[0:05] Order? Okay. I'm A and I hear by the way, so I'll do the roll call. Swan? Fricky?

[0:14] Here? Hi, it. Here?

[0:16] Resene? Here?

[0:17] A and Smith.

[0:19] Resent.

[0:21] Stand up and say the pledge of allegiance, please.

[0:25] A pledge of allegiance to flag.

[0:28] A pledge of allegiance to flag.

[0:29] A pledge of allegiance to flag.

[0:43] All in the mail, the copy of the agenda for this evening's anybody have a conflict of interest.

[0:52] Nope.

[0:54] There is none.

[0:54] We'd hear a motion to approve it.

[0:58] So moved.

[0:59] All second.

[1:01] All favor?

[1:02] Aye.

[1:02] Both.

[1:04] You all have a copy of the January 15th minutes.

[1:07] Any corrections or comments?

[1:08] So I really get elected this past year. I thought Ruzikki was still that when he was still alive

[1:15] Well, he passed it on to you

[1:17] After the meeting I don't know. I don't know that that was January

[1:22] It's too far back for Peter

[1:24] It's too late to turn it down. I can tell you that much

[1:29] Okay, we've been trying to get out his position for a while

[1:33] Anyway, there's no more comments on the minutes we do a motion to approve or deny

[1:38] I'll make a motion to accept the minutes from the...

[1:43] was it the January, my gosh.

[1:45] All of favor?

[1:46] Support.

[1:48] I...

[1:48] I post motion carries minutes of past.

[1:52] Item 3, new business, public hearing.

[1:54] Very quest made by Daniel.

[1:57] A shooter.

[1:59] Thank you.

[2:00] For a variance from the waterfront setback requirements and sections 535 of the zoning

[2:06] This is a specific request is asking for a variance to allow for the replacement and the expansion of a deck and handicapped grant not meeting the waterfront setback requirements.

[2:16] The property is owned our one single family residential and is currently used the single family residential. The property is located in 178 northwest.

[2:24] Survelling road property number 05 180 0650.

[2:30] Stop up to the podium and introduce yourself. Tell us what you have in mind young man.

[2:37] Damn it too. 11718 Northwest over Lake. We had a relatively decrepit deck and we're going to

[2:47] We're looking to replace it in the amongst the project the contractor didn't pull permits or anything like that

[2:56] So here we are now.

[2:59] We got stopped when was it?

[3:02] I believe sometime in May.

[3:04] It sounds about right.

[3:05] Yeah, it was quite earlier this year.

[3:08] And so we've been going through the process thus far.

[3:12] And here's our first board meeting.

[3:17] The expansion of it.

[3:22] And maybe you can help me out with us.

[3:24] I'm not exactly clear in per hour drawings.

[3:26] And what was there existing?

[3:27] I'm not sure where the expansion is, which

[3:35] was existing deck space, it's just just

[3:38] changing.

[3:52] But it's just the ramp, it's not an expansion of the actual deck.

[3:59] No, the deck surface proper, if you will, the flat area, that's staying the same size

[4:07] as well proposed as it was.

[4:14] I think that's about it, yeah.

[4:16] Mike, you have any comments on this?

[4:18] I'm not the one really, I mean the only reason I mentioned

[4:21] expansion is kind of like what these guys are saying,

[4:24] because it's the deck was the deck is not

[4:27] in conforming or appears to be not conforming,

[4:29] because it was there in 1958, but the ramp was added

[4:32] in what 2012 or somewhere down the road.

[4:36] We just wanted to make sure if it wasn't legal not

[4:39] informing that they had the opportunity come in here and ask for a variant so it could be considered

[4:45] conforming. So that's kind of the purpose of the language I guess if that helps explain anything

[4:52] of that. That helps me a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. That guy in 58 didn't pull from that side. I can't

[5:09] I guess I'll unclear on exactly what's being expanded.

[5:16] Well, if anything, right, well, are you on the same footprint?

[5:21] Of the proper deck, the flat area where you know, activities could be based, yeah, we're not.

[5:27] The existing deck, you're going to be right in the same spot.

[5:30] From the, well, the ramp is it was flat area.

[5:34] When was that done?

[5:37] 2007?

[5:39] 2007?

[5:40] When my wife started getting old?

[5:42] Hmm.

[5:42] That's when I built the ramp?

[5:43] Yeah, and we cut off a bunch of flat area and made a double descending ramp.

[5:51] But I mean, if that was, however many years ago, and I was very long time ago.

[5:56] At that point, though, that both areas that were cut for the ramp were flat deck areas.

[6:02] So overall the footprint is the isn't changing at all from when we purchased it in

[6:10] 2002. Yeah, just a little different

[6:13] Rapture

[6:15] So the ramp has been there since 2012 or whatever and what you're proposing is to

[6:22] What we make it remake to save me up in the same footprint. Yeah, yep, it's a it was to the point where

[6:29] Um, we had another piece of wood sitting on top of the deck to keep the children from falling through the hole, because it was, when I say it was getting bad, it was really bad.

[6:41] It was, it was a, it was a major safety thing for sure.

[6:43] super hoping that the superstructure of the ramp was okay and we tore the boards up, but they

[6:51] just crumbly fell apart. Yeah, they're when we started replacing those and that's, we got

[6:58] one and five of the million spectators. Yeah, and there's two concrete footings. They're outlined

[7:06] in the drawing. We're not changing those or redoing anything. They're just kind of replacing what was

[7:13] there with new boards.

[7:16] He says the plan.

[7:17] Fifty eight was well before.

[7:19] Well, then there's also a minute.

[7:22] I don't know if he had enough.

[7:25] Yeah, we searched this.

[7:27] But I think it was very, very old.

[7:31] I'm not sure what's your concern?

[7:35] Oh, I don't have a concern. I just, I look at the ordinance language and it seems to me that you can, you can do repairs,

[7:44] but you can't re, can't tear out rebuild something that's not conforming without coming in here for a very,

[7:50] so it's just, for me, the concerns just making sure we go through the process to get proper approvals.

[7:56] If you do want to support this that it's done through a process,

[8:01] so I don't have any concern about what they're doing.

[8:03] We just want to make sure they're getting the right permits to do it.

[8:06] There was also some questions about what was permitted, what wasn't.

[8:11] The original deck obviously was we before our zoning ordinance.

[8:15] The ramp though was built after the zoning ordinance was adapted,

[8:19] and we couldn't find any record of any permits that we've issued for that.

[8:23] So at least the ramp part of it I would say may may not be legal not informing, unless it's approved tonight.

[8:35] So that's only my own, I guess that's my only concern about the whole thing here, where it stands today.

[8:54] Well, Mike's explanation is clear to me that this is just trying to follow the ordinance.

[9:01] I think we are. I think you are. John or Lynn, any questions on this?

[9:08] No, I read through it and it does appear as long as he's staying with the same footprint of everything.

[9:15] Not extending beyond or doing anything different. I don't see a problem with that.

[9:20] Same, no issues with the reasoning.

[9:26] Like is there a short time with this?

[9:31] Yeah, I believe as long as you, as long as you've, you know, acknowledged that you've reviewed the findings that I've offered and if you agree with them, you can acknowledge that you agree with them.

[9:44] There was one, there was nine out of the ten standards that I provided findings in favor.

[9:52] there was only one that I provided a finding in favor in one possibly again. So maybe maybe

[9:59] go over that one and just kind of acknowledge whether you believe that's met or not and provide

[10:08] I'm going to try to find out about the bottom of the page.

[10:14] 2E-0.

[10:15] Yeah.

[10:16] Thank you.

[10:18] Very defining in that.

[10:20] Oh, here we go.

[10:22] Okay.

[10:28] Did that back?

[10:29] Oh, yeah.

[10:30] It's 2E under general criteria, page 3 out of 6.

[10:36] The standard says that the requested variance is the minimum variance that will make it possible

[10:40] or that will make possible the reasonable use of the land building or structure, and there's no reason

[10:47] all turn of location on the parcel for the proposed improvements for which a variance is sought.

[10:53] We're such alternative location would eliminate the need for a variance, or reduce the extent of the condition

[10:58] that's necessitating the variance.

[11:00] So basically, is this necessary or that could they do with less?

[11:05] I guess it's kind of how I understand that.

[11:08] Standard.

[11:09] But

[11:13] doesn't what he's asking for fall under replacing what was there and that kind of...

[11:18] Yeah, cover this.

[11:20] I mean, yeah, I believe so.

[11:22] Even though some might have been built without permits, it was still recognized.

[11:28] No one from this department, everyone out there and say, hey, you can't have that.

[11:33] Not to say that makes it right.

[11:34] I mean, if it wasn't built without permits, it's not protected, but it's been there.

[11:41] You do have the eagle letter that talks about, you know, what they wanted to do.

[11:47] They didn't really say they could do it or not, but said they didn't really care as long

[11:51] as you're behind the high water market.

[11:53] So, you know, so you have that documentation back if you were to allow them to do this

[12:00] project.

[12:02] Well, if you, any board members want to go through this step by step, feel welcome to,

[12:06] But I don't think we need to know, I thought what was prepared was very easy to follow and very thorough.

[12:14] And when you drive by you, then understand what he wants to do.

[12:16] Yeah, I get it too.

[12:18] It looks like Mikey will offer three possible draft motions.

[12:22] Is it the middle one that, oh, we're likely to settle on here that we're not talking about expansion.

[12:30] Yeah.

[12:31] Well, actually, yeah, I would go with the middle one because it's,

[12:35] I mean, we're only, it's not as amended, maybe as presented, maybe instead of saying

[12:41] as amended, say as presented, but based on the two standards there, I just want to

[12:46] make sure that we're not granting them rates to build beyond the ordinary high watermark.

[12:52] I don't know.

[12:53] They, they're trying to show that it's not, so I just want to make sure, because that's

[12:58] what the eagle letter says, so, so early in that condition, so much as they're just

[13:03] standings, I guess.

[13:06] It previously the lower portion of the deck, what rested on top of the C-wall was flush

[13:13] with the end of the C-wall, and that's our intent with the new.

[13:19] Well, with that understanding, I'd hear a motion to prove this, I guess.

[13:26] Do you want the motion read?

[13:28] You can, if you like.

[13:30] I think I'll read that middle one.

[13:32] Yes, please.

[13:32] everybody can curse with that because I think we want to be clear that from what we're all

[13:36] understanding this is going to be done in the same footprint but it's not going to get

[13:41] expanded outward and I think that middle motion that might drag the cover that so I'll make

[13:45] a motion to grant the request for variants from section 535A2 of the Garfield Township zoning ordinance

[13:52] as presented to allow for replacement of the existing deck attached to the dwelling based on

[13:59] findings for each practical difficulty, standard and general criteria for granting such

[14:04] a quest being met for the reasons stated in the Stafford port.

[14:12] Subjects of the following conditions, and that's conditions one and two set forth in

[14:17] Mike's report of September 17th.

[14:21] Motion has been made.

[14:22] We'll hear a support.

[14:24] I will second it.

[14:25] We have a roll call vote for the motion please.

[14:27] Okay, oh

[14:30] Okay, uh freaky. Yes, hi it. Yes, we're seeing. Yes, and Smith. Yes, motion carried.

[14:39] Thank you all very much

[14:42] I don't know I know you max I

[14:46] Sit there looking at you

[14:49] Oh my gosh, yes, we did how are you? You know I'm gonna alter what's going on? What are you drinking out there?

[14:59] That's good.

[15:01] I never opened this to the public. Is it too late? Was that? I never opened this, this petition up to the public. Oh, shoot. If it was someone here, I don't know.

[15:14] I was okay.

[15:19] I guess it was.

[15:20] I guess it was.

[15:22] I guess it was.

[15:23] He wants you to have your own.

[15:24] He wants you to.

[15:25] He wants you to have your own.

[15:26] He wants you to have your own.

[15:26] I guess he had anything to realize.

[15:28] He had nothing to realize.

[15:30] Well, I would say when there is no public, we can bypass that.

[15:34] I don't know.

[15:35] Yeah.

[15:35] Tell me.

[15:36] Well, I mean, yeah, if you don't recognize any public members, I have seen, at least I've

[15:42] where the word of order is not really a question. No one's going to question

[15:47] I don't know. I mean, if the guys don't say here. Item four, unfinished business?

[15:54] Mike. Yeah, I'd have nothing. Other business discussion on a proposed

[15:58] change in the bylaws. We talked about that in January. Yeah. So the only reason I

[16:04] put that on there was to more or less give you an update of what we

[16:09] a staff reviewed. So we initially wanted some of those standards and talked about putting

[16:17] those in the bylaws, but we felt like they would be better in the text of the zoning

[16:21] ordinance. Because they're approval standards, so we're talking about bases for approving

[16:26] variances or approving appeals, I'm sorry, or reviewing appeals. So we felt like if that wasn't

[16:33] in the zoning ordinance, it should be added there. So we'll talk in the John site and Steve

[16:38] in our planning department, we all agree that that might be something our attorneys should look at.

[16:43] Okay.

[16:44] For possible, text amendment.

[16:46] Okay.

[16:47] Just, just, maybe we don't need to do it, but we just, we should see if it, it's necessary.

[16:53] So, just a touch of attorney looked at anything yet.

[16:57] I don't know.

[16:57] I thought that's what we decided at January, so you're going to have just looked at by the touch of attorney.

[17:02] Oh, instead we're going to maybe put it in the ordinance instead of the bylaws.

[17:06] Yeah, so we've probably still ought to get looked at by somebody, right, so yeah, I think they're going to bring it to the attorney for a text amendment.

[17:17] Yeah, and that discussion I believe involved our township manager too, so we kind of felt that that was the best approach.

[17:25] So I mean, bylaws is more about running meetings and things of a business nature and those, those amendments were really more speaking to the process of reviewing the application.

[17:36] and it's consistent with other processes,

[17:41] where it's in the actual zoning ordinance.

[17:43] When you look at variance requests,

[17:45] we have standards for how we review those as well.

[17:49] So I found it interesting,

[17:51] and you published a page of information

[17:54] on public comment participation policy.

[17:58] Is that because of the egg thing?

[18:00] Oh no, I didn't do that.

[18:01] I think that's something that Chris did.

[18:04] Oh, okay.

[18:05] Yeah, I have fact 8 didn't even know about it.

[18:09] I wish I had a number, there was 3 minutes limit.

[18:11] Oh, she said I think, I think, that that probably was emanating from a planning commission

[18:18] meeting from hell that I luckily was sick for us, I felt with data centers and also a

[18:24] town board meeting where I think there was a lot of talk about those things and it made

[18:30] tough for the, for the sitting body to actually get to the agenda and talk about what

[18:35] they're supposed to talk about, because it was two or three hours of, oh, I think

[18:39] you experienced some of that, but last, well, last couple of years.

[18:43] If you read these rules, we could have put a stop to a lot of that.

[18:46] Actually, I'm thinking, now you've got a new tool.

[18:48] Yeah, hammer right on.

[18:51] When the show's tagged brothers decided to fight the grand charmer's mom, you talk about a

[18:57] remember that oh my gosh we finally got an egg timer a little guy from show

[19:02] stack I said well I had to flip this timer over you start talking one that

[19:05] thing's done you're done

[19:09] I mean that like is he just going on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on

[19:15] anyway I don't know I don't know for the next agenda well we'll have another

[19:19] very still look at so that'll be wasn't as easy as this one I don't know

[19:24] We'll see.

[19:26] All right, now it's time for public comment.

[19:29] There are no public.

[19:30] If there isn't any, we'd hear a motion to adjourn.

[19:35] So, Luke.

[19:36] Support?

[19:37] Support.

[19:38] All in favor?

[19:39] Aye.

[19:40] We'll adjourn.

Charter Township of Garfield Zoning Board of Appeals 9/17/2026

Transcript