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Good afternoon, everyone. We welcome

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you to the regular

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meeting

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of the audit committee for the utah

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transit authority. Today is monday,

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september 22 .

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our colleague beth holbrook will

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join us in a little bit and we welcome

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commissioner

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bob stevenson with us

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as well. Just a note that this meeting

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is being recorded. Live remote viewing

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for the public is

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available

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through our

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uta board

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meetings website.

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also, hold the microphone

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closely so it is picked up. Excuse

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mayor

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natalie hall who is

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unable to join us today.

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with that, we will begin with our

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safety first minute and I will turn to

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my colleague jeff acerson.

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jeff?

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>> thank you, chair.

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I appreciate the opportunity to share.

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we are at a

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season, fall. We are there. It

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is happening. We get a lot

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of moisture . The temperature has

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changed and in utah

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at least, historically, it comes

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hunting season.

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utah is

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well known for their right to

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bear arms and go after a game and have a

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good time

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and

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hunt. A lot of time it is a family

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event. I think it is appropriate to

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share some guidelines for those that

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do make that choice

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to go hunting and have guns.

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some safety items to be

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mindful of, how to

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safely store your firearms. Storage

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methods include key locks, combination

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locks, lock boxes and

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firearm safes as well. If

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you don't have access to

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a lock like that, you can go

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to your local police department. Typically

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they have those in supply

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and you can get those free

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of charge. Keep the keys out of reach

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of children and

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where others cannot find them. Store

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ammunition in a separate security

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locked container and use

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a firearm safety device such as a

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trigger lock or a

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cable lock, as I mentioned. Some basic

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firearm safety rules. Treat all firearms as

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if they

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are loaded.

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ofttimes we don't pay attention to that and

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sometimes accidents

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happen. Always keep your finger off the trigger

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until you have made the decision

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to fire. Never pointed a firearm at anything

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you are not willing

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to shoot. And, know your target,

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your target's environment and any

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other safety hazard before you

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fire and always keep the

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gun unloaded until you are ready to

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use it.

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I can just share a couple of personal experiences

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having been

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a hunter. I haven't hunted in quite a

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few years

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but it was a family event and

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you get out in the mountains and you

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get a

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lot of people out there shooting.

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you just have to make sure you

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are safe at all times because bullets

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are not --

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they go. Once they

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are fired, they go whatever direction they

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fire and they can always ricochet

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so you

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have the mindful of your target and

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beyond so you don't harm something

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you are not intending to shoot.

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okay. Chair?

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>> thank you, jeff.

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with that, we will entertain

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a motion on our consent, which

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is the approval of our minutes from

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the

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prior meeting.

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>> I will move. >> second. >> I have a

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motion from bob and

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seconded by jeff. All in favor say

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aye.

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>> aye. >>

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any opposed?

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that motion passes. Let's then go

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to item 4 on our agenda. It is

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the internal audit update. We welcome

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mike hurst, our internal audit director

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to give

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us an update.

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mike, welcome.

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>> is it working now? There

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we go. New microphones. Good

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afternoon, committee members. For the

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record, my name

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is mike hurst, director of internal audit

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for utah transit authority.

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in this first presentation I will

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give an update for

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the status of the

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2025 internal audit plan and an update

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on the bus

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safety audit.

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>> these last

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few slides are

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lists of the individual audit engagements

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that are on the

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audit plan. On this

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slide I will highlight the

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environmental

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governments it is being performed

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by our

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internal auditors and we expect

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to

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have it by the next audit

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committee meeting.

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>> I am going to

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go

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through the slides based on my talking

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points. If there is anything I don't

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cover that you want to know about,

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please stop me.

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>>

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on this slide, you are going to get a

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report today on special services operations. We

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have

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also finished video security but not in time for

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the submission

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deadline of this

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committee meeting. We will report

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on that also in the next audit committee

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meeting in december.

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>>

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let's see. Buy american compliance,

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I am currently working

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on that. Forgive my typo here. I

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will have a report to you sooner than

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december 2026.

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>> just hedging

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your bet.

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>> I am really

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pouring a lot into

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this. No

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.

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>> you are at least ready when january

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comes around. That is what I'm always forgetting,

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the wrong

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year.

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>> yeah. It is a good thing I'm an

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auditor and not an

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editor.

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let's see. Commuter

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rail safety, the current status says not

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started but

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since submitting these files for this agenda,

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we have started

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that and we expect to have that to this

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committee for

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december 2025.

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>> mount ogden bus

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maintenance. This project, we broke

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up

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into two sections. We did

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the governance and risk management

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sections and reported on that in the june

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audit

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committee meeting and then we have

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subsequently have done the

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second part of that audit which

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is testing the rate of completions

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on preventative

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maintenance and I completed that

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last week. The results are in the

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hands

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of

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management to review and work through those

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things. We will have that second phase

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report

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in december. Then, finally, these

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are

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our

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outsource projects. We have the bus

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safety

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audit which I will give a more complete audit

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in an update and then we

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have our construction audit. Currently,

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the committee --a committee is reviewing

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the proposals. We got eight or

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nine bids on this. We will

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report back on what auditor was

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selected in the december audit

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committee meeting.

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>> the bus safety

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audit, this

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was outsourced to auditors, provided

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by

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the american public transportation

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association. They are going to be

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on site the week of

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october 6 and they will have a report

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ready for the december

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audit

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committee meeting.

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>>

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this takes us to the end of the presentation.

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are there any questions or concerns

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I can address?

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>> at this point, mike,

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it doesn't look like

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you have any concerns about things

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not being done in

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a relatively good timeframe. Does

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that

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sound right?

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>> yeah. That is definitely

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accurate. We

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keep internal tracking of the

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status of our projects relative to how

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much of the year has lapsed and we

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are in

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a really good place right now and

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we expect to fully complete the 2025

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audit plan

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within the --not

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calendar but

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--week of march to february. We will

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have it all finished

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before february.

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>> any other questions

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for mike on

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this part? It doesn't look

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like it. Thank you.

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>> thank you.

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>> then,

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let's see. Going to the

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open audit recommendations report.

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mike?

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>> great. So, this presentation is a

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report on

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the status of

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open audit issues and recommendations. This

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is a report

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that we give every

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committee meeting . We have closed

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one issue since the june audit committee

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meeting. That

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was

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issue r-22-06-4

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which is a recommendation that controls

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around support vehicle custody and

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key security be

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improved. Historically, keys for our support fleet

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vehicles were kept hanging on

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a pegboard type thing in

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an unlocked lockbox

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just out in the hallway. Since that

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time,

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management has purchased and installed

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an electronic check out and check

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in and key management system. I

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tested that system

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out to make sure that

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it assigns proper custody, that only approved

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users can check

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out a vehicle and that

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keys are secured unless it is authorized

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for use. I

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threw a lot at this, trying to break

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it, so to speak and it

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held up, at least to me. I think it

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is in

298
00:10:33,386 --> 00:10:36,389
good shape and they have taken some

299
00:10:36,389 --> 00:10:37,390
strong steps to secure this valuable

300
00:10:37,390 --> 00:10:39,390
asset.

301
00:10:42,395 --> 00:10:43,396
>> mike, is that type of control at

302
00:10:43,396 --> 00:10:45,396
all of our

303
00:10:46,399 --> 00:10:48,799
facilities that have support

304
00:10:49,402 --> 00:10:50,403
vehicle thing? I

305
00:10:50,403 --> 00:10:52,405
just don't know how many --I assume

306
00:10:52,405 --> 00:10:54,405
that everyone

307
00:10:54,407 --> 00:10:55,408
of our maintenance facilities have

308
00:10:55,408 --> 00:10:57,410
something similar but not to

309
00:10:57,410 --> 00:10:58,411
the same extent, right?

310
00:10:58,411 --> 00:10:59,412
>> I focused

311
00:10:59,412 --> 00:11:01,414
on the controls here

312
00:11:01,414 --> 00:11:03,414
at the

313
00:11:04,417 --> 00:11:05,418
headquarters building. As I

314
00:11:05,418 --> 00:11:07,387
understand it, and if anyone in management

315
00:11:07,387 --> 00:11:09,387
knows

316
00:11:10,390 --> 00:11:12,390
differently, fl

317
00:11:13,393 --> 00:11:15,395
hq has most of the support fleet

318
00:11:15,395 --> 00:11:16,396
vehicles that are floating that can

319
00:11:16,396 --> 00:11:18,396
be

320
00:11:21,401 --> 00:11:22,402
checked out. I think some of the locations have

321
00:11:22,402 --> 00:11:24,402
some but

322
00:11:25,405 --> 00:11:26,406
those are primarily signed out to

323
00:11:26,406 --> 00:11:27,407
individuals.

324
00:11:27,407 --> 00:11:28,408
>> those vehicles are typically assigned

325
00:11:28,408 --> 00:11:30,808
already. They have a

326
00:11:31,411 --> 00:11:33,411
responsible party for

327
00:11:33,413 --> 00:11:34,414
them.

328
00:11:34,414 --> 00:11:35,415
>> we better have use your microphone.

329
00:11:35,415 --> 00:11:37,415
>> is

330
00:11:37,417 --> 00:11:40,387
there any problem with over demand

331
00:11:40,387 --> 00:11:42,387
for

332
00:11:42,389 --> 00:11:43,390
these vehicles? Is there always a

333
00:11:43,390 --> 00:11:45,392
vehicle available for those

334
00:11:45,392 --> 00:11:46,393
who want it? Does anyone know the

335
00:11:46,393 --> 00:11:48,393
answer

336
00:11:49,396 --> 00:11:50,397
to that?

337
00:11:50,397 --> 00:11:52,399
>> we have not had a problem where

338
00:11:52,399 --> 00:11:53,400
we have not been able to meet

339
00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:54,401
the demand of the vehicles.

340
00:11:54,401 --> 00:11:55,402
>> my

341
00:11:55,402 --> 00:11:57,404
next question is, do we have too

342
00:11:57,404 --> 00:11:58,405
many vehicles?

343
00:11:58,405 --> 00:11:59,406
>> that is something

344
00:11:59,406 --> 00:12:00,407
that our vehicles team

345
00:12:00,407 --> 00:12:01,408
was always looking out. We have retired

346
00:12:01,408 --> 00:12:03,408
a number

347
00:12:05,412 --> 00:12:07,414
of vehicles. That is something we

348
00:12:07,414 --> 00:12:08,415
always look at.

349
00:12:08,415 --> 00:12:10,417
>> I think it was

350
00:12:10,417 --> 00:12:12,417
an issue two

351
00:12:13,386 --> 00:12:14,387
years ago .

352
00:12:14,387 --> 00:12:15,388
we have made some changes.

353
00:12:15,388 --> 00:12:16,389
>> that

354
00:12:16,389 --> 00:12:17,390
was part of the analysis process

355
00:12:17,390 --> 00:12:19,392
we went through to right size it and

356
00:12:19,392 --> 00:12:20,393
make sure we get efficient use out

357
00:12:20,393 --> 00:12:21,394
of it.

358
00:12:21,394 --> 00:12:22,395
>> one of the issues from this audit

359
00:12:22,395 --> 00:12:25,395
that is still open is

360
00:12:25,398 --> 00:12:27,398
about right sizing

361
00:12:28,401 --> 00:12:30,401
the fleet

362
00:12:30,403 --> 00:12:31,404
. And, about having processes in place

363
00:12:31,404 --> 00:12:32,405
to ensure that we have the right

364
00:12:32,405 --> 00:12:34,407
number in the right time of vehicles

365
00:12:34,407 --> 00:12:35,408
in place and

366
00:12:35,408 --> 00:12:37,410
management has taken some strong steps

367
00:12:37,410 --> 00:12:39,410
toward that

368
00:12:40,413 --> 00:12:42,813
and are developing policies

369
00:12:45,418 --> 00:12:46,419
and procedures to make sure that we

370
00:12:46,419 --> 00:12:48,419
have a good

371
00:12:52,392 --> 00:12:54,792
balance of the rain

372
00:12:55,395 --> 00:12:57,397
number of vehicles but also

373
00:12:57,397 --> 00:12:58,398
good availability.

374
00:12:58,398 --> 00:13:00,398
>> does that answer

375
00:13:04,404 --> 00:13:05,405
your question?

376
00:13:05,405 --> 00:13:06,406
>> let's

377
00:13:06,406 --> 00:13:07,407
see. The current status of open issues.

378
00:13:07,407 --> 00:13:08,408
there are currently 37 open issues.

379
00:13:08,408 --> 00:13:10,408
here is

380
00:13:10,410 --> 00:13:12,410
just

381
00:13:13,413 --> 00:13:15,413
a breakdown

382
00:13:15,415 --> 00:13:16,416
by cheap office, 10 are in capital service,

383
00:13:16,416 --> 00:13:18,416
10 in

384
00:13:22,389 --> 00:13:23,390
operation, 10 in the people office, six

385
00:13:23,390 --> 00:13:24,391
in

386
00:13:24,391 --> 00:13:25,392
finance and then one is shared by

387
00:13:25,392 --> 00:13:27,392
enterprise strategy

388
00:13:31,398 --> 00:13:33,398
and operations

389
00:13:34,401 --> 00:13:35,402
. Another way to break that down is

390
00:13:35,402 --> 00:13:36,403
by year.

391
00:13:36,403 --> 00:13:37,404
three in 2020, seven in 2021, six

392
00:13:37,404 --> 00:13:39,804
in 2022, 16 in 2023, three 2024 and

393
00:13:40,407 --> 00:13:42,407
two from 2025.

394
00:13:42,409 --> 00:13:43,410
another --this is on the slide but

395
00:13:43,410 --> 00:13:46,410
it may also be instructive

396
00:13:46,413 --> 00:13:48,413
to know

397
00:13:48,415 --> 00:13:52,419
that the risk rating on those. For

398
00:13:52,419 --> 00:13:54,387
each of the

399
00:13:54,387 --> 00:13:55,388
audit issue, we ranked them as high, medium,

400
00:13:55,388 --> 00:13:57,388
or low

401
00:13:57,390 --> 00:13:58,391
based on the severity of the issue

402
00:13:58,391 --> 00:14:01,391
and the relative importance of

403
00:14:01,394 --> 00:14:03,394
it. Out of

404
00:14:03,396 --> 00:14:04,397
those 37, 12 were rated as high, 20

405
00:14:04,397 --> 00:14:06,797
as medium and five

406
00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:08,401
as low.

407
00:14:08,401 --> 00:14:10,401
>> or any of

408
00:14:10,403 --> 00:14:12,403
the ones from

409
00:14:13,406 --> 00:14:15,406
2020 or even 2021,

410
00:14:16,409 --> 00:14:19,412
are those high at all? Do

411
00:14:19,412 --> 00:14:21,412
you know?

412
00:14:22,415 --> 00:14:24,417
mostly when I am going for

413
00:14:24,417 --> 00:14:25,418
there, high risk issues that have been

414
00:14:25,418 --> 00:14:27,418
around

415
00:14:28,388 --> 00:14:29,389
for a

416
00:14:29,389 --> 00:14:31,391
long time. If you don't have that

417
00:14:31,391 --> 00:14:33,393
answer right now, you can come

418
00:14:33,393 --> 00:14:34,394
back to this later.

419
00:14:34,394 --> 00:14:35,395
>> christi, do

420
00:14:35,395 --> 00:14:37,397
you have that information?

421
00:14:37,397 --> 00:14:40,400
I don't know if you want to

422
00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:41,401
come up.

423
00:14:41,401 --> 00:14:42,402
>> we would need

424
00:14:42,402 --> 00:14:43,403
you to come up and use the microphone,

425
00:14:43,403 --> 00:14:44,404
christie. We would love to hear your

426
00:14:44,404 --> 00:14:45,405
response.

427
00:14:45,405 --> 00:14:46,406
>> while she comes up, I can read them off

428
00:14:46,406 --> 00:14:48,406
real quick.

429
00:14:49,409 --> 00:14:53,900
>> sure. >> the three in 2020 are medium,

430
00:14:54,414 --> 00:14:55,415
high, medium and in 2020 when we have

431
00:14:55,415 --> 00:14:56,416
medium, high, medium, medium, medium, medium,

432
00:14:56,416 --> 00:14:58,416
high.

433
00:15:00,387 --> 00:15:01,388
>> okay. >> I don't know that you need

434
00:15:01,388 --> 00:15:03,788
me to add to

435
00:15:04,391 --> 00:15:05,392
that.

436
00:15:05,392 --> 00:15:07,392
>> it

437
00:15:07,394 --> 00:15:08,395
is not -- are we

438
00:15:08,395 --> 00:15:09,396
actively working on these issues?

439
00:15:09,396 --> 00:15:10,397
are some of the issues open because

440
00:15:10,397 --> 00:15:12,397
we

441
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:14,401
don't have moved forward with the

442
00:15:14,401 --> 00:15:15,402
correct information

443
00:15:15,402 --> 00:15:16,403
to audit? Can you give us -- we are

444
00:15:16,403 --> 00:15:18,403
working on this

445
00:15:19,406 --> 00:15:20,407
with mike, give the committee a better

446
00:15:20,407 --> 00:15:22,407
understanding of where

447
00:15:22,409 --> 00:15:24,409
we

448
00:15:24,411 --> 00:15:25,412
are at?

449
00:15:25,412 --> 00:15:26,413
>> for the record, I am christie giles,

450
00:15:26,413 --> 00:15:27,414
the 10 risk management administrator

451
00:15:27,414 --> 00:15:32,814
and we do work closely with mike and we

452
00:15:34,387 --> 00:15:36,389
do check in on the open issues with

453
00:15:36,389 --> 00:15:37,390
the issues owners every month. They

454
00:15:37,390 --> 00:15:38,391
are getting constant attention. In

455
00:15:38,391 --> 00:15:40,391
some cases,

456
00:15:40,393 --> 00:15:41,394
in fact, in most cases, with these issues that are

457
00:15:41,394 --> 00:15:43,794
older, they have been

458
00:15:44,397 --> 00:15:46,397
escalated to chief

459
00:15:47,400 --> 00:15:49,402
level recently because in some places we

460
00:15:49,402 --> 00:15:50,403
need a little bit higher authority

461
00:15:50,403 --> 00:15:52,403
to

462
00:15:53,406 --> 00:15:55,806
make decisions and to

463
00:15:56,409 --> 00:15:58,409
take actions

464
00:15:59,412 --> 00:16:00,413
around these issues

465
00:16:00,413 --> 00:16:01,414
that are assigned to a lower leadership

466
00:16:01,414 --> 00:16:02,415
level so we are finding that we need

467
00:16:02,415 --> 00:16:03,416
to

468
00:16:03,416 --> 00:16:04,417
do a little more escalation to the

469
00:16:04,417 --> 00:16:05,418
right level to address the issues

470
00:16:05,418 --> 00:16:07,818
but they are getting

471
00:16:08,388 --> 00:16:09,389
constant attention.

472
00:16:09,389 --> 00:16:10,390
>> I

473
00:16:10,390 --> 00:16:11,391
guess, and I apologize because I have

474
00:16:11,391 --> 00:16:12,392
been gone a lot, within the last few

475
00:16:12,392 --> 00:16:14,394
weeks, I did not get a chance to look

476
00:16:14,394 --> 00:16:16,394
through

477
00:16:16,396 --> 00:16:18,398
the details. Getting escalated is

478
00:16:18,398 --> 00:16:20,400
one thing, taking action or figuring

479
00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:22,400
out a

480
00:16:26,406 --> 00:16:27,407
claim plan -- game

481
00:16:27,407 --> 00:16:29,409
plan to resolve it is a different thing. This

482
00:16:29,409 --> 00:16:30,410
would be helpful to know what

483
00:16:30,410 --> 00:16:32,412
the game plan is, at least on those

484
00:16:32,412 --> 00:16:34,412
20 and 21

485
00:16:37,417 --> 00:16:38,418
issues.

486
00:16:38,418 --> 00:16:39,419
>> the status updates are

487
00:16:39,419 --> 00:16:40,387
accurate.

488
00:16:40,387 --> 00:16:41,388
the status updates are provided by management

489
00:16:41,388 --> 00:16:42,389
in every report in detail the action

490
00:16:42,389 --> 00:16:44,789
plan that is underway.

491
00:16:47,394 --> 00:16:49,394
>> absolutely. >> I will

492
00:16:49,396 --> 00:16:50,397
commit, chief carlton, that the december meeting,

493
00:16:50,397 --> 00:16:52,397
we will have

494
00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:55,402
a report. I would like a report

495
00:16:55,402 --> 00:16:56,403
on 2021 and 2022 to see where we are

496
00:16:56,403 --> 00:16:58,403
on each

497
00:16:58,405 --> 00:16:59,406
of those.

498
00:16:59,406 --> 00:17:00,407
>> okay. That is helpful.

499
00:17:00,407 --> 00:17:02,407
thank you.

500
00:17:02,409 --> 00:17:05,409
anything else on that, mike?

501
00:17:05,412 --> 00:17:08,412
>> no. Any other questions for

502
00:17:08,415 --> 00:17:09,416
him? Okay.

503
00:17:09,416 --> 00:17:11,416
>>

504
00:17:11,418 --> 00:17:14,387
with that, why don't we go on to

505
00:17:14,387 --> 00:17:16,387
internal

506
00:17:17,390 --> 00:17:20,390
audit report. The first item

507
00:17:20,393 --> 00:17:23,393
up is our light rail

508
00:17:23,396 --> 00:17:24,397
safety audit. I think travis king

509
00:17:24,397 --> 00:17:26,399
is going to join you. Does that sound

510
00:17:26,399 --> 00:17:27,400
right?

511
00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:29,400
>> yeah,

512
00:17:31,404 --> 00:17:32,405
he is.

513
00:17:32,405 --> 00:17:35,408
>> travis, we should have you introduce

514
00:17:35,408 --> 00:17:36,409
yourself too.

515
00:17:36,409 --> 00:17:37,410
>> good afternoon,

516
00:17:37,410 --> 00:17:41,100
travis king, director of safety and

517
00:17:41,414 --> 00:17:42,415
security.

518
00:17:42,415 --> 00:17:44,415
>> to quickly set

519
00:17:45,418 --> 00:17:47,387
the stage for what this audit is,

520
00:17:47,387 --> 00:17:48,388
this is an auditor

521
00:17:48,388 --> 00:17:50,390
that we internal audit perform on

522
00:17:50,390 --> 00:17:52,790
behalf of state safety

523
00:17:53,393 --> 00:17:55,393
oversight. They

524
00:17:56,396 --> 00:17:58,396
provide checklists that

525
00:17:59,399 --> 00:18:01,399
originally published

526
00:18:02,402 --> 00:18:04,404
by the fta to give us subjects

527
00:18:04,404 --> 00:18:08,604
and procedures that they want applied. They

528
00:18:10,410 --> 00:18:14,414
set the period of review. Also, unique to this

529
00:18:14,414 --> 00:18:17,414
audit is internal audit is

530
00:18:17,417 --> 00:18:19,817
strictly fact finders in

531
00:18:20,387 --> 00:18:22,787
this. We report the

532
00:18:23,390 --> 00:18:24,391
results

533
00:18:24,391 --> 00:18:26,393
and then the state safety oversight

534
00:18:26,393 --> 00:18:27,394
works with our

535
00:18:27,394 --> 00:18:29,396
safety management to determine what

536
00:18:29,396 --> 00:18:32,396
observations from the audit require

537
00:18:32,399 --> 00:18:33,400
corrective action

538
00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:35,402
and what that corrective action will

539
00:18:35,402 --> 00:18:37,402
be. This presentation

540
00:18:38,405 --> 00:18:41,405
will be more limited in

541
00:18:41,408 --> 00:18:44,408
the scope because of that

542
00:18:44,411 --> 00:18:45,412
reason. Internal audit

543
00:18:45,412 --> 00:18:47,414
does not issue recommendations for

544
00:18:47,414 --> 00:18:49,414
this audit the

545
00:18:50,417 --> 00:18:53,420
way that we do in a typical audit.

546
00:18:53,420 --> 00:18:55,388
this covers calendar year 2024 and

547
00:18:55,388 --> 00:18:56,389
then I won't read them all but those

548
00:18:56,389 --> 00:18:58,389
are the

549
00:19:00,393 --> 00:19:02,395
audit topics. A couple I will point

550
00:19:02,395 --> 00:19:05,398
out are the second bullet, transit

551
00:19:05,398 --> 00:19:08,398
agency safety plan updates. We

552
00:19:08,401 --> 00:19:10,403
did quite an extensive review of

553
00:19:10,403 --> 00:19:14,603
the task. That is the acronym. We

554
00:19:17,410 --> 00:19:19,410
reviewed the

555
00:19:22,415 --> 00:19:23,416
tasp. Halfway down, maintenance audits

556
00:19:23,416 --> 00:19:24,417
and inspections. We look

557
00:19:24,417 --> 00:19:26,419
at the way they handle preventative

558
00:19:26,419 --> 00:19:27,387
maintenance for our light rail vehicles

559
00:19:27,387 --> 00:19:29,387
and

560
00:19:29,389 --> 00:19:32,389
tested their compliance with those

561
00:19:32,392 --> 00:19:33,393
preventative

562
00:19:33,393 --> 00:19:35,395
maintenance schedules. We also looked

563
00:19:35,395 --> 00:19:37,395
at our

564
00:19:38,398 --> 00:19:40,798
security system. We looked

565
00:19:41,401 --> 00:19:44,404
at the security system plan. We

566
00:19:44,404 --> 00:19:47,407
reviewed that document and some other aspects

567
00:19:47,407 --> 00:19:49,407
of the

568
00:19:50,410 --> 00:19:51,411
security program.

569
00:19:51,411 --> 00:19:53,413
>> we completed this audit on june

570
00:19:53,413 --> 00:19:55,413
30, 2025 and then

571
00:19:56,416 --> 00:20:00,160
a report was issued to state

572
00:20:01,388 --> 00:20:02,389
safety oversight. I will turn it over to

573
00:20:02,389 --> 00:20:04,789
travis king to report

574
00:20:05,392 --> 00:20:08,392
on what next steps are.

575
00:20:08,395 --> 00:20:10,397
>> yeah. Thank you, mike.

576
00:20:10,397 --> 00:20:11,398
I would also like to express my gratitude

577
00:20:11,398 --> 00:20:13,398
to the

578
00:20:14,401 --> 00:20:15,402
internal audit team. They have been

579
00:20:15,402 --> 00:20:17,404
a great job in helping us establish

580
00:20:17,404 --> 00:20:20,407
best practices in helping us do

581
00:20:20,407 --> 00:20:22,409
this review. Essentially, as

582
00:20:22,409 --> 00:20:23,410
mike explained, this is a breakdown of

583
00:20:23,410 --> 00:20:25,410
the same

584
00:20:29,416 --> 00:20:31,418
review that the fta does

585
00:20:31,418 --> 00:20:32,419
of us when they come in and do their triannual. We split

586
00:20:32,419 --> 00:20:34,387
it up into three

587
00:20:34,387 --> 00:20:35,388
different bases and cover a three-year period. Next steps,

588
00:20:35,388 --> 00:20:38,388
now that we have the

589
00:20:38,391 --> 00:20:40,391
results

590
00:20:41,394 --> 00:20:42,395
from mike's team, we are working closely with

591
00:20:42,395 --> 00:20:43,396
the sso to

592
00:20:43,396 --> 00:20:46,996
make a determination. If there was

593
00:20:50,403 --> 00:20:52,403
a finding

594
00:20:53,406 --> 00:20:54,407
, those will follow our hazard

595
00:20:54,407 --> 00:20:56,409
management process plan and will be

596
00:20:56,409 --> 00:20:57,410
issued a corrective action plan that

597
00:20:57,410 --> 00:20:58,411
will be

598
00:20:58,411 --> 00:20:59,412
approved by the state safety oversight

599
00:20:59,412 --> 00:21:00,413
and will be worked through and then

600
00:21:00,413 --> 00:21:01,414
closed out with

601
00:21:01,414 --> 00:21:02,415
the approval and help from the state

602
00:21:02,415 --> 00:21:03,416
safety oversight. Any recommendations,

603
00:21:03,416 --> 00:21:04,417
which are essentially

604
00:21:04,417 --> 00:21:05,418
best practices, will be reviewed and

605
00:21:05,418 --> 00:21:07,818
analyzed to determine if

606
00:21:08,388 --> 00:21:09,389
a corrective action plan is needed

607
00:21:09,389 --> 00:21:11,389
or if

608
00:21:11,391 --> 00:21:13,391
a lower mitigation

609
00:21:14,394 --> 00:21:15,395
is appropriate in that case all with

610
00:21:15,395 --> 00:21:17,395
the

611
00:21:17,397 --> 00:21:19,797
assistance and approval through

612
00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:22,400
the sso.

613
00:21:23,403 --> 00:21:26,406
>> just making sure it is clear for

614
00:21:26,406 --> 00:21:28,408
the record, the sso means what?

615
00:21:28,408 --> 00:21:29,409
>> I apologize pick the sso stands

616
00:21:29,409 --> 00:21:31,409
for the state

617
00:21:32,412 --> 00:21:34,412
safety oversight which

618
00:21:34,414 --> 00:21:35,415
is overseen by udot, the current assigned

619
00:21:35,415 --> 00:21:38,415
state oversight is peter jaeger.

620
00:21:38,418 --> 00:21:40,418
>>

621
00:21:41,388 --> 00:21:42,389
okay. Questions?

622
00:21:42,389 --> 00:21:44,389
>>

623
00:21:44,391 --> 00:21:45,392
thank you.

624
00:21:45,392 --> 00:21:47,392
>> I do

625
00:21:47,394 --> 00:21:48,395
have one.

626
00:21:48,395 --> 00:21:50,395
>> you

627
00:21:50,397 --> 00:21:53,400
said you completed the audit --

628
00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:54,401
bob is your --sorry.

629
00:21:54,401 --> 00:21:56,401
>>

630
00:21:59,406 --> 00:22:01,408
you said that you completed the audit on

631
00:22:01,408 --> 00:22:02,409
june 30. Okay? That was a few months

632
00:22:02,409 --> 00:22:04,809
ago. Are some of

633
00:22:05,412 --> 00:22:07,412
these

634
00:22:08,415 --> 00:22:09,416
audits too large with not enough staff to

635
00:22:09,416 --> 00:22:10,417
be able to

636
00:22:10,417 --> 00:22:11,418
complete in a timely manner or do

637
00:22:11,418 --> 00:22:14,387
you feel that that is a timely manner?

638
00:22:14,387 --> 00:22:16,787
how would you weigh

639
00:22:17,390 --> 00:22:20,393
that out? I know that is an

640
00:22:20,393 --> 00:22:21,394
open question. But be honest.

641
00:22:21,394 --> 00:22:22,395
>> they

642
00:22:22,395 --> 00:22:23,396
are

643
00:22:23,396 --> 00:22:26,396
very manageable. Very manageable audits.

644
00:22:29,402 --> 00:22:30,403
a typical --audits are

645
00:22:30,403 --> 00:22:32,405
not a homogenous product. They are

646
00:22:32,405 --> 00:22:34,805
not one-size-fits-all but these

647
00:22:35,408 --> 00:22:38,408
probably take -- I would

648
00:22:38,411 --> 00:22:40,413
guess two months to

649
00:22:40,413 --> 00:22:41,414
complete. State safety oversight,

650
00:22:41,414 --> 00:22:43,414
correct me if

651
00:22:47,387 --> 00:22:48,388
I misspeak ,

652
00:22:48,388 --> 00:22:50,390
travis. State safety oversight once

653
00:22:50,390 --> 00:22:51,391
the results early enough in the year

654
00:22:51,391 --> 00:22:53,391
that they

655
00:22:53,393 --> 00:22:54,394
can have

656
00:22:54,394 --> 00:22:56,396
corrective action plans in place by

657
00:22:56,396 --> 00:22:58,398
january. At least that is

658
00:22:58,398 --> 00:22:59,399
my understanding. So, I did this audit

659
00:22:59,399 --> 00:23:01,399
myself. I

660
00:23:02,402 --> 00:23:04,802
started it in late

661
00:23:05,405 --> 00:23:07,405
march,

662
00:23:08,408 --> 00:23:11,408
early april, we completed it

663
00:23:11,411 --> 00:23:13,811
june 30. And, as I

664
00:23:14,414 --> 00:23:15,415
understand it, that is plenty of time for

665
00:23:15,415 --> 00:23:17,415
state

666
00:23:21,388 --> 00:23:23,388
safety oversight

667
00:23:23,390 --> 00:23:24,391
to develop the corrective action plans and

668
00:23:24,391 --> 00:23:25,392
then as far

669
00:23:25,392 --> 00:23:26,393
as resources on my side, that was

670
00:23:26,393 --> 00:23:27,394
another part of your question. No,

671
00:23:27,394 --> 00:23:29,394
it

672
00:23:29,396 --> 00:23:33,400
wasn't a burden. We had planned for

673
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,403
this and I was able to complete

674
00:23:36,403 --> 00:23:37,404
the audit as well as all of

675
00:23:37,404 --> 00:23:38,405
my other responsibilities during that time

676
00:23:38,405 --> 00:23:39,406
without any other issue.

677
00:23:39,406 --> 00:23:41,406
>> okay.

678
00:23:42,409 --> 00:23:44,809
>> good question. Thank you.

679
00:23:45,412 --> 00:23:47,412
>> with that, we

680
00:23:47,414 --> 00:23:51,140
will move to our special services

681
00:23:51,418 --> 00:23:53,418
operations

682
00:23:54,387 --> 00:23:55,388
audit. Mike, it looks like

683
00:23:55,388 --> 00:23:57,390
he will be joined by ryan taylor. Does

684
00:23:57,390 --> 00:23:58,391
that sound right?

685
00:23:58,391 --> 00:24:01,991
>> yeah. Ryan taylor and then also

686
00:24:02,395 --> 00:24:03,396
joanna gossen. I will let both of

687
00:24:03,396 --> 00:24:05,396
them introduce themselves

688
00:24:05,398 --> 00:24:06,399
for the record.

689
00:24:06,399 --> 00:24:07,400
>> hello, committee.

690
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:09,400
I am

691
00:24:12,405 --> 00:24:13,406
joanna goss, one of the senior

692
00:24:13,406 --> 00:24:14,407
internal auditors for the uta.

693
00:24:14,407 --> 00:24:15,408
>>

694
00:24:15,408 --> 00:24:16,409
I am ryan

695
00:24:16,409 --> 00:24:18,411
taylor, general manager of special services

696
00:24:18,411 --> 00:24:20,411
at

697
00:24:24,417 --> 00:24:25,418
uta.

698
00:24:25,418 --> 00:24:27,387
>> first, special services

699
00:24:27,387 --> 00:24:29,787
operations audit. Our scope

700
00:24:33,393 --> 00:24:34,394
was dedicated to

701
00:24:34,394 --> 00:24:36,396
the four different areas. First is the

702
00:24:36,396 --> 00:24:38,396
governance of special

703
00:24:38,398 --> 00:24:39,399
service operations. The second would be

704
00:24:39,399 --> 00:24:40,400
staff training

705
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:42,402
and oversight. Third would be the

706
00:24:42,402 --> 00:24:45,402
scheduling process that is utilized

707
00:24:45,405 --> 00:24:47,405
by special service

708
00:24:48,408 --> 00:24:50,408
operations in creating

709
00:24:51,411 --> 00:24:53,811
daily schedules for the

710
00:24:54,414 --> 00:24:55,415
routes

711
00:24:55,415 --> 00:24:57,417
and to fulfill our paratransit needs

712
00:24:57,417 --> 00:24:58,418
and then

713
00:24:58,418 --> 00:25:00,420
fourth would be the participation

714
00:25:00,420 --> 00:25:02,420
and

715
00:25:03,390 --> 00:25:04,391
risk management. Excuse me.

716
00:25:04,391 --> 00:25:05,392
I got the order wrong. It is on the

717
00:25:05,392 --> 00:25:06,393
slide there. Regardless, that was

718
00:25:06,393 --> 00:25:08,393
the

719
00:25:09,396 --> 00:25:11,396
scope of this

720
00:25:12,399 --> 00:25:15,402
audit. Hour period of review was

721
00:25:15,402 --> 00:25:18,402
january 2022 to february of this

722
00:25:18,405 --> 00:25:20,405
year, 2025. Any questions

723
00:25:24,411 --> 00:25:26,411
so far?

724
00:25:27,414 --> 00:25:29,414
>>

725
00:25:30,417 --> 00:25:33,417
all right. For our recommendations,

726
00:25:33,420 --> 00:25:36,389
the first and that we

727
00:25:36,389 --> 00:25:38,391
ended up doing was reviewing our

728
00:25:38,391 --> 00:25:39,392
safety-related standard operating

729
00:25:39,392 --> 00:25:41,392
procedures for special

730
00:25:42,395 --> 00:25:44,795
services and found that

731
00:25:45,398 --> 00:25:47,798
many had not been

732
00:25:48,401 --> 00:25:50,401
completed within

733
00:25:50,403 --> 00:25:54,407
a five-year timeframe so we had made the

734
00:25:54,407 --> 00:25:55,408
recommendation that two

735
00:25:55,408 --> 00:25:56,409
special service operations, to work

736
00:25:56,409 --> 00:25:59,412
with our safety team to a date these

737
00:25:59,412 --> 00:26:00,413
standards of procedures so that we

738
00:26:00,413 --> 00:26:02,413
could have effective

739
00:26:03,416 --> 00:26:05,816
and relevant standards of

740
00:26:06,419 --> 00:26:08,419
siege are.

741
00:26:09,389 --> 00:26:11,389
any questions regarding

742
00:26:12,392 --> 00:26:14,392
the

743
00:26:15,395 --> 00:26:16,396
sop?

744
00:26:16,396 --> 00:26:18,398
>> may be looking to

745
00:26:18,398 --> 00:26:20,400
ryan for a response and how that

746
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:21,401
gets accomplished?

747
00:26:21,401 --> 00:26:22,402
>> we have set

748
00:26:22,402 --> 00:26:24,402
up

749
00:26:24,404 --> 00:26:26,406
a working group to review all of

750
00:26:26,406 --> 00:26:27,407
our sop's, concentrating first and

751
00:26:27,407 --> 00:26:28,408
foremost on the

752
00:26:28,408 --> 00:26:30,410
safety sop's which have been identified.

753
00:26:30,410 --> 00:26:32,410
they are doing

754
00:26:33,413 --> 00:26:36,413
that work currently and we

755
00:26:39,419 --> 00:26:41,388
are on

756
00:26:41,388 --> 00:26:42,389
schedule to have draft revisions submitted

757
00:26:42,389 --> 00:26:43,390
by november 1 which

758
00:26:43,390 --> 00:26:45,392
will review and we should have those

759
00:26:45,392 --> 00:26:46,393
completed by december 1 of this year.

760
00:26:46,393 --> 00:26:47,394
>>

761
00:26:47,394 --> 00:26:48,395
maybe

762
00:26:48,395 --> 00:26:49,396
it is too early to tell but are you

763
00:26:49,396 --> 00:26:51,398
looking at significant changes

764
00:26:51,398 --> 00:26:53,398
or refinements

765
00:26:54,401 --> 00:26:55,402
based on

766
00:26:55,402 --> 00:26:56,403
more current guidance?

767
00:26:56,403 --> 00:26:57,404
>> many of

768
00:26:57,404 --> 00:26:58,405
the processes are current. They may

769
00:26:58,405 --> 00:26:59,406
be

770
00:26:59,406 --> 00:27:00,407
old. We haven't deviated from that

771
00:27:00,407 --> 00:27:02,407
work over

772
00:27:03,410 --> 00:27:04,411
the

773
00:27:04,411 --> 00:27:06,413
past decade. The regulations for paratransit

774
00:27:06,413 --> 00:27:08,415
service has not really

775
00:27:08,415 --> 00:27:09,416
changed significantly. We are finding

776
00:27:09,416 --> 00:27:11,416
areas where

777
00:27:12,419 --> 00:27:13,420
we can tidy

778
00:27:13,420 --> 00:27:15,388
some of those sop's up and make some

779
00:27:15,388 --> 00:27:18,388
of those current but we

780
00:27:18,391 --> 00:27:21,394
don't see any major revisions of

781
00:27:21,394 --> 00:27:22,395
those.

782
00:27:22,395 --> 00:27:24,395
>> any

783
00:27:24,397 --> 00:27:26,397
further questions? Our

784
00:27:30,403 --> 00:27:31,404
second recommendation

785
00:27:31,404 --> 00:27:33,406
that we came up with after reviewing

786
00:27:33,406 --> 00:27:36,409
off the job descriptions held within

787
00:27:36,409 --> 00:27:38,409
special

788
00:27:38,411 --> 00:27:39,412
service operations was that some of

789
00:27:39,412 --> 00:27:42,412
these job descriptions had not

790
00:27:42,415 --> 00:27:46,150
been up dated in at least

791
00:27:47,387 --> 00:27:48,388
five years. We recommended that special

792
00:27:48,388 --> 00:27:51,388
service operations review these with

793
00:27:51,391 --> 00:27:53,393
human resources or our

794
00:27:53,393 --> 00:27:54,394
people office in order to update these

795
00:27:54,394 --> 00:27:56,394
the way that

796
00:27:57,397 --> 00:27:59,397
made them relevant

797
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:02,400
to 2025 and

798
00:28:06,406 --> 00:28:07,407
moving forward. Then, the list,

799
00:28:07,407 --> 00:28:09,409
obviously the list of the job descriptions

800
00:28:09,409 --> 00:28:10,410
are there on the slide.

801
00:28:10,410 --> 00:28:12,410
>> we

802
00:28:12,412 --> 00:28:14,412
also agree with

803
00:28:18,418 --> 00:28:20,418
this finding

804
00:28:20,420 --> 00:28:21,388
and have tasked our managers for those respective

805
00:28:21,388 --> 00:28:22,389
job descriptions, to go through

806
00:28:22,389 --> 00:28:24,391
those. We have been doing that on

807
00:28:24,391 --> 00:28:25,392
a case-by-case basis so when a job

808
00:28:25,392 --> 00:28:26,393
opening happens, typically the hiring

809
00:28:26,393 --> 00:28:27,394
manager will at least review that

810
00:28:27,394 --> 00:28:28,395
to see if there

811
00:28:28,395 --> 00:28:30,397
is anything that has had any major

812
00:28:30,397 --> 00:28:31,398
changes but we are going through and

813
00:28:31,398 --> 00:28:32,399
redlining

814
00:28:32,399 --> 00:28:33,400
any of those to update those and our

815
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,800
target date for completion

816
00:28:36,403 --> 00:28:38,403
is to have

817
00:28:39,406 --> 00:28:40,407
all the description reviewed

818
00:28:40,407 --> 00:28:42,409
by january 1 and complete those updates

819
00:28:42,409 --> 00:28:44,409
by

820
00:28:45,412 --> 00:28:46,413
february 15.

821
00:28:46,413 --> 00:28:47,414
>> any

822
00:28:47,414 --> 00:28:48,415
questions? Jeff?

823
00:28:48,415 --> 00:28:49,416
>> it sounds like it

824
00:28:49,416 --> 00:28:51,416
was more

825
00:28:53,420 --> 00:28:54,387
as needed and this way you are getting

826
00:28:54,387 --> 00:28:56,389
a full look and

827
00:28:56,389 --> 00:28:57,390
trying to make sure these are up to date.

828
00:28:57,390 --> 00:28:58,391
>>

829
00:28:58,391 --> 00:28:59,392
rate.

830
00:28:59,392 --> 00:29:00,393
>> sounds great.

831
00:29:00,393 --> 00:29:01,394
>> it probably only helps you later

832
00:29:01,394 --> 00:29:02,395
on when

833
00:29:02,395 --> 00:29:03,396
you go to host if you are not having to

834
00:29:03,396 --> 00:29:05,396
do it.

835
00:29:06,399 --> 00:29:08,399
>> absolutely.

836
00:29:08,401 --> 00:29:09,402
>> moving onto the next slide, we

837
00:29:09,402 --> 00:29:11,404
reviewed some data that special

838
00:29:11,404 --> 00:29:12,405
services collects in order to create

839
00:29:12,405 --> 00:29:14,405
goals and

840
00:29:15,408 --> 00:29:17,408
to maintain compliance

841
00:29:18,411 --> 00:29:20,811
with fta regulations. Within

842
00:29:21,414 --> 00:29:23,414
this data,

843
00:29:23,416 --> 00:29:24,417
it is noteworthy that even with an

844
00:29:24,417 --> 00:29:26,417
increase in ridership

845
00:29:27,420 --> 00:29:28,388
throughout the reporting

846
00:29:28,388 --> 00:29:30,390
period, special services has supported

847
00:29:30,390 --> 00:29:32,392
a higher rate of

848
00:29:32,392 --> 00:29:34,792
on-time performance for operators

849
00:29:36,396 --> 00:29:37,397
and maintain low rates for missed trips

850
00:29:37,397 --> 00:29:39,397
and trips

851
00:29:39,399 --> 00:29:41,799
taken over 90 minutes, which

852
00:29:42,402 --> 00:29:45,405
is commendable. Some of the data that we reviewed

853
00:29:45,405 --> 00:29:47,405
suggested that average

854
00:29:48,408 --> 00:29:49,409
hold times for customers calling in

855
00:29:49,409 --> 00:29:51,409
to create a

856
00:29:51,411 --> 00:29:53,411
trip had increased

857
00:29:57,417 --> 00:29:59,817
and that --there is

858
00:30:00,420 --> 00:30:01,388
an increase in calls that were over

859
00:30:01,388 --> 00:30:03,388
two

860
00:30:03,390 --> 00:30:05,392
minutes. We have made the

861
00:30:05,392 --> 00:30:06,393
recommendation that management reevaluate staffing

862
00:30:06,393 --> 00:30:08,393
needs

863
00:30:09,396 --> 00:30:11,396
to assess if

864
00:30:12,399 --> 00:30:13,400
increased staff would ensure average

865
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:15,800
call times and then

866
00:30:18,405 --> 00:30:20,405
also review

867
00:30:21,408 --> 00:30:23,410
the call time in general over two minutes

868
00:30:23,410 --> 00:30:24,411
to see if there were needs of re-addressing

869
00:30:24,411 --> 00:30:27,414
those goals or looking into that

870
00:30:27,414 --> 00:30:28,415
as well.

871
00:30:28,415 --> 00:30:29,416
>> do all scheduling have

872
00:30:29,416 --> 00:30:30,417
to be

873
00:30:30,417 --> 00:30:32,417
done through

874
00:30:33,420 --> 00:30:35,420
an operator?

875
00:30:36,389 --> 00:30:38,391
is there an option

876
00:30:38,391 --> 00:30:39,392
or something where they can schedule

877
00:30:39,392 --> 00:30:40,393
something --

878
00:30:40,393 --> 00:30:41,394
>> really, all calls and

879
00:30:41,394 --> 00:30:42,395
reservations go through our call center.

880
00:30:42,395 --> 00:30:43,396
that is correct. We are looking at

881
00:30:43,396 --> 00:30:44,397
a technology solution for

882
00:30:44,397 --> 00:30:45,398
a self-service portal that we would

883
00:30:45,398 --> 00:30:47,398
hope could come

884
00:30:48,401 --> 00:30:50,401
online next year.

885
00:30:51,404 --> 00:30:54,407
>> okay.'s tee we do have

886
00:30:54,407 --> 00:30:57,410
a small call center of nine reservation

887
00:30:57,410 --> 00:31:00,410
agents. It is our obligation

888
00:31:00,413 --> 00:31:02,813
to that fta and

889
00:31:03,416 --> 00:31:05,418
all of the regulations

890
00:31:05,418 --> 00:31:06,419
regarding ada and paratransit that

891
00:31:06,419 --> 00:31:08,388
we can take

892
00:31:08,388 --> 00:31:13,188
any trip reservations up to the day before

893
00:31:15,395 --> 00:31:17,395
the service

894
00:31:21,401 --> 00:31:22,402
. So, that operates 24/7. For example,

895
00:31:22,402 --> 00:31:24,404
when we are closed on christmas day,

896
00:31:24,404 --> 00:31:25,405
we need to be able to take reservations

897
00:31:25,405 --> 00:31:26,406
for

898
00:31:26,406 --> 00:31:27,407
the day after so we have staff available

899
00:31:27,407 --> 00:31:29,409
for that. During this time, we

900
00:31:29,409 --> 00:31:30,410
did have some turnover in that department and

901
00:31:30,410 --> 00:31:32,412
we were short a

902
00:31:32,412 --> 00:31:35,415
few individuals and we have hired

903
00:31:35,415 --> 00:31:36,416
staff there who are in training. Because of the

904
00:31:36,416 --> 00:31:38,416
complexity of looking

905
00:31:39,419 --> 00:31:41,388
those

906
00:31:41,388 --> 00:31:42,389
trips, we do have conditions of eligibility

907
00:31:42,389 --> 00:31:45,392
for a lot of our individuals. It

908
00:31:45,392 --> 00:31:48,392
does take a good amount

909
00:31:48,395 --> 00:31:51,395
of time for someone to

910
00:31:51,398 --> 00:31:52,399
become proficient in that job and

911
00:31:52,399 --> 00:31:53,400
we are

912
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:54,401
in the process of training those individuals

913
00:31:54,401 --> 00:31:57,401
and also working with the

914
00:31:57,404 --> 00:31:59,804
business analysts, ensuring that

915
00:32:02,409 --> 00:32:03,410
our data on those calls is correct

916
00:32:03,410 --> 00:32:06,413
on the hold times to make

917
00:32:06,413 --> 00:32:10,130
sure that we are in compliance

918
00:32:10,417 --> 00:32:11,418
with

919
00:32:11,418 --> 00:32:12,419
that.

920
00:32:12,419 --> 00:32:13,420
>> is there -- maybe you answered the question

921
00:32:13,420 --> 00:32:15,388
-- is there a way for customer service

922
00:32:15,388 --> 00:32:17,390
to take rollover calls for you or

923
00:32:17,390 --> 00:32:18,391
not really?

924
00:32:18,391 --> 00:32:19,392
>> no. With the complexity

925
00:32:19,392 --> 00:32:22,392
of the trips, it is

926
00:32:22,395 --> 00:32:25,395
very specific for those ada

927
00:32:28,401 --> 00:32:30,401
paratransit trips.

928
00:32:31,404 --> 00:32:32,405
it is specific

929
00:32:32,405 --> 00:32:33,406
to each individual booking that.

930
00:32:33,406 --> 00:32:34,407
>>

931
00:32:34,407 --> 00:32:35,408
when you are fully staffed, do you meet the

932
00:32:35,408 --> 00:32:36,409
thresholds?

933
00:32:36,409 --> 00:32:37,410
>> whatever our commitment is.

934
00:32:37,410 --> 00:32:39,410
>> it ebbs

935
00:32:40,413 --> 00:32:42,415
and flows. When you have a staff

936
00:32:42,415 --> 00:32:44,417
of only nine reservationists and four

937
00:32:44,417 --> 00:32:45,418
leader reservationists and you are

938
00:32:45,418 --> 00:32:46,419
open basically business hours seven

939
00:32:46,419 --> 00:32:48,419
days

940
00:32:49,389 --> 00:32:50,390
a

941
00:32:50,390 --> 00:32:52,392
week, you are trying to manage those calls

942
00:32:52,392 --> 00:32:55,392
when you have people who

943
00:32:55,395 --> 00:32:56,396
call out sick or

944
00:32:56,396 --> 00:32:58,398
are on vacation and you have limited

945
00:32:58,398 --> 00:32:59,399
staff, that also limits

946
00:32:59,399 --> 00:33:01,401
our availability. Our lead schedulers who

947
00:33:01,401 --> 00:33:03,401
take escalated calls

948
00:33:04,404 --> 00:33:06,406
and do a lot of

949
00:33:06,406 --> 00:33:07,407
the training, they jump in on the

950
00:33:07,407 --> 00:33:10,407
call too. They are actively

951
00:33:10,410 --> 00:33:11,411
monitoring

952
00:33:11,411 --> 00:33:13,413
that to see how many calls we have on

953
00:33:13,413 --> 00:33:14,414
the q and can

954
00:33:14,414 --> 00:33:16,416
jump in and mitigate that when they see that

955
00:33:16,416 --> 00:33:18,416
going too

956
00:33:19,419 --> 00:33:20,420
long.

957
00:33:20,420 --> 00:33:22,389
>> I am sure you are

958
00:33:22,389 --> 00:33:25,389
mindful of this. When I

959
00:33:25,392 --> 00:33:26,393
hear automation, there tends to be a

960
00:33:26,393 --> 00:33:29,993
little less of the human characteristics

961
00:33:31,398 --> 00:33:33,400
of that and I would think the

962
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:34,401
clientele that take advantage of this,

963
00:33:34,401 --> 00:33:36,401
there is

964
00:33:37,404 --> 00:33:40,407
probably an enhanced need to make

965
00:33:40,407 --> 00:33:41,408
sure they feel like they

966
00:33:41,408 --> 00:33:43,410
are connecting. I don't know if any

967
00:33:43,410 --> 00:33:44,411
of you had been on the

968
00:33:44,411 --> 00:33:46,413
other end of an automated call but

969
00:33:46,413 --> 00:33:47,414
sometimes it can become a

970
00:33:47,414 --> 00:33:49,416
little frustrating. I am sure you

971
00:33:49,416 --> 00:33:51,416
are being mindful

972
00:33:51,418 --> 00:33:54,421
of that and whatever system you move

973
00:33:54,421 --> 00:33:58,391
forward with, it will take into account that

974
00:33:58,391 --> 00:33:59,392
need to make sure

975
00:33:59,392 --> 00:34:01,394
that there is still the ability to

976
00:34:01,394 --> 00:34:03,394
communicate

977
00:34:03,396 --> 00:34:04,397
directly if needed.

978
00:34:04,397 --> 00:34:05,398
>> absolutely.

979
00:34:05,398 --> 00:34:07,400
we will always make

980
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:10,400
sure that that is available

981
00:34:10,403 --> 00:34:11,404
for individuals. A little bit of background

982
00:34:11,404 --> 00:34:13,406
on the system we are looking at. It

983
00:34:13,406 --> 00:34:14,407
is a web based portal where

984
00:34:14,407 --> 00:34:16,409
an individual can log on to an internet

985
00:34:16,409 --> 00:34:18,411
site. They will have to have

986
00:34:18,411 --> 00:34:19,412
their credentials and they can only

987
00:34:19,412 --> 00:34:20,413
book trips for

988
00:34:20,413 --> 00:34:24,613
themselves or a caregiver can book it

989
00:34:26,419 --> 00:34:27,420
for them. Then, that still has to

990
00:34:27,420 --> 00:34:28,388
be evaluated. That will actually shorten

991
00:34:28,388 --> 00:34:29,389
the process

992
00:34:29,389 --> 00:34:31,391
for many people and they can do it

993
00:34:31,391 --> 00:34:33,391
on their

994
00:34:34,394 --> 00:34:37,394
own time. We are excited

995
00:34:37,397 --> 00:34:38,398
about that, to have it as a

996
00:34:38,398 --> 00:34:39,399
elementary product.

997
00:34:39,399 --> 00:34:40,400
>> some of the

998
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:41,401
groundwork can be pre-done so when

999
00:34:41,401 --> 00:34:43,403
they get to the queue or that , it

1000
00:34:43,403 --> 00:34:44,404
helps everybody.

1001
00:34:44,404 --> 00:34:46,404
>>

1002
00:34:46,406 --> 00:34:48,406
correct.

1003
00:34:49,409 --> 00:34:51,809
>> thanks. >> okay. For our

1004
00:34:53,413 --> 00:34:55,415
next recommendation, actually moves

1005
00:34:55,415 --> 00:34:57,415
right into

1006
00:34:58,418 --> 00:34:59,419
the

1007
00:34:59,419 --> 00:35:02,419
scheduling. From my perspective as

1008
00:35:03,390 --> 00:35:04,391
an auditor, the scheduling process

1009
00:35:04,391 --> 00:35:06,391
for special

1010
00:35:06,393 --> 00:35:07,394
service operations, to ensure that

1011
00:35:07,394 --> 00:35:08,395
we are

1012
00:35:08,395 --> 00:35:10,397
fulfilling our ridership needs is incredibly

1013
00:35:10,397 --> 00:35:12,397
dynamic. We are

1014
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:16,400
dealing with a diverse group

1015
00:35:19,406 --> 00:35:20,407
of individuals , calling in, requiring

1016
00:35:20,407 --> 00:35:22,409
operation supervisors and scheduling

1017
00:35:22,409 --> 00:35:23,410
staff to quickly review

1018
00:35:23,410 --> 00:35:25,412
incoming information. That is being

1019
00:35:25,412 --> 00:35:28,412
bombarded at them throughout the

1020
00:35:28,415 --> 00:35:30,417
day. And, the need to plan

1021
00:35:30,417 --> 00:35:34,170
these routes every single day 48 hours

1022
00:35:36,389 --> 00:35:38,391
in advance in a way that best serves our customers and also

1023
00:35:38,391 --> 00:35:40,393
balances the workload of available operators

1024
00:35:40,393 --> 00:35:42,793
and available routes within

1025
00:35:43,396 --> 00:35:46,396
the system. In looking at

1026
00:35:49,402 --> 00:35:52,405
how dynamic this process is and

1027
00:35:52,405 --> 00:35:54,407
how well the team is working on

1028
00:35:54,407 --> 00:35:55,408
managing that with all of the different

1029
00:35:55,408 --> 00:35:57,408
needs,

1030
00:36:00,413 --> 00:36:01,414
we suggest --we recommend that management

1031
00:36:01,414 --> 00:36:02,415
should formalize the procedure as

1032
00:36:02,415 --> 00:36:03,416
a standard operating procedure rather

1033
00:36:03,416 --> 00:36:04,417
than rely on the wonderful communication

1034
00:36:04,417 --> 00:36:06,417
on the

1035
00:36:10,390 --> 00:36:13,393
teams there. A way that patient

1036
00:36:13,393 --> 00:36:15,393
won't

1037
00:36:16,396 --> 00:36:18,396
be lost

1038
00:36:18,398 --> 00:36:19,399
in the case that everyone wins the lottery

1039
00:36:19,399 --> 00:36:20,400
and decides to

1040
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:21,401
walk away. A recommendation here would

1041
00:36:21,401 --> 00:36:22,402
be for management to formalize the

1042
00:36:22,402 --> 00:36:24,402
scheduling process and

1043
00:36:25,405 --> 00:36:27,405
the standard of

1044
00:36:27,407 --> 00:36:28,408
procedure document.

1045
00:36:28,408 --> 00:36:30,410
>> we also concur with

1046
00:36:30,410 --> 00:36:34,414
that finding. I think that one of

1047
00:36:34,414 --> 00:36:37,414
our opportunities is in our

1048
00:36:37,417 --> 00:36:39,417
formal documentation and

1049
00:36:40,420 --> 00:36:41,388
I think that is probably an area that needs the

1050
00:36:41,388 --> 00:36:43,388
most amount

1051
00:36:43,390 --> 00:36:46,390
of work. We have all

1052
00:36:46,393 --> 00:36:47,394
you

1053
00:36:47,394 --> 00:36:48,395
formulated --also related a working

1054
00:36:48,395 --> 00:36:49,396
group and they are currently meeting

1055
00:36:49,396 --> 00:36:51,396
and working

1056
00:36:52,399 --> 00:36:53,400
on this process and

1057
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:57,000
the target date for completion is

1058
00:37:01,408 --> 00:37:02,409
april 1.

1059
00:37:02,409 --> 00:37:04,409
>> then, for

1060
00:37:07,414 --> 00:37:08,415
our last --I'm

1061
00:37:08,415 --> 00:37:09,416
sorry. Were there any further questions?

1062
00:37:09,416 --> 00:37:10,417
>>

1063
00:37:10,417 --> 00:37:11,418
I don't think so.

1064
00:37:11,418 --> 00:37:12,419
>> for our last recommendation,

1065
00:37:12,419 --> 00:37:13,420
we

1066
00:37:13,420 --> 00:37:14,421
reviewed our cdl licensure of employees

1067
00:37:14,421 --> 00:37:16,389
and

1068
00:37:16,389 --> 00:37:21,189
the system in which we are keeping those

1069
00:37:21,394 --> 00:37:22,395
records here and employee license

1070
00:37:22,395 --> 00:37:24,397
records that are entered

1071
00:37:24,397 --> 00:37:25,398
into udot's system, which is the system

1072
00:37:25,398 --> 00:37:27,398
we

1073
00:37:28,401 --> 00:37:30,403
rely on with our

1074
00:37:30,403 --> 00:37:33,403
acquisition team, with our people

1075
00:37:33,406 --> 00:37:34,407
office team, the records are inaccessible

1076
00:37:34,407 --> 00:37:37,407
or not as accessible to

1077
00:37:39,412 --> 00:37:40,413
operations services --service units,

1078
00:37:40,413 --> 00:37:42,413
excuse me.

1079
00:37:43,416 --> 00:37:44,417
that

1080
00:37:44,417 --> 00:37:46,419
prohibits records and monitoring and

1081
00:37:46,419 --> 00:37:48,819
a proactive notification to

1082
00:37:49,389 --> 00:37:51,789
employees when their licensing

1083
00:37:52,392 --> 00:37:55,392
is expiring. We make the

1084
00:37:57,397 --> 00:37:58,398
recommendation here that in order for us

1085
00:37:58,398 --> 00:38:00,398
to be

1086
00:38:01,401 --> 00:38:02,402
more secure in

1087
00:38:02,402 --> 00:38:06,602
these records that we come up with

1088
00:38:07,407 --> 00:38:08,408
a way so that our talent

1089
00:38:08,408 --> 00:38:10,410
acquisition and our people office

1090
00:38:10,410 --> 00:38:11,411
can share

1091
00:38:11,411 --> 00:38:14,411
these records with the operations

1092
00:38:16,416 --> 00:38:17,417
business units.

1093
00:38:17,417 --> 00:38:19,419
>> I can't imagine this

1094
00:38:19,419 --> 00:38:21,388
is limited to special services,

1095
00:38:21,388 --> 00:38:22,389
though, right? How do we check the

1096
00:38:22,389 --> 00:38:23,390
rest of our cdl?

1097
00:38:23,390 --> 00:38:24,391
>> I would

1098
00:38:24,391 --> 00:38:25,392
have to bring up andrea's pullman

1099
00:38:25,392 --> 00:38:28,392
to see how we are

1100
00:38:28,395 --> 00:38:30,395
doing that.

1101
00:38:31,398 --> 00:38:33,398
>> are you getting

1102
00:38:34,401 --> 00:38:35,402
expired cdl? You would probably have

1103
00:38:35,402 --> 00:38:37,402
to

1104
00:38:37,404 --> 00:38:39,804
pull that down toward

1105
00:38:40,407 --> 00:38:41,408
you too.

1106
00:38:41,408 --> 00:38:42,409
>>

1107
00:38:42,409 --> 00:38:43,410
the light isn't on. We received routine

1108
00:38:43,410 --> 00:38:45,410
reports from

1109
00:38:46,413 --> 00:38:48,413
the people

1110
00:38:49,416 --> 00:38:50,417
office and

1111
00:38:50,417 --> 00:38:51,418
our senior office specialists review

1112
00:38:51,418 --> 00:38:52,419
those. They schedule appointments

1113
00:38:52,419 --> 00:38:53,420
ahead of time for

1114
00:38:53,420 --> 00:38:55,388
cdl holders. I think the challenge

1115
00:38:55,388 --> 00:38:57,388
comes when

1116
00:38:58,391 --> 00:38:59,392
things happen in between those reporting

1117
00:38:59,392 --> 00:39:01,392
periods

1118
00:39:01,394 --> 00:39:03,394
but

1119
00:39:04,397 --> 00:39:05,398
we do monitor. We schedule these

1120
00:39:05,398 --> 00:39:07,400
appointments for our employees and we

1121
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:09,402
do a good job at it but

1122
00:39:09,402 --> 00:39:10,403
there are sometimes gaps because we

1123
00:39:10,403 --> 00:39:13,403
don't have access in real-time

1124
00:39:13,406 --> 00:39:15,406
to

1125
00:39:16,409 --> 00:39:18,409
the information.

1126
00:39:19,412 --> 00:39:20,413
>> so, it sounds like it is not just

1127
00:39:20,413 --> 00:39:21,414
a special services challenge.

1128
00:39:21,414 --> 00:39:22,415
>> that

1129
00:39:22,415 --> 00:39:23,416
is across all services.

1130
00:39:23,416 --> 00:39:24,417
>> I wonder if

1131
00:39:24,417 --> 00:39:25,418
udot

1132
00:39:25,418 --> 00:39:27,418
or somebody would

1133
00:39:28,388 --> 00:39:29,389
help share real-time access.

1134
00:39:29,389 --> 00:39:31,389
>> we will

1135
00:39:31,391 --> 00:39:33,791
work with a team.

1136
00:39:34,394 --> 00:39:36,394
>> anyway. >> on this

1137
00:39:39,399 --> 00:39:40,400
particular one, the lead, they have

1138
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:41,401
an action plan put in place

1139
00:39:41,401 --> 00:39:42,402
for that where each of the service

1140
00:39:42,402 --> 00:39:43,403
units will provide subject matter

1141
00:39:43,403 --> 00:39:45,403
experts

1142
00:39:45,405 --> 00:39:46,406
to assist on our sides to help them

1143
00:39:46,406 --> 00:39:48,406
craft

1144
00:39:48,408 --> 00:39:49,409
a solution.

1145
00:39:49,409 --> 00:39:51,409
>> okay. Anything else?

1146
00:39:52,412 --> 00:39:54,414
>> absolutely. This concludes --unless

1147
00:39:54,414 --> 00:39:55,415
there are other questions from the

1148
00:39:55,415 --> 00:39:56,416
committee.

1149
00:39:56,416 --> 00:39:58,416
>> I don't see

1150
00:39:58,418 --> 00:39:59,419
any.

1151
00:39:59,419 --> 00:40:00,420
>>

1152
00:40:00,420 --> 00:40:01,421
thank you.

1153
00:40:01,421 --> 00:40:02,389
>> ryan, thanks for those

1154
00:40:02,389 --> 00:40:04,391
goals and I look forward to

1155
00:40:04,391 --> 00:40:05,392
the follow-up is.

1156
00:40:05,392 --> 00:40:07,392
>> purchase card

1157
00:40:07,394 --> 00:40:09,394
program

1158
00:40:10,397 --> 00:40:12,397
audit.

1159
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:15,400
welcome. Welcome our

1160
00:40:16,403 --> 00:40:17,404
colleague, beth. Welcome. Mike, I

1161
00:40:17,404 --> 00:40:19,404
guess viola

1162
00:40:19,406 --> 00:40:21,406
miller ,

1163
00:40:22,409 --> 00:40:25,409
you will be joined by

1164
00:40:25,412 --> 00:40:27,412
anybody else?

1165
00:40:27,414 --> 00:40:28,415
>> yeah, yeah. We also have luke barber,

1166
00:40:28,415 --> 00:40:30,417
one of our senior internal

1167
00:40:30,417 --> 00:40:31,418
auditors.

1168
00:40:31,418 --> 00:40:32,419
>> okay. Great. We will

1169
00:40:32,419 --> 00:40:34,419
turn the

1170
00:40:34,421 --> 00:40:35,388
time to you.

1171
00:40:35,388 --> 00:40:37,390
>> we will go ahead and

1172
00:40:37,390 --> 00:40:38,391
take it.

1173
00:40:38,391 --> 00:40:40,391
>> luke barber, senior

1174
00:40:40,393 --> 00:40:41,394
internal auditor. We have the purchase

1175
00:40:41,394 --> 00:40:43,394
card

1176
00:40:44,397 --> 00:40:46,397
program audit. It

1177
00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:50,403
took place mid part of the year

1178
00:40:50,403 --> 00:40:52,403
and ended

1179
00:40:53,406 --> 00:40:54,407
back in -- well, right in

1180
00:40:54,407 --> 00:40:56,409
august. We got the report locked out.

1181
00:40:56,409 --> 00:40:58,809
it is a pretty

1182
00:40:59,412 --> 00:41:01,412
big program. The

1183
00:41:01,414 --> 00:41:02,415
audit scope was from that period of

1184
00:41:02,415 --> 00:41:04,415
september

1185
00:41:05,418 --> 00:41:07,418
1, 2021 through february

1186
00:41:08,388 --> 00:41:10,388
28,

1187
00:41:11,391 --> 00:41:13,791
2025. Just to address the

1188
00:41:14,394 --> 00:41:16,396
dates there, that is when we switched the

1189
00:41:16,396 --> 00:41:19,399
uta to using u.s. Bank as our card management

1190
00:41:19,399 --> 00:41:20,400
bank. We recorded the duration of

1191
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:22,400
that and

1192
00:41:23,403 --> 00:41:25,405
the audit topics were

1193
00:41:25,405 --> 00:41:28,408
the governance over the program with

1194
00:41:28,408 --> 00:41:32,412
a compliance with any laws and within

1195
00:41:32,412 --> 00:41:34,414
our own sop's. Various

1196
00:41:34,414 --> 00:41:35,415
transaction testing, we looked at

1197
00:41:35,415 --> 00:41:37,415
the

1198
00:41:38,418 --> 00:41:40,418
different

1199
00:41:41,421 --> 00:41:43,390
transactions and some analytics as

1200
00:41:43,390 --> 00:41:44,391
far as how certain transactions were

1201
00:41:44,391 --> 00:41:47,394
handled. The scope also included a

1202
00:41:47,394 --> 00:41:48,395
risk

1203
00:41:48,395 --> 00:41:51,395
management portion. We don't have

1204
00:41:52,399 --> 00:41:53,400
a slide.

1205
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:54,401
>> sorry, that should say

1206
00:41:54,401 --> 00:41:56,401
the

1207
00:41:56,403 --> 00:41:58,405
scope did not include

1208
00:41:58,405 --> 00:41:59,406
risk management.

1209
00:41:59,406 --> 00:42:01,406
>> we don't have

1210
00:42:02,409 --> 00:42:04,809
a slide addressing this

1211
00:42:05,412 --> 00:42:06,413
but our program is quite large,

1212
00:42:06,413 --> 00:42:10,613
something to bear in mind. We have

1213
00:42:11,418 --> 00:42:12,419
approximately

1214
00:42:12,419 --> 00:42:13,420
500 p cards within our system. They

1215
00:42:13,420 --> 00:42:14,421
are used for smaller purchases that

1216
00:42:14,421 --> 00:42:16,421
don't require direct

1217
00:42:17,390 --> 00:42:19,390
oversight from

1218
00:42:19,392 --> 00:42:20,393
accounts payable. There is about 1

1219
00:42:20,393 --> 00:42:21,394
million to 1.2

1220
00:42:21,394 --> 00:42:23,396
million in spending per month that

1221
00:42:23,396 --> 00:42:24,397
goes through that and if we did

1222
00:42:24,397 --> 00:42:26,399
away with the program that would all

1223
00:42:26,399 --> 00:42:28,399
fall on ap

1224
00:42:29,402 --> 00:42:31,404
and I am sure that would be a

1225
00:42:31,404 --> 00:42:32,405
big burden. With that being said,

1226
00:42:32,405 --> 00:42:34,405
we will

1227
00:42:35,408 --> 00:42:36,409
jump in --

1228
00:42:36,409 --> 00:42:39,412
>> do you have a total number

1229
00:42:39,412 --> 00:42:41,414
of annual p card transactions? Do you

1230
00:42:41,414 --> 00:42:43,414
have

1231
00:42:44,417 --> 00:42:45,418
that report?

1232
00:42:45,418 --> 00:42:46,419
>> I

1233
00:42:46,419 --> 00:42:47,420
had an estimate in the introduction

1234
00:42:47,420 --> 00:42:49,420
of

1235
00:42:53,393 --> 00:42:55,393
the report.

1236
00:42:57,397 --> 00:43:01,597
the most recent annual spend was about

1237
00:43:02,402 --> 00:43:03,403
13.5 million.

1238
00:43:03,403 --> 00:43:05,403
>> that was about

1239
00:43:05,405 --> 00:43:07,805
a year of 2024 calendar

1240
00:43:11,411 --> 00:43:12,412
year.

1241
00:43:12,412 --> 00:43:13,413
>>

1242
00:43:13,413 --> 00:43:14,414
can I ask a quick question? Sorry, I

1243
00:43:14,414 --> 00:43:15,415
was late

1244
00:43:15,415 --> 00:43:17,417
to the party. Thank you for everybody. On

1245
00:43:17,417 --> 00:43:18,418
the good news, the city

1246
00:43:18,418 --> 00:43:20,420
did obtain their. I had a question

1247
00:43:20,420 --> 00:43:22,820
on your transaction testing.

1248
00:43:23,390 --> 00:43:25,390
structurally, do you

1249
00:43:26,393 --> 00:43:28,395
--is there a percentage that

1250
00:43:28,395 --> 00:43:29,396
you attempt to understand? Do you

1251
00:43:29,396 --> 00:43:30,397
do specific dollar

1252
00:43:30,397 --> 00:43:32,399
figures or specific months? Maybe

1253
00:43:32,399 --> 00:43:35,402
you could just talk about how

1254
00:43:35,402 --> 00:43:37,802
you navigate the specifics

1255
00:43:38,405 --> 00:43:39,406
on that?

1256
00:43:39,406 --> 00:43:41,406
>> within transaction testing,

1257
00:43:41,408 --> 00:43:42,409
we looked at it from a few different

1258
00:43:42,409 --> 00:43:44,411
angles. One of them is running analytics

1259
00:43:44,411 --> 00:43:47,414
to provide to management in determining what our

1260
00:43:47,414 --> 00:43:49,414
biggest spend

1261
00:43:50,417 --> 00:43:51,418
areas were

1262
00:43:51,418 --> 00:43:53,420
. We provided a table with information

1263
00:43:53,420 --> 00:43:54,421
as far as what the spend is per

1264
00:43:54,421 --> 00:43:56,389
area. We can provide that or it is

1265
00:43:56,389 --> 00:43:58,389
in the report

1266
00:43:59,392 --> 00:44:02,392
as well. We also looked

1267
00:44:02,395 --> 00:44:05,398
at, based on risk, what areas

1268
00:44:05,398 --> 00:44:07,398
would be a

1269
00:44:10,403 --> 00:44:11,404
higher risk type item. One of the policies

1270
00:44:11,404 --> 00:44:13,404
that we

1271
00:44:13,406 --> 00:44:14,407
looked at is having things shipped,

1272
00:44:14,407 --> 00:44:17,410
directly to a uta address rather than

1273
00:44:17,410 --> 00:44:18,411
a

1274
00:44:18,411 --> 00:44:20,413
non-uta address. We looked at transactions

1275
00:44:20,413 --> 00:44:24,130
that were sent outside of the

1276
00:44:26,419 --> 00:44:28,419
uta address

1277
00:44:29,389 --> 00:44:30,390
. In addressing your question, kind of

1278
00:44:30,390 --> 00:44:31,391
yes. We looked at

1279
00:44:31,391 --> 00:44:32,392
all of those things from different

1280
00:44:32,392 --> 00:44:33,393
angles.

1281
00:44:33,393 --> 00:44:36,393
>> there is not a percentage,

1282
00:44:38,398 --> 00:44:40,398
per se?

1283
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:41,401
just a strategy to know where you're

1284
00:44:41,401 --> 00:44:42,402
more potential risk

1285
00:44:42,402 --> 00:44:44,404
factors are. With that be accurate?

1286
00:44:44,404 --> 00:44:46,404
>> yeah.

1287
00:44:46,406 --> 00:44:47,407
>> thanks. >> if you have a p card

1288
00:44:47,407 --> 00:44:48,408
--

1289
00:44:48,408 --> 00:44:49,409
>>

1290
00:44:49,409 --> 00:44:50,410
do I have one?

1291
00:44:50,410 --> 00:44:51,411
>> no. Just hypothetical.

1292
00:44:51,411 --> 00:44:53,811
if you have a

1293
00:44:55,415 --> 00:44:56,416
p card, and your supervisor, will he

1294
00:44:56,416 --> 00:44:57,417
go through your charges at

1295
00:44:57,417 --> 00:44:58,418
the end of your billing period?

1296
00:44:58,418 --> 00:44:59,419
>>

1297
00:44:59,419 --> 00:45:01,819
by policy, they should

1298
00:45:02,389 --> 00:45:03,390
be reviewed.

1299
00:45:03,390 --> 00:45:05,390
>> due to

1300
00:45:05,392 --> 00:45:07,392
the large scale

1301
00:45:08,395 --> 00:45:10,395
of the program,

1302
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:14,401
you have two options. One would be to

1303
00:45:14,401 --> 00:45:16,401
hire staff that

1304
00:45:17,404 --> 00:45:18,405
could directly monitor all of

1305
00:45:18,405 --> 00:45:20,407
the transactions. I don't know if that

1306
00:45:20,407 --> 00:45:21,408
would be super effective the other

1307
00:45:21,408 --> 00:45:23,408
one

1308
00:45:23,410 --> 00:45:24,411
is relying on supervisors and middle

1309
00:45:24,411 --> 00:45:25,412
management

1310
00:45:25,412 --> 00:45:28,412
to actually review the transactions

1311
00:45:29,416 --> 00:45:30,417
and

1312
00:45:30,417 --> 00:45:32,419
approve other people's transactions.

1313
00:45:32,419 --> 00:45:33,420
>> are there receipts and other things

1314
00:45:33,420 --> 00:45:35,388
attached

1315
00:45:35,388 --> 00:45:36,389
to them?

1316
00:45:36,389 --> 00:45:37,390
>> there

1317
00:45:37,390 --> 00:45:38,391
should be.

1318
00:45:38,391 --> 00:45:39,392
>> we will address that.

1319
00:45:39,392 --> 00:45:42,392
there are a few findings

1320
00:45:44,397 --> 00:45:45,398
on that.

1321
00:45:45,398 --> 00:45:48,998
>> I think we will also note

1322
00:45:50,403 --> 00:45:52,403
that the

1323
00:45:53,406 --> 00:45:54,407
numbering on

1324
00:45:54,407 --> 00:45:56,409
this doesn't flow exactly and that is because

1325
00:45:56,409 --> 00:45:57,410
there are a few items that were more

1326
00:45:57,410 --> 00:45:58,411
sensitive in

1327
00:45:58,411 --> 00:45:59,412
nature and so those will be addressed

1328
00:45:59,412 --> 00:46:00,413
in a closed session after this.

1329
00:46:00,413 --> 00:46:04,613
so, the first one we are reporting

1330
00:46:05,418 --> 00:46:07,420
on is audit finding 25-03-02

1331
00:46:07,420 --> 00:46:08,421
and the issue was that there was one

1332
00:46:08,421 --> 00:46:09,389
open purchase card that belonged to

1333
00:46:09,389 --> 00:46:11,389
a

1334
00:46:11,391 --> 00:46:13,391
terminated employee.

1335
00:46:14,394 --> 00:46:17,394
we did not find any

1336
00:46:17,397 --> 00:46:18,398
evidence that

1337
00:46:18,398 --> 00:46:20,400
a fraudulent or any spending was done

1338
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:21,401
after they had left uta employment

1339
00:46:21,401 --> 00:46:22,402
but that

1340
00:46:22,402 --> 00:46:23,403
is obviously a risk because it was

1341
00:46:23,403 --> 00:46:26,403
open. You can use it

1342
00:46:28,408 --> 00:46:29,409
for possible online purchases, et cetera.

1343
00:46:29,409 --> 00:46:31,409
>> could you

1344
00:46:31,411 --> 00:46:32,412
clarify if they had returned the card

1345
00:46:32,412 --> 00:46:34,414
to their supervisor or

1346
00:46:34,414 --> 00:46:35,415
if they literally took the card with

1347
00:46:35,415 --> 00:46:38,418
them accidentally? I am just going to

1348
00:46:38,418 --> 00:46:40,420
presume accidentally. Can you not

1349
00:46:40,420 --> 00:46:41,421
specify?

1350
00:46:41,421 --> 00:46:45,210
>> we were not able to determine

1351
00:46:46,393 --> 00:46:47,394
that. The office takes care of that and

1352
00:46:47,394 --> 00:46:49,396
gets the card so management, I

1353
00:46:49,396 --> 00:46:50,397
think, addressed that and said they

1354
00:46:50,397 --> 00:46:51,398
were able to determine.

1355
00:46:51,398 --> 00:46:53,398
>>

1356
00:46:56,403 --> 00:46:57,404
go ahead.

1357
00:46:57,404 --> 00:46:58,405
>> so, yes,

1358
00:46:58,405 --> 00:46:59,406
we were able to determine that no

1359
00:46:59,406 --> 00:47:00,407
charges were made after the fact but

1360
00:47:00,407 --> 00:47:01,408
we

1361
00:47:01,408 --> 00:47:02,409
are working with the people office

1362
00:47:02,409 --> 00:47:04,809
to make sure that

1363
00:47:05,412 --> 00:47:06,413
we get notified when people are terminated

1364
00:47:06,413 --> 00:47:08,413
if they

1365
00:47:08,415 --> 00:47:10,415
have

1366
00:47:11,418 --> 00:47:13,418
a card.

1367
00:47:14,421 --> 00:47:15,388
>> okay.

1368
00:47:15,388 --> 00:47:16,389
so, the recommendation there were that

1369
00:47:16,389 --> 00:47:17,390
management should coordinate with

1370
00:47:17,390 --> 00:47:19,790
people office, which they

1371
00:47:20,393 --> 00:47:22,395
are working on and then consider

1372
00:47:22,395 --> 00:47:23,396
creating an automated system that might

1373
00:47:23,396 --> 00:47:25,396
notify if that

1374
00:47:29,402 --> 00:47:30,403
is needed when an

1375
00:47:30,403 --> 00:47:31,404
employee leaves. And then, having the

1376
00:47:31,404 --> 00:47:32,405
p card administrator periodically

1377
00:47:32,405 --> 00:47:33,406
reconcile or create

1378
00:47:33,406 --> 00:47:35,408
some kind of a tracking mechanism to

1379
00:47:35,408 --> 00:47:36,409
ensure that only active cardholders

1380
00:47:36,409 --> 00:47:38,409
are

1381
00:47:40,413 --> 00:47:42,813
current employees. Any additional

1382
00:47:47,420 --> 00:47:48,421
questions there?

1383
00:47:48,421 --> 00:47:49,389
>> okay. Then we

1384
00:47:49,389 --> 00:47:50,390
are

1385
00:47:50,390 --> 00:47:52,790
going to go to

1386
00:47:53,393 --> 00:47:56,396
finding 03-05. The issue here was

1387
00:47:56,396 --> 00:47:58,396
at 137

1388
00:47:59,399 --> 00:48:01,401
cardholders or --speaking to the question

1389
00:48:01,401 --> 00:48:05,405
that bob had earlier. There are cardholders

1390
00:48:05,405 --> 00:48:06,406
and then there can be within the system

1391
00:48:06,406 --> 00:48:07,407
just transaction approvers.

1392
00:48:07,407 --> 00:48:08,408
they may not have an actual card but

1393
00:48:08,408 --> 00:48:10,808
they log into the

1394
00:48:11,411 --> 00:48:13,413
u.s. Inc. System

1395
00:48:13,413 --> 00:48:14,414
and they are able to view those and

1396
00:48:14,414 --> 00:48:16,416
approve them. So, a

1397
00:48:16,416 --> 00:48:17,417
total of 137 card elders were approval

1398
00:48:17,417 --> 00:48:18,418
had not completed the training that

1399
00:48:18,418 --> 00:48:20,418
is available called

1400
00:48:20,420 --> 00:48:22,420
basic purchase

1401
00:48:24,391 --> 00:48:26,391
card training.

1402
00:48:28,395 --> 00:48:30,397
>> I did not think there was an option. I

1403
00:48:30,397 --> 00:48:33,397
thought it was part of

1404
00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:35,400
the

1405
00:48:35,402 --> 00:48:36,403
training module requirements.

1406
00:48:36,403 --> 00:48:37,404
>> part

1407
00:48:37,404 --> 00:48:38,405
of the issue

1408
00:48:38,405 --> 00:48:39,406
here is that the training module requirement

1409
00:48:39,406 --> 00:48:40,407
is only for

1410
00:48:40,407 --> 00:48:42,409
the cardholder. We are working on

1411
00:48:42,409 --> 00:48:44,409
updating that now.

1412
00:48:48,415 --> 00:48:50,415
>> okay. >> so, just

1413
00:48:51,418 --> 00:48:54,418
for clarity. You can be

1414
00:48:55,388 --> 00:48:57,390
an approver and not be a cardholder.

1415
00:48:57,390 --> 00:48:58,391
>> not actually have

1416
00:48:58,391 --> 00:48:59,392
a card.

1417
00:48:59,392 --> 00:49:00,393
>> exactly. >> it is really

1418
00:49:00,393 --> 00:49:01,394
be

1419
00:49:01,394 --> 00:49:03,396
approver that is missing the training?

1420
00:49:03,396 --> 00:49:05,396
>>

1421
00:49:06,399 --> 00:49:07,400
yes.

1422
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:09,402
and, where we have annual training requirements, some

1423
00:49:09,402 --> 00:49:12,402
people are not meeting those.

1424
00:49:14,407 --> 00:49:15,408
>> okay. >> there should be some clarification. The

1425
00:49:15,408 --> 00:49:17,408
issue that

1426
00:49:17,410 --> 00:49:18,411
we looked at was more in the calendar

1427
00:49:18,411 --> 00:49:19,412
year

1428
00:49:19,412 --> 00:49:21,414
or from starting january 1 of 2024

1429
00:49:21,414 --> 00:49:23,416
and rolling through the end of

1430
00:49:23,416 --> 00:49:28,216
the audit dates. We did not look at

1431
00:49:29,389 --> 00:49:30,390
the historical.

1432
00:49:30,390 --> 00:49:31,391
>> if somebody did not

1433
00:49:31,391 --> 00:49:33,391
complete

1434
00:49:33,393 --> 00:49:34,394
their training of the card, you

1435
00:49:34,394 --> 00:49:35,395
can suspend the card?

1436
00:49:35,395 --> 00:49:36,396
>> they will

1437
00:49:36,396 --> 00:49:37,397
get notification if they

1438
00:49:37,397 --> 00:49:39,399
do not pay it within the 30 days.

1439
00:49:39,399 --> 00:49:41,399
the card will

1440
00:49:44,404 --> 00:49:45,405
be suspended.

1441
00:49:45,405 --> 00:49:46,406
>> with that, our recommendations

1442
00:49:46,406 --> 00:49:47,407
were that

1443
00:49:47,407 --> 00:49:50,410
policies and sop's be updated to clearly mandate

1444
00:49:50,410 --> 00:49:51,411
the annual training for the cardholders

1445
00:49:51,411 --> 00:49:53,411
and

1446
00:49:53,413 --> 00:49:54,414
the approvers. Then, also identify

1447
00:49:54,414 --> 00:49:56,414
cardholders

1448
00:49:57,417 --> 00:50:00,417
and approvers who have not

1449
00:50:00,420 --> 00:50:01,421
completed it in

1450
00:50:01,421 --> 00:50:03,390
the past year and require that completion. Or,

1451
00:50:03,390 --> 00:50:06,390
as they said, they can

1452
00:50:06,393 --> 00:50:09,393
suspend the card. Any additional

1453
00:50:09,396 --> 00:50:11,396
questions there?

1454
00:50:12,399 --> 00:50:13,400
>> our next one, the

1455
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:15,402
issue was training for specifically

1456
00:50:15,402 --> 00:50:17,402
transaction approvers does

1457
00:50:21,408 --> 00:50:23,408
not exist

1458
00:50:26,413 --> 00:50:27,414
. Currently there is just that p card

1459
00:50:27,414 --> 00:50:28,415
basic training and

1460
00:50:28,415 --> 00:50:29,416
it seemed that there might be an opportunity

1461
00:50:29,416 --> 00:50:30,417
to provide some additional training

1462
00:50:30,417 --> 00:50:31,418
for those who don't

1463
00:50:31,418 --> 00:50:32,419
necessarily have an p card but are

1464
00:50:32,419 --> 00:50:33,420
required to review those and those

1465
00:50:33,420 --> 00:50:35,420
transactions

1466
00:50:36,389 --> 00:50:38,389
and then approve

1467
00:50:39,392 --> 00:50:40,393
them.

1468
00:50:40,393 --> 00:50:42,393
>> what is

1469
00:50:45,398 --> 00:50:46,399
your response?

1470
00:50:46,399 --> 00:50:47,400
>> yes,

1471
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:48,401
we absolutely are working on this as well.

1472
00:50:48,401 --> 00:50:50,403
first, I just want to go back in general

1473
00:50:50,403 --> 00:50:51,404
and to say thank you for this audit

1474
00:50:51,404 --> 00:50:52,405
because we do not have a

1475
00:50:52,405 --> 00:50:54,407
full-time p card administrator and

1476
00:50:54,407 --> 00:50:56,407
the work

1477
00:50:57,410 --> 00:50:59,410
that a p-card

1478
00:51:02,415 --> 00:51:03,416
administrator does do is obviously

1479
00:51:03,416 --> 00:51:04,417
missing

1480
00:51:04,417 --> 00:51:05,418
some things because of the resource

1481
00:51:05,418 --> 00:51:06,419
factor. I was happy to have this audit

1482
00:51:06,419 --> 00:51:08,419
done

1483
00:51:09,389 --> 00:51:10,390
so we could identify the gaps or,

1484
00:51:10,390 --> 00:51:12,392
rather, have someone else identify them for

1485
00:51:12,392 --> 00:51:14,394
us so we could start figuring out

1486
00:51:14,394 --> 00:51:15,395
what to do about these. In this case, we

1487
00:51:15,395 --> 00:51:17,795
did not have a

1488
00:51:19,399 --> 00:51:21,401
transaction approver trainee. I saw

1489
00:51:21,401 --> 00:51:24,404
that when I came in because someone

1490
00:51:24,404 --> 00:51:25,405
told me what to do but there was no

1491
00:51:25,405 --> 00:51:27,407
training on specifically what to look

1492
00:51:27,407 --> 00:51:30,410
for and I think this lack

1493
00:51:30,410 --> 00:51:32,410
of training

1494
00:51:33,413 --> 00:51:36,413
is also an indirect cause

1495
00:51:36,416 --> 00:51:39,419
of some of the other issues

1496
00:51:39,419 --> 00:51:40,420
that luke brought up especially, for

1497
00:51:40,420 --> 00:51:42,389
instance, the fact

1498
00:51:42,389 --> 00:51:44,391
that receipts are not

1499
00:51:44,391 --> 00:51:45,392
uniformly attached. If we don't train

1500
00:51:45,392 --> 00:51:47,392
the approvers that

1501
00:51:48,395 --> 00:51:50,795
they are supposed to

1502
00:51:51,398 --> 00:51:52,399
make sure

1503
00:51:52,399 --> 00:51:53,400
that the receipts are attached, then

1504
00:51:53,400 --> 00:51:54,401
that is an issue. We are definitely

1505
00:51:54,401 --> 00:51:56,401
working

1506
00:51:56,403 --> 00:51:57,404
on that. I am working with todd and

1507
00:51:57,404 --> 00:51:58,405
tina to come up with what

1508
00:51:58,405 --> 00:52:00,407
should be our training and we are

1509
00:52:00,407 --> 00:52:02,807
working with people office

1510
00:52:06,413 --> 00:52:08,413
as well.

1511
00:52:14,421 --> 00:52:15,422
>> one other question I would have

1512
00:52:15,422 --> 00:52:17,390
on it. Are these tax-exempt?

1513
00:52:17,390 --> 00:52:18,391
are we tax exempt on this?

1514
00:52:18,391 --> 00:52:19,392
>> yes.

1515
00:52:19,392 --> 00:52:20,393
>> is that something that is being

1516
00:52:20,393 --> 00:52:21,394
asked? The reason I ask that is because

1517
00:52:21,394 --> 00:52:22,395
at the county, it is something we

1518
00:52:22,395 --> 00:52:24,397
look very closely at, to make sure

1519
00:52:24,397 --> 00:52:26,399
everybody is doing that. If not, there

1520
00:52:26,399 --> 00:52:27,400
is a red flag that goes up on each

1521
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:28,401
one.

1522
00:52:28,401 --> 00:52:29,402
>> we get a report from

1523
00:52:29,402 --> 00:52:30,403
mike every month that he works with

1524
00:52:30,403 --> 00:52:31,404
the comptroller's office to recover

1525
00:52:31,404 --> 00:52:33,404
anything that

1526
00:52:33,406 --> 00:52:35,806
has not been properly

1527
00:52:36,409 --> 00:52:37,410
not taxed.

1528
00:52:37,410 --> 00:52:39,410
>> how many

1529
00:52:39,412 --> 00:52:41,412
millions did you

1530
00:52:41,414 --> 00:52:42,415
say is annually on each cards? See

1531
00:52:42,415 --> 00:52:45,415
the most recent one was

1532
00:52:48,421 --> 00:52:49,389
13.5 million.

1533
00:52:49,389 --> 00:52:50,390
>>

1534
00:52:50,390 --> 00:52:51,391
so if that is the total amount. I

1535
00:52:51,391 --> 00:52:53,393
was asking for the number of transactions on

1536
00:52:53,393 --> 00:52:54,394
an annual basis. Do you know that?

1537
00:52:54,394 --> 00:52:57,994
>> I don't know about annual but

1538
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:01,401
hour period covered --I could give

1539
00:53:01,401 --> 00:53:03,401
you an exact

1540
00:53:03,403 --> 00:53:05,403
number. It

1541
00:53:06,406 --> 00:53:07,407
was 136,599.

1542
00:53:07,407 --> 00:53:08,408
>> total transactions?

1543
00:53:08,408 --> 00:53:09,409
>> total transactions. >> we will rounded

1544
00:53:09,409 --> 00:53:11,409
up to 600.

1545
00:53:12,412 --> 00:53:15,412
>> mike, to bob's question, if

1546
00:53:15,415 --> 00:53:17,415
the sales

1547
00:53:18,418 --> 00:53:21,421
tax is paid and it is

1548
00:53:21,421 --> 00:53:24,391
paid in utah, anyway, then that

1549
00:53:24,391 --> 00:53:26,391
is recoverable through

1550
00:53:26,393 --> 00:53:27,394
filing with the tax commission, correct?

1551
00:53:27,394 --> 00:53:29,394
>> it is. We

1552
00:53:30,397 --> 00:53:31,398
work with --like I said, we work with

1553
00:53:31,398 --> 00:53:33,398
the comptroller

1554
00:53:33,400 --> 00:53:35,400
to

1555
00:53:36,403 --> 00:53:38,405
do that and they have a regular cadence for

1556
00:53:38,405 --> 00:53:39,406
going back to the tax commission and

1557
00:53:39,406 --> 00:53:41,406
getting those

1558
00:53:45,412 --> 00:53:46,413
funds back.

1559
00:53:46,413 --> 00:53:47,414
>> it should

1560
00:53:47,414 --> 00:53:48,415
be noted that that is contained within

1561
00:53:48,415 --> 00:53:49,416
the p-card basic training, you have

1562
00:53:49,416 --> 00:53:50,417
information about being tax-exempt.

1563
00:53:50,417 --> 00:53:51,418
>> I would just think that with that

1564
00:53:51,418 --> 00:53:53,818
total many dollars and

1565
00:53:54,421 --> 00:53:56,421
that

1566
00:53:57,390 --> 00:53:59,390
many transactions,

1567
00:54:02,395 --> 00:54:03,396
that is not an easy task to watch that but

1568
00:54:03,396 --> 00:54:05,796
I would say that

1569
00:54:06,399 --> 00:54:08,399
has got

1570
00:54:09,402 --> 00:54:10,403
to be open and not

1571
00:54:10,403 --> 00:54:12,405
accusing anybody but it definitely

1572
00:54:12,405 --> 00:54:13,406
opens it up for there to be some

1573
00:54:13,406 --> 00:54:15,408
type of fraud going on someplace as

1574
00:54:15,408 --> 00:54:17,410
far as that goes. That is a lot of

1575
00:54:17,410 --> 00:54:18,411
things that could be being charged. They

1576
00:54:18,411 --> 00:54:21,414
are not all being looked at

1577
00:54:21,414 --> 00:54:23,414
very,

1578
00:54:24,417 --> 00:54:25,418
very closely.

1579
00:54:25,418 --> 00:54:27,418
>> certainly

1580
00:54:27,420 --> 00:54:30,390
fraud is --fraud and also

1581
00:54:30,390 --> 00:54:33,390
accidental personal purchases are always

1582
00:54:36,396 --> 00:54:38,396
a possibility

1583
00:54:39,399 --> 00:54:42,402
and I've got to choose my

1584
00:54:42,402 --> 00:54:45,405
words carefully. We didn't find any

1585
00:54:45,405 --> 00:54:47,805
evidence of widespread or

1586
00:54:48,408 --> 00:54:50,408
egregious fraud in

1587
00:54:51,411 --> 00:54:53,811
our procedures. Separate from

1588
00:54:54,414 --> 00:54:56,414
this audit, my

1589
00:54:57,417 --> 00:55:00,420
team also --we also do a

1590
00:55:00,420 --> 00:55:03,390
number of other things that gets our

1591
00:55:03,390 --> 00:55:05,390
eyes on p-card

1592
00:55:06,393 --> 00:55:08,393
transactions.

1593
00:55:08,395 --> 00:55:09,396
for one, the sales tax thing. Because

1594
00:55:09,396 --> 00:55:11,796
of that, we reviewed

1595
00:55:12,399 --> 00:55:13,400
just about every transaction. We,

1596
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:15,400
on

1597
00:55:15,402 --> 00:55:17,402
a quarterly basis,

1598
00:55:18,405 --> 00:55:20,405
we review

1599
00:55:21,408 --> 00:55:22,409
p-cards, specifically looking for duplicate

1600
00:55:22,409 --> 00:55:23,410
transaction. That gets us

1601
00:55:23,410 --> 00:55:24,411
pulling reports, seeing what is being

1602
00:55:24,411 --> 00:55:26,811
spent . I also have

1603
00:55:28,415 --> 00:55:30,415
a

1604
00:55:31,418 --> 00:55:33,418
monitoring report

1605
00:55:34,421 --> 00:55:35,422
--

1606
00:55:35,422 --> 00:55:36,389
credit cards have what is called an

1607
00:55:36,389 --> 00:55:37,390
mcc code, merchant category code.

1608
00:55:37,390 --> 00:55:39,392
every company has an

1609
00:55:39,392 --> 00:55:40,393
associated code. For instance, walmart

1610
00:55:40,393 --> 00:55:42,393
or

1611
00:55:43,396 --> 00:55:44,397
a department or

1612
00:55:44,397 --> 00:55:45,398
store, mcdonald's would be fast food, et

1613
00:55:45,398 --> 00:55:49,402
cetera. I have flagged some of the

1614
00:55:49,402 --> 00:55:50,403
high risk

1615
00:55:50,403 --> 00:55:55,203
type mcc codes and I have a report

1616
00:55:55,408 --> 00:55:56,409
sent right to my

1617
00:55:56,409 --> 00:55:58,411
email box. I get it just about every morning

1618
00:55:58,411 --> 00:56:00,413
of any transactions that hit up

1619
00:56:00,413 --> 00:56:01,414
against that and then I can review

1620
00:56:01,414 --> 00:56:03,414
it and see

1621
00:56:04,417 --> 00:56:06,417
if any follow-up

1622
00:56:07,420 --> 00:56:09,420
is

1623
00:56:10,390 --> 00:56:12,390
needed. So,

1624
00:56:12,392 --> 00:56:13,393
nobody can guarantee that an environment is

1625
00:56:13,393 --> 00:56:15,393
100% free

1626
00:56:16,396 --> 00:56:18,398
from fraud. As long

1627
00:56:18,398 --> 00:56:19,399
as people are involved in any process,

1628
00:56:19,399 --> 00:56:21,799
that promise can't be

1629
00:56:22,402 --> 00:56:24,402
made but,

1630
00:56:28,408 --> 00:56:29,409
our internal audit, both in

1631
00:56:29,409 --> 00:56:31,411
this audit and through all of those

1632
00:56:31,411 --> 00:56:33,411
other activities I

1633
00:56:36,416 --> 00:56:37,417
have described, we have seen enough that

1634
00:56:37,417 --> 00:56:38,418
I am confident

1635
00:56:38,418 --> 00:56:39,419
that we don't have systemic or widespread

1636
00:56:39,419 --> 00:56:43,190
fraud going on within our purchase

1637
00:56:46,393 --> 00:56:48,393
card program.

1638
00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:54,401
>> also, if I could touch base on

1639
00:56:54,401 --> 00:56:55,402
this. Since I have joined us in 2023, we have

1640
00:56:55,402 --> 00:56:57,404
also reduced significantly the number

1641
00:56:57,404 --> 00:56:58,405
of p-cards being held. I don't know

1642
00:56:58,405 --> 00:56:59,406
if you want

1643
00:56:59,406 --> 00:57:00,407
to touch on that quickly or not.

1644
00:57:00,407 --> 00:57:01,408
>>

1645
00:57:01,408 --> 00:57:03,408
on

1646
00:57:04,411 --> 00:57:05,412
the training, I have

1647
00:57:05,412 --> 00:57:07,414
noticed this a little bit, and thank

1648
00:57:07,414 --> 00:57:10,417
you, bob for being here. I am

1649
00:57:10,417 --> 00:57:12,417
hoping that

1650
00:57:13,420 --> 00:57:15,420
it includes

1651
00:57:16,389 --> 00:57:17,390
--if you have a business meal,

1652
00:57:17,390 --> 00:57:18,391
the purpose of the business meal,

1653
00:57:18,391 --> 00:57:19,392
those types of things. It seems intrinsic

1654
00:57:19,392 --> 00:57:20,393
if you

1655
00:57:20,393 --> 00:57:22,395
have lived at your whole life but if

1656
00:57:22,395 --> 00:57:25,398
you haven't, somebody may not realize

1657
00:57:25,398 --> 00:57:26,399
those are

1658
00:57:26,399 --> 00:57:28,401
the things they actually need to be

1659
00:57:28,401 --> 00:57:29,402
submitting on the

1660
00:57:29,402 --> 00:57:31,404
documentation and I am wondering if

1661
00:57:31,404 --> 00:57:33,804
those things should also

1662
00:57:34,407 --> 00:57:35,408
be included.

1663
00:57:35,408 --> 00:57:36,409
>> those things

1664
00:57:36,409 --> 00:57:37,410
are absolutely being considered. We

1665
00:57:37,410 --> 00:57:38,411
recognize from this audit that we

1666
00:57:38,411 --> 00:57:39,412
need not just to

1667
00:57:39,412 --> 00:57:40,413
establish some training portals for

1668
00:57:40,413 --> 00:57:42,413
specific things but

1669
00:57:46,419 --> 00:57:48,419
also retraining.

1670
00:57:49,389 --> 00:57:50,390
the receipts for when there are

1671
00:57:50,390 --> 00:57:52,392
meals, one, they are not supposed

1672
00:57:52,392 --> 00:57:53,393
to be single person

1673
00:57:53,393 --> 00:57:54,394
meals and two, they are supposed to put

1674
00:57:54,394 --> 00:57:55,395
on the receipt who was in attendance at

1675
00:57:55,395 --> 00:57:57,395
the

1676
00:57:58,398 --> 00:58:01,398
meal. Right? So, also making

1677
00:58:01,401 --> 00:58:03,401
sure

1678
00:58:03,403 --> 00:58:04,404
that the senior person who was in

1679
00:58:04,404 --> 00:58:06,804
attendance at the meal

1680
00:58:07,407 --> 00:58:09,409
is the person who uses

1681
00:58:09,409 --> 00:58:10,410
the card. We definitely need to do

1682
00:58:10,410 --> 00:58:12,410
some retraining

1683
00:58:13,413 --> 00:58:15,813
and we are working

1684
00:58:16,416 --> 00:58:17,417
on that.

1685
00:58:17,417 --> 00:58:18,418
>> with that, are there any

1686
00:58:18,418 --> 00:58:19,419
questions

1687
00:58:19,419 --> 00:58:21,419
on

1688
00:58:22,422 --> 00:58:23,390
this slide? You can skip to the next

1689
00:58:23,390 --> 00:58:25,392
one which is totally fine because

1690
00:58:25,392 --> 00:58:27,394
we did find a

1691
00:58:27,394 --> 00:58:28,395
number of potential purchases where

1692
00:58:28,395 --> 00:58:29,396
it was an

1693
00:58:29,396 --> 00:58:31,398
individual meal or when that would

1694
00:58:31,398 --> 00:58:33,398
not fall

1695
00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:37,000
within policy. As noted, they recognize

1696
00:58:37,404 --> 00:58:38,405
the ability

1697
00:58:38,405 --> 00:58:40,407
to improve that process and create

1698
00:58:40,407 --> 00:58:42,807
some better documentation for

1699
00:58:43,410 --> 00:58:45,410
that and training.

1700
00:58:46,413 --> 00:58:48,413
any additional

1701
00:58:49,416 --> 00:58:50,417
questions there?

1702
00:58:50,417 --> 00:58:52,417
>>

1703
00:58:52,419 --> 00:58:54,419
the last one

1704
00:58:55,422 --> 00:58:57,822
is issue 25-03-08

1705
00:59:01,394 --> 00:59:04,397
where the issue is purchase transactions lacked

1706
00:59:04,397 --> 00:59:06,397
detailed information required

1707
00:59:07,400 --> 00:59:09,400
by policy.

1708
00:59:10,403 --> 00:59:11,404
so, a few different things there.

1709
00:59:11,404 --> 00:59:12,405
as mike noted, there were 137,600

1710
00:59:12,405 --> 00:59:13,406
transactions, I think. So, 85,068

1711
00:59:13,406 --> 00:59:15,406
of them

1712
00:59:15,408 --> 00:59:16,409
were 62% did not really have a description

1713
00:59:16,409 --> 00:59:18,409
as required, written

1714
00:59:19,412 --> 00:59:21,812
in the u.s.

1715
00:59:22,415 --> 00:59:24,415
bank

1716
00:59:24,417 --> 00:59:25,418
system. 4412 were missing receipts

1717
00:59:25,418 --> 00:59:27,418
and

1718
00:59:28,421 --> 00:59:31,391
then 3039 did not have any recorded approvals from

1719
00:59:31,391 --> 00:59:33,391
a supervisor or

1720
00:59:34,394 --> 00:59:36,394
transaction

1721
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:41,401
approver.

1722
00:59:41,401 --> 00:59:43,401
>> I was going

1723
00:59:43,403 --> 00:59:46,406
to ask, how does it go

1724
00:59:46,406 --> 00:59:48,406
on

1725
00:59:49,409 --> 00:59:51,409
that long?

1726
00:59:52,412 --> 00:59:53,413
the system, having used it, if somebody doesn't approve

1727
00:59:53,413 --> 00:59:55,413
it,

1728
00:59:55,415 --> 00:59:56,416
it doesn't always come to the

1729
00:59:56,416 --> 00:59:58,418
approver but at some point, somebody

1730
00:59:58,418 --> 01:00:00,818
should flagged that as

1731
01:00:01,421 --> 01:00:02,422
lack of

1732
01:00:02,422 --> 01:00:04,391
action by the cardholder. I am just

1733
01:00:04,391 --> 01:00:06,393
wondering how does that

1734
01:00:06,393 --> 01:00:07,394
get resolved?

1735
01:00:07,394 --> 01:00:09,394
>> again, retraining, absolutely

1736
01:00:10,397 --> 01:00:12,397
require it

1737
01:00:12,399 --> 01:00:13,400
but in some cases, there are a couple

1738
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:16,400
of things going on here

1739
01:00:16,403 --> 01:00:18,803
where the auto populated

1740
01:00:19,406 --> 01:00:21,806
piece in u.s.

1741
01:00:22,409 --> 01:00:25,409
bank allows people to think

1742
01:00:25,412 --> 01:00:27,412
that the

1743
01:00:27,414 --> 01:00:28,415
field has been completed so they just

1744
01:00:28,415 --> 01:00:31,418
approve it or they just let

1745
01:00:31,418 --> 01:00:33,420
it go. The other is, in

1746
01:00:33,420 --> 01:00:37,200
some cases where the information has

1747
01:00:37,390 --> 01:00:39,790
become an issue where

1748
01:00:40,393 --> 01:00:42,395
the manager has not approved

1749
01:00:42,395 --> 01:00:43,396
it and the two cycles that they are provided and then

1750
01:00:43,396 --> 01:00:45,396
the

1751
01:00:46,399 --> 01:00:48,399
card

1752
01:00:48,401 --> 01:00:49,402
is shut off and then they go in and

1753
01:00:49,402 --> 01:00:52,405
they fix and the card is turned back

1754
01:00:52,405 --> 01:00:54,407
on, it doesn't automatically

1755
01:00:54,407 --> 01:00:55,408
wipe up --out the stuff that wasn't approved

1756
01:00:55,408 --> 01:00:57,408
the

1757
01:01:00,413 --> 01:01:01,414
prior times. Sometimes it is just

1758
01:01:01,414 --> 01:01:02,415
a communication issue. Sometimes it

1759
01:01:02,415 --> 01:01:04,415
is a

1760
01:01:04,417 --> 01:01:05,418
system issue. Sometimes it is a people

1761
01:01:05,418 --> 01:01:06,419
issue.

1762
01:01:06,419 --> 01:01:07,420
we are working on that. One of the

1763
01:01:07,420 --> 01:01:10,390
things that I wanted to

1764
01:01:10,390 --> 01:01:11,391
bring up is that we are working with

1765
01:01:11,391 --> 01:01:13,391
a vendor

1766
01:01:13,393 --> 01:01:14,394
that is coming in next week to give

1767
01:01:14,394 --> 01:01:15,395
--

1768
01:01:15,395 --> 01:01:16,396
I believe the meeting is next week,

1769
01:01:16,396 --> 01:01:18,796
just to give us

1770
01:01:19,399 --> 01:01:21,399
a discussion, right?

1771
01:01:22,402 --> 01:01:25,405
of what kinds of things we

1772
01:01:25,405 --> 01:01:28,408
could be looking for in a p-card

1773
01:01:28,408 --> 01:01:30,408
management vendor because

1774
01:01:31,411 --> 01:01:35,110
there are ways that we could

1775
01:01:36,416 --> 01:01:37,417
structure this so that we could send

1776
01:01:37,417 --> 01:01:40,417
a list of our active

1777
01:01:40,420 --> 01:01:42,420
employees and they

1778
01:01:43,390 --> 01:01:45,390
automatically roll

1779
01:01:45,392 --> 01:01:46,393
it through the system and so the ones who

1780
01:01:46,393 --> 01:01:47,394
are no longer active,

1781
01:01:47,394 --> 01:01:49,396
they automatically turn those cards

1782
01:01:49,396 --> 01:01:50,397
off so even if somebody doesn't turn

1783
01:01:50,397 --> 01:01:52,397
in their card,

1784
01:01:52,399 --> 01:01:53,400
they won't have access to spend against

1785
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:54,401
it.

1786
01:01:54,401 --> 01:01:55,402
there are options where they could

1787
01:01:55,402 --> 01:01:56,403
set up, instead of a card, they have

1788
01:01:56,403 --> 01:01:58,403
a

1789
01:01:58,405 --> 01:02:00,405
replenished account where

1790
01:02:01,408 --> 01:02:02,409
you don't --for those cardholders

1791
01:02:02,409 --> 01:02:03,410
who have cards

1792
01:02:03,410 --> 01:02:07,610
because they travel once a year to

1793
01:02:09,416 --> 01:02:10,417
a conference , they are not going

1794
01:02:10,417 --> 01:02:12,419
to have any option

1795
01:02:12,419 --> 01:02:13,420
but to turn the card on for that conference,

1796
01:02:13,420 --> 01:02:14,421
right? Otherwise, you would have to

1797
01:02:14,421 --> 01:02:16,389
go through your management to say,

1798
01:02:16,389 --> 01:02:17,390
I am going to two conferences this

1799
01:02:17,390 --> 01:02:19,390
year. Can you

1800
01:02:19,392 --> 01:02:21,392
turn the card

1801
01:02:22,395 --> 01:02:23,396
on for this other

1802
01:02:23,396 --> 01:02:25,398
conference? There are options we have

1803
01:02:25,398 --> 01:02:26,399
looked into because we know we don't

1804
01:02:26,399 --> 01:02:27,400
have internal resources to

1805
01:02:27,400 --> 01:02:28,401
do this full program the way it should

1806
01:02:28,401 --> 01:02:30,401
be

1807
01:02:31,404 --> 01:02:32,405
done and we are looking

1808
01:02:32,405 --> 01:02:34,407
into those options at the same time

1809
01:02:34,407 --> 01:02:36,407
as improving our

1810
01:02:37,410 --> 01:02:38,411
training protocols.

1811
01:02:38,411 --> 01:02:40,411
>>

1812
01:02:43,416 --> 01:02:44,417
anything else?

1813
01:02:44,417 --> 01:02:45,418
>> I mean, there is

1814
01:02:45,418 --> 01:02:46,419
a second slide of recommendations

1815
01:02:46,419 --> 01:02:47,420
but I think most were addressed in

1816
01:02:47,420 --> 01:02:49,420
the comments

1817
01:02:49,422 --> 01:02:51,391
just now. It should also be

1818
01:02:51,391 --> 01:02:53,393
noted that management and everybody was

1819
01:02:53,393 --> 01:02:55,393
very helpful in

1820
01:02:58,398 --> 01:02:59,399
this audit. It went very well, very

1821
01:02:59,399 --> 01:03:00,400
smoothly as

1822
01:03:00,400 --> 01:03:03,400
meetings were requested or information

1823
01:03:05,405 --> 01:03:07,405
was requested

1824
01:03:07,407 --> 01:03:08,408
. The team is aware that there are some areas

1825
01:03:08,408 --> 01:03:09,409
that probably needed some improvement

1826
01:03:09,409 --> 01:03:11,411
and they were very helpful throughout

1827
01:03:11,411 --> 01:03:12,412
the

1828
01:03:12,412 --> 01:03:13,413
whole process. It has been a good

1829
01:03:13,413 --> 01:03:14,414
process that way.

1830
01:03:14,414 --> 01:03:15,415
>> viola, what you

1831
01:03:15,415 --> 01:03:16,416
see is

1832
01:03:16,416 --> 01:03:20,160
the timeframe for getting into some

1833
01:03:20,420 --> 01:03:22,420
kind

1834
01:03:23,390 --> 01:03:24,391
of overall --

1835
01:03:24,391 --> 01:03:25,392
>>

1836
01:03:25,392 --> 01:03:26,393
the end of this year is the plan. There

1837
01:03:26,393 --> 01:03:27,394
are couple of things we were able

1838
01:03:27,394 --> 01:03:29,396
to do immediately like restricting

1839
01:03:29,396 --> 01:03:31,396
who

1840
01:03:31,398 --> 01:03:32,399
has approvals. Now, that is set by

1841
01:03:32,399 --> 01:03:34,399
the p-card

1842
01:03:35,402 --> 01:03:38,402
administrator and not by the

1843
01:03:41,408 --> 01:03:43,408
individual cardholder.

1844
01:03:43,410 --> 01:03:44,411
there are some compliance audits and we

1845
01:03:44,411 --> 01:03:45,412
are checking

1846
01:03:45,412 --> 01:03:46,413
those right now to see who is outside of

1847
01:03:46,413 --> 01:03:47,414
the compliance as far as not taking

1848
01:03:47,414 --> 01:03:49,416
the training. Those immediate things

1849
01:03:49,416 --> 01:03:50,417
are being done and then the training

1850
01:03:50,417 --> 01:03:51,418
and finding some

1851
01:03:51,418 --> 01:03:53,420
vendor support is going to be at the

1852
01:03:53,420 --> 01:03:55,820
end of the year.

1853
01:03:56,389 --> 01:03:58,789
>> okay. Questions for vi

1854
01:03:59,392 --> 01:04:01,392
or staff?

1855
01:04:02,395 --> 01:04:03,396
okay.

1856
01:04:03,396 --> 01:04:04,397
>> I have one thing to add

1857
01:04:04,397 --> 01:04:05,398
that you brought up in the beginning

1858
01:04:05,398 --> 01:04:08,398
which was about the packages

1859
01:04:08,401 --> 01:04:10,401
being sent

1860
01:04:11,404 --> 01:04:12,405
to non-uta addresses. Again, that is

1861
01:04:12,405 --> 01:04:14,407
another training issue but I wanted to

1862
01:04:14,407 --> 01:04:16,807
bring up that of

1863
01:04:17,410 --> 01:04:18,411
the

1864
01:04:18,411 --> 01:04:21,411
numbers, two people were responsible

1865
01:04:23,416 --> 01:04:24,417
for 60% of those

1866
01:04:24,417 --> 01:04:26,419
transactions so those two people have been

1867
01:04:26,419 --> 01:04:28,419
identified and those

1868
01:04:28,421 --> 01:04:29,422
specific retraining's but it wasn't

1869
01:04:29,422 --> 01:04:31,422
everyone

1870
01:04:33,393 --> 01:04:34,394
running amok.

1871
01:04:34,394 --> 01:04:35,395
>> I actually did not

1872
01:04:35,395 --> 01:04:37,397
think you could go to

1873
01:04:37,397 --> 01:04:41,401
a non-uta address. I know you can

1874
01:04:41,401 --> 01:04:43,403
but from the policy

1875
01:04:43,403 --> 01:04:44,404
standpoint. Mini from a policy standpoint

1876
01:04:44,404 --> 01:04:46,404
it is

1877
01:04:47,407 --> 01:04:48,408
not supposed to

1878
01:04:48,408 --> 01:04:49,409
happen but the thing is, when you

1879
01:04:49,409 --> 01:04:50,410
order on amazon, sometimes you just

1880
01:04:50,410 --> 01:04:52,410
forget

1881
01:04:53,413 --> 01:04:55,415
to change it from your personal. They

1882
01:04:55,415 --> 01:04:59,615
are supposed to be using our business

1883
01:05:01,421 --> 01:05:02,422
amazon account.

1884
01:05:02,422 --> 01:05:03,390
>> okay. >> that is helpful.

1885
01:05:03,390 --> 01:05:04,391
it

1886
01:05:04,391 --> 01:05:05,392
takes out the sales tax, anyway.

1887
01:05:05,392 --> 01:05:06,393
>> exactly.

1888
01:05:06,393 --> 01:05:08,393
>> okay.

1889
01:05:08,395 --> 01:05:10,397
with that, mike, anything

1890
01:05:10,397 --> 01:05:11,398
else from your end?

1891
01:05:11,398 --> 01:05:12,399
>> nothing else.

1892
01:05:12,399 --> 01:05:14,399
>> our next meeting

1893
01:05:14,401 --> 01:05:17,401
will be on monday, december 15

1894
01:05:17,404 --> 01:05:19,404
at 3:00.

1895
01:05:20,407 --> 01:05:22,407
we do --

1896
01:05:22,409 --> 01:05:27,209
let's see. We do have a closed session

1897
01:05:29,416 --> 01:05:31,418
to discuss a strategy session to

1898
01:05:31,418 --> 01:05:32,419
discuss topics as defined in the utah

1899
01:05:32,419 --> 01:05:34,421
code in regards to

1900
01:05:34,421 --> 01:05:35,422
deployment of security personnel,

1901
01:05:35,422 --> 01:05:37,390
services or

1902
01:05:37,390 --> 01:05:40,390
systems and that particular meeting

1903
01:05:43,396 --> 01:05:44,397
will be in our map room. With that,

1904
01:05:44,397 --> 01:05:46,397
I entertain

1905
01:05:47,400 --> 01:05:50,400
a motion to go into

1906
01:05:51,404 --> 01:05:52,405
closed session.

1907
01:05:52,405 --> 01:05:53,406
>> so moved to go into

1908
01:05:53,406 --> 01:05:54,407
closed session.

1909
01:05:54,407 --> 01:05:55,408
>> second. >> I have a

1910
01:05:55,408 --> 01:05:56,409
motion from jeff, seconded by beth

1911
01:05:56,409 --> 01:05:58,409
to go

1912
01:05:59,412 --> 01:06:01,412
into

1913
01:06:01,414 --> 01:06:02,415
closed session. All in favor say aye.

1914
01:06:02,415 --> 01:06:03,416
>> aye. >>

1915
01:06:03,416 --> 01:06:04,417
any opposed?

1916
01:06:04,417 --> 01:06:05,418
>> that motion

1917
01:06:05,418 --> 01:06:06,419
passes. We will plan to see everybody

1918
01:06:06,419 --> 01:06:08,421
there in five minutes at a

1919
01:06:08,421 --> 01:06:10,123
quarter after.

1920
01:06:10,123 --> 01:06:13,123
>>> we have returned our closed

1921
01:06:13,126 --> 01:06:15,126
session and with

1922
01:06:15,128 --> 01:06:20,528
that, we will take a final motion of adjournment.

1923
01:06:22,135 --> 01:06:24,135
>> motion. >>

1924
01:06:24,137 --> 01:06:25,138
second.

1925
01:06:25,138 --> 01:06:26,139
>> motion and a second. All

1926
01:06:26,139 --> 01:06:27,140
in favor say aye.

1927
01:06:27,140 --> 01:06:28,141
>> aye.

1928
01:06:28,141 --> 01:06:29,000
>> any opposed? >> we stand adjourned.