[0:05] All right. Welcome, everyone, to the December 21st, not quite Christmas meeting of the city of

[0:12] Davenport, zoning board adjustment. The zoning board adjustment holds, while the curings to consider

[0:17] the strict application of zoning ordinance for our hearts, appearances, special uses and appeals.

[0:23] I'm Dean Darlin, chairman of the Davenport, zoning board of adjustment. Members present today are

[0:28] from your left to right, my Galliard,

[0:31] Brigitte Boyd Carlson, myself, and Jeff Blumker.

[0:36] Staff present today are our Berkeley and Scott Cope's,

[0:42] and potentially maybe Mallory,

[0:44] Big Beard, attorney, maybe poppin' in.

[0:48] If you have a mobile device, please turn off

[0:51] as it may interfere with the room's electronics.

[0:53] As we conduct our business,

[0:54] we expect that everyone here will conduct themselves

[0:56] and respectful courteous and civil manner.

[0:59] And we'll speak only after being recognized by the chair.

[1:02] The only exception to this standard is that staff is expected

[1:05] to interject when necessary to ensure

[1:07] we are property conducting our business.

[1:09] If I want to wish us to speak on particular agenda,

[1:11] I would immediately provide an opportunity to do so.

[1:15] When recognized by me, please step to the podium,

[1:17] introduce yourself and provide your input.

[1:21] I'll pause here in my notes for a second,

[1:23] say the podium area is important because the microphone

[1:26] directly above it, so that's where you have to speak or won't get picked up. By practice, each person

[1:33] is only permitted, one opportunity to speak, exception to that practice is that my discretion.

[1:39] Of course, if board member asks a question of anyone, you'll be permitted to speak to answer

[1:43] that question, but I'll ask if you keep response a limit to the specific question.

[1:49] Okay, any corrections to the minute from our last meeting?

[1:57] If none,

[1:57] If none might have a motion to approve.

[2:02] Motion to approve.

[2:04] Second.

[2:08] Second.

[2:10] Okay.

[2:10] All in favor.

[2:12] Aye.

[2:12] Opposed.

[2:14] Motion passes.

[2:15] First order of business.

[2:18] Is request.

[2:20] S U 2 3 dash is 0 2.

[2:24] A 53 luxury LLC at 2021.

[2:29] in 1911, 2131, East 53rd, Street in Devinport to operate vehicle dealership with outdoor

[2:35] storage and display table 17.08-1, requires especially use for vehicle dealership with outdoor

[2:44] storage of display on property zone C3, General Commercial District, and this is in

[2:57] So we can start off with the staff report, please.

[3:01] Scott Coats, DNS.

[3:04] This request is here before us because the zoning code is deemed that the outdoor storage areas of vehicle displays should have extra review.

[3:14] This property, as a background information, was resumed from C1,

[3:20] two C3 district in November of 23, which allows us to have the special use permit today.

[3:31] This map shows the location of where the proposed site plans going to be for the new car dealership.

[3:39] The area that resumed is a little bit larger, it included the area down here.

[3:45] This is just an area photo of it.

[3:48] The previous slide was the zoning map.

[3:53] And as you are probably aware, there are two other auto-dealer buildings adjacent to the west.

[4:03] This is the proposed site plan.

[4:05] On the far left is the existing auto-dealer.

[4:09] Three buildings here for dealerships and support building in back with admin and car wash.

[4:18] The green here at the bottom is approximately 80 feet.

[4:22] It's built in as a buffer.

[4:24] It's equivalent to the buffer that is adjacent to the west.

[4:31] When I get into my conditions and recommendation, I will talk to you about this issue here.

[4:39] Staff is recommending that the types of islands that are existing to the west would

[4:44] carried over to the islands for the new dealerships, and there's five spots where we've

[4:51] been like additional islands.

[4:56] We did our notification procedures, 54.

[5:00] For notices were sent, we have not received any written or email or voice communications regarding

[5:08] this topic.

[5:12] Our findings,

[5:19] the petitioners proposed location and design meet special use requirements.

[5:24] The use is compatible with adjacent land uses and types of development, and the proposed special use in accordance

[5:29] is in accordance with a special use criteria as condition.

[5:35] Recommendation.

[5:38] Staff recommends the board adopt staff's findings and approve SU23-02 subject to the following six conditions.

[5:48] Number one, the extent of exhibit A site plan as email to planning staff on November 29, 2023 shall be binding.

[5:55] No dealer uses shall be allowed outside the designated area.

[5:59] The use of additional land to the south and east or any land not shown on the proposed

[6:04] concept plan shall be prohibited without a modification to the special use as per our

[6:09] normal code requirements in section 171450.

[6:15] Condition number two prior to occupancy parking landscape islands shall be consistent with

[6:22] 1777 East 53rd Street.

[6:24] That was the exhibit that I showed earlier with the five landscape islands.

[6:33] to be in the staff report.

[6:40] Condition number three, prior to occupancy,

[6:44] and approved full-site plan,

[6:46] review shall be completed and approved

[6:48] through the City of Devon Hortz E. Plan review.

[6:54] Item number five, all conditions to the Devon Hortz rezoning.

[6:59] No one on the floor, my sorry, thank you.

[7:02] The use of flags, penance, pencils, balloons,

[7:04] and other similar attention getting devices,

[7:06] shall be prohibited.

[7:07] That's number four.

[7:09] Number five, all conditions of deventport rezoning,

[7:12] R AZ-23-03, City Council ordinance,

[7:18] 2023-436, labeled Exhibit Senior Packet,

[7:22] shall remain in full force and impact including

[7:24] but not limited to the location of the car wash

[7:27] at least 125 feet from residential zoning districts,

[7:31] stipulated buffery yards along the north property line

[7:34] of the stone gate development.

[7:37] prohibition of billboards and the implementation of dark sky compliant light fixtures.

[7:43] Finally, condition number six

[7:47] should complains arise due to not compliance of these conditions

[7:51] and where if staff is aware of infractions to these conditions and or any other code violations

[7:56] or if an ownership or management company is changed by more than 50% are rehearing

[8:02] of the special use shall be scheduled for the

[8:04] Dev Important Municipal Code Specifications for Zony Board of

[8:06] Adjustment Special Use hearings, at which

[8:09] the special use may be modified, re-approved or revoked.

[8:13] These conclude Dev report, planning staff,

[8:17] recommended conditions to the approval,

[8:20] and our staff report.

[8:22] Thanks, Scott.

[8:24] Any questions of board members or staff?

[8:27] Well,

[8:31] I'll start.

[8:34] The zoning change in November of this year,

[8:39] prior to that, it was C1.

[8:42] There was a part of it that was residential multifamily as well.

[8:46] The portion that is going to be used for this site plan was

[8:52] totally zoned C1.

[8:54] The property to the south that little weird triangle area,

[8:59] that's where the multiple family was located.

[9:01] Okay, do the other two properties without pump the addresses.

[9:08] I'll say where the Mercedes and then over where the toilet is.

[9:10] There's a ship board that are both now C3 where they see one prior as well

[9:14] where they already see three.

[9:17] They were zoned under a different code, okay.

[9:22] So they are currently C3, I'm trying to get to one, when this land was purchased, what

[9:30] everything was if they may have planned for in their mind.

[9:36] So that's the genesis of those questions.

[9:40] We is in the first recommendation,

[9:46] so the length of the south and south east that we

[9:54] can

[9:54] pull the zoning map with the red and the yellow square.

[9:59] Okay, that works too.

[10:00] So the area to the south and south east, is that property also owned by the same people?

[10:06] It is, and actually, from what we have seen from some of the civil site plan work, it's going to be expanded detention area.

[10:16] So. So the yellow rectangle here shows exactly where the site plan is going to be impacting.

[10:24] The only thing that's ancillary is that drainage, but none of the actual physical uses will be outside of that rectangle.

[10:34] So there are areas being used for water retention.

[10:39] All right, getting there.

[10:43] The third, your third recommendation says prior to occupancy, an approved full site plan refute should be completed.

[10:52] I mean, the plan we need to be approved prior to construction or just prior to occupancy.

[11:02] Pardon?

[11:03] So the way we wrote that is reinforcing that this is the only approval process that this needs.

[11:11] So it will need full site plan, civil review, and approval from other departments in the city.

[11:17] Okay.

[11:19] Is that the way you want to keep it ordered?

[11:22] It's up to you.

[11:23] I just want to just want to make sure it says what we mean it to say if you want to simplify it, we can walk through and then think that it

[11:33] Then the only other question I had was on the in the six bullet ownership management change

[11:39] More than 50% so is it more than 50% or 50% or 50% or more so is it 51%

[11:46] Okay, so 50% okay more than 50 got it those are my only questions. I do have a question

[11:53] Scott, if you could go to the site plan again,

[11:57] you may have mentioned this,

[12:01] but the existing dealership that's there now,

[12:04] is that that buffer's 80 feet now,

[12:07] as proposed to the, okay, so it's the same.

[12:11] Yeah, the existing built buffer is 80 feet, okay.

[12:13] And that's approximate what the other one is as well.

[12:23] So where it ends to the east,

[12:26] how does that relate to the property?

[12:30] So the bus ends, right about there, okay, where that existing retention is, okay.

[13:06] I'm sorry, I couldn't hear.

[13:08] I think because I'm saying it's probably more discussion, and so at this point just you did have

[13:12] a question for staff.

[13:14] Okay.

[13:14] Question for names, no.

[13:15] Okay.

[13:16] The answer is no.

[13:18] Okay.

[13:19] Fair enough.

[13:20] So if I can have the applicant or who are speaking on behalf of the applicant,

[13:23] stuff to the podium please.

[13:30] You can introduce yourself and then make your request.

[13:34] Yeah, my name is John Hoffmar, and with the Aronson Law Group and I represent the applicant,

[13:38] we also have the civil engineer that's working on this with us here today as well as a

[13:43] representative from the dealership. We have been going through a lot of processes as you can see

[13:49] the zoning was changed in November, and so we've kind of moved through this, and I'm not sure what

[13:56] You do know or don't know or do have or don't have other than this, so I would be happy to answer any questions or if you'd like an overview of the site plan, a little bit more from the Civil Engineer, we can do that as well.

[14:10] I think an overview would be good and or you can also, I guess, dubbed off of anything from the staff report, but I would say don't don't rely on what you think we may or may not know this, this needs to stand on its own.

[14:24] Can you go back? Can you change your's back to the general site plan?

[14:28] Sorry,

[14:32] you want to go to the site plan?

[14:33] Yeah, that one, thank you.

[14:35] So the intent here is to continue across, there's already two dealerships in the area, and to continue across those dealership developments to this space along the north.

[14:45] Additionally, as they discussed, the entire southern part, although it got re-zoned because it's one parcel of real estate.

[14:52] and that's kind of how the zoning we were told was going to work with it is being used for retention

[14:57] basin and there's no plan at this point.

[15:15] I would just add that the landscape buffer, we actually took it all the way out past all of those properties. So, it's not, it doesn't end at that retention rate.

[15:29] That goes out to the end of where the corner is and where our base and will then start going back there.

[15:38] Properline drops out.

[15:40] Yeah.

[15:41] It actually goes to that.

[15:43] You can see that line that comes straight up there.

[15:46] It goes to that line.

[15:49] And then the plan here is that we'll have Alexis will build Alexis dealership in line with what the manufacturer requires.

[15:58] similar to if you've ever driven past their the quality and type of dealership that you're seeing there right now with the Audi and BMW Mercedes.

[16:07] Then we'd have a Kia dealership in the blue next to it and the purple would be a Hyundai dealership.

[16:13] Now, one thing that we have to keep in mind when we're doing designs on sites like this is that the national manufacturers have a lot of requirements that they impose upon us on what we are and are not going to do.

[16:24] We have some leeway with that, but a lot of times we are pretty restricted in parking and access to the facility.

[16:34] And so our site plan here is very intentionally designed so that we have the right number of spaces within the right proximity to each of these dealerships so that they can function.

[16:43] In line with the requirements that we're going to be hit with from the national manufacturers in order to actually move forward with this.

[16:51] We are very excited about moving forward and getting these new dealership buildings put up here so that we can move

[16:58] Move our operations over and get kind of a dealer row started here and

[17:04] That's kind of that's all I have right now. I'll ask Eric to come up for a second to speak about the water run-off and how we address it unless you have more questions for your question for you

[17:14] Yeah, we'll see if there's any questions for you before we switch off to Eric

[17:18] Do any of the six recommendations from the city propose any concern to you?

[17:24] The only concern that we have is we've tried to work really closely with the city on the

[17:31] design as we've been working through this and the only concern is the wording involving ownership

[17:37] change.

[17:38] The reason being is that from our perspective if it continues to be operated as a Lexus dealership

[17:47] For example, or a Kia or a Hyundai dealership moving forward, it could be very detrimental

[17:52] to us to have something that says that that's not allowed if it were to be sold to a

[17:58] different operator.

[17:59] Just as an example,

[18:03] who has to abide by all the same rules and regulations and operational

[18:06] stuff that we do, but we're not, we're trying to be as helpful and work work with the

[18:17] big a big problem with that. That's the only thing that's concerning. Otherwise we've, we've

[18:21] even braced the landscape buffer as you can see and all of the other regulations and worked

[18:26] with the city to put those into place, including by increasing the number of trees that we're

[18:31] doing on landscaping buffer as well as trying to do as much as we can to minimize the impact

[18:37] of our site against any of the neighbors. Okay.

[18:42] Thanks for that. So Laura, can I ask, is the,

[18:45] the municipal code as far as if ownership changes that there has to be.

[18:52] No, it's not a municipal code.

[18:53] It's been suggested through legal to help special uses certain.

[18:59] And it doesn't necessarily mean you have to stick with it.

[19:02] Generally certain specific uses, not necessarily dealerships, but more related to other ones in the code.

[19:10] Having an ownership change definitely changes how things are operated.

[19:14] And that's why a re-review is nice, and it would be at your discretion if you choose to strike the ownership pieces that that would be up to you.

[19:24] And just to note, it doesn't state that it wouldn't be allowed. It just states that they would have to go through the same special use process that this current owner is going through.

[19:34] That's what I was asking is like who owns that special use permit once it's granted.

[19:41] So generally in state law, especially uses generally run with the land.

[19:50] And that's why legal has suggested we incorporate a condition related to change about ownership.

[19:58] But it would be your discretion.

[20:00] And maybe more proper of a certain, especially, you says, than other ones.

[20:05] So let me understand that in the way it's the way it's set up right now. It would not go with the land,

[20:11] that the special use permit would not go with the land. There's language in there right now,

[20:16] and needs to be amended in order to allow it to, to know. It's okay.

[20:20] It's okay. All we're saying in this one is that we would want to re-review it.

[20:24] doesn't mean that it wouldn't pass, it would just be a kind of a refresh to make sure everybody's

[20:30] still on the same page. But are you saying we have the option here and now to amend that language

[20:35] so that it wouldn't have to go through or over view? So it would not, especially used runs with the

[20:41] land, if there's no conditions. Okay. If you put this condition on, they would have to come back here,

[20:47] come before you explain how they're operating the business, if there's any changes. Again, as Laura said,

[20:53] It might not be a car or dealership.

[20:55] It might be a different business next time they come before or before.

[20:59] I'm going to take the decisions that I've got you.

[21:02] All right.

[21:03] Thank you.

[21:05] Can I ask you one thing on that?

[21:07] I think our request would be that it that that be impacted

[21:12] if the changing use of the facility were away from being a franchise

[21:17] motor vehicle dealership.

[21:19] For example, if somebody wanted to change it to a used car dealership

[21:23] or if we were trying to change what the use was beyond that.

[21:27] The only reason, and again, we'll cooperate with whatever you guys decide.

[21:32] But the reason I say that is because these are very, very expensive and specialized buildings to build.

[21:41] And the impact in difference could be very, very large, depending on whether or not someone has the ability to continue operating.

[21:54] to Lexus dealership there if it were to just change the operations over ship.

[22:00] So, thank you.

[22:02] Just to clarify, Franchise means one of the OMB regulated car brands.

[22:11] Quick question, sir.

[22:12] So, that these are these are new franchises, so to speak, you're not moving them from

[22:16] somewhere else.

[22:17] These are these are new for this organization.

[22:19] We are relocating the current operations that are over by welcome way.

[22:25] So there is a Kia and a Hyundai dealership there.

[22:28] We do not own those buildings.

[22:29] We do not have the option to buy those buildings and the owners of those buildings.

[22:34] We don't know what they will do with them after that.

[22:37] We are looking to buy these sites, move them here and build new buildings for those franchises

[22:43] here, including the Lexus and Kia and Hyundai.

[22:47] you mentioned in Hyundai, the same whole truth for the Lexus, they don't own that property here.

[22:53] I believe we do own that property.

[22:58] Sorry, that's owned by the same group, this call.

[23:02] Understood, okay.

[23:03] Any other questions?

[23:05] All right.

[23:12] The members of the board, Eric can 2727,

[23:15] South Losner, Boulevard here on behalf of Center Associates.

[23:17] So we're the Civil Engineer in the project.

[23:19] We've been working diligently with staff and everyone here.

[23:22] We are fairly early still in the process, you know,

[23:25] zoning went through recently, now for the special use permit.

[23:29] Working with them, we've got an initial grade plan,

[23:31] some storm management studies into the city, but we understand we have to go to the full

[23:35] site plan process, you know, following this.

[23:37] What I mentioned, we'll be back as far as the approvals go before they can start everything out here.

[23:42] So just to kind of touch on the site,

[23:44] It's a little challenging. Obviously in this view, everything looks flat. The site is anything

[23:50] but flat. Everything does fall to the east. If you've ever been 53rd it kind of dips down the hill.

[23:54] There and there's a big cold or creak right there at the east side. So we've got a lot of great change here to manage.

[23:59] That's one of the things that's been a bit of a challenge. It's also a blessing to the site as well,

[24:04] especially for the residents to the south. They sit up about 10 to 12 feet higher than this property.

[24:10] So, that will provide some natural separation and buffer, and then again, we were also doing the enhanced buffer there on the south property line to continue that same mantra and theme that was done with the regional dealerships.

[24:23] So, consistency is our word here as well as managing the site.

[24:28] So, again, married with the grades on the west side, we're married to the grades up on 53rd of that access point.

[24:33] So, really, kind of those two things set the site grades, everything does fall to the east.

[24:37] There is an existing basin, which I don't know if you put back to maybe the bigger earlier.

[24:43] Existing basin, just kind of the very southeast corner that yellow box.

[24:47] A couple things.

[24:48] We need to make that bigger for stormwater management, and we also need dirt.

[24:52] Because of kind of those elevation challenges on the property.

[24:55] So we're going to be really explaining that basin into that whole parcel that's left over.

[25:00] Here on the south that they own that will completely be used for storm management for the site. There will never be any ability to expand the dealership or anything. They're just from a physical standpoint. So when they say everything will be contained within the yellow box, that is very true, because we need all that dirt to be able to kind of get all the grades and everything to balance out on the property.

[25:18] So what amazement will happen there.

[25:20] We've been working with staff on that.

[25:21] We've got an initial grade plan and storm order study into the staff.

[25:25] I'm knowing that's a very important part of this project.

[25:29] Something that's been very consistent for the beginning.

[25:32] We've also got information to the core for the Cree, as far as managing some wetlands on

[25:36] sites.

[25:36] So we're working all those things early.

[25:38] We know they take time.

[25:39] We know they're important.

[25:41] But obviously before we go full boron, kind of detailing every handicap ramp and parking

[25:46] We want to make sure that the use is allowed, so obviously that's where we're here tonight.

[25:53] So happy answer questions, you guys have heard.

[25:54] Sure, so that entire property will drain basically to the southeast, correct?

[25:59] It actually kind of goes do east and then it'll go south.

[26:03] The site will sit up about 20, 15 to 20 feet higher than that creek.

[26:07] So how does the existing dealership, does that drain to the west?

[26:11] No, that all drains to the east and it's currently serving the current dealership.

[26:16] It was, it was size two.

[26:18] Yeah, this might help another contour.

[26:20] It will hard to see that, okay.

[26:22] This all falls this way.

[26:23] There's some existing water quality basins here.

[26:26] And then it's all kind of pipe down to this basin today.

[26:29] Okay.

[26:29] We're going to be expanding the basin as you can see here.

[26:33] And then we'll continue all that storm so we're going to get it to the basin as it

[26:36] is today.

[26:37] So nothing really different than what was originally planned.

[26:40] There was a master plan for all of this site was mascrated.

[26:44] Now that we're getting into the weeds of exactly where the bones are going to sit, everything falls.

[26:49] That's where we're getting into detailed design elements.

[26:53] You're the buffer area in the landscaping.

[26:57] Do you have proposed landscaping there?

[26:59] Yeah, so all those little circles and squigglys of all represent trees that will go in there.

[27:05] Again, we took the same plant schedule as far as Evergreen's over stories, ornamentals,

[27:10] And carry that exact same kind of repetition all the way through there, so and they're fairly grown.

[27:18] So it's not 10, 15 years for it to be enough of a buffer between the properties.

[27:23] I mean, that's part of the reason ever Greens are going in.

[27:25] Those are established day one, right?

[27:28] Overstory and ornamental tree does take a little bit of time.

[27:30] They typically get planted like a two inch wrench, and have caliper tree.

[27:33] They may take several years to kind of stop for surening before they get to their ultimate canopy.

[27:38] But at Burm's probably 10 feet tall now, isn't it?

[27:42] Yeah, yeah.

[27:42] Yeah, if you've been to the site, there was a road that kind of cuts through

[27:45] you're now, you kind of see it on the area, so you can drive through it.

[27:48] Um, and yeah, you can see the great change that exists there today.

[27:51] And then Burm is still staying, right?

[27:53] Yeah, that's part of their plan to look at that Burm there as well.

[27:56] Very good.

[27:57] So for, um, for the people on Stonejade there, so that you're your Burm,

[28:03] your green area was quickly buffers from the noise and such

[28:08] there to the north.

[28:09] Does there anything planned or needed on what would be the east side

[28:15] of Stone Gate from a static standpoint versus the retention

[28:21] pond, or is that all going to be very static?

[28:24] It's all going to be natural grasses and turf area there.

[28:28] So we're not doing a wet pond.

[28:29] We are a dry basin, which is exactly the same in that's there

[28:32] today. So it really shouldn't be any different than what's there today. This will be maintained right now.

[28:37] It's I've walked it. It's grass. It's about this tall. So they have mode and I think you know periodically throughout the summer, but it'll be it'll be a natural terraria.

[28:50] All right. Any other questions? Thank you. Thank you very much, appreciate it.

[28:58] Is there any one of the audience I'd like to speak in favor of the request

[29:08] that that would you would speak as you would like this to go through

[29:18] and see none

[29:19] I will ask the opposite there's any one of the audience or I'd like to speak opposed to the request

[29:23] So you would not want the project to go through

[29:33] 1800 don't get where the sixth house in from the east we have 20,000 dollars with the landscaping on that 10-foot berm in the back of our property

[29:43] We have a $5,000 patio on the back of the house.

[29:49] Our bad news, on the next side of the property,

[29:51] went from 3, 30, 3, 75, 380 was the last house sold.

[29:59] Since this is...

[30:00] This is going in. Discussion of it. A neighbor sold the house last week for 334. Not the direction I wanted to go. So, we're just asking for to, yeah, with a landscaping to be maintained and taking care of to protect us, our value, our property. What you're not seeing up there in that particular picture is the car dealers should the car wash and the detail shopping all that.

[30:28] That is right on the yellow line.

[30:31] Right.

[30:33] No, no, no, no, it's not on the property line.

[30:36] No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[30:36] We like just part of it.

[30:39] It's actually 80 feet from the property line.

[30:42] 80 feet from the property line.

[30:43] There is nothing on the the other property.

[30:47] They said car parking.

[30:48] So there are 80 feet closer to me than the dealerships are anywhere else.

[30:54] Well, I'm just asking that

[30:55] that it's noted that we're asking for proper landscaping to maintain landscaping which

[31:03] sprinkler systems. The other property is touching go as depending on the landscapers and

[31:09] when they can make a property, we'd like to make sure that that is maintained. And a question

[31:14] to you all, is there any requirements for walls or anything like that in the city proposals between

[31:24] the properties?

[31:27] No, no, no. So staff was around when the first audio dealership went in.

[31:34] At that time, stone gate persons did not want to fence there. They were not in favor of it.

[31:40] They opted instead for the 80 foot landscape area as a buffer.

[31:47] So that was last time.

[31:50] If that was something that was approved by them, we were looking forward to having landscaping there.

[31:57] We just think about your backyard, you're going to have a car dealership factor with not the nice cars, but the older cars, the detailed cars, the cars that maintenance are going to be on the back lot there.

[32:11] That's what we get to see. So that's all I'm addressing.

[32:13] I'd like to make sure that that's maintained and taken care of.

[32:18] We have a good relationship with our dealership that's there currently.

[32:22] We knew this was going to be here when we bought three years ago.

[32:26] We just didn't know they were going to be putting something that close to the property line.

[32:31] And so we're just surprised by that, but we're asking that when the proposal of building up,

[32:37] those buildings on the back, the purple and the beige, they maintain the back side of them as well as they do the front side of it,

[32:44] so it's attractive from our property.

[32:47] I do have a 10-foot berm from my patio to the top.

[32:51] On the other side, it's roughly the same.

[32:55] The brown building was proposed originally to be a two-story building.

[32:59] So I would be looking at my back window seeing that.

[33:03] So now that there's discussion that will not be happy and right away.

[33:07] This is all proposal.

[33:08] But I just want to maintain the entire property, the entire building design.

[33:14] So it's attractive from all sides.

[33:16] So we don't lose any additional property value, you know, that's why I'm asking and appreciate your time.

[33:23] Thank you.

[33:24] Thank you.

[33:24] I do have a question.

[33:26] What's your opinion of the existing Berman landscaping at the existing dealership?

[33:35] In minimal maintained.

[33:38] They have done addressed a lot of things, but a lot, if you went back there, you'd see a lot of dead treats.

[33:45] Not a lot, because there's not a lot of trees, but they've had sprinkler problems, they've had to dry whether they've had conditions that they had to address.

[33:54] Well, we'd like to sprinkle a system that you put in there and maintain, so the grass is green and the trees are alive. Otherwise they don't do us any good.

[34:03] Don't stop any sound or keep the visual.

[34:06] We like the lighting system that's been proposed that they put out there, the third sky.

[34:13] That dark sky is really nice,

[34:16] yet you're still looking at a bright parking lot.

[34:20] There's reasons for the three different designs

[34:22] and the three different buildings.

[34:25] And we understand all that.

[34:26] We were hoping to also originally we were told

[34:28] that the brown building would flip to the east end

[34:31] to the purple.

[34:32] That way it wouldn't be in the residential area,

[34:36] but that's changed because the parking requirements

[34:39] I'm told.

[34:39] So that's something that is proposed down the road so maybe when you review their proposed in the future

[34:48] We can also look maintain that property better

[34:52] maintain it so it looks nice for us

[34:54] But they've done a great effort the property is clean they manage their good neighbors

[35:00] I wish it was a tiled in your shift because of the 125 feet between me and the property. But it's 80. And we have to live with that. We just want, we want to be good neighbors. And we want our neighbors to be happy with us too. That's all right.

[35:16] Thank you. Any other questions?

[35:17] Hi, I have a question. Please.

[35:19] I'm confused. Maybe it's where you said you were located, but you said something to the effect that the berm or the

[35:30] It was right on the property line of your

[35:35] The

[35:58] Okay,

[36:02] the double this size of the active system.

[36:10] They continue this all the way down here.

[36:12] I'd like to see that in a picture.

[36:14] Didn't that totally say

[36:21] because we do have the burn.

[36:23] It's that's nice.

[36:24] But my house is 10 feet up.

[36:26] My house.

[36:28] First for a level is looking at the top of the burn.

[36:31] Okay, so consequently I will be looking into the parking lot.

[36:35] like everybody. So is the, um, is the burn, whose property is the Burma on?

[36:44] There's a dealership.

[36:48] That's the top of the Burma, but then they'll have trees up on top of that. So, that's what we're

[36:53] hoping lots of trees stop me next.

[36:55] Well, I'm also, I'm, I would like to speak, but there's the dealership or whoever owns the property.

[37:08] Okay, because things won't happen properly, we won't get recorded, so we're done and then you can step up and have your piece.

[37:16] Any questions?

[37:18] All right.

[37:18] Thank you for your time.

[37:19] Thank you.

[37:21] All right, sir.

[37:22] Step step up and reach yourself.

[37:27] My name is DM Davis.

[37:29] Also a resident on the North side.

[37:32] 1744, which is actually exactly in the middle.

[37:36] as far as the circle is concerned, so we're the tenth unit in from either side, basically.

[37:48] You don't have, obviously, you don't have a drawing whereby it shows this plus the stone gate circle, right?

[37:57] But I mean, the two together,

[38:00] so I guess I'm just a little bit confused.

[38:07] Let's go back. Let's go back to the start.

[38:09] You talked someone talked about a packet. Is that a packet for you folks not us it was publicly available online

[38:16] Okay, how would I get that online just through the city of the airport?

[38:22] Yeah, there's there's an agenda section to the city website

[38:24] Yeah, good board boards and commissions and you can work your way into it. Okay. All right

[38:30] So then on the 125 foot

[38:32] foot mentioned. That's between the dealerships.

[38:42] What was the question?

[38:44] I'm sure we're the hunter.

[38:44] There was something to say about 125 feet.

[38:48] For the car wash, the car wash.

[38:51] So, do you want it?

[38:58] And the car wash of the present is the purple building.

[39:01] No.

[39:19] Yep. So, it's completely buffered by a building.

[39:24] So, my initial point while I'm still sitting was that

[39:29] The south, the southern line there, or the vegetation is, for like, a better word,

[39:40] the top

[39:40] of the bar, basically from the dealer side. The actual property line is further south than that,

[39:48] correct?

[39:51] Because some people, like you have said, you've done some work in the back, and is a part of it.

[40:00] On the south of south.

[40:10] When you say top, the very top from coming up the hill on the dealerside?

[40:16] No, no, not in the whole property. So for the dealership, the south edge of that green area.

[40:24] That's your 80 foot,

[40:29] so the south edge of that green area is the property line.

[40:33] For reference point, the northern point of the buildings to the edge of the parking lot is

[40:43] 120 feet. So there's the 80 foot buffer plus there's 20 foot set back of those buildings.

[40:49] But your property line is correctly as stated, the southern edge of that green buffer

[40:55] shown on that map right there.

[40:57] Okay, because we actually, I mean, we'll be out as you pay, you know, a month, let's be the mole.

[41:06] I'm sorry. I mean, I directly make my comments to most everyone in here, I guess.

[41:13] But, so we actually mole part of the grass that belongs to the dealer.

[41:22] I mean, that's the best way to set up and it's fine.

[41:25] But I wouldn't think that would be the case or at least not be the requirement on what

[41:32] we're going on.

[41:33] They're currently going through problem.

[41:34] There's an ingress there currently on the firm.

[41:38] I think in general what you're getting into is discussions you need to have the owner

[41:41] regarding maintenance of the property and ensure that being specific to the special use permit.

[41:47] But generally, ultimately, the maintenance of a property would be on the property on itself.

[41:54] There go if you're going on or beyond, that's something you guys can work on amongst yourselves.

[41:59] Well, I'm certainly all for extending the vegetation to the east, but I mean, I'm not impressed with what is already there that's behind Mercedes and Volkswagen and Audi.

[42:22] That's why I agree with what you're saying that it needs more maintenance.

[42:28] I mean, way back when, I mean, we've been there for 13 years, so we've had, you know,

[42:35] we were adding discussions with currently when they first came in and I think the vegetation

[42:43] to the east will need improvement, that's just my point,

[42:52] so what about the road, can we go

[42:56] to the other picture in the next one, I guess.

[43:05] Wait a minute, you're right back to that one.

[43:07] Okay, so the road then comes in now from 53rd

[43:10] and goes to the existing dealership.

[43:15] What will happen on the right to the east

[43:19] or that comes down to it, what would normally be considered a T?

[43:24] That road kind of goes a few feet to the east.

[43:27] I can walk over there if that helps.

[43:28] No, I think I think that's the answer.

[43:31] So what will happen to that world?

[43:33] We'll have to do the same thing and just go straight across

[43:36] or will it come down and connect to the eventually

[43:38] connect to the properties?

[43:42] I don't think that the road destiny

[43:43] where it just looks like it's all incorporated to the parking lot.

[43:46] I can expand upon that.

[43:48] So it's a separate action from the rezoning

[43:50] was a right away vacation.

[43:52] So Spring Street South the 53rd is no longer a public road.

[43:56] It has been vacated and the last been conveyed to luxury 53.

[44:04] So it does not exist as a city road anymore.

[44:08] The pavement will be maintained.

[44:10] But as you can see, one of the buildings will be where that key is.

[44:15] So it is a private drive.

[44:17] So it will be all, you can circulate amongst all the dealerships, but it won't, and then I suppose they can exit out onto Eastern at the far end, but it serves just the dealerships specifically.

[44:34] okay so any roadwork in the future would be down to the far south east corner and that's not

[44:45] our concern at this point. There is no road at all. There will be no road, there will be no road

[44:51] stuff for them to think that goes through. Should this request be approved tonight? What you're

[44:56] on there would have to be the same, so they don't have to.

[45:00] Any roads proposed going south with this development. If they make any changes, they would have to come back to this board to make a change.

[45:09] So basically what you're looking at is three different buildings and then kind of more administrative and de-hilling building to the south and a parking lot.

[45:19] I think that's it.

[45:22] I just heard it.

[45:23] Just a few clarification.

[45:25] Thanks for your concern.

[45:26] Sir quick, quick, quick questions.

[45:29] When you say that the burn back there needs additional maintenance or are you saying that it needs additional vegetation?

[45:36] Yes.

[45:38] So if it's there, it's not a matter of making what's there, you're asking for additional vegetation.

[45:44] Great.

[45:45] Thank you.

[45:46] and that's what we correct. It's not sufficient. There certainly is no whatever the right word is.

[45:58] Reducing noise. This is not capable. And the vegetation now has been there. Well, I think it's been whatever this time flies three years.

[46:10] I mean, and it really hasn't grown much, so that's all I'm saying, thank you,

[46:22] anyone else?

[46:24] No.

[46:32] Thanks, John Kelly, and I also live on Stoke.

[46:35] They were talking about the runoff, and I'm concerned now because all that planned was dirt before

[46:43] Now it's going to be concrete and is that area where it's going to run off is that going

[46:49] to be able to hold the water and it's not going to suddenly start washing it into stungate

[46:56] circle or the other kind of at the end of stungate circle, the high-rise kind of.

[47:04] Right, that all would happen to the proof through.

[47:07] Yep, so they're in the very preliminary stages of the civil review.

[47:11] They're prohibited from pushing stormwater run off onto other properties so they will be retaining up to a hundred-year storm event on their property.

[47:20] That's why the land

[47:23] to the south of this property line is expanding their detention area to handle the additional pavement.

[47:31] So they're basically doubling the size of the detention area.

[47:35] as part of the storm was the and heavy storm. So it's designed just it's the

[47:42] hundred year storm is what the calculated requirement is and then it's

[47:46] released at a two year event rate and that's per code and that's across the

[47:50] board. I need a development within the city to have a report because there's no

[47:54] absorption once they put all that contest. All the water is washing down towards

[47:58] yeah area yeah they're they're doubling the detention area

[48:07] okay thank you all right thanks

[48:17] I live at 1800's Stone Gate also and um the Burm if you go back to the picture with the Burm please

[48:28] that one there um they are absolutely right we the original Burm that was there was 25 feet

[48:39] last year at the beginning of the summer, they added an additional 25 feet to it.

[48:47] So now that berm is 50 feet, the original 25 feet are we paid out of our HOA fees for

[48:57] our Leo's Capers to cut that also. Just because it wasn't getting cut off to

[49:05] enough or whatever, and it was weeds and everything up there.

[49:10] So they are land scalpers, cut that 25 feet.

[49:15] Once they put in this firm with all the land,

[49:18] once they put in all the landscaping on that burn,

[49:22] it should cover, if I'm correct, the whole burn,

[49:26] not just 25 feet of it.

[49:29] It should cover the whole thing, correct?

[49:31] So when they put the landscaping there, they will then be maintaining the whole thing and we won't be paying our landscapers any longer to cut that 20, that 25 feet.

[49:47] If it becomes an issue, I'm sure that we could agree, get an agreement with them to have them have their landscapers that are...

[50:00] We're already cutting the existing dealership to trim that 25, the whole 50 feet up there as

[50:09] or not. So I don't think that that's a real issue at this time. And as far as putting

[50:20] in the landscaping for it, speaking with Mr. Kilmer earlier, he has suggested that there's

[50:27] possibility that they could, this, the spring coming up, start putting those landscaping

[50:38] trees and stuff there so that they have an opportunity to grow before they even start

[50:46] turning the shovel. So I think that that's, I think that they're being more the bearer

[50:54] they're trying to work with us and, you know, do the sprinkler system maintaining it up there

[51:05] and putting all the landscaping up there, because our HOA years ago voted, and this was

[51:17] before we bought our property there, voted not to have a wall there.

[51:21] that's what we have to work with and so I myself personally would like to have the ever

[51:31] grains and trees and that up there and by them putting their them there and doing

[51:36] it possibly to spring that gives on what maybe a two to three year jump start before buildings

[51:50] So there are things that, you know, the full site plans or anything that would have to be approved before they could start any type of work, but once their plans are approved by the city, then how they step through the plans.

[52:02] Right. Yeah. I don't want to write a tiny bit of context. The luxury fifty-third does not own this property yet and so they're not.

[52:10] They haven't been the ones maintaining it, so it will change in terms of how it's being maintained.

[52:17] And I have also talked to Mr. Kilmer over this past summer because the vegetation back there.

[52:27] You call it vegetation, I call it weeds.

[52:31] But that all back there was so high and he within a week he had that cut.

[52:40] everything where those dealerships are at now, he had that all cut, and there are 25 feet on the top of the burn that they had just added last year.

[52:52] So they're going above and beyond trying to work with us.

[52:58] And you know, any time we felt that it needed to be cut, specifically the top of the burn, I text him, and it was cut within days.

[53:09] Okay.

[53:10] So.

[53:11] Well, that's great.

[53:12] That's obviously you look.

[53:13] We'd like to see that neighborhood and neighbor thing working, of course, then within

[53:17] the recommendations, if passed as written, you know, if anything goes outside of what's

[53:22] approved, then there would be the opportunity to address that here, but clearly neighbor

[53:28] to neighbors, the best way to do things in the sounds like it's working.

[53:32] It's.

[53:33] We're going to be neighbors either way.

[53:35] We might as well get along, you know.

[53:40] Absolutely.

[53:42] All right.

[53:42] Got that question.

[53:44] Thank you.

[53:49] That's all for.

[53:50] So at this time for the applicant, do you have any final comments?

[54:01] Just a few here.

[54:03] I think Laura pointed out one of them.

[54:05] We don't currently own the property.

[54:07] And so we haven't been maintaining the berm or that stuff.

[54:11] So that that'll all change.

[54:13] There was as we acknowledge, we had the zoning, the zoning board meeting.

[54:18] we learned that there had been a sprinkler system that failed and a bunch of our trees died,

[54:23] and so we have to get them replaced. But at that point, it was almost no member.

[54:27] And it's impossible to plant them. So we are working on getting that all done. We're working

[54:33] on getting all those trees. Also, as Laura indicated, there's no sheet runoff planned with this

[54:40] development. In other words, we're not putting in a parking lot that the water runs off the

[54:44] the parking lot, it's all controlled as Eric discussed. We've also, we are taking a lot of precautions

[54:53] with the noise as part of the zoning requirements that are already in place with, even

[55:00] Without the zoning board of adjustment, for example, those back buildings, they don't have doors opening to the back where there's going to be noise coming out of those buildings.

[55:09] So it's all to the side and to the front in order to try to help protect the noise even more than the 80 foot buffer already will.

[55:17] And I think that's, that's it unless you have any additional questions for me.

[55:22] is the the berm and landscaping area behind the existing buildings different than what will be behind the proposed building?

[55:31] No, but there was about 10 or 15 percent of our trees that died when that's

[55:37] sprinkler fail and stopped growing. So we we do acknowledge that it takes time to put in trees.

[55:44] We can't we can't transplant 30 and 40 foot tall trees. We have to bring them in and then then let them grow.

[55:50] So with that, there will be some delays with those trees.

[55:54] We are working, we did get a hold of the landscaper.

[55:58] I think very quickly the Monday after our meeting

[56:01] when we learned about that and got that all started

[56:03] and moving forward.

[56:05] The plan,

[56:10] I don't know exactly how to describe it,

[56:11] but I think we put in about twice as much vegetation

[56:16] as was required under the zoning behind that dealership.

[56:21] know it still has to grow up and do all that kind of stuff but it is our intent to always be a good neighbor

[56:27] and to do these things to try to make it to make it look good. We're not in the business of

[56:33] creating an ice ore or a lot of problems for those around us. All right. Then one thing I want to add

[56:40] regarding landscaping, you do run the risk if you over plant of things dying as they age due to

[56:48] of crowding of roots and shade and things like that.

[56:52] So there's a balance there in the in between the density

[56:59] that you're looking for in an landscape area.

[57:04] Well, when the Texas says six to eight foot spacing, they mean that.

[57:07] All right.

[57:08] The only thing I would also add is we are looking at the best order

[57:14] operations building a development like like this is not like going and putting up a house

[57:21] where you're just putting up the one house and then the house is done and then you move on.

[57:26] So there will be a stage of operations. We are trying to look into how we can

[57:33] and when we can do the vegetation, clearly we will have to do grading before we can put in the

[57:44] When you're going to put up the buildings, you don't want to plan to tree and then drive a bulldozer next to the tree because it'll just die and then you'll have to plan to new tree.

[57:53] So we are looking at how quickly we can do that and in what order we can get this all done.

[57:59] Yep.

[58:01] All right, any other questions?

[58:03] All right, thank you.

[58:04] Thank you.

[58:07] All right, board time for our discussion.

[58:09] any

[58:15] point you want to bring up of the planet's self or the staff recommendations?

[58:25] I had a question for staff, so you feel like the I mean we've heard the concerns about

[58:32] appropriate green barrier and you feel like that's been properly addressed in the

[58:37] site plan already. That's question I want to question number two if this form feels like

[58:43] and it needs some form of augmentation

[58:48] is that possibility?

[58:50] Can that be, is that it can be a provider

[58:53] of the special use program?

[58:54] The first point is, yes, we feel like the level of landscaping,

[58:59] especially being that they have an 80-foot buffer

[59:02] between that and any kind of actual pavement or building,

[59:07] is sufficient.

[59:08] Generally, just context, sake, the general buffer requirement

[59:12] between residential and commercial properties is one linear row of hedges with with a tree at

[59:22] every 50 feet. So for context sake it is in only 15 feet wide. And only 15 feet wide. Now they

[59:30] agree to this with the rezoning to do this as part of their conditions. We feel like it is

[59:37] It is over and beyond what generally would be required and from the fee that we had from stone gate neighbors that were closer to the existing dealership they were fairly happy with that level of landscaping and distance and to try to keep it consistent as well.

[1:00:00] But to answer your second question, you could amend conditions who require more. We would just need direction on specificity on what that meant.

[1:00:11] I would also like to state that the existing landscape ordinance that we have does require that they be maintained.

[1:00:18] So those dead trees that are on the other end, the first development, they are required to be replaced.

[1:00:24] And the same would hold true for this area of a tree gets, you know, for some reason that breaks when storm had dies for whatever reason it's required to be replaced.

[1:00:38] Okay, so then that's reinforced by, by a recommendation, sex that there's any noncompliance of these conditions or other regulations that can't be worked out neighbor or neighbor than they come to the city and.

[1:00:51] generally what would happen is we would try general enforcement before we would

[1:00:56] ever try to do any kind of revocation.

[1:01:00] Yeah, would be an absolute route last resort.

[1:01:06] Okay.

[1:01:07] Any other questions or thoughts?

[1:01:10] I'd like to comment on conditions that's a little more regarding the 50%

[1:01:16] ownership.

[1:01:17] But I know it could be kind of honest for the owners, but I think that gives, in my opinion,

[1:01:26] gives the city the right to keep an eye on the special uses that is there.

[1:01:33] I know we've kind of had that issue before about city trying to keep track of stuff,

[1:01:42] If something does change, so that's my opinion for that.

[1:01:48] Yeah, I'm good with the more than 50% change,

[1:01:51] I'm wondering if it makes sense to add the,

[1:01:54] you know, and no longer franchise dealership.

[1:01:58] So as long as it maintains the same use.

[1:02:02] Sure.

[1:02:03] Then the smoke continues to go with it.

[1:02:05] And or which one do you set and and?

[1:02:08] I would say, or.

[1:02:12] Because there would be more than a 15% change if it was a change in franchise, because it would go from a Lexus dealer to some other kind of dealer.

[1:02:24] That would be fine if you want to do that. We can help walk you through an amendment.

[1:02:28] Generally with franchises, they, I think John kind of alluded to this, there's a lot of oversight with those franchises in many different criteria.

[1:02:40] So it's not just our ordinance that they have to follow, and so you get a pretty

[1:02:46] well-meantained property. It's when you get out of those franchises, and our code doesn't distinguish between the two nor is it right for it, too?

[1:02:57] So that would be something that you could distinguish in

[1:03:01] Especially if you can even stay the same franchise just changing ownership. Yes, so right

[1:03:09] all right, so or so we

[1:03:11] If we amended the line, I don't know we have to make amendment motion,

[1:03:18] kind of violation of ownership or management companies

[1:03:21] change more than 50 percent or

[1:03:26] or is no longer a franchise dealership

[1:03:30] that they're re-hearing for special use.

[1:03:34] I would say active franchise dealership.

[1:03:41] John, do you have any feedback on this?

[1:03:49] I think just to make sure what the what what your because the end in the or is is very different right so if it was and it would mean that

[1:03:58] if

[1:03:59] it was sold

[1:04:00] to be continued to operate as a as a

[1:04:04] franchise dealership

[1:04:05] then it wouldn't meet both parts of the criteria so it would be okay like the hand.

[1:04:10] I think I think we we like the we like the and our intent would

[1:04:15] I deal, well, I deal would be nothing, but the best I think that makes sense here both for

[1:04:23] the city and for us would be that if it continues as long as it continues to be operated

[1:04:30] as a franchise motor vehicle dealership, the special use permit, which I understand to be a limited

[1:04:37] special use permit to be as a motor vehicle dealership, would continue with that use.

[1:04:43] it would not extinguish unless that used stopped.

[1:04:50] And that that used does not include, for example,

[1:04:54] I think it would make sense to us that that used

[1:04:56] does not include being a used car dealers.

[1:05:00] For example, or a non-franchised dealership. With that said, if it's the or then it would mean that whether or not 50% ownership in the property changed or it's not being used as a dealership. The special use would cease and you couldn't restart a new specialty, a new motor vehicle dealership at that property. That's kind of how I'm understanding it.

[1:05:24] and we'll reapply.

[1:05:25] They have to reapply, right?

[1:05:27] So those are our thoughts, obviously, we would prefer

[1:05:32] that it be allowed to continue to be used

[1:05:36] as a motor vehicle dealership that we're building it for,

[1:05:39] as a franchise dealership, as long as it's being used,

[1:05:42] as that franchise dealership, but we understand if that's not gonna

[1:05:49] be allowed.

[1:05:50] What we have to try to do is think what's gonna happen

[1:05:52] 30 years from now for that property, so it's no longer franchise dealership and becomes a

[1:05:58] you know, it used to be press-down motors of run-of-vision chemistry right now it's a

[1:06:02] card dealership but it's not a franchise. It's not easy on dealership anymore right dating myself, but

[1:06:09] so so I think you know what it was a, was it look like in the future so

[1:06:15] but I think

[1:06:17] So I think the one that the last proposal I think I heard the staff talking about, my interpretation of what that would have meant was that if ownership changed or it stopped being used as a franchise dealership, it could not which would.

[1:06:33] Our preference would be if it stops being used as a franchise dealership, it can

[1:06:39] especially use permit terminates when it stops being used.

[1:06:43] And it's not necessarily tied to ownership of the property itself, like who owns the property.

[1:06:51] The reason being, as I said, these are very, very specialized buildings that cost a lot of money to build.

[1:06:58] and they lose a considerable amount of value.

[1:07:06] The second that they can no longer be used for that,

[1:07:09] and that it may not seem like it,

[1:07:13] but it's a pretty devastating idea to not be able to keep using your

[1:07:18] Lexus dealership as a Lexus dealership,

[1:07:22] because for example, 51% of the owners changed.

[1:07:28] on the person who's operating in Lexus dealership.

[1:07:32] I think he would be reasonable to have the franchise block

[1:07:37] because I think that makes a lot of sense.

[1:07:39] I do a lot of this with motor vehicle dealerships.

[1:07:42] We do a lot of by-sells at my firm.

[1:07:45] I've personally been part of over 130 of them.

[1:07:48] So we see this a lot and it's very devastating if the property.

[1:07:54] If the property has a block on it that requires any transfer in ownership to cease use as a motor vehicle dealership, that's very difficult to try to get past.

[1:08:07] It doesn't seem like it would be, but it is.

[1:08:11] But there is a, I do agree with the city that there's a material difference between somebody who's operating Alexis or a Hyundai or a Kia dealership, especially under all of the other restrictions that we've already agreed to with the zoning and everything else here and the buffers and everything and the noise ordinances and you can't, there's a lot of stuff that people think of that they don't like about car dealerships that we are already blocked from doing.

[1:08:39] We don't generally do them, use of PA systems, all of those type of things, but it will have a, it will have a, it will have a really big, that particular requirement will have a very big effect on us potentially in the future.

[1:08:54] So just a quite a point of clarification, it wouldn't be that they would have to cease

[1:08:59] to use. It would be that a new ownership would need to become before the board and review

[1:09:07] their business plan, basically, or if there were proposed changes for those to be reviewed.

[1:09:12] But it could be considered. How do you want to move forward? We'll help you.

[1:09:19] So I guess thinking about this a little bit more, you could remove the word revoke.

[1:09:24] from the condition so that it just would be reviewed.

[1:09:32] If I may ask, is it possible to have a non-public review?

[1:09:38] Is that even allowed by the law? I didn't think so.

[1:09:42] So just in context of what happens, I'll just give you guys a little bit of context.

[1:09:48] When you're selling a motor vehicle dealership,

[1:09:49] really a lot of different businesses. It can be incredibly devastating to the business.

[1:09:57] If, for example, a sale is to start.

[1:10:00] Not finish. Employees may get afraid for their jobs, even though there's no reason to be, even if there's

[1:10:07] requirements that they're all being hired. And I have been involved only once in one operation,

[1:10:17] where the what could happen in a sale. And then you get left at the altar. And it's it's really really

[1:10:26] imaging to the to the seller and it has a it has a very large effect on on what happens and so

[1:10:36] it's not the it's not the seeking the permit or the or the ongoing approval because I am

[1:10:44] strongly confident that anybody who's going to be operating one of these dealerships will

[1:10:49] easily provide the same guarantees that we're providing and the same operations that we're providing

[1:10:56] But, but it adds to any sale of the business, a publicity requirement that is substantially

[1:11:04] before you can, you would normally ever see publicity in a deal like that, and it just,

[1:11:11] it has a, it would have a very far region effect on both the operations and the real estate.

[1:11:17] So, I think I, I think I've, I think I've said what I can say on that.

[1:11:21] All right.

[1:11:22] I appreciate it. I am drafting it the post.

[1:11:25] Okay, so, all right, thank you.

[1:11:27] Thank you.

[1:11:29] To me, staff,

[1:11:34] bullets, six needs to be broken into.

[1:11:36] Okay.

[1:11:37] Right, because it talks about any of the non-compliance of the conditions,

[1:11:42] which is our all-one-three-five,

[1:11:44] could cause it to be revoked or reproved or revoked, which makes sense.

[1:11:50] But then, as far as the change in management or change in,

[1:11:57] use to a non-franchised dealership to be, um, okay. I see where you're going. Yes, come back

[1:12:05] back in front of the board. Great. So yeah, complaints are that kind of stuff. The

[1:12:10] act caused revoke and the change could cause it to be evaluated or represented or

[1:12:16] where you want to work that.

[1:12:19] So it seems like we're weighing the difference or the juxtaposition of ownership with use.

[1:12:32] And the operative word in this whole matter is use.

[1:12:36] So I definitely concur that tying it to the franchise license franchise dealership makes a lot of sense.

[1:12:48] I'm just playing in my mind whether the ownership issue is really germane here.

[1:12:54] I can see where from the city standpoint that's a nice safety net.

[1:12:58] I mean, it's definitely, you know, and it's not such a, it's not such an owners thing to have to come back in.

[1:13:05] and have the special use permit reviewed, again, I suppose,

[1:13:11] with ownership changes significantly.

[1:13:15] Is that really kind of what we're dealing with here?

[1:13:22] So what I'm thinking would

[1:13:34] be a motion to amend conditions six to strike,

[1:13:40] quote, or ownership management companies change more than 50%

[1:13:45] quote from condition 6 and then to add conditions 7 which is should the ownership no longer

[1:13:56] be affiliated with a franchise to deal or ship the special use shall be reviewed by the zoning

[1:14:03] board of adjustment.

[1:14:07] John,

[1:14:11] is that work for you?

[1:14:13] So, I take the text at once, I mean, I was thinking through what you just said.

[1:14:18] Okay, so the first part is to strike quote, or if ownership or management companies change

[1:14:24] more than 50% and quote from that, from condition 6.

[1:14:31] And then it would add conditions 7, which shall read, should the ownership no longer be affiliated with a franchise to deal

[1:14:40] ship, the special use shall be reviewed by the zoning board of adjustment.

[1:14:53] We bring this over to have somebody.

[1:14:55] Yeah, yeah.

[1:14:56] We can make that motion into, yeah.

[1:15:00] So if you have to do a motion to amend the recommendations, first, voting just on that.

[1:15:14] First, usually how this would work is you entertain a motion related to the amendment of the conditions you vote on those amendments and then you vote on the full social use.

[1:15:29] So you have any motion to, with the amendments in place.

[1:15:33] So before we hit that, are there any other discussions on the package as a whole?

[1:15:40] I would just want to reiterate what I was battling about earlier.

[1:15:44] I think it's just a very well prepped site and it's teed up quite nicely.

[1:15:50] As long as the city feels like ingress and egress has been properly addressed and we're now dealing with

[1:15:56] the issue of satisfactory above to the residential neighborhood, it seems like it should be pretty

[1:16:07] smooth sailing really in a very nice investment for the city.

[1:16:14] All right, thank you, Dr.

[1:16:15] All right, I'm so before we have a motion to approve, I would ask for a motion to amend the

[1:16:23] recommendations, the conditions, the conditions that are being recommended.

[1:16:30] I'll make a motion to amend conditions six in stating to strike, quote, or if ownership

[1:16:41] or management companies change parentheses more than 50% parentheses, end of quote.

[1:16:50] And then add conditioned seven, should the ownership no longer be affiliated with a French

[1:16:59] ICB dealership, especially you shall be reviewed by the Zoning Board of Adjustment.

[1:17:08] Second.

[1:17:11] All right, so there's a roll call or, okay, roll call,

[1:17:19] the Blunker.

[1:17:21] Gallaire?

[1:17:24] Boyd Carlton?

[1:17:25] Yes.

[1:17:26] And Darlin.

[1:17:27] Yes.

[1:17:29] All right.

[1:17:29] So we've amended the conditions.

[1:17:32] So now I'll ask for motion to approve HV23-02 with SU.

[1:17:43] That's on our second one this year.

[1:17:45] This is 02.

[1:17:46] SU23-02 as amended.

[1:17:54] Motion to approve, SU-23-02 as amended.

[1:18:03] I just would prepare for clarification with staff conditions as amended.

[1:18:06] Correct.

[1:18:08] Yes, with staff to conditions as amended.

[1:18:12] I'll second that motion.

[1:18:14] Will call please.

[1:18:17] Would call them?

[1:18:19] Yes.

[1:18:20] Well, sir.

[1:18:20] Yes.

[1:18:21] Galler?

[1:18:22] Yes.

[1:18:22] in Darlin. Yes. So the motions of the proof with the conditions.

[1:18:32] That is all the

[1:18:33] business we have. So at this point I would ask for a motion to adjourn. So I'm

[1:18:39] moved. Second on favor. Yes.

[1:18:47] Motion to have at Merry Christmas.

[1:18:52] And to see the January 11th, don't even worry we're adjusting the canceled no business.

[1:18:58] Okay.

[1:19:01] Lord, do you want to?

ZONING BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT

Agenda

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