Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to welcome each of you. We do have a fairly large crowd tonight, and we will try to move along as smoothly as possible. First of all, I'd like to ask everyone in the room to put either turn yourself into all for place-in-one. Silence out. Consideration to everyone else here. Next, I'm going to ask everyone, I'm going to ask Mr. Bruce Bando, Bando to have an indication. Mr. Joe Hutton, have a pledge of
allegiance.
pledge allegiance.
Thank you, gentlemen.
We will be having a joint meeting with the Planning Commission in just a little while, but
the first item on our agenda is a public comment.
At this time, the Board will help public comment from those registered speak.
Please come to the podium as I call your name.
Please, please state your name, mailing address and the organization you represent.
Each speaker will have five minutes for comments beginning with the green light at the
podium.
With one minute remaining when the green light begins collecting and 30 seconds remaining to
conclude when the yellow light appears, speakers reminded that the board members of staff would not at their
questions or otherwise engage speakers during the public comment time.
The matters in which the members of which speakers may address the board should be limited legitimate matters of
county business, those speakers shall engage political statements, personal attacks upon board members,
The county employees are officials or any other person, nor are speakers in time to use the
abusive language, or discuss matters outside the authority to the Board of Supervisors.
We, I know some people sign up when they come in for things we do have someone here to
speak on the quarry.
Other things also, the one on the, the, the Brawl Mealker, the milk
tonight. This would not be a public hearing. We're only having a presentation.
So we will not be discussing this.
All right, the board members.
This is strictly for information for us.
But we will not have people come up to the podium and speak it or not only agenda.
I do ask you if you have signed up for anything.
It's only a agenda for a public hearing.
I ask you to let me move you to the other.
If not, you'll have five minutes.
We will not respond to you.
If you wait till we have the public hearing,
We can answer questions if you want to ask
first one on the list is Carla Dolce are
they here?
Or do you want to speak now? Are you here for another matter?
Well since we're not we're not having public hearing on that so I suppose you can come and speak on it
And for please
if you would please give it your name and address
Okay, my name is Carla Dolce and I live at three 15 low-lit street southeast and having them
And I don't represent anybody but myself
I'm responding basically to the Washington County Board of Supervisors and Agricultural Committee
view on raw milk and uninspected meat and I'm here to basically to support my local farmers.
But to make concerning benefits of raw milk and illnesses caused by its consumption ranges
with information and misinformation.
What is apparent is that the debate has far less to do with realistic health concerns and
more to do with business interests.
This is clearly an issue of big business versus small family farms.
If there was ever a case for letting the market operate freely from free from government interference,
this is it, with all the family owned farms in Washington County and all the business
transacted directly between those farms and the residents of this county at farmer's markets,
this board has every reason to protect small farms and not impose any sort of barrier to the business
conducted between farmers and consumers.
The health issue is just really quite interesting, but the CDC has reported that there were
three deaths from supposedly from consuming raw milk between 1987 and 2010.
Compare that with some other risks that we all face, for example, the Centers for Disease Control
estimates that 250 people die each day from hospital-acquired infections, so that during that same
period of time when three people allegedly died from drinking raw milk, 3 million people died
from hospital acquired infections. So someone were to get sick from drinking raw milk and then
go to the hospital statistically they would have a much better chance of dying from a hospital
acquired infection than from drinking raw milk. Now I have faith that this board recognizes
the raw milk and unexpected meat issue as strictly a business issue. Big agribusiness versus
low family farms. And I also have faith that this board will let the free market work and allow
family farms to sell their goods directly to consumers as permitted by Virginia Law without
any interference from the county government. Thank
you.
Welcome, sir.
I'm going to have my live in
a matter of view on Poppy Lane, although I'm just over the border sign and this forpinning some
district. I'm a professor of in Marine Henry College. I teach courses in Sustainable Agriculture.
I'm here to speak about the milk issue. I'm also the director of the harvest table restaurant and
Metabute. It's on Metabute Square that supports small scale farmers. We've supported over 100 farmers in the
eight years that we've been there, including Mr. McIntyre, who's speaking. I'm also on the board of
Appalachian Sustainable Development, which looks into farming issues in this region. And so you can see
I've been thinking about farming issues for a long time, particularly small scale issues,
and I'd like to submit some papers to the board, and I do that how would I?
We'll look at a very few handled Mr. Berry, right there.
Because this issue of unprocessed milk has become a national issue,
and it's been addressed by a lot of states.
And one of the models for how to address this has emerged in the state of Michigan,
which is one of the top dairy producers.
And these are the recommendations I have one copy for each member of the board.
And basically I won't read it.
It's 104 page report and it summarized in some bullet points that are over here.
And basically what they're saying is it should be allowed.
And accountability should be ensured by both producers and the people who purchase the mail.
So I'm here in support of allowing local farmers to sell their unprocessed fresh mail up directly to consumers.
We have a couple of years of sign-up for us to speak on the rock quarry, Ms. John Eckenberger.
I'll pass. I'll wait.
And, Max, wine guard.
Thank you, sir.
Jim.
Simpson,
welcome sir.
Jim Simpson, 1, 3, 6, 3, 0, Rivera, Drive, Mendoza, Virginia, 2, 4, 2, 7, 0, and I, 2, represent no, 1, 7, 7, so.
Does it end up the past few days since the election? I received some very disturbing information that's not done right disgusting.
And I will use a ledge because it hasn't come to any legal matter yet, but there have been
many allegations from many different people that the pre-election were all the signs appeared.
Seems like a lot of them were missing.
And some I understand were for members of the board.
If you go to pick only by the pick only, I'm not picking only by you.
You are the board, but they're all you're a little chicken, sir, whatever you want to call.
But nevertheless, the person knows who it is and there might be more than one.
And I find it downright disgusting or childish if in fact this is the case and come to litigation
yet, but it's going to.
And if this is so, this individual or these people need to be removed from this board, that's a childish thing that happened when you're pulling pranks of Halloween.
Not for adults, they're in positions like we're in right now.
So I appreciate the time, and I hope you take it to heart, dig in there, and find out what's going on. Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Here?
I'm a drinker, and I don't represent, well I think I represent a lot of people.
So I won't take five minutes, but in the invocation someone mentioned the right to live
in a free country, and I just moved here about two months ago from New Jersey for that
very freedom.
I can't say that I agree with everything, and with all due reverence and respect, there's
lot of people waving flags and I'm not sure I agree with all of their points but one thing
is very clear to me that freedom that I moved here for included the right to eat what I want
to eat the right to drink but I want to drink and not to be told what I can and can't do with
my own body. So I think that there's some thinking about, and I think you'll find that
as time goes on in the years past, there are more people up north who would move here for
those same kinds of reasons. But if you become the north, there's nothing, there's nothing left.
You know, there's no place to go. So remember those freedoms. Thank you. Thank
you.
Thank you, sir.
Can't read the first name, flanary.
Also on the court.
If I may.
If you may.
My name is Missy Flanary and I'll live at 16371 Pine Hill Road.
I'll also own 16391 Pine Hill Road.
It's nice to finally get to meet Mr. Owens.
I have a criminal issue right beside of my bedroom window.
in the reason that I'm coughing like I am is on a track to land that's no water
than a right away. These two women have perched in there and said, I'm not going to respect
any zone in law or any septic law or any kind of any kind of law that we do adhere to,
live free and clean and quietly, safely. The county has been helpful to me, Mr. from
Mr. Hilderbrand, to the officers, to the County Administrator's Mr. Owens, that I just
wanted to come tonight to bring it to the board to tension because these two women are
the kind of people that when my mother and I about air home, we jump through every hoop to have it
legal, to have it resellable, to have it inheritable. These people say, I'm not going to invest
a dime and I'm going to live on it like it is and there's nothing you can do about it. I have obtained
four protective orders. One man has been put in jail for trying to run me off the road. I've had
and shot over my house, we go to court on the eight tank and I just wanted to bring it to the
board's attention to please keep us in mind and hopefully you will not seem again.
Thank you. Thank you.
Dick and Senator
Sandra,
that give you the last name.
A.L.A. in. Okay.
Welcome.
I live at 273 Spring Branch Road in Bristol, Virginia.
Some of you may know me as an attorney in this area. Probably far fewer know that I'm also a farmer.
We do vegetables and eggs on 64 acres, and I've been a vendor at the Bristol Market before years, and I haven't been Market for 2 years.
There is an issue tonight that's being discussed about now.
I would just like to preface the discussions with a few facts.
I spoke with the CDC yesterday, and I found out in 13 years from 1993 to 2006, there were
121 incidences involving milk, both pasteurized and unpasteurized.
That's roughly 5,000 people over a 13-year period in the entire nation.
There were almost twice as many illnesses from pastureised milk as it were on pastureised
milk, although admittedly fewer people drink on pastureised milk.
My comparison, as someone else also said to you, over a 13-year period for Washington County
Virginia alone, consider the hospitalizations, illnesses, and deaths from cigarette smoking,
gunshot wounds, automobile accidents, probably in excess of 5,000 for our little pounding
over that period of time, where there were 5,000 for the entire nation,
Virginia has adopted
the federal regulations regarding milk and it is very comprehensive. It regulates the distribution
and sale of milk. It does not regulate consumption as such. Do we really want laws that
prohibit a family from putting a picture of milk on their table that comes from messy,
their cow in their barn in their backyard?
Please remember this issue of milk refers to both
unpasturized and pasteurized milk. And both cause a very insignificant danger to society.
Finally, I draw your attention to Virginia Code regarding your ability to review this issue.
And if I may, I'll pass this to one of you to pass up.
Thank you.
Thank you, Chair and Nicole.
Members of the Board of Supervisors.
I'm Anthony Flock and then Tom.
My wife and I live on in 18157 Windville Road, just outside of the town limits.
And I'm going to use my time to also dress the milk and the egg and poultry issue.
Speaking, first is a consumer, and then briefly as another small farmer, like Dwayne McIntyre and a lot of other folks here.
As a consumer, we've been for more than 10 years, maybe 12 or 13, we've Lori and I've been by nearly all of our poultry, chickens and turkeys both as well as our eggs.
And for that matter, most of our meats from local farmers, who sold the Abbeyton and other markets.
And for the last six years, I think it is.
we've had a share in a cow in three different farms over that time.
And I'll say that for all that stuff, the eggs, the poultry, the meats, the raw milk,
the quality has been outstanding.
I mean, that's why we do it, and that's why a lot of other folks do it.
The taste, the nutrition is just extraordinary.
You can't get anything like it in the supermarket, you just can't.
The farmers, I think it's that way because all the farmers do in this, just take great care of what they're doing, they know what they're doing, how they manage their herds, how they manage their pasture, how they manage the whole process of either picking up eggs,
are in chickens or getting milk they do it with their customers in mind with safe
clean cleanliness in mind so we both feel in our experience from eating one heck of
a lot of chicken eggs and drinking milk over these last 10 to 12 years not only have we
never gotten sick but the quality has just been just without a peer it's been fantastic.
As a small farmer we've been farming now commercially for about 22 years we grow organic fruits
vegetables and we spend a lot of time talking to folks like Dwayne McIntyre and David
King and Dan Smith and others who are here tonight and for small farmers, a number
of you on the board know what it's like, the margins are small. We are all the time trying
to figure out both how to be more productive on our land whether we're growing vegetables
or raising animals and at the same time to find new ways to sell better markets and new products
And one of the things that the heard shares and the chicken and eggs have done is they've opened up new markets.
We've got a lot more of that going on now than we could have dreamed of a decade or so ago.
And that's been good for the community.
And it's been good for farmers, ain't getting rich.
But they like we have a chance to at least get a decent return on what we sell because of these direct relationships with consumers.
And because we all have to do a bang-up job with the quality of what we do and that's everything from looks, the flavor, to safety and cleanliness and it's because these folks are doing a bang-up job, we're doing that, that the market has grown so well.
So, you know, to sum it up as other folks have said, we take risks and everything we do and we take risks whenever we eat.
And I think the only reason to change the existing law on these would be if these transactions
pose really serious threats to consumer health.
And there's just no evidence to support that in Washington County or anywhere nearby.
And all this record, and if I know evidence of people being made sick and I think a light
of that in light of the demand and the important contribution to the county, I hope that you'll
do everything you can.
not only to stop any sort of additional regulation but to really support
least farmers who are pioneering the way for us.
Thank you so much.
Ms. M. M.
Ms. Dan Smith, 17091 Hollis Lane,
Mr. Silver Jr.
I represent Robe Farm.
Mr. Chairman, I'm members of the Board.
My family farms 124 acres along the North Fork of the Holster River.
Nearmond, Western Washington County.
We are a first-generation family farm that has been in operation for seven years.
We produce a certified organic produce and a certified organic seed for wholesale markets.
We also produce vegetables, beef, pork, poultry, and dairy for our own use, and for
the use of individuals in our community who are interested in naturally grown, local, quality
food.
The Commonwealth of Virginia allows unspected on farm processing of several thousand
meat birds a year for sale directly from the farmer to the consumer.
Our friends in this community are eager to purchase local, local, humanely raised, pastured
poultry.
There was not raised in a two-foot cubic cage eight states away.
We know that if we provide them an inferior product, it'll be the last time they buy
from us.
This is the same chicken that I feed to my own children.
The laws of the Commonwealth allow the consumption of raw milk from a cow that you own,
so we operate a raw milk herd share.
The local folks who want raw milk for nutrition, health and quality, we sell and divide
the shares of our herd, and our owners in turn are entitled to their share of the herd's
production.
As far as public health is concerned, this herd share is a private arrangement.
Only owners of our herd receive the raw milk we produce.
Every owner in our herd share has a farmed in riding that it is illegal to sell raw milk
in the Commonwealth of Virginia.
If anyone is selling raw milk in Washington County, they are breaking the law.
It's wrong.
My dream for my family is that we will be able to live primarily from the stewardship and the increase of our land, and a sustainable, profitable farming operation that provides quality healthy food for our neighbors here in Washington County.
I ask that you not take any action that hinders the freedom of farmers like me to feed our community. Thank you.
My
name is Ruth Condit, and I live at 437 Brook Hill Drive in Abdington, Virginia, and my husband and I moved Abdington last year.
One of the big attractions of this area, to us, was the vibrancy of the farmer's market, and the availability of locally grown foods.
We are consumers of raw milk. My husband is a medical doctor and he's a licensed physician in the Commonwealth of Virginia and he
I actually am representing him too. He told me I could say that and
He's very aware of the benefits and the risks of raw milk and we both researched it before we started drinking it
And we both enjoy it without worry and we're making an informed choice to drink this milk and I would ask you all
Please do not make any laws that would restrict our choice. Thank you.
I am Bill
I've
been laying down, I live at 1-3-3 Jackson Street here in town, and I'm a single
bad, so I represent 0-3, so I have no babysitting.
I'm here to simply share my positive experience of being a heard share owner, my family's
drunk, raw milk, from three different heard shares that we've been invested in over the last
going on 10 years, I guess, dance my, if you just spoke, I work vested in his farm,
we've been with him for three or four years now, I suppose. I just wanted to share my positive
experience with that and the benefits of being at home per chair owner as I see it.
I like being invested in a family business rather than a corporation, being invested in a dairy
operation like that is expensive when I look at my budget for milk, it's five or six times higher,
most people pay but for me the nutrition and the the connection but I guess that we have
with the farm and the operation is worth it for me. It's some of the best milk I've ever
drunk. I'm the second Yankee here I'm from Northern Vermont which is another big dairy operation
I'm from a big Dutch community and growing up all of my friends were the sons of dairy farmers
and so I never had the opportunity to live on a dairy farm, but as much as I could get out
of my parents' house, I was probably on a dairy farm, so I learned a lot about running
a dairy farm and safe handling of milk and how to milk a cow and how not to get run
over by a cow and a dairy barn from one I was young. I like having that experience for
my kids too where they can go out and see the farm and be on it. You know where their milk
comes from and have relationship with the people who are bringing it to us.
It's it's it's it's good for them.
We have a bad panel in the middle
opportunity to if anything to have it be more accessible.
I'd like to see more farmers have the opportunity to see the profit and business opportunity to
make raw milk available to more people.
So that may be in the future it might not even be so soon to be a to be a knowner
But thank you for your time. I just wanted to share that with you
Thank you very much
Thank you
Thank the Board of Supervisors for the sub-continent to speak tonight. I live at two three two two zero Northsburg River Road along the Northsburg Coast and River
been farming there for 20 years with my family, good place to raise our family,
it's our way of living, it's where we get our income from, and been doing that for the
20 years we lived there with raising organic produce, and I'm here to support small farmers and I just
I want to echo what Anthony Flakavente and Dan Smey said. I fully agree with them. I
heartily echo what they said that this is an opportunity for small farmers that we
cherish. In small farmers are very important to our local economy and we need to support them
and to make it where they can be prosperous and not put any hindrance in the way of small farmers.
not to be shackled with excess regulations.
Our country was founded on principles of freedom and liberty.
It helped to make this a great and prosperous country,
a good place to live in.
And I said, let's try to keep it that way.
We're farmers have the freedom to do what they need to do.
And let the consumers, once this type of food,
Let's give them the opportunity.
This is like a rising tide amongst us
where more and more people are finding out the benefits
and they want this kind of food.
They are all milk from cow shares and the opportunity
to purchase the unexpected chicken meat and eggs
at the market and we take our unexpected eggs to market it.
appreciate the opportunity to do that, to market them and I think that the sport of supervisors
has heard a lot about the need to leave the industry on Shackoden and the way that it
is and rather, you know, to everything you can to support this type of industry. And not only
that I just want to put a bug in your ears tonight that I think that all Virginians ought
to have the opportunity to have raw milk. There's a raw milk bill that's been
put before the folks in Richmond and coming up again and I think it's a real good thing
where there's something people want. That would just like to take maybe just a moment to let
audience have a chance to raise their hands for anybody that thinks that the consumer should
have the free right to buy a wrong meal as they choose to.
Wow, what a what a consensus here
of people who want to buy a wrong meal. I thank you so much for the opportunity to speak
Next speaker is here to speak on the core of Toby Jordan, you want to wait.
That's what we think too.
Next was Andy Stockner.
Good evening, Boris.
My name is Andy Stockner.
I'm from 184 Mountain.
You drive, having an engineer in Glenrokey.
I'm a fixed supporter of the local farmer.
Hi, I grew up on a 85 acre farm in Hillsville, Virginia, where we've milked
cows and trying to crawl milk in and sold the raw milk to our community. Our community was one of the
healthiest people in our county. My brothers and I, we really enjoyed the raw milk and unexpected
me, where we would meet, it would be a community thing in Thanksgiving, where we'd meet and
and butcher hogs in order to provide for our family and also for the community and also we
do that with the cows so I would ask that you would not put any more regulation on the local
farmers. There are hundreds of cowschairs legally operating in the state of Virginia and it's been
the policy of Richmond to not interfere with private contractual interactions of cowschairs
and Washington County should follow Richmond's example.
Thank you.
Have one more on the list, Jackie Williamson, you want to wait.
Thank you.
I do not have any more on this list.
I don't know if anyone else has signed up,
back here, here's everyone else here, like to speak,
hearing public comment time.
If not, I'll declare the public hearing closed.
Next is going to be our joint meeting with the Plan of Commission.
I'm going to ask the Chairman of the Planning Ms.
Charlie Hargis called his board to order the next part of the meeting.
Thank you Mr. McCall, I'm calling meeting you order, Washington County Planning Commission.
First on our agenda is approval of the meeting agenda.
So moved, second.
I moved by Mr. Winder and seconded Mr. Dando. All those in favor please raise your hand.
We have six years, I just felt he's absent this evening.
Let's see next on our agenda, presentation of the special exception request of Ms. Freeman.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Commission members.
We have both tonight a request for a rezoning and a special exception permit.
I'm not sure if it'd be the pleasure of the planning commission to hear both at the same time.
Yes?
Okay.
We need to vote on this. We've got to come and see anything.
Okay. Thank you.
We do have, I believe, in the audience tonight, the owners of the property, Mr. Helms, and the
Rilla to Prison.
Okay.
Thank you.
Tonight, we have a request on behalf of Mr. Helms for the International Recovery Group,
which is a company that is requesting to have the property resumed from R2 to A2 in order
operating light industrial use on a property that is formerly known as the Moritz Candy Facility.
I think everyone's probably familiar with that particular site.
It's located at 8142 Wagner Road, the lower end of the county in Bristol.
If the business were to be approved, then they would employ approximately 30 to 50 employees.
The company would manufacture products and would expect also to contract to manufacture other products.
The products would be used for and you have examples in your agenda material pictures have been provided.
The products would be used for airports, lifting overturned trucks,
some in shifts, tanks, crop buckets for forest fires, you were able to look at the pictures
those examples were provided.
There would be minimal renovation necessary to get the building that's currently on-site
prepared and ready for the company to move in, and I would be glad to answer any other
questions I think possibly Mr. Homes or the Realtor could probably give more details that I have not provided.
There are any questions from his Freeman.
Have any questions of Mr. Homes or anyone else?
Mr. Chairman, I do have questions in general about the manufacturing process that we take in place there.
Is there anyone here that can answer those questions?
I'm not sure.
The Realtor, I think he's got his hand up.
Mr. Anderson would be the owner of the company
And according to his relative, he said he was unable to make it to the meeting, he's on his way back from Chattanooga, but he's unable to make it here, and he would be the one that would be able to give those details.
Thank you.
Thank you, sir.
I would be interested to know if there were any manufacturing problems such as elderly or chemical dispersion or anything like that.
That's where my questions would be and whatever raw materials are going to be there versus
Are they bringing in the fabrics and plastics in sheets and cutting and I really don't understand the process.
I have to make some pretty
Yeah, I know these two
And there is no one here who can answer those questions right. I'm correct in that, no one here who can answer those questions.
Make a motion, table.
Second.
If we table, set to the board at their meeting.
I know a lot of people have been put into the joint meeting, but it's beyond a leap of faith that
move forward and recommendation. If, personally, I don't know what they're going to be doing there.
I can make some assumptions based on pictures, but I don't think we should.
I don't think I would be comfortable making a recommendation in the affirmative, if I don't know what's happening there beyond the pictures I've been provided, I'm sorry.
Apologies to the board.
Can you come up to the podium, sir?
Please come up to the podium, sir.
This meeting is being recorded, and we need to have you go here talking.
Larry Real Estate, Mark Anderson was wanting to be here to answer those questions I can try
to reach him ears on the red and find out that in my conversations with him there are
no chemicals that are hazardous to anything like that that I would have to confirm that
with him before I would be able to address it. It's very light matter, actually it's mainly what
to exist that is putting things together. And noise levels should be very
manageable for what he does. And the only has two trucks a week, usually they go out
and they're not 16 winners normally. They're just local delivery to the airport, the
ship out. And like he just fell in the contract with American Airlines and shipped
there's this week that if you'd like, I would be born to have to go outside and try to reach
by the phone.
Well, what you're saying is basically this is an assembly plan rather than, it's not going to be
manufacturing.
Yeah, they have the particles come in.
They cut up the gator with vast person things.
They don't do that, believe, that they use any chemicals into processing, but I'll be glad
to call it.
Well, we're kind of pressed for time here along you think that would day.
If I go outside, if I get it on the phone now, I'll have an answer for you.
Excuse me.
Yeah, that would be greatly appreciated.
I don't know how to hear a motion.
Or is there any more discussion? Excuse me.
Okay.
Now, do we have a motion to table then?
You made a motion?
If the planning commission is entertaining a motion to table, then I'd recommend that the planning commission set a specific date by which it would continue the consideration, instead of just tabling indefinitely.
Thank you.
I want to tell you what to do to our regular meeting with that be your motion.
We have a meeting right at this moment.
Yes, it is.
Our meeting.
We want to do our schedule meeting.
We want to do our schedule meeting at the next floor.
Supervisor meeting.
The original intent of the joint meeting was to try to accelerate the process.
That was the idea.
Yes.
So with the board, if the board be acceptable, I'd say we move to joint meeting with the next
regular schedule, board of supervisors meeting.
There we go.
Actually, our meeting is the day before they're actually,
in that case, I'm going the way.
Our next regular meeting is, okay.
Okay.
Motion by Mr. Hayden to postpone this table this until our next meeting, which is, let's see.
I think it's 23rd in that correct.
We third thank you Mr. Richardson and the senior we have a second. I'm Mr. Adam's motion.
Thank you.
Seconded by Mr. Wagner. The motion is to table this until I are November the 23rd meeting.
Our regular November meeting for the Planning Commission.
All those in favor please raise your hand.
That was six o'clock. That's unanimous.
Okay. Let's see. I think it's all we need to discuss this evening.
Do I hear a motion to adjourn?
Do you hear me?
Excuse me?
The motion by Mr. Vice-President.
I'm sorry, Mr. Head. Now, there's some favor. Please raise your hand.
Thank you.
You give us just a minute or two, so the planning commission can step down and get our board member
Supervisor Vacken position. We'd appreciate it.
We'll call the meeting back to order.
The Board of Supervisors has a decision to make.
Do we want to continue with the recommendation planning mission to table this?
It will go to our next meeting in November.
It will be a pleasure to board.
I'll make a motion that we table the mission or hear after they're meeting on the 23rd.
Our meeting on the 23rd is quite a question.
We table 81 for Wednesday, Wagner, Redden.
No one is a hands problem.
We
have a motion, Mr. President, to consider Mr. Owens that we table the one we just had from the Hawaiian Commission discussion.
I'll play raise your hand.
We're coming out.
Now our next item is approval meeting agenda.
Are we having additions or corrections?
Mr. Chairman, members of the Board, the only addition was Mr. Smith asked Mr. McIntyre be.
Doine McIntyre be added to the agenda of Royal Milk.
Everything else on the consent agenda.
I just went chair on that, I was a little confused by the agenda this time, I'm discuss with Jason and a few other people.
This board in January of last year discussed some length and unanimously modified our bylaws,
with inclusion of paragraph 6.1.6.
This says, in the interim between election and new members to the board in November and elect election years,
And the seeding of such members at the first meeting of the Board following January, which
will refrain from taking any action that can be postponed.
This is a packed agenda, maybe one of the fulls to genders we've had in the last two
years.
And yet, it's at the first meeting in which this bi-all that we unanimously proved to actually
applies.
Now, I look through this and it's like a number of them are coming here and have certain schedules
associated with their advertising, but it seems bad planning, if you will, for them to be
scheduled at the time that the board has already decided it didn't want to do anything
that couldn't be postponed for the new board. But even so, the first item, a presentation
as I understand the presentation is primarily for the education, the information, the education
of you, if you will, of the supervisors to bring them more in line with an ending so that they can
apply that to future votes, and yet this board will, like a better term, expire in a
couple of weeks, it seems like a presentation like this would make far more sense in January
or February when our new board is seeding, in which they may actually be confronted with some
kind of vote that's related to this information that's going to be presented tonight.
I'd like to go of all items that the our our bylaw
Affirmate would apply to would be to a presentation which is nothing more than educational to our membership and three out of four of the members are the new members come January are not
Are not on this
On this panel to hear with
Well everyone is here and they've given patients of certainly not recommending the
bullet, but it just, well, correctly runs counter to the request of this board, January passed.
Thank you.
Are we having here the Adjustments Recorrection for the agenda?
Not all of our international motion to approve the agenda.
Take it.
Hello, Mr. Owen, second Mr. Pannington, I'll play raise your hand.
The next time, a special recognition presentation,
a special presentation at Coach of Committee for all milk.
Reena Johnson.
Welcome.
Good evening. I appreciate the opportunity to speak to you all tonight.
My name is Reena Johnson. I'm a dairy farmer in Washington County.
My family's been in the dairy business since 1946,
and I'm the third generation off the right of the farm. I have a very
science degree for Virginia Tech and I work in our farm every day. I know
every Cal they're personally and I oversee our entire milk and operation. As I'm
sure y'all know agriculture is our number one industry in the county and our
state with their even a major contributor. In 2014 the Virginia Dairy
industry contributed $3.2 billion to the state in industry output and employed over 13,000
people. So we play a critical role in our economy and we're proud to contribute to our
state in a very vital way. Very farmers are very busy people with very little free time, but
when issues arise that concern our consumers and may jeopardize the industry itself we do our best
to be proactive in addressing these matters.
And it's you that we've seen recently
is a desire to sail and purchase
an inspected milk in me.
Now being a dairy farmer, I'm more familiar with the milk side,
but the principles the same for both.
Our tiny ag advisory committee is in no way
asking the board to take a position on this matter.
This is, I'm simply just a messenger here
from our industry to give our side of the story.
I realize this is a very hot button issue.
Some people like to create a niche market for their product,
and others don't like the government telling them
what they can and cannot consume,
and I understand both sides of those arguments.
My argument, as well, as that is a Virginia dairy industry,
as well.
This many other major act and healthcare organizations is that consumer, high risk, big products such as raw, uninspected meal is a threat to public safety.
Now, wanting to clarify about one of my online handouts. Earlier this year, there were several bills that were considered by the general assembly that were in support of the sale of uninspected meat and meal.
The list that provided contained 23 Ag and Health Care organizations that were in opposition to those bills.
The bills did not pass in part to the amount of support and scientific research performed by these highly accredited organizations.
So that was a separate issue then this tonight.
My granddaddy, as I said, started out milking a few cows in 1946.
He milked his own cows and he grew up drinking raw milk.
Then one day he became very sick with undilent fever, which is bristleosis.
It was determined that he contracted it from a bristleosis in fact, in Cal, who passed
this along with her meal.
He had lifelong effects from this illness.
Ever since that day, the milk he and his family drank was pasteurized, and that's what my
family and I do.
Over 100 years ago, when Louis Pasteur figured out that heating up milk to a certain temperature
for a certain time, killed harmful bacteria, he discovered a process that would protect millions
of lives from diseases, including tuberculosis, brusylosis, salmonella, and scarlet fever.
Pasterization would go on to be considered one of the most monumental health achievements
of that century.
Pasterization simply kills any harmful bacteria that may be inherently present
meal. It does not change the nutritional value of milk in any meaningful way. Nor has drinking
raw milk been scientifically proven to cure asthma, lactose intolerance or any other health
problems. I fully believe the risk of drinking raw milk, especially raw, uninspected
meal, far outweigh the benefits and this is why. Number one, raw milk has been proven to
illness. Especially the elderly, young children and those with weak and immune systems are
at most risk. Number two, even in the most sanitary conditions, and I know because I'm a dairy farmer,
and I'm yielded my own cows. Even in the most sanitary conditions with the strictest procedures,
healthy cows with normal looking meal can still shed human pathogens such as E. coli,
this period in Salmanella. It takes a very small amount only 5 to 10 sales to become sick.
Number 3. As more and more states relax their laws on raw milk sales, the number
ever-lighted outbreaks has risen. The CDC reports that from 2007 to 2009 there were 30
related outbreaks. From 2010 to 2012, there were 51 outbreaks. During those six years there
were 979 confirmed illnesses.
Number four, unpasturized milk is 150 times more likely to
cause foodborne illness. In extreme cases this can mean kidney failure, paralysis, and
And again, these are all statistics reported by the CDC and the FDA.
And number five, big or small farmers are striving to maintain an open and trusting relationship
with their consumers.
And we're also fighting to promote a product that we stay in behind and believe in 100% and
have worked so hard to produce.
If a raw milk related outbreak should occur, the public blame and distress that would
would not be limited to the raw milk industry, but to the entire dairy industry.
For the past 69 years, the herd of a few cows that my grandday started has grown
to 500, and we have done this by hard work. We've missed Christmas's, we've missed
high school sport and events and many years we don't pay ourselves at all.
It scares me to think of our lifetime investment being jeopardized by the black eye
dairy industry would receive in the case of an outbreak caused by unexpected raw meal.
My farm is regularly inspected by the Virginia Department of Agriculture.
We have rules for everything from the cleanliness of our milk and equipment to the temperature
of our wash water for our milk and equipment to simply keep in the door shut on the room
that our milk tanks are in.
These regulations are good because it ensures that our milk is a safe high quality product.
I believe that anyone producing milk for public consumption should be held to the same quality standards and food safety regulations.
Milk is nature's most perfect food.
Pastorized milk is an excellent nutritionist and safe product.
The farmers take extreme caution to produce the highest quality milk with the lowest
bacterial load possible.
However, raw milk is still not safe to drink because of naturally occurring bacteria that
may be present in the milk.
Pastorization is simply a way for farmers to go the extra mile to make it possible for
Americans to have the most foundable and safest food supply in the world.
And I will encourage those who seek to have a personal relationship with a dairy farmer or who wants to know about the dairy industry to get to know me and get to know my family because I'm a local farmer and just like the other farmers who spoke in here tonight I care deeply about my cows and deeply about my product and again I thank y'all for having me here tonight and for allowing me to comment on this matter.
Next, we have another presentation from Dwayne McIntyre.
Welcome, sir.
My name is Dwayne McIntyre.
I'm a small farmer from Russell County,
and managed with cattle operation,
and who has been selling
at the Avenue Farmers Market for a little less than a decade.
I also recently started my own farm,
family farm operation,
which also operates at the Avenue Farmers Market.
I've been providing uninspected
an unregulated poultry and eggs legally to the market for over seven years under the poultry
exemption and just recently started a legally-recognized cow share program under my own
family's operation.
While tonight's presentation was titled in opposition to all of the above products we legally
provide, I'm afraid it's legally-recognized cow share programs which has provoked the presentation
you just received.
Like I mentioned, I just recently started my own farm operation over two months ago, upon
start up a local journalist found our story in Rodin article on us which was picked up by
the Bristol Harrow and a few of the local papers in the region. It was a wonderful story
in my opinion offering a great and biased interest in our program in a small story regarding
the past two years I have gone to Richmond and given testimony to the State Agricultural
Subcommittee on the bills that Mrs. Johnson mentioned, all of which was on behalf of small
in support of the freedom of food choice and free market access.
First off, I'd like to present an owner, how can I send this?
There's seven copies here.
Okay, this is, I'd like to present the legality of the operations that I perform on my farm.
The state recognizes it as legal to produce up to 20,000 chickens a year under exemption,
under exemption, with only the requirement being a need to file for that exemption.
The requirement is dropped for any producer who only produces 1,000 birds or less annually,
which almost all local small farmers who sell chickens and market fallen.
Likewise, egg production is exempt from state regulation to produce your selling a total
of 150 dozen eggs, or less per week, produced by their own hands.
Again, this covers almost all local small farmers who sell the market.
Calshare programs however, fall under a different legal mechanism, Calshare programs
are cow boarding contracts, which are allowed under the code of Virginia, as an adjuster's
lien.
This law allows all men or people who otherwise don't have the ability or land to hire
farms, to board and take care of their cows or other animals, and benefit from them in ways
they themselves see fit.
While in Virginia it is illegal to sell raw milk.
It is not illegal for people to drink raw milk from their own camp.
It has been Richmond's policy, to not interfere with individual rights to acquire unregulated
and unsppected product from their own privately-owned sources,
no matter what the private contractual relationships
of the just-of-programs.
Because of this policy, hundreds of Calshare programs
have popped up all over the state without any interference.
Under state law, it does not matter what the view of 23-day agglobious
represented in the previous presentation is in regards to unregulated
and unsppected foods in these matters.
While we appreciate the concerns of the shellfish growers of Virginia and Virginia Sea Food Council and the Virginia Hospitality and Travel Association, it concerns me and many here while there is so much emphasis of powerful lobby interests represented in the presentation before us.
Now for clarification, I'm not here to debate the advisory committee on the points that contaminated food causes illness, regulated, unregulated, inspected, unexpected, it offers no assurances against contaminated food.
I will have represent the points that the product mentioned is not the menace society that has been painted.
First, Calshares are not a sale of raw milk by any means, and I just want to point out that I am following the point by point agenda item that was presented in the meeting document.
So, Calshares are not a sale of raw milk by any means. It is a sale of livestock.
what people do with their purchase livestock is their private business.
While I agree with Ms. Johnson, this is not an issue of personal privilege.
Mainly because privilege suggests a need for permission. I do agree.
It is a matter of personal privacy, freedom and liberty.
Second, the notion that this presentation tonight was a public service announcement about food safety.
Um, I'm not sure much sure considering all the talking points neglected to offer a comparison
of the industry product, they were subtly suggesting is without risk.
While admitting in this agenda item that industry milk is naturally contaminated with harmful
bacteria such as listeria, salmonella, and ecoli, raw milk from healthy cows has no such
natural contamination.
Not that it can't become contaminated, it's just a natural, it's just not naturally, as the agenda items suggest the dairy industries is.
Also, the opinion that pasteurization does not change the nutritional value in any meaningful way as total bias.
Who has given large scale dairy farmers the jurisdiction to decide what's meaningful and what's not to people who want to consume the living enzymes, the natural vitamin D, and calcium and raw milk versus the dead enzymes.
the artificial fortified vitamin D and calcium in dead pasteurized milk.
Why would pasteurize milk need fortified with nutrition,
anyways, if the nutritional value isn't altered,
especially nutrition, milk naturally provides an abundance
like vitamin D and calcium.
While I have no care to declare the opinion that raw milk is a medicine,
it's just as equally ridiculous to push a statement
of blanket statement that raw milk has been proven to call it illnesses.
In recent years, on first off on here, it is quoted that in recent years 81% of un-pasturized
milk-related illnesses occurred in states where the sale of raw milk is legal and
some form. Well, in recent years, 100% of pasteurized milk-related illnesses occurred
where it is legal to sell. While it seems professional to just throw a statistic in the air,
regarding raw milk in an agenda, it should make sense to the case being made.
The truth is that all contaminated food products have been proven to cause illness.
In fact, in the past few years, the CDC reports that there's not been one single
death attributed to raw milk in the nation.
Meanwhile, pasteurized milk killed three people over the summer.
This summer, over the industry's ice cream outbreak, and just last year here in Virginia,
the industry, the AG committee, and the big AG lobby, represent here tonight.
got dozens of unsuspecting children's sick and a Enrico County schools. I could go on in
incidences that if we were actually talking about food safety tonight, the pasturized
dairy industry has a much longer list of examples to dull, devolgent. There is enough
fingers and toes in this whole county that could count the number of industry illnesses
and deaths caused by the industry dairy in the past decade. But that is not what I'm worried
I'm not here to pull their product from the marketplace.
Nonetheless though, the Henryco County school systems after pulling milk from their schools
reintroduced the very same company back to its students in the fall.
The bunk in the fear-mongering that the milk sickness is going to hurt the whole industry.
I mean the very same company back in the very same, you know, marketplace.
there's there's you know no harm no file I guess I mean but if it was raw milk the whole
industry is going to topple that's what they want you to believe. So while pasteurization
has been proven to kill milk and still there's no difference in safety between regulated and
unregulated foods. Oh let me see something.
The truth is whenever there's a chicken beef or
dairy outbreak in the nation with a recall and that's attributed to it and this is in regards
to the fact that when these sicknesses happen the industry crumbles, but the truth is that business
emerges for people at the farmers market, for sales of people who are tired of the
blind trust that we are demanded to give to the industry. So while pasteurization has been
proved to kill milk and they are still is no difference in safety between regulated unregulated
foods, it does come down to this whole issue being a personal choice issue. We want to
We are on risk, whatever, whether it be the grocery store or at the market. This is not a public safety
matter in our eyes. Under law, there is nothing illegal the small farmers do here in the county,
and we don't appreciate the big aglobbiose coming before you to present a completely biased
opinion on our product, why ignoring the concerns of their own. This is why tonight, I call upon you,
the Washington County Board of Supervisors, to declare your support for the small farmers who live
do business in your county. By giving your consideration and vote on a resolution drafted by
the small farmers and their support system here tonight, on behalf of myself and the small
farmers and local market consumers in the county, asking for your support of small farmers
in the legal business we engage in here in your county. If I could give you guys a coffee.
This resolution reads as follows. This resolution is made in respect of and in support
of small farm producers who engage in private contract and the legal sales of unregulated and
unexpected product under Virginia State law, and consumers' rights to acquire own and buy
food and food sources they'd be in fit for consumption as allowed by Virginia State
law.
Here in Washington County, in its thriving farm market community, whereas the Washington County
Board of Supervisors finds that family farms are an integral part of the local economy
community. And whereas the Washington County Board of Supervisors finds that the ability to
be self-sufficient in food production, strengths, things, the community. And whereas the
Washington County Board of Supervisors finds that a community cannot be self-sufficient
in food production without thriving family farms. And whereas the Washington County Board of
Supervisors finds that the family farms need to diversify the products, and services they sell
in order to be processed prosperous.
And whereas the Washington County Board of Supervisors finds that selling on-form processed
poultry is legal in the Commonwealth of Virginia and provides an important income source
for family farms.
And whereas the Washington County Board of Supervisors finds that it is legal for unlicensed
producers to sell ungrated eggs in the Commonwealth of Virginia.
and whereas the Washington County Board of Supervisors finds that boarding
dairy animals for others that have either ownership interests or ownership
rights in those animals is legal in the Commonwealth of Virginia. And whereas
the Washington County Board of Supervisors finds that those who have ownership
interests or ownership rights in dairy animals have the legal right to consume
raw milk produced by those animals. And whereas the Washington County Board
supervisors finds that a growing body of consumers in Washington County are selecting
poultry, eggs, and cow boarding from these local farms, deeming them to be preferable
to other sources of these products.
Now therefore, be it resolved by the Washington County Board of Supervisors, that the Washington
County Board of Supervisors supports the right of family farms to sell on farm processes
poultry on the farm and Washington County farmers markets and other venues.
Be it further resolved that the Washington County Board of Supervisors supports the sales by
unlicing producer of ungrated eggs at the market at Washington County Farmers markets and other venues.
And be it further resolved that the Washington County Board of Supervisors supports the right
of farmers to enter into boarding contracts with those who have either ownership interest or ownership rights and dairy animals
and to distribute raw milk produced by those animals to those individuals.
We hope that you pass this resolution and show a support of two of the small family farmers
who live in our new business in your county, to the thriving local markets who benefit
from the products of these farmers, and to the continued success of our local farm to consumer
marketplace, which is specifically given national recognition to this county, and offers
much sanctuary to the small farmers who have made this reputation possible. Thank you much for
opportunity to speak tonight and I hope whatever it takes to make that resolution official
I do it.
Those are sectional special recognition presentations.
This is not an action item at night, this is purely informational, so we will do not take
any action on this.
Our next item is economic comment.
Can we add this to General Bessons for our next, maybe there is only General Bessons
to focus in relation.
This is Smith.
I don't believe that in accordance with our vitality.
He post-pondled January.
Sorry for you.
January.
That's five of us.
Second meeting.
January.
Okay.
Our next item is approval consent agenda.
We do not have any changes to it.
Do I have your motion?
We approve consent agenda.
Two votes.
Motion Mr. Panic and second Mr. Owens.
All if I raise your hand.
7 out.
Here, next item is our public hearings. First public hearing will be intent to
resume.
And this would be a pleasure to board if you want to hear on both at the same
time. I'll read the first one, intent to resume. It's farmland incorporated in Plinch,
Prophecy, Prophecy, Technic Number 142-6-1-234, 1-42-818, Request Reson, Prophecy 1201 acres and
Prophecy located on both sides of the south side of state Route 625, Wardland Road, East
side of state Route 645, Wallace Pike, and A2Aculture General, so if you're on to Industrial
General, we'll send you the master of district.
Please do the board you want to hear these together, separate.
I'll make a motion here and again.
It's the secondest of Smith that we hear these together.
I'll say raise your hand.
Okay.
I will read the next one also.
Special.
Request for special section.
Permit.
Garmin.
Corp.
Red.
Green.
property tax matter number 142-61234 and 142-818. Request with special exception for
me to distract and operate a Christian operation to include quarrying. Association was
such operation on property located on both sides of the state of the state of the state of
to industrial generals and laws of my school district if the property is
reason. This Freeman, you have the information force and welcome.
Thank you Mr. Chairman, board members.
If y'all would invite out there if you'd step outside if you want to
tell the police.
Give an application from farmlands, incorporated in
clench properties on behalf of Ag or get USA. The applicants have
submitted both a rezoning and a special exception
application in order to construct an operated
Crestone operation to include
Coring in association with the operation.
The staff has provided the Statement of
In10 in accordance with the section 66-421
of the County Code, which states the primary
purpose of the M2 General Industrial District
is to establish an area where the
principal use of the land is for heavy
commercial and industrial operations, which may create some new sense and businesses that may
have an adverse effect in the business district, and which are not properly associated
with residential, institutional, and neighborhood commercial service establishments.
The property currently is owned A2, which is an agricultural general, which covers a portion
of the county, which urban type development could logically expand as the need occurs.
As a general rule is surrounds residential sections. The A2 district is established for specific
purposes of providing orderly expansion of the urban development into territories surrounding
incorporated areas within or adjacent to the county. The staff is also included a statement
in regard to the future land use map. It's included in your Washington County Conference of Plan.
This area is identified as the general area for the land use classification of residential.
Staff has also included the definition of such.
Mr. Anderson at the Planning Commission meeting addressed the Commission members and
discussed the need for the stone in the area and the quality of the stone at this site.
He also summarized the plans for the operation of the quarry, and a site plan has been provided
in your gender material and detail.
Numerous individual spoken opposition to the request, Mr. Bill Vennable expressed concerns
over the rock blasting, Mr. Bob Williams spoken opposition to the traffic and the landowners
having no input into the process.
as Jane Grant's spoken opposition to the dust, the traffic, and how unsafe it was to travel
to her mailbox right now. Toby Jordan, Ginny Grant, Ben Jenkins, Trace Bradden, Jackie
Williams, and Dwight Reigns were also those of the spoken opposition. Mr. Jonathan Reynolds
spoke in favor of the request. There was a motion made by Marion Compton with a second
by Rostando, to recommend approval, the place of stipulation for consideration that blasting
only a car a Monday through Friday between the hours of 10 a.m. and 4 p.m. and the
question of the rocks only a car a Monday through Friday during daylight hours. This vote
was recommended approval on a unanimous vote. I'd be glad to answer any questions.
This is my
phone's not working over here,
but I'm just feeling what was the record, what was the vote?
The vote was unanimous to recommend approval.
But it was the same amount.
The sixth cell, Mr. Feldby, was absent.
Thank you.
Ah, yes sir.
Part of the question on the zone pictures you have here.
Yes sir.
The H2 is green, R2 is a bright yellow, and there's a patch of a pale yellow, extending down
looks like a near creath on the side of this picture.
What is that pale yellow?
Okay, that would be your flood zone here.
You're right in there, sir.
The pale yellow.
And your white would be your corporate boundary.
And your yellow, the R2.
Mr. Wagner had a question as to that what the planning commission that runs down to Route 11.
Thank you.
Any other questions, Freeman?
Thank you, sir.
Now, we'll declare the public room open.
We have anyone here to speak in favor of this application.
Here's your name and address, please.
My name is Mike Anderson at 1 3 4 7. I'm a good driver in Virginia.
Mr. Chairman, it members of the board and personnel in Mr. Barry.
I'm here to speak on the Clash Properties Department of Corporate.
My partner in Australia Reynolds, we brothers grew up in Washington County.
We both do business in Washington County.
And have we, if you're for a whole life.
We also have a major year from the European Engineering firm and Mr. Jim McGeele,
from USA. I'd give it to you, to have a question if you all have later.
And we would come before you and ask that you follow the recommendation of the planning
commission, which was a six-note vote, and approve this project, or shall we count
the needs more small businesses, you all know better than I do.
And this is, they also have been a quarry on this property, in the past, it's still there,
If this green information, it was probably used to man and to grab all the roads and make this a railroad as they were built, probably in early days.
But a little bit about our project.
It's the Cory business. It's a really simple business.
We can make it as big or as small as we want to, but it really involves taking a big rock to make it much smaller than some of the turn to some money.
which we have to have to survive unless we have many roads because everybody
came here tonight. Some board of agonist was used for to make the
pavement to make the concrete and that thing also from exit probably 14
18 in that area is going to be a really is now going to be a hotter spot all
to the density line. So this will benefit Washington County as though probably somebody
who makes it 10, wouldn't get involved in the traffic and having them to get low to gravel.
They very well would travel to Boston on the density side. So this is great. Great potential
for Washington County to be a tax revenue.
I will say that I call the Commission Revenue Office and I ask them about if I spend $8 million in machine,
by machinery, what would attach to me. I was told approximately $100,000 per year. Then, if you calculate
1,225,000 tons, and if you settle 1,200,000 tons, and you figured it $12.5 a ton, and
most of that takes sales tax value that you come up with approximately $14,000 and it might
be here for greater smaller to be known, so if it was tax, then it might tax for some reason
or other.
So if you add all that together, not to include the industrial tax on the land versus
agricultural in the land, you would come up with a quarter million dollars or more in that
ballpark and the curve is this, it's not started overnight, it takes planning and preparation
to get to where you can do business. And I'd also like to say that the side is basically
you can see one of the shopping centers somewhat over the next 81.
Probably the
quarry side is based, but the back of our property. If you can't everything around
it's an added up, I come up with some more between 300 and 400 acres, which don't all
I've got another hundred acre farm below us, renegade this in the city of Bristol, but you've kind of got a query what to go in the middle of about 300, 400 acres.
And we have already been, you have a commercial interest, we have a V dot, and it's been improved in the bonds we've been paid in that matter.
So I
thank you for your time, I thank you for your consideration and if you've got any questions, I've got these guys here to answer is they might come up
If this were approved properly how long would it be before you started production?
I'm going to say it would take Mr. McGeele to get started and get to some of the rotten up
meat uncovered.
That's one of the ideal things about this site, if you go down low enough, it costs a lot
of the whole rock up to you, but when it falls down to you, it's pretty easy to start
in low enough, that gets a quarry more out of sight of that meal.
Any questions, Mr. Anderson?
Mr. Smith?
How
many jobs do you expect to leave jobs?
No jobs.
I think it would start out with this.
This will help out.
We need to come up in my home.
Come on.
Bring me my job.
Jim and Gil would actually get to USA.
Approximately four to six jobs starting out.
Of course you also have the people that will come and work on the equipment.
You
have the ill-generate.
Other jobs.
What will be the hours of operation?
Other sites are seven
-thirds of weekends.
There will be a need, a customer needs, for whatever they're doing.
These say VDOT is already approved.
This is VDOT, say they don't have to be any speed limit adjustments on borderline road.
And they said they said that was fine and they said that was fine and we had we did put it on a shell-russian line
Did you all have a picture of the
couple more about plank is probably gonna be direct. I think we have some life from we fear
Do we?
But I'll just ask those later
You estimate 140,000 sales tax was that the full sales tax or the county
That would make it full.
I assume we get some part of that here in the county.
And we're doing what people can be gravel in the western side of the county.
Get it now.
I have a question.
What time?
I think a lot concerns about the road and make school buses.
That type of problem.
Potential.
What time would be your last.
the trucks that you left go out that you'd actually feel with grammar and send out.
Any other questions?
I know there's
somebody coming from a local standpoint.
It was a single like a doctor.
Then people will go back that way.
I really don't know, as you
can.
What you're interested in?
Do you do the OT?
Do they require us an acceleration line?
Yes, they actually.
If we would give property to have one.
They said, you know, we're telling you, it would be to everybody's been a thing, if you all would give property to have it, shall we actually?
And we, we won't do what's best for everybody.
Maybe it's like a universal safety and all.
Could you give me into that little more detail on the self-righteous mind, how it's going to be?
I've looked at them.
I have them.
But I'm sorry.
But I think it might be explain a little better how the entrance is going to come in and out.
It's been just right down to the room.
Well, the entrance is not.
It's not where we go into the house.
The entrance is approximately a bit below that.
And there's a runoff on board.
And then the acceleration line comes back toward Lehighway.
Which I believe you're all right.
I'm not going to do that now.
It's a pretty lengthy.
I'm going to say a hundred feet or maybe maybe two hundred.
to make sure that in the speed limit we had 35 was a great, you know, when they pulled me over
doing 4 was 35, that's how I found it was 35, so I said, you know, and then I showed
a total of the signs was that so, but anyway that is a great benefit for us in the county.
It's certainly a plenty of commission recommended, some was friction on the hours, blasting only 10 to 4, and crushing during daylight hours.
Now does that fit with your normal operations or what kind of impact would I
have?
A major problem in this far is your
engine.
Question, I know you have different variables of rock, kind of having corridors, any work from Rick Brath to 57 to P gravel.
I know the P gravel was washed when it comes out, but also you want to produce this line.
And initially,
the dust from having Cory has put me
into any other questions and
went out
to hear the life of specifying application.
Everyone here to speak in opposition,
come
forward, you should name.
Good evening, Chairman McCall and members of the Board. My name is
Max Wigard. I'm an attorney with a law firm of gentry lock out of Roanoke. And my firm
has been retained to represent a number of landowners who own property in close proximity
to the site of the proposed press down quarry, to say that my clients pose the rezoning
application, depending, rezoning and special use permit applications is an understatement.
They vehemently oppose these applications for a number of reasons that you hear more about
tonight.
Some of those reasons were discussed at the Planning Commission meeting a few weeks ago,
And frankly, they were surprised that there was not a significant discussion or analysis of some of those concerns about the potential adverse impacts of the proposed quarry before those made and recommendations were made to you to take action on these spending applications.
Specifically, their concerns involve the...
Health safety and welfare of the residents of Washington County and the users of natural resources
and cultural resources in the areas surrounding the site of this vote is quarry, including
the excuse me, Sugar Hall of Park, Crystal Creek Recreation Center in Gulf of course, as well
as many residential properties in the area along Bourbon Road that are situated on large
lots and our lovely places to reside. Many of which in fact all of which use groundwater
resources for their consumption and use in the hope. Nothing has been said much was
said at the hearing about the plant machine hearing about the potential effects of the
geology and you're going to have a pit a quarry that will have to be as we assume
the water and my clients have significant concerns over how that will affect their
water resources and springs on which one of the properties of the homeowners that we
represent. Additionally, some concerns have been voiced about traffic on board one
and safety concerns. While the materials were provided with the application in
number 40 tonight, Dress, the usage of the road at certain times of day and the
closed acceleration lane and the commercial entrance, they do not address
things like sight lines, stopping distances, and the width of the road for very
of vehicles, including trucks coming from the Korean school buses to pass safely during, especially
during times, once the school children are being picked up and dropped off, which, coincidentally,
it would be during some of the times that the school will be operating and opening and closing.
In summary, we believe that what you have before you tonight is an incomplete and, in fact,
half-baked set of applications that need further consideration.
We hope that you would vote to deny the pending applications because you have a comprehensive
plan in a future land use map that's part of that comprehensive plan that was fast just
this past year that identifies the area of the property on which the proposed board would
decided as a future residential use and industrial uses anything but the description given during
the presentation to you of what industrial use would be is exactly those things that are
not compatible with the residential area and surrounding residential uses. So the comprehensive
plan is in direct conflict with the pending applications for that reason we hope you would
to deny them.
Additionally, without full and careful analysis of the potential impacts of the proposed
quarry use on the surrounding properties, the residences in the area, the recreational
uses of sugar hollow park, and the golf course, as well as the proposed blasting on
historic structures and older homes in the area that have been restored. Without a full
and fair analysis of the impact, potentially the impact of this proposed use on those resources,
what you have before you as a request to make an arbitrary precision on these pending applications.
For those reasons, we hope that you will vote to deny the applications tonight. However,
If you're not inclined to vote to deny them tonight, we hope that you will demand these
applications back to the Clinton Planning Commission for careful consideration of the
potential and potential impacts of the proposed quarry operation.
If you're not willing to do that, we hope that you will table this so that my clients will
have an opportunity to examine some of those potential impacts on their properties, or the
the applicant will have time to provide you additional information so that you will have a full
suite of information in front of you and you will be satisfied about what there's impacts
might be when you are asked to vote on the pending applications.
I'd be happy to answer any questions that you may have, but thank you for your time tonight.
I'd like to ask a question first. Can you let us know who your people you represent so I can
more from my map here, no other location, the job.
Sure, Judy Howard 10 of the map here, Jane Grant, as well as Judy Howard 10, and Ken Grant,
Janelle Bowers.
Can't hear what's up, and Don and Shelby Jordan,
or these are joining for our community.
We can provide you a list if necessary.
Because I'm not seeing any of these on list, but as you join in for our community, in the list
I have here.
I can't comprehend what you're saying from back there.
I can look here at the gentleman at the podium.
The jodens are, and Jane Grant resides on property across the street from across
or runway, from the professor's court.
There's me.
You may some comments about the traffic,
who were born on road, they did discuss this, your concerns was beta.
We have not had an opportunity, I have not had an opportunity to do that yet.
That's right.
Thank you.
We have one afternoon to speak in the opposition to this.
Please come forward.
We've got a gentleman in the back here.
We've got the gentleman stood up for you.
You didn't feel any further.
Well, I'm sorry.
Thank you.
I have a package I'd like to thank you.
Good evening.
I'm here at the request of some land owners, the same land owners, then Mr. Weard mentioned.
And my name is John Iconberger. I am a professional engineer and a certified industrial hygienist with Bob Cornflint.
We are a row-note based consult and environmental engineering consulting firm.
I've had the opportunity to review the agenda that was provided on the board of supervisors as well as inspect the site from public road.
Based on the review of the information that I've been provided, I have four primary concerns about this project.
One, the groundwater risks have not been defined for the project.
Secondly, the traffic study that was presented by the two of the board, in my opinion, is inadequate.
Thirdly, there hasn't in to my knowledge for any effort to address the study of the noise potential.
And lastly, in reviewing the agenda board agenda that was online,
I noted that the application from the DMA ME was incomplete and didn't have any attachments.
So it was that it was not possible to review the complete application.
I'd like to address each of these concerns individually.
First off, I'd like to talk about the groundwater risk.
The mine itself is being constructed in the limestone bedrock of that area.
And while I'm starting to cut carbonate, cut the carbonate bedrock also provides a local
potable groundwater source for area residents, limestone geology or carstiology is typically
characterized by having a lot of solution pockets or being very coarse below the ground.
This presents a real concern for potential groundwater contamination, because you have this
core's bedrock, surface pollutants can easily migrate to groundwater and then when the
in groundwater they can become very widespread, very quickly. Therefore there's a, there's
a real concern for potential groundwater contamination associated with the mining operations.
One of those being elevated turbidity and then also if there are any petroleum oil releases
from the site, they could in effect water and this would have an effect on a joining properties
the wells or springs. A second concern is that as part of the mining operations, they're
going to construct this kit to a elevation of approximately 2,000 feet above sea level.
As part of these operations, they're going to have to de-water the mine pit. This is going
to have two effects. One is going to locally reduce the groundwater table and could potentially
because the local change in the groundwater gradient, I even make the water flow a different direction than it does naturally.
These effects could have a profound effect on groundwater wells and springs in the area,
and actually reduce their capacity of the productivity, and in some cases they even make them go dry.
Under the DMEE regulations, any mining below the water table requires that a mining
of water resources study be completed to evaluate the overall impacts to the groundwater
of the overall hydrologic soil cycle, for that reason I recommend that a comprehensive
groundwater study be completed and reviewed prior to approval of this.
Second concern that I have is regarding traffic.
As was mentioned, one traffic study has been completed.
This study was very limited in its review, and that it only looked at the adequacy or need of a commercial entrance for the mine.
What it did not do was determine whether or not borderline road can adequately handle the additional truck traffic.
Route 625 has only a 20-foot-wide driving service, which is the minimum per Ashstroke design guidelines.
Secondly, it has a very limited shoulder, less than as recommended by Ashstroke.
A third concern is that there is an extensive number of sharp hidden blind curves on this road,
and a very steep grade as you drop off the route 645.
These can think the combination of their erode and lack of shoulder raises the concern
that the erode may not be able to support future truck traffic and be able to safely
allow the passage of other large vehicles, including public schools.
Secondly, the curves and the steep grades, particularly as you go down to Route 645,
presents a significant risk to residents in their driveways, because they don't have an
but line of sight, the safely pull out in the road, and if you have a heavy truck traveling
down these steep grades, it could present, they may not be an adequate stop-existant.
The ash dough, which is a national guideline on highway design, does provide special consideration
for loaded vehicles, and so I would recommend that prior to passage that you require an expanded
traffic of study, that addresses the adequacy, determines whether or not to 6.25 itself
is adequate to support the additional traffic.
The third concern is regarding noise.
While the county does exempt mining operations from the noise ordinances, mining operations
are very noisy, the crushing and blasting operations, there's a certain whether or not this
would be in keeping with the other uses of the area, including the public park, public schools,
public golf course and residential areas.
It's for your consideration, in a similar plot, in a similar project located in Shannon Doe
at County, the DMME of actually required an noise assessment study that you completed prior
to approval of the mind, and I recommend that this same similar study you completed for
this site.
A final concern is regarding the availability of the DME permit application.
As I mentioned earlier in my talk, the Board of Supervisors agenda that was provided online did not include a complete application.
It only included the front paperwork.
Any kind of applications is going to be accompanied by an operations plan that addresses a whole litany of concerns, including
Reclamation bonding, drainage, sediment control, screening, construction standards, closure,
post-closure considerations, overboard, bird storage, slope stability, reclamation,
post-line, and post-mine land use, and health and safety, none of the, because a complete
package was not provided, none of these concerns have been able to be addressed.
under state regulations, it is required that a complete permit application be made available
for public review, and I have so I recommend to the board that a complete permit application
be made available for public review so that concerns the citizens can review such considerations
of stormwater management, erosion, sediment control, noise control, dust control, seismic
stability and reclamation.
Thank you.
I just want it's you brief the final commission on this this I did not thank you
Any other questions I got I have one said that the the application was incomplete in the agenda packet that we had yes
Lucy, do you know whether the application is available for public view or was it application
not provided in the first place?
I believe that the information that the gentleman is referring to is the complete application.
Go to the Department of Mods, Minerals, and Energy. The county, the agenda materials contained all of the application materials that were submitted to the county for special exception permit review.
And the Department of Mods, Minerals, and Energy would be responsible to make a complete copy of its application available for public review.
If
for the questions, decide this one, do we know how many schools actually use this one?
The society not.
The other question?
Someone from the audience said three twice a day.
Any other questions?
Thank you, sir.
Thank you.
and everyone else, much speak, or please.
Chairman and Board of Surveys, good evening.
As citizens of Washington County, I'm sorry.
I'm Elizabeth Carroll, I'm speaking for Toby Jordan,
1416, Board One Road, Bristol, Virginia.
She can't just got energized and so she can't talk.
So as citizens of Washington County,
on and around Board One Road, have brought before you
many viable reasons to vote against the outrageous
rock quarry proposal. We were not heard at the August, October 26th, making today we ask
you to truly hear each of our concerns. They are real. I have received numerous phone calls
from people throughout the county in region. I was told by others who have been affected by
nearby queries and there's concerned people told me that it goes through,
that if it goes through,
being rocked and shaken, be on repair, clear, in-store, for feel, just cure feels.
I totally, everyone, ever asked or, to our computer and kept community.
With this land, when this land is blown to pieces, it is forever gone forever.
No amount of reclamation can bring it back.
And then, I hope you, I hope the word forever, resignates in your mind, we can repeat and repeat the wrong in this proposal.
Please do not turn a defier. What if you live in the vicinity of 1416 to 1416?
When it be your decision then,
be honest with yourself.
I think about all the concerns that we have brought before you, would you vote, yes, again be honest, we are no different than you as a citizen of Washington County.
We have collected over 200 signatures that I have here in my hands of citizens that are concerned and citizens of Washington and other concerned people opposing the proposal.
If you would like to have them, I can pass them alone.
We have yet to find anyone in favor.
This is our home, our livelihood. You are playing with.
Would you want to live and disrupt it in France upon life, disrupted in France upon?
As it will do to us, I hope you have made yourself familiar with Board One Road.
And if you have had traveled firsthand the road that is conductive, oh, I'm sorry, conducive to having an oversized vehicles.
I hate to be the school bus driver at 735 in the morning, or 315 in the afternoon.
Which is my children,
Dr. Taylor.
Running the L.O.I. through the curves before the creek.
Down over the bank through the fence row,
broken into pieces, in the woods, in the living is relative to the children on board.
As we got going to keep the road and repair, as it is riddled by the heavy loads of the
constant trips across it, I'd rather hope you to have educated yourself
to far-reaching hazards of the rock quarry, residential means homes,
moms, dads, and children living together as a community.
Do not jeopardize the health and well-bailing of many people over the handful of jobs and the extra tax dollars.
Our lives worth it is our environment worth it.
Our recreational pleasure worth it is anything worth it.
If you decide yes, you are putting all of those things on the chopping block.
A total sacrifice of us.
If it's in your hands, it is not reasonable, reasonable for the lives of so many residents to be disrupted, a way that brings disruption to all of us.
If you allow the zone change to M2, you are opening Pandora's box. Anything could follow without anyone requesting anything, no special exception permits, no hearings, no questions, not fair.
I call file on that move. If you vote in favor, you are about to break your own rule.
When you accepted the position that you were in, you took it on pretence that you would accept the responsibility of protecting the health,
Safe you welfare of all the citizens in the Washington county whether they be in our district or not
Whether they be young or old
Richard poor
Thank you and if you vote as
Mr. Ketton McCall says as that he does you will vote from your heart and you will vote no
I also have a letter from a
President from board one road that was unable to attend tonight, so I'd like to pass that out to for you to read
Thank you chairman and board
Question,
give me your name again, but my name is Elizabeth Carol Carol
For you listed as a joining for opion. I'm the daughter of her and where she's a rare has landitis
I'm just speaking for her. Toby Jordan Jordan. Yeah, 1416 zero board one road
Right beside the property
any questions
anyone else like to speak
We have late in the back and just stood up back here.
Gentlemen, my name is Karen Anstee.
I live off of Windale Road.
There are several people who spoke tonight who are much more eloquent than I.
But just for a case in point, I'm very involved in the Children's Advocacy Center.
I donate a lot of my work to support their efforts.
That building was built 1850 with 10 bricks.
Can you guarantee what's going to happen to that foundation and to that historical property
when this goes?
First of all, concussion underground can't be controlled.
You don't know what direction it's going to go in.
You don't know if it's going to destroy the foundation of houses.
You don't know if it's going to destroy the wetlands.
You don't know the effect it's going to have on sugar hollow.
You don't know what the diesel smoke from the trucks and the explosives and the gentleman said
that they use diesel fuel in the blasting.
So everything that's been said here tonight is trying to draw your attention and your understanding to what is involved here.
And I think the recommendation made by the gentleman back there, I didn't get his name, would be well advised for each of you.
And that is to go deeper and dig deeper before you make any decisions on the matter.
Thank you very much.
Anyone else?
Tell them in the Brown Jackage stood up for useful.
You manage Michael Mompower.
I'll live at 15-254 board line road.
And I'm going to get completely off my script here.
I had written what I wanted to say tonight.
But it already been said by many others.
But there's a couple of issues that I do want to address that I've not heard as mentioned.
And now I'll leave my own, I'm a good half-mile east board-wine road of this portfolio site.
I might not see it, as I said earlier, it's going to be out of sight, but it's certainly not going to be out of mind.
I'm still going to see the trucks.
I'm still going to hear the trucks, because I'll leave right in the 90-degree curve on board-wine road.
I'm going to hear them every time they gear down and hit those brakes.
Secondly, I live right across from the Washington County Senior League field.
I've not heard us discuss that tonight.
Folks, I'm telling you, starting before winners over, after names about two o'clock or two thirty,
board line road from Lehighway, at least to that ballpark, stays busy.
And I mean it's a constant deluge of traffic and a lot of that young young kids who've just gotten
a driver's license is they're not the best drivers in the world they end up in my front yard
several times they come around that curve a little too fast but not just that just to share
volume of traffic during ball season and that goes until I don't know until mid summer I guess until
about the second week.
Go ahead, we can't hear what you're saying.
Yes, well, that guy was in till mid-to-life
cinema, sometime late in July.
And we mentioned a heard it mentioned earlier
about the times of day that this could be an operation
from 730, a place till 330, was what I heard.
I said, we no longer live in a society where everybody
lays home.
7 o'clock in the morning and then come home to 4 or 5 o'clock.
people, I'm in the real estate business and people work so many different shifts and so many
different jobs. Now even kids in school no longer is 8 or 8 or 8, 30 to 3 at clock.
And there's a lot of people who have kids to go to school year around and so they're all for weeks at a time.
and they're home. We're not talking about a really
schedule with people anymore. We're 7.30 to 3.30 and it's
necessarily worse. But aside from the ballpark, and the fact that I'm
going to see a truck traffic in here traffic in and deal with that, I'm
in a real estate business. I'm a real driver. I'm a licensed
Virginia real estate broker. I have been for 38 years. And I'm also a
certified resident to a real estate advisor. And I can tell you all, this is
This is, made really a residential area, and whenever you're showing people property, people who are looking for a home to live in,
they want to know about noise, they want to know about traffic.
They're going to ride up and down the streets where you're showing them property to investigate themselves,
and it seriously affects the value of residential property whenever you've got a business, particularly like this.
That's got this kind of prep-trafficking noise and desk or an own down the street.
You're talking about affecting people's property values.
Now, that's a reason that a lot of us are here tonight.
We're concerned about that.
As everyday working people, we pour what we own into our homes.
My wife and I, both the two acres, our home is out on board line road.
And we built our drain home there.
We had lived inside of Bristol, Virginia and the city.
I grew up in the county and Washington county.
And whenever my wife and I were first married we lived inside of Bristol, Virginia, because
I'd bought a home to flip there.
I was anxious to get back out in the county.
I went to move back to where I was from, and I went to get away from congestion and noise
I was down near the exit, save an area, and so we bought this track to fly on board line
right and build our dream home.
And we've been happy there ever since, but this certainly threatens that this scares me.
And I do hope that you've had professionals here tonight to the attorney and this engineer who spoke, and that they certainly
brought out things that I couldn't even touch, but certainly thanks for you all to consider in this.
And finally, before I leave, I want to address Mr. Smith, you are the supervisor in my district.
and whenever you are running for office you'd strip to these flyers.
And in these flyers it says,
that you were championed patiently, my right to know and to say no,
in county government.
But you'll always remember that our right to come from our creator
and I appreciate that, that statement on your flyer.
You also said that the government's responsibility is to protect those rights and to rise it's just powers from the consent of the government.
And you also have on here that you would oppose resolutely government, which is not accountable to its citizens.
And I'm anxious to see, and I hope to see you stand by what you had in your fight.
Do I have one question? You're a realtor, Chris. Well, I just got a question about, you know, the rock
Query Navigment, where I agree USA is a Navigment. How can you explain the growth of the anti-smil
road and do your field subdivision, being so close proximity to that query? And in fact, you're
So for Cross-Road is the having been sewer plant.
How can you explain that the explosion of a house is big houses on Vance's Mero.
I can't.
The having the market really is not part of my market.
I show property on the case.
That's what you can't mean.
Vance's Mero is what you can't mean.
Well a lot of that area is kind of having to do this in court.
No.
Don't mail road out to them.
Well, Vance's Mero is, that's all what you can.
And how about the Iran, is that not inside the town of Avington?
I'm not sure.
I don't think the crowd said, the interstate does have the interstate.
The only comment I could think on that is the fact that that's already exposed to the interstate anyway there.
So I think it'd be some trade-offs there with people.
But that's just not normally my market, at least the price will rise.
It's not.
And I show property up there by dawn of praise and having been marketing anymore.
You know the question if you do.
Thanks, sir.
Yes, sir.
Thank you.
It's full and I believe you've done it.
My name is Dury Fulton.
I represent universal fibers at 1.401 Industrial Park Road.
Our industry is not an adjoining landowner to this proposed site.
So we are a bit behind in this process.
We just came, we came cleanly aware of it this week,
when we were notified by one of your prior supervisors
that understands our plant sensitivity to clean air.
And that supervisor, completed with our understanding,
and if we wanted to become involved tonight would be our time.
We operate 23, 300 plus horsepower, air compressors in our process.
We have over 60 HVAC systems and all of this equipment is relied on clean incoming air.
In that, we haven't had the opportunity to view an environmental impact study, or to complete
one of our own. We're not here in opposition and we're not here in support of this process only
to ask that a final positive vote would not be given tonight until we have the opportunities
I described as far as the environmental impacts to our company.
Thank you. A number of years ago there was a cement plant going above y'all in the
worst concern about the dust and what became of that. This board is super visor than I
did application.
Any questions, gentlemen? Thank you sir. Thank you.
You want to have a question? I have a question. Would universal fibers, would they pay for this study?
So if we're required, I'll just ask the question.
I should complete our own study.
We must definitely would.
I thought that that's what I thought I heard you say.
I was confirmed.
There typically is, with a land management change such as this one, an environmental impact study required.
I don't know if one has been.
I don't know if it's required in this county.
But in that, even Beaver Creek, which is an enjoyment to this property, is a listed endangered
body of water, I would expect that one would have been completed, but I don't know
that.
Thank you.
Now, to answer your question directly to the effect on our system, we would do our own environmentally
impact airborne particular because that's our concern.
My name is
Tammy Gilllin and I live at 1442 board 1 road and we live probably about half
a mile headed toward Lee Highway from this proposed site but a couple questions that I
I'm sorry, I didn't get your name, but I heard about the dimensions of the road and several years ago when they were doing this study on the concrete plan.
I did Call V dot and had measurements which I can probably get again. I have them at home, but we had measurements of the concrete trucks and we had measurements of a school bus.
And we proved that if they are each passing on board one road that one of the vehicles will go off of the road.
Well, if you have traveled on board one road or if you had just go there and look, there is not very much room for either one to go off.
And it presents a lot of danger.
Our children read the school bus.
And right before our house there is a heel, and you can't see over top of that heel.
Several times there is almost been serious accidents. I have ran from the house screaming at the bus driver because I see the trucks coming even if it's 35
Coming down the heel and the bus is stopped. There is no way I had that the there was a life saving crew coming
Went on the other side of the school bus. It's a very dangerous road and I believe that I was told that there's 50
It's a very dangerous situation, I believe, so I wanted to answer that question, and also how many school buses, while I know John Battle, I know that Wallace Middle School, and I also know that people's incorporated bus, when it's about 220, so I can give you the times of all the school buses, but they run twice a day, so those are the questions that I wanted to answer that you all had asked earlier.
They weren't able to answer.
Any questions, please?
Thank you, ma'am.
Thank you.
Sounds like speak.
Do we have anyone here from DMMA?
Yes.
Would you like to speak, or answer some questions?
I think that is very easy.
Thank you, ma'am.
My name
is Tom Bid.
I'm the Engineering Manager for the Virginia Division of Menon Money.
And there's Sheriff and Marshall.
How do we question?
We attend the meeting and see.
Could you answer some of the questions
have been brought up to mind about the groundwater in the dust and what's your regulations
would be?
Yes, there'd been that too.
The first thing I would tell you is that other comments made this evening notwithstanding,
we have not actually received a completed permit application for this site yet.
Monitored an application that we probably will receive a complete application sometime next
week.
But we haven't seen it yet, so I can't speak this specific, so this particular sign at this time.
I will tell you, in general, this sort of operation is governed by a Title 45.1 of the code of Virginia,
and under 4VAC-25, 31 other Virginia Administrative Cup and there are several issues that
were mentioned in the night. The gentleman with the environmental firm in his book earlier
obviously is familiar with some of our regulations, but in general we do have as part of the
And a reclamation plan for the site, part of that operations plan includes the valuation
of groundwater under 4VAC 2531-130.6 of our regulations, there is a specific requirement
that the operator show whether he is going to be above or below the water table.
If his operations are going to be below the water table, he then must provide a plan which outlines any possible adverse effects on the hydrology and whatever mitigating measures he intends to take to deal with those issues, so groundwater is part of the review process.
We talked about dust, I think there have been several comments here about dust this evening.
We have general regulations, which deal with dust suppression as a gentleman from aggregate
U.S.A., mentioned.
We require dust suppression systems, typically we, certainly insist on hardening a pavement
to minimize the generation of dust from crook traffic.
In this particular instance, the Virginia Department of Environmental Quality also has regulations which fit two in particular is that as far as dust goes given their operation they would have to have an air quality permit from the EU for the operation of the site and that are quality permit would address dust from all processing machine.
We have general regulations, which deal with the generation of processing and road traffic,
but their air quality permit would require more strange measures under de-huses already.
The other area that de-hue would have authority is that where this operation to go forth,
they would be required to obtain a general loan mechanic permit for discharge of water off
the site. Those those discharge would have to be permitted under the Virginia
Polluting discharge elimination system. And those those discharge would be monitored
quarterly for water quality. So those are two issues you may hear may not be aware of.
Generally as far as our permanent application process goes, we will only receive our
like this or permanent application. We go through it and review it for compliance with the relevant
regulations. This said then includes during each regent settlement controls.
Roads those
were to miss use stability.
Once that technical review was completed, if any landowner within
thousand feet has requested a public hearing and in my knowledge I believe we've received at least six
requests for a public hearing already on this site. It's such time with the technical review was
complete the department division with held a public hearing to allow those landowners was standing
to address any concerns they may have and take that into consideration as we get forth an
process. And only after a decision had been made on the, after that public hearing and the
input received a public hearing with the Department of California.
So that's maybe a
quick thumbnail sketch of kind of how the system works. Currently we have about 440 sites in Virginia
under permit. Probably 200 plus of those or, I think probably 150,000 or more of our
operations for each dollar operations. The other, as you I guess, it's been raised and
I was blasting. We do have state regulations which require the operator to limit the
effects of the outside effects of blasting, and that includes ground vibration and
hero over pressure. We do monitor that, and we do enforce those standards which are designed
to prevent damage to structures.
Who would be responsible for any damages?
Would it be the Bicycle Company or the Corridor itself?
Or is it that side of your scope?
Well, all we do is enforce the code and the regulations.
So if the operators had a compliance, we would force him to get into compliance on that issue.
Any damages, any potential damages would be of an issue, a civil issue,
which would be addressed in other venues.
Did I understand you to say that the percussion from the blasting should not be fell off the property?
No, sir, you did.
I did not say that.
No, sir.
The current limits, well, it gets a little technical, but I would tell you basically the current standard
is basically one inch per second of a peak particle velocity.
That is a nationally recognized standard, which has been shown over the last 40 years to provide adequate protection to structures.
It doesn't mean you won't feel it, it doesn't mean you won't hear it.
The era of repression limits are about 133D.
The decibels put that in perspective,
in fact would be up to maybe a hundred,
a rock band might be up to 120, a really loud rock band might be up to 120. So it's kind of in that neighborhood.
The blast, the area where pressure generated, which is the, that's the noise you hear, we call it area where pressure and that's really a pulse of compression in the air.
and we have instruments that monitor that.
Is it about the fact that we require any quarry in this day's required to monitor
on every shop to require to monitor, hear over pressure, and ground vibration at the nearest
structure, not under operated by the American body operator?
Can you monitor the test at these places, these races that are the closest?
can you monitor the dust there and if and is there a threshold of being me, thanks is too much
test.
We have a general narrative standard on that.
DEQ actually has and you're getting me into an area that I'm not familiar with as DEQ
because we really don't monitor.
We don't really, we don't have any regulatory authority in that area but I would tell you
general there is a general minus 10 micron, standard none of the clean air act, and that's
what DQ, and forces, and they do have the capability to monitor for that desk, for those
dust concentrations.
I know several instances across the state where they have actually come in and done dust
monitoring for that particular particular point.
Yes, I can receive your permanent application.
It's hard to give you an exact answer to that, because it is a very spiced, site-specific issue.
And some instances where there's a little disturbance and a very minimal impact,
it goes pretty rapidly.
And if there are no objections from surrounding landowners, then it goes pretty rapidly.
Another emphasis is where there are substantial flood-sake groundwater hydrology issues.
We had a site the last year, that, when I said, we're county that probably took a year, just to do the groundwater hydrology.
Or six months ago, it could be a bit conferee.
They would have to submit this application to be approved before they would be licensed, right?
Well, technical review, technical review will have to be completed before we then would go to a public hearing process and based upon the input from that public hearing, we might go back and request additional information.
The public hearing process alone usually is a free month process.
I have a question,
4-7, or we've never dealt with BME as far as an application.
So is it standard practice that the board supervisors approve their special exception
permit, or does BME do theirs first while it comes first the chicken or they?
Which one?
How many do you not do it if we don't approve it?
Those are our processes completely independent of the locality, approvals, there are not any five counties in Virginia, and all of them have their own sense of how I like to do business, and what sort of requirements they place, and you have a couple of counties with no zoning whatsoever, and then you hear Fairfax County, which is almost all along to itself and pretty much everything in between.
So our regulations are statewide and they are completely independent of any actions to look
counties.
They take what we have seen in a lot of counties is if as part of a, as part of any resolution,
especially use permit, they will require the operator to obtain a permit from DMA
before they conduct any operations.
we see that oftentimes in these sort of special, special permit situations, or especially
use permits or counties at different names for their approval process, but that is a common
note, certainly, in these different parts of the state, which you get pretty commonly.
Dr. Bledger, a couple of questions. To do your assessment, the licensing permit process, who pays for
The operator is, well, there is no financial requirements for the operator until the firm
made it is.
It's such time as the firm made it approved.
We do have a bonding requirement of a thousand dollars per acre for the area they proposed
to discover.
And the Department will not be issued until a permit from the DNA without cost prior to committing a lot of funds to this particular project, is that correct?
Say, answer.
They could pursue the licensing through the DNA prior to their having commit substantial funds to this project, but it was like a find out whether or not they're able to do that.
Okay. You mentioned, uh, was it 130 decibels, uh, the, uh, air vocational?
103 years. And, and is that at the blast side or at the boundary?
No, sir, that is, that is it to near, that Yann of the nearest structure, not under, or, uh, not under, released by the operator.
Okay. Thank you.
Usually, we see numbers lower than that, but, uh, I would, sorry.
You're in front of your structure, yes sir.
Any other questions, gentlemen?
I want this one.
So you have a, when they have a public hearing.
Where was it?
Where would that be held at?
We, we tried to set them up at a location fairly close at a public location fairly close to the, to the, to the site, the mining site.
And this is since I would not at all be surprised that if we were setting up a public hearing we would be back at the county requesting some assistance and providing some sensible venue for that public hearing.
Any other questions, gentlemen?
I thank you for being here in the next few questions for tonight.
My pleasure.
Well, so you were like to speak.
Let's look to one's back here and I'll let you all in back and speak to some questions and
we'll get to it and be coming up here.
My name is Chris Robinson.
I'm not a resident of Washington County, but that was my choice.
I unfortunately was annexed by the city of Bristol with clear creek.
You know, I want to recite something to the board here with regard to
land using a county, and you should be familiar with it. It's your mission statement. It says
rule, residential, retail, and industrial endeavors, prosperous throughout Washington County,
and they mutually respectable in non-invasive fashion. So with that being your state
admissions statement as a board, my question to you would be, how would you intend to
I can saw that with the fact that you're going to have blasting and dust exposed the community.
How could that not be invasive on me as a resident of the joining city?
You know, these gentlemen have spoke about the need for gravel in the county.
And I don't dispute that.
But you know, I don't believe the need for gravel is such that it has to be stuck between park, the city park,
sugar hollow, recreational way of being a clear creek, next to a school being Walmas Pike.
And I travel these roads every day myself.
I can't hardly pass a normal car in the little amount of dump truck carrying tons of
gravel.
You know, I think, you know, what sort of excites a lot of people and government is job
creation.
I hear that come up from Mr. Smith and it's always good.
heard these folks talk about four jobs and it's great. But I've heard more than that
speak here to not about the hell I didn't convince you to film and the loss of real
state value. Mr. Gibson addressed the issue of real state value and he made a good
example. There is growth in some parts of the county. But what you got to remember was that
the sewer plant was there and the rock fray were there when people made the decision
by there. I bought my house,
I invested in my house, in my home, without a rock query and
without a sewer plant down the street. Unfortunately, we in clear creek are sort of orphaned.
We're supposed to outside the city they don't care much for us, and the county really doesn't
care much for us. So we're sort of one of those folks with taxation without representation
to some extent.
We talked about the income that the county will get from the equipment
on site. I think it's about $100,000 a year. You know, I would challenge the board to
look what's going to be the negative impact to the real estate value in a community. I guarantee
He's going to be more than all sent by the introduction of this mining operation in the
community.
I'll tell you I grew up in Dickinson County, I know a little about living close to mine
and I know the promises that are made, there's not going to be dust, there's not going to be
noise and I've never lived near a mine side or been there one with that's been the case.
Our friend from DOME, I'm not a geologist, I don't know a lot about mining.
He talks about the sound that is permitted from the mining site.
He also referenced traffic noise, 100 decibels.
I think I'm right on that.
100 decibels is the traffic noise you referenced.
Okay.
So he said, well, we can get a 133 decibels from the mining site.
Now, how much more is that from traffic noise, you know, percentage-wise?
It's not 33%.
I'd ask you guys to ask the question, you know, is it how much more is it?
It's not 33%, I think it's probably like 30 times normal traffic noise on my right.
We can look at that out, but I don't want the board to think that traffic noise being 100 decibels,
and then this blasting noise being 133, just 33% increase and sound is a whole lot more, it's probably 30 times what you hear from normal traffic.
So really, I think I want to close and say that you've set forth your mission for the county.
And it's very simple. You know, be respectful and non-invasive.
So I'm going to challenge you guys to ask yourself, how can you have a mining operation
set in the middle of a residential area, literally adjacent to a public park, upstream
of a protected wetlands and abide by your own mission statement as a board.
So I would strongly recommend that you go to this rezoning.
I think you've heard enough people here to not speak out.
Thanks to them in a negative way.
These gentlemen, I'm sure I have a good business venture.
I don't think there's a shortage of rocks in Washington County.
I don't think there's site is the only one they could look at.
And I think there'd be a lot of other sites they could use and have their venture
and it can be used as a lot less people.
Thank you.
Hi, I'm Becky Bratton. I'll have an excellent address as Queen's Light Strive that it's off a board one road.
I share property with my dad and my sister. We have 160 acre farm and one thing that I know just hadn't been mentioned is a lot of this land is grandfathered in agriculture as long as we have cattle.
And so we haven't talked about how the noise will make the cattle run.
And if you ever had to have cattle, you know, you can keep them in a fence anyway.
So you can imagine how this blasting might endanger that.
And then if our cattle gets out and pays responsible, we are.
So that's one thing that hadn't been brought up.
And then another thing is, I'm not sure if anybody's aware,
that their caverns that run all through that property at board one road because I grew
at there and I'll be an enum. So what does the blasting do to land that has caverns
under it? That's a question I'd like maybe the environmentalist's answer or somebody else's
answer.
And then again I'd just like to say how dangerous a road is. There is rarely a few
go by that we don't have an accident. I have sit in the road with a farmer that got hit by
car. I sit in the road with a young man that was critically injured that turned his car
upside down. In fact, it has been six weeks ago that there was an accident right in my
gunpower corner that a car flipped upside down. And also in my sister's creek, two people were
that you would consider it. Look all that traffic. And there's one other issue personally. I'll have a child with asthma.
I have an autoimmune disease, my sister has an autoimmune disease. I mean, we live in a place where we want to open our windows and breathe fresh air and we won't have that opportunity if you let this go through.
I just beg you not to let this plan go in there. Thank you.
Anyone else is speaking opposition to this if you do come forward?
Hello, my name's Jackie Williams. I live at 1-4-1-5-3 board 1-road. Our property will be
diagonal across from the entrance to the query. So we are not adjacent to the query site that we are directly across the road.
There were a couple things that were brought in. I don't have a statement. I'll retipe that some,
talking off the cuff. But there were a couple of things that were that were brought up that I had
jotted them. And I think one of the maybe Mr. Owens asked him any buses going that road in a day.
To me it would matter if it was one or 30. One child is not worth acquiring.
So I don't
That was my point. A lot of this has already been talked about the high school drivers
You know, they're not good drivers yet a lot of them have just started. They get on board one road
they don't obey the
speed limits they go over the over the middle line
but as a
seasons season driver
You see a large truck on your side of the road, you panic, what is that teenager that has just
gotten their license or been driving for a year going to do? Their panic is going to
be out the roof. You need to take that into consideration when you think about putting this
in. It is a residential area. Mr. Gibson, you ask about the growth around the other
They made that choice to buy that house close to that query.
Our houses are there.
The query is infringing on us.
We're not choosing to live beside a query.
We chose not to live beside a query.
I implore you to vote no for this.
I implore you, I implore you to investigate this, do your due diligence, learn about it.
Don't just take someone's word that they're not going to work past four clock or three clock or whatever.
There are so many holes in the, when they stand up here and talk to you, there are so many
holes that they won't put concrete in for you.
Who's going to be there when the property damage happens?
These are all questions that need to be answered before you even consider to vote for this.
Please, please,
listen to what everyone has been saying.
Thank you.
Speaking of observation,
but gentlemen, I'll let you all come back and I think so I'd like to speak here on the front row, and forwarding it.
My name is Stephen Maxfield. I work for B.R. Price Engineering.
I'm a consulting engineer that prepared the permit application to Division of Mental Mining, and also to the feedback information.
it. The consultant spoke earlier about a lot of concerns. All that's addressed in the
application, the reason it hasn't made it to Tom and the gas and Sardt's wheel is a public
participation process before the application is completed. Everyone within a thousand feet has to
being notified by mail, sort of there's two main owners according to the tax records that have
a client, their notification, checked on the internet today. One of them is coming back again,
unclined. I think it's the Kim fixed corporation and maybe the gentleman that spoke earlier
and hearing all he had to say maybe he's a part of that company. I don't know, but maybe that's why
He doesn't know anything about it.
The other company is another corporation called Switch Trading Company.
I think it was claimed that we should have the green core today.
So, depending on what the M has to say about notification for the, except the application is complete.
It will go forward at that time.
Any questions, gentlemen?
Right now, the thing I complete because all owners have not received no duplication of
intent to mine.
There are two owners listed in the type record, switch trading company, in QMPX, have been
notified and several teams by the tax record addresses and the notifications come back
client, I think finally, switch trading company, it's calling their notification today.
Kim fix, it's coming back, I'm calling again.
Yes,
the MMA here, it's to the MMA, or division, mental mining under the MMA,
and it addresses
a lot of the concerns that they can tell them about it, it's the thing complete because
public dissipation processes in complete.
These notifications from my album, except the end of the first.
I don't know what the requirement from division of mental mind years as far as
further attempts to notify the landowner.
I've not made additional contact with the Tax Association to see if the Tax
I'd be late or a clerk collecting taxes or if that's how valid that address is or how valid that tax record is.
Who didn't need this information be made available to the board.
I'd like to thank you.
You have the questions, Filma?
Also, the site distance was measured.
It was in the data application.
Actually, a site distance and speed limit considered acceleration lane was not required.
However, they not deemed it due to the use of the traffic, deemed it requirement.
And we used ever foot of property that these German owned to make acceleration lane.
And the location was picked based on optimal site distance.
is the site, the site distance, the company matters, where the guns will enter, or do I am
road?
Yeah, the other specification for majoring in Adam, it's a certain height, I think three
and I feet from road level in either direction at a certain point, I'm the entrance, I think
in a point and some many feet back from the right away I think 14 feet but you know whatever
those requirements or that's where the measurements were taken.
We're reconsiderating given to the remainder of the road such as sight and distance.
I'd rather have that road mean.
And I think you're one curve and there's the
remainder of the
road.
They have that surveyed up to question, they have approved the interest for me and so I
have seen them on occasion, not approved the interest for me to the road was upgraded.
When they done the year permit, will they consider the entire road back to Route 11 or all to the other road, or will they just consider the site distance and access to your property?
It's like this, it's an access to property,
but there was a traffic analysis provided to
the data that we've done with traffic counts from, it was an actual physical traffic
counts, but it was a online data provided by the data.
It's a vital online, and then they didn't require a specific traffic number count.
as if some of my districts are so forth.
There will be information that you...
by whatever.
If you have many vehicles, we will travel that road
on average.
Yeah, that's available from beat up studies.
That figure.
Nobody's in my permanent application, and I can provide
I guess Tom spoke for mental mining and it's an approved permit, so I think the reason
I'm going to provide you complete copy of the application and I'll just approve language
of the permit.
Any other questions?
I have one.
This information you said you got outlined from 3D, was it's from past traffic camps?
I assume so, and maybe supplemented with satellite photography, and I'm about to stop in town or something.
At least that was the way Pamela Heath,
the entrance part made at Vida, who reviewed the part made, explained it to me.
Any other questions?
Any one else like to speak here?
right up against
Theresa Blankenship. I live at 1.40.48.
I never received a registered letter.
I'm not saying that nothing ever came to me
because I'm actually scared to go to my mailbox to get my mail
because I usually have to wait until both lanes are completely clear
that's how dangerous the road is.
Also, I live, but with my driveway goes, I have to roll my windows down to make sure that I can hear a vehicle coming toward one del road before I can pull out, because there is a hump there, where they keep talking about having a lane to cut off.
You still have a hump there. We're kids, especially in the morning evening. We have teenagers driving crazy, that once that they can't see over that hump
to see if there's any large trucks pulling out our large trucks turning into the entrances.
I mean, I just, I guess I was just sitting right there and he was saying that everybody picked up such two, but I guess I never received anything in the mail
And I don't know that he was telling that I had picked up something, but I had not.
Okay.
And for my understanding, my neighbor had not received anything either.
And I think his name is Douglas Hurr.
And like I said, I'm bright in front.
My property is bright in front of the barn, on top of the hill where they play,
and on putting the office.
I
have close to three acres, a very private, very, I mean, well, you sit on my back porch, see all kinds of wildlife, and once all of this noise, everything else happens, you know, I'll have none of that, and I just purchased my home, I guess it would be a year, this month, and again, I purchased it, not knowing that we would have a query in my backyard.
It's actually the second driveway down from where the rope goes up into the field to the cattle.
In the direction of Wallace, fine.
Yep.
Like I said, just right over that hump, if mine is on the opposite, and I still don't understand how they can say, just adding a lane in their first trucks to get on the road, is going to solve that problem.
I believe acceleration lane would be going back toward the rail level.
Okay.
The next day.
I'm not turning left.
You're coming up turning right.
Again, people coming from windmill road toward Lehighway.
There's a hump.
And they're not going to see anybody pulling out regardless if there is.
It's lame there.
The question?
It's one of those pipes.
Yeah, there's about to change a lot of three names.
They're there.
Any other questions, ladies?
Thank you, man.
Do you want to ask a lot of people?
Yes, sir.
I just want to say that.
You know, we're depending on both the citizens and the company, we're depending on the
dot to say, this is what this road requires to meet the needs.
We're depending on the vision of mine's and minerals in the part of the environmental quality
to say, this is what you have to do to protect groundwater to not pollute the air.
And those people, governments, and check up on us, so all the concerns are kind of being met within those processes.
It's wrong though, we're not paying division minds of minerals anymore, so they're not costing us anything.
But it's actually costing us a lot of money in the form of outside engineering services and just like in our own people and time to go through the permit process.
And will with the Department of Armor and Quality as well.
So it's good for us to know how the county feels about this before we just keep spending money.
And so, you know, if you could vote on it, you know, contingent on mind's minerals or contingent on something else.
I mean, because if you say no, there's no use in us contingent, spend money on the engineering services and all that stuff to try to make this work.
And, you know, if you guys, you know, see it as the right thing to do, then we know that we can, you know, keep paying money to, you know, adjust these other hurdles to get through.
For my experience, we've got to be a reaction for it.
They won't come and build a road and say, you've built a rock parade.
They will say, you've built a rock parade for the man's working and build a road.
I'm just saying that we're depending, you know, I'm not a traffic engineer.
I'm depending on them to say this is what we need.
No, but there have been concerns about the road to tonight.
Yes, it would not be improved until it's necessary.
And then they have to raise the funds where they can do it.
So that could be a period of time before the road to be improved.
But I'm just stating that from the experience I've had on this board.
Any questions, Jim?
I'd like to start.
Thank you.
Anyone else?
I would like to say, let me hand these maps out.
I would like to say the gentleman from the fiber plate over looked the fact that he is close to
his neighbor is a asphalt point which takes quarry products, puts him in a hot permit
as a retire and puts him out into a truck and shifts him out wherever they get him.
And so, it's a little bit unfair to us to meet an external thousand feet away and not
meeting the asphalt point, which is just across the road.
Do you have to make it a man?
And I guess I got this man just for the convenience of everybody, because in the Plain of Commissioner
I talked about dear run of states and how close those houses and how that's been one of the
successful subdivisions of my real estate career. And also, if you look at that yellow
dot-off put, I think we all feel safe here tonight. And it's a crow flies. This
building is just as close to a quarry as much of those people in that area. And I
think you can take the map and see that.
And that's why I brought a map.
Any questions?
Now you're saying this, but I'd like for you, clarify that after the completed application
you received, you will do the studies, there will be public hearings
issued or do that.
Yes, or that's generally well.
Not before any of that happens.
Those are the, well, we will look at the permanent application to make sure that it addresses
all the regulatory requirements that we have for the operation, as such times such
time, as we are satisfied internally, that the permanent application has addressed all the relevant
regulatory items. At that time,
we would, we would then go forth with a public hearing,
and as, because the gentleman with the engineering permission, the state code, there is a requirement
that any property operator within a thousand pleaded to propose permit boundary, they know
if I'd mastered a fat male, so that's what he was referring to.
And that's part of the permanent application is to make sure
that all the people within a thousand feet
all the property owners have been notified.
That is a requirement mistake.
But once there's, as I said, the technical review
of the permanent is complete.
Then we would go to a public hearing.
Whatever issues came up with that public hearing
that had not been addressed in the firm, or perhaps needed to be addressed.
Could go forth or the hearing officer could decide that at a point of fact that even
under the issues raised, that they were all set as factually addressed in the
permanent application.
But that's the hearing officer decision and that's typically a 60 day process.
And then, once the hearing officer writes his findings on the public hearing, those are turned over to
I director, he then, I froze it or it requires it for modification, but it's touched on me,
it proves it within no-to-find, all the kinds of parties, but I sort of find mail of the findings.
It's in the McCombia, I believe in their state law, they then have 31 days to appeal, if they just
appeal would get a certain court to get. So that's generally the process.
In the question. Thanks, sir.
It's very, did you make copies of that, ma'am?
I believe there's some people interested in seeing about hearing the audience.
It's just as a public mirroring, this should be public information.
I've had a request appear. We take just a very quick break on this for a good time if we
like to collect a bathroom break after one, so they can break this time.
First thing we need to do before we make a decision on that, we need to make a motion
to extend our meeting, our time is to cut out time is 10 o'clock, we're not going to make
it tonight, so to make it legal, we had to have a motion to extend the meeting, Dr.
Moose.
Second, I'll say raise your hand.
Now, we've heard a lot of information on here.
I don't know if there's much more can be said.
If I had a burning desire to say anything else, I would close the public hearing.
What the place of the board is.
Mr. Chairman,
have a lot of good comments here tonight.
And one thing I want to say is, I was really surprised
of the individuals who had one of my flyers for two years.
I just hope it's not in the bathroom.
That's so right there.
But anyway, I'd like to make a motion that we table this until the enemy,
It does a study and see what they come back and if I approve it or not.
I'll second then.
If you have a much missed second Dr. Baker that we table this until DMME has an opportunity
to do their thing and possibly get some information back to us.
With us tabling us we don't have a date to bring it back to us right until we have to let
you do they do their thing and then we would go to the mayor.
Can I ask the question here, sir?
Do they have a time frame on when this will be done?
Because I don't want this to be table, didn't know date whatsoever then.
Do they give us an idea on this?
Yes, or the permit review is kind of an iterative process,
but I would anticipate in this particular instance.
I mean, what obviously depends on how many deficiencies we find with it,
and how much to and then from and back and forth between the operator to address those issues goes on.
And it could be, you know, one cycle, it could be two or three.
I would think that we would be able to at least get an additional initial review of this within a month of reception.
But there may be other issues, and certainly it at that point in time, it would not be a completed permit application until technical review was completed.
As I know, we've advertised your public hearing from sure you do.
Yes, sir. We did.
Time frame for those.
Well, as I said, we don't even set them off until that court view of the permit has been completed.
Typically we try to, we try to, we try to, for a lot of least minimum ten days, maybe two weeks notice.
We send the people who are requested to public hearing.
we typically send them a letter by sort of five mail informing them of the public hearing
and we also put it on the Virginia Town Hall website, typically it's how we know
the five folks.
But as I said, we don't set that date until such time as we have a completed permit.
Now, are you involved with DEQ, did I do a separate report or, I mean, this permitting process,
Are you guys working together or not?
We all work together.
I'm aware of their processes.
We see their handy work, but their regulations or their regulations and their responsibility
and ours are ours.
I do know that in this particular instance, as I understand it, if they're going to crush
a material that would require an air quality permit from DEQ.
and I'm also familiar with their discharge water discharge standards under the VPDES program.
So the gentleman who could speak to you, knowledgeably in that area is Mr. Allen Newman, who is the area manager for DEHEAP here in Atlanta.
So you could contact Allen Newman at DEHEAP, he could probably give you specific symptoms of their programs.
I know that the water quality permit is a pretty straightforward process with a gentleman.
I don't know why I can't speak to the air quality permit, but I think it's a pretty standard.
Please, excuse me. The EQ does the water quality, right?
Yes, sir.
And they also do the one around the avenue corner here.
Yes, sir. There's two creaks around it. It's almost surrounded with creaks here.
Yes, or DQ, and then again Mr. Newman, who is the area manager, reach on me and it's your hair and the apping of office good.
The service will have to be there either way I say.
And I think it'd be best that we get all these results first.
Before we set another name.
Mr. Smith's time to change your motion that includes in waiting for results from DQ.
Not just D&A.
Well, if you want me to know about that, if it's the same as I can do like it.
I'd like to come in. The reason I asked this is I don't think it's fired any individual in this room.
For us to table something is set in white for several months to get an answer on what they have to say
with their public hearing and whatever is the reason I brought this point forward.
There's a lot of questions you've been asked tonight. The Sunday I hadn't thought about. I said here in listen, what everybody's got to say, and that's why I asked to see if we could meet a specific date, because I've just done what this put on the table and everybody said, and I can ask, one word out around this, is the reason I asked this.
Okay, but I believe gentlemen, we can't really come up with a date yet, but you have an opportunity to get all your applications in and redo it.
Right, sir.
That's correct.
Any further discussion?
We have a motion, Mr. Smith, a second doctor, Baker, and we wait on the results of the MMA and the EQ,
or we can make a decision on this.
I'll pay raise your hand.
Seven of them.
But this will not be ruled on the night.
It will be active. We get more information from the MIMD and the EQ.
Okay.
Next item for a special for public hearing is request for such assistance.
Tommy and Linda Baker on behalf of JOMB, investment company LLC, property tax and my number 159-5-5-6.
The place of a special section for mid-tune structure operates small visits in general,
more specific dollar store and profit located on West Side of the lake around 58 gc.
In the intersection, which is the LJ Drive, private and eight.
Outer match to a district.
Can you repeat that?
Here it's correct.
It's correct there.
If you're not interested in this next public hearing we can continue,
you want to come up?
Yes sir.
I just want to make point of fathers of Tammy and Linda Baker listed here.
I have no idea who they are.
They're not related to me at any of them.
That's a disclaimer.
This room?
Yes.
Thank you Mr. Chairman board members.
We have an application tonight that's been presented by Mr. Tommy Baker on behalf of J&B Investment Company.
The application would allow for the dollar general store to be constructed on two lots located on Route 58.
Gay City Highway. The staff would like to note, however, that if approved, we would need
to have a boundary adjustment done in order to consolidate the two lots. Christina Clark,
Revis, spoken opposition to the application at the Planning Commission meeting. Mrs.
Revis expressed her desire for the area to remain rural. Angela Van Overse, spoken
Opposition noting she was adjacent to the site, and her bedroom and her office would face
the proposed store, and she was concerned about the lighting, the traffic, and the noise
that the dollar store would generate.
Gary Levin addressed concerns with the effect on the tax rates, and there were property
how it would affect their residential properties.
There was a motion made by Bruce Dando with a second by Terry Grossclosed to recommend approval
with the stipulation that the lighting on the side not bleed over onto the surrounding properties
and that the lighting of the exterior signs be limited to the operating hours.
And the vote was unanimous.
It was 6-0 and Mr. Feltie was absent from the media.
Questions from Mr. Freeman? Mr. Dr. Feltie?
Freeman referring to the map that shows the properties nearby.
Yes, sir.
It looks like about three properties adjacent. There appears to be some sort of store there.
Looks like a parking lot next to it.
If you have, in that particular area, you have a Valero gas station.
It used to be formerly BJ's market.
Okay, that must be there.
And behind the property, there appears also to be a business.
I've just seen Carl and Junior Barney, I've got some of my glasses to the rehearsal center.
You have mum, it's a sign company. Yes, and then farther down the road, you have the
didn'ts only seen business.
And that was seen.
Big Valley.
Nancy and Phil Benton.
Are there any other businesses in the jungle as well?
We're not on this one, if you go on to have a mobile home park, I would be considered, I guess, a business, rental property.
It's directly caught in this park.
I had this freeman look up for me on the gas station. It was built in 1970, so it was a grandfathered-in.
Bristol sign, they were approved with a permit in 1997.
Special extension.
with a special session. Thank you.
Any further questions, Miss Freeman?
If not, I'll declare
the public hearing open. Anyone here to speak in favour of this application?
Yes, sir.
Aaron Dickinson with J&B Investment Company, 325 Aaron Drive, Knoxville, Tennessee.
This is a similar building that project has been before you guys before. It's a 9100 square feet
it will bring eight to ten jobs use about 1500 gallons of water a month as far as the
lighting I'll say I think what I said last time is we can use deflectors and make the
light shine straight down with a parking lot so it doesn't bleed over to adjacent properties
other than that I guess I don't you know I've driven by the Valero but I'm not sure if
signs are on at night. I guess I would ask the board that if anybody knows. They are on a knife.
Okay. Well, I would just ask the board to take that into consideration concerning our signs.
It's approved. I'm going to map you to address any questions. You guys may have.
Thank you, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you. They have a white smile.
Yeah, not driven by at night, so I was unsure.
to write and question that they've had a major idea of this.
Which Jigsson are most, they're all built the same, typically.
Right, they really have three prototypes that can be mayored.
I throw by the one at Routenite, a 10-less night.
And just look over at those lights.
The outside lights are actually attached to the building.
OK, they don't have any pole lights on that one.
I think they had one pole light, but rest of them.
Okay, those lines are actually attached to the building and they want straight down.
Okay, so I just wanted to, that would probably be there.
There's various variations in the type of lighting they can put on the building.
We've been used thanks before, there's a number of different things you can do.
Just depending on the jurisdiction you're in and what they require.
That one out, not saying there's really it's not close to many homes on that one.
There's basis on both sides of that one.
Any further questions for you?
more on location of property here in the size for as much space you have available on on the
girth there. I noticed that a residential house adjacent to it and I read some concerns of you
is the space in your property there to put some kind of privacy edge like a landscape type
buffer yeah we could probably do that now you're referring if you're looking to our property to left
to the right from the road okay yeah we could put we've done a row of ever grain trees before
that's acceptable to the board because there's sufficient space there for you to do.
Now I got a caution you know I mean if you've been out there you can see that it's I mean it's
kind of a difficult slope so we'd have to be strategic I guess on how we planted those things
make sure that they grew and remained alive but more and not get to do that.
Just get a phone and have a look about your...the lot is elevated and it's on a slope.
How much grading work are you planning on doing there?
We haven't gotten in the engineering yet.
We normally don't.
So we have a approval.
So we've got an engineering gauge.
We're going to use the line bar if you guys are familiar with that.
But if we get a proof, we're going to set them loose, surveying and take a look at it, we just don't know yet.
You either have to flatten it or raise it one.
Yeah, I think we'll probably flatten it.
Because I think we have certain standards we have to meet for VDOT and our engines.
So I think we're going to have to flatten it, probably quite a bit.
And possible retaining all around the back.
Yes, sir.
Any further questions, please get in.
Thank you sir, anyone who's here to speak in favor of this application, you know, and here to speak in opposition.
Yes, ma'am, come forward, please.
My name is Donna Mumpower, 1-1-408, Reading Creek Road, Bristol Virginia.
I was in the impression that this particular dollar general store was the one on BAM's road.
I wasn't aware that it was on BAC Highway.
But since I apparently missed that meeting,
I'm just going to go ahead and speak out against this one.
You're talking about having two dollar general stores within 10 miles of each other.
Not a shirt, right?
We need two dollar general stores within two hundred miles of each other.
And as far as at the Gacy Highway, you do have some businesses that are right there.
And I get that.
I'm very disturbed about the one that you've already approved on the Bynoms Road.
especially when I know the background of that information.
So, you know, I've said here through this entire meeting,
listening to each one of you all,
and listen to all these wonderful people in what they had to say,
and it's really upsetting to me that I feel like there's only been one man
that hurting anything, and that was you.
And that's very disappointing to me.
So, I want to speak out that you need to really research
a little bit more before you guys make some judgements
because
I don't understand where you're going in this direction
and you're obviously not for the citizens
because if you were, you would heard everything that was sent tonight
so I'm in opposition too
because I don't see the point having a dollar general store within 10 months
each other
this is the county
and if you want to go to college, just go to town to get it
thank you
I don't know if I can speak
about what you're in close, what you're in the board.
I moved that way, father, the recommendations, planning commission.
Not second enough.
The motion is drawn.
Second, Mr. Gibson.
Are you further discussion?
I guess I would like to say something.
I'm a little concerned that the impression was the more listening.
On the previous issue, I think we listened very carefully.
A number of issues were brought before us that we had to consider.
But they were questions that, frankly, we could answer.
I don't know any, but I'm a board that's qualified to determine air quality or the effect of ground of blasting.
It's one thing to decide whether or not building to be built somewhere,
but to another, whenever the question involves such factors as mining,
and for that we have to defer its experts.
Now we could have just gone ahead and approved it anyway,
because, you know, it's a business, but the citizens brought reasonable questions of the impact on the neighbors.
And so our action was to find out the answers about what we made in the action.
That that wasn't a deferment, and it wasn't not listening to what the citizens had to say.
It was acting on what the citizens had to say to actually get real answers for them.
Any further discussion?
Yeah, I just want to say that, you know, this business is a dollar general store, like the one in B&M's.
Now, I thought that it's super vouchers in South West Virginia and tell about the opposition that we have on a lot of B&M's and new developments and most South West Virginia counties would love to have our problem.
They're not having any new B&M's, they're closing.
And we're one district, one county that is actually having new development, we're having growth.
And you know, if you want to get the car and drive the rest of the county,
do you see what I'm talking about?
Let's pay for a leave.
But people are coming here.
When you have growth, you need things, you need to keep up with the growth. And for that reason, that's why I second this motion to approve of this.
And the market would dictate if you need $2,000, $2,000 and $10,000.
It's the market would dictate. It's cut capitalism. It's cut free enterprise.
Thank you.
for the discussion.
There are motion, Mr. Owen's signature gifts.
I'll play raise your hand.
Let's have a note.
Next application is the request of special section permit.
Ramirez contracting LLC on behalf of any Ramirez.
For Ramirez contracting LLC property tax.
My number 086-5-1A.
Request for special section permits to construct an operator light industrial use.
We're specifically an asphalt panel property located on the south-south-south-south-south
State Route 879 ultra-road at the intersection of State Route F274 Harrison Road, and A2 at
Culture General Zone, Harrison Marshall District, Ms. Freeman.
Chairman, board members.
This is a previous application that was approved in 2008 for a special
exception permit to construct an operate the asphalt plant. However, Mr. Ramirez was unable to complete the construction within the 24-month period.
He is here tonight to ask that it be granted again for approval. You do have in your information, the application data.
The correspondence from VDOT, the environmental quality air permit, we had the application that was approved and granted May 13, 2008 by the governing body of the Board of Supervisors.
You have a memorandum that's provided to you of the action that was taken at the public hearing on May 13.
You also have a detailed summarization of the activity of the previous application before the planning commission with the minutes as well as the proposal and the general information.
that was submitted. And then of course your verification of illegal advertisements, your photos,
and your zoning map. The planning commission meeting, there was no opposition present.
Mr. Ramirez spoke to the planning commission. He did give some updated material as far as
a presentation. You have both the air quality from DEQ in reference to the run-off and the
emissions. There was a motion made by Mr. Joe Hutton, seconded by Paul Wider, to recommend
approval once again of a special exception permit. But this time Mr. Joe Hutton asked
that consideration and it was recommended in the motion. He given to have a signed place
Mr. Ramirez property to ask that the trucks leaving the property to please take the east route on State Route 609 and
Mr. Ramirez agreed to that, so that was asked that a stipulation be placed in the motion for that and the vote was unanimous.
You're questioning the frame?
I don't know.
Can you sit on the stick on six or nine?
There's no six or nine listed on the maps provided.
Is this the same as the stick value, 79?
Six or nine is on human.
Not showing them off.
You're not picking up on your...
When you're mad.
Come and highway.
I believe that map is in D&D for it.
Is what?
Map is in D&D for it.
Oh, D&D, I'm sorry.
Okay. If you leave off of...
I was didn't know it by number.
Okay, I'm sorry.
Yes, that would be a way for them to use human eye way
into town and to...
But they don't want them to take that route
because of the bridge there, it's so narrow, the under.
But they don't want them to take the route
road between there and near the four-eight center.
Right. Right. Right. Right. Right.
to be on with the underpass because it's all works.
It is narrow and there's one where major concerns last time
to head to application for this and where you're
quest to take the signing jet to request the trucks
and the whole race for a truck to want to go that way
would be if everyone at turn on salt works.
And that would be restricted, probably the single actual truck
could get on the underpass.
We haven't problems at that time with breaking the water lines
and stuff on the road.
Okay.
Any other questions for me?
We have anyone here to speak in favor of this application?
I was prepared as you hear.
My name is Eddie Romeras.
Last time, I think I gave the wrong address.
I was a little nervous, but I live at 21380.
Sheffield Corps.
As that pass around just a low note,
I won't happen in 2008.
We were about 2-3rds of the investment,
borrowed the money, bought the plant,
my head loss, bought the property,
so I can start that business.
2008, we all know the economy tank, and certainly it did not make sense to continue and borrow some more money.
But we continue our construction business and from our construction business, we've funded and paid for the plant,
actually bought the property for my loss.
So we had made the investment and committed it to the area.
So we, you know, I could have walked away from it and the default and everything,
But we have made an effort that the pay for it from our construction business.
So I think now the market is coming back as Mr. Gibson said earlier, we are growing
the county and there are some opportunities there.
I think there are some opportunities for local competition.
As everybody here knows, we have some local companies going to some business here,
a devine health construction who is owned by Ocaso, who is owned by CRH.
It's headquarter of Dublin, the operating 27 countries, that grow 100 locations in the United States,
and the report, 18.7 billion euros in 2013. There's a last information that I can find.
So it's a pretty large company, and they do a great job, and they serve this community,
but I think on the smaller size that we can come in and do some of that work here locally.
Next slide is competition with, again, old castle, and here's a $3 billion for the work
in the United States.
So again, I think we can take a small piece of that and work on that.
The 2014 Comprehensive Plan showed that entire area, as an area, for industrial,
the ultra-road
kind of separates the zoning there and so the property sits between ultra road and interstate
so there's nothing else behind and all the properties there or let me rephrase that
most of the properties are actually owned by investment or actually industrial companies.
You can look from the map that I provided might give you a little bit better idea on how
and how way, but you can see that that makes eye is right across the street, half-co, and
a lot of other neighboring businesses, including low fields, of course, you know, you got
whoop-saving distribution center, so there's a lot of businesses up in that area.
Back in 2005, the Washington County Industrial Development Authority actually addressed
the board and trying to get the entire area of resong to industrial.
So there was an opportunity at that time to do that.
A few items on general information, this is an asphalt plant operation only, no cork quarry,
none of that.
We'll bring in some of the aggregate and store it on site, but it will not be.
The site's actually surrounded on all sides, except obviously on all trail by trees, so there's
a lot of blockage from the highway and everywhere else.
We submitted our program at preliminary plants at the time and also provided a bond for
every year and maintain up to date. So we actually have a side plan in the system here
in the county.
The construction operation of the plan that's actually, B.E.Q. is actually
the governing agency for that, so they'll be the ones that come in. And what they do, as
they'll come in, the monitor, the construction, and after the plan is built, they'll come
and then do what's called stack theft.
With Staddle Tell them, it does make the regulation.
It also, then they will tell us how much product we can produce.
So we're limited, the production of the plan is actually limited by the ability of the plan
to produce clean air.
So obviously, first of all, we've got to meet the standard and then based on that standard
and where we meet it is where our production numbers are set by the EQ and then they come
never so often and they check that by doing continuing stat testing.
The season of operation probably nine months out of the year, if you've got a good
year like this year, we'll probably get more production out of it, hope to create somewhere
on 10 jobs between people around the plant and hauling some of the material.
Of course, there'll also be local trucks that will be coming in and we talked about that
is only part of it. It will also be some other structure that we wouldn't know that would
come into by some of that mix. Hence the request put in on the side, it will say which way
they should come in. We can actually also print that on the ticket for the driver. So that
was also one thing. To put a picture of the general area there with what we consider the best
and ingress into it, and as you can see, it will be a lot easier for a driver to go up to exit 22
and you just take exit 22, either north or east or west, basically on 81.
So a lot of growth going on the east, adding as far as for the high school is, and all that.
So definitely, unless they have to go underneath there, and all sorts of works,
it probably would not be much of a need, unless you were putting makes in there
that a driver will go through that traffic to get there.
So you'd like to think that the easiest way of egress would be using that.
And then on the traffic side, and last year, VEDOT actually white and browned 609, put
brand new water lines from 609.
We actually put in the water lines on the project and the sewer lines going from old trail
out that basically enterprise road and enterprise road had been white and so there's
access for trucks and both directions and I think that's it pretty much for what I had
any questions.
What type of you going to have a tower there with your asphalt and how many times can you do the badge?
I think it's a three-toned badge if I remember correctly and we'll have the storage on the upper side of that lot
and we'll put the cold feet in, so we can bring the mixture on the top, material from the top and drop it into the cold feet in there.
So on three times the time, it will take a little while for a truck to load 15 to 20 times.
So you're not going to be...
Yeah, it's a mouse plant.
Not going to be a large volume of power.
Correct.
Yeah, yes.
So it's a vast plant.
So we got a batch and we can't store it.
And as quickly as WS does, that's right in there, it's replaced frames, yes sir.
You'll be more competition with Watson, right in this sir.
Yeah, that's the market that we look to try to capture and pull it beside it, count.
Any questions, gentlemen?
Thanks sir.
Okay, when I first speak,
the proposition.
I do know that we did hear this a few years ago.
You did say the economy dropped.
It was approved, but there was major concerns
about the trucks going down the Illinois highway. That was the biggest concern. There was one here
to speak about the subdivision that was built. Carl's used to be joint manufacturing at
time, and that's up next to the regional jail on the back side, but this is a, I would say,
is that close to a quarter of a mile you'll be from that subdivision as you go up at road, not quite,
not quite, but it won't be right next to it.
If you would, so we cannot, we can hear you here.
Yeah, there's about three or four and actually, their entrance is on a 6-0-9.
So when you get to the intersection, their entrance kind of forge on the left.
They're traffic and our traffic will not make as much.
Any other questions?
Mr. Chairman, I've got this one actually.
Well, she helped it with the legal aspect, but I'll go over it and she's going to
address the legal aspect, but before I begin, we have a day.
Epony that needs to go home if he can, and he needs to report to our forehand of Sukuhi, send one of the two home.
All right, never mind.
This is actually there's an email in your packet from Robert Green with WNL. WNL is actually moving the dirt at the X-19 Walmart development.
And currently the county's noise ordinance covered between 10 p.m. and 7 a.m.
Robert came in the office last week, saw the building official and grabbed me and he said,
Is there a thing we can do to move the dirt at night, do the traffic that is currently in 19?
And they're concerned of, you know, in nighttime obviously they potentially could violate the noise ordinance, and obviously they didn't want to do that.
So the only option went to Ms. Phillips would be for the board to consider an emergency adoption to modify the noise ordinance for a specific purpose in this case for public safety.
You'll see a letter from his Brown from B.D., encouraging, moving the dirty nighttime for the safety and congestion of X-19.
Also, Robert Seminole requesting, we look into this after he and I talked.
But this noise ordinance would, if modified by the board, would actually, as Philips' draft and language would allow the county administrator to make a modification to an exempt for special reasons public safety mainly.
the incordination of state and local agencies for a specific period of time.
So if the Board would approve it, would allow me to have the authority in this one case
with X-19 development to exempt them from the noise ordinance from, say, 7 p.m., the 7 a.m.,
it's kind of what Robert and I talked about, or 6 p.m., the 6 a.m., whatever the Board would
like to do. That's up to y'all, obviously, if you want to provide some guidance on what you
thought the time would make sense. But under the state code, this ordinance, if adopted, would
only be good for 60 days, and so basically it would sunset. So that's what the request is.
They would probably move the dirt within a period of two weeks. It's what he told me.
So if the board was to adopt this and provide the authority, I would basically provide a letter
to WNAO provide the permission and exemption from this county ordinance and provide that
also the shares office in case there was a call. Just kind of a side comment because the
location of the site, the interstate's right there, you know, the noise probably is going to be
about the same as interstate traffic and truck traffic. But nonetheless, they're playing it safe
And that's what the request is about.
It's a very talk to me about this and first proposal was, go from six to six, I ask you
to play with proposed, go from seven to seven, that way they would stop before the school
traffic started coming in and it's also at seven clock in the evening and give more of the people
going home from work to get out of that intersection because I have seen them back up on
the interstate coming down, coming northbound to get out there so they would help with that.
I'll also ask him if they would request a V-Dot to sign a judge or the large sign with the
trucks entering the Warren people before they get there, and then I'll also ask him to
find out who would affect the only ones that on the job site would be the people in departments
behind it.
And if they work off the front of the pile, they won't hear it either because the trucks will
not be dumping there.
thing with here with the engine running of the excavator to load the dirt. The trucks will not be
banging or tailgates because of either the load they will be there to empty. I didn't ask him to find out
where they were hauling the dirt too. I believe it's going your direction out there and calls it might
affect people there because there probably will be a bulldozer there running and the trucks banging
the tailgates get the dirt slide out of it. Fish hauling night to dirt like stick. So, what did you say
It's the property in between Ray Valley Road, and I'm sorry, Bethel Road and Ray Valley Road just on the left.
If you'll remember where WNL was dumping the dirt from the 58 winding project.
It's the same location.
The gentleman's name escapes me, but it's a farm.
The county's already issued the permit to move the dirt to that location.
So everything's done there, so basically it's the same operation that VDIN-WNL used before.
Well allow this to happen. The impact of noise would not affect peak was much as the traffic would affect when you're under your daytime.
As far as I know there's no complaints of where they dump the dirt for the 58 projects, it seems to be a safe location.
The place you're talking about dumping is that down at the turn-off off of the new 50-year-old
on-deray valley or it's where there are dumping up there closer to the upper-end of Bethel Road.
It's just past Bethel before Ray Valley where the land kind of went down on it.
A V-shaped and now it's going to lift it up to road level to the new road level.
A few hundred feet after the Bethel first Betheled.
Because there's another downside down in the most close to the Ray Valley, so it's in that in that area.
There's almost no houses there anywhere nearby, so.
And what's the place where the board on this one?
Did you put that in the form of motion from seven, seven?
This is what you've done.
I'm a lazy request, yes ma'am.
There does have to be public hearing on this.
All right.
I mean, I will open public hearing.
I'm here to comment on this.
I'll have a clear plug thing closed.
Thank you, Miss Phillips.
I didn't like the request that it would be seven.
Was that okay with them about that time?
I think it would be fine.
I know that you'd like to go 12 hours at a time to do it, so.
I think any ability to do it would be greatly appreciated.
And we've one time looked at having to burn brush air and impact it.
We get to hollow it all off with the burning.
They have worked out.
And worked.
So, two of that emotion.
Here but I'll make motion next here.
Who made motion?
I'd need any.
Any recommendations?
Anything except me?
I'll play times.
I'll pay for hand.
I'll tell you one more.
I'll post.
I'll post!
I'll post.
We finished the public duty.
Next slide is general business consideration resolution occurring with a junior part in the
current situation decision to temporary, the closed approach to route 808, Hallsbottom,
Road,
welcome sir.
I'm John Watson, I'm the assistant resident administrator at the 11th resident.
We have some construction projects needing to take place on the Interstate 81, where we
have twin bridge structures that will need replaced. These bridges cross over route 808,
Harbottom Road. And our bridge construction is going to impact traffic on route 808, Harbottom Road.
And I have asked Mr. Marty Harway, I need to be here with our construction division to be here
tonight to try to answer any questions that you all may have at this time. And Marty has
short presentation on this project, please support
Mr. Chairman, more members currently
the Department is receiving offers closed as of Bob O'clock yesterday. The project will
be a design bill project. The reason we're asking the request so far in advance is as part
the contract. We have to tell the contractor what time frame he can work on the road and so
for so that he knows how perfect his bid. Route 81 will be unimpacted other than a speed reduction
based off of safety needs. The project is anticipated to be awarded in April. That's when
type of construction work there to replace the twin structures. They do have to be
complete by August of 2018. It's a very aggressive schedule, a very
tight rally at a weight will be impacted by some of the construction work to go
most greatest impacted residents that would utilize 808 to access back to Route 81.
Currently, it's three miles and seven minutes from the most impacted to 81.
The detour that we or it should, should the Route 808 be closed, the detour would take
folks from Rayland Metos in that area down at 808 to the Jonesboro Road to Route 611 which
has just been newly upgraded to exit 13. That's a 4.4 mile B2 or it's 9 minutes so the
traveling public would be impacted by 1.4 miles in 2 minutes. With this we've got three
proposals, or three options, that we would like for the Board to consider allowing us to,
for the offers to bid on. Whatever decisions made to nine would not be made, it is not
the final decision. This is only for bidding purposes. Once we had the contractors
full plan in place, we would then come back to the Board and request whatever they are offering
to us for more safety and more efficient operations, as I did say, this is a very, very
tight time frame to construct to large structures on I-81. The first option is the
third option that I would like for the board to consider allowing offers to bid on would
be a complete closure of route 808 for the time of construction starting, not the time of
But it's time of construction so it could be closure for approximately a year, maybe along that.
The second option that I would like for the board to consider would be intermittent closures on 808 to where the
Construct your kid, close the road for two months at a time to do concrete deck removal operations, beam removal and plus a setting of beams.
Like it be somewhere between eight to ten closures throughout the year.
The final option is do nothing, not allowing closures on 808, which is not recommended, but I wanted to throw it out to the board for consideration.
This will severely, even though there will be no closure, it will impact users' other road by delay flagging operations because we do have to make sure it is safe operations.
So, that is all I have. One thing I'm just asking for you guys is a resolution of support for one of those options that I can take back and incorporate into the contract for the bidders to consider and bid on fairly.
You have a traffic count on every little possible.
You've been playing a day.
I'd hate to quote that.
If I may, I can get that back to you.
I just want it.
I know it's not used as much as I missed it.
It's a 13.
Where you've just improved it.
And that will help this.
I'm also, because it's just stuff to read.
Yeah.
Also, we're going to get back to you.
All the way to Bristol, is it?
That would be it.
Because typically they would take X at 10 and access 81 that way and we're going to put them back to X at 13.
The only drawback I see is this will be very good.
Close the lane on interstate 81 because they're going to be doing an ever X at 14.
That's going to be very inconvenient for travelers, but it's something it has to be done.
There will be very close coordination, personally responsible for that coordination between the two projects.
And both projects do have to keep four lanes of 81 open at all times except for there will be a loud times at night once the traffic volume dies down.
That's when there's less impact to the users.
81 does carry about 28,000 vehicles a day, but at night time it tapers off to a little bit of nothing.
But it's going to be very landed operations that will take a lane and that will be sitting at beams and so forth.
At this time, the exit-14 project will start probably a project in the January 1st.
With them being first in, that means they had priority on lane closures over this project.
So you could not have unless coordination and traffic volumes did allow.
There is very stiff stipulations inside the contract that says you cannot take lanes or impact traffic during
Washington County Fair, Bristol races, or the UT Virginia Tech football game.
So we have it very spelled out of what they can.
can't date and thank you John. John just handed the traffic count for House
Bottom is 1,500. That was counted in 2013.
Be it with per day. But that's over a 24-hour
period and it is data information.
But we do have a very strict maintenance of traffic
plan for both of these projects, and we do require a large amount of coordination cooperation
from both contractors.
Hey, with your wish list, which one of the two do you like to have?
I prefer option one as a constructor, close it.
That will give us a more cheaper price. I feel. It will, it let me know a lot of the hazards that we can have as far as requiring containment systems for removing contrary to concrete from the bridge, which we do quite often over the interstate, and it's not creating an issue, but I would prefer option one if it was mild.
If it was my wish, retain the flaggers or if you use that often right, which does reduce calls.
We would have, we would have the detour adequately signed and we would not put it in place until we absolutely had to do that.
808 is not considered for any kind of reconstruction in the proposal.
However, I do have a caveat in there that does require the contractor any damages to 808, it's ditched lines
Anything utilities whatsoever. They do have to repair it back to an acceptable form of the department and that will be available
Dr. Beggard, yes, thank you. Since option one is a full closure will that
Reduce the amount of time that the shady one is in fact it will
There is a there is a incentive to the offer
So you complete the project, 90 days ahead of schedule, if so, he will receive a sound
of the amount based off of every day that he completes it ahead of the August timeframe.
One of the questions, just a general one, why are these being replies?
Is it just they're falling apart or you make them wider for it to later spend some free
there's the point of ticket, make ticket points there. The structures themselves are
structurally deficient, deemed by the way we analyze a bridge. As you can tell, the
patch quilt that you see across the bridge decks, they have been yourself no longer
repirable all we're doing now as emergency repairs to keep them and keep traffic moving.
The future bridges will have to have the possibility for expansion.
That is one thing that the design builder has to consider.
And as of right now we have a general concept to the design builder
that he can look at, but they can bring to us other options and other alternatives
that allows us to give a lot more value and they still have to consider everything in the timeframes.
It's an under or over, but now the conditions on 808, there is a site condition for people
coming out of Rayland Meadows taking a left to come to Jonesboro Road.
There is a current site distance issue.
The design builder can not make that condition worse.
It can only improve it, so if they can't change any of the existing conditions on 808.
So it would have very little impact to the users.
So the new bridges won't have a wider stance
to wait to be widened with you.
It will, you can't widen eight, eight, eight under there.
If you so choose to, in the future,
there will be the stream that you would have to mitigate
and work with there, along with the bank
that is underneath the bridge.
At this time, I don't want the design builder would do.
They could have the option to bring the bridge above the end,
which the department would like because that's less bridged to maintain its cheaper
more efficient product and if they do that then you know we would have to look
but if that is something that the board wishes I can put that in there that we would like to consider
possible future expansion 4808 under there.
It's been 1500 cars a day, I don't know, a highway in ten years, that is at a high number for a two lane, there's a lot of it.
It is, it would be what we consider how high and 400 vehicles per day is what we consider low by.
Fifteen's about right down the middle, I would say.
And the, you know, did you study some emergency services if you block that road?
What would they, will they have to travel up to?
They will, because they will have, it will increase their travel time.
We did model that and we did analyze it.
And it will increase it by two minutes of travel time.
There will be very inside of their many, many requirements that will be within this contract.
They have to provide EMS, any 911 services, plus it hits Virginia 5-1-1.
All the informational technology that we have today will be broadcasted to where it picks up on Garmin GPS or anything
of what the closures are and when the impacts will be.
Or questions,
when you do X-14, when you get to do the same thing?
It depends on on X-14, we don't anticipate closing any roadways there.
We told all the bidders that they would have to maintain traffic and auto-reactions now.
Loop ramp 5, which will be the northbound off ramp, will be closed temporarily for construction
connection. The contractor has 15 days to complete that connection. If not, he pays the
department around 15,000 dollars a day until he gets that completed. In this contract,
the any impacts to the main line will be at a cost of $584 an hour that he will conduct
it. He will compensate to come well for any impacts to the trailing public. Not to exceed
I think $14,000 a day.
All right, Janet, what's the pleasure on this?
You guys requested option one.
You have two others to consider.
Oh, it's a nice, an option one.
Thank you.
Motion is a good excuse.
Thank you Mr. Rollins for the discussion.
Would there be any benefits to go with option two other than saving money?
Lead to the travel, if you want.
It just gives them, you can possibly create confusion because then people don't know if it's open,
if it's closed, then they're taking a chance, but like I said, we will sign either way.
Whatever the board we're willing to work, the sense of the security.
I mean we'll gladly work with everybody as much as we can.
It's just that from the sounds of it option two would have a longer impact on the state
one.
Yeah.
I just one question I was having said.
We've indicated that we could request that they'd bridge the build a little wider, so
so 808 could be widened down the road, is that it's something that we should request
it this one.
We could probably request it, but that would be a state decision.
What's the magnetic?
I will incorporate it.
Don't worry about that.
I'll take care of that.
But now I'll also remember.
This option here is for bidding purposes.
I will come back to you again in the future for the final decision.
Because we may have an offer that doesn't do any of these.
It's just, this is one of these things that, I mean,
we don't do a lot of design bills in Bristol,
and this is one that we're wanting to experiment with.
and it's got a very tight time frame, and we're looking, like I said, we received, we have six offers, or six teams that's coming in, and they're very, very good teams, and we're very excited to have those folks coming in, because it's all the way from West Virginia down the North Carolina that are coming in to work on this.
Any further questions?
Mr. Chairman, is the motion to support the resolution concurring with the project?
I just want to make sure.
Back in.
I think you need that for sure.
No need.
Resolution, and you also need the option.
That's correct.
We'll do that in your motion.
Yes.
Should I include Resolution?
Yes.
Option one.
Thanks sir.
Darkness drones.
We've got the discussion.
I'll pay raise your hand.
Seven out.
Thank you. At any time, if you have any questions, feel free to contact me.
Listeners, sir.
Thank you.
Next is Floating at 1844-29 Butler-Thon Road.
Grant Residence.
This year, this week, I saw you.
Yes, Mr. Chairman.
As you know, Chris has been having problems with their flow for quite a while,
and they want to get some kind of answer here from the board so they know what kind of action
of the next step I need to take. I'd like for them to go ahead and make your comments to the board.
Well at first I'd like to say thank you for letting us come today and present this again.
We are coming to the meeting tonight to receive a vote from the Board of Supervisors on the flooding
issue on Bethlehem 100. We have presented this issue on two other occasions to the board,
but the timeline of the damage that has occurred at our property from 2009 to 2015.
There are three main reasons that we see Washington County being responsible for the damage
at our home. Washington County issued the building permit for our home in 2007,
and if that much water float in the area where the home was built, then this lot should have
have been issued a building permit. Subdivisions were required to determine the flow of storm
water during the construction process before lots are sold. This determines the amount
of water before construction and after construction. Additionally, due to the requirements
for septic systems and easements, this was the only area of the lot that the home could
be built. Washington County issued a permit to Kimden Village Subdivision in April of 2008
to allow lots to be sold in homes built on the property.
To permit, allow the developers to drain additional water into the area of our home.
We carry water from Camden Village Subvision, and Buffalo Hills,
Buffalo Pond Hill Subvision, and having the drainage ditch built in 2010,
will not carry the water that comes off the mountain in that area of Washington County.
Washington, came to village to cease construction of the subdivision in April of 2009 and released the bond that they were holding, but we were flooded in June of 2009 and received six inches of mud in air crawl space that we had to clean up.
It was the responsibility of Washington County to ensure that the ground was stabilized,
with grass or vegetation before the bond is released.
This bond money could have been utilized in the first flood to correct some of these problems,
had the county not released the bond back to Camden Village.
If Washington County would have ensured the ground was stabilized,
we would not have had all that mud washed in our cross-phase.
Washington County Building Fisher's officials have indicated that there are only
option for saving our property is to have the house raised to ensure that we
don't continue to have flooding within our cross-based and the potential of
having flooding in the living area of our home. This flooding is an inconvenience, a
financial hardship, and a huge health hazard for my family. We have received several
estimates that involve raising the house, additional block and building steps, moving the
crawl space location to the opposite side of the house, reconnecting the plumbing, having
the breaker box relocated, having additional drainage from Apple Jack Road, which is about
a half a mile left from our property, to our property to control the water on the buffalo
heat pond heals side subdivision of buffalo pond road. Repairs to the heat
pup damaged buffalo water and inspection of across-based formalde. The
cost associated with all these necessary corrections will be $50,000 to ensure the
flooding can be controlled and lessen the risk but we can lose our house to
flooding or have it lost due to the health health risk associated with flood
Well,
I'd just like to add a little bit, I know that I've done a lot of research on that,
and I really feel that we didn't do our job on this one.
Reminds me of the great wind day of flood, and a few other things that we had to come plain with,
but anonymous else was like some remarks here before I go a little further.
Yes, Mr. Chairman, members of the Board.
The trends have now made a official claim against the county and are alleging that the county's
livel to them for the expenses that's mischanted, just described.
And it's my understanding that she has forwarded that,
the transfer Mr. Mr. Mr. Trent had forwarded that correspondence to all members of the board
by email over the weekend. Under state law, of course, the county board of supervisors
is limited by the Dillon rule and the county can only do what's allowed by statute or implied.
Or necessarily allowed by implication of the requirements of statute.
So, there's two things for the Board to consider as you look at this claim that the transfer making, first is the
is a political subdivision of commonwealth, and as a political subdivision of commonwealth,
it is subject to the same sovereign immunity that the commonwealth enjoys.
In other words, because liability is something that's established by law, and if you establish
by the government, then the only way the government can be sued is by those very laws themselves.
So, in this case, the state law does establish a very specific procedure for a person or
an entity to make a claim against the government, and the first step is what the trance
have done here.
They've notified you of the specific amount of a claim that they assert that they are entitled
to from the county.
Now, under state law, once that claim is made against the county, the county attorney is
obligated to advise the board as to whether that claim is a legal claim, or if it might
be an illegal claim for many number of reasons.
So I do have that responsibility to the board to give that advice, and I will give you that
advice.
I'm additionally the board then having heard that advice from me when we get to that point the board will make its decision and if there's of course two decisions that the board may make the board may make the decision to deny the claim or to grant the claim or grant some portion of it.
If the board decision is to deny the claim, then the claimants have to follow a very specific procedure
as set out in the state law in the event that they wish to appeal that claim, and they can file an appeal in circuit court.
But in order to do that, they are required to file a notice of appeal with the clerk, which would be the County Administrator,
within 30 days of the time that the board makes its decision on the claim,
And additionally, they would have to file surety in the amount of $250 to secure their faithful
prosecution of that claim as an appeal.
On the other hand, if the board decides to pay the claim, and if that decision is contrary
to the Vice of the County Attorney, if the County Attorney advises that it's an illegal
claim, and the board decides to go ahead and pay it. Then again, it's an obligation of
county attorney to request that the Attorney General's Office for the Commonwealth is
in opinion as far as the legality of that payment. And if the Attorney General's Office is
also of the opinion that payment of the claim is illegal, then a lawsuit would be brought
by the Commonwealth Attorney's Office against the Board of Supervisors to seek a judicial decision
as far as the legality of the payment.
If the payment is determined by a court to have been inappropriate, then the county of
course of the Board would be enjoying prohibited from making that payment, or if the payment
had already been made, then the county would be compelled to seek reimbursement from the
claimant. So those are the procedures that are set out in state law for situations
of this nature. So in terms of the legality of making the claim, the first consideration
and is what I mentioned earlier that the county has very strong sovereign immunity and in
particular the claims that are outlined in the trance letter all go to matters of governmental
public function and as governmental public functions as opposed to something that might
done by private enterprise, that those activities are subject to that sovereign immunity, and
the Virginia Supreme Court has consistently upheld that sovereign immunity, in other words,
saying that the county would not be liable for damages, even in the event of negligence
if such negligence had occurred on the part of public officials.
So the only way that that liability would occur would be as if there is some specific statute
or constitutional provision that would open the door to that liability and in this case
there's not one in particular for enforcement measures by county officials and building zoning
health, fire, and safety. I'm another matters. The court would not subject the county to
liability, even if conducted in a negligent manner. This has been I'm just consistent
and citizen application by the Virginia Supreme Court. I'm second, as again, as I mentioned
earlier, this is a Dillon rule state, and so the board is authorized to take an action
only if it's established by statute of Constitution or something that's necessary, necessarily
implied by statute of Constitution requirements.
And in this case, there's no statutory or constitutional authority for the Board of Supervisors
to give county money to a private individual to benefit their private property.
And so my advice to the board is that paying the claim that spending asserted by the
trance would be beyond scope of the board's authority and therefore not legal action.
I'm just
received from AMT.
What if we have clearly
taken from the Cannabis well beside would have reduced peak storm
of so forth. It goes on the ideas of my professional opinion that there is nothing
worse than can I can do legally to be able to treat a less active construct and
resume to a can do in the village. You have the idea.
Just keep in mind that they have in the last two months been over their bulldozinges. So technically
an active construction was over there. Now if they've continued it I cannot tell it from the land.
But at one point they had ran a lot of dirt around that property in the last two months.
Whether they got permits to do that, I don't know.
And the claim was made by somebody over on
them in villages side but they were trying to help us if they did not make a mess and
mess it up the first time we wouldn't need help to begin with.
They
had heard that there were issues with the property and some of the areas there were
completed with it, with the seeding and strong, and there was still a pond that the
remnants of the pond that was left over from the original project were there, and so
they went up there to close the pond and to recede and there was some grading done on the
property, where there's a house of the hill, where they relaxed the grade of the mill so
it wasn't extreme, and through that process, we saw that they were doing that, and so
our environmental inspector went and investigated it, and what they were doing was actually
less than what a new permit would be required for a land disturbance, because it was less
in the 10,000 square feet, and it was determined that what they were doing would be of more
help than hurt for anything, because they actually did receive an install area, and it
has established grass now, and the property is actually secured more than it was before.
Which is this the developer who is that the owner of the property of who is they I'm I'm not sure if it's an aim off top of my head actually
He is a well- I call the property very building was
Not of Camden Village if he build the house
He built their house
are they also going to rip right the ditch is coming down that's fairly steep and blind going into it
blow the water down from them to the extent that they've done it is all that we expect
they're going to do.
The huge vector to help the water switch away.
I don't expect that there's much that they could do to help it very much from that property.
While it does contribute to the water flow into there, there's not much that they could do
that would actually help the trans-property.
I believe that, with the daystand,
they would have been required to put a retention
fine there, right, and bleed it out slowly.
And if we're run out to the main road to prevent it from increasing
volume, they wouldn't be required to reduce the volume
from what has already come and down, only to avoid increasing
I
have a question you talked about.
I've given mine to have a citizen.
I remember years ago, sitting right out there,
and I think it was a side of the vision where we split the difference.
How do we get how do we do that?
You may be like split the difference for a road improvement project.
There's a specific statutory program for that, it's set up in state law, and some people call it the rule editions program, and so that's a program that's established by state law.
And you're saying that, basically, we're immune from everything, and even though if it's possible, I don't know what I said earlier.
That's what we're saying.
Very much what she said, no matter what you do, you're not a fault.
I apologize to my mom.
That's the thing.
When I be sitting at the bar, I can demo the debt right.
They know way the debt right.
I think the way you said that, we would be saying no, I think it takes just court and so
us, and possibly not get too many there, or we'd give them the money, and then it's
filed to the higher-ups, and come back and say no, you can't do that, and I'll come to
smack our hand and take the money back. They're right. So it's a catch 22 either way we give.
Well, if the board were to give the money, then at a court where the lighter site was
appropriate than the county would be obligated to do to sue the trance and try to get the money back.
Well, but if we went to court and over you all did agree to it, and we kept the money in some kind
of limbo until the court decided it's a third party for third party opinion about it.
How does that work?
Well, the board could take action and make a decision,
as far as the money goes and not pay the money just make its decision and then I would go through
the process of asking the Attorney General's Office for what opinion and that opinion would
be returned to the board and then having that opinion the board could decide whether to disperse
the funds.
But it's still in the pain.
That's a consideration of the pain.
When this was issued, that was 07.09.
The rehearsal permit.
It was given for me that was issued, and I'll say that.
That's what this letter says.
When we issued building permits, do we?
This question may be to you if you know about 07.
Does the county, or did the county evaluate run off water impact on whether I, on issuing a building?
We would not have the authority to do so. The only case where we would have the authority to determine whether or not the house could be there or what height it would have to be at if it was there or what have you would be as if it was in a flood zone. And that hasn't changed to this date. We just wouldn't have the authority to tell them they couldn't build their house there.
Okay. And from that, I question whether we're even in a position that we have a righteous
obligation here, because if we didn't evaluate whether or not it would say if we simply
issue the permit to somewhat allowing them to build a house and inspect it as to whether
it was built according to code, then this wouldn't have been an issue that we necessarily
from 186 acres of drainage. That's good. The subdivisions only 15% of that, so, well, you know,
they refer to words like, you know, a negligible increase. Again, I'm not convinced that it's
our fault that, you know, the house is built in a place that's
inappropriate based on, on
Rothwater, or that it was necessarily the akin villages. Well, clearly that would have increased
It's some I think they still would have had five inches of life instead of six inches.
You ever wonder what would happen with that and then it's so division up there, put up there?
Because the name has any problems.
I don't think any problems, still division up there.
It's fortunate not that I wouldn't have had a motive and then it's so division up there.
So they started that so division up there.
You don't get mad from farmlands.
I mean, that's better.
That's where the mud came from.
The subdivision being built.
That was the only lens that around there that was raw at the time that the first floor was the cart was that way and right there
And I find it funny that they fell bankruptcy two days after and then the county releases the bond
That bond like she said get it went toward us
I think it's good to thought
I'm sure
No, it's page two thirty seven of year of hacking of seven thousand six hundred and twenty three dollars
I have a question but I read through this and listen to the testimony and when you
all first looked at this piece of property, I wanted to set your house on a different
part.
Yes sir.
Okay.
Who told you that you couldn't build a diary that the property didn't park or that the
the city system wouldn't park where my house is sitting so I had to sit the house there
and put the septic behind it. So the time you put the septic where it is and I have to be so much
pretty jalfa road and so much pretty jalfa property boundaries that's on the place the house can sit.
And this was through the help department told you that it wouldn't happen.
wasn't to pay for it.
Thank you.
Hello Mr. Chief.
They told you that the subject system needed to be up the hill for a door properly.
Yes sir.
Does your subject system work properly?
Yes sir.
Yeah, I tell you I've flooded.
I mean, you know, like the way the pump works is once that thing feels, it says also long.
It won't pump until it actually drains out.
But yeah, I mean, as far as I've ever been used, it works fine. Yes, it is.
No, but when I came in, I didn't get up.
Um, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
When I came in the night, it was called I was a lion, it was my neighbor, and he was out of town.
It was alarming, and we like to have never got the alarm, the answer.
The way it works is, um, which I'm McCall, I'm not a bit lazy.
I've spot out back, uh, a hold and tank.
Once that fills up, then it pumps through the field lines.
When the water comes through, once it's flooded, it's fixed into that, so it fills it up and in a long.
You said it won't work until the long clear, so you can pass this at there and let it manually drain out over time.
The last flood, it took three days.
I had to go to the neighbors to take a shower that night, but because I was covered in mud from trying to wake them up.
I mean, it's more than inconvenience, I mean, it is, I've got a seven year old kid that's got asthma in my life as asthma.
It's a past year to put yourself in my spot.
How many more times do we do is to look for the mold dates over and we lose everything?
I mean, this is what we have.
We work hard.
So I mean, you know, if it's not within a county to show compassion and sympathy, then you're all sitting in a room of chairs, of course.
I would appreciate it yes or no, so we need to know which, which way we got to go.
We've been here three or four times already.
We've been here three times over this one.
We've let it go before for the last four years.
And now, day you were not given up on it.
We ain't given up this time, we don't plan on giving up.
I would like to make a motion that we do that as a request of 50,000 if they sign a agreement that they, if it's more than that, you know, they won't come back and we will agree to that only.
We will even, if you, I will agree that I will even go a step further and if it takes 45, I'll return the other five.
I do not want any more money than it takes to take it.
It's always long. It's our home fixed.
If we can do it for 37 and y'all can have whatever's left, we just make it fixed.
And for all of the ingredients that steps is a board to help us decide who doesn't.
If they want to get estimates that are more conducive for this, I don't care.
We are just desperate to find an answer and find a way to say what we've got and what we've worked hard for.
And then that's my understanding, and if I understand right now, the board approves, then it has
miss fields, we'll have to go get a thing from the 32nd, which I correct,
and we can't.
Of course, if
we can't do anything, he'll spring anyway, because the house is going to be, would have to be winner.
We're not going to be in that house for a good month, we're going to have to find places to live.
This is not going to be easy for us to eat.
I mean, it'll be spring before this can be really starting to do anything anyway.
That would give time to make a decision for a higher up to the side.
I have a general question, and then the fact director of this, but the estimates I see here are
for raising the house up on stills.
I'm going to be having flooding through your landscaping.
You'd still have presumably mud on your house, just as you'd be able farther away from.
I'm trying to find some place where I can.
I get the mud and I build the water now through my vence.
the fresh air vents in the cross space, that's more of where it comes in at it, dumps in.
Our plan is to, when we raise the house with raising it enough to go far more block, and
then we will take out the cross space entrance, which is on the back of the house, and the
vents on the back of the house.
The cross space entrance we moved to the front, where no water has ever come in, so if anything
does, hit the house, it'll be a much bigger ground hit, because once we raise it, we'll
dirty and on the backside as well to divert ever saying back into the shot.
Be behind that for one come through the vans, but the area is still flooded by 186 acres of
runoff. Have you gotten an estimate of moving the house somewhere?
I've got nowhere to move it to. I mean if I had to buy another lot and now we're talking
another $50,000. It's I can't move it because my sewer is on the back. I mean there's
somewhere on my lock and I move it too. I mean if that's what you're asking, I mean
I'd have to have more land to invest in that. There's a really house once in the other
soul the land to the Sam's and so they came in and put the house up on wheels and yeah.
And the guy that we have got a nest in the forest, that's what he got is.
He puts the historical houses.
I'm just writing a word of music too.
If I did, I would be great.
I would love to, and do the way with the whole problem all together.
But, you know, I mean, I mean, I'm either stuck, you know,
buying more land or building what we're doing here, you know.
What does this mean?
It's just kind of...
Yeah, I mean, I understand, you know.
The whole plan is, once we get everything done,
is we can have a big and a set pump put in. But the whole reason of raising the house is to
get my insulation, my lents, my serv floor, away from water, so I don't get mold. If I get four
five inches of water and I've got six foot under there, I can pump it without a worry. It's not
hitting my serv floor. I mean once I get mold on the serv floor, we're done. I mean you're talking
not the floor in the cell floor and had a cell-by-be-old near-thing else.
He knows what this is.
What's condemned?
Once you get black-mode, you're condemned.
And if it's...
Or we're stuck, but we're at.
You can't sell it.
Because he was gonna buy it.
And we're just trying to make a bad situation.
But it's
something.
You'll be raised in the house about 40 inches, right?
8 inches long.
Yes, sir.
I'll rent.
I won't say a mission.
It's a mission.
And we have a motion.
It's a mission.
It's a thousand-dollar.
And neither problem.
Mr. Chairman, I would like to make just a few more comments on that.
I'm addition to the sovereign immunity and the Dillon rule explanation that I stated earlier,
there's nothing in the facts before the board that would show that the county is at fault
in this matter. I feel terrible for the trance and I hate the situation there. I know it sounds
cold to be saying this, but as Dr. Baker alluded to earlier, the county was not the responsible
party to say where the house had to go on the property. Nor was the county the party that chose
a lot with a blue line stream going across it for construction of the home.
The county
responsibility, the county did building inspections to see if the house was constructed
properly and if the house had been on any other lot, there was no, well even on that
lot, there's no problems with the construction of the house. It was in the selection of
lot in the location on that particular parcel that is causing the problems.
We have letter from a Morton Thomas that says that there's drainage issues through that
area, I'm completely independent of the construction at Camden Village, had I'm the
One red, which is last name with Bill, with V dot, come in and explain after looking at the road situation there that there's a amount of tremendous amount of surface water drainage down that roadway, again, having nothing to do with a Camden village or any permitting or a review done by the county or any other state agency.
And so again, I urge the board that the appropriate place for this matter to be decided would be in a court.
And if the board were to deny the permit tonight, the trance could file a lawsuit tomorrow and be that much quicker on their way to having a decision.
that's an absolute true decision, instead of putting the county at risk of being found
as board-taking illegal action, and money at the county being spent inappropriately.
Well, we're not going to eat illegal action until we get a ruling back from a turn to
general, I thought we'd say it.
The decision?
And it was identified as the decision come back and says we could do it, then we're okay.
It says we're not done.
You also had to decide to pay the money using illegal action, is my opinion, and my recommendation to the people.
The regardless of whether or not we're not by our own record until we get that opinion back, right?
Well, Mr. Smith, you made a motion to pay it. If we pass the motion, then we have our thought out.
I thought any team of his motion there was a second was it
So that the county would pay the money, but after the attorney general makes a decision, we need to make a decision that we can't pay it, and we won't.
It's not just a matter of when the check is cash, not what action the board has taken.
But check is not written, material.
I guess I see it as a legal because how many of you shouldn't be running around giving money to individuals, regardless of how much they need it,
or how, I mean, I've compassion with situation too.
I was we had an answer and we've done what we can't try to direct them.
But I also have compassion for, you know, my taxpayers
and the other people in the county that, you know,
we're taking money away from to, to use it in this situation.
I think it's illegal by state law for a reason.
Well, I don't want to sound cold with the response and I do feel compassion, but I think
we're opening a can of worms that will never be able to close every time that somebody
in this county has a problem with the house that has been approved by Bill and Inspector
or certain areas, what do we do then? They come back. So we got the same problem. I mean,
I really feel, I feel terrible for this family. I really did. I also know that there's
a reason that they're not doing this. And if they take it to court and they went in court,
they'd be great. If that's, if the court would see that. But I think for us to give out
money. To write a check for $50,000 for weight on an opinion is we're opening up a
kind of orange we'll never be able to close. I mean you just can't as much as I would
love to. You just can't do that from the county government. You just can't happen.
I don't mean no disrespect to anybody but I do want to say that when the county
allows subdivisions and I don't say one subdivision. I say multiple
subdivisions because Hamden Village and Buffalo Ponds subdivision was
written up numerous times for not having slow water control permits. You can't
write somebody up and not make them accountable for it and then let that
something like this happen and not think that that's not somebody's responsibility.
These permits you have to buy for a reason and then they don't get them
and then they can just get put all this water on us and then we are the ones held accountable.
And you have heard the subdivision not too important from DCR on my step was not even buildable to Mrs. Phillips
saying how do you get out of that when the DCR or whatever there was said at the end
last should not even be buildable, but you are counting on your separation of self-hout
however it goes. But if it's not buildable then how much we get a permanent
if our house wasn't available. How can you say my said to can't sit here, because what
you want to sew which won't flow, but you can sit your house here and let your family
and your dreams and your financial future go down the same thing.
Well, the health department did your safety system. County building's budget didn't have
anything to do with that.
No, but the county at all.
No, responsible for that.
But the county at all to do with the subdivisions.
Buffalo pond and Camden Village were Shawty subdivisions. They went back and they you
look at the documentation. They were Shawty subdivisions and all they did was just
went in there and just started brightened land.
I have to go to work now. I'm going to
do this on my own.
Go to motion Mr. Smith and second Mr. Gibson.
Go to
work with
The point, Charlie Bird, to the IDA board on her district, that
I should be even saying
what's growing, it's got to make one comment to be consistent, I'll be building against
it, because I laid it as, I mean, laying the day, but laid in the term, I've looked
in Charlie Bird, I'll have a problem with him, this is with a couple of the other very
I think that if you find one on the idea, and I just think within the last few weeks of a term,
and someone else is going to have to work with him for their almost their entire term and office,
I think this should be an appointment that they should be making.
And for consistency across the other votes I've had on this, then I'll be going against him,
I don't want him to think that it had anything to do with his qualifications, or I don't
have anything to
do with his qualifications, or I don't have anything to do with his
qualifications.
Mr.
Chairman, there was a board, Philip Sprinkle, has been recommended by the
Highlands Committee Services to serve, and this will be the last appointment after a series
of three prior appointments, if you approve his appointment.
I'll just prove filth for free.
That's it.
Push, push, can you come second?
Those drones?
Scursions?
That one, if you get, if you can get someone to take them home and challenge a bit of fruit.
Those are hard.
What are they saying?
Any further scutting?
Let's go.
How's this a toilet spot?
I'll inflate your hand.
Seven, no.
That's a towel.
I'll give you.
Do any board members have anything they want to say tonight?
It's more of a labor of poverty.
Now, I want to thank Mr. O'Gones and Berners Smith for their service.
This is also as if having to be at W on sign on the 15th.
It's a sign sign.
Sunday. What time?
Good morning.
Two o'clock. I'm going to try to get out of there.
I don't know what.
Just a bit.
Good morning.
Chairman, Jason, is handing out your completed financial disclosure form, your statement
of economic interests for you to review, and if there's any corrections that need to be
made, please let either me or the Genderson know about it, and if not, then please sign
it and turn it on.
I know I need to come and talk to make a couple of changes to like on my own journey.
Not this hour.
Motion to adjourn.
Safe.