[0:00] foreign

[0:04] curbside trash committee meeting on

[0:06] Thursday April 6th 6 p.m in the veterans

[0:09] room uh roll call Council marketing is

[0:12] here

[0:12] the concert Steve is on his way uh

[0:15] Health direct inspector Daniel suik is

[0:18] on his way as well we had another

[0:19] meeting we were at for the health member

[0:21] Daniel globalski yeah assistant member

[0:24] Kevin Buxton President Steve Gregoire

[0:26] president Mark LaToy here Kathy boner

[0:29] here

[0:30] a personal owner of Liz are minutes of

[0:34] the March 16th 2023 everybody have a

[0:36] chance to look at them

[0:39] anything okay with them

[0:41] [Music]

[0:46] I'm doing them

[0:49] you want to take a minute to look at him

[0:51] that's fine

[0:54] uh I pretty much follow I I'm recording

[0:57] it so everybody knows I am recording the

[0:59] meeting so I'm kind of following it

[1:00] along

[1:03] [Music]

[1:08] so I think you could tell by the end I

[1:10] was just saying further discussion I was

[1:13] getting tired

[1:15] [Music]

[1:17] foreign

[1:23] [Applause]

[1:35] curbside trash collection Southbridge

[1:37] before we start doing any votes I just

[1:40] want to do a quick recap of what we've

[1:42] talked about so far and then I'd like

[1:44] everybody if you'd like to speak that's

[1:46] fine uh back in November we started this

[1:49] committee our charge was basically just

[1:53] to look explore pay as you throw that

[1:56] was all right that was our only charge

[1:58] however what the discussions that became

[2:01] apparent that pay as you throw program

[2:03] would not be enough to cover the cost so

[2:05] we started looking at other costs so

[2:08] property tax flat fee Enterprise fund or

[2:12] a user fee pay as you throw in December

[2:15] our first order of business was the

[2:17] discussion of the survey to send out

[2:19] with the census the survey was created

[2:22] we also the IT department created the

[2:25] website excuse me and we also talked

[2:28] about building issues with the

[2:30] assessor's office by January we were

[2:32] discussing the RFP draft with the

[2:35] creation of an Enterprise fund with

[2:37] McCall and harness Ms harnoy's made some

[2:40] comments about

[2:41] associating an Enterprise fund for

[2:43] curbside would be self-sustaining

[2:45] funding would cover all expenses she

[2:49] also thought it would be easier to do a

[2:51] tax general fund because of her concerns

[2:54] about enforcement what happens if people

[2:56] don't pay

[2:58] then in later in January Miss gong and

[3:01] then discuss pay as you throw options

[3:03] explained how it worked cost of the bags

[3:06] and savings

[3:07] we started the discussion of a flat fee

[3:10] Mr Gregor presented a draft of his plan

[3:12] by the end of January there was an

[3:15] update of RFP Miss congen raised the

[3:17] billing issue again billing department

[3:19] private billing staffing issues we are

[3:22] talking about a potential cost to

[3:24] residents for bags we spoke about

[3:27] possibly using some royalty funds which

[3:29] right now is at 3.9 million there was a

[3:32] discussion with Mr Mr Gregor's funding

[3:36] options in February we did survey

[3:38] results started to come in we spoke

[3:41] about the user fees or number one

[3:44] which is a pay as you throw bag taxes

[3:46] with number two flat view is number

[3:48] three most of the respondents for

[3:51] homeowners and renters most of the Town

[3:54] information was gathered from mailers

[3:55] social media and the town websites many

[3:58] residents attended our meetings and said

[4:00] they would did not have enough

[4:01] information information about the cost

[4:04] to make a a decision and there were

[4:07] questions about the toters we are

[4:09] keeping the toners uh in March waste

[4:12] zero representative came here and gave

[4:14] us a presentation on the bag program

[4:17] there was further discussion on the RFP

[4:19] uh we have three interested haulers at

[4:22] the time Casella waste management and

[4:24] Republic

[4:25] we also talked about the survey results

[4:28] again

[4:29] user fee was again number one flat fee

[4:32] became number two and taxes was number

[4:35] three

[4:36] I went out in March and talked to the

[4:38] seniors I talked to Latino groups I

[4:40] talked to the downtown partnership Miss

[4:42] Condon was there Mr gravoski was there

[4:45] at the meetings I reached out to the

[4:47] landlords and I've reached out to the

[4:49] churches about this program March 16th

[4:53] we approved applying for a community

[4:54] compact prep for a cost benefit analysis

[4:58] if we end up doing a a flat fee

[5:00] Enterprise fund we are going to have to

[5:02] have a benefit analysis done on a what

[5:06] it would take to start an Enterprise

[5:07] fund we had a presentation on billing

[5:11] from Francine Ireland we looked at the

[5:15] user survey results again user fee was

[5:17] still number one it's been number one

[5:19] all along taxes and flat fee was pretty

[5:22] close to each other

[5:24] again we discussion of the RFP we did a

[5:27] straw poll since our last meeting we

[5:29] have received additional rfps and

[5:32] additional updates on the survey

[5:34] my plan is to address the council Monday

[5:38] April 10th at 7 pm if any of the

[5:41] committee members want to attend that

[5:42] meeting you are welcome to attend I'd

[5:45] welcome you to be there and I will let

[5:47] you I think you should all if you want

[5:48] to speak to the council I think that is

[5:52] would be a good idea Miss congen if you

[5:55] would like to be there it might be

[5:56] beneficial if you were there as well I

[5:58] believe that this committee is on

[5:59] schedule according to my notes from our

[6:02] very first meeting you had scheduled

[6:04] April to look at the RFP in details

[6:11] so here we are tonight we're going to

[6:15] start we're going to speak about what

[6:17] this committee wants to do as far as far

[6:19] as the different programs

[6:21] so I've taken a look at all all the

[6:23] programs and I'll let everybody speak as

[6:25] well we looked at the user fee where the

[6:28] town would purchase Tom bags such as

[6:30] colored bags with a down seal uh we we

[6:34] talked about the cost and ranges from a

[6:36] buck and a half to two and a half bucks

[6:37] for a 33 gallon bag a dollar to 1.25 for

[6:42] a smaller bag

[6:44] the bags are usually sold in 10 bag

[6:45] rolls

[6:47] we would be keeping the toters so the

[6:49] bags that the residents would purchase

[6:52] would go inside the toters the pay as

[6:55] you throw

[6:56] saves a ton of money by reducing trash

[6:58] it reduces disposal costs

[7:01] they say that there's most communities

[7:04] that start this they see a 30 percent

[7:06] drop in their trash

[7:08] most of the residents who responded to

[7:10] this survey

[7:12] overwhelmingly chose pay as you throw as

[7:15] an option but as we know pay as you

[7:17] throw would not be enough to cover the

[7:20] entire cost of our utility bill I mean

[7:23] now you tell you though I'm in the trash

[7:24] program so then we looked at a flat fee

[7:28] such as a utility bill would be paid

[7:30] quarterly like water and sewer sewer the

[7:34] pros of a flat fee is that it's fairer

[7:37] than a property tax it's not based on

[7:39] their property values if you have three

[7:41] Apartments there would be three bills

[7:43] correct yeah

[7:45] and then also as a dedicated funding

[7:48] source the con in my opinion told flat

[7:50] feet per state law homeowners can opt

[7:53] out

[7:54] the more residents opt out potentially

[7:56] the greater cost of those who don't opt

[7:58] out it's also difficult for the hauler

[8:01] to set a price when he's not sure of the

[8:03] number of people that are in the program

[8:06] uh however a homeowner if he does opt

[8:09] out would have to provide proof that

[8:10] their crash is being picked up by a

[8:13] licensed private hauler and I did have

[8:15] some questions about that

[8:17] if they have a dumpster is that enough

[8:20] proof or if they use a transfer station

[8:22] is that proof enough that they they need

[8:24] to give you a receipt of who where

[8:26] they're going all right

[8:27] and it really cannot be you can't have

[8:30] any legal transfer station to say then

[8:31] bring it to work that that's not it and

[8:34] then the final option is a property tax

[8:36] homeowners cannot opt out curbside

[8:38] programs paid for profit attacks since

[8:40] every homeowner pays including the

[8:43] businesses the prowess of it is that the

[8:46] trash will get picked up the con it's

[8:48] based on the value of your home whether

[8:50] you have one family or three family you

[8:53] all pay the same the the issue with flat

[8:57] fee and property taxes is that there's

[8:59] no incentive to the risk to reduce the

[9:01] trash so it's good to have a bag program

[9:03] to help reduce the trash so now I'll go

[9:06] around the room and if anybody wants to

[9:08] speak go right ahead we'll start with

[9:10] you Mr burlesque just for the reasons

[9:12] you said about the opting out people can

[9:15] opt out that that really scares me

[9:16] because you know people are going to do

[9:17] that

[9:20] I don't care what my neighbor's house is

[9:23] worth I just want I just want a peace of

[9:25] mind also my trash is going to get

[9:27] picked up

[9:28] the one reason why that's really like

[9:31] I've never had a problem where it hasn't

[9:33] been picked up if you have a flat feet

[9:35] it's going to work out it's mostly the

[9:38] time when we have issues with

[9:39] communities that haven't had a program

[9:40] like Oxford does not have a town program

[9:43] not knowing how many households is an

[9:47] issue when they were looking at going to

[9:49] a curbside program you have carts on the

[9:52] ground we know how many households are

[9:54] in town that is so a hauler is not

[9:57] coming in here blindsided going oh is

[10:00] this going to be

[10:01] this many households or that many houses

[10:03] because you have private subscription

[10:06] um that is not the case for Southbridge

[10:08] the cost between your contract cost and

[10:11] a private subscription is dramatic so

[10:14] residents that choose not to participate

[10:16] it's only going to be a very few

[10:20] and it's very unlikely and really would

[10:23] not impact

[10:25] the cost that greatly if you're just

[10:27] having a few

[10:28] households are

[10:31] so if it goes to the flat feed so

[10:33] basically the Town Council hammers this

[10:35] out and that's it and then it goes to

[10:37] the people

[10:38] right so that in other words the people

[10:40] don't have any say about that other than

[10:41] what the Town Council gives them am I

[10:43] correct if it goes to attacks

[10:46] right other than that it doesn't go on a

[10:48] ballot it does not so you're telling

[10:49] people in this town this is the trash

[10:51] this is the way it is if it's a flat

[10:53] feet there's

[10:56] what happens if taxes get shot down at

[10:59] Council and then we start over no no you

[11:02] can't start over you go to private trash

[11:04] tell the truth

[11:05] private trash

[11:07] and there's a mess so you can't do that

[11:09] so we can't start over there's not

[11:12] enough time yeah the most important but

[11:15] either way whatever we decide I'll go

[11:16] with because I'm not gonna know whatever

[11:18] you can drive to people vote for that's

[11:20] what I'll go for it because I have no

[11:22] choice

[11:22] but the real biggest thing is about the

[11:25] enforcement of all this is right now we

[11:27] don't have the recycling because because

[11:30] um we have these bins that are overfill

[11:32] because nobody nobody you know you can

[11:34] see the bottles coming out of the trash

[11:36] who's gonna who's gonna take care of

[11:37] that so we have to go with the pays you

[11:40] throw a bag program in a cart then the

[11:43] when it gets flipped over you will see

[11:46] what your color that you pick and then

[11:48] they write down it what it is so I just

[11:50] did a video on that for um what is being

[11:54] done in Fall River and in Upton and so

[11:57] those two communities have that and they

[11:59] can easily and then she writes a letter

[12:00] and yeah but who's automatically who's

[12:03] gonna do that right there needs to be

[12:05] another person what we kind of talked

[12:07] about there we need to have at least two

[12:09] people so you're gonna have to hire

[12:10] somebody we already discussed that that

[12:11] was perfect I just want to make

[12:13] everything clear just so like what's

[12:15] going on yeah yeah so that's pretty much

[12:17] it okay

[12:20] um

[12:21] so I think my point has been

[12:23] quasi-consistent along the way here

[12:26] um

[12:27] I was looking at a few options as far as

[12:29] taxes and

[12:31] uh what Flappy would look like and just

[12:34] you know a real quick number if the

[12:36] town's budget incorrectly if I'm wrong

[12:37] is in and around 50 million dollars

[12:39] right is that about right the annual

[12:41] operating budget for the town

[12:51] tax increase approximately to raise two

[12:54] million dollars

[12:55] so on a 400 000 house which a lot of the

[12:58] nice houses in this town are worth with

[13:00] this Market 400 000 you're going to pay

[13:02] an extra sixteen hundred no three

[13:04] percent less than that

[13:06] thirteen hundred bucks a year in tax for

[13:09] your average single family home

[13:10] for your one bag of trash and your

[13:13] average multi-family which has a lower

[13:14] value because they just don't look as

[13:15] nice they're gonna pay

[13:18] eight hundred dollars a year eight

[13:19] hundred dollars for tax for trash

[13:21] completely unfair in my opinion the more

[13:24] Equitable option will be a flat fee I've

[13:27] got some different ideas what a flat

[13:28] view would look like but in the end it

[13:29] won't be my choice and I'm really torn

[13:32] down the line even walking into tonight

[13:33] if we should go straight flat feet

[13:35] or flat fee with a partial offset in

[13:37] bags

[13:39] I like the idea of adding bags to it

[13:41] because it gives people that don't use

[13:43] as much trash a chance to save on the

[13:45] program

[13:46] however

[13:48] the Democratic demographic in this town

[13:50] bothered me I think you're gonna have

[13:52] people trying to find ways to cheat the

[13:54] system or plain old dumping it on the

[13:55] sidewalk it worries me I know I'm not

[13:58] going to be that way and most of us here

[13:59] in the room aren't going to be that way

[14:00] but we all know who we're talking about

[14:02] here

[14:04] um and I don't want to see that happen

[14:06] so I'm torn whether I want to go or vote

[14:09] for a flat fee or a flat fee with bags

[14:11] um but you know Dan I know we don't

[14:13] agree on this but I do want I think it's

[14:15] great that we we're pretty civil up here

[14:16] right thank you absolutely that's that's

[14:19] all I have okay

[14:20] Kathy

[14:22] I'm still torn I mean

[14:24] you know we raise the taxes

[14:27] working with the elderly like I do

[14:29] nobody can afford it I'm sorry

[14:33] I mean a collection

[14:35] I'm thinking more along the lines at

[14:38] this point than Steve is with maybe the

[14:40] flat feet if we can keep that low and go

[14:43] with the bags as well

[14:46] [Music]

[14:47] I mean I can't afford an increase in

[14:50] taxes like that can you not talk while

[14:52] somebody else is speaking please I mean

[14:53] I couldn't afford an increase in taxes

[14:55] like that either I mean what the heck

[14:57] I'm still a part I'm I'm part of the tax

[14:59] rebate program and I'm you know trying

[15:01] to get my hours in just so I can get

[15:03] something taken off

[15:05] um to help decrease that cost but if we

[15:07] have to go I'm I'm with both at that

[15:10] point

[15:11] and I know that most of the seniors

[15:14] we've talked to have said no they'd just

[15:16] rather do it with the taxes because they

[15:18] just can't get out there to do it any

[15:20] otherwise and they and they can't afford

[15:23] it it's a hard it's a hard cross and I

[15:27] mean if we only knew how many seniors we

[15:29] did have in this town as far as you know

[15:31] who couldn't couldn't afford it those I

[15:33] talked to Camp well we got four up here

[15:35] well yeah that's true

[15:38] and their houses are nice

[15:40] are you all set Kathy in our assessment

[15:43] shows are you also important yes I am

[15:45] Council Steve's we're talking about the

[15:47] different plans what you want to go with

[15:49] yeah we haven't voted yet we're just

[15:51] speaking about it well I'm inclined to

[15:53] think of

[15:54] um

[15:55] I tend to like the idea of doing the

[15:58] bags but I can understand what a lot of

[16:01] people are saying and unfortunately I

[16:03] walk in the middle of the conversation

[16:04] upstairs

[16:06] um but from the previous conversations

[16:07] we've had I can also understand

[16:10] obviously we need to talk about this

[16:12] some sort of a funding that will cover

[16:16] pretty much everybody because the uh the

[16:19] cost and and I totally I totally

[16:21] understand what you're saying Kathy

[16:23] um about there's so many people out

[16:25] there who do not really

[16:27] I don't think they really know how much

[16:29] they can afford and a lot of people

[16:31] already can't afford it I know I can't

[16:34] um

[16:36] it's

[16:39] we're not voting yet we're just talking

[16:40] about right now I know I get it and uh

[16:43] some of the numbers we've already been

[16:44] throwing around just even with the the

[16:46] tax rates that we've seen to date

[16:50] um plus some of the other stuff that we

[16:52] know is coming down the pike or right

[16:55] kill a whole bunch

[16:57] um

[16:58] but we need to do all of this stuff so

[17:00] what how do we how do we balance these

[17:02] needs

[17:03] that's really the kind of Crisis we're

[17:04] in right now

[17:07] okay

[17:09] what's up for the moment all right

[17:14] um well I'm I'm uh

[17:17] I'm in favor of the service charge or

[17:20] flat fee uh I'm inflated I'm in favor of

[17:23] um at least some kind of escalation for

[17:27] multi-families even if it's a small

[17:29] amount in other words if and when we get

[17:32] the numbers and we can actually figure

[17:34] out what it's costing a single family

[17:35] home let's say if it's costing a single

[17:38] family home uh fifty dollars a quarter

[17:42] ah two families they should be paying 55

[17:46] just a 10 increase the person right

[17:50] three families per unit three families

[17:53] same situation just 55. at least you're

[17:56] making that extra additional money for

[17:58] these multi-families

[18:01] um but then again we need to look at the

[18:04] percentage how many single family what

[18:06] percentage of single families and

[18:07] multi-families do we have how many units

[18:10] do we have in multi-families and how

[18:13] will that change the numbers

[18:16] um as far as the service fee I think the

[18:20] service fee should cover

[18:21] 95 of the cost of the RFP

[18:26] the bags which I will agree I I cannot

[18:29] deny that bags would correct

[18:33] the the trash problem we've had in this

[18:36] town ever since we've started curbside

[18:38] pickup

[18:40] so I have to in some way say yes it has

[18:44] to be a very low cost bag I agree uh

[18:47] that's one of the reasons why we we

[18:48] gather all our Revenue we need in the

[18:52] service fee right and the bags are just

[18:55] maybe can be considered an inflation

[18:57] control for as the Enterprise fund

[19:01] builds up we have additional cash to

[19:03] cover either inflation or additional

[19:06] operations like transfer stations

[19:09] whatever but um as fast taxes go the

[19:13] only reason I see a tax item

[19:16] in the trash pickup is if you want to

[19:19] guesstimate just guess the myth what it

[19:22] costs the municipal properties to be

[19:25] picked up

[19:26] yes you could put a line item for

[19:29] um

[19:31] Municipal trash pickup and add that to

[19:34] the Enterprise fund but it shouldn't be

[19:37] an amount that needs to go to the voters

[19:39] it should just be a line item

[19:42] and that's pretty much what I expect

[19:44] okay all right Mark I think that

[19:48] um I don't know forever being on for

[19:50] being on my first committee I there's a

[19:53] lot of stuff that went through my head

[19:54] first is that

[19:58] I've seen Irene and I've seen the person

[20:02] from way zero come here and their

[20:04] salesman for the vet program they're

[20:06] funded buy bags

[20:08] your pushing the back program I've seen

[20:10] the back program be pushed I've also

[20:12] heard about a camera on the top of

[20:14] garbage truck for the first time ever

[20:15] that can spot a tick on a squirrel's

[20:18] behind from 100 yards how have we not

[20:21] enforced anything now yeah it's funny

[20:23] but it's not how have we not enforced

[20:25] one thing right now and you're telling

[20:28] me by Chain by changing the color of our

[20:30] bag all of a sudden this do-it-all

[20:32] camera is going to solve all of

[20:34] suffrage's trash problems there's no way

[20:38] that bag is going in there and it's

[20:40] going off and now we have bags which

[20:44] they can change the rate on the bags and

[20:46] you have something else whether it's a

[20:48] flat fee or taxes now you have two

[20:50] different animals that the town can

[20:53] raise that you you gave the town two

[20:56] ways to raise money they can raise the

[21:00] bags if there's a shortfall or they can

[21:02] change the fee whether it's taxes or a

[21:04] flat fee it can be raised you gave the

[21:07] town two ways to do it I think that

[21:10] there's a gentleman here that stated

[21:13] somebody has lived somewhere else and

[21:15] they have property here that person

[21:16] doesn't want to see the property tax go

[21:18] up if it's a flat fee they can opt out

[21:20] that would be one of the times a flat

[21:22] fee somebody would be able to opt out I

[21:24] think they should have the option I also

[21:26] think that if you have

[21:29] 10 people that are

[21:31] applying for a service and you have one

[21:34] person trying to do a private service

[21:36] that there's no way that that one person

[21:38] is going to pay less than the 10 people

[21:41] it's impossible it doesn't it it's you'd

[21:43] be throwing money out just to spite the

[21:47] system

[21:48] there's that's I mean that's pretty much

[21:51] my thing my in the as far as the

[21:54] multi-families

[21:56] I don't feel bad if everybody pays their

[21:58] fair share no it's about time I don't

[22:00] feel bad I lost my dashboard coming down

[22:03] Denison drive so I'd like to find a way

[22:07] for pavement to go there and adding

[22:09] making the taxes so ridiculous that we

[22:12] can't do it you know anybody here that

[22:15] wants to have the taxes raised doesn't

[22:18] have a problem with our roads or

[22:20] infrastructure

[22:34] to my opinion in all fairness I I would

[22:37] I thought about this and

[22:41] I look at the flat fee as being

[22:44] advantageous uh and being fair Equitable

[22:49] um

[22:49] and and the best solution now more

[22:53] importantly I look at

[22:55] the options in respect to what would

[22:57] mitigate the amount of trouble the

[23:00] amount of trash accumulation the amount

[23:03] of non-compliance

[23:05] and respect to any of those changes I I

[23:09] personally feel that this is going to be

[23:12] a challenging coming to my department

[23:14] and

[23:16] um

[23:17] I I think I think it's going to be a

[23:20] challenge in many different different

[23:24] levels and with many different variables

[23:27] but ultimately it to conclude it's it's

[23:30] going to be a challenge that presents

[23:32] itself we'll face this Challenge and be

[23:34] able to do it but

[23:36] um uh the significance of it is is there

[23:39] and it's it's it's got to be there we

[23:43] recognize that challenge is going to

[23:45] have to be met

[23:47] whether it's going to be completely

[23:49] unprecedented uh that's the question of

[23:52] what level as you said but taking it in

[23:54] variables and the factors I feel that a

[23:57] flat fee Associated will make it more

[23:58] fair and will ultimately uh not not

[24:03] increase the amount of non-compliance

[24:06] which leads to trouble that's my honest

[24:09] opinion

[24:10] okay thank you

[24:12] all right but before I go around the

[24:14] room Mr Tom manager is Tim still here

[24:16] did you want to speak to this oh yes

[24:18] yeah you asked us to come in here

[24:19] provide information on what we've

[24:21] received on the request proposal so we

[24:23] can mentioned so I'll pass these out

[24:27] thank you sir

[24:29] thank you

[24:45] okay so as you mentioned uh

[24:49] councilman Kennedy that on February 17th

[24:51] we did uh advertise for request for

[24:53] proposals

[24:55] um we received two proposals today from

[24:59] Friends capable of providing the

[25:01] services requested one proposal was from

[25:04] Casella Waste Management obviously was

[25:06] currently providing the services and the

[25:09] second one is from Waste Management

[25:11] um

[25:12] we've had a series of questions we've

[25:15] had a few rounds of interviews regarding

[25:17] questions and clarification on the

[25:19] proposals since this is not a project

[25:22] subject to 30p the town has the ability

[25:24] to negotiate a final contract

[25:26] the Review Committee expects that'll

[25:28] return over the next month or so but we

[25:30] do want to give you the information that

[25:31] we had from what has been perceived the

[25:34] costs received in these proposals range

[25:36] from 2.1 million to 2.24 million these

[25:41] costs are for the base cost for the

[25:42] first year beginning March 25th 2024 of

[25:46] curbside collection for municipal and

[25:47] solid waste recyclables and yard waste

[25:50] from the residents of the town and the

[25:52] town facilities that were based enlisted

[25:54] in the RFP

[25:56] at this time and for the purpose of

[25:58] budgeting as you you know discuss the

[26:01] best way to fund this we recommend that

[26:04] the town budget 2.35 million dollars

[26:07] which is the high end of the range it

[26:09] includes a 5 contingency

[26:11] and so I don't know if you have anything

[26:14] to add this was a subcommittee or a

[26:16] committee Review Committee but myself

[26:19] Anna and uh Mike cipione from Western

[26:22] and Samson

[26:23] yeah I mean I don't think I can add

[26:25] anything with any questions I guess we

[26:27] could answer questions

[26:30] oh yeah I had a chance to think at all

[26:33] about what this would cost the uh each

[26:36] resident each homeowner you haven't even

[26:38] really couldn't break it up that way yet

[26:41] we haven't really done that in other

[26:44] words uh it would be easy enough to do

[26:46] okay

[26:47] what I just need the collection number

[26:50] what is it which is 2.359 that's the

[26:53] whole thing that's including disposal I

[26:56] think that's the question and I promise

[26:57] my computer is so that's the full budget

[27:00] we were estimating about 2 million and

[27:02] then this is saying 2.5

[27:05] 2.35 but even even the front thing is

[27:08] going to be responsible for the disposal

[27:10] cost yeah so it needs to be broken down

[27:13] it's just

[27:15] for some reason my computer is

[27:22] n't it I don't know why I'm I'm stuck

[27:25] I'm just wondering

[27:27] get rid of my squares

[27:37] while we're waiting on that I'm gonna go

[27:39] around the room any residents have any

[27:42] questions I'm gonna go with Kevin first

[27:44] is

[27:57] after it goes upstairs and they make a

[27:59] decision

[28:01] [Music]

[28:06] um

[28:24] we have to leave

[28:27] but exactly thank you but nothing's

[28:29] getting done

[28:31] well part of the program

[28:34] we are just going to recommend what type

[28:37] of programs

[28:42] we're just going we're just going to

[28:45] recommend what

[28:47] uh mechanism

[28:49] for paying for the program it's up to

[28:52] the town leaders to put together a

[28:55] program

[28:56] for enforcement and uh that's probably

[29:00] going to be part of

[29:01] whatever program we choose if we go with

[29:03] a flat feed and be covered by the

[29:05] Enterprise of course when it comes with

[29:07] every bag so

[29:08] part of part of the bag program some of

[29:12] the enforcement about all of it but some

[29:14] of it will be done by the people who

[29:16] provide us with the bags they would be

[29:18] sending out letters to telling people

[29:20] that you have not complied the truck is

[29:23] supposed to have a camera on it which

[29:25] they tell us can see if there's a bag

[29:27] some communities have done away with

[29:30] toters so the bags are right out there

[29:32] and they can see the color of them I

[29:34] don't have a problem with that myself

[29:35] but we don't know yet what's going to

[29:38] happen with our toters I know that we've

[29:40] been told we're going to keep the toners

[29:42] but we don't know if we're going to keep

[29:43] the toners right now right the way our

[29:46] bylar is set right now I believe we're

[29:49] supposed to have to play a trash bags

[29:50] actually it doesn't say that I looked it

[29:53] up a couple days ago it actually doesn't

[29:54] and whether it's the one on the website

[29:56] but to get back to your point

[29:59] Hannah has been proposing to hiring two

[30:02] people for in her Department which would

[30:05] be covered by I had this information

[30:09] well we have to hire somebody to enforce

[30:12] them

[30:13] if you want it enforced there has to be

[30:14] it's going to be enforced by the hauler

[30:16] and somebody works we need to change the

[30:19] number

[30:21] thank you all right George I think he's

[30:25] gonna send out your question here

[30:27] the question here even though it's not

[30:30] mandated but it gave you a mandate on

[30:32] which way to go right and and that's not

[30:35] in taxes

[30:37] uh I don't think the tax is the way to

[30:39] go uh

[30:41] because it's it's not actually a fair

[30:43] cost of the trash pickup for the whole

[30:46] Community as a whole uh and it's not

[30:49] fair to local industry to pay for a

[30:52] substantial cost of having their trash

[30:54] removed and then also paying in their

[30:57] tax in their tax base

[30:59] a user fee Enterprise fund I think is a

[31:04] way to go a pay as you go uh I know

[31:06] there was concern with Paige you know is

[31:09] that we may not meet the uh necessary

[31:13] quote that is going to be built but as I

[31:18] heard through the program and the few

[31:20] times I did come that the pages row will

[31:23] pay for itself and that is substantial

[31:26] uh lots of people say we're not going to

[31:29] do it we're going to go some elsewhere

[31:30] it's very low in numbers

[31:32] so if you if you take the Enterprise

[31:34] front or use the screen uh I believe

[31:38] we've heard through here that one to

[31:42] four families we're mandated if you have

[31:44] some type of trash pickup that they

[31:46] equally share the cost

[31:48] so by using a user fee and writing into

[31:51] the regulation per unit covers you up to

[31:55] a full family so that single family home

[31:58] is going to pay x amount of dollars and

[32:01] that for family home is going to pay the

[32:03] same amount of money per unit

[32:06] and I think that's the way to go the

[32:08] enforcement is going to come is

[32:11] five families in US

[32:13] and they're not gonna they're gonna not

[32:16] even be part of this thing because the

[32:18] regulation is going to force them into a

[32:21] dumpster and and it the enforcement of

[32:24] that dumpster will become with the Board

[32:26] of Health so it's it's Germany how many

[32:30] units we have that are going to be

[32:31] eligible for trash pickup and then how

[32:34] many units are not going to be eligible

[32:35] for trash pickup and that's the five

[32:37] families or more and then then industry

[32:40] in those five families are going to

[32:43] either submit a lettuce and this is how

[32:45] we handle our trash and they're not

[32:47] going to pay attention so I I just think

[32:50] it's important that committee look at

[32:52] the restart

[32:54] or the uh pay as you go system user fee

[32:59] you've mixed it up a little bit the user

[33:01] fee is the pay as you throw it's the

[33:03] flat fee okay so yes it's the flat fee

[33:06] yeah

[33:07] I think it's it's important to go either

[33:10] way uh this way it's equally shared by

[33:14] each unit okay uh I think it's important

[33:17] because people don't want to pay more

[33:18] taxes we got a tax increase coming with

[33:20] the regular budget you've got the fire

[33:23] station come in online and then if you

[33:25] go with taxes on the trash you know what

[33:27] people aren't going for it

[33:31] thank you and thank you for the work

[33:33] that you've all done uh it's been a high

[33:36] process for you guys if you guys should

[33:38] be committed for the work that you have

[33:39] done thank you very much thank you Irene

[33:41] did you want to say something yeah I

[33:43] just got the numbers and I can plug them

[33:45] in and so I can kind of give you an idea

[33:47] of wait now that we have the two point

[33:51] 2.4 million here of the cost so if you

[33:56] this is not my computer and it's a

[33:59] little thing here so the cost we're talking about the

[34:04] amount of trash that we have of 4 500 a

[34:07] thousand pounds of

[34:09] 4550

[34:11] 68 tons of trash

[34:14] like 5300.

[34:17] ton for a year

[34:19] that was the number that you gave last

[34:20] time

[34:23] we can

[34:24] and for 90. 90 a ton

[34:28] um

[34:29] the um if you did

[34:32] flat feet all right you wanted to look

[34:34] at taxes taxes

[34:36] yeah I look at your thing taxes with uh

[34:41] taxes with pays you throw just wanted to

[34:44] kind of put that in with the bags

[34:47] you're using your trash comes down about

[34:50] 20 percent

[34:52] residents get two sizes of bags

[34:55] I'm just checking to see if

[35:02] there's a connection if we don't enforce

[35:05] it now I know well I'm just remind me

[35:07] about a yellow bag okay all of a sudden

[35:10] create enforcement it's it's it does

[35:13] because I need to go back

[35:16] they're buying a bag but we're still not

[35:19] if they do not if they do not enforce so

[35:22] you see the bags in the container or

[35:24] people have the extra bags then if it's

[35:28] not in the right bag you get a fine

[35:30] right away so the company said that they

[35:33] would do that for free right away I have

[35:35] some recent pictures may I give to the

[35:38] committee just four hold on just hold on

[35:40] for that the landlord we get let's

[35:42] finish this conversation first just the

[35:45] guy the tenant buys the bag so how that

[35:49] comes out to be is 1.2 million dollars

[35:52] would need to be under the tax base if

[35:55] you were using that taxes and bags if

[35:59] you went with all bags we're talking

[36:01] about 20 to 2 400 2.4 million dollars

[36:05] has to be paid by taxes so if you're

[36:08] saying all taxes then that whole bill

[36:10] 2.24 million dollars has to come from

[36:13] taxes if you were going taxes with pay

[36:16] days you throw with

[36:20] um the average resident would pay 195

[36:23] dollars with their 1.5 bags per week so

[36:26] if you only use less than that you use a

[36:29] smaller bag if I'm saying if you use the

[36:32] large bag of 1.5 bags on average then it

[36:36] would be 195 dollars

[36:39] per year per year per year per year and

[36:41] then that's really all you would pay

[36:43] because the rest comes out of taxes but

[36:45] the taxes would be

[36:47] the what did I just say 1.2 million

[36:50] dollars

[36:51] all right if you go with flat fee which

[36:54] would still require over us

[36:58] all right so now the flat fee the flat

[37:01] fee I'm just looking here to see how it

[37:03] comes out

[37:09] um

[37:18] I'm sorry I missed my mouse I should

[37:20] have brought my mouse with me

[37:24] includes that they've separated out

[37:26] every apartment yeah this is for per one

[37:30] you've got the numbers

[37:36] well because right now we even Supply

[37:38] four and up to six family

[37:42] trash barrels because we don't enforce

[37:44] it

[37:45] says my my thing is that I think like

[37:48] the bad because the colored bag is gonna

[37:51] change that

[37:59] time okay

[38:02] Irene yeah I'm gonna come back to you

[38:04] Miss clemos did you want to say

[38:06] something yeah

[38:09] um well mainly I'm glad you got some

[38:11] sort of number on units yes that was the

[38:13] question I had back a year over a year

[38:15] ago

[38:16] um and I'm five minutes again thank you

[38:19] like the real says to the committee

[38:20] because you guys you know really stepped

[38:22] it up and gotten the information out

[38:24] still almost to do this here but got the

[38:27] information out

[38:28] um we've gone full circle too from well

[38:31] taxes to Black fees to Flat fees with

[38:33] bags so now back to Flat fees I find

[38:35] that very interesting actually because I

[38:37] was actually starting to lean for Splat

[38:38] being back

[38:40] um but honestly whichever way is going

[38:42] to work I I take a a little a little

[38:45] offense in some ways to listening to

[38:47] this non-enforcement thing in the sense

[38:50] that there was a time when we enforced

[38:53] in this community yes it wasn't that

[38:54] long ago well it was now because it's

[38:58] been a while since you know but there

[39:00] was a time where we had some part-time

[39:02] enforcers who went out and wrote tickets

[39:05] and when the tickets started to roll and

[39:07] everybody got on board with

[39:09] understanding what they had to do and

[39:10] how they had to make their tenants

[39:12] comply I'll continue to say this all the

[39:14] time then suddenly we saw it and we saw

[39:17] some clients we saw trash in containers

[39:20] we saw a lot of trash and it weren't and

[39:23] I I took the side many times of

[39:25] landlords who I felt bad for because

[39:27] they had such high tickets because their

[39:29] tenants were the deadbeats not them so

[39:32] just you know being sure on that so in a

[39:35] department in which gets bigger smaller

[39:38] or bigger I'm very confused you know

[39:40] Health Department nothing against it at

[39:43] the moment just saying I don't see why

[39:45] we can enforce you'll need a couple of

[39:47] part-timers or something people who

[39:49] don't need to have you know 401ks or

[39:51] whatever part-time people writing

[39:53] tickets that is the plan that should be

[39:55] easy and that should come out of the

[39:57] Enterprise money that we're collecting

[40:00] I understand I'm just making it clear

[40:02] because the conversation that's been set

[40:05] around here and multiple people have

[40:07] concerns about enforcement I'm just

[40:10] stating as a resident as a former

[40:12] counselor as someone who's sitting at

[40:14] these meetings not just yours but lots

[40:16] of meetings on lots of subject matters

[40:17] when it comes to trash and somebody who

[40:20] calls the the department of scent used

[40:22] to send pictures of non-compliant trash

[40:25] containers and such it can be done and

[40:28] once the curve is met again then the

[40:31] people step up because they don't want

[40:32] those fines so I'm just saying that can

[40:34] be done as far as I was concerned about

[40:36] Mark's comment about um we're giving

[40:38] them more race ways to raise things well

[40:41] clearly it was discussed in here that

[40:43] obviously in the first year you don't

[40:45] really know what's going to happen but

[40:46] with an Enterprise fund you set a rate

[40:48] you set the rate and within you know

[40:51] depending on if you have bags or not but

[40:53] if you just do a flat fee you're going

[40:54] to set the rate and we should be able to

[40:56] know that it's within enough money we

[40:58] should have a contingency in there it's

[41:00] like our water sewer situation we should

[41:02] know what the um what the cost is from

[41:05] the hauler we have a contract doesn't go

[41:07] up for whatever many years or maybe it

[41:09] goes up it's two percent or whatever we

[41:11] should know and there should be a

[41:12] reasonable expectation of that fee what

[41:15] it needs to be how it's going to be

[41:17] raised if it's bags we don't know if the

[41:19] bags bring us the money again reasonable

[41:22] consideration maybe we make extra as it

[41:24] was told to us a few meetings ago in the

[41:26] first year oh and then we can reduce it

[41:28] but maybe we don't make enough and we

[41:29] have to go up a little that's the nature

[41:31] of an Enterprise fund and I and yeah

[41:35] there is that option that someone's

[41:37] going to raise it but in an Enterprise

[41:38] fund the money goes to what it is you're

[41:40] paying for correct not getting the trash

[41:42] so it's not going to go on the tax

[41:45] costers it's not going to get stuffed up

[41:47] we're not going to council voting on how

[41:48] to spend it because it belongs into the

[41:51] Enterprise fund only for use trash use

[41:53] so you know again just being clear as to

[41:56] those types of things you mentioned um

[41:59] opting out it is a it's a state thing we

[42:02] were we we're told that a number of

[42:03] meetings ago unfortunately to my to my

[42:06] concern oh bummer they can opt out that

[42:09] stinks however they have to make prove

[42:11] that they have a reputable hall or of

[42:13] some sorts of legal entity who's taking

[42:15] trash and therefore then they have the

[42:17] right to opt out but as you all skate

[42:19] the cost probably to opt out and just

[42:22] stay in is

[42:24] it's probably going to be cheaper to

[42:26] stay in so why opt out as a matter of

[42:28] fact the idea of having small businesses

[42:30] opt in is a much more lucrative thing to

[42:33] go after now there's something for um

[42:37] for future to go after with a campaign

[42:39] saying you have the ability now to get

[42:42] your trash picked up on trash day with

[42:44] everybody else here's the cost I think

[42:46] that will make money and maybe help

[42:47] reduce the average person's fee just

[42:50] saying

[42:51] um let's see opt-in opt-in enforcements

[42:54] you know I talked a service resident

[42:56] said to me they couldn't understand you

[42:57] know Sturbridge has a lots of things but

[43:00] she sees six haulers going down her Road

[43:02] and she goes I don't understand I take

[43:03] all my things in my five different bins

[43:05] then I go to the transfer station which

[43:07] is free she goes I don't understand why

[43:09] these people you know there's so many

[43:10] haulers and storage is horrendous how

[43:13] many haulers are going down the road on

[43:15] the same given day so just saying from a

[43:17] local community who thinks and she works

[43:20] she's a

[43:22] she's in this community in a

[43:24] Manufacturing Company in a high position

[43:26] so you know she's she sees what's going

[43:28] on in Southbridge and she was actually

[43:30] she was at the business meeting and

[43:31] heard the discussion and was was really

[43:34] surprised at the option itself for chess

[43:36] and thought it was a great thing

[43:38] Worcester which had more like that so

[43:40] just saying

[43:42] um what else I I still go I go either

[43:45] way you know you guys think fluffy I

[43:46] think it's great you don't have to worry

[43:48] as much compliance but I certainly hope

[43:50] we have compliance we enforce it as far

[43:53] as containment and and the mattresses

[43:56] and all that we need to get out there

[43:58] boots on the ground is what it's going

[44:00] to take can't get out of this town hall

[44:02] walk down the street and write a few

[44:03] tickets it's very simple you could write

[44:05] them all your way out of town and in

[44:07] town

[44:08] um but I think if we don't do that

[44:09] nothing's gonna ever change that did

[44:12] change we got lazy again and it's time

[44:15] to enforce again it's just like being

[44:17] prepared with your children

[44:19] um and there was something else I was

[44:21] going to say about all that but I guess

[44:22] it's not so important that I did write

[44:25] it down

[44:27] so thank you I hope I hope we get this

[44:30] accomplished really soon

[44:34] um uh before I go to you Kevin this is

[44:36] playing a question for uh

[44:39] yeah so these numbers that you're giving

[44:42] us

[44:43] the first Little Numbers you just gave

[44:45] us is based on our collections number

[44:47] correct yeah so my question is is how

[44:50] accurate is that collector's number okay

[44:53] that's the number that we had just

[44:55] received of the um

[44:58] you know of what the what the what their

[45:01] collection cost would be 1.7 I'm just

[45:04] doing the trash yeah and we'd have a

[45:06] reduction

[45:12] and it will go up with years you know

[45:15] there is a five percent right it goes up

[45:17] every Thursday

[45:21] yeah I'm using the most updated number

[45:23] that I have

[45:39] [Music]

[45:48] that number we gave you is really a good

[45:51] number to use as you figure out the best

[45:53] way to pay right because my estimate was

[45:55] 1.3 million and really is 1.7 you know

[45:58] so that that impacts a lot of it

[46:01] changing numbers yes I want to go with

[46:04] Kevin oh are you done yeah the second

[46:06] part of the question is

[46:10] we're trying to base it on military

[46:13] families pay more on stuff

[46:15] how accurate is that number that you're

[46:17] getting from the town

[46:19] do we even have that number

[46:23] Francine actually has a lot of that

[46:25] information she can tell you how many

[46:27] multi-families there are yeah

[46:48] enforcement uh last meeting we heard

[46:52] about the D2

[46:54] glitch in other words that there was

[46:56] some seventy thousand dollars worth of

[46:59] fines and tickets written out but there

[47:02] was never

[47:05] um an I.T line item or something to make

[47:09] sure that it's fine got attached to that

[47:12] property is that still in existence are

[47:14] we going forward that we want to enact

[47:16] Municipal charges mean so when you want

[47:20] to identify ticketing ticketing is great

[47:22] but it's been more show than substance

[47:24] here because all of these unpaid tickets

[47:28] now at the beginning when these were

[47:31] issued years before my time I'm sure

[47:33] they were effective but with time it

[47:36] became apparent that if you don't pay

[47:37] your ticket there's no consequences from

[47:41] and I have a significant amount of

[47:43] unpaid

[47:47] tickets that were not even the the

[47:50] individuals didn't even make the effort

[47:53] to appeal

[47:55] so there was no follow-up now now with

[47:58] the enactment of the municipal charges

[48:00] name if those are unpaid we didn't go to

[48:03] certain departments at the end of the

[48:05] year meaning the health department of

[48:06] issues

[48:08] see yeah they're unpaid they will get

[48:11] stuck to your taxes okay and I have been

[48:15] down this road in my experience it works

[48:17] very well it resonates with individuals

[48:20] the word word gets out so to speak I

[48:22] think we'll take it seriously okay well

[48:24] right now we're deficient of that and

[48:26] it's been problematic and I have

[48:28] pictures to even substantiate a

[48:31] commonality that we face

[48:36] you I'm going to look at the picture all

[48:39] right uh can can I have an insurance

[48:41] from the health department and the town

[48:44] manager that that municipal

[48:47] process to make sure he

[48:50] finds our

[48:52] tag to the properties yes yes

[48:56] okay we've already moved with that okay

[48:59] and on

[49:00] um bins in bags

[49:03] um

[49:04] the flat service fee would cover the bin

[49:08] um there we we always talked about the

[49:11] fact that any change we do to the

[49:14] climbing common masses out there

[49:16] takes

[49:18] a lot of time effort and we still have

[49:22] people that don't comply and it's been

[49:24] four years 17 years since we've been

[49:26] trying to compile however what if we to

[49:31] avoid

[49:32] the confusion of bags if we start by

[49:36] using the bin system and say as long as

[49:39] your trash is fitting in the bin and

[49:42] you're paying your flat fee your service

[49:43] fee your company however in the future

[49:47] we may end up going with

[49:50] bags

[49:52] giving people so people understand

[49:54] there's not going to be any change now

[49:58] but if you don't start

[50:00] following the rules yeah doing your

[50:03] recycling you're going to end up buying

[50:05] trash bags in the future

[50:08] so the problem with that is first of all

[50:11] the bags will help us reduce the cost

[50:14] second of all a survey came back an

[50:17] overwhelming amount of residents when we

[50:19] turn the survey you want bags so I think

[50:22] we should comply with what they want

[50:26] the flat fee the taxes were pretty close

[50:29] you could go either way we had over 1600

[50:32] people respond I think that's a pretty

[50:34] good player of What the residents in

[50:36] this town know so just tell me how the

[50:39] back makes the difference I mean that's

[50:40] what I'm saying it'll help offset the

[50:42] cost yeah but or you put in a bag the

[50:44] more bags you have to buy you will

[50:47] recycle more yeah but also you're paying

[50:49] for the bank so that goes into the

[50:52] revenue it's a psychological thing that

[50:54] when you it's looking for something it

[50:57] reduces it's also an enforcement in that

[51:00] the hauler sees it you get a fine right

[51:02] away

[51:04] should not happen now because there's no

[51:06] question the lawn chair sticking out of

[51:08] a recycling because nobody's paying the

[51:10] cost right now

[51:11] okay hold on

[51:14] are we all sitting out here are we ready

[51:16] to I am 1650 out of six thousand six 1

[51:21] 650 respondents that does not represent

[51:24] no it doesn't a big portion of this

[51:26] community it's a pretty good pool I just

[51:28] have one more numbers that's actually

[51:29] very good I only have one question

[51:35] does anybody know where the Royal were

[51:39] the royalties from the dump was that put

[51:40] into an Enterprise fund

[51:44] I know but in its entirety it's never

[51:47] been touched because it's in an

[51:48] Enterprise fund to start up trash right

[51:50] yeah

[51:56] the idea behind it the idea behind it

[52:01] was that the royalty fund was supposed

[52:03] to be for our trash startup right yeah

[52:10] [Music]

[52:13] knowing that we would run out one day

[52:15] you know free trash okay

[52:18] [Music]

[52:24] well she has numbers thank you okay

[52:29] right now okay

[52:43] I've been using this model for other

[52:45] communities it has worked and I don't

[52:47] know why it keeps saying

[52:49] so we're just talking about tonnage

[52:51] we're talking about cost ninety dollars

[52:53] per ton we're talking about the solid

[52:57] waste collection that's the guy going

[52:58] down the road it's a salary for two

[53:00] different things one is the salary for

[53:02] Board of Health that's always in there

[53:06] um and uh there is publicity there is

[53:09] billing costs uh for a staff person for

[53:13] if you do the flat fee version if you

[53:17] just do a flat fee just by itself then

[53:22] it comes out to 372 dollars per unit so

[53:27] if you have a six unit then you times

[53:29] that by six per year per year per year

[53:32] sign me up yeah I'm in 17. 31 a month

[53:37] yeah

[53:38] what are we doing why are we arguing

[53:45] because we need the multi-families to

[53:47] pay just a little bit more okay

[53:51] hold on let us finish please okay if you

[53:55] go with the flat fee and pays you throw

[53:57] so you have a two dollar bag and a one

[53:59] dollar bag so people that I only put out

[54:02] one bag if the apartment they pay for

[54:05] what they use

[54:06] the landlord pays what they you to have

[54:09] the container so that is

[54:13] 240

[54:16] uh for the flat fee

[54:20] and 156 dollars if you use a dollar a

[54:24] 1.5 bags per

[54:27] um per year so it's actually perfect

[54:35] if you are using so yes it costs more if

[54:41] you do the average but there are some

[54:43] people the best people that use more if

[54:45] you go away you don't pay for a bag of

[54:47] trash if you

[54:49] um you know if you're a one person

[54:51] you're probably only gonna use the

[54:53] growth you know the smaller bags

[54:56] if you do a full hold on

[55:01] if you're doing the whole thing the

[55:04] whole cost for the whole operation is

[55:05] 2.4 2.2 right point four million dollars

[55:09] you have to put on the tax base so

[55:10] that's the other if the taxes go up they

[55:12] have to do that if you do an all

[55:15] encompassing so a little bit in the

[55:17] taxes a little bit and things then it is

[55:20] about 55 is it 220 flat fee

[55:25] 156 dollars for a one one bag uh 1.5

[55:30] bags per week and then you put 225

[55:35] 000 in the tax base like that there's a

[55:38] portion in the text and you name your

[55:40] pothole on your Hill

[55:44] so it's not that big of a difference but

[55:47] if it's it's spread out 55. yeah it'd be

[55:51] 55 a quarter then and if you are a

[55:54] senior plus the best plus the bag but if

[55:57] you're just a senior and you're doing

[55:58] this one a dollar of a kitchen bag it's

[56:01] still a professional

[56:03] um anything's additional if you're going

[56:05] to pay 300 I'm going to go with Francine

[56:07] next

[56:08] so the first question I have this

[56:10] because I've been looking at the billing

[56:12] cycle it's been said that it's one two

[56:14] or four family

[56:15] okay but it has it's seven you're up to

[56:18] six it's up to six units right seven

[56:21] units or more have their own dumpster on

[56:23] their land such as Riverview place has

[56:27] 42 units or whatever they have a big

[56:30] trash dumpster yep okay so let's be

[56:33] clear on that that the number it goes

[56:36] from one family to six family including

[56:38] condos that are single unit okay

[56:42] um

[56:43] my other thing before I get to the

[56:45] billing part of it

[56:46] the I have talked to multiple people

[56:50] um and not really my choice they brought

[56:53] it to me a the survey they didn't

[56:56] understand it I must have had seven

[56:57] people that told me they didn't return

[56:59] it because there was no dollar amount

[57:01] and they didn't understand it

[57:04] so that's right that's right they don't

[57:07] want to come anyway I don't want to go

[57:08] there so that may have skew the results

[57:10] right yeah so they said you're going to

[57:12] do what you want you're going to do well

[57:14] I can't I said I can't control it I work

[57:17] for the town the decision maker okay

[57:20] um

[57:21] the second thing is the black Torres

[57:23] versus the Green toters

[57:25] a lot of people

[57:28] or they're saying they called for extra

[57:31] toters in the health department and they

[57:34] can't get more black Taurus I said well

[57:36] you're not supposed to it's one per unit

[57:39] oh I have eight

[57:40] so this is the thing those toters need

[57:43] to be marked inventory you know like my

[57:47] brother said send out a letter to all

[57:49] homeowners to verify this is the total

[57:51] we have listed for you your black Tony a

[57:54] green toner these are the numbers on it

[57:56] please confirm and sign if you don't you

[57:58] get a fine

[58:00] you need to reply back to inventory list

[58:03] and of course all the single families

[58:05] are gonna they're gonna comply okay but

[58:08] the ones that don't send back the letter

[58:10] then you follow up and go out there and

[58:12] inventory those toters all right for

[58:14] example when we first got the toters my

[58:16] three family I had six black toters and

[58:18] three green

[58:19] why I had to call the health department

[58:22] not the staff but previously to get them

[58:25] removed previous employee from the

[58:27] health department followed a guy that

[58:29] had black toters on the back of his

[58:31] pickup truck and drove him to

[58:32] Connecticut the employee followed the

[58:35] guy into Connecticut all right and went

[58:37] to his land pulled in and he was you

[58:41] know confronted him the guy gave him

[58:42] some kind of sob story that he was

[58:45] washing the

[58:47] toters out at his property says you have

[58:49] a water spigot at your house don't you

[58:51] in Southbridge

[58:53] you know put those things back on your

[58:56] truck and bring it back to Southbridge

[58:58] by the end of the day and we have um

[59:06] but the other thing other Town people

[59:10] you know they don't think it's fair to

[59:12] go one family pays the same as a six

[59:15] family or four family five family should

[59:17] be a graduated rate that graduated or

[59:20] don't whatever but again that's not

[59:22] gonna be our decision no but I'm just

[59:25] saying I'm not getting any

[59:28] feedback as to put it on the tax bill

[59:30] I'm getting

[59:32] a flat fee and a yellow bag yellow pink

[59:35] purple whatever thing you know because

[59:37] most of them say yellow bags because you

[59:39] get this they could bring them to

[59:41] Worcester

[59:42] okay I have four people that told me

[59:45] that you can get them out of the health

[59:47] department he has to have our name on it

[59:49] big deal how are they going to check in

[59:51] so that's the other thing I granted

[59:54] there's a camera on the thing but how

[59:55] does it know okay that it's a

[59:57] Southbridge bag

[59:59] so as a label but yeah you're good yeah

[1:00:04] there's going to be even more expensive

[1:00:07] if we go with the one and two dollars

[1:00:08] then worcester's more expensive right so

[1:00:12] there you go so there you all said okay

[1:00:14] who do you want to go with ours

[1:00:17] is I did the testing or tried to what

[1:00:19] they titled Communications I do not have

[1:00:22] the general ledger numbers I could not

[1:00:24] test it for trash I did all there was

[1:00:27] all other things that had nothing to do

[1:00:28] with trash instead of you know just

[1:00:32] ahead of it anyway but they're not

[1:00:34] having a GL leads me dead in the water

[1:00:36] come this Monday to do testing so

[1:00:41] yeah the accounting and the town manager

[1:00:44] Tom manager came to Rachel and said it's

[1:00:47] delayed so I can't and I'm not you know

[1:00:50] I know I'm on camera but it's very

[1:00:52] difficult to do my job if I'm not giving

[1:00:54] given the things I need right so I'm

[1:00:56] saying to this committee at this point

[1:00:58] if I don't have a

[1:00:59] gl's on Monday

[1:01:01] and even so if I did and I'm doing the

[1:01:04] testing I still need more sessions with

[1:01:07] the with toddler communication to fix

[1:01:09] the software two tests okay and

[1:01:12] especially because I have to do import

[1:01:13] of all these files and create new

[1:01:15] accounts and create new Services the

[1:01:18] billing part of it will be something

[1:01:20] that will be in this cost benefit

[1:01:22] analysis that will be done and then we

[1:01:24] will check it out see if it should be

[1:01:26] done in the house right for whether it

[1:01:28] should be done by a private company

[1:01:29] right so the thing is

[1:01:32] I need a three month I need a quote from

[1:01:35] the type of communications and we need a

[1:01:37] three to four month late time to book

[1:01:40] the people I need to work with okay

[1:01:42] we're already in March I'm in April it's

[1:01:45] not I've booked it in February and I my

[1:01:47] choices were either April or May so you

[1:01:51] can't you know it's not your fall

[1:01:52] friends

[1:01:56] so if you have something new Miss

[1:01:58] Clemens otherwise we're going to start

[1:02:00] voting here no go ahead uh companies the

[1:02:03] thing I forgot to mention was holler

[1:02:05] compliance you know we continually talk

[1:02:07] about uh Community compliance I hope

[1:02:10] that somewhere in that contract is

[1:02:12] holler compliance can you talk about the

[1:02:13] cameras and everybody doing the right

[1:02:14] thing but the haulers are two things

[1:02:16] well the main thing about Haulers is I

[1:02:19] go out trash day everyone's got their

[1:02:20] trash lined up I come back I see trash

[1:02:23] cans everywhere because the haulers do

[1:02:24] what they want because we really need to

[1:02:26] have holler compliance as well so that

[1:02:28] our streets and our sidewalks are safe

[1:02:30] to transfer from whether it's a person

[1:02:32] with disabilities or whether it's a

[1:02:33] mother with a carriage and as Miss

[1:02:35] Congdon said at the last meeting the

[1:02:37] hauler that would be in the contract

[1:02:40] right I'm just mentioning it because we

[1:02:42] haven't had that to the state so I'm

[1:02:44] bringing it up because that was what I

[1:02:46] forgot but

[1:02:47] um as far as the money goes with the

[1:02:49] numbers that you're if they are kind of

[1:02:51] accurate so I'm a little concerned you

[1:02:52] know up to six families seven or more is

[1:02:54] the number wrong so did we only compile

[1:02:56] up to four families or do we compile up

[1:02:58] to six but it's really fours so we did

[1:03:01] up to taxes so therefore it's not up to

[1:03:04] Fours so is our number correct in in

[1:03:06] your calculation

[1:03:08] okay that's because it was it was you

[1:03:11] were talking four versus six absolutely

[1:03:12] so that could be an over a stage it's

[1:03:15] just an estimate too I think at this

[1:03:16] point right but four to six could be a

[1:03:18] big number yeah I'm using this but again

[1:03:20] at 372 I think you have room for legal

[1:03:23] there just my opinion

[1:03:25] um as far as the uh compliance with that

[1:03:27] kind of number you could hire two part

[1:03:29] time you could hire two extra people for

[1:03:31] an entire year and and it wouldn't cost

[1:03:33] us that much more as a community to be

[1:03:35] honest this money is expecting that

[1:03:37] you're having two people right but I'm

[1:03:39] saying you could that's so low if you

[1:03:41] ask me to remember I know it's not low

[1:03:42] to everybody but I'm just saying if you

[1:03:44] really needed to have it it's really

[1:03:46] worth that much you know to stick on an

[1:03:48] extra 20 bucks to us so that you can

[1:03:50] make sure our streets are perfect but

[1:03:51] anyway just say

[1:03:52] um as far as the extra toters very

[1:03:54] interesting uh comments there but can we

[1:03:57] and I've asked this way back I asked

[1:03:59] about this you know there I if somebody

[1:04:01] has a house where they have you know

[1:04:02] they want to pay for two toters a year

[1:04:04] can they not opt in and pay for just you

[1:04:07] know multi-families off the into pay

[1:04:08] can't they buy two toners and and be

[1:04:10] charged twice why not I don't know that

[1:04:13] you know I'm just saying some people

[1:04:15] want to told us they're going to pay for

[1:04:16] the trash of two toters can they do that

[1:04:19] um that's something we should we should

[1:04:21] think about negotiating without the

[1:04:22] contract as long as you know I mean I

[1:04:25] don't know you could have extra colors

[1:04:26] for recycling

[1:04:28] yeah so okay but I'm saying somebody

[1:04:30] wants to pay for extra trash they do

[1:04:33] people single-family homes do have two

[1:04:35] more multiple yeah

[1:04:38] but they're Town one so somebody from

[1:04:41] the town gave it to them so how illegal

[1:04:43] is that

[1:04:46] [Music]

[1:05:31] so yes is it quoted former counselor

[1:05:40] okay I think that's it thank you all

[1:05:42] right

[1:05:43] so we're gonna take a vote here and what

[1:05:45] how you want to go with this this is the

[1:05:47] recommendation I am going to make to the

[1:05:49] Town concert on Monday night

[1:05:51] um

[1:05:52] we'll go around the room

[1:05:55] um oh first of all

[1:05:58] how should we do this should we do do

[1:06:00] you want flat fee or taxes and then do

[1:06:03] you want to add bags or do you want it

[1:06:04] all together I'd say we go with the flat

[1:06:06] fee and for knee pad bags later on we do

[1:06:09] it because the flat fee like we said it

[1:06:11] was 372 that's that's not bad at all

[1:06:13] that's real nice

[1:06:16] [Music]

[1:06:18] I like my bags

[1:06:26] this is great

[1:06:28] Steve I'm in favor of flat fee and with

[1:06:30] an Enterprise account I'm sure it would

[1:06:32] be yeah

[1:06:34] no bags I would agree to bags later I

[1:06:37] think Kevin had a great idea all right

[1:06:38] yeah all right

[1:06:40] go ahead flat fee with bags later

[1:06:44] same flat fee with bags later

[1:06:47] good

[1:06:52] um

[1:06:52] celebrity I I would like to see you next

[1:06:55] fix extended multi-family

[1:06:59] um

[1:07:00] if that can be worked out uh flat fee in

[1:07:03] future bags I think all right

[1:07:06] you know I feel you need my vote yeah

[1:07:11] and bags later so that's one two three

[1:07:16] seven man seven flat feet and no bags

[1:07:19] I'm gonna stick with taxes okay

[1:07:35] yeah I told you when we started I'm

[1:07:38] going to go to the conference though

[1:07:39] exactly what you're recommending so our

[1:07:42] last agenda items that make a

[1:07:44] recommendation of Town Council on using

[1:07:46] other funds I went to the arpa committee

[1:07:48] tonight I asked for some funds

[1:07:50] unfortunately I had to come down here so

[1:07:52] I never I never found out exactly what

[1:07:55] happened with that councilor Adams is

[1:07:57] here go ahead yeah so right now what we

[1:07:58] did was did an operational pause in the

[1:08:00] arpa account we did it now

[1:08:02] obviously use some of this money for for

[1:08:05] the trash so it's going to be about 380

[1:08:09] 000 I believe in the top of my head

[1:08:11] getting all the computer and stuff taken

[1:08:13] care of so right now we'll hold off on

[1:08:15] 380 000 I know you looked at a couple

[1:08:17] people to hire on and obviously some

[1:08:20] startup fees so we'll hold that money

[1:08:23] Friday now okay all right and then the

[1:08:26] other thing is do we want to recommend

[1:08:27] using some funds from the royalty

[1:08:30] account that's what I have recommended

[1:08:31] that we look at go ahead Mr Grandma's

[1:08:34] um what do we say we had around three

[1:08:36] I think I think it's a good idea to take

[1:08:39] a little bit out of the room for

[1:08:40] royalties

[1:08:42] um the reason I say that is a lot of

[1:08:44] people don't realize they came up

[1:08:45] earlier what that fund is for right and

[1:08:47] it's for anything the time once I get

[1:08:49] that however

[1:08:51] I've done a unique perspective being in

[1:08:52] the water department we just well not we

[1:08:55] Casella and GP just installed water

[1:08:56] mains in Charlton because of

[1:08:58] contamination coming from that landfill

[1:08:59] that 3.9 million dollars in the future

[1:09:02] is going to be needed to possibly extend

[1:09:04] water lines in other parts of town as

[1:09:06] contamination spreads yeah or possible

[1:09:08] lawsuits we need to be careful not to

[1:09:10] pillage that account or else we're gonna

[1:09:11] have to come out of pocket for it later

[1:09:13] so we've just warn everybody to try to

[1:09:15] fleece that account

[1:09:16] it's you're borrowing from Peter to pay

[1:09:18] Paul in my opinion so be careful so what

[1:09:20] is your recommendation

[1:09:24] under half a million all right

[1:09:25] a million or less maybe a quarter

[1:09:28] be careful that's all I'll say because

[1:09:30] I've seen you know how where this goes

[1:09:32] that's all thank you Kathy did you wanna

[1:09:35] [Music]

[1:09:36] oh I'm sorry

[1:09:37] go ahead all right I'm not opposed like

[1:09:40] I told you Mike before that maybe out of

[1:09:42] royalty but I'd also like to see

[1:09:43] something I want to go back into the

[1:09:44] royalty agree with Steve at the same

[1:09:46] time we've made it very clear at the

[1:09:48] council we should hold on that money

[1:09:50] just in case of future lawsuits the

[1:09:51] insurance money is now gone so we got to

[1:09:54] be really careful with it if we could

[1:09:56] pay some of that money back with uh down

[1:09:58] the road in a few years that would be

[1:10:00] great as well but I I don't know if I

[1:10:03] would my recommendation to to the

[1:10:05] committee would be going is this really

[1:10:07] what you you are you want to vote on

[1:10:09] this or do you want the Town Council to take a look do you have your numbers

[1:10:14] and what you really want to do to start

[1:10:15] off just hold off and say but hold up

[1:10:18] for now maybe you don't need that money

[1:10:20] yeah okay you know it's a good safety

[1:10:25] net yeah if we took 385 out of arpa if

[1:10:27] we were to take another 120 that would

[1:10:29] get us to 500 000 that would give us

[1:10:31] almost a quarter's worth of payments for

[1:10:34] the hauler to get our to get our first

[1:10:36] quarter of the payment coming in from

[1:10:38] the citizen so that could be reasonable

[1:10:40] all right how soon can we get this the

[1:10:42] counselors Steve did you want to say

[1:10:44] something

[1:10:45] I don't know I was thinking kind of

[1:10:46] along the same lines that Steve was

[1:10:48] thinking about of

[1:10:49] baby 500 grand

[1:10:52] um I I would love to be able to use more

[1:10:54] but I mean we did see how expensive

[1:10:57] those last that last round of lawsuits

[1:10:59] was and when we finally had to finally

[1:11:03] get it settled Council Steve what would

[1:11:05] you think if we did a like almost like a

[1:11:07] surveyors loan where the the Enterprise

[1:11:09] account agrees to put money back into

[1:11:11] landfill Royals these over a 10-year

[1:11:12] period so just make sure we have that

[1:11:15] money that our kids who needed that's

[1:11:16] not a bad idea would that be legally

[1:11:18] would be able to do anything else it's

[1:11:21] free money

[1:11:22] all right

[1:11:26] no I think I think he's got a point

[1:11:28] though is that we don't want to we don't

[1:11:29] want to rate and we we there have in the

[1:11:31] past been times when people rated that

[1:11:33] account do you just want to lock it up

[1:11:34] somehow make sure it stays there in one

[1:11:36] place the Catch-22 is that it is I mean

[1:11:40] it is not a Revival it's not a revolving

[1:11:42] fund it is not a um it's not an

[1:11:45] Enterprise it's just an account correct

[1:11:48] um and

[1:11:50] we don't have any more money coming into

[1:11:51] this

[1:11:52] uh actually um

[1:11:59] so your recommendation we take a look at

[1:12:01] that well I think we're not also I mean

[1:12:04] I think we can do that

[1:12:06] um I think we should probably

[1:12:09] I mean we've we've talked about at our

[1:12:11] bill we're talking about the idea of

[1:12:12] scraping some of these other old

[1:12:13] accounts that might be worth looking at

[1:12:16] but we also have so many other costs

[1:12:18] that we need and I think we do need to

[1:12:20] be careful about

[1:12:23] taking all of this loose money and just

[1:12:25] kind of dumping it into one place if we

[1:12:27] may need it for other costs because we

[1:12:29] will all right

[1:12:31] I'm gonna go with you next Kevin

[1:12:33] what do you think of using some

[1:12:36] um I I I think it I think the users need to pay for the service

[1:12:45] um like I said if it's a situation

[1:12:48] I I don't see any advantage to oh let's

[1:12:51] grab 500 000 from here and oh wait a

[1:12:54] minute how about if we take

[1:12:56] um you know a little from here this will

[1:12:58] just be a first start but no so I would

[1:13:01] say leave it as a safety net

[1:13:04] um and and we need to walk we need to

[1:13:07] walk on on our own and not have

[1:13:10] subsidized service anymore

[1:13:15] uh any opinion on it at all yeah I mean

[1:13:18] I I agree with Steve that you know we

[1:13:22] need some money in case something really

[1:13:24] does happen I mean Steve was speaking

[1:13:26] about a real life situation this that

[1:13:29] wasn't a guess he knows that happened he

[1:13:32] knows the numbers he knows what it cost

[1:13:33] us okay and I just think that if we do

[1:13:36] it through an account like that

[1:13:39] you know there has to be some way so

[1:13:42] that

[1:13:43] if something bad happens somebody don't

[1:13:45] go dipping into that account because it

[1:13:46] happens more frequently than not it has

[1:13:49] retirement plans

[1:13:52] one of the things we haven't yet

[1:13:54] discussed is the fact that we've got

[1:13:55] more than 5 million

[1:13:57] right

[1:13:58] um and although that was and obviously

[1:14:01] that's yet and that's similar under the

[1:14:03] similar similar circumstances where

[1:14:04] that's one of the record rainy day

[1:14:06] accounts that quite frankly we haven't

[1:14:08] used much but

[1:14:14] um I think this is something where maybe

[1:14:16] we want to seriously consider using a

[1:14:18] little bit not a lot okay

[1:14:21] um

[1:14:29] yes

[1:14:41] [Music]

[1:14:46] okay I thought you were going to start

[1:14:48] up the fee at least a quarter or more

[1:14:50] sooner anyway so I'm confused as to why

[1:14:53] you need to dip in too much if you were

[1:14:55] going to start building say in the fall

[1:14:57] because they don't there's some things

[1:14:59] that I'm not sure about but I'm gonna

[1:15:01] hit the r but and then do that right

[1:15:04] I

[1:15:52] it is uh

[1:15:54] the point is that 380 000 should not be

[1:15:59] the first thing that's stress it should

[1:16:00] be actually if you're gonna build early

[1:16:02] and obviously bylaws have to change we

[1:16:04] have to you know prove if we don't want

[1:16:06] this or not get a system going a little

[1:16:09] early and then didn't work if you need

[1:16:11] that 380 or we have to zip into a little

[1:16:13] bit my concern is and I'll tell you what

[1:16:16] my concern is we've been told we're

[1:16:18] going to keep the toters are we going to

[1:16:19] keep the toters I don't know so what if

[1:16:22] we have to buy toters I know Anna said

[1:16:26] we're going to keep the toners but I

[1:16:28] don't know it says

[1:16:54] thank you

Ad-Hoc Curbside Trash Committee - 4/6/23

Agenda

Transcript