[0:00] Good evening all. This commences the Tuesday, September 9th meeting of the zoning and design review board.

[0:16] Thank you, Michael. Can we get a call to, we're calling this to order and can we get a roll call please?

[0:25] Members for L. Headthorn here. The posky here. Vice chair is the Gorsek and chair Miller here.

[0:33] Thank you.

[0:41] Thank you. All right. Would you all join me in standing for the pledge of allegiance?

[0:55] All right. I want to welcome our new member first of all. It's nice to have you sitting next to us. Thank you.

[1:17] Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Let's, does anyone want to move to adopt the agenda?

[1:27] I will make a motion to adopt the agenda. Excellent. Thank you. All in favor.

[1:33] Aye. Aye. And approval of the minutes that we saw delivered to us last week.

[1:45] Are there any public comments? All right.

[1:51] Approval of the minutes. I'll make a motion to approve the minutes from July 8th, 225.0.0.

[1:59] I'll second then. Thank you all in favor. Aye. All right. Public comment on matters not listed on the agenda. Anybody?

[2:11] No, I don't see any hands. Okay. Let's move to the presentations.

[2:17] Thank you chair Miller. I am Brad Rolston, your town manager. I'm sitting next to Aaron Hicac, the planning and building director.

[2:23] And Brendan Kelly, who's been the lead designer for the comments project. So tonight we're providing a planning update.

[2:31] As you can see from the timeline here, I'll blow it up a little bit.

[2:35] We're starting sort of a week of outreach. And this is really an update. We're not asking the ZDRB or the town council to take any action this week.

[2:45] You'll see a lot of things. But you'll see beyond this week, you know, we will go to the measure S in the park and record advisory group.

[2:55] We intend to be before you in November and December likely hopefully the ZDRB and November town council in December with

[3:03] you know what we refer to as the entitlements or the sequo approvals. And so that'll be, you know, really an important milestone.

[3:10] And then beyond that, you know, we're looking at hopefully early 26 of coming before council to talk about options for funding and financing.

[3:19] The building portion of it. But we wanted to take this opportunity to give a little bit of a retrospective in terms of where we've come,

[3:28] because we have new members but also there's always people that are, you know, joining along the way. And so I worked with Brendan and you may see this train metaphor that we are using to help sort of guide the process.

[3:42] And although it's, you know, a little tongue and cheek, I do think it's a critical, a critical piece of explaining things. And I think, you know, as we try to explain where we're going,

[3:55] you know, there's all these milestones. And I think what you'll see, you know, and it's this foldout map here. And by the way, all of this is available on the desk and we'll be available on our website throughout the week.

[4:07] We will use these as documents throughout this outreach week to inform the public. And I think tonight's the kickoff to that.

[4:16] This is a regular meeting in the sense that this is the 530 schedule meeting, relit versus the study session that will be a week from today with the town council in here.

[4:27] Which will be at one o'clock, you can see on this, the difference being, as this being a regular meeting when Brendan's done with his presentation through the chair, we will take public comment.

[4:40] And the rules of public comment are you can come before the microphone and speak for up to five minutes and, you know, through the chair asks questions, et cetera.

[4:48] The study session, which was a format that was adopted by council a couple years ago, is, you know, I joke, I do the fill down here where I walk through the crowd and hand the microphone to everyone.

[4:58] So you can, you can do that versus come to the mic. So there's a little difference in tonight, but you're welcome to come and provide your comments today in a week and anywhere in the week in between.

[5:09] And so tomorrow from 3 to 6, we will host an open house and Schmidt Hall. The next day, also starting in Schmidt Hall, we decided to do some focus groups and those focus groups are based on the themes of mobility at 9 o'clock.

[5:22] This isn't essence talking about things like parking or things like car share or things like, you know, bikes and all of the things that go into moving people around the side and through the town, et cetera.

[5:36] Sustainability is more of a focus on things like energy and things, you know, that could be, you know, sustainability is always a big word, but, but in essence, green things that, you know, people are interested in.

[5:50] We then switch to a clock to dogs. We have a dog.

[5:55] Canine commons group that has formed it, you know, has really taken ownership of the dog park, so we want to have that group.

[6:04] So we're able to ask those types of questions, and then finally with wellness, I've asked actually both the operators of the on fill fit and the coops slash farm stand to join us.

[6:14] So that if you have questions or concerns about either of those operations, we can talk about that under this sort of broader category of wellness. So that will be Thursday.

[6:24] Those will all start in Schmidt Hall, and I think I told the clerk, if it's a small group, you can move over to the Schmidt board room that might be a more intimate setting to have a conversation like a focus group.

[6:36] And then Brendan will be back to the one on one conversations on Friday and Saturday.

[6:41] This was the million cups of coffee that a lot of you participated in where you can make an appointment to come see Brendan and talk, you know, one on one, I think this is an area where we discovered through the process.

[6:51] It's a much more comfortable area. I do recognize it can be challenging to come to the mic. Obviously, we are filming this. There is, you know, the issues that come with that. So we want to give everyone an invite, you know, an environment they're comfortable in to share their thoughts.

[7:06] And then again, back to Council on on on September 16th at one o'clock.

[7:10] Peerack and following, I think, Thursday and then the following week, measure S, which is, which is our workforce housing committee. And then I already mentioned that. So before I get to the train metaphor.

[7:26] I wanted to show just a quick and and Brendan is going to do this to a quick clip. This is, you can see here, this is March 5th of 2024. So this is a year and a half ago, and this is just a 90 seconds on.

[7:37] When we made the decision to enter into S, grow to buy the school site. So this is a proven resolution and authorizing and directing execution of the purchase and sale of the young film elementary school.

[7:57] With that, tell me, Andrew, you're going to start us off. Thank you. Thank you. And as you see in the agenda, there's actually two staff reports. This is the first of two that will address the purchase and sale agreement related to the the school site here behind me at 6554. Yont Street.

[8:17] That's approximately 6.83 acres. I know everyone on the town is very familiar with it. And just a quick history lesson in terms of the school was closed in 2020 by the district due to declining enrollment.

[8:32] The town in the district had been engaged in talks since that time sort of off again on again conversations prior to me starting in June of 2023. There was a goal setting workshop that the council had where you unanimously agreed that the school site was the highest priority. It was actually one of the I think it was actually the only thing that got five votes at that time.

[8:57] And then more recently in January of this year we convened and we had our own goal setting session and that was reaffirm by this council as one of the highest priorities in terms of how we prioritize sort of a new initiative.

[9:13] So obviously clear to staff that this is important and we've been working hard to get to this point today.

[9:24] So you know purposes of showing that and going back to the timeline that we kept showing through the the what we called the visioning process.

[9:34] And you can't see all the dates but these were all the meetings that we had and a couple of coffee in the dinners and conversations.

[9:41] You know throughout this and then even more recently this year the town council you're elected leaders have you know maintained that this is the highest priority.

[9:51] So I just want to make sure everyone you know saw that from the beginning you know Brandon's going to show like when we adopted the vision of short video that kind of gets into some of the more detailed comments.

[10:02] But this is a you know continuum right and this gets you to you know to this week and beyond and then you know here's the.

[10:11] I call it the treasure map but it's it's just that you know this is no this is not young fill this is whatever this is some.

[10:20] And I'm going to take it through the green because the green is the stuff that we've completed and the visions and you can see along the green there are four.

[10:32] Stops where the council took action made decisions and in some cases informed by their boards and commissions like ZDRB and the other two that we've been working through.

[10:43] So we started with the station and the station was when we actually we actually ended up acquiring the school site in April.

[10:50] That was when we entered escrow we closed escrow in April we then started interim use fill which was five interim uses which were things that were committed.

[11:00] In addition to the eleven million dollars paid for the school site there's been you know roughly two million dollars invested in interim uses and planning I think there's another.

[11:11] Another appropriation of approximately a million dollars to get us through the planning phase which we're in the middle of here.

[11:19] But the interim uses were the dog park first it was both the Schmidt Hall and Yachtville fit and then it was the farm stand in the farm stand garden so those were all completed and then we had what's called on call onboarding and so this is when the design team joined the train.

[11:38] So this is like the second car if you will and that was you know let's still led by Kelly Morgan or Brendan and his wife Carrie who's also here with us but we added engineers and other specialists that are you know helping us get to what we called ideation springs which is all the ideas that came from the community and then vision village which is what was adopted.

[12:03] And then we recently brought on a financial advisor what we call an F.A. and an F.A. is designed to help us figure out what we can afford.

[12:14] So there's you know definitely two parts of this from the community perspective is like okay what can we afford based on.

[12:22] You know both the bonding capacity but also the the what we what we call pay go which means like what can we afford.

[12:29] You know with cash with cash on hand and so we're able to buy the school with cash on hand you know we continue to you know fuel this train with cash on hand.

[12:40] A financial advisor helps you understand your capacity to issue debt but also creates guardrails and that's why I put guardrails straights because this is where you know we made a decision actually before we even acquired the site of what our emergency reserves for this town will be and it's 35% of our.

[13:00] Our gross revenues are general front revenues which is a high mark by the way in the terms of municipalities so when the bond.

[13:08] The financial people looked at it like oh this is a great start it helps you with your credit rating but those things need to be worked out through you know.

[13:16] What is now RFQ crossing and so I'll explain that and then Brendan can kind of take over to you know and tell you how the train gets to the grand central station but that's kind of where we are right now I would say and RFQ crossing and the town council also earlier this year adopted a policy for.

[13:34] Design build so what design build means in government speak is you have two ways you can build things you can either design them bid them and build them which is the design bid build which is.

[13:47] Generally where you have to design 100% of everything so that you can get competitive bids those competitive bids and through public contracting law require that you choose the lowest responsible bitter.

[14:01] What the challenge is with that process is it's very hard to create 100% bit of document so once you do.

[14:09] You know create the sealed bid you open the bid you start building things and change orders and other changes can become a real challenge for those that understand.

[14:18] You know public works contracts so there's another way to do that and that's what is called design build and so what in essence we do is take the design to a place and we call it bridging documents but it's a place where we can.

[14:31] Shortlist builders and so this is where builders will come in with their qualifications so that's a request for qualification so an RFQ you'll see later in the train is.

[14:41] What do we call it RFP grade so an RFP is actually when they submit proposals so what we're doing right now is just getting qualifications and we're trying to shortlist.

[14:53] A handful of builders that we feel confident can respond to the RFP after we pass funding junction but.

[15:00] And that's really the key milestone, I will say, when we're talking about our capacity right now, with our FAA and guardrail straits. We're going to be talking about the, with the community at number 11 there. Like, okay, what can we afford? What do we want? This becomes the really sort of critical point. And then the RFPs then can become phased. I think that's important. So, this, what you see before you, when you see this site plan, you know, which is, you know, basically an iteration.

[15:30] Or a development of the vision, this doesn't mean this will all be built at once. I think that's, it's really critical to understand. So, as we start to understand our capacity, we start to hear more from the community beyond workforce housing. Like, what are things we want to build? We then can organize an RFP process. We can still do design bid bill, okay? This is still in our quiver or tool box, whatever, but I do think that, you know, the team, which is a very strong team that

[16:00] we're adding, sees the value in design bill. Because then you pick the best value contractor. And this gives you the opportunity to really work with someone to finish the design in a way that's most efficient. And then they are responsible as the general contractor in the architect of record of finishing the permits. So, they'll have to work with Aaron to finalize the permits. Such that we, you know, of course, have to live by our own rules. And then we build something, you know, as a team versus as a team.

[16:29] versus as a, you know, kind of what can sometimes be an inefficient bureaucratic process. So, hopefully that makes sense. It's a lot of information, but again, the reason for the train metaphor was to hopefully simplify that. Hopefully you will find joy in reading the explanation of all these stations, because we did try very hard, you know, in very simple terms to explain everything that I took you to in RFQ crossing, but I'll let I'll let Brendan take it from there.

[16:59] I just want to make a quick motion to always use train maps now for planning sessions, moving forward.

[17:05] All right.

[17:07] All these train metaphors. I think so in my own.

[17:15] Yeah.

[17:20] Good evening commissioners. Nice to be back. I'm going to go quickly, because I've been told to go very quickly.

[17:35] I'm going to go slower than very quickly. But I want to get to the public comments. I want to get to your comments.

[17:42] There's a lot to share tonight about the comments.

[17:47] This is the start. This is where we were six months ago yesterday, and it'll be a little longer video.

[17:59] And possibly adopt a resolution that will direct the town manager to proceed with further designs, plans, entitlements and studies based on a conceptual plan for potential development of the young fellow comments site.

[18:14] So with that, Brian, I'll turn that over to you.

[18:20] I think one of the things I am most proud of is we stuck to the timeline.

[18:25] I think rarely do you see in government where you say you give a timeline, which was about nine months ago, and we're literally here on March 4th.

[18:34] As we had promised, this is where we need to go into what I have called the planning phase, so when we outlined, you know, sort of these three big phases, if you will, of visioning planning and then building.

[18:48] You know, we are moving into the next phase. There's going to be a lot of questions over the next year, and I think it's going to be important for the team to to drill in.

[18:57] We'll continue to keep people posted, but it won't be a hundred cups of coffee and dinner's in conversations. This will require a lot more technical analysis and work for us to come back to you with a project that is substantially conforming with what you see before you, but also is feasible.

[19:15] I'm going to now turn it over to our lead designer, Brendan, who can walk you through the plan.

[19:22] We were here many months ago, and it is a joy to be here today to get sort of at this milestone moment to get your feedback on this concept.

[19:33] This is what we said we were going to do when we first met with you. Don't harm things.

[19:41] We are going to concentrate on simple forms. There are no big projects and no specialized buildings for housing or for anything else like that.

[19:50] The form-based architecture comes through on this project.

[19:55] We're seeking to make a place, not a project. When people talk about how's your project going in the first one to say, I have no idea what you're talking about.

[20:05] We're just designing a really great place in the development. Youngville doesn't need projects.

[20:12] It starts with listening, and this is the result of a lot of different kinds of listening.

[20:18] You are aware, as elected officials, not everybody who wants to say something or offer an idea, it wants to do it in public.

[20:26] We've heard a lot of good ideas, and a lot of really important concerns, privately, that we've been able to answer, some that we've been listed.

[20:34] We've had to explain that are just part of a housing project, but the listening part has been one of the great joys and honors about how to incorporate all those things into the project.

[20:47] I really like the overall layout, and I want to just thank Brandon and Carrie for all the work they've done as well as our town manager and everyone else.

[20:56] I'm very supportive of it, and I really think it's only been about a year since we bought it, which is I think nothing short of remarkable.

[21:04] Thank you.

[21:05] Engagement of one-on-one, and then the dinners and all the workshops really has been, I think, a really extraordinary participation from our community.

[21:19] And that's exactly what everybody wanted in the first place, and I think it was accomplished by staff and consultants and our town residents.

[21:32] I definitely will support this resolution today because I think it's important for us to move from this concept planning process to a design process.

[21:45] I do want to underscore that this concept and plan has, and it's interesting.

[21:52] And it's special, and it's retaining the charm and the character that is young though, and that is what over and over.

[22:00] I know for sure myself has been asked for, and I know when we were back in 2022, that continued to come up as being the biggest concern from locals is getting to school, and then keeping the character of the town, and I think we've achieved that.

[22:18] Full star is everybody involved, really.

[22:21] The ace this one.

[22:22] Home run.

[22:23] Well, I am move adoption of resolution number 254344 directing a town manager to proceed with preparing further designs.

[22:32] Plans and taglements and studies based on the conceptual site plan for potential development of youngville commons located at 6554 through 6546.

[22:45] Councilmember Knight?

[22:47] Yes.

[22:48] Councilmember Trip?

[22:50] Yes.

[22:51] Councilmember Reeves?

[22:52] Yes.

[22:53] Vice Mayor Mickey?

[22:54] Yes.

[22:55] And Mayor Muller?

[22:56] Physiastically.

[22:57] Yes.

[22:58] So thank you very much.

[22:59] That passes unanimously.

[23:06] So this train is moving and mostly for me that helped and I hope it helped you.

[23:13] Kind of re gather where where we were and tonight for the first time really since that meeting is the first look for you appropriately the ZDRB at the development of this concept plan last from last March.

[23:31] Again, I'm going to go quickly.

[23:33] I'm going to say it one more time.

[23:36] If I feel if you feel like it's going to quickly please sign up for individual appointments with us on Friday and Saturday.

[23:42] Come to the focus groups, come to the open house.

[23:45] I have a lot of things to share but tonight I'm going to go relatively quickly.

[23:50] There are three things that we want to get we want to convey.

[23:54] The most important part of the project which is really the site and the landscaping and the open space.

[24:00] It is a seven and a half acre beautiful piece of land sitting smack in the middle of Yountville.

[24:07] And the most expensive part of the project which is the housing and the buildings.

[24:12] Both have to be successful and neither one can succeed at the expense of the other and we're going to go through all of those all of those pieces quickly in this deck.

[24:23] I'm not going to repeat what I said six months ago.

[24:26] It still feels like a joy and an honor driving up to Yountville working on this.

[24:31] It is definitely a developed plan.

[24:33] You can see what you approved, what you what the town council and what you guys all looked at six months ago.

[24:41] Intimate village character, a lush creek side landscape walkable connected community which is now a clustered village neighborhood.

[24:48] A creek side garden pathway pedestrian folks experience.

[24:52] That's not chat GPT that's just are trying to sort of like make sure that you're under you're aware that you can see like hey that's what I saw last time.

[25:01] And this is what we're looking at there's actually fewer I think one or two fewer buildings not more buildings.

[25:07] Some things are this model in particular is on a piece of foam core as we're trying to prepare a final model.

[25:13] So everything's about 10 or 15 feet higher than it really sort of is scaled but it is a study model.

[25:20] Everything in white is a new building everything in gray and you can see the building that we're in town hall and.

[25:26] Yountville fit and Schmidt Hall and the farm center all in gray because they exist and they're highlighted in red.

[25:32] It's for the people at home sorry the buildings are not 10 or 15 feet higher.

[25:37] I know that you said because it's on foam core.

[25:40] They look higher on the model but they are the same height that what they were shown earlier.

[25:44] Thank you Brad.

[25:45] Nothing's grown.

[25:47] These are all still two and three story buildings throughout and we'll get into those details.

[25:53] This program is way too small for you to see but there is a lot of data about the square footage.

[26:02] Fifty two thousand square feet of of new buildings new condition space.

[26:07] It's about twenty one thousand square feet of footprints for a seven acre site.

[26:11] It's not very big you'll sort of see that in a minute and you can see it kind of just looking at the white buildings on a seven and a half acre site in front of you.

[26:18] I'm showing this mostly to say that come to the appointments and the meetings if you want more specific measured information.

[26:25] That's definitely what we've been trying to do.

[26:30] Copies of what.

[26:31] Now that that will be actually and actually the PowerPoint will be available on the website so everything that you're seeing in the slide deck will be but yeah it's not in that package.

[26:40] It was it was it's not legible at this I just mostly wanted to sort of show a big spreadsheet to make my point.

[26:47] Yeah we'll post the PowerPoint on the website and then you know I guess yeah we can talk about we haven't really finished what all the open house stuff.

[26:57] But you know it's funny as I told them don't put that slide in everyone's going to ask questions but I you know and I think it's it's a conceptual program right.

[27:08] And so but it's important to have the program so that we can start talking about square footage take off so we can start talking about the fact that 90% of the condition indoor space is housing.

[27:18] So that people see kind of okay what the priorities are so.

[27:21] I do think it's an important spreadsheet but I don't want everyone to focus on it like it's locked in and I think that was why I was worried about that slide and you know my worry has proven to be true but.

[27:32] We can answer questions but that will morph you know and I think the key to again the design build team is that someone will come in and look at it and say we can do it more efficient plane than that and that's the goal but maybe this is the most efficient plan that's ever been created and Brendan will become.

[27:47] A legend and workforce housing and these will be replicated throughout the world but I do think it's important.

[27:53] You know to be careful about getting two into the details at this planning stage right.

[27:58] So I included some shots of the model we took this I think last night as we're trying to finish pieces mostly because I realized and the last few meetings I've seen online that you actually can't see the model that it just sort of appears so I want to do include these in the.

[28:14] In the PowerPoint both for the record and so other people could see them the model without having to kind of like you know sort of come and find us.

[28:21] So in the model we're going to we're going to talk about the site there are some foreground architecture pieces in the red arrows indicate some of the.

[28:32] Some of the buildings that we're going to talk about whether it's a building right next to town hall and it's kind of mission revival style other taller buildings that have studio apartments and laundromats which is what the.

[28:43] Upper one is but these buildings even though they're conceptually in white actually have quite a lot of architectural development which we're going to go through tonight.

[28:53] Let's talk about the site these are these are collateral images that lands that are landscape and planning team have been able to kind of like.

[29:03] Show the town and weave into the landscape design that's that's reflected in the current site plan.

[29:09] Everyone will ask about the blue what about the fountains what about the creeks what are what are all these things going through the.

[29:15] Through the the site and runnels are a very old agricultural way George young use them.

[29:21] They're called race ways there there's a lot of different terms but it's a way to get water from rivers and creeks and wells.

[29:28] And we're trying to use this element in a very easy you can see them all through the estate.

[29:34] Where water whether it's hiding the sound of highway 29 or just the sound of neighbors and guests talking.

[29:42] There's a lot of really great examples of runnels that already are here successfully in the outfill and we're trying to replicate this instead of.

[29:50] Fountains or figures or other things like that and some of them are most of them are all quite shallow and they're designed to kind of draw people through the site.

[30:00] Trollesses, do not have to be expensive because they will grow on, they will have a lot of landscape growing.

[30:07] The most expensive and popular floor surface in the world is dappled sunlight. And this project depends a lot on it.

[30:15] There's a lot of great trees on the site. We're trying to increase that quality. A lot of paving details.

[30:22] There's a lot of design around the oval and how you sit on it and how it's used. And the olive orchard that's kind of planned around it to both be a usable functional space.

[30:34] But also a lot of shade. I mean, today is a nice sort of tropical afternoon for September. But we know what young people can be like in September. And you need to be in shade.

[30:43] And that's a big part of the site design.

[30:47] This is the meadow. The meadow is mis meant for recreation, just like a lot of elbow space, where there's a 125 new homes here.

[30:55] That's almost maybe 250, maybe more people living here. They're going to need a little elbow room to run around and not just with dogs.

[31:03] Or, you know, there's a lot of great parks in the outfill. This is part of the lungs and the oxygen that was very popular in the concept design.

[31:11] The dog patch. I definitely, if you want to learn about this design around the dog park come to the focus group about the dog park. We will get into great details.

[31:21] There's passive dogs and active dogs and not the sizes and I think maybe sometimes it's about the people.

[31:27] And those two parts of the design have been sort of split at some request from folks who've enjoyed the dog park, but want a little more separation from active dogs and passive dogs.

[31:41] The plant palette is largely already here with the oak trees and the sick amorous and the postage trees were trying to make sure that not this doesn't look like some weird thing that happened from some other planet.

[31:54] It's supposed to be an extension of largely native palette that's already here in the outfill.

[32:01] Papers. There is less permeable cover in the design we're reviewing tonight than all, then exists because of so much asphalt and concrete surfaces.

[32:13] The school, any elementary school would do. It's not that they were horrible people.

[32:17] It's just when people were designing schools in the 1960s and 70s, they put a lot of asphalt down.

[32:24] And there is no asphalt, not even for parking lots right now in the current concept. Everything is more is permeable to the ground much better for hopper creek itself and for the tree health.

[32:37] This is the street and the edges, whether it's on young street or or this or trying to make.

[32:43] We had a question right before the meeting started tonight. What is the guest house? The guest house is just more apartments. It's just more housing.

[32:51] It's more studios. We couldn't. The design wasn't to put all the housing in the back corner and let everything else kind of be something else.

[33:00] There's a lot of housing. There's 35 units along young street and two or three buildings on the second floor and on the ground floor for accessibility.

[33:09] This is a section of the housing project that is mixed use.

[33:14] So the town has the opportunity later to add a barber shop or you know something else that is a unmet local need that if the town wants.

[33:24] That's the way it's getting zoned but in terms of it's getting built it's just more apartments. It's more housing.

[33:32] And if you don't like the term guest house, you can blame me because I came up with it.

[33:37] There's a lot of furnishings and materials, long tables. I think there's a couple of fire pits.

[33:42] There's, you know, it's there are no private backyards anywhere on this project.

[33:47] So that the park, the park like setting and we tell a lot of people, this is not a housing project next to a park.

[33:55] It's houses in the middle of Youngville's newest park.

[33:59] And and everyone, it's not a 180 degrees. It's just a five degree shift of reality of what the priorities of the town are.

[34:07] And what's more efficient in terms of a cost efficiency and an enjoyable thing.

[34:11] So you don't have to take care of your backyard.

[34:14] That's right next to a park that's absurd.

[34:16] Right. So we're trying to make certain that these outdoor spaces are inviting for residents and visitors and current, whether new or current.

[34:26] The parking groves all the parking, all the parking spaces like the images in the upper right and corner are gravel. You can see them all over Napa County. There's no reason that this project doesn't have them.

[34:39] We've been with commissioners and council members.

[34:42] This is not one of those places where you'll be able to park right in front of your house and walk in.

[34:48] That's not what this is.

[34:50] You're going to like a lot of us have been to Asia or South America or Europe. You will walk some distance from your car. It'll probably take a whole minute.

[34:59] And and it has a lot of mobility mobility options, both cars shared cars or bikes or golf carts.

[35:07] But but there are no structured private parking garages conceived of as part of this, but there is very easily accessible parking in the two groves the north and the south, which are on the on the model.

[35:20] A lot of the water and the paving.

[35:24] There are no curbs in the design anywhere. Curbs are expensive and they sort of separate planting from paving and we're trying to bleed those edges in this concept.

[35:34] Mostly so that it it's very less less institutional and less you know like a college or a hotel so that so that plants just like in your own house go from paving to planting to sort of steps.

[35:48] While everything needs to really accommodate chapter 11 be for accessibility everything needs to be accessible as people roll through whether whatever whatever levels of disability you have.

[36:00] Okay, we showed this which is cat fiddle and North Carolina many many people in our in our first open house said, hey, what's this I like this and I'm and I'm pointing to you to this basic plain metal covered.

[36:15] Simple structure that has shutters we didn't sort of go with shutters but but what this what this building really is is the missing middle and to be able to get the density the 125 units onto this site.

[36:28] We need to get to the missing metal we can't have apartment houses those are expensive to maintain their expensive to build and it doesn't give the town any flexibility on how much and what phasing to build because you can't build just a quarter of an apartment house.

[36:43] We're the 125 units for example right so the strategy here is to make is to find one thing that you can repeat.

[36:50] At a level that you can afford both to rent and to build and to maintain and this was actually from our the feedback that we received from town a very popular model.

[37:01] And you can see obviously this could land anywhere in young fill and be kind of a popular spot the missing middle is not my term it's a very popular issue right now under the 2025 building code.

[37:11] You get eight units in a single stair and that was really our model to use.

[37:16] And that is an example of what these white these white buildings are that's four studios to a ground floor every one of those studios is about 320 square feet.

[37:27] It has a Murphy bad or some ability to you know we've all sort of had studios in college you all know what studios work like.

[37:34] There is very the most the highest need for the fewest available is studio small units because of the housing stock the existing housing stock in Napa Valley.

[37:48] So studios and small one veterans junior ones are are the dominant product that we're making available here now.

[37:56] I mean just some day that those those those those middle walls are not structural but four studios fit on the bottom floor of these of these L shaped buildings and there's 13 of them in the building in the.

[38:08] In the project and we're trying very hard for them to be the same.

[38:13] But not look the same so we've kind of shaken the grid and move them around and they might end up being kind of different surfaces or colors.

[38:22] And this is a sketch that where this started sketches of how you of how you use it how to protect some of the windows.

[38:32] And this is actually from the trail looking back into the into the village center creek side villages what we call this kind of neighborhood of homes and it is mixed income.

[38:43] Even though that studios and one veterans the income is designed to be something that the town is in control of not just like hey it's only for this level of income that would be that's actually against your housing policy by the way.

[38:58] And this is a this is another shot of the corner of the property right as you would come in from the north on hopper creek and how big these houses are.

[39:08] And how important the creek the hopper creek is to make it feel like it's a really successful almost a linear park.

[39:16] When you're sort of going through there it's a very popular walking trail as you know.

[39:21] This is a shot actually looking up the from this shot that from this view when that 1956 building is removed.

[39:30] Looking at a new the new the guest houses of of course on the left and you can see yampville fit and a greenhouse in the distance.

[39:38] But this is actually it will be a new civic space conceived of as a civic activity with with residents with people coming to the health club with people going to the Schmidt Hall you know what this place is like with a hundred kids running around on a summer day those are active uses.

[39:55] This is a shot of young street again apartments on the top and potentially apartments on the bottom but in a mixed use environment the town has the option of of.

[40:05] of leasing them to civic uses and what what they are is for the town to decide we're making them very simple so they can be joined or separated so that so that it can be very active.

[40:17] And or or not it's it's up to the town our job is to make sure that the building can serve several functions and not one specifically not one specific one because the housing is driving the economics and the use for this project.

[40:33] I said project I meant place.

[40:36] That's the site plan and that's the end of my talking this is really what's driving it there's a lot of terminology we use guest house.

[40:45] Mostly because our whole team needed something to say oh you know the how you know the apartments that thing over there on the outside like yeah it's the guest house so everyone.

[40:54] It was our short hand to use it it wasn't meant to be a controversy it's the same kinds of studios that are on the bottom floor of the of the creek side village.

[41:02] Yeah just to thank you first of all you did have a lot to say you said it pretty quickly so I think more to come and I do think the focus groups in terms of where you're interested in you know.

[41:14] But typically how this works and I know you all know this but for those of you that are.

[41:19] No and I want to thank everyone for coming out this is a this is a good crowd for you on fill in terms of you know the journey we've been on but generally speaking.

[41:29] We asked the members to ask clarifying questions so all of you can take around at any questions you have for myself or Brendan you then go to public comment you're not making any decisions today but once you're done with public comment if you want to provide sort of final remarks.

[41:47] You know I are intent which can change through the week but is to show the same presentation away from today.

[41:54] But if we get questions and things that we hear over and over and we want to add a slider to so that people.

[41:59] You know can see things because obviously not everyone's here and we do post this on the web and we do hope that.

[42:04] And I think a lot of people do chime home or or stream is right stream from home.

[42:10] So it's important those that are at home and you know I think that you know understand you know we want to see you here.

[42:16] Seeing the physical model to me is like a little bit of a game changer and I do think like seeing it is is hard it through TV and I think you took some good images of it so thank you.

[42:26] But the three dimensional model I think is and I want to actually thank.

[42:31] Kerry Morgan back there the chief sculptor in 3D artists and I watched her all day trimming trees which was that interesting to see.

[42:39] But I think I want to thank you for for the model because it really is useful tool to understand what we're trying to accomplish here in the out bill.

[42:46] So with that through the chair if you want to ask any clarifying questions before you take public comment we're happy to answer.

[42:51] Great.

[42:52] Thank you both.

[42:55] The one question that I have off the off the cuff is the EBC building I'm imagining that that's some kind of engineering and building management or something.

[43:05] All right that's an executive briefing center.

[43:08] So in essence what that is is a small meeting room that would support town hall but also be available for like what we've done with Schmidt board room if you've been in there.

[43:20] So that's it's a term of of an industry term but it's a small sort of high tech meeting room.

[43:26] It's like the 1200 square feet on the site plan.

[43:29] It's very long.

[43:30] It's about the size of the room.

[43:31] Sorry yeah so EBC is executive briefing center.

[43:35] Thank you.

[43:37] Are there any other questions?

[43:42] I had a question.

[43:43] Can we go to the North Carolina slide?

[43:47] Yes because you just made a comment that I just wanted to.

[43:58] So I think I'll speak for myself but I think I'm speaking for some other people.

[44:03] I think the reason that resonated that building resonated a lot with a lot of people is the well first of all it's just feminism of kind of a Parisian building with the attic apartments.

[44:14] But also that architectural accents and maybe it's not shutters but you mentioned taking away the shutters but I'm hoping that there's it's not too stripped down because I think the charm is in those architectural accents and also the roof shape and so just hoping we hold on to some of that.

[44:36] I am all for the shutters.

[44:39] We've drawn some of the audience and some of the other pieces of these are our sketches.

[44:45] We will happily draw the shutters on here.

[44:49] I think it's actually a-

[44:50] And maybe it's not shutters.

[44:52] Well sorry.

[44:53] It has to be shutters.

[44:54] The reason that we haven't drawn every one of them is that is that the-

[45:00] The center, the center neighborhood building the one kind of the largest one with the public roof

[45:05] garden. It faces west. And everything facing west on this project is going to need sun protection,

[45:13] which is of course why the shutters are there, whether it's in North Carolina or in Napa. So I think

[45:21] there's a lot, we are kind of, make sure that there's a lot of language around window coverings

[45:26] because I agree with you. I think that just because it's work force housing doesn't mean that it can't, you know, a

[45:30] shutter is not a thing in terms of work force housing. The architectural style will benefit from it. So I'm on board.

[45:36] Okay. I would say it's almost more important because if these places are somewhat transient,

[45:43] that you want to make sure that not everybody's bringing in their own sheet to hang over the window or something.

[45:50] Yeah. Yes. Good point. Anybody else?

[45:57] I had a question. Maybe this might be a future train stop. So if I'm getting out of myself, it was mainly

[46:04] just the, given that it's a lot of studios in one bedroom is, are, have you decided in terms of these

[46:12] are for sale units, rentals? I'm just curious about how to manage this plan to back because it's it's

[46:16] very unique to have this volume and density of housing stock in a place like Yongeville. My hunches

[46:22] that it will be welcome and used, but also there's a relative unknown aspect to that for.

[46:28] Yeah. I think we're trying to keep options open, right? Because when you get to funding

[46:34] junction, like you want to have all options open and I do think, you know, phasing and other things

[46:38] or will factor into that. But it is intended to be rental housing. I mean, I'll, I'll start with that.

[46:45] And I think, you know, whether there's enough demand, you know, we'll see, but it will come back to

[46:50] what's the rent, right? And I mean, obviously, the price is of key factor and will it be fill. Our goal is,

[46:59] of course, to build these such that the rents will be not only subsidized, you know, at what we consider to be

[47:07] reenan affordability levels, you know, affordability levels, excuse me, which gets into a

[47:12] whole housing conversation, which we can, we can do over, over tomorrow or the next day, if need be.

[47:18] But I think that what's the market affordability, right? And I do think that measure as one of the

[47:24] key funding sources being considered for this, you know, which is now, you know, $800,000 a year

[47:32] that comes through our hotels into the town to basically build workforce housing, gives us flexibility.

[47:40] So we will work with those numbers, but I do think like, you know, I used to say this a lot more in my previous

[47:47] gig where, you know, if people are looking for, you know, a place, you know, basically when you talk about

[47:53] service workers and students and people that are, that are, you know, struggling with rent, you know,

[47:57] they're not looking to rent or buy. They're looking to rent, right, because they need a place, and,

[48:02] you know, they got a job in Yonville, had a hotel or a restaurant, you know, most of them are commuting in,

[48:08] as we all know, from Balejo or from Backofil or from Beyond. And this is a key issue that needs to be, like,

[48:16] considered, right? So I do think, you know, yes, many people could live here. We talk about service workers,

[48:21] students, seniors, you know, this is not intended to be a family housing project. You know, we have

[48:27] three bedroom, two baths, you know, dwelling units in the valley. We need this, and this is what we need

[48:34] for the people that serve our town. This is definitely not a finger in the air, although I'd probably

[48:41] presented it like that. There's a lot of data around Napa housing sort of studies and stock from the county

[48:48] in particular who have sort of like have measured all these things gone to employers, and it is a very

[48:55] rare developer because of the, the cost per square foot and the rentals. It's just easier to build, you know,

[49:03] 40 things that you can sell or rent, and you have 40 people to worry about instead of 125. And, and they

[49:10] were designing these units so they can be two stories and one and two so that structurally, the, the

[49:16] programming, let's just say it's 20 years from now and all of a sudden, everybody's looking for two

[49:20] bedrooms. These things can't absolutely be converted, which is I think the most important part. We're

[49:26] trying to max it out right now for entitlement purposes so that when, if there is a market in five or

[49:31] 10 years, you're not trying to add things on to buildings, you're trying to, you're breaking down

[49:37] simple device involves. I just have to finish. I'll get the last word on this one. There are

[49:45] such things. We used to call these things mega trends if people remember that book and like the mega trends.

[49:50] Well, a mega trend at least that to me is I don't, I hope it changes, but I don't think it will is,

[49:56] you know, in the US we've gone from 20% of 30% people that live alone. This is a mega trend, right?

[50:02] And I do think there's a lot of factors that play into that, but I do think like we have to recognize

[50:08] that the school is not going to reopen, you know, and I think that's a hard pill for some people to

[50:15] swallow because I think it was such a hard thing when school is closed. I recognize, I remember my

[50:20] grammar school closing in La Jolla, it was like painful, but you have to move forward, right? And I think,

[50:26] you know, the thing that we're trying to do, you know, as we are designing and thinking about the future,

[50:32] you know, is to make sure that this place is a public place. That's why it's called the Commons, right?

[50:38] It's for the common person. So I think that's just philosophically what I think is really important is we try to

[50:45] you know, think about the future. I think this project, you know, part of the idea of foreign-based architecture is that a

[50:51] cannibal in the future, but ultimately the future is now. And we have more service workers in the

[50:56] town than we do residents, arguably. And I think we need to address this. And this isn't me getting the

[51:04] last word on your last word, on my place through that. But you can finish up if you want. I'll just

[51:11] say a quick story. When I graduated my first job at a college was in Boston and I lived in Beacon Hill,

[51:16] which was a really nice old neighborhood if you've been to Boston at all. And what's interesting is that

[51:22] over the 200 years that neighborhood was there, you know, it changed quite a bit. They started as individual

[51:28] town homes, but over, I think, in the 60s, 70s, they started to get divided up. Not all of them, some of them.

[51:35] So you couldn't walk down the street and know which one was a single family versus which one's

[51:39] right up. And it just so happened. I lived in a studio on the second floor of a five-story town home.

[51:47] The top three floors were owned by a family who basically took the three top units and made it back

[51:53] into a family. And then the bottom two were studios. So I experienced that hybrid. And so you build

[52:01] the building, you build the neighborhood, you make it something that people want. And then life will take

[52:07] its course. So I think it's interesting to be on the front side of something like that.

[52:11] I have a comment on the workforce housing and the multi-ownership possibility that I think

[52:20] when you have workforce housing, you have to expect you're going to have more than average turnover

[52:26] because they're young people that are doing interim jobs for summer, interim jobs before they start a

[52:31] university. And when you have multi-owners, it's been my experience that every owner maintains

[52:40] their property differently. It's like a home. Everybody's idea of clean is different. And I think that when

[52:45] you have something that's multi-owners that there have to be strict CC&Rs, de-restrictions,

[52:54] and penalties for those owners that don't maintain the property to the level in which reflex

[53:01] our community. And I think we need to be really mindful about that because people use them as investments

[53:07] and ATM machines, they don't use them as something that we call community or a place.

[53:17] All right, we're ready for public comment. No, but I'd like to say so. Oh sorry, go ahead.

[53:21] So no question, but a comment as well. I think you guys deserve an incredible amount of credit,

[53:26] your team, along with town hall, everybody involved in this project. I've worked on projects before that

[53:31] were a tenth of the size and it took an additional three years to get it to this point. So I think it's

[53:36] incredibly impressive. I think everybody including the audience that home watching should be

[53:41] physically impressed with what you guys have pulled together in a very short amount of time.

[53:45] Yornflos are ready on the map. I think this is a project that is going to put us way above, way above.

[53:51] So Kudos to you. I think it's fantastic. Thank you. It's trying to keep up with Brad. That's the

[53:59] pace that's being said. I did all that, Ken. I did all that. Yeah.

[54:05] All right, are there members of the audience that would like to speak on behalf of

[54:11] themselves or others? Anybody? Come on up to the mic if you'd like to speak if that's

[54:21] all right. We can bring it to you if you're unable, but we'll see you later this week and some out here

[54:31] you guess? Good job. Good job. Thank you. Yes, you do. Kimberley Cook. Yeah, just a couple of questions that

[54:46] come up. A little confusion over, are they all going to be rentals? Because some people were talking about

[54:53] multiple owners. Dr. Nancy. Do you want me to answer that? My understanding, what I heard from

[55:03] the presentation was that they're starting out as rentals. What I heard from my cohort was that if there's

[55:11] ownership involved, they're need to be clear CCNRs. But I think that the answer to that question from

[55:18] presentation if I'm incorrect is starting out as rentals. Let me clarify. And I think it's an

[55:26] important thing for the town to understand the strategy that is being put into place. Even though it

[55:33] looks like one big seven and a half acre parcel, it's being entitled as 18 parcels, much like a subdivision

[55:41] of a neighborhood. And it's not because the town is looking to, you know, all right, we developed it.

[55:47] Let's sell it off to the highest bidder. The idea is that in five years or ten years or however,

[55:51] phasing happens that there's great control the town can have over institutional owners or other kinds

[55:58] of agencies and town, other things like that. So there's a lot of flexibility in terms of the ownership

[56:05] of the land. But in terms of the development and the concept, it's not multiple operators or multiple

[56:12] owners. It's only one operator who has one set of rules and they're going to be pretty strict if

[56:18] I understand, you know, what I'm going to call the Yantville vibe. So it's absolutely rental. That's the

[56:24] question. And the multiple owner pieces that there are multiple parcels to own the way that it's being

[56:32] entitled. Just keeping options open. I guess is where I'm hesitant to give a hard answer. But the answer I

[56:40] gave earlier to me is the primary focus is for workforce rental housing. There has been talk about,

[56:47] you know, what some people refer to as value transfer or what if we sold two units or sold two parcels

[56:53] that then could generally subsidize the lower income stuff. Those are options that I don't want to take

[56:59] off the table. But I do feel like I'm confident, you know, through a phased approach that we can

[57:06] develop this. And we can talk about ownership, but not from a control standpoint, you know, from a

[57:14] funding or from, you know, there might be a business in town as an example that might want to lease

[57:20] eight units, right? So, okay, we'll figure that out economically, rather than, you know, forcing maybe

[57:27] someone who wants to do something to build workforce housing, okay, you can fund workforce housing,

[57:33] but under the control of the town. So I do think that gets into an ownership question and the strategy

[57:39] of having 18 parcels, which is what you'll see when we get to the sequa station, I think we call it.

[57:46] When we get to sequa station, you'll see that each of those parcels provides flexibility for ownership.

[57:51] But it's really in my mind for partnership, you know, it's not like we're just going to like sell off a parcel,

[57:56] so we can raise money to build a building. I think that would be responsible. But I do think opportunities

[58:02] you know, as long as it's meeting the objectives, the mission of the project or something,

[58:08] I don't want to like say no to at this stage. But I think, yeah, I mean, you hear what I'm saying.

[58:15] I'm trying to, I'm trying to create flexibility. I do. Okay, thank you. I know we're not talking

[58:23] about cost yet. There's a lot to like here. It's amazing. But it seems like there's been a lot of

[58:32] really expensive details put into this. Let me respond to that because, you know, and I've said this

[58:40] before to his face, so I don't feel problem. I don't trust designer estimates, you know, cost estimates.

[58:46] It's just this becomes, you know, we do have a construction manager or an owner's rep,

[58:51] Sean Grinnell, a lot of people know pound management. They've been with the town for a long time.

[58:55] So I think we are at a stage where we can at least start at getting some, you know,

[59:00] through Sean contractor estimates, you know, so that we can start talking about the horizontal

[59:04] and the vertical and what a building will cost, et cetera. The term that I like, well, there was two

[59:10] terms actually, you use that I like both of them, but they were frosting and jewelry. And as since

[59:16] this gets into things like, you know, like the shutters or the awnings. And you know, I mean, we all love

[59:21] frosting and jewelry, right? But I don't want to fall in love with it because it's like, can we afford this?

[59:27] And I think this is where, you know, we can, because we're, we're creating a design, you know,

[59:33] that will likely bridge to a design build team. And I think that we want to be clear. And I think what's

[59:39] probably most impressive about this site is where the buildings aren't, right? And this is where the green

[59:45] and the paths and the runnels and all the stuff that, you know, we're not going to compromise. We're also not

[59:50] going to compromise on the jewelry and frosting. I will tell you that. But I feel like this gets to be a point where

[59:54] the council has to make a funding decision. And like, okay, how much jewelry and frosting can we afford?

[1:00:00] I think that's, you know, not a decision I want to make now. I truthfully don't want to put a designer in charge of that.

[1:00:05] Like I need to maintain control so that we have flexibility when that decision comes up.

[1:00:10] But that decision will be part of funding, funding juncture. So when you get to that decision point, you know, this will be, okay, here's where it is, you know.

[1:00:20] And then the funny part, which we didn't get to is lawyer Mountain, you know, is after we make that decision as a council, you know, this is where all the contracts need to be signed.

[1:00:29] You know, which gets into, you know, the builder and gets into the operator, like everything, until you make a funding decision to me is conceptual.

[1:00:37] And then you get to, okay, this is what we're paying for.

[1:00:40] And then obviously the lawyers need to make sure all those dots are, you know, crossed and tees and all that kind of fun stuff.

[1:00:47] But I am committed, you know, as long as I will be here, that there will be beautiful jewelry on these buildings because it's critical to, you know,

[1:00:57] the livability of it, too. You know, whether it's the sheet you brought up or it's just generally to me, like what, you know, what attracted places have, which is kind of a hard thing to define.

[1:01:08] But it is something that will be defined when the funding decision is made so that people know what we're paying for.

[1:01:17] I was one comment about frosty and jewelry is, um,

[1:01:22] the awful isn't a town that has a lot of that and I think that's what makes it so charming. So I don't want to see that over done, but I wasn't really talking about frosty and jewelry.

[1:01:31] I was talking about more like, I'm surprised there's not more density, you know, between a Rhode Island day and hopper create, you know, more shared walls, more units of five.

[1:01:45] You know, instead of single buildings, so I'm a little surprised that only about a third of the property is housing.

[1:01:53] Yeah, it's a good debate. I think that, you know, is obviously a balancing act that's in the eye of the holder. I feel like what we tried to do.

[1:02:01] You know, as a clear main chain open space, there's a big grass, you know, field as we know out there, but I do feel like as we looked at the edges, like we really tried to think of the edges as parks and open space, useable space.

[1:02:14] And I think that, yeah, I mean, this is, again, I don't want to turn this into a debate. And I think clearly, you know, the ZDRB and the community at large can contribute to that.

[1:02:25] We are just for a preview because we were going down, you know, the tracks to sequestation. We are in the project description.

[1:02:33] I'm going to say 150 units because this is a maximum through sequa. So if, you know, down the road, you know, the town council on the ZDRB said, you know what?

[1:02:43] We want to take, we want to squeeze another 25 units somewhere on the site. We will have the ability to do that without having to go through sequa re-entitlement. So we're trying to think about that, but this was just at least in our attempt, the balance that we struck.

[1:02:58] Okay, that makes sense. It just, you don't want to get to the point where you're over promising.

[1:03:04] Yeah, of course.

[1:03:05] And then have to cut way back because funding isn't there.

[1:03:08] Thank you.

[1:03:09] Thank you.

[1:03:12] Anybody else?

[1:03:17] I had a question that I would love to just have you guys walk us through a little bit about what we're in this conceptual conversation.

[1:03:29] Conceptually, as we move into design build companies that are looking at this is, is the idea that certain selection of buildings might be developed by a single developer.

[1:03:44] And then another building might be developed by another is it one developer doing everything.

[1:03:51] And how they're taking this conceptual design and applying their own design to meet it.

[1:04:02] So I'd love to hear you guys just reminate about that a little bit.

[1:04:06] Yeah, I think first of all, I would refer you to the design build policy that was adopted by Council, which defines a lot of the things that you just said.

[1:04:13] I think there's also state law that gets into some of these questions, which, you know, we need to be clear about, but it's complicated in terms of where those bridging documents take you.

[1:04:25] But to the point of the process and you know this because you're part of it and I will tell for the community when we issued the RFQ and so again the RFQ is just asking for firms designed build firms this is a builder and a designer to submit qualifications so we can shortlist them.

[1:04:44] And you along with the chair of, and I know the chair of Prakis here, Alan Tentcher and then the chair of measure as Lisa Bertolucci will be included in the qualifications panel.

[1:04:56] We actually filled this room whenever it was last week.

[1:05:00] So we had like a mandatory site visit where people that are interested in design build can ask questions.

[1:05:08] Which was great, we had the room was full, so there's a lot of interest, but we will see I think Monday we will get the actual design build qualifications and so we will then go through a process with you and the other two chairs of short listing.

[1:05:27] You know qualified teams and then the question which is sort of the core of your question based on funding we'll make a decision like when people say horizontal and vertical I know you know what that means but what what that means to the public is there is a strategy of like hey let's do all the horizontal which is all the infrastructure.

[1:05:45] Let's get all the energy and you know, sewer and everything that's basically not vertical think of it that way done because then you have finished paths and because all of the construction you here is you see here is an essence slab on grade you have what they call engineered paths so a lot of work right engineering the soil making sure that when you pour the concrete like you have.

[1:06:08] Engineering paths so we could decide hey let's do the horizontal I don't want to guess what that number is going to be because there is a builder that is hyper qualified to do the horizontal and a different builder could we would issue different RFP so this would be the RFP.

[1:06:27] It's great so I gotta remember the name of these things but it just to be where you know and I kind of talked about it earlier with Brendan when you get into the blue section this could be a loop you know it could be like three or four loops so it's not like one stop to grand central station we could do the horizontal we could do two versions of the vertical or three.

[1:06:46] There's a lot of ways to slice that up and I do think there are certain builders and for those of you that hopefully have appreciated the fact that we did a road washing street in like three days it is past week that was because the builder good fellow brothers you know and this wasn't a design build thing but they came in.

[1:07:07] Because they don't how to do that like they came in with all their equipment and they did it and I know is irritating to certain people for a day or two days but it wasn't two months.

[1:07:17] I mean that's when we did South Washington it was two to three months for those I wasn't here but I heard the stories right so this is where you make a value judgment with a builder and I do feel like.

[1:07:27] There is an opportunity depending on the funding you know to do the infrastructure because there's a lot to that and I think it's an interesting discussion.

[1:07:37] And then I think as you look at the buildings again you look at the 18 parcels like depending on funding you know there's there's a lot of interesting strategies on the vertical.

[1:07:46] But we will qualify design build teams that are able to do both and it's then our opportunity after we pass funding junction to decide how we want to approach the RFPs.

[1:07:59] Kind of just.

[1:08:01] I just want to add one thing when we're in front of the fire marshal or PG&E they they're happy to talk about phases but they want to talk about the whole project because they don't want to look at half of something.

[1:08:13] Because like oh yeah maybe they'll build the rest of that road or maybe a transformer down here someday that's not how institutions think.

[1:08:19] And so this project for a lot of the public next week is going to feel like oh it's all coming down the pike on all one thing and that's even though we have to sort of plan it that way.

[1:08:32] The the planning stage is really what's feasible and how do you build it in what order and and what's what's logical what can you afford how the rents you know what's the saturation.

[1:08:44] Those are those are really interesting things but right now we're trying to show everybody everything so nobody says like oh you're hiding.

[1:08:52] You know behind something or hey what's going on over there so we wanted to make sure that from a trust standpoint.

[1:08:57] We're showing you entire project even though the funding and the and the phasing of it is very much in the in the wind.

[1:09:05] With flexibility built in.

[1:09:08] Yes of course absolutely.

[1:09:10] Okay that's what is getting out.

[1:09:12] What would you expect the build out time to be on the project from the time and and everything's done it started it where it's actually built out and.

[1:09:22] The work force housing is available and the landscaping's in what are we talking years we're talking years what I'll show you on your handy dandy train guide here we actually did make the decision to put dates so you'll see in parents.

[1:09:37] But this is the dates here are based on us building it basically.

[1:09:42] The two phases which would be horizontal and vertical if we face the vertical this is too ambitious okay but this shows 2008 as the time.

[1:09:52] 2020 excuse me total flashback there.

[1:09:57] In 2008 where we would be able to you know again if we did it just in those two phases so.

[1:10:04] You know this requires that you know obviously you know the council.

[1:10:08] You know makes decisions at all the decision points in the front so there's a lot that goes into that so I hate to be presumptuous especially with the council because there's there's going to be these value judgments that are going to have to be made based on.

[1:10:21] What are all four trains of the four rail cars of the train and I think.

[1:10:26] You know I just think it's doable the construction because it's slab on grade and because you know the other thing we didn't get into but when you look at.

[1:10:36] Two of these buildings you'll you'll see there's sort of tout we're not towers but there's elevator course.

[1:10:42] You know having built a lot of things and you know obviously having worked with.

[1:10:49] You know we're trying to really keep it simple and I think you know I've said to people like these elbow buildings if I was in the private sector.

[1:10:56] And had a good good contractor I could build those and probably six to nine months like but this is the public sector so you have to be realistic about some of the.

[1:11:04] You know challenges we deal with but it's really designed to move quickly but I also will just keep emphasizing flexibility as relates to funding and phasing and I think.

[1:11:15] That what you see here it was another thing I was reluctant to just like the program sheet where I said and we want to put dates because then people see.

[1:11:23] Twenty twenty twenty eight okay everything's going to be done when we move in can I get on the waiting list.

[1:11:28] You know those are the questions you get from a certain demographic and I don't want to over promise so you know that's the answer but just understand the.

[1:11:36] You know the flexibility and the phasing is is a huge part of giving that answer.

[1:11:46] Excellent.

[1:11:49] What else do we need to cover are there you need to come to the open house and if you're interested again in any of those specific subjects.

[1:11:58] Branding can talk about energy for hours it's it's actually fascinating it really is like if you want to get into kilowatts per hour and what we're trying to accomplish in terms of the sustainability of this site come to the sustainability focus group.

[1:12:12] If you want to talk about parking you know then.

[1:12:16] Come to the mobility group but I love to I love talking about parking parking is another great subject now I.

[1:12:22] You know staying engaged I mean I'm glad a lot of people are here I think it's.

[1:12:27] You know next week at in this room at one o'clock you know we'll have our elected officials and decision makers in the room.

[1:12:35] You know I think it's important you know we we've tried very hard from the beginning to you know obviously work through the council but then there's.

[1:12:42] You know the ZDRB the measure S group the PRAC we're going to go to them so if you're interested in any of those.

[1:12:48] You know specifics you know show up and share your interest and obviously you always have the citizenry at large which is.

[1:12:54] This huge foundation we try to build off of but.

[1:12:57] You know the town council ultimately needs to you know make the decisions at the points outlined on the train so recognize those are ahead and you know contribute as much as you.

[1:13:09] You know have the capacity to do but thank you for everyone coming and and I want to go ahead.

[1:13:15] We tried to finish public comment but go ahead and come on.

[1:13:18] Hi Megan Mason yeah I feel.

[1:13:21] This is impressive impressive and I guess a little overwhelming to me from when I first started coming to some of the sessions and.

[1:13:33] I don't know I guess I have a question I didn't think it was going to be so big I thought it was going to be 70.

[1:13:40] We talked about all kinds of numbers during the let's just say ideation Canyon or wherever that was but it ended up being 100 it's 95 in the back.

[1:13:53] In the Greek side village and 35 in the guest house up front on young street.

[1:13:59] And that and that 95 is between you know where the farm sand is and the and the food hub all the way to the corner.

[1:14:06] If I can just offer something real quick because because I think as a bonus I know Brandon loves to sit around the model and talk about it.

[1:14:14] And so I think for questions you know again I we're trying to at least finish a formal meeting and I do think I'm happy to want some meeting off the thing is and you can finish but I think like.

[1:14:25] This is kind of the interaction that's really intended to be for the one on one where you can come in and say well what about this what about that.

[1:14:32] But you know again I don't want to short circuit anything but I feel like once we're done running if you want to hold court again because I said when I came in I saw there was a lot of people.

[1:14:42] I think those kinds of conversations are really.

[1:14:45] Yeah important but I do think.

[1:14:49] Whenever you're done we should you know it's in essence finished because there's also people that are at home trying to listen and I think it gets hard when it's the.

[1:14:59] I think.

[1:15:00] I'll just do this. But please finish your comments and questions.

[1:15:05] I'll cut back there. I guess one thing I just kind of relating to Carol, it said, how does it's going to be beautiful initially?

[1:15:15] And if it is workforce housing, how does it all continue to be maintained and the cost of it and how does this still be an inclusive to the residents who aren't living there and we're feeling like

[1:15:29] maybe it's not where we can pick me. Pick me. Pick me. Pick me. I want to answer that question.

[1:15:35] Excellent. I'm going to thank you, Megan. I have a feeling we're going to see a lot of you tomorrow.

[1:15:44] And I welcome it. Really, you know, you can tell. I love talking about these things.

[1:15:52] So, I'm going to go back to the train, there we go. There's a train station right here of operator onboarding.

[1:16:01] Whether town develops it or it's a flag for a hotel, a barge, a montage, whatever.

[1:16:08] Somewhere along the development line, especially around hospitality, whether you're selling real estate or renting it by the night.

[1:16:15] The operator who is going to set the expectations, not for opening day, but for, you know, ten years down, is a critical part of this process.

[1:16:25] Doesn't matter if it's town owned or you've partnered with a housing developer, somebody needs to operate it. The goal is to find somebody who will operate workforce housing at a lower rate than a higher rate, because, you know, you get to do more for more workforce.

[1:16:41] So, this, this, this, this stop up here, operator operations is the answer. That's, that's some, that's when somebody can, all of a sudden arrive who knows exactly what to do when all of us have gone.

[1:16:53] And you're still here and you're wondering, like, how come they can't put the garbage back or, you know, all those, how come the bikes are everywhere.

[1:17:00] All those really good questions. It's the reason around public transit and public housing, the rules and the enforcement of just basic rules are a big part of the success.

[1:17:10] The operator onboarding is part of the process for this project.

[1:17:14] Yeah, and I'm happy to keep going, but let me try to get last word, but just, you have, I want to finish something that, because I worry, again, when you say certain things, and then people hear them and I, I have to respond.

[1:17:28] We're not building a hotel, okay, the guest house is not a hotel, okay, and I know, because you build hotels, you talk about flags, you know, which may or high at these are all flags that are operators.

[1:17:38] Okay, so we're not doing that. I, I said, bringing us all the way back to station one and if you listen to that whole meeting, and by the way, we're going to post the whole meetings. It's 13 hours, by the way, if you want to listen to it all.

[1:17:50] So, for those, Alan Tentures, which I, I do thank, you know, he was in the room, tried for everyone.

[1:17:58] One of the things that was said in that meeting was when we bought the site, we bought control.

[1:18:04] And I think controls this word, and I can, it's a power and control, but I think what was meant, you know, by people that said that, is we will own the site as the town. This will always be my recommendation.

[1:18:16] We can partner with people, we can do things like y'all feel fit and do things that, to me, are in the benefit of the town, but we aren't going to sell the site so that we lose control.

[1:18:26] And I think this gets core to the issue. And as long as I'm here, that will never be my recommendation. So, I think we can talk about operating or onboarding, which is key, because it's really property management.

[1:18:38] But I do think that when you look at that, my goal would be to have someone, this is by the end of the year, that we are working with, but we actually wouldn't sign a management contract till we climb lawyer mountain.

[1:18:51] So, this is like, we need someone that we're working with, that can help us with the performance, help us talk about how it's going to be operated.

[1:19:00] Because the town won't, I mean, we can maintain the landscape and do everything because you've seen what we've already done to make it a much more beautiful spot.

[1:19:07] But I think we will work with the property management firm, because we're not going to, I'm not going to run a housing development. This is not core to, you know, the town's civic duty.

[1:19:19] But we will have a property manager that understands what we're trying to achieve. So, I just want to get us off the hotel thing.

[1:19:26] Yes, House is not a hotel. I do a lot of, but I do think it's a really good question. So, I'm not going to do that.

[1:19:33] Yes, House is not a hotel. Yes, thank you. The barriers will not run the guest house.

[1:19:39] All right.

[1:19:41] Judith Caldwell, I want to fill. I am concerned about not having the financial yet. I'm also concerned about the speed of this extremely large project.

[1:19:57] If a private person brought a project of one sixth this size, it would take a long time. The church took several years.

[1:20:12] And so Rome was not built in the day.

[1:20:19] And I also I'm concerned about the beautiful buildings correct me from wrong. Did you say eight units with one staircase three stories?

[1:20:30] In California, the maximum you can do with one with one stairway is eight units. Yes.

[1:20:37] Is that we'll have?

[1:20:39] All of those L shape buildings are right now one stairway with seven units. That's the current design.

[1:20:46] There are rental properties throughout Napa Valley that are beautifully rented to work force housing people.

[1:20:58] One bedroom I've seen with mother and a father three children and two mothers, the mother of the mother and mother of the father.

[1:21:12] So that would be seven people in a one bedroom apartment. Will you regulate the number of people in those small buildings?

[1:21:25] You can. Yes, but we're not this is not the point to have a dialogue with the design team again. I think like please come to the next few meetings. I'm happy to have conversations with you.

[1:21:37] But yeah, of course, there are lots of housing laws. You can't overcrowd on and on. But I think, you know, please come and we can get into the, you know, again, we're not making a financial decision.

[1:21:48] I know people are we've been doing this for a year and a half. I do think there's certain people and I think everyone understands and I know your family's in development time is money we're spending money.

[1:21:57] We can take as much time that the council tells us to and I will be clear to them how much that will cost them.

[1:22:02] And I think there are certain people that worry about the costs that are being spent, you know, as we plan things and then there's other people that are worried about what it's going to cost to build them.

[1:22:11] So I recognize in my job, I've never going to please everyone, right? It's impossible.

[1:22:15] And I think some people want us to slow down, some people want us to speed up.

[1:22:18] I'm trying to take us out of pace where the council can make those decisions.

[1:22:22] But we will follow every law that it required to and I do feel like there is so much to housing law that is something we could, we could have a housing focus group if we chose to.

[1:22:35] And I'm happy because I ran a housing authority for 15 years. I can talk about it, you know, as long as you want to.

[1:22:42] And I think what we're trying to do is what we said today, trying to create flexibility, we're trying to move this train down the track so we can keep making progress.

[1:22:50] Because what you see too often, I hopefully everyone sees this in government, you know, we run in circles.

[1:22:55] And then all of a sudden we start over because something different happens.

[1:23:00] And then I think the fact that the Planning Commission's EDRB, you know, is sort of acknowledging the progress.

[1:23:06] This is just a progress report. And I think it's, you know, it's an important point in time where the community can see what we've done.

[1:23:13] And I think I want to hear from everyone, this is an earnest sort of plea to come out over the next day and have this conversation.

[1:23:21] And then yeah, in front of your elected officials a week from today, you know, please do it again so they can hear directly from you.

[1:23:28] And if you have concerns, you know, I know that I will do my best to explain things, but there is.

[1:23:37] We trust that that this EDRB and that our council will with a fine tooth comb go through every design.

[1:23:50] Point and every financial element that's necessary for this project so that the people who live here and work here can move forward with great trust.

[1:24:03] Yes. Thank you.

[1:24:04] You're welcome.

[1:24:06] Thank you, Judith.

[1:24:08] Okay. I would like to make a plug. I've been to some of your meetings and the dinners and I think they're really, really incredible forum for people to presence the concerns that they have about the CC and ours or about the density or about any of the different.

[1:24:31] I'm sorry.

[1:24:32] Mary had subjects that they come up in this process and I think what I've experienced is that Brennan and his team are really good at listening and adapting and relating to those issues.

[1:24:47] So I feel strongly that the more people that come out and the more our voices are heard or community voices are heard.

[1:24:58] It's just going to make a better project a better, a better place. Sorry.

[1:25:03] We do love a crowd at CDRB so please come. Yes, as well.

[1:25:08] We do.

[1:25:09] All right.

[1:25:11] That having been said, there are no administrative items for us to discuss and do we have a staff report?

[1:25:22] I will just make note that a sent environmental who was the consultant that prepared the regional climate action and adaptation plan will be presenting that draft plan to the town council next Tuesday at the regulatory scheduled meeting.

[1:25:35] And the public comment period for that draft regional climate action and adaptation plan ends at the end of the month.

[1:25:41] So it's important for everybody to tune into that.

[1:25:44] Great. Thank you.

[1:25:48] With that, does anyone want to move to adjourn this meeting?

[1:25:53] I make a move to adjourn the meeting.

[1:25:56] Our second.

[1:25:57] All right. All in favor.

[1:25:58] All right.

[1:25:59] Hi.

[1:26:00] Thank you.

[1:26:01] Thank you all for coming.

Sep 09, 2025 Zoning and Design Review Board (ZDRB) Meeting

Agenda

Transcript