[0:00] which items two and three around just because we have our sheriff here

[0:03] and I know he's going to have some comments on on the third item.

[0:07] So just let you know kind of where we're going with this morning.

[0:11] Um So first up we have our highway department communication plan with Megan

[0:16] and Justin I assume as well.

[0:18] Sarah, we got Sarah here.

[0:20] And what's your name? Sarah. Sarah. Okay.

[0:22] Morning.

[0:23] Good morning, yes.

[0:24] Good morning. Thanks for having us back.

[0:26] We just have a a thought we'd come back with a quick update.

[0:29] Um at our last meeting with you guys.

[0:32] We took a lot of notes as to kind of what your expectations were and what you wanted

[0:36] to be able to communicate out to residents regarding this this project still, so

[0:40] we as a team worked with your staff and kind of came up with an overall plan.

[0:44] So we'll go through that.

[0:45] um today just a quickly on a couple things.

[0:48] Um if you do want to put that PowerPoint up, that would be fine.

[0:52] Um so just as a quick reminder too,

[0:55] and we'll they'll send you these documents after this meeting today.

[0:59] We will always have the frequently asked questions.

[1:02] So we have based on your comments last time, we did basically reformat this

[1:07] and kind of retool it and made some edits

[1:09] based on what your desires were to communicate.

[1:12] And then we took that and we created what we're calling core messaging.

[1:16] So an FAQ is really going to be a could be a very long document.

[1:20] will be live and will always like have different edits to it

[1:23] based on kind of where things are out with the project.

[1:26] And even like during construction we can add updates.

[1:29] But then also just taking like a core messaging right now is to again like

[1:33] the the why are we doing this, what is it, what is it actually going to be

[1:38] and then kind of when and how?

[1:40] So those things are kind of like will be paired down

[1:42] so we can really kind of get to what is it that you guys need to help

[1:46] communicate out to your constituents and residents.

[1:48] So with that, one of the things we wanted to show you is

[1:51] um what we're calling kind of your communication toolkit.

[1:55] This is several slides. It's mostly ment for an internal document for you.

[2:00] And this will continue to be updated again as things continue to progress.

[2:04] As you decide exactly how you're going to fund this

[2:07] and what the taxpayer impact is going to be.

[2:09] This will be something that will update for you

[2:11] and then you can continue to reference this.

[2:13] So when you get questions, you can be able to go back to this document and say,

[2:18] okay, here's what the information, the data is.

[2:20] And then that way, you're all saying the same thing

[2:23] and you all have all the data in front of you.

[2:25] So Sarah's going to walk through this really quick and then we also have some

[2:28] additional information on the few other outreach plan that we have coming up.

[2:32] Yeah, I'm just going to add really quick to Megan's comment about the

[2:35] core messaging is the last time we sat in front of you

[2:38] we just talked about how the FAQs told a lot of the story,

[2:41] but the core message is really going to tell that story from beginning to end

[2:45] and the FAQs will complement that.

[2:47] So anything that isn't included in like a brochure that might be out or

[2:51] readily available as part of that story on the website,

[2:53] then the FAQs support that to make sure we're telling the whole story.

[2:57] So, um as Megan mentioned, this toolkit is created for you guys, so you guys

[3:01] have one place to always go and access information should you get asked questions.

[3:06] Um so we have everything from an elevator pitch that high level overview

[3:11] of the um project and the kind of the why of just a quick little

[3:15] quick little burb and we won't spend a ton of time on each of these slides.

[3:19] I Megan mentioned, it'll be sent out to you later,

[3:22] but just want to kind of show you what all was included in this.

[3:25] And then we'll break down the core messaging into some slides.

[3:28] So whether someone's like, what are the real challenges?

[3:31] You have a slide just to speak on that.

[3:33] We have the project goals broken down.

[3:36] And then as you continue some more about the project details,

[3:39] is going into that plan that you guys are deciding to move forward with?

[3:44] and then um or tells concept images of what will this look like?

[3:47] You have one place to go and pull that up quickly.

[3:50] And then um project cost. What does that breakdown look like?

[3:54] And this is a great time to remind you of this is a living document,

[3:58] as decisions are made, as things are updated, we will always be updating this

[4:03] so that you guys have the most up-to-date information kind of at your fingertips,

[4:07] so that will continue to live as we continue to make changes.

[4:12] Um and then the outreach schedule.

[4:15] As we build into this, as we solidify some dates,

[4:18] as we make those changes, we'll update this here as well.

[4:22] Um but just drawing some attention to we know we want to do a community

[4:25] open house this fall. We know we're going to hit the ship meetings.

[4:29] All of those will be built into this.

[4:33] Um I'd just say that um this represents also kind of where the design is

[4:38] into is also

[4:39] so like the the purple is the design schedule

[4:41] and the blue is the um the communication schedule.

[4:47] So really again just trying to put all this together for you,

[4:50] so you can kind of see again, construction, design, communication, how it kind of

[4:54] all goes together. And then the mid-September

[4:57] and the October, those are the two

[4:59] really big outreach, um, meetings that we're targeting.

[5:03] We've talked with your team about in September,

[5:05] like having tours of the facility.

[5:07] Maybe doing something kind of around like public safety,

[5:12] kind of having some, I don't know. I threw out the fun idea of

[5:15] having some of your staff be part of like a coloring book.

[5:19] Like with you know, the people could bring their kids and whatever.

[5:20] I'm not sure that that's going to go over. But you know,

[5:23] we could we could talk about those ideas. So just again, having,

[5:27] being able to have people look at the facility, but then also

[5:32] again, having you to be able to be there to answer questions

[5:36] so that you're being transparent about what is going on. And then

[5:39] the township meeting, we know it's important for us to reach

[5:41] out to the township to have the same messaging. So we'll want

[5:45] to work with you on that so that again there, we're doing that

[5:48] in partnership with this with the staff and with you guys

[5:51] to attend that. So again, um, we're all kind of saying the same

[5:55] message. So, this is just all that put together, construction,

[5:58] communication and design. So that's what that all that looks

[6:01] like. to Sarah's find is always on the website, we'll always have

[6:05] that available for you guys, um, the FAQ will continue to live on

[6:09] there. And then this is just again a quick thing that we want to make

[6:15] sure we're communicating on. We could do postcards that we could

[6:20] work with your team to make sure everyone knows that the open house

[6:23] is there. Social media, we'll work a plan so that again, there's

[6:25] a cross-way that we're getting this message out there about this open

[6:27] house and facility tour. like don't go next yet. Um, because I think

[6:31] it's gonna automatically play. Um, next we just wanted to kind

[6:37] of share, we had the opportunity to spend the day, um, with Justin

[6:40] and Amanda at the facility to create a video and I don't think

[6:47] you guys have seen that full video yet. Um, again, there's still

[6:51] opportunity to make some edits to this and things like that, but

[6:56] we wanted to share that with you today because we feel like it's in

[6:57] a really great spot and will be a great communication tool moving

[6:58] forward to live on the website, to be shared, um, throughout

[7:03] the communities as well. Any questions before like the video

[7:07] might just automatically play after I hit it. I have one. Sure.

[7:11] The last, um, no, yeah, there. So, it says approval to bid down

[7:16] by December 2027. What does that mean? That's, that is more

[7:18] the construction process, so like when they actually go out and do

[7:23] the bids, that that has to get final approval. So it's the

[7:28] construction again. That's part of what, um, is Ken Francis has

[7:31] been up here before kind of showing that timeline. Once that

[7:35] gets refined more, again as you continue to make decisions on

[7:41] design, those days will get changed. But right now that's

[7:42] overall what Ken has shown you for the bidding process. So then,

[7:43] then they'll award the bidding contracts December, January. Yep.

[7:47] Okay. Just one minor correction that should be December 2026.

[7:48] So we have, yeah, sorry. Okay. No, it's just carry over because

[7:49] you have December, January 2027. Yeah.

[7:52] First of the year 2027. Thank you. Oh yeah.

[7:58] I had a couple quick comments on the project cost sheet.

[8:01] Absolutely.

[8:02] And I know that's what we're going to get the most questions on.

[8:05] So, um, on the left side, um, I'm not sure we are for sure

[8:12] going to be using property tax levy because I guarantee that's

[8:15] what most people are going to be asking. For sure.

[8:16] Um, I think Commissioner Westerberg has made that an

[8:19] option for us to consider. But I don't know if I want to put that

[8:23] out to the public at this point in time. As far as an option, all

[8:27] options are on the table in my mind. It's just that we're really

[8:33] not looking at that as a priority at all as far as funding, right?

[8:37] That I think the top three are really where we're going with this.

[8:38] Okay. to maybe comment on that, then maybe we say property tax levy

[8:44] question mark or possible. Yeah, you, yeah, that would be fine.

[8:46] Um, yeah, I, I think I agree with uh, the chair

[8:48] because what I would see if I, if I didn't know what was going

[8:53] on, I would see that and go automatically assume they're

[8:56] going to raise my property taxes. They've already raised, going to

[9:00] raise tabs and now they're going to do property taxes. So, like

[9:04] you say, right, option after it or, you know, something. And, and

[9:09] on that note, if we're going to do, separate that say alternates

[9:12] or different possible funding options, whatever we call it. Um,

[9:15] I think we also may want to say the sale of existing property. And

[9:20] that's certainly going to be a question mark too. We don't even

[9:24] know if it's a positive value, but I'm hoping we'll, you know,

[9:31] it's going to be worth three to five million, time will tell.

[9:32] I suppose we couldn't add in the sale of other properties in

[9:33] the county. You think? No. Well, I mean,

[9:34] I mean, that just kind of gives people a more of a vision of

[9:39] that we're not going after their property taxes, we're trying to

[9:44] find every avenue we can. To pay for it.

[9:48] I like that, yeah.

[9:49] Yeah.

[9:50] So I would put that sale of properties, property, however you

[9:54] wanted to find it first. And then property tax levy second and and make it very clear that these

[9:59] potential options or however we want to phrase it.

[10:01] [clears throat] Okay.

[10:03] Um and then the one other minor comment I had was um

[10:06] I didn't have a time to read all the particular pages,

[10:10] but I think somewhere in there it'd be important to communicate

[10:13] to the public that one of the key parts of this is that we're

[10:15] keeping our services full throttle during this transition.

[10:19] Yep.

[10:20] Because that justifies the need of finding a different spot to

[10:23] get it and that during this time, nothing's going to be hindered.

[10:27] Yep.

[10:28] we do have that in here.

[10:30] Okay. Yep, good.

[10:31] If you feel that after you've read it, just let Justin and

[10:34] Amanda know that if it needs to get beefed up like let us know.

[10:37] Can you show it real quick?

[10:38] rest is kind of one of the wise.

[10:40] Can you show it real quick? Is it one of the slides you just

[10:42] went through? Um it is not on the slides. Again, because that's

[10:45] part of the bigger messaging we're trying to make sure.

[10:46] But if you want us to add that, we certainly can.

[10:49] If Mr. Mr. Chair was in this area here you were talking about adding

[10:54] sale of existing building?

[10:55] Yeah, I like that idea.

[10:57] just he added to it.

[11:00] in the general land properties. Yep, there you go.

[11:01] Yeah.

[11:02] I think we should add that.

[11:03] Just so they I mean

[11:05] I think it could be all encompassing and just say sale

[11:09] of existing properties without specifying anything.

[11:12] That's true. I would I would I can see that, but also clarity,

[11:15] clarity is we need clarification.

[11:19] Well, so probably I like the language I'm seeing, so I guess

[11:21] I'll leave it up to their hands to.

[11:23] Okay.

[11:23] Exactly.

[11:24] Let us make those edits and get them back over to Justin and Amanda

[11:29] to send out to you. For sure is the sale of the existing building

[11:32] because people go, what are you going to do with the old building?

[11:34] Yep, for sure.

[11:35] Megan, can you tell me what you mean when you said this, the

[11:38] transition, keeping services going as in a different form of communication?

[11:43] So it's in it's in these documents, but

[11:45] what I just noted here is that

[11:47] um maybe on the core messaging project goals, uh we'll add

[11:50] a bullet saying, you know, keep existing services intact.

[11:55] We'll come up with better

[11:55] I'll lean on your judgment.

[11:56] I just think that's important.

[11:58] wherever we communicate that.

[11:59] We can do that.

[12:00] That's not a problem.

[12:02] [chair squeaking]

[12:04] Um

[12:06] I don't know if this is digging too deep or maybe it's in that

[12:10] story you have there. Um

[12:11] something about the defrayed cost of $5 million if we keep the

[12:14] existing building, would probably be important for people to know

[12:17] because I'm seeing a lot of people saying, um how come you're not just

[12:22] remodeling what you have? A lot of it is the size, a lot of it is

[12:25] how old it is. It's just, it's more financially feasible to start new.

[12:30] Yep.

[12:30] And that that is there are all pieces in here that does say that

[12:33] you know, it is.

[12:35] Okay.

[12:36] Good.

[12:36] deferred maintenance and all that, like it it doesn't that does not

[12:41] make sense. Okay.

[12:41] But again, if once you read it all, if you feel like there's something

[12:45] else needs to be bolstered, let us know. But

[12:47] I think what I'd like to just encourage is to really take your

[12:50] time and read this. Um and again,

[12:52] remember that like there's pieces that get pulled out because when

[12:55] you get so detailed too, you kind of end up losing people. So we

[12:58] want to make sure that we're hitting the things that are important.

[13:00] The key points, yes.

[13:01] Yep.

[13:02] Yep.

[13:03] So.

[13:04] Any other questions?

[13:05] you can explain, but yeah, let us know we're happy to.

[13:07] None for me on this.

[13:08] I'm excited to see the video, any other questions before we do?

[13:10] No, I'm ready to see you.

[13:11] Bring it on.

[13:13] All right, let's see if it works.

[13:16] Who's that guy?

[13:17] Is that an actor from Hollywood?

[13:18] Yeah.

[13:20] [music] Our highway department's responsible for emergency response,

[13:24] and that looks different every day of the year. We're responsible for

[13:29] the road maintenance in the summer months throughout the year and also

[13:34] the snow clearing in the winter months. Most of our county is

[13:37] rural and really counts on the County Highway Department to get

[13:41] their roads cleared. Every day we have to move equipment just to get

[13:44] to our equipment. If I wanted to go get our sweeper out, I'd have to

[13:48] move four other pieces because we got it packed in so tight.

[13:50] Some equipment is between two buildings constantly going back

[13:52] and forth. Some days it actually adds time to get what we need and

[13:56] get out the door. I worry about, you know, the roof whenever it

[13:59] rains hard, we have water coming in, we have it on our trucks,

[14:01] we have it on our floor. I worry that someday this roof is going

[14:04] to be collapsed. New snow plow truck is on the order of $400,000.

[14:08] And we need to make sure that we're protecting those assets. The section

[14:12] that we're in currently was built in 1949 and

[14:16] Well, floor drains don't work.

[14:19] We have horrible ventilation like you start welding and it gets smoky.

[14:27] We need to have a good facility to operate efficiently out of

[14:30] and to make sure that as we have more areas of pavement to maintain that

[14:34] we have a reliable, safe and efficient facility to work out of.

[14:38] A building of this age, 75 years, the different code compliance, just

[14:41] the space needs itself.

[14:44] It really didn't lend itself to a remodel project or a band-aid approach

[14:47] to to get us by. It's time to replace the building. It's served

[14:50] us for some time for the last 10, 15 years. It really hasn't met

[14:54] our needs. It hasn't served us well.

[14:58] [music]

[15:01] Wow.

[15:01] Very well done.

[15:03] Wow.

[15:05] [music]

[15:07] Oh, that's pretty really good.

[15:08] One little thing I think I saw was when Justin was talking,

[15:11] it said Cody's name. Cody Goodheart.

[15:13] Oh.

[15:14] [laughter]

[15:15] Just in one of the spots.

[15:17] At the very, at the very end of the video, did you did you

[15:20] say that it hasn't served us well or it has served us well?

[15:23] For some time it's served us well.

[15:25] Yes. Okay, there you go. All right, sounds good. Yeah.

[15:28] Because it sounds like we've kind of got our money's worth out of that building.

[15:30] Yeah. Yeah, I would say.

[15:32] And even you know, speak on that. I know we have uh some

[15:36] inquiries out just on looking at this the value of the

[15:38] existing property.

[15:40] Um I have heard rumor that the property just east of us

[15:42] was going to close.

[15:44] Um so that would be a very direct comparable to

[15:47] A nice comp for the how much it would be. Okay.

[15:52] Similar land size.

[15:55] Yeah, it's the potential um housing just Oh yeah, okay.

[15:59] I think there's six or you know,

[16:01] obviously be a price for square foot on a commercial property, but

[16:04] Okay, cool.

[16:05] Very well done. Appreciate that. Everyone involved.

[16:08] Thank you guys. I'm getting, you know, access to this video.

[16:11] And then again, putting it on your website and utilizing how you feel best.

[16:15] And how long was it? a minute and a half, two minutes?

[16:18] Yes, we don't want it too long.

[16:20] A minute and a half. A minute and a half? Okay.

[16:22] Can this video be uploaded to YouTube where a lot of people

[16:24] can see it?

[16:26] Okay.

[16:27] Do we get revenue if we get uh

[16:30] revenue so we put on that

[16:32] Like your video.

[16:33] That the color looks nice.

[16:34] [laughter]

[16:36] I do got to say though, the video was very tastefully done.

[16:39] I didn't I didn't really see anything that struck me bad

[16:41] about it, so

[16:42] gets the point across without problem.

[16:44] Yeah, it gets the point across without being assessive about it.

[16:47] Yeah. Good.

[16:50] Well, thank you guys for having us. We appreciate it.

[16:51] You have by Sandy County

[16:54] mn.gov. Is that

[16:57] for strictly

[17:01] for the building and stuff like that just

[17:04] or is this does this go for

[17:05] It's just our county our county website.

[17:08] Oh.

[17:09] And then there is a landing page.

[17:12] There is a landing page.

[17:13] Yeah, and that might be we can have a direct link.

[17:17] Yeah, we should.

[17:18] It might be more difficult to find it.

[17:21] Yeah.

[17:22] And I'm not sure if the if the video was uploaded, if there

[17:24] would be a link in say like the subject or something

[17:27] that a person could click or

[17:29] Okay.

[17:30] I know some some people find it a challenge to find things

[17:33] on our website.

[17:34] So I from my perspective, this is our one of our top

[17:37] priorities of this year.

[17:39] And so having it front and center, whether it's a link on the front

[17:41] page or what have you, um to me, I would be very supportive. Or YouTube.

[17:46] Cuz then we can share it.

[17:47] Well, the YouTube link would be on the front page of our website.

[17:50] Oh, that way. Yes, there you go. Yes.

[17:52] Our QR code.

[17:54] Do you have QR codes that you're going to be putting?

[17:56] Okay.

[17:57] We can absolutely do that.

[17:58] Well, it looks great. Good job on the video.

[18:00] Thank you.

[18:01] Everything good as far as like update for communication, anything

[18:03] else you'd like to comment on or don't do we miss anything

[18:06] that is important to you?

[18:09] No, just a couple comments that were made on the list of things

[18:12] but otherwise, yeah, no, it looks great.

[18:15] Is it too late to ask for a different um Hollywood actor at

[18:17] the beginning of it?

[18:19] We can come back and interview you to film.

[18:21] No, no, no.

[18:22] [laughter]

[18:23] Yeah, you're going to say Justin.

[18:24] I'm Mr. Chair, if I may, uh,

[18:25] you know, looking at that open house, is there any vision that

[18:29] commissioners would would like to see,

[18:31] you know, our thought too is and maybe it's partnering with the

[18:33] sheriff, there's the safety day in September.

[18:35] Not that it would be the same day, we wouldn't want to rain

[18:37] on that parade,

[18:38] but we'd also want to show that what we do has a lot involvement

[18:41] with law enforcement and what they do has a lot of involvement

[18:44] with what we do. So

[18:47] understanding that relationship and the importance,

[18:50] um our expectation was, you know, potentially having maybe

[18:52] there is some law enforcement or safety and rescue

[18:54] or fire department to show that, you know, the need that the plows

[18:56] get out, kind of clear the way for emergency response.

[18:58] So that was

[19:01] kind of our vision, not making it overdone.

[19:03] It's a chance to for folks to see the facility, but to have that

[19:07] Have you two had a preliminary chat on this?

[19:09] We have not, it's no, I just um I know there's this, you know

[19:12] the date of the safety day for September.

[19:14] Uh, I can maybe tell you real quick here.

[19:18] Well, you're if you do it the same day, I guess that's kind of a

[19:20] separate question, but from my perspective, correlating it with

[19:23] our shares department is a is a great idea.

[19:26] I think so. Because it looks like you're working together, it

[19:28] brings like community

[19:30] together. Absolutely 100%.

[19:32] Because that is the fact, that is what they're doing.

[19:33] So might as well show that.

[19:35] Yeah, and that was our take too is, you know, to show the

[19:37] importance that what we do, you know, is relied upon by a

[19:40] lot of services.

[19:44] Good.

[19:45] September 12th.

[19:45] September 12th. Yep, that's Saturday.

[19:48] Yeah, we'd be happy to partner with you however we can

[19:50] and help support those. Yep, appreciate it.

[19:52] So maybe we'll do we can talk offline and figure out a

[19:54] different day but around that time frame.

[19:57] Okay. Perfect.

[19:58] And have instead of the internal working is is great, but also

[20:01] communicate the value to the public, IE your kids will get

[20:03] to

[20:06] uh, um,

[20:07] the sheriffs will be out, uh, deputies will be out giving tickets.

[20:10] We maybe not that one. [Laughter]

[20:13] But that we, you know, emergency service can be people in

[20:15] dangerous health conditions can be taken to the hospital.

[20:19] a lot quicker if we have safe roads.

[20:22] Anything else, commissioners?

[20:23] Um, I just want to ask one question there for Justin.

[20:25] So, one of the comments that I've been, well, been getting quite frequently on the wheelage tax is, is do, uh,

[20:32] they say that it can only be used for road and bridges,

[20:36] not for a building.

[20:38] Can you clarify that?

[20:40] Definition and statute is highway purposes.

[20:43] Highway purposes, yes. I like that.

[20:47] So, obviously for, for many departments of public works, sheriff,

[20:50] we need a facility to operate out of. Okay.

[20:53] We need equipment to to manage and maintain roads.

[20:55] So they're all highway purposes by definition.

[20:58] But I just thought I would ask that well, so other people listening could know that too, so.

[21:03] Oh, great. Good question.

[21:04] And to add to that, has that been done in other counties?

[21:07] Wheeled tax to use for to use for highway building?

[21:10] Uh, for equipment, for sure.

[21:12] I don't know uncertainty for for use for facility,

[21:15] but I know the definition of highway purposes.

[21:17] But we can definitely look into it and confirm and next.

[21:20] Probably would be nice to know.

[21:22] Thank you.

[21:23] Yeah, I think either way, I mean if if, you know, from budgetary standpoint

[21:26] that whelage tax revenue could be used to offset some burden of road and bridge

[21:30] and that other burden could be, also it's

[21:32] maybe restricted, but then, you know, say it is

[21:35] Yeah, it's all, it's all coming from the same pool of tax.

[21:38] It's just a question that has come up many, many times.

[21:40] So I thought I would just get it on.

[21:42] Commissioner Christenson, I'll seek the answer and we can get verification back.

[21:46] Thank you very much.

[21:47] Megan, one more time, can you go back to the project costs?

[21:51] Um, can we increase the next fiscal?

[22:05] Um, this is probably too much in the weeds, but we have, uh, you know, a debt that's going off

[22:11] that we're basically maintaining.

[22:15] to go on it.

[22:16] I guess my as I say this, I think that's probably too detailed.

[22:19] because it's not really new funding.

[22:21] Yeah, I would just leave that out. Okay.

[22:23] No, because when I've brought that up, uh, people will say, well, then our taxes will go down if that, you know, goes, expires, so.

[22:33] Very true, but I I like the part of saying we're not really, we're not going to be,

[22:37] hopefully not adding any new taxes other than the wheel tax.

[22:41] Right. It's my home.

[22:43] Okay.

[22:44] All right, I just wanted to bring up just wanted to bring up just in case anyone had a opinion on it,

[22:46] but I I think that'd be good to keep it out of there.

[22:51] Okay. Perfect.

[22:52] Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[22:53] Thank you. Yes, appreciate it. Well done.

[22:55] Good, good job, ladies.

[22:56] Thank you.

[22:57] I'm really glad we didn't bring in, uh, some actors, huh?

[23:00] Haven't real people that are hands-on doing the video, it's fantastic.

[23:03] I wasn't an actor.

[23:05] [Laughter] Krissen,

[23:06] that's your call.

[23:07] Hey, maybe, Justin, maybe you have another trade or another, uh, career move. You never know.

[23:11] his acting career now.

[23:14] Thank you.

[23:14] Thank you, guys. Yeah, thank you, guys. Appreciate it.

[23:17] Next up on the agenda, I don't know if you heard it, but we switched items two and three around

[23:21] since our sheriff is here to respect his time.

[23:25] So, update on the regional jail meeting, we had a meeting yesterday with, uh, Pine County.

[23:29] There were about 40 people invited or not invited that were there.

[23:33] Um, with the was it seven counties or eight?

[23:36] Eight. Eight.

[23:37] Okay.

[23:38] For some reason I was thinking seven.

[23:39] So there were eight counties talking about a subject that I thought was very interesting of county jail collaboration.

[23:46] And I give Pine County a lot of, uh, credit for thinking outside of the box.

[23:50] And I just wanted to bring this to our attention,

[23:51] I don't think it's something we're gonna solve today

[23:53] or tomorrow.

[23:54] It's kind of a long-term thought process of how do we,

[23:59] um, administer and fund and our, uh, jails and in a way that's, um,

[24:04] you know, most efficient.

[24:09] So some of the key takeaways I had and then Amanda was there.

[24:12] Um, Wayne and John were there from our Sheriff's Department.

[24:15] Jeff Edblad was there, um, as well as Jackie from the jail.

[24:19] So some of the key takeaways.

[24:20] And and what I was curious about is none of us, most of us didn't sit together and so I was thinking afterwards like,

[24:25] I bet we all saw different parts of this that we gravitated towards.

[24:30] What hit me, some of my key highlights were mental health jeeling is an extre

[24:34] extremely important topic for everybody there.

[24:38] Um, it's just a very big challenge.

[24:39] Wayne and I talked a little bit about that on our way back home.

[24:43] Um, so maybe you can comment on that a little bit more.

[24:45] Um, most of the counties are way overbuilt.

[24:47] I didn't realize, um, you know, our low numbers are, um,

[24:51] really not any different than anywhere else.

[24:55] And there were some a lot of legal reasons that they went through that are on the slide,

[24:58] maybe we can zip through that real quick.

[25:01] Um, not a lot of love for Department of love for Department of Corrections in terms of the inconsistent.

[25:05] agencies of how they're inspecting. Um, that was a challenge.

[25:11] Um, from my perspective, the one question I asked was, um,

[25:14] can I ask the Pine County? It was a formal meeting for Pine County,

[25:17] and the rest of us were kind of guests of that meeting.

[25:20] I asked them how they came up with the eight counties.

[25:23] And their answer was solid. It was because it's

[25:25] they're the center and that's kind of the counties

[25:27] that are within an hour and a half drive of them. Okay.

[25:30] So I walked away from that thinking, well,

[25:32] we work a lot with our neighboring counties

[25:34] and maybe we would want to think about it from that perspective,

[25:37] because I know we have some things going with Chisago County

[25:40] um, in this area.

[25:42] And also a good comment was the need for

[25:44] a lot of our state legislator's involvement

[25:47] on this in different ways,

[25:49] and perhaps one of you two can comment more on that.

[25:51] Why don't we just go through a couple of the highlights

[25:53] do you want to narrate from here and go through this?

[25:56] Oh, my, I certainly can.

[25:57] So this was really a meeting spearheaded by Canabec County,

[26:01] and Kelly Schroder did a lot of uh work,

[26:05] I think in conjunction with their sheriff

[26:07] to put together some of the information provided to the

[26:10] rest of the attendees in the meeting.

[26:12] It stemmed out of this uh 2024 jail study that was

[26:15] done statewide to determine um functionality

[26:17] of jails across the state and feasibility of

[26:20] any sort of regional initiatives.

[26:25] Um, and I I can send all of you this PowerPoint

[26:27] after the meeting today,

[26:28] but uh Kelly touched on what the uh State Department

[26:32] of Corrections should be doing based on that jail study

[26:37] regarding regionalization or um treatment

[26:40] and alternatives for jail needs because those

[26:43] mental health components.

[26:49] we touched on the uh age of of jails

[26:53] and the life expectancy of those

[26:56] and then those highlighted on the screens are the jails

[26:59] that were or the counties with the jails that were

[27:02] involved in this meeting.

[27:05] So, um, I see Anny County being one of the oldest

[27:08] in in that group.

[27:10] Um, but across the state there are many, many aging jails,

[27:14] so lots of counties are having these same conversations.

[27:19] Say, did they mention anything of why, why does it say

[27:22] 30-year life expectancy?

[27:24] Did they anybody touch on that at all, why that's that?

[27:27] Um,

[27:28] they did not. And we did talk about the studies

[27:30] that are done to determine, um, you know,

[27:32] what the best route is for counties to do that receive

[27:35] like that that that letter from the state saying

[27:37] that their jail is out of compliance.

[27:39] They'll have to close.

[27:40] And if it's, um, more fiscally responsible to

[27:43] build or, um, transport, and for those studies,

[27:47] they go off of a 30-year lifespan.

[27:52] I, I, I agree with where I think you're going.

[27:55] 30 years doesn't seem like a very long time.

[27:57] If I buy a house, I hope it

[27:59] lasts 100 years

[28:01] and my kids want to move into it someday too.

[28:03] Um, I think specifically with jails is

[28:06] uh because of the changes in requirements for those jails,

[28:11] and we we see that with our own jail.

[28:13] Structurally, well, Dan might disagree after this morning,

[28:17] but structurally, it's sound. It's a concrete building.

[28:20] But we're having issues with wiring, um,

[28:23] with the technology within the building, with, um,

[28:28] the, the service of inmates. We have a whole portion of the jail

[28:32] that isn't used anymore because judges don't

[28:34] order that type of sentencing.

[28:37] So, um, I think they use 30 years because it seems like

[28:40] a reasonable time frame for life expectancy given

[28:44] frequent changes.

[28:48] I'm not saying I agree with it.

[28:49] I just wanted to bring that up.

[28:51] I mean, it it's a ridiculous number.

[28:53] It and and I'm not, that's not pointed at you or anybody.

[28:56] Yeah, I mean, we're building a highway building

[28:58] hoping it will last a heck of a lot longer than 30 years.

[29:01] I mean, we're hoping for 75 years from the building

[29:04] that's going to go up.

[29:06] So to say 30 years

[29:08] and then what's what's the average cost?

[29:11] Did they bring that up?

[29:12] We didn't talk, but isn't it like 50 million or

[29:13] something like that?

[29:15] Yeah. So 50 million every 30 years.

[29:17] Jeez.

[29:18] Well, and and you got to that's 50 million today.

[29:20] Next year it's going to be at 5%.

[29:23] The year after that is add another 5%. Something.

[29:26] Yep.

[29:27] Yeah.

[29:28] Anyway.

[29:29] Um, so, yes, Kelly touched on some of the points

[29:33] that this uh jail study uh came across like um

[29:38] bed space and uh benefits for regionalizing, um,

[29:42] being able to pool and share staff and resources.

[29:49] And and just raise the question of does it make sense

[29:51] for all 87 counties to have a jail?

[29:54] Currently not all 87 do.

[29:56] Um, 77 do. There is some regionalization

[30:00] throughout the state, specifically in in much

[30:03] smaller counties.

[30:06] and then there are a few slides here and then there are a few slides here and again I'll I'll share this with all of you.

[30:10] One thing that I want to touch on when I click through these slides that have specific information to the counties.

[30:16] It was noted during the meeting that perhaps the data within these slides is not exactly accurate.

[30:23] Um, it's the data's pulled from a a statewide

[30:26] uh Department of Corrections report,

[30:29] but um perhaps the way counties do their reporting is not consistent.

[30:33] So there will be some um variable data in this that shouldn't be considered.

[30:40] There was a lot of discussion on that about the inconsistencies of it and I can't remember if it was Cannabic or Pine mentioned.

[30:45] I think it was Cannabic that that's their whole budget for a particular area, not just the jails.

[30:51] So, I mean, whatever it's it's flawed data.

[30:53] But ours was on track, it seemed like, right?

[30:56] Correct. Ours was pretty accurate.

[30:58] Yep. Um, and and so this is Commissioner Dove touched on it,

[31:02] the capacity of the jails throughout the region

[31:05] that was here

[31:06] far exceeds what the average daily population is within those jails.

[31:12] Um, Carlton County is a a brand new jail built to house about 100 people,

[31:17] but their average population is around 25.

[31:21] Um, and so that is is part of what spurred the

[31:25] you know, idea to have a conversation about regionalizing

[31:28] because some of these counties on this list have newer facilities.

[31:33] Um, some of us do not.

[31:36] Um, but all of us don't use our jails to their full capacity.

[31:42] Not that we'd want to necessarily use it to our full capacity, that would increase our costs significantly.

[31:47] Um, and we'd have to ramp up staffing and resources,

[31:52] but um space-wise it's not being utilized.

[31:56] Um, just some more comparisons amongst the counties.

[32:01] Um, one piece that was talked a lot about was inmate classification.

[32:06] Uh, so determining which inmates can be housed

[32:09] near one another.

[32:13] Um, and what what jails are set up

[32:15] currently

[32:17] or um being constructed on how to set them up

[32:20] so you don't have certain classifications with others.

[32:24] You know, many of us can see like males and females

[32:26] being separated,

[32:27] but there's a lot more that goes into it when we talk

[32:29] about violent offenders,

[32:30] sexual offenders, things like that.

[32:32] Um, so that was a a big part of the conversation yesterday.

[32:36] Um, again, more about that classification and and separation.

[32:44] I'm I'm just going to flip through some of these that would be a lengthy

[32:47] conversation that I don't feel equipped to answer

[32:49] and Wayne ever wants to chime in, you please jump on in.

[32:54] Um, so one one other piece that was talked about yesterday, um, and we've had conversations about that here too.

[33:02] is the the factors that lead into jails and their

[33:05] um daily populations.

[33:10] There's significant changes in um how the courts

[33:13] handle um sentencing,

[33:16] jail is not being ordered nearly as frequently or for as long as it has in the past.

[33:22] Um, marijuana laws changed, which means there's a

[33:25] a big pool of

[33:27] the population that used to be arrested and put in jail for

[33:31] drug use that now

[33:34] are not.

[33:35] Um, that's now legal,

[33:37] so those people aren't serving time in jail,

[33:39] even for a weekend, even for getting caught on a Friday

[33:42] and spending a few days in our jail,

[33:44] that's not happening anymore.

[33:45] That's a a legal thing now.

[33:48] So, um, we talked a lot about that, we talked a lot about that, we talked about, you know, sentence to serve our our Huber.

[33:54] other jails have areas like that as well that are just not being used, they're vacant.

[34:02] Um, this touches on on court hearings.

[34:05] So, I I think part of the reason why this conversation

[34:07] took place

[34:09] and the timing that it took place of of now versus

[34:13] you know, 10 years ago when many counties started having

[34:15] conversations about jails

[34:17] is the fact that so many court hearings take place remotely now.

[34:23] Um, 10 years ago, regionalization probably couldn't even be considered

[34:28] because it'd be an enormous amount of transport back and forth for court hearings.

[34:34] Um, but now the majority of court hearings are held remotely.

[34:38] And so that offers some potential for um housing

[34:42] at at different jails.

[34:47] But there's still a lot of complications

[34:49] and you know, I think it was Wayne brought up a good point

[34:51] during the meeting yesterday of

[34:52] no county theoretically is going to get away from having

[34:55] any type of jail at all.

[34:59] and so if you have even an area for for booking, um

[35:04] You have to have meal services, you need a

[35:07] kitchen, you need staff. Um, so

[35:11] you can't fully get away from the costs of operating

[35:15] any type of facility, even if you do some um,

[35:19] regionalization for some.

[35:20] We talked about, you know,

[35:22] regionalizing certain classification of offenders

[35:25] at different jails, that sort of thing.

[35:27] Um, and then it was just a lot of discussion.

[35:31] So, that's a quick high-level overview of what

[35:36] I saw the conversation being like yesterday.

[35:38] I will say, um,

[35:40] I had thought when we got the invite for the meeting,

[35:44] um, and then all went,

[35:45] maybe we'd leave with some significant next steps of

[35:51] like, let's we're we're moving forward with this

[35:54] conversation of regionalization or we're

[35:56] not because it just absolutely would not work.

[35:59] More so, and and both of you, please, you know,

[36:02] chime in if your opinion differs.

[36:04] I left more with the sense of frustration with

[36:09] the DOC and with the

[36:12] the process of of jails becoming outdated or

[36:17] or needing improvements, um, the lack of offenders

[36:20] being sentenced to serve jail time.

[36:23] Um, it more so seemed like the next steps were creating

[36:28] some sort of task force or work group to push the state,

[36:32] um, and law makers to have some changes surrounding

[36:35] jails and funding and requirements versus

[36:38] next steps of coming back together to continue the

[36:41] conversation of regionalization.

[36:43] I uh, I'd like to ask our sheriff to come up, please.

[36:46] if you would like. Um, and while you're coming up,

[36:49] a couple comments to piggyback off of Amanda is,

[36:52] I talked to our attorney after the meeting a little

[36:54] bit about what he sees as the future, um, number of

[36:57] inmates going up or down, and he was very clear with

[37:00] me that it's all depending on who's the governor and

[37:03] who's the state legislature and how they uh, create laws.

[37:06] Obviously, the marijuana law changes quite a bit.

[37:10] Um, the one I agree with Amanda's frustration that

[37:13] there was really no clear next steps direction.

[37:15] They're going to send a summary of it to us and

[37:18] the one thing I I wanted to mention what I saw possibly

[37:20] coming out of this is a feasibility study.

[37:24] And so I just wanted to bring this especially to

[37:26] alert to our commissioners that

[37:29] I would expect they're going to ask us to pony up if

[37:31] they go that direction. Um,

[37:34] and I would have a lot of questions before I would

[37:36] feel comfortable throwing dollars at it because I

[37:38] think we need to think of Isanti County and what

[37:41] is our geographical area we work with, you know,

[37:44] depending on the sheriff's input and all that, but I

[37:46] don't know if it's should be based out of Pine County.

[37:48] And Wayne, appreciate you coming here and you being

[37:51] there yesterday. You asked a lot of good questions and

[37:53] comments. Um,

[37:55] two things I would like to make sure you cover with us

[37:57] or I'm going to ask them afterwards otherwise. Um,

[37:59] your idea with the state legislators, I thought that

[38:01] was fascinating. I want I'd like the full board to hear

[38:04] that. And anything else you think us as a commissioner,

[38:07] commissioning board should think about big picture

[38:09] about how we go forward. Like I said, I think this

[38:11] is just something on the tip of our radar just the

[38:13] beginning. If there's something more urgent, we

[38:16] should be aware of, bring that to our attention. The floor's yours.

[38:19] So there's a lot to talk about. Um,

[38:21] So one of the biggest issues that we have with uh, our

[38:25] jail when we talk about classification is um,

[38:29] there was the list. I don't know if you want to bring

[38:31] that back up or not, but like how you classify somebody

[38:33] based on their history or what the potential crime

[38:36] was they committed. But there's more than that, too.

[38:38] So think about the homicide that we had a few years ago

[38:41] where we had four people in custody for that.

[38:43] They may all classify the same, but now they're

[38:46] co-conspirators and even though they're same

[38:48] classification, we can't put them together.

[38:50] So sometimes your classifications are are

[38:52] even more complicated than just what was the crime

[38:54] committed. The easy way to look at it is, you don't

[38:57] put a man with a woman in the same cell, right?

[38:59] Obviously, that's two different classifications.

[39:01] But it expands and that was one of the things is

[39:04] where do you put certain people and that's where the

[39:07] the mental health part of it came up.

[39:09] Um, for the last few years and I've been to the capital

[39:13] a few times with the sheriff's fighting uh,

[39:15] with the 48-hour rule.

[39:16] And what that is if you're not familiar with it is

[39:18] essentially when you're arrested without a warrant,

[39:21] you have 48 hours to be seen or heard by a judge.

[39:24] Uh, it's a it's a constitutional right.

[39:27] Well, the issue that we're having is sometimes people

[39:32] are um, heard by the judge and they go through the

[39:35] court proceedings and then they go through what's

[39:37] called a rule 20 which assesses their mental

[39:40] capacity and if they have any mental illness.

[39:42] And when they're found not to hold or have that

[39:45] capacity be held accountable for the crimes,

[39:48] we no longer have mental health facilities like

[39:50] we once did, and that is because the legislature

[39:52] took that away.

[39:54] So now you have an individual who was arrested

[39:57] on a crime, who's gone through the court proceedings,

[39:59] found to not be competent to stand trial,

[40:01] but we can't release that.

[40:03] person because they're a danger to um the people, society.

[40:08] So where do they stay? They stay in our jail.

[40:11] And why are they in our jail?

[40:12] Because they're not being they're not being charged with a crime anymore.

[40:16] So we have one of those individuals in our jail now.

[40:19] We have another one that's going through a rule 20 right now.

[40:22] It's very likely we're going to have two.

[40:23] And that's not unusual for any of the jails.

[40:27] So the problem with that is, you know, our correctional

[40:30] officers are wonderful and they're very, very good at their job

[40:33] and trained well on how to do their job.

[40:35] But they are not mental health professionals.

[40:37] Um, we can care short time for individuals and their immediate needs,

[40:41] but their long-term needs, we're not we're not trained for that.

[40:44] That's that should be something that um, that's why we have facilities

[40:49] for that and doctors and staff that are trained specifically for that.

[40:53] So, one of the individuals that we have in custody now

[40:55] has been here six months

[40:56] and is number 16 on the bed for a waiting list.

[41:01] So, think about that. Six months already and and number 16.

[41:05] How much longer are we going to have that individual here

[41:07] who shouldn't be in the jail to begin with?

[41:09] So, so so he has to be somewhere is the thing.

[41:13] Has to be somewhere. That so?

[41:15] Right. We can't release him because this person is dangerous to the public.

[41:20] But the legislature took away our mental health facilities,

[41:23] our hospitals, um, things, places like Mead.

[41:27] So, the jails are stuck with him.

[41:28] You know, and that's a liability for the jail, for for us,

[41:32] um, anything that happens to those individuals.

[41:35] So we've been fighting with the legislatures trying to find a remedy

[41:39] to this and there are some very proud legislatures that are are

[41:43] like I said, proud that they got rid of these treatment facilities.

[41:46] Um, sometimes I think what looks good on paper doesn't make sense in reality.

[41:50] And if you're not in reality, if you don't see it first-hand,

[41:53] you don't know. So, what is their answer then?

[41:56] They don't have an answer. So, what we got was about $50 million

[41:59] in the last uh legislative session to try to help.

[42:03] But $50 million in the grand scheme of things, 77 jails in the state

[42:07] with all with mental health people, it did nothing. It did nothing.

[42:11] Um, the other individual that we have is going through a rule 20

[42:14] and if that person is also found to be, you know, unable to be held

[42:19] accountable or stand trial or has a mental illness,

[42:22] we're stuck with the second person in our facility.

[42:25] And that is a separate classification.

[42:26] You don't put someone like that with, you know, a DUI arrest.

[42:30] They they need special treatment.

[42:33] So that really breaks up your jail and how much space you have,

[42:36] how much room you have, where do you put certain people?

[42:38] Um, we don't have this often, but like I said, men and women.

[42:42] What if you have somebody who's transgender?

[42:44] Where do you put that person?

[42:45] You know, and and still respect their privacy and their rights,

[42:50] and how do you sell them up with somebody, you know, and so sometimes

[42:54] it's it's really, really difficult to move on with the classification.

[42:58] So one of the conversations were,

[43:00] and and I asked this because I wanted clarity.

[43:02] Are we saying just for the sake of argument that, okay,

[43:05] Pine County is going to hold all of our our male in custodies

[43:08] and our county would hold, hold all females

[43:11] or what are we talking about?

[43:13] Um, and they said, you know, that's one of the things that we could discuss.

[43:16] The problem I think with that and all the ideas are great

[43:20] and they need to be talked about. But the problem with that is

[43:23] um, number one, if you had a regional facility,

[43:26] Let's just say, let's just say Isanti County no longer had a jail.

[43:31] And we house all of our inmates in Pine County or or wherever.

[43:36] Now we're looking at taking a deputy off of the road to transport someone

[43:41] all the way to Pine County to book them in, process them, and then

[43:45] return to duty here.

[43:46] So you short the staff, you short public safety. It doesn't make sense.

[43:50] And that's why Amanda was saying and I had said,

[43:52] it would make sense that every county have at least what they call

[43:56] a class one jail, which means that you could hold somebody for up to

[43:59] 72 hours here.

[44:01] to at least process them, book them in,

[44:04] and then you would have to transport them later to your regional facility.

[44:08] But that would still require a medical, food service, inmate

[44:12] or corrections officers for the inmates, the care, transport vehicles,

[44:17] And if you, if you board inmates in another facility,

[44:21] it would only make sense that you have to pay for that, right?

[44:24] So, essentially we'd be paying for our jail that we have existing

[44:29] and adding more to move them.

[44:32] Whereas right now we have what's called a class three jail,

[44:35] which is full service. So we can house everybody.

[44:38] And we've got plenty of room to do it.

[44:40] The problem is, and I'm not saying any judge in particular,

[44:43] but judges overall are not sentencing people to jail.

[44:47] We have a 111 bed facility.

[44:49] A big part of it is meant for a sentence to serve, which is a program

[44:53] that we don't even run anymore.

[44:54] It's too expensive and even if we did or could afford it,

[44:58] we don't have the inmate population to put in there.

[45:01] And it's frustrating because

[45:02] pre-COVID our population was 50 to 60 inmates.

[45:06] Now we're averaging, I would say 25. Today we had 28, you know,

[45:09] in in custody last Tuesday when I checked it was 28.

[45:12] That's half of what we're used to.

[45:14] We can we can facilitate many more.

[45:18] But we can't if the judges aren't putting them in jail.

[45:21] And again, I'm not cutting on the judges. It's just the way the

[45:24] court systems are working right now. They're more about rehabilitation

[45:27] and treatment versus incarceration.

[45:29] That's just the the movement right now in the legislature.

[45:32] So, when we continue to go to the capital every year, we continue

[45:35] to fight for the 48-hour rule and the violations that are in place

[45:41] with it. Um, needs of the jail,

[45:44] we need legislators who are going to listen.

[45:46] And right now it's pretty, pretty 50/50 in the legislature, right?

[45:50] So, some do and some don't.

[45:52] And we made some progress last year like I said, which is great.

[45:55] But overall, it really didn't make that much of a difference.

[45:57] We still have the same issues.

[46:01] So that that's the classification issue, that's also the regional

[46:04] jail issue. I think that is going to cost us a lot of money to

[46:08] house people.

[46:10] And right now our jail is equipped and and set up to house everybody.

[46:14] And we've got plenty of space. It's just we're not using a lot of the

[46:16] space because we can't.

[46:18] It's designated for certain things. It serves is it's secured because

[46:23] it's a jail but it's non-secured, right?

[46:24] So, same with your your work release, those people can come

[46:27] and go to work. So it's a different part of the jail and how it's run.

[46:31] It's not like a a pod where you're stuck within a a certain area.

[46:35] Um, there's more freedom to move.

[46:38] Um, we can't put the general population in there.

[46:41] Because obviously, we don't want them walking out the door.

[46:43] So, our jail when the remodel was done years ago to make it a

[46:48] 111 bed facility,

[46:50] I don't want to say it was a waste of money, but I'm going to be honest,

[46:52] it ended up being a waste of money because we can't use it for what it is.

[46:57] So, and even if we were to remodel it to make it a secured facility,

[47:01] we don't have the population coming from our judges to fill it.

[47:04] So, we're in a really, really tough spot.

[47:07] Jails never ever make money. They never will.

[47:09] I also think that if we got rid of our jail, that our citizens would

[47:13] lose a sense of security that we don't have a jail here.

[47:17] And that that's a big thing.

[47:19] Someone referenced was it a state statute that jails cannot claim

[47:22] revenue in their financing, how they deal with things.

[47:26] That was interesting, I thought. Did you?

[47:29] I don't yeah, I don't.

[47:31] I don't know if that's more of a an accounting finance type of

[47:34] question, but I thought that was an interesting comment.

[47:37] So you're and you're right, it's not a revenue generator.

[47:39] No, it's always going to cost us money to to have have a jail.

[47:43] Public safety is expensive and it always will be.

[47:46] A revenue generator I suppose would be applicable if somebody's taking

[47:49] someone from our county and they're charging us 500 and it's really

[47:52] costing them 300 a day.

[47:53] I heard it yesterday that Pine County is housing a couple dozen

[47:58] of St. Louis Counties?

[48:00] And it's because of funding?

[48:03] Yeah, they had a yeah, a structure issue.

[48:08] That brings up the inconsistency with the Department of Corrections

[48:11] and I brought that up too and.

[48:15] I I don't want to be disparaging when I say this, but and and maybe

[48:19] you're not aware of it, but the sheriff's association the majority,

[48:22] we had submitted a vote of no confidence against the commissioner

[48:26] of corrections.

[48:27] Because of the inconsistency of how the DOC is is run.

[48:31] And I can give you examples, so the last three years we had a great

[48:35] inspector. We worked very, very well with.

[48:37] But in the last three years, we've been told that our jail is so old

[48:40] that we can't house inmates from other facilities.

[48:42] Uh, we have a new inspector now who I think we're going to have a

[48:47] Who is saying, well, why can't you house for other other agencies?

[48:51] And my question was, well, you tell me because we haven't done anything

[48:55] And what it comes down to is it's it's based on the interpretation

[48:59] of the DLC inspector and how they look at things and how they rule

[49:03] So, we may not change anything, or we may change to meet one inspector's

[49:07] needs, another one comes in and says something different.

[49:10] And how how do you keep up with that?

[49:13] And what I think the answer is, and what and what the sheriff's

[49:17] I personally believe that the DOC should be running our prisons and

[49:22] that the jail should be run by the sheriffs, should be run through the

[49:25] sheriff's association because the the jail falls under the

[49:28] responsibility of every sheriff anyways.

[49:29] That would take away the inconsistency, the change of an

[49:33] inspector from the DOC.

[49:35] Um, that was brought before the legislature and we didn't get any

[49:38] traction with that.

[49:40] No.

[49:42] So nobody is even willing to discuss it?

[49:44] We'll continue to fight for it.

[49:46] But you got to have legislatures who are willing to look at the

[49:49] big picture overall and we're just not having luck with that right

[49:53] Have you had this same conversation with Jimmy Gordon or Mark Curran?

[49:57] Not directly, but I know that they're aware of it.

[50:02] And I think that our state reps and our senators are probably on board.

[50:06] But you got to look at the entire state

[50:08] and not everybody has the same views as our representatives or senators.

[50:13] No, but it's impossible to operate if you're not getting consistency

[50:17] from one inspector to another. I mean,

[50:19] It's just insanity.

[50:21] Yep, it's difficult.

[50:22] And when you, when you ask commissioner about the 30-year rule,

[50:25] that's a DOC thing.

[50:26] So, if the sheriff's office or the sheriff's office or the sheriff's association was in charge of it

[50:30] and you had a building that was structurally sound

[50:32] for the next 75 years, I don't think that would be an issue.

[50:35] It's basically how you run it and how you maintain it.

[50:38] Yep. You know. Wayne,

[50:39] Question for you that maybe is more applicable for Amanda,

[50:42] is AMC very helpful in helping you with this?

[50:45] I really have no affiliation with the MC at all.

[50:48] I I don't know. Okay, Amanda?

[50:50] It's something that I've talked about in various meetings, um, with AMC

[50:54] but I don't think, you know, they AMC functions on those legislative priorities that are voted on

[51:01] each year by commissioner by by their um members.

[51:05] So I don't know that this has gotten enough traction to be a

[51:07] legislative priority by the voting members.

[51:10] Could they be a helpful voice for Wayne's desire

[51:12] to have the DOC be involved like you said?

[51:16] I wonder how AMC could help with that.

[51:18] I think every voice would matter.

[51:20] And one of the questions that you had asked Mr. Chair was, you know, what

[51:23] what about the commissioners, what can we do?

[51:26] So, you have 87 sheriffs in this state

[51:28] and the majority of us go to the capital at least twice a year

[51:31] and we can discuss these issues.

[51:34] That's one sheriff for 87 counties.

[51:36] What if you had five commissioners also for 87 counties?

[51:39] That's a lot of people.

[51:41] And people will pay attention to numbers.

[51:43] It's true. It's good point.

[51:44] as commissioners, you fill that capital building

[51:46] and you talk to those legislatures also and say, hey, listen,

[51:50] We've just you you've taken the sheriffs and multiply it by five.

[51:54] Plus we would be there with you as well.

[51:56] I think that's how you voice it.

[51:59] set it up. Good deal.

[52:01] Yeah. I I'm not the one to set it up, but we could we could figure it out.

[52:04] I mean, there is a day that the sheriffs go to the capital.

[52:07] We call it the day on the hill.

[52:08] We could probably do the same thing.

[52:10] Our commissioners could do the same thing.

[52:12] for commissioners to have their day on the hill.

[52:14] Somebody has to start it.

[52:16] Yeah. I'll be meeting with our senator next week.

[52:18] Can you give kind of a summary of your proposed plan.

[52:22] Now, Amanda's here on that.

[52:24] The proposed plan that you had that you're not getting any traction on,

[52:27] like Commissioner Westerberg said it'd be good to have kind of a cheerleader,

[52:31] a legislative cheerleader helping you, helping this get more traction at the capital.

[52:35] And like you said, they're probably both gonna be on board

[52:37] with this idea anyway.

[52:39] Let's just plug them in with the particulars

[52:40] unless you've had those conversations with those two.

[52:42] Yeah, I I haven't directly had those conversations. I certainly can.

[52:45] I'm happy to get started and steer them your way

[52:47] if they want more DLs, of course.

[52:49] Yep. That's a good idea.

[52:52] When it comes to this regional thing here,

[52:54] would there be any room for like cost sharing, you know, um,

[52:59] when it comes to it, like if we have somebody in their jail or,

[53:02] you know, some kind of cost sharing

[53:03] or I suppose we have to pay if we have somebody in their jail,

[53:07] but in turn, they would pay if we had were housing some of their

[53:10] inmates as well.

[53:12] So it would be a cost sharing essentially.

[53:14] You you could potentially offset it as far as the boarding, but like

[53:18] if we had an Anoka County in custody in Pine County,

[53:22] we're responsible for picking them up to bring them to court.

[53:25] We're responsible for their medical, their needs.

[53:28] And the other thing too, even though if they're in Pine County

[53:30] and something happens that inmate and that person passes away,

[53:34] that in-custody death reflects us, not Pine County.

[53:38] Really? Yes.

[53:39] Well, that's a good point. And I suppose with the Anoka County,

[53:42] they're already pretty set with what they got going on, huh?

[53:44] I honestly I think that other than the battles we have with the

[53:48] legislature and classification,

[53:49] the 48-hour rules, I think all the jails are sad.

[53:52] It's just jails are stressful. They're very hard to manage.

[53:55] They're high they're high stress.

[53:56] And they're not money makers.

[53:58] But if we could just figure out what the classification specifically

[54:02] mental health and then as far as the inconsistencies with the DOC,

[54:05] it'd be a lot easier for sheriffs to run them.

[54:09] I have a few questions.

[54:10] Um, where do they go to treatment then if they get

[54:13] for medical assessed for

[54:16] that they would need treatment instead of going to jail.

[54:18] Where do they go then?

[54:20] So part of that rule 20 is all within the court system,

[54:22] so we have employees here in the county that will help with that or they'll

[54:26] they'll outsource that to other people who could come in and give these

[54:30] assessments to try to determine their their capacity.

[54:33] Um, anything that's medical,

[54:35] Um, like if we have somebody who's in our custody now,

[54:38] we would bring them to Cambridge.

[54:40] But if we had to bring them somewhere else, we could.

[54:43] What that opioid funding does that cover?

[54:48] So in terms of receiving mental health treatment, um,

[54:50] the facilities I think that Wayne is referencing are probably St. Peter,

[54:55] um, Mental Health Hospitals and also Anoka Metro Regional Treatment Center.

[55:00] um, last year, I believe the legislature

[55:02] appropriated 50 million for uh Miller building expansion.

[55:06] So that is in the works. If you drive past Anoka,

[55:09] um, Metro Regional Treatment Center,

[55:12] and the intent is to expand capacity to alleviate

[55:15] issues like the 48-hour rule where people have been

[55:18] found incompetent and do have mental health and require treatment.

[55:22] Um, it's it's taking time.

[55:26] Yeah. Any other build out.

[55:29] Then, um, is that 55 million, is that what?

[55:33] The legislature granted 50 million.

[55:35] 50 million. Where is that then? Where did that go?

[55:38] I don't I don't know.

[55:39] Miller building expansion. Is my understanding.

[55:41] Okay. Oh, okay. Anoka, Anoka Metro.

[55:44] Yeah. Okay, that's interesting.

[55:47] Okay. What I would like to do today is uh not

[55:50] repeat yesterday where we kind of walk away from this

[55:52] conversation, frustrated or not really knowing what our next steps.

[55:55] [clears throat]

[55:56] Um, I really like your idea of a next step that seems

[55:59] pretty reasonable is have a more of a force of the commissioners

[56:03] joining you at the capital on

[56:05] I'm making it so I I think that would be a nice

[56:08] priority to take away from this. It'd be a lot more effective

[56:10] than what we came up with yesterday.

[56:12] Yesterday I really give Pine County a lot of credit for setting this up,

[56:16] but we we talked a lot and

[56:17] it was brainstorming and it was good, but it

[56:19] we never really walked away with, what's do this or that.

[56:22] Yeah, I would like to know more options and possibilities.

[56:27] It'd be nice to know.

[56:30] That sound like a good takeaway for us that

[56:32] Yeah, if you guys would like, I I can look into

[56:35] what it would take to set up like a day on the hill for

[56:38] commissioners.

[56:39] I mean, obviously I I can't tell everybody in the state what to do,

[56:43] but we could figure out what the process is to do that.

[56:45] Um, I think that after our meeting yesterday,

[56:47] that continue conversations are important.

[56:50] And I don't mean to be negative,

[56:53] but I I had said too during that meeting, we could start a task

[56:55] force or some sort of a correlation

[56:57] but if the legislature is going to oppose anything we do or the

[57:01] DOC doesn't support it, then what's the point of having it?

[57:03] We need to start with the legislature and start making changes,

[57:06] you know, and and that's going to require some sort of a group

[57:10] and and putting our voices together,

[57:12] but the eight counties that were there, that's not going to be

[57:15] enough to change the legislature.

[57:16] It's going to take a lot more of us.

[57:19] Well, Sheriff, I appreciate your comments.

[57:21] I think the um next steps, I guess we got two in your court.

[57:24] If you could just give me a summary email of talking points

[57:28] with our Senator, I'd be very happy to get that conversation

[57:30] started with hopes of probably getting them in direct contact with you.

[57:33] And then just keep us apprised of when to get to the capital

[57:35] when we can help with that.

[57:37] I think that would be some great steps. Be great.

[57:39] Sure. Anything else for the sheriff?

[57:41] Um, no. Thank you. Good job. Thank you for all your hard work.

[57:44] Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

[57:46] All right. I kind of figured that might be more than a 10-minute

[57:49] conversation.

[57:50] A lot of good stuff. A very interesting day.

[57:53] Um, next up is discussion on data centers as requested by

[57:56] Commissioner Christensen.

[57:58] Yeah, um, so this has been something that's really come up,

[58:02] come up a lot as far as these these large data centers and uh

[58:06] my my concern is is that right now, I mean,

[58:09] I'd like to see personally a moratorium,

[58:12] kind of like the city of Vandy has done. I believe there's was

[58:15] 30 months. Um,

[58:17] just just to get a better understanding of what is in involved.

[58:23] Cuz I mean, I'm not against I'm not against modern technology,

[58:27] as long as it doesn't negatively impact our residents.

[58:30] And one of the things with these uh these things, they

[58:33] they consume, you know, millions of gallons of water per day for

[58:36] cooling,

[58:38] competing with local drinking supplies.

[58:40] They demand immense power, driving up utility costs for

[58:43] residents and causing severe

[58:45] air and noise pollution.

[58:47] Now I'm referring to the very large facilities.

[58:49] There are some that are are smaller.

[58:52] Um, I've also been told that we don't have the um

[58:55] infrastructure for one. However,

[58:58] um my understanding is that they can supply their own uh

[59:01] power with large generators.

[59:04] These can be very noisy facilities.

[59:07] And I think it would be very smart to uh

[59:10] cuz if they come in, if they come in and buy some property

[59:12] and they meet all the zoning

[59:13] as you know, you know, there's not a whole lot we can do about it.

[59:17] But it'd be nice to have something in place to give us time, um,

[59:20] to

[59:22] look at all the facts and what's actually going on with them.

[59:26] Just to give us some time to look at it.

[59:28] Maybe something for a sub committee or something.

[59:31] But but I mean, for right now, I mean, if you look into these um,

[59:34] these massive data centers.

[59:37] It's uh again, I'm not against modern technology. That's fine.

[59:41] As long as we have a good understanding of it and

[59:44] maybe we can do some adjustments in our zoning,

[59:48] you know, they have to provide more information, whatever the

[59:50] case may be. But I really think a

[59:53] temporary moratorium and I've thought like the city of Vania,

[59:56] they had talked about one year, but 30 months really gives

[59:59] guy a lot more time to look into it.

[1:00:02] The problem with a moratorium and I've had this discussion with our county attorney many times

[1:00:06] over the last several years is

[1:00:09] you have to be able to articulate what the emergency is to have a moratorium.

[1:00:14] Well, I mean, we could we could pass something that says we don't have to have them,

[1:00:19] which is a totally different thing, but a moratorium.

[1:00:24] Okay. If if we do that, somebody can challenge that and they'll be saying, well, what's the emergency?

[1:00:28] why are you doing this on that basis?

[1:00:32] Well, I think the emergency could be, I think the emergency could be, I mean, in theory, the emergency could be a

[1:00:37] the fact that the the lack of knowing, you know, the impact in the area.

[1:00:42] I mean, maybe, um, until we could determine what an impact study would be

[1:00:47] for it, be based on water consumption, the noise.

[1:00:50] I mean, I've I've watched quite a few videos where, uh, holy macro, they are noisy.

[1:00:55] And and when, um, when they're told how it's going to be initially,

[1:01:00] it's never what it ends up being.

[1:01:03] It's louder, more noisy, water consumption, and the electric, the cost of electric goes up.

[1:01:09] I'm not saying it does in all cases, but the large mega these mega data centers.

[1:01:16] So, I don't know, this is something we should take seriously.

[1:01:18] how you need to do it.

[1:01:20] I don't know if a moratorium would be the answer then.

[1:01:23] Yeah. And and the other part about that is

[1:01:26] [gasp]

[1:01:28] shockingly, I actually talked to somebody that's in the process of

[1:01:31] he's working on a project right now in another state.

[1:01:34] And he the company he works for has been putting these up.

[1:01:38] And he's been on these for several years.

[1:01:41] And and we talk specifically about Isanti County.

[1:01:45] And he said, what you just brought up was, we don't have the infrastructure here.

[1:01:48] We don't have the the things that are needed to to do that right now in Isanti County.

[1:01:54] I'm not saying it's not possible for it to happen, but that was his take on that.

[1:01:59] I mean, the sheer size of some of these places.

[1:02:05] The the locations, um, that that's all he's been doing.

[1:02:10] Well, the city of Isanti still. I and

[1:02:13] I understand that, but the city of Isanti, they don't necessarily have the infrastructure either.

[1:02:18] However, to prevent, you know, something from happening, they needed to have more time to take a look at,

[1:02:24] take a look at the impact and everything of it and get a better understanding of the data centers.

[1:02:30] Oh, can do we have to, can we just not allow it?

[1:02:33] Yes, and that then that's actually the probably the better approach.

[1:02:38] Okay. We we have a lot of leeway on what we can do that in that direction with things.

[1:02:44] We we have more liability if we go the moratorium route.

[1:02:48] Okay. Then I would I would make a suggestion that we are not going allow,

[1:02:52] um, the large mega data centers.

[1:02:55] Or at least, at least for now, at least for now, at least until, you know, they can be more proven.

[1:03:00] Well, and I, I wish I had my zoning book in front of me right now because there's one ordinance I I'd pull up,

[1:03:06] but I don't want to misquote, so.

[1:03:08] Um,

[1:03:09] this is something that we definitely can look at though.

[1:03:12] Because they because in theory they can come in, um, maybe they're, you know, time is on their side, they

[1:03:17] could buy a piece of property with the intent, you know, to do it.

[1:03:21] I'm sorry, you don't want to do a moratorium.

[1:03:23] You know, so. We literally can pass an ordinance that there might be something in place like this already,

[1:03:28] but I don't want to say for sure, my memory's not perfect on this.

[1:03:31] But we literally can say anything that we don't list as something allowed is not allowed.

[1:03:37] Yeah, well, I think I think, uh, for the sake of this, um, I would like to see it actually say

[1:03:41] mega data center.

[1:03:45] I don't know if we

[1:03:47] Go ahead. I think I think there'd have to be, um, some

[1:03:49] specifications in that what the definition of mega data center is

[1:03:54] compared to just a data center.

[1:03:58] Um, the other piece of of why it might be good for the subcommittee to work on an actual ordinance.

[1:04:05] Uh, Commissioner Westerberg's correct in that a moratorium is is for those emergency situations.

[1:04:10] But I've I've heard you mention 30 months a few times and I'd have to confirm with the county attorney, but

[1:04:15] typically the max time frame for a moratorium is one year with the potential

[1:04:20] of extending it out six months.

[1:04:22] But only for an additional year. I think Minnesota statute caps it at two years.

[1:04:26] I, you know what? And I and I I you're right, I stand corrected,

[1:04:29] I believe there is it is something like that.

[1:04:31] But if if nothing else, because I mean, we do want to stay, um, you know, obviously the United States wants to stay up on their

[1:04:38] technology and all that stuff too, but again, this cannot be at the sacrifice of our our residents either.

[1:04:46] So, and and again, I

[1:04:48] you know, we have so much leeway as far as what we want to pass for an ordinance.

[1:04:53] I mean, we can't I don't even want to say the things we can't do, I guess, but.

[1:04:58] Uh, we have things that, like I said,

[1:05:01] we can literally say anything

[1:05:03] not listed is not allowed.

[1:05:04] And that's that would cover that. Right.

[1:05:07] And so you don't have to define large or small or medium.

[1:05:10] No.

[1:05:11] You can just say a word data center.

[1:05:12] So, okay, and let's let's just say this, okay.

[1:05:15] so let's just for the sake of argument, um,

[1:05:17] if we say don't say large, that's fine.

[1:05:20] So you got data center.

[1:05:21] But they still have the right to come in and if they can show that

[1:05:24] it is truly not going to have a negative impact,

[1:05:27] it's something we could allow.

[1:05:28] something we could allow.

[1:05:29] Well, if it's not allowed, it's not allowed. Okay. Right.

[1:05:33] if we don't have it on a list of things that are allowed. Right.

[1:05:37] then it's not allowed. Right.

[1:05:39] Yeah, it's just it's something that I don't think we should um,

[1:05:42] sweep under the rug.

[1:05:43] I've I've got a lot of um, a lot of people that are

[1:05:46] concerned about this.

[1:05:49] Yep.

[1:05:50] the noise factor alone

[1:05:51] The noise factor and the massive water. I mean, imagine that,

[1:05:54] potentially millions of gallons per day of water for cooling.

[1:05:58] The other thing though is, now this is a different topic,

[1:06:01] but solar fields, for example,

[1:06:03] we only have say over up to a certain size and anything over

[1:06:06] I'm I don't know if it's 48 acres, somebody could correct me on that.

[1:06:10] Anything over that, we have no say in it. state controls that

[1:06:13] completely or the federal government. I think it's the state.

[1:06:18] And we may run into that problem with data centers too. That's true.

[1:06:21] But at the same time if we have something in place ahead of time

[1:06:24] and hopefully other counties might follow suit,

[1:06:25] it's going to make it harder for them to, you know,

[1:06:29] Solar was a little bit different thing, so.

[1:06:32] But again, I don't I don't want to I don't want to sweep it under

[1:06:35] the rug, I think it's something that we need to address.

[1:06:37] Yep.

[1:06:38] Yeah, no, we can look at that for sure. It's not a problem.

[1:06:41] I want to say I concur with Todd's comments.

[1:06:44] How fast can we push this through Planning Commission?

[1:06:46] is it kind of a simple just, well, the wording of something?

[1:06:50] The problem you run into on all that stuff is

[1:06:53] when you when you go if you're in a hurry, you're going to have

[1:06:56] somebody asking the question after you're done, what about this?

[1:07:01] Oh, we we didn't see that. Somebody didn't ask the right question.

[1:07:04] I'm not saying that it can't be done.

[1:07:07] But I'm I really want to take a look and see what we have for an

[1:07:10] ordinance on the books right now that may cover that already.

[1:07:14] Yeah, because you could have a, you could have a, you know, this

[1:07:16] is where the thing I see you could get complicated.

[1:07:18] because you could have a small, a small data center that would be

[1:07:21] totally fine and not, uh, you know, not affect anything, but

[1:07:25] Okay.

[1:07:26] So, but, but

[1:07:28] per Amanda's statement, where where's the definition? Right. Right.

[1:07:32] So and maybe that's something the sub committee can look in at, you know.

[1:07:36] Because I there was one that, one that caught my eye, I

[1:07:38] because I've done a lot of studying on this is they were in a rural

[1:07:41] area. In fact, they went in on a, um, if I remember right,

[1:07:44] it was an opportunity zone like we had an opportunity zone potential.

[1:07:48] And they went in and they set up the, uh, they set up a data center there.

[1:07:52] um, without really much infrastructure, but they had massive,

[1:07:55] I mean, massive generators,

[1:07:58] you know, that were able to be heard for a long ways and

[1:08:01] Well,

[1:08:02] So,

[1:08:03] Yeah, and I again, I think it's something to look at.

[1:08:06] I mean, I'm going to be in zoning office all afternoon, so I'll

[1:08:09] bring that up, but

[1:08:15] Right now it's the kind of thing that I it's not something like it's

[1:08:17] going to happen next week.

[1:08:19] Yeah.

[1:08:20] Well, just uh I'll just um

[1:08:22] Let me change that.

[1:08:24] The County Board can pass anything they want. We Jeff encourages me

[1:08:27] all the time to go through the normal process. Right.

[1:08:32] And and I agree with him on this.

[1:08:34] But we do have the we we actually could just do that.

[1:08:38] I would advise against it heavily.

[1:08:40] No.

[1:08:41] So.

[1:08:42] Well, I mean, I

[1:08:43] I'd like to see it get through as as soon as reasonably possible,

[1:08:46] I guess would be my wording.

[1:08:50] But I guess I go back to your comment about we're probably not

[1:08:52] set up with the infrastructure for us to do it.

[1:08:54] So maybe in some ways we don't have to have this done yesterday.

[1:08:57] The

[1:09:01] Well, you're going to be challenged maybe at some point and that's the

[1:09:04] that's the point of this, yeah, is getting ahead of the game before.

[1:09:06] This is a great time to do it.

[1:09:08] challenged Definitely.

[1:09:11] Say that I'm I'm

[1:09:12] You could be challenged in what way?

[1:09:14] If we don't have something in place wording-wise.

[1:09:16] Yeah.

[1:09:17] Yep.

[1:09:18] Yeah.

[1:09:19] So.

[1:09:20] If someone wants to put one in and they have lawyers and this and that.

[1:09:23] Because I'm, and I'm fairly sure, I don't know, uh, Commissioner Laro

[1:09:25] would agree with me, but if you know, we

[1:09:28] not that we have to do this, but if we had a public hearing on it,

[1:09:31] I'm sure we would pack the room with people that don't want the

[1:09:32] noisy things next to them.

[1:09:35] I don't doubt that.

[1:09:36] So.

[1:09:37] Yeah. We know that part.

[1:09:39] So.

[1:09:40] But.

[1:09:41] So we so we have a consensus that we want to deal with this proactively.

[1:09:44] I would like to I'd like to see that.

[1:09:47] Based on based on all the constituents that

[1:09:48] have been, you know, looking at it.

[1:09:50] You know, I

[1:09:52] Um.

[1:09:53] I would expect that we should take the time to do it so that we do it

[1:09:56] correctly though.

[1:09:58] So, do we

[1:10:00] do we have a, uh, talk to our attorney then or how do we

[1:10:04] Well, no, it's the the the proper way to do this is

[1:10:10] Now we've talked about it here.

[1:10:11] I'm going to bring this up to the planning commission,

[1:10:14] whether it's the sub committee or the full planning commission.

[1:10:17] They come up with something.

[1:10:19] I mean, we literally we we reach out to other

[1:10:21] counties all the time that have an ordinance in place.

[1:10:25] and look at that and say how does that fit Isanti County?

[1:10:29] I think, um, Elk River just did something too.

[1:10:32] So they might be able to reach out to Elk River

[1:10:34] and see what what they did.

[1:10:36] Or City of Isanti.

[1:10:37] I see we have our IT guy here. Yeah.

[1:10:41] I I I do have a question if you

[1:10:43] Have you seen any of the stuff as far as uh, um, these data

[1:10:47] centers that are producing their own electricity?

[1:10:51] I have.

[1:10:52] Um, a lot of it's steam based.

[1:10:55] Uh, there are some turbine based as well.

[1:10:58] Okay.

[1:10:59] One comment I do have about the infrastructure,

[1:11:02] Isanti County really doesn't have the infrastructure as

[1:11:05] as far as transport. The fiber in the area is very

[1:11:08] limited, mostly owned by the state at this point.

[1:11:12] Okay.

[1:11:13] And some Mitco and things like that for a data center

[1:11:15] to come through they would need huge bundles of fiber,

[1:11:18] um, just to transport all the data back and forth.

[1:11:22] So, but it's not impossible to make it happen.

[1:11:25] but there's there's places that are way better set up

[1:11:27] right now to make it happen and that's

[1:11:30] And that's why we're seeing a lot of cities pass

[1:11:32] moratoriums because they are set up.

[1:11:35] As of now in Minnesota, the only counties I could

[1:11:37] find that have passed moratoriums are

[1:11:40] Wright and Pine, Carlton's considering one.

[1:11:43] Um, but the cities have the infrastructure in place,

[1:11:45] which is why they're

[1:11:48] more rapidly passing these moratoriums, um,

[1:11:51] because of that fiber piece.

[1:11:54] Across the county to rural land sites, there's not

[1:11:57] fiber.

[1:12:00] So, I guess my concern is that a conglomerate comes in,

[1:12:03] buys a piece of property, and then just, you know,

[1:12:07] all of a sudden now, you know, they meet all the ordinance,

[1:12:10] the thing pops up and there's we don't have no say in it.

[1:12:13] So, maybe it's not this year, but maybe it's a couple years

[1:12:16] from now, but meantime they have the money, the deep

[1:12:18] pockets to wait.

[1:12:21] So.

[1:12:22] But anyway, it's good to know. I thank you for backing that up

[1:12:24] for me that there are some that are are run with

[1:12:26] alternative power source.

[1:12:28] So.

[1:12:29] Anyway, I'll just get back to the point of we do reach out

[1:12:32] to other counties and see what they're doing.

[1:12:35] See how that fits

[1:12:38] with our county and sometimes it's almost, yep,

[1:12:41] that's a good idea, we're good to go on that.

[1:12:43] Although most of the time it's not quite that simple.

[1:12:45] Or tweaking it a little bit, whatever they got.

[1:12:47] But but then you still go through the planning commission,

[1:12:50] get that and then it comes back here.

[1:12:53] So if we go through it's it

[1:12:55] you can maybe correct me on this, Amanda, but

[1:12:57] you know, if we have a moratorium in place,

[1:13:01] somebody still can challenge that.

[1:13:04] I mean, that that's my what I think I'm hearing out of

[1:13:06] the county attorney on this.

[1:13:08] I mean, we have to have a reason.

[1:13:10] So in other words, no data centers at, you know,

[1:13:13] at the we can say no data centers.

[1:13:15] Could we say no data centers allowed and then give it a time frame?

[1:13:18] Or is that still a moratorium?

[1:13:20] No, no, it's not a moratorium.

[1:13:22] Okay, good. But we'd have to this is where

[1:13:25] you know, we just a while back we had a, uh,

[1:13:27] cleaned up some language in the ordinances we had

[1:13:31] where we defined words.

[1:13:34] Right. We have to say, okay, what is a data center?

[1:13:38] You know, what is that? Okay.

[1:13:40] Well, maybe, um, I don't know. Have you done any

[1:13:42] research into it at all what they are?

[1:13:45] Well, a little bit. I mean, I had about an hour-long

[1:13:48] conversation with somebody the other day about this.

[1:13:50] No, that's that's that's tip of the iceberg.

[1:13:52] Yeah, so I mean, maybe um, watch watch some videos and

[1:13:55] things and get some, um, all of us gets more education

[1:13:57] on this data center so we know, but, uh,

[1:14:00] Anyway, yeah, well, thank you,

[1:14:02] thank you for, uh, putting that on the agenda, Amanda,

[1:14:05] and I think, um, it was good a good conversation.

[1:14:07] Yep. No, it's it's well worth bringing up.

[1:14:10] Just for my clarification and, um, next steps,

[1:14:13] is there any direction the board wants to give me

[1:14:16] regarding follow-up on this item or is it is the

[1:14:18] plan that it will go to potentially a sub committee,

[1:14:20] the planning commission? I just don't want to drop the

[1:14:22] ball if there's an expectation that I have something to

[1:14:25] follow up with.

[1:14:27] My my answer, my answer for me personally would be

[1:14:30] let's get something done as soon as possible on it.

[1:14:34] Well, you know, Amanda, if there's some county that,

[1:14:37] you know, I mean

[1:14:41] put it to this way, if if I wouldn't mind if you reached

[1:14:44] out to somebody and said, what do you what did you

[1:14:46] guys do here like

[1:14:47] If Isanti did that.

[1:14:48] And then and then Elk River, Elk River that'd be

[1:14:50] Sherburne, Sherburne County, I believe is Elk River.

[1:14:53] So if you could reach out and give us some ideas that

[1:14:56] we could that we could, um,

[1:14:58] potentially take a look at and

[1:14:59] Yeah.

[1:15:02] And along with that, um, our expected time frame would be

[1:15:05] by the end of the year, something like that.

[1:15:07] Uh, yes, by no no later than the end of the year.

[1:15:10] I'm not going to gear and beat that out.

[1:15:12] Well, that's our expectation, doesn't mean it's gonna happen.

[1:15:14] Yeah. I hope it's that.

[1:15:15] Right.

[1:15:16] I mean.

[1:15:17] Because it sounds to me like we could do something

[1:15:19] relatively quickly, but we need

[1:15:21] I would like to see what the other counties and cities have done

[1:15:24] their actual language.

[1:15:26] Yeah.

[1:15:27] Yeah.

[1:15:28] Yep.

[1:15:29] If there's anything complicated or things we don't know that we've

[1:15:31] been talking about here, you know, please bring that to our attention.

[1:15:34] Yeah.

[1:15:36] And again, thank you for putting it on the agenda and thank you,

[1:15:39] Commissioners, for uh hearing me out on it.

[1:15:42] Yeah, it's good.

[1:15:43] Anything else on this issue?

[1:15:44] No.

[1:15:45] All right, we're up to miscellaneous staff.

[1:15:49] Nope, I don't have anything.

[1:15:52] Heather doesn't have anything either?

[1:15:55] Commissioners?

[1:15:56] Nothing, that was it.

[1:15:57] No.

[1:15:58] We are adjourned.

[1:15:59] Yep.

[1:16:01] Do you want to cover something?

[1:16:03] No, Commissioner Burke's not here. We I we just I was had the

[1:16:06] employee appreciation.

[1:16:07] Oh.

[1:16:08] meal and, but we need to discuss with him to ensure we have a

[1:16:12] place for that.

[1:16:14] Don't forget the fair this week.

[1:16:16] Yes.

[1:16:16] Yeah.

[1:16:17] Yep.

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