should be reminded that you all live here in palace verties, you're all volunteers,

558
01:02:37,640 --> 01:02:43,680
you're all unpaid, you all care what happens to the community because many of you are

559
01:02:43,680 --> 01:02:45,280
going to be living near these sites.

560
01:02:45,900 --> 01:02:50,020
So I want to thank you, you can be with your family, you can be having dinner, you can be

561
01:02:50,020 --> 01:02:56,400
relaxing, which most nights you're working. I'm at home relaxing with my family. So I want

562
01:02:56,400 --> 01:03:02,280
you all to know that you're very appreciated. So thank you for that. And I hope that the

563
01:03:02,280 --> 01:03:06,700
people after me will remember that you're part of our community, that you live here, that

564
01:03:06,700 --> 01:03:13,420
you do care. With that being said, I don't see our city manager here. Does anybody know?

565
01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:18,940
She is paid, correct? So I'm not sure why she's not present. I would have liked to hear

566
01:03:18,940 --> 01:03:21,600
from her, you know, part of her comments.

567
01:03:23,100 --> 01:03:28,280
The next thing that I'd like to say is that I have had a little experience in construction

568
01:03:28,780 --> 01:03:37,300
and I realized that the smaller the lot is, and the fewer, excuse me, the fewer units

569
01:03:37,300 --> 01:03:42,160
that you can put on a lot, the more expensive it will be for a builder, so I would think

570
01:03:42,160 --> 01:03:47,440
that maybe we could focus on smaller lots with less doors that can be built to make it more

571
01:03:47,440 --> 01:03:52,900
more expensive for builders so that they won't have that incentive to go in and build

572
01:03:54,040 --> 01:03:56,800
a huge complex which they could make more money on.

573
01:03:57,740 --> 01:03:58,720
Thank you very much.

574
01:04:01,910 --> 01:04:02,450
Thanks.

575
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:05,280
Hello.

576
01:04:05,580 --> 01:04:09,500
My name is Julie Heiden and I am the Assistant Director for Town and Country Nursery School.

577
01:04:09,960 --> 01:04:14,460
I would like to thank the Honorable Mayor Murdoch and City Council members for this opportunity

578
01:04:15,070 --> 01:04:18,560
to offer my opinion and insight in this very important issue.

579
01:04:18,560 --> 01:04:28,900
As you know, Town and Country Nursery School is located on the St. Francis Church property and St. Francis has been identified as an underutilized church site.

580
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:41,840
The term underutilized, confused me when the minute I heard it, the term underutilized is defined as to utilize less than fully or below the potential use.

581
01:04:42,660 --> 01:04:45,820
This property certainly does not fit that definition.

582
01:04:45,820 --> 01:04:51,120
I assure you that this property is, in fact, highly utilized.

583
01:04:51,740 --> 01:04:58,220
I invite all of you to show up any weekday morning to see for yourself just how utilized this property is.

584
01:04:58,220 --> 01:04:59,700
my question

585
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:29,980
You is exactly when was this property assessed and who deemed it to be underutilized? If any of you have spent any amount of time on the St. Francis and town and country, nursery school campus, you would know that the property is filled with families coming and going throughout the day, dropping their children off, picking their children up, the property is consistently buzzing with the sounds of our children laughing and playing. If anything, this property is overutilized.

586
01:05:29,980 --> 01:05:34,780
I think the 190 children that are currently in attendance at Town of

587
01:05:34,780 --> 01:05:40,320
Country as well as the thousands of alumni would agree. I would also like to add

588
01:05:40,320 --> 01:05:44,700
that our current location of the St. Francis Church property is in very close

589
01:05:44,700 --> 01:05:49,720
proximity to the Palis Verdes Police Department. Having them close by for the safety

590
01:05:49,720 --> 01:05:55,060
of our children and the nature surrounding us provides a campus for childhood

591
01:05:55,060 --> 01:05:58,160
of learning that is unmatched anywhere in South Bay.

592
01:05:59,120 --> 01:06:03,360
Lastly, I keenly aware that the church,

593
01:06:03,580 --> 01:06:05,980
along with town and country, utilize the property

594
01:06:05,980 --> 01:06:07,220
for the following activities.

595
01:06:07,980 --> 01:06:10,880
Regular church services, Sunday school sessions,

596
01:06:11,480 --> 01:06:13,700
various community support meetings,

597
01:06:14,660 --> 01:06:17,980
antique fairs, weddings, funerals, family events,

598
01:06:18,960 --> 01:06:21,780
parenting classes, weekend family days.

599
01:06:21,780 --> 01:06:24,780
is I can go on and on, but I think you get the idea.

600
01:06:25,660 --> 01:06:28,520
It's difficult to put a value on the services provided

601
01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:31,380
by St. Francis Church and Town and Country Nursery School.

602
01:06:31,720 --> 01:06:34,040
Our request is that if you truly believe

603
01:06:34,040 --> 01:06:35,900
that this property is underutilized,

604
01:06:36,360 --> 01:06:39,420
please provide the data that supports that conclusion.

605
01:06:40,100 --> 01:06:42,860
And if you still believe the property is underutilized,

606
01:06:43,080 --> 01:06:44,780
I will plan on seeing you tomorrow

607
01:06:44,780 --> 01:06:46,480
during morning preschool drop off.

608
01:06:47,040 --> 01:06:49,040
Thank you for your time and your consideration.

609
01:06:49,600 --> 01:06:50,020
Thank you.

610
01:06:53,080 --> 01:06:58,780
Thank you for your time. My name is Chincham Reddison. My husband, Chris, was raised in

611
01:06:58,780 --> 01:07:04,460
Pellarsbury, the States. He and I also raised our family here. Although our children attended

612
01:07:04,460 --> 01:07:08,980
new horizons, many of our friends were lucky enough to sit on the Aristotelian country.

613
01:07:09,720 --> 01:07:16,000
It had and it still has a wonderful reputation by both its look, by both parents and the children.

614
01:07:16,000 --> 01:07:19,500
We are so pleased our grandson will be going to school there soon.

615
01:07:20,340 --> 01:07:25,880
My in-laws were very instrumental in building and growing a St. Francis Church.

616
01:07:26,540 --> 01:07:31,000
My husband and his brother attended church and Sunday school there as did our children.

617
01:07:31,880 --> 01:07:34,920
St. Francis has met so much to so many generations.

618
01:07:35,940 --> 01:07:41,600
It hosted many events and it does good work in the community as an example which I happen

619
01:07:41,600 --> 01:07:43,000
to help with as the blue bin.

620
01:07:43,000 --> 01:07:48,680
We accept donations from the community and we distribute them to places like Beacon House,

621
01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:52,040
St. Luke's, Salvation Army, St. Francis, etc.

622
01:07:52,860 --> 01:07:57,460
We get so many wonderful children's clothing from the generous parents of town and country

623
01:07:57,460 --> 01:08:03,460
and we send it to the varying eating and deserving families at Camp Pelton.

624
01:08:04,280 --> 01:08:10,020
I implore you to take San Francis off your list and let both these fine institutions continue

625
01:08:10,020 --> 01:08:11,960
to serve the community for years to come.

626
01:08:11,960 --> 01:08:18,660
Thank you. Thank you. Before I next speaker, I want to introduce that our city manager, Elaine

627
01:08:18,660 --> 01:08:24,260
Jayne, has joined us. So for those of you that haven't met her or haven't seen her,

628
01:08:24,980 --> 01:08:30,720
that's who's joined us next to the city attorney. He's going. Good evening Madam Mayor, members

629
01:08:30,720 --> 01:08:37,080
of the city council and staff. My name is Clara Duramm Reid. I am a resident of Paulus

630
01:08:37,080 --> 01:08:41,760
Verdes and a former planning commissioner and run to Paulus Verdes. I understand that

631
01:08:41,760 --> 01:08:45,380
And at this evening we're talking about summoning and I understand the difficult task

632
01:08:45,380 --> 01:08:52,020
you all have here and the concern, the very valid concern about the businesses and the

633
01:08:52,020 --> 01:08:53,660
residents of Palisburg as the states.

634
01:08:54,280 --> 01:08:58,440
But I want to share with you that I'm very sure that the rest of the California cities

635
01:08:58,440 --> 01:08:59,720
have those same concerns.

636
01:09:00,580 --> 01:09:04,880
I have been hearing from many people and I understand that there is a lot of construction going

637
01:09:04,880 --> 01:09:09,720
on specifically because of the builder's remedies and while I don't want to see that, I would

638
01:09:09,720 --> 01:09:28,500
I would like to find out if I'm sure you all know about the League of California cities whose mission it is to maintain a local control over the zoning, which Sacramento has now seen to try to demolish that and build a lot of units here.

639
01:09:28,500 --> 01:09:35,220
So my question is, has the city attorney and the city contacted other cities in California

640
01:09:35,220 --> 01:09:42,860
to come together and to bring a claim or a lawsuit against the state of California for this forced resounding?

641
01:09:44,540 --> 01:09:46,960
And well, okay, so I

642
01:09:49,900 --> 01:09:55,420
understand that Huntington Beach has dug its heels in and rightfully so

643
01:09:55,420 --> 01:09:59,320
they have decided not to move forward with any ADUs and

644
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:29,660
The state sued them, but they fought back three days later than while their own lawsuit. Now, I understand that we may not have enough money here in the city to bring our own claim, but I think that if we join in with other California cities, other city attorneys, it can be much more feasible financially to go against Sacramento and return that zoning back to the local people to the city here and to all the good people right here. So thank you very much.

645
01:10:31,920 --> 01:10:32,480
Hello,

646
01:10:36,290 --> 01:10:43,390
good evening. My name is Mike Spaldingen. I grew up right here in PV. I've

647
01:10:43,390 --> 01:10:48,590
teacher peninsula high school like each physics. I run the advent program there. My wife

648
01:10:48,590 --> 01:10:54,250
also works in the PV district. She's assistant principal at PVIS. We have three incredible

649
01:10:54,250 --> 01:10:59,310
kids and I'm here to speak tonight on behalf of St. Francis Church and how it's being

650
01:10:59,310 --> 01:11:01,550
it was labeled as an underutilized space.

651
01:11:02,810 --> 01:11:08,390
I just want to share with you that St. Francis Church is a very, very vibrant community.

652
01:11:09,090 --> 01:11:10,550
It's a very active community.

653
01:11:11,010 --> 01:11:16,930
My wife and I started attending there about 15 years ago and simply put, we chose St.

654
01:11:17,050 --> 01:11:21,470
Francis specifically because of the incredible community that it is.

655
01:11:22,230 --> 01:11:27,410
In my years of St. Francis, I've been on the vestry, on the board.

656
01:11:27,410 --> 01:11:34,170
I served as junior warden kind of oversight facilities there work with town and country an incredible group

657
01:11:34,990 --> 01:11:39,210
I've enjoyed helping to cook many meals for all our church events

658
01:11:39,210 --> 01:11:45,770
I've organized build days with Habitat for Humanity where our church members go out and help build homes for

659
01:11:45,770 --> 01:11:47,090
those in need

660
01:11:47,090 --> 01:11:53,330
And just attended so many of the events that our church put on puts on each year so to keep this brief

661
01:11:53,330 --> 01:11:59,710
St. Francis were an enormously vibrant community, it's a place, it's my

662
01:11:59,710 --> 01:12:04,570
consider, my spiritual home, and I love I love going there, and I know many

663
01:12:04,570 --> 01:12:09,750
people in the church community feel the same. Thank you so much. Thank you,

664
01:12:12,940 --> 01:12:14,400
yep

665
01:12:14,400 --> 01:12:20,160
I'm Julian Salinas. My name's Julian Salinas and I'm gonna let the kids do the

666
01:12:20,160 --> 01:12:25,020
talking who will prove very much so that Saint Francis Church is utilized.

667
01:12:25,020 --> 01:12:25,140
Yes.

668
01:12:26,320 --> 01:12:27,220
Go ahead, Stella.

669
01:12:28,120 --> 01:12:32,660
I don't like to attend because I like to love it.

670
01:12:33,560 --> 01:12:36,840
She doesn't want to town in the country to change because she loves it, and it's her

671
01:12:36,840 --> 01:12:37,100
school.

672
01:12:41,600 --> 01:12:49,660
I do not want to town in the country to change, change, change for my little sister.

673
01:12:52,280 --> 01:12:54,120
Well, thank you for joining us this evening.

674
01:12:55,320 --> 01:12:55,920
My

675
01:13:01,770 --> 01:13:13,450
name is Devin O'Toole and my son, Dylan O'Toole, went to town and country two years ago and my daughter, Maya O'Toole, will be attending town and country next fall.

676
01:13:13,990 --> 01:13:21,270
And town and country is an amazing school. It really is truly a magical, beautiful experience for the children.

677
01:13:21,270 --> 01:13:34,910
And by no means is St. Francis Church underutilized because there are hundreds of people going in and out of that property on a daily basis, and it provides some substantial impacts to the whole community.

678
01:13:35,450 --> 01:13:49,630
I don't know what our life would be like without it, and I hope that's not an option going forward. I think that the committee should focus on other properties, open spaces and other underutilized properties that are truly underutilized instead of focusing on this at all.

679
01:13:49,630 --> 01:13:52,430
I think it shouldn't even be an issue right now, so thank you.

680
01:13:52,850 --> 01:13:53,410
Thank you.

681
01:13:56,980 --> 01:14:06,060
Peterson, when I thank you for including in your high priorities the design, the objective

682
01:14:06,060 --> 01:14:15,880
criteria, and I think that has an urgency, you've told us about that new proposal that

683
01:14:15,880 --> 01:14:18,560
Rancho Palas Verdes is having to contend with,

684
01:14:19,120 --> 01:14:22,840
and it's simply horrifying to think

685
01:14:22,840 --> 01:14:27,940
of seven story buildings in a ravine.

686
01:14:28,880 --> 01:14:33,360
So it brings to mind the importance of safety

687
01:14:33,980 --> 01:14:36,120
in those objective criteria.

688
01:14:36,900 --> 01:14:40,900
We know that we have fire safety concerns,

689
01:14:41,200 --> 01:14:43,580
we have flood safety concerns

690
01:14:43,580 --> 01:14:45,300
that we're all aware of right now.

691
01:14:46,640 --> 01:14:53,800
So I have a question for our city attorneys, is there anything legally that prevents us

692
01:14:53,800 --> 01:14:59,300
from including safety criteria in the objective criteria?

693
01:15:01,680 --> 01:15:22,220
He's shaking his head, no. Okay. So, I urge you again, hoping that as you work on the objective criteria that you also include safety along with those important design criteria that we all want to see happen. Thank you. Thank you.

694
01:15:26,510 --> 01:15:34,610
I'm Joan Davidson. I've been active in this community for a long time, and I'm a school board, et cetera. I just so want everyone to understand

695
01:15:34,610 --> 01:15:36,910
that the city is the messenger.

696
01:15:37,250 --> 01:15:38,590
Please don't kill the messenger.

697
01:15:39,510 --> 01:15:41,970
These all these state laws started during COVID

698
01:15:42,910 --> 01:15:45,410
and they'll round the mayor down to each community.

699
01:15:45,490 --> 01:15:48,970
This was coming, he started our neighborhood voices

700
01:15:49,530 --> 01:15:51,090
at the ballot initiative.

701
01:15:51,690 --> 01:15:54,330
If you want the city to be able to save in the state,

702
01:15:54,670 --> 01:15:58,530
no thanks, then you have to pass this initiative

703
01:15:58,530 --> 01:16:02,110
and gave out a flyer to everyone in this room for a reason.

704
01:16:02,110 --> 01:16:08,650
because if the city doesn't submit their application then they can be just as

705
01:16:08,650 --> 01:16:14,370
horrified as they are in our PV because builders remedy takes effect. Builders

706
01:16:14,370 --> 01:16:20,030
remedy is what's allowing the developer to put in that project and silver spurt

707
01:16:20,030 --> 01:16:25,890
can in. We don't want that in the city and then on deep valley drive they're

708
01:16:25,890 --> 01:16:30,710
trying to build I'm calling it the New York City apartment complex on deep

709
01:16:30,710 --> 01:16:33,570
Valley Drive, where it was a prior landslide.

710
01:16:34,070 --> 01:16:39,250
I'm hoping it cost them $100 million to try to even think about this, because we always

711
01:16:39,250 --> 01:16:39,890
use the library.

712
01:16:40,570 --> 01:16:43,490
So Dawn told us to come and sit down because we're all neighbors.

713
01:16:43,850 --> 01:16:44,570
We are all neighbors.

714
01:16:44,750 --> 01:16:49,490
We've lived here a very long time, most of us, and we get it, but I don't think everyone

715
01:16:49,490 --> 01:16:54,830
understood that for three years, I have been working on this with others.

716
01:16:54,830 --> 01:17:01,290
My Griffith has California Studies for Local Control and he started that two years ago

717
01:17:01,290 --> 01:17:04,850
I've been working with him and I've been in the catalyst group in Northern California.

718
01:17:05,470 --> 01:17:06,670
We're all together on this.

719
01:17:06,930 --> 01:17:09,750
Every city is having the same horrifying problem.

720
01:17:10,150 --> 01:17:12,590
Our city is small, we're trying to find a place for everything.

721
01:17:13,550 --> 01:17:20,470
So they're doing their best in my opinion, but my kids went to town in the country, my great

722
01:17:20,470 --> 01:17:21,490
kids have gone there.

723
01:17:21,810 --> 01:17:22,410
I love it there.

724
01:17:23,290 --> 01:17:28,450
I know you're struggling, and I'm sorry that you have to struggle for this, but our city

725
01:17:28,450 --> 01:17:30,790
was built out in 1923 and planned out.

726
01:17:31,130 --> 01:17:32,410
I don't know what we could do.

727
01:17:32,770 --> 01:17:34,350
And someone said, why don't we do Sacramento?

728
01:17:34,690 --> 01:17:35,410
RPD tried.

729
01:17:35,770 --> 01:17:36,790
They joined other cities.

730
01:17:37,070 --> 01:17:37,430
They lost.

731
01:17:37,810 --> 01:17:38,670
They lost their money.

732
01:17:38,910 --> 01:17:39,290
It's gone.

733
01:17:39,850 --> 01:17:44,970
And we're waiting for the ruling from Judge Curtis Kim on the Senate Bill 910 hearing for

734
01:17:44,970 --> 01:17:49,750
charter cities which have more rights than we do as a general law city.

735
01:17:49,750 --> 01:17:56,010
So that would suit that Judge Kim's foster and give his judgment within the next week or two.

736
01:17:56,170 --> 01:17:57,430
We'll see if they prevail.

737
01:17:58,030 --> 01:18:03,030
Senate Bill 9's lit every single family law in the state of California so you can bill two or more.

738
01:18:03,590 --> 01:18:04,670
Think about your dream.

739
01:18:05,470 --> 01:18:08,790
It's disgusting, it's horrible, Sacramento is a problem, not to counsel.

740
01:18:09,610 --> 01:18:13,410
Join our neighborhood voices, get it on the balance, we can all say no.

741
01:18:14,110 --> 01:18:14,510
Thank you.

742
01:18:14,510 --> 01:18:15,290
Hi

743
01:18:18,940 --> 01:18:24,560
there, my name is Katie Callahan, I've lived in Palsbury's States and moved to

744
01:18:24,560 --> 01:18:29,120
Rancho Palsbury's to get a larger view. I am one of those neighbors that are

745
01:18:29,120 --> 01:18:36,800
being affected by Builders Remedy. Literally behind my house, that is the view

746
01:18:36,800 --> 01:18:42,460
I wanted and the city view. Jacques Elise, who's the developer, has utilized Builders

747
01:18:42,460 --> 01:18:47,360
remedy in order to submit this application, which is an

748
01:18:47,360 --> 01:18:51,360
preliminary process at our PV, and it's affecting not 10

749
01:18:51,360 --> 01:18:58,380
homes. We have about 48 around the canyon and 244 in total in

750
01:18:58,380 --> 01:19:01,900
my neighborhood. He is building four or proposing a build at

751
01:19:01,900 --> 01:19:06,320
482 units. So almost twice the size of my neighborhood is

752
01:19:06,320 --> 01:19:11,600
what he wants to build in a canyon. So my, what I needed to

753
01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:17,540
do is to understand the process and what was explained to me is that the housing element

754
01:19:17,540 --> 01:19:23,540
which the city is trying to get passed is basically a report card that we as a city have

755
01:19:23,540 --> 01:19:28,600
to get to this data California saying oh you want how many affordable pieces of housing

756
01:19:30,480 --> 01:19:35,580
647 which is what they want from our PV. Well this is how we're going to do it. You submit

757
01:19:35,580 --> 01:19:41,100
it. If they don't like it they give it back to the city and you have to revise it.

758
01:19:41,100 --> 01:19:44,780
This housing element happens every six years.

759
01:19:45,060 --> 01:19:47,920
It's not you, it happens every six years.

760
01:19:48,260 --> 01:19:51,140
Our PV is two years behind a six-year cycle.

761
01:19:51,840 --> 01:19:55,440
You guys are behind two years in a six-year cycle.

762
01:19:55,720 --> 01:19:57,340
So this is going to continue to happen.

763
01:19:57,620 --> 01:19:59,960
And the scary thing is...

764
01:20:00,400 --> 01:20:30,280
The housing element doesn't get passed. We're not passed on our PV. You guys are not passed in PVE. We are susceptible to these predatory developers who are coming in and doing Wajjah Ikej wants to do in our canyon. And it doesn't have to be a vacant land. What he has done in the past and what he is doing now is building on one small little parcel like your own home, 32 units. And it was passed.

765
01:20:30,280 --> 01:20:37,620
He actually sued that just like you guys, the neighborhood was appalled because it's in the middle of single family homes

766
01:20:37,620 --> 01:20:43,900
He bought this parcel, submitted this application, the neighborhood sued him. He turned around

767
01:20:43,900 --> 01:20:53,180
sued them back because he's backed by Yimbi. Yes, in your backyard, this organization is strong, and they backed him up and he won.

768
01:20:53,840 --> 01:20:58,760
So what I'm saying is that you have to work with the city to get the housing element passed.

769
01:20:58,760 --> 01:21:05,220
They are not your enemies, they are only doing what the state is mandating them to do.

770
01:21:05,420 --> 01:21:11,200
Their hands are tied, you guys need to work with the city to pass your housing element.

771
01:21:11,540 --> 01:21:17,680
So you keep these predatory developers away from your precious PDE as I'm trying to do with

772
01:21:17,680 --> 01:21:18,320
our PDE.

773
01:21:18,580 --> 01:21:24,580
So we created a chapter from neighborhood voices, which is neighborhood voices of Silver Spur.

774
01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:26,320
And I would encourage you guys to do the same.

775
01:21:26,620 --> 01:21:27,100
Thank you.

776
01:21:28,100 --> 01:21:28,800
I'm

777
01:21:31,870 --> 01:21:35,850
going to take it down to be a little bit more specific.

778
01:21:37,320 --> 01:21:43,010
If that's the consultant repeatedly stated at the last city council meeting, the palace

779
01:21:43,010 --> 01:21:48,530
rate of stays was already 90% developed, then not a Bay is at 100%.

780
01:21:49,600 --> 01:21:52,150
I want to talk about the patio building.

781
01:21:52,800 --> 01:21:59,170
The patio building serves as an emergency hub and communication tower for all of lower

782
01:21:59,170 --> 01:22:02,090
and we cannot afford to lose it.

783
01:22:03,010 --> 01:22:07,950
The patio building accommodates parking for its current customers

784
01:22:07,950 --> 01:22:10,430
and we cannot afford to lose it.

785
01:22:11,070 --> 01:22:15,510
The patio building generates jobs and services critical to

786
01:22:15,510 --> 01:22:19,610
not a bay and we cannot afford to lose them, especially

787
01:22:19,610 --> 01:22:20,590
the hardware store.

788
01:22:21,350 --> 01:22:26,470
The patio building sits in a tight, tiny horseshoe

789
01:22:26,470 --> 01:22:31,730
that cannot, by any stretch of the imagination, handle more density.

790
01:22:33,130 --> 01:22:41,630
That consultant presented some erroneous information into the staff report about the

791
01:22:41,630 --> 01:22:48,250
constraints of the decaying infrastructure and the minimal leases, etc. of our situation.

792
01:22:50,610 --> 01:23:04,410
That's it's untrue and as Diana so brilliantly pointed out and all the speakers of the last meeting were I thought wonderful and really presented the truth about the patio building and what great shape it's in.

793
01:23:05,510 --> 01:23:11,830
As I recall, one air stated that the last meeting there are 19 partners in the family.

794
01:23:11,830 --> 01:23:21,350
So, it's not one-hour owner to remove the patio building from and so that should remove

795
01:23:21,350 --> 01:23:25,650
it from density consideration because I understand that's a constraint not to have more than

796
01:23:25,650 --> 01:23:26,210
one owner.

797
01:23:27,390 --> 01:23:35,750
The recent Maui fire, fires, highlights our own severe fire zone safety dilemma and we cannot

798
01:23:35,750 --> 01:23:38,970
handle additional density as you all know.

799
01:23:39,410 --> 01:23:40,190
Thank you very much.

800
01:23:45,630 --> 01:23:51,030
Good evening. My name is Tony Graber. I was actually born in this community and raised my three children

801
01:23:51,030 --> 01:23:55,710
and I personally found my way in my first childhood out in country nursery school.

802
01:23:55,950 --> 01:23:59,390
Hey, is Tony, could you please get closer to my phone for the people in the back?

803
01:23:59,690 --> 01:24:00,830
Yes, thank you.

804
01:24:01,390 --> 01:24:08,090
My name is Tony Graber and I have raised my three children here and followed my first one to

805
01:24:08,090 --> 01:24:14,530
town in country nursery school. Where I worked, I am the retired director and I worked there

806
01:24:14,530 --> 01:24:23,350
for 35 years. I understand what a difficult task you have in front of you. But I also support

807
01:24:23,350 --> 01:24:28,250
town and country and airfee school and believe along the St. Francis. These are two of the

808
01:24:28,250 --> 01:24:32,370
most important community institutions that we have in our community.

809
01:24:35,320 --> 01:24:36,020
I want to make

810
01:24:36,020 --> 01:24:40,740
you wear three important reasons why I believe that you need to find a different site

811
01:24:40,740 --> 01:24:48,360
and St. Francis Church. First, the site is fully utilized as you have heard, and we do have

812
01:24:48,360 --> 01:24:55,700
190 children every year coming through our school. Secondly, young families in

813
01:24:55,700 --> 01:24:59,960
Alice Verde's need excellent preschool education for their children.

814
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:07,840
And where would that take place if we lose our beloved town and country? TNC has provided this

815
01:25:07,840 --> 01:25:17,140
essential service for the last 65 years, graduating 7,000 young students. That total is more than half

816
01:25:17,140 --> 01:25:26,720
of the current population of Palisbury's estates by the 2022 count. Town and country is an indispensable

817
01:25:27,540 --> 01:25:32,200
multigenerational educational community of current families and alumni, many of

818
01:25:32,200 --> 01:25:37,180
whom are here tonight to remind you of the impact of your decision and what it

819
01:25:37,180 --> 01:25:42,060
could do to them and importantly for the future children of Palis Verdes. By a

820
01:25:42,060 --> 01:25:46,500
show of hands can I so ask people who are related to talent country to raise

821
01:25:46,500 --> 01:25:47,120
their hands.

822
01:25:49,760 --> 01:25:57,300
Thank you very much. Finally, there is no other romantic lighting.

823
01:26:04,480 --> 01:26:11,040
Finally, there is no alternate site, which could house town and country within this geographical

824
01:26:11,040 --> 01:26:18,200
area. Since 1958, town and country has been located in five different sites, Portuguese

825
01:26:18,200 --> 01:26:24,800
Bend, the LA Presbytería before that site became St. Peter's by the sea, Chadwick School,

826
01:26:25,620 --> 01:26:30,040
Marguerite School and now St. Francis. Our previous moves have been

827
01:26:30,040 --> 01:26:33,780
necessitated because our space was needed by the property owners much like

828
01:26:33,780 --> 01:26:39,040
what is currently feels like it's happening here. We have been pilgrims since

829
01:26:39,040 --> 01:26:43,580
our beginning but we and our families have believed so strongly in our school and

830
01:26:43,580 --> 01:26:49,360
the values it provides that we have worked together tirelessly to find each new

831
01:26:49,360 --> 01:26:54,340
site. We clearly understand the risks of losing our home. When the school

832
01:26:54,340 --> 01:27:00,060
Districts reclaimed Margate for their use in 2000. Town and country did an exhaustive

833
01:27:00,060 --> 01:27:08,740
search for a new site. Within PDE, Rolling Hills of States, RPV and even adjoining Redondo

834
01:27:08,740 --> 01:27:14,160
Beach and Torrance. St. Francis was the only place that was willing or had the space to

835
01:27:14,160 --> 01:27:21,100
accommodate a school of our size. Our educational philosophy is beautifully matched with

836
01:27:21,100 --> 01:27:26,920
our location and environment. Safe Francis is both the perfect and the only site available.

837
01:27:27,620 --> 01:27:33,200
It provides adequate indoor and outdoor space and supports our active, confident and capable

838
01:27:33,200 --> 01:27:39,800
young learners. This is personal for our children, our families, our staff, and our alumni.

839
01:27:40,840 --> 01:27:45,820
Please understand the value that Town and Country Nursery School brings and wants to continue

840
01:27:45,820 --> 01:27:51,580
providing to the children and families of Carlos Verdes for generations to come and ensure

841
01:27:51,580 --> 01:27:57,160
our future by removing St. Francis from your list and choosing an alternate site for

842
01:27:57,160 --> 01:27:58,360
your low-income housing.

843
01:27:59,020 --> 01:28:00,000
Thank you very much.

844
01:28:17,850 --> 01:28:19,750
So the audience, the council,

845
01:28:23,560 --> 01:28:28,880
my name is Deborah Poll and for 25 years I lived on Roning

846
01:28:28,880 --> 01:28:37,160
Ridge Road, which is directly adjacent to the Christian Science Church, located at Via

847
01:28:37,160 --> 01:28:44,880
Campusina near Palisburg's Drive, North. The city had cited this property for the

848
01:28:44,880 --> 01:28:53,520
erection of a 116-unit apartment building, which is if that's done, would exponentially

849
01:28:53,520 --> 01:29:03,200
devide my single family home as well as the residents of other residents of

850
01:29:03,720 --> 01:29:14,860
Rolling Ridge Road is that you remove the property that site from your list

851
01:29:18,260 --> 01:29:24,440
especially since it is directly adjacent to me. My

852
01:29:31,220 --> 01:29:33,800
cursory review of the House

853
01:29:33,800 --> 01:29:41,080
development plan shows that it requires the building of 199 housing units in PDE.

854
01:29:41,780 --> 01:29:51,260
PDE sites the Christian Science Church property adjacent to me as appropriate for the erection

855
01:29:51,300 --> 01:29:58,860
of this apartment unit, apparently in response to the development of housing and community

856
01:29:58,860 --> 01:29:59,760
other.

857
01:30:19,420 --> 01:30:27,380
And I know that I, and at least one other resident of Rolling Ridge Road, were the victims

858
01:30:27,380 --> 01:30:30,760
of residential burglaries in the very recent past.

859
01:30:32,460 --> 01:30:39,580
The city can comply with the state's mandate as ridiculous as it is even if it removes

860
01:30:39,580 --> 01:30:47,380
the church property from the site while adhering to its long-held general plan and zoning

861
01:30:47,380 --> 01:30:47,880
laws.

862
01:30:48,480 --> 01:30:56,820
The general plan is designed to preserve the quality of life and it sets guidelines for

863
01:30:56,820 --> 01:31:02,240
are the areas among others of open spaces, housing,

864
01:31:03,940 --> 01:31:06,780
scenic highways, safety, noise,

865
01:31:07,240 --> 01:31:11,060
and most importantly, neighborhood compatibility.

866
01:31:12,060 --> 01:31:18,180
A 116 unit apartment building directly adjacent to me

867
01:31:18,930 --> 01:31:21,900
and the other residents of Rolling Ridge Road

868
01:31:21,900 --> 01:31:29,540
is not consistent or compatible with the policies written in the city's general plan,

869
01:31:29,820 --> 01:31:34,000
especially as they relate to neighborhood compatibility.

870
01:31:35,040 --> 01:31:40,460
Indeed, deep restrictions can hold by the city of Palisburg and

871
01:31:40,460 --> 01:31:47,760
the states prevents PVE from development of these multi-family housing on this property

872
01:31:47,760 --> 01:31:50,720
that's directly adjacent to me.

873
01:31:50,720 --> 01:32:00,280
This would be offensive and probably actionable to which the residents of a rolling bridge rose and the Church object.

874
01:32:02,610 --> 01:32:05,650
I know my time is running out but just give me one more minute.

875
01:32:06,130 --> 01:32:14,990
Another goal of the city's general plan is to maintain low density with a predominantly single family residential pattern.

876
01:32:14,990 --> 01:32:23,650
building a 116 unit apartment across the street from me is inconsistent with

877
01:32:23,650 --> 01:32:30,050
that goal. A primary focus of the housing element plan is also to protect

878
01:32:30,050 --> 01:32:35,730
existing residential neighbors and to preserve the quality of the existing

879
01:32:35,730 --> 01:32:37,390
living environment.

880
01:32:41,130 --> 01:32:41,910
So where

881
01:32:54,260 --> 01:32:59,820
any of you live and I don't need to know it for my

882
01:32:59,820 --> 01:33:01,180
last point that

883
01:33:03,680 --> 01:33:11,220
none of you would want to live next door to a 116 unit apartment

884
01:33:11,220 --> 01:33:17,520
building that would destroy the neighborhood compatibility of your home.

885
01:33:19,100 --> 01:33:20,180
Thank you.

886
01:33:20,680 --> 01:33:26,520
All comments, all we ask is that you give us the same consideration.

887
01:33:27,280 --> 01:33:28,720
Thank you for listening to me.

888
01:33:29,020 --> 01:33:29,420
Thank you.

889
01:33:40,830 --> 01:33:43,130
I'm Debbie Jones, I live on Pulse Verde's Drive West,

890
01:33:43,290 --> 01:33:46,550
and I moved to this community for all the reasons

891
01:33:46,550 --> 01:33:50,690
that people are here so emphatically describing.

892
01:33:51,590 --> 01:33:55,770
Most of us are here because we don't like the proposed sites.

893
01:33:56,970 --> 01:34:02,630
What we need to understand is that the draconian state legislator

894
01:34:02,630 --> 01:34:03,150
eat us.

895
01:34:04,270 --> 01:34:05,710
They need to be changed.

896
01:34:06,490 --> 01:34:09,870
If they're not changed, we will be continuously

897
01:34:09,870 --> 01:34:11,130
this week fighting this battle.

898
01:34:12,530 --> 01:34:15,070
The council was just talking about new aid,

899
01:34:15,150 --> 01:34:17,490
I won't repeat many of the things that have already been said,

900
01:34:17,490 --> 01:34:21,370
and I want to thank the council for an excellent summary

901
01:34:21,370 --> 01:34:22,870
of what's been going on.

902
01:34:24,190 --> 01:34:27,010
You know, one of the other things is the council brought up

903
01:34:27,010 --> 01:34:28,850
were the new aid you laws,

904
01:34:29,430 --> 01:34:31,970
which we certainly don't want to get into this evening,

905
01:34:32,610 --> 01:34:33,730
because that's once again,

906
01:34:33,970 --> 01:34:36,070
another state legislature heated.

907
01:34:36,070 --> 01:34:43,730
Mr. McGowan did emphasize that none of this building would be happening unless landowners

908
01:34:43,730 --> 01:34:52,530
sell their land, but you can imagine how the developers can incentivize for people to

909
01:34:52,530 --> 01:34:53,350
sell their land.

910
01:34:55,780 --> 01:34:59,900
We cannot allow the state legislature to send down

911
01:35:02,700 --> 01:35:03,500
We must

912
01:35:08,460 --> 01:35:19,360
approach the ballot initiative with this same furver. Please, donate, support our neighborhood voices.

913
01:35:20,420 --> 01:35:32,080
Our neighborhood voices.com, you can get all the information. We must approach the ballot initiative with the same furver. Our council is doing the best they can.

914
01:35:32,080 --> 01:35:45,020
But we are dealing with draconian edicts that are being dropped down from the state, and we have to address it as a community and as people that live in this city and this state.

915
01:35:45,320 --> 01:35:50,280
So please, please support the ballot initiative and get involved however you can.

916
01:36:03,240 --> 01:36:05,500
He might not you. He might not you.

917
01:36:05,720 --> 01:36:11,480
I'm just too tall, I'm sorry. In the last time I was here, I was actually dressed up and

918
01:36:11,480 --> 01:36:17,120
dragged for the one out of a talent show circa 1996. Mr. Herman, and then before that,

919
01:36:17,160 --> 01:36:22,680
we were the Beatles and then the YMCA. I still remember him doing the YMCA. Sarah remembers.

920
01:36:24,920 --> 01:36:29,060
And her son, Andrew, was at Sullivan, and I was George Harrison.

921
01:36:31,280 --> 01:36:41,200
Anyway, you know, looking around, I don't have anything prepared to say, but I do want to say that we're all in this together.

922
01:36:41,820 --> 01:36:47,300
The sense I get from looking around people tonight is that we're all angry, we're all in a fight. That's all I feel.

923
01:36:47,300 --> 01:36:47,580
So we

924
01:36:53,120 --> 01:36:58,060
have to look, we have to be strategic about how we fight issues,

925
01:37:01,810 --> 01:37:04,240
or that's one

926
01:37:04,240 --> 01:37:05,020
prong of attack.

927
01:37:05,780 --> 01:37:12,380
Getting the housing element passed so a builder can't exercise the builder's remedy and

928
01:37:12,380 --> 01:37:14,340
build them on stress beyond the sale del mar.

929
01:37:14,700 --> 01:37:15,560
That's another one.

930
01:37:16,680 --> 01:37:22,840
And the third one, which I haven't heard discussed much tonight, are the de-restrictions.

931
01:37:24,420 --> 01:37:29,440
And I think we all just assume automatically, we don't have any money, PBHA's broke.

932
01:37:30,560 --> 01:37:35,440
We don't really have a voice when we vote anyway, they don't open the ballots, what's

933
01:37:35,440 --> 01:37:35,780
the point?

934
01:37:36,900 --> 01:37:39,740
They're going to do what they're going to do and we're S-O-L.

935
01:37:40,120 --> 01:37:48,380
Not really true, if you read the by-laws, there actually is a mechanism to require a special

936
01:37:48,380 --> 01:37:52,240
meeting when a certain number of signatures are obtained.

937
01:37:52,240 --> 01:37:56,340
I mean, at a special meeting, we can then be in another vote.

938
01:37:57,380 --> 01:38:05,640
There's also not a requirement in the bylaws that the ballot's not be opened unless the

939
01:38:05,640 --> 01:38:06,220
quarantine is met.

940
01:38:06,380 --> 01:38:11,040
That was opposed maybe 10 years ago, although I wanted to previous directors.

941
01:38:11,300 --> 01:38:12,100
That's not a requirement.

942
01:38:14,220 --> 01:38:22,840
My suggestion is that we hold another vote, we get somebody in there, that's accountable

943
01:38:22,840 --> 01:38:28,300
the residents and that's going to pass assessments so that we can actually fight

944
01:38:28,300 --> 01:38:35,520
back when the time comes, fight back through the courts. What better city, what

945
01:38:36,990 --> 01:38:41,290
other cities are there like ours that are similar situated that have

946
01:38:41,290 --> 01:38:45,270
deep restrictions that have the kind of rich history that we have in

947
01:38:45,270 --> 01:38:51,090
California very very few and I think I think we would have a decent shot at

948
01:38:51,090 --> 01:38:53,770
and taking a case all the way up.

949
01:38:54,870 --> 01:38:59,530
And so what I'd like to see is the community band together

950
01:39:01,370 --> 01:39:06,070
and require that our HOA board pass assessments

951
01:39:06,070 --> 01:39:07,490
so we can build up the workshops

952
01:39:08,110 --> 01:39:10,370
and fight back to protect our leader restrictions.

953
01:39:11,010 --> 01:39:11,990
That's all I have, thank you.

954
01:39:24,560 --> 01:39:26,840
Good evening everyone, I'm Aziz Saleh

955
01:39:26,840 --> 01:39:29,000
and my both kids are going to town on campus.

956
01:39:29,000 --> 01:39:38,840
I feel so lucky because my kids they have the same opportunity that I had 40 years ago in my school.

957
01:39:39,320 --> 01:39:42,520
I grew up in nature, so I'm so happy for them.

958
01:39:43,140 --> 01:39:47,040
They go to town and have the other cousins, other uncles, etc.

959
01:39:47,940 --> 01:39:50,380
So they are kind of second or third generation there.

960
01:39:51,980 --> 01:39:56,460
I wish I could share with you my thoughts in the next story about this matter.

961
01:39:56,460 --> 01:39:59,980
So you could see more houses are filling up.

962
01:40:05,820 --> 01:40:28,240
So, I want to invite you to come over at the peak of old drop-off time and see how hard it is to get in the rear of the road or get out of the PV drive. It's a huge traffic. So, how you can add over 600 or whatever amount of the buildings there and I don't know how you want to handle it.

963
01:40:28,240 --> 01:40:35,880
you want to add at least 1,500 won't cost to this simple no no. I think it's

964
01:40:35,880 --> 01:40:40,960
better to invite Sacramento people to this area and show them the situation of

965
01:40:40,960 --> 01:40:45,520
the PVE and tell them that this is what we cannot do it here.

966
01:41:01,490 --> 01:41:02,670
You're not

967
01:41:02,670 --> 01:41:10,190
and other council members. My name is Richard Breaks. I live in Nevada Bay. I've been a member

968
01:41:10,190 --> 01:41:16,850
of St. Francis Church for over 40 years. I have served the Church in a variety of leadership

969
01:41:16,850 --> 01:41:24,890
capacities and as a practicing attorney I have performed legal work for pro bono for the Church

970
01:41:24,890 --> 01:41:33,210
for over 25 years. Last July the City Council removed the church from its list of

971
01:41:33,210 --> 01:41:41,390
potential sites for affordable housing for very valid reasons. The reasons for

972
01:41:41,390 --> 01:41:49,930
that decision have not changed, have not changed so there is no basis for the

973
01:41:49,930 --> 01:41:53,430
the City Council to reconsider that decision

974
01:41:54,110 --> 01:41:58,410
as has been intonated at the last City Council meeting

975
01:41:58,410 --> 01:41:59,810
and also tonight.

976
01:42:00,850 --> 01:42:03,430
I would like to review some of the reasons,

977
01:42:03,430 --> 01:42:05,770
reiterate some of the reasons to you,

978
01:42:06,310 --> 01:42:09,650
both to you and to other members of the community

979
01:42:09,970 --> 01:42:11,210
who are with us tonight.

980
01:42:12,110 --> 01:42:15,110
First, the church has no desire whatsoever

981
01:42:15,110 --> 01:42:16,650
to sell its property.

982
01:42:16,650 --> 01:42:23,850
That is a criticism. This is critical because the housing element, as you yourself have said, is not

983
01:42:23,850 --> 01:42:34,090
imminent domain. An owner must wish to sell his, her, or its property. Further, while the

984
01:42:34,090 --> 01:42:42,350
rector, wardens, investor member of St. Francis Church hold legal title of the property, the

985
01:42:42,350 --> 01:42:46,110
The beneficial owner is the Episcopal Diocese of Los Angeles.

986
01:42:46,870 --> 01:42:57,230
We are an integral part of the diocese and we have consulted with Bishop John Taylor

987
01:42:57,590 --> 01:43:01,570
and he supports our decision not to sell the property.

988
01:43:03,070 --> 01:43:09,810
Now one may ask why we are concerned about being included in the city's list of potential

989
01:43:09,810 --> 01:43:17,450
affordable housing sites if we have no desire to sell our property. The answer is that such

990
01:43:17,450 --> 01:43:24,090
listing would distract the church from its mission, would cause internal and community

991
01:43:24,090 --> 01:43:28,270
divisions, and cause increased pressures from the state.

992
01:43:30,340 --> 01:43:33,380
Second, we are a vibrant, active

993
01:43:33,380 --> 01:43:40,780
church, members of St. Francis as well as town and country of testify to that tonight and

994
01:43:40,780 --> 01:43:42,400
and I'm sure others will speak as well.

995
01:43:43,360 --> 01:43:47,520
Therefore, there is no chance of realistic development capacity

996
01:43:47,900 --> 01:43:52,300
or high likelihood of turnover within the planning period,

997
01:43:52,500 --> 01:43:55,800
which are the requirements for being included by HCD

998
01:43:56,300 --> 01:43:58,680
in the inventory for affordable housing.

999
01:43:59,620 --> 01:44:03,060
In conclusion, I wish to note that both our chapel

1000
01:44:03,340 --> 01:44:06,240
and our church are architecturally significant

1001
01:44:06,520 --> 01:44:07,500
in their design.

1002
01:44:07,500 --> 01:44:13,040
noted architect Walter Swindle Davis who designed Leventy in with his

1003
01:44:13,040 --> 01:44:18,700
brother in the building in Malikov that houses the ranch market, designed our

1004
01:44:18,700 --> 01:44:24,900
chapel which was completed in 1952 and George Vernon Russell who prepared the

1005
01:44:24,900 --> 01:44:30,460
master architectural plan for the LA County Museum was the architect for our

1006
01:44:30,460 --> 01:44:37,320
church which was completed in 1965. Because of their architectural significance we

1007
01:44:37,320 --> 01:44:42,980
We consulted with noted expert Robert Chattell about having these buildings listed on the

1008
01:44:42,980 --> 01:44:44,960
National Register of Historic Places.

1009
01:44:45,460 --> 01:44:50,040
He was involved in such effort with respective buildings in Malibu, Kova Plaza.

1010
01:44:50,580 --> 01:44:54,660
Thank you very much for your attention to this matter, and thank you for your service to

1011
01:44:54,660 --> 01:44:55,000
the city.

1012
01:44:55,560 --> 01:44:56,020
Thank you.

1013
01:45:01,680 --> 01:45:08,480
My name is Jeff Hayden. I have lived on the Hill my entire life. I was at Valmer.

1014
01:45:08,700 --> 01:45:14,300
I was at Kalmani Elementary, Mallorca, the Intermediate at Royal Hills High School. I raised my kids here.

1015
01:45:15,440 --> 01:45:26,880
My house is on the picture that you showed at the Craig Science Church. This is going to have a huge impact to the generation of my family.

1016
01:45:27,580 --> 01:45:32,720
not to mention the traffic that's already there, the turn signals that'll probably have to be put in.

1017
01:45:34,880 --> 01:45:36,160
I'm not sure what happened.

1018
01:45:39,080 --> 01:45:45,220
This is kind of what goes on when we're having to have outsiders decide how we want to have

1019
01:45:45,220 --> 01:45:46,780
to live and put our culture is.

1020
01:45:47,660 --> 01:45:49,900
But I would encourage you to get with the other cities.

1021
01:45:50,780 --> 01:45:55,200
What can we do as all the cities on that hill to connect this?

1022
01:45:55,200 --> 01:45:59,940
We probably have a brief little attorneys here that might work pro bono on the thing.

1023
01:46:00,640 --> 01:46:05,660
We have to have something else to do rather than to do that.

1024
01:46:06,740 --> 01:46:11,520
I know that representatives from the Church of Christ science will probably come up and

1025
01:46:11,520 --> 01:46:12,860
talk at some point here as well.

1026
01:46:13,300 --> 01:46:17,020
They've already indicated that they're not interested in selling, and that's encouraging.

1027
01:46:18,280 --> 01:46:21,300
However, the zoning's are changed.

1028
01:46:25,240 --> 01:46:26,120
Thank you.

1029
01:46:27,220 --> 01:46:27,660
My

1030
01:46:32,940 --> 01:46:33,820
name is E. G. O'Bernier.

1031
01:46:34,060 --> 01:46:35,240
I have a fund of E. La Selva.

1032
01:46:36,540 --> 01:46:39,680
Very different than a lot of people who have come up and talked about how long we've been

1033
01:46:39,680 --> 01:46:39,900
here.

1034
01:46:40,260 --> 01:46:45,420
We've only been here for about a year and a half and the biggest thing for us is the sense of

1035
01:46:45,420 --> 01:46:46,060
community right.

1036
01:46:46,260 --> 01:46:51,600
And Andrew goes to town and country and it's something people have, the kids thrive there and

1037
01:46:52,120 --> 01:46:55,580
they're very purposeful of how the school is set up in the activities.

1038
01:46:55,580 --> 01:46:59,300
in that place is very, very special.

1039
01:47:00,380 --> 01:47:05,520
I said you guys are very long to email, so I apologize for that, but it's really important

1040
01:47:05,520 --> 01:47:09,840
to a lot of the families, I think you saw how many people raised their hands, how important

1041
01:47:09,840 --> 01:47:15,280
that school is, we're walking this is the way, the other piece on the utilization that I

1042
01:47:15,280 --> 01:47:19,980
think was really talked about is I almost feel sometimes that I'm at that school more times

1043
01:47:19,980 --> 01:47:23,560
than Andrew is, and I think they don't want me to be there anymore, but you know, we're there

1044
01:47:23,560 --> 01:47:28,300
for parenting classes. We go there for advice. I mean it's it's an unbelievable

1045
01:47:28,300 --> 01:47:31,940
community so I want to keep a break but really great support for the school.

1046
01:47:32,500 --> 01:47:33,980
Thank you. I

1047
01:47:43,160 --> 01:47:45,920
have a summer resident down here in Manana Bay. First of all I want to say

1048
01:47:45,920 --> 01:47:48,820
thanks to you all for dealing with this for I don't know how long it's been a very

1049
01:47:48,820 --> 01:47:52,740
long time and it's literally a rock and a hard place. What I want to say is as

1050
01:47:52,740 --> 01:47:56,380
much of everyone in this room and everyone that's not in this room as much as for you

1051
01:47:56,380 --> 01:48:00,500
guys which has been brought up a couple times but I think it's been lost a little

1052
01:48:00,500 --> 01:48:03,460
a little bit in the forest or in the forest for the trees or whatever the saying goes.

1053
01:48:04,180 --> 01:48:10,960
Which is we are one community and no matter where these end up someone is going to be super

1054
01:48:10,960 --> 01:48:11,220
mad.

1055
01:48:11,900 --> 01:48:15,680
But if you get out of your area it's going to someone else's and then they're going to

1056
01:48:15,680 --> 01:48:16,980
be super mad.

1057
01:48:17,820 --> 01:48:22,900
So there is no world in which just nothing happens unless we want 500 unit developments next

1058
01:48:22,900 --> 01:48:26,640
door to our single family homes that's just not a realistic scenario for us.

1059
01:48:26,640 --> 01:48:33,740
I agree with our neighborhood voices, push, I agree with any every legal means we possibly can to push back.

1060
01:48:34,340 --> 01:48:39,580
But if we do not pass a housing element, the number one enemy we have is building a remedy.

1061
01:48:40,240 --> 01:48:42,940
It will be a nightmare beyond any of you can imagine.

1062
01:48:42,940 --> 01:48:45,600
You're talking about 115 units in a place.

1063
01:48:46,140 --> 01:48:48,620
Think about 500 and not in one spot.

1064
01:48:48,900 --> 01:48:51,600
Think of every open lot we have where to fetch a price.

1065
01:48:52,140 --> 01:48:57,680
So I empathize with everyone, no one wants the pain of the traffic and the

1066
01:48:57,680 --> 01:49:01,360
constructions and all the pain that will come if one of these ends up in your

1067
01:49:01,360 --> 01:49:05,220
backyard. But keep in mind that if it's not in your backyard it's in

1068
01:49:05,220 --> 01:49:10,400
someone's and they're getting that pain. But I would recommend to the impossible task

1069
01:49:10,400 --> 01:49:15,360
of the council is to do it based on equity as much as possible. Have everyone bear

1070
01:49:15,360 --> 01:49:19,980
the pain equally as much as is possible. How to calculate that in a way that

1071
01:49:19,980 --> 01:49:22,400
it doesn't anger a lot of people, I have no idea.

1072
01:49:23,040 --> 01:49:26,300
But there is some way to think about traffic impact,

1073
01:49:26,780 --> 01:49:29,020
congestion impact, property value impact,

1074
01:49:29,260 --> 01:49:31,480
and try to at least from a principle perspective,

1075
01:49:32,240 --> 01:49:35,360
spread the pain as much as we possibly can

1076
01:49:35,360 --> 01:49:38,480
so that no one bears it inordinately more than others

1077
01:49:38,860 --> 01:49:39,800
as much as we can.

1078
01:49:40,240 --> 01:49:42,140
Recognizing there is no perfect solution

1079
01:49:42,140 --> 01:49:44,520
where everyone's gonna get 3% of the pain.

1080
01:49:45,060 --> 01:49:47,660
With that, I'll yield my last 54 seconds.

1081
01:49:47,660 --> 01:49:50,360
Thank you my

1082
01:49:57,600 --> 01:49:59,840
name is Catherine Hayden. I was born and raised.

1083
01:50:00,000 --> 01:50:29,980
I'm Karen Palsberties. I went to high school or the view of your case. And I'm currently a graduate student at the University of California. So today, I've heard a lot about traffic impacts. I've heard a lot about the home values that are going to go down by the way. I live right next to the Christian Science Church, but I'm much better there. But for me, I want to talk about something that I'm more familiar with. My thesis is on air pollution exposure and adverse spread outcomes. Something that hasn't been talked about today is the air pollution

1084
01:50:29,980 --> 01:50:33,520
that is going to come from the construction at this church,

1085
01:50:33,580 --> 01:50:34,900
if it is approved for this site.

1086
01:50:35,320 --> 01:50:37,340
There are houses on every single side.

1087
01:50:38,020 --> 01:50:40,180
And as you know, construction is not fast.

1088
01:50:40,640 --> 01:50:42,460
It's going to take years and years and years.

1089
01:50:42,940 --> 01:50:45,700
And everyone that lives around that church

1090
01:50:46,100 --> 01:50:48,820
is going to have to breathe in all of that lucid.

1091
01:50:49,340 --> 01:50:51,040
We know that it has adverse health effects

1092
01:50:51,040 --> 01:50:53,080
no matter what you feel about, private change,

1093
01:50:53,760 --> 01:50:55,740
and air pollution, this is an issue

1094
01:50:55,740 --> 01:50:57,640
and we're only beginning to understand the effects.

1095
01:50:58,340 --> 01:51:04,400
So, and also if anyone has a membership of the golf course, you will also be exposed to all of that construction pollution.

1096
01:51:05,240 --> 01:51:11,780
I understand that you have to find a spot, and I understand that the state is putting all of these regulations on you.

1097
01:51:12,980 --> 01:51:21,960
But I would ask you find a site that is not going to impact so many neighbors and not going to cause health effects not only today, but in the long term as well.

1098
01:51:22,360 --> 01:51:22,680
Thank you.

1099
01:51:23,140 --> 01:51:23,580
Thank you.

1100
01:51:23,580 --> 01:51:26,460
And my name

1101
01:51:32,350 --> 01:51:33,250
is Jason Shelby.

1102
01:51:33,430 --> 01:51:36,150
I'm a priest at St. Francis' fiscal church.

1103
01:51:37,010 --> 01:51:40,570
And before I begin, I've been asked by one of my many bosses

1104
01:51:41,290 --> 01:51:43,350
for the people that are here from St. Francis

1105
01:51:44,070 --> 01:51:46,270
to stand up for at least a raise your hand.

1106
01:51:51,190 --> 01:51:52,050
Thank you very much.

1107
01:51:54,820 --> 01:51:55,240
This is,

1108
01:51:58,780 --> 01:52:02,600
I saw many of you at the funeral for my looting.

1109
01:52:03,020 --> 01:52:04,500
You came in the chapel for the funeral.

1110
01:52:04,500 --> 01:52:11,520
And I'm glad that you were in attendance to honor his life and legacy of the work that he did for

1111
01:52:11,520 --> 01:52:12,560
the Palace Verde's Estates.

1112
01:52:13,780 --> 01:52:14,780
I'm a new resident.

1113
01:52:14,960 --> 01:52:18,040
My family and I moved to PVD in February of last year.

1114
01:52:18,960 --> 01:52:24,480
We live in the Belmonti neighborhood on a street with several young families, like

1115
01:52:24,480 --> 01:52:28,340
why the teachers of Montmelagia Elementary feel at home.

1116
01:52:31,410 --> 01:52:35,610
Throughout the week at church, we receive phone calls and visits from people meeting financial

1117
01:52:35,610 --> 01:52:43,290
assistance, a place to stay, or food to eat, is not unusual to find a non-house person sitting

1118
01:52:43,290 --> 01:52:51,730
in our front office waiting to talk to me. We are a place of refuge for many. People know that

1119
01:52:51,730 --> 01:53:01,110
they can come here and at the very least be warmly greeted and welcomed. We are not obsolete. We are not

1120
01:53:01,110 --> 01:53:08,410
under utilized. We are not for sale for any price. Thank you.

1121
01:53:15,230 --> 01:53:17,190
Good evening. My name is

1122
01:53:17,190 --> 01:53:22,010
Aileen Taver. I'm an attorney and I represent concerns that is since of

1123
01:53:22,010 --> 01:53:27,410
Alice Ferries. I think we've heard a lot from you about the fact that HDD is

1124
01:53:27,410 --> 01:53:32,710
making you do this. Yeah, there's a state law that says that you need to have the

1125
01:53:32,710 --> 01:53:37,790
housing element, but what is in that housing element is your discretion.

1126
01:53:38,670 --> 01:53:44,770
So HCD telling you you have to include specific lots is absolutely false.

1127
01:53:45,350 --> 01:53:50,050
You can meet the standards, for example, by having ADUs.

1128
01:53:50,710 --> 01:53:52,570
There are alternatives.

1129
01:53:53,590 --> 01:53:58,550
This city will be making the findings that say this is what we're going to be doing.

1130
01:53:58,550 --> 01:54:07,610
it gets submitted to HCD. HCD does not approve your housing element. HCD's role is to look at it

1131
01:54:07,610 --> 01:54:14,010
and say, is it in substantial compliance with luck? That's all. You can disagree. HCD can

1132
01:54:14,010 --> 01:54:19,430
disagree. As long as you've approved that housing element, there is no filters. Remedy, whether

1133
01:54:19,430 --> 01:54:27,090
or not HCD likes what you have in that particular housing element. So I think it's a little bit misleading

1134
01:54:27,090 --> 01:54:32,370
meeting to say that you have to have certain properties in that housing element, it really

1135
01:54:32,370 --> 01:54:37,770
is up to the city as to what specific lots you want to have in there.

1136
01:54:39,890 --> 01:54:45,170
And so I think that I would urge you to look at what those alternatives are and to particularly

1137
01:54:45,170 --> 01:54:49,770
look at accessory dwelling units as part of your package.

1138
01:54:50,150 --> 01:54:50,510
Thank you.

1139
01:54:50,510 --> 01:54:51,490
Just

1140
01:54:53,860 --> 01:54:59,980
to clarify, in the table that Gina shared, we do.

1141
01:55:00,000 --> 01:55:21,430
We have 80, 80 use as part of our 199 plus 15% by here. So we have no limit. It's got to be based off of the calculation of how many units realistically we will build based on past and current practices. I'm sorry. Next. Hi.

1142
01:55:27,230 --> 01:55:34,510
I was intending to speak, but I have two doubts in this fight, so I feel compelled to.

1143
01:55:35,450 --> 01:55:38,650
The first, and I'm so happy to see there's so much support for Town and Country.

1144
01:55:39,010 --> 01:55:45,190
I feel like I don't know, ma'am, if you live in Palsbury, the States, but to characterize

1145
01:55:45,190 --> 01:55:51,370
the site, the town of countries on St. Francis, the physical church as underutilized or obsolete is

1146
01:55:51,370 --> 01:56:00,750
completely misinformed, frankly, sorry. So that's the first one. Second is I see all this because I

1147
01:56:00,750 --> 01:56:04,870
have three children, one of which has gone through a town of country. My daughter is currently

1148
01:56:04,870 --> 01:56:10,810
at town of country. I have a baby at home who will attend town of country next year. I have many

1149
01:56:10,810 --> 01:56:15,530
friends here, whose children, I mean, I don't have to keep going on. I think all of you

1150
01:56:15,530 --> 01:56:23,010
who live here know that it's a highly utilized location. My second point, my second issue

1151
01:56:23,010 --> 01:56:31,950
with some of the areas is next to my home. I'm not as close as the lady on a rolling ridge

1152
01:56:31,950 --> 01:56:38,890
road, but I am on the corner of Via Campusina and Via Pima, which is kind of

1153
01:56:38,890 --> 01:56:45,150
kind of corner to that site, and as you know it's smacked out in the middle of

1154
01:56:45,150 --> 01:56:49,890
a four-way stop at PV Drive in Via Campusina and a four-way stop at Silver

1155
01:56:49,890 --> 01:56:56,830
Square PV Drive, and if we think it's bottleneck now, I can't imagine adding what

1156
01:56:57,530 --> 01:57:05,110
160 times 2, I don't know, 320 extra cars, not to mention that is where I'm pretty sure

1157
01:57:05,110 --> 01:57:09,490
the crime is coming into the increased robberies and burglaries and things that have been happening

1158
01:57:09,490 --> 01:57:10,450
in Palsford and the States.

1159
01:57:11,050 --> 01:57:13,890
We're pretty close to Crenshaw and Hawthorne in that area.

1160
01:57:14,270 --> 01:57:16,050
I'm pretty sure they're not coming from PV dry.

1161
01:57:16,710 --> 01:57:20,230
That seems like a much more reasonable route to take if you want a burglaries someone over

1162
01:57:20,230 --> 01:57:20,430
here.

1163
01:57:21,050 --> 01:57:28,050
So, increasing the traffic through that area, I mean, I think we can be a little more

1164
01:57:28,050 --> 01:57:34,010
creative in terms of where we're trying to place, which parcels are trying to use.

1165
01:57:34,150 --> 01:57:39,910
Someone mentioned that it's much tougher for a developer to build and smaller parcels

1166
01:57:39,910 --> 01:57:40,270
of land.

1167
01:57:40,270 --> 01:57:41,150
It's less desirable.

1168
01:57:41,790 --> 01:57:47,070
I think handing them five acres and saying have at it, they're probably going to build to

1169
01:57:47,070 --> 01:57:47,310
the max.

1170
01:57:47,310 --> 01:57:49,730
So, that would be my argument against Christian science, I don't care.

1171
01:57:51,270 --> 01:57:56,210
And also, in terms of traffic, town and country, it's just be reasonable, that's one of

1172
01:57:56,210 --> 01:58:00,330
the most dangerous left hand turns, and I've remained in my life, so let's reconsider

1173
01:58:00,330 --> 01:58:01,230
that one, too, sure.

1174
01:58:01,730 --> 01:58:01,830
Okay.

1175
01:58:02,030 --> 01:58:02,230
Thank you.

1176
01:58:11,950 --> 01:58:18,030
Joshua Gottheim, Land Use Attorney, representing St. Francis Church, you know me from a couple

1177
01:58:18,030 --> 01:58:19,310
of letters, so one recently.

1178
01:58:21,030 --> 01:58:25,670
This is a political issue for you, but it's also a legal issue, and I don't think that's

1179
01:58:25,670 --> 01:58:29,330
received sufficient attention through this process.

1180
01:58:30,690 --> 01:58:35,030
Specifically, government code section 65583,

1181
01:58:35,950 --> 01:58:39,030
specifically requires that the sites included in the inventory

1182
01:58:40,110 --> 01:58:42,950
are suitable and available for residential development

1183
01:58:43,710 --> 01:58:46,150
and have realistic and demonstrated potential

1184
01:58:46,150 --> 01:58:48,170
for redevelopment during the planning period.

1185
01:58:49,390 --> 01:58:52,030
I would like to see or recommend that you

1186
01:58:52,030 --> 01:58:59,490
from your staff and consultant team into your city attorney and analysis looking at the

1187
01:58:59,490 --> 01:59:02,450
statutory criteria and applying them to the various sites.

1188
01:59:03,670 --> 01:59:09,730
Now I represent the St. Francis Church property, is that available, is it likely to turn

1189
01:59:09,730 --> 01:59:10,010
over?

1190
01:59:10,630 --> 01:59:10,770
No.

1191
01:59:10,950 --> 01:59:13,810
In fact, it's legally prohibited from being developed with housing.

1192
01:59:14,490 --> 01:59:21,570
It would be a fraud to represent to HCD that this church property could be developed

1193
01:59:21,570 --> 01:59:26,910
housing or is this suitable and available for housing? Why isn't there a city

1194
01:59:26,910 --> 01:59:32,730
attorney's memo shared publicly that sets forth these criteria and these legal

1195
01:59:32,730 --> 01:59:36,510
standards? I don't think the council is being well-served or at least it's not a

1196
01:59:36,510 --> 01:59:42,590
transparent process. Another legal consideration, the state trans property is

1197
01:59:42,590 --> 01:59:47,130
subject to a restrictive covenant that prevents it from being developed with

1198
01:59:47,130 --> 01:59:52,390
multi-family housing. That covenant can be enforced by the association of my

1199
01:59:52,390 --> 01:59:57,110
neighbors by hundreds of property owners surrounding. It's part of a cohesive

1200
01:59:57,110 --> 01:59:59,230
plan for the city and cannot be.

1201
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:07,900
Cannot be dispensed with by the church, even if it wanted to, which it doesn't. Another source

1202
02:00:07,900 --> 02:00:15,880
of legal authority or advisory authority is HCD. It's been variously represented. Well, some

1203
02:00:15,880 --> 02:00:31,100
of these sites are acceptable to HCD, and some are not acceptable to HCD. Where is that

1204
02:00:31,100 --> 02:00:35,840
I would hate to be on the City Council and not have these resources available

1205
02:00:35,840 --> 02:00:39,620
a clear legal analysis that should be shared with the public.

1206
02:00:40,360 --> 02:00:46,120
A written response to analysis from HCD of the effect of restrictive

1207
02:00:46,120 --> 02:00:51,460
governance which absolutely prevent this property from being included in the

1208
02:00:51,460 --> 02:00:56,380
site's inventory. This is not a popularity contest or should not be, this should

1209
02:00:56,380 --> 02:01:00,180
be an orderly process where you are well advised by your council and your

1210
02:01:00,180 --> 02:01:06,120
consultant and make appropriate judgments within the discretion that's allowed by the law.

1211
02:01:06,900 --> 02:01:15,740
For non-vacant sites, properties according to the HCD guidebook, properties much they have

1212
02:01:15,740 --> 02:01:19,120
made certain criteria if they're non-vacant to be included.

1213
02:01:19,700 --> 02:01:22,940
Is there a lease that would expire early within the planning period?

1214
02:01:23,400 --> 02:01:23,800
No.

1215
02:01:24,020 --> 02:01:27,240
For St. Francis, is the building dilapidated?

1216
02:01:27,440 --> 02:01:29,160
Is the structure likely to be removed?

1217
02:01:29,160 --> 02:01:35,840
No. Not for St. Francis. Is there a development agreement to develop the site with housing? No.

1218
02:01:36,960 --> 02:01:41,080
Has the entity operating the use agreed to move to another location? No.

1219
02:01:41,840 --> 02:01:47,880
And the fifth of the five criteria that are cited in the in the HCD guidebook for non vacant sites.

1220
02:01:48,540 --> 02:01:54,520
Has a property owner provided a letter stating its attention to develop the property during the mining period? No.

1221
02:01:56,300 --> 02:01:57,900
So it's simply

1222
02:01:59,200 --> 02:02:03,420
confusing, it's not a no-pick, it is a no-pick process and I don't think you're

1223
02:02:03,420 --> 02:02:07,600
being well served by the analysis. I don't think you're in a position to make a

1224
02:02:07,600 --> 02:02:08,920
decision tonight. Thank you.

1225
02:02:16,990 --> 02:02:22,890
Good evening and many of you know me as your neighbor to City Hall. My name is

1226
02:02:22,890 --> 02:02:29,110
Darcelle Ramirez-Hamson. And truly, I, well, I'm really here to speak to our

1227
02:02:29,110 --> 02:02:32,650
community because I'm

1228
02:02:36,010 --> 02:02:40,030
really here to speak to our community because there's so

1229
02:02:40,030 --> 02:02:46,210
many instances here and some of you are just coming along with a neighbor here.

1230
02:02:46,970 --> 02:02:52,670
Another neighbor behind the library just heard about this today. I've heard

1231
02:02:52,670 --> 02:03:00,950
about many activities as the City Council that do not represent us or our

1232
02:03:00,950 --> 02:03:06,370
benefit when the street expansion with the Metro Authority was trying to be passed.

1233
02:03:06,890 --> 02:03:14,150
Let me tell you, our city council was well aware that that bus line would have brought

1234
02:03:14,150 --> 02:03:22,050
in SB 10 and building and builders remedy within a half mile radius of a bus.

1235
02:03:22,530 --> 02:03:24,450
They can build 10 units.

1236
02:03:25,010 --> 02:03:28,390
Our city council knew this and did not protect us.

1237
02:03:28,390 --> 02:03:33,910
We were very fortunate. We have so many intelligent people in our community and

1238
02:03:33,910 --> 02:03:39,690
engineers that push back at the time of all the liability of the exon right

1239
02:03:39,690 --> 02:03:44,870
below the five-way or via campus. You know that they wanted to dig up and take

1240
02:03:44,870 --> 02:03:50,130
down our community. It doesn't make sense because they are truly not representing

1241
02:03:50,130 --> 02:03:57,970
us. Our city attorney is not our city attorney. It is their city attorney.

1242
02:03:57,970 --> 02:04:04,070
I believe there are residents when they're not here, but it's shameful.

1243
02:04:04,790 --> 02:04:07,910
You know that St. Francis is all that you're hearing.

1244
02:04:08,310 --> 02:04:09,030
You know that.

1245
02:04:10,190 --> 02:04:16,370
Mr. McGowan, you sit there sheepishly not looking up at other times, but you know this.

1246
02:04:17,090 --> 02:04:19,150
Let me just give you a short experience.

1247
02:04:19,990 --> 02:04:27,830
When that street expansion project came on, their city attorney told everyone that

1248
02:04:27,830 --> 02:04:35,870
the open space lot between what happens to be my home, 360 PB Drive West, and the city

1249
02:04:36,490 --> 02:04:46,470
hall was not open space, was commercial. I had to go through so much next door, every

1250
02:04:46,470 --> 02:04:54,090
city council truly looking feverishly to get some attention and notice to our people.

1251
02:04:55,110 --> 02:04:59,850
He never corrected the record, not even today.

1252
02:05:00,000 --> 02:05:29,980
So, you are not getting accurate information. Let me give you some data on telling country. I did have two children that went there, your fabulous. In every way, and all the teachers and volunteers. My daughter's class, she is a junior, forgive me for sounding as different from being for my, that I'm saying, accolades for my daughter. But she's phenomenal. And she came up to me.

1253
02:05:29,980 --> 02:05:36,700
out of towning country with 10 other girls. I had a very big girl scout, a true

1254
02:05:36,700 --> 02:05:47,820
fat Montmelaga. Out of this class, 10 girls, those girls and young men are at

1255
02:05:47,820 --> 02:05:56,320
higher universities, Berkeley, Stanford, Northeastern. I could give you data on

1256
02:05:56,320 --> 02:05:58,680
just my daughter's graduating class.

1257
02:05:59,160 --> 02:06:03,960
That is a contribution to our community and our world.

1258
02:06:04,980 --> 02:06:07,020
When your time is up.

1259
02:06:07,220 --> 02:06:08,000
Oh, thank you.

1260
02:06:09,220 --> 02:06:12,880
Congratulations for your daughter for becoming the mayor.

1261
02:06:13,500 --> 02:06:15,320
My sentiments are the same.

1262
02:06:15,600 --> 02:06:16,400
It is shameful.

1263
02:06:16,980 --> 02:06:17,260
Thank you.

1264
02:06:17,260 --> 02:06:19,760
What you guys do not tell us.

1265
02:06:20,040 --> 02:06:20,960
And it's no notice.

1266
02:06:21,480 --> 02:06:22,340
We have other people waiting.

1267
02:06:22,380 --> 02:06:23,080
Thank you.

1268
02:06:25,080 --> 02:06:29,380
No mistake, there's no notice, that is their technique.

1269
02:06:33,080 --> 02:06:34,760
Hello, my name is Elizabeth Peterson.

1270
02:06:36,500 --> 02:06:38,120
I'm also, can you hear me?

1271
02:06:40,170 --> 02:06:41,490
Hi, I'm Elizabeth Peterson.

1272
02:06:42,630 --> 02:06:43,890
I'm also a town and country parent.

1273
02:06:44,070 --> 02:06:44,930
My two kids are in high school.

1274
02:06:45,010 --> 02:06:46,170
I see most of their teachers over here.

1275
02:06:46,790 --> 02:06:47,990
Thanks for everything you did.

1276
02:06:48,850 --> 02:06:49,930
I owe a lot to you.

1277
02:06:50,470 --> 02:06:55,490
And I'm here to speak in support of not targeting

1278
02:06:56,410 --> 02:06:59,910
the property in St. Francis, which we're talking about in countries located.

1279
02:07:02,530 --> 02:07:03,270
One of the things

1280
02:07:03,270 --> 02:07:09,380
I really want to raise, though, is this map I have here that shows Native American,

1281
02:07:10,080 --> 02:07:15,960
archaeological sites and palace forties. One, I point to here, number 55, is literally

1282
02:07:15,960 --> 02:07:25,020
rate at the site of St. Francis. In the 1920s and 1930s, the USC did a big excavation on

1283
02:07:25,020 --> 02:07:31,840
that white condo building just over from the St. Francis property and found massive amounts

1284
02:07:31,840 --> 02:07:36,200
of artifacts, the stratification going back a great deal of time.

1285
02:07:37,100 --> 02:07:47,530
And then in the 1960s they found burial sites, another archaeology at 2109 was it a place

1286
02:07:47,530 --> 02:07:55,790
closer to the property. I show up, everybody here, a burial site. These are the Tongva,

1287
02:07:56,810 --> 02:08:04,590
Gabyelina Tongva tribe, which shows, you know, burial position, specific position with artifacts

1288
02:08:04,590 --> 02:08:11,390
around them. So having spoken archaeologists is every reason to believe that that entire area is filled

1289
02:08:11,390 --> 02:08:14,790
with Native American artifacts and burial sites.

1290
02:08:15,570 --> 02:08:19,370
And I think considering all that has been done

1291
02:08:19,370 --> 02:08:20,930
to the Native Americans in this country,

1292
02:08:21,150 --> 02:08:23,530
including sending them out of palisaries,

1293
02:08:24,710 --> 02:08:28,070
and basically attaining them internally in California,

1294
02:08:28,590 --> 02:08:30,810
that should be a protected site.

1295
02:08:31,370 --> 02:08:34,350
These Native American tribes recognized.

1296
02:08:35,210 --> 02:08:37,930
So I want to just put the weight of that out here.

1297
02:08:37,930 --> 02:08:43,930
And then the next thing is the Elsa Gundot Blue Butterfly, I don't know if anybody is familiar with that,

1298
02:08:43,970 --> 02:08:45,630
it's a great rare butterfly species.

1299
02:08:46,090 --> 02:08:49,910
It's really only found between roughly Santa Monica and Pallas Verde's

1300
02:08:49,910 --> 02:08:54,050
and it has been found just adjacent for sure.

1301
02:08:54,730 --> 02:08:56,270
It's very hard to find them.

1302
02:08:56,750 --> 02:09:02,350
Right over there on just at the end of Torrent's Beach and also in Monacofe area

1303
02:09:02,350 --> 02:09:04,930
and then also the Pallas Verde's Blue Butterfly.

1304
02:09:04,930 --> 02:09:08,570
So both of these species of butterflies are very rare.

1305
02:09:08,890 --> 02:09:13,830
Some of the most rare butterflies in the world and their members are federally endangered species

1306
02:09:13,830 --> 02:09:17,850
and they're protected by the federal and major species sect.

1307
02:09:18,430 --> 02:09:21,890
I bring this especially to your attention because back in the 1980s,

1308
02:09:22,050 --> 02:09:27,810
Ranch of Pelas race tore up the only really known site for the PV blue butterfly

1309
02:09:27,810 --> 02:09:31,910
and the federal government tried to prosecute.

1310
02:09:31,910 --> 02:09:36,750
They were unsuccessful because it doesn't really matter because the lives have been changed

1311
02:09:36,750 --> 02:09:38,690
and now you can't go after municipalities.

1312
02:09:39,710 --> 02:09:44,790
So I would just, I would, out of concern for protecting Palisbury's estates, I would

1313
02:09:44,790 --> 02:09:51,570
just warn you of that situation and really encourage you to look elsewhere and to just leave

1314
02:09:52,090 --> 02:09:54,610
the same Francis site out of this.

1315
02:09:55,090 --> 02:09:56,190
Thank you very much.

1316
02:09:56,570 --> 02:09:57,210
Thank you.

1317
02:10:12,750 --> 02:10:22,130
I am Jerry Nelson. I was at the end of the line and people are behind me. I am in agreement with

1318
02:10:22,130 --> 02:10:27,790
the man in the crutch, who spoke earlier, and I just would like to make an observation

1319
02:10:27,790 --> 02:10:32,710
about the Christian science side. I'm not a member of the church. I don't live right next

1320
02:10:32,710 --> 02:10:47,630
to an effect mild, but it's nearly 75% that is proposed to go on that land of what is required of the 199.

1321
02:10:48,590 --> 02:10:58,890
So you're shoving 75% of your crop of your responsibility into that one corner of the city.

1322
02:10:58,890 --> 02:11:06,630
I know you're between a rock and a hard place that I agree with the younger the other man let's print the pain a little bit.

1323
02:11:07,110 --> 02:11:08,070
Thank you.

1324
02:11:08,070 --> 02:11:08,670
Thank you.

1325
02:11:14,730 --> 02:11:15,830
Good evening, Council.

1326
02:11:16,670 --> 02:11:18,410
Thank you for the opportunity to speak.

1327
02:11:18,550 --> 02:11:24,570
My name is Craig Quinn, a 20-year resident here in Palisperty, the States in Lennon, a Bay.

1328
02:11:25,810 --> 02:11:32,370
From a cash perspective, that's a little over $400,000 in property tax that we paid into the system.

1329
02:11:32,950 --> 02:11:37,190
So my first comment is if you're looking for affordable housing, I'd like you to

1330
02:11:37,190 --> 02:11:45,210
not profit taxes by half. That would help a lot. For those that are

1331
02:11:45,210 --> 02:11:49,270
underserved that come into our community, let them start off at 25% of the

1332
02:11:49,270 --> 02:11:53,630
tax rate help along rather than build these shuddy buildings that we're talking

1333
02:11:53,630 --> 02:11:59,610
about. I did not vote for anyone in Sacramento that is shoving this down to

1334
02:11:59,610 --> 02:12:01,650
art for adults. It's a second age.

1335
02:12:05,720 --> 02:12:08,420
I'm not all my friends. I continue to some of you are,

1336
02:12:08,500 --> 02:12:12,800
my friends here, but a lot of people are leaving California as you know. A lot of people are leaving

1337
02:12:12,800 --> 02:12:18,940
Palisperies of states. And I'm looking for reasons to stay in California. I brought my kids back to

1338
02:12:18,940 --> 02:12:23,840
California from Texas and they went to great schools down there. So we're looking for reasons.

1339
02:12:24,920 --> 02:12:29,140
This is horrific what's going on. So we all know that and I think we all agree with that.

1340
02:12:30,000 --> 02:12:35,240
We're also members of St. John Fisher Church, although I'm thinking of switching to St.

1341
02:12:35,400 --> 02:12:36,000
Grant itself.

1342
02:12:38,820 --> 02:12:40,280
Maybe just for a month or two.

1343
02:12:41,760 --> 02:12:43,460
But part of a great community.

1344
02:12:45,100 --> 02:12:48,420
Let me get into the weeds here real quick.

1345
02:12:48,640 --> 02:12:52,520
And it has, if we have to do this, which sounds like, you know, unless we get lawsuits

1346
02:12:52,520 --> 02:12:57,780
and some other things, we're going to have to go forward, less is more from my perspective

1347
02:12:57,780 --> 02:13:03,520
and from everybody's perspective, it's my understanding that there is a number on your report

1348
02:13:03,520 --> 02:13:12,940
that has 271 low income housing units. It's extra sites that were added to the proposition

1349
02:13:12,940 --> 02:13:20,800
or the proposal, but the RHNA only requires that we submit 199 units from what I understand.

1350
02:13:21,440 --> 02:13:27,360
So let's stick with under 200 to start. Don't give them anything else that we don't have to do.

1351
02:13:27,360 --> 02:13:31,440
If it's a recommendation, it's not a law on their part from what I understand.

1352
02:13:33,700 --> 02:13:38,500
And eight use would be a great way for us to do this.

1353
02:13:38,620 --> 02:13:44,060
It's my understanding that rolling hills saw the majority of their issue with about 95%

1354
02:13:44,060 --> 02:13:44,820
of ADUs.

1355
02:13:45,440 --> 02:13:50,100
They'll be where they're going to put them, but if that is in fact correct, it's what I understand.

1356
02:13:51,260 --> 02:13:55,740
If they're willing to put them in their backyard, there's got to be good reasons for that.

1357
02:13:55,740 --> 02:14:00,340
so we should strongly consider that. We can parcel up the rhetoric community, hopefully behind

1358
02:14:00,340 --> 02:14:04,780
other residences, they won't be being constructed, start from buildings and that type of thing.

1359
02:14:05,900 --> 02:14:12,340
Malagic code, banana-based plaza, et cetera, don't necessarily need to be on the list. So,

1360
02:14:13,120 --> 02:14:17,040
I'll leave it with this, 199, and 80 use. Thank you.

1361
02:14:27,040 --> 02:14:31,860
My name is Stanton Huntson. I am a 24-year resident

1362
02:14:36,300 --> 02:14:45,920
I'm not saying that to Bragg, but I've moved four times in California since 19, since 2001.

1363
02:14:47,080 --> 02:14:51,180
Every year that I've done it, I've done it for the betterment of my family and my children

1364
02:14:51,180 --> 02:14:54,080
of two amazing daughters, ten and twelve years old.

1365
02:14:54,740 --> 02:14:58,480
I don't envy anyone, any nine of you, up there.

1366
02:14:58,480 --> 02:14:59,820
by comments and words.

1367
02:15:01,920 --> 02:15:29,860
I have been sitting in the back listening. I got here a little late, so I'm just a little bit of the presentation, but I don't think as angry as we are. My anger, personally, is not against any of you because I don't envy your position. My anger is Sacramento. So what we need to do as citizens of a lot of things, the one gentleman said that we are one, and we are one, right?

1368
02:15:29,860 --> 02:15:37,100
Because if someone build that unit across the street for me and blocks my view, I'm going

1369
02:15:37,100 --> 02:15:37,620
to be furious.

1370
02:15:38,660 --> 02:15:42,120
But if they don't build it where I don't want it, they're going to build where somebody

1371
02:15:42,120 --> 02:15:44,880
else doesn't want to let the woman to keep talking about the rich, the rich, the rich,

1372
02:15:44,940 --> 02:15:45,880
the rich, the rich, the rich.

1373
02:15:45,880 --> 02:15:49,220
You were listening to sort of laughing at the same time you laughed to keep them crying,

1374
02:15:49,340 --> 02:15:50,920
did you feel bad for this person?

1375
02:15:51,340 --> 02:15:55,340
She spent all this time, money, raised her kids like I'm trying to do and I'm thinking

1376
02:15:55,340 --> 02:15:57,240
that my property guys are going to diminish.

1377
02:15:58,320 --> 02:16:03,260
and the element, I think, that is going to come into Palsbury's if we talk about low income.

1378
02:16:04,020 --> 02:16:10,340
I'm not trying to be stereotypical, but if someone is going to be living in a apartment

1379
02:16:10,340 --> 02:16:14,980
for $1200 where I'm spending a lot of money to live where I'm living,

1380
02:16:15,920 --> 02:16:19,820
I don't think you're just going to get one family in that apartment, right?

1381
02:16:20,460 --> 02:16:24,380
I think you're going to get a number of people in that apartment and you're going to get an

1382
02:16:24,380 --> 02:16:29,500
elements in Palsbury's that is going to diminish, just not our property values,

1383
02:16:29,880 --> 02:16:31,360
police, gentlemen, our way of life.

1384
02:16:31,840 --> 02:16:35,660
I moved here in Palsbury's because I love what Palsbury's represents.

1385
02:16:35,880 --> 02:16:36,620
I love the community.

1386
02:16:37,080 --> 02:16:40,820
That is going to be threatened if this passes.

1387
02:16:41,160 --> 02:16:44,180
So we can be as upset as these nine peoples you want.

1388
02:16:44,320 --> 02:16:46,060
And I think our anger is displaced.

1389
02:16:46,060 --> 02:16:47,320
This needs to be Sacramento.

1390
02:16:47,660 --> 02:16:51,080
So the one moment that was handy, that was holding that flag up, whatever it was.

1391
02:16:51,080 --> 02:16:54,160
I talked about the voices of the neighborhood.

1392
02:16:55,480 --> 02:16:58,240
That's the project number one which we need to do.

1393
02:16:58,680 --> 02:17:04,480
And as I was sitting back here since 20 minutes after quarter after six,

1394
02:17:04,940 --> 02:17:09,100
I saw nine people in this room that were my clients,

1395
02:17:09,720 --> 02:17:11,180
four of which are attorneys.

1396
02:17:11,740 --> 02:17:12,420
One of them just left.

1397
02:17:13,180 --> 02:17:17,320
So I think if it's a funding that we can't,

1398
02:17:17,600 --> 02:17:19,160
if the city can't afford it,

1399
02:17:19,640 --> 02:17:25,580
You tell one of those attorney clients of mine that they possibly could have a building

1400
02:17:25,580 --> 02:17:31,020
to obstruct their view and diminish their property values and change policies will not

1401
02:17:31,020 --> 02:17:32,140
obey the way of life.

1402
02:17:32,920 --> 02:17:38,120
I don't think you're going to have a hard time getting a band of attorneys together to help

1403
02:17:38,120 --> 02:17:40,680
fund whatever initiative we're trying to do.

1404
02:17:40,820 --> 02:17:42,080
So it starts a Sacramento.

1405
02:17:43,220 --> 02:17:43,740
Not necessarily.

1406
02:17:44,020 --> 02:17:44,700
It's people going to be angry.

1407
02:17:44,880 --> 02:17:47,260
You don't want to don't displace your anger Sacramento.

1408
02:17:47,600 --> 02:17:47,880
Thank you.

1409
02:17:47,880 --> 02:17:48,800
Thank you.

1410
02:17:56,120 --> 02:17:59,360
Thank you for the opportunity to address you tonight.

1411
02:18:00,480 --> 02:18:04,400
I would tell you, I am a grandmother of Pound Country.

1412
02:18:05,400 --> 02:18:07,000
My grandchild was there.

1413
02:18:07,600 --> 02:18:09,200
It was a wonderful experience.

1414
02:18:10,280 --> 02:18:16,240
I have lived in Palisparadees, America co-pactually, for 39 years.

1415
02:18:16,900 --> 02:18:19,200
I worked for St. Francis for 30 meters.

1416
02:18:19,500 --> 02:18:20,980
It feels like yesterday.

1417
02:18:20,980 --> 02:18:30,360
day. St. Francis, it's an amazing, amazing place. Truly, come see. Truly, you will see

1418
02:18:31,300 --> 02:18:38,120
what a resource it is to paddle through, and especially Malibu Coast. And yes, it

1419
02:18:38,120 --> 02:18:48,200
has been Mr. Representative. It is very, very active. I only have three minutes, so I can't

1420
02:18:48,200 --> 02:18:58,140
tell you everything and I can tell you a little. In 1952 you heard the PVE community

1421
02:18:58,140 --> 02:19:06,580
there were some ladies here that said, Palis Verde needs a church. They banded together,

1422
02:19:07,340 --> 02:19:08,980
the brothers were part of that,

1423
02:19:11,640 --> 02:19:16,740
and they built the very first church built in Palis Verde

1424
02:19:18,460 --> 02:19:27,420
it was active then and it is still very active. It served the community then and it still

1425
02:19:27,420 --> 02:19:35,720
serves community. It serves the members and it serves the residents. We are truly there

1426
02:19:35,720 --> 02:19:37,660
through every one.

1427
02:19:39,670 --> 02:19:45,650
I moved here and drove by. St. Francis, you're five years before I

1428
02:19:45,650 --> 02:19:53,750
knew it was there. My tennis partner insisted I apply for a job there. And I wasn't

1429
02:19:53,750 --> 02:19:59,770
very good at tennis obviously. I applied and I'm still there.

1430
02:20:00,750 --> 02:20:09,690
I could go on and on and tell you more and more, but I do want to know how many organizations

1431
02:20:09,690 --> 02:20:19,810
we serve. A-A, L-N-N, they meet there every week, three times a week actually, Sunday nights

1432
02:20:19,810 --> 02:20:27,770
and Thursday. I think that's important to know. Our clergy's busy performing baptisms.

1433
02:20:27,770 --> 02:20:37,810
we actually had just this past week of two babies baptized. Marriages still, their families

1434
02:20:37,810 --> 02:20:44,970
are getting married in churches and need a church. Yes, we do end a lot of services.

1435
02:20:45,390 --> 02:20:50,950
We're all going to die some time and churches are very important for that as well.

1436
02:20:54,140 --> 02:20:55,680
I'm not

1437
02:20:55,680 --> 02:21:02,020
public speaker. I've only come to visit you in 39 years, three times, and two of them have been

1438
02:21:02,020 --> 02:21:07,260
about the housing elements, about St. Francis. I hope you never have to come back, you know.

1439
02:21:07,900 --> 02:21:15,660
I hope you never have to talk to you about them. It really is a challenge. It took me a while to

1440
02:21:15,660 --> 02:21:18,460
even try to write down what I could tell you.

1441
02:21:20,480 --> 02:21:24,020
Thank you, you're a timeless. Thank you. Well, let's

1442
02:21:24,020 --> 02:21:26,220
You just say, okay, come and see.

1443
02:21:26,480 --> 02:21:28,400
We do so much more and there's more time.

1444
02:21:28,600 --> 02:21:29,920
I'd like you to come see us.

1445
02:21:30,480 --> 02:21:33,080
Come check us out before you even think about

1446
02:21:33,780 --> 02:21:34,820
putting St. Francis.

1447
02:21:35,760 --> 02:21:36,100
Thank you.

1448
02:21:42,740 --> 02:21:43,440
I am Tom.

1449
02:21:44,520 --> 02:21:45,440
I am Dan Gimellan.

1450
02:21:46,100 --> 02:21:48,040
I wasn't planning to come up and make any comments

1451
02:21:48,040 --> 02:21:49,620
or anything tonight but I felt compelled

1452
02:21:49,620 --> 02:21:51,940
and some of the things I'm going to say are actually repeat.

1453
02:21:52,600 --> 02:21:55,320
I think that you're in a really hard position.

1454
02:21:55,720 --> 02:21:56,920
The state has put this on you

1455
02:21:56,920 --> 02:21:59,540
And the first thing this is a comment section, it's all a comment.

1456
02:22:00,200 --> 02:22:03,940
If a politician says they're going to pass this law, and you vote for them, and then they

1457
02:22:03,940 --> 02:22:06,420
pass that law, and you go, oh my gosh, that's terrible law.

1458
02:22:06,820 --> 02:22:10,640
Maybe it's time to start thinking when you go to the ballot box, who the heck you're voting

1459
02:22:10,640 --> 02:22:12,120
for, and what they say they're going to do.

1460
02:22:12,540 --> 02:22:16,340
Because people are all surprised, like, oh, we're done with each other, oh, really?

1461
02:22:16,580 --> 02:22:16,940
Oh, wow.

1462
02:22:17,080 --> 02:22:18,400
You said he was going to do it, and they did it.

1463
02:22:18,540 --> 02:22:25,400
So that's my first comment, is our council, our city, is being forced to do this because

1464
02:22:25,400 --> 02:22:26,180
of sacramentum.

1465
02:22:26,180 --> 02:22:35,960
So be careful who you vote for, maybe there's other reasons you're thinking you're voting for this person, but when it gets down to the bottom line, you're voting for somebody that's going to affect your life, your house, your property.

1466
02:22:36,520 --> 02:22:43,800
We work hard, we play by the rules, we pay our taxes, we move into our houses, we build our houses, we remodel our houses, whatever it may be.

1467
02:22:44,340 --> 02:22:48,020
We'd say, oh, great. This is it. They come and say, we're going to diminish your property

1468
02:22:48,020 --> 02:22:51,360
vibes. You're going to force you to do these things. Even though you play by all the rules,

1469
02:22:51,880 --> 02:22:55,180
too bad, we're going to make new rules. We're going to move those goal posts. And I think

1470
02:22:55,180 --> 02:22:59,980
that's a terrible thing to do. On the other hand, for the comments, maybe one of the best

1471
02:22:59,980 --> 02:23:06,020
things we can do is 80 use. It's the most, maybe every bonus room, pool house, guest house,

1472
02:23:06,160 --> 02:23:09,840
we can say, hey, that could be an 80 you. That isn't 80 you. Maybe we can get a lot of that.

1473
02:23:09,940 --> 02:23:13,540
There's a lot of those houses in the PVE. So maybe we can knock off some of those

1474
02:23:13,540 --> 02:23:17,860
numbers quickly and easily with that. We have to also put in our objective standards,

1475
02:23:18,260 --> 02:23:22,220
make them as tough as possible so that anybody that is going to build anything has to

1476
02:23:22,220 --> 02:23:26,280
follow up so many rules, so many new infrastructure, they had to put it so we don't even have

1477
02:23:26,280 --> 02:23:30,320
storm grade on our street, you know, so our house is the storm grade for the entire block.

1478
02:23:31,660 --> 02:23:36,640
You're going to put more houses and none of these plans are in my particular neighborhood,

1479
02:23:36,880 --> 02:23:41,820
but everything that happens to PVE affects everybody in PVE, so even if it's not your house,

1480
02:23:41,820 --> 02:23:46,840
your school, your church, when it goes up, when it goes tight back, it's affecting all of us.

1481
02:23:47,140 --> 02:23:52,840
So let's look at any alternative we can to make it as tough as possible to build anything

1482
02:23:52,840 --> 02:23:57,360
in the future and to make it squeak by with whatever minimum we have to do to make a state

1483
02:23:57,360 --> 02:24:01,380
get off our backs right now. Thank you. It's

1484
02:24:12,490 --> 02:24:16,520
a work for you. I'd like to introduce myself. I'm

1485
02:24:16,520 --> 02:24:23,640
Stuart Kriley and I grew up here. I went into the school and if I'm going to be a devil's advocate

1486
02:24:23,640 --> 02:24:27,740
it is because I've worked for the devil. I was a planning commissioner for five years,

1487
02:24:28,160 --> 02:24:35,040
so I served with you and by you on the days of the self, and if you think this meeting

1488
02:24:35,040 --> 02:24:38,900
is running late, some of our meetings ran until 1.30 in the morning, so this is actually

1489
02:24:38,900 --> 02:24:41,240
your just hidden third name at this point.

1490
02:24:43,560 --> 02:24:46,400
I've also been a part of St. Francis since

1491
02:24:46,400 --> 02:24:47,500
I was six months old.

1492
02:24:49,770 --> 02:24:53,270
I was a senior athlete when our church was consecrated.

1493
02:24:55,500 --> 02:24:56,000
My children

1494
02:24:56,000 --> 02:24:59,520
and also service our collides. My wife serves an inquire.

1495
02:25:01,010 --> 02:25:09,730
I never thought I would be here today to explain my connection to St. Francis to you, but here we are. I

1496
02:25:12,610 --> 02:25:33,870
know the dilemma you're in. I want to sympathize. I know what it's like to make difficult choices involving people's homes and their pieces of business. In this present manner, there's very little that you can do. I know that Sacramento has taught your hands, but there are two very important things

1497
02:25:33,870 --> 02:25:38,630
important things that you should do and I will argue that you have failed to do.

1498
02:25:40,630 --> 02:25:48,570
One, you have failed to be timely. This freight train was long incoming. You have used

1499
02:25:48,570 --> 02:25:54,350
up so much time that you have now have days, not months, to get this housing element in.

1500
02:25:55,110 --> 02:25:59,950
You had an ad hoc committee that was trying to do this work. It was started and then abandoned.

1501
02:26:00,890 --> 02:26:04,710
The best solutions are no longer in the table because you've run out of time.

1502
02:26:06,570 --> 02:26:11,610
Now you have a messy series of public meetings where the people you rely on have not done

1503
02:26:11,610 --> 02:26:16,370
their homework, leaving you unprepared, and the public horrified.

1504
02:26:18,240 --> 02:26:19,960
Your consultants are unreliable.

1505
02:26:20,960 --> 02:26:26,060
They're creating staff reports that cut and paste from other work they're doing for other cities.

1506
02:26:27,600 --> 02:26:31,660
In your last meeting, someone prepared the staff report for you.

1507
02:26:31,740 --> 02:26:32,780
This is agenda 11.

1508
02:26:33,860 --> 02:26:35,120
Look on page two.

1509
02:26:36,800 --> 02:26:40,420
They're talking about the two sites, shirt sites that are under consideration.

1510
02:26:41,560 --> 02:26:46,020
The United Methodist Church and the First Church of Christ Scientist.

1511
02:26:46,560 --> 02:26:50,060
Last I checked, the United Methodist Church is enrolling hills.

1512
02:26:53,450 --> 02:26:54,730
Why do you tolerate this?

1513
02:26:54,730 --> 02:26:58,490
these people are working for you and if they're not as a planning commissioner,

1514
02:26:58,790 --> 02:27:03,310
I needed staff to help me understand the applications are before me.

1515
02:27:03,890 --> 02:27:07,250
But if they're just cutting and pasting and letting you hang out to drive,

1516
02:27:07,890 --> 02:27:10,670
you suffer and we do too with you.

1517
02:27:12,310 --> 02:27:15,830
Two, I would argue you've been failed to be honest dealers.

1518
02:27:17,050 --> 02:27:18,770
You have made churches a target.

1519
02:27:19,510 --> 02:27:22,210
I know a fall, well, why? They're easy targets.

1520
02:27:23,350 --> 02:27:24,930
They probably won't sell.

1521
02:27:25,490 --> 02:27:26,170
What's the harm?

1522
02:27:27,590 --> 02:27:29,630
It will appease the housing gods of Sacramento.

1523
02:27:30,190 --> 02:27:32,030
The neighbors won't object easy, right?

1524
02:27:34,240 --> 02:27:38,700
Instead of your manager and staff engaging with these churches, my church,

1525
02:27:39,040 --> 02:27:40,940
in your deliberations, honestly,

1526
02:27:41,600 --> 02:27:45,200
you have invited them to dinner only for us to find out where the main course.

1527
02:27:49,080 --> 02:27:53,240
It might actually make financial sense to slap an overlay zoning for these churches.

1528
02:27:53,440 --> 02:27:55,540
Hey, they will be coming out ahead if you might aren't you.

1529
02:27:55,540 --> 02:27:58,880
If it's such a good idea, why not do it in every church in the city?

1530
02:28:00,380 --> 02:28:02,280
As a child, I play some city.

1531
02:28:03,120 --> 02:28:03,720
What again?

1532
02:28:04,960 --> 02:28:07,720
Do you create power stations and airports and roads?

1533
02:28:08,620 --> 02:28:12,660
And then every once in a while, the big fat church would spawn right on a piece of

1534
02:28:12,660 --> 02:28:14,420
prime real estate, the city you were trying to build.

1535
02:28:15,740 --> 02:28:17,140
Do you know how annoying that was?

1536
02:28:18,560 --> 02:28:19,920
Well, you actually do.

1537
02:28:21,260 --> 02:28:22,480
Churches house no people.

1538
02:28:23,840 --> 02:28:27,040
They generate no business. They pay no taxes.

1539
02:28:29,420 --> 02:28:30,700
The difference is I'm not playing

1540
02:28:30,700 --> 02:28:33,080
soon city, but you are.

1541
02:28:44,090 --> 02:28:49,410
Do it out a question for you. You had stated that the best solutions aren't on the table.

1542
02:28:50,170 --> 02:28:53,370
What do you think we are overlooking?

1543
02:29:00,360 --> 02:29:02,100
It can be running for city council right now.

1544
02:29:04,120 --> 02:29:08,420
I'm sure all of us have an opinion what it is, and it's not my backyard, correct?

1545
02:29:09,080 --> 02:29:11,060
And so, they're just saying, hey, we try.

1546
02:29:11,880 --> 02:29:14,740
A really good idea, I would think,

1547
02:29:15,220 --> 02:29:17,980
is to take the commercial areas that we have.

1548
02:29:18,660 --> 02:29:21,620
We're on the ground floor, all the businesses are presently

1549
02:29:22,040 --> 02:29:23,660
and generate more traffic for them

1550
02:29:23,660 --> 02:29:25,480
by building housing above them.

1551
02:29:26,140 --> 02:29:28,040
Try and keep them whole so that the people

1552
02:29:28,040 --> 02:29:29,840
who own the leases don't go out of business

1553
02:29:29,840 --> 02:29:31,140
while you're doing the construction.

1554
02:29:31,780 --> 02:29:33,520
Try to do that three corner, build your shot

1555
02:29:33,520 --> 02:29:35,880
with the multi-owners and the landlords

1556
02:29:35,880 --> 02:29:40,820
that our absentee just collect collecting rent and set it by us then by saying look we'll buy you

1557
02:29:40,820 --> 02:29:45,220
out but we're going to have some sort of a bond to help them build those things so that we actually

1558
02:29:45,220 --> 02:29:50,260
have better businesses for the businesses that are there to increase density when we work it out that

1559
02:29:50,260 --> 02:29:55,620
way but I don't you're not going to get that done by February 11th and you'd have to really really

1560
02:29:55,620 --> 02:29:59,960
engage the neighborhood and get them engaged and saying yeah you know it would be nice

1561
02:30:00,000 --> 02:30:27,640
Let's have a couple more restaurants and make sure that there's not this revolving door. I share links also, very easy. I just hope it's still there. Is it going to be a business like the other five ones, like tallow shades and everything else? But that's going to take hard work. And I don't know if that's going to happen. And it's certainly not this point. We have looked at the other commercial areas. So just just to clarify that. But thank you. Thank

1562
02:30:33,340 --> 02:30:33,840
you.

1563
02:30:33,840 --> 02:30:41,480
Good evening. My name is Robin Panneau. I've been a member of St. Francis Episcopal Church since 1992, and I've lived in

1564
02:30:41,480 --> 02:30:49,560
Palsbury's estate since 1990, first in Almaty, and now in Mount Bay. At St. Francis, I served in many capacities over the years.

1565
02:30:50,180 --> 02:30:59,300
I currently have at the St. Francis, St. Teresa's Guild. I'm a long-time member of the St. Francis Outreach Scholarship Committee, and a regular helper for

1566
02:30:59,300 --> 02:31:03,220
We're St. Francis by monthly, homeless feeding activity in St. Louis and Long Beach.

1567
02:31:04,340 --> 02:31:09,040
Our St. Francis outreach scholarship fund health students of limited means with our unmet

1568
02:31:09,040 --> 02:31:11,380
college expenses and with mentoring.

1569
02:31:11,980 --> 02:31:13,820
We are celebrating 26 years.

1570
02:31:14,680 --> 02:31:22,320
In 2023, we dispersed over 18,000 to health students with tuition, laptops, and books.

1571
02:31:23,040 --> 02:31:25,500
We do a lot at St. Francis, we're very active.

1572
02:31:25,500 --> 02:31:29,860
Our St. Teresa's Guild is a group of women whose mission is to help women and children.

1573
02:31:30,420 --> 02:31:35,640
We support Mama Gills' Health, which is a watch-based after-school program and House of

1574
02:31:35,640 --> 02:31:36,820
Hope in San Pedro.

1575
02:31:37,780 --> 02:31:40,800
Our research of the community is an important mission in San Francisco.

1576
02:31:41,540 --> 02:31:46,500
In addition to what's done through our Guilds and Scholarship Committee, we are active partners

1577
02:31:46,500 --> 02:31:51,540
with St. Luke's Episcopal Church in Long Beach, Harbor Interfaith Services in Beacon House

1578
02:31:51,540 --> 02:31:56,500
San Pedro and Rotary's program to help the military families in Camp Pendleton.

1579
02:31:57,180 --> 02:32:03,360
We prepare food for the homeless, we collect food donations, we sort and distribute clothing

1580
02:32:03,360 --> 02:32:07,200
for vegan house, and we engage in a variety of the bond-going projects.

1581
02:32:07,880 --> 02:32:13,080
We use the facilities regularly in St. Francis in carrying out all these activities.

1582
02:32:14,020 --> 02:32:16,840
St. Francis is my spiritual home and my social home.

1583
02:32:16,840 --> 02:32:22,440
It's a very vibrant community, very active, and a great group of do-coters, if you will.

1584
02:32:23,080 --> 02:32:24,340
And I appreciate your time.

1585
02:32:25,140 --> 02:32:25,440
Thank you.

1586
02:32:32,540 --> 02:32:32,780
Hi.

1587
02:32:32,980 --> 02:32:33,180
Good evening.

1588
02:32:33,520 --> 02:32:34,880
My name is Jennifer Sam's.

1589
02:32:34,980 --> 02:32:37,200
Thank you very much for letting us speak here tonight.

1590
02:32:37,440 --> 02:32:42,720
It's a nice place to be able to come and speak and listen and share in a peaceful environment.

1591
02:32:43,760 --> 02:32:47,320
One of the places, of course, that you've heard about that's come up for a possible site

1592
02:32:47,320 --> 02:32:48,960
is St. Francis of this culture.

1593
02:32:48,960 --> 02:32:55,600
My family and I we live in Torrance, but St. Francis has become our spiritual home for over 25 years.

1594
02:32:56,320 --> 02:33:06,440
In fact, when we first started, I wasn't even a Piscopillian, it was just a very comfortable, friendly place, and I felt welcome in with them.

1595
02:33:07,080 --> 02:33:12,780
So our church is a very prominent piece of the South Bay community, I want to share a little bit of that.

1596
02:33:13,520 --> 02:33:15,960
Our church is being used every day and night.

1597
02:33:15,960 --> 02:33:20,880
our church hosts town and country preschool during the day. At night we hold a

1598
02:33:20,880 --> 02:33:24,840
meetings church services and other community meetings such as quilting

1599
02:33:24,840 --> 02:33:30,640
gills, pavilion dances, and fundraisers. As a church our members are very involved

1600
02:33:30,640 --> 02:33:35,580
in not only raising funds for our keep and our programs but also for outreach

1601
02:33:35,580 --> 02:33:40,400
within our church and community. The physical church women's group raises over

1602
02:33:40,400 --> 02:33:45,600
$25,000 a year and the majority of the money goes back into the community for

1603
02:33:45,600 --> 02:33:50,640
such things as Camp Stevens Scholarships for kids that can't afford camp, feeding the

1604
02:33:50,640 --> 02:33:55,740
homeless at St. Louis and scholarships for students outside of Palo Suri, shooting money

1605
02:33:55,740 --> 02:34:02,260
or other needs to be able to attend college. You might wonder where this money comes from.

1606
02:34:02,780 --> 02:34:07,820
Three of our huge fundraisers are an antique show, a rubbish sale, and an art and wine auction.

1607
02:34:08,700 --> 02:34:13,940
These events are visited by all walks of life here in the South Bay community. Some of you

1608
02:34:13,940 --> 02:34:15,780
might have even attended some of these things.

1609
02:34:16,420 --> 02:34:17,620
People come for the entertainment,

1610
02:34:18,080 --> 02:34:20,940
some come for meal, others might come for fellowship,

1611
02:34:21,620 --> 02:34:24,440
some might come for the need to buy clothes, furniture,

1612
02:34:24,840 --> 02:34:27,600
or housewares that they wouldn't normally be able to afford.

1613
02:34:28,400 --> 02:34:31,360
Not only are we providing this, but the money raised,

1614
02:34:31,480 --> 02:34:33,300
then leads to the huge amount of outreach

1615
02:34:33,300 --> 02:34:35,020
that we do through our women's groups.

1616
02:34:36,200 --> 02:34:39,020
May this church and the grounds continue to be here

1617
02:34:39,020 --> 02:34:41,200
for our spiritual needs as well as the needs

1618
02:34:41,200 --> 02:34:42,520
for everybody in our community.

1619
02:34:42,520 --> 02:34:45,420
thank you. Thank you.

1620
02:34:51,250 --> 02:34:59,290
Good evening. My name is Rocky Weber and first I want to thank you all for having a special meeting.

1621
02:35:00,750 --> 02:35:30,590
It's really cool. And thank everyone for coming. I mean, I couldn't get a parking spot. It was so crowded. And we're in the third hour. So, and it's raining. And it's raining. And I think it's, it's very cool that you're letting absolutely everyone express their opinions. So, my opinion. I, for 41 years, I've lived on Camp Seanna. It's a Christian.

1622
02:35:30,590 --> 02:35:37,330
science churches there. And earlier a woman who was tall, I lived on the other side, like

1623
02:35:37,330 --> 02:35:45,010
one street down, one street down. So I've seen that Camusine Road, it's cute, it's small,

1624
02:35:45,810 --> 02:35:52,570
the golf course traffic gets heavy there. And I know that's what you're looking at. There's a

1625
02:35:52,570 --> 02:35:57,930
really only about the anchor you're going to be able to get to the side of that church. And if you

1626
02:35:57,930 --> 02:36:03,030
If you stuff a lot of housing in here, that's just going to be a nightmare for that area.

1627
02:36:03,710 --> 02:36:05,250
And it's actually going to be unsafe.

1628
02:36:06,090 --> 02:36:15,570
I mean, they've put up, they used to have a stop sign here, that they put up, this has been taken there.

1629
02:36:16,450 --> 02:36:21,070
Now, so the safety issue there, I think, is more than you want to get into.

1630
02:36:21,670 --> 02:36:23,370
And it's just out of place.

1631
02:36:23,590 --> 02:36:27,290
I mean, there are only single family homes here.

1632
02:36:27,290 --> 02:36:30,570
So it really does, it will change the value.

1633
02:36:30,850 --> 02:36:32,950
Someone else is talking about the value of its housing.

1634
02:36:33,370 --> 02:36:34,150
They're all really expensive.

1635
02:36:34,530 --> 02:36:35,970
It definitely will change the value.

1636
02:36:37,090 --> 02:36:43,130
So that's my wish is that you take that area off your sites.

1637
02:36:44,190 --> 02:36:50,130
Now the second part is if the obvious place is the open space.

1638
02:36:50,850 --> 02:36:53,690
I mean, that's the, I mean, that's the elephant in the room.

1639
02:36:54,030 --> 02:36:55,410
That's the obvious place.

1640
02:36:55,410 --> 02:37:00,530
So if the zoning wasn't a problem, who would you guys,

1641
02:37:01,050 --> 02:37:04,010
like that spot, would you use that spot, send that spot in?

1642
02:37:04,670 --> 02:37:06,110
I'm thinking yes, right?

1643
02:37:07,210 --> 02:37:07,410
No.

1644
02:37:08,350 --> 02:37:11,130
If the zoning was okay, you wouldn't use those paint,

1645
02:37:11,290 --> 02:37:15,410
all those acres down by Malachiko where people play sports and all.

1646
02:37:16,350 --> 02:37:16,910
Okay.

1647
02:37:17,250 --> 02:37:18,450
That's a district property.

1648
02:37:19,530 --> 02:37:21,730
Well, it's in the city.

1649
02:37:21,730 --> 02:37:29,410
What I heard was, it was the open space we couldn't use because it was too hard to do.

1650
02:37:30,630 --> 02:37:36,950
And now, so what earlier said, you've been just taking two years, how we've kind of behind me,

1651
02:37:37,030 --> 02:37:42,870
but that didn't sound too right, too hard to do.

1652
02:37:44,810 --> 02:37:51,070
So maybe we should, I think maybe the gentleman behind me is going to know one of us.

1653
02:37:51,910 --> 02:37:58,750
I mean, we should open that up and see that is it really too hard to do.

1654
02:37:59,030 --> 02:38:00,110
I mean, it's possible, right?

1655
02:38:00,550 --> 02:38:04,010
You said you can change the open space and zoning can be changed.

1656
02:38:04,830 --> 02:38:07,370
So that would be my only recommendation.

1657
02:38:08,350 --> 02:38:12,090
If that was really, you should look into that before you start

1658
02:38:12,090 --> 02:38:15,470
We're going and getting all the other spots in your city.

1659
02:38:16,210 --> 02:38:17,230
Okay? Thank you.

1660
02:38:23,440 --> 02:38:27,280
Good evening. I think it's kind of ironic. It's a dark and stormy night.

1661
02:38:27,560 --> 02:38:32,380
As we're trying to tackle what is a very difficult tickle that you all have been put in.

1662
02:38:33,220 --> 02:38:37,780
I echo the statement of the gentleman that big crutches and that we are all in this together.

1663
02:38:37,780 --> 02:38:41,400
I also echo what the very tall woman said.

1664
02:38:41,400 --> 02:38:45,760
And I think we're adding this to the phrasing of an MV is not next to me.

1665
02:38:46,180 --> 02:38:48,320
You're going to be your players who didn't want it next to me.

1666
02:38:49,620 --> 02:38:51,500
But my name is Todd Salasca.

1667
02:38:51,700 --> 02:38:56,120
I've got four children that I'm raising here in Palsbury's estates, all four attended

1668
02:38:57,160 --> 02:39:01,500
the town and country preschool, under the stewardship of Miss Sharon and Miss Tony.

1669
02:39:01,960 --> 02:39:05,600
My wife attended some four years ago, though I would tell you as she looks 25.

1670
02:39:07,920 --> 02:39:12,480
We are here in support of St. Francis in Town and Country School.

1671
02:39:13,260 --> 02:39:15,600
You know, and I have the pleasure of serving on the Town and Country Board

1672
02:39:15,600 --> 02:39:19,080
with Ms. Sharon, Ms. Julie, overseeing day-to-day operations.

1673
02:39:19,780 --> 02:39:21,980
And as I said before, you all are really in a pickle.

1674
02:39:22,420 --> 02:39:25,300
And with respect to St. Francis and the Christian Science Church,

1675
02:39:26,020 --> 02:39:29,880
sites, you know, Josh presented legal reasons, Elizabeth presented environmental

1676
02:39:29,880 --> 02:39:31,120
and historic significance.

1677
02:39:31,660 --> 02:39:35,180
I think you've received an overall abundance of emotional reasons

1678
02:39:35,180 --> 02:39:40,040
why that is such a critical component of this community and Dick presented a reminder

1679
02:39:40,040 --> 02:39:45,620
for why St. Francis was removed in the first place. All of this tends to focus on not

1680
02:39:45,620 --> 02:39:54,220
next to me. And in my opinion, my limited experience, a compromise is leaving both sides equally

1681
02:39:54,220 --> 02:39:58,840
unhappy or equally pleased depending on which side of the coin you're looking at it from.

1682
02:39:59,600 --> 02:39:59,980
What are you doing?

1683
02:40:00,000 --> 02:40:12,600
I think has been missing in this pursuit has been clarifications around timing. What is the actual timing that we need to get a conforming housing element in? I would appreciate a direct answer.

1684
02:40:14,740 --> 02:40:29,600
Exactly. And here we are catching up for lost time. The gentleman that was just up here saying we're trying to make up for lost time. Second element, collaboration. We have a committee of ready willing and able, very intelligent

1685
02:40:29,600 --> 02:40:31,420
and people working within our community

1686
02:40:31,420 --> 02:40:33,700
that I think have been underutilized.

1687
02:40:34,040 --> 02:40:36,380
You, City Council are volunteering your time.

1688
02:40:36,840 --> 02:40:38,680
I know you're not developers by background,

1689
02:40:38,960 --> 02:40:40,380
real estate experts by background.

1690
02:40:40,780 --> 02:40:42,320
We have a lot of those in the community

1691
02:40:42,320 --> 02:40:44,080
that I think have been underutilized.

1692
02:40:44,560 --> 02:40:47,400
Finally, a plan, a plan going forward.

1693
02:40:47,600 --> 02:40:50,440
To me, we have a vision of, we wanna conforming plan,

1694
02:40:51,060 --> 02:40:54,500
but a vision without a step-by-step plan is just a dream.

1695
02:40:54,980 --> 02:40:56,560
And thus far, I don't think we've been able

1696
02:40:56,560 --> 02:40:57,660
to achieve that dream

1697
02:40:57,660 --> 02:41:02,580
And because we haven't had open communication with the community for many in the community

1698
02:41:02,580 --> 02:41:08,300
it's been a kind of gotcha as different sites were put onto the housing element as potential

1699
02:41:08,300 --> 02:41:08,800
candidates.

1700
02:41:09,320 --> 02:41:14,080
I would strongly encourage you tonight, knowing that we're two years behind someone's

1701
02:41:14,080 --> 02:41:19,580
at February 11th as a deadline, how can we engage this community, create a committee which

1702
02:41:19,580 --> 02:41:24,580
was discussed at the PV Country Club, getting a committee of ready willing and able people

1703
02:41:24,580 --> 02:41:30,020
in our community to help provide professional advice because I agree that the consultation

1704
02:41:30,020 --> 02:41:35,980
that the committee has been provided thus far is insufficient and is not going to allow us to

1705
02:41:35,980 --> 02:41:42,080
address the housing element in a timely manner with sites that would actually work. There are land

1706
02:41:42,080 --> 02:41:47,120
mines, there are things we can do with how we present it to the city or to the state that provide us

1707
02:41:47,120 --> 02:41:52,840
the ability to essentially protect ourselves, getting an approved housing element without putting

1708
02:41:52,840 --> 02:41:58,120
properties at risk like town and country, like the Christian Sciences Church. So please leverage

1709
02:41:58,120 --> 02:42:01,140
the community and thank you for your service. Thank you.

1710
02:42:05,760 --> 02:42:07,940
I do want to address one of the comments.

1711
02:42:08,440 --> 02:42:13,960
We've submitted and talked to HCD over the last two years and received comments back and they just

1712
02:42:13,960 --> 02:42:20,960
have an approach. So it's not that staff or council has been, you know, to relate our fingers, you know,

1713
02:42:21,140 --> 02:42:25,580
we've been actively working on this and we've had a number of public meetings over the last two

1714
02:42:25,580 --> 02:42:32,000
plus years to try to try and do this I do more than two years. So, sir.

1715
02:42:32,700 --> 02:42:36,360
Good evening. My name is James Dawes and I don't want to be able to sell that.

1716
02:42:37,900 --> 02:42:43,580
You know, I'm continually struck when I come to these meetings about the fact that

1717
02:42:43,580 --> 02:42:48,700
you know, people here in my opinion understand the problem, they understand this

1718
02:42:48,700 --> 02:42:53,540
getting crammed on everybody's throat. They understand it's a tremendous problem.

1719
02:42:53,540 --> 02:42:57,740
In fact, I'd say you can probably be the biggest problem that exists for most of the

1720
02:42:57,740 --> 02:42:59,220
residents here in Baltimore today.

1721
02:43:00,380 --> 02:43:07,720
But I think they also sorely lack information, and I don't know why there is not some

1722
02:43:08,400 --> 02:43:14,640
place that they can go look on some website somewhere that says, hey, look, here's why we

1723
02:43:14,640 --> 02:43:21,400
have 80 ADUs in our submission, here's why it's not 100, here's why it's not 50, here's

1724
02:43:21,400 --> 02:43:28,860
is 80, okay? Here's what design element really means. We can really hold people's feet

1725
02:43:28,860 --> 02:43:35,740
to the fire, or maybe we can't, but we'd like to try. You know, let people understand

1726
02:43:35,740 --> 02:43:41,320
exactly where things stand, what is builders' revenue? You know, even though somebody

1727
02:43:41,320 --> 02:43:46,040
talked about it here, you ask people out here, if they can explain what that really means,

1728
02:43:46,040 --> 02:43:53,640
I mean, people, you think, no, that, you know, I did very few and the same with, you know,

1729
02:43:53,800 --> 02:44:00,240
almost everything is discussed is, okay, you started out with this big funnel, here's

1730
02:44:00,240 --> 02:44:04,860
the possible response, you narrowed it down, why did you narrow it down the way you did?

1731
02:44:05,360 --> 02:44:11,560
Just write it down, let people know so if they disagree, they can come and say, hey, I disagree

1732
02:44:11,560 --> 02:44:17,000
agree with you, I want you to hear my opinion and consider their opinion.

1733
02:44:17,640 --> 02:44:22,660
At the end of the day, we might go with what you just selected, but let people understand.

1734
02:44:23,100 --> 02:44:24,660
This is why we're doing things.

1735
02:44:24,980 --> 02:44:25,880
This is our plan.

1736
02:44:26,240 --> 02:44:27,980
This is our strategy moving forward.

1737
02:44:28,380 --> 02:44:33,200
All these other legal processes that were people who supposedly took on the state and lost,

1738
02:44:34,060 --> 02:44:35,760
put it down and right, it's people who understand.

1739
02:44:35,760 --> 02:44:42,740
These can be fought the state on these issues. They all lost. It was all unanimous or it wasn't

1740
02:44:43,380 --> 02:44:49,940
Give people information so they know. Okay, we have to where we're doing everything we possibly can

1741
02:44:49,940 --> 02:44:56,200
Even as far as assessments let people know hey, we can assess everybody a thousand bucks two thousand bucks

1742
02:44:56,200 --> 02:44:59,960
If you're in let us know you're in we'll put that

1743
02:45:00,000 --> 02:45:29,980
That on the table. You know, I think that people just want to understand what is going on, why it's going on, what the plan is going forward, so they have that information, so they at least get some peace of mind. I may not like this, but I understand why it is happening. And I really, I really think a lot of people would benefit greatly from that. And I also think that when you run these meetings, these need to be informational, informative, and not sort of a meeting where

1744
02:45:29,980 --> 02:45:34,400
you guys don't even know the answers to things. Michael asked a question earlier

1745
02:45:34,400 --> 02:45:39,900
at the very beginning and he probably heard me shout back there about what you

1746
02:45:39,900 --> 02:45:45,620
know it's because to me these should be like an attorney. An attorney asks questions

1747
02:45:45,620 --> 02:45:50,700
that he knows what the answer is going to be if he's a good attorney. He is prepared

1748
02:45:50,700 --> 02:45:55,820
the witnesses prepared that's how you educate people and I think that's why people

1749
02:45:55,820 --> 02:46:00,240
come here is to get educated, get informed and not leave here with a bunch of

1750
02:46:00,240 --> 02:46:03,740
questions like, I don't know what's going on, I don't know what they're doing, I don't

1751
02:46:03,740 --> 02:46:06,520
know why they're doing it, it doesn't make sense. Thank you.

1752
02:46:18,180 --> 02:46:25,540
Good evening. I've seen you before. I'm Deborah Goplin. I've lived here since 1962

1753
02:46:25,540 --> 02:46:32,060
so I've seen a lot of changes over the years. I'm also a company manager for

1754
02:46:32,060 --> 02:46:36,620
several commercial buildings in the United States, including the Paddy and Field.

1755
02:46:37,100 --> 02:46:43,300
I know most of the testimony are questions. Tonight have been about St. Francis Church.

1756
02:46:45,440 --> 02:46:50,080
I'm a member of the G.A. Garden. They have their meetings at St. Francis Church.

1757
02:46:50,280 --> 02:46:58,060
That's how I got to know the campus and it's a beautiful campus and work pretty serving me.

1758
02:46:58,940 --> 02:47:02,220
My question is, I have more questions than anything.

1759
02:47:03,660 --> 02:47:08,480
It seems like the common thread of the choices that they have been

1760
02:47:08,480 --> 02:47:18,680
are up for on list are buildings that you know are not going to sell.

1761
02:47:19,400 --> 02:47:21,720
They've all said that you know what that is.

1762
02:47:22,320 --> 02:47:24,720
And this is the same thing with the patio building.

1763
02:47:24,960 --> 02:47:26,680
The owners don't mind itself.

1764
02:47:26,680 --> 02:47:34,840
So I'm wondering if these buildings are like the sacrificial land, you know, this is what

1765
02:47:34,840 --> 02:47:43,360
you can come up with to satisfy the requirement and that's how it is.

1766
02:47:44,260 --> 02:47:55,160
My question is, if you submit these buildings now, can we have a better measure to perhaps

1767
02:47:55,160 --> 02:48:00,560
on a open space that we qualify for this housing.

1768
02:48:02,020 --> 02:48:05,540
And our work is this list locked again.

1769
02:48:06,460 --> 02:48:10,280
And then you can't change your maybe come back later

1770
02:48:10,280 --> 02:48:11,920
and say, well, we have open spaces.

1771
02:48:11,960 --> 02:48:16,440
It's been voted into, you know, to meet these requirements.

1772
02:48:16,760 --> 02:48:17,760
Can that be changed?

1773
02:48:18,380 --> 02:48:20,160
So that's simply my question.

1774
02:48:20,280 --> 02:48:23,260
Or can something be annexed, you know,

1775
02:48:23,260 --> 02:48:30,760
like Woodford Hill. I don't know if that seems to be staying for a while. Maybe there's some kind of

1776
02:48:30,760 --> 02:48:39,040
arrangement between Torrance and PDE that you can satisfy the requirement that you need but that was some kind of change.

1777
02:48:39,260 --> 02:48:44,520
I'm not a lawyer so I can't answer any of this but there are just questions. Thank you. Thank you.

1778
02:48:49,750 --> 02:49:01,830
My name is Ed Whitmore, I'm a 30-year-plus president of the House of the United States, and I wanted to address the issue of the ADUs as our option to solve this problem.

1779
02:49:02,450 --> 02:49:13,350
We've come to a number of ADUs. How do we arrive at that number? Is that the maximum number that we can have as a part of this process?

1780
02:49:13,350 --> 02:49:17,550
So, I guess I'll put that question in terms of its whole.

1781
02:49:22,700 --> 02:49:33,800
Okay. So, the state has cities looked back at the last eight years, and of course,

1782
02:49:34,100 --> 02:49:41,680
eight years haven't been around for the last eight years. So, starting from 2018 through 2021,

1783
02:49:41,680 --> 02:49:50,940
the city provides the yearly permits and approvals for ADUs and that sets the

1784
02:49:50,940 --> 02:49:59,900
precedent for how many ADUs the city is expected to approve and permit.

1785
02:50:00,000 --> 02:50:11,900
And the following eight years. So we were able to demonstrate that was an average of 10 per year by counting up all the

1786
02:50:11,900 --> 02:50:21,500
have been permitted so far because we had to negotiate and say instead of stopping at 2021 can we

1787
02:50:21,500 --> 02:50:29,740
go through now and HCP said yes and then we also projected for the remaining year because this

1788
02:50:29,740 --> 02:50:40,700
was preliminarily approved in mid 2023 so we projected forward for the remaining of 2023 and we

1789
02:50:40,700 --> 02:50:49,600
We also made a statement that said the city just adopted a new ADU ordinance that came

1790
02:50:49,600 --> 02:50:54,340
into compliance and made more information readily available.

1791
02:50:55,140 --> 02:51:02,320
Therefore, we project that more ADUs will be permitted in the next eight-year cycle.

1792
02:51:02,860 --> 02:51:06,620
So therefore, it's one of the things you're probably going to do.

1793
02:51:06,620 --> 02:51:09,840
The City of Rolling Hills solved this problem.

1794
02:51:09,960 --> 02:51:10,940
It's absolutely true.

1795
02:51:11,180 --> 02:51:12,060
It's written record.

1796
02:51:12,620 --> 02:51:15,540
It's solved with this problem through ADU's only.

1797
02:51:16,120 --> 02:51:18,440
I'll guarantee you, there wasn't one ADU built

1798
02:51:18,440 --> 02:51:19,520
in Rolling Hills.

1799
02:51:19,900 --> 02:51:23,800
So they were all on the school houses and everything else.

1800
02:51:24,740 --> 02:51:29,420
So why are we so beholden to this when the City

1801
02:51:29,420 --> 02:51:35,280
were next door, solved their entire problem through ADU's.

1802
02:51:35,280 --> 02:51:43,580
This is basically saying existing barns, existing pool houses will be recategorized as 80 years.

1803
02:51:45,040 --> 02:51:52,580
And here we are, saying we're only allowed to have any age use because we actually hold so many permits for a year.

1804
02:51:54,600 --> 02:51:56,600
Thank you for your patience for being here.

1805
02:51:56,900 --> 02:51:58,100
I really appreciate that.

1806
02:51:59,280 --> 02:52:00,120
In Rolling Hill.

1807
02:52:07,640 --> 02:52:16,480
I will try. Can you hear me now? Okay. In Rolling Hills, we did two cycles of housing

1808
02:52:16,480 --> 02:52:21,940
element, and I think that Syria referring to the most recent cycles, which is what

1809
02:52:21,940 --> 02:52:29,920
we're on. But I think what's not really shared in the general public is that in order to

1810
02:52:29,920 --> 02:52:32,620
He was a probably housing stock rolling hills.

1811
02:52:33,000 --> 02:52:37,260
Rolling hills had to rezone a property in Rolling Hills.

1812
02:52:37,940 --> 02:52:41,740
For I want to say, I forget, I think 18 units.

1813
02:52:43,000 --> 02:52:45,460
Everyone's rene as different, so it's relative.

1814
02:52:46,100 --> 02:52:50,560
So Rancho del Mar High School, or the site,

1815
02:52:51,060 --> 02:52:53,900
or the next to John Fisher, some people

1816
02:52:53,900 --> 02:52:55,180
mentioned that that's their church.

1817
02:52:55,820 --> 02:52:57,840
It's that site in which it was rezone.

1818
02:52:57,840 --> 02:53:09,180
And following that, ACD was then able to recognize with that reason of that copy that the rest of the housing stock can be filled with ACD.

1819
02:53:09,920 --> 02:53:13,720
Okay. So, okay, very much.

1820
02:53:13,980 --> 02:53:17,400
Rancho del Mar has been identified as some sort of a site.

1821
02:53:18,180 --> 02:53:23,360
So, you know, a lot of people here are upset about their Christian signs to church site,

1822
02:53:23,640 --> 02:53:28,440
and rightly so, it's going to be, you know, 100 plus units on that one specific site.

1823
02:53:29,220 --> 02:53:31,100
Thank God I don't live next to that site.

1824
02:53:32,380 --> 02:53:41,280
But is there a way still to increase the number of aid units so that we can do something

1825
02:53:41,280 --> 02:53:47,100
similar in that one kind of identify smaller sites where the impact would be far less significant

1826
02:53:47,520 --> 02:53:57,280
both traffic, potential crime, whatever the other issues may be and minimize having a site

1827
02:53:57,280 --> 02:54:06,140
I've been Christian and science church with well over 100 units and then we have one side of the man on a baby 17 one side of the 17 and

1828
02:54:06,760 --> 02:54:13,240
Potentially we have two smaller sites like that with a hundred and twenty five eighty-two. So they were to justify that

1829
02:54:14,860 --> 02:54:16,200
It was hard enough

1830
02:54:17,040 --> 02:54:25,520
For us to convince HCD to accept 80 we're saying ten eighty here. They're zero and

1831
02:54:25,520 --> 02:54:32,260
and 2018, that there is very minimal in the city but in recent months.

1832
02:54:32,340 --> 02:54:38,640
So, if you went back to what I believe to be the Royne Hills stop process, which is bring

1833
02:54:38,640 --> 02:54:44,080
us your farms, bring us your pool houses, any other secondary structure, and we will give

1834
02:54:44,080 --> 02:54:50,080
you a permit for an ADU. I'm sure there are plenty of people in the previous days with

1835
02:54:50,080 --> 02:54:53,480
of the secondary structure at Grant Brothers Unit at Koolhouse.

1836
02:54:53,820 --> 02:54:59,780
Bring them in, we'll give you a permit as an ADU, we can count those.

1837
02:55:00,020 --> 02:55:01,000
Is there any way to do that?

1838
02:55:03,340 --> 02:55:31,340
I'll take that one. Yes, it's possible. What HCDs are relying on historical data to demonstrate to them that EDU is the right way to go in adding housing stock, you know, community, but based on historical data. So I think at the onset of rolling houses were sued. We didn't have much data, but we did tell them the number of applications that were in the works. And so they took that as real good data to say,

1839
02:55:31,340 --> 02:55:38,860
Okay, well, we believe you, but you got to remember that the rena number is significantly smaller than the rena numbers here

1840
02:55:38,860 --> 02:55:45,680
And so there is a possible way in which if the community demonstrates that we have data to back it up

1841
02:55:45,680 --> 02:55:47,920
That somehow mid cycle

1842
02:55:48,580 --> 02:55:51,340
Following the end of the cycle the beginning of the next

1843
02:55:52,140 --> 02:55:54,120
Housing element because isn't going to go away

1844
02:55:54,740 --> 02:56:00,780
That we can convince ACD that a use is the housing stock that's most suitable for the need

1845
02:56:00,780 --> 02:56:09,000
That is possible, but don't you think if you educated the community that is one potential avenue you would have a lot of you to get the microprime?

1846
02:56:09,460 --> 02:56:14,080
Yeah, okay, thank you.

1847
02:56:21,100 --> 02:56:31,560
Good evening, my name is Daniel Income. I've been here about close to 70 years. I'm a artist on a good day.

1848
02:56:32,680 --> 02:56:39,040
I'm not so good day, I'm not, but I wanted to speak, I wasn't planning to speak, but

1849
02:56:39,040 --> 02:56:44,280
I wanted to say a few things about both churches and the school.

1850
02:56:45,520 --> 02:56:49,300
Years ago I had, in my studio, I had a collector combined.

1851
02:56:49,620 --> 02:56:57,620
He was Vice President of UNI Count, and he came up the steps and he said, hi, Dan, it's

1852
02:56:57,620 --> 02:56:58,420
great to meet you.

1853
02:56:58,600 --> 02:57:00,160
I heard you were a great investment.

1854
02:57:00,820 --> 02:57:08,760
and I thought, wait a minute, you know, he didn't strike me favorably right from the

1855
02:57:08,760 --> 02:57:13,380
window. And so he came in and he looked at the artwork and he looked at the paintings

1856
02:57:13,380 --> 02:57:20,800
and I waited for a response and he looked at me, you know, was favorable and I said, you

1857
02:57:20,800 --> 02:57:29,280
know, we'll say Bob, I said, Bob, you know, you're a great businessman and a leader. I said,

1858
02:57:29,280 --> 02:57:36,580
And he said, let me ask you, what do you think of great investments in life?

1859
02:57:37,460 --> 02:57:48,480
And he said, oh, well, let me think of property, goal, stocks, he gave me all the answers.

1860
02:57:49,180 --> 02:57:51,960
And I said, boy, those are great.

1861
02:57:51,960 --> 02:58:00,180
But, you know, I really think the greatest investment in any of us here in Maine, in the community, is in our soul.

1862
02:58:01,400 --> 02:58:08,780
And so I said, I think our soul is the greatest investment because we have it forever.

1863
02:58:09,540 --> 02:58:16,260
And so I'm concerned when we talk about closing the churches, closing the schools.

1864
02:58:16,260 --> 02:58:25,440
We are shooting ourselves in the foot as a community because if our community doesn't retain its soul and it's spirit, it'll be a debt community.

1865
02:58:26,420 --> 02:58:29,880
And so I'm sorry you have to go through this with Sacramento.

1866
02:58:30,520 --> 02:58:35,520
I know none of us want to deal with it, but at some point we probably have to take a stand.

1867
02:58:36,380 --> 02:58:37,500
Thank you.

1868
02:58:38,000 --> 02:58:38,480
Thank you.

1869
02:58:38,480 --> 02:58:39,180
I

1870
02:58:42,130 --> 02:58:44,130
promise I will be really quick, really quick.

1871
02:58:44,370 --> 02:58:47,110
Four kids went to town in country, Olympic graduates,

1872
02:58:47,830 --> 02:58:50,470
excellent school, excellent staff, excellent teachers.

1873
02:58:50,990 --> 02:58:51,630
Excellent location.

1874
02:58:53,410 --> 02:58:55,710
We asked you to take us off your list,

1875
02:58:56,210 --> 02:58:58,510
but I know that you are in a hard place.

1876
02:58:59,070 --> 02:59:02,030
It's a you problem, it's a me problem, it's a us problem.

1877
02:59:02,450 --> 02:59:05,430
What you need to do is give us more information.

1878
02:59:06,130 --> 02:59:08,210
The community is in the dark.

1879
02:59:08,210 --> 02:59:15,450
please, as a, as, you know, PBS states, give us as much information as you can.

1880
02:59:15,850 --> 02:59:19,070
It's not going to wait, like the manager said, every eight years is a cycle.

1881
02:59:19,930 --> 02:59:25,070
Let's break that cycle, give us the information so we can vote properly, get

1882
02:59:25,070 --> 02:59:29,970
some of these guys out, get someone in who's gonna, that's so it's not this eight

1883
02:59:29,970 --> 02:59:35,190
years six-year cycle. We need to break this cycle, give us the information, give us

1884
02:59:35,190 --> 02:59:39,550
candidates who are going to vote against us. Give us anything. Let's move forward, but

1885
02:59:39,550 --> 02:59:47,050
tackle it now so we can get rid of it and tackle Sacramento. Thank you.

1886
02:59:47,370 --> 02:59:47,650
Thank you.

1887
02:59:58,020 --> 02:59:59,440
Council.

1888
03:00:00,000 --> 03:00:07,780
Staff. My name is John Connelly. I am one of the owners, one of the partners of the round of

1889
03:00:07,780 --> 03:00:14,780
a building and I also have an interest in the melodic over building. So when the gentleman spoke

1890
03:00:14,780 --> 03:00:20,920
earlier about being fair and equitable about naming the properties, I'm all for that.

1891
03:00:21,020 --> 03:00:25,760
This would be fair and equitable because I have interest in two of the three properties

1892
03:00:25,760 --> 03:00:27,060
that were named.

1893
03:00:29,660 --> 03:00:34,200
And I feel that, you know, like the gentleman went down the list and said,

1894
03:00:34,460 --> 03:00:40,280
you know, this is required, this is required, this is required. And the shot down each one,

1895
03:00:40,400 --> 03:00:46,140
we could do the same thing for both buildings that we had, that were blue, not a bay and the

1896
03:00:46,140 --> 03:00:55,620
malaga coat. The choices were made on the information that isn't true. And I want to invite you all

1897
03:00:55,620 --> 03:01:02,440
to come over and try our new elevator to live on a bay building. Look at the patio, we've

1898
03:01:02,440 --> 03:01:07,620
built a lot of money into both buildings over the last couple of years, a lot. Come on by,

1899
03:01:07,800 --> 03:01:15,580
check them out. And the owners have provided space for work and community services for years,

1900
03:01:15,880 --> 03:01:22,520
years. And we want to keep doing that. You know, we're the heirs of the original builders and they

1901
03:01:22,520 --> 03:01:28,160
I had a dream to provide these buildings and this space for this community to have.

1902
03:01:28,440 --> 03:01:29,740
We'd like to keep it that way.

1903
03:01:38,870 --> 03:01:43,910
I ask you to give us a break, take us off the list, everybody wants to say that.

1904
03:01:45,450 --> 03:01:48,930
But we believe that we're trying to be a good part of this community.

1905
03:01:49,650 --> 03:01:56,710
And I also want to say I've never been to St. Francis before, but I want to go to school there now.

1906
03:01:57,450 --> 03:02:12,310
I would like to support St. Francis and people who are really putting it out there for them and that's a great thing, but as long as we're talking about community, you know, we are part of this community too, we want to stay that way.

1907
03:02:13,090 --> 03:02:26,690
And also I spent a lot of time over the last two days in the HCD website, and they do an awful lot of talking about supporting local governments and all these programs and all these things are going to happen.

1908
03:02:26,690 --> 03:02:32,990
to do for local governments. I don't know where it is or what it is, but I hope I hope they

1909
03:02:32,990 --> 03:02:38,990
can help you out or we're mining all the resources that they're saying they have. Thank you.

1910
03:02:39,330 --> 03:02:40,510
Thank you. I

1911
03:02:46,020 --> 03:02:51,880
live at the corner of Via Camposina and the San Diego Campo, which means directly across

1912
03:02:51,880 --> 03:02:56,880
the driveway to the Christian scientist church. I wasn't planning on saying anything I can say

1913
03:02:56,880 --> 03:03:01,260
that comes nice just to listen because the reason I'm up here is because I just found out about this

1914
03:03:01,260 --> 03:03:06,380
five days ago because someone put a letter in my mailbox informing me in this meeting.

1915
03:03:07,140 --> 03:03:10,740
I went to two my neighbors next door to tell them they had not heard about it either.

1916
03:03:11,000 --> 03:03:15,040
So my complaint is the lack of information that's coming out to the community.

1917
03:03:15,620 --> 03:03:20,200
I think for something this important, it would have been nice to have gotten, you know,

1918
03:03:20,520 --> 03:03:25,980
mailings, paper mailings, not emails, because I was not connected to the email system.

1919
03:03:25,980 --> 03:03:35,740
So, you know, I think it would have been nice and appropriate for all members of the community to be informed of what was going on, you know, for months, years.

1920
03:03:35,980 --> 03:03:37,860
This is the first I've heard of it several days ago.

1921
03:03:38,320 --> 03:03:40,080
I brought this property three years ago.

1922
03:03:40,420 --> 03:03:44,060
We have plans to renovate and remodel.

1923
03:03:44,220 --> 03:03:48,300
And at this point, I'm honestly thinking, is that really how I want to spend my money or should we be selling?

1924
03:03:48,480 --> 03:03:50,960
Because I don't know what the future holds.

1925
03:03:50,960 --> 03:03:58,280
So I just wanted to say that I appreciate, you know, some better communication if that's possible in the future, so thank you.

1926
03:03:58,740 --> 03:03:59,480
Thank you.

1927
03:04:00,020 --> 03:04:00,400
Good

1928
03:04:05,390 --> 03:04:05,570
evening.

1929
03:04:06,470 --> 03:04:10,210
My name is Tim Schaefer and I'm the representative of the Christian Science Church.

1930
03:04:11,570 --> 03:04:17,290
Our church previously expressed opposition to the housing element because we're not going anywhere.

1931
03:04:17,810 --> 03:04:17,970
They're

1932
03:04:20,110 --> 03:04:22,430
firmly committed to staying in our current location.

1933
03:04:22,430 --> 03:04:26,950
We love this city, we love our neighbors, and we love our property.

1934
03:04:28,110 --> 03:04:35,550
That being said, we were concerned about whether there was going to be an eminent domain situation.

1935
03:04:36,190 --> 03:04:41,030
And so we consulted a land use attorney who advised us that resounding the property

1936
03:04:41,030 --> 03:04:46,490
would not negatively impact our church's ability to continue our property.

1937
03:04:48,320 --> 03:04:54,940
So knowing that the city is in a tight spot, we are not as strongly opposed to being on the list as we were before.

1938
03:04:55,500 --> 03:04:59,860
We have no plans of selling, no plans of going anywhere. We want to be helpful.

1939
03:05:00,000 --> 03:05:18,240
We are going to move to our community and if we're zoning our property is a way to protect the city from the builder's remedy and it allows our church to continue as we are. We can look at that. Thank you.

1940
03:05:35,150 --> 03:05:40,270
isn't this wonderful two and a half hours we've been hearing all of the accolades and

1941
03:05:40,270 --> 03:05:45,830
great obscenities and now fantastic guys are you guys are in the dilemma oh my gosh

1942
03:05:45,830 --> 03:05:53,930
Secretary no who needs this well we did we have to come together and figure out a way

1943
03:05:53,930 --> 03:06:03,030
to resolve this issue is going to affect all of us I'm a resident of pve for 50 years

1944
03:06:03,030 --> 03:06:11,590
plus. 39 of those years, my lovely bride, Ms. Harriet, has been a teacher at a

1945
03:06:11,590 --> 03:06:17,290
town and country school. She's educated many of the folks around here. I said

1946
03:06:17,290 --> 03:06:24,850
let's use a short hand. How many folks either went to school or educating their

1947
03:06:24,850 --> 03:06:31,990
children there? The majority of the folks in the house raise their hands. You guys

1948
03:06:31,990 --> 03:06:40,390
have a challenge in front of you. I'm here to advocate to take St. Francis Church and

1949
03:06:40,390 --> 03:06:47,270
tell him country school off to list. I mean come on. You want to go against the

1950
03:06:47,270 --> 03:06:56,340
church and the school? Good luck with that. Thank you very much okay so I'm gonna

1951
03:06:56,340 --> 03:07:02,240
go ahead and close the public comment and I'm gonna take a five minute break so

1952
03:07:02,240 --> 03:07:06,760
We'll be back here at 10 minutes, right?

1953
03:07:06,840 --> 03:07:07,960
We'll be back at 9.15.

1954
03:22:04,530 --> 03:22:29,550
Thank you for listening to each other and being respectful. There are a couple before we launch into council deliberations, and we're just a couple of things that were brought up by the various speakers that I wanted to touch upon. I think we answered the question around. Have we really maxed out the potential around ADUs, at least in terms of, to the extent that staff has worked with HCD.

1955
03:22:29,550 --> 03:22:36,710
trying to get that number as high as they can to date. The other thing I wanted to touch

1956
03:22:36,710 --> 03:22:42,370
upon, we also talked about the comments around lost time when you guys have been doing for

1957
03:22:42,370 --> 03:22:43,350
the last couple of years.

1958
03:22:46,380 --> 03:22:50,700
One of the things that we talked about at our January 23rd meeting

1959
03:22:50,700 --> 03:22:58,620
and it didn't dawn on me until Mr. Criley made the comment and that it wasn't in today's

1960
03:22:58,620 --> 03:23:05,260
presentation was, when we talk about all the sites that staff and council has

1961
03:23:05,260 --> 03:23:11,400
looked at, one of the areas that we didn't touch upon tonight was a number of

1962
03:23:11,400 --> 03:23:19,740
the commercial areas in La Nota Bay as well as Malaga, COVID, what we found was

1963
03:23:19,740 --> 03:23:26,680
that they were so fragmented in terms of the number of owners and the size of the

1964
03:23:26,680 --> 03:23:34,400
lots that they didn't represent reasonable options.

1965
03:23:35,480 --> 03:23:38,140
And that's how the discussion had to be somewhat not

1966
03:23:38,140 --> 03:23:40,880
to be shifted over to the patio building site.

1967
03:23:41,080 --> 03:23:43,320
I did want to make sure people realized

1968
03:23:43,320 --> 03:23:45,660
that we did in deep look at those sites,

1969
03:23:46,220 --> 03:23:48,620
especially from a mixed use overlay standpoint.

1970
03:23:49,720 --> 03:23:52,260
The other comment I just wanted to make was around

1971
03:23:54,610 --> 03:23:57,520
what low income means.

1972
03:23:57,520 --> 03:24:01,220
and it carries, for some, a connotation.

1973
03:24:01,680 --> 03:24:05,120
Low income housing can be senior housing.

1974
03:24:06,320 --> 03:24:08,400
It can be disabled and adult housing.

1975
03:24:09,220 --> 03:24:11,340
It can be teacher, new teacher housing,

1976
03:24:11,800 --> 03:24:12,960
new police officer housing.

1977
03:24:13,700 --> 03:24:19,720
All of those professions or life situations

1978
03:24:19,720 --> 03:24:21,760
that seniors aren't a profession,

1979
03:24:22,340 --> 03:24:26,440
they all qualify under the income requirements.

1980
03:24:27,280 --> 03:24:44,980
So I just want to keep that out there, that there is an opportunity to better serve our own residents, our own residents that are seniors, our own residents that might be disabled, the teachers that want to teach in our schools, the officers that we want more department.

1981
03:24:44,980 --> 03:24:53,500
So, I just want to put some additional context around what type of people might move into.

1982
03:24:53,500 --> 03:24:59,960
if low or very low income, how do you do that?

1983
03:25:00,020 --> 03:25:14,500
I mean, if it were to be built, what that potential occupant might be. So those were the things I wanted to touch upon from what I've heard in the comments. Is anybody else want to touch upon anything?

1984
03:25:19,340 --> 03:25:25,180
What is the discussion about ADU's and calculating and thinking about time periods?

1985
03:25:26,800 --> 03:25:32,160
PDE is unique and that we, when I say we, residents, not the communities of power.

1986
03:25:33,520 --> 03:25:37,380
If we have an arms-length relationship between PEHA and CC&Rs,

1987
03:25:38,040 --> 03:25:44,540
and we all talk about our CC&Rs, our CC&Rs are not governed by this municipality.

1988
03:25:44,540 --> 03:25:46,200
We are elected to represent.

1989
03:25:49,280 --> 03:25:56,440
Up until a few years ago, the CCNRs, which again are subject to part of the city, restricted

1990
03:25:56,920 --> 03:26:02,980
the ability to have, and if you think of ways that one, the designers of the city went

1991
03:26:02,980 --> 03:26:10,760
about this, you were not allowed to have a second kitchen, and that's how with their intent

1992
03:26:10,760 --> 03:26:13,820
they went about saying, well, people are going to want to have a cool house.

1993
03:26:14,520 --> 03:26:16,360
But we don't want it to turn into a second residence.

1994
03:26:17,080 --> 03:26:21,060
So in CCNR, we're going to restrict a second kitchen.

1995
03:26:22,220 --> 03:26:26,320
The architect got created, and it was like, you know, a plug-in stove, but it didn't work anyway.

1996
03:26:26,420 --> 03:26:27,320
So they didn't get more creative.

1997
03:26:27,800 --> 03:26:35,520
Well, all that was pushed out by legislation where the legislature passed the law

1998
03:26:36,880 --> 03:26:46,520
that specifically targeted CCNRs and online associations and relatively used blue completely through that.

1999
03:26:47,540 --> 03:26:51,840
I'll skip my political opinions on that, you can figure out by my tone and my voice how I feel.

2000
03:26:53,100 --> 03:26:58,100
The reality is when you come back and look at this situation and you look at the ADU calculations,

2001
03:26:58,720 --> 03:27:03,060
you heard the story about having to go back to HDD and have a conversation about it in the average.

2002
03:27:04,100 --> 03:27:08,460
Thank God they agreed to do it because part of the reason that we couldn't get the average

2003
03:27:08,460 --> 03:27:16,000
job was because of CCNR restrictions here in the PPE, there were no any use allowed up

2004
03:27:16,000 --> 03:27:16,960
until that point.

2005
03:27:17,580 --> 03:27:21,460
So then when you have to turn around and go backwards and take an average, you're in a real

2006
03:27:21,460 --> 03:27:21,840
pinhole.

2007
03:27:22,920 --> 03:27:23,760
So that was that.

2008
03:27:25,320 --> 03:27:26,220
The other one.

2009
03:27:27,240 --> 03:27:30,100
Let's talk about the third rail on this town, open space.

2010
03:27:32,650 --> 03:27:37,570
I don't want to get too into this because this is recorded video and it goes all over the place, but I'm just going to say

2011
03:27:38,530 --> 03:27:43,090
The minute that you start seeding and letting go of that, that's the beginning of the end

2012
03:27:43,650 --> 03:27:50,470
Everyone here this evening was all upset about sites and wanted to protect sites, and we are of course in the difficult

2013
03:27:50,470 --> 03:27:56,410
I'm going to use the word everybody used to make a tickle of having to make balanced challenging choices

2014
03:27:57,010 --> 03:28:00,710
28% of our cities is parkline slash open space

2015
03:28:02,050 --> 03:28:06,050
You know, you can argue that there are some other sites that go beyond that 28 percent.

2016
03:28:08,440 --> 03:28:12,880
Every one of us tonight, and I'll argue that those of us around here have similar feelings,

2017
03:28:13,320 --> 03:28:21,400
want to protect and preserve what is this place that we also live with you in as residents.

2018
03:28:22,240 --> 03:28:23,780
And I'll speak only for myself.

2019
03:28:23,780 --> 03:28:33,980
If we deed one inch of the parkland of open space out, whether by a vote or not, that will

2020
03:28:33,980 --> 03:28:39,420
be the beginning of the end of allowing the rest to continue.

2021
03:28:42,360 --> 03:28:46,260
One other comment, there was a discussion about assessments.

2022
03:28:47,220 --> 03:28:52,080
The city, as an entity, does not have the ability to assess owners.

2023
03:28:53,160 --> 03:28:57,660
Assessments can only occur under the CCNR by the Pebbles for Insum's Association.

2024
03:28:59,980 --> 03:29:04,660
So that effort, I'm not going to get into the forum, but it's not anything else that's

2025
03:29:04,660 --> 03:29:08,880
on the table right in here because of an election that just sort of happened.

2026
03:29:10,760 --> 03:29:18,300
That would have to refer under that organization and the efforts that we could all be involved

2027
03:29:18,300 --> 03:29:20,500
in his home owners and I'm your elected city representative.

2028
03:29:22,100 --> 03:29:23,840
I like to call it Pest of the League.

2029
03:29:25,040 --> 03:29:26,940
So while there's the Our Neighborhood Voices effort,

2030
03:29:27,240 --> 03:29:29,680
there's also the defendant protect the CCNR's effort.

2031
03:29:30,300 --> 03:29:33,500
Our decision to have here relative to the housing element

2032
03:29:33,900 --> 03:29:38,380
has absolutely nothing to do with the CCNR's minus the fact

2033
03:29:39,000 --> 03:29:41,960
that we and Jim and I when we had the I talk forum,

2034
03:29:42,840 --> 03:29:44,720
that everything we could in looking at all these sites

2035
03:29:44,720 --> 03:29:46,760
very early on in Gina can attest to this.

2036
03:29:46,760 --> 03:29:56,940
The first PowerPoint that she showed us, fortunately, we were on Zoom, so I could turn off my video, I told her.

2037
03:29:58,240 --> 03:29:59,880
because it was it was not.

2038
03:30:03,020 --> 03:30:19,100
The first slide that was in front of my face. Let me also say thank you for coming, thank you for speaking, thank you for all your contributions, and I went to time at your preschool. So those are my non-publicities.

2039
03:30:26,670 --> 03:30:35,510
There you go. I just, I actually had one quick question. I was talking to some folks down there, and we were talking about the open space question that Michael referred to.

2040
03:30:35,510 --> 03:30:41,430
And all of the property that is owned in the OS is owned by the city.

2041
03:30:41,990 --> 03:30:48,210
Is it reasonable to assume that HCD would require us to sell anything that we will re-zomb

2042
03:30:48,210 --> 03:30:48,730
that purpose?

2043
03:30:51,200 --> 03:30:51,480
Yes.

2044
03:30:51,980 --> 03:30:52,180
Okay.

2045
03:30:52,540 --> 03:30:53,560
By the way, I figured it's much so.

2046
03:30:54,280 --> 03:30:58,260
I mean, you know, it's not enough just to re-zomb the OS parts hall you'd have to sell

2047
03:30:58,260 --> 03:30:58,480
it.

2048
03:30:59,080 --> 03:31:00,580
So keep that in mind.

2049
03:31:05,430 --> 03:31:05,650
Okay.

2050
03:31:05,890 --> 03:31:09,930
I do have one question and it came from the speakers.

2051
03:31:09,930 --> 03:31:21,010
When we met January 23rd, we heard what at least was news to me was that HCD requires

2052
03:31:21,010 --> 03:31:30,170
the 199 plus the 15% buffer. Is the buffer preferred? Is it required? What is it that

2053
03:31:30,170 --> 03:31:33,310
that we have to come up with here.

2054
03:31:36,700 --> 03:31:43,240
So it's part of the Millnet Laws Law,

2055
03:31:44,330 --> 03:31:45,740
and it is in statute,

2056
03:31:46,600 --> 03:31:50,440
but it's the best way to explain it is

2057
03:31:50,440 --> 03:31:53,560
that if there's ever a site in your inventory

2058
03:31:53,930 --> 03:31:56,420
and somebody comes in with a lesser density,

2059
03:31:57,140 --> 03:32:00,300
so they don't build out to the max.

2060
03:32:00,300 --> 03:32:07,160
that site hasn't. You still have loved oversight and you can't go back and find

2061
03:32:07,160 --> 03:32:14,920
other sites. You already have the buffer in another site. That's basically what

2062
03:32:14,920 --> 03:32:22,320
that means and so there are the 15% is in the guidelines as or it says

2063
03:32:22,320 --> 03:32:31,340
is recommended, they don't have a precise number of offer but it is built into the actual

2064
03:32:34,560 --> 03:32:35,100
No, no, no.

2065
03:32:35,100 --> 03:32:35,820
It's not illegal.

2066
03:32:36,740 --> 03:32:39,020
No, it is illegal requirement.

2067
03:32:39,280 --> 03:32:40,460
The law firm's.

2068
03:32:40,460 --> 03:32:40,620
Yes.

2069
03:32:40,940 --> 03:32:41,840
I don't believe so.

2070
03:32:42,120 --> 03:32:43,620
Is anybody that's in the office?

2071
03:32:43,660 --> 03:32:43,900
No.

2072
03:32:44,420 --> 03:32:44,720
Yes.

2073
03:32:46,380 --> 03:32:47,520
Is it a guidelines?

2074
03:32:48,780 --> 03:32:49,320
No.

2075
03:32:49,460 --> 03:32:52,000
Do we have the statute for no net loss?

2076
03:33:02,800 --> 03:33:03,660
It's in the guidance.

2077
03:33:33,160 --> 03:33:41,880
I think there's two different questions here. One is no net loss and one is whether there

2078
03:33:41,880 --> 03:33:45,060
is a miracle requirement for the buffer.

2079
03:34:00,680 --> 03:34:03,500
Just get the answer and tell us what he says.

2080
03:34:18,670 --> 03:34:24,350
No net laws as government code 658-631.

2081
03:34:36,090 --> 03:34:46,650
Okay, the question is the numerical buffer required for the site inventory.

2082
03:34:46,650 --> 03:34:48,810
I'm talking to the attorney.

2083
03:34:48,910 --> 03:34:49,810
Wait, I'm talking to a lawyer.

2084
03:35:16,560 --> 03:35:17,440
So

2085
03:35:25,760 --> 03:35:40,180
what he's telling us is it may not be codified, but he believes that HDD does require a 15 to 30 percent, but for when they're reviewing housing elements for

2086
03:35:40,180 --> 03:35:43,160
for the certification.

2087
03:35:45,020 --> 03:35:47,540
It's in their official guidance document.

2088
03:35:48,200 --> 03:35:48,660
It's like this.

2089
03:35:49,800 --> 03:35:51,220
This is long, I'm sorry.

2090
03:35:52,760 --> 03:35:53,360
Okay, where are you?

2091
03:35:53,780 --> 03:35:54,380
You have to know.

2092
03:35:56,940 --> 03:36:00,000
It's in their official guidance and so

2093
03:36:00,000 --> 03:36:03,140
if we wanted to go and challenge the bunker,

2094
03:36:03,500 --> 03:36:05,980
we would probably have to end up getting it forward to a breach.

2095
03:36:06,340 --> 03:36:07,560
We wouldn't have to have the bunker.

2096
03:36:07,560 --> 03:36:10,620
and we'll be at, you know, a difficult argument

2097
03:36:10,620 --> 03:36:12,280
that problems are more important.

2098
03:36:12,940 --> 03:36:14,160
Did everyone hear that?

2099
03:36:14,460 --> 03:36:14,600
No.

2100
03:36:14,820 --> 03:36:17,240
He said that if you didn't want to,

2101
03:36:17,360 --> 03:36:21,020
if we didn't want to comply with a 15 to 30 percent buffer,

2102
03:36:21,520 --> 03:36:24,680
we would have to get a court to agree

2103
03:36:24,680 --> 03:36:26,740
that we don't need to do that.

2104
03:36:27,080 --> 03:36:28,720
And we don't have time to do that.

2105
03:36:29,900 --> 03:36:31,540
But that's not correct.

2106
03:36:32,360 --> 03:36:36,000
You can submit it as an HCD doesn't like it

2107
03:36:36,000 --> 03:36:36,900
and don't come back.

2108
03:36:36,900 --> 03:36:38,880
But you don't have to get it toward order.

2109
03:36:40,240 --> 03:36:42,180
OK, this isn't open mic.

2110
03:36:42,480 --> 03:36:43,520
So this is.

2111
03:36:43,780 --> 03:36:45,620
That's a landing system, can you tell it out?

2112
03:36:45,800 --> 03:36:45,920
Yes.

2113
03:36:46,520 --> 03:36:48,460
The real landing system is already together.

2114
03:36:49,180 --> 03:36:56,220
So how do you, for example, on the ADU line, we have 80 units.

2115
03:36:57,020 --> 03:36:58,960
How does that get allocated?

2116
03:36:59,140 --> 03:37:02,860
What's the methodology to allocate between low-very, low-moderate

2117
03:37:02,860 --> 03:37:03,980
and then above-moderate?

2118
03:37:03,980 --> 03:37:13,400
So the Southern California Association of Governments created a study that looked at patterns

2119
03:37:13,400 --> 03:37:21,880
of affordability with ADs and basically was a based on historical precedent on how they

2120
03:37:21,880 --> 03:37:23,080
are typically rented out.

2121
03:37:23,380 --> 03:37:27,660
So it's based on a study that HCB accepts.

2122
03:37:27,660 --> 03:37:28,460
So,

2123
03:37:30,840 --> 03:37:38,160
it's a good thing that's there because in some counties there is no historical precedent

2124
03:37:38,160 --> 03:37:46,260
or their cogs or association of governments doesn't have any kind of evidence to support

2125
03:37:47,260 --> 03:37:54,640
income brackets and they can't assign any of their ADUs for affordability.

2126
03:37:54,640 --> 03:37:57,820
like the central valley, they can't do it.

2127
03:38:00,100 --> 03:38:05,140
So could we, what could we try to put our 80, 80, 80 years

2128
03:38:05,140 --> 03:38:07,640
in the very low and moderate category,

2129
03:38:07,900 --> 03:38:09,520
divided between those two categories?

2130
03:38:12,750 --> 03:38:15,550
We would have to provide substantial evidence

2131
03:38:16,270 --> 03:38:20,530
based on another city that has shown a track record

2132
03:38:20,530 --> 03:38:28,210
of all of their ADUs being rented and documented

2133
03:38:28,210 --> 03:38:29,930
at those levels?

2134
03:38:32,130 --> 03:38:35,950
So where I was headed, you guys probably don't remember the chart, but

2135
03:38:35,950 --> 03:38:41,670
where I was headed, for example, on above moderate, our Reno requirement is 25 units,

2136
03:38:42,410 --> 03:38:48,350
our vacant single family lots at 41 meets the 25 plus the buffer, so they don't want

2137
03:38:48,350 --> 03:38:52,990
anything else in that category. I want to move the other stuff to the other end. I'm willing

2138
03:38:52,990 --> 03:38:57,250
to put the buffer somewhere else, but I don't want to pull over the buffer.

2139
03:39:00,870 --> 03:39:02,770
There's a lot of bills you should say for citizens.

2140
03:39:03,290 --> 03:39:04,270
I'm sorry, we're not.

2141
03:39:04,890 --> 03:39:05,150
We're not.

2142
03:39:09,580 --> 03:39:12,840
Sorry, I don't think you're getting on the aid of use in the bank.

2143
03:39:13,000 --> 03:39:15,760
I don't think you get the opportunity to move those from above the water.

2144
03:39:16,140 --> 03:39:17,120
They're kind of dictated.

2145
03:39:17,820 --> 03:39:18,400
Please Michael.

2146
03:39:20,880 --> 03:39:22,960
This question I think is for Gina.

2147
03:39:23,200 --> 03:39:24,120
So let me ask this.

2148
03:39:24,400 --> 03:39:29,020
With the analysis you've done, assuming that the income categories are not modified.

2149
03:39:30,340 --> 03:39:38,300
If we use the combination of vacant single-family locks, we include the Malangal Code of Site 1.

2150
03:39:39,280 --> 03:39:42,040
We, please don't react, because it's going to cost money.

2151
03:39:42,680 --> 03:39:50,560
We remove the same Francis Episcopal Church, and we don't change the first Church of Christ scientist.

2152
03:39:50,560 --> 03:39:59,820
And we leave, sorry, with residential housing opportunity overlaid, not the commercial

2153
03:40:00,110 --> 03:40:08,930
All over, like, combined with the ADU count that has been accepted in 80, will those numbers

2154
03:40:08,930 --> 03:40:15,050
combined be to the requirements, including, I'll call it the low end of the required

2155
03:40:15,050 --> 03:40:22,310
buffer? Can you clarify what numbers you're talking about? The ADU's are 80, same

2156
03:40:22,310 --> 03:40:26,290
Family Laws is 41, so that's 121 there.

2157
03:40:26,750 --> 03:40:29,230
All right, what are the others that you're talking about?

2158
03:40:29,490 --> 03:40:32,070
So the big and single family law is 41.

2159
03:40:32,710 --> 03:40:35,170
Malorie closed site one with a mixed-used overlay

2160
03:40:35,170 --> 03:40:37,430
because it's existing commercial, 17.

2161
03:40:40,160 --> 03:40:42,400
St. Francis, the physical plan of removing Francis,

2162
03:40:43,160 --> 03:40:46,660
first church of Christ's scientists in the table I'm looking at

2163
03:40:46,660 --> 03:40:51,240
with the residential opportunity overlay at the lower density

2164
03:40:51,240 --> 03:40:52,460
is listed at 71.

2165
03:40:54,810 --> 03:40:57,550
The 80 you've been talking about is listed at 80.

2166
03:41:02,040 --> 03:41:02,960
What is that total

2167
03:41:02,960 --> 03:41:03,580
up is that call?

2168
03:41:09,990 --> 03:41:14,490
The answer is going to turn on whether or not the buffer has to be applied

2169
03:41:14,490 --> 03:41:22,690
to each income category. Because when I do math, you have those sites up. You don't get to...

2170
03:41:25,590 --> 03:41:30,610
That was the question I had at January 23rd. Me was whether the buffer was an aggregate or if it

2171
03:41:30,610 --> 03:41:35,710
was by an income category and I was told it was an aggregate. So can we clarify if that's true?

2172
03:41:39,900 --> 03:41:47,080
I was told it was an aggregate and I would like the, it

2173
03:41:49,610 --> 03:41:51,250
could be aggregate because when you use

2174
03:41:51,250 --> 03:41:58,150
another site you can always change it. So yes. So when you $199 by category? Yes.

2175
03:42:03,270 --> 03:42:04,490
So $229.

2176
03:42:05,090 --> 03:42:09,330
Right? The other 30 doesn't matter what category the other is. Correct?

2177
03:42:10,870 --> 03:42:13,970
It's going to make it lots. In fact, all is making lots of good news.

2178
03:42:14,790 --> 03:42:17,210
Exactly. That kind of goes back to where it was.

2179
03:42:17,430 --> 03:42:18,730
That's our bottom.

2180
03:42:19,470 --> 03:42:19,890
That's the bottom.

2181
03:42:20,670 --> 03:42:22,490
Okay, so let's get to 190.

2182
03:42:26,010 --> 03:42:27,590
Why don't we, let me ask this.

2183
03:42:29,010 --> 03:42:31,970
We heard from a representative first church of Christ scientists.

2184
03:42:31,970 --> 03:42:35,270
This is one of the last speakers he said.

2185
03:42:36,030 --> 03:42:36,430
Resonance.

2186
03:42:37,190 --> 03:42:38,430
Is there anyone with them?

2187
03:42:38,450 --> 03:42:41,070
It's not fair that the president's rolling out the streets.

2188
03:42:42,330 --> 03:42:44,070
This is close discussion now.

2189
03:42:47,800 --> 03:42:49,020
It's like a late-night meeting.

2190
03:42:49,320 --> 03:42:50,340
Mike, I'm in the lower-down.

2191
03:42:50,760 --> 03:42:52,420
He's going to be doing that at the lower-downs.

2192
03:42:52,680 --> 03:42:53,620
It's just too old now.

2193
03:42:53,620 --> 03:42:54,540
Yeah, that's a good question.

2194
03:42:54,740 --> 03:42:56,940
Can we get away with that at the lower-downs?

2195
03:42:57,140 --> 03:42:57,300
Yes.

2196
03:43:03,370 --> 03:43:05,190
So I just quickly did.

2197
03:43:05,190 --> 03:43:15,190
And the lowest density we can go for the first church of Christ scientists would be 23

2198
03:43:15,190 --> 03:43:17,630
do you per acre?

2199
03:43:19,890 --> 03:43:21,210
We cannot.

2200
03:43:21,590 --> 03:43:22,070
Why is that?

2201
03:43:22,710 --> 03:43:27,130
Because we do not have enough land.

2202
03:43:29,070 --> 03:43:33,070
It doesn't reach even if we love the 199.

2203
03:43:33,070 --> 03:43:40,130
29. So how many units is that at 23? So again, it's 23 on the 5, 4, 4, 6, 3. Can we

2204
03:43:40,130 --> 03:43:44,100
break that apart? It's two parcels over there.

2205
03:43:46,800 --> 03:43:47,280
The

2206
03:43:50,320 --> 03:43:54,060
way you're having a drawing doesn't show where the parcel is. Right. It's right through

2207
03:43:54,060 --> 03:44:01,120
the middle of the building. You know, I don't know that there, if we could have, I don't

2208
03:44:01,120 --> 03:44:06,380
think that there's any reason why we couldn't have two different overlay zones on each

2209
03:44:06,380 --> 03:44:11,280
the parcels so if you really get the creative it'd be more work for you to

2210
03:44:11,280 --> 03:44:13,620
re-zone but so

2211
03:44:16,150 --> 03:44:19,670
help us understand what that would look like and what the

2212
03:44:19,670 --> 03:44:20,670
application is.

2213
03:44:22,870 --> 03:44:27,170
I think it might be difficult for you to have two different

2214
03:44:27,170 --> 03:44:40,490
zoning overlays for one site with two parcels because you didn't know about

2215
03:44:40,490 --> 03:44:50,610
25. So in the 25-view raker on Malaga and 25 on the first church of Christ for the

2216
03:44:50,610 --> 03:44:53,990
325-6 acre site.

2217
03:44:55,430 --> 03:44:58,950
And what side of the...

2218
03:45:01,700 --> 03:45:09,000
Which parcel is the three-and-a-half acre parcel, the one that fronts PV drug north? Because that's the only one. Yes.

2219
03:45:09,400 --> 03:45:18,000
Okay. Yeah. It doesn't make sense to have, to even have the sun and the scene of that would be.

2220
03:45:18,000 --> 03:45:23,900
When we spoke earlier, I thought you would tell me that that three and a half acre lot could have it to one tube.

2221
03:45:25,100 --> 03:45:30,440
If it was residential lonely, I never say that it has to be 23.

2222
03:45:32,500 --> 03:45:36,780
If it was combined with the

2223
03:45:43,820 --> 03:45:44,580
math here,

2224
03:45:57,680 --> 03:46:00,920
maybe that was when I was looking at it with another site.

2225
03:46:00,920 --> 03:46:12,240
But now, with my mouth, hold on, I've got lots of tabs here with just, so, yeah, I would have to be twenty-fucked.

2226
03:46:13,560 --> 03:46:16,500
Could hold on, I just...

2227
03:46:36,950 --> 03:46:43,010
Here's the map. The bigger car solace, like, it's really mostly a campus scene now.

2228
03:46:43,130 --> 03:46:44,370
I think you've got to do them together.

2229
03:46:46,440 --> 03:46:48,840
I don't know, Dave, just hold it on its head.

2230
03:46:48,840 --> 03:46:49,380
We do.

2231
03:46:49,380 --> 03:46:49,520
Jessica.

2232
03:46:52,320 --> 03:46:52,960
Okay.

2233
03:46:55,540 --> 03:46:56,180
Okay.

2234
03:46:58,900 --> 03:47:00,060
Thank you.

2235
03:47:00,140 --> 03:47:00,400
That's it.

2236
03:47:00,480 --> 03:47:01,020
That's it.

2237
03:47:01,060 --> 03:47:01,380
Okay.

2238
03:47:02,820 --> 03:47:03,460
Okay.

2239
03:47:03,920 --> 03:47:04,100
So.

2240
03:47:04,460 --> 03:47:04,980
Okay.

2241
03:47:05,180 --> 03:47:05,860
So we do.

2242
03:47:08,040 --> 03:47:13,080
If we do on the first first church, press scientist, and we do

2243
03:47:13,080 --> 03:47:17,880
the residential only, and we want the lowest, density possible,

2244
03:47:17,880 --> 03:47:25,360
possible. Tell me again why that can't be 20 units per acre? Because that's what you have here.

2245
03:47:25,660 --> 03:47:28,920
20 votes is 20 to 25, but why can't they do 20?

2246
03:47:55,830 --> 03:47:59,010
I'm going to say it here instead. There

2247
03:47:59,010 --> 03:48:04,970
was an email from staffed us that had the Mallory Coast site one, the St. Francis

2248
03:48:04,970 --> 03:48:12,850
the principal church, the first church Christ scientist at the 20th to 25th

2249
03:48:12,850 --> 03:48:17,490
D.U. such as in N.A.D.U.'s, if I were to...

2250
03:48:18,190 --> 03:48:20,390
That's the key to success in the tool.

2251
03:48:21,690 --> 03:48:24,190
Here's the thing, if you...

2252
03:48:24,190 --> 03:48:33,770
Okay, so in her alternative here at the 20th to 25th D.U.s. per acre, that's 92 units.

2253
03:48:34,310 --> 03:48:43,750
we need 87 anyway. So we need 87 after you subtract everything else. Like if

2254
03:48:43,750 --> 03:48:48,450
after you account for A to use, assuming that we're, I don't know what direction

2255
03:48:48,450 --> 03:48:51,810
we're headed here, I'm assuming I'm, I'm parroting what, what Michael was

2256
03:48:51,810 --> 03:48:55,690
suggesting which was, you know,

2257
03:49:03,150 --> 03:49:06,670
the rocks out there, right? So I do think we have

2258
03:49:06,670 --> 03:49:10,250
to spread this around though, and that tips, so to me the comments of all the

2259
03:49:10,250 --> 03:49:18,530
speakers, which again, I mean a lot of left, but thank you. Is that, is the spreading

2260
03:49:18,530 --> 03:49:24,490
around? And we have to spread around. And so that's why I'm trying to get to residential

2261
03:49:24,490 --> 03:49:34,770
only small, that 20 units per acre number, and spread it across the two church sites and

2262
03:49:41,370 --> 03:49:46,250
It can be pretty loud in the view, but it's good to know when it's going to get it all.

2263
03:49:47,590 --> 03:49:53,330
Hi, the problem is, I think in the view, for example if you wanted to split it up the

2264
03:49:53,330 --> 03:49:57,230
way right now, then you just put a handful of units on the patio building and I don't think

2265
03:49:57,230 --> 03:49:59,690
it except that because...

2266
03:50:00,560 --> 03:50:14,500
We have 17-17 of the- those are 17, I'm sorry. I was being so funny. My husband and my children would say I screamed constant.

2267
03:50:18,680 --> 03:50:28,020
We were saying that the 17 didn't work for HD on the Malaga Code site and the Lenape Bay site, but 16s a minimum and those are 17. Those were working.

2268
03:50:31,140 --> 03:50:32,460
Last week, when we talked about the

2269
03:50:32,460 --> 03:50:36,240
talked about this, we actually talked about taking both of those off and spreading

2270
03:50:36,240 --> 03:50:38,860
in between the two church churches.

2271
03:50:40,860 --> 03:50:45,480
But I think we either have to do that and spread it across the two churches

2272
03:50:45,480 --> 03:50:47,700
or across all four.

2273
03:50:51,200 --> 03:50:53,840
I agree with the spreading.

2274
03:50:54,380 --> 03:50:59,020
What gives me pause about a couple of things.

2275
03:51:00,720 --> 03:51:03,480
When I first saw the Church of Christ scientist

2276
03:51:03,480 --> 03:51:07,360
and solve 116 number I choked.

2277
03:51:10,020 --> 03:51:13,200
We have to think about the safety of our

2278
03:51:13,200 --> 03:51:20,180
residents and neighbors and egress and that's part of why the churches are

2279
03:51:20,180 --> 03:51:27,740
appealing because they have better access to egress. So for me that's where

2280
03:51:29,240 --> 03:51:35,760
a little bit tricky because there aren't a lot of ways to get out of La Nota Bay.

2281
03:51:38,560 --> 03:51:41,760
But it's on a Bay Street.

2282
03:51:44,280 --> 03:51:45,820
Going through the Accord.

2283
03:51:50,860 --> 03:51:56,340
If there's a higher or an emergency, I'm worried about egress and egress for evacuation.

2284
03:51:56,480 --> 03:51:58,620
Are you talking about, you said La Nota Bay?

2285
03:51:58,620 --> 03:51:59,620
But then you said to be a current-

2286
03:51:59,620 --> 03:52:00,960
Still not a baby, but I think you've known.

2287
03:52:01,460 --> 03:52:04,420
But if you're in, but not a baby, the only way out

2288
03:52:04,420 --> 03:52:07,160
is to go in the e-drome or to go to the accordor.

2289
03:52:07,460 --> 03:52:08,560
The intersection, right?

2290
03:52:09,260 --> 03:52:11,280
Where else are you going to get out of the area?

2291
03:52:11,500 --> 03:52:12,240
I'm just interested, sir.

2292
03:52:12,760 --> 03:52:13,480
What does that mean,

2293
03:52:16,070 --> 03:52:17,590
awkward, awkward, awkward?

2294
03:52:23,710 --> 03:52:24,370
Let me say this.

2295
03:52:25,710 --> 03:52:29,530
I'm just thinking out loud here with what Michael said.

2296
03:52:29,750 --> 03:52:33,910
So I think that I continue to think the Church of Christ

2297
03:52:33,910 --> 03:52:41,770
scientists just definitely on the table. I think of the two other sites that are on this table,

2298
03:52:41,890 --> 03:52:46,390
and there's other sites that we can consider, but of the smaller code for the patio building,

2299
03:52:47,550 --> 03:52:53,530
the small area and malloc code we're talking about is clearly underutilized relative. I mean,

2300
03:52:53,870 --> 03:52:57,230
it's certainly underutilized relative to the patio building.

2301
03:53:04,950 --> 03:53:06,050
One thing that gives me

2302
03:53:06,050 --> 03:53:11,410
cause about that is that there are six homes that may have views over the time

2303
03:53:11,410 --> 03:53:12,510
these existing buildings.

2304
03:53:20,910 --> 03:53:26,150
Yes, they're taking lots of ideas. No, you don't understand.

2305
03:53:28,950 --> 03:53:29,790
Thank you.

2306
03:53:38,930 --> 03:53:43,770
We don't have the numbers. We're short a little bit.

2307
03:53:46,150 --> 03:53:51,430
I'm sorry, sir. Could you please stop yelling out at us? We're trying to solve

2308
03:53:51,430 --> 03:54:01,550
problem here. This is an opportunity to talk. Please let us know the problem. You're interrupting the problem, the discussion we ask you to reframe, please.

2309
03:54:03,960 --> 03:54:15,380
What I'm coming up with is we have the 41 of the vacant lots. We have 80, 80 use the church at 71.

2310
03:54:15,380 --> 03:54:23,480
one. And if we include it, we'll not obey any malle code that both of the 17 that gets

2311
03:54:23,480 --> 03:54:28,920
us to 226 and my calculation is we need to 29 if we're going to have a 15% profit.

2312
03:54:32,150 --> 03:54:32,550
Is that

2313
03:54:32,550 --> 03:54:36,090
correct? What's your first thing and what's your

2314
03:54:36,090 --> 03:54:39,350
church number? Sorry, what's your church number?

2315
03:54:40,710 --> 03:54:46,270
71 for the. That's not right. 71 is only for the 356. So do it with the whole protocol

2316
03:54:46,270 --> 03:54:47,150
That's all I think we're there.

2317
03:54:47,350 --> 03:54:47,450
Right.

2318
03:54:47,870 --> 03:54:48,510
Oh, if I did it.

2319
03:54:48,630 --> 03:54:48,870
Okay.

2320
03:54:49,090 --> 03:54:49,190
Yeah.

2321
03:54:49,290 --> 03:54:49,890
I was looking for it.

2322
03:54:49,890 --> 03:54:51,070
I was working off on our schedule.

2323
03:54:51,290 --> 03:54:51,370
Yeah.

2324
03:54:51,630 --> 03:54:52,550
I mean, I need so many.

2325
03:54:52,610 --> 03:54:53,130
I need two.

2326
03:54:53,230 --> 03:54:54,150
That's my original question.

2327
03:55:00,340 --> 03:55:30,320
So, so I'm sorry, but where are we? When we say we're there 81 plus 80 plus 41 80 use and vacant lots, right? That's a 121 that's set still. We're adding 92. 92 was the lower dead city for the Church of Christ scientist. That brings us to 13. So we need another 16. Did you claim the malignant dose? No, I didn't do that. So it's you need one of those two.

2328
03:55:30,320 --> 03:55:30,760
two sides.

2329
03:55:56,890 --> 03:56:00,410
You can see if there's another way to deviate out between the two terms.

2330
03:56:09,650 --> 03:56:09,870
Okay.

2331
03:56:10,090 --> 03:56:17,210
So the St. Francis is one parcel at 2.84 acres and 20 units per acre is 57.

2332
03:56:20,750 --> 03:56:23,670
Well, because we don't really know how that mine's cattle.

2333
03:56:24,470 --> 03:56:29,670
Victoria, I just, you know, before we go too far down this, I mean, I hear what you're saying

2334
03:56:29,670 --> 03:56:34,110
about wanting it to be balanced, I don't disagree with the point you're making.

2335
03:56:35,310 --> 03:56:40,870
I think that the problem with St. Francis' two things.

2336
03:56:40,970 --> 03:56:47,090
Number one is, I actually agree with the folks who are saying that the argument that I like the most

2337
03:56:47,090 --> 03:56:50,070
is that I think the building is architecturally significant.

2338
03:56:53,130 --> 03:57:02,970
And that clearly there's a strong argument that has been made that it is not underutilized

2339
03:57:03,490 --> 03:57:09,510
since it's both bringing us preschool and as a church and as a bunch of programs going on.

2340
03:57:11,470 --> 03:57:18,070
So, you know, I'm not super inclined to split the baby's inner.

2341
03:57:37,220 --> 03:57:39,720
David, why don't you have a perspective on this?

2342
03:57:40,140 --> 03:57:41,440
Let's see if I can move this meaning along.

2343
03:57:41,860 --> 03:57:44,040
I'm out on St. Francis. I will vote now.

2344
03:57:52,470 --> 03:57:55,550
David, where are you wearing any on this?

2345
03:58:03,530 --> 03:58:07,970
I agree with the concerns about the architectural aspects of St. Francis.

2346
03:58:08,570 --> 03:58:12,910
And if we can do it without St. Francis, I think that makes more sense.

2347
03:58:13,790 --> 03:58:14,930
And is this for this government?

2348
03:58:15,310 --> 03:58:16,310
For this government, yes.

2349
03:58:17,870 --> 03:58:20,750
Okay, so that leaves us with the ADUs.

2350
03:58:21,130 --> 03:58:23,130
AD and they get mod of 41.

2351
03:58:24,050 --> 03:58:26,010
First Church of Christ in 92.

2352
03:58:28,130 --> 03:58:37,170
We need to add another 16 so is it not going to come, is it not a bay, is it boat, any proposals on the table?

2353
03:58:37,410 --> 03:58:39,850
I mean it really has to only be one but it can't split it.

2354
03:58:39,870 --> 03:58:45,130
It only needs one, yeah you can't split it because when you're below the 16th threshold.

2355
03:58:46,230 --> 03:58:51,750
I think the reality is when you go and look back at the challenges that we have of the important intersection,

2356
03:58:51,750 --> 03:58:58,670
It's bad either way, but funneling traffic in and out of a lot of things, and by the way,

2357
03:58:58,690 --> 03:59:02,590
anybody that thinks that council members make choices for their own benefit.

2358
03:59:02,870 --> 03:59:04,550
This is about to smash my own stuff.

2359
03:59:05,050 --> 03:59:07,110
So we don't.

2360
03:59:08,430 --> 03:59:13,470
Moving traffic to that intersection, because we have not been able to expand it by whatever method

2361
03:59:13,470 --> 03:59:18,970
and forget what it was or wasn't going to be, it's the challenge of adding more housing

2362
03:59:20,170 --> 03:59:25,030
and moving through that intersection will make that untenable.

2363
03:59:25,530 --> 03:59:29,870
So I think between the two sites and considering the business use,

2364
03:59:30,030 --> 03:59:32,810
even though I understand it could continue at the patio building.

2365
03:59:33,190 --> 03:59:34,450
Well, something was going on.

2366
03:59:35,190 --> 03:59:39,770
It probably for this round makes most sense to put that in a gallery co-location.

2367
03:59:41,370 --> 03:59:42,490
I'll agree with that.

2368
03:59:42,750 --> 03:59:43,530
I'm going to.

2369
03:59:44,570 --> 03:59:59,520
Is there a way that we could increase the density of the first church Christ and just pick it up and move that up the 16 or 17 units that we need?

2370
04:00:00,000 --> 04:00:24,880
The density? I'm not comfortable doing that. I think we've already burned the nibs. The short answer to your question is absolutely yes. In fact, it's one of the options you have 116, when the sufficient of what we're proposing is to is to limit the impact to neighbors in the vicinity of there to use the lower density and only prevent 92 units.

2371
04:00:35,590 --> 04:00:51,450
I'm sorry, ma'am, ma'am, if you're going to keep talking, I'm going to need to ask you to be removed. So please, I understand you're frustrated. We're doing the best we can with what we have. Thank you.

2372
04:00:52,150 --> 04:00:52,590
Yeah,

2373
04:00:57,320 --> 04:01:11,300
I don't love the 902 there, I prefer the 71, but there's no other way for us to get to our numbers, even if we threw in the oligarcho, unless we threw in St. Francis,

2374
04:01:13,800 --> 04:01:16,660
and I think at this point...

2375
04:01:19,410 --> 04:01:28,410
So what I'm hearing, just to repeat, actually, is there a motion on the table?

2376
04:01:28,630 --> 04:01:29,310
Let's put it that way.

2377
04:01:32,510 --> 04:01:33,910
Does somebody want to make a motion?

2378
04:01:38,840 --> 04:01:40,400
Let me try and do it in my motion.

2379
04:01:42,180 --> 04:01:42,660
We are not.

2380
04:01:42,820 --> 04:01:49,700
Or are we sensitive to the allocation of the lower common-moderate and common-manence as a practical matter?

2381
04:01:49,860 --> 04:01:51,080
It doesn't really have any effect.

2382
04:01:56,870 --> 04:02:02,570
She's just checking the math on the various categories for income or categories for the sites.

2383
04:02:03,090 --> 04:02:04,370
Yeah, that doesn't work.

2384
04:02:05,530 --> 04:02:10,070
But I mean, Gina, the point, I guess it's the question that's, what's the method to,

2385
04:02:10,620 --> 04:02:14,350
what's the method to splitting between very low and moderate?

2386
04:02:14,790 --> 04:02:18,510
The sites are split 65% all the way.

2387
04:02:18,930 --> 04:02:20,090
Okay, so it doesn't, okay.

2388
04:02:22,890 --> 04:02:27,010
But at the end of the day, if someone comes in and they build a whole market rate, we

2389
04:02:27,010 --> 04:02:28,710
just got to reallocate those to another site.

2390
04:02:28,710 --> 04:02:31,050
Anyway, it doesn't make any difference.

2391
04:02:31,270 --> 04:02:31,350
Okay.

2392
04:02:31,930 --> 04:02:40,750
So I think that then maybe we have a submission where the issue here is we're going to submit

2393
04:02:40,750 --> 04:02:41,710
to HCD, right?

2394
04:02:42,070 --> 04:02:43,510
A proposed housing element?

2395
04:02:44,070 --> 04:02:44,270
Yes.

2396
04:02:44,270 --> 04:02:49,610
Okay, I'm sorry for any more questions because I don't think I understood your answer. I'm so sorry.

2397
04:02:50,490 --> 04:02:57,410
So on the Reno line, I don't know what Pedro meant, but on the Reno line that it breaks down the 199

2398
04:02:58,590 --> 04:02:59,550
by category.

2399
04:03:00,350 --> 04:03:02,010
Don't we have to read those numbers?

2400
04:03:02,770 --> 04:03:06,610
Yes, so we're not meeting those numbers with what we're proposing here. Yeah, we do.

2401
04:03:07,890 --> 04:03:11,590
We get it's 80 use, 41 vacant single-fendent.

2402
04:03:11,590 --> 04:03:17,450
I don't know. It has to be by Cat the one that she doesn't have any. No.

2403
04:03:18,050 --> 04:03:23,410
Oh, we were talking about the individual site. How? Because for example,

2404
04:03:23,430 --> 04:03:29,710
the Malgo Code is satisfying both the low, very low and the moderate. So within that site,

2405
04:03:29,910 --> 04:03:35,410
we're splitting the entire area 65 percent in the cloud.

2406
04:03:38,340 --> 04:03:40,060
What, where do you think the problem is?

2407
04:03:40,060 --> 04:03:47,240
I said another way, the one ninety nine, do I have to have a hundred and twenty six

2408
04:03:47,240 --> 04:03:48,160
a very low low?

2409
04:03:48,380 --> 04:03:48,540
Yes.

2410
04:03:48,780 --> 04:03:50,260
Okay, guys, we don't.

2411
04:03:50,480 --> 04:03:54,260
If you're at which scenario are you looking for?

2412
04:03:54,260 --> 04:03:58,440
We have forty eight EVUs, I see what you're looking for.

2413
04:03:58,440 --> 04:04:03,980
We have eleven from the Malaga Coast site, and we have sixty for the church, it's one

2414
04:04:03,980 --> 04:04:04,340
nineteen.

2415
04:04:04,740 --> 04:04:04,780
Okay.

2416
04:04:04,780 --> 04:04:06,080
We don't have twenty six.

2417
04:04:06,080 --> 04:04:12,300
Are you are you looking at 20 do you for acre? Yes. Yes. We were talking about 90.

2418
04:04:12,460 --> 04:04:20,300
Okay. Yeah. And the minimum we would need would be 23. Okay. So. And that ends up with how many units?

2419
04:04:21,220 --> 04:04:25,420
Because what was in your presentation? Your presentation, the numbers in your presentation are 20.

2420
04:04:26,220 --> 04:04:32,040
Well, no, that was if it was with the other church. She's taking it back. No, it wasn't.

2421
04:04:32,040 --> 04:04:38,360
No, no. You can slide this up and down. It's just a matter of whether you get the units somewhere

2422
04:04:38,360 --> 04:04:44,540
out. So this alternative was with the other church. If we eliminate St. Francis, we can't go

2423
04:04:44,540 --> 04:04:44,960
that alone.

2424
04:04:52,180 --> 04:04:56,480
So how many units does that end up? We were just saying we were comfortable going from

2425
04:04:56,480 --> 04:04:58,480
from 116 to 92 at the church.

2426
04:04:58,820 --> 04:04:59,880
Yeah, we think we-

2427
04:05:00,000 --> 04:05:28,540
You're going to have to kick about 20. We got it, we got to talk through it more. What is how many units does that end of being? That would be of exactly 128, low, very low, 48 moderate, 68 above moderate. So your buffer would be, certainly, any above one. What's the total? If you're lined for the church. If you're at 23, do you purge?

2428
04:05:30,040 --> 04:05:30,720
106.

2429
04:05:31,060 --> 04:05:31,680
106.

2430
04:05:32,460 --> 04:05:32,700
For low?

2431
04:05:33,300 --> 04:05:34,340
It's 16.

2432
04:05:34,520 --> 04:05:34,620
No.

2433
04:05:35,000 --> 04:05:35,460
Low.

2434
04:05:35,680 --> 04:05:36,180
Very low.

2435
04:05:36,400 --> 04:05:36,540
Yeah.

2436
04:05:37,120 --> 04:05:39,040
37 moderns.

2437
04:05:40,320 --> 04:05:43,140
So it's not the 92 we've been talking about.

2438
04:05:43,340 --> 04:05:45,760
It's 106 right now.

2439
04:05:46,780 --> 04:05:47,900
We only cut 10 units.

2440
04:05:53,660 --> 04:06:00,760
106 were two units short without any other site.

2441
04:06:02,020 --> 04:06:06,180
But 88 use, the buffer.

2442
04:06:09,800 --> 04:06:17,140
So my point is if you go to, if you get into 108 units on that site, then you're done.

2443
04:06:17,680 --> 04:06:23,520
It's the one site, 88 use, 41 vacant single family lots plus 108.

2444
04:06:49,510 --> 04:06:49,790
Okay.

2445
04:06:50,050 --> 04:06:51,550
Gina, one more time.

2446
04:06:52,530 --> 04:06:52,890
Slowly.

2447
04:06:52,890 --> 04:07:02,070
for me. We can only do 20 units per acre on the first church of Christ scientist.

2448
04:07:02,670 --> 04:07:10,190
We only were getting to 20 if we alluded to church properties, but if you have one church property it goes to 23.

2449
04:07:10,190 --> 04:07:21,130
It goes to, yes, so 20 with bold, 23 only in this scenario with only Malaga.

2450
04:07:22,490 --> 04:07:23,170
So,

2451
04:07:25,740 --> 04:07:31,460
yes, you could only do 20 a per acre in bold church sites are included.

2452
04:07:32,260 --> 04:07:35,040
Which has nothing to do with the Malaga COVID-19 database sites.

2453
04:07:37,040 --> 04:07:37,360
Correct.

2454
04:07:38,180 --> 04:07:42,080
So if I put a lot of it back, can I get to 20 on the church?

2455
04:07:43,980 --> 04:07:46,300
Let's take a look here.

2456
04:07:46,840 --> 04:07:47,120
I'm

2457
04:08:05,160 --> 04:08:06,260
going to double check this man.

2458
04:08:08,020 --> 04:08:10,140
So, yeah, if you have Malaco,

2459
04:08:10,920 --> 04:08:13,680
Leonardo Bay at 25,

2460
04:08:14,680 --> 04:08:17,260
first church of Christ at 20,

2461
04:08:19,960 --> 04:08:22,960
you do meet the Reno.

2462
04:08:22,960 --> 04:08:23,980
Yeah,

2463
04:08:28,590 --> 04:08:36,750
you would have 130 low, very low, 49 moderate, 68 above moderate.

2464
04:08:37,490 --> 04:08:41,430
This is a strategy question here about future housing on this.

2465
04:08:41,570 --> 04:08:42,530
That's all I can say.

2466
04:09:09,260 --> 04:09:12,060
Going down on the very low, low column.

2467
04:09:13,460 --> 04:09:21,620
You have 48 for 80 use, 11 for Malacca code, 11 for LaNoda Bay, and 60 for the church, correct?

2468
04:09:21,820 --> 04:09:21,980
Correct.

2469
04:09:21,980 --> 04:09:30,440
Okay, going down the moderate column, you have five, five, eight years, six

2470
04:09:30,440 --> 04:09:36,500
formalical, six-relinato-bay, thirty-two for the church. Correct, correct, and then

2471
04:09:36,500 --> 04:09:40,060
twenty-seven and forty-one for the above. Correct.

2472
04:09:44,720 --> 04:09:49,700
So, at these density ratings, this

2473
04:09:49,700 --> 04:09:53,940
This is all predicated on a limit of three stories, right?

2474
04:09:56,170 --> 04:09:56,570
Correct.

2475
04:09:56,990 --> 04:09:57,530
So okay.

2476
04:09:58,290 --> 04:09:59,010
I'm just...

2477
04:09:59,010 --> 04:09:59,970
I'm thinking...

2478
04:10:00,000 --> 04:10:17,400
I'm thinking about, I'm trying to evaluate the impact to the neighbors there. I mean, a three-story apartment building is, for a fine neighbor's side is not completely outrageous. It's not terribly in character, but it's not life.

2479
04:10:21,380 --> 04:10:33,080
Well, it depends on the footprint and how many units are in it. Well, it would be, yeah, of course. So we're talking about 92 versus 16. What's the impact of the additional 24 units?

2480
04:10:33,080 --> 04:10:36,020
units. I mean, that's true.

2481
04:10:39,850 --> 04:10:40,850
A lot of cars. Yeah.

2482
04:10:46,620 --> 04:10:52,840
I'm with Victoria. I think we can't, we can't

2483
04:10:52,840 --> 04:11:03,460
put all the onus on the church that's being helpful and I think the way out of this is excuse

2484
04:11:03,460 --> 04:11:06,080
Excuse me, it is to do the Malaga code,

2485
04:11:06,460 --> 04:11:10,200
Lennata Bay, and the 92 at the first church of Christ.

2486
04:11:10,700 --> 04:11:10,880
I just,

2487
04:11:12,970 --> 04:11:14,730
as much as I don't love the egress issue

2488
04:11:14,730 --> 04:11:19,290
at Lennata Bay, I think we need to spread, spread the pain

2489
04:11:19,290 --> 04:11:21,650
as the guy with the crutch said.

2490
04:11:22,490 --> 04:11:24,990
As I've said before, we should have a place

2491
04:11:24,990 --> 04:11:27,110
in Lennata Bay not to add, but we don't.

2492
04:11:27,330 --> 04:11:28,230
So, here we are.

2493
04:11:29,230 --> 04:11:30,410
Could that put us over a budget?

2494
04:11:31,730 --> 04:11:33,110
That's more units than we need.

2495
04:11:34,350 --> 04:11:41,750
Well, the thing is, this puts us at 130 for very low low and we need 126. There's only

2496
04:11:41,750 --> 04:11:47,630
a 4-buffer there and on the moderate we're only a over by 1. So it's all about moderate.

2497
04:11:48,850 --> 04:11:55,190
It's the vacant lots that are doing that unless somebody wants to reason those as multi-family

2498
04:11:55,190 --> 04:11:55,690
housing.

2499
04:11:55,690 --> 04:12:03,030
I mean, I can't imagine the people on the Elivato or the Affernandes want to do.

2500
04:12:07,040 --> 04:12:10,340
You're talking about the vacant lots right now that are above moderate.

2501
04:12:11,940 --> 04:12:14,600
That's basically just...

2502
04:12:14,600 --> 04:12:19,880
No, I'm just saying the only way to ship those out of above moderate is if we resound them

2503
04:12:19,880 --> 04:12:25,440
into multi-family, which is not going to happen, so I think we're there.

2504
04:12:33,370 --> 04:12:34,250
Reluctively I agree.

2505
04:12:34,250 --> 04:12:35,030
Does

2506
04:12:47,670 --> 04:12:52,670
someone have the matrix of how this works out with the proposal on the table?

2507
04:12:52,990 --> 04:12:57,030
Is that something we can't prevent here, I don't believe.

2508
04:12:59,180 --> 04:13:04,280
I think if we're going to make a motion, we need to have a document that read into the record.

2509
04:13:10,830 --> 04:13:11,870
Do you want to see it?

2510
04:13:12,450 --> 04:13:14,470
I just want to make sure we're clear on force.

2511
04:13:16,860 --> 04:13:20,020
Mayor, maybe you should make the motion since you're going to announce.

2512
04:13:20,820 --> 04:13:21,880
Okay, here we go.

2513
04:13:21,880 --> 04:13:34,980
So I move that for our site selection for the very low slash low category, we do 48 ADUs,

2514
04:13:36,240 --> 04:13:42,280
11th at the mile of the cove site, 11th at the La Nota Bay site, 60th at the first church

2515
04:13:42,280 --> 04:13:49,100
of Christ's scientist site for a total of 130, which means our 126 Reno requirement.

2516
04:13:49,100 --> 04:14:00,300
For the moderate, I move that we have five ADUs, six at the Malaga Coast site, six at the Lennonada Bay site, 32 at the first

2517
04:14:00,300 --> 04:14:12,300
Church of Christ scientists for a total of 49, which means our rena requirement of 48. For the above moderate, we have 27 ADUs, 41 vacant

2518
04:14:12,300 --> 04:14:19,700
single family lots for a total of 68. That gives us a total going across the

2519
04:14:19,700 --> 04:14:29,900
rows of 88 use. 41 make it single family lots. 17 sites at Nalagaco, 17 in La

2520
04:14:29,900 --> 04:14:37,280
Nata Bay, 92 at the first church of Christ scientists for a total of 247 which

2521
04:14:37,280 --> 04:14:45,620
which is 18 above R-229 with the buffer.

2522
04:14:56,140 --> 04:14:59,540
Okay, that's assisting the city card.

2523
04:15:00,000 --> 04:15:02,000
Please do a roll call vote on this.

2524
04:15:06,260 --> 04:15:11,140
Councilman Kempz. Councilman McIntyre.

2525
04:15:15,520 --> 04:15:18,380
Councilman Ross. Rose. Rose.

2526
04:15:35,740 --> 04:15:47,260
Thank you all for your patience, also the council will you allow staff to submit the other

2527
04:15:47,260 --> 04:15:53,600
a half of the draft to HCD for preliminary review at this time.

2528
04:15:54,880 --> 04:15:57,200
Are we able to do that? Was that only agenda?

2529
04:16:10,260 --> 04:16:14,520
Those sections already been conscious and I always needed fresh tonight to add on to

2530
04:16:14,520 --> 04:16:21,780
that the actual sites. And on here, we've decided to propose to HCD for inclusions so

2531
04:16:21,780 --> 04:16:26,800
that would all be part of what we're going to submit here to HCD for review.

2532
04:16:26,800 --> 04:16:32,520
You'll have planning commission and then the City Council of the problem approval and adoption of the housing element.

2533
04:16:32,940 --> 04:16:34,500
This is just a bit of an authority part of it.

2534
04:16:35,540 --> 04:16:38,240
So would you please repeat what you want the motion to be?

2535
04:16:39,480 --> 04:16:40,160
No, you're not.

2536
04:16:40,160 --> 04:16:41,100
We don't need a motion.

2537
04:16:41,360 --> 04:16:52,520
And I'm just going to give the council's authorization to allow us to submit the second part to HCB for informal review.

2538
04:16:52,920 --> 04:16:53,640
All in favor?

2539
04:16:53,640 --> 04:17:05,480
I opposed. You've done it. Thank you. Thank you all for your patience for this unpleasant undertaking. Meeting adjourned.