[0:01] Okay, so I'm going to go ahead and call the special meeting of Monday, July 27th to order. It is now 6.19 p.m. Mr. Spord, you want to read what you need to read? Thank you, Mayor. Good evening, and a lot of the recent record spikes in the number of COVID-19 cases in Pemelles County and the public health emergency presented by COVID-19. This regular meeting of the city commission is being conducted via communications media technology.

[0:30] I'm sorry, the special meeting of the city commission is being conducted to be a communications

[0:34] media technology pursuant to the governor's executive order number 2069 as extended most

[0:39] recently by executive order 2150 and city resolution of our 2020 15.

[0:45] Notice that this meeting will be held by communication media technology and out of physical locations

[0:48] posts on the city's website was advertised on social media outlets.

[0:52] The notice included all information that the city has included in the past several months

[0:56] we conduct the virtual meetings during COVID-19. As city manager, I will continue to serve as a

[1:01] technology moderator for this virtual meeting and Mayor A. U. will handle zoom public comments.

[1:06] The city is using zoom meeting technology. The zoom meeting ID and information on how to download

[1:11] and access is available on the city's website, www.cityofsakeyharbour.com. The commissioners are only

[1:18] able to communicate with one another on Zoom via video competency. No other chat functions are utilized

[1:24] for the city commissioners to communicate with one another. The visuals to be displayed for the

[1:28] Zoom meeting platform are also being broadcast on the city's website and there is a live stream

[1:34] being broadcast at City Hall subject to social distancing requirements and screen for COVID-19 symptoms.

[1:40] Again, we have three participants joining us this evening at City Hall. The methods for receiving

[1:45] public comment will be the same as the past several months of conducting virtual meetings during COVID-19.

[1:49] option one US mail or email prior to this meeting submitted written comments prior to this meeting by US mail or email

[1:55] Comments of 500 words or less would be read during the meeting during the appropriate time for public comment

[2:00] This is because 500 words can be read roughly three minutes as it heads up commissioners. I have right now 25 emails that have come in

[2:09] To read at some point this evening option number during this special meeting option number two email during this meeting

[2:16] The public may submit comments via e-mail to p-comment at cityassadegarber.com, e-mails

[2:21] of 500 words or less we read aloud during this meeting during the appropriate time for

[2:25] public comment.

[2:26] The read aloud e-mails less we received before audits we heard has concluded or for comments

[2:30] on agenda items before public comment on the agenda item is closed.

[2:34] E-mails that exceed 500 words will only be provided to the mayor and commissioners and writers.

[2:38] All written comments whether submitted via a US mail or mail will be included as part of

[2:42] the public record for this virtual meeting.

[2:43] Option number three telephone. Those of you attending this meeting via our toll free telephone access line 1-877-8535257, if you wish to speak with the mayor calls for public comment, please press star 9 and your telephone touch pad to raise your hand.

[2:59] The mayor will be notified that you wish to comment you will be called on at the appropriate time and will be given three minutes to address the city commission.

[3:05] We'll be patient pressing star 9 again will only lower your hand and may not be called on.

[3:10] option number four, zoom meeting. For those of you attending this meeting via zoom

[3:14] meeting, if you wish to speak with AmeriCorps for public comment, please press the

[3:18] raise and icon on the zoom meeting platform. Just as with telephone users, the

[3:22] mayor will be notified that you wish to comment. You'll be called on at the

[3:25] appropriate time and you will be given three minutes to address the city

[3:28] permission. Again, please be patient, continue to press the raise and icon will

[3:32] lower your hand and you may not be called on. A few additional matters for those

[3:36] providing live public comment via phone or zoom meeting. Please minimize any background noise

[3:41] and please be reminded to state your name and address in the beginning of your comments.

[3:45] Please speak slowly and clearly so that everyone can hear your comments however please do not

[3:49] shout. At the end of your comments or maximum time your line will be placed on you by the host please

[3:54] do not raise your hand again or attempt to unmute yourself during the same agenda item. Please be patient

[3:59] while we do our best to make sure everyone has had the opportunity to participate in the meeting

[4:03] and we have a clear record for our minutes.

[4:06] If at any time we have technical difficulties,

[4:08] we will recess the meeting briefly

[4:09] to try to resolve the technical issues.

[4:11] At the issues are resolved,

[4:12] we will conclude the recess and proceed with the meeting.

[4:15] At the issues are not resolved,

[4:16] we will adjourn the meeting.

[4:18] That's all I have there.

[4:21] Okay, thank you for that.

[4:22] So I see we already have 103 attendees.

[4:28] You said you had how many 25 emails?

[4:33] I have more now.

[4:35] I have 27 now.

[4:37] Okay, so in the past we let public comment go to three minutes. I think on this one we're

[4:43] going to have to do two minutes just to make sure everybody has a fair chance to speak given the amount of people we have.

[4:51] So with that said, but I'll get more to that before we open it up to public comments.

[5:05] Okay, so I call this meeting as a continuation of the last meeting we had.

[5:09] We had an issue on there that we got a lot of citizen input from so I want to continue that discussion but before I did I had a couple things I want to talk about with regards to just kind of the length of the last meeting and meeting flows going forward and based on the flow of the meetings.

[5:27] I mean, we're going in a few months before the election, based on the meetings, how they

[5:32] were going before the last election and how things went at the last meeting, I've done

[5:37] a little thinking and realized that these meetings can be run better, so I'm going to be

[5:42] making some changes and asking the other commissioners and staff to help me out with that.

[5:47] So during the audience to be hurt portion of the meeting, in the run up at the last election,

[5:51] I started noticing this portion of the meetings was getting just a little bit out of control.

[5:57] the level of negativity was getting to unacceptable levels by city of safety

[6:03] harbor standards and on several occasions people have been acting disrespect

[6:07] with others in the room and saying quite frankly unacceptable things to elected

[6:11] officials and others. So going forward I'm going to do a better job to make sure

[6:16] this does not happen anymore. In addition this portion or the audience to be

[6:21] her portion of the meetings has been prolonged in the past by organized efforts

[6:25] to push for certain courses of action while pushing scheduled agenda items to later in the night.

[6:31] And I don't think this is fair to the people who come out for scheduled items. So when it appears,

[6:36] this is happening. What I'm going to do is I'm going to make that topic an agenda item

[6:40] and just move it to another night just so we can have everybody that's come out for that

[6:45] meeting to give everybody an opportunity to be heard. With regards to Zoom meetings, I'm also going

[6:51] exercise greater control over these meetings by managing who's on mute and who's not on mute.

[6:59] Now, with regards to the length of meetings, I want to say that last week's meeting, I think,

[7:04] went unnecessarily long into the night. So given this, I'm asking both commissioners and staff

[7:10] to just be a little more aware of how much is on the agenda into act accordingly.

[7:17] In the past, I've oftentimes asked questions that I already know the answer to and I think

[7:21] several of us do that also, kind of just for the benefit of those watching, but when we

[7:26] have a packed agenda, I just ask everybody to just be a little more cognizant of our

[7:33] time restraints.

[7:34] So, again, we're being fair to the people and the audience that came out for other items.

[7:41] I also ask everyone to be more concise with your comments and, quite frankly, to be more

[7:47] prepared.

[7:47] the last week we spent way more time that was necessary on a consent agenda item for which we

[7:54] already received numerous emails, background information, and we already had several in-depth

[7:59] discussions on that issue. So what I'm going to propose is that we limit the length of the meetings

[8:05] to end at 10 o'clock instead of the current 11 o'clock with the ability to extend for another hour

[8:12] until 11 o'clock. I don't think holding a meeting at last five hours until midnight. I don't think

[8:19] that's fair to anybody waiting on agenda items. And quite frankly, I don't think it's within the

[8:23] spirit of holding meetings in the sunshine. I'm also proposing an idea to have a petition review

[8:31] process before we take any action on any petitions. And I've spoken to Matt, staff can research this,

[8:37] But before I move on to the next topic, which has to do with the signs on city property, I just want to open this up to the city commission and see if we can put the agenda, put the discussion on the agenda regarding the length of the meetings and a petition review process in place.

[8:56] And I'm just asking that we put it on the agenda. We're not going on anything right now.

[9:02] commissioners, you may have to unmute yourself.

[9:12] I'll start.

[9:13] Yeah.

[9:13] You know, I agree with everything you said.

[9:16] I think that the last week's meeting, I think it boarded a little bit chaotic.

[9:23] It seemed like everybody wanted an audience to be heard item.

[9:26] We were addressing it and putting it on the agenda, which is that's not what the audience

[9:31] to be heard.

[9:31] it. And this has become a precedence here under this commission for a while. And we keep

[9:40] addressing people audience to be heard. And the thing is, is that people in the audience

[9:45] to be heard, people are there to voice their opinions on something. And I think that any

[9:51] commissioner at any time, you know, you have your commission, you have the commission notes

[9:57] at the end, where if they like something an idea that somebody came up with, bring it up there,

[10:06] during the commission notes at the end, and we could all look at it, listen to it, and then have

[10:13] a vote, and possibly put it on, you know, put it as an agenda in the future. I don't think it's fair

[10:22] for us to be holding meetings on complex items that haven't been advertised to the commissioners

[10:34] and also to the public. Some of these things, a lot of people would want to have their

[10:41] our voice heard, and obviously, and as far as, you know, the commissioners, you know,

[10:48] we, particularly myself, I would like to be prepared, you know, on looking at the

[10:54] different items, looking at the different ways and stuff like that, you know, it's so,

[10:59] I think it has to do with a little bit of courtesy, not only to the citizens that put us in

[11:04] this position, but also to our peers that are sitting at the, on the dias, and also, you

[11:09] you know, to the city manager and to the city attorney, you know, for everybody to be prepared. So we can have a more thorough and orderly conversation on things.

[11:27] Mayor.

[11:29] Can I just add one more thing? Sorry, Nancy. Is that okay?

[11:38] I am a little bit concerned, I am a little bit concerned, you know, you know, let the public know, let the whole commission up, I'm a little bit concerned about the way our meetings have been run, you know, specifically now with these Zoom meetings.

[11:55] We pretty much had some pretty easy meetings as we went virtual, except for the last meeting

[12:02] which was actually packed and of course it went to stray.

[12:07] But I think that we need to start putting in better protocols, parameters, and discipline

[12:13] on these Zoom meetings as things start to, you know, we deal with more complex matters

[12:22] And also with the election coming up here in five or six months, you know, I'm sure there's going to be a little bit of a tally here.

[12:31] I'm, you know, on items being put and stuff like that. So I think I think we need a little bit more discipline and order to the meetings or we just we just can't do it virtually that.

[12:44] Thank you.

[12:48] I have two things mayor, if you can hear me, okay to go ahead.

[12:55] Okay, first thing I want to be very, very sure that we don't wash the commissioner's ability to pull a consent agenda item and ask for more information.

[13:08] So I'm a little cautious, very cautious mayor about what you said about the consent agenda

[13:14] item and that we should be more prepared because sometimes when the commissioner pulls

[13:19] an item and asks it to be set aside instead of just saying, I, I, the commissioner wants

[13:25] more information.

[13:27] So I just want to be sure that we're clear that no one should ever hesitate to call for

[13:32] clarification or for more information, even if that makes the meeting more lengthy.

[13:37] And then the second thing really is a point of clarification to you, Mr. Mayor.

[13:42] I don't know how I heard this or where I heard this, but I believe Mr. Pawns

[13:47] might have approached and asked you to be on the agenda.

[13:51] And I thought you made the decision to have him speak an audience to be heard.

[13:56] Am I incorrect?

[14:01] I do not remember we had a lunch.

[14:05] I don't remember if he asked to be on that night's agenda or a future agenda, I'm just trying to jog my memory.

[14:11] I may have, if he did, asked to be on agenda. I think I may have suggested if he wanted to, if he wanted to be on agenda,

[14:19] we'd do it at later night and there was a little bit of urgency to speak sooner, so it was done during audience to be heard as far as I can remember.

[14:29] Okay, because I'm in total agreement with you that that would have been much smoother had we had it as a separate agenda item and people would have felt that we had been more inclusive. So thank you.

[14:40] Okay,

[14:44] are we going to make one comment, too?

[14:49] I want to make sure the commission understands this issue.

[14:55] We don't want to quash citizens' input.

[14:57] Again, that is...

[15:00] Commissioner of the source said the consent agenda items are particularly important for me. Consent agenda item is a type of item that typically is so insignificant or is not not a big issue that they can put it on a special part of the agenda called the consent agenda. It's just approved. It's almost an automatic. And my concern, and I'm totally in favor of using consent agenda items, but there are certain things that get popped into there that I

[15:29] I want there to be more public knowledge of,

[15:34] I don't think anybody would disagree with that.

[15:36] You wanna have government to sunshine.

[15:38] So the idea that you're not gonna pull a consent agenda item

[15:42] because it was unexpected

[15:44] or that the commissioners already should have had conversations

[15:47] with the city manager about it.

[15:49] That's not really a good excuse.

[15:50] You wanna pull a consent agenda item for one questions

[15:54] and two to make sure that the residents

[15:55] and the citizens understand what's going on

[15:57] in that public hearing. It's still a public hearing and consent agenda. It's just handled

[16:02] it slightly differently because it's put on this special agenda where it's almost

[16:06] like an automatic. So we got to make sure that we don't, you know, cause the commissioner

[16:13] is not to pull something because of a policy that avoid a longer meeting. I mean, the reality

[16:22] as the meetings are fluid, they change. Subjects can come up. Certainly certain things are required

[16:29] to be advertised and noticed. That's very clear, bright line rule of what needs to be noticed

[16:34] beforehand and put in a newspaper and published, but certain things don't need to be published.

[16:41] At certain activities within the city, like putting up a sign or even a stop sign,

[16:48] what you're sort of arguing about mayor is if a group of people come in for a

[16:54] petition that want to put up a stop sign on 2nd May, you're suggesting that we

[16:59] can't do that at that hearing. And I would totally disagree with that. I think

[17:03] that's something that's totally appropriate to be heard at any particular

[17:07] hearing or at commission meeting. So I'm not sure if I'm really

[17:12] comfortable with coming up with standards that say, oh, a petition has to go to the next hearing

[17:19] or a commissioner can't pull something. This is all about government and sunshine. That's why

[17:24] we're doing that. And I'm frustrated by the Zoom meetings too, but what we have to do right now,

[17:32] it's the right thing to do and we have to live with it. So, but I want to continue to have this

[17:40] commission, Operable Sunshine. Okay, so let me just be clear, I was not suggesting that we not

[17:46] pull consent agenda items. I'm perfectly fine with this point, consent agenda items.

[17:51] My point for the last meeting was is we pulled the consent agenda item that we have spoken

[17:56] about ad nauseam in the past. We've all had the opportunity to discuss and be prepared and talk

[18:01] to the chiefs to fund stick about the implications of priority dispatch.

[18:07] And I think we ended up having something like a 45 minute discussion on it after we'd already had a long presentation after we have an audience to be heard.

[18:16] So I'm not suggesting we do that. I'm just suggesting that when there's something that we've already that we should be a little more prepared for, we're just cogniz that there's always an expensive something.

[18:25] So we've been at all the sunshine in the world, but if people can't speak until close to midnight, that's kind of having the adverse effect also.

[18:33] When I talked about, you know, if there's a group of, I didn't say push petitions to another

[18:39] meeting.

[18:40] I think what I was trying to crystallize was, if there's a group of people, and they're

[18:44] all want to talk about the same subject, and it's, you know, it's a potentially hot

[18:49] button issue, or it's something that I think other people of the public that are going to

[18:53] be interested in, I think I have the, I don't think, I know I have the right as the mayor

[18:57] to just take it make an agenda item, advertise it and give everybody in the city or the public the opportunity to also have their voice heard on that.

[19:06] So that's what I'm going to be doing with with regards to that portion of audience that you heard.

[19:12] But I was asking the commission for is if we're all open to just creating an agenda item when we talk about the length of the meetings and a petition review process before we take any action on petitions.

[19:24] They are just one point for the petition review process you mentioned.

[19:30] There already is a citizens initiative process described in the charter.

[19:35] So I think that may be one item that may be able to be worked out through the current

[19:43] charter provisions and the agenda process that you all have.

[19:48] I think your decision of how you all as commissioners want to add things to the agenda is

[19:53] is separate from that citizen's initiative process,

[19:56] but I did want to point that out

[19:57] that the charter does already provide

[20:00] for parameters on the citizen's initiative process.

[20:04] So we couldn't provide for anything

[20:07] that conflicted with the charter.

[20:09] Just to the point on the question

[20:12] for the two items that you wish to discuss in the future.

[20:16] And we can just dust that off in a future meeting

[20:18] and just get more acquainted with what's going on with that.

[20:21] I want to add my two cents.

[20:25] We meet twice a month to me limiting the meetings less than what we currently have.

[20:32] If we have a rare occurrence where we end up having to go to the time period,

[20:36] where we have to ask an additional hour.

[20:39] To me,

[20:42] I wouldn't want to reduce it because people have the opportunity.

[20:46] And I think people have the right to be able to have a discussion when it's necessary.

[20:52] So these Zoom meetings, I get it, they are different.

[20:56] It's taken a little bit to get used to, and there needs to be, perhaps, this is going

[21:02] to be the norm for a while, I have to figure out ways to keep things, you know, moving in

[21:07] control.

[21:08] But limiting the total amount of time that we can speak, where people can speak, that's

[21:16] right now, I would vote no for that. And the discussion that Commissioner Diaz mentioned

[21:25] about bringing things up, I can support that. I also, as long as we're talking about that kind

[21:31] of stuff, it doesn't have very often, but once a while, even with the Commission's reports,

[21:37] all of a sudden, something pops up during that time that ends up getting voted on or

[21:43] And to me, I also like the ability to read up on stuff as much as possible and be able

[21:50] to be prepared, and when that happens, even at a commissioner's report, even though it

[21:58] makes sense that he might have gotten that input, as he might have gotten that input from

[22:02] the discussions of the meeting, I think we should try to restrict from making votes without having

[22:13] sufficient time for staff to be able to pull in information, to give us information on it.

[22:19] And so that happens once in a while, it doesn't happen very often, but sometimes it catches

[22:23] you by surprise, and you may or may not know all the details that you might have been able

[22:28] to find out if you had the ample amount of time. So I just wanted to add that as well.

[22:38] Okay. Anyone else before we move on?

[22:40] Okay,

[22:47] I heard one against discussion about limiting the time moving the change in the

[22:53] length of the meetings from ending at 11, ending at 10. I'm not sure where everyone

[22:59] else stands on it. I can still add it as an agenda item.

[23:04] All right, I think maybe we're all

[23:06] just being a little quiet, but why don't we just add that as an agenda item to discuss that

[23:11] more at length at another meeting.

[23:16] Okay.

[23:19] Okay, so moving on to the topic that has I think most

[23:23] people out here tonight, I just want to say a few words and I'll just say at our last meeting

[23:29] the commission consented to allow signs stating in part that Black Lives Matter. Since the decision,

[23:37] I'm sure we're all aware that we've received enormous feedback from the community. The two big takeaways

[23:44] for me are that we allowed signs of a political or let me another way of saying that is a non-governmental

[23:50] or segmented nature to be placed on taxpayer-funded property and that we did not give other members

[23:57] of the public an opportunity to weigh on an issue before we took action on such an item that was

[24:02] such interest to the community. We are living in a very polarizing period of time in our nation's

[24:09] right now. And a spotlight is being

[24:12] shined on the issues of systemic

[24:14] racism and social injustices. I should

[24:18] say injustices. Given this our city

[24:21] commission started the important work

[24:23] of putting together a diversity board

[24:25] to address how we as a community can

[24:28] do a better job of addressing these

[24:30] issues. My goal when we decided to

[24:33] move forward with this board remains

[24:34] the same, which is to make everyone in

[24:37] the city feel like they are an equal

[24:38] an important part of this community into explore ways to improve upon this. But I've never had any

[24:45] illusions that to make real change that it would require a sustained effort of engagement in our

[24:49] community. A wise person I recently spoke with described this as a thousand mile journey beginning

[24:57] with one step. I believe the first step of this journey is with our diversity board.

[25:04] Well, the intentions of those to put up signs in front of City Hall proclaiming by five matter was good.

[25:10] I think they're distracting us from our goals in the efforts of our diversity board.

[25:15] And it is time to reassess how we achieve this goal, which is why I'm proposing we not have our signs of non-governmental or non-segmented nature on city property.

[25:26] I propose that we replace the signs that are up on city property now with signs that

[25:33] have non-segmented unifying language, such as safety harbor stains united with the image

[25:42] on the program of the unity rally organized by Louis Ponds.

[25:48] Based on the feedback from the city attorney, I suggest that if we want to allow signs of

[25:53] non-governmental or non-segmented nature than we would be best advised without the policy to

[26:00] consider those signs in the future. I also propose we pass a resolution similar to the one

[26:06] that they need in past condemning racism in all of its forms to send a very clear message to the

[26:13] community on where this elected body stands on this topic. I believe this course of action will

[26:20] the United Community rather than divide it and get us closer to our goal of more inclusion

[26:25] in the city. To quote the great Dr. Martin Luther King, we have before us the glorious

[26:32] opportunity to inject a new dimension of love into the veins of our civilization. I think

[26:39] we have a great opportunity before us. At the end of the day, any action we take should serve

[26:44] to meet our goal of more diversity and awareness into the United Community, into heal any

[26:49] racial wounds that exist. With that said, I'm going to turn this over to I'm going to open this

[26:57] up to Carmen Lundy, who has been pivotable. I'm sorry, pivot home and establishing the diversity

[27:02] board and then go from there. So let me see what I have here.

[27:16] All right, Ms. Lundy, you're on.

[27:19] Am I clear?

[27:21] You're my clear?

[27:23] Yep.

[27:24] Okay.

[27:24] Carmen, I'm just 660.

[27:26] Elm Street.

[27:27] You know, I believe that it's not that everything is face can be changed, Mayor.

[27:32] You know, but nothing can be changed until it's faced.

[27:36] And we know that.

[27:38] I don't live with a medical disability blindness.

[27:40] I'm not wheelchair bound.

[27:42] I don't have any speech and pyramids.

[27:45] It's a kind of disabilities that were in the meat from a physical function.

[27:49] I'm not a part of a LGBTQ challenges, never had to get help from any imposed abuse,

[27:56] such as child abuse, spousal abuse, no mental health concerns, nor have I personally had

[28:02] to deal with anyone that encounter human trafficking sufferings, these type of things.

[28:08] But being an African American born in the late 50s, you know, having no choice about what

[28:15] color skin I've been born in but yet I am proud of who I am. I have experienced the affliction

[28:22] of racism starting right here in this wonderful city of safety harbor and the effects it really

[28:28] has had on me personally. I have children especially a black son who is personally encounter

[28:33] unnecessary force and what I call unfair justice and you know it's easy to say you know why don't

[28:41] matter to some people until you as a person who's had to deal with any of these struggles

[28:47] or any of those things that I've mentioned up above.

[28:50] Thank God for those who stand like women burning their bras, you know for what was right

[28:56] and for those who got beat, spit, water holes, dolls, what was right.

[29:02] And all these adversities mentioned, we all have some kind of a heartfelt concern of course,

[29:08] or strong emotions about some, some more than others.

[29:12] We're more concerned about.

[29:13] But the bottom line is one is no greater than the other.

[29:17] Not that I'm trying to warden his down

[29:18] of any importance or urgency of the need

[29:21] for our remedy for these issues,

[29:23] but again, I say nothing could be changed until it's faced.

[29:27] Now, with all his being said,

[29:29] I wanna deal with the one day,

[29:30] we all as men kinda guess I'm gonna put this out here.

[29:34] It's gonna read for every last one of us.

[29:36] A date born, then it's going to dash, and then it's going to say, a date we left this

[29:43] world, our lives ended.

[29:44] But the thing I'm concerned about is that little dash in the middle of those days, which

[29:49] to me is a definition of accountability for life lived.

[29:54] You know, accountability to what positive impact did we contribute, accountability to that

[29:58] But I treat a lot of people who don't know what I'm talking about, but I treat a lot of people who don't know what I'm talking about.

[30:00] I expect to be treated. And all these little things that these dash were consistent, the actions that we've had in our lives. Self-examination, hopefully not self-exterminating. And I can only give an account for myself, not for nobody else. This is not a black people, white people. It's about a right, and it's about a wrong. If I came and I lifted a sign and raised it because I want to make the awareness,

[30:28] and I put a sign that said, Manatee's lives matter,

[30:32] I don't even think we'll be here tonight,

[30:34] even though all special animals lives matter.

[30:38] But I know how we care about animals.

[30:40] So, Mayor, I respect your recommendation

[30:44] and this resolution that you've put before us

[30:48] and I'm going to tell you what I'm going to do.

[30:49] I don't know nobody else.

[30:51] I'm going to put on my big girl pants

[30:53] and I'm going to take the high roll

[30:54] and understanding that this issue we're addressing tonight is definitely bigger than a sign which is unfortunately brought out about this division.

[31:05] You know, yes, I agree with what you're coming from and this is why and hopes that replacing the sign if needed is the first step as you've mentioned and allowing this community to take that thousand mile journey to the sake of unity.

[31:19] So be it, because even when the sign has been changed, the purpose of healing should still

[31:26] remain our primary focus.

[31:29] You know, I pray what we do here in this community, pick our battles, and don't pick battles

[31:34] that is going to distract us from a community that we really supposed to be striving to achieve

[31:40] what we all should want is liberty and justice for all, not some but all.

[31:47] So with this being said, for I'm praying, I'm welcoming the spirit of unity and if that's what

[31:55] taking the sign down and putting a new sign up, then so be it unity. Yes, I pray for. Thank you.

[32:05] Well, thank you very much, Ms. Lindy. I'm going to turn this over to Lewis Pond right now and this

[32:14] here what he has to say. Louis, are you with us?

[32:22] Can you hear me?

[32:23] Yeah, we hear you.

[32:25] All right. God bless you, Carmen London.

[32:27] Appreciate those words, 100% mayor, commission.

[32:31] You know, we have over 400 years of undoing something wrong.

[32:35] And I believe the civil rights act was just signed

[32:38] in either 63 or 64.

[32:40] So we're barely 50 years into 50 plus.

[32:51] Amen. Do you hear Louis right now?

[32:53] I don't know if he's going to

[32:56] call.

[32:56] Wait, Lewis.

[33:00] Are we as he ought to work?

[33:04] Can you hear me?

[33:06] Can you hear me?

[33:07] Yes, I can hear you, guys.

[33:09] You're back.

[33:10] You said 400.

[33:12] All right.

[33:13] I was over 400 years on doing.

[33:15] Like I said, the civil rights

[33:16] actually just signed 63 64.

[33:19] And we're only 50 plus years into

[33:21] undoing this thing, but it's

[33:23] the late great Dick Gregory said who's next? So I guess it's Carmen, it's me and you. I need more

[33:31] active citizens willing to do more. Dick Gregory also said, and I quote this, every door of racial

[33:39] prejudice I can kick down is one less door that my child will have to kick down. I'm saddened by all the

[33:48] who plot of this design, I'm upset about the division.

[33:54] Anybody who knows me has always been about unity

[33:57] and I tried the same thing Carmen said.

[33:59] It's always been about unity.

[34:01] The greatest thing that this sign has created is dialogue.

[34:06] So now you guys all upset about this sign,

[34:10] but that same energy, I need you guys to take it

[34:13] and help me fix the problem.

[34:15] and the problem is just as simple as it says black lives matter we have to make

[34:22] black lives matter. That sign isn't going to make black lives matter. Hopefully the

[34:28] diversity advisory board starts bringing some of that traction in progress.

[34:35] Hopefully our mayor and commission board start implementing some things that we

[34:40] We can start doing locally, organically, to start pushing this.

[34:45] So I say, I say this to all of my residents of safety harbor.

[34:52] No name calling tonight.

[34:55] You know what?

[34:55] All you guys can say what you need to say and speak your mind and do it with dignity and

[35:00] respect.

[35:02] Everybody should be heard.

[35:03] and if taking this sign down and putting up a new one is the answer, which I 100%

[35:10] doubt, we have to accept that. But at the same time, speak with dignity tonight

[35:17] and respect all yours, ma'am. Thank you, Lewis, appreciate it. Anybody on the

[35:25] commission want to be heard? Do we want to open it up to the rest of the public?

[35:30] I have a I have a something to say I wrote a couple lines down because I'm not sure I can get through it otherwise so if I'm reading it, please understand obviously there's there's been a lot of discussion and emails since Monday and I want to just go through a few things that I'd like to bring up for discussion and and I'd also like, you know, the thoughts of those from the.

[35:58] of the black community as well.

[36:01] Although everyone seems in favor of this establishment

[36:04] of a diversity of committee that we put together,

[36:07] varying opinions have been expressed regarding

[36:09] this Black Lives Matter song.

[36:12] With the discussion primarily centered on the difference

[36:15] between Black Lives Matter, the idea,

[36:19] and Black Lives Matter, the LLC basically the organization.

[36:24] Yes, yes, Mr. Mars, Mr. Mars, okay, and so and and and what various people believe each stands for, okay, most of the emails that I read support what I think is irrefutable basic premise and phrase that black lives matter.

[36:45] Okay, but not the organization of the same name because some of the basic tenants of the founding members.

[36:51] and other things that have occurred obviously some of the recent protests unrest and things associated with it.

[36:59] So there's two camps there.

[37:02] And the issue at hand is that when you create an organization with this irrefutable basic premise, such as Black Lives Matter,

[37:10] or justice for all, as its name, it's really hard to disagree with the group without people

[37:19] thinking that you don't support the underlining idea, and that's very difficult.

[37:25] It's a tough and potentially divisive place to be in, and the only way to get past it,

[37:31] I think, is through education, through discussion, through dissemination, and ultimately the building

[37:38] of trust that comes from it. That seems to me something that the diversity committee should be

[37:44] tasked to do, in my opinion. However, if things get too divisive prior to that, then we risk the

[37:52] limiting the ability of the diversity committee to make the significant impact in our community

[37:58] that I believe it can, by limiting its participation or attractiveness for dedicated people to step up

[38:06] and join in what can be very complicated decisions,

[38:10] obviously, as what we've seen over this last week.

[38:14] So this week's discussion has been occurring

[38:16] and evolving citywide, and perhaps the city hall sign

[38:20] that we've been discussing should evolve as well

[38:23] to reflect some of these comments.

[38:26] And here's my question.

[38:28] And if I'm off base, and if I'm not insensitive enough

[38:32] for a missing the words, that's part of the diversity deal

[38:36] that we got to talk about, but would design have sufficient meaning if the word

[38:45] black was just replaced by African American, where it said African American

[38:51] lives matter and then perhaps underneath it says something like all lives matter

[38:58] or something like that. African American is a synonym for black depending

[39:05] anyone, how you read, maybe it is, maybe it isn't, I need to be educated. However, that potentially

[39:12] takes the sign that is basically, I think, important in stating to people and reaching out to people

[39:22] who feel disenfranchised and unwanted, that they are unwanted, that they are incorporated and included.

[39:29] But it potentially separates the African American lives matter from the black lives matter diversity and discussion, which is ongoing.

[39:40] I don't think that's good for the community, but I don't necessarily think it's good to stop and remove the whole sign or the issue because of it because obviously it's spurred on some discussions.

[39:51] I think positive steps forward are necessary, sometimes they're small and sometimes they're big, but I don't know if they have something that is offensive, if that is something which would be something that we would want to discuss.

[40:09] But when I read all the emails and I've talked to people, to me that sounds like something at least we should put on the table for discussion.

[40:17] All right, let me, I'm going to address, thank you Vice Mayor, let me address that you just said in your suggestion about all African American Lives Matter signs.

[40:27] So I spoke to our attorney before the meeting and was asking about legal ramifications that having different types of signs up on the property.

[40:36] And Nikki, please jump in any second if I go astray, but my takeaway from that discussion

[40:42] was if we allow a sign, and I originally referred to it as a political sign, but I'm going

[40:49] to remove the word political for just to keep things in the, using the language of Nikki,

[40:55] if we allow any sign that's of a segmented nature or of a non-governmental nature on city

[41:02] property, we opened the city property up as a public forum, and we would have to allow

[41:10] other segmented type signs on the property, and if we didn't, we would have a good risk

[41:17] of being sued for not having done that. The reason why I suggested a sign that says safety

[41:25] harbor united was it was important to put the word safety harbor in there. That indicates

[41:30] that it's a government sign. It's not a non-segmented sign. And it's a, it's sending a message of

[41:39] unity to the community. So if we wanted to go down the path, Nikki, jump in after I'm done. If we

[41:46] want to go down the path of allowing segmented signs on city property, might take away from the

[41:51] discussion with the city attorney was, we should have the policy in place that were, you know, it's

[41:57] about different categories of types of signs.

[41:59] Without that, we may get requests,

[42:02] and we've actually been already gotten requests

[42:04] for other segmented type signs.

[42:08] I mean, we can end up with a request

[42:09] for a Scientology sign on city property,

[42:13] and we would have a strong,

[42:17] there'd be a strong case to be made for allowing it,

[42:19] and if we didn't for getting sued.

[42:22] So Nikki, jump in if I said anything I shouldn't have said.

[42:25] I think it, well, this is, I would be happy to answer any questions that the commissioners

[42:32] have. After your last discussion, and I was maybe the one that was least informed on,

[42:40] you know, the mayor's lunch or where the prompt came from, I heard it as a request from

[42:47] the mayor with the consensus of the commission to put up a, you know, what I considered

[42:53] After the first discussion you all had to be government speech about the community recognition decision that you all made at your last meeting.

[43:04] Now in like commissioner mers said hearing about some of the other requests that have come in and the issue is if you are going to put up any kind of expressive signs upon request.

[43:19] then as the mayor indicated, then you may be creating an open forum where you need to be very careful about the policies that you employ to consider what can be displayed at the forum.

[43:36] and so as the mayor indicated if you put up a sign at the request of one group then you may

[43:44] need to put up a sign for anyone who requests it. That being said there are a number of different

[43:52] ways that policies regarding community recognition decisions have been developed and are really

[43:58] interesting especially with the commission's creation of the diversity advisory board that you created

[44:05] at your last meeting as part of the resolution you adopted, so there are a lot of different

[44:11] ways to go about developing those community recognition decisions in a way that is primarily

[44:18] focused on the goals and missions of the city as a whole, the benefit there to the general public,

[44:28] but mostly what you all want to advance as the official policies for inclusion and for

[44:38] a quality of the city can be importantly captured in those types of community recognition decision

[44:45] policies. So that's to take it kind of one step further Joe that is that that's kind of explains

[44:52] where our discussion based on the different types of forum that can be created.

[44:58] And traditionally you have not

[45:00] I put many signs outside of City Hall, and that is also why I interpreted your last direction to be that type of city-led community recognition decision. I did not take it to be geared at any political group. I think that was very clear from the discussion that that was not the commission's intent. But going back to what the mayor said, if the commission does not want to create this as an open forum, then absolutely I recommend you consider

[45:29] that are a written policy for that decision.

[45:33] I do not think that the mayor suggestion

[45:36] to have a sign about safety harbor United

[45:39] that equally sounds like it would be government speech

[45:42] geared toward that community recognition.

[45:45] So I didn't have an issue with that being displayed

[45:49] while you consider developing your written policy

[45:56] on how you may want to use that property moving forward.

[46:00] I hope that helps the commission's discussion this evening.

[46:04] Let me ask you this.

[46:06] Okay, right now there's a sign out there.

[46:08] Let's say you go through the Diversity Committee.

[46:11] And the Diversity Committee comes up and says,

[46:13] you know, we need a sign.

[46:16] Okay, and a sign is every month we put a sign out to represent

[46:20] some group just to show uniformity.

[46:22] And is there a difference between from a legal standpoint of putting the sign out there right now then having the sign that comes out from a committee recommendation and the same sign shows up and it's sitting there.

[46:37] Well, there is one major difference, which didn't exist at the beginning of your meeting yesterday, which does exist now, which is that the city now has an internal advisory body that it is created.

[46:51] to help it to make decisions as a city commission on what to do on these specific areas.

[47:02] So whether the recommendation that would come out of that committee is this action or

[47:09] another and then how the commission would consider that action is kind of, I can't say whether

[47:15] that would be the ultimate thing that the commission would do.

[47:18] But the difference is if it's a request or a initiative that starts from within the city and its own diversity advisory board as opposed to outside requests.

[47:31] For example, many community recognition decisions require that there are sorry many community recognition decision policies will not allow for any outside requests.

[47:43] So that's one important consideration that the commission would have to make.

[47:50] But it's really a better part.

[47:53] I think the mayor and various commissioners have discussed.

[47:57] Of a scheduled planned agenda item where you can have a memorandum on all these different items in front of you, you can explore how if you want to consider any third party request, how you might consider them.

[48:12] If you don't want to consider third party requests, if you only want to consider requests that stem from within the city or within the diversity advisory board, there's so many different ways that you can look at structuring this policy that I would suggest that you do that as part of a more thorough discussion.

[48:32] And I

[48:35] can see the differentiation, but I appreciate the discussion as the nuances of coming

[48:46] from a recommended internal city committee and coming from an outside.

[48:52] If that's what you, if that's the point that you're mentioning.

[48:56] Yes.

[48:59] Okay, that's it for me for now.

[49:02] Anyone else before I open it up?

[49:05] I guess Mrs. Day, I have a question about like the city of Dunedin.

[49:12] They have a, and I've always wanted something like this for the city's safety harbor, but

[49:16] they have a banner supporting the military right on Main Street.

[49:20] How, are you familiar with the city of Dunedin and the process of how they were able to come

[49:26] up with that banner?

[49:28] I mean, this is something that recognition thing, is that something that's required?

[49:37] I'm not familiar with the city of Dunedin's decision to place a military banner. I am familiar with the city of Largos inclusion and community recognition policy and I'd be happy to forward that to the city commission if you'd like.

[49:57] I'd

[50:00] be curious to see that.

[50:02] And that, for example, is how they go, how they went about the decision to raise the

[50:10] flag pride in June and certain other various decisions.

[50:14] I'd be happy to forward that to the commission.

[50:22] Well, Nikki, so in your opinion, you think this is this Black Lives Matter sign that we have

[50:30] at City Hall and the Library.

[50:31] or is it a political sign or is it a community recognition sign?

[50:38] I don't want to put you on a spot.

[50:40] You don't have to answer it if you're wrong.

[50:41] My understanding from the discussion was that the commission made it very clear

[50:46] it was not an intent to endorse any political organization.

[50:52] I think there have been some other authorities which have recognized that there is both a

[51:00] organization affiliated with that name, but a larger issue that it is intended to be commenting on. And I think that was very, very clear from the lengthy discussion that the commission gave that there was no intent to be to be endorsing any political organization or engaging in political speech.

[51:26] Thank you.

[51:26] Well, am I still on mute?

[51:28] And Carmen, we hear you.

[51:30] I just want to write quickly.

[51:33] I stand probably more than anybody of these 150 people

[51:37] you have on this line for the Black Lives Matter movement,

[51:41] sign purpose, all the above of what it stands for.

[51:44] But I do recognize an all wisdom.

[51:47] If you open it up for one, you open it up for all.

[51:50] And if you guys allow the Black Lives

[51:52] sign to stay there. Praise God. But then you turn around and you let clue club can. You let

[51:59] supremac. You let all these other people start putting their signs. You're opening up a

[52:03] candle worms. And I'm standing in front of everybody. Yes, I do believe in the black lives matter sign.

[52:10] But now this is going to become so political that we've been to go down that route and open it up

[52:15] for one. You open it for all. Then the next sign go up. If I don't like it, then you'll be hearing my

[52:21] I'm all for it.

[52:22] So you might want to think, what is fear?

[52:25] Thank you.

[52:27] Thank you.

[52:35] All right.

[52:36] Anyone else before we go to some more hands raised?

[52:45] Matt, how many, how many emails you have again, 27 now?

[52:53] Sorry, I was muted.

[52:54] I have 28 now.

[52:57] I, it's up to you mayor, but I would almost suggest

[53:00] you go to the hands raised only because I see

[53:04] some similar names and so if they speak then I will just forward you their email and I have to read

[53:11] their email. That makes sense rather than me read all these and then we have to tell people you

[53:16] can't talk because he just read an email from you. So yeah. You know I think it has some good

[53:21] discussion from the commission from Miss Miss Day, Carmen and Lewis and maybe that's changed some

[53:29] people's minds whether they want their email story. But let's do this we have a lot of let me see how

[53:33] many hands we have.

[53:38] Mayor, I did have one lady email me that she does not want her email read now because her her questions have been answered. So the other thing is you have 21 hands up some of those names of people that also send in an email. So I would then not read their emails and it will also give people time if they're listening to email me if they don't want me to read their email.

[54:00] Okay. What I'm going to do is given the amount of people and potential letters that we're going to ask, we're going to open it up. I'm going to ask everybody that wants to be heard to number one, please state your name and address for the record.

[54:12] And then two, we're going to limit everybody to two minutes given the amount of people that want to be heard in the possibility that other hands are raised.

[54:21] And I will very politely when there's, you know, 10 seconds left, I'm just going to raise my finger like this, which is your cue to wrap it up so we can move on to the next person.

[54:33] So, and again, I ask everyone to remember what Lewis said earlier that please be kind, please be civil to one another.

[54:40] And, you know, we'll go from there.

[54:43] So, all right. Melissa, you're on. You have two minutes.

[54:49] Hi, this is Melissa, I'm a 26-fistory south. I had an email so you don't have to read it now.

[54:57] What I was just trying to say is I believe that Black Lives Matter as a movement is a valid

[55:02] concern and we do need to certainly address it, but I do not support the organization Black Lives

[55:07] Inc. Our Black Lives Matter Inc. So I feel that with the current language that you guys have on the

[55:13] sign, I agree with Ms. Day, you're opening up yourself to a can of worms where if I want to put

[55:18] up a sign that says, blue lives matter, then that would have to be put up following your

[55:22] logic with allowing a black lives matter sign. So, I agree in support. May I use position

[55:28] to put up a safety harbor united? Sign that presents a standing together as a community.

[55:35] We've had a lot of divisiveness and name calling, bullying, and just nastiness that's been going

[55:40] on. And if we can put that aside, follow the golden rule, respect everyone, find common ground,

[55:46] and come together as a city and as a country, we can get this overcome and get everybody

[55:52] what they need so we're all equal. So that's all I want to say. I'm against the current

[55:56] sign language and I support what Mayor IU is suggesting and I also don't want to think

[56:01] I don't think that the government needs to put in itself into a position where it's going

[56:06] to open itself up to a lawsuit and your ultimate responsibility is our representatives is to

[56:11] remain neutral. So that's all and I hope we can find common ground and unity together. Thank you.

[56:17] Thank you, Melissa. Okay, let's go to

[56:24] seven number. Um, whoever's number is in 2823. You are now on.

[56:33] Are you there?

[56:35] Hello? Yes, we hear you.

[56:40] Uh yeah, my name is Michael Habit. I'm at 884th Street,

[56:44] itself and I'm calling to state my vehement opposition for the Black Lives Matter sign.

[56:53] I think the sign, like it's been mentioned before, the sign and the message, well, I'm

[56:59] necessary. It's certainly a political message, you know, the national organization. My

[57:06] opposition is due to the fact that I oppose the Marxist rhetoric that the national

[57:12] organization as spouses, people who have a short memory, they forget the five police officers

[57:18] that were murdered in Dallas with a chance of picking a blanket to pry him like bacon

[57:24] or what do we want dead cops when we want him now.

[57:27] So I think it's dangerous to support one segment of the society while we maybe alienate another.

[57:34] So I want to acknowledge the Miss Lundy I believe her name is and Mr. Ponds' decisions.

[57:40] We have to listen to our Black residents, and if they feel alienated, we have to, as the

[57:46] community, get their back, if you will, but we can't do it in alienated others.

[57:53] So my thought is, strap the Black Lives Matter sign.

[57:57] I really supported the sign that showed the Black and White class cans in the sign of racial

[58:02] unity and harmony.

[58:04] I supported that, and I would also support another sign that is more generic and kind of

[58:10] a safety hub or strong state card united,

[58:12] something that we've heard echoed.

[58:14] I just don't see something that pays

[58:16] a certain segment of society a nod while,

[58:20] like I said, alienate another,

[58:21] and I do not support any sort of

[58:23] radicalized political agenda

[58:25] and this slogan is now directly tied to that.

[58:28] So that's the only reason why I oppose the sign

[58:31] and has nothing to do with the underlying expression

[58:35] and intent of the sign,

[58:36] and I certainly want to work.

[58:38] I've been living the harbor since 1990, I'd point to school here since 1986.

[58:45] Michael?

[58:46] Sorry.

[58:47] We got it.

[58:48] We got it.

[58:48] Thank you.

[58:49] We got to move it on here.

[58:51] Thanks again.

[58:51] I appreciate it.

[58:52] Thank you again.

[59:01] Okay.

[59:01] Laura McCullough, please say your name and address to the record.

[59:06] My name is Laura McCullough.

[59:07] My address is 1858 Lake Cypress Drive Safety Harbor.

[59:11] And I would just like to say it was heartbreaking to listen to Lewis Ponds

[59:15] at the last meeting asked for, asked to be treated equally.

[59:19] Should he really, should any African-American person have to ask

[59:22] to be treated equally?

[59:24] Right now we have John Lewis lying in state at our Capitol

[59:27] and we are arguing over whether it is fair to put a Black Lives Matter sign

[59:32] that breaks my heart.

[59:34] The obvious safety harbor is obviously not a teeny-weeny little bit

[59:38] at all united in anything if you've seen the Facebook posts

[59:42] that are frightening, and you know you want to take a journey of a thousand steps, we have to take the first one, and you already want to go backwards. Let's not go backwards. Let's move forward.

[59:54] We have to have awkward difficult conversations. I don't know the answers to this. I don't know how to...

[1:00:07] I would like to encourage you to have a diversity board in place within 30 days and not drag it out.

[1:00:17] And the inspector general of the United States, which is federal, has said that black lives matter is not a political sign and he said all federal employees are allowed to wear any black lives matter.

[1:00:29] or T-shirts, or hats, or signs, or whatever they want to do.

[1:00:33] I would have no problem if you put up a KKK sign.

[1:00:36] I don't believe in the KKK, certainly.

[1:00:38] But if you want to put it on City Hall,

[1:00:39] I can walk right past it and not be bothered by it.

[1:00:43] Because, you know, this is ridiculous.

[1:00:45] And from what I understand, Attorney Nikki Day

[1:00:47] said that it's okay to, the commission decides who puts it up.

[1:00:52] It's okay if they want to decide to put up all the signs.

[1:00:56] This is heartbreaking.

[1:00:56] I don't want my grandchildren growing up in this mess.

[1:01:00] We need to do something positive, thank you.

[1:01:05] Okay, next up we have Carol McNamey.

[1:01:09] That's a meter.

[1:01:14] Carol?

[1:01:15] Yes, can you hear me?

[1:01:17] Yeah, can you say your name and address?

[1:01:18] And...

[1:01:19] Yes.

[1:01:20] My name is Carol McNamey.

[1:01:22] I live at 222 12th Avenue, South.

[1:01:25] And I would refer everybody to an op-eds

[1:01:29] that I wrote in the safety harbor sun in which I said some of the things that Larger said

[1:01:35] specifically, I was pointing out the fact that this is not a political issue. If it were,

[1:01:42] it would not be the case that the inspector general of the US said it is not. The other issue

[1:01:49] I want to speak to is the organization Black Lives Matter. There's so much misunderstanding

[1:01:55] and so much wrong information.

[1:01:58] Yes, the founders were educated in Marxism.

[1:02:04] I have an undergraduate degree in philosophy,

[1:02:07] and I studied Marxism.

[1:02:08] What does that mean?

[1:02:09] Does that have something to do with the price of AIDS?

[1:02:12] I doubt it.

[1:02:13] The issue is if you look all over this world,

[1:02:17] you will see hundreds of thousands of people marching.

[1:02:21] And why are they marching?

[1:02:22] This is grown beyond those founders and I've sent you articles about that, even the Tampa Bay Times has said,

[1:02:31] address this Marxist issue.

[1:02:33] The fact of the matter is, there is oppression of people, including poor white people around the world,

[1:02:40] and people are tired of being oppressed.

[1:02:43] And that's why they're marching.

[1:02:45] And Black Lives Matter just happened to be the one used because it was a Black man, George Floyd,

[1:02:51] who was who was who has become the symbol for all that is wrong and but I am one

[1:02:58] of the people who helped put the signs up there. I whatever Mr. Ponds and

[1:03:05] this Monday what to say I will go with it. Despite the fact that I I agree with

[1:03:12] the sign? That's my thing.

[1:03:17] Thank you very much.

[1:03:21] Mary Paul, can you sit your name and address

[1:03:23] and you have three minutes? Thank you. My name is Mary Paul and I live at eight Harbor Point

[1:03:29] Play Safety Harbor, Florida. I'm a 73-year-old woman who's lived here for 25 years. I'm a mother,

[1:03:35] a grandmother, and a college professor of communication at USF. And it breaks my heart that in the year

[1:03:41] 2020 we're having this discussion and it breaks my heart that I hear people like

[1:03:45] Common Mundi and Lewis Ponds have to say oh well concede we'll be the ones to

[1:03:50] give. Why do they have to be the ones to give in? This city like cities around

[1:03:56] the country and around the world can put out a sign that says Black Lives Matter

[1:04:00] and they can keep it up because it's the right thing to do. It's the right moment in

[1:04:04] time to do it. This sign simply says that in a world where Black Lives haven't

[1:04:09] always mattered and still today often don't that we infirm in our city safety harbor the black lives

[1:04:16] matter. Our mayor wants to backtrack due to pressure from some of his contributors and supporters.

[1:04:22] He says the sign is divisive and then it's just a sign and it doesn't solve the issue of systemic

[1:04:27] and institutionalized racism. My answer to that is it's not the sign that's divisive, it's the racism

[1:04:34] on the device. Why does anybody have a problem saying black lives matter? And interesting how

[1:04:40] signs don't mean anything now, but they meant something when I grew up as a child in Atlanta

[1:04:44] and it said, for whites only, and no color to allow, those signs meant something didn't I.

[1:04:50] And they clearly meant something in the mayoral election when Joe IU and others had their signs

[1:04:55] all over town. As a professor of communication, language starts, change starts with communication,

[1:05:02] and idea goes to words, sign says the word. Black lives matter is a statement that in a world where black lives have it mattered, that we recognize that they do matter.

[1:05:13] Mayor Yudh says it makes people uncomfortable. What people? Race? Let them be uncomfortable. Let the white privilege of our community feel the discomfort of their racism.

[1:05:23] of the black folks of our community have thought of for a long time and they felt more than

[1:05:27] discomfort.

[1:05:28] They felt exclusion, they thought about economic deprotation, do the right thing, stand strong

[1:05:34] and keep the signs up.

[1:05:38] Okay.

[1:05:39] We're going to move on to the next person.

[1:05:43] I don't have a name, but it's a phone number ending with 0285, can you hear us?

[1:05:51] I can.

[1:05:51] My name is Brad Rutherford, the eight-villacore.

[1:05:56] Just listening to some of this, you guys have covered a lot of the points that I wanted

[1:06:01] to make.

[1:06:02] Obviously, none of us have a problem with the statement.

[1:06:06] Black Lives Matter.

[1:06:06] Nobody disagrees with that.

[1:06:08] It's the organization, the hatred that they have, not every person that follows Black Lives

[1:06:14] Matter, supports BLM, feels that way.

[1:06:17] But they all, but the organization itself might ask it, some of the states, some of their

[1:06:23] chance that they do during marches, the violence that's ensued from it. I can't stand for that.

[1:06:31] That's not who we are as a city. It's not who we are as a country. We're not Marxist.

[1:06:37] You know, that's insanity. And do we call the racist because I don't agree with an organization's

[1:06:43] ideology. I mean, that's insanity too. I mean, I should have the ability to voice my opinion

[1:06:49] without being shouted down as a racist in my own city. You know, I'm all for the class

[1:06:56] pans design. I would even encourage the city to make that permanent monument to our city

[1:07:04] and the progress we've made. There's still work to be done, sure, but you know, I think we've

[1:07:09] come a long way as a country and as a city,

[1:07:11] our community's pretty nice for people.

[1:07:14] So there's no need for political statements though.

[1:07:18] And for those that say that this is not a political move,

[1:07:20] political organization, 100% of their donations

[1:07:23] go to act blue and to Democrat candidates.

[1:07:26] So that kind of shoots that down.

[1:07:28] So that's all I have to say.

[1:07:29] Thank you.

[1:07:30] Thank you very much.

[1:07:35] Next up, we have Tony Vidavik.

[1:07:37] Please say your name and address you have two minutes.

[1:07:44] First of all, I just want to say that I stand with everything that Mary Poole says.

[1:07:48] She's amazing. Also, hiding this meeting between an audit and a budgetary meeting is shameful.

[1:07:54] The mayor is asking commission to take down the Black Lives Matter signs,

[1:07:58] saying that they are political nature. Black Lives Matter is not a political organization.

[1:08:03] It is been determined to be a human rights group.

[1:08:06] saying that it is political is weak and accurate distraction and it is cowardly.

[1:08:12] It is lacking the convictions to stand for values that we all believe in, equality.

[1:08:18] We are all upset about the division. Now is a time for conversation, learning, and self-reflection.

[1:08:26] We deserve leadership was willing to do the right thing even at the cost of a few votes here.

[1:08:31] That is what we elect you for.

[1:08:33] There are racial injustices happening in our town,

[1:08:36] and we cannot deny or ignore it.

[1:08:39] We have to stand together as one united voice.

[1:08:42] If we ignore it, we are part of the problem,

[1:08:44] not the solution.

[1:08:46] Here in Safety Harbor, Black Lives Matter.

[1:08:48] We, the residents of Safety Harbor,

[1:08:49] support all members of the community

[1:08:51] and want to show support and justice for all.

[1:08:54] I created a petition on Change.org asking to stay

[1:08:57] with the Black community and asking the city commissioners

[1:09:00] to keep up the Black Lives Matter signs,

[1:09:02] and it has over 300 signatures so far.

[1:09:05] The city is defaulted to Clearwater on the petition,

[1:09:08] so we corrected some of the addresses,

[1:09:11] just letting you know.

[1:09:12] I emailed you all a copy of the petition.

[1:09:16] I, as a resident safety harbor,

[1:09:17] would like to see our city as a small,

[1:09:19] but important first step, not the only step,

[1:09:22] display two Black Lives Matter signs.

[1:09:24] Justice for all, as a symbol of solidarity against racism.

[1:09:30] The last commission meeting in the city unanimously decided to display these signs for 60 days outside the city hall.

[1:09:38] Well, and also I want to say that the diversity board is needed right away and it should be made up of all people of color and also.

[1:09:46] We need also an LVT.

[1:09:49] All right, thank you.

[1:09:50] We're going to move on to Liz Conkel.

[1:09:54] Liz, are you there? If you sit your name and address, you have two minutes.

[1:09:58] Good evening, City Commission.

[1:10:00] Listen, we're conical, thirty-ten,

[1:10:02] Incher, Terrace Safety Harbor.

[1:10:04] I spent the afternoon watching John Lewis

[1:10:08] and his coffin being brought to Washington, D.C.,

[1:10:14] and listened to the speeches,

[1:10:16] and listened to the music that was outstanding.

[1:10:19] And the one thing that I took away from it was

[1:10:22] John Lewis's quote, when you see something

[1:10:24] that's not right, not fair, not just.

[1:10:26] You have to speak up. You have to say something and you have to do something.

[1:10:31] I applaud the city for starting this conversation.

[1:10:35] I did come away from the last meeting, not believing a black lives matter sign was going to go in front of the city hall,

[1:10:42] but that the safety harbor stands united or something to that effect was going to be the language.

[1:10:48] Everybody right now, liberals, conservatives, black, white, male, female.

[1:10:54] Well, everybody is so focused on the words Black Lives Matter and that organization that

[1:10:59] we're missing the whole point of the conversation, all right?

[1:11:03] The diversity council is going to be fantastic once we get up and running, but we can't stop

[1:11:09] ourselves because of the words Black Lives Matter if it's going to cause such an issue

[1:11:16] in this town.

[1:11:17] So I would say that I would agree with the signage that the safety harbor stands united that Carmen talked about that Lewis talked about and justice for all, you know, and then after the 60 days is up, what do we do?

[1:11:33] What are the next steps and we in our family are right behind this diversity council and we'll do anything that we can to help.

[1:11:41] Okay, but I really, really believe that we can't get caught up in something that is so divisive. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

[1:11:49] Thank you. I appreciate that.

[1:11:52] Okay, next we're going to go to Sarah Robinson. Sarah, are you there?

[1:12:03] Yes, Sarah Robinson 38 Harbor Oak Circle.

[1:12:07] And these words are in memory and in honor of the late great Congressman John Lewis.

[1:12:11] us. First I want to begin by thanking the four commissioners who voted to take a small

[1:12:17] but significant symbolic act to express the recognition that black lives matter. You are

[1:12:25] on the right side of history. It's an ugly truth that the city of safety harbor has a

[1:12:32] history of racism as do many places especially in the south. I have lived in Northern Pinellas

[1:12:38] county for 40 years, 26 of them in safety harbor. I remember hearing about the Ku

[1:12:45] Clarks clan having a local presence, and then of course there's the ubiquitous

[1:12:49] Confederate battle flags. While we cannot write the wrongs of the past, we can resolve

[1:12:55] to move forward with acknowledgment that changes need to be made. So when I heard

[1:13:00] that all but one of you have your hearts in the right place, I felt good about

[1:13:05] the city for the first time in a while given the recent division. It's one thing to disagree on

[1:13:11] issues like building codes, development, tree ordinances. But this, this is a matter of the heart,

[1:13:21] of integrity, of love. To those of you white people who somehow are bothered by the city displaying

[1:13:28] the sign, I ask you to walk a mile in the shoes of our black brothers and sisters. I ask you

[1:13:36] to look into your hearts and ask yourself what lies within them. I ask you to study history.

[1:13:43] I ask you what kind of a city do you really want to live in? We have a majority white town which is

[1:13:50] all the more reason we should display this and we are also a tourist destination and we have a

[1:13:56] culturally and ethnically diverse group of visitors. If you vote to remove, what kind of message

[1:14:03] is that going to send to the world? Do you want to be Hicksville? Or do you want to be an opening,

[1:14:10] welcoming, enlightened, and loving community? Thank you. And Black Lives Matter.

[1:14:21] Wayne, are you there? Sit your name and address it. You got two minutes.

[1:14:53] I moved here to safety harbor about four years ago, and I wasn't sure if that was the correct

[1:15:00] I'm going to move, but since then I've become a member of this law, exercise in the morning, walk, on light of the COVID thing. And what's nice about safety harbor and I've fallen in love with his back is I can walk down the street, deeply from all over the world as the speaker before just talked about. You can walk by and say, hello, and they respond with a hello that applies to people with color that applies to people from all over the world. So if there's a problem here in safety harbor,

[1:15:29] I have not seen it. I see people at the coffee shop of color and wave to them. They wave to me. They say hello

[1:15:37] That's all on an amical basis to say that this is a political

[1:15:40] Or devices. I think it's totally wrong. You can sell by the

[1:15:45] Different comment from the people that we've heard

[1:15:49] What Nikki day had to say about the problems with having to raise other signs

[1:15:55] Do present a problem?

[1:15:57] You could change it around to say all arrives matter or other situations, but I don't think we want to get into a political situation.

[1:16:06] What the strike effect that people are saying is not clear.

[1:16:09] Yes, just listening.

[1:16:11] Thank you.

[1:16:15] All right, thank you.

[1:16:15] We get somebody in the audience that we can hear.

[1:16:19] Or maybe you wanted to panelist.

[1:16:21] Just everybody just maybe check your phone.

[1:16:24] that was all the last caller. I was checking and everyone was muted except for you and him. Okay.

[1:16:34] Okay. Heather, are you there?

[1:16:43] Right. Name an address. You got two minutes.

[1:16:45] So, my name is Heather Heldic. I live at 333 Bailey Street. I have been writing speeches since this happened. It has just made me absolutely crazy. And I'm not reading a single one of them.

[1:16:58] The first couple of speeches made me so proud to be a safe year of a resident and that's

[1:17:03] what I live every day.

[1:17:05] I run in the bay with my dog, I go all over town and then a couple of speeches came in

[1:17:12] and just broke my heart.

[1:17:13] History has passed and it was awful but we learned from it and we moved on.

[1:17:20] This organization is political, plain and simple.

[1:17:24] It has no place on our private property, private property, place whatever sign you want.

[1:17:32] By all means, it what makes safety harbor wonderful.

[1:17:35] Oh my goodness, we all are artsy creative.

[1:17:38] Do whatever you want on your property.

[1:17:40] But the city hall just needs to be the city hall.

[1:17:43] Welcome the safety harbor.

[1:17:45] And my heart broke when people said that they weren't welcomed.

[1:17:49] I used to have a restaurant in town.

[1:17:51] and oh my goodness did I not welcome everybody and I would love to do that again and if anybody does

[1:17:58] not feel welcome please contact me and I would love to be on the diversity board. I'm a positive

[1:18:04] thinker. I think everybody goes into something with good intentions. I don't think we do stuff with

[1:18:08] that intention. So I want to think that the people that put up these signs had the most wonderful

[1:18:13] intentions of welcoming the black community to downtown, but I think a sign honestly is virtue

[1:18:19] signaling, and we can do more than that. We're safety harbor. So let's come up with our own movement.

[1:18:26] Let's come up with our own cause. Let's work together. Let's just stop being mean. You guys are

[1:18:30] nasty on social media, man. Just stop. Please, please, please. So thank you guys for listening,

[1:18:37] and again, I appreciate you commissioners as well, and I appreciate everyone for trying. So let's just

[1:18:43] and that's not a good night, good night, cheers.

[1:18:46] Thank you.

[1:18:48] Next we have Johnston, are you there?

[1:18:54] We are here.

[1:18:56] I'm sorry, Dan and Paula.

[1:18:58] Dan and Paula, Johnston, 10, 15, Konant Avenue.

[1:19:02] We've been here about four years

[1:19:05] and racism is alive and well in safety harbor.

[1:19:10] The first real reaction we had to that

[1:19:12] But when we were looking for a house here four years ago, we found a house on MLS that

[1:19:18] our Realtor hadn't told us about, and I called him up and said, hey, this house looks like

[1:19:23] exactly what we're looking for, and his common was you don't want to live there.

[1:19:28] So that was our introduction to the south.

[1:19:32] We strongly support the signs, but having listened to the previous speakers, Carmen, we'd like

[1:19:40] to take you out for a beer sometime, but we are, if, if Carmen, if you and your group feel that

[1:19:47] we need to kind of back off on this, we're with you, but there is just a heck of a lot of racism

[1:19:54] in this town and I, I asked the people who are listening in on this call, if you're really, really,

[1:20:00] really having a heartburn over this sign, look into your heart because something's not right.

[1:20:06] and that's the end. Thank you. I love everybody. Bye-bye.

[1:20:11] Let me see.

[1:20:14] Next we have Megan Poole-Van.

[1:20:18] Something. Megan, are you there?

[1:20:21] It's Poole-Van Swal. Yes, I'm here.

[1:20:23] And I'm at eight Harbor Point Place.

[1:20:26] I just want to say,

[1:20:27] everyone wants to talk about the message this and that.

[1:20:29] And the bottom line, we live in an area that was one of the last

[1:20:34] to be desegregated in the cell.

[1:20:37] Our educational system was not fully desegregated

[1:20:39] until 1972.

[1:20:43] And now, because some people got all excited,

[1:20:48] we're gonna back up.

[1:20:49] So what is it gonna say when we as a community

[1:20:51] take out these signs?

[1:20:54] When we say, you know what, this isn't worth it to us.

[1:20:58] What does that say about your character?

[1:21:02] When just this one very simple thing, one tiny gesture to say you know what I'm going

[1:21:10] to look outside my own privilege and see that because I'll tell you I'm disabled.

[1:21:17] And the moment I saw a model with a mobility aid and target, I cried because I felt

[1:21:23] scene. And I'm queer. And the moment I saw a pride flag, I felt seen. And there's so many people

[1:21:33] that have to hide. And right now, the only thing you're letting go is you're letting the racist.

[1:21:39] And yes, if you have a problem with the Black Lives Matter sign, you have a problem with racism.

[1:21:47] look inside your heart and really investigate your own bias. Because this, this is not, this is not, this is not just something simple. When you take away that sign, what are you saying when we take it away?

[1:22:06] Think about that.

[1:22:09] And thank you.

[1:22:11] Thank you. Just a reminder, everyone, please be civil, and let's refrain from name calling,

[1:22:19] moving over to Robin Harris.

[1:22:25] Robin, are you there?

[1:22:31] Oh, no, we're going to go to James Shaw,

[1:22:33] actually. James, are you there? I am, Mayor. Thank you so much. James Shaw, 23-20, messenger circle.

[1:22:39] You know, I just think being on the right side of history requires some courage. It requires

[1:22:45] leadership and requires you to do the right thing even when it might seem unpopular.

[1:22:51] The Black Lives Matter science should stay because I think we need to tell people the Black Lives

[1:22:56] Matter and Safety Harbor for more than a week. And what is the message that you send by choosing to

[1:23:01] take it down? And so with that said, I'd like to offer this and that's to remember that our perception

[1:23:08] of Black Lives Matter lives in our reality and our reality is based on our perspective and we all have

[1:23:13] our own perspective. We have our own ideas. We have our own accumulation of thoughts and beliefs,

[1:23:19] and attitudes, and experiences, and we put all those things together. It creates our reality.

[1:23:26] And yet if we change our beliefs, if we change our attitudes, if we change our perceptions,

[1:23:32] we can change our reality. And I'm asking some of you to be willing to do that today.

[1:23:37] I recognize that we don't all think the same. That's totally fine. And that your reality is based

[1:23:42] under experiences in the past, just as this for mine, and yet it's time for us to remove judgment,

[1:23:49] get out of a fixed mindset, and instead be curious. Be curious about other people's experiences,

[1:23:57] be curious about what's happening in others' lives, and when you do that, you open yourself up to

[1:24:02] learn and grow and get better. Mayor and commission, I'd ask that you leave the sign up to show this

[1:24:08] community that we do believe that Black Lives Matter. Thank you so much.

[1:24:13] Okay. Okay, we're going to go to Robin Harris.

[1:24:21] Robin, are you there?

[1:24:24] Yes, I'm sorry I was muted. Are you good? Hello, can you hear me? Yeah, we hear you.

[1:24:29] Yeah, 3604 Springland Drive. I visited safety harbor.

[1:24:36] Some years ago because my cousin had married a professional baseball player.

[1:24:40] I thought that safety harbor was one of the most beautiful places in Florida.

[1:24:46] However, tonight I am disheartened at the hypocrisy that I'm hearing on the phone,

[1:24:52] that 2020, there's an issue with a sign.

[1:24:56] And I just want to clarify even more about Black Lives Matter was simply a hashtag in response

[1:25:03] that a black woman wrote on social media in reference to the acquittal of

[1:25:09] George Zimmerman after Trayvon Martin was murdered and then it became

[1:25:13] organization. Everyone that says Black Lives Matter is not part of the

[1:25:17] organization so please stop using that as an excuse to advance the moment to

[1:25:23] advance the principle. That's it's a principle and what I see on this phone tonight

[1:25:29] is that Black Lives, the reason why Black Lives Matter isn't

[1:25:34] mattering in safety harbours because the black, the black of

[1:25:37] black power. Black power was an issue back in the 60s of

[1:25:40] Hell when people chanted that. But I see an all-white

[1:25:43] commission, and you guys are consulting with each other about a

[1:25:47] black struggle that you cannot interpret. I feel my heart goes

[1:25:51] out to Mr. Ponds and Ms. Carmen because they are outnumbered and

[1:25:56] and you cannot properly interpret a struggle

[1:25:58] that you've never had the pleasure

[1:26:02] or the words to walk in.

[1:26:04] You haven't walked in our shoes.

[1:26:06] Black Lives Matter is a principle.

[1:26:08] And we're like about what approximately three months

[1:26:10] after the death of George Floyd,

[1:26:12] nationwide, global wide,

[1:26:14] we see Black Lives Matter all over the world.

[1:26:17] And you mean to tell me that safety harbor

[1:26:19] is gonna divide itself because of a sign,

[1:26:22] because of a statement, because of a principle,

[1:26:25] So the overreach and the words that are being used tonight is just so you want you want us to say things that make white people feel comfortable.

[1:26:34] You want to sign that will make you not feel so guilty or not make you feel so racist and we can't do that.

[1:26:40] If you plan to advance, you're going to have to face it.

[1:26:44] Please contact me, Mr. Ponds.

[1:26:47] Over.

[1:26:48] Thank you very much.

[1:26:50] Okay.

[1:26:51] On to the next person, phone numbering in 5093.

[1:26:59] I'm not sure your name, but are you there?

[1:27:02] Yes, that's my husband's number.

[1:27:06] I was on also.

[1:27:09] Just your name and address.

[1:27:10] And I, my name is Rosaliboutin at 1016 Main Street.

[1:27:16] We feel that the name Black Lives Matter

[1:27:20] does represent a political group.

[1:27:24] Our nephew will be released from the hospital tomorrow

[1:27:27] after being beaten with a pipe.

[1:27:30] Through his police vest,

[1:27:32] it would have killed him if he'd not had that vest on.

[1:27:35] So for us, this is a very strong statement

[1:27:40] given by this city that we pay taxes to and that we haven't

[1:27:44] enjoyed. For us, it is a slap in a face of a young officer that all he

[1:27:52] wanted to do was to protect this community. And I do think the

[1:27:57] sign is divisive. And I do support Black rights in this country

[1:28:03] and always hands. But I cannot support this group. And I hope that

[1:28:09] you will take it down. And if not, I would like to be able to add other signs to the area down there

[1:28:17] and I would appreciate information on how to do that. I thank you for your consideration.

[1:28:25] I have thought some of the speakers were wonderful. I would like to speak to Carmen. I think that was

[1:28:31] her name, the first speaker. I think she and I just come to agreement on this. It is very painful

[1:28:37] for those who have been damaged by this organization.

[1:28:42] Thank you very much.

[1:28:44] Thank you very much.

[1:28:48] All right, so we're going to Brigh.

[1:28:51] Brigh, are you there?

[1:29:02] Brigh, you may have your phone muted.

[1:29:14] We're going to try to come back to Brigh.

[1:29:16] We're going to Katie Turner.

[1:29:18] Katie, are you there?

[1:29:23] Can you hear me now, Mayor?

[1:29:25] Yeah, we hear you.

[1:29:27] Hi, my name is Katie.

[1:29:28] Hardgrave Turner. I reside at 2542 Loweberg Court in Safety Harbor. Thank you Mayor and Council

[1:29:37] for letting me speak this evening. My family moved to Safety Harbor about 50 years ago,

[1:29:44] and I grew up on an 11 acre farm on 7th Street North, which is now the Greek side subdivision.

[1:29:50] My childhood friends at both Safety Harbor were actually at Safety Harbor Elementary,

[1:29:54] safety harbor middle school and

[1:29:56] country side were a wide array of

[1:29:58] religious

[1:30:00] Let's see how economic and racial backgrounds. Over the past 50 years, safety harbor has prospered in its diversity. As a former assistant state attorney, I take great exceptions to the posting of the political Black Lives Matter sign on City Hall property. On May 30, 2020, the Black Lives Matter movement made the hashtag, defund the police part of their national platform.

[1:30:25] Throughout my career, I have been honored to work alongside amazing,

[1:30:30] courageously brave public servants. To this day, I am blessed to call many in law enforcement,

[1:30:36] my friends, and in some instances, even my family. For the past few months, I have witnessed

[1:30:42] a horrific shift of personal and physical attacks on our country's law enforcement, spurred by

[1:30:48] the Black Lives Matter political movement. If individuals wish to support any political

[1:30:54] organization, they have the blessed freedom to do so, but without the specific backing of our

[1:31:00] wonderful city. By placing that political slogan on city hall grounds, the city is giving

[1:31:07] credence to a specific political movement, one that is not unifying. Law in order is

[1:31:14] tantamount to the success of our beloved safety harbor, and my heart broke for that previous speaker.

[1:31:21] I've read that the basic premise for this petition and this sign was to make people of color feel welcome in our community.

[1:31:28] Therefore, why does the posting of just a simple move?

[1:31:32] Yes.

[1:31:33] Sorry, yeah, we're over two minutes.

[1:31:35] Okay, okay.

[1:31:36] Thank you.

[1:31:37] I just wanted just the opportunity to just to finally say I would respectfully ask that the city of safety harbor remove the political signs of the city hall grounds and allow safety harbor to be welcoming to all people in safety harbor.

[1:31:50] Okay. We're moving on. We're going to try Amy Brands. Amy, are you there?

[1:32:03] Do you hear

[1:32:03] me now? We hear you. Okay. Hi. This is Amy Brand, 380 North Bay Shore Boulevard. As you

[1:32:10] well know, that's a mile south of you, but my life is spent in safety harbor. My whole

[1:32:16] life is spent there. I would like to speak in favor of keeping the signs up. City

[1:32:22] Many resolutions are not made in the arena of Facebook grants, but by the rational, clear

[1:32:27] thinking, decision-making protocols of the City Commission.

[1:32:32] The main issue at hand appears to be a misunderstanding as to the concept of Black Lives Matter.

[1:32:38] It is not a political concept, but a moral, social justice matter.

[1:32:44] Any rhetoric to the contrary dilutes the history and present moment manifestation of systemic

[1:32:51] racism. Rather than backtrack and remove the signs, I invite you to look upon

[1:32:56] this as a teaching moment to educate people as to the true meaning of the

[1:33:02] concept of Black Lives Matter and its impact on the citizens of safety harbor.

[1:33:08] Thank you for listening.

[1:33:13] Okay, thank you very much. We're gonna try, we're gonna try to break again.

[1:33:19] Greg, are you there?

[1:33:25] Greg, are you there?

[1:33:30] Greg, it's showing you're active.

[1:33:32] I'm sorry.

[1:33:40] Greg, you need to unmute your phone if you can hear me.

[1:33:45] Okay, we're going to move on.

[1:33:49] Barbara, think we'll see you're right there.

[1:33:54] Mayor, if I could jump in real quick.

[1:33:56] We've gotten a couple of emails of people that have called in.

[1:34:00] If you've called in and you'd like to raise your hand,

[1:34:02] please press star nine.

[1:34:04] So if you called in and liked to raise your hand, please press star 9.

[1:34:09] If we get to it in a minute, I do have one person that I see his phone number who was

[1:34:14] emailed to ask to speak so we'll get to that when we're done with these hands.

[1:34:22] Barbara, are you there?

[1:34:23] Yes, I'm here.

[1:34:25] I'm Barbara Finkelstein.

[1:34:26] I live at 408 Marshall Street in safety, Barbara.

[1:34:31] Thank you for the listening tonight.

[1:34:33] My friend Amy Bryant truly speaks my mind, but I feel like I need to add a little more.

[1:34:41] I want you to count me in on the hard conversations about racism in ourselves and in our town.

[1:34:48] We have a long way to go.

[1:34:50] I am so impressed with the commissioner's decision last Monday night to take this first step.

[1:34:57] Just in case there's not a written record about this sign, I want to describe it.

[1:35:03] We're talking about a rectangular white plastic sign on thin metal supports that are pressed into the ground.

[1:35:11] There's a border of children's faces, all colors and shades of skin, all kinds of hairstyles and colors and smiles, lots and lots of smiles.

[1:35:22] The words across the top says black lives matter in the middle and the center are the words from our pledge of allegiance with justice for all justice is printed in big purple letters.

[1:35:36] Yesterday I took a photo of it with that green lawn and city hall.

[1:35:41] show up in the background. I wish I could send this photograph around the world so that

[1:35:48] for at least one week and hopefully more this spirit will be displayed and honored. It matters

[1:35:58] so much. Thank you. Okay,

[1:36:05] we're going to somebody with a galaxy S9. Do you know who you are?

[1:36:11] All right, just unmuted you.

[1:36:17] If you're calling in from a Galaxy S9,

[1:36:21] you need to unmute your phone.

[1:36:22] Your phone is on mute.

[1:36:26] Hello.

[1:36:28] We hear you.

[1:36:28] Name it as this.

[1:36:30] Nick Allen, I'd like to leave my address on an ounce.

[1:36:34] Thank you.

[1:36:37] Nobody can say that three words, black lives matter.

[1:36:40] Nobody can say that black lives or African-American lives

[1:36:45] don't matter.

[1:36:45] From my standpoint, you know, I love everybody and I'll shake anybody's hand, I don't,

[1:36:50] it doesn't matter to me.

[1:36:52] The problem is with everybody, I would assume maybe mutually, is that the organization

[1:36:59] has gotten a bad rep from my opinion and my standpoint because of Antifa, this anti-fascist

[1:37:07] group that has intervened has disgraced and taken away from the movement of Black Lives

[1:37:15] matter and has given them a bad wrap to where people have this taste for the organization

[1:37:21] that is that they don't want anything affiliation with them.

[1:37:26] There's been tons of media coverage that, you know, every time there's a black lives

[1:37:31] matter protest that may be peaceful, you have these antifa people getting involved and just

[1:37:40] ruining it.

[1:37:41] So, keep the sign, don't keep the sign, whatever you want.

[1:37:47] Maybe we can find a resolution to where safety harbor can stand united and acceptable for anybody.

[1:37:55] Black, white, Asian, Irish, British, Australian, Canadian.

[1:38:01] I don't care where you come from or what you do.

[1:38:04] As long as you're a good person.

[1:38:07] something. Yes, there has to be a resolution of something. I can go on and on. I know I

[1:38:13] got two minutes. I just feel that the Black Lives Matter organization, good or bad. However

[1:38:19] you want to view them has gotten a bad rat from this antifa issue. So you guys are up to

[1:38:28] make the decision. Thank you.

[1:38:30] Yeah.

[1:38:32] Okay, we're going to go to

[1:38:34] Kerry Kent. Terry, are you there?

[1:38:40] I'm here.

[1:38:41] My name is Kerry Kent.

[1:38:43] I'm at 3498 Enterprise Road East.

[1:38:47] And I zoomed in to express my support

[1:38:49] for displaying the Black Lives Matter

[1:38:51] and justice for all sign in front of City Hall.

[1:38:55] I'm a mom to three sons,

[1:38:57] minor boys who walk around with privilege

[1:38:59] that they have done nothing to earn. Most recently, they had to learn the names,

[1:39:05] Briona Taylor, George Floyd, Elijah McLean, and Ahmad Aubrey. In learning their stories,

[1:39:12] they've grown to understand how so many of our systems and institutions allow racism to not

[1:39:20] only exist but thrive. They're making the connections to the small piece of the world they live in here

[1:39:27] safety harbor and the global Black Lives Matter movement. The flurs they hear at school,

[1:39:34] the in-birds crawled on bathroom stalls, the comparative lack of diversity seen in advanced

[1:39:40] and gifted classes. The proud boys' t-shirt worn in a local restaurant and the lack of

[1:39:47] black teachers in their own schools made just to name a few. The racism that is part of our everyday

[1:39:54] lives exposes the urgency to be anti-racist and to proudly and peacefully claim Black Lives Matter.

[1:40:04] I want to be able to point to a Black Lives Matter sign in front of our city hall and say,

[1:40:09] look boys, we're heading in the right direction. I fear that the only explanation I'll be able to

[1:40:15] provide for reversing the decision to display the Black Lives Matter sign is its ad one.

[1:40:21] that anti-racism is too complicated and too hard and it makes too many white people uncomfortable.

[1:40:30] Thank you.

[1:40:31] Thank you.

[1:40:35] We're going to go to Tammy Conrad, Tammy there.

[1:40:44] My name is Tammy Conrad, eight or seven North Bay Shore Drive.

[1:40:48] I've lived in and around safety harbor for 61 years.

[1:40:51] I have sibling, parents, children, cousins, grandkids, and friends that have moved

[1:40:55] to and lived in safety harbor. In all these years I have never seen or felt anything but good old

[1:41:01] fashion small town charm and southern hospitality until now. If this town is as bad as it is described

[1:41:07] then I find it ironic that this is the town everyone also wants to move to. I certainly wouldn't

[1:41:13] raise my family and live in a divisive town. I don't understand why a few people feel the need to

[1:41:19] force their agenda political views etc. on other people. If you want to fly a flag or put a poster up

[1:41:25] your property you have every right to. We have an American flag. Don't tread on me. Buccaneers and

[1:41:30] a God says all lights matter flag on our property. As for flying a black lives matter flag under

[1:41:35] our American flag, I find it unbelievably sad. It's for the sign in front of City Hall. I do not

[1:41:40] understand how it is not in violation of Article 12 of the municipal code. As a former business owner

[1:41:46] in town, I remember how extremely difficult it was with signage for our restaurant having to

[1:41:52] remove the painted name of the restaurant

[1:41:53] from the fence surrounding the restaurant.

[1:41:56] Many people think the Black Lives Matter

[1:41:58] is a slogan, ideal, or grassroots movement.

[1:42:01] The Black Lives Matter organization

[1:42:03] has trademarked those three words.

[1:42:05] And unfortunately, the founders of that organization

[1:42:08] have made it very political, divisive,

[1:42:11] anti-police, and overall unpatriotic.

[1:42:14] My wish is to go with the sign.

[1:42:15] JoAU has presented.

[1:42:17] It would be much more unifying for this town.

[1:42:20] Thank you very much.

[1:42:22] Do we

[1:42:33] have a flag that's flying to?

[1:42:38] No.

[1:42:39] Okay.

[1:42:40] Thanks.

[1:42:53] Mayor, you're on mute.

[1:42:56] Tara, are you there?

[1:42:58] Oh, yes, I am.

[1:43:00] I'm part of Pearson 516-3rd Street South in the safety hardware.

[1:43:05] Two things.

[1:43:06] I've heard several people say, oh, it's history in the past, you know,

[1:43:12] past that now. I just want to say the paraphrase is really a visual that those who do not remember

[1:43:18] the past are condemned to repeat it. And racism is not passed. I mean, maybe we don't have

[1:43:24] sway options out on the square and in safety harbor anymore, but what we do have is a situation

[1:43:32] where a man named Ahmad Agari who was dragging in a residential neighborhood shot by white supremacists

[1:43:40] because he was a black man in a white neighborhood.

[1:43:44] That's racism.

[1:43:46] And I think we all need to remember

[1:43:48] that this is happening daily

[1:43:50] in different places in our country.

[1:43:52] I'm disturbed that anyone can object

[1:43:54] to the Black Lives Matter time

[1:43:57] that is out in front of the hall.

[1:44:00] After hearing numerous times,

[1:44:02] that it is a socially-based justice-based message,

[1:44:05] which simply asks that everyone's support

[1:44:08] our African American brethren, and that they have the same life opportunities as we do. I encourage

[1:44:15] the City Council to continue having these signs out front of City Hall. Thank you.

[1:44:22] Thank you, Tara.

[1:44:28] Okay, we are going to

[1:44:33] Shoney. Shoney, are you there? I am. Can you hear me?

[1:44:41] My name is Shawnee Talk, 24 or 15 Madrid Avenue.

[1:44:46] It was real quick on the Dunedin thing.

[1:44:48] Dunedin was honored as the first purple heart city of Florida.

[1:44:53] They have a park to that.

[1:44:54] Maybe also why they have that banner up that you were talking about.

[1:44:58] Bye.

[1:45:00] So as a, you know, the figure is a lot of people on here. I'm a gay woman with a disabled wife. We have a five-racial child married to a black man. So, yeah, we've got it all going on here. They're both in the Army. Shout out, think, and both of their service. I've lived here for 15 years. Most people, you know, know me. I was a significant part of the little league. The service is a board member.

[1:45:29] president like I've never ever been the subject of you know any any issues at

[1:45:40] all I mean really the thing is you can put the sign up you can have a sign but

[1:45:47] then what are you going to do after that well how what are you going to do in

[1:45:52] the city how are you going to stand up and say okay this is what we're going to do

[1:45:56] What is it that you're going to do? You put a sign up, but that doesn't make everything go away.

[1:46:01] So we really need to figure out how are we going to help these people if that needs help.

[1:46:09] What is it that you're going to do? And my fear is, if this divisiveness continues,

[1:46:15] it's just going to set us back that much further. And we really don't need that. I mean,

[1:46:21] if you go down you go downtown I mean I think it's wonderful down there but I

[1:46:28] mean I don't I don't claim to have all the answers I just know as the person

[1:46:33] with you know like I said being a gay woman I have a wife, a biracial daughter, a

[1:46:40] black son-in-law I really don't know what the answer is so but thank you guys

[1:46:47] have a good night. Thanks, Sean.

[1:46:56] Okay, Sherry, are you there?

[1:47:02] Hello, can you hear me? We hear you.

[1:47:05] Hi, Shari Moskardini, 1403 North Bay Shore Drive. What really hit me when Lewis Ponds held

[1:47:14] that visual is when he said to the black members who were attending that he thought it was the first time

[1:47:22] they had ever seen this beautiful part of safety harbor, the waterfront part. Why? Because

[1:47:29] they never came downtown. And I thought about that. It kind of shocked me. And I thought about it.

[1:47:35] I worked at the Maddie Williams neighborhood family for some five years with many members of the Black

[1:47:41] community and other families. And I realized that I never ever saw any of those people downtown.

[1:47:50] and that made me realize that oh my gosh we are still basically a segregated town black communities

[1:47:57] back there behind the railroad tracks and they don't come downtown and everybody I've heard

[1:48:06] tonight says how lovely safety harbor is well they're running around the white community where you

[1:48:12] know where the spa is and North Bay Shore Drive in downtown. So we've got, we have a problem here,

[1:48:20] guys. And you took a symbolic step. You took a step that said we're going to try and do something

[1:48:27] about it. And I think that step meant a lot to members of the black community, that symbolic step

[1:48:34] that we want you downtown. And I just wish you would stick to that. And I really wish you would

[1:48:41] read politic fact because a lot of the things that have been said about the Black Lives Matter

[1:48:46] Movement today tonight is then debunked by politic fact and other fact checkers. So I really

[1:48:56] wish you would check that out and do I have two minutes?

[1:49:03] I would like you all to check that out

[1:49:08] and to stand strong in what you've done. I think that you made the decision on

[1:49:13] the date and you should stick to it. Okay, we're going to move on to Justin.

[1:49:22] Justin, are you there?

[1:49:30] Justin, are you there?

[1:49:32] Hello?

[1:49:32] Yep, we hear you.

[1:49:34] Hi, my name is Justin Brazier, 48 Crane Drive.

[1:49:39] I've been sitting here watching this meeting from the Gecko,

[1:49:42] And it really bothers me that a lot of people are throwing around the word racist because

[1:49:51] we don't, you know, certain people don't believe in this sign.

[1:49:58] I think most people believe that black lives really do matter but it's because of a national

[1:50:09] organization. Their leaders have stated that if they don't get what they want, they'll

[1:50:18] burn the whole system down. Is that really something that safety Harbour wants to get

[1:50:24] behind? I would hope not.

[1:50:32] I do, I'm beginning, I did not want any sort of a sign, but I do support

[1:50:38] the idea of safety harbor strong I think that is a more rewarding sign than

[1:50:49] the current sign that's my opinion thank you we're gonna go to Rick McCormick

[1:51:00] Rick are you there yes I'm here can you hear me we hear you okay thank

[1:51:08] Thank you, Mr. Mayor. My name is Rick McCormick. I live at 3432 State Route 580. I believe

[1:51:15] this entire discussion should not be about our personal feelings, about race or diversity.

[1:51:23] What events have happened in the past or what race was responsible for bringing us to where

[1:51:28] we are today. I believe the main reason for this meeting is to determine whether or not the

[1:51:34] city of safety arbor should pose signs on city property that appear to support a specific group

[1:51:41] at the exclusion of any and all other groups. I strongly feel that the city should refrain

[1:51:48] from placing any signs of a special interest group on public property. I don't begrudge anyone

[1:51:57] from expressing their cares and concerns about race or diversity, how their lives have

[1:52:04] been impacted, are their thoughts on how they believe people should respond to their

[1:52:09] situation. That's our basic rights. I too support an atmosphere of unity and respect

[1:52:15] for all people. I just feel that placing any signs of these type on public property is likely

[1:52:22] to cause more problems down the road. Just take the signs down and establish a policy

[1:52:29] that no similar signs will be allowed on public property. Move ahead with your diversity committee

[1:52:35] and let's get beyond this issue. Thank you. Thank you, Rick. All right. Let's see. We're going to

[1:52:45] have Carmen Lundy a chance to say a couple things again. Thank you, sir. And I just want to piggyback

[1:52:51] of Mr. McCormick because it's my thoughts exactly.

[1:52:56] And let me say something for the record.

[1:52:59] I mean being an African-American black woman,

[1:53:01] don't mean I'm a victim

[1:53:03] for all those who talk as though the compassion is sympathy.

[1:53:07] And I thank you for it

[1:53:08] because I'm not a victim, I'm really a victor.

[1:53:11] I have victory because I've overcome

[1:53:14] and we as a black community have overcome

[1:53:17] quite a bit in where we are.

[1:53:19] know we might not be where we want to be but we're showing the heck any way we

[1:53:23] used to be and we know every movement is a movement forward so those of who

[1:53:29] talking about taking down that sign is a movement going backwards there's no

[1:53:35] going backwards whether that sign stay there don't stay there because the sign has

[1:53:39] nothing to do with purpose and I want to say like Mr. McCormick was saying it's

[1:53:45] not about, you know, are we, and for the other record for someone, you know, no, I have

[1:53:53] heard any black residents in the city of safety harbor because of like my matter,

[1:53:58] live matter, we're going to come and burn down the city. So okay, so it has nothing to

[1:54:04] do with what the national, what those other folks doing. We're talking about the city of

[1:54:09] safety harbor. So don't even take us down that lane or put us in that category. We're talking

[1:54:14] about setting a preface, a preface, whatever that word is. I want me to spell it for you,

[1:54:19] PR, E-C-E, D-E-N-C-E. Okay, and it's not even about the science they are don't say,

[1:54:26] it's about unity. And the thing of the president is that if the science stays, and I'm black,

[1:54:32] I'm proud. I'm not a victim. I'm good with going forward. You know, going backwards,

[1:54:38] whether that's fine, stay there or not.

[1:54:40] But in going forward, meaning if we allow

[1:54:44] the black matter signed to go up

[1:54:46] and I'm not against it so you can't say that,

[1:54:49] then does that mean that I pose this

[1:54:51] to all our commissioner?

[1:54:53] Does that allow any sign to go up?

[1:54:56] Because if it does and a sign go up

[1:54:58] that us as black residents don't like,

[1:55:01] we're gonna have this discussion all over again.

[1:55:03] And there's gonna be a constant battle

[1:55:05] back and forth about why that sign?

[1:55:07] Why that sign? Why that sign? And with that, we're in due unity come in because we're going to be too busy fighting battles about this sign.

[1:55:16] It is not a setback unless we allow it to be a setback. I say, okay, I understand the concerns, the passion that everybody have for the cause.

[1:55:26] But the bottom line is, how do we come to unity? How we get away from this separation and taking down a sign is not a setback. That's my opinion.

[1:55:36] Okay, it is city property. It's for any who said we is because we all pay taxes up there, but the bottom line is where did you set the president's to where enough we can't let everybody.

[1:55:49] You let black lives matter sign stay up. If you don't set your resolution in and then you have other folks go up and put sign.

[1:55:56] other ladies say, well, I'll just walk past a cool club playing a side. Well, I won't.

[1:56:00] And none of the other residents in the city of safety are will. So maybe you want to think into

[1:56:06] going forward and everybody want to look at as a kickback. No, going forward. How do we go forward

[1:56:12] that we don't come to this place again over this? Thank you.

[1:56:19] Thank you again. Okay, we are going to go to somebody as a phone number that ends in 9024.

[1:56:29] Can you hear us? Yes, this is Rob Subversky. Can you hear me? Yeah, we hear you.

[1:56:35] Okay, again, my name is Rob Subversky and my address is 531 Home Freeze Road.

[1:56:41] I strongly urge the commission to stand by the decision to place the Black Lives Matter signs in front of City Hall and in front of the library.

[1:56:48] I continue to assert that the signs are not political.

[1:56:53] The signs serve as a call for unity and a commitment to justice for all.

[1:56:58] And as the background of the sign illustrates, I.e., the children, the sign is inclusive

[1:57:03] of blacks, whites, Hispanics, Asians, Middle Easterners, etc., as well as for those of all

[1:57:09] nationalities and not solely blacks.

[1:57:13] My understanding is that the signs were not designed to be, nor were there any intention

[1:57:18] of the signs being associated with what we've come to know is the larger Black Lives Matter movement.

[1:57:24] On June 20th at Waterfront Park, I witnessed Mr. Louis Ponds do a courageous thing.

[1:57:30] I organized and leading the community vigil. Mr. Ponds' quote got in the arena,

[1:57:34] unquote, whereas it could be also said he got in the ring. That's a gut.

[1:57:40] Noting up front that the community, you know the front that the community vigil was not being held

[1:57:46] as a black lives matter rally. Mr. Ponds clearly and unequivocally called for unity, for understanding,

[1:57:53] and for compassion in our community. Mr. Ponds made no calls for marches, no calls for violence,

[1:58:00] there was no fiery rhetoric nor did he call for defunding the police. It was not political.

[1:58:07] Nevertheless, he knew that the potential for misrepresentation of what he was doing was high,

[1:58:12] well he went ahead anyway. One could say the Mr. Ponds was tested. By stepping up on that

[1:58:19] portable platform and speaking he took it upon himself to be tested and he passed with flying

[1:58:24] colors. With a special meeting the members of the Safety Harbor City Commission are being tested.

[1:58:30] You are in the ring so to speak. You're being asked to make a call and it won't be an easy call.

[1:58:36] pressure is being applied by those misinterpreting and representing signs. I ask you not to yield to the pressure to affirm your decision of Delight 20th to keep the signs and with that your head held high passing the test.

[1:58:50] And by the way, I'm a retired career law enforcement officer and I have no problem with the signs.

[1:58:54] Thank you.

[1:58:56] Okay.

[1:58:59] Karen, no.

[1:59:00] And Karen, are you there?

[1:59:03] Yeah, I'm here.

[1:59:05] Yeah, I just want to thank the commission for the vote that was held last Monday night.

[1:59:12] I support the replacement of the small, very cheerful, supportive, unifying sign that says Black Lives Matter and Justice for all in front of the city hall.

[1:59:26] and in front of the library I think it's a great idea, don't think it's divisive. I think it's great

[1:59:31] that you are going to create the diversity, the neighborhood diversity committee. I'd like to

[1:59:37] see some progress on that and I want to thank all of you on the commission for your vote last week

[1:59:42] and I strongly support the continued placement of the science. I think it's a great idea to unifying

[1:59:49] and I think it's time for us to change things here in safety harbor with a more positive

[1:59:55] for all people regardless of their color.

[1:59:58] Thank you so much.

[2:00:00] Thank you, Kevin.

[2:00:08] Jim Barger, are you there? Yes, sir. Can you hear me? We hear you. All right. This is Jim Barger's 815 North Bay Shore. First, a big hello to Lewis Ponds. We've coached basketball at the community center together. I do want to point out, I think my win loss record against him is probably more wins and losses, although he would probably argue the counterpoint to that. Lewis is a great father, very involved in his son's life and just want to say hi. I haven't seen you in a while.

[2:00:35] As Commissioner Meyers mentioned, there is a Black Lives movement, a BLM group, proper

[2:00:41] noun, capital B, capital L, capital M, and then there's the BLM ideal.

[2:00:47] And then of course, a silent city property.

[2:00:49] First as far as the Black Lives Matter organization goes, the group's website and their own manifesto

[2:00:56] makes claims for decarceration and repatriations.

[2:00:58] So, I'd strongly encourage Sherry, Master Dini, Carol,

[2:01:02] Mackney, Tonya, Vidavik and Mary Poole, all who said they support the organization to

[2:01:08] give away their homes and saving accounts to the BLM organization.

[2:01:11] You can politely put your money where your mouth is if that's really your belief.

[2:01:16] On the topic of the sign, my message isn't prosign or anti-sign.

[2:01:21] It's more of a, how do we come together as a community?

[2:01:25] In this environment, everybody seems to feel you have to pick a side.

[2:01:28] that if your Black Lives Matters, your anti-police,

[2:01:31] or if your blue Lives Matter, your anti-minority,

[2:01:34] the reality is neither of that is true.

[2:01:36] I have many Black friends and colleagues,

[2:01:38] none of whom are writing or burning down buildings.

[2:01:41] I also have several friends that are in law enforcement,

[2:01:44] none of whom go to work every day to kill minorities,

[2:01:46] but go to work every day to serve and protect

[2:01:48] and put themselves at great risk to do so.

[2:01:51] We live in the United States of America,

[2:01:53] the keyword being united.

[2:01:55] yet we act like it's red versus blue, conservative versus liberal or way too politicized, way too polarized.

[2:02:02] General Mattis recently said, instructions given by the military departments to our troops before the Normandy invasion,

[2:02:09] reminded the soldiers that the Nazi slogan for destroying us was divide and conquer.

[2:02:15] Our American answer is in union, there is strength.

[2:02:18] We must summon that unity regardless of the commission's decision to keep or remove the sign

[2:02:25] Which is going to be a binary decision? It's going to be a yes or no

[2:02:29] And it will be liked or disliked by half of the residents on this call

[2:02:32] Let's all accept that decision and move on in a unified manner and by the way, I'm also 100

[2:02:39] Fundy, I don't want to see a KKK case on any city property

[2:02:43] Thank you, Jim

[2:02:46] Okay, so we're going to move now, Matt, you want to read the emails on?

[2:02:54] Yes, we have, I believe 25, some did email that we no longer have to read their emails.

[2:02:59] So I'll just start reading.

[2:03:02] The first one is from Sally Bishop.

[2:03:03] I have to say that I don't know anyone who doesn't agree that what happened to George Ford

[2:03:07] was a crime and not justice for all.

[2:03:10] That we so do believe in.

[2:03:12] But I also have to speak up and say that Black Lives Matter is an avowed Marxist group who

[2:03:18] supports the destruction of the nuclear family.

[2:03:20] I don't believe anyone in taking Harvard believes that so the science should not create

[2:03:24] further divide, but the unity we all believe in.

[2:03:27] I believe in the science said, I believe if the science said all African-American Lives

[2:03:32] Matter just as for all, you could avoid some of the issues that would be so strainerously

[2:03:37] voice as I do about BLM. As leaders, you need to not be supporting a

[2:03:43] Marxist group. I implore you to read about what BLM stands for. And once the

[2:03:47] fact that they believe in destroying the family units so that government can

[2:03:50] be in charge of everything means if you use it, you are supporting it. Are you

[2:03:53] really supporting that? And if you hear an uproar about it, you will understand

[2:03:57] why because you are supporting something that abounds to destroy our way of

[2:04:00] life, family units, self-decision, and justice for all works always. Please, please,

[2:04:06] please distinguish yourself from a march to screw up and pick something else. This decision

[2:04:09] matters and calls for your best leadership, Sally Bishop.

[2:04:14] To city commissioners of safety harbor from Brent Russell, as resident homeowners, taxpayers

[2:04:19] and voters of safety harbor, we are appalled and horrified to learn in the placement of

[2:04:23] Black Lives Matter signage outside of city hall. How can you think of reclaiming public community

[2:04:27] support for an organization that has founded and the objective of hating the United States

[2:04:32] and overthrowing our Constitution and government.

[2:04:35] As a sentence, we have no quarrel

[2:04:37] with the statement Black Lives Matter, all lives matter,

[2:04:40] and with that organization, sadly,

[2:04:42] objecting to our brave members of law enforcement,

[2:04:44] most importantly, blue lives matter.

[2:04:46] As an organization, Black Lives Matter represents total

[2:04:48] andarchy and terrorism.

[2:04:50] Please read the actual proclamations

[2:04:52] and foundation of the leaders in the mission statement

[2:04:55] of Black Lives Matter, and hopefully,

[2:04:57] you will rethink and resend your plan.

[2:04:59] Thank you for your consideration.

[2:05:00] upset in angry safety harbor residents Brent and Carol Russell.

[2:05:05] This is from Designia Daily to whom it may concern I'm requesting the removal of the Black Lives Matter

[2:05:10] Science from city property. I don't believe any signage outside of city notices.

[2:05:15] Outside of city notices should be posted to enter or installed on city property.

[2:05:19] The Black Lives Matter Science is controversial at best and has caused a vision not only in safety harbor

[2:05:24] but nationwide. The group is political period. Thank you for listening Designia Daily.

[2:05:30] I'm opposed to the BLM sign being on city property even worse in front of city hall saying the lives of black citizens are important is a good and honorable message saying black lives matters promoting a radical political movement is no different than placing a mega 2020 sign or pro life banner at city hall.

[2:05:46] I strongly recommend a sign you're moved immediately before more damage.

[2:05:49] individual is suffered by our community,

[2:05:52] sincerely, make Elliott.

[2:05:56] Patty Bell, to the mayor.

[2:05:58] I feel the sign in front of City Hall

[2:05:59] is inappropriate and should be removed.

[2:06:01] The work Black Lives Matter kind of take

[2:06:03] divisiveness and discrimination.

[2:06:04] I believe the intention is to promote inclusion and unity.

[2:06:07] And in my mind, does exactly the opposite.

[2:06:08] I find the sign offensive and racist and ashamed

[2:06:11] that this commission has bowed to a mob mentality.

[2:06:16] That was Patty Bell.

[2:06:18] All

[2:06:21] right, this one's a little longer.

[2:06:22] peak shields. It is my opinion President Obama has divided this country and has

[2:06:27] infuriated the black community against law enforcement officers and the law

[2:06:30] itself and the eyes of Christ all eyes matter. There are several successful black

[2:06:35] leaders and professional people who are contributing to the success of our

[2:06:38] country. I have never disrespected a black person in this serving my country in

[2:06:43] the US Army or as a civilian, hijacking the Black Lives Matter mantra for the

[2:06:47] old for the own agenda is creating lawlessness, looting, and destroying property. By you continuing

[2:06:53] to promote Black Lives Matter, you are encouraging more attention between law-abiding citizens,

[2:06:58] police and minorities. This movement now has created an atmosphere that is so dangerous for

[2:07:02] law enforcement officers that now they have to defend themselves while engaging their work and

[2:07:06] protecting us. There is now more attention paid to police behavior than to gangs or crime.

[2:07:12] This scrutiny has triggered more violence against the police. There are more Black people committing

[2:07:15] crimes against other black people than police violence towards blacks. Respect is the real answer

[2:07:21] to the problem and it has to start in the home and in our schools. If a person of any color starts

[2:07:26] respecting the laws and the police, the police will respect them. Stop handing out relief money to

[2:07:32] those who can work. If you want money from the government, then the government should give you a job

[2:07:36] to earn it. Idol minds only creates trouble. The trouble with this country is not the police,

[2:07:42] but the lawbreakers. This is a country of laws and when someone breaks the law, they should

[2:07:45] go to jail or is her citizenship and be deported to another country, it takes guts to solve

[2:07:50] the problem, not lawless, infuriated movements, respectfully peat shields.

[2:07:58] All right, Rick McCormick,

[2:08:00] I know he spoke earlier, so hold on. I don't want to read that one. John Turner, the front

[2:08:06] yard of City Hall is the wrong place for a Black Lives Matter sign. The Commission

[2:08:10] reports to be a nonpartisan by allowing signage with a distinct political agenda you are opening

[2:08:15] the door for each of us to exert our first amendment rights and request the opportunity

[2:08:19] to proclaim our opinions and legitimate and legitimately you could not deny this privilege.

[2:08:25] Safety Harbor City Hall should not become the battleground for strongly held opposing views.

[2:08:31] One second, make sure I don't read one twice. Okay Janet Hooper, we hold these truths to be self-evident

[2:08:42] that all men are created equal that they are endowed by their creator with certain

[2:08:46] unalienable rights that among these are life's liberty and the pursuit of happiness

[2:08:51] ramble to the declaration of independence but all did not but capital all did not mean all it meant

[2:08:57] white men only in 1918 the 19th amendment gave women the rights to vote so all then meant white

[2:09:02] men and women in 1964 the Civil Rights Act outlaw discrimination based on race so all should have

[2:09:08] I meant everyone, but it did not.

[2:09:10] Safety Harbor has a history that no one should be proud of.

[2:09:12] None of us who's skin is white ever fear being lynched or killed for

[2:09:16] looking at some more the wrong way.

[2:09:18] It is time that our city declared that black lives matter because for too long they did not.

[2:09:23] The Maddy Williams neighborhood family center supports Lewis Ponds and

[2:09:26] the African American community in place of the black lives matter sign in front of city hall.

[2:09:29] As do I, Janet Cooper, a former city commissioner.

[2:09:32] The very fact that you are brought, you have brought this forward to reconsider as a dangerous precedent for

[2:09:37] all commission decisions going forward, a very sad day for our community, Janet Cooper.

[2:09:43] Tammy Verena, let me start off by saying that I support the Black Lives Matter movement

[2:09:46] and believe that safety harbor should act to vote quality in our community.

[2:09:51] That said, I am troubled by the decision of the last commission meeting to entertain a lengthy

[2:09:54] off agenda discussion on Black Lives Matter without public notice by allowing this spontaneous and

[2:09:59] robust discussion myself and the vast majority of harbor rights were denied access to this very

[2:10:05] important and sadly controversial topic. I am most disappointed that the City Commission

[2:10:09] discussed in very concrete ways our community will elevate the Black Lives Matter movement

[2:10:14] when the Commission is on the cusp of establishing a diversity council whose aim I assume is

[2:10:18] to take up and lead on issues and actions of this very nature. Why arrest this significant

[2:10:24] process away from the diversity council? I can't think of a better first ever biodiversity

[2:10:28] council than brainstorming and developing their recommendations on what symbolism would

[2:10:33] best promote diversity and equity in safety harbor. In conclusion, I ask that in the future,

[2:10:39] the Commission provide public notice for important discussions like this so that all voices have

[2:10:43] the opportunity to be heard. Thank you for your thoughtful leadership in this moment of crisis,

[2:10:47] Tammy Veranna.

[2:10:50] Sonya Haas. The city should not be allowed to post any signage promoting a Marxist,

[2:10:55] terrorist groups such as BLM. Do your research. Putting up such signs will only divide the

[2:10:59] community more, the L.M. movement is not what you think. Thank you, Sonya Haas.

[2:11:04] Phyllis Shanks, please do not reverse your decision to support the Black Lives Matter

[2:11:08] and Justice for all signs. The Commission agreed in majority to support the sign. It was

[2:11:13] not political. To remove it now would make it political and send a wrong message to the

[2:11:17] residents of safety harbor community. The sign does not say Black Lives Matter.com, nor is

[2:11:22] an endorsement of any group. It simply says Black Lives Matter. This does not mean more than

[2:11:26] in any other lives, just that they matter.

[2:11:29] The, and justice for all, in quotes,

[2:11:32] in addition, supports this.

[2:11:34] This country is so divided on so many things.

[2:11:36] This is not the time to backtrack.

[2:11:38] It is time for safety, Harvard, to come together

[2:11:40] and support equality and justice for all, to the shanks.

[2:11:44] Give me another minute.

[2:11:46] We actually have emails coming in as I'm reading.

[2:11:52] Hold on one sec, I'm being told I don't have to read a couple.

[2:11:55] So let me look at those real quick.

[2:11:58] Okay.

[2:11:58] Okay, we have about 16 more.

[2:12:02] The Black Lives Matter sign in front of City Hall is the smallest anti-racist message we

[2:12:06] can possibly deliver, and even this is controversial.

[2:12:09] Given safety harbors racist roots, we should be doing so much, much more.

[2:12:13] To expand diversity and inclusion in the heart of this city, please let this tiny sign stand

[2:12:17] for those of us who are seeking hope for a better future, Devon Murray.

[2:12:22] Diane Vidavik.

[2:12:23] I urge you to please keep the Black Lives Matter sign up in front of City Hall, rewarding it so

[2:12:28] that white people feel more comfortably only waters down the issue. Racism still today reduces

[2:12:34] freedoms and rights of black lives makes their lives seen less than mine. It may seem simply symbolic

[2:12:40] and empty words, black lives matter without action behind it, but finally white people all over

[2:12:45] the nation are getting what white privilege means. White people all over the nation are standing up to

[2:12:50] make necessary changes to equalize opportunities and rights, liberties for all. I stand with them and

[2:12:55] want to live in a community that works hard to include everyone. The Black Lives Matter

[2:12:59] Science speaks to where we need to grow now. It hurts to hear Peter Allen Burke say in a

[2:13:04] safety hover Facebook post I read earlier today. So my guess is that our voice freedom rights doesn't

[2:13:10] mean anything to anyone that says Harvard just as long as we stay in our place and eyes and head down.

[2:13:14] Huh? We know better. We have to do better. Keep to sign up and follow up with action. Diane Bidevik.

[2:13:22] Certainly, I'm going to say surely be because I'll, I'll butcher the last name. Surely be. Thank you to all city officials who realize the agenda of Black Lives Matter is far different than their slogan to allow this type of political messaging, gives approval to not only potentially further racial division and political harassment, but also the opportunity to incite demonstrations, disturbing the peace, defacing buildings and destruction of private property, for which BLM is well known for.

[2:13:47] It is a documented fact by their own admission that the founder and co-founders of the LM are train

[2:13:52] buses having been students of Eric Mann, former agitator of the weather, underground, domestic,

[2:13:59] terror organization. Is this really the message safety harbor wants to embrace and support? I think not

[2:14:07] surely be. Elena, adding, I am a resident homeowner, safety harbor. I love this community and certainly

[2:14:15] welcome individuals of all races to safety harbor. This is not what this is about. The issue that many have with the sign

[2:14:21] with others are not understanding is that Black Lives Matter is a political organization which

[2:14:26] donates to a particular political party while I and certainly most, if not all residents of safety harbor

[2:14:32] agree that Black Lives Matter this sign is advertising for Black Lives Matter the political organization.

[2:14:37] If we are opening up city hall property to signs and support political organizations, I would like

[2:14:41] to add a sign for national rights to life,

[2:14:43] baby's lives matter,

[2:14:44] blue lives matter,

[2:14:45] and while we are at it, perhaps even a Trump 2020 sign.

[2:14:48] This sign has only cost for the division

[2:14:50] as well as any sign of political nature,

[2:14:52] kind regards Elena Adenk.

[2:14:56] Jared Vitamick.

[2:14:58] I commend you for making a unanimous-

[2:15:05] I believe it was an important but small step to state our intention. Despite our past, we hope to be a more inclusive, aware and just city moving forward.

[2:15:14] I must admit, I was surprised at the level backlash residents exhibited in response to the unanimous agreement to display a message that represents quality, justice and an acknowledgement that we have worked to address racial injustice and communities across America.

[2:15:27] In the face of this backlash, our mayor decided to re-discuss whether these are values we hold

[2:15:34] in what to display. Yet, these values, equality, justice are not controversial and are the

[2:15:39] basis for the support cities like Tampa, St. Pete, and Orlando have shown Black Lives Matter.

[2:15:44] Similarly, Major League Baseball, the NHL, the NFL, and NBA have offered support for Black Lives Matter.

[2:15:50] When you ask Alexa if Black Lives Matter she agrees and explains that Black Lives Matter is about

[2:15:55] equality and justice. Therefore, I would ask that our elected leaders instead of

[2:15:59] wavering in the face of criticism, create and facilitate dialogue and lead

[2:16:02] the way next 20 to our community, why Black Lives Matter. Let's stand

[2:16:06] together for equality and justice rather than allowing safe harbor for, rather than

[2:16:13] allowing safe harbor for racism. Thank you, Jared Vitavek.

[2:16:18] Paula Peterson. Black Lives Matter is a political organization founded by three

[2:16:24] I believe we better serve our community through dialogue, not divisive, political, work to

[2:16:32] signalling.

[2:16:33] I have been verbally demeaned and called racist by our fellow state network resident because

[2:16:37] I disagree with this political sign of public property.

[2:16:40] I taught over 40 years working with four kids, most who are black or Latino.

[2:16:44] I work in schools, hospitals, jails, juvenile detention centers.

[2:16:47] I'm a trainer for framework for understanding poverty and reading specialists in the work

[2:16:52] and Black communities to help bring literacy.

[2:16:56] I do not believe this sign helps.

[2:16:58] I believe it divides.

[2:16:59] It does not mean to help the very community

[2:17:01] that you want to help.

[2:17:03] Talk with representatives

[2:17:04] and safety-hearted Black community.

[2:17:05] Find out what really matters to them.

[2:17:07] Then you can support and help.

[2:17:09] If you choose to keep this sign of public property

[2:17:10] then all residents should have their voices heard.

[2:17:13] I believe all lives matter

[2:17:14] and like to see a pro-life sign displayed.

[2:17:16] Planned parenthood has killed millions of lives.

[2:17:19] A disproportionate number where Black lives

[2:17:21] Please represent all voices,

[2:17:23] sincerely, all of Peterson.

[2:17:25] Make it quick, great.

[2:17:30] Hey, man, I'm all right.

[2:17:31] We have 11 more.

[2:17:35] Good job, we're doing good.

[2:17:37] All right, Wendy Vernon, please reconsider the political,

[2:17:41] the politically mode, and I apologize,

[2:17:43] this is the first time I'm reading most of these,

[2:17:44] so that's why I pause some time.

[2:17:47] Please reconsider the politically motivated signage

[2:17:50] in front of City Hall or any city government property,

[2:17:52] now and in the future.

[2:17:54] If one political movement is allowed, it opens the door to debate other political movements such as pro-life or other controversial topics.

[2:18:01] Focus on the development of the diversity, volunteer board, so we can get direct input from those that may feel underrepresented.

[2:18:09] Black Lives Matter, as an organization, does not have a good reputation, and I believe that is why our community is opposed to the side.

[2:18:16] A select group of white individuals in this town are causing our city to be painted as racist because of this controversy.

[2:18:23] It's because of the aforementioned group and the political group Black Lives Matter causing

[2:18:27] to divide.

[2:18:28] I wholeheartedly believe that the concept of the lives of all of our Black community members

[2:18:32] and their value in it, equality, is important to all of our community.

[2:18:36] Ashton speak louder than words, let's hear from our diverse population on how we can ensure

[2:18:40] everyone feels value, equal and welcome to our community, promote the diversity board, not

[2:18:44] a controversial sign.

[2:18:45] Thank you, Wendy Burnett.

[2:18:48] James Rooney.

[2:18:48] The City of Safety Harbour should not provide official signage for a group which is completely

[2:18:52] political in nature, the BLM group is a group which is planning radical changes to the

[2:18:57] United States.

[2:18:58] If there is signage for an extreme socialist group, then there would also be room for extreme

[2:19:02] politically conservative groups.

[2:19:04] I am certain that the City of Safety Harbour would not allow such a sign, James Rodin.

[2:19:10] Stephanie Dobson.

[2:19:11] My name is Stephanie Dobson.

[2:19:13] I am in full support of the Black Lives Matter signs on Main Street.

[2:19:17] I believe there is some misunderstanding about the phrase Black Lives Matter.

[2:19:20] Hashtag Black Lives Matter is a social movement that is for basic human rights and racial equality

[2:19:26] and against racism.

[2:19:27] That's all.

[2:19:28] It does not mean that one supports the organization which happens to share the same name.

[2:19:32] It does mean that you want racial equality for all, including Black people.

[2:19:37] Thank you, Stephanie Dopsie.

[2:19:40] This is from Paul Ebokker.

[2:19:44] Sorry Paul.

[2:19:44] I understand that there have been some citizens expressing negative opinions regarding the black lives matter sign place in front of city hall

[2:19:51] I would like to express my support for keeping that sign all lives do not matter until black lives also matter

[2:19:57] There are many areas where racial inequality still exists including the equal treatment of all citizens by various police agencies across the country

[2:20:04] My vote is that the sign is appropriate and should be kept in front of city hall hall and boxer EBA C-H-E-R

[2:20:13] We have Jessica Lewis sent in a letter from the Sierra Club. I write in support of Black Lives Matter Movement. Racism is real and our communities must boldly face this fact as it relates to our past, present, and future.

[2:20:27] If there were ever a time to do so, this is it, demonstrating leadership and courage in this historic moment isn't easy.

[2:20:32] But it is indeed necessary. Please stand on the right side of history and support racial and

[2:20:37] Racial support racial justice in our community. We stand with you respectfully James Scott executive executive community chair Sunco Steera Club

[2:20:48] Only a few more mayor

[2:20:55] American cook Carter. She may be listening. She sent five or more emails

[2:21:00] She sent one to you today, which is over 500 words. I will not be reading that you have a copy of that

[2:21:05] that, I will read the first one chronologically

[2:21:07] that she sent to you this evening.

[2:21:09] We must take sides.

[2:21:10] Nutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim.

[2:21:13] Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.

[2:21:16] Sometimes we must interfere.

[2:21:18] When human lives are endangered,

[2:21:19] when human dignity is in jeopardy,

[2:21:21] national borders and sensitivities become irrelevant.

[2:21:24] Wherever men and women are persecuted

[2:21:26] because of their race, religion, or political views,

[2:21:28] that place must at that moment become

[2:21:30] the center of the universe.

[2:21:31] Ily Weissel Holocaust survivor.

[2:21:34] And again, there's more and I, we have all this for public documents, but that's the first one that she sent in tonight.

[2:21:41] Okay. Diane Wallman. Diane Wallman. I, I'm sorry, city commission.

[2:21:46] I would like to speak in support of the Black Lives Matter movement and sign. I moved to safety harbor four years ago.

[2:21:51] I am a professor of anthropology at the University of South Florida.

[2:21:54] First, I want to commend the commission and city for establishing the board of our diversity.

[2:21:58] I want to thank the many others tonight for so eloquently speaking and support the commission's decision

[2:22:03] I just want to note that for many of our society's most vulnerable history has not passed

[2:22:07] Systemic and structural racism exists and apparently also does overt races in our town as disappointedly shown on social media

[2:22:15] As white people we don't see this because we don't live it

[2:22:18] We must as a community and society recognize the institutional and systemic violence against black people and other historically oppressed and marginalized groups

[2:22:27] This is a moral issue not political as others have said we need to be on the right side of history keep this sign up

[2:22:33] And please continue the work on diversity and equality. I'm sorry

[2:22:38] Please continue to continue the work on diversity and equity in our city. Thank you, Diane Walman

[2:22:46] Okay, well, I just got an email. I said I don't have to read an email. So I probably already read that email

[2:22:51] Hold on

[2:22:58] Michael Moskardini

[2:22:59] This Monday Eve you will be asked to reconsider your decision to place on city property two small

[2:23:04] signs reading Black Lives Matter Justice for all. How sad that such a simple message can provoke so

[2:23:09] much what? Darison, anger, hatred but there it is and now you must face up to it. I favor the signs but

[2:23:17] you will not read here any further argument why they are appropriate for this time and for this place.

[2:23:22] I think we're beyond that. Rather I ask only that you be true to the heartfelt sympathies you express

[2:23:27] publicly last week. More simply, I ask that you be true to yourselves. Aim at the inevitable

[2:23:32] tumult and shouting that may not be easy, so for its worth, I ask you to recall your high school

[2:23:38] history. Writing at a time when the American Revolution seemed near collapse, Thomas Payne wrote,

[2:23:44] these are the times that try men's souls, the summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will,

[2:23:48] and this crisis shrank from the service of his country, but he that stands it now deserves

[2:23:53] serves the love and thanks of man and woman.

[2:23:56] Of course, the stakes in safety are not so dire,

[2:23:58] and yet in a very real sense,

[2:24:00] the cause of freedom remains in peril.

[2:24:02] Reversing your votes, Monday means enlisting

[2:24:04] in an army of summer soldiers and sunshine patriots.

[2:24:07] I pray you stand your ground knowing that as pain wrote,

[2:24:11] tyranny like hell is not easily conquered,

[2:24:13] yet we have this consolation with us

[2:24:17] that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumphs,

[2:24:20] and certainly Michael Mustardini.

[2:24:23] Lin and Hutchins. I unconditionally feel that all of African-American lives matter, the radical sign in front of the City of Safety Harbor City Hall needs to be removed because it is a marshallist organization, it is horror that there has been police brutality across all colors but with that being Lin and Hutchins.

[2:24:41] And the last one, Aaron.

[2:24:44] a vote against BLM sizes, a vote against what this community claims to stand for, any vote against it is someone who will no longer have my support.

[2:24:52] Mayor commission, those are all the public comments we have.

[2:24:57] All right. Thank you. You deserve an award for reading all that.

[2:25:01] So thank you for that. All right.

[2:25:04] Back up to the commission just to keep things moving along. Anybody want to weigh in on this?

[2:25:12] Let me just start off by saying, I just want to say I want to thank everybody for joining this meeting.

[2:25:17] This is obviously a sensitive topic one way or another and I know we're meeting on Zoom, we're virtually meeting, but, you know, it's just good to engage the community and be able to talk about this in an honest, frank manner.

[2:25:30] So I appreciate everybody's feedback and participation in this matter and I'm confident that the city commission is going to come up with a way forward.

[2:25:38] that's going to unite the city and continue the dialogue.

[2:25:42] But I'd like to open it up now and see he wants to weigh in.

[2:25:47] Yes, Mayor.

[2:25:48] I'll start.

[2:25:49] You want to go, Commissioner Diaz?

[2:25:51] Right.

[2:25:52] I've got a lot to say.

[2:25:53] I don't know how long you're going to be if you want to go ahead.

[2:25:57] I'm going to be brief.

[2:25:59] I really am.

[2:26:01] The only thing that I really want to say is this was a good discussion tonight.

[2:26:07] At first I was hesitant about having this, but this is sort of the purpose of these signs

[2:26:13] to get the people to talk, and that's what we have.

[2:26:16] We got to get dialogue tonight, and people will hear what their neighbors think, and it's

[2:26:21] an interesting discussion.

[2:26:22] So I commend everyone who came out and spoke, it's actually an interesting process for me.

[2:26:29] What I do want to mention is just two really quick things I want to mention, but the public,

[2:26:33] I think it's important to recognize this didn't pop up out of anywhere, just nowhere.

[2:26:39] The commission has been having some discussions about social justice and trying to get the

[2:26:45] African-American community to come down to the city main street and get more involved

[2:26:51] hence the diversity group.

[2:26:57] So, and I'm proud of the city commission, everybody's sitting up there, the mayor and all the

[2:27:02] commissioners. I'm proud that we've had that discussion. I think that's a good thing.

[2:27:07] It really has become a city initiative to try to address social issues in the city.

[2:27:16] Now what I believe I heard the city attorney say is that the city can display signs that

[2:27:25] address city initiatives that talk about, and nobody really talked about that

[2:27:30] tonight, that to me it's sort of a test of what signs we can put up, what signs we can put up.

[2:27:36] The sign was part of the commission's process of engaging the African-American

[2:27:45] community and trying to get people to come downtown. This is a process that we've been talking about

[2:27:51] for some time. I don't think anybody on the commission would disagree that that's a city initiative.

[2:27:57] In my opinion, that is, that means that the city can put these signs up because it supports

[2:28:06] that initiative, but it wouldn't allow a KKK sign. That would not support any city initiative,

[2:28:13] and a majority of the commissioners could say no. And obviously a majority of the commissioners,

[2:28:19] I think maybe could say yes, but I don't think that would happen.

[2:28:23] I think the city could say no to a certain sign because it doesn't support a city initiative.

[2:28:31] And therefore, that whole argument about, oh, suddenly we're going to get swamped with

[2:28:35] all these different signs, it takes that argument away.

[2:28:40] So I'm not really concerned about that.

[2:28:42] I would like the city to further explore the issue of coming up with a policy. I'm cool with that. I think that's an appropriate thing. The city should be looking at and doing.

[2:28:56] But I spoke before at the last meeting about my personal beliefs, where I stand on this issue.

[2:29:04] and based on what I said before and based on the fact that I don't I'm not too

[2:29:09] worried about a slippery slope of signs popping up on City Hall because I

[2:29:14] wouldn't support those signs. I'm not going to change my position on the

[2:29:19] sign. I just I don't think it's to put everybody agrees to put the sign out and

[2:29:24] then a week later we all somehow agree to take it down. I'm just taking my

[2:29:28] position. Thank you.

[2:29:32] Yeah. Thank you, Commissioner Zordor. Yeah, so from this whole meeting,

[2:29:39] you know, obviously, you know, to meet Black Lives Matter represents a social movement.

[2:29:45] It's basically equality for all and particularly trying to help out the African-American community

[2:29:52] in establishing themselves in the mainstream of American society. That's what it means to me.

[2:30:00] Obviously, you know, and to me, this is being on the right side. Eventually, you know, maybe hopefully it happens soon, but eventually it's going to happen where black Americans and Latinos and white Americans are all going to sit around and talk to each other kind of like kids do. Kids don't really recognize color. You know, they look at each other, they just look at each other to play. You know, if you want to play with me, if you want to talk to me, it's fine. They engage freely.

[2:30:29] it's a colorless relationship. What I found here is that, you know, it's people are freaking out

[2:30:41] over two signs, right? One sign is City Hall and one sign at the library. If people who've seen

[2:30:51] these signs, if you look at them, I mean, basically you have Black Lives Matter on it, and I'm not even

[2:30:58] going to explain it because to me it's kind of ridiculous that people are

[2:31:01] freaking out and so insecure about their status in society that they're really

[2:31:06] scared about these two signs because the signs are basically, you know, it's

[2:31:13] Black Lives Matter and Justice for all and it has no really attachment to the

[2:31:20] fist pumping Black Lives Matter organization that you see is somewhere else but

[2:31:27] But so you had you had that part of it and obviously people are talking about the political

[2:31:35] side of it.

[2:31:36] Well, people are making it political.

[2:31:38] People make it and people are making it political here in safety harbor.

[2:31:41] Yeah, people that are calling in a Marxist group.

[2:31:43] People that are calling it, you know, anti, you know, the majority, the majority of the

[2:31:48] people are Americans, they're just all they want is equality for each other and, and hard

[2:31:54] working, hard working Americans.

[2:31:56] And then you have the other side, you know, let's be fair now, there's another side that

[2:32:00] are calling the other side races, you know, so it becomes a political movement.

[2:32:05] And somewhere in the middle, right, somewhere in the middle is the true cause, the true

[2:32:10] people, the African Americans and the minorities that stand to benefit from this.

[2:32:16] You have one side claiming Marxism, another side claiming racism, and then you have in the

[2:32:23] middle, this one side that all they want is equality.

[2:32:29] I have no problem with the signs,

[2:32:32] but hand store in these meetings, you know, with Carmen Lundy and Louis Ponds, coming up

[2:32:39] and saying that, you know, to them the signs don't have any kind of relevance to them. To

[2:32:45] To me, it just puts the signs in a hands of political, you know, local politics, you know.

[2:32:54] And, you know, to me, it means equality, to me, it means fairness.

[2:32:58] And without the backing of the African-American community, and to me, I look at Carmen London

[2:33:03] and Louis Ponds as the backing to this, to these signs.

[2:33:08] So, I mean, that's one of the things that to me is what I took out of this meeting.

[2:33:15] So, I will, I will relinquish and give it up and listen again and then I'll cast my vote.

[2:33:33] Nancy, you'll have to unmute yourself.

[2:33:36] There you go.

[2:33:36] If I speak next,

[2:33:45] let's say I'm on YouTube.

[2:33:49] No, you're good. You're good.

[2:33:50] You go ahead.

[2:33:53] Thank you so much.

[2:33:54] I want to say that I was listening to everybody.

[2:33:59] And I came at this tonight thinking I want to listen to Ms.

[2:34:03] Lundy. And I want to listen to Mr. Ponds.

[2:34:06] And I want to see what they think of being in the thick.

[2:34:09] Because they really are up close and personal in the thick of this.

[2:34:12] because they made the request. But as I read all the emails and as I listen to everybody's

[2:34:18] impassioned arguments, I am also feeling responsible for my own conscience. And the mayor and I

[2:34:26] and probably all the other commissioners were invited to St. Paul AME Church 2018. We were invited

[2:34:33] to red-weight blue week or day and I went mayor you were there also. They welcomed us, they fed us,

[2:34:41] they sign with us, they encourage communication.

[2:34:45] So to Commissioner Zodger's point, this isn't new.

[2:34:49] This is something the African American community

[2:34:51] also reached out personally to us, to engage us.

[2:34:55] So that was point one, I got a picnic basket

[2:34:57] and a proclamation about my leadership.

[2:35:00] Those are in my conscience with Mr. Lundy and Ms. Lundy

[2:35:05] and Mr. Ponds.

[2:35:06] A second point is my friend Melvin Fort passed away in 2018 and I went to his visitation.

[2:35:13] I don't believe I could go to the funeral, but I heard reports.

[2:35:17] I saw hundreds of people in line to greet the family.

[2:35:20] Melvin was an African-American native of safety harbor and he started activities with AA, I believe.

[2:35:28] And there were black and white people in hundreds.

[2:35:31] I heard also at the funeral.

[2:35:32] So I also have those folks in my conscience, not just black people, but white people who stood up for Melbourne.

[2:35:40] So I'm thinking if I go back on these signs, I might go back on Melbourne.

[2:35:44] And I'm also thinking of Curtis Curtis from our board and Curtis from our neighborhood family center.

[2:35:53] And how that lecture to welcome us who were able to go to the funeral.

[2:35:57] and they want to engage with us and I'm just curious what message that would give if I said, okay, everybody's really making it very unpleasant for Mr. Ponds and Ms. Lundy.

[2:36:09] I want to support them so I'm going to back off on the sign. My conscience isn't there. My conscience is sticking with our initial decision and thank you very much.

[2:36:22] I started this by saying through on an idea of changing the word black to African American,

[2:36:31] and listen to 50 people, everyone is stuck with their focus point.

[2:36:38] I don't see any compromise. I see it all as just a focus of either,

[2:36:43] we feel that this has to change one way or we feel this has to change the other.

[2:36:47] And the concern is for the black community in between how they're going to react to this

[2:36:54] or be treated because of this.

[2:36:57] I appreciate Louis Ponds and Carmen Lundy's comments.

[2:37:03] And I certainly hope that they participate or wish to participate in the diversity committee.

[2:37:13] they speak very strongly. Louis Ponds, as was mentioned, he works at the community

[2:37:24] center as a coach. He was my son's coach last summer in basketball. He's a man of

[2:37:30] integrity. Carmen, very strong points. There's part of me that says why are they

[2:37:40] saying that and saying that just to get past this because there's diversity and there's issues,

[2:37:46] it will make it harder for them.

[2:37:50] But then there's also the point of as I brought up that there's

[2:37:54] the difference between the idea and the political organization and what we talked about initially was

[2:38:04] the idea and the idea still stands that there is no that black lives do matter all lives matter.

[2:38:13] And I mentioned that about change in the name just to kind of get the focus off and it didn't go

[2:38:19] anywhere. And adding extra all lives matter on the sign didn't go anywhere either. So I think the

[2:38:26] focus is is that people are pretty much set in their views. There's going to be a lot of discussion

[2:38:32] that needs to get done. There's a lot of education that needs to be done. There's a lot of forward

[2:38:37] process that needs to be done. And stepping backwards, I don't think is the way to get it done.

[2:38:57] Mayor, you're muted. Yeah, Mayor, you're muted. Okay. So just vice mayor, what is when you say stepping back,

[2:39:04] what is stepping backwards me? Well, if I think we're moving the signs. Okay.

[2:39:11] I mean, I like the idea of

[2:39:13] the center sign. I mean anything that supports unity. I don't know whether or

[2:39:22] not you remove the black life sign but then you put unity saying look how

[2:39:29] unified we are but we all know what just went on so it's not really that

[2:39:32] unified. You know we need to I think continue this conversation. I mean there's

[2:39:39] There's lots of little, there's steps and there's necessary ways to discuss and to move ahead and you know.

[2:39:55] I mean, the idea was to put it up for 60 days, I don't know if you want to put it for 60, want to leave it at 30.

[2:40:00] I mean, those kind of things are fine, but I think it's important to.

[2:40:03] But to keep.

[2:40:08] Right.

[2:40:10] Let me just say this.

[2:40:11] I think all of our hearts are in the right place.

[2:40:13] I'm not questioning anybody's motives.

[2:40:15] There were anybody's heart is.

[2:40:16] I think we're all booking.

[2:40:18] I think we all share the same goal,

[2:40:20] which is racial awareness,

[2:40:22] which is more diversity,

[2:40:24] which is more inclusion in the city.

[2:40:27] And, you know, I think that's a good thing.

[2:40:29] That we all want the same thing.

[2:40:30] I think where we diverge a little bit is when we get down

[2:40:33] to the strategy and the tactics.

[2:40:36] I call this meeting because I think by any objective measure, well one I call it because

[2:40:42] a lot of people never had the right or never had the option or opportunity to weigh in

[2:40:46] on this subject and they wanted to weigh in and I thought it was only fair to give everybody

[2:40:51] a chance to be heard before we continue a course of action.

[2:40:56] But I also call the meeting because I think if we're focused on the goal and I just said

[2:41:01] with the goals where, you know, racial awareness, inclusion, diversity, we, I think we can

[2:41:09] object, we need to, at this point, objectively ask ourselves, are we, is the course of action

[2:41:14] that is the path that we're on achieving that goal? Or is the path that we're on taking

[2:41:21] us away from that goal?

[2:41:25] And I think, by most objective means, even though, to Commissioner

[2:41:29] address point, it got the conversation started. It's also a headline-grabbing move that,

[2:41:37] and yet it got the conversation started, but to the vice mayor's point, people are stuck in

[2:41:43] their positions. I don't see anybody changing their views from the audience I've heard.

[2:41:51] Actually, the only people that have heard that have been open to changing strategy and tactics to

[2:41:57] meet the goal are Lewis Ponds and Carmen Lundy.

[2:42:02] So I ask ourselves if they're recognizing the path we're not, the path that we're on

[2:42:06] right now is not working, then I really need to beg the question to the rest of the commission

[2:42:13] and say, you know, we have this important work ahead of us on the diversity board.

[2:42:18] This, what's going on now is a distraction.

[2:42:21] It's grabbing headlines, it's grabbing quick attention, it's getting people writing emails.

[2:42:26] But the work towards progress, the thousand-mile journey, as Carmen Lundy said, is going to include

[2:42:34] it's going to be a long path of constant engagement.

[2:42:39] And as long as we're getting distracted in talking about the meaning of Black Lives Matter,

[2:42:45] what's the difference between the organization and the movement?

[2:42:48] We're sucking all the energy and all the oxygen out of the room,

[2:42:51] And we're not allowing people to come together and focus and have real meaningful dialogue and engage with one another and get past three words on a yard sign.

[2:43:03] That's what this is right now. It's three words on a yard sign and people are staking their flag in the ground, adding it about three words.

[2:43:11] I think we really need if we're serious about making progress on this issue.

[2:43:16] If we're serious about addressing it, we're willing to do the work when nobody's looking.

[2:43:22] When we're not getting media attention or the Tampa Bay Times isn't writing a story about it,

[2:43:27] when things are quiet and we don't have a hundred people on a meeting to see what we're going to do,

[2:43:33] it's when we engage the people and get them to go to the diversity board,

[2:43:37] instead of meetings and engage over a course of months or years if that's what it takes

[2:43:42] to understand each other, to communicate with each other.

[2:43:45] I think that's what really needs to be done.

[2:43:48] And to be honest, I don't know if the word is, I'll say it, I'm disappointed that we

[2:43:56] are focused on a sign in three words and I really think this has taken attention away from

[2:44:04] a really worthy course of action because nothing was done overnight.

[2:44:08] The civil rights movement didn't happen overnight.

[2:44:11] You know, other important progress on, you know, diversity in addressing racial

[2:44:17] issues. Nothing happened overnight. So after 60 days, we need to ask ourselves,

[2:44:22] where are we going to be? Are people going to be more open to engaging after that

[2:44:28] 60 days? Is this the way to win hearts and minds? I mean, maybe there's racism in the

[2:44:34] city. From what I heard, there's, there is racism in the city. Is this how we win

[2:44:39] those people over? Isn't that the goal to win people's hearts and minds over? Or is it to make a

[2:44:45] statement? And I submit to everybody, the goal should not be to make a statement that's going to,

[2:44:52] you know, just grab headlines. The goal should be, let's make progress on this issue.

[2:45:02] I think everybody is a look inside and ask ourselves, what's more important making a statement or making progress? And to me, that's what this boils down. So I stand by my proposal to put a sign up there that talks about unity.

[2:45:20] I would take the, I submit that the commissioners,

[2:45:22] I would not completely represent what our city attorney,

[2:45:27] Nikki Deicent, that I think this will open the door to request

[2:45:31] in potential litigation if we turn down other signs,

[2:45:36] but that's how I feel, and I'll turn it back over

[2:45:40] to whoever wants to jump in.

[2:45:42] Does anyone feel that the change of the name to change the focus

[2:45:47] to African-American versus Black as any issue here in trying to separate and distance

[2:45:56] from the difference between the topic and the organization.

[2:46:02] Right.

[2:46:03] And to that, I would just say after speaking with Nikki Day in Alan Zimmer earlier, they

[2:46:08] talked about non-governmental messages, and they use the words segmented messages.

[2:46:15] And when you segment it to a particular race,

[2:46:18] then you open it up to other segments,

[2:46:21] whether it be, I mean, pick your,

[2:46:23] I mean, pick your, but we've heard other people

[2:46:24] during the course of this meeting suggest other signs.

[2:46:28] I think you're quite frankly, Vice Mayor,

[2:46:29] I think you're just trying to, you know,

[2:46:32] just, you know, split the difference.

[2:46:36] And I think we really need to just figure out,

[2:46:39] you know, what's best for the city

[2:46:40] and what's best to move this issue forward.

[2:46:42] I just want to maybe clarify a few points that may be helpful.

[2:46:49] First, I think Commissioner Zadro, your points about government speech and speech that's

[2:46:54] exclusively of the city, is one part of what I was talking about before and is an important

[2:46:59] part.

[2:47:00] I think that's much better established by a written policy which going into the July 20

[2:47:05] meeting and going into tonight, we don't have.

[2:47:09] So my recommendation would be to develop that policy so that it's clear that the message is exclusively from the city.

[2:47:17] It is not a public information channel that is being used as a forum for free expression, which is one of the larger concerns mayor.

[2:47:27] not just of obviously certain community recognitions that we have will highlight different members

[2:47:36] of our community, particularly if it's minority members of the community. We have African-American

[2:47:44] history month in February. We have National Women's History Month in March. We have Asian-Pacific

[2:47:50] American Heritage Month at different points in the year. So we do have community recognitions

[2:47:56] that will focus on education and promotion and different public information with regard to specific

[2:48:03] segments of your population. So I don't want to report that if you have a block history month,

[2:48:14] and that means you're required now to establish months for every different segment of community.

[2:48:19] But the importance is how those decisions are made and developed, certainly after the discussion on Monday and after this discussion, the commission could decide we want to keep this exclusively a voice and a channel that's used by the city and to promote our city initiatives and the city could determine that

[2:48:49] as commissioner Zadro and the mayor and others have pointed out that this has been a long

[2:48:56] long discussed city initiative it was not something that even just came up on on Monday night

[2:49:01] but has been something that's been discussed for a long period of time which was why when I started out

[2:49:06] my comments at the beginning of the meeting I referenced that I viewed the discussion in line with

[2:49:12] that government speech, but in light of the various different interpretations of the

[2:49:22] message that the city sought to display. And in light of the fact that we don't have

[2:49:29] a policy right now, the better course would be to adopt a policy establishing how you're

[2:49:38] going to go about making those decisions and what you want to put out as city initiatives.

[2:49:43] And if you even want to use temporary signage for that message as opposed to flag polls

[2:49:50] and other official announcements and information channels. So that is part of a much larger discussion,

[2:49:59] but I guess I wanted to lay that out again to say if the commission did want to discuss

[2:50:07] the specific exclusive message coming only from the city that they wanted to display and I think the mayor mentioned some options at the beginning of the meeting about a totally different sign developed by all of you as you sit here of what exactly you wanted to say and I've heard a lot of similar messages expressed by each of you about equality and about inclusion and fairness and the city's diversity.

[2:50:35] the initiative overall for social and racial inclusion

[2:50:40] specifically into downtown.

[2:50:44] I think you can do that,

[2:50:46] but I would suggest that we also have

[2:50:48] a agenda item for an upcoming meeting

[2:50:53] where you discuss developing a written policy

[2:50:56] on how you're going to make those decisions.

[2:50:59] That is a little bit different than the scenario

[2:51:03] you sit in today because it seems like the current pending request is a result of a specific

[2:51:11] request from a third party. So to keep that internal to the city, you all should first

[2:51:16] decide what you want it to say, and then secondly decide how you're going to make those

[2:51:24] types of determinations. Does that make sense?

[2:51:28] What would be your professional opinion then in that particular case?

[2:51:33] It sounds like the idea would be to remove the signs temporarily until we set that in place

[2:51:41] and then re-address it and if the similar idea comes out to then put the signs back out

[2:51:49] or some similar sign that in that case you have this in place and you're not setting a precedent

[2:51:57] prior. Is that what you said?

[2:52:05] I'm not suggesting that you I think what I said is if the intent is

[2:52:10] the sign as currently designed and word it is meant to be exclusively from the city not the request

[2:52:17] of any third party or community member requests,

[2:52:22] then the

[2:52:27] city commission could determine to keep that sign.

[2:52:36] Or I think that the mayor also suggested some other ideas

[2:52:41] that he had for language of a city initiative sign.

[2:52:47] So my opinion would be to make it an exclusively a city decision, and that doesn't necessarily,

[2:53:09] does that make sense? I'm not necessarily saying that your exclusive city decision means you have to take the sign down, but then you should sort of

[2:53:17] take it to make sure it's an accurate expression of what the city initiative that you have sought to achieve.

[2:53:28] Will you say we need to be the conceptual design of the sign?

[2:53:34] Correct.

[2:53:34] Okay.

[2:53:36] Okay.

[2:53:39] Mayor.

[2:53:41] Yes.

[2:53:42] Can you hear me?

[2:53:43] I with the legal ease, no offense to mistake, but my passion in rebuttal to your former

[2:53:51] statement about our making a statement has been a little dulled and perhaps that's a good

[2:53:57] thing.

[2:53:58] But when I want to put out there and what I want to say about that word statement is that there's

[2:54:03] movement in Pinellas County called FAST. I believe it's faith and strength

[2:54:09] together or faith are stronger together and they have these meetings that's

[2:54:14] an ecumenical organizations all different faiths and they meet and they get

[2:54:19] politicians to make a statement to make a stand and when I first heard about this

[2:54:24] probably 10 or 15 years ago I remember thinking that's just superficial that's

[2:54:31] just there's just putting the politicians on spot,

[2:54:35] like you said in the media

[2:54:36] and making them stand up for something.

[2:54:38] And it's superficial and it's wrong and wrong.

[2:54:41] But my attitude changed because they affected change.

[2:54:46] They got together and they got politicians to make a stand,

[2:54:49] whether it's education, whether it's reading,

[2:54:51] whether it's housing.

[2:54:52] So when all of them got together in unity

[2:54:55] and made a stand, it was good.

[2:54:57] So I just wanted to say to you in my defense,

[2:55:00] I'm not just simply making a statement by saying my conscience says stick with my decision.

[2:55:05] It's a reason I've listened to all of the people speaking and I've listened to their arguments

[2:55:12] and I've looked at my own conscience and I've decided this time should stay so thank you

[2:55:17] for listening.

[2:55:20] Yeah, let me add something else that I wish I would have said beforehand.

[2:55:23] And obviously these signs need the backing

[2:55:28] of our African-American leaders,

[2:55:31] Carmen Lundey and Louis Ponds.

[2:55:34] And without that backing, I think they have a little bit

[2:55:41] more knowledge.

[2:55:43] And I think that it comes back to like,

[2:55:46] they are in the middle of this battle.

[2:55:48] They've been in it.

[2:55:50] They know what unintended consequences

[2:55:52] can happen. For some reason, it doesn't have to be shared, but I trust their thoughts and opinions.

[2:56:04] The more I think about it, the more I'm going to lean. I'm here to support the African-American community.

[2:56:12] If they want the signs on, I will support them 100%. If they feel there's going to be unintended consequences, let's not put it up.

[2:56:22] let's back up a little bit. We got the diversity council that we're

[2:56:29] formulating and then we will do everything in our power as a commission to

[2:56:34] help them advance in some other way but they are on the right side of history and

[2:56:40] so are we you know and I think that sometimes sometimes you have to take a step

[2:56:45] back, you know, in order to advance even further. And that's my soul. And that's the only

[2:56:56] reason I'm making this decision is because I want their support. And I respect them for

[2:57:02] their decision. They're taking the high road unlike a lot of other people, you know, in

[2:57:09] Now

[2:57:17] I would just reiterate, I mean, the goal is to engage the community and get people involved.

[2:57:24] And if we have Carmen Mundi and Louis Pond suggesting a unity sign rather than the Black Lives Matter Center,

[2:57:32] they like the idea of us passing a resolution, condemning racism in all of its forms.

[2:57:38] So they can say the City Commission passes a resolution.

[2:57:42] and we are adamantly against any kind of racism in this city.

[2:57:46] And then we put our efforts towards the diversity board.

[2:57:51] And let's, I mean, if we want to do signs, fine.

[2:57:54] Let's do signs, but let's do it in the context of a policy.

[2:58:00] And we can ask the diversity board and

[2:58:02] we can charge the diversity board with leading the effort on that policy.

[2:58:07] And if through that process, they come up with a, you know, they decide they want to go down that road.

[2:58:15] I think it gives us a little more context to keep things in perspective and to make a decision going forward.

[2:58:23] But I agree with what Commissioner Diaz is saying is I think we also need to listen to the African American community on this one.

[2:58:30] If they're telling us signs are not the answer, even though the message, I mean, I will

[2:58:39] be clear, they were very clear.

[2:58:40] They stand behind the Black Lives Matter message in the movement, but they're just saying

[2:58:46] the tactics are not exactly what's helping achieve that goal and that goal and I'm paraphrasing.

[2:58:55] Isn't it upon us to listen to them?

[2:58:57] Is it about time we start listening to them?

[2:59:02] Yes, let's call.

[2:59:04] There's the open in the room.

[2:59:05] I mean, should we be listening to them?

[2:59:07] Or I mean.

[2:59:09] What am I missing here?

[2:59:10] So I don't know.

[2:59:13] Alternate advice mayor.

[2:59:14] I think I'm going to turn over to you because I think we have two that are.

[2:59:17] Want to keep them to that are looking to.

[2:59:19] Focus on the diversity board.

[2:59:21] And you know, look at a policy in the context of the diversity board.

[2:59:26] so well I was free. I think that what Carlos just was saying and you

[2:59:37] know what let me

[2:59:38] connect with you in one second what's that you was ponds his hand up again so why don't

[2:59:43] we let him we're gonna let viewers weigh in because I just saw his hand.

[2:59:51] Lewis are you there?

[2:59:53] Yes, I'm here. Can you guys hear me here yet? Thank you. You're still listening in here

[3:00:00] Yeah, just want to make one thing clear. Yeah, I did send, I do, or I do stand by the sign that I did request it. Okay, get that, that, that part straight. But for the most part, this has been overwhelming. Not moving with the traction that I want. What I do like now is that my cedar, my city leaders are listening. My city leaders are listening to me and Carmen's pride, which is the greatest thing.

[3:00:29] what I do hate is that I shouldn't say that I hate. I hate the arguments of that you guys

[3:00:38] think we're taking a step back. Definitely not a step back. What I do hate is that just

[3:00:46] due to appease the mob and move forward with progress, we're conceding to and we're open

[3:00:55] and I shouldn't say conceiting, we're open to change.

[3:00:59] That's the only thing, but yeah, I do stand behind my side,

[3:01:03] but the main thing is I am open to change

[3:01:05] and the main thing is you guys are listening.

[3:01:08] And let's take this the same energy

[3:01:10] and put it towards action in Unite City.

[3:01:15] And that's what I wanted to reiterate

[3:01:18] as I've been listening to these last couple of hours.

[3:01:23] The way this meeting's been broadcasted.

[3:01:24] So, thank you.

[3:01:28] Thank you.

[3:01:30] Well, what I was going to say is, you know,

[3:01:33] the point is you've got five white commissioners

[3:01:38] telling what the right direction forward is.

[3:01:42] And, you know, even though,

[3:01:44] and everyone's heavy of heart of what's been done in the past

[3:01:49] and trying to figure what's the right answer to go forward.

[3:01:52] And there is something to be said for asking the people that potentially could be most impacted by the decision, what they think, and the best approach.

[3:02:07] And obviously you feel you don't want to step backwards because it's not the right thing, but we have the diversity committee.

[3:02:17] We have, I like that the idea of the resolution, something that promotes equality through and we need a way to advance the equality.

[3:02:29] And if they're hope for that, maybe the discussion needs to go to the diversity committee and they come out with some kind of a crafted sign.

[3:02:41] I feel bad for what Carmen was saying if there's some issue that something comes up and

[3:02:47] that's against the black community and then they're coming and arguing and they can't

[3:02:50] do it because of a precedent that we set, and that doesn't help, that that just makes

[3:02:57] it worse.

[3:03:01] Well, you know what?

[3:03:02] Speaking of Carmen Lundy, she has her hand up against her, what, see what she has to say.

[3:03:09] Carmen?

[3:03:09] I just make it short and brief and I understand where all this is about and if we look over the

[3:03:18] time of history it is a point of picking a battle and I guess we and some people may say as a black

[3:03:26] you know generation in time we've rolled over and just accepted things but even Martin Luther King his

[3:03:34] whole concept was to pursue peace. And I do believe peace wins. It's not all about choosing a battle

[3:03:43] of power as much as sometimes giving in is a point of overcoming just to get to the next point.

[3:03:52] And if we stay on this battlefield back and forth, which I felt were open up of the doors, which Andy

[3:03:58] and Ms. Nikki both, you know, addressed, my thing is being proactive. Not down the road,

[3:04:06] we're going to be visiting something of this nature all over again. And that was my whole biggest

[3:04:12] given to, you know, if it takes, let's squash this right now, you know, so that we don't encounter

[3:04:20] these unnecessary battles coming forth that may hinder us at another point. This, I can squash now for

[3:04:28] a bigger cause. And that's what I mean by taking a high road. Not that I don't, I'm grateful

[3:04:34] to all those, you know, folks that came in and standing for the cause, standing for

[3:04:41] the purpose, I get that. But if that is going to be a part that become a hindrance,

[3:04:47] from us going to the point of unity. And that's what needs to be established from going to the point

[3:04:52] of getting this advisory board, diversity board, making those decisions that's really

[3:04:58] going to be about the change, I just want to get there.

[3:05:02] And if saying, hey, take the high roll on this, y'all, we get it, okay, it's a sign, but

[3:05:08] that's not where our battle ends.

[3:05:11] We have a greater cause, and sometimes you have to give up something for the greater cause.

[3:05:17] And I would just like to see this as Martin Luther King, if he was here himself is, let's

[3:05:21] just pursue peace, because peace is what's going to make us

[3:05:25] win this, because as long as we stay divided, we cannot win.

[3:05:31] Thank you.

[3:05:34] All right, Vice Mayor, keep interrupting you, but we had

[3:05:38] important people to hear from. So I'll flip it back to you again.

[3:05:46] I think the show of signs are important. I also think the

[3:05:51] support of those who the signs are supposed to support is

[3:05:56] important. It's a funny edge to be sitting on.

[3:06:02] I think I think I would like to go with the idea

[3:06:08] that if the community supports it, I'll support it, and if not, I think it's best. What she said

[3:06:15] was just it's

[3:06:19] an excellent position of compromise, a very difficult one from her perspective.

[3:06:31] It's

[3:06:31] to understand that she's looking for the next

[3:06:35] and the bigger win.

[3:06:37] And all I can say is if we pull those signs,

[3:06:40] we've been a damn sure get those

[3:06:41] that committee set up quick and move in that direction.

[3:06:46] So we can at least begin those discussions

[3:06:48] because otherwise the battle would be for nothing.

[3:06:55] Do I like to see the committee set up?

[3:07:00] I mean, we already passed it, but I mean, to get people

[3:07:03] will lined up and get that moving along in the discussion on this.

[3:07:08] And in that case, I think I agree with what Carlos was saying.

[3:07:13] And I think what's the mayor was saying that we listen to the black community on this one.

[3:07:21] Or at least the representatives that have expressed an opinion on it and go with what they think.

[3:07:28] Okay, so I'm going to make a motion.

[3:07:30] And I think we kind of figured out where everyone stands on this one.

[3:07:35] I'm going to make a motion that we replace the signs that are at on city property right

[3:07:41] now with signs that say safety harbor stands united.

[3:07:51] If possible, I would like to see if we can use the graphic that was on the event that we

[3:08:00] on the program that Louis Ponce put together with the different colored hands

[3:08:06] class together making a heart assuming there's no patent infringement on that.

[3:08:10] If we're not allowed to use that image, I would just say for the timing we just

[3:08:18] put a sign up that says safety harbor stands united.

[3:08:23] I would also I would

[3:08:26] It also suggests that we do not replace the sign until the unity sign is ready.

[3:08:33] I don't want it's signed to come down with nothing there.

[3:08:35] I'd like it to be, you know, a replacement.

[3:08:39] I'd also include this notion that we direct the city manager to draft a resolution that

[3:08:48] is similar to that of the one that Deneet and did that talked about, you know, condemning

[3:08:55] racism and all of its forms in safety harbor and then we focus our attention on the diversity

[3:09:03] board and we see we open up to them if they want to move forward with a policy to allow

[3:09:08] signs of different segmented groups within city on city property so that's my motion.

[3:09:17] What about including the words just as for all or something like that on that sign?

[3:09:22] Are

[3:09:26] we doing another sign without looking at it or talking it over or putting it on an agenda and inviting people to comment on it?

[3:09:37] Question.

[3:09:41] Well, go ahead. I think I don't know who the question was for.

[3:09:45] Technically, we don't have a second to discuss the motion.

[3:09:49] So someone wants to second it for purposes of discussion.

[3:10:01] Motion fails.

[3:10:05] Commissioner Diaz. So there's, I mean, I think the mayor's to make a motion is still. I mean, we've had now to three, three and a half hours of public comment on this item.

[3:10:17] It's been noticed as a special meeting in more than more than the amount of time called for by the charter more than the amount of time recommended for a sunshine law for the sunshine law purposes.

[3:10:31] So I wouldn't have an issue with the commission developing or moving forward with an alternative

[3:10:41] message if that's what it would like to display in the meantime.

[3:10:47] One thing I wanted to mention about Ms. Lundy's comment because I think it was another good

[3:10:52] one and kind of spoke about something commissioner Zadra brought up and something the mayor brought

[3:10:57] which was about if the commission received, for example, an additional request tomorrow from the

[3:11:05] Ku Klux Klan to put a sign up, that would be something that she and others in the city would

[3:11:11] want taken down. And without the policy developed, it would be a much more difficult action to defend,

[3:11:21] to deny others the right to make other similar requests so that the concept of developing the

[3:11:27] sign yourself is a good approach and as well then developing the policy so that you'll have that

[3:11:35] support to keep your city initiatives city led. You'll have the resource of your newly created

[3:11:44] and hopefully energetic and energized diversity advisory board. So you'll have the ability to

[3:11:50] keep those as city as as official city initiatives and not you know some of the the back of Fort and Fort that we've now gone through in the six or so hours of public comment on this item.

[3:12:05] So I just wanted to point out those comments to the commissioners is I think that might be helpful.

[3:12:11] and the mayor, I'm sorry to take over for a minute.

[3:12:15] You're welcome to make another motion or the commission

[3:12:20] really just needs consensus here,

[3:12:22] although you can only do, you know, consensus

[3:12:24] if it's unanimous.

[3:12:25] So in

[3:12:29] your statement,

[3:12:31] Ms. Day, who would make the sign?

[3:12:37] I mean, it started with the mayor

[3:12:39] throwing a couple of ideas out.

[3:12:41] And of course, Carlos then asked,

[3:12:43] are we making the sign here?

[3:12:44] I mean, if we go through that process, I mean, is it the committee or, you know, the committee hasn't been set up yet, and that could be, you know, a few weeks a month before that would get done.

[3:12:59] Who would be the group? Would we be doing it here on the commission in an open meeting like this kind of a thing, or would we be able to have staff put some ideas together and then come back and review it?

[3:13:15] I don't want to speak for the capabilities of Mr. Spor's staff, but I imagine if the city had an in-house person that could take the commission's idea and develop it into a sign that could be one option.

[3:13:33] There's not the requirement that it come to the commission for a vote.

[3:13:41] Again, this is kind of one of the reasons why I really recommend having a policy that we're following.

[3:13:48] So I think that with what the mayor just described,

[3:13:55] I think it was sufficient to say the language that you wanted to see and the visual and the important thing there is, it's been entirely developed by the mayor and the city.

[3:14:12] So that was why I was comfortable if that's the direction the commission wants to move forward in in the interim to place.

[3:14:23] a sign there at your direction at the, um, with the language that the commission wants to see,

[3:14:31] and any visuals that the commission wants to see, but that it moved forward toward a discussion

[3:14:40] on a written policy. That's what I understood the mayor's proposal to be, and I think that's

[3:14:46] consistent with what he discussed at the beginning of the meeting as well.

[3:14:50] I'm going to ask Carmen wanted to chime back in.

[3:14:54] Carmen, are you there?

[3:14:56] I just want to ask Mayor, didn't Louis have an original-

[3:15:00] No sign, he has submitted before this sign. I thought there was two signs in the beginning. Would that other sign be optional or something to consider? Are you talking about the moment the fists in the air? I thought it was a circle like when he used on the unity program he used for the event. It was like all the hands, I wanted to like. It had the hands class they were making a heart and the only the only thing I kind of qualified my emotion.

[3:15:29] for was because when I'm speaking in Matt about it, he just want to make sure that there's no copyright

[3:15:35] issues preventing us from using that image. So, I mean, yeah, I think that's the first choice of

[3:15:42] to make the motion would be use that image if we can if there's no copyright issues. But if there is

[3:15:48] a copyright issue, then I would, I mean, I don't want to sit here all night with the five of us designing

[3:15:52] a sign, but I would just ask city staff to take the spirit of this conversation,

[3:15:58] and take the words that we're telling them

[3:16:01] and just come up with something.

[3:16:04] And if the image can't be came up with when the next,

[3:16:09] you know, isn't ready by tomorrow,

[3:16:10] then we just put up a temporary sign

[3:16:12] and so we come up with a couple of images

[3:16:16] to vote on on our next meeting.

[3:16:17] And then we could vote on an image in our next meeting.

[3:16:20] So that's kind of where my head is on that.

[3:16:42] Are you still there?

[3:16:46] Let me see the hand up any more.

[3:16:48] All right.

[3:16:49] So could

[3:16:59] I make a request mayor?

[3:17:03] Yeah.

[3:17:05] Would you please separate the idea of the resolution similar to Dunedin's from the sign issue. Could that be two separate consensus or votes please?

[3:17:17] Absolutely.

[3:17:18] Thank you.

[3:17:22] Let me toss an easy one out, I'll make a motion to have the city manager draft a resolution

[3:17:30] condemning racism in all of its forms to be monitored off the one done in Dunedin.

[3:17:36] Second.

[3:17:38] Okay, all those in favor say I in raise your hand.

[3:17:41] I.

[3:17:42] All those opposed say nay.

[3:17:44] Motion passes five zero.

[3:17:47] back to the sign issue. I feel like we have three of us on the same page. I'm not sure what's.

[3:17:54] If I need to reward the motion or if I need is anybody need more clarity that I'm leaving out.

[3:18:00] Yeah, could you restate it?

[3:18:02] Yeah, so it'd be a motion to replace segmented signs that are on city property right now with a non-segmented sign.

[3:18:12] reading safety harbor stands united and using the image that Louis Ponds used on his program for the unity rally in June of the hands with different colors of shaded skin, clasped in the heart.

[3:18:31] And if that image is for whatever reason copyrighted and we can't use it to just.

[3:18:36] Just come up with a blank sign with those words safety harbor stands united and asked staff to then come up with some ideas of images that we can use that we can vote on as a commission at the next city commission meeting.

[3:19:06] Well, seconded.

[3:19:10] Okay.

[3:19:11] Thank you.

[3:19:14] Ms. Simmons, you haven't spoken.

[3:19:16] Can we discuss this before we have the vote?

[3:19:19] Sure.

[3:19:21] All right. My only thoughts are,

[3:19:24] Lewis, he had mentioned that he still supported the sign.

[3:19:29] And I'll go on record saying that I would,

[3:19:32] I would change the signs.

[3:19:35] I would support changing the signs.

[3:19:36] if I heard that there was a significant number of the African-American community that

[3:19:41] affirmatively did not want that current sign that we have up right now.

[3:19:46] I'm okay changing it if people came in and said they specifically don't want that sign.

[3:19:52] But I haven't heard that and my fear is, my fear is we're going to get day-loosed with a bunch

[3:19:58] of emails again and this is going to come back again and the city will look silly.

[3:20:04] we're going to have these decisions going back and forth, so I'm just putting everybody on notice

[3:20:09] that I think there's going to be a bunch more emails and, you know, we can ignore them and move on

[3:20:16] with our lives, but I just wanted to throw that out there because I didn't hear anybody in the African

[3:20:22] American communities say they affirmatively object to that sign, I'm going to say I'm going to

[3:20:29] position. That's all.

[3:20:32] And Mayor, I'd like to jump on that. I too am really torn. Mr. Ponds sounds conflicted.

[3:20:39] It sounds like he stands by his sign, but he wants to unitate. And I would be appreciative

[3:20:45] too of hearing from a lot more of our community, of our African American black community. Thank

[3:20:54] you. I'm going to stand by my decision until I do so.

[3:21:00] Again, anyone else before I ask Ms. Seymour to call the roll?

[3:21:06] Yeah, I don't mean, listen, if Mr. Ponds and Ms. Long Day, if they supported it, I would support it also.

[3:21:15] I'm going to say it one more time.

[3:21:16] And I hope the reason why they're not going to support it is because they think that there's a lot bigger fish to fry than this.

[3:21:28] which I agree, it's two little signs. It's not a big deal, you know. But, you know, KKK is not going to come in, you know, and, you know, I can tell you that much. I mean, that's, that's not going to happen here.

[3:21:43] you know that I mean there's no way the residents of safety harbor would

[3:21:50] support the KKK or or you know fascist type groups or anything like that.

[3:22:01] I

[3:22:01] just want to say that.

[3:22:06] Okay, so let's Ms. Simmons, do you call the role? We have

[3:22:10] a motion we have a second.

[3:22:17] I'm muted everyone, so let me get her on muted. Oh Karen

[3:22:20] you're unmuted now. Thank you. Mayor A. U.

[3:22:24] Vice Mayor Murrers. Commissioner Zadro.

[3:22:36] Commissioner Vassore.

[3:22:38] May.

[3:22:41] Commissioner D. S.

[3:22:43] Hi. Okay. Motion passes three to two. I just want to say thank you everybody for

[3:22:51] participating again. It was good to have the discussion. I think everybody's heart is in the right

[3:22:57] place and as long as we stay focused on the goal I am confident we're going to move these

[3:23:02] issues forward and I just want to thank especially thank Carmen Lundy and Louis Ponds for everything

[3:23:08] that they've done for sick and they're next out for being knee deep in in this discussion

[3:23:13] so thank you to all of you thank you to everyone on the commission and the residents for joining

[3:23:17] this. Let's take a it's him in a break Matt and then we will do our budget workshop.

CITY COMMISSION - SPECIAL MEETING

Agenda

Transcript