[0:07] He is. Got it. Now,
[0:08] I guess I don't have to ask you in room.
[0:10] Yeah, yeah. He'll let us know. Okay. We'll call a meeting.
[0:13] New order for the Monday,
[0:14] March 30th special select board meeting.
[0:19] First item is the pledges, you,
[0:27] The United States of America to the Republic
[0:31] for which stands, one Nation under God, individual
[0:35] for liberty and agenda.
[0:42] And we'll set the agenda.
[0:45] Does anyone have anything to add or My
[0:50] Only question, should we do executive session
[0:51] prior to or post?
[0:53] Post, post would be okay. Yeah.
[0:55] We've got David, I'm sorry, David,
[0:58] I forgot how to pronounce her last name.
[1:00] Is it Ru?
[1:08] Yeah, it's David Ru. David
[1:10] Ru.
[1:11] Yep. And he is going to
[1:14] just help us with the fine details.
[1:16] He prepared all of the, the necessary steps for us tonight
[1:20] to take, to make sure that we warn the, the bond meeting
[1:23] the bon boat right this time.
[1:25] So, so he's on Zoom.
[1:27] We also have a couple other people on Zoom, Janet Stone
[1:30] and, and Lauren Buck.
[1:33] He seems supposed to be here.
[1:35] He's on Zoom. He's, he's a table.
[1:36] Oh, he, okay. Yeah.
[1:40] Reason why we're having this is unknown to slug board
[1:44] and the Newtown manager,
[1:48] we've never dealt with bonds before.
[1:50] There the special requirements
[1:52] of the bond bank requires for their loans.
[1:56] And one 'em was, he had
[1:58] to have an advertised newspaper five weeks right?
[2:01] At a time or before the vote.
[2:04] Yeah. It's state law. Excuse me.
[2:08] State law requires that the, the warning of this meeting
[2:12] where you're voting on bonds be published
[2:17] for three weeks on the same day in three consecutive weeks.
[2:23] And that it,
[2:24] the warning be posted in five places in the town.
[2:29] And that's a little different than
[2:31] annual meeting warnings when you only have
[2:33] to post 'em in three places, if I'm remembering correctly.
[2:36] So what happened was we didn't,
[2:39] we didn't follow the correct procedure
[2:42] to notice bond vote.
[2:45] And unfortunately that's one of those errors in process
[2:49] that cannot just be corrected
[2:51] by resolution of the select board.
[2:55] Well, we did, we did send mailers out
[2:58] to everyone in town about the vote
[3:01] and what was about, what it was about.
[3:03] I guess that doesn't count. So here we are.
[3:09] So how you want us,
[3:13] you wanna go through it?
[3:16] Tell us what we need to do or?
[3:18] Sure, sure.
[3:20] So, you know, there's, there's procedural requirements
[3:23] and then there's, there's what the bond bank likes to see.
[3:26] And there are, there's also, there's what the law requires
[3:31] and we've sort of wrapped them all in.
[3:33] The procedural requirements are a little bit different.
[3:36] But as I said, you know, we're gonna have a bond.
[3:40] We're planning to have a special town meeting to
[3:43] vote on whether this in the,
[3:46] the town should incur the million dollars of indebtedness
[3:49] for these road upgrades and improvements.
[3:54] The warning of that special town meeting needs
[3:56] to be published on the same day of the week
[4:00] for three consecutive weeks with the last date,
[4:03] not more than 10,
[4:05] and not less than five days before the meeting.
[4:07] So if we're talking about a special meeting on Wednesday,
[4:10] May 8th, the last day
[4:12] of publication should be probably
[4:15] Thursday, April 30th.
[4:17] And I, I can't remember, I don't know if you guys use the
[4:20] Times Argus or, or something else.
[4:22] And I can't remember what day it comes out,
[4:23] but if the Times Argus is Thursday, like I remember,
[4:27] you should publish the warning
[4:29] of the special meeting on the 16th, 23rd and 30th of April.
[4:34] And then you also have to post
[4:36] the warning in five public places
[4:39] at least two weeks before the meeting.
[4:41] And then you will need
[4:44] to have a public informational meeting, typically
[4:48] with a couple days before the meeting.
[4:50] And that's called for here in this resolution,
[4:54] because it's an Australian ballot vote.
[4:56] All Australian ballot votes on public questions
[4:59] or indebtedness, need to have a public informational hearing
[5:04] within a few days of the vote.
[5:05] So that's the procedure
[5:10] On that public hearing.
[5:12] The way our TV coverage is set up,
[5:16] if we had the meeting on a Monday, people wouldn't see it
[5:19] on TV until Thursday.
[5:21] The, the vote would be on a Wednesday.
[5:23] So is it possible to do it the Monday before
[5:26] or is that too far ahead?
[5:29] One second. We'd be about, about
[5:35] nine days before the actual vote we did that.
[5:42] The public informational hearing needs
[5:44] to be at least 10 days in advance.
[5:48] Okay. So if you wanna do it on Monday the
[5:53] 27th, you need to,
[5:58] you, you need to change the resolution
[6:00] that you're gonna vote on tonight in the second
[6:05] to last, be it further resolved on page one.
[6:10] So, so that says one day April 27, not May four.
[6:16] Okay. That's the only way
[6:20] people are gonna see it on tv.
[6:22] Yeah, it's fine by me. Yeah. Okay.
[6:25] April 27th, a April 27th is what you said?
[6:30] Yep. That's,
[6:31] and then you also have to change the last paragraph of
[6:35] that draft warning we sub submitted to you
[6:40] of the special town meeting.
[6:41] 'cause that in the last paragraph says
[6:43] Monday, May 4th as well.
[6:45] Gotcha. Well
[6:56] skip a question,
[6:58] But what you'll see is we combine the notice
[7:00] of the special town meeting with the notice
[7:02] of the public informational hearing.
[7:04] So all you have to do is publish that one warning
[7:08] and post that one warning in five places.
[7:11] And you will have complied
[7:12] with all the statutory requirements killing a couple birds
[7:15] with one stone there.
[7:18] So aside from,
[7:20] if there's no other questions on the procedure stuff
[7:25] From the for staff,
[7:27] I, I'm Barbara Graham, I'm the town clerk.
[7:29] I, so we, we don't have to follow the same protocol
[7:34] as we did for town meeting.
[7:35] I can hold the vote on a Wednesday versus a Tuesday
[7:39] and the hours don't have to be from 10 to seven.
[7:42] It could be at my, you know, either eight to seven or
[7:47] On the, on the first part.
[7:49] Yeah. It doesn't matter
[7:50] what day you hold the meeting On the second part,
[7:53] what they're approving tonight contains
[7:55] the hours for the vote.
[7:56] So they, they have those in the warning as 10 to seven.
[8:00] If you want that to change, you gotta change it now.
[8:03] No, I, I'm fine with that.
[8:04] I just didn't know if we needed to go by the same protocols
[8:08] that we do on town meeting together.
[8:10] Yeah, this is a special town meeting, so you're not bound
[8:13] by the annual meeting first Tuesday in March kind of thing.
[8:17] Okay. Sounds good. Thank you.
[8:22] Yep. Yeah,
[8:24] this is your last opportunity here to change the hours.
[8:27] If you don't like 10 to seven, we gotta change it, but,
[8:34] Okay.
[8:35] So probably have you make the,
[8:39] if you run over and make the necessary changes on this
[8:42] so we can sign it all tonight
[8:44] and change the date, those dates.
[8:48] Yep. We can do that. Any,
[8:49] any other changes Barbara or Anthony can think of?
[8:52] No, the only, the only other thing is can we do it,
[8:57] you know, as far as the paper ballot, instead
[9:00] of using the tabulator as I'll be just coming off from a,
[9:04] a revote from the school with a tabulator.
[9:07] So I was thinking of just do it at the old fashioned way.
[9:09] We, you drop the ballot in the box
[9:11] and we, we count 'em at the end of the night, yes or no.
[9:15] So what the select board is approving tonight is a
[9:18] form of ballot.
[9:20] You have that in your paperwork that is a piece of paper.
[9:24] And on that piece of paper, there are two check boxes.
[9:27] It says, if you are in favor of the bond issuance,
[9:30] you check in this box.
[9:32] If you are not in favor of the bond issue,
[9:35] you check in that box.
[9:37] If you do not need to use the tabulator,
[9:42] but you should use this ballot form.
[9:46] If you are going to use a paper ballot
[9:49] That that's fine.
[9:50] I just assume do it that way.
[9:51] And like I said, the week
[9:53] before, we have a rebo on the school amount,
[9:57] so, okay.
[9:59] That, that's perfect. Thank you.
[10:00] Yeah. So You could do it either way with a tabulator
[10:03] or with a paper ballot like this.
[10:05] Correct. Right.
[10:08] But it's, it's, it's Australian ballot voting.
[10:12] So it's not like people walk up to the front of the room
[10:15] with a little slip of paper and drop it in a box.
[10:18] It's people have seven, have eight hours to vote
[10:20] and each person fills out one of these ballot forms,
[10:24] drops it in a box, and it all gets counted later on
[10:26] at the end of the voting.
[10:28] Not like a floor vote meeting where people come up
[10:30] with a little slip of paper, drop it in a box,
[10:33] gets counted immediately, and you announce the results.
[10:35] That's not that, that's not an Australian ballot vote.
[10:40] That latter situation's more like a floor vote
[10:42] where if someone moved for a paper ballot,
[10:46] you understand the difference?
[10:48] I do, yes, I do.
[10:53] Anyone else have any questions for him?
[10:56] I was gonna say, I, I'm sure we've discussed time,
[10:59] but we can't do the vote on the
[11:00] same day as the school budget.
[11:01] I'm assuming. I don't, so timing won't work
[11:04] because I just figured that would have more voters. Yeah.
[11:07] Oh Yeah. You gotta have this warned between 30
[11:10] and 40 days in advance.
[11:12] So we don't have enough time.
[11:15] We never even did have enough time,
[11:17] even last week if we were
[11:19] to warn it in time for the school vote.
[11:20] So,
[11:22] And I don't have to hold it in the school,
[11:24] I can hold it here in the public safety building.
[11:26] Correct. You can hold it anywhere.
[11:29] You're warning it to be held.
[11:30] And that's, we're warning it
[11:31] to be held at the public safety building.
[11:33] Sounds like a plan. Yes.
[11:39] So other than the procedural requirements,
[11:43] I wanna make sure the select board knows this is a,
[11:45] so we have to do this necessity resolution.
[11:48] We have to pass this resolution.
[11:50] And what this says is basically
[11:54] that the project is necessary for the town.
[11:57] It doesn't have to be strictly necessary,
[11:59] but it necessary in the sense of like laying out a road,
[12:03] the same kind of standard,
[12:05] and that the expenses of the project,
[12:09] which is a capital improvement, are too great to be paid out
[12:13] of the ordinary expenses of the town.
[12:17] And the remainder of this resolution
[12:22] lists the costs and describes the procedure for voting
[12:27] and then says, you know, if the vote is passed,
[12:34] we can issue the, the, the town can issue the bonds
[12:37] to fund commencement of the project.
[12:41] I think if you've worked with the bond bank
[12:43] before, you know that it's a, it is not just the town
[12:46] that issues its bond.
[12:48] It is done like a loan
[12:49] because the bond bank pools all the bonds from towns
[12:53] that have been passed in the last six or so months
[12:56] and goes to the market with those.
[12:57] And it's technically a loan.
[12:59] So you don't have 20 town Vermont towns going
[13:03] to the bond market with separate bonds.
[13:05] You get a much better rate
[13:07] and deal when the bond bank pools them all together.
[13:10] But the prerequisite
[13:12] to holding the vote is the select board finding
[13:15] that the project is necessary
[13:18] and that the costs are too great to be paid out of the
[13:22] ordinary income, revenue
[13:23] and available resources of the town.
[13:25] So you need to go out to, to incur the indebtedness.
[13:30] And I, I don't usually read the resolution.
[13:33] Instead, you know, the resolution incorporates the form
[13:37] of ballot as well as the warning
[13:40] and by a, a motion to approve the necessity resolution
[13:45] for capital improvements that takes care of that.
[13:49] And then I would suggest you have one more motion
[13:53] to approve the warning of the special town meeting for
[13:57] May 8th and, and leave it at that, I'm sorry, May 6th.
[14:05] I assume that there's a 30 day appeal
[14:07] period with this as well?
[14:10] That is correct.
[14:12] There is a rescission period after the vote.
[14:18] We have timed this so
[14:20] that in all likelihood you'll still be able
[14:22] to make the summer bond pool with the bond bank
[14:25] because their final meeting isn't
[14:28] until the very end of June.
[14:30] So even with the, the vote will become final
[14:34] on June 7th, or sorry, June 5th.
[14:37] And then you'll still have time
[14:38] to get materials into the summer bond pool.
[14:41] So we can sell the bonds in probably early August.
[14:46] Okay. Anybody else have any
[14:50] questions? The,
[14:53] The only question I have on the resolution here was
[14:57] when we had discussed the length of it was 90 days
[15:01] and this just puts July
[15:02] and August on there, the anticipated construction.
[15:05] Yeah. We may be wanna change that from July to September.
[15:09] September. September.
[15:13] So July two, September
[15:17] of the end. Yep.
[15:19] What we'll do is Ryan will go back
[15:22] to the town office, make these changes.
[15:24] So we have a clean thing to sign tonight
[15:26] so we can get the ball rolling.
[15:28] So that sound like log the wing to do.
[15:32] Yeah. Then I would, I would say the motion should be
[15:35] motion to approve the necessity resolution
[15:39] for the $1 million in road improvements as amended.
[15:45] Yep.
[15:49] Well, I think we're all set.
[15:53] Thank you very much for your help.
[15:55] You're welcome. Don't forget to move
[15:57] to approve the warning for the special town meeting
[16:00] and get that signed as well.
[16:02] Yep. Great.
[16:06] Thank you. Thank
[16:07] You.
[16:08] Thank you everybody have a good night.
[16:09] Thank You.
[16:15] I think we need to, we can take a
[16:17] recess and let you go do that.
[16:19] Okay. So we can get some
[16:22] and then, we'll, we're gonna go
[16:23] to the executive session afterwards.
[16:25] So it's pretty much the end of this meeting
[16:26] unless somebody does it that you'd like to discuss it.
[16:34] You could, you could probably go do that. We're talk. It's
[16:37] Okay.
[16:38] Well if you're recessing,
[16:39] I would stop recording is all I would do
[16:43] The question first.
[16:44] Okay.
[16:45] So we're specifically talking tonight,
[16:48] I realize about the road bond,
[16:50] but what about the other resolution for the audit
[16:53] that was also not properly warned at the town meeting
[16:58] and placed on a Australian ballot?
[17:06] So you're the, you're, you have brought that up right now.
[17:10] I think someone else had mentioned it to me, the debate
[17:14] and talked just honestly, so he notified me
[17:18] that What year was it?
[17:21] Just so I can be ntroduce Sorry, stop.
[17:24] Sorry. I know I, Ben Moffett, I'm a resident of town.
[17:28] So the year that the ambulance got taken over,
[17:30] that was the specific year of town meeting that the voters
[17:34] said any budget issue needs to be
[17:36] on the floor, not on the ballot.
[17:40] So by moving the audit vote
[17:44] to the ballot that essentially potentially,
[17:47] or has potential to have gone against
[17:50] what the voters voted for.
[17:53] Now I, I guess, well, I'm sorry.
[17:55] I guess I didn't understand that to be that way.
[17:58] I knew there was an article on that year
[18:02] that it was put out there
[18:03] and approved by the board that could we put all articles
[18:08] on Australia ballot for here future has
[18:12] to be voted on the floor by the voters.
[18:15] It was, it was failed. The voters didn't want all articles.
[18:21] But I didn't realize that included any special articles.
[18:24] I didn't get that at all.
[18:25] I know all bond votes by law have
[18:28] to be done this way.
[18:31] Right. But I didn't realize any special,
[18:34] like the forensic being a special
[18:39] vote that that had to be included
[18:42] because we've always had articles like the a TV vote
[18:46] that was, that was an article that was, we,
[18:51] we warned a special meeting.
[18:53] We had it, it was here.
[18:54] And, and so it, it wasn't discussed.
[18:59] It was you guys agreed to either adopt or whatever and
[19:02] and approve
[19:03] Dealing with the bond bank.
[19:05] This is the only way it could be done by us
[19:07] About.
[19:08] Yeah, he's not asking about that though. We Well
[19:10] I am asking about that too.
[19:12] I'm sorry I walked in a little late, I apologize.
[19:14] I don't mean to drag this out,
[19:15] but what's the statute,
[19:17] you guys have statutory reference for that bond date?
[19:19] The necessity resolution that was mentioned by the,
[19:22] I'm assuming that was the town attorney?
[19:24] Yes. Yes. It's in here. He's a bond bank attorney.
[19:28] Okay. And in this official warning
[19:32] State of Vermont.
[19:33] And it does,
[19:35] I mean it'll be writing in chapter 43, 51 and 55
[19:38] and Title 17 Vermont sent you Title
[19:40] 17 43, 51 And 55.
[19:43] Okay,
[19:46] Thank you.
[19:48] I do. And Also the
[19:53] ne necessity resolution also says chapter 53
[19:57] of Title 24.
[20:10] But it was not my impression
[20:13] that anytime you wanted a certain article that
[20:15] everything had to be voted on the floor like the A QB vote
[20:19] was vote like we're gonna do for the bomb vote.
[20:23] We did it here. A piece of paper was just no,
[20:27] we kinda did it at the end of the night.
[20:28] It was one of the biggest turnout votes we ever had.
[20:32] So, so I didn't realize that
[20:38] it was for any future questions.
[20:43] It was whether to put whether
[20:46] to make Australian ballot in the future
[20:49] for all articles do away with discussing it on the floor.
[20:54] I did not realize it was all articles
[20:58] Would be so way to look into for next get clarify.
[21:05] So Yeah, so generally speaking, anytime, you know,
[21:08] title 17, chapter 55, we conduct business in the town
[21:12] of Williamstown by traditional town meeting.
[21:15] Yeah. Anytime you want to bring something
[21:18] or move something to an Australian ballot,
[21:20] you need prior voter approval to do that.
[21:22] Right. So, and then once that approval is given, it is good
[21:26] for until they decide to overturn it.
[21:30] And that goes for budgetary items, that goes
[21:32] for election of officers.
[21:33] That's right on down the board.
[21:35] And so my question for the board at the meeting was
[21:40] we just arbitrarily decided to move that, that article
[21:45] to the Australian ballot as well as bongo,
[21:47] there's another statute requiring the bongo
[21:50] to trigger an Australian ballot or a paper ballot.
[21:53] It sounds like talking to him, it can,
[21:54] doesn't necessarily have to be Australian,
[21:56] but it does need to be a paper type ballot.
[21:59] So that's what I'm requesting clarification on.
[22:02] Yeah, well From he did clarify
[22:04] that it can't be just a drop in piece
[22:05] of paper that could tell me.
[22:07] Right. It can't be a floor vote.
[22:08] You can't have someone make a motion to call
[22:10] for a paper vote on the floor.
[22:11] It does have to be an actual ballot, formal ballot,
[22:14] which you guys have in front of you. But yeah.
[22:17] Yeah, I think when I talked, I talked to Ryan, he said
[22:19] that the statute for bonds is, it has to be
[22:22] the ballot thing, but I'm pretty sure you are correct
[22:25] and I think it was just, we didn't,
[22:27] we didn't know this. So how are we remedy,
[22:29] What, what are we doing about that?
[22:31] I don't, we haven't had a chance to discuss that yet.
[22:33] Okay. Yeah. For the, for the audit.
[22:37] Yeah. I think probably the best thing,
[22:40] because I will be honest, I'm not the most legal person,
[22:43] but I would probably have to be reaching out
[22:44] to the town attorney to see what the process is.
[22:48] So when the town manager,
[22:49] because he has contact with the attorney,
[22:52] that will be something that we will vote on
[22:54] or don necessarily have to vote on tonight.
[22:56] But request that, what's the
[22:59] attorney's take on that?
[23:02] What's the legal
[23:06] Opinions Different animal than where our normal
[23:11] coming day budgets were for the one year deal partialed out
[23:15] between the highway department and general fund
[23:18] and ambulance and fire trucks. And, and no, I
[23:20] Understand, understand the rationale.
[23:22] Larry and I and I, I certainly can appreciate
[23:24] giving more people.
[23:26] This isn't because I'm disappointed in
[23:27] the outcome or anything like that.
[23:29] It's just that it needs to be done legally. Yep.
[23:30] And that's, that's my only point.
[23:32] Regardless of the outcome, the people decided in 2024
[23:36] that we want to, we want to do business in the town
[23:39] of Williamstown on the wall at the old fashioned way.
[23:41] And there's, there's value in that.
[23:43] There's some people that may argue the other way
[23:44] that they don't wanna do it that way 'cause it didn't work.
[23:48] Who have to work to come out and vote.
[23:49] But I just wanna make sure it's done legally
[23:51] Talking about the old fashioned way.
[23:53] Anything we've ever bonded
[23:54] before has done been done
[23:55] by Australian ballot water tank, which sort land.
[23:58] And he's not worried about the bond though.
[24:00] This, this building. He's
[24:02] Not concerned about the bond vote necessarily hiring,
[24:05] there's a different legal process when we're
[24:07] as a town signing on the dotted line to borrow money
[24:09] that there has to be a different process.
[24:11] I get that. I'm just saying
[24:12] that in general, there's a process.
[24:15] We didn't follow it. So now what are we gonna do?
[24:17] So I would just ask you guys
[24:19] to contemplate that amongst yourselves.
[24:20] Talk to the town attorney. Yep.
[24:22] I have filed a complaint with
[24:23] the Secretary of State's office.
[24:25] You guys are in copy of that. It was sent to you.
[24:28] So I one sent to me, it was sent to the town. Okay.
[24:31] Sent to the town. Okay. Sorry. I have not received.
[24:33] So you guys can hash that out.
[24:35] However, it may land is CAFO end and Yep.
[24:38] The way it was worded is, is you're probably correct on
[24:42] that, but I don't think that was the intent at the time
[24:45] for everybody to not be able to do anything with
[24:48] 70 people voting versus a couple thousand.
[24:52] I I I did it, I get it. I did it. I really, yeah.
[24:54] I'm spending Seven people walk
[24:56] and make a vote for the entire second one. We're committed
[24:59] For 10 years on this thing, not one
[25:02] Laws.
[25:03] Oh, I not, I'm not saying that.
[25:05] Well this is, this is all known to me that, that, that
[25:07] that didn't work out the way it was supposed to be either.
[25:10] I believe for the matter of months we've been trying
[25:13] to put this together and get it done the legal way.
[25:16] If there was any question, it would've been nice
[25:18] to come forth prior to all this.
[25:21] So by all means, your knowledge just let us know
[25:26] what about it prior to,
[25:27] I didn't even know it was, I went up
[25:29] to Barb when I was checking to vote.
[25:30] I didn't even know that it was going,
[25:32] that we weren't gonna discuss those two articles
[25:34] until the day of top meeting, frankly.
[25:37] So I, I absolutely would've
[25:38] Come forward from Did you, did you receive
[25:40] it in the, in the mail? I
[25:42] I received the town report
[25:44] And the informational packet put out weeks,
[25:46] months before. Yeah.
[25:48] There was, there was letters For,
[25:49] for informational meetings and everything else. So
[25:53] It should have been in the town report.
[25:55] They were I know the two, article two
[25:59] and article three were in town report.
[26:01] And then you guys did separate mailing.
[26:04] Yep. Nothing. Yeah. Every, Every
[26:07] Voter in We actually, reality we did better than
[26:11] what the bond bank requires by sending that mailing out.
[26:14] 'cause it went to everybody in town
[26:15] and not everybody reads newspaper or calls the internet
[26:19] or comes the public hearing.
[26:21] So I don't, we did, we went above
[26:23] and beyond what we required. See,
[26:26] But I didn't, you know,
[26:28] bygones are bygones and here we are.
[26:30] So we where we're at and We're gonna,
[26:33] I'm not here, we're gonna figure it out.
[26:34] Yeah, we'll figure it out.
[26:36] I just wanna make sure that whatever we do moving forward.
[26:39] Yep. It sounds like Ryan is, you know, very on board
[26:42] with the legality of things and you Cody Tyler
[26:45] and all of, so Yeah.
[26:47] Yeah. The question I wrote down to,
[26:49] what is the legal opinion
[26:50] of having the audit paper ballot versus on the floor?
[26:53] Is that the right question to ask?
[26:55] And you, me, you mentioned a specific statute.
[26:58] Yeah. You want say that that's the statute
[27:01] that he used here or he asked about it being on,
[27:05] is it Title 17?
[27:07] Yeah. So Title 17 Got you got the
[27:09] minutes for the town meeting.
[27:10] Right Barbara, you got the previous town meeting minutes
[27:13] that he is referring to?
[27:15] Yes. I So you could, you arrived
[27:17] Actually he made a copy that we're what is in the letter
[27:19] that, that Ryan
[27:21] Have an option.
[27:22] So you and Ryan can work together with the town attorney
[27:24] to figure out if we're doing something illegal again, right?
[27:28] No, we don't have to legal,
[27:30] we just didn't do it quite the way they
[27:32] require us to do it. So Title
[27:33] 7 2 26 26 80 a 26 80 a.
[27:37] Yep. In 26 80 C.
[27:39] So 26 80 A says that you have to do this
[27:42] and then 26 80 C is specific to budget items.
[27:45] Yeah.
[27:52] So that eliminates any special vote.
[27:55] The future, like say at TV vote.
[27:57] Well, I'm just using that 'cause it was,
[27:59] the last vote we had
[28:00] Was the, at was the at TV vote before or after
[28:04] It, it was this Whole meeting.
[28:06] So it was well before then. It was before
[28:08] Then.
[28:09] Yeah. Okay. But we did live all the time.
[28:10] Like we did a REVO for this public safety building.
[28:13] We done, several people got a petition found,
[28:16] it was too close to call.
[28:18] We did a revote, I held it in the old fire station
[28:22] and we did a bond vote with the water.
[28:26] So we've had special votes in the past
[28:28] that have been just a paper ballot.
[28:31] And so that's gonna eliminate any of these.
[28:35] Well, it might have been just the fact
[28:36] that it happened on town meeting day.
[28:39] And again, I'm not an
[28:40] attorney, but that would be a question to
[28:41] Ask.
[28:42] The thing is that, 'cause it was,
[28:43] if you're talking 70 people
[28:45] that attend town meeting million. No,
[28:49] I, I I, I believe me, I I get that and I'm not, I'm,
[28:54] I would like to see all articles on ballot. Right.
[28:58] I would have to go before we voted
[28:59] that there was significant conversation
[29:02] and people didn't want that.
[29:03] Yeah. Yes. I'm fortunate enough to be able to attend
[29:06] and I get that some people can't and that's unfortunate.
[29:09] But we have to follow the process if we want
[29:12] to do Australian ballot and we forward.
[29:14] Yeah. I lived in a community
[29:15] that did everything on austral ballot, like break down
[29:18] to the, every budgetary item was
[29:21] listed out on Austral ballot.
[29:22] And frankly it was obnoxious
[29:23] because you had to vote line by line.
[29:26] Appropriation has to be. Yes.
[29:28] Yep. I know. So I get it.
[29:30] But we just need to follow the process.
[29:33] I think, you know, like you said historically,
[29:35] I mean I know the, the water tank and so plant
[29:40] and this building all done through bonds.
[29:44] I think water, the sewer plant may have been through SDA
[29:47] but different type of bond.
[29:48] But anything we committed to town to for a long period
[29:52] of time, like this is 10 years
[29:53] or the, I think the water tank was 20 to 30 years.
[29:56] Same. The sewer plant
[29:58] or this, this building was like 20 years or so.
[30:01] What? And at then we've committed it to town to, to have
[30:05] to pay on for a long period
[30:06] of time has always been Australian ballot.
[30:08] And at then, like the regular budgets for the highway
[30:11] and the general fund and is a yearly thing.
[30:14] So they vote that annual budget at town meeting, which
[30:18] it doesn't commit the town for everybody in town
[30:21] for a number of years.
[30:22] Just that one year. If they don't like it,
[30:24] they should either show up to town meet
[30:26] or whatever the next year.
[30:28] But once you commit to something like this long term,
[30:31] you gotta make sure it's as many people can vote on it.
[30:35] So if that was the way it was worded, I gotta believe
[30:40] that what we've done in the past, so it's a precedent for,
[30:45] so probably would be fine, but I don't know for sure.
[30:48] I'm not a lawyer. Don't pretend to be
[30:50] Do you have it down court on you?
[30:51] I I have it up right now.
[30:53] The one question that could be questionable.
[30:55] No, I guess the minutes of the 2024. Oh hold on.
[31:01] Still in the, if you're in the 25 pounder board,
[31:05] the 2024 minutes should be in with that. Am I
[31:09] Looking at the 20, 24 minutes or the
[31:12] We're in the beginning.
[31:13] You're looking at Yeah, I don't
[31:14] 20, 24 Minutes and 2025.
[31:18] Yeah, I think that's right, Barb.
[31:20] Yeah. Yeah, I know it, I know it.
[31:24] I I don't know what the margins were, but I know it
[31:26] Failed. It did fail.
[31:28] I don't, but I don't know if you keep, and I,
[31:29] and I'm pretty sure that went to paper ballot.
[31:31] Yes. I believe it, it, it would say
[31:34] that in the minutes. Do
[31:35] You remember what article it was?
[31:37] It was toward the end of, I believe, article 7 17 18.
[31:41] It was after all the appropriations, I believe. Well that
[31:45] Article is to put everything on
[31:47] Article 17 I think.
[31:48] So to see if the town will vote
[31:50] to adopt all budget articles is
[31:52] by Australian ballot pursuant to 17 BSA section 26 80 C.
[31:57] The motion was made by Ramish Schneider
[31:59] and seconded by Mike Sparano
[32:02] to prove the article is written.
[32:04] Ramish Schneider spoke in favor
[32:06] to moving all financials to Australian ballot.
[32:08] Many people spoke on behalf of seeing the tradition continu,
[32:11] they enjoy the discussion.
[32:12] Charlotte Mills stated that 371 people out
[32:15] of 2,600 voters voted last year by Australian ballot.
[32:19] Asking if is that really being represented that you need
[32:24] to realize the town meeting is important.
[32:25] Motion failed by voice vote. Okay,
[32:27] Voice vote.
[32:29] So so that was Per that.
[32:31] Yeah. So that was budget items.
[32:34] This is, this is a bond vote.
[32:36] Right. That's What I'm saying. There's different batch,
[32:39] But I think he's talking about in the thing,
[32:41] but I think he's, I think we're
[32:43] Good.
[32:44] Yeah. If it was a paper ballot,
[32:47] I would've said Yeah. An
[32:49] Australian ballot like it.
[32:51] Tell me what's that?
[32:53] Is that if you're doing an Australian ballot,
[32:56] like it would've tell me, is there anything
[32:58] that says we cannot have it discussed on the floor
[33:03] before the Australian ballot?
[33:05] Well, we're not gonna,
[33:07] We're just gonna have a vote.
[33:08] We're not gonna have, if you wanna discuss it, come
[33:10] to the public hearing prior to it,
[33:13] You gotta do it prior.
[33:14] You can't do it act down meeting.
[33:17] There's just gonna be a polling booth
[33:19] just to vote yes or no.
[33:20] Okay. Yeah. But like on town meeting,
[33:23] is there any way they could,
[33:24] we could do discussion on the floor and still do what ballot
[33:30] This year Discussion has to be had
[33:35] Not gonna be, but here it's just gonna be polling.
[33:37] You kind have like the school does there you can't,
[33:41] you call the school board members.
[33:43] Everything's on Australia pal.
[33:46] So you could answer any questions
[33:48] that anybody in the audience may have,
[33:51] but you couldn't like both on each particular article
[33:55] because it was all written valid.
[33:58] So the day of town meeting was
[34:00] article two and article three.
[34:04] I mean, I know there was a little confusion
[34:06] with the moderator and everything.
[34:07] I mean, they could be discussed like we do
[34:10] like a different school,
[34:12] but you couldn't, you couldn't be decided on anything
[34:17] on Article two three.
[34:19] You could ask questions,
[34:20] but that just seemed to go on forever. Yeah.
[34:24] You can't, you can't make
[34:24] amendments or anything like that. Like
[34:26] Traditionally be were The four.
[34:29] Yeah. Think. And then the question, you know,
[34:32] this is gonna be questionable article two, this is
[34:35] what it was stated
[34:36] as shall the voters approve adding
[34:38] 250,000 to the general budget.
[34:41] So that sentence might've kind of hurt us right there.
[34:44] Potentially legally, because the general budget was voted
[34:46] by the floor, but one item was voted by Australian ballot.
[34:52] So if it's part of the Australian ballot,
[34:53] or sorry, the general budget, how can one piece be here
[34:57] and the other piece be there?
[34:58] It would be additional to the what you,
[35:00] because that 251 not included in the general
[35:03] budget. Correct.
[35:05] Yeah. But I just Yeah, I, I see. Because
[35:08] Any, any voter I think could pull
[35:10] something outta the general budget.
[35:12] Okay. I see What you're saying on the floor
[35:13] and say we don't want to, I mean,
[35:18] I would say the, the one
[35:19] that always brings up things is the, hold on,
[35:23] let me make sure I'm saying it right here.
[35:25] Basically all the money we give to the support of
[35:30] parent child fund that always gets pulled and says,
[35:33] and it got pulled this year in town meeting, we don't want
[35:36] to give X amount of dollars to this organization.
[35:38] We'd rather give that, I mean,
[35:40] I feel like some members are saying some numbers
[35:42] so they can kind of dissect.
[35:44] Yeah. But we didn't really hope anything.
[35:46] Didn't everything get everything voted
[35:50] that just the way it was in the article. Why?
[35:52] Yeah, but they were, they weren't attempting. You could,
[35:55] Yeah.
[35:56] You could make a motion. Yes.
[35:57] Someone could make a motion on the floor
[35:59] to amend the budget not to include the like s there
[36:03] Yeah.
[36:04] Anything. And then we try to,
[36:06] because they misunderstood what the article was
[36:09] and then yeah, it kind of was chaos there.
[36:13] But, and, and all, it all came out the way it was,
[36:19] it was in, in the article of the amount.
[36:23] So Ryan, while you were making copies? Yeah.
[36:27] The question is could we get a legal opinion from our,
[36:30] whoever the right attorney is for the town
[36:32] of Williamstown? I've reached
[36:33] Out to Nicholas Lowe.
[36:35] I haven't heard back from him, but Ill follow
[36:37] Up.
[36:38] Okay. The question is having the audit on paper versus
[36:41] floor, which is legal.
[36:42] Did we do it correctly? That's,
[36:44] That's what I asked.
[36:46] Robert got the information on the warning
[36:48] and what was done at that meeting.
[36:51] Previous meeting Guys can on that figure it out.
[36:54] Yep. We'll figure It out.
[36:55] We just dismissed it, I thought, didn't we? Yeah, but
[36:57] He wasn't here.
[36:59] No, no. Oh no, no.
[37:00] I met when we brought up that article that,
[37:03] that people discussed that day.
[37:05] That was the warning back then in 2024.
[37:08] Okay. James, I don't know what you're asking Larry, but
[37:15] Brian was just telling him to Ryan
[37:18] to reach out to the attorney to,
[37:20] Right, I got that then Larry said Brian was gonna look up
[37:23] for the warning, but he read that warning
[37:27] Ryan will fill you in. You guys will fine.
[37:29] Okay. All right. Just like you said, just
[37:32] Go over what you asked him to read to you.
[37:34] Yeah. Figure it out with the lawyer. Yeah. Okay.
[37:38] I fact, so we have to make two motions, right?
[37:41] One for the warning and one for the resolution.
[37:44] Correct. Okay.
[37:46] And should we read, I think it would probably best
[37:48] to read them as they were being
[37:50] voted on so everyone knows what they
[37:52] Actually say.
[37:53] Read what we're doing here and then we,
[37:56] Okay.
[37:58] So this is the necessity resolution
[38:03] and it reads, resolved that a special meeting
[38:07] of the select board and of the town of Williamstown.
[38:10] Duly notice for and held on March 30th, 2026.
[38:13] It was determined by the select board
[38:15] that the public interest
[38:17] and necessity demand
[38:18] that the town performed capital upgrades
[38:20] and improve at least 13.84 miles
[38:24] of nine unpaved town highways that had insufficient base
[38:28] and traveled way with to allow the public
[38:31] to safely travel set town highways in all seasons
[38:34] of the year, particularly in the spring by adding crushed
[38:38] granite to the base and be it further resolved
[38:43] that the select board and town manager estimated,
[38:45] but the total cost to perform the A four set upgrades
[38:48] and improvements to 13.84 miles
[38:52] of nine town highways is not more than $1 million,
[38:56] which is referred to as the project.
[38:59] And be it further resolved that the costs
[39:01] of the project are too great to be paid out
[39:04] of the ordinary annual income, revenue,
[39:06] and available resources of the town.
[39:09] And be it further resolved that the anticipated construction
[39:12] of the project is to occur in July, August
[39:14] and September, 2026, making it necessary
[39:18] to schedule a warrant
[39:19] and conduct a special town meeting for consideration
[39:21] of the project and be it further resolved that a proposal
[39:26] for the issuance of general obligation indebtedness
[39:30] of the town in an aggregate amount not to exceed $1 million,
[39:34] having a maximum term of 10 years
[39:36] to fund the project should be submitted to the legal voters
[39:39] of the town to be voted on by Australian ballot
[39:43] at a special town meeting to be called duly warned
[39:46] and held on Wednesday May 6th, 2026 at the public safety
[39:50] building 2 49 Meadow Street in the town of Williamstown.
[39:54] And be it further resolved
[39:56] that the select board will hold a public informational
[39:59] hearing on the project in bond issue proposition on Monday,
[40:02] April 27th, 2026, commencing at six o'clock in the afternoon
[40:07] at the Williamstown Public Safety Building,
[40:09] 2 49 Meadow Street, the town of Williamstown and by Zoom
[40:12] and be it further resolved that all acts relating
[40:15] to the proposition of incurring indebtedness
[40:19] and the issuance of general obligation, depth,
[40:22] or purpose of this project.
[40:24] The importance with the provisions of chapter 53,
[40:27] title 24 Vermont statutes indicated am it further resolved
[40:32] that the attached form of the warning
[40:34] and form of ballot are specifically adopted
[40:37] for use in connection with consideration of the proposition
[40:40] of undertaking the identified capital improvement project
[40:44] and incurring indebtedness, therefore,
[40:47] and then the signature page, what we adopted.
[40:52] Okay. Will we entertain a motion
[40:56] to accept the article?
[40:57] Is read a resolution? Is it read?
[41:00] I make a motion to
[41:02] Tyler.
[41:04] Remember that the lawyer said to say as amended.
[41:07] Oh, so we, what he just read is the amending.
[41:10] Okay. We read it amended. He read the new one. Okay.
[41:12] So I, I just, I remember Well I'll let,
[41:15] Then I'll let you make the motion because you sound like
[41:18] He already amended it so we're,
[41:19] we're good the way he read it.
[41:21] Okay. Well I'll say I make a motion to
[41:27] adopt the necessity resolution capital improvement as read
[41:32] Your I'll second.
[41:34] It must be seconded. Any further discussion? All in favor?
[41:39] Aye. Aye. Opposed? Okay.
[41:43] Right then next up is the town of Williamstown Vermont.
[41:48] Special meeting of official warning for May 6th, 2026.
[41:53] The legal voters of the town of Williamstown,
[41:55] Vermont are hereby notified
[41:56] and warned to meet at the public safety Building 2 49 Meadow
[41:59] Street and the town of Williamstown on Wednesday
[42:02] May 6th, 2026, between the hours
[42:04] of 10 o'clock in the four noon,
[42:06] at which time the polls will open
[42:08] and seven o'clock in the afternoon at which time the polls
[42:11] will close to vote
[42:13] by Australian ballot on the following article.
[42:16] Article one shall the general obligation bonds
[42:20] or notes of the town of Williamstown in an amount not
[42:23] to exceed $1 million, having a maximum term
[42:26] of 10 years be issued to fund the purchase of materials
[42:29] and equipment to perform capital upgrades
[42:32] and improvements to at least 13.84 miles
[42:35] of nine unpaid town highways.
[42:37] By adding a new crush granted base, the legal voters
[42:42] of the town of Williamstown are further notified
[42:44] that voter qualification, registration
[42:46] and absentee voting relative to said special town meeting
[42:50] shall be as provided in chapters 43 51
[42:53] and 55 of Title 17 Vermont statutes annotated.
[42:59] The legal voters of the town
[43:01] of Williamstown are further notified
[43:03] that a public informational hearing will be held on Monday,
[43:06] April 27th, 2026 at the Williamstown Public Safety Building,
[43:11] 2 49 Meadow Street in the town of Williamstown,
[43:14] beginning at six o'clock in the afternoon.
[43:17] For the purpose of explaining the project
[43:19] and the financing thereof, the voters may attend to via zoom
[43:22] and the following link, and then adopt an approved at a
[43:27] special meeting of the select board, the town
[43:29] of Williamstown duty recall notice
[43:32] and held March 30th, 2026.
[43:34] And a signature page.
[43:37] Not gonna get the motion to accept this as red,
[43:42] I Make a motion to accept the town of Williamstown.
[43:45] Special meeting, official warning, May 6th, 2026 as red
[43:50] Your second.
[43:51] Second motion made. Second. Any discussion?
[43:55] All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed?
[44:02] Alright, great.
[44:04] Send these around. We have the spot for you.
[44:07] Brian, anything?
[44:13] We don't have to make a motion for the ballot.
[44:17] I don't believe so. A Nothing's said on not hearing.
[44:21] Did you check the spelling? Well, we just to be safe, let's,
[44:25] let's make a motion to approve the ballot as written.
[44:27] Sure. Yep. Just in case
[44:30] I, I'm gonna just read it just quick.
[44:32] Do you want me to read it out loud? Yeah,
[44:33] Please. Okay.
[44:35] William Town's official ballot, May 6th, 2026.
[44:37] Article one Shall the general obligation bonds
[44:40] or notes of the town of Williamstown
[44:42] and the amount not to exceed $1 million,
[44:44] having a maximum term of 10 years be issued
[44:47] to fund the purchase of materials
[44:49] and equipment to perform capital upgrades
[44:51] and improvement to at least 13.84 miles
[44:55] of nine unpaved town highways
[44:57] by adding a new crush credit base.
[44:59] If in favor of this bond issue, make a cross in this square.
[45:03] If opposed to this bond issue. Make a cross in this square
[45:10] Motion. I make
[45:11] A motion to accept the ballot room.
[45:14] Second. Second. Motion May 2nd.
[45:17] Any discussion? Favor?
[45:20] Aye. Aye. Opposed?
[45:23] Is this something we need to vote on now or there?
[45:27] No, I just want to discuss it in executive session.
[45:30] Just for probation? Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
[45:47] You're all good There?
[46:14] No. Any additional requirements you aware of? Nope.
[46:19] On the table?
[46:24] Nothing.
[46:26] Yeah. As far as the ballot, will that be mailed
[46:29] to every individual person
[46:31] or will it be available at the time of the vote?
[46:34] Yeah, if somebody's gonna ask me that question. Yeah.
[46:36] No, they'll be, you can get an absentee,
[46:39] but I think the way the mail is, you vote in the office
[46:43] if you can't make it to the vote, but there'll be,
[46:46] but they, they'll get, there'll be a stack of them here
[46:49] where that's what, okay.
[46:51] Thank you. We're not mailing them out to people. No. Okay.
[46:53] Well I just, somebody gonna ask that question
[46:56] if you need absentee.
[46:58] Yeah. Absentee ballots can be mailed, right?
[47:01] That's what I mean. Other than
[47:02] that it's not like we just send them
[47:03] and people send them back in.
[47:06] We'll continue.
[47:09] Okay. I guess that's end of the regular meeting.
[47:13] We're gonna have to have executive session.
[47:15] So somebody wanna vote to go to short recess?
[47:20] I make motion to take a five minute recess
[47:22] and then enter executive session. I'll second
[47:25] That.
[47:26] Motion. Motion be seconded. All in favor? Legal issues.
[47:29] I think you have to state for legal issues.
[47:31] It's for legal issue. Thanks everyone.
[47:40] Okay. Okay.
[47:43] Are they vote to come out of SEC two session? Somebody?
[47:46] Yeah, I'll make a mark come out. Executive session.
[47:49] I second a motion may. Seconded.
[47:53] How do we work that? No action taken.
[47:55] Just do we have to or we did a motion? Second.
[47:59] Do we have to vote? Toye? All in favor? Aye. Opposed?
[48:04] Okay. And there was no action taken. So yes.
[48:10] Motion to adjourn. Motion to adjourn. Last.