[This transcript was generated automatically from audio using AI and hasn't been reviewed by a person -- it can contain mistakes, including plausible-sounding sentences that were never actually said. Treat it as a starting point, not a verbatim record.]

[0:00] All right. I'm going to go ahead and open up the town of Williamson Board of Health meeting. Today is September 8th. It is 9-02. We're going to start with a roll call. My name is Devon Bartels. I'm the chair. Jim Parkinson, member, but it was not a member. Wendy McQueen, member, Sandy Goodbody, member, and the throssal health inspector. Okay. Now, I'm going to start the agenda with a public comment period.
[0:29] I'm going to open that now.
[0:31] There's anyone who wants to speak either in present or in Zoom we ask you just come to the podium identify yourself with your street address and try to limit your comments to five minutes.
[0:42] Will Raymond 189 Straton Road Williams town mass.
[0:47] I wanted to follow up on conversations I had with Ruth about a matter that's emerged at Highland Woods.
[0:54] senior's complex over 140 Church Street for at least several months now there's been
[1:01] a sort of a low grade bed bug infestation.
[1:06] They've tried to, Hartway has tried to treat this with their vendor Orkin in April, then
[1:15] again in June and again another spring, two or three weeks ago.
[1:21] So they opt the treatment to take the outlet covers off the wall and put some sort of insecticide to get into the walls because the problem is the migration of bed bugs from units to units to units.
[1:36] I have an older friend who lives there who unfortunately has an allergic reaction, which has been a significant health issue for her, very uncomfortable, very painful.
[1:45] and the only clear treatment is they got to get rid of the bed bugs.
[1:50] Ruth has been in contact with a hearthway, and I'm just asking for some follow-up
[1:55] where maybe Ruth, you could talk with them for some specifics.
[1:59] What insecticides have they used in the past?
[2:03] And are there alternative treatments that they could consider if they're needed?
[2:08] Just to wrap up, the most recent treatment was a few days ago.
[2:13] And we'll know in a week or two if that's been effective or not.
[2:17] Part of the issue is that they tend to inspect the units during the day.
[2:21] Bed bugs don't come out during the day, so they might walk in and say, oh, there's no bed bugs here.
[2:27] But at night, it wanted to o'clock in the morning, there are bed bugs.
[2:30] So there's an inspecial issue that's difficult to resolve.
[2:34] So in any event, I'm just hoping that one, this issue can be on the agenda for next month's meeting when we'll have more information.
[2:40] and that Ruth, if she has the time, and you go a couple with it,
[2:45] do you get more specifics on what specifically they have done?
[2:48] And I will send a video to Ruth about alternative treatment methods
[2:52] that she can circulate if she feels it's helpful to you folks
[2:55] to have a bit more information as to what else might work.
[2:58] I don't know if any questions you guys have or if not,
[3:00] then I'll just sit down.
[3:04] Anybody have a question?
[3:07] Thank you for bringing that to our attention.
[3:08] I think we we were aware of that. I've been talking with Ruth about it offline. So thank you for bringing that up.
[3:14] You think it'd be okay to get more details on what insecticides they have been using?
[3:20] I think we'll discuss it and under new unforeseen business and I definitely want to include it if Ruth deems it to be appropriate
[3:27] for adding to the agenda for next meeting. If the issue certainly is not resolved and I would be a favorite at least adding that to the agenda.
[3:36] Okay. Thanks so much. Anybody else? Anybody on Zoom or the public comment period? No one
[3:45] turned up on Zoom. All right, I believe there were no hearings at the time of hosting.
[3:51] Minutes, we're going to table that for the next meeting. Unfortunately, we weren't able to get the
[3:57] minutes prepared, but we're going to try to get that ready for the next meeting, so we'll have more
[4:01] minutes to approve, hopefully. Licenses and permits, as well as enforcement actions,
[4:08] none. So I'm going to move to old business. We have some updates about some violations
[4:14] at 330 coal avenue unit D6. I'm going to turn that over to Ruth.
[4:19] Sure. Yeah, just kind of a continuation from our past couple meetings.
[4:25] There's a few things
[4:26] that aren't quite at the end yet. So we did get the new filters, at least for unit
[4:31] at D6 arrived. I believe they got a large shipment or package of the filters so I'm hoping
[4:39] and I did receive a updated maintenance schedule that hearthway created to kind of get
[4:46] these more on their radar. I don't know how deep into checking stuff off they've gotten
[4:51] yet. There's a few things I had to have them add to the maintenance schedule that I'm still
[4:57] Waiting to get a new copy of that, I think they were researching some things to do with the mini splits and the units to see how often those may require either filter changes, inspections so that's kind of up in the air.
[5:14] And we've had some, I'm still kind of confused on whether or not the mini splits do provide the humidification.
[5:20] I've had a lot of back and forth there and it just seems like more research to be done either on my end or hearth ways end.
[5:26] Because I'm still a little unsure there whether it's the many splits that don't provide dehumidification or that they do and it's not working.
[5:34] So I'm a little in limbo on that section.
[5:41] Again, it's slow. Communication's been slow but it has been happening.
[5:46] I know a lot of folks are waiting to be on the list to get their filters since the hope was that
[5:54] you know, if no one's had been replaced that they would be on that list.
[5:59] You know, I was kind of thought D6 might happen first, but since theirs have come in,
[6:05] I was hoping kind of more people will get checked off the list.
[6:08] So, been following up on that, haven't heard how many units have gotten their new filters yet.
[6:13] That may be none, so I'm trying to continue to follow up on that.
[6:18] D6 was really the unit I had deadlines on, so it's just kind of a matter of do I write
[6:22] up violations for all the other units to actually put a deadline on the filter situation?
[6:27] Do I keep getting on them?
[6:28] So just kind of figuring out the right method to get action.
[6:33] Well, Ruth, if you don't feel like it is a reasonable time frame for communication, I think
[6:38] it could be reasonable to get ahead.
[6:40] I don't want to have to issue a warning.
[6:42] right if you could just let us know yeah I'm trying to be civil right kind of
[6:47] help I know they they have a lot going on they have limited resources but it's
[6:51] also about getting the appropriate maintenance in place that for the public
[6:57] health of the people living yes we're just gonna see a little more actions from
[7:01] hoping yeah I'll try poking one more time and if we need to do just inspections
[7:05] and yeah I wonder if like another check with that moisture detector that's a
[7:11] a good point with the dehumidification going through the many splits.
[7:16] I mean, I know that maybe there was some concern from the tenant that it wasn't working or it was going to hurt something.
[7:25] And I know actually that does remind me, I think while I was away, D6 has reported back and I haven't had a chance to investigate yet,
[7:33] but they don't, they have the new filters, but they're still having lots of moisture on the walls.
[7:38] so I'm still in process there and the last question is whether we have had
[7:47] any input from our building inspector colleagues I will try and get a more
[7:52] formal statement from them yeah I mean I understand things break down what my
[8:01] expertise kind of comes to a there's there's a barrier yes and I think getting
[8:06] their input as to what is reasonable and what requires by code replacement would be valuable.
[8:15] Right, because at a certain point, if the ventilation continues to have issues,
[8:21] it will have to just get referred to the bill, like we've gone as far up kind of weekend.
[8:26] I think we're leading now in the bill.
[8:27] Yes, so if it's a system issue up in there and it's not moisture, yeah, that kind of would be the next step.
[8:33] Let me know if you want me to reach out.
[8:35] No, when I can figure out who it would be, I think it might be the plumbing inspector that does mechanical stuff, so I'll make sure I'll actually work towards getting a more formal statement, or maybe just passing on the complaint and see, let me see what I can try again on that.
[8:52] Let's keep this on the agenda.
[8:54] Okay, yeah, it's kind of ongoing and I know there's other units that are yeah concerned so any other concerns questions
[9:06] Okay, I'm gonna move on to old business vector-borne diseases Berkshire County mosquito control project. I'm gonna turn it up in a marsiel
[9:13] Yeah, you're going to have a public meeting the 20s of October at the library
[9:20] Recreation, the superintendent of the county project coming to answer questions and
[9:28] Explain what the project is about.
[9:34] Fantastic. Thank you for organizing that and the time on that is four to four to six
[9:39] Four to six, and so it's at the at the Milna probably one of the back
[9:44] in the community room, the community room in the back room.
[9:48] So, a great opportunity for the public to interface.
[9:53] Hopefully, we can ask our Willie net colleagues if they're available to be there to publicize it, that would be fantastic.
[9:59] I can reach out to a couple other people, maybe Chamber of Commerce help publicize it, especially as it gets closer.
[10:07] But it would be a great opportunity, I think, to get questions answered about the exact
[10:13] the compounds being used for the larvae side and insecticide and when you trigger different
[10:18] thresholds to do different things, what that would look like, what the cost would look
[10:23] like to the taxpayer as well.
[10:25] So those are big questions that probably require a lot more public discussion.
[10:29] So I would really encourage everyone to try to attend to learn and be educated about it.
[10:34] I'm going to try to spend my fur at least part of it.
[10:36] What is the date again, Margea?
[10:38] October 20th.
[10:43] I don't know if you notice there are more mosquitoes around right now.
[10:47] I have a bug better than I think.
[10:51] No, it's real.
[10:53] And so I think it warrants more discussion.
[10:58] And I really applaud you, Marzu, for bringing environmental health concerns like this to the four and on the agenda.
[11:05] So, just like with air quality, these things we have to evolve and think about what are
[11:11] reasonable things that we can do as a community to mitigate the health risks associated with
[11:16] it.
[11:16] And, you know, summers are hotter, and, you know, people who didn't need air conditioning
[11:21] before, like, gosh, I need a fan, I need air conditioning, I need to move further north
[11:26] otherwise.
[11:28] So, it's with that changing climate comes more vector-borne diseases, and so we just have
[11:34] have to be ahead of the curve.
[11:36] So this is an effort that the Board of Health is really trying to bring to the public to
[11:41] decide this would have to be something that was voted upon at town meeting in May.
[11:47] So it's an educational effort to decide, do we want to have this, do we want to be a part
[11:52] of this, what are the costs associated with it, and have a public discussion around that.
[11:57] Okay?
[11:58] So thank you, Marcia, for bringing that to our attention.
[12:01] All right, and then I want to, is anybody, anybody who could have questions, anybody
[12:06] else has questions, comments, concerns about the Mosquito Control Project that are upcoming
[12:13] Q&A?
[12:14] Awesome.
[12:15] Community engagement update.
[12:16] Sandy.
[12:17] Hi there.
[12:19] I have not been to the farmer's market three times, and it's not been a scientific study.
[12:27] I didn't write a lot of things down because I discovered people were more interested in
[12:34] talking, but I've come away with four takeaways, and they bolstered some of the things we've
[12:43] talked about, but some aren't new ideas.
[12:47] One group of comments had to do with environmental concerns, mosquitoes, air quality, the new notification
[12:56] education system. Second thing were more personal concerns. Several people spoke to me about
[13:05] smoking issues from the outside and about the bedbugs. And they're concerned that the
[13:13] landlords really do nothing or do very little to get the problem solved.
[13:22] There was concern
[13:23] about the homeless in the sense that they're often camped around some of the housing for elderly people
[13:33] and people spoke about feeling afraid for their own safety with this group, particularly
[13:43] because they sensed a lot of behavior that came from drug use.
[13:49] They have talked about access and lack thereof, to medical services, and more importantly,
[13:57] to transportation to get to any of the health centers in our area.
[14:04] So that was probably the most meaty piece.
[14:07] But then there were a couple of pieces that are nice to hear.
[14:11] People were very excited.
[14:14] But in this was a surprise to me just to know that there was a board of health.
[14:19] I was passing out a flyer I had made about some of the things we're doing.
[14:25] I have little stickers that say we listen, but people, and maybe you noticed it, some people
[14:34] came and spoke with me and asked, so we said, other people just walked by and waved in an
[14:40] excited kind of manner.
[14:42] So, I consider that a step forward for us because I think in the past our group hasn't been enough out in the public.
[14:52] And the other thing that I am thrilled to announce is this lady over here got a lot of cuckoo, a lot of cuckoo.
[15:00] No, thank you. I'm on the line. Several times I've said to people, the person to call is our health inspector Ruth. Oh, we know her. She's great. She comes. She chips. She's doing those landlords. Make sure she knows that they didn't get me the Friday deadline because we want to know what's coming next. Thank you. So this week coming up is going to be the last time I'm at
[15:29] the farmers market. And I was thinking this morning that public engagement needs to be ongoing.
[15:40] And what might be some of the next steps that we consider. And what I'd like to do if it seems
[15:47] okay with colleagues is over the fall and maybe the winter go and talk about go and talk to people
[15:56] in the school system, and elementary school, middle school, upper school, because I think
[16:03] there's different health issues. I think we have overlap. And the other thing is I would
[16:10] like to, you know, SVMC is doing a lot of exciting things now, and I'm like, there's Williams
[16:16] Tom Boyd, and I'd like, one of the things they're doing is they're going to reopen the
[16:23] the Origin Care Center by stop and shop.
[16:26] And apparently it's a very, very large space.
[16:30] They're also going to put the Northern Berkshire
[16:33] orthopedics in that space.
[16:36] And apparently the orthopedic practice has a lot of,
[16:41] you know, has extreme machines and other stuff.
[16:45] So the Origin Care place can go beyond just,
[16:49] you know, a five minute, here's what you should do.
[16:51] But I started wondering if maybe SVMC was also trying to arrange a residency problem with
[17:01] Dartmouth, might consider having some kind of family practice person there on a periodic
[17:09] basis, and that that might help some with access.
[17:13] I think I just think that we need to think of ourselves in partnership with people,
[17:21] either a piece of partnership in which we're going forward, or a partnership where we're
[17:29] helping them go forward with their agenda.
[17:33] So, thank you so much.
[17:35] This is so valuable.
[17:37] It's a lot of time that you've spent, sitting there and also just engaging with the community
[17:43] and being thoughtful about these ways of being more present in the community.
[17:51] So thank you for being that outward face.
[17:53] I would love for someone to write an article for the Berkshire Ego.
[17:58] Writing is not really my best feature.
[18:01] So if one of my colleagues might like to give it a shot, I'll work with you on it.
[18:07] I've got some examples of other health announcements from the newspaper that I've collected, so we have a bit of a model.
[18:18] Well what I was going to say too is so much of what the kind of this qualitative data that you've just collected.
[18:25] I think it's echoed in the needs assessment that the college students kind of presented last spring.
[18:33] I think this is perfect because the next step is the students come back, they start classes
[18:39] on Thursday.
[18:41] So we are scheduling a meeting for next week to talk about how the fall cohort of public
[18:46] health students can take, remember they came up with a huge class student, you were there,
[18:51] and how do we start getting those doing a more formal survey.
[18:55] So I think to Devin's point, put a little bit more of a quantitative, that would be true.
[19:00] And that was a little bit more evidence-based than to the qualitative work you've been doing
[19:05] and it could be really nice.
[19:06] And thinking about how we get to survey our, I think, it'd be great.
[19:11] Because the ultimate goal is to show what the needs are, how we survey the needs,
[19:17] identify the issues, and then ideally, we can write a grant to try to address them.
[19:23] So the, it's interesting to me that two of your bullet points homelessness and
[19:34] transportation, such access for echoed in the classes students independently came up with.
[19:42] So this is sort of more thematically valuable and I think we should write down what you have and
[19:49] and include that as part of that assessment.
[19:52] And I think I'll be here on Saturday.
[19:57] Fantastic.
[19:57] I think I would love to come.
[19:59] Are you there for your, is it market this Saturday,
[20:02] right?
[20:02] I think I'm coming.
[20:03] Oh, super.
[20:04] We can catch up then.
[20:05] OK, that would be great.
[20:06] And I'll try to speak by for a part two as well.
[20:09] Graham.
[20:10] You're invited to the market.
[20:12] I'll give you a sticker.
[20:15] All righty.
[20:17] So let's go to new unforeseen business.
[20:19] So just in response to the dead bug issue, Ruth, let's please continue to add this to the next meeting's agenda for an update, because I don't think we have a formal anything planned for today.
[20:38] I know Ruth has been working with Harkway and following whatever the code of Williamstown in the Massachusetts Department of Public Health State Code regulations are for her ability to support residents and making sure that there's sanitation standards are here too, but these are difficult situations because it is so intractable.
[21:07] in terms of trying to get rid of every little bed bug.
[21:13] And timing, no one's going to inspect the apartment at one o'clock, unfortunately.
[21:18] So yes, so there's that risk of false negative.
[21:22] Oh, it looks good, right?
[21:24] And really it's not.
[21:25] So I think that's something that we should all thank you.
[21:28] Thank you for bringing it up.
[21:29] I want to make sure that we address it at our next meeting for sure,
[21:32] but know that this is an ongoing issue that rules not everything
[21:36] Everything that comes to meeting and is addressed informally on the agenda is what's going
[21:41] on.
[21:42] So sometimes there's something that don't require the board's input that Ruth is handling
[21:47] separately.
[21:48] So I know that it's been an issue that Ruth has been giving a lot of attention to.
[21:53] And we'll continue.
[21:53] One thing just to flag again without over monitoring the residents, I do think if there are residents
[21:59] who move to some other institutional setting for whatever reason it is worth flagging.
[22:04] I mean, from past experience, I know that's often when, you know, if somebody were
[22:09] then to be admitted to a hospital or to a nursing home or because they do go to the
[22:14] That's high risk.
[22:15] Yeah.
[22:16] They travel often with you.
[22:18] Yeah.
[22:18] And very briefly, it's 30 seconds or less.
[22:21] Hardly is making a really good faith effort.
[22:24] Sonny Bullet, Robin Napp, you know, the CEO have come to a public meeting again to talk
[22:29] about this issue, but it is a tough one to solve.
[22:32] Because one end, there's 20 apartments on one end of the building, where there's bugs migrating back and forth.
[22:39] Without a really comprehensive plan for all 20 units, I don't think we're really going to get ahead of this.
[22:45] And finally, Hardthway did commit to an inspection within 24 hours of any new person moving in to make sure that they're not bringing bedbugs in with them.
[22:55] and hoping that they will follow through with that,
[22:58] given their limited resources,
[22:59] that very specific action will also help.
[23:02] Preventatively, I agree, that's one.
[23:08] All right, so I know I want to leave some time
[23:10] for the discussion and the recodification project.
[23:14] This is a, it looks really thorny.
[23:18] So I want to give some time for it,
[23:20] if that's okay, that we move on in the discussion section.
[23:23] And so Ruth has been asked to ensure that our code, our town bylaws and regulations are internally consistent and that they are at least up to date with the wording meeting the standards of these state homes as well.
[23:46] So, we have been charged to look through our bylaws and regulations, which are separate,
[23:53] and make sure that the wording is appropriate.
[23:57] And maybe also use this as an opportunity to simplify or readjust things as needed.
[24:04] So, I want to go through a couple bylaws, I'm going to hand it over to Ruth to run through.
[24:12] some of these are I think simple okay seem very simple to go through but we
[24:16] formally have to go through them. My plan is just to make this a discussion and
[24:21] then at a subsequent meeting once we have the wording that we like we can vote
[24:27] on it so we'll do kind of like all like we're not going to go line by line voting
[24:31] for each thing. Okay so we're going to go to by-law chapter 27 section 5C
[24:38] the article one under environmental hazards, this is the new by-law regarding plastic bags.
[24:50] And I did just find out right before this meeting that the plastic bag by-law that had
[24:57] gotten updated by a citizen these past few months did get approved, so her changes did
[25:07] get accepted by the Attorney General's Office just about late August.
[25:13] So these two questions that we were asked about the environmental hazards by law, kind
[25:18] of, they were taking from the old by law, rather since the system didn't know that it was
[25:25] currently being updated.
[25:28] So it kind of talks about these $50, $100, $200, I believe the citizen who updated had also
[25:35] So, change the fees to I want to say 75, 150, and 250.
[25:41] If I'm remembering correctly, we, and I think it was actually a first offence.
[25:47] Thank you.
[25:48] Warnings, seven, eight, five, and then 150.
[25:51] Thank you.
[25:51] And then fourth and subsequent was 250.
[25:53] 250, thank you.
[25:54] Yeah.
[25:55] And we were kind of wondering.
[25:56] So, yeah.
[25:57] So, my suggestion was that there's a lot of fee structures.
[26:05] embedded within each byline and section, and it requires a lot of referencing on
[26:13] roof behalf. These are not overwhelmingly different than the standard fee
[26:19] structure, which is 100 for the first offense, 200 for the second offense, 300
[26:24] for third and subsequent offenses. So I was going to recommend and propose that we
[26:31] standardized it to the generalized fee structure for board of health matters
[26:36] that are under the by-law and chapter one so that we kind of just make it
[26:42] standard for for Ruth what's easier to enforce that was going to be my
[26:48] recommendation although I would raise the I think that's a very generous fee
[26:54] structure to the people who are unfortunately misbehaving and I think by
[27:02] third or subsequent fees people ought to get the point that we're serious about
[27:10] this and we're not just going to horse around forever because people are
[27:15] willing to like to be nice. Are there limits? Don't I remember that there are
[27:21] I think we because for the galaxy gas I remember signature point I wanted to yeah a little more draconian and I think we are there are
[27:29] It tops out pretty well. Right, and I'm gonna
[27:33] I'm actually looking up now to determine
[27:35] Because that was the nitrous oxide regulation and I'm just you remember that. Yes
[27:40] We said it was too much and I'm wondering if the town limit if we yes in that and I
[27:46] So at any point maybe we take whatever they're limited and have it be the top now. I will do some research into whether
[27:53] Is it a bylaws have a different
[27:57] Right, I mean that's certainly make sense. I personally would love it. It's the fluid
[28:03] Offense and more could be a little harsh. Yeah, let me look up. How high it can be for bylaws and for regs
[28:11] Was regs it was because we tried to do a thousand and yeah, let me figure out what we
[28:16] We can do as a top, and then if I'm not understanding, we want to take out the warning for you, right?
[28:23] So it just becomes first.
[28:24] Yeah, there's no warning.
[28:25] Yeah, for a second, there'd be, gotcha.
[28:27] This is the fine, it's the fine, perfect.
[28:29] I wrote that as a note to add for next time, just to get that one last adjustment in there.
[28:35] But my thought would be, let's use this recodification effort as an opportunity to standardize.
[28:42] Yeah, and maybe it's time to raise the
[28:45] benefit for everything, such that it
[28:48] meets like, you know, the normal
[28:50] upsets. People of my third time ought
[28:54] to be upset at how we're treating
[28:57] them. And I think this we're being
[29:00] too easy to dismiss. And so we'll
[29:02] figure out what the upper limits are
[29:04] so we can stay within our. I think
[29:07] also that money is not in many of
[29:10] the things it's not going to be the
[29:11] big deterrent. And what the actual amount is is probably less important than what you're
[29:18] saying about getting a standard thing so we know it's always this. I would agree with
[29:23] you that what we do need is when you do it three times in a row. It's a problem. Something
[29:30] more than a monetary fine. And I don't know exactly what I guess it depends on what the
[29:37] actual offense is but taking the ability to make money or why these people are doing it is
[29:45] more important than just I mean you know if you're a store and you're selling $10,000 worth of
[29:50] something and you're paying $100 fine that's not not that big a deal. I would say I would go along
[29:58] the standard icing and if we want to-
[30:00] Maximize the met, whatever the state will allow that's fine with me. And is there some precedent, Ruth, in the fact, you know, if if you're a restaurant and there are no violations, you're closed. Right. There means something similar, right? That if you're cost-solving this, if you give somebody three or four, you're closed. You know, the reason for having a third and fourth offenses so that you can say what you do it again, you know, rather than, oh, did it first, you're closed. It's challenging because oftentimes if it's not a
[30:29] permit that you issue. It's hard to understand. But that's what I'm saying is here is something
[30:34] that's a little more. What's our leverage? Exactly. That's I think what the issue with the
[30:39] nitrous oxide because we're not issuing nitrous oxide permits. So it's sort of like well, yeah,
[30:45] yeah, yeah. That's what the lawyers would say. I think. Okay.
[30:53] Yes, please.
[30:54] Mike Miller, Lyndon Street, Williamson. Just want to point out that there's growing evidence.
[30:59] And it's a reason why this is a public health department issue growing evidence around the broad and severe and growing health impacts of plastics, microplastics, nanoplastics, and not just from the production and other things, but actually in the environment, there's actually a meeting this afternoon I'm participating in about this and it's really scary is the New York Times article about Indonesia and microplastics.
[31:28] that you might want to read in today's paper,
[31:30] or today's website.
[31:32] Thank you.
[31:33] Maybe more fodder for why we should maximize penalties.
[31:36] Well, and it's a reason why somebody says
[31:38] why is the board of health involved in the plastic bag ban?
[31:43] Certainly.
[31:43] Well, this is why.
[31:44] Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[31:45] But we do need something, if we don't issue a license
[31:51] that we can take away, is there some sort of legal way
[31:56] Where we can say the board, I don't know, may not be a question for town council, but in
[32:02] meetings that we've had with them previously, and the feedback that we've gotten, it's
[32:07] challenging to rescind a license that you didn't, your board did not issue.
[32:15] And so, or if there's no license to sell, like, apples that you put in a plastic bag, you
[32:22] that we're not regulating necessarily.
[32:25] But yeah, we can ask them.
[32:27] That's a legal question.
[32:29] In my mind, too, it's third and subsequent offenses.
[32:33] So there's no cap, I believe, on the number
[32:35] of subsequent offenses.
[32:36] So you get on Monday, you get the Tuesday and Wednesday.
[32:41] So if it's something that you need to kind of not
[32:45] that you want to be going every single day
[32:46] to these places to issue a fine, but sometimes
[32:49] you need to ensure compliance.
[32:50] I mean, the $300 fine every day or a couple times a week would be a lot.
[32:55] And then if you don't pay those fines, that's the time and have the ability to.
[32:59] Right. That's when I know at that point, the town can bring them for non-payment and fines.
[33:04] Yes. Okay.
[33:06] And then in some of the instances with a plastic bag, we have, like if a restaurant has bags,
[33:13] they technically have a permit, but places like with Devon was saying like a place like,
[33:17] I think RK miles came up before just to use a similar place that has plastic packaging like they
[33:22] They don't have a food permit obviously and we don't have a plastic bag permit
[33:27] So in the cases like that I do wonder how you you know the fines would kind of be the only thing to do whereas in a food situation
[33:35] I guess we could
[33:37] You know there is a permit there in some but not in all only in some
[33:41] That does tricky it
[33:44] Well, if you can issue a fine, why is a penalty?
[33:51] Why can't you issue a, we're closing you for 48 hours kind of penalty?
[33:58] I don't wonder.
[34:00] That's a good question for the label.
[34:01] I don't know, I don't know if you can just do that.
[34:05] Right, I don't think that the, the stretching on.
[34:08] Yeah, exactly. I think there's authority.
[34:10] There's certainly, we have to follow the code.
[34:12] based on what the board is allowed to do, so whatever authority is granted to us
[34:19] through both the state and town codes, that limits our authority, so we have to
[34:26] put everything in there, it's sort of following, we have to follow the letter
[34:31] of the law. Okay, I'm gonna go ahead and move on to the next bylaw, which is
[34:38] environmental health standards and definitions.
[34:40] And this is, I think, a pretty straightforward one if I...
[34:45] Yes.
[34:46] And is this still on the plastic bag right to this?
[34:49] This is regarding the word, so yes, it is on the plastic bag by law.
[34:57] And I'm wondering, and it's regarding the definitions,
[35:03] ASTMD6400, which is the American Society for Testing Materials.
[35:07] However, I have the actual wording was on the town warrant at town meeting and a lot of
[35:16] that was crossed off.
[35:17] So this is already out of that, I think, and they were looking at the old version.
[35:21] So I wonder if the E-code folks were just looking at an older version.
[35:26] We should just verify with them that it's taken care of, definitely, because now that it's
[35:34] been approved by the AG. I'm sure the clerk town clerk will be working to get it working
[35:38] with ECO to get it into a you know a tight doubt way into our website. So I'm absolutely
[35:44] I that one maybe one that we can skip because it's already been removed but I will verify
[35:50] like you said look at a clean version. But otherwise I'd be in favor of replacing it with
[35:57] the more modern definition, the D6691.
[36:01] So that's a bit of a technicality in the law,
[36:05] but I think it's going to be a non-issue.
[36:10] OK, so the next one is the bylaw chapter 55, section 2A
[36:15] article no 8.
[36:17] No, sorry.
[36:17] Chapter 46, right to farm.
[36:20] Chapter 46 bylaw.
[36:23] And this is the right to farm.
[36:26] I mean, establishes Williamstown as a farming community pursuant to a section of the state code with all attended protections of that statute, provided that it reflects current practice.
[36:37] This chapter appears to be satisfactory as written, that was the recommendation.
[36:42] So, I see no reason why we can't just say that.
[36:45] I don't remember, I don't know if there's anyone on the board now except for me that we did actually have an issue.
[36:51] I remember with the chickens and reading through that and thinking back through the discussion
[36:58] that we had with that, the only thing, just in short, a gentleman complained that he
[37:04] lived next to a farm where the chickens were.
[37:06] That was on the board.
[37:07] Okay.
[37:07] So you got that.
[37:08] But the only thing that I saw in there was the definition of enclosure, what you had to have
[37:16] your Polkry or whatever livestock enclosed in and there was no strict definition so could
[37:23] you have your chicken running around and that was the only thing I thought might be altered
[37:29] a little bit on that you know fence I don't even know how you would say it but and then
[37:37] of course with that of change the situation no right they can clock just as much inside
[37:44] So, it doesn't make that much difference.
[37:47] And just to add, sorry, Devin, I didn't want to go over that.
[37:51] But one of the questions that we kind of aren't going over today because we needed
[37:55] a little bit of guidance from town council did was another by-law, the Anna-Dur-Tan Anna-Dur-Tan Anna-Dur-Tan.
[38:02] Yeah, and it did actually ask if we wanted to define what adequate enclosure is.
[38:08] So, I wonder if that could be, I ran some new language
[38:12] which by town council, because there is a there is a CMR out there that kind of goes over what the state says is adequate.
[38:18] So we down the line and include this in today's agenda, right, because it was going to be a longer discussion.
[38:25] Yeah, but that there is a section that would I think we could address the more by more specifically defining what adequate means for enclosure.
[38:35] You can do that by potentially referencing the state code within our, our, the, down, by-law.
[38:43] But this particular issue in hand is the chapter 46 right to farm.
[38:48] That just establishes this community as a farming community.
[38:54] And that doesn't really address, I think, the enclosure and the adequacy of those enclosures
[39:01] in that particular by-law.
[39:04] It just recommended that we just maintain it as is.
[39:08] There's no need to review it unless people feel differently.
[39:14] In which case, I'll move on to
[39:17] Biolol Chapter 552A Article 1, which is smoking and vaping.
[39:23] And this was also regarding the fee structure.
[39:28] And so this, I think it was the same concern for the,
[39:31] But is this an adequate fee structure that 100, 200, 300, which I think we're tabling
[39:37] that discussion to the next meeting?
[39:41] It sounds like people want are in favor of making it standard, I think, that's awesome.
[39:48] Okay.
[39:49] Then the last one, the last by-law to review is chapter 56, Article 1, Solid Waste and Littering.
[39:56] This is a, it just requires any vehicle transporting litter and refuse in town to be covered, and that they ask us whether we should make any revisions.
[40:10] argue
[40:18] that this is not well-enforced.
[40:20] Definitely good reminder, we'll see vehicles traveling, so I think at least a reminder
[40:27] to the mostly smaller scale or private operators that do not cover their trucks and stuff
[40:38] does fly out, so that should be definitely, we could say enforcement is coming.
[40:47] And hopefully involve law enforcement to help with that if they've needed.
[40:53] If they see any, yeah.
[40:55] Alrighty.
[40:57] I think those are all the bylaws and so once we have the wording that we like on each
[41:02] of those, hopefully by next meeting we could have a vote and then that goes to town meeting
[41:08] to be officially adopted and vote on that town.
[41:11] Okay.
[41:12] I would hope at some point we could go back to what Jim said and put our heads together
[41:18] and think is there a way besides the additional fines for chronic disregard of the laws, what
[41:33] might we properly consider?
[41:38] And I think Ruth getting guidance from the legal team, that won't happen, and even just
[41:42] understanding what to do. Like to your point, Devon, if you were to find somebody $300 every day,
[41:48] and then if the town's able to insist on the payment be made every week, or you know,
[41:52] figuring out, and then if in 24 hours, 24 hours without payment, that triggers the town being able
[42:00] to do something, right? So even if we can't do something ourselves, what needs to happen for the
[42:06] town to do something? Yeah, learning with that process. Right, so we construct your hours in order
[42:11] or it's quickly a possible trigger in the town.
[42:13] That's definitely will be added to the question.
[42:16] The question was absolutely.
[42:17] That's a really good one.
[42:18] Thank you guys for bringing that.
[42:20] Yeah.
[42:21] Okay, so I'd like to move on to the regulations if that's okay.
[42:25] So these are Board of Health regulations for review.
[42:28] First one is chapter 142-6 on lower drains.
[42:33] The e-code said, and this is maybe a small thing,
[42:37] but is on the front page of the chapter.
[42:40] But neither the online or paper code is an actual front page for chapters.
[42:45] So this wanted us to maybe rephrase that so that we could make it more consistent with an electronic format.
[42:55] So I'm going to recommend that we remove that on the front page of the chapter and instead reference the actual section of the code.
[43:09] Or the actual effective date that was decided upon that was made the law.
[43:14] Well, is anyone have any other concerns or questions?
[43:19] This is sort of a little bit of a technicality.
[43:20] Some of these are like, really, but they require public discussion
[43:24] and us to weigh in.
[43:29] The next one is chapter 147, section 5E,
[43:33] manufactured housing communities.
[43:36] Okay, what was this one about?
[43:38] There's another kind of just wording,
[43:39] like they renamed DEP, renamed a guideline, it seems like, and they just suggest we use what they rename it to another kind of formal.
[43:51] We should change DEP storm water management policy, and is instead mass DEP and Massachusetts storm water handbook and storm water standards.
[44:03] So just taking one and inserting the new terminology, which I think is reasonable, and easy to do.
[44:10] Any other concerns or questions about this one?
[44:16] Then we're going to move on to chapter 153, Refuse and Recycling.
[44:25] That was another one I was just asking, you know, looks good.
[44:29] Do you think it also, do you also think it looks good?
[44:31] So if, you know, anyone were to think just from your own private research if you thought it didn't, certainly, let us know.
[44:42] I'm okay with proceeding as this.
[44:46] Anybody else concerns about this one?
[44:51] Seems internally consistent and reasonable.
[44:54] Board of Health, chapter 158-24A smoking.
[45:00] Restricting sale of tobacco products.
[45:07] Remember, this was also a just a typo that they wanted correct to.
[45:15] It says that this site suspension of tobacco sales permits and that section of the regulation does not exist. Right. Oh, dear. No, I did. And I did. Sorry. This was number 158-002. It was just named incorrectly. So I think, sorry. So it should have been 105 CMR 660.
[45:39] So I think they just, at some point, 65 got like missed so that should be an easy one if you guys are and I did go in and verify that O-40 of that CMR-665 was still, but this is talking about which it does appear to be, or it is, so I think it was just 665 got missed.
[46:01] And this is another example of just just heterogeneity in our fee structure.
[46:06] So this is a violation of $1,000 for the first case violation in the case of selling
[46:15] tobacco products to a person on the age of 21.
[46:17] And this is a state violation.
[46:22] I guess it's consistent with the state.
[46:24] It must be a law or something that violates the state law.
[46:29] So unless it has to violate a statement.
[46:33] Okay, dokey, so that seems reason that Ruth, I think it's just updating the number to fix the problem.
[46:43] Chapter 159, Stables and Livestock Keeping.
[46:53] Satisfactory as written.
[46:58] We have a lot of break, not to be confusing.
[47:00] We have like the animals the right to farm and then we have stables in life to keep things so this would be the kind of a separate one than the other two we kind of mentioned just
[47:13] to clarify.
[47:18] Does anybody see any reason to make any revisions?
[47:30] I'm hearing none so I'm going to move on to regulation chapter 164 slash 5b section 4.
[47:40] This is regarding wells and well construction.
[47:46] What was the issue that they brought up?
[47:48] I wondered.
[47:49] So the e-code folks were wondering if we may just want to make a couple word adjustments.
[47:57] Similarly to the stormwater one we just talked about.
[48:00] It looks like division of water supply protection has been renamed.
[48:07] And then rather than stating that the registered well-driller, rather than referring to them as a registered well-driller, you guess, Mass-E-P certified well-driller?
[48:17] Yeah, Mass-Till-P certified well-driller.
[48:19] So again, a little formality that does require poor health approval, but a kind of easy one, unless you guys see.
[48:26] That makes sense.
[48:27] Another issue.
[48:28] That seems like a slam dunk.
[48:29] Thank you guys.
[48:31] I appreciate fantastic.
[48:33] I know this seems a little tedious,
[48:35] but I think it still is our law system.
[48:38] And we have to make sure that we're
[48:40] Yes.
[48:41] And so hopefully for next time,
[48:44] we can maybe have some clarity
[48:47] about the fee structure
[48:49] maximums.
[48:50] And then whether we can just hopefully
[48:53] add it to the one section
[48:55] referred to the general fee structure
[48:57] for various enforcement needs, so you can kind of just refer to it and it's just the general fee structure that you can then amend as, you know, inflation changes things.
[49:12] And I'll get a better packet to us just with what we've talked about once we have that.
[49:17] But that would probably require us changing the actual fee structure under each line and
[49:24] just say refer to fee structure.
[49:25] That way next time when it comes to amend the fee structure, you're not going to regulate
[49:29] it.
[49:32] You're just referring to the fee structure, like in chapter 1 where the fee structure is actually
[49:38] put through bylaws.
[49:41] Okay.
[49:42] Fantastic.
[49:42] Thanks everybody.
[49:44] I'm going to go to correspondence.
[49:45] So there was nothing that I heard of you any correspondence and the meantime no and then I'm
[49:52] moved to adjournment. Before I go to adjournment, they'll pick up a meeting date.
[50:03] I guess this kind of puts us into like the first or second week of October.
[50:08] We had a Columbus Day kind of would make that difficult. We could meet on the 13th
[50:15] if two days works. Does that work? Okay. How about the week prior?
[50:21] with that work. Let's see. The fifth with that work. Let's do it. Does that work for everybody?
[50:31] I'm going to be going all that month but I can zoom in wherever I am.
[50:35] Okay, Marcio you. I'm fine. So October 5th for a next board of health. Fantastic. Thanks everybody.
[50:44] All right. Here we are five short of ten o'clock. Actually wait.
[50:48] I think it is. I think it is. Maybe seven short. So I'm going to ask for a movement to
[50:56] adjourn. I move to adjourn. Is there a second? I will second it. All in favor. Hi. All
[51:01] opposed. All right. Thanks everybody really for your time.