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[0:00]
It is 4:30
of the department of human services
[0:04]
Wednesday August 5th 2026.
This mean all other meetings of this
[0:10]
committee are open to the public. Proper
notes have been posted given to the
[0:13]
media and queries were sent from statute
so the citizens may be aware of and
[0:17]
place an agenda of this meeting. Uh roll
call shows that we have sufficient
[0:23]
numbers for a quorum. Correct?
>> Correct.
[0:27]
» All righty. review and approve the
agenda as handed out.
[0:34]
» I move to
>> that too. [laughter]
[0:40]
» Motion made and second to approve the
agenda.
[0:45]
» Just the sound of my name.
>> Oh,
[0:51]
there's a bar. We got to change that.
>> Yeah,
[0:54]
» we'll get the name right.
>> It's all right.
[0:57]
» Venturing. that right. Um the motion
made second to approve the agenda handed
[1:03]
out with the um correction of name
spelling. Any further discussion on the
[1:08]
matter? All in favor say I.
>> I.
[1:11]
» Any contrary? So move. We have the
minutes of the previous meeting July 1st
[1:16]
of 2026. Any additions or corrections
that we may have on that?
[1:23]
» Not a motion to approve the uh minutes.
So I'll second
[1:28]
» motion made senator to approve the
minutes of July 1st 2026. Any further
[1:32]
discussion at all? All in favor say I.
>> Any contrary? So move
[1:39]
for public comment.
I think we have anything
[1:44]
for comments today. It will be
apparently u Mary gave me a thing here
[1:53]
that talks about individual will be
given five minutes present their
[1:57]
information and such if they have public
comment on this sort of thing um
[2:03]
certainly make us aware if five minutes
seems wrong on that or something and a
[2:08]
maximum of 15 minutes is what they have
suggested here so um that's what I will
[2:15]
go ahead and work with at at other
meetings. Um
[2:20]
this is something we you live and Mary
right that we had as part of your
[2:25]
» in my time here I don't recall that
we've had public comment but this is
[2:29]
what is in
items that we have for
[2:34]
» okay if anyone does have any
next meeting actually change it whatever
[2:46]
think we're aware that we have that Um,
next we have program presentation,
[2:51]
behavioral health wraparound treatment
services.
[2:55]
Mary, you want to introduce our H
everything with that?
[3:00]
» I I will let Kim
>> Kim get
[3:04]
[laughter]
the manager of the uh wraparound
[3:08]
behavioral health division wraparound
treatment services which she'll go into
[3:12]
like what that means.
>> Hi.
[3:16]
Um so last thing
I'm in the other half of the so um I
[3:25]
supervised our two wraparound programs
they are comprehensive community
[3:29]
services and community support program a
lot of similarities and also a lot of
[3:34]
differences so I made some lovely
handouts for all of you um so we'll
[3:39]
start with
let's start with CCS first.
[3:52]
So I talked about this all day every
other day and I probably talked fast. So
[3:56]
please stop me as a question. Oh,
thanks. Um but really in a nutshell,
[4:02]
right? Um starting with CCS. So round
program rehabilitative in nature. So CCS
[4:09]
serves people all throughout the
lifespan. So kids through adults um and
[4:14]
really families. So like if a child is
in our program, we really see the family
[4:19]
as the client. So serving the individual
and really all the people in their
[4:24]
family or kind of around them, their
supports. Um so like I was saying it's
[4:28]
rehabilitative in nature meaning they're
you know coming in for mental health um
[4:35]
concerns anxiety attachment trauma um
disruptive behaviors those types of
[4:41]
things and average length of stay um in
the program definitely varies um
[4:46]
probably like one and a half to two. So
get in, get the skills, get out, like
[4:52]
get on your way,
[4:56]
right? So that's kind of uh that's
that's important there.
[5:02]
Um CS is really consumer driven. So
consumers pick their own goals. So we'll
[5:08]
have kids whereas, well, I don't want to
get angry anymore. Okay, yep, hear you.
[5:13]
And so then um
um case manager will work with that
[5:18]
person to okay well what does that look
like right what are some realistic goals
[5:21]
okay we want to work on coping skills or
you know finding some healthy hobbies
[5:25]
things like that but really taking the
consumer's words and building from there
[5:28]
we find that really empowers people
seveny olds in the program where it's
[5:34]
like yeah I get to choose the goals
right and they get to choose their
[5:37]
providers as well so within the CCS
program um there's different providers
[5:42]
So there's always a therapist on the
team um and they can provide individual
[5:47]
and family therapy and then there's um
let's say a mentor um type person. So
[5:54]
they um different skills. So they can
teach daily living skills, maybe anger
[5:58]
management skills, uh skills to manage
anxiety, social skills, um all of those
[6:04]
things. And so um the the consumer gets
to then choose um from a pool of
[6:12]
providers and let's say it's you know
what it's not it's not working very well
[6:17]
right like the relationship just didn't
match then we can go back to the pool
[6:21]
and choose something new. So it really
does focus on what do they need to
[6:25]
summing
on their strengths.
[6:30]
That is it in a nutshell. Again, there's
more information on this as far as
[6:34]
requirements and things like that, but
[6:38]
any questions before I move on to the
next one?
[6:42]
» Strictly MA type program.
>> Yeah. So, everyone in the program has to
[6:47]
have MA. Um, that being said, so for
children, there are state programs that
[6:53]
can help them get MA if they don't have
them. And that's important because I
[6:56]
think some people outside of the county,
you don't know that. And so if a child
[6:59]
does not have MA feel free to refer
anyway because we can work with the
[7:03]
states of
[7:07]
» how much of an outreach you have for
that you know I look at these programs
[7:11]
is very important and how much are we
able to I'll use the word since you said
[7:18]
consumers uh how much are we doing to
market it we're getting it out there so
[7:23]
that people are aware of
>> well here's an I I love that question.
[7:27]
Here's what I'm going to do. I'm going
to jump to my last handout because
[7:32]
um we have so many um relationships
formal and informal within the
[7:37]
community. And so that's a big way that
we quote unquote market I would say. Um
[7:43]
so coming around you'll see um a whole
list of different team relationships
[7:49]
that both represent have. There are
contracted providers at the top so they
[7:53]
are specially trained to provide CCS
services. Um, then we have our internal
[7:58]
DHS programs. And I know that you all
know the internal DHS programs, but I
[8:02]
wanted to list them out so that you knew
that you know which ones that the
[8:05]
referum program specifically interact
with daily. So, ADRC, right, is one of
[8:10]
our big connection points as well. And
then it's a very extensive list and I'm
[8:15]
sure there's more in forgetting, but um,
of different community partners. Yeah.
[8:19]
So there's schools on there, there's
food pantries on there, you know,
[8:24]
housing authority. Um, and we get also a
lot of hospitals,
[8:35]
» you guys.
[8:39]
» Yeah. So actually we get a lot from Yep.
I get and and that's more for um our
[8:45]
community support which we'll talk about
next but we have some people in CPS that
[8:49]
use man organization we get referrals
from the organization
[8:54]
um so for you guys probably already know
this but right they need to go through
[8:58]
the count to get on managed care
organization and then they sometimes
[9:03]
will then back and reach out to us
saying hey I work with this person they
[9:08]
can relate you with rep service because
with both rep wrap around services. The
[9:13]
goal is to remain in their community of
fortune. a really big deal when we look
[9:17]
at you like say 20 30 years ago but Alan
probably you know 40 50 years ago right
[9:24]
like a lot of these individuals would be
in out of home placement in hospitals in
[9:29]
group homes and so repar programs do a
lot um to really keep them in their home
[9:37]
right seeing this list it's really like
a testament right because all especially
[9:41]
the community partners that last list
right there you know We connect people
[9:46]
to them, but then people can ask them on
their own, but sometimes you don't know
[9:51]
about them, right? Like even because I
had asked my staff to help with this
[9:55]
list, there were some that I even forgot
about. So, I think it's just good to um
[10:00]
to know all of the community resources
so that you can feel, you know,
[10:04]
connected.
>> And follow up on that question is how
[10:09]
are we connecting with these community
partners? We do the meet groups of them
[10:15]
at once, twice a year, something that
goes out to them.
[10:21]
I don't want to say a newsletter, but
something similar that kind of makes
[10:24]
them aware of things to help remind them
of that. I kind of wish we had doctor
[10:28]
here today because certainly has
mentioned many times about resources
[10:34]
that that she needs and her colleagues
need in order to refer because they see
[10:38]
these families and everything. Um but
that so the question that marketing part
[10:44]
of it sure that we're we're catching
earlier than later one thing. Um the
[10:50]
other question I have too and this
because we're talking budget here and
[10:54]
everything on that MA program is there
any additional taxing monies that have
[11:01]
to go into this or is the MA pretty well
cover it
[11:04]
» for CCS is 100%
>> 100% reimbursement. and it is covering
[11:09]
the overall cost in there. So it's
basically spread out to the state all of
[11:13]
us as a nation as it were in provide
these services. That's very important
[11:18]
for us to know because when push comes a
shove and we do have six supervisors up
[11:24]
to county number 27 and uh it's
important for us to be able to form our
[11:30]
fellow supervisors that something like
this program
[11:39]
don't want to touch
those programs alone
[11:44]
» you think so yeah little budget side.
Okay. The CSP.
[11:49]
» Um well, I just want to get back to your
question about marketing, right? Because
[11:52]
so we do with um the majority of the
school listed on here. So we meet with
[11:58]
them monthly um New London we're
starting monthly. I know Wy
[12:05]
and then we've also been invited to
different
[12:08]
um I know two years ago now um I
presented at Theta Care. they had asked
[12:15]
me to come present. So I did that.
>> Y
[12:18]
» um so and and to right like there's just
different relationships that come with
[12:23]
having community partners. So I think as
a and I think like marketing right like
[12:29]
makes a lot of sense to me and we have
our staff that programs right like they
[12:35]
have long-standing relationship housing
authority people at DVR right like
[12:39]
neuroscience things like that and so I
think those speak a lot to that
[12:45]
» I'm certainly yeah no but I just want to
make sure that
[12:49]
support
[clears throat] that we are making for
[12:54]
and it is one of those things
done. So whatever
[13:00]
much need
but it's very thank you
[13:06]
clarifying some of those things
any other
[13:12]
question.
[13:17]
All right, CSP.
[13:27]
I've been around a really long time.
Kevin
[13:31]
saying she is perfect.
[13:35]
Let's go ahead and give you
>> so um CSP again wrap around program
[13:43]
rehabilitative in nature but different
in a way and that we're really we're
[13:48]
really just stabilizing people right so
um within this program um we serve
[13:52]
adults so 18 and up um and to be in this
program you need to have um serious and
[14:00]
persistent mental illness so a lot of
people think
[14:05]
um foster current psychosis, um a
history of hospitalizations, difficulty
[14:10]
living safely at home. Um and so this
program really aims to um reduce those
[14:17]
psychiatric hospitalizations, prevent
them if we can of course and then you
[14:21]
know
um individuals in their community of
[14:25]
origin again, right? Like 40 years old,
they would have probably been living in
[14:30]
hospitals. So um everyone in this
program lives on their own um which is
[14:36]
really cool right and right now everyone
in the program is also their own person.
[14:40]
They don't have guardianship over um
anyone and so um like I said the main
[14:45]
purpose of this program is
stabilization. So really helpingers
[14:50]
uh navigate the world around them. So
that can look like helping someone with
[14:55]
grocery shopping um going with them. We
do a lot of um helping alongside. So
[15:00]
grocery shopping, laundry, cleaning, we
do with not for. We really encourage
[15:05]
that. Um so the consumers are um doing
these these activities along with the
[15:12]
workers. Um and then med checks is um a
really big part of our program. And so
[15:19]
we'll go as frequently as twice a day,
so morning and night in person to see a
[15:24]
consumer and make sure that they're
taking their um psychiatric medication.
[15:28]
So, like I said, that's a big part. Um,
and it also provides um a social outlet,
[15:34]
too. A lot of our consumers are pretty
isolated. Um, so we find that that
[15:39]
definitely helps in their mental health.
Um, we do have our two psychiatrists
[15:44]
that are contracted with the county.
They help to oversee our program. They
[15:48]
see the majority of our consumers. Um,
and they provide weekly supervision to
[15:53]
us. Um and you can see there that I
listed out um just the um CSP consists
[16:01]
of like I said that community support
staff to provide those daily living
[16:04]
skills um and med checks. We have two
case managers um that are coordinating
[16:10]
you know necessary mental health um
medical dental um appointments all those
[16:16]
good things. We do see um a good amount
of overlap um with um medical and mental
[16:24]
health and especially in this program
right um a lot of our consumers are you
[16:30]
know aging a bit and so we kind of see
that crossover and so um CSP right the
[16:36]
main focus is mental health but right we
also need to look at the medical side
[16:40]
and so that's really where we partner so
much with the ADRC and so grateful for
[16:44]
that we're always you know calling
saying
[16:48]
help us what would make sense and so um
consumers can be duly enrolled um in the
[16:53]
ADRC
in a lot of our usually on an MCO
[16:58]
managed care organization
kind of helps
[17:02]
um CSP just like CCS um there's a
process right to evaluate and assess and
[17:10]
make sure that the program makes sense
um for CCS specifically it's kind of
[17:15]
like a tier
So tier one is like um just once a week
[17:19]
outpatient therapy and CCS is already in
a little bit more. So um it's um
[17:24]
multiple hours a week of services. Um so
when consumers go through this
[17:29]
assessment process and let's say they're
found in knowledgeable or it just
[17:34]
doesn't make sense, right, to move
forward with the program, they cannot
[17:37]
leave empty-handed. that's really
important um [clears throat] with these
[17:41]
programs is they're left either with a
referral or a warm handoff to okay maybe
[17:46]
try outpatient services first or right
like okay well it sounds like you know
[17:51]
um food and transportation are really
your main issue. So here's you know list
[17:56]
food pantries and then here's the
numbers to taxi. So that that's also a
[18:00]
big piece of this too. If they're not in
the program, you know, they are.
[18:07]
» So your numbers, if I recall correctly
on this you have within the program 30
[18:15]
plus
clients and I always I'm sorry
[18:20]
call clients simply because I think you
are high professionals come to you for
[18:26]
clinical type services. call clients
case manager with social workers and and
[18:33]
uh not economic support workers but
anyways it it because I I see that as a
[18:39]
high level of service for both programs
and such I mean really very high level
[18:44]
of service um but we have easily two
full-time case managers working um and
[18:52]
the support staff you have which is
wonderful uh especially you have
[18:56]
full-time nurse
um psychiatrist do the outpatient as
[19:00]
well and
uh but a wonderful program and very
[19:06]
important as you point out what the
costs are per day to be hospitalized
[19:10]
just the fact that you deteriorate if
you have a psychotic break you know come
[19:15]
back same as you were a little bit each
time so it's very important program but
[19:21]
the question I have is is it
I want to at capacity, but are are we
[19:29]
pushing that 30 or a little over 30
people in the program or we're still
[19:35]
doing around the 20
right now? And I I guess I would think
[19:42]
that,000
population that we have. Um, and I
[19:46]
understand you talked about as a
volunteer program, but I'm certain you
[19:50]
do have
those who would definitely benefit that
[19:54]
may not have some choices in their
treatment as it were. Um, once again,
[20:02]
the outreach type thing.
We're going to fund it for uh say 30 125
[20:09]
per full-time
social worker. Um
[20:14]
yeah, we almost
I'm just curious as to what we can do so
[20:20]
for next year to uh increase that
number. Not that I want to work, but you
[20:26]
definitely have the capacity to go up to
151 for a full-time social worker and
[20:31]
it's at 40 hours a week now social
worker has. So you got 80 hours for 30
[20:36]
people and I understand that you know
and all that stuff in there but you
[20:42]
still have adm
[20:50]
people again
>> majority are MA it is long-term
[20:55]
pervasive mental illness so they're
unable to disable
[21:03]
just I guess encouraging
[21:07]
seeing those numbers up to cover the
staff we have which is really nice to
[21:12]
have as we have to uh always justify the
cost of of fee and it really helps to
[21:18]
say hey we're at the you know we're
really busting at the seam as it is so
[21:23]
come on you must have a question
>> I do um the three community support
[21:28]
staff members
um do they have specific qualifications
[21:34]
Is this an area where volunteers could
be utilized or that really not?
[21:43]
Yeah. Um so as far as qualifications um
[21:51]
I was volunteer
that is there is specialist training
[21:55]
that we have them all. Um and then just
the piece uh so uh a part of our program
[22:02]
is to involve staffing. So by stat
because of how many people we have to
[22:15]
I volunteers I like that idea. I think
it was
[22:19]
that we serve also um these
[22:24]
really
[22:31]
They're service aids. I use
essentially they are those helpers in
[22:38]
the community, eyes and ears. uh because
you only have two social orders uh case
[22:44]
managers and they basically create I'm
assuming they create case plans pretty
[22:49]
much overall and then intervene or step
up as needed assistantness or thing but
[22:55]
those those uh wonderful people there
are services actually do so much of the
[23:00]
hands on the program and everything
really are the key for us other than the
[23:07]
fact you mentioned medication Without
all medication, we may as well throw
[23:11]
everything out because the medication's
required in order to maintain
[23:17]
so important.
>> Yeah, I would say it's both you. I
[23:19]
appreciate that piece of right like the
those three community support staff,
[23:24]
they are so important and I definitely,
you know, agree with that and they're in
[23:28]
the community% of the time. You know,
Case Andrews, they really split their
[23:32]
time though because yep, they're, you
know, greeting the all that. They
[23:36]
typically see their consumers once a
week as well. And so they're they're
[23:40]
really in their, you know, eyes and ears
too because again they're speaking
[23:45]
creating those treatment plans with the
clients. I think it's really important,
[23:49]
right, that they are connecting them
versus just sitting behind a desk,
[23:53]
right? It's kind of hard to I think
create a plan that meets the consumer's
[23:56]
needs
to
[24:00]
do you mind if I add to that just from
question too um with these typically the
[24:07]
clientele that have these diagnoses to
to meet qualifications to be in this
[24:12]
program have a high level of paranoia um
and trust and social socializing
[24:19]
to meet new
hard Um,
[24:24]
and we get in their seats. We're in
their business. So, to build that trust,
[24:28]
but repeat
helpful to build rapport and trust so
[24:34]
that if they're having a bad day and
like, I think that you poisoned my
[24:37]
medication. I'm not taking it from you.
That trust. It's like, hey, it's me.
[24:42]
Like, we do this every day. I'm like,
oh, okay. I'll take it. Right. And so,
[24:46]
that piece is really important. Um and
then also we just talked about this
[24:52]
um
[24:57]
just talking about uh shifts or changes.
So, we have three staff that are
[25:05]
constantly going in uh one to two times
a day for our folks depending on what
[25:10]
kind of regimen they have.
To use eyes to see, oh, you look
[25:17]
slightly different.
Maybe if you had a new face every day,
[25:21]
you wouldn't know that, right? Like
maybe their clothing is different, their
[25:26]
affect is different, maybe they're
responding to you, but like their affect
[25:30]
is not matching the situation.
really early signs that we can intervene
[25:34]
on before we go into a full-blown
psychosis which brain matter and you go
[25:39]
you slide backwards every time and
intervenes faster
[25:44]
like the same eyes if that makes sense.
So kind of like yes and right it's a
[25:50]
little complicated especially with a
very
[25:55]
special population when they're very
vulnerable um individuals that need a
[25:59]
lot of support.
[26:08]
I do recall the fact that parents are
learning something for something
[26:16]
um
a member down Moda uh taking them out to
[26:20]
their local grocery store whatever it is
but when they got to their home
[26:24]
community they couldn't carry that
learning over they had to go to Europe
[26:28]
grocery store had to go to your
particular aisle of that grocery store,
[26:33]
whatever. It it it hard to understand
unless you're working in that system is
[26:39]
that these individuals, as Kim just
point out, we're talking fragile
[26:44]
actually might not quite understand
what's going on with that person. I
[26:48]
mean, it's just a few moments, but you
scratch it and you'll find out that
[26:54]
there are all kinds of areas that need
support in order to maintain them.
[27:01]
place in which it's basically
[27:07]
but things don't always well
[27:14]
fortunately but
it's the one on and trust
[27:26]
Yeah.
[27:32]
Unless you really enjoy just that kind
of challenge.
[27:35]
» Keep on your toes, right?
>> Yeah. Yeah. Keep you going. There's
[27:38]
other groups that run out of
anyway. Thank you on that. Does anyone
[27:44]
pretty much covered everything you
wanted? Anything else? Any comments or
[27:47]
anything?
enjoyable
[27:51]
because once again
[28:04]
» let's move on
[28:07]
board which is the advisory committee
reports that we have we have the ADRC
[28:13]
and advisory committee report the
transportation coordinating committee
[28:16]
for join us and the nutrition advisory
council
[28:20]
July 16th. Do we have any questions or
anything up from staff to bring up
[28:27]
anything special that's going on with
them? Nothing in particular. Then we'll
[28:31]
just simply place it on file. Martha,
are you so kind on that? Uh DHS programs
[28:37]
14 students.
[28:43]
» Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot. Nutrition
program. Okay,
[28:46]
» I jumped ahead. Okay. So, I'll get us
launched with a little bit of an
[28:49]
introduction on that. So, we have our
ADRC manager, Melissa Anderson, as well
[28:54]
as our nutrition and wellness
supervisor, um, Lauren Eert. So, we we
[28:59]
have revisited um some concerns relative
to one of our nutrition areas last um
[29:07]
within the last couple of months, we
we've done that. So, we wanted to loop
[29:11]
back and take some opportunity at this
meeting as well to get grounded on some
[29:15]
updates. So Melissa, I think is going to
get launched in that space this evening.
[29:19]
» Absolutely. Um happy to be here. Thank
you so much for having me. Um I want to
[29:25]
start by saying that um feedback is
necessary and vitally important that we
[29:31]
are providing quality products, quality
services to our people without the
[29:36]
comments, without the reports that we're
hearing from people. Um yes, mostly
[29:41]
things that could be improved upon. Want
to hear that. We want to make those
[29:46]
necessary adjustments. Um look into
those things that people may not like
[29:50]
and make the the necessary change.
[29:55]
This is um continual feedback we're
hearing from participants um throughout
[30:00]
the program in every community. Um you
know, you have people's likes and
[30:04]
dislikes. Um those those reports that
we're getting from people, we look into
[30:08]
every one of them. um get as much
information as we can gathered about um
[30:14]
that specific um situation that that
individual may not like or maybe there's
[30:19]
a a group of people that may not like
that specific thing. Uh gathering the
[30:24]
necessary information, really get to the
root cause so that we can address
[30:27]
whatever that concern is um and help
educate the participant on the reasons
[30:33]
why maybe something is a certain way or
work with the caterer um volunteers to
[30:38]
improve
[30:41]
and things in the future. So,
specifically within the Clintonville
[30:45]
area most recently, um we started with
Peter, JJ's in Bowler, JJ's on Maine,
[30:51]
which
um they are new to us. They've been with
[30:55]
us for a few months now. Um and through
that process, we have gotten some
[31:00]
feedback from some of our participants
that were not happy with the quality of
[31:04]
that they were receiving. Um so with
those reports um we did a survey to the
[31:11]
participants in Clintonville, asked them
all the same questions to get a better
[31:17]
understanding of where they were at with
the the meals, what they thought about
[31:22]
the I'll read the specific question that
um that they were asked. Um overall,
[31:27]
what is your satisfaction with the meals
that you eat? Um how would you rate the
[31:32]
overall quality of the meals? How would
you rate how the meals taste? Have you
[31:38]
experienced any packaging problems? If
so, what are those um what are those
[31:43]
problems? How satisfied are you with
your meal delivery service? And have you
[31:47]
noticed any change in the meals over the
past few months? If so, what have you
[31:52]
noticed a change in? What improvements
would you like to see? Are there any
[31:56]
foods on the menu that you especially
enjoy or do not enjoy? Um and is there
[32:02]
anything else that you would wish to
tell us? So, we had an intern that was
[32:05]
working with us for a couple of months.
Um, who really happy to have her help.
[32:10]
She was able to call everybody
individually, all of our participants up
[32:13]
there. Um, roughly about 35
roughly. Um, so have a one-on-one
[32:20]
conversation with learned a variety of
things through that survey. Um, and some
[32:26]
of it was educating our volunteers and
our our participants. And we also gave
[32:32]
the same information to our volunteers
as well um about what the program is and
[32:36]
what the program is not. Um one of the
things that was repeatedly told to us
[32:42]
was condiments. They don't receive
dressing. They don't receive ketchup or
[32:46]
mustard if if there is a food item that
would require one of those types of
[32:50]
condiments. Over the years and working
with our caterers, um the prices for
[32:55]
food, as the price for food has
continued to go up, there are some
[32:58]
things that aren't able to be
consistently provided to people.
[33:02]
Condiments is one of those things along
the way over the years that we've needed
[33:05]
to cut back to
keep a better handle on the food costs.
[33:10]
Um, so we tell individuals when they're
starting the program, um, the ketchup,
[33:16]
mustard, dressing, have those in your
refrigerator when those meals, um, when
[33:21]
you want something to be added to your
meal, you have that on hand. That won't
[33:24]
be part of your meal. Um, we had some
comments about specific vegetables or
[33:31]
specific fruits that were given. Um, it
sounded like there needed to be a better
[33:35]
variety of fruits that were given. Um,
so we took a look at that. Um the size
[33:41]
of the meal was commented. Um the
portion size was small
[33:47]
as well. Um they commented that there
wasn't a dessert and some of the
[33:51]
vegetables were hard to eat. Um so in
educating our our participants, we let
[33:57]
them know that overall in the menu the
fruits and vegetables need to be part
[34:01]
are a staple and need to be part of
every meal. the portion sizes um are set
[34:07]
the caterers are following a set menu
with the set portion sizes that they
[34:12]
need to follow. Um we obviously like I
had just explained um about the
[34:17]
condiments. We explained that to them as
part of the letter. We explained that
[34:22]
another part of controlling the cost was
the desserts as well. Desserts are not
[34:27]
unfortunately part of what the state
requires us to provide to folks. um as
[34:34]
part of their meal. Everybody loves
desserts unfortunately
[34:39]
to always provide those desserts. We
like the caterers to try to incorporate
[34:43]
them when they can. Um but it used to be
something that um folks would get almost
[34:49]
every
over the course of time that has changed
[34:54]
unfortunately, but it it's a it's a
necessary change that we maybe didn't
[34:59]
explained to everybody. So this provided
an opportunity to kind of get everybody
[35:03]
all on the same page um in providing
everybody with the same information. Um
[35:09]
so with regards to those letters then
that went out we were also
[35:13]
simultaneously working with our caterer.
So we shared these survey results with
[35:17]
our caterer um who Jessica the owner of
um JJ's on main is very thankful for the
[35:24]
feedback um and made necessary changes
immediately. One of the comments that we
[35:29]
were getting from participants was the
meal packaging. So the packaging of the
[35:34]
meals looked different from what it has
been previously with the other caterers
[35:38]
that we had been working with.
That feedback um to the owner and she
[35:44]
has she has made those changes um
including not just the meal packaging
[35:49]
but also the cooler and the transport of
the meals being different as well.
[35:57]
decided
[36:04]
for the meal so that nothing is tipping
so everything is staying in place. Some
[36:08]
really good things she did and she's
also providing us with um if you want
[36:16]
to um we can give a couple of this way.
[36:23]
Um, so Ajessa is providing us with daily
pictures of the meals that are being
[36:29]
served. Um, more recently there was a
article in the Waka County Post for
[36:35]
those of you who may have read that. Um,
and we don't know where that meal that
[36:42]
was pictured if that was our meal. Um,
we're not sure if that was or not. um we
[36:48]
don't have eyes on those meals every day
to be able to confirm or deny that that
[36:53]
was or was not our meal. This is a
better way for us because we're not
[36:57]
physically present in being able to see
those meals. Our volunteers are our eyes
[37:01]
and ears up there. Our participants are
as well, but if nobody's telling us,
[37:06]
we're not aware of it. So, um that is
one of one of several things um that
[37:11]
Jessica has put in place. Um, we also
are looking at making some additional
[37:18]
improvements within the community of
Clintonville. Right now, we're doing a
[37:21]
meal pickup at the library. We're having
conversations with some community
[37:25]
partners in Clintonville to see if we
can have um maybe a person that they can
[37:31]
touch base with when they drop off the
coolers or in the very least if
[37:35]
volunteers are dropping off the coolers
and there's still a meal inside the
[37:38]
cooler that the staff member can discard
that meal. Um AJ's was saying that our
[37:44]
our caterer was saying that there were
times that they would go to pick up the
[37:47]
coolers and there had been a meal in
there from Friday or Thursday and it was
[37:51]
Monday.
>> Um so problems Anna with a soft cooler
[37:55]
and all of that what kind of smell that
would be. Um
[38:00]
» we we are thankful for the library for
partnering with us and allowing us to be
[38:05]
able to put our cooler
of the caterer with their supplies. the
[38:10]
library, the smell, and all of that. We
want to come up with a system that works
[38:14]
well for everybody. Um once we get a
better handle of if we can find a
[38:19]
community partner to partner with, um
within the next month, um Lauren and our
[38:26]
nutrition receptionist, Trace, are going
to be having a meeting with all of the
[38:30]
volunteers in Clintonville to touch base
with them to let them know what some of
[38:35]
these additional steps for improvements
are going to be. Um but we wanted to get
[38:42]
confirmation that able to happen before
we set up that that's the only reason
[38:47]
why it hasn't happened.
>> Um so
[38:50]
» how big of a space
>> in Clintonville
[38:54]
» for the bags
we have a tote right now that the bags
[38:58]
are put in. Um how big
[39:04]
the bags don't
next to
[39:08]
» Okay. cuz they don't think
>> good good shelf. Okay. It's just a tote
[39:13]
sitting in the in the library
[39:17]
room and there's a tote there. But
>> what I
[39:21]
» four or six bags
>> I can talk with this
[39:26]
find out if there's
>> I know we used to pick up at the
[39:30]
community center which was really really
community. So, the community center um
[39:39]
required rent for us to be able to
continue
[39:44]
this cost savings with not having a site
there. We were looking for a spot that
[39:50]
didn't have a cost associated with it.
So, when we're talking to we are in in
[39:55]
conversation right now with one of our
community partners that's looking
[39:58]
favorable. Um I don't want to call them
out in this meeting just in case it
[40:02]
doesn't happen
>> um because this is being live streamed.
[40:05]
Um, but Darl, thank you for that offer.
Um, can I reach back out to you if that
[40:11]
doesn't happen? I do appreciate that
being
[40:14]
» Yeah, I I know some as well.
>> Okay. Thank you, Lori. I will reach out
[40:17]
to you as well if that does not
>> Okay. Okay. Um, so good things come from
[40:25]
the feedback that we receive. And just
so that everybody knows here, we we do
[40:30]
we get this kind of feedback all the
time. This is the first though that
[40:34]
we've had on social media and in the
paper. This is the first for me. In the
[40:39]
10 years I've been with the program,
this is a first for me. So, um, this
[40:43]
isn't the only thing that we take
seriously. We take all of the reports
[40:46]
that we receive everything. Um, not just
meal and welld
[40:53]
[laughter]
[40:56]
chicken with gravy. I delivered that
meal and it was very well received.
[40:59]
» Yeah. I'm getting
[laughter]
[41:12]
» to the meeting tomorrow.
>> Any questions? Anything that you would
[41:18]
like us to look into?
[41:25]
» Great. that was looked in.
[41:31]
» My dad, like I said, when we had a
problem up in Clintville there with the
[41:35]
cemetery,
I said what my dad always said that
[41:40]
there's a problem, there's always that
solution. Something bad happens, there's
[41:44]
always a good part of it here again.
Something bad happened, but look at
[41:52]
again.
Great job.
[41:56]
Great job.
>> And I would say too, the JJs, I mean,
[41:59]
they were the owner was very committed.
>> Great job.
[42:03]
» Communication.
Great job on JJ.
[42:10]
» We just didn't we could have easily sat
on our hands when Lori was talking about
[42:14]
some of the things.
>> Great job.
[42:16]
» And
>> I didn't expect something,
[42:18]
» but but you took the ball and
great work. Great work. I mean,
[42:23]
» I did reach out
and I said, "Hey, please call me."
[42:28]
» I wanted her to know that we were
already discussions with
[42:32]
» I didn't know that the newspaper was go
back on our meetings and quote
[42:39]
» sometimes it's easy to put out that
negative press and then you're damage
[42:42]
control.
>> Yeah,
[42:44]
» we don't get this press like we're
taking care of it now,
[42:48]
» right?
>> You never hear that part. So, that's
[42:49]
unfortunate. Spread the word. We're on
top of it and it's as good as we can
[42:55]
make it.
>> It might be worthwhile sometime in the
[42:59]
future to actually have the press as a
showm
[43:10]
controversial part of it. Um great job.
>> Yeah.
[43:16]
They were very responsible
and everything somehow make them aware
[43:21]
of that
>> because I I think
[43:25]
pat on the back for stepping up right
away rather say forget it
[43:29]
» move on to something else. But Melissa,
I think you and your your your staff
[43:34]
here have up on something that is fairly
negative sounded let's
[43:42]
give an opportunity then for us
shine show a good program we do have and
[43:49]
and the staff we have that car and the
volunteers
[43:55]
is one of them.
Thank you for that.
[44:02]
It helps us. They can't have it can't be
everywhere.
[44:05]
» Voices that is always well received.
>> Anything else that we have during that
[44:12]
Melissa? You have any comment on that? I
thank you very much for that. Sorry, I
[44:16]
almost missed you. That was a senior
moment on my part.
[44:22]
» We do.
>> Okay, let's move on. DHS program
[44:26]
supporting students.
>> All right. So, we have another hand out
[44:30]
here to
[44:33]
» All right. So much.
>> So in the spirit of continuing um with
[44:40]
providing information to this particular
ward about what it is that we do
[44:46]
partners um in the month of August as
promised we are bringing you information
[44:49]
about our connection with our um our
school partners through through our
[44:54]
collaborative efforts there. Um, so this
is a handout that just highlights um
[44:59]
some of our public school districts,
well all of our public school districts
[45:03]
that um that we some of whom we Hana had
mentioned that we meet with like Waka on
[45:08]
a monthly basis and we have other
districts that um that we meet with with
[45:12]
a similar frequency or some that you
know less of a frequency or on as needed
[45:18]
basis. But um but we have done outreach
to all of our public school districts to
[45:23]
offer that opportunity to connect to
talk about um what it is that we do by
[45:28]
way of programs, what it is that you
know we can offer, how we can get
[45:32]
referrals. Um we've done certainly some
work within DHS in our space about
[45:37]
trying to streamline a process and make
it make their um make it a central point
[45:42]
for access. um saying to our community
partners, our schools in particular of
[45:46]
if you get us the information, we'll
figure out what to do with it. We'll
[45:49]
figure out what program um that an
individual or student needs to be
[45:53]
connected with. And so just working
through some of those pieces. Hannah had
[45:57]
mentioned the opportunity to provide
some education to know to our schools.
[46:00]
And so um we're always willing to step
in and do formal presentations if that's
[46:05]
what our schools need. Um and um and so
we're really just trying to connect with
[46:09]
our schools um to be able to meet
families where they're at, to be able to
[46:13]
make sure that there is an
[clears throat] awareness within our
[46:15]
school districts about what it is that
we need and what it is that we can
[46:20]
provide by way of services, whether it's
wrapping around a family, whether it's
[46:24]
through mandatory reporter training in
our child welfare space, you know, so so
[46:28]
a number of different things that we
look to do um as the Department of Human
[46:32]
Services, you know, offering flexible
engagement um you know, We talk about
[46:37]
our early intervention programs. We talk
about warm handoffs, access integration.
[46:41]
So those are, you know, again some of
the things that we've done. Um and then
[46:46]
just noting on the second page, we see
the program area, the service
[46:50]
description, target population, those
all being things that we run through um
[46:54]
with our schools. So again that they we
draw back on what it is that we do and
[47:00]
um so that they understand how that may
be of benefit to the students that um
[47:05]
that they intersect with every day. you
know, I I I think about people that we
[47:09]
intersect with as educators and they're
with um they're with these students for
[47:13]
multiple hours in a day and so they
really have a great opportunity to have
[47:17]
eyes on a student and to be able to um
you know work with families in a way
[47:23]
that um that we we don't know all of the
families, we don't know all of the needs
[47:27]
and we rely on those community partners
to make those connections. Um so we we
[47:33]
then um thought it would be helpful to
um do a a program spotlight. So our
[47:40]
third page of this particular handout um
highlights a student snapshot again
[47:45]
deidentifying um you know the student um
and so identifying a student as um age
[47:52]
nine um great but a real life um
scenario. So um of a student that has
[47:58]
intersected with our program um in in
our county and so the work with the
[48:06]
program um I I don't know that I
necessarily need to like read through
[48:09]
all the pieces but we thought it would
be helpful to um talk through in this
[48:14]
narrative for our board here this
particular student identifying the goal
[48:19]
um developing relationship with trusted
adults um making sure that you know kids
[48:24]
all kids should have a safe person. All
kids should be able to identify somebody
[48:28]
that in their day that that they lean on
and go to for, you know, those tough
[48:32]
moments. And so, um, and so working
through that, um, this also highlights
[48:37]
the tremendous strides that, um, that
this little one has made, um, you know,
[48:42]
identifying that he began by hiding
under a chair and avoiding
[48:44]
participation, now sits upright, engages
confidently, openly, shares his thoughts
[48:49]
with with the group. So just um really
seeing um through this snapshot the
[48:55]
progression and the growth um you know
of of a student that that we're working
[49:00]
with outcomes achieved emotional self-
advocacy peer connections school
[49:04]
inclusion
uh family alignment all really really
[49:08]
important and and wonderful and great
things for um for again every kid should
[49:13]
handle that you know coming to um coming
into so um and I'll just highlight too
[49:19]
this family's biggest hope for Jay to
feel safe and connected to his peers,
[49:23]
his school community. Now comes to
school each day excited to tell his
[49:27]
parents or comes home rather each day
excited to tell his parents about his
[49:30]
experience at school. So um so it's just
some really neat able to see with with
[49:36]
the kids and helpful to have those
school partnerships to then draw back on
[49:40]
to be able to get those referrals um and
have those come our way. Um and then
[49:45]
again we one of the other things we look
to do if you look to the following page
[49:48]
CPS guidelines um so the objective of um
our our child protective services world
[49:55]
to protect child welfare prevent harm
preserve family integrity wherever it's
[49:59]
safe to do so. So working with our
schools to talk through mandatory
[50:03]
reporting standards. Um you know
educating about our assessment um when
[50:07]
we receive report concerning neglect.
What does our assessment process look
[50:11]
like? Um making sure that that our
schools are understanding the
[50:15]
confidentiality of the nature of you
know when those reports come in and then
[50:19]
what um what that schoolbased access
looks like. So, um I think we've done a
[50:25]
bit of work within um these recent years
to um to enhance that relationship with
[50:31]
our schools and I and I think that's
really off from you know some of the
[50:36]
feedback certainly that we've we've
received um with the schools. I know
[50:39]
that Shauna and I had highlighted in one
of our more recent meetings um a
[50:44]
presentation that we had done um at the
Wisconsin Human Services Association and
[50:49]
where in that presentation we were able
to highlight the partnership with our
[50:53]
schools and had a couple of
representatives from our school
[50:55]
districts um that really spoke
positively about our engagement. So um
[51:00]
so again when we think about the access
that we have with schools and um and
[51:04]
being able to change that and then the
next thing program overview with the
[51:11]
justice and diversion programming um so
one of the things that we've really
[51:15]
looked at um and sought a a grant
opportunity and we we did provide I
[51:20]
think a little bit of highlight on that
um not recently though so thought that
[51:24]
it was it would be helpful to just loop
back on that when we think about our
[51:28]
work with kids And in particular, we
think about our wraparound services. We
[51:32]
think about what it is that we do, you
know, with within um within many of our
[51:37]
teams that are working with kids like
just trying to get ahead of of the
[51:41]
things and really um really sit in a
preventative framework. So um so our
[51:47]
youth justice and diversion programming
that particular team we had applied for
[51:52]
a grant and we have a um an individual
who manages um our diversion programming
[51:59]
and so working with you where maybe
they're intersecting with law
[52:03]
enforcement or they're intersecting with
our schools in a space where it's like
[52:06]
oh I can see that this is this is
gradually creeping up into a concerning
[52:11]
um space and so getting those referrals
from law enforcement getting those
[52:14]
referrals from our schools so that we
can um start to work with those youth
[52:19]
and develop positive pro-social, you
know, relationships, talk about goal
[52:24]
setting, talk about again looping back
to that one connection, having that
[52:28]
positive support within the school,
within the community. And so really
[52:32]
working in that space um from a
diversion perspective or from a group's
[52:36]
perspective working on self-esteem,
self- advocacy to really give um you
[52:41]
know to give a boost to our youth um
because um it's been a little bit since
[52:45]
I've been in in school and in high
school in particular, but but I you know
[52:49]
you think about those those are delicate
years. Those are tricky years and
[52:53]
there's a lot of spheres of influence.
And so how do we really work with our
[52:56]
youth to be able to provide support to
help them to make healthy choices? Then
[53:01]
uh the program spotlight for youth
justice which on the very last page um
[53:07]
it just highlights a group of teen boys
um court ordered supervision
[53:11]
restitution. though um receiving a
referral um burglary, property damage,
[53:17]
breaking even um so talks about court
supervision um and then our intervention
[53:23]
approach um enrolling youth in moral
recog recognation therapy MRT um that
[53:30]
12step cognitive behavioral curriculum
focused on moral reasoning decision-
[53:34]
making personal accountability working
through outcomes um with
[53:40]
um and then just drawing down to that
detailed case narrative. We're we're
[53:44]
working with these youth and um and one
of the things that we look to detail in
[53:50]
the youth justice um programming in
particular is looking at where youth is
[53:54]
at um at one point in time and then fast
forwarding to another point in time and
[53:59]
just saying have we received more
referrals? what is that feedback from
[54:02]
the schools and from you know from
potentially u law enforcement about how
[54:06]
they intersected with with the and so
just being able to create markers that
[54:10]
way so that we data track some of the
things. Um so so really some some
[54:17]
exciting and positive things going on I
would say with within our
[54:22]
our schools
[54:29]
questions
[54:34]
such
[54:38]
go ahead
>> I used to sit on a regional
[54:42]
but it kind of tends the C
SC that they would bring
[54:49]
the regional meeting they would actually
bring
[54:53]
some of these participants the children
or whoever give thank you for and it's
[54:59]
so powerful the students relay what
they've done and how they've gotten
[55:04]
better it's quite amazing when you read
this it's it's like the things I heard
[55:09]
from these committee meetings when they
did bring these children and and young
[55:13]
adults and and tell them how did it help
you? Well, I'm this much better. I do
[55:18]
this better. It's amazing. It's it's
worth it when you hear something
[55:22]
firstand probably
not just from one that the from the
[55:28]
program. It's believe me it's wow
[55:35]
court used to actually have
doctors board.
[55:41]
» Yeah, they've done that. I mean it's I
think that impression upon me. I often
[55:46]
think that the group here probably hears
an awful lot and has the relationship
[55:52]
» but the uh it is warm in here.
[55:58]
I couldn't even see
>> but anyhow um Scott
[56:04]
I I question I wonder you know are there
some barriers or something? Obviously
[56:09]
the school districts are so important in
this thing. Is there school district
[56:14]
because we're here in Waka often they
said that Waka gets lot of services
[56:20]
versus up in Clintonville for instance
or Marion um I didn't say that but the
[56:26]
the fact is I guess I'm asking question
and then be very specific about it but
[56:33]
are there any barriers
that can be that a board like this can
[56:39]
be of help in order to uh
allow this kind of program which is very
[56:44]
helpful. Make sure that's available for
all all the juveniles, all the school
[56:50]
districts and such.
That's
[56:54]
any any barriers you can think of
challenges regarding school districts?
[56:59]
» Yeah, I would say this. Um, one of the
things that we look to do with their
[57:04]
schools um is making sure that there's
an equal access opportunity with every
[57:09]
district. So, so districts are getting
the same email. They're getting the
[57:13]
same, you know, the identical outreach
when if I take by way of an example of
[57:16]
youth diversion programming. all schools
when we were leaning into um you know
[57:21]
launching the the program with the grant
funding that we had received um just
[57:26]
everybody gets the same communication
and so the referral process there's an
[57:30]
equal opportunity um and we have I'm
trying to think of like with this
[57:33]
particular board um you know I I think
just the continued encouragement of the
[57:38]
community to loop back and if there are
you know if there are things we talk
[57:42]
about the concern that we you know that
we highlighted with nutrition and so the
[57:45]
same would apply to this where it's like
if of hearing things to be able to loop
[57:49]
back to us as you know within our our
management team to have those
[57:53]
communications or um we also appreciate
hearing like the highlights of where
[57:57]
things are are going well so we make
sure that we keep the things that are
[58:01]
going well um so just just that
communication where you think there's
[58:05]
programming and things just back to us I
I think that spreading the word about
[58:10]
what it is that I think that we've even
talked about that um you know Kevin
[58:14]
certainly within space of when our
community knows what we do
[58:18]
» then it makes it um it it makes it
easier to kind of create those lines of
[58:23]
connection to be able to help people.
[58:28]
Oh, I just sometimes I I I think when I
go back to my home county um where Ripen
[58:34]
was far from Fland City and most of our
services were in the city of Flight
[58:40]
that's where most of the people live you
know and here we are in Waka on this
[58:44]
corner of the county and sometimes I
don't know for sure but sometimes very
[58:51]
including sometimes I northward he um
wonder if if they really are aware of or
[58:59]
services seen as available to them even
though they are available to them. I
[59:03]
understand all that but sometimes you
may have to make some extra effort make
[59:07]
sure that they feel that uh we're also
providing services for them as you did
[59:13]
in nutrition. I mean my god you you
stepped up and you really appropriate a
[59:18]
lot of of services for them and and look
at the uh reaction we had. It's going to
[59:24]
be a very positive
up there. I'm certain they're just very
[59:28]
grateful what
sites that Melissa is in charge of. So I
[59:34]
I'm just the same, you know, just maybe
more more and more positive
[59:40]
type of impact and there something that
would barriers of any kind challenges
[59:45]
that we have serving some of the
outlying communities that we have. Um
[59:51]
just being be aware of them down the
road.
[59:54]
and and perhaps sometimes we help most
of them just money that's the issue
[1:00:04]
in
those that are in trouble all over the
[1:00:09]
county um in different various school
districts
[1:00:14]
when they are have a provider when they
have a social worker when they have a
[1:00:18]
juvenile just or in juvenile justice
when they're in any of the programs that
[1:00:22]
are through the county, you know, it
doesn't really matter which school they
[1:00:26]
go to because they're getting the
services, they're getting the
[1:00:30]
information, getting the wraparounds and
all the things that we've talked about
[1:00:35]
and I really enjoy, you know, the little
scenario about these juvenile justice
[1:00:39]
kiddos because we
um and so it really nice to, you know,
[1:00:47]
have that for people for us to share the
posit positive outcome from programs
[1:00:54]
like that, the moral reasoning program
where that is so needed. I mean, that's
[1:01:00]
that's just something they don't have
and they don't understand cause and
[1:01:03]
effect and to be able to do that for
kids and do that now and they can get it
[1:01:10]
now when they're young rather than
waiting until they do something very
[1:01:16]
serious.
[1:01:19]
Where our money needs to go is
[1:01:29]
Dr.
[1:01:33]
for
something to look at. Perhaps
[1:01:41]
you're part
[1:01:50]
number
[1:01:57]
agency. the county may have to somehow
figure out how to make that happen. Um
[1:02:04]
30 years ago, we were the only game in
town basically for kids and and that was
[1:02:10]
very difficult.
um have more services obviously with
[1:02:16]
private services and such hospital
that's an area that I think the county
[1:02:22]
as a whole probably is a little weak in
as well as every county I suspect
[1:02:28]
everywhere has it's hard to find a child
psychiatrist
[1:02:32]
such and even regular MDs
serve
[1:02:38]
tough situation anything else uh
regarding Morning. Our students have a
[1:02:43]
very nice handout. Again,
very helpful to have for us to be able
[1:02:48]
to let other people know as well as
other supervisors to be aware of that.
[1:02:55]
» You want to throw that across the room
for me?
[1:02:58]
» It's not
[laughter] that.
[1:03:02]
» Okay, this is my check compared to my
other phone. I am
[1:03:07]
going to just simply derive it. I
thought I dropped it down low enough.
[1:03:15]
» I didn't want to do that.
>> You could have done that. Yeah, I like
[1:03:19]
my little old flip phone. I move out of
here.
[1:03:23]
But anyways, it's outdated. Um, anything
else to talk about on this otherwise?
[1:03:28]
Um,
something wrong.
[1:03:33]
» We just did that. Yeah, Shauna Hansen,
this was her bullet point a conflict not
[1:03:39]
able to attend. So I said speak on her
behalf. Um the state had some extra
[1:03:45]
money uh floating and so they offered
counties throughout Wisconsin uh to be
[1:03:50]
able to apply for the CST supplemental
grant award. Shauna applied for it. Um
[1:03:54]
and then
the two categories that the money's
[1:04:00]
on are one workforce development and
then two family support. Um so the
[1:04:05]
family support uh lump of money is for
engagement
[1:04:13]
engage in their where they live. Um, and
with these bunnies choosing purchase
[1:04:20]
certain uh fidgets like hand uh things
like fidget balls or um sensory objects
[1:04:27]
to one help children their bodies and
also for staff to be able to go to
[1:04:33]
events like um Terill was just talking
about there's an event this week that
[1:04:37]
staff are going to and handing out
certain items, right, to engage in their
[1:04:42]
community and allowing children and
their families to um you know uh be able
[1:04:48]
to grab some things and then enjoy enjoy
the event that they're going to. So
[1:04:51]
those monies were were spent on fidgets
and things like that and sensory objects
[1:04:56]
and then the other funds for that
workforce development which is going to
[1:05:01]
training. Um, so these monies were meant
for um, leadership to be able to enhance
[1:05:08]
their skills to be able to then help
staff uh, the best that we can in their
[1:05:14]
agency.
So, just another positive um
[1:05:19]
one of that that noted that it's it's a
positive thing to be able to be able to
[1:05:23]
grab some extra funds from the state and
be able to again repurpose that or put
[1:05:28]
that back into our community
services that we provide. Is the dollar
[1:05:34]
a month or
>> you know what I as I was sitting here I
[1:05:37]
was like you know I I did not write that
number down but if you would like me to
[1:05:40]
follow back up with you I can the dollar
>> you're basically there isn't additional
[1:05:47]
staff or anything that's up to provide
more um support of more things because
[1:05:53]
» yeah they're very particular with like
the fine print of how you can use the
[1:05:57]
money um right so each each dollar
amount they're lumped into those two
[1:06:01]
categories and they have to sensor third
way
[1:06:05]
» one one that sensory to help children
engage in their community families
[1:06:09]
engage in and then that workforce
development how are we training staff
[1:06:12]
how are we giving back um to our
leadership to make sure that we are
[1:06:16]
doing the jobs that we invented services
yeah
[1:06:20]
» not that
it's not an additional cost in that
[1:06:27]
» that's fine I just thought if you had
>> hearings I have no problem circling
[1:06:34]
uh AI has some things to I don't know
what to
[1:06:37]
» believe [laughter]
just around 11,000 right
[1:06:43]
» 11,000 was something
[1:06:47]
you have to compliment your
>> staff for
[1:06:53]
just Sha does a really nice job um
another staff too about writing the
[1:06:57]
narratives to be able to be awarded the
funds you don't have to get the funds
[1:07:01]
right? And she works really hard to
capture dollars where she can to then
[1:07:05]
reinvest. Um
she just wanted to let you guys know
[1:07:10]
that
>> that's a skill
[1:07:13]
grant writing
[1:07:17]
» that's still
actually yeah
[1:07:20]
» you're sitting in a building because of
a grant writer that had good skill. I
[1:07:24]
mean because it was competitive grant so
I mean if you write a good grant
[1:07:30]
» can make a difference
>> some funds.
[1:07:32]
» Yeah.
>> Any other questions on that or comments?
[1:07:36]
Otherwise we move down to discussion and
possible action regarding support
[1:07:41]
exploration of outsourcing
transportation services.
[1:07:46]
» Okay. Okay. So this particular item
again request to support exploration
[1:07:49]
outsourcing transportation and support
services with no commitment to
[1:07:53]
implementation at this time and to
authorize um us as staff to prepare and
[1:07:57]
issue an RFP. So request for proposal
for transportation services options. And
[1:08:03]
so I I'll get up and launch with this
particular um agenda item and then
[1:08:07]
Melissa is here as well as as well as um
Jana
[1:08:11]
transportation coordinator. Um so
so um we're definitely here to field um
[1:08:18]
questions you may have but um but so
I'll I'll back up a little bit. So when
[1:08:22]
we think about our role and our
responsibility as a department of human
[1:08:27]
service in a public sector, county
government um space, one of the things
[1:08:32]
we feel like we've been tasked with is
making sure that we are maximizing our
[1:08:36]
reach to our community and that we are
um we are able to serve the people
[1:08:42]
in um within our county and and um and
so and we also have a finite amount of
[1:08:49]
dollars to do that with. And so one of
the things that we've talked about in
[1:08:52]
particular within the management team or
within our department is looking at
[1:08:56]
services we provide and thinking about
community entities that are providing
[1:09:02]
like related services um or um or there
might be an opportunity to um to expand
[1:09:07]
our reach. So, um, so those
conversations have occurred again within
[1:09:12]
our management team. And as Melissa and
I were having the conversation about,
[1:09:16]
um, about programs within ADRC, um, in
aging space, one of the things that, um,
[1:09:21]
that we had spoken about was
transportation. And um and so what we're
[1:09:27]
looking to do is we are looking to
explore whether or not there is that
[1:09:33]
entity that might be able to provide um
the transportation service um in a in a
[1:09:40]
way with a reach that we're not
currently maybe able to or just do a
[1:09:44]
point of comparison to say are we really
maximizing what it is that we can do
[1:09:49]
within our DHS space. And so if we were
to go out for RFP on this um we would
[1:09:54]
work through and model um we've got some
sample RFPs um you know from um from I
[1:10:00]
think from some other counties who
aren't doing who are outsourcing
[1:10:03]
transportation. Um really to work with
and to be able to push an RFP out. Um
[1:10:09]
we're aware of other counties who
outsource transportation. Um I know that
[1:10:14]
we've had some conversation with um
Janna in particular about you know like
[1:10:17]
what are the pros and cons of doing
that? What role might she play? um in
[1:10:21]
that space if if the work were to be
outsourced. Um, and so really looking to
[1:10:27]
potentially push an RFP out and then
loop back to our board here with the
[1:10:32]
findings and and again I think it's
something we're tasked with doing like
[1:10:36]
are we doing the best that we can be
doing? um and are we being as you know
[1:10:41]
as um as good as we can our our reach um
you know we recognize that there's a
[1:10:46]
space where you know in conversation
with Janet right we talked about the
[1:10:48]
fact that there's that personal touch to
being able to provide the service within
[1:10:53]
the DHS space and do we lose that by um
by another entity providing the same
[1:10:58]
service or if we have an entity that
were to write for the RFP because
[1:11:02]
they're doing like related work um
potentially um you know are they able to
[1:11:07]
to do it in uh in a way where we didn't
even realize you know some of the
[1:11:11]
opportunities that could exist. So
really again just an exploratory phase
[1:11:16]
right now that we sit within and then
what we talked about between Melissa and
[1:11:20]
Janna um and myself and then um we did
have a conversation with our finance
[1:11:25]
director as well as our HR director
because it involves you know a potential
[1:11:30]
um change to an employment position as
well as you know some um some financial
[1:11:35]
considerations. So, um, so we had those
conversations and we talked about would
[1:11:40]
it be reasonable if this board were to
approve us to go out to RFP to then move
[1:11:45]
back um with the way that the timeline
would push out to um our meeting in
[1:11:50]
October and then bring those results and
those findings back to this board so
[1:11:54]
that we could have an educated
conversation about what it is that we do
[1:11:58]
well in house and what opportunities may
of another entity. So, I'll rest with
[1:12:03]
that much.
>> I don't think that what her
[1:12:06]
know what's out there.
>> What kind of transportation? When you
[1:12:10]
say services, what are you referring to?
>> Yeah, transport services. So, um we
[1:12:17]
received two grants from the Department
of Transportation that provide services
[1:12:24]
specifically targeting seniors
60 and older and individuals with
[1:12:31]
disabilities.
So [clears throat] the specialized
[1:12:36]
transportation case is focusing on those
specific target groups. So our funding
[1:12:42]
the grants that we've the reporting that
is um shows the numbers the number of
[1:12:48]
people that we're serving in different
categories um
[1:12:54]
who is that we're serving how many
people we're serving and all of that.
[1:12:58]
Um, our current, just so you know, our
current specialized transportation
[1:13:01]
program, um, we operate with volunteers
that are providing that service.
[1:13:06]
» And this is the Waka County catch a ride
>> separate from that.
[1:13:11]
» Okay.
>> So, you've got multiple programs already
[1:13:14]
available
>> already. Yes.
[1:13:17]
» But this one has grants that will cover
costs.
[1:13:20]
» Yes. Grant does cover costs. Yes.
>> So, this is going to basically try to
[1:13:26]
replace kits. Get a medical transport.
>> No. Well, that's a little bit different.
[1:13:33]
So, um that's medical transport. So,
specialized transportation
[1:13:39]
from medical transportation.
>> Our specialized transportation program
[1:13:44]
provides transportation for individuals
to get to doctor's appointments and
[1:13:48]
things, but ones that are able to
independently transfer in and out of our
[1:13:52]
volunteers vehicles. Um but we do have
people that do contact us that are not
[1:13:57]
able to afford wheelchair
transportation.
[1:14:00]
» We assist those people as needed as we
hear about them. Um medical
[1:14:05]
transportation is very expensive.
>> But do you also like from say a nursing
[1:14:10]
home to doctor appointments too because
he did that kind of stuff?
[1:14:14]
» We do not.
>> Okay. Um,
[1:14:16]
» there are a few assisted living
facilities that we do assist with. They
[1:14:22]
pay full price for our service though,
so we don't use our grants for those
[1:14:26]
trips.
>> Um, there are other facilities though
[1:14:31]
that have their own transportation. Um,
it's a mixed bag. Some facilities do
[1:14:36]
have their own, some facilities.
Well, in the nursing homes, um, funding
[1:14:42]
and grants from the state
and that's part of their benefit.
[1:14:53]
» So, these are volunteer drivers that
utilize their own vehicles and with our
[1:14:58]
funding and grants, they're reimbursed
for their mileage.
[1:15:02]
» A liability with that though. I mean,
>> they utilize their own insurance and
[1:15:07]
then the county also has insurance.
[1:15:12]
» There's certain minimums that are
minimums that are required.
[1:15:18]
» They need to a certain level of
liability coverage in order to be by the
[1:15:24]
county for the trips that they
>> similar to what
[1:15:29]
» it is exactly the same actually. Yeah, I
assume they're saying
[1:15:35]
it's a volunteer driver.
The county has had it forever.
[1:15:40]
» I mean, it has decades
>> reimbured
[1:15:49]
and they're not
[1:15:53]
» volunteers if you have people willing.
Absolutely.
[1:16:01]
the question obviously
providing
[1:16:05]
more service
better service through this sort of
[1:16:10]
thing but is there cost savings I mean
are we really having I imagine we are
[1:16:18]
are we having difficulty with the amount
of money available to pay for the
[1:16:22]
mileage so I'm not sure exactly how the
private sector would be able to step in
[1:16:28]
And
for less cost or more service receiving
[1:16:32]
a grant for it to cover that then
>> that's where it saves us money
[1:16:39]
» until the grant goes away
>> or yeah
[1:16:43]
» well the RFP is what will tell you
whether it's financially going to be
[1:16:48]
beneficial or not. But my question is um
how do you ever anticipate the level of
[1:16:54]
conflict for ride availability? You're
outsourcing to a company that's also
[1:16:59]
providing rides to
multiple other
[1:17:04]
programs.
>> Um is there a way for them to measure
[1:17:10]
» are there going to be conflicts? Are
they going to be there 100% of the time?
[1:17:14]
Are your volunteers able to provide it
100% of the time? Well, that's something
[1:17:20]
maybe other counties that do outsource
help you figure out how to manage for
[1:17:28]
» being volunteers. Are they going to
commit be committed?
[1:17:31]
» Well, they're volunteers now. I think
they're planning to outsource to a
[1:17:35]
company.
>> Gotcha.
[1:17:37]
» Who would conceivably absorb our
volunteers and then manage the
[1:17:42]
» that way? Okay. And and I just want to
make sure to loop back to um supervisor
[1:17:47]
Shi as well about the question about if
we um as a county so we've got the 8521
[1:17:53]
um grant all these numbers 8521 we have
the 5310 um planning and zoning has the
[1:17:58]
8520 um and and that and we have had the
conversation about what does that look
[1:18:03]
like to bring those those programs
together. what you know so just
[1:18:07]
exploring all those options going out to
RFP would help us to also get grounded
[1:18:12]
on um on just what are those
opportunities
[1:18:16]
so so if this board is so inclined we we
um just a motion to provide the support
[1:18:22]
for us to do
>> well basically for a motion see allow
[1:18:29]
you to
possibilities and bring it back then to
[1:18:34]
the
um ask how does this work and cost and
[1:18:39]
everything
your volunteers wonderful program it's
[1:18:43]
been around forever and
[1:18:48]
volunteers
>> I'll make a motion on that
[1:18:52]
» issue RFP with no commitment oration for
trans services
[1:19:01]
to allow for the
looking to multi clarification services.
[1:19:09]
Any further discussion?
>> Wanted to say to Paty
[1:19:14]
the board um I've been doing this over
12 and a half years and since I've been
[1:19:20]
doing this we're pretty much at 100%
right fulfillment or that we say no. It
[1:19:26]
might be that we shift a
[1:19:31]
» with their flexibility, but our
volunteers.
[1:19:38]
» Yeah.
>> Might be a concern when we
[1:19:41]
» absolutely
>> discuss it
[1:19:44]
as a company because you know dollar
bills get in the way and
[1:19:49]
may not be the
>> That's awesome. Well, it's it's a great
[1:19:55]
statement.
Wonderful program.
[1:19:58]
» That's some great volunteers.
>> They are.
[1:20:03]
» That's the reason I love my job.
>> Hard job. Any further discussion at all?
[1:20:09]
Otherwise, all in favor of the motion
has been allowing a
[1:20:18]
service.
All in favor say I.
[1:20:21]
» I.
[1:20:26]
Okay.
[1:20:35]
Okay.
[1:20:41]
» Okay.
[1:20:45]
» All right. So the we um sorry we
embedded um this particular the quality
[1:20:51]
assurance economic sport update with
along with our employee updates
[1:20:57]
a recruitment. So just an update for um
for this board here that we are
[1:21:01]
currently in
we are currently in the process of um
[1:21:06]
we've done the internal posting for the
quality actually it's quality control um
[1:21:10]
position within economic support. Um and
so we are actually tomorrow we start
[1:21:15]
interviews for that position. Um so so
we'll I anticipate we'll be looping back
[1:21:21]
then in our September meeting with an
update there. Um so wanted to make sure
[1:21:25]
to provide that information um to our
board here to see and then uh in
[1:21:30]
addition to that that position once
filled then we'll create the vacancy per
[1:21:35]
the state direction we couldn't
supplement the funding um with uh the
[1:21:39]
quality control position. Um, so we
received that funding. Um, that was so
[1:21:44]
this position will be filled with no
levy draw, but um, but so that will
[1:21:47]
create a full-time economic support
position and so we'll then look to
[1:21:51]
recruit for that position. Um, so so
we'll work our way through the process
[1:21:56]
and and I mean it'd be wonderful if we
had that update too at the September
[1:22:00]
meeting. Um, so so that's one thing. Um,
and then we um we had a recent so now
[1:22:06]
I'll flip to uh children and family
services and let's just tag team with my
[1:22:10]
um my here but um if if I miss anything
but we've got um an access TSSF case
[1:22:17]
manager um that uh position will be
vacant. Um so we had a resignation there
[1:22:23]
August 14th. Um so that particular staff
member um has decided to go stay within
[1:22:29]
the the field but um but pursue um a um
child welfare, right? We talk about the
[1:22:35]
the heart of of those spaces and so just
um that individual decided to pursue um
[1:22:42]
something else um within a similar
space. So that um and then we had um we
[1:22:48]
had a vacancy that I think I made
mention of last month within our youth
[1:22:52]
justice team. um we had one of our
teammates who who had come from the DOJ
[1:22:57]
so from that system um within the the
prison setting so decided to make a
[1:23:02]
return to that setting and so that
created a vacancy and then we had
[1:23:06]
somebody um who had started within the
initial assessment space who said wait u
[1:23:10]
I'm going to raise my hand because I I
really think that I have a strong
[1:23:14]
interest um has a um an SRO background
within the school setting so um we we
[1:23:21]
talk that through so that individual has
made a transition to the youth justice
[1:23:24]
space and we want people in positions
where you know where they're um they're
[1:23:28]
feeling connected to the work. So, so
then that ultimately though created an
[1:23:32]
initial assessment vacancy. Um we're
fortunate that that individual though
[1:23:36]
had had just been in the initial
assessment space for just a short pocket
[1:23:40]
of time. So making that transition um u
just that that was a a good and healthy
[1:23:45]
um transition. And then we also had an
individual start in initial assessment
[1:23:51]
um actually after our last meeting who
comes to us with um with some years of
[1:23:57]
experience. So that's been a pretty
exciting opportunity to have somebody
[1:24:00]
start in child welfare with experience.
Um so um and and so she's really um
[1:24:07]
doing a nice job acclimating within the
team and they're and they're making some
[1:24:10]
good connections that way. There's that.
Um then CCS facilitator. So, uh,
[1:24:17]
recruiting for the CCS service
facilitator concluded, um, interviews
[1:24:21]
and just kind of wrapping up that piece.
So, hopefully next meeting we'll have an
[1:24:24]
update there as well.
Our speech there position, which still
[1:24:30]
remains. So, um, there's
so that that really concludes that by
[1:24:39]
way of our personnel updates. I did as
long as I have the a moment. Um did also
[1:24:44]
want to make mention of um from the the
fiscal perspective, we'll be looking to
[1:24:51]
um come to our next meeting. We've been
doing a lot of meeting um with um with
[1:24:56]
Heidi and our finance director and Tara,
our assistant finance director, with our
[1:25:00]
budget, working through the new pieces
of workday and how the budget um
[1:25:04]
preparation process looks different. So,
um really spent uh a lot of time um
[1:25:10]
working within the program there and
just making sure that all managers um I
[1:25:14]
think Heidi and Ter have done a nice job
of making sure we've got things um set
[1:25:18]
within the workday system as we're um
working on our budget. So, we will be um
[1:25:23]
coming back to um this board um in
September. what we're working through is
[1:25:30]
trying to come up with um and see if we
can solidify things to come back at the
[1:25:34]
September 2nd meeting. Um otherwise um
what Heidi had indicated was um an ask
[1:25:39]
to this board um about holding a special
meeting um in September just to make
[1:25:44]
sure that we get um those budget
conversations and discussions um held
[1:25:49]
early enough um in September to really
be able to put some thought um and have
[1:25:53]
some you know good um and and helpful
healthy conversation about our budget.
[1:25:57]
So there's there's that piece I wanted
to just make note of. And then we also
[1:26:02]
have the financial report um you know
for
[1:26:06]
for 20 26 that came out with the agenda.
And so no um no major concerns there as
[1:26:12]
far as trending. And so I just wanted to
make mention of that before I
[1:26:21]
found a question on that. um speech
therapist part
[1:26:28]
um Stephen's Point has a speech therapy
program right
[1:26:32]
» we do
>> and I think previously you mentioned the
[1:26:35]
fact that you know I have had some
contact with them and everything but I
[1:26:41]
it's me looking at things but um things
are very competitive obviously for those
[1:26:48]
others mind you but uh we've been going
a couple of years it seems like we're
[1:26:52]
just struggling with
on that. I don't think we should look
[1:26:57]
outside of the box as to approaching
something. I I know the law enforcement
[1:27:04]
we actually pay for some of that. um go
through the program they have for patrol
[1:27:10]
officers and such and
might have to look at some way of
[1:27:15]
spending some money to have someone
who's maybe fresh out of school
[1:27:21]
to make sure they come or a lot of
medical uh fields coming that way too.
[1:27:27]
state of Clark or state scenes are
actually approaching those students and
[1:27:33]
helping to pay some of the costs
provided that they work for us for a
[1:27:37]
period of time. I encourage that kind of
talk and everything anytime you have a
[1:27:42]
vacancy there anything that HR committee
does or just HR the department talk to
[1:27:48]
you all about how you know look at that
to ensure that yeah it's a viable
[1:27:55]
position program you definitely have to
have
[1:27:59]
anything with the human resources
>> and I would say in particular as to the
[1:28:04]
speech therapy position because we need
to have it those are conversations we've
[1:28:08]
with the HR committee. We've also had
conversations with um
[1:28:11]
» or not with the HR committee but with
our HR director. We've had conversations
[1:28:15]
about um about what are we doing from a
recruitment effort um perspective like
[1:28:19]
what sites are we getting on to, what
outreaches are we doing? Um we've had
[1:28:23]
conversations with um Nicole who
um you know program um you know about
[1:28:30]
the with WP
about you know the potential there. Um I
[1:28:36]
one of those in particular was as a
result of a conversation that we had
[1:28:41]
about okay about the potential for um
how could we get creative and after we
[1:28:46]
come back to this board with if it is a
a tuition type you know and and it is
[1:28:52]
contracting for a commitment to our
county for x period of time. So, we've
[1:28:57]
had those conversations. Um, and the
candidate pool unfortunately is just
[1:29:04]
really small,
>> right? And that's way
[1:29:10]
a few years
heavy,
[1:29:20]
which is kind of an interesting concept.
It worked. It worked well like
[1:29:27]
didn't have a very good relationship
with the speed test and the virtual for
[1:29:34]
the same building and they did virtual
because it was just easier for him.
[1:29:37]
» Yeah. Yeah. So
[1:29:41]
» it worked for him.
>> It works. Yeah.
[1:29:45]
» Do people at UWSB who are in studying in
this field have required internships?
[1:29:53]
Is there a rotating internship provide
[1:29:59]
compensation?
>> I know WSB has many internships with
[1:30:04]
organizations that they provide um and
fulltime job um in his field with a
[1:30:13]
company that every year they get the new
interns. They provide that guaranteed
[1:30:19]
spot.
[1:30:26]
have to look at you know approaching
this sort of thing market is different
[1:30:32]
but it was many years ago I think you
are allowed I believe now to get have
[1:30:39]
paid internships for social work and
stuff like this where at one time there
[1:30:45]
wasn't any right
>> you were not allowed to on the C
[1:30:48]
compensation for your hours that you had
to put
[1:30:52]
and stuff.
is it
[1:30:58]
be encouraging on that just you know
anything and just the fact that I know
[1:31:03]
there's question always when we have a
vacancy
[1:31:06]
um in fact here's a policy somewhere in
there at 6 months or something it's open
[1:31:10]
I don't think it's been followed for
years um
[1:31:15]
and certainly there are some of the
newer uh supervisors come board that
[1:31:21]
always question opening really need to
tell. That's why I was asking HR make
[1:31:27]
sure you know that you know they're
comfortable with it because uh as much
[1:31:32]
as we provide some direction perhaps or
prioritize some degree uh HR human
[1:31:39]
resources the committee as well as the
department itself really kind of makes
[1:31:44]
decisions on like this
>> that says you know what we can have or
[1:31:49]
can't have and
personnel that we have to some degree
[1:31:53]
that way. So
good though. I'm glad pass you brought
[1:31:57]
that up. Any ideas we have will help.
Anything else at all regarding other
[1:32:04]
we'll move on and just talk about any
supervisors? Anyone going for the fall
[1:32:08]
conference?
[1:32:12]
I'm not the chair. We're really
promoted. Well, February has one in
[1:32:16]
Madison which is legal. I know some are
going. Yeah,
[1:32:20]
» we'll go. Yeah, I know. Two others are I
know.
[1:32:23]
and
[1:32:31]
» we're pretty well done already. I mean,
they already it's pretty close to hand
[1:32:37]
now. I think it's beginning or
something.
[1:32:40]
» Yeah, I don't remember. I'm not going to
>> February though. There is a a very good
[1:32:46]
I've never been to it. I've always
wished to go to it. Wasn't able to
[1:32:49]
because um I'm sleeping in Florida. not
for the Alabama thing. Um but the um you
[1:32:56]
might in your mind think about for the
uh supervisors that you might want to go
[1:33:01]
to the February one has to do with
legislative
[1:33:06]
actually go and meet legislators in
Madison
[1:33:10]
» talk to our
which reminds me Mary that we have some
[1:33:15]
things that we need to promote some
things and resolutions that we maybe
[1:33:20]
should have
>> that we should have those kind of things
[1:33:23]
in can to give to our legislative
people. Um I don't think they've been
[1:33:27]
doing that for many many many years. Not
that I was aware of you have any for
[1:33:32]
that.
>> I think that's in February.
[1:33:34]
» In February and I'm not sure.
[1:33:40]
Yeah.
>> You could ask some things you wish to
[1:33:43]
promote or tell the WCA and everything
maybe have some things that you wish.
[1:33:48]
» Yeah. I think it's kind of Yeah. to
compote. What we need is state and state
[1:33:53]
legislators
to loosen up drinks. We need this
[1:34:01]
house. Our next meeting is September
2nd. It'll be at the highway department
[1:34:07]
and I have to thank you to take a
beautiful building. I think if I may
[1:34:14]
make mention I I don't know if there's
an opportunity for us to tour but I just
[1:34:18]
because this is a public
no business will be conducted on the
[1:34:23]
tour but yeah just
[1:34:28]
for
[1:34:33]
a motion to
[1:34:37]
» don't have to I know we don't we don't
have to
[1:34:42]
would say that's