[0:00] Good afternoon. Well, good evening. This is the Guilford Board of Education. Today, we have a special meeting. And our welcoming, our colleagues on the Board of Supply Pen, on the Board of Finance, and on the standing building committee to be with us tonight. So welcome. Thank you for joining us.

[0:20] We are going to hear tonight a presentation by the fire's group.

[0:25] I'm going to turn over to Dr. Freeman to appropriately and adequately introduce the group.

[0:31] This is a group that has done a facilities study for the Board of Education.

[0:37] This is something that we do regularly.

[0:41] This is a 10-year study.

[0:43] The Board of Education has had the privilege of hearing this study.

[0:49] We're getting initial presentation of this study from the gentleman to my left, and we are now

[0:57] wanted to not only give the public a chance to see this presentation, but certainly have

[1:04] our colleagues again on the board of select and board of finance and sending the link committee

[1:09] receive this as well. This is going to be an opportunity for these four groups of folks

[1:17] to ask questions to learn about what the facilities that he is telling us.

[1:24] This is the kind of report that's going to be used pretty heavily as we move forward by

[1:33] I go for public schools and then buy the town in considering various projects that need

[1:39] to get done and kind of making priority decisions around those things.

[1:46] So I am going to turn over to Dr. Freemann, who's going to introduce the presentations.

[1:52] Thank you.

[1:52] I'm Freemann.

[1:53] I'm pretty much set it all.

[1:54] The only thing that I would note is that the presentation and the figures that you're

[1:58] going to here tonight are based on architectural engineering and facilities considerations.

[2:06] The numbers that we share with you tonight, while they will become a foundation of a road

[2:12] map and a planning tool for us moving forward, do not take into consideration other financial

[2:18] or political implications considerations, so it will become the baseline of a road map that

[2:24] We will use to inform our decision and our planning and our preventative maintenance over the next 10 years.

[2:31] In with that I am pleased to introduce tonight, Mike Serrano and Bryce Sens and Jamie Young from Fryer and Associates,

[2:40] who are going to give us first and overview of the study.

[2:44] And then we'll open it up to conversation and question and answer for members of the building committee and three four and so are with us.

[2:53] We're going to look at you again for a bit.

[2:55] Our pleasure.

[2:56] Evening everybody.

[2:57] So what we're going to present tonight is a piece of the study.

[3:03] The study itself, the facility study itself, is 1,200 pages.

[3:08] We've looked at every school in the district.

[3:11] We looked at it for what is lacking, what is broken, what it needs to be on the deferred maintenance schedule.

[3:19] In order, again, as Doc said, to inform decisions moving up over the next 10 years for our facility study.

[3:29] So we're going to show you an overall big picture of the two, the seven, and the 10-year look at capital improvement expenditures as a planning tool.

[3:41] And we've broken it down into just each individual school and the big picture of what's going on in each school, and if you want to go through the 1,400 pages, that is the backup to this.

[3:52] I welcome you to do that. All the information is there.

[3:55] And so I'm going to hand it over to Bryce and Jamie to dive into the study.

[3:59] We'll make all the supporting materials available.

[4:01] All of you first things are important.

[4:07] So, to start off, we're going to go through each of the seven schools, we visited the four elementary

[4:12] schools, two middle schools, and this high school that we're in right now.

[4:17] So I'll start with Cox, first of summary of the overall CIP, so these were our findings

[4:23] as you'll discuss in more detail for each of the schools.

[4:28] But we put together these extensive spreadsheets to show you the cost that we recommend for

[4:34] year over the next 10 years. And we tally that for over the 10 years, which it also includes

[4:41] escalation. And the total price here came to a little over $92 million. And when you look

[4:50] at the report, you must see at the end of the document, these extensive spreadsheets that detail

[4:55] out the items and show you the escalation and all the costs that are associated with these numbers.

[5:02] So to start with cost elementary, this school over the 10 years we came to just over $6 million.

[5:09] The majority of that cost what were in these items I'm going to present to you here, HPAC.

[5:17] The bulk of that is recommended around five years from now.

[5:21] A lot of it has to do with duckwork and air distribution and insulation of the existing piping.

[5:26] Also included in this is exterior soft bits and case work.

[5:30] A lot of it is aged and some of it isn't necessarily accessible, so we recommend it over the next three to five years to replace and make upgrades for those items.

[5:42] Also included in this is Kitchen Equipment.

[5:45] This was brought out about nine years considering the condition of all of the equipment in there.

[5:52] We had a kitchen consultant who thoroughly catalogued all

[5:57] of the equipment in each of the schools.

[6:00] And then the other big ticket item for this school

[6:02] was exterior improvements.

[6:04] We met with the police department, the fire department,

[6:09] to talk about any security concerns

[6:11] that they had whether it's site-wise, interior,

[6:14] and with that for each school, we came up with a budget

[6:16] for our security upgrades.

[6:18] Also, exterior improvements of big ticket item

[6:20] was new pavement and striping.

[6:26] For a Baldwin middle school, this school, the, um, a little

[6:30] bit older. This one is, I'll just sorry, that one's not older. It's 1968, but, um, being a bigger

[6:37] school, it requires a little bit more money towards these capital improvements. Um, one of the big

[6:43] ticket items was roof replacement. AP, AP, DM, roofing, asphalt, shingles, and flashy,

[6:49] were big items that needed a lot of repair.

[6:52] Again, exterior improvements and security improvements.

[6:56] The lower parking lot requires some restriping

[6:59] and repaving.

[7:00] Some security upgrades.

[7:01] We had talked about since that has a long driveway coming down

[7:05] to it.

[7:05] There was concerns about car access and other similar security

[7:10] upgrades.

[7:11] Another big ticket item was case work again

[7:13] with just overall aging repairs and accessibility.

[7:18] Being an older school, the masonry, the exterior masonry needed, looks like it needs a bit of work.

[7:25] Some of these repairs are considered more immediate repairs, because we saw a lot of deterioration.

[7:30] At the exterior in certain facets, especially where moisture build up and mold growth and things like that we're occurring.

[7:37] Also, electrical upgrades, upgrades to the emergency systems, the exterior lighting and controls, and distribution panels.

[7:46] And then we put in some allowances for some accessibility and abatement for some of these upgrades,

[7:51] Being an older building, a statement is definitely a concern.

[7:57] For Kelvin Leat, we're around $12 million over the 10 years.

[8:02] Again, this was for HWAC replacing AC units

[8:06] and operating the HVAC controls.

[8:10] Also, in this one, a roof replacement,

[8:12] which we consider an immediate need for EPDM

[8:16] and asphalt shingle grouping.

[8:18] The plumbing systems need some upgrades for storm drainage systems and replacing some of the older manual flush valves to make them more energy efficient and also address some of the accessibility concerns.

[8:32] electrical upgrades, the main electrical service, electrical power distribution, for case work

[8:40] again.

[8:40] This is a similar accessibility concerns and older facilities, kitchen equipment, and then

[8:47] we also put in some allowances for there's an area where there's a connection to what looks

[8:53] like an addition for some portables that isn't necessarily accessible, so we've recommended

[8:58] and allowance for making that accessible.

[9:01] And then just general mechanical maintenance,

[9:03] because I believe this school had some newer systems.

[9:09] Geophort High School being your newest building,

[9:11] had far less that was required over the 10 years.

[9:14] Some kitchen equipment, replacement of some ovens,

[9:17] things like that, just keeping up with the times

[9:19] in all of your students coming in and out.

[9:22] And then exterior improvements in some security upgrades.

[9:26] But overall, this school obviously has a least amount

[9:29] because it's here, newest facility.

[9:32] Gilford Lakes were about $6 billion here.

[9:37] Exterior improvements, security upgrades,

[9:40] sidewalk replacements.

[9:42] Again, kitchen equipment.

[9:43] And again, in our report,

[9:45] you'll see a detailed breakdown of each equipment item

[9:48] that they're recommending being replaced

[9:50] in when they recommend that.

[9:53] And again, exterior soft bits and case work.

[9:57] And again, we put in the allowance

[9:59] for just some general repairs, general maintenance items that weren't necessarily big, ticket

[10:05] items that needed to be broken out individually, but things that just needs to be kept

[10:09] up with over time and then again, a statement for any of these types, any type of work

[10:13] that might impact like COA and so anything like that.

[10:19] And then Melissa Jones, we are just over $3 million.

[10:23] The bulk of that went towards Electrical, the Electrical Power Distribution, Made Electrical

[10:28] service and operating emergency lighting on the interior and exterior. And then

[10:34] an exterior improvement sidewalk and ramp replacement. Some of the ramps were a little

[10:39] older and we were concerned about the slopes as well. So some of that needs to be revisited

[10:44] with us, we would recommend a civil engineer.

[10:49] And Adam's middle school, this one was the biggest

[10:52] one. It's one of the older buildings and this one came in about 50 million dollars. The bulk

[10:59] of that goes towards the HVAC upgrades. We recommended installing a fully-ducted system within

[11:06] the old 1930s portion of the building and update the system controls, replace existing duckwork,

[11:14] HVAC units, RTUs. All of that has a huge impact on the structure of the building. There's an

[11:21] space above, so configuring all of that would be quite the challenge so a lot of that money would

[11:26] go towards structural upgrades that would be needed to support any new units that were installed

[11:31] in this portion of the building. We also recommended plumbing upgrades, replace existing fixtures,

[11:38] sanitary and vent piping, replace storming natural gas piping, and then roof replacement,

[11:44] And the single roof that you have is brand new and in beautiful condition, but the EPD and portions of the roof are definitely older and require replacement along with the flashing.

[11:57] And then we also recommended a full fire suppression system. Only a small portion of the building has any system and to be to make this building fully compliant with current standards.

[12:08] We recommend it in the entire building be provided with this and then a full kitchen renovation is something that we discussed

[12:16] At length with the superintendent and facilities director. It's a little bit undersized at the moment

[12:24] So we put in a number for full renovation and then

[12:29] Additionally, electrical upgrades, which would also be partially in conjunction with all these HBAC upgrades

[12:35] Upgrade exterior emergency lighting, distribution panels to help support all of those new systems and data cabling upgrades.

[12:45] As well as case work repairs and accessibility concerns.

[12:49] We also put in an allowance for potential swing space depending on when this work can happen.

[12:54] It might be too expensive to our extensive to happen over just one summer when you're doing a whole new HVA system or fire protection system.

[13:03] So, we put an allowance for a potential swing space.

[13:10] And as we continue to our discussions about atoms, we ended up going, we extended our

[13:16] CIP to 20 years, considering the age of the building, and all of the CIP is just for

[13:21] 10 years at the cost associated with that, as you can see quite intense.

[13:27] So, over the 20 year period, we would also recommend replacing the modular classroom, which came out

[13:35] to a little over $7 million.

[13:37] And then included in that some concrete sidewalk

[13:39] updates replacement of the driveways.

[13:43] And over a 20 year period escalational loan

[13:46] is almost $7 million.

[13:48] So that's where you get the $14 million at the top of the page

[13:51] here.

[13:54] And as we were working with the team on this,

[13:57] we looked at what it would cost to have a renovate

[14:01] as new, your existing building versus new construction.

[14:04] And then we also explored a new construction with a bonus, which the bonus would happen if we can prove to the state that

[14:13] Building a new building would actually be less expensive than renovating your existing building. So as you can see that we've breakdown on

[14:22] the left

[14:23] That's the total number and then we in the middle you have the eligible state share and on this right. That's what gilford would be

[14:32] would have to pay for this

[14:34] these changes. So renovate as new came out to about $99 million for the existing building

[14:42] including the portables that you would want to you would potentially replace. New construction

[14:47] adjust what your allowable is based on your enrollment projections does not include that extension

[14:54] because that is over the allowable per the state standards.

[15:00] So that came to about $87 million. And then, as you can see, when you do new construction with the, with the existing square footage, minus the portables, it's about $68 million.

[15:15] But since we were able to show here that you would have, it would be less expensive to do renovate as new, or no sorry, new construction renovate as new would be more expensive.

[15:26] of, then you get your construction bonus, your grant, if you went in for a grant, your share

[15:31] would actually go up to the run of A as a new percentage, which at the time was about

[15:37] 30 percent, I think it's changed the 27 numbers have come out, so these numbers would

[15:42] need to be tweaked a little bit, but it actually comes out to about 61 million dollars.

[15:50] I just wanted to plug in.

[15:52] Should you go back to the first page really quickly?

[15:59] So that was a lot of information that I'm sure you did the second page.

[16:04] That one.

[16:07] So everything that she just went through is summarized here.

[16:10] And if you add up everything that she just showed you,

[16:15] you'll see there's a lot of other things that are in the report that are not accounted for.

[16:19] those were just the big, the big picture item,

[16:22] so that we could actually make a presentation tonight

[16:24] and not have to go through 1,400 pages of this report.

[16:32] This also accounts for the cost of money

[16:35] as you go through the years.

[16:36] So we've escalated the price of these.

[16:38] If we say we're going to do something in one year,

[16:42] it's next year's dollars.

[16:43] If we say we're going to do something in five years,

[16:46] it's the price of money in five years.

[16:48] and then out 10 years are using a 4% per year escalation in price.

[16:53] So that's kind of what we did as a broad brush.

[16:56] Keep in mind that these are budgets and not cost estimates.

[16:59] These budgets are based on this was vetted by us,

[17:03] by our engineering firms that we work with, by our cost estimator,

[17:07] as numbers that we are currently using for railing wage construction

[17:12] in this area of Connecticut.

[17:14] So we've accounted for escalation and we've attempted to account for state reimbursements.

[17:21] Some things are reimbursable, some things are not reimbursable.

[17:24] And keep in mind that this report that we're asked to do is capital improvements.

[17:30] It's not an educational specification based review.

[17:34] It is just simply to maintain your buildings.

[17:37] With that?

[17:40] Yeah.

[17:41] Thank you.

[17:42] Sorry.

[17:44] I want to give you an opportunity, or anything you want to say at this moment?

[17:51] Okay.

[17:51] No, they want to roll up.

[17:52] You can argue to deny them so.

[17:53] Okay.

[17:54] Okay.

[17:56] I imagine there could be questions about process here and then no doubt.

[18:04] Questions or conversation around specific schools or specific items.

[18:09] And I have no need to kind of structure the conversation in any particular way.

[18:17] So really open to wherever someone might want to start a lot to take in, even just at the higher level.

[18:28] And because of that, the reformation for Adams was the timing such that it included the capital funding for the gym that we just passed or does that.

[18:40] Yes, we knew about that, so we did not include that.

[18:43] Don't learn.

[18:46] There are some small items that we did chip off of the list.

[18:50] Primarily, they were some of the safety and security upgrades.

[18:53] Now, those would fall into the tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars that we were able to chip away at this summer.

[19:00] But not any of the significant work we rolled into the numbers.

[19:05] Yeah, thanks.

[19:06] There'll be some people who are viewing this skeptically and last question.

[19:12] How much of this is nice to have, as opposed to must have, is over the next 10 years.

[19:20] do we really have any sensible choice about ignoring any of this or at least the things that

[19:27] really have to be done and get going on or you might be able to pair 25 or 30 million

[19:36] dollars off it and done a very minimum.

[19:43] So we did this report alongside our engineers that designed and filled with us on a daily

[19:54] So they went through and they looked at the life expectancy of the mechanical equipment and we

[20:00] based the big numbers here are our mechanical electrical and plumbing systems, as you can

[20:05] end roofs.

[20:06] So, we based the roofs on the roof age and when the warranty of the roof is up, the

[20:11] roof you could have had the greatest install ever and your 20 year roof will last you 40

[20:16] years.

[20:16] You may have gotten the McCoy units on the roof that were built on Wednesday and not on a Monday and they could last you 30 years and not the

[20:26] The to the end of the warranty. What I'm trying to say is we tried to take a look at an objective look at this and we projected this stuff out to the life expectancy of the equipment

[20:37] You guys have excellent maintenance here and things could last longer, but the the warranties and the maintenance

[20:45] schedule say this is when it's time to do the work. I know that you can take your

[20:51] chances but these are and then with the accessibility things the accessibility

[20:57] things should have been addressed a long time ago as you know we address those

[21:02] when the money is available to do them we call them out so that you can put them

[21:06] on your schedule. As far as nice to have I did right out of the gate say that we

[21:10] We're not addressing educational issues.

[21:13] We were just simply addressing facilities issues.

[21:17] Education's at my heart, but at the same token,

[21:19] we were just trying to make sure that your building's function

[21:21] as they were intended to be when they were designed

[21:23] and can continue to operate.

[21:25] So my short answer is you have to take this report very seriously

[21:29] and attempt to put these into your capital budgets.

[21:35] And this again is just a tool.

[21:37] And hopefully your schools last for a lot longer,

[21:39] but they are aged.

[21:43] What's the point, just focusing on Adamson's moment?

[21:45] What's the point beyond which we do so many of these projects that you're recommending

[21:52] that it no longer makes sense to consider a new building?

[21:56] No, no longer makes sense to consider a new building out in terms of doing capital and projects.

[22:00] In other words, if we once we spent 27 million dollars, we're not going to spend another 60 million dollars

[22:06] to build a new building right now.

[22:08] Okay, so what's the title of it?

[22:10] And then we have to consider the first 20 million dollars worth of work.

[22:14] I mean, the roof is a huge chunk of that.

[22:18] I mean, picked off part of it this year.

[22:20] Keep in mind, right?

[22:22] There's a huge difference between doing this work.

[22:25] This is maintenance.

[22:25] This is replacement of systems, right?

[22:28] Which normally gives you another...

[22:31] We're looking at abs specifically, that building, which has been almost 100 years, another 10 years will be 100 years old.

[22:41] By putting in 30 million dollars, you're not getting another 50 years out of it, right?

[22:47] Putting another 60 million in that building, you're not going to get another 20, you'll get 20 years, but you're not getting another 50 or 75.

[22:53] So what the point is is that this is more maintenance to keep it going if you were to build a new school and spend 60 million

[23:01] That's like this high school right we expect it's now the last 50 years

[23:05] But if I spend 30 million at Adams, that's only getting you 20 years

[23:09] So I don't know if you want to spend 30 million to get 20 years or do you spend 60 to get 50 to 60 years or 100 out of it again?

[23:16] But if we decided tomorrow to build a new school

[23:20] We would still have five or six years worth of bandits that would still need to be invested in that small to get us there.

[23:28] Now, the bandits won't cost the full 54 million, but it would be some amount of money like the roof that we did this summer to make sure that we could get to a new red and cutting.

[23:41] For example, it won't happen overnight if we decide if the community decides that that's the way to go.

[23:48] But the things that are wrong is the list of nothing to do with building being on your

[23:52] goal.

[23:53] The things that are on the list are HVAC, which hasn't.

[23:57] That maybe has something to do with being on building.

[24:00] But once you install that, you're going to get the lifetime of that out of it.

[24:05] 20 years.

[24:06] Approximately.

[24:07] That's how they go into it.

[24:09] What's that?

[24:09] That we're seeing in the news.

[24:11] That we're seeing in the news.

[24:12] That we're seeing in the news.

[24:16] That we're seeing in the news.

[24:17] It's just so weird.

[24:19] Easy and good stuff.

[24:20] Matt.

[24:21] Thank you very much for your presentation.

[24:22] Did my job explaining it?

[24:24] To blame?

[24:26] My question is a little bit more around priority solution.

[24:29] You gave us one to 10 year olds.

[24:31] We have a habit here in town of bonding on an annual basis for certain projects.

[24:36] A lot of those that we bond for, I've seen up here.

[24:41] So at some point, is there a way to prioritize on an annualized basis on these

[24:47] I'm going to call them peripheral, you know, not the $50 million project, and could we theoretically

[24:54] live over the next 10 years with bonding for $4 million a year, because that's what we've

[25:02] been historically doing. So, this is a little premature in the conversation to have that,

[25:08] but that kind of prioritizations because we'll give us some idea of how we could afford to

[25:13] some of this over a period of time, with having the bullomen payment do for the one major project

[25:21] at some point done. So we did actually attempt to address that with this report. We tried to

[25:28] bundle these projects so that they made sense. What is the priority on what's going to fail early

[25:37] and what makes sense to bundle things together. So the HVAC and roofing for instance kind of need

[25:43] be bundled together because you don't want to replace your roof and then have to go and rip

[25:47] the units off it and redo all of your doneage and redo all of that against.

[25:51] We tried to bundle all of the things together to get one mobilization at a school by a certain

[25:56] group of contractors.

[25:58] So instead of it being a flow of that kind of look straight across, it kind of goes like

[26:05] this over time, so it's really more of a question of, and then we try to look at what projects

[26:13] the state is going to assist you in, so what is the state going to allow you to bundle

[26:17] the other and what's going to be, so like the accessibility projects, the roofing projects,

[26:22] all of that stuff, you'll get some money for a lot of the, you know, the carpet replacements,

[26:27] and the ceiling replacements, and the cafeteria equipment, they're not going to give any money

[26:32] for that. So you can, you can kind of prioritize that as needed. Again, being the tool to help you

[26:40] decide that but we did try to bundle it that way it was hard to see that but on that first

[26:44] slide the first thing that you saw was that 10-year calendar and again it possible to

[26:50] see there but it shows you you zoom in on your projected spending for a year for those 10

[26:55] years but that is built on that 93 million dollar number not on a total of 40

[27:01] over again right this is this does not take into consideration other financial

[27:09] pressures, or political pressures, or anything else. So there might be some

[27:15] VE that could take place here, some of the right things that we could choose to address,

[27:19] not address, and if there were to be a large-scale decision about Adams and that

[27:26] calendar changes dramatically while you look at six buildings and a building project

[27:33] in the way we did 12 years ago now. Let me get this.

[27:36] And this is a working document.

[27:38] So we can actually read a lot of those things.

[27:40] And we call this up and say, you know, we're not doing

[27:42] Adam's taking about to move it out five years.

[27:44] So that's what I do on a regular basis every year.

[27:47] When I go for bonding, because I work with Paul and the staff,

[27:50] and looking at all the buildings at a replay order type of projects.

[27:53] You know, for example, we look at Adam's roof and go,

[27:55] can I get one more year out of that section or not?

[27:57] And then we determine that has to stay where we push a more year.

[28:01] So it is a fluid number that goes up and down.

[28:03] based upon what we think we can afford, get out from talking to you, and you have more to

[28:08] find as, and where are we stand with the operations of an actual physical condition of

[28:13] those different projects and the buildings themselves.

[28:18] Just a quick thought.

[28:19] Thank you.

[28:19] Thank you for that explanation.

[28:21] I couldn't see that.

[28:22] I couldn't see that.

[28:23] Do you think it would be easier to see tomorrow?

[28:26] We'll get that opportunity.

[28:28] Thank you.

[28:30] I'll pass on this.

[28:31] That way.

[28:33] My nails.

[28:36] First of all, nice job.

[28:39] We kind of live in the same sphere of self.

[28:43] To kind of address a couple different issues and I'm not going to answer this question because it's on that last slide which I appreciate.

[28:49] Because we do analysis this all the time.

[28:53] When I look at something like this, for example, I see $92 million.

[28:57] and the community, of course, is going to go $92 million a lot of money, but communities do

[29:04] this so that they can actually, and I think you probably already kind of figure this out.

[29:08] And I think we're all going to come to the realization that there's going to be one, usually

[29:12] there's one or two projects that are like, well, that's the big one.

[29:16] There's no surprise here.

[29:18] I don't think from any of us that Adams is the big ticket item.

[29:21] So, I would be looking at this at least from the summary that you've got $92 million, but if you

[29:29] subtract out the 50, no, wait for it, because there's a reason why I'm doing this.

[29:35] Now you're at, but, you know, call it 42 million over 10 years, which now gets to your

[29:40] 4 million.

[29:41] But that means you're taking items and you're saying, all right, you can't necessarily

[29:46] bond for $18 million for the HBAC at all, right, so this is where it's a community

[29:51] we need to start thinking okay, going to lose point and the mass point. How much money do we

[29:57] sink into atoms before?

[30:00] It makes sense to take it offline and build possibly a new school that would be more class effective.

[30:09] And I didn't want to necessarily try to answer the question of likelihood, but if you go to the last slide, you have that reimbursement.

[30:16] This is what communities look like when you hear about the community somewhere in Connecticut that says,

[30:21] Okay, they did a study at this school,

[30:23] is now being, is going forward for referendum

[30:26] to do a renovated new.

[30:29] And you look at, you know, the costs here.

[30:32] The one thing that I wanted to make sure was clear

[30:34] that there's a 20 year CIP that is put out for, you know,

[30:39] called $64 million based on all the analysis that you did.

[30:42] And then a renovated new is $99 million.

[30:46] Could you, for the people here in,

[30:49] could you just explain why there's such a difference between why there are 20-year CIP

[30:56] of 64 million and a renovated new for $99 million, which is basically adding 50% of

[31:03] the cost. Why is that? So we were asked to put together a 10-year CIP and when we looked at

[31:14] And so the problem here, the first short answer to that is, is a bond is going to be for 20 years, and not 10 years.

[31:23] So you would want to compare a 10 year CIP to a 20 year bond project.

[31:28] You want to go look at Apple's to Apple's.

[31:31] And so what would happen is if we looked at Adams as a 10 year project and disregarded the portables and the fact that

[31:38] The swing space would be required for a renovate is new or a new construction.

[31:43] That's money that you wouldn't be comparing apples to apples if you didn't look at it through the lens of 20 years.

[31:50] So that's why this one kind of sat in the kind of a separate category because we get to the end of the 10 years.

[31:58] You've spent your 50 million dollars, but you've got other money sitting out there that you're going to have to spend between year 11 and 20.

[32:06] That's a real money that we didn't want to disregard.

[32:10] And so that became the comparison for, do we do the CIP?

[32:14] Do we look at, and the whole reason to look at a renovator's new is the cost of money.

[32:19] The state's going to give you reimbursement on that renovator's new.

[32:22] You're not going to get renovated.

[32:24] You're not going to get money on a lot of these CIP projects.

[32:27] So that's why this was a look at in a different lens.

[32:30] Did I answer that?

[32:33] I just want to say appreciate this slide because this could be a very key slide for us to keep going back to because guess what it's only going to get worse is the year to go on.

[32:44] But I know that there's escalation that's part of this as well, but I'm sure you're out of it.

[32:49] But this is where communities and ours included would look at a new construction with the bonuses.

[32:53] It's just assumed that we get all the bonuses that Jamie talked about.

[32:57] The Gilford Chair would be 60 million versus doing 64 million over 20 years.

[33:02] Well, that is something to think about, that it's actually cheaper for the community to go for a new school.

[33:09] And get the reimbursement then to do repairs over and over and over again and get almost virtually nothing.

[33:15] Which, which also has another added benefit, it allows us to also have the same time for fewer dollars.

[33:23] think about education and instruction, and so we've said several times that this

[33:28] presentation is about facilities only, and we understand those limitations, but

[33:34] if the community chooses to go in this direction, just as we did with this

[33:38] high school, this high school project 12 years ago, wasn't just a thoughtful

[33:44] and efficient savings for the town over time, it also became

[33:49] and structurally wholly different than that old building was, and we would have that opportunity

[33:54] a little bit up to us if we talk about this slide, that opportunity does not open to us

[34:00] when we talk about all of the other slides that we've looked at today.

[34:04] My only last thing is that we did this with the high school, and this is the analysis that we do

[34:10] with Adams, and that it being the right move for the high school.

[34:14] Of course, you could look right and say, of course it was, but back then, when we were looking

[34:18] the numbers it was cheaper to actually build a new school that tried to renovate what was here

[34:22] by by the long shot. So I did. Yeah, so while I'm glad we're talking about the

[34:29] Amazon, I'm wondering if we could have the same conversation around Calvary Lee.

[34:32] It was a matter of fact, it seems to actually have a higher percentage of

[34:35] placement need to replacement value or sorry, but herane need to replacement value,

[34:40] then Ava's does. So I mean, should we be having the same conversation around Calvary Lee as well?

[34:45] So Calvin Lee is coming to this 20 year life cycle on a lot of items that were done.

[34:52] So when I first arrived, he replaced the entire HVC, he replaced the food portion of the roof.

[34:59] I saw the windows, and it sunk into your upgrades. It was not renovated like new,

[35:05] but that hit the largest costs for that building.

[35:10] I think it was about the 90 million dollar project back then.

[35:13] years ago. So all those systems now are coming at the same time, are coming up due to be

[35:20] looked at. Now that being said, again, we'll win those last over 20 years. Yes, that

[35:26] you know, we'll keep pushing those and we've done certain stuff that increased or

[35:30] relaxed man, but things like the HAC system. Yes, we're starting to start to break

[35:37] down and have problems. We'll let have to get replaced, yes, a little.

[35:43] So it is a potential

[35:45] time to discuss that. I just don't see that that building being as large of a need as

[35:51] analysts and as critical as Adams. I think I'm rather than best, you know, several million

[35:57] in the cowardly and revitalized system by system, plus I can pick them off and stagger them,

[36:04] where I feel that Adams is a much bigger number in a much bigger

[36:08] need than what we have going on at Cal.

[36:11] I think I look at that 10 year number of, I know it says,

[36:15] I know it says Paul is here, but we've got total number of 27 million.

[36:20] That's 63 percent of that.

[36:22] The place we cost.

[36:24] I think to lose question,

[36:27] Leet is more of a car that is generally in good shape that needs

[36:31] new transmission, and it's worth putting the new transmission in to get another 100,000,

[36:36] whereas Adams already has 300,000 miles, and would you put a brand new transmission into

[36:43] the car that has a bad signboard transmission?

[36:47] So, I think yes, openly, because of that 20-year mark is a bigger ticket, but the building

[36:54] that is generally in good shape, but needs to have a number of those systems replaced, and we

[37:00] we'll get another 150,000 miles out of that once we make those investments.

[37:05] Adams, I think, is fundamentally a different question, as it begins from the approach

[37:09] of Centennial.

[37:11] I did, at the second given mic, PTS.

[37:17] Can we show that a number to build a ballman would be close or grossly higher than the

[37:26] 50 million to move atoms over there, share that infrastructure.

[37:30] This was something that went to referendum on a long ago. So that's a level of analysis we had last four.

[37:37] These prices are just based on square footage, but a thoughtful plan that may be with the existing property of all land and grows out and existing facility that already houses 500 to be capable of housing a thousand or 1100.

[37:55] There might be some efficiencies that could be found in such a plant.

[37:58] We didn't ask these guys to go to that level of analysis yet.

[38:02] I hope I did.

[38:03] Did I also, as an education.

[38:06] Because there would certainly be some adaptive reuse for the current out of his property, including such a revenue.

[38:14] Right, tax revenue.

[38:15] I think when we do know from the previous study, what pushing 20 years ago now, that the site

[38:20] that all when is large enough to facilitate a thousand students five through eight middle

[38:25] school, which are right, then clears up and makes that property available for town use or

[38:30] for any number of things that might offset the cost of a project.

[38:35] Sorry, Mike.

[38:36] I thought, hey, I'm like, can't you everyone who wanted to speak?

[38:41] Go ahead.

[38:42] I'm maybe restating a previous question.

[38:45] The question is, in the report, in the 1,400 pages, is there a place that we could go and I'll

[38:52] just focus on groups, for example, where we looked at a 10-year study here, but are some

[38:57] of these groups still in a year or in a year of 10?

[39:00] If that's important, if it's not in the report, or maybe it is, is that information there?

[39:06] Yes, yes.

[39:07] The end of the document, we have spreadsheets that bring you out for every single year.

[39:10] So you'll be able to see where we've recommend that our roof replacement, for example, happens.

[39:16] Thank you.

[39:18] Yeah, the whole thing is all strong in the others.

[39:20] So as we cost the things out, it depopulated the big picture and so as you.

[39:25] And so we placed each roof in what year we think it should be done.

[39:29] We tried not to stack everything in the first year, but a lot of things, obviously, are stacked in the first year because of Adams.

[39:34] These guys have been building, they could have presented by year and got 10 years out and you see everything that way as well.

[39:40] What do you want to talk about in a little bit with Matt's comments about Adam's involvement?

[39:48] But generally speaking, the 60 million that's represented here to build Adam's

[39:54] is just simply a square footage to build a school number.

[39:57] Is that right?

[39:57] Correct.

[39:58] So it's not including purchasing property, which I assume if we put it at Baldwin, we don't actually

[40:03] have to purchase property.

[40:05] And then we would be able to potentially sell atoms and then gain whatever tax benefit we would get from

[40:13] somebody doing whatever they decide to do with that property. So we would get a potential

[40:17] sale number that would come to the town and then a tax revenue year over year that would be coming to the town.

[40:25] And that is not anything that's represented here at all. So that's 60 grand is 60 million.

[40:31] wish it were 60 grand. It's just square footage grace for the building.

[40:36] Yeah, we took the projected enrollment, multiplied that by how many square feet the state was going to allow.

[40:41] We multiplied that by the current cost of construction, within we accommodated for some swing space,

[40:46] some different, some things that are probably likely you were going to spend on it.

[40:52] And then that's how we get it.

[40:52] This number was high.

[40:54] Is it possible that we would use the existing building as swing space and then be able to

[40:58] to adopt that, that's you out of that.

[41:01] Yeah, it's a brilliant relationship.

[41:02] If we were building on empty property that existed adjacent to Baldwin,

[41:07] then there wouldn't be a swing space.

[41:08] Yeah, right.

[41:09] It's what we did here.

[41:11] It was really complicated here.

[41:12] But we squeezed two buildings onto this space during the construction

[41:17] and then demolition.

[41:18] And was that swing space number like 7 million more?

[41:21] Yes, so was it around 7 million?

[41:23] Yes.

[41:23] We renovated as new.

[41:25] That was included in the renovating space.

[41:26] down to 53.

[41:30] What

[41:33] was the construction cost that you use per square foot?

[41:36] A thousand thousand.

[41:39] I wanted to make sure that got up there.

[41:40] That is unfortunate.

[41:43] Ten years ago it was...

[41:46] Four hundred four hundred four hundred.

[41:48] Four hundred four hundred.

[41:50] It's gone up substantially in the last five years.

[41:53] You've lived it as well.

[41:55] That's a little bit good.

[42:00] Mike, now you can take around all of the semifzina come out with this question, but Mike,

[42:05] you were asking a question before you understood it, but for the rest of us about, I think,

[42:15] to some extent the difference in cost and a new versus a renovate like new, would some

[42:24] that be about things like in order to put HVAC, appropriate HVAC in this building, we're going

[42:33] to need to do acrobatics.

[42:39] That's why the state kind of gives you that incentive to do a really deep dive into

[42:45] renovators.

[42:46] Because some renovations, you have some space and it's really easy to get move the kids out,

[42:51] the construction and move them back in. In some cases it's, it's, it's, yeah, it's, it makes it,

[42:58] complexity is one of the big cost drivers here. Right. Yeah, for sure. No doubt.

[43:03] To follow up on that, so the 20 year CIP number was different than the rainyvades new. What is included

[43:09] in one that's not in the other.

[43:13] We felt that if we were going to look at a renovated new number,

[43:18] that was going to be a 20 year bond?

[43:24] Yeah, is it all the projects in the 20 year CIP,

[43:27] that you're just calling right away as new in the state?

[43:29] Get your money for it?

[43:30] Or is it like that you're doing it all at once?

[43:33] Or are there more projects involved in the renovators?

[43:37] Could it?

[43:39] Well, I'm just going to ask for you to confirm this.

[43:43] Usually it costs like that.

[43:45] So when you renovate a school is new,

[43:47] you have to touch everything.

[43:49] So there are projects that are not in that

[43:51] 64 that have to be touched.

[43:54] That may not be 20 years old.

[43:56] And so you have to make everything 20 years old,

[44:00] even if it's two years old.

[44:02] Yeah, that's right.

[44:03] But if you got reimbursement for it,

[44:04] you're going to lose your reimbursement because.

[44:07] So the root for you just your place.

[44:09] We'd have to replace it again.

[44:11] Yes.

[44:13] Really, really, really important piece of this whole thing

[44:17] is that it's a special for the state, it says, if you're not maintaining it, we're not paying for it.

[44:24] But we're going to let you renovate it as new if you do everything and we know that your investment is good for the next 20 years.

[44:30] That's the idea.

[44:34] So.

[44:34] Yeah, go ahead.

[44:35] How much of, I'm guessing, considering projected census, as far as student populations and the different levels?

[44:44] Yeah, we looked at the year projection for the enrollments.

[44:48] Whenever we looked at a portion of our project, that was going to be reimbursed by the state.

[44:53] We would look at the year loan projections, or out of years, and use that number.

[44:58] And that was the number that we used.

[45:00] Yeah, I'm a school as a replacement. That's how we size the new construction and how we took the penalty on the renovating this new to the existing building. The truth is when you probably do that, you're probably going to just eliminate that the portable classroom, right? I mean, you're not going to renovate that. So in order to fully understand that, that goes the next level to, you know, the board writing and educational specification and it becomes a guideline to that.

[45:31] And these are objective, how the state reimburses you and what your money is worth.

[45:39] That's a bunch of things.

[45:40] So the outcomes of the programatically are we at a place where that school is becoming more

[45:44] and more obsolete.

[45:46] Just to do it programmatically, it's not my area of expertise.

[45:49] Yes.

[45:50] And so again, it would be really similar to the change that we made here.

[45:54] So there were really good things happening in the old high school, despite the facility

[46:00] limitations. Now those challenges have been taken out of the way and we're the same as happening

[46:07] at Adams. Really simple things like the 1930 classrooms that have space cooler units in them

[46:15] that you can't run while you're trying to have a conversation with your children. And so we turn

[46:21] the AC off during actual instructional time so that people can hear each other and we try to cool

[46:27] the spaces down when the room isn't being used or when the students are doing

[46:31] project work.

[46:33] Real simple example.

[46:35] But we would be able to do different things with technology, different things with furniture,

[46:39] different things with a front shape with a classroom, size and a classroom.

[46:44] And what I said we'd finally be able to think about the instructional impact of doing this work

[46:49] as well as trying to be efficient and spend our money wisely to keep these buildings

[46:53] from the best shape we can.

[46:55] I think the high school staff here felt unfettered when they moved into this space in a way that they haven't expected.

[47:04] We talked a lot about roofing each VAC, but there are, are there any like health and safety priorities that we need to make sure our front focus?

[47:12] Like things that we need to take care of now.

[47:16] The indoor air quality of the buildings is addressed directly by the HVAC.

[47:22] And

[47:25] so addressing that is going to address a lot of the health and safety issues.

[47:31] I believe one of the problems with doing it this way, I'm trying not to be not objective, but one of the problems here is that you've got the big operating windows and you've got walls that have an R value of zero.

[47:44] So, we're literally like monomidages to say,

[47:47] what are you heating me outdoors?

[47:49] You really are.

[47:51] So, before you really size your HBC equipment,

[47:53] you want to really secure your on-the-loop.

[47:56] And that's something that we wouldn't be doing.

[48:00] So, on a day when you've got a high-pollony count outside,

[48:02] and you've got students sensitive to allergies.

[48:08] And it's really hot in the building.

[48:09] You're opening that window.

[48:11] And the allergens are all coming in

[48:12] with us secured, for a visitor of secure envelope.

[48:17] You don't have that problem, you were dealing with the air,

[48:19] with filters, and pre-cooling, and I'll let maybe

[48:22] you'll know there's a reference made about, like,

[48:25] electrical panels, right?

[48:27] Are we of any concern right now about some of the electrical

[48:29] that's in any of the buildings that we need to replace

[48:31] you anyway?

[48:32] No, we've taken care of most of those issues over the past

[48:37] probably 10 years.

[48:38] If you recall, we did do a couple of large upgrades,

[48:40] It's atoms, which we carry out on a bunch of panels there.

[48:45] And then we also do work at Jones to ensure sections of that building we're done in Baldwin.

[48:51] We did a heavy electrical upgrade there to improve and replace a lot of panels.

[48:57] So overall we're all going to pretty much see this electrical.

[49:02] We kind of did not have some of the really old stuff.

[49:04] But again, it's all going to be fun.

[49:06] you'll like safety systems in our mind, they're just, yeah, they're just, yeah, they're just like to follow up on Bill's question, relative consideration for student population drops, which are their obvious, and they've got a continuing drop, they're based on birth rates, right?

[49:24] What are we going to be prepared to start the community about why we are or are not considering closing a school?

[49:31] It's an unfair question, but it's one that I think is in the community, right, neighbors around us are close in schools.

[49:40] We are also seeing population drops.

[49:42] I know we haven't seen them through the green that Madison did or maybe some of the other communities did.

[49:48] Oh, into the success of this board of education and putting the first class education out there.

[49:53] So at one point, we start addressed that conversation and cut it off at its knees before we get too deep into this.

[50:00] So, where are we in our, I'm trying to remember where we are in our demographic study?

[50:06] Like two or three years in?

[50:07] I was going to say two or three years.

[50:09] We had a slammer who would do a demographic study.

[50:12] It's actually showed that we're going to start increasing enrollment again.

[50:18] Now, we only now will go out another seven years.

[50:25] So, it's not an important question.

[50:27] But the study that was done for Gilford suggests that we're going to start increasing again.

[50:35] We are not going to reach the level we were at 10 years ago, and looking at Paul because

[50:39] he might know the study more, have it more in the front of his head, but actually showed

[50:46] that we're going to start picking up enrollment again.

[50:50] Yeah, so the it's available on our website it is the slam demographic study

[50:56] It showed that in years one through five now again probably two maybe even three years into it

[51:03] It had showed that in years one through five the decline was gonna slow and then stop in plateau and in years five through ten

[51:10] We were going to start increasing in the moment once again

[51:13] We are tracking behind we're not slowing as quickly as it said we would

[51:18] So it might be worthwhile, especially if we're going to think about a building project.

[51:22] It might be worthwhile to go back and ask them to update that stuff.

[51:26] But they saw leveling and then increasing birth rates again, or enrollment rates.

[51:32] I think the birth rate is already sort of leveled out and they're expecting that we're going

[51:36] to start growing again.

[51:38] We're not seeing that as quickly as the study projected in first couple years.

[51:42] It's really different because the previous study we were supposed to be declining.

[51:47] and we never declined at the rate that the study projected we always declined slower.

[51:52] Now this study tells us we're going to plateau and start growing and we're not doing that as quickly as the study projected either.

[51:59] I think we need that data sooner rather than later because there are a number of people who will tell me.

[52:04] Absolutely.

[52:04] And as time goes, we had 3700 kids in a system.

[52:08] Sure.

[52:09] I would say this out of my street.

[52:11] Four houses in the last 18 months have turned over from no kids families to babies.

[52:17] preschool age kids all four houses so we can reach out and ask them to take care of it.

[52:23] I think we need to get 100% and it is a good idea to best have a little bit of time.

[52:34] I think there's a perception in the world that our student population is dropping, is dropping, significantly over the years. Why are we going to be spending so much more money to not look at when the opportunity to solve it?

[52:46] Now, I think that, right, again, if we go back to the plan of taking two middle schools

[52:53] and consolidating, they're right, so I think that there is consolidation in the buildings

[52:59] there.

[53:00] There'd be bus run efficiencies that could be generated there without necessarily, we need

[53:06] to be prepared to answer the question, but it might be consolidating at that middle level

[53:11] and not necessarily closing one of four neighborhoods schools.

[53:13] I don't know, it's a good one.

[53:16] Thank you, I don't know.

[53:17] No, no, it's a really, really, really, really.

[53:19] I have this, thank you.

[53:23] I know, now, once people have materials in front of them,

[53:28] and are looking at them, they'll be more good.

[53:32] I'm looking at them.

[53:33] Good job.

[53:34] Good job.

[53:35] Good job.

[53:39] Good job.

[53:44] Good job.

[53:46] And I kind of wanted to bring my question back in line.

[53:49] I mean, if we do that 12 million dollar project, somehow.

[53:57] And even if we decided we're going to build a new building today,

[54:01] that's five years of tone.

[54:04] That's the way five years.

[54:09] And then I hope I'm saying this clearly.

[54:11] As a ten-year window of usage for the HBAC,

[54:14] is that cost effective?

[54:16] We're getting a building 10 years from now,

[54:19] and we have nine years at least of better air quality

[54:24] in this middle floor building.

[54:27] Is that a sensible question?

[54:31] I think I just can kind of feel off that a little bit.

[54:35] Depending on what the decision that's made, right?

[54:42] That would greatly influence what work we do there,

[54:45] but it also determines what level we're working, right?

[54:48] So if you told me we're gonna keep this building

[54:50] for about 50 years, I'm gonna do

[54:52] that we do the most of the schools

[54:54] and put a mid to high range system in there

[54:58] that we know we get good quality, right?

[55:01] That beats all, you know,

[55:02] assuray's and all the other standards that we need.

[55:04] However, if you told me that you only need to get five,

[55:07] maybe seven years out of it,

[55:09] I'd be that system now, right?

[55:11] We still get good air quality,

[55:12] But it might not be as high a quality or have different features, right?

[55:17] It might have less controls, some less monitoring, things of that nature,

[55:22] because we know we don't need that long term.

[55:26] Yeah. So you can get a million dollars.

[55:28] H2S, you said it twice. Just pick a yellow, it's out of thin air.

[55:31] Yeah, right here, you said it twice.

[55:33] And suddenly with a lot of 10 year life, not 20 year life, that's right.

[55:36] So the whole ad is planned.

[55:39] Like plan being for ad.

[55:46] So it sounds like we're sitting in the study is really study of necessity, it's necessary that we do most of this work.

[55:59] And there's a cost associated with it, they can't be ignored.

[56:02] And no matter how much none of us like this is community members, we're either going to pay now or pay later.

[56:08] And that seems to be a fact.

[56:12] That's the general thing.

[56:15] The elephant in the room is atoms.

[56:18] Insofar as if we decide that the cost benefit of fixing it and then seeing that we're not going to get one that tenure benefit out of it.

[56:31] Versus going to do it, biking the bulletin out and starting to plan, even if we take five, six years or seven years to get it.

[56:37] Since if we decide that relative we soon speak from strategic point of view, we usually

[56:44] just start having the conversation with the community, so that in fact, we haven't spent

[56:49] four years talking about this in 30.

[56:51] We've got real numbers, we've got real needs, and these things can be made very concrete,

[56:57] no pun intended.

[57:00] And so, I'm simply suggesting that the more we can actually make this a realistic proposition.

[57:09] At some point, the board is going to be responsible for making a recommendation in our budget as to what we should do.

[57:17] I'm just saying to my colleagues, it sounds like we, in consultation with the other board,

[57:22] or to come up with some sort of a plan, well, to be said.

[57:27] I want to add something that I think is really important

[57:32] for everybody on the camera to hear.

[57:37] And I'm sure the Board of Supplements are thinking about it,

[57:39] I'm sure the Board of Finance is thinking about it,

[57:42] but we know I hope everyone knows when it comes to the community

[57:45] that this is not the only project that's going to be happening

[57:50] when we just had a meeting last week and having a meeting next week about buying property

[57:55] possibly for use of another for a police station project that we don't necessarily have

[58:03] yet. We also have a public work skill that is looking to be moved in our place.

[58:10] I think it's very important that no one thinks, hey, Adam's needs to be replaced. We need

[58:16] plan in a year and we need to get this thing built in five years. We've got bonding, you know,

[58:22] to consider. I'm not saying we have bonding issues, but we can't bond everything all in a

[58:27] matter of five years. Otherwise we're going to spike to like a 20% or 15% of our capacity,

[58:33] which is not what we want. We want things to roll off to add on. So, I think I wanted to do that's kind

[58:39] of a PSA, because if anybody thinks in the community, oh my God, we're going to do that.

[58:46] And there must be crazy.

[58:47] And I know that people will post on Facebook tonight.

[58:50] Or in social media or whatever their media is,

[58:54] I can't believe this town is going to spend more money.

[58:56] This is part of the whole process of planning.

[58:59] And it wasn't for Friday or doing the study.

[59:01] We wouldn't have the tools, which is exactly what Michael said

[59:04] numerous times, to be able to look at this in a realistic way.

[59:09] So we're cognizant of all the other things

[59:11] that are going on.

[59:11] We have to plan and put them in the,

[59:14] whether I want to say white order because I'm sure the police station wants to be done first order.

[59:19] But I'm sure that the school system wants theirs on first, and I'm sure public works wants theirs on first.

[59:23] But they're going to have to somehow go into a process.

[59:26] And perhaps they think they're very obvious, but always work.

[59:32] Right, we have the board of selectments and the board of finance and the standing building committee here.

[59:37] Not as an FYI, right?

[59:40] I mean, this is a community or decision, right?

[59:46] Two-year point.

[59:49] And on top of your point, these are decisions

[59:52] we need to make collaboratively thinking about everything

[59:56] that we as time officials need to think about.

[59:59] Go ahead.

[1:00:00] Another intangible that's kind of held in the room for the atoms is the historic nature of the building. Yes, it's the downside because the HVC is difficult to put in all that, but I know there are people in the community that don't want to see that building just raised and replaced it, so that will be part of the conversation and on both sides of the fence.

[1:00:23] I'd like to thank you for bringing up the townside, I didn't want to rain on it, I'd like to pray here tonight.

[1:00:28] I'd like to write and talk to you tonight's point.

[1:00:31] We've basically been sitting on a new public version of SLA for a few years.

[1:00:36] We purchased a piece of property that we had with the express intent of moving it up there.

[1:00:39] We did some preliminary, the site work, we did some preliminary design work,

[1:00:45] and we've been sitting on it because it's very fact that in 2030 we're going to see this and ever get to decline

[1:00:51] in our death service pains, which are for, so we've got into the queue,

[1:01:00] essentially at least one project on the town side, and now there's another

[1:01:04] potential project in the police department, so I think it is going to take a

[1:01:08] little bit of work, a lot of work, and we've demonstrated that the ability to do

[1:01:12] that in the past, between the boards, to figure out how we do this collectively.

[1:01:19] We had kind of a one-hour meeting here in mind, but I don't want, and I'm saying that

[1:01:27] I'd just to be respectful of people's time, but I certainly don't want to cut off discussion

[1:01:31] or questions if there are people who still have them that haven't had a chance.

[1:01:36] The only thing I'll have to do with Dick was just saying is, in order to have a communication,

[1:01:41] conversation we do need to understand what the cost to add to Baldwin will be.

[1:01:46] That is definitely, you know, an important piece to this.

[1:01:53] I mean, I've heard a couple of action items, some of them easier than others.

[1:01:59] One is a Board of Education for Public Schools,

[1:02:05] considering a kind of an update toward a demographic study.

[1:02:09] That's going to be an important information to it in the form.

[1:02:14] That has a great, that has come up.

[1:02:16] If one of the things we need to think about

[1:02:18] is is Baldwin, a site where we might

[1:02:23] in a conversation around all these things,

[1:02:26] think about adding what we'll have to determine

[1:02:31] how to make that assessment.

[1:02:33] We can have a conversation about how to try to find

[1:02:38] more specific numbers, but it gets complicated

[1:02:41] it by how far into a process do we want to start going to?

[1:02:46] I don't think we're ready to start writing in specs, which would be a requirement to start

[1:02:51] to get real numbers, but we might be able to refine the very broad numbers for tonight

[1:02:56] more fully and see if that helps as the town has to make thoughtful holistic priority decisions

[1:03:04] overall. We're very aware of the fact that this is only one side of a very multifaceted conversation.

[1:03:14] One question. Like how much work was done to develop estimates for moving for expanding

[1:03:20] Baldwin, 15 years ago, whatever that was? Well, didn't we know it was dead while? Were we

[1:03:27] looking at developing Baldwin? Yes, it is. How much state work was done? Engineering workers? Is there

[1:03:33] anything that we had on a...

[1:03:35] There was a study done by...

[1:03:40] I think was the only system.

[1:03:42] I think Fletcher Thompson.

[1:03:43] Yeah, there's fairly extensive plans.

[1:03:45] I want to get you all.

[1:03:46] I probably have it somewhere very filed.

[1:03:48] That probably talks me about it.

[1:03:49] There was a possibility that we'd have, we have those.

[1:03:52] We have, we have those.

[1:03:53] If you have it, but again, there are 20 years old.

[1:03:56] And we want to look at the plan itself.

[1:03:58] I think at a very high level,

[1:04:00] it is a really thoughtful and elegant plan

[1:04:02] to put two facilities on one side.

[1:04:05] There's a lot that are used for a 5A in middle school.

[1:04:08] I don't think we need to be maintaining

[1:04:10] two separate middle schools.

[1:04:12] I think there's a lot conceptually that is very good.

[1:04:16] But it's 20 years old.

[1:04:17] We want to take a look at it and be really thoughtful about it.

[1:04:21] But I think that even the 20-year-old plan should have been able

[1:04:23] to say, OK, we're going to accommodate

[1:04:24] 70, we're going to accommodate the playing field.

[1:04:26] We're going to accommodate, we're going to accommodate.

[1:04:28] I think he tells us we have this big set for sure.

[1:04:30] The other document to start, the only thing I would caution, and this is something that

[1:04:35] sort of, Dr. Freeman would have to do, is look at those planets and look at the concepts

[1:04:40] and say, all right, is this still going to meet?

[1:04:44] You know, for example, 20 years ago, you may not have the technology,

[1:04:48] or whatever other C for equivalent that you would want to implement now.

[1:04:52] So you'd have to look at it and say, oh, this wasn't in there.

[1:04:54] Oh, we don't need that anymore.

[1:04:56] But other than that, I think, I think it was a pretty accessibility and

[1:05:00] services, yes, I think it answers the fact that I think it answers that it's feasible.

[1:05:05] Yes.

[1:05:05] So that's another action I can make to take a look at those plans and see what we can learn

[1:05:10] from them in a way that helps inform thinking that way.

[1:05:16] And would there then be projects at Baldwin that you'd want to put off because...

[1:05:20] Yes.

[1:05:21] Construction.

[1:05:22] Oh, absolutely.

[1:05:24] I mean, exactly.

[1:05:24] That was factored on timeline.

[1:05:26] I'm sure it's a very complicated web.

[1:05:28] I'm just trying to identify, because any action steps that we can, you know,

[1:05:36] these decisions are going to be made by kind of identifying the small steps first.

[1:05:41] So we've got a couple of, I imagine people around this table would think of these on the car right home

[1:05:48] or tomorrow or sometimes this weekend.

[1:05:50] And I...

[1:05:52] Or when they get poor food applications.

[1:05:56] And I do want...

[1:05:59] There may be a better approach to this product.

[1:06:02] At least in the meantime,

[1:06:06] I, as Board of Encher,

[1:06:08] with Dr. Freeman and Clip,

[1:06:10] and we can receive questions,

[1:06:16] proposed additional action items

[1:06:19] that could help this group really think thoughtfully about various actions.

[1:06:26] If there's a lesson to be learned of what we've been through with the police department situation,

[1:06:32] we don't have any plans to spend any money right now.

[1:06:36] All we're talking about is what are the needs over the long term?

[1:06:41] No, we got clocked with a $35 million police department.

[1:06:46] And that, unfortunately, sort of, coalesced with the opportunity to purchase the property on that, on that, on that, so to keep it separate, and message is we don't have any definitive players to spend, any money at this point.

[1:07:03] I'm trying to be fall forward for it.

[1:07:04] No, that's what I'm holding.

[1:07:06] And have a long game.

[1:07:09] Absolutely.

[1:07:11] Any last questions?

[1:07:18] I want to thank fire for all the work that they put in the time it's put into helping us to have this conversation and two I do want to know and I want to thank Cliff Gernom

[1:07:29] We have been

[1:07:30] Investing thoughtfully in these buildings for the last 15 to 20 years now. We know that this is a big number. I also know that this number is a lot smaller because of the work that we've been doing consistently regularly and thoughtfully. We started with a 10-year study. We had a 10-year study 12 years ago that we worked from in very much the same way. And I know that that number could be a lot bigger if it worked for the thoughtful work and planning that has gone into date.

[1:07:59] We are in good shape because of the work that we've done this board and our facilities office and I just wanted to acknowledge all of that work as we're talking about really thoughtful big decisions for the town and moving forward.

[1:08:13] I want to thank everyone for joining us for the viewing public.

[1:08:19] You may also certainly address questions as you always may.

[1:08:24] our email addresses are all online and I think this is obviously getting a lot of conversations moving forward.

[1:08:40] Last chance. Last chance. Again, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for answering all of our questions.

[1:08:49] I am going to request motion to adjourn.

[1:08:52] Thank you.

[1:08:53] All in favor?

[1:08:55] All right.

[1:08:56] Thank you, everyone.

Board of Education Facility Assessment Meeting 9/9/26

Transcript