[0:00] Mac is on an important phone call. Okay, I'm going to call, call the order. I've got 601 p.m., September 10th. Uh, roll calls, uh, stop down at Matt. Matt,

[0:16] joyce here. Prishark present. Fast McCracken here. Been okay in here. Gary Luna over here. We don't

[0:28] have

[0:28] any citizens communications do you want me to still roll through with them no

[0:32] unsigned up to speak okay it's up to you we're going to bypass that we're

[0:39] gonna go down to line item number 4.1 the minutes consider approval for August

[0:46] 13th 2026 regular planning and zoning commission meeting minutes move we

[0:54] You make a motion adjournment, motion second, same.

[0:57] All in favor?

[0:59] All right.

[1:00] Okay.

[1:04] Minutes have been approved.

[1:08] Moving down to public hearing and possible action.

[1:13] Item number 5.1.

[1:16] Hold a public hearing and consider making the recommendation to City Council regarding case.

[1:26] ZA26002.

[1:27] A zoning amendment to change the zoning for properties located at 200, 202 and 220 River Road,

[1:37] Wimbrily, Texas.

[1:38] Otherwise known as Cliffside Second Unit, law 17, 18 and 19 from residential 3 to commercial

[1:48] low impact, C1.

[1:58] Okay, so this was initiated actually out of this board in December of last year.

[2:08] We recommended that we pursue the city initiated zoning of these three lots.

[2:14] You can see on the map here, this is the zoning districts for the corner of River Road and

[2:19] a lot of commercial on the east side of the screen and then the CLS side neighborhood

[2:25] starts right here with all R3s. Your recommendation was that we pursue rezoning these three

[2:32] lots. I took it to City Council, they also recommended that we pursue that. So staff has

[2:37] begun the notifications, sent out all the required notifications, and we're here to basically

[2:46] discuss have a public hearing and make a vote on the city initiated zoning change.

[2:52] I don't have much more to add to that since this was you know originated out of the planning

[2:58] and zoning commission. Nathan is it that stone house on the corner is that one of those

[3:03] three is that the one lot?

[3:07] So the three lots are three days okay it's the

[3:13] There's a stone lot right here, then there's a vacant lot.

[3:18] And then there's another, it looks like a single family residence here.

[3:22] The commercial zoning, single family resident is a permitted use.

[3:28] So nothing will happen to the folks that are living here.

[3:31] I mean, it's a permitted use, so they'll continue without experiencing any change.

[3:36] It would just be if they have any development plans in the future,

[3:40] or their options would be opened up quite a bit

[3:44] with the commercial zoning.

[3:47] Originally, I think, refresh my memory,

[3:50] it's because you've got C1s all right there,

[3:54] and we were trying to encourage that's

[3:58] where the low-impact commercial can continue on with businesses

[4:03] and such pouring over from the square.

[4:06] Is that kind of what we were thinking on that, Nathan?

[4:10] I mean several several months ago, right? Yeah, I think just to be consistent with the surrounding

[4:15] zoning, they're surrounded on these three sides by commercial zoning. I don't, I wouldn't

[4:21] use the word encourage, I wouldn't use the word accommodate, because there you go. Because

[4:27] those, we ran into them.

[4:31] The, was it conditional use permit that was requested? The cut, the

[4:35] long. And so this would be a way to allow what we thought was appropriate. At least so

[4:43] this thought was appropriate. Use of that river road from properties basically across

[4:49] the street from leading pairs and the leading pair parking lot.

[4:58] And that's what that came

[5:00] from as like it in the future somebody wanted to build something like that it would be

[5:05] in zoned appropriately.

[5:09] I'm out Nathan since last month and with the last or the City Council meeting before

[5:15] last we have said that even notes commercial use you still have to come in for a cup.

[5:24] Correct?

[5:25] Yes.

[5:25] Yes, well, is that right?

[5:28] I thought commercial use, you could, you know,

[5:31] if you wanted to have a vet service,

[5:34] I mean, that's permitted, isn't it?

[5:35] Oh, yeah, oh, yeah.

[5:36] And you don't have to come in for a couple of minutes.

[5:38] Oh, no, I mean.

[5:38] I just assumed you're talking about short-term rental.

[5:41] Oh, of course, sure.

[5:42] Yes, yours.

[5:42] You still have to come in.

[5:44] You still have to come in.

[5:44] You still have to come in for vacation rental.

[5:47] Okay.

[5:48] Lodging.

[5:52] But yes, all the other commercial uses retail

[5:55] and food establishments, all of that would be permitted by right.

[6:05] As long as you understand that.

[6:09] But you know, last month, we recommended the City Council some zoning changes involving

[6:19] our threes.

[6:21] and what we did was to restrict the use of R3s and that had to do with the fact that

[6:36] the short-term rental committee has seen that over time people investors come in to

[6:46] town and buy up R3s and R2s as well and they convert them from residential properties

[6:57] into STR2s, non-residential STRs and this was, we were seeing evidence on the committee

[7:10] that this was diminishing the number of houses that were available for people who needed

[7:18] to be in the R3s, low income folks, possibly, and the prices of the land were going up

[7:31] as a result of people coming in and buying up these properties for non-residential use.

[7:38] So, that's what we did last month. This month, this month, we are talking about reducing

[7:47] the inventory of R3s by 3 as it happens. And, you know, it doesn't follow that we were

[8:00] doing one thing one week and one month and something that kind of counters that the next

[8:06] We need these R3s. We need them in order to keep the number of, you know, try to do what we can to keep the residential properties available for low income folks.

[8:21] The prices are indeed going up and people are feeling a little squeezed.

[8:27] There are 176 parcels of R3s and there happened to be 176 parcels of C1s.

[8:38] The R3s comprise 63 acres and the C1s comprise 242 acres.

[8:46] But the life of me, I just don't see the need to add commercial space there in those particular places.

[9:01] I mean, we've already made a hotel in the middle of it, in the middle of it.

[9:06] We've authorized that, although it hasn't been built yet.

[9:09] a two-story hotel with a side building but you know those homes are still part of a residential

[9:15] area and they're just as adjacent to residential plots as they are to commercial plots and I

[9:24] think that I really do think that it's in the best interest of all of Wimbledon to maintain

[9:31] as many of these R3 plots as we possibly can in order to keep the prices down and to not

[9:41] diminish the supply of R3 plots. We need those plots. I think it's just in the best

[9:51] chances for quimbrally to leave things as they are rather than to add more commercial space.

[9:57] I think if you need commercial space, there are plenty of places to go, and I have commercial

[10:02] space in Wimbledon, but to do it at the expense of R3s, I think, is not an interest of the

[10:09] city.

[10:10] Catch it.

[10:13] Anybody want to chime

[10:18] in or anything to say to you?

[10:24] We're looking at changing data.

[10:28] Is three lots now to R3?

[10:30] They're going to see ones.

[10:38] I'm going to be moved to the same R3 that they say to R3.

[10:49] I feel like you do.

[10:51] All right.

[10:51] All right. We.

[10:55] Now, Nathan, two of the three lots have structures on them, correct?

[11:04] The one on the corner is occupied. Are they the two with structures? Are they occupied?

[11:10] It looks like it. Okay. So they're residents. Yeah. You know, if they're rentals, I do not know.

[11:19] I don't believe they are.

[11:22] I know what those hundreds I believe.

[11:28] Now, how many owners are their three owners?

[11:32] Yes.

[11:33] Okay.

[11:33] And each of...

[11:35] This is the city wanting to rezone

[11:37] of not the individual owners, correct?

[11:41] Right.

[11:42] Okay.

[11:46] Any thoughts?

[11:47] Well, I think Vance's point is good and valid.

[11:53] But I do think that it's inconsistent with the zoning on the rest of the street and

[12:00] it also is inconsistent, according to the agenda with the comprehensive planning

[12:07] area description of that part of the city.

[12:13] So I mean there's two competing ideas there and I mean I understand where Vance is coming

[12:20] from with why do anything to reduce the pool of residential lots but at the same time

[12:29] we're not necessarily reducing the pool of residential lots we're just opening those

[12:34] lots to other potential uses in the future but I get it is a difference.

[12:42] So I mean I could go both ways on this I thought

[12:51] I think the big part of the reason this

[12:54] came up was because it was pretty contentious with the with the SDR application in the

[13:03] one lot in the middle and the thinking was well let's just clarify that this area is primarily

[13:14] commercial and so it would be okay for somebody else to continue that trend in the future if

[13:20] They wanted to, right?

[13:24] Correct.

[13:25] I guess I was thinking of my understanding

[13:27] was if these people ever sold their house

[13:31] that they're living in, and it's now

[13:33] zoned as a commercial, these new owners

[13:37] would have to apply for a commercial loan.

[13:40] And they require much higher down payment

[13:45] than just a residential loan.

[13:47] I mean, we had to do it ourselves.

[13:50] If it's zone commercial?

[13:52] Yes.

[13:53] It's considered a commercial property, a commercial, you know.

[13:57] So I'm wondering if that holds up for these lots

[14:03] that are residential.

[14:05] No idea how the lenders be like.

[14:07] I don't think it.

[14:08] And I'm not trying to take some issue with you.

[14:10] And Mr. Chairman, I always ask, my son is down here

[14:13] in the ER room and I'm trying to work with doctors

[14:15] and whatever. But I think we really did those three lot owners of valuable service because

[14:26] the way I understand it and they they'd back me up. Those laws can stay residential

[14:32] usually use for as long as they want to, the owners want to, if, but if, if jury comes

[14:43] by or jury comes by wants to buy it and build whatever on it for a SDR or something, it's

[14:51] already zoned, but we've gave them, and I don't think they realize this and they may take

[14:58] issue with me, if someone's here to.

[15:00] So, I would like to ask to defend that position, but what we've really done is enhance the value of those laws. Considerably, from a residential lot that

[15:10] Jerry's got to go take and get converted from a residential to a commercial lot, where they can leave that house and that the most common mantra coming back that I hear from two of those owners is, they want their kids to have it.

[15:26] Well, my experience has been the kids are going to be sick, POS, as soon as they get it,

[15:33] get their hands on the money, and we really enhance the value.

[15:37] But by this end token, if we want to zone it towards here, you can buy it as a course

[15:46] a lot, then he'll go and he'll have to get his financing on those standard terms.

[15:51] but to buy it as a residence, I don't think they're not going to take the C-standing and make that an appraisal of it will probably affect the appraisal price having that value, but it won't, I don't believe it will affect the owners in any negative way.

[16:12] Now, if someone on the board here has a better insight into that, bring it on.

[16:20] Because I'm in my way of seeing it right now anyway, so.

[16:25] I can't recall.

[16:27] I think if you were going to have a commercial business, you get a commercial loan,

[16:31] but if you're just having a residence, I don't know.

[16:35] That is a really good question.

[16:37] I mean I know from you did it absolutely we bought a commercial a like commercial and we had to get a commercial

[16:43] which required a much bigger down payment.

[16:47] Uh-huh, even though it was a resident.

[16:49] Even though it was a resident.

[16:51] Because you could always open a barber shop or a shop.

[16:54] I mean it wasn't like commercial when they sold it but, you know, we had to buy it as that.

[17:09] It seems to me the value of the property might well go up if it turns from residential

[17:15] and to commercial, but what that means is that at the water taxes are likely to go up

[17:23] as well.

[17:24] And some people don't much care about their net worth, but they certainly do care about

[17:29] their cash flow.

[17:30] and if taxes go up, that's a strain.

[17:34] And I'm not sure that are we ready to do that

[17:38] to these residences here?

[17:42] I'm not sure how they're having one

[17:44] and San Marcus will affect it,

[17:46] but I think that it's certainly not going to go down,

[17:48] and I think that it's much more likely

[17:50] for taxes to go up as a result of this commercial thing.

[17:53] For the largest part, I don't take much exception

[17:56] what you say, but I believe in we may have to shovel this off to next meeting, but it wouldn't

[18:02] hurt us or the hooves of someone to go to Hayes Cad and say, how's this really going to shake

[18:07] out in a real world when someone else buys the little ice? I mean, I think that's the very question

[18:14] that we go down here and get Joe Malone or someone and tell us what they think. But I think we've

[18:21] really done them a financial win-ball.

[18:26] One thing to think about is that it's been brought to the table before, it's been brought

[18:31] to City Council before, and we have no chatter about it from the property owners, correct?

[18:37] So if they have caught wind, and we have one here in the audience that it's going to cost

[18:45] more on insurance or financially or whatever we would probably hear about it by now Nathan.

[18:55] Is there anything that you've heard or what's the council saying or thinking about this?

[19:03] Well they directed us to pursue it so I wouldn't say that.

[19:08] I'm putting it back in here.

[19:11] That's what that's called so we have or have not notified.

[19:14] I sent letters to them.

[19:16] I emailed the property owners that I knew,

[19:19] like Lindsay and the audience,

[19:22] could she apply for the cup on that one property?

[19:24] I emailed Ms. Jean-Bert who lives on the corner

[19:27] because she had emailed me before for another item.

[19:32] I don't have the email for this person's,

[19:34] I didn't contact them, I just don't have it.

[19:37] But they did all receive letters

[19:38] for the state law requirement for notification.

[19:40] I would venture to add that Hayes Cad is already factored in a healthy amount of property

[19:48] taxes, looking at the properties forward and backward stored in the lane of what is

[19:55] already there.

[19:56] I'm not trying to take issue with you, but I don't want to get my ass lit tonight, but

[20:04] you get where I'm going that I think.

[20:10] I mean, I'll be happy to go down to Hayes-Ked and go on the table and see what they're saying.

[20:16] So what you're saying is that based off of the surrounding C1s, commercial properties,

[20:22] and their property values has affected these R3s already.

[20:28] With the potential of them converting to C1s probably in the future with an application.

[20:33] and I tend to agree with that because that's basically an appraisal you look

[20:39] around in that area because some of those C1s still have residential homes on

[20:45] so I can see where that can that can be quite true without this is a tough one

[20:51] because it's not the property owners per se applying for the conversion it's what

[20:59] But we're kind of doing as a city.

[21:03] I think in the end, if I'm stopping someone, let me know.

[21:09] I think in the end we're really doing in the paper.

[21:12] I know that it may sound a little pious.

[21:15] Could be a blessing, could be a curse.

[21:17] I don't know if it would give the owners more flexibility.

[21:21] That was the sole swaying factor when we put the zoning

[21:27] that we get on to what's a lot,

[21:34] you know, 202.

[21:37] That's how I felt that the owners would see it.

[21:42] I haven't been out and trying to sell it or buy it from them, but you get the idea.

[21:48] Do we have in the, as a result of the new comprehensive plan,

[21:56] All right, is there going to be a big rezoning effort or sort of an effort to align zoning

[22:03] with the new comprehensive plan?

[22:06] I don't think so.

[22:07] I think the new land use map really looks a lot like this planning area map.

[22:15] It's really a little more vague, but I don't think our current zoning disagrees with the

[22:21] Newland use maps. I wouldn't see us doing any big zoning map changes. At least not in the near future.

[22:29] With the prominence of what's across the street, my personal, the Carson's property is through there.

[22:38] It's only a question of time until if we don't put a nail in this by my view and do it what I think

[22:45] it's the right way. It's only a matter of time. So this situation comes back again and we're

[22:52] going to deal with it this way we don't have. It doesn't mean I'm necessarily for it but I think it's

[23:00] the logical process to follow and that's the reason I brought it up several months ago when we first

[23:07] district it up is that and that that gives the owners and I know the two owners and they're

[23:16] they're what I call soggy old Kimberly they want to keep their property just they don't they don't

[23:24] want to be told what to do or what they can't do but this gives them by my view the best opportunity

[23:31] to stay residential from now to it freezes over or if they decide they want to move to

[23:40] kissing tree or somewhere, so I'm not being good gone.

[23:47] I've said enough. Thank you.

[23:49] Ben, we still don't need to open the public hearing and give people an opportunity to speak.

[23:54] I don't know if you got to. Well, Mr. Sergio, unfortunately we already will you want to?

[24:01] that's up to you let's let

[24:08] me see hold on Sergio is probably going to want to

[24:11] talk about this one because he has properties right behind this so this is the

[24:15] one he wants to talk about and I think you should open it okay we're gonna take

[24:19] a break from the discussion by the commission and we're gonna open up the

[24:24] discussion to the or to public hearing Sergio would you like are you wanting to

[24:29] talk about this item okay come on up Sergio so

[24:40] I would like to know and

[24:42] And I'll also hold on one second to state your name and your address.

[24:46] All right.

[24:47] My name is Sergio Gutiérrez.

[24:48] My father says, five or two, I met a drug.

[24:51] OK.

[24:52] So I would like to maybe call it Nathan.

[24:55] The lot in the middle is doesn't have any building, right?

[24:59] No building.

[25:00] Great.

[25:01] OK.

[25:02] So if you guys do commercial, what kind of business you later than do it?

[25:08] I

[25:11] mean, you have the options of any low-impact commercial use.

[25:18] Well, that's what he's asking, like, give him an example of...

[25:21] Well, he wants to know where's probably where...

[25:23] I'm taking your line.

[25:25] You're worse than your best.

[25:26] You've got to see an ex-on station move in.

[25:29] No.

[25:30] Are you going to see a thrift store or a retail shop...

[25:35] Okay.

[25:36] Probably familiar to all the other...

[25:37] The childcare commercial.

[25:40] But those are too small to do like a B business right correct it's small yeah it's less than it's 0.4 or 5 acres or less yeah

[25:53] Okay, so no you can go up but it has to it has to meet

[25:59] Building requirements, and I know you're a contractor if you remember the discussion last time you were here

[26:06] It can only go it can't go any more than two stories and can't be any higher than X amount of feet roof-wise

[26:12] Okay, okay, so it still has to fit in that lot

[26:17] Okay, still has to fit based off of

[26:21] Zoning and permitting requirements same thing when the drain like I for the

[26:27] Setty correct

[26:28] Okay

[26:29] All right, yeah, but still has to check all the boxes off all right

[26:35] because in the and the bellhouse like they use it for weddings like an

[26:42] resort the bellhouse they call the bellhouse okay and they always call the

[26:47] cap on my tenants because they say okay did they and did they we have an

[26:53] event so we don't want any noise on the jar like a kiss playing around and it's

[26:58] kind of like a few weeks coming when this business like commercial lots if they

[27:02] do some business kind of like that business we go to say about the same problem so you're talking

[27:10] about the bell house calls calls the cops on your tenants because you live right on the yes behind

[27:16] them okay on Dobie Lane right yes sir Dobie Drive or Drive sorry yeah so are you afraid that a commercial

[27:24] So business will come in and disrupt or call on Dolby Drive, the residents over there.

[27:32] That's correct.

[27:37] So my question, what kind of reason did they allow to do it?

[27:43] As long as it's legal.

[27:47] The ordinance is long, but I can read a few examples, administrative and professional office,

[27:55] insurance, real estate attorneys, attorneys, accountants, architects, and

[28:00] Georgia, Georgia, Georgia, Georgia, Georgia and Georgia.

[28:05] Organizations, civic uses such as city hall, research services, limited and office,

[28:15] religious assembly, retail, sales and service, business support services, child care center,

[28:21] repair services, eating establishment, animal sales and service, convalescent service,

[28:30] So a lot of smaller quiet business.

[28:32] Yeah, that's what I'm afraid.

[28:34] Like I feel they do like a loud business or music.

[28:38] So the one you mentioned, I think it's good.

[28:43] And that is not comprehensive, but I know

[28:46] that there have been issues with music venues

[28:49] over there in the past, right?

[28:51] That music venue is not as C1, I don't think.

[28:59] What would you expect a C3 to what kind of business would in your worst nightmare what kind of business you think would find movie in there?

[29:09] Who knows whatever like a by the property so if they felt it like a they they can I don't know what what kind of being a debris.

[29:20] Well, you've got the same recourse you've got now, but I just don't see those two lots

[29:29] being built out into some thriving hub of business activity.

[29:36] I think it's going to be more exclusive to smaller, maybe a little tripled business.

[29:46] But I don't, I just don't, that's my experience.

[29:50] Yeah, that's what I think.

[29:52] Well, your properties are R3s on Adobe Drive.

[29:55] So imagine that, what can you build on that legally?

[30:00] It's not a whole lot of space, and it's not a whole lot of parking. So you're probably going to have businesses that are literally eight to five during the day and gone. The bellhouse is different because it's bigger, multiple people staying there, and so, and they're staying overnight. So your tenants that they're having a barbecue or, you know, they're going to hear them. So that's a little bit different situation than what I would imagine happening down on these three lots.

[30:25] Yeah, if they do commercial, like I would like to have it like a

[30:30] Signed Restoration like a sign a specific business and all like a big business or a lot of business

[30:35] Well, they still got to come in here and apply and then they gotta they gotta they gotta check off all the boxes

[30:42] Okay, so a lot of that has to do with you know, there is a noise

[30:47] Disturbance where I mean you're more than happy to call the police, you know, and

[30:53] But that's out of the city's control

[30:55] Yeah, you're not advocating your, your rights by this, you know, you maintain the right to protest.

[31:04] Yeah.

[31:05] Yes.

[31:05] Okay.

[31:06] Well, that's what I was warning nobody.

[31:10] And we don't have nobody's come up and said what they're going to plan on building there or anything in the future.

[31:15] So we have no idea.

[31:16] All right.

[31:17] We have no idea, sir.

[31:18] All right.

[31:18] Thank you.

[31:19] Well, on the three lots, thank you, sir.

[31:32] I mean, the day we start trying to limit kids, I think we're in the wrong business.

[31:43] And kids are going to, they're not, I just don't think they're going to be a problem.

[31:47] Max, real quick, I have to close the public.

[31:53] Okay, at this point in time at 6.35 pm, I'm going to close the citizen public comments.

[31:59] Okay, so it's been open and closed now.

[32:01] Do we want to continue on with more discussion after we've heard from Sergio.

[32:07] Does anybody have anything else to say?

[32:11] Or do we want to make a motion based off of what we've all heard?

[32:18] and from Sergio and what we know is projected to be built on one of the lots

[32:24] already and based off of what City Council is kind of pushing towards on this.

[32:33] So keep that in mind as well.

[32:37] I don't think they keep us in mind.

[32:42] I promise they do.

[32:44] Okay. Well, then I'd make a motion, Mr. Chairman, that we approve of this to be rezoned

[32:50] those, those laws.

[32:53] I have to see what from R1 to C2 are created as far as possible.

[32:59] Can I ask a favor from you all?

[33:01] Can I get a general consensus on the reasons why?

[33:04] Because I'll have to go to City Council next Thursday and present this as a favorable recommendation

[33:10] and they're going to ask, well, why?

[33:12] Okay.

[33:12] Is there a few bullet points that I can bring forward to them about why this is a good idea for us why yes, or why no or both

[33:21] Well, I guess it depends on how the vote goes, but so do we take the vote first yeah, do we take the vote first that's

[33:30] If we could do that afterwards then because that will determine why yes or why no I guess okay in my opinion

[33:39] so continuing on with max or max

[33:44] Motion okay, well you say it again max and you got R3 and C1

[33:50] I I would move that we go ahead and convert the R3s the C1s

[33:56] The two other properties that are affecting

[33:59] Okay, for let me read it off again for 200 202 and 220 of River Road, Wimbledon, Texas.

[34:10] Yes sir.

[34:11] Cliffside, second unit law 1718 and 19.

[34:18] Correct?

[34:19] Yes sir.

[34:19] Okay.

[34:20] Is there a second on this?

[34:23] Second.

[34:24] Okay.

[34:25] any opposed? Any opposed? Yeah I'm opposed to the motion. I'm opposed to. Okay so we

[34:35] have a book. We'll go down the line and start with Matt. Yeah okay. Matt how do you

[34:44] favor I'm for okay I'm sticking to my original I'm for okay I'm for it okay so

[35:00] that is four to three right motion pass motion has failed okay so as Nathan

[35:13] has requested why?

[35:19] Because he has to pass it. Well, Vance has said enough. We'll start with Chris.

[35:25] Yeah, no, I agree. I agree with Vance. We don't need to take our three in temporary out of the city.

[35:31] Okay. It's counter to the plan. Vance, I want to get another summary. So I'm ready for something.

[35:37] I think I've said all I've got to say, but basically it is that it's just consistent

[35:48] with what we did last month in terms of keeping the R3 inventory and trying to keep people

[36:00] from buying it up and repurposing it for non-residential uses.

[36:07] So I think that that's something that perhaps needs to be said to City Council because that's

[36:15] part of what's going on here, and it's certainly contradictory to take the position we took

[36:24] last week and then pass this, or pass this motion.

[36:29] So, I think that's where I am on it.

[36:32] Okay, thanks.

[36:33] There.

[36:34] I'm going to agree with you.

[36:35] In a second.

[36:36] Yeah.

[36:37] Thanks.

[36:37] I agree with that too.

[36:39] I will.

[36:39] So, at this point, I'm not really sure about financial going in a future.

[36:43] How that might affect a future home buyer of those properties.

[36:48] You're worried about the financial burden on the property owners with the...

[36:51] If there are future property owners, from what I personally have,

[36:57] I would have to look into it more.

[36:59] I would like that opportunity, but I found that if it's

[37:04] like commercial, you have to pay a bigger down payment.

[37:08] It's going to really limit people's ability to buy

[37:11] in a vicious, effective affordability.

[37:14] I would go ahead and say, oh, I'm done, thank you.

[37:19] I would challenge that.

[37:21] And I'd say I'm going to go so far as to get a legal opinion

[37:24] on it.

[37:25] I think it's important.

[37:26] But I think we're leaving our head in the sand if we don't address this now, while we're

[37:35] not under the gun with anyone else pressing us to move it to C3 or L1, I mean C3.

[37:46] C1.

[37:47] I think it's time we've got to recognize that where Sergio is, that's probably going to

[37:56] go commercial or a lot more sophisticated are than what it is now because as we see the

[38:05] dynamics of the income and the selling price, the sales price, I think those properties

[38:11] are going to go up. I don't think they're going to go down. I think that's going to be a

[38:16] good thing. Okay. Nathan, is it you, how much you need?

[38:22] Okay. So we're going to close out on 5-1. Thank you, sir, to move on to 5-2.

[38:35] Hold a public

[38:36] hearing and consider making a recommendation to City Council regarding case cut 26-002

[38:42] an application for a conditionally used permit to allow for the sale of alcohol for on-premises

[38:50] consumption and off-premises consumption at a property located at 151

[38:56] olem Wimbledon, Texas. Nathan what's the scoop? So we're looking at a

[39:04] conditional use permit for a use that's not really listed in our conditional

[39:08] uses because there's nothing that really covers this type of use in my

[39:13] And this is for what you call a wine tasting type of business.

[39:19] We've done this before in 2024 with wine verly that's also on the square.

[39:25] In our conditional uses, we have a package store, which is like a convenience store that sells beer and wine alcohol for sale to consume all premise.

[39:35] And then we have a restaurant that serves alcohol, we don't have the in between of come in, try your wine.

[39:42] and if you like it, buy it, take it home.

[39:45] So what I've been advised to do is basically run it like this,

[39:48] to basically focus on the alcohol part of it

[39:50] because that's really what it deals with in our code.

[39:53] And this, if approved, would just give them the ability

[39:57] to sell alcohol for consumption on the property

[40:02] and for consumption off the property.

[40:04] Take a bottle home with you if you purchase it.

[40:07] Right now, I have this, the exhibit labeled

[40:11] as this entire property, which is just this lot, I will say, if you'll see that.

[40:16] If there's any narrowing down of where you want this used to take place,

[40:20] that's something you'll can discuss and give me direction to do for City Council.

[40:25] But as of now, I'm just considering it the whole property as requesting this use.

[40:34] Well, off-premises means they can buy a bottle.

[40:39] Yeah, taking home or because it's very vague and the wording here like have a plastic cup of wine and walk off with it

[40:49] Like walk down the street with it. Is that what you're saying?

[40:51] Well, I think that would be a different thing

[40:53] I'm just saying that you could go and you can drink alcohol on the premises

[40:57] You can also buy a bottle to take home which when at the time the zoning code was made was that it was illegal

[41:02] You you couldn't go into a bar and buy a six pack and go home with a six pack but now you can't

[41:07] Okay, so that, I mean, that's just why I differentiated it in that way and that wording so so this is no different than wine burly

[41:15] That's my understanding, but we do have the applicant here that can give you more information on the specifics of the

[41:19] I'm running this the exact same way we did wine burly. I'm being consistent with how we treat people with these requests

[41:29] Okay, well, we don't have every quest to speak do we still want to

[41:34] Bring open it up and close it. Yeah, okay at this time. We're going to

[41:39] open to public hearing 6.45 pm and we don't have anybody signed up to speak so we're

[41:49] going to close the public hearing at 6.45 pm and open it to discussion amongst the commission.

[42:00] Do you guys know I drove by today? I need to drive because if you guys remember there's

[42:06] It's all 151 old and so what do you think about do we need to restrict it in any way I just don't know it's hard to

[42:20] for me to understand well right now you can go into some establishments on the square by a frozen margarita

[42:30] in a plastic cup and walk down the street.

[42:32] That was my question on it.

[42:33] Restricting it geographically to one part of this area.

[42:37] Well, I don't want to short them.

[42:39] If we say you got to keep it on the premises

[42:41] when legally they can have a glass of wine

[42:44] and walk off with it.

[42:45] And I don't want to restrict them if it's not necessary.

[42:49] Yeah, but it is for the sale of alcohol for those uses.

[42:55] What is the business now?

[42:57] is a brand new building. It's a brand new building actually. The tattoo parlour is right next to it here.

[43:03] The tattoo parlour is next to it, you're saying?

[43:05] Yeah, so that's still, that's within this block of that we're talking about, too.

[43:10] Oh yeah.

[43:11] The tattoo parlour.

[43:12] Oh, the old rock grill.

[43:13] Oh, this house. That's tattoo parlour.

[43:15] That's tattoo parlour.

[43:15] So it is right here because I said the same thing. The tattoo parlour is 151. It has it in its window.

[43:22] It's tasting, it's education, it's going to be very exclusive and specific on membership

[43:29] and then sort of elevating all of it, so.

[43:33] And it was, from what I could tell, incredibly fun wrong, it looks like it's all indoors

[43:38] because I didn't see like an outdoor seating like patio area or anything like that.

[43:42] Yeah, I mean it's really small, it's all indoors and then there's that little sitting area

[43:46] outside.

[43:47] There it is, okay.

[43:48] That I can use that as well, so.

[43:50] So you're at $151, is that right?

[43:53] I'm at $151.

[43:54] Is anybody else any other business at $151?

[43:58] No, so the whole LLC is $151.

[44:01] And this is, I think it's zoning or I don't know, but the landlord has let me use Sweet 300,

[44:09] which is new construction, yes.

[44:13] And nobody else holds a TDC license.

[44:16] There will be the first one.

[44:17] So, I think that's the reason why it's a little confusing.

[44:20] So, I just want to be able to sell wine and then also utilize the outdoor space for events.

[44:29] Do you know that, do you know if, so you have a TIVC license, do you need this zoning change

[44:39] for the entire property or just for your, no, no, I think it's just for my building.

[44:43] I mean, I know this through TVC, I've held the TVC license for a while, so I actually opened

[44:48] Casa Vendemia on where Creek House is in 2016, and I've been in business for 10 plus years now.

[44:56] So I closed, I was down on Rancho R12, which was a-

[45:00] Unincorporated area. So, I think, I think, Chris Sharp knows. He was a member. And so, I sold that property, the commercial property, and now I need to be on the square. It's very difficult to operate off the square. The business is all on the square. And so I managed to run that business for about seven years. And I sold it in August of last year. And now I need to be on the square.

[45:25] So is this the sitting area?

[45:29] Is it attached to the building?

[45:32] Yeah, I mean, no, will you mean the outdoors?

[45:35] Yeah, I'm sorry, the outdoors.

[45:37] It's, no, it's to the side, but per the landlord.

[45:43] He's, as long as I have liability insurance

[45:46] to cover sort of the events, and of course, I'll take care of that.

[45:52] But I can use it once or twice a month, that extended area.

[45:57] But I won't pay rent for it.

[45:59] It's sort of an additional perk for everybody

[46:02] who's friending a business there.

[46:04] Up until now, no one has sold alcohol there, or wine.

[46:10] Mine will be solely wine, so that's my focus is on.

[46:15] Oh, I made it.

[46:16] I'm sorry.

[46:17] Can you bring up a Google map of just so we can see satellite

[46:26] It's hard to tell. So I'm dealing now with Hays County food and you know, sanitation. And so they also needed a more

[46:36] clearer survey. But there's a, so behind the cigar shop, the whole idea was, you know, to sort of create more of an ambiance with all of the businesses there.

[46:49] and something that's, you know, offers a little more traffic in that direction.

[46:56] And so the landlord built a stage there.

[46:58] So, you know, to have music and events.

[47:03] And so you see, yes, and yes, that's all that.

[47:07] Yeah. And then I'll be, I don't know, is that 300 on the road?

[47:13] Yeah, you have to rotate it.

[47:14] You're building, I don't think you're building it there yet.

[47:16] Yeah, it's not there so yeah, it's with these cars out there.

[47:20] And it's tiny, it's not that large, it's about 800, it's for fee.

[47:24] And you know, I really want to just open by appointment only during the week and then

[47:29] on the weekends, I'll operate like 11 to 6, so it'll be pretty simple.

[47:35] So is it an option to apply the cup to sweet 300?

[47:39] Yes, I can just, I can just amend, I can just basically put a hash mark over this, the

[47:46] So does a business is there as there are already a parking requirement that goes with the amount of buildings that are there that are

[47:54] Does that open some particular parking requirement to have a one?

[48:03] Venture

[48:04] I don't know

[48:06] Let me check something real quick. This is in the city center overlay. I believe

[48:11] So the answer would be no. There's no

[48:14] So, like general parking based on use requirement.

[48:18] Right, there are still at least, I think, 10 to 12 parking spaces.

[48:26] Is it a problem, Nathan, the sitting area outside with the stage?

[48:32] I know it's still 151 old as a collective whole, but when you state, sweet 300, is she going

[48:40] going to run into a problem that her customers and members go out to this area and drink wine.

[48:48] Is that going to be a problem for her?

[48:52] I mean, I can double check, but I would think no, because you're applying for the ability

[48:57] to sell.

[48:58] You would sell it in the building that you could take it over there.

[49:01] You couldn't sell it out there with like a stand.

[49:04] Oh, no, I can't do that.

[49:05] TBC1 allowed me to.

[49:06] I would have to pull it down.

[49:07] Okay.

[49:07] That answers, I think the answer is my question on that part.

[49:11] We just don't want to give restricted or it's a disaster for your business.

[49:16] No, I feel like it's a great location.

[49:19] I think that it'll benefit all of the businesses.

[49:23] I just want to clarify, it's not a bar, it's a tasting room.

[49:26] My background is wine, so that's what I want to do.

[49:28] I just want to utilize the space and be able to utilize the outdoor space

[49:33] and bring wine to that part of the square.

[49:38] Thank you.

[49:39] You're welcome.

[49:44] I tend to...

[49:45] Did I open it?

[49:46] Did I open it and close it?

[49:48] Okay, no, no.

[49:49] I tend to gravitate towards Chris's idea of...

[49:54] I don't know if you were advocating that,

[49:56] but restricting the cup to sweet 300.

[50:01] Oh, it needs to be.

[50:02] Because we don't know what else might come along

[50:05] and how the attitude of the town might change in 10 years and whoever's sitting here can address the next couple of cases.

[50:14] Another establishment needs it. They can come and get a cup for that.

[50:18] Right.

[50:18] Or write a building or whatever.

[50:19] Correct.

[50:22] If the wine tasting shop moves on and closes, does something else, and someone else comes and occupies Sweet 300,

[50:32] will the mission to sell alcohol still go with that?

[50:38] That's right.

[50:38] It'll convey.

[50:39] It'll convey.

[50:43] Can we restrict it?

[50:45] I mean, I'm not sure that I want to.

[50:47] I'm not sure how I feel about that.

[50:49] Leaving it wide open to future uses.

[50:53] They change its hands.

[50:54] They change its hands.

[50:55] They change its hands.

[50:56] They change its hands.

[50:57] They change its hands.

[50:58] They change its hands.

[51:00] get a permit. They have to get the permit from certainly TABC, but I guess they wouldn't

[51:04] have to come back here for any room. But if it were a clothing shop or something, I guess

[51:10] they could still sell all the wine, I suppose they could. I don't think that's a problem.

[51:16] I just want to refill it. Yeah. I mean, we definitely have a precedent for improving

[51:21] similar. Yeah. That's true.

[51:25] If it is like a cost of the model, I can speak with first-hand

[51:29] experience. It's pretty low key. You know, it's not a, it isn't a bar. It's a, you go, you have a

[51:34] couple of wine to taste and buy a bottle or, or not.

[51:41] Karen, do you have anything to say?

[51:43] I was just thinking that I know there's the treasure dog rescue research shop right there and there's

[51:50] Casa de Linda, the art studio and then there's the tattoo place and then there's a

[51:56] a little place there. And there's just a good scar lounge.

[52:05] It would, I would think it would

[52:08] change the atmosphere for those other two businesses. And a positive way or negative way.

[52:14] I don't

[52:19] know positively. I mean, it could bring more business up to that area. There's a

[52:23] little slow up there, but it could also get

[52:30] really busy and there's no parking for other

[52:33] of people that frequent the treasures.

[52:37] There's signs everywhere, and I can tell you right now

[52:40] that property owner that owns that property.

[52:43] If he gets out of control, I guarantee you,

[52:45] there's some tow trucks that are gonna go in there

[52:46] and get vehicles out there.

[52:49] And even across the street, they've got not a turnaround,

[52:52] not a turnaround, I mean, there's signs everywhere.

[52:54] In fact, when I was going to look at the building,

[52:57] I stopped because there's two signs in the parking lot

[53:00] that this is not an exit, and I had to turn around,

[53:02] come back out to old them. So I mean it's it's it's it's crystal clear you'd have to do it on

[53:08] purpose not to see the writing on the wall so to speak.

[53:15] Yeah. Did you have to send out a letter to

[53:18] all the tenants or just the one owner of 151 letting them know her intentions of a cup. I sent

[53:26] a letter to everyone within 200 feet of the property line.

[53:31] And you haven't heard of anybody?

[53:32] I haven't.

[53:33] Yeah, but you would.

[53:35] Well, I move that we approve an application for condition use permit to allow the sale

[53:39] of alcohol for all in-premises consumption and all-premises consumption at sweet 300, 151

[53:46] o'clock.

[53:48] So that's it?

[53:49] Sure.

[53:49] All in favor?

[53:50] I have.

[53:51] Anybody oppose?

[53:52] Okay.

[53:53] to me, it's been passed. Congratulations. Okay. 5.2 to okay. Board member reports, 6.1. Any

[54:08] announcements? Yes, please. I'd like to get Nathan back me up from going the wrong way

[54:16] with this. I'd like to give you the chairman's blessing to go with an official member planning

[54:21] and zoning and either go to independentist title,

[54:25] zoom alone, and or both HayesCAD,

[54:30] and try and answer the question and the concern

[54:32] that I think is valid about the effect on property tax

[54:37] base that we have on these properties,

[54:40] which is based on a line item 5.1.

[54:43] Yes, please.

[54:45] And I don't know, Nathan, how would you prefer,

[54:48] I go off and do this or you want to go with me or you want to go do it yourself

[54:54] But I don't my point I'm skipping that we want to find out I'd like to do this before this goes before council next week

[55:04] Well, I got the time. I'm

[55:07] Gonna die pretty sure

[55:09] I got a good outlook for a guy with cancer. I'm good

[55:18] you're well then you're right to go find that out yourself and bring it back to us let us know

[55:22] which found out all right madam secretary with that work for you to get you to written some sort of

[55:28] written answer okay that takes a burden off of you I will do you work yeah or I can do that

[55:41] I'm just letting out.

[55:44] No, I've handed it person here too.

[55:47] All right, so what about what about boss?

[55:51] Hey, that sounds great. I don't think we need to make a motion on that.

[55:54] If you want to do it, Mac, I mean, it would answer probably half of the

[56:03] the serious doubt on moving forward on that is putting a burden on the property owner.

[56:09] right yeah so that that would answer a lot of people's concerns so that would

[56:14] be a good thing and plus the council would be able to use that information to

[56:17] make their decision it's a better informed decision so it can't hurt right can't

[56:22] hurt how can you screw this up man I don't know I don't know anything we get our

[56:28] tattoos right okay yeah we're trying to get a potential like new member

[56:35] refresher type training for P&B, even city council members, and parks and

[56:40] board members, through our attorney's office, and that we haven't done a training

[56:44] in a while. I think we've only done one since I've been here for, but I'll

[56:48] send out some dates. I don't know if Thursday night seemed to be the best night for

[56:52] people, or is there a particular day, but overall I'm gonna try to get as many

[56:58] people as possible to attend, just a little refresher, and just to, and then

[57:04] know how to run meetings and what you know but what we can say and do like so do we do that

[57:11] during a P&Z meeting or is this a separate bill. It would be separate so I can probably get

[57:17] a bunch of the different bodies together and we can see what price it is it may be better it

[57:23] may be easier to get everybody by the board and so we can do you know the 30 minute refresh with

[57:28] that maybe an option too but I'll look at all the options but just at some point so do we have to

[57:33] Okay. No, it will be. No, it's okay.

[57:38] The big bucks right here.

[57:41] Okay, so we're going to figure out the white cut

[57:44] from the meal choice.

[57:46] Oh yeah. Yeah. Thanks.

[57:50] Any future agenda items, Nathan?

[57:53] No.

[57:54] Other than City Council meeting next Thursday, 6 o'clock.

[57:57] That's right. Okay.

[57:58] And the next meeting is scheduled for October 8th.

[58:00] So is everybody excited to pay for everything?

[58:02] Okay.

[58:08] Let's see here. It is 7.03 p.m. making a motion to a

[58:17] adjourn. We'll go ahead a second. Okay, all in favor? All right. All right. Thank you.

Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting

Transcript