[5:14] Good evening. I' I'd like to call the uh the meeting

[5:20] of uh September 1st of the planning board to order. So, if everybody could

[5:25] uh get seated, that would be uh very helpful.

[5:34] I thought from a uh clarification standpoint be a good idea to just uh run

[5:40] through the agenda so every everyone's expectations are the same.

[5:46] » I I was going to say you got to speak. >> Uh I can't raise the volume. I can raise

[5:49] the microphone but maybe that'll do it. Uh so um anyway I

[5:57] I too close.

[6:01] Well, we'll see. Um I wanted to uh review the agenda for everyone just so

[6:06] we all have the same uh expectation of how things will flow.

[6:11] This is a regular planning board uh meeting for the town. And our first item

[6:17] of business is anformational meeting with regard to a five lot subdivision

[6:23] for the Harrison's. Uh and we'll review that. Then we have uh two other items

[6:29] that have been advertised which are uh zoning board requirements. a petition

[6:36] for a solar operation and a petition for a dimensional variance or um

[6:45] de demolition rebuild project. So, we'll review those

[6:50] five things. Then we'll go into regular business uh

[6:55] planning board minutes and uh a uh a special um

[7:04] u motion for the remand of the request from the young family to review the uh

[7:11] farming accessory use petition. So, I would um

[7:17] turn the mic over to uh Mark Hartman just to

[7:23] review a couple things. >> Mr. Chair, I just want to address item

[7:26] four on the agenda. I I think it's it's no secret that the reason we have such a

[7:31] a robust crowd tonight is because everybody wants to hear about the farm

[7:35] accessory ordinance. So, I just want to talk about what that is and what that

[7:40] isn't uh relative to the agenda item. First, it's not a vote by the planning

[7:45] board. This is a remand from the town council. So, it's a uh opportunity for

[7:51] the Youngs to be heard tonight. Um and the reason for that is because the town

[7:58] council had uh asked the planning board to review a farm accessory ordinance.

[8:04] The planning board did that, sent their recommendation to the town council. When

[8:09] the recommendation got back to the town council, the young family had indicated

[8:14] they hadn't had the opportunity to be heard at the planning board. The town

[8:18] council sent it back to the planning board so that the Youngs would have that

[8:22] opportunity to be heard. And that's why we're here tonight. And it's for that

[8:26] express purpose that we're here for to for that tonight. Again, there's not

[8:30] going to be a vote on that. Uh but for the sake of fairness, we'll have anybody

[8:36] that wants to be heard, they can be heard tonight on that farm accessory

[8:42] ordinance. Now, when we do have that opportunity

[8:46] for comment, uh we'll limit comment to three minutes per person, and we just

[8:52] ask that you try not to um repeat the comments that are uh provided.

[9:02] Now, one last point on that farm accessory ordinance. Um,

[9:08] we may or may not get to it tonight depending on how quickly the agenda

[9:12] goes, but for everybody's knowledge, uh, the accessory ordinance is about a

[9:20] change to the zoning ordinance that would allow for a special use permit to

[9:26] allow certain activities on uh, farms in town.

[9:32] the uh the planning board had heard that prior and made their recommendations on

[9:38] that particular ordinance and that again is what is up for discussion tonight for

[9:44] the Youngs to be heard. Mr. Chair, that's all I have.

[9:48] » Thank you.

[10:01] But that doesn't get hurt tonight.

[10:09] All these people here please don't vote for the whole agenda

[10:18] so we can all hear what's happen. >> Well, thank you

[10:26] I don't know that we can do that, can we?

[10:32] » I live across the street.

[10:37] » So, um there's a request to to uh change the order of the agenda. Uh I can put

[10:44] that before the planning board. Um >> I'll make I'll make a motion that we

[10:49] move that item to the top of the list. >> Really?

[10:55] I have a second. >> What happens to theformational meeting?

[11:02] » I'm not trying to make it. >> We can move it below theformational

[11:07] though. It's second on the exam. I think the the theformational

[11:13] hearing has to be uh and I think that we can um we have two

[11:22] uh zoning uh requests petitions that have been advertised and so we can uh

[11:29] make sure that we have time to hear those prior to the uh closing of the

[11:35] meeting. So if if the the uh discussion uh with the farm accessory uses carries

[11:44] on uh past 9:00 we can terminate then and bring uh the subject to the zoning

[11:52] petitions is that so um can I amend your motion? Sure you

[11:59] can >> to uh so the motion is now to hold

[12:03] theformational meeting first then move to item four which is to

[12:09] remand the request from the young family for the matter of farm accessory

[12:13] ordinance to the planning board for further discussion and then we will uh

[12:19] terminate that at 9 and we will uh deal with the recommendations for the zoning

[12:25] board and those two petitions Is there a second to that?

[12:30] » Second. >> Second. All those in favor?

[12:35] » I >> I.

[12:36] » Any opposed? >> No.

[12:39] » Okay. Thank you, >> Mr. Chairman. I just like the record to

[12:42] show that I need to recuse myself from theformational meeting item number one

[12:46] on the agenda and I'll return for for the open meeting.

[12:50] » Thank you. So item number one is notice of

[12:55] anformational meeting is hereby given upon the petition of David Harrison,

[13:00] trustee of the David Harrison 2024 trust, owner of the subject

[13:06] property located at 147B West Main Road, Little Compton, Rhode Island, Tax

[13:13] Assessor's Plat 2, lot 9-9. The applicant and/or their

[13:19] representative is presenting a master plan for a five lot major subdivision of

[13:25] the subject property, including the request for a dimensional waiver in the

[13:30] form of a road measuring approximately 2,380

[13:35] linear feet, including the 1,00 linear foot along the existing 50ft wide right

[13:44] of way where greater than 900 linear F feet is not allowed pursuant to appendix

[13:50] C 2D2.2.2E

[13:55] of the Lil Compton subdivision regulations.

[13:59] The petitioner intends to create a five lot residential family subdivision

[14:04] including one LMI low to moderate income unit to be

[14:10] incorporated into an ADU accessory dwelling unit on lot number one.

[14:17] Is this mic on? >> Uh, I don't know.

[14:22] » Can Can everybody hear me? Oh, there it is. Good evening, Court Chappelle. On

[14:26] behalf of the Harrisons, I'm going to begin tonight by asking uh Mrs. Harrison

[14:31] to give you a brief overview, but just for the audience and and for the uh the

[14:36] board, let me remind you that we were here a couple of months ago on a

[14:39] conceptual. This is a 31 acre parcel. The 31 acre parcel is owned now by the

[14:46] Harrison Trust and the goal is that the Harrisons are building their own home on

[14:51] lot one and then each of their children some of whom are represented here

[14:56] tonight are also uh hopefully building a home within the next three or four years

[15:01] and it will be what I commonly refer to as a family compound. It is extremely

[15:07] benign use and that it is five house lots on 31 acres. There is just a single

[15:13] modification that is needed and that is that the road that goes into it is in

[15:18] excess of 900 ft. But I remind you that the planning board saw this before at

[15:24] the alme subdivision. When the Alme subdivided and the a trust purchased

[15:28] some of the land, there was specifically an easement that was uh incorporated

[15:35] into all the planning so that this lot nine could be subdivided. And in fact,

[15:40] the planning board was involved in that. In many cases, we see the easement go

[15:45] across the a trust land. And in other cases, we see what we call hockey stick

[15:50] lot, which is the large 31 acre lot in the back with an appendage that goes out

[15:55] to the main road. For some reason, I was not present. Some of you may have been.

[16:00] This particular 50-foot road was a separate parcel known as lot 7 and its

[16:06] sole existence was for ingress and egress to lot 9. It is restricted from

[16:12] going to any other lot. They cannot according to the a trust easement use

[16:17] this to develop and go into lot 10 or any of the other surrounding properties.

[16:23] So it was apparent whether it be mandatory for us or good neighbors, we

[16:30] wanted to go to the a trust and we were on the agenda on two weeks ago and we

[16:35] were before them. So there's no issues with the a trust land. There were

[16:41] discussions certainly that we had about how we can uh decorate that piece, if

[16:46] you will, and landscape that piece. And we agreed that we would stake it out uh

[16:51] to show where we were going to lay out the road on that property and where the

[16:56] drainage and utilities would go, which are part of the underlying easement. And

[17:02] we'll go back there regarding any permission to put in trees and grass and

[17:07] those things. So, with that said, I'm going to have uh Marilyn read a

[17:11] statement or give you a statement of what her intentions are, and then I'll

[17:14] go over the modification and the plan that's slightly different from the

[17:19] conceptual plan. The conceptual plan, if you recall, you had some issues with. We

[17:24] were asking for phasing. We were asking to cross some roads. We redid this as a

[17:29] simple, straight uh five lot subdivision. Each lot meets your minimum

[17:34] criteria in your town ordinance for 2 acres. Each lot meets your minimum

[17:38] frontage and width requirements. And it's all designed to be a large family

[17:42] farm with the large area including the stable, barn, and riding area

[17:47] incorporated into and onto other parcels. So,

[17:52] the property will flow as one big uh farm type uh family compound. All the

[18:00] amenities won't just be on the lot one. So, with that said, this is Harrison.

[18:08] Thank you uh for giving us the opportunity to be here tonight.

[18:12] Oh, sorry, uh Maryanne Harrison. Um you know, we purchased this property

[18:18] because we really see it as an opportunity to create something for our

[18:21] family that's going to go well beyond our lives. We, as Court had mentioned,

[18:26] we are building five home sites on there. Our each of our four children are

[18:31] planning to build a home and my husband and I will be building one as well. and

[18:34] we will have a barn with horses and a paddock area also. And it's really to

[18:39] create a life that we really think would be a beautiful one here in Little

[18:43] Compton. Um I [clears throat] grew up in the country myself and I know how

[18:47] special it is to have that experience child and the key thing for us and what

[18:52] we are trying to accomplish is to have a place where our children can raise their

[18:56] families and they can have our grandchildren would be there as well and

[18:59] they have a connection to the land to the ocean and most importantly to their

[19:03] cousins. When my kids grew up, they had an environment like that and we would

[19:07] like to replicate that for our grandkids. U my daughter's here this

[19:10] evening as you can see. She's expecting our first grandchild in the next couple

[19:14] of weeks. So, we're very excited about that and my son is expecting twins in

[19:18] November. So, it is already starting to to build and we really are looking

[19:22] forward to being able to have that experience with our children. We also

[19:26] recognize that Little Compton is a very special place and with that comes a

[19:31] responsibility for all of us. you know, we want to be very thoughtful about how

[19:35] we develop the property. We want to preserve as much as we can of its

[19:39] character and the open space and we want to be good neighbors. So, that's really

[19:43] at the heart of what we're trying to accomplish uh with purchase of this

[19:47] property. So, I'll leave it to court to go through the details.

[19:51] » Thank you. So, I'll begin with the access road. The access road again is on

[19:55] lot 7, which is a lot owned by the a trust. It's 50 feet wide and your plan

[20:01] approved by the planning board when it was done specifically says that we could

[20:06] have asked for modifications for 12 foot wide road if we were building one house

[20:10] but if we were going to do more than two I think it was that you set the width at

[20:14] 20 ft. So we are so we believe that's kind of a done deal that you said that

[20:19] the width of that would be 20 ft and consistent with the egg trust. They

[20:23] obviously don't want that pavement. They're very uh big on impervious

[20:26] service that must be gravel. So like most of your roads in town we are

[20:32] proposing to uh honor obviously the easement that that's gravel to that

[20:36] point. >> Tell us what the what the proposition of

[20:42] would be please. >> Yes.

[20:45] Yes, the Phil Bill Smith civil engineering concepts. So that road will

[20:49] be a gravel road and consistent with the subdivision standards. Uh 8 in bank run

[20:55] gravel, 8 inches of processed gravel on top of that. Um compacted and uh

[21:02] essentially we're we're not asking for any waiverss in the construction. We're

[21:05] going to meet your specifications for that.

[21:09] » Okay. And even though that road is approved, I should have said it's not

[21:12] installed. And part of the reason we were here for master plan is that

[21:16] somewhat we're going to try to put the cart before the horse and one you could

[21:20] certainly go down tomorrow and build get a permit for one lot. So with that

[21:26] starting we want to improve the road to make sure that we don't do damage to it

[21:30] to put it right up with the gravel now so that we could get construction trucks

[21:34] and those things. And that's why we went to the a trust and said hey do you want

[21:38] it left or do you want it right or you want to keep us just in the middle? We

[21:42] don't want to put it in and then come back to the planning board for

[21:45] preliminary and have them say, "Hey, thanks for spending the money to make it

[21:48] a nice gravel road that's not in the center, but the egg trust uh wants it

[21:54] differently." So, it's going to be staked out before it's done. We also

[21:57] with the egg trust, there's corn growing there now. Uh obviously, we're not

[22:01] plowing the corn to start it. We've agreed to wait until harvest and to

[22:05] start it then. So again, I think it's a a good communal effort to try to to try

[22:10] to work that out with them. Once you come in, you can see where our road is

[22:14] really quite simple. It just sweeps down along the property and then turns uh to

[22:20] the north and then each of the lots draw themselves off the back. If you look at

[22:24] the topography of the land, you'll see why that road is where it is and why the

[22:29] uh topography allows houses off to the left of it. And then the large lot which

[22:34] we call lot one that would be occupied by the parents uh building their house

[22:40] in the north west corner and building the barn and amenities in the middle. Uh

[22:46] I certainly don't uh you know most of you know I have a horse farm. I don't

[22:50] find uh horse farms offensive. Uh but certainly the amenities of the horse

[22:56] farm which means where the horses are and manure piles and things are kept in

[23:01] the middle of this uh property. It's over I think five or 6 h00 ft uh from

[23:06] the from the nearest uh boundary to the south. So again they're developing in a

[23:11] way with their neighbors in mind. Uh we were here last time, remember we could

[23:16] have come, I guess for a four lot subdivision and we could have avoided

[23:20] the uh low to moderate income requirement. Uh but the truth is in the

[23:24] end we want five lots. So we might as well address it now. So we are proposing

[23:30] five lots. By my definition under your new ordinance, I guess we get to pick

[23:35] which lot has the LMI dwelling unit and we want that dwelling unit to be on lot

[23:41] one. that lot uh lot one dwelling unit will be in the form of an ADU which

[23:47] according to your ordinance is a dwelling unit and can count and

[23:50] according to the state law an ADU can also uh count as an LMI it has to be

[23:56] your solicitor would have to uh with our office make sure that the proper

[24:02] documentation is filed so there are it's a deed with the restrictions that would

[24:08] in this case not be a lot that an ADU that was offered for separate sale, but

[24:13] a lot that we had to uh lease, show annually the lease if uh if we lease it

[24:19] to someone that fits the criteria of the LMI ordinance. So, it does

[24:26] effectually pass not only your old ordinance, but the new ordinance that

[24:31] you just looked at that we have 20% of the lots, 20% of five is one has a uh

[24:38] dwelling unit. that dwelling unit has to be done with the same construction uh

[24:42] construction materials and architectural integrity as the other houses. And

[24:47] again, because it's a family compound and all of the houses are done uh to

[24:53] look like a a rural family farm and match the barn and match the stable. uh

[24:58] we will meet the criteria that the construction materials and that the

[25:03] quality of the 1,200 square ft unit in the ad in the barn itself uh will be as

[25:11] uh with the same quality and construction materials as our homes.

[25:17] So for those of you that might say the house in the in the barn facility is

[25:23] strange, not so. Uh, I have a number of clients that have them. And in my

[25:27] opinion, if we go back over to my side of the bay over in Portsouth, the finest

[25:32] equestrian center is with J Sergeants called Sandy Point Farms, there's seven

[25:37] apartments attached to that. So, there are in fact uh plenty of people that uh

[25:43] like nice apartments attached to the equestrian world.

[25:48] Uh as to the modification um I am asking there's there's two

[25:54] things I think we're asking for tonight even though you're not voting even

[25:57] though it's just master plan. One is we're going to try to put that road in

[26:03] once the a trust tells us where they want it and once we know that it is to

[26:09] town specs. Normally the planning board approves something and then your

[26:15] department of public works oversees the road with Mr. Smith. Mr. Smith is going

[26:20] to try to get Department of Public Works to oversee it now and to give good

[26:25] pictorial evidence so that he can show that what we're doing now, a little bit

[26:30] cart before the horse, meets the specifications of the Little Compton

[26:35] Road ordinance. The other thing comes back to some

[26:39] recent controversies that we don't necessarily like to talk about, but the

[26:44] this road is in excess of thousand feet and that's the modification. There are

[26:48] many roads in town that do that. And the problem is is that according to your

[26:53] ordinance, if it's a major subdivision, once that road is approved over a,000

[26:57] ft, there's an argument that no further subdivision uh can be done off of it.

[27:02] and we have a five lot subdivision, but we have

[27:08] disclosed to everyone that there's a strong possibility that we need a six

[27:12] lot subdivision. The reason we may want a six lot subdivision is lot one could

[27:18] be cut off separate. Remember, lot one is 13 acres. So, it could certainly be

[27:23] cut off from the Harrison's main home and the apartment could be done separate

[27:28] as a primary dwelling or a house. The most common things with family compounds

[27:34] and the trouble with them is sooner or later a house needs to be sold and in

[27:38] the natural order of things that may be the one occupied by the oldest people

[27:43] and at my house that's the parents and when my house gets sold I don't want the

[27:48] farm to go to my house cuz my farm is the amenity for my four children and

[27:53] that's exactly what is happening here with the Harrisons. So we would like the

[27:58] ability to cut that off in the future so that it could be a separate lot so that

[28:03] we could still maintain ownership of that even if the main house sold. It

[28:07] would still be a six lot subdivision. It would still be a minor subdivision. It

[28:12] would not kick in any more LMI requirements. It just and we understand

[28:17] that in the future if the zoning changes we may not be able to do it. But as of

[28:24] today, we could easily make lot one into two lots because it has adequate

[28:30] frontage and adequate size. We don't have an intention of doing it now, but

[28:36] when we come back in the future, if we ever did, we'd like the planning board

[28:40] to say that road that you designed that has a

[28:46] uh criteria that there may not be any further subdivision.

[28:52] you have disclosed to us and we designed it in a way that it was adequate for

[28:57] six. I I don't think the board will ever say

[29:02] that making this 22 ft is necessary for six. Although if you do that, that's

[29:06] fine with us. I just want to be genuous and say we see that there's a

[29:13] possibility sometime in the future that it may go to six slots. And if it goes

[29:17] to six lots, we would like the board to note that that requirement that it no

[29:24] further subdivision was addressed and that we did that. That can be done at

[29:28] preliminary. Uh it may something that you want to talk about. It might be

[29:31] something that Mark wants to to research about the availability of it. We did

[29:36] turn that over to Anthony Disto that specific question, but he reserved his

[29:41] right to keep looking I think is fair enough to say. Um, but those are really

[29:45] the only criteria that make this any different from a very innocuous simple

[29:50] subdivision. >> No, I'm I'm just the the conscious of we

[29:56] right now you want to establish the elements that you want in the master

[30:00] plan approved in preparing for the preliminary plan. Is that right?

[30:05] » Yes. And so the the um if if you want to have in my opinion if you want to have

[30:12] six slots eventually we need to provide some conditional approval for that in

[30:17] the preliminary stage. I also think that the the

[30:23] we're going to need some better understanding of having uh the loader of

[30:27] moderate income

[30:31] building affordable factor that's in in in another

[30:36] structure. We're going to need

[30:39] » I I can address I can address that. and and in in addition to I'm assuming

[30:44] you're going to rent it. And so then then there there's all the

[30:49] the management of an affordable uh property and and how that is

[30:55] » monitoring >> monitored with the state

[30:59] there. There's a lot to that question. >> I'm I understand I just want

[31:04] » and I'll answer it at the preliminary but on a very preliminary because of

[31:08] where we are tonight. First of all, your ordinance specifically defines a

[31:11] dwelling unit. And when you look under dwelling unit under your ordinance, it

[31:15] says a building or a portion of a building. So your ordinance contemplates

[31:21] that a dwelling unit may be in a barn or maybe a duplex or maybe a market. So it

[31:27] doesn't have to be its own freestanding building. That was the first hurdle I

[31:30] thought I had to get over. Secondly, your

[31:36] ordinance says, "Thou shalt have one of your five lots." In this case, 20%, one

[31:42] of your five lots. It doesn't say shall contain a single family home. It doesn't

[31:47] say it shall contain a dedicated single family house to low to moderate income.

[31:54] It says it must contain a single low to moderate income dwelling unit. And when

[32:02] you go to dwelling unit, it says a building in a structure. That's I

[32:07] believe hurdle number two. Hurdle number three, when you redid your ordinance and

[32:12] when the state did the ordinance, it did not say that the unit needs to be the

[32:16] same size. Some communities actually have that. They have a size requirement

[32:20] for an LMI. Yours does not say that. Yours does just says it has to be the

[32:26] same quality. You don't want an LMI that's

[32:30] anyone insulting me with a trailer, but a trailer next to another home and say

[32:35] that's not the integration of a low to moderate income home into a nice

[32:40] community. I assure you this, I don't think it's possible that this isn't the

[32:45] nicest LMI in Little Compton when it's done. The problem with LMIs is

[32:53] there's some density bonuses and things, but as you know, you can't sell them for

[32:57] more than 400,000 and you can't rent them for more than X dollars. And you

[33:02] have to have a certain uh economic uh person to lease them that doesn't make

[33:08] over 85, I think, if they're single or 120,000 if there's a a couple of kids

[33:13] and a and a spouse. But you can't It doesn't It works in Providence. It

[33:18] really does. And we're trying to make it work in Little Compton, but you can't

[33:22] spend millions of dollars on a piece of of land and millions of dollars or

[33:28] substantial dollars to build a unit and then say, "Let's sell it." Even if

[33:33] someone could afford the maximum $480,000 to buy it, they couldn't afford

[33:37] the taxes and the insurance and the homeowners association often times in

[33:42] this unit. So, this is a subsidized unit basically for life by the Harrison's

[33:47] that they will rent it at uh according to the code at an amount that does not

[33:55] exceed the rental that can be charged in an LMI by state law that they will not

[34:01] have a tenant in that unit that exceeds the economic or monetary salary. And if

[34:09] the property loses, that's on them. that's a little easier to incorporate um

[34:15] inside a structure that you're already paying for and that you have the help of

[34:19] a homeowners association, in this case your own four kids um all utilizing and

[34:24] maintaining. So I think it works in that it fits your ordinance and I think it

[34:28] works in that it integrates quite frankly an LMI in a in a neighborhood

[34:32] that would never have it without your ordinance.

[34:40] S could you lean into the mic so that everybody can hear you

[34:43] » please >> lean into the microphone

[34:53] » can you hear me? >> There you go

[34:54] » everyone. >> Thank you.

[34:57] » So you want us to go beyond 900 ft. You want us to go to six lots

[35:06] eventually. You want us to give you the the the expectations of possibly

[35:15] using lot one for further subdivision. >> Well, that would make five into six.

[35:20] » Yes. >> Not ever more than that.

[35:22] » But you're you're talking about lot number one possibly in the future to do

[35:26] something else. meaning it could be a six lot subdivision whether we do it now

[35:32] or later. But okay, we would rather not create a lot for the sole purpose of

[35:38] beating an ordinance in the future that isn't necessarily

[35:43] always uh where modifications aren't >> always granted

[35:49] because we have no intention of cutting off a lot and selling it to anyone. We

[35:53] have intention of keeping this as a family. I'm going to make sure you don't

[35:58] uh that's not my problem. My problem is that you've given us a lot of

[36:03] definitions when you came here just now of what you could do without us. If that

[36:10] was possible, we wouldn't be here. >> I I don't that way.

[36:14] » I want to I want to be clear. I want to be clear on what you want before we go

[36:19] to the next stage. All right? I don't want to leave anything in the dock. I

[36:25] don't want to leave anything to your determination later. I want to know what

[36:30] you want now and and if it's something that we

[36:35] can agree on, fine. If not, I want to know that now.

[36:39] » All right. Let me go through a four process situation and have something I

[36:44] don't like later. >> Let me start with what we don't want. We

[36:48] don't want a 12 lot or 13 lot subdivision that this land supports. the

[36:53] engineering supports it here and they >> we know that

[36:57] » okay and and we don't want that. We would like one lot for parents and four

[37:05] lots for kids. >> Okay.

[37:07] » But we see the pro strong possibility that the

[37:14] 13 acre lot number one may need to be cut off in the future. And when it's cut

[37:19] off in the future, either we can say, "I just want to let you know we're cutting

[37:24] it off in the future. Are you okay with it?" Or if you would like here at Master

[37:28] and we just show you the six slots now. That's okay, too. We don't If this was

[37:35] the old days, we'd ask for two right now. And when a child said, "I'm ready

[37:41] to build," would come in and say, "The roads in as what used to be an admin or

[37:46] planning board approval not required. Can I have a lot for my next child? Can

[37:50] I have a lot for my next child? And we'd move right down the road. But because of

[37:54] all the new ordinances that say successive and we may not be able once

[38:00] you give us a modification for over 900 ft, if you granted us that, you may not

[38:05] do it again. We want to just say if we have to do it that way and do six now.

[38:11] Now, we're still not saying 12, but if we have to do it that way and do six

[38:14] now, then we'll do that. I just don't think that's a practical approach.

[38:20] But that's me.

[38:24] » Yeah, I'm good. >> The only scenario, just to be clear, the

[38:28] only scenario for lot six is should my husband and I die, we want to make sure

[38:33] if the kids can't afford our place, which I'm sure they probably won't be

[38:36] able to, and they have to sell our house, that the farm doesn't go with it.

[38:40] we just want to append it probably to somebody else's lot or have a lot six

[38:44] that they can all own. The plan is not to expand and build another house. So, I

[38:48] just want to make sure that's really clear.

[39:01] » Do you have any questions of Mr. Smith? Uh, by the way, do we have the drawing

[39:06] of the uh barn? Well, the one question I had was you you

[39:11] shown the uh six houses with

[39:16] six accessory dwelling units. Is that correct?

[39:21] » That is >> five

[39:24] » five houses with five houses dwelling units. Correct. And so when you uh come

[39:30] back for uh the preliminary, you'll know the number of bedrooms and because it

[39:37] you've switched from uh I think so now everybody has an

[39:43] individual uh septic system of their own. Is that correct?

[39:47] » That's correct. >> So those will all obviously be worked

[39:51] out for prelim >> including the ADUs. And then besides

[39:54] appropriately to handle an ADU, if there is going to be an ADU for for those

[39:59] lots, it is allowed. We as a matter of we wanted to show it so that if somebody

[40:06] down the road >> wanted to do that, then nobody's going

[40:10] to say, "Well, you never told us," >> right?

[40:15] You say, "I want to know."

[40:28] look like. >> Very nice.

[40:33] » It's like the school. It looks like the school.

[40:37] You take a picture of the school built.

[40:58] Yep.

[41:04] Just Bill, other than the unique nature of this lot and that it's already starts

[41:09] 980 ft deep on on the road that was other than the unique nature of the lot

[41:15] that it by definition doesn't start till 1,000 ft in the road that you've

[41:21] designed. Were were there any uh scenarios that you could shorten that

[41:25] and still try to get the frontage of uh the five lot division?

[41:34] » Um yeah. So, so that was laid out so that

[41:38] we could take advantage of the there's a substantial amount of water frontage

[41:43] along this lot and the four lots um lots 2, three, four, and five will all be uh

[41:50] have water frontage. So, the road really couldn't be shortened uh substantially.

[41:56] Could I move the coal sack back a few feet? Maybe, but this seemed like this

[42:00] was a a good fit. Um, we've incorporated storm water uh BMPPS along the roadway

[42:08] uh so that we capture storm water so we're not causing any issues with uh

[42:13] runoff or sedimentation um you know for the for either the water

[42:18] or for any of the neighbors. Um this this seemed like this was the best best

[42:24] fit for the roadway. >> Uh stay at the mic Bill for a minute. I

[42:28] have a question. When you I was up there today. When you when you go in and you

[42:33] as you go in, it takes quite a rise [clears throat] to the peak. Are you are

[42:39] you confident that you can pick up that water that's coming off that ride and

[42:44] going towards West Main Road? >> Yes.

[42:48] » Okay. Yeah. >> If if do you have

[42:52] do you have a a way of uh of taking care of that if the calculations are

[43:00] » So So we do that that section that's on the actress prop a trust property um

[43:06] that drains back toward West Bane Road. We'll have a swale system incorporated

[43:11] into it with a series of check dams so that it can have whiz going down in the

[43:17] swailes. >> Exactly. Yeah.

[43:18] » All right. So, you can feed the swale at at West Main

[43:22] » and and the water will stay in each of the cells, if you want to call it that,

[43:27] uh infiltrate into the ground so that it reduces the runoff going out to West

[43:31] Main. >> That's designed to the south side of the

[43:33] road so that it doesn't interfere with the farmer.

[43:37] » Yeah. >> And that was part of the act trust

[43:39] discussion. >> Thank you. Thank you.

[43:42] » Can I just say >> you you had asked a question if for

[43:44] Perlin we would have the number of bedrooms for each of them. I just want

[43:48] to make sure that you're aware that three of the lots will be built on

[43:52] relatively soon. The other two will be quite a while. So, we originally, as you

[43:56] recall, we were going in phasing because we knew two of them weren't building for

[44:00] quite some time, but we're still going forward with the five, but we don't have

[44:03] we won't have the details on two of those lots.

[44:05] » Okay.

[44:09] Thank you, C.

[44:13] » I'm good.

[44:18] I don't think we have any other questions.

[44:21] » And all five of these are individuals, right?

[44:23] » All the septic systems. >> So all five of these lots are individual

[44:27] ISDs systems. So they would um based on Rhode Island DEM be approved for a

[44:34] fourbedroom or a five-bedroom. If the person that was getting the lot, the

[44:38] child that was getting the lot anticipated the ADU and the ADU was

[44:43] going to be onebedroom, then if they were at a four-bedroom house, they

[44:46] either would build a five- bedroomedroom system or they would have to do a new

[44:50] system at a later date. But that is 100% uh done by by DEM, right? But this is

[44:56] not the common system like we that's a much bigger issue in the common system

[45:01] in the other properties that we've been before you recently.

[45:05] You're you're not going to utilize the first culde-sac at the at the beginning

[45:12] of this property and at the end of the egg trust property.

[45:16] » That culde-sac was put on to provide frontage. Yes. This lot. So it

[45:20] legitimized this 31 acres as a separate lot. We are not going to use that

[45:25] culdeac. We don't need the front. >> So that won't be improved.

[45:28] » No. Okay. >> No, there's no need for that.

[45:31] » Okay. >> We're good.

[45:34] » Yeah. But the culde-sac at the end is of adequate size and we'll have letters

[45:39] from the fire department. >> Okay,

[45:41] » I'm good. >> Thanks,

[45:44] » Mr. Chair. So, all you would need on this is a a vote to move to public

[45:48] hearing. Master plan public hearing.

[45:54] » Master plan public. >> Never mind. So moved. I need to hear

[45:56] what it is. What's the motion? Mark, can >> you make the motion again? Mark.

[46:02] » I'll make a motion that we move this the master for

[46:05] » to to master plan. >> Master plan.

[46:07] » Master plan. Public hearing. >> Public hearing.

[46:11] You >> want to second?

[46:12] » All those in favor? >> Second.

[46:13] » I we scheduling that for next month. >> Thank you.

[46:18] » Second. >> Are we automatically scheduling that for

[46:20] next month? >> No.

[46:25] [laughter] >> Yeah. Okay.

[46:27] » The application. >> Can I Can I ask a question? I just want

[46:30] to make sure I got it straight. It was master plan not

[46:33] » this is a master plan applic

[46:38] » right but this is a master plan application so weed the entire package

[46:42] to do master plan so we're not coming back for preliminary we just agreed that

[46:46] this could be informal and then we'd come back for

[46:50] but we don't have to refile anything no >> which would except for advertising make

[46:56] this continue to next month on your agenda subject to our uh working with

[47:01] Julie to make sure it's advertised for the public master plan hearing.

[47:06] » Yes, correct. >> Skip a month. I have time to to

[47:08] advertise. >> We want to make sure the advertising

[47:11] gets done correctly. So, absolutely. >> But if the advertising is done, we'll

[47:14] see you next month. >> Yes.

[47:17] » Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Bill.

[47:44] So now we're we're going to um move to item number four in accordance with the

[47:49] agenda. Uh and u I think that we should we should uh

[47:56] ask the youngs to lead off the comments and uh then we'll

[48:03] alternate with other people that wish to speak and we'll um

[48:09] try to limit it to uh 3 minutes but we'll we'll see how that goes.

[48:15] » Good evening. Good evening, Tyler. >> You have me before we started.

[48:25] » So, good evening. My name is Tyler Young. Uh, my wife Carl and I operate

[48:30] Young Family Farm. Many of you know our farm well. We started 108 acres back in

[48:35] 1997. And over the years, we've grown into

[48:39] operation over 300 acres. We're one of the larger growers in the state. Uh,

[48:43] raised some pretty good corn, too. Farming this land always will be

[48:50] our primary purpose. But as anyone in agriculture knows, open land isn't just

[48:55] scenic backdrop. It is a living, breathing operation that

[49:00] requires constant physical work, massive daily investment, and deep

[49:04] responsibility to our environment. My family has worked these lands for

[49:07] generations, and our greatest hope is to pass the legacy on to the next. But it

[49:13] brings up a critical question. What will our town look like if working farms

[49:17] disappear? When farmland is no longer financially

[49:20] sustainable and active cultivation stops, those fields don't simply stay

[49:24] pristine. They quickly turn into dense brush, overgrown briars, and unmanaged

[49:29] tall grass, breeding several tick infestations, and

[49:33] driving deer activity right into our neighboring yards, which we already

[49:36] have. Even more than that, keeping a working

[49:40] farm viable is what protects our community from ultimate disruption,

[49:44] being forced to sell farmland. The reality is very few farmers today can

[49:48] afford to purchase land in this town, even land that is protected.

[49:53] To keep 300 acres active and well-managed, modern farmers must be

[49:57] allowed to diversify. That is why we started a petition for

[50:01] our community members and customers who support our vision. We're not asking for

[50:06] zoning change. We are requesting a special you special use permit

[50:11] specifically for our farm. This ensures the town council retains

[50:16] full control of keeping our plan squarely aligned with the town's

[50:20] comprehensive plan. In a short time, we received

[50:24] overwhelming support, nearly 900 signatures, 400 which have come directly

[50:29] from Old Compton residents and taxpayers.

[50:33] We're also honored to be joined tonight by representatives from Rhode Island

[50:36] BEM, the Department of Agriculture, the Farm Bureau, and State Legal Council.

[50:41] The state of Rhode Island has made its position explicitly clear for preserving

[50:45] working farmland for main and production, family farms need

[50:48] sustainable economic models such as hosting limited farm-to-table events and

[50:53] community gatherings. State officials are here tonight support

[50:57] modernizing rules so that family farms like ours can survive

[51:03] tonight. Let's simply set the record straight and work together to preserve

[51:06] agriculture part of our town. Thank you. But I'd like to also say that there's a

[51:11] flyer that was passed around town and that flyer was very inaccurate.

[51:17] Some of the claims were multiple commercial venues false unrestricted

[51:22] parties false. harmful tranquility false. Now, we did a measurement. Some

[51:27] of the neighbors saying we're 70 ft from the venue. The closest one was 241 ft.

[51:32] The next one was 401 ft. Our proposed guardrails and facts

[51:38] limited special use permit pilot program. Maximum 10 evening events per

[51:44] year with flexible to work with town 150 guest cap. Music stops at 9:00.

[51:51] Farm first focus events tied to agriculture, farm, flowers, vegetables,

[51:56] and local. Designated parking area avoids on street parking and traffic.

[52:03] Why support this proposal? Preserves working farmland. Creates critical

[52:08] revenue for multigenerational farm sustainability. Fair treatment. Follows

[52:14] rules similar to other non-farm venues in Little Compton.

[52:19] Specific special use permit. A property specific permit for young

[52:24] family only. This is not a townwide zoning change. It allows for strict

[52:28] custom conditions tailored to farm and neighborhood. Give towns council

[52:33] complete control and full review after two-year trial. Next, I'd like to

[52:37] introduce my daughter Sarah.

[52:42] Just give me a minute. I got to pull this up.

[52:49] We're ready to add another grandchild. >> Yeah, any day now.

[52:56] » Actually, >> um, good evening everyone. My name is

[53:01] Sarah Young. My sister Haddie and I are here tonight to ensure Young Family Farm

[53:06] survives for our kids' generation. She has twin boys and I have a boy due

[53:11] probably the end of this week. To be honest, working farms are a huge part of

[53:15] what makes Little Compton special. However, keeping a farm viable today uh

[53:20] requires diversifying revenue to be sustainable against the unpredictable

[53:24] weather. Yeah. And today's market cost of

[53:28] agriculture. This isn't just business, it's personal.

[53:32] Hadtie and I held our own weddings and baby showers on the farm just last year

[53:38] and in 2024 successfully without any complaints.

[53:42] Many people in this room were actually at these celebrations where our caterers

[53:46] featured the farm's crops, which guests still talk about how good the sweet corn

[53:50] and potatoes were. Not to mention the immense amount of flowers showcased. My

[53:55] sister and I own a floral design business, Young Designs. We sourced at

[54:00] our both of our weddings roughly 75% of the flowers used directly from the

[54:05] fields. Since 2016, Young Designs has been rooted in agriculture.

[54:11] We focus sourcing farm flowers, which significantly drives the farm's flower

[54:15] growing operations. The farm's flower growing operations wouldn't be what they

[54:20] are today if it weren't for our floral design business.

[54:23] Private events like these are what help provide the predictable revenue, demand,

[54:28] and profitability that our farm needs to thrive.

[54:32] To clear up confusion and address those who oppose our request, we encourage

[54:36] everyone to read our full pilot program proposal that we have on our website and

[54:42] the town's public records. We don't want a permanent zoning change.

[54:47] were requesting, as my dad said, the temporary 2-year special use permit for

[54:52] a tide events, including private daytime gatherings intertwined with workshops,

[54:58] farm-to-table weddings, in addition to the public events we already host, like

[55:03] the annual apple festival. Our farm has hosted that responsibly for over 10

[55:08] years now. Allowing private gatherings in

[55:11] residential zones is not unprecedented in Little Compton. The golf club

[55:16] operates right here under residential zoning. Regardless of grandfathered

[55:20] rights, working farms deserve that same conditional land use opportunity to

[55:25] divers diversify and adapt to today's economic realities.

[55:32] Banning events outright isn't the answer. Enforcable [clears throat]

[55:35] rules are. Our pilot program addresses impacts that would affect neighbors with

[55:40] binding conditions. 50 guest cap, on-site parking, and the

[55:45] uh 9:00 p.m. music cutoff. States across the country like New Jersey and Virginia

[55:50] have already passed legislation, recognizing that private farm events are

[55:56] essential to saving family farms. They do this again through clear enforcable

[56:00] caps, the exact same accountability model we're proposing tonight.

[56:05] We want to thank the nearly 900 supporters, including over 350 Little

[56:09] Compton taxpayers, who stand with us and have signed our petition supporting the

[56:14] proposal. We ask the board to evaluate this

[56:18] proposal based on its concrete physical impacts and sound land use policy. Thank

[56:23] you.

[56:26] » Thank you.

[56:40] Anyone

[56:45] else want to speak?

[56:50] » Someone from your

[56:54] » Yes. >> Yes.

[57:03] » So, my name is Jane Wear. I am taking over White Lark Farm, which is right

[57:10] across from Peekom's greenhouse, if everybody knows where I'm talking about.

[57:17] My father is Rusty Kabat. Um, and I have a vested interest in Young's Farm

[57:27] being able to host weddings because that will affect White Rock Farm in the

[57:35] future because um, as we set ourselves up for the next generation to take over

[57:44] the farm, if they want to, I don't know. Um,

[57:50] we need to have other revenue outside of agricultural

[57:59] agricultural um, things for them to be able to do and

[58:04] weddings is one of those things because it's agricultural tourism.

[58:11] Um, and the Right to Farm Act for Rhode Island states specifically in

[58:22] 2-23-4 agricultural operations defined is

[58:30] in that is the mixed use of farm and farmlands for other forms of enterprise

[58:37] including but not limited to the display of antique

[58:42] vehicles, equipment, retail sales, tours, classes, petting, feeding and

[58:48] viewing of animals, hay rides, crop mazes, festivals, and other special

[58:54] events are hereby recognized as valuable and viable means of contributing to

[59:02] preservation of agricultural. So, one of the things that came

[59:10] out was that weddings were not agricultural.

[59:16] And according to the definition

[59:21] of the farm, the right to farm act is festivals and other things

[59:31] i.e. weddings are allowed on agricultural land.

[59:37] Um, so

[59:41] with the 2018 Little Compton comprehensive plan,

[59:50] one of the things on page 71 and 72 is that that the town is concerned not only

[59:57] with preserving agricultural land, but also improving the vitality of the

[1:00:03] existing agricultural operation and maintaining rural

[1:00:08] rural economy. In many farming communities, accessories used to support

[1:00:14] agricultural growing portions of revenues for farmers often

[1:00:21] ne are often necessary to maintain active farms. While the towns

[1:00:28] is generally supportive of this concept, the strong desire of the town to ensure

[1:00:35] that commercial activities on farmland are an appropriate scale and are

[1:00:40] directly related related to our agricultural

[1:00:45] production of or principal use of the land. The town should consider

[1:00:51] regulations that will support desired and appropriate commercial activities on

[1:00:56] farms and discourage and set limits to the types of activities will that will

[1:01:03] increase uh create a nuisance for surrounding residential properties and

[1:01:09] compro and compromise rural and peaceful nature of the community. with Young's

[1:01:16] Farm's proposal of a 2-year um

[1:01:27] special license that they will h and they've

[1:01:34] um

[1:01:37] [sighs and gasps] limited themselves i.e.

[1:01:41] Everything will be com done by 900 pm. The the the

[1:01:47] size of the the wedding will be either 150 people or 175. I've seen both of

[1:01:56] those numbers. Um I think is valid

[1:02:03] because it's not a overreaching.

[1:02:08] It's it's a limited let's see how we do with this

[1:02:17] limited number of um weddings

[1:02:23] and if there's a problem then we can readress it.

[1:02:32] » Thank you. >> Thank you.

[1:02:41] My name is Lindsay June. Um, friend of the farmer, friend of the cabbs,

[1:02:47] obviously. And not to quote anything agricultural, and you might call this

[1:02:51] apples and oranges, but a little bit of me feels like we were burned before.

[1:02:57] And we give a better chance to a millionaire in a mansion in Newport who

[1:03:01] sold jewelry than we're giving to our own local farmers

[1:03:09] to maintain and to prosper on their land. For our future, for Little

[1:03:16] Compton's future, the Kitts had Jane Kat. She kept Little Compton little,

[1:03:22] didn't she? She looked out for the farmers. She looked out for the

[1:03:24] civilians. She looked out for all the workers. while her son was off fighting

[1:03:29] in the folder for the nation. These are good people, guys.

[1:03:35] Really good people. We don't have 100 farms

[1:03:41] in Little Compton that could handle a 150 person wedding. It's nonsense.

[1:03:48] We have a few farms and they're good farms and they're good people and

[1:03:52] without giving them a shot. It's two years. It's two years. They're reigning

[1:03:58] themselves in. They're begging you guys for assistance. These are your people.

[1:04:04] These are your constituents. Just think it through long and hard.

[1:04:09] That's all I have to say. Thank you.

[1:04:21] Good evening, Mr. Chairman, members of the board. Uh my name is attorney Dne

[1:04:25] Ardente. For the record, I represent a group of concerned abutters and agreed

[1:04:29] parties and residents uh within the town of Little Compton. I wanted to mention

[1:04:33] to this planning board before I get started, I'm very well aware of what

[1:04:37] we're doing here tonight and I'm very well aware that the planning board also

[1:04:40] understands what we're doing here tonight. Um, as the planning board

[1:04:44] knows, this is a process and it's the same process for every town for passage

[1:04:48] of an ordinance. I understand that the planning board has already issued a

[1:04:51] negative recommendation to the town council and ultimately it's going to be

[1:04:54] the town council's duty to actually review the ordinance, hold public

[1:04:58] comment, and take a vote on it. However, if the planning board were to uh want to

[1:05:04] hear further input on this, I would ask that the planning board not change its

[1:05:08] current negative recommendation for the following reasons.

[1:05:12] I heard uh earlier some testimony provided that this special use permit is

[1:05:17] not going to apply to every farm. Um but the problem is is when we actually look

[1:05:21] at the text of the ordinance. There is no limiting factors, right? It's a

[1:05:26] farming accessory use. There is no qualifying factors for which farms are

[1:05:29] able to take advantage of it and which farms aren't. Now that would be probably

[1:05:34] the qualifying language that you would look for would probably be dimensionally

[1:05:37] related potentially on acreage or amount of space or something of that nature.

[1:05:42] The only thing in this ordinance that it actually proposes is someone engaged in

[1:05:46] farming use. So it is applicable to any farm any farm throughout town if this

[1:05:51] ordinance was passed as written and take advantage of the special use permit. The

[1:05:55] second part of this is I'm not aware of any provision in the Rhode Island

[1:06:01] general laws that would allow a special use permit to have a sunset period or be

[1:06:05] temporary. But what I am aware of after reviewing the code and the proposed

[1:06:09] amendments is that the text as written in this ordinance has no 2-year

[1:06:13] provision for this to be temporary. Once this is in, as it's written, it's in.

[1:06:17] And I didn't see anything proposed that would say it was 2 years. And I worry

[1:06:21] that the town council is going to potentially just assume that that's

[1:06:24] drafted into there. Now, the planning board's only concern with their

[1:06:30] recommendation and the negative recommendation which they properly

[1:06:33] issued and the the reasons for why they properly issued is based on the fact

[1:06:37] that this is inconsistent with the town's comprehensive plan. And I just

[1:06:40] wanted to point out a few portions of the comprehensive plan that uh that I

[1:06:44] think the planning board should be aware of. Uh in the accessory uses on farms

[1:06:48] and the comprehensive plan, it provides it is a strong desire of the town to

[1:06:52] ensure that commercial activities on farmland are of an appropriate scale and

[1:06:56] directly related to aggricultural production or principal use of land.

[1:07:03] Additionally, uh limiting factors for economic

[1:07:07] development provides most importantly economic development is limited by the

[1:07:12] desire of the residents to live in a quiet rural community. I understand that

[1:07:16] this ordinance is limited to size and the amount of people that can be at the

[1:07:21] venue. Uh but there are several portions of the comprehensive plan that this also

[1:07:26] raises concerns about with the amount of lighting. I understand that the

[1:07:30] ordinance proposes an enclosed uh event area, but that doesn't take into

[1:07:35] consideration the amount of vehicles that are going to be coming in and out

[1:07:38] on uh West Main Road, which I understand currently is an unlated road. Uh and

[1:07:42] again, these are going to be patrons of a wedding. We all know that patrons of

[1:07:45] wedding weddings drink. Uh that's a concern that I think the town should be

[1:07:49] considering at this point in time. Um, additionally, uh, I understand that

[1:07:54] although it's not this this board's jurisdiction or interest to determine at

[1:07:59] this point in time, uh, the restrictions applicable to to the Young family farm,

[1:08:03] there's a conservation restriction on this property that directly and

[1:08:08] expressly prohibits them from engaging in this in this use. And the last thing

[1:08:13] that I'll touch on for the board tonight uh, is I heard reference that this is an

[1:08:19] agricultural use. Well, the problem is, and as I'm sure the board's council,

[1:08:24] who's a phenomenal council, has advised them many times, there's a case called

[1:08:28] Zerella versus the town of Exiter, and our Supreme Court has specifically

[1:08:32] declared and expressly declared that weddings and events are not an

[1:08:37] agricultural use protected under the Right to Farm Act. Thank you.

[1:08:41] » Thank you.

[1:08:51] Good evening. I'm uh Jack Salvagio. I'm a a butter of

[1:08:57] the young farm and um I consider myself friends with the Youngs. I partnered

[1:09:05] with Tyler for at least 15 years to farm my backfield. Uh got to know the family

[1:09:12] through that process and I still regard them my friends. I I don't enjoy coming

[1:09:16] up here and having to face off my neighbor, but that's where we are. But

[1:09:21] [clears throat] there were a number of letters written

[1:09:24] to the planning board, town council about this, and there were about 15

[1:09:30] letters of opposition. At least eight to nine of those letters

[1:09:35] were direct to Butters to the Young Farm. There were no letters of support

[1:09:41] on the young side that were direct to Butters. And I'm

[1:09:45] I'm here to speak about being in the butter here and what what's ahead of us.

[1:09:50] First thing I'd like to point out is they're they're proposing 150 people for

[1:09:57] these weddings. And if you count up the amount of people in these rows and you

[1:10:03] count the number of rows, we don't even have 150 people

[1:10:08] sitting here. We have less than that. So you have to add more of these people

[1:10:11] here, more of these people here, probably to at least the front half of

[1:10:17] this room. So we're talking about this many people

[1:10:21] um attending these weddings and the parking that you would also assume for

[1:10:27] about this many people would come onto the farm. Um what we're really here to

[1:10:32] talk about is a zoning change. um and the difference between residential

[1:10:40] zoning and commercial zoning. And the uh the the number one goal of our

[1:10:49] town's zoning ordinance is to promote the public health, the safety, and the

[1:10:56] general welfare of the town. Okay. of the number seven goal is to provide for

[1:11:03] the control, protection and abatement of air, water, groundwater and noise

[1:11:10] pollution. Okay. And I and that comes to partly

[1:11:15] what we're talking about as was just mentioned by Dane Ardente.

[1:11:21] Uh there w this this entire case there was a farmer in exit Rhode Island in

[1:11:26] 2018 that

[1:11:29] uh interpreted accessory use under the right to farm act as his ability to host

[1:11:35] weddings for a fee on his farm. And unlike our town, uh the town of Exiter

[1:11:43] uh looked at the residents were abudding

[1:11:46] his farm and they they objected and the solicitor took that farmer to court and

[1:11:53] this case went to the Supreme Court. And the wording in that the wording from the

[1:11:59] the ruling, I'll read it to you right here. It says, "After careful

[1:12:03] consideration of this issue, we agree with the town. It is our view that the

[1:12:08] second sentence of 2-23-4 provides only a clear and unambiguous

[1:12:14] list of mixed uses that the general assembly has recognized as a valuable

[1:12:19] and viable means of contributing to the preservation of agriculture. That list

[1:12:24] does not include weddings. But it is our opinion that even if the activity of

[1:12:28] hosting weddings for a fee fell within the ambit of 2-23-4

[1:12:35] second sentence that's second sentence that sentence would not and could not

[1:12:40] expand the definition of agricultural operations.

[1:12:44] So what we're if you look at the definition of residential zoning versus

[1:12:52] commercial zoning the purpose for residential zoning it's

[1:12:56] designed for housing including single family homes, town houses, apartments,

[1:13:01] condominiums maintained to have a lower traffic

[1:13:05] levels and strict noise limits to ensure quiet safe living environments.

[1:13:11] Uh the regulations for residential zoning focus heavily on maintaining

[1:13:16] neighborhood character, lot sizes, keeping commercial disruption out.

[1:13:22] Commercial zoning dedicated to business operations such as retail stores,

[1:13:27] office, rents, restaurants, hotels, and warehouses built to hire higher volumes

[1:13:33] of people and noise, delivery trucks, heavier parking, utility demands. So,

[1:13:40] this is kind of what we're talking about right in as in a butter right right in

[1:13:45] our neighborhood. Now, um bear with me a second. So,

[1:13:52] I understand there's going to be a representative here from the DEM who

[1:13:56] owns the or who uh the conservation easement was

[1:14:02] conveyed by the Rhode Island Department of Environmental Management. I have I

[1:14:07] have a certain I have a I have the same easement on my own property. Um

[1:14:13] so [clears throat] if you go to the Department of

[1:14:16] Environmental Management's actual website today and you wanted to find out

[1:14:22] about farmland preservation which I did which I have on my own property you read

[1:14:29] the very first uh sentence. It says the farmland preservation program helps to

[1:14:33] ensure that farming remains viable in that state in the state. It does this by

[1:14:39] purchasing development rights from farmers which enable them to retain

[1:14:44] ownership of their property while protecting the land for agricultural

[1:14:48] use. Um not commercial use, agricultural use. And if you go down and they're

[1:14:55] frequent frequently asked question, [gasps]

[1:14:58] what is a development right? The acquisition of development rights is a

[1:15:04] purchase right or easement to the property which restricts all future use

[1:15:09] except those relating to farming with a goal of permanently protecting the best

[1:15:13] farmland farmland and preserving a base of agricultural land for food protection

[1:15:19] and open space. Selling development rights enables a land owner to keep land

[1:15:25] in agricultural use. And finally on their website

[1:15:32] and their frequently asked question once I sell my development rights how will my

[1:15:37] property be restricted and it gives three or four restrictions.

[1:15:41] Final one is no use other than agriculture.

[1:15:45] So, even if we have the DEM supporting weddings, and I support expanded uses

[1:15:53] for farms, this is really about weddings and corporate events on farms. It's not

[1:15:58] about farm-to-table dinners, uh, you know, some of the festivals Tyler's had,

[1:16:04] we nobody's had any issue like that. But the abutters and one thing that was

[1:16:09] mentioned here earlier that was on some things on that card were not accurate.

[1:16:13] If you take the GIS map of the young farm,

[1:16:18] one thing that the Agricultural Land Preservation Commission has said is we

[1:16:23] will allow you to have farms on that farm of 180 acres, but it can only be on

[1:16:30] the equivalent of about a five to 6 acre parcel pushed right up against the homes

[1:16:36] on West Main Road. And if you take the GIS map, which you can do, and you use

[1:16:41] their measurement tool, there are three homes, including the Youngs, which could

[1:16:44] be sold in the future, that are 70 ft away from that border. That border only

[1:16:50] extends another 200 ft total from that back wall approximately. So, so you

[1:16:57] really are not talking about 180 acre farm. You're talking about a 6 acre

[1:17:01] parcel, 5 to 6 acre parcel pushed right up against the West Main Road homes. And

[1:17:07] that's how it should be looked at. Finally, uh, with regard to the

[1:17:10] comprehensive plan, >> Mr. Salvage, I'm just going to ask you

[1:17:15] to try to wrap this up. >> Yeah. Okay. I'll finish up.

[1:17:17] » You're going about five minutes. I >> All right. Thank you.

[1:17:19] » Just earlier that we try to keep these comments to about three minutes.

[1:17:22] » Okay. I'll just I'll just read two goals. One of them was was already said.

[1:17:28] I said it says a strong desire of our town to ensure that commercial

[1:17:31] activities on farmland are of an appropriate scale and are directly

[1:17:34] related to agricult production or principal use of land and to discourage

[1:17:39] or set limits on the types of activities which may create a nuisance for

[1:17:43] surrounding residential neighbors or compromise the rural and peaceful nature

[1:17:47] of the community. And there have been some people suggest you know we we close

[1:17:51] our windows. Uh you know little kids little b you little three-year-old kids

[1:17:56] which the young baby sap for my kid when they're 3 years old they they go to bed

[1:18:01] at 7:00 at night and we like to sleep with our windows open little Compton and

[1:18:07] we like to sleep where we're not hearing 150 people in our backyard 10 times a

[1:18:12] year. Thank you.

[1:18:23] Good evening. Um, Chairman Steers, a member of the planning boards. My name

[1:18:26] is Eileen Stores Celino and my husband and I live at Two Butts Rock Road. My

[1:18:31] husband and I are a Butters at a family farm on Shaw Road, Wishing Stone Farm

[1:18:36] that would be affected by this revised zoning ordinance to inject commercial

[1:18:40] businesses like weddings into a residential neighborhood. We're here

[1:18:45] tonight because of a dangerous myth circulating by neighbors who do not abut

[1:18:49] the farm who have com commented that there's a middle path or an easy

[1:18:53] compromise that can regulate commercial weddings on farmland. I'm not sure they

[1:18:58] understand the implication of a townwide zoning regulation change. Or if they do,

[1:19:03] they aren't living right next door to the location of a farm that may become a

[1:19:08] wedding venue. As my compatriots already said, this room is probably a good size

[1:19:14] or estimate of what a wedding like that might be. And in speaking directly to

[1:19:18] one of those neighbors, when I asked them how they would feel living across

[1:19:22] the street from a farm with weddings, they admitted they would not like it at

[1:19:26] all. It's easy to advocate for a compromise when you are an armchair

[1:19:31] observer living safely down the street, far out of earshot. Another neighbor

[1:19:36] also mentioned by someone else here, not in a butter actually advised that we

[1:19:40] close our windows. But for my family, living under a 100 ft

[1:19:45] from a farm in the residential agricultural zone, a middle path does

[1:19:50] not exist. We love the tractors, the working soil. We knew what we moved

[1:19:54] into. We knew there was a farm across the street. We rejoiced. We had a lovely

[1:19:59] organic farm. But that's a vast structural difference between the sounds

[1:20:04] of agriculture and small to farm table dinners and other appropriately scaled

[1:20:10] agricultural accessory uses versus 150 person weddings with amplified music at

[1:20:16] night going on until late in the evening. And as aside, I have my

[1:20:19] grandchildren coming here shortly and I don't want to have to close the windows.

[1:20:23] We moved here because Little Compton is beautiful and we've been coming down

[1:20:27] here for 45 years and we was our dream to buy this home and be close to the

[1:20:33] ocean and around all the farms. So, this is absolutely just crushing and so

[1:20:38] stressful. But the e acoustic and ecological reality is that we are in a

[1:20:44] rural environment and this zoning rewrite is directly threatening that

[1:20:49] piece. Not just for human residents but for the local environment. Our dark

[1:20:54] skies, our wildlife, we heard uh great horned owls the other night. I don't

[1:20:59] think we're going to hear those over the music and lights. The directives of the

[1:21:03] comprehensive plan were extremely clear. There's proposed v the proposed zoning

[1:21:08] rewrite explicitly contradicts many of those uh directives which have already

[1:21:12] been mentioned but things like residential character protect the

[1:21:16] residential character from nuisance that generate excessive noise light pollution

[1:21:20] or traffic. Also, the comprehensive plan speaks expansively about sustaining

[1:21:26] rural landscapes, directing growth away from farms and forest areas into

[1:21:32] villages and existing commercial areas, being compatible with the aesthetic

[1:21:37] quality of the community and minimizing the negative environmental impacts. In

[1:21:41] other words, keeping Little Compton a quiet and beautiful place.

[1:21:46] This commercial, this proposal also raises fundamental questions about the

[1:21:51] economic priorities and the unverified narrative that our farmers are in

[1:21:55] trouble. We don't have proof of that. I'm sorry, I have financial backgrounds,

[1:21:59] but we don't have proof of that. And the reality is that local farmers today in

[1:22:04] Little Compton receive massive amounts of land for free to support their

[1:22:08] operations through the Little Compton Agricultural Trust, which we contributed

[1:22:13] to, the DEM, Sakconet Preservation Association, and the Nature Conservancy.

[1:22:19] Our community already heavily subsidizes agriculture to keep it viable. Pushing

[1:22:25] commercial operations into quiet residential agricultural zones is a

[1:22:29] failure of planning that compromises compromises neighborhoods rather than

[1:22:33] doing the hard work of supporting an active commercial center. And I will

[1:22:38] just comment we have seen a real decline in our commercial activity here and that

[1:22:42] is a problem that I think that the town council and the town needs to pay

[1:22:46] attention to. >> Miss Selena, we're going on about four

[1:22:48] and a half minutes. Could you please comments? Um, I just want to talk

[1:22:52] personally about what we we dealt with um in 2015 and 2016. We had

[1:22:58] unmititigated noise next door to us. We did not get any reaction from town

[1:23:04] council or the police. We were told to stop calling. There was also multi-year

[1:23:09] litigation at Carolyn Sconet Vineyard. There were no noise limits uh that were

[1:23:14] enforced. And today, Little Compton does not have the infrastructure to manage

[1:23:19] it. And in fact, the budgeted police force today is the same with 10

[1:23:24] policemen that there were in 2016. So increased costs. We are going to see

[1:23:29] Little Compton residents are going to be facing larger tax bills. It will require

[1:23:34] a larger police force, more zoning inspectors, and an increased number of

[1:23:38] fire department personnel. And abutterss are going to see a decline in the value

[1:23:42] of their real estate. So, we'll be asking for some mitigation in our

[1:23:47] assessed values and as um attorney already stood up and talked about there

[1:23:52] will be likely lit litigation that the town will need to pay for. So, the town

[1:23:57] and the town uh planning board has already been given some very good

[1:24:00] direction from the town solicitor. The Zerella versus extor.

[1:24:06] » Yes. And I'm wrapping it up. I will >> but I am

[1:24:11] I'm wrapping it up. I urge the planning board to stand by its previous logic and

[1:24:17] town council when presented with this zoning change and say no to protect our

[1:24:22] residential neighborhoods, protect our local environment, and soundly reject

[1:24:26] this short-sighted proposal for our family for generations to come. Thank

[1:24:31] you very much. >> Thank you.

[1:24:37] I'd just like to reiterate, we asked for people to keep their comments to about

[1:24:42] three minutes if they could. We have people standing in line. I'm sure that

[1:24:47] there more people are going to comment. The meeting has to be closed by 9:15.

[1:24:51] We're not going to get to everybody if we're all doing five minutes.

[1:24:55] » Thank you. >> And you're welcome. Can you hear me?

[1:24:59] My name is Barbara Passmore on West Main Road and I'm a butter to the far to the

[1:25:05] fam farm young family farm and they've been good neighbors. But as a farmer's

[1:25:13] daughter, I ask that you not change the rules that would take away our town's

[1:25:19] tranquility, uniqueness, and simplicity. Help us to

[1:25:24] keep our farms for farming and keep our town like no other that we have known in

[1:25:32] all these centuries. I ask you not to agree to this. Thank you.

[1:25:50] I'm Amanda Nickerson Toasty. I am 253 West Main Road. Any of you any of you

[1:25:57] that have purchased produce at Young Family Farm have seen my house. I live

[1:26:02] directly across from the entrance. Uh 9 years ago, my husband and I bought our

[1:26:07] home. We would like the Youngs to know that we support them and their right to

[1:26:13] have weddings on their property. They are our friends.

[1:26:18] They have been any time I have gone to Carla about the corn honking sign,

[1:26:25] the great corn honking event. Anytime we across the road have had a problem that

[1:26:30] has been very small in our opinion, very, very small. We've gone to Carla or

[1:26:36] Tyler. I have their cell phone numbers. If Tyler is about to start irrigating

[1:26:40] and using the wells, he texts me and it's usually along the lines of, "Hey

[1:26:45] kid, if you have any trouble, let us know." We support their right to have

[1:26:50] weddings on their farm. We would ask daytime if it could if if we do

[1:26:57] introduce weddings in some capacity into our farms, which if you support agro

[1:27:02] tourism, weddings are a part of that. farm-to-table weddings. You want to see

[1:27:07] the produce, you want to see the fields, you want to get married in the vines, in

[1:27:13] the pumpkins, whatever it is. Um, but what we would say is when the family

[1:27:19] weddings have happened, which we have no complaints. Many of them are our

[1:27:22] friends. Um, my bedroom faces the farm stand. So, every single vehicle that

[1:27:29] doesn't follow their very detailed parking, and they've done a great job at

[1:27:34] parking people on the farm. I used to be the crazy lady putting caution tape so

[1:27:39] people wouldn't hit my stone wall because stuff happens. They within the

[1:27:43] next season modified and moved all the parking from West Main Road into the

[1:27:49] farm. They've seen dangers. They've mitigated in the past. Um, my main thing

[1:27:55] would be if it could be a daytime event where if the farm stand were allowed to

[1:28:00] extend their hours to maybe 6:00 p.m. or 700 p.m. I can tell you I can tell time

[1:28:07] by 5:34 a.m. Tyler is in that tractor and he's in the front field. We hear him

[1:28:14] all night, all year in his tractor trailer, air braing right in front of my

[1:28:20] bedroom. But we understand that's food. That's the food bank donations that they

[1:28:25] make. That's all of the other good things that they do. I believe we need

[1:28:29] to support Wishing Stone. And also, I am a unique butter. I share 488 ft of stone

[1:28:36] wall with Ian Walker. So, not only do I live across the street from the Youngs,

[1:28:41] I purposefully bought a home 9 years ago next to Cole Walker. We love looking out

[1:28:47] our windows watching Cole in the tractor. We love looking out our

[1:28:51] windows. What I don't like is the idea of 75 to 100 cars coming out at my

[1:28:57] bedroom. The breakdown of a wedding if it ends at 900 p.m. Those of us that

[1:29:03] have worked for local caterers know that's not staff breaking down. That's

[1:29:08] not chairs, tables. That's not any of the cleanup that needs to be done. We do

[1:29:12] live in the woods. All of the food needs to be cleaned up and secured and

[1:29:16] removed. So, there's a lot more work that goes into a 900 p.m. event ending

[1:29:21] with 10 p.m. guests out the catering staff and it's not their fault and it's

[1:29:26] nothing that Tyler or Carla could control or any farm voices in the night.

[1:29:32] It sounds like they're in our bedroom. So, again, I would say we support

[1:29:37] weddings daytime use maybe until 7. We would just love to see a little bit more

[1:29:44] rained in on what exactly. And then also the daytime events. They're daytime

[1:29:49] events we've had no problem with. So if this was something we could fold in and

[1:29:53] talk more about, um, we are the voice of disscent in the neighborhood. We support

[1:29:58] you.

[1:30:10] » Hello. Good evening everyone. Uh my name is Ananda Fraser. I am the acting chief

[1:30:15] of the division of agriculture and forest and environment at the DEM.

[1:30:21] I am here representing the department of environmental management to express our

[1:30:26] strong support for the young family farm and its proposal.

[1:30:30] The young family farm is exactly the kind of agricultural operation Rhode

[1:30:34] Island has worked decades to protect. For nearly 30 years, the young family

[1:30:39] has farmed more than 300 acres, producing food for Little Compton, Rhode

[1:30:43] Island, and markets throughout the Northeast. Importantly, there is now a

[1:30:48] second generation that wants to continue their agricultural legacy.

[1:30:53] This is not something that should be ignored. It should be encouraged.

[1:30:58] When we talk about protecting farmland, we cannot simply focus on the land and

[1:31:02] allow it to beow. We have to keep the land in active agricultural production.

[1:31:08] And for that to happen, farms have to be viable. Not just financially viable, but

[1:31:14] viable across generations. Agriculture has changed. Costs have

[1:31:20] increased. Markets have changed. And island farms generally do not have the

[1:31:25] economies of scale available that larger operations would. Farms

[1:31:32] therefore need the ability to diversify and develop additional sources of

[1:31:36] revenue that complement and support their agricultural production.

[1:31:42] That is particularly important for Rhode Island agriculture. The average age of

[1:31:47] Rhode Island agricultural producer is over 57 years old. At the same time, 41%

[1:31:54] of producers are considered new and beginning farmers. We have the highest

[1:31:58] percentage in the nation. This is the exact scenario at Young Family Farm. We

[1:32:03] have people who want to continue farming and at the division of agriculture, it's

[1:32:08] our responsibility to make sure that they have the ability to continue

[1:32:11] farming that property for decades to come.

[1:32:15] Farms face unique pressures. We continue to lose farms over time. Rhode Island

[1:32:21] had,243 farms in 2012

[1:32:26] compared to just over a thousand farms today. That's almost a 16 16% decline or

[1:32:33] 200 farms in the last decade. Every time a working farm leaves

[1:32:38] production, we lose more than just the farmland. We lose the food production,

[1:32:42] the economic activity, open space, agricultural knowledge and an

[1:32:47] opportunity for the next generation. This is why the young farmley family

[1:32:52] farms proposal is so important. Agurism and the diversification of agricultural

[1:32:57] activities can provide farms the flexibility to remain in business while

[1:33:01] continuing their primary agricultural operations. A farm market, education

[1:33:07] program, seasonal activities, agricultural experience, and even

[1:33:10] hosting a wedding that highlights food and flowers produced on the farm can

[1:33:15] create an opportunity to sustain agriculture while connecting people with

[1:33:19] the land. The Young's plan is that the fundamental purpose of the property

[1:33:25] remains in agriculture. Diversification is a tool to support that purpose and

[1:33:30] help ensure the farm can continue operating.

[1:33:34] Rhode Island recognized th this reality through its right to farm act and its

[1:33:38] recognition of the diversification of agriculture activities means as a means

[1:33:43] of supporting the preservation of agriculture.

[1:33:46] So from the division's perspective, I come back to a simple question. What can

[1:33:51] we do to make sure that farms remain in agriculture as working farms for the

[1:33:58] next generation? In this case, we have a family that

[1:34:02] wants to continue farming hundreds of acres in Little Compton and a new

[1:34:06] generation prepared to take up that responsibility.

[1:34:09] We strongly support giving them the opportunity to do that. At the end of

[1:34:13] the day, preserving farmland is extraordinarily important, but

[1:34:17] preserving working farms is the goal. We want to see the Young Family Farm

[1:34:22] continue to produce food, support the local economy, steward the land, and

[1:34:26] provide an opportunity for another generation of Rhode Island farmers to

[1:34:30] make a living from agriculture. Thank you.

[1:34:41] I also just want to put on the record, I have sent in a letter to the planning

[1:34:46] board, but on the record that the young family farm does have an easement um

[1:34:51] through the the DEM, the division of agriculture. However, they did go

[1:34:55] through the necessary channels for approval for the event for the weddings

[1:35:00] event planned on the farm and it was approved in late 2024. So I just want to

[1:35:05] make sure that they have gone through the necessary channels to make sure that

[1:35:07] they are in compliance with their easement and nothing that is proposed

[1:35:11] would um would be in uh juxaposition of their their current easement. Thank you.

[1:35:28] » Good evening. My name is Heidi Quinn. I'm the executive director of Rhode

[1:35:31] Island Farm Bureau. Um, much of what Ananda says expresses our views as well.

[1:35:37] So, I'm going to be a little bit more brief. Uh, the most recent USDA census

[1:35:41] of agriculture shows Rhode Island to have the highest percentage of new and

[1:35:44] beginning Sorry, new I'm from Rhode Island. I apologize. Um, new and

[1:35:48] beginning farmers in the nation. If we do not allow our farms to be profitable,

[1:35:53] the next generation of farmers cannot succeed.

[1:35:57] Farm succession, either family to family or outside the family, is one way to

[1:36:01] maintain current a acreage, but only if farms can be profitable. It is far

[1:36:06] easier to sell off the land. Currently, Rhode Island has the highest

[1:36:10] agricultural land value in the country at $23,000 per acre. To compare, the

[1:36:16] national average is $4,300 per acre. All of New All of the Northeast has an

[1:36:22] average value of $7,500 per acre. The Youngs have preserved land, but

[1:36:29] there is a lot of agricultural land that is not preserved in Little Compton and

[1:36:33] other areas of the state. It is much easier to sell that land than to try to

[1:36:37] fail at farming. As farm input costs increase, fuel, seed, fertilizer,

[1:36:43] equipment, insurance, product prices cannot keep pace. Without profit, what

[1:36:48] is there to keep farmers farming? Agurism and diversification of a

[1:36:53] activities is an increasingly common way for farms to support their businesses

[1:36:58] economic stability while at the same time giving guests the opportunity to

[1:37:02] experience the farm. The Young family farm has offered a

[1:37:06] well-thoughtout proposal to allow them to host agurism events while maintaining

[1:37:11] an authentic agricultural connection to their farm. These events will help them

[1:37:15] to continue to strengthen their own economic viability and that of the

[1:37:19] farm's next generation while continuing to respect the community that they are a

[1:37:23] part of. Thank you. >> Thank you.

[1:37:38] » All right. My name is Skip Paul. I'm probably one of the oldest farmers in

[1:37:43] Little Compton at this point. I'm 74 years old and luckily I have a 35 year

[1:37:48] old son that's going to take up the mantle and keep going with it. I've been

[1:37:53] a 46 year town resident and uh running stone farm for a good 40 years of that.

[1:38:01] I want to support the uh young family farms uh farm ordinance uh accessory

[1:38:08] because I want to think it's a and everybody seems to be getting all

[1:38:12] bunched up about changing the town plan and reszoning everything. We're just

[1:38:16] looking for an example for him to try something out for two years. And uh I

[1:38:22] think that's really important to begin with. People get all freaked out that

[1:38:26] we're going to change the town u ordinances and everything. Um, I also

[1:38:32] like to give our small perspective on farming in Little Compton. And uh,

[1:38:36] another thing I want to comment is the extraordinary means that wellunded

[1:38:41] opposition has gone to inflate fear, misrepresent facts, and gaslight the

[1:38:47] farming community and the town into believing that allowing farm weddings

[1:38:52] will bring decades of out of control events which will ruin life as we know

[1:38:57] it. And I've seen misrepresentation coming

[1:39:01] through cards, video, the amount of money spent on uh websites and stuff and

[1:39:07] a lot of it's gone way over the top. It's almost become vitriolic and we're

[1:39:12] just trying to experiment to see how how a system would work for two years. Um

[1:39:18] the town can build whatever parameters it wants to and protocols to be met. The

[1:39:23] weddings don't have to go from 5 to 10:00. They can go from 1 to 7. public

[1:39:28] can be done. Nobody's headlights are bothering anybody. The town traffic is

[1:39:32] uh can be moderated. Um the town parking will be contained in their farm. Their

[1:39:37] farm is plenty of size to to take the uh farm uh parking. Noise town ordinances

[1:39:44] will be met. Um I don't think we have to change the town

[1:39:49] plan, but it it's good to have an experiment for two years.

[1:39:54] Um

[1:39:58] trying to save you a lot of my extra ideas here. Um but this the whole

[1:40:04] subject of that there's a hundred farms in town and that we're we're in danger

[1:40:08] of having all these people with card tabletop people selling eggs and

[1:40:14] zucchini as if they were there going to be a new type of farm that's going to

[1:40:18] register to try to be do weddings and everything else. I also like to mention

[1:40:24] hearken back to like Nelson Farm was doing weddings four or five years ago

[1:40:29] and it wasn't until some wealthy neighbor

[1:40:33] got enough lawyers and forced them to shut it down. And so um I say that

[1:40:39] little Compton, this famous rural character was created by agriculture and

[1:40:43] the fishing industry. Families like Gary Maderas

[1:40:48] and Cole Walker silently were the backdrop to the alluring character that

[1:40:53] Little Compton still is today. Yet some of the new wellto-do residents

[1:40:59] have any of their impact to the extent that Walker stand was closed because his

[1:41:06] son couldn't protect a sweet corn with a gas cannon. I was in an agricultural

[1:41:12] land tr the agricultural land trust committee meeting and some wealthy guy

[1:41:16] got up and said I didn't work all my life to buy a piece of land to have this

[1:41:20] cannon going off for 10 days and ruined my summer and I got up right after you

[1:41:25] stood up and said sir don't tell me you don't invest in the stock market you

[1:41:29] wouldn't buy a stock and have no idea you have somebody look at what the what

[1:41:33] the parameters are for what that's going to be I'm sorry you didn't look at your

[1:41:37] land next to a piece of land that the guys been using a cannon for 25 years to

[1:41:42] protect his his crops. And the farming community doesn't want a

[1:41:50] hand up, but needs some community awareness of the financial needs that a

[1:41:54] limited agricultural income requires. Many East Coast farmers, 85% of them now

[1:42:00] they say, need a husband or wife that has off

[1:42:04] seasonal job of teaching or some other work to make ends meet.

[1:42:09] If the wedding concept doesn't pass, please don't take aim at farm-to-table

[1:42:14] school bus tools and apple festivals. And my last comment I love to call

[1:42:19] walkie was a friend of mine. Walkers didn't close by lack of money, more from

[1:42:24] the lack of the community's interest and supporting the value of the commodity

[1:42:29] they offered. Thank you.

[1:42:50] I don't there's no way that I can uh follow, you know, the words of a real

[1:42:57] farmer and a real hard worker like Skip Paul. Um but I'll try.

[1:43:04] I'm speaking. My name is Jim Piatt. I live on Amesberry Lane. I'm an

[1:43:08] architect. I'm speaking tonight in support of the Young family farm

[1:43:12] proposal for a pilot program. I and probably everyone in this room in

[1:43:17] support or oppos opposition to the Young's proposal values the farm and its

[1:43:22] products as they relate both to their delightful consumption but also as part

[1:43:26] of the more intangible and aesthetic enjoyment of the

[1:43:30] ruralesque environment of the town itself.

[1:43:36] I though apparently not everyone take it at the young family's word

[1:43:41] and also the word of other farmers like Skip and other families. People can read

[1:43:45] about it across the country. We heard the state representative talk about it

[1:43:50] that farming crops in themselves does not provide a sustainable living for a

[1:43:55] farm family. I'm 77 years old. I've been working

[1:43:59] since the age of 14. generally hunched over a drawing board, but sometimes in

[1:44:04] construction labor. And so I figure, as many might, that I have worked hard.

[1:44:11] But I have for a long time been aware that there are others, farmers for sure,

[1:44:16] who work much harder physically, start their mornings earlier at 4:30, and

[1:44:20] don't quit at my closing time. They take extraordinary risks financially for

[1:44:26] tools and seed with their fortune such as it is determined as much by weather

[1:44:32] as by skill. And then we all who sit on the sidelines in safe and secure

[1:44:37] occupations hope that the farmer's children will want to continue the

[1:44:42] family tradition. It's a romantic notion that I wouldn't

[1:44:47] bet on. In Switzerland, by comparison, the government pays subsidies that

[1:44:53] account for approximately 50% of a farmer's income. So, the farms will not

[1:44:58] only survive for their produce, but also enhance the landscape quality based on

[1:45:04] legally determined aesthetic concepts of beauty, ecology, and

[1:45:09] tradition. And yet here in Little Compton, we hope the farmers will just

[1:45:14] keep doing it so the rest of us can have a bucolic landscape to drive by and eat

[1:45:20] a peach.

[1:45:28] The Youngs are asking for a permit for an event to occur on 10 days a year,

[1:45:32] creating increased activity for those 10 days. Well, the rest of us, for every

[1:45:37] day from mid-spring to midfall, we all accept outdoors, the unbidden and

[1:45:42] unlimited noise of lawnmowers, leaf blowers, airplanes overhead, motorcycles

[1:45:47] in convoys of a hundred, neighbors, outdoor parties and weddings, boom

[1:45:52] boxes, dogs parking at all hours, and did I mention fireworks?

[1:45:56] Well, some of these can be managed by calling them police. Most we cannot

[1:46:00] change. or we choose not to in the spirit of live and let live which is how

[1:46:05] I go about my life. I support the Young's proposal. All the

[1:46:10] concerns about how Little Compton will deal that as a practical matter that can

[1:46:13] be worked out. Perhaps volunteers such as myself to what to help with

[1:46:18] monitoring drawing plans of the site to show what they're trying to do etc.

[1:46:24] The alternative may at some not too distant point in the future be the

[1:46:28] collapse of the farms when there is no one in the family who can make sense out

[1:46:33] of being a farmer. Those holes in the landscape will be filled by more big

[1:46:39] houses with plenty of peace and quiet. Thank you.

[1:46:55] Good evening. Uh, my name is Rob Galford. I live at 35 Butts Rock Road,

[1:47:00] just a stones throw or a shout down from Swishing Stone Farm. As you may have

[1:47:05] seen included in the record, I wrote the letter that was published in the Zakon

[1:47:09] at times suggesting and saying that you don't really need to make that stark a

[1:47:13] choice between banning all such events on one hand and devol defaulting to

[1:47:18] parties run a mock on the other. Tonight in three minutes or less, I promise uh

[1:47:24] I'm here to offer a different focused perspective on how and why such items as

[1:47:28] the farm accessory ordinance and special use permits can and should indeed

[1:47:33] accommodate both these all these kinds of activities. In one of my earliest

[1:47:38] jobs in the hospitality industry, I worked for a specialty caterer at more

[1:47:44] than a 100 weddings, remote weddings and celebrations in parks, private gardens,

[1:47:49] estates, and farms. Exactly the kinds of setting that the youngs are proposing.

[1:47:55] It's a complicated business to run off-site events where everything, and I

[1:47:59] do mean everything, is brought in. An entire catering kitchen and everything

[1:48:03] that goes with it. and they can't forget a thing because here's the important

[1:48:07] part. Having those things ready on the site are not the business of a farm or a

[1:48:12] park or a garden. Their business is simply growing things for people to

[1:48:17] enjoy and to share it with with them in a place of their own. And the successful

[1:48:22] caterers and suppliers are masters at making it work with hosting locations in

[1:48:28] the single most important category, which is respecting the rules. These

[1:48:33] specialty caterers, such as the ones I've worked for, work closely with the

[1:48:38] host locations on adhering to rules about safety, parking, timing, lighting,

[1:48:43] and everything else. If a town says no music after 9:00 p.m., you can be sure

[1:48:49] that the band starts to play Last Dance or Don't Stop Believing at 8:47.

[1:48:55] They make they turn down cash bribes of $1,000 or more from fathers of the bride

[1:49:01] to keep the music going. And they never get those bribes accepted. They hire

[1:49:07] local people whenever possible. They pride themselves on preparing meals

[1:49:11] using ingredients grown right on that site. They work closely with the towns,

[1:49:16] police, and hosting locations and staying within the rules. And that's how

[1:49:20] they stay in business. That's why specialty event kinds of catering

[1:49:26] understands exactly what has to be done and to make this work. And hosting

[1:49:30] farms, however, hosting farms are in the business of growing things for the

[1:49:34] people to enjoy. And that's what they want to do. Their intention is not to be

[1:49:38] in the catering business, but to put their farming places in the best light.

[1:49:42] And they don't get rich from being a fake farm with a catering business.

[1:49:46] That's not what they want to do. They are real farms and there are very few of

[1:49:50] them left and we are very lucky in Little Compton to have places like

[1:49:54] Youngs and Wishing Stone and Small World in our midst where farming is what they

[1:49:59] do and they do what they can to support and continue that and limited event

[1:50:04] hosting 10 days perhaps out of 365 would be one of those things. So please let's

[1:50:11] not make it any harder for them than it already is. Thank you.

[1:50:28] Jane wear again. Um so I have a couple of things. Um

[1:50:36] this is my child. We are looking at generational farming. Um, and one of the

[1:50:43] things we want to do is looking at diversifying our farm in order to make

[1:50:50] the next generation be able to make it profitable.

[1:50:56] Um, [sighs and gasps] the other thing I would like to ask is what is a

[1:51:01] commercial wedding? Because one of the things that was put out on the postcard

[1:51:08] that was sent to everybody is that commercial weddings was going to be a

[1:51:14] thing. I don't understand what a commercial wedding is. In my opinion,

[1:51:19] weddings are personal. So, how do you make a wedding commercial? Um, and then

[1:51:27] I talked to somebody else and they were like, "Oh, well, if you're a wedding

[1:51:30] planner, it's a commercial wedding. You you do that for a living."

[1:51:37] Well, if you're only doing it for five or eight times out of the year,

[1:51:44] that's not a commercial wedding.

[1:51:48] Um, the other thing is

[1:51:53] if our farm, White Rock Farm, across from Peekom's greenhouse were to ask for

[1:52:02] a uh variance or a a permit to have one

[1:52:09] wedding, would that be a problem? If that's not a problem, then why is

[1:52:15] this why is Young's farm asking for a permit or or a problem? If you would let

[1:52:23] one farm have a wedding one time,

[1:52:29] why is it a problem to let this one Young's farm

[1:52:34] have five weddings in one year if they follow the rules that they've

[1:52:40] set out which they have set out that they would have off?

[1:52:45] » Miss Weir, I'm just going to ask you to wrap up your comments. We have three

[1:52:47] more people. We're almost there. So, >> okay. Thank you.

[1:53:02] » Um, good evening. I'm Cherry Bar and I live at 231 West Main Road. So, first

[1:53:09] I'd just like to thank everybody for coming here. Um it's a very sensitive

[1:53:16] subject and we do have differing viewpoints

[1:53:21] but this issue is creating hostility

[1:53:27] and I hope we can get beyond that. I mean I have to say when I go to Young's

[1:53:33] farm which I do almost daily I don't even go to the cash register. I just use

[1:53:38] the honesty box because this issue is getting way too personal. So, I did

[1:53:45] actually have a lot of comments. So, I know that we're very pressed for time.

[1:53:50] So, I just would like to say them very quickly. Um, the ALPC easement contains

[1:53:56] a pond and repairarian area which is near to the wedding venue and which is

[1:54:01] home to including not but not limited to deer, coyote, fox, barred owls, wild

[1:54:08] turkey, small animals, and multiple species of birds. The easement

[1:54:14] specifically states, "The premises has over 180 acres of land with splendid

[1:54:22] views. major habitat types common to the area, woodlands, agricultural fields, as

[1:54:30] well as repairing corridors and other natural areas.

[1:54:35] Has anybody requested that any kind of environmental study be performed to see

[1:54:40] what the impact of noise and lights are on the area and the the wildlife in this

[1:54:46] area? It seems to me that should be

[1:54:50] considered. Secondly, I'd like to speak to um

[1:54:55] some of the diagrams that I've seen in the licensing application

[1:55:03] uh entertainment licensing application. The Young submitted a diagram

[1:55:10] um which showed the activities fully within the easement area

[1:55:17] um in which they're allowed to have agricultural structures.

[1:55:21] In the current proposal, they show a completely different diagram. And I can

[1:55:27] assure you if that diagram were scaled, had layout areas, had property lines and

[1:55:34] easements, you would notice that the entire tent is is is beyond the

[1:55:41] agricultural area for structures. So I think that really somebody needs to look

[1:55:46] at this a little bit more carefully. Um

[1:55:51] I mean this kind of goes to another thing which I just really want to touch

[1:55:55] on. um because I know we're we're very short

[1:55:59] of time.

[1:56:03] All right. Well, I don't have my notes, so I'll just uh summarize it here. In

[1:56:09] the application um for the entertainment license

[1:56:15] um which was granted um

[1:56:21] farm to folk to farm farm to fork dinners was approved.

[1:56:26] This was completely inconsistent with what the zoning board said. They

[1:56:33] said farmtofork dinners are not allowed. In addition,

[1:56:40] the the application asks that a diagram be submitted that is scaled and includes

[1:56:49] measurements. And the answer from the Youngs on that

[1:56:53] was yes. The diagram had no scales. It had

[1:56:58] absolutely no dimensions. So

[1:57:02] where is the coordination between what one department says and

[1:57:08] what is being permitted? Why aren't you why are you approving

[1:57:16] applications which are actually incorrect and incompliant?

[1:57:22] That really raises a lot of red flags for me when we are talking about these

[1:57:28] much larger issues. And then I will just say one other

[1:57:33] thing. The cabbas are on the north side of my

[1:57:38] property. The dressers who also have a farm are on the west and the south side

[1:57:43] of my property. The peckhams are a tenth of a mile away. And the youngs are a

[1:57:48] tenth of a mile away. If each of these farms can have 10 weddings a year, that

[1:57:55] is 40 weddings a year. All of which are going to happen in the

[1:58:01] summer months. Is that right that I can't open my

[1:58:06] windows because there's amplified music for 40 nights of my summer?

[1:58:13] What does this do to my property value? I'm already thinking that when I sell my

[1:58:19] house, I'll have to say, "Hey, extra bonus, free music on Thursday, Fridays,

[1:58:25] Saturdays, and Sundays." So, I again I want to conclude this by saying I am

[1:58:32] totally in support of appropriately scaled farming and you know, revenue

[1:58:39] generating activities. I do not believe wedding venues fit within this or fit

[1:58:45] within the comprehensive plan. So be nice everybody.

[1:58:51] » Thank you. >> Thank you.

[1:58:55] » Well, I could have gotten a bigger class if you don't agree with what I said.

[1:59:06] » I met the ones that grant the permit to me.

[1:59:13] Hello. I'm gonna speak now. Uh my name is Alexandra Greenwood and I keep

[1:59:18] hearing tonight that we want to keep Little Compton little and quiet. And I

[1:59:23] think that if we don't support this proposal, it's going to be a ghost town.

[1:59:27] Um we need to shift with the times. We need to pivot. And I think everyone has

[1:59:31] been affected by the increasing cost of literally everything. You know, that

[1:59:38] might be getting a second job, having to be a stay-at-home mom because daycare is

[1:59:44] too freaking expensive. Um, we're all just trying to financially survive right

[1:59:49] now. And these financial pressures have touched farmers, especially the people

[1:59:53] who feed you. And no offense, Tyler and Carla, but this is like the least

[1:59:59] creative thing that you could do is being a wedding venue. But if it's going

[2:00:03] to keep you going and it's going to keep you, you know, the next generation

[2:00:07] farming, I'm all for it. I think that's incredible. They're not asking for

[2:00:12] [sighs] more than what, 10 events a year. Um, I

[2:00:17] don't think that the great horned owls are going to go away after 10 events a

[2:00:21] year. Um, I think we can all find it in our hearts to be flexible for our

[2:00:26] community and for our farmers. Thank you.

[2:00:30] » Thank you.

[2:00:37] Good evening. My name is Sarah Rich and our family home sits at 238 West Main

[2:00:42] Road, directly in front of the young family's barn and working areas. We've

[2:00:46] owned the property since 1989. I'm not speaking about this from a

[2:00:51] distance. I have personally heard music from farm weddings already held on the

[2:00:55] property, clearly from inside our home. At that time, I remember being excited

[2:01:00] knowing that it was Hadtie and Sarah's wedding and that they were celebrating a

[2:01:04] big milestone. I even remember a Venmo link being shared on Instagram so

[2:01:09] friends could chip in for a drink at their bachelorette parties. And of

[2:01:13] course, I did. My brother and I anticipate being future owners of this

[2:01:18] property. I live in the area year round today with a good chance that I'll live

[2:01:22] at this residence year round in the years ahead. The Rhode Island Supreme

[2:01:26] Court has already ruled on this. Commercial farm weddings held for a fee

[2:01:30] are not considered an agricultural use the way a dinner or a festival would be.

[2:01:35] That means this is a zoning question, not a farming one. And the comprehensive

[2:01:40] plan already speaks to it directly. Policy ED2.D

[2:01:44] Directs the town to regulate uses on farms that are not directly related to

[2:01:50] the agricultural operation or the principal use of the land. I'd ask this

[2:01:56] board to weigh this when you are making a recommendation to town council. I also

[2:02:01] don't believe weddings are easy to contain, especially at a scale of 175

[2:02:06] people. Based on what I've seen so far, I don't have full confidence that a 9:00

[2:02:11] cutoff will actually mean 9:00. What makes this farm able to operate

[2:02:16] under different rules than other farms, the Stonehouse or the Vineyard? They've

[2:02:20] been abiding by these rules for some time now. What starts as a 10 weddings a

[2:02:24] year could easily become 20, once something like this is approved, there's

[2:02:28] little standing in the way of the number growing. I'd ask that the board to

[2:02:33] consider that although tonight's hearing is only about the young family farm, a

[2:02:38] zoning change would apply to this far wouldn't apply to this farm alone. it

[2:02:42] would open the door to other farms across town to make the same request.

[2:02:48] It's also worth noting that the original 1996 conservation easement on this land

[2:02:53] explicitly restricted the property to agricultural use and prohibited

[2:02:58] commercial development. I grew up next door to the Young family. I remember

[2:03:02] when they moved in and I watched Emma, Hattie, and Sarah grow up. I've always

[2:03:07] made a point of buying my hanging basket, gardening needs, fruits, and

[2:03:10] vegetables from their farm to support them. This is exactly why it's so

[2:03:15] surprising that this proposal in progress since last fall was never once

[2:03:20] mentioned to us or to the other neighbors. And yet, the Youngs were able

[2:03:23] to launch a petition and have it shared across the entire community. Many people

[2:03:28] who signed it have told us they didn't fully understand what they were saying.

[2:03:32] It's telling that outreach outreach was possible when it served the proposable,

[2:03:37] but not when it came to informing the neighbors who'd actually be affected by

[2:03:41] it, who had supported them for so long. This board already did this work. On

[2:03:46] July 7th, by a vote of 5 to zero, you found that weddings do not conform with

[2:03:51] the comprehensive plan. You specifically warned that a special use permit becomes

[2:03:56] permanent and travels with the property. Meaning this decision binds every future

[2:04:00] owner of this land forever. Honestly, what's hardest for me isn't just the

[2:04:05] noise or the scale. It's the disappointment. This has stopped feeling

[2:04:09] like a decision made with farms, neighbors, and community in mind and

[2:04:14] started to feel like a decision made for the revenue at our expense. I support

[2:04:18] the youngs earning a living on this land. My first job was at Skit Paul's

[2:04:24] country stand. I was very close to Cole Walker and grew up with other farmers in

[2:04:29] this town. I want to see farms in this town find creative ways to stay viable

[2:04:34] through farm stands, farm-totable dinners, and other events that stay

[2:04:38] close to the land's agricultural roots, but not at the direct expense of

[2:04:42] neighbors closest to it.

[2:04:48] » Mr. Sher, I I would note that uh we had a 9:00 deadline, but it looks like

[2:04:53] there's only one more gentleman up here, and I would suggest that we just uh be a

[2:04:57] little loose with that 9:00 deadline. Excellent.

[2:05:02] » Yes. Thank you. It's a pleasure to be here in front of the board. My name is

[2:05:07] Henry Wright. I am president of the Rhode Island Farm Bureau. I had the

[2:05:12] pleasure of uh serving on the board of directors bureau with Tyler for years.

[2:05:18] Uh very dedicated farmer. Uh you people are extremely lucky to have a farm such

[2:05:26] as the Young's farm here in Little Compton. Uh Ty, a few years back, Tyler

[2:05:31] got an award for giving the most food to the food bank, donating the food to the

[2:05:37] food bank. He has always been community-minded.

[2:05:41] uh just excellent as my position as president of the Farm Bureau Rhode

[2:05:46] Island, part of the American Farm Bureau, which

[2:05:50] is largest Farm Bureau organization in the United States. I get to travel

[2:05:55] around a lot. Uh see what's wrong, what's right. uh very very difficult to

[2:06:03] continue to farm hold on to the land especially to pass it on to you people

[2:06:09] within the family. Uh this year as in other years I had an

[2:06:14] opportunity to visit farms that have wedding venues and every one of them

[2:06:21] said if it wasn't for the wedding venue we would no longer be able to farm. Uh

[2:06:27] it has been the bright spot in agriculture. Agurism is the only thing

[2:06:32] that's really keeping us going. Remember, we're only producing 3% of the

[2:06:38] food that we need here in Rhode Island. 3% is all we produce. If we lose that,

[2:06:45] you know, you see on the TV all the time, buy local. Where is local? Local

[2:06:50] is 500 miles from here. It's it's going to be difficult. Have we ever run into

[2:06:56] trouble with transportation? Three years. Uh I'm sorry. We only have

[2:07:02] three days of food in Rhode Island. After three days, we're out. Hurricane,

[2:07:09] snowstorm, bad roads, whatever. So, this is an opportunity perhaps for Little

[2:07:16] Compton to step forward and maybe do the right thing and show that they can do

[2:07:21] something for two years. Thank you. Thank you.

[2:07:26] » Thank you, Mr. Wright.

[2:07:34] Matters again. I'd like to thank you for allowing all these people to speak

[2:07:37] tonight. It was very enlightening to me because

[2:07:41] it's going to come in front of me with everything everybody said. So, thank

[2:07:45] very much. >> Well, thank you.

[2:07:53] » So, Uh Mr. Chair, as that concludes the the comments, uh no motions necessary on

[2:07:58] this because this was just a remand again to the planning board to hear uh

[2:08:03] the Youngs in accordance with the town council's order.

[2:08:07] » Thank you everyone. Uh we'll continue with our our planning board of business

[2:08:12] as I had mentioned earlier and and the next item for us our first item is the

[2:08:18] petition by Lesie Fox for some solar panels.

[2:08:28] » Sorry, but they don't.

[2:08:35] So, so you lastly that means we're back to the zoning.

[2:08:49] » Let's get Julie. >> Um, how many council here?

[2:08:56] » Excuse me. >> Excuse me. We're holding a planning

[2:09:00] board meeting. If you could exit quietly, please, you can have your

[2:09:04] conversations outside. We'd appreciate that.

[2:09:10] » Oh, really? Hi.

[2:09:14] » Yes, that's what I'm trying to do right now is trying to

[2:09:20] » trying to get everything back up here.

[2:09:31] fire away.

[2:09:38] » Yes. >> And he's going to make it or just run

[2:09:42] through the you slides.

[2:09:46] » Right. I think the most important thing.

[2:09:59] » Where's S when you need it? >> Do we have the packet for this one?

[2:10:03] » Yeah, I do. I label it number two.

[2:10:06] » Oh, you're smart. Let's do this. >> Give Tyler Dang.

[2:10:10] » I have spread out got important solar things. It's, you

[2:10:15] know, I don't like what they've done here.

[2:10:18] » It took me a while. >> Can anyone hear me? Uh, we we have to

[2:10:22] conduct the rest of the business for the planning board. So, if you want to

[2:10:25] continue talking to one another, could you go out in the foyer, please? Thank

[2:10:28] you.

[2:10:34] Not you, Marsha.

[2:10:46] Yeah, where the start of the races right across the street.

[2:10:55] » Um,

[2:11:00] » which ones? >> Well, that shows your house, right?

[2:11:05] » I've got the two photos. I've got the survey plan.

[2:11:09] take a photo of the court. I mean they like the little flag in the drive

[2:11:15] » myself different

[2:11:18] » different

[2:11:22] I don't like this yet.

[2:11:26] So the the ordinance asks you to come for a special

[2:11:32] use permit when you want to put solar in Pikes Peak area

[2:11:37] » and so that is >> Mike we can't hear you

[2:11:42] » the the ordinance uh on on solar >> just turn me off. Oh, go ahead.

[2:11:50] » The the ordinance is is so that the from the visibility standpoint of solar

[2:11:55] panels within the Pikes Peak area and does it affect the the view of the

[2:12:02] quality of the town. So that's why the pictures of your house

[2:12:07] » Yes. >> and where the panels will be and are

[2:12:10] they visible to the the general public. >> Correct. is is probably the first and

[2:12:17] most important question uh with regard to your solar application.

[2:12:24] » Okay. I don't know. Do you have the plans?

[2:12:29] » Yes, we do. We do have we do have your plan.

[2:12:31] » Oh, yeah. They got they got copies of everything that you gave me. So,

[2:12:35] » thank you. So, I'm Lesie Fox. I live at 14 Commons and I have a application for

[2:12:41] a permit for solar panels which would go on the south roof which you cannot see

[2:12:48] from the street. Uh 10 panels 10 or 12 I can't remember 10 or 12 would

[2:12:55] go on the south roof. The north roof faces the street. No panels on the north

[2:13:02] side obviously. and two panels would go on the west

[2:13:08] roof, which is where that arrow is pointing to. So, if if you stood exactly

[2:13:15] where this photo was taken, you would be able to see

[2:13:21] uh a pan, at least one uh of the solar panels, but otherwise not visible from

[2:13:27] the street at all. >> The panel with air was

[2:13:34] You couldn't see anything else.

[2:13:38] » To the south. >> Yeah. Can't see anything. Yeah. Okay.

[2:13:45] All right. >> Should I go on or

[2:13:49] » the the solar application is for the use of

[2:13:54] your property? >> Yes.

[2:13:57] » I don't know. They call that net zero or or whatever. So, it's not not a solar

[2:14:02] installation where you're selling it to uh Rhode Island Energy.

[2:14:08] » I would It's a reciprocal, what do you call it?

[2:14:13] » So, it's it's called net metering. I I'm Thomas Campbell. I work for Beacon

[2:14:19] Solar. Um so, what it's referred to as net metering. Um, so basically

[2:14:25] she's not selling any of the electricity.

[2:14:28] » Whatever she produces, her electrical panel will draw

[2:14:33] » and then if there's any excess, the meter that Rhode Island Energy

[2:14:39] installs or whoever the local company is over here,

[2:14:42] » um, >> tracks that and just keeps the data for

[2:14:47] her use. >> So it it banks that energy sort of. Yes.

[2:14:51] for her for her future use. >> Yes. But it's not be sold or

[2:14:56] » the solar installation is for the use of the residents and their consumption.

[2:15:01] » Yes. The sole use of her res. >> And the main reason why I wanted to get

[2:15:06] solar is to um have a power backup. I was without electricity for 24 hours

[2:15:15] last February and it was pretty brutal in the cold. I don't want to buy a noisy

[2:15:21] generator. So, I'd much prefer to >> So, this has a clean.

[2:15:25] » This has a bank of batteries as well. >> Yes.

[2:15:29] It'll have a >> Yes. Yes. If you look on the plan set,

[2:15:33] it kind of shows it. It's the Franklin Agate and the battery disconnect and the

[2:15:38] uh Franklin A power 15 kilowatt hour. That's what the battery is. Yeah.

[2:15:43] » Right there. So, all right. >> That's pretty good. Yep.

[2:15:51] No. Carter, you Mary, you okay with Yep.

[2:15:56] » Yep. >> Yep. Yep.

[2:16:00] » Anybody want to make a motion to uh

[2:16:06] communicate to the zoning board that this uh

[2:16:09] » with the comp plan? Yeah, I uh I'll make a motion that this uh application

[2:16:15] uh adheres to the comprehensive plan and uh and uh will provide for

[2:16:23] » um the clean energy the the type of energy that we're looking for in the

[2:16:27] town and also uh takes uh the our ordinance in the uh in that area into

[2:16:34] consideration. >> Second.

[2:16:38] » All those in favor? Hi. >> Hi.

[2:16:41] » Terrific. >> Thank you everyone.

[2:16:43] » You're very welcome. It >> was a long

[2:16:45] Well, it was a little a little flag. Don't do anything flag.

[2:16:50] » No, the flags are staying. >> We Okay.

[2:16:56] » Well, no. I think we have one more. >> Yes.

[2:17:00] We're going to come up to the 15 minute point on that. Do we just move to

[2:17:04] elections? >> Yeah.

[2:17:09] Um and please

[2:17:13] can we extend the we

[2:17:18] » why don't we do elections and then extend. See

[2:17:20] » I think you you've got to extend now. >> Yeah. Do both.

[2:17:24] » We can do both. >> Yeah.

[2:17:26] » Um Marian Carter, what were uh conversation think about extending the

[2:17:33] meeting so we can do this? We're we were at 14 after

[2:17:39] » Yeah, we're running close. >> We I'm fine with continuing.

[2:17:43] » Yes, >> everybody. Okay. So, make that motion.

[2:17:47] » Yeah, I'll make a motion that we accept the meeting

[2:17:49] » till 10. >> Okay. Well, we don't have to go that

[2:17:52] till we're done >> until we're done.

[2:17:54] » Continue the meeting. That's first. Anyway, how about 12? And who second?

[2:17:58] » All right. Um second, second. Thank you, Carter.

[2:18:04] » All those are in favor. We weed within favor.

[2:18:08] » Okay. Uh the the um the next uh petition is is um

[2:18:17] on behalf of the closest >> I miss our small room. I can't hear you.

[2:18:21] I'm not sure whether it's a variance or whatever. Yes,

[2:18:24] » we cannot hear you down here. >> Speak to the microphone so we can hear

[2:18:29] you. >> Okay. I'm not used to this giant venue.

[2:18:33] » We're we're >> Thank you.

[2:18:36] » Okay. Yeah, we're we're we're moving on to the next petition

[2:18:39] » for the the closest. >> I I can help explain this if nothing

[2:18:45] else.

[2:18:49] » I know you said, >> right?

[2:18:53] » Just for this one thing and then you then you're free to go. Thank you.

[2:18:57] » Thank you. Very briefly, hopefully. Yes, briefly.

[2:19:01] Uh, Court Chappelle on behalf of George and Mallerie Close. This is 71 Warren

[2:19:06] Point Road. It is just a single mic. >> Yeah, it's just a single family home. It

[2:19:12] has no basement and no garage and it has a structure on it now that according to

[2:19:17] the town is a 10x12 cottage. It more like a 10x12 shed. And off of that shed

[2:19:24] there was a permitted outdoor shower. Now, whether that's a fence or whether

[2:19:30] it's a structure is an interesting point, but long story short, uh your

[2:19:35] zoning ordinance has a provision that if you have a pre-existing building that's

[2:19:41] too close to a property line and you file for a demolition permit, you can

[2:19:46] ask to rebuild it and they can move it. Uh but you can without getting a

[2:19:52] variance. The issue with the and I don't want to

[2:19:57] get caught up in it here, but the issue with the zoning board is one of the

[2:20:00] criterias that you can do that is that the increase is not more than 50%. And

[2:20:05] if you have the 10 by 12 building alone and this building goes 16 to 20, well

[2:20:11] that's more than 50%. But back when the shower got permitted, that was an

[2:20:15] enclosure that's 5t by 14t and then the generator was it was enclosed.

[2:20:23] It's not just a fence. It's a fence. This area meets the building on all

[2:20:28] three sides. It in some cases by the shower has a floor under the generator

[2:20:34] doesn't have a floor. So it would be less than a 50% increase if you looked

[2:20:40] at the current footprint of the building. And I think Julie has some of

[2:20:44] the pictures and you can see it. But that isn't really for here. What I'm

[2:20:47] saying to you is a home that is a single family residence that fits in your

[2:20:53] comprehensive plan as a single family residence has an existing structure that

[2:20:58] straddles and goes onto the neighbor's property. It's a foot and a half onto

[2:21:03] the egg trust easement. We're raising that and moving it as far as we can and

[2:21:10] as close to the house as we can to put in this small 16 by 20 studio that and

[2:21:18] part of the w part of the width is a stairway so that there's storage in the

[2:21:22] basement. Uh you can't even get to the basement from the inside a separate door

[2:21:26] that goes down. So, it'll have some storage underneath that the house is

[2:21:30] desperate to to add some storage to and a small uh building for a studio and

[2:21:36] fitness room for uh Mr. Close and his wife.

[2:21:42] I would argue it's more fitting with the comprehensive plan because you're taking

[2:21:46] a building that has not only a zero lot line but a negative 1 1/2 ft trespassing

[2:21:52] lot line onto the neighbor's property pre-existing from these owners and

[2:21:58] you're moving it 7 ft away. If they say it is 50% or less, it's just

[2:22:06] a special use permit and we'll argue that at the zoning board. If they say

[2:22:10] it's a variance, then we still think it uh fits with the comp plan because it's

[2:22:15] not getting any closer to where it is now. The current building is 41 ft from

[2:22:20] the road where 50 ft is required under your ordinance, but that's just the

[2:22:26] distance of the current structure. If you say the generator, which is 5T

[2:22:32] closer, then it's 37 ft, I believe. And we're not moving anything closer. It's

[2:22:38] just straight sideways moving it closer to the house, moving it away from the

[2:22:42] property line. >> So if if if I can um

[2:22:46] » back to the chase, maybe the the on the north side of the property, there's a

[2:22:52] small shed that you've on your plan. Is that going

[2:22:57] away? >> On the north side? No.

[2:23:00] » No. So the the little shed just past your driveway where you park, that

[2:23:06] stays. next to us >> and and

[2:23:09] » sorry George post >> and so the the the the structure that's

[2:23:15] going to get demoed is the existing one that in fact encroaches on the property

[2:23:21] line on the south side of the property. >> Correct.

[2:23:25] » And you're you're going to you want to consolidate that

[2:23:28] » want to consolidate that with the existing shower generator

[2:23:32] » with one new building. >> Correct.

[2:23:34] » And push it over. Yes. So you're you're um

[2:23:39] you're asking to be able to take down that building, put up a new building and

[2:23:44] that >> right

[2:23:45] » is better conform more is in more in conformance with zoning than the current

[2:23:50] situation. That is correct. >> Property too. The other one is off the

[2:23:53] property >> and well that could be and again it's a

[2:23:57] special use permit. If you look at the size of it as a whole, it is less than a

[2:24:03] 50% increase. >> But that our concern is does it con

[2:24:07] comport with the comp plan. >> It's still more conforming still

[2:24:11] residential >> is makes the property more in

[2:24:14] conformance. >> That is correct.

[2:24:16] » And a new better structure built to code.

[2:24:19] » That's absolutely true. whether the zoning want board wants you to do it one

[2:24:23] way or the other doesn't affect the the the

[2:24:29] effect or it doesn't >> I agree I just background but

[2:24:32] » um how does everybody >> I don't have

[2:24:35] » they think it's a good idea or okay with it

[2:24:38] » Mike I have >> pardon

[2:24:41] » uh what um >> in the mic

[2:24:44] » oh in mic sorry um is there something you have to do to comply with CRMC See,

[2:24:50] seeing it's within the uh 200 foot jurisdictional area,

[2:24:57] » I think when they anything that we do, we'd have to go through them. We believe

[2:25:03] it's either not going to need them or what we call a minimum of impact, but

[2:25:08] » what we call a minimal impact petition, which is kind of an administrative

[2:25:12] petition where they say, "Hey, that was there before. It's okay now." But the

[2:25:16] zoning board or the town never waves that if it's uh if the building

[2:25:21] inspector requires that we go and get the coastal permit. We they require town

[2:25:27] first. I can't go to coastal and say the town might do it. So can will you they

[2:25:32] only opine on things after I get a letter from the building inspector says

[2:25:37] that according to the planning board and the zoning board and the building

[2:25:39] inspector you could do this. So yes we will we may have to that that line I

[2:25:45] understand has shifted. Yeah, there was a it was just redrawn that say that 200

[2:25:51] foot jurisdiction is set back is as of last when it was drawn I think uh

[2:25:58] a year ago right so >> so and if you can see it's right on it

[2:26:03] » well I don't think it's going to be worse

[2:26:09] even even considering that she don't you

[2:26:13] agree that it's it's it's improvement

[2:26:17] because it's it is where it is and it's going to be where it is.

[2:26:24] Yeah. Okay.

[2:26:29] And the irony is moving in 5t to get out of that is closer to the street which is

[2:26:34] a zoning. Okay.

[2:26:40] » Yeah. I'll make a motion that we accept this plan as provided and uh make a

[2:26:45] recommendation that it is uh in conformance more in conformance to the

[2:26:50] comprehensive plan uh in the plan than as as it exists now.

[2:26:57] » Is there a second to that? >> Second.

[2:27:05] » Second. >> Second. All those in favor?

[2:27:08] » I >> I Excellent.

[2:27:10] » I wish to be recorded as having recused myself from the vote due to my service

[2:27:14] on the Little Compton Agricultural Conservancy Trust which has a easement

[2:27:19] abuing the property. >> Thank you everyone. Enjoy your evening.

[2:27:23] » Thanks. >> Thank you

[2:27:24] » again. >> All right. Um

[2:27:30] offices. >> No, I think the next thing is

[2:27:32] » Tracy, you're all good to go. Thank you. Thank you.

[2:27:38] » Thank you. >> So our next uh item of business is the

[2:27:43] um minutes from July 7th resitions, corrections.

[2:27:50] » Mr. No amendments for the move that becept

[2:27:55] prepared. >> Seconded.

[2:27:57] » All those in favor? I. >> Any opposed? No. Okay. And the um

[2:28:11] I think that request for extension >> where is that handled with?

[2:28:16] » Well, we're going to the the extension can be handled administratively.

[2:28:21] » So, we don't need to do the the request for the SBA extension. I

[2:28:27] can I can do administratively. We don't have to with our new laws.

[2:28:36] So, sorry to make you uh hang out for >> Pardon.

[2:28:44] » Okay. Um and the the uh

[2:28:51] Donnie, I I don't think we can give you justice tonight on

[2:28:55] uh >> want

[2:28:57] we're passed. We need to do our officers and

[2:29:01] » we might still make it if we don't. >> All right.

[2:29:05] » It's only I mean we'll go to 10. >> I

[2:29:10] got a date in the morning though. >> Pardon?

[2:29:13] » Thanks again Tracy. >> Yeah. Let's get it done.

[2:29:18] » What are we doing? >> Let's do the election of officers.

[2:29:21] » Okay. >> Okay.

[2:29:22] » Okay. Uh if we do that, we should switch uh

[2:29:26] we should have a vote to move that up in the agenda.

[2:29:29] » Let I I uh I make a motion that we move the offic's uh uh item uh

[2:29:37] » the agenda to the next item. >> All right.

[2:29:42] » Second.

[2:29:45] » All right. Second. >> Okay.

[2:29:47] » Okay. >> Okay. Wait a minute. Just moving.

[2:29:49] » Who s you made the motion? Mayor, you second. Thank you.

[2:29:56] » All in favor? >> All those are in favor?

[2:29:58] » I >> I

[2:30:03] » All right. >> All right.

[2:30:04] » We ready? >> All right.

[2:30:07] » I'll make a I'll I I'll nominate for president,

[2:30:11] » Vice Chairman. Chairman and vice chairman. uh chairman first

[2:30:19] Carter Wilkkey, vice chairman Mike Steers and

[2:30:25] administrative officer for them to share both to share that

[2:30:31] position. So if one has to recluse himself, the other would be present

[2:30:38] » and Carter will do a trust.

[2:30:42] » Mary, >> what second?

[2:30:45] I think uh Mike Chucker amendment was that I take Mike's position as the

[2:30:50] planning board's design agricultural.

[2:30:55] » You want to add that to it? >> Yep. Just add that to it.

[2:30:58] » So that that motion's been amended. Is the second uh in conformance with that

[2:31:02] amendment? >> Yes.

[2:31:05] » Yeah. All those in favor? I

[2:31:09] » Great. >> All right. Okay. All right. Now, now

[2:31:13] Donnie, now we got to move. >> Come on. We got to get done.

[2:31:16] » Got to talk fast. It's not your not your your trait, you know.

[2:31:22] » Super quiet. >> I had to talk him into it. Hurry up.

[2:31:25] » Really, it just hinges on a on a question as to how the board wants this

[2:31:30] to be filed. U, it's a it's a concept plan. Um, you know, basically it's an

[2:31:36] administrative subdivision that follows the

[2:31:40] » uh format or the end result of a one-time only subdivision. As we know,

[2:31:44] the one time only requires a variance for the for the back lot having

[2:31:49] frontage. And so we, as I said in the cover letter, we believe that we um need

[2:31:55] unified development review um to get a frontage variance for the rear lot to do

[2:32:01] this. I just before we file a formal application, we just wanted to make sure

[2:32:06] that uh we understood >> direction from the board on how to the

[2:32:10] proper way to proceed with this. >> So,

[2:32:14] we did an administrative subdivision on this a while ago, right? To take the

[2:32:18] property line out of the building. >> That That's correct. Did the property

[2:32:22] was owned by the Teachman estate. The north lot had the existing house number

[2:32:27] 44. Um and the south lot was vacant. um at two long narrow lots each one acre in

[2:32:34] size, basically the same shape, same amount of road frontage, same width

[2:32:39] going down to the back. Um but the lot line of the vacant lot went through just

[2:32:44] clipped the corner of the existing house.

[2:32:46] » So So now you're you're right now there are two dwellings on

[2:32:52] this property. Is that right? >> No, it's two separate properties.

[2:32:55] » Two separate properties. >> Yep.

[2:32:57] » And how many how many dwellings are there? There's one dwelling on each

[2:33:01] front on each property. That's correct. >> So you're you're you're you want to move

[2:33:06] the property line. >> That's correct.

[2:33:08] » Right. >> That uh instead of it being horizontal,

[2:33:13] you want to slice it vertically in the middle.

[2:33:17] » That's correct. >> Which then causes you to make the access

[2:33:21] by easement. >> That's correct.

[2:33:24] » Why? It would seem to me you you could make this administrative change, but

[2:33:31] keep let the house >> in the back, if you will, have access to

[2:33:36] the road on and own that access. >> Well, we we could, but what we're trying

[2:33:42] to do is keep the lot areas equal. Um what happens is if you take that area

[2:33:48] for the driveway and incorporate it into the rear lot that you you have to make

[2:33:54] the front lot bigger to accomplish that. >> Right? So if you move the line the

[2:33:58] septic system line to the right then then the the house to the south or the

[2:34:06] » compensate by moving the line near the septic system

[2:34:09] » then they can own their their their right of way to their house

[2:34:14] » instead of and instead of having it by easement.

[2:34:17] » Well >> that's correct but but just kind of

[2:34:22] concept discussion. >> Yeah. So the with the concept

[2:34:24] discussions, our our advice always is we don't want to we just want to say

[2:34:28] whether these ideas are good or bad. We don't want to give the applicant the

[2:34:33] plan that we want because then what happens and I know Don wouldn't do this

[2:34:39] to us but >> yes he would.

[2:34:40] » We don't want them to come back later and say oh no you said

[2:34:43] » you told me to do it this way. Yeah. Okay.

[2:34:45] » Right. No, I'm just suggesting that in we've done two lot one time only and you

[2:34:52] could do the access by easement as opposed to owning the right of way. The

[2:34:57] the it's been favored or thought that if the land owner can own his access,

[2:35:04] that's a preferable position. If that doesn't work the way you want to slice

[2:35:08] it. >> Yeah. that I mean my my thought is

[2:35:12] there's two options there and they're options right one way or the other you

[2:35:17] know that there's I think there's benefits to to both options depending on

[2:35:22] where you're looking where you're coming from

[2:35:24] » and it's just >> I do know now

[2:35:26] » the both houses the set back to both houses to the property line is about 12

[2:35:31] feet so this basically makes the two lots much better shaped and more

[2:35:36] functional in terms of yard area and privacy and whatnot

[2:35:41] So I think we're back to the to the crux of the question

[2:35:45] » and how is he? Yeah. Any >> All right. So what were you were you

[2:35:51] wanted to know what kind [clears throat] of

[2:35:54] » So I the the the I just wanted to make sure um

[2:36:00] » to the degree that you can. I just wanted to introduce this before I file

[2:36:04] formally to do it. Um, but I believe this would be um this is an

[2:36:09] administrative sub as presented. It's an administrative subdivision. Um, that

[2:36:14] follows the format of a one-time only and we know the one time only requires a

[2:36:19] frontage variance for the rear lot to not have frontage, which

[2:36:23] » we're not creating a new lot, right? >> But we're adjusting lot lines,

[2:36:27] » which is just an administrative subdivision.

[2:36:30] » Well, so we're taking a lot that has frontage and we're rendering it with no

[2:36:33] frontage. So, so, so Don's right here. The issue is you could do an

[2:36:38] administrative subdivision if there are no uh incursions onto the setbacks. So,

[2:36:45] imagine let's say um the problem here is there's an incursion into the setback,

[2:36:52] the frontage setback. So, it's Yeah. So let's say if it was a, you know, a line

[2:36:57] right down the middle of the lot and you know we have to have 175 feet on each

[2:37:05] for each lot. Right. So what if we say it's down the line then we move it even

[2:37:11] more so that there's only 100 foot of of frontage. Right. Right. We would require

[2:37:16] a variance in that case. Yeah. Now, this is a little bit different because we're

[2:37:21] flipping the W line, but we're still uh basically making it so that there is a

[2:37:27] um an incursion into that frontage. Don, is that am I explaining that?

[2:37:32] » Well, less conforming, >> right? So, you're you're making it less

[2:37:35] conforming. >> So, so I think what Don's asking is

[2:37:39] whether he needs a variance here. And I guess the question is whether you go to

[2:37:43] the zoning board to get the variance or do you apply to um univ development

[2:37:48] review because we have an administrative subdivision right here too.

[2:37:51] » So I guess it's a question of whether you guys want to see this or you want to

[2:37:54] hand it off to the zoning board. >> Well the the um he wants to change the

[2:38:01] current lot configuration. >> Yes.

[2:38:04] » Zoning board can't do that. Right. >> Correct. So a unified development is

[2:38:08] whenever it's the variance is attached to a subdivision.

[2:38:12] » Yeah. >> So

[2:38:13] » it has to be. >> So that

[2:38:18] that's the the the decision here.

[2:38:21] » So then therefore because the variance requires unified review it then rises to

[2:38:26] a minor subdivision. Correct. I just want

[2:38:30] » in order to do the the >> an admin will well an administrative

[2:38:33] subdivision that requires relief automatically rises to a minor.

[2:38:38] » Okay, that's correct. >> So I I just that's why I'm here. I just

[2:38:42] wanted to make sure I understood how how this

[2:38:44] » I'm glad you're here because now we understand it too.

[2:38:47] » Awkward to treat it as an admin that you know is going to have public hearing.

[2:38:52] » Say again. >> It's gonna it' be awkward to treat it as

[2:38:54] an admin that admin subdivision that's going to have a public hearing. So,

[2:38:58] » it's better to call it a minor anyways, I guess. Right. Is that what you're

[2:39:01] saying? >> Yeah.

[2:39:02] » You got to come >> both. Yeah.

[2:39:04] » Yeah. You got to >> Okay. Thank you. I appreciate you saying

[2:39:09] to save your time. >> Yes.

[2:39:13] » We agreed. >> I think we did. Is there something else

[2:39:16] you want to have a motion for? >> No.

[2:39:18] » What? >> I say something.

[2:39:20] » Oh, good. >> Thank Julie.

[2:39:23] » Yes. >> What? She's coming back next month. She

[2:39:29] can't leave. She can't leave. He may listen very

[2:39:34] loud. >> You're welcome.

[2:39:37] » Ah, Julie, Julie, Julie, Jolie, Julie. I'll make a motion we

[2:39:45] adjourn.

[2:39:54] » No. Bye.

[2:40:03] » So, what's your report? >> Thank you. Thank you.

[2:40:07] » So, when you say we can do this administratively, you know, what does

[2:40:11] that mean? We need an extension. That's right. So I

September 1, 2026 - Little Compton Planning Board Meeting

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